The Sun. — London, England, 1842-04-12 00:00:00

10 0 , -„_ x ow, s t eT.). The vessel also coetained 100 boxes of salmon. cies the saf e ty of th e St a t e was t h e supreme l aw, to p ected, tt such, an e xte n sive impottetion were to be ex- which every other consid sra ti on s h ou ld yi e ld. B u t i nequa li ty prastie would lik e to as k w h ere t h a t coun t ry was w hi c h an d i n j ust i ce so gross as were admitted to exist in that tax e o ' i ti PPlY it? He had looked over the imports and ex- . were evils ss g rea t, t h a t ext r e m e necess it y a l one could b ead 4en i 'woe of the countries of the north of Europe. them to sancti o n su il a measure . If th e t ax was un j ust ' in e toe _ inland th e i mpor t s were 1,139 h ea d . P russ i a was substance, its mode of collection was not less oppr ess i ve . Th e elt•rt- which both imported and exported; but the import , Right Hon. Baronet appeared, on a formeriocc as i on, to l ean eeeete very largely exceeded the export in any one year. very `fore tan opinion expressed by the Fiore and Learned % Zeit! the number of oxen, steers, cows, and calves import e d Member 'Bath (Mr. Roebuck), an entnion which he 40 .:152 head, the exports amounted to 8,197 head, being believed was somewhat of this kind, that no hone•t men should u est .e of imports over exports nf 11,551. In 1829 the im- be afraid to state openly and honestly the amount of his pro fv re 20,342, the exports 7,971, being an excess of im- perty. But was that a general feeling ? Was it not a fact er exports of 12,371. In 1839 the imports were that people in this country felt ashamed to make an avowal ot head and the exports 9 , 0 'os being an excess. on the s peverty ? Was it not a fact that men were anxious to look tp e ee l B,939. In 1831, which was a year in which little well in the eyes of the world? And did net the eetati on took place, and for which he could not account, that feeling prevail among that class in particular bei,,,,eapi,rts only amounted to 13,000 and the imports toSse,ooo, upon whom the proposed tax would press most severely ? "- an excess of imports over exports of upWards of 5,000. Was it not a fact that half of their lives was passed in a coil " the n .1, • 11 53 ,, e, e importation into Prussia amounted in 1828 to slant strueg'e against their poverty--in a constant strugele 'to hn ., l U 0 head, and the experts 76,464, being an excess ef appear a little above their real means ?If thi3 were the case, W e il . over exports of 134,928 . He would not trouble the it would be to no purpose to say that a little philosophy would i e r ee with the details, but the excess of imports over exports raise men above those feelings. While these were the feein , ri amounted to. 141.000; in 1830, 126,i 00; and in 1831 1 which people entertained, it would be cruel todespise fly m. eor te,0"!,000. Swine was also in proportion to that number. 1 his part he should no more think it advaable to interfere with ipetuathis it would appear that Prussia was not the country to such feelings than that when he was in In fa, he should treat large quantity of cattle to this country. In Denmark , disrespectfully that feeling among the native women of rank ,7( .. 1 that t h e amount o f exports i n, 1 83 6 to t h e whole th at i t was a deeradation that they s h ou ld b e seen unve il ed, or e 4 4113 28,000 head of oxen, 5 , 000 cows, 6,9 00 calves, and that they should be seen talking with men. He knew that 11;;P i gs. Let any person co"sider these statements, and the fr cling was unreasonable, and he did not share it.—( A N. : a e thee the apprehensions which had been raised were laugh.) But he did think that in legislating for a people he ', ni t lottery. He did not think that the proposed measure was bound in, comn on humanity not io treat their prejudices lot the reduce meat a penny per pound.' He ventured to trete. with contempt. He would appeal against the authority of the toti, :ne Hou se w i t h these figure 3, considering it to be his duty, Right Honourable Baronet, and aga i nst th e aut h or i ty o f t h e its as he was with a large a gr i cu lt ura l county ce l e b ra t e d Hon. a n d L earne d M em b er f or B at h , to t h e aut h or i ty o f one Bt te s Progress in farming and agricultur a l p ursu i ts . H e did of the greatest moral phil osop h ers , an d certa i n l y t h e greatest tle s -a ilay the fears and al a rms of p ersons concede d w i t h writer up o n poli t i ca l economy t h at ever lived— e lie Pursuits. These statemen:s he felt convinced would he meant Adam • Smith.—( Hear, hear, and cheer s .) n i ,i i teceived b y t h em , f or t h ey came from an His declaration on that subject was strong, distinct, and expli *Peeled quarter. In France the imports of live anirual s in cit. Hv said, that a tax on income could be raised only by %,.....artiounted in value to 5 37,000 1 . ; the value of exports, means of an unusual investigation into income, and such an in • he", , 411 . *hewing an exce s s of v a l ue o f i mpor t s over exports o f vestigation would necessarily he felt as more grievous th a n an y 4 14 7' 81 . It was not then from France th a t th ey had to dread tax whatever. Here, then, they had a tax, admitt e d to b e i n "iodatio n of ca ttl e i n t o th e E ng li s h mar k ets ' He believed its own nature, and in substance, unjust ; pronounced by the Se rk lf any part of Europe was likely to supply th e E ng li s h greatest authorities, and felt by the body of the people, to be in e l j l • it would be Holstein and Denmark ; an d even f rom the mode of collection, the most vexatious of a ll t axes . Thi s , h i would be at a great disadvantage, as a great part of the then, was a tax which should be resorted to only in the last fe ssd r -Ilse was closed by frost, and many m o n th s it was ex - extremity. Did that extremity now exi s t? H e denied that th e t , ° severe storms. With respect to the timber duties, he it did. He conceived that the Right Flora Gentleman who i e. e!i a the alteration would give general satisfaction. There carried this point on Fridsy did not succeed in making out such th e ert a large meeting ir. Sunderland on the subject, called a case. • With regard to the question of Affghanistan_, he li e h e t Purpose of passing a vote of c ens u r e on th e p io p os iti on o f • thought it was no more th an th e t rut h to say, t h at though the the ti • Hon. Bart. That meeting was attended by a very influen- Right Hon. Gentleman made a rhetorical use of that topic, y t t ee, tuber merchant of the town w h o proposed the fir s t resold- what he said on the subject could be regarded in no o th er li g ht te tri p ut he found a seconder, but n o supp or t er , an d an than as mere sophistry.—(" Ora oh ! from the Ministe r i a l Ri c 'meat was proposed and carried. He (Mr. Liddell) benches.) "Du you say," said the Right Hen. Gentlem an , ex: the saute time well aware that a very strong feeling " that there are no disasters? Was there ever such a disaster Pr:'On the proposed change in the timber duties. Th ere as this ?" And then, with great feeling, and, he had no 'doubt, ,'IY one more point to which he would a ll u d e , i n or d er to with deep, sincere feeling, su c h as th e y mus t a ll enterta i n, h e terre the House for a f urther notice on the subject. There exclaimed, " Was there ever such a disaster—ever anything il tle proposition of the Right Honourable Baronet heard of like this—a whole army perishing, only one, two, or li e which h e could not agree. (Loud ironical cheers.) I three persons, out of a great army, escaping to tell lode prepared for that cheer. He alluded, as th e the tale of its destruction ; an d y e t you talk of this ti teli : would anticipate, to the proposed duty on co a l s . Th ere Ls no extremity."—( Hear, hear.) He believed that in one Ir se (_ be another opportunity, when that part of the subje c t sense no person could feel more deeply than hi ms elf th a t thi s it is rfore the House, for him to make such observations upon event was a deep and painful digests r ; not from any feelings tt a , Ts duty demanded. He merely alluded to it th en t o s h ow such as those which an Hon. M em b er on th e ot h er s id e h a d at et; t "e proposition of the . Right Hon. Baro n et had not his tempted some time ago to excite on th a t ( t h e Op pos i t i on ) si d e 'e support, With regerd to his proposition with respect tof the House ; for even if .he did n o t consid er th a t ex p e diti on e tt f i salle he could not agree. At the same time he was per- defensible, and that was not a time for examining the question, • Killing to say that nothing could be more fair than the he bore no share in the responsibility ; lie was nor even in tear lt,.`ll-oe upon ,which the Right Hon. Baronet imposed that liament when the expedition was sent; he was not in office till eo, His intention in rising to address the House had been the expedition was over and Shah Soojah dethroned. • Tnere. t4;' the purpoee of removing what he considered a visionary fore, in anything which he said on the subject, he spoke. With tel, and he thanked. the House for having so patiently heard to out any sense of personal responsibility. But. if every person who lad real that sto-y, if even foreigners who had read it; and N i l. RIGBY WA SON said, sufficient fir the day was the foreign ..rs entertaining no friendly feeling towards this country, liet o ;!ereof.—( Laughter.) He should most certainly dectne were melted into sympathy, what, he might ask, must be the li t ,V 4 g the Hon. Gentleman who had just sat down. feelings of one who had been on term s o f f r i en dl y i ntercourse 4,..„Poght there were strong reasons why the. Right Hon. with the braveandhonourable m e n w h o h a d b een b utc h ere d , an d ttse u eulan should reconsider this proposition, and he would with the amiable women now at the mercy of the murderers of their tie t l th e R ig h t H on . Ge n tl eman th a t t h ere was a great husbands ?—(Hear, hear.) He cou ld sa f e l y say t h at no pu bli c event . which . had ever occurred had given him so much pain. hp g enes between a property and an income tax ; this diffe- D . isastrons in . that sense, indeed—disastrous if they talked of t ei , had been recognised by Mr. Huskisson, and he had eie , disgrace to their arms—disastrous if they talked of the do apt itleona es derived from industrial sources and funded pro ti,,,Ye were very• different, and should not be equally taste I. brave men who had fallen—irretrievably disastrous if they !is e ,!'olen opposite had asserted that they were similar, but thought of the feelings of some who were living—disastrous in ail these respects all must admit. the event, to have been. e'"ori - was not proof, and they had not adduced one proof to their assertion. He thought that real property But they were then to deal with it purely as a financial ques ,eu be taxed, but industrial incomes certainly should go free. tion ; and the courage, the tremendous loss of life, the suf tn"s not going to treat this question as a party question; he fering and wretchedness of the few who survived it, should not ltiene of those who cheered the Right Hon. Itoronet when he Le introduced into the debate for the purpose of aggravating, what he pro titltehat th e t i me was come when property should bear the for the purpose of exaggerating. Th a t was nounced an unfair, s o phi st i ca l, an d r h etor i ca l . use of this great s , t :IS of th e St a t e ; lit t l e did h e t h en thi n k th a t the Ri g ht Lo tt tiaronet was going to subject them to this odious im- calamity.—( Cheers f rom ' th e O ppos i t i on. ) • Th e quest i on (e el he had erred in thinking that there was a wide which they were then to discus, was not a question of cala 1140'etion between a property and an'income tax, he had erred natty —the question was the income tax, as it affected pounds, shil ‘iiiktn'nOn with the landowners of Dumbartonsht:e and Ayr. lings, and pence. lie would ask was it in the contemplation of that who, in the year 1798, had cl e arly exp resses ! their calamity that the Right Hon. Gentleman brought on his in ns on the subject. The Right lion. G en tl eman th e come tax ?—(Loud cries of " Hear, hear," from th e Opposi likeeilor of the Exchequer had asked them if it would not be Con.) Was it not altogether an after-thought? This event, Ik ha to tax the professional man who earned 8 or 10,0001. which was put in the fore front when the income tax was to ltst and the Right ,Hon. Gentleman said that no tax was be justified, was it even known when the income tax was de ei'e.Lfhe (Mr. Wason) had to choose between two species of termined • upon 2—(Cheers from the Opposition.) 