The Sun. — London, England, 1827-03-28 00:00:00

PARV!AMIZNT. WOLIS2 OF LORDS, Warts Q 7. BREACH OF PRIVILEGE. Attu the meeting of the Hotter., and before the corn nienrainent of public business, strartgen were ordered t° eithd raw , w h en Mr. John Bell was (as we understood) 'adled to the bar, and, after having made suitable apology for the circumstance which led to his being summoned, which was accepted, he was allowed to withdraw. CATHOLIC CLAIMS. The Bishop of LANDAFF presented a petition from the 'clergy of the southern division of Landoll against the Roman Catholic claims. The Earl of LONGFORD presented petite -As against the Roman Catholic claims from parishes in Tyrone and Armagh. Lord HOLLAND held in his hand two petitiotas, which had been sent to him to be presented to thelt Lordships, one of which came from the Roman Catholic inhabitants of the parish of St. Peter, county D rogheda, and the other from the Roman Catholic inhabitants of the parish of Naas , county Kildare. The prayer of both the petitions was to the same purport, namely, that their Lordships should repeal an Act of the present king, passed in the last Ses sion of Paulir:went, respecting Vestries in Ireland. With respect to 'the allegations contained in the petition regarding that pP:rticular Act, he was not able to say any thing, as he lead no local knowledge respecting the circumstances. He believed that Act was passed with a view to lessen the e yds complained of, but it had, as the petitioners stated, ',greatly aggravated those evils ; and if only half of the statement of the petitioners was true, he had no hesitation in saying that the Act ought to be repealed. One of the petitions, in urging their arguments for the re peal of the act he had mentioned, stated that the Church of Ireland was the richest church in all the world, where so few persons professed the faith of the Church. The petition stated that a very large proportion of the people of Ireland did not profess the faith of the Established Church. The petitioners ales) stated, that, by the ancient laws of the coun try, and by the common law, which, for ought they knew, was still in existence, a part of the revenues of the Church ought to be appropriated for the relief of the poor, and the building and repairing of churches. The petitioners also stated, that at the time when the Church and its revenues were tramferrcd from the controul of their Catholic pro genitors into that of the Protestant Establishment, the churehes were in complete repair, and that no additional churches were required to be built ; but that, by neglect, or abuse, or by evasion of the law, the churches had been allowed to get into total decay, and the petitioners complained that the Act of Parliament laid on the Roman Catholics the burden of repairing those churches which, - had been incurred by some of the ministers of the churches themselves. That was what had been stated to him. He had no intention of moving any thing at present on the subject. He was aware that some persons might say, " Yost see that the intention of the Roman Catholics is to subvert the Irish Protestant church : you see in that Petition a proof of that which we have repeatedly stated to Parliament, that the Roman Ca tholics are actuated by a hostility to the Protestant estab lishment." All he could say in answer was, that if such were the views of the Roman Catholics, and if such hosti lity did exist in their minds against the Protestant church, it was created by those very persons who made that objec tion. The people of Ireland might submit to the payment of that church, the faith of which they did not profess : they might submit to that payment without irritation, when they considered that that church was preferred by the opulent part of the country, and cherished and pro tected by a large proportion of the empire to which they belonged. But when they were told, and told repeatedly, in the most - emphatic manner, that that church was the at bar to the enjoyment of their rights, it was a little too much to exspect that they should not be actuated by feelings of heistility; or to suppose, that when Parliament chose to neglect and thwart the only mode which could lead te. peace and good government, that they should not wash to destroy that edifice which had divided for a long period the Roman Catholics from their privileges. But it was the rejection of the claims of the Roman Catholics -by persons opposed to the measure, which alone had raised that hostility. Before he answered the objec tion of those persons whiz ! ' thought the constitution would be endangered by granting those claims, he wished them to point out in what manner the admission of a few Roman Catholics in Parliament would add one jot to their power, while at the same time it might diminish some of the hos tility which existed. Upon them must the responsibility fall and they must be answerable for all the effects which the frequent rejection: of ' the Catholic claims might pro- duce. He beheld with some concern the natural effect and ronsequenee which the rejection of the claims of the Catholics of Ireland had produced in that part of the em pire. He now thought it his duty to present the peti tions, and they were perfectly respectfully worded. The Earl of LONGFORD had net intended to have said a word on the subject, knowing how inconvenient to the House such conversations were ; but when their Lord ships heard ouch remarks as the Noble Lord had just made, brought forward continually from day to day, he could not let them go- forth to the country without some observa tions, and in doing so be should confine himself to the last remark of the Noble Lord. , The arguments for granting the Roman Catholic claims were to be regarded in two points of view. The first was one of general policy, result ing from motives of general expediency or justice ; and the second was, with respect to the effect which the granting of the Catholic claims would have on the tranquilization and amelioration of the condition of Ireland. He doubted the justness of these opinions. It was now 150 years since those restrictions had been imposed which excluded the Roman Catholics from political power. Repeated op portunities had occurred for considering, re-considering, and discussing the object of those restrictions, and every time Parliament had decided that these restrictions were necessary and politic, and every time had rejected to re peal those laws which enacted them ; and he was surprised how any persons cculd declare on their own opinions that those restrictions were unjust which the law proclaimed to be just. Lord HOLLAND said, the Noble Lord was mistaken, if he supposed the petitions prayed for a repeal of Roman Catholic Restrictions. The Earl of LONGFORD had not intended to advert to the petitions, but to the observations of the Noble Lord ; and when the Noble Lord stated that the responsibility was upon those who rejected the claims of the Catholics, he must say that the responsibility was upon those who would do away with those restrictions, so important for the good of the country. The Earl of BELMORE presented two petitions from the Roman Catholic inhabitants of parishes in the counties of Fermanagh and Tyrone. He would not enter into the general merits of the question atlitesent, but would take the liberty of remarking, that not only the Noble Lords who were of the same opinion as himself on the subject of the Catholic claims, but also those Noble Lords who were of a