The Sun. — London, England, 1812-03-07 00:00:00

certain Resolutions were agreed to, and leave given to bring in a Bill. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved for leav, to bring in a Bill, to render valid and effealual certain oaths taken by certain Members of the _ House of CoMMons, before the Deputies of the late Lord High Steward of his 'Majesty's Household, during the vacancy of the said Office. After a few words from Mr. Spencer Stanhope, 'apd from Mr. W. Wynne, who gave it as his opi . n;on, that two courses might be pursued on this subjed, as the Deputies of one Lord High Ste Ward might be continued till another was sworn into Of fice, or the oaths, which were very unnecessary, might be taken aitiay altogether, leave was given to bring in the Bill. The Chancellor of the Exche quer then brought it in. It was read a first and se cond time, and cocnmdted. The report of the Committee was then brOught up and received, and the Bill ordered to be read a third time, this day, if engrossed. The Bill was then engrossed, read a third time, passed, and ordered to the Lords. Mr. W. WYNNE gave notice, that on Tuesday next he would move for leave to bring in a Bill to take away the oaths at present sworn before the Deputies of the Lord High Steward. The Penitentiary Houses.. Bill,• on the motion of Mr. Goulburn, was read A second time, and com mitted for Monday. MUTINY BILL. On a motion for the House resolving itself into a Committee on the Mutiny Bill, Mr. WHITBREAD wished the Committee to be postponed to an early day. This he wished, as he understood - the Noble Lord had some new clauses to propose, in addition to which he (Mr. Whit bread) had one to suggest ; and besides notice had been given of one by an Hon. Baronet (Sir F. Bur dett). He wished it postponed, as Irons these cir cumstances it must take up some time, and the Irish business which stood for this day might in conse quence be driven off. Sir J. NEWPORT, on similar grounds, wished the Committee to be postponed. Lord Palmerston and the Chancellor of the Ex- chequer replied ; and the result was understood to be, that the Committee should be gone, into, but that the clauses on which discussion might be expetted should be postponed. The House then resolved itself into a Commitee. Mr. WHITBREAD wished to propose a clause, which however he hoped the Han. Gentleman op posite would frame, as he would do it much better than he could. Schools had been established in the Army, in order to qualify the soldiers for Non-corn - miasioned Officers. He had understood the Officer could order the men to, attend such schools, but a learned Judge had declared, that such order was il legal, and that consequently a soldier refusing to obey such command, and advising another not to obey, was guilty of no offence. An anion was pending against him, (Mr. Whitbread) for imprisoning a man under such circumstances, which was to.have heen.broeght on that day, but which had been post poned, alter having been kept hanging over hien a y,v2r an a half, et- a'very considerable expeoce.— Now, when a provision was made in the Army Es timates for maintaining such schools, and Officers, were direißed to send the men under their com mand to them, he thought they ought to be em powered to force their attendance. He begged to read what had been said by the learned Judge. His words were—" That the order to go to school was an order which appeared to him not to be warrant ed by any law. The men were unwise in not avail ing themselves of such opportunities for improve ment, but lie knew of no law that could force them to attend." Thus, it should appear, that one man saying to another, " I will not obey the order to go to school, 'wed 1 advise you not to obey it," was no offence. The order was, in the opinion of the Judge, illegal, therefore the man bad- a right to give such advice; hence it followed that soldiers were justified in encouraging one another not to obey their Officers. Orders had been some time ago is sued by the Duke of York, direeling the officers to send their men to school. In consequence of this, if an Officer fade. to give orders to that effea, he might be brought to a Court-martial ; and it he forced them to attend, he might, in consequence; b© brought to trial. A sort of mutiny was thus en couraged, and the whole dhcipline of the army was broken in upon. Lord PALM ERSTONE observed, the subject was entitled to serious consideration; but to attend the schools had not be considered as any part of military duty. Schools had certainly been established, and a provision made for maintaining them in the Army E s ti ma t e s. This was done, that those wishing to - avail themselves of such an adVantage might do so, but still toat tend or not to attend had been left wholly optional to the parties. In almost every instance, where an individual was qualified to hold the situa tion-of a Non-co;nmissioned Officer, he would be happy to avetl e himself of the advantage held out 'to him by these schools, and therefore it was as well to leave it optional for him to attend. Mr. FRANKLAND was of opinion, that however advantageous it might be to the men to attend, they ought not to be forced to go to school. Mr. WHITBREAD, before the agitation of the - question this day, had never heard the legality of an officer ordering his men to attend, doubted by any lawyer or officer with whom he had conversed. The Noble Lord gave it up in a legal point of view altogether, but lie believed he weuld not find' an officer who was not of opinion that he ought to have power to punish disobedience to so . 