The Sun. — London, England, 1820-05-13 00:00:00

1) Ait 1..1 A 1 E :_*i HOUSE OF WM DS, FII/DAY, MAY 12. The House proceeded in Appeals. The oaths were admin gtered to the Duke of Somerset, the Eatls of Suffolk, Ayle,ford, Gosford ; the Bishop of Cloyoe, -, snd Lord Gray. The Insolvent DehtOrs' Cont.inuance Bill was }•rt>u,;lr► „l► from the H , ntse of Commons by Mr. Clove .end othr Men►hets. Al!. :‘ , llson, from the &Ist India noose, pre scot,(l itt• s o,,tioos of t!ic Court of D . :lectors, re specting rnswns, sakries, &c.—Ordered to he . 1)1)0 ,, thv Tab!e. REMUNERATION OF FOREIGN MINISTERS. of La NsDowN. hrougiut I,trward noticed no ion 00 this subject. lie was prin cipally indut.ed to call the attention of the House to it by t!,e comidetation of this patticular part of the mcional expenditure being flow its nature more liable to tinettiation than most of the other branches. A contra-1y opinion, however, had been advanced on this point ; hilt it struck him that io no particular deptittment of the pnikjic ser vice was it more desirable that estimates should be laid annually before l'arliaarent than in this very branch. The scale of expenditure twist in a wear mewure depend upon the varying political citrmustances of the moment. This, though it enhanced the difficulty of forming correct •esti mates, vet he thought it the more necussary that it should he under the riequent control of l'at ha tnet,t ; and a view to soinc arrangetnent of the kind bt , i , g formed, he would move an Ad thess to his Majesty, pray;mq that there mitAtt he laid betnre the douse au Act:ount of all Salaties, .Clllowances, and reosions paid to Foreign Nlinis tens bi t - or e Lu s t ten years ;' which, on the ques tion, was fortlut‘ , ith orth-red accordit.gly. PREVEN'IIVE NIEASLTItES. The EaTtjtillanNLeY, atter-With)? seeming to advert to what had been said in the former discus oh t hi s sabioct, observed, that he still re rained his opinion that the old established law of the snit %1 as pet fee ty adeviate• to protect the country from the evils which were so strongly ap prehended, and thought there was of course no ttecessity for new, severe, Or unconstitutional en actthents. In these scwinsents lay the considera tion, (which he believed was well founded), that under tie new restrictive statutes, no oue convic- Inok place while several convictions 'occur red under the old law. For the purpose of bring ing till, imporianr consideration regolarly before t - ! eir L! , rdships, he should now move that there be laid before the House, a Statement of ttil Con victions antler arty'. , v Acts passed since the Ist day of December, 1310 witiell was ordered.ac c:ortiingly, • cASE OF THE REV. MR. JONES. The Order of the lily, upon which their Lord ships ,unthioned, being read, Lord IiuLLAND r SC, p; Stttttt to his notice, to call their 1.-idsliips! atirntiou to the case of this Rev. Gel , tleinan. His Lordship prefaced his mo tion, (minded upon Alf Jones's netition, with a bptertt of ',cry e'insidto able lentil. The petition, • I ns Lordship ohseivrd, which he was about' to present to the !louse, was founded upon a eit cumstance which took place in September last, but it. cidental or unavoidable cirenins otters cans fte t 1 ,1,1 of the presentati .n to this 'period. ;Ilr'let:Hied it upon , he veli.le the more eligible way 'o state the circninstances, accompanied with Iris reattlts and a nimadvelsioos upon the case he fe:t it incumbent upon hint to make, than that their Lor,:ships should proceed to the the petition in the first i ns t a nce, 1-l e bed no! 0. , 1y given the most serious attention to the subject himself, but be had, by the desire of the Rev. petitioner, communicated is tenor to those most likely to be 4ected by its allegations; and this mode lie thought would he the most ad. vaniageous way 01 introducing the motion which Ile Meant to (Mind upon the allegations. The pe titioner, he slated, was a Clergyman of the Chinch of En.4land, and regularly ordained in the diocese of Esete.r. A tew months ago a county meeting of the inkabitants of Devonshire took place, for the purpose of considering the propriety of peti tioning Parliament, with a view to the grant of no more indulgences to our Catholic fellow-sub jects The petitioner attended, and spoke at the meeting, in answer -,;tincipally to what had been