The Sun. — London, England, 1834-04-21 00:00:00

SPIRIT OF THE PUBLIC: JOURNALS. their encouragement of Political Unions, as long as they thought a formidable demonstration of physical strength by those bodies was necessary to keep them in their places. We then foretold what has since been but too fearfully realized—that ministers would evoke a giant power in this country that would eventually struggle for dominion with the political wizards that brought it on the scene. Here it is to-day— the principle and the spirit of the Political Unions embodied in the combined physical force of the work ing classes. A giant power indeed, which, though only stretching forth its hundred arms, at present, in the attitude of supplication, causes our State magi cians to recoil with horror from their own work. Well do we recollect the time when the highest judi cial functionary in the realm assisted the natural force of his eloquence by describing the appalling spectacle of 150,000 unionists assembled under their leaders, on New Hall-hill, near Birmingham—with their heads bared—making their simultaneous vows to Heaven, and ready to march wherever their leaders chose to direct them. It is true we have lived to see some of those leaders become pensioners on those taxes which the "cheap government" of reform was to have im mediately demolished ; and we have lived to see others of them described as mountebanks--impostors—poli tical jugglers--and " Birmingham Hampdens," by the very journals that affected to regard their talents for political regeneration with mingled awe and admi ration, as long as they were necessary tools of the Whig ambition. But the example of successful inti midation had been already taught the people, and the spirit of the defunct Political Unions passed, by a sort of political metempsychosis, into those new and por tentous confederacies which cause in this, the second year of reform, preparations as if for civil war in the streets of this metropolis. If the working classes of London could be persuaded, by those who are really their friends, to desist from the intended demonstration, and to forward their pe tition to the throne on behalf of the Dorchester con victs by a delegated few, it would be well. They may be assured that they have with them on this point the moral support of public opinion ; for all persons who are not the servile followers of the Whig camp are either convinced that the law was strained— ' in error, perhaps, but certainly strained to catch those unionists in its meshes ; or, if they think- the I law not improperly applied to the case, they are still disgusted at the severity of the punishment inflicted for a first offence under an act which had so long slept on the statute-book as to have passed out of remem brance. In fact, government has put itself in the wrong by the sentence, which has excited public sympathy for the offenders, and deprived the example of all moral influence. Still, if the trades' unions, rejecting sound advice, will go into procession to-day, government will, of course, be prepared to put down violence if it should be attempted ; but they will act wisely if they will abstain from adopting the counsel of those who advise them to provoke it. We do not wish to see the dreadful scenes of Lyons and Paris imitated in the streets of London. Therefore, we say, let those who are appointed to protect the peace not begin by breaking it.—Morning Herald. We must again express our deep regret at the in tended physical demonstration of the Trades' Unions of the Metropolis on the occasion of their address to the King for a commutation of the sentences on the Dorsetshire convicts. The columns of this Journal have always been devoted to the interests of the mass of the people ; and in 1824-5 we advocated the rights of industry on the important subject of the legislative modification of the laws against exporting machinery, and combination. We have always contended for the right of the working classes to combine for the protec tion of their interests in questions with their employ ers, provided they avoided all attempts at coercion or other unfair means of influencing their own classes. Under the exciting circumstances also of the recent unadvised and injurious formation of the organized societies now called " Trades' Unions," we have fear lessly contended for the sufficiency of the existin g laws, and decidedly deprecated any new legislation. We deem the statute in force a sufficiently fair and full protection of the relative rights of masters and men— except, perhaps, the illegal influence obtained by the physical means denominated "'picketing" and "scout ing"—and the numerous convictions in all parts of the kingdom, and the notorious failure of the most offensive unions and " strikes," as a demonstration of the practical sufficiency of the existing law. It is, therefore, with great pain that we observe these asso ciations adopt a course of procedure palpably injurious Ito their honest and injurious members, and pursuing measures which must alienate the best friends of their undoubted rights. On the subject of their present address to the crown we concede to them a perfect right of opinion and a natural occasion of sympathy. We admit, that viewing all the circumstances of the case of the Dorsetshire labourers, the sentence is severe ; and it is much to be regretted that an extreme punishment falls upon individuals who may have been partially ignorant of the law against secret oaths under which they were convicted, and the general rules and objects of whose association do not appear to have been otherwise illegal. We could have wished that worse offenders had been the victims of the law, as far as example and punishment operate to prevent crime. But it must be conceded that the government is placed in a difficult and embarrassing situation. The real evils of these organised societies—the natural complaints of the great body of masters and the middle classes affected by them—and, indeed, the cunning of political parties opposed to ministers, probably unite to urge the government to further le gislation as a control of their bad tendency. We think that Lord Grey has most wisely resisted any in fluence which may have been used to induce him to propose new laws--an experimental legislation which would probably aggravate instead of diminish the evil, and which would assuredly have had the injurious con sequence of severing the real union and good feeling of the different classes of the country. We grieve, therefore, to notice the trades' unions issue absurd and dangerous manifestoes of their objects, and indulge in chimerical schemes regarding capital, and in views hostile to the natural order of human society—equally mischievous and unsusceptible of realization. And we the more deeply deplore their folly, when we see adopted a " spectacle system" of public funerals of de ceased members of unions, and numerous public pro cessions promoted, such as we are to witness this day. No government can sanction acts of the people so ut terly at