The Sun. — London, England, 1852-02-20 00:00:00

the real motive which actuated the Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland and the Chief Secretary throughout these trails "inns —(Cheers.) The edif,or of this newspsper— the World —the Noble Lord says was a perste.' who was discredit to any newspaper with which he was eon nectar!, and referred to his previells c 'unexi nay, and although he acquits Lord Clarendon of any knewfedge of the facts, he states that he certainly ought to heve known them. Now, for my own part, the firsi. occesien Upon which I had ever heard or read of the World newspaper, was seeing a letter which was written by Mr. Elliot, who formerly held the position of secretary to the Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland, and who spoke in the most complimentary terms or the news- Paper. The letter was date i September, 1842, and was as follows:—" Sir—Bslievine- that the recent prosecution instituted against the World newspaper was g fleet to the displ easure wit h w hich some of the poli• oPponents of the present Government have viewed the Course taken by that journal, I cannot but exceed ingly regret that the very independent support which You have given to the measures of the Government should' have subjected you to this treatment. Dif feringas you do from the Government upon many and moat Political opinions, 'cannot but think that your con duct as proprietor of the World. in having considered and discussed their acts with impartiality and candour, is very creditable to you. With these feelings I very 'stiflingly subscribe the sum of 501. to the fund for pay ing the expenses of this prosecution." This letter Was written at the very time that the Earl of St. Germans watt Chief Secretary for Ireland—and the Earl of St. Germans is a man of the highest character—(Hear, hear)—and I certainly never should have supposed, • after seeing that letter, but that the editor of this newspaper was the editor of a respectable journal. expressing his own impartial and independent opi nions.—(Elear, hear.) Mr. Birch had sent me copies of a number of other letters, some of them to the same effect, purporting to be from Earl De Grey, Earl Glengall, and others. I know not what authority those letters may have, and I shall not, therefore, quote them. I received the letters to-day, and as I consider that the word of Mr. Birch is but of little value, I shall de cline to quote them upon his own unsupported authority. Mr. Birch, it appears, in his statement to Lord Claren don, stated that it was very difficult to procure a sale for a paper which did not deal in the exciting topics of the day in favour of rebellion, and asked him for some money to enable him to get a.tents, and to pay for the expenses connected with increasing the circulation. That, it appears, was the first beginning of his re ceiving money , an d Lord Clarendon at first let him have 1001 , which was afterwards increased by various pay - Ments to 1,7001. But in the year 1849 the times had Materially changed. At the end of 1349 there was no longer any danger to be apprehendedlo Ireland, and it appears that the Lord-Lieutenant did not direct any further sum to be paid to Mr. Birch. Iu the beginning of 1850 , Lord Clarendon, having considered the matter over, asked some of his friends, whom he consulted, whether it ought to be considered that the sums ad vanced to Mr. Birch were properly payable out of any Public fund entrusted to his disposal, or whether they should be paid out of his private purse.—(Loud cries °f " Hear, hear.") The quesdon was referred to the Chancellor of the Exchequer, and he was of opinion that they ought to come out of the private funds of that Clarendon.—(Hear.) At tee beginning of 1850, all sums taken out of the public fund were r paid to that f und, and the whole charge of this expenditure was at But Sole expense of Lord Cl aren d on —(L ou d c h eers .) °lit Mr. Birch being determined to give notoriety to these tra nsactions, or t o ex t or t m oney from the Government, de manded a atm of 4,000/. for his s.rvices. Lord Clarendon was advised that if the matter came before a court of law, as he never made any express stipulation with Mr. Bir c h, or entere d i nto an y contract , b ut as h e tat paid him from ti me t o t i me , th e j ur y mig ht fi n d a Vedict, for a large sum, and that it wow(' be safer for him to make some adjustment of the claim. Ia conse quence of that advice Lord Cl a rendon p ,id Mr. Birch :;0001•, which with what he had already received made e it 001, a sum mu c h mor e th an a d, gu s t s f or t h e p a y men t any services he had performed.—(Cheers) It would eve been thought that after these transactions his relations with the Government would cease; but being det ermined, if he could, to extort more money, he Proceeded to bring his action against Sir W. • t,otnerville, which was heard last December, and W ith the particulars of which the House is an tplainted. Upon that trial Lord Clarendon was examined a s a witness; he declared that he never directed in any W ay What should be the course of the paper, that he never wrote duringwrot ea line in it, that he read the leading the excitement of 1848; but that after tille danger was over it was not his custom to read them. the now to the tr a n sa ctions which are connected with see present motion. It suits the Noble Lord exceedingly well to omit all mention of those circurastasces, which hers a great i mpression at the time, an d w hi c h Mem _n era of th e H ou,e will hardly forge t.—(Hear, hear.) the begi nn i ng of 1848 a democratic revolution took place in, France which destroyed the monarchy, set up a republic in its place, with democratic leaders, and pro claimed in somewhat ambiguous t 'lll4, its intention to the oppressed nationalities in other countries. The disaffedisaffect e d in I re l and immediately endeavoured to ta k e savantse of th a t c i rcumstance. Cl u b s were ra i•ed in eo Ireland expre ss ly f ur t h e purpose o f sever i ng that u ti t s l , ll ! t rY from G rea t B r i ta i n . Cl u b s were es all caked f ur t h e purpose of throwing off t h e e g l ance to the Crown, an d a s p ec i a l m ission F` sent sent to France, w i t h t h e id ea o f securing eneh assistance for the contemplated rebellion. This ° nut does not forget t 1 withering reply given to "" t iorts put in this House by one who returned from tillsl mission. To enable the Howe to remember still e _ mo re, vividly the circumstances to which I allude, I will b a l ?_.aome few, and only a few, of the extracts of the es u nliti newspapers which then circulated , and which, aantaining the most exciting matter, were read with the I,l_titiviost avidity, while those newspapers which supported high er and order were either only circulated amongst the e'rier classes of society, or else had a very limited cir ea i s s li nth These extracts will show what was the nature he dange r and what was its extent. In the begin eine, he ti a , March there appeared in an Irish newspaper waeannsendations fur street fighting, in imitation of UV: had taken place in Paris. Advice wss given to to d theavements to procur mssiles, ad how bes deep the soldiers , who we to i n t rit B defsnd the autho of the British Crown. After recommending these sh e s "es, this journal (the United Irishman) said:—" To ea , e Missiles from windows and house-tops revolutionary ezies s • e ,_ Cold t e r co:17 add boiling water or grease, or better available; molten lead is good, but too Werde• l • In the Nation newspaper the week after coaaer%the llth of March, it was said:—" We demand a .eas e "'ten nt to t rea t wit h • Envied tor our freedom— winnoabe:,tion repre sent i ng t h e peop l e, an d w h om h- people On the same day the United Irishman said: de c .._ Intist utter and maintain the goasent ~ r ude—the the de that is in the hearts of us all—Hate England to Ren ea :r." This was the language commonly used and the is ; a 7 spread by these newspapers in Ireland. On ne wsr , March a similar passage appeared in the same Xart ra Per, the United Irishman was a letter to the ot treas one c b arendo n: —" And, as for the same warlike and Meade l e arti c l es i n t hi s newspaper, they will b e Until tl e° ,„ la tieued and improved upon, week after week, a stre et h ave 'ate produced their effect—the effect not o f berateet riot to . disturb a peaceful meeting, but of a deli- Cleee and universal armament, to sweep this island British butchers, and plant the green flag on of el ° Ca ltle." The letter was addressed to " The Earl , her Majesty's Executi ,ner-General, and aer•nheeariendon Butcher of all Ireland." In another passage— aat.at strong English reaping-hook is a capital vvea re'nst and in case of street fighting let no powder f air (3° explosive, or no instrument be too hot for , a _ ll hands to lift tied hurl down upon the enemy." This ;as sae kind of language Lord Clarendon hart to meet. : d e: were the circumstances in which he thought it advisable to spread an antidote against such poison. The e the circumstances in which he aided and en toged a public writer , to defend his conduct, butnot defend his merits, or to defend the cause of the un e i of his administration, Parliament, the cause of the etite'd Kingdom, the cause of (Loud cheers.) There se as au :lt:ace of this empire.— to l d ' e Nassage, written in 1 similar tone, in which it Was that their object to destroy the accursed BritisAh Oentives had werea empire. r li e att T tue s h md e secured, r r very great effect. Pekes were manufactured, and , hero a avom i e l,s in, the different towns, as ai l aC t eaad throu2.hout the country districts d'iivi 9g e( O l u Y t t f h o e r tmaposs. of an insurrection, Nintera r. every than the troo-ps,of Property -whtue co untry, These we re the circumstanc.,e and plundering utede r mel ee Lord Clarendon was called to govern Ireland. i --" 22(1 of July, on a Seturiay morning, I prop osed :i t thi s le eee - "nose to suspend the Habeas Corpus Act, and 8— " 11- o'clock on the same evening a bwithonlyund aught dissentients out of an assembly of three ' its t the Habeas Corpus Act, passed through b all tlainsites.