The Sun. — London, England, 1825-02-26 00:00:00

PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS, FRIDAY, Fin. 25. Prayers were read by the Bishop of LICHFIELD and Co ' /ENTRY, who, together with the Earl of OnbIOND, sat after wards as an Appellate Peer, when the LORD DEPUTY SPEAKER, whose routine turn it was likewise to sit, proceeded with Appeals. The resumed case of " Dixon v. the Company of Proprie lots 9f the Monkland Canal' was first called for, when Mr. - Sandford was heard (in conclusion) for the appellant, and the Sotitivor.fleneral of Scotland, joined with Mr. Campbell, for I N g , re;spona ents ; after which Mr. Solicitor-General (of Eng_ later).was heard is reply, but judgment was deferred to a fu tate Av. 01...Roxburgh v. Mraushup" was heard in part, when the fur tltetatt-earing-wa.s adjourned to Tuesday. -literd-GtrroaD rose at four o'clock, and in half an hour ater tue, Loan CHANCELLOR came into the House, where n aareralmf'their Lordships soon joined him. The Earl -of SHAFTESBURY presented a petition from the: Merchants ; Bankers, and Traders of Stoke, praying fot)an alteration in the Laws for the Recovery, of Small De 3.. ; ; ! - 1115otl: the motion of the Earl of SHAFESBURY, the Otebe. , Lartd . Bill was read a second time, and committed for erutey: Viseount 'MELVILLE was understood to give notice that upon Monday he would submit to their Lordships a Bill for regulaiitig the mode of choosing Juries in Scotland.—Ordered that their boi-dships should be summoned. liord , KING presented a petition from the Brewers of Stock port-1h 'Cheshire, praying to be relieved from the visitations of Inftognet9.l:--Adjourned - to Monday. %ttli Off. HOUSE OF COMMONS. . -~: . 1. STANDING ORDERS. ..A ipetition was presented against a private bill for empowering tbg:lt4int!s Canal Company to extend a railway from the Isle of Dogd-to Whitechapel, which prayed that the House would require - the Standing Orders to be complied with. 41 - . discussion ensiled upon the question whether or not the petition could be referred to the Committee appointed last Sea lion to. comider petitions which might have for their prayer that the House :.would* dispense with the Standing Orders ; no peti tion against the dispensing with the Standing Orders ever hav ing been referred to that Committee. The SPEAKER, in the course of his observations, took no tice of the great benefit to the public in the saving of money and preventing nefarious jobbing by the appointment of the litaniiing Order Committee: he gathered from the remarks of thc"members, that the Committee ought to he empowered to considered questions on either side of the question. It was agreed, however, to defer the decision of the House upon the point until the Committee on Standing Orders could have an opportunity of consulting together; and the petition was withdrawn till Monday, for that purpose. Lord STANLEY'presented • a petition from Chorley, pray ing for a repeal of the whole Assessed 'faxes. • Sir W. DE CRESPIGNY presented a similar petition from Southampton • and a petition from Portland, for the repeal of the. duty on Coals. - Sir C. COLE presented a petition from Glamorganshire, for the repeal of the fluty on Coals.—Ordered to be printed. He also presented a similar petition from Llandovery. Sir W. GUISE presented a petition from a district in the county of Glocester, against the Assessed Taxes.—Ordered to be-printed. Mr. CARTWRIGHT presented a petition from Towces ter, in the county of Northampton, in favour of the County Courts Bill. Sir WANGILBY presented a petition from a town in Lin coliNhire against the duty on Goals. • Mr. -MAJORIBANKS presented a petition of the same de ser,iption from the town of Itythe. . Alderman WOOD presented a petition from the ward of Yin try.: for the repeal of the House and Window Tax. fir ii. MURRAY presented a petition from certain Distillers .in._:•,;c.otland, for- the reduction of the Duty on Spirits. WILSON presented a petition from the occupiers of houses in the ward of Cornhill, against the House and Win d° w Tax. • Sir E HARVEY presented a petition from Hornchurcli .again*t the Dnty on Coals.—To be printed. sir .I. SEMI IG HT presented a petition front the , town of Ware, in II ertforshire, of a similar description. CITY OF LONDON PETITION. Mr. Sheriff llioWn appeared at the lar, and resented a pe tition from the Lord Mayor, Alderinen, and Commons of the city of London, for the repeal of the Assessed Taxes. On the petition being brought up, Alderman WOOD said he was extremely glad the Chancellor of the Exchequer was in the House when this petition was presented ; and he hoped that -the Right llon. Gentleman, by the repeal of those taxes, would give relief to the Citizens of London and to the country at large. The House and Window Duty was in particular a most objectionable tax, and of its operations the petitioners more es pecially complained. The manner in which these taxes was -collected, and the various- surcharges that were made in dif ferent 4istricts, tendered the House and .Window Tax exceed ingly oppressive. The House Tax was a great crying evil. He ic:pew houses that positively paid 80!. a-year to this tax. Mr. T. WILSON said, he had that evening presented a pe tiop sirniliar to that which was now before the House. The Rollie and Window Tax were extremely oppressive, and the of the i.schequer, in relieving the publi c f rom t h e i r ope:ritionompltl confer a real benefit on the conmiunity. gr,11013.1101581.: said, that though his constituents had not petitioned against the Assessed Taxes, supposing that such a inevure would be useless, yet they had instructed him to state, that they considered the continuation of this extremely odious tax—the /louse and Window Tax—without any excuse, ai a: spry great-evil. Very little benefit had been derived from tlier:rttpual oe other branches •of taxation • hut if these taxes irele xeknoved,s•it would be productive of the most beneficial ii.-O;ALVERT was of opinion, that the Chancellor D ti Frwschequer ought to relieve the people.froin the burden of the :assessed.texes. -- „i;:.:-_i1((;46•L;01"NE said, they all knew by experience how small a portion of relief was given to the people by the repeal of a part of the tax on leather, and on various other articles.