The Sun. — London, England, 1842-04-09 00:00:00

lORTALIT The fiillowing are the results of " A Table of Mortality in the Metropolis, showing the Number of Deaths from all Causes Registered in the week ending April 2, 1842." The Table is issued from the Office et the - Registrar-General ; Weekly Average 183&9••40-1 Total. -A--- 1 , Fo u r I Four WinterslYears Epidemic, Endemic, & Contagious Diseases 125 199 190 Diseased of the Brain, Nerves, and Senses 140 160 149 Diseasei of the Lungs, and other Organs of Respiration iiseases of the Heart and Blood-vessels -13,iseases of the Stomach, Liver, and other Organs of Dig, estion ... Diseases of the Kidneys, &c. ll 1 4 Childbed, Diseases of the Uterus, &c 9 11 10 Diseases of the Joints, Bones, and Muscles 3 7 6 Diseases of the Skin, &c 0 1 1 Diseases of Uncertain Seat l2O 115 104 Okl Age ' or Natural Decay Deaths by Violence, Privation, or Intem perance . Causes not specified Deals from all causes . 832 -- Average Weekly Deaths lOl7 912 Population Averag e Deaths renu- y in merated Deaths the 18 4 1. 18.1?-2-V-1. Week. West--Kensington, St. George r --A----1 • ( Hanover-square), Westtnin- Four I Four • ster, St. Martin in the Fields , Ye rs. Wint rs. St. James 300,705 135 151 131 North—St. Mary-le-bone, St Pancras, Islington, Hackney 365,660 162 182 179 Central—Saint Giles and Saint George, Strand, Clerkenwell, Holborn, St. Luke, East Lon don, West London, City of L0nd0n...... 373,808 188 213 177 I CAUSES OF DEATH; East —Shoreditch,Whitechapel, • Bethnal Green, St. George in the East, Stepney, Poplar 392,498 206 228 154 South—St Saviour, St. Olave, St. George( Southwark ),Ber mond.ey, Newington. Lam beth, Camberwell, Bother hi the, Greenwich .... ...438,060 221 243 191 Total 1,870,727 912 1017 R 32 It is slated that under the term Metropolis are comprised the 32 districts herein mentioned, which include the City of Lon don with and without the walls, the City and Liberties of Westminster, the out-parishes within the Bills of Mortality— and the parishes of St. Marylebone, St. Pancras, Kensington, Fulham, Hammersmith Chapelry), St. Luke (Chelsea), Pad dington, St. Mary (Stoke Newington), St. Leonard (I.3rorn ley), St. Mary-le-bow, Camberwell, Greenwich, St. Nicholas and St. Paul (Deptford), and Woolwich. The population, as enumerated in 1831, was 1,594,890; and in June 1841, was 1,870,727. The weekly average for 1838, 1839, 1840, and 1841, was obtained by dividing the deaths in the four years by 208, and the deaths in the four winters by 52. TE3IFIRATUkE IN THE WEEKS ENDING March 19. Apt it 2. 5 , ?.° 58' 34 36 42 49 7. 1812. Highest Lowest Daily Mean . ...... General Register Office, April HORRIBLE MURDER AND MUM LATION OF A FEMALE. not decided upon GREAT HARLOW. The Committee met again yesterday at the ma' hour. The room was immediately cleared, and the Committe e eort tinned for a short time in deliberation, but it was not stated what was the subject under their consideration. The inquiry into the vote of Jason Povey was eAntinued. John Giles, the bailiff of Sir William Clayton, was called by counsel for the sitting Member, and deposed that he had from time to time sold sheep to Povey, and that there had been con stant dealings between them. Mr. AUSTEN then entered into a long and powerful argu ment in defence of the vote of James Povey, which occupied the Committee during the remainder of the day. DEATH Or MR. ELLAR, THE HARLEQUIN.—EIIar, the most celebrated harlequin of his day, died on Monday last, at the advanced age of sixty-two, at his lodgings, No. 15, Mount-row, Lambeth. He has left a wife and child totally unprovided for. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS, April 8. , Their Lordship s were occup i e d i n h ear i ng a di vorce case, which lasted till half-past five, at which hour the LORD CHANCELLO R took his seat on the Woolsack. CANADIAN AGRICULTURAL PRODUCE. The Earl of RIPON presented a petition from the Chamber of Comfnerce of Montreal, praying for a re moval of restrictive dies from all Canadian Agricultu ral produce, NATIONAL EDUCATION (IRELAND). Lord REDESDALE presented several petitions, from places in Ireland, against the National System of Edu cation in Ireland. CORN IMPORTATION BILL. Messengers from the Commons brought up the Corn Importation Bill, which was read a first time. BRANDLING JUNCTION RAILWAY BILL. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY presented a pe tition against this Bill, from certain Shareholders. Lord CAMPBELL presented a petition from a cer tain sect in Scotland, who stated that they were not Quakers or Sabbatarians, and yet they had religious scruples which forbade them to make an oath ; they prayed, therefore, that they might be exempted from doing so. IMPRISONMENT FOR DEBT. Lord CAMPBELL presented a petition from a priso ner in the Queen's Bench Prison, against imprisonment fur debt. MARRIAGES (IRELAND). Lord WHARNCLIFFE presented a petition, praying for an alteration in the marriage law of Ireland. CHURCH EDUCATION SOCIETY. The Marquis of DOWNSHIRE presented several pe titions from places in the county of Down, and elso • where, praying their Lordships to make a grant in favour of the Church Education Society. SEVERN NAVIGATION BILL. A NOBLE LORD presented a petition from Stafford in favour of the Bill fur the improvement of the River Severn. CORN IMPORTATION BILL In answer to a question from Lord BROUGIIAM, The Earl of RIPON stated that it was not his inten tion to move the second reading of this Bill sooner than► this day week. Lord BROUGHAM wished to know if it was intended, by the introduction of the new towns, to raise or lower the averages. Earl RIPON said that he did not anticipate it would have any effect one way or the other. CHURCH EXTENSION. INQUEST ON 'TIE BODY. Yesterday, at twelve o'clock, Mr. Carter, the Coroner for tin Eastern Division of Surrey, and a Jury of 17 inhabitants of the parish . of Putney, assembled at the Angel Inn, Roehampton, to investigate the circumstances connected with the death of a female unkuown. whose trunk and mutilated .emains were dis covered in the stable adjoining the mansion, and belonging e, Qurlez Shiell, Esq., of Putney Park-'ane. The mot iutense interest prevailed dutotg the proceedings, and the jury having been swo n, proceeded to view the remains of the body. It was the tn. re trunk, divested of arms, legs, "and head, urither of which could be found. On searching the harness-room, however, it was quite c:ear that the remainder of the body had been burned, for a potion of a jaw -bone, and the ashes of human bones, was found amongst the tinders of the fire--21ace. On the return of the jury th e es id ence was entere d into as follows : • • William Gardner, police constable 279 V, :vas ii st sworn. He said on Wednesday night la•t, the Rh of April, about a quarter to nine o'clock, 1 was on <lnv in High-site -et, Wand , - worth, when, from information 1 received from Mr. Cohn borne, of Ilizh-street, pawnlroker, I went with two lads to the house of Mr. Quclez Shiell, Putney Park-lane, in the parish of Putney. The names of the lads no re Robert Speed and Sa muel Smith Dagnall. On sr. icing there I tang the bell, aed the footman XIISW4 red it. I inquired of the loatman if the coachman had cone home. Ile said No; hut direited me doe nes the stables, Si) ice; he mCgiit be there. The staid s are about two hundred putts from ti c house. I desired the lad Speed to ring the ; i 11. lie tilt! so, a d the coachman came to the gate. The lid asked it the coachman hail come hem o and the person said, "I am the coachman." I then went up to the man, and told hint I had come to take him into custody of a charge of stvallng a pair el !lack trousers, wh;ch wan my only object in going there. Tee man said... Yes. I bought a pair of breeches from %Ir. Celinborne, and I did nut pay hint fix them." He pulled out his purse, and wished me to take back the money for the breeches. I told hits I would not take the money ; the breeches had nothing to do with the charge of gilding trousers. Ile thee said, "Oh very well ; 1 will go to Wet cis: meth, anti sett's with Mr. Colinberne. I asked him if he would allow me to look over the chaise and stables. He made no objection, but said •• Yes." I went f: on* the lane where I was standing, accompanied by Speed and Dagnall, and the coach man %eta 'With on and, pointed me out the eha'se. house anti sitaolei e 1 searched the chaise which wa s out s id e , then th e eltaiareetteessr, and front these I went to the liarriese-resin tot joinieg.,thestable, and from thence to the stable. When ; I was aboutarnteriug the staf.le the coachman said "No, no; let us go to Wandsworth and make it all right." I re, lied "No, 1 mill not until I.ltave searched the stable," as 1 had not then found, the trowsers. Before I got into the stable a Iverson came COLLEGE OF MAYNOOTH. up, whom I understood to eo Mr. fioughton,•Mr. Shiers gar- I Mr. HARDY presented petitions from Bridport, Sails dener. He asked me what was the matter, and I told him the places in Sussex, Buckinghamshire, Essex, and ohjectof my visit. I then went into the stable accompanied by bur y, the two halls and Mr. Houghton, the coachman, and a child numerous other places, against any further grant to the about ten or eleven year, of age. The door of the stable I fOund Colleze of May n ooth. open. I desired the lad Speed to stand by the coachman Major CUMMING BRUCE presented a similar while I made the search. I searched the first and 1 etitiun from the town of Elgin, signed by 125 persons. second stall from the door, and then proceeded to the THE TARIFF. corn blow on the left of the . doorway. I. had 'The HON. MEMBER then presented a petition nume searched two of the binna, when the coachman said Let us rously signed from the landowners of Forfar, in Scotland, go to Wandsworth and have it settled, and appeared very anxi- praying that any duty impos e d on c ure d mea t m i g h t b e ous. I a ga i n sa id I wou ld nut unti l I had made a diligent such as to afford them suffi c i en t p ro t ec ti on , ' a hi c h t h ey search. After this co nversa ti on I searc h e d one more binu, and while searchi ng th a t, th e coac h man went to t h e lower stall—the conceived the proposed tariff would no t a ffb r d. fourth in the row —i n w hi c h t h ere was a quant i ty of hay. 1 THE INCOME TAX. went after him, and saw him move some h a y f ront one s id e of The HON. MEMBER conclud e d by p resen ti ng anot h er the stall to the other, and nuder the window. I made a re- petition, numerously signed, from the landowers of For mark, that I did n o want his assistance, and the lad Dagnall tarshire, regarding the mode in which it was proposed to was holding my lamp whilst I began to move a portion assess the income of tenants occupying land in Scotland, of the-hay that 1 bad seen the coachman move. I moved trio praying that in the assessments they might be placed on trusses, and under it I felled some loose hay which I moved a footing with the holders of land in England. with my foot. I then observed something lying under it, Mr. PROTHEROE presented a petition from Halifax, and? I moved the hay with my hand, and said to the lad, deprecating the proposed reduction of the duty on fo- Dagnill, " What is this ?