advances( by a Rev. Brother, uho was in favour of the object for which the meeting was called. Not long after this the petitioner bad some eccle siastical preferments tendered to him, which were situated in the dioceses of Lincoln and Peter borouelt, In order t o v a lify him for i n stituti o n, it was necessary he should obtain testimonials as to his character and competencyfrom two or three Clergytnen of the Diocese ; these he had rept -larly procured ; but it was also necessary . that tht se testimonials should be countersigned by the Bishop of the Diocese; but in this last procedure, to ilia great surprise and injury,. the Bishop re. fused to countersign the testimonials. By the Prelates, in whose Diocese the preferments con ferred upon him were situated, he was informed that it was an invariable rule that the testimonials sho:ild he eouniersigned by the Prelate at his OW a Diocese betore his institution into the liv ings co411;1 take place. In the petition it was alleged, that the petitioner had personally appli td to his Diocesan, who assumed to himself the right of refusing his counter-ignature without as . - sighing any reason for so doing. Yet it appeared be did admit that his reasons were not for any de- feet in competeocy or moral character. He after w.►rds learned that the refusal proceeded from his alleged holding certain language in a speech he cn,*(le at the said county meeting. The petitioner offered proof that he had never t►ird such words ; but he never had an opportunity of rebuiting or • • disproving the charge alleged against.hito ; and in consequence 1),; was consttained to relinquish pre fermeirs which would have bronght him in five hundred ponitils , a year. So that for no clerkal or moral offence whatever wal Mr. Jones con strained to mike such a sactifit:e of his profes sional hopes au t! prospects in life ; and he learned farther that he had little or no remedy at law ; and he was, through the treaTmcitt he 'hen re ceived, rendered a waked and stigmatized person in ihe Diocese. lie Was, however, snffered to remain to the Curacy which he hch! icy the county of Devon; Their Lordships must feel what ef fect such a treatment must have with reapeet to all free expression of rentiment ou the part of the far greater portion of the Cleve)? in Foreland. — The name of the petitioner was the Reverend John Pike Jones, and the seat of r , ia Corary, Ndrih Ptivey, in the Connty.of Devon. lie ad jured the House to consider the effect of such an aas t oundon of power pi) the part of Djocesaos ; mid with respect to the idea of such t man as the petitioner recurring to the legal Tttbon ii in such a case as the present, which involved a question of power on the pa-t of Dioreseatts, how was.a poor Curate, at 80t, per stilton!, to contend against the whole Prelacy of E o gand His Lordship then more partictll3 , ly adverted to rite charge made ageriut the pe'itioper, that not oine.tencits of the Clergy of Ettglaitit, or la ther the approbation of the A•haeasian Creed, particularly its damnatory articles, believed in what they so sigoed. But when the tenor of his argument, and the general conduct of that speech, ,vas considered, he, as alleged, must consider that such part of Mr. ifllles'S speech was improperly or ineorrec:ly reported. What he had said seemed rather to apply to cer tain tenets in the [impair Catholic faith or creed ; and for the purpose of proving that he was mis represented, the PeritkiWt had not only adatteed arguments, but references, that he court ow, o r did not so express himself. His Lordship then animadverted at some length oil tne nature and tenderey of the Creed of St. Athanasius, and re ferred to the expressed sent intents of several high and learned Ptelates, and other lumivaties of the English Reformed Church, ire order tut strew that several of those had gone greaaer lengthy in tin pnuing the 41.01111 es of that Creed than what it was asserted had been expressed by the peti- He, alnotig whets, instanced the senti ments t xpreased by Archbishops sou and Tennison, of Bishop Burnett (who had said, that hp believed not CO out of 100 of those who had aimed the articles, h - ad actually read them) ; awl of that admirable writer, Archdeacon Paley. Some of these, and other clerical writers, opetey ex pressed their disbelief in the darnnatory articies