variance with social order ; and it is their bounden ministerial duty, as guardians of the public peace, to discountenance proceedings injurious to all classes, but to the actors above all others. We are not, therefore, surprised that an official communication has been made to the leaders of the metropolitan unions, that the address to the King will not be received in this mode of presentation. We think this determi nation wise and humane towards the unionists themselves. If the ministers of the crown were to compromise its dignity, by the reception of the address, accompanied by the contemplated array of great masses of trades' unionists, it is evident that similar popular demonstrations would be repeated. The danger of such congregations of the working classes cannot be disguised. We honour the just character which the population of this country have obtained for order and respect for property. We do not give credit to the silly alarm which imputes to the people a conspiracy against property, and democratic designs in these displays of numerical power. The national character of Englishmen belies the aspersion. But it is palpable that accident may ignite the mate rials of combustion. A few bad men among the unionists, or a few excited police officers, might give occasion for lamentable consequences ; and while, therefore, we give the government credit for the pre cautions they have prudently taken, we trust that no officious interruption will be given to the intended pro cession. The conduct of the Home Office by Lord Melbourne has been hitherto most prudent and sensi ble. In times of no ordinary political excitement and difficulty, he has ably and moderately exercised the extraordinary powers of his very responsible office, and we do not doubt that on this occasion he will secure the public peace, and by official directions, avoid the least shadow of provocation. We apprehend no permanent evils from the , trades' unions. The extent of their numbers, and the wildness of their projects are an ample security for their speedy disso lution. They may be temporarily swayed by a few philanthropic enthusiasts like Mr. Owen, or a few political fanatics and charlatans like Dr. Wade ; but the good sense and plain interest of the intelligent mechanics will soon emancipate the unionists from their temporary delusion. If trades' unions are " let alone," they will die the natural death of all those artificial and temporary associations which preceded them ; if absurd and abortive legislation meddles with them, they will not be dissolved without the substitu tion of evils far greater than the present : the cure will be worse than the disease. We doubt not the intended procession will prove only the pageant of a Saint Monday, and will equally disappoint the expec- In the course of yesterday many details became known, through various channels, to the public, respect ing the ostensible designs and proceedings of the Trades' Unions, or rather of their leadgrs, who take the field this morning. It rejoices us to have ascer tained, from indisputable testimony, that the admoni tion we addressed to all classes of our fellow-citizens on Saturday, has produced upon some of them the salutary effects which were intended by it—that many who had inconsiderately talked of " seeing" what was to go forward, have declared their resolution to remain at home, and insist on a similar forbearance on the part of their families. Further, we have reason to believe that no small number of those simple and well-mean ing, but misguided men, upon whose presence and subserviency on this occasion the leading mischief makers had securely reckoned, have begun to draw back from the snare so insidiously laid for them, and to ask themselves—" What good will it do us or our children' to make part of the crowd at Copen hagen-fields ?" There are some men,_ doubtless, who can turn such things to temporary profit, namely, those who contrive to become managers and directors of them. These persons obtain the power of ordering and commanding others, which all conceited and self ish people are fond of; they obtain, moreover, the handling of their neighbours' money ; they have large subscription funds at theiddisposal ; they have pretty good pay, some of them at least, for their daily trouble in keeping up by artificial and deceitful means the agitation in the minds of the honest work ing classes, and in setting a number of their own desperate tools to threaten and bully the more peace ably disposed into a reluctant co-operation with the " unions." In fact, the whole scheme is the most flagrant humbug upon those poor people for the bene fit of the " managers" alone, and this day's farce is got up for the double purpose of cheating the poor gulled members of the unions with the fancy of their own importance, and frightening the government by a display of their numerical force. The notable attempt will, we imagine, be a twofold failure. We have reason to suspect that the authorities of the State, from the higest downwards, are well pre pared to insure the peace of society by lawful power, and that the utter idiotism of the plot for subjecting all other classes of the nation to this tyranny of a certain clique of quack visionaries and projectors, is hourly making itself more palpable to the least clear-sighted of its hoped-for victims. In the first place, however, it is right to correct a false assertion, and in the next, to expose a silly expectation. It was said, on we know not what authority, yesterday, that the police are this day to be equipped with cutlasses and fire-arms. Now we are sure that no such intention is entertained by his Majesty's Government. The police will not be armed. A right feeling prevails, that except in ex treme emergency, it is out of character for the civil power to act with military weapons ; and we appre hend that if unfortunately any occasion for the em ployment of such auxiliary means should now arise, the access to them will not be difficult. This re port may have been innocently promulgated, but its tendency must be to raise angry passions, which all good men would anxiously allay. Again, an absurd notion has got hold of these " trades' unionists," that notwithstanding their multitudinous meeting, and their alarming and most inconvenient and troublesome procession, their petition must, as a matter of course, be received at Whitehall, provided only that the entire mass of 200,000 petitioners abstain from breaking bo dily into the Home-office, and content themselves with sending a small detachment of their numerous army to present it. Now, we can inform them that so clumsy and wretched an expedient will not serve the purpose. The petition is to be marched down to Westminster with an escort calculated only to intimi date the Government into submission ; and it is not by stopping a few paces from the door, while the dele gates enter, that the multitude can pretend to separate itself from the individuals who the moment before constituted a portion of it. The document is still forced upon the King's