The Sun. — London, England, 1842-03-08 00:00:00

SPRIIT of the PUBLIC JOURNALS. PROM THE EVENING PAPERS OF YESTERDAY. GLOBE.—We are glad that Lord John Russell means to perform what we deem the duty of again taking the sense of the House of Commons on the principle of the Peel Corn Bill. We do deem it the duty of the party of Trade and Industry to place on reeerd.their solemn protest against this poor palliative of their evils. We give Sir R. Peel all due credit for the degree of discipline he has contrived to introduce amongst his three hundred and fifty myrmidons. The bulk of them may indeed be regarded as schiavi ogni frementi beneath his yoke. Rage, however, as they may, they are compelled to devour their wrath in silence, or to give it vent in other channels than arti culate speech. The Yahoo-like utterances, and in human noises, which have lately been heard in the House, may be ascribed to the stifled spirit of the Tory malcontents ; and here and there one of this Yahoo section of Ministerialists has been suffered to get up, and state " the thing that is not" — provided he 4evelled his statements, not at the Corn Bill, but at the Anti-Corn-law League. Neither Yahoo, nor Yorkshire Hussar, has been allowed any fArther liberty. " The Premier's threat," says the 'Weekly Chronicle, " that he would leave them to fight their own battles, unless they not merely pledged themselves to give a consistent support to is plans in Parliament, but g i v e u p the p r actice of talking against them at their Clubs, has had its effect A Tory of the old school told us the other day that he was perfectly disgusted with the tergiversations of the Carlton Club, where one stripling after another came in to say, 4 I'm satisfied—and rm satisfied—and the average price of wheat will be so and so, under Sir Robert Peel's Bill'—when I'll be hanged if there's one o f them (said our informant) who knows what an ave rage is !" Sir R. Peel may be satisfied with this very intelligent unanimity; and we are satisfied that the whole responsibility of the measure should rest on his Govern ment ; and that he should have full force to carry exactly what he proposes. It rests, however, with those who regard his proposals as founded on a false principle—as calculated to evade, not answer, the urgent demands of the most momentous commercial crisis that ever arrived to a nation—it rests with every assertor of regular commerce in the first neces:: saries of life—by his voice or by his vote to attest his con victions of true policy. The time may not be distant when the importance of firmly planting the standard of sound principles will be seen more clearly than it is now. STANDARD.—The high reputation of British Honesty it is well known has done more to promote our commercial greatness than any other cause. It is not necsssary to assume, and we are sure it would be unjust to assume, that all our manufacturers, or even a majority of them, are guilty of the dishOnest practices exposed by Mr. Ferrand ; but it is obvious that some of them must be guilty, even without Mr. Ferrand's evidence ; and Messrs. Cobden and Brotherton acknowledge as mall. If, however, some, and even but a few, are guilty of such practices, that is quite enough to soil the British character in foreign markets—quite enough to suggest foreign rivalship--quite enough to explain the anxiety of the members of the League for opening new markets, seeing that British goods have lost all character in the old ones. A cry is raised against Mr. Ferrand, because he has told the truth in this particular, and he is charged with wishing to injure the export trade. This is, however, most unjust. The trade can be injured only by itself—by the employment of worse paid and therefore less skilful workmen, and of inferior materials, thus producing a bad article, which, however disguised by fraud, will soon be detected by the purchaser. We did not understand Mr. Ferrand to charge all manufac turers—indeed, he cautiously guarded himself from being thought to do so. We did not understand him as charging even all the members of the League ; though, by associating with those guilty of the frauds, they show that they do not think very hardly of them. What we understood Mr. Ferrand to say was, that the foreign market for British Bcoda had been injured by such frauds. Messrs. rotherton and Cobden, however, confess that such frauds have been committed; and every one can judge whether great disgrace to British goods must not have arisen from them. We feel, as every one must feel, great difficulty in dealing with the ques tion generally, because we know that many ex cellent men are engaged in manufactures, and that some of them are even compelled, by the tyranny of Competition, to do otherwise what they would not do ; but the interests of hundreds of thousands are at stake, and we may not be silent. The character of British trade, too, through all its departments, is se riously menaced, for the character of the British mer chant will not long survive the character of the goods which he exports. The time, indeed, seems to have arrived when the state of manufactures ought to un dergo a strict investigation by the Legislature. COURlER.—Certain printed documents have just been laid before Parliament in the form of " Papers relating to the moneys received from the Chinese authorities in the city of Canton, under agrvitleA, emoted into with her ar command of her"Vajesty, 1842." From this singular batch of papers we learn officially that , for the arbi trary levy of the six millions of dollars the Superin tendent had no warrant from home, or what could, from any forced construction of general instruc tions, be even interpreted into a warrant, excepting ander the special circumstances of the definitive conclusion of a treaty of peace for the settlement of all differences with China. That the levy was grounded on the condition of the conclusion of a definitive treaty is now denied by Captain Elliot himself, although by the Chinese negotiators it was clearly regarded in that light, as we learn upon the indisputable authority of Captain Senhouse, Naval Commander-in-Chief of fhe operations against Canton, who fell a sacrifice to the chagrin and irritation caused by Captain Elliot's in capacity and unaccountable blunders acting upon a - • frame already perhaps enfeebled by the hardships of service and the rigours of an unhealthy season. Nor in the copy of the Convention arranged with the Can ton functionaries does the money payment stipulated appear to be at all.expressed as, or limited to the sense of. a ransom for the city. Upon the copy transmitted 1 Ft to Superintendent to him the Gallant Senhouse thus observes—" In perusing very attentively the document your Excellency has been pleased to transmit, I cannot avoid considering that the terms -of the arrangement must appear to an unpre judiced person, ignorant of local circumstances, more as a settlement for a general peace, rather than conditions proposed, discussed, and agreed to, for the sole purpose of delivering the city of Canton from the penalties of actual occupation." In the authority given to the Kwang-Choo-Foo by the Commissioners, they clearly state that the English g g bein willin g to Plenipotentiary, ob serve a truce and make arrangements for peace, they, therefore, appoint the K wang-C'hoo-Foo to conduct the details of the pacific arrangement and settlement LAW INTELLIGENCE. HOUSE OF LORDS, March 7. ROYAL BURGHS OF SCOTLAND V. CUNNINGHAME. 3lr. GoanoN addressed their Lord%hips for the appellant Mr. STUART followed on the same side. The ATTORNEY-GENERAL and Mr. MacorfocitiE appeared for the respondents. Their LoRDSHIFS postponed their judgment, LAWRENCE V. BLAEE.—JUDOMENT. Lord COTTENHA M gave judgment in this cue, affirming all the ord.rs appealed from except one, which his Lordship ordered to be reversed. ALLAN Y. ➢RANDER. Lord COTTENUAII also gave judgment in this case, affir, - .-.ing the interlocuters appealed from, with costs. CENTRAL CRIMINAL COURT. James Gissing and James Laidler acre indicted for break ing in o a warehouse. and stealing therefrom a quantity of sacks, the property of Messrs. Richardson, hop merchants, in the borough. On the 24th of February last the warehouse of the prosecutors was left secure at five o'clock in the afternoon. At about nine o'clock one of the men had occasion to go back to the warehouse, and he then found the warehouse broken open, and the prisoners with the sacks in their possession. The prisoners were found guilty. Mr. CLARKSON, who appeared for the prosecution, said that the prisoner Gissing had twice been summarily convicted, and, singular to relate, only a month previous to the present transaction the prosecutor discovered the prisoner Gissing in the act of picking his pocket. The prisoners were then sentenced to be transported for the term of ten years. • Frederick Jones, a young man, who was said to be most re spectably connected !leaded Guilty to an. indictment charging him with the manslaughter of Richard Simmons a fishmonger in Ce.apel-street, Pentonville. Mr. CLaascsoN, on behalf of the prisoner, said the unfortu nate occurrence which gave rise to the present inquiry, hap pened some months since, in a struggle which took place be tween the prisoner and the deceased, during which the latter, who was a very heavy man, was thrown down and several of his ribs were broken. Ile was at that time in a delicate stale of