— ( Hear; beatly—lnAtead of relaxations of this nature, which prodtged i;icArcelY any benefit, it would be much better to confer reel good on 'the- tieople i byrepealing the assessed taxes. /le certainly would vote forthe. repeal; whenever the question came before the House. Mr, 11. DAVIS-said, he had presented a petition from the City etf Briita on this subject;, and he agreed with the peti- Czners, that the , repeal -of those taxes, at least of the window t,,x, was extremely desirahk- He hoped the finances of the uountzy would enable the of the Exchequer to grant . this auxh-desired. boon. Mr. BRIG RT said, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, by repealing thosataxes, would confer a very great favour on the lower classes of society. The petition was then read, - and-laid on the table. - • P:1 r. BYNG presented a petition from the churchwardens and o;:erspers of the pariah of St. Mary, Whitechapel, against the dotyron coaLs, IifACI,ONALD presented a petition from the town of Bury :Edenunct's, .praying for the repeal of tilt. assessed taxes. The;petitioners said, very truly, that it was much better to repeal one-tax totally, than to efFect a partial repeal of seve ral,: This wnifshown by the effect which was produced by the entire repeal of the - salt-tax - On the one hand, and by the opera tion, of the partial rcpel of ,• the leather-tax on the other.— ( Hear ) — The7apphrent loss which the Revenue might sustain by the repeal of a tax, was no eri tegon by which to judge of the propriety of that repeal, since the increased consumption might more than compensate for the contemplated deficit. When the members for London, .Soud4Wark, Bristol, and Westminster ;:ad so decidedly spoken their sentiments on this occasion, it V 044 to he hoped that the Chancellor. of the Exchequer would pay some attention to -thetr representatiois. He trusted that ta e people would not tail to pftitevere in reminding the Legis lature that these were in their nature war taxes, and were, in a t ime of p e ace, a grievous infliction on the public. petition was read, and ordered to be printed. Lord M ILTON presented a petition from the town- of Whit.. by, praying for the:repeal of the assessed taxes, particularly the Window Tax. —Ordered to be printed. , % , 1 7 yVII,L presented a similar petition from. the City of York.—Ordered to be printed. K.. E. W ODE 11 0 i;;.,:k; presented a petition from the parish of St : Peter, and three other parishes in Islorfolk, against time aisessed taxes. Alf% )13/10USE presented a petkion-from the Ronan against the. But for putting Catholics of the lawn of:Einsaie, dawn the Catholic Association. —Ordered to be printed. Mr. H. DAVIS presented a petition . from the churchwardens Bristol, praying that the avid vestry of the parish of St. Pete r, Bill for putting down Associ a tions may pass into a law, • and that no further poirer'bc given to the Roman Cathohcs. - - 9rdered to be printed. , • WORTI,v ingesented a petition • from .enrnwall, 3 g. wag'. the Duty on Coals ; also a petitiOn from Sulkesby; in savour of the County Courts! Bill. Mr. Al A CA,II JEE t Ni urn to lawear at' the: County Courts' PT Ordered to be printed. presented a petition from Wob , Sir It. lIERON t he obit. ants of Peterborough,pres , mted a ,petition from if in favour of ' the County Courts' Bill. 61 ' J. MACKINTOSH presented a petition from iinareS 'borough in 'favour of the County Courts' Bill. A peculiar fea ture of the petition was, that it was signed by a:number of at tornies, who were willing to sacrifice their own gains for the. interest of the public.---(" Hear," and latighterj Lord MILTON hoped, that the noble example held out by those attornies would be followed by 'individuals in higher situations.—(Hear ! ')..-The petition was read, and laid on the table. Sir J. MACKINTOSH presented a petition from the inha bitants of the parish of St. Mkhan, in the city of Dublin,against the Bill for auppressing the Catholic Association.—Ordered to be printed. Mr. D. GILBERT presented a petition from Ulverstone, againstthe Duty on Coals. -- Mr. T..COURTENAY presented a similar petition from Totdess. Mr. EGERTON presented a petition from Stockport, pray ing for an alteration in the Beer Law. Lord PALMERSTON presented a petition from Sligo, praying that certain disabilities which effected private banks might be removed. Mr. LOCKHART presented a petition from the parish of All Saints, Oxford, for the repeal of the House and NVindow Tax.—Ordered to be printed. Mr. C. HUTCHINSON said, he held in his hand a petition froth the'ROman Catholic inhabitants of the town of Cloyne, calling on the House to pause before they suppressed the Ca tholic Association. The petitioners repelled the assertions of the Right Hon: Secretary for Ireland, and of the Hon. Mem ber for Lowth (Mr. L. Foster), who were, in the public news papers, reported to have said, that the Association was the cause of infinite mischief to Ireland. If time were given them he was sure the Association would rebut all the other asser tions of a hostile character that were made respecting it.— J c ilear !)—He also had to present another petition of the same nature from the town of Mallow and its neighbourhood. The Hon. Member for Mallow (Mr. Beecher) was prevented by illness from presenting it ; but he entirely participated in the sentiments which it contained. The Catholc people of Ireland looked upon this bill as an invasion of their best privileges, and an attempt to deprive them of their birth. He regretted most deeply that - the House had on a former evening refused to hear Mr. O'Connell and his associates, because he was sure that the representations which they would have been enabled to make would not only have convinced the House of the perfect inte grity of their intentions, and the harmlessness of the Associa tion, but they would also have had the effect of removing front the minds of the people of England many injurious impres sions which existed with respect to. the Catholics. - Ile could not help fearing, that the putting down the Association would be a cause of throwing back the success of those claims, which, however, must ultimately prevail. For this reason- he recom mended to the attention of the House the petition which he had now the honour of presenting, and repeated his hope that the bill would yet not be permitted to pass.