Minister—that is, in fact, upon his Majesty's presence—by the compulsion of an im mense physical power; and as it would be at once a disgraceful act and a fatal precedent to receive a pe tition under such circumstances, so are we convinced that it will be at once rejected as an attempt at doing violence to the Crown. If the unionists, therefore, be disappointed in this matter, they will have richly earned it by their own misconduct, and have none to blame but themselves and their shallow, perverse, and unprincipled leaders. These leaders are now mani festly frightened at the predicament they stand in ; but the incendiaries have gone too far to retire—mortifica tion prevents their retreat, and imminent danger be sets them as they move forward. Nor are the chiefs the only penitents in this instance. Hundreds of em ployers have declared that their unhappy workmen would exult at having this nightmare of the " union" despotism shaken off them ; that they have been tricked into it—are bullied out of the virtuous resolu tion oftentimes formed to break away from it, and that their attendance this day is an act of the most stern compulsion. Against meeting, especially against marching, at all, however, there are innumerable and unanswerable reasons. Our free acknowledgment has been given that we acquit the Unionists of a design to commit such violence, as would bring them into actual collision with the public force. The great bulk of them, that is, the passive portion, are too well disposed, to be capable of deliberate crime ; and the chiefs are too conscious of their weakness. But, once more, we must seri ously ask all of them whose minds are capable of any dispassionate forethought, can they, even with the best intentions, be sure that no calamity will occur ? Half a dozen drunkards may force a quarrel with the police, which might involve the whole body of policemen on one side and of unionists on the other. There are 50,000 thieves and pickpockets in London ' • a gang of only 100 such may produce a premeditated and, even pally, a universal tumult. Should there be no alter native for the restoration of peace but the dreadful one of an appeal to the army, is there a human being who without shuddering can meditate the possible result ? But look at the very form of the procession, and tell us is a safe or satisfactory issue to be -anticipated ? They talk of marching six abreast, and, in some cases, "supporters" on each side of them. Now, is it pos sible that a column of eight, or even six, men in front should move along the streets of London without creating obstructions at every step, and hindering the progress of every one of the King's subjects, male or female, on foot or horseback, or in carriages, and of all goods in carts and waggons, throughout the whole line of route, while troops are commanded to march in single file through London ? This is a considera tion of extreme importance. Not many weeks ago a trades' union funeral, real or pretended, (for there used to be in Ireland, just before the rebel lion, such things as mock funerals got up for displays of force) took possession of the entire width of Hol born, and effectually blocked the free passage of every person who had the misfortune to face or follow. it. Is not that an outrage ? Is it not a breach of the peace ? Yet is it not inevitable if the programme of Copenhagen-fields be adhered to ? And let us put it earnestly to the judgment and feelings of the trades' unions, if the police on duty endeavour to remove the obstruction by opening a passage for any of the King's subjects who may be repelled and thrown back by the enormous advancing column on its way to Whitehall, can such policemen be called aggressors, or be blamed Ibr any disastrous consequences which may follow ? ASile have been accused by a malignant and ruffian even ing paper of diabolical wickedness for stating the afects which we feared. Our wish was to offer a conscientious and useful warning, and no other—to avert mischief, to put the unwary on their guard, to protect the public tranquillity, and to save even the meditators of evil (if such there should be) from suffer ing by their own machinations. God grant that all may end in peace ! and that the people may learn to distinguish their independent friends from fawning and designing traitors.— Times. There can be but one opinion among all sensible and sober-minded persons, and among all who are really the friends of the working classes, respecting the intended procession of the Trades' Unions of London to-day -----namely, it is a very ill-advised, and may be a very disastrous measure. At the same time we are far from approving of the advice given to the Govern ment by some of our contemporaries to put it down by force. Every precaution ought to be, i.nd we pre sume is, taken by Government to protect the public peace, if the unionists should put themselves in the wrong by any attempt to disturb it. In this case the Government would have the strong support of public opinion at its back ; but the case would be very different if Government should become the aggressi ve party against a body of petitioners, however numerous, who conducted themselves peaceably. As we have never advocated the principle of carrying public measures by intimidation, whether on the . part of the crown or the people, we cannot, without mconsis tency, rebuke the Trades' Unions for doing that which his Ms,iesty's ministers set them the example of doing by tations of its political agitators and of sanguine Tories. —Morning Chronicle. In the course of the discussion on the question, the hon. member for Boston, and the hon. member for the University'of Oxford, had brought forward statements with which his plan would be found perfectly consonant. The first said that the dissenters objected not so much to the amount as the principle, and the latter that the legislature ought to provide for the supp o of the church. The plan of Government would be in accordance with both opinions ; it was that church rates should be entirely abolished, and that 250,0001. should be applied out of the land tax in the manner which he would show. (Oh, oh!) Some hon. mem bers cried oh 1 but he would show what he in tended. ( Hear I). The mode in which this sum was to be applied generally towards the support of the iabric of the parish churches, by paying it into the hands of the commissioners, a:body which it would be neces sary to make permanent. It would be found from the returns before the house that the sum hitherto applied was about 245,0001., and the sum proposed to be appropriated he had not the slightest doubt would be quite equal to the purpose. As the law at present existed, either the rector, or the lay impropriator, was bound to maintain the repairs of the church but it was his intention to relieve them from that, but on condition that the internal services of the church should be. maintained. These were not very heavy expenses, and the lay impropriator would not be placed in any worse sivation than he was at present ; by this plan all