'Had the s hould say that it was better th a t th e p ro f ess i ona l Right Hon. Gentleman th o u g ht it necessar y t o a dd a s i ng l e 1% , 3v !th Bor 10,000/. a-year should go untaxed, than th a t the farthing to his Ways and Means in consequence of that cala e,l4',th a miserable pittance of 1501. or 2001. - a-year should nifty? And if he had not thought it necessary to make an 1 1: 4 1 e " to contribute es) large a sum towards the maintenance • addition of a single farthi n g t o hi s W a y s an d M eans , i n conse % state. All taxes that had )et been proposed pressed uuenee of that disaster, how could he call it, financially speak tetthe working classes, but no tax, inquisitorial lug, a great and unparalelled disaster—a disaster such as s, w ^h some of them were, such as the wi n d o w tax was never known in the history of this country ?—( Hear, 4 1 1, 4 so inquisitorial and so odious as this. He hear.) And though no information had been received from t4piL 4 t a notice on the paper, which he mea n t mos t cer t a i n ly the Secretary at War, they were not altogether without the ttla r ' s 'to a division. The Right Hon. Gentleman had r e - means of judging what would be the effect of the disaster in a 4 'them tl en , to exert themselves ; they would do so ; the dc- financial point of view. Of course he (lid not mean to say that ite f 'Y . was two and a half millions, and why should three and he could produce an exact estimate, or anything approaching it teiti ons b e a dd e d to it? H e t h oug h t t h e exper i ment o f to an ex a c t e stim a t e o f the char g e, b u t h e cou ld f orm some hit, 'Olt Hon. Baronet, re'ative to the timber duties, was thing like an opinion. It was the ordinary course for the ksee t t ulealled for; he slid not depreciate the benefits which estimates to be brought in, and the supplies voted, bef o re the pieresulc from that, but he did say that this was not the Ways and M e an s were provided. Not having at pr ese nt any 1 5 5. 1-5 reduce the duties on timber, arid to impose an income estimate of the amount he could only say that he felt firmly t `tl6l had set on the paper that this tax was most inquisi- ' satisfied that nothing could be more futile than to cons' t ,l i ' but the Right Hon. Gentleman said that he would do any comparison between the charge which' this esisastrous event was likely to lay upon the country, arid the charges even of , 4 •44‘4the could toalleviate that. What was said, in 1816, by `ti,je e ', o lkest o ne ? That Nobleman said that this tax was the cheapest Europ 'an war—the charges . of the last war it would li~ee i 0 princip e and inquisitorial in practice, and if they re- be idle to talk of in comparison. His opinion was most strong Nil t " ll ainquisitorial character it would no longer be an in- and decided , as far as lie could see, that the Government we e i; and Lord Brougham had expressed a similar at present taking a very bold and spirited course. lie knew te a " He had set en the paper that this tax was nothing of the subject except what he saw in the public prints, J'Sitt:` immoral one ; and, in proof of this, he ' but it appeared from all the information which he had oh rie Il form them that in 1815 there were 11,003 appeals t o i tamed, that they were taking most vigorous measures f or for -I,ooo'lurnission in consequence of surchargee, and of th-se warding troops to the seat of the war.—(Hear, hear.) In all ' 7 ,000 did not appear, allowing thEmselves rather to be such measures they should have his full and cordial u s • w ed upon than subject their atfairs to pubiie invetigation. support, as much so is though he sat on the other 'side of the 1 14 t ° 4 ld m a k e one more observation before he sat do wn , an d House. No sum of m one y, w hi c h was b ona fi d e necessary f or t,j, was, t h at the Right Hon. Baronet, whilst he did not do that purpose, would 'be refused. He did not, however, antici- N,tL ii, e himself, must take care that injustice was not tom- pate, if ordinary rigour and prudence were shown, any disa s . It e t l by others ; he must take care that he did not allow the trous consequences from the event to which he had referred. lte r r i 4 tax to become the law of the land, and then allow the There was no doubt that firmness and prudence would be 1t, t ,10 be rejected by tne House.—(" Hear, hear," from Sir shown.—( Hear, heas. ) There was no doubt that a Govern -I'd h eel * ) He was glad that the Right Hon. Baronet cheered, ment,which had the Duke of Wellington fir one of its members, `vas quite the advice of so many eminent and ' 4 ll ll k -the wHou for the attention with which the few remarks experienced military men, would be most inexcusable if every made had been listened to. effort were not made which could tend to remedy the disaster. q WYNN said that he felt the justice of the. ob- —(Hear, hear.) Besides, the Right Hon. Gentleman must t'ixa 1_ • had been urged by Hon. Members against this remember that the principle ordinarily acted upon—he believed etys,"-n was aware of the inequalities of the tax, but he invariably acted upon—was that all the troops tent upon such a ;;( 4 Re k ,Y 4 oth er t o which stronger Objections would not apply. service as this were a charge upon the Government of India. e et then h ear.) He saw the objections, and he was ready to Let him suppoie that the Right Hon. Baronet intended that the the the estielile d face them in consequence of the difficulties English people should bear the ' charge of the re-in at in th !' vie had to contend.—( Hear, hear.) He thought forcements sent out to India. Why, what re-inforce ehalieek,ls question there would 'be no difference of opinion, menus did he intend to send out there? He wool's' ta t h P. , that every one believed that the time was come suppose that 10,000 or 12,000 troops added to those which C'ess t i 5 Y Tnust in justice take some bold and decided measure, were in India would be most amply sufficient for any service i:clee es l t et wished to sacrifice that credit which the country for which they might be designed. Now, if he correctly re tethe measures maintained. They were told they ought to resort membered the army estimates, a regiment of 1,100 men in as proposed in the budget of last year. Now, India cost 32,000/., or thereabouts. He believed the whole ett e C an arguirpnt already disposed of ; the House had charge of the addition which the Right Hon. Gentleman con - !ne pro e osal, and the country at large had confirmed templated would fall somewhat under 400,000/. a ,;51l e us ion• He did not think it necessary, therefore, to year. Now, let them remember under what circumstances e. . 4 tlei 7l ' ° u that subject. Again it was said there might be the income tax was introduced f .rmerly. When the income t s 7 761 1 n to tbe assessed taxes. He remembered that, in the tax was introduced in 1798, England stood alone against France, such a proposal bid met with the concurrence of the Austria, and Spain i n France ranging itself on the banks of the at, PY ., I hut that we; a period of peculiar emergency. There Rhine, Austria bound this by a treaty, England not having a h e Loat time a triple assessment, and an increase of revenue single ally; Ireland in rebellion in that year ; the three per Iteeoeh Obtained. Some of the l a r g est pr o pri e tors i n the cents. at 50—under those circumstauces, the income tax was c tti t t e r wer e , however, opposed to the war altogether, and introduced. There were then 300,000 soldiers in the as -` ti a much aspossibie, contributing in anyway to bear their army, 120,000 seamen a fl oa t ; th e navy es ti m ates alone 4 lt the b ur d ens t o w hi c h th e coun t r y w as su bj ec t at the were hi g h er th an t h e w h o l e est i mates o f t h e a rm ) , - t he T he taxes imposed fell, by this means, very unequally navy, and ordnance, for the present year.—( Hear.) Of ii:la se l ,7 ° Perty of the country ; and the income tax had been course be referred now to the year 1806. The late calamity under th ose c i rcum stances, to remedy the inequality, was indeed a most serious a n d pa i n f u l one; but it was not so i• l e l ';'ed it wa s ow i ng t o th' s t hat th e co u n try submitted so great a blow as to requir e th a t th e y s h ou ld r esort to a remedy Oita; ° a tax upon i ncomes . Th e great party who had dis- which nothing but the last extremity could justify.—( Hear, k t i t t ei:' of th e war h a d oppose d th at tax , an d ins i s t e d on its hear, hear.) He mus t say i t appeare d to him that , Ltil etermination 01 the war. They succeededintheirpur- neither the proposition, nor the language of the Right i ; tee, ahe country, however, had since fallen into embarrass- Honourable Baronet was calculated to inspire a and e tt „ cli s , extraordinary;me effort should be made to support high and just idea of the . spirit an d res ources of this country. etee e ; He confessed that he felt great objection to an in- Not, indeed, that he said the calamity was irreparable ,he E 4. 1 0 , 4 1, the assesse d taxes, which lie felt would press with very now referred to his first speech ; yet wlierev, rhe (Mr. Macau- F,te 4 ' weight upon the labouring classes. Again, it had lay) opened the French papers he found then' using such , , 1, .—Sett to levy a tax upon succession;. But he be- language as this See the th a t the English aristo ne it'would be very difficult to carry out such a measure. cracy that huge power which has been th. e terror kte t 'Ye in raising a tax on funded property, to ascertain of Europe. is now beginning to decline the most amount;Pptpro b u t th e same thing come not be said of odious tax which could' be devised, never before telke e e e rtY Were they to have valuators appointed for the resorted to but in time of war, i s about to be t ale 'to fix the value of estates in the different parts of the revived. Praise to the Minister who has shewn such spirit." i k ti e k and to determine the interest which each individual Were those terms of applause which an English Minister did tr d• Property ? He thought such a system would lead to seek to call forth ?—( Hear, hear.) He believed it to be a most !lee di and inconvenienc e s, and th a t ;t would be more certain and demonatrablefact, that at this moment England was 1 1 ,- ,in its nature than the proposed income tax. It better able (God forbid that the necessity should arise) to 'Val e t' said that the income tax was a war tax; but maintain agrees war than she ever was in the whole course_ of t he real not attach much importance to that objection. her history . .—( Hear.) Believii.g this, he could not wander t ii le t questi on was w h et h er i t was t h e b est mo d e o f mee ting that pmiticia ns abroad, who krew the o diousness of this tax, teat eh es lities of the tim e , an d w h e ther any o ther tax could be that as soon as peace . was restored it w as the first which the Cp,"" more efficient. He confessed that the proposal of voice of the whole nation compelled the Parliament to repeal— Or a e'hosent was the best, in his cainion, which. under the it was no strange that politicians abroad should form an ei I 'tette ea, could he adopted. He did . not labour under neous Notion of the effects of the late disaster as espected the e e k oension that the tax would be continued after the nc- power and resources of this country. Sir R. PEEL made some observations across the table. tit,"lr! ' e - i ",ad passed away on which it had its rise. Nj'tled t fICAULAY rose, and said, that since the House had Mr. MACAULAY—The,• R ght Hon. Gentleman de la.:ll.l considerations of constitutional right and acti- dared that he had said r othing so alarming as b il ge lence should yield to a mere usage of 150 years,. he, •be described. He (Mr. Macaulay) had said what he believed )1 1 ,,NtIl t , r1 °Mance of a pledge which he had given to his con- 'to be important truths. He believed that the Right Hon. the th Would venture to submit to the House their wishes Baronet had taken advantage of the feeling naturally excited !'t tt i L e r: subject then under its consideration. He trusted by the late calamity, and had used it with the skilfulness of a te e re long it would be in his power to perform that duty practiced debater, to make* it tell upon the financial question 11t. more regular and more agreeable to his own lea- before the House, which was in fact e a question totally eta which eou.d not believe in the lontocontinuance of any distinct from it. A few words with respect to another cip t is v g o 'eh haul in its favour, for the time, a majority .of a topic. The Right Hon. Gentleman had' thought fit to ke t , t e , and not the shadow of even a single reason,— introduce into that discussion, namely, the state of the Indian ti ti • ear. ) He would state as concisely as he could, in pre- finances. The Right Hon. Barenet said that there was a t l ltl se tt Petition to the House—for his object was not vexation deficit in India as well asin , England, and he intimated that in ( - ** - that he had been charged by the Lord Provost, the some mode or other it might be necessary for this country to li:treb t ' e urleil, and Magistrates of Edinburgh, in some manner make up the deficiency. Surely it was important, before they n,,155 e1 , 0 7 to communicate to the House their opinion that voted away money, to know precisely for what purpose it was e al to tax all kinds of income would lead to palpable in- to be applied.