The Sun. — London, England, 1842-02-22 00:00:00

ENCE. Feb. 21. „kip OF ARGYLL. • 2 :!d at half-past threer,,, this day). HORNE. a this case, which W -dship was Chancellor; e Noble Lord, ordered:4, eversed, with costs... n• judgment, but their ni till to-morrow ER, Feb. 21. ' re Lord ABINGER Ind RAILwAir ccotrANY,W ared fur the plaintiff; ley and Mr. Talbut,;,,, !covery of a balance or pulated to finishie, Roberts, thebe celebratO: r the defendants. The was 2,373 L, and tiler •uction of the engines cement or specific ation rendants, by using iron )ortes instead of copper :ontract to use; it ir enginrs for the fr° equi.ntly became con: icy -stipulated to build - in the same principlvar Teat Western 'Olivia/ ;fines were made With uted iron, because la lore absolute strength' withstand the P° er the original COO"' after the derrill. objected to Pay for lor ion of iron for ore that they considers.' w appeared in evidenee rivets was a subaolid Lt that, amongst" ther had been ma& for ~.,thir der the engine ° o o '7 ions cost the Osia lines, according t, ° ,ifts ted to. The plaw; o 4 ae last three years' .4 were all very I on the Croydon Of n• than co pper.,, • degree than Co ?roil arable of drawitlob the fire-boxes , r p s could be heat t it 'ely, he meant I9g without deterio to !nacity anti streli, and in controPZ ctrd more rapid!, i Te cause it had the n e ar tly. There was O it a ads of copper bol ts ! , he heads of irol r p ratively sound. •„, fi r 3roydon Railway %v il o t the plaintiffs). P l opil had now been wa r ts no reason whafe ve o li were found to be I° • Brighton and Le °4l)° ,o Oneer of the Nortiot likewise deposed to the opinions of t o ihs and addressee ty estion was w hethe r eise t entered into bet st ,w not, whether tb plianee 'by recei or to the discoVerloo should be strictly 0 iy had entered in to 'tbc in deviating frre? be rtf ie plaintiff had terms of the sr ee 4 o ;1 or Mr, Gouebetos ,ition, it is tru e ' _ • 4 O tract by .makingrisip stead of iron, " iolut ely refused to i y it was found tht i ost engines of the: eti os sent had been g 3l ; fle in that respect. 0 a 0 intain their 00, ir written contraetot igineers of the , A 0 )oxes of the 112 e 7 - 00 ie supplied by 16 ijs 4 1 copper rivets. ,;%0 and Itoberts fro:n.11:0 rivets were iron n, efendants. reat Western 1 1 7., ii nes had been de o i s ol' ege. ;cs the best of lone consid e rable - or, endants had 11 34. 010 (the Panther) udgment whetted'l4 )g to iron rivets; ad no proof Of theso 3 arpe and Ilosiritos he substitutie,Mist lent ioned to orr,.- s w . S. llef4; seed that'„fot.- - . d e . ad of eopr,.,,y plaintiffs or be en"` of ,on that into , as tetto, 6 Using iron ; to irture, W 07,010 it int . , the der e "4s llB and durables o o f ;, the differe.gt for copper 1 " 4 hat with rega i iefee" [cheered to O l e _ Agt for nd to find sl7l)ei th 4 Whether Lin e ncloe; ered to the A c e i; o o 0 ", it engine he' ic ed ill the way eP ec ti l e tbse ies ; it was tr- ,to 00 done according d. • ete ' of could be rei e Or • stion were not 13 : 0 0: ed by' the del e th iel, !mine whether ot; -whether th FOIL ,ines, arose [rte tee to be inferred j Ly engines dellosi4el e jut y s hould 0 /4 tunnies for 00_0! i been made 7,40.0) ertained but ne t pfr lade. Severe and had net tI bel ;;), seemed as if d w ere, in 17, 4 , pest, from the/0011 part of the d i e; osi ( ge e 11 they r , b 00 , 1( „ot alteration be "egr e ,, , ' with a view t d t he r, d th at ner y , an .„ to , d opportunNotio pliesed in lt: be ir 1,0 it was Of '00 (0 .1 for the OAT 0 0 i jr Ilion was 20i, etrimental re . 0 , defendants. ,kap ir verdict for,o" 4IP u. t o r 4/)lna s. t p et (loat- eL 40 .............. ass ........... ,3t4 for to. glii . g jt s o SOW • crusht4 ... . ...... Per .............. i v , 0 uct4rd... 1 ,401,0 7 itto ....... •• ;OC' 1$ 0 • ..................... 1 tl 8,,c„ pct 1 ,6 0 u ugh....... 0 .............. igs ....... tone of ylbs.... .Iters).. ....... s 4. I . . ..... ••••51 0 .......... 35 1 0 .... . ...... .... 0 .......... 6 CI 0 6 Ha sty fletton ....... 4 1 0 Lambt°ll . 0 0 Stewart 3 ... 6 Cavulot .......... .1 Gosop . 0 j 0 0 5e3 munr 1,, 10 6 godscvliti.,uro ............ ..... •••••• ........ rth "%Vest .... . day', y, .....-"'" , d i , A 3l- 1 rs, VEIJ, 0' !:1) PV3A.O',/ predeitl to $000; otoeeher. 01(1 aer ,11 who work OA, rade. 13y rf°t7ier Et protect till 1:1,114 :totals, and ( t,,,, !Iy protect the t. .. ,pot 04 fo re, nos', .„$ a labourer, hot Ire :or. 1101. Ge,lit.ie , a t the price 0t13,... takes to the 001.ie',., re than two-aocl._Pf y laid Inttl, O f I , : r , toffietnres:--(11`0L 60;000/.- or 80,00.1 tre tv.0,11,11d-s-ji,t iTard)) theolit v, Os not-o.vell 1.19 t t 0110 of up. i.. 01, ,i, tr . flitOpson $; , l ic• Haves) held e• • and, in vshieh ss . ' l i '' '' ' .. • - reoresen oaioil ac ne 5f . , ,, , •!_tY gosese tn a 'le,. ,AS ~. _ i ~.. 1- 111 1 \ 1 1 1,,h sl, ~ ) ....•,..1., •1, quid Isos roo a( a f la ig , G Liel v ' 3r c s :t - t- e..i;. ' tir. - : - e ' s " :.:.lio•.V , s . sl in :re.. Pamphlet *din read an co tsact frets: a :pessii, is'as;tl (I oceanL 11- usitisson's, the substance of which admitted:lit:li InDder4tP for-safe , t , a stea d) . home supple was the only foundation prices. If foreign corn were freely littl e , read !night be aohni tted a little, though a very ' ene u•Per than at present, for a seear . or two. But tbe Mall farmer -. 11 I . •-, • isnrr os meat; would oh , 1 - Is on t it. I ALB, 1 , 1 ~ ,'. l , return t ,, n ' 86 11, and impoverished land w;000 .: r country, tion, tens' a st ate of waste ; home constunp ')f On h conductel so much to the prosperity the 8 would iie.e.ssarily decline. To protect Gent] firmer WaS to protect the eole. Toe lion. heroin enattn opposite had (riven them details of the num at present ot h t r I 1 1 lied not stated • I- 0. eurp.oy, tut le • - ... ellen these mill 11 b .1 - I tl er betore the existen t. o f t he - s lac een bllht--1‘ le -1 uorn-laws or after their enactment. "Can Ho. ale , ffl o o ' ' case, then I ' " said ' " I ' that sere the til a Isefore. ) t stroef, , le (Mr. liar ly) thought that was a • 0 proof that tl • Corn-laws had nothing, to do w it h the , . were i se nulls being unosscupiesl, for these ~.,, OM in existence when immense sums of money were ett ion the ereet . y 1 , •that had occurred :beli e - ion. et the depression • o . - k w ‘n• Gentleman was ready to impute to the toot n ,„, si vhen under them these erections had been made,— ane Hon AI 1. - h a d elle • A sari )er for kiln re iborough said . that he had to h Ol d ugh fur hineielf. He (Mr. II.) was really „ a ll ° well ear that the Honourable alember had gone on the a system which had been described in Such drattdful terlOs a fs v days since at the Criersii _lnd Anchor. c . Oillltry ts But so it ' W '- es in all other instances. The 'l4 advanced in general prosperity, as well as in eninufeetnres s' well as before and Under that ', since the Corn-laws as i n at : B ,7"teill; we had also been enabled to maintain . security tnat great empire, which was so extensive pat the Im' brated h a' .1 sof thel •• ' •nt which we lately cele happy €ll, . It was p el o ;lad probably not vet revelled its confines. in factthe • • of''speculation that had glut- The• te, 11 : 1 1 1.1( ots, and thrown the operatives into distress.. of. - -' 11 • Ntern'oer for Oldham told us that the produce - certein cotton sticle had advanced so prodigiously, that the o a' 'so tor that labour which f Perative had now but -Ls. as Well °latterly produced 965., yet the former, 'hat as the latter price, was under the Corn-laws. i li on bel l 0 • Gentleman hill thought fit to accuse a . ein• tos , n thatside of the House with adopting a species of tanoauct at which he VM S very much surprised ; and the that n. si‘letriber foir Sheffield had said that Members on 1 (1% . 11 2.'11ic f' the House only came there to vote for their ate, interets.- 4 . , Meat. hear.) The lion. Gentleman had %Mik e s t a lle- w ith the g ' reafest earnestness, although he holm t, tbe ti i t ; - le he stated it. For his 01‘1 part, he had kigh interest ' ll i tnis q stion • he had no interest in the of hop r-- °f coril ue. Ile ' had never sold a quarter lar ge " il l his lifo.' (liver, hear.) lie- employed it a afford j?,•l',,aStitY of labourers, and nothing l o t voti. 1 and looS"',greater satisfaction than to see them app? , - that obl3'entY Of bread, but he should not like to see at eri. :I.lleet atteined at the expense of the country. _r i l 0 charg e e m ber for Sheffield had asked how they liked tt , sitie _,Lnat had been made against manufacturers on that th e I ' l 4 . the - : 21 , "". o ilse He (Mr. HardY) . did not consider e "-- . .. 1 against thatside of the House. Th ey bade Wea mace , ~ %mi tt , "" not sent out lecturers to every part of the a yto agitatequestion, they had not used the -ri ot __, the ques • have been iehmiceci.esiastic for that purpose, he should th s . o d if such means had been used by any persons on aSl ue of the, House. ' He was willing to admit that th e ' fl i e tub -, had • e r of petitions on tile subject of the Corn:lt . v,vs kut :Increased —he admitted that those petitions tes,a,teed Upwards of four hundred thousand signs ' to tii;: (li ear, hear.) • Those signatures were entitled - ilk ""iasideration of the House, but it could not be said that 14:represented the whole manufacturers; he thought it would • ti on i l e coreut '0 all that the Corn-laws were not for the protec- ita g , th 4 class but for the benefit of the country generally. That with e l , way in which the question was coesidered th e :lout he had talked upon the subject. It was batedby N, t i t rere n d Delegates that the laws were intended only e ar s b enefit of the landlords, and that assertion was ma they ma nner not very becoming.—( Hear.) It was true . when )8 3t1 P i ssed the resolutlon which he was about to read, it was 'oi l " o'clock, and some allowance might be mad,: for them.. th e no ea ; c , , hear, and a laugh.) The resolution was : that d it is ' her it'l l 'on of this meeting, that the measure propose by • )i.t.Lajesty', Government, so far from holding out the slwhtesf i , fo o r! of any relief of the distress of the etiuntry, is an . in i s o u ok t tikoa ti nt and suffering people, and that the Deputies . . key -e Prap,sition as an insinuation that the landed aristoe slaitgere destitute of all sympathy with the poor, and must not Ifsist r ,„,,e Permitted by an outraged people to pursue a policy sio, he ar to the country.--( Hear, hear.) He was sorry the -;`,"! Members of Parham. nt use in that House ' AkCile language as was indulged in at the Crown anll field, er---(Hear, hear.) The Honourable Member tor Silas • ar asilt , of 1 % 14 , d the landed proprietors of the consequences • Thep Ming the Corn-laws, and reminded them of the fate of 'lot th r s e .,, e ch nobility.—( Meer, hear.) And the Hon. Member e lekt ' "wet Hamlets, said if the Corn-laws were not fe o ed. th e rush the aristocracy, which '-Sto i a ti re would be a upon - Iles, id et s '"P away not only the Corn-lows, but many things d t ' - ooret,„ --- alear, hear.) Was that the way in which the et- Vfl io - ts of Parliament were to be governed?—Hear, hear.) , ei ßi r t "ha were to send out agents and lecturers d to li x r i o t r um e 2fla 4 b Ltre3 . th petitions for a minimum of wages at; W• O 066 r ' he would undertake to attain, no 4 a 0(7,000 but i (I I )A d would it be decent or Viet lon hear. n f him to li cs os nary ° Olese and threaten the aristocracy with revolts eon if they refused to sequences hear, hear.) oss , ~the uf those petitioners ?—( Hear, They_ ; ''aeeti s fat e ,'lng ,, ag - e of Cato on their lips, and the spirit itt i i : a tt f 'e, ut h -• - hearts. He (Mr. Hardy) hoped a e g . rii Ih rettet etr , . persevering in that policy and In I e s' pri n • weel 9 g ° on ' ' rearly and fully to the Il ikele e lPles which he had state( 4 4 04 ,_colintry in his address to his constituents at Tamvt - orth, alki,;; .. „ "° had been called by his late alajesty to the helm of "Its tlo If the Right Hon. Baronet did not receive all the serc,te of the country, he (Mr. Hardy) was sure he de • Itti.ell Let them burn the Right Hon. Baronet's effigy. l -- and •a laugh.) They all knew that that amounted to 4 ti et hat it was the mere vox populi, which carried execrma •kr uith it one day and applause the next. The Right . 11( hts . ~..sietealet would despise such demonstrations, and go on in , • se r s pination to do jut tice to the country. thannel-FOX had great hesitation in venturing . h to address onclu lien; 'lase on a subject such as the present, on w i l l i e ic eoa c sidet,ett h hi s ' l t terlsosite had been come to. However, the subject. ... • 4 4 _ uty to his ccastituents to say a few words onamendment of j he constituents perfectly concurred in the , ~: fc.lo.4llletuber for Wolverhampton (Mr. Villiers). ' n aval el for was for total repeal, immediate but not for .The .see k: ' in that alone he differed from his Hon Friend. ths,,,, e c i e which he (Colonel Fox) would support would be any ., t k- -: snort of repeal now—a measure enacting a fixed duty of s-tatZ I W. and reducing every year that duty by 25., until the :. Oa re P e al way effected. But immediate repeal he could not t i PPart 1. 1 - . He should therefore, not vote on the queation. ' 'colloid , ' • • 'llt aoti erect there were occasions when opposing or voting for tar ot ,' was so contrary to one's feelings that one ought not ... AI se on either side. I'' toot • 11 ,,,•,_ H. LINDSAY supported the proposal of Sir 11. , i f &flea heard much in that House of class legislation, , .'• *0 eleer there was anything that would lower its character,. iSb olat ti ' d be this, that in dealing with the great interests of t he p olve Z it descended to class legislation, by agreeing to o t h. 