The Sun. — London, England, 1849-03-23 00:00:00

THE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY EVENING, MARCH 23, 1849. dissatisfied with the arrangements of the Turkish Govern ment, who had shown the must praiseworthy anxiety to meet the wishes of the inhabitaptz, for N:bile, on the one hand, they had givt n an amnesty to the parties engaged in these disturbances, en the other they E how(d an auxious desire to investigate complaints and make inch reforms as would be likely to sat;sfy the reasonable de mands of the people. He agreed with his Hon. Friend the Member for Bradford that it was most &sirable to f„, nee to other products would show a result no less f ar arable to the former then that to which we have arrived as ropects the most important branch of our facturing industry."— (Hear, hear.) He f1101.11(1 be t' letthat these' goods were only sent to Turkey in iransins to others parts; but should we even enjoy this eat.tr.g if Turkey were in the hands of Russia? And if that event should happen, how long would Persia re main independent? It would be urged that the aid of smugglers would be called in to prevent the exclu la of our goods; but this would only operate as a miti gation of the evil, and not as a cure. He did not call on Government to resist the progress of Russia by ar maments or war, but by giving its assistance to Turkey. N ot long ago the Noble Lord the Secretary for For ei g n 'airs had said, that when this country gave advice, it t: s always listened to, and never spurned. Let the Noble Lord exert the moral influence of Eugland to prevent the en croachments of Russia, and give support to a country I ° identifi e d w ith our best interests. Had the Noble Lord been more alive to these matters, a great deal of harm t tglit have been prevented. If last year, when Russia ti rst entered Moldavia—which she did with great hesita eons disavowing the General whose act it was — the No ble rd had assumed a firm attitude, and used determined language, and had shown that the proceedings in Molda• , Were looked on with the greatest distrust and the most determined aversion by the British Government, Russia would have soon retired altogether. If the Noble rd laid the papers on the table they would see whether 2 Was wrong or not in attributing to the Noble Lord a "Mt of determination, and he therefore hoped the papers leould not be withheld.---(Hear, hear.) t Colon e l THOMPSON would state to the house the :evens which, in his opinion, gave an importance to the motion of the Noble Lord. Honourable Gentlemen who b or e in the habit of looking around upon the political izon might probably have felt some suspicion that the position of England, like all other sublunary things, si ts b . very far from stationary. It had been said b y a dHonourable Baronet in that House , but wh o m h e " I d not then see in his place, that the naval supremacy this country, upon which their forefathers had for so It nY years prided themselves, was not to be calculated tn as an immutable thing, certain to descend to their e ildren. They saw a great republic growing up on the Other side of the Atlantic, the members of which did not 'Pear to be always actuated by the best of feelings towards I' 4 country. He had seen an American guide - book which 2 1 ,tilutely been published, and he was curious to see in m 'at manner it might indicate the sentiments of the People of th a t country. The writer of the book said at, upon passing the Horse Guards, be thought of the t i hte when 50,000 American troops should be drawn up 1 ,; 1 array behind it; and while gazing upon Windsor 'itstle he thought that many years might not elapse be ',are he saw th e fl aun ti ng bunting on its towers replaced 7 the modest stars and stripes of the great repub li e. —(Laughter.) Looking round upon what was pass ing in the world, he could not help thinking that the ground was shifting away from them; and as with Ire 4ice, Genoa, Holland, and other countries in Europe, so p ith this country, there might be a time coming when they would hold their ground, it must not be upon chits old foundation, or upon the supposition that they could hand down to their posterity anything like the co mparative or relative power which Er gland had en- Sled i n past ages , un l ess they could contrive to make str uggle somewhere and with somebody in the great juggle which everybody knew was going on between a t 'lliZatioll and political liberality, against barbarism and de spotism. He was anxious not to omit any of portunity of holding before the eyes of the Government, which, P : t haPs, might not be blind to this subject, that there t he same position as that held by their ancestors in the ' ri le' of Elizabeth and Cromwell—the woman and the 1 114 a to whoua their greatness was mainly owing. —(Hear e 111 ..) He believed that there was a great weakness of ar gument t among Hon. Members on the opposite side 131:°11 this subject. He did not wish it for a moment to thou g ht that he was pleading for war; he hated it, end great warriors had said so before him.—(Hear, e Itea —) He earnestly trusted that the Gover nment would consent,i to lay before the House some informa tion to fh 9w that they had felt an interest in the subject.— rar, hear.) Such being his view of the importance of f " ,e question brought forward by the Noble Lord, he e '!_ great pleasure in seconding the motion.—(Cheers.) i li Lord PALMERSTON said he should best discharge „, 1 duty to the House in rising after the seconder of the motion in in order to state the view he took of the motion lih,ja Noble Friend. He fully retained the opinions his il t ) ote Friend had quoted from a former speech of his— (4 it was desirable for the interests, and creditable to he honour of this country, that the House of Commons shouldti; take a lively interest in the foreign relations of 18 country. And he owned that it was sometimes a 41 !tter of regre t to him, when out as well as when in Q;', l ee, that the foreign relations of the country should it cue so little interest within those walls. For although h e taight be inconvenient to the person filling the office had the honour to hold, that the frequent discussion ‘)I these questions should be intrt duced, yet any man oho felt that he was honestly discharging his duty must 4 `-' I E at least for the support of the majority of that douse; :c 1 he need not say that that support would greatly st rengthen the hands of any Minister in his relations with 'foreign, Powers. Nevertheless, he did not feel it eon tlltent with his duty on the present occasion to consent t i / 1 the motion of his Noble Friend, for the reason that ° napers he called for were connected with discussions ~,, "tell were still going on, and it was the universally re ii?Zised rule of that house that inconvenience was ,: k „ te l to arise from tro unfiished corre cY dence respecting he ma p tter d uction s which of were still pending. h (Hear, hear.) He could assure the Noble Lord that g was greatly mistaken if he supposed that the ques lioll to which lie had called the attention of the Millie e ras ll not considered by the Government as one of great n ational and, indeed, of European, importance. was Suite ready to agree in every word that had fallen from e Noble Lord as to the necessity of m aintainin g the l4 i ki ucpendence of Turkey. It was of vast i m p ortance th in i ally a it potical and a comme p of view. wasP hardly necessary ial to go oint into any argu 'its to show, that it those vast regions which were at wit debt under the dominion of the Sultan were to be par -4,loned a m ong the other powers, that could not be done 11, t :thout a great European contest, without material de d d n gement of the balance of power, and without great i!triment to those powers which did not share balan ce the spoil. In short, it would derange the existing of power in Europe. And es England could ne ither wish for, nor possess, any share in the spoil of inch a transaction, she certainly could not share in such transaction. That opinion was not confined to this i °antr. he House might be assured that the other ding powers of Europe were equally sensible of the great importance of maintaining the ictegrity and inde tadence of the Turkish empire. That independence 1 4(1 been recognised and cared for in the treaty of 1841, ) ;:q . regulating the passage of ships of war through the i .ardanelles. He was satisfied that none of the great rowers who were parties to that treaty would attempt to infringe the principles so solemnly recorded in the pre ,uble of that treaty. Her political independence then L . 43 admittedly of great importance. Commercially, t he Noble Friend had in no degree overstated v e case. It was true that there was no country th ah which they had great commercial transactions , i ,et the tariff was so law or so liberal as in Turkey. ha trade with Turkey was, besides, en annually in creasing trade; so far from having reached its maxi 420ea, it was still advancing, and it the improvements W hich were being carried out in that country still con tihaed, b which increasing security would be afforded () indi v id u y als and property, and greater protection to the oc cupations of industry and the employment of ca p ital, 1 45 Y would find with that their commerce increasing, not th rl ( l 3 Y with. which but with every trading nation; and . 