—(Hear, hear.) What mte , t have wouldeEn !by: l e ieer and th e imminent se s tiee d the House of Commons to p4 , s .. c . peril which h intitending the liberties of the hide people—and writ i n_ Inite e e e° .... t hem to act with such speed and such mien Ot o ' rci well, Sir, these measures, with other measures sore Clarendon, completely defeated the intended !ti er e b eti ° l3 . It was intended to deter for some six weeks, t he tel the time o f t h e h arves t, th e out b rea k. When -er e f ile rs found their persons were to be seized, they (1 011 wOreel into premature insurrection. Lord eleven dwispat:ha alive and vigilant to the . danger. He instantly -e re the General Macdonald into those parts which ed tnies. reat ene e ; u and the insurrection, according to the week b / ; ° ,. 11 of the Noble Lord, which was formidable a tom' "re, failed utterly, and became utterly ri lieu becaZ(Cheers and counter cheers.) But why did it • the e° ridiculous? —(Loud cheers.) Why was it that °jail ae a c r Y was not subject to those sad disorders of se cltlene wh ich took place in 1798, and the cruel con kale t e es Which followed it?—(Hear, hear.) Is was be tts"Le Government of Ire laud was alive and vigilant. thea e e ause the Lord-Lieutenant acted properly that data t - e ;""tnPts at insurrection were defeated, and the kqtleticaverted.—(Cheers.) I have alluded to the esti.- See le of the outbreak in 1798. Every one has heard the ad With • e p , pain the scenes which were enacted, and Whi c h aliment which follow, d. Sir, the punishineet of followed the attempt of 1848 was totally 1 differ th e i r Put nature. The chief actere were put upon hi gh tlrria4 for high treason—they were convicted of exs etw e ason no blood flowed upon the scaff id—the Ittai s s ! t lea was not called in to complete what the civil kene utl e t Y had commeticed. Agr example of cle ateAwns.shown, which had its ell' ct, and the ratalling W inch it t- h ! -ester i❑ '--a -) attends insert cceon defeated, did visi t —e 'Zan I reland. - 11ear, bear.) Aaer a very short eeici e began to adm i t that the Governnonst had acted anu Was d leniently.—(che Corpus"glin thoughterl) A However, next 37:: . p rudent to ve-•nenti the llflb th e -.et, and it was be Leal sessioe ea A suspended trom the beginning of 1- "nar k( d, hsc u4 Umt, 1849. 1w ah these facts to lid A atr.e ther e is , • fur r. Birch sa t eounsel alt, a sire to ienore them, tit tdi have endeavoured to show d anger was r in 1 848. Why, if that bad • rnE SUN, ' been the case, this House would not, hew, readily a hi , cond rinse 9,hsPNted to the suppression of the Ithsress e f Ireland.—(Hear, hear.) Wolf. thee), Sir, I think it is , I generally asimittsd—universally admitted—t het Lord Clarendon, in a time of great danger, great eifficulty, I and great peril, has shown ebility, vietleoce, pile - 4mm and judgment. and all the characteristics which out ht to datinenish !.‘ Vtceroy in a moment of thffieulty and danger—(Cneers.) Stivereign readily admitted ' that merit, and thought him e.ntirlo i to those distinctions given by the Crown, or which it eels said— " Teo et emblems Cc cti did invest, And gleamed on wise Godolphin's breast." bee We n n ptehrefaormeSier,, rafter , i it isa fete ti em ie pted —atter these services have se dangers are past—it is at tempted to sffix a stigma on that character, and mark with indelibl e di sgrace t h e man who per f orm ed these strange n a rr ( a C s h: i e p rs w ) as Why. we would think it vary n the exertion of toil, ant g i r j e u a d t g p in e e r r i l l t , . a a i n ld d d t s e c r c e a t n i n t n a b a y d lashied the efforts of the winds and waves, and saved the vessel from the storm, if some ono who had not assisted in that endeavour crept out from the hold—(Tremen dous cheering)—and said, "I must inquire into the means by which the safety of the vessel has been se cured. I must see how you have contrived to weather the gale. and if I find that any on© of your sailers who was employed, either in cutting away they mainmast or haling out the water, is an unworthy person, I will con demn you, and pass uunotieed the great act by which you have saved the vessel."—(Cheers.) But I am still further astonished at the quell, r from whence this mo tion proceeds. I could have imagined that some dema • gogue who had hoped in the overthrow ot existing institutions in 184$ to have obtained place or plund e r, who had desired to invest himself in the insignia of a secretary of state of a republic-e-I could have imagined him corning back to vent his spite and indignation against the man who bad bsfil td anti overthrown treason and rebellion.—(Cheers.) But what I do not sad what I cannot understand is, that a member of a Conservative Opposition, rifesr having shared in all the benefits of L•rd Clarendon's wisdom and policy—and it was to that wisdom and that policy, and the energy which characterizsd both, we owe the satety of the people and the peace of the country—l say I cannot understand a member of a Conservative Opposition coming clowa here to arraign the man who has conferred these benefits, and asking the House to agree with him in condemning the man to whom they ought to be grateful,—(Cheers.) lam sure that such will not be the feeling of this House. This House has done nothing—t has no opportunity of doing anything by which they can show their estimate of the services per formed. But they will not give their first expression oi opinion on Lord Clarendon's administration by the se vere and unsparing condemnation centained in the terms of the notice. Never was the Executive stronger than in the hands of Lard Clarendone- e (Chrers,) Never was public authority more rt spected, even by his ene mies. —(Cheers.) Never was there a Viceroy carrying on the duties of that office with more fairness to all par ties, with nasre courtesy to all who came to consult him, with a more earnest wish to remedy some of the many grievances under which Ireland labours.—(Cheers.) But 1 have now stated a hat was the nature of the transactions with regard to this newspaper, :he Woad. I do not propose to follow the Noble Lord into those statements of the merits of the various transactions to which he has alluded. I believe it was with the motive that he stated that Lord Clarendon accepted the services of Mr. Birch when they were offered. I believe that he accepted them with the view that they might be of service in maintaining order ' when it wes so grievously assailed—that ha might be ' able to administer some antidote to the poison spread- ' ing throughout the lead, a poison which might have the worst ,ffeets. Whether Lord Clarendon was right at any time, even when placed in circumstances of great I danger, or when the danger was not so lowering, to ' spend public money on purposes connected with the I press, Ido not mean to combat with the Noble Lord.— l (Hear, hear.) It you enter into that (siltation, you i ought to consult persons connected with the Govern- t merit in Ireland.— (Hear, bear.) We know very well that in this country it is not the practice to du what Mr. Curry Counellau calls subsidizing the press.—(Hear, hear.) No Government could receive any advantage from such a proceeding. But if you want to know what is the practice in Ireland—it you want to know the po hey of that conduct—ask all the chief secretaries who have been there, and hear their opinions. Take the Earl of Derby—(Loud cheers) —and if the Earl of Dsrby wore to declare that in no circumstances what- I ever were you to give public money for put poses connected with the press, that he had always care fully abstained from it, .1 would have the greatest respect and attach very great weight to that opinion.— (Cheers.) I should likewise wish to hear the opinions ot other chief secretaries, who could tell what has been the practice, and what were the grounds upon which it was Justified. For my own part, I have never been either locally or immediately connected with the Go- ' vernment ot Ireland, so I cannot express an opinion upon the point. Ido not think it necessary to say more than that in my bel ie f L or d Cl aren d o n acted with Ito wtsh to benefit himself or to support his own adminis tration; he seems to hive ratted solely with a regard to the public good; and he also seems to have acted not eiffsrently from those formerly in the government of Ireland.—(Cheers.) With regard to the further ques tion, immediate to this, whether Lord Claret don should have given aid to an editor of a paper of so disreput able a character as the World, I have only to say that the Noble Lord in his speech girea full credit to Lord Clarendon's assertion that he was not aware that such was the character of the paper. And what do I find? . Why, Oat Mr. Birch being imprisoned for libel, many of the most respectable citizens of Dublin, amongst others Mr. Hoe, had gone with a memorial to the Go vernment, asking fur his release. This was not the coed act of persons who believed that this mart was of a disreputable character. With respect to the further question—whether the Government ac ed wrong io'giving bums of money, and whether Lord Clarendon ,shoula have paid that 2,0001 upon demand, without going before a jury—l am of opinion Lord Clarendon erred in not contesting the payment, and in not refusing the compromise. I only heard of these transactions lately, and I have framed my judgment upon them; but I do nee, think that au error of th..t kind, an error of no very grave importance, not so much to be weighed even against the weight of a feather, can prevail against the eminent, the undoubtt d, and valuable services which Lord Clarendon has rendered to his country.—(Cheers.) Well, then, here is a great question before the House. You have the 'character of• a public man entrusted to your hands. I am persuaded that you will be of-opinion that it is neither consistent with the diguisy of Parlia ment nor with the welfare of the country, that you should pronounce the condemnation that is Frayed for. Aud for my part, as a colleague of Lord Clarendon — as one who has esteemed him, and for many years has loved him—l am ready to place his character and his conduct in the hands of the Commons of England, anti am assured that he will obtain justice in their decision. —(Tim Noble Lord resumed his seat amidst loud and continued cheering.) ' Mr. DISRAELI—I wish if it is the intontion of no othee Honourable Member to address the House, to apply myself' shortly to the unravelment of the ingenious so pairtry of the Noble Lord who has just addressed you. The argument of the Noble Lord, as I understand him, is this:—" Put down rebellion, and if you are successful, never mind the means, you may appeal c onfidently to the country for a verdict of acquittal." But is that the logic supported by Members of the d fferent parties in this House?