The Sun. — London, England, 1812-04-09 00:00:00

cescary they should - know the real state of that Com pany. He therefore should feel it incumbent on him to submit a, motion ior . the purpose of bringing to the le• , of their .Lorilt,hips the various prices of Bark Stock since the year 1797, and a particular statement of those.prices in every half year since 'liar pet tot!, Aod a motion for Accounti dist in • the . inclease in the Bank Pividendssince that year. And one which would go to slim the Bonuses given to. that Corpor4tionf at different times, and from which he would venture to say it would appear that not less than 16 .or 'l7 millions .had been given to the i , t consvcinei-ide 'ot-nielsures which had produced great and unisrrsal'distress. S me orders ~.ere made with respect to the con sideration of certain Peerage, cases in the Committee of Prvileges: atter which their Lordships adjourned 'till to-morrow. HOUSE OF COMMONS. WEDNESDAY, APRIL 8. Mr. ROBERT WARD postponed the consideration of the Wootton Bas Set Election Petition. • The - setund reading of the Clandestine Marriage .Bill was postponed to Friday se'nnight. Sir CHARLES MORGAN brought up a Petition, signed by sixteen thousand persons belonging to Birmingham, against rue East India Monopoly. General GASCOIGNE said, he should wait until all the Petitions which were expected were on • the table, before - he brought forward his intended mo tion on the subjeet. Mr.. WALLACE thought that any motion upon that subjea, would come better from the Govern ment, and that the Hon. Getieral would do well to postpone his 'intention, until they should bring for •wird the question. After a few words from Mr. Creevey and Gene ral Tarleton, the Petition was ordered to lie on the table. Mr, RosiNso N acquaint e d the House, that th e Lords Conirnissioners of the Admiralty, having thought fit to bring Lord William Stewart, Com mander- orthe Conquestador, to a Court Martial, for having run - that ship aground on the coast of France, and having put'.hitn under arrest for that purpose, left it a respell due to (he House, he being a Mem ber of it, to give notice of such ptoceedings. POSTPONEMENTOF . yHE CATHOLIC QUES- TI yN. -Mr. GRATTAN said, he should not be able to bring forward the question with respect to his Ma jesty's Catholic subjects in Ireland, on the 14th ; nor was he inclined, at the same moment, to fix a day for the discussion ; but he should certainly bring it forward, as so6n as possible,'in 'the course of the week after next. The- CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER wished illatThe Right Honourable Gentleman would name a day, as it would'-be desitible to 'appoint a certain period for the Call of the House, which must be po , rponed also. Mr, GRATTAN said he should name to-morrow fortnight, it no business interfered., The Call of the House was then appointed ac cordingly. VOTE OF THANKS. The CHANCELLOR Of the EXCHEQUER moved a Vote_of Thanks to Major Generals H. Campbell, C. Stewart, Kemmis Daw, and Colonel Hardy, who were omitted 'in the Vote of the ioth of February, to the OtEcersand men concerned in the capture of Ciudad Rodrego.—Agreed 10 nem. con. Mr. CREEVEY gave notice that he would move to morrow, tor Copies or the Letters Patent, by-which the. Prince Regent had granied the salaries of Lords Melville and Buckinghamshire,- in the Board of Co'n t rani. The Prinusses' Annuity 811 was read a second time, and ordered to be comttitted on Tuesday cext. Sir JOHN NEWPORT gave notice, he should move to-morrow for the addition of six Members to the L - :sh Finance Committee. EXPORTATION OF IRISH SPIRITS. The House having resolved itself into a Committee on-the exportation of Irish spirits; Mr. W. POLE moved the order of the day for the 'Rouse to resolve itself into a Committee of the whole House, to consider of the exportation of spi• tits disiitled in Ireland, to foreign parts. The House having resolved itself into a Commit , ter, f• Mr.,.W. POLE said, he•rose pursuant to the notice which be gave yesterday, to move a resolution, that the exportation of spirits disidled in Ireland ) to fo reign parts should be prohibited for a time to be li , -rnited. In proposing this measure to the Commit tee, it was necessary for him to observe, that the rate of the list. harvest in Ireland was such as to renter it expedient to take some step; tb counteract the eery high prices to which grain hid risen in that country. In considering this subject, tour methods occurred, which appeared to be calculated to attain the object i 0 view. The first was, to prohibit the flee intercourse of grain between Great Britain and . .This, however, was a .measure which he was sure every Gentleman would agree with him thinking ought not to be resorted to, except in a case of the last necessity, and theref o re be had not thought of proposing it. The second method that presented itself was, that of stopping the distillation 1 - r -in grain in Ireland,; but that also was a measure that ought only to headopted in case of eXtreinity, because it would-not only be highly injurious to the . reienue, but would contribute most essentially to check that spirit