—( Hear.) He (Mr. Macaulay) must altogether kti i '' th e "' °Ppression, would be unequal in its operation, would dismiss ,f, om his view this unexplained demand, and confine ts,, %% we door to frauds, would debase the national cheracter, his attention to existing circumstances and difficulties. Since tp i t tt. t" r ender necessary the most inquisitorial arrange. the last war there had been twenty-two millions of taxes taken lleel ae 4 e nother resolution to the same effect had been played off, and he believed he was not incorrect in saying that those by the Chamber of Commerce of Edinbuigh, and ' taxes, if now in existence, would yield a much larger sum. li n ti le eett requested to communicate, in some Parliamentary Why was the tax which was the last imposed and the first re. e,,,tZsubstance of that resolution. His own Opinion upon pealed, to be, without any overbearing necessity, re-inflicted j iZ e t. agreed ith that of his censtituerds; and that upon the country. Consider for a moment the article of sugar. eirtll,„'`inot been shaken by the speech delivered by the The Right - Honourable Gentleman's memory appeared to th e PeeC Baronet the Other evening—a speech to which he fail him on that subject, when he said on Friday that to e '4ht t he greate s t a tt en tion. Th e r e al questions, as he he had never denied that an increase of revenue 1ts?„, t ' w hich they haul to consider were these : Was the in- mi g ht he .I.rtv,.d from the alterations proposed by the 'Hes% of a tax which ought to be imposed only in circum- late Gc vernment iu the duties on timber and sugar. tr ee ele e l extreme emergency ? and were the text in The Right teen. Genteetnen said he used the argument with L l-T geie: s putitry was now placed, circumstances of reme regard to other things, but his (Mr. Macaulay's) memory was ktl t t 4 a a • His ans Ater to these questions was, that the income quite the other way, and he had got a copy of the speech mid?. t ° it! k t u . r . l - Right Ho- G-- igt tk dich nothing but. the last extreniiiy could justify, t r "It -last extremity did not now exist. With regard it, th t objection t o th e ta x , th e Right Hon. Baronet had e 9 l je 1::(1 Hord w hi c h affected it, or which touched upon qo ty sail one word tending to show that the in ,"i,fri,rLe lto it did not exist, or that that inequality was ievance. Instead of astern ting to prove t „ 'equality was not a most odious part of the tax, the 14 4 , . . " „ en himself with showing them that it was an es it 0 r' k s i,..the tax. Whenever any Hon. Gentleman on e %I t 'l'm benches had said that the inequality was an in -14.'14 D i l t art s he tax, so often did the Hon. Gentlemen on I`;l l ,„l'le, h 7that assertion with applause. It was their 4 cOsii4 . l 3elieved it was a sound principle—that it was next t lii t iliev ec r to separate a property tax from an income tax. 1 4% a h - Income sax to be one of the most nnjurt and un -that could exist. He allowed that necessity might w kt,..24. 14 1 ? it . , just as necessity might force them to tea. ;14 si g - --Just as necessity might force them in time of t qcp:ge towns, 'destroy suburbs, and ruin property, Pet satingibe bufferers; because in great emerges by .ighk _on. , entleman, - which confirmed his impres sion. And he believed he may appe::l to the who'e House, whether the report was not almost verbally correct. The Right Hon. Gentleman then referred to that part of Sir R. Peel's speech, in which he said that be could not expect to de rive an immediate revenue by having recourse to the measures of the late Government. l'herefore his (Mr. Macaulay's) memory was confirmed by the report of the Right Hon. Ba ronet's speech, and the only argument which he brought for ward, and which had received such an overwhelming answer from his Right Hon. Friend, he said, on Friday night, he had not used with regard to sugar and coffee. The truth wrs, that when he entered upon that " process of exhius tion," and enumerated the devices for obtaining a revenue, and when he came to that part of the plan of the late Government which he ought have repeated, he felt the diffi culty, and be now said that he had not used any arguments with respect to it, because he knew that they would be utterly trifling and impotent.—(Cheers.) Being ashamed of those arguments he returned for the first time to the story about slavery, but when he (Mr. Macaulay) saw no scruples with THE SUN, LONDON, TUESDAY IVIORNING. APRIL 12, 184 2 regard to. the revenue raised from slave grown tobacco.— ' ( Hear, hear.) And slave grown coffee.—(Cheers.) On which a reduction had been made in that very ,tariff—( Hear, hear) —how was it possible for him under those circumstances to think that slavery was the real object in view, and he must confess that it was a strong effort of charity on his part to believe the Right • Hon. Baronet sincere.—(Laughter and cheers.) if he were to find other reasons why a reduction of the duty on sugar was nut proposed as one of the means to meet the deficit of the revenue, upon looking to the whose history of the matter he might suggest that last year, when it was determined to turn out the late Govern ment, and the popular cry of slavery was raised, and, a reso lution was passed in terms condemning the project of the late Government on philanthropic grounds, the names of one or two Hon. Members were mentioned in connextion with the subject.—( Hear, hear.) Now he (Mr. Macaulay) appeared before a constituency at all times zealous in the Anti Slavery cause, and he found all the statements of the party opposite Were treated as hollow pretences.—(Cheer;.) Well, the Right -Hon. Gentleman came into power after the vote of last year, 'and he did not propose a reduction of the duty on sugar because li`de knew that he could not propose a measure, which he Opposed on moral grounds, wit bout exposing himself to the Charge of gross inconsistency, but an income tax was the price which the country had to pay. —( Hear, hear.) The Right lion. Gentleman when he could not find reasons for Iris proposition, made theM, andwith one swoop he did away with • bOO,OOOl. derived from the timber ditty, and his, firm belief was, that the throwing away of 600,0001. of timber duty, was a greater misfortune than what had occurred in Affghanistan. It was clear that they were going to loose 600,0001. in the one case, and he hoped that so great a suns would not be lost in consequence of what had happened in Affghanistan.—( Hear.) And when, instead of making an additional .560,0001. by tim ber. the Right Hon. Baronet pitched over the 600,00:3, they wese receiving from it, and was forcing an income tax on the country to supply the deficiencies in the revenue; lie must say that he seemed to him to be employed in making a deficit in order that he may have an excuse for imposing an income tax. —(Cheers.) Believing, then, that the tax could be proved, and had been proved, to be one which should nut be imposed, except in the extreme necessity of the country ; that the Right Hon. Baronet had exaggerated the financial difficulties of the country ; that he had brought into the discussion of the subject matter whi h should not be connected with it ; that he had made vague hints of the crippled state of the Indian finances; wthout giving the smalles enlightenment on the subject—that he had refused a plan simple and plain, and which would benefit the public, while it would partly supply the deficieucies, —that lie had thrown away sources of revenue. Under these circumstances he felt lie would not be discharging his duty if hedid not vote for the motion of his Noble Friend.—(Cheers.) Lord STANLEY, said that he was anxious before the debate came to a close—especially after the speech they had just heard from the Right Hon. Gentleman who last sat down —to state as shortly as he could the grounds on which, not without reluctance, but from a conviction of its necessity, he concurred in that course which was unanimously resolved upon by her Majesty's Cabinet as the only course—as the fitting course by which they should meet the great difficulties of the country, and endeavour to find a remedy for the financial and other embarrassments bequeathed to them by the late Government.—(Loud cheers.) Widely as Gentlemen on both sides may differ as to the course they were taking, and to whatever vote they may come on the present occasion, it was satisfactory to him to know that much of the time i.f the House had been saved by the concurrence, more unanimous, or, at least, more general, than he ever remem bered on any question approaching to the present in Weight and importance, as existed with regard to the premises on which their conclusion is to be founded.--( Cheers.) '1 he fact of a deficiency was clear, palpable and notorious.—(Cheers. ) It is admitted by the Noble Lord, that for a successionpf years there was a continued increase of a deficiency in the revenue to meet the annual exeenditure of the country. He stated the truth—not the whole truth—hut he stated the truth with re gard to the deficiency of the present yearof 2,500,000/., and for the next of 2,600,0001. But lie went further; for, now heing no longer in offise, lie charged them with those acts for the purpose of mating that popularity of which Hon, Gentlemen on the other side were so fend. They were now no longer charged wth the responsibility of proposing taxes as a Government to meet the financial em barrasments of the country by vigorous measures.—(Cheers. ) The time few mete shifts had passed away.—(Loud Cheers. ) The time was come to when they must take some effectual mode of equalising the revenue with the expen diture, and they thought it right and necessary to raise the amount of taxation requisite to meet the deficiencies.— ( Hear, hear.) Here was another admission made by Gentle man on the other side—namely, that the commercial interests laboured under a state of great depression and difficulty, and on every side it was admitted that there was a great and growing deficiency; that that deficiency must be met; that no temporary expedient could abate that deficiency, that it is impo:sible to do away the evil by a temporary plan to meet the evil, and that they must raise the amount required by taxation, and that commerce labouring in distress must not be subjected to any additional burden. ( Loud Cheers.) Now, here were admissions made not only by that Gentleman, but by every Member on both sides of the House who had ad dressed themselves to the consideration of the question that then engaged their attention ; and they had also another valu able admission, he believed from the Hon. Member for Tams ton,:the Vice-President of the Board of 'trade; from him the bad an admission that if they were now to have recourse the scouted and condemned budget of last year, which they Noble Lord brought forth in his resolutions, that that budget, and a large increase of taxation in addition to it, would be in sufficient to meet the, present emergency.—( Hear, hear.) These were the unanimous admissions made by the House when it came to discuss the question .of how they were to meet the de ficiency. And now, nut to be behind Honourable Gentlemen opposite in admissions, they, on ths side of the House admitted that the income tax was a measure which, except in a case of great emergency, could not be justified, The question before them, then, was this : Is this such a case of emergency ? If Hon. Gentlemen opposite admitted, as they must admit, the necessity of equalis ing the revenue and the expenditure ; and if they cannot show, as a less objectionable mode of meeting the exigency, they must come to a direct taxation. He said direct taxation, because the Noble Lord had so carefully worded his resolution, as to conceal beneath it, with a most impolitic ambiguity; the dif ference of opinion which he knew existed in the ranks of his supporters with regard to the kind of taxation to be resorted to. Having now mentioned the points of agreement, he might now be permitted to mention the points of disagreement among Gentlemen on the other side of the House.—( Hear.) The Honourab'e Member for Ipswich, who seemed to have got up a little scheme of his own, which at the proper time he would propound to the House, in dis cussing the question, of the emergency said, he ( Lord S. ) en tirely agreed with him, that peace had its times of emergency as w,ll as war, and admitted that they were in that condition i n which direct taxation must be resorted to.