different opinion, were relieved from all responsibility by the acts of the members who composed his Majesty's Go vernment, who had gone to the full extent of concession to the Roman Catholics, without giving them political power. The only question now was, whether they should stop short without completing that plan. It appeared that the argu ment chiefly relied on for the exclusion of the Catholics from power, was that it was inexpedient to free the Roman Catholics from the disabilities under which they laboured, on account of the principles of the Roman Catholic Church. That argument went to the extent of declaring that the Constitution of this country was not calculated for the cemfort or enjoyment of the rights of one third of the people of the British Empire. He, for one, could never accede to such a proposition, nor could he comprehend how those persons who had allowed relief to the Roman Catholics to a great extent, could be satisfied to suffer the laws to re main as they were, and stop short, as it were, in a system which had been so well begun. GRANT TO THE DUKE OF CLARENCE. Earl BATHURST moved the second reading of an act to grant further provision to the Deka and Duchess of Clarence. Lord KING stated that the Noble Earl, who had just moved the second reading of the Bill for granting a further provision to the Duke and Duchess of Clarence, had thought proper not to say a word to their Lordships on the subject. He should have rather thought, that in such a case as the present the Noble Lord would have stated some reason for the additional grant. From the circum stance of this Bil: s_sroing been left a long time elsewhere, without any notice being taken of it, there seemed to he a desire to get it smuggled through this House, without saying a word upon the matter. Perhaps the Noble Lord thought that, as he was going to make corn very dear, it , was necessary to raise every thing in proportion. Or per haps it was because he thought the time favourable fee ra4 hl7, a grant. He had chosen a favourable opportunity for it Whil e great distress existed among the manufacturers, as Be lt year probably there would be great distress among , the a g r iculturists. The Noble Lord had timed his shot well—he had sent it between wind and water. He did not know .the ,reason why the Government had been so long without a bead. He certainly wished for an efficient 3liuister to take charge of such things as the present. He thought the Noble Lord looked like an efficient Minister yesterday. It w. certainly high time for their Lordships that there should be an efficient Minister, for they looked like a Bork of sheep without iheiih.rd, and til-v vsF•re bleating in every tete of the gamut, from L sharp to n flat But (pointing to Lord Bathurit)— ‘ Hic sir, hic est, tibi quern promltti swpitis " Augustus Cmsar, Divuin genus, aurca condet ig • This was certainly a golden age for princes, for palaces, and for Ireland, Ile had a petition intrusted to him to present against the present Bill; but he had never known when the Bill was to be read a second time. Earl BATHURST stated, that his Noble Priend (the Earl of Liverpool), in moving an address in answer to the message of his Majesty, proposing an increase to the pro vision of the Duke and Duchess of Clarence, in conse qtience of their present situation, stated what would be proposed as the amount of that additional increase. His Noble Friend stated that an income of 3,000/. devolved on the Duke of Clarence in consequence of the death of the Duke of York, and that an addition of 9,0001. was proposed to be made for the maintenance of the Duke and Duchess of Clarence. He also stated, that 3,000/. was to go to the Duke of Clarence, and 6,0001. to the Duchess. Such was the statement made by his Noble Friend when he moved the address, and their Lordships had unani mously consented to it, and he therefore had a right to conceive that they had consented not only to the increase itself, but also to the particular manner in which that in crease was made. Such being the case, he did not think it necessary to trouble their Lordships with any observa tions in moving the second reading of the Bill, because that Bill only enacted that which his Noble Friend, on moving the address to his Majesty, had stated to their Lordships, at which time it met with their unanimous concurrence. And what was this increase ? It was an increase by which the Duke and Duchess of Clarence would be entitled to receive upon the whole, an income of 35,5001. He could net conceive that there could be any serious objection to such income for the Heir Preeumptive of the Imperial Crown of Great Britain and Ireland. His Noble Friend had devoted a great deal of attention to the financial distress of the country, but their Lordships would recollect that they had unanimously granted 60,000/. per annum as a provision to her Royal Highness the Princess Charlotte of Wales. At that time she was standing in the same relation to his Majesty as the Duke of Clarence now stood in, namely, the Presumptive Heiress of the Crown of Great Britain, the Duke of Clarence being now Presumptive Heir. But the Princess Charlotte was one degree further removed than the Duke of Clarence, being Presumptive Heiress to the Heir Apparent. He was con vinced their Lordships could not object to such a grant. The Bill was then read a second time. CAPE OF GOOD HOPE. Lord KENYON presented a petition from Mr. Parker, stating, that he had gone out to the Cape of Good Hop. with a colony of 200 men ; that he had returned with his fortunes broken, having met with a loss of 3,0001. and of four years of his life, and praying for redress, and com plaining of the conduct of Colonel Bird. The Noble Lord slid not wish to be identified with the party from whom the petition came; but thought the circumstances of the case well worthy of their Lordships' consideration, and especially of his Majesty's Secretary of State for the Co lonies. Earl BATIIURST stated, that Mr. Parker had made several applications to be permitted to go out to the Cape of Good Hope. He embarked, perfectly aware of the conditions under which he was allowed to go, but ever since his arrival in that country he had been making com plaints. The petitioner stated, that in consequence of his representations Col. Bird had been removed from his situa tion. He was removed from his situation of Colonial Se cretary, not on account of any representations of Mr.. Par ker, not on account of his professing the Roman Catholic religion, but on account of the serious misunderstanding which exi s t e d between him and the Governor-General of the Colony, which went to the interruption of the business of that Colony. He had been removed with a pension in consideration of his long services, and on account of his large family. Mr. Parker states, that on his arrival at the Cape of Good Hope, he was asked by Colonel Bird whether he had not brought over with him any Catholic priests, and when he stated that he had not, that Colonel Bird had acted towards him with great hardship. The al legations of Mr. Parker had been submitted to the Com missioners of Inquiry, and had proved to be without foun dation. There had been something stated in the petition relating to the prevention of intercourse between the bor derers and settlers. It bad been found very necessary to discourage all intercourse between the settlers and the Catfres, and it was a penalty for any Caffre to be found among the settlers. That intercourse had been