The Sun. — London, England, 1861-05-29 00:00:00

the natives were, with few exceptions, loyal and attached subjects to the Queen ; and that was a representation of a state of things which would be generally found to exist. In February, 1854, Governor Williams reported the pros perity of the colony, and the disposition of the natives to continue friendly relations. In Ma y , 1854, the actinggo vernoreon congratulated the colonists on the prosperity of the colony, and on tho friendly relations which existed between the two races and the House of Assembly, and the Legis lative Council, in their addresses in reply, reciprocated those expressions. In Sept., 1854, Governor Brown reported that the natives were well disposed, but he added that they did not view the Assembly very favourably, because they seemed less scrupulous in their desire to obtain the possession of land. In 18.56 the existence of this feeling was more clearly manifested, and it seemed to him to be impossible that it could be otherwise, far the authority of the governor was reduced to a mere shadow. And although in matters affect ing the natives he appeared to have an independent autho rity, it was merely nominal, for it was perfectly clear from the papers on the table that even with regard to native affairs he bad no real power, and had to follow implicitly the ad vice-of the Executive Council. But the administration of affairs in the province was still worse. He had no doubt in his own mind that nothing so much contributed to excite the Maories against the government as the manner in which patronage had been used to their detriment for party pur poses. They had seen men holding offices in the right dis charge of which they were deeply interested replaced, not by others who were more fitted to . discharge the duties of those offices, but by men who were governed by party inte rests. They also felt how miserably inadequate were the grants made for purposes in which they were interested. They understood these things very well. It was, perhaps, impossible to judge, at so greot a distance, of the details of administration in New Zealand, but if he wore to judge of the spirit in which the administration was conducted by the tone of the colonists, from the language they used at public meetings, from the proceedings of the provincial councils, and even of the assembly itself—and he knew of none more certain to which he could have recourse—he must say that it showed an entire want of consideration for the feelings of the Maoris and even of their rights. There were many proofs of this, but he should refer only to the address of the provincial council of New Plymouth, pre sented to the governor in 1856, in which that want of con • sideration was most painfully manifested. "In 1858 the same council called upon the governor to compel the natives to sever their tribal tenancies. This fact was most signifi cant, especially when one of the representatives of New Plymouth was Mr. Richmond, who held office as one of the responsible advisers of the governor—native minister, he believed, he was called. Ho believed it was the attempt to compel the recusants to sell their lands that led to this war, and he would ask whether Mr. Richmond was an im partial and trustworthy adviser of the crown under such circumstances. Last year the Government themselves pro posed a bill having for its object to establish a council en tirely independent of the assembly. The only intelligible ground on which that measure could be put forward was that the existing Government could not safely be trusted in matters affecting the natives. The bill passed their lord ships' house, but happily it did not pass the other house of parliament. He said happily, because though the present evil was real, the remedy proposed would make the new state of things worse than the first, and bring about a con flict of authorities which would make all further Govern ment perfectly impossible. It was admitted by her Majesty's Government themselves that there existed just ground of complaint amongst the natives, and was their remedy merely the sending out of troops to compel the natives to submit to a government which it was admitted was bad and unjust? He trusted not. He implored of them to adopt other mea sures. It seemed to him that they ought without delay to take measures to redress the grievances of the native in habitants of New Zealand—that they ought to take every means in their power to conciliate them and to put an end to this war. Why not send out Sir G. Grey, whom they knew and in whom they had confidence, armed with full and ample powers to meet the emergency ? He believed Sir G. Grey was a person of too much public spirit, and took too deep an interest in the welfare of a population for whom he had already done so much, to refuse this sacrifice—great as he believed it would be—if he was asked to make it. But in the present state of affairs he ought to be armed with very great powers. Nothing less than a suspension of the representative system for three years, and depriving the council of the authority which it derived from the Crown, for the same period, would be sufficient for this purpose. He believed that the presence of Sir G. Grey in the colony, armed with full legislative and executive powers, would be worth the pre sence of 10,000 troops,.and that at no distant day he would be enabled to restore peace to the colony. And when peace was restored the system of representation could be brought into operation again, but not with those defects which ex perience had proved to exist, or without those changes which were required. He believed those changes were not numerous, and might be easily accomplished. If the governor were made responsible for the impartial admini stration of the executive government; if men of experi ence in the colony were appointed as his advisers, and held office as long as they properly discharged their duties ; if at the same time a moderate and fixed appropriation were made for the necessary expenses of the Government, and those objects in which the Maoris were concerned settled—he believed nothing else would be re quired to enable representative institutions in a compara tively short period of time to be re-established with a prospect of success. If her Majesty's Government declined to take the more decided course which he pointed out by suspending during the war the popular government that now existed, he hoped and trusted they would at least make such changes and modifications in the government as he had described, and as he believed would conduce to the restora tion of tranquillity. He knew it might be said that having once conferred representative government on New Zeeland, they could not now recall it or modify it. It was held that no less than 4,000 or 5,000 British soldiers, kept up at a large expense by the mother country, and two or three war steamers were absolutely necessary in order to enable the colonists of New Zealand to defend themselves against the natives, and he had received communications to the effect that the colonists were going to push their claims further and to ask that the pay of their own militia and the expense of putting their own force into the field might be defrayed, not from the colonial, but from the imperial tree-. aury. He did not deny that in the present state of the colony it was necessary that the British settlers should be assisted by the mother country ; he was indeed persuaded that it was absolutely impossible for them to bring the war to a satisfactory close by their unaided effort, and therefore he did not object to the employment of a sufficient number of British troops for the purpose without any charge being made upon the colony. But if her Majesty's Ministers and Parliament were to undertake the defence of the settlers against the natives, they must also undertake the regula tion of the policy to be for the future pursued towards the natives, in order that the generosity of the mother country should not be abused, and that the powers given to the settlers should net be applied to purposes for which they were not intended. Could it for a moment bo contended that it was just and reasonable either to the native inhabi tant of New Zealand or to the British taxpayer that the colonists in th e i sland were on the one hand to retain the undisputed management of the affairs of the colony, while on the other they were to be freed from the burden of a war which their oppression and mismanagement had brought about ? If the colonists their own affairs as welltold that they must manage as w def end themselves, they would have the strongest ind ucemen t ;but tokeep if on the beat terms with their barbarous neighbours the s mother country un ttabeined the dertook their defence while the colonist manage ment of their own affairs, there would n r o e rity for the maintenanc e o f peaceful relation t s h w e s it a h ra t e h se e n cu a - - ti ves. If, however, under th e partial authority Crown, the government of the co l ony were administeroefdtfhore the benefit of the natives as well as of th e Europeans, us tice and forbearance would be enforced ; b u t i f the Go jus tice Govern meat were left to the colonists themselves, th e y took v a e wa; the only effective check upon that selfishness from which he was afraid human nature was never exempt. These were the reasons which induced him to complain of the measure now submitted to their lordships, as one which was entirely inadequate to meet the present circumstances of the case, and he thought the second reading of the bill afforded a legitimate opportunity for expressing to the house his con viction that her Majesty's Government could not safely leave those matters as they were at present. If the Govern ment did not take a more comprehensive view of the ques tion than they had hitherto done they might be sure that before this war was brought to a close