'lee t „ s l ion of the Hon. Member for Wolverhampton. Its e ss . . land o, ) ~,, 0 inflict injury on the agricultural interest.— i . ite "°! did they not hear of an aristocracy and a 14,1ererst, Alto had been in the enjoyment of advantages for a 'llot t h o lil le, and of which they ought to be deprived? Did they . W -ar t 8 1 1 , t uis out of the House, and ocean ()tidy echoed within ticsib-ri'sr This would certainly be class legislation, and he 4 : 1 4 tn " Inn hif it id h • benefit to the manufacturers. ts nip c • ti tis . - a' ground s he himself, and those on his side of the tur t(i', woked on the proposition of the Honourable Member Aci,i ,°"erhampton as injurious to agriculture, and not.betoe , tided .° Man ufactures, and he therefore should give it . his de- Ise % übeeative. With respect to a fixed duty, its principle had ? l oble ' r l eoned by the entlemen who had advocated It. The l e t - word , th ii e Member for the City of London, had declared ' 441 • t i s 11411 : 1 “, e l of maintainin. the principle of a fixed dut at _all t itt i4 7- set corn be at what price It might ; yet he had h det ,otet, re in that resolution. One authority on t , he su pc t , I°Rerer, had !ince that period proposed to give the Governmen !te e, to relax the fixed duty whenever they might see occa ,l4 t n e d elt the Noble Lord himself had proposed the other even• ""%thi " II away with the fixed duty, so soon as the price of corn Th e rea c h 745. He objected to both these plans. %tat first was calculated to hold out an itiaace skoed to Popular clamour and agitation, and • the l'es e d t foster gambling speculations ; taerefore he was op ufths is ° t. ll o schem- of a fixed duty. He approved of the plan ttl im ; '.‘ight Hon. - Baronet the - Member for Tamworth, be orueq il , his opinion, it carried ' out the two objects which t u the i t ;'‘''Ys to be kept ' in view in legislating on the subject. 5 ". 1 4 a l t. Place it relieved the people from the pressure of . a ' a'reie`„ecs and, in the second, it removed from the trade in Zeet4„ e i ° ,rh that ambling character by which it had hitherto as"' n gilished g It I d been said that censiderable time hest - I'se 1s ' 'a of •Id be received from e , aoore a cargo corn could be thi s 1 He er fter having been ordere, . st , ti ,..Y,. ag reo .e,ount3. hMember, when he said that two (hit r hs ~t ' s ' , wit . _ the . Hon. • ... t 6 .0 Li p „ 4 little time as col •Id be expected. Now he suggestion 11 0 „, IIZeY) would take leave to make was i - 'ltirsi,"•ei that if worth anything, su a re the Right he -t his. - .le tt - m h for Tamvrorth, would giv to e eth , eoto,, aronet, the . em en i -.4 hoth -lu erati on An objection had been made in . reg h ar f il r.. sts at s i t ,s; Ate. • country . nsequence of the time elapsing e o c 4 'nes -: 1 i i , this ' ina yNow, would it not be better when c ' ,II st e t h t - h tit gent his order, he should be allowed to enter the o rn : t Oene of shipment, paying the duty payable in this t-a t 6 el " the date - of the shipment.' In that case, if he found iletye," had fallen in price during his voyage, a rise in the . the r evenue °l t'd of affect him, although in his case, it would affect h o od ;so on the other hand, if the price of corn i th e eb, anti the duty fallen, his case whould be.ne tothe :.nrcvenue, and a falling duty would not be injurious o th e resTene„reheut• Therefore in either case it would not injure "ould ht - , - . ac t • nor the agricultural interest, and lie thought it le allitr iet e l s cuie benefit to the merchant who was sending his ask ret urea to .. merica and wished to obtain a good and til t " ' 4ll . He (Mr. Lindsay) would venture to throw out dent tFgestion to the House with all hismility, feeling confi- . • sia etat eat if it was worth anything, it would receive full con ' he t h o le e• He apoligised for intruding upon the House, but s4 Y th a t het is , his duty to make this suggestion. He would of t riti ,iie felt the greatest interest in the prosperity lissi bee n se commerce and manufactures. All his live Aos leaA as in commerce, and he owed all he coo hee qu to in industry, and all his future prospects were On all ed. with the prosperity' of the commerce of the country. (k r ,objecta which should extend commercial prosperity, he sit e ; -c,"ll°,d?ay) should be happy to unite with gentlemen oppo terest t _' ) 1 : never could consent to allow the agricultural in t.:apt:ab ..neglected.—(llear.) exte nded , I-A. YARD solicited that that favour might be every ne ° him which the House had so unanimously shown to feh for the"embr whohacl yet addressed them. Anxious as he gi ve ~ relief of the sufferines of the people, he could not W eire 7 vote for the motion sisoposed by the Member for iilt ere :, latnPton, because, he did not think it would be for the J l , gso. t_ (. the people, or at all tend to alleviate their sutler -118.,,,.%47,a; iS, he could not rote for the motion of the Right Hon. littt h e fi t 'his intention was not to vote st all on this occasion, suited to t i l? Y believed that . a fixed zluty was the only measure . 1. e , a ,,, e present exig,eneies.—( Hear.) 'When he (Captain a„ . ,_,.! 1 1 . ;my the Right Hon. Baronet advance to that box, it ii.ritZL,' kinds 7 hen lik e a Pandora's box, for, from it went forth ilive:_.,o ev.ils, taxes, and such like, flew forth, but there it No n 7; L I° him ( is I a ar ') the ' simile ceased. for the . him (lon. Baronet said therY• ci. shat g te r- ) It had heirleft. ( Cheers and t was no hop —, Itt the princi al n stated by Hon. Gentlemen opposite, s-ooesiso Pburdens on land were the land -tax, and the tt,,,,._ ,,, , let them look for themselves, however, and see what . . , . I : ....r u er , e....... . Land -tax. Other taxes. 1 7, ~.e;•,l,,lcitod ............ ... 1,183,5tiw . 51,977,0001. : • I r ' t si, r all u ,F. .............. 23450,000/. 17,500,0001. lr s Aus!'!" ............ -- 3,994.000/. 00/. . ~.,(ebeo oi l ... . ......... 8,795,000/. ' • that th i ts ' ) 7.7 0 0 , 00 0 /, 0 Ile (Captin a.ard) did not think. therefoo• l aud the and-tax pressed heavier on the in , 074 . than M other countries.—(Hea owners of laud Eng tate% they Were b e r. hear.) theen av came the • Y Mated, but, ;a year 1696, 1 o'l t h ontLnan's in Ii -~ lu THE SUN, __LONDON, TUESDAY EVENING. FEBRUARY 22, 1842 rental of laud amounted to. 6,500,0001. ; in 1841, the rental was 200,000,000/.; he should think, therefore, that they might lie prepared to pay something towards the poor-rates.--( Hear.) u'roi,is 1810 to t SlO, there were upwards of 1,000 enelosure s'sets passed, and no less than 6,840,540 acras of land had been enclosed; he thought, thin, that whatever burdens the landed aristocracy might say they endured, they ale ays took very good (-are of themselves.—(Cries of " Hear.") In a town in Derbyshire he remembered to have seen a slgte upon which was painted the king in his robes, with a scroll t.o this effect, " I govern all ;" near him was painted the Arch bishop of Canterbury, with the inscription, "I pray for all ; '' next was a field-officer, with the inscription, " I fight. for all ;" and then at the bottom was a person dressed in a smock frock. suoported by a plough and a harrow, who was good enough to tsl ' l them he " paid for all."—(Laug ;ter.) The landlords. he contended, did not bear more than their 'air proportion of the ourdens of the country; he should say oti the contrary, that instead of paying all. all paid for them.—( Laughter.) He be lieved that the beggars in the street paid more than their pro portion of taxation, for the benefit of those who were placed by the bounty r f Providence in the enviable situa tion of landed proprietors By an Act of Parliament, passed in the reign of Queen Elizabeth, any soldier or marine who was found begging in the streets was liable to be punished by death ; that law hail been repealed as a disgrace to our legis lation ; but he believed that a law which restricted the food of the people was no less cruel, unwise, and unjust. He was not disposed to tax the landed interest with selfish or avaricious mo tives—he thought that they were merely mistaken in their opi nions. He did not tax them with injustice, but he taxed them with ignorance. Blessed by Providence with all ths comforts and luxuries of life, they were not aware of the many miseries and wants to which a large portion of their fellow-countrymen were subjected. He wished the Members of the Goeernment had taken care to make themselves persocally acquainted with the wants of the humbler classes. He wished they might visit Birmingham, Manchester, Paisley, Liverpool, and other towns; arid that they might pass from Liverpool across the Channel to that country so important to us in every point of view, and which the Right Honourable Baronet had declared to be the chief difficulty of his Government. Now a difficulty it would continue to be to any Government which (lid not administer to its people full and impartial justice.—( Hear. ) He wished Hon. Gentlemen would visit Ireland, not to see Wicklow or Killarney, but to inquire into the misery and dis til esa which existed in that country to au amount of which he had no conception till he had been quartered there.—( Hear, hear.) They would also see that misery and distress borne with a fortitude and resignation, which, if it was ever equalled, was certainly never surpassed. —( Hear, hear.) And he thought if they had seen it they would soon come forward with a remedy to alleviate it.—( Hear, hear.) He might be told . that any alteration of the Corn-laws would he the ruin of Ire land. He (Captain Layard) entirely denied that statement. A sliding scale might ruin it, but a fixed duty would be a boon and a benefit.--( Hear, hear.) It was the gambling specula tor, and not the Irish agriculturist, who gained by the present system. He begged to say one word with respect to the Hon. Member for North Lincolnshire, who seemed to him act to the !part of the dog in the fable of the " Dog and the Shadow." _-(Laughter.) He could assure them there was no fear to the people of this country from relaxing the present restrictive Corn-laws, but if they persevered in upholding them, he was certain that if there was truth in the opinion that " coming events cast their shadows before," the handwriting would be seen on the wall, and their kingdom would be taken from them.—( Hear, hear ) With regard to those who held the reins of Government, he could not help thinking that they lot a golden opportunity of reaping a rich reward for them selves by feeding the hungry and relieving the suffering people of the country ; but he believed the time was approaching when they should•grant to the people what they unwisely de nied to their petitions.--(Cheers. ) Mr. SMYTHE said that he considered the Hon. and Gal lant Member who sat down, and the Hon. and Gallant Mem ber who preceded him, acted wisely in rejecting all proposi tions and assenting to none, but he (Mr. Smythe) would en deavour to prove the inconsistency of such a line of conduct. The lion. Member for Wolverhampton had told them that the ell', et of repealing the Co , !•n•laws would be to throw a great deal of land out of cultivation, while the Hon. Member for Stockport had told them that, in his opinion, the value of land would be considerably diminished, and that there would be a restriction of capital to agricultural objects on the Continent. If such were the case, no one would pretend to tell him that the producers of this country would be able to compete with the producers of the Continent. There was a great discrepancy of opinion between those who told them that the agricultural interest was suffering under great and peculiar burdens and those who said that they had no such burdens to complain of. Mr. Ricardo, in his work on agriculture, in an argument in fa your of a drawback, said, that in allowing this drawback • they merely returned to the farmer a tax which was already p dd, and which he must have t.o place him in a situation to compete with the foreign producer. Not less inconsistent were those who denounced all protection, and who yet voted with the advocates for a fixed protection. There was an other inconsistency between those who advocated a repeal of the Corn-laws, because they believed t'At it would extend the home market, and those who aslvoested it because they believed it would extend the foreign market. Now if the House would dispassionately consider the proposi tit.n of the Right 114. n. Baronet, they would see that finding that the agricultural interest hAi been too much protected, he p ()poseur to abate it, but gradually—a course that had been adopted in 'imilar cases in foreign countries, and referred to, not in reprobation, but as en example, by Mr. M'Ciregar, in his evidence before the Import Duties Committee: That Gentleman stated that Austria, considering that her manti factures were inordinately favoured, imposed a maximum duty of 20 per cent. on foreign manufactures. In like manner the Right 1-lon. Baronet proposed a maximum duty of 20s. per quarter on foreign cern. But, truly, the best praise of the Right Hon. Baronet's measure was, that it had displeased the extreme men of both parties. HoWever, as an argument for the justice of the Right Hon. Baronet's course, he (Mr. S.) would remind the House, that in 1802, 1803, and 1804, which were marked by agricultural improvement and' encourage ment, the average price of wheat was 61s. ; in 1823. by no means a bad year, it was 51s. 9d. Taking into consideration the cheapness of labour since that time, the improvements in agricultural science, anti the reduction of taxation, he would now put it to those Honourable Members who feared that the landed interest were hardly dealt with, whether from the same soil, wheat could not now he raised at much less expense. But he would also put it on another and a kindlier ground. He would remind them of what they owed to the manufac tures—( Hear, hear)—to them they owed the splendour, the power, the prosperity' of the country.