—( Hear, hear. ) By the confession of the a-lon. Member for Ipswich, the bring ing forward a propertr tax was a wise and politic measure. But the Noble Lord, if he admitted a property :ax at all, contended that all equity and justice and sound sense required therri to admit an income tax also, and that if they threw out the in come tax, they could not for a moment stand up . and support a property tax. But, said the Noble Lord now, admitting that I couple them both together, the present circum stances of the country give no reason for introducing a property tax as any direct tax whatever. They had also the testimony of another Gentleman on the other side ; the Member fur Greenock, and he states that in his judgment a property tax and an income tax must go together; the House could not object to one and not to the other ; that if they resorted to direct taxation, it must tike effect on all property alike, de rived from incomes of every description. In this he entirely agrees with the Noble Lord ; but he would be found to differ from very many gentlemen on the other side of the House, who were exceedingly ready to tax all real property—(hear, hear)—who cared not how heavy were the burdens they laid upon the landed or funded property—( Hear, hear) —but who took especial care. of all property arising from un certain and contingent sources. Then the Hon. Member for Coventry whoa ho came to discuss what they should take instead of a tax or income, or property , referring to the bud get of last year, said that they were periectly right in the state of their relations with foreign countries, not to take the duties on sugar as part of their budget. With regard to the timber duties, the Right Hon. Gentleman who had just sat dawn, had told them that the loss on the timber duties was equal to the great financial diastar that had occurred in Affghanistan, of which he shouln presently have a word or two to say to the Right Hon. Gentleman,—(Loud cheers from the Ministerial benches. That was the language held by the Right Honourable Gentleman on the other side, while the Hon. Member for Coventry, speaking of the same duties, and the same reduction of them says, that for the extension of the commerce and the general community, it was impossibe to propose a measure more beneficial. Here was a sample of the agreement and the harmony among gentiemen en the other side of the House, when we propose to meet the emer gency which they cannot deny; they cannot avoid all sorts of differences among themselves without being able to point out any better expedient. Now what are the circumstances in which it is justifiable to have recourse to an income tax? It was not the emergency of a state of war alone, but the emer gency of that state of things in which the revenue was iesuffi ciene to meet the current expenditure; a state of things which, if permitted to go on, must injure the credit, and con sequently damage the prosperity of the country.—( Hear.) The Noble Lord told them that in no ease should an income tax be resorted to, except in a time of war: he did not think that that admission of the Noble Lord was xery complimentary to the Government, by whose management and policy, the finances of the country, of the end of twenty years peace, were brought into such a state that there should be a necessity to resort to an income tax to supply the deficiency.—( Loud cheers from the Tory benches.) To that extreme measure which heretofore had been considered among the peculiar re sources of the country in a time of war—(Cheers)—but neitner could he admit that in the present state of things they were in such. a condition as that described by the Hon. Member for Lewes, who said they were in a state of profound peace. A state of profound . peace . Let them look at their relations with all the li - refit!, relaiions that had been bequeathed to them by Hon. Gentlemen opposite.—( Cheers.) Let them look at the state of their relations in the North, in the South, in the East, in the West 1 Let them look at this moment,—(Oh, oh, and cheer from the Ministerial side.) He earnestly hoped, and he wls sanguine enough to believe that their differences with the United States of America might be brought to a friendly and happy conclusion ; but he asked when ever had it been necessary for the state of their Canadian provinces to keep there 20,000 British bayonets ?—( Cheers. ) When before, in a state of profound peace, had it been necessary to maintain in Canada an army of 20,000 men ?—(Cheers.) A state of pro found peace ! Look at China. Look at the war they had stirred up there, and let them tell him the amount of financial difficulty they had created. Let them calculate, if they Could, the amount of tinancial embarrassment which they had secured them for toe fortune of the war.--( Cheers.) Do not measure it by the number of troop=, by the 9,000 or 10,000 men of all arms, and by the fleet which they had there, but was there not a war, then, of which no man could see the result, and in which every man knew but little glory could be reaped by the British arms, while there was much uncertainty whether or not, they might encounter signal disaster and failure. A state of profound peace ! Look at India. Let the Right Honourable Gentleman turn his eye to that portion of the Indian empire, of which the Right Hon. Gentleman had spoken, contending that the disasters is Affghanistan, even made a mere sophistry and plausible argument. • The state of Afighanistan mere sophistry ! The Right Hon. Gentleman himaelf, was glad enough to disclaim all personal responsibility for that state of things.—(lmmense cheers from the Ministe rial benches. ) The Right lion. Gentleman who had subse quontiv tilled the situation of Secretary at War, must have had means in his official capacity of calculating to a certain extent, the dangers and disasters they were likely to meet, and well and wisely did the Right Hon. Gentleman tell them, that when the expedition was undertaken he was not in power—(Cheers) —that he was not in the Cabinet—that he was not even in Parliament ; that so far from counselling such a war he was not even in England, nor a Mentber of the Administration till the expedition had come too its completion. Ah ! but then came the time when they were warned by the Dake of Wel lington what would be the result. They would recollect :he prophetic sagacity with which he told them that triumph they might—that he bed full confi dence in the bravery of their troops, and in the gallantry and skill of the a-my, but when they should have succeeded then woe!d come the difficulty of keeping possession. And you did succeed, and you slept on the top of the volcano, and you woke only to find yourself overwhelmed by the_ fiery tor rent, The Right Hon. Gentleman admitted, indeed, that this wes a great disaster, but that, in a financial point of view, it was nothing at all that, in afinancial point of view, while, addressing a British House of Commons, he said, Was the ()ply light in which they had to view it.—(oli, oh, from the Oppositioe.) Even on the low ground he would meet the Right Hon: Genth-man, and tell him that he takes a false view of our financial diffi culties, occasioned by their miserable policy, with regard to Affghanistan. Would the Right Hon. Gentleman, the late President of the Board of Control, coincide with him? Ile knew the Right Hon. Gentleman's knowledge of India, and his official connexi on w i t h that d e p ;r tment had taught him to estimate more- g l oom il y, and he believe d more tru l y , the financial embarra ssment consequent on the di sasters our army had sustained in Affghanistan—the disaster which, they were told by the Right Hon. Gentleman, was not, in a finan cial paint of view, worth the 600,000/. tiry were going to give up on the timber duties. But thev were going to send out ten thousand men more, and that would not cost more than 25,0001. ; and that, in a financial point of view, the misfortune was a mere matter of sophistry. and in a financial point of view contemptible. Contemptible, was it? How did he view the declaration of the Right lion. Gentleman as to the Freemasonry of Islamism? What did lie tell you of the religious feeling Ahat had beer, excited ? What did he tell you of a great Mahometan success? Th at it would fall like a spark upon tow. That when he forms an estimate of pounds, shillings, and pence, of the loss of these brave men ._(Cries of " Oh," and" Hear)—when ha made his calcula tion—(" Oh, oh ")—ashen he has made his celculatien of the :urn of money—(" Oh, oh ")—h e was quoting the Right lion. Gentleman's owa words ; an d h e told those Gentlemen who tried " Oh, oh," on this occa s i on , t h ough he adm i tte d t h at the disaster—a disaster not less than Walcheren—yet he affirms that the loss is less than the amount given up on the timber duty; that on the present occasion they had only to deal with it as a financial question, and one which was to be propeed merely as a measure of. pounds, shillings, and pence, I would the Right Hon. Gentleman say, when he had calculated the amount of pounds, shillings, and pence, by which we are financially to measure this great di saster to the British arms. I say he has omitted in those calculations, or rather those fearful anticipations, which would necessarily arise in any man who gave a moment's coni•ideration to the subject, all these consequences that might arise from this great Mahometan's success, which was falling like sparks on taw all the consequences that might spring from that Freemasonry of Islamism which extended from Morocco to Coromandel.—(Cheers.) If our Empire is, India rests upon that prestige of opinion, who shall calculate is a financial point of view the ruinous and extravagant expenditure to which we must be led, it we intend to support our character in India, and maintain, against the spread of the feeling to which he had alluded, as well as against the memory of recent disasters, the opinion of the invincibility of British arms. Was not the Right Hon. Gentleman aware that besides the deficiency of 2,500,000/., there was also the war of Affghanistan to be provided for, and the recent disaster to be repaired.—(Cries of " Hear, hear.") However gloomy were the apprehensions t f her Majesty's Go vernment at the beginning the sestiob, they were not fully aware of the extent of the disasters in Affghanistan.— (Cheers.) Still they had foresight enough to think of making provision for the evil that might come.—(Cheers.) They did not act upon the aphorism of the Hon. Member for Ips wich, that sufficient for the day was the evil thereof. —(r ory cheers.) But, in January last, they did know that it would be necessary to call for an increase of taxation, not without consi dering all the objections which would be raised against any measure of taxation which they night bring forward.— ( Cheer,.) They knew how skilfully and ably, and how un fairly—(Cheers)—those objections would be brought forward — but yet they came to the conclusion that by indirect taxa tion alone they would not be able to meet the difficulties which were not of their creation..—(Cheers.) But that by the financial arrangements proposed by his Right Hen. Friend, they would be able not only to meet the deficiency, but at the same time greatly to relieve the commerce and industry of the country. The Noble Lord opposite said that all difficulties would have been avoided if the House had conceded the budget which he had brought in last )ear. In proposing that budget the Noble Lord had spoken of the howl of the old slave-holding party.--( Cheers.) But the Noble Lord had this year an oppor tunity of again proposing that part a his budget, and the House had condemned it as far as regarded that item, and he sent up to the other branch of the Legislature a bill framed upon an opposite principle.—( Cheers. ) The Noble Lord disclaimed being the enemy of the landed interest, and yet he said that what he should propose would be an increased impost upon the assessed taxes, and a new duty upon the transfer and succession of real property. The noble Lord argded as if real property had escaped from all taxation, and overlooked all the argument of his Right Honourable Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer, who showed that tl.e land now paid taxes equal to those paid by personal property in various forms.—(Cheers and counter cheers.) lion. Gentlemen who cried, " Oh, oh !" were not conversant with real property.—(Great cheering, and Lries of " Oh, oh !") They di t not know what were the bur • dens actually borne by the land, nor what were the duties im posed upon the transfer of real property by settlement and conveyance.—(Cheers, anti cries of " Oh, oh !") He would not weary the House by going through the whole of a subject which had already been nearly exhausted. He would not deny that an income tax must p..rtake of an inquisitorial character. Neither would he go the length of the Hon. and Learned Mem ber for Bath, who said that no honest man could object to make public his ref l circumstances ; for he (Lord Stanley) could understand the case of an honest man to whom it wculd be most inconvenient and painful to be compelled to say exactly what his income was.