—The petition was then brought up, and ordered to be printed. BRITISH MUSEUM. Sir CHARLES LONG presented a:petition from the Trus tees of the British Museum, the statement contained in which he begged permission to repeat to the house. Mr. Rich, who had been in the service of the East India Company, as their resident at the Court of the Pacha of B-rdat, had made, during the many years which he resided in India, a very extensive and valuable collection of manuscripts, .medals and antiquities. It was the wish of that gentleman, who was since dead, that this collection should be in the possession .of the British i'iluseum, in order that, by being opened to public inspection, it might be the means of facilitating the discoveries and studies of persons Of science. His widow, in pursuance of this desire'of her late husband, had offered the whole of his collections to the Trustees !' of the British Museum at a reasonable price, which might be fixed upon by persons acquainted with its value. The trustees, when this offer was made to them, felt bound to make an in quiry into the value of the collection. They procured the opi nions of Dr. Macbride, Dr. Nicholls, of Oxford, Dr. Leigh,. of Cambridge, and of Dr. Young, all of whom were well qualified to estimate the worth of such a collection. They gave . their concurrent testimony, that it was highly valuable, and would form an important acquisition to the British Museum. The collection consisted of 900 volumes of Manuscripts, in the Per sian, Turkish, Cealdaic, Syriac, and Arabic languages. They contained commentaries on the Scriptural• writings, and were likely to afford very important illustrations- of the sacred text. Another part of the-collection was composed 'of Oriental and Greek medals, the value of.. which would be satisfactorily proved to the house when he told them, that they were held in the highest estimation by the late Air. Payne Knight, who had carefully examined them. The last part of the collection was a large quantity of antiquities, which had been discovered in the neighbourhood of Babylon and Nineveh, on Which were inscribed characters which had not yet been .deciphered; and which, it was obvidus, never could be . deciphered but by means of comparing them with other similar remains. Not withstanding - the long and intimate connection which we had had with Asia, the library of the British Museum was almost wholly destitute of the productions of oriental litera ture. ThiS was one reason why he-recommended the purchase 'of the collection ;. and another was, that it was in itself com plete and entire, and contained not one duplicate of ally 'thing the-Museum at present possessed. He had, in the course . .of the last Session, when he called the attention of' the Muse td_ the munificent gift which his Majesty had made of the late King's library, expressed a belief that . this example would be followed by others. He bad great pleasure in stating now-- (not because it was - a fulfilment-of his own 'prediction, but be cause it was highly honourablecto the 'generosity and public spirit of the individual to whoin he alluded)—that sir Richard Colt Hoare had expressed 'his ' intention of presenting to the trustees of the British Museem, for the use of the public, the large and valuable library which . had been collected by 'himself and his family. It contained, among other valuable books,'a coin plete collection of Italian history and topography; and amount ed to not less than 17 or 18,000 volumes. After stating that the computed value of the collection - of the late Mr. Rich was 8,0001.,. of which 6,0001. was for MSS., 1,0001; for the medals; and 1,0001. for the antiquities, the Hon. Bart. beought up the . . Petition, which was ordered to be printed. Ile then. moved that a Committee be appointed, ad had been done in the case of the Lansdown MSS., to report to the House their opinion on the proposed purchase, which was tarried. Sir J. NEW POlc.l' rose to - move again for returns relaiive to the population of Ireland- from. the last census, which had been ordered on the 2d and sth of May last, but which.liad not yet been laid on the table.—Ordereci. . . ARMY ESTIMATES. " Lord PALMERSTON said it was not this intention to move these estimates to-night, on account of other business, which must necessarily be postponed if it!!hould do so. lie would.' therefore take Only a vote on account;:and, move the whole of the estimates on this day se'nuight. • COAT M ITTEE SUPPLY. •• t The House then resolve itself into 'a Committee of Supply on the tilotion, Lord PALMER:STON ~who moved also, that a sum not ex ceeding one million should be granted to his Majesty, towards discharging the eliocnces in respect to• Army Sulgeons. Colonel DAVIE ! S said, he had intended to appose the vote, unless the Noble Lord should be. prepared with a very strong Case to justify the large additions which were.to be made to the army. He hoped the Noble-Lord - would be•prepared with such a case when he should move the estimates, and that the House, if it should be satisfied, would show to Europe and the world, by their unanirmius vote, that they were determined to support the honour of the country. . . . • BRITISH MUSEUM. • Mr. BANEES moved that a sum of 15,4161. should be granted to his Majesty, to defray.the-expences of the Briti s h Museum for the year 1825.• He was ready to explain the items if any lion. Gentleman should think it necessary. Mr. CROKER rose, not for. the purpose of opposing the vote, but to repeat annbservation which be had wade last year respecting the price at which _the catalogue of books in the Museum was sold: 41 catalogue: was, as - it were, the key of the Museum, and highly .pseful, if not necesssary, to the persons who. wished to. eortsult • the book s . The pri c e of. the catalogue now was - I or B guineas, and this made it wholly im practicable for poor .scholars tt procure it. He was sure tire House would agree to. no vote more readily than to one which would enable the. Muscum to sell their catalogue at a cheaper rate. He did not at; present urge the printing a new .one, be cause, until the King's-Library and other additions which had recently been made should be open to the public, it would not be advisable to have a new edition. Mr. BANES said • the price of the catalogue was four guineas, but that he }vas aware.was too large a price. Mr. 1 - 111. ME, referring to the returns which bad been laid on the table of the.liouse, wislied to know whether there was any .objection to adding.one or two days in' each week to the three on which the Museum was now open to the public ? Mr. BAS;KI.:S said, that theremereonlY two days at present reserved for private inspection of the Museum, and this reserve tion•w.as•made with a view to accommodate foreigners and other curious persons who -came thither to consult the objects which the Museum contained,.and whose object would .be frustrated by, the admission.of a crowd. • Arr. 11 IJM E said, then it appeared that two days were re served fin .. .this purpose, and only. three for the admission of the .whole coirnrinnity. Ile thought this was hardly fair. Mr. CROKER said, it must be obvious to every one who had visited the Altt.einn, that it was necessary for.the students (he did Plot greatly value the argument as to foreigners and cu= riaus persons) to be allowed the undisturbed access to the Mu: seurn ; and he did not think two days in each week were too much for this purpose. . Mr. HUAIt: said, there still remained one day unoccupied. Mr. CROKER said that day •was -necessarily employed in cleaning the building. 111 r. W. .J. BANKES took this opportunity of reminding, the House of the Circumstance of he collection which had been ceded by Itlr. Salt to the Erlich Museum. A sum of 4000/. had been given to him for tht collection, but he was still a loser by it, °Wiwi to the sum w hi c h h e h a d h a d to pay for the alabaster sarcophagus. Mr. Sit made no demand fir the sum he was a loser of, but he Mr. Bankes) hoped that some opportunity would offer of rerninerating him.