hundreds, and per haps thousands, of the lives of British soldiers would be sacrificed, millions of money would be expended, and in all probability in the end they would be only able to restore tranquillity by a war of extermination —a struggle which would bring many English settlers to beggary, and compel them to seek in other climes the peace and prosperity which they could not find in New Zealand. Lord LYTTELTON was satisfied with the steps the Go vernment had taken upon this subject, approved of the de spatches they had transmitted to the colony sin ce the out break of the war, an d did not complain of the bill which the noble duke had introduc e d. He, however, ventured to ex press a hope that the Powers given to the general assembly would be more guarded than th ey had been hitherto. He did not concur with the noble earl that the constitution of New Zealand was erroneous in principle. He sympathised with the Governor and Government in the extreme hosti lity they bad met with for some time past on the part of al most all the leading ecclesiastical authorities in the colon ' which ho re gar d e d as a very unfortunate circu mstance. The work of colonisation and the work of evangelisation, so far from being naturally mutually auxiliary, were sometimes mutually obstructive, and indeed the best fields for colonise tion were where there were no native inhabitants. What a semi-savage race required was a great deal of government, but the effect of what we had done in New Zealand had been to destroy such government as formerly existed, and to Substitute very little government at all. The colonisation of New Z ea l and dated from the colonial. administration of Lord Norraanby, who in his despatch r of A ug . 15, 1839, sa id that eannibalisr a , human sae warfare and murder amongst the nati ves must b e put"sdow , by f orce, but so far from this policy having been acted upon, the not governors - andbe ern . genet* had always maintained that force could pica ed with effect in the repression of murder warfare. They had notice of these things in the colony fora time past. There arose what was called the native koinng movement. The natives bad no king in former times, be cause they were governed by chiefs, and when the power of the chiefs was destroyed they cast about to see what they could do to supply their place. They attempted to set up as king an imbecile old man named Potator, and this was nothing but a feeble and ineffectual attempt on the part of the natives to carry out the principle of sovereignty. With regard to the particular question of the origin of the present war, he (Lord Lyttelton) must confess, having read all the papers on their lordships' table and many others which had reached him from New Zealand, that he quits agreed in the conclusion of the noble earl that the question of the tribal right was one which was open to very considerable doubt. He must also say that since the bishop had expressed his opinion in favour of the tribal right, and particularly of the exercise of that right on the part of Wirimu Kingi, that a perusal of those papers had very much shaken his (Lord Ly ttel ton' s) opinion on this point, and he should re commend no one to form a definite opinion on the matter without hav ing read the last despatches on the subject, especially that one from the governor dated in December, 1860, which occu pied a space of some 30 pages in the volume before them. He thought that the governor had produced weighty evi dence to the effect that there was reason to doubt whether any ancient signorial rights had existed at all among the native princes independent of treaty. He also thought that the governor had made out a very strong case in favour of the justice and wisdom of the course he had pursued. The Duke of NEWCASTLE said that his noble friend the noble earl, in introducing this interesting discussion upon a very important question upon the somewhat slender basis of a bill which he (the Duke of Newcastle) had asked their lordships to read a second time, expressed the regret which he (the noble earl) felt that this was the only bill which her Majesty's Government were prepared to lay on the table with respect to the colony of Now Zealand. Until the close of the noble earl's speech he (the Duke of Newcastle) had felt surprise at this expression of regret, not only because he knew the noble earl disapproved of the measure which he (the Duke of Newcastle) had introduced last year, but also because he could not gather what reme dial measure the noble earl wished should be introduced into a bill. He (the Duke of Newcastle) would not say anything with regard to the recommendations ho had received from time to time as to the measures he might have introduced; but his noble friend had certainly misunderstood or had mis quoted what he had said with regard to that bill. He cer tainly did not advocate that bill on the ground that he dis approved of the Constitution or Government of New Zee land, or of the course that had been taken with respect to the management of native affairs. He understood his noble friend to say that that was the sole ground upon which that bill was supported. What he (the Duke of Newcastle) said was this—that the Constitutional Act of 1852 having im posed upon the governor certain duties with regard to the management of native affairs, and it being found not only dif ficult but almost impossible to carry those functions into effect, in order to enable him to do so, he recommended the establishment of a native council. His noble friend said he rejoiced that that bill failed, because he thought there was more chance of a council succeeding in the colony. But so far from the colony supposing that a council was objection able, they had themselves introduced a bill into either house of Legislature—which had been discussed in a very liberal and impartial spirit—by which they themselves had proposed the constitution of a native council ; and though they differed as to the provisions, yet in more important respects they had sanctioned the principle of a council. The noble earl did not dwell at any great length upon the origin of this war ; and he (the Duke of New. castle) thought he was right in doing so, considering the period at which they were discussing the question, viz., one year only since the war had broken out. But inasmuch as the noble earl had expressed an opinion of his own, founded on an opinion of persona in the colony, to the effect that the Governor was wrong, and that Wirimu Kingi was right, he (the noble Duke) felt bound to say he did not concur in authorityth Arnold. at vi ewo. This, f Sirll e Ivbelieved moreover, Martin had t and;e notbgu governor b e he r ee n no believed, a to suddenly have been h aorru though arranged g t h h e d e e right, and in this respect he must say his mind had taken the same course as that of his noble friend (Lord Lyttelton). In. a despatch which he (the Duke of Newcastle) had writ ten shortly after his arrival from America, he had expressed his great doubts as to the justice of the course which had been taken ; but he said he would not then express his opi nion on the matter. But after reading the despatches which had arrived since, and especially the-despatch which had been referred to by the noble lord, he felt convinced that the governor was right, and that the balance of opinions in clined in. his favour. He did not wish to dispute the high did not so say positively—certainly not officially—against that opinion might be set the opinion of Chief Justice transaction. It had been said the Government had shown haste ; but nine months were spent in the adjudication con sequent on the purchase of this small piece of land. It had also been said that threats had been put forth by hostile claimants. ul T d h h e a f v a e ct u r e e e a n lly en w i as y , to th o at gi t a n d e governorifeueha atribunal dth a e settlers existed ; but there was no such tribu na l, an d th e rea l op position to its institution arose f rom th e na ti ves. N o go vernor had been able to establish a t r ib una l, w hi c h would only have been injurious to the Maori. Did th e t rea ty o f Waitangi contemplate such a t r ib una l ? C erta i n l y not. It provided for bargains b e i ng ma d e b etween the nat i ves and agents of the Government, and the fact was that the Government agents were more favourable to the natives than any tribunal. A tribunal would proceed only upon , strict legal principles ; whereas the common practice on the part of the agents was to yield points here and there in favour of the natives, and against the Government —a prac tice which he believed had materially served the interests of the Government. The question of a tribunal had been urged by the bishop in what he called a "solemn protest." He (the Duke of Newcastle) deeply regretted the course which the bishop had taken and the language which he had used. That language had been commented upon by a noble friend of his in terms which, if they had fallen from him (the Duke of Newcastle) as Colonial Secretary, would he feared have had very little effect. He hoped that excel lent man, the bishop, and the missionaries in NewZealond, would take from his noble friend in good part the valuable lesson he had read them, and would abstain from that in terference which upon this occasion had been most unfor tunate and mischievous. This protest, which was in most powerful terms, was yet political in its character, and if it had emanated from any prelate in Europe would have been met by a universal outcry against the interference of a bishop in matters of such a nature. He had read it with great pain; because there was no man holding the position cf a minister of religion whom he looked upon with such respect, not only as a friend but as a minister of the Gospel ; but the bishop had allowed himself, in this instance, to be diverted from his high calling to the partial