—(Cheers.) And in reference to what had' been said by the Hon. Member for Knaresborough, he must warn those to whom it appeared that it was the time for the agriculturists to indulge in Quixotic aggressions, whieh originated in , •spurious and hypocritical benevolence—( Hear. hear)—this was not the time to re ject God's gifts- , -(Cheers)—this was not the time to reject . the blessings of machinery.—( Cheers.) But for it Birmingham and Manchester would be like Woodstock and Dunstable.— Hear, hear)—and Liverpool would still be a fishing village.— Hear, hear ) Look to the imperial Augsburg, of which it was said that it was more magnificent and great when the sound of the hammer and the mill-wheel was in a perpetual din, than when it was the seat of imperial grandeur. The rent of the adjacent land was ten times as high.—( Hear, hear.) For his own part, in looking to the working of this question, he had come to the conclusion that there had been but four Ministers who had dealt with this question in the spirit which the people had at right to expect. These were Lord North; afterwards Mr. Canning, who was unsuccessful in the measure which he proposed in 1827 ; and lie thought the Noble Lord opposite (Lord J. Russell) was entitled to a full mend of credit for the measure which he proposed last year.—( Hear, hear.) But he thought, however, that the Right Hon. Baronet had a still higher claim for the measure which haul been laid before the Committee.—(Hear.) He was glad to see an end approach to the unjust system of protection—(Hear, hear)—by which so much bad land had been broken up—by which our commerce had been crippled, and so much wealth amassed with little labour and little merit.—( Hear, hear.) He wns glad to see that this monopoly and another als Hear)—would be broken up and trampled in the dust.—( Hear, hear.) He had been sent to Parliament to represent, it no directly, at least indirectly, 16,000 consumers, • and he could testify not only to the distress which prevailed amongst them, but to the grati tude with which they would receive any boon.—( Hear, hear.) The assertion of the people's rights is eonsistent And nature!, whereas opposition to them is inconsistent and unnatural—the Hon. Member for Bradford had, the other night, pronounced a well-merited panegyric upon tins country—he described her as the mistress of one-sixth of the earth and the entire of the seas. How could it be said t here that she, was not able to protect the in dustry'of her sons?—( Hear.) What could be more melancholy than that the distress which is now so general throughout the country was owing to the idleness of the people—not to their negligence or inactivity but to over-production —to over in dustry-.to the over exercise of those arts and sciences, and of those talents, for which the people of England have lung been celebrated— Lex est artificis, arte perire AIM ( Hear, hear) It was melancholy that the industry of the people should be the cause of their distress ; but he hailed the measure now proposed by the Right Hon. Baronet as an in stalment.—( Cheers', and counter cheers.) Yes, he hailed that measure as an instalment of a wiser and a more thoughtf course of policy.—(Loud cheers and counter cheers. ) He entertained an anxious hope that that measure would serve , the country, and he looked upon it as an earnest, that the pro portions of their monstrous tariff would be reduced to some thing of a seemly shape.—( Hear, and cheers.) He trusted that the 'tight lion. Baronet would carry out his projects without inflicting a calamitous burthen of additional taxes upon the starving people of this country. If the measure proposed by the Right Hon. Baronet werecarried ire() effect, it might sava the people of England from destitution and misery. England was pre-eminent in power—pre-eminent for her arts and sciences. but those advantages would be scarcely a guarantee for the preservation of her interests. It was he believed Dryden, who said that he had heard of many virtuous per sans ending unfortunately, but he had never heard of a virtuous nation ending so. It was to be hoped that the calamities of misfortune would not weigh down this country; and if the Right lion. Baronet had accomplished his objects without appealing to the passions or the prejudices of the people, his best reward would be the universal gratitude of a relieved—a free and a contented people.—(Cheers.) • Mr. MAC AULAY said that many expressions had fallen from the Hon. Member who had just sat down— and he con sidered them the best parts of his speech—which he hardly knew how they would be taken by those with whom he would divide on the present occasion. Per himself, he had never on any former occasion addressed the House on this subject ; and the course he should think it his duty to take this night made him very desirous that he should not be misunderstood. He thought., also, that something was due on this occasion to the great constituent body he had the honour to represent, and and which on this subject entertained a . feeling peculiarly in • tense. The House would permit him perhaps to soy, that there was no constituent body more entitled on this subjet to a favour able hearing, for there was, perhaps, no constituted hotly, no city in the kingdom, containing a hundred and twenty thou , and inha bitants, somuch in a situation to be an impartial judge of the question. He had heard with great pain ; the sarcasms that had been thrown out against the manufacturing interest—sa•- casms thrown out against great communities engaged in com merce. But against the people of Edinburgh such sarcasms I would fall pointless, for Edinburgh was a capital c ty, a city having l.eh no manufact ures , a city having no foreign trade, a city which was support e d pr i nc i pa ll y b y it s conne ction with the administrati on of the law by its connection with the Univer sity, by its liteiatme, by its society, and the attractions ant! facilities it held out to the gentry of a whole kingdom, who were in twhheuhidabhiet (oliffltto repairing thither during a portion of every year, It an equal ext en t, could be en s t a io t n ,a a i n y y sa c i o d os t t u it h u a e l n e t body intdywehreiesht but that Which it had in common with the whole empire. Its in teresta,y,thsav a t s ai t t h h a h t ug w ha ' n than th • h : ic hs h etr w p a e s oi c a o e m o m f on to all ; and he could truly theirin h disapprobationqttesti eir approbation to takeon he should think it dutyhisongEdinburgh took an interest of hi a s s ei, his . et he expected rather Should the great body f e el r presentt c o u r o s e e c w a a i c a l . 1 of his Hots. Friend the that conduct, yet lie oid not feel.ostituents not feel satisfied with that motion , nevertheless, he imheart fur liberty ‘v otiov,s,ruip,apoinrit)ttahne motion With a ro m n o e t t i on e th a a g t reed in principle, and as he plan of theu Right Hon. Baronet. His v,.agreedwas he opposed in principle e principle understooddifference w t i h th 6 the Right unds alflotnh.e t neasure to be principles on was fundamental d o a n m e which he was sure, it the Right Baronet should feel him self to bells error, he would see it ". to be an error of the most fatal kind g Ile underst oo d the round s of the m e a sur e to be based on' this priaciple, that the cheapness of life was not uniformly essential to the pro s perity of the necessu ies of a people. The Right Hon. Baronet , inth o and most distinct manner said that he should be deluding the people if he held out from this, or from any similar change, a hope of relief. He said it was a mistake to suppose that cheap food necessarily had a tendency to promote the prosperity of the people. Now, if on 0 at paint the Right. Honourable Baronet was wrong, he 'Oust admit that he had founded his measure on false erneiples. The Right Honourable Baronet had distinctly disclaimed all intention of benefiting one class mere than others. They had heard no talk from him about the consti tutional grounds on which one class should be protected to enable them to support the dignity of their state. Such doctrines were not only not brought forward on the present occasion. but he (Mr. Macaulay) understood the Right Ho. nourable Baronet, disclaimed all such doctrines. He under stood that he considered this subject with a view to the general prosperity. If it then were the fact that cheapness of food was always a blessing to the people who enjoyed it, he ( Mr. Macaulay) conceived the measure of the Right Honourable Baronent not to be defensible. On that matter, certainly, the political economists had the advantrige. For certainly the general opinion of mankind, from the earliest. ages to the present time, decided that the cheapness of food was a blessing. That was the deeply-rooted conviction of all countries. He need not refer to the Hebrew Scriptures, as some had dune, for. the purpose of deciding this question. The oldest documents and historical authorities contained the clearest proof of the ihelings of mankind on this subject down to our own times. No person was better acquainted with the histories of Greece and home than the flight lion. Baronet, nor could better fur nish proofs of the feelings of those nations on this subject. When one found a labouring man makings 40h a-year for the support of himself, his wife, and family, would one say that a difference of 8/. a-year, being 11. on each of the eight quarters required for the sustenance of his family was not material ? That was only a prima facie case ; and how did the Right lion. Baronet meet it? Why, the other night the Right Ho nourable Baronet came forward, after the sense of all ages and nations had been otherwise expressed, to show that cheapness of food was not necessarily a benefit to the people The arguments of the Right Hen. Gentleman were simply these—that there were countries in which food was cheaper than in England, and yet the people were not so well off. The countries mentioned were Prussia and Belgium. If the Right lion. Baronet used any other argument than that in opposition to the sense entertained and expressed by the world during 4,000 or 5,000 years, with respect to the advantages of cheap food, such en argument would receive his (Mr. Ma caulay's) most particular attention. Nor was the argument ab• solutely worth anything—was it even plausible ?—( Hear, hear.) The doctrine he (Mr. M.) affirmed was, that cheap food was a blessing to a nation, in the same way that health was a blessing to an individual. Of course a snail might be in the enjoyment of excellent health, and yet, from peculiar circum stances, such as family embarrassments or a stain upon his character, he might be worse off than another man who was ill. But that did not go to disprove the general position, that the man who was in the enjoyment of health was better off than the man who was labouring under disease, and that the invalid, who enjoyed other blessings, would cer tainly have those blessings greatly enhanced- by the enjoyment of health.—(l-lear, hear, and cheers.) The flight Honourable Baronet's argument went to destroy all belief in good and evil. It was the same thing as saying that fertility of soil was no good to a country. Suppose they possessed the power by legislative enactment, which they did not, of making the barren moors and mountain tops of Scotland as fertile as the vale of Taunton, the Right Hon Baronet, upon his principle, would be bound to tell them it was their duty to abstain from doing so. He would tell them to look at the state of Scotland and of Bengal—Bengal, a country so fertile, that they had regularly three harvests every year, and yet where the labourer could not enjoy from• his earnings one half the luxuries and comforts that s are enjoyed by the. Scottish peasant. The Right Hon. Baronet, pointing to the fertility of Bengal, and the state of the labourer, then would say that it was their duty to abstain from the endeavours to make Scotland as fertile as Bengal. In considering this question the Right Hon. Baronet had kept out of view all those modifying circum stances to which he wet bound to have paid attention before in stituting the comparison--circumstances all-important in the consideration of such a question. Apart from good government, the security of property, internal order, the colleciion of im mense) masses of machinery, the enjoyment of civil and religious liberty, the immense wealth of our minea— a 11 these had been entirely left out of the question by the Right Hon. Baronet, and he had produced merely one single argument, which he had urged against the general sense of all ages, and of all nations.--( Cheers.) There was one single point in the comparison between England and Prussia which had been instituted by the Right Hon. Baronet, to which he (Mr. M.), would direct the attention of the Committee, which had been wholly passed over by the Right Hon. Baronet; that was our insular position, and our m ,ri time supremacy, which was the consequence of that position. —( Hear, hear, and cheers.) We had never within the memory of any owe living seen an enemy in this country. Our fathers had never seen such a thing. With the exception of the march of the Highland clans to Derby in the years 1745 and 1746, they must go back fur centuries to find the time when Englishmen had seen a foreign enemy in this country.— ( Cheers.) Could the like be said of Prussia. ?—( Cheers. ) Why, in the memory of many now living 50 pitched battles had been fought in that country, and withit the memory of many of those who now heard him, in one year, 13,000 housei in Prussia had been seduced to ashes by a foreign inroad.—(Hear, hear.) Rut were they, therefore r in instituting a comparison between the people of Prussia and England, to say that cheap ness was no blessing?