of. agriculture which was so rapidly increa.ing in Ireland, and which was prodUaive of So much athantage to•the countiy. Another plan vilti,ch might have been resorted to was, that of pro hibiting the exportation of'graiii for the. use of our • anwei abroad ; but this also was a plan which he Awas.sitre the House would not think of adopting, if , at. could, possibly be avoided. The only remaining ~;ati, then, was the one which he had now . the ho •iour of proposing. He trusted that the House would agree with him in thinking that if it was calculated . to attain the objeCt in view, it was preferable to the ,either modes which he had enumerated, bec,ause it wonbi be productive of legs injury to the revenue, and to the agricultural interests of Ireland„ He was aware that the adoption of it would be productive of Considerable disappointment to a very' meritorious claSs of persons, viz. the distillers, who by their ac tivity and industry had established a new trade highly , beneficial to themselves, and advantageous to the country. He trusted, however, that they would have pattiLti•ln enough to comply cheer:oily with this regulation, knowing, is they must, that it 'idt, S .only adopted in consequence of thesvery high price of grain, which pressed so. heavily on the poorer clasSes of the community. The relief which this measure (coupled with others which'he wouldhere after propose) would afford, would, lie trusted; be effe6tual ; if it should not, it would be the duty.of, Government to be prepared to submit other and stronger measures to Parliament'. If the Commit.. tee should approve of this resolution, and he sho u ld obtain leave to b r i ng i n a Bill , he meant to provide, that the exportation of spiritti distilled from grain in Ireland should be prohibited, 'after this day, for a time to be limited ; and 'he meant to propose that the 31st of December should be the period of the li. I mitation. The Bill would, be founded up . Othe model of. the'English AM for prohibiting distilktion from grain, but power would be given in it to the' Lord Lieutenant to grant permission for the export atiOn of spirits after th.-iober next, if it should appear expedient; or, if it should be necessary, to*cOntinue the prohibition till forty days after the next meeting of Parliament. There would be also prirvisions in the Bill to afford relief to persons who might innO 7 . cently export spirits, from their ignorance of the measure adopted by the Legislature. The CoMmis-, sioners of the Revenue:would be empowered to hear the cases of persons who might be exposed to -parti cular hardships, in consequence of this-regulation, and to afford them such relief as their, cases 'night require. , Mr. Pulesaid he should not trouble the Committee further at present, but conclude with moving the Resolution. Mr. STEWART said, that the object in vievv-wonld, in his opinion, be better i,?romoted, by the.stoppage of distillation from grain altogether, and it would be sides mark the attention of the Irish Government to the wants "of lire people. Mr. cuuwEn thought it surprising 'that Govern ment did riot go., into a general consideration of the resources of tlie country with respect to its - supplies of corn, after the quantity that - was annually import ec,l.. He thought . t h at a r i se on t h e pr i ce at which grain might be imported • would insure a constant supply, and two bushels more on the acre through the country would give an abundance. Ministers should have a more accurate view of the whole agri culture of the country, and, would by that trlL:ans haVe it in their power to adopt some general mea sure, instead of those temporary expedients now re _sorted to. He wished to God, for the sake of the health and morals of the people, that an additional duty was laid on spirits, which would oblige them to make usc'of the wholesome - and nutritious be verage of porter: Mr. SHAW (of Dublin) said, that it was impos sible for him to. allow this Measure to go forward, without entering his protest against what was likely to prove so injurious to the whole body of the dis tillers of Ireland. It would, in the first place, throw a great superabundance of spirits into the country ; and, in the next place, he thought they should be very cautious hoW they interrupted aleade which was likely to be so beneficial to the country. Another measure offered itself; which, he thought, would have a better ofiect—namely, the stopping of distillation atter a certain time. It was to be considered too, that large contracts had been en tered into, arid this measure would throw a damp on "alt enterprise or speculation, for which rea sons he felt it his duty to dissent from the Reso lution. Sir Join , / N r awPoßT said, that no man could mor. hvartily concur in any measure, which ap peared likely to obviate the difficulties or distresses of the people than himself, but he could not help considering the present as inefficacious. Some do cuments should be before the House Oa enable them to form a correct judgment, and to make it manifest that there was no danger from illicit distillation.