—here's a goose !" Dagnall drew 'lose towards it, and the lad, Sp ee d, a l so, an d the same moment. reign manufactured boots and shoes. Speed came towards us, the coach man rus h e d out of the stable Mr. GORDON presented a petition from Aberdeenin the duty on f ore i gn door,.pull e d it u tt er him, and locked it on t h e outs id e. I against the p ro pos e d reduction said:: now we are done,"meaning he had escaped from beingmy cattle. prisoner for stealing the trowsers. We all ran to the door, The Marquis of GRANBY presented a petition to the anti the lad Speed and myself took up a hay fork and coin- same effect. meneed prysing the door. I left him doing so and went back to Mr. GREGORY presented a petition from Galway, the stall to see what that really was tinder the hay, and the two praying for a system of scriptural education in Ireland. lads came also. Pack of us passed some remarks as to what it 31r.PLUMPTRE presented a petition from the Fruit wa,, and the lad Darien exclaimed, " Why it's a human growers' Association of East Kent, against any reduction being." Speed said-Oh, - nonsense, and stooped down and in the duty on foreign fruit. t tined it over, and then we saw that it was the portion of a body or trunk of a f ema l e . W e ieturned to the door and suc- Lord F. EGERTON p resen t e d a pet i t i on f rom West ceeded in getting it open with the fork about a Derby, near Liverpool, praying that further powers quarter of an lunar alter the escape of the coach- might be given by law to the overseers of parishes relas man. I told the lad Digliall to nut down the lime towards the to the reputed fathers of illegitimate children. Also, Wau:tosortli, and tell every policeman what had happened, anti a petition from 4,000 persons of Bury in favour of the give the coachman's description, and also to do so at Wands- commercial policy of her Majesty's Government. worth station-house ; and he left f o r that purp ose , whilst I and Mr. ATTWOOD presented a petition, praying for an the others remained where we %Y. re at the stable. I remained equalisation of the duty on timber between this county about twenty minutes, when constable 192 V, cline up, an d I and the Isle of Man (as we understood). y despatched him to Putney to give informati on . Ab out h a lf an Mr. MITCHELL presented a petition, praying for an hour after, police constable Tighe, 199, arrived, and I despatched alteration in regulating seamen's wages. him to Wandsworth to give information to Superintendent Bicknell with a full description of the coachman's dress. The 11Ir.HUTT presented a petition f rom H u ll aga i nst Superintendent, Mr. Inspector Buseain, and a medical man, ar - the proposals of her Majesty' s G overnment w i t h respect rived in about half an hour. Afte- we had found the body, M r . to the tariff. Houghton's son came down to the stable. We gave him in formation that something strange had been found, and he ap peared much alarmed, and said he would stay in the house. I do not think he knew the body was concealed there. He went to see it in the stall, and exclaimed " What a wretch he must be to do such a deed," meaning the coachman. The trunk was lying on its front when the boy Speed turned it over. 1 then knew it to be a woman by its breasts. The arms were cut off close to the sockets. The legs were severed at the hips. The head at the lower part of the neck, and the entrails, had been taken out, the stomach being cut open. I searched but could not discover the other parts of tile body, but I have since seen, that which is described to have been a portion of thebody. 14 the CoaoNea—Mr. Houghton's son said it was dan gerous to sleep in the house. He might be murdered. We believed that the conduct of the coachman in running away anti locking ns in in the manner he did, showed that he was the-murderer, and had placed the body where it was found. After the Superintendent came, I and Sergeant Palmer again seattehed the stable, but did not find the stolen trousers ; but in the third stall, which I had not previously searched, we found a Traitress under some trusses of straw, with two blankets rolled up .inside of it. There were some stains on the mattress, but I cannot say if it was Wood. It looked more like urinal stains. The body, as it has been viewed this day by the Jury, is in the position.we found it. with the exception of being turned over witla the head part towards the manger of the stal. There was straw under the body which was stained with blood, but not to any great extent, By a Juror—l saw the coachman's clothes hanging up in the harness-room, but I did not minutely examine them. The coachman made no observation when he rushed out cf the stable. Robert Speed examined—l am shopman to a grocer iu High. street, Wandsworth, About half-past eight o'clock Mr. Colin borne, the pawnbroker, came and asked ino to go with his boy in search of a man at the house of Mr. Shiell, of Putney Park lane, who had taken a pair of trowsers that did not belong to him. I went to Mr. Shiell's premises. We gest saw a female, anti then a boy, who told us where to go to find the coachman. We rang the bell, and a female came to the gate, accompanied by the coachman we were in search of.—The witness here de m.: 'bed what passed, and the discovery of the remains of the murdered woman.—After the examination of several other witnesses the inquest was adjourned till Tuesday. The Bishop of DERRY presented a petition from Longfield in the county of Tyrone, Ireland, in favour of Church Extension. The Ecclesiastical Leases' Bill passed through Com mittee, and was reported. The Beele3iastreal Corporation Bill went throaEh Committee, and was reported. Their Lordshipi then adjourned to Monday. HOUSE OF COMMONS, APRIL 8. The SPEAKER took the Chair at the usual hour. STANIIOI>E AND TYNE RAILWAY. Mr. LII)I)ELL moved the third reading of the Stan hope and Tyne Railroad Bill. Mr. CURTER.; moved that the Bill be read a third time this day six months. He contended that the parties should have sought to attain the object which they had in view by applying to a Court of Equity. He had no ntcrest whatever in the matter, and it was on prin ciple that he opposed the Bill. No Hon. Ah;xiiber having seconded the amendment, the Bill v 4 as read n third time and passed. The Forth and Clyde Navigation Bill ; the Glasgow Police (No. 3) Bill ; and the City of Glasgow Life As surance and Rev ersionary Company Bill, were each read a second time. HAWKERS' LICENSES. Sir G. STRICKLAND presented — : petition from certain inhabitants of Durham, being hawkers, com plaining of the tax upon their licenses, and of the regu lations connected therewith, whereby they were much harassed and oppressed. The Honourable Baronet pre sented also six petitions for the repeal of the Corn-laws. The designation of the petitioners was not heard in the gallery. . ELECTION CoiviiiiiTEES. .WIGAN. The Committee met at Eleven o'clock. ti he vote ofJohn Ceterall was retained on thepetitio f ner's poll. tt Mr. HunrAo then said that, i n conseq uen c e rest lotions to which the Committee had come, h e wou l d ~ , t ' ! priiilege to place Mr., Crosse at the head of the poll, anadrveeareritsi ui.i . `,,n Counsel for the petttionets to pl ace M r. Standish an dt Mi,,... prilifell, it they intended so to do, above Mr. Gree„all the,)tig's.st on the po'l of the sitting , Memb ers . r., AusiENt said - that the usual i settee was that the sitting_ Member, when !laced _lowest cn the poll. should seek to re 7 - ettablish skis position on it, and that it Mr. 11ihiyard d.cf :riot mein to place Mr. Crosse in his position at the head of thi poi% he should withdraw him altogether. The room was cleared, and on our entering, the Chairman sea that the Committee decided that the scrutiny on the part oflhe petition , -s should be proceeded wish. Joint Warrii4gton was then objected lo by the Counsel for the ~. . yew toners nit the grouud of change of oco.patico• 'I he vote ofJohn Warringt n teas retained. stualph Woodcock, objected to on the et0t11:(1 9f removal, was ck off the po:1 of the sitting Members, seph Walsh was ne t objected to by counsel for the peti tioners, Ott the same ground, but it being announced 'hat the Mr. PALMER supported the amendment for the ad journment of the debate on the petition. Sir R. INGLIS said the Hon. Member for Finsbury might have carried his motion by an assault, but at pre sent every moment that the debate was prolonged, his chances of success were vanishing. He must allow that the debate had not been prolonged by this side of the House, if the Honourable and Learned Member for Dublin had abstained even from his two minute speech, he might have secured the success of the Hon. Member's motion. But he (Sir R. Inglis) contended on principle that the decision of the House on one day, ought net to be set aside without notice ; the Hon. Member ought to have given notice of his intention to present such a petition, then the whole question might have been re-argued, and no one would have any right to complain of the course taken. But having ascertained what the decision of the House was on the point, he ought not to have raised the ques tion, when nine out of every ten Members only expected the ordinary presentation of petitions. He should there fore vote for the adjournment, trusting that by this time, by the assistance of the Hon. Member for Durham, the object of the Hon. Member for Finsbury was effectually frustrated. Captain PECHELL said the Hon. Member for the University of Oxford spoke as if his Hon. Friend had had the petition in his pocket for a fortnight. If he had only received it that morning, how could he give such notice? He hoped he would persist in dividing the House ; it might happen that he should follow the same course with the petition he held in his hand. The Hon. and Gallant Member for Lincoln had endeavoured to lead the House astray by putting the motion as a want of courtesy to the Speaker. He was perfectly satisfied that this was not the case. The SOLICITOR-GENERAL h o p e d t h e H onou r a bl e Mr. T. DUNCOMBE CUSTOMS' DUTIES.. • resented two petitions from Member would not press th e mo ti on . Th ey were not to p bodies of journeymen corners, discuss whether the practi ce were a w i se one or not, against the re d uc ti on of but it certainly had been th e p rac ti ce f or a num b er of years the tax upon f ore i gn curr i e d l eat h er, and the tax not to receive petitions presented under such circumstances. upon . the importation of 'Ants and shoes. He Last night the Hon. Member for Finsbury, after having also presented a petition from the straw-plait given notice of his intention upon the subject, moved manufacturers of the county of Suffolk against the that the practice of the House relative to the reception reduction of the d u ty on f ore i gn plaited straw. of petitions shOtild be discontinued. He admitted that it —(Cries of " Hear, hear," and great laughter on the was perfectly open to the Honourable Member to pursue Tory benches.) such a course, an d t o ca ll i n quest i on the former THE RIGHT OF PETITION. . usage of the House. B ut a f ter t h e House had Mr. T. T. DUNCOMBE then said he had anothe r peti- tided upon that motio n it was not fair of the Hon. tion to present from the members of trades and pro- Member to bring forward on &succeeding evening the same fessions in the metropolis ; the name, profession, and question without having given any previous notice of his residence of each person was appended to his signature, intention ; such a course, if acceded to by the House, and the number of signatures, altogether was 380. would lead to very inconvenient consequences, inasmuch (Hear, hear.) The petitioners st a t e d their reasons why as all the proceedings of that House were regulated by this House ought not to agree to a Bill imposing a tax precedents, and by former practices. It was manifestly on income, which was, under all circumstances, neces- inadvisable that the decision of the House upon a right sarily unequal, oppressive, and unconstitutional.