—(Cheers.) If the Right Hon. Baronet had said that there was a necessary connection between cheap ness of bread arid lowness of wages, he might have made some thing out of that. But he was not aware diet the Richt Hon. Baronet had made such an assertion, and he (Mr. Macaulay) was by no means disposed to admit the existence of any such Connection, for he had seen within the - last few months the price of bread much raised in this country, hut wages had not risen in proportion. Besides, every fact refuted an argument founded on the assumption of such a connection. It was true that :in Prussia corn was cheaper than it was in England, and wages were lower; but it was equally true that on the banks of the Ohio corn was much cheaper even than it was in Prussia, and wages were twice as high. —(Loud cheers.) It was therefore perfectly clear from experience that the mere cir cumstance of the 'slice of provisions being low would not cause v:ages to descend. He (Mr. :Macaulay) conceived that the Right Hon. Baronet had shown no reason against the principle that to the people it was a blessing to have cheap food, and, 'as he had founded his measure upon that principle, his measure was against him. lie (Mr. :Macaulay) equally dissented from the other propositions on which the Right Hon. Baronet had raised his measure. He denied the doctrine the Right Hon. Baronet had laid (town with respect to the importance of being independent of foreign countries. He would not argue the question whether they could be per fectly independent. That would be a good state of things. It was unnecessary to argue that question, because the Right Hen. Baronet himself admitted that perfectly independent they could not be. It seemed to him that it could all but be demonstrated that it was utterly impossible ' for a nation in which corn was grown to be per fectly independent. He would suppose that 25,005,000 quarters of corn was the supply required annually by the peo ple of this country ; such being the ease, it was clear that, in order certainly to have that quantity always at commaad, it would be necessary to sow such a quantity of corn, that in years that were better than the average years they should have a larger . quantity. Such a circumstance must be taken into consideration when the nature of the product was considered, and also 'the nature of the season. Such a course must be ' adopted in order to have a certain supply to so great an extent. Corn was very different from manufactured commodities; they might order 25,000,000 pairs of stockings arid be certain of having them; but such was not the case with corn. If they wished to have 25,000,000 of quarter:, certainly, they must at times have an over quantity ; the only way, therefore, in which they could be certain of always having 25,000,000 quarters for consumption, must be ruinous to the farming in terest ; it therefore seemed to him to be clear to demonstra tion that when once in the country the price of corn was dearer than in others, independence was impossible, and experience confirmed it. Formerly England was an ex p or ti ng co untry, but in later time, in spite of all improvements in agriculture. the progress of population had gone on to such an extent as to render it almost impossible for agriculture to supply the wants of the people.—(Cries of " Hear, hear.") The Right Honourable Baronet admitted that we were to be dependent, but lie (Sir R. Peel) preferred casual dependence to vonstant dependence; he (Mr. Macaulay) would say that ha 'preferred constant dependence.—(Hear, hear.) lie pre ferred it partly for reasons which had been assigned by others more ably than he (Mr. Macaulay) could have thine—he pre ferred it because constant dependence had a tendency to be • come mutual dependence —and be preferred it because it wsuld lead to the exportation of manufactures.—( Hear, hear.) If we had casual dependence we must export the precious metals, and those consequences which had been depicted by Mr. Huskisson twenty years ago would result.—( Hear, hear.) But he like. wise preferred it on the Right lion. Baronet's own ground. '1 he Right Hon. Baronet and others had said that if we were not independent we should remember that the harvests in foreign countries were likely to be bad at the same sea son that they were bad here. They would find by experience that the probability was that if we de pended on them, when a bad harvest came, they would shut their ports; but those were the very years when we must be dependent—the Right Hon. Baronet admitted there must be casual dependence, and that world be the time when we must be dependent.—( Hear, hear.) He believedthe system which the Right Hon. Baronet proposed to adopt would have a tendency to produce those evil..; but though it happened that in countries situated near to each other the harvests were generally bad at the same time, it was by no means the case that when the harvests of England were bed the harvests on the banks of the Ohio would be bad too.--s( Hear hear, ) Could anything be more clear, than that next to independence —and, indeed, almost the same thing—was a very wide de pendence—a dependence on the whole world ?—( Hear, hear. ) fhe probability was against the supply failing simul taneously in all parts of the world. The only way to have this wide dependence on the whole world was a constant dependence, fos it was quite clear that under the Right lion. Baronet's sliding scale, we could not have it—( Hear, hear) — and an Hon. Gentleman on the other side had said that we could not have it if the Right Hon. Baronet's measure were carried out as it at tresent stood, and that we should not be likely to have a supply from the United States. He confessed that there might be a danger of being politically dependent in consequence of being commercially dependent, but it was im possible to show any ground for its real existence. Experience however, was spite clear on this point, and his Noble Friend the Member for the City of l a ondon had mentioned en instance he might have made stronger. He (Mr. Macaulay) believed that the year in which the greatest import of corn was made into England,that had ever been made in any year up to that time, was the year 1810.-4 Hear, hear, from an Hon. Member on the Ministerial benches.) 'Under the continental system.— (Hear.) He was not so fortunate as to catch what the Hon. Gentleman said, but he believed these facts to be perfectly obvious—that in the year 1810 England imported about 1,600,000 quarters of wheat ;. that of those 1,600,000 quarters of wheat absut 800,000 came from France itself.—( Hear, hear.) That the rest came from countries that were then provinces of France. For observe what the year 1810 was. It was the very i height of the continental system. That system was then screwed up• to its • very utmost rigour. It was in the beginning of 1810 that Bonaparte deposed from the throne of Holland his own brother Louis, for not carrying that system Into effect. Denmark acted upon the system, and, as far as he knew, it was not from America that any part of that supply came which was deserving of attention. Now, were we ever likely to be placed in such a situation again ? Was it probable that there would ever be again s'ich a combination against us— the whole of Europe united against us under a chief of such extraordinary rao his rdi i i n ta te r b y se ab b il a i t t r y ed a and f energy, thiscountry, and his detertnina and distingui s h e d above all Lion to attack that country by means of its trade and corn.- merce? And•yet in such a Government, and in the very year when the severity of that Government was screwed up to the very highest point, in that very year we imported into England, and from his own domionins, a greater quantity of corn than had ever been imported into England before.—( Hear, hear. ) That circumstance, until he heard some , xplanation of it, which he had never yetheard, that circumstance seemed to him verycon soling with respect to the effect of that commercial dependence. ' He thought that, in a certain degree, the mutual dependence of nations was a great blessing ; and he fully agreed with all that was so eloquently and forcibly said the other night by his Noble Friend, the Member for Tiverton. He could Trot but consider it as one of the most consolatory facts, as one of those things which ought to lead them to entertain the best hopes for their the cou ntry, when hesaw, in remote and fertil e parts o f t h e wor ld , s population whose most lucrative employment w ilderness into corn fields, multiplying was turning at suds a rate that it doubled every two or three .and twenty years. He did not knew what limit they were to place to the prosperity of a 'country whose skill, whose machinery, whose vast accumulations of ca • pital enabled it 'to supply the whole world with manufactured articles. Whatever the 'distress might be here, however unfa vourable the seasons, people were at work to save our population from starving. All along the banks of the Mississipi and the Missouri ; all along the Euphrates, in those countries where coal perhaps did not exist, where there was scarely any capital, there were people looking forward to cutlery and clothing. and a thousand comforts of life coming from their skill ; and then stepped in the Legislature, and said, "No, you who ought to he manufacturers for the whole world, shall be turned into ploughmen ; and you, who ought to be producers of corn for the world, shall he turned, against your will, into manu facturers ; you shall not buy from them, you shall undersell th e m." In a time of distress they had at one end of the world artisans starving, in order that barren fields might be forced to yield a small return for an enormous outlay ; while at the other end of the world they had persons who could be most beneficially employed in sowing corn ; they had been making bad coats and had snives , and a ll t hi s th a t a par ti c ular class might be benefited at the expense of every other.—( Hear.) ' This was a subject which they had been cautioned against en • terine upon by the Hon. and Learned Gentleman the Member for Bradford ; hut he ( Mr. Macaulay) could not refrain from touching it, although he hoped lie should do so in such a mari ner that no one could condemn the spirit in which he spoke. It was not possible for us to shut our eyes to the remote poli tical consequences of such a state of things. The people had borne their privations patiently—they had borne their disaps pointments patiently, for with regard to those little exhibi tions of feeling to which allusion had been made, he thought as s t e ilhvi t ,ah l t a t: r iti e hti d f vi a ,: e y es rrtye t h h v etre l r, i nei iidgt to t h oy Right ht ajotim any s r r o ,gt hpn e ee t rt fht l l r tu awrs future ominous—any littlehrt n :l:h g o o e h u ft s s t_ h oh o fe a u lm n i l d y e asms sign n h , law, of of order, ought to contemplate with uneasiness, it was one which he saw so very generally hailed with acclamation by those gentlemen who professed the strongest attachment to the princi plea Conservative policy.—( Hear.) He knew of nothing that seemed to him more alarming than the obstinacy and the enihusasm with which some persons, to whom he could give no better name than that of incendiaries—persons who professed doctrines subversive of all order and all property_ labour to prevent a settlement of the question of the Corn laws. Whenever he heard that by the advice of some noted dealers in sedition, numbers of people, who were all Chartists, had gone to break up meetings held for the purpose of peti- Honing for a repeal of the Corn-laws, he looked upon it as a sign, not of immediate danger, but still as a sign of serious danger. For what reason could it be imagined that those whom they (the Ministerial Members) agreed with on that side of the liou.e, in designating 113 incendiaries and sowers of sedition were desirous of preventing an alteration in what they considered an abuse ? Did that proceed from a love of the landed aristo cracy, or of any other interests connected with the aristocracy ? They all knew the aristocracy ; nay, they knew that the people in their own addresses talked most bitterly against those very Corn-lase. And yet if a meeting were called in almost ' any of the great towns in this country to petition against the Corn-laws, those men would more Heaven and earth to cause that meeting to fail; and for what purpose? Evidently for this ; they knew perfectly well that however much the people might complain of the effects of the.present partition of power and of Government—however much they might feel about abuses merely political, there was very little danger that unless they had such a grievance as the Corn-law to work upon, they would never raise the people against the established order of things.. They knew that the most torraidable rebel lions were the rebellions or the belly.—( Hear, hear.) He (Mr. M.) firmly believed that it was not by chance but by deliberation, and with . a serious purpose, • that those parties wished to have the Corn-laws part of our in stitutions, in order that some day or another those Corn-laws might be the death of our institutions.—( Loud cries of " Hear, heir.") He believed that they wished this abuse to remain part of our laws, in order that some day or another-_that day he prayed they might never see--this abuse and our laws might perish together.