the expences now provided for by church rates would be amply met, for it was intended that the church fabric should be sustained, and the ex pences of the chancel ' and the church-yard, should be met by the rector or the lay impropriator, There were other points, such as the support of pews. With respect to pews in parish churches, he thought it would not be an unfair arrangement to make those who had the use of them keep them in re pair. (Hear.) It was stated that, with respect to the faculty and possessory pews, this was the practice. Another source of expenditure was the visitation fees paid by churchwardens. The legal fees which they were called on to pay were very inconsiderable ; still the attendance of churchwardens at visitations occasioned a very large expenditure. As far as however as the attendance of churchwardens on this occasion went, that attendance did not appear to be a matter of very great necessity, therefore he would dis pense with it altogether, enabling the parochial clergy to swear them in upon their appointment annually, and not taking from them the power of making precentors which they at present possessed. By the arrangement at present proposed, it would be necessary to impose some fresh check as to the expenditure. The check now existing was very insufficient. By the present practice the money voted for the repairs, &c., of churches, went out of the parish, but by the regulations proposed it would be the reverse, because all that might be voted would be kept within the aespective parishes. Besides the amount to be ap plied would be limited, and when the claims upon the church commissioners were larger than the sum at their disposal would admit of being complied with, the claims would have to be sent back. In addition to thisthere would be this further check, that when the churchwardens and parochial clergymen thought repairs necessary they would have to call in the surveyor of the county to examine and ascertain whether or not those repairs -42.---_ were absolutely imperative ; the surveyors would have HOUSE OF COMMONS. to report to the quarter sessions, and, upon a certificate The SPEAKER took the chair at a quarter past five from the quarter sessions only would the repairs be authorised to be made. The county surveyors were o'clock. men of the highest trespectability, and this could not Lord HO WI C K brought up a return of the num- fail to be a satisfactory arrangement, and such as ber of writs that had been issued from the different would prevent any extravagant outlay. It might be courts during the last year ; also, the report of the said that he had adverted to no provision for a large Chancery Commision ; which were ordered to lie on the table. . number of bills and other things that might be considered as luxuries to churches.—( Laughter.) If Upon the motion of Mr. MAXWELL, the Lanark- those things were absolutely necessary, he had no shire Roads Bill was read a second time. Mr. TOOKE presented a petition from the mer- doubt that by:voluntary, contributions they would be ot. It was probable e roosition f chants, bankers, and other inhabitants of the borough hon. friend the member for th at if th Exeter had bee p n adopted is of Truro, in Cornwall, against the Hailes Railway Bill. viz., to leave the whole to voluntary contributions, that would have been quite sufficient.—( Hear, hear. ) Mr. C ARTWRIGHT presented a petition from but he thought in - the present state of the church of the farmers and grasiers of the county of Northampton England, regard being had to the principles for which against the Islington Market Bill ; also a petition from the church establishment existed, it would not have C otsgrove, in Northamptonshire, against the Stony Stratford Bridge Bill. been consistent with those principles to have left the thing in that way. Of course it was impossible for Lord ALTHORP said that before moving the order him to know how this proposition would be received of the day for the house to resolve itself into a corn by those who were firmly attached to the church, mittee upon the subject of the church rates, he had as little did he know in what light the Dissenters certain petitions to present upon the subject from the themselves would receive it. ( Hear, hear, hear.) dissenters of Cricklade, Houston, and Grove, in North- This he was confident of, that with respect to the am inns and from Milton, in Essex ; also, a petition from the vicar and churchwardens of Thax- church, the maiutenance of churches in repair would ate. be placed upon a better footing. If things remained as lead, against the separation of church and st they were churches would not be repaired, as the Mr. FINN said that he and other Irish members had a great number of petitions to present, for a re- greatest difficulty hae already occurred. With respect to the dissenters, he would say that they did not object peal of the union: As he understood it to be the usual course, he hoped permission would be granted to pre- to the allowance, but to the principle of imposing any sent them to-morrow evening, without making any tax peculiarly for the purposes of the established church. This was the objection they made, and he might say, speech upon them. therefore, that as far as both parties were concerned , Mr. PETER submitted to the house whether , The effect of this measure would be, to give satisfac having a case of breach of privilege—viz., the inter ference of a Peer of the realm with an election, his, Lion. There was another point which was not imme (Mr. Peter's) motion ought not to take precedence of diately relevant, but which the house ought to consi der, namely, that this measure would effect not only a the orders of the day. relief to the scruples of the dissenters, but relieve from a The SPEAKER said that there were two questions before the house, the one whether they should act in tax the people of England. They proposed to apply conformity with the rules of the house, this being an to the purposes of church rates 250,0 00 /. a year out of the land tax. while the sum hitherto raised etas about order day, and the other whether they would make an exception and let the honourable member's mo- 600,0001., the last sum was 560,0001., the measure would lion take precedence. It was true that this was a relieve the people from a tax that pressed upon them question of privilege, and such had always had to this amount. (Hear, hear.) There had been great precedence, but then those questions were always extravagance heretofore in the expenditure of this money through the churchwardens having an interest limited to such as the house had to deal with, and to judge and decide upon. The motion of the hon. as tradesmen in making improvements, from which member, being an address to the Crown to exercise its cause much extravagance had arisen. (Hear, prerogative, could never be considered as coming hear, hear.) He had gone through his plan, within such questions of privilege. and had stated the grounds upon what he The house then resolved itself into a committee. relied :he