discou raged for this reason—because, though at first it was corn- eencnkeeitie, an makable feeling. ye‘it On ware. broultht The Earl of CALEDON should say but a few words after the clear explanation of the Noble Earl; but as he had been officially connected with Colonel Bird, he could assure their Lordships that there never was a better or more efficient officer. The Eatl of ROSSLYN thought the petition could not be received, as it bad no prayer, but only pressed for an inquiry into the conduct of an individual. Lord KENYON said, that the petitioner stated that he had suffered a great loss, and prayed for redress, as also for a correction of the evils he complained of. With respect to the person to whom the blame, if any were due, was to attach, he could say that it was not to Lord Charles Somerset, as he was absent at the time, and had left an acting Governor-General. After some conversation, the petition was ultimately re jected on the motion of Lord Caledon. The Marquis of LANSDOWN gave notice, that he should on Friday next move for an account of the number of appeals brought over from the Courts of India, and the number of decisions thereon.—Adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS.-TUESDAY. The gallery was not opened to the public this evening until five o'clock, in consequence of the ballots which took place for the Marlborough and Banffshire Election Com mittees. The names of the defaulters absent at the ballot on Wednesday, the 21st of March, who had been ordered to attend this day, and who had not attended, were then called over. Several were excused, in consequence of ill ness and other causes; and the Hon. John G. W. Forester, and another Hon. Member, whose name we could:not catch, were ordered to be taken into custody by the Sergeant at Arms. MARLBOROUGH PETITION. The following are the names of the Committee sworn and appointed to try the merits of this petition :—The Hon. G. J. W. A. Ellis, Mr. Abel Smith, Mr. Robert Price, Sir Henry Hardinge, Mr. T. E. Kemp, Lord Marquis of Worcester, Alderman John Atkins, Mr. C. Mackinnon, Mr. C. P. Thomson, Lord James Townahend, General Gascoyne, Alderman Thompson, Sir Jas. Graham, and Thomas G. B. Eatcourt. Mr. BELL presented a petition from certain occupiers of land in the north part of Northumberland, praying for the protection of the landed interest. Mr. VAN HOMRIGH presented a petition from the Chamber of Commerce of Drogheda, praying that the duty on coals might be taken off. BANFFSHIRE PETITION. The following Members were sworn, anti appointed of the Committee to try this election petition :—Mr. W. J. Denison, Lord P. J. Stuart, Hon. W. H. Lascelles, Mr. J. M. Dawson, Mr. Arthur French, Mr. J. D. B. Evans, Mr. W. Beauchamp, Mr. L. Peel, Mr. E. H. A'Court, Mr. Abel R. Dottie, Mr. T. Alcock, Mr. T. Chaplin, Mr. W. Henry Fellowes, Dr. Phillimore, and Sir G. Warrender. FLEET PRISON. Mr. PEEL rose, with reference to a notice of motion made by the Hon. Member for Aberdeen, for a Committee to inquire into the state of the Fleet and other prisons, which stood for this evening. He wished the Hon. Gen tleman would consent to postpone this motion to another day, because he (Mr. Peel) had written to the Chief Jus __. . _.. . . tice of the King's Bench, who was at present on circuit, on the subject, and his answer had not as yet arrived.— He wished to make one observation with reference to what was stated to have fallen from the Honourable Member for Aberdeen when he gave notice of this motion, The Ho nourable Member was reported to have said, that frequent applications had been made to the Chief Justice of the Court of Common Pleas, with reference to the state of the Fleet Prison, which had not been attended to. Now the fact was, that no such applications had been made, either to the Chief Justice of the King's Bench or the Common Pleas ; and it was but justice to the latter dis tinguished individual to say, that no application of the kind had ever been made to him to which immediate at tention had not been given. He mentioned this on the authority of the Chief Justice of the Common Pleas, in answer to the observation of the Honourable Member. Mr. HUME had no hesitation in saying, that when the prisoners confined in the Fleet Prison stated their complaint to him he advised them in the first instance to apply to the Chief Justice of the Common Pleas. They applied to the Chief Justice accordingly, but, after waiting three or four days, no answer was received. So far, therefore, he (Mr. Hume) was correct in what he stated. It appeared, how ever,: that the day after the business was noticed in the House, a person deputed by the Lord Chief Justice of the Common Pleas sent a person to the prison to inquire into the complaint of the prisoners. The only mistake, there fore, was with regard to time. Having given this expla nation, he had now no hesitation in sayinq that he should defer hie motion, on the suggestion of the night Hon. Gentleman to Thunday next. Mr. PEEL said that it appeared from the statement of the lion. Gentleman that Le had not said that the Chief Justice of the Common Pleas was in the habit of passing over the complaints of the prisoners confined in the prison, over which he held control, and the Hon. Member had ad mitted that immediate attention had been paid to their case when the Chief Justice was made acquainted with it. The only difference between the statements of the Hon. Illember was with regard to the time when the complaint was at tended to. IRISH SHIPPING. On the motion of General DUFF, is was ordered that here he laid upon the table of the House an account of the number of ships, with their freight and tonnage, entered outwards and i nwar d s , at t h e severa l por t s o f Ireland, in the year 1827, distinguishing British and foreign vessels. Mr. KEMP presented a petition from certain owners and occupiers of land in Sussex, praying for protection to the landed interest. On the motion of Sir Jour( NEWPORT, it was ordered that there be laid before the House a copy of the report of the Newry Navigation Committee. On Monday night, Mr. Fowr.u. BUXTON gave notice of a motion, after the holidays, to prevent the immolation of Hindoo widows on the funeral piles of their husbands. Mr. HUME presented a petition from a person named Logan, complaining of want of accommodation for pri soners in the Fleet Prison.—Ordered to he printed. On the motion of Mr. lirevicoTE, a return was or dered of the number of ships (and the amount of their ton nage, with the number of men and boys employed in them) which cleared out from the ports of the United Kingdom to foreign ports, from January 1826, to January, 1827. DUNLEARY AND novrni HARBOURS. :11r. H. GRATTAN, after some remarks on the sub ject of the experiments made by the Post .office in the esta blishment of packets between * Holyhead and Dunleary and Howth, and between Dunleary and Liverpool, moved fur several returns connected with those establishments; among others, for a return of the number of voyages made by his Majesty's steam-packets from Holyhead to Howth, and from Liverpool to Dunleary, in the year 1826 ; also for a return of the number of hours and minutes occupied by such packets in their respective voyages from Holyhead to Duuleary ; an account of the shortest passages made from Holyhead to Dunleary and Howth, and the difference of time between such voyages.