--( Hear.) Still he thought it was possible to avoid such inconvenience, and to divest the impost of much of its inquisito.ial character, and to guard against any greater breaches of morality than would be involved in such an increase of the assessed taxes as the Noble Lord himself did not hesitate to propose. To the inequality of the tax, he confessed he slid not tee so high an objection. He had heard an Hon. Gentleman, he did not re member whom, say if such a tax were to take off the national debt—if it was to set the country free for the future from a large proportion of the debt, and if for that purpose they were going to raise ten or fifteen per cent. or even twenty per cent., he would not object to an income tax. Now, in his (Lord Stanley's) view, such would be a case of gross injustice and the present was not. They were not calling upon the country to pay its past incumbt aeces, nor to provide for future exigencies. They were calling upon every man of this country, according to his means, lie those means chat they might, ex empting those of very moderate incomes, but upon every man who had a competency they were calling to contribute front his resources to the payment of the expenses of the year. Whether incomes were derived from fixed capital, and were such as remained after expenditure had ceased, or whether they were of uncertain tenure, or were mere annuities, they were calling upon every man in his situation (it might be unfortunate for hint to be in the pessession of a larger income at a particular time) they were ceiling upon every individuel in the country at large to provide for the annual expenditure of the country. So far horn its being an unequal, unjust, and oppressive mode of proceeding, he be lieved it to be a w i se , soun d , and politic mode ; verydifferent from the system pursued by the late Government, but not, in his mind, less deserving the attention of the country, because not altogether following the precedent set by that Govern ment. The Right lion. Gentleman, the Member for Tippe rary, in a very eloquent speech—[The Noble Lord was here reminded that the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Shell) to whom he alluded was Member for Dungarvon. 1 The Noble Lord then went on to say, that he had been so accustomed to consider the Right Hon. Gentle Man as his (Lord Stanley's) re presentative—(Laughter)—that lie had totally forgotten that the Right Hon. Gentleman had ceased to sit for Tipperary. The Right Hon. Gentleman the other night in taunting his (Lord Stanley's) friends and those on that side of the House that supported them, ha l quoted two lines from the poet Waller— " Still as you rise, the State exalted toe ; Knows no distnrbance while ttis changed by you." The quotation would have applied still better had the Right Gentleman gone cn and quoted two lines further— ' " Changed is the world's gre a t scene, w h en w ith ou t no i se , Therising suns light vulgar li g h t destroys. " (Laughter.) From an opponent he (Lord Stanley) must say, that that was a most attering testimony to the change which had taken place, and he knew it would be more emphatic if they looked that the change took place without noise. There was not so much fuss and bustle ; more business was done; where things were dark anti obscure and uncertain, and men got perchance into the right path, they knew not how; for the present they would keep it, and would diverge from it —they saw nothing but what was under their nose--(Laugh ter)—but the moment the change took place, which had been alluded to by the Right 'Hon. Gentleman, all that had been dark became light—all that had been confueion became order —men saw obstacles in their path,. but found themselves able to surmount those obstacles, and did not go stumbling into every puddle which might lie in the way of those who walked by night. He (Lord Stanley) did not think that the Right Hon. Baronet required any vindication for preferring his own plan to the course of the late GovernMent as indicated las Year, and as pa-tly shadowed forth in the course of the discus sion by lion. Gentlemen opposite. Whatever alarm might be said to be felt as to the present measure, he re peated he did not think that they required any vindication, nor that they were fairly to be charged with hesi tating to confront great interests, or with seeking for them selves popularity. They proposed a measure, which he trusted the House would adopt, and which, he believed, would meet with the general approbation of the country at large—a mea sure against which he was, at least, justified in sea ing that the interval of Easter, which was so earnestly prayed for, had not pro. duced that universal burst of execration which seemed to have been expected—a measure, moreover, which proposed to raise tile credit, and redeem the embarrassments of this country, at a time when its commercial interests required it—a measure which had extorted, even from stiong political opponents, this honourable testimony, that it was an honest, a direct, and a straightforward measure.—(Cheers.) Mr. LABOUCEIERE said, thal the Noble Lord who had just sat down had addresses the House with his accustomed vehemence and ability, but he was sorry to be obliged to add, with much less than his accustomed fairness, lie tMr. L. ) should not attempt to follow the Noble Lord through all the glaring misstatements and misrepresentations which he had made. But there was ope which he had heard with peculiar regret, and to which 'he would not say, in justice to his Right Houourable Friend, the Member for Edin burgh (Mr. Macaulay), but in justice 'to the Hon e it necessary to and his (Mr. L's.) own feelings, he thought Right Hon, lion. Friend had call the immediate attention of the House.. He thought the mis-statement so gross and obvious, that it must have struck every Member equally that had heard it, as be h y e o ( n A d i a r l . m L o . s; atoonyk sligetnentifielenln.tF, character and thing which had been a precedent in that House in the way of B a r n i d tis n h ot a h r i m ng y n occurred to rais t e h n e d; d m o i w s t t a h te e m w e o n r t d . s a The thehe tNobleme, that t d h said, treated the disaster which had in Affghani,tan as a mere financial question, th a e n N d o h b e le a L th o le rd d that the Right Hon. Gentleman had estimated the lois of brave men by pounds, shillings, and pence. He (Mr. L. therefore ventured to say, that as nothing could be more im. ca p otr attempted odiousr pbte aendmdtooifasten ds tieffnetrhueenpnot upon suchrho the Right dispo sitionm of the Right Hon. Gentleman; and also from the words and arguments used by him on the occasion referred to, he (Mr. L.) really felt it almost unnecessary, for he was sure there was not a man in the House, who had listened to the Noble Lord, on whatever side that Member might be sitting, that was n o t aware of the answer which he (Mr. L.) was not,/ going to give. His Right Hon. Friend in very eloquent and forci ble language, has cleared himself of even the possibility of an impuation. He had expressed. that which all must feel, namely, deep regret at the disaster, he trusted temporary disaster, which had befallen the British army ; but he had added that they were called on to con sider not of the policy that led to that. Conduct, nor of i . s mili tary consequences, but solely of it as a question of finance; and in that sense, and in that sense only, had spoken of it. He (Mr. L.) thought that his Right Hon. Friend was justified in using that_ argument whed they were called cn to vote a tax founded on those circumstances which might be alleged as one of the reasons for the tax.—(Hear. ) He (Mr. L.), therefore, thought the Right lion. Gentleman perfectly justified in using such an argument, and it was not worthy of the Noble Lord to refer to it as he had done. The injustice of such an allusion he thought the Noble Lord must, upon reflection see, and would, no doubt, regret it. In truth he (Mr. L.) attributed that departure f Gin the usual fairness if the Noble Lord to those symptoms of irritation which they had se, n persons connected with the Government in the course of these debates evince. . Notwithstanding the coefid ntial tone with which they had spoken to the House, and the country, of the financial scheme they proposed, he could not help attributing very great doubts h..; rig entertained by them, as to whether the country would receive that mea sure with such entire satisfaction, as they affected to believe. The Right Hon. Member for Tamworth, in the speech which be had addressed to the House on Friday night, expressed his astonishment at his - having encountered determined re sistance on thi s subject. He (Sir. L.) could as-' sure the Right Honourable Gentleman that neither on the present occasion, nor on any fdrmer one had he expressed him self towards him in a manner inconsistent with personal respect, which he felt more for the character of the Right Ho-, pourable Gentleman, than for his high and official station. But at the same time, in speaking for himself, he (Si r. L.) must say, that when a Government brought .forward a measure,. of which • he, in his cogscience disapproved, and which he thought dangerous to the country, be felt it his duty to offer it determined opposi tion. He would give such a measure no factious or vexatious apposition for the purpose of delay ; but by every means which the constitutional rules of the House allowed, he would oppose the Income Tax Bill on its first, second, and third readings, and if ,he [did not do so he did not think he would be doing his duty to his constituents and the country. The Right Hon. Gentleman the Member for Tamworth had taunted the late Government with having clung to office, al though supported by very. small-majorities, and contrasted their situation with his ( Sir R. Peel's) own, supported as be now was by a considerable majority. He was surprised to hear the Right lion. Gentleman using language of that kind, and thought he must have fergottrn the history of the y ear 1835 ( Chcers)—when there was a Government which remained in office a very considerable time, although it was not only not supported by a small majority, but was actually, during the whole period of its existence, in a very considerable minority.— (Cheers.) He did not mean to reflect on the conduct of the Right Hon. Gentleman on that occasion. He had no doubt but that the Right lion. Gentleman had then been actuated by very proper motives, but it was a little too much, after the events of 1835, for the Right Hon. Gentleman to be so elated by his having now a large majority as to taunt the late Government with having held office although only sup ported by a small one. The .Right Hon. Gentleman had said that the late Government had delayed proposing their plans of commercial reform until they had no chance of carrying them. Now the late Government at its first advent to power, when it was strong in public support, and strong in the sup port of a large Parliamentary majority, had proposed an alter ation in the timber duties. That proposition the Right Hen. Gentleman and others acting in concert with him, had by raising the cry against free tra.le, and appealing to the influence of those interested in supporting monopoly, been enabled to defeat, and knowing that, was it surprising that they should hesitate to bring forward their measures of commercial reform until they felt that further delay would be dangerous to the in terests of the country, and having felt that they proposed those measures to Parliament, and staked their existence as a Govern ment upon the issue. —(Cheers.), the Noble Lord who had just sat down had said that now, for the first time, they (the Opposition) admitted that it was necessary to make some effort to place the revenue and the expenditure upon a satis factory basis. Why, that was the point taken by his Honour able Friend, the Member for Portsmouth, in proposing the ad dition to the assessed taxes in 1840; that was the ground taken by him last year in bringing forward his budget. Gentlemen op posite had objected to the measures they had proposed to re medy that deficiency, but they certainly had no right to say that the necessity for making some finanical effort had never been acknowledged until now. The Noble Lord had gone on to say that he (Mr. Labouchere) had admitted that the measures proposed last year would now be inadequate to make good the deficiency, and that it would be necessary, in order to do so, to resort to additional taxation. lie (Mr. Labouchere) would admit what he hail stated, but he (Mr. Lahouchere) had also said that, although he believed the budget of last year would, if now adopted, be insufficient to make up the whole of the deficiency, and that rather than suffer that deficiency to remain, it was the duty of the Government to have recourse to direct taxation, yet, that if the alterations then proposed in the sugar duties, in the timber duties, and in the Corn-laws, had been adopted, the deficiency would have been so small as to afford no excuse to the Government for resorting to such a measure as the income tax.