The Sun. — London, England, 1861-03-08 00:00:00

(Hear, hear.) Well, it is just that spirit of fanaticism the Italians are trying to annihilate. (Hear, hear.) What recent decrees, I ask, have most excited the admiration and applause of the people of Italy ? The decrees that have broken up the monastic institutions and nunneries. (Hear, hear.) Those institutions are unserviceable to civil society, and can only exist upon its destruction, or upon the want of it. (Cheers.) Those decrees have been received by the people of Southern Italy with the greatest applause. But I admit there is a difficulty in the consideration of this Italian question—a difficulty that may cause serious inconvenience before it is settled. That difficulty is not at Gaeta; that fortress has fallen, and South Italy is entirely free. I ad mire the chivalrous conduct of Francis 11. in the last days of his political existence, or rather of his political agony ; for what agony can be greater to a king than to be despised by his subjects ? (Hear.) I admire the spirit the King of Naples showed at the last, and I only regret he did not give to his people the benefit of the better part of his character at an earlier periol. But Gaeta has fallen, and the Italian diffi culty isnot there ; nor is it at Venice. (Hear, hear.) Prince Napoleon in his speech treated the question of Venice in a re markable manner. (Hear.) What do we see at Venice? Venice is not Austrian—it is certainly Italian; but it is trampled under foot by Austria, and held in subjection by 10,000 bayonets, by a race foreign to Italy in language, sympathies, and feelings. (Hear, hear.) Do not tell me that this state of things can last. (Cheers.) Venice may be trodden down and ground into the dust, but they cannot change her from what she is. Venice is Italian 1 " States fall, arts fade, but nature doth not die; Nor yet forget how Venice once was dear, The pleasant place of all festivity, The revel of the earth, the masque of Italy 1" (Cheers.) That is what Venice was; what is she now? (Hear, hear.) See her "in her voiceless woe ; see her palaces crumbling into ruin 1 For in Venice there are none of those marks of improvement which the hon. gentleman opposite says he saw in the states of the Pope. No ; you will find in Venice a melancholy and trzstesse most painful to observe. (Hear, hear.) But, yet, what I have often told Italians is this, —"Wait ! Do not be in a hurry to take Venice, and the necessities of Austria and the public opinion of Europe will give you Venice without fighting or bloodshed." (Hear.) I have heard of offers to purchase it. But with the force of 200,000 men in and around Venice, I do not believe the condition of the finances of Austria will permit her to hold it long. Therefore the chief Italian difficulty is not at Gaeta, nor at Venice, nor at Messina. It is true Messina still holds out. (Hear, hear.) The hon. gentleman opposite appears t 3 derive some satisfaction from that circumstance, but I think General Fergola, who has disregarded the summons of General Cialdini, had better accept it with honour, whilelie can do so with dignity. It is impossible that Messina can hold out when the heights behind the town are in the hands of a general like Cialdini. The chief difficulty of Italy is at Rome. (Hear, hear.) Rome is the real difficulty and the obstacle to the consoli dation of Italy. And I ask the hon. gentlemen opposite, do they know what is the present condition of Rome P The Popes, not satisfied with being priests, have resolved to be kings. But that union of temporal and spiritual power, which once constituted the strength of the Papacy, has become the cause of its weakness. Enlightened Roman Catholics, from the time of Dante to the present day, have condemned and denounced the temporal power of the Pope. It was remarked to me by a learned Italian, that if the Pope determined to retain the two powers he would lose them both. What is the condition of the city of Rome ? For 11 years it has been in the hands of the French ; for 11 years French bayonets have supported the Papacy. The hon. member for Dun dalk gays that if the Sardinian soldiers were taken away from the South of Italy the people would welcome back the King of Naples, and carry in Francis 11. and his family on their shoulders. I do not know what the con sequence would be if the Sardinian troops were withdrawn f r om the territory of Naples, but this, I know, that if the French troops were to leave Rome an outburst of popular indignation would sweep away the Pope and the whole college of Cardinals together. (Hear, hear.) The tem poral power of the Pope has been defended in this House. 'We are told that we exaggerate the facts stated against it, and that the Roman States are better governed than any other part of Italy. But how is it that all Italian feeling and sympathy are opposed to that temporal power? This is the reason; the Papacy as it exists in Italy is an insti tution of the middle ages, and, like the monastic institu tions and others, must yield to the course of time and the progress of events. (Hear, hear.) The hon. gentleman o pposite smiles; but I think we may well smile with pity and contempt when we listeri, as I have done, to assertions a the doctrine—the blasphemous and damnable doctrine, as the Church of England calls it—that gives the Pope the power to absolve the people of other States from th e oa th of allegiance to their Sovereigns. (Cheers.) That power was attempted to exercise against Victor Em manuel. The thunders of the Vatican were prepared ; why were !hey not launched ? Why was not the threat put into execution ? Because they would have roused the execration of all Italy, and have fallen without effect on the head of that sovereign. (Cheers.) Talk about eccle• siastical government I Why the bigotry of the Church of Rome cannot be disputed. For centuries it has condemned not only the writings but the liberties and lives of thou sands of men of literature and science. (Hear.) It has done it from the time of Galileo to the present. (Hear, bear.) We need not be surprised, therefore, if in the moment of the triumph of the one and the difficulty of the other there is so littlasympathy between the people of Itome and the Government. (Hear, hear.) If, in the course of my observations on these Italian questions I have not alluded to my own experience, perhaps the House will allow me to do so on the subject of the bigotry of the Church of Rome. (hear, hear.) It was only the other day, when tra velling through the South of Spain, that I was in commu nication with two men who have been giving proof of their truth and honesty by suffering from their faith. One of them had been committed to prison for 11 years, and the other was on the point a:: being adjudged the same punish ment. Their names aro worthy,of being recorded, and there fore I shall give them—they are Alhamit and Matamorom. Those two men I saw myself, ana eney were rue victims of the bigotry of the Court and in paw of the priesecralt. Their sole fault was that they had in their possession a copy of the Holy Scriptures. (Hear, hear.) There is the bigotry of the Church of Rome! (Hear, hear.) My heart bled for Matamoros. lie was in a prison not larger than a few feet square. When I saw hint he was suffering, but he was courageous. When I told him to remain firm in the faith which he had adopted, ho said he looked to this free country, England, for that sympathy which would allevi ate his sufferings. (Hear.) This bigotry of the Church of Rome has bee:fn. generations. It has interfered with the emancipation of the human mind by choking and stopping ue the avenues of human knowledge. It is time that those anomalies should cease. (Hear.) I believe that the Reforma tion has commenced in Italy. (Hear.) I believe that the desire for civil liberty in that country is united with a strong desire for religious freedom and that that which has already been accomplished in Germany, in England, and in Scot land, has been commenced in Italy. (Cheers ) I say that the Reformation is growing apace in Italy, in spite of the Court of Rome, and in spite of the bishops. This accounts for the wish of the Church of Rome to stop the march of Italian revolution which it sees is every day sapping the :foundation of priestcraft and • priestly intolerance. But, sir, the great movement has gone on, and I may be per mitted to express my hope that tha t ' system of progress e i Nieh checks superstition and religious intolerance may take still deeper root in the minds and affections of the peo ple, ar id that their country may enjoy the full blessings of universe? liberty. (Cheers.) These are my feelings on Italy. I believe I have not exaggerated. I believe I have spoken the tout, with regard to the bigotry of the Church of Rome and the intolerance of its conduct; end I believe the Italians will do well to separate themselves from that conduct, and turn front idle tales to the blessings of re ligions liberty. (Hear, heer.) Gentlemen opposite accuse the policy of the noble lord the Foreign Secretary ; but I assert that the noble lord could not have acted otherwise than on a policy of non-intervention, coupled with the ex • pression of those sentiments to which 1 have before referred (Hear, hear.) The Italian people will be worthy of our sympathy! and encouragement so long as they show that prudence, discretion, and dignity which they have shown from the commencement of their struggle to procure that liberty which was so long forbidden them. (Cheers.) In thanking the house for the kindness with which they have listened to the few observations that I have addressed them, I would ask them to let the question itself plead my apology for any warmth which may have characterised those re marks. (Cries of " Hear, hear.") And, in conclaeion, the best hope I can utter—the best wish I can entertain—is one -which is echoed by thousands and ten thousands of people. to-day, and which is felt, almost invariably, by the people of this country,—it is that the present occasion of revolu tion may not close without affording to Europe and the civilized world the glorious spectacle of a united and con tented Italy, with a reformed and invigorated priesthood. (Loud cheers.) The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER—My hon. friend who has just sat down has addressed the house with his usual force and ability. (Hear, hear.) He has given us a just and eloquent description of the position of the King of Sardinia ; and he has also declared, and declared with truth, that my noble friend the Secretary for Foreign Affairs has, in regard to the Italian question, pursued an admirable policy—a policy than which none other would have been freely tolerated by the people of England. (Hear, hear.) If this debate had been confined to criticisms of the King of Sardinia, or if it concerned only the policy of my noble . ' friend, r, for one, should have remained silent, because I think that policy is one which commands approval far be yond the limits of party connexion—far beyond the walls of this house—far beyond class or interest. (Hear.) I be lieve it is stamped with approval throughout the body of the people of England, from the greatest to the least. (Hear.) But my hon. friend the member for Dundalk (Sir G. Bow yer) following in some degree the line marked out by the hon. member for the King's County, but likewise extend ing the subject of debate, has raised a great issue; for he bold solemn language. He told us in terms of, I have no doubt, great sincerity that we ought to lament our foreign policy—that it was founded on injustice and could not prosper, and that the cause which we favoured in Italy was the persecution of righteous Governments. He rang the changes on the law of nations, public right, established .authority, and legitimate possession. These phrases came round in our ears almost likethe chimes of the clock which wit had in this neighbourhood last year; but I must say that they did not strike on my ears quite so musically. (Laughter.) Those events which we and the people of England look to with a mixture of wonder, astonishment, and admiration, are, according to him, nothing but the result of unworthy intrigues carried on by an unprin .eviP,l,ed, King and a cunning Minister; and the issue ...",.