3 e regions were formerly the centres of human a nd would again approach their former condition, in creasing their connexion with Turkey would be of annually a nd importance. Under these circumstances, ik l with these views, it would have been a dere 'titaa of duty on his part if he had seen with apathy 4 , 11 d indifference the transactions which, in any way, 1 ° wever indirect, appeared to boar upon the indepen• de uce,, of Turkey—and such undoubtedly must be the Vnia facie appearance of the occupation of two provinces Turkey by a neighbouring power. Explanations "e given at the time by the Russian Government, and L (:) ,,kmunications—some verbal and some written — had n ever since going on between himself and the Ruse 47e11 0 Minister at the Court of St. James's, and between t he Russian and Turkish Ministers at Constantinople. There representations had been made in the most friendly spine —in the spirit of those friendly relations which !zisted between that country and Russia. They had been received in the same spirit—and whatever the com munications might have been, the House might be antis fied that in no degree had they produced any alteration in the friendly relations between the two countries. When the occupation of these provinces first took place, l i t_ ci rcu l a r was issued by the Ru ss i an G overnment , w hi c h " 0 held in his hand , stating the reasons that had in anced Russia to sanction the advance of Russian tr oops, and stating the co ntingency under which t hat advance bad taken place, and under which l h e occupation wou ld cease. The general groun d It which the sanction was given —he said the °ltnetion, because he belie ved that the immedi ate ad - Va rlee was from a communication between the Turkish a uthorities and die Russian gen eral commandin g —but t hat was sanctioned afterwards by the Russian Govern iskent, After stating the grounds on which the advance P assage, taken place, the circular stated, in the following Psage, the contingency on which that occupation would ,lePend. Count Nesselrode said, after alluding to a for. m ew occupation, " The same thing will happen this time - 1 8 ° • and from the moment Wallachia and Moldavia s hall have order re-established, or that the Porte thinks t t) has acquired a sufficient point d'appui for the en ire peace of the two provinces, our troops shall be with drawn, end shall again re-occupy that position Ii Was defensive which they originally occupied. " Was of course open to anybody to say that when he viSeed confidence in the views of any Government, he ry as likely to be deceived. He (Lord Palmerston) could Only say that whatever might be urged en either the o ne _ side or the other as to the grounds on which the ,7eupation took place, that he placed confidence in We' R us.sian Governmnt, and that he believed th4 t l no intention of f making a permanent encroach ey • went upon the Turkish empire, and he was es rtainly co nvinced that the question pending between the Russian G overnment and the Turkish Government was merely a question of time, and not one of principle or of ulterior in tentions. Since the events had happened which bad a gitated Europe, the Russian Government had shown a great desire to remain in an expectant attitude, and had 1.(1 ,.t interfered in the internal affairs of other countries. ua grounds assigned for the interference in the present in stance was the revolutionary movements of these pro • v : l ees, and their being supposed to be connected w i th r tieh more extensive arrangements, and that it was to , Hard her own provinces from extensive movements that ~ Provinces. contemplated, and she felt bound to occupy these V i "itices. His Noble Friend had stated very correctly e Proems of that insurrection. It was perfectly true t hat iLoldavia and Wallachia bad been for a long time assert the moral power of that country—and it was, doubtless, very great, unless, by her own fault, she should forfeit it lie could assure him that it was the wish of her ➢tajesty's Government to maintain it by every poisible means. A country strong in itself, and which could not be supposed to be actuated by fear, was enabled to couch its communications in a manner calcu- lated not to wound the feelings of other states, and by that means it was frequently enabled to confer essen tial benefits upon the parties concerned, end promote the interests of peace, to which his Honourable Friend had so _ably alluded and so well described. With regard to the question before the House, the Government had taken that part in the discussion which, as the friend to both parties, were best calculated to forward the objects they had in view, and he trusted the question of time, being the only question now pend ing between the two powers, would be ultimately settled to the mutual satisfaction of both.—(llear.) He was dis- posed to finish there, did he not know that the state of those affairs had created a great deal of discus.ion out of doors, from the apprehension that that question would lead to an interruption of those friendly relations. It was alleged that certain orders that had recently been given by Turkey for the usual naval and military pre parations—that the announcement of the usual equip ment of a squadron at that season, and the march of troops to the northern provinces for review, were some what suspicious, and that had led to a disclaimer of any hostile intentions. He trusted that these statements would prove well founded, and that the negotiations which were then pending would terminate to the satis faction of both parties, and without disturbance to the general peace of Europe.—(Wear.) Mr. ANSTEY said matters had now assumed so serious an aspect in the east of Europe that if England was what she had formerly been she would not then be discussing the present question in the House of Com mons. He maintained that a fearful blow had been struck at British interests when the first Russian so!dier had passed the boundary of those principalities. They had seen on the part of Russia perfidy after perfidy, and fraud after fraud, and yet the Noble Lord told the House that he relied upon her honourable intentions, because she had signed the treaty of June, 1841. He contended that the English Government was bound to interfere, and to insist upon the immediate withdrawal of every Calmuck and Russian from that soil, which they pol luted by their presence. These provinces were 30.000 square miles in extent, and no less than 20,000 of them were rich and fertile lands. This territory was inha- bited by a population now of upwards of 4,000,000. This population was capable of supplying our markets with every commodity which we were now reduced to pur. chase, at enhanced prices and inferior quality, in Russia. They were willing to receive payment for their com modities, not in money, but in British produce. The mouths of the Danube were so choked up with sand as to make it impossible to carry on properly the timber trade, which was formerly the most thriving trade in those parts. At this moment there were not more than eight:or nine feet of water, and the vessels that could enter there were of two small a size to conduct properly that trade. Russia had beset every mouth and access with her quarantine regulations; so that if even a letter be allowed by the Russian authorities to pass, we owe it to their forbearance, or, as the phrase is—their magna- nimity. The consequence was that British trade in Mel- daviai was now wholly extinguished. Our merchants were forced against their will to go to Odessa and other ports, vthich, it might be said, enjoyed the advantage of the prohibitory tariff of Russia. The question the House had now to decide was, whether we were strong enough in our foreign, commercial, and politi cal relations, to submit to this great loss of political influence and commerce in the territory he had described. If Wallachia was suffered to import and export freely, the trade of Russia was gone. So that this was a case of life and death to Russia. If the policy o' Russia, and he was afraid he might say the policy of Great Britain, be suffered by Parliament to be carried out in respect to these provinces, he feared that what had been done in Moldavia and Wallachia would be imi- tated by Russia in every other part of the Turkish do- 1 minions, so that the future occupation of the Dardanelles would not be a question fur the statesman to consider, but for the historian to record. He did not know what information the Noble Lord had received from his diplo matic agents in this quarter, but he was authorised to say by one of the highest authorities on this subject, that every attempt was now being made by the Russian general and the troops under him to stimulate and exasperate, not only the population, but the Turkish army of occupation, to aggressive measures against Turkey. As to the Noble Lord's confidence in the disclaimer of Russia in respect to any aggressive intentions, it should be recollected that Russia had never yet invaded any country with out heralding her advances by a disavowal of aggressive designs. It was quite clear that Russia:would remain in these provinces in spite of all that S had been said and done; so that it was too much for the Noble Lord to say that Russia would withdraw her ttoops. He should vote for the motion of his Noble Friend, and he hoped that Noble Lord would not yield to any persuasion to with draw it. If the Noble Lord did give way, ho (Mr. An stey) should feel it to be his duty to ask the House to come to a division upon the question. Mr. M. MILNES trusted that his Noble Friend (Lard D. Stuart) would not press his motion upon such en im portant question to a division in so thin a House (about fifty Members were present) as this happened to be.— (Hcar, hear.) He (Mr. Mines) would not attempt to follow the Hon. and Learned Gentleman who preceded him into the various topics ho had adverted to in the course of his speech, because he thought that the present was not the time or the fitting opportunity for discussing the to rms and principles of the treaty of Adrianople, and other treaties of an equally ancient date. If this country had failed in petorming its duty to humanity with respect to its share in those treaties, he thought the cause of any such failure was not attributable to the Noble Lord now at the head of the Foreign Depart ment.—(Hear, hear) He saw no reason far supposing that any dispute between Russia and Turkey could be adjusted at the desire of this country. All it could pos sibly be expected to do was to exercise its moral ilifia ence to prevent any misunderstanding which was calcu lated to disturb the peace of the world. It was cer tainly very hard that Wallachia should be forced to contract debts for the purpose of maintaining the troops of Russia, and he hoped that his Noble Friend (Lord Palmerston) did not countenance such an imposition. — (Hear, hear.) He trusted that his Noble Friend might feel it his duty to represent to the Government of Russia that this nation dtd not approve of the system of forcibly occupying a country with foreign troops that did not require their presence or assistance. — (Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord would do well to im press upon the Russian Government that in the opinion of the English people it was vain for that Govern ment to declare that they had co ulterior object in view in sending their troops to occupy foreign province 3.— (Hear.) The evacuation of Moldavia and Wallachia by the Russian troops was a subject that his Noble Friend would do well to keep in mind. Let him take a firm stand upon the matter without tiny attempt at dictation, and he believed that the advice of England opportunely given would have the effsct of restoring to those Turkish provinces that independence in the scale of European countries to which they were justly entitled.