—(Cheers.) Is that reasoning to apply to other rebellious as well as those in Ireland, which have been equally unsuccessful, but in respect to which the Government had recourse to means in which those Hon, Members did not concur? This is not political mora lity; I might say that it was political 'immorality, oily that in this House there is no need to have recourse to strong terms; it is a course which I am sure this House will never sanction.—(Cheers.) But the most remark- - able part of the speech of the Noble Lord is the position in which he places the journalist whose conduct is in question on this occasion. According to the statement of the Noble Lord there was a great crisis •in Irel•tad at the period referred to, and such a crisis that the very existence of the empire was at stake.—(Hear,•hear, tiriq laughter.) The Noble Lord added that so strong was the feeling of the Ileuse of Commons, end so keen their sense of &urger, that they agreed almost Una nimously to the suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act in a single dsy. It was in eerisr of tact patriotic energy of the Place of Commons, and other means, argued the Noble Lord, that Lord Clarendon savedi Ireland. What were those other means? Mr. h ch ( Laughter end cheers.) The Governor of Ire land is Lord? herought before the consideration of this House, because o r a l Placed hunselt in connexion with the editor t s , e s hb s a,e,tini iso o a o c nyi a ss : vitai i i,is n i f uN r . h ri, Journal, under a u t o , d d er authority eireum s a . ted ßu O t t l Noble Lord says that of that country, se w e in Ireland by the administrator the Parliame nt or gptetiirted by the unanimous voice of The Si t ri a e a s t c e cr a n l i c i u tr i Nohitl,aughter.) There was a t h e vest a m s_ uit a'gr, td. What What has that to do with person in Ireland would haveLk:rds that every honest ma y be, deprived of their livese great chenee, seer th e that country e e a s t e l plundered, and, it e a t a h nd to prevent this honest people, a nd cheers.) catastrophe, as well as to proteci the Lord-Lieutenant of cils this eottor of the .--augard to his culla- That Noble Lord, it appears, was the Seh 3,700/ cut of his own pocket.—(Cheers, laughter°, paidd occesion, for to prevent plunder and cries of " Oh.") I only want to place the quhstiri e ee a r n i to saLeilf)eat he the before the u„ ssa —(Leughter, and cries ot o sh t \ Th 3 e . issue at stake is the character and conduct ( - 1 the Governor ot Ireleed —(Cheers.) There are certain facts and cirstimsteeces the accuracy of which has n e t been denied, h ot* the truth of the Noble Mover who stated them challenged. Whether these facts and circum stances—these " transactions," to use the words of the motion —e be of a nature to weaken the authority of the ex, cative, and to roil ct discredit on the ad, ministratiors of public affairs" in tha t country, is the question the House has to d. cide. Well, are they cal culated to strengthen the authority of the CiteCutiVP, or to ail e ertdit on the administration of public offers in Ire!ann ?"—(Cheers.) Have we or have we nut, to these transactions, a dark inkling of a system of government in that country prijudiciat to public morality, and dis creditable es well es disadvantageous to the administra tion of public affair. ?--(Cheers ) The Noble Lord, Ireland rebellion, Ireland fur its justificat (Cheers)—St cretaries wider state of things. Ilse Noble Lord said that Lord Eliot lB4l, approved of the c oldest of this journalist; ate; in Lord Derby, the Nobls L rd teals, 'soul ; answer whethe r or of Ireland was subsidized—as a practice. the press "se iu. ; question was a peculiar one—if the I r i s h Government I w.s placed at the time in a peculiar position—then I 'agree with the Noble Lord that there would Is 3 greueds fur deducieg an interence nut unfavourable to Lord Clerenden's conduct on the occasion under discussion. But the Noble Lord the First Minister of the Crown cuts away that ground himself, by stating, that sects transactions are ordinary transactions in land.—(L en' cheers.) The Noble Lord cannot have the advantage of both positions.—(Cheers.) He west choose either; and it is because I believe them to be ordinary transactions in that country—a conviction which the Noble Lord has not disproved-s-that I ask the calm and dispassionate vote of this House on such con duct—that I Del( their opinion as to whether these trans actions shall have their approbation, and whether or not they will perpetuate a system of a nature to weaken the authority of the Executive, and to reflect discredit on the administration of public affairs in Ireland.—(Cheers.) I have now brought back this discussion to the real point—the point from which it started, after the discur sive argument of the Noble Lord. Lord Eliot may have expressed his satisfaction with Mr. Birch in 1842, but that is an additional reason for the House expressing its own opiniou in 1852.—(Hear.) Lod Derby may have had transactions with the Irish press when he was Chief Secretary of Indeed; but that is only another reason for this House expressing an opinion now. Every statement of the Noble Lord, in fact, destroys his own argument, and renders it more and more impossible for him. to ride off his case by means of an appeal in justification to the existence of an extraordinary crisis at the period in question.—(Cheers.) If this were, indeed, a motion brought forsvai d for the purpose of casting a stigma upon ineividual character, as the Noble Lord assumes it to be, I very much doubt if my Noble Friend the mover, who has introduced so important a matter in so temperate a manner, and who is himself proud of being an Irishman.—(Hear, bear.) I very much doubt, I say, if he would have made any motion of that naiure—(flear, hear)—and certain I am that I should not have been the individual to support it.—(Cheers.) If this was if transaction arising out of extraordinary circumstances, produced by the heat of political proceed ings, and not of a normal character, then I freely admit that every generous man would feel disposed to cast a veil over it, and to say it has never occurred before, and probably may never occur again, and therefore it is not my duty to notice it.—(Cheers.) That very cheer is the best argument in favour of the motion.—(Cheers and laughter.) We have it on the confession of the First Minister of the Crown, however, that this transaction is part of a system. That every secretary of the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland pursued that system, and this ren ifers it the more important on my part to ask the House if they believe that system to be a pernicious one. It is not an affair of Peeling or taste on the part of the House of Commons, it is an affair of public duty that we should' examine these remarkable circumstances which the Noble Lord has referred to, and express an opinion upon them. Now, Sir, I have nothing to say as to the con duct of Lord Eliot—that Noble Lord has friends in this House ready, if necessary, to vindicate his conduct. But the Noble Lord (Lord J. Russell) has referred to all other secretaries, and in a marked allusive manner he referred to Lord Derby, when he, as Mr. Stanley, was secretary for Ireland. Now I remember to have read a book recently which throws considerable light on the mode of conducting Irish affairs at that time: I believe it was the fact that during the. Administration of Lord slegleses, now a member of the present Government, when party spirit ranged high in Ireland, when the press in that country—cud no country is more influenced by the press—was divided between two great sections, the Orange and the Catholic party, or what we did call the Catholic party—l believe it was the fact that the Go verment of Lord Anglesea, wishing that the temperate tones of a wiser policy should be heard by his Irish cnuotrymen, did attempt, and not unsuccessfully, to es tablish a newspaper. Is there any one who will quarrel with the conduct of Lord Anglesea in this matter?— (Hear, hear.) Is there any one in a free country like this, which owes so much of its liberty to a free press— is there any Honourable Gentleman present who will say that such conduct was disgraceful? who will not, on the other band, maintain that it was bold, wise, and proper conduct for a Government to attempt to establish an organ in order to express its opinions faithfully in a country where the public press was ranged between two hostile parties?—(Hear, hear.) I say I know nothing could be more legitimate, proper, and praiseworthy than for a Government to attempt to infuse a temperate tone into politics; and I say it was a wise policy for Govern ment, amid the exacerbations of party, to attempt to re gulate the public mind, and to soften it down to a safer tone, and to succeed in establishing for itself an addi tional amount of influence in support of the Adminis tration. 1 believe this was the case in the Adminis tration of the Marquis of Anglesea, and I believe it pro duced beneficial fruits. A newspaper was established by a respectable man, it was written by a not undistin guished man, a member of the Irish bar, and it had a salutary iefluence on public opinion. If, Sir, I chose to view the question merely in a party point of view—if I availed myself of the allusive remark of the First Minister of the Crown—if I chose to denounce that at tempt of Lord Anglesea, instead of meeting it with my sincere admiration—l might refer to the memoirs of Lord Cloucurry, in which strange revelations of certain noblemen are given, and there find a passage which would not at all have assisted, not what I will call the argument, but the brilliant explanation of the First Minister of the Crown. The Administration of Lord Anglesea was placed under circumstances of great ddfi eulty—it was in great straits—it was anxious to pursue a truly national policy, and therefore a newspaper was established, written by honest able men, who en joyed the respect of that society of which they were the ornaments.—(Hear, hear) But who were the prime advisers of the Lord Lieutenant of that time? I am afraid, though it may mortify the Gen tleman to say so, that he did not exercise so much in fluence over the mind of the Lord Lieutenant as his talent entitled him to exprct. There was a camarilla, Lord Cl. ncurry says, in the Castle et Dublin at that time. Three or four individuals entirely managed the Lord Lieutenant, but the Chief Secretary was not one of them. I recollect reading that, amongst these three or fur individuals, the most eminent, the most influen tial of all, was George Villiers, now more distinguished as the Earl or Clarendon.