The Sun. — London, England, 1835-02-27 00:00:00

I "1 • .---- i ; C •-•,,.. ,s„ ~.,..., Le ~. - Tx , ' - • 1--------k e gvE"---- ... v-..,. z....,-, . ...... ... ,• ,- . , 'N'-,,-, N,' • . if•-'-'' ; --... °- 14 N....' 0,..,.... ! -(x ; (.17---------/- --...",'Pe- . + 'Y 1,,(\c„..,..,._ :11, • / an 4 umr. IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. i/ :„..• , .." . , \t' •1", , Ip , =is •\ - " 1 I .. , . • it,4,,,,,t ,z,,, The WHOLE of the DEBATES in BOTH HOUSES of PARLIAMENT, with the DIViSION on the AD DRESS, were published in THE SUN this morning, at Three o't_lock, and SENT EXPRESS throughout the country. rietive e Par- Wit . .diency , in 00 ;;=~~ ,~. uty an ,rhe HOUSE OF LORDS, FEB. 26. th ree ~,larl of SHAFTESBURY sat for the Lord Chancellor at flieve achy when the Duke of Northumberland and other rs_ yv. took the oaths, and subscribed the Parliamentary roll, ,7, e which the House adjourned during pleasure. ,fteiln_LOßD CHANCELLOR took his seat on the w001.,..,:.........--,-.__ .,..,:.........--,-.__ " five o'clock, and announced to the House that the as to the nature and extent of the existing abuses, that tile trds a ve i .ith white staves had waited upon his Majesty with means necessary to correct them, might be safely appliod. a ss. _ nuaresa of that House, to which his Majesty had For this purpose his Majesty last year intended that -- vst pleased to return the following most gracious ' i nsWer • the report should be laid before the House. 1i is a nswer : g Lords, I thank you for your loyal mid dutiful Majesty had not been enabled to• perform that th e ass a Address, and I receive with great satisfaction promise, and as within a few weeks or days from that time he i n all *us e nee, that you will afford me your c or di a l co-operation would be enabled to perform that promise, and as it was men measures measures as will tend to promote th e happine s s and tioned in the speech from the throne of 1834, it The of my subjects." 40Dukeof was essential that it should also be mentioned in the speech Petiti ons so RICHMOND then presented a number of of this year, anti that the reason should be given fur that tomorrowii mplaining of local taxation. H e a l so ga ve notice not performing it. Had his Majesty acted otherwise, it of unneeeasaryoa h t e hs would present a petiti on on th e abolition might be inferred that it was not the intention of his Lord Majesty's Government to communicate the report, and tinder th ELL E NBC) . ROUGH gave notice that to-morrow' lie o f cour se n o t t o act upon it.—( Cries of " Hear, hear.") would bring in a bill of indemnity for certain officers acting However illegal some parts of the Commission might be, that th e Go 8 Indian Government. The laws upon that subject, was no re ason why they should not avail themselves of the in ent of India, were so widely spread over the formation collected. Some bodies had resisted the enquiry Statin e ve =.`"? ou g h t to be done that it wa s a l mos t i m p oss ibl e t o know what of so inquisitorial a nature ; but many bodies had submitted, by one or other. He had taken steps for the and a great mass of evidence had been obtained. This evi t7itso lidivaotion of the whole of the Acts of Parliament which he dence would receive the fullest consideration of his Majes eo7,,7o_ uld soon be done. In the meantime h e moved for ty's Government. It was unnecessary to lay down the principle tir . ! certain letters written by Sir Charles Metcalf rela- upon which the Government would proceed in the contradic the subject, in order to explain it.—Ordered. tion of that report. He would, however, tell the Noble and 0t • T he pa Lit . ;_strl of RADNOR gave notice of a motion for a series Learned Lord and his friends, that both as respects this Corn- Titte'` Earleative to the oaths taken in the Universit mi s si on a n d a ll others, his Majesty's Government would not wh ich he uef MULG RAVE gave notice that to-morrow, consider it to be eithertheir interest or their duty to maintain sante __ es9olerstood would be a convenient day, h e would put any one recognized abuse.—(loud cheers)—and that their oh con e. r ti ns to the Noble Secr e t ar y fo r th e Colonies, ject and determination was to correct all abuses.—( Cheers. ) fo ll r l in3 some measures taken for carrying into effect the Lord PLUNKETT observed that if the Commission was ' Q uid x aboli shing slavery in the West Indies--his question illegal, it was impossible that it could be acted upon for ?Ity ate more particularly to the Island of Jamaica. useful purpose; because, if the allegation be true, it is an CORPORATION COMMISSION. inquisitorial commission, calling upon individuals to make returns Lord B ROUGHAM upon oath of the nature of their property, in ordei that whi m , , said he had a motion to make, to I ret 7.2 l e did not think there could be any objection—it was the abuses connected with:them .miglst be corrected, and urn of all the Commissions that passed the Great Seal in the parties offending visited with punishment. Many in eon 182 8, 1829, and 1830. dividuals had submitted to that inquiry, but it was cor relative ti,..BoL th L e E e N lp ß e O ns ß e. o UG H said something a cross th e t a bl e trary to every principle of justi ce if the Crown (after having made the discovery o f it s i ll ega li ty )—i t wou ld b e most un j ust ti e! , 7 "ROUG HA M said he had taken that into considera- and contrary to right and reason, if the Legislature would at an y2awas the last to move for anything that he did not think avail itself of that information so illegally acquired. It would be l test 4Y necessary. That was the first time, however, he had base to do so. He did not 'pretend to be acquainted with the his _ t .at objection made against the Commissioners, to w hi c h question of the legality or illegality of that Commission ; aliztllon referred. There was one, the Law Commission, to nor did he know whether the opinion of the Noble and leN .° was a party, and must take the responsibility— Learned Lord opposite, or the Noble and Learned Lord on the f os i it s,ve, however, not rainisterial—for he had moved woolsack was the more correct. This, however, he would say, d eue in the other House.—( Hear.) It had certainly that if the Commission was liable to the imputation of illega lise t l ya lli nth good. However, he was most anxious to lity, there was not a particle of the information acquired under . Cor r e!arn, because when he saw the notice taken of the it tha t . could be made the foundation of any judicial h ad fi ction Commission in the King's speech, and after what proceeding. Indeed he did not see how that could be pos_. le a k e n from the Noble and Learned Lord on the wool- sible. Every-person who knew any thing of the practice tial wi ts , t 0 its illegality, he expected to be impeached, observed in courts of justic e mus t b e aware that if in opinion bed to be p re p are d.—( Hear, hear.) After th e formation be extracted under the pressure o f ver y hi g h was ' e llreased from the Woolsack so strongly, he certainly authority, that inlormation could not be acted upon for the the el‘toirPosed t o !tee by the King's Speech th a t the report Of purpose of visiting the party with the consequences which that Th e m s tnission was to be acted upon. information might entail on them. If then the measures to he Lord "CiRO C HAN - fiELL OR said the Noble and Learned adopted were to be grounded upon the answers so given, the eta tte "'as wrong in his inferssnces. It did not follow that be- public might put it out of with their minds that any judicial pro- Spe..traention was made ‘ - t* 'he Commission in the King's ceeding would take place respect to these Corporations. hets;:•" its report was to o be t. acbd on. It would be laid- The Duke of WELLINGTON said that no doubt it Lord the Legislature. Neither was the Noble and Learned would be impossible to found any judicial proceeding upon eve r ".. e etrect in stating that he (the Lord Chancellor) h a d questions illegally put. Certain powers had been granted to sain4tated it to be illegal. What he said was, that it con- the Commissioners to ask questions, and call for papers and re -4ersow, „ which could n o t l ega lly b e g i ven --which were cords. Some persons had refused to d o so , an d o th er s h a d given ttp.,, Y illeg a l ,• ; he was of the sam e o pi nion sill, and chal- up their papers and records, that or the other and answered such questi ons as were pr o ;tthe N o b le and Learned Lord on a future (occasion to put to them. The question was whether T he °Y law that he wa s wrong . House of Parliament would proceed to legislate upon the Re the Id! arqui s of LANSDOWNE said that, in his opcoion, port of that Commission. The Noble Lord supposed that they tiled i''' le and L earne d L or d b e l ow hi m was perfectly jCs- were g oin g to p ro nounce judgment ; but such was not the case. lilltha in fears.