The Sun. — London, England, 1842-07-09 00:00:00

1 ...-,.....-..-......-....._ I ~3. ~~ :-5-, - SUN, LONDON, SATURDA_Y MORNING; JULY 0, 1842. Would be an importation of salt meat and bacon which would be a great relief to the working classes and the o r , and this was the reason he supported the Right 1 - Bar one t. I n t hi s measure t h e poor agr i cu l tura l 011 rer. would have a piece of bacon hanging up in hi 11v to c h eer hi m w h en h e got h ome , w hil e h e now mind on potatoes and bread. He had no hesitation in ug that there was nothing which the country so ;eh dreaded as the return to office of the Noble Lor' tihad brought us to our present condition. tth respect to the statement of the Noble Lord (Lord 'tiat sini erston) whom he did not now see in his place, That !Prese nt G overnmen t d es i re d L or d . Aneithuid to con ;'`,`,lle Gov ernor o f I n di a, he (Mr.-reseott) believed there con ;',, `,`, ll e not the slightest ground for the statement. He fr o le fro that statement not from authority exactly, but In all but authority, end he had every reason to rely the statement which had been made to him. Other - r a, P,' embers had cautioned and had advised the ,ight Hon. Ge ntleman at the head of the Government ; he would t il h ° , t Present , e either to caution or advise him , but having 1 / " honour to sit in the same Parliament with the Right * e a u- Gentleman, he would implore him, having settled derang e d fi nances o f t h e country, to d ev i se some me asure for comf or ti ng th e sons an d daughters of indus t r ) , and fo r secur i ng to t h em t h at rewar d to w hi c h t h ey were entitled. u Lord PALMERSTON said that he had been given to t rerstand that, during his absence, the Hon. and that he contradicted from a uth o rity th e s t a t emen t w hi c h the late Pre s id ent o f t h e B oar d o f C ontro l (L or d Ellen t I.° l- _ u gh) had, soon after his accession to office, written saord Auckla n d expressing a wish that he (Lord Auuslt.land) should continue Governor-General of India. he been rightly informed ? NadESCOTT—Not exactly. I did not say that I seade that statement from authority. my IL L r o rti PALMERSTON—From all but authority. Mer e ESCOTT—I meant to say that I had reason to „ ere tout suc h was t h e f act ; b ut w h at I state d was e ehr e t 3 , own responsibility. 1113 r PALMERSTON said that there was then au b ec l U al 4ecessity for him to elain to the oe the L r eunds on which he had made xp that statemen H t. us That t "I'd was an extract from a private letter, addressed an member of Lord Auckland's family in India to b ° ther m em b er o f hi s L or d s hi p ' s f am i ly res i d i ng i n ' Al g l ikfid, which letter was in his possession, and an ex irtet from which he would read to the House.— Lear, hear.) The letter was dated Calcutta, Novem -20, 1841, and after expressing regret that the last 4 s7il had not brought out the appointment of Lord f Auckland' s successor, the wr i ter procee d e d to say, "I n set, it is lucky that Lord Auckland has sent home his Positive resignation, for Lord Ellenborough writes a Most friendly letter, wishing him very much to remain, and stating that he has no doubt but that they shall get ' ll very well t oget h er ."—(Ch eers .) sir. ESCOTT apprehended that that was no contra diction to his statem e nt. (Cries of " Oh, oh," and r e u g ut er-) Lord Ellenborough was not the Govern "l"-(0h, oh, and laughter.) Lor d PALMERSTON—My statement was, that soon bt r the access i on of t h e present Government to o ffi ce e then President o f the Board of Control had written Lord Auckland, expressing a wish that he should con T u e in the Government of India, and those were the g . Lunds on which he had made that statement. le r . P. M. STEWART thanked his Hon. Friend (the inoenaber for Greenock) for having brought forward his were ti °M The first five propositions of the Government ter undenied and undeniable.—(Hear, hear.) The in sta,ests of the country had never been in such a distressed maleses at this moment. From Scotland, England, a en , an Irland, one note f estituon had been tip to d the e House, and not o dti a single statement had n made ha meet it. He had that night presented a shrt• f i cant petition to the House. It was from 1,600 t e_Pwrights, a new c l ass o f comp l a i nan t s , s h ow i ng h ow th e s hip-building trade might be improved by opening timber trade with all p arts of the world. He depre cated . vete benevolence, disposition to discourage the practice of pri a for if it had not been for that the o_te of Refrewshire and Paisley would have ,r r eu still. worse than it was at present. For erel weeks the people there had been entirely depend ent on private benevolence for support. th the motion of last night it was proposed to entrust ste ' e ePing of the corn chest to the Right Honour ,„e Baronet. but Honourable Members would not I, truss him with that power, lest it should be abused. Gee ertainly should divide with the Hon. Member for ,„nock on his motion, though he feared no practical red would result from it. The question now was, bather they s h ou ld remain th ere use l ess ly di scuss i ng a ti le h e " upon which they were all agreed, or whether teiriesYt'oh:ehirould return to their respective homes, and take stations as members of the suffering communi he ,io'which they were the representatives,ie . ave to e a ,Z__vernrnent the awful responsibility of .neir own T " • tb:' °r d CLEMENTS bad not intended to take part in is discussion ; but he wished the House not to be led " error respecting the distress existing in Ireland, W hieh 1 v iks . le could a s s u r e Hon. Members was such t tit tlmpossible for one who had not witnessed it to con e it. desBORTH WICK admitted the existence and extent tobe distress ; and as he intended to vote against the i-teslutions of the Hon. Member for Greenock , he thought At light to state the grounds on which he would do so. t empts were made to excite pop+ . er indignation against thee,, Present Administration for the distress of the c oun t but it ought to be recollected that there was great th s e tress when the Whigs were about to leave o ffi ce, and th e re were no attempts used o raise up against Is the th e fury and indignation of the people. • "e distress was so great as he was sorer to admit it M i t Was the duty of the Members of that House to Ml!e for the purpose of ascertaining what remedy her th, ai t e3 ,tys Government ought to apply. He contended c o - a " tne decay in the manufacturing prosperity of the ttl• itry had been gradual and constant p ; that the repeal t op " L e Corn-laws would not afford a su ffi cient remedy lei o tge evil, while it would introduce the same distress eaupthe agricultural districts. If any Hon. Gentlemen Prove to him that the distress would be removed p 3' or t t he re 'a of the Corn-laws, he should have his sup k eff ort which he might make to obtain their _ spew e ho „ ARSLAND thought they had relied long ply teem teern wit upon the British farmer, who had tOiled to sup ih su ffi cient food. The disease had gone on e o „L e ng for half measures to be effectual, and they r etae ]lot afford to wait longer . for . a full and complete e ou „ u.Y. The distress which existed throughout the tse;',, t ry could not be exaggerated, and the measures ti p , e ",,had been taken to relieve that distress had been alt er . la `l3' unsuccessful. The Corn-laws had indeed been (1 . but the price of food had actually increased in laeniantets. The distress was not confined to the work !, u g ' Y Asses : those in the middle walk of life were equally te x r. town by the pressure of the times, and yet fresh were . being imposed, when a general . alms-giving e een solicited for the relief of the suffering people.— ea r,hear.) There was a crisis beyond which misery fee p ' not be endured—(Hear, hear)—to that crisis, he • the — " they were fast approaching.—(Hear, hear.) When tr se verities of winter should add to their dis totres, they wou ld fi n d the people, who had drunk ee ed °ll g of the cup which still overflowed with misery, fur: r ed more terrible by the knowledge of their th e r, Patience and endurance. He would not deny icy could put down any insurrection by means of te na lr well trained soldiery ; but such acts might be at ah ste d with risk, and much blood would flow, which, he fie(!uld think, would form no subject for pleasure to re cont quit, and yet the Right Hon. Baronet seemed to b ut e mplate such severities—call them not seventies, res, tat uer mercies; for it was a mercy to put such suf ts4orsout of their misery. —(Hear, hear.) In the Pre se ta of Stockport, which he had the honour to re , there were not half the rate payers that there Ont, e , s 4 few years ago ; their cottages and nouses were se c aunted ; 1 1 . 0 of their . manufacturers were ruined, ond . "e feared t , I , L were hastening to the same Just; ' hies 1; • , Charity, but they did ask for of tl e : art 1 t • ney 'Quid et it at the hands theiGovernmea r, ,C 1114 i) .mtirmed the existing distress Da /1 % 4 ; 0 u: the wintry. whieh was not confine .: to any the I s ,,tlr teeitli'ies out was spread far and wide over ca ti „,"te zount; • He had endeavoured to trace the , nes t "I this di st ress . to its source, and he could fin d - e other source but the high price of corn.—(H ear, k 4 l e ) The Right Hon. Baronet at the head of her . 11 4 Den s , t Y's Government stated the other night, that lie tia.r i t s e d plentiful harvest this year, because the two last d the scarce ones, and it was seldom that they ha d Niedeonseeutive bad harvests. This statement ho (Mr. f e 4) did not think was a correct one, for it would le st rind, upon investigating the prices of corn for the dee o e w Years, that they had already had four years of dis i i i „ e nt harvests. He must repeat his opinion that the . toe it -s3 of the country was owing to the high price or fe eitst i and from a calculation which he had made he inst er ,, t hnt if the rice of wheat in 1841 had been 565. hite e Z "665. 4d , a sum of 14,000,000/. of money would 4 pt llt ' e en saved * to the country, which would have been lAtiy s od Circulated amongst the tradesmen and opF the B Of the kingdom. They had now an alteration in nuse„.ern-law, and to that alteration he objected as in ,,,thet-ltrent during the long period that it was discussed in klare '''' e use. Under the Corn . Bill of the Right Hon. We s n et, corn would be poured into the country when it ere e Pt wanted, an d when there was no corn in the Thi s rY foreign corn remained in bond.