The Sun. — London, England, 1842-03-05 00:00:00

~ CORN LAWS. The HoN. MEMBER also presented a petition praying for the total repeal of the Corn-laws. • Sir V. BLAKE presented a petition praying for a total repeal of the Corn-laws. Sir R. B. PHILLIPPS presented a petition from St. Davids, with a similar prayer. Sir DAVID ROCHE presented a petition from the millers of Limerick, complaining that the law Which prevented the importation of foreign flour was to be altered and would interfere with them ; alio a petition from victuallers of Limerick, stating that by the. Act of Union, they were placed upon the same footing with the victuallers in this country, and complaining of- the late legislation of the House on the subject. Mr. AINSWORTH presented a petition from the in habitants of Bolton, asking to be heard before the Com mittee on the Borough Improvement Bill. Mr. HUTT presented a petition from Forfar praying that the bonding of flour may be substituted for that of corn. REPEAL OF THE UNION. Mr. O'CONNELL presented a petition from War rington, in Lancashire, for a repeal of the Union. Sir J. EASTHOPE presented petitions from Forfar, Lincoln's Inn-fields, Newcastle-upon-Tyne, Salford, and several other places, against the Corn-laws. Mr. MACAULAY presented two petitions, one of Avhich 'was from Edinburgh, against the Corn-laws. Air. M. PHILIPS presented several petitions from Manchester to the same effect. COPYRIGHT BILL. . • - i On the motion of Lord MAHON the Copyright Bill was read a first time, and ordered.to be printed. POOR LAWS. Mr. DUNCOMBE presented a petition from the F;a%ingwoll Union, in the North Riding of the county of York, praying the House to alter the Poor-law, so as to give greater discretionary power' to the guardians in the wit ter of grantinz out-door relief. DUBLIN ELECTION. The SPEAKER annonneed to the House that he had been informed by the examiners of recognizances that the two sureties of 500/. each, for the prosecution of the Dublin Election, were unobjectionable.- SEVERN 'NAVIGATION. Lord G, SOMERSET presented a petition from the merchants and shipowners of Newport in the county of Monmouth, in favour of the Severn Navigation Bill. CORN-LAWS, Mr. THORNELY presented one petition from Kircud bright, and five from the working men of the Metropolis, praying for the total and immediate repeal of the Corn laws. Mr. ELPHINSTONE presented a petition from Man chester with the same prayer. Mr. COBDEN presented similar petitions from the Working men of Stockport, from the Magistrates of Dunfermline, from places in the county of Northumber land, and from Manchester. IMPORTATION OF CORN FROM AMERICA. Sir R. PEEL said, that he wished to inform the Gal lant Officer opposite (Sir C. Napier), whom he then saw in his place, that he had made inquiries relative to the length of time occupied by vessels in voyages from the United States of America to Liverpool. He found that there was no means of obtaining direct official information on the subject through the Custom House. He bad, however, received a statement on the matter from the American Consul at Liverpool, which he would then lay upon the table of the House. It was an ac count of the average number of days occupied in voyages from the several ports of the United States to the port of Liverpool by all vesse's laden with flour or corn during the year 1841. Sir C. NAPIER said that he had no wish that the Right Hon. Gentleman should have gone to the Ameri can Consul for the information in question ; and he was sorry to find that the accounts were kept in so slovenly a manner at the Packet-office. If, however, the Right Honourable Baronet were satisfied with the information given by the American Consul he (Sir C. Napier) should also be satisfied. Sir R. PEEL said that the Gallant Officer could take whatcourse he pleased upon the matter. Sir C. NAPIER then moved for a return of the num ber of vessels laden with corn which had arrived from America, from the Ist of January, 1841, to the Ist of January, 1842, at the port of Liverpool ; and also a return of the number of days occupied in each voyage. Sir ft. - PEEL then laid upon the table the account from the American Consul, to which he had already referred. Sir C. NAPIER said that the paper gave a return both of vessels laden with corn and flour, while he only wanted the number of vessels laden with corn. Sir R. PEEL said that the statement, which he made on a former occasion, related to a vessel laden with 1,000 barrels of flour. NOTICES OF MOTIONS. Mr. FERRAND gave notice that on Tuesday next, when the Honourable Member for Salford should move for the returns of the names of individuals or firms keeping cotton, flax, or silk mills, who paid the wages to their labourers in goods instead of money, or who supplied their provisions upon the truck- system, he should move that the following words be added— " returns of the names of manufactures of printed works, or proprietors of coal works or iron works ;" and also after the word "'truck system," he would move the fol lowing words—" A return of the names of all such own ers of cotton, flax, silk, or printed works, mills, or iron or coal works, who compelled their workmen to reside in cottages, the property of their employers." Mr. WODEIMUSE gave notice of a motion for a return of the names and salaries of the Commissioners who had been at various times appointed to inquire into the hand-loom system. Sir G. STAUNTON gave notice that, on Monday next, he should move fur all communications received from Captain Elliot relative to the affairs of Canton, and our relations with China. Mr. O'CONNELL gave notice, that on Monday next, on the Order of the Day for a Committee of Supply being read, he should move for a return of the names of all persons who had registered arms in the county of Down, in Ireland. He would also take the opportunity of putting a question to the Noble Lord opposite (Lord Elliot) respecting the trial of parties who were tried for the murder of a person of the name of M`Ardle. Sir V. BLAKE gave notice that before the passing of the new Cora-law Act he would move that, in conse quence of the unusual depression of the trace of the country, a clause should be inserted suspending the pay. 'Dent of all duties upon corn until January 1, 1843. Mr. ELPHINSTONE gave notice that on Tuesday next he should move for certain returns relating to the legacy duty, in continuation of the papers laid before Parliament last year. CORN LAWS. Colonel SIBTHORP gave notice, that in the Com mittee on the Bill for the Importation of Foreign Corn, he should move that all duties payable on the importa tion of corn or wheat flour, after the passing of the Act, should be levied and paid at the period of the importa tion of such corn, instead of at the time of its being taken out of bond. LETTERS OF MARQUE. Mr. STAUNTON moved for certain returns relating to the issuing of letters of marque against China (as we understood) which were ordered. SHANNON COMMISSION. Mr. F. FRENCH, in moving for certain returns re lating to the sums levied, on the different counties for the improvement of the River Shannon, gave notice that on an early day he should move that the Commision for the improvement of the river Shannon be abolished. The Honourable Member also moved for certain returns, relating to vaccination in Ireland, which were ordered. ALGERIA. Mr. SIIIEL postponed to Thi'rsday, the motion of which he had given notice, relative to the production of the communications between the Earl of Aberdeen and the French Ambassador, on the subject of the French occupation of Algiers. PORTENDIC. Mr. SMYTHE wished to ask the Right Hon. Baronet at the head _of the Government, if he was prepared to state to the House the progress which had been made in the negotiations with the French Government, for the purpose of obtaining for certain British subjects com pensation for the losses they had suffered in consequence of the conduct of the French authorities at Portendic. Sir ROBERT PEEL begged to state, that some time since, as long ago he believed as April, 1840, a Commission had been appointed consistinc , of Commissioners appinted by the Govern ment of both countries, for the purpose of inquiring into the merits of the respective claimants. The sit tings of that Commission had been interrupted from va 7 rious circumstances, but very recently the English Com missioner had returned to Paris, and the Commission bad resumed its sittings, which he. had every reason to believe would soon be brought to a satisfactory termi nation. Should anything, however, occur to frustrate the hopes which he entertained on the subject, he would take an early opportunity of giving the House informa- Eon on the subject. CORN-LAWS. Mr. 'M. GIBSON begged to ask the !Right Hon. Baroeet opposite whether he was aware of any commu nications on the part of certain dignitaries and clergy men of the Established Church, having taken place with any member of her Majesty's Government relative to the new system of taking the corn averages, and the effect it may have upon the title rent charged, and also, whether they would adhere to the proposed system of taking them. Sir R. PEEL said that of course he r,-ceived nume rous letters every day upon the su bj ect o f the Corn laws, but he was not aware that he received any such formal communications as the Hon. Gentleman had al luded to. Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that: he wished to ask a question of the Right Hon. Gentleman, the Vice-Pre sident of the Board of Trade H w e . i h th at fe h s e p a ect to the new towns for taking the averages. , ar r lc d e t t hat in particular left ni out counties. towns, which had corn m of the new list and others put in. lie dil v i e l l :) e t Bay that any partiality in selecting certain towns tt e, a a a n ii t t ° tended, but lip wished to know if any a statement could b e made respecting the change of particular towns, and Whf O thers had been selected. Sir ROBERT PEEL said that he would answer the Woble Lord after he had brought in the Corn Importation Bill. The Right lion. Gentleman then brou g ht i n th e Bill, which was re ad a first time. Sir 11:f PEEL said that he would take that opportu nity to answer the question of the Noble Lord. The Bill was drawn up in conformity with with h the it resolutions t R was drawn up in general conformity v expla nation he gave on the part of her Majesty's Govern iment, on moving for leave to bring in the Bill. There were one or two pints : on which he wished to make a statement to the House. The first was with respect to the inspectors. He received communications from them, and from persons interested on their behalf, with respect to the hardship of removing them, and that their removal would give grounds for claim s to compensation which he wishd to avoid. He prop osed that the averages. in the new towns should" be taken by the Excise officers, and placed under the Board of Ex cise ; but with respect to the towns that were not entered, he proposed that the present inspectors should be continued, as they were - perfectly efficient ; and that they should be placed under the Board of Trade. He (Sir R. Peel) proposed to give the Treasury, acting in concurrence with the Board of . Trade, the power of granting superannuated Salaries . to those inspectors who may be removed from office, and who, for a . length of service, and propriety of conduct . _ in the discharge of their duties might be entitled to retiring allowances. The whole - duty would be performed - by-the Excise, with out any, or scafcely any additional expense to the public. With regard to the period when it was proposed that the Bill should come into operation, as it was intended to give an immediate remission of duty, it appeared to him (Sir R. Peel) that it would be desirable that as soon as the Bill obtained the assent of the Legislature, that it should come into operation as soon as possible, he would like to permit the duties substituted by the Bill, for the existing duties to be in operation as soon iis possible ; th e Bill , t h ere f ore, on i ts pass i ng , would come into operation immediately.