The Sun. — London, England, 1842-06-04 00:00:00

nto Committee 3rn the S4e . tse 2 further reduction petition from thil ha same effect. g_TER %al he °s ir iion for the st n ,, Sugar Duties. _1 {vantage eflieorTe. n. Friend at t°l not be olet le .,/ i t to retoollne; ntion to ;.re e ..o l d b e c° l 4,, o ul :lf if Eying to ...--- Law the countrN h. been haPPY 1 , r , ve a dmitted rug , °lonics, a t slo e,- 'antage to the m . r conas:ancest.ft ,sition of the Ing e ; nth, would Ptlf, ny prop/ 160 ...k t when se,l , jet it must--iii 01°,1, s, be made inif i t ; he atnolle!_,`,st Mali . , -retel',„eo ni r of the tow",,, tless the Hot°, to a, and withouto des of coos u l e to dbe impost' f ‘ 4 be nece2l o 4 •rsons migules .duce the Ou,"71,00 ; ,at the sill'l"Yo . d et the eats_ wa st i that ours' to t (1 1 Id not coosm 0 ar, because berg ue might beA. ler, as unleassbei? y reduetl o P ~bll l e . He to is to duty on 171;s• opinion he ajar uestionantao vest consio to duty 00 6 ;0 her count is' o give uP -04 hey had 'LW e nearer '',:olist 'he BritiskwAid for slave A 'l o o cent perie dtt o ttl o :onsequenee ni viii ay thetcon°'7,o in L e ague..f ore preper.7o !ion to the' 0! ing to thettY lave trade. 71 - 0 0 xpected to Oil 'inn manifef ciir L, against tbe:ig to read then( ;, without gni , l formerly 0 201 slave tra , sll on was no f ie against titso y into cultil l to compel . ()detain the i d th whiclrhe 04 .r of Cubs.,4 hat a spirit n' e # aetical in it. i gt free la bourgo,,,, i ; and that,- e pat t of Pe„;ji the. Chanel mation, 03 , 3 ; # ' colony. 7,, i 1d or had pre 0 00 ' :olony. fie,_ A se he had tsei_iii ;ht not to T. :he benefit o I L ' a motive to, .be r ality iv ouki not re m i do o relax tbeno td already _'_7 ( oo lout a relerf, duty en &so o him, thes v , o the present ; he had the iarip which word' ntry. His: that - from if the prod w oii believe 4 100 amply .47# i of thi s" st o' on. Friend . ris confirro t ot eeeivetl, nki e igi th of sue' here the e1",_ ... 01 'sing, and,4o , y those hit":et :at Indies,,..""ii • the drol e lso gknial w . pp i y , tha t -;;‘,, op ly of the as 20 0 0 ° - enP, of' in this coe t : l o 4 bundant ; be main , mi l o high ? ~ _41 , .; was the saw ' 365. notv.4, .' aal price;l" 0 aipared wield' . :rage of. the.'7,pi .t, at the LITSI I 65., then. o 7 o o: 365. nolo t ii i iperior 11 10 7,11 , nsum ptietc. • equally co r i i i to the eul . e 4 apprehend , , • le consuin 4 inferior c A l, e to knoll '' - o';,. of the core:i:, on of the '24, ch the c 0 11 1 ,5,1,.. pression of . l s t t. grounds _,,ak esolution P iot:, e that 0 6 " ti o posing ?S r i 00: • Bath ,0 0 0, (Ai& li t _or ,r He Is the 0 0: a a 8t or .sirabls to 00 i not fe el ' rafe e .li to the Air k !link thSt 74, conotselbso o, i Ender sh e gliVef o House Ir,„ i fs l l; d for th ie r e 8 supf 6' •,',,, • ; '•,t d ; TTES• ~•' 1, 104 r , that , iii: v . :, Sorge°'''.4e his f° l :. 4 i r the P a tli.: i Wst*,,4.o s d , A!..• . 1;0 tr. • rf ~ f. l 1 , ,:i :•• 1 4r 1, a t i V I 141 cii 6 7 • l . I hist 1 ° a . " :, i , only pro _ ii : 0, / sti A ,entry' ;I: J t ins f -", 'it ipso . _AI 1 • is belier7,o,, I, Pu wa l 04 ,r,,, s- the • 1 grappl; • ) . Gen At I ~ r !oil e r 0 estel o 4,so, , f ie n• h°,;l. , : !e w .e, e Ifis' 7 a it. 05 0 :,tt ould !MPS ,' .1 . . 4 id dsliSibe :-1,1 one letlly_'',, , / xietY,•6. ---, 1 0 ill he stl' IP , .1 . m edifi r ,8 v a i i oB ,t e a ti•- t ' ~, cA : ( 0 1 ''''i eP •-•ee - ,, I co o tti o .. EN .. , at le gs ot° :''' f." ) nore ba n c o _ • , .! the tiw novf ! !.;' I aid tl t ,piv, l . :''6' , pors"p o f ..,%!! i f. 3 , mat t e 1 ,' ,0 1! S aitOr t io• P: i ii , of g re f : rai l. i i, 0 „, mar , ... „ od to 1. 4 1 ~ 7 0 10 I slid it be ... * le rat e eu t heA too t 0 4 e, l et- i tfl#: Pe: # 4 elle° D .sper‘,. 4 .', a 1 , 0 r'ell f t c, 'at i" ; 4 ,0%4 ,i,. co ,, ? t isti l 4,o .? the Bri etet ) ,eic t : es. 5 . 4 w ~. ;'. e ) - ,' L t th° I , 4 1 - :1 013-, •r'''' ti: ~ in - 4 - ov ', r: ° _ se .. _ • ~.,, It °la' ',• rO, 0 1 5 e " is• arg , "' t he be a t , t a t j s tid f p n r, o tr bac ., „ s e e l e r p o the ;e nt ( c i tify , the ag o. ba t hat I, bi 1,04 Eli . c o uli r; %c_ ofh 11°t1 11 Ge t a pou O P 3 • t'%Ob - - -- ~. ......a..-a................................i.t . (~ r . a .',lrrtid,.,,,the Right Hon. Gentleman, there is the inter-colonial the seiner duties with a view to their alteriatios, Ile "A.l L - - ~rh "''Ple to support, which being interpreted into or Mary boaeher , •) recollected that when he Was in Liverpool, three e' _ - b i l a egY, meant that the people of this country were to tay stems ago, a very respectable deputation wetted upon Lim, with eg o Te, t est Luria. proprieto rs two millions per annum. Was Lord Sedenham's sp••tech in doer hands, And with an eep r ee s i o n Ip7o ei nese of Commons prepared to tax the people of E ng l an d of great alarm, they sail that they hoped that lie Wks not going 0 7"o" per annum Or r the tenefit of the West India to adopt the plena of his predeeestor. ile was nut abl e t o gi ve . l ., let ,, rs? Oh !it was not for the benefit. of the proprietors,but them any satisfactory assuranee of thin, and the gentlemen lef 'of the slay thi e , es , of the inhabitants of the West Indies. Ile denied him anghing but emotion'. He recollected that when the entire:together ; it did not at all benefit the slaves ; it went R i ght Hen. Winkelman the Member for Portsmouth brought ; .. ae 1 Y into the pack ets o f th e proprietors. And now he" torw"rd hIS prep eition with respect to the su gar duties, that . • , i 'el to that shadow of an argument which was pressed into tee Cha,ceiler of the Exclempler said, tha" they were taking the z_wrirk e of gentlemen oeposite for the purpose et bolstering 'interacts concerned by surprise, and he could hot, therefore, help making th,s statement to the House of Commons. He then . - 7 q sinister interest. He always observed that when swine thought it necessary to give the West Indian interest breathing albissel•er interest was to be supported, a plausible kind time, after the great cap riment ef neg,i•c• , mancipation; brit 9:. argument was generally resorted to. Thus when the time was . now come whin, in justice to the people of this • trowAes.esanted to keep up the price of bad timber, they were count, ee•-on ju-t!ce even to tho•e protected interests them aht`m their navy and their mercantile marine, and to keep up s ' - Is,/,..... 1 9" sugar, they were to ld o f encouraging the slave tr a d e , salves—it tea. right an d fi tt i eg that the Parliament should, he w ou l d say broanily from the statement of those most censider the subject with a view to its alteration. I t was in v:rsant w i t h the subject, and who had taken a met part accordance oith this opi n i on t h at t h e Government, of which Oe'n in the Opposition l he had had the honour of being a Member, brought forward . attee , to the slave trade, that all their qu•xotic • their proposition last year. hat wh:ch, unfortunately, did not ~,--"pt, on this subject had been attended with mischief and meet wilts 'the support of the. Legislature. He thought the iter with good. He would state 011 the authority of Sir Fowell reeetos which existed last year for this step, existed with the • 1 ,, -on, that the importa•ien of slaves into South America, • 'same force now. It must be recollected that this was a qui t ireen not increased, but that. there was a large, exportatien ; lion distinguished from the other interests in the country. gin t:eu Africa ; that they bad not preventee the mischief of the They had had lately alterations made in the commercial port et i ee - system fur the general betrelit of the community ; but still • - •• When the French people thought they had got a mere 'id in they . could not hide from themselvee the fact, that • meth ea their revo,ution, they tried their propaganda; Rai e to was th en a great outcry raised asetinst it; it was certain protected interests had been deprived ot the protection • e l e„ , ne V had no right to force their notions on other come- they had hitherto elijeyed. He held filet 'every interest they • .. Anti arid to become the Quistmes of the earth. had so effected, had a right to complain, unless they dealt in the le e " " a matter of argument what was the dif- same mann". with the sugar producing interest. It was on • c eeg e .e between political' relations and. social ones ? this ground the the complained of the course pursued on the sub. ims e'r 'persons formed the op nion that the slave trad e seas ject of the Corn-laws which applied to the prohibiting so e , le ''Ont• He agreed with them in that, opinion. He duty on sugar. But they were told that the present state of the sugar Lade, and the present prices of sugar were satisfac „CZ with them that it was immoral, and ought to be put vi t t, ' 'But there was another opinion he sleeted in common tory, arch that they might rest perfectly content to leave things fles the propaganda of France—that it was no part of the h a .. •as they were the preceding year ; that no great practical cvii • her, e ,e)::_ f 'me nation to propagate any opinion, as a nation, o n , could pessillis• recurs by delaying tha alteraticn of the sugar dukes. et least fur the present year. He must say, that when es a '•• The reason he said this was, that if it was once admitted he looked to the figures, he did not find that those figures bore to s e e P ti aeiPle, there was no line to be drawn where they were -- • theirs out the statement of eentlemen opposite on this subject. He row 1 ; If to-day they put a stop the slave trade, toonor.• began with prices. The Right Hon. Gentleman, the Chaneel eY Might put a stop to slavery itself. The sea was not lor of the Exchequer, told them that sugar was at a low price, .. a l i d.t e and to assert supremacy thereon was as wild as if they He (Mr. Labouchere) thought the fight Hon. Gentleman . t ie lc the Americans that they should put down slavery there. must have spoken rather in his capacity as We:t India pro thseuteieeee that by stating those opinion's lee was subjecting than as Chancellor of the Exchequer when he said this; 'OW I to much imputation. but he seat too accustomed to that Prieter , , etnindit Out it certainly was not at all satisfactory to the people of Eng little-ea - "W. After a speeeh delivered by an Hon. Gentleman land.. He (Mr. Labouchere) supposed from the statement of ne eig gard to the mode of proceeding by the Government on • WoOlect of the Corn-law, he, did not think he was unchari- the Right HMI. Gentleman, that there had been a great and prices. He (Mr. L.) found that from the Gazette yet an belie v i ng t h at t hi s cry was laid hold of as a con- sudden fall in t ` of the 25th of May, the last we e k, in th e l ast mont h, th a t t h e eg et i es one for th e purpose ef exc i t i ng, the peop l e o f th i s country 'ruble a th e late Governme n t, an d t a ki ng a d van t age o f a very price of West India Muscavado sugar in hoed, eas 395. 51-d.; at the p e "m benevolent feeling which pervaded their bosoms for the same period of last year, it was 385.e11d., being rather more ' heif er e r tose of furtherireg a particular party.—(Hear.) He than is. pier t - wt. differ, nee in the corresponding period. He would takes wider range. He found that in January, the ave. be e that if those' ditties were maintained it would not be rage price was ttis. 10 id., February 375., March 395. 2id., he ' bogie eee t he Government did not believe them mischievous— April 38s. Hod., and in May, the first week, 415. 10. ; so • tad e . oe '„ r !ee they were not mischievous—in everything cruel pa te ie7 o :ll - Ile to the poor--but because they were bound as a that it would appear that the whole of this year's prices had' ranged high, and that they were not satisfactory at the present "tee, !he Phrposes of party, and for saving, apparently, their moment. There was also antiV , er point. He held this to be • • Cane .iatistency, to maintain them.•—(Hea , , hear.) He now the result of the plan on which the sugar market was supplied. 40 , . - 0 4 ,: ek to his original position, and he ached the Committee There was now continued violent alteration in price, but extend :.:* it Right Honourable Baronet to point out to him the market and the effect. would be steadiness of price. But epee} wls that the benefit in prospective which he what lie considered as the more important part of Slits question to induce the Governments of South was, the actual price of sugar in this country as compared with ''entearniea'to namely, IY ev i ith him in putting down the slave trade, the sugar in other countries. By that would be shown what for. t Y. j u stilitation to them or to the poor of this country were the burdens on the people of this country by meaes The 111.,1 Right them to the amount of '2.000,000/. per annum ? of the sugar lag s, and the great disadvantages they were . I N 0 e . g, 4 Hoe. Gentleman said that it could not he the inte under compared to their foreign rivals. He believed that i stai ned r u'is country to admit foreign sugar, till they had ob- Porto Rico sugar might reasonably come into fair lii, the guarantee for the suppression of the slave trade, competition with British Indian Muscovado sugar. Now •N g c ountries from which we were to derive that sugar. He the price of Porto Rico sugar he believed at this r v,ith.te (* beck) believed that if we were to consent to trade moment to be about 19s. or 205., being as nearly as possible ther e th es e People, we would have a more cogent influence on one half the price of West India sugar of the same quality. Of • the Right n Ise could otherwise have. It was remarkable that course the difference between 195. mia ,IDs. w s taken by the t he 'kercee d btage to be derived f withholding commercial in- Prohibitory syst , to nee the supply Mid consumption of sugar. • le 'eurses with from The next point to which the Chancellor of the Exchequer • °ac n , n those people. Those who argued in favour of dar e ', on the ground that it prevented the horrors of the adverted was the probable supply of sugar for Ism present year. • • 'leat e _le e e , only showed that misplaced benevolence . was as He told them he was quite certain of an ample pply of sugar, "Yr ee - Yebs as malevolence in its effects. He would conclude and that there was no fear but that the people would be abun evt - , v e leg that all dutydantly supplied. He (Mr. Labouchere) had not the saint , '. 