did not know the course of objection CHURCH RATES. which the hon. member for Middlesex meant to take ; Lord ALTHORP said he presented the petitions he only knew, from what that hon. member said, that from dissenters, complaining of their grievances, he intended to make some objection. He could not because he was against the principle of dis- object to the application of part of the land tax, as it would senters being compelled to pay church rates. He by relieving the whole country to a large amount, and thought that there was a difference between tithes and the substitution was not a new tax, but the division of church rates, inasmuch as the latter were uncertain in existing taxes. He felt confidence, therefore, that the their amount, and levied on dissenters as a sort of house wauld support him in moving that, after a compulsion to worship in a manner different from ce.tain time, to be fixed, church rates should their conscientious belief. The dissenters had a right cease, and that, in lieu of them, his Majesty to complain of their grievances, and the legislature had be requested to grant out of the land-tax a a right as well to take such steps as would relieve them. sum not exceeding 25,0001. for the repair of churches, The present state of the law was unsatisfactory to the that sum to be expended in such manner as Parliament church, both in the obstinate refusal of the dissenters to should think fit. ( Hear, hear.) pay the assessment, and in the inefficiency of the remedy Mr. H UME disapproved entirely of the measure left the collectors by the power of the law. The brought forward by the noble Lord. It would not legislature should consequently enact some m easures satisfy the dissenters, nor the members of the which would have the proper effect of re moving the established church. It seemed as if the bench complaint and improving the remedy, by renderi n g the of Bishops h a d b een a t th e no bl e L or d's e lb ow w h en assessment more just, and of course more easily he arranged that m easure . It was mere ly t a ki ng th e brought in. Two plans were suggested to effect hand from the right p oc k e t an d p u tti ng it i n t o th e that ; but then neither seemed to him to effect left to take money still from the dissent e rs. Th os e the wished-for object. The first was proposed by ecclesiastical commissioners were the most inimical the ecclesiastical commissioners, but that did not go to the feelings of the dissenters, and to the real to remove the grievances of the dissenters ; it merely interests of the established church ; and any law coming aimed at the securing the church in its revenues. The from them, or to be enforced by them, must be consider adoption of that, therefore, would be unwise , as it ed compulsory on people's consciences, and be rejected. Why had not the noble lord proposed that the sugar would leave the difficulty unmitigated. Another plan was to take a middle course—to avoid the g r est ex- internal tax or the malt tax, or any other, should be applied penditure that was necessary for the to the purpose of the payment of these rates ? decorations of churches, and to relieve the dis - There was no reason why one tax should be preferred senters from contributing their money to that purpose. to another, but he ascribed it all to the cunningness It had been alleged by those who advocated the claims of the clergy who concurred that the loud tax was of the dissenters, that it was not so much the amount more secure than any other, and therefore he choose that was objected to as their being compelled He was therefore right in assuming that th rs. e bench of bishops had been his lordships advise to contribute for the support of a church to hear.) It was a proposition to take from the which they did not belong ; and although their Hear, p ublicp revenues a sumsupport for the of the church, exemption from the payment of rates for the embel the noble lord, with his usual candour, had admitted lishment of the church might diminish the church an extraordinary fact—that the greatest extravagance rates, it would not satisfy them. Another proposition had been exhibited in the management of the church that had been made was,to continue the church rates, but rates heretofore, and he now proposed to give them the to exempt Dissenters from t would concerned, be satisfactory, ttlement of their claims let them give up the whole but the effect of it he (L o rd A. ), need not say would be 1 3 detrimental to the inte r ests of the established church, of their revenues, and then the house would put them for they could not have the least doubt that if it was in the budget, and grant them whatever theythought once said that Dissenters were exempted, the number proper. ( Laughter. ) There was no alternative. of those who professed to be dissenters would be very (Laughter.) He (Mr. H.) was not, however, pre pared to meddle with the revenues of the church y e t. and cries of "Oh I") He wo u ld as k much increased. He, therefore, could not bring him self to make such a proposition, because it would (Laughter, up as if he had made some monstrous proposition ha not d be quite contrary to every principle of justice the noble lord, and his friends who c h eere d he ever brought forward any meas ure that he did and fairness. ( Hear, hear, hear.) Another pro position, which he understood had been made by the hon. member for Exeter, was to do away with church wish to carr y b y conviction. But probably the heads rates altogether, and substitute nothing in their place, o f the noble lord and hi s f r i en d s were at t h at but leave the m o n e y now levied by the church rates to m oment ;full of the ide as o f ro bb ery an d spo li at i on . be raised by vo luntary contributions. It might or He bery (of any establishment never ; what he wis p hed for was that Mr. H.) would advocate soliation and rob might not be, th a t the voluntary contributions would be sufficient ; in some cases it would be sufficient, some proposition would be made to that house. ,for the purposes of ma i n t a i n i ng th e established church, and not wheth er an es t a blished church but he, (Lord A.) was far from certain that this would, The q uestion was, whe ther the funds were sufficient generally speaking, be the case. The dissenters called upon that house not to require of them to contribute to 1 the support of a church to which they did not i was necessary. Th en 'th e no bl e l o rd stated belong, but one consequence of the existence of an o ne reason why 200,000/, s h ou ld b e ta k en f rom the public taxes to s u pp ort t h e c h urc h ? Had h e established church (and it was a principle which he ' would always advocate) was, laid any documents bell); the house, to show that the be provided for the support of that some means should its fabric. (Hear.) On funds were not amply su ffi c i en t ? He thought these grounds he (Lord A.) could not have acceded there were more th an enoug h, an d if an ything would to any of the propositions to which he had alluded. I injure that church this extr av agant proposition would SECOND EINVTION. SUN OFFICE, Seven o'clock. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT, THIS EVENING. HOUSE OF LORDS• Lord HOWARD DE WALDEN presented a petition from the dissenters of the chapelry in York, praying for relief. The Earl of RADNOR presented petitions from Carmarthen and Brecknock to the same effect. Also a petition from a parish in the county of Down for a repeal of the union. The Bishop of EXETER presented petitions from Topsham, and from the Wesleyan methodists of Exeter for the better observance of the Sabbath. The Duke of - WELLINGTON presented a peti tion from a parish in the county of Derby, in support of the established church. V••,. Lord WYNFO RD presented a petition from Wil mington to the same effect. The Earl of DURHAM presented petitions from the Protestant Dissenters of Newcastle on Tyne, Dun stable, Bury, Ashton-under-Lyne, and Gainsborough, praying for a separation of Church and State. Lord STRANGFORD gave notice that he should to-morrow move for certain papers connected with the subject which he had brought under their lordship's notice on Friday last relative to smuggling on the coast of France. do it.—( Hear, hear, hear.) In Lancashire only the land tax amounted to 12,0001., and Warwick it was 25,000/. No tax could be more unequal than the land tax. In fact the noble lord contemplated raising his plan upon a delusion. Such a measure would give no satisfaction to dissenters. Then what would Ireland and Scotland say ? Episcopal England and Catholic Ireland, and Presbyterian Scotland, would equally oppose this measure. (LEFT SPE.% ELNG. ) CAMBRIDGE PETITION. The Duke of GLOUCESTER said that in pursu ance of the notice he had given on Friday last, he now rose to present to their lordships a petition, signed by 258 members of the Senate of the University of Cam bridge, praying their lordships not to adopt that measure which had been prayed for by a petition which had been presented on a former evening. In doing this, he hoped it would not be understood that he meant any thing unkind or disrespectful towards those gentle men who had signed that petition, for they were most respectable, and for some of whom he had a great personal regard. In present ing this petition, he did not think it ne cessary to trespass on their time on his own behalf, but on behalf of his brother petitioner 3 he thought he ought to make a few statements, which he would do as briefly as possible. With respect to the first pe tition presented, he had never heard anything of it ; until Wednesday the 19th of March, when he learned for the first time, by the newspapers, that notice had been given in that house that such a petition was to be presented on the 21st. He immediately wrote to the Vice-Chancellor to express his astonishment that he had not heard anything of it, and desiring to know from whom it emanated, by whom it was signed, and :particularly to be informed whether it con tained the sentiments of the majority of the senate of the University of Cambridge. On the following Friday he received a letter fromthat gentlemn, stating (LEFT SPEAKING. TRADES' UNIONS. GREAT MEETING OF THE TRADES' UNIONS.—(THIS DAY.) (Concluded from our First Edition.) SIX O'CLOCK. The leaders of the unions have upon this occasion shown great good sense. After marching their first lodges out to Kennington Common, they dis banded them, with an understanding that the answer to the petition had not then been re ceived, but would be communicated at the various lodges in the evening. Those lodges that were last in the procession were dismissed on the road from the Obelisk and the Elephant and Castle. The conse quence was, that all was peace and quietness along the road, which more resembled the time of a Camber well or Peckham Fair, than the day of such an alarm ing meeting. ANOTHER ACCOUNT. SEVEN O'CLOCK. Since our first edition we have ascertained that up to the present time everything has passed off in an orderly and quiet manner. The vast number of the unionists who assembled on Kennington Common marched off or dispersed in the most peaceable manner, and not the slightest manifestation of feeling was exhibited. Every person seemed to be under the orders of a superior, who exhorted them to peace, and those exhortations were strictly attended to. The dif ferent unions, we understand, will take refreshment at their respective lodges, but the greatest anxiety appears to be with them not to do any thing to disturb the public peace. Not a soldier, not a policeman, has been called into action, on such a day as this, when so numerous a body has met for one common object. BETTING.-(THIS EVENING.) THE ERBY. to 2 agst Planipo 20 to 1 agst Viator to I apt Milelab 20 to ! agst Kate. to 1 aBst Bubastes 20 to 1 agst Delirium to 1 agst Bentley (taken) 22 to 1 apt Comet to 1 agst Glencoe 33 to 1 apt Olympic )AKS. 12 to 1 agst Pickle (taken) 14 to 1 agst Flycatcher 16 to 2 agst Zulima 3 to 1 agst Cotillon l 0 to 1 agst Louisa ll to 1 agst Rosalie THE THE AFFAIR AT OLDHAM. CORONER'S INQUEST. OLDHAM, APRIL 18.—The Coroner arrived this morning, and about eleven o'clock proceeded with the Jury to inspect the body at the King William, where the inquest is held, and at which house the body has lain since Tuesday. Arrangements were made, in consequence of the Coroner (Mr. Ferrand) having resolved on making this inquest a close one, with the consent of Mr. Thompson, solicitor, that the witnesses, immediately after their depositions before the Coroner, should re state to the reporters what had been stated to the jury. Some one, however, told Mr. Ferrand what was passing, who immediately sent word to the land lord that either the reporters or the jury must leave, unless such proceedings were abandoned. The re porters, on hearing this, unanimously resolved that they would not quit. On this being communicated to the Coroner, he ordered a constable to take two wit nesses who had been examined, and who were then in the reporters' room, into a room by themselves, and to keep them aloof from the " Press." The reporters, on this, decided to demand admittance into the room where the two witnesses were huddled, with a view to ascertain whether they were willingly detained. The contrary was found to be the case, and they came back again into the reporters' room. These proceed ings being communicated to the Coroner, he then sent peremptory orders that they should be kept aloof from these dangerous persons ( I suppose). On this, the press, in a body, resolved on forcing a pas sage, or rather insisting on seeing the two men ; and on one of the reporters attempting to pass up stairs, where the two witnesses were, a Mr. Barlow (this im portant personage fills, it is said, the high office of book-keeper, and that of one of the four high consta bles of " Oldham above Town" to boot) threatened to call in the military if the attempt was persisted in. Of course, a night's lodging in the guard-room among the rioters was not relished, and the matter there dropped. The Reporters now seeing that