—(Cheers.) Hon. Gentlemen opposite themselves, therefore, had created the necessity far the income tax, if any such existed—(Cheers)—and the House ought to be aware, and the country ought to be aware, and the country was becoming aware, that if there were any necessity for the imposition of the income tax, that tax was the price they were paying for the continuance of the sugar monopoly and the Corn-laws.—(Loud cheers.) He had not heard any reply to that point from Hon. Gentlemen opposite.—( Cheers.) In all their speeches they had cautiously avoided all allusion to that part of the subject.—(Loud cheers.) The Noble Lord had thought proper to say, that if they objec ted to the Government propositions they ought to state what Course they would recommend. Although he (Mr. La bouchere) acknowledged there would be much force in that argument, yet he could not but express his surprise at hearing it from Hon. Gentlemen opposite.—(Cheers.) When, during the course of last year, the then Government proposed their financial measures, which were opposed by Gentlemen oppo site, those Gentlemen at that time cautiously abstained from giv.ng any opinion as to what would be the proper measure to be adopted. He (Mr. L.) did not thean to say it was their duty to have gone into the technical details of the measures, but they would not give the smallest indication of what they thought ought to be done. lion. Gentlemen opposite then said it is enough that we negative your measures ; we will not say whether we think new taxes ought to be imposed, or whether other changes should be made in the commercial policy. The Right Hon. Gentleman hid on former occasions protested against having recourse to the system of loans, but on that oc casion he cautiously abstained from committing hfinself event to that extent.—(Cheers.) He (Mr. Labouchere) had thought that conduct unworthy of the Right Hon. Gentleman.—( Loud cheers.) He (Mr. Labouchere) thought that no Gentleman, occupying the high position of the Right Hon. Gentleman, ought, under such circumstances: to have so completely ab stained from stating what were his general views. His Noble Friend (Lord John RusseH) had not adopted such a line of conduct. - A Cheers.) With that frankness which belonged to his character—( Cheers) and which did him so much honour —(Loud cheers)—his 'Noble Friend, in proposing his re solutions, had gone into details to a degree almost bor dering on the verge of indiscretion—( Loud cheers) — He (Mr. Labouchei e) almost thought his Noble Friend had, in his ingenuous frankness, goee too far; but he (Mr. Labou chere) would not quarrel with him for having done so. The Right Hon. Gentleman, the Member for Tamworth, had ex pressed great indignation at the idea that it should be supposed that he had adopted any of his measures from those of his op ponents. The Right Hon. Gentleman said that all his mea sures were original; that they were exclusively his own, and was extremely offended at the Idea that it should be supposed that he had received any hints frcm the measures of his predecessors, He had no fear, but the country v ould do impartial justice to all. He thought the Right Hon. Baronet had attempted to run away with credit which did not belong to him. He had left others the battle and the burden of the day, and had given them no very great support—if his conduct could not be chat ac terised as a decided opposition. He then stepped forward in the eleventh hour, when he found that the tide was turning, when it found it was impossible to resist the application of that principle, he then endeavoured to give himself out as a person to whom the country was indebted. He (Mr. Labouchere) would not waste the time of the House by debating this ques tion; he was perfectly willing to leave it to the public at large, being satisfied that its judgment would do justice to all. The Right Honourable Baronet quoted the speech, and the resolutions of Lord Althorp, when he proposed his resolution to the House of Commens upon the subject of taxation when the repeal of the malt tax was proposed. He quoted the resolution of Lord Althorp, and his language on that occasion, and attempted to show that at that time Lord Althorp was favourable to a property tax. He (Mr. Labou chere) had looked to that speech, and to that resolution,_ and he was really astoni s hed at the a tt em pt o f t h e Ri ght Hon. Gen tleman in striving to prove that Lord Althorp was favourable to suck a tax. He should observe that at that time certain taxes had been repealeil, and it was thought necessary to resort to a property or income tax. Lord Althorp said, if they re pealed the malt tax they must apply a property tax. Did Lord Althorp by that say that he was favourable to a property and income tax? The Right Hon. Gentleman should have stated, when quoting the opinion of Lord Althorp,. that Lord Althorp did not at all contempl a t e a property tax. Lord. Althorp said that the country should never receive less then ten or twelve millions from. such . a tax.. What had misled the Right lion. Baronet; - was that Lord Althorp had frequently stated that abstractedly, and in theory . a property tax was the most just of all taxes, but be said its inquisitorial process was most disadvantageOus. It was this that ought to deter the House from passing this measure into a law unless it was convinced of its real necessity. It was a part of the English character to feel disgust at any investigation of their private affairs. This was a valyable part of their character. The independence of the people would revolt at the investiga tion of their affairs by the Government officers. The income tax was accompained by an inquisivorial process; it was a necessary part of the tax, and to attempt to do without it, became a scarcely less evil, as it would fall unjustly. Now, if this were the case, he would then ask whether it was worth their while, whether it was safe, whether it was politic, to proposea tax of this nature to the country; even if they themselves were of opinion that it was the best course that could be pursued, they should not adopt it, unless they could act on it under such circumstances as would speak fur them selves as being of advantage for the country, foe its honour abroad and its safety at }lime. He should only det a i n th e House with one or two more observations ; and they should be confined to the tariff. He could only soy, with regard to it, that it contained much of infinite value and importance ; and Ke regretted to say that that which appeared to him to be the most valuable was that which had excited the greatest opposition. He approved of the duties upon corn, cattle, and provisions —that was no new opinion of his. He perfectly agreed with the Right Hon. Gentleman, in the determination to which he had arrived relative to those articles, and if he had been in a posi tion to have proposed a tariff, he should have proposed a simi lar one to that of the Right Hon. Gentleman, so far as these articles were concerned; and whatever opprobrium might at tach to those articles, he was ready to bear his share in it. There was no doubt that these measures must produce the most beneficial results to the general interests ; and he believed that the removing of the duty from foreign metals, would be of great advantage to the industrial portion of the community. tie was glad to hear what the Right Honourable Gentleman had said relative to the commercial treaty with France.—(The Right Honourable Gentle man here lowered his voice so much, as to be almost inaudible. ) He WU of opinion that they were dealing with there trade questions in a manner in which we could afford to deal with them ; at the same time he thought that those questions should be looked at with a vi e w to avoid fresh taxation. He would only conclue by saving that he opposed the tax from a deep conviction that it was not necessary. That summed up the whole of his ob jections. He did not say that there might nut be circum stances in which the imposition of such a tax would be ad visable ; but he did not think that such cir c u ms t ances now existed.-- t Hear, hear.) He did not think there was any sufficient reason for imposing on the people of this country a tax so alien to their habits and distasteful to their feelings. He was afraid that by adopting the proposal of the Government they would be holding out a signal of distress to foreign nations, and that they would excite throughout the country a feeling of aversion to such a tax, which would render the people unwilling to hear it even at periods when the public exigencies imperatively demanded its imposition. Lord STANLEY wished to offer a few words in explanation. The Right lion. Gentleman had commented upon an expres sion of his, with regard to which he should be sorry to be mis. understood. In alluding to the affairs of A ffghanistan, he had stated that the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite (Mr. Macaulay) had treated much too lightly the importance of that national disaster. He thought that to look at the mater merely in a financial point of view. would be to con skier it in a very narrow and imperfect light. He thought even in a financial point of view, the Right Hon. Gentleman had very much underrated the disaster; but cer tainly if he had said anything which attributed to the Right Hon. Gentleman's personal indifference to the loss of life which had occurred, he had, no intention of imputing to him anything of the kind. If he had nut chosen his words very nicely he had not the least intention of imputing to him a feeling of indifference.—( Hear, hear ) Mr. MACAULAY said he need hardly say that he could not have felt indifference in any other than a financial point of view. What he had said Was that he could not see what in a financial point of view the recent disasters had to do with the present question.—( Hear, hear.) Lord F. EGERTON rose to address the House amidst loud cries of" Divide, divide, divide." Mr. BROTHERTON moved the adjournment of the de bate. BLEWITT seconded the motion. Lord F. EGERTON was proceeding to Aldrets the Home, when Mr. BLEWITT spoke to order. He said the Hon. Mem ber ought to know that the Noble Lord rose before he moved the adjournment. If the 'Hon.. Member had moved the ad= journment first, he would save been entitled to speak before the Noble Lord.—(}fear, hear.) He wished to say a word in his own justification—( Cries of " Order, order.") I .ord F. EGERTON said he rose chiefly f:•r the purpose of calling the attention of the House to the opinion of his consti tuents upon the question under consideration. Last, week he had presented a petition, signed by 4,000 inhabitants of the manufacturing town of Bury, that evening he had presented one, which was signed by 24,000 inhabitants of the town of Manchester, and both were in favour of the income tax. These petitioners stated that they were sensible of the necessity which existed for making a vigorous effort to supply the defi ciency ; that they believed the plan proposed by the Govern ment would relieve the distresses of the industrious classes, and relax those impositions which impeded our intercourse with foreign countries, and fettered our domestic industry. —( Hear, hear.) These were matters of opinion, but what followed was matter of demonstrative tact ; it was to the effect that any delay in this emergency beyond the limits of fair discus:ion had ceased to be pardonable, it was not a mere Parliamentary manceuvre, it was a crime of the deepest and blackest magnitude—( Great liughter from the Opposition)— for it was a prolongation of the distress which existed.-- ( Hear, hear, from the Ministerial benches.) These petitioneis ware the sensitive plants of property, which were to wither and die, and yet they told them that they believed the mea. sures proposed were calculated to relieve the country in its distress.—( Hear.) It would ill become him (I.ord F. Egerton) to stigmatise the course of moving adjournments; but the peti tioners stated that in their opinion such delay was highly pre judicial to the interests of commerce in general, as well as to the petitioners, to whom the revival of trade was a matter of most urgent necessity. It was after the close of the Easter recess, that this petition had been presented, after the Noble Lord had come down to the House with that declaration of his, which infused new life and spirit into the ranks of his party. He (Lord F. Egerton) remembered when, after the defeat which he had suffered, the Noble Lord— " Lay floating many a rood." --(Great aughter from both sides of the House.) During the Easter recess everything that could be, was devised and lie had looked forward with some apprehension to see what course would be pursued.—(Laughter.) It was subsequent to all this that petition was drawn up, in which the petitioners spoke of the high satisfaction with which they had seen that a plan, in cluding the income tax, and his Right Hun. Friend's tariff, had been submitted to the House by her Majesty's Go vernment.