'He dut on foreign sugar be reduced to 245. vet means of information as the Chancellor of the Eechequer had ; - ' ;The eg •Y eta colonial sugar. :At e. G et es itoe.aer having put the question, but he had, however, attempted, by theta means as he had access ; r elati ve ~"-I F -tON said that he would not go into the question to, to corns to some conclusion tin the question, and from these Chance: the slave trade, or to the policy laid down by the he was not disposed to form any sanguine expectations. of the supply of sugar. He held in his hand what he believed to be a fir, ely t".. of the Exchequer, but would confine himself en- supply statement of the importations of late . years, and he' ear upci J.he two propositions put forward by his Hon. and fount" that from the West:ll-macs there came in the- film first L and e e t th , vll ^hd, relative to their going to the cheapest market, mouths of 1e , 41, viz. from the sth of Jannary to bile. May, 'boar • - • -W ould be the effect of the resent measure en free 'titl e , I. _tn the West Indies. He did not think that the propo- 814,000 cwt. of sugar; and iii 1642, 240,000 cwt. was came. He found that, of Aitemetrus sugar, in 1841, was imported gibe+ "Add be the means of reducing the ,ices, as the sugar te,R.: ag countries would impose a duty upo the export of 303,00'd curt. ; and, in 1642, 244,000 cwt. Of British Indian ;pis; u ntnediatelv the sugar theee was a still more remarkable falling off, for, in the fest t ‘'S respect' present . competition was abolished. four months of 1841, the imeortation was 4843,001 seeel. ; and, co _ to the West India slave asantry, our abolishing in 1842, 296 000 cot. during the came period. If they com • ti umetition must necessarily reduce - ,es ntee.• GLADSTONE said .t h o u h their i %N a r z al pared the quantity ot sugar in bond Which paid duty, and was "te e eMtnittee was to go into the u g es t ti q t on le u g p e ( n m e the motion of of • feeling introduced for consumption its the first four months of 1641, with the same pelted of 1842, they would find a small increase di o . es i ght- Hon. Gentleman opposite Thie was not out of in the presissit ever. In 1841, the amount was I,loe te 2,b00 . or ee Peet to the Hon. aid Learned Gentleman, but his motion one 0 cwt. ; and, in 184') the amount was 1,146 alai , so that it of a peculiar nature, length, which • thaps, few going a great re r o Members of the Committee would follow. •he was quite clear that there had been 1 large drawing on the th e p o ,htlernan said the onus was laid upon the Chancellor of stock,' and it was obvi•.ue that th a t st oc k m ust have b e en dimi :zit - see•cnequer t o s h ow why the re,ention of the sear a nrshed, by 320,000 cwt., since the last year ; and that what _ • oueht to be supported against 'he rules . -of ever would be coneurned this year of course, would make the e) log e e e - What were the rules of trade ? When stock so much less than it was' les , t, year. He also found that •1 1 ''`v- was a. producing • vi .,_ _ interest at home, it was affected 'his was confirmed by a document which was ehtilled to consi luedety on a competing • country. In France Germany, deration. It was the circular of Mmes. Truman and Cooke, 47,7 America, the duty had been considerably increased. who we ee • 1 ed hi • -I , ' • information. He . • g nera .y eup e o. to into.. accurate -"ot think the Honand Learned Gentleman-• Zle! leg , _ fwdthese imaginary rules to exist to which he had re- overland despatch to their correspondent in India, and doted the sr - Trert. A Strong Protective• bird - Gentleman ' d t sleet up, • e on. thee? tee t kith it would be most, inconsistent in that House suddenly to extract from the Circular, from which it opetaged that the withdraw_ that protection, ' as proposed by the Hon. Gentleman. stock since the same time last year had decreased to the amount ,lie did not Think the ' rs.:. of that C • Hon. Gr neleman could find a dozen Mem- Committee who would be m o men t 1 2 ,000 . of 12,000 tons.) Therefore it • dthat ' stock at that appeare the in extent. He was prepared to go to such wa s less than thecorre• cl•period of the year spun ing . . sure the desire of some protection in the before. He (Mr, Labouchere) could not help remarking the of sugar Was as great as the desire for protection in any altered state of the abet article. He could not think that the House was prepared site and those used last used by Hon. Gentleman ep . i i , a o•• I_ l lt . tite any exception to all other general rules, so sudden as seemed to have is _ __ year.—( Hear, hear.). T.h y ,I .d . prgsed all the arguniehl-s they could into then 4 ,J . f . n. Gentleman proposed, in favour of sugar. service. Fur inst•ince, One ale last - i }ear was that they "e't CO l l ' (the Oppositio ) ' Ltltnet ' t inhabitants t . DEN said that ene of the main objections to the ii were eareful of the interests of the q 4asal of his Hen. Friend ,__ (the Hon. _Member for Bath) was, on the banks of the Amazon, but they forgot the interests of the . , • .e k . they should not, by abolishing the duty upon hundreds of millions ' l aniou sugar, afford ns of their fellow-countrymen, who lived on aels,_ ragement to slavery. But the opponents of the the banks watered b th G es That was the ar ument propo- . , last . _ y e ang . g 1%1,nd-tot carry nut their own principle,f ' or, under the system u.ed 3.ear, but it would not do new. They had heard tha t ev4fa notv existed, and which they were advocating, we trafficked w ,. hie l h would be entirely incontinent with this argument fronts t;‘,lthe Brazils and otherriro__.cummodities. iiti cgu ri ntr t ia,s s v ix hose produce h we exchanged emeenrtcoameropposite its the course of the discussion on cern eahr s a dwpaidieh classed ,, h o a o d oo o ; goodi fo l r subjects, titcse because these monopolies were not even ?fee t oe i ndsl to 1840 inclusive, During country 'who were said to be benefited by them. l o ttia te % auger than it would have paid if we lad been enabled' He was told that interests had risen up under those pro- Pareek, beat in foreign markets. Now that was as nearly as testing duties, but those interests would soon find that r the a their foundation • , b . ° goo mount of the goods sold during the period in oo ___lttliteth:Jhe inhabitants of the West Indies ; and they other reason why he thought these sugar duties should r7 liteg -- `aliere conclude that they would have lost nothing b „ not continue. He referred to the Bill introduced by the Right li‘-' Ne se A,. . . time • J Hon. the ViceePresident of the Board of Trade, which would , L es t .fade in sugar, and at the same making our make a very material alteration in the West Indies regard beiTonghnct, ent of all the goods they had purchased from us, -- 'cril - he ill csed b his Hon Friend the Alem- to the cultivation of sugar—he meant the Colonial Pa l sengers et /k i„ a t h o c auge prop ,y_ . . Bill, It bore a close resemblance to a measure he (Sir. La -1 of justice. It , bso e i k c i ti b ot w s :l d forded h upon l ei every iiitraidnciapce peculiar elaim houchere) had had the honour to introduce, and he felt that .1111.4eeeentether cotunattryt, f e or c trey me derived many benefits benefits from when this Bill passed it would be highly injurious to maintain the . restrictive system in the We . s . t Indies, and, at the same time, t i e!? s, a ' ir l i fut with U. There was another vote for the subject there to foreign competition with regard to the staple Iti r - re; eh c r which was to be paid nut of the taxes on the .te •s eito _ er e -,,.. ve another tax for the iie - bt-houses, and also article of the country ; therefore, both . on that account and on ,e e lit e r f • It. might be all very well for those out of trade not geec'ral principles,. and the his of justice to the West Indies, he had felt it to be his duty- to introduce that measure, eZei karr b this, but tradesmen wished to know how all this which he rejoiced to see had been adopted and brought forward tie /' Th e ed ' There was no plea whatever for a differential cit . • But, in doing this, were giving i ,e w _ i ntan e ,„ u•acturers were ready to give up all protection, by gentlemen opposite. an important boon to the West Indies. He found this tn e - 7,oe e i7 " undertake to bring the whole manufacturing in subject treated with especial attention by a Committee fly la th,, e e nuntry toogre to such aproposition, and they , eek 1 hem _ . . in . wh 1 sat u the West Indian colonies in 1831. He found it . upon 4.% for it. He would, conclusion, only say, t, st e h0 I , ed the„ would a passage in the Report of that Committee relating to those re ., to e h a s h oe , .1 not persevere too long. strictions. (The Right Hon. Gentlemanehen read an extract •te e _ title " conversation the Committee divided upon Mr. proposition•mared to reduce the duty to 245., when there from the Peport of this Committee, from which it appeared that ''Por e , ;the annual charge upon the colonies was 1,392,0001. ) This was . 4 -eit Lon Roebult's motion "st it quently, every article- was a great price. Thfs was le o leIaj o! ,•, ... ............... .. the t•t ok 'I anainst the motion BO 41 not natural, for Jamaica,w - as not far distant from the Mississippi, ,toto:otio e of tiCHERE said he was not able to concur in and the Chesapeake. He trusted Si on, to see Jamaica, instead Nsot h st r e e Hon. and Learned Member for Bath. He of being the dearest place in the world, one of the cheapest to i v it t himself,after • live in. He then came to what believed the main objec t; tte7_ aet edi i . 0 a system of protection. he . . tion gentlemen opposite advanced to the proposition he Lad tah, 4 70.0 14 , POn in this country for a great length of time, :le eve. 4 ,elite, Protection suddenly and at once. But the brought forward. He meant the encouragement it would give otelOch_th-"anitsd truly stated that that was the principle to slavery. Now he hoped he was not insensible to that argu tlottela,?he A i always acted. He could not believe that any ment. If he really believed *hat it was substantial, however tlep o olf he - hei n o try had an interest in doing injustice to another much importance he attached to the question of these duties ; 41 1 1 0et' e tehoe , the hat ...hat to be true with regard to t h e mother being discontinued, he would rep:•fiee it. But he could not be _evealig 4 " less d, would he apply it to the colonies. His lieve that the country was called upon to submit to this impost - Nltl - " w Ya 'i,!: l e . ollo, ct i ons h•een raido away with those monopolies fe?r the purpose ef using the ihfluenee-the .influence world, whch h t no good .to any class. ffiu 1 % tte: 1 ,% 1 4 e al W4 s to ke ep for i'n the g lan ultimate 1 ; l i e n ' : a I,7lXUnsf tshiartitdhettelis%cbileunatnrd'esod o i f ou t s he tr• _ wt,tr biles4l:lle, as an art p t, up ti h: nt pr t er a n t t t d h u c tie d s ct on ( s itt ugi i i. c r r end the slave trade. Ile could not. believe that they were traffic— F M S st I t i nt i t ! 20 4 1 e per to 30s. 'per cwt., and y on colonial upon to make that sacrifice with this object.—( Hear, hear.) r ~. se , a 4 1 ,,_ Per cwt. They had had an avowal from the He supposed when gentlemen talked of making treaties with a ,Itle . ' 17ie t e e nf the Crown, that it was highly important the foreign country to relax the sugar duty, the Brazils was the ta r litl t lf ' hot b s e nf consumption should be reduced. This prin. Place they meant. Now, what was their position with respect thlfft o pt etoo p 1 fully carried' out in their measures. He to the Brazils ? We had now a very advantageous treaty with i t ? 4 that ;l . tt .w i ta . nothing had been done to this end in the Brazils ;it was a treaty imposed on them when they were tV; o l4!_lit oo le!'ail been effected had been lamentably small. strugelii g for independence, and was almost too advantageous col t et gi v e i n des would rather be by the indirect increase to this country Our commercial treaty With them was this: they tt l / 4 4 1 1 ul * aro rn luoYment, than from any actual reduction in bound themselves not to impose a duty on any article of British . ore !les et t produce, of more- t han 15 percent . ad valorem, and there was no eira c i as , _consumption. With the exception of corresponding stipulation for- the admission of Brazilian arti ttele,ertO° .4 to •no article on which, by substituting a Ils e q t VA:th e " t he r could so materially add to the des into this country ; we only engaged to place their produce flo fit's Cosen t O 43 „ ..o ecPles • The price of corn would probably be on the mot. favourable footing we could. This treaty raised Oetp, t ettelif te 'r" the charge of the law, but there wa s great irritation, in the Brazils ; it interfered with all their com- Vit. 4 iree t V.;nec between the price of sugar here aid on mercial concerns, and stood very much in their way. 