—The vote was then agreed to. _ _ 31r. H RI ES moved for a sum of 100,0001., on account of civil contingencies, the whole amotnt of which. was 260,0007. Mr. HUME asked if an account Hating to•the expenditure in the colonies, which lie had moved for, and which had been promised to - him, last year, was now ra dy. Mr. W. !HORTON • acknowledgd that it had been pro mised, but it was not yet ready. The vote was then agreed to, the louse resumed, and the report was o i r ., ( T l N er t ed A t i o v b i e ,,i br i o d u s g ( l j a c u i p E t;ll E l s oni l la i tn u e . xt. 31r. GOULBU RN moved the Orcer of the Day for the third reading of this Bill. LEYCESTER said, that it his opinion the society ought to be tolerated by the Governnent, because, if it were pot down, it would give rise to otters which would be more. .powerful, and far more formidabe than this, and which no human power would he able to pit down. lie was sure that the Catholic Association had, so lon; as it had existed, contri buted to preserve the peace of lrelanl, and he could dot, there, fore, doubt that it would continue tt do so. He believed, too, (and this was another reason .which Tould make him regret to • see it put down), that Catholic Enuncipation iCould be has tened and rendered more certain by neans of the Catholic As-, Sociation. It was wholly incompathle with Orange associa tions and Orange triumphs; and by annihilating, as it would, these, which had always been the destruction of public tran-. quillity in Ireland, it would produce real and lasting benefit's to the country. It was • said of a great man of old, that he could, by a stamp of his foot, raised thirty thousand men ; brit the Right Hon. Secretary opposite might do more; for he could, by advancing his foot towards the Opposition benches, raise six millions of people to an equality with' their fellow-subjects. Mr. S. RICE felt it his duty to protest against the passing of the measure before the Home.. There was one of the clauses of the [till at which he was perfectly - astonished, on account of the monstrous power which it proposed to vest in the hands of the Irish Magistracy. The 'clause to which he alluded was that which empowered any - illeyoe, Sheriff, or Justice of the Peace, within his and theirrespective jurisdictions, to conimaad all meetings declared in the Bill to he unlawful assemblies im mediately. to disperse, and to demand admission into any house, out-house, or office, where they shall reapectively have good reason to believe that such unlawful assembly shall be; and if refused, to enter by force. That he considered to be one of the most monstrous and unjustifiable provision that could he -proposed to be inserted in an Act of Parliament. Even if the Magistrates of Ireland were all that was most pure, it would be wrong to intrust them with such powers; but when it was a traitor of notoriety that many of the Magistracy had committed acts of the greatest injustice, how much more impolitic would it be to do so.—(llear !)—The Chief Justice of the Court; of Icing's Bench in Ireland had declared that the higher classes in that country were too often found " trampling on justice, and converting the law into an instrument of oppression against the weak abtl Powerless."—(hear !)—That was the character which the Chief.lustice gave of the class of persons from whom the Magistrates were selected, who. if tie present Bill should pass into a law, would be intensted with the power of breaking into a man's house, with Out the preliminary proceeding of information on oath—(Hear !) It had often been allowed against Mein . - bets on his side of thellouss, that they dealt only in.generalcharges against the magistracy, and refrained from referring to any particular case. He would, therefore, on the present occasion, mention two or three instances of the misconduct of the magi stracy, which had been substantiated by evidence - in a court of justice. At the last Waterford assises, a magistrate named Boyce was prosecuted by a man named _Laden, for false im prisonment. ,Ladall, it appeared, was a tenant of Boyce, who wished him to give up the lease of his farm. Ladall refused to do so, and Boyce thereupon sent him to . Bridewell on sonic false charge, where he was kept for fifteen weeks, at his own expence. At length he consented to give up his lease, and was discharged. The Hon. Member then mentioned another. case, (we could not catch the nartiAS of the parties), in which a ma- - gistrate had committed a man under the insurrection act, .be cause he had neglected to pull off his hat when he came to con sult him on business. When that was the way in which justice was administered in Ireland, let not the House be told that there was no ground for complaint on the subject. Ile asked the Attorney-General for Ireland, who .kne-s- die magi stracy of Ireland, whether he thought it was right to confer 1 on them the power of breaking open a man's house, without information on oath ? Ile did not wish to cast a sweeping een sure upon the magistracy. He knew that there were many worthy men .in thatbody e but he knew also that it was in proof that many had tniseonductecl themselves. Ile called upon the House not to pass such an iniquitous Bill. Ile implored the secretary for Ireland, who was responsible for the peace of that country, not to subject it to a measure which would lead to the most lamentable result:..—(lcer !)—lt was with the most un feigned regret that • he had witnessed such a measure' proceed.. ing from the -Irish Government, because, in other respects, he felt.that the comntry ow e d muc h t o that Government. The Irish Government appeared to him to be in this situation—they recognized sound constitutional principles, but seemed to be . unable to carry them fully into effect..—(hear!)