— The - Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Pole) had last night stated from the Commissariat Returns, the prices infinitely lower than the market prices in the adjoining district, which was certainly no great proof of their accuracy. He was far from wishing to oppose the present measure, except on the grolllla that it led the House to suppose that they had ap plied a remedy, where, in truth, they had not. It the prohibition of di st ill at i on f rom corn took place, there would, be no suffering, because the distillation in a great measure took place from raw corn, which • could be brought to market, and was still to other pyrposes, • Mr. PARNELL thought that the direa conse quence ,of the present measure would be to dimi nish the profits of the Distiller, and to lower the price of spirits in Ireland. And the Right Hon. Gentleman himself bad admitted that, it would not cause a great saving in grain, but was calculated to allay the apprehensions of the people. It was highly impolitic to adopt a measure so injurious to the numerous class .of Distillers in Iteland. They had expended their capitals .to meet the or d ers which Parliament was about to prevent them from fulfilling. Under such circumstances, be thought they had a right to' apply to Parliament for corn pensation. After the opening of a new market,. they should be very cautious how they adopted such a measure as the present.' He was of opinion that the scarcity was not real, and that if matters,were• left to themselves, nu bad consequence would Id- law. I\lr. W. POLE begged leave to say a very few words in answer to some of the obfervations which had fallen from different Gentlemen in the course , ot this . discu.sion.. There was one f, Z of which he. Was surprised they were not aware, because it was one which he thought was perfectly well known, viz. that the distillers were almost all in the habit of making greater quantities of spirits than they were by law bound to do. It had been the. policy of the Irish Government to compel the persons working large stills to make a certain quantity, but the faat was, that - almost all of them made more than the quantity prescribed. It had been stated that this measure would not afford any relief, be cause the quantity of spit its exported was not great. In answer to this objedion, he had to state, that tke quantity of spirits exported in the last month, amounted to between one-fourth and one-fifth of all the spirits distilled in Ireland,- and that the capi-. tal had been increasing for the last six months. He could not, therefore, be accused of, bringing forward a measure not calculated. to produce tiny efleet, when . he prop ose d t o prevent the exportation of nearly one-fourth of all the spirits distilled to Ire-: land. He entertained sanguine hopes that. this. measure would afford -effectual relief, if it should not, other measures must be resorted to. Au Ho net:table Gentlerden . behind trim (Mt. SIA*), stertied to think that this measure would be unjust to the distillers. He Was really at a loss to know in what the injustice consisted. Parliament was bound to consider the public interest, though in so doing eheyerright do injury to the interests - and profits of sortie: individuals. The Hon. Gentlemon ,had pro posed to stop the distilleries immediately, and, to prevent them'from commencing before a certain period ; but he was surd that Parliament would not adopt a measure that would be.'eo highly injurious to the revenue, without much stronger grounds titan they had at present before them. When lie proposed to prohibit the exportation of spirits, the Hon. Gentleman seemed to feel for the situation of the distillers, but he certainly did not, reel for them when he proposed to stop the distilleries altogether. It had been said, that he ought to have laid more information before the House before he brought forward this measure, but he really did not think it necessary to load the table with papers upon (Lis subject. Every Gentleman kneW, every Gentleman who had spoke, admitted, that some step was neces sary to countered the high prices of grain in Ireland. Another objedion which had been made was, that the, distillers who had entered into' contracts would by this measure be exposed to peculiar hardship; but it appeared to him, in cases of such contracts, the law would exonerate the distillers; if, however, it would not, he had no objection to propose a clause for that purpose.. Sir SOHN NEWPORT contended, that there was not sufficient information before the House. The Right Hon. Gentleman might, from his official si tuation, have even information, but he: (Sir John Newport)" had not the same means of bbtnining it. Mf. W.. POLE said, he hid 'never 'refused the Hon. Baronet anv information he had applied for; but the Right Hon. Baronet did not seem to know tvkat was in his ()Wu power. Yesterday he had moved for papers which had been oefnre moved for, and which were then actually a,t the Bar. Sir JOHN NEWPORT said he could not tell what information vv,is in the papers which were at the Bar, and he had not had an opportunity•of seeing them, for as soon as they were brought up they were ordered. to be printed. MI. GRATTAN said, that when the question