—(Hear.) Mr. URQUHART said that the question before the Hou e involved more than a mere motion for the pro duction of papers. It was a question whether an act of oppression had not been committed against one ally of the British Crown by another of its allies; and the an sa er must be that there had. The Noble Lord the Se cretary for Foreign Affairs said that the question between Russia and Turkey_ was one of time. But in his (Mr. Urquhart's) opinion, the question with regard to time was not when Russia would deem it necessary to give up her occupation of the provinces of Turkey, but when Turkey would be able to resist and throw off the system of oppression to which she had been subjected for the last 150 years. Being an ally of both countries, ho thought that friendly mediation uporlifour part to settle the differences was perfectly justifiable, and ought to have been applied. He trusted that the Noble Mem ber for Marylebone would press his motion to a divi sion, for the purpose of showing how few Members were in the House upon this occasion, and hew small was the number who sanctioned the general concurrence of the Foreign Secretary in the acts of Russia. Mr. HUME said he was disposed to think that the Hon. Member for Pomfret (Mr. Milnes) had somewhat magnified the power of Russia; though he (Mr. Hume) had expressed himself frequently against the aggressive policy of the Emperor of Russia, and he thought that the introduction of questions of this sort was of advantage, because opinions expressed in that House and by the people of England were likely to produce an effect even on the mind or such a despot as the Emperor of Russia. He (Mr. Hume) confessed that he thought there was not much danger to be apprehended from Russia. Ho believed the . Emperor of Russia's present coun c il s w ere l ea ding him into danger, which might ultimately render him as helpless as were many other monarchs at the present moment. The Noble Lord at the"head of the Foreign office had stated, that having offered the advice of an in dependent country like this, he thought that that advice would be sufficient. He (Mr. Hume) was glad to hear that, because there could be no doubt that honest advice would ever produce a good effect. He certainly did not believe that Russia intended to take permanent posses sion of those countries ; but at the same time it was most desirable that this country should use the moral influence it possessed to prevent the encroachments of Russia. Be was glad to hear that harmony existed be tween France and this country, and he hoped that other countries in Europe would be equally disposed to join with them ; but whether they did or not, he was firmly convinced that by the cordial co-operation of France and England, even though it were against the inclination of other powers, they would be able to maintain the peace He would advise his Noble of the world.—(Cheers.) Friend not to endanger the advantage which had been obtained by the introduction of his motion, for during the time he had had the honour of a seat in that House he did not recollect that any Member ever rose and defended the course which Russia had taken, and he believed that there was not only un animity in the House, but out of the House, upon the subject of the aggressive character of Russia. It was on this ground—whilst deprecating all interference by co ercion—that he thought it would be prudent and wise in his Noble Friend not to pr e ss the House to a division, but to accept the fact that negotiations were still pend ing, as a sufficient reason why he should not persist in calling fi r the production of the papers.—(Hear.) Mr. DISRAELI--Sir, I rise to express my hore that the Noble Lord will not call upon the House to divide upon the present occasion, for by so doing, I thi :k that it will not advance the interests he is ad- vocatiog. But lam opposed to those interests, and, of course, the Noble Lerd will not take my advice. The llon. Manber icr Montrose (Mr. Hume), as oce of his reasons for recommending that the Noble Lord should not go to a division on the pretent occasion, said he had _ _ fund, which he termed a dunghill, had made his being Chancellor of the Excht quer out of the questicn, al.cl that in the Protectionist Govern ment which was about to be formed, the post of sat in Parlknicnt a ecwsierable time—that there had always been a unanimous feeling against the policy of Rus sia, and that the Autocrat and his policy had never been mentioned without being denounced; and, therefore, he recommends that the same course should be pursued on the present as on former occasions—namely, that those denunciations should be continued, and that divisions should not be had recourse to —(hear, hear.) Now, the . only inference I should draw from the advice of the lion. Gentleman would be rather against the counsel he re commends to you, for certainly the speeches which have been made in the House of Commons have not produced any particular effect upon the policy of the Russian Court.—(ll , ar, hear.) But I wish to remind the Hon. Gentleman that the policy of Russia has never been mentioned in this House without somebody rising to vindicate what I, for one, generally speaking, regard as most politic and even magnanimous. I would appeal to the policy which Russia has pursued during the last twelve months of agitation; and there are Jew but will be ready to admit that there has been exhibited on the part of that power a great amount of forbearance—a great desire to maintain peace (an object which is of such importance with Hon. Gentlemen opposite), and I be lieve a sincere desire to maintain tranquillity. What ever may be the ulterior designs of Russia, and I do not pretend to share in the powers of divination which Hon. Gentlemen opposite seem to possess, yet I think it is a point upon which we may fairly congratulate this country, that a power of the importance of Russia, under such circumstances of temptation as those which have presented themselves during the last twelve months, should have evinced a disposition which no one can deny had not only materially tended to, but has been one of the principal causes of that pence, the maintenance of which you congratulate yourselves upon.—(Hear.) Con trast the conduct of Russia under those circumstances with that of the French Republic forty or fif y years ago. Imagine the career which might have been open to a great power like Russia had she chosen to have seized such opportunities as have recently occurred; and what contusion, suffering, and loss to Europe and to civilisa tion might have been the result.—( Hear, hear.) Nothing can, I think, be more unjust than for Hon. Gentlemen to give an opinion as to the character and conduct of one of the greatest powers of Europe, not on account of what it has done, but of what it will do, according to the pro phctie powers of Hon. Gentlemen. We must judge of the conduct of Russia by what has actually occurred. We see that its conduct In a late transaction was charac terised by great temperance and great forbearance. With respect to the immediate instance before the House, we do not know the cause of the occupation of those principalities. It may have originated in a false interpretation of treaties—in a misconception of the di plomatic position of Russia with respect to these trans actions. It is quite true that the conduct of Russia under the :circumstances, however we may consider it Secretary of State for F,Teign Affairs might alit him, and that in that situation it would he mote easy and agreeable to him to carry on business if he was on gond terms with the Czar. The Honourable Member had pronounced the most unbounded culo glum on the Emperor of Russia. Ile had said that he was the most peaceable, the least ambitious, and the least likely to cause apprehension to other states; but he thought, notwithstanding this, that the Ho nourable Gentleman had betrayed in the course of his speech, considerable doubts of the accur.cy of what he had himself stated ; for after he had pro- fessed that it was matter of congratulation that the Em peror of Russia had not interfered with any other country, he said that he was not gifted with the power of divination, so as to divine the intentions of the Emperor of Russia. As we judged of a tree by its fruits, so we, seeing what Russia bad done, what bad be, n tier conduct in Poland, the Crimea, and Turkey, how, by insidious proceedings she had extended her frontit rs, and enlarged her territory, we naturally con cluded that she was going to do that which she had done befta-o. He believed that all the Turkish empire wanted was sure moral support from this country. With two such countries as France and England united, he did not be lieve that if they spoke out and declared their opinions forcibly, they would find any country in the world to go aga nst them. He was gratified that the Noble Lnrd ap peered to participate in his views. As to Russia being in vited by the authorities of Moldavia, he believed that the Hospodar had invited the Russians, but that it was entirely against the will of the mass of the popula tion. As to Wallachia, the Russians had entered it gratuitously, without any invitation whatever, and after all pretext bad been taken away by the Turks. The Noble Lord professed to feel great confi dence that the Russian troops would withdraw, and said that it was only a question of time ; but, in this time, the unfortunate inhabitants of the principality were forced to pay for the maintenance of these ,inty thousand Russian troops. The Noble Lord bad been deceived before in this very instance by the Russians, who told him last year that they were going out of Moldavia. The Noble Lord said that, except as regards the subject of the present motion, their conduct was marked by dignity and forbearance. This reminded him of what had recently occurred to a friend of his, who was also known to many Honourable Members—he meant the celebra ed writer, Mr. Charles Dickens. He opposed to our interests, or to the law of nations, is still such, that it is on an occasion like this that we must look with confidence to the Minister of the Crown, and we aro bound to give him our fair confidence in a trans action like this, for this is an occasion on which negotia tion ought to have a fair opportunity. If the result of the negotiations should be fruitless—if they should be hostile to the interests of England, then there will be the right time and the proper occasion for the House of Commons to interfere.