of the Athanasian Creed. - Yet for not going ‘tc tar (eveo admitting that the allegation was correct), the Reverend Mr. Pike Jones was to he sacrificed st: gr.n a ii t ied. lowards" coniclio,ion, the Noble Lora sovonterlYeited upon whir: was Said by ;Mr. Prefee,h,ey D.!i1111S, IZI his ConvOentio . prtictibiri6nth r c ct tit tVil at he s hio tit , R e v. Prelate (Clerk of t:e floy:t1 Closet) raving s(4tCd that a Great PerSoe.ee would wi!bhold is assent to a Bill in favouV of the Ca:htilie were it passed by "both Houses of - Parliament --e l'orsoing this strain of argument, and glancing „• the lanatiage belt! by a late Rev. Prelate, •ot part of the doctrinal or dogmatic tenets of the Church. which hi regarded as it sp.:cies of re bosses or conitntlrtima—(A Lordship proceeded to consider the praencability of such d man as the petit inner hoping flir a - iia7fe - qoate re medy at law. OU thishead, however, he admit ted himself to be nought of a profound Lawyer ; but he considered, upon the whole, that the - most likely mode in such a man as the petitioner, was by laying iris case humbly before the Legislature, as .wits the course now adopted. • It %vas his in tention to move, after the Petition shookd be read, for the appointment of a. Committee to inquire into the allegations of the Petition of th e fl e Ar.. J. P. Jones, and the state of the Law respecting the hystitution of (iltrgyinent into vaesot fiees. and to report thereon to the House. Th e P e tition was then lead, and a s tpearea •o the effect stared by the Noble Lurd, who afterwards - moved as above. The Milton of EXETER rose—He did not feel himself, he observed, called upon to enter i n to any of thoSe details or animadvetsiona into which the Noble Laid had gone so mach at large, but ,would, as was all that seemed to him to be neces sary, confine himself to such of the allegations of the petitioner as personally referred to What had been said of the County Meeting was, believed, correct ; but not so with respect to what the petitioner alleged as to his belief of his (r he Rev. Prelate's) motives for declining to countersign the Testimonials, baying proceeded from the petitioner's making a speech in favour of the Roman Catholics. hare petitioner was pre sented to two livings, and had applied to him to countersign his testimonials. It was, he should observe, an invariable practice, anti of very ancient •usage, and he believed never omitted, that such a sanction should be received. When the peti tioner presented himself, he distinctly said to him, that his decision in this instance, had no reference to those opinions which he _(sw petitioner) had expressed. Thst liv was at full liberty to hold his opioions and with respect to himself, he (the Nev. Prelate) hoped for the same indulgence for his own opinions, which the Noble. Lord oppo. site claimed, in holding the claims alluded to in a different• light front the Noble Lord, and from those who-thought with him. 'lle principle upon which he'acted oft the present---occasion had al ways ruled his conduct ever "since he presided in his present diocese, which was more than 13 years. In his declining to countersign these testi monials,' be must distinctly disclaim that his mo tive had any reference to the speech referred to ; and the petitioaer knew that he bad so disclaimed it. lie thought he could trot he regularly called upon to state why he had so declined, because be had a clear discretihnary power vested in hint so to do. His own conscientious jrulgtoent ap proved of his conduct on the occasion. He had acted from the best of that judgment. He had investigated the matter with the greatest care arid, instead of the case bring lightly treated, be must beg leave to say, tire vet v reverse was the tact. It was true, lie had received letters deriving what was asserted ; brit, on the other hand, he had received information from persons in habits 'of intimacy with the petitioner, and he had re ceived letters corroborating vrbat he had heard by word of mouth, and he begged leave to say, that the three Clergymen who signed the testi monials a ire pet feet ly ignorant of what hail passed, awl when they received information of it they beg ged leavp to withdraw their testimonials, which documents' of course fell to th.e grotrud. Doubts may be entertained by some as to the power of a