—(Hear, hear, and cheers.) when, therefore, that distinguished individual went in his new name and his new capacity to Dublin, he was n ot entir' ly ignorant of th e state o f t h at coun try; and w hen adorned with that surp ass i ng d ecorat i on which the Noble Lord had referred to, he was not entirely unac quainted with the Irish press.—(Hear, and laughter.) The Knight of the Garter condescended even to know a newspaper editor. Distinguished as this individual was in position and iu ability—decorated as he was with his worthily won honours. I cannot believe that the Viceroy was ignorant of the men who pro dueed leading article s . I must, h o wever, ex extremeth at e astonishment minent perso n at w h o t e mode p ad re o s p s ted in yby to use the language of th e N o bl e Lor d , an d that I should make no mist a k e I made a m i nute o f the words —" At a moment of peril and concern to the Crown and the British empire, the Viceroy of Ireland should have sought an antidote." The Noble Lord read one after another these leading articles, which led to so many public trials, and so much painful public punishment — articles which excite d many persons to misconduct, and which produced acknowledged perils to the state. The Noble Lord wishing to find an antidote, and to encou rage some writer who would counteract those seditious efforts which imperilled the Crown and the empire—the Noble Lord with all his previous experience and ac qaaintance with the press, when Mr. Villiers, as may be learned from Lord Clurcarry, falls into the trap of—Birch.—(Laughter and cheers.) lam the last man to depreciate the influence of the press. I respect and admire the press, fur to the press I think we are indebted for some of the greatest blessings we enjoy, and I believe it affords the best security for liberty. But, at the same time, I do not take an exaggerated view of the power of the press. It is not clear to me that in either revolution or rebellion the very best leading article would save the country.—(Hear, hear, and laughter.) Nay, I doubt whe her the Noble Loll], in a moment of diffi culty and danger. would think that even a leading article in the Times, written with more than usual ability, would serve all the purposes he wished to ac cou3ptisb, and avert all the expected danger. But, certainly, if the Noble Lord went to the press tor help, he would go to the Times, not to the Satirist—(lenr, hear.) Here we have fairly put before us these facts temperately expressed—that the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, doing as the First Lord of the Treasury tells us was usually done, placed himself in communication with a newspaper—l do not say whether great or small, or whether its reputation was high or base—in order to gain the influence of that newspaper to support his Administration, paying that newspaper out of the public purse.—(Rear, hear.) And then we are told that this is not a subject for the House of Commons to inquire into, and the First Minister of the Crown rites and appeals to the Lord Lieutenant's great deeds, and says we ought not to in q uire into the c i rcu mstances involving u question o f p ublic moralit y , because the Noble Lord succeeded in putting down a rebellion. This is the old story of Scipio revived. Had the Noble Lord contented himself with this position the matter would have been intelligible, coupled with the significant intimation that it was part of a system which had always prevailed. Is it the opinion of this House that such a system should always prevail?—(Hear.) Is it the opinion of the Horne of Commons that it is bene ficial to the country that the Government of Ireland should subsidise the press from the public funds? That is the question we have to decide—that is the question in which the country is interested. What the country is now watching for is, whether the vote of the House of aa division, t said D u n i d of a e p h u Commons shall put an end to a system which, in the had heard language of the resolution, is of a nature to weaken the authority d of the executive and to reflect discredit on the h a e ff a a r ' d irg n .— oth ( nothing u i t . affairs.—(Loud ta h h e e e r sa. arguments u OBROUSE, who rose amidst • rtial cries for adduced on the statements madoepptohsuittehside of the House, or in the that this motion was justified, at all tended to show him ore to cast a stain oni the ments ii on that it was not of a na tee ant, and to embarrass the e c co ara d cter of the Lord-Lieu- Ireland.—(Hear.) The lion. Membernuet of public affairs in seire (who had not displayed his for Buckingham speech he had just made) had endeavouredlusual ability in the there was a distinction between the course to show that the period when Lord Stanley was Chief fs taken during Ireland and that taken by the present Lord-Lieutenant; for b ut he (Mx. Hobbouse) did not perceive any distinction ;i apt; between the two proceedings. In the former instance the Croveretneet retained particular writers to advocate its cause, and this was all which had been done by the pre sent Viceroy. If there were any difference between the two cases be thought the difference was in favour of Lord Clarrndon, for at the time the latter had engaged tee eerdees of the newspaper, law and good order w , :re very much at stalte. Ho was informed that the Dublin Times, the paper alluded to as having been engaged while Lord Stanley was the Chief Se- ; LONDON, cretary, received communications from Governenent, and was supported by the secret service money of the State—(Hear, hear)—and not, as in the present case, the pocket of a nobleman who disinterestedly came forward in the support of order.—(Heata bear.) It seemed, therefore, that the opinions of gentlemen opposite had changed a little since the days of Lord Eliot. At that time, becaute the Weill ham cued to be supporting their own opinions, it was a very respect able newspaper; but now the Hon. Member far Buck inghamshire trampled up en a fallen may, and, it we were to believe him, the W or ld was t h e Satirist o f the p re ss. With regard t o t h e Dublin Times, he was in formed that two of its writers were pl ace d by the then Government in high o ffi c i al appointments, for h av i ng e spoused and promoted t h e doctrines of their party; and even the judicial station wag, he believed, conferred upon one of them.—(tl ear . hear.) He askod whether this was true or not? If i t was not true, let it be denied; but it it were true, do n o t l et Hon. Gentlemen come for ward with trivial and trumpery charges against Lard Clarendon for doing what they themselves had sot the example or. But then it was said that the charge brought against Lord Clarendon was not for having connected himself w i t h the press, but for having con nected himself with .an unprincipled end profligate journal. Now he (Mr. eleeaeuse) wa's no t going to say a word inteitist the press; whether Le admired it or not, as the Hon. Memb er f or Buckineleamahire said he did, was beside the p resent question, cud his opinion on the subject would p ro b ably have iten e weight; but he conceived what had happened i n this particular in stance was the con sequence of the system of anonymous writing—of that syst em b y which public writers refused to affix their names t o th e i r contributions, and by which unprincipled and vicious men came sometimes to write us turthereece of doctrines which he had rather teen supported by men of better character.—(Hear, hear.) No doubt there were certain truths which would be ad mitted equally as well when stated by persons of bad character as by men of the purest morals. The fact that three angles were equal to two right angles was equally indisputable from whosever pen it was stated, and so with general doctrines of morality. But there were certain doubtful truths a n d disputed doctrines, especially in the regions of politic s , t h e a d vocacy o f which by a bal man no doubt b roug ht dis credit on the cause with which he was connected. He did not see, however, why War his eindt-°-u-easas and wr i ter— (a 1 a n g h)— himself of the services of Mr. Bi rch, Hon. Gentlemen Was wrongi availingn of hs himself beena c a d u e sneo,uLn denouncing ' thi i unfortun ate and holding him up to the contempt of this !louse, but he shoal i take the liberty, in addition to the letter of Lout Eliot, of quoting the opinion o f the Standard as to the character of this paper in for mer years. The Standard did justice and homage to an opponent, and its opinion was all the more worthy of their attention because it confessed in bestowing an , eulogy on the World, that it did so on an opponent. ( The Hon. Gen tleman he w r a e s r s e ta a t d ed a t ti liat extract from Worldnew spaper was con duc•ed with great ability and independ ence of spirit, and th e Standard, in that it had been eminently useful to th e peace of the c u o ie un e t o r n y d ; u a ct nd of L thi o s r wa d it thus appeared, then, thought well of t h e World, and if so, why should Lard Clarendon not hav e ava i led him self of the services of that very paper? — (Hear, hear.) Eliot). The followed rrh beyg re at Protestant party a pass age v i ndicating . The Hon. Member fir Buckinghamshire stated that this was a question of duty; and he seemed to insinuate, though he end not openly assert, that the House had no alternative bat to say " Aye " or " No " ee the motion before them. Ho (Hr. Hobhouse) begged distinctly to deny that principle, so far as he understood the course of procenure in constitutional assemblies. They were to take into account the whole conduct, the whole character and policy, of a person standing in Lord Clarendon's position. They were to sur vey the entire case from first to last, and were not bound to give a distinct affirmative or negative to the ques. tion.—(Hear, hear.) They were not there as a jury, to say " Ay" or " No" to a particular issue; they might object to the issue, and he, for one, did object to the one brought before ahem on that occasion. --(gear, h ear .) Lord Clarendon had held the scales between parties in Ireland with moderation and justice, and had discharged his duty with ability, skill, and judgment. —(gean) The Noble Lord had come in contact with the old ultra- Protestant leaven of bigotry; and he showed, in his treatment of the Orangemen, that he was not disposed to see the Irish Government treated with disrepect or in a manner unworthy of its dignity. He would not say whether that was the cause of the present motion or not, but he believed that if the Noble Lord (Clarendon) had played a little more into the hands of that party, the House would have heard less of the present vote of cen aure.