1 1 an order as well as disobedience to any other. Had he known that it was to be left optional to the soldier to attend the schools established,- he should have paused betore he consented to the vote proposed for theri support. Mr. M. SUTTON admitted that if it was ordered at the Horse Guards that the men should be sent to school, that order ought to be obeyed as much as any ether, end disobedience punished according ly. It was how.evet necessary to introduce a clause in the Mutiny Bill on the subjed, as when suet)" an order was issued, disobedience could be punished under the act as it at present stood, without adding to it the clause proposed. Mr. WHITBREAD said, the order from the Horse- Guards direaed the establishing of schools; and an Officer was placed in a disagreeable situation, if, when be dire fed the men to attend such schools, 'hi might refuse to do so. Colonel Dteeote remarked, that men did not _ •- . 2nd thought it vt•Quid in. jure the reuniting service if an idea went abroad that they were to be forced to ettend. The CHANCELLOR Of the EXCHECITYER stated it not to have .been the inten , ion of the Duke of York to make 9Se attendance of the men compulsory, though much advantage was eti,eded from the es tablishment of schools ire the army. • Gen. TARLETrN thought the subject entited to serious consideration. Mr. WHITBREAD said the aclion commenced /gainst him was not for confining a man who had disobeyed his order to go to school, but it was for putting under imprisonment one who had incited others to disobey his orders. Mr. BROUGHAM wished to know if it was the in tention to introduce any clause to do - away military .flogging Lord PALMERSTONE said it was not; but that the regulation of - last Session, leaving the option of impri ionment to Courts Martial, would be rendered more general. Mr. BROUGHAM. said; as he could not be present at any other stage, of the-Bill, he -would avail him self of the present opportunity to enter his protest against that species of punishment. ,One of the ends of punishment was the improvement of the culprit, but the evidence of the best'aut horities jus tified him in stating, that flogging could only debase andruin the character' of 'a soldier. - As to example, that.benefit was also lost by its exciting a sympathy in -favour of the sufferer. All the arguments against torture apphed with tenfold force against this me thod of punishing ,4oldiers, and therefore he was most anxious that some amendment might be pro posed, which would go farther than was intended .by the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite. He pre sumed there was .no clause limiting the power of ,the Crown with regard to the employment of Fo reigners in our Army, and lamentetl that the Aet of Settlement 'was not more strhlly adhered to in that respect. It was well known, that his Royal Highness's Regiment, the loth Light Dragoons, were in a course to be changed into- a German re giment. Having deprecated in strong terms the system of recruiting regiments from the Hulks, he concluded with expressing a hope that some im provements would be made on the different heads to which he had alluded. Mr. M. SUTTON assured his Hon. Friend, that he was greatly deceived in the exaggerated state ments be had brought forward. As to the corporal punishirients, it was not the intention to prevent them, from a convidion that they could not be dis pensed with. It appeared in' the debates of last year, that there 'was no prediledion towards corpo ral punishments; but an experiment was made, by permitting imprisonment to be substituted ; and he was happy to be able to state, that fromJanuaryto December, 1 8 1 1, only eight persons were sentenced to. corporal ~punishments by Genentl Courts Mar tial, and on one alone was that punishment aflided, not however without first making an offer to the individual to commute the punishment for general service. Such was the torture complained of by the Hon. Gentleman, that the individual submitted to receive 700 lashes rather than make the exchange. But he wished to know from the Gentlemen who opposed this species of punishment, whether any substitution was intended ? If - none was