the evidence could not be obtained in conformity with their first plans, waited upon Mr. Thompson, the solicitor, at the Angel Inn, where the Bench was sitting, and stated to him the proceedings of the Coroner. Mr. Thompson at once sent for the witnesses at the Angel, with the view that the witnesses might re-state what they de posed before the Jury. The following is the evidence given before the Jury, and re-stated by the witness, James Thomson, to the reporters :—The mob came between nine and ten o'clock ; was in the mill ; we then went into the yard up to the fence ; some of us, about half-a-dozen, had fire-arms ; the mob gathered round the mill on all sides ; there was a large mob in Cotton-street ; stones were thrown out of Cotton-street into the yard at us ; kept shouting at us who had the fire-arms; they then got into the cottage houses ; nothing was left whole ; this was done before any firing took place ; then they fired one after another ; the shouting and firing con tinued ; don't know where they got the _fire-arms ; there were one or two blunderbusses, one pistol, and two or three muskets ; windows in front of the mill were broken before firing ; these half-a-dozen shots had been fired before Bentley was killed; six or seven were fired before he was shot ; did not know till some minutes after he fell that any one was killed ; a shot was fired at a man who was entering the yard, and who held up his arm, saying, " Come on I" we then all ran out of the yard with our arms. ( Here the Coroner's in terference took place.) The body was removed from the King William about four o'clock this afternoon to his (Bentley's) late home. The funeral is to take place on Sunday next, at the Independent Chapel, Mumps, near Oldham. This has been arranged in order to give all possible time for the operatives of Lancashire, Cheshire, and Yorkshire to be present. It will doubtless be one of the most numerous assemblages that ever took place in England, as it is calculated that 100,000 persons will be in Oldham on the occasion. The military force is, however, great, no less than 1,020 men, besides others which are expected before the time of interment. Special constables are hourly sworn in. There appears no prospect whatever that the factories will resume work on Monday—this sort of thing cannot last very long. In consequence of some evidence which transpired before the Jury, the Coroner's warrant was issued, and Mr. Thomson's carter, whose ',name I understand is Isherwood, was taken up on suspicion of having shot Bentley. Another man was also seen to shoot at the same time, and from the same point as Isherwood. He is known, and it is expected will be secured. It is pro per to remark, that on looking at the place where Bentley stood when he was shot, it could not be less than fifty yards from the cottages, and one hundred from the mill—and that it was utterly impossible, without the aid of -a slug, that he could have even broken a window, or done any, the least injury to the property—it may be said in justification of Isherwood and his colleagues, that Bentley, the deceased, with others, were attempting to get over the yard wall when he was killed. This, however, does not appear, from James Thompson's evidence, to be the case. The Committee of the Commissioners of Police in Oldham had a meeting on Wednesday evening con vened specially to investigate as to whether Heywood, their servant, had acted on the instructions and autho rity of the magistrates, or whether by any other. Hey wood admitted that Pagel was very tipsy on the Mon day evening when the Trades' Union books, &c., were seized, and would have laid the blame on the magis trates, but on close examination by the Commissioners abandoned that tack. Heywood tried next to say that one of the magistrates' sons had given a sort of sanction for the proceedings ; but as this son was only a minor, say 15 or 16 years of age, and which the Commis sioners knew right well, the police officer was obliged to give up this defence also; at last he admitted that he had no authority for thus acting, but having heard from some one whose name he could not or would not tell, that they were in the habit of administering oaths, he thought it only his duty to do as he had done. Page, the drunken officer, first entered the lodge. Heywood_ said, He did not like to tell all. The town is comparatively deserted to-day ; proba- bly the money is growing scarce with many. All the, factories are still standing ; and there is no chance ot resuming operations next week even. This, however, Cannot last very long. People cannot starve , and they must eat. It is thought that this inquest will last several days ; indeed it cannot be otherwise, seeing that more than forty witnesses on both sides have still to be examined. It can only be shortened by the ( 4 jury expressing themselves satisfied with what they . have heard. The operatives are exceedingly well sa tisfied with the panel. TEN O'CLOCK SATURDAY MORNING.-- two or three coaches filled with the rioters at Oldham just arrived. They are lodged in the New Bailey. A meeting took place this day at Readman Edge Moor, near Mosley, three miles from Oldham, w hen resolutions were come to again not to work till the two Unionists are at liberty. The Manchester Grand Jury have found true bills against them, and they probably be tried here next week. the P. S. The following resolutions were passed at meeting on Wednesday morning : itself , t, 1. That the Trades' Union in Oldham pledges 1 as far as possible, to preserve the peace. " 2. That the Trades' Union, anxious to maintain PI and harmony, and, as far as possible, to maintain the p..tui_.„ police in breaking into our lodges, and disturbing peace and the laws, deprecate the conduct of the Oldw: There are t ceedings. thou " 3. That this meeting deprecates the conduct of engaged in destroying property yesterday. •ll the " 4. That this meeting will not go to work ti present excitement is finally settled." Iv one, There is only one opinion, there can be ° n '-' f a w an ° that the police officers, by their rashness an .„ Authority, have been the sole cause of this most lament,lives able affair, an affair which may cost some their and many their liberties for life. It is pretty cl ear ' , nay certain, had the police officers only taken the coT mon precaution of having their prisoners gu arded ° Y the military when on their way to Hillenwood for el a ; mination, that no rescue would have taken place , n ° , any thing more than some warm expressions of abln r a rence and indignation at the conduct of Heywoo d "- Page. On their heads lies the guilt. (From the Second Edition of the Leeds MercurP l ) . Manchester, Friday evening, Half-past 7 o'ci c)c-. ing ADDITIONAL PARTICULARS.—On Thursday ...