—( Hear.) The Noble and Learned Lord. What they were called upon to do was to legislate on that in totai„"oolsack had found out, at a very late hour, that the formation,_ if they found that it had been properly acquired. Ittot i pl s iun was so decidedly ' illeg al, and he sed such It bad been stated on a former night that certain powers had 4le ; language upon the matter, b that impeachment was been b triven to that Commission, which should not have been granted, ~! least that the late Ministers could expect. but . as he (the Duke of Wellington) had never seen Ala a LORD CHANCELLOR, in answer to the observa- that Comoussion he would pass no opinion upon it until the is t h;isde by the Noble Marquis would say, that he never was subject came regularly before the House. thee h 1-I ° l -ise when the Commi ss i on was un d er di scuss i on, Earl RAWsIOR observed that the Noble Duke had stated tint I never heard it e ven ment i one d i n t h e H ouse, that lie had neverseen the Commission, and, therefore, could tar s t t had never seen th e Commission, and that it was only give no opinion upon it. But the question was, whether th e i r lt so4t & to report th a t h e h a d f orme d hi s op i n i on w i th respect Lordships should see it at all or - not. He had a distinct re keit . 4e jer was mentioned in his presence except the other collection that the Noble and Learned Lord on the Wool %l t:nen Ms attention was called to it by the Noble sack had stated, on a former occasion, that the Com- I t h ai lled the Chief Baron of th e E xc h equer . I t was mission was illegal.. If so, nobody ought to know any -144 he had had a conversation with that Neale and thing of the information so illegally obtained.—( Hear, hear.) toe,. Lord upon t h e su bj ect an d a f ter that he came Th e N o bl e an d L earne d L or d sa id he never saw the commis edv- ee adusion that the particular powers to which he had sion, but still he pronounced it to be legal. t iNie r v . were illegal. How far the Commissioners h a d ac t e d The LORD CHANCELLOR said—l may be supposed r eik rt wese proceedings could not be ascertained until the to have been rash, because I have stated that I have "ld, n w as laid on the table of the House, together with the never seen the Commission, and yet have pronounced upon tioi i , ee upon which it was founded ; when that was done the its legality.---( Hear, hear.) But the knowledge - I have ttlq lei would be in a condition to form a correct judgment of derived of that Commission was from a communication made 1, 4 , 41 itY or illegality of the commission. a to me in a conversation which I had with the Noble 1 / 4 1, ir e , t ' B ROUGHAM confessed himself at a loss how to and Learned Lord.--(Hear.) If I am right, it must N 8 4 the _Rouse. He had never witnessed a scene like the a s to, depend upon the information and knowledge so derived. The o` se s i sOr at all resembling it, except the first part of opinion of that Noble and Learned Lord was required by s's I wl • s dthe before 1 •t s tat t zid ti _ which wa : *etc . night it....—,.. Ch eers. ) some persons, who had laid a copy of the Commission a lap h ti eir L or o s ai„ g believe it, that the Lord Chancellor, beforetheNoble and . ... Learned Lord. In consequence of being t ,„,_ s nsso s ? of the kin e , ' ''sos e stjude r • •sdom the highest minister of justice, so consulted, he directed his attention to the subject, and there, Csst r i a ' , awn s in E ngland ~,,:vro similar to those who ()reign in f • is no man in the empire who is more capable of forming 4 13 Mac: " er e called the Minister' s at' Justice, could get up in a correct opinion upon such a subject.—( Hear.) He stated ess t i ii that House upon a so ' a wn debate upon an Ad- to me what that opinion was, and was I rash then in assuming "Po s ° the Crown ' h o r it having been moved that the statement of the Noble Lord was correct ? Was %,, th,t Address own ; and an Amendm. • •• hispredecessor in I wrong then, when I found that it was in accordance with my N ;:t, e i Ge. , and being agains, own opinion, to declare that ? The Commission in its attune, and his lie;i e n t glie;, "' I T & _with the same high ,eut: silt 4 . ither more nor less than' . a Charge o f original form did- not contain the particular clause the in 'host the Great Seal to a Com nl 3ssion which to which I alluded, and he told me so, and I ask whether d I was rash in confirming his opinion ? Now, my Lords, with 1 ' it st Material respects illegal—( Hear • bear— an o 'l't Ives was intended—scimethin like s a threat of that respect to the rest, when we came into office, we had reason to t l 'ece e . 'told o by the and Learned L vo.—that believe the enquiry under that Commission had terminated. , 4 di 4 , l ~ out Noble o. iht e ssd tl.anould be taken in consequence. He for o ne, till Did we call upon the Commissioners to go on?—No ; but we ~ [ s ue , ue statements of the Noble Lord, never anticipotc,d called for the report. Our intention is to examine that report, i l l Pte s h ` 1 4 cours e was to be adopted from the words in tce and act upon the evidence . therein which . has been legally 4t h ' and when h (Lord B)• • L e ti e. stated,mmoving or the returns, f i taken. It is our intention to pursue the enquiry, for the purpose a correcting any abuses that may exist in Corporations. ittettrsedunderstood,or from the statements of the Noble and To•hing that I said the other night is inconsistent with this th i ti e ht. d on the Woolsack, that something like an ' se All I said was, that until that was made, it 4 fom ent Was intended, that Noble and Learned Lord 1 3 ° 1 ) 16 ' • asible for the report Pe a nd and the government to adopt any specific t h set , , 1 0 th y i his own statements' had been misunderstood, 14 Itt ehti isi out no promise, nor even a pledge, or intimated Lord meastu . e• BROUGHAM would say nothing in reference W es in" except that of laying the rep or t b e fo re p ar li ament , to the i'ttstructions or information which the Noble occasion he (Lord Il i a ' s not tho le judgment of all their Lordships whether that Lord had received. On the . first . B•) had expeasiencecl a grievous disappointment ; on the second Il t . 141.7 Lo the extent of the Noble Lords' gloss upon • i i,sats ed ,oi the King's speech. But then theagreeable Noble and an a. INtppointment, and on the third a total disappoint eCs '-'ord had sa id , far f rom • ' A m. , s td had so . giv i ng up the . illegality of ment. In the fillit place the Noble and Learned Lord declared merely that the report shad been, or would be, ieceived; in the ha i l expect so f . ar from !dm , itting that which everyone second, that something would be done upon the production of its cacti i ted Ss' .? seeding the King s Speeli, found the report aeel s , ';'it, that there was no foundation for the charge of that . report • but upon the third case, the whole resolved itself id, 414,11 illegal. The Honourable and Learned Lord into an impossibility' that something might perhaps be done. \ tl i l lu e would pray their Lordships to consider if the like But it turned out that the opinion given by him, and which ies °lll s t s ci 7s e 'er seen in any Court or any place before. The had been alluded to by the Noble and Learned Lord on the put - to him as counsel, in ItZ it s in to '' ' ' , ar ned'Lord said, bringing none of his judicial woolsack, was in reply to questions upon byhis As i t " 4 / ill h i s legislative proceedings he was rea to prove a brief with a f ee marked it Os is 'Val i nThe ' Noble Lord h d • 1 r tained —( Hear, hear, hear.) That was ~,, •is the opinion 1 , i s atimoion that it was illegal—be had stated the particu- of the Noble and Learned Lord on the Woolsack. but it tank a ch , it was illegal. and it was no less than a most i m . was also stated that the circumstance upon which it was h kt kop e r rt e `ut as regarded the law affecting the rights formed was, that he had received information to the effect d o o tt i tt l e o d f individuals and of corporations. That might of an a lteration in the original draft of the Commission. ti h is o him, Lord tto his utter astonishment, that very It might perhaps happen that inquiry would be made s•- on . Learned avowed to-night that he had given it into the manner by which that information was acquired. al tt r tistf a in ,',O,n the night before last, that the Commission was Access must have been had to the records in the Home Office, t,(l i r e "legal, without ever having read the commission it- and search must have been Made in its archives. The draft li o j s l'a sc s t !")