advocacy of political rights, in a manner which had led to most disas trous consequences. The noble earl had done wisely, he thought, in not entering deeply into the subject of the war. It would have been just as wise during the mutiny which lately raged in India to have diseussed largely in the press and in the legislature the question of i he greased cartridges which was the pretended reason, but was probably only the pretext, of the outbreak. There was no doubt that it was a struggle of nationalities. The feeling on the part of the natives was that they were entitled to a nationality of their own, and they wished to prevent the superiority of Eng land. From this cause arose the land league of which Wirimu Kingi was the chief. It followed also that the chief, named Potator, to whom the noble lord had referred, when he found himself engaged in a struggle with the British Government, placed all his force at the disposal of Wirimu Kingi. The Maori king movement commenced some seven years ago. It would have made very little pro gress, and the policy of the Government, which was to let it alone, would have prevailed, if they had had to deal with the natives only. But he was sorry to say, the natives were not only assisted in their hostility, but were instigated by disaffected Europeans. Correspondence was opened, mis sionaries were sent out ; deputations were organised to native chiefs; in one part of the country a subscription was raised for setting up a printing press, with a view of dis seminating everything which could excite them against the British Government ; a flag was prepared, and there was even an att empt made in one instance to levy customs. It was given out that the Governor of New Zealand had a secret plan on foot to exterminate the people and .. to con e use fi scate th e i r l ands for th e of the British settlers. Thus he did not say without good reason, that European emis saries were sent amohgst the natives.' point to the conduct a a friendly But her e ho m i g ht of wise advic e offered to t tribe, wh o , i n consequence spirit from th e fi rst, and bleidem, had r e t a i ne d a peace f u l continue to do so. Th ere could besnhown every disposition to of the Maories the dispute bet e , een o doubt th a t in the minds they should have a M aor i kingor them WaS thi s , w h e th er il Great Britain should be th e sove reiNvenet her th e Q ueen o f ( the Maories were deter m i ne d , i f they eeof h u l the colony, a n d Europeans into the sea, and ma k e a native chief oriva th e a t of the country. He thought the la s t d espatches ief d shoaled king signs of peace on the part of the Maories, excepti ng n e e' h as would result if her Majesty resigned the sovereignty of the colony. The war in New Zealand was a most deplor able one, because he felt that if there were any class of abo ri,ines more than another which the English people had a great admiration for, it was the Maories. They had un doubtedly as brave qualities as Englishmen, and they had shown in this foolish and disastrous war di acts of courage whieh did them m any in i the highest honour. (Hear,hear.) His noble friend had stated that the cause of the war was of a longer date than the purchase of land question, and Pe (the Duke of New castle) agreed with him. His noble friend did not blame the representative institutions of New Zealand in reference to that question, but considered the blame rested with the system of party government at home. Now, he thought his noble friend would find it very difficult to discover more than two passages in the blue book in support of his charge against responsible government. Earl GREY thought he could point out 20 places which would prove the propositions which he had laid down. The Duke o f NE WCASTLE—WeII, so far as he coul d discover, r epresentative government was not so much in fault as party government at home, and he had not found in the despatches those passages to which his noble friend referred. Ile was about to say that, although he did not think re sponsible government had created the dissatisfaction which existed in the minds of th 3 Maories, yet there could be no doubt that the change which took place in 1852 in the go vernment of the colony had had this effect, viz., that it had deprived the governor of th e powers which he formerly possessed, and also of the funds which he formerly had at his disposal. With regard to the conduct of the Govern ment of New Zealand and the assembly, he must express dissent from the opinion entertained by his noble friend. He could not read the blue-book the same as he had done, and he thought the debates in the assembly had been con ducted with remarkable ability and with a fair disposition to consult the rights and feelings of the Maories. It was not fair to quote the press as conclusive upon the subject, because some papers said the Maories had been properly treated, while others said they had been treated harshly. (Hear, hear.) He agreed with his noble friend in think ing it was a great misfortune that the superintendents of the provinces had been made elective and quite indepene I dent of the supreme Government, and, indeed, sometimes they were antagonistic to it. It was an institution simi lar :to those in the United States, without the reasons for it which existed there, and he thought that if the superintendents were nominated by the Governor-in-Chief instead of being elected by the provinces, it would be a great improvement. Ho had referred to the fact that by the changes of 1852 the Governer lost the command of funds which had been of the greatest advantage to him in carry ing on the Government of the colony, and this was one of the greatest evils of the working of the new system. At present the whole of the territorial revenues were at the disposal of the provincial Governments, and they absorbed any surplus which the colonial Government might have in stead of leaving it to be appropriated for native purposes. There was another cause of evil, namely, the extension of English laws to the colony. No doubt they purported to extend those laws to the natives, but in fact that had not been done, and by the present system the natives were nei ther separated from nor incorporated with the Europeans. At the same time, there was no distinct and formal separa tion. No Maori was an elector, for by a decision of ono of the courts of law no title to land was recognised except such as was admitted by English law. Therefore, if a native wished to have a vote, he must be possessed of a freehold ; but he had no interest in acquiring a freehold, because he would be purchasing land of the Government ; whereas he possessed in his own right a title, and was, as a Maori, in possession of sufficient land to give him a vote. Neverthe less, they were not allowed to exercise the franchise. He believed that nothing would be more conducive to the set tlement of the colony than the introduction of the system adopted by Sir G. Grey in British Kaffraria. He referred to the system of giving native chiefs appointments and a position, and connecting them with the English Govern ment, while they were allowed to retain their own position amongst themselves. Then again, with regard to the schools, he thought it would be an additional advantage if the Eng lish language were taught in them, and if the missionaries taught in that language instead of teaching the people in the Maori tongue. With regard to the expenses of the war, the colonial Government not only expected the mother-country to pay the troops sent out, but an attempt had been made to impose upon us a portion of the expenses belonging to the militia and the volunteers ; but that he (the Duke of New castle) had not allowed, and he had instructed the governor how to act in future in regard to such a claim. He might mention that an agent of the New Zealand Government was in this country, and was endeavouring to effect a loan of 1150,000 for the express purpose of paying the expenses consequent upon the war. He could not say whether the disposition of the natives was more for war or for peace. There were many reasons to suppose that they were anxious for peace, while on the other hand there were appearances which indicated that there would be a serious extension of the war. If the war should extend it would, he feared, be a most disastrous one. He would now mention to their lordships that as the present governor's term of six years' service would expire in a short period, it had become his duty to recommend to the Queen the appointment of a successor to Col. Browne, and she had graciously approved of it. Sometimes his noble friend and himself differed in reference to colonial matters, but in this he thought they would agree, for he had recommended to the Crown the appointment of Sir George Grey; but he felt that in asking Sir George to return to the government of New Zealand it was a tax upon his patriotism, as it was supposed that the governorship of the Cape was superior to that of New Zea land. He had no doubt, however, that when Sir George Grey received the intimation which he sent out to him by the last mail, that he would probably by the following mail receive his instructions, he would readily consent to return to New Zealand. The intimation to Colonel Browne was sent out by the mail which left yesterday. It would be most unjust on his part to close this statement if he did not, on the part of the Government, say that they fully recognised the great services rendered to the colony by Colonel Browne, and that the re-appointment of Sir George Grey to the colony was done without intending the smallest reflection upon the conduct of Colonel Browne. He could not agree with the statement of his noble friend, which seemed to disparage the government of Col. Browne, for his noble friend, and every one reading the despatches, must feel that Colonel Browne was a man of great ability, and that he