—(Hear, hear.) to th l vas th e i nev i ta bl e consequence o f a s liding scale, (]t ea r it.reat detriment of the agricultural interest. — of hear )H e qu i te agree d w ith the observations the y th ` tl e lioneurable Member for Evesham that tress ou ght to look to a remedy for this dis . was s i n the country. Ire was happy to say that t here 'Nat ,p r obability o f a go od harvest. This would be a st em enefit t o t h e country. H e h ope d t h a t the price, in the 1 : ) . ra nging from 60s. to 645., as had been the case for hep ed st ,oor Years, would be low during time winter. .He was tee Right Hon. Baronet would see that the t ime The e t ?, u lri e for great changes in our commercial system. , ---- (4,„ le was come when monopolies must be abolished. lel to t ir , hear.)i,. With regard to the tariff, he felt grate lttirik,. rtlght lion. Baronet for the concessions therein le e It Ns „ a I er e , great step towards Liberal principles. 4 1ou se glad the motion had been brought before tle Was itr ,," it would sh o w the country that Parliament lief i n unmindful of the existing distress; but he was Ihe re e ` o n u , habit of voting for propositions from which Ppo s e no practical result, and he niust, therefor,. . t he motion. 13 3 z hi ; PHILIPS said that the statement made aervi q -1 "-m• Friend the Member fur Stockport was de trek, gof the deepest consideration of the House. Die, t°eseal throughout the borough of jtithnddii:tress • It might be greater in the districts sur tirel g even than in Manchester, as they were en the Y dePendent on the cott trade. Not only was givnt in the (1:-t - ,1 r aPid stride s Or • lic i%s one oi thos e that had vu o ". " C orn-law s ior yeafz , ihongut tAlltv me were injurious to trade. In 1835 and 1836, when there was a temporary prosperity, he then expressed his opinion that the Corn-laws were at work to the in jury of that property.—(Hear.) What they wanted was employment for the people, and he never was more convinced, than at the present time, that nothing could restore the commerce and prosperity of the country but the a')olition of those laws. As a proof of the distress which now existed, he would read an extract from a re port Tnade by Mr. Muggeridge, or. emigration ; and he would call the particular attention of Hon. Members to it. It was dated the 20th July, 1836. It stated the total number of paupers transmitted to the manufacturing dis tricts for employment was 435 families, comprising 3,454 persons ; of these, 329 families, or 2,673 persons, ar rived at their destination ; 43 families refused to work after employment had been found them. From Bedford shire there were 18 families ; from Buckinghamshire, 47 families "' • Cambridgeshire, 5 families ; Dorsetshire, one family ; Essex, 4 families ; Hampshire, 48, and Suffolk, 184 families, all sent into the manufacturing districts. All these individuals were, at the present moment, starving without the means of being maintained. He would ask whether it was possible to raise, by private charity, even one day's wages of the whole manufactur ing population of this country? If any disturbance was to arise it would be impossible to make up even one single day's wages of the manufacturng people by pri vate subscription. Under these circumstances it be hoved them to look this distress fully and fairly in the face. He felt that nothing but a repeal of the Corn-laws would give employment to the population of this country. He had entertained that opinion when the question was neither popular with one party in that House or popular with the other. When he had first a seat in that House hehad said that the duty on corn ought to gradually de cline for ten years, when the duty should cease altogether. He was then thought Quixotic by parties who now enter tained the same opinions on the subject which he did. He felt certain that the repeal of the Corn-laws would benefit every class and interest in this country, and none more so than the agricultural interest itself. If there were not an improvement in the legislation of the coun try, such as might lead to an improvement in manufac tures, he was convinced that the whole bur then of the national debt must be borne by the land, until the over whelming distress of the people would bear down all the institutions of the country. Mr. R.YORKE said Sat there had been much contra diction on the subject of the distress of the country—one party declaring . that it was general and grievous, and the other maintaining that it was partial and temporary. He thought inquiry in such circumstances most desir able, and he supported the motion. General JOHNSTON could not think it possible that the responsible Minister of the Crown could leave the people in their present distress without in quiry, or an attempt to relieve them. He could not undertake to point out a remedy, but something should be tried. The distress was not exaggerated, and it would be shortly more severe, for his experience as an agriculturist enabled him to say that the ensuing harvest would not be an average one. He hoped that, before the close of this debate, the Minister of the day would hold out to the starving peo ple some better hopes for the - future than could be found in any of the measures hitherto proposed. Mr. GRIMSDITCH denied that the repeal of the Corn-laws would afford a remedy for the distress which, he was sorry to say, was undeniable. For the last twenty years he had seen, with sorrow, the wages of the artisans in Lancashire taking a downward course. He attributed this distress to the improvement of ma chinery, by which human. labour was displaced, and he feared, whilst the introduction of machinery went on, no Corn-law regulation would prevent distress. There was already in this country sufficient machinery to supply with cotton goods the whole of this world and another as large.—(Hear, and a laugh.) Much had been said of the value of the American trade but was it not the fact that this country was a loser by that trade ? At the present moment America owed our manufacturers nearly 50,000.0001., which was an important item in. the causes of our distress. He believed that a reveal of the Corn-laws, so far from relieving, would only-aggravate the existing distress, inasmuch as' such a step would bring ruin on our agricultural population ; and he be lieved that the number of labourers engagt d in agricul tural pursuits was greater than the number of those who found employment from manufactures. He should give his decided vote against toe motion of the Right Hon. Memty r for Greenock. Mr. LEADER did not wish to give a silent vote upon a subject so interesting to his constituents, and to the country at large, as the motion then before the House. He was surprised at a good deal of what had fallen from the Hon. Member who had just sat down. The Hon. Member seemed t, think that the evils under which the country suffereu we-e Mainly owing to ma chinery, and to the state of our relations with America. The Hon. Member, however, tiO also admitted that much of the existing distress be traced , to the fact, that our production was so great that w• had not markets enough to suppi.::. Now he (Mr. Leader) believed that to that point the ques tion would really come. ' We had not markets enough, because the great article of corn, which was the main production of many other nations, could not be received here in exchange for our manufac tures, That was the main source of the distress which now pr, vaiie roughout the country ; and that system was the reailt lass legislation. The present Govern ment had hod out magnificent promises for the relief of the country ; but how ;.ad those promise been realised? The Government ha , —troduced an Income-tax, which would be severely telt by our entire population ; and al though they had effected some improvements in the tariff, they had left materially untouched the principal articles of subsistence. The wishes of our working classes had been contemptuously overlooked by Minis ters, even when those wishes came recommended by three millions of signatures. Again, the Government had failed to place upon a better -pilicy our commercial relations with other countries. The promised commer cial treaty with France had not only not been 4ranted, but the French Government had, a,few days ago, imposed an additional duty upon one of the most important of our manufactures. While speaking upon the subject of our commercial relations with other countries, he wished to say a few words relative to the attack of the sleeping Member opposite (the Hon. Gentleman here alluded to Lord Stanley, who was at the moment asleep . in his seat) upon the policy of the late Govern ment in India and in China. Now he would ask what would foreign Governments think of a Cabinet, a leading Member of which had thus denounced. a policy which the Cabinet was determined to continue?—(Hear, hear.) In his (Mr. Leader's (Aid the remedy for all the evils under which the country suffered was to he found in making our tam more liberal than it was at present, and in adopting, to the fullest extent, the principles of free trade.