`c a n n ho has raised is that the people of Italy were "6",venzpressed people, but a people attach' d to their and the r 0 (Hear, bear.) The honourable member , ""8. Who think with him tell us that there existed muner those uovern system, alwa ys ments a beneficent and benignant th Wisely administered, and in respect of that IG overnwent whi c h thf, solemn sanctionhiof is, above all others, solemn, for it has ready to assure us that religion, it members of the house are religion itself. (near, „t wat; carried on in the spirit of that a laugh.) I wish to try it The face of this house, a n ‘ c r i b oleo 3 . , :eference to unquestionable sources, whether those allegatio n s of the hon. gentleman (Sir G. Bowyer) are true. su re that the hon. member ht / Dself believes them to be true, n l cl that he also believes however, om afraid it be has them from the best source ' s. that he has not had the:ft. will be fog that those sources. but from the e mns which impure sources of those f a t* have made it their unho ly work to trample down , tgiberty and happ iness of the It alien people. (um, ' ) hear., ?;‘; v ii'lltris the case of Napl e s , as so w ell put by my /0 uthw irk in that speech "" fri.td tim.,?4 , iszp4‘ wh ic h ° A rkt , l roes eI to Ili lic - „t• cr t a spcoeh wartned by t . • . clzractet Lai , by well ei;i4blidhcc, •tr. , u ,4 3 eL.th .11 truth ? My hon. friend (Mr. Layard) said that Naples was that country where perjury was the tradition of the King. (Hear, hear.) We would not trust the son of Jam 11., and we cannot wonder that the Neapolitans say tl ey Cannot trust a King of Naples without seeing the source from which he has sprung. It is needless to go back very far—to refer to the days of Ferdinand IV.—to see the mix ure of violence and fraud as the engines of the Governmen' of Naples. Let us begin with the time of the late King. Is it not on record that if ever a man was perjured on the face of the earth, the late King of Naples was that man ? (Hear, hear.) Did he not in February, 1848, confer a Constitution on his people, and ratify it with a solemn oath ? (Hear, hear.) And did he not, after the bloody struggle of the 10th of May, again ratify that Constitution? I shall read his oath on that occasion. He says :- 4, With reference to our sovereign Act of the 29th of J an uary, 1848, by which, concurring with the unanimous desire of our most beloved subjects, we have promised, of our own full, free, and spontaneous will, to establish in this kingdom a Constitution, conformable to the civilisation of the times, whereof we then indicated, by a few rapid strokes the fundamental bases, and reserved onr ratification of it till it should be set out and arranged in its principles, ac cording to the draught which our present Ministry of State was to submit to us within ten days' time; determined to Five immediate effect to this fixed resolution of our mind, in the awful name of the Most Holy and Almighty God, the Trinity in Unity, to whom alone it appertains to read the depths of the heart, and whom we loudly invoke as the judge of the simplicity of our inten tions, and of the unreserved sincerity with which we have determined to enter upon the paths of the new political order, having heard, with mature deliberation, our Council of State, we have decided upon proclaiming, and we do proclaim, as irrevocably ratified by us, the following Con stitution." (Hear, hear.) And in most solemn terms that terrible oath was repeated in the face of Europe. What has become of that Constitution? Why, it was trampled under foot. (Hear, hear.) And that which it is difficult to convey to the mind of those who are assembled in this house, or in any other place in this country, is that the case of the Go vernment at Naples was not the case of a Government guilty of particular actions wrong in this or that respect, but that of one built up and founded on the denial and destruction of law. (Hear, hear.) In the first place, the Constitution so solemenly sworn to was shamelessly set aside and violated; but in the second, it is to be remembered that, even though the Constitution had never existed, the whole course of the Government at Naples, so far as regards the relations of the people to the Crown, was lawless from first to last. (Hear.) I heard a gentleman in this house speak the other night with horror of the principles of 1789. I will not enter into any discussion as to the comparative merits or demerits of one period or another of the great French Revolution, but I suppose the hon. gentleman meant to speak more particu • larly of the agonising transactions that took place in 1793. Amid the flood of evils which that period let loose on Europe, the most pernicious is undoubtedly the system of modern police. (Hear.) That was the fruit of the great French Revolution, and it was embraced and hugged to the heart by every Government in Italy—(hear)—and it was by means of that police, substituted for good political govern ment, and intrusted with the maintenance of law and order, that the subjects of the King of Naples were doomed and compelled to live in an atmosphere of lawlessness. (Hear.) Their rights had no existence, and the reign of wrong and violence was universal. (Hear, hear.) That was the position of the people of the Two Sicilies during the reign of the late King and after the revolution of 1848, for from that period, and after the solemn and awful oath to which I have refer red, their condition was altered greatly for the worse. (Hear, hear.) We now come to the accession of Francis 11. and it is painful to speak of one so young and so unhappy; but certainly if ever there was a human being, young or old, who marred and spoiled his own destiny, it was that miserable monarch. (Hear, hear.) It is all very well to claim consideration for him on account of courage, but I confess I feel much more admiration for the courage of the hon member for Dundalk (Sir G. Bowyer) and the hon. member for King's County (Mr. Hennessy), for I think T would rather live in a casemate listening to the whizzing of bullets and the bursting of shells, than come before a free assembly to vindicate—(Loud cheers, which prevented the conclusion of the sentence -being heard.) I for one do not hesitate to say that when Francis IL ascended the throne he did so under circumstances unusually favourable. (Hear, hear.) Let me do justice even to the previous King or Naples. He proved himself a man of great practical abi lity, and he certainly exhibited political courage. His cause was founded on wrong, but he made good his ground in the face of Europe, and h left his son in a position to make concessions without having them imputed to alarm. If it had been the policy of that son to govern even with decent moderation ; if he had had one single spark of human sym pathy in his composition; had he endeavoured to soothe even one sorrow among the millions of his oppressed subjects, he might have been King of Naples at this day, and Italian unity would still have been a dream. (Hear, hear.) But short as was his peaceful possession of the throne, short as was his possession of it at all, even that short time did riot pass by without giving rise to the most frightful revela tions. (Hear, hear.) I doubt not there are gentlemen in this house into whose hands fell a publication that ap peared at Paris, and which shortly after, from some myste rious cause, was not to be found at any price—l mean a pamphlet published in the French language, and entitled "La Torture en Sicilc." (Hear.) This pamphlet bore the name of its author, M. Charles La Varenne, and it contained names, dates, places, and particulars relative to transactions that every nelson interested in the character of the Kin of N a ples must have dearea to see ("twined or denied. 13tit no portion of those statements has ever been denied; and having myself heard and seen something of Naples in former times I am bound to say that what I heard and saw fades and faints by the side of the revelations which that pamphlet disclosed. (Hear.) But it' this was the condition of the kingdom of Naples, what shall we say with regard to the States of the Church? (Hear.) Without desiring to draw a broad and clear distinction between the personal character of Pius IX. and the effect of the miserable and execrable systenf' of which he has been the instrument and the vic tim, I am ready to admit that ha is simple, gentle, and re fined, and possessed of every personal quality and accom plishment that could tend to draw towards him feelings of veneration—(hear, hear)—but when we speak of the system with which he is identified, I must tell the hon. member for Dungarvan, who will probably follow me in thii debate, that it is impossible for him, by gathering carefully together all that was so sedulously shown to him of the hospitals and charities of Rome, to set aside the tread, the damning facts that have been established against the Papal Government. (Hear.) We had last year an official document presented to us, emanating from Rome, which the great leading journal in this country rather irreverently termed "a prolonged shriek," and when we consider the epithets with which that document was studded, the term "atheists," "anarchy," "revolution," a "combination of all the vices," &c., ap plied to those who opposed the Government of the Pope in theßomaema, it is:difficult to describe it by any other term. (Hear.) I hold in my hand authentic documents relating to the Austrian occupation of the Romagna for 12 years. The evils of all foreign occupations are bad enough, and this Austrian occupation cannot be thought to have been mitigated by any peculiar kindliness or refinement in the character of Austrian soldiers. (Hear.) But what are we to say of any Government—above all, of a paternal ecclesiastical Government—which could hand over to the officers and the Austrian soldiery the common administration of justice? (Hear, hear.) Is it possible by any epithet that language can supply to convey a picture more terrific than this—that the Austrians, whose feelings towards Italy have always been that of a dominant race, should come in as the defen ders of order and religion—(hear)---that not their great offi cers merely, but their colonels, their majors, and their cap tains, should have delivered into their hands, ignorant as they are, the common administration of justice? (Hear.) I have in my hands the proofs of what I state. Here are 16 men ordered to be shot, not for a political crime, but for two rapes. Whether they were rightly or tirongly so con- . demned I cannot say—though I may be somewhat doubt ful of the fact that 16 men should have committed two rapes—(hear)--but the point to which I wish to call the attention of the house is, that to theseAustrianisoldiers was intrusted the ordinary administration of justice. /Hear.) Here is an example in the case of the brothers Donati, shot in 18,51. The man who ordered them to be shot, and who, I presume, was responsible for their trial—that is, who judicially ordered them to be shot—l do not mean the man who obeyed the orders of justice, but the man who was their judge and signed their sentence—was an Austrian major. The crime of these two brothers was stated to be that they had received assassins or criminals into their house. (" Hear, hear," from Sir G. Bowyer.) Does any body, knowing the state of