The Sun. — London, England, 1846-07-24 00:00:00

RAILWAY COMMITTEES. (3 ESTERDAY) HOUSE OF LORDS. • , or. Room A. CORNWALL. The members of thls Committee re-assembled to-day at eleven. Mr. Rowe, on the part of the Central Devon and Cornwall line, applied to the Committee with the view of obtaining permission to, proceed with evidence to show that the bridge which the Cornwall Company proposed to construct over the river Tamar, at Saltash, was so low as to impede the navigation of the river. This led to a discussion between the respective counsel, and the Committee decided with respect to the construction of the bridge in question, that it was a matter that rested solely with the Admiralty, in whose hands the responsibility should remain. The witnesses against the Bill having been exhausted, a delay of considerable length ensued, till fresh witnesses could be sworn in. The Committee having, then, heard some additienal evidence, ad journed. Room B. The Committee on the Newport, Abergavenny, and Hereford Rail way—the Vale of Neath Railway—the Llynvl Valley and South Wales Junction Railway—and the 'Monmouthshire Railway Bills, con sisting of Lords Fortescue (chairman), Suffolk. Liverpool, Beverley, and Lilford, assembled at eleven o'clock. VALE or NEATIL precedence having been given to this Bill. Mr. Calvert opened the ease for the promoters. Mr. Harris *its examined, and stated that the present price of coals at Merthyr Tydvil was 7s. 10d. per ton, owing to thansufficlent supply afforded to that place, which would be remedial By the pro posed railway. Mr. White, F.C.S., residing at Dowlais, and had about a hundred patients under his care daily, at ironworks and collieries. The highest wages were about 30s. a week, and the lowest about 14s. a week. Swansea was the favourite resort of persons of that class, and if a railway like the proposed one were constructed, the number that would avail themselves of it would be illimitable. Had himself recommended, as a medical man, persons to take these excursions when in a state of convalescence. The Committee, having heard some further evidence, adjourned, Room C. LONDON AND GRAVESEND. (lontinued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.) In answer to Mr. GoLnsmin, Mr. Clough replied that with respect to the public institutions he did not speak as a public servant, but as a town commissioner. A discussion here ensued with the Committee as to whether the evidence was satisfactory. Lord Sondes, Mr. Plumptre, Ar.r., Sir Edward Filmer, and two or three witnesses from Gravesend, confirmed the assertion that the line would be generally acceptable to the district. Colonel Menzies, of the Chatham garrison, was called to show that the line in a military point of view would be highly advantageous, giving a quick and easy communication with Woolwich, Deptford, and Portsmouth. Mr TALBOT was proceeding to cross-examlne as to the point whether the line would not be equally advantageous as a military communication if carried on to Canterbury, when Mr. MERAEWETUER objected to the questions, and the room was cleared. . _ _ After a very lengthened discussion the parties were again admitted, when _ CHAIRMAN read a resolution to the effect, that there being no Bill before the Committee for any line below Rochester, no inquiry ought to be entertained which affected any point below that place. The Committee then adjourned till to-morrow. Room D. GLASGOW,: DUMFRIES, AND CARLISLE (Continued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.) After the absence of about three-quarters of an hour the parties were re-admitted, The CHAIRMAN intimated that as the Committee had considered rallwapommunication was required for the district, they desired that the parties against the Bill should confine themselves to showing that the estimates for the line were inadequate, or that the line, if made, would not be remunerative for the capital invested. Till this was done they could not entertain any other proposition. After some conversation between the Learned Counsel on both sl6les, Mr. CocßotriPe said he was willing to go now into the question of estimates, and reserve any other point that had been raised till after wards. should the Committee then think such to lee necessary. The ezasainatien of witnesses against the Bill was then proceeded with. Mr. Collister, civil engineer, examined—Said he was acting engi neer of the Caledonian line. He knew the route of the present lino well. He knew the price paid for work on the Caledonian and the Lancaster and Carlisle Railways, and he brought those prices to bear on the estimates of the present line. He had gone over the esti mates of the present line carefully, and he felt confident it could not be made for the sums named. He considered it could not be made for less than 1,453,0001. The estimate of the promoters was 1,200,0001. From the nature of the country he considered the line could not be made for less than he had stated. He had endeavoured to take cross sac tions of the country, to know the extra works necessary, but his assistants had been prevented by the agents of the Duke of Buc clench. In fact, they had been assaulted on the highway. He considered that the estimate should also have included houses for workmen engaged in making the line. They had included these In the Caledonian line of last year. There were now ton thousarel men engaged on the Caledonian line, and a proportionate number of men per mile would be required for the present line. The country was so thinly populated that these houses must be required. He thought, also, 100,0001. should have been added for working stock, plant, &c. These items were in ad dition to his estimate of 1,453,000/. Now with regard to the latter estimate, which was 253,000/. over Mr. Blythe'e estimate, he as sumed nearly the same amount of earth-work as they did, while be estimated the coat at 311,5361. He calculated it at 12%d. per yard, whereas they had set it down at 10d. It was often thick blue clay, and the price he stated was the least It could be done for. The whinstone and sandstone cuttings had been much underrated. He considered from the survey he had made there was not less than 622,300 cubic yards of these rock cuttings. Their quantity was 336,000. There was more than this on the Crawick branch algae. He calculated this kind of cutting at 2s. 1010., whereas they had set it down at 2s. 6d. He calculated the work at the prices on the Caledonian line, and if the works were to be done the next three years, from the almost certain nature of the labour-market, it would be impossible to do the work for less. He calculated the whole rock cutting at 88,940/. instead of theirs, which was 42,0001., being 46,0001. more. The masonry, also, he con sidered to be much understated. They made it 92,230/., or about 1,0001. a mile. Me made it 199,516/. (The witness here passed over in detail several bridges along the line, which he represented to be under-estimated considerably, compared with the prices he was paying on the Caledonian line. He also characterised the bridges in meet instances as inadequate for the safety and proper accommodation of such a line of railway. Both the bridges over the streams along the route of the line, as well as those over turnpikes and public roads, had been understated. With regard to occupation bridges there was a glaring defect. They had only fifteen of these in an extent of ninety-two miles, whereas he considered there should not be less than seventy-three. He said so from experience on the Caledonian line. Fer there bridges they set down only 5,070/., whereas he estimated them at 29,1631. The level crossings and lodges had alsobeen ander-estimated both in number and expense. The tunnel at Drumlanrig he esti mated at 451. per cubic yard, against their estimate of 351. He cal culated it at this price, as he considered it would have to be lined with brick-work. In similar works, where there were different layers of strata, it was usual to line the tunnels. His calculation would be 15,0001. more than theirs. The per manent way he made 5,5741. per mile ; their estimate was 5,320/. Resting roads they made 7.000/. ; be made it 11,0001. In his opinion the working expenses, e hich had been stated at 33 per cent., was fixed too low. A per tentage on the gross receipts could nor fairly represent the working expenses, as, whatever might he the amount of the traffic, there would be fixed expenses going forward. A certain uunabcr of truing would have to be ruts daily, officers tied alerks paid, and the way maintained. He considered a lane of 92 miles would require 1501. per mile yearly to keep it in repair. This was 32,5671. 10s. in all. To accommodate the traffic four trains would be required each way daily, and two on Sunday. This, at ls. 3d. per mile each train, would be 15,3821. Goods trains, two a-day, he estimated at 8,810/. ; police, 1,0001.; station ex penses, 1,6501.; rates and taxes at 201. per mile, making 1,8151.; management and chief office expenses, 2.500/.; Government duty on passengers, 1,9501. Total, 46,352/., or 45 per cent. on the estimated receipts. Cross-examined by Mr. Sergeant BELLASTS—Iid went over the Ilse about Whitsuntide with Mr. Errington. He left London, and was absent about a fortnight. They started at Springfield to go over the line on Monday, at ten o'clock, and were engaged till Wednesday. Witness was the assistant of Mr. Locke. Mr. Locke bad only completed one line as yet in Scotland—the Glasgow and Greenock. Mr. Miller had, he believed, completed in &co land about 2041 miles of railway. With regard to Mr. Miller exceeding the original estimate on the Edinburgh and Glasgow line, he was not aware of any branches beyond what were provided for in the original estimate, but there was the expensive entrance into Edinburgh, which was not originally given. It ought in fairness to have been stated. He was not aware that the pleat and stock of the cempany, were not included in the original estimate. lie was In possession of most of the data he had given three weeks ago, but it was put into its present shape last night. He had no doubt the North British line was completed for lower prices than those he had stated, as there had been a great competition. He was not aware that the Edinburgh and Hawick, or the Ayrshire line to Cumnock, were contracted for at less prices than he had stated. The Cale donian line had not been contracted for by public competition ; it was agreed for at a certain price, which he was satisfied was as little as it could be well done for. The Caledonian Company were paying in some cases is. Gd. a yard for rock cuttings and supplying the parties with waggons and other conveniences. The prices he had named were similar to those on the Lancaster and Carlisle, and Blackburn and Preston. The same contractor was enaged on the former as was engaged on the Caledonian line. The working stock of the Caledonian he calculated, last year, at 137,0001. He did not add any additional working stock