--(Elear.) But then these attacks on a great power, not on ac count of what it has done, but on account of visionary results, which only exist in the imagination of those who speak them, are certainly not the basis on which public men should act. We expect a Secretary of State to express opinions upon some other grounds was walking in the street, when he felt a man put his hand in his pocket ; he seized him, and hid him taken before the Marylebone Police -court, where he himself attended. Mr. Dickens having visited the prisons, recognised the man as one whom he had before seen, and said, " Have you not been in prison before ? " " No, never," was the answer. The policeman, who was by, and conveyed him to prison, nudged him, and :said, " What are you talk ing about ? " Well," said the prisoner, "I never was—except for two months." The Russians had not interfered in the affairs of any other country; they had only taken possession of a territory to which they were not entitled. In reference to the motion before the House, considering the recommendations from all quar ters, he would not insist on going to a division. The motion was then withdrawn. • THE 6TH MADRAS LIGHT CAVALRY.' Mr. ANSTEY moved for copies of the proceedings in the Court of Inquiry and the Court-martial held at Arcot, in the year 1844, in the case of the alleged muti neers of the 6th Regiment of Madras Light Cavalry, and of all memorials and correspondence relative thereto, or to the punishments or commutations of the punish ments of any such mutineers; and also of the Madras pay regulations, and the Native Mutiny Act. The Court-martial was held on 17 Sepoys, privat e produced, h wouldsoldiesrs show this regiment, under the following circumstances:—The Madras pay regulations, when that the Sepoys were enlisted on the terms of receiving so much additional batta when they took the field, the object being to enable them to remove their wives and families with them. The Marquis of Tweed dale, who was Commander-in-Chief at Madras, having suspended the issue of the field butte, these Sepoys were unable to take the field, and they refused to mount. This state of things continued for four days. The Marquis discovered that he had made an error, and issued an order acknowledging it, and declaring that the field batta should be allowed. The men immediately returned to their duty; and the Marquis, in a general order, expressed his satisfacton that he had done so, with his determination not to select them for a post of honour for a time at least, but to detain them upon ordi nary service; and they did duty accordingly for nine months, mounting guard about his own person, and no distinction being made between them and the other sol diers. But at the end of nine months a court of inquiry into these bygone transactions was held at Arcot, and the result was a court-martial on a charge of mutiny—a capital offence by the Native Mutiny Act, and requiring nine officers, whereas this court consisted of only :even. Applications for copies of the charges and for legal assistance were refused. 16 of the 17 wen were convicted. Two were shot; one was pardoned for having given " Queen's evidence;" the other 13 were sentenced to banishment for life. They were brought to Madras for the purpose of being removed to their place of exile; an application was made to the Supreme Court for a habeas corpus, but they were instantly re moved out of the juri,cliction of the court to their place of exile. Soon after their arrival there the Government pardoned all but two, whose sentee ce was commuted to banishment for seven years, and chat they were now suf fering. The present application to .I.',Arliament del not originate with perseos having any pique against tho Government or the Company, but with some gentlemen of the highest respectability in India; and when the papers should be produced, he (Mr. Ansley) should make a very serious case against the Nlarquis, and thLu'd pro pose a most searching and rigorous examination into the matter. than those which such Crude materials would afford him to deal with, and the promulgation of which are calcu leted to lead to results most inconvenient, not only for the s transaction of public business, but ultimately to the tranquillity of Europe. This, Sir, is my opinion, and I have now to express the hope that there wilt be no division on the motion before us, and it may lead to a false im pression. I do not wish the Emperor of Russia to sup pose that there is a want of sympathy for populations that are not treated in accordance with what may be considered the law of nations, nor with what may be considered is high policy—that suffering humanity has net the sympathy of the Huse of Commons under all circumstances. I hope the Emperor of Russia, too, will understand, that it is not the opinion of the House of s Commons, nor the opinion either of the English people, that he is a despot whose conduct no ono will vindicate.—(Hear, hear.) I hope the Emperor of Russia will understand that the speeches made by the Hon. Member for Montrose, and of others, are not a fair representation of the feelings of the House of Commons nor of the English people.—(Hear, hear.) I do not be lieve that such speeches do represent the feelings of the English people. I believe that the feeling of the sensible part of the community is that they recognise in the ruler of Russia en individual of great ability and of great merit—that ho is a man of great intelligence and of great power, and that he has exercised that power with a due regard to the position he occupies and a strong sense of the duties that devolve upon him.—(Hear.) As to the inclination to impugn the conduct of the Em peror of Russia, as if he had committed an act of felony, because he has not been born with a king, lords, and commons, and a parliamentary committee, to keep him in check, it is an absurdity, for which there is no sym pathy in this House; but I believe there is no sympathy even amongst the people who are now walking outside in the streets. The time has gene by when such attacks can be made, and they have been left unimpugned too long. For 30 ycars tt e Hon. Member for Montrose has been indulging in these remarks—and I say it with great respect for his talents, ho has been during all that time indulging in unmitigated nonsense on the subject.—(Laughter.) He has subjected the Em peror to the same sort of criticism, because he has not been surrounded with the forms of a consti ution. For this reason the lion. Member has described the Emperor as a despot, as an ogre, as a sort of being that only ex isted for the purpose of inflicting misery upon mankind. I believe the opinion entertained of the Emperor is, that throughout his career he has shown the influence of his individual character, that he is rather in advance of the people he governs, and that of all sovereigns that during recent events have occupied thrones in Europe, he is the most entitled to the respect of mankind.—(Hear.) Sir H. VERNEY observed that the question before the House was, whether the Emperor of Russia had done that of which this country had a right to complain. If Russia had been peacefully inclined, why had the Em peror promoted the denunciation of the treaty of Mal moe ? There could be no doubt that if Russia had re monstrated with Denmark that peace would have been the result. Mr. J. A. SMITH differed from the Hon. Member for Bucks, and thought the feeling in this country in general was against the Emperor of Russia.. Perhaps it was from necessity that the personage had become the unscrupulous and determined enemy of constitutional liberty wherevsr it appeared. The House had surely not forgotten the history of Poland, of Circassia, and of Cracow.—(Hear, hear.) The Noble Lord could not have forgotten the opinion which he • had expressed of the conduct of Russia towards Cracow. He hoped the Noble Lord would not divide the House, for be must feel satis fied with the result of his motion. The moral force of England, in this as in other questions, would have its weight, but influenced as it was with our alliance with France would be irresistible. That alliance they owed to the conduct and policy of the Noble Lord the Secretary for Foreign Affairs, and on that alliance he believed the peace of the world depended.—(Hear, hear.) In the occupation of Moldavia and Walla chia by the Russians, he feared the rights of humanity had been disregarded. He hoped Turkey would protest against it, and he trusted, as the Noble Lord had not t xpressed a different opinion, that the Govern ment had also protested against it. He joined with those lion. Members who had asked the Noble Lord not to divide on his motion. Dlr. J. O'CONNELL congratulated the Hon. Member for Buckinghamshire on the cause he had undertaken. The remarks of the Hon. Member who spoke last were excellent. He could have been content to leave the matter to his vindication. If any subject could excuse the use of strong terms, it was the conduct of that monster—the Emperor of Russia. The Hon. Member for Buckinghamshire had defended the scourge of women and the destroyer of men. Had the House for gotten the case of the unfortunate nuns of Minsk— dragged from their convents—brutally flogged—ex posed to the violence of ruffian soldiers—with the cognisance—with the express written approbation of the client of the Honourable Member for Buckingham shire? Had the House forgotten the conscription of Polish children sent to Siberia, dying by the way-side, and the orders issued to fill up the numbers by fresh victims—all to satisfy the cruelty of this hide ous monster I He was glad such conduct had been protested against. If sentimentality meant sympathy for human suffering under the heel of the greatest despot—the greatest monster of modern times—be should not be ashamed to avow it. Speaking on behalf of the Irish people he should support the motion, if pressed to a division. At the same time, he admitted there might be reasons why the Noble Lord should not divide the House. Lord DUDLEY STUART, in reply, said be gave full weight to the opinions of those Lion. Members, whether agreeing in his views or not, who recommended him to withdraw the motion. He had heard with some surprise the Hon. Member for Bucks say that on this question he advocated opposite interests from those es poused by him (Lord Dudley Stuart). He (Lord Dudley Stuart) was endeavouring to defend the in terests of the Turkish empire, and he thought lie recollected that not very long ago the Hon. Member for Bucks, in a most elcquent speech en the question of Servia, had expressed as strong an opinion on the im portance of maintaining the integrity of the Ottoman empire as could possibly be imagined. He (Lord I), Stuart) had, throughout his observations, endeavoured to express himself iu temperate language, and had given no utterance to those feelings which he was not ashamed to confess always rose in his heart when con templating the acts of the oppressor of Poland; and he would not be at duced by the exaggerated language in which the Hon. Member for Bucks had thought proper to support his views, or be led to resort .to intem perate expressions by way of retort. The opinions of the Honourable Gentleman appeared to find no echo in the House, and he was sure they would find none in the country; which was much more likely to coincide with the feelings of the Hon. and Learned Member for Limerick. He (Lord D. Stuart) confessed he had heard the observations of that Honourable and Learned Member with pleasure. Stich generous sentiments did honour to him who delivered them. as to the assembly which received them with cheers.