—hie trusted that Parliament would consider the subject, and adopt measures • which would either enable or compel the Irish Government to the people to-do justice placed under its controul. The Hon, Gentleman concluded with moving, that the Bill be read a . third time that day six months. Mr. DOH EPt.'r said, that the Hon. Member who had just sat down seemed to insinuate that pdor people in Ireland could not obtain justice. lie was not bound, standing where he did., : to answer for any seeming inconsistency into which he might have been led as an advocate. The bounden duty of an ativie cate was to, make the best of his cause; the duty of a senator was to maintain the truth. He did not come before - the House ac an advocate ; for, even at the moment be entered its doers, he had thrown of that character. But it was said that justice contd . not be impartially administered in Ireland : as far as his own experience 'went, he found that statement contradicted. In the course of his professional practice, he had been Counsel fOrlmany individuals, Catholics and poor p eo pl e i nto the bargain, who had recovered large amounts, in damages, from persons who had oppressed then,. in one case, in the county of Waterford, he had been .concerned for a man of low ranw, .against a perion of fortune, and a magistrate. Whether his client bad been a Catholic or not, he did not remember, but he had been poor certainly, -and grievously oppressed. In that very case, lie had not only, gained a verdict, with a considerable sum in damages,. but the defendant had been instantly stripped of his Commis sion of the Peace. Then, if justice could be done in Ireland between Protestant -and Catholic—equal justierscertain and impartial—he did intreat that there might be an end ofthat un worthy slander which Gentl e m en were apt to cast on the audio rides of their country. lie did not Mean to say thatethe legal road was very smooth in Ireland —that it was quite dear, or that men could travel upon it without pain or cost;' but' where could they do this in 'England, or in any other country ? After repeating that . justice had been done in Ireland, and could still be done there, between man and man, without the aid of the Catholic Association, the lion. Gentleman concluded - by ap pealing to those who knew him, whether personal. or political • feeling had ever biassed him in the discharge of his duty ? Mr. :ePRING RICE declared that he never meant to ins ' pure to the Hon. Member any thing like being actuated by per ! sand feeling. All he contended for was, that the magistrates of Ireland were not fit to be intrusted with the new and inor dinate powers vested in them by the present bill; and to sus stain that proposition, it was tot necessary to discuss the clues= tion how far enstiee could or could not be done in 'that county between Prottstartt-and Catholic. Mr. ALEXANDER BARING 'still believed, thai in the present state of party, the impartial administration Of justice in country:i t, and lll u N s i t , I c y o , n ti b n a it t e a to fe b w e so, lrelpnd,was impossible. The ease had always been as he stated the commonest Court in England—tire again, after the riots resulting out of the funeral of the Queen, ti s ie m c ce o , u in every time, and in every a t: ter, had been found entirely inefficient. He did not believe that - o ll f la tt n i e h ( f e o s c7— d it would have been possible to get justice in Ireland, either in the late cases brought forward the other day by the Right Hon. Attorney-General, or in the proceedings that originated out of the attack in the theatre upon the Lord Lieutenant. While the great question of Catholic claims remained entirely undecided, and Ministers could give no advice to the Crown upon the sub ject,he wag sorry to see thern coming down, year after year,with new measures of coercion, which the Attorney-General of lie land declared t o h e wholly inefficient. mo ll t l i r on N b V e . fo C re ° -t U h e ll favour of Catholic Claims ; and believed their grant to be Most thought H T o E u N se ek: b.c s a u t i e ti l a e the . liad always voted in important to the well-being of Ireland.. But supportedthe. a .society like the Catholic' • • "'one of the • heaviest Association afflietiona with 'whirl)The Hon. -- any country could be visited. possessing resources which Gentleman proCeeded .coritend, that the' effect of the Aliso, elation as interfering with the re 1 Course of justice, would be most injurious;.if not checkedllaby-the present Bill. He the existence of maintained 'that an Associat:oi actin*'., as this had 'done, and incompatible with the s of no the n Constitution, and out to be put down. Ile could as p s t ure he House, that feeling as lie did on the general question of -tCatholic Emancipation, lie gave his vote for this Bill with felt convinced that. the regret ;but lie tranquillity of the countryrequired it: There was absolutely 'idividual could possess, was only one part of the Bill on u w hi c h he had any. doubt , a nd ' the exist ence of whicirmigtitl t iave induced him to oppose it— he meant th at c l ause whichgave au thority to a single 'Magi strate to .enfore th e pro.viai L s g of the A c t .; but on this point he felt himself rr2licved by an intimation from his Right lion. - Friend (Mr. Goulburn), that it was his intention to alter that clause, and to make it necessary that there should be more than one Magistrate present in certain proceedings under it.— ( H ear, hear !) Mr."SYKES expressed himself altogether hostile to the prin. ciple of.tlic bill, which he. contended was an unnecessary addi tion to the penal code of the country, inasmuch as all the evils said to have resulted from the Association might be corrected by the existing laws. . --- Sir J. NEWPORT could not allow this opportunity to pass without saying a few words at the present stage of the bill.— It was, he •maintained, an oppressive act, introduced to put down by force an Association which had necessarily grown out of the system so long pursued towards Ireland. He denied that this Association had the effect of interfering with the re gular course of justice, sas had been so often stated. The aid they affbrded to the peasantry to obtain justice for acts of op pression, was by no means unnecessary; for though there might be a few instances where the poor peasant obtained justice, there were thousands of cases in which innumerable _difficulties were thrown in his way in endeavouring to procure it. It was known and proved before a Committee up stairs, that Magistrates were in the - habit of receiving presents in kind from those to whom they administered justice. The witness who gave this evidence explained his meaning of " presents in kind," by saying that the Magistrate who dealt out justice to the poor farmers had his corn reaped, his turf cut and drawn home, and other acts of service done by those poor individuals. —Was this a system which looked like the result of a regu lar system in the administration of justice ?—But he would not confine himself to this. He had the authority of no less a per sonage than Lord Redesdale, who had the best opportunities of knowing the state of Ireland, that there was in that country one law for the rich and another for the poor, and both equally bad.