—so that it was not the opinion of the Noble and of the Commission was issued from that office, and he (Lord kj- l ofi re °RI himself, but it was the opinion which he had got Brougham) did not shrink from any responsibility that tjeabescond-hand. He had consulted one judge, who was then might be attached to it. He trusted the House would take s 7 oo stu r , of the Lordships' House, but then at the bar, and measures to enquire into this breach of their Soother authority I P 1 "e h ti t, t , , and who—for ought their Lordships or any would be set at nought, broken through, and set at defiance'. s 4 t, , ,i, Vletv—had never seen a word in the report any more He had got the fact, and he was determined to make use of N, te kt - 3 , noble and Learned Lord, because when people were it :.there were clerks employed in the public offices under , tilt tau s tigmatise anything as being unlawful, they did not the . late Administration . who were playing the with of ki % t i t . `ik about ccming to a hasty conclusion , so that the their enemies, and in constant . communication with them. hiklit b e ' e s 0 \ " the Noble and Learned Lord on the Woolsack It was important to the public service that this matter should t i ti telt . •Ilist as ,much in the dark on the subject as he was be enquired into, and that also it should be seen whether the 1 1 he has Hear, ,and laughter.) Then the Learned Lord Commission was illegal or not. He ( Lord Brougham) IN t i tie .whe never cld the commission, that he was never in the. never objected to the inquiry. He admitted that he was did ' l 4 q It la n the legalit v was disputed, and that he had never the person . who advised the issuing . of it, and he a t , t e osid e4 s tioned in that" House, . y nevertheless he did not deny, not shrink from the responsibility of having done so.—( Hear, 4 t , (3 se a " e deny that he knew it was the subject o" i hear.) If he had advised any thing that was illegal, no ''tit 4 . 1 1 e :Y -- -( Hea r , hear.)' He knew it was controverted ; man would more cheerfully abide by the consequences of his r ;:' d '% , that it had bee.s the subject of discussion act. He formed the opinion which was referred to upon state -I.b,ll'ata°s ;he knew . that inftnae had been taken, and that ments made to him by counsel. If that was illegal, it tarried Vt had acted on those opinions yet the Noble and clearly was the . duty . of the Learned upon it the ~th , ord had allowed for 3 months' since he had taken the Woolsack to advise his Majesty not p act upon , it. He t`44terZCommissioners to go on acting under a Commission should not have allowed it to go . forw . ard ; he should i t: a ki isth e Y , il legal," and also allowed his Majesty—and this not have put men to the torture, which it brought upon Ste L•ora s . Pclint to which he wished to calf the attention of some, when he Thetisha believed it to be from the begin qt t ktk wi t s i illPs----h e allowed his :11 - ajesty to refer to that Corn- ning illegal. ubject- was one which should engage Il k !tikk l d out ever • • • , 1. 14 4 ,_ having read it, without it,havin.g made up the attention of both Houses of Parliament. It was pecu. ‘4lht hsd the subject from the perusal of without ever liarly interesting to the public at large, and the country gene tittsit-soit,the mea ns o f f orm i ng an o pinion worth one rally looked with anxiety to the subject ; and it was now too i lt s ' 596' 11 he had pursued a course which would lead bad, that, when nothing specific with regard to the intentions 4 ;' s te s ed i s : n is ei' out of a 1 000 all over the country, of Government was mentioned in the Speteh from the Throne, tt l :' .4 th t e i z‘nig's Speech, to imagine ' that those who had that the country would have nothing but a declaration of the 'l4 ''ss ' l ulling of that Speech, had never considered that opinion of Government that the Commission was altogether ll t i c , a flaw, or the least illelitv or the' least taint of illegal. ,f l-,,, t 1 1 11e N t ' ob l any ' ' a ffecting'that - "nmmission. Lord WHARNCLIFFE said kind whatever, la in the Noble and Learned t, as ti of hi L!,and Learned Lord would sac was that, the Lord had been told over and over again that the evidence jesty s Speech, when the "h.be 8 wi a * ' report came irt, it taken by the Commissioners was first of all to be laid h4a t 'ta ( 1 eOrnwunicated to the Parliament. It seemet.! before the Houses of Parliament, and the Report . acted hktilet.‘.:4°i'd I.i.rougham) if there were some reason — 000 n, as fa r as they possibly could—the Ministry it 4 . 1 , 4 consequence of something that was said in were most anxious to correct all abuses which were found to t i k l)es i i• t he other House of Parliament—to make exist. The charges had been made, and that was the answer i t i ' soj n t to give a somewhat stingy assurance 'they had to give ;it wouldgo forth to the country, and that would i itla that ' and th - erefore the Noble Lord said that he had decide the question between them. As to the question of the . e- It 'eitt at When the result of the report was laid before gality of the inquisitorial powers given by it, they, in point of k1:110„ ,it Was the intentionof his Majesty's -at to h , t , seelings upon it. been done under them; but if so, then the question , e , bade _t 1 \ B 0 RO UGH said that he did not apprehend would arise; whether they could act upon evidence taken the direction of those p owers. In point of fact, -4 .. ttE , f . .her said that there was anything_ illegal in the under , Ives an Commission. What he had said was, that the einestion had been brought on by the Noble and Learned , I 4 ' s stlai ti B 44 illegalit in the g rant to the Commissioners Lord for the mere purpose of raising a doubt of the intentions . e4 s 4 • Poste Y '',,,,,ts •') The Node and Learned Lord Chan- Learned Lord lied called them apostates, and all other tad l i st lt s: . d azoste competent as an man to judge of the na- names, but the Government meant to act in a bona fide way t :il,7 it s ec n rri t_of e the pow . ers granted to the Commissioners, with the people of England—it was the wish of Government ‘:s st eital Le rt nt to give a judgnltint upon them, as the to reform the institutions of the country, so far as they could k cl i ,e tl ie -i ied Lord, Brougham, who introduced those do so with safety, and no power on earth could make them go IN trom thecmniission. His Majesty, s e 1 ~throne in that t to his gracious one step further. HO us ro the report Lord BROUGHAM denit'd thg he had ever called the 41 ". °a their table, that they might form a jodoment ' Noble Lord, or any one an apostate, for i; Irf4 a hard word. . a• No. 13.230. Decla effec- itantial aesdaY, rt e fig redue as the oral re- ie Sep' Ition of n ot be which s at the ❑ g from nd from LI public begin to st," f course, A me by d e vil 116 that thl tome ) utvoteur House pf y enoug h _ , 4defen .A " nays l >entatives entlenien ures, r f; lee of tu fooner Lve Oval itions an e o to b Nas f a third ° breeches m peruse d t e P res eel be hoing , Leroselve? " because en ders" of, 0w lona ef Iges" u ,they pt, • b‘ lt ' AA 5, , V IU r (less teir ;left ParliasneP" (It a ni C : E Ti- INIsT Eco IACI( a t ADI or e o y 14 v v er ne the Coo iog to suPP ° in D es a tru r ing. f°r 7 o nd 0 _ • To sea r m ° 0 f all ' P i 00 Ig e stl asuer t ' ll tle c , , b , Led.-from desirous 'MEN D ,' wira ono' ie resow LONDON, FRIDAY EVENING, FEBRUARY 27, 1835. His Noble Friend, he knew, was not one of those bigoted anti reformers, like some of those with whom he was acting—he was a sort of moderate man—a kind of milk and water character. It seemed that the Government were now most willing to give to the people all that they wished. He trusted that the people of England would not fail to piit them to the test. His Noble Friend said the discussion had been got up for the mere purpose of, damaging the character of the Ministry. Now what were the facts of the case ? He (Lord 13.) moved for papers, and did not say one word upon the subject till he was attacked by the Noble and Learned Lord on the wool sack. He had nothing to do with it, and was most unwil lingly dragged into it. The /notion was then put, and the returns ordered. Lord BROUG HA M again rose, and said that in redemp tion of a pledge given last Session, he presented a Bill for the purpose of putting an end to bribery at elections. He was certain the Bill would meet with no opposition in that House, and he trusted but little in the other. It had been rejected last Session, not upon the merits, but because it had gone down in so altered a shape as to make it a new Bill, and at too late a period of the Session to allow it to receive proper consideration.