—( Cheers.) There was also another circumstance connected with the question, to which he wished to refer. The Hon. and Learned Member for Bradford had warned them not to draw any parallel from France and the French Revolution. The Hon. and Learned Member would ex cuse him if he alluded to the subject in a manner of which he could not complain. If they observed the history of the French Revolution, the first thing that would strike them was, that that revolution was not merely brought about by the lower classes. It was not a mere movement of the Faubourg St. Antoine. If the labouring classes, had not, in the first in stance, and great part of the higher and aristocratic classes at their head, they could have dune nothing. But the feuds en gendered by all sorts of vexatious distinctions between the landed aristocracy on the one hand, and the monied and commercial class's on the other, were these which enabled the first end, of the wedge to enter. Whi e a whole empire like this was united, he could not fear the result of any insurrection ; but he could not but feel uneasy when he saw all those topics which, in other countries, and ages, had been confined to the lowest disturbers, now being .agitated by men worth twenty thousand a year—(Cheers)—it was im possible for him not to fear, when he heard the manufacturers crying out that the landlords were grinding the faces of the poor, and, on the other hand, men of great landed property denouncing the manufacturers as they had been denounced in that House, ever since the present debate had commenced.— ( Oh, and No, no.) lie would venture to say that no expres sion could he more unjustifiable as used by a manufacturer against the landholders than what Hon. Members had heard in the course of the present discussion, coming from the mouth of the Hon. Member for Knaresborough against the manu facturing body.—( Cheers, and No, no.) He (Mr. Al.) was quite willing that the truth of this assertion should he left to the judgment of all those who heard and read that attack.—(Cheers.) Now, therefore, we had arrived at a most serious stage in the interests of this country. He did not ap prehend the dangerous issue that he feared would occur to •meerow, or next year, or five years hence ; but he would say that it was impossible that this country could safely -follow up a system which they saw had the effect of arousing ,and pro voking the violent passions of multitudes, while at the same time it promoted division, rivalry, and animosity amongst the two great classes of proprietors in the country. Therefore it was of the greatest importance that this question should be satisfactorily settled. Yet that which was proposed as satis factory was not even contended to be so en the ether side.— (Cheers.) Even the Right Hon. Baronet, the Secretary for the Home Department abjured all notions of finality. —(Hear, hear.) The Honourable Gentleman now laid it down as a wise system .that we shoul•I legislate gradually, and in bit by bit reforms... The present measure he would take as an instalment; but -if it were to be received as • an instalment, he (Mr. Macaulay) should-consider it as an instalment of little more than a farthing in the pound.— (Laughter and cheers.) But was it. to be understood, now that we were to have a Bill of this kind introducetlas often as the Members of that House were summoned to assemble thither, Were we doomed every year, or • every three years, to renew discussions of this sort? Was it to be expected, that the first Minister of the Crown would- again settle and again unfix this great question ? The more he (Mr . . Macaulay) thought on the Right Honourable Baronet's Bill, the less he (Mr. Ma caulay) confessed himself able to understand why . the Right lion. Gentleman introduced it--(" Hear, " and cheers.) He did not introduce it to please those who cried out for a change in the .Corn-laws,' for it was clear that they were not satisfied —( Hear, hear.) It was equally clear that he could not have introduced it to please his own supporters, for, though they would vote for him. and carry his Bill though, there could be no doubt that nine-tenths of them would vote for him with much greater pleasure if he refused all change.— (Cheers, and cries of " No, no.") On this point he (Mr. Ma caulay) was content to defer to fhe judgment of those who ob served the silence of some gentleratm opposite, and in the House— something very different from silence elsewhere. (Cheers and laughter.) The Right Honourable Baronet himself had avowed that he • knew he could •not please bath parties, and he complained of the peculiarities and difficulties of his position. Now he (Mr. Macaulay) could understand that an enlightened statesman might risk the displeasure of each party, while supported by the consciousness that -he was introducing a measure that would relieve and prevent •the distresses of the country. But did the Right Hon. Baronet say this of his own measure ? Why, he told us that he could hold out no hope of reli e f t o th e distress that pre vailed.—(Cries of " Hear, h ear .") D i d he then bring in his Bill to settle the question? Why, finality was disdained to Why, then, did the Right Hon. Baronet introduce his measure? Wh y , h e • sa id h e introduced on his own benches. prevent frauds in taking the averages, of the existence of which frauds he was riot sure, and which he acknowledged must have been much exaggerated.—=( Hear, hear.) He also in troduced it to fix the price of wheat between 545. and 58s. a q give n o reason s, except ex c e c di o se y vagueuarter. one sßuindeed, t uit o l sli ow why he was convinced that its plan would have this effect.. Vague ! why to he sure it must be vague for any wise statesman to determine what the price shall be—(Cheers)—and that is the reason that all wise states men have agreed to leave the price to be settled between the buyer and seller.—(Loud cheers.) There was a measure— he took the Right lion. Baronet's own statement— which settled nothing, which pleased nobody, which nobody asked for, which nobody wonld thank him for, which would not extend trade, which would not relieve distress, and which offered provisions at a price of which the Right Hon. Baronet did not profess to know anything, and for which he could give no reason.—(Loud cheers.) tin arinciplc he op. posed the Bill of the :light Hon. Baronet, and e on principle he approved of that of the lion. Member for Wolverhampton.— (Loud cheers, answered by ironical cheers from the Ministe rial benches.) In the first place, he understood the Hon. Member for Wolverhampton was opposed to protection alto gether, and therefore opposed -a fixed duty ; hut he (Mr. Ma caulay) desired to be understood as advocating a fixed duty, 'on the ground of • protestims 'alone. , There were two reasons for imposing a duty, for .tbe purpose of protection. in One of which be . entirely,concurrecly and there. was only ono word in the motion of the Hon: Member for Woli , erhampton with which he could not entirely agree—that was the word " now."—(Hear hear.) He did not think it had been proved satisfactorily to him that the price of corn in England was in creased by the burthens which peculiarly affected agriculture ; but, he considered the English farmer entitled to. protection to the extent of those burthens, reserving to himself, at the same be unanswerable.—(Hear. ) time, the opinion that it would be much more expedient to take into consideration a new distribution of them, than that 3 Ystenit e--( Cheers. ) The ca pital_fro e ne one employment to another. other'viich seemede g x t, r ) s . dui him (Mr. for under :Ni n t a h o c t e a removinguplraeyntto protection altogether, tho th ag o h ugt h ht ff d th iff e e y re w d ou fr l o d r ebe t h s e at r is e n so e l d ut i i f on a had e i s declared tne e of thattttime , e the wa s p g e i o v p e l e n 1-le was not disposed to take all protection from the Eng he lish 1 i s tp,l e -ef es e lea m iroo e , fnr hear.) transferring e a Aa n ir and mi h b e eS t r h ,ht u e g d h t t d thatno differ i t m e e r should from hime inpallowedprinciple.— (Cheers.) p o r l e t . were desirous of having an immediate repeal of the Corn-laws; . but he (Mr. Macaulay) certainty of repeal, at a certain (Cheers.) He (Mr. might them. As the motion stood, it be thought to be brought forward in a fit of despair ;. by . men who, knowing they should get nothing, were determ'ned to ask much more than they could expect.—( Hear, hear.) He understood that the Hon. n had Member for Wolverhamp to exp ress o resolution, et of the uest' ' that if he saw any prosPe • i on being brought to a settlement on what he thought sound principles, the word " should not stand in the way of such a settlement. But Villiers) while the word " now " stood part of the proposition, while it , remained such as it was, be could not give his vote for it. With regard to a fixed duty, a, l a perman en t measure, he con sidered it in no other light t tau ise a mitigation or a compro and as a compromise, mime. As a mitigation, I t nlise, he was ready to support it, as a measure brought indistinctly for the purpose of giving, relief to the Peopleu t • he could not consider that a settlement of the question whichleft a distinct protecting duty, not intended for the purpose of are venue, anti any su pp or t h e might give to such a meas u r e world only b e suc h a support a , he apprehended every person in that House had repeatedly given to measures which they thought imperfect, because, though imperfect, they a l s o considered them decided improve inents.—( Hoer, hear, . tic: He felt exceedingly indebted to the House for the petienee with which it had listened to him on a question on which he had never before addressed it, but he considered that his vote on the question might have otherwise been misunderstood. H i s objection applied to the word " now," it and on this ground he h a d thought necessary to give the House the present explenation.—(Cheers. ) Mr. STUART WORTLEY ;said he should take the present opportunity of declaring his opposition to the proposal of the' Member for Wolverhampton. He rose with some reluctance to speak on a question that had been so thoroughly debated by the House that it would he impossible for him, and • difficult for many who were better qualified than him, to add anythingnew, either of fact or arg innent,4 o thejUbject the'House had to de bate. If there was orte.,re4SPP :why he had taken- the liberty of addressing them, if *as the spei l rb Of the' Right` Hari. Member for Edinburgh, became he muss: say that • of all the speeches he ever heard, he had never listened to one that so little an swered the purpose its author intended, as one half of It.com bated phantoms of his own raising, and the other half was formed of arguments totally .incorsistent with the course he . had adopted. He had charged the Right Honour able Baronet with maintaining in. general, abstract terms, that cheap food was no blessing to the people. The Right Hon. Baronet never made use of any such expression—he never laid down any such maxim.--( Hear, hear..) There was no doubt that if the question were Asked, whether cheap ness of food was.a blessing to the population of the country, there could be no other answer, than that, ar, a matter of course, it would be of the utmost importance ; but notwith-• standing the truth of that maxim, it was very. questionable whether the condition of the poorer classes of the country . would be improved because food was made cheaper. The whole, of the argumenti of the Right. Hon. - dentleMan opposite (Mr. Macaulay)depended upon the fact, whether the population hall the means of maintaining itself, and could, if provisions were cheaper, enjoy a large r p ort i on of the necessaries of life. He.taiked of that as if the sole question to 'be consi dered was whether, if provisions were cheaper; the demands for labour would be such as would enable the labouring classes to' obtain sufficient employment. If those commodities, which constitute the necessaries of life, were cheaper, no doubt they would be brought within the reach of the population, who could procure the means of purchasing them; but it did not follow that they should he brought within the reach of the population generally, unless there was employment given to them. He (Mr. W.) was prepared to contend, and he believ e d if to be tr ue , that if the price of food was reduced, the benefit's would not go into the pockets of the poor, but the advantages would be conferred upon a totally different class of persons. There was much more It bJur in this country than the demand required. Wages were depressed, and the conseqUence was, that if the price of •corn was reduced much lower than it was now, the poorer classes of the people would not obtain any advantages from that rednetion.L( Hear, hear. ) The feeling or ,the manufacturing labourer at the present moment he believed to be this—he felt a strong conviction that there were other questions affecting interests, and moral and social condition, more bearing upon his and more deserving of his anxiety and attention. It was to these he looked. Mr. C. HULLER.—What are they? Mr. S. WORTLEY.