—(Hear, hear.) He thought Lord Clarendon had deserved well of his country, and was entitled to the, ap probation of that House and the country; and had the Noble Lurd at the head of the Government met the mo• tion with a direct negative, he would have been disp posed to bring forward an amendment, calling for in quiry into the whole character, principles, and conduct of the Noble Lord's goveinment in Ireland. Under the most trying prove caucus he had succeeded in repressing rebellion, and throughout he bad done all that lay in his power to promote the welfare of Ireland.—(Hear, hear.) It might be all very well for the Noble Lord who intro duced the motion to cast .ridicule now on the danger that was then treated as so very serious, but the House was not likely to forget what the circumstances really were.—(Hear, hear.) At that time the ultra-Protes tents and the Conservatives came forward with addresse of congratulation to Lord Clarendon, and he thought is was a little inconsistent on their part now to come for ward with the language of censure.—(Hear, hear.) For these reasons he should deem it his duty to vote against the motion of the Noble L,rd. Mr. S. CRA.WFORD considered the question before the House to be, whether the Government was justified in subsidizing or bribing the press. He had great re spect for Lord Chirendon, and on many points he agreed with him. He had been most useful in advancing the linen trade in Ireland, and, on a late occasion, he (Mr. Crawford) had been a party to presenting him with a testimonial for his exertions in that matter.—(Hear, hear.) As one sent there to protect the rights of the people, he regarded a free press as the great palladium and security of liberty; and he blieves that if they permitted Government to tamper with the press, they would destroy the . confidence of the public in that great engine. --(gear, hear.) Tampering with the press was defended on the ground that it had been the custom of all Governments in Ireland to do so. T ha t was the very reason why he now took his stand on this question. He believed this' had been the custom of all Governments, and he feared that on a very important q uestion the press was at present subsidized.—(fl ear ' hear.) He deprecated all such practicee, an d hoped they would receive the m ost positive censure- of that House. Suppose ' the Noble Lord was to be charged with subsi dizing the press of thi s country, would the people of England for 8 mo ment bear suck a thing? Certainly not. Then, why should it be tolerated in Ireland? — (Hear, hear.) He much regretted the course he felt pound to take on the present occasion • but no considera tion would prevent him fro m motion.—(Cries of " Divide 2) giving Mr. G. H. 'MOORE ob h bad the served, that since e honour of a scat in that House, he neve r had more a nxiety as to its deci s i on than at that mo ment. That question was, whether any amount of misconduct which would b tt e e considered 'objection a bl e in Englan d s h o uld be commid in Ireland with impunit El hear.) It y ( Qar, ought not to be allowed te -- besaid.--swhile in every that other assembly in the country auch an act would be re pudiated, that in that House it would be palliated and overlooked. The people of P. —agland and of Ireland did not, perhape, agree in all att 111 ere; but he did not doubt that they were as one in this, that they would not allow a public violation of decen c y and decorum , - especially if such was practised in high 1 unpunished. P aces, to go If that House allowed an tict of that description, such as had been t h a t night datan e d red they would to pass uncensu , , would not be raising themselves in the estimation of the country. What were the facts. —.. t h e l a i n , palpable facts simply of the case? Why, this, tha t Lord Clarendon did not scruple to corrupt and p a y a man to use his paper as en organ of the Irish Government—which of the most disreputable paper was character. He would nut even put it is comparison With th e Satirist; and if a similar case had occurred in Lord E e i d 2 what would have been thought of the N o bl e an at the head of the Government to support what he was leased to call law and order, and to blacken and defame his opponents. Even on the trial respecting this eas e , w hi c h t o ok place realit Lord Clarendon iu Dublin last autumn, s Mr. Brewster, who was in y 'co usel on that occasiela, stated that the proprietor of ta --e World, Mr. Birch, had done as much as man ev er did topoison the public mind. The Noble Lord at the head P of th© Go vernment had read quotations from several Irish rapers, and he had got quotations innumerable from le' one, t show that it was of a bad and malicious character, t i e s wile it had in fact beer expelled from every ci a u c b -room in Dublin ; and whet, then, .were they to think of - the Earl or Clarendon taking such a paper into hi ' . maintain the cause of law and order. It hadn service bns , d o that Lord Clarendon had great difficulties to e c e onte e n i d with—that that there was a deep and ta w•-e -spread con spiracy throughout Ireland for having Ireland disse vered from this country—that the Irish press was for the most part leagued with the instigators of that con spiracy, and that therefore he Was obliged to have re course to Mr. Birch, and his paper, to support the cause of law and order. But was such the fact? Was there a sane men in Ireland, who believed that there way any_ the like au insurrectionary spirit abroad? Why, y a - t the time the Irish people were utterly prostrate ; they were more incompetent to aid or take pa rt in any such insurrectionary movements than they had been for ages before—the Roman Catholic clergy of Ireland were well known to have been as much opposed to the Young Ireland party of that day as they were to the Red Re publicans of Italy of the present day; and what then was this terrible power, and this deep l a i d and wide spread conspiracy which Lord Clarendon had to contend with? Why, a small knot of individuals,th who did not possess a trifle of influence over e Irish people, and w hose doctrines were so oppo sed, that on going into a certain to propagate town in Ireland, , them , they were mobbed and beaten by that very democracy, of w h ose cause they were said to be the champions.—(Hear, hear) into this ear, hear) But to look a littl e conspiracy, re and the conduct of Lord ClarendonaMitehell 6...eptecting it. It was about October, 1848, that t e informed theut a journal in Dublin. In that journal Lord -Lieu tenant, was his intention tenant, that on an early Castle, "and drive him fr to take h. poisession of Dublin was no doubt about the omi' " mm" Now there was treason, and admitted h point there, for it was downright y the writer to be se, for he wen t on to tell the L ord -Lieu tenant that " either I will pu t y ou down, or you will put me. langu age - " But after all that strong a n d a f ter 11 calculated to excite had been the feelings it was Tve with a magistrate's well roused, two policemen, t down the United Irish ' were found quite sufficient to pil .man. _([lsar, hear.) articles These , however, were al lowed; ulate throughout Ireland, for a lung time to env and Government taking no steps to repress them, men FRIDAY EVENING-, FEBRUARY, 20, 1852. and harassing circumstances of the case, was it just or generous to seek to slander a man's character because, for the interests of peace and good order, he applied to a public journal to counteract the -poison of Socialism with which the general press of Ireland was for Rich a long period teeming? That was the head and front of Lord Clarendon's offending. If the Noble Lord opposite, instead of bringing forward .this resolution, introduced a motion Lir the appointment of a Select Committee to inquire into all circumstances connected with the employment by former Governments of such agents and spies as were deemed requisite, he would find that they were not very particular as to the characters or morality of the parties they employed. For his part he could not bring himself to vote in favoui of that motion. He could not forget that Lard Claren don wee one of the best Viceroys that ever ruled in that unhappy country—that he lost no opportunity of pro moting in every way its best interests, whether in agri culture, manufactures, education, or the general deve lopment of its resources.—(dear.) But there was one thing above all others for which the Noble Earl was entitled to most conspicuous credit,. and that was the &cited manner in which he had chained down the monster of Ovangeisin.—(" Hear, hear," from the Radical benches.) The Noble Lord opposite and the Hon. Member for Bucks might perhaps come into office, as the result of the division upon that motion; but ho would warn the Noble Lord and Hon. Members that a great many of his present supporters would soon expect them to repeal the Ecclesiastical Titles Bill, give tenant-right, arrange the revenu es o f th e E sta bli s h e d Ch urc h, and do other things which they might not find so convenient. — (Hear.) All he could say was, that if Hon. Gentlemm Opposite made these concessions, they would have no more strenuous supporter than himself (Dr. Power). Under all the present circumstances, however, he could not give his sanction to any measure which might tend to the removal of the best Lord-Lieutenant whom Ire land had ever seen.—(Hear.) Mr. NEWDEGATE was not s ur p r i se d at t h e pol i t i cal morality of the two Hon. Members for Cork. who said they would vote against the motion before the House, because if it was- successful it would place the party to which he had the honour to belong in power. But that party would not accept power on such terms.