—(-Hear, hear I)—With respect to the - effects which the passing of the present bill might produce in . Ireland, he could assure the House that they were anticipated with no slight degree of alarm by those who were best acquainted with the real state of that country. He held in his hand a letter from a most respectable individual, a Protestant, residing in one 'of the most populous, and what had been one of the - most dis turbed distrcits in Ireland. In that letter he stated, that the papers announcing the first night's division on this question had arrived in that country, and had produced in the minds of the people generally the most intense anxiety. lie added an ex 'pression of his own great surprise, how any man who really knew the state of the country could vote to put down an Association which had done so much to restore tranquillity in Ireland, and had b een so much adored by the great mass of the people. livery peasant, he added, contributed his mite to wards the rent with the utmost alacrity, though he did not know its nature and object.--(" Hear, hear i" from the Ministerial benches.) The writer of the letter concluded by expressing the most serious aoarehensions as to what might be the effects of ' the passing of this Bill. He (Sir J. Newport) would not name the author of this letter publicly; but if he were to do so, every one who heard it would at once admit his high respectability, and the means which lie possessed of knowing the real state of public feeling in that country. lie had resided 30 years in Ire land, and no man was more competent to judge of the probable effiset of such a measure as the present.—(Hear!) Mr. GOULBURN said he did not intend to delay the House by any lengthened observations, but he could not allow this last opportunity to pas; without making a few remarks in reply to some of the objections which had been Urged against the. Bill for the first time that evening. It had been asserted that this was partial legislation, and that the Government had made no attempt to put down associations of a different description. He denied the fact, and he ap pealed to the statutc-book'for proof, that the house had legis lated to put down other societies. Did Honourable Members . forget the Act passed in the year 1823, to put down associations of a particular description, by which Orange societies, though not mentioned by •name, were particularly aimed at ? The Honourable Baronet (Sir J. Newport) had Said, that there was one law for - the rich and another for the poor in Ireland. If that meant to convey-to the House that there was in that country a -denial of justice to the podr mall, he begged to deny the fact ; but if it meant only that great inconvenience was felt by a poor man in prosecotin , a suit at law, it was zio more than was 'felt in this country, and was incidental to the condition of the poor in every state. With respect to Magistratea s he would assert, and he defied contradiction', that - there was no such thing as a dispositiOn amongst them to take bribes for - the administration of justice to the poor. - There might have been cases of hijos_ tice and oppression on the part of thesmagistrates'; but when ever a case of the kind came fully before Government, there was no indisposition to exercise the authority with which they Were _ invested, of removing such persons,from the commissiOns In cases; which affected the conduct' of magistrates, and 'which be came the subject of judicial inquiry, it was the constant prac tice of the Lord Chancellor to iaquire into the merits of the case, by takisos the report of the Learned Judge who tried it, and to act by his opinion. This was done in the case of " Lawrence - and Dempster." The Right, Hon. Gent. then went on to contend for the necessity of such a measure as the present, to put down an Association having a very dangeroui tendency,' and against which the existing _laws afforded no sufficient protection. It had been, said that the giving the power to a single Magistrate to enforce thi s A .pct in particular instances was without precedent;- but did Hon. Members recol lect, that the Conventionsactgave• power, not only to a single. Magistrate but even to a peace officer, tcsprevent or stop a me e t_ big held chntrary to the 'clauses of that ,Act ? In the present Act no such power Was given, Wept to a Magistrate. Yet . even - on this point he'was ready.. to _attend to ,the suggestions which hail been thrown out, and to make the presence of more' than one Magistrate necessary in certain talcs; and he assured. Hon. 3tembers opposite, that from the first be •was prepared. to give his most patient attention to every suggestion by which the rsevesityof this Act might be mitigated as Muth as pos. slide, without destroying its effect. Ile then - proceeded to show that the statement made . by the Honourable Member for Win chelsea, regarding - the conduct Of Baron I .ll'Cleland on one . of recent trials in Ireland, was utterly without founda tion. The Hon. .and Learned Memb er h a d state d , t h at the-ac quittal of the soldier . ..sias attributable to the i n t er f erence o f th e Learned Judge in preventing one of the witnesses giving an answer to the question why he had omitted to state at the Coro ner's Inquest' that which he was then stating' . to the Court.— _Since that statement had heeO made, he had received. one com munication from the Learned.JUd ge w h o s e con d uc t w as im ‘ peached by it, and another from'two of the counsel employed for the prosecution. Now, on th e au th or i t y o f t h e co un s el h e could inform the House, that no such qUestion had been pro posed to. the . witness . as was stated t o h ave b ee n objected . to ; and on the authority of the Learned Judge, that he had not pat any stop to such investigation. The Right flon s §ecretary here read Baron APCieland's letter to the effect we have stated ; and then added,. that he had the satisfactiOn of announcing to the 'House, that he had recently become acquainted with another proof of elie soldier's innocence. The l - ..earnetlJudge had summed up the evidence on this indictment with so much minuteness, that in the course of it the counsel foe the prosecution had said to a gen tleman who sat nexthini, " I -Wonder Why the Judge should give himself the trouble of charging on a case upon which there has been the necessity of a clear acquittal from the beginning." —(llear, hear I)—The Hon. and Learned Gentleman had also made, upon what' authority he knew not, another charge against the Learned Judge s Mr. - BROUGHAM.- I made the chargea.on the authority of one of the Counsel engaged in the prosecution: . . Mr. GOULBURN.S.-.Tfle. Hon. and Learned Gentleman had said that the Learned Judge had'not only forborne to defer to him (btlf a .a.luire t lsion irsneeicea;orgaariiin,tnn, read name over of which t h w e • aesvnidoetrincleenotti.fatinieedv:ittnillestsheme.wChoou Counsel ewr. zed in it was sent for from another court, but had also re act been examined.Previoosly to his coming into it. The, Right Hoin'Gentlemasi here read, a letter from the Learned Baron, ' stating, that . as the name of the' ase had not been .mentioned, he could not' meet the charge made against him . with as positive a - denial as he had - done the.lormer charge, but adding that he* no recollection of such a circumstance having' occurred On the circuit; and, that lie believed that no such cis. ,that , u ha c ne t dh which . cumstance had.occurred , as it was in direct contravention to the a r a e t l gr the in e : conduct which he had long been inthe habit Of ptrsuin , to wards the bar.