intended, many must escape with impunity; and if death was to be subSituted, it would make our military a most sanguinary code. As to imprisonment, it could not be inflicted on foreign service. Improvements should be made, but tte general abolition was im predicable. He regretted to hear those attacks made day after day, upon a system, without which the discipline of the army could not be maintained. Though the power of imprisonment had been most useful, he doubted much whether it would have b en so to the same extent, if the prisoners knew before hand that they could only be imprisoned. Colonel DOCKET said he was 17 years in the home service, and bad found the opinions of all the Colonels with whom he had - conversed in that time, concurring in the necessity of corporal punishments. Mr. DILLON approved of the clause of the list Session, and thought that colonial service might in some instances be resorted to as a punishment. He thought that in a few years the instances of corporal punishment would be solitary, and should in a short time propose a motion on the sublet/. _ . . Mr. BROUGHAM said he had not objeaed to.the severity, but to the improper mode 01 severity.— As to the lamentation of his Hon.. Friend (Mr. M. Sutton) that the subje& should be so often renewed, he would console him by referring him to hiS own statement, that there were only eight . persotis sen tenced to that punishment in t be course of the last 12 mouths. The discdsSion 'on this subjea had begun out of doors, and he could not help regretting, that those persons who 'commenced it, he meant Mr. Cobbett and Mr. Drakard, should now be in prison. _ _ _ _ Mr. MANNE:I3SUTTON thought it-rather hard th,it his Hon. Frtend•should ascribe the improvements .to Mr. Cobbett and Mr. .Drakard. Much was owing to the Courts themselves, who had as good wishes• for the army, and as little intention to mislead the public, as either of the two Gentlemen alluded to. _ SIT G. WARRENDER was sure the amendment was owing to the Courts, and not to Mr. Cobbett or Mr. Drakard. Lord PA LME RSTONE rejoiced that the Hon. Gen tleman opposite had avowed what he wished to sub stitute for corporal punishments : his substitute was death, which would go to make cur military a most sanguinary code. The Hon. Gentleman had said that punishment was intended for the amendment of individuals, but it was. also intended to prevent crimes, many of which required the most summary punishment. If they were to send offenders to the colonies, they must provide for their punishment there. As to what had ben said respetting the Gth Light Dragoons, it waz totally unfounded. General TAHLETort defended the necessity of cor poral punishments. Sir Jon N NEWPORT . stated, that the laws on this subjet now in force, patticutarly in Ireland, re quired some amendment or explanation. In Ire. land, the officers who had the distribution of billets, were in the habit of sending an undue proportion of soldiers to the houses of Quakers, who, from the tenets of their religion, were patticularly averse to military men, and were therefore compelled to pay any money to get rid of them, rather than have them in their houses. This was a serious evil, which he believed to be-carried on in collusion with the po verument, because, in the city of Waterford, which he had the honour to represent, the officers so treat- W every Quaker who voted for him at Isis election. L 0 IV D 0 1V , SATURDAY, MARCH 7, 1812. Dispatches, dated the 12th' ult. were this morning received from Lord WELLINGTON. No event of any importance had taken place, up to that time. This morning we received Lisbon Papers, from which we have made some extrads, but they are very unimportant. , We this morning received American Papers, from which the following are extracts :-- " WASH/NQTON o FEB. 2,--The war is nearly over. The tax scheme lies dormant. An adjourn. ment of Congress is talked of till May, but I doubt whether succeed. " NEW YoRK, FEB. 6.--,ADJOURNMENT OF CON GREss..—II is rumoured at Washington, that Con gress is about to adjourn to meet again the last of M a y. This, we suppoSe, is a plan of the friends of Mr. MADISON to secure his re-eleaion to the Presidency. - The administration men are at pre. sent, in such a situation, that they cannot move without injuring Mr, MADISON'S popularity : let them go forward or backward, it .is all the same, Mr. MADISON . suffer. Now if they can .con. trive to stand stock still for a short time, they may probably get Mr. MADISON norninwed to hold his seat for the next Presidential term, which according to the ; new republican doarine is equiva lent to an elee.',lion. This done, Congress mil rotor, and proceed to: carry on the war they have -com menced, or make "peace for want of resources, as they rnly think prOper. The office-holders being made easy, what the people may say or do will not • be regarded." " FEB. B.