—• The Bill was read a first time. Lord ELLENBOROUGH thought that no person could deny that the Bill when it left that House was much better than when it was sent up from the House •of Commons ; but in the present instance he would suggest for the consideration of the Noble and Learned Lord, whether it would not be expedient, as the opportunity now presented it self, that such a measure should originate in the other House. His opinion was decidedly against its being brought forward in that House. Lord BROUGHAM had not the slightest Objection_to the measure originating in the other House. His only object in presenting it now to the House was the redemption of his pledge. He admitted that it certainly contained matter more for the consideration of the House "of Commons than that House. His understanding, however, last Session was, that the Com mons had no objection to the introduction of the Bill in that House. Ile would inquire into the subject, and would therefore withdraw the Bill for the present. He had two other Bills to lay on the table which last session had been read a first time : the first was for the prevention of pluralities, and the other for the purpose of enforcing the residence of the clergy , . Lord ELLENBOROUGH observed, that the two bills referred to by the Noble Lord related to most im portant subjects, and it was certainly competent for the Noble and Learned Lord to bring them for ward, and to discuss their merits ; but the Noble Lord must be aware that a Commission had been issued to the heads of the Church, for the purpose of enquiring into its re venues, with a view to the introduction of measures for the better appropriation and distribution of them. It would, therefore, perhaps be more convenient for the Noble Lord to delay proceedings with the Bill, until the Commissioners had made their report. Lord BROUGHAM had no objection to delay the further proceedings with the Bill for a short period, but he must confess at the same, time that he had but very little hcpe or trust that the report of the Commissioners would lead to en effectual or efficient reform.—(A laugh.) The Duke of CUMBERLAND wished to ask the Noble and Learned Lord, whether the two Church Bills he had introduced, were exactly the same as those he brought forward in the last session ? Lord BROUGHAM said that they were. He hsd intended to have made some alterations in the Bill with respect to the residence of the clergy, but upon his mentioning those alterations to the Archbishop of Canterbury his Grace objected to them, and he had, there fore, presented the Bill in exactly the same form as he had last year. Both Bills were then read a first tine, and the House adjourned at half-past six. tage to the country.--( Hear.) He thought it was rathr too bad, that because some of their professional delegates would by such an arrangement be deprived of attending to their practice, that the House should be put to so much ia conirenience. He knew of no subject on which the public was more deeply interested, more especially as it was a notorious fact that many of the estimates were passed after twelve o'clock at night. He therefore hoped that this question would spee dily be brought before the notice of the House; and that the Right Honourable Baronet would take it into his mi sideration. An HON. MEMBER thought that the greater part of the in conveniences to which the Hon. Baronet had alluded might be done awa' with if the House met at an earlier hour. Mr. 4111`60N2sELE said he hoped that some effort would be made to induce the House to commence busi ness at an earlier than which was at the present time done: - This was the only public assembly in the world in which business was done at such late hours. There was no place in which business of so much importance, considering what a nation it was, had to be deliberated ; at the same time that the interests of so many others are involved in its considerations.—( Hear, hear.) Al her nations finish their business by day—and why ? becatlr hey commenced it by day and not by night. He should vote that the public business of the House might commence at eight or nine o'clock in the morning, and then he was quite convinced that by making the three days to commence at this early how, they would dispatch much more than they did in the time they now occupied. Something he was sure must be done. The House ought not to submit to the present system ; and he was sure that the,,country at large was interested in it. Persons arrived at the age of fifty or sixty felt its inconvenience the most acutely ; and it was only the youthful part of the assem bly which could endure its fatigues. He did not know whe ther it was intended to persevere to a division at the present time, but he hoped that they would persevere in bringing thi,, forward until some effectual arrangement was made. Mr. HUME thought it could not be maintained that the business of the public was properly transacted under the pre sent arrangement. He would not then go into a discussion cif the subject, but he would propose the adjournment of the debate. Mr. EWA RT thought that there was not much value in the Right lion. Baronet's observations. They pos sessed mare ingenuity than solidity. There would be more real economy of the public time, under the plan he proposed, than there was at present. Hon. Gentlemen who were engaged throughout the day required, morn than others, some repose, and therefore they should give over their deliberations at so seasonable an - hour as would give them time for natural rest. It had been said by the Right Hon. Baronet, that it they be gan to reform in this particular, they should revise the whole system ; but he would say, that if they once commenced, the other reforms would soon follow. He thought the best way to induce gentlemen to attend early to business would be to al low them to depart at seasonable hours, and it would tend much to the furtherance of legislation upon any subject. It had been said by the Member for Dublin that this was the only assembly in the world which transacted business at such late hours, and he would add, reverting to the ancient principles of the constitution, for which the Right Hon. Baronet had such a reverence, the practice of sitting late was not the custom of their ancestors. He would, however, consent to postpone his motion to the 1 ith of March, The motion was accordingly adjourned. Mr. JERVIS asked leave to bring in a Bill to regulate the practice of Criminal Courts in the county palatine of Chester. Leave given. _ _ HOUSE OF COMMONS, FEB. 26, The Sruataa took the Chair at a quarter to four o'clock. Sir FRANCIS BITIIDETT, who had been in waiting for nearl an hour, took the oaths and his seat. A messenger from the East India House presented the prc ceedings of the East India Company relative to certain com pensations to reduced officers. Lord GRANVILLE SOMERSET brought up the Re port of the Committee on the Great Western Railway. Mr. E WART gave notice that on the 31st March he should renew the motion of which he had given notice last session relative to the state of the Royal Academy. THE FACTORY BILL. Mr. BAINES presented a petition from the parents of chil dren employed in the cotton factories of a place in the West Rid ing of Yorkshire, praying for the repeal of certain provisions in the Factory Bill. It appeared that those parties who were most anxious to procure the passing of that Bill were now the most anxious for the repeal of its provisions.-4 Hear. ) Lord GEORGE LENNOX presented petitions from dif ferent parishes in West Sussex, praying to he relieved from the burden of county rates. BOROUGH OF STAFFORD. Sir R. FERGUSON, we believe, gave notice that early in May he should move for leave to bring in a bill to disfranchise the Borough of Stafford. GENERAL REGISTRATION. Mr. WILKES gave notice that unless his Majesty's Go vernment previously brought forward a measure of that nature, he should, on the 16th April, move for leave to bring in a bill to establish a national civil registration of baptisms, deaths, and marriages. Lord KERRY gave notice of a motion relative to the Malt Duties, the purport of which we could not hear. THE FACTORY BILL. Mr. MARSHALL, seeing the Right Hon. the Secretary for the Home Department in hi.; place, would beg to a , k whether it was the intention of his Majesty's Government to take any measures for the alteration or regulation of the Fac tory Bill. Mr. GOULBURN said that the Bill had not yet come into that extensive operation that was contemplated by its pro jectors, and the Government could not therefore at present take any steps upon that subject. Mr. MARSHALL then gave notice that it was his in tention to introduce a bill to repeal the Act called the Fac tory Regulation Bill, and to substitute in lieu thereof an Act to restrict the employment of persons in factories worked by steam or water power, under 21 years of age, to a certain number of hours per day. IRISH POOR. Mr. RICHARDS begged to ask when the House might ex pect the report of the Commissioners appointed to inquire into the state of the poor in Ireland ? Mr. GOULBURN could not give the Hon. Gentleman any information as to the time the report would be ready. BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE. _ Mr. EWA RT rose to bring forward his motion, to the effect that no new business should be introduced in the House ‘fter the hour of 11 at night. He had a strong impression of t h e ,7Qcsssity of such a regulation as thi s , b o th as re spe c t e d t h e Members .7f that House and the public. It was well k nown that at present, great deal of the most important business of the House was trait qacted after midnight, when members were unable effectually discharge their duty to th e public, and were most of them Slumbering on the benches in motions the most unbecoming.