— should be reversed the succeeding night, while the House (Hear, hear.) But they further stated their reasons why, was not prepared for discussion upon the subject. He if the House consented at all to such an imposition, hoped, therefore, that the Hon. Member fur Finsbury it ought not to be fixed for three years, as its continu- would not now persevere in his motion. mince for so long a time would secure its re-enactment for Lord JOHN RUSSELL said that he was one of a longer period; and they prayed that the House would those Members who were not aware that his Hon. Friend not pass the Bill under its consideration. He said, " Sir, meant to propose that the petition should be brought up I will now move that this petition be brought up"— that evening. He agreed with his lion. and Learned (Hear)—and he was proceeding towards the bar when Friend In thinking that it would be very inconvenient— The SPEAKER called out " Order, order," and said that the lion. Member was aware that it was the usage practice—that -it would be very inconvenient ' without taking into consideration this particular and rule of the House not to receive petitions against a with regard to the general usage and forms tax or duty, which was tinder the consideration Of that of the House, that a motion that ha& been rejected House ; and, yesterday, on a motion brought forward by the Hon. Member himself, the House had decided after due notice, should be again brought forward when many Members of the House were not aware that the that the rule should not be discontinued. Mr. T. DUNCOMBE—Sir, with every respect for subject was to be a ga i n cons id ere d.—(H ear , hear.) H e thought it was not only quite competent, but that ;it the order which which you have just laid own, I think would be quite reasonable on the part of his Hon. it is in the power of . this House to accept or reject any Friend t o b r i ng t h e quest i on aga i n b e f ore t h e petition, as it may think proper.—(Ch eers .) • T here House. It appeared to him, that the, fact of a is no rule or order which can prevent the Rouse pm actice having prevailed nir one hundred and fifty years from receiving the petitions of the people MIA a sufficient ground for the Muse to reject a motion at any time.—(Cheers.) But I admit that the resolution for its reversal on its being first proposed. But the which I yesterdt!,y proposed, and which was, " That ,the house might no doubt again consider the reasons upon practice of this Himse, which precludes the presentation think it ad visa bl e to do so. He understood that the that p ract i ce stoo d , and repeal it if they should thick of petition s u p on t h e su bj ec t o f an y t ax or d u ty un de r its I consideration, b e di scon ti nu ed," w as, by a very narrow lion. Member for Surrey had moved that the debate should be adjourned until Monday, and he hoped his majority, at the instance of her Majesty's Government, 1 Hon. Friend would accede to that proposal.—(Hear, certainly rejecteil.—(Hear, hear, hear, from the Tories, responded t o by c h eers f rom the Opposition-) But there I is no ru l e or standing-order which makes it im Pe hear.) He believed th at i t would be in the power of his p Hon. Friend to brin g on t h e q uestion at an early hour , on the H ouse to reject any petitions.—(Hear, hear.) If on Monday, and the Ho use wou ld then have an oppor , there were any such rule or order, I would be the last to tunity of reconsidering the matter. fly in the face of it. But as it is only a practice, I Mr. AGLIONBY said he concurred in the reeommeiji an obsolete, absurd, and cobweb practice—(Cheers and dation of the Hon. and Learned Solicitor-General, though laughter)—which has been departed from in various in- not upon the same ground ;he concurred in it not from stances ; and as it has been clearly proved that the a-my regard for the practice of the House, but because he DISTRICTS. iTROPOLIS House has the power of receiving or rejecting all kinds of petitions as it deems proper, I shall on this occa sion take the sense of the House.—(Cheers.) I admit it has been the usagf? since 1693—1 admit that it vvas to practice adhered to in the time of Sir Robert Walpole, and followed up from that time to the passing of the Reform Bill.—(Hear, hear.) - But from the time of Walpole to the Reform Bill this House became every year more and more corrupt and more pliable to the will of the Ministry than it ever had been.—(Hear, hear.) However, in 1815, Sir William Curtis was allowed to present a petition from the City of London against the property tax, pending the consideration of that tax, though the House divided as to whether it should be received or not—(Hear, hear) —and again in 1816, another petition was presented by Sir W. Curtis against the same tax, and the City of London presented a similar petition by the Sheriffs at the Bar—(Hear, hear)—and it was received—(Loud cheers)—and I think for one, that the old usage was more honoured in the breach than in the observance. —(Hear, hear.) I must therefore, Sir, with all respect to your authority as to what are or are not the laws and usages of the House, take the sense of the House upon this petition, as I am resolved to stand by the right of the people to petition. The SPEAKER—Of course it is for the House to de cide whether it will receive or reject any petition— (Cheers)—it is only for me to say what are the usages of the House.—(Hear.) Mr. ROBERT PALMER (who spoke rom the Trea sury Benches) did not see any reason why that petition should not be received.—(Hear, hear.) If be had been in the House yesterday, when the Hon. Member for Finsbury brought forward his motion, he (Mr. P.) should, most certainly, have voted in the mino rity with him.—(Hear, from the Opposition.) But, in point of fact, the Hon. Member had done quite as much to answer the ends of the petition, as if it had been formally laid upon the table.—(Hear, hear.) The Hon. Member had stated the prayer of the petition and the number of the petitioners--(Hear, hear)—and he (Mr, P.) could not see what inconvenience there would be in practice from allowing the petition to be received and laid on the table. Mr. KEMBLE was not present yesterday when the motion of the Hon. Member for Finsbury was under dis cussion, and he could not say whether, if he were, he should not have supported it. He could not say posi tively whether or not.—(Laughter.) But when it was known that no public business was brought on until five o'clock—(" Hear, hear," from the Tories) —and he thought no gentleman—(lnterruption and cries of " Hear, hear," from the Tories)—he repeated, that when this was known, and when this question was dis cussed last night, and the House decided that the rule should not be departed from, he thought it a most unfair proceeding to come down with the other side in such strong force as they had on this occasion. —(Great cheering and laughter from the Opposition benches.) It was impossible to see the array on the other side without coming to the conclusion, that an effort had been made for the purpose.—(Hear, hear.) It was not fair after the discussion of last night to try and get rid by a side wind of the resolution which had been come to, and when the Speaker had declared it was contrary to the usage of the House. Under these circumstances he should move that the debate upon the subject be adjourned till Monday.-(Hear, hear.) The amendment having been put, Sir H. HARDINGE said he must declare, after the decision which had been come to yesterday evening, that it was an unparliamentary proceeding to comedown to the House that evening, and before the usual hour at which public business commenced, to attempt to set aside that decision.—(Hear, hear.) He hoped, therefore, that the Hon. Member would not persist in his motion, but would adjourn his proposition till Monday. Mr. O'CONNELL hoped his Hon. Friend would not consent to postpone his motion, and as to saying that the proposition came by a side wind it was no such thing. It came directly, and that was what they wanted. It was far from being unparliamentary to preseat petitions ; it was the foundation of their Parlia mentary jurisdiction to receive and entertain the petitions of the people.—(Hear, hear.) They never would have a Parliament but for the coin which the English, people took out of their purse ; and money was the foundation of the institution of Parliament, and it was ridi culous to say thitt the people of England need not give a shilling of their money, and, at the same time, preclude them from • telling their representatives whether they would consent to it.—(Hear, hear.) Ho confessed he had come down for the occasion. He had the misfortune of being shut out from the division of last night, and be had determined on being present this evening, and, without meaning any disrespect, lie would persevere on the subject till he had succeeded. He felt embarrassed lest the Speaker should de cide otherwise than he had; and in that case he (Mr. O'C.) would consent to his decision ; but as he (the Speaker) left the House to decide, lie trusted an end would be piit to the question. Taxes was a subject which, of all others, most affected the interests of traders and professional people : and ought not they on such a subject to be heard by their representatives ?—(Hear, hear.) He hoped it would not be consith-red a party question, and that they would only consider what was their duty to their con stituents ; and, for his own part, he would, under any circumstances, have supported the view he was now ad vocating.—( Hear, hear.) Mr. KENIBLE wished to explain. He had said no thing with regard to the question, but he complained that, after the decision they had come to last night, the question should b e soug h t to b e carr i ed by a side wind. —(Hear, hear.) Colonel SIBTIIORP said that he had last night voted for the Hon Member for Finsbury, but after that mo tion had been lost by such a majority last night—(lroni cal cheers from the Opposition)—he did not think it altogether fair to seek to upset that deci sion in the manner he (Mr. D.) now sought to do it. It was not consistent with the open and manly course which that Hon. Member always took, and he should therefore vote against his proposition to-night. Mr. LAMBTON said that he had supported the mo tion of the Hon. Member for Finsbury last night, but after the decision which had been then come to as to what the practice of the House was, he did protest against this proceeding, as being rather an unfair way —(Ministerial cheers)—of obtaining by a side wind a reversal of that decision.—(Hear, hear.) Let the Hon. Member, bring forward his motion on a future day, and he (Mr. L.) would support him on a question which involved the security of the people, and their right to petition that House, but he would not lend himself to upset the rules and regulations of the House by a side wind. Speaker was at prayers the Committee had the vote. BUSS AND CROMARTY COURT HOUSES. This Bill wai read a second time. . YARMOUTH AND NORWICH RAILWAY BILL. Mr. G ItEENE presented a petition from Leeds agai nst this Bill. LONDON AND CROYDON RAIr.WAY BILL. . This Bill pas,;cd through the first and second readings. BOLTON AND PRESTON RAILWAY BILL. 'This Bill also passed through the first and second r:adings. NATIONAL EDUCATION (IRELAND). Mr. W. 0. GORE presented a petition from King's County, Ireland, against the present system of national education in that country. BOROUGH IMPROVEMENTS BILL. Mr., MUNDY presented a petition from the bor,,ugh of Derby, complaining of certain clauses in this Bill, and praying that that borough might be exempted from their operation. _ _ SuN LONDON', SATURDAY ItIVENINO, APRIL 9, 1842. was anxious that that practice should as speedily as possible be discontinued, and because he thought that object would be best promoted by an adjournment t ill m0nday.......