—The Berlin and Milan Decrees cre revoked!—This has been so often. asserted by the PRESIDENT of the United States—by the Governors of each State—by Members of Congress, and by every friend' to the administration throughout the Union, that it has acttiilly 'become a painful task to multiply evidence proving the falsehood of tho assertion. But it is our duty; - and, however dis agreeable, we must perform It. We proceed, there fore, to produce another fa6t, which shews that the Decrees in question are in full force, and were abed upon by the constituted authorities of-Fratwe as late as the 10th of September last. It is an offi cial account of the condemnation of the brig Julian of Philadelphia,' EDMUND ABBOT, Master. This vessel was avowedly condemned under the Berlin and Milan Decrees: the Council having declared, that on 'account of her " being loaded with col - nial merctiand:ze, having touched at Gottenburgh, and having been visited by divers English vessels of war, she is good and lawful prize.". One of the Opposition PaperS which has been • most virulent in ItS abuse of the PRINCE REGENT, has thought it necessary to enter into some justifi tation, or rather some palliation of its conduCt: We are always willing to do justice to an opponent, and are therefore fully disposed to give the Pa per in question credit for its candour upon this occasion. We really flattered ourselves, sayi the Paper in question, that the moment his Royal Highness the PRINCE REGENT was set, at litcr ty from the restritlions, he would have chosen our friends (that is, the Party) for his Ministers ; as tong as we entertained that opinion, so Jong" he . could " command our humble praise and our re. speelful obedience ;" but, when, to our inconceiv able amazement, and our inexpressible discomfiture, we found that the • REGENT •thought proper to choose other Ministers, it was too much to expeEt that we should , continue the praises we formerly bestowed upon him. In , reply to this defence, we 'shall only say, that it they had been satisfied with merely discontinuing their praises, nay, if they had vented their complaints in decent terms, we should not have thought it necessary to reprehend them; but when, in. the course of one week, one little werk, they turned round upon their Prince, their Friend,--wheel they assailed him with every species of abuse, we did feel it to be our duty to point out their conduit the indignation of the public. There is one sen tence. in the paragraph to which we are alludin g , which we wish particularly to notice. " Now that the PRINCE is inveved with th e f u ll hitins! o, ti t le pr -a e.ced tso ing Gov ernments havef his Govern ment authority judged of a a .s,to been. We wish not to pry into the recesses of his private life : while the prediledions in which he still indulges interfere not with the Government of the State, we shall ne‘er allude to them. It is not our pra6tice to contaminate our pages with scandal, or to by indecent topi c s We have qu o t e d t hi s - pare aotft animadversion."atte ntion to our column s para graph, because we lin.e seen already some strong symptotris of a disposition, to depart from the profession . contained in it. We trust, however, t hat for the "Tuture, the Editor will adhere to the resolution which he 114 s di st i nd i., ed. If he does, he will be u n d er the necessity o f c .i , eB c d a s n of excite iris i Roy no . al l ght rejecting many of the contributions, both itt prose and verse, which will be :urnished by some o f the other g p i r i a m t i ej r N e; ee e abuse, ful sensation in the' breast' of that Illustrious Pa , so:loge, .except that which may arise frotn-the. re conedipa that he had permitted such men to' as sume such a title. Yesterday, at two o'clock, a full Cabinet Courcil wa; held at the Foreign \ Office, ,which sat fill a quarter past four, wi.ea, we understand, it was En ally settled that Lord MELVILLE is to be First Le rot of the Admiralty. Yesterday ItIC Duke of YORK, Mr. PERCEVAL, and the-Earl-of DARTMOUTH, had audiences of the PRINCE REGENT, at Carlton House. It is stated that the Marquis of HERTFORD has appointed Colonel Say noun to be Serjeant at Arms. Yesterday Mr. THONIAi SYDENHAM had a long interview with Lord CASTLEREAGH, at his Lord ship's house in St. James's-square. The E.ifi 01 LIMERICK. has been mentioned as one of ti;t.: personages IQ aucceal to a Meant ittbb9n. Mr. W. POLE raid, that this was the first time he had heard of the abuse complained of by the. Right Hon. Baronet, and therefore, it was impossi-_ . ble.that he could have taken any means to redress it if it realty existed. If the• Right Hon. Baronet had made any application to the Irish Government, the subject would have been immediately inquired into, and every possible attention paid to it : instead of which the Right Hon. Baronet had thought proper to come forward, without any previous