—The motion was agreed to. On the motion of Mr. COURTENAT, a Select Committee was appointed to take into consideration the laws affecting " Friendly Societies," and to report their opinions and ob servations thereupon to the House. A MEMBER IN CUSTODY. The SPEAKER informed the House that Mr. Forester (one of the Members who had been absent from the ballot on the 21st inst., and who had not attended in his place this day), was then in the custody of the Sergeant at Arms. It was then moved and carried, that Mr. Forester be discharged, on the payment of his fees. The Annual Duties Bill was read a third time, and passed. WRIT OF RIGHT BILL. On the motion of Mr. Stianwam., this Bill was read a second time. On the question that it be committed, Mr. D. W. HARVEY expressed a hope that the Hon. and Learned Gentleman would not press this Bill at the present time, more particularly as, from what bad fallen from the Right Hon. Secretary opposite (Mr. Peel), there was reason to hope that he would he ready, in the course of the present, or early in the next Session, to introduce some general measure respecting the transfer of real pro perty. The Bill now before the House referred but to a small part of the general subject, and that in a manner not affording a happy s p ec i men of the H onoura bl e a n d Learned Gentleman's legislative notions ; it was defective in parts which it might have made an improvement. It would, he thought, produce no good, but on the contrary would in: some respects be in jurious. He did not say that the Honourable Member did not mean well, but his measure did not go far enough in some points, and too far in others. The Honourable Member then went on to point out the various modes of expense to which a party was put in levying a fine in the every day practice of a woman giving up her claim to her portion of her husband's property. The prOcessisidlo kt . • through some six or seven officee before it was complete, and at the expence of 201. Now, let the House contrast this tedious and expensive process with the simple one which was resorted to and held sufficient in cases of copy uota 43 et t There, if a wife was illeposed to 'eye up trr claim on her husband's property, she might do so by going before the steward of the manor, and by taking hold of one end of a stick of which the steward held the other (in deed a poker was made use of on some occasions), and by that means might signify the alienation of her claim, and the steward's certificate to that effect was held sufficient proof of each alienation, and was as effectual for its object as the levying a fine in the Court of Common Pleas. An, easy and simple process for the same purpose Was known to prevail in several corporate towns. It was the caseiin London, and in the town which he had the honour to re present. There a lady might go before the Mayor, and signify her intention to resign her claim, and the Mayor's certificate, for which she paid only a shilling, was a suffi cient attestation of the fact. Mr. BERNAL expressed a hope that the Learned Gen tleman would not withdraw his bill, which, as far as it went, would be found very useful, and would; save a great deal of expense. The old and antiquated forms attending the trial of a writ of right, were too absurd to be allowed to continue in the year 1827. In other respects also the exist ing anomalies were absurd. For instance, a man bequeath ing by will a real estate of N. a year, was obliged to have his will attested by three witnesses, while a man who be queathed 15,0001. of customary or copyhold estate, had no occasion to have his will attested even by a single witness. He did hope that those anomalies would be abolished, and also that some steps would be adopted to do away with the enormous expense attending the purchase and transfer of property. This was a subject to which he hoped the at tention of the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Peel), would be directed. Mr. PEEL observed, that upon any specific plan which should be pursued, he had not made up his mind, for he was so overwhelmed with business, as to he unable to give it that attention which it deserved; but as far as he had considered it, he thought a preliminary inquiry should be devolved on a commission consisting of some members of the profession. Whether the commissioners were to be paid (and if gentlemen of the legal profession devoted their time, it could not be expected that' they would set gra tuitously) or not, he had not considered; but that was a question of minor importance. However, that some such inquiryas to the present modes of transferring real property, should precede any legislative measure on the subject, he had no doubt, and the question was one to which he was disposed to give the fullest consideration.--(Hear, hear.) Dr. LUSHINGTON congratulated the House upon the prospect thus held out of having OMB steps taken towards the abolition of the present tedious and expensive process in the conveyance of property. He himself had seen an abstract of a title, which occupied not fewer than SOO sheets—(hear, hear,)---and yet it was drawn up by a most respectable solicitor, who found that be could not avoid that course consistently with his chit) , to his client. He hap pened to he concerned in the purchase of property sold under an Act of Parliament, and the respectable convey ancer employed felt it his duty to object to the title under the very Act which he had himself framed, and it cost 100 guineas to have the doubt as to that title removed. Now, ke thought that when /such difficultiee'attend e d the pur chase of property, and the establishment of titles, it was time for the Legislature to interfere. Bet their first step should be to ascertain the nature and extent of the evil, and then, in devising a remedy, care should be taken that other evils were not let in, as great as those which it wa s in tended to remove. Mr. FERGUSON hoped that the Tim and Learned Member for Ripon (Mr. Shadwell) would not press this Bill en the House at present, but would leave 'the whole matter in the hands of the Right Hon. Gentleman near him (Mr. Peel), who had expressed his willingn e „, to h ave this portion of the law of the country amended as soon as possible. The ATTORNEY-GENERAL expressed himself will ing to lend his bumble assistance to the improvement of the formal and instrumental modes of conveyancing. Mr. PEEL repeated, that he did not mean to pledge himself at present to the appointment of a Commission. He wished the inquiry into this branch of the law of Eng land, whenever it took place, to be conducted by persons whose experience would carry with it a warrant to the public that any measures which they might prope l* wou ld be judicious. He pledged himself that the subject should shortly be taken into consideration. Mr. SHADWELL would gladly give his assistance to such a Commission as the Right Hon. Secretary near him had spoken of ; but as some time would necessarily occur before the recommendations to which that Com m i ss i o n might come could be carried into execution, be thought that his Bill ought to be in operation during the inteital. ' Theßill was then ordered to be committed on Frid a y ne xt. CORN LAWS. Sir A. GRANT brought up the Report of the Resolu tions on the Corn Trade Acts. On the question that it be now read, Mr. HUME commenced by a recapitulation of the ob.. serrations used by Mr. Canning in proposing the resolu tions, and of the arguments used by both sides of the House in defence and reprobation of them. He differed from every person who had yet spoken on the subject. He was of opinion