heal' h. and there could be no doubt that the accident aecele rated his death. The prisoner's friends had given the deceased 25/. after the accident occurred, not supposing at the time that it would terminate in his death. The REcoanna, upon looking ever the depositions, saiA it was a case which could not be passed over without some pu nishment, as great violence appeared to have been used by the prisons, The sentence, therefore, was, that he be imprisoned, but without hard labour, in the House of Correction, for three mon ths, and pay a fine of 25i. The Learned Judge, at the same time, said he would give a certificate recommending the fine to be given to the deceased's family. John Oliviere Martin, a genteel youth, l 7 years f age, was indicted for stealing 3001., the prope r t y of W illiam Salmon, his master. It appear,ed from the evidence that the p r i soner had been an apprentice to the prosecutor for about th ree years, and on the morning of the 10th ult. he abseonded with anaher ap prentice of the name of Jones ; and it wa s soon discovered that ar iron-safe in the prosecutor's shop had been broken open, and die sum of 3001. carried away : two days afterwards the prisoner was apprehended at Portsmouth, n4ll a great portion 'of the moneyi nh is possession. fn his cross-examination the prosecutor admitted that he 'kept a " tally-shop," and that the prisoner was in the habit of collecting money, for which purpose he hadf requently occa sion. to go to brothels, the keepers of such places being very good customers of his : the prisoner had been in the habit of collecting from them before he was fifteen years of age : `'474j r y.„1,.. • .-; • it was not a general practice to send the prisoner to such houses. The Jury found the prisoner " Guilty," but strongly recom mended him to mercy on account of the very improper employ. ment assigned to him by the prosecutor. The prisoner was again indicted for stealing a quantity of linen of the value of 401., the property of the same prosecutor, and the Jury a second time returned a verdict of " Guilty," but still adhered to their former recommendation and obser va ions. The Recorder deferred passing sentence. AUSTRALIAN AN D NEW Z EA• LAND EMIGRATION AND LAND FUND. An Adjourned Meeting of the members of this Society was held last night at their offices, 455, Strand, for the pur pose of taking into consideration the measure about to be intro duced into Parliament liyLord Stanley, with respect to the sale of Colonial Lands. Mr. Pim took the Chair, and stated the object of the meet ing. He understood that Mr. Walker had some old despatches to submit to the meeting, in which was a pledge to appropriate the sale of Colonial lands to the purposes of emigration. Mr. WALKER said he had such despatches in his possession, but he had not got them with him. They were dated, June, 1831, and they contained a pledge that the produce of the sale of Colonial lands should be appropriated to emigration. Mr. KINNAIRD wished to put a question io Mr. Walker, whether that pledge had been made pubic ? Mr. WALK ER said it was not made public at the time, but it was afterwards ; and the inhabitants of the Colonies placed implicit confidence in that pledge. A GENTEMAN said that Sir George Gibbs hail denied this two years aso in council. Mr. WALKER said that Sir George Gibbs had denied it, but he afterwards became so convinced of appropriating that fund to emigration, that he stated it in Council to be his belief that the fund ought not to be appropriated to any other purpose. A GENTLEMAN suggested that it would be desirable to coincide with Lord Stanley in his views, with respect to this fund, for he believed that Lord Stanley was a man of talent, and hid the interest of the colonies at heart. He, ther-fore, thought that if they coincided in the measure, they would tie the Government to apply half the produce of the sale to emi gration which was their own proposal ; they could go for the other afterwards. Mr. Hinton said their object was to go hand in hand with Lord Stanley, but they wished to alter his scheme. A GENTLEMAN said he thought they were frightening themselves more than there was any occasion for, for he be lieved that the object of Lord Stanley was to apply not less than one half of the proceeds to emigration, and out of the other half would come the expenses of survey, making roads, building bridges, &c., and the residue of that half to be applied to that object. The CHAIRMAN said if this was their object theycould have no objection to it. After some further discussion on the motion of Mr. Hinton, a COmmittee was formed for the purpose of drawing up a memorial to Lord Stanley, expressive of their views on the measure he is about to introduce to Parliament, and to wait upon his Lordship with it. The Meeting was then adjourned to Wednesday week, when the memorial will be submitted to the Meeting previous to presentation. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS, March 7. The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat on the Wool sack shortly before Five o'Clock. Lord REDESD ALE presented a petition from Newry, praying that wheat might be admitted in preference to foreign flour. The Noble Earl also presented a petition from Wigan, praying that the provisions of the Act relative to licensed vic tuallers in London, preventing them from opening their house before one o'clock on Sundays, or of serving persons under a certain age, might be ex tended to the rural districts. LOAN SOCIETIES BILL. The NOBLE EARL moved the second reading of the Loan Societies Bill. _ _ Lord CAMPBELL trusted that the provisions of the . Bill would be extended to Scotland. Lord REDESDALE said if there was any objection to the second reading, the better course would be for him to postpone the second reading to a future day. The second reading was then postponed. PRESBYTERIAN MARRIAGES. Lord CAMPBELL presented petitions from several parts of Scotland, graying that the Bill with respect to the marriages of Dissenters, might be a declaratory Bill. The LORD CHANCELLOR gave notice of his intention, on Friday next, to move for the appoint ment of a Committee to consider the law relative to marriages in Ireland, with a view to make such altera tions as might be necessary. Lord CAMPBELL said, that all the petitions which he had presented were in favour of the Bill being made a declaratory and not an enact ing Act. He would take that opportunity of putting a question to the Noble and Learned Lord in reference to the subjects which had been alluded to in her Majesty's most gracious Speech from the Throne on the 3d February. In that Speech her Majesty was pleased to say that measures would be introduced to amend the Bankruptcy Laws, and to effect improvement in the Eccle siastical Courts. It was now the 7th of March, and no mention of either of those subjects had yet been made in either House of Parliament by any Mem ber of her Majesty's Government. He begged to ask whether any measure was in contemplation. The LORD CHANCELLOR said that he would introduce a measure on the subject of the Bankrupt Laws on Monday next ; and that a Bill in reference to the Ecclesiastical ul Ement -l uttertreaftorthe 0,- E respect to the Marriage Act he . would - move the second reading of the Bill on Thursday next, when it would be the proper time to discuss the principle. Numerous petitions, praying for an alteration of the law respecting mixed marriages in Ireland, were presented by Lord BROUGHAM and the Marquis of CLANRICARDE, from places in the counties of Down, Tyrone, Armagh, and Londonderry. The Bishop of LONDON presented a petition from Southwark (as we understood), praying for the interference of Parliament for the prevention of burial grounds being formed in populous places. Lord MELBOURNE presented a petition from a place in Ireland relative to Presbyterian mixed mar-. riages. ALGIERS. The Marquis of CLANRICARDE sald he wished to put a question to the Noble Earl, the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, upon a matter of consider ; importance. There had appeared in the newspa , pers of Paris and of this country reports of a conver sation which had taken place between the French Ambassador and the Noble Earl relating to the oc cupation of Algiers by the French. He was aware that it was best to refrain from expressing any opinion or sentiment respecting this transaction, in of der to avoid the possibility of giving offence in any quarter. • No person could be more desirous than himself that the best possible understanding should exist between this nation and the French people, and no person could be more alive to the danger and in- convenience that would arise to both countries and to Europe in general, from even the slightest tem porary estrangement. But as between individuals, so between Governments, a good understanding should always be maintained with respect to the matter, he thought it was best to ascertain the fact, because it was a matter of much importance. and had been made public in the press ; • and he wished to know whether it was true that her Majesty's Government had permitted this country to be committed, as had been stated by the papers He had heard two different versions of the conversation. He would not quote the words attributed to the No ble Earl, but it had been reported by the press of this country, that the first Minister of the Crown had stated that there was no difference in the two expressions. True, the Right Honourable Baronet at the head f the Government did say that there was no substantial difference between the two versions, but from this opinion he (the Noble Marquis) had the mis fortune to differ. He considered there was a very wide and important difference between the two versions. —(Hear, hear.) The first version led to the impression that the Noble Earl, in conversa tion witll the French Ambassador, rather avoided going into the subject of Algiers, and de clined; on the part of his Government, ex pressing any feeling or opinion under existing cir cumstances ; but the other version made the Noble Earl give, on the part of Great Britain, a posi tive and direct acquiescence to the permanent occupa tion and assumption of sovereignty by France in Al giers, and the country overrun by the French. He (the Noble Marquis) thought it not at all likely that the Queen's Minister could have so com mitted the Government and the country to such a step without first communicating with Parliament.