—(A laugh.) It was at such times as these that advantage was taken to smuggle obnoxious bills through the House, and on the contrary, those who opposed bills, had an opportunity of throwing them out. Such a practice was contrary to all sound principles of legislation.—(l-fear, hear.) There was never an instance of an assembly carrying on business at such hours. It might be truly said, that the debates after two or three o'clock were carried on under the influence of sleep-- Sleep the tired members slumbering all around, And sleep the clerks below.—(A liTugh.) lie hoped his suggestion would be approved of, as he thought it would greatly facilitate the conduct of public business. Major BEA UCLERK seconded the motion, The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he thought the Honourable Member could hardly be in earnest in taking the sense of the House upon this important proposi tion—( Hear, hear). It was quite clear that the whole condition of the public business must be reviewed, be fore they could admit such a change as this—a change which would only leave six hours for the transaction of public business.—( Hear, hear.) If, indeed, they began public business at ten o'clock in the morning, it was possible that it would be competent to the House to establish a limit of this nature.--( Hear, hear.) Above all, it should be re collected that a very great part of the public business was done in Committee, and that, too, the most useful part, for the debates in that House were very often the contentions of party—the real business being most fre quently done in committee.—( Hear, hear.) If this were so, would it not be most convenient to curtail the time of those Committees ?—( Hear, hear)—besides he did not think that the motion would effect its object, which was to prevent the introduction of new business after eleven o'clock. Now the Hon. Gentleman complained that there was a good deal of somnolency about twelve or one o'clock, yet he does not object to the debates continuing to that time ; he only refuses us the opportunity, by the introduction of new subjects, to excite some interest.—( Hear.) There were besides many matters of form, such as the orders of the day, which it was necessary should P ass before the House rose, and this, too, the Hon. Gentleman's motion would prevent. On the whole, he-hoped the Hon. Member would defer his motion till a later period of the Session, when the new Members would be better able to form a judement upon it. Major BE AUCL E Rh: hoped the Right Hon. Gentleman would take the matter under consideration, for he could speak from experience of its bad effects • as he had been compelled to wait for sixteen nights, on a bill brought in by a Learned Sergeant last session, until after one o'clock in the morning. 03 these grounds he thought, therefore, that some fixed ti me ought to be appointed bey end which no new business was to be entered on, and he trusted tile House would take it under its consideration, that some steps might be taken for tile House adjourning at an earlier hour. They are oil now assembled men of business, and he was convinced that, by meeting at a somewhat earlier hour, they would be enabled to carry on their deliberations with equal, if not greater, advan- ADJOURNED DEBATE. Mr. MULLINS moved the Order of the Day for the re sumption of the adjourned debate on the Address. Mr. MULLINS then resumed the debate upon the Ad dress. After an apology for intruding upon the House, Ile begged to express, in the name of his constituents, his entire dissatisfaction and disapprobation of the conduct of the Right Honourable Baronet since he took the seals of office.—( Hear, hear.) Throughout the whole of this debate, he had not heard one single solid reason for the dissolution of the late House of Commons, and the Right Hon. Baronet, in having recommended that measure, had incurred the re sponsibility of throwing the whole country into commotion. The pretence was the breaking up of the late Cabinet, but Lord Melbourne was obliged to resign office, not because he was disposed to do so, but because his Majesty who had reposed . confidence in the late Ministry for four years was induced to dismiss it by the representations of the Right Hon. Ba ronet, or some of his colleagues. The present Ca , binet might he very strong, but with all its strength it was not able to obtain a majority in this House, which had been pros' in a manner which could not be misunderdtood— (Hear,)—and the Right Hon. Baronet would And that in other divisions which were of increasing importance, that that majority against the Government would also increase. The Right Hon. Baronet, after opposing the Whigs, came forward to propose those measures which were entirely consonant with the principles of the late Government and the wishes of the Whigs. What, he would ask, did the Speech from the Throne promise to the people of this country ? Nothing, he was satisfied, that was at all in accordance with the spirit of the Reform Bill, it' the House was to take the hon. baronet's speech as an explanation of the principles by which his Government was to be guided. He ( Sir Robert Peel) did not state that he would be guided by the spirit of the times, or that he would act upon those considerations of expediency that influenced his conduct when he yielded the measure of Catholic Emancipation—and that as then, so would he now yield his own judgment to the wishes and desires of the people. On the contrary the Right Hon. Bart. has now asserted that his principles, and those of his colleagues especially on the question of reform, remain unchanged ; end that they are determined not to deviate from then:. What has, the Right Hon. Baronet and his colleagues promised to do on the subject of municipal reform ? All they have stated is, that the return of the Commissioners " who were appointed is appointed is not yet prepared, but they omit to state what their intentions are, when that report has been laid upon the table. If the declaration which was made elsewhere be any guidance to us on this all-important subject, no thing can be expected from the present Administration th p ow ers The declaration he referred to was that of th e p resent L or d Chancellor, who stated when the question of i ssu i ng t h e Com mission on Municipal in discussion t tat e h Cn another place,that Commissionl did not possess, and which he (the Lord Ch ance ll or ) wou ld a rl . nieipal was Reform invested was under w were illegal and unconstitutional. That Noble Lord stated that the report of the Commissioners would be laid on the table ; and when laid on the table, what was to be done would depend on the nature of the evidence contained, and on other circumstances. Can any man of common sense after such a declaration, say that the Right Hon. Baro net and his colleagues really intended any measures of muni cipal reform that would he satisfactory to the people ? It was easy for the present Government to profess re form ; but it was by their actions, and not by their pro mises that he would test their sincerity.—( Hear, hear. ) With reference to Irish Tithcs, did the Right Hon. Baronet express any intention to introduce a measure which was likely to be acceptable to the Irish people. He had not heard one word that such an intention existed.--( Hear, hear.) Did the Right Hen. Baronet mean by the Church Commission to con travene the tithes, or did he mean to deal with them on the principle of expediency. Or would his measures main tain the principle which the Bill introduced last session, by the late Secretary for Ireland, or did he mean to limit the extent of his intended measure. He thought, and he was ' sure the House would agree with him, that before he asked the confidence of the House he would to its satisfaction explain what were his intended measures. He must still know that the system of tithes in Ireland met with universal execration.