that protection ought not to be granted to the landed interest, even to the amount of a shilling, unless they could show that they were liable to taxes which the other classes of the community did not bear. At the same time lie admitted, that in whatever degree they proved that they were taxed beyond others, to that degree they de served protection. Ile contended that, after the declara tions whichillinieters had made three years ago respecting free trade, they were bound to take an even course between the agricultural and the manufacturing interests, and not to favour one of them at the ea:pence of the other. He con ceived the present resolutions to give an unjust preference to the agricultural interest, and to be injurious to the gene ral prospects of the country. Some gentlemen might sup pose that there was a difference between the producer cor n and the producer of shoes ; but he was convinced from long study that they were mistaken. The farmer was as much interested in having a low price of food as any man who manufactured either shoes or woollens or any other commodity. He entered his solemn protest against the doctrine that the farmer was a party interested in this ques tion. It was a question between the landowners and the rest of the community, save only where the farmer had a long lease of the premises of which he wee the occupier._ The present plan grew out of the conduct of speculators, who, in the course of the war, had brought into cu lti va ti on a great quantity of poor land ; and, times having altered, they now called on the House, as all speculators would do, to support them. Their object was to exclude from compe tition the produce of other and better soils. He objected to any such system, because he wished the pi inciple of free trade to be adopted with respect to every species of commo dity. He would buy corn wherever it could be obtained at the cheapest rate—and lie would pay for it with the manufactures of the country. In tins case nine-tenths of the people were opposed to the landowners ; and if a working men were enabled to procure two bushels of wheat for his day's labour, through the medium of fo reign importation, he was bound to do so, instead of getting cnc bushel, by preferring those agricultural inte rests as they were called. He might he told that the land owner,: wished that every person should receive a just re muneration ; but how did their conduct bear out that as sertion, when they endeavoured to keep up the price of every necessary of life, and thus praver:ed the manufactu rer from comparing with foreign countries; the conse quence of which Must necessarily he, the decrease of wages, and the throwing many individuals out of employment?-- It was, however, said, that without this system of protec tion were continued, the country would run the chance of being visited by famine. " It is not," said the landown er, "for my own sake, hut for the sake of the public, that I desire this protection." A snore fallacious argument never was advanced. If they would suffer corn to be im ported only when it arrived at those very high prices which could rarely occur, then foreign countries would not be encouraged to grow corn, which they might exchange for English manufactures; but if on the other hand, corn were freely admitted, then the whole world, on whom they must depend for trade, would he able to prepare an abundant supply of grain, to assist this country, if it suffered from the failure of the crops, or from any other circumstance. Without looking to average., a system which might be abused—without looking at the price of grain, lie would open the ports to corn in the same way as they were open to other articles. He would open a trade immediately with every other coun try that had surplus corn to sell, and thus increase the de mand for the manufactures of England. His proposition was, that the ditty should now be laid at 155., and that la. should be taken off every year, until it came to a perma tient tax of 10s: Though he was tilling to do this, yet he was convinced that the agriculturists were cot able to show that they paid in taxes more than four shillings above the other classes of the community. If this were done, the population would consume all the corn that was imported, as well as that which was grown in this country. The workmen would be well paid, and the manufacturers would be enabled to get off their goods. Such would be the effect of setting free the trade in corn; but the present law tended to produce want and destitu tion, in the country. He wished to introduce a ccuntervail iug, tax, to the amoutii, which the land-owners could show they Veit bovine the other' Viart of Ithe=e'olianiunity. somewhat audible conversation between several gentlethen, here occasioned the Hon. Gentleman to complain that due attention was not paid to him). He was peifectly willing to do one of two things ; and he should like to know how far the Hon. Member for Wareham (Mr. Calcraft) would meet him. The land-owners, it was said, paid 5,000,0001. or 10,000,000/. more of taxes than the other branches of the community did. Now, he would either repeal those taxes, or give them a countervailing duty, in proportion to the amount which they proved they paid beyond the other classes of the community. It was asserted by a Noble Lord ihanotherplace, that the land-owners paid 24-25ths 'of the - poor-rates. This, however, was not the fact. Last yearthe poor-rates and parish-rates amounted to 6,900,0001. Of this, 2,700,000/. was raised on dwelling-houses, and the remaining 4,200,000/. on the land ; therefore, the land appeared to contribtite - two-thirds Of the poor-rates, or 2,000,0001. more than the other classes of the commu nity. If, however, this slim of 4,200,0001. were divided into three parts, it would be found that one-third was not I paid by the land-owners. The remaining two-thirds, or about 2,500,000/., were paid by them. But of this 2,500,0001., nine-tenths, he was prepared to show, consisted of wages. The Honourable Member then proceeded to enumerate the other burdens to which the land-owners complained that they were peculiarly liable. The Tithes be would remove ; and in their place allow a fixed sum. The land-tax might be differently modified ; and, with respect to the county rates, the coun try gentlemen had no right to complain of them, as they were levied and laid Out by themselves. The duty laid upon a vast 'variety of the necessaries of life, amounted to an absolute prohibition of importation ; but this would not satisfy the country gentlemen, nothing would content them, unless that prohibition was extended to corn. It was contended that the home consumption was the great support of the British manufacturer. This was quite im possible, as would be seen by an account of the quantity of goods manufactured in a given time. The amount of tba valueof goods manufactured in 1824 was 44,000,000/. ; in 1825,49,000,000/. ; and in 1826, 47,000,0007. Now, it was impossible that this country could consume manufactures tothis extent. But if the trade in corn were thrown open, it would afford a vent , for those manufactures ; and every knife and stocking sent abroad would produce a profit that would enable the manufacturer to pay his portion of the in terest of the national debt. The Hon. Member proceeded - 0 argue that the hind-owners demanded a protecting duty for the purpose of Obtaining high rents. That was an ob ject unworthy of the attention of Parliament. Indeed, he was of opinion that if no rents whatever wire paid, it would be for the advantage of the country....._(L ou d laugh , ter. )—He concluded by saying, that he believed be had succeeded in expressing his sentiments clearly and distinctly .