Italy and the condition of the people, groaning under a military occupation—nay, more, does anybody, knowing the state of Italy with respect to the habits of the brigands and the ineffective means which the people weald possess to defend themselves against them, not see that it is an odious and a monstrous system which enables a soldier, a major in the Austrian army, to shoot the subjects of the Pope upon the plea that they have received brigands, or, as they call them, assassins into their house ? (Hear, hear.) A man named Gherrardi, having been tried by a major, was sh .t for the same reason in 1856 ; another, Gian Castelli, after trial by a captain, was shot in 1855. Four more, whose cases I have here, were upon the same I must say, most vague and general plea of reception of bad characters, shot by order of a captain. An other, Itandi, was, in the year 1851, shot by order of a cap tain; and another, named Borghi, was shot upon similar grounds by order of an officer of similar rank. These things did not occur in time of war, they did not occur during the revolutions of 1848 ; they occurred through the long course of years from 1848 to 1859, and never was there a period in Italy when the disposition of the people to rebel—the dispo sition, I must say, to vindieate by resistance the claims of outraged humanity (hear, hear), was, for the moment, at least, more effectually subdued. As likendd t o h e i s s mwyash to . b f e rien friend really think that a state of thing en dured by a population such as that which inhabits the Ro magna ; and does he really think that any Government, even if it were compelled to submit to the monstrous evil of oc • cupation, when, surely, it should abandon the cant and hy pocrisy of declaring that its people are fondly attached to its dominion (hear, hear), ought to deliver up into the hands of a foreign soldiery the whole judicial machinery of the coun try, upon which the peace and private happiness of indivi duals and families depend. (Cheers.) I must confess, Sir, that it appears to me that the whole doctrine upon which the Papal sovereignty has of late years been supported is so intolerable that the man who could acquiesce in it—l mean the Roman or Italian who could acquiesce in it— would be nothing but a worm, fit to be trampled underfoot, sovereigntysays t hat is (Cheers.) What says the most eloquent champion of the is Papal so vereig nt y, mis a grea t Mppoonseta that the ? Pap H a e l te o N s . O e . Every a sovereignty over 3,00 0 , 000 of I talians to bo dis p osed of by the Pope. It is not to be disposed of by the P ope. Papal sovelreign vested interest in the maintenance of the Pap one of the 200,000,000 Roman Catholics has a right a nd_ a th . that the Church have not even so much hope left as is, ty." And therefore the people who inhabit the States of if the Pope and the Cardinals are favourable to them they may have somechance of relief. 'No ! every Roman Ca tholic all over the world is to presume to deal with their feelings and their destinies, and to assert a political right to establish dominion over them, which I must say, appears to me to be a doctrine, if possible, more monstrous than that upon which the laws of Draco were founded. (Cheers.) But my hon. friend the member for Dundalk fol lowed the hon. member for Southwark, and said that he had dealt in a multitude of allegations which were all equally worthless ; that he couli not possibly occupy the time of the house by entering upon a discussion of them all, but that he would select one for confutation, and he added ex tow disee mimes By•that summary, convenient, and com fortable In ()less my hon. friend get rid of the indictment made by tf tc me m ber f r Scut we; k. The statement which :La seL a ted fer eetirtatalifni was this, th tt at the capture of l'e:ugia a nuelLer of Si )hips v. - crP Iti «ntonly killed by the THE: SUN, 7LONDON, FRIDAY EVENING, MARCH 8, 1861. soldiery. Says the hon. member for Dundalk—" I saw two I gentlemen who were eye-witnesses, and they assured me there was no such thing." I have not got to quote two gentlemen who were eye-witnesses, but I have to quote the printed account of one gentleman who was officially respon sible, for he was the Papal officer on the spot. (Hear, hear.) The paper from which I am about to quote is the report of that Papal officer to- his superior in Rome. His name is Menem, he was sub-intendant of the district, and he re ports to his Excellency the Intendant-General Agostini, in Rome. We have heard something about foreign mercena ries, and a comparison was drawn between the foreigners whom England has at different times employed to make up the paucity of her men—a policy, perhaps, doubtful enough —but a comparison was drawn between them and the foreigners in the army of the Pope. This reporter, who I must say seems to do his duty honestly, but who of course does not make the case too bad says :—" The enthusiasm of the troops in attacking the city was indescribable, espe cially that of the foreigners and gendarmes." Their en thusiasm in assaulting the city was something beyond the average of the rest of the soldiers. Having men tioned that there were certain barricades, he goes on— will read it as accurately as I can into English :- 0 The soldiers then passed over these barricades. They took by assault the houses and the convent, where they killed and wounded all they could, not excepting some women"— alcune donne—" and, proceeding for Ward, they did the same thing at the inn in the Borge San Pietro." This is the case on which my hon. friend undertook to confute the lion. member for Southwark, and with respect to which he thought that confutation would be so easy. Why, sir, this is the precise assertion in terms that was made by the hon. member for Southwark, because it was not the accidental death of women in the moment of assault, but it was the wanton and deliberate murder of women distinctly testified to by an officer of the Papal Government. (Hear, hear.) [Sir G. Bowyer—" Read, read 1"] I have read. [Sir G. Bowyer—" Nothing about ' wanton."] Ido not find here the word " wanton." 1 admit that. I find that the troops when they had got into the town killed all they could, including women as well as men. (Cheers.) Now. sir, unfortunately, there is, at least there was, a de plorable solidarity among the Italian Governments, and as sometimes in a miniature you see represented with the greatest force the features of the countenance, so there was one of the smallest of these States, the most insignificant of these Governments, which perhaps presented the fullest and truest development of the system—l mean the Govern ment of a Sovereign to whom no allusion has been made by my hon. friend the member for Dundalk, the late Grand Duke of Modena—(hear)—one of those a horn, of course, we ought to regard with pity, and even with veneration, as a righteous ruler driven out of his States by the contemptible intrigues of Victor Emmanuel. Well, sir, here are again a set of original documents. Perhaps the hon. member will say that they are forgeries. ("Hear, hear," from Mr. Hen nessy, and a laugh.) I have never seen the original manu scripts, but I hold in my hand the published book, and no contradiction of that book has to my knowledge or belief ever appeared. (Hear.) Let us have a few specimens of the mode of governing in that country which was above all others a paternal State, which was the pet State of the Austrians, and was steadily supported and uniformly countenanced by the Pope. The Pope, who has the thunders of the Vatican ready to launch at the head of Victor Mu manuel, and to brand his crimes, never had any words ex cept those of courtesy and kindness for the Duke of. Mo i dens, to whose deeds lam about to refer. These are docu ments, of a great number of which I have not been able to make myself master, but I think that the specimens which I shall give you will be sufficient. The first which I shall cite was written in the year 1853, a time of pro found peace. It does not mention whether the persons referred to were criminal offenders, but I have no doubt that they were This document is signed "Francesco," and dated Reggio, May 22, 1853, and is addressed to the Minis ter " di Buon Governo," which I may translate " the Home Office," although my right hon. friend the Home Secretary, who I am glad to see is not in the House, would not thank me for the comparison. The decree refers to a batch of 254 criminals, and orders that they shall all be sent to another prison, and then continues : " Observing that about one-third of them, who have received but very slight sentences from the tribunals, are to finish their sen tences within the current year, we decree by our Sovereign authority that none of them"-80 or 9Q—" shall be re stored to society until they shall have given a proof of re formed conduct in the place where they are to be confined, and shall have acquired some trade." That is the system of government with regard to the security of the people as respects their personal rights. (Sir G. Bowyer.— " The offence ?") The document does not state the offence. My case is, that they were offences that had been tried and judged not by Italian juries but by Italian judges, not persons of opulence and station, like those of this coun try, but receiving pittances not sufficient for a moderate livelihood, and holding those pittances at the absolute will of the Crown. (Hear, hear.) The Duke of Mo dena said, " I decree that the imprisonment of the whole shall be prolonged until the parties shall individually give satisfactory proofs of reformation." Again, a young man of 17, named Granaj, of Carrara, was found guilty of murder or manslaughter. The law of Modena does not permit capi tal punishment under the age of 21. After the trial the Duke of Modena sends forth an edict declaring that, not withstanding the law, the young man shall be executed. [Mr. Bowyer made an observation which did not reach the gallery.] Ihe hon gentleman seems in some degree acli mated. (Laughter and cheers.) In another edict I find that the Duke is nauseated by reading three judicial sen tences, and his reason is that the crimes are so lightly treated that the punishment is worth nothing at all. The Duke is even more nauseated by finding that previous good conduct has been alleged on the part of the criminals. (A. laugh.) The third thing that nauseates him is that a man named Felice Libbra, who had been the accomplice of some criminal, should be let out of prison when he had exhausted the whole term of his imprisonment. (A laugh.) In this case the judges were rebuked and a new trial was ordered. I do not wonder that a smile of incredulity passes over the lipabf hon. gentlemen. It ought to do so. (Hear, hear.) It would be wrong that in this age and in this part of the world ono should be too ready to believe that such things could take place. (Hear, hear.) But I quota offlcini docurrzente, which I offer for the inspection of hon. gentlemen opposite. I have told the house of the case of a criminal who did not come under the operation of capital punishment, but in whose case the Duke made an ex post facto law for his exe cution. Here comes a converse case of a law or a remission that is not allowed to be retroactive. The Duke, writing to one of his Ministers, describes his affliction relative to the case of some criminals who were entitled to the operation of a mitigating law, and he issues an edict addressed to his _ _ " Dear Cocchi," its object being to declare that the initi‘ gating law shall not be applicable to that crime. (Hear.) Here is another case, in which one citizsn was killed and others were wounded in a row between the townspeople and the military at Carrara. The order to fire was given, not by the commander of the troops, but by a soldier, without the