(1 ea e.) He believedthat no advantage had been gained by Hon. Members opposite, nor could they gain any without making the practice a Standing Order of the House. He hoped that this question would be tried time after time. It had not been smothered by the majority of 31, and if Hon. Members persevered in pressing the right of the people, there was little doubt that they would eventually succeed.(Hear, hear.) Mr. T. DUNCOMBE said he had stated, in asking the House to receive this petition, that if there had been any Standing Order of the House, any rule or re gulation, any lex scripta against presenting a petition on the subject Of a tax under the consideration of the House, he would have been the last man in the House to oppose such a Standing Order. But there was, in fact, no such Standing Order or regulation.—(Hear, hear.) There was a Standing Order against the presenta tion of a petition asking for relief out of the public purse, without the consent of the Government. The debate of last night showed that there were prece dents on both sides—that there was not an uninterrupted stream of precedents against the presentation of such petitions as that now under' discussion. He (Mr. D.) had shown that in 1811 petitions of this kind were not only received but submitted to a Committee of the whole House, when there was under consideration a Bill for levying taxes to the amount of 1,500,000/. The Right Honourable Baronet quoted two or three precedents in 1795 against the presentation of such peti tions ; but if the Right Hon. Gentleman looked to the year 1815, he would not find that those petitions were rejected nemine contradicente. In that year, on a divi sion respecting the presentation of a petition of this na ture from the City of London, the numbers were, if ho were not mistaken, 108 to 69 against the presentation. The Speaker had laid down that there was no rule or Standing Order against the presentation of such, but that it was merely a usage, He (Mr. D.) maintained that that usage was not continuous from the time of , the Revolution. All their rules and precedents, unless based on common sense and Justice, and supported by public opinion, amounted to nothing, and ought not to be attended to by the House. The Hon. Member for Surrey (Mr. Kemble) found fault with him (Mr. buncombe), because Hon. Gentlemen came , down to the House and seemed pre pared to support the presentation of the petition. He (Mr. Duncombe) certainly had stated to several of his friends that the question should not stop there. Unless they laid down a Standing Order against it, day after day, when any of his constituents or any other portion of the community placed a petition, such as the one now objected to, in his hands, he would place that petition before the House, and the .odium of its rejection, by the House should rest upon the responsible decision which a majority of the House should come to. He agreed most willingly in the sug gestion of adjourning the subject to Monday next, when at fire o'clock he would ask the House whether they would receive the petition, which, till then, he should keep in his possession. Mr. M. GIBSON wished to know what distinction was drawn between the duties on corn and duties on in come, that petitions could be presented against the one and not against the other ? Ile wished to ask the ques tion, as the practice on the matter had not been uni formly agreed to. For his part, he looked upon the duties on corn as much a tax upon bread, as the three per cent..was a tax upon income. Sir R. PEEL said that the duties on corn were not proposed in Committee or Supply for the service of the year, and therefore the general rule respect ing the presentation of petitions applied to them ; whereas the income tax was proposed for the service of the year, and the practice was not to petition against propositions of that nature. After a short conversation across the table between Mr. T. DCNCOMBE, and Sir R. PEEL, It was arranged that the Debate should be adjourned until Monday at Five o'Clock. THE TARIFF. Mr. R. PALMER presented a petition from the land owners and farmers of Berkshire, expressive of th e i r fears of the proposed alter a tions in the Corn-laws, and of the alterations .in the tariff with regard to the duties on the importation of cattle and provisions, and praying the House . not to consent to those alterations. MARINE INSURANCE. Captain PEC HELL presented a petition from the' merchants and shipowners of Brighton, Worthing, and Chichester, praying that the duties payable on the effect ing of marine insurances might be lowered. INCOME TAX. Mr. Q. W. WOOD had a petition to present on the subject of the income tax, which, he thought, did not fall within the rude laid d 'lvo last evening for the guidance of the House in these matters. It was not a petition against the income tax. Its prayer was, that the House would adopt every other expedient for equalising the re venue and the expenditure before resorting to a measure so demoralising, unjust, and inquisitorial as an income tax.—(Cheers and laughter from the Ministerial benches.) The SPEAKER said that the petition came within the rule, and therefore could not be received. THE SUFFRAGE 'Mr. S. CRAWFORD gave notice that, on Thursday, the 21st April, he would call the attention of the Ilonse to various petitions of the people praying for extension of the suffrage, and for ether amendments of the repre sentative system, as stated in these petitions, and to move the House to take the same into immediate consideration. ROMAN CATHOLIC SOLDIERS IN INDIA. Mr. O'CONNELL begged leave to ask the Right Hon. Baronet, the Secretary at War, whether it was the in tention of the Government to provide for the spiritual wants and religious instruction of the Roman Catholic soldiers now on their passage to India ? Sir H. HARDINGE gave an answer which was almost inaudible, but he was understood to say that from papers brought forward by Lord Ashley, in 1839, it would be seen that there were already seventeen Roman Catholic chaplains in Bengal. DEFEAT OF THE BRITISH TROOPS . IN AFFGHANISTAN. Mr. ESCOTT begged to ask the Right Honiurable Baronet at the head of the Government, whether he in tended to make any statement to th e H ouse as to the causes Right of H itle o w n. ar ßro i a nA n ff e w g t haonuilsri ; and furth er , w h et h er the bring forward any facts, to enable the House to form a judgment on the justice and policy of that war ? Sir ROBERT PEEL said that several extracts from official documents respecting the war in Affghaniatan were laid before the House som e time since. Those ex tracts conveyed all the information which it was at that time expedient to furnish. As to the late events, the Government had no better intinanation than the melan choly statement already laid before the public. As to the causes of the late enormous losses, and the peculiar motives and circumstances actuating those in command, the Government had but very knowledge,imper trehertougl va te and as yet informed princip a lly PESTILENTIAL BURIAL HOUSES. Col. FOX stated, that he and o th er M em b ers o f t h e sources. were Committee for the improvement of Towns, had lately received a statement affirtning that in a Build ing called Enon Chapel, in the midst of a densely populated district of the metropolis, not less than 12,000 bodies had been interred since 1823 or 1824, in a superfices not so large as that House. It was suspected, indeed, that very many of those bodies had been made away with in other ways. The flooring of this vault consisted merely of planks laid together without bricks or mortar, or any other kind of protection to those walking on the floor from the effluvium arising from the bodies below. He under stood that it was intended to open the upper part, of which those planks were the floor for a school for Roman Catholic children on Monday next. He begged leave to ask whether the Right lion. Baronet, the Se cretary for the Home Department, was aware of those facts, and whether he had taken any steps to prevent those proceedings P S:r J. GRAHAM said, the matter was under the con sideration of a Committee of the House, with a view of framing a legislative measure on the subject. As to the point to which the Hon. Member had directed his attention the selection of the chapel the Hon. Mem bet' had referred to as a place of education for children, he did not know how he could interpose his authority. He was afraid that he had no direct power to interfere. INCOME TAX. deficiency as it now stands, and as it has been stated by the Government itself, that this great effort is to be made. Now, Sir, in order to enable nit to consider, and in order to place in a elsarer view the necessity which now exists, so far as oar finances are concerned, to take the course proposed, I mutt ask leave to refer to former occasions on which income taxes have seen proposed and have been enacted, and to occasions on which the House did not confirm, but negatived the proposi tion by large majorities. The difficulty which yeu had to en counter when the income tax was first proposed, was of this nature. For several years you had been eng aged in war, and you were adding every year t o t h e amount of your debt, raising money on very disadvantageous terms, and increasing every year, therefore, the interest• of the public debt. In the year before the income tax was imposed, a loan of fifteen millions was raised for the service of the year. In that year the assessed taxes, I think, were trebled, but there was a provision with respect to those assessed, that every person who would be obliged by those assessed taxes to pay more than a tenth of his income, should declare that such was the fact, and thereby should be exempted from any overplus beyond that amount. In the following year, notwithstanding the imposition o f th ose assesse d taxes, which' then produced more than four millions, it was found that there was a defi ciency of ten millions for the year. The pressure of the war required that a very great effort should be made, and the Mi nister of that day having the House and the country with him, in favour of the prosecution of the war, thought it necessary, and, I think, rightly, thought it necessary not to go on increas ing the debt in such an immense ratio, but to ask for a still further effort from the country, in Order to make the revenue:nearly equal to the expenditure of the war. As soon as that war was over, the succeeding Minister (Mr. Addington) came to the House of Commons, and proposed at once that the income tax should be discon tinued. It is fair to say—l do not remember what provision was made by Parliament in that respect—but it is fair to say that the original tax was made liable to the charge of the debt for several years to come in respect of the war. lam not quite aware of the manner in which the provisions were made. Mr. Addington then thought it necessary to abolish the tax upon the declaration of peace. When the country was again engaged in war that tax was renewed, in order again to prevent an immense accumulation of debt, In 1806 by that Act, which has often been referred to, a tax was proposed of ten per rent. Lord Lansdowne, who was Chancellor of the Exchequer at the time, stated that the loan which had for some years been ten millions a-year, had in the previous year increased to twenty millions. It was in order to avoid if possible such a growing accumulation of debt—the imposition upon the posterity of that generation of a debt in ereesieg at the rate of twenty millions a-year—that the Go • vernment of the day proposed the imposition of the tax. When the peace arrived, it was proposed, indeed, to continue the tax for two years, I think for the purpose of paying off the debt, but the proposition was resisted by Members on both sides of the House—it was resisted generally by the independent Members of the House who then supported the Government. - After several nights discussion the proposition was defeated, and I think it is stated by Lord Brougham, in the introduction to one of his speeches, that it was considered as thereby established that the in come tax should be reserved for a period of wa • and for I hat alone. Many years aft rwards such was the case with this tax when there was a very great pressure on our finances. But, Sir, it may be asked, has this tax ever been under discussion in this House in times of peace? It has. In the course of the year 1834 it was proposed to reduce the malt tax to the amount of ten millions, at the same time that there was a proposition for a reduction of the window tax. On that occasion Lord Althorp proposed a resolution to tie effect, " That a reduction of the malt tax to the amount of tee millions, and of the window tax at the same time, could only be supplied by an income tax, which at the present is not expedient." Lord Althorp then declared that "he confined his reso!ution to the time at which be moved it." But he also made several statements as to the general proposition of an income tax. He said that he " thosght it was not prudent to have a small property tax." He thought " that ten or twelve million should be made by it if it was imposed at all." But he went on to say, that "he i never knew a t ax so unpopular as an income tax when • was in operation."—( Hear, he tr.) He said "it was de tested," and he asked " what more inquisitorial powers could be employed than noes required fur the collection of such a tax? —( Hear, hear)—and' it was impossible that it could be made to bear on all pat ties of the community." Now, Sir, at that time what was proposed was to propose a tax on property, and not on income—( Hear, bear)—and I must say that the Rigtit Hen. Bart. opposite said on that occasion nothing which was at all inconsistent with the course which he is now pursuing. He said that he would not refuse the tax in time of war, nor in some circumstances even in time of peace. But lie said at the the same time that " it was a tax which required inquisitorial powers—which required a rigid scrutiny into private affairs, and which would lead to fraud and persury."—( Hear, hear.) But, Sir, it seems to be the opinion of some that it is possible to get rid of the inquiry into men's affairs, and yet to have a tax on income which would supply the deficiency. But I think the Right Hon. Gentleman himself in the debate, to which I refer, said that there must be inquisitorial powers, atid he has on the present occash n admitted that necessity, or else encouragement would be given to fraud and perjury —as tie men only who were not disposed to give a faithful account of their property would pay the tax, and those who chose to give false and evasive returns would escape the impost. I think, Sir, from the whole that I have said, that it appeals that whenever an income tax has been proposed, that income tax has been proposed fur the sake of supplying- a deficiency of not less than from 10 to 20 millions in the current year in the ex penditure of the country.—( Hear, hear.) It was imposed in 1798, when you were borrowing money at 47—( Hear, hear) — we en you were paying 46 per cent. on all the money you bor ! owed.—( Hear, hear.) L , tme ask if there is any resemblance between that situation and the present situation of the country. —( ) Your deficiency does not amount to one-twentieth of your annual income ; an although that deficiency has existed for some. years, yet the credit of the country continues unimpaired.—(Cheers.) During that period, your Three per Cents. have been at 89 and 90, and you have been able to bor row money at less than 31. 10s. per cent., while other nations, which have had to borrow money during the same p may mention Austria, Russia, and Holland, as examples—have had to pay 5 per cent. for the money advanced to them.— (Cheers.) I state this, to show that there is nothing in the present state of affairs to require this extraordinary effort ; that there is n atteng in the present state of affairs, that should make you contradict the assertion of former Parlia ments, an assertion supported by the generality of politi cians, that an income tax ought to be reserved for a time of war, or, when imposed in a time of peace, it should only be imposed under oircumrtances of great difficulty—of difficulty equal to life difficulty under which a country must labour in time of war--(Cheers)—and that it ought not to be had recourse to merely to get rid of ordinary difficulties.—(Loud cheers.) Sir, let me state again what appears to me to he the general objections to this tax—objec tion: which made the country so eager to get rid of this tax as soon as peace was declared, and which have hitherto made Chancellors of the Exchequer refrain from proposing the adoption of it, when by so doing they might have re lieved articles of consumption from many of the duties levied on them. In the first place, I think it a great objec tion to this tax, that it proposes to tax the funds. It appears to me, that you ought not to impose any tax on the funds unless you were labouring under such difficulties that you can hardly find resources for your Exchequer without it.--( Hear, hear from the Ministerial benches.) lam aware that Lord Althorp proposed a tax on the transfer of stock— ( Ministerial cheers)—but I am aware likewise that his own friends Pointed out to him the impolicy of such a tax— ( Cheers )—and that he was most vehemently opposed by the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite.—( Opposition cheers. ) Now, I am not saying that a tax on the funds, accompanied with a tax on landed property and on the profits of trades and professions, may not be expedient. That is not what I said, and it is not the nature of the argument I wish to put. The nature of the argument I wish to put is, that the funds being the gene ral deposit of the savings of the country, that being the deposit of the savings of many persons engaged in merchandise abroad, it is not expedient, if it can be possibly avoided, to lay a tax ou those funds. It is of great advantage that London should be the chief money market of the world.—( Hear, hear.) It not only increases the riches of London as a capital, but also the wealth of this country, that merchants look to London as the great money market of the world. It is advantageous, there fore, that the hauls should be free from taxation on that ac count.—( Hear, hear.) Is it not likely, if you place a tax on the funds, that either Amsterdam or Paris will be come the chief money markets of Europe and the world ; that whatever capital may succeed London as the chief money market, that country will engross much of the wealth that falls into this country in consequence of the prefer • enae now given to it.—( Hear.) That is one general objec tion to an income tax. Another is the admitted inequality of the tax.--( Hear.) It is an inequality that has not, and indeed cannot, be denied.—( Hear.) It is obvious that with respect to three or four persons who possess 3001. a year, that one may have that 3001. a year, which belongs to himself and his heirs, without any exertion whatever on his own part. The second person may have it in terminable annuities, which partly re present capital; and the third person may have it by exercising a dangerous and unhealthy profession ; as, for instance, a sur geon in the country, who exposes himself in aq weathers, and who has laid up a portion of his small income to make a provision for his family. In that instance you tax capital as well as income. Those engaged in trade were likewise sub ject to the same disadvantage, and was it right to place such persons in the same situation with those who had 4001. or 500/. a year secured to them without any exertion of their own ? What is the answer ? Is it denied that this inequality existed ? By no means. But the Right lion. Gentleman pointed out, and pointed out not only with great ingenuity, but with suc cess, that there were other inequalities. That though there were some inequalities there were others, five or six, or ten or twenty, for which we could find no remedy. Others may say that they could find a remedy, but the Right Hon. Gentleman did not profess to provide one. He pointed out that there was not only one, but many inequalities; but is not this a reason why a tax, so confessedly unequal in its operation, and so different in its pressure on the different classes of the community, as ould not be resorted to without great and overbearing necessity. Another and odious objection to this tax is that it was stated an inquisitorial examination must form part and parcel of the tax. It is quite impossible that you should avoid it. It is impossible that- you should take the declaration of persons without further inquiry as to the amount of their incomes. I may be told, anti I have heard it said in the House, that it should be a matter of indifference—that persons should not he afraid of telling the amount of their incomes. I must say, that for a commercial country, that is a very extraordinary doctrine. —( (-Tear, hear.) Who does not know that, however firmly commercial affairs may be conducted by an individual, there may be occasions in which the publication of his accounts would be eery injurious to his credit, and inconvenient to his future prospects • and are you now t o l ay d own as a maxim that there is something criminal or guilty in such a man saying, " I do not like my affairs, my accounts current, to be proclaimed at Charing cross and over the world ?" Let me observe, in respect of this objection, there is a peculiar unfitness in the time at which this tax is proposed.—( year, bear.) During the latter part of the war, and indeed from the year 1797, the currency was gra dually more and more depreciating. The consequence of that depreciation of the currency was somewhat similar to the effects remarked by the historian to have been produced by the dis covery of the precious metals in America, which was accom panied by their depreciation. The consequence was the increase of trade, and the wealth. of the country, whilst capital and fixed incomes were lowered in "aloe. Thus trade and currency were in a flourishing condi tine, but is that your position at present. You are now deal ing with trade in a state of great difficulty and embarrassment and at a moment when you hope it may recover, but you do not see any strong symptoms of any recovery. Wily,"at such a moment it is peculiarly injurious to individuals that their affairs should be known and promulgated—( Hear, hear ? and I do not speak merely for individuals, but that which is inconvenient and injurious to individuals generally, is inconvenient and injurious to the country at large. You cannot do that which is hurtful to men engaged in trade generally, especially to men of small cipital, and who are struggling with present difficulties. You cannot impose upon them additional embarrassments, without acting injurious:} towards the trade of the country. Hiving stated that the proposal of the flight Hon. Gentleman is to obtain, by taxation, a much largersum than that which the:deficiency alone calls for, I come to the second part, which relates to the duties proposed according to the new tariff, anti the deficiency thereby occeeioned for this ',consider is the principal difficulty of the coup try ; it appears that it has been predie , ed for many years by per sens well competent to judge, that having an enormous debt, that having necessarily a very large amount of taxes, and hay- On the motion of Sir R. PEEL, that the Order of the Day, for bringing up the Report of the Committee of Ways and Means, be read, Lord J. RUSSELL rose. He said—Sir, being al ready informed that the proposition for an income tax has been agreed to by a Committee of Ways and Means, and being aware that the House has already de cided that no petition can be received on the question, on the'ground that this House has this tax under its consideration, I conceive that 'before bringing up the Report, I am fully justified in moving a resolution which shall convey my sense of the present state. of our financial and commercial affairs, and of the remedy that s h ou ld b e ap plied to them.—(clear.)lf it has ev er b een t h e m i s f or t u ne of a n y M em b er of this Com m itt ee to take a g l oom y view of the p resent state of public affairs and to picture to the House our wretched situation with respect to the future prospects of the ceattry, I am happy to say this is not my position. On the contrary, I am disposed to think that, with re spect to the financial part of the question, the Govern ment have talcen too serious a view of the difficulties of that situation—(Hear, hear) —that they have mis calculated as to the nature of the evils which now afflict us ; and that their remedy, although not totally inapplicable, is beyond and beside the occasion.—(Hear.) The view which the Government takes, as I un derstand it, is, that the financial difficulty, the enormous deficiency as it was called one evening, is the great evil N hid' we ought to remedy ; and that, as a subsidiary measure, we should make those amendments in our laws with respect to corn—with respect to raw produce— with respect to manufactures which the interests of the country m a y require. Now, Sir, my view, generally speaking, of the situation of the country is that our financial difficulties call for no such extraordinary effbrts as have been proposed ; but that there are serious difficul ties affecting the conreercial and manufacturing portion of our people—affecting our situation as regards our trade, and the future stability of our manufactures. It is to that second portion, rather than to the first, that our deep attention should be directed, and it is in that quarter that the ehi.f remedy should be ssaight.. (Hear, hear.) Let me obst eve, Sir, that the deficiency for the year, for which W e are now to provide, is stated by the Right Hon. Gentleman at about 2,570,0001. ; but that the proposal made first, of an income tax, and secondly, of taxes with re spect to Ireland, in order that Ireland may bear at least some portion of the public burden; and lastly, the amount of 200,0001. to be raised at h' me from other sources, will give us, as the total sum which the Right Hon. Gentleman pro poses should be levied on . the country, 4,381,000/. It is no', then, for our immediate financial deficiency ; it is not for the ing likewise to compete with foreign countries in the corn- I sensible of the evil of a continued inadequacy of the pus merce of the world, we should thereby be subjected in time to come to meet the public charges, and will take effectut very great emba rr a ssmen t s. e a 1821 Lord A s hb ur t on , then , sores for averti ng th e same i n future years. " With reMr. Raring, stated in th e House of Commons that hitherto ' the mode which should be adopted for this purpose, - their manufactures and commerce had flourished, because they taking upon me the office of Chancellor of the Excht had flourished without - diffieulty ; because they had not met think that most of the necessary measures which have with any competition in the markets of the world ; but the war suggested have been better than the propositions being concluded other nations would have the opportunity of Government. - (Cries of " Hear, hear," and a turning their attention to commerce and manufactures, and it There is one proposition which has been mooted in this was necessary they should take legislative means to enable and which perhaps is a tax not desirable to adopt if th-- - this country to m ee t th e diffi cu l t i es i t would have to no necessity for it-still I think it wou ld b e pre f era bl e toy encounter._( Hear, he ar .) H e ma d e t hi s statement i ncome tax- I mean a tax upon the succession of real e.7:g in presenting a p e titi on f rom t h e Ci ty of London, a petition perry equal to the probate and legacy duty on personal FL(' 4 which was generally in favour of measures that might be called perry. I know the Chancellors of the Exchequer, measures of free trade, in favour generally of the repeal and I amongs t them my Hon. Friend near me, and Lord Althol; i relaxation of prohibitions and restrictions. In 1830, Mr. have said, that there was a duty on the conveyance of 7: i Huskisson made a somewhat similar statement ; he said, as property equal to the amount of the probate and legacy was referred to last night, that this country could not go on But, Sir, although that may be true, yet I contend that it s' o f ) under their existing Corn-laws and their existing taxes, hay- leaves untouched a great proportion of that species •L it,;, ,,t ing to meet that competition in the markets of the world. He property, because a great portion of the landed prope a l , stated also, and I think it cannot be denied, that it was impose has gone on descending in succession from father to ' l eg ~ sible for the English manufacturer to raise his prices in foreign or to some near relative, for the last 150 ye s ' markets beyond what the foreign manufacturer would ask. His and to not one particle of this description of property dotetn: only resource was to reduce those prices, and in order to reduce duty on conveyances attach. Now, Sir, Ido not see any vee,: those prices it was necessary to reduce the cost of pro- why, if it be a great object to impose a new tax, a tax of 1 .7; duction, and for this purpose he must lower the wages- nature should not be adopted in preference to an income tax' t e of the persons employed in that production. Now this is a Then, Sir, there have been various taxes repealed, some 2 process which has been going on, with a few interruptions, for which might be reimposed, not taxes on articles of consetrer i g g a series of years ;we have now to encounter the competition ! tion, or articles of necessity ; but there had been taxes takesl de with foreign manufactures carried to a much greater perfection on four-wheeled carriages, on male servants, and other taxe s a '' than they were thirty years ago. We have to m ee t them in : a like nature, paid by the rich; and I etrn see no reason Ir; the markets of the world, and we have to meet them not only ' we should not reimpose such taxes, rather than i_npese, c e loaded with taxes, but loaded with burdens, which make the income tax.- From 1821 to 1e23 there were 6,000,0°) eg price of subsistence and the price of all articles of necessity, taxes reducei, and of this amount a sum amounting to rt°,,„et greater in this country than in any other country in Europe.- than 2,300 0001. was taken off the assessed taxes. The Rill, (Hear, hear.) What are those burdens ? Mr. Hume, in Hon. Gentleman, before he brought forward his prop e l` duties giving evidence before the Import Duties' Committee-a Com- made an allusion to what had been the result of incree s b ' i t mittee which tins year I may venture to quote, although last the assessed taxes. The Right Hon. Gentleman stated t d 1 year that Committee was the subject of general sneers and in 1840 the assessed taxes had been increased 10 per cent", 0 ., taunts by those w h o were t h en s i tt i ng on this side of the House, th e resu l t o f t h at measure had been to produce an actual . but with whom in 15342 its R e p or t i s a n ee d s o f authority, ! crease of 11 per cent. in the assessed taxes. This, therefl4 since even her M a j es t y ' s G overnment i s not ashamed showed that the produce of the assessed taxes has not 'user to act on the p r i nc i p l es i t l ays down. Sir, Mr. Hume, any ditniutition in consequ ence o f the imposition of an adds' , before that C omm i ttee state d , that, if he could buy ! tional 10 per c e n t., an d I th oug h t w h en the Right Hon. G e n e an article for Is., and that by the effect of law and pro- tleman made the statement, that he was about et tection, that arti c l e was ra i se d to I s. 6 d ., h e ca ll e d t h at ad- ' propose an inc rease i n the assessed taxes, as the for m er ditional 6d. a t ax .-( H ear, h ear. ) This is a principle which I experiment had a l rea dy so comp l ete l y succeede d . I n i ss , cannot be cont rover t e d ; w h e th er or no, ei t i s paid i nto the l in my hand a return moved for by Mr. Herrtbs Exchequer, th a t amount i s a tax, an d i s lev i ed at the expense 1 which shows what had been the effect of a reduction or of the great body o f th e commun i ty.- ( H ear, hear.) Sir, we i assessed taxes. A considerable reduction was made in the 0, proceeded o n th ose pr i nc i p l es l ast year-p: inciples not so much I sessed taxes from 1821 to 1831, and the effect of that redlgoir oe s admitted th en as th ey are now-we proceeded on that princi- I was to bring a greater change to account. The return ~.., id i Pie to say, that th ere s h ou ld b e moderate duties on the great i that at the ti me o f th e re d uct i on i t was est i mated that it w°4o articles of consumpt i on, wh i ch were effected by taxes of this 1 realise - 3,623,000 e, whereas it h a d actua ll y rea li se d no ' tic kind, and we t oo k corn, sugar, and timber, as the three great 1 than 4,271,000/., showing an excess over the estimated artic'es on which we p ropose d fi rst to proceed.-( Hear, hear.) 1 of 648,0001., showing that the operation both of an inergg I do not w i s h t o avo id , f ar from it, any odium that may i and of a diminution had been to increase the amount reali e o s"; attach to the Government of the present day of ! thus showing the buoyat.cy of this source of revenueg e , taking away protection from other articles.- ( Hear, hear.) (Cheera.) An increase in the assessed taxes has this ad" - tg , I3eeause the principle we stated as a general one, and though tage over the proposal for an income tax. If ye° P op; , we thought those were the main articles which first required . pose an income tax, you must set all your so ; I the attention of Parliament, we never meant that the same chinery in motion for a perioJ of five Y e t ot -., principle should not apply to all those articles to which the if afterwards you find that your revenue has increased, o r d e e tariff of th e Ri g ht H on. G ent l emen refers -( Hear, hear.) your establishments can be diminished so as to enable vout°o,-.g. On the- prese n t occas i on, t h ere f ore, I shall act en the same away vvith the tax at th e en d o f th a t per i o d , you w illla e ,1 , principl e as l as t year. 1 d eclared last year that you was acting curred all the unnecessary difficulty, and all the unneeeff e r i t r on a vi c i ous c i rc l e o f protect i on ; that your manufacturers are odium of the charge. You may lay on taxes en articles "_,, to take articles from the colonies at a dearer price than would are generally used. You mac lay them on windows ande e ' g (temper - late them, and that the colonies were to take oar manu- riages, which are obviously used, and you may easily take "; 00 factures at a dearer price than they could get them at other off; but if you impose an income tax which is to prodol os s ports, and that, in that way, you were acting in a vi c ious circle millions a year, because I think the Right Hon. Genti e tbs t '' of protection, instead of giving every body an opportunity of under-estimated the produce of the tax-you may be sur e , it I' getting every article he wanted at a moderate price. Sir. the the Chancellor of the Exchequer will be in no hurry to ts" ° , i s ,e first article to which I shall refer on w hi c h th e b u d ge t of last off.-( Hear, hear.) The tax is certain for three years-- -- " tee . s year was proposed, and I must refer to it now, because the probable for five years-and it is probable for five years or the Right Hon. Gentleman in his speech made what seemed to are years after that: therefore, Sir, what I should urge 00 - 0 a very u n f oun d e d argument against the proposition-that ar- House is, first, that this tax has been hitherto imposed 01 1 i; title is sug ar . A n argument use d b y the Right Hon. Gentle- times of extreme necessity-that it has been only imposed i man, and oft en repeate d b y ot h ers, to the effect, that if you re- Mg perilous wars with p ower f u l enem i es, an d h as b een ta ken et duce a duty, y ou cannot b e sure t h at b y i ncreased consumption on the return of peace-that hitherto Parl iament'w it 0 you will have any increase in the amount of that duty, or even -thought fit to adopt an income tax in time of peace-tint -0a the same amount for many years to come. He supported that pro- accompanied with inequalities, and with an ineu.: oo , . position by i nstances o f w i ne, rum, tobacco, and other arti c les. i n t o p r i vate a ff a i rs which renders it peculiarly ° w o e That principle may be very true, but that is not the principle which was the reason that Lord Althorp declared that it g o on which my Right I-lon. 'Friend proposed his reduction of the more unpopular, and more di stestable than any other tax, to t • sugar duties.._.( Hear, hear.) It was i n d ee d qu i te a diff erent in going to men ' s means to obtain an increase of revenue, eg one. My Right H on . F r i en d sa id , l ast year, that foreign sugar increase may be assisted and made so complete as to suOI"L e Y was subject t o a d u ty o f 63 5. per cwt. Now this is not a duty deficiency you require by taxes, much more just to the 7 0 4 0 which gives a cer t a i n revenue to t h e S tate which might be di- on whom they are imposed, and which can be taken off, _ g i st ' minished by a r e d uc ti on ; b ut i t i s a prohibitory duty, and one the necessity ceases. -( Hear, hear.) I should not despair ite s, ' which prevents, except in one or two extraordinary years, sugar a proposition which appears to me so reasonable would be g. from corning in from foreign colonies. Ai) , Right Hon. Friend cepted by the House, but that I observe it is declare u c io proposed to reduce this euty to 365., and very justly argued avowed thrtt the matter to be considered now, is not to P r° ges s ; that we might from this obtain a perfectly new revenue. Sup- for the necessities of the revenue, not to provide for deficie" gb ket , pesing, as has been said, that this encouragement should but that the business to be considered is to contrive V t be cause foreign sugar to displace a million cwts. of West India manner Hon. Gentlemen can best give their support e allS,s, production, you might say', deed that this was an unfair dimi- Administration of the Right Hon. Gentleman. With r e 44,,e• notion and hard treatment of the \Veit India interests, but to another measure, an Hon. Gentleman, the Member for A,. j , , , to .. s';! ~ I still, as a question of finance,' it cannot be denied that the lingford, had asked many Members if they would agree change would be gr. ally in favour of the revenue, for we a Corn Bill as they supported, if it had peen proposed by h". f s la should then have one million hundred weight from foreign and they all answered that they would not.-( Hear, hear 1 colonies, paying thirty -six shillings instead of the same quantity have at en it stated, over and over again, by Hon. Gent"' sof !! 1 from our o wn colonies paying '24s. dety..-( Hear, hear.) It i s t o th e i r const i tuents, t h at they were opposed to the Corrt - o gg t o i clear that the p r i nc ipl e on w hi c h H on. Gentlemen opposite which they passed-( Laughter)-which they had eoted ii i te o,gr i rely, is wholly inapplicable when they assert th .t this arid which they voted for contrary to their convictions.--(' 04 t e e chane in the t a r i ff would yi e ld no i ncrease to t h e revenue. In hear, and laughter.) I have observed that they t o, t; truth 'the Right Hon. Gentleman never touched my Right still more so against Ole proposed tariff-(Hear) oe eS il l Hon. Friend' s proposition at all.-(Cheers.) I s h a ll now t h ey v i ewe d i t with great alarm ; that the consequegese 'l t take the items in succession. My Right Hon. Friend said the of the tariff would be injurious to the farming interest 117se e s' other day that if you toil the average consumption of sugar rally ; but the question with him was not whether it eras g6,:k, s , for eleven years, there ought to bean increase of 312,000 cwis., or useful-(1 aughter)-but that they must support the. .f . ,, , ..' , and that by the duty he proposed, there would be an increase vernment of the Right Hon. Baronet.- (Cheers.) lge‘g t brought to the revenue of 587,0001. I think that was a very must say that that declaration makes me despair of th ioC, e fair estimate, and I do not see why the incontrovertible prin- successful in the proposition that I have to make. I tott cipl.e en which my Right Hon. F r i en d ca l cu l ate d s h ou ld not b e it, however, my du yto make it, and to offer that pro P ee o cs o e , r , admitted as part of the finan c ial resources o f her Majastv's to the Hou se o f C ommons as a means b y which I think rl oe f , 4 Government.-( Hear, hear.) With nspect to t i m b er, t h e avo i d the infliction of the tax More you. Those Gentle ' g et 1 Right Hon. Gentleman opposite proposes to throw away who have so ill-used the constituencies who trusted then' t of,- 1 600,0001. altogether on the timber duties.-(Cheers.) I agree their interests, tell me that if they opposed the Government of` that if the Exchequer wer e oserflowing, and if you had with the Right Hon. Baronet they would be aiding the eneen,'„ of i 1 perfect ease reduced some other duties, you might also make the Corn-law. I ask, what right have these Gentlemen _w e d, ; 1 a great reduction on the duties on Canadian timber ; that lam the bitter enemy of the farmer? I wish to P`"v i - but, in the present state of the finances, I think the original that which is en advantage to the agricultural interest. k id; , o proposition, to add 10s. to the duty on Canadian timber, and belief is, that you would have a more abundant stiP t P o l :per . 1 to take ss. off that on Baltic, would add considerably to the corn, aid ' in the first place, that those who would gain e , ; io ' 1 revenue, without being a hardship to the consumer.-( H e a r , food would have the means of purchasin'g more manufactur, e to st t hear.) That proposition, according to the calculation of Lord the second place, the manufacture r would give fresh empl°l t he it Althorp, would have given 750,0e0/. ;my Right Honourable in order to send goods in return for that corn; and 1 ,,,e0( s 1 Friend only to o k it a t 600 . 0 00 / . N ow, the other remain- third place that general prosperity would thereby ensue 3-1 s oo 4 ing article is the article of wheat, and my Right Honour- the labouring classes, agricultural and manufaCturinflegoe 1 able Friend has st a t e d, th at if t h e proposit i on of an that the agriculture of this country, stimulated by comPe t le be -' 1 Bs. duty had been appli e d t o a ll th e w h eat t h at had been would improve and advance ; its means of production We ° eet• e ls admitted last year, an additional duty of 530,000/. would have augmented, fresh demands would arise for this productiont e r s ae :-• 1 been received. A n argumen t was oppose d to t h at of my flight hops ultimately the price would not be greatly less than ° ot e ' 1 Hon. Friend, by the Right Hon. the Chancellor of the Ex- it at the present moment, but that price would be concor a tr inet. I, chequer. The Right Hon. Gentleman had said, that there was with the general well-being and welfare of all the ind e l.heef e S Q no proof that so grea t an amount o f w h eat would have pail classes of the c ommun ity. if t h at i s my b e li ef, what rig"- per a V the duty, and that it would have been a hardship to the con- they to rail at me as the enemy of the farmer, becaus e , s '' 1 sumer to have had that additional duty to pay, instead of 3s. ported that opinion -because I proposed •Sig 6d., or some su c h amoun t, w hi c h was t h e average of thought was a measure by which the ' farmer the duty. Why, so f ar f rom i ts b e i ng a hard- this country would obtain an advantage over the forettr d l i ffee- ship to the consumer, the consumer would have had (hitter ? But if I went further towards abolishing th e atii '' 4 the corn on bett er t erms th an h e h a d i t accor di ng to the law altogether, are there not men as friendly to the fernie r ... or 1 1 which existed last year.-1 Hear, hear.) We have it on record Hon. Gentlemen opposite who are in favour of such le Wet! that the wheat i n b on d f rom t h e mont h o f J une to the month sition ? Who has shown himself more devoted to ar c es ter e ' lof September, increased, I think, 225. in price. But if at that in the course of a long life than the present Lord Leir ogi re• - 1 period an 8s duty only had been paid, it is evident that, with Who in the present day has been more devoted to agri c o 1 0 0 . it an addition of Bs. only, and toot an addition of 225., wheat more fond of its pursuits, than Lord Spencer ? But th e eg ett ° _, - ,1 would have been brought into the market, not, I will allow, do not think that even the protection which I propose ° I ; at"' 'I that the seller would have sold it merely with an addition of Bs., be permanent ; they think that agriculture may fr u reile n he would have got his profit by it, but his profit would have unaided by protection, and without difficulty, against a lly w ere" . t been somewhat diminished ; that of the fon ign importer would competition. Are these Noble Lords enemies of the fargo the ' 1 have been somewhat diminished, but the whole of the Bs. duty that account? By no means. But those Gentlemen In' to be II would have been given to the benefit of the revenue, and not taunt me with being the enemy of the farmer, seemed .4 0 at the expense of the consum er , b u t a t t h e expense of the composed of the same heavy clay as are the acres -01 1 foreign importer, of the foreign g rower , an d o f t h e merc h ant they possess. They rail at me as the bitter o r eg es% 1 in this country, who made those enormous p ro fi ts ow i ng to of the farmers, because I am proposing a e° g th a t V yourabsurd law which, happily, you h ave now t r i e d to repea l , al- diminished protection as compared with that which dr though you have not placed a much better law in its place. have hitherto enjoyed. Have I been the b e dmeanS i r e 1 Sir, an observation was made last night, to which I must beg ceiving the farmer?--( Loud cheers.) In 1839 I ru b 4 e tec e V pardon for referring, as to the change which I was supposed to the world, and I declared in this House, that I thougo rig ul I have made in the proposition of a fixed duty. My proposition derate fixed duty was the best system on which the C i c o ot last year was, that there should be a fixed duty of Bs. ; but I could be established. In 1840 I declared my-self in ' 1 ! f th e I l stated to the House that I did not calculate th a t t h at d uty a similar alteration in the law. Most of the Membere f l o osh 1 would be enforced in times when there was a prospect of a se- late Government in this House, and some in the other _ er r 1 n et rO. I were scarcity in the country, and when wheat naturally rose to declared in favour of the same system, and was is f n tbe ° t he an inordinately high price ; and I proposed that the Queen in babe that his Noble Friend, who was at the head 0- id the II Council should have the power in such cases of remitting that vernment, and who entertained a contrary opinion, b e igg so; 1 duty. Now, that proposal was not founded upon any notion opinions of his colleagues, would have conceded the P ° oo rer 1 1 that it would be a real and actual benefit to the consumer it might thus have become a united measure of the Goveethis .1 t. that the duty should he lowered. If the importer can send Was there any deception towards the farmers ,i" t eete , , corn with a profit, as it is supposed he can, under the new law, (Hear, hear.) Was there not due preparation °f en ce? , I when wheat is at 625. or 645., how much more could he sell it Have they had due preparation in the present inf;', o Ole i with a profit when wheat inthis country is at 745. or 755. ? But (Loud cheers.) I was not the man who said that be wou - ' 1 I confess it appears to me, after the strong opinions fident, if his party was in power, the present protecti„ °° , Or ; that were stated by the opponents of a fixed duty be continued ; I was not the rnan who said that if sp li g l u ld , 1 7, , in this House aid in the country, that if different parties ration were made in the Corn-laws the Government igi tr" . 11 na so 1 should combine in order to force up the price of wheat in the faithless in making the proposition. I was not the gg or , o ii prospect of a scarcity, that it was necessary to have some means said that he had no doubt but the present Corn - ler t if I or another by which the prospect of a real scarcity, and when equivalent protection, would be continued, and that a '4 , prices rose ve r y hi g h, public discontent should not be excit e d, equivalent protection was not continued, he would fr pleac. rely view was that the law might on certain occasions be kept yet afterwards, in defiance of that romise, an d tho g oo t t g - 1 t back, so that it might be restored whenever an immediate ne- voted for the change.-(Loud cheers.) I, then, e w t 101 ti cessity is required-and I certainly had some fear upon eon. one who is the bitter enemy of the farmers ;it was " ° fi s the e . 1 sidering how many would cry out against the operation of the led them into this mistake, who induced them to el l e r o etete I law in such a case-I had some fear that if the law was capital in resorting to expensive processes, under Via there 1 then kept down by a clamour against the Executive there might that an injurious and vicious law would be maintained sr; 1 be a difficulty in maintaining the law till after that neces s ity sole purpose and benefit, so that thereby they couldh b i d t had ceased. With that view, therefore, I stated ti-at when to give rents for land which it ought not to yield. it, A n cr io %. prices rose very high, and there was a great scarcity, you been misled and deceived, and if they are angry thes e ‘‘. to might then provide by law for that necessity. Now others them so misled, let that anger be directed against t trY ng o have differed from me in that respect. Ido not say that I was had justly incurred it.-(Loud cheers.) Let them n ° _ 00 t he e right in that opinion; but still I must say it appears to me that, throw off on Gentlemen on this side of the House, g r"" vc r gi e hl; 1 with a fixed duty, you must look in some way or other to its Members of the late Administration, the indignation the jet being:taken off at periods when there is a great scarcity. But that been justly excited by the cii, , envery which, d ' . 11 ,g Bet el s I does not prevent, nor I think would prevent, the usual operati o n election, was an carefully concealed.-( Loud cheers ...) ci li a I of the law being such, that there would be a regular and constant those who have so acted, thinking, I supPiest sre supply of corn in this country; the price world be kept mode- the plans now proposed are the be e t e poi se/e e o0 : I rate; merchants would import corn as regularly as they would be obtained, let them manfully avow and make tn_ °n thes e h a ve °' t the cotton or any other article for which there was a demand ; and sponsible for any change of opinion they may een r e,, ....ro f .) ~,,i, that the necessity would seldom exist for making any alters - or, if they do not, they will justly excite the distrusttro of.„„ tion. The amount calculated by my Right Hon. Frier(' as who have confided in them, and incur the that which would be 'derived from his proposed alteration, was, country, whose interests they have neglected.-(‘ - '"" o f nele ll , 1 for sugar, 578,000 e ; for wheat, 530,0001. ; for timber, Sir, is it right after all, to impose an income, t, 31 •la er" . • tons' - is' I 630,0001. This. would give an increased revenue o f 1 four millions stet - ling, a tax which is of so inetnel a rose . , ) 1 1,717,000 L, and this without imposing any burden on the I racier, so partial, and so unequal, fur the _g c hee''t I people ; on the contrary, diminishing the taxes paid by parti- 1 suppoi title an administration ?-( Hear, hear, and C that a esli. , ' haw 1 cular classes to particular individuals-an increase of the pub- llf they can say that it is justified by public nee _ sa y I ~. I lie revenue, and at the same ti me an increase of the public 1 public necessity cells for this infliction, lam ready _ t e ° , rigb" I comfort and the public, happiness-an increase accompanied ! they are right in facing the difficulty-that they a .t i tai oil , i by no inquisition into private affairs, accompanied by ne ins- 1 imposing on the count r y a t ax , even unjust and P.asloned uric 1 15 I quality in its operation-an increaie from the most legitimate l it ma be, because publi c necess ity cannot be re a soned thi' l , o % I sources, and becomin g a Pa r li amen t which was anxious to pro- I But if, on the contrary, they are not convinced ' stiop erg es - 1 vide for the general welfare.-_( ch eers .) But, Sir, I must case of public necessity if it be only for the sake . of are ad"si 1 admit that if you proceeded to legi s late upon other articles, the tariff and the Administration of which theyyoo' P h ' ef 1 though and took them into consideration a t the s ame time, there would I rents, that they- impose this tax, I then say, that es, wet, the .. i l' be a diminution of revenue. The Right Honourable Ibe successful in its imposition at the present more"! s i ts o f ' 5 Gentleman h as t a k en t h e a lt era ti o ns in his tariff as 1 may depend on it, that such a sacrifice of the interests na . , ' causing a diminution of 270,000/. He has frankly I country to party views-( Hear, hear)-and I d le g g Y ta v r itr, s i ,„ ' i stated that he anticipates a diminution of 170,0001. on the ! avowed as it is with respect to the Corn-laws and to the re ati article of coffee, No w , I thitrle that on the article of coffee he which seems I.kely to iufluence them which regard.._ inte .., 1 has made an unnecessary sae ritice.-( Hear, hear.) He has ' come tax-I say, if they make such sacrifices Mu' er late r made a difference of no less than 100 per cent. between colonialcountry, then indeed the country wi ti r, ou S I produce and foreign produce- a m uch greater difference, I and I think it wi I not be long, say that the think, than it is at all necessary to make. My Noble Friend ' which they have elected whir other hopes, andwith , eo near me stated that he thought, for the purposes of revenue, ' tations, have betrayed the trust which Lord e tare d which might keep 6d. and 9d. as the duty. The proposition in them.- ( Loud cheers. ) The Noble , Tlrat it has been ~ iii , which was made by the G.) vernment last year was an altera. ! moving the f01i0.% ing resolutions :- the deficiency (eel, tion without much loss. It was a duty of 54. on colonial 'to this House, on official authority, thatt ro___ be es tans- . ( g ,: eofftse, arid of Bd. on foreign• Now, that was still a differential ' come to meet the expenditure of the A cou r r i l l, ry, 42 7) je at 2,3's°'t is duty of no less than 75 per cent. But I think fur the year ending the sth day of p _ , _ 69,000/. lbs. ~ o f that from that reduction you might calculate on and on the sth day of April, 1e43, at 2 5 continued inadequii:el et, an increase of ten per cent. on the consumption, and on a loss . House is fully sensible of the evil of a t charges, and will ta Tote - of no more than 70,0 1 0/., which with the other reductions, ' the public income to meet the public e rn o g f i:rt °' ; 'eld e s te gi would amount to 360,0001. And I think it would be better, fectual measures for averting rite sam s e n corn, bY a re `7 l , :t 0 was gen.eroounsicyluTiend ,bedi with respect to the 1,717,0001., t o leave a large portion of it, by a judicious alteration of the . dutien,ar, andan ad Justin . der in future in the present situation of the country, for the purpose of a of the prolebitory duty on foreign t s i, u ee further reduction of duties here& be combined Iwith an incere- . 1 earl i .e which the State may require. I should not propose, there- Price to the community may . 'ter, and for the contingeneies the duties on timber and coffee, fore, after taking away this 360,0001., to take the whole of the sts of trade will be veromo:, surplus, as there it. a deficiency of _2,570,000/. But I general consumption, the nacre venue to the State. wohibitery and differse _I:14, think also that you might calculate upon having pro. the repeal or reduction be various I will improve the ree n t u o s bably some t welve or thirteen thousand pounds, i n duties, and that extended commerce That the anic' e llast , the way of surplus, on these duties. You might at least while it gives employment to f in That .' m atldit'ion• a t ' o lva th n e t ts a e g the y. terminseion of ,if eool e . , take it at 570,000/., and you would only have to provide for taxes taken off, or reduced, o the 2,000,000/. in the way of taxa' ion. You would have two at ex 23.873,000/. That i ...,,,ne may be stated in round numbers.p eriod d e e j ; i 0 0 millions of deficit ncy to strike off by the imposition of new imposed in a war to the end of the year 11336, m clu , iyeof the tax " w the ion taxes. But, Sir, we are in a different situation now from that of come tax, having been first . iwar, oyes reP . sed' last year. You did not adopt the plans which we proposed to having been again ~ t er 1816 n tee e( you last year, and by which I consider a considerable portion the re-establishment of peace, and repealed 1 ,, , n gs emergency, and during a most perilous of the deficiency would have been aupplied, and I therefore on the . renewal fbos of i. w e a s r, was again Thanconsitlering the various lilt r i c e think that it is necessary to take some step ; therefore it is urination that I shall move the resolution; 11 That this House is pretty i o sti f l t U'i n n n e t o e t s l the present of life, or embarrassing trade, ts the "Y tiiti deficiency, without enhancing tnerefilion Lthii7 9 ? Lod that t fix t 1 belief,os Why ' l l . l, Governr. : „.,'ne . uttnost m ug interest ( 4. 'eQul at ed th 4 44.4 ; li t ( i t :e. P r r°tit Piked that t i' , l ,.. i gh n t' a b r. e ") t t i , :ti.: , vi k• t h i:44,l4tititizill as betthih t ena i tei j ge() u anr s sii t ,iii L e _c eatowed ;i tta , ery tax w . kttil t l which she ~im 'iner gency it 6 7. Pitt foui":d tut react the I tilt, -le found t,il4 was enffa D.. 1 . -1 to '' ' .-,, ed mail iI4C to large iik,; ; _i, in the first IC"o4tion of th 4 it '' ' f • ' I ~. t was n it, ' - ' 1 for a s ure4 i 'rnsut in ti ih e . 0 far w: tik I ncome tat ~t 1:, nf war, tit ,Iti `,., ;might be !' 4 4i l „ -rl ' e remic 1 1 , 1 1 i -- ' 4 IR the p 4119ittU,!..tr):: at t is in it iiaaT • wb: jui:ct t teh t ttt el. o Hansa su ase et t l h pot „ 4 " 1 „, for by ve bee ° CH ANCEL of t he,- ll_ to hear I i.ttgb.l -79er ellor o f s 1100. t i r 4 with 0 1 ' if - 10 ing th Are , in, th in (