—(a laugh)—so as not to be understood.—(Great laughter.)—He meant so as not to be misunderstood. He then moved the following resolution :—" That from the sth of July, 1827, until the sth of July, 1828, the duty payable on any quarter of wheat imported into the United Kingdom shall be 15s. ; that from the sth of July, 1828, to the sth of July, 1829, the duty shall be 14s. ; and that this duty shall decrease Is. every year afterwards, until 1833, when a permanent duty of 10s. shall be established. Mr. MARSHALL addressed the House in a tone of voice so feeble, as to be almost inaudible in the gallery. ,We understood him to second the amendment, and to declare that the commercial interest of Yorkshire felt greatly disap pointed by the measures which Ministers had proposed relative to the trade in corn, from which they expected no substantial relief. Mr. IRVING entirely dissented from all that the Hon. Member for Aberdeen had stated on the subject. His pro poeition that the country would be benefited by the non payment of rents WAS quite untenable. The effect of such a s tate of things could not but be injurious to the best inte restsf h and Poland, where the landed prop r i e tors, in consequence of not ti eing a ble to obt a i n any certa i n i ncome , were enti re l y te country , as was ev i nce d i n t h e cas e of Prussi a dependent on, and under the controul of, the Government. The Hon. Member concluded by declaring, that he should be disposed always to confine the consumption of the country to its own produce as f ar as poss ibl e , a nd that he thought that s ystem a bad one which would leave the home agricul turist constantly open to the interference of foreigners. Sir H. PARNELL said that there was no doubt that, in t h e produce of manufactures, c apital might go on to be applied almost unlimitedly, and that the result would be a continued reduction of the article produced, in price; but the, case of agricultural produce was entirely different. The e xtent of the fertile land which be had to cultivate, must determine the extent in which capital could be applied to cultivation with ad van t age . Up to, a certain po i nt--so long as we worked onlypr ice cheapness of upon fertile lands—the• application of capital tendea ''to produce increased ' but. when the -continued applicati on o f ca pital l e d .us int° PUltiVging pOr,kioils i then the effect,of -that course would ha a rise of price ; th e quantity of labour, &c. requisite to make those twits productive was greater than that which we had been accustomed to apply before. If we cultivated poor land, while land of a superior quality was at our die posal, we in fact paid so much more for en averace crop than tie need do ; it sru go rout labour or capital thrown away ; and this was exactly the effect of our refusing to take corn from foreign countries. To look at this system, therefore, as. it affected the manufacturing interest, the quantity of corn consumed annually in this country was about 50,000,000 of quarters. If, by any law or arrange ment, all that corn was purchased at the rate of 10s. a quar ter higher than it need be, the charge so laid upon the public was 25,000,0001. ;in money. And this was the syste:n which gentlemen argued produced no injury to the coun try. What would be said, if the Treasury proposed to levy a tax of 10s. upon every quarter of corn consumed ? If all this 25,000,0001. went to the landlord, even that would not be entirely ruinous ; at all events, it would be a trans fa. simply of so much money from the pockets of one class of people to those of another. But the fact was, that taking the admitted average, that only one-third of the sell ing price of corn went for the landlord's rent, the landlord got only a third of it ; at the utmost, he did not receive half. And what became of the rest of the 25,000,0001. — that was, of the additional 10s. a quarter ? Why, the landlord got about 3s. of it, or 4s. ; and the rest was di rectly wasted—thrown away—laid out in producing that from a lower soil which a higher would have produced without its expenditure : it : was wasted i❑ growing corn at a higher price than wo could purchase it. The effect of this course was to encourage our manufacturers to carry their capital to foreign countries, where they could use it to more advantage than tkey could at home. Mr. W. WHITMORE could not concur in the emend ment of the Honourable Member near him (Mr. Home.) He was opposed to the proposition of a fixed duty, and was convinced that it would be found impossible ever to main tain such a duty as lOs., subject to a scarcity price. Mr. IRVING explained. Mr. CRIPPS thought, that while there-was land that could be cultivated in this country, and while corn could be grown here, even though it might be at a somewhat greater expence, they ought not to subject themselves to a foreign market. Mr. 'WARBURTON looked upon the question as a choice of difficulties, and as that of the Hon. Member for Aberdeen sp?eared to him to be the lesser one, he should vote for the amendment. An Hon.. Mantuan, under the gallery, said, that taxed and burdened as the agriculturists were by the poor's rates, he did not think the amendment by any means a fair proposition. If those burdens were removed, the trade is corn might be as free as any Hon. Gentleman pleased. Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and upon our return we found the numbers— For the amendment,l6 1 Against it, 140 1 Majority against the amendment, 124. The remaining resolutions were then put and carried. An amendment was moved by Mr. Huaxt, which was agreed to without any discussion; but we were unable to catch the precise terms of it. In answer to a question from Mr. BANKES, Mr. C. GRANT said, that he hoped to have the Bill ready to-morrow, and if the House had no objection, he should wish it to be read on Friday. The report of the Ways and Means Committee was brought up, and ordered to be received on Friday. The annual Indemnity Bill was read a third time, and passed. The Bills of Exchange Bill was read a third time and passed. Mr. S. RICE moved that a clause should be added, by way of rider to the Bill, exempting Ireland from its enact ments.—Agreed to. SPRING GUNS BILL. On the report being brought up, Lord BELFAST trusted this Act would not extend to IrelancL In that country the people were, unfortunately, not so much civilized as in this country. The planta tions were constantly plundered for fuel, and spring guns were absolutely necessary for the protection of this spe cies of property. The Noble Lord thdn referred to the outrages which had been committed in the neighbour hood of Tlli , r,lstown, where about 90 acres of land were ploughed up. Between 400 and 300 persons were pre sent on that occasion ; an incessant fire of small arms was kept up all night, and on the following day a notice was served upon a person (Mr. Smithwick) to whom a portion of the land belonged, which he would read to the house:— " Notice is hereby given to Black Jack Smithwick, if he does not immediately give the . wood and road fields to the ,distressed, sour „for Totato ground, at - ,a• moderate rez.t r . be .will - meet w ith' tie fate of Baker', or Varrell's wife. Any person -who'stois up thofie sods will meet with the loss of his life ; and, if you do not comply with this, we' will shoot your stock, burn your dairy-house, men and milk women. This is enough. Given at our council-room by the provider of the poor. " ROCK." (Loud laughter.) If spring-guns had been set in this de mesne, he did not believe that this outrage would have taken place.