--(Hear.) With re spect to the other question put by the Noble Loid his (Sir R. Peens) object was, as he had already stated, that the pla ces f rom w hi c h the returns should be taken should be as extensive as possible, with a view in the first instance to obtain more accurate informaticin of the quantity of corn sold, and the prices of those different towns. But in taking those averages in these towns, he had no wish whatevqr to add these towns for the purpose of diminishing the price of corn, and raising the duty. The Noble Lors.d asked upon what principle those towns were selected'? He (Sir R. Peel) found it was exceedingly difficult tlo ascertain what was the relative importations of those towo, or what was the quantity of corn sold in them, but tlle revision of the list of towns was conducted upon thi, prinelple, which appeared to him to be a fair ono. At present there were about 150 or 151 towns in which tla. averages were taken by means of inspectors ; of coal+ there was a certain number of towns on that liSt which bore a relative proportion to the agri cultural, manufacturing, and commercial towns. ' In the selection of the towns connected with the runil and agricultural districts, lie had attempted to maintain the same ratio in tho new. towns, with respe4t to the proportion of agricultural to manufac turire', towns, as was observed in the existing list. That was the general principle on which he hail attempted to proceed. The Noble Lord would have an opportunity of seeing the list, and if it could be shown that there were towns, with respect to which Gentlemen were in the possession of information which he had not bad the means of procuring ; and if it should be found that some errors existed, he could only state that he had takea all the means in his power to collect a list of those towns which were most important for this pur pose. If any errors should be found, those errors would be a fit subject for discussion. He must, of course, nece4- aarily submit himself to the pleasure of the House, ut after the sense of the House had been marked on the que4- tion, he should proceed with the measure as ra pidly as was consistent with a due deliberation of the details and principle of the Bill. He proposed, therefore, to fix Monday next for proceeding with it, and if on Monday other business should prevent its due consideration, he should not bring it on at any hour which would be unsuitable to the discussion. If the sense of the House should be decidedly in favour of the improvement of the existing laws, he should do all in his power to bring the Bill into as early operation as possible, without at the same time pressing it unduly against the sense of those who might wish to take part in the discussion. With the understandieg then that on Monday next, if the business of supply should occupy the House to an inconvenient hour, he should take the earliest opportunity afterwards for the second reading. Mr. COBDEN claimed the indulgence of the House in a matter personal to himself. It would be in the re . - collection of the House that, a week ago, an Hon. Member had stated some facts personally relating to him ; it was stated that while he was complaining of the operation of the Corn •laws, he was working his mills night and day, by which cruel means he had amassed a large fortune. The facts not being then within his knowledge, he did not think proper to answer this statement ; but he had since written into the country for information to enable him to meet the charge, and he might first mention that 'the concern in which he was interested, employed 600 people, and during the last 18 months it had been employing by night ten men, from the 31st of July to the 4th of September. During that interval they had employed ten men by night, in casual work of finishing and dressing. Now, the charge of cruelty to himself must necessarily mean that the same hands were employed. He would, therefore, be allowed by the House to explain that they had furnished work by night to hands who were out of work and who would have had nothing else to do, if they had not employed them. He read an extract of a let ter that he had received on the subject, stating that they " only wished they could employ 500 extra hands, for if they wanted 5,000 they could get as many very glad to get • work, for the men had never been so badly off." Now he might mention, with re gard to the cotton printing business, as the House did not seem to have a very clear knowledge of the distinction be tween a cotton mill and a print work, that cotton printing was something like paper printing,—it had its seasons, and to prevent a cotton printer from occasionally employ ing half a score men at night, in particular seasons, would be like interdicting the printingof magazines, which were required once a month, as of newspapers, or any other kind of publications.—(Hear, hear.) He mentioned this in order that Hon. Gentlemen might know that there was a distinction between a cotton printing work and a spinning mill. He hoped that the two had not been confounded, from a desire of fixing upon him that peculiar odium which seemed to be attached to the cotton mill. Between a Cotton mill and a printing mill, there was, in fact, no more analogy, than between a cotton mill and that House. He (Mr. Cobden) had not an atom of mill-work belonging to his establish ment. The Hon. Gentleman opposite had made a sweeping charge against the Anti-Corn-law League, stating that the manufacturers who belonged to that body paid their wages upon the truck system. Now that, as a violation of the law, or at best, an evasion of the law, was a very seriouscharge ; and as he was proud to avow himself a very conspicious member of the Anti-Corn-law League, he hoped he might be allowed to state, as far as he was acquainted with the case, how far that charge was deserved.—(Hear, hear.) b' Of course you are aware„" said the letter which he had received that morning, "that our wages are paid every Saturday morning, and our rule is that every person in the works shall be paid by eight o'clock in the morning, so that they can lay out their money to the best ad vantage when and where they pleased."—(Cheers.) Now nothing could possibly be more futile than for a person like himself to stand up there and - to disclaim the truck system, if be practised it ; for he assured them that the shopkeepers in the neighbourhood of any large establishment were exceedingly jealous, and very acute in perceiving who were the parties that paid money and who were not. He therefore begged to say, in answer to the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite, that he had paid 20,0001. a year foi wages for the last ten years, and that lie had never either directly or indirectly been concerned in keeping any shop about the establish ment ; every farthing had been paid in money.— (Loud cheers.) That fact was notorious to every one in the neighbourhood of the , establishment to which he belonged.—(Hear.) And now he must be al lowed to state, in answer to the Hon. Gentleman oppo site, that when he made that charge so broadly, without excepting himself, he was aware at the time, for an II onourale Gentleman opposed to him in politics, who lived near to his establishment, h a d t o ld him, that as far as he (Mr. Cobden) was concerned, that charge was not true ; and he called upon the Hon. Member for Wigan, though an opponent in politics, to state whether every word which he now uttered was not the truth—(Hear, hear, hear)—and now, as he had said a week ago, he repeated that he consi dered this to be a very undignified occupation, for them ; and he might be allowed to state, that in fu ture he hoped he should not be expected to come forth and occupy the time of the House in refuting charges of that kind from the same quarter.—(Hear,) If any Hon. Gentleman should condescend to take the slightest interest in his personal character, he would refer him to his neighbours and to his work people ; he would refer him directly to them, and if any Honourable Gentleman in , that House, or out of it, should take upon himself to speak as to his character, he only wished him to carry out towards him the golden. rule, of " doing unto others as they would have others do unto them," by first making inquiries as to his character in his own neighbourhood.—(Cheers.) Now, before sitting down, he might be allowed to state that an Hon. Gentleman in that House had been entrusted with a number of declarations from a large body of individual s i n Lanca shire, who had requested him to lay before that House a distinct denial of the charges so broadly made against the members of the Anti-Corn-law League.—(Hear.) Mr. VILLIERS wished to make a few observations, as he was entrusted with a statement from several manu facturers, members of the Anti-Corn-law League. The House would remember the circumstances under which the charge was made against the manufacturers, by the Hon. Member for Knaresborough. He made certain charges against the manufacturers gene rally, and afterwards he qualified those charges by stating that he meant them to apply to the manufac turers of England, members of the Corn-law League. The nature of those charges had become • matter of notoriety. Those charges were of a most serious character. It was right that those charges should be sifted to the bottom ; and as he had a state ment, utterly denying the whole of those charges, on the 'behalf of a great number of manufacturers, members of the Corn-law League, he felt bound shortly to bring them before the House.—(Hear, hear.) The charge made by the lion. Member for Knaresborough was that the manufacturers in his neighbourhood could not compete with the Anti-Corn-law League manufac turers, because it was their practice to pay their men in goods and not in mon ey. It was true that money was given them, but the whole of that money was taken from them by the servants of those for whom they . worked for the payment of clothing and the necessaries of life. He also said, that it was ccnotorious fact that the master manufacturers cleared 25 per cent. upon goods that they sold to their workmen. Now, that statement having been submitted to a great number of master manufacturers connected with the League, they had in a deliberate manner drawn up a formal denial, in which they repudiated the whole of the charges contained in the speech of the Hon. Mem ber for Knaresborough, as far as they were concerned. They stated that they were utterly destitute of truth ; that they kept no truck shops;_ and that they paid their workmen in no other way .than in the current coin of the realm. This 'aeclaration was signed by a great number of the principal manufacturers of the Anti- Corn-law League. 'He thought after this that the House would feel satisfied that the Hon. Gentleman opposite ought to enter into some explanation on the subject. Mr. FERRAND would first reply to the Hon. Mem ber for Stockport. He did not charge him with cruelty to his workmen.—(Cries of " Oh, oh.") As far as he re collected, he said, that the Hon. Member for Stockport had worked his mills both day and night. He never used such an expression as abominable cruelty. — (Cries, of " Oh, oh.") The Honourable Member had said that he (Mr. Ferrand) had charged him with adopting the truck system. He could assure the House that he had never done so. If it had been his intention so to have done, he should have plainly told him so in his presence. It was true that the Hon. Member, to whom reference had been made, had told him that the Hon. Member for Stock port had not been guilty of adopting the truck sys tem, but paid his men in money.