Bishop in such. a case, hut in Lis own view of it, informed as he was by persons 'every way worthy tioner. credit, and not mealy those who had signed the testimonials, his conduct was perfectly satis factory to his own cotiteitnce and . his jiidgment. The petitioner 'says, that by "the elect of his (the Rev. Prelate's) refusing to countersign, lie was debarred from. all legal remedy. Ile begged leave to say, that the petitioner actually had a remedy in the Courts below ; and even were there no such remedy, he (tl►e Rev. Prelate) felt that he was bound in conscience to act as he had done. It was also stated, that though he refused to authen ticate the testimonials, still he permitted the pe titioner to retain a minor preferment; btit in thiS he conk say that - he was actuated by considera tious.of feeling.—(l-tear, hear o—Atid he most again repeat that he had made every practicable ingaity into the circumstances of the case, at least daily for three weeks, and the result was such as to determine him to act,as he had done. Lord ERtKIYB contended that the petition ought to be received, because be conceived that the.con , inct of the Right Rev. Prelate could not be justified in refusing to countersign the ;est imo trial 0, the petitioner. All the reason given by the Right., Rev. Prelate for the refusal was, that lie had made inquiries and found the tel te net's of the Ciergymau were not such as he ap proveft. But it was the duty of the Prelate either to countet sign Or give such reasons as might enable rho.. pe , itiouer to jostify his conduct in a Court .nt Justice. No - man had a greater vetter4tion tnr the Liturgy of the Chinch o EnAantt than him !selt ; but at the sane tin e, theie were parts of the Ailiatia*i.n Creed from whit it some of the Clergymen of our ClAirch diff:red. It Aes ;here iore a g ri e vous thing tti:t a Asian of good moral conduct anti correct religions principles; should for such an itriagtriary offence as thiS, be deprivci, of his future prospects in lite. Some , . hing: ought to be done, and a law should be iotrocl,kieed, to. prevent such an abuse of power at this. Loup CHANCELLOR }.hied ,it it was fitt,.hat the House should for, monaent qin, Mqp , lion, for the purpose of institcting an, inqpiry, whether the Bishops int England should be coin pclied to nepait from that lint of discretion they, had right to exercise whit respect to the infe 7. rior Clergy. The Canon law kid down no rule upon the subject Every Bishop ita the poy.er countersign a Cicrgyrnates testimonium, 16. it tiley hioke ,l upon that 'act es r•:!.:0,,g :note tAan in,-.tter of course, they failed {4l ii,t per kJ)" MaliCe of their duty. Jr vi+As, the duty of the Bishop to eX" amine whether ripe pe,ti,on proposed to! a living, Vi .53 tit to have one iu.•hoi.diocese. ItaDt'e the lii.hop had exercised an improptr tuts, err I WO,• it" c'•raplatning pc: .3r had a remedy in a Unutf:o;_LA.V. ; it Was sio' ror Parliament to . eriteroan. tit t h kind, or to adopt any n 7 bad object to alter the law of , ne .vas r,••; a individual cast g that suE.Aild heir Lonia.6ps make so material a departure from the usages of the j co.int ry 'l'be Earl of CARIVAAVON observed, that the Right Reverend Prelate loAd assig , ,,l no reaaon wha'ever toF7t0”:„;:g to sign .itioner's tes tinroniun ; consequently cf . con-. ;ning an un fortunate indivi:!ual to ruin, He upon th.e principle of the Spanish Ini!o;sirio, by making secret inquiries, and acting owthe i•t',or t n o tion h e received without affording the accts . d an oppor-_ tunity of defending himself. The Hte.res'.3 of all The Clergy and patron 3 in the kiT.:;dom tcquiret: that the law should be clearly down on thi; subject. As to the Athanasian Creed, he would ask whether the Rev. Prelate himself believed or approved of its doctrines ? It was well known that there were Bishops in this country who did not believe that Creed. Here the Noble Earl rend an extract from a book published by a Bi shop .of Lincoln, in which it was. asserted, that the Athanasian Creed was composed 100 years after the death , of St. Athanasius, and in whieh the Bishop declared to be an untortnnate thing, that such unqualified expressions as those con tained in it should be used. The unfortunate however, whose petition was now the subject of debate, bad lost his living, and had all his hopes destroyed, merely for saying that 9-tenths of the Clergy held opinions, which one of the Bishops of the Established Church oat think it incon sistent,witu his duty, his rkliH.ons !Lows, or his ecclesiastical character, to eni.ci:ain, and to pub lish to the world. The Marquess Of LaNspowNti„said, that after what had taken place - that night, and the little disposition that was sheen to defend the conduct of the Right Rev. Prelate, he could not abstain, as an individual, from calling their Lordship's' at tention to the situation in which they were placed by the right that was exercised by the Right Rev• Prelate in the exercise of what he was pleas ed to call his principal duty. But what did the Right Rev. Prelate mean had . told theist that he telt himself authorised, perhaps he was so legally, to receive accounts of the character of an individual, not from the pat ishioners among whom he resided, and towards whom he had discharged the duties of .his sacred office, but to go to. a dis tance in order to collect testimony as to particular expressions, and on the ground of that testimony, to inflict the most cruel punishment. Though there were persons, who, like the Right Rev. Prelate, might feel indifferent to all views of promotion,' still he might find an apology in the weakness of human nature, for no unfortunate Curate who might look forward to some advance ment in his humble and obscure situation.— (Hear, hear !)—But the contrary was•manifested by his conduct. He had used his discretion to blast those prospects, merely because lie bad - ex- excised his tree privilege as a Briton, and without any allegations against his moral conduct, had refused him the means of cotoradicting the fact for which - he was to be twined for life. But mark the most extraordinary part of the Right Rev. l'relate's conduct; he had felt himself justified in refusing the means of defence, anti yet Out of pute.good-nature, as a twitter of feeling, had per mitted him to 'retain his curacy. One of .two things must follow, either the Petitioner was most cruelly and barbarously used, or 'he Right Reverend Prelate had neglected to perform his duty, which was to have removed him altogether. He did not sce that any legal remedy couLl be obtained, and theretote kit indebted to his Noble Friend for raving brought the subject before the Ilouse—(l.lear.) The Bishop of LANDAFP snpported what fell from the Reverend conduct (of Exeter), in the prop rieiy of whose he coincided.. The Eirl of CARNARVON spoke shortly in rx• planation. The Bishop of EXETER was about to comment on the observations which the . 133r1 of Carnarvon had explained, when Lord ,Polland called him to order. The House then divided on the question as Follows _ Contents -85 Non-Contents - • Majority agaisisi Motion.. —l7 At nine u'Cluck the 'louse adjourned till Monday. HOUSE OF COMMONS. The SPEAKER took the Chair this day at a fecv• minutes bettire•toor - o'clocii, when several - Mein- . hers took the "oaths and their seats. AGRICULTURAL DISTA.ESS; • • • • Mr. CHARLES, DUNDAS presettled ti petition rota Newbury, in the County of Berks, praying fhr a consideration of thwdistressed state of•tb . e agticul rural parts of the community, with a vi e w to the :Adopt ion of s" me t;neasures of relief.-01 tiered to lie .on the table. Lord TEMPLE presented petitions from certain occupiers of land ii► the County of Buckingham— from Newport Paged—from the Southern part of he County—and from the whole County, prising Ow a Parliamentary 'it vestigatiim might be . in stiNted into the distresses or the , :igriettlturiste, irk nraer that some plan might eventually be devised or their relief. On the question that these petitions be broiNht Mr. Hama remarked on the numbers of peti -t ions of this description -witch w ere rlrtly clowin K into the Hintse. He objecron'id offer to an inquiry taking place, but he h. a ed Gov ilonfie to consider that it sv, , s not +he a;;4nenlturat class alone that snffered. The 'coinn:erei.d awl ckSses suffered equally, an , : were erinally: !it not inure deserving ot tie altei.tion n t the House. When the House came :0 the considura. ''rout of the commercial distresse , .4 the c •ntury, he hoped . they would set the propriety of - 11%1114 'off, instead of adding to the re‘ttictioos of w oe• commercial sys ern. The petitioners th,,n be , •tre 'the House wonlct fain persuade them , o a rontrary cow ; hut' he hoised it would' not be torgotten,• that the' Bill which the Agrtctoturists had alfeady' obtained trout the Legidattire was exclusively f?;Voor ; and ncrtt 00) VOl)sidel at ion would infinence then) in the steps it might be thiongbk pr per to take. Mr. Ivan, EN said, that if the Hon Genlemart who had s j,,st spoken bad tak n the trouble in tools at the petitions before the House, lie Wonld haves seen that the prayer of the Agricultioia , s was not ,for immediate relief ; hut, that an inquiry might_ be instituted 400 the state of the couurry. That this was a reasonable req , est,ao one could doubt . , who was at all aware ot the great increase of the dicress which bad so long prevailed. The great numnets of the labourin, classes that were daily' losing' employment 'was iticalculable. The sole' attection - of the farmer was directed to see-hove tar he coo: , ! from, an addi to it, Under greatly re. ti'tl to see the :t its which %vete nyik.i.ng irte fl owle t o 3::,:•r=1::*. P_Z!'icultural (rpm Eke inse;-.Ets. Both these interests int-I,' usl'y demanded the wiention of Patlimnent,:.: El , . regretted to hear an Hon. Member (General, Ga7voigne) sound the air:: a for rner evening' ago, Ist the encroacht-..- of the agriculi urak class. He was firmly ;: , :t.3natied that no measure , could be taken witich benefited the one, without doing good to the other. It was true,- as Ora Honourable Member had said, that the. C,ttru had not answered, It had trot, undoubtedly ; ptic the agriculturists were not to be blamed for that. He was anxious that - sorne mode should fietriett, to lighten the taxes ; and be was afraid that n 0.. .- thing effectual could be adopted for that-purposep without an attempt to lessen ate NatiOnal Debt. l IVithout that were effected in some shape or sow titer, he was sure nothing would avail to bring fly back to prosperity. \ rrl'tort adowing some p:aut of that description, it 1.7.:G5 only potting off the evil hour, and increizio?; the tlistrestat of the country. General GMCniGNE protested against going ihtew a premature discussion of. this queition. The Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Curwen) was either not present, or had misunderstood him, w• , en,he re" presented him as sounding 'the alarm - st. flee agriculturists on a former evening.. not have been said than had fallen (rot., that occasion ; end had he acted up to extent of his duty, he should have been °Vim say much more. lie had, hoWever, objected entering into a discussion of that description, wl‘f.: so much irritation existed throughout the count:Y. respecting it., They were told ; in these petition' , that the'principal cause of the distress was o ' l importation of corn. The object of the Pet tioners, therefore, must be — tel . riiise - thelprice corn, and increase the vahre of land; and wide' these circuMstances,.he would not be, doing big duty, unless he stated, as his opinion, thtit it t;' sense of the whole country were taken, it wont" be found that not one in twenty was orthat 'niOn. He had that day received a letter from 04 'veral respectable Manufacturers in the - c ountP , consulting hitn on the propriety of calling.,a mee t d ( ing to counteract the (Alcoa of the agriculturio combination. He had replied, that these o!jec i l must be more folly detailed, before liesoulrti vise any interference. This, at least,, served t o, shew that all classes were not agreed in . 0 question. Sir JoHN w „r- he NEWPORT said, in' the ords t hc late Spe-aker, that the doors of the H ouse otts‘, to be thrown wide open to petitions.; and Yv l l . o those complaining of agricultural distresses 1: 40 so numerous, wOnld or ought the tt , itsi to re t o to'inquire ?—(flear.)=—He „had no objectie" to receive Petitions from all quarters, relatit4 4 . e , trade and manufactures; but as soon as ttoY „, lacing to agriculture were podncred, certain,irr Gentlemen thought it right to interfere , 91 ". pose them. When agrienlturits were fished, nianofacturers Foist the best ma et their commodities. LQl'd TLAIPLE: saitr, that the Petitioits be tig‘ !! 1, 0111( 11, iie 1 , 11. 110 411 test h u „ .i If ~i ~n , , Plost 11, e boo, '4) 11 - 411si, th,. 1 11, O wn 164 t si A ct 1, 14 4 i 411e%1 ill'', ficit %till tor VI I Pet) L hi any Arft cii, tr;