—(Laughter.)—He would therefore move that the provisions of this Bill should not extend to Ireland. Mr. J. GRATTAN believed that the effect of the Noble Lord's measure, if carried, would be most injurious to. Ireland. Mr. S. RICE also opposed the motion. Mr. Secretary PEEI, hoped the motion would not be pressed to a' division. He begged the House to observe, that they would by no means leave the question in the same state with regard to Ireland, after the passing this Bill, as before : because if Ireland should be exempted from its operation, it would not only imply , that spring-guns might be set in that country, but would also go far to decide the ,legality of a practice at present very much doubted. Lord BELFAST said, that if such was the opinion of the House, he would withdraw his motion. The report was then agreed to, and the Bill ordered to be read a third time on Friday next. On the motion of Mr. Kennedy, the Salmon Fisheries' Bill was recommitted, the report brought up, and agreed to, and the Bill ordered to be read a third time on Mon day next. GENERAL TURNPIKE ACTS BILL. Sir T. LETHBDIDGE moved that the House should resolve itself into a Committee on the Turnpike Acts Bill. Mr. BARING opposed the principle of the Bill. He believed that this measure originated in the failure of an attempt which had been made to shut up a road in the vicinity of the Hon. Baronet's seat. If that had not hap pened, he believed this bill would never have found its way into this House. _ , Sir T. LETHBRIDGE complained that the Hon. Gen tleman had taken a liberty with his name which it had been better for him to have avoided. He suspected the Iron. Gent. had collected such information as he had obtained on this subject from a bill which had been circulated in the lobby of the House, and which contained dark, insidious, false, and malicious aspersions on his (Sir T. Lethbridge's) character. If he had thought it worth his while, he should have brought the authors of those imputations (whom he knew) before the House. On public grounds he had taken up this bill, and on those grounds alone he was prepared to justify its principle. Mr. BARING, in explanation, disavowed all personal feeling against the Hen. Baronet. If the Hon. Baronet would consent to withdraw the present Bill, and leave the matter as it stood till the Turnpike Laws could be consoli dated, which might be brought forward after the holidays, he would, in his opinion, act judiciously.—(Hear.) Mr. CRIPPS agreed with the Hon. Member who bad just spoken, that it was desirable to withdraw the present Bill, with a view to the consolidation of the Turnpike Laws. Mr. GORDON wished that the Bill should be with drawn. Mr. T. F. LEWIS had intended to consolidate the turnpike csh inprogress o laws but feared he should be unable to make n s in s uc h an un d er t a king during the p resen t Session. It was a most important subject, for the House was u accustomed to delegate to Commissioners the power of raising an nua ll y a m illi on an d a h a lf st er li ng b y a t ax on the com mun i ty, t h e accounts o f th e ex p en dit ure o f w hi c h eorawess were with difficulty obtained. Until the Act which lie had the honour to introduce, there bad never been an at- I tempt made to compel the making up of the accounts ; but now, a Member, desirous of information on this sub ject, could move for the accounts, and they must be pro duced. He was perfectly willing to undertake the conso lidation of these laws ; the difficulty, however, would be great, owing to the complexity of the subject, and the variety of connections which it had. It was not to be completed this Session, but he would, if required, put the measure into a state of preparation. If the Hon. Member could not wait for this remedy, he (Mr. Lewis) was ready to take up the prevent bill, as be felt how ob jectionable it was for an Hon. Member to manage such an undertaking under an imputation of acting from private motives. Sir T. LETHBRIDGE was willing to withdraw the Bill, with an understanding that the Honourable Member (Mr. Lewis) would move for a Committee to commence its labours this session. Mr. T. F. LEWIS was ready to begin a preparation for a Committee, eo as to prepare a consolidation of the exist ing laws against the next session. The Cztata,maN then quitted the chair, and the House resumed. The orders of th e d ay were t h e n di spose d o f, .sad 'the Howie adjourned at a quarter past twelve o'clock. The inhabitants of Southampton are about to establish a Picture Gallery and a Female Penitentiary; the one to encourzge the arts ; the other to avert their conse quences. LISBON, MAucti T. CHAMBER OF DEPUTIES. Senor F. J. Maia, after some preliminary oliservationg on the continued rise in the prices of all kinds of grain the three Provinces of the North of Portugal (millet, which ie the chief article of food, being already 650 reis per al quiere, and likely soon to be 700), called the attention of the Government to this state of things, and remarked that the exorbitant duty of 220 reis per alquiere on millet im ported from a foreign country, fixed by the Alvara of the 15th of October, 1824, is, in fact, a rigorous prohibition. He therefore proposed to imitate the method lately adopte d by the British Parliament, on a similar occasion, and to authorise the Government to reduce the duty on foreieu millet imported at Oporto, according as circumstances shall require. Senor A. I. Claudino, in speaking on the subject, et Glared, that all the evil which it was intended to remedy , arose from the feeble measures employed to put down the rebellien. A great part of the loyal inhabitants of Trase os-Montes wander from their homes, and perish from fa mine, in avoiding the fury of the rebels. This famine the result of the troubles that have agitated that part of. the kingdom for these three months, and of the little 60 has been done to appease them. Extraordinary evils re" quire extraordinary remedies. Those who say that civil war may be ended by gentle means, either do not knout what civil war is, or they have evil designs, and are eae mies to the country. MARCH B.