—(Hear, hear.) He was persuaded that un less they adopted such a course they would lose the markets which they now had, and as to those they had already lost, he was afraid it would be impossible, under any system, to regain them. Looking to the present state of the country, he should say that he never expected an adequate remedy for that condition until the people at large were fully and fairly represented in Parliament. Mr. C. BULLER wished to discuss this question with out any reference to the party questions of the day, or any wish to impute all the blame of the present distress to the present Government. The policy of the late Go vernment with regard to China and Affghanistan had been alluded to by the Noble Lord, as partly the cause of the present distress. But no one interest could be named that had been affected by this policy. The war in China had been undertaken with a view to restore the state of things that previously existed ; and in addition to this, the fact that the importation of tea had continued —that tea had even fallen in price since the com mencement of the war, proved that it had caused no interruption of British commerce. The introduction of English goods into the countries watered by the Indus had increased since the invasion of Affghanistan, and the cultivation of tea had been, for the first time, established in India since the system of policy of the late Govern. ment had been commenced. , An impulse had been given to the whole commerce of India. , No question ought to be so impartially approached ; there wie , anger I, ! raising untimnded hopes of relief , an ,ney might waken vain hopes as to the power of the Legis- . lature to afford relief. He considered the present perii.d as a great crisis in the history of the country. The ' distress that prevailed presented different features to what had existed at former periods: In the first place it was more extensive—it extended from the cotton trade to the woollen and iron trades ; it also prevailed to a , great extent in the South of Engand, in such towns as Plymouth and Exeter. It had affected the Metropolis. Notwithstanding the brilliant appearance of the season, and the number of carriages that were to be seen in their public places, he believed that no season bad had so lit-', tle effect on the revival of trade as the present. one. He might take as a criterion, the state of the bookselling business, which was in a state of unprece dented depression. The Bight Hon. Baronet had used an unsound argument, when he referred to the increased import of cotton, and the activity of their manufac turers. This, he thought, was the most alarming fea ture of all. It proved that the manufacturers were re sorting to small profits on large quantities of goods, in order to make up for the decrease of profit on the annual amount of production. There never - was . a pe riod when the people were more ready to work. The cause of their distress was entirely the want of a market for their manufactures. And how could they raise a market for their produce ? The want of a market arose from their absurd system of commercial 'policy. They expected to be - able to carry on a one sided trade. Let them resort to the principles of fair barter—let others gain by them, if they expected to gain by others. The object of legislation with regard to corn, was, in the beautiful language of the Paymaster of the Forces, to keep the country gentlemen in their present position.—(Hear, hear.) The introduction of the tariff was made in an admirable speech ; the prin ciples laid down in that speceb were the consistent prin ciples of tree trade ; but those principles were most in consistently carried out in the tariff. He believed that speech was made not only for that tariff, but for the future one, It seemed to him that the tariff was most ingeniously contrived to steer clear of every one of the great articles used in the ponsuinption of the people. (Hear.) Be would mention the articles? to show that the people could derive no advantage from the aitPr- tions, Nothing' was done for sugar, bread, cheese, butter, malt, tea i OP gpffee there was a reduction—he find it opt— of 2d. a pound. h o o i p i e soapd the candles there was no rgduPaPill Mg iff an p d * li short,. like all the reductions of the tariff together, there was no o ne great article of consumption reduced in price, Jven the reduction on ,meat was only made under the sOlPfl 4 91,9yance of the Ri g ht Hon. Baronet P that no meat eottla pos s iblyhe iPPPorPd and the reduc tion, in this case would 110 `pelf.q ti•.4eiess. There was a second m ode, in whichit was said that tlie iountry u, slit be rcli f . v ,/, L.:v,i %', k means of a wide ~pread system ofentigration. W hat had the Government done iti the wa r y apron3pOpp PEA, iiii7.‘, 49. a ? No. Govern ment had done less to promote emigration. Another mode which was suggested was the relaxation of the Poor-laws. The Government had very properly refused to accede to that suggestion, and turn the country into a country of paupers. Another mode by which it was pro;..osed to relieve the distress was the granting a mil lion of money ; that also had been refused. 'What remedy, then, had been devised for the distresses of the people ? Why, in point of fact, the Parliament would break up without any practical remedy being adopted. The Right Honourable Baronet admitted that dis tress existed at the time he came into power, but he then said that that distress 'was yielding to the acces sion of a Conservative Government. When that state ment was refuted he still held out hopes to the country of a revival of commerce and manufactures. In the spring the Right Hon. Baronet came down and confessed that his hopes had been disappointed. There was nothing but a general admission of distress ; nothing was pro posed for its removal. The Right Hon. Baronet had complimented the people upon their patisnce—his eulogy was not more than was deserved ; but there was one thing which tended to infuriate the people, and that was the notion that their misfortunes arose, not from Provi dence, but from the selfishness of the Legislature. — (Hear, hear.) The impresion of the people was, that their distress arose not from the visitations of Providence, but from the selfishness of those who were entrusted with power. The people were beginning to think that it was better to fly to evils they knew not of than to endure those which they now experienced. Every day they were giving an argument to those who would shake the institutions of the country by their present legislation. He hoped there were some Hon. Gentlemen opposite, who would not be so bound by party interests but that they would yield to the cry of distress. There was one at least, who would feel his responsibility at the present time—he alluded to the Right Hon. Baronet, the Mem ber for Tamworth. The Right Hon. Baronet might rely upon national feeling to elevate him above party considerations.—(Hear, hear.) He believed the Right Hon. Baronet had an anxious desire to use his power for the good of his country. He believed that his views were more enlightened than those which he professed ; but the great question was, whether the Right Hon. Ba ronet would use his power for the benefit of his country? He knew not whether the Right Hon. Baronet would become the Minister of the nation, or whether he would persevere in the miserable course which was consistent with the means by which his party obtained power, and be the agent of that destruction in which they threatened to involve the country. Mr. EWART contended that the rspeal 'of the Corn-laws was absolutely necessary to secure the peace and prosperity of the country. It would behove us to encourage free trade at this parti cular crisis with America. With respect to the present position of the Right Hon. Baronet, he thought that po sition was upon a sliding scale. The impetus which free trade had received from the measures lately adopted by the Right Hon. Baronet, must go on in the course which he bad begun, and free trade must ultimately prosper. If the change in the commercial code which was now sought by the . people, was not in time granted to them, it would be ultimately effected by political convulsions, in a manner which none would have reason to regret more than Hon. Gentlemen opposite. Mr. COBDEN, from the silence with which the state ments of the distress now prevalent in the country were received by the House, entertained very serious doubts as to Hon. Gentlemen believing the present condition of the country to be as wretched as it really was. The government lent themselves to that persuasion. The Right Hon. Baronet did not himself sufficiently acknow ledge the existing distress. He had merely admitted the distress in the cotton manufacturing districts, which the Right lion. Baronet seemed to attribute to the in troduction of machinery. He (Mr. Cobden) denied that the introduction of machinery ever threw. men out of employment. It was a fallacy to say that theintroduc don of machinery caused distress, by throwing men out of employment. Let them take the cotton trade as a proof of his doctrine. In the year 1767, when Ark wright perfected the spinning frame, there were no more than 13,000 persons employed in that trade in this coun try. At the present period the number - employed amounted to if millions. There was an instance of an increase in the number of operatives employed in conse quence of the invention and application of machinery to manufactures. In agriculture there was no one case of great improvement in machinery, and yet an increased number of labourers was not employed in that occu pation. On the contrary, those labourers flocked into the towns where machinery was used for the purpose of obtaining employment. It was unworthy, then, in the Prime Minister, - to pander to the prejuices of the people, by thus attributing the distress to the use of machinery. He did not complain of the Hon. Member for Macclesfield propounding such doctrines, for, in doing so, he was but following his vo cation. Then they talked . of over-production. Let them analyse what was meant by over-production. Why, it meant merely too much industry. There was a charge to bring against a nation. But why did distress arise from over-production, as it was called ? It was, because we lost sight if the science which taught the proper distribution of we- th—it was because they lost sight of the truth of po.. !.sal economy . that their population was so wretched. All that he (Mr. Cobden) asked was, that they would give employ ment some way or other to the people. To return to the argument relative to machinery. Let them go to districts where machinery was not improved these 200 yearsto :he Midland Counties. He called on the Hon. Member for s; ottinghamshire to tell them what was the condition of that county. There were there no improve ments in machinery—no steam—they had inventions of 240 years ago, and) t what was the state. of Notting hamshire ? The Right Hon. Baronet the Seeretary for the Home Department had not attributed the distress in Paisley to the manufacture of stockings. But let them take Nottinghamshire, against which no such charge could be brought, where the plcugh now used was on the model of that used by Cincinnatus and yet in that dis trict the distress was appalling. In Hinckley, in Leices tershire, out of 1,500 stocking frames only , twenty were employed. Before Parliament met again many of our towns would be given over to pauperism, and their inhabitants must be fed from the poor-houses. The distress was general throughout the country. Let them go to the Potteries, in Staffordshire. Why there no improvements in machinery had been iutroduced. In the works there the same description of wheel was now used as that in the time of the Pharoahs ; the wheel now used was the same as that used in the time of Moses.— (Laughter.) Perhaps that was a. state of things would satisfy the Hon. Member for Macclesfield, and yet there was no district in which the distress was more severe than in the Potteries of Staffordshire. Trade was there depressed, and there was little. or no de mand for the productions of the place. Let them next go to the mines and collieries in Staffordshire. Much improvement had not taken place in the ma chinery used in the coal mines, and yet at the present moment there were no less than 25,000 men wanting • employment in the coal districts of Staffordshire. Go to the glass-blowing in Stourbridge and Warrington, and the distress is the same.—(Hear, hear.) The Right Hon. Baronet said " Hear, hear." Why then did the Right lion. Baronet pander to the vulgar prejudices about machinery ?—(Hear, hear.) He could tell him that the tail-end of his party had been lifted up upon thlit prejudice;—(Cheers.) He knew men and women to be subsisting ©n boiled nettles.--( hear, hear.) Nay, more, he knew that the putrid carcass of a cow was dug up in the neighbourhood. of Brous oh.) He understood by that groan that t was not believed. He did not wonder at it .ear. hear.) But he wrote to a schoolmaster, a respectable man, whom he knew, to tell him if it was true, ann ne desired him to have it attested by others. Now he had that document in his possession. —(Hear. hear.) And such was the effluvia that a part of the carcass had to be re-buried.—(llear.) In Akington also a dead calf was dug up by the people.— (Hear, hear.) They did not believe these things. It they did, could they sit there without applying a remedy: —(Cheers.) Yes, the people of England, to their credit, would rather subsist on such food than deprive them selves of their liberty by going into the poor-house.— (Cheers.) Ile did not want to introduce the Corn-laws into the debate if they gave him a better remedy.—. (Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord, the Member for Lanca shire, ought to have some sympathy for the place he re presented. _ Bur what .did he say last night? He said that America sent over two millions of goods more than she 'took back. Did America then send over 2,000,0004 wort?" of goods without getting anything back? The Noble Lord ought to know that foreign trade consisted in nothing but barter.—(Hear, hear.) He was often surprised at the ignorance dis played by the Noble Lord on practical subjects.—(A laugh.) Possessed of a clear and vigorous intellect, he was bound to make himself better acquainted with sub jects of a practical nature, which, however distasteful, Noble Lords and Hon. Gentlemen of a certain education must learn, because such were the subjects that must now come before them.—(Hear, hear.) But on such subjects the Noble Lord was profoundly ignorant.— (Laughter)—and he could not but think the Right Hon. Baronet exercisi d a sound discretion in speaking - for him on sLch subjects.—(Hear, hear, and laughter.) But he believed if the Corn-laws were repealed that the same post which would convey the intelligence would give revived energy to the sinking trade.—(Hear, hear.) He knew of no other means by which it could be done. What happened a few days ago in Stockport ? The distress was so extensive and alarming that the Mayor said he would not be responsible for the consequence.— (Hear, hear.) He did not mean to say the masses would pull down their palaces, but they were drifting on to confusion without rudder or compass.—(Loud cheers.) They may talk of the military, but the military would not avail them.—(Hear, hear.) Would they put an end to the distress ?—(Hear, hear.) What could they do for the poorer inhabitants of Stockport ? The military would not avail them.—(Hear, hear, hear.) The people would not break out unless they were actually starving —unless the poor -rates failed them.—(Hear, hear.) He did not wish that anything should be misconstrued. But if they perished, their deaths would be at the door of the Government. Englishmen ought net be allowed to starve, and they would not suffer themselves to starve.—(Hear, hear.) At the close of the Session Hon. Members opposite might go to the Con tinent and to the rural districts, but what were they going to do with them ?—(Hear, hear, hear.) They must answer that tpiestion.—(Cheers.) The people of Stoapprt Fame to them with clean hands. Mr. Twisel ton, the Aisistant Pope-le se Commissioner, speka of the people there in high terms for their willingness to work and their unwillingness to have paupers amongst theM:. hear.) They wanted - not charity nor an alteration Of the PeOr-leYv—afpßa 4PanFlmt they wan ted the means to obtain work.—(tiear, hear.) ttey wanted to be allowed to live by their industrious hands. —(Hear.) They waniee. alone.—(Cheers.) Whatever befell them lay at the door of the floiesngfenF ttit Tiop t ie. 7 -jliectr, hear.) They could not o thiployrneiii at+home'; the pest wor k me n were going abro a d, an d l eav i n g t,he i- wbrst behind them. They were going to the western countries to work the machinery and d coal mines of America, where bituminous coal was to be got, for he saw it himself, for Id. a bushel. They were not going by tens and hundreds to teach others, but they were going in thousands to live.—(Cheers..) They were sowing seeds broad cast over the great Western continent which would grow up a better crop.—(Loud cheers.) There was nothing like it since the revocation of the edict of Nantes, and the dispersion ofartists by the Duke of Alva from Belgium.—(Cheers.) For himself he did not look at this question with party : views. When he came into that House he looked at the Noble Lord the Mem ber for London as the leader of the Liberal party, but he was as little disposed to join him as the Right Hon. Baronet when he did not take the right course.— (Hear, hear.) He believed he voted against him four out of five times. Therefore, he had no party spirit in the matter, but he insisted on some measures, and he would take advantage of all the forms of the House to get relief. lie confessed he - "did not think any rational man ought to envy the position of the Right lion. Baro net.—(ffear.) He gave him credit for the difficulties with which he was surrounded.—(Hear. hear.) He made no opposition to him as an individual— (Hear, hear)---but again he said this question must be met with out quibbling about machinery, and something must be done before they separated this session. —(Loud cheers.) Mr. FERRAND was surprised that the Hon. Member for Greenock had brotight forward the present motion, as nothing could result from it but a grant of money. The shopkeeper would tell them that the cause of the distress was the truck system and the frond in manufactures ; which fraud had been carried to such an extent, that the London shopkeepers did not dare to admit to their cus tomers that they procured their goods from Manchester. —(A laugh.) The manufacturers should recollect that their best market was in the agricultural districts. An other cause of the distress was that capital alone was protected, and labour starved. The working classes asked for protection for their labour. It was the duty of Government to legislate so that every man should be protected, and no Government could long hold the reins of power which did not make protection the polar star of its legislation. Mr: VILLIERS in listening to all that had fallen from the Hon. Member for Macclesfield, and the Hon. Member for Knaresborough, had only heard what had already been said by those who had preceded them, by the Ministers of the Crown on a former evening, and those were the only reasons-that had been given for re fusing to take into consideration - the cause of the dis tresses of the country. He hoped the people would read those speeches, and remember that those were the only reasons that had been given .for the shutting the door of the House in their faces, and refusing any inquiry into their distresses. The lion. Member for Stockport had said that, from the apathy exhibited by the Government and by Hon. Gentlemen opposite, he did not believe that they thought that distress wa; really existing, which, in words, they seemed inclined to admit. He differed in opinion on that point from his Honourable Friend. He thought they were perfectly aware and believed in the existence of the distress, but they also ,believed that the people would be quiet—that they had no reason to be afraid—(Cheers)—and on that ground alone they acted.—(Cheers.) The only question they asked was, Are the people . quiet ? = (Cheering and counter-cheering.) God g rant they might continue quiet—(Cheers)—but the House should recollect that there was a point beyond which human endurance could not go—(Cheers)—and every hour brought fresh accounts from the country calculated to create the deepest alarm.—(Hear, hear.) If the present motion had no other merit, it had at least afforded an opportunity to the Government—had called-upon it to state its views as to the present condition of the people, what was its opinion as to the causes of the distress under which the people were suffering, and what were the prospects of the future. It was the duty of a Government to state its opinions on these subjects, either to afford relief, or to state at once that it could not do so. Now he would ask if any thing had fallen from any Minister of the Crown, which ought to satisfy the people that ther condition was in evitable?—(Hear, hear.) `Would what had been stated by the Ministers satisfy the people ? Would they be satisfied with a few phrases of sympathy—(Cheers) —and a cowardly sneer at machinery—(Loud cheers)—without the boldness openly to denounce it?—(Continued cheer.) Then they were told of over-production, which meant simply that the peeple wore too badly off to purchase commodities. They exhausted the means of the people by their monopolies, and then talked of over-production. —(Cheers.) The Hon. Member for Knaresborough talked of the home market and of the agricultural population forming the greater portion of it—there could not be a greater fallacy.—(Hear, from Mr. Ferrand.) Did the Hon. Gentleman mean to say that the great proportion of the population of the country was agricultural?— (Hear, hear, from Mr. Ferrand.) The Hon. Gentleman might make statements of that sort in the House, but he had really , much better go and inform himself on the sub ject. If he would look at the official returns of the census he would find that whereas in 1811 the agricultural po pulation was in the ratio of two to one as compared with the rest of tha community, in 1831 the ratio had been precisely reversed, and the agricultural popu lation only bore the proportion of one to two.