— The Hon. Member for Bucks, however, took another view, and he had a right to his opinions. His motives, no doubt, were excellent. Possibly he might think, now that his contemptuous treatment of the consolidated Mr. J. O'CONNELL seconded the motion. Sir J. 1101 11.0UziE had not been tw3re that this motion was likely to come on this evening. In the many years that he had been in Parliament he reeollecttd no case, or not more than one, w h ere the procee di ngs o f a court-martial had been made the subject of a discussion —(Hear, was that st it rati in the House, or, at least, of inquiry before a Committee. without . shocking public feeling. It set med fair to ask o why it had . been brought up now? This attack upon strange, should if have this s w le a p s t s o a long n a r Hag e nuo n di u d s suet and i ntw e d the Marquis IN gan with the presentation to the House of Commons of a petition from Mr. Malcolm Lewin, o ts u ti o s r that.b,rdotif difference they eirroieibinht ce.oedu w_ s oe(u) printed—(Hear, betweenee at not ire, vth, r hed e ea c rtiv o h r_ ea which the Committee on Petitions found. to be so libel i nenLe unfortu natetev to never nh allow ahvee heard of this affair.. The matter originated, he would not say from no public motives, but from a great deal of - private feeling. He had not a word to say against Mr. Lewin's private character, but, in consequence of that gentleman's conduct, he was removed from his office of Provisional Member of Council at Madras, and obliged to quit India, and, if the Honourable Mem orif Ao u would Mem ber should proceed on any f u t ure day w i t h t hi s case, it would be his (Sir J. HobLouset.) painfel duty to present papers signed by Mr. Lewin hi mself, w hi c h wo uld be a full justification for the course pursued by the Mar quis and the Government. N o d ou b t th e men were not tried at the time; it was thought that according to forms they should first be m ar ched back from the Bengal Presidency into th e i r own; a g reat portion of the whole regiment, too, was implicated, a general ac tion was expected, and if there had been immediate in quiry, it would have been ne cessary to h av e artillery to se cure the execution of the ord ers o f the C o mmander-in- Chief: The mutiny was of a most serious c haracter; it it included a great number of the native officers; secret oaths were taken; meetings were held; there was a po sitive refusal to march; the men woufa not even parade. —(Hear, hear.) Surely the lion. Member must ace that the present was rather an awkward time to make this complaint of the conduct of a Commander-in -Chief towards native troops in India, and without the produc tion of papers.—(Hear, hear.) The A.arquis of 'I weed dale was too much of a gallant soldier to be chargeable with cruelty, and be was sure he was too much 4 an ho nest man to shift from himself the responsibility that fairly belonged to him. Though 13 men were condemned to be shot, only two were ordered for execution by the Marquis of Tweeddale; and these were . two men who had administered illegal oaths to the mutineers, and en deavoured by a combination to destroy all discipline in the regiment, and march it to a place where it would be under the guidance of a Zemindar or some person of that kind in India.—(Hear.) But this matter did not escape the attention of the Government of the Right Hon. Gentleman the Member for Tainworth; and he found, on making inquiry, that the whole case was submitted to the Duke of Wellington. The Noble . Duke wrote a minute on the subject , w in bich he entered into the whole of the transactions and especially that to which the Hon. Gentleman had so , strongly referred—viz., the men being allowed after the mutiny to go on common duty. On this point the minute showed most distinctly that so far from such a line of conduct being contrary to the ordi nary rules as laid down in the articles of war, there was, under the circumstances, no other mode of dealing with the matter ; and that the commanding officer was per fectlyjustified in allowing the men to do common duty. —(Hear.) In another account which he had seen, it was stated that the men never did mount guard; but whether this was the case or not, was of very little importance. They were never under fi re; an d he had no doubt that if they had it would have been re garded by all parties as an ext enuatin g , circumstance.— (Hear, hear.) He did not see that anything would be gained by inquiry into this matter, and certainly ho was not inclined, except for reasons much more strong than any urged by the Honourable Gentleman, to l ay the papers before the House. It was very seldom that the proceedings of courts-mar tial were ic quired int o by that House, and he saw no re ason for d oing so in the present instance. lie might just state, betore conclud ing, that the parties who had been pardoned were so favoured in cons( (pence of subsequent good con d uct. It was thought better, after justice had been administered in the case of two individuels, to extend mercy to the others, so that no undue severity should take place. Fur the reasons he had stated he could nut consent to the presentation of the papers.—(Hear.) Mr. J. O'CONNELL believed that gross illegality had been practised in this case, becau e by the 7th article of war not less then 13 members should sit oil a court martial, unless it was held in the territory of F ort S t. George, whereas only seven ha d sat in the court which tried these men.—(Hear.) He thought this a fair case for inquiry. Mr. 'FUME thought it was of consequen ce to know who ordered the batta to be discontinued, because it ap peared that that was the cause of the dissatisfaction which led to the mutiny.—(Hear.) The court-martial was clearly an illegal court, and he did not understand how in India nine months (-11p;cd, and a sufficient num.. er of officers could not be got to try the parties.— (Hear.) He must say that to try men before an illegal tribunal, and then to execute them, appeared to him to be a very serieus matter ; and, as the case occurred under the Government of the 11:ght Hon. Gentleman (Sir 11. Peel), he should like to hear from him a state ment of the facts. As to the petition of Mr. Lewin, he did not see that it had anything to do with the matter; for, though he had libelled the whole House, it would not affect the question before them. lie must say he thought this a fair subject for inquiry. He wished to know why, after a period of nine months, the parties were brought to trial, and that before an illegal tribu nal; and why, after this illegal trial, they were ex ecuted.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. ELLIOT se:el, no doubt the withdrawal of the batta was a very natural cause of discontent; but the cause of the mistake which led to it was explained to the regiment only two days after it had occurred, so that there was ample time for the removal of all feeling of discontent on that ground. As to what had been said with respect to the parties doing common duty after the mutiny, it should be borne in mind that it was not known who the persons implicated were till after inquiry. It was only then that the ringleaders were known, and they were immediately put under arrest and ordered to be tried by court martial. Mr. AGLIONBY thought it was perhaps to bo re gretted that a matter which dated back so many years should have been revived when its revival might do no good. But the question having been raised, especially with reference to the legality of the court martial, he thought some further explanation was due to the House than that accorded by the flight Hon. Gentleman. Sir 11. PEEL had not expected that the motion under discussion would have been brought forward that even ing, otherwise he would have made himself master of the facts, the case having occurred when the Govern ment of which he was a member held dike, and he should then have been able to le spond to the appeal of the Hon. Member for Montrose. He had no recollec tion of the facts of the case as enabled him to enter on the merits, but he would give his vote on grounds sug gested by the circumstances in which the case was pre sented. In all those cases great confidence must be placed, and great allowances must be made for the cir cumstances under which individuals were placed with respect to, military questions. From all he had seen, heard, or known of the Marquis of Tweeddale during a long and distinguished career under the Duke of Web lington, he felt as strong a conviction as ho could with respect to any officer, that the Noble Lord was the last man in the world who would have been guilty of oppres sion, or could have been charged with an excess of mi litary discipline. His tendencies were tendencies of kindness towards the soldier. But what was to be done when those papers were got? It had been stated that there was no sudden instantaneous act of severity. The proceedings might have been the result of impulse, not of deliberation; but it was stated that there had been an interval of nine months, that the sentence was carried into effect against two of the parties only, and they were ringleaders. All those facts produced a presumption in his mind, without an exact recollection of the circum stances, that there had been no unnecessary severity.— (Hear, hear.) But, further, it was stated that the Com mander-in-Chief (the Duke of Wellington) had per sonally examined the facts of the case, and had pro nounced a deliberate judgment that the sentence was perfectly justifiable. Hon. Gentlemen might disregard the opinion of the Duke of Wellington; but the question for the House of Commons to consider was really a question of authority and jurisdiction. If they chose to supersede the Commander-in Chief in the discharge of his peculiar furetions, the British army would be much less satisfied with their decisions.—(llear, bear.) On the grounds be had stated he could safely deprecate the constitution of a precedent, now for the first time pro posed to be introduced, by the House of Commons un dertaking to revise the sentence of an Indian court martial. After a few words of explanation from Mr. AG LIONBY, The ATTORNEY GENERAL begged to remind the Hon. Member for Youghal of the consequences which his legal experience ought to satisfy him would follow on the production of these papers. Was he to refer them to a Select Committee of unpractised Mem bers to determine whether there was an illegal defect in the court-martial? The precedent would be a most dan gerous one and destructive of all subordination in the army. Might not the Hon. Member for Cockermouth have given the Government credit for having directed attention to the legality of the proceedings; and was the House on a bare motion for papers to commit itself to referring the question to a Select Committee whether murder had been committed or not? Mr. ANSTEY briefly replied. He maintained that Lord Brudenell's case afforded a precedent for inquiry. The House divided, when there appeared— For the motion ••• Against it 54 -40 Majority ••• SCHOOL OF DESIGN. On the motion of Mr. M. GIBSON. the following gen tlemen were nominated members of the Select Commit tee on the School of Design:—Sir R. Peel, Sir G. Clerk, Mr. Milnes, Mr. Moffatt, Mr. Lsbouchere, Mr. Rich,' Mr.Wakley, Mr. M. Gibson, Mr. Hope. Mr. Scholefield, and Mr. Kershaw. PROTECTION OF JUSTICES (IRELAND) BILL. The report on the Protection of Justices (Ireland) Bill was brought up and agreed to. On the question that the Bill should be read a third time to-morrow, Mr. J. O'CONNELL expressed his objection to the Bill, and moved as an amendment that it be read a third time to-morrow L•ix months. After some remarks in approval of the Bill from Sir %V. Somerville, 151+jor Metcalf, en l Mr. M. J. O'Con— n.ii, tho House divided, and the numbers were— For the amendment 2 Against it Majority The original motion was agreed to, and the House ad journed at Eleven o'clock. HOUSE' OF LORDS, March 22. ROYAL COMMISSION. Their Lordships assembled at Four o'clock. The Royal Asstnt was given this day by Commission to the Overseers (Cities and Boroughs) Bill. The Royal Commissioners were the Lord Chancellor, the Marquis of Clanricarde, and Lord Campbell. Their Lordships then adj9urned during pleasure. Their Lordships resumed at Five o'clock. Lord BROUGHAM presented a petition from the Society for the Protection of Trade praying for an ex tension of the County Courts. The Duke of RICHMOND presented several petitions complaining of agricultural distress, and praying for re lief from local taxation. The Earl of ERNE presented a petition from some unions in the county of Donegal against the rate in aid. The Earl of MALMESBURY presented a petition against the Petty Sessions B+ll, and gave notice of an amendment which ho intended to move in the preamble of the Bill to-morrow. The Earl of WICKLOW presented several petitions against the rate in aid. OUT-DOOR PAUPERS BILL. Their Lordships then went into Committee on this Bill. The Duke of RICHMOND thought that houses in which paupers were farmed should be placed under the regulation of the Poor-law Commissioners in the same manner as union houses, and he should propose a clause to the effect; but he objected to the practice of farming out paupers, and would wish to see it abolished. The Earl of CARLISLE thought it would be difficult to abolish the system, and while it existed, certainly it ought to be under stringent regulations. Lord BEAUMONT considered this Bill would do away with the whole of the evils of the system of farm ing, paupers. The clause proposed by the Duke of RICHMOND was negatived without a division, and the Bill passed through Committee. NORTH WALES RAILWAY. On the motion of Lord AIONTEAG LE, the order for the attendance of Mr. W. Chadwick and Mr. J. Marriner was discharged, and they were ordered to attend this day week. 1. _. _~ ^~;~ presentations had been made to the Court of Turin, and Earl of Aberdeen) was perfectly ready not to press for the Noble Marquis had stated that representations had I its production. ~`Some time or other he presumed it been made which had h a d th e effect of retarding the war, would be thought fitting by he r . M e j esty ' s G overnment but he thought he could show from the papers moved by to produce all the documents explanatory of the whole his Noble Friend that greet remissness had been shown proceeding connected with the war. Considering what in doing anythi ng ; an d th a t t h at lit, could not have had taken place, he felt it incumbent o n hi m to move for on produced any p oss ibl e e ff ect . Th e first in- their production now, but, as he sa id b efore, he was timation made to the S ar di n i an G overnmen t was 7illing not to press for their bein g immediately laid in March, le4e, exp ress i ng th e sat i s f act i on o f t h e the., table, if the Noble Marquis sho u ld fi n d it laconic- Government at the assurances of the Court o nirnt to submit them to the House.—(Hear, hear.) Turin, that they would not interfere either sa The Marquis of LANSDOWNE, who was very iodise the affairs of France or in those of Italy, and on the 27th tinetly heard, said be had heard with great pleasure the March the King of Sardinia and the Sardinian army conclusion of the speech of the Noble Earl, because the crossed the frontier, and the Marquis of Pareto immediate production of the papers would be attended declared to the British Minister that Sardinia entered with some inconvenience. lie believed the moment was into the war to diive Martini from Italy, and to assist approaching when their production would be iudispen tho Provisional Government of Lombardy, where- sable for the credit of her Majesty's Government and upon the British Minister was instructed to remind the satisfaction of the country, He thought the Govern the Sardinian Government that the war in which they had merit were fully justified in taking a most ample, full, entered was one of doubtful issue. It was true advice and comprehensive view of all the negotiations which was given to the King of Sardinia not to go to war with had preceded the armistice at Turin : and though he did Austria. The advice might have been given had the war not propose to enter into any lengthened detail upon that been just, but he found no remonstrance against the in. subject, yet he wt uld take the liberty of brie fly advert justice of the war, no protest against the violation of ing to it. The Noble Earl had commenced his speech treaties on the pat t .of the King of Sardinia. The by alluding not to any recent negotiations, not to any King of Sardinia was not only an acceding party to the papers which he was now desirous of possessing, but to treaty of Vienna, but he was under an engagement to certain documents which last year were laid upon this country, as well as to all Europe, to maintain the the table of the House, and from these he provisions of that treaty, and therefore its violation by hid inferred that a disposition then existed him called for a protest in strong language. Therefore, upon the part of her Majesty's Government unfa in addition to that violation of the public l aw , an d th a t vourable to the Austrian empire. Now such an inter act of scandalous violation of the peace cf which the ence was not deducible from the documents in question. King of Sardinia had been guilty without any assignable The Noble Earl would remember that at the time they cause or pretext, it was a breach of an engagement en were laid upon the table a very reroarkablesta appearedte of tore] into specifically with this country; and the least things existed upon the Continent ; an d yet he that the British Government could have done would to forget and to suppress the fact, so far as he could, that have been to have entered a formal protest against it. in the interim between the original communications and There was a recent example of the same kind. Not those now sought for, there had occurred an extraordi long before, Austria, Russia, and Prussia had taken nary event,—namely, the revolution at Paris.—(llear, measures to deprive Cracow of its independence. That hear.) He need only appeal to the sound judgment of was an act of comparatively trilling importance as corn- the Noble Earl, and to that matured spirit of states pared with the war in Italy ; but the Governments of manship which he was at all times able to display, and France and England thought the three powers alluded ask whether there was one relation subsisting in Europe, to had violated the treaty of Vienna. That there had or one course of conduct between one country and ano been great provocation on the part of that state could not ther,which by such an event as the one he referred to be denied, and the three powers declared that they had not was not liable to be altered and modified, and which did violated the treaty, but England and France considered not in fact require an ample review to be made after that they had, and they lost not a moment in entering a the occurrence took place to avert the consequences strong official protest against it. Here, then, was an it involved?—(llear, hear.) The Noble Earl had re example which ought, for every reason, to have been ferred to a dispatch which had not been laid upon the followed.—(Hear, hear.) Much had been said as to the table, but which he said he had perused. treaty of Vienna, and there appeared to be a good deal Lord BROUGHAM said the Noble Marquis was of uncertainty about the application of that treaty. Ile under a misapprehension. The dispatch bad been laid would, however, express what his notions were on the upon the table; it was produced on a motion submitted subject. In the first place, all parties either contracting last year. or acceding to that treaty were bound by precisely the The Earl of ABERDEEN observed that the Noble dame obligation. He thought there was a moral gun- Marquis had laid a dispatch upon the table in the first rantee given by every Power, whether signing or acted- instance, which ended with a threat against Austria for ing, to preserve and cause to be preserved the terms of a supposed interference on her part with Sardinia. That that treaty. He considered that any violation of that threat might have been deserved. Six months afterwards, treaty, strictly speaking, might be a cause of war, but however, Austria sent an answer, in which she not only of course it would depend on the view the party injured denied that she entertained any such intentions, but might take of his own interests. But that some notice stated her readiness to act on the aide of Great Britain ought to be taken of an infraction of the treaty there in abstaining from interference. He (the Earl of Aber could he no doubt—whether it should be by recalling deen) contended that it was a suppressio yeti not to pro the Minister of the offended Power, or by what other duce that communication when the other dispatch was means, must depend on the feeling entertained.— laid on the table. (Hear.) Ile fully admitted ' that neither England The Marquis pfa LANSDOWNE was under the nor any other state was bound to make corn- impression that Thee communication had been mon cause with any other party who might be immediately produced; , but, at all events, when th e injured. There were special guarantees which were on original dispatch was laid upon the table a very a different footing—there were special guarantees con general apprehension prevailed that Austria was pre tained in that very treaty, the conditions of which, if pared to interfere in the affairs of Sardinia, and it violated, must be redressed by war. Fortunatele, this was an object with her Majesty's Government to remove country had always felt great reluctance to enter into that apprehension. In that attempt they succeeded. A. special guarantees. They had avoided all guarantees of communication was sent to the Austrian Government that description, and he hoped they would continue to which stated fully and explicitly what the views of this du so.—(Hear, hear.) To proceed with a narrative of the country were as to the formation of independent states, war:—The remonstrances being of such a nature, had and, at this distance of time, looking back to that dis produced no effect, and the war thus iniquitously begun patch, he (the Marquis of Lansdowne) saw nothing in continued at first with success to the Sardinian arms. In its style or composition to cause the slightest regret. — the distracted state of Austria—with a revolution in her (Hear, hear.) But as he had stated before, the late re capital, without resources, without instructions, without volution in France must not be forgotten in considering order, the Austrian army was, for a time, completely the details of the present question. That revolution dis paralysed. In this emergency, the government at played itself in colours which impressed the world with Vienna, still relying on the alliance which had so long alarm, and imposed new duties on France and a new existed between that country and this, sent a mes mode of executing those duties. It also imposed a duty senger to England in order to induce us to mediate, upon her Majesty's Government, to maintain a good un and restore peace. He did not know accurately how derstanding between this country and France. But the that mission had been received, but he had seen re- Noble Earl's reason for not coming to an understanding ferences nsado tceAustrian dispatches, which he presumed with France, or, at least, for not joining with her, was were authentic. The proposals, however, made by the somewhat singular. He said—" I admit that France Austrian Government were not sufficient to satisfy the and you had at the moment, a similar in exigencies of her Majesty's Government. Still further terest in preserving peace, and that you had a right to concessions were required; and although Austria offered believe that the French Government were kindly- dis to surrender the whole of Lombardy, and recognise her posed; but the motives of the two countries were different, independence, that was not thought sufficient to satisfy for, had there been a war in Italy, France would be our friend, if he must call him so, the King of Sardinia. obliged to take a different course from you." Bat as [happily for Austria, the conditions were refused, because France was ready to act with England up to the point of shortly after the Austrian army having been reinforced press ruing peace, and to forego any designs she might in Italy, and a better spirit prevailing in the Austrian base in the event of war, why should the 'Noble Earl councils, the offensive was resumed, and the Austrian think it injueicious to invite France to join in a media general, Radetzlry, drove his enemies before him until tion?—(Elear, hear.) The Noble Earl had a right to the Austrians had crossed their own territory, showing comment on what he had read, but ho was not justified as much energy and vigour as when ho (the Earl of in commenting upon official and authentic communica- Aberdeen) had before seen him himself at the head of Lions which ho had not seen, because they had not his Jictorious hussars.--(hear, hear.) On arriving at hitherto been laid upon the table; and yet, in adverting the Bietimontesc territory, he with rare p. udence and to the conditions involved in the negotiations; ho generosity abstained frees following his beaten enemy seemed to think that the terms which were pro• into his own territory.—(hear, hear.) lie granted posed by England to Austria as the founciiiion of ..n armistice to the King of Sardinia, with a the mediation, were not such as to satisfy the exigencies view to the settlement of the terms of peace; which, of this country. But where did the Noble Earl find indeed, would have been an easy matter, and have that we had any exigencies, or where would any ro qiiired but little time to accomplish if England and testimony bearing on that point be derived from the France had not in a few days offs rel their mediation. pip rs hereafter to be produced ?—(hear, hear.) This was eagerly necepted by the King of Sardinia, and, Throughout the whole of the tranetions England had after some hesitation, by Austri a. This mediation, how- acted with perfect fairness, and what was invidiously over, offered no prospect of any satisfactory result. But celltd an exigency consisted merely of the conditions when two powers agreed to offer mediation it was very sawn which the mediation was likely to be best effected. essential that their interests should 0., identieal.—(liear, Would the NOble Earl, who had had much to do with hear.) It we, quite clear that England and France both meciiltionn bet Ore, and might have 'nue!' to do with them sii:cercly desired the restoration of peace; but it was vain ould he enter into a negotiation upon any ()Ater not at all clear that their interests in the north of Italy ground than that which was most likely to bring were identical. Oa the contrary, the interest of England tooth parties to a proper understanding? lkesuse, it a had always been to see the north of Italy forming as mediation were undertaken, and initeer party would strong a birder as possible; and this was effected by the ;give way, there would ha an end to all expectation of treaty of Vienna, bringing the great military power of compromise. Ama diation was founded on a belie f that Austria into contact with the keeper of the passes of the two parties, from circumstances, had got into a state Alps, and thus a formidable barrier was opposed to any in which they could not melee peace for themselves, foreign aggressor. Now, it had always been the interest but in a hich they were desirous for pa ace, and ce ll e d. of France to weaken that barrier, and that could never in a third party to state the extent of mutual have been done so effectually as by weakening the power concessions. If there was any case in which the princi of Austria in Italy.—(llear.) lie thought, therefore. pie of mediation was applicable more than in any other, that there was no prospect of a satisfactory issue, even it was in that of Austria. There had been a sanguinary if it had been undertaken on the most practical grounds. alienation then existing, and at the moment when the But when one considered what was the subject, and what honour of that country was supposed to be more or less they were to confer about, it was difficult to understune compromised in the result of the contest, it was con how any conclusion could have been arrived at. As sidered possible that the intervention of two such powers Austria from the first declared that she was not dis- as France and England would be successful in extricee posed to cede a single inch of that territory which she ing the parties from the difficulties in which they were had obtained by such sacrifices, he did not see what involved with honour to themselves. He was happy to there was to stipulate. It reminded him of the inter• s'ate that the official documents when produced would ference in the case of Switzerland, where, with more dispose of many of the una'hentic dispatches which, like ingenuity than good faith, we contrived to put the war base coin, had been circulated throughout Europe filling at an end before the mediation commenerd. And so the columns of the newspapers, and causing much mis here as to Austria it might well have been said that the apprehension to exist with reference to the parties who war was at an end. Austria did not wish to follow the lied, in reality, proposed the abandonment of Lom- King of Sardinia, and he might think himself fortunate bardy.—([fear, hear.) If howilities should recommence, to be allowed to retain his own territory. This war being certainly it would not be for want of the best exertion of at an end, he had no doubt her Majesty's Government Franco and England to prevent them. Every means had made more strenuous efforts to prevent its renewal had been used by the Governments of the two than they made when it first broke out; but it appeared powers to induce the King of Sardinia to recon that such efforts had been inn ffectual. Now, what was cider his determination. At the same time he was not it that her Majesty's Government proposed to do ? quite prepared to employ such very strong language as Such was their position that it was impossible any one the Noble Earl had though it right to use, in reference could believe th e ir s i ncer ity i n o bj ec ting to the war, to the course taken by that Power; for he could not but which had be en u n d er t a ken by the King of Sardinia. believe that there were circumstances to afford the King Seeing the violation of the general treaty of of Sardinia, he would not say a justification, he would Vienna, which was equally binding at this 'me- hardly my an excuse, but something like palliation, by ment seeing, especially, the engagement which events which had occurred in the disordered state of the the King of Sardinia had made with this country—in country, and the demands of his subjects. It was easy addition to which, seeing his contempt for the mediating for Noble Lords, or for persons sitting in Downing powers—and which mediation was his very salvation. — street now t o s it down, and, looking over the events of (llear, hear.) Seeing all this, no one would believe the the past years, apply to them the strict rule of diplomatic sincerity of her Majesty's Government unless they re- intercourse and international action; but in defence, not called her Majesty's Minister from Turin.—(llear, of the Government of Sardinia only, but of all Govern hear.) He held in his hand a manifesto from the Sar- merits, he submitted, that when the events arose by dinien Government, which for its inconsistency and which continental Europe had during the last year been audacity was unparalleled.—(Hear, hear.) It was fall convulsed—when those Governments saw the clouds of fine words of honour and good faith ; and he should lowering and the storm breaking—threatening some with have thought such word's would almost have paralysed the immediate, others with remote, subversion and destruction, hand which indicted them.—(Hear, hear.) It rejected to the course taken at such a time and under such dr at once all treaties, ancient and modern, considering cumstanees those rules in all their severity and all their them all us good for nothing, and quite forgetting that strictness were not altogether applicable; he knew not it was only by treaties that the King of Sardinia held one of the Governments which had been affected by possession of Genoa—(dear, hear)— that it was only by those events whose acts would bear that strict test—not the treaty of Vienna that he was not now in his island of even that of Austria, one of the oldest and strongest in Sardinia.—(Hear, hear.) This mode of treating all Europe. He did not think that that Government, acted engagements showed the desperation, madness, and upon as it was by the events of last year, could show a utter want of good faith of the King of Sardinia.— course of perfect consistency, either in reference to the (Hear.) He accused Austria of a violation of th e armis- transactions of Europe generally, or even of Germany. , tice, when it wets notorious that, from the first, the vie- He knew that every empire, especially ono CO situated, Litton had been on the part of Sardinia. For instance, was bound to bow to the feelings of the g reat . could mas f the continuance of the fleet in the Adriatic contrary to the people; but if, by the force of events it and h uld the express stipulations.—(llear, hear.) But he had no control, it was driven out of its habitual,.eproper,, doubt they should soon see a satisfactory reply to this strictly honourable course, surely some inumeenees o h regard to a powerful extraordinary document by Austria. There was just be extended to it; one passage which he would read. It said—" And has , and strong Governeaaenndt if so with of Austria, how much ing weighed all the chances, examined the remote and more should such indulgenceen,if , bo extended to a smaller when driven by currents it immediate causes of the last events, it has come to the and weaker Government, to r stem, it pursued a course which, on conviction that it is not less necessary for Upper Italy found impossiblees, could not he justified?—(Hear, hear.) than for the whole of the Peninsula, to be delivered from mean to justify the, conduct of the the present state, in which otherwise the most important !,. sit . re r i d ed i t n iaP i e ri ‘ n n"°.t G P Government, but the Government of Aus conditions of political and social existence would be assented, as it clearly did, to the pro- Sardiniant'ria, having placed in jeopardy. After all these considerations, the posed mediation, had given the strongest proof of that Government saw that there was but oneit asseat by negotiating month after month as to the par decidedcourse open to it; it had no choice but war, and l ticular place in which the mediation should take place; accordingly." Now, this was, to use a h e o r na l e es e s . having nevertheless, after appointing a person to but expressive expressive English saying, neither more i n a Hear, duct it on her part, and after her assent had been con , than " Needs must when the d-1 drives. tinued six months, suddenly refused the necessary hear," and great laughter.) That unffharLits.fheeni.isg,uns powers to give effect to the mediation, it had given, if was impelled by a force greater thanhandn's of others, not a sufficient excuse, at least a palliation for the con whoe tool and an instrument in if he he were to succeed duct of Sardinia in entering into that which might be a were hostile to him; and in driving the Austrian army out of Italy to-morrow, long and must be an unfortunate wan—Meer, hear.) his difficulties would be only t hen begun.—(Hear, hear.) The Governments of England and France would, what ell the InftnltelSetOlOvnetari.llGd, their Lord- soever the resu l t , have the sa ti s faction to reflect that Netwithstanaing of the Italian they had done all in their power to prevent the resumpe :hips had heard nothing of 1 subjects. The !louse used to hear a good deal of the Lion of hostilities and to avert the evils of war. This leaden and iron sceptre of Austria, and such like figures; was a gra tifyi ng circumstance, and in conclusion he but he behaved t hat the Austrian provinces had long would observe that it was of the greatest imp ortanee to been the best administered of any part of Italy. Con. Europe an d t o the world, and the best security for the ofpeace, should war r hall not, but property was secure, justice restoration un.urtunately have 'on they stistsuatidministered between man and man with as much broken out, and for the future preservation of peace, purity w and impartiality as in any country in Europe. that two countries like France and England They had now, or would shortly have, a constitution as should bo found uniting to get h er i n the en frreas heart could desire. He only:hoped and trusted they fleavour to maintain universal peace.—(Hear, hear.) inight be zs happy amid us prosperous with a constitution He looked forward with confidence to the time as they had beats without one; but, hoe e v e r, that co n when, by the jo hat exertions of the Governments of stitution they would have, and he could not help taking those two countries—by their uniting in the same poli cy, that oeportunity of expressing the joy he felt that the and making peace th e i r ro l e o bj ect — t h e general peace of Austrian empire possessed statesmen having the Europe would be restored and preserved.— (Hear, hear.) boldness and the ability to frame such a Constitution at He had only further to assure the Noble Earl and the the present time. He rejoiced to say that this noble House that the papers connected with the negotiations work—for noble it was—would p r obably be promulgated should, at the proper time, be laid before the House. through Italy as well as other parts of Europe; and he Lord BROUGHAM heartily agreed in two of the hoped, for the sake of the C o ntinent, and especially for propositions laid down by the Noble Marquis—the on e that of England, that Austria might, under the Consti- the importance to the peace of Europe, and the best in. tion, enter upon a long career of happiness and glory,— t erests o f t hi s cou ntry, of preserving a good understand (Cheers.) If the Noble Marquis should tell him that the ing with France (and he gave credit to his Noble Friends correspondence to which he alluded could not be pro- apposite for their successful junction with France, even duced at the present moment with coirienieneo, he (tho in tho.deubtfulluatta of the. 51 trtliujiill Mediatioe)—the NORTH OF ITALY. The Earl of ABERDEEN rose to draw the attention of their Lordships to the state of affairs in the north of Italy. He had long feared, from the attitude assumed by the Sardinian Government, that the war would be renewed, hut he had abstained from drawing their Lordships' attention to the subject--se long as any chance remained of peace being preserved, or of the Brussels congress taking place. He moved for the production of any correspondence which had taken place between her Majesty's Government and any other Powers with a view to the preservation of peace. He dis approved of the course of policy pur ued by our Government in the north and south of Italy. It was now just twelve months since the King of Sardinia had, with perfidy unparalleled, invaded the territories of Austria in Italy without a declaration of war, and without the allegation of any grievance or injury. He would, before• going further, allude to the position of her Majesty's Govern ment between the contending parties. Last year two dispatches from Prince Metternich, dated 24 Au gust, 1847, declaring that the Emperor of Austria had no object in view in his proceeding but to secure the observance of the treaty of 1815, and the answer of Lord Palmerston recalled the attention o' Prince Metternich to the right which the independent Italian States possessed of introducing reforms in the in ternal administrations. Her Majesty's Government, en tertaining an idea that the Austrian Government enter tained ambitious views of aggression and encroach ment in Italy, instructed the Minister at Vienna to represent to the Austrian Government the hope that Austria did not entertain views of aggression on Sardinia or the Pope, and reminding the Austrian Government of the alliances existing between this coun try and Sardinia, and that it could not look with indif ference on any aggression by Austria against the King of Sardinia. Six months after, in the month of August, on the moion of his NoLl. and Learned Friend, the answer to the dispatch was produced, in which Prince Metternich assented to the justice of the principle hid down of non-interference in the internal affairs of the Italian states, and declaring the readiness of Austria to place herself by the side of Great Britain in order to defend Sardinia against foreign aggression. The Go vernment had been in possession of this answer twelve months before they laid it before the House. How, then, while in possession of such an answer could the Govern ment take credit for having st o pp ed Austrian aggres sion. That answer ought to have been produced at the sa me time with the other di s p atches, and the non productionoituen tin g feeling silnt fact, to an assertion o f that which was actually false. Ho it on could tiolef tAh n ue o s t t r itar b nu u t t h Government. e a x m c n acqu i t t e d the Noble Marquis of all blame in t h is transac ti o n, to which he • would not have lent him onf,asinadignsuatpipoornfessi self bad he been aware Of the nature of it. OW gall of Aberdeen) had asked if similar re- 'I