—ln the sitting of the Deputies on the Btbf Senor Magalhaes made (or rather read) a very long die course on the events that occurred in Port-gal since the 2d July, 1626, when the Lea Wade corvette arrived froal Rio, with the Constitution given by Don Pedro, showing the progress of the conspiracy against the Charter, the hostility of Spain, the culpable negligence of the persons at the head of the Administration, &c. Had not our allies come to the succour of Portugal, an explosion would have taken place, the result of which it would be difficult to Calculate. It appears, then, that there exists a strugg lB of contrary elements, and thence the want of unity and activity in the Ministry. Future ages would with horror peruse the history of Portugal at this period. It would be seen that only two men, feeling an interest in the wel , fare of the State, had endeavoured to save the almost shipwrecked vessel, and steer her into port. He wished to know what had been done in' virtue of the law which ordered traitors to ,be tried by courts-martial ? As yet there had not been a single instance of punishment. The processes should - have commenced on the 81st July; bu y as yet nothing has been done. The chiefs of the rebels preserve their titles and their ranks. Many of them re' ceive the revenues of their property, and it is even affirm . ed, incredible as it must appear, that some of them have received their military pay up to the month of November last. The most violent incites-8 of rebellion are allowed to return to their homes. The Generals of the army bad complained of the conduct of the municipal Magis' trates in the province of the Minho, and no measure Lad been adopted against them. Money, and arms , and plans for the military operations, came from the neighbouring country, but the Ministers continued to sa' crifics the national dignity to pretended considerations 0 moderation. In the meantime a levy was carrying into effect in Spain which could have no other object than We with Portugal. After various other charges against the Ministers, the Deputy observed, that Portugal ought to have good diplomatists to represent the country properly b' foreign states, but perhaps none such were to be found excise in England and Denmark. He attributed all the evil that had happened not to bad intention on the part of the nistera, but to their open divisions, and to the want of coo' fidence in them. -As the Chamber would soon separate, he wished that some Measure should be adopted. He, there fore, proposed ' That a respectful address be presented to the Princess Regent, showing the actual state of the patios), and requesting her to adopt such measures as the Portugues e nation expects from her exalted virtues, and to entrust the execution of them to men who have not lost the confidenc e of the nation.' " Senor Borges Carneiro was against discussing thin motion in the present session. As the subject was of goo importance, it ought to be deliberated on with cirannr spection. " The Minister for Foreign Affairs intended to have re' plied to some of the calumnies stated by the mover of this proposition, but another occasion would answer for thi 6 purpose as well as the present. ‘ Senor Derramado was of opinion that this proposi' tion ought to be carefully examined in every stage of its c')nsideration. It was necessary not to act rashly, for pre' cipitate measures are always dangerous.—(Murmurings ►o the gallery.) "President—The persons in the galleries must be Bile° spectators. This is what the law orders, and it is 'leaf? sary that it should be maintained in its full extent.—( lo the Chamber cries of " Agreed ;" "Agreed ;"and complete silence in the galleries.) " The Minister for Foreign Affairs.—A hasty resolutio o on this motion might prove the ruin of the state. " After some further debate, the President put the quer tion whether the orders of the Chamber were to he soy pended for the immediate discussion of this proposition.-' The decision was in the negative, and therefore the m otio o must o be taken i n th e regu l ar c ou r se. Cneeu.s, MARC4I 4.—His Excellency. General Clinton reviewed all the British troops quartered in this town, the Campo do Bulao. Notwithstanding its blowing ate rible gale of wind, there was an immense concourse of pet; pie to witness this brilliant parade, which lasted mai)! hour:. The Lancers attracted most public admiration, 0 , account of the richness of their appearance, and the unusoP arms. To-day prisoners arrived from that town. (EXTRACTS FROM CORRESPONDENCE.) LISBON, Maxcx 10.—It would seem as if at length the rebel force was crushed ; but we have had so often simila r accounts, which proved deceptive, that we must not be to ° sanguine in belief even now. It has been said, with some appearance of truth, thst General Clinton, being of opinion that the affairs of the North are settled, is about to alter the position of oar army nearer to Lisbon, and more on the line of the TV gus, for the convenience as well as economy of sue' It is probable that head-quarters will be brought down t o Leira or Thomar, and that our whole force will be ste' tioned between either place and this. This belief ie strengthened by a contract being now out from the Coe' missary-General, for bread, fresh meat, wine, and grail' for any quantity which may be required for three month's, front the 24411, for such of our troops as may be on th e line of the Tagus from Lisboa to Abrantes, within thre e leagues of the river. I am glad to learn that a material improvement has late taken place in the supply of our army. It i. said the; Don Miguel has positively refused to go to the Brazils, an d that he is either now in Paris, or about to proceed there and that he will immediately eomein triumph to Lisbee' or put himself at the head of his faithful followers, to en' force his pretended rights. Once in France, may not DO Miguel declare that he is in another territorn, and that b e is determined to assert his freedom? It is strange that the old Queen is about to change her residence from Quelas the palace of the Ajuda, where the Regent and Princess° are. - Considering that she is the head-of the Apostolic pail , and the chief mover of the opposition to the Charter, 1/ will he indeed strange if such a step be permitted. V e i have all this time been surprised that she has not been see' out of the country: but if this instance of considers' tion towards her takes place, we may expect in realiti, a return to that system o f w hi c h s h e i s th e o pen an d avowed patron. This dread of her influence, and the cer; tainty of Don Mignel's return, distant as it may be, and the apprehension of exciting both their resentment by aol violent measures against those who have taken up arms ie his favour, is one cause of the imbecile progress of public affairs. If the young Prince is to be loose, they are making every exertion in Spain to sexist him. I understand the recruiting of the army is going o n w itb great vigour, and every preparation for war making with great efficiency. The delusion which has prevailed here as to the inters' tion of that kingdom is at last removed. A declaratiAl of war is con fi dently expected. T he co urier from Madr i d of yesterday was looked for with sonic anxiety; I h ave n 0 the means of ascertaining of what colour his despatch° were. I understand there is a v ery considerable Frene ll force at Bayonne, including the Swiss Guards that came 00 of Spain; it amounts to 7,000 men. I have just sett e e gentleman who left that place a fortnight since ; he ssi e , the people are all a nxious for war, and they imagine the appearances about them have that tendency. They area .: sirous of it, as the ir trad e with Spain is disarranged byt"" present unsettled state of things. The affair of the Loan. has been again discussed, 11 " ;• without a decision. It is now said that Mr. Rothschild; to find .the cash, and that his nephew is daily expected fte r Madrid to conclude the arrangements. - has sailed last week from Falmouth r L i s ( b N o n . B —He . tI The last news this evening is that-the Britialt Areslos certainly to take up, before :the. 24th, As Ink from 1 : 4 0 Franca, to Abrantes, along-theTsgus...L.the:head•qtuirr,o probably, to be at the latter place: We , also;Jearlr that rebels have been actually _opposed enteringther Spai t iae/P 7 , 0 ritory near Braganca, and that they ure sow - beyfun e e to that town. exultation Cive o i f s' t g ir Co . trtit Ad ut r io id nalis i"nd in , thi if s "PPA :se" — " ellug ' the rebel affair is quite over.