—(Hear, hear.) The question, there fore, which he had to put to the Noble Earl was, whe ther, on the part of her Majesty's Government, he had had any communication with the French Ambas sador about the government and sovereignty of Al giers, and the territory occupied by the French ? The Earl of ABERDEEN said the Noble Marquis had been good enough to give him notice of his inten tion, and therefore he (Lord Aberdeen) was now fully prepared with an answer. The Noble Marquis might recollect what ha (Lord Aberdeen) said at the time of the expedition against Algiers, for he believed the Noble Marquis then asked for some expla nation of the negotiations that took place on this subject between the French and the British Governments. In 1833 he (Lord Aberdeen) in consequence of what took place elsewhere, was under the necessity of moving for papers conne c t e d w i t h this subject; and the Noble Earl then at the head of her Majesty's Government, not only had no objection to the production of the papers, but said that he was satisfied with the course he (Lord Aber deen) had taken. ,From that time to the pre sent he (Lord. Aberdeen) had remained silent on this subject. When het Majesty called upon him to take office again he felt that his opinion on this subject would be regarded with some importance by the French Government, considering the part he took when he held office before. He felt he had but one course to pursue, that whatever he might have done if he were recalled to office in 1831, that coming into office in 1841, after ten years' silence, it was ne- cessary to deviate from the course taken Witktreference to this subject by preceding Governments, the was, retaining all the opinions he had before expreSsed, to say nothing about it. The conversation alluded to by the Noble Marquis was quite incidental, arising out of a conference of a confiden tial and friendly nature. • He had no doubt that M. St. Aulaire was perfectly convinced that he made an accurate version of his (Lord Aber deen's) remarks to the French Government, and he was glad to have this opportunity of declaring, that he never had dealt with a more honourable, high-minded man than the French Ambassa dor—(Hear, hear)—and it was a fortunate thing for both countries that France was so repre sented.--(Hear, hear.) But when he (Lord Aber deen) saw in the Moniteur the report of this conver sation, as given in the Chamber of Deputies by M. Guizot, he saw that M. St. Aulaire had fallen involuntarily into an erroneous version of the con versation, and therefore he (Lord Aberdeen) hastened to rectify it, as would be seen by the despatch he wrote to the British Ambassador in Paris. The despatch was dated January 28, and ran thus :—" My Lord, I beg leave to direct your attention to a report in the Moniteur of a speech delivered in the Chamber of Depu ties by M. Guizot, on the 20th. On that occa sion his. Excellency read an account of a con versation that had taken place been M. St. Aulaire and myself in relation to the French possessions in Africa, and which the former transmitted to the French Ministry : In this narrative the Count de St. Aulaire says, I began by asserting the security of our African possessions as of the last importance, which must not be allowed to give way to any consideration, and Lord Aberdeen, after listening attentively, said, ' I am very glad to be able to explain distinctly on this point. I wag Minister in 1830. If you go back to that time I have much to say ; but taking af fairs as they are in 1841, and the state in which things have been left by preceding Cabinets, I look at your possession as a fait accompli, and I have no further observation to make.' This quotation, purporting to be the account of the Count de St. Aulaire, with the exception of the last sentence, is correct. I never said that I had no objection to make to the establishment of the French in Algiers, but that I had no observations to make on the subject, and that it was my inNntion to be silent." The context showed that such was his (Lord Aberdeen's) view, and that decision he had come to after mature reflection. He (Lord Aberdeen) felt that after ten years, any objection at the present moment, would have been MiSplaced. The course which it would have been impossible for him to have adopted then, was now entirely consistent with propriety. It did not follow, if any objection was not expressed that it was not entertained. He had explained to the French Ambassador the misre presentation which he had fallen into, and the erroneous statement which he had made in consequence. With respect to Lord Cowley, that Noble Lord had fulfilled his instructions upon the subjent, and there the matter rested. He (Lord 'Aberdeen) was not aware that he had any further explanation to give on the subject. He would then lay the despatch on the table of their Lordships' House. THE ADMIRALTY. _ - - - - Lord MINTO wished to call their Lordships' at tention to a matter personal to himself. He was not insensible to the great inconvenience of referring the House to any matter that - might have passed in the other House of Parliament, but there were occasions on which it would be highly improper to allow unseemly ex pressions to go forth without some explanation ; and when he should have read to their Lordships the pas sage from a newspaper to which he alluded, he thought their Lordships would feel with him that the present was such an occasion. The passage to which he was about to refer purported to be a eeport of the speech of a Gallant Officer in the other House of Parliement. The object of that Gallant Officer at the time was to recommend to the notice of the House what he (Lord M.) must beg leave ) call a rather fanciful scheme for the Naval Administration. The Gallant Officer to whom he alluded, in pointing out, in the course of his speech, the incompetency of civilians to fill the situation of First Lord of the Admiralty, made the following observation " When the late First Lord of the Admiralty came into power he was in general extremely ignorant ; but after he had been there a little time he began to fancy that he was a thorough sailor." But it was to what followed that he (LordMinto) wished particularly to call their Lordships' attention. " After he had been at the Admiralty for some time, he began to assume a great deal more power , than he ever ought to have assumed." Now there was a distinct charge. But the Report proceeded :—" He had al ways understood there was a divided responsibility in the Board of Admiralty; but the late First Lord acted against the express desire of every other Lord. Amongst other things a scheme was proposed to reduce the complement of men by one-eighth; and that was assented to by every one of the Naval Lords. 'lle result was communicated to Lord Minto who put the (.12sux2aeilt Alta Ilk iniket Tin ird w! s ~ returned to the Board, when it turned out that Lord Minto had taken upon himself to reduce the number of men not by one-eighth but by one-fifth." Now before he (Lord Minto) went further, he would endeavour, in a few words—confining himself to the charge—to make their Lordships, if possible, understand what actually did take place on the occasion alluded to. He wonld not enter into the controversy as to the peace and war complements. lie believed it to be a question of circumstances. In a time of profound peace, he thought that it might be wise to have a large number of ships afloat with a smaller complement of men than would be required in time of war. But when the state of our foreign relations 'was at all menacing, it was necessary to increase the complement : and he thought that the present First Lord of the Admiralty was perfectly right in p u tti ng on the full complement of men, in all :hips in f ore i gn s t a ti ons . H e h a d sa id t h at h e beg !red leave to call their Lordships' attention to the large against himselfpersonally ; which was that a cer tain complement was recommended to him by the other Lords of the Admiralty, and he took upon himself to adopt a different scale. The full war complement was determined by the recommendation of a Commission, end was understood to rest upon that recommendation. the opinions of this Commission were held to deter 'nine what were the complement of ships. The peace stablishments were sometimes reduced and some :imes increased, and of late years considerable reduc ;ions had been made. He rather