—( Cheers from the Ministerial benches.) The sig natures to that petition were nut exclusively of a Tory charac ter. It was stated that the petition was not more than six days in progress of signature. It was only exposed for signa ture at the Exchange, and two or dm. e other places ; yet so popular was the subject of the petition, that the names of a great number of the Whig party were attached to it. He did not attach more importance to this petition than it deserved. and he should think as much of it if it had contained 24 or 4,000, signatures. Under all the circumstadces it was a demonstration which ought to relieve the anxiety which the Right Hon. Baronet was supposed to labour under. There were one or two topics of the various speeches of that evening upon which he wished to make one or two observa tions. Great alarm appeared to have seized the Right Hon. and Learned Gentleman who preceded the Right Hon. Baronet, for he thought that the proposal of Her Majesty's Government would have the effect of lowering this country in the estimation of foreign powers. If he (Lord F. Egerton) concurred in the prayer of that petition, it was because he thought it was conceived in a spirit which would raise this country in the scale of nations and in the est;mation of foreign powers.—( Loud cheers.) He had been very much struck with a passage of a work written by a foreigner in very eloquent language, which he would read to the House. "If we are destined, as we might be, to meet her (England) in arms, in every continent and in every sea we should meet her as an antagonist worthy of our arms."— (Cheers.) This he (Lord F. Egerton) believed was the spirit and the feeling that would be engendered, if they made the proposed effort to relieve the . country from her present difficul ties. He thanked the House for the patience with which he was heard, and he would most cordially support the measure of the Right Hon. Baronet.—(Cheers. ) Mr. BROTHERTON then moved the adjournment of the House. On the question being put, Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that the Noble Lord had used a few observations to which he wished to refer. The Noble Lord bad alluded to the conduct of the late Government, and said that those who gave delay to the measures of the Government would be guilty of a crime. He thought that Hon. Gentlemen must be guided by the nature of the question brought forward, before they could come to a conclusion with respect to them.-- ( hear, hear.) But with regard to those bold measures of the Government, let it be recollected that, in the month of May, these questions might have been fully considered, and they had been put off on account of the slave trade and the misery that would be inflicted on the natives of Africa; and in the month of September, when the new Administration came into office, they did not bring those measures forward—( Cheers)—but they put them off till February--(Cheers)—and it was not till the month of March that those measures which the Noble Lord's constituents at Manchester were so anxious about were brought forward.—(Cheers.) Therefore, if there were any responsi bility, he begged leave to say; that the bulk of the crime was not to be imputed to his side of the House. He (Lord J. Russell) had not voted for any delay ; he only wished that time might be allowedfor,the due consideration of a question, which. if carried, would not give that relief to the country which the country had a right to expect; and which it was necessary, on that account ,the 3should spend some time in considering. There was another point on which he would say a few words. It bad been stated, that it would be necessary to institute some inquiry as to the original policy , of the expedit.on to Affghanistan. He (LordJ. R.) was fitly I responsible as a Member of the late Government for that expedi tion, and he did not wish in any degree to avoid an inquiry; but let it be recollected that at the time the late Government laid I on the table of the House, whe n th e ex p e diti on h a d t a k en p l ace , papers which they thought sufficient, to justify them, the Members of the Opposition were then very vigilant in watching I the policy of the Government, and they brought forward mo- I tions with respect to Canada and China, but they did not make I any • s milar indication with respect to the expedition to Affghanistan.—( Hear, hear.) liut, if it should be made matter of future discussion, he only asked that not only those papers immediately referring to the matter, but that the full and entire case, as contained in the documents in the Foreign-office, would be laid before the House, I and that Parliament would be afforded an opportunity of considering them.—( Hear.) He need not say further with respect to his Noble Friend, Lord Auckland, than that it was j imnossible for any man t o g i ve greater attent i on to t h e affairs of his Government ; and after all the deliberation whieli the Government, of which he (Lord J. Russell) was a Member, hadgiven to all the occurrences, they could come only to this conclusion, that the expedition was necessary to the preservation of our empire in India, and he (Lord John Russell) would always be ready to identify himself with the policy of Lord Auckland. Sir J. HOBHOUSE was not prepared to take Part in a debate upon the policy of the late Government in East Indian affairs. He could only say with his Noble Friend that lie would not shrink, and that the Governmeut of which he had been a member would not shrink, from the responsibility of Lord Auckland's policy. But he thought that it would be more convenient for the House of Commons to take another occasion of discussing this question, when it would be possible to give it a full and fair discussion.—( Hear.) He thought that the late Government would be able to show that Lo r d Auck- land was fully borne out in the conduct which he had pursued, and that he would have betrayed his duty, not only to the In dian Government, but to the Government of this country, if he had taken any other course.—( Cheers. ) Mr. MARK PHILIPS had never sought to protract a debate from factious motives. Ho had been re turned to that House by a majority considerably greater than any Conservative candidate for the Borough of Manchester could procure. His constituents would not object to their fair share of the public burdens. If re course must be had to an income tax, it behoved the House to protect the people against, any further tax on articles of consumption. He had looked forward with great anxiety to the settlement of the questions pending between this country • and the Brazils, and he saw nothing in the propositions ema nating from her Majesty's Government by which those diffe rences could be placed on a more satisfactory basis ; he should, as far' as the income tax was concerned, give his conscientious opposition to the plan of the Right Hon, Baronet. Mr. LABOUCHERE was understood to put a question in reference to a charge made by the Noble Lord, the Member for South Lancashire, that that gentlemen on this side of the House had obstructed the progress of the tariff ? Sir. R. PEEL said he wished to al oid, as much as possible, giving any promise to which he could not adhere. lie held the tariff in his hand, and it had gone to the printer. When it came on for discussion he felt confident that Hon. Gentle men opposite would not throw any obstruction in its way other than what might arise from a fair discussion of it. The House would discuss the propositions with a deep sense that in the meantime the country was kept in a state :of depression and uncertainty on account of the discussion. There was no wish for precipitation, but while it received a full consideration, he trusted that the other side of the House would not throw in its ' way any unnecessary obstruction. Lord F. EGERTON said, lie had been quite misunderstood. He had not meant to charge Hon. Gentlemen with any suck proceeding. He had stated that to protract the discussion be yond the limits absolutely necessary, would be a crime of the greatest magnitude, but he had not the smallest intention of charging Hon. Gentlemen with participating in it. Sir R. PEEL said there might be three or fonr articles, but they were not impo. taut ones, on which it might be de sirable to take the opinion of the trades, and this might justsfy sonic alteration. Mr. C. POWELL having given a careful attention to the income tax of the Right lion. Baronet ; and seeing its inquisi torial nature, while ke had failed in shessing a necessity for it, he must give his vote against it. Mr. IILEWITT rose amidst loud cries of " Question." He would only trouble the House with one word of explanation. He had thought that he was perfectly in order in acting as he had done. As soon as the Speaker had called him to order, he had submitted, and if he had been guilty of any breach of order, he begged to apologise to the House for his conduct.—(Cheers.) The question for the adjournment of the debate was then put and carried. FISHERIES (IRELAND) BILL. The Fisheries (Ireland) Bill was read a second time. INDEMNITY BILL. The Indemnity Bill was read a third time and passed. 1 URNYIKE ROADS' BILL. Mr. MANNERS SUTTON brought in the Turnpike Roads' Bill, which was read a first time. The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of and the House Adjourned at Half-past One o'Clock. We are sorry to say that we have not te=, vet seen any such symptoms of a revival of t ra d e as would lead us to hope that employment is becoming more plentiful, or that the destitute poor who are out of work can as yet safely be thrown altogether upon their own resources.—Manchest er Paper. ItrorcrioN or VS Aons.—We hear on all hands of reductions in the wages of manufacturing workmen. Yesterday, we believe :the hand-l oom weavers i n the employ of Messrs. Fielden Brothers, of Todmorden, had an abatement made of about 20 per cent. on their previous earnings.—Manchester Paper. On Saturdav morning a fatal accident occurred at Kingston-upon-thames. A boat, loaded with gravel, in which were John and James Blake, father and son, and another ' man named Jone s , was go i ng up he river, and near Thames Ditton the boat, whi c h was heavily laden, su dd e nly sunk, and the three men were i mmerse d in the water. John Blake and Jones succeeded, after a severe struggle, in getting to shore, but the son, James Blake, was not so fortunate, as he was drawn into the eddy caused by the sinking beat, and did not rise again. Lord ee Roos, who has a residence at Thames Ditton, was standing upon his lawn at the time of the acci dent, and when he saw what happened, be immediately jumped into the water, and dived several times in the hope of rescuing the unfortunate youth, who had sunk with the boat, but his gallant and humane endeavours were unsuccessful ; he did n o t, however relinquish his attempt until all hope of saving the life of the youth was abandoned. The body was picked up abou two hours afterwards. The Scotsman of Saturday has the following short extract of a letter from India, which we subjoins without com ment Bellary, 22. d Feb., 1842.—Wild has forced his way to Ali-Musjeed with the four native regiments ; I s i ncere l y ' trust he may save Sale, and not be himself cutup," AGRICULTURAL MEETING AT CALLINGTON. (Abridged from the Devonport Independent.) On Wednesday last, pursuant to requisition, a public meet ing was held in the Town•hall, at Callington, in the county of Cornwall, for the purpose of opposing the new tariff relative te the introduction of foreign cattle, &e. The requisitionists, with the exception of two, are Tories, and consequently a meeting got up for the purpose of opposing a Government. formed of the " farmers' friends," excited no small degree of interest. B. SNELL, Esq., of Landulph, one of the requisitionists, was called to the chair. On his right were Sir W. L. S. Tre lawny, Bart., and J. S. Trelawny, Esq. ; on his left W. Net tle, Esq. The hall was crowded almost to suffocation. The CHatastale read the requisition, and said he had, at the desire of the requisitionists, enclosed copies of the requisition to Lord Eliot and Mr. Rashleigh. Lord Eliot returned a prompt and ready reply, in which he expressed his sorrow that any mea sruesrtes o o f i t t f h ,e e G co o u v n e t T , m b e u n t t h s e ho s t l i i l d d e n e o d t a b n e g l e i e r ve th i c ha a t gr t i h cu e l a tu lt r e a i l a i t n io tee ns proposed Goin m e w n o t ul d an y h have t e t in h a e t effect; oso of facts but t le h i a t w t o h u e l d lay be meeting fo s r the he should ld think tit to send him. Mr. Rashleigh had not replied. J. BOGER, Esq., moved the first resolution, to the effect that the object of the proposed new tariff was to give a stimulus to trade and manufactures, and.to afford employment to those branches of trade which wereat present in suffering or distress; that the agriculturists were prepared to take, in common with other classes, the proper share of any sacrifices which might be, t necessary re t n o o a t r d r e i r o a u t s o o f i m raisingp orta n a t n a T r o e b s s u t a l t e l ; e s b but t that a w tta b i i n ls . t ment of that object, they thought the proposed tariff made alterations in the admission of agricultural produce to a much greater extent than necessary, and to an extent that was likely to prove injurious to the British farmer. The resolution was seconded by Mr. Hawke. J. S. TRNLAWNY, Esq. rose. It was impossible for him to allow that resolution to pass without a few preliminary ob servations. He (Mr. Trelawny) was placed in a peculiar position, for while he could not entirely support the resolution, on the other hand he must partly oppose it. At the last election he told them that a change would be pro posed in the Corn-laws, and many would recollect that on the hustings at Bodmin he asked Lord Eliot whether he would bind himself to support the principle of protection. What was the answer of Lord Eliot ? He said, " I will support no change that shall not be acceptable to the aericulturists themselves," or words to that effect.