'This .147 othe ee ' 4l ess tome clear and solid rt•ason could be treaty expires, according to us, id 1643 ; according to them, i l. :w.,,,i -- t o, !=try, it Was the dutyof the - House to"make 'in 1642. It was undoubtedly of the greatest consequence that, ts g e e ge "hei r ,,t to the engar duties, as would SPCille - to the before' it expired, some commercial arrangement of a fair ria le;qltVeeret a . 'Pate supply of an - article so, necessary to their ture should be entered into with that country. He appre hended the danger we had to fear was, that they would refuse ko l tetYniehP o f 'derate rate; Before proceeding further, he to have any commercial treaty with us, but would instead place e ka l t leeYear e " v ett .the the history a the sugar trade for the Ant • o*- II on a discriminating duty, which would be favourable to other le t - -eteeen ,P• to that period; although our own colonies countries, but unfavourable to us. That they had threatened ibi o ee'ot Yet 0 o ; the monopoly of the supply of sugar to this to do, and he was afraid they would. He believed it would be hy'mtht• hf Ih e ," -e tgeally, the British consumer had not felt very uneesirable to-put off negotiating with them till the t;eoeT oo tti et i7: . rnehnpoly, because the supply from the ast mement ; and Honourable Gentlemen opposite said that w t trii"Nuttie ''""ing- much greater than could be absorbed l t e , t•etr_a tid I.,narkets the surplus was exported to foreign this was a reason for delaying the alteration in the sugar 4 7 ei:1 11 . . - b y.i . i. , be price in the British market was cense e tl, duties. He would meet that objection, by saying that they it (se tleP , h he Price in the • • •• ` clu " 'would be in • favourable for negotiatingwith , a more condition . 4 _ .„ , ~,..._ foreign market. Within the last t_tc.ekteZeite of the . supply from onr own colonies had the Brazils on es mmercial matters, alter we had made this efhtie iith i.....n l i d . , and the sugar cultivationof f • countries alteration in the sugar duties. Government would then be e e4 'i ll O ur markets oreign „ lO 3 t h al ! . th e Price than "ere scantily supplied. We paid free to act as they pleased, nothing could prevent them coining 41e Gi l l 'ar e d evil' had foreign nations, and practically ex;'e- to the House of Commons, and proposing to make a distinction 'At e , -It ' -uties e monopoly. In 1829, the question of duty with regard to count ies where slavery prevailed, and m e e oeleg , th been brought before the House by where it did not. He did not say that that was a proper k ' , o ft , - , to r ,„_. , en Alt- been t*t 1 n , .ltio n .rant. and Alg Huski ss o n , m e , policy, still it-would be open to the Government to adopt it if • i essast I spa; that the they pleased ; and he would say that if they wanted to make te miti4" eel 01 tithe a . duty on foreign sugar should be ,tti, e ~ o„ at the Only difference which Mr. Grant and Mr. commercial prosperity, they would be in as auvantageous a situ- N., 4 t teas-th e ;r2 Make between foreign and British colo- tion to do so after an alteration, as they were now. If Ire e l. It I deed _ merence between 28and 9 0 the were right in the view which he took on thatof s. IN) ..,e7Cornpanied ilt e a „ph 4 arat i on that proposal by a •most re-the arguments used on the other side relative to slave-grown , i , f. o. •'i:'2 ad of nalnel, that Mr. Huskisson and sugar would fail to the ground. With regard to the West Pti k alt 44 - go _ . the Cabinet of the Duke of Wel- Indies, they were told that they must delay this measure •; in ~,tt , , , the that answer to that, he would beg to place the opinion of one who %to t l °Met, and . proposal to their collea,eues AO „ b . ei t w i t . no objection had whateverbeen was often before Committees of that House on questions of c Pod top. ,leet tmple which had the W Italian policy, and• ) vest s ee it ) , ( , 4 544 been . been fully admitted, that ' le l t t.tr i . kerl t a4jection inc of revenue, and that, on the ardent, the most able, and the most indefatigable opponent of It': i h bat ' th - -Ir. Gr Grant proposition had been postponed negro slavery—he meant Mr Joseph Bevan, who said that an 4 , . tt e•l t . e th e , e , a had expressed his great disappoint- alteration in the duties would tend, so far from checking the i he ___ nancellor of tl progress of the Colonies, to render them quite successful • ot e lo Wd m 'anie eefiee,, had le Exchequer, who at pre- Although the Right Hon. Gentleman the Chancellor of the ,_ ti tt oe _ oc ie ls The ,„ not proposed some alteration in tSt y p ( 4 1 s e e l es,,, th'e not Hon. Gentleman had opposed Exchequer rested his opposition to an alteration of the duties 4 4 „ ‘ l 'utild °M ended fo gr ound b of revenue--he had admitted mainly on the point of the encouragement which he said would timeyeh eh o rrnit, that s • y Mr. Grant. He (Mr. Labou- be given to slavery; he also looked at it as a point of revenue. 11 % ef re sted I ! sire d , but tince that period colonial slavery. He (Mr. Labouchere) was not prepared to deny y e ti• th e dg o s npno. ,.. he Chancellor of the Exchequer that some loss of revenue for a year or two IN t h e duty''' w ou r d 'ul°n now on theground that d must be expected, Oil] he believed ' that there were Nie tt ad e '''an d en c"rage the slave' a Te . tics he ely e ` 'arei " 1 ' a digi ts t• V I. 4. trust r rel Y that ob. c ion between slavery and the non, with a greater certainty that the . revenue would speedily e.riee 4 183 1 h ire Cat, jection could have been urged as recover from that reduction, as they could on sugar. There tilli t i'eand • the r a proposition as against the ,resent was none of more extensive consumption, none of which the 't ee et seas giro, et measure of lio,te e iz., ir„„,Lgeneraily f e l t negro emancipation was • consumption had been more obviously checked by high prices kr"' th e eotetti g i s 'ately after that there ought to be an un- • than sugar, and there was none, therefore, with which an expe itt,\, aiclist en of our W est a change had been made in riment might be made with greater safety. He thought the tp ' 4 i k t ' 110 11 e Orb the workv• t India colonies, to do anything Right Hon. Gentleman was quite right in not laying great stress f ti te 1 1 id a rl the mg of the new ' 't lie ti ea 0 1 s ugar duties system. On that on the loss of revenue. The motion he made now di& en the at th remained undisturbed not feted from the motion of the Government last year in this. The t e ln e o w; sie ve . e alteration i•le 4 4f b *rade h of those duties would dut whi •h he roposed now on foreign sugar 305.,1 .. en- y . L . .. was and on 11 ire g h aat , reatei n ~, ut from the n • eke • n e a be i g tube to the • _ e.ceseity which existed colonial 20s. ; last year it was 3bs. on foreign and 245. on colo ski;ale -PPrebe epo c h , on colonies, after such a great nit!. He need hardly explain the reason for that. . Last year i ke se . tegut e et ioe ,Ved, wae th them by the mother country.. their object was to secure an increase of revenue ; their budget 'le ' k in '' gee - "g interf e solo and suffleient . e gv 14 4 -Un c l , two ere with the sit -•- • reason why was based on this, that they must receive a certain revenue f t 'e *, Sr ht e Years ago, that he g l ee , duttes. It was from sugar, and they did not think themselves justified, under t i t l it '' ett o .,• si:rn, Hon ion the Memb ‘ f• r. 1.,,) resisted a such circumstances, in trying a bolder experiment than they 4 , 41 _ to e , grog ~ • time, that he reetecnl.,,z Wigan, stating, did. .. But now they should consider the sugar duties under 'Nth " e eeo ". tor• hg r e • ey e .„ g el , , -,.,. bete , e!,:tv , ~ a t , 1., 0 , , 17:: siti 7, . not , altered cireurrestances ; they lead got an Income-tax, and if they 1, 4•• , te e , the l e wet? to have th , ; tV•IS 01 au Income-tax, at least let them have Ite s ge ,_ ,e,,y eitra *--ouela that his A °hie .I• fiend °Yr'''. "tmblota if ag distinctly stated to the Co Li" toe oceeels ai i. ; ;got Moo I.,,,aiaet. -..a.y tiii.lt lie. liesil: - ,,,1. the..t Wollki be .bi , untr tax would be much more roductiVe to the revenue thahtine - utery nec escar . y -0 COD d y R . 1 P at er ig It Hon., Gentleman had calculated upon ;he thought, riaE SUN, LONDON, SATURDAY MORNING, JUNE 4, 1842, then, they could not be in more favourable Circumstances 'd. trying the experiment en wear than they *ete hoer: He tonic( only add that there *as another reason why he considered they cerise to a consideration of the sugar duties this year, under favourable circumstances. His Hon. Friend, who was not now in his place, the Member for Nottingham, stated to them what were the grounds on which he voted against the sugar duties last year.-a-" Don't stippose es," he bald, such narrow-minded penple as to allow any alteration in the sugar ettties or the timber duties; that was all very well last year, but now we are able to express those opinions which we always entertained. Timbe: last year meant popery, and sugar meant revolution, and we were opposing, not the sugar duty or the timber date, but a Government of Radicals and Papists."—( Great laughter.) He (Mr. L. ) was sorry the H. n, Gentleman was not in hiS place now; he hoped he would come down in the evening, as he thought he had a right to his vote. He would only conclude by reminding the House that they were called on to determine this question at a period when it was one of vital interest and importance. Her Ma jesty's Government had advised her Majesty to issue her let ter, in which she had called on her opulent subjects to administer to the necessities of their peorte fellow-country men, No doubt the call would be responded to with that rea diness with which the wealth and property of this country always answered such appeals ; but he would venture to say that the House had an opportunity to-night of conferring a boon, of more advantage than could be done by the letter, if they would accede to this motion.—( Hear, hear.) They would at once open new channels of trade, and at once reduce the price of one el the greatest nectes tries of life. He trusted this appeal would not be made in vain. It eels with the Utmost disappointment he heard the an• noubeement of the Right Honourable Baronet the First Lord of the Treasury that he meant to exclude the sugar duties from all amendment. He could not help suspecting that that course had been adopted, rather through a determination to adhere to the course they pursued last year than any sound policy. Sure he was, at least, that the course the Govern ment. now adopted was strap sly inconsistent with the principles which bad been ennounced by them in the course of the dis- Cutsions which they had already had, and especially inconsistent with the desire which the Right Hon. Baronet expressed him self to have for reducing the price of the articles of subsistence of the people of this country; and he would ask them, if they would be doing their duty to their constituents in opposing this motion, when, by pursuitg an opposite course, they would be acting in aceoreanee with those principles of trade tehieh seemed to be unittersally acknowledged to be sound, and which would confer an incalculable boon upon the commerce of this country.__( Loud cheers.) On the question being put, Mr. GLADSTONE rose. Ho said that the flight Hon. Gentleman had congratulated himself en what he considered to be the altered tune of gentlemen on his (Mr. Gladstone's) side of the House, and appeared to think that there was a ells position to abandon the arguments or portiont of the arguments which were urged last year in resisting the propositions of the then Government. He could see nothing to be abandoned in the arguments then used.—( Hear, hear.) The discussions of last year extended over no less than ten nights in a single debate, and in the present state of the public business he saw the necessity fur brevity. Thete ttas ild eentest last treat On the stager detites With respectto commercial principles, but it tees Contended that there were peculiar considerations, from the connection with slavery and the slave trade, which exempted it for a time from being dealt with as it ought to be ; on these grounds the Right Hon. Baronet opposed the late Govern ment, on the same grounds as he did it now. The whole question still remained as it was then. The Right Hon. Gen tleman lamented how little had been done by the tariff for cheapening articles of sebsistenee ; that *as no doubt true. The ;neat bulk of the revenue which they had to give away was not on articles of subsistence, but on articles of industry ; and in doing so he thought they were more certainly conducing to the comfort and well-being of the reople, even than by cheapening the articl es o f inv.'s).file tlignt lion. Gentleman alluded then to e. point on which he ( stone) ehould touch very briefly—the proposition of Mr. Grant in 18_ 2 9 1n 1529 Mr. Grant proposed to reduce the duty on foreign sugar to 118 e, and on West Indian tb 20s;, leaning only a pinteetion to the West Leila Over the fotelge of 8s: The Chancellor of the Exchequer then opposed that proposi tion, but he did not do so on the greund of protection. The Right Hon. Gentleman now raised the arguinenium ad honii nem, and said that his (Mr. Gladstone's) Hon. Friend was wholly inconsistent. But the Bs, duty proposed under those eircernsteecee ) would 'mire keen a p:ohibitory duty.