-- ( Cheers,) And if the Right Honourable Baronet meant to act fairly by the country, he would not cloak Isis mea sures behind the prerogative of the throne, but fairly submit them for the consideration of the House. He had not said one word of municipal reform. Would the Right Hon. Baronet state whether he was willing to go as far as the Government which had been lately dismissed, and that without a particle of cause.—( Cheers,)—while the Right Hon. Baronet persevered in such a course he had no right to ask thq support of the House to an Address founded upon such a Speech, and he would therefore support the Amendment. Ile trusted if the Right Hon. Baronet had any spirit or feeling of justice he he would evince a disposition to satisfy the expectations of g reforming country, which Ireland was, upon a subject of such vital interest to its peace, prosperity, and happiness. If it were inquired who were the supporters of the present Government, it would he found that very few members of the late parliament were among them. He would also assert that public opinion was very different from what the Right Hon. Baronet represented it to be; and he was sure that the present Ad ministration would not obtain a majority on so important a. subject as the one now before the House. The Right Hon. Baronet had Conte forward on no good or ficcppsible grounds:, and neither was he prepared to propose such measures as would satisfy the people. Did, therefore, the Right Honourable Baronet act honourably towards that House and the country in sanctioning the ejection of the late Ministry, and thus destroying the peace and tranqpil -14 which the kingdp m pujQyed under the Admintstra, tion of Lord Melbourne, and by holding out promises rs hich he never intended, and knew lie never could perform ? The country, however, would speedily discover, and was al ready persuaded, that their promises were delusive, and, there fore, never would give its suppqrt er confidence to, the present Ministry. Mr. FINCH said, he was too well aware of the respect that was due to the House, and of the greater title which many other gentlemen had to its attention, to trespass long upon it. Although the prerogative of the Crown was a legal • and legitimate right of the Crown, yet it ought always to be exercised in accordance with the wishes and feeling* of the ; people ? lie 4i4 net, however, recollect in • the course of history any instance in which that prerogative had been I exercised more legally and legitimately than in the dis missalof the late Ministry. If he understood rightly the principles of the Reform Bill, it was merely intended to effect 1 such reforms, and to correct such abuses, as the Constitution , PRICE 7D. admitted of.. He would ask whether the Right Hon. Baronet had not followed the spirit of the Reform Bill in its true sense by the Reforms • which he had proposed ?—( Hear, from the Ministerial Benches.) But the Gentlemen on the other side of the House, nevertheless, expressed a want of con fidence in that declaration. But nothing would put the claims of the Opposition on so solid a basis as if the Right lion. Baronet were not to fufil his pledges. It was one thing to support a set of men when in power, and another thing to support them when out of power ; and, therefore, there was no inconsistency in the conduct alluded to by the Honourable Member. • The Hon. Member then alluded to Mr. O'Connell having designa ted the address of last session -as " bloody and brutal, and a declaration of civil war," avid yet that address had been carried. Was the Learned Member for Dublin prepared to laud that Parliament, while he had thus designated its address ? Mr. Finch then alluded to the manner in which Mr. O'Connell had spoken, last session, of the f.'Q nduct of the late Parliament towards Ireland. Was Mr. O'Connell then prepared to sup. port the present Amendment, which lauded that' Parliament ? The new measure introduced by Ow late administration•was for the co utation of tithes, the principle of which measure was, that tithes should be appropriately distributed among the clergy. This measure, however, produced no impression on the Hon. and Learned Member, for agitation still continued, and it was stated by him publicly that agitation was necessary for procuring justice for Itellhd. At this time a report was tir a sse np by the Noble Lord then at the head of the Government, but there was a subsequent oemmunication made by the Right Hon. Gen tleman then Secretary fnr Ireland, without the consent and direction of the Noble Earl, and a report was founded that they might form some measure different from thatthat badlseen given by the former oornmiqsion, when this unparalleled measure was done. He did not wish to detain the House with • what would be his expressions if he were to condescend to describe them ; yet it was Well known, that the Noble Lord, then Chancellor • of I'7: x fhegller, on his hearing of that communication was so astounded, that the consequence was a temporary resignation of his office. Immediately upon that Lord Grey himself resigned, and, in assigning as his rea son, he stated that he had lost his right arm in the resig nation of his Noble Friend, and that, without his assist ance in the House of Commons, it would he found in:pos sible to carry on the government of the country.—( Hear.) We were told that the Melbourne Administration had not been tried. Yes, they had been tried—they had been acquitted, and had been again tried and convicted—thee had been first tried and were acquitted by the Hon. and Learned Member for Dublin ( Mr. O'Connell)—they had been tried a second time and condemned by all parties as incapable of discharging their duties. If that Administration could have been sustained Ur the appointment of any individual to super intend it, Earl ey ought to have beer, selected by them. To Say nothing of his high sense of honour—his unsuspected political integrity—( Cries of " Hear, hear") —not to menu tiOn his partiality for those who epteposed that Administration, for the Noble Lord was acquainted with them all—he knew them all when in office—yet what did he say respecting them ? He declared that if Lord Althorp ceased to be a Minister, he (Lord Grey) would he incapable of carrying on the Government. The Sovereign thus cir cumstanced was perfectly justified to select an Administratioe competent to carry on the affairs of the Government, and if any responsibility attaches on account of the exercise of the prerogative, the Right Honourable Baronet, as Minister of the Crown, under the circumstances, may safely undertake We are told that the principles of the Melbourne Admi nistration are a new distribution of the revenues of the Irish Church. What was meant by a new distribu tion ? The Noble Lord ( Stanley) gave a definition of what it was last night. Lord Brougham had formerly given the same opinion, What, be (Mr, Finch) would ask, was meant by a new appropriation but taking away a part of them and giving them to the Roman Catholics of Ireland, and placing it under the controul.of the Roman Catholic priests. ( Cries of " No, no," from the Irish Members. ) He (Mr. F. ) thought that that was the opinion of the Noble Lord ( Re sell) opposite—of Lord Lansdowne and of Mr. Riee. He under stood that after appropriating what would be sufficient of these revenues for the proper maintenance of the Established Church, the supplies should be converted into a fund disposable for the - education of all classes of his Majesty's subjects,—( Hear. ) Now it was well known that the Roman Catholic Church did not allow education to be given to Roman Catholics, on principles of which Protestants could app. ove. Therefore, the new appropriation contemplated was different from that for which they were designed. The amendment of the Noble Lord merely announced a fact they all knew very well—namely, thet the Reform Bill had been carried three years ago. He could not then support any such amendment. He maintained that such appropriation of the Church revenues was a violation of the coronation oath. Ort3haLacesiont. rts well as on account of the conduct of the AriSinene Admi nistration on the subject of the Irish Tithe Bill—of the Irish Coercion Bill—and because their incapacity was declared by Earl Grey—on all these grounds their dismissal was perfectly justifiable. Captain BE RK EL EY said that he should make a few re marks in statirg his reasons for giving his vote. While he did so he regretted the absence of the Right lion. Baronet. The removal of the late Ministry was a justification for ' for his supporting the Amendment; they were dismissed even without a trial. If the vote which he was about to give bad no other object in it than the removal of the present, he would give it. He had 1000 other reasons for supporting the Amendment. Amongst others were the feeble attention to the claims of the Dissenters—(Cheers)—as also their op position to the Reform in the Irish Church, and moreover their neglect in correcting the abuses of their own church. —( Cheers.) He thought it was impossible, as the present Cabinet was composed, that it could longer exist. The Right Hon. Baronet and his colleagues gave Lord Grey's Government few opportunities to carry into effect those measures, which they were now so anxious to hold office bt their tenure.