order of the commander, who was on the spot. The Duke of Modena issued a public edict, stating that, having looked into the case he was of opinion that the soldier was perfectly justified in firing without the order of his commander, who he added, probably deserved a rebuke for not having given the order to fire. (A laugh.) I will trouble the house with one more document, and if ever there was a document that deserves to be transmitted for the study of posterity, it is this. It is a letter of congratulation addressed by the Duke of Modena to his Minister of the Interior. I will state its purport in English. The Duke states that, hav ing examined the list of those admitted to philosophy and the superior faculties in the Universi y from 184 S to 1833, "we have remarked with genuine satisfaction the decreasing number of admissions." (A laugh.) He says that these admissions had previously gone to an excess most pernicious to society. "We recognise that these results are owing, not only to the method of examination and the firm ness of the professors, but particularly to the firmness of the Minister of the Interior, who is persuaded of the evils that flow from an excess of students and doctors. (Laugh ter.) Wherefore we exhort him, as well as all the pro feassors, to continue always in this salutary path of reduc ing more and more the number of those who are to be admitted to the faculties and philosophy, and particularly to the faculty of law, which is still in excess." (A laugh.) This is followed up by a positive decree that there shall only be two examinations in the University, that only 150 students shall pas‘the first, and 80 the second. I am afraid I have tried the patience of the house in dealing with the case of these Italian Governments. (Cheers.) Now, let me say one word as to the yearning of the Italians for poli tical unity. I am ashamed to say that for a long time I withheld my assent and approval to these yearnings. I asked why they were not content to pursue locally their local reforths. But there is the most conclusive evidence that the time has now come when Italian unity can be no longer regarded as a dream. And I would ask who have been its main promoters ? My noble friends who sit near me hare done something. (Cheers.) The influence of Eng land is acknowledged, and it is felt by the Italians that England has done something to promote the great and noble object they have at heart. (Cheers.) Let us do justice to our neighbours over the water. (Hear, hear.) We may criticise the annexation of Savoy. We disapprove the still stronger case of the annexe' ion of Nice. We may be lost in astonishment at the proceedings before Gaeta. But, after all these deductions have been made—and they are serious deductions I admit—ltaly acknowledges with one voice that she owes a heavy debt of gratitude to France. (Cheers.) But it is not our neighbours nor Victor Emmanuel and Count Cavour—with regard to whom I wonder at the ex travagant compliments paid to them—who have been the doers of this wondrous work. They have helped to forward it, and wherever the name of Victor Emmanuel is men tioned,, it is a charm from one end of Italy to another, because he has set that rare example in Italy of a true and loyal King—(cheers)—l mean a King to whom a com pact with a subject is a sacred th:ng, to be maintained through life and until death. (Loud cheers.) Count Cavour will bear any criticism, either here or elsewhere, and I do not anticipate the public judgment when I say that the name of that man will take a place in the list of those who have deserved well of Italy. (Cheers.) There are few indeed whose influence on their time or their coun try has been greater in its power or more successfully directed to benefit that country. (Cheers.) But the house will permit me to say that it is not any of those who have made Italian unity what it is—namely, a prospect not far from being realised. There are others who have more con tributed to this unity—those who have resisted all moderate and reasonable reform—the Kings of Naples, the series of Popes, the Emperors of Austria. These are they who have forced forward, and not simply helped forward, the cause of Italian unity. (Hear, hew.) How is it possible that when the subjects of the King of Naples found themselves put down by military power they should not seek that re ource, which nature herself teaches, of helping themselves, and becoming stronger by union with others ? How is it possible that, when the government of the Pope is carried on upon the principle that every Roman Catholic through out the world is to have a voice in maintaining it, and a greater voice, indeed, than those who are under the Papal sceptre—how is it possible the subjects of the Pope should not seek for strength wherever they can find it to meet such an unnatural combination ? (Hear, hear.) Above all, it has been the conduct, the doctrines, and policy of Austria that have laid broad and deep the foundations of Italian unity. (Cheers.) When I speak of Austria, I draw a wide dis-inc tion between Austria in Italy and Austria beyond it. (Hear, hear.) Beyond Italy I wish her well with all my heart, and regard her as the mainstay of the peace and order of Europe. I do not for a Moment doubt that it has been her unhappy and miserable task to be the instrument of carrying afflic tion to a people, not for her own benefit, but with a result imperilling her existence as a State. (Hear, hear.) It is Austria that has ma d e It a li an unity. (Cheers.) What was the course taken by Austria on acquiring her Italian provinces? Did Austria hold that Italy was a mere acci dental aggregation of States, each one of which might be dealt with by itself apart from the others? No, Austria was the first that denied that doctrine. She d e ni e d it in her alliance all over Italy. She denied it when by arms and treaties she provided for perfect unity in the spirit and principle of government from one end, of the Peninsula to the other. (Hear, hear.) We know bow Aus tria succeeded in that j olicy. She had Piedmont at her feet, and after the peace drove her into the desired system territorialad a demands. treaty with S h e N h a a pt übsy in the most stringe...t terms, e b wa y hn itychhea at threatthh her ic in o nm f g. n f Nlv r a e an s 4d h b ,nis: ul to sanction no instil ution that was net in conformity with those of the 411:3ttian &millions. Is it possible to so in India not many months ago ? (Hear.) I say, therefore, ' this is not a principle that can be adopted by English poli ticians. The only parts of Italy held by Germany are Venetia and the Quadrilateral. I press on the noble lord opposite and the noble lord at the head of the Government—and I do so in consequence of what was said by the Chancellor of the Ex chequer—the danger of the course they are pursuing in en deavouring to exclude Austria from her dominion in Venetia. (Oh, oh.) I am much accustomed to that dismal sound— (laughter)—but I must have something more than that sonorous " Oh !"—I must have an answer. And what I am asking for, and what I am endeavouring to discover, is some counterpoise to the power of France—(hear, hear)—some counterpoise to her interference in Italy, which shall pre vent the Italian people from becoming the slaves and vas sals of France. Considering both the interests of England and Italy, I say it is our duty to prevent the expulsion of Austria from Venetia at present. I know this is an un popular view. (Hear.) Oh, I have no doubt of it. (Laughter.) It has been my fate very often to bring forward unpopular ideas in this house ; but the curious thing is, that what was popular when I first mentioned it, has become the creed of this house. (Laughter.) I will mention a particular case. The hon. member for Leeds is laughing, but it was before his time. (Renewed laughter.) In the year 1835 I made certain propositions with regard to our colonial rule, and 1 recollect the time when I was considered a traitor and not an Englishman for doing so. I want to know whether there is a single word which I then uttered, a single demand which I then made for the colonies, which has not been granted—(hear, hear)—and whether you have not adopted in your colonial policy the very rule which I recommended, and which was so unpopular at the time ? (Hear, hear.) When such a change has taken place on an important point in the views of the noble lord the Minister for Foreign Affairs, may I not hope that—unlike the member for Brighton, who meets me with a sonorous " Oh !"—he will listen to my arguments, and, possibly, to adopt them. We have made an alliance with France; and I will ask any man who has studied the history or the geography of Europe whether our natural continental ally is not Austria. But it is said that Austria is at the head of the despotism of Europe. Austria was at the head of the despotism of Eu rope ; but Austria is now a constitutional Government. (Laughter.) There is a great prophet come among us, and that prophet is the member for Southwark. He laughs at the idea ; but I want to know whether our conduct to Ire land before 1829 was not quite as bad as that of Austria to her subjects. In 1829 we changed our policy, and from that time to this our policy has been different. I believe Ireland is well governed now; but I believe that our policy before 1829 was bad, was cruel, was unjust. Well, then we changed, and Austria has changed, and the Constitution which she has granted to her people is as liberal as our own. (A loud cry of "Hear" from Hr. White, the mem ber for Brighton, which caused considerable laughter.) I am Lot a nervous man or I do not know what might have been the effect on me of that very melodious cry of the hon. member. (Renewed laughter.) I say that on paper the Constitution of Austria is as liberal as ours, and what is it that makes me believe that that policy will be persevered in ? The interests of Austria—the interests of the house of Hapsburg. If Austria attempted to depart from it—if she were to go back to the old days of 1849—the house of Hapsburg would disappear from Germany, the Austrian throne would be overturned, the whole empire would be split up into parts, and we should see the various nations around enriched by her dissolution; (Hear, hear.) No one knows better that this is the case than the leading men of Aus tria. They have told me so. (Hear, hear.) The policy of England ought to be to support Austria, because she has no interests opposed to those of England. The hon. member for Southwark talks of the Austrians—the brutal Austrians. (Hear, hear.) I want to know, when you set soldiers against a besieged town, is there any country in Europe whose army is not brutal ? What do you say of Badajos— what do you say of St. Sebastian ? I say that if you put soldiers before a town, and they take it by assault, there is no crime that is not committed, no brutality that is not per petrated, nothing shocking to humanity that does not oc cur; and among the nations that ought to blush by reason of such deeds is England. There is no man who hears me speak but does not know that from youth upwards. I have always been called a thoroughgoing John. Bull. (.A laugh.) I am not a big John Bull, but I am a John Bull. My sym pathies are with my country ; and I believe I have all the prejudices, all the peculiarities, and all the faults of my countrymen. (Hear, hear, from Mr. White.) I think I have read of some Roman orators who were accustomed to have fighters by their side. Others had persons to make gestures. The hon. member's interruptions remind me of the services performed by those assistants—(laughter)—but I am pretty well hardened, and I can bear these things. I was asking the house to listen to my argument in respect of our policy towards Austria, when I was interrupted by the hon. member, and going