—(Hear.) The Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Ferrand), who pretended that he represented the working classes, stated that those classes did not wish for a repeal of the Corn- lime. But let it be remembered, that upwards of two millions of our population had petitioned for a repeal of the Corn-laws, and upwards of three millions had petitioned for a -shange in our legislative system. On each of those questions the Hon. Gentleman the Member for Knares borough voted against the expressed wishes of the peo ple. The Hon. Gentleman appeared, on all occasions, to think that what the people wanted was charity, and the relief afforded in the workhcuse ; but he (Mr. Villiers) begged to say that the Hon. Gentleman misrepresented the English people, who did not want charity, but a fair field ,for the exercise cf their in dustry, and who abhored pauperism as much as any other class in the community. He had that day had an interview with the Delegates of the Anti-Corn-law League, and the unanimous feeling among those gentle men was, that the advocates of some remedial measure to meet the prevailing distress, should not cease in their efforts to press the subject on the consideration of Par liament, while any opportunity of doing so was offered. As an instance of the state in which the country was now plunged, he would; refer to the case of Bilston and its neighbourhood, containing 700,000 souls, now left almost totally without employment, and involved in the deepest distress. It was the belief of these men that all the evils under which they suffered might be remedied, if the Corn-laws were repealed, and the markets of the world thrown open for their productions in exchange for articles of provi sion. He would refer to the statistics of the United States in proof of the capabilities which that country possessed of supplying us with food, for the purpose of showing that if we had a free trade with the United States all the privations which our people now endure would cease. A gentleman in Liverpool had lately re ceived a letter from a correspondent in America, in which the writer stated that the opening of the Erie Canal would enable the agricultural produce of a country com prising 90,000 square miles to enter for the first time the port of New York; and again the State of Ohio contained 4,000 square miles of good soil ; so that in all there were on the United State s side', of te Great Lakes, nearly 100,000 square miles from which wheat was- now sent to Ne w York, but from which not one bushel could have been sent in the year 1830. This correspondent also stated that being unable to ex change their corn for our manufactures, they were be ginning to manufacture for themselves. It was stated also that immense tracts to the north of the Mississippi were capable of growing corn and wheat, and that the most distant parts of them were to be reached in twenty days. The superiority of the, wheat grown in the west ern States was also worthy of notice. The duties on importation from America had not increased for many years at all in proportion to the increase of the population. To America our Corn-laws were very injurious, • and the greatest minds of the Urn to States considered the movement going on ti England for their abolition, as opening a grand prospect to the people of that country. He was sorry to detain the House with these details, but. they must re collect that thousands would look anxiously o n th e mor row to what had been said in the house on this ques tion ; and it was to console the people that ho stated these things. England had a double interest in the question, arising not only from the benefit she would derive from obtaining corn from thence, but that the British capital embarked in the public works of America would be rendered more remunera tive.—(Hear, hear.) In the corn lands of America was to be found the great resource of the people of this country. If the present state of things continued, the middle smd the working, classes of the nation must be come united in Condemning the Corn -laws. Everything said in favour of the Corn-laws had been disproved. High wages and good trade at home had been promised as the effects of the Corn-laws, but these promises had been shown' by experience to be fallacious. The peOPle ern assment on the pre sentsaw that the Corn-laws c aused much of their distress, and gave none of the b enefits p r edicted as consequent upon them ; and yet wh en the o peration of those laws tinauserathiseinmg th . occasion, because from thepeculier manner in which Mr. ROEBUCK p the motion was worded , it was impossibl e for him to sup port it ; and yet, on the oth er ha nd , knowing w e ll t h e in knowing also that they must, of necessity, leans whether any por tion of the di s t ress to which the rlcfe of food,, they we re go i ng to con elt some barr tentions of the Hon. Member o brou g h t i t forward ; motion referred could be remedied by legislation, he felt unable to vote against it. He thought it of import ance to consider what would be tho conduct of gentle men opposite, but particularly of Ministers, if this pro. position of the Hon. Member for Gr eenock were assented to by them. That proposition- pledged the Ministers of the Crown to provide sustenance and work for the poor. It was a proposition which appeared to him so fraught with mischief that he would not, in any shape whatever, be a party to passing those resolutions. If the Right Honourable Baronet acceded to it he would show himself unfit to .be a Minister of the Credit ; he would he drawing not only the people but himself: He (Ur. Roebuck) thought gentlemen on that ( t h e Opposition) side of the House had a right to complain that a proposition of this sort should be brought forward at a time when they admitted the existence of the distress, and were , anxious to devise a remedy for it—a propes4 l 9. which s involved them in the diffieulty either bf SuPPP rt ! u g that 'which was false and itnproper, or of letting itgo forth -to the public that they were opposed' to blimp( n the !patter, and were not fiend to the people- :9: Il l s Plvil part he certainly felt that he was nbt ih a position to support the motion of the Hon. Member for Greerck lie however. Hell. Gentlemen OD nosi - tfreons t wer this question, not as it-was placed iii'the paper notice before the House, i),ef fs# Si ftiff q eofne ‘) deckl e d either th a t night "Or 01 some e.thei•:tinle not far . diatan't:=alear.) Let' them throw asitio for ever all- party feelings, consider theniselveS as brethren, met for the put, pose of legislating for a great and large community, that must be dear to them.--(Hear, hear.) What, then, was the cause of the distress ? He believed it was not solely to be attributed to the Corn-laws. But allowing to Hon. Gentlemen all the addition to the distress which was made from over production and the monetary dis tress of America, he would Still ask if the narrowing of the markets, which was occasioned by the Corn-laws, was not a great cause of distress? He believed, however, that if they had the most unrestricted trade, there would be periodic recurrences of distress.—(Hear.) There were things which no Government could do, to procure sustenance and labour for the people. They ought therefore to distinguish between what could, and what could not, be done by legislation.—(Hear, hear.) The maintenance of a whole people could not be procured by alms. It must come from themselves.—(Hear, hear.) But while he admitted that the whole distress could not be done away with, he thought it might be partially alleviated. And how ? By an alteration of the Corn laws.—(Hear, hear.) Th a t was within the grasp of the Legislature. And if it could be shown that such a re sult would be produced by an alteration of the Corn laws, how could those who, for their own private gain, maintained those laws, justly —to themselves such a line of conduct ? And in, his opinion there could be little doubt, that even besides the admission of corn into this country, the opening of foreign markets to the produce of their manufactures, which would be created thereby, would operate powerfully to mitigate and re duce the present intense destitution of the people. But he would say, what prevents the remedy ? lie would be told the cold-hearted selfishness of a body of men who, for the benefit of themselves, maintained those laws. lie did not think that those were the motives of the landed interest; he did not believe they were actuated by bad motives ; but he . would tell them to look to their starving countrymen, and to remember that it was by an extension of trade alone that the people. could obtain labour. Seeing those laws were admitted by all high authorities to b mischievous, he would ask, then, if they would maintain them? He would appeal to their pru dence, their generosity, and their good feeling, if it was wise to create this difference between those who lived by labour in land, and by labour in manufactures. He asked them, not to repeal the laws, but to inquire—that was the question put by the-lion Member for Greenock, and inquiry was refused, on the ground that it would lead to a repeal of those laws. There could be no doubt that the Corn-laws were not the sole cause. There were other causes. He pointed to various parts in the tariff which required to he re-considered. There was the Brazils ; there was the timber trade ; there were other parts in the tariff which required reconsideration which had produced, and were producing great mischief—mis chief that had increased, was increasing, and ought to be diminished. He would take care that before they separated the House should have an opportunity of de ciding distinctly on the question to which he had al luded—first, whether the people were in a state of great distress ; next, whether that distress admitted of a legislative remedy, and if so, that the House ought to inquire what the remedy should be. Those he believed were the points which the Hon. Member for Greenock wished to bring clearly before the House, and he asked that Hon. Member if he could not devise some means of bringing those questions before the House, in place of the ill-judged resolutions now before it. He be lieved that it was practicable to do so. If the Hon. Member would allow the original question, which was, that the Speaker do leave the chair, to be put and carried to-night, the same question must be again put on when the question in its amended shape could be brought forward in such a manner as to obtain the ap proval of thinking people. He besought them to do their duty as the representatives of the Commons, who were suffering under the dreadful distress, by first inquiring into the disease and then providing some remedy. Mr. FIELDEN moved that the debate be adjourned. Mr. WALLACE besought his Hon. Friend to with draw his motion and to let the division be taken before the House separated. With regard to the wording of the resolution he was not wedded to it, and in accordance with the suggestion of the Hon. Member for Bath he would agree to his alteration, and consent to the leaving out the latter part of the sixth resolution or any other part that any Hon. Member might suggest.