-- ( Loud cheers.) As an excuse for abandoning their princi ples, they said that they were forced to it by external pressure : that was the language of the Right Hon. Baronet, whose ability and talent for office no person could deny, and he entertained no doubt that his ta lents would be exercised to the advantage of his country, but while he had such colleagues they wer e n eu t ra li se d, an d would prove valueless.---( Cheers.) Q Under all the circum stances he could not consistently discharge his duty to those he represented if he gave any vote but in favour of the amend ment. An HON. MEMBER, whose name we could not learn, but who spoke froin the Ministerial side of the House said he could not but express his dissatisfaction at the slight and insignificant mention in the address of the distress of the agricultural classes (loud cries of " Hear"). No class had borne more distres , :, or had borne it more patiently. He regretted this the more bitterly, because he knew that the agricultural classes would be greatly disappointed, and if the Government should be under the necessity of again appealing to the country, he was afraid that this neglect would he the means of alienating from the Government that support which, at the late eleetloii, they had afforded so nobly, and with such effect.—(Cheers.) He, however, approved of the principles upon which relief was to be given, for if he understood rightly it was itt contemplation to introduce measures of relief; but as for county rates, repairs of highways and bridges, these would be wholly insufficient as a means of relief—they must have those broad and substantial reliefs which were become indispensably necessary. Concurring, however, as he did, in the Address, he would support it to the best of his abilities, as he could not but regret the factions opposition—(Loud cheers)—banded together for the purpose of promoting their own selfish plans.—( Renewed cheering from the Ministerial benches.) Mr. G ILL ON said it was his intention to vote for the amendment. He did so although i.e did not altogether concur in the tenor of it, as in his opinion it wanted that force and strength of expression which their constituents had a right to expect from them at a crisis like the present.—( Cheers. ) It did not sufficiently bring forward the feelings which in duced him to vote on the present occasion—feelingi which were shared by a great preponderating majority of his countrymen, and which were expressed by a total want of confidence in the promises of the present Administration.— (Loud cheers.) When he saw a great political party arrayed against them, which had de parted from the political principles of their whole life-- when he saw them adopt the principles of those men whom they so unceremoniously turned out of office, he could not help feeling alarm. An appeal had been made to the country, and in no part of the empire was that appeal more nobly responded to than by Scotland. The people of that country had declared by their representatives—by a majority of two to one, that they would place their liberties at the feet of a party who in their former Administration were only known by an extravagant debt and augmented taxation—the encouragement of despotism abroad, and the suppression of freedom at home. He rejoiced that the appeal of the present Government by the dissolution of the late. Parliament had been so ably responded to by the people—( Hear; hear.) The Right Honourable Baronet had, told the House that during the two last Sessions of Parliament he had adopted the principle of the Reform Bill, ar expression which had been re-echoed to night; and, as an illustration of that, he referred to several votes which he had given, supporting the - measures of that Administration which brought forward the Reform Bill ; but when he (Mr. Gillen) looked to see what those measures wore which he had supported, whether in opposition to, or in concurrence with, the Administration, he found they were measures always opposed to the people's wishes, from the intro duction of the Irish Coercion Bill, which had cast a dark shade over the commencement of the first Reformed Parlia= ment—(hear, hear, hear)—down to the refusal to admit the Dissenters to the Universities ; he found that whenever taxes which pressed heavily on the pcoduotive classes were pro posed tci repealed, the Right Honourable Baronet 4pOied that repeal ; he found that whenever it was proposed to abolish pensions or sinecures, the Right Hon. Baronet and his party threw around those pensions and sinecures the shield of their votes and eloquence.--( Hear, hear, hear.) But when it was proposed to cast the Ooereion Bill upon the breast of a misgovered poople---( Hear, hear, from the Irish lliem.beta)-,-titere was the Right Honourable Baronet Nene/ nis party ready to stretch forth their hands to ao. .date and to augment the terrors of the blow.—( Hear. ) when these things were considered, how could any Hon. and liberal Member be accused of inconsistencv in refusing to give the Government their support He (Mr. G.) seas astonished to hear the Hon. Member who had just sat down, assail his side of the House with a cry of factious opposition. He would appeal to the House and the country whether anything ever had more the appearance of faction than the dismissal of the late Administration—(llear, hear)--or the attempt of those men who firmly refused to reform and hnprove the State, now to become Reformers for the purpose of keeping their places ?—(Cheers.) He would take upon himself To say that unpopular& ; the Conservatives were during the last Parliament, the dissolution would tend to make them doubly so.-_( Hear. ) He could assure his Majesty's Government that the people of Scotland were not to be deceived by that part of the King's Speech which stated that such measures would be taken as should give to the poorer classes of that part of the United Kingdom greater opportunity of religious worship. Under the pretext of affording spiritual instruction to the poor of Scotland, the object was to swell the already enormous amount of the revenues of the dominant sect in that country. He was not surprised that such language sho u ld b e put into the King' s S peec h , when he was aware of the tone that that had been for so long a period adopted by the High Church party. In the calculation lately made for further church accommodation, the principle laid down was that the number of Dissenters should be left out as an element in the calculation. Ile knew not on what grounds that had been done, unless he would give it the charitable con struction of a clergyman of the Scotch Metropolis, that all Dissenters were unbelievers and apostates.—( Hear, and a laugh.) In that metropolis a cry had been raised, that more churches should be built, at a time when it was notorious that in the Established Churches between five and six thousand seats were unoccupied, and yet with that fact so ostentatiously before them, five new churches were now about to be built.—( Hear, hear, hear.) The object it was; said was to promote the religious instruction of the poor; but he could assure them that this was not, re quired, for the dissenters were the religious instructors of the poor, In that eity to which he had alluded, while the • dissenting Owes. of worship were filled, whether from the inatitention of ministers, or from what tause he knew not, the Established clergymen were r-eachi ng to unoccu pied seats.- 4 Hear,) The parao-saph 'in the King's Speech rrstg,l4 seam at Erst right -t - 0 apply only to Scotland, but he called upon the Elutl'a.:',l and Irish Members to look to them selves, and he asked them if they were prepared to Vote a sum out of the consolidated fund to increase the wealth and interest of one peculiar sect in Sootland without in any way advancing the interests of religion ? ( Hear,. hear.) Were they prepared for the progressive in crease of the already enormously endowed Church of Eng land ?