this year for the Dumfries and Langholm branches. There was about 16 miles of the Caledonian line higher than the Dumfries line—not more. (The Learned Gen tlemen then went over the Nithsdale line along with the witness, with the object of showing that there were villages along the route that would accommodate the workmen without the erection of the houses spoken of.) . _ The Witness Was next subjected to a rigid cross-examination on the details he had given respecting the brid ges and viaducts, with the object of showing that the scale and principle on which he had es timated them were exaggerated and unnecessary. and that the prices of masonry had been fixed too high. He ma d e a , esti mate of the whinstone rock cutting three weeks ago, but be had it not upon him. He estimated this rock from the examinations he had made by borings and by observa tion of its repeated protrusions on the surface. After a few more questions on the details by which he had arrived at his conclu sions of the amount of rock and whinstone cutting, the witness, at the request of Mr. Sergeant Bellasis, promised to furnish them in writing by the morning with the particulars which he sought to obtain. The Committee then adJournel till to-morrow at eleven o'clock. Room E. ILICEITEZ AND DORCHESTER. (Continued from our Afternoon Edition of yesterday.) Mr. lIILDrAItD said Sir E. Duckworth, Bart., 31. P. for Exeter, was in attendance, but they did not think, in consequence of the in timation of the Committee, that it was necessary to call him before them. Mr Juft, of Chard, was then called, who gave evidence as to the benefits to be derived by the construction of the proposed railway to the town of Chard. Mr. Hayward, of Crewkerne, thought the present line better adapted for the interests of Crewkerne than the lin e Great Western Company, notwithstanding the art re er posed by t i b n e . , tended to run nearer to the town than the former one. al m g ai . alone were entertained by the majority of the inhabitants of Crew_ ;:erne upon this subject. Mr. J. Thytherleigh, residing at Axminster, said that he felt great Interest in the success of this line. His opinion as to the superior merits of the line before the Committee was also shared by the inha bitants of Axminster. Mr. T. Holloway, timber merchant, of Salisbury, stated that there Were considerable quantities of tim:)er grown in the districts between Salisbury and Yeovil, which was at present unsaleable in conse quence of there being -no means of transporting it to the water without considerable expense. The prepozed line, if constructed, would open the dockyards of Southampton and Portsmouth markets for timber—elm timber especially, large quantities of which were grown in those districts. Mr: Dowding, meat salesman, of Newgate.market, was in the habit of receiving from 8 to 10 tons a week of dead consignments from his son, who resided at Gillingham. It occupied one day and two nights to make the journey to London. He had often lost as much as 501. in a day, In consequence of the delays that had fre quently taken place by sending meat, first to Andover, a distance of 28 miles, ,and then by the Great Western Railway, that being the course they were obliged to adopt. If the railway went through this d strict, they would, of course, be able to rec e i ve the meat quicker and fresher. Cross-examined by Mr. BLADE—The Great Western Railway Company had refused to compensate him for the losses he had sus tained by their delay. Mr. MEsszwrraza then proposed to call Mr. Oliver, butcher, of tiouthampton, bat . The CI!AMMAN stated that there was no necessity for calling any ferther traffic evidence. The Committee were quite satisfied upon the point, and were quite su re th at no ev i dence which could be b r ought forward by the opposing parties could shake the evidence which had been given. The teas spoken to i • were ncentrovertible by their very nature. Mr. MElletwerneit then proposed to call the engineerity , evi dence. Mr. Locke, engineer to the South-Western, was then called. —Th e line before the Committee had been laid out by him with a vletw'of affording the best mode of communication between London and Exeter. It was also proposed to carry the line from Eieter west ward to Falmouth. The total length of the line between Exeter and London was 170 miles ; the distance by the existing route was 193% miles. On that portion of the line between Salisbury and Basing stoke, a distance of 32 miles, there was no gradient steeper than I In 180. On the line between Salisbury and Yeovil, a distance o f 41 miles. there was no gradient more severe than I in 10G—that gradient only occurred once. The line between Exeter and Yeovil, which was a very difficult country for the construction of a railway, was 47 '• miles in length. Toe steepest gradient was 1 in 81, The steepest gradient upon the line between Exeter and Yeovil was in 78. There was no really substantial difference between the two lines in an engineering point of view. There was no curve upon the line of a less radius than 20 chains. The amount of tunnelling on the line between Exe`er and Yeovil was 2,950 yards. On Mr. Brunel's line, between Yeovil and Exeter, the quantity of tunnel ling was 4,565 yards. From Yeovil to Salisbury there were 1,830 yards, and on the lino between Salisbury and Basingstoke 1,160 yards. The three lines forming an integral and competing scheme between London and Exeter affected also the means of communication through districts entirely destitute of railways. The estimate for the Basingstoke and Salisbury line was •• .. •• .•.••• •• • • • • £700,000 Salisbury ana Yeovil Yeovil and Exeter • ....... • • .... 200,000 .............. 1,300,000 Making a total of •• . . ... ....... There was a surplus of nearly 300,0001. on the line between Exeter and Yeovil, in consequence of one of the branches being thrown out in the house of Commons. The actual estimate would therefore be 2,600,000/., which he considered amply sufficient for the purposes of constructing the line. Cross-examined by Mr. TALtioT —Yeovil was placed upon a branch of almost two miles in length, proceeding from the main line. For a distance of six miles between Sherborne and Yeovil the proposed line would run parallel to the existing line of the Wilts and Somerset Rail way. They did not propose to effect any junction with that line. lie thought there should be a narrow gauge line between Bridport and Dorchester, In order to complete the chain of narrow gauge commu nication. He did not think that a line could be constructed north ward of Sherborne with a gradient of 1 in 98, or if It could be, he was sure that It would be attended with very great expense. As there was no probability of the cross-examination being con cluded to-day, the Committee adjourned till eleven to-morrow. Room F BIRMINGHAM AND OXFORD JUNCTION AND BIRMINGHAM EXTENSION. Their Lordships met again at the usual hour this morning, Lord Ripon in the chair; present, Lords Eldon, Montford, Wynford, and Sondes. Mr. Wm amnia stated, on the meeting of the Committee, that none of the witnesses whom he was about to call had been sworn, and that they could not be sworn in the House at present, as a legal discussion was now going on, and would probably last for some time. He there fore requested their Lordships to hear the witnesses at once, and to leave them to be sworn afterwards. - Their Lordships, after some hesitation, gave their consent to the "iourse Mr. Haddon, a brewer, at Leamington, and Mr. Gladstone and Mr. Nelson, merchar is and manufacturers at Birmingham and Ban bury, gave evidence in favour of the line, chiefly in corroboration of that of the wftness called yesterday. Mr. I. K. Brunel, the engineer to the lime, gave the engineering evidence, which was the same as his evidence before the Committee on Group 33, in the Commons, at an earlier part of the session. It . . was reported at sufficient length in The Sun at the time, and it is, therefore, unnecessary to repeat it here. He referred to the offer made to the petitioner, Mr. Wyse, to refer to any nobleman or gentleman in the country near his estate, to decide whether or ne the company should buy the whole or any part, or, if so, what part of that gentleman's property, and also to put a price on it. The company were ready to fulfil that offer, and to allow Mr. Wyse to choose the reteree. He also made reference to the offers made by the company to the several other petitioners, which he said they were still ready to stick to. Mr. Brunel's evidence was not concluded at five o'clock, at which hour the Committee adjourned till eleven o'clock to-morro v. Room H. LEAMINGTON (lILACKBURN, AND SOUTH LANCASHIRE RUGBY AND PRESTON, JUNCTION). The Committee met at eleven o'clock, the Earl of Strafford in the chair. Mr. WALLINGTON, a solicitor of Warwick, was heard in opposition to the Leamington portion of the line, on account of its interfering with the Crown Hotel. He maintained that a better line could be made, which would interfere with less valuable property, and save 50,0001., without in any way detracting from the advantage of the line, and called upon the Committee to adopt this deviation. Mr. Nichol, a surveyor of Leamington, corroborated this statement. The witness was eross-examined by Mr. LAING with respect to several inaccuracies in the sections of the deviated line, which, he held, were fatal to it, and that it could not be made. It appeared there was a mistake of 10 feet in the levels, a gradient of 26 chains being marked I In 104, instead of 1 in 114. Mr. Duffy, an engineer and surveyor, admitted the mistake, and also that such a mistake would, in many instances, prove fatal to the undertaking. Mr. Olding, an engineer, said, assuming the section correct, that the line was practicable. Mr. Stanley said his rent was 4501. a year, and that the line would not touch the hotel, but would run aeross his farm within 20 yards of it. Mr. lIILDYARD contended that the case was simply one of com pensation ; and after some discussion, a clause was agreed to, that the property of Mr. Stanley should not be interfered with with out his consent, and that compensatien should be awarded, if injury was done. The preamble of the Bill for the amalgamation was then agreed to. BRISTOL AND BIRMINGHAM (GLOUCES TER AND STONEHOUSE). This was a Bill to enable the Bristol and Birmingham Railway to lay down the narrow gauge by the side of the broad gauge from Gloucester to Stonehouse, a distance of seven miles. Mr. AUSTIN opposed the Bill, for the Great Western Company, on the ground that an agreement had been entered into lay the two com panies which this Bill would interfere with. lie had no objection to the laying down of the narrow gauge even as far as Bristol, but he held that the narrow gauge ought not to be laid at the side of the broad, but within it. Mr. Sanders, the secretary to the Bristol and Birmingham, gave evidence to show the necessity of the narrow gauge to Stonehouse, and. the Committee