—The Hon. Member asked what they were, he would tell him. The regulation of labour—that which . sffected every act of their lives, and which pressed di rectly or indirectly upon their social existence. The atten tion of the manufacturing labourers was directed to these ques tions as more important to their interests than the question of the Corn-lairs. lie did not mean to say that the question of the Corn-lases was not a most impnrtaat one. He admitted its importance, but he did not think it excited so much inte rest among the manufacturing labourers as had been represented. —( Hear, hear.) -If it could he shown that, by reducing the price' of corn, they would give to the people a greater mass of the necessaries of life; if he could be convinced that it was for the advantage of the great mass pf the labouring population, that the importation of foreign corn 14iould be perinitted nithout restriction, he would not be found to oppose it. He admitted that the first concern of a Legislature, wits the happiness, welfare, and improvement of the condition of the great mass of the population ; and if it could be proved to him that that happiness might be' secured by the course recommended by the other side of the House, he should be , unwilling to place himself in opposition to it. It had frequently been asserted that the price of food had no connection with the rate of wages. He denied that proposi ,tion and could quote high authorities in support of his opinion : 'Adam Smith, the father of the science of Political Economy, said " the money price of labour is regulated by two. circum stances ; the demand for labour; and 'the price of' the netes series of life:" - This' opinion' of Adam Smith was confirmed by Mr. M'Culloch, and Mr. Ricardo had, in treating of wages, said" we must hot forget that wages are alio regulated by the prices of commodities." Mr. Iluskisson who had been fre quently quoted as an authority by Hon. Members opposite, had said that if they reduced the price of food in the mariner proposed, he held it by no means clear that wages would not fall in a still more rapid manner. (The Hon. Gentlaman then read an extract from Mr. M'Cul loch's Dictionary of Commerce in proof of h:s argument It was to the effect—that, in 1814, the price of wheat was 745. per quarter ; and, in 11515, it had fallen to 64e. ; and, in con 'sequence of the tall, the price of wheat not indemnifying the occupier of poor lands, those lands became gradually out of tillage.) He said, therefore, that he was justified in concluding that the price of food and wages had a relation to each other. The competition amongst the labourers themselves, and the competition amongst the masters, in respect of the employed alone, would prevent the working classes being benefited by any reduction in the price of food. That this was the case among those who were practically conversant with the subject he thought there could be no doubt whatever. It was not very long , since,they hadheard the evidence of aperson of that (lasi of whom they were then speaking, and who expressed the opinion of a great number of his companions upon this question. The man's name , was Brighton, and he was examined before a Committee of ' Inquiry of that House. He said " some people will say that if our provisions were cheaper we should be better off, but our masters would take advantage of these rates, and reduce the Weavers a penny upon each quantity of work, whieh'woull amount to about 2s. or 2s 6d a week." He proved by this that the working people held the same opinion as that expressed by, 51r. Huskissan, that a reduction in the price of food would not, put the labourer in a much better position than at present.% Now when they talked of repealing the Corn-laws, he thought there were full and sufficient grounds for decidedly opposing that measure. His ,opposition and objection to this measure was founded simply upon this reason, that he was not prepared to ask for relief of one portion of the population, and that the minority, by almost certain ruin to the other class.—( Cheers.) Because, whatever Hon. Gentlemen might say, there could be no question of this fact - being proved beyond the possibility of a doubt, that, taking the two classes which inhabit the empire, those who were engaged in manufactures and those employet, in agriculture, that the latter class and the fortner compared with the numbers, would .show a great ma. ority of ,the agriculturists.—(Hear.) Be thought he should be within the mark, when he stated what had been alleged during the course of the debate, that themanufacturing . popue lation taken altogether, was as one to two compared with the agriculturists. When they took these classes together, and they were asked to adopt a measure for the purpose of relief, and this a doubtful relief to the smaller body, but which in volved ruin to the other, he thought it was best to hold from such' a proposition. Gentlemen opposite told them that the English farmer would not suffer. In the first place they told them that the importation of foreign corn would not be such as to reduce the price of corn in this country. It did not seem to him to be necessary • to occupy the time of the House in entering into that question.--( Hear,. hear.) It, was in the power of the foreigner to transport corn to this country at 35e. to 405., and if they had noisome protection the foreigner "would be able to introduce corn into the country to the prejudice of the farmer, and so far the farmer would ' be injured. But Hon. Gentlemen turned round and said,,aupposingit were ro, he need only turn his capital to other sources of indistry arid culti vate grass land, and he would make as much profit as be formerly did. In .the first place, did those Hon. Gentlemin recollect the circumstance that all those lands .which were fimt abandoned from cultivation, were those least capable and the worst of quality ? Thereforelt was no answer whatever to tell him that he would do well by turning his land under cultivatiOn into pasture or grazing land. But there was another circum stance attending this to which he would call the attention Pf Hon. Gentlemen. They m ust look to the population supporto by the cultivated land. Ile (Mr. S. Wortley) had seen some thing of this, and he had no d ou b t he was within the mark when he said that the population supported by the labour ,in grazing land was not above, one-half that supported by the other branches of agriculture. This land was, therefote, thrown out of cultivation, and the labourers were necessarily thrown upon other resources. This, then, it was that matte the argument inefficacious, which was brought forward, that tha farmer • could turn his capital to another channel, He would not detain them longer, as it was not his wish to occupy an unreasonable portion of the time of the House. The question had been so elaborately debated upon, that there was scarcely anything new to be add e d. H is reason for opposing the proposal of the Hon. Member for Wolver hampton was, that he felt that it would not be advantageous to the whole community that the Corn-laws should be repealed. He thought, it was fair there should be such a reduction made as the nature of the case called for. He wished for relaxation of the law, but hr was not prepared to risk all the consequences of an entire repeal of the Corn-laws. With respect to the proposal 'of the Right Hon. Bart. at the head of her Majesty's Government, he believed it would be viewed by the people of this country as a measure of reasonable relaxation, and calcu la•ed as much to benefit one side as the other. Mr. MITCHELL said that a fixed duty was preferable to a sliding scale. He had taken the opportunity of consulting his friends in the City, both Whig and Tory ; and he found that ail, from the highest to the lowest, although many of them considered the measure of the Right lion. Bart. did not go tar enough, yet the principal part of them considered that the measure was a great and valuable improvement on the late sliding scale.—( Loud cheers from the Ministerial benches. ) Some three years ago, considering that the prices were low, he had himself speculated in corn.—(Laughter.) However, they condemned the present system, he condemned the former one more. So far he believed that it was a block to trade, and prevented fair speculation.—( Laughter from the Ministerial benches.) He had purchased wheat at 30s. a quarter, and he might have purchased 20,000 quarters at the same price ; now, calculating the charges from the continental port of freight, sound dues, commission, &c., altogether they would not exceed 7s. a quarter —he knew that the average price of Hritish wheat was 561. a quarter, and which was the average stated by the Right Hon. Baronet in his speech ; now, adding this 7s. to 305.., the original price of the wheat would be 375., the duty when the price Was 375. in this country would he liis., and that brought the price of the article up to 535. Now, as the average price of wheat was .565., this would give him a profit of 2s. or 3s. a quarter. The average price of wheat in London was generally a shilling or two higher than other parts of the kingdom ; therel,re, the average price in London would be 575. or 583. Now, according to the pro posed measure, he had a fair prospect of from 4s. to ss. a quarter, by importing wheat from the Continent when the price was at Nis. in this country. Now, under the old sliding; scale of duties, he found that the duty at 695. and 70s. would be 13s. Bd. Now, when the average price of wheat was at 693. the duty was never paid, because those who held wheat would keep it back until the price was up to 7 Is., 725., or 735. a quarter. The only time when a duty higher than 6s. Bd. is paid is when the price has been up to 735., and when the price is going down, cargoes of wheat came over, and the parties are anxious to pay the duty before it rises to 20s. The only time that lOs. Bd. or I:3s. r_sd. duty has been paid, has been when large quantities have been imported at one shilling duty. Now the effect of the alteration as proposed by the Right lion. Baronet will be this, that upon an average crop in this country, and when the average price of wheat is 565., wheat will be ordered from the foreign market with a view to its bring brought over as a legitimate subject of speculation, and expecting a profit of 3s. or 4s. a quarter, that speculation not being founded upon the prospect of a sufficient harvest, but upon the certainty of a fair mercantile profit arising out of it. lie therefore was of opinion, that the alteration of the duty will have the effect of causing an importation of foreign wheat in this country when the average price was 565. or 575. and he was also of opinion that it would prevent persons hold ing back corn till the price was at 70s. or 7 Is. He there fore considered that there was a productive and a real and beau fide improvement in the whole scale, by which the duty might. be expected seldom to exceed 14s. or lbs. Now he considered that a great improvement upon the whole scale. Honourable Gentlemen might ask whether it was equal to a fixed duty ? He said candidly he did not consider it was; but although he did not think so, yet he considered it to 'be his duty, sitting there as a Member of the House of Commons, and one sent there to do the best he could for his constituents, to take this measure when there was no chance of getting_ any better—( Cheers) —not onl y in that House but in the other House of Parliament. Having nu prospect, then, of a better measure, he thought it his duty not to reject the measure of the Right lion. Baronet merely because he was of opinion that another measure might be brought forward. lie did not consider it ,his duty to reject the measure of the Right lion. Baronet on that ground. A great many Hon. Gentlemen might think he was , ct ing contrary to party in this declaration; because a fixed duty was proposed by one p art y a nd a scale by another, he did not feel himself called upon to.vete for a fixed duty whenhe saw no prospect of its being carried, and therefore h • was wil ling to aeept of the present instalment. (Cheers from the Ministerial Benches.) He did not expect the mea sure would be a final settlement. Certainly not.—( Hear and cheers from the Opposition.) Ho was of quite a contrary opinion. Yet, at the sarne time, he considered that the Right Hon. Baronet opposite had brought forth the most Liberal measure that he himself th oug ht h e could carry, and as s uch he (Mr. Mitchell) accepted it.---( Cheers from the Minis. terial benches.) He would say more, he was grateful to him, for, su far as he could judge for the sentiments of his constitu ents, and of the great body of merchants whom he represent ed, they were of opinion that the - measure was a great im pr4veinent, and ought to be accepted and tried for a 'short fluke, to see whether its working would not produce a steady trade in corn. He was of opinion that it would.—(Loud cheers from the Ministerial side of the House.) He had not yet alluded to the article of oats, and he thought with respect to; that produce, the present measure was an exceeding liberal . one. At this moment he had oats weighing 421bs. to the btishel : the price in Denmark for these oats was Bs. a quarter. arid the charges from Denmark independent of the duty would not exceed 65., thus bringing the price up to 14s. Now, atOs , the duty was 65., and thus they could bring oats into this country, paying a duty of 6s. when the price was at 20s. NOW, tinder the old scale, 20s. was almost prohibitory, and, therefore, there was a great improvement, and not only was it a treat improvement, but it acted as a check upon the home market. On all these ground s , cons id er i ng the measure to be one of great reform In the old scale, he did not feel it to be his duty to refuse so valuable an improvement as that proposed by the. Right Hon. Baronet, on the ground that an abstract re snlution had been proposed in the principle of which he agreed, but which he felt assured there was no chance of carrying.