—(Minis tenet ek,eerli.) While he admitted the eloquence and statesmanlike qualities of the Noble Lord (Lord John Russell), he must say that his powers as a partisan were equal to his other qualities—(A laugh)—and these powers were displayed effctively that evening. What was the real state of the case? Why, that the Irish Government were reduced to the necessity of employing a convicted libeller—Mr. Birch and the limes news paper—(Laughter)—the World newspaper, to support it. If the House, carried away by the eloquent address from the Noble Lord at the bead cf the Governmen successfully oppoied tho motion before it, the people of Englund would, notwithstanding, remember the facts of the case must always be prejudicial to the Go vernment. Colonel THOMPSON said, that in listening to the speeches on the other side of the House, he had come to the conclusion that the Hon. Counsel laboured under the disadvantage of having had the wrong briefs deli vered to them, for the main portion of their eloquence had been applied to blacken with intensity of ingra titude the character of their worthy client, Mr. Birch. —(A laugh.) For himself, the only question he had conscientiously to decide way. whether he should take side with this convicted libeller,—he borrowed the term from the gentleman's own advocates,—with the man who was stated to be notorious as practising the art of wielding threats of the betrayal of public and private confidence as a means of making money, or with this man's victim.—(Hear, hear.) That Lord Clarendon had been imprudent no man more clearly saw and ad initttzi than Lord Clarendon himself; and Lord Claren don, were he present, would probably apologize for his imprudence, in much the same terms that had been used the other night in the House by an Hort. Gentleman who admitted that he had been guilty of one fault in re lation to a certain borough, which fault was that of hav ing ever gone near the borough—(A laugh)—there could be no doubt that Lord Clarendon quite as clearly recog nized his mistake in having ever gone near Mr. Birch. The short statement of the case was, that Lord Claren don had made a false step, and fallen into a quagmire —(Hear, hear)—Hon.Gentlemen opposite scarcely meant to propound that public men were to be debarred from all communication with the press; nor would they pro bably affirm that when they or theirs had been hereto fore in office, they had never had recourse to the aid of the press; though, of course, they had always taken the utmost care to secure the perfect purity of their press agents.—(A laugh.) Lord C. HAMILTON said it was because Lord Cla rendon had fallen into a quagmire, that he supported the motion before the House. In doing,so he violated his own private feelings, to carry out what he believed to be his public duty; for knowing Lord Clarendon well, and enjoying the privilege of being upon intimate terms with him, he knew that Nobleman was most anxious to promote the welfare of Ireland, and history would hand down to posterity with honour and credit the name of Lord Clarendon.—(Hear, hear.) Such then being his feelings, he could only give his support to this motion with a feeling of regret. Ile had heard nothing from the Noble Lord to induce him to suppose that Lord Cla rendon had relied upon any extraneous assistance than that of that despicable paper the World. He had altogether overlooked the loyalty of the Irish people, and had attributed everything to the effect of those articles. Voting, as he intended to vote under those circumstances, in favour of the resolution, he hoped he should not be told that he was giving a party vote. As an Irish Member, he felt that he owed a deep debt of gratitude to Lord Clarendon, bat at the same time he felt that he should be placing a stigma on the whole course of his public career, were he to mix up this affair with it. He was convinced, too, that that high-minded nobleman deeply regretted the whole circumstance. There was a remarkable fact, and one which the press especially—the mighty organ of the public—should keep in view. The Noble Lord at the bead of the Govern- meat, and another Noble Lord il g itii;office:lil loudly inveighed against the independence of the press, which had since won much praise in asserting it nobly, repu diating the charges brought against it, and criticising the language in which those charges were conveyed. The Noble Lord was pleased to censure the way in which the unbought press of this country had criticised the acts of foreign Governments, and it was a corollary of that censure, that on the first occasion on which, in the present session, the forces of parties were marshalled, the Government should endeavour to obtain a majority directly in the support of the principle of buying and rendering venal the public press of England.—(Hear.) Sir D. NORREYS observed that the opponents of Lord Clarendon praised him to the skies, and his friends supported him, though not with respect to the intrinsic merits of the question under discussion. God bless Lord Clarendon. (Cries of " Hear, hear," and laughter.) Never was a man so singularly defended as Lord Clarendon. The Noble Lord was attacked for having recourse to the public press. Many an honest man had sought the aid of the press, but Lord Clarendon it was said, forsooth, had had recourse to a convicted libeller. The Noble Lord who brought forward the re solution, when he described the paper as libellous and scurrilous, did not show, as he ought to have shown, that the political talent of its articles was 'extraordinary. What else did Lord Clarendon want?—(bear, hear.) Only look at the press of this country. Did not 999 out of every 1 ; 000 of the people delight in the press as the speaking and thinking machine of the nation? Did men in general think for themselves?—(Cheers and laughter.) Was it not a fact that 999 out of 1,000 were guided by the press, and was a public man to be blamed because he thought to gain the assistance of such impor tant means of securing the approval of the public? Oa that ground he had taken his stand there, and de clared that Lord Clarendon had acted rightly. He would not stand forward as the apologist of Lord Cla rendon, and acknowledge that there was a blot upon his character. He repudiated such an argument. Any public man who felt confidence in his opinions, was Jus tified in having recourse to the means which he thought o best suited to give effect to them, and Lord Clarendon had taken the right course, for he had availed himself of the assistance of a journal circulating amongst the t very classes of the people who it was m should be brought to acquiesce in his Government. But what opinion did they entertain of the press in this country ? Did they consider it to be like a virtuous wo man, whose morals it was unpardonable to corrupt, a n d with whose fame it was horrible to tamper ?—(Great laughter.) No such thing. Stich an idea was not to be realized, and he repeated that he could see nothing dis honourable in the offer or acceptance of literary services under the circumstances. He thought that Lord Claren don had done nothing more than any statesman was justified in doing. Ho had bsen unfortunate, certainly, in having had to do do with Mr. Birch, who appeared th 4 red to , have no honourable feali .l 4 whatev-r, b u t L ., .: not the smallest moral C , ELEUTO attached t o hr Lord PALMERSTON (who was greeted with almost ciar years had un iversal cheers) said—Sir,—Having for many the advantage and the honour o f Lord endon's pri vate friendship, and having been closely and directly connected with him by official relations I cannot recon cile it to my feelings to give a silent ' negative to the motion of the Noble Lord.—(Cheers.) I f ee l bound, Sir, to bear my testimony t o the u privaie worth, and to the public personal honour, an d to the valu e of Lord Claren don as a servant o f the pCro ws — (Cheers)—and to ex press my deep regret that ho should upon this occasion have been selected as the . (Cheers, a n d d No, n object of a personal attack.— o," from the Opposition.) Sir, the Noble Lord who made this motion disclaimed its being a personal question. Sir, if this be not a personal ques tion, lam utterly a loss to understand what a personal q uest ion is.—(Cheers.) This is not an attack upon a measure of the Government or the Administration, but the Noble Lord brings under he decision of the House, and he calls upon the House to censure, a strictly personal act of the Lord-Lieutenant of Ireland. "(Haar, hear.) Now, Sir, I hate personal attacks.— (C h eers.) I think it is au unworthy mode of political w arfare—(Cheers)—but, at all events, if any Hon. Mam_ laer considers it his duty to bring forward a personal attack upon a public man, I think ho is bound to sec that the grounds on which his attack is founded are broad, clear, and substantial. — (Cheers.) Now, Sir, I appeal to those who have heard what has passed this evening, to say whether tho Noble Lord has succeeded iu laying any such grounds before you?—(Cheers.) I confess, Sir, that it bas never been my lot to see so un substantial grounds laid for so grave and serious an ac cusation.—(Cheers.) What is it that the Noble Lord has established? On his own showing, what is the charge which he brings against my Noblo Friend? It is this:—ln a moment of great public peril, w h en danger of the greatest magnitude threatened that part of the empire of which he was the responsible governor, a newspaper editor comes to him and says, "I agree in the policy which you are carrying on—l wish to support the cause of monarchy, the cause of loyalty and • order,. which you arc char ge d t o m have II paper which :has but, a e 43.411 I am willing, if you von ir, , sist sus it a greater circulation, to endeftrour to tensively the opinions which 1 conseicritioil and which are favourable to the system of that you are desirous of carrying out." Sir, that if my Noble Friend had shrunk the editor that support he would have-bee n to blame than he is for having afforded Ricans of rendering the public a service. It may be that the editor was in so] unworthy of the confidence which my Noble posed in him. Sir, it is the misfortune of generous minds frequently to fall into the error of trusting -too implicitly those who afterwards prove themselves un worthy of the confidence placed in them.—(Cheers.) But, Sir, I must sat r that for my part, I should not think that I was doints myself credit or honour by taking advantage of information given me by a man who had proved himself so undeceiving of confidence; and it must be recollected that those who endeavour to throw dirt upon others may sometimes soil their own hands.— (Cheers.) I confess that part of the pain which the de bate of this evening has occasioned me arises from seeing the Noble Lord, fur whom I entertain personally great respect, become the insfrument of so unworthy an at tack.—(Ckeere.) Sir, I shall ray no more. I see, from the tone and temper of the House, that this unjust and unworthy attempt at censuring my Noble Friend will utterly f ail -- (Cheers)— and I am persuad e d that the de bate which ha s ta k en Noble Lord, will le ave my place, and the sense and opinion which this Hou se w il l pronounce upon the motion of the most rendered r servant ceies o f andth performed Noble F r i en d stan di ng i n the high position distinguished g s ea trvchick h e h as hitherto maintained, its hasoal a g d r eaa man t ben e ss fi l e for his country.