adjourned until to- morrow. Room 5. ROTHEILIZAIVI, BARNSLEY, WAKEFIELD, HUDDERSFIELD, AND GOOLE. The Committee on this line met at the usual hour, at No. 5 Abingdon-street, the Earl of Radnor in the chair. The case of the promoters having closed yesterday, the evidence on behalf of the opposition was proceeded with this morning. Mr. Graham, master of the Milton Iron Works, near Shetlicld, was exarninel at great length. The effect of his evidence was to show that a line east and west would give greater accommodation than one north and south. Mr. Itigley, a coal surveyor at Manchester, corroborated the evi donee of the last witness. Ile did not think that the proposed lin would accommodate the coal-fields so well as a line east and west Messrs. Swanwick and Gee, civil engineers, were each subjected to a long examination on the part of the opponents of the line, to prove the difficulties connected with its construction. The latter gentle man stated that it would cost a great sum of money, and that there were more tunnels on the line in proportion than on any other line with which he was acquainted. The Committee adjournel till to-morrow. HOUSE OF COMMONS. GROUP LX 11. The Committee on this group of Bills met again to-day In Room 22 (Grand Corridor), Lord Lincoln in the chair, when the case of the LONDON AND SOIITH-WESTERN (LONDON BRIDGE EXTENSION) was resumed, the preamble declared to be proved, and the clauses agreed to. The Committee then adjourned. GROUP LXIX. This Committee re-assembled to-day in Room 23 (New Uonses of Parliament), Mr. W. Baring in the chair. NVISDECII, ST. IVES, AND CAPIZZEIDGE ?UNCTION This case was resumed, and the preamble of the Bill eventually de. dared to be not proved. GROUP LXX. The Select Committee on this group of Bills re-assembled to day at the usual hour, in Room 24 (New Houses of Parliament) ; Sir George Clerk in the chair. There were also present all the other members of the Committee, ♦iz., Colonel Peel, the Hon. Captain Carnegie, Mr. Smyth, and Mr. Tower. DUBLIN AND ENNISKILLEN. The opposition to this Bill was resumed. Mr. Fleming, secretary of the company, was called by Mr. Murphy, to prove noncompliance with the Duncombe resolutions on the part of the proprietors. Mr. RYAN, accountant to the Dublin and Kelso Bank, was also called for the same purpose, but no decision on that charge was given at the rising of the Committee at four o'clock. STANDING ORDERS' COMMITTEE. HOUSE OF LORDS. Their Lordships' Committee on the Standing Orders met to-day at two o'clock, in Room No. 1, Parliamentary Offices, Abingdon-street, the Earl of Shaftesbury in the chair. In the case of the SOUTH STAFFORDSHIRE RAILWAY (WITH BRANCHES). The preamble was proved. BIRMINGHAM, WOLVERHAMPTON, AND STOUR VALLEY (BIRMINGHAM, WOLVERHAM ?TON, AND DUDLEY LINES). The preamble of this Bill also was proved. CORK AND WATERFORD (TWO LINES.) The preambles of these Bills were also proved. LEEDS AND BRADFORD (JUNCTION AT BRADFORD). Preamble proved. EAST AND WEST INDIA DOCKS, AND BIR3IINGILi.3I JUNCTION RAILWAY. The preamble of this Bill was proved ; as was also that of the GLASGOW, GARNKIRK, AND COATBRIDGE RAILWAY EXTENSION. Their Lordships then adjourned. NORTHERN AND SOUTHERN CONNECTING RAILWAY. A special meeting of the shareholders in this line took place yesterday at the London Tavern, under the provisions of Lord Dalhousie's Dissolution Act, in order to determine upon the propriety of winding up the affairs of the Company. There was rather a numerous attendance of the proprietary present. The chair was taken, at half-past one o'clock, by Mr. E. Scard. The Sacarrany read the advertisement convening the meeting. The CHAIRMAN said be had received a letter from Mr. De Burgh regretting that he was unable to attend the meet ing of the Company, in consequence of a domestic affliction. It did not behove him to state very much to the meeting; he would merely observe that they were all aware of the rejection of the Bill in the House of Commons, and likewise of the action in the Court of Chancery commenced against the directors. He was happy to say that the plaintiff's, Messrs. Castendeeck, Baring, and Swinton, had consented that the money be withdrawn from the Ac countant-General's hands, and placed in the hands of two of the directors, Mr. Edward Scard and Mr. Johnston, and two of the plaintiffs, Mr. Castendeeck and Mr. Swinton. He would conclude by observing that they would do their utmost to discharge their liabilities in a manner satisfactory to the pro. prietary at large. Mr. FRANCIS begged to move that the Company be dis solved. Mr. CORSET seconded the resolution. Mr. CLARKE desired to have a statement of the accounts before he would proceed to act as a scrutineer. Some very disorderly and irregular conversation here en sued, and Mr. Daniel, one of the scrutineers, refused to act with Mr. Clarke. After some further noisy discussion, the resolution was carried for a dissolution of the Company, the number - voting being 456 shares, assenting to a dissolution without bankruptcy, and 510 remain neutral. 1 The meeting then settarated. DIRECT WESTERN RAILIVAY COMPANY. ( The adjourned meeting of the shareholders, for the p ur p ose of determining on the dissolution of the Company, was held at the King's Head Tavern, Poultry, at two o'clock. Ye 3 s f ter'ia r. Alyderman CIIALIS having taken the chair, apologised for not being present at the app ointed hour, havin g been detained by magisterial duties , a nd then read the clanseof theActunder which the adjourned mee tin g was held. The SECRETARY read the advertisement convening the meeting. meetingemen present t at the wholewoul d recollect fr o m li A I R M A whatN octheenurresadida, at question was simply whether they should g o on, or whether they gould dissolve the Company? and, if so , whe ther t he y the the la g s e t ntl that would declare a bankruptcy, or consult, perhaps, their inte rests, more efficiently, by leaving it in the hands of the com mittee. He had told them at the last meeting that the effect of going into a Court of Bankruptcy would be that the concern would be referred over to a Blaster in Chancery, and it might not be settled in the course of two or three years. He said, however, if the Company could be referred to any official tribunal in the country, with a pros pect of ready settlement, the Committee would be very glad to get rid of it. He made these remarks because he took the chair that day, as he hadAone before, only with a view to yield to every proprietor every reasonable satisfaction on 'any matter connected with the present failure—for failure it had been ; and just because it was so, the suspicions of proprietors would be most naturally excited against the Provisional Committeemen. For his part, he had actually sought for objections among his friends, and the amount of these, he would be candid enough to tell them, was that the committee had spent a large amount of money on engineering, when they knew that the pub lic would not take up their shares. But this objection arose out of ignorance of what actually occurred. It was only in the month of October that the shares were issued, and they were all issued at the same time. Now if it was considered that by the month of Feb ruary following the committee had to place the Company in a fit position to make their deposits, so that between October and February they bad to originate a working corn mittee, get up surveys, and prepare sections for 150 miles of railway, within the space of six or seven weeks—if taken into account, it must appe ar t h at the Provisional t Com mittee had only done what they w ou ld h ave been most 1 culpable, indeed criminal, if they had negl ec t e d. Another THE SUN, LONDON, FRIDAY _EVENING, JULT 24, 1846. chsrge'against the Committee was that they had not used any diligence in getting in those deposits whi c h had not been paid. But he asked what right, till the present hour, the Cuimuitee had to go forward to those persons with an account of ex penses, and a calculation of the proportion fur which they were liable, and demand payment? Now, however, it was different, and the Committee pledged themselves to use every means to make these persons pay up, which they could do, he was sure, more efficiently new, even in law, than they could before. He was of opinion that the Company was in this respect in a more favourable position than any other company which had hitherto dissolved and its claims stronger ; for no promise had been made at starting which had not been fulfilled, nothing had been held out which was not afterwards made good. Indeed, next week they were as ready as at first to hold a meeting, and to tell the merits of the proposed line; they wanted nothing but money to enable them to go on. The only other objection which he would mention arose from a mistake made in the report of the last meet ing by, he believed, the Railway Times, in stating the number of shares written for to be but 400,000, instead of 1,400,000, which was the true number. The mistake, how ever, had been the occasion of his receiving several letters from the country, altogether arising from a casual error of the press. The proposal of the Committee, he said, was, that they should nay over to the shareholders immediately the balance in hind, about 265. a share, the Provisional Com mitteemen standing aside till they got in money from the Provisional Committeemen who had not paid up, and the allottees. The Solicitor of the Company stated, in reply to a question from one of the proprietors, that the number of committee men who had not paid upon their shares was thirty-three. A PROPRIETOR asked to have a list of those thirty-three persons, who he said had acted so unlike gentlemen, and re pudiated their just and legal debts. The CHAIRMAN said, he and the committee thoroughly sym pathised with the indignation that had been expressed against those who had connected themselves with an undertaking while its prospects were fair, but had abandoned it so soon as these had changed. He stated that they would use their en deavours in every way to recover the debts, as indeed they had done already, having issued writs against several, and holding over them the shame of exposure of their conduct. A PROPRIETOR moved that a list of the names of those on the provisional committee who had not. paid should be fur nished and published. The CHAIRMAN said that it was not regular, according to the Act of Parliament under which they were met, to intro duce other business at present. But what would answer the same purpose, the Committee pledged themselves to intimate to the persons in question that, unless they paid up, their names should be printed and sent round to all the share holders.