thought that tinder iir. James Graham and Lord Auckland some reduc- tions were made in the peace complements. Such was :he state of things when he came to the Admiralty. There was then a sufficient complement to certain „lasses of ships. Many descriptions of ships had been ntroduced into the service since that state of comple :lents had been considered necessary. Since that time a new and more power - iiil armament :lad been considered necessary. All this seemed to regard a revision of the complement of the ships, and accordingly, in the autumn, persons were employed on the subject, many schemes vere produced, and at length, after they thought suffi ient progress had been made, a meeting of the Board vas called, at which the attendance of Sir T. Hastings ,nd the Surveyor-General was required, and after sitting iometime a complement was devised which was 'sought a full war complement, and to that arrange ient, as far as he recollected, h 3 thought that Capt. 3erkeley was a party. And that scale of complements vas the one he left when he retired from the Admiralty. ,'hen, with respect to the question of peace complements. Jnder the old system, the complement had been reduced me-eighth. A scale was suggested by which it was 'reposed to take one-fifth or one-sixth. Mr Wood drew up a minute on the'subject, and brought it to the Board. It described the principle on which they should proceed with respect to war complements and peace complements, Ind in that statement he most cordially concurred. that minute was brought forward and approved of by ill the members of the Board, and yet this was the one .vhich he was supposed to have put in his pocket, and 'hanged for an entirely new plan. He said at the time, that it was a question requiring much investigation, and that he was bound to see that the professional zeal and 7re:indices:of naval officers did not run away with them and induce them to recommend a wanton expenditure. He did what he thought was his duty, namely, he con sulted the two senior Naval Lords, both flag officers, and 11e ir de men in whose opi n i ons h e had the fullest confidence. They went into the q ues ti on m i nutely, and he stated to thhee mustthat b e i t bbeing bound s e o n ti e r n e t l i y r el b y y a t professionalc is o n question,. They found that the principle of the plan was totally inapplicable, that to establish any one proportion, between the peace and war complements of every de scription of ships would be productive of all sorts of con fusion, and, in short, though it might look well upon !)aper, yet it was in fact arrant nonsense. After much liscussion a scale of the peace establishment was agreed m by Sir C. Adams and Sir W. Parker, and he (Lord %(into) fully concurred with them. It was considerably ess than the scale recommended, but it was made with their entire concurrence. As to Captain Berkeley not having been consulted, that was not his fault, as that Gallant Officer was out of town. lie trusted that the statement he had made was sufficient to acquit him of having acted on his own authority, and not on the judgment of the Board. He would proceed to the next subject of complaint against him; as an evidence of his undue assumption of authority, it had been stated " he" (Sir C. Napier) " had read in a Levant paper, that Sir Stopford had received private orders from Lord Minto to proceed off Candia; there to wait for further orders; was it right there should be such an assumption of authority?" Even supposing the circumstances had been, as there stated, he should not think that he had in curred any reproach. The First Lord of the Admiralty being in the Cabinet, was, necessarily, in most confiden tial communication with the Commanders-in-Chief of the naval forces. At the time referred to,' the commu nications with the Commander-in-Chief in the Mediter ranean were Of the most delicate nature, and he believed that notwithltanding, in this instance, But in fifty others, he had intimated to that officer the wish of the Government, though not in the shape of an order, , Courts was in _preparation, r,i ! 'of the Secretary of State. Wit THE, SUN, LONDON, TUESDAY EVENING, MARCH 8, 1842. which he had not a right to give, but he had to enlighten I him as to the intentions of the Government, and often sug gested to him what would probably be the course of opera 7 tion. But he was happy to say that in this particular case, he had the testimony of Sir R. Stopford himself. He then -.read the following letter :--`• Greenwich Hospital, March 6. My Lord, --I have received your Lordship's letter ii reference to the observations of Sir C. Napier, in the House of Commons, as to having received a private letter from your Lordship, directing me to proceed to Candies I find, on -reference to my papers, that that order pro ceeded from the Board of Admiralty, dated Oct. 22,1840, transmitting i n structi ons from Lord Palmerston, dated Oct. 19. In consequence, I believe, of not being able to obtain the necessary force of, Turkish troops, I did not proceed to Caudia, and I am quite sure that I never received any private order from.. our Lordship." His Lordship then read an extract frornamote from Admiral Stopford to Lord Ponsonby, asking for instructions, and proving that the Admiral did not consider himself bound to act on such a private communicatidis as he would have been by an order. He evidently did' not consider it as im posing any obligation upon him. He felt tempted to refer to one or two other subjects that had been touched on, b - st he would carefully abstain fronii:so doing. Lord COLCHESTER said that the Npble Lord had quoted from a newspaper which must have, given an in correct account, because it was inconistent with their Lordship orders that such an order should have taken place. There were two circumstances to which he alluded. One related to certain circumstances which took place, when the Noble Lord was at the head of the Board of Admiraly in 1839. He the Noble Lord stated that he was charged by a Gallant Officer in the other House, with disregarding the opinions of high naval' officers. The Noble Lord was of course quite right in giving the best explanation of the circumstances in his power. But when four officers, and the Secretary, con sulted as to the best mode of manning the ships, the Noble Lord differed from them for certain reasons.— (" No, no," from Lord Minto.) Such was the impres sion which he received from what had fallen from the Noble Lard. The other case was, that certain orders were given to the officer commanding in the Mediterranean on the authority of the Noble himself ; but this he denied, and read a letter from Admiral Stopford on the subject. But from the extract which appeared in the paper, it would seeni that such an order was given. The Noble Lord then read an extract from the paper, by which it appeared that an order, dated November, 1834, was sent from the Noble Lord, directing the Admiral in the Le vant to proceed with his fleet to Cyprus, and he . (Lord Colchester) understood that he went to Cyprus in con sequence of that order, It appeared to him that any person reading the extract he had just read, must come to the conclusion that the Commander-in-Chief was to obey the First Lord of the. Admiralty. The' Hon. and Gallant Officer in the other . House might have been mis taken, but it appeared to him that he could not, after the extract he had read, be accused of making any wilful misstatements. He received that extract from the Qullant Officer to whom allusion had been made ; and having read it in the public papers, he conceived the Commander-in-Chief was bound to Qin it; PICI that if ' he did not do so, be would have incurred heavy responsis bilities. He would not go any further into discussion, but he might be permitted to say, as an officer of her Ma jesty's Navy, that the government had acted with great prudence in increasing the estublishmetit to which allns ' sion had been made, for it would be a means of prevent- ing such occurrences as took place in 1812 and 1813. The Duke of RICHMOND said the, present was an instance of the ineonvenience that always arose from Noble Lords making obsesvafinnet on what appeared in the public papers,—(Hear,) Such a mode of proceeds ing was contrary to the orders of their Lordship& House, His Noble Friend complained of iv:let had boon said by Sir Charles Napier and Captain Berkeley. Now it was a great charge Against a gentleman that what he had said was not true—(l - lear)—and those gentlemen would defeini,themselves in the other House, when, of course, his Noble Friend would reply, and they should go on speaking at each other in both Houses. His Noble Friend read a letter which appeared in that newspaper, but which was not the letter written by Capt, Berkeley, and read.by Sir Charles Napier.—(Hear, hear.) The letter really written was in these terms :—" Let there be no mistOke,as to my quitting the Admiralty. After mature consideration, a reduet:on of one-eighth was agreed to by the naval Lords, and was approved of by Lord Dalmeny. This I assented to, and it was consi dered as a great boon. The Minute was shown to Lord Minto, and he put tho paper in his pocket. It was never brought before the Board af . Admiralty again, and I heard no more of it until I received a letter from Mr. Wood, informing me that the reduction was to be one-fifth. This was done without Consulting the other Lords," Now • his (the Duke of Richmond's) Noble Friend (Lord Minto) admitted that he did not consult the other Lords, and that he only sent the order to two of them, to put their initials to it. If any Minister of-the Crown resigned his office, he ob tained the leave - Of the Sovereign to explain in his place in Parliament the ' reasons, of his resignation, and he could not see why,, if a Cabinet Minister could do that, a member of an inferior Board, - such as- the Admiralty, should not be at liberty , to explain in a letter to a friend his reasons for resigning office.