—(Hear, hear.) .He hoped he had now stated sufficient to satisfy the House, and the Honourable Member for Stockport in that respect. With regard to what had fallen from the Honourable Member for Wolverhampton, he was prepared to prove by credible witnesses that a great number of members of the Anti-Corn law League had paid their workmen wages in goods. He did not say all —( Hear.) He nevar used the word "all " at all—( Cheers and laughter)- - -and he again asserted that he was prepared to prove, on tke twits of clergymen, of gentlemen of the highest respectability and station, of manufacturers, of tradespeople, of working people, who had given him their names since he had brought the question before a Com mittee of that House, every assertion that he had made the other evening on the subject—(Cheer:)—and there was an Hon. Member on the other side the House who said that he was prepared to prove every word that he (Mr. Ferranti) had said, and ten times more. Mr. VILLIERS said that the Hon.' Gentleman had said that the explanation was only a 'miserable quibb'e. He (Mr. Villiers) contended that the floe. Gentleman did charge all the Members of the Anti-Cern-law League.—(Cries of " Order," " order," " chair," " chair.") The CHANCELLOR of EXCHEQUER rose to order. When any Hon. Member disclaimed having uttered any words which were imputed to him by another Hon. Member, it was decidedly out of order for a Hon. Member to get up, as the Hon. Member for Wolverhampton had done, and declare that the Hon. Member had uttered the words he disclaimed. Such a mode of proceeding was not at all in accordance with the usage of Parliament. Mr. VILLIERS again rose, but was met by loud cries of " Chair, chair," " Order, order," in the midst of which the Hon. Member resumed his seat. Mr. LA BOUCHERE rose to order. He did not under stand his Hon. Friend to say that the Hon. Gentleman had charged all the manufacturers.—( Cries of " Yes, yes," and " Order, order.) He understood his Hon. Friend to say that the Hon. Member for Knaresborough had said that the bulk of the members of the Anti-Corn-law League were in the habit of paying their woi , kmen their wages on the truck system. Mr. VILLIERS again rose, but was again met by loud cries of " Order, order." He hoped the House would allow him to explain what had taken place. He had made a mis take, and had apprehended that the Hon. Member for Knares borough had charged all the manufacturers in the manner al luded to ; and he (Mr. Villiers) had so stated in his reply. He was met by cries:of "No, no," and he (Mr. Villiers) then said the Hon. Gentleman then limits his charge to the manufac turers constituting the Association called the Anti-Corn-law League. The Hon. Member for Knaresborough touched his hat, and said "Decidedly." He ( Mr. Villiers) did not say that the Hon. Gen leman said the word " all," but he had in cluded in his charge every member connected with the Anti- Corn-law League.—( Cheers, and cries of Order, order.") The SPEAKER said that after an Hon. Member had given a positive denial of words imputed to him, it was decidedly out of order in any Hon. Member to contend, atter such a dis claimer, that the Hon. Member had made such a statement. Mr. VILLIERS was willing to say that he had misappre hended the Hon. Member, and was ready to receive his ex planation, which be understood to be, that he did not intend to allude to all the members of the Anti-Corn-law League, but only to some individuals of that body.—(Loud cheers from the Opposition.) Sir B. HALL wished to ask a question of the Hon. Member for Salford and the Hon. Member for Knaresborough. The Hon. Member for Salford had given notice of a motion fer Tuesday next on the subject of the truck system, for returns of the districts in which the truck system was pursued by ma nufacturers in paying the wages of their workmen ; and the Hon. Member for K naresborough had given notice for an amendment, extending the motion to other parts of the coun try, particularly to the mining districts. He wished to know whether the Hon. Gentleman wished, if the motion was granted, or if the returns could not be made out, to call the at tention of the House to the necessity of legislating on the sub ject. There were some parts of the kingdom in which the system prevailed to a great extent. After the statements which had been made to the House, it was impossible for them to allow the matter to rest, and he thought the most efficient way of putting a stop to the system would be by making . public all the information which could be obtained regarding it. He consi dered that a more effectual way of putting a stop to it than the introduction of a legislative enactment. Mr. BROTHERTON said that the motion of which he had given notice related to cotton, silk, woollen, or flax mills; and he had so worded his motion, because by an Act of Par liament inspectors were appointed who could furnish the in formation in question. He had not asked for returns relative to printed works, or to iron and coal works, because these did not come within the province of the Inspectors of Factories, and he did not see how these returns could be obtained. His object was to ascertain the extent of the truck system, but not from any belief that that system was practised in cotton or other mills. The Right HOn. Gentleman opposite ( Mr. Ferrand) might move for separate returns, according to the terms of his notice, if he thought proper to do so; but his (Mr. Brotherton's) motion motion might be defeated if the Hon. Gentleman coupled his notice with it, inasmuch as the information relative to printed works could not be obtained through the Factory Inspectors. Lord J. RUSSELL wished to observe before the subject was dropped, that he thought it of the utmost importance that the House should agree as to the manner in which the accusa tions brought by the Hon. Member opposite (Mr. Ferrand should be investigated.--(Hear, hear. ), ,certainly had not understood the Honourable Gentlemen:. to have brought forward allegations against the manufacturers generally; but he had understood that the accusation was made with the explanation that though it did not apply to all the manufac turers of England, it applied to those manufacturers only who were' connected with the Anti-Corn-law League.—(Loud cries of "Hear, hear," cn the Opposition benches, in the midst of which we understood Mr. Ferrand to adopt, by nod ding his assent, the interpretation of the Noble Lord.) Cer tainly the impression with which he (Lord J. Russell) had gone away, although the exact words were not used was that the great bulk, the great majority of the manufacturers be longing to the Corn. law League were guilty in the first place of fraudulent practices with regard to their manufactures ; and, secondly, that they cheated their workmen by selling their goods which were worth 25 per cent. less than they charged. •It would appear, if he understood rightly the Hon. Gentleman's explanation, that what he meant was only that some of the manufacturers belonging to the Anti-Corn-law League had been guilty of the practices, and that to that extent, he was ready to prove his charge. That was not certainly any contradiction cf what had been read by the Hon. Member for Salford. There might, no doubt, be manufacturers belonging to the Anti-Corn law League guilty of such practices, and there might also be manufacturers very much in favour of the Corn-laws, who had been guilty of similar p rac ti ces .— ( Hear, hear, and a laugh.) There might be charges quite as serious brought against many farmers—they might find out cases of farmers who paid their workmen the scantiest wages, and who acted very oppressively in their mode of paying those wages. But what was to be avoided as much as possible was that charges of this kind should ,he brought in such a manner as—to proiuce an impression that the great body of our countrymen engaged, whether in ma nufactures or in agriculture, were guilty of these fraudulent practices.- Loud cries of " H ear , hear," from the Opposition benches.)e much regretted that the Hon. Gentleman, if he meant to make an accusation so limited and so confined, did not express himself in such a manner as not to be mis understood; and the more so, because those who listened to him came to such rapid and instantaneous conclusions against all the manufacturers.—(Cheers, and cries of " No, no." from Mr. Ferrand). If the Hon. Gentleman had any further explanation to give, or meant to bring forward those charges again, he believed there was no doubt of his having an opportuity of doing so.—(Hear, hear.) He must say that for his part he heard with pain the speech of the lion. Gentleman, and he must say likewise that he had seen with great pain charges made in many of the speeches, not of persons in that House, but of persons ecnnected with the Anti, Corn-law League, against those who maintained the present Corn-laws, as if those persons had been animated by a desire to ruin and destroy the great increase of the manufactures.— ( Heir, hear.) There may have been a bias on both sides, and personal interests might have influenced both parties, but that there was any part of their fellow-countrymen so sordid and wedded to their own interests as for these reasons to main tain the Corn-laws ; or that there was any party which, for the same reasons wish to alter them, he (Lord J. Russell) did not believe ; he thought the charges unfounded in themselves, and that they ought not to be made.—(Loud and long cheering.) With respect to the motion of the Right Hon. Gentleman he must say, from several communications he had wi.h other gentlemen, it was their intention to take a debate on the prin ciple of the measure, as to whether it was a good settlement of the question as regarded the Corn-laws or not. That being the case, if the question is brought forward on Monday next, it was the intention of his (the Opposition) side of the House to take a debate, and divide on the question; because, if it came after the estimates, it was impossible it would have any effect. He thought it right to let them know that it was their intention to take the sense of the House on the subject. Mr. FERRAND said, he wished to state that he had as serted that frauds had been carried on by the manufacturers to a great and frightful extent, and that the truck system was also adopted to an alarming extent, and was increasing daily to an amount that, as far as the poor were concerned, God only knew.---( Cries of " Oh, oh.") Mr. VILLIERS said, that he wished to make a few obser vations on a slight difference in the speech of the Right Hon. c G o e n n tr tle ar to n the otbanedru he les be o g r g t e h ( a l t that ho to mightread on e be l line.—( n allowed, e_ ( t Order.oug waThoeutStl;l...lrAdKern(Rndinctoiumldatneedtt;rteeelr. Gentleman that he or the Right Hon. Gentleman, the Vice-Presi dent Mr. M. PHILLIPS wished to ask the Right Hon. Baronet, practicesade of thiswhi circumstanceewhich country hofad made with reference to the foreign cotat:re t r ra a de statem ent dent o f Board of Trade, whether they were prepared to d t he taken ha particularp a l a a c ff e er i te m n dw od t ke s, foreignstat consequencee d thatma marke t, kh of ft forei g n certainfro from the t r in which cotton goods had been prepared.—(A laugh.) Sir R. PEEL could not form any opinion upon Me sub ject. He did not see, since his appointment to office, any representations of the description alluded to by the Hon. Member FINANCIAL STATEMENT. Lord J. RUSSELL wished to ask the Right Hon. Baronet at whit time he would be prepared to make his financial state ment. Sir R. PEEL, in answer to the question which the Noble Lord had put, stated that the motive that existed for bringing forward the second readinc , of the Bill for the Importation of Corn, was solely with reference to public interest. He ( Sir IL Peel) would then state the course which he should be de_ sirous of pursuing, but that must depend entirely upon the will and pleasure of the House; he received daily communica- tion urging the great necessity of a speedy adjustment of that question, but he wished to take the earliest opportunity to explain the views of her Majesty's Government with respect to the financial and commercial policy of the country ; he felt the necessity of that most forcibly—( Hear, hear.) To night he proposed to introduce the estimates of the Army and Navy in Committee. The House would be fully occupied with those several questions until Wednesday the 23i1 Alarch. Good Friday would be the 25th March, when of course the House would adjourn according to usual custom for some period. Consequently on Thursday the 24th, there would be an inter ruption for some time, however short, to the progress of business. s S u u e p h p o p se rog th re e ss es i t n im co ate rn s m of it t t h eee as Arm wo y u a l n d d j N us a t v ify y sh h o i u m ld i ha n vemade oniitteybteothy 'financial n this an day ial explain ing to the House the views and opinions of her Majesty's e f n G o o r n t e :b e e r w n d i ffi t i h s e po n r e t s f e e d w re t i t o n h c postpo ne e ?' n esPeet t public interest, he would be anxious that there should - be as powleieekv: and s t h h o fi u re ld . personal convenience, but to THE SUN, LONDON, SATURDAY MORNING, MARCH 5, 1842. little delay as posstble—that there should be no unnecessary interruption.