—(Hear, hear.) The CHAIRMAN, in reference to a remark which fell from a person in the meeting, said the Committee still had the power by law, and more power than before, to make these parties pay up, The scrutineers having completed their task, The CHAIRMAN intimated that the votes for dissolution were 3,785, neuters 10, against dissolution none, for bank ruptcy none, and in the room but did not register 100. The number of those who voted at the previous meeting for dis solution, and whose votes must be reckoned in addition to the numbers of that day was 2,985, being some hundreds more than the Act requited of them. The CHAIRMAN, after declaring the vote, expressed his high gratification at the result. Mr. BLEADEN moved a vote of thanks to Alderman Challis for his conduct in the chair, and for the upright way in which he had conducted himself throughout the whole pro ceedings. Mr.I)EANE seconded the motion, which was carriel unani mously. Mr. Alderman Crraws expressed his gratitude for the kindness with which they had listened to him on this un fortunate affair. The meeting then adjourned. IMI'ERJAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS, July 23. The LORD CHANCELLOR took his seat upon the Wool ' sack at Five (Meek precisely. MESSAGE FROM TIIE HOUSE OF COMMONS. Messengers from the House of Commons brought down certain Bills. MR. HUDSON AND THE BREAK OF GAUGE. Lord HATHERTON said that their Lordships would recollect that a discussion had taken place in their Lordships' House on the subject of the gauge resolu ti,ns, and he wished to make an explanation upon the subject. On that occasion he made some comments on the break of gauge which happened at Gloucester. He had been since informed that Mr. Hudson had nothing whatever to do with that event, and that he had nothing whatever to do with the Birmingham to Bristol line, and had never been to Gloucester but once. He had, therefore, very great pleasure in making this retractation of his observations with regard to Mr. Hudson, fur whose pui.lic conduct he had a very great respect. Mr. Hudson had even been characterised in his public conduct by the utmost liberality and good faith, but he did not mean to retract his obser vations to the effect that the inconvenience of the break of gauge were very ereatly exaggerated. THE GREAT WESTERN RAILWAY COMPANY. The Duke of WELLINGTON presented a petition from Mr. Hartnell, complaining of the conduct of the Great Western Railway Company, who had, in construct ing the Yeovil line, entered upon his property, and refused to give him any satisfaction whatever. He had received two notices to quit, but no notice what ever of the affixing a price upon his property, so that he had been deprived not only of the . enjoyment of his property, but of the money which ought to have been paid for it. lit (the Duke of Wellington; thought that, considering the great power which had been conferred on these great companies, they ought at least to have conducted themselves without such trespass as this. He would not conclude without naming the company who had committed what he could not but call this outrage— it was the Great Western Company. The Earl of CLARENI)ON felt anxious to put the matter in its proper point of view, he having been chair man of the Committee when this line had been passed, and he had cenceived it then to be a case of great hardship, and he had provided for the evil, but he was not at all aware of the trespass that had been committed. He yet believed that if this poor ►wan were advised aright in his neighbourhood, he would be able to sustain an action for trespass, and would obtain damages. Lord BROUGHAM was very glad that his Noble Friend had brought forward this case, for it really was beyond all bearing that those great companies should have the power to act as they chose. Last session, in presenting the petition of a certai❑ noble lady, lie had been very properly instructed to bring the case of this poor man under their Lordships' notice, and it was one of very great hardship. The fact was, my Lords, that the railway speculators might come on the laud at any time they chose, and the owner was prevented from letting his land or improving it, or even using it in his business as a nursery gardener. As for a tresspass, the great probability is, that if this poor man were to bring an action, all the jurors being railway prop. ietors, lie would certainly not obtain even the costs out of pocket, much less get any damages for the injury he had suffered. Lord VIVIAN had always felt that this long time for the railway companies to come on the land was a great evil, and in the London and York Committee, after much discussion, ho had succeeded in obtaining a reduction of the time specified in the Bill from seven years to five years The Duke of GRAFTON vite agreed in the neces sity of curtailing the powers of the great companies The petition was ordered to lie on the table. SLAVE TRADE DISCUSSION. Lord BROUGHAM begged to give notice to their Lordships, that in consequence of observing that the subject of the sugar duties was to be brought on in another place to•morrow, he would beg to give notice that he should postpone his motion respecting the slave trade till tomorrow week. The Marquis of LANSDOWNE wished to know whether his Noble Friend really intended to bring on the matter th.-n ? Lord BROUGHAM—Of course, it would much de pend upon the turn the matter took in another place, but if he postponed it until the. Bill came up from the other House, the probability was, that it would be at so late a period of the session that there would be a very thin attendance of their Lordships, and whether decided or not, therefore, he should certainly bring on the sub ject to-morrow week. POLISH CONFISCATIONS. Lord LANSDO .V NE stated, in referents to a ques tion put by his Noble and Learned Friend (Lord Brougham), in reference to the unfortunate circum stances which had occurred in Poland, that he had informed himself on the subject of the Learned Lord's question, and found that no in formation had been received from the Austrian Government. But authentic information had been re ceived by her Majesty's Government from time to time, and from that information it appeared that the Austrian Government had every disposition to leniency. lie (Lord Lansdowne) could only say that if any one had been involuntarily involved i❑ the unfortunate occur. rences that had taken place in Poland, he had no doubt that the Austrian Government would do them reason able justice. Lord BROUGHAM expressed his gratification at the information he had received, and strongly condemned the Polish insurrection. CATHOLIC RELIEF BILL. Lord LYNDHURST intimated that he had met with the Right Reverend Prelate who interposed at a previous stage of this Bill, and they had agreed en two amendments, and he now asked the House to go into committee pro forma, that these amendments might be incorporated with the others that had been made in the House. He stated that he understood her Majesty's present Ministers had intimated their intention to adopt the measure as a Go vernment measure. If they adopted that mea sure in whole, and without change, he would go on with it, hoping to have the support of the Go. vernment. Lord LANSDOWNE said that the Government would open every facility for the progress of the measure. The Bishop of LONDON said there were several difficult points in the Bill, especially the supremacy of the Crown, and the introduction of bulls into this coun try; and he begged, on behalf of his reverend brethren and himself, that the Bill should be postponed to another session. Lord BEAUMONT could not help expressing his surprise at the course pursued by the Right Rev. Prelate and his brethren. The question had been before the House now three years. The Right Rev. Prelate on every occasion of its being introduced had spoken on it, and had had opportunities of dividing the House on it. The two questions, the supremacy of the Crowa and the introduction of bulls, had been discussed, and every objection met by the Learned Lord, yet the Right Rev. Prelate wished to have it postponed to another session. The Bishop of LONDON explained, and said his reason for wishing it postponed was the absence of his brethren on official duties, the discharge of which occupied the whole of their time.—(Hear.) As it appeared to him it would affect the oath which the clergy took, he did hope that they would postpone the discussion, as it affected the interest of his right rev. brethren. Lord LYNDHURST said he had nothing to complain of in the manner the discussion was carried on. He desired that their Lordships would allow him to go into Committee proforma, in order that he might have an opportunity of printing those amendtnents which had been agreed to by him end the Right Reverend Prelate, and wick which he expressed himself quite satisfied, he must say that he was quite unprepared now for any opposition. The House then went into Committee pro forml. ST. ASAPH AND BANGOR BILL. Earl PO WIS moved the third reading of this Bit which was agreed to and passed. LIVERPOOL, PRESTON, AND ORMSKIRK RAILWAY. Lord STANLEY said he had a petition from the in habitants of Ormskirk in favour of the Liverpool, Preston, and Ormskirk Railway. Their case was one of peculiar hardship. The Bill had been now before Parliament for two years. The company had petitoned to brim* in the Bill early in January ; they did so early in the month of February. In June, the parties being all ready to proceed, the House of Commons interfered, and a delay of four months was thereby occasioned. They went into Committee early in the month o f June, l andearly in the month of July it was reported that they had complied with all the standing orders. On the 7th some communication was made which led to a private inquiry, and the consideration of the report was postponed until the 9th. On the 10th of the same month the Bill was engrossed, but in consequence of the neglect of the officers, the sheets were not stitched together, and a considerable delay was occasioned. Now had not any of these accidents happened, not one of which were occasioned by the neglect of the parties, the Bill would have already received their Lordships' sanction. The post?onement of this Bill would involve the parties in an expense of 60,0001. ; and if the same accidents were to occur next session, they would be pr e . cisely in the same position next year as they were now. He would rot ask his Noble Friend for an answer just now, but he would ask him to inquire , and ascertain how many Bills there might be which had passed the third reading in the other House, and wer e sto pped by s il o o m u e se r Lu d t i s a e r e h ow circumstancesmanyof them tmh re gulationsemi g bt,without m uc h inconvenience, be committed, an d got through the House, s o as t o h ave as f ew rem nants left for next ses- sion as possible. Lord BROUGHAM conceived that some plan should be devis e d , s i m il ar to t h at o f t h e l as t session, and that this frightful expense might be saved to the parties. A suggestion had been made that three Peers should be selected for Committees, but considering the great powers which were delegated to those Committees, and now unwilling the Hou s e were to set aside their deci sions, he thought there were important reasons why•the number of five should be continued. Some provision might be made to the effect which he had suggested. The Earl of CLARENDON said that he had had the honour of receiving :several parties connected with (his Bid, and lisd certainly not given them much hope that the House would depart from the resolutions which it had adopted. But this was a case of very great hard ship, and if it could be overruled by any means, he thought that course ought to be adopted. The Bill, in tact, had been read a second time on Monday. Lord BROUGHAM and Lord STANLEY explained that the Bill only stood for a second reading. Lord REDESDALE thought that their Lordships ought not to commit the same error which they did last year—that of preferring one line to another ; for it should be recollected that they were all competing lines. He said that the public suffered much from imperfect systems, passed under particular favour. He said it not with any disrespect t,f his Noble Friends, who had been on the Committee ; but he did say that there were not two less perfect schemes than those two which he had enjoyed the honour of bringing up.—(Hear, hear.) These schemes could not have been constructed on the Bills which had been passed ; the Bills were being amended and patched up, and indeed new Bills altogether would have to be drawn up. He hoped the House would keep strictly to the rules which had been laid down; and, though it might be a hardship, their keeping strictly to a day beyond when no Committee should be appointed would only prevent greater hardship in a future year. Lord BEAUMONT thought it would have been more convenient if the Noble Lord had not entered into dis cussion on that occasion, as the Government had given notice of their intention to lay these measures before the House to• morrow. But he could not allow the House to go away under the idea that the Government agreed with all that fell from the Noble Lord. He thought it would be a monstrous grievance, if in a case which was purely voluntary, as the rising of the House was, their Lordships inflicted on parties who came into that House with private Bills the necessity of renewing the whole progress. Lord STANLEY thought that it would be convenient if a list of private Bills, and the stages at which they had arrived, were laid before the House. Earl GREY assented. GLASGOW TERMINI BILL. On the motion of Lord HARDWICKE, this Bill was read a third time and passed. The MN on the table having been forwarded a stage, their Lordships adjourned. HOUSE OF COILLTIONS, July 23. The SPEAKER took the Ch a i r shortly ' before Four o'clock. Mr. WILLIAM BROWN was introduced by Mr. Bro therton and Mr. Thornely, and took the oaths and his seat for South Lancashire, in the room of Lord Francis Egerton, now Earl of Ellesmere. GLASGOW, AIRDRIE, AND MONKLANDS JUNCTION RAILWAY. Mr. DENNIST')UN moved that the Lords' amend ments to the Glasgow, Airdrie, and Mouklands Junc tion Railway Bill should be considered and agreed to. Mr. HOPE JOHNSTONE trusted that the consi deration of the amendments would be postponed for a fortnight. After a short discussion the amendments were agreed to. ELY AND HUNTINGDON RAILWAY (BED FORD EXTENSION). This Bill was read a third time and passed. LORDS A M ENDMENTS. _ _ The Lords amendments to the following Bills were agreed to Black burn and Preston Railway. Blackburn, Clitheroe, and North Western Juncticn Railway. Black Sluice Drainage and Navigation. Grand Junction Railway (lluyton and Aston and other Branches). Lancaster and Carlisle Railway (Extension to the Cale donian Railway), and Lancaster and Preston Junction Rail ways Amalgamation. Leeds, Dewsbury, and Manchester Railway Deviations and [ranches. London and Brighton Railway (Wandsworth Branch). Sheffield, Ashton-under-Lyne, and Manchester Rail way, &c., Amalgamation. Sheffield, Ashton-under-Lune, and Manchester Rail way (Peak Forest and Macclesfield Canal Purchases). Ten by, Saundersfoot, and South Wales Railway. REPORTS. The following reports were brought up, agreed to, and the Bills ordered to be printed : Australian Agricultural Company. Barr's Estate Bill. Fleeming's Estate Bill. Londonderry and Enniskillen Railway. North Kent Railway (City Extension). Park's (or Yates') Estate Bill. Phiip's Charity Estate Bill. Sligo and Shannon Railway. Stamford and Spalding Railway.• DUBLIN WIDE STREETS. Mr. GROGAN moved the order of the day for the further consideration of the report on the Dublin Wide Streets Bill. Mr. O'CONNELL moved that the further considera tion of the report should be postponed for a wei k, in order that the evidence that had been taken before the Committee might be printed and laid ou the table of the House. Mr. GROGAN would have no objection to the propo sition of the I-lon. and Learned Member, provided it would not have the effect of defeating the measure al together. It was admitted on all hand.; that some altera tion of the law was necessary, arid the Committee were unanimous in favour of the Bill. Mr. ESTCOURT supported the Bill. Mr. P. SCROPE trusted the House would consent to the postponement of the consideration of the report, in order that the evidence might be printed. After some observations from Mr. BaoTnEirroN and Captain JONES, Sir W. SOMERVILLE trusted the House would not read the Bill a third time until the evidence had been printed and. laid before it. After a few words from Mr. O'ColorEu. and Mr. Gnoo.ex in explanation, Mr. LA BOUCHERE sa'd there were important public considerations mixed up with this Bill, and he was therefore an advocate for its postponement. It ap peared to him that the whole subject of local taxation in Dublin required to be fully inquired into, and the Bill ought to be delayed till such an inquiry had been instituted. It would seem that the late Government had given their sanction to this Bill, but the Noble Lord who had formerly been connected with the Irish office, he was glad to see was in his place. and he should be happy to know from him if any member of that depart ment had given his &section to the measure. Lord LINCOLN said the Bill certainly was brought under the consideration of the Irish offi,v, but it was before he became connected with that department. He, however, on taking office as Secretary for Ireland, did look into the provisions of the Bill, and certainly his inquiries did not lead to th ! conclusions which the Right Hon. Gentleman stated he had come to.—(Hear, hear.) Lord WORSLEY said it really appeared to him that it was highly desirable that the House should have the evidence of the Committee in their possession before they passed this Bill. Lord LINCOLN said, since he had addressed the House he had made some inquiries relative to the question of' the Right Honourable Gentleman opposite, and he had ascertained that an application was made to his predecessor to introduce the Bill, but he declined doing so because he thought it came within the scope of a private Bill.—(Hear, hear.) The consideration of the report was adjourned. EDINBURGH PAVING BILL. Mr. GIBSON CRAIG moved that Standing Orders Nos. 110, 114, 116, 117, and 134 and 135. with the reso lutions of 3d April and 10th June last, in reference to the last mentioned order, be suspended ; and that the Edinburgh Paving (No. 2) Bill be read a second time ; that a breviate thereof be dispensed with ; and (hat the said Bill be committed to the Chairman of the Corn mittee of Ways and Means, and the Members appointed to bring in the same, with leave to meet to-morrow, at one o'clock.—Agreed to. LONDONDERRY AND ENNISKILLEN RAIL WAY EXTENSION. Sir ROBERT FERGUSON moved that the standing order be suspended, and that the report on the London derry and Enniskillen Railway Extension Bill be taken into consideration to. morrow.—Agreed to. POOR REMOVAL BILL. The Marquis of DOURO presented two petitions against this Bill. TOBACCO DUTIES. Dr. BOWRING presented a petition from some of the most respectable tobacco dealers in the kingdom, which stated that it was impossible to prevent the smuggling or adulteration of tobacco, in consequence of the pre sent enormous duties on that article, and they prayed that the duty might be reduced to one shilling per pound. THE INDIAN ARMY. The SPEAKER informed the House, amidst general cheering, that he had received communications from Lord Hardinge, Governor-General of India, and Lord Gough, the Commander-in-Chief, returning thanks for the vote of Parliament respecting the late spirited con duct of the British army in Indic. THE REPEAL OF THE UNION. Mr. O'CONNELL gave notice, that early next session he should move for a Select Committee to inquire into the manner in which the legislative union of England and Leland was effected, and under what circumstances ; and also to inquire into the effect which the union had had upon the people of Ireland —(Hear, hear.) Sir ROBERT FERGUSON moved for certain re turns relating to Ireland. FAILURE OF THE POTATO CROP IN IRELAND. Mr. O'CONNELL said, seeing the Right Honour able Gentleman the Secretary for Ireland in his place, he wished to ask him whether the Government had received any information relative to the anticipated failure of the potato crop in Ireland, and whether they intended to take any measures to meet the suffering which such an occurrence must necessarily occasion. Mr. LABOUCIIERE said, in answer to the question of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, he begged to say that from various quarters, some private and some official, Government had received information, that although there was every prospect of an excellent harvest in those things which constituted the food of the people, yet with regard to the potato crop, the disease which produced such sad effects last year had made its appearance. With regard to the second question, as to whether Government intended to take measures to provide for the emergency, he hoped the House as well as the Honourable and Learned Member for Cork would see that it was highly important gentlemen should have time to consider a measure which ought not to be pre maturely decided upon.—(Hear, hear.) JOINT STOCK BANKS (IRELAND AND SCOT LAND) BILL. On the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the EX CHEQUER, the committal of this Bill was postponed. FEES IN COURTS OF LAW. Mr. B. ESOOT r said that, in the course of a debate which took place a short time ago with reference to the system of lees in courts of justice, a general inquiry was acimi•ted to be necessary into the whole system. Considering what took place in that debate, and what fell from the late Prime Minister and the late Secretary for the Home Department, he was induced to ask the present Secretary for the Home Department if, in the event of a Committee being moved for, he would have any objection to grant an inquiry into the system of fees and compensation paid in the courtsof common law and equity Sir G. GREY said, in reply to the question of the Hon. Gentleman, he considered the subject of fees and compensation in courts of justice a at and legitirmite subject for inquiry ; and he had not the slightest hesi tation in giving him an assurance that, in the event of a Committee being moved fir, he would be happy to sup- Fort en inquiry into the subject. POOR REMOVAL BILL. On the order of the day for going into Committee on this Bill being read, Mr. WODEHOUSE said that when this Bill was last before the house he expressed a desire that it should be postponed. It was not his wish to extenuate the hard ship which attended the removal of paupers, but he sub mitted that they could not proceed with too much caution in legislating on this subject. The ground why he wished postponement was that the question should be brought be fore Parliament fully. The great danger which would follow the present measure was, that it would throw a vast number of people on a district of small resources. The committee which sat upon the subject in 1817 said that a residence of three years entitled the party so circumstanced to relief, but to prevent litigation they considered it advisable to accompany that expression of opinion with a recommendation that the party should depose to the fact of such residence before two justices. The Hon. Gentleman concluded by moving that the Bill be postponed till that day six months. Mr. HUME seconded the motion. He considered it rather singular that the Poor-law Com missioners gave no recommendation of the Bill. If they had, he (Mr. Hume) did not see any He was anxious that the question should be postponed on this ground. If the subject were to be taken up early next session, when the whole of it would be considered, he (Mr. Hume) was not prepared to say that he would not then agree to the settlement now proposed, provided an union settlement were established. He could state that in parts of Norfolk entire parishes could remove every individual from its bounds and pass them to a neighbouring parish, called an open parish. He could state on his own knowledge that one parish would have the power of removing every individual from its boands, and there were hve other parishes in the same district could remove their poor, and obtain what labour they required from the neighbouring parishes. The system would throw the expense of the maintenance of the poor on the most populous and poorest parishes, and thus cause the greatest possible inequality and distress. There were many reasons which might be assigned, but he would only appeal to the Right Hon. Baronet himself, for in the statement which he made to the House a few nights since, when he asserted that he would only take a part of the Bill, he said that he would leave the rest to be considered early next session. When the whole subject would come under their consideration at a future period, why should it be proceeded with now? Without any wish to give a further opinion on the subject, he hoped the House would assent to his motion, and postpone the discussion. Mr. BROTHERTON was anxious to state that the manufacturing interest entertained no adverse feeling to the Bill. If the present Bill was thrown out, the House must bear in mind that it would be by the hands of the Government, and not in consequence of the opposition from the manufacturers. Sir G. GREY wished to remove any opinion which might be entertained that the Government wished towith draw the Bill. He proposed that the Bill should go into Committee for the purpose of receiving any amendments which might be proposed by the House. He admitted that the present measure was but a partial remedy. He did not think the House ought to refuse to proceed with the measure. It would be merely a step to the passing of a more comprehensive measure. He hoped, there fore, that after the gratifying fact which they had heard from the Hon. Member for Salford, that the manufac turing interest did not intend to oppose the Bill, the House would allow the Bill to be proceeded with. Mr. P. SCROPE thought the present Bill removed an old injustice, and introduced in its place a new injustice. He held a list in his hand of a few parishes, which set forth the burdens which would be imposed upon them if the Bill was passed ; and he should like to read a few of the state ments set forth in this petition to the House, in order that they might not rush into the great change with their eyes shut. In the parish of Sutton, Nottingham shire, there were eighty heads of families engaged in agricultural pursuits, entitled to relief, and 90 heads of families, consisting altogether of from 300 to 400 souls, not settled there, but who, on the passing of the Bill, would become immediately irremovable, and would, con. sequc ntly, become entirely new burdens. In St. Mary's, Cambridge, 100 families would become chargeable to the perish, who were not previously entitled to relief ; and in a parish in Warwick, 300 per sons, not previously entitled to relief, would become chargeable. A petition from a parish in Norfolk stated that the Bill would nearly double the present number of paupers. Such was, in reality, the principle of this Bill, and the support of the poor would be thrown on parishes whose finances were extremely inadequate for that purpose. The Right Hon. Baronet might say that in a future stage of the Bill he would take care to remove this inequality, but he (Mr. P. Scrope) was not sure that those who had an interest in the pas sing of the Bill would allow him to alter its objection able provisions. A parish in Wales, inhabited princi pally by per'sons who worked in mines in a neighbouring parish, only separated from that in +.l hich they re sided by a small stream, would, under this Bill, become chargeable to the rural parish on the other side of the river, in which they did not res!de. Surely, as the Bill as it stood was not in tended to become the law of the land, it would be better to postpone it until the laws relating to settlement had been clearly defined by the House. He thought it would be bet ter to postpone the Bill till the whole question of settlement was gone into. It would then be seen what steps were necessary to adapt the Bill to the law of settlement that might be agreed to; till then he did not eunsidQr it would be proper to do anything in the matter. Mr. S. WORTLEY believed that the measure, even in its present shape, would prove extremely advan tageous, and be a great boon to the working classes. I He confessed he should have preferred the Bill as it was originally proposed by the Right lion. Baronet, the late Home Secretary, still he would support it as it now stood. He could not conceive how anything more satisfactory could be proposed than the proposi tion respecting the irremovability of the poor. They could scarcely have forgot the papers that had been placed on the table of the House, showing the great hardships imposed on the poor by the present state of the law. He knew, from his experience in the West Riding of Yorkshire, that the greatest complaints had been made respecting the sending back of the poor in populous parishes, in times of manufacturing depression, to the agricultural districts. He was sorry the Bill did not go further on the subject of I settlement than it did, still he was willing to support it in its present form till inquiry was made, as proposed, into the subject. Mr. STRUTT thought the measure ought not to be pushed forward in the present session, but they ought rather to wait till a full investigation into the law of settlement had taken place. They were told that the subject was one of great difficulty. If so, then he considered it would be better to wait till the whole question was fully discussed, instead of passing the Bill in its present shape. They were pro posing a new principle in the Bill—that of irremovability; 1 and he considered it could not be properly arranged till such time as the law of settlement was finally disposed of. Now, under those circumstances he could not help think ing that if they waited for a few months, till an inquiry , had taken place, which inquiry would by no means pre judge the question, the House would be better able to dis cuss this measure. The Right Hon. Gentleman who spoke last stated that those gentlemen who he (Mr Strutt) would not say opposed, but desired the postponement of this Bill, did not seem to consider the labouring poor. He (Mr. Strutt) hoped he should not render him self liable to the charge of a want of humanity towards the poor.—(Hear, hear.) But while they were . auxious for the relief of the labouring poor, they should not . for get that they ought elk) to show some humanity to wards the poor ratepayers—their humanity should not be exclusively confined to one class.—(Hear, hear.) Now, what would be the immediate effect of this Bill ? Why, it would impose upon a great number of poor parishes the burden of relieving the poor of this country, and the result would be that the poor would hereafter be relieved by poor ratepayers, that burden having been removed from the shoulders of the rich.—(Hear, hear.) When he saw a poor ratepayer, who might have been a pauper, bat who by his own exertion, his own industry, economy, and self-denial, had succeeded in maintaining him self as a ratepayer, he must say, that he did think that some humanity should be extended towards such men, and they should take care that no provisions in this Bill should injure them. —(Hear, hear.) There was another provision in the Bill to which the attention of the House had not been called. He thought it was now admitted that nothing could be more dangerous than leaving it to the option of the pauper as to the parish by which he should be relieved. It was well know how much the officers and ratepayers of a parish were interested in getting paupers removed from their parishes, and that they would offer bribes and - inducements to paupers to swear that their place of settlement was in some other part of the country. It was true that there was a penalty of from 40s. to 51. in the Bill against such practices, but how difficult was it to put such provisions into effect. —(Hear, hear.) He trusted, in conclusion, that the House would not proceed with the measure at this period of the session. Sir JOHN PAKINGTON could not help express ing his great satisfaction at finding that the Right Hon. Baronet the Secretary of State for the Home Depart ment had made up his mind to proceed with this Bill, and trusted be would not be deterred from doing so by such arguments as those they had heard from Honourable Members on the oppo site side of the House. One Honourable Gentleman opposed it on the ground that the Poor-law Commis sioners had made no report upon th e subject but so f a r from this being the case, he held i n hi s hand a report of the Poor-law Commissioners wherein was the very principle that was proposed by this Bill.—(Hear, hear.) Another lion. Gentleman urged as a reason for its postponement that the Bill had been brought forward before it had received sufficient con sideration, but let him remind that Hon. Gentleman that this Bill was inbroduced so far back as 1814, by the Hon. Member for Dorsetshire ; again in 1845, when it was fully discussed ; and now again in 1846.—(Hear.) Mr. PACKE thought that Lancashire, Yorkshire, and Cheshire, were the only counties' where this Bill would operate beneficially. He thought the poor would be liable to be most tyrannically removed from their parishes, and treated most harshly by the operations of this Bill. He could not consider a measure fraught with more in justice than the present one; he would, therefore, oppose the motion for the House going into Corn,te on this Bill. Colonel WOOD considered that the proposed Bill would remove considerable hardship from the poor. It would prevent their being Sept sway in their old age :~~ from strange those parishes places w hw-ehreertehtebyeyw were ed unknown.resided for n y e_ e_ h a de rl d : wi t o : his hand a petition, signed by the clergyman ratepayers of a parish, in which a number h w a a d ste se e tt o l na ed mo tl o ie , m a s o e d lve w s. ork l e ' neighbouring parish. The parish in which they had settled, and were of c I s l r e g P e . able benefit to it, and in case of their being made P for fherefore able,few their individuals living l wished that the Government would keep the law y i d l s e p y e a ntlti had dni builti theirro nw houses moneyoo rfisaobinst.ll;:n;:blirrsee left would o n moretthe p ari than sh, compe nsa t e u ein its present state, and mak e no a lt era ti on a t all. Mr. E. BECKETT DENISON sa id that no te .ono was more convinced th an h e was o f th e neceseitYel: Be e alteration in the la w o f se t t l emen t. I t wa s a u, l :g p r ia ts to England ; f or p oor peop l e were sent awa y to an very of the kingdom, as if they were criminals. It altel e i r hard that persons having spent the greater part ot , r, e, lives in one place should, in their old age, be removed.B43 another, where they had no friends. In the year l ov e in the borough of Leeds, there were 964 persons real _ i d from it ; of these, six had spent their lives there L six had passed forty years. He had no difficulty T eo , nouncing as inhuma n , an d a scan d a l upon the 0 7 . 1 " t0s that those p ar ti es s h ou ld b e removed in that manne,og place where, perhaps, they had never been before..nuse would be the consequence if the Bill before the J" i f re .. passed, and that no person would be removed after2 ot a sidence of five years? Why, these 900 persons"' remain injLeeds, and there would be an enormous eL" tbee and responsibility inflicted on that town. Look , if it what would be the effect of the present measureouse now, in July, i n 18 46, passed the House. He nonsi• therefore, c a ll u p on t h e H ouse to consider the resy tee bility which the present measure would put 11 1 )00 Ise* mannfacturing town s . H e was net adverse t tile d be of irremovability, but this was a monstrousj amp , ail t he asked the House, and the Right Hon. Gentlem an se Secretary of St a t e , t o b e upon their guard, and 13 ,,, ot the deal li g htly w ith t h e quest i on. With respect ".ties hardship of a p ar i s h b e i ng o b l i ged to mainta i n po i did who had no other claim but industrial residence, b o e eeb t not think that of t h e s li g h test i mportance, for h e th et when these pat ties earned and spent their money i . n re d parish they had a claim upon relief if they ee ( Il ll e, t he He hoped the Committee on the Bill would tn., the whole matter into their consideration, together wel" ne t law of settlement, and that the House would tsie b rush hastily into a new system of legislation !" might be attended with the worst results. n eeitig Mr. G. BANKES f e l t great difficulty in b eb his opinion on t hi s su bj ect, when he saw 50 01 he diversity of opinion amongst those for evl l te sa entertained the gre a t es t respect, and who, as cha " ol of quarter se ss i ons , h a d b een able to obtain a prec,ltie experience of the working of the present law, and„ 4 probable working o f th e Bill under discussion; ",:es after all, he still held th e op i n i on h e expressed whoa stePpthe measure was introduced, and although it far short of wh a t h e cons id ere d a proper arrangemelLi% the question of se ttl ement , yet l ook i ng at the Yob, which only contained seven c l auses which were not or jectionable, he could no t consent to postpone the diseede sion of the subject un til a f uture d ay. It was true 51'01 tions might be made i n Committee, but in its pr es form he considered it would confer great benefit 111) 0 ( the poorer classes, imperfect as it was. He w ‘ g il d opinion that the right o f sett l ement should he con fer by a residence of five y ears . Th e poor would clere consolation from the knowl e d ge th at suc h a B ill was er oe . tertained, and was likely to be adopted by the fle w , He wished to ask th e A t t orney -G eneral this quest:her which he conside re d was a very important one--whe tt it was the intention of the Bill, for so it seemed h i s stood, to allow a man to c h oose h i s settlement? 'intent were so, h e d ou b te d whether it would benefit ale ale poor ; an d w h ether he would have be hereafter to return to the settlement to whic h a ll was now entitled? B y t h e Act, it seemed tnn' te& power of removability was taken from magiet r tift The poor man had not the means of removing hi llls e - te d and, looking at the constitution of the Bill, he dell • of the power of th e mag i strates to interfere to oeue:fig removal. He doubted whether they would be conferr i d g any benefit at all on th e poor man if they proceeo, with the Bill i n it s p resent s h ape, without any exPl%te lion of this poi nt . H e s h ou ld support the going Imo Committee, with the di st i nct un d erstanding that ose in Committee he should, in the first clause, Pol l ee s words whereby th e p oor man m i ght gain a sett l ef o: i f by an industrial residence of three or five years ; t e e he preferred it, he should have the option of going es to his original settl emen t. I n that case they WO"' 1 4 conferring a benefit on the poor man; but if they l abe him no option, he doubted whether benefit woul conferred. He would go into Committee entirelftwo this understanding. Il e diff ere d altogether w i t h e r, , Hon. Member for th e W est Ridi ng of Yorkshire b$ B. Denison) regarding union settlement, and he thol h . the present Governm en t h a d acted prudently in ligeet drawing that porti on o f t h e measure for the Pre' ef session. His prese n t o pi n i on was, that if the range a settlement was to be altered, they had better bi l , e ro, county instead of a uni on settlement.—(gear, hear' ) be that shape the proposition might advantageously adopted. With these observations, h e would d ec linai`a vote for the motion of his Hon. F r i en d near h i m , n should vote for its going into Committee. A fig Mr. EVELYN DENISON said that he ha d chrnen objection Gentlema n t o t n h et the Bill oppositeas it a (si t. :te p r. re o s Ef e . r t i h t De s t en o n o oi d suo . sne : s)t h at e e r n li belief that the Bill would be of no avail unless j.t , e' .. e t r a it were followed by that f T o h ll e ow N ed ob b l y e ' a BillLord measure it would 13 . 0 f be ne f Opposite as an authorit3rie,side e a the House, on that obstlie svf u ao n tri i o o n n settlements, uotcd in dEtrniaefint. but declined fol lowing it by such a measure the Bill,e union settlement; and lie (Mr. E. Denison) Consi l s e circumstances, his Hon. Friend :a teh g d ht tl i l i a o t i tuonhdaeNr'e tblahl°ll quoted at all as an authority for the Bill. He be li „ e , to that the effects of the Bill would be very injurious to the ratepayers, and would be certainly calculated l y cause great injustice to the poor. He therefore ear ne. r e• entreated his Hon. Friend not to press the Bill this session. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER ne s that he did not by an y means consider the 8.11 as r;il manent measure. The p resent l aw of settlement, 11'ra existed, was a great ha r d s hi p, and he thought that th, legislation whi c h w ou ld destroy that law, and the t ffi e t moval consequent upon i t, was a measure for the hel l ' of the poor. wth,o)DuullgrdhdftloiEtsNom:Loau}:liYdd ph i d e rhetermowuvgtat thought removals, ibtsupport did not o ß itm i t l ph l 71, :f t s a s t a o a fe et measure, he must support the amendment for a P ° ,; ii t ; iiwtn htlgemlwouldawmtre .ponement.havietietriehorne Government oonwu%t ,roeseuet They at al r ig es hi t t th p e ass the questionßil o l f this t a s e e m ss e i n o l 4l cig j ld the h y av t e oo t k o , ebaerlymionotthede nextand srees-siooPne.ll:,b l i d d A t to contend induce felt sht against, a g t io l n y sv t t o, h t ne e nfd d o ri itffi t c hw u ea l difficulties e ot shs postpone five ] meat of this Shopualoor-law settlement. When the GoVernia merit came int o o ffi ce, he anticipated that they ri°tl,,,a -have abandon e d t hi s B i ll, but he had been mistake True, they had a b an d one d part of the Bill, but he thollgl the measure ought no t to b e considered piece-meta, et/ he must, therefore, vote against the Government. „g Sir J. GRAHAM had not the slightest doubt t' e l e this portion of the original Bill would be of inestimable value, and he was prepared to proceed with it. W hme t ; however, he said this much, he must admit that ther e would still remain a good deal to be done. It Wel l e l i indeed, in justice to the ratepayer, be indispenen l l, necessary next session to establish the right of tn% settlement, but still he must repeat he was prepared t go on with that portion of the original Bill now befor e the House.— (Hear, hear.) Mr. V. SMITH thought the speech of the Right Tit Baronet opposite was of itself sufficient ground for t",, '" postponement of this i mportant matter. The Right Hon. Baronet admitted t h at even i f they pissed the 13'1: beforea s T it h now e hi eosuqt House ei o e d ts ie t on h n e d r wi e vo w iud o led u d l ,b d ew satisfactorilystill h en t remainhereamp p u e c a h r et settled.od_b e op' A Fo g r ai t t h l s e t i a t tn .. e . ........... .................... The original motion was then ......... 1 3 12 6 Majority against . . .......... House went into Committee on the Bill. . —76 „ agreed to, and th e the first clause being proposed, Capt.PECHELL moved as an amendment, that in lin e seven, after th e wor d " parish, " be inserted the word° " who has maintained himself therein by his industry, O r been a householder therein." The Right Hon. Barone t the late Premier, admitted that the settlement ought be an industrial one, and he apprehended, therefore, the Right Hon. Baronet's party could have no objection to his amendment. The present Government, however , he inferred, f rom t h e i r om i tting the words he propelA to be introduced, did object to it, but if they wow.