had, by a great consideration forall the interests in New Zealand, whether they were those of Englishmen or natives, distinguished himself during the six years he had been in office. Colonel Browne, with a small naval and mi litary force, had shown temper and discretion in all the trans • actions of this war which did him the highest honour. (Hear.) He thought he had in that respect steered a fair and proper course, and he felt certain that when this war was over, the people of New Zealand would acknowledge that they owed a debt of gratitude to him whose government was now about to expire. (Hear.) He had recommended to the Queen, and her Majesty had been pleased to assent to the recom mendation, that Colonel Gore Browne should be sent to another government; and he trusted the appointment of Sir G. Grey to the government of New Zealand would lead to the settlement of these unhappy disturbances. Earl GREY, in reply, said he had heard with great satis faction the statement of the noble duke, and he agreed with him that Colonel Gore Browne had been placed in a false position. But he hoped that when Sir G. Grey arrived at New Zealand he would find before him an act of Parlia ment suspending the constitution of that colony as the only means of settling the minds of the people there and prevent ing this war from extending. The Duke of NEWCASTLE said he could not comply with the request of the noble earl. As he had not alluded to that subject in his previous remarks his silence now, after the second appeal of the noble earl, could receive but one interpretation. He had no hesitation in saying therefore that he had no intention whatever of suppressing the consti tution of New Zealand, which would be, he believed, a most impolitic, unwise, and with all due deference to the noble earl, a most unjust act, and would be punishing the innocent for the guilty. (Hear.) He was not now pre pared, nor did he see any likelihood of being over prepared, to sanction such a course. (Hear.) The bill was then read a second time. The Offences in Territories near Sierra L eone Bill was read a third time and passed. The Combination of Parishes Dissolution (Scotland) Bill was read a second time. Their lordships then adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS—YESTERDAY. The SPEAKER took the chair at four o'clock. • PRIVATE BUSINESS. The Workington Tidal Basin and Railway Bill was read a third time and passed. The Lyra and flunstanton Railway Bill was considered and ordered for third reading. DUBLIN CORPORATION WATER BILL. On the motion for the consideration of this bill, Sir E. GROGAN moved that the bill be re-committed, for the purpose of hearing the petition of ratepayers and others of Dublin, deposited in the Private Bill-office, and complaining of matter which had arisen during the pro gress of the bill before the committee on the bill. He said that there were objections to the bill which were considered reasonable by those persons who were acquainted with the subject, but there had not been sufficient time afforded to enable him or those who agreed with him on the propriety of this motion to urge these objections at the previous stages of the bill. By the provisions of the bill power was given to the Corporation of Dublin to raise any amount of money for the purpose of supplying the city of Dublin with water. There were also other most objectionable clauses in the bill, including exemption to Trinity Collegs, and cer tain companies. He did not want to destroy the bill, to which the committee to whom it had been referred had devoted much time and attention. His only object was to render the clauses less onerous and oppressive on the rate payers. Mr. MAGUIRE, whose name was on the bill, said that the object of the hon. member was to destroy it, notwith standing that he disclaimed any such intentian. The bill would be of great benefit to the inhabitants of Dublin, and so far from large houses in that city being well supplied with water the reverse was the fact, as he was informed by the most creditable authorities. There was scarcely a week elapsed that there was not a fire in the city of Dublin, and yet there was not sufficient water supply provided to meet such accidents. He contended that this matter might be fairly left in the hands of the corporation, who were really the representatives of the people. That body were willing to tax themselves for the benefit of the Poor, and experience had shown that no greater boon could be given to the humble classes than affording them an adequate supply of water, which, amongst other advantag es , tended to arrest the progress ' of disease. Ire contended al so th at every opportunity was given to the opponents of the bill to disput e it in committee. Mr. MASSEY said th a t the ratepayers wererepresented by counsel before the committee, and if they chose to retire prematurely, that was no reason why the committee should be called on to sit on the bill. If any hon. member of the committee said that he thought it desirable to have the bill reconsidered, that certainly might be a reason for adopting the course advocated by the hon. baronet (Sir E. Grogan), but in the absence of any such expression, he felt bound to oppose the amendment for the recommittal of this bill. Mr. VANCE said that some of the clauses in this bill took his hon. colleague and himself by surprise, and were not in the original bill. He strongly objected to the exemption of Trinity College from being taxed, and also the Admi ralty clause in the bill, which made it imperative to main tain a certain depth of water in Wicklow harbour. Mr. TALBOT said that the committee sat for three weeks, and were unanimous in their decision. He thought therefore that there was no ground for calling on them to tilt again, and he called on the house to =Wain ita priyi- THE SUN, LONDON, WEDNESDAY _EVENING, MAY 29, 1861. - - leges by rejecting the amendment of the hon. baronet (Sir E. Grogan). After some observations by Mr. Whit,eside, Mr. George, and Mr. Lefroy, Mr. WALTER, as a member of the committee, said that, as regarded the Admiralty clause, there was no ground for apprehension. Sir E. GROGAN consented to withdraw the amend ment, and the bill was considered and ordered for third reading. THAMES EMBANKMENT BILL. On the motion for the second reading of this bill, Mr. COWPER said that the object of this bill was to enable the London, Dover, and Chatham Railway Company to take possession of the proposed embankment, and to re munerate themselves out of the tolls which they might levy. The company proposed to obtain £400,000 through the-medium of the Metropolitan Board of Works. They sought to relieve themselves from the expenses of the under taking and to throw it on the house. The company proposed that the Woods and Forests should buy land and give them as much of it as they required for their purpose and retain the remainder for their own use. He thought if they allowed this bill to pass they would be adopting a precedent that might be used injuriously against the house on a future occasion. The embankment of the Thames was a subject of great importance, and a Royal Commission sat on this subject, which had not yet made their report. In all probability a bill founded on the recommendations of that commission would be introduced next session. For these rea sons, although from his position he felt disinclined to in terfere with a private measure, he felt bound to move that this bill be read a second time that day six months. Mr. AYRTON supported the second reading of the bill, but he reserved to himself a right to consider the bill in its future stages. Lord FERMOY said he thought that the subject should ba dealt with by a public bill, and supported the amend ment. After some further discussion the motion for the second reading of the bill was negatived without a division. GALWAY MAIL. Mr. GREGORY moved an address for copy of all cor respondence between the Post Office department and the Board of Admiralty and the Board of Trade with reference to the Galway Postal Contract ; and also of all correspondence with, and instructions given to, the surveying officers in reference to the ships of the Atlantic Royal Mail Steam Navigation Company, or with reference to the ships from time to time submitted by that Company to the Postmaster-General for the performance of the postal service between Galway and the United States of America.—Ordered. THE GOVERNMENT OF VE NETIA. Mr. GRIFFITH asked the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs whether, when Count Rechberg, in his despatch of the 27th day of April, denied that a state of siege existed in Venetia, it was not the case that the ordinary government in Venetia was, at least, as severe as any state of siege, and that four men were executed, by sentence of court martial, at Venice or its neighbourhood, on . the very day on which Count Rech berg dated that despatch ? Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that he had sent a despatch to Sir James Hudson stating the general views of the Government, and Count Cavour communicated with the Marquis d'Azeglio. He had received a despatch on the subject to which the hon. member had alluded, but he did not consider it of sufficient public importance to lay it on the table of the house. The Foreign-office was not in possession of any official information as to the severity of the Govern ment of Venetia, to which he referred. THE GALWAY CONTRACT. The O'DONOGHUE asked the Fin t Lord of the Trea sury whether it was the intention of the Government to carry out the views of the Postmaster-General, expressed in a. recent letter. and annul the Galway contract ? Lord PALMERSTON—The intimation conveyed to the GalwayCompany was no act of the Post-office, but the deci sion of the Government. It was, of course, competent for the parties concerned to make any representation they thought fit to Government, who would then consider what steps they would take. All the correspondence on the subject would be shortly laid on the table, and then the house would be in a better position to understand this sub ject. THE BLOCKADE IN AMERICA. Lord J. RUSSELL, who laid on the table certain corres pondence relating to the blockade of ports in America, said —lt may be convenient to the house, and especially to the commercial interests of this country, to state the substance of the correspondence which has lately passed with regard to the blockade of ports in America. On the 19th of April the President of the United States issued a notification that it was intended to institute a blockade of the ports of the seven States which had seceded, and on the 27th of April another notification was issued that it was intended to blockade the ports of North Carolina and Virginia; but when Lord Lyons applied for an official notification of the establishment—the commencement of the blockade, he was told by the Secretary of State that it was not usual to make such notification, but that it would be made by thedifferent naval commanders in the different ports when such block ade was instituted. The results, therefore, of the . corres • pondence ate that the blockade is to be notified in that manner, and that ono blockade has been already notified in that manner, namely, the blockade of the ports of Virginia and North Carolina, by the flag officer Prendergast, by let ter, who has declared.that he is in a situation to make an efficient blockade of those ports. There has been no noti fication of a similar kind with regard to other ports. The rules, as far as Lord Lyons has been able to ascertain them, and of which he has given an account to Admiral Milne, commanding the British squadron in those waters, are, first, that the notification is in each case to be made by the naval officer commanding the squadron which institutes the blockade, and in the next place, that fifteen days are to be allowed from the commencement of the bl oc k a d e f or vessels to come out ; and it appears that whether they are loaded or not, provided they come o u t i n the fifteen days, their passage is to be all owe d. On the other hand, it is not permitted by the United States Go vernment that any vessel shall be sent to the ports block aded for the purpose of bringing away the property of British subjects or property of oth er nat i ons in the ports blockaded. An application was made of that kind, but the Secretary of State replied, that if such permission were ranted it would be used by American citizens who wished to bring away property from the ports. If the blockade is carried into effect according to the regular law of nations, we of course are bound by it, and we have only to see that the blockade is efficient. he thought the noble lord British oug l h r t . tTo.inDfoUrmNCth°eMhßouE said d at means h e h a d t a k en 0 give British protection in the slave States outrages were committed on British subjects in those States; and he wi s h e d t o k now whether the noble lord had received any inf orma ti on on th e o property r'e America. rt y and Very ery great e subjects subject. Ile (Mr. Duncombe) had received letters from a gentleman ho could depend on, who had requested him to ask Government what they intended to do. There was no complaint of the Government of the free States of America, but in the slave States neither life nor property . was safe ; and British subjects there at this moment were compelled to take up arms and fight against the free States, and were prevented from passing to the free States. A proclamation had been issued by our Government stating that the Foreign Enlistment Act was put in force. That being the case, all British subjects engaged in this war were to be treated as pirates. Now the mercantile marine of America was chiefly manned by Englishmen and Irishmen, and these men were not allowed to depart, and they were obliged to fight against the free states. If they were taken, were they to be treated as pirates? We talked of our neutrality, but was it no thing that in the confederate states the captain of a mer chant vessel had been tarred and feathered ? (Laughter.) It was all very well to laugh, but this was a serious matter. What was to be done ? These men could not get away. What means had been taken by the noble lord to prevent them being treated as pirates ? At this moment there was an advertisement in the slave state newspapers offering a reward of 20 dollars for every person pre sed and brought on board one of their vessels. Did they suppose that the Canadians would submit to have their fellow -subjects dragged into the slave states, and there imprisoned or made ti fight against the free st it9s ? The question he wished to ask was what steps the noble lord had taken in order that the Irishmen and Englishmen who were now detained in the slaves states, and who wished to come away, might have the opportunity of doing so. _ _ _ Mr. B. OSBORNE said he was not aware whether he was strictly in order, but he must protest against the tone and the sentiments contained in the speech of the hon. gentle man, who altogether prejudged this question, and when he talked of having reliable information from certain friends of his, he (Mr. Osborne) was also in possession of reliable in formation which gave the direct lie to the statements of the hon. gentleman. He was in a position to deny that any of these outrages had been committed in the Confederated States, but he could point, if this were the proper time, to outrages committed by the militia of New York in one of the Southern States which they had occupied, in which Oen. Butler had actually issued an order of the day, on the pretext that one of his men was poisoned by strychnine, threatening to put a slave into every man's house to poison their masters. But do not let the house be led away by these sad events, which were calculated to excite a very painful feeling. He hoped that they would not be led at this time into a debate, and that the noble lord (Li.rd J. Russell) would maintain that judicious silence which ho had always maintained on this subject. If they were to have a deliberate debate, let it be regularly brought on, and not brought on in this irregular manner. Mr. BRIGHT said nothing could be more injudicious or more unfortunate than that they should have in that house, from private letters, accounts of particular out rages, said to have been committed in America. They knew that there would be outrages enough before war there or anywhere else was brought to a close. B u t in the .North, as well as in the South, there would be the greatest possible indisposition to bring about a quarrel with this country. Whatever quarrel there was between the two sections, there could be none between either and this country. The policy which the noble lord had announced, and in which he cordially con curred, was one of strict neutrality on the part of our Go vernment. He thought it would be well for the house to adopt the same line of neutrality as much as possible. It was an unhappy thing that this dissension and this war had grim; but lot them hope that among that cation, which was more educated perhaps than any nation in the world, there might be found persons who could surmount the vast difficulty in which the country was placed without those calamities which always accompanied civil war. With that feeling ho asked the house to avoid as much as possible dis cussion on matters which he believed they could not in fluence for good, but by which they might create a state of feeling either in the North or in the South, which might add to the difficulty of our Government in that wise line:of neutrality which they bad laid down. (Hear.) Mr. GREGORY said he hoped the house would not be led away by stories from letters from the Southern States. He had no doubt that the gentleman from whom the hon. member received this letter knew just as much as the hon. gentleman himself. They knew very well that neither letters nor newspapers had been received from the South. They should read the official documents, the address of President Davis, in order to form a judgment. He should certainly on the 7th of June bring forward his motion, and he trusted that the whole matter would be then consi dered. Mr. BOUVERIE said this was a very important matter for the commercial interests of this country. He believed the rule was that a neutral did not incur the forfeiture of his goods by attempting to violate a blockade, unless he had received due notice of the blockade. The rule was that noti • fication to the state of which the person was a subject was notification to all the subjects of that state, but if notifica tion had not been given in that way, then it must be actual notice to the subject himself. Therefore, the house would see how important it was whether notification had been given of a blockade, or merely an intimation that on arrival at the port there would be a notice given of the blockade. He wished to ask whether the mercantile interests of this country were to understand that a public notification of the blockade had been given to her Majesty's Government, or merely whether the blockade would be notified to neutral ships on their arrival at the port in question ? Lord J. RUSSELL (who was heard very indistinctly) was understood to say thathe had already stated the course which the Government had pursued. With regard to the blockade his right hon. friend would see from the papers, when they were distributed amongst the members, the exact state of the case. When Mr. Seward was asked whether he would give us a notification of the blockade he refused to do so, saying he found no precedent for such a proceeding. He (the noble lord) referred him to a precedent,-but Mr. Seward said he would not give a general notification—he would leave it to the naval commanding officer of each station to declare that the blockade had been instituted; and when the fact had thus been generally communicated, it was to be considered that the blockade had been regularly established. Of course he (the noble lord) was not going to enter into questions that might have to be argued and decided in a prize court with regard to the regularity of the blockade. He had no doubt that the United States Government, which had always been very cautious on the subject of blockades, had consulted the precedents and taken the best legal advice before they adopted the course they had pursued. With regard to the question of his hon. friend ( Mr. Buncombe), he must say that though there was a great deal of vague statement in his speech, he had not brought forward any particular facts upon which the Foreign-office could proceed to take my steps. His hon. friend had re. ferred to the case of the master of a merchant vessel who had been tarred and feathered; but that case had occurred many weeks before the outbreak of civil war, and when the country was at peace. There might have been some inten. • tion of secession, bat it had not at that moment taken place. There are rumours of a very disparaging character with regard to the person in question ; he was attacked and ill treated by the mob ; but the authorities had endeavoured to arrest the rioters, and our consul stated that they (the au thorities) had done everything that could possibly have been done. The affair had really, therefore, nothing what ever to do with the secession or civil war. (Hear.) With regard to these cases generally, the steps her Majesty's Government had taken were these :—They desired, in the first place, that Admiral Mills should be present with a sufficient squadron, and orders had been given by the Ad miralty that other ships should be sent out to strengthen the gallant officer's squadron. Lord Lyons had taken care to inform himself with regard to the laws of the United States and of the seceded states with respect to persons serving in the militia. Those laws varied in the different states of Europe, and they even varied insome of the states of America. Lord Lyons had, however, taken the opinion of counsel, and if any question arose he would no doubt en tertain the matter with due discretion, having reference both to the law of nations and to the law of the particular state with respect to which the question might have arisen. In the next place, without entering upon the treatment of neutrals, which he should be ready to discuss on the 7th of June, he (the noble lord) might state that her Majesty's Government had been in communication with the Govern ment of France on that subject, and hlso with the Govern ment of the United States. He entirely agreed with the hon. member for Birmingham that with respect to the un happy quarrel, which he believed had given pain generally throughout this country, no words should be used that would tend to bring this country into the conflict, or that might create exasperation or bitterness on the one side or on the other. (Hear.) That a great and free nation, like the United States, should be exposed to the evils of civil war, was an event that every lover of liberty ought to deplore ; and ho hoped that the contest, if it could not be averted, might at all events be very short, and might nut interfere with the ultimate prosperity of the country. (Cheers.) The papers were then ordered to lie on the table. THE DERBY DAY. Viscount PALMERSTON moved that the house at its , rising adjourn till Thursday next. (Cheers.) The motion would be for the general convenience of the house—(a laugh)—and it would be unnecessary for him to enter into any details, for the reasons in favour of the proposition would be patent to every hon. gentleman. (Laughter.) Mr. BENTINCK did not rise for the purpose of offering any opposition to so popular a proposal ; but he felt it right to call attention to the position in which private members had been placed by the recent alterations in the mode of conducting the business of the house. To those alterations he had ventured to object, on the ground that they would deprive private members of a portion of the time which had hitherto been allotted to them ; and the noble lord met his remarks by assuring the house that the contrary would be the fact, because the new rules would give the Government an interest in keeping a house on Friday. But what had been the fact ? On Tuesday, the 14th inst., the house was counted out at a quarter to 7 ; on Friday, the 17th, it was counted out at half-past 8 ; and on Friday last there were not sufficient members present at 4 o'clock to make a house at' all. It was hardly possible to conceive a mor3 complete re futation of the prospect which the noble lord had held out to them, or a more complete justification of the view which he (Mr. Bentinck) had expressed. But that was not all. Pri vate members were often appealed to by distinguished mem bers of the Government on the ground of public convenience not to offer any obstruction to their measures. The other day they had thus had a most pathetic appeal made to them by the Chancellor of the Exchequer ; but what had hap pened last night ? Notwithstanding the great urgency of the financial measures of the Government on which the right hon. gentleman had more than once insisted, the Go vernment themselves interposed just as the house was on the point of dividing and proposed an adjournment. (Hear, hear.) He did not blame gentlemen on the two front benches for an arrangement which those who enjoyed or were hoping b enjoy office would naturally wish to carry into effect, but he did blame independent members of the House for allowing themselves to be deprived of their pri vileges. (Hear, hear.) Mr. DISRAELI said that the House had certainly agreed to the alteration on the clear understanding that the Government would always feel it their duty to secure a house for private members on Friday nights. (Cheers.) The occurrence last Friday must have arisen from circum stances which could not have been foreseen, and which were not under the control of the Government, for there were only the n.embers of the administration present at four o'clock. He really doubted whether the House ought not to have met on Saturday; because, if he recollected the words of the standing order rightly, they were to the effect that the House at its rising on Friday should stand adjourned till the following Monday. If construed strictly that could not apply to a sass when the House had never met on Friday at all. (Hear, hear.) It appeared to him, therefore, that the Speaker ought, if possible, to have taken the chair on Saturday. (A. laugh.) He (the right hon. gentleman) trusted that the noble lord would give them an assurance that a House should always be made on Friday. Lord PALMERSTON could assure the right hon. gentleman that he very much regretted that a house was not made on Friday last, for the Government had themselves business which they should have been glad to have brought forward on that day. It was, in truth, entirely owing to accidental circumstances that there was no house. The Government would feel it their duty to make a house on Fridays, but as to keeping it he did not understand that that was their function. If private members brought forward questions of interest no doubt other private members would come down to receive them ; but if they did not the Government had no power to com pel them to do so. Fir J. PAK INGTON reminded the noble lord of the old parliamentary tradition that there were certain members of the Government whose duty it was both to make and to keep a house. (Hear, hear.) The motion was then agreed to. NATIONAL EDUCATION. Sir S. NORTHCOTE, in bringing forward his motion regarding national education, said there were so much as £BOO,OOO a year given to the promotion of national education, but there were classes of children in workhouses, and in re formatories, and industrial schools, to which Government gave aid to the extent of about £BO,OOO a year. The case he had to submit was this—that there were classes of chil dren who did not come under the heads he had alluded to, and for their education no Government aid was given, and it was with reference to that class that he wished to o btain the appointment of a select committee to consider what steps should be taken in such an important matter. He had been met by the statement that a Royal Commission had been issued to inquire and report, and that therefore there . was no necessity for the appointment of such a committee as he now moved for. Ile understood that the Government had the recommendat'ons of the commissioners under considera tion, and that next session the Government would give effect t9'glch recormumclatiou as they tilirmYed - Oft 13 09 if anything decisive was done he was desirous that the whole matter should be fully investigated by a committee of in quiry. That inquiry should be especially directed to the wants of the most ragged class of children, and the means of providing education for them. It was most important to ascertain whether they could be admitted into "pay schools." It was evident that they had not the means of pro curing admission into those schools. It was, however, im portant, that for the interests of the State those children should be educated. It was out of this class of children the criminal classes were recruited, and it was the duty of the State, in cases where the parents were unable or unwilling to pay for the education of the children, that the State should step in and perform the duty. The eleemosynary principle was universally admitted. The difficulty was, as to how far the .State should interfere in a compulsory manner. He thought the State should insist on providing means for teaching the children reading, writing, and arith metic, and should provide the means of moral training. The pay schools did not provide these means of education. The report of the commissioners said that a large propor tion of the children did not even learn to read well, and the moral and religious education imparted was of the most imperfect character. The pay schools were not the proper schools for the ragged outcast Arabs--those that now went to the ragged schools. He wanted a committee to dealwith the whole subject. If that committee were granted, he would call schoolmasters and other witnesses to give testi mony as to the best means of providing for those poor children. He thought much more might be male of ragged schools than was made of them at present. They were told that they did a great deal of mischief, that they drained the day schools, and that they were disorganised and mismanaged. The commissioners had taken evidence with respect to these schools. They had employed three assistant-commissioners in making inquiry into these schools. He did not wish to question the conclusion at which the commissioners had arrived, but he was bound to say that he thought their own evidence showed that the ragged schools presented a case for inquiry, in order to ascertain whether more might not be made of them. (Hear.) The cases of Bristol and Ply mouth were prominently brought forward, and the commis sioners established a broad distinction between ragged schools in these towns. The Bristol school was generally well conducted, and was doing a considerable amount of good; that at Plymouth had been badly conducted, and it was doing a great deal of mischief. Well, these two facts seemed to suggest an inquiry into the difference between the systems as practised in those towns. They had no right to ignore ragged schools, but if they thought these schools were not useful, then they ought to be got rid of altoge ther. He therefore hoped the house would give this sub ject their greatest possible consideration, and this could only be done by means of a committee of that house. The hon. baronet concluded by moving for a select committee to in quire how the funds voted by Parliament for the promotion of national education may be most efficiently and most economically applied, in the case of neglected and destitute children. Mr. LOWE would, in the first place, state that the Go vernment had no objection to the motion, but he must take the liberty of objecting to its terms. That motion was to in quire "how the funds voted by Parliament for the promo tion of national education might be most effectually and economically applied in the case of the neglected and desti tute." His objection to it was based upon two grounds. Firstly, it contained an implied assertion that the public grants ought to have been applied differently, which would be an imputation of censure against the Commissioners. He would not raise the question whether that censure was just, but it ought not to be assumed before the inquiry. The resolution, in its present form, implied that the mat ter should be placed under the direction of the Committee of the Privy Council of Education. This he thought was wrong, as they were utterly unfitted for such a duty. The department with which he was connected was doing all it could to raise the standard of education, discipline, good order, and cleanliness, making them grants dependent on these conditions. But for such schools as were contem plated in this inquiry, the grants he presumed would not be dependent on those conditions, but on the necessity of the case. Now it would never do for the same board to say to one set of schools, " if you maintain a high standard of education, discipline, good conduct, and cleanliness, we will giva you so much," and to another, "if you will disregard these conditions we will give you more," He did not want the house to assume that he was right in this view, let it be matter of inquiry; but he hoped the hon. baronet would agree that they should not assume the contrary. If the hon. baronet would alter the wording of his motion, so as still to include the ragged schools, but not confine the re solutions to them, and not to prejudge the question as to the grant being distributed by the Privy Council, then he (Mr. Lowe) would not oppose the inquiry. He would, therefore, suggest that the latter portion of the resolution should be made to read thus—" how the education of desti tute and neglected children may be effectually and econo mically assisted by any public grant." Sir S. NORTHCOTE assented to the alteration. Mr. HANBURY thought that great advantage would result from the inquiry, for even at the late Social Science Congress at Birmingham, he was surprised to find how little information was generally possessed on this subject. It was not generally known that a system of schools of this description had long existed. He thought the inquiry would tend to decrease rather than to increase the expense, for money was now given to many schools which ought not to be so assisted. Sir J. PAKINGTON had heard the somewhat unex pected reply of the right hon. gentleman to the motion of his hon. friend with very great pleasure. He did hear that it was the intention of the Government to resist the motion, but he did not believe they could contemplate opposition to so fair and moderate a proposal, and he felt certain that if they had done so, they would not have been supported by the feeling of that house. He believed these schools had been very useful indeed, and in the committee that the Go vernment was prepared to concede, there would be an op portunity of showing whether they ought to be assisted and further encouraged by participation in the Parliamentary grant for education. At the same time he should not have risen to say a verb few words if it had not been for the re • ference which had been made to the very valuable report of the Royal Commission. If the advocates of the ragged schools urged upon the Government the duty of giving them greater support, he should be sorry that he at least meant any disparagement thereby to that able and valuable report. He entirely adopted every word of the right hon. gentle • man opposite with respect to the report, which did the Royal Commissioners the greatest credit for having given the country the most valuable and compendious statement ever presented in this country on the subject of national education. (Hear, hear.) But he felt extremely gratified with the decision to which the Government had come with reference to the motion of his hon. friend. Mr. H. DANBY SEYMOUR hoped that it would be understood between the Government and the hon. baronet who moved for the committee, that it would finish its labours this year, and present their report to the house in time to enable them to understand whether, for the first time, we were to enter into a system of gratuitous grants for an im.. perfect system of education. Mr. ADDERLEY said he rose to enter his single but very decided protest against the motion of his hon. friend and the course of the Government with reference to that mo tion. They were about to overlay the subject by a fresh in quiry, when they had just placed in their hands the valu able report of the Royal Commission, which he believed very few members had read, and certainly none had read the five volumes of evidence on which the report was based. That inquiry and report cost the country at least £40,000, and hero they were about to institute another, necessarily attended by expense, without having even read the results of the last. Against such a course he felt bound to protest in the strongest manner. Sir G. LEWIS said after what had fallen from the right hon. gentleman opposite he would make a few observations. He entirely agreed in the commendations which had been bestowed on the report of the commissioners. The right hon. baronet, however, does not agree with the report and the evidence upon which it is founded, and he therefore wished to have a further inquiry, and he (Sir G. Lewis) would not object to the motion for a committee ; but by giving his assent to the motion he would not be precluded from proceeding with the bill he had brought in on the subject, Mr. DILLWYN said he understood £BOO,OOO a-year was voted, not to improve the standard of education, but to pro vide education for the poor. He supported the motion of of the right hon. baronet. Mr. CAVE also supported the motion. Mr. HENLEY said he quite agreed in the opinion that the report was drawn up with great ability, although it was in some respects contradictory. In one portion of it, those who aided in establishing ragged schools were highly complimented, while in another portion of it the commis sioners gave them an awkward slap, and wished the ragged schools to be regularly snuffed out. He hoped this com mittee would throw great light on the whole matter, and makd suggestions such as would dispose of the whole matter in a satisfactory manner. Lord J. RUSSELL said the question before the house was not as to the merits of the report of the commission, but whether a committee should be appointed. They had a re port of a committee on the subject, and before a fresh corn- mittee was appointed that report should be carefully consi dered. From the statement of the lion, baronet it appeared that there was a large number of children whose education had been wholly neglected. It had been urged on the one side that many children sent to ragged schools had parents who were able to pay for their education at superior schools. The statement on the other side was that many children would receive no education at all if it were not for those ragged schools. He was inclined to this belief, and thought such schools should receive encouragement. But then the question arose as to the manner in which they should get support. He did not think it expedient to place under the same supervision persons receiving a superior and inferior education side by side. If ragged schools were to be encou raged, it should be in some other way. He thought the Committee of Council on Education had done much to raise the standard and improve the quality of education; and h e hoped nothing would be done to lower the standard or de teriorate the qualify. (Hear, hear.) Mr. LOWE said he believed all necessary provision had been made for religious Education. The motion as amended was then agreed to. PAPER. 4r. NORIs m9Y94 for a WM cvmtnitteQ f 9 inqUIR into the effect of the law relating to the free importation of foreign paper, whilst rags (the raw material for paper) are entirely prohibited, or subjected to a heavy export duty, in all those foreign countries which compete here with our home producers ; and also to inquire what steps can be taken or provision made whereby a system of free trade in the raw material can be rendered co-existent with that in the manufactured article, or otherwise to put the English papermaker on an equal footing with his foreign competitor.—Agreed to. MUNICIPAL CORPORATION ACT AMENDMENT. Sir G. C. LEWIS moved for leave to bring in a bill to amend the Municipp.l Corporation Act. Leave was given to bring in the bill, which was subse quently read a first time. EXPIRING LAWS. Mr. PEEL moved for a select committee to inquire what temporary laws of a public and general nature are now in force, and what laws of the like nature have expired since the last report on the subject; and also what laws of the • like nature are about to expire at particular periods, or in consequence of any contingent public events :—Mr. Peel, Mr. Massey, Sir S. Nerthcote, Mr. Attorney-General, Mr. Solicitor-General, Mr. Adderley, Mr. Cowper, Sir W. Jolliffe,Mr. Baring, Mr. Williams, Mr. Brand, Lord John Manners, and Mr. Knatchbull-Hugessen :—Power to send for persons, papers, and records. Three to be the quorum. —Agreed to. POOR RELIEF (IRELAND) BILL. Mr. CARDWELL moved that Colonel Forde be die• charged from further attendance on the select committee on Poor Relief (Ireland) :—That Colonel Dunne be added to the committee. Agreed to. REFORMATORY SCHOOLS (SCOTLAND) BILL. This bill passed through committee. BOUNDARIES OF BURGHS EXTENSION (SCOT• LAND) BILL. This bill was read a third time and passed. PUBLIC OFFICES EXTENSION BILL. This bill was read a third time and passed. CONSOLIDATION FUND (tI0,000,000) BILL. . •,, This bill was read a second time. The house adjourned at nine o'clock. THE UNIVERSITY OF LONDON. SIR J. ROMILLY A CANDIDATE. When the University of London was named as It new constituency, in the Reform Bill of last session, a requisition to Sir John Romilly was most influen tially signed by upwards of 230 graduates, request ing him to allow himself to be put in nomination as a candidate. The friends of the university are in great hopes now that one of the four vacant seats will be allotted to them; and at a meeting of the for mer requisitionists, held last Friday night, at the Freemasons' Tavern, the following resolution was passed :—" That the former committee be requested. to resume their functions, and that the gentlemen now present and those who answered the circular be requested to act as an executive committee to watch over the proceedings of the House of Commons in regard to the probability of the Uni versity of London being created a constituency to return members to Parliament, and to take such steps as may seem to them advisable to bring Sir John Romilly forward as a candidate at the earliest period, and that all gentlemen who sign the requi sition to Sir J. Romilly be invited to act upon such executive committee, with power to add to their numbers." SIR JOHN ROMILLY'S REPLY. 6, Hyde-park-terrace, June 6, 1860. Gentlemen,—ln answer to the requisition you have this day presented to me, I have to state that, although I should never have ventured to offer my self as a candidate to represent the University of London in Parliament, I should consider it the highest honour to be selected by such a body as their first representative in Parliament. I feel that an honour of so high a character has already been conferred upon me by the presentation to me of this requisition, proceeding from such a body of gentlemen as yourselves, that I cannot hesi tate to accede to your request. If your exertions should be successful, I shall with pride accept the office, and endeavour to fulfil your expectations by the faithful discharge of the duties which will be imposed upon me as your representa tive. This I shall try to accomplish by bearing con stantly in mind the principles in which I was edu cated, the precepts which were impressed upon me in early youth, and the conduct of him from whom I received them. I trust that I may thereby be enabled to assist in promoting amongst all classes perfect freedom, both reli gious and civil, in increasing the means of instruction, and in extending the advantages of it throughout the population of this country. At the same time I shall always bear in mind that, by selecting a person in my position, you have expressed your belief, and that you have a right to expect, that whilst by calmly promoting all re forms I shall endeavour to preserve and improve gentlemen,te ancient i n t s h t i t g uLi o a n t s re o s p f e t c h t i , s ykoinugrdoobnali.g—edl and obedient servant, JOHN ROMILLY. Dr. Barnes, Dr. Sturt, &c., &c. COUNTRY MARKETS. LIVERPOOL-MAY 28. -- --- There was a good attendance of the town and country trade at this morning's market ; we had only a moderate business doing in wheat, and to effect sales a decline of ld to 2d per cental had to be submitted to. Flour an inactive inquiry, at 6d to is below late quotations. Oats and oat meal were dull, at late quotations. Egyptian beans (new) gave way is per qr. Barley and peas at no advance upon last week. In Indian corn a further decline—American mixed 31s per qr. ex ship. NEWC A STLE -IJNDE R-LYNE—MAY 27. At this corn market there was a moderate show of wheat. The trade was slow, and the prices were Is lower than the rates of last week—white making 60s 'to 68s, red Ms to 625. The supply of barley was small, and not much changed in value. Oats were in steady request, with a firm sale, from 24s to 3251 per 24 stone. Beans met with a ready sale, ft om 44s to 58s per qr. LYNN —MAY 28. There was a moderate attendance. the supply of wheat was limited, with a slow business. Good sorts receded Is on previous quotations; inferior hardly so dear. Bar ley in small supply, at the prices of last week. Oats were in fair demand. Beans in short supply, and realised late rates. teas firm Old white 56s to 60s I Old red 50 s t o 54s Barley 2Bs to 42s Oats .22s to 26s Beans .42g,t0 46s I Peas 48s to 54s LEEDS-MAY 28. Our market to-day was fairly attended by millers, and the trade in wheat was of an inactive character, at about last week's rates, although offered at a decline. Barley hardly any inquiry, Beans, oats, and other aiticles un. altered. NORWICH CATTLE. The show of store cattle to-day was good. Trade in favour of the purchasers. A large portion remained un sold. Scots, 4s Od to 4s 6d ; shorthorns, 3s 6d to 48 Irish, 3s Od to 3s 6d ; Devons, 4s to 5s 6d (estimated weight when fat). Fat beasts a small show, and sales duil, - at . 7s 6d to 8s Od per 141 b. Sheep—There was a good supply of sheep in the pens. Fat sheep, 7s 6d to 8s Od per stone ; prime, 108 Od. Pigs—A fair supply. Store pigs, 16s to 20s ; fat pork, 78 6d to 8s Od per stone. [ADVERTISEMENT.] Pills and medicine invariably am. private and perpetuate diseases; their annoyance, dis appointment, and expense may be avoided by persons in indifferent health sending only their address to E. S. Barry, Esq., 77, Regent-street, W., London, and they will receive gratis and free by post the " Invatime Own (iIIIDE," or Natural Restorer, without medicine or ex pinse, of perfect digestion, strong nerves, sound lungs, and refreshing sleep, to the most enfeebled, insuring the removal of indigestion (dyspepsia), constipation, liver complaints, nausea, epilepsy,paralysis, debility, nervousness, palpitation, cough, asthma, consumption, dropsy, flat u l ency, diarrhcea, dysentery, biliousness, fevers, sore throats, catarrhs, colds, noises in the ears. rheumatism, gout, impurities, eruptions, hysteria, neuralgia, irritability, sleeplessness, acidity, palpi. tation, heartburn, headache, despondency, cramps, spasms, sinking, fits, bronchitis.—" Unquestionably the safest Guide to health." BIRTHS. BATES. —On the 26th inst., at Hope Lodge, Woodford, the wite of Mr. F. W. Bates, of a daughter. GARDNER.—On the 25th inst., at Clifton, the wife of Cap tain Alan Gardner, R.N , of a son. YOUNG.—On the 27th inst ,at 36, Camden-road Villas, the wife of G. A. Young, Esq., of a daughter. MARRIAGES. FLEMING—REECE. — On the 27th inst., at Bath , J ames William Esq., la o t f e B Cr e e z ig s a in n, F.R.C.S., t o El v i ra, Reece, Esq , of the Island of Barbadoes. fourth daughter of the TEAPE—TEAT. — On the 28th inst., at St. lidargaret's, Lee, Kent, Richard, the sec lnd son of H. Teape, Esq., Trinity-square, Tower, to Jane Elizabeth, only daughter of T. Teape, Esq., Blackheath, Kent. DEATHS. BROWN.—On the 28th inst., at 5, Gloucester-place, Port man-square, John Brown, Esq., aged 63. CHEEL.—On the 27th inst., at Brighton, Mary, mother of Mr. Chas. Cheel, of the Sun Hotel, East-street, in her 90th year, Dixon,—On the 26th inst., at Brighton, James T. T. Dixon, Commander R.N., aged 72. FERNIE.—On the 25th inst , at Edinburgh, Eb en . F ern i e , Esq., formerly of Tottenham, and Kew, Surrey, deputy lieut. Middlesex, aged 79. RUSSELL.—On the 15th April, at Oetacamund, Francis Russell, 3d N.I. WESTALL.—On the 28th inst., at 18, Camden-street N., Camden-town, Ann, widow of Willi am Westall, E sq ., A.R.A., aged 72. LONDON : Printed and Published by MURDO YOUNG, of No. 112, Strand, Printer, at TPIE SUN Office, No. 112,Strand, in the Precinct of the Savoy, IA th e c eautz o f ximu nejt Weclingdah MAY 28.1661.