—( Hear, hear.) On those grounds he thought it essential that the financial statement should be made as soon as possible, and he would not think it necessary that the whole of the Army and Navy Estimates should be considered , before he made it. It was of the utmost importance that it should be determined, from the probable demand on the country for the protection of commerce, and the relations of the country generally, what would be the amount of the force to be kepi up both of the Navy and Army. Consequently, when the House came AN vote as to the number of seamen for the Navy, and th e mount of the Army, he should be jus tified in proposing that the House should resolve itself into a Committee of Supply, in which he should be able to state the financial views of the Government. He had stated to the House what was his own impression of what would be for the public convenience, but the course to be taken would depend on *.he decision of the House. He did, however, earnestly hope that the House would so far affirm the proposal to be made as to the amount of force, that he might be in a condition, on Friday next, to explain the views of her - Majesty's Government with respect to the finances. With regard to the second read ing of the Corn Bill, if it was intended to take the principle of the Bill into consideration he should fear that it would defer the period till Monday next. And if he could not bring it on at an early heur on Monday, lie would at once say that he would c!efer it till Wednesday. He would not bring it on on Monday, unless he could do it at such an early hour as to ensure it a fair discussion. _ _ Lord J. RUSSELL fully concurred with the Right Hon. Baronet, as to the importance of taking an early day for the second reading of the Corn Bill. But the Hon. and Gallant Member near him (Sir A. Leith Hay) had a most important question to bring on, and which it would be impossible to leave without explanation ; and he hoped the urgency of the present measure, would lead his Hon. and Gallant Friend to postpone his motion Sir A. LEITH HAY said, from the wish expressed by the Noble Lord, and the statement that had just been made by the Right Hon. Baronet, the first Minister of the Crown, it was his most anxious wish n-t to obstruct the consideration of a question of such paramount importance, and interest to the country. He should net, therefore, press his motion. Lord HOW ICK conceived that it would by no means expe dite the measure, to have the second reading of the Bill fixed for Monday next. The SPEAKER then put the question—That the Corn Bill be read a second time on Monday next, which was agreed to. Sir R. PEEL then moved, that the House, at its rising, do adjourn to Monday next.— Ag,reed to. WEST INDIA CLERGY BILL. The West India Clergy Bill was real a second time, and or dered to be committed on Monday next. SUPPLY.—NAVY AND ARMY ESTIMATES. The Order of the Day for going into Committee of Supply was then read. On the question that the Speaker do leave the Chair, RELIGIOUS INSTRUCTION IN THE ARMY. Mr. O'CONN ELL, pursuant to the notice he had given "On go'ng into Committee of Supply onArmy Estimates, to call the attention of the House to the state of destitution, with respect to religious assistance, and instruction, - of the Catholics serving in Her Majesty's army : also, in like manner, to call the attention of the House, on going in o Committee of Supply on Navy Estimates, to the total destitution of the Catholics in the navy, of all religious assistance or instruction in their faith," said, that he would not unnecessarily detain the House with this subject. But it was a matter that struck him to be of vital importance, in connection with the supplies to be granted to her Majesty for the purposes of the Navy. The facts he had to state were unquestionable. It was unques tionable that a very considerable number of the persons em ployed in the Navy were members of the Roman Catholic reli ligion The proportion was not so great in the Navy as in the Army ; but still Ireland furnished a large number to the Navy. There could not be a higher character than that which the late Lord Collingwood gave of the boys hrought up in the Navy. Ireland did not supply so many able seamen to the Navy as England did, but its supply of boys was very considerable ; and the seamen who had been brought up from boyhood in the ser vice were found to be among the very best. Now, it being quite certain that a considerable number of the seamen in the Navy were Romnn Catholics, it must be admitted that, in point of fact, no provision whatever was made with respect to the religious worship or religious in struction of these seamen. Not a single shilling was em ployed for this purpose in the Navy. Those seamen to whom he alluded had no communication with the clergy men of their own persuasion—no period was allotted to them fur religious instruction and prayer or communion with clergy men of their own faith. These facts were undoubted, and he respectfully submitted to the House that something ought to be done to rem- dy that destitution. It was quite clear that the House would concur with him in his views on the subject, and that it would be a means of inducing those who were dis posed to enter the Navy to enlist in the service, if some pro vision, such as he alluded to, was made.—( Hear, hear. ) It was equally clear, that to a feceriain extent the destitution he adverted to must, to a certain extent, operate against that class of persons adopting the profession of their choice. He was: not to be told that persons would enlist in the service, notwithstanding the want of religious instruction in it. That was the reason why that distinction should not be allowed to continue. Complaints had been made ; and he had received many, complaining of the manner in which they had been treated in this respect. In many in stances, their attendance at Protestant worship had been com pelled. Some complaints had also been made against the offi cers of the Coast Guard, who, in extenuation of what they had done, stated that they had received instructions from the Ad miralty to compel men to attend prayers where there was no Catholic church. He wished to know if any such instructions had been given? and, if there had, whether there was any objection to their being produced? The Right Hon. and Learned Gentleman concluded by moving for a copy of the in structions given to the Water Guard in Ireland respecting Divine service, and the reading of prayers to the men. Sir R. PEEL said with respect to the instructions, he was not aware whether they had been issued or not, but if they had he could have no objection to produce them. With respect to the other matters referred to by the Right Hon. and Learned Gentleman, he thought he had better abstain from giving any answer at present, as he should have another opportunity of doing so. The motion was then agreed to. AFFAIRS OF SPAIN. On the motion being again put that the Speaker do leave the chair. Lord PALMERSTON sail he wished to ask a question of the Right Hon. Baronet (Sir R. Peel) on a subject to which his attention had been drawn some time ago by the Hon. Mem ber for the Tower Hamlets, and which he was sure had occu pied the serious attention of the Government. He ought to apologise for not having given notice of the question, but he was quite sure that the Right Hon. Baronet would be able at once to answer it. The question of the Hon. Member had re lated to the dangers which were threatened to Spain from cer tain proceedings in France. Since the time when his Hon. Friend had asked that question, reports had become still more prevalent, that enlistments at the depots, and organizations of a very extensive character, necessarily involving the expenditure of very large sums of money, were now in progress in France, the avowed purpose of which was to assist in an early irruption_ in Sp a i n , f or th e purpose o f pro moting the interests of Don Cellos in that country. Now, he cowl(' not doubt that the Government of this country had made strong representations upon the subject to the Govern ment of France ; for besides the general -interest which the Right Hon. Gentleman very properly admitted that England must have in the maintenance of the order of things at present es ablished in Spain, the Quadruple Treaty, though not now in such vigour that they could expect the parties to act up to its provisions, would, from its spirit which ought still to ani mate both France and England, justify the English Govern ment in making strong representations to the Government of France, against any danger to Spain originating in France, which the Government of France had the power to prevent. He could not, therefore, doubt that the English Government had made strong representations to the Government of France on this subject. He would rather infer from what had passed that the Government of. France had given to the Government of England assurances that they would use those means which were in their power to prevent this movement from taking effect. He could not believe that the French Government, owing its origin as it did to popular will, founded as it was upon popular institutions—he could not believethat that. Go vernment would lend itself to a conspiracy, the avowed and notorious purpose of which was to control the will of the people of Spain, and to establish either a despot is, e , a o Fr r ,r eh a ne n es rh ea ) r oo vernm ent approximationpo possessed sas edespotism,control - Certainly thei r i n f erence o f th e power ou v, nt h r i y e . H h— h transactions of that kind withi n its territory would expose prevent an outbreak. He twrvtith,aahtoe, taking t ineyenem G gs‘ e, taking oeen, donev rffv eei effect—whether, rei had aware _ n m ehdaf fiw e ere n hhehen t teww: receivedt hwha o o leenurttul steps dlt e e diefner:ff i sot addition idetoe u urFth t a f a eroni imputation therefore wished to ask whether, in addition to those assu noetilgohr Governme n t p oa tuG f h n rn t o connivance l Majesty'srwai afsanspreventing assurances, - as g t, every thing should be done to prevent this conspiracy from o r an irruption in Spain on behalf of Don Carlos? Sir R. PEEL said the lion. Member for the Tower Hamlets had asked him whether he was aware that there was in progress a system of active combination and conspiracy which was directed against the frontier of Spain. He had also asked him whether he was aware that an active partisan in the late civil war, General Cabrera, was actively engaged in Paris in organising that conspiracy. He then stated that he hail no positive information ; that he had heard the report, but that it was impossible for him to state whether General Cabrera was or was not in Paris. It had been supposed that he had asserted that Cabrera was in Paris; but he had made no such assertion. The Noble Lord must excuse him if he could only say for the present that the Government had ,sinc its accession to power, maintained the most friendly relations with the existing Government of Spain. They had done all that a friendly Government could do to con solidate that Government by counsel and advice, where such counsel and advice could with propriety be given to confirm its character. During the period of the existence of the Go vernment now established in Spain, that country had made great progress in the restoration of order and the revival of its prosperity. Throughout the struggles of Spain the English Government had taken an active interest in its concerns. They continued to take that interest, as far as they couid feel justi munications upon the subject with e him if he declined, from a toodt mote by t h c p u r m o s s t p a e n r c i t e y s , f i n a conform in. .t thtyhe They G i h t h aodv t e h er e nn i mt r e er d en e dt s e fn tF t o o r ac p no r em o e - -, but the Noble Lord must excuse . national i n ternal divisions ; and if would forget their party disputes and takese n s et that tdut opportunityy, t o e te r ointo expressing ptaaetn standard—(Cheers)— ah o ra i dnt the (c H h se e ep people would rally round thewrason)utlhd they hadreason to credit the existe this trusted they would feel that the interest of Foreign Powers should wob be was t hlooked o r n n teo s p , i wb r a hu c et i n es , n h t when o Government, hi s belief w as tnat they which the Noble that combinati on , an d th e i r conspiracies, With his (Sir R. Peel' s ) their m e n t own whi e h x ert ruledo n s o shouldvert them brne,directed and if they to maintain bedid rae rally ya t hbrieoeudGnt y Govern ment t e dh r e n af t - Lord had a d verte d.