—(Loud laughter.) He had, before Bringing the resolution for went, asked the Speaker if it was competent for him to make any alteration in the resolutions of which he had given notice, and had been informed that it was not. A great part of the object which he had had in view had been obtained, for, during the discussion, the state of the country had obtained a much greater degree of attention than he had anticipated or expected. He hoped his Hon. Friend would withdraw his motion and suffer the division to come on to-night. Mr. FIELDEN, who rose Ittnitlst cries of " adjourn " and "go on," said that lie did not think it advisable that the debate should be continued at that late hour of the night. He should therefore persevere in his motion for an adjournment. Sir R. - PEEL said that the question had been before the House since Friday last, and he asked, he would not say of the courtesy, but of the justice of the House— (Hear, hear)—that they should dispose of the subject that evening. The House t hen divided, and the numbers were— For the adjournment Against it Majority against the adjournment On the original motion being put, Mr. lIINDLEY moved that the House do now adjourn. "Mr. CALLAGHAN seconded the motion. The gallery was again cleared for a division. The numbers were— For the motion lB Agaipst it _ - Majority against the adjournment —195 On our return to the gallery we found Sir R. PEEL addressing the House. He said he knew the power which individual Members had to obstruct the business of the House, and considering that the de bate had now lasted a week, he must leave to the house and the country to judge of the propriety of such ob structions. He certainly thought it a duty he owed the public to guard as far as he could against the establish ment of such a precedent, which in the present case was a most unjust one. Mr. WALLACE said that there were several Hon. Gentlemen who had not yet spoken during the debate, and who intended to deliver ,their sentiments on the subject. The country would appreciate his resolutions, and none more than the sixth one, though it did not exactly suit the parliamentary feelings of some Hon. Gentlemen. But out of doors it would be under stood. He would not withdraw his resolutions, but he was willing to go to a division now. Sir B. PEEL said he was willing to go on with the debate on Tuesday, and it was not his fault that it was not proceeded with. Mr. FIELDEN said that he was desirous of addressing the House on a subject of such importance, and as he could not do so at that late hour, lie would move the ad journment of the debate till Monday.—(oh, oh.) General JOHNSTON said the question was, whether they would refuse to adjourn, for some thirty hours, in a case where bread was asked for the people ? Mr. ESCOTT-said (amidst loud cries of " Oh, oh !" and " Spoke, spoke")—that the time was now come when it would be advisable to stop such proceedings, by al tering the rules of the House with regard to adjourn ments.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. COBDEN said if any such attempt were made, he should feel it his duty to attend in his place to defeat it, by moving perpetual adjournments.—(Laughter.) Strangers were ordered to withdraw and the House divided on the question of adjournment, when there ap peared— For the adjournment Against it 209 _ _ 'Majority against the adjournment —l9O Before the gallery was opened, The House divided on the original question, when there appeared— For Mr. Wallace's resolutions Against them 49 174 Majority against the resolutions -125 Sir R. PEEL then moved that the House should re soh e itself pro forma into a Committee of Supply. The House accordingly went into a Committee of Supply, Mr. GREENE in the chair ; the Chairman im mediately reported progress, and obtained leave to sit again on Monday. The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the House adjourned at a Quarter to Three o'Clock. MR. HUME AND HIS MOTION FOR RETURNS OF THE SERVICE OF FLAG OFFICERS IN THE NAVY. On Thursday, when the gallery was cleared, after the motion for adjournment of the house (the hour then a quarter to two o'clock) was decided, Mr. Ilume again moved the adjournment of the debate, and the propriety of giving the returns was strongly urged by Admiral Dundas, Commodore Napier, and Captain Pechell. Af ter some time Sir Robert Peel thought proper to agree to the adjournment of the debate, which leaves the question open for discussion on Monday next. We are sorry to see the old Tory course of refusing to let the House have returns of the nature asked for by Mr. Hume, and it is to be hoped that there are in the House a sufficient num ber of Members who will support him, and insist on the information being furnished. An excuse was given by Mr. Sydney Herbert, the Secretary to the Admiralty, that th e making out the returns would occupy so much tim e o f the office, that the other busineis of the Admiralty would be incommoded ; and it is to be regretted that Mr. Charles Wood, late Secretary to the Admiralty, sup ported that absurd defence, and actually voted against the motion. We desire to explain what the nature of the return called for by Mr. Hume was, that the country may see the commencement of a system of secrecy in the proceedings of the Admiralty Bnard. In the Report of the Commissioners for inquiring into the promotons in the Navy and Army, laid before the llcitse in 1840, it is stated, that in order to show the extent and nature of the promotions, of flag-officers in the navy, the Com missianers had directed a Return of the services of each flag.officer to be made out and laid Wore them, to see not only how long their names had been on the list of the navy, but how long they had actually served the country from whom they received their half- ay and the table or return of services of all the thig' illeer s promoted by the two preced_ing 13revetS, as appended to the liepqrt IRid before' the Commons' in 1840 (see page 322). 'Afr. Hume asked for a continzai(imi of the same land of return of the services of the fiAg'officers pro moted a last Brevet. It was sot a new or NlkeitVl r.etuyn o, A„r, iniagination, hat a e9ntinuatton of the return prpp qr p4 h., A aNer of the CoreT.l'Lloners of inquiry, and that is thg retimnqused. Commodore Nader t 1.1:: Muse, as Mr. Hume had done, that as every officer promoted was required to give, and actually did give in a list of his services, the labour to complete Hon; member for Montros e tile return required by the was only 0 . Copy those statements,. And as th e Hon. Member offered to send his own clerk to 44 . tie P°P3 l l no excuse of that kind could be admitted. It ull7 be well to explain the nature of the Report and Return given already of all flag-offi cers promoted, for example up to the 28th of June, 1835, and of which a continuation was asked for. Admiral Drummond is stated to have entered the navy in May, 1780, and his whole service in commission is stated to have been nine years, eleven months, one week, and two days ; by which, the Commissioners re port that, after deducting, we will suppose eight years, for his service as a boy and Midshipman (which is the average service before promotion to be Lieutenant), the whole service in the navy of his country of Admiral Drummond, whose name is in the promotion of Ad mirals of the 221 Jtily, 1830, was under two years, and for that two years' service he has the title of Admiral, and the pension of a naval officer from the public, since the year 1792, i.e. 40 years' pension for two years of service as an officer in the navy. Is it to be wondered at that the expenses of the country are great. when such proceedings are allowed ? We will give another example of the service of Admirals, for which the rank and pensiona of the public are given. In page 323 of the appendix to theßepert, itis stated that Sir L. Curtis, Bart., entered the naval service on the 2d of June, 1795 ; that he was in active service only seven years, five months, two weeks, and two days, and if we deduct the period of six years, that by the rules of the service he ought to have been in the navy as a ,boy and Midshipman before he could be promoted to be a Lieutenant, it appears by that return. that his whole service as an officer in the navy was less than one-and a-half years, and for that service he has. been paid by the public, i. e., he has been on full and half-pay for forty eight years for that short service of one and a half years to the country. Mr. Hume declared that he wanted the continuation of the returns to enable him to bring forward the promo tions in the navy as an abuse of the .powers of the pre rogative, and a waste of public money. We shall see ' how far the refusal of Sir Robert Peel to give the in formation to the House will be supported by the Mem bers of the Commons, in the present state of the finances especially. The question stands adjourned ; and we trust the first opportunity will be taken to have the return ordered. DISTRESS IN THE COUNTRY. MEETING OF DISSENTING MINISTERS AND CONGREGATIONS. Yesterday evening a meeting of the Dissenting Minis ters and their respective congregations, in the neighbour hood of the metropolis, was held in the Finsbury Circus Chapel, for the purpose of considering the present awful distress so general throughout the country, and hearing the statements of several clergymen from the provinces, relative to the facts in connection with the distress, which came under their cognizance in their capacity as Christian pastors. Thomas Price. Esq., D.D., in the Chair. The large and roomy chapel, with its two tiers of galleries, was tilled almost to suffocation by a most respectable audience, who seemed to manifest the deepest sympathy and interest in the proceedings of the meeting. The Rev. Mr. Lows, of Forfar, after some preli minary observations, said that he, in conjunction with other clergymen, some of them members of the Esta blished Church, had gone from door to door in the town of Forfar for the purpose of ascertaining the real situa tion of the working classes there, and, as the result of his own personal observation, he could state, that out of a population of 1,402 families, containing 5,012 indi viduals, 139 were liVing on a sum averaging from 6d. to 9d. per day ; 193 men, earning from ss. to ss. Gd. a week ; 386 had only from 4d. to 44d. a day ; and 853 were dragging out a miserable existence on 3d. per day. Again, there were 1,533 persens who had only 31d. to live on during the day, whilst 169 had only the incredi ble sum of from three farthings to one penny to live on during the twenty-four hours. Such was the state of the working classes in Forfar ; but lie was also sorry to be obliged to add that their spiritual as well as temporal interests were affected by this, inasmuch a s th e p eo pl e had not the means of attending their religious ob servances, from the want of decent apparel. The conse quence of this state of things was increasing disaffection and demoralization ; and in proof of the latter assertion he would state that in 1836 there were only 90 com mittals from the criminal tribunals, while in 1841 there were 202, and of all these latter the greater num ber were for thefts, not of valuable articles, but of mere eatables. The maternal instinct was as inherent in the breast of the emaciated and pauperised mother who nourished her child with the last life springs of an ex hausted frame as lit the Dechess who entrusted her offspring to the charge of a stranger, and supplied its void with a lap-dog . —(llear, hear.) After some further observations, and "detailing several cases of individual misery, with which the reports of the proceedings of the Anti-Corn-law Delegates have rendered the public painfully familiar, the Rev. Gentle man sat down amidst loud cheers. The Rev. Mr. MASSIE, of Manchester, next rose and sail he was grateful for having an opportunity to address his fellow Christians of the metropolis, and more espe cially so when it was en behalf of the poor. It was, scarcely necessary for him to enter upon the d e t a il s o f sufferino• b which were of daily occurrence i n hi s na ti ve town, but still he feared that the condition of their fel low Christians and countrymen in the provinces, was but little understood by their brethren in London.— ( Hear, hear.) A proposition had been made that 1,000 of the starving artisans ,of Manchester should be enabled to come as a deputation to London by a public subscription, and the reason why inch a proposition was entertained was, that they believed if the people of London were aware of the misery and distress which pervaded the provinces, they would not for. a moment appear so apathetic as they had done. He knew there were many claims as Christians upon the people of London, and therefore he could not expect that they should come forward with charitable contributions, nor would he desire it, for much as he would cherish the heart of charity, he never would encourage the feeling of dependence on eleemosynary aid.—( Hear, hear, and cheers.) Noble, generous, warm hearted John Bull had been contrasted - with the poor rrostrate Paddy. He gloried in his own feelings of inde pendence in other days, but that feeling is now fast going. —(A Voice—" It is gone.") It was coming to the last point, but still they should struggle to regain it, It was not a spirit of idleness that kept the people prostrate, for he could assure the meeting that there were thousands in Lancashire who worked from six o'clock in the morning until ten at night to earn 4s, a week. " Hope deferred taaketh the heart sick I" and if a man saw that he laboured six times 15 hours to earn 4s, as his reward was it a wonder if he reversed the order of the well-known sentiment, and turned his ploughshare into a sword ? Mr. Massie then detailed several of those heart-rending scenes of distress which render Eng land the scorn and pity of the civilised word ; and con tinued to say, that . distressing as the scenes which he described were, they were scarcely worse than the con dition superinduced by those in the mid , lle classes.— (Hear, hear.) Ho would refer as briefly as possible to the state of the shopkeepers, such as bakers, butchers, grocers and the like, in several parts of Lancashire. Returns had been made to him, by which he would be enabled to institute a comparison between the income of this class of tradesmen in the years 1839 and 1841. The returns related to the receipts of 13 bread and provision dealers, 14 butchers, 10 grocers and tea-dealers, and 13 drapers, all men of the highest character and respecta, bility. In the year 1839, their aggregate receipts amounted to 197,7001., in 1841 they were 130,1001., making a difference in two years of 67,0001., and shortly before be came to London he had been in• formed by these parties that their income up to this period of 1842 was at least 15 per cent. less than what it was at the termination of the year 1841, thus reducing their receipts to about 110,0001. instetul 'of 197,000/., or little more than one-half in two years. In 1839 the poor -rates were only Is. 4d. in the pound, and he was in fo.:med by the overseers that this year they would be at least 4s. The shopkeepers were coming down fast to the level of the paupers, and he could state that many of them in Manchester, to his own knowledge, did not taste butchers meat during the week..—(Hear, hear.) In the years 1835, 1836, and 1837, the average number of cattle sold weekly in Salford was 700, while last week, when, owing to the propitious weather, th e greatest plenty might be expected in the market, only 361 were sold. He had been'aaked by a friend whether he con sidered himself Justified as a minister of religion in mixing himself up with the angry polities of the day, but be (Mr. Massie) would ask, could a roi mster of religion—that religion which exorts you to love your fellow-man as yourself, be aware of these facts, and abstain from joining in endea• vouring, constitutionally, to obtain an amelioration in the condition of the suffering people ? Let them go to the home of the working man, and then they would see the child perishing in 'its spring -time for want of food, while the parent was sad, and muttering vows of vengeance agsanst his oppressors, for to this it had come at last. The people spoke of it openly • they said they only wan t e d . l ea d ers, and he feared that such would Pat long be wanting. In conclusion, he would call upon all those who were ministers ' to lose no time in • convening their brethren, and imploring Providence to avert the evils which seem to threaten - this country, and calm down those angry feelings by which the masses seemed actuated, and which, unless speedily soothed, would lead to a sanguinary revolution.--(Loud and long continued cheering.) Mr. GEORGE TEIOMPSON addressed the meeting in a long and eloquent speech, in which he, stated that eight or nine months ago those in power strenuously denied the statements with respect to the distress of the country, but now they had it on the anthority of the Home Secre ary that there was in Great Britain upwards of 1,300,000 persons dependent upon parish relief, and read several extracts from the Right Hon. Baronet's memorable work on Corn and Currency, which, with Mr. Thompson's caustic observations, caused much laughter. Amongst those present we remarked the following Rev. Gentlemen:—Bev. J. U. Hinton, James Carlile, Gilbert, Dr. J. P, Smith, G. Evans, J. Miram, J. Ad: y, J, G, Vuller, J. Angus, T. Aveling, J. Raban, J. Nellor, M. Pittan, E. Halliday, M. Pennan, Rev. J. W. Massie, Manchester; Rev, Dr. Hough, Glasgow; M. Lowe, Forfar Dr, King, Glasgow ; Dr. Perry, St. Luke's, Kingsland; W. Harrison, Tottenham; Mr. Da hourg, Clapham ; J. H. Morgan, Stourbridge ; Mr. Muller, Amsterdam ; Mr, Ferguson, Bicester, &e. Re. The meeting separated shortly after one o'clock. ALF-FARTHINGS. A writer, addressing the Master 0.1 the Mint, says—.." You have invented a new coin. Axn have you shrunk from giving it an original name ? The eeusequonee will be that there mu s t b e an a ddi t i on al column in ou r tradesmen's ledgers, ' a. d. q. iq.' and an *sack may cost Is. iq., or lid. and so on. May n ot this in convenience be avoided by the disus e of the word 4 farthing , and by th e a dopti o n o f th e wor d 4 octave' tbr the half farthing? The entry or the price of the article will then he Is. lid., or 10, 11 The Right Hon; C. T. DTyncourt paired off on Thursday night with Dr. Nicholl, in favou r of Mr. Banne r . man's motion on the Corn-laws. Mr. Marjoribanks has paired off with Mr. Astell from the let to the Bth instant znclusive. imumwou HAMBURGH MAIL. DRESDEN, JUNE 27.--In consequence of the long. , continued drought, the Elbe is so low that our steamers cannot move ; but the Bohemia steamer, drawing much less water, still continues to ply between this and Jeahen. It is high time to make every exertion to remove the obstruction of the navigation of this great German river, which is above 700 miles in length. ST. PETERSBURG'', Joit: 25.—His Royal Highness the Princ:! of Prussia arrived on the 21st, in good health, at the Palace of Peterhoff. . . . DAN-rzlc:JuNr. 2; .—Yesterday evening, at ten o'clock, the two Russian steam-boats, the Kamschatka and Bogota, the latter of which had just before taken his Majesty our King on b oar d, l e ft this port for Cronstadt. HANOVER, JULY 2.—His Majesty the King left. Ro tenkirchen yesterday afternoon to go to Ems. A LTONA JULY .—The King of Denmark has tic ceded to the ') le petition of a Company, to make an iron railway from Altona to Kid. HAMBURG/1, JULY -I.—The Committee appointed by the Senate has published to-day, the 4th. a list of the contributions fur the aid of Itlatuburgh, including• the money received by the Relief Committee. The amount received - up to the 2241 of June, in the evening, is at;out :;,230,000 marks banco. HiNovEn, JULY 2.—yes terda y afternoon, about live otelock, we had a thunder storm. with torrents of rain, and such a hurricane that not only were the roofs 01' many houses in the city much damaged, but the largest trees were broken, and a whole row of smaller trees were torn up by the roots. All the booths and tents erected for a fete of the citizens, to-morrow, were levelled i‘ith the ground, and the boards carried ton great distance.— Ifamburgh Papers, July 5. BELGIAN t UNDS-13kUMEle, JULY 6 _ . Actual Debt. iSi per Cent. _ 5: h e Rothschild's Loan, 5 per Cent RV Loan of Thirty Millions, 4 per Cent. 93 • Spec Cent. — --.-- 71% (1840) lO2l Loan of City, IV3. 4 per Cent. __. -. le, i, ..... Tbirty.seven. Society of Coinmeice:4 hi per sank of Belgium. 