—( Hear, tr point of fact, what the Right Ben. Gentleman advanced as a ground of his (Mr. Gladstone's) Right Hoc. Friend's in•. consistency, showed, on the contrary, no ineottSisithet %that ever in the matter. If Mr; Grant' }lion had beeh telopted, there would h a v e b ee n by lOA bit the Fif reienite. 'I he Right Hon: taentleillan appeared tothink that no great stress nettild be laid, in resisting his motion, on the ground of revenue.--( Rear, hear.) On the contrary, he (Mr. Glad stone) believed there were csnclusive objections to his motion on the ground, of .reveripe; ,and that too without refers's:en to others' considerations. Looking at the firencial eltimates of the year, he (Mr. G.) submitted that the Right Hon. (lent eman s plan was inadmissible on finan cial grounds alone. He had endeavoured to consider what would be the effect of the Right Hun. Gentleman's plan on the finances of the country, and he would ventuee state to the House that it wes by no fisaithi an eitraviaant estimate to state goat the adoption of that plan would cause a deficiency in the revenue of 600.000/., that it was a most liberal estimate to lay the deficiency at 400.000/. The net revenue from sugar was 5,400,060 i. If there should be no increase in the consumption of that article (and from the et-event state of teatie ttld em ploetnent netre seat likely 't, the Ri g ht lion. Gentleman's pro pesition would only admit of a revenue of 4,548,0001. to be derived from sugar, thus leaving a deficit of 852,0001. And what—even admitting, that an increase in consumption took place what would be the amount to put as sett-cfl against that sum: Why, 21t5,000/., which would leave a dtbeit of 632,0001. He would now proceed to another subject, to which he thought it necessary to advert. The Right Hon. Gentleman was wrong in suppos'ng that the only ground of opposition to his motion would be a financial one. The price of sugar its the year 1841 was 395. 7d. per cwt. ; in 1842 it Y - aS Lltis 2d. per'lwt., sitoltitig 3 fall in the year Itlata e.s ceenpated with 1841. They had also terry reason to believe that there would be a much larger supply of sugar this year from British possessions than there had been last year, and consequently they were justified in entertaining no apprehension as to a rise in the price of sugar, but, on the contrary, in looking forward to a fall. There was one material alteration in the Right Hon. Gentleman's plan as compared with the pl n of the late Government. The Right Hon. Gentleman left a protective duty of 10s. on British colonial sugar, while the plan of last ter gave a protective duty of 12s. on sugar of an inferior description, and 18e. on superior sugar. - The Right Hon. Gentleman had thrown away an additional 6s. without saying one void. That was hardly consistent with : the general principle upon which his plan was founded. That difference of 10. s. duty, given as protection to British sugar, would be more than counterbalanced by the superior quality of the sugar sent from Cuba, upon which cheaper - labour could be bestowed, to an extent not in the power of the British producer. In fact, that protection was altogether a nominal one. The Right Ho nourable Gentleman had also presumed that great stress would be laid on the tendency of the adoption of his motion to stimulate the production of sugar by slave labour, and consequently to stimulste the slave trade ; and the Flight Hon. Gentleman said, with a frankness and sincerity that would not be doubted, that if he believed the adoption of his motion would have such an effect, he would abandon his propo sition. Now the price of sugar in the British market was 385. or 395., and the price of sugar in bond was from 19s. to 20s. If then the British market was thrown open a would it not have a tendency to the production of a larger quantity of sugar, and consequently give a stimulus to the slave trade ?—( Hear. ) With regard to the negotiations with foreign countries, the Right Hon. Gentleman said, it was better to make the change en the sugar duties fist, and then proceed with the negotia tions. But they were going on with negotiations with States who had the utmmit, reluctance on the subject, and were they to throw away the consideration for which these treaties were to be obtained? But the Right Hon. Gentleman would throw away that by which they could work on the interests of those States, and then a-k them for what they were unwilling to give. It was a material question for the consideration of the House to know the effect of this measure on the slave trade. The Hon. and Learned Member for Bath had said that interference was useless, and that they might as well interfere with the practice of domestic slavery. Was there nothing, then, obtained by the great sacrifices of this country? He re joiced that there was. The low price of sugar in the markets of Europe, had a salutary and powerful influence on the pur suit of the slave trade; which low price was produced not only by the exclusion of that sugar from the British market, but by other measures adopted on the Continent of Europe ; and par ticularly by the doubling of the duty on sugars by the German Customs Union. He would pass over the growing feeling in those c, untries themselves against the slave trade, be cause he would be only repeating what had been said by his bight Honourable Friend, the Chancellor of the Exchequer. The valuable information given by Mr. Baudinet was clear upon that point. 'I he rate of insurance on slave adventures also indicated the success af the measuses which' had been taken for the suppression of the slave trade. From the year 1817 until the conclusion of the treaty in 1835, the importation of slaves into Cuba, was 40,000 a-year. When tee treaty with Spain, establishing the right of 'search and ether severe mea- sures were passed, the imporatirin decreased. Iri 1838, the importation was 38,000; in 1839, it was 25,000; in 1840; it was reduced to 14 417. With regard to Brazil, the facts. Were still stronger. 7n 1638 the importation into Rio alone, was 47,000; and into a'l the ports it was 94,000. In 1839, the importation into Rio was '28,000 ;- into the entire country it was 16,600 In 1840, the importation into Rio was 7,000; the total amount was 14,000; making a difference of 'one -sixth in the course of two )ears.—( Hear.) He now asked the Com- mittee if these were not most important facts ; if it was riot most important they should not run the risk of stopping the course of events so satistactury to the adoption of a measure which would at once apply a stimulus of a powerfol description to the slave trade, namely, a remunerating price in the markets of Great Britain for slave-grown sugar?—( Hear, hear.) And if there was one thing more than another which would be likely to check the encouragement for the abandonment of the slave trade, it was the unfortunate influence which the knowledge that there were in that House gentlemen who would, at all h—a zards, open the British markets to their produce, must exer• cise on the people of Spain and the Brazils. He therefore acquitted the Right Hon. Gentleman of any such intention. But it was a satisfaction to look back and know that it was on such a subject the late Government were deserted in the hour of their extreme need, and it was a still greater sa tisfaction to hope that the present Parliament would, by a greater and still more d ec i sive ma j or it y t h an was o b ta ined on that occasion, maintain its determination not to pursue that course of policy marked out by the Right Hon. Gen tleman ; and in approaching the commercial consideration of the sugar duties, endeavour so to approach it as to combine the be nefit of the consumer with the more important Interests of hu manity at large.—( Cheers.) Mr. HUME said, that if the House was determined to put an end to slavery, by excluding all articles that were the pro duce of slaves, he trusted they would exclude cotton, tobacco, and other things, and if they did so, then he would believe they were in earnest ; but when Hon. Members talked of slavery abroad, without considering their population at home, be doubted their sincerity. The Hon. Gentleman who had just sat down. had had several new lights broke in upon him since lasf year. He thought they ought to direct their attention to this question as a commercial question, and to consider how far they could reduce the duty. He believed that West India pro perty was never in so bad a state as it was at present, as estates in that country had produced no profit. What was. the. cause of all this? Why keeping up improper prices. It was a noto rious fact at the present moment, that a black in the West Indies could obtain more in seven hours than an Eng lishman in sixteen. He believed that, by the course that had - been adopted, gross•injustiee was being done both to the consumer and producer.—(Hear, hear.) The course he thought ought t be adopted in fairness to .the planter was to remove restrictions, and allow him to carry his. produce to the best market. Let them free the colonies from every re striction, and the best results might be expected. He thought keeping up this enormous duty was second only to keeping up the Corn-laws. He thought th e Ri ght Honourable Gentle. man's argument with respect to the slave trade ought to be scouted altogether. He wished, instead of his turning his at tention to slaves abroad, he would do so to the slaves at home. The Right Hon: Gentleman: said th at t h e revenue could not bear the proposed reduction in the sugar duty ; but in hii 1 opinion, the revenue like every other national interest, would ultimately bee At by the alteration. The people of this .couetyy, bad riot the MeaLi 61 contributing...to the r e venue, while they - Contributed at the same time, as was the case under a system of monopoly, to enrich individuals. He believed f;at if tht Right Hon. Gentleman admitted fereigs sttgar at a dot v of 30 per cent., instead of at a duty of 50 per iieat., he would And that we should have an increased consump tion of one million cwt., and that would give a revenue of 5,500,000/. instead of 5,000,00 W., which was the present am)unt. They were proceeding on a most erroneous system— a system whi^h injured many parties, and benefited none. On these grounds he supported the proposed reduction; and in his opinion the course they should adopt was that of gradually, frnrn year to year, lowering the duty, until they had adopted to the fullest extent the principle of free trade. Mr. P. M. STEWART said that they had had three pro rosals submitted to theie consideration : —The proposal of the Governmnnt for a continuance of the present duty, the pro posal of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, the Member for Bath, for a total abolition of all duty, and the proposal of his Right Hon. Friend (Mr Labonchere), for effecting in the duty a considerable reduction. Now with regard to the proposal of the Hon. and Learned Member for Bath, he had no hesitation in saying that no man alive to the interests of our colonies could have supported such a motion. With regard to the pro• posal of his Right Hon. Friend, he admitted that in principle it was just; but he could not, under the circumstances in which our colonies ,s ere, approve of the proposed reduction of the duty. He thought that it would be unfair to expose them to a com petition with colonies producing slave-grown sugar, and not subject to any of the burdens which our own colonies had to bear. If there was any prospect of amelioration, the Government would be to blame if they did not take their stand on the principle of working out the experiment they had commenced, and of which these differential duties were the protection. In 1833, by wise, because just, interference, the country gave up the system of slave cultivation. What was the effect of the competition into which they were forced by this measure ? 