notice, .and propose to make an alteration in the law. Sir JOHN NEWPORT said, he did not want any alteration in the law, but that it should be pltin and specific. He had not applied to the Irish Go vernment for redress, nor should he ever ask. them' for any favour which the Right Hon. Gentlemen in his caprice might refuse or grant, but he ap plied to Parliament, which he knew to be the pro per place. Mr. W. POLE said, .that the Right Hon. Baronet was neither warranted in the observations he- had made, nor in the tone he had assumed. The Right Hon. Baronet, when stating his ground of complaint, had addressed himself personally to him (Mr. Pole). - In reply, he had merely told the Right Hon. Baronet, that he had never heard:any complaints before upon the subje&, and had expressed his readiness to give every satisfat`ztion upon the subject. Surely ten 'the Right Hob. Baronet was not justified in assum ing the tone which he had done. He wished to state, before he sat down, that one of the principal towns . in' the county. which he had the honour to represent, was 'inhabited entirely by Quakers, with many of whom he was in the habit of constant communication, and he had never heard any com plaint from them of the kind mentioned by the Right Hon. Baronet. ' Mr. FRANKLAND said, he thought it would be of great advantage, if - the laws in lre!and upon thes . e points' were brought annually betore the House, as they were in England, by the. Mutiny Bill. s He did not know, whether it would not be wise to ,incor pnrate them with that Bill, -hut at all events, • he thought the attention of the House should be an nually called to them. Mr. W. POLE said, there was much gob(' sense in the observation of the Hon. Gentleman, and 116 for one was ready to give every assistance in his power to promote the Hon. Gentleman's object. He agreed with the Hon. Gentleman, that it would be highly advantageous to have the laws subsisting in Ireland upon these subjeas brought annually before the House; but any attempt to revise those laws, and incorporate them with this Bill, at present, would only create contusion. • Some further - discussion ensued, both on this clause and on that which related to the allowances, in which LOrd Palmerstone, Mr. Parnell, Mr. Frank land, Mr. W. Pole, Sir J. Newport l Sir G. War render, Mr. Herbert, Mr. Yo r ke, &c. participated ; but no material alteration was made in the Bill.— Eventually, the . Houie having resumed, the Re port was ordered lobe received On Monday. Mr. W. i'oc3 was about to move, that the Home should resolve into a Committee of Supply, to take into consideration the Irish Miscellaneous Services ; but at the suggestion of Sir J. N Ew s;oRT, who stated that several Irish Members had quitted the House, on the suppoSitiv that the subject would not be brought forward that night, he consented to post pone his motion till Monday. FINANCE. On the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the Ex- CHEQUER, the House resolved itself into a Com mittee of Ways and Means. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER then rose, for the purpose of submitting to the Committee his proposition for 6,789,tk5i. by Navy Five per Cent. Annuities. He rtmarked, thar the Committee were. aware, that some time ago a proposition had been adopted for funding in' the Five per Cents. in the month of February last, fourteen millions of Ex chequee Bills. He had never been so sanguine as to expect, that the whole of this sum would be funded ; but he bad certainly entertained a hope, that a greater part would be so than the sum actu- . ally subscribed, viz. 5,431,7001. The Right Hon. Gentleman proceeded to state the terms on which he proposed that this should be done. He observed, that at the price of the funds that day, the bonus to the subscribers would be only t9s. 2d. But •in consequence of the expected proposition, the Five per Cents. had been more than Ordinarily depressed for the last two or three days, and he hoped, that when they recovered from this temporary depression, the bonus would be found a sufficient inducement to subscribers. The Right Hon. Gentlemancon• cluded . by moving, " That it is the opinion of this Committee, that towards raising the supply granted to his Majesty, the sum of 6,789,62.51. be raised by annuities,:" This resolution was agreed to, as were several subsequent ones, comprehending the terms of the proposed subscription. ' The Rouse having been resumed, the report was ordered to be received on Monday. Mr. WHART.ON brought in the Legal Quays Bill, which was read a first time, and - ordered to be read a second time on Monday ; to which d.ty the House then Adjourned.. 17:11 1.3. A artlvED-1 New-York, x Dublin, 2 Waterford. 13uz-1 Malta, I Brazils. !PRICE of: IiToCKS. THIS DAY AT TIVtLVICO'CLOCK. Consols. - - - - 601 .; 7 . 1 1 j 5 per Cent.. THE S UN. SOLEM QUIS UICiRE FALSUM AUDEAT?