—(Cheers.) ' He asked them whether or net they were contented with the measures recently pro posed ; he asked whether Lord Eliot would have fulfilled that pledge if he supported the measures of Sir R. Peel ? The CHAIRMAN thought it was hardly fair to presume that he would support those measures. Mr. TRELAWNY now thought they were bound to apply to Lord Eliot either to resign or to oppose Sir ,R. Peel. W. NATTLE. Esq., questioned very much whether the reso lution proposed by Mr. Boger was in accordance with the feel ing of the meeting.—(Cheers.) Before they passed the reso lution he would beg to ask them whether they had met there to oppose the present tariff or not. Every man of common sense knew that this tariff was unfair in its application, and yet at a meeting which had been called to oppose it, a resolution had mt acknowledgement submitted l% sa propert oet en their h i e s e ; w i r ahpni part tuhiiat containedthtohu wishing objectai s hi perfectly hghfmtueortithosn eat distinctly oiGeuasuitliorsa Govern ment oeccdre::inya.n.t (r p G.: a pio r vr, t i y edsren p tnhm o te l a i e,m t ni i v e .t,_e s, 6l(,, h ca z hi r w e.ed o rll u esc l a d ae,nii . , a d.Te s d k uigpi t r itloih:anermd.uproar.) meeting whether not only the o b u rd d e t E w l w o i o u h t l e , state that the present Government had got into power on delusive principles, and that they had deceived the public.—( Cheers.) Some ot.e had said that lie had no stake in this matter, but he might state that he believed he should have in spring tillage this year a greater number of acres of corn than any man that was likely to address them : he thought therefore he might hes allowed to have some feeling on the object of the meeting. Mr. Nettle concluded by moving an amendment to the ors ginal resolution. As the amendment had to be put first it was subsequently altered and proposed in these words : " Resolved, that to acquiesce in the measures recently pro. posed by Sir Robert Peel, would be to acquiesce in the policy of Sir Robert Peel, of which this meeting entirely disap proves."—(Enthusiastic cheering. ) W. S. MoecAN Esq., of Launceston, se con d e d the amend ment. He thoug ht that the measures proposed by Sir It. Peel were such as the people of England would not assent to, and if the Hon. Baronet had announced those measures before he dissolved the late Parliament, Ise would not now have had a hundred followers in the Ittruse.—( Hear, hear.) As for pe titioning the House of Lords upon the subject, he would as soon petit u., a brick wall.—(Creat cheering, and cries of " Chair.") The only way was to memorialise her Majesty, who had shown her patriotism on this occasion, for she had said to her Prime Minister, " if you tax my people. y ou s h a ll t ax me too."--(Loud cheers.) What had been the principles of the Tories ? From the beginning to the end they had never taken off a tax as long as they could keep it on. Pressure from without had always done that. Press them now, gentle men.-(Cheers.) Press them now by calling for different measures. Press them now in their Tory districts.—(Cheers and laughter.) It was now a time for them all to come for ward, for he had taxed the landowner, the renter, and the in dustrious class of manufacturers. He had taxed them all. and the worst tax of all was the income tax, for it would paralyze the whole country.—( Cheers. ) On the amendment being put, the Chairman declared it carried by a large majority. The original resolution was sub sequently discussed at some length, but on being put to the vote was rejected. THE WAR IN AFFGHANISTAN. The position of the British forces west of the Indus is neither desperate nor disheartening. We are in the possession of Kelat and Candahar; and the communication of these posi. tions with Bombay is open. Jellalabad still holds out; and the Sikhs, through whose country the communication from the Presidency of Bengal must be kept up, are friendly. There is every reason to believe that they will continue so. There is an inveterate hatred between them and the Affghans, origi nating in, and fostered by, the prejudices both of race and religion. The Sikhs can have no sincere or lasting friendship with the Affghans ; and to quarrel with the British on their account would be to place themserves between two fires. The wealth and efficiency of the British Government in India, and the intellectual character of those who direct it, tender it able not only to make great and energetic efforts, but to main , - tain a protracted struggle without flagging. The Affghan po. pulation is not dense ; it is broken up into a multiplicity of rude clans, devoid of a common aim, jealous of each other ; there is no man among them of sufficient command or influence to organise them for a continuous defence. It is only in the yip drifts, of Cabool that the tribes have been roused to an enthis. siastic and successful attack upon the British ; and even in that district it is clear that the effervescence had already begun to cool. Akbar Khan had been unable to rally the clans for an at tack on Jellalabad ; and they were already beginning to decide, upon the claims of various chiefs to the sovereign authority. It is an easy matter for a Government possessing such resources as the British in India to concentrate its forces upon the region around CabooL It is there alone that any thing has been done which the British Government is bound by self respect and .in self-defence to punish. And the inhabitants of that region are not in a condition to oppose such an, overwhelming attack as the British Government, acting judi... ciously and with promptitude, can make upon them. The first duty of the British Govcrnn:ent, then, leas plain as it is easy-- to lose no time in marching such a force upon the Cabool district as shall be able to reduce its inhabitants to surrender at discre tion. The true economy in such a case is to commence opera tions at once on a sufficient Scale to bring the affair to an in)p mediate settlement. Whatever may have been the morality or prudence of our first interference, there is no other course for us now. Rude though the Affghans be, they know that falsehood and treachery are indefensible. Nor is their love of national independence a suffic . ent excuse for the atrocities they have been guilty of. The Affghans have on many oces sitins— when they usurped the throne of Persia, and founded dynasties in indostan—w hen their chiefs intrigued alternately with the British, the Persians, and the Russians, to promote their oWn selfish views—shown how lightly, when they had. any object to serve, they could regard national independence.. They have done what they cannot defend ; and the British Go vernment is bound alike by the principles of justice and self preservation to make them feel that the moral principles taught by their own mollahs, and reverenced even amid the clash of arms, are not to he violated with impunity. The next duty of the British Government is equally clear—as soon as the Affghan clans have been made to feel its strength, so that there can be no mistake either on their part or on the part of any Oriental nation as to the motive of the retreat, te resume the frontier of the Sutledge, and withdraw every Briti::11 soldier from the West of the Indus. It is useless to theorise on the occupation of India by this country : we governs it as a dependency : in the stage of social improvement which it has reached, it would lose infinitely were the British au thority withdrawn and as to preparing . it for self-govern ment, that must task the native energies in some incalculable futurity.— Spectator. TORY OPPRESSION IN BATH. TO THE EDITOR OF THE SUN. Sul,-1 take the opportunity, through the medium of your wide/yr circulated paper, of exposing as heartless a proses e di ng on the part of some of the Bath Conservatives, as 9s er was. conceived and perpetrated by man. It is of course wed k nown how signal was the defeat sustained by this party at the last election, but it is probably not in the knowled ge , o f any s ave the inhabitants of this place, that on that occasion numerous bands of navigators, from the neighbouring railway, were contendi ng hired for the express purpose of with the .Liberals, and of making themselves generally useful to tho Blues, or Conservatives, by whom they were fed and paid. On the day of the nomination some fearful outrages vere committed by these men, who in large bodies endeavoured to disturb the pro ceedings of the day : in this they were defeated, and the re sult of the nomination was most decisively in favour of the Liberal Candidates. In the evening of that day (23th June last) one of the Liberal voters, in passing down Avon-street, was savagely attacked, and almost murdered, by a party of these men, who immediately afterwards retreated into a low public-, house close by, called the Pig and Whistle : the alarm laavin been given, a party of the Liberals immediately came to the, rescue of the injured man, and finding out to what house his , assailers had retreated, they went to it, and demanded of then landlord to turn them out: this he refused to do, at the same time denying that any of the Blues were there ; upon this the Liberals burst open the door, but not being enabled to get at their opponents, who contrived to make their escape, left the house, and as may have been expected, not without expressing their anger by breaking roost of the windows in the building; here the disturbance ended. A few days after this, fifteen of the Liberals. supposed se* have been present on the above occasion, were apprehend:lds, and taken before the Bails :Magistrates on a charge of havMg begun to demolish the Pig and Whistle. The case of the com plainant was fully investigated, and after a most patient and. careful examination for several days, the Magistrates came to, the conclusion that there were no grounds for supporting the, ede t d a t k o i t n i g m bail cou n for their capital charge of felony for beginning to demolish, but com mitted the parties to take their trial for " a riot," a t t h e t h em T h e due prosecutor, ai e n are not appearance. The next borough quarter sslistsiliefinesd,:ittitiltiheissame oc time e, pr Assizes in August last, and there presented a bill to the Grand Jury (which they found) for the offence again of "beginning to demolish," an offence NV hill is a felony, and was at that ti me punishable with death. Upon the bill being found, these poor fellows (most of them in the humblest circumstances) were again taken into custody ; some of them, after an expensive application to a Judge in London, were admitted to bail; others, from their poverty, were unable to procure this advan tage, and were in consequence confined in gaol from last Au gust to the assizes which are just over. Upon the indictment coming on for trial, a legal objection was taken on behalf of the prisoners to its sufficiency—the objection ultimately prevailed. Up goes another bill for the felony ("beginning to demolish") which the Grand Jury, upon the evidence alone of the prose cution, foutAl. The men, twelve in number, were then put upon their trial, and the case broke down in its infancy. It appeared clear upon the evidence that the prisoners never d had who, without c alling t teda us in o n . the a ui sense in which th e any int en ti on w h atever o f d emo li s hi n g the house, and so the Judge stated to the Jury, pri soners for their defence, immedia.hteolicy Nothing could more plainly dings,thanhisrefusingt o a ll ow Learned Judge viewed these or po!•-dti°ob y the Conservative A ssoc i a ti on. e n of his expenses; which, ce the prosecutor a large b, at t he bottom ofthe whole pro 'ours, how ever, will doulstless be Pal who are, beyond a dovuurt,, ceedings. I am, Sir , 3 A HATER OF OPPRESSION. Bath, 6th March, 1842. • he an d Ju re ),,f• • 1.0 14 the s . of lieY hei ;0' fa ~~e ~.