'I he cost of the production of sugar had been increased. The colonies now were to be treated as integral parts of the empire ; upon these grounds he could assist in bringing this question to a settlement in a commercial shape ; but he could not look only to one side of the qu,stioa. He would enter into com petition with all the world, but he protested against going into the contest with roe hand tied up, and against those who would enjoy at once tho advantages of a free trade and slave labour. Lord J. RUSSELL said the Hon. Gentleman appeared to have argued the question without a decided opinion, both as a free nrader and a colonial proprietor. If his opinion appeared at all inconsistent, there were many others who had shown equal itconsisteney. Upon the pr esent occas i on , h e conce i ve d that the House might well eonsider whether it was not an opportunity in which the House could evince by some practical proof their wish to diminish the price of the main articles of subsistence. They had heard that this was to be the object of the great changes that were in contemplation; yet though that was the object the Government had the most nearly at heart, and the House wished to accomplish, somehow there appeared to be great difficulties in attaining it, pith respect to any of the great primare articles, of subsistence. With regard to some articles, which, to the working classes, were of the greatest importance, the tariff had already been altered so as to give some relief from taxation ; on salt, coal, and candler, and other articles, there had been a re duction, or revision, of taxation. With , respect to the great articles they were now to consider : beginning with the great nccesszry, breed, they found they could not make any great reduction in that main article of subsistence; that for it they must be independent of foreign apply, and they must consider the interest of those wh o prudes:eel forty eight millions of quarters a-year. Then they came to the great articles of cheese and butter, and here they found the revenue was so conc erne d that i t was impossible to make any recite:don of elu t ty ey up h o a n d t c h h e a m ng . ( Hear, hear.) On cattle, and on wheat, h ed tdgh and prohibitory duties for touch lower once, but then it was unfortunate that at the same time they received the un fortunate assurance, and from the same authoritv,that the'people were not lihely to derive any great advantage from a reduction in the p:ice of matt. Then in the very important article of sugar, important from the improved hebite of the people, which it was the duty of every Legislature to pre mete, he was sorry to hear that they must be cotitent with the promulgation of their wish to reduce the cost of stsbeistetiete They reduced, to an almost nominal amount, the detie.i bli s'>o dt eOO Se-ticks; which never came into the consumption of the working clasttee Irtst an the comforts of the great body of the poor, the change was of little importance. With regard to the great article, sugar, they s m i l ed a dills cults in the way. The Vice-President of the Board of Trade could not concede any reduction of duty, and the Chancellor of the Ekellvetter proposed the continuance of a prohibitory duty, contrary to all the principles announced by the Govern meta: The price of sugar, at the latter end of 1841, was 355. per era., and itt present he believed it was 38s. The price hf ferelisn sugar; with the duty, was 545. per cwt., The difference in tne dot) pmened by his Right Hon. Fries d would amount to 7s. 10d. a cwt.; which, said the Right Hon. Gentleman the Vice-President of the itostrd of Trade, would make a difference in price amounting only to ice a lb. ; but that, he would remind the Right Hon. Gentle man, as It sight spear, would make a most impo r t ant differerco in the weekly' bills er the poor man. He (Lord J. Russell), in speaking of the proposed redhetion or the sugar duties last year, had stated that one great object of the then Government in proposing the reduction, was to prevent. an iii create taking place in the price. That argument had last year bee-h treitgd by Hen: Gentlemen opposite as absurd. He (Lord John Russell), hosiCiref. thorsght it a sound one; but this year he had had the happiness to hnt the same argu -ment made use of by the Right Hon. Gtutleman at the heed of the Government respecting cattle and other articles. That had been his (Lord John Russell's) argument with respect i t t o w su a g s treldb to o t b to e f r e i e di f c ro u r ou b , t:in a T tli h o e4 h g eod perfectlywith witht sugar, re gard to cattle.---( Loud cheers.) The Right Hen s Gentleman took two grounds for refusing to assent to this motinn—the Riot was, the loss which must accrue to the revenue, which was es mated at from 600,0001. to 400,0001. ; but with respect to the tariff generally it should be recollected that they were considering how they tottld eaerifice one portion of their revenue for the benefit of the people. The Right Hon. Gentleman said that there was a deficiencey in the revenue amounting to two millions and a half. He proposed to lay on additional taus lion to the amount of 4,300,000 U; and he stated that the diffe reties., would enable him to lessen those duties which pressed in the most burdensome Manner upon the people, and that he proposed to do so in the manner the. most likely to reduce the cost of subsistence generally throughout the country. If that was the Government plan, there was nothing In which a por tion of the revenue could more usefully be sacrificed thin sugar. Other articles on which it was proposed to make a sacrifice of revenue, were not of nearly the neces sity that this article of sugar was of; and throughout the. Whole range of the Customs duties no reduction could be proposed which would be of greater benefit to the Foyle of this country than the reduction which his Right Hon. Friend had proposed. In a petition presented from the coffee-house keepers of London last year, it was stated that twenty-five years ago there were not ten coffee-houses, properly so called, London, but that now there were 1,800. Surely it was im portant to the morals of the people to encourage them to use a refreshing beverage of this nature in preference to having re course to inebriating liquors, and surely a high cost of sugar tended to prevent the encouragement of these moral habits so conducive to the welfare of the people of the United Kirgdom —( Cheers.) Then with regard to the argument respecting the slave trade; if it were proposed to prohibit the importa tion of all articles the produce of slave labour he could un derstand the argument; nay, if they were to take lower ground, and to say we will not lower the duties on any fresh 1 , articles of slave produce, there might be some force in the argument. But he found that the duty now payable on Brazilian coffee was 15d., and that duty it was proposed to reduce to B d.—(Cheers.) This reduction was to be made on behalf of slave-grown coffee—(Lorid cheers)—so that that which with respect to coffee was per fectly harmless, was, with respect to sugar, an encourage ment of the slave trade.—(Load cheers.) Then, again, it was proposed to lower ,the duty on American copper. Why, the American copper mines were worked entirely by slaves ( Cheers and laughter)—and the slavery in the copper mines was more horrible than that of any other.—(Cheers.) What became of their virtuous indignation then ?—( Loud cheers. ) It was doubtless desirable to put an end to the high restrictive duties on copper, but if they compared the at ticles of copper and sugar together, he thought it must be admitted that the welfare of the people of this country would be infi nitely more promoted by a reduction of the duty on sugar than by any supply of copper that could ever come from abroad. —(Loud cheers.) He could not understand this argument about the slave trade. The Right Hon. Gentleman said, the slave trade was decreasing, but that was in consequence of efforts of a totally different description. That decrease had been brought about by sending cruisers to the coast of Africa, and by treaties entered into with other powers for the sup pression of the slave trade ; and he doubted not but that, by a continuance of such efforts, the slave trade would be utterly abolished. He could not see the advantage to be derived from keeping up the prohibition against the importation of foreign sugar, while other articles, the produce of slave labour, were admitted ; and he trusted that, on that occasion, the House wou:d endeavour to carry into effect the principle laid down by the Government, that as the Income-tax had been imposed upon the people, something would be done by the re moval of prohibitions to reduce the cost of living. The inflic tion of the Income-tax was certain ; he feared that the reduce tiou in the cost of the articles of living would prove delusive. There could be no doubt as to the heaviness of the impost, but the disaprintment would ;:e great, when it should be found that the promises of relief which had been held out had not been fulfilled.—( Loud cheers.) Mr. ROEBUCK supposed that the Noble Lord when he spoke of the necessities of the people, and said that unfortu nately they were unable to lower the price of the poor man's bread, thought, while he was casting a slur on his opponents, to claim to himself the credit of being a person who would diminish that price. That asser tion he (Mr. R.) tetally denied. The Noble Lord teemed to take pleasure in recounting the difficulties by which the Right Hon. Gentleman was surrounded. No doubt the Right lion. Gentleman was surrounded with difficulties, and ere this he must have felt the working ,of his own iilustration, " that every man had his herring. —( Hear, hear.) The "herring" of the Hon. Gentleman who had spoken before the Noble Lord was colonial protection, and if he (Mr .12. ) had not checked him by an unfortunate cheer, the lion. Gentleman would have gone on to demand the re-estahlishment of slavery, preparatory to applying the doctrine of free trade to the colonies. Did the lion. Gentleman mean to say that the present re strictions upon the colonies in the Vt est Indies crippled the \Vest Indian produce, and that in consequence they were unable to compete with the other portions of the colonies? Because if it was not, it was nothing ; and if it was, he ( Mr. Roebuck) was quite prepared to say that if he brough a motion forward to-morrow, he would be the first to vote with him. Let him try it.—(CheerS and laughter. ) But he was the last man to propose it.—( Cheers.) If it was not, that what did it mean? The Right lion. Gentleman came down to the House bound up in the West Indian colonies, and he said that they had crippled their right arm. He said put them on a free trade principle; make us equal with those parties with whom we have to compete, the parties with whom we have t o corn .. vote being users of slave-labour. What was the meaning of this proposition, but to restore slavery in the West Indie s ?— (" Oh, oh.") It was all very well t o cr y , " Oh, oh;" that was the meaning of the proposition. It itdid not mean that, wh at did it mean ? The West India proprie tors said it was of so much importance to this country, that they m ust tax the lalo cur . nig classes for whom the Noble Lord t elt such a wond er f u l degree of sympathy and affection, that they were to tax the labOuring classes of this country between 2,000,0001. and 3,000,0001. per annum, for the benefit of the West Indi a pro prietors: . Now to come to the way in which the Ri ght Hon. Gentleman dealt with the question. They did not w i sh to give all the glory to the other side.—(Cheers.) Therefor e , they said, as the opposite party had a stalking horse, they would have theirs, and that should be sugar.—( Cheers a n d l aughter.) They (the Ministerialist.s) had given the agricultural classes protection in corn, and they' (the Opposi tion) raid, they wo u ld not have a free trade tocorn at all, but in one of those mystifications ; vco , co were shown by gentlemen on that side of the House th ey Proposed an t. 4.5. duty.—( Cheers. ) Why, this was an illusion on the part of the Right Hon. Baronet. There would be no dimi nution in the price of bread, and, therefore, it wa s ill usory. The Right Hon. B arone t sa id 'f a i r ly he was for p rotection to to the agriculturists. He (MI. Roebuck) quarrelled with him on that. lie said he was for protection to agriculture, and he proposed it to the shape of a sliding scale. What said they on that side. They wanted to avoid protection, and, therefore, they would propose an Si. duty. This was the first ; then came the second, precisely of the same description. He (Mr. Roc. buck) proposed, not many hours before. the equalization of the duty on sugar, and wh o oppose d Li la ? Why, th e gentlemen on his sidethe House.`l ttev sa id t h e y were for protection ; they werefor keeping out the foreign sugar; they did net want competition, but they wanted something on that side of the Howe; and so the Right Host. Gentleman' and the Noble Lord came with something to go to the country with. They said they wished a di scr i m in a ti ng d u ty o f 10 s. Thi s was. very like the duty on corn.—( Cheers. ) Now let them see the consequence. At present there was a duty of 633. upon foreign sugar, and 245. on colonial sugar, which was a difference in favour of our own colonies of 395. Now the Right Hon. Gentlemen proposed a duty of 30s. on foreign sugar and 20s. on colonial sugaa ; making, thereby, a difference of 10s. Now this was the question he wanted answered, would the difference in the duty of 10s. keep out the foreign su g ar? If it would not, would it not put out of the market the colonial sugar ? ( No, no.) No; why that was a kind of hocus pocus.— ( Cheers and laughter.) In the case of foreign sugar he took the figures of the Noble Lord, the price was 21s. He would take it from the colonies at 395. and the 20s. duty would make 395. ; but 21s. to 30s. duty made 515. So that there would be a difference in price of. foreign sugar and colonial sugar of Bs. Was that protection to the colonial interest ? It was or it was not. If it as to keep out foreign sugar it would be no protec tion to the colonial interest. He wanted to know how they could get out of that. Now his proposal was 245. to be paid, so that 21s. and 245. would snake 455.; and 395. and 245.