- -n ot a six additional companies of infantry arrived an Stockport and Rochdale, and seven persons were tvl, i , our pro into custody. The meeting, did not take place the morning, in consequence of the interference d Act gentleman who owns the ground, and of the Rit p ,dy being read at an early hour to such as were g u m a v er present. The meeting was adjourned to Moor, to be held at ten in the forenoon. the solicitors V reporters,b o o , c d l y o o k f o t the yr deceased.efivveen witnesses Mr. Ferrand proceeded to hold an inquest ad m it r ifr• s u hf s oa u rd a l e , bi te h he e enr perefusedaxratmy.i toexamine e i tai ci •t: except that of the first, who was a workman o f the Thomson's, no useful trace could be o btained as t o an d nature of their evidence. The town was qui et ' lli probably will remain so, except some accidental co sion takes place betwixt the military and the people. n n ,ns,cwvgeairoicefii Thursday hn,Gwottnrahoesyeeiwncn who course petitionit c e crhhh N s i e, e wc n Dhoho i u i fai evening g prdhm. ti lay aoa Majesty meetingHepdts:het speech cim Woolwich, opoortropheti eehsio:eni impressed ce imbc t , uieht or go i ° )(t Pi Bern,_o bokeooy_ff meeting 3G a teieh t raa i eee O v teterh e ki and Lewisham, was held in the Mitre Tai of the sentence on the unionists. Pee n ' t - e u T n h i e o y ns m a ig dm ht it d t e in p g en t d he e i p r e m n e i m t members iwfitthheout oaths a not come to the unreasonable terms of tigheb°tir to the law i d masters, la_ masters must ultimately come to the terms of the d . bourers. Mr. Powell, Mr. Keeton, and others a ss dressed the meeting, and the petition to the sing W agreed to. The Trades' Unionists in this town are, 0 : 8 ,. fear, daily gaining strength. We understand that ten; original oath has been abandoned, and another syst . of affirmation substituted, in order to elude the Nig: of the law. Delegates from the tailors' union in LcT e don, it is said, arrived here on Monday, when all th e journeymen tailors were summoned to attend t!',.', lodge ; and such as attended were initiated. This."_ we believe, all that is known ; for the whole of tu ; men seem spell-bound as soon as they are initiatei9 taciturnity thus takes the place of volubility. It I also reported that the tailors contemplate a genera strike, as soon as the spring trade sets in, not for wages, but as regards the hours of labour. \%e are informed that the modest wish of the tailors is to com mencewould their daily labours at eight o'clock in the morn ing, work till twelve, have two hours for-dinner, and finish work at six, devoting the remainder. of the t:1 1 _0 0 ' to .recreation. We understand that upwards of Ib. agricultural labourers have come into the town withll the lasf few days, to join the union societies establish' : here. The shoemakers met at the Artichoke, .., fLeTuesdayomaadloens., and e v A en f i t n eom g , Female l formateo t b a e i initiated iru rneiocne. L b o delegate s y dgsed.:,_ vr, ; i l9 ; Gazette. , , f .,, v A JERSEYMAN.—A Jerseyman WOula vt-iiii, Sider the occupation of a tailor beneath him • an d , t he trade is, therefore, in the country, i n the hands O' ", per cll'Y' Inglis's Channel Islands, Vic. we5___......000, BIRTHS. 'On the 14th inst., at Tunbridge Wells, the 101 r Heneage, Esq., M.P., of a still-born child. ro o w a On the 16th inst., at Old, Northamptonshire, Harrington, of a daughter. kleO ncier On the 17th inst., in Hanover-terrace, Mrs. Boyd ' th e of a son. On the 13th inst., at Weston Rectory, near CanT le'' , lady of the Rev. R. Allan Scott, of a son. of )f"' On the 15th inst., at Rodney.house, Clifton, the 1 3— Pringle, Esq., of a daughter. D. • On the 17th inst., at Southam MARRIE pton, Jos. Jas.. ti o u „nt; oi son of Sir Joseph Wallis Hoare, Bart., of Annabellas e Cork, and nephew to the Marquis of Thomonk t i ° sod eldest daughter of Henry A. Hardman, Esq., of I D *" VP' ampton. ftev. ,01 On the 15th inst., at Walcot Church, Bath, ta e f Scott, M.A., son of the late Rev. T. Scott, wattcanaugtil Norfolk, to Sophia Anne Wolfe Woodley, younges t tie r. 4 of Charles Woodley, Esq., of the Island of St. Christoliootsi; On the 17th inst., at All Souls' Church, Henry 11 ", c torb a , Esq., of Kyre, Wexford, nephew of the late Lord Dr 3 of Eugenia Fanny, only child of Simon J. Rochard, gent-street. On the Ist inst., at Sidmouth, the Rev. John BaC° , oscoh oe of Corpus Christi College, Cambridge, eldest son ofJol'f to I Esq., of Sidcliff, Devon, to Mary, second daughter 0 1 , M. B. Lousada, Esq. On the 17th inst., at St. George's, Hanover-s o3 f, r e Ce t P topher A. Hagerman, Esq., Solicitor. Gener al of !VP — o r to Elizabeth Emily, daughter of William Merry, F A. sO,Vpl• downe-terrace, Cheltenham, l a t e Deputy Secretary at 'il, On the 15th inst., at Walcot Church, Bath, th e r o 0%0 Scott, M.A., son of the late Rev. T. Scott, Of Wa.- ;a ' Norfolk, to Sophia Anne Wolfe Woodley, Yo ung : es t t allto of Charles Woodley, Esq., of the Island of St. Chris' e h e'yn' On the 29th ult., at Lisbon, at the Protestant chu:',4ol, city, Charles Payant, Esq., to Miss Guillerinin a t o ns denbergh, Esq., Consul. General for the Hansc 1. 4 Kingdom of Po 7, rtugal. . es ty q. On the 14th inst., C. M. Pocock, Esq., of his Le acY , toms, London, to Ann, eldest daughter of „ler Lewes, Sussex On the 16th . 1, inst., Edward Ings, Esq., of the Cr P to Belle Emily Lydia, youngest dau g hter of f ul i3 .e o l: sl ' i rilic Esq., of Craven-house, Hants, and Chilton-hous e ',"tt, On the 15th inst., at Lewisham, Mr. Joh n Grove, Hackney, to E iza, daughter of the late }l e ' fo et son on King, the of l s ; h Tottenham.ins inst., George Gillman, Esq., /33— h e Pr'' E sqo. n mouth, btah t re o r i 1 Ann, youngest t; y si aot ins"., n ,a g tt e o s Mt Hammersmith, i sMiss daughter maifii o i d f e E d . ura r d - c a 5 ,, 1 ,_ e r : , , _AO , the same place. la d O i° ' On the 16th inst., in St. James's Church, ft° %/- ° the late Wm. Wilson, of Kendal, to Charles c li b t ef e baPtfff . : Go o ds n tf t m h e e . ft ° 17th inst ,in herD6l9Ethp'year, Miss 1 0 nottfr Fan On thshawe, of Berkel „ s e 20th inst., ey-square. at Argyll-house, Lady Frances h." thly daughter of the Earl of Aberdeen. - hetb, On the 12th inst., in her 19th year, Ellen EliZ3—treet.„,ft. daughter of Mr. Henry Rodwell, of Great PortlancP., o f ifi On the 15th inst., in Bedford-place, Margaret, vii' D i Chandler, 17th Lancers. v ote, o , On the 30th ult.. Eliza, relict of John Ilobda): Do VI Boughton House, Kent, an d gra nddaughter of Sir JO if I `. of Newtown Hall, Montgomerys hi re , Bart. 6 ,0 0 On the 14th inst., in Kensington.squ are, D „ faj or- William Douglas, K.C.H., aged 62. gen , ' "ste " f On the 17th inst., at St. Mary Abbott's.terrace, sta 0 , i A n ts l v i o e .d r , 69 m t . h A y ., ea R r, ec K to i r tt o y f , BreuliecktwoofrtthheallX Ti io r g o n ge, o° 4 and Perpetual Curate of Hammersmi th, Middlesex' et, jta r i ' ,/ , On the 15th inst., aged 22, in Upp er HarleY". _idge, Legh Parnell, Scholar of Pembrok e College, Canw. ~f son of Samuel Parnell, Esq. et fe.. le " ofr' On the 14th inst., at Lyme Regis , Mary Margo , i ier .p the late Thomas Symonds, Es :., of the Mynde par'', shire, aged 69. Q. Loudon: Printed and Published by MURDO 1 A the Snn ()flit*, kie, 112, $10114.: ', ~ Y ►, t,