-,(Hear, hear !)—Aftei such a Statement,' he did d not suppose that . arty hotly would again impute to the Learned attributed to hum by the Hon. and Le7edreaGt eloquence in Filiation to employ the wzightstifis g t a hp pe n r person and w' wasg Learned ah criminal o til judicial uen charac ter, act-1 d ' be e such unfounded -accusations V Baron the ill hear ru g ll was and s l f sr c t: h s i t l a f a tiger . and half ter, and lie trusted that it would accusations hint to abstain from de-' anotheriCl g a him nm in a ' l, fu l t i y i e ch as named, though unfortunately the word had not readied his ears.—(Hear, hear !)--Such language. was icariely-tlC . fensible when used towardic all individual convicted •of *crime, but „was quite_unwarrantable when . ua e d t owards an individual of the Learned Baron's high. station and character. (Hear !)—He was sure those that knew, him would a h . . gree with h im when he stated, that no' individual .discharged Iris functions more im partially, or oftener interfered to prevent the recurrence of the violent party disputes which so frequently came before the tri bunals of Ireland:—(Cheers.) - Mr. DENMAN had Waited .with 'impatience for some ex planation of the Learned Baron!scoriau c t in the two cases which - had been brought before the notice of the House; and now that the explanation had been given, he must observe that to - him it appeared to, be any thing but satisfactory. The _Learned Baron had met the first charge with a positive denial. This was no more than might naturally be expected from a person in his situation. A Learned Counsel had, however, pledged his professional fortunes to the truth of the charge ; and he eould not see any reason why tile Judie was to - credited merely because he was on the bench, or why the barrister should be disbelieved merely because he was below it.---(Hear, hear !) a man were to be considered innocent merely, because he denied the accusation brought against him, why should not the Catholic Association have the benefit of the same doctrine ? It had certainly every claim upon their indulgence; it bad chal• lenged inquiry into its conduct—it had offered evidence of its proceedings--that evidence •had been rejected, and its guilt had been taken for granted, not only without producing any facts to establish it, but after shutting out from the public view every document except those miserable papers which were now poured in from every quarter to blacken the conduct and ob• Jects of the Catholic Association.—(Hear!)—Gentlemen on the other side had told them that they ought not to attack the ab sent. He wished that they would follow the advice thergavg; •and before they . poured the vials of their wrath on the Ca tholic association, would recollect that they had driven its 'members • from their B ar , anti had not allowed..them , fute the charges whieh they had produced against them. 7-. It was, however, quite ridiculous to talk of not attacking the absent when it was of. Chancellors and of JudgeS that they had to speak. ThOse persons could not hold seats in that House ; but it was the duty of those who could hold them to re mark, and to remark by name on their conduct if it were oh- , jectionable.. Now, when he found the Noble Lord who filled the office of Chancellor acting as the head' of administration, and putting language into the mouth of his colleagues, which filled the country with astonishment, lie should be deterred by any invidious sarcasms from declaring his opininn of that Noble Lord's - political proceedingi They were told that the Noble Lord, if his colleagues would not adopt his language, in tended to resign. When Gentlemen on his side of the House intimated their doubts as to that point, they were told it must be so, for the Noble Lord is a man of honour and integrity.— (Hear„ and a laugh !)—And yet the men' who told *them so were themselves men of honour and integrity, who agreed to" adopt language as their own which they _disapproved, 'rather than resign the good things of office.—(Cheers and laughter !), —The Hon. and Learned Member then proceeded at consider-. -able length to arg ue aga i nst t hi s Bill , as one t h at was calculated to excite lasting discontent in Ireland, and implored. the House, if it wished to re-establish itself in the confidence of the popu-, lation of that country, 'to put down this Association, not by the enactment of fresh penal laws, but by th e re p ea l o f th ose w hi c h' already existed.---(CheerS.) Colonel FORDE bore testimony to the high character and impartial conduct o f Baron 'Clebind as a judge, and declared h isintention of supporting this Bill. • Mr. C. IluTcurrrsom and Mr. PEEL rose at the same mo ment, amidst deafening cries of " Question." Mr. PEs:r. having sat•down, • • 31r:"C. HUTC'HINSON proceeded to address the House, buts was inaudible for the greater part of his speech, in the gallery, owing to the noise and coughing in the body of the House. The first words that we caught of his speech were these—" Gen tlemen, you shall hear what it is my pleasure -to submit to the House. You will only compel me to be ten times as te dious as I otherwise should be. by attempting to cough me down. I trust, however, for the honour of the House, that you will hear me, for I represent a large body of men, who deem this question o vital importance to the interests of Ireland." The Hon. Member then proceeded, amid much confusion, to reiterate his opposition to this abominable measure, which he considered to be full of mockery and insult to the 'Catholics of Ireland. He trusted that if it were carried into a law in that House; the Catholics would not only petition the House of Lords to throw it out, but in case it passed there. would peti tion the Throne. to withhold from it the. Royal Assent.— (Hear !)—After some further obserVations, he proceeded. to re mark, that he could not suppose that Lord Wellesley hail the littleness of mind to be envious of the fame which the Catholic Association had-already acquired. He would beg to ask the , Secretary at War, why, in a time of peace, the House Were, -in a few days, to be sailed 'upon to vote 15,000 additional men to the army ? It had been already stated, that Government-wanted . but 5,0110 men for Indi a . • Wh at serv i ce, -then, were the other. 10,000 required for ?