back I wish to remind the house that the Austria of the present time is not the Aus tria of the past. All our interests are, coincident with hers. She exports corn, wool, wine, and hides—all which we de sire—but she does not export manufactures. (Hear.) And be it remarked that Austria has no desire to compete with us, not merely in commerce, but in war. (Hear.) She builds no ships to be the rival of our navy. (Hear.) She does not keep the world alive and disturbed by her aggres sive policy. (Hear, hear.) We have made friends, or at tempted to make friends, of those who did all these things. Why should we not address ourselves to that great Power of the Continent which would be our friend in difficult times? Besides, Austria lies between Russia and Western Europe; and depend upon it the words of the First Napo leon were prophetic—" Europe will be either Republican or Cossack." The time will come when the attempt will be made to make her Cossack ; the tima is now hovering over us when we are threatened with an alliance between our ally and Russia. (Hear, hear.) lam now speaking frankly to this house, and I am speaking words which I think the noble lord the Secretary for Foreign Affairs will say are worthy of consideration. An alliance between France and Russia is threatened—is predicted—from day to day, and let me tell the house that such an alliance is not for our benefit. (Hear, hear.) We shall have to cast about us for frien's, and I think the friend on whom we ought to rely, and on whom we can rely, is Austria. And let me tell the hon. gentleman the member for Southwark that the Aus trian nation have feelings which lead them to wish for the good will of this country. Their childien arc brought up to esteem and love English literature, and let me tell the house that that is a mighty link between two nations. (Hear, hear.) You cannot go into a house in Austria in which, if there be means to accomplish it, there is not a teacher of the English language. The literature of Eng land is a literature which they all admire, which they all love ; and let me tell the house that from that litera ture, which has been read throughout Austria, the desire for freedom and self-government has arisen through out that country. (Hear, hear.) This has not been done in an hour, or a day, nor in the life of a man, but gradually the Austrians have acquired English desires, and our public men ought to look to Austria as a friend in time of aggression. They would find in her a willing protector; for a protector we may need against the agres s:on of Russia or France. But, returning to Italy, do not the Italians want some counterpoise ? The member for Southwark talks about Charles V 111. Did he not go from the Alps to Rhegium ? What is to prevent Napoleon 111. from doing the same thing? Will any man tell me that 40,000 Frenchmen might not march from one end of Italy to the other ? Does any man believe, I ask, that the fili bustering—to use an American term—army of Garibaldi would have been successful in. Italy if they had had some regiments of French soldiers to oppose them ? (Hear.) I admit that great things have been done by Garibaldi; but he does not owe his success, as the hon. member for Dundalk asserts, to Victor Emmanuel, or Count Cavour, or the noble lord opposite. It was not these who did it, it was the bad rule of Italy. (Hear, hear.) When Garibaldi landed on the territory of Naples, with a fewhundred men, he found a large army before him. If that army had been faithful and brave could Garibaldi have succeeded ? No ; but there was in the Neapolitan people a feeling of hatred and detestation of their monarch, and a determination, on the first chance offered them, to throw off his odious rule. (Hear, hear.) Garibaldi succeeded because the rulers of Italy were unfit to govern—(hear)---that is the secret of his success. Had he on his lauding been opposed by Austrian troops he would not have succeeded ; and if he attempts to attack Venice, with only the same means with which he attacked Messina, I prophecy that he will be hanged in a week. What I state is perhaps unwelcome; but the truth is often unwelcome. And if what I have said to night is in time to have any effect, I believe that effect will be wholly in favour of England. (Hear, hear.) Her power, her do• minion of the sea, her influence over men's mind and intel lect are her greatness and her glory. To maintain this position is now in the hands of the two noble lords oppo site. They are the rulers of the destinies of this great coun try. On their heads will rest the responsibility for what they do. If they make Italy merely the vassal of France they will have done no good for England or for the world. But if Italy is made really free, independent, and united— free from spiritual as well as temporal despotism —they will have done that for which their names will be hailed by posterity, and they will deserve and receive the thanks of the whole world. Mr. S. A. BEA UMONT defended the policy of the Go vernment ; it had acted on the true principle of non-inter vention, and he had never heard it stated how it could have acted otherwise. Its policy had been truly national ; and at the same time had been to the advantage of Italy. Mr, MONSELL had never heard a foreign debate in that house involving great national interests in which so little reference was made to the great principles of international law as had been shown by those gentlemen who defended the policy of the Government. (Hear, hoar.) The hon. and learned member for Marylebone had endeavoured to make out that the revolution in the Neapolitan States was pro moted by the great majority of the people ; but he main tained, on the contrary, that the Sardinian Government eves most unpopular among the Neapolitan people, and that its only supporters were to be found among those to whom places had been given. (Hear, hear.) As to the Abruzzi no difference of opinion could exist, for then an insurrec tion had been vigorously carried on by the peasantry, and a large i'iedmontese army was required there to keep the people in order. (Hear, hear.) He did not say this from any want of sympathy for the Italian people, but because it was his solemn conviction that the liberties of Italy would never be accomplished by any attempt to unite people who differed more from each other than did the French and English people. (Hear, hear.) He desired to see the Ita lians rise from the depths of degradation to which they had sunk, but that could only be accomplished by allowing each people, after their own kind, to develope its own civilisation. (Hear.) 'With the views of the hon. member for Sheffield he bad no sympathy whatever. There was a strong feeling on the part of the Italian people against the system of Aus triao rule. (Hear.) That system was established by the arrangement made in 181.5, and was among the chief causes of the misery of Italy. (Hear.) The present apparent unani mity in Italy had risen almost entirely from that cause. But on the other hand those were mistaken who imagined that the national feeling of the different Italian States was not strong. It might sleep for a while, or be crushed, but it would most certainly rise again. With regard to the speech of the right hon. gentleman (Mr. Glazlstone), he would ask what it amounted to, considered in relation to the foreign policy of the Government. (Hoar, hear.) He described the trials that had taken place at Modena and scenes that occurred during the Austrian occupation of Bologna, but these were matters that had no direct bearing on the question before them. He remembered well the doctrine put forth by the late Sir R. Peel in the last speech he delivered, viz , that we ought to treat the smallest States with the same consideration that we gave to the most powerful. (Bear, hear.) His right hon. friend in his vehatnent denunciations frightened gentlemen an the benches opposite when he said that those who defended the King of Naples had more courage than the King of Naples had. (Hear.) With reference to what had fallen from the hon. member for Tavistock as to the feeling of the Italian people regarding the Roman Government, he must say that his experience differed from that of the hon. gentleman. At the-end of the year he eves at Rome. It was the custom of the Pope at that season to go to one of the churches of [tome about a ride and a half distant. He (Mr. Monsell) was present on the last occasion, and, though accus tomed to Irish enthusiasm when their atiections were called nirtit in any way, never had he seen such a dumonst ralb,n of affection as was shown towards the Pope by all classes of the people who crowded the streets, He have fuller or more striking testimony to the strong power of unity pervading the feelings of the Italian people than in the fact that Austria based her entire policy on the re cognized necessity of assimilating the whole spirit of go vernment in every state in the Peninsula, and of bringing it under the influence of one moving power? (Cheers.) It is the Powers hostile to Italy who, in the mysterious coun sels of Providence, have been made the means of compelling the people to forget those local feelings with which they , were strongly imbued. Every jealousy, every petty tradi tion, every narrow local view have been merged in one desire—a desire which has arisen from the overpowering necessity of moral self-preservation. (Cheers.) That is the desire which the people of England have been viewing with united prayers for its prosperity. As it has begun so may it go forward. Never were changes so great and im portant effected with so little to raise a blush on the cheeks of those who promoted them. (Hear.) They recall to my mind the words with which Mr. Fox greeted the first ap pearance of the French revolution, when he said that it was the most stupendous fabric that had ever been erected on the basis of human integrity in any age or country of the world. (Hear.) Sadly was that prophecy falsified by sub sequent events from causes which were not then suspected ; but I believe the words were not far from the truth at the time when they were spoken; and whether they were or not, they are the simple and solid truth in their application to Italy. (Hear.) For long years have we been compelled to reckon Italy in its divided state, Italy under the friends of the Austrian, Italy the victim of legitimacy, Italy with a spiritual sovereignty at its centre, one of the chief sources of difficulty and disturbance in European politics. We are now coming to another time. The miseries of Italy have been the danger of Europe. - The consolidation of Italy, her restoration to national life—if it be the will of God to grant her that boon—will be, I believe, a blessing as great to Europe as it is to all the people of the Peninsula. It will add to the general peace and welfare of the civilized world a new and solid guarantee. (Loud cheers.) Mr. MAGUIRE said he might commence by stating he was no apologist of the atrocities which had been com mitted, or of the course pursued by Austria. The right hon. gentleman, in the most solemn manner, endeavoured to fix the crime of perjury on the King of Naples, but let them see how the King was met by a powerful party, and before the Parliament met which was called, the clubs said they would have a Lower Chamber but no Upper House, and the King had pledged himself by a solemn oath that there should be two Chambers; one a Chamber of Peers. The result was that barricades were erected, and they were aware of what resulted. He (Mr. Maguire) was no advocate of tyranny, and no opponent of nationali ties. From the moment the young King of Naples came to the throne the noble lord of the Foreign Office became the schoolmaster of the young King and of the other rulers in Italy. The hon. member then passed a high eulogy on the conduct and demeanour of the Pope of Rome, in circum stances, he said, of great trial and difficulty, and that the troubles in the Papal States were not to be attributed to the badness of the Papal Government. As to Italian freedom, the first impulse given to iteamefrom the Vatican. Pius IX gave his people free institutions on the model of England. He gave a free parliament —a free Press—and a lay Gover ment, and how was he recompensed ? He was told that these institutions would not work, nor did they—the institutions broke down, and the Pope himself fell with them for a time. (Hear, hear.) The Minister of the Pope was assassinated. 'I he Press became licentious. The hon. member for Southwark (ylr. Layard) shook his head as if that was untrue ; but he had the writings of the Press which Pius IX. had liberated, and that Press had since written in the spirit of Red Republicanism. He would here refer to the writings of Montalereb:rt, to show that the Pope had given liberty to his people, which they received in a spirit of ingratitude and baseness. The Pope had done much to give his people liberty ; but his libel ality was met with acts of murder and bloodshed. Would the Pope, after that, be warranted in making a second experiment of extending the liberty of his people ? He would have been mad, in the face of such facts, had he done so. The Pope, instead of being decried for not giving liberty to his people, ought to be regarded as the apostle of liberty. (Hear.) He believed the King of Sardinia was a most execrable man, and a man who would hereafter be regarded as execrable and be execrated. Garibaldi had acted as a pirate, but he had proved a successful adventurer. The King of Sardinia had taken advantage of the action of Garibaldi while it was useful, and then had basely dismissed him. Everybody knew what drove Napoleon to Italy. It was the bloody finger of Orsini pointing from the scaffold to Italy. Let him beware of persevering in the course which he was now pur suing, driven on by the fear of assassination. Let him beware of his end. It might not prove so glorious even as that which befel the first Napoleon as prisoner at St. Helena. The King of Sardinia was an admirable imitator of King Henry the Eighth, and if he had the same oppor tunity he might give as many wives to the axe as the author of the Reforma tion. The King of Sardinia had the morality of a moss trooper and the temperament of the he goat. (Laughter.) The unification of Italy was a dream, and was a dream never to be realised. Mr. ARTHUR RUSSELL said that having been some months in -Italy he desired to bear his testimony to the fact that everything which he heard, saw, and observed fully bore out the impressions stated to the house by his hon. friend the member -for Southwark. He (Mr. A. Russell) thought that the affairs of Italy might safely be left in thp hands of Victor Emmanuel; and he felt convinced thal what her Majesty's Government had done with respect to Italy was in accordance with the sentiments of the whole British people. (Hear, hear.) Mr. ITILNES said it appeared to him that the advocates of the Pope had made a fundamental mistake in confound ing questions of property with questions of sovereignty. He earnestly hoped, however, that, the difficulty would be solved in a way most agreeable to the feeling of the Catho • lie world. The motion they were debating was intended to impugn the conduct of her Majesty's Government. They were in favour of non-intervention. When Talleyrand was asked what non-intervention meant, he said it was a meta ipityAie)al e i x T rz r s ,r si t w h no t h oi s a i t g:i w fie o d uld in i t h er o m ro e u d g d h l l in v g u . nde (A . stand that the feelings of the people of England were en tirely with them, and that in all their struggles the Italians might rely upon our sympathies. (Hear, hear.) Mr. ROEBUCK—There is no person who feels more acutely than myself the responsibility which attaches to a person who speaks on a great question like that which now occupies the attention of the house. Every word that is pronounced in debate here is echoed at the uttermost parts of the earth ; and, no matter how insignificant may be the individual, his words contribute in some measure to the effect produced. (Hear, hear.) What I shall now say will, I fear, be unpalatable to many here; lont not holding any office under the Crown, and not being connected with any party, I give expression to my own opinions alone, and let the world judge what they are worth. (Cheers.) It ap pears to me that many gentlemen who have addressed this house have mistaken the object with which we are now discussing this question. What we want to learn is not so much what has occurred in the past as what the future shall produce. We want to know how the Government of this country ought hereafter to dct concerning Italy. To the extent that the answer to this question depends on what has passed we are justified in referring to the past ; but so much lies in the future that we may well pass by the petty discussions with which we have been enter tained, leaving to future history the disputes between the followers of Garibaldi and the followers of the Pope. We are here as legislators to determine in what way the great influence of England shall be directed in coming years. I shall look on this question simply as an English one. (Hear, hear.) I believe that what is for the interest of England is for the interest of the world. (Hear, hear.) Her influence is so great and so,good, that what conduces to her welfare conduces to the welfare of the world ; and therefore I say, I address myself to this great question simply as an Englishman. Now, I want to know what ought to be the policy of England, and for that purpose I ask myself what ought we to wish Italy to be, and what are the steps that we ought to take in order to bring Italy to that condition. lat once confess that lam for what is now to be considered an United Italy. That is an expres sion which I know excites discontent in some minds, but when I come to describe what I mean, perhaps it may not be so offensive. I w ant to see Ital y under one Govern. meat from the bottom of the P eninsula u p to the Mincio . I want it not to be held by any foreign Power, but to be wholly Italian. (Hear, hear.) Entertaining this view, I have to ask myself of what nations Italy is composed, and what are the nations round and about Italy. I find in the north-west a great Power—namely Trance; I find in the north-east another great Power—Austria ; and still further east another great European Power—Russia. All these countries were to be borne in mind in considering the state of Italy. What are the hopes which ought to exist in any rational mind of accomplishing an united Italy? To the present hour that is a consummation which has never been effected. Excepting under the leaden;despotism of the Empireof Rome, Itaty never could be considered • in any way as one. Under the Republic she was many ; and in the great days of her existence there were separate Powers throughout Italy. Before, then, we can hope for an united people, we have to conquer' all the feelings of municipal rivalry. But is theie no ether disturbing force? We have been told, with all that vehement eloquence which so dis tinguishes the Chancellor of the Exchequer, that France has done great things for Italy. (Hear, hear.) Yes; France has done great things foe Italy; may not France do great things for herself? (Hear, hear.) Has not France ad vanced towards the crests of tha mountains which surround Italy, and can she not, when she chooses, pourher soldiers down on the plains, and put an end to your expectations of an united Italy ? (Hear, hear.) At the present moment is there not a wedge driven Vetween the north and the south by 40,000 French quartered at Rome ? (Hear, hear.) You have to get rid of them. You have also to f create some counterpoise to the power of the Emperor of the French before you can expect, not merely a united Italy, but a self-governed Italy —one which shall be a nation for itself, and not a vassal of France. (Hear.) It has not been my fate to appear in We character of one who lauded the Emperor of the French. (Hear, and a laugh.) I have to look at his conduct with regard to Italy—and, in this house, where to-night we have certainly heard some very remarkable statements and some very hard language had been used—l hope I may be per mitted to express in respectful terms my opinion —even though it shonld affect so great a potentate as the Emperor of the French--I have no faith in the Emperor of the French (Hear, hear.) Ido not believe there will be an united and independent Italy. And I warn the two noble lords who sit on the Treasury Bench, in older that they may not be tools in his hand in making Italy his vassal, and in increas ing the power of Fronde, which is even now imminent on her border, which is hanging on the crests of the Alps, and which has 40,000 men in garrison at Rome. I warn them that they may not be instrumental in uniting Italy to France, and thus increase the power of France to domi neer over Europe. Mark how you step; be very cautious how you tread, lest you should be led into that path. I pass now from the north-west to the north-east. The Ita lians hate the Germans. When France ruled Italy, the Ita lians hated the French. (Hes& hear.) It was a very com mon opinion now-a-days, and it is one which the French Emperor has proved, thatwe are to listen to what is called universal suffrage, and to be guided by popular opinion as to the governors of States. Is England in a condition to mequiesee in th a t op i n i on ? D o es England adopt that prin ciple ? ihall we g i ve u p the seven islands in the mouth of rho Adriatic? (Hear, hear.) Ifwe listen to the hon. member for Dungarvan obeli we be able. to adopt this coarse with regard to Ireland . ? Should \vo have been able to do so in Catada some )'ears ago *mid we have been able to do would say one or two words on the question of inter national law. At the time of the invasion of the Roman States by the Sardinian soldiers the French Emperor sent a telegraphic message from Marseilles to the Duke de Gramont, saying that the French Government would oppose the entrance of the Sardinian troops, and that message was sent from Rome to Ancona. General Cialdini said that he understood the matter better —he knew what was the feeling of the Emperor of the French, because he had had an interview with him. On the 22d of October M. Thouvenel sent a despatch to the dif ferent Courts of Europe, explaining that it was true that such an interview took place, and stating that what General Cialdini said on that occasion on the part of the Cabinet of Turin was that if great disturbances occurred in the Roman States it would be necessary for the Piedmontese to enter those States, in order to protect the temporal Government of the Pope, and to go on into the Neapolitan territory to fight a battle against the revolutionists. In spite of that de spatch, which he was surprised did not appear in the blue book, the noble lord had given his approval to the course which was being pursued by the Sardinian Government. He asked any gentleman whether there ever was in the world an act of greater treachery than that which the Go vernment of Sardinia had committed ? (Hear, hear.) Such conduct must be shocking to the mind of every honourable man, but still it had received the approbation of her Ma jesty's Government. Lord J. RUSSELL—At the close of the second night's debate upon the question of going into Committee of Supply, it is very difficult to say what is the real question which hon. gentlemen upon different sides of the House have raised. Upon this occasion I can perfectly understand that gentle. men, either in opposition or supporters of the Government, may