—(Loud cheers.) Lord NAAS replied. He did not intend at that hoar, and after the lenEthened debate which had taken place, to trespass for any time on the attention a the Heine, but he stood there to repel - with indig nat i on the asser dtioon(Cheers, n ._ and " Oh, oh!") Ho q u it e agreed personal wit that this was a attack upon LordClaren h the Noble Lord who bad just sat down that, if he had made a personal attack upon Lord Clarendon he should be unworthy to hold a seat in that House; bat he con tended that he was justified in bringing under the notice of the House the public, act of a public individual, par ticularly when that act was justified by himself upon public grounds.—(Hear ' hear.) It was not the act of Lord Clarendon, but the act of the Lord-Lieutenant and the whole of the Executive Government of Ireland that he impugned. He thought, then, that no one could for a moment maintain that this was a personal attack. If he had been so unfortunate as to give it that colour— which, however, he did not believe—all he could say war, that such a thing he bad never intended.— (Hear, hear.) He appealed to the fairness of the House whether, in the speech of the Noble Lord the First Minister of the Crown, able and eloquent as it was, he hod controverted one fact of the case. He (Lord Naas) had maintained that the act of the Irish Go vernment in this case was reprehensible and dis graceful. His resolution had been opposed by all the ability and talent of the other side of the House; but all had tailed in disproving any of his facts, or in vindicating the act which they were about to sanction by their vote. He left the issue calmly and with perfect fearless ness in the hands of the House; but he must remicd them that the vote they were about to give was one which might hereafter be turned against them.—(Heev, hear.) They were going to establish this dangerous precedent—that the House of Commons approved of the abstraction of public money from the public purse for the purpose of subsidizing a venal press.—(" Hear, hear," and " No, no.") Turn it as they would, that was the question they were about to vote upon; and he was cer tain that if they came to that decision they would soon have occasion to repent it.—(flear, hear.) The House then divided, when there appeared— For the motion ... . . 137 Against it ... ••• ••• 229 Majority against the motion ... —92 - The announcement of the numbers was received- with loud cheers. Various other motions on the paper were then de ferred. The second reading of the Improvement of Towns (Ireland) Bill was postponed till Monday next, The House adjourned at Half-past Ten o'clock. ~1 maintain. 1 4 :.... rcalatio 6011- 0- -.. t .1.,• 61, 4 /...") , : 4 5 ill .a), v; , ruse o 2,tp it . .... , , gofer ' tir';;; - i- W 0 ,-. ''''/,' ''''. , i* , •. ir 4 ~ • ~,,. ~ ~,.., 1 to .„, 4 #4 ?.—(Ch )me reap ' to Friend re- began to think that John Mitchell's sayings and doings were right and proper. For months a &two of the greatest uncertainty prevailed as to the intention of the Lord-Lieutenant, and Dublin was kept in a state of fear and anxiety, while all thewhile he did not hesitate to say that Lord Clarendon was as much the dupe of the lunacy of Mitchell, as he was of the villany of Birch. What ever Lord Clarendon might have been doing all this time to resist rebellion, he did nothing to- pat it down; he allowed matters to go on,. and rendered theta still worse by the diTusting articles which appeared in the papers he had taken into his pay. Ile believed that if it had been possible to have caused blood to have been shed in Ireland at that time, no better course could have been adopted for doing 60, but the people had more sense than to ba stung to madness either by the inculcations of Jacobmen or the intrigues of state. Supposing there were difficulties to contend with, was it a proper means of getting over them to employ such an organ as Lord Clarendon did in defenc e as he called it, of l aw an d order?—(Hear, hear.) It was said, moreover, that his Excellency was not aware of the character of Birch, but that was an argument which could not be held good even by the most credulous, for though be might know no thing of him personally himself, he was surrounded by men who knew him well; and was it possible that- during ail the period he was connected with him, no one should ever have said a word to him respecting his character? But this was not the first plea of ignorance that had been Put forward as an excuse for the actions of Lord Claren don. They all remembered the story of CapteKennedy and the Orangemen, who asked the Lord-Lieutenant for arms in order that they might put down the rebellious, (Her.) On the application of Captain Kennedy, arms were given to these Orangemen, and next ses sion, when a sum of 5901. was voted to ()apt. Kennedy for the cost of them, Lord Clarendon said that he knew nothing at all about it—that the 5901. was given to Captain Kennedy for a book that he had published; but as to the arms for the Orangemen, he knew nothing at all about them. Now, although he might make up his mind to believe one impossibility in one Englishman, he must say that it was putting to him more than the utmost stretch of his credulity could permit to make him believe two. It had been said that these motions (such as that now before the House) were intended to get rid, by a side wind, of the Reform Bill of 1852; but say, rather, that the Reform Bill of 1852 was intended to get rid of such motions as these; for the new Reform Bill, he considered, was nothing but a miserable shift to enact that farce which had been enacted session after session, in order to keep the present Government in power. After taking advantage of every national preju dice, Louis Napoleon having disappointed him in his in tended invasion, and protection no longer being repu diated, the Noble Lord now came forward with his Re form Bill, and told his followers that if they did not keep him in office they would lose their bait, and their enemies would come into office.—(Hear, hear.) He ap pealed, howeier, to the Reformers of England whether they would be cheated in that way, and he appealed to the good sense and justice of Englishmen to repudiate such conduct as the motion now before the House had reference to.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. ROCHE would state strictly the reasons for the vote he should give on this question. He considered that after the speech of the Noble Lord, the First Mi nister of the Crown, the question as regarded Lord Cla rendon had been very much reduced indeed. The Noble Lord in the commencement of his speech alluded with great eloquence to the general policy of Lori Clerendon in Ireland, and with regard to that general policy he was not disposed at present to find fault. He admitted that during Lord Clarendon's administration there had been an incipient rebellion in Ireland; he admitted that that rebellion had been put down, and that those employed in it had been punished with considerable moderation; but he denied altogether that Lord Clarendon was the only man in Ireland who was the means of putting that re bellion down. The truth was Lord Clarendon was aided by the Roman Catholic clergy in Ireland, a elms whose merits did not find much acknowledgment in that House, but they greatly aided him in putting down that rebellion, and to their con duct must be attributed much of the good results which flowed from his government. But the policy of Lord Clarendon had very little to do with the subject before the House—(Hear, hear)—the question simply being, whether his conduct in respect to the infamous paper could be borne out as prudent and just. That question the Noble Lord the First Minister of the Crown had himself settled, for while he defended Lord Claren don's policy, he admitted his imprudence in respect to the newspaper in question, Well, then, that being so, the next question that presented itself to him was, had Lord Clarendon been sufficiently punished for that im pudence? As regarded that question, it must be borne in mind that the accusation was brought against him in a place where he could not defend himself, while, had the motion being the production of a Noble Lord in another place, it could have been brought forward in his own House, where he could have met it personally. To his mind he had received ample punishment, for while he had been attacked behind his ,back, he had been but indifferently defended by his friends.—(Hear, hear.) Then came the question, had the motion no other bear ing than a ensure upon the act of Lord Clarendon? He believed that it had.—(Hear, hear, and cheers.) He believed that it embraced a far wider range, and had more meaning than what actually appeared from the mere wording of it. The motion was brought for ward with much parade. and after long notice given. The press in England and Ireland favourable to the views of gentlemen opposite, had heralded from end to end of the land that th© existence of the Government would be tested on this subject; and ho had no doubt that a man of the Noble Lord's prudence did not under tske to bring forward such a motion without being pre pared for the consequences.—(Hear, hear.) What, then, were those consequences? Why, if the Nuble Lord carried his motion Ministers must resign, and Gentle men opposite must take their places. Now before he adopted that alternative and made up his mind to that change of policy, he must inquire what are the claims of the Opposition party. In the first place he observed, that during the present week a meeting of Members of that House had been held at the Earl of Derby's, and that it had there been de cided, without allowing any discussion on the Irish Reform Bill,, that they were to do their best to throw it out of the (louse.—(Hear, hear.) Should they get into office, therefore, they might expect that measure would b e s h elved, and he was no t prepared to give such a vote as would give them chance of doing so. Then, again, at the commence ment of the session he observed that the Earl of Derby found fault with the Government for not carrying out the Ecclesiastical Titles Bill in Ireland. —(Scar, hear.) He was one of those who opposed that measure; he believed Government acted improperly in applyin g it to Ireland , but h av i ng committed that foolish act , he thought they had done the next best thing they could—never to ,enforce it in Ireland.