—( Loud and reiterated cries of,'`., tion.") they apprehend that there ~was any thing in:,thp present aspect of the Continental Powers-to call for_sucti a vast increase? If not, he would ask whether. Ministers had pur posely selected such a moment for insulting a Catholic popula don of 7,000;000 of souls ?—(" Questiors.r) • • Mr. PEEL begged to assure the Hourie, - that at thatlate hour life would not trespass on its,: attention longer than the few - oh servations he felt it his duty to address to it would render neees sary. ,He was disposed readily to acquit.the Hon. Menaber of any intention of seriously terrifying by any thing that had fallen from him; he was also ready to acquit bins of any intention of terrifying.hin t personally. lie could assure the Hon. -Member, that if he (31r. P.) belieYed such to be his intention', it was not in that House he would appeal to him. As to any alarM of Ministers losing their heads, or any apprehension from the pile of petitions with which th'ey had been threatened on a former night, he need not say, no real .ground of fear existed. Ile Would not. at that hour follow. the Hon. Member throughlhak topics of foreign policy ,and the army estimates which he thought proper to obtrude on their attention. Neither would he anticipate, the discussion on the - general measure of .Eman cipation, which Was likely to come under their attention in a . few evenings. On thut:sUbject his opinions had been deliberately formed. lie had no reason to regret or retract the part he had ' taken, and that he would continue to. take on that-qUes don. At the same time that, theßbuse would bear in. Mind that he h a d no t b een oppose d to a ll species of concession w the Catholics. When. a Bill had been introduced into that I - 104Se' for the extension of some privileges.' to the Roman Cathblics, he had supported it, and he now regretful that that measure had not been successful. The opinions he had taken upon this important• question were entirely his own : they were es ' poused by him without any regard to party, and with a view' to the general interests of the eutpite. An observation had escaped . a Right Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Tierney) few evenings since, which it was intended to . apply, be thought, unfairly to him. His Right Honourable Friend the .A ttorney-Ueneral for Ireland, in describing the state in which Ireland was when the present Lord Lieutenant assumed the go vernment of that country, had described her as a vessel which he had found upon the breakers. The Right lien. Gentle man (Mr. Tierney) had asked what would he (Alr. Peel) say to that sentence who placed her in such a iitaation ? He denied that he had done so. Lord %Wellesley entered uperi the government of Ireland in 1821 : he (Mr. Peel) did not im mediately precede him. At the very same time did.he. (Mr. Peel) accept the office of Secretary for the [loose Department. It was true he had formerly fulfilled the office of Chief Secre" Lary, is Ireland, hut he had left it.in the year 1818, and:he 10 5 not therefore accountable for the state of things in the year 1821. All he could say was, that when he left Ireland, al though he could not deny that some party spirit existed, yet It was in a state of general tranquillity. No violent proceedings of associations then prevailed ; nor was there any angry. exacer bation of party animosities.—(Hear, hear !)—At the time that the disturbances did break out, he believed n blairo was imputable to any portion of the Govermnent of Ire land.. These disturbances, in a great degree, arose out sif the distresses of the thness• out of the sudden revulsion Of things that then occurred—the effect -of the . recurrence tie cash payments, and the calamiti es consequent on t h e - close of a protracted war, which were felt very heavily -in this country, but which were felt in a very aggravated degree-in Ire- land. These were the causes which led to that temppraridis turbance, of which Government was, he believed, wholly Inno cent, and which Government could not controul. Before he sat down, he was anxious of adverting to the speech. of the Honourable and Learned Gentleman, the Member for Win chelsea; in repleeto what bad fallen from him respecting:a state ment he, had made concerning an individual-31r. Hamilton Rowan. .It would be fresh in the recollection of the House, that in a former discussion on this bill he had adverted to the authenticated doCumefits of the Association. To them only did he refer; and he even requested that he might be stopped if he stated any thing in an exaggeraeed or unfair manner. • What lie had remarked upon on that Occasion was, the publication of air address to the people of Ireland on the very same day -that a letter of thanks was voted to Mr: Hamilton Rowan. The terms of the letter were—that the writer could not find language to .convey the esteem in which the Association held the beloved and respected name• of 31r. Hamilton Rowan, for the service he had done Isis country. This letter, containing other enco miastic phrases on the character and conduct cf Mr. Rowan, was signed by Mr. O'Gorman, secretary to the Catholics of Ireland. • —All he said of these proceedings was' (he believed •he re membered the, very. words), that the Act was equiYocal—that it was at least indiscreet —and that it was calculated to excite suspicion and alarm as to the objects of the Association.--- (clear!)—Now h e -(M r. Peel) was somewhat surprised. at the ,powerful speech of the lion. and Learned Gentleman, whom he 'always heard with great pleasure e and with great admiration of his talents ; and after he had heard his statement, he was de termineded .tomlt,annetetgathtttoeet letter o hboeesan b inht e t :da c ob o don m et Irfeio e afar. nldefi false expressed o e epwtutr a leolilenld e unosd c ssl a u dieoeti h r dlivfu a ioetn t ri ield,lie4yegdrart if-heaac occupied ice l ft t cou a tuuod i p n neci t doet e odnhrt er w ti hi it. —(Hear the hit ktaken facts e i o ri; f . one —and determined. also not to make an inglorious surrender vice of Mr. Rowan to his country, and Concluded by Rowan ( f e o h o l I :e r o m e a tae ne rd ia lti s ) o e c r o - , expres sion, cwalsi iiocui dan6wn t a l la i hcs a ahsote t acuitsntllrei h ,da d e b a. se s t s ae u it teriiditenr,scoec much uv t ec h yh i this odgratitude history v w e d a s . o t f h o e 3ni s r w . a e sweetest reward extractpu t the froml ouicdecsedaoesanrianeitnnirdpeadpoxno cooperatedr cist s oop s non e i ir s v.e s wi(t i ci o ii r e i ot• Secret his Committee character. o e f read l794 i them e showa that he had been attained of high treason, that he had acknow lchw.elerhd circumstances allgni h s c s e a thetrr w y ha s o ideo f ehns giroinannsnpcloewi implicated ha Jackson,aot ensded trial3t h l at Rowan, and subjected him to a similar charge. Yet it had been asserted by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman that he was