=,(Hear, hear.) His Noble Friend admitted that the full complement should be kept up, when 'the political horizon was clouded. Weil, was not the political horizon clouded at the time of that reduction ? and had not his Noble Friend to send out reinforcements to the Mediterranean ? But he (the Duke of Richmond) thought it was' not right to send out our seamen in ships which had not a sufficient complement of men. If a war broke out, they might be en countered by a superior force ; and under such circum stances, the first six .weeks might determine the issue against us. For his cosh part-he_Wonlll rqui, iiare t w o ~, •.- - 1--.,-,... ~ ilgmf i .. v . uperly manned than a cozen without — the full complement of men. Tie would only refer to one point further, and that was merely to state to the House that he was aware that Sir Thomas Hardy was on a Commission, 'but his friend must be aware that it was never carried into effect. It was notorious that that Gallant Officer had told Captain Berkeley that he . was one of the old school, and was not for ships going to sea not fully manned. : He thought that the First Lord of the Admiralty had done rightly, and he only hoped they would never alter, the manning of ships. He would' at any time rather see too many men than too few in the Navy, The Earl of MINTO explained. He had made no charge against any Gallant Officer, although it appeared to be supposed he had done so. He had no charge to make against Sir Charles Napier, but that he greatly misunderstood the relations between a Commander-in- Chief and a Government; so intimate was this that when a change in the Government took place, they did not appoint a new Commander -in-Chiefin the Mediterranean. The Duke of RICHMOND explained and said, the charge against the Noble Earl still remained unshaken. Lord FITZGERALD condemned the conversation as irregular .. beyond example, and showing how un wise it was to take up debates that took place in the other House. The' anxiety of the Noble Earl was quite natural, and it was only to be regretted that the Noble Earl had not taken such measures as the House pre scribed, by moving for papers - and records instead of making the speech which they had just heard from him, in reply to statements made by Gallant Officers in the other House, when no question was before their Lordships, and in the irregular manner in which he had hoped th e f ew remar k s t h a t done. He (Lord Fitzgerald) h a d f e l t hi mse lf ca ll e d d act so as to pre ven t suc h oc loinadtofael currences taking place again. o le r n re f c r t om thi h s, im an u d .ou h l e Earl MINTO said the only observation he was de sirous of making in reply was, that he hoped the Noble Lord would give him credit for having abstained gene rally from replying to what passed in other place s. His whole object. had been- attained, if he had succeeded in vindicating himself. Lord FITZGERALD said that he was ' quite prepared to admit that the anxiety of• the Noble Earl was quite natural, -but he could not retract what he had said rela tive to what appeared to Win to be an irregular pro- ' ceeding in that House. 147,ap•VMINTO briefly explained, and after a few words from the Duke of RICHMOND, the matter dropped. LUNACY, The LORD CHANCELLOR gave notice that he should to-morrow lay on their Lordships' table a Bill to' alter and amend the law respecting proceedings in lunacy.. , The Bills on the • table were fbrwarded a stage, and their Lordships adjoorned shortly before Seven o'Clock. • HOUSE OF COJIMOiYS, MARCH 7. The SPEAKER took the Chair at Four o'Clock. Mr. MARTIN took the oaths and his .seat for the county of Galway-. • • Returns were presented from the Poor-law Coln missiOners, and ordered to be laid on the table. Mr. PACKE presented a petition against the Mid land Counties Railway Bill. The Rochester Roads Bill was brought in and read a first time. The Dundee and Arbroath Railway Bill was read a first time. • _ . On the motion of Mr. B. WOOD, the Equitable Gas Company Bill was brought in and read a first time. The Southwark Improvement Bill (No. 1) was read a second time and ordered to be committed. The West Stirlingshire Roads Bill (No. 1) was read a second time and ordered to be committed. MANCHESTER and SHEFFIELD RAILWAY. Mr. W. PATTEN presented a petition, signed by 1,700 manufacturers, and other residing on the line of the proposed Manchester and Sheffield Railway, to which on some future occasion it was his intention to draw the attention of the House. The p etitioners s tated that in consequence o f the depressed state of the times, th ere was grea t d an ger of the undertaking falling t o th e groun d , an d pra ying that Parliament would be pleased to devise some remedy to get them out of their difficulties. On the motion of Sir GEORGE LARPENT, the Nottingham Gas Bill (No. 1) was read a second time and ordered to be committed. On the motion of. Mr. STUART WORTLE Y, the Hinckley Road Bill was read a second time. The Ormesby Inclosure Bill was read a second time and ordered to be committed. CORN-LAWS. Mr. WALKER presented three petitions from Sheffield, and its neighbourhood, against the Corn -laws. Mr. REDINGTON presented petitions from the millers of Dundalk, Louth, and Monaghan, against the contemplated alteration of the flour duties. Mr. CHRISTMAS presented a petition from Cavan to the same effect. e Mr, READ p resen t e d three petitions from Kil kenny to th e same e ff ect. b y upwards r C d s ß o A f l S V O F O O i Rn inhabitants b i p t a r presented t o e f d H a a petition,Hall d parishsigned of Rochdale, in which the petitioners expressed their disapproval of the Ministerial measure relative to the Corn-laws—they declaring their want of confidence in the present advisers of the Crown, andin the exist ing system of Parliamentary representation. The petitioners also prayed the House to reject the inisterial measure ; also the fixed duty scheme, and to grant total, immediate, and uncompen sated repeal of the Corn and Pibvi'sion-laws, and also to adopt • such measures as will secure a fair Parliamentary representation of the people ;" ass:, five petitions from different classes of workers, viz., calico printers, boot-makers, tailors, millwrights, painters; and paper-stainers in Manchester, praying for the immediate and total repeal of the Provision and Corn duties. Sir C. COOTE presented a petition from Queen's' County, praying for additional protection for flour an oatmeal. Mr. THORNELY presented four petitions from Dumfries and other places, praying for an abolition of the Corn-laws. Mr. JOHNSTONE presented a petition from the Anti-Corn-law Association of Kilmarnock to the same effect. Dr. BOWRING presented 59 petitions from va rious places in Kent, Surrey, Chester, Shropshire, Flintshire, &c., to the same effect ; also a petition from Manchester, praying for a remission of punish ment of Frost, Williams, and Jones, PRESBYTERIAN MARRIAGES Mr. E. TENNENT presented three petitions from the county of Down, praying for a prospective and retrospective measure on the subject of Presby terian Marriages. UNIVERSAL SUFFRAGE. An HoN. MEMBER presented petitions in favour of Universal Suffrage, Vote by Ballot, and for shortening the duration of Parliament. Mr. M. SUTTON presented a petition in favour of the County Courts' Bill. GLASGOW AND AYR RAILWAY• The Glasgow, Paisley, Kilmarnock, and Ayr Rail way Bill was read a second time, 7 : CORN-LAWS. Sir V. BLARE presented a petition, praying for increased protection to Irish grain, to that given by the proposed Governnnt scale of duties. Lord NEWRY presented a petition, with the same prayer, with the addition of it request that the Government pleu should not come into operation for six months, Mr. T, DUNCOMBE presented a petition from a body of residents in the metropolis, complaining of the manner in which the provisions of the law were carried into effect, with respect to the burial of paupers, under the Poor-law Act; also a petition, complaining of the abstraction of papers from the Irish Court of Chancery. Mr, WYNNE ELLIS presented-a petition from Leicester, against the Corn-laws. An HON. MEMBER presented a petition from Cupar and other places in Fifeahire, praying for the total repeal of the Corn-laws, Mr. MARK PHILIPS presented a petition, praying for the pardon of Frost, Williams, and Jones. An HoN. MEMBER, on the Ministerial Benches, presented a petition from the Corn-Inspectors of Reading awl another it praying either to be con tinued in their situations, or that the Hon. Rouse would be - pleased to give them some compensation. Mr. VILLIERS paces petitions from Gala glens, and" from places in Montgomeryshire and Durham, praying for a repeal of the Corn-laws. Mr. J. WOItTLEY presented a petition frorti Manchester, praying for the release of Frost, ; Williams, and 'Tones ; also a petition from the millers of Huddersfield, praying for further protection to the English miller. The petitioners felt assured that the new proposal of the Government would prove pre judicial to their interests. CHURCH OF SCOTLAND. Sir ALEX. CAMPBELL gave notice that on the 15th inst. he would 'move for a Select Committee to consider the constitution and principles of the Church of Scotland, and into the circumstances of the late collision between the Supreme Courts of that Church and the Civil Courts, and to report their observations thereon ; the Committee to have power to send for persons, papers, and records. CONVICTED MANUFACTURERS. Mr. FERRAND gave notice that on Tuesday, the 16th of March, he would move for a copy of all convic tions that took place in the counties of York and Lancaster, before magistrates in - petty sessions, of persons for illegally paying wages to work people in goods, instead of the current coin of the realm, since the Ist of January, 1835, contrary to the Act 1 and 2 William the Fourth, chap. 32. Mr. S. O'BRIEN moved for copies of the Coroner's notes 'on the inquest of Mr. M'Cardle.