— (,Lourl cheers from the Ministerial benches. ) Mr. C. BULLER said, the Honourable Gentleman who had just addressed the House, seemed to differ much in the scram, rats he entertained now, and those he entertained when he addressed the electors of Bridport, in June last. He called upon them then to sink all miner differences, in the great cause of free trade, when he said the question was, whether the people should suffer by the monopolists, whom he designated as living upon the fat of the land. ye was proceeding—and he, (Mr. Buller) was delighted to perceive that those by whom the Right Hon. Baronet was oc casionally supported, supported him (Mr. Mitchell)—to prove to the. Right Hon. Baronet that it was a benefit to the country that wheat 'could be brought from Denmark at 285., and oats at 20s. There was only one other speech made that night , upon which he felt inclined to remark, and upon only one pas sege in that speech. He was very glad that a remark of his elicited from the Hon. Gentleman, tho Member for the West of Yorkshire, an explanation of what he thought was a fair subject for agitating the minds of the people, and what he thought was a fair subject of the people's wishes. They should all admit that the pi ice of food was naturally ona of the everyday considerations of the people of England, but although the people were agitated upon that question, it seemed to him to be one of the greatest advantages that could se, that there should be honest and enlightened Members who should tell their constituents ashen they were actuated by delu tions, that those delusions were mischievous and utterly useless. He appealed to Hon. Members to say, whether it was not the duty of intelligent Members of that House to disabuse the minds of their constituents upon these subjects? He (Mr. Buller) had taken no part in debates upon this question before ; he knew the collision of interests which wou ld p e r va d e he country when it came to be discussed; but he was always of opinion that whenever it came to be settled—whenever the circumstances of the country were such as to require a settle tment of it—when the people came to demand an alteration of those laws which prevented the introduction of corn into this country, the question would be speedily settled. The one great : argument which excited the feelings and biassed the judgment or the people against the Corn-laws was their manifest injus • the. If there was nothing else—no other consideration but that, it rendered the immediate settlement of them most essen itial. Hon. Gentlemen on the other side did not avow ',that they were personally interested in a settlement of ,-the question—they • stated that it was not for them -selves they cared a bit, but they were anxious for the :prOsperity of the farmers, and were not indifferent to the manufacturers, who were the parties principally interested in this measure. Consistent with common sense, it was im , pet ative upon the Legislature to enact a measure with respect to the introduction of corn into this country, and it was equally imperative upon them to remove the fatal mistrust which ex isted with reference to the present law. Even if those laws were not so objectionable, it would be wise to remove those causes which had the effect of rendering their legislation so much an object of . suspicion.—( Hear, hear.) It is an in variable rule that when the people of any country believe that laws are founded on unjust principles, that they always ex aggerate the evils which result from them—they are slow to sit down under the notion that those laws might have been originally founded in justice if they cannot impute the evils from which they suffer to aoy other cause. When complaints are • made that . the people attribute more evils to the existence of the Corn-laws than are due to them, it would be wise to consider them and to remove those causes. The Right. Hon. Baronet opposite had stated that the present dis tress of the people of this country was not owing to the opera tion of the Corn-laws, but that it was caused by over-production. Sir R. PEEL—It very much leads to it. Mr. BULLER—The Right Hon. Baronet states that the present distress is the reaction consequent upon over-production and increase of machinery ; what consolation did that give the Right Hon. Baronet, what advantages were there from that, except the employment of capital? but no proportionate advan tage accrued to the people. Last year he called the attention of the House to the increase of population, and the decrease of their means of employment. Between 1825 and 1831 more than two millions of people were added to the population of this country, and during that interval of time there was a po sitive diminution in the number of families employed in agri culture. He would ask the House to consider what the effect of that was upon the country. According to the last returns the population was increased 4,500,000, and although they were not regularly classified, as far as could be judged from other circumstances it might be fairly inferred that the entire of that increased population found its support in manufactures, Led not in agriculture.--( Hear, hear.) 4,500,000 were added to the population of this country since 1821 and it did not appear that agriculture gave them any increased employment, but that than whole means of subsistence had been found in trade and manufactures alone. It was his (Mr. Buller's) firm belief, whe ther the present distress was attributable to the Corn-laws or not, that it was quite obvious the duty of Parliament was to search for some effectual means to relieve that distress, or at all events to secure for the people some permanent means of employment. If agri culture gave no increased employment, but manufactures did, it was the duty of Parliament to do all they could to facilitate the employment of the people,. and enable them to ac q u i re th e necessaries of life.. If the town was made too large for the country, and the country could not feed the town, what was the .clear policy of a Government but to remove the restrictions under which the town. was in getting food,? They should be allowed, at all events, to obtain food for themselves, and if they could not get it from their own country, the people should not be prevented from getting it where they could at a reasonable price. He did say w ithout hesitation that the present Corn-laws, or any laws like them, which prevented the people from getting the necessaries of litc at a fair reasonable price, and did not facili tate their employment, if they did not directly take the bread out of the people's mouths, effectually prevented the people from getting it.—( Hear, hear.) Notwithstanding what he (Mr. Buller) then said, he felt himself constrained to express a very great discrepancy of opinion between him arid his Hon. Friend the Member for Wolverhampton. He would wish to say one word with reference to the vote which he would be obliged to give that night ou the m o ti on o f hi s H on. Friend (Mr. Villiers). He should say, in the first instance, that he could not assent at all to a motion that all duty upon corn should cease.—(Cheers and Hear, hear, from the Ministerial benches.) He (Mr. Buller) would explain to the House, in a very few words, the grounds upon which he had come to that honest opinien.—(Laughter and cheers.) In altering the Corn-laws there ought to be a fixed duty,. and a due regard should at all times be observed for vested interests. Nothing could be more fatal than the notion that vested interests should be interfered with ; be the laws bad, mischievous ;or even founded on injustice, still when interests haelgro u up and had been recognised by the Constitu tion, nothing could be more fatal or prejudicial than to interfere with these interests rashly or precipitately.—(Hear, he a r.) It was stated that this question was decidedly a landlords'question, He believed it was—( Hear, hear)—and that the effect of the Right Hon. Baronet's measure would be to r a i se th e land lords' rent and cheapen food by artificial means. The Go vernment should look at the immense body of farmers and agri cultural labourer:, whose condition required improvement— ( Hear, hear.) The laws might be aitered, but if they were they should be so altered as to abolish all unjust restrictions, and allay those alarms which every class of the emir msnity must naturally feel.—(Hear, hear, hear.) There was as great a difference between these two principles as it was possible could exist. The plan proposed by the Right Hou. Baronet was one unheard of in the history of taxation. He had heard of prohibitory laws, and of protection, but laws so totally , prohibitory as these, and protection so exclusive as this, had never before came under his notice. The English Corn-law stood forth alone as the only instance of an attempt on the part of the Legislature to regulate by laws the imperta ‘tion of any rartieular article.--( An Hon. Member on the Ministerial benches—" The French law.") What was the French law but an imitation of ours? It was nothing more, and it was one universally condemned. Whatever the price of corn, might he, by this sliding scale, it was quite evident that the consumer could not procure it at a reasonable price. There was a great difference between this system and the fixed duty. We say that in consideration of certain in terests to be preserved we will give you a fixed protection to your corn. He would ask on what principle the Right Hon. Bart. could justify the sliding scale because of the peculiar burdens on 1 and. The burdens on land were fixed, and if corn were low, taxes did not get higher; indeed, the contrary was the fact, for when corn was low, the taxes became lower too. Gentlemen oppo site, then, did away with the whole of their arguments for the justice of the duty on corn, if they applied it in the shape of a sliding scale. The sliding scale raised the price of corn much higher than was necessary, and than they who advocated it imagined. At 68s. the duty was 16s. Bd, which left 525. 2d. price, and he (Mr. Buller) believed that no return had been made of corn: coming in at a less price than 525. The effect of this scale would be in the working, but the speculator in corn would always keep back the price of corn for the lowest duty— formerly for the Is. duty, and now for the lower duties. Sup pose, for, example, that the price of corn here was 625., if the price rose Is. the speculator got 25., so that there was always a prospect of large gain for holding the stock back. It was not the same as in Other' duties, where he could get the rise of price only, for in this instance they would get that and the duty too. Sir R. PEEL.—Suppose it should fall? Mr. C. BULLER- fhe Right Hon. Baronet said, suppose it should fall.? The effect of the sliding scale was to make the price higher than it need be. Suppose, however, that the price should fall, there was no injury to the agriculturist They did not give the consumer the advantage of a fixed price but threw in parcels of foreign corn without giving any cheap i price, and ao t did no good to the consumer. He (Mr. Bul ler) did not contend that we should have corn Is. a quarter lower now and then, but . that we should have it at as low a price as the variations of the season would admit. There was only one other argument of the supporters of this Bill to which he would now advert. The Right Hon. Baronet said that we said our fixed duty would settle the question, but such was not the case, for the moment we get the fixed duty agitation would be started for the total repeal. It did not depend, however, on what was said in that House 'or what was said out of RI; it all de pended on thernariner in which the question was settled, and if once the fixed duty were established there would be no mis chief whatever to be apprehended in that way. The advantage of the fixed duty was, that whether the price was high or low there could be no exaggeration as to it—if the fixed duty were ss. the price of corn would be augmented ss. ; if the duty were Bs. the price would be increased Bs., and so on. That would be the effect of the fixed duty, and he (Mr. Buller) would defy human imagination to impute anything elk(' to it. He (Mr. Buller) would not pretend to say that no good would result from the measure of the Right Hon. Baronet. He admitted that it would do some good, and that it would somewhat lower the price of corn. All he (Mr. Buller) had to say was that it did not du enough to satisfy the people, it did not remove 'the real evil, it did not create a steady de mand for corn from foreign countries, neither would it ensure a steady supply from foreign countries, nor secure a moderate price. I be Right Honourable Baronet said that the usual price of corn under his sliding scale would be from 545. to 58s. per quarter. He (Mr. Buller) did not think that it 'would give us corn lower than from 60s. to . -665. He believed it would do little goad; it would not re assure the manufacturers, nor would it place commerce upon a sure foundation in this country. He should say no snore on this questioW; but as he should give his vote against those gentle men with whom he had so often voted, he thought it right that he should say what was his ground for doing so, and that he should state his opinion - of the general impolicy of the Corn laws, more especially under the sliding stale.—(Hear. ) Mr.f J. B. HOPE spoke at considerable length, but in so low a tone of voice as to be wholly inaudibl e i n t h e ga ll ery . We understood him to say, that if the Corn-laws were repealed, agriculture would be ruined, and England would become a manufacturing country, depending altogether for support urea . E of re o gr th e e t r te c d ou t n h t a r t i e h s e . ;he m s t o!) i l e c s could not approve of the motion of the Honoorable Member for Woverham ton and at p ,long as he had a seat in that House, he woul d give effect to his opinions by his vote.—(Hear, hear.) He approvedthe the principle of free trade, but it could not, he thought, be applied in this country, consistently with justice, or with the general interests of the community to the question of the Corn-daws.