—(Hear.) But it gentlemen opposite got into power, the morning after the news reached Ireland that they had done so, the common informer would . be let loose, and the whole country would be thrown into a state of confusion.— (Hear.) He was not, therefore, prepared to take upon himself such a responsibility as to:give theta the chance of office—(Hear, hear)—for he believed that were these men in power Ireland would soon be in such a state of agitation and turmoil that it would not be worth hold ing.—(hear, hear.) The present Government were also accused by those wko were bidding for their places of not putting a stop to the agrarian outrages in some parts of Ireland by suspending trial by jury, and intro ducing coercive measures. That policy he must also oppose, and on that ground also he must vote against the motion. The speech of his Hon. Friend opposite who last addressed the House reminded him that in stating these views he was at variance with many of his Friends opposite, but he thought that those Roman Catholic Members who were joining in the support of this motion were following a wrong course—(Bear, hear)—and were committing a great mis take. They no doubt believed that in doing so they were marching in brigade order to the defence of their country, but they were mistaken.—(Hear, hear.) 'They were simply joining in an Orange foray in order to in jure a man who, whatever other faults he might have, had the courage and the honesty to keep down Orange ascendency in Ireland, by attacking one of its chiefs, and for a time to disgrace him.—(Cheers.) He was not there to defend the acts of Lord Clarendon, but be was not prepared to vote fur a motion such as this, which, if carried, would place in power hparty who bad been all along opposed to the Roman Catholics of Ireland, and be warned his Roman Catholic friends who were now joining that party in this motion that, however their aid might now be courted, so soon as that party gained their object they would throw them off and spurn them. —(Hear, hear.) That party was, no doubt, old and constitutional, but their prejudices against Roman Ca tholicism still remained the same; and they only wanted oppOrtunity to - act towards it as those prejudices actu ated them. He should therefore oppose the motion. Colonel SIBTHORP thought the thanks of the country were due to the Noble Lord for his moral courage in bringing forward so important a motion. It was a step in the right direction. It was a clear case of misappro priation of the public money—of that portion of it to which he had more than once directed attention—secret service money.—(Hear.) No man had a greater resp ect than he had-for the public press, though it did some times censure him. The whole transaction would have hah . e . h been a reflection on any Government , and 9eu eo g n h d beunt in did not deny the ability of Lord. Clarendon, this affair showed that though a man might do de a great deal of good. yet he might at the part, he held the country &great deal of harm. For his same time do bis Noble Lord at the head of the Government drihnogrearned sponsible for that dangerous course very reprehensible description of Noble Earl himself — the Lord-Lieutenant right direction, The present, however, was a step government , t o e f n a p u r t ° o e ha ' th an Ireland. t t he ' and they might soon hope to know what England and Ireland.— what became of the secret service money both in (Hear, hear.) Secret service wa asnaenddetfioniititonbewthhiocuhghhet hated, and anything which put hear.) ought to be supported.--(Hear, Dr. POWER said he had listened w h it o h h g a r d ea i t u a t t r t o e d n u t u io u n d to the speech of the N oble Lord w that motion, and to the speecheswo supp , i of or Hon. Members on ted himn er the other aide of the Hu to discover bow far those transactions h ra nsaetions referred to " h a d weakened the authority of the executive, or reflected discredit on the adm inistration of public affairs," and he confessed he had heard nore h a u s d on b s e o eu r a t r h g e_ u r_ m em t t. If the authority of the s ad duced to show that an y such executive in Ireland had boon affected in the slightest degree by thee.) prime. diegs, would they not have p etitions explainin g such a state of in its that country, and callin g upon the Par public feeling;feelin g; li ume nt to lend aid i n the removal of Lord Clarendon from the position he now held? Ile did not mean by an y means to sa y but that the act o f L ord Clarendon in that respect would not bear the test of severe morality— (lisar)—but when they considered the pressure of the times in which it took place, and all the difficult circum stances surrounding him, they would find much to pal liate, if not to justify the act.—(H ear. ) Aga i n , h e would ask, when they took into account all the painful COURT CIRCULAR. _ - - The Queen and Prince Albert walked yesterday in the grounds of Buckingham Palace. His Royal Highne!s Prince Albert rode out on horse back yesterday, attended by Lieutenant-Colonel the Hon. A. Gordon. The Royal Family took their usual exercise in the garden of Buckingham Palace yesterday. The Royal dinner party yesterday, at Buckingham Palace, included the Marquis of Breadalbane, Colonel the Hon. C. B. and Mrs. Phipps, and Major-General Sir George Bowles. A aepatation, consisting of Lord Jocelyn Mr. James Caulfield, Mr. Chichesser Fortescue, Mr. R. M. Bellew, and Mr. C. P. L2slie, had an interview with Sir George Grey yesterday, at the Home-office. General Bell had also an interview with the Right Hon. Baronet. Dispatches were sent yesterday from the Colonial office to the Governors of Hong• Kong and Ceylon, and to the Lard High Commissioner of the lonian Islands. Dispatches were received from the Lord High Commis sioner of the lonian Islands yesterday, at the Colonial office. The Judicial Committee of the Privy Council sat yes terday at the Council-office. Present, Lord Cranworth, Sir J. Knight Bruce, Dr. Lushizigton, and Sir Edward Ryan. Rainy's petition for leave to appeal (Sierra Leone), and Lowes's petition for extension of patent (part beard) were heard. Afterwards the appeal from the Admiralty Court, Vaux v. Sheffer (the Immaganda Clausina), part heard, was concluded and judgment given. The Lords present being Baron Parke, Lord Cranworth, Sir J. Knight Bruce, Sir J. Patteaon, and Sir E. Ryan. AMALGAMATED SOCIETY OF ENGI- NEERS AND THE EMPLOYERS. We have procured the following r e t urn , s h ow i ng the nu mber of men who have resumed wor k i n t h e s h o ps of the members of the Association of Employers in Lan cashire, so far as concerns twenty-four firms who had made returns up to Monday morning : Millwrights, fitters, turners, planers; and machinemen Smiths, boiler-makers, &c. Moulders Others, including labouaers 1,149 Total s ea s rt e m pt hr b oe l es prosecuting uotwinng- THE CATASTROPHE AT ROLIIIFIRTH. saerifieed. On Wednesday, at ten o'clock l , atote M w r d . art D ecah y d s ft o uh n ie , cp e r : oc rt m n iet e yd r : for the Halifax d f i o s r tr t ic h t eirpo a u La r d pFc t sr h ie e d l o u yf r jury ua r sr e tt : the Government; Mr. Jacomb, solicitor Town hall, pur suanta 11, it ln i adjou r nmentdrt h , nd clerk to the commissioners of the t b h y e winhqicuhirnyeisnrtloy be en tpoeoß..claEivn.e:seashttosefvnetdheed inquiry was to be re olufgClis a ou p nci t a db i ee n rhs M afilef oo kio d ,f ) a • Holme reservoirs, was present on behalf of that body . A great number of witnesses were examined on Wed tahnisdinyoersnteinrdgay, and the s n u e m s deady RAILWAY SHARE MARKETS. BRISTOL, FEB. 19. srocK EXCHANGE.—The market continues active, and shares command advanced rates. Bristol and Exeter were done to-day at 87—Midland Stock, 5714—Taff Vale, 154%. LIVERPOOL, FEB. 19. STOCK EXCHANGE. —There has been a fair amount of business done to-day, but prices in most cases were lower yesterday. The transactions were as follow :—Lancashire and Yorkshire, 66 —Ditto, Fifths, 7 dis.—Liveool Crosby, and Southport, 1:-1 dis.—London and North-Western, IlBNt c. Ditto, New Quarters 6 1 ,4 p.—Midland 56/ ---South- Eastern and Dover, 201 A—butch Rhenish, 4 7-16 dis. MANCHESTER, FEB. 19. STOCK EXCLUNGE.—A moderate amount of busineas.b2! been done to-day, without material alteration ill price". The transactions were as follow :—Eastern Counties, i_is: Lancashire and Yorkshire, 6534—Ditto, "I 2 7 13- d n . - Ditto, Preference, 1334—East Anglian, 6 per cent, itto, Pro- Manchester Sheffield, and Lincolnshire, ference, 1 ..21,a —London and North- South cheater and Birmingham (C), Qurije'rn, 87—East Lan westerni2B%,s2l:.t-Man- Eastern and Dover, 20 7-16—Great_I.Ts_ o. , 56 ,. cashire, Preference, Quarters, 8 `..f 1111U14 I " 9 ' 74 Fin. • STOCK EXCHANGE.—..he a ss done was moderate. The day, but the amount of busine cas hire and Yorkshire, 6574--; 14HAM hare market was steady to. dis. South Staffordshire, 1% only sales reportedßiwl:77 RAILWAY TRAFFIC RETURNS. BRISTOL. AND EXETER RAlLWAY.—Traffic for the week ending Feb. 8: — Passengers Goods ... Parcels ..• Mails .•• ••• £2,381 7 4 .. 1,220 15 9 ... 137 16 10 ... 223 4 2 ••• ••• 1.04 £ 3 , 963 4 1 SIiREWSBURY AND CHESTER RArr,wity....Traffie rectum or the week ending Feb. 15.: Passengers £471 16 1 ••• ••• Parcels, horses, & o. 32 4 4 950 1 11 Merchandise, mi nera l 4 &c. Total Corresponding Total ~„ 4 451 17 5 £l, 2 4 MANCHESTE R , BUXTON, MATLOC K, AND MIDLANDS JUNO.' week last year ... 1344 TION RAILWAY.—Return of traffic for the week ending Feb. 15 : • £lOB 4 5 ••• •• ••• Corresponding week last year ... 97 7 7 SCOTTISH CENTRAL RAILWAT.--Traffic for the W eek ending Feb. 15, 1852 : Passengers (6,379), parcels, horses, an d c arriages ... ... £745 1 1 Goods, cattle, kc. ••• 844 4 9 1,589 5 10 Corresponotding week in last year... 1 ,495 19 7 WESTERN (11LELAIID) RAILWAY .88 wiles ). —Return of for the week en di ng F eb. 14:— p a ssengers, parcels, &c. 1 1 , 852. ... £2,948 15 7 isi erc handise and cattle .... 1,097 15 2 Perth, T sFeb.ouTn E G 18, 14 AND Total .... ... £4,046 10 9 corresponding week last year ... 4,729 17 5 THE BAR MILITANT. —The lawyers are about to form themselves into a rifle corps, for which they are well fitted by their peculiar practice, and their quickness in die• covering the objects that are worth powder and shot. — .Punch. MILDNE3S OF THE SEASON.—PrimroE es snd violets have been gathered in this neighbourhood in abundance. — Western L um i nar y. ( Newton Abbot),