—Ordered. Mr. MASTERMAN wished to ask the Right Hon. Gentleman at the head of her Majesty's Govern ment, with respect to the period at which the new Corn Bill would come into operation. Some of the newspapers had given different interpretations to the answer of the Right Hon. Gentleman the other evening. and what he wished to know was, whether the averages would be taken upon the new system the week after the liiltreceixed the Royal assent. Sit ii. FEEL said - it was intended that five weeks' averases should be taken under the old system, and the sixth week under the new one. Sir C. NAPIER wished to ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether it was the intention of the Government to propose increased allowances to the old captains. The CIIANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER was understood to say that the question had not at present been taken into consideration by the Government. FRENCH OCCUPATION OF ALGERIA. Sir ROBERT PEEL thought it might be con venient in relation to the motion for which the Hon. and Learned Member for Dungarvon had given notice for Thursday next, for the production of the despatch of his Noble Friend, the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs, on the subject of the conversation which had taken place between the French Am bassador and his Noble Friend to state at once his (Sir Robert Peel's) intention on the subject. (Hear.) It was his (Sir Robert Peel's) intention to lay that despatch on the table of the House.—(Cheers.) He did so because in the first place he thought it very desirable to avoid what he must consider a most inconvenient practice, namely, the raising a debate in that House in reference to a debate which had taken place in the Chamber of Deputies in Paris; and, in the second place, because in any answer which he (Sir R. Peel) might have to make to any observation of the Honourable and Learned Member he (Sir R. Peel) would have to make frequent reference to the despatch in question, and therefore he thought it best that the House should have the whole despatch to refer to. It would be for the Hon. Member, if he should think proper afterwards, to found a motion upon that despatch. While on this subject, he felt it to be his (Sir R. Peel's) duty entirely to exonerate the French Ambassador, Cgmte St. Aulaire, from all blame on the subject. It was his duty entirely to acquit the Comte St. Aulaire—(Hear, hear)—of any intentional misapprehension. He (Sir R. Peel) felt assured that all who had . the happiness to know Comte St. Aulaire, must feel assured that any misappre hension must be entirely unintentional on his (Comte St. Aulaire's) part (Hear, hear) and although the Hon. Gentleman might think it necessary to correct any misapprehension, yet he (Sir R. Peel) was sure that every one would acquit the Comte. St. Aulaire of everything like intentional error. The Right Hon. Baronet then laid a copy of the despatch on the table. BANK ISSUES. Mr. C. WOOD said, before the House went into a Committee of Supply, he wished to put a question to the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite, in order -to ascertain what were the intentions of the Government on a subject of great importance, and which had excited great interest in the country. The House was aware, that during the last Session of Parliament, a Committee was sitting, of which he had the honour of being Chairman, for the purpose of inquiring into the circulation of the banks of issue. In the middle of the session, those events occurred which brought it to an earlier conclusion than was expected, and interrupted that inquiry. The House had barely time, at the close of the Session, to pass an Act providing for a more accurate and general publication of the amount of bank-notes put in circulation, but it was impossible for the Committee to come to any conclusion, or make any. Report to the House. Since Parliament had met, many` inquiries had been made of him, and he had received a great many communications from different parts of the country, owing to his having been Chairman of ;that Committee, requesting him to ascertain what were the intentions of the Govern ment with respect to the question. Some time since he had mentioned the circumstance to the Right Hon. Baronet, in order that he might have time to consider the matter, and to confer with his colleagues as to the course the Government might think ad visable to adopt. He was quite aware that there would be considerable difficulty in re appointing the Committee, from the circumstance that many of the efficient and active Members had not seats in the present House of Commons. He, there fore, wished to ask what course the Government in tended to pursue, on a subject that had excited .great interest in many parts-of the kingdom. Sir R. PEEL said he had given his best considera tion to this important subject, to which the Hon. Gen tleman had drawn his attention, and he was sorry that last year, after ha Jing applied so much time to a conti nuous inquiry into the matter, and with the recollec tion of great attention paid to it by the Hon. Gentle man himself, and the ability he displayed, they should have separated without coming to any distinct proposal. It-appeared to him that a new Committee for fur ther inquiry was altogether needless. For three years there was an inquiry, into the subject of Joint Stock Banks, which subject, as far as investigation was concerned, was entirely exhausted by the Committee ; or if three years would not exhaust the subject, he (Sir Robert Peel) thought it inex haustible. Whilst on the subject at that time the Right Hon. Gentleman proposed a subject of equal importance, relative to the issue of stamps by the Bank of England and other Banks. They sat two sessions on the subject, making altogether nine 'sessions. On these grounds he (Sir Robert Peel) thought a new inquiry was unnecessary. Should they, then, appoint a Committee of Inquiry ? He found that no less than eight Mem bers of the Committee who were in the last Parlia ment were not in Parliament now, and of these eight several were amongst the most regular attendant: at the Committee, in addition to this the subjects brought under the consideration of that Committee were of such im portance, that he thought they were matters with which the Executive Government, rather than a Com mittee, ought to deal. This was purely a matter for the consideration of the Executive Government, and as soon as it was possible it should be considered, and the determination of her Majesty's . Government should be laid before the House.—(Hear`, hear.) Mr. CHARLES WOOD said he entirely concurred in what had fallen from the Right Hon. Gentleman. He had• asked the question merely because he wished to know what was to be done, and that the answer might go forth. THE TRUCK SYSTEM. Mr. FERRAND said he had been charged with having made assertions which were not correct, and with having charged Hon. Members with making use of expressions which he never did use. But in standing forward in the House, having been deputed by the working classes—(Cries of " Oh, oh")—of the North of England, he trusted he should be acting strictly in accordance with the rules and regulations of that House if he took up a little of their time in de fending himself. With respect to Friday evening last he had looked at what he had previously said in that House,:and he found he never used the word " all " at all—that he never did charge the Hon. Member for Stockport with abominable cruelty to his work people; but that he found, was another lapsus lingua of the Hon. Member for Salford, like those he uttered the other night with regard to his print works. The Hon. Member said he employed twenty persons in his print works by night during the last eighteen months, and perhaps that Honourable Member would be obliged to him (Mr. F.) for giving him an opportunity to explain the great distinction which existed between what he asserted that evening and what he found stated by Mr. L. Horner, in the pam phlet which he published. Mr.L.Horner was an inspector of factories, and he says that no person could print works without being assisted by others. The process was carried on by a boy, who stood, by a pot of colours, and who transferred the colours from the pot to the cloth by means of a brush for the purpose of smoothing the surface ; that was called "colouring," and the person so employed is called the clear boy. The person so employed must per form his work standing, and the air must be rather humid. He would ask' the Honourable Gentleman whether, during those eighteen months persons were not so employed morning and evening, to assist the men in the print works, and whether what the Hon. Gentleman stated the other evening was correct, and what Mr. Homer stated was incor rect ? The Honourable Member for Wolverhampton read, the other night a. declaration signed by seventy-two cotton spinners, and he (Mr. Ferrand) had received a copy of the declaration, together with extracts from the speech made by him the previous evening in the House. Those cotton spinners say :—" We, the undersigned Manufacturers and others engaged in and connected with the Cotton Trade, being subscribers to the Corn-law League, have read with disgust the enclosed extracts from Mr.. Ferrand's speech in the House of Commons."— (Cries of " Order, order.") The SPEAKER said, that the Hon. Member was out of order in reading statements made by persons out of the House, in allusion to what had been said in it. Mr. FERRAND—These cotton spinners stated that they kept no truck-shops, and that they did not. pay their workmen in any other way than in the current coin of the realm. But he would ask the Honourable Gentlemen opposite, if these cotton spinners did not compel the workmen to take cottages from them, and whether they did not draw their cotton with paste ?—(Oh, oh.) He asked them would they'deny what he asserted of their chalies being composed of old rags and devil's dust ?—(Laughter.) They asserted that they kept no truck-shops, and that they did not pay their working people in any other way than in the current coin of the realm. —(Hear.) Now he had never charged them with doing so ; he had never charged them with keeling truck-shops ; he had never charged them with paying their workmen otherwise than in the current coin of the realm. But he had said that they evaded the law by their relations keep ing truck-shops, by paying their workmen in the cur-. rent coin of the realm, and then by stopping them op their way home. Even supposing these 72 cotton spinners, declared by the Right lion. Member for Wolverhampton to be the principal subscribers to t'ic League—supposing there were 72 just men ong the Members of the Anti-corn-law League, could it be said that these 72 men composed the whole of that League ? He thought they had boasted that the ramifications of their body extended to every part of the country—that it was a National League—that the manufacturers in Yorkshire, and all over Eng land, Scotland, Ireland, and Wales had joined them. If that were the case, how happened it that after eight days those members of. the League had only denied by a quibble what he had asserted ? He turned over, and he found a circular sent to the Members of the League from the " Anti-Corn-law League at Manchester." That circular was as fol lows :—" You will oblige by affixing your name to the declaration, and returning it at the earliest possible opportunity." In that address which the Hon. Member for Wolverhampton had read to the House on Friday night there was not one Yorkshire manu facturer whose name was attached to it. There was not the name of any manufacturer attached to it who did not reside—at least he believed not one— either in the town of Manchester, or in some other large manufacturing towns, where they could not, and thirst not, carry on the truck system, for this very reason, that the shop-keepers in a mass would rise up against them, and would not allow such a system to be carried on. It was in secret—it was in dark cor ners, that the poor working men were plundered—it was where there were no shop-keepers to rise up and den Ounce the system as he had done in ;that House.—(Hear, hear, and laughter.) No interup tion would put him down. He was speaking the truth ; and if what he asserted were false, let Hon. Members prove it to be so. But if he did speak the truth, in the name of the working -classes of England he called on the Hon. Member for Wol verhampton to deny it, inste a d o f d ev i s i ng w i th the Honourable Member for Oldham, as he had done, when he ( Mr. Ferrand) had made his second speech upon the subject. The Hon. Member for Wolverhampton went and told the Hon. Member for Oldham, that the assertions made ought to be proved ; but the Hon oura bl e M em b er for Oldham told him upon that occasion, that "he had better leave the matter where it was, for he would himself undertake to prove what Mr. Ferrand had said, and ten times worse."--,-(Hear, hear, and laughter.) In the name of the working classes of England he called upon the Hon. Member to move for a Select Committee before which he (Mr. F.) would prove everything that he had asserted. He wished the House would allow him to read a letter from a poor man, one of the working classes, who, according to the Hon. Gentleman opposite, were all in favour of a repeal of the Corn-laws ; and he thought he could prove the charges he had brought, or drive Honourable Gentlemen to the worse resort, of seeking a Select Committee. Now this was from .a poor working man, and he trusted that those who came to the House pro fessing to be -the_ champion of the poor would listen to his statement. The writer said "It is with the greatest pleasure I read your speech of last Thursday. It was one of the sort that has long been wanted. But, Sir, though it appears to have struck such a panic amongst them as they (the Anti-Corn-law League) little expected, you did not positively more than half do it. I wish some one on the Con servative side of the House would move for a Committee to inquire. I feel confident it would strike such an awe over them as that they would not again be guilty of such practices. On Monday evening, the 21st last, a meeting of the Anti-Corn-law League was held in the Temperance Hall, when ---' he would give the name if required—" was called to the chair. Now, Sir, this is a spinning master, and keeps a large mill in Brown -street. He lives about a mile out of town, in a splendid mansion on the road." The letter then went on to state that this individual kept about twenty cows ; that he compelled his work -people to have about a. quart of milk a day, whether they could drink it or not; that most of the spinning masters compelled their people to rent cottages of them for which they paid exhorbitant wages. It then continued :—" Now, I will tell you another ras cally trick"—this is a poor labouring man— "he makes a practice of running his mill f ro m Monday till Saturday, and because Satur day is a short day, in which we work only nine hours, he only pays the hands for five and a-half days. I wish you would only give him a touch in the House of Commons on this point. I think it would stop him, and it would confer a blessing on hundreds of poor helpless factory people, helpless, I say, because too many of us, owing to the coupling of wheels"— Mr. WILLIAMS would be glad to know the name. Mr. F ERRAND would give it to the Hon. Gen tleman whe n h e sat down, or, if he wished, he would follow him out of the House. Nfuno l Let him tell the Hon. Gentleman that the poor working men had suffered so much when they had tried to expose these cruelti es, t h at if a Committee of Inquiry were appointed, they would hardly dare - too — Come for, ~. ward. He would prove that ail he had statec, ~, was true before he sat down. He had giv_eA,rif an instance of what had occurred ' in,.l Lancashire, he would now state to the House whrit. - ; had occurred in Yorkshire, in his own neighbourhood - The Hon. Member then read a letter which pur- ported to be from a poor weaver residing in Yorkshire who had been employed by a person who kept a shop upon the pre m i ses , and in which the working men ern: ployed by him understood that they were to spend their wages ; the writer of that letter incurred s debt of ten shillings, which he allowed to he liqui dated by a deduction of one shilling .a week front his wages. On Saturday, the 19th of February last, his employer deducted the full ten shillings, d is- - charged him his service, and refused to give hinli further employment. On the Monday following that -' poor man applied to a Magistrate for a summons i 5, 1 1.1 order to obtain his wages, and the result was the NiaLf'7, gistrate gave an order that it should be paid, and be. (Mr. Ferrand) was happy to say that the Clerk al lowed the poor man the t ee f or th e summons , a nd thui .-*. ended the investigation of the case by the Magistrate- These were Anti-Corn-law League men.—(Laugh ter.) He (Mr. Ferrand) had scores of such facts to. lay before the House, and he was prepared to pro ve . .', them before a Select Committ ee ; no t on ly that, bu t the working classes of' England -were rising Li? throughout the country to prove every word ,t.. --- Anted in that House. 'W hat would P":' House say when he t o ld th em that ' th e working classes of Birmingham had assembled ti,! .. .- other day, and unanimously p asse d a vo t e o f than t' to him ?—(Hear, hear, and a . laugh) Yes, , ' 7 - repeated it, the workin g c l asses o f Birmingnmc s had assembled an d a d o pt e d a vo te o f than . r . ~ to him for opposing th e con d uc t o f the ir hard-hearted task-masters.—(Mr. Ferrand then rr, ceeded to read the resol u ti ons t o w hi c h he N fTi: alluded.) ' He -would not detain the House N'''' reading the whole of what had taken place at th at t ;meeting, but -he said the people w h o adopted th a ,,,,. ~ resolution were working men , w h o no t only approv e L of everything he st a t e d w ithi n th e walls of 6 ' 3; - House, but justified it, and declared themselves,.. ready to prove it. Let it not be said 'that these state' e- , ments depended upon hi m (M r . F erran d). Again f? : challenged Hon. Gentl emen opposite to call for a Sel ec g , Committee, and if they did not, he would do ri•- The Noble Lord the Member for London had sat that he had understood that h e (M r . F erran d) In' only urged his char g e s aga i ns t a li m it e d nu mber et: , manufacturers. He (Mr. Ferrand) had said that he had brought charges against a large number of inanT',. facturers. On Saturday last he (Mr. F.) had though it his duty to the Noble Lord, considering tl,' high position which that Noble 'Lord held, not cal in the House, but out of the House, to send hin', e sample of the calico which was commonly sold tn,t; j, working classes—(A laugh)—and 'he (Mr. F. , a n f x . also thought it his duty to send a sample' of u' ci. ' calico to the Prime Minister of England—(L oud laughter)---that they might have ocular demonstratice, of the sort of stuff that was sold to the working ..„l' e n. ple ; and he was prepared to prove it. Would 0° t Members opposite contend that calico was u i, daubed with flour and pa s t e ? H e would cal upon the Noble Lord to rise .in his place and saZ t i c . ever in all his life he had known such plunder as Wi t which was practised on the poor in this particular ? I was really horrible to behold.—(Cheers and laught er./ The shirting sold to the working people was el r ", pletely daubed over with flour p as t e . N ow he ( Ferrand) 0.3 would ask if that was true ?—(Ch eep and laughter.) If it were untrue was there ev,e,l such an opportunity as th a t now a ff o rded l' , y giving him a contradiction.—(Ch eers an d laughter:i e Was it not the duty of the Legislatu r e to afford th e ',, poor people protection. Th e y h a d sen t t o him to 1 13 ,7 . him to claim protection for , them from the Ilousrl Did he say anything that was unfair ?—(Cheer' - r ' , . It was well for Hon. Members to smile •ind ehe iet , • but would those who cheered attempt to contrawhe, him?--(Hear, hear). It was at the request of i tl i e poor people that he . had acted as he had done, at''',,, , an Hon. Gentleman opposite would take up the cauSel, l 4,, way.—(Cheers.). Ferrand) would g i ve therefore begged of them not to sneer at hirn.-- 2 -(0 1 and laughter.) His heart had urged him to do yili he had done.—Cheers and laughter.) He besout h them to bear with him for the cause he advoet . a He would read a l e tt er f rom th e M anc h es t er Guard t i i; the organ of the Anti-Corn-law League, which -t i ;: - . appeared in that paper on Ist December last. (-' - ' - 5 ,.. Hon. Member here read the letter alluded to, whien l " - ., 0 signed " A Manufacturer," and whi c h s t a ted thata manufacturer paid 7501. per annum more than he h g _O done in 1815 for flour f or d ress i n g, i n cons equenee.:6- the operation of the Corn-la ws . That- letter went on to state that more flour was consumed . 4 1 , 1 =-3 7 i ; -manufactory in filling up the cloth than was 113 0 0' - the labourers employed in it for food, and CO tended that while f ore i gn m anufacturers 1 31 cured their flour for those purposes o'l cheap rate, it was i m p oss ibl e th a t B r itish , i nrus! - .. eactirrers could compe t e w i t h th em w ithottt - 9 repeal of the Corn-l aves . Th e rea di ng 'of fhiglot 4 was met hy ironical cheers and loud . 141 . gi ro from the Opposition.) No. wonder the pr ; '4 corn was kept up in the manufacturing - .di4 ' Now he would ask Hon. Gentlemen opposite. ix,_,... it they deny that calico contained paste ? He had tamr__,: that letter from their own organ. When he stated tie' 100,000 quarters of wheat were consumed to defrti the public, more especially the poorer classes, Ti statement was considerably w ithi n bounds. H e }'d _Teemed it to be his duty, on Saturday last, to info'iii the Noble Lord, th e M em b er f or L on d on , ths t 4, . would be his duty, in defending himself t ,. r i i - 1 evening to refer to a correspondence which took 0 9 . ~ between the Noble Lord and Mr. Baker, the SnP erf ` l. ,,,,- tendent of Facto r i es . Th a t corres p o ndence i''' - ordered to be printed by the Reuse . of Com-0 1 17 on the 21st of -Ju ne , 183. - He (Mr. Ferro" believed that the Noble Lord th e. M em ber ' London was, at th a t pe r i o d, S ecretary o f SO" - for the Home - Department. He (Mr. f,.: 1 rand) did hot blame the Noble - "d e , for not being acquainted with the shoddy tr n , e But he would read to the House the statement of t' s l 3 Sub-Inspector of Factories, which statement '' d, ordered to be printed by that House, as he j) ,• 11 ); stated before, on the 21st June, 1836. He °,..,,.. addressing his Lordship, " that he had to in f ` .. „„' him that his report of Taylor, Ibh.ltsy - ; and Co. (Anti-Corn-law League-men), hz i ,: v % v ;:i worked their boys twelve and fifteen ''" -- - 0 was correct. The district was DewsburYi e i , Yorkshire, a neighbourhood thickly 1)01)1110 'depending 'entirely on the manufacture of she d ~ cloth, which was made from woollen ra gs tt )r j in pieces by a powerful machine., and reduc e ! as far as possible to its original form, a n d the 1 .1 worked again into c l o th." N ow , h e as k ed H ono urs j. ,Gentlemen 'to listen to this, in tearing up- t he "' rags a great quantity of dust was ernittei:e, this was called " devils' dust "—so much' . 4 4 that in general persons standing three or four Yll'ip apart could scarcely di s ti ngu i s h t h e other persons.ii the room, while the machinery was prop e lled -o , l le great velocity. W ou ld t h ey li sten to him Ivluto he read four or five lines of the Report its' Which he had allud e d, t o p rov e to t h em the. crue l practised upo n th e p oor while the, ir oppressors. defrat i .`:; 3 c ' the public ? There was a -charge broi.ight ag,'' l 4,,e these men before th e M ag istrates. A charge whiLT '. fi l inspector decl are d the law ,did not gi ve him " i ,' c t i l e authority to go int o . H e took' it, from the mouth o ' . ` 0 sufferers themselves,' • and they , stated that °t the 27th of Sept em b er t h ey went "to work at : 1 ;1 o'clock in the m orn i ng , an d w i th the ' exception of ra:Lee hours, and one hour at midnight, they 'did not e e o ,. working till four o'clock on the Saturday - a fterao ° . , ; , Did not this justify his charges againSt these 'l e tt men of the Anti-Corn-law League—men who sin - il so much for the suffering of the poor , - i who went for the repeal of the Corn-laws , ° la , for their own benefit, but for the benefit of e th Pe ° P o ,l He would now read five or six lines from another working man, relative to the short of those poor men for whom Hon. Gentle pretended to feel so much, and to whose fore, he (Mr. F.) hoped they would poor man said, " I am engaged in trade in • Battely, near Dewbury, I your last speech on the Corn-laws, but made some observations relative to the In every piece made th ere are th ree poun d s o f flour' to stiffen it, which deceives the wearer. enti-teVi and spoils th e t ra d e . I n another village, "4t,-°OA a mile from Dewesbury, there used to be good trade in the manufacture of paddil7, and drugget." He (Mr. Ferrand) would a tt i c ! Honourable Members to listen, and he vbr ° ,.e tell them h ow th e tra d e i n that vil , ' 4`' i s had been lost out of the mouth of th y. working man —not by the - operation fac , the Corn-laws, but by th e b e h av i our o f the mant'lor tuners themselves. The wor k man wen t on t o say," "411 carried this shoddying and stiffening to such a le ri ,„ L b t, that the trade was lost. The trade was entirely lob but a few manufacturers have retired wi o r fortunes. They were in the habit of using fiv,,, e ' pr , six pounds of flour in every piece." He (Air. ' ;he rand) 'had proved his statement first of all from ` ha Anti-Corn-law League, then from the mouths 01 i ." working classes, and they should now see what des er fi tion manufacturers gave of it, and then he sh °. 0 challenge the Hon. Membe rs oppos i te once mo re to L i for a Select Committee. (Th e H on. Gent l ema n. ti' o f proceeded to read a letter from a manufactur er ' f' Whitney, in Oxfordshire, relative to the p r actice to , shoddying.) He would as k H on. Gentlemen opPos ita t he' do him justice, and he wou ld here bear recor d to e , noble exertions of th e H on.. Member for Salfor d O n half of the factory children, and though they were opP2 eo o on this questio n , h e (Mr. F e r ran d) hoped ' , i' to be able to unite h eart an d hand with that Hon. Melr4 Ilse the preservati on o f t h e factory children. . H e h a e 7 4 16 d e only spoken to defend himself from the remarks 's''" „ e against him on F r id ay l ast. He felt he had wail '-' ) ," - e . his duty to th e wor ki ng men in England, w h eal Je 'DJ presented, and from whom he daily received o•7ores " sco: a ny th e th e he) olttri the P„ ti 4 4 , e Lo rd Polk 140 Pea II ( ) b„ ' I na n t the lette a s th e kddy.trade, 011 1 ; sbitl lemen oppo 3 _ 4 l „ Lmi l e letter, the 1', 4 A listen. T h 4i in , the shodu. , 'kt 0 ave . 0 I am told Y ..li t i ej shoddy trr,d,_le' : i , , , I. ~P Atm** 1 e 1,,,,e1