-635., and the difference between foreign and colonial sugar would be 18s., so the whole of the great discussion was upon that point that there should be some distinction between colonial and foreign sugar, and by a kind of mystification, they wanted that the country should be benefited by cheap sugar, and the colonies to get advantage from protection. Now, this was a fallacy. It was either one thing or the other. It was either protection or no protection. If it was protection, they had dear sugar ; if no protection, it was at the expense of the co lonies. fie did not like to mince matters, but he was alto gether against the colonial system. It was a system by which the people of England were taxed. The Noble Lord was there to quarrel with the proposal which he (Mr. R.) had made. Now he had something to say to the Right Mon. Gentleman the Vice-President of the Board of Trade, who would not ans wer his proposition, though he did answer the proposition of the. Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. :Macaulay). He could reply to the Right Hon. Gentleman's proposal by saying, that danger to the revenue would be incurred by its adoption; but no such , objection could apply to his ( Mr. Roebuck's) plan. Instead of doing that, indeed, it would add to the revenue; it would in crew the comforts of the community, and would be of great general advantage; and that the Right Hon. Gentleman did not deny. Though the Bight Hon. Gentleman did not reply to his (Mr. Roebuck's )proposition, he said it could be answered, and he supposed the answer would be that it would give them some excuse for levying from the people of England 3 or 4,000,000/. of money, when the same advantage could be done to the revenue by another plan, with no harm to any individual except those called the West Indian interests—the in terest of a set of barren islands, for which they had dearly paid, and which they only maintained at the expense of the breath and blood of this country. Where did England derive one single advantage from this interest? Jamaica, to the butt m of the sea, and all the Antilles after it !—( A laugh.) He wanted the representatives of the West Riding of Yorkshire to say what advantage had been received by England in the manufacturing or agri cultural interests from the West Indies. What benefit did the poor weavers of Lancashire receive in return for paying dear for their sugar? He knew they had fought for those islands, had conquered them, had lost much money, more blood, and gained much misery. He wanted know the advantage, he wished to grapple the difficulty there', at its head and front. Let no one go away impressed with a notion that he did anything else but vote away the strength, the health, and the happiness of this country, when he voted fur the differential duty. Yes, he would he making the boor man—he would use the Noble Lord's own expres sion—pay clearly in his weekly bill, pay dear for that food which lie earned with the sweat of his brow, from the rising of the sun to hip going down, nay, sometimes many hours before the rising of that great luminary, and many hours after Isis setting. He wished he could see the Hon. Mem ber for Knareshorough, who was usually so eloquent a (Wender of the people of this country in his place ; he wished he would go to his friends and ask them what be nefit the weaver.; of West Yorkshire would derive from the West. Indian gentry; he would ask of the House, he would ask of the Right Iron. Baronet, to give them something more in the shape of argument, than the flimsy thing with which the Chancellor of the Exchequer commenced his statement—viz., that he was about to commence means for putting down the slave trade, tit an expense of 4,000,000/. per annum, which was to be drawn, be it observed, from the pockets of the poor, not from the rich, for theirs would be but a drop in the mighty ocean. For the shadow of the Quixotic hope of putting down the slave trade, they were now about to tax the poor of , this country to their very life's blood.---( Hear. ) Mr. P. STEWART rose to explain, and said that what he stated gas, that he was a free trailer, and a condemner of me nopolies.—( Oh, oh The Hon. Gentleman misrepresented him in another part ; he said that he stated that he was for the reatoirttion of slavery by the British nation. Why, he argued in a mannte directly the reverse. There never was a more un founded statement than that made against him by the Hon. and Learned Member for ilatl, Mr. BERNAL said that before they came to a division he hr would say a few words on the subject. To sit there for hours together and hear certain documents read, certain state ments mad d, certain modes of argument advanced, to hear all that with meekness showed more of the stupidity of an irrational being than the patience of a rational one. But the Hon. and Learned Member for Bath (Mr. Roebuck) was a philosopher, :fn.! hated mystification and circumlocution, and he (Mr. Bernal), too, was an enemy to circumlocution, and hated mys tification, and he wished to enter the lists of plain dealing. His Hon. ani Learned Frlend started with one argument, which he (Mr. Bernal) was not able to meet. He said perish Jamaica ; drown the Antilles ; ruin your colonies. But that (IA not convince him (Mr. B.) as to the inutility of those colo nies. Be would say, long flourish Jamaica and the Antilles, and long flourish Great Britain. The well-being of the mother country was bound up with the prosperity of those dependen cies, as it was with that of the counties of York or Durham. When an [lon. Member who sat behiud him, but whom he did not now see in his place, had spoken to-night of the expenses of Jamaica, did not the lion. Gentleman know that Jamaica raised taxes—that it had its poll-taxes, its parochial taxes, and that out of those taxes the :salaries of officers employed under Government were paid ? It was said the expenses of re giments in the colonies were paid by the mother country—why was not the expense of regiments in Scotland paid by the mother country ? He heard it said that Ja maica paid taxes. Why, so did Scotland. What were Jamaica and Darbadoes ? Why, were not the prosperity and glory of England founded upon her flourishing navigation and commerce, her extensive marine? His Hon. Friend (Mr. P. Stewart) had risen to defend himself, but he did not require it. What his Hon. Friend had said was, that a most sanatory and important measure had been passed—the negro emanci pation, and that it threw cur West India colonies into a most singular situation ; that they were not prepared for so sudden a step; that every thing had been unhinged; the system of agricultural labour completely overthrown ; and that at the I present moment there was not a sufficiency of labour for the land. In the West Indies the labourers were independent of the landed proprietors. They required but little for their wants, and in a tropical soil two or three hours a day were quite sufficient for the cultivation of land for the production of provisions. They possessed land to which they had a prescriptive right, and from which he would y not be answerable for the consequence of their ejectment ; and he would like to know what la bourer would work without the necessity for so doing"? He was sorry to say, that the price of sugar was much exagge rated in the printed statements. British Colonial sugar might be bought now, duty included, at about 60s or 61s. in London. He had as much feeling as any person for the situation of his fellow sufferers, but when he heard that three farthings reduc tion in the price of sugar would contribute to the relief of the artisan of Birmingham er Manchester, he could not sit down with common patience and submit to be classed with those who wished to oppress his fellow countrymen. A reduction of 3d. or 4d. might be a telief to them, but he would tell Hon. Gentle men, that though they initaht get sugar from Cuba and Florida arid the Brazils. they never tseuld have a reduction of 3d. or 4d. in the pound. When the Nor:, Member for Bath talked of this beam, a boon to the West India interest, he forgot the East Indies altogether, for he should know the duties were equalized, and that the East Indian interest would be equally benefited with the West Indies. He did not vote on the motion of the lion. Member for Bath, because he was an in terested party, and he would adopt the same course on the present motion.—( Loud cries of " Divide, divide.") Sir R. PEEL said he could not. waive his privilege of rising, because it was evident if this debate were allowed to go on between the party opposite, there would be a degree of pique anti asperity it would not be right should proceed.—(Much laughter.) It would therefore be necessary for him to inter pose between the. Hon. Gentlemen,—( Laughter.) It would Ise requisite.to throw oil on the troubled waters.—( Laughter. ) But he hoped the HOuse would come to this practical conclusion, that by far the safest course they could adopt was, to vote for the proposition of her Majesty's Government, and to leave those other propositions in the hands of the Honourable Gentlemen opposite—(Loud laughter)—for it was evident the adoption of either of the rival propositions would produce no satisfaction whatever. —( Laughter.) He :lid not speak against the motion for the [ion. Member for Bath, but he voted against it. The Hon. and Learned Gentleman said it would be entirelyin different, if Jamaica was merged in the sea, and if the Antilles f ollowed. These were the principles by which he would convert the /louse. But he (Sir Robert Peel) thought that calm reasoning was hardly necessary to confute them. The Ron. Member for .Montrose wished to maintain these colonies, and all his object was, that:each colony should maintain itself.—(Laughter, and cheers.) Yes, but he (Sir Robert Peel) apprehended his proposition to admit those colonies to unlimited competition with slate colonies, was riot the way to effect that object. He would now ask, would this he any advantage to the artisan of Lancashire or Yorkshire ? Was he to go to a distressed weaver of Yorkshire and to ask him what so as to be got from Jamaica ; and if he gave hire an unsatisfactory answer, was he to ask the same question with respect to this country; and, upon such grounds, was he to state that he was prepared to dissolve the Whole com:ection with this country and the colonies?—(Hear, hear.) If that was the course the Hon. Gentleman was prepared to pursue, they must resolve their powers into their own shores, and try what England could do against the world.—( Hear, hear.) He would ask the House whether the Government was not intitled to demand its confidence with respect to this proposal.— (Hear, hear.) The proposal was, that for another year year the annual vote on the Sugar Duties should be granted. That was the proposition on which the House was called upon to decide. He would ask had the Government taken a course with respect to the amendment of the tariff, which disentitled it to the consideration of the House ?—( Hear, hear.) He would venture to say that the weakest of all interests in that House in political votes was the West Indian interest.—(Hear, hear.) It might in an unreformed Parliament have been powerful ; but, looking at it in its present state, he thought it would be a most unwise step to create enemies in England for the purpose of supporting the West India in terest. The Noble Lord opposite had taunted him with re spect to the course the Government had pursued ; now, he had been ten years in office, and he had never proposed any alteration in the tariff ; he had never proposed to alter the . duty on the importation of foreign cattle. What, however, had been the course pursued by the present Ministry. They had done all they could to give a facility to the impor'ation of foreign cattle. When the Noble Lord talked of the fear of offending powerful interests, he would ask, had he net run as great a risk as Minister ever ran, when he saw a hundred Members prepared to vote against him, and yet was deter mined to proceed ? The Noble Lord had put forth a propo sition entirely different from last year, and he, therefore, could not blame them for opposing a proposition which he now opposed himself. lie could not agree with the Hon. Gen tleman who had spoken, that the reductions he had adverted to would be disregarded; he went upon a different principle, consi dering that the increase of small savings was a great good. But he was not prepared upon that ground to incur a risk of a loss to the revenue of 600,0001. He had been told that the Income-tax would be more productive than he anticipated, and that, therefore, they should diminish the duty upon a commo dity which entered so much into the consumption of every class as sugar. Now if he had yielded to the argument in each par ticular case which might be urged, he would venture to say that at the end of next year, notwithstanding the Income-tax, he would have a deficit in the revenue amounting to 2,000,0001. No doubt it would be a great advantage to re duce the duty upon wool, or upon cotton, or upon various other articles; but it was impossible that a Minister of the Crown could recommend extensive re ductions in each of those articles. Again, he would venture to say that they could not confer a greater benefit upon the people of this country than by reducing the duty on the manufacture of glass; but the public exigencies did not admit of that re. diction. lie could not now consent to sanction a measure which would had to a reduction of 600,0001. a-year in the sugar duties, for the purpose even of gaining the benefit, which he admitted to be a considerable one, of a reduction of three farthings per pound in the price of that article. On that ground. therefore, he could nut accede to the proposal of the Right Hon. Gentleman. But he should also say that they could not properly consider the question without also takin-g into con ideration the effects of the contemplated changes upon the West Indian interest.