was, whether distillation or exportation should be pro hibited, he thought the milder method 'should be first tried. It was bad policy to make the agricultural system depend on caprice orchange of circumstances, unless there was a pressing necessity for it. He agreed, that in the present case, something must be done,- and he therefore gave his assent to the milder measure as an experiMeet. After a few words froM Colonel BASTARD, the ReSolutions were agreed to, and the Report ordered to be brought up to-morrow. The House having resolved into a Committee of ' WAYS AND MEANS,' • Mr. W. POLE roseto submit to the Committee the resolutions of which he had given notice yes terday. The first resolution was, that an additional duty should be laid upon spirits distilled from grain in Ireland. The additional duty he meant to pro pose was, 2s. Cid.' per gallon, which would- just double the present existing duty. The grounds up on which he offered this resolution were, first, the relief which it was hoped it would afford to the brewery trade of Ireland. The. Committee would recollect, that, a petition was presented to the House last year (tom the Irish brewers. The Committee to whom that petition -was referred :had, reported, that the, distress,s of the brewers in Ireland arose from the Inordinate use of spirits, in conse quence of the lowness of the price, and that illicit. distillation had increased from the stme cause. The Committee also expressed their epiniore, that the health and,industry of the people were materially injured by the excessive use of spirits, and suggest ed the propriety of laying an additional duty upon them as soon as posSible, Another object which lie had in view by this resolution, was, to assist the measure which he just had the honour-of propOsing. He hoped t hat these measures Quid lessen the con sumption of spirits, arid thereby tend to di minish the price of grain. The duty upon spi rits in Ireland, if this resolution were agreed to, , would be greater than ever was raised in Ireland, if would not be a greater duty than ever was laid on, but greater than ever was collected, The duty before the last reduction was 6s. in cluding the malt duty, the duty he now poi osed would b'e bs, ma. including also the malt.- He trusted that thin measure would not have the effect of increasing illicit distillation ; . formerly he was . aware that an increase of duty was an encourage ment to illegal distillation. He had now, however, the satisfaction of stating that, in consequence of the measures- adopted list year, great progress' had, been made in putting down those illegal stills, The% number of still-heads and other appendagek stills destroyed- last year was greater by twO ; nirns, than in any former year, and he had no doubt that tke accounts from the last Assizes would state, that still greater had been inade in that desirable ob ject. In addition to these measures, the Bill for enabling persons possessing small stills to work them - in a ditferent manner, now required by law, would; he hoped, induce many persons ,now en gaged in the illicit trade to take out licenses. He trusted that the. Irish Government would be able ef fectually to put an end to illegal. distillation, with out•putting in force those laws which were now in existence for that purpose. They were really of a nature so oppressive .and so intolerant, that he should feel it to be his duty daring the present Ses sion, to propose to repeal them. He had to observe, that the- duty in , the present case was to be laid only on the stock on hand. He then concluded by moving--- " That it is the opinion of this Committee, that froM and after the Sth day of April, there be laid.on every gallon of strong water or spirits made in lieland a duty of 25*. • Lci. per gallon.in addition to the duty,now'paid." • Sir JOHN NEWPORT was extremely happy to see the present motion brought forward, and thought thete was no tract thee which ought not to be made to the great Object of preventing the excessive use of spirits among the ldwer orders in Ireland: He hoped a full and fair trial would be given to the aug mented duty. GRATTAwsaid, that he perfeetly concurred in the present measure, which went w prevent ,the' sacrifice of the health and morals of human crea tures to the benefit of the Revenue. He hoped this measure would increase the consumption of malt liquor, whiCh was so much more wholesome. He coti§iderd the ithti pfite be spirits in' freiand,, cause of their 'excessive use, rather than any d \r position in the people to intemperance. This do y would go to correct that evil, and he had not any doubt that it would beiollowed up. Mr. PARNELL conceived, that the increased duty proposed, by the Right Hon. Gentleman 'Would not attain the objects he had in view, that of suppress ing illicit. distillation, or of.diminisfiing in any con siderable way the distillation of spirits from corn. He had hoped that the R;glit Hon. Gentleman. Would have taken a more cornprehensiVe. view. of the subject, as forming one, of 'the principal branches. of the Excise Revenue. He also alluded to the elt 6. pense attending the - collection of Revenue in gene ral