—( Ch eer s.) add cordial good will on the part Spanish i people struggling for in fopinionst h i a n t e r o e u s ir s e t r c y t t o h e a c e t i n v l e d i n n t oil e t r u et off r i e fmt i hh c i se en ee Bm, roi tr i t es h h t e h domesticG peopleov ye mrn pmlav eet a hnr f to the Government of Spain. d an ep im en a d te e d nt h e y ou th g a h t t si t i o ir b it e , b a y nim wh at i e c d h d a , (Hear, , hear)—they m i g h t depend upon it that they would fin o n the part of this count r y, e n G a . p o l v e er t n n m em . ent to tri ( u .n m nfi p r h r ! but tha i t sympathy and in tuit an active intervention, perhaps, might be exposed. e t was Baronet, m as that u at t h e n r et e ii r - y t itn i h n dr eo t p h u e e gn i h r d e e an x ne e ve r , t s i t o ar n un s gd g w tl o h e oa h r wr w yh o t u i ch l h d e p tr a y ini eo a n ll so t i h id ey tted gratifying ton t e o Perceive from the answer of the N Lord JOHN fiUSSELL said thaotbli should be enabled to maintain her freedom and independence.-_wish pre ailed among men of all parties; namely, that Sp:tin (Cheers.) Neither the Government nor the country wished c in ou S n de siredf or any exclusive asto se e the or institutions r a m o u nt of influence that m ight think it right t o a d opt, tthoet whichnhaa t t ho S en p s a ßo i m hEtn i g rii h o o ne b . e ß e an which r a o b n l o e eo d t o take t to be that o n belong t h o i g h h e placer for the a m he n e g_ rote ch aracter of her people. With res p ect to the measures he (Lord John Russell) would not, after what the Right Hon. Baronet had said, a!li him for any further explanation. As to what would be the proper policy' for this country to pursu e , whether it should merely be confined to the expression of ,ym pathy,whether measures of a more active nature should be adopted, or what steps should be taken, must depend on the form which .1 the movement against the Spanish Government might assume. It the steps taken in Spain should assume merely the cha racter of civil war, then it would be unwise in this country to interfere. But if incursions should be made into the territory of Spain by a foreign army, and if money should be raised by foreign Governments, to support the war against the existing Government of Spain, then, perhaps, it might be advisable that a different policy should be pursued on the part of the Government of this country.—( Cheers. ) Mr. O'CONNELL said that if he had misunderstood the Right Honourable Baronet at the head of the Government, he was sure the Right Honourable Gentleman would he obliged to him for affording him an opportunity of explanation. He (Mr. O'Connell) had understood the Right Honourable Gen tleman as expressing his decided approval of the general con duct of the present Government of Spain. He hoped the Right Honourable Baronet did not approve of the cruel perse cution which that Government was carrying on against the clergy, not only of the clergy belonging to the Carlist party, for he could not complain of the laws being enforced, but against the clergy who had remained true to their legitimate Queen, and who had held high situations in her service ; he might mention the Archbishop of Toledo, as an instance. These clergy had been subjected to the most cruel persecu tions. A law had befn passed for seizing the temporalites of the Spar ishChurch, leaving only a nominal allowance to the clergy. The law had been carried into effect as regarded the tempora lities but the allowances had b ee n fo r g o tt en . H e did not complain of that; it was matter of internal regulation, with which he had no right to interfere. But it appeared that it was desired to make the clergy assist in the conveyance of this property. Now, although they would not oppose the law tak • ing its course, they objected to taking any active part in assist ing in the conveyance of the property from the Church ; and in order to force them to join in these conveyances, some thousands of them had been immured, and while in prison, had been subjected to the I greatest cruel ties, because they would not actively join in that which they were prepared passively to submit to. The case was still stronger, because, when the parties were brought before the Courts of Justice they were allowed a counsel at first, and when they were allowed, the trial of the accused parties did not terminate until the counsel themselves were brought before the tribunals, and punished for being present thereat. He did not wish to trespass on the time of the House, but if he were to apply for a Committee he would be able to prove the unrelenting cruelty of Espartero in that respect. If a revolution were about to take place, and if it was the obj ‘ct to establish one religion in the place of another, he (Mr. O'Connell) should not interfere ; but the proceedings in the present case rather resembled the Jacobinisin of France at the time of the National Assembly.—( Hear, hear, hear.) They differed in no respset. It was not the substituting one Church for another; but it was the giving of the property of the Church to the military, and the treating the clergy with cruelty that he complained of. He thought that if the Right Hon. Gentleman were aware of all the circumstances he would not sanction such proceedings, but it was vain to apply to the people of Spain, and he was sure that he would be able to prove before a Committee of the House the truth of the facts he stated, and he hoped that the British Government would not rally round the Government of Espartero. Sir R. PEEL said he did not express any opinion with re spect to particular acts of the Spanish Government. Nothing would be so vain or so presumptuous in him as to adopt such a course. Ho would adhere to the course he always adopted of not interfering with the particular acts of other Governments.— ( Hear, hear.) Soon after they came into office they found a conspiracy directed against the Government of Espartero, while between the two Governments friendly relations existed, the object of which conspiracy was to meet in the dead of night and make an attack on the palace of the Queen of Spain, and to seise on her person. If that attack had succeeded, the life of the Queen of Spain would have been placed in the greatest jeopardy, and the British Government felt, though not actually in conformity with. the law of nations, it was their duty, as it was of all Governments between which friendly re lations existed, to do every thing in their power to discounten ance such wicked efforts, and that such scenes as took place in Spain should be discouraged—( Hear, hear)—and they felt it to be their slaty to give every aid to the Government of Ever tern for such purposes; but with respect to particular acts, he should disclaim either approbation or disapprobation of the persons engaged in them. —( Hear, hear. ) Mr. BO RT HWICK was much relieved by the answer which the Right Hon. Baronet had given to the question which had been put to him, because, the Right Hon. Baronet stated it to be his determination not to interfere directly in the affairs or in any of the domestic ar:angements of Spain, but that it would be his object and his wish to increase generally the advantages and the interest of that country which, he hoped, would always continue in friendly alliance with England; he (Nlr. Borth wick) believed that the whole statements made with reference to the transaction, were exaggerated ; it was pretty well known by this time that Don Carlos had, on his own part and on the part of his General,, disavowed all intention whatever to inter fere ; that they would abstain from any measure which had for its object the upsetting of the present Government of Spain, or to implant in its stead any ether form of Government. The internal wealth of Spain was almost without limit, her moral power was very great, her internal wealth and internal moral power would have developed themselves greatly for the interest of Spain itself, greatly for the advantage of Europe if that coun try (Spain) had been left to settle her own 'affairs, according to her own fashion long ago.—( Hear, hear.) What he (Mr. Borthwick) protested against was, that there shou'd be any interference on the part cf England in the settlement of those affairs of S, ain. If England sympathised with that country, it should sympathise with her as a nation. If England held out the hand of generous friendship to Spain, it was impos sible that the prophesy of the Right Hon Baronet should not be fully and satisfactorily realised. He (Mr. Borthwick) trusted that whatever influence could be legitimately used by the present Government would be exerted for the purpose of putting an end to the persecutions of the clergy of Spain, and that that influence would be exerted without reference to any political faction whatever. He considered that the Spanish clergy had conducted themselves with great credit, and that they were entitled to every protection.—(Hear. ) Colonel FOX had only one observation to make with re spect to the observations cf the Hon. and Learned Illember for Cork. He thought it was somewhat exaggerated to say that the Spanish clergy had been treated in the same manner as the clergy of France were during the French Revolution. He would like the Hon. and Learned Gentleman to name an instance in which the blood of any clergyman, or of any other man hail been shed, except in the heat of the late conflict. No clergyman had been bayonetted or shut as in the Jacobini cal excesses of the French Revolution. He protested against the statement, and he hoped if the Hon. and Learned Gentle man could prove what he had stated that he would do so. Mr. O'CONNELL said he had referred to the general con duct of Espartero towards the Church ; it was precisely the same as that of the Jacobinical Government of France, namely, the making the Government complete master of the Church, both spiritually and temporally. The Hon. and Gallant Mem ber was mistaken if he supposed there had not been a massacre of some of the clergy in Madrid. Lord MANNERS said, he believed he should not be wrong in stating that there was one instance in which no less than thirty friars had been put to death, by being thrown over a bridge. He felt great satisfaction in hearing that the principle of non-interference would be adhered to,, and he trusted the Noble Lord, who had introduced the question, would also feel satisfaction from the fact, that there would be no more quad ruple alliances, and no more British Legions.