—( Hear, hear.) Ile doubted whether the West India colonies, in which slavery had been been abolished, could at present compete with coun tries its which slavery existed. That was also the opinion of Mr. Deacon Hume, a man who carried the principles of free trade as far as any man could carry them. But Mr. flume was of opinion that, in considering the competition between the colonies in which slavery was abolished and those in which slavery still prevailed, they could not apply the principles of free trade. Mr. D. Hume stated his opinion upon the subject as follows:—" I cannot conceive, having thirty years ago abolished the slave trade, and having now abolished slavery, that any question of free trade could arise between Jamaica and Cuba ; Cuba, with abundance of fresh and rich soil, not only having the advantage of employing slaves, whatever that may be, but notoriously importing the enormous amount of 40,000 or 50,000 every year; having, in fact, the slave trade and slavery, and as the law of this country had deprived the planters of Jamaica of that advantage, I consider that is a question that is taken entirely out of the category of free trade." That was the opinion of Mr. Hume, placed by him deliberately on record. Now was there any pressure at the present moment upon the consumer, in respect to the price of that article, which compelled them to proceed immediately to reduce the duty ? He found th a t in 1840 the a verage p r i ce o f sugar was 495. Id. ; in 1841 the average price was 395. Id : while the price during the last month was only 375. Now, let it be remembered that there had been an increase of consumption during the last year, as well as a reduction of the price. There hatl been a greater consumption of sugar during the last year, absolutely and without reference to the population, than there had ever been before. Theconsumption had amounted during the sear to 4,000,000 cwt. The main ground, however, upon which he opposed the motion of the Rigbt Hon. Gentleman was that on which he had grounded his opposition to a similar motion last year—namely, that he did not believe that it would be for the honour or the character of the country. He thought that they should not open the markets of this country to the pro. duce of slave holding colonies, without insisting on receiving from them some concession in favour of the slaves, or an equivalent. What was our position with respect to that great country, with which we stood in such important relations—he meant France ? They had recently beheld France refusing to ratify a treaty which had been signed by her, on the subject of the slave trade. Impu. tetions had been cast upon the character, the honour, and the disinterestedness of this country in respect to its pro• ceedings relative to the stave trade; and be said it was of great importance that they should not lightly take any step which would abate the confidence of the world in the disinterested ness of their motives.—(Hear, hear.) This country had held out a great example; and there was a growing conviction among slave holding countries that slavery was accompanied with great dangers. In Cuba, in the United States, and in the Brazils, there was a fer ment in the public mind in respect to slavery —not merely with respect to the slave tratte, but in respect to slavery itself; some front humane and benevolent motives, some from interested fears, were anxiously looking to the great example which this country had set. It was impossible to see the difference of feeling that ex isted between the Northern and Southern States of Assetica, with out perceiving that slavery stood on a very precarious footing; and the same feeling had extended to Cuba and Brazil. He read an extract from a letter from a naval officer in Cuba, showing that there was an indisposition to engage in the importation of slaves, from an impression that the system would cease at no distant day, and consequently to increase the importation of slaves was only adding to the risk and embarrassment of that time when it came. If this feeling had penetrated to Cuba, was it not likely that it would prevail still more powerfully among the enlightened people of the United States In all negotiations on this question, conces sions should be mutual ; this was the principle acted on with regard to Texas and France ; and concessions front slave-holding countries on the subject of slavery ought to be simultaneous with any concessions of duty on our part. There were circumstances connected with the cultivation of sugar that did not apply to other articles, such as tobacco and cotton, the cultivation of the sugar plant being eminently destructive of human life. He believed that, to admit the sugar of Brazil without any stipulation for the welfare of the negroes, would detract from the character of the country, and its power and influence in foreign nations. A cortlict was going on in those countries; and while they main_ tained their present position—while they could repel, by their acts, the imputation, that in voting the twenty millions for extinguish ing slavery in their own colonies, they had been Ictuated by other than pure and disinterested motives, they should be able to speak to those countries with authority. But if, while no great pres sure existed, they relaxed the duty in favour of the sugar growers of Cuba awl Brazil, their present influence would be materially abated, and they would be unable to make those exertions in favour of the continued progress of this great cause, on the c.mti nuatice of which exertions the ultimate extinction of slavery must materially depend.—(Cheers.) Lord JOHN RUSSELL could not suffer the debate to close without alluding to one observation which had fallen from the Right Hon. Gentleman. The Right Hon. Gentleman had stated that during the ten years that the late Government had been in office, they had never proposed to remove the prohibition on the importation of cattle. Now, with respect to those ten years, he had no reason to take blame to the Government of which he was a Member tbr any neglect, for he doubted if in the course of any ten consecutive years, so many important measures had been proposed and carried.—(lmmense cheering and counter cheering.) With respect to questions of free trade, he begged to observe, that he thought it was at all times in thepowerofan Opposition, although not by any means strong in the House, by aiding protected interests, to prevent the carrying out of such measures—at least, he bad I found such to be the case from experience. It was not difficult to frame some motion by which, without giving expression to prin. cip!es opposed to those free trade principles which were professed by the Right Hon. Baronet and the Right Hon. Gentleman the Vice-President of the lioard of 'grade, free trade measures might be effectually prevented from interfering with protected rights.— (Cheers.) Lord Althorn had found that to be the case in 1831, when he proposed a diminution of the differential duties on tim. ber.—(Loud cheers.) The principle of that motion had not been impugned, but yet a motion had been proposed and carried which effectually prevented Lord Althorp from carrying the principle into effect.—(Cries of " Hear, hear.") Some years afterwards a motion had been brought forward on the subject of this very question of sugar, proposing a diminution of the pro. hibitory duty. A mode w. - )s found of opposing the proposition of a re.olutioir founded on this very question of slavery. Such being the result of their experiment in two instances, he thought they were justified in having recourse to other measures of great impor • lance, in which the Opposition could not form a coalition with pro. tected interests.—(Cheers.) When the Right Hon. Gentleman re ferred to the risks which he had run, he t Lord John Russell) would ask him if he had been met with a similar opposition.— ( Hear, hear, and cheers.) 'WWI respect to this very question of cattle, one Honourable Gentleman had proposed that the payment of the duty should take place by weight instead of by head. For his (Lord J. Russell's) past, he had no preference of one mode of payment over the other. To the one proposition in itself he could accede as readily as to the other. But the proposition of the Government was brought forward for the purpose of doing away with prohibition, and admitting cattle at a moderate duty, and be cause the other proposition to take the duty by weight had been brought forward with the intention of raising the duty, without any obligation to support the one measure in preference to theother, but because he thought the Right Hon. Gentleman vv•as proceeding upon a right principle, lie (Lord. J. Russell) and those with whom he generally acted, had given him their support.—(Cheers.) If they had pursued another line of conduct, and voted against the Government, the majority of the Right Hon. Gentleman would not have been a large one; and if all who sat on that side of the House had taken the same line, the Right Hon. Gentleman would have been in a minority.—(Cheers.) But instead of that they had given their support to the Government, because they considered they were carrying out free trade principles. On that point it was a subject of congratulation that the Right Hot). Gentleman was in power, for he thought that if the late Government had brought forward a similar proposition for the admission of cattle, they would have been defeated.—(Cheers.) Whereas, acting as an Op_ position, they had had the pleasure of enabling the Right Hon. Gentleman to carry it.—(Loud cheering.) Colonel SIBTHORP, amid loud cries of " Divide, divide," which rendered him frequently inaudible, denied that the late Go. moment had ever brought forward any one good measure. Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, and the Committee divided— For the Amendment Against it '245 Majority against the Amendment . PARISH CONSTABLE'S BILL. tilt J AMES GRAHAM said that as many alterations were pro. posed to he made in this Bill, he proposed to refer, it to a Com mittee up stain:. Th Tithe Commutation Bill went throtlgh Committee, pro forma. PUBLIC HOUSES BILL. After a short discussion this Bill w•as reported. COPYRIGHT REGISTRATION BILL. This Bill was ordered to be committed on Wednesday next. BUSINESS FOR MONDAY. In answer to a question from Mr. lIUME, Sir li. PEEL said it was his intention in the early part of the evening of Monday next to proceed with his Bill for the prevention of bribery, and afterwards to proceed with the tariff: The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the House adjourned at a Quarter to Two o'Clock,till Monday next. FROM LAST NIGHT',LttpAZETTE. ST. JAMES'S-PALACE, "Sums 1, 1842. The Queen was this day pleased to confer the honour of Knighthood upon George Hayter, Esq., Member of the Aca demies of Rome, Florence, Bologna, Parma, and Venice, Painter of History and Portraits, and Principal Painter in Ordinary to her Majesty. The queen was also this day pleased to confer the honour of Knighthood upon William Charles Ross, Esq., A.R.A., Minia ture Painter to her Majesty. The Queen was also this day pleased to confer the honour of Knighthood upon William Allan, Esq., President of the Royal Academy of Scotland, and her Majesty's Limner for Scotland. The Queen was also this day pleased to confer the honour of Knighthood upon Henry Rowley Bishop, of Albion-street, Hyde-park, Esq. WAR-OFFICE, JUNE 3, 1842. sth Regiment of Dragoon Guards—Cornet G. R. Hamilton to be Lieutenant by purchase, vice Cowley, who retires ; Sir W. H. Don, Bart., to be Cornet, by purchase, vice Hamilton, June 3. _ 6th Regiment of Dragoons—Lieut. R. M. Peel, from the Rifle Brigade, to be Lieut. by purchase, vice Cathrey, who retires, June 3. 11th Regt. of Light Dragoons—Lieut. F. Sutton to be Cap tain, by purchase, vice Vivian, who retires ; Cornet M. C. B. Cave to be Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Sutton ; W. S. Sander, Gent. to be Cornet, by purchase, vice Cave, Ju ne 3. 16th Regt. of Light Dragoons—Cornet J. R. O'Conor to be Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Codrington, who retires : J. A. Mayne, Gent. to be Cornet, by purchase, vice O'Conor, June 3. sth Foot—W. K. Gretton, Gent., to be Second Lieutenant, by purchase, rice Sutton, promoted in 7th Foot, June 3. 7th Foot —Capt. L. W. Yea to be Major, by purchase, vice Sir W. P. Gallwey, who retires ; Lieut. Lord J. Butler to be Captain, by purchase, vivo Yea ; Second Lieut. F. Sutton, from sth Foot, to be Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Lord J. But ler, June 3. 17th Foot—Assistant-Surgeon A. Smith, from the 31th Foot, to be Assistant-Surgeon, vice Fraser, who exchanges, June 3. 23d Foot—G. Philipps, Gent., to be Second Lieutenant, without purchase, vice Raitt, whose appointment has been can gelled, Juno 3. 27th Foot—Captain R. Ellis, from half-pay, 18th Light Dragoons, to be Captain, vice Brevet Major W. Amsinck, who exchanges ; Lieut. H. D. Cholmeley to be Captain, by pur chase, vice Ellis, who retires ; Ensign 11. R. M. Prior to be Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Cholmeley ; 13. Noble, Gent. to be Ensign, by purchase, vice Prior. June 3. 34th Foot—Assistant-Surgeon R. W. Fraser, M.D., from the 17th Foot, to be Assistant -Surgeon, vice Smith, who ex changes, June 3. 42d Foot—Captain 11. Wainwright, from half-pay Unat tached, to be Captain, vice Brevet Major G. Montagu, who exchanges, receiving the difference; Lieut. H. M. Drummond to be Captain, by purchase, vice Wainwright, who retires; Ensign A. Ramsay to be Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Drum mond ; Gentleman Cadet S. D. Abercromby, from the Royal Military College, to be Ensign, by purchase, vice Ra msay , June 3. 4.5 th Fent—W. E. D. Deacon, Gent., to be Ensign, with out purchase, via Yrice, whose appintment bas been can. celled, June 3. 46th Foot—Capt. E. C. Thompson, from half-pay Una tached, to be Captain, vice Joseph Davies, who exchanges June 3. 75th Foot—Cast. E. Hickey, from the 86th Foot, to be Captain, vice Lucas, who exchanges, June 3. t46th Foot—Capt. W. Lucas, from the 75th Foot, to - be Captain, vice Hickey, who exchanges, June 3. 90th Foot—C. Dowson, Gent., to be Ensign, without 'pur chase, vice Morley, promoted in the 40th Foot, June 3. 95th Foot—Ensign H. J. Baines to be Lieutenant, by pur chase, vice Godby, who retires; .1. G. Eddington, Gent., to be Ensign, by purchase, vice Baines, June 3. 99th Foot—Staff-Surgeon of the Second Class A. West, M.D., to be Surgeon, vice W. Williams, who retires upon half-pay, June 3. Rifle Brigade—Second Lieutenant C. J. Woodford to be First Lieutenant, by purchase, vice Peel, appointed to the 6th Dragoons ; R. D'Arcv Thoroton Hildyard, Gent. to be Second Lieutenant, by purchilse, vice Woodford, June 3. Hosrerni, STATF—Assistant-Surgeon T. Beavan, from the 7th Light Dragoons, to be Staff-Surgeon of the Second Class, vice Anglin, deceased, June 3. 131 (EVET — Captain R. Ellis, of the 27th Foot, to be Major iu the Army, J u ly 22, 1830; Captain H. Wainwright, of the 42d Foot, to be Major in the Army, Nov. 23, 1841. MEMORANDA. 1 tie commission of Mr. W. Young, as Deputy Assistant Commissary General, dated 24th December, 1841, has been cancelled. The name of the Colour Sergeant, who was appointed, in the Gazette of the 27th May, 1842, an Ensign in the 41st Regi ment of Foot, without purchase, is Thomas Horan, and not Thomas Floram. The names and title of the Captain and Lieutenant-Colonel. of the Ist or Grenadier Regiment of Foot Guards, whose com mission is dated 28th September, 1830, are Sir J. 0. Hony mass, Bart. The date of the commission of Lieut. Medwin R. Pilfold, in the 2d Foot, to be 12th May, 183 S, Army rank to remain as at present, viz., 16th March, 1834. The Christian names of Ensign Fethebriclge, of the 20th Foot, are Thomas John Oliver Jermyn. The Christian names of Ensign INcamc, of the 47th Rot, are Charles Covell. OFFICE OF ORDNANCE, MAY 31. • • Ordnance Medical Department.—Temporary Assistant—Sur geon 11. Bri , coe to be Assistant-Surgeon, May 27. DECLARATION OF INSOLVEICY. THOMAS LONG, coal merchant, Beaufort-place, Chel%ea. BANKRUPTS. PETER ANDERSON HEPBURN, wine.merchaa Powis-place, Hampstead-road, to surrender June 10, at twt*. and July 15, at twelve, at the Court of Bankruptcy. Lack ington, Colersian.street-buildtngs, official assignee ; Frond„ Essex-street, Strand. T 11011 AS QUAIFE, THOMAS JONES TYRRELL. and JAMES QUAIFE, brewers, North-end, Fulham, June 10, at one, ar.d July 13, at eleven, at the Court of Bankruptcy. Johnson, Basinghall-street, official assignee; Fyson, Curling and White, Frederick's-place, Old Jewry. WILLIAM CHAP.PELOW, bridle cutter, Long-acre., June 17, and June 15, at one, at the Court of Bankruptcy. Whitmore, official assignee, Basinghall-street ; Hornidge, Bloomsbury-square. CHARLES SAMUEL HEYWOOD and WILLIAM HEYWOOD, warehousemen, Manchester, June 15 and July 13, at ten, at the Commissioners'-rooms, Manchester. Reed and Shaw, Friday-street, Cheapside, Lo n d on ; S a l e an d Worth ington, Manchester. GEORGE WILLIAM LONGRIDGE, ironmonger, Sun deiland, July 7 and 15, at eleven, at the George Inn, Sunder land. Loveland, Symond's Inn, Chancery-lane, London ; Cooper, Sunderland. WILLIAM HARPER, merchant, Cowper's•court, Corn hill, June 10, at two, and July 15, at eleven, at :the Court of Bankruptcy. Groom, official assignee, Abchurch-lane, Lom bard -street; Kirkman, King William-street, London-bridge. GEORGE BOWER, woollen cloth manufacturer, Wooldale, Yorkshire, June 11, at ten, and July 15, at two. at the George. Hotel, Huddersfield. Corlithwaite, Dean's -court, Doctors'commons, London ; Cornthwaite, Cable -street, Liverpool. JOHN BAINBRIDGE, ironfounder, Richmond, York shire, June 24, at three, and July IS, at ten, at the Golden Lion Inn, Northallerton. Addison, Mecklenburgh-square. London; Hunton, Richmond, Yorkshire. HENRY WILLIAM JACKSON, wine-merchant, Haver hill, Essex, June 17, at four, arid July 12, at two, at the Rosa ond Crown Inn, Saffron Walden. Holmes, Liverpool-stieet, London ; Jardine, Stoke next Clare, Suffolk. EDMUND ASHWORTH, innkeeper, Manchester, June and July 13, at eleven, at the Commissioners'-rooms, Man chester. Adlington, Gregory, Faulkner, and Follett, Bed ford-row, London; and Chew, Manchester. JOHN NOTTINGHAM, picture dealer, Cheltc&harn, June 13 and July 15, at eleven, at the Royal Hotel, Chelten ham. Bey, Blunt, Johnstor.e, and Walton, I.otlibury, London; Bubb, Lingwood, and Bubh, Cheltenham. JOHN GOODER, fancy cloth manufacturer, Halifax, Yorkshire, June 14, at eleven, and July 15, at twelve, at the George Hotel, Huddersfield. Clarke and Medealf, Lincoln's Inn-fields, London ; Whitehead and Robinson, Huddersfield. , WILLIAM WALKEN, mercer and draper, Burton-upon- Trent, Strffordishire, June 17, and July 15, at twelve, at the White Hart Inn, Burton-upon-Trent. Drewry, Burton-upon- Trent ; Bicknell, Roberts, Finch, and Neate, Lincoln's Inn fields, London. SCOTCH SEQUESTRATIONS. JOHN BLACK. merchant, Aberdeen, June 8 and 30, at twelve, at the Royal Hotel, Aberdeen. A. G. BAXTER and J. BAXTER, saddled, Glasgow, June 9 and 30, at twelve, at the Chambers of J. Ritchie, Glasgow. PRICE OF SUGAR. The Average Price of Brown or Muscovado Sugar, computed from the Itcturns made in the Week ending May 31, 1842, is 375. lid. per Cwt., exclusive of the Duties of Customs paid or payable thereon, on the imi ortat ion thereof into Great Britain' POLICE INTELLIGENCE. MARLBOROUGH-STREET. Mary Ann Baher, a ycung woman of interesting appearance, was placed at the bar, charged with uttering a counterfeit crown-piece. A shopman in kbe employ of Messrs. Stephenson and Allen, of No. 144, Regent-street, silk-mercers, hosiers, &a., stated that between fire and six o'clock on Thursday afternoon the prisoner entered the shop, and having selected a pair of stockings of the basest price they had, tendered in pay ment a crown-pie, c, which the witness immediately detected to be a bad one, and recollecting the prisoner to be the pet , son who had passed a counterfeit shilling to him about sax wecks ago, he untamed her, and gave her into the charge of the police. The prisoner strongly protested that at the time she offered the money she was ignorant of its being spurious. Respecting the shilling the witness must be mistaken as to her identity. The w itness said he was quite positive on that point. Inspector Plume, of the C division, stated that. she had te. fused to give her name or address on being brought to the station-house, and still persisted in not giving any account of herself. Mr. IFARDWII K to the prisoner —How do you get your living ? Prisoner—l am so situated I cannot answer that question. Mr. HA ttpwlck —lf yon are expectable you would have no hesitation in giving a proper account of yourself, and of whom you received the bad money. Prisoner—lt was given to me by a friend of mine, huh whose name I still not be induced to disclose. lam placed in a most unfortunate situation, which prevents.me from .leering myself of the charge made against me. • Mr. HARDWICK inquired if the prisoner was known to the ushers of the Court or the police, and received an answer in the negative. He then ordered the prisoner to be Yemanded until this day week, in order that the Solicitor to the Mint might attend and see whether he knew her. The prisoner, on hearing that she was to be sent to gaol, wept bitterly. John Davis, an intelligent lad only between twelve and thirteen years of age, but who has been three times convicted of fe!onv at the Central Criminal Court, and undergone dif ferent periods of imprisonment, with the addition of being twice privately whipped, was again committed for trial from this Court charged with stealing a book (Bogatzky's Golden Treasure), from out of the shoe-window of Mr. Alfred Sharp; of No. 14, St. Martin's -court, bookseller. He was detected in the act by a police-constable of the C division, and the pro perty found upon him. UNION- RA L L. Mal aimostAt. MISERIES.— George Davis, a lighterman was charged with violently assaulting his wife, and threatening to murder her. The wife said that the defendant was in the habit of ill.treat, ing her, and that on the previous afternoon he snatched up a knife and swore that he would serve her as Good served the woman at Putney. lie then approached her and mad. a stab at her with the knife, which cut through her clothes and inf.. liteted a slight wound. The defendant said that he and his wife were in The habit of fighting with pokers, and that he was certain slaughter would ensue if they lived much longer together. Mr. COTTINGHAM said that if the parties led such an us social life, it. was quite time that they should be separated to prevent murder. r Both of them agreeing to the suggestion, they left the Court ' to have a deed of separation drawn up, the defendant having en tered into his recognizance to keep the peace. KENS /NG TON I'OLIC E. Mr. Alexander Walker, a gentleman residing at No. 3, Regent's-place, Regent-square, appeared on warrant charging him with having assaulted Thomas Robinson, the conductor of Cloud's Hammersmith omnibus, No. 2,442, under th e follow log circumstances :—The complainant deposed that on tits night of Tuesday, the 26th ult., while he was standing with his omnibus at the Three Tuns public-house, opposite the Palace-gates, Kensington, the ;defendant, who had alady with him, came up and asked if he had room to town. He asked him what part, when he said " Piccadilly," but at the same moment two or three persons, desirous of going to the Bank, came up ; he told the defendant the fare would be a shilling each. The defendant, however, immediately said he knew what the fare was, and he should pay the proper fare when be got out, and at the same moment he got upon the step to get in, calling his wife to follow him. Complainant told him he woald rot take him unless he consented to pay the full fare, and touched his arm to prevent him getting into the omnibus, when the defendant said, " You vagabond, if you touch me again, I'll knock you down ;" and he instantly struck complainant in th• face a severe blow, which cut his nose and made it bleed. Complainant said nething to him, except telling him the fare ' was a shilling. Complainant never struck defendant or offered to strike him. Complainant gave defendant in charge for the assault, but on his obtaining defendant's address at the station house, forbore to press the charge. The defendant, in answer to the charge, said that believing the fare for the distance he intended to go was only 6d., he told the conductor he would pay the proper fare, when the defen dant, in an insulting manner, took hold of his repeated,his arm and after and said he should not get into the omnibus, which being told lo desist, and he acknowledged i h he then struck his. He admitted, however, that the complainant's language was not insolent. Dlr. CLIVE said, that as the defendant had not entered the omnibus the conductor had a right to demand what fare he pleased. Had the conductor allowed him to get in without first telling him the fare was Is., and then afterwards charged more than the customary fare of 6d., it would have been clearly an act of extortion ; and if proprietors of omnibuses took ad. vantage of the time of night or of the weather to make an in creased charge, they were bound to inform their passengers of it before they entered the omnibus. As to the question of the public right to met into an omnibus—if the proprietors pos. scssrd the right of making bargains as to the fares (which he considered they did possess), they had clearly the right of pre vent:ing persons getting into their vehicles who refused to cont. , ith respect t o thi s c h arge , a s th e de ply with their terms. W fendant struck the conductor a violent blow, which was un called for, he must tine him 10s. and costs. The defendant immediately paid the penalty, and was dis charged. --- - At I N larlliorouvh-street, Police Court, yesterag, George Woodhall, mho stated himself to be a clerk, and Ed ward Skipper, a gentleman's servant, were charged with cots mittirm a viole n t assau l t upon M r. S amue l R a y, th e l an dl o rd of the Duke of York, public house, in Shepherd•streef, Orford' street. The prisoners tried to make their escape without paying their Bill, and on the landlord interrupting them they com mitted the assault, for which the Magistrate t ned them forty shill)a,ga each. One paid the fine, and the other was sent to prison. 1 ; .J