—( Cheers.) No doubt an excuse would be found for such a proceeding by that intelligent Church Commission, the mere mention of which was enough to convince every intelligent man in the empire that nothing like an of Church Re form was to be obtained, or was intended, by his Majesty's present Government--( Hear, hear). On account of that proposition in his Majesty's speech (were it not on no other account) and in consequence of the disapprobation which pre vailed very generally throughout the country at the whole tenor of the conduct of that party, he ( Mr. Gillen).now came forward to support the amendment rather than the add ress , at_ though he must observe'that there was part of that amendment which he did not entirely approve of. Major BRUCE rose and said he could assure the House that it had not been his intenfion to trespass on their pa tience by taking part in this debate, if it had not been for the observations which hatle.fallen from his Hon. Friend. The Hon. Gentleman commenced by stating, that the ins si°rit' .of tho people of Scotland was not in favour of the change which had taken place in the councils of his Ma jesty—that the majority of the people of Scotland were averse to the Government of the Right Hon. Baronet. Now, he contended that, relying on the abilities of the Right Hon. Baronet, and relying on the talents of the Right Hon. Ba ronet's colleagues, the people of Scotland were anxious to give them a fair trial.—( Loud and continued cheering from tho Ministerial Benches.) He was sure that his lion. Friend would not deny him' the justice of the remark. that there was in Seotlnnd a great diversity of opinion on this subject. In that part of the country with which he was more immediately connected, the great proportion, he was convinced, was not against the change, There might be some of the Honourable Gentlemen's consti tuency who were against it, but there were others, and these he considered by far the largest proportion in point of num bers, who were not only favourable to the present Ministry, but actually thankful for the change. He could appeal in support of his argument to the great constituency of Edinburgh, and to the still greater csanstituency of Glasgow, with a variety of other places, where it was well blown that a great majority of the people were satisfied with it.—( Cries of " Oh, oh," and cheers. ) . But if the Hon. Member disputes the assertion with regard to members in these large towns, what will he say of the counties of Scotland? He would refer him •to the present state of the representation, or he would even go back to those counties which have returned Members favour able to the late Administration itself. What was the case with regard to the county of Haddington ?—( Cheers from the Minis terial side of the House.) The Honourable Member was re turned by a very narrow majority. What was the case with regard to Perth—(continued cheers from the opposition)— there, perhaps he might in some measure }awe failed, though a very large number of that constitertency he knew was fa vourable to the present administration.—( Hear.) But let him ask what was the case with the county of Inverness, a district of Scotland with which he vas more immediately con nected ? Why, his Hon. Friend was returned by a majority majority of only seven, and it was well known to the Right Hon. Gentleman that there were a vast number of persons walking about the streets sufficient to have turned that election, if they had not been deterred from voting on that occa sion by the other party.—(Cries of " Oh, oh.") He stated that which he knew—(cheers)—and he begged. moreover to st a t e t h at there were other persons posses sing Conservative opinions, who, if they had come up to the record their votes, would have placed the Conservative can didate at the head of the poll.---(" Oh, oh," mingled with cheers, from the Ministerial benches.) In the county of ROSS, was the majority so great for him to say that there was no opinion hostile to the late Government ? Why, it was a fact, well known to Honourable Gentlemen, that a great majority of the wealth and talent of that dis trict was against the return of the Honourable Gentleman. What was the result of the other Scotch County elections ? Was themetropolitan county to be reckoned as nothing ? Were Stirling, Roxburgh—(cheers from the Opposition) and Selkirk to be counted as nothing ? All those facts proved the narrow majorities by which the Scotch Members on the opposite side had been returned, and he could assure the liouse that there was a growing conviction in Seotlaral that the Go vernment, whether Whig or Tory, he cared not which (Loud cheers from the Opposition side)—eould only be safely and beneficially conducted upon those principles announced by the Right Hon. Baronet in corroboration of the statements in the King's speech.—( Oh, oh.) The Member for Falkirk took an exception to one part of the Speech, which be thanked the Government for advising, for that clause recommended a more efficient provision for the religious instruction of the people, which at present was vet) , inadequate, especially in Scotland.---,(-Hear, hear.) The principles, the sound Conservative princisples of the party to which he was attached, involved a ti:eterrnination to sup port and give extensien .-to that connexion which exists be tween Chur`...t and State—( Cheers from the Opposition by )—, ulf,cti the true i n t erests o f re li g i on would be promoted. 'iYere he to consider religion only in reference to time and man's mortality, and if- he did not consider it as in- yoking all the interests of man in time and eternity, but also as connected with the security of the poor man's rights, and the safety of the rich,- he should still hail with great satisfaction the announcement in his Majesty's Speech that the Government intend to direct its attention to that subject. That was the true con servative principles by which his party were. bound together, and it was not like the rope of sand which was depended upon by those on the opposite side.--( Hear, and laughter from the Opposition.) Mr. FOX MAULE would not go through all the circum locutions of the funeral oration the Hon. Member had been pleased to pronounce over Scotland, or the phillippic he had uttered against the side of the House on which he stood. He, as the Representative of a very large county, which belong e d a l most ent i rely to those who had receiv ed their elective franchise through the Reform Bill, could eon tradict the statement of the Hon. Gentleman, that the ma jority of the wealth of Scotland regretted the formation of the Melbourne Administration. Major BRUCE explained. He said the majority, though not expressing any positive objection to the late Ministry, was not averse to the present. Mr. MAULE then resumed. This constituency had, according to the Hen. G ent l eman, g i ven majorities of a small number i n favour of the Reformers, but what was thb case with regard to himself? Why even that Hon. Gentleman, who now sat on the other side, had been sent in only by a ma jority of four !—( Hear, hear).--and the Hon. Gentleman was the only one from the boroughs of Scotland who sat on that side.--(llear, hear.) With regard to the counties, he was afraid that, in some instances, the constituencies had been obliged to exercise their conscientious feelings rather at the risk of their temporal interests. The landed property of Scot land was, he admitted, adverse to his standing there--( Cheers from the Ministerial side).—but his constituency, who were bold and patriotic enough, when they could not find a represen tative among themselves who would serve their interests, sought one where they could find him, and returned him independent. It was not his intention to detain the House by follow.. inn the Honourable Gentleman through all his statements, but this he (Mr. Maule) would maintain, that the ma jority of the property of Scotland was not in favour of the present Government, but were decidedly friendly to popular right s . H e h a d not the discourtesy to deny the Hon. Gentleman's statement in tote—he would like to see the proofs of the accuracy of the statement, but he defied him to produce them.--( Cheers from the Opposition.) The Hon. Gentleman (Mr. B.) had referred to that part of the King's speech which contained allusions to the established church of Scotland. Now he (Mr. F.) would simply make one observe- • tion on this subject, and that before his voice would be given for the appropriation of any grant from the public revenues for the building of ecclesiastical edifices, they would first fill the churches they had, before they built others. As lt_yeg as those they had were empty, they had no necessity for others. He would not occupy the attention of the House any longer than merely to state, what indeed vas hardly necessary for him, that under the circumstance, in which he was placed, be • could repose no confidence the present Administratio n . —( Cries of 4 , Hear, ) But the opp os iti on w hi c h h e gave was riat a factious ortrosition, as he understood what was meant by the words fivftions opposition, namely, a vexatious, frivolous