The Sun. — London, England, 1828-04-22 00:00:00

~''l 'is view et ed- whic h any actlY also to the s, that the wo cue 0 ° o take 0 0 he tnie Englo 4 - 1 ' . ed in to' ;e of the fitting t o ieir 1,01: 3 ; vere whiell, 11 . Ae t/ , pt to sat e ; eratioa reflectioi holiest rift t could li e lie 0 , 0 1 opinino of nnecessof .cts w ho , refine tal i to being eee Acts to and Stat e ' vhich th e their Pre:' egat' !are d- s " 1 et:- lumber of [stcning to rellingtoot in of th e od that it to declar e ew Testa' churcilti• atiefactill e he clause , 3ill, whei ich it Was to several ivitid be it of it. that the a the face our Jesus the heed' oks.of the Lns otestant s, ity:: mill in es' r. foble Ea ,l ven notice eir Lord' sent frog' h they 311 the sa.iP e claratioo , d, in all I doge" -This de" tnd dello" nd of tb c nstitutioo of 03(1 ; red by all to v ;itly olaration• hose Per:, themselves Christiaus. and yet dis'uelicvc in the divinity or Christ. It is for that express impose that I would alter the declaration into the form which I have proposed,—" I declne in the presence of God, and in the name of his Son our Saviour ;Jesus Christ." These words can give no of fence to any person who believes in the fundamental doc trines of the Christian faith. The Earl of CARNARVON—If your Lordships in as evil hour shall think lit to accede to the amendment just prop ose d by th e N o bl e Duke, I shall feel it my duty °Prease this Bill in every future stage of it. Instead of limiting yourselves to imposing upon all aspirants fee " t lice a declaration that they will not, by any power en trusted to them by virtue of their office, injure the rights and privileges of the Church, you are now calling upon therm to make a declaration of their creed. You are en tering into details of faith, when you call upon them to declare what part of the Scriptures of the Old and New . IC eitainent they believe in. Now, can you say that there are , no coetroverted books, no apocryphal writings, on wnich different sects do not entertain different opinions ? Whilst you express your desire to throw open the doors of °true to all classes of Dissenters, why do you close them belief telling upon them to make a declaration of their "eliel in all parts of the Old and New Testament, which you have made canonical by authority ? By such declare i°ll we plunge at once into an endless labyrinth, and we m astitute for an antique law, which scarcely embarrasses "Y one e a new clause, of which no one can define the If the proposed words should be inserted in Cie original declaration, I shall feel myself under the n ecessity of opposing the Bill. .Lord CALTHORPE had the most sincere desire to up hold religion in the deepest reverence ; but it appeared to bins that every step made to add to the religious privileges qf the Church, any thing in the shape of a religious test b eyond that security which she had already in public esti - Metion, had a direct tendency to depreciate the value of . that' hunk and of those scriptures en which it was her h ighest boast to found her doctrines. For these re asons he 'confessed that he for one should have been better pleased if t he Bill - which came from the House of Commons had Partaken of a civil test more simply than be feared that it ban' would partake, from the changes which the declara tion. had . 'already undergone, and from those with which it Ras - menaced. It indicated a consciousness of weakness, t 0 impose 'on others a test from which their con "c'enee shrank; and such a course, so far tiom i l l Pholdin g the dignity of the Church of England, ad a 'tendency to weaken and impair it. He cnld have wished that the Bill before their Lord- Ps had continued to maintain its original character, ”._° 'had p re s e r ve d di s ti nc t th e r e ligiou s and civil h t,' r acter of the privileges of the Church. He believed "at the Church of England was rising higher and higher every day in public regard, and he therefore could not ac beta ce in tho se a pp re h ens i ons w hi c h l e d th e N o bl e E ar l t„ ~y him to move the amendment to the declaration Was then before the House. If there were any se de ti ts, it should be a civil security. It would be extremely treble t o p u t an en d t o th e T es t an d C or p orat i on A c t s , •L t only if they considered themselves bound to rescue the M . ( ;; ; erit from degradation, to r e scu e th e i r f e ll ow - su bj ec ts, q ` rescue—which, in his , opinion, was the most aggra ."ed case--the Church ; but if they were also to consider a learning to future legislators not to legislate in the ' fi e spirit in which th e se Acts had been passed. If th e y we re dictat e d by a si ncere an d hon e st desis t: to uphold the Etnity and security of the Church, they must not perpe ate the same error which had marked the conduct of th ose 4 first p ro p ose d the Test and Corpor a ti on A c t s —th a t spe ,., of error whi c h had deprav e d th e h o ly sacramen t it se lf,— itwas true, with a wish to do so, but which, never tl+lsa'a in the desire of upholding the interests of the church 3 "q overlooked the upholding of the sanctity of th e sacra -424. Though certainly he, for one, was ready to do ~n p le justice to'the feelings and the motives of those who 1. 7 . ? made this change in the declaration, yet he could not 1 ,7 1 P feeling that if they went on thus changing the decla tv—ti°o, step by step, it would be the same as though they a ere to undo with one hand what they were doing with other. He wished the Noble Duke at the head of the Pniv f o ernent had taken an opportunity of explaining what , rn I:%freaa him the other night, respecting the reasons which , 41 indu ce d hi s M a j es ty' s Government to take this step, 1 — t Meant what the Noble Duke had said respecting it being 'air alteration, that was supported by a considerable ma- J°t itl of the House of Commons,—because it seemed ~,, hi m , that one the most memorable circumstances c a ttending this Bill was, that in the other House, where„ 'rotri its very constitution, the Dissenters might be sup- Posed to have some influence, the Bill was not at first re eeiVed with such unanimity as it was received in this, Z s t i ' l leh contained so many of th e cons tit u t e d h ea d s o f t h e U tehs'and in which the church would receive peculiar "itection and support. He therefore considered the Bill, ta:Ott.„.inuch due measure of relief to th e Diss e nt er s, b u t Pr Z f onsidered it in its more important character of a chti 'proof anxiety on the part of that House to rescue the i tibo re ° fora hose reproaches under which it had so long _ured _ by the continuance of these Acts. He hoped the declaration and every part of the Bill would be so rnodi • a 3 to give relief to the Dissenters, and confer benefit • ti , t hechar e l s . • Lon] REDESDALE would ask their Lordships, what it a3 the simple law on this subject as it now stood? For O *as: very simple, though it might be objectionable: Vbv, it merely supposed that those persons who took 5h,...- e lj were members of the Established Church; and, ir°re, instead of interrogating them individually— sete Yua a member of the Church of England it said, You conform to the ceremonies of that Church? bee if yon'Aer, will not inquire more particularly." ti was' the simple law as it now stood, and the dechua °° Would "fisted oil introduce doubt and difficulty where none now. If they would by an Act simply repeal the l it t f l ent law, then matters would stand pre c i s ely as they did e t 2e the passing of the law. The Church of England 4. hefeire the passing of the Test and Corporation Acts, ti ; a a• it stood now. To introduce a clause like thi s , h owever , *Ohl lea.d to endless disputes. Many men would declare 1 , 1 4 they would not swear to, and some men did no t thi n k 1 1 11 13 ath binding if it were not proposed in their own way. A Y could never see an end of the difficulties to which l oe IlLttee would lead. If they would say that it was no th, t ' e necessary that persons taking offices should show that te l Were members of the Established Church by adhering not eerernoniee, let them repeal the law altogether, and alit ▪ complicated difficulties by such an alteraticn as that a li t Proposed. But, after all, what did it do? Why it e se ,. * ,ed a man to exercise every other influence in the .. qo but that which he derived from his office. It ad- Trub •m'etl L to office any person, whatever his religious opinions ll eah 4 " t hs, if he would promise not to make his office the I thC 3 of subverting the Church. The first Church in th eb eountry was the Church of Rome ; but at one time Lo l f a h arl a king upon the throne who had the House of ki d " 3 quite at his command. He was a sort of absolute th e t' and by the influence of his political power threw off (.I, B4 Preinacy of the Pope, and so they went on until the tape oh of England was established. Political influence, eal, ef° re, their Lordships, would see, created what was rd the Established Church. h e e Duke of WELLINGTON (as we understood) said, ssla a l3 not aware when' he proposed an addition to the de it inn, which he thought would evince unanimity, - that li s i t tn lld be objectionable to officers in the army and navy. thar,und by reference to the Act of the 3d of Geo. 111. 91 0 ,.;rt Would effect the exclusion of Catholics ; and he re 4, :therefore propose a clause to the same effect, but in tO niprehellilVC terms. siaZor d .HOLLAND observed, that there was now a dis • • krt tlestion before the Committee. , ah . 4 1, Contersation between Lords T E NTERDEN, ELDO2i, APTESBUZY, 411 6 GREY said the amendment before the House 'lllll4tia put, and any other amendme nt p ro p osed at a ati e , - ! n t period. As to the words which it wa s the in °f the Noble Duke to insert, he must say t hat he pot e . ot . Wish them to form a part of the Bill. For his own !hula ! e l4d eed, he should have been more content with a t_, 4 Peal of the existing laws, without any declare -4%4'1. He should prefer that the Church of England i 'llea, st anri, as assuredly it would stand, upon that rock 'Wpm 'C I , formed by the purity of its doctrines and the kta t i.iL ae character : of its professors. These would form /tete 7 enou h , without the aid of Test and Corporation g witl sot n these the Church of Ireland had rested in safety, afford, r any flitch assistance as these Acts were supposed to aasin g i t _ a nd - if it were exposed- to any danger at all, it was • Inajoi t " . those severe, and intolerant laws which made the ,estahli e l l Of the people of Ireland the enemies' of the Church Ple r e ,nient. If; then, he should have preferred the sim tirretral of the existing laws, so also be should have pre the • • a irlee t k l . .'simple declaration as it originally stood, to the ~eotdeta Which had been proposed in it. To the first tin • ny t h W i e ntitteed by the Noble Duke be had no objec was - afraid that by their endeavours to con bhich th !Y...frequently got into difficulties. The ground te v i •Nohle Duke had tak e n on this question entitled deaet;xrit thanks of the country, and increased the confi 't w ere , is eh he (Earl Grey) had in the Noble Duke. If for Ought that some further proof of the candidate b ettee, L l l . :eng a Christian were necessary, it would be Posed, IV_ alna to add, as a Reverend Prelate had pro- Ward s - to words "on the true faith of a Christian," or conee r , t 2nat effect. As far, however, as unanimity was better as he thought the declaration would have been ese .s stood. 1 "711 m ere His object, however, in rising, had 7 t o Point out the course by which their I,9rd . ships might proceed in a more simple way. Let the amendment now before the House be first proposed, anti when that was disposed of, the Noble Earl might propose the insertion of the words respecting our Saviour—worth, however, he must be allowed to say,- that he should cer tainly oppose the introduction of, because he was con vinced that they'would destroy the measure—and if they were inserted, he, for one, should vote against the Bill. The Earl of SHAFTESBURY then put the question that,. after the word " declare,". the words "on the true faith of a Christian" should be inserted. Tie Amendment was agreed to. Lord HOLLAND perfectly concurred with those Noble Lords who had said that they should have preferred the simple repeal of those Acts to any other measure, but find ing that the object of the Noble Duke was to procure una nimity, he should not offer any objection to the Noble Duke's proposition. His object was this—that the same words occurred in onother oath taken by the same set of persor, and though he should not press this objection, yet he could not have the pleasure of saying " content" with the great majority of their Lordships. The Earl of ELDON had some other words to propose, which be should abstain from pressing on the attention of their Lordships then. He should, however, propose them on the report, when he should again make the mo tions which their Lordships had negatived. He should do this, not for the purpose of raising any discussion upon them, but that he might record, on the journals of their Lordships, that he had made them. The question tvas then put and carried in the affirma tive, without a division. The Earl of WINCHELSEA then proposed the intro duction of the words, "and our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ." After a remark from the Bishop of LLANDAFF, the House divided upon it— Contents Non-contents Majority 9S The Amendment was therefore lost. On our re-admission, we found Lord TENTERDEN suggesting an Amendment, for the purpose of securing that the governing Members of Corporations should be Members of the Churehof Eng land : it was in the form of an addition to the declaration in the subsequent terms—" I entertain no opinion on the subject of religion, that can or may prevent my attending the morning and evening service of the Church of Eng land, as set forth in the Book of Common Prayer." His Lordship made a few remarks upon the propriety of hold ing out inducements to Members of Corporations to belong to the Establishment, in order that they might reach the higher offices. The Bishop of CHESTER asked, whether it was not at the present moment the law, that no Chief - Magistrate of a Corporation could attend a conventicle , with the in signia of his office? Lord TENTERDEN replied, that such might be the law ; but if it were, it did not go half the length of his Amendment. The Bishop of CHESTER begged to remind the Noble and Learned Lord, that when the Bill against occasional conformity was passed, in order to quiet the apprehensions of those who thought it would take Magistrates from the Church and carry them to conventicles, it was enacted that nd Magistrate should attend, with the insignia of his office, any place of worship but the Established Church.— He believed that that law was not only at present in force, but that it was well known to the Members of all the Cor porations. _ _ Lord DONOUGHMORE asked (we believe) whether the Amendment was intended to apply both to England and Ireland ? Lord TENTERDEN answered, that the Act of Charles 11. only applied to England. Lord HOLLAND remarked, that the Test Act was not in force in Ireland, and Dissenters were there Members of Corporation.. Lord ELDON agreed, that• the existing law was what had been stated by the Bishop of Chester. - After a few words from the Bishopof GLOUCESTER a division took place. The numbers were— Contents 22 Not Contents lll Majority against the Amendment---89 The Earl of LAUDERDALE moved that the words " within this 'realm" should be omitted, and " England and Wales" substituted instead of them. There was no necessity to include Scotland, where the people had confi dence enough in the purity of their Clergy and in the soundness of their doctrines to maintain their Church without any tests or declarations. The Amendment was agreed to. The Bishop of CHESTER gave notipe that he intended to move the insertion of the epithet " Episcopal" in the terms of the Declaration, so as to style the Established Church the Protestant Episcopal Church. Lord HOLLAND remarked, that the Declaration re ferred to the Protestant Church 'as by law established, which could mean only that to which the Right Rev. Pre late belonged. The Bishop of CHESTER said, he would state can• didly at once what his reasons were. He understood that some of the Dissenters considered themselves, to a certain sense, established by law in this country. To prevent any equivocation, which, however, was an intention he was far from imputing to the framers of this sill, he intended to propose this Amendment ; where even possible error could be avoided by the insertion of a single word, he thought there could be no objection. The Marquis of LANSDOWNE observed, there could he no objection to the Amendment, and suggested, that the most convenient time fur it, now as the clause had passed, would be on the consideration of the Report. . _ Some verbal Amendments, at the instance of the Earl of ELDON, were agreed to in the next claube. The Earl of ELDON called the attention of their Lord ships to the following clause, relative to the offices, by the holders of which the Declaration was to be made. This was a very important clause. As it was not intended to apply the Declaration to all offices of trust, he would pre fer that a schedule of those to which it was to be applied should be made out and appended to the Bill. The consideration of this clause and another, therefore, it was agreed, should be postponed till Thursday, when the Report will be further considered. The House resumed, and the Report was brought up. The Bill was ordered to be printed with the Amendments. The House then Adjourned at a Quarter past Twelve. HOUSE OF COMMONS, APRIL 21. Mr. Smith brought up Returns from the Office of the Masters in Chancery, pursuant to the orders of the House. Mr. JOHN wool) presented a petition from the Merchants and Shipowners of Liverpool, praying that the Bill relating to the Harbour of Liverpool may not pass into a law. Lord WILLIAM PAULETT presented a'petition from the Inhabitants of the North Riding of the county of York, praying that the Clarence Railway may not pass into a law. EAST LONDON RAILWAY. Mr. Alderman THOMPSON presented a petition from St. Ann's, county of Middlesex, against the East London Railway Bill. Mr. Alderman WAITHMAN presented a similar peti tion from 411 Saints, -- Pirplar. The petitions were re ferred to the Comtnittee on the,Bill. • FRIENDLY SOCIETY BILL. Sir C. BIORGAN presented a petition from Newport, against the Bill for the regulation of Friendly Societies. Similar petitions were presented by Mr. Egerton, from a Friendly Society in S toc k port ; b y Mr. Davenport, from Stockton, Cheshire ; by Mr. John Wood, from two Friendly Societies in Preston, Lancashire ; by Sir George Robins, nine petitions from Friendly Societies in Northamp ton ; by Mr. Dundas, from a Friendly Society in Ipswich, county of Suffolk ; and by M r . Ald e rm an Waitb man from a Benefit Society held at the Three Tuns, Ches ter, and also from Stockton. The Hon. Alderman was convinced that the Bill was intended for the benefit of the members of the Friendly Societies, and he hoped it would receive such amendments as would render it palatable to the Members and to the public. The petitions were all referred to the Committee on the Bill. Mr. SHIRLEY presented a petition from the Grand Jury o f M on aghan against any further concessions to the Roman Catholics. The Hon. Member also presented seven similar petitions from parishes in the county of Monagh an . Mr. R. COLBORNE presented a petition from the also Northampton, i n f a _ ented a petition from th e your ßo s in i raonfßtCyhaeAt i DI cs Catholic Claims. Sir MARTlN Llaieinins. s t p e r r e , s Trustees of a Turnpike road at Portsea, praying the House passing gTurnpik e Bills. to T in h a e ke H n on ew . Arealasttionnas for lso presented a Petition from the Mayor and Corporation of Plymouth, against the Alehouse Licensing Bill. The Hon. Member also presented a Peti tion from the Mayor and Corporation of Plymouth for the repeal of the Duties on Stamp Receipts. Sir JOHN CALVERT presented a petition from the Mayor and Corporation of rluntingdon, relating to the Bill for Licensing Ale houses. • ' Alderman WAITHMAN gave notice, that to-morrow he would present a petition respecting the losses sustained by Government Annuities. 5100 RE gave notice that on Thursday he would present a petition from the Corporation of Dublin against any further concessions to the Roman Catholics. Mr. TYLER presented a similar petition from a Friendly Society meeting at the sign of the Griffin in Coventry. Mr. Alderman THOMPSON preSented =iVe similar peti tions from Friendly Societies in London, one of which was, he said, established no less than one hundred and twenty seven years, during which time no difference whatever oc curred amongst its Members. This alone, he thought was a sufficient proof that such an Act was wholly unnecessary. Mr. Alderman WOOD presented three similar petitions from Societies in the county of Lancaster. Mr. Alderman WOOD also presented a petition from a parish in the North Aid;ng of Yorkshire, praying for some restriction upon the importation of lead ore. Sir M. W. RIDLEY presented a petition from the Ro man Catholic Inhabitants of Waddington, in Northumber land, in favour of the Roman Catholic Claims. Sir T. LETHBRIDGE presented a petition from Si mersetshire, against concession to the Roman Catholics. The SOLICITOR-GENERAL presented a petition from the Medical and Chirurgical Society of London, praying that the House would inquire into the difficulties which attended the studies of Students of Anatomy. _ Colonel CHICHESTER presented a petition from the Roman Catholic Inhabitants of Sutton, in Wexford, in favour of the Catholic Claims. Colonel CHICHESTER presented a petition from the Owners of South Down Farms praying that the House would afford a protection to the Wool Trade ; also a peti tion fro.n the Proprietors of the Hibernian Joint Stock Mining Company, residing at Wexford, praying for the dissolution of that Company. Mr. LEONARD presented two petitions from Friendly Societies in Ipswich, against the Friendly Societies' Bill. Sir A. CAMPBELL presented two petitions, one front the Surgeons of the University of Glasgow, and the other from the students of medicine in the same Univeisity, pray ing that some enquiry should be made into the difficultie!, , at present presenting themselves to students in anatomy. Mr. LEICESTER presented two petitions from Hamp , shire, against the Friendly Societies Bill, and said there were so many objections to the Bill, that he hoped.the Hon. Gentleman who brought it forward, would for the present withdraw it, until further consideration could• he given to its provisions. Sir F. BURDETT presented two. petitions from thc Memhers of the Benefit Societies held at. the Old George, Drury-lane, and the Half Moon and Seven Stars, Adam street, Cannon-street, against the Friendly Societies Bill.- Referred to the Committee on the Bill. BOROUGH OF LUDLOW. Sir F. BURDETT presented a petition from certain inhabitants of the Borough of Ludlow, stating that the Corporate Body of that Borough, which consisted of a mayor, 12 aldermen, and 25 common councilmen, held by charter considerable lands for the benefit and amelioration of the borough.. That the old burial-ground having become very crowded, and wholly inadequate to the purposes of burial, an application was made to the Cor poration in the years 1811, 12, and 13, for a new burial ground, but this application not having been attended to by the Corporation, an inquiry was instituted, and it appeared that in 1771 the Corporation got possession of an old chapel to which there was a burial ground attached, an alms-house and lands bequeathed by one Charles Fox to the Corporation as trustees for charitable purposes stated in the will of the testator, that immediately after having got pos session of those tenements the Corporation pulled down the chapel, and let the burial-ground on lease for 99 years at an annual rent of 1/. 14s. A petition was signed by some of the most respectable inhabitants in the borough, pray ing that the Corporation would either give to the borough the burial ground or other land, but the prayer having been disregarded, the petitioners, acting under the advice of counsel, filed a bill in Chancery against the Cor poration in 1813, alleging that the Corporation had acted illegally, and ought, under Sir S. Romilly's Act, to make restitution. In 1815, the Vice-Chancellor pronounced a Decree against the Corporation, stating that they could no longer be trustees for the charitable purposes of the donor, and that the Corporation should pay the costs. This de cree, which was afterwards affirmed by the Lord Chancellor, was reversed upon an appeal to the House of Lords, upon the ground that the breach of trust by the Corporation, did not come within the operation of Sir S. Romilly's Act; but ought to be the subject of a criminal proceeding. They prayed the House to institute an enquiry into the conduct of the Corporation, with a view to give them redress, and to give the petitioners an opportunity to establish by evi dence, that during the proceedings in the House of Lords, two Noble Lords (Lord Powis, the Recorder of the Bo rough, and Lord Redesdale) had interfered in an improper and unconstitutional manner. Lord CLIVE regretted that the Honourable Baronet had not, before he presented the petition, communi cated with him upon the subject, because he was satis fied that he could show the Honourable Baronet that the facts were misrepresented in the petition, but when he said so, he wished it to be distinctly understood, that neither he nor his Noble Relative, nor the other Noble Lord mentioned in the petition, had any wish to throw any impediment in the way of any inquiry which the House might think fit to institute. The fact was, that the chapel alluded to was in a most sad ruinous condition, and a representation to that effect was made to the Grand Jury of Ludlow, 4o far back as the Year 1750, and the appeal was not brought by the Corporation with any oppressive or vexatious views, but 'was brought in consequence of the advice of the late Lord Gifford, the present Lord Chancellor of England and Ireland, and of his Majesty's Attorney-General. Sir J. YORKE said he did not think the Noble Lord had given any explanation as to the most material al legation in the petition, namely the granting a lease of the old burial-ground. Lord CLIVE said the question at issue between the parties was, whether or not this burial-ground was paro chial ? and that issue was decided in the negative in fa vour of the Corporation, but since that period a sufficient quantity of ground had been granted by the Cor poration as a burial ground. Mr. SPEAKER having read the petition, suggested to the Hon. Baronet the propriety of considering whether, according to the usual forms of the House, a petition, containing charges against Members of the other House of Parliament, acting in their appellant ju risdiction, could be received, and whether it would net be better to Withdraw the petition, in order to have the latter part of the prayer expunged. Sir F. BURDETT, after some observations, withdrew the petition. COLLEGE OF SURGEONS. Mr. PEEL presented a petition from the President and Counsel of the Royal College of Surgeons in London, stating the difficulties which existed in procuring a sufficient supply of subjects for anatomical purposes, and praying that an enquiry upon the matter might be insti tuted. He should, for the present abstain from offering any observations, but should reserve himself until the discussion which would take place to-morrow upon the subject. Mr. Secretary PEEL presented similar petitions from the surgeons of Leeds. Sir JOSEPH YORKE suggested, that it might be very advantageous for anatomical purposes, that the bodies of persons who died by suicide should be given up for sur gical dissection. He did not mean the bodies of persons who perished by suicide under delicate circumstances..-but those whose bodies were unclaimed. He thought much advantage would follow from the investigation of the brains of persons dying in that way. The petition was then brought up. Mr. HUME said he hoped that seine Hon. Member would be able to suggest to the Committee some measure of supplying the anatomical schools, without at all offend ing the prejudices of the people. He hoped, therefore, that the Hon. Member opposite would suspend his judg ment until the Bill should have gone into a committee. Mr. Secretary PEEL presented a similar petition from Huddersfield, in Yorkshire, and took the opportunity of adverting to what had fallen from his Gallant Friend be hind him (Sir Joseph Yo,rke). It might be true that the supply of anatomical subjects would be increased by the means lie had mentioned; but he much doubted if it would not eventually prove injurious, as tending to keep alive the prejudice of the public against the dissection of the bodies of their deceased relatives. The petitions were then ordered to be laid on the table. Sir JAMES MACKINTOSH presented a petition from the Medical Society of Edinburgh, complaining of the im pediments which stood in the way of the study of ana tomy, and praying that the House would take the matter into their consideration, and endeavour to obviate the same. He was disposed to protect and venerate the right s o f sepul ture ; but it was o f th e utmost importance to the country, that the useful and noble science of anatomy should he cultivated. Without doing anything inconsistent with the interests of hu man ity, h e thought mor e encouragement might be given to that science than it at present enjoyed. He did not anticipate much advantage to that science from the proposition of the Gallant Admiral (Sir J. Yorke), that the bodies of persons perishing by suicide should be given for dissection. That would be a very trivial increase to relieve the dearth at present complained of. It would be seen, on inquiry, that there were far fewer suicides in London—the capital city, he might say, of Europe— than in any other city of Europe, in proportion to its in habitants. In Paris, with only half the population, there Were, three times as many suicides, The number of ezecu- tions for murder in Eng Lind and Wale:, furnished a very in sufficient number of subjects fur anatomy. They did not ex ceed- fourteen annually, on an average, which was not core than an execution of one in 1,850,000 persons. He had looked into the report of the number of persons execu ted for murder in 1733, in Middlesex and London, and compared it with the number of executions for the last seven years, and it appeared, on comparison, that in 1733 one in 10,000 persons, and during the last seven years, one in a population of 70,000 was executed for murder, being a sevenfold diminution since the former period. He thought, therefore, that if the surgical profession were to be dependent upon those who were executed, the supply of bodies would be very scanty indeed. The Right Hon: and Learned Gentleman deprecated any legislative measure which added to the punishment of death, and congratulated the country on having the subject at present under discus sion referred to a Committee, from which he anticipated the most beneficial results. WAGES. Mr. D. W. HARVEY wished to call the attention ef the Right Hon. Gentlemen (Messrs. Ifuskisson and Bankcs) to the petition which he was about to present; as it referred to the policy of free trade, with which their names were principally associated. The departure from that policy might be regretted in the speeches of these Right Hon. Gentlemen, when measures bad been introduced to coun teract it; but be besought those Right Hon. Gentlemen and the Government, while they extended protection to the rich, not to deny the means of subsistence to the poor. There were many thousands in this country who could not procure Is. a day for labour; and how was it possible that such persons could exist if the primary article of subsist ence, bread, was made dearer at a time when the demand for labour and the wages for it were contracted? The Pe titioners ditlnot ask for any monopoly=for any exclusive privilege—for au undue advantage of any kind ; but merely prayed that the higher and wealthier classes should not receive extravagant protection, which must he attended with ruin and starvation to the bumbler classes of the community. On the Metion for bringing up the petition, Mr. FYLER observed, that the petitioners did not re. quire any fixed legislative standard of wages. All that, theyrequired was, . that occasional arrangements might be made with respect to wages by a Committee composed of the employed and the employers. To agree to this propo sition would, at least, quiet the minds of the petitioners ; and might have the effect of preventing great fluctuations in the rate of wages. Mr. C. GRANT was ready to de full justice to the motives of the petitioners, although he could by no means acquiesce in the prayer of the petition. The Hon. Gen tleman, who spoke last had adverted distinctly to what the Hon. Gentleman who presented the petition had, with more skill, only glanced at. It was evident that what they required was an Act to regulate the rate of wages. [The Right Mon. Gentleman here read a part of the peti tion, which prayed that a Law might be passed establish ing a Committee of the employers and the employed, by which Committee the rate of wages should from time to time be regulated; that monopolies and taxation should be abolished ; that corn should be admitted free from duty ; that all pensions, sinecures., &c. should be re duced, &c.]—ln the. first place, there was no .neces sary connection 'between these objects. It might be very advantageous to abolish monopolies and taxation ; but it did not follow that it would be advantageous to fix the rate of wages. But for the sake even of the peti tioners themselves, he must protest against any legislative interference on the subject of wages. If there was any one principle more firmly established than another, it was that any such interference must be injurious to all parties, and must press with especial severity on those classes by whom it was in this instance required. With respect to the rate of the wages of the silk weavers particularly, there was certainly nothing in their case at present that called for any interposition on their behalf. Four or five years ago the best workmen certainly obtained from 255. to 30s. a week ; but that was for a description of manu facture not now in demand. The wages obtained at that period for manufacturing the ordinary Bros de Naples were only 10s. or 12s. a-week ; at present the majority of workmen received eight-pence a.-yard for weaving, and were able to weave five-and-twenty yards a-week; making their wages sixteen or seventeen shillings a-week. If any proof were necessary of the benefits arising from the prin ciples of free trade, it would be found in the present con dition of the silk trade. Mr. HUME believed the petitioners were in a great error in wishing to have a rate of wages legislatively esta blished. Mr. A. DAWSON denied that the petitioners asked Parliament to regulate the rate of wages. Mr. P. THOMPSON expressed his firm conviction, that if any Act were passed to regulate the rate of wages, not a twelvemonth would elapse before petitioners would crowd to the House to implore its repeal. if over there had been a triumphant illustration of the principles of free trade, it existed in the present state of the silk trade ; which had increased within the last eighteen months more than it had done for the preceding forty or fifty years. He was willing, however, to support that_part of the peti • Lion which prayed for an unrestricted importation of corn. Mr. Alderman WAITHMAN very much doubted if the Silk Trade had improved generally, in the manner repre sented by the Hon. Gentleman who had just spoken; al though in some descriptions of articles it might have done so. The very statement of the Right Hon. Gentleman, that the workmen who, four or five years ago, could make thirty shillings a week, make now only sixteen, was a proof of this. He considered that the proof of the pro sperity of that, or of any other trade, was to be found in the importation of the raw material, and the exportation of the manufactured article. New, with respect to silk, we exported a great deal of raw material, and imported a large quantity of manufactured goods. For his part; be was quite at a loss to know what kind of reciprocity had been established between this country and France on this subject. It was undoubted that there had been a great re duction of the profits of weavers, and of all persons con cerned in the Silk Trade. The petitioners threw the House into the dilemma of answering their question, why they protected other trades if they did not protect theirs. Mr. C. GRANT had not asserted that workmen gene rally had received 255. or 30s. a week, whilst they were now receiving only 17s. What he had asserted was, that whilst some were receiving to the extent of 255. or even 30s. per week, the generality %vete in the receipt of only 12s. Mr. D. W. HARVEY explained. After a few words from Mr. FRA.NKLAND Lawn, Mr. Alderman THOMPSON, and Sir G. Pniturs, the petition was ordered to be printed. COMMERCE WITH THE UNITED. STATES OF AMERICA. Mr. S. WORTLEY seeing a Right Hon. Gentleman on the Treasury Bench, rose to put a question upon a stib ject of very general interest. It must be recollected by every body present, that last year there had been laid upon the table of the House Copies of the Correspondence which had been carried on between the late Mr. Canning, upon the part of Great Britain, and Mr. Gallatin, on be half of the United States of America, with reference to the negotiations upon the subject of the Commerce of the United States with the British West India Islands. That correspondence brought the negociation down to January, 1827. It left it at that period not terminated, but open to a renewal of negociations, if eithei party thought fit to do so. He was anxious to be informed upon the subject, for he was sorry to see any impediment to the free inter= ceuree of this country with one of the greatest of all com mercial nations. The feelings of attachment towards that country Were daily becoming stronger amongst the people of England, and, it was for the interests of all parties that a reciprocity of kindness should he encouraged. He should now ask the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite, whe ther any, and what, proceedings had taken place since Ja nc;,,lry last, with reference to the negociation between the United States and this country, en the subject of the com mercial intercourse between the United States and the Bri tish West India Islands ? HUSKISSON bad no difficulty in stating, that subsequent to the correspondence laid upon the table of the H ouse , there had been further communications nit the subject between Great Britain and the United States of America. Ile assured the lion. Gentleman, that there could not be the least objection on the part of the British Government to lay all the documents before the public; they bad already been published in America. The Hon. Gentleman might also feel satisfied, that the friendly senti ments by which he professed himself actuated towards the United States of America were such as the Government of this country would always be disposed and ready to pro mote in every possible manner. He could further state, that in a few days there would be laid on the table of the House, by command of his Majesty, certain credentials which had been passed between this country and the United States; and the ratifications recently received from Ame rica, relative to regulating the question of the North-West Boundary and other points of moment. WAYS AND MEANS. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved, that the House resolve itself into a Committee of the whole House, upon the Ways and Means. The Speaker having left the Chair, on the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, four mil lions were voted out of the Consolidated Fund already • granted, to be appropriated to making good certain sup plies already agreed upon by the House. The Stamps on Canis and Dice Duties' Reduction Bill was postponed till Friday next. The Committee of Supply was postponed to Wednesday. Mr. HUME could not help expressing his surprise, that, at so advanced a period of the Session, no notice had vet been taken of those Bills upon the Excise, the Stamp Duties, and other subjects with which the House was to be supplied. He wished to know if Alinisters intended to introduce these Bills during the present Session. y The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER must con fess that some delay was to he attributed to the difficulty he the found,respect ectto numerous t b e ei ge Stamps t l; oa s r would e of so many subj ec t s . Th e Bill w i t h cn soon as possible ; and with respect to the Bill for the Consolidation of the Excise, he hoped that, at all events, be should be able to bring it in so that it might be passed during the present Session. etl in offi ce , i n exam i n i ng i nto t be laid b e f ore t h e H ouse as Sir ALEXANDER GRANT brought up the Report upon the Records' Variance Bill. RENEWALS OF TURNPIKE BILLS. Mr. LITTLETON moved the Order of the Diy foi resuming the Adjourned Debate upon the Resolutions re garding the Renewals of Turnpike Bills. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER should object to the proposition of the Hon. Member, as it tended to throw an expence upon the public. The custom of im posing fees on Road Bills was extremely ancient; it com menced in 1700, since which time it had been twice con sidered, and continued without alteration during the last 130 years. When the House considered the great altera tion in the value of money since that time, they must surely perceive that the fees charged so long ago could not be looked upon as too high to be continued at present. The Right Hon. Gentleman, after a few additional obser vations, proposed an Amendment, that where Road Bills were merely renewals, and called for no additional powers, they should be exempted from fees; and that where Bills did call for 'such powers, the fees should be paid by the Commissioners of his Majesty's Treasury out of such monies as should be provided by Parliament for that purpose. LITTLETOZI, et:MN not accede to the Amendment prOisosed by his Right Hou. Friend. _ _ _ Mr. D. GILBERT thought it would be advisable to simplify all Turnpike Trusts as much as possible; and also, that ail renewals of Road Bills ought to be exempted from fees. Mr. CRIPPS thought that, in matters of such. great importance as the establishment of good public roads, all private interests ought to give way to the general public benefit. He thought too, that some plan ought to be de vised which would lessen the enormous expenses attending all private Bills. Mr. GORDON thought it would be most advisable to make the whole of the Road Bills public instead of private measures. Mr. Secretary PEEL objected to paying these fees out of the public funds on various grounds, but particularl:, because the expence could not then be so narrowly watched as at present by the Local Authorities. He should there fore support the Resolution of his Hon. Friend (Mr. Lit tleton) in preference to the Amendment of his Right Hon. Friend (the Chancellor of the Exchequer.) Mr. LITTLETON, in answer to the proposition of Eli , Right Hon. Gentleman, said that he had already postponed these Resolutions for three years. Last year he brought them before the House, and postponed them at the expres' desirs of his late ever-to-be-lamented friend. Mr. Canning ; and now he was called upon to postpone them again, ir order to afford time for inquiry. That was a proposition to which he could not give his assent. _ _ _ Mr. Secretary PEEL thought his• Hon Friend mistook what he said. He merely wished to afford time for in quiring if there were any fees paid which could be calks! greater in amount than the sum which ought to be paid for the trouble which .was given. If there were any such fees o he had no hesitation in saying they ought to be reduced. Strangers were then ordered to withdraw, when a divi sion took place, and the pumbers (as we understood) were, For the Resolutions For the Amendment 32 Majority against the amendment-IS On our return to the Gallery, we found Mr. LITTLE TON proposing the 4th Resolution, that a term not ex ceeding 31 years ought to be granted in the case of Turn pike Bills. After. a few words from Mr. DAVIES GILBERT and Mr. Secretary PEEL, Mr. ESTCOURT proposed a Resolution to be added, for the purpose of removing a very unnecessary piece of expence—the notice which the Standing Orders of the House required to be placed on the door of the County Sessions House, with respect to Turnpike Bills. He bo . - lieved that the fees of the House were not so much of the expence ola Bill as some persons imagined, for he knew a Turnpikeßill where the expence was 16G01., and the fees of the Houses of Lords and Commons amounted only to two hundred and forty pounds, the remainder being con sumed in Solicitors' bills, and the expeuce of notices which he had alluded to. Mr. LITTLETON knew many cases of the failure o 1 Bills from neglecting this formality of the notice on the door of the Sessions House. It was a Standing Order framed before Newspapers became so numerous or were so extensively circulated, but now that the notice was inserted in those papers, he thought the notice on the Sessions House an useless and expensive formality. Mr. C. W. WYNN would even go further, and abo lish the necessity of notices on the doors of Churches. After a few words, Mr. ESTCOURT withdrew his Reso lution, and the original Resolution of Mr. LITTLETON was agreed to. The Offences against the Person Bill, and the Law of Evidence Bill, were read a second time, and ordered to be committed on Monday, the sth of May, upon Mr. Secre tary PEEL giving notice of his intention to go into an ex planation of the nature of the provisions of the Bill on that day. Mr. C. W. W. WYNN moved the Order of the Day, for going into a Committee on the Election Trial Acts' Consolidation Bill. The several clauses of the Bill were agreed to ; the Report was brought up, and ordered to be taken into further consideration on Monday next. The other Orders of the Day were then agreed to. CANADA. Mr. Secretary HUSKISSON postponed the Motion until Friday next. The House then adjourned, at five minutes after Ten o'clock. SHIPPING INTEWGENCE-(THIS DAY.) FROM LLOYD'S. • Mat, Aran. 21.—Arrived from London the Sarah Ann, Green, for the South Seas; Magnet, Johnston, for Van Diemen's Land; Eliia, Wylie, fur Pernam buco ; and Jely-n, Phillipson, for Africa. PORTSMOUTH, Aran. 21. —Wind E.N.E.....-Arrived from London the Captain Cook, Willis, for Bombay; Lonacb, Totnland, for Bengal ; and Romulus, Cox, for Honduras. Passed the Carn Brea Castle, from Madras.— Ship at St. Helena—Duke of. Lancaster, Royal George, and Buckinghamshire. At the Cape—tb9 Governor Ready, from the Mauritius, and the brig Patience.. FALMOUTH, APRIL 20.—Wind N. to E.—Sailed the Ceylon, Davison, for Mauritius. boe•aa, Aram 21.—Wind N. N. W.—Off port the Newton, Vobreckt, ftom Matanzas. _ BRISTOL, APRIL 21.—Arrived the Ebenewr, Prosser, from St. Vincent's. LONDONDERRY, Arun, 17.—Arrived the Fortune, Rea, from Alieant. FAYAL, APRIL 2.—A large log of Pine timber,. marked A. A. drifted on shore about three weeks since, and had been apparently but a short time in the water. Thum, Aram 10.—The Cornwallis, Henderson, sailed hence on the 7th inst. for, Hacnburgh, ran on shore the same evening a little beyond Salvore Point, but was got off the following day without damage, after discharging part ofher cargo, and put into Peran to refit the water casks. HA3IRURGII, APRIL, 18.--By accounts from Riga up to tha 4th hist,, the ice had broken up. The Jane, Jaine•nu, sailed from Portsmouth the 4th July for Madras, and had not arrived there ou the 9th January. THE MARKETS.-(THIS DAY.) HAY MARICE ST. JA, s. .C. s I nwland Mead. Hay 3 Zi to 4 5 Upland Ditto 4 0 5 0 Rye-grass Hay 4 0 5 0 New Meadow ay 315 410 A good supply, and a dull trade ing to b SM ITH s. X. a. Lowland Mead. Hay 3 0t o 3 15 Upland Ditto Rya-grass Hay .. New Meadow Hay 310 4 0 S u pply good, and trade d ; per Load of 3G Trusses, MES'S. !. 4 Clover 0 to 5 15 O a t Straw ........... 110 114 Wheat Ditto ....... 114 11 8 ; jorites stationary, but threaten. ,e lower. FIELD. s. Z. s. Clov.llay generally 4 10 to 5 10 Do. extra tine 0 0 515 Oat Straw llO 112 Wheat Ditto .... 112 116 ill; prices as last quoted. Sir THOS. LETHBItIDGE, Bart. had a grand dinner rut - on Saturday, at his house, Whitehall-place. To COMMERCIAL, TRAVELLERS AND OTHERS, ALBION HOTEL, HAYMARKET, SHEFFIELD. WTR Avfs respectfully informs his nu . •tnercus Friends, Commercial Gentlemen, and the Public in general, that he has lately entered upon that spacious Inn, THE ALBION HOTEL, situate in the Haymarket, Sheffield, 80 many years known as " Healey's Hotel," where he trusts he shall meet with that encourage ment which, by an unremitting attention to business, it will be his constant study to deserve. The Premises have recently been most elegantly tittial up, and nothing conducive to the comfort of those who may honour him with their Patronage will be found wanting. \Vines and Spirits. at a moderate charge..—Good Bcd, and Stabling. Next week will be published, by Messrs. Longman and Co. Paternoster-row ; and S. Highley, Fleet-street ; ACOLLECTION of CASES of MEN TAL DISEASE, with Practical Observations the Medical Treatment, for the Use of Students. By ALEXANDER MORISON, M.D. President of the Royal College of Physicians of EtLu burgh, Lately published, by the same Author, • OUTLINES of LECTURES on MENTAL DIS EASES. Second Edition, with l 3 Plates, price 1073. 6.3. • • 4 ' . Axe" LONDON, TUESDAY EVENING, APRIL 22, 1828. We have no great partiality for the fashion which the House of Lords now so generally adopts, of tinkering Bills sent up from the Commons. With the most profound respect - for their Lord ships' judgments, we are frequently unable to detect anything of improvement, even when ther exertions fail in . utterly destroying what -is submitted to their handy work—and in the Bill which was last .night under their consideration, we fear that any farther changes will so distort it as to render it dif ficult to be recognised, and will utterly defeat the object which its promoters have in view. Indeed, we have our doubts, how far the clause i:►- troduced by the Bishop of LLANDAFF has not already succeeded in excluding some who now it in Parlia ment. How, for instance, can the Socinians make a declaration on" the true faith of a:Christian"—for in our acceptation of the word, those certainly are not Christians, who deny the Divinity of our Saviour? If we are right in our supposition, their case was in finitely better before, and it would be a strange result, if a Bill, professing to be for the benefit of Dissenters, had the effect of expelling some of. the most useful and honourable Members in the House of Commons. We deeply deplore their spiritual blindness o►► this subject; but it is a question be tween them and their Maker, and evidently' does not incapacitate them for the social and civil duties of life. The fact is, we can never feel secure about any measure which is opposed by the craft . and deep subtlety of the Earl of ELDON. He is quite the modern " Cunctator," arid_when force and stratagem fail— " He wins, like Fabius, by delay." The conciliatory and manly conduct of - the Duke of WELLINGTON : IS entitled to the highest 'praise, and we shall, no doubt; very soon exceed the Morn ing Post i',self, in admiration (extorted by conviction) of his fitness for the post which he now occupies. 'Cer tain it is, that a Whig Administration never could have'carried this Bill. The country would have been in arms against it from one end to the other. The Gazette de France of Sunday contains little news, nor do the other French Papers furnish us with any important intelligence from the probablf. theatre of war. We received this morning the Austrian Obscrucr of the 10th April, which contains the Proclamation of the PRESIDENT of Greece, respecting the esta blishment of a National Bank, but the document is too long for insertion to-day; we shall, give it to morrow. In our front page will be found the Manifesto of the Emperor NICHOLAS, on the Treaty of Peace concluded with Persia. The terms of this Treaty arc altogether favourable to Russia, and extremely humiliating to Persia, who sacrifices all and receives nothing. So much for Russian forbearance, and the unambitious views of the CZAR I It is confidently stated in the City, that the re monstrances of England, Austria, and Prussia, have induced the Russians to delay the patlsage of the Pruth for a month. THE FUNDS-(THIS DAY). CITY, TWELPE o' Clocx Consols left off yesterday at 85, sellers, and the advance which then took place has not only been maintained, but a still further improvement has taken place this morning, they opened at 85 reached sal, buyers, and may now be quoted at 85i I; the Commissioners gave 851; the scarcity of Money stock still exists, and the supply is not by a ny means equal to the demand, which, from the invest ments making by the pablic, and the amount required by the Commissioners, are to such an extent that still further advances may be calculated upon, if, as it is reported, tic Bears have oversold themselves. India Bonds are a trifle higher, and 97 99 pm. ; Exchequer Bills remain stationary at 64 65. The Foreign Funds have had very trifling activity to - day, and prices have been nearly the same since the open ing of the house; Russian Bonds accompany the rise In Consols, being 884; and every other Foreign security is a shade higher. Shares are in a dormant state. TWO O'CLOCK The report which we stated yesterday, as current, of the delay till the 12th of Alay for passing the Pruth by the Russtaa Army, is circulated with increased confidence to day, and Apse period CM:owls were done at 84 They remained at 85 buyers,-until within the last few minute:. when they reached 85 a ri m:es CL 0 cK. consols, 85k i. . FOUR O'CLOCK.--cLosoicr PRICES. Consols 85i 4 Danish 60 Do. for Ac. 854 i Greek, 1825 16i Brazilian Bonds 60 Mexican, 1825 334 Pen, • Buenos Ayres 34 4 -vian —. Chilian Do• -:, Russian 881 Columbian , 1 81 " 23 4 1 Spanish, 1821 114 Lis Kos T e h Ge Secretary, E D o n ß k e o n f d t e h v e : et: A n ititrAL OF THE DUKE OF CUMBER-- r ivate L: 1 1 7 ; E R: ::0 1 7 and attended by Colonel Porzw, his apartments in the Ring's Palace, St. James's, about five o'clock yesterday afternoon, in his carriage and four, from Dever. The Duke left his Palace near Berlin on the 9th a p r a r n is i7l ed b a y t instant, and proceeded to Hanover, where his . Royal Highness remained two days visit to the Duke and on a Duchess of CAMBRIDGE. His Royal Highness upon leaving Hanover travelled through Brussels, Lisle, &c. to Calais. He embarked at Calais about half-past one o'clock yesterday morning, and made the passage across the Channel in about three hours. The Duke landed at Dover, and after breakfasting at the Ship Hotel, pro ceeded direct to town. Part of the Royal Duke's Suite followed in two carriages and four. Soon after his arrival, his Royal Highness, accompanied by Prince GEORGE, went to visit his MAJESTY. His Royal Highness re mained to dinner with the KING. Prince GEORGE re turned to the Duke's apartments, where be was visited by his Royal Uncle, the Duke of CLARENOE. HOUSE OF LORDS.--(THIS DAY.) —Their Lordships and the Judges were engaged all the day in hearing a case, HARDING against PocLocs, on a Writ of Error'froni the Court of Exchequer Chamber in Ireland. `i't I I