- I R I mt E hl Y onste t b h we o h u po g ri p h wt t ioeu t s h l div e hc oomh a amendment press .dubnedeenr ti F : undertake to introduce it into the larger measure to be brought forward next Session, he would not oupne t. SnreiareteiaGoanaEroOyf,Rt becauseGh E s B G i dustriously engaged in a parish for a period of My years. Mr. V. SMITH considered that, from the manner is which property was distributed in this country, ther e g res o i f dez would be considerable difficulty in carrying out the Pr e. visions of this Bill. lie hoped some words or • clause d re e f fi e n r e to th in e d m us e t a ri N a i l n would be inserted to make the present measure one 1 1 thought it - residency. No ' ll ‘ r o e n sid M en e c in e, b " er an e rb ; would not be right to leave during the ,1 2 „ terval of this and the next session of Parliament 01 : solution of the difficulty to country magistrates. It wa s no joke to leave this matter to be settled by these magistrates. He therefore wished the term residene used in the Bill to be defined. Mr. HENLEY thought the meaning which would 1 1 put upon th e wor d res id ence, in the Queen's Bench Common Pleas, would be that it was constructive r im dence referred to in the Bill, and not actual residence. _ Sir J. GRAHAM sa id , after having given it the 11 2 ° t Z, mature consideratio n , an d h a d the advice of the law a` c i i visers, he had thought it right to withdraw the wo„ . 1 4 / which he h a d i nserte d after first proposing the J?;::a. There was an immense di ffi culty in settlin g thi s quest' a Any attempt at definition would lead only to cavil, s e e , he thought it w as th e b est mode to allow the word to r main as it stood f or so l ong a period. There was no doubt that th e wor d " residence " in the Act referre d an industrial r es id ence. This was a term well-known o ce to the laws o f S cot l and, but was not known to the h e . of England. In amending in the last session of ril t r oo d meat a Scotch A ct, i n which the word was uud.e,to "„re as referri ng to an i ndustrial residence, the Lego'"t had not, how ever , t h ought fit to alter the term or attenip to define it ; they left it in precisely the same form see befure. He thought that the chairmen of quarte r their sions would have no difficulty, in the exercise o . t foro discretion and judgment, in determining wha t for! of residence was referred to by the term t o goi in the Act. He hoped, therefore, the House w?,__ Ao s here to the usual term, and not introduce into t he a term unknown to the laws of this country. . 00 0 The ATTURNEY.GENERAL perfectly 69" DUTCH MAIL. THE HAGUE, JULY 21.—The hopes that were enter tained at the commencement of the year 1845, that the commerce at Canton, under the flag of the Netherlands, would be more considerable than on the preceding year, has not been realised. Only five Netherland ships with cargoes of tea have sailed direct from China to the ports of the Netherlands, and two others have returned by way of Java. For want of the Netherlands, it was necessary to have recourse to an Amc rican ship to send to the Ne therlands a cargo of 10,000 chests of teas. In July, 1845, the freight for the Netherlands was 130 florins, vith 15 per cent. for vessels going to Java. in De cember, 155 florins, with 15 per cent., were paid for freight to Rotterdam ; and ut the time of the Chinese New Year, 180 florins, with 15 per cent. were offered, and this freight was undoUbtedly paid, for the cargo sent by that American vessel of 200 tons burden, sent trom Macao to Batavia; from 6,000 to 7,000 florins were paid. These high freights are generally offered in the season from October to April. These statements we hope will induce the merchants to send a greater number of ships, since freights may be had for Manilla and Bale, as well as to the Netherlands and Java. The exportation of tea in Dutch ships were less in 1845 than in the preceding year. Bills of the Netherlands could not be negotiated at Canton. None were taken but such as were payable in London. AMSTERDAM, JULY 21.—The first herring buss ar rived at Vlaardingen with forty-one barrels, and to-day another with eighty-one barrels. The accounts of the fishery are extraordinary unfavourable. The Rev. Mr. Grootf, Vicar Apostolic in our East Indian passessions, had an audience of his Majesty on the 18th of July. FLANDERS MAIL AND DUTCH PAPERS. BRUSSELS, JULY 18.—It appears from a letter written to the Echo de Sambre of Meuse, by our countryman, Mr. J. Guinotte, engineer, who directs in Mexico the construction of an iron railway from Vera Cruz to Mexico, that notwithstanding the various impediments arising from the climate, the indolence of the inhabi tants, the political state of the country, and the blockade of the port of Vera Cruz by the American squadron, the works are proceeding as rapidly as could be ex• preted. The levelling the works at the station, and the laying down the rails are completely finished, for nearly 25 kilometres ; about the half of the first section. But it is to be feared that the continual troubles which afflict this unhappy country will not allow the com pletion of the plea to continue the railway to the pitecau of the Cordilleras. Mr. G uinotte states that his comrade, M. Van Arbrouke, and several of the Belgian workmen who accompanied him to Mexico, have fallen victims to the insalubrity of the climate. Ho had himself two very severe attacks of fever. The Itloniteur Belge promulgates several laws of the 18th of July, granting supplementary votes of credit to different departments fur 1845. Solemn Pacha (Colonel Selves), and Mr. Horace Vern( t will be present to-morrow, at the military operations in the field of manoeuvre. A letter from West Flanders says, " The rye harvest is begun ; unhappily it does not promise more than half the usual crop. Oats, beans, and linseed will likewise produce but a moderate crop, but the wheat is magnifi cent ; so good and abundant a crop is not iu the me mory of man. The principal article of food for our poorJooks extremely well; I mean the potatoes, which, however, want rain. Forage in general is much better than warexpected, after so long a continuance of dry weather. Tux HAGUE, JULY 20.—The official journal pub lishes the reports on the state of the charitable institu tions during the year 1844, presented by the Government to the Second Chamber of the States General on the sitting of the 27th of April last, conformably to Art. 226 of the fundamental law. The accompanying tables fill twelve pages of the journal. The official journal publishes likewise the eighteenth supplementary article to the convention of Mayence of 30th March, 1831, for the navigation of the Rhine, in the Dutch and French languages. TUE HAGUE, JULY 19.—The receipt of the ways end means in the year 1845, first six months of the year 1845 was f 25,705,065,301 ; 1846, f25,653,432,74i. De crease in 1846, 41,632,5611. It appears that, in 1846, there has been a decrease in some branches of revenue of f379,043,86i, and an in-. crease of f 327,411, 301; on other differences f 41,632, 56. The King returned to the Hague on Wednesday morning at ten o'clock. We understand that he will go on Sunday, by way of Leeuwarden to Groningen, on the 25th to K unpin, then to Zwolle and to the Lou, when he will return to the Hague. It is thought that his Ma jesty will then go on to Luxemburg. A General of the German Confederation is expected to inspect the Luxemburg and Limburg contingent of the army of the Confederation now in garrison in some towns of the Netherlands. (Major-General Mulder, here alluded to, has arrived at the Hague.) ST. PETERSBURG, JULY 7.—The ceremony of betroth ing the Crown Prince of Wurtemberg and the Grand Duchess Olga Nicolagewna, will take place to-day (the 51st anniversary of the Emperor's birthday) at the Palace of Peterhof.—.4llgemeine Zeilung. July 18, 1846. WOOD FAIR.--LEWES, JULY 20.—Our annual wool fair was held this afternoon, at the White Hart; the Duke of Richmond in the chair. Among the company present were Lord Abinger, Sir Henry Shiffner, Bart., H. Blackman, Esq., J. W. Shelley, Esq., John Ellman, Esq., &c., several wool buyers, and most of the p r i nc i pa l f armers in te neigh bourhood. The Earl of Chichester, who usually takes the chair at this meeting, was unavoidably absent. The Duke of Richmond, on the removal of the cloth, proposed " the health of the Queen," and the usual loyal toasts; after which his Grace called upon Mr. Ellman to give the meeting some Is i n an f i od fact,r thenihti i o em n de u i sdp were n oe rt t ek h n e o ou s wt t state of hj o oa f itn t t h t ; aia w ndn o vod o irs l dhe m e,er a bht r uao k dt e htnseo. show wi tl sof r oou . rmi would. onk a ng n e. an offer to Mr. Legge of hi s woo l , wil w esa oo see : su a ,t t uot 3 f B w a j . ohi p ine e ti r : sod like all business. round. ISlltr. co nsistedEllman t o h f e n a b o o ff u e t r offered t t h e e l what o offer. number 350 were hoggett. Mr. Legge decylicnoeudld He (Mr. Legge) did not know in the present depressed state as Mr. the Ellman h ad ihvandattrtuolyoffsetra.tedE,vaenrdytnhoibm was before them. At present the market was completely paralysed, but be was ready to meet the graziers and give them the best price, if they knew what the best price nf ve st r a . teooff one e ng t ihneg wofaospqinuiiotne that really itvho w en a ri e s ; eau l d n i db t ehbeeen he sure, e p a g leestills r lo eat reduction in foreign wools, and h v a as d t f p o u u r n c d ha thir purchases h a d avdbienetno them na m de a . rk , e l t s , n a i n a d n y manu facturers were to find money to meet such sales he could not tell. One thing was quite certain. if they expended it on fo wahsere als 30,000 he b fo reign, they would have little for home produce. Mr. Shelley said that Lord Torrington had sold his wool at 14d. per .b., in answer to which Mr. Legge said, that the markets had fallen considerably since that sale took place. The Duke of Richmond made an offer of his wool to Mr. Legge, but it was not accepted. His Grace having apologised for being obliged to leave early, took his departure, and Sir Henry Shillimer occupied the chair. The best sale announced was that of Mr. Stemming Beard, who sold his wool, consisting of 820 ewes, 30 fat sheep, and 300 teg fleeces, at 333 6d. per tod. Several sales were effected after this at a trifling advance. Sir H. Shiffner vacated the chair at seven o'clock, after which the meeting immediately broke up. THE LEICESTER FREE TRADE DINNER. —This very appropriate and festive gathering took place at: the Bell Hotel on Thursday afternoon, when a numerous and in fluential company sat down to an excellent dinner. But the company, though influential, was by no means of an ex clusive character; all parties and classes who have taken a share in this important national movement were fairly repre sented, and all were blended together most harmoniously, Leicestershire Mercury. , ui in *I .h St: but an ( the 11 % Nu )t.c th e t ew the