—( Hear.) CORN BILL. Sir R. PEEL said, he had determined to move the second reading of the Corn Bill on Wednesday next instead of Mon- day, as the most convenient day. THE NAVY ESTIMATES. The House then went into a Committee of Supply, and Mr. S. HERBERT rose to bring forward the Navy Esti mates. He thought he should best consult the convenience of the House, by not going into every detail of the estimates now presented, but he should merely give a general view of the diffe rences in the estimates, and an explanation of the increase and decrease that had taken place in them, as compared with the estimates of last year ; he should also explain as fully as he could the amount of the alterations that had taken place. He should have to state the alteration in the number of men re quired for the Navy as compared with last year; and state that in pursuance of the general opinion that ships ought not to leave this country except with their full complement ; to ensure this, if they preserved the same number of men, it must be expected that there must be a smaller number of ships. But from all he had heard, from the best naval authorities, he felt confident that a rednction in the number of ships, and no reduction in the number of men, would not make the Navy less efficient in maintaining peace, than a larger number less efficiently manned. With regard to the second head, there was a small diminution of amount, in consequence of the increased price of provisions. Upon the Admiralty-office there was a further increase ren dered necessary by superannuations, but the increase was very trifling. With regard to the Registers'-office there was no alteration, and when he came to that head in the estimates, he should be enabled to give the House some information. A small increase had been made in the scientific department, in consequence of additional surveys and printing scient.fie works. He was sure that the House would not grudge any money that had been expended for such a purpose. Upon the establish ments at home there had been a small decrease. Upon the establishments abroad there had been an increase of 1,0001. There was likewise a small decrease upon works at home, but an increase up in works abroad to the extent of 1,900/. There was also 1,0001. extra for artisans. In naval stores these had been a slight decrease not from any diminution of the quantity of stores, but from a diminution of prices. While he was upon the head of stores he might say, that he believed there never was any year in which the stores were in a better state than at present. Under the head of machinery there was 10,000/. extra for steam-engines. The next item on which he had to make any remark was that of New Works. On this head there was very little difference in the estimates of last year and those of the present year. At Woolwich there had been built a large basin for the purpose ofdocking steamers to be repaired. There was ale') a large sum expended on engines, &c. for the purpose of preventing fires in dockyards. The Gov ernmen t had applied to this service a sum of 10,0001. surplus of last year's estimate, in order to accomplish those works. Another source of expense was the laying down of pipes and several tanks for water in several dockyards, for the purpose of having access to water in cases of emergency. In some dock-yards the absence of any accident by fire for a great length of time hal engen dered a feeling of negligence in that respect; so much so that they seemed to have forgotten where the water-cocks were ; and some of those cocks were so covered with timber that before they could be got at in cases of fire, the flames would have made great progress. ' The whole expenditure on this head amounted to 14,000/. The House would see, however, that - though that appeared a large expenditure, it was economy in the long run. The expenses on forges for making anchors was also very considerable. There was also an additional slip built at Portsmouth. It was necessary to make a great outlay in that quarter, because the soil was gradually giving way, and in consequence the wharf-wall inclined out towards the sea in a most dangerous manner. It was well known that a ship when left on a slip lasted much longer than if she were not. For the miscellaneous estimates there would appear an increase of 7,380/., 1,000/. being taken for part of the expenses of last year. For the half-pay list there would appear an increase of 22,000/, In the estimates for freight for the army and navy the increase was nearly 44,000/. For the ' Halifax mail-station there was an increase of 20,000/. For the West India contract there would be required 240,000/. from the let July, instead of 80,000/. as voted by the last Par liament for the previous three months. This was iu order that no restrictions should be placed on those entering into this speculation. This concluded the estimates for the year. He w, uld not occupy the House with any further observations, ex cept to call their attention to the fact, that there were other estimates included in those which did not properly belong to them, and that in voting six millions, they were not voting that sum merely for the Navy, He foun t that the expenditure of the Post-office, for the last year, was 640,000/., a sum which he believed was nearly as large as its revenue.—(Hear, hear.) Now, iu the present estimate there was included for troop-ships, 36,000/., fur the army and ordinance, 247,000/., for the home dsparment, 109,0001. Now, in conclusion, he would state, that these estimates had been framed with the strictest view to economy, which the requirements of the public service would per mit. There was noth'ng of large amount which could possibly be reduced, and he trusted that that 1 i beralt y which had always been displayed towards this great national arm, would not be wanting on that occasion. The Hon. Member then moved that 48,000 men be employed during the ensuing year for theisea service, including 10,500 Royal Marines. The question having been put that the proposed estimates should he adopted, Sir C. NAPIER rose, and said, that he did not mean to offer any opposition to the adoption of the estimates moved by the Hon. Gentleman. For his part, he thought that if there was any improvement desirable in those estimates, it was that they should - be considerably increased, in justice both to officers and men. He could not refrain from complimenting the pre sent Board of Admiralty in their wise and judicious plan of ' fully mailing the British •men-of-war.—(Hear, h ear .) G o to what part of the world the British navy now might go, they would have no disgrace to fear as they were at present manned. —( Hear, hear.) It was the opinion of various officers and civilians that it would be better to have more ships and fewer men—that it would be better to have five vessels undermanned than to have four vessels on full complement. Now he ( Sir C. N.) was of a different opinion. Experience had proved that when an emergency arose, it was impossible to find men to put yes. sels in full efficiency with the promptitude !hat might be re quired. That had been shown in the course of the operations on the coast of Syria, where the ships were improperly manned, and where all the efforts 'of the Government could not enable them to complete the ships then in service in the Mediter ranean. If they had been attacked at that time, unmanned as they were, it would be exceedingly difficult to say what the con sequences might have been. But when the fleet was afterwards further impaired by deaths and disease, he really thought that if they had fallen in with the enemy they would have run great risk of being beaten.—( Hear.) He thought that in such times as these no British ship should be sent to sea improperly manned. He believed that the French Government intended to keep up twenty sail of the line : eight at sea, four in road, and eight in harbour. It seemed that the British Government had deter mined on reducing six sail of the line. Ile doubted whether the present were a moment for effecting such a reduction. But that was a question for the Government, undertaken by them on their own responsibility, and with which the Admiralty ha I nothing to do. With regard to the Board of Admiralty, when that part of the service came before the House, he should state his opinion with regard to it. He should say he was not at all favourable to the present state of the service. He believed it was well known that all our superior officers were n ov of such an age as to be nearly superannuated. Our Admirals in parti cular were arrived' at such an age that, with the excep tion of one or two of them, it would be impossible to expect that they could discharge their duty as efficiently as they would in earlier life have dune ; and as for the greater part of them, it would be absolutely necessary to send out nurses with them to take care of them.—(Loud laughter.) We had at present but few officers under 70 years of age to command our fleets. Although he had the highest opinion of the gallant officer who was going out to take the command in the Mediterranean, yet still he could nut but remember that the gallant officer was seventy-two years of age ; and although he no doubt was per fectly able to perform the duties of Admiral in the Mediterra nean in tine of peace, yet he (Sir C. Napier) would contend that it was physically impossible fur any man, seventy-two years of age, to do the duty of Admiral in time of war. If he looked at the list of Rear-Admirals, he found that but little better ; and if they went upon the present system, it would be almost impossible to have an Admiral under sixty years of age. Now, he would ask, was that right ? He would next allude to the: injustice which had been done the Navy at the last pro motion ; but in what he was about to say, he begged to be understood not as desiring to bring the Army down to the level of the Navy, but to raise the Navy up to :the Army. Before that promotion there were 171 flag officers, and 346 General Officers; there were 693 Post Captains, 779 Commanders, and 809 Colonels and 735 Majors. At the promotion seventy-four Colonels had been made General Officers, making a total of 420 General Officers, while there were only 40 Post Captains made Admirals. Now he considered that was great injustice to the Navy, and this was still more apparent when they came to consider 51 Commanders only had been made Captains, while 77 majors had been made Lieut.-Colonels. He had understood that the reason given for this injustice was, that an Admiral cost the country more than a General ; but he could show that that idea was a fallacy. The additional expense of a General officer over a Colonel was 1991. 155., while that of a Rear- Admiral over a Post-Captain was that of 191/. 12s. 6d. Before the last promotion, th e ex p ense o f th e Admirals had been 95,000/. a year ; after that it had been 105,0001., being an ad dition of 10,000/. The expense of the Generals had been 85.0001. a year before, and 98,0001. a year after the promotio n ; but it was only a small part of the expense of the General Officers. The General Officers had most of the regiments. There were 130 regiments, and, valuing them at 1,0001 a year each, there was 130,0001. a year to be divided among the Generals. Promotion was also much more rapid in the Army. Many of those who were now Generals had entered: the Army as late as 1814, while all who were Postj Captains in 1808 were Post Captains still. It was clearly shown that Lord Rodney, whom no person could deny to be an excellent and gallant officer, did not perform his duties so well as if he had been a younger man. When he fought his great action he was 70 years of age, and was labour ing under a fit of gout, and it was evident to all that he could not perform his duty so well as if he had been only 40 years of age. The next instapce he would take was the action of the let Tune, fought by Lord Howe, when he was 63 years of age, and it was well known that for three years previous to the ac tion he was subjeet to mental and bodily afflictions, and al losved six or seven of the enemy's fleet to escape under their spritsails. The next example was that of Sir Thomas Holder. He would next take Lord ,Nelson as an example, whose le knovvledged ability and naval talents everybody must allow, but whose gallant actions were, in his (Sir C. Napier's) opinion, to be attributed much more to his youth than to spy particular ability he displayed ; and he was sure that if the other Admirals,,whom he mentioned, were as young, and strong, and healthy as Lord Nelson, they would have been able togive as good an account of the enemy as he had. Lord Nelson was made an Admiral at the age of 35. He fought the battle of the Nile at the age of 36 ; that of Copenhagen at 42, and was killed at 47. He once asked a Gallant Officer, whose authority no body in that House would deny—he meant Sir Thomas Hardy— whether if Lord Nelson had been sixty years of age when he fought the battle of the Nile, or sixty-six when he gained that of Trafalgar, he would have fought the battle of the Nile on the night he had, or have gained the other as he did ; and he (Sir Thomas Hardy) replied that he would not. He would next take the example of Sir J. Saumarez, but before he did so, he would make an allusion to Admiral Duncan, who, at the age of sixty-eight years, attacked the enemy's fleet, which was more numerous than his osn, upon a lee s'aore, at a dis tance of only eight miles from land, and had obtained a glorious victory. But it should be recollected that that was an exti a ordinary case, and he (Sir C. Napier) was only speaking of the general sun of men. Now, with regard to Admiral Saumarez, he took a small squadron at the age of forty two to Gibraltar, attacked the French fleet, was defeated, and lost his ship things which rarely occur to a British Admiral.