take the Ministry to task for their foreign policy, and may say, as they have a perfect right to say, "Before we go into committee to give any supply to her Majesty, we must have explanations with regard to the policy which the Government have pursued." But the hon. member for King's County, the hon. and learned member for Dun dalk, and my right hon. friend who has just spoken, have in fact raised a totally different issue. They have raised the issue in the first place whether the Government of the King of Sardinia is a better Government than that of the late King of Naples, or that of the Pope; and in the second pl ice whether, seeing that in their opinion the Government of the King of Sardinia is not so good as that of the Pope or of the King of Naples, her Majesty's Government were justified in giving support to the King of Sardinia against the Pope and the King of Naples. To the whole of that question I might answer "Your representation of the policy of her Majesty's Government is an entirely mistaken one." I might even grant the first proposition. I might say "The Italians are extremely wrong to prefer the Government of the King of Sardinia;' it is, no doubt, perfectly clear, you have made it clear to demonstration, that the Government of the Pope is much more enlightened, and the Government of Naples far more humane than is the Government of the King of Sardinia ; " but after all I should say that does not touch the policy of her Majesty's Government, whiclkhas been that we would not interfere by force to prevent the Italians from chosing the Government under which they would live. (Hear, hear.) That has been, and is, the policy of the Go vernment, and not a policy of supporting the King of Sar dinia against any other sovereign or State whatever. My hon. friend who has just addressed us has, indeed, referred to the approbation which I expressed in the name of her Majesty's Government of the entrance of the Sardinian troops into the States of the Pope, and into those of the King of Naples. For that, no doubt, we are responsible, but that, again, I say, is a question for the Italian people themselves to decide ; and that is what I said in the des patch which has been so often alluded to. If the people of Naples preferred, as they evidently did, to be governed by the King of Sardinia, and to be relieved from their existing Governments, it appears to me, looking to numerous pre cedents in the history of Europe that they were justified in making that election, and that we should not have been justified either in expressing disapprobation or in prevent ing them from changing their governments. The right hon. gentleman refers to Belgium, and says, " Would you allow French troops to enter Belgium ?" Why, we did allow French troops to enter Belgium, and not only that, but we made it a matter of convention that they should enter that country. The people of Belgium had risen against their sovereign, with whom we were bound by every treaty of ; they had broken the Treaties of Paris and of Vienna, by which all Europe was bound, and it was be cause they had done this that we allowed a French army to go into Belgium in order to prevent the sovereign from enforcing the dominion against which they had rebelled. (Hear, hear.) Therefore this is not a matter without a pre cedent. And, as I have mentioned this instance, look how it bears upon another question which the hon. member for Dungarvan has raised to night. He said the Government of this country had such a hatred against the Pope that they are ready to support any persons who will overthrow his dominion. They cannot bear the Pope, and therefore, because there was an insurrection against him, they imme diately took the part of the rebels. My first answer to that must be that all the persons, that all the great bodies who were fighting in Italy were Roman Catholics. (Hear, hear.) There is no Protestant Power which is directly concerned in the question at issue there. (Hear, hear.) It is a con test of Roman Catholics against Roman Catholics, not on any matter of faith, but upon a matter of temporal power and government. (Hear, hear.) But in the next place, I shall reply that, in the instance to which I just referred,we making myself responsible, but more particularly my noble friend near me (Lord Palmerston), who is supposed to be in spired by the evil one quite as much as myself--(a laugh)— took the part of a Roman Catholic people, who wished to establish Roman Catholic institutions, against a Protestant Sovereign who was accused of making them too Protestant, and of attempting on account of his prejudice in favour of the Protestant religion to overthrow their Roman Catholic institutions. Well, then, I think that that aecusation, at least, will fall to the ground. I will now touch upon the question, which, I must say, I think is hardly one for the House of Commons, but which yet is the question to which we have devoted two nights' debate— vie., whether the people of Italy have been right or wrong in overturning the Government of the king of Naples, and that of the Pope in the greater part of his dominions. Upon that sub ject I must say that, after all I have heard, it seems to me that Governments more abominable and more degrading to the people than those of the King of Naples have never existed in the world. (Hear, hear.) Look at what the young King who has lost his throne was led by evil advice to do. We have lately heard a good deal said against the King of Sardinia on account of a certain pension paid to the mother of one Milano, who attempted to assassinate the late King of Naples. That, at all events, is no fault of the King of Sardinia, because his lieutenant at once abolished that pension. When the late King of Naples came to the throne, he found a number of persons who had been put in prison because they were supposed to be the accomplices in this crime, or to have some knowledge of the attempt of that soldier who endeavoured to be an assassin. It was repre sented to the King, and by the English Ambassador among others; and a petition was also presented to the King by the persons thus imprisoned, setting forth that they were altogether innocent of the crime laid to their charge. They said, " If thera is any ' evidence, bring us to trial; let wit nesses prove that we are guilty, and we are ready to submit to any punishment the Court may decree," But •the Go vernment of the King of Naples said "No ; we will not bring you to trial." The persons accused replied, "If you will not bring us to trial, let us go free." " No," said the Government; "It is possible you maybe guilty, although there is no evidence to prove it, We shall endanger the safety of the King if we let loose those who may possibly be guilty, and you must therefore stay in prison for the rest of your lives for this imaginary crime." (Hear, hear.) That was the way in which justice was administered in the kingdom of Naples. Take another instance. As:my right hon. friend stated, the whole kingdom of Naples was go.. verned by the police. There were a number of persons, principally of the middle orders, who were called " sus pected." They were not allowed passports to go to the next town ; they were not allowed to leave the country, or to bring up their sons to the learned professions. If one of these persons said, " I have a tion for the law," or another said, " I wish to send my son to a medical college," they were not allowed to do so, About 100,000 persons were thus watched by the police, and were not allowed the use of those liberties which the subjects of the greatest despotisms are permitted to enjoy. At length a decree appeared declaring that this surveillance was at an end. But the Minister of Police sent a secret order to the police that these persons were still to be watched, and were not to be allowed to do the things previously forbidden without the matter being reported to him. That shows the perfidy of the Government. (Hear, hear.) They were not only tyrannical and destroyed the social life of the country, but they concealed what they were doing. Well, these things naturally sank into the minds of the people, and when they saw the opportunity of freeing themselves from such a torment it was no wonder they gladly availed themselves of it. (Cheers.) I now come to the case of the Pope and the Legations. The very worst character that a Government can have is that they neglect the things they ought to do, and do that which they ought not to do. (A laugh.) Well, that is exactly the fault of the Roman Government. The first thing a Government ought to do is to protect life and property. The Roman Government afforded no protection to life and property. A man could not travel in the Romagna in safety. One gentleman told me he was about to sit down to dinner in his country house, when a band of robbers carried off everything in the house, and he determined—svissly, as T think —never to live in his country house any more. Some young men who committed offences against ecclesiastical discipline were punished, but theonly remedy against robbers and mur derers was that military tribunal to which my right hon. friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer has alluded, and which, evil and oppressive as it might be, was only an indi cation of the insincerity that prevailed. 'With regard to those things which the Government of the Pope did do, one of the greatest abuses a Government can commit is to prevent a man from using those faculties that are given to him, and interfering with the freedom of religious worship. That was the whole business of the Roman Governments I Every care was taken that men should not use those facul ties wh ch Qod gave them, and should not worship according to the dictates of their conscience, Thus the Roman Government forbade that with which a Govern ment had nothing to do, and did not do that to which the people were entitled. (Cheers.) If these were the faults of the Government, what wonder that the people should at once and gladly receive another Government ? (Hear.) T should like my right hon. friend (Mr. Monsell) to account for the fact that when the Austian garrison left Bologna there was no question about carrying on the Go vernment on behalf of the Pope. The cardinal who go verned there, as the representative of the Pope, left Bologna as soon as the Austrian garrison took its departure. There were no Sardinian troops, or, se far as I know, Sardinian agents in Ilologna, but there was a general resolution on the part of the people to declare that the Papal Government was at an end and was dissolved. (Hear.) In like manner, every one knows that if the French troops were to leave Rome exactly the same consequences would ensue, and th Government of the Pope would be at an end. (Cheers.) Then, the real question is not whether the Sardinian Go vernment is preferable or not to these Governments, but, these Governments being thus distasteful, not to say ab horrent, to the people, was it any Lusiness of the English Government to say, "However much you detest your Go vernment and prefer to live under the King of Sardinia, however much you may, wish for Italian unity, we, the English Government, are'deternoined to oppose your wishes and to employ the force of England to prevent you from ob taining your independence ?" Was that a course that any English Minister would take, or that this house would ap prove ? (Hear.) It is not necessary to prove that the King of Sardinia's is a good Government, but I see with great pleasure that an Italian Parliament is assembled, that per sons duly elected by the provinces of Italy have taken their seats, and that they have met to carry on a constitutional Government, in which freedom of conscience and political liberty may be completely enjoyed. (Cheers.) The hon. gentleman the member for Sheffield says we ought to con sider what is our policy, and ought to prevent the expulsion of Austria from Venetia. There, again, is a question for the people, themselves. I should be very glad to see that Power maintained, because I quite agree with my right hon. friend (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) that during many con tests in Europe for two centuries past we have often con tended in the same cause, and against the preponderance of other Powers. with Austria. I agree with him that Austria is a great, regular, and conservative Power in the middle of Europe, that tends to preserve many of the political and social advantages which Europe enjoys. With regard to Venetia, it is true that Austria has adopted a representative constitution. It is for those who are summoned as repre sentatives of the province of Austria to decide what their policy shall be ; but I believe it will be found so difficult to. retain the affections of the people of Venetia, and that the Austrian garrisons are so costly, that it is not for the inte rest of Austria to continue making such heavy sacrifices as the preservation of Venetia requires. I think, therefore, that it would be better for Austria herself that Venetia should be governed according to her own wishes and aspi rations. But I can never lay down the principle, as the hon. gentleman seems to wish, that this country should go to war for the purpose of maintaining the Austrian power in 'Venetia. Mr. ROEBUCK said he never wished that war should be declared, but that persons coining from other parts of Europe should be prevented from attacking the Austrian dominions. Lord J. RUSSELL—With regard to a war of aggression that is a different matter, upon stoich when the time comes it will be sufficient to enter. The hon. member for Lime rick says that the people of Italy destest one another so much that they bever can form one country. It is for them to decide that. If their mutual hatreds are so great they will not fail to find expression in the Parliament of Turin, and separation will probably be the result. But„ having known something both of Spain and Italy, I should say that the hatred which exists in Spain between one pro vince and another, between Castille and Andalusia, or be tween Valencia andi which is to be found in Italy. Yet Spain has been go verned for a long period by one monarch ; and any jealousy or dislike that may exist between the people of neighbour ing provinces has never been urged as a ground for consti tuting a Federal State or of separating one province from another. If the people of It a ly can get over the jealousies and dislikes, let them form one united people. (Cheers.) Unfortunately there are objections to that course from very opposite quarters and of the most opposite character. France is disposed to think that it would be much better for her to have a number of weak separate States in Italy than one strong State exercising a pressure on the South as unpleasant as the pressure on the North. Germany, again, fears that an united Italy would be sure to take part against her with France. Now, it seems to me to be rather hard on the Italians, who have not yet constituted an united Italy, and are free to choose their policy, to bring such ob jections against them, and to assume that they will adopt this or that disagreeable line of policy. I believe that when they are united they will look solely to the interests of Italy, and will go to war for or against France, or perhaps remain neutral, j us t as may seem most beneficial for their country. (Hear, hear.) Although I hold that we were not only at liberty to interfere ourselves, but were , bound to use our influence to prevent others from interfer ing in the affairs of Italy, I do not disguise the great satis faction I feel at the prospect which is opening before that country. If it be a crime to wish that the people of Italy should be free to use the intellect with which it has pleased Providence to endow them, and to tread, as our own nation has done, the path of constitutional Tiber ty, then it is a crime of which I must plead guilty. (Hear, hear.) I should heartily rejoice in that result. It appears to me to be no obstacle to their progress that in no former period of history has Italy been united. It was because Italy was disunited, because three centuries ago a great Power found it expedient to break the country up into separate States, that Italian independence was destroyed. What is more natural than that the Italians should say, " Our di visions have ruined our independence, lot us try if our union will not restore it ?" (H ear , hear:) I shall not enter into all the particular accusations which have been made against myself on this subject. They are of the most con flicting character. The hon. member for Ring's County charges me with extreme partiality for Austria •, the hon. baronet the member for Dundalk charges me with a desire to see Austria dismembered. Austria occupies a most difficult position at this moment, but it is my earnest wish, as it should be of every Englishman, that she may so reconcile the various parts of her monarchy as to satisfy the wishes of her subjects, and maintain her place as a great Power in Europe. That, however, is also a question in which we cannot interfere; and it must de pend on the wisdom of the Austrian Government whe ther within the next three months, that State re-esta blishes her position, or whether she takes a step that may be injurious, if not fatal, to the recovery of her influence in Europe. (Hear, hear,) I Yejoice to observe the strength lately acquired by constitutional parties in almost every country of Europe. After a long interval, we see in the Senate of France a revival of liberty of speech which is really quite delightful. One gentleman with a great historic name, the Marquis de Larochejaqueleis, has delivered a opPc.oh abusing the poltry of England, but I perused it with no less pleasure on that account, being satisfied that free dis cussion must, in the long run, after, no doubt, much bicker ing and mutual accusation, tend to promote greater confi dence and amity between the two nations. (Hear.) In Aus tria and Hungary representative assemblies have been sum moned. In Prussia there have been signs of greater indepen dence in a Chamber which has hitherto seemed a mockery of a representative assembly. (Hear.) I hope that the unfortu nate occurrence which has lately taken place at Warsaw will lead to the recovery by the Poles of some of the ancient pri vileges of which they were deprived after the events of 1831: On almost every side, indeed, we witness the progress of constitutional liberty; and an ancient and classic land of freedom like our own cannot but rejoice in the success of principles to which we are so much attached. My object, as one of the Ministers of her Majesty's Government, has been to follow, not a party policy, but a national policy. (Hear.) Although my administration has elicited a good deal of criticism from the party in Opposition, I do not understand that they venture to condemn it ; and I trust and believe that the great majority of my count r y men a p prove a policy which i s favourable to the liberty of Italy, and to the interests of Europe. (Cheers.) Mr, WHITE remarked that he had ventured to cry " Oh, oh," when the hon. and learned member for Sheffield was eulogising Austria, upon which the hon. gentleman had reminded the house how he had always sympathised with the oppressed and among others, with the Canadians. He could only say that the population of Venetia were much more deserving of sympathy than the Canadians, and that he could not compliment the hon, and learned member on his "latest style," to borrow a phrase from art, as being his best. It had been proclaimed in the city that the hon• member for Sheffield would return to this country the eulogist of Austria, because he was received in gilded saloons by Archdukes and Archduchesses—(laughter) —and it was rumoured that the Ivza. member had come back from Vienna with a very lue:rative contract in his pocket. (Oh, oh.) In reply to Ito statement that it would be a material advantage to thi s country to uphold the dominion of Austria in Italy, tie must observe that Italy united under one monar,a, with a moderate tariff—(laughter)—would bes wit l a the exception of the United States, the best customer of Great Britain. Mr. LINDSAY then moved the adjournment of the de bate, but withdrew the motion on being informed by Lon/ Palmerston that he would have an opportunity before a. vote was taken with respect to the construction of ships and the expenditure of the dockyards, to propose the mo tion of which he had given notice on those subjects. Mr. HENNESSY explained that the numbers he had given respecting the eleetions in Italy were drawn from an. official document. In reply to Sir S. NORTHCOTE, Lord PALMERSTON said that on Monday the Go vernment would wish the numbers both of the army and the navy to be voted in Committee of Supply, in order to form the foundation for the Mutiny Bills.. The house resolved into Committee of Supply,pro forma, and immediately afterwards resumed.. The Qualification for Offices BIP, was read a third -time, and passed. The house adjourned at halt'-past twelve o'clock. Pills and medicine invariably avate and perpetiate diseases ; their annoyanoe, dis appointment, Ara expense may be avoided by persons in indifferent health sending only their address to E. S. Barry, Esq., 77, Regent-street, W., London, and they will receive gratis and free by post the " INvAraos' OWN GUIDE," or Natural Restorer, without medicine or ex pmse, of perfect digestion, strong nerves, sound lungs, an& refreshing sleep, to the most enfeebled, insuring the removal of indigestion (dyspepsia), constipation, liver complaints, nausea, epilepsy, paralysis, debility, nervousness, palpitatiot cough, asthma, consumption, dropsy, flatulency, diarrheas, dysentery, biliousness, fevers, sore throats, catarrhs, colds. noises in the ears, rheumatism, gout, impurities, eruptions. hysteria, neuralgia, irritability, sleeplessness, acidity, palpt• tation, heartburn, headache, despondency, cramps, spasms. sinking, fits, bronchitis — "ljnauestionably the safest Guide to health." BIRTHS. ANDERSON. -011 the sth inst., at 40, Minto-street, 14din burgh, the wife of Captain Anderson, 78th Highlanders, of a son. BRAITHIVAITE.—On the sth inst., at 65, Mnrnington road, Regent's -park, the wife of Joseph B. Israithwaite p barrister-at Jaw, of a son. MARLING.—On the 6th inst., at Stanley 'House, Glouces tershire, the wife of William H. MarY,ng, Esq., of a sou and heir. MARRIAQES. DYER—RICHARDS.—On the 6th inst., at St. James's, Pic cadilly, Frederick C. S. Dyer, Captain 17th R eg t ., third son of Sir Thomas P'yer, Bart.,_ to Selenah M ar i a A nn , third daughter of Il e l a te Rev. E. D. W. Richards, rector of St. Andrcw' , ..•,, Glamorganshire. WAKEmAN--lincumsr.—On the 6th inst., at St. Paul's, Coventarden, Walter Alexander James Wakeman, Esq., to Matilda, eldest daughter of Edward Kitchen, Esq. _ _ DEATHS. EDWARDS.—On the sth inst., at Cerrig Clwydion, Den bighshire, Edward Lloyd Edwards, Esq., of that plac aged 46. FOiNTAINE. — On the 6th inst., at 29, Porchester-terrace, Bayswater, John Miles Fountaine, Esq., aged 74. LLEWELLIN.—Qn the 6th inst., Henry Llewellin, Esq., solicitor, late of 29, Noble-street, Cheapside, aged 55. MASTERS.—On the 7th inst., in London, the Rev. Dr. Masters, vicar of Swingfield, Kent, aged 73. NICHOLES.—On the 6th inst., at Hall Farm, Heston, near Hounslow, C. R. Nicholes, fourth son of HenryNicholes, of 71, Piccadilly, aged 35. LoNnoN : Printed and Publislfied by MITRDO YOUNG, 8 1 No. 112, Strand, Printer, at THE SUN Office, No. 112,Strs 48, in the Precinct of the Savoy, in the County of Mildxsex. Friday, Mai ch 8, 1861. 2