—( Hear, hear.) He would not imitate the example of the Gal:ant Commodore the Member for Martle bone, who, while he expressed his approval of ail Bs. duty:an nounced his intention of voting for the motion then before the House. He deeply regretted that the proposal of the late Go vernment had not been adopted last year. That proposal would have led to a settlement of the question, unlike the measure introduced by thepresent Government, which pleased no party —( Hear, hear.) It was objected to a fixed duty, that it could not be maintained in time of severity ; but he be lieved that a severity could not arise under such a duty. H e would repeat, however, that he could not approve of b. motion so sudden and so violent as that which the Hon. :Member for Wolverhampton had brought before the House. Mr. MONCKTON MILNES could not help calling the attention of the House to the pathetic situation of his Hon. Friend the Member for Wolverhampton, who was 1, ft alone that evening its his advocacy of .a total repeal. Some of his friends, timidly and with qualifications, supported his motion— sonic announced their intention of voting against him, and others announced their intention of not voting at all.—( Hear, hear.) He believed his Hnn. Friend had not acted prudently in bringing forward his motion in its present shape, so that he could get so few to speak and hardly any one to vote in its fa vour. The whole discussion appeared to him (Mr. Milnes) to be a vain and fruitless scinmachy.—( Hear, hear, and laughter. ) Ile contended that the opponents of the motion were con tending with a mere shadow. But he would proceed to answer the objections which had been brought against the Government scheme. Be would first refer to the speech of his Hon. Friend the Member for Liskeard; and he did believe _it would not beast all difficult to show how totally inconsistent were the arguments efune part of that speech with those of another. His lion. and Learned Friend said that the people considered any legislation upon the Corn-laws ipso facto un just ; and that therefore they were right in agitating against it. Hon. Members opposite could no doubt excite the people on this question by appealing to their passions and also their appe tites.—(Latighter.) But having done so, did they think that they could prevail on them to stop at an Ss. duty? It was disheartening- to see the religious agitation that had been en flamed on this subject; yet he had the consolation to know that scarcely one clergyman of the Established Church had ' degraded himself by taking part in Hear, hear. ) He believed that of that body three only sat in the late Conference, while scarce' a single clergyman of the Wes myan body joined the agitation, of which the Hon. Member for Liskeard confessed the of ject was to promote confusion .n the interests of the country. But the people of Eng- Isnd, inspired by CJMITIOII sense, would see through the delu sion that had been attempted on them, supported, though those were by assertions that cheapness of food was the greatest blessing that a community could have. We should reflect that the landlords had the protection given to them under the law, and by a right as strung as the landed pr o p er ty itself was held—only the law which guaranteed that protection was declared unjust. ; then you might also as properly declare the law Width regulated the property of every- Hon. Member opposite unjust. The Honourable Member for Wolverhamp ton had spoken of class legislation in a very absurd manner. Why, what class could le g i s l a t e on thi s su bj ect un l ess an inter ested one?— ( Laughter,and Hear. ) Were not the manufacturers interested in the present question ? Every representative bode must contain interested persons. He (Mr. Manes) con. tended that protection of the landed interest was quite con sistent with the welfare of the manufacturers. The opponents of the Corn-laws had undertaken to prove the reverse, but they had failed. Now, he asserted that the Corn-law repeal was agitated for the sake of effecting a a reduction of wages. If the manufacturers were honest they must admit that they could not compete with foreign manufacturers, unless bs a re duction of the wages of our operatives. It was quite ' absurd for Honourable Gentlemen opposite to in sist that a repeal of the Cotn-laws would greatly 'increase the foreign demand for our manufactures. Now it was well known that the great corn-growing countries would not take our manufactures, because they did not want them. The banks of the large central rivers of Europe, on which the great fields of corn were cultivated to which we looked, were inhabited by a rude and scanty population, who were able to provide for all their own wants, and were quite ignorant of the' necessities of our highly civilised condition. In the north and east of Germany, where the corn-growing countries lays the Prussian League had failed in its operation, for thous parts would not take the manufactures of the other parts ; and if the League had failed in effecting an interchange be tween its agricultural and manufacturing constituents, how could we expect that those people would buy our manufactures who had refused to buy their own ?—(Hear, hear.) They might do so some time hereafter, but it was a cruel absurdity to say that they would do so immediately, and so relieve the distresuof our artisans. In talking of the boundless fertility of the filains of America, the Hon. Member for Kilmarnock 'had mingled poetry with statistics. God forbid that the ex change of the corn of these vast fields, extende-t even into the primeval forests, for our manufactures, should not hereafter take place, but no law that we could now pass could effect this, so as to be as immediate relief for our dis'ress, and fill our land with abundance. But if the present agitation were conti nued he would not say that there might not be brought about an absolute necessity for the repeal of the Corn-laws.—(Cheers.) This would be no proof that the agitators were right, or that a repeal of the Corn-laws would be of any benefit to the people. No necessity existed now for that repeal—if the necessity existed they need not be there to talk about it, for it would demonstrate itself with force irresistible. The violence he apprehended might be aroused, he could not deny ; but did those who had the power of exciting this awful force calcu late the.. consequences ? Did they not think that if the landholder were destroyed the fundholdcr could not be allowed to remain where he was ? (Hear, hear, hear.) The fundhulder was protected by the same law that protected the landowner, who was thus enabled to pay the former the money he lent the country in the crisis of 1813 and 1814. If a robbery, then, were com mitted on the landowners by a repeal of the Corn-laws, the landowners would sink, but if they sank, the fundholderS must sink with them.—( Hear, hear, and Divide.) He had 'but a few words to say of the . proposition of the flight Honourable Baronet. Public opinion 'bad already changed in its favour. They who at first could sec nothing in the scale, now saw a great deal in it. —( Cheers and laughter. J The Hon. Member for Bridport said, that the practical men of the City approved of it ; the Hon. Member for Dover said also that it was much superior to the present scale ; nor should the public condemn until they had well considered all circumstances connected with it, and particularly whether the Right Hon. Baronet had the power to carry a larger and a mere liberal measure.—(Laughter anti cheers.) The Right Hon. Baronet might have proposed a measure that would have excited greater applause, or have l rovoked 'a more vigorous resistance ; but his intention was to please the few moderate men of each party, and this he had done. For his (Mr. 31.'s) part he would admit that a more liberal scale would have pleased him better.-- (Cheers.) He did not think the Right Hon. Baronet would secure the country against an oscillation of prices; but it would be impertinent in him (Mr. M.) to state his opinion against that of the Right Hon. Baronet.—(Laugh ter and Hear, hear.) So he would leave him to take care of his'own reputation.—( Laughter.) But really the manner in which this poor Corn-law was abused and badgered about, was most amusing to young Members. The Noble Lord, the Alem her fin' Tiverton, loaded with every abuse the measure whi c h he, as a Cabinet Minister, helped to introduce in 1828; while those on the opposite side, who, a short time since, revered the Corn-law as a part of the Constitution, were now quite ready to abolish it.—(Cries of .6 H ear. ") He rejoiced to see a tendency towards free trade, though he strenously opposed and refused to give his assent to any violent and absurd measures for attaining that end, without having gone through the necessary steps. While in France, the Com mittees of Agriculture, of Commerce, and of Trade, had met to gether to discuss this question, and in those three Committees there was only one member found to contend for any reduction of the present protection duties in that country ; while M. Dupin , the Lord Brougham of France, as he was frequently callecifrem his manifold attainments, declared that the sliding scale ap peered to him to be the very acme of political invention ; while Russia, Austria, and Prussia were determining to com bine agriculture and manufactures, and working against each other, not from any motiae of competition, but to secure that combination of manufacturers and agriculture, which he believed to be as necessary to the body politic as the combina tion of animal and vegetable food was to the body corporate— ( A laugh)—while such was the position of things, and considering also the state of our relations with other countries, he could not but think that suddenly to establish free trade would be an act of anything but wise legislation. He supported most heartily, therefore, the Bill of the Right. Hon. Baronet, and rejoiced that all differences of opinion on that side of the House had subsided into approbation of that measure. He hoped that the time would come when the im provements in agricultare would enable the English agricul turist to compete with the foreign, and when the agriculturists would be enabled to raise double the crops which they now produced; and he trusted and believed that the agri cultural interest would act then with the same good sense and moderation which now marked their conduct, and tl.at they would then only demand, as they now only demanded, °fair remuneration. Capital might flow in those channels, and if it were allowed peaceably to remain, there would, he thought, be hardly a Member of that House who would not live to see the Corn-laws legitimately, peace fully, and lawfully repealed.—( Cheers. ) Mr. WA KLEY said the Hon. Gentleman the Member for Liskeard, had manifested in his speech the greatest possible anxiety, lest he should be misunderstood. It was a natural anxiety, a commendable anxiety, and one for which he should experience sympathy from the Members of that House.—(Laughter.) lie (Mr. Wakley) recollected an old gentleman who informed him, some years ago, that he always felt the greatest wish to under stand what was going on in the National Assembly. lie said, " I like to understand the proceedings in the House of Com mons, and my mode of doing so is this,—l always read with the utmost rare the motions •and the amendments, and then I put off reading the long speeches until I am at a wateringsplace in the summer."—(Laughter.) Now, he thought that his Hon. and Learned Friend's speech was a good speech for the sutnmer— ( Loud laughter)—it wee bis opinion that the perusal of it ought to be deferred; it was bettter that it. should not be read now, because it was calculated to confuse, rather than to elucidate. Why, the Right Honourable Baronet, the Member for Tamworth, when he introduced that discussion, had stated ths,t it was not a subject for the indulgence of fancy ; that it furnished no scope for the imaginative powers of the mind ; that it was a very dry question of detail, and that he felt that there would be the greatest difficulty in making it interesting to that House. But it did appear to him (Mr. Wakley) that a great deal of fancy must have been exercised, in order to clothe a subject so simple in such en enormous quantity of words.—( Laughter.) Hon. Members of that House ar gued the question as though it was one of extreme complexity, and, one requiring unusual and inordinate sagacity, in order to be - properly understood. But the healthy brains, the strong natural intellects, which had not been vitiated by a corrupt and false education, understood this subject well enough, and laughed at them for being so preciously deluded as they were in believing that the community did not comprehend it.— (Hear, hear.) There was scarcely a child, there was scarcely a human being, who was capable of earning his two shillings a day, who did not fully. compre hend this question ; it was only there that it , idimitted of mystification or intellectual confusion. Honourable Gentle men. opposite, who talked of the landed Interest, professed, and he dared say honestly, that their efforts were directed to the im provement of our national resources ; that they had no itit!nr .ested motive in this question; that they were actuated b y ane spirit oh patriotism ; that they took the most enlarged and ca re of com prehensive views ; and it was only to secure them t he vy the national welfare, that they supported the heavy s ip i r , corn--( Hear. ) They heard the words continually in that House, " Protection to agriculture andas 1 in terest." The "landed interest!" Now, t r. what l meant hy Why was not the the last two words—" lauded interest ? interest ?—( Cries of landed interest of England a nation he ) " Hear, hear," and loud cheers from tht a lso to Cheer what he Well, if they cheered that, y theeomniercial interest of England would say next. -Was notCheeers from both sides of the House, ) a national interest too?( Cheers they were all agreed.—( A laugh.) Well, that was right— 'nterests. Then he asked them, why Those two were national landed interest a sp ec i a l w ished to make the they "by it was " the Opposition. one ?---Crsesr' hear- from Why was it that "demanding a protection for their produce, they werewhen the manufacturers of England, they who lived upon indq. ,„..,, ;,