5 per Cent... ...... 75% National Society Exchange on London (short) ....... —Brussels Papers, July 6. MONEY MARKET and CITY NEWS. FROM THE MORNISG PAPERS OF YESTERDAY. POST.—An absurd rumour, to the elect that Sir Robert Peel had been shot a'., caused the funds to decline I ,i per cent. Although it never was generally believed, and, after inquiries promptly made, almost immediately contradicted, still the mar ket had not recovered from the effect at the close of business. TIMES.—The collection of the income-tax at the present moment being an all-absorbing subject, every information to be gleaned respecting the mode in which it is to be carried on is of course of general interest . To-mot row the dividends are payable to the public, and hence the following novice has been issued by the Bank of England to those whose income is such as to exclude them from the operation of the tax : " Bank of England, July 6, 1842, TO RECEIVERS OF DIVIDENDS WHOSE TOTAL. INCOI4I is IJ\DER I 50i. " If your total income is less than FA. annum, your claim for a return of the tax must be made to the Commissioner* of the district in which you reside. " The assessor of your parish will supply you with the ne cessary forms." As a great many questions have arisen as to whether a sove reign placed on the balance ought to turn it, it is important to know that the Bank of England to-day decided that all sove reigns presented at their counters which shall be ma the balance shall be taken as legal weight. The new silver coinage will be issued to the public to-morrow, and it is understo o d th at t h e Bank vaults, both yesterday and the day before, received large supplies from the Mint. The dealings in the English Stocks to-day were to a certain extent unfavourable to the maintenance of that firmness which has within the last day or two been exhjbited in this market, and the cause of the decline visible in the quoted prices at the close of the business is alleged to be the re-action which gene rally follows a rise in values brought about more by speculation& than real and bona . fide bargains. There was also some little tight ness experienced in respect to money, but. the borrowers, only in a few instances, paid increased rates, the supply of te-rnor row bring expected considerably to increase by the payment of the dividends. Our letters from Amsterdam contain some particulars rela tive to the capitalization -contract between the Dutch &rem ment and the t• Handelmaatschappy," which was lately ratified by the Second Chamber of th e States -General. By • the ori ginal contract made in the reign of William 1., which is elated • July, 1840, it was provided that the Government should pay yearly to the " Handelmaatschappy" the sum of h,b00,000 guilders, so that the 39,000,000 due by the (vovernment, to gether with 5 per cent. interest, would be paid off in 1849. When report had made some of the members of the Second Chamber acquainted with this contract, which was very oner ous to the Treasury, they insisted so much on the necessity of changing its conditions, that the Government resolved to pre vail on the '° Handelmaatschappy" to alter them. The conse quence was that a new contract was made in Alarch .1841, ac cording to which the interest alter that year was to be only 4 per cent., while the reimbursements of the principal would be so diminish, d, that in 1850 there would still remain a sum of about 10,500,000 guilder.. The object of the altera tion seems to have been that the state should not be deprived 1,000,000 guilders of its income in the first years. It ap pears by the same letters that the holders of " United States Bank" bonds, issued by Messrs. Hope and Co., are displeased that that firm exchanged the Louisiana bonds, which were giveu as &special pledge by the bank, for those of Pennsylvania. Even at the time the exchange was made the Penusylvank were quoted in London at a less price than the Louisiana And they continue to be of less value now. As many persons may be uneasy at not reeeivinsv answers to their letters sent to India rite Falmouth on thP. of March, it may be a rebel for them to know, that by a Post-office notice published at Bombay, it appears that a box of the letters tent on that date received so much damage that many • were' cow pletely destroy e d, some were 'partially injured, and oth ers were left without any address. 11.10. t of the last-mentioned class appear to have been family letters. ASSIZE INTELLIGENCE. 110.11 E C 7 liCl7 T-11(r(fi,rd, Fricluy, JO / CI VII. slot:. (Before Lord AHISOCH and a Special Jury.) COOK C. THE AYLESIH. RAILWAY. coNr , A:vr. This was an action to recover the anumut of damage sustained by the plaintiff in consequenco of some of his cows having been run over by a train upon the railway. Sergeant Shee mid Mr. Wordsworth were for ,tlw plaintiff; Mr. Morffagn Chambers, Mr. Peacock, and Mi. Rose, for the defendants. The defence set up was, that - the Directors bad done all the law required them, and that the gate in question was properly erected, and in good condition at the time of the accident; and witnesses were called, who swore positively that they examined the gate before and after the accident, and that it was perfectl> . , secure, and it was alleged that the- accident must have occurred through some person opening, the gate. Lord ABINGEIS said there was no donbt that the Railway- Company were bound in law not only to erect proper gates and fences in such situations, but also t o t a k e care afterwards that they w ere kept in proper repair. Irthe Jury believed that, from any circumstance, even from the ordinary wear and tear of such an article, the fastenings were defective, and that the gate might have blown open, and so allowed the cattle to get upon the line, the defendants were liable, because they were bound by their Act of Parliament to keep the gates and fences in proper repair. If, on the contrary, they believed the witnesses fur the defence, when they declared the gate to be in a proper and secure state, then they would re turn a verdict in their favour. The Jury returned a verdict for the defendants. - EDWARDS V. LORD LISTOWEL. • The aLove cause has excited a good deal of tnterest in the county, and it was expected that some curious dis closures would be made in reference to the proceedings connected with the recent elections at St. Alban's, be tween the plaintiff who was the agent for the Noble Lord on both these occasions, and the defendant. The declaration set forth, that the plaintiff claimed from the defendant a certain large suns of money for work and labour done, and services performed by him for the defendant. Mr. Chambers, Mr. Gurney, and Mr. G. Taylor, were for the plaintiff ; Mr. Sergeant Shoe, and 3[r. Peacock, were instructed for the defendant. Before Mr. CHAMBERS could well enter on his state ment he was stopped, and afterwards addressing the jury said that the present proceedings had led to an under standing between the parties, and he had the pleasure to inform them that they would not be troubled any further, as it had been agreed that one of the jury ;Itottld hK withdrawn, and that no verdict should be taken. A juror was accordingly withdrawn. POLICE INTELLIGENCE. MA 111,11011011 G S T 1? E E DARING ROBBERY. —7'homax Biggs, an nrchin between nine and ten years of age, was committed to Newgate for trial, charged with the following impudent and daring robbery : About half-past eight o'clock yesterday the prisoner entered the shop of Mr. Robert Allen, of No. 4 20, Dean-street, Gros venor-square, tobacconist, and asked for a quarter of an mulee of tobacco, and while being served he suddenly made a dash at a pile of cigars lying on the counter, and grabbing up his two hands full, run out of the shop. He was, however, punted and overtaken. On searching him le. sd. were found in his pockets. He was identified as having been previously in cus tody on a similar charge. NUISANCES AT THI ITALIAN OFERA.--FiTe powerful. and stalwart young men, ragged and shoeless, were charged as fol lows : Police-sergeant, No. 24 o f th e A di v i s i on, stated that the prisoners were part of a gang of between 30 and 40, who in. fested the Opera on the nights of performance, and under pre tence of being " linkmen" or " eosch•callers," took the op portunity that offered either of stealing anything that might be left in the carriages, or of soliciting charity, without which" when they got two or three ladies by themselves, they refined to quit the carriage-door. A few evenings since one of the prFsniters, in rushing along the Colonnade, ran against Lady Coventry, ant knocked her Ladyship down with very considerable violence ; however, fortunately, but slight injury was sustained. On the prisoner being spoken to about it, he made answer, " flow the h-11 could I help it ? Her Ladyship should stand nut of the was' and let a poor man get his They bait all been repel/Wry cautioned to keep away. A set of persons with badges were ap pointed by the proprietors of the Opera to act as " linkm en. " Mr. liAnnwtot said that be knew the nuisance w as a very intolerable one and must be put down, and he should t h erefor ; commit each of the. prisoner s for one month to hard labour. y, with the mot tri. ttrceoounldTnhoutt otherwise from the r l 2.l;;;;;RE. — The opera of Fier Diavolo tat:::cu3Yecilifferent characters , great - care having been taken success gi by the management that every character should be sustained in the most perfect manner. The reception which the opera te ,•thini3deethPi ceived from a crowded house fully proves that the public ere alive to, and capable of appreciating worth, both as regards 'Llpthaertsscweneerresustained by actors and management. The opera was in every respect west was . perfect ; and when we say that the p g r o i t n u ci p p Miss Romer, Mrs. Stade, the :tJessrs. tlarrhon, Stansbury, and Leffler (of whose excellence the public are perfectly aware), we need scarcely say that the opera was everything that could be wished far. The parts of Lord Alleash and Lorenzo were played by the Messrs. John Webster and Walton very respectably. ALARMING FIR E.---ThllrStiftV night, between ten and. eleven o'clock, a fire broke out on die premises of Mr. Corde roy, a large wool-stapler, in the Bermondsey New-road. The fire originated in a portion of the building used as a drying room. By the speedy arrival of the eagines the fire was fortu nately confined to the room, which was almost entirely con gamed. The tire is supposed to have originated by the heating of a stove. The damage atone is considerable. cast ;Ills tspBohpurr Ito