--( Hear, hear.) lie got his fleet into port, and with five sail of the line he managed to defeat the Spanish fleet. Two of their vessels were blown up, and the rest were obliged to surrender. Now he (Sir C. Napier) attributed the success of that exploit to the youth of the officer in command ; a man of seventy years of age could not possibly have accomplished such a victory. A remedy ;was absolutely and indispensibly necessary for the present evils which existed in the Navy. The cure which he, ( Sir C. Napier) would suggest was—he would not say a ra dical cure—( Laughter)—for he was sure the pre sent Government did not like anything of that sort—( Great laughter)—but he would undertake to say it would be an effectual remedy—( Hear, hear)—it would only cost the Government 100,0001. His proposal was that when Captains in the Navy came within 100 of the. top of the list, and were 60 years of age, they should he allowed to retire upon penaens cf 1001. a year. He only asked the House to give 10,0001. a year, and they would provide for old officers, and render the service more efficient.—( Hear, hear. ) fhat would be making sure provision for those officers who had been worn out in the public service, and had been the very flowers of the service during the wars. His object was to make make some provision for those who happened not to be the second babies of the aristocracy—(Laughter )—and con sequently were not promoted or made Commanders, as they had no friends or family to push them forward.—( Hear, hear. ) He would propose that old officers should be put upon the re tired list, and promoted to the rank of post-captains —it would give them the rank, and yet it would be only an addition of 6d. per day to their pay. Now he asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer to give them even that 6d. a day, it would not be much, but it would be accepted as a boon. If the Government would once make some such arrangement it would have one good effect at all events, namely, the service would never again be worn out as it is now. Then he would suggest that the proportion should go half by seniority, and the other half by choice—( Hear, hear)—or if the Government did not think that half was not sufficient for their patronage, as he knew they were greedy about it —( Hear, hear)—he would give them two to be promoted by choice, and one by seniority. The slow promotion of the Mates especially operated to disgust them, and had a very disheartening effect on the young men who were entering the service. Formerly it was very rare to find men quit the service after having joined it, but it was now a common thing, and in those who did remain it caused the same sort of feeling. Formerly they had some proepect of promotion after six, eight, or ten years' Service ; if the Mates were promoted after six years' service he thought they should not complain ; bnt having served that time, they thought it hard to get no promotion. He next came to the petty officers, and if justice were done them, it would also cost the Exchequer a little money. If they looked at the manner in which the Navy was manned, and the difficulty there was at all times in getting m en , w h en h e h ad known an eighty gun ship lie at Portsmouth for more than six months, without getting her complement, it was evident that it was absolutely necessary something should be done to en courage seamen to enter the Navy. Every officer in the House knew that the working petty officers were the most useful class of men possible, but the difference of pay be tween the able seaman and the petty officer was not suf ficient to make the former aspire to the station of petty officer. Of these effacers there were two classes— the second class having but2s. or 3s.a month more than the able-bodied seamen. When the Duke of Clarence was Lord High Admiral, he put a patch on their arms, and made officers of them ; he did a great deal of good, but if he had put a patch on their pay—(Laughter)—he would have done a great deal more. He should propose that the pay of the petty officers be 31. a month, and he would do away with the thirteen months in the year instead of twelve. Seamen were paid for thirteen months in the year, but many of them could not understand it; he had himself heard a sailor in Cork say he understood there were only eight pay month; in the year, and on being told there were thirteen, said he did not know, he had always been told there were twelve. lie would change this system altogether, and give the sailor 2/. a month. He approved generally of the Bill of the Right Ho nourable Baronet for manning the Navy, which was the only attempt that had been made to regulate the supply of men to the naval force, for theaast thirty years. But it ought, to go further, because, in the event of a war, it called on British seamen to serve their country, and gave them only four or five days to decide whether they would serve as volunteers or be impressed. They ought to make the seamen understand that the service of this country was a good service. He felt that it would be extremely difficult to pass a Bill of that sort in the present feeling of the country, but a beginning. might be made. Now there was an A c t pas se d i n th e re i gn o f Queen Anne re quiring merchantmen to receive parish boys on ;board their ships, and after they had served four years on board those vessels, they should go irsto the Navy. That Bill he might say was at present a dead letter, but when the Poor-law Bill came to be discussed, he thought the House would have an opportunity of making good use of that Bill. There was another arrangement he aighly approved of, which the present Government had adopted, and that was reserving to seamen their pensions, or rather plowing them to have their pensions, allowing them to be employed in the service still re tain in it t W h eir onld have 'penaion been better to ahhad always been lib era ', b ut h e thought give them more pay. He would now come to officers' pensions. Thesofficer when he went to sea lost his pension ; now , that appeared to him to be extraordinary, because when he went to sea, he was obliged to fit out his ship, and if he got appointed to a small one- he then lost half his pay. There was another point with respect to pensions, to which he was anxious to call the attention of the House. By the Queen's reg u l a ti on when an officer received wounds, amounting to the loss of a limb, her Majesty was authorised to grant him a year's pay, and she reserved to herself the granting of an annual pension if be had received wounds of a certain description. But what had the Admiralty done about 150 years ag o ? th ey ma d e a regu l at i on that no officer should receive an annual pension unless wounded equal to the loss of a limb. He had never heard that the regu lation had been altered. One observation he would make with respect to a statement of the Right Honourable the Secretary to the Admiralty. He said that in reducing the ships to six sail of the line, the fully manned ships would require the same number of men. He should have thought that if foursail of the line took as much material as five sail of the line there aught to be some reduction in the materiel. With respect to ships being placed in slips ; he believed it to be the very . best thing the Admiralty had done. He thought if the Admiralty built more slips it would be a benefit to the country. But it was most extraordinary that for thirty-five years they could not find that out. They had a twenty-six years' case , and they never found out b e f ore that it was necessary to keep ships on the slips. H e b e li eved there had been one tried at Deptford p fourteen years ago, and there it was now.—(Laughter.) AR- lfr other point he wished to refer to was a subject not genera known in that House. In 1835 a report got about thst all the masts of the British nave were rotten.—( Laughter. ) He, found that after twenty yews a survey was made in 1836, ana the report was that those masts were unserviceable, and vrefe very properly taken out of the ships, and put into a stiffc . rqi,t e departm en t. N ow thi s prove d very b a d m anagement. came then to the construction of the ships in the serviee; they happened to have a good surveyor, they generally:btu" good ships ; but if they had a bad surveyor, which had : off!! happened, they built very indifferent ships. The building - 4 ! those ship s was given to one swan, whether he was clever oriait• The present surveyor constructed excellent ships, but Sitlr, Symmonds put in mos t r idi cu l ous s t ern s. Mr. Greg, 6 ' Pertsmouth D oc k -yard. and Mr. Ray, all r i d i cu l e d thi s stern ; and it was impossible for them to bear eight, fen, or twitle_ guns on the q uar t er. E very sh i p that ha d b een b u ilt uncle. , SrS William Symmonds, had this ridiculous stern, and it iris necessary to unship these before before they could fire a single gun. They were supported by an iron board, or elselbei would fall into the water. If they measured the Quertik the lower deck, they would find that she was thirty-six feet longer on the poop than down below. He believed that till sterns had been cond e m ne d. as i mproper ; an d h e thought grea t credit was due to the Admiralty for their conduct in reference to them. He was extremely obliged to the House for the at' tention with which they had listened to his remarks. Captain ROUS said he believed that there had always bee n but one desire in that House in reference to the Royal Na i l' namely, to render it as efficient as possible ; but their end ! a ; yours had been frustrated by th e Lords of the Admiralty , wwe * instead of being, as they ought to have been, its protects had ben its greatest enem i es . H e had grievous faults t o 6e with the Admiralty ; and hi s au th or it y for venturing' to entire', , „ his opinion was, that having:commanded in her ,, service for ten ye ars, he was in possession of facts T o d which he dre w the i n f erence t h at no s ervice been more neglected than the Royal Navy since 1815. fro'he would begin with the state of her Majesty's ships. 1815 to 1825 and 1826, the Admiralty kept on building old gun brigs, like those formerly used, most ridiculous which would hardly s t an d up under canvas, donkey friglii; which were desig na t e d " Forty thieves. "—( Hear, hear.) ' co d Duke of Portland, and other leading personages, at lengthi r .„ g i n . the Admiralty to b u ild a b e tt er c l ass o f vesse l s . Sir Vh° . Symmond's model was peculiarly ad a pt e d f or b r i gs a nd cot veal; but when that model was fir s t i n t ro d uce d, it was thought in so perfect, that it would answer for all vessels from the brig io. the 120 gun ship. He had a l wa y s th oug ht th a t as theY he creased the size of the vessel a n d th e ti er o f the guns, t a , b , „ must proportionally incre ase th e fl a t ness o f t h e floors. ' for model answered very well for brigs and corvettes, but not be larger vessels. When Sir W. Symmonds built his vessels , ,, 0 gave them lofty b ows , w hi c h ma d e t h em goo d Oaf o e iw t when not hea v ily l a d en . H e ( C apta i n R ous ) 1" it necessary on one oc cas i on t o bring down his siiiP, ,„0 feet lower in the stern, and by d o i ng so, h e renov't :ad ' d the vessel somewhat easy ; and for doing that he was fouls fault with by the Admiralty. But the thing most to be ; mented, was the failure of the steamers. The Gorgon stealuet was built to carry 1,200 troops in case of war, and if, w i t h di: number on board, and the number of guns allotted to her, ; le e r fell in 'with a heavy gale, there was great probability of being lost. The ships were made without any pains tie taken whether they would succeed or not ; and he bei,,L e ' ra that it arose in some measure from the fact that many owr aid of the Navy, whatever ships they were apppointed to, //,,7,,,„ always fancy their ships were the b e st in the v/ 0 ' 1 ;0 (A laugh.) They would cry up their virtues, 0 4 take care to conceal their defects. He remetut 6 that after Sir William Syminond's improvements had fti os introduced, three ships, the Inconstant, the Castor, stu".. Pique were to be tried, and the last was to be taken model. But what happened? Six new sister Piques were built before the trial was made, but there were no we re t he constants or Castors. The race was thus decided before of horses were saddled.—( A laugh.) The present sYst e f he se promotion in the Navy was decidedly objectionable. bo o were at present 500 or 600 Mates in the service in . " hope deferred had made the heart sick."—( Hear, P`Ti ort There were a number of Lieutenants waiting for proto,o until they had become almost superannuated. al oftic%. again were always preferred for the command of vesseis„; ol ; that a man who had been perhaps twenty years on w ins . and who could not probably pass a midshipman's exalw oh ip tion, was appointed to the command of an 80Pu w as and 800 men.—(Cries of " Hear, hear.") lhat t ) what they called common sense.—( Hear, hear, n` , ~k , They had ,expected to have been mu c h benefited by the d l e val and Military Commission which had sat in 1839, an e • condition of Lieutenants and Mates had been somewhat b en _,I fitted. Before that Commission the half-pay of a Lieu te t P i had been ss. 6d. a day, and his full pay 6s. 6d. ; the har o f of a Mate had been Sc., and his full pay 6 1 . Now the on bh p a Lieutenant-cost at least 1001., and for that they gav e _bat the magnificent remuneration of 6s. 6d. a day. But? In had the Commission done for the higher rank of officers ? ‘ „ st , the year 1832, the Right Hon. Baronet the Secretary of !'„, o , for the Home Department had taken away part of their p r e; money from Captains, without awarding to them any i W e s of pay. Now, all that the Commission had done fell the ir was to allow them, when fitting out their ships, to talc' o t, plate and table-linen from the Dock-yards, paying 10 perandee, per annum for th e use o f it— a f avour w hi c h, h e apprehei. 3 0 any friend would do th em . With regar d to t h e Admira ls ' they had done was to t urn b e t ween 60 or 70 ye ll o w Adnu jo g to the active list. Now, with regard to the enW i lhe of old officers, he would p o i n t t o th e M e di terranean meet, Oe would ask if that fleet was in a proper state of discipline r was told that it was not. He w o uld as k, was the fleet u rff be larly manned, was it fit for active serv i ce ? What co iiroe, the state of discipline. when the midshipmen on board a sh o r e ship, who had been prevented from going "then!' because on former occasions they had misconducted with selves by exceeding their leave, had rowed about the fle et o wl a flag representing a negro in chains, to show the crue l t?: or ,) tyranny with which tky had been treated ?—( Hear , c oo While he was on the subject, he would just allude to *tees' which had been most improperly made a subject of my be He disliked mystery ; it looked as if there was something b" s t e hid.—(Cheers.) He alluded to the case of Mr. Eltoti._ a had been informed that Mr. Elto n had been turned out o w ! ,!'' co ship commanded by the Gallant Member for Gloucester, _t, Mr. Williams was First Lieutenant ; and when he after met Mr. Williams at the social board, and made the request him to take a friend on shore in his boat, it would appea, L_"...0 from the length of time w hi c h h a d e l a p s ed since they had sitipmates, that M r . Elt on h a d no right to make such a r . e (le!: as they wer e pl ace d on a very different f o oting towards e ac other from th a t w hi c h t h ey had previously been. Mr, Elton ha; been advised by his senior officers to make an apoolgy, but h l l t r y refused to do so. He had a f terwar d s o ff ere d to ma k e a n allffe but it was considered too late. H e (C a pt. R.) w ou ld noL „, upon himself to say when:an apology was offered it s hould"' - toe jected, but it was considered in t caseat the a poloY too late, and it was decided that M hat r Elton should be trued Oust Court-martial, the consequence of which every one knew w .l O l be, that he must be dismissed the service. The Mates others were going to give him a jubilee, but in order toti r vent that scandal—and he hoped, if possible, he might hef t io tradicted as to the fact if it were possible—the officers In he Court-martial ordered him six months' imprisonment; 0 7_ i n was sent on board of a ship to receive his punishment,. w od close arrest, as should have been the case, but in open arre st, r d, the consequence was, he grossly misconducted himself on ban 6 He went on the quarter-deck, where be should not hoe cr oa . and told the officer in command that he was a liar, in fl o w& other disrespectful terms. But when h e came home the hid of Admiralty, eo n sidering him a n un f or t una t e cu lprit w h o already suffered enough, discharged hi m f rom the custouii e l, which he was subjected by the sent ence o f t h e Court-ma rt e d to Rut if it had been a person without e d ucat i on , w ho dar rior make use of such language, or send a challenge to his sur o r officer, he would now be on his way to a penal settlemen t, s. be hanged at the yard-arm. If h e (C aptain R ous) were °-tht Court-martial, and if a doubt existed with regard ° ho e' amount of punishment to b e awar d e d , he wou ld t" th er the doubt into the scale of the greater punishment 144 than allow the discipline of her Majesty's r to be broken. The M a t es an d t h e Mid s hipmen were 3 ,' a ss verned by the sy s t em o f rewar d s an d punishments- i ,t;b e rs fact, that many officers were anxious to prevent Sir d• rbg plan being carried into effect. In the year 1812, bef ore the; American wa r , it w a s s t a t e d by a ll th e nava l sages then 'oo House, that it was impossible for an 18-gun frigate to e , / as with one of 20 guns ; but at th a t very moment the fcr! nty's being dispr ove d. Wh en h e was i n one o f h er Mai e , - . o te vessels, in 1811, they chased the Fr enc h f r i ga t e Chloines 1 1 01 Brest, and fired five to every four shots fired by the enetnif,,, of that he wanted was, to impress on th e H ouse th e necesalls, employing efficient men. He was trading on sacred groueder he was about to refer to a Gallant Officer, but be ha a s 4 cribed the state of the Mediterran ean fleet, and how ne ck it was to have men of energy and activity for that service ' he was obliged to say that the Gallant Officer about to yja• that command, will have been sixty-seven years in be r th a it jesty's service next August. He c ou ld no t h e l p f ee ling ; r e' was cruel to drag men full of years and honours, from tb ei w its l tirement, and appoint them to suc h a comman d. And a i d excuse could the Admiralty make for it? Why, tb„,„ *.... ,. would tell them that it was ne c e ssar y t o h ave an ,j certain rank to take the command in the Meditcrrau e 7 o rsee the event of being obliged to co-operate with a foreign tr tP The excuse was ridiculous and childish, for her MaJe o s . o , oa Council could at any time order an officer to hoist 0,..71,51e any rank her Majesty ple as ed. B ut h e b e li eve d that 9 '400 miralty thought the virtue lay in th e fl ag , and not in t' fr pcf and energy of the man who s e r a n k it denoted. Did they t old that that flag, when it fluttered in the breeze, w ould And the circulation to the aged veins of the Commander ? ns t when, in a dead calm, it hung c lin g i ng t o t h e m ast, o " not be considered an emblem of stre ng th d eca y e d, as t e th e shook in the gale it might be taken as an emblem oa r of chieftain was about to depart ? If he had been the ariv i r se ed $ PhP O the First Lord of the Admiralty, h e wou ld no t have W fine building on a ruined arch, even th oug h that ar e ep twined with ivy and covered with laurel. He had draw red ° plan for the improvement of the Navy, which had aPP e llott ° the newspapers, and therefore he should not trouble the 110 with it, as any one might make himself acquainted , W p ' o t contents. His object was, that commissions should granted by the Admiralty to the influence be e f apa g id rea fo t r rel e t a bl; that something of an equivalent should cf obtaining an efficient officer, without adding to an„motiel t . p — rno (ma number Hear, hear.) os: lhoeealrd. years b) afloat;e i v l e n n at t on h dt e hos p e r— b, 8 0 0 0 r; o se fv r il v li e be d untr th ine e anne g tds rea tlh t i e se s t a s thes ,ooo o selected by their Captains, who were the best judges , theY ref be better selected than they could be by the AdmiraltP l a . nt e put the young men on the shelf, and drew out the 6 , t vt l " They seemed to for4et that they could afford to do' 11 " 1 . 1 m right, hut they could not afford to do what was wrong. go o) • expenditure, they knew that the clergy received ono"' ,}iter' the rental of this country.—(Opposition cheers and -i t a'a,r, and cries of " One-fifth.") Well, one-fifth would saf gument as well. They had Crown officers, law offir oa rsi munificently paid ; but they could not afford to pal ips officer. But would the prayer of the priest, and the plead for of the lawyer, st o p the bull e t? N o . They must depen`i the their defence on the stro ng a r m and daring valou r ° t hose soldier and the seaman —they must depend ula sw wet ki , men who conquered kingdoms in every part of the gis and brought this little island to the highest pitch of glory' they mightobjec f was el t e o w b r i i e n g th o e ther steps offi o e f e rtsh forward, their pred was his duty to bring forward this subject. Shafts of fa it, a ril might fly about his head, but they would pass unheeded! the the good things might be remembered. He would finish words of the old song : " Then oh, protect the British tar, ceinsseorrsdeier gthies_rsf_u.ol.ol:. Be mindful of his merit ; And when again you're plunged in war, He'll show his daring spirit." Sir G. COCKBURN was happy to find young offi.e:_ /. .. 5 , c 1: 1 forward in that House in the manner in when the 1 1 7.' near ,) Gallant Member who had just sat down did.—(lle,iar tosill The first thing he (Sir G. Cockburn) wishe—, Elton' the attention of the House to, was the case of Ihr.. et , er to Mr. Elton, as the Gallant Officer had stated, wrote A 4 to an officer whom he considered his friend, making a reeile o ' r ai, which no answer was returned. He then wrote an iti_suj ur ts nate letter to that officer. For this he was tried hyt he Os martial and dismissed the service, in addition to which sentenced to six months' imprisonment in the Marshalse a t of , had no hesitation in saying that when the intelligen ce o fficer sentence arrived at the Admiralty, there was not aa„, t heir there who did not consider that a severe sentence, theu n g; , t hat took for granted, considering who had ssed the sente, n t heir there were good reasons for it. They then determine r !' he arer' own minds not to send him to prison. Wh en thej a _ ting oil , however, of his improper conduct on board of the!t n o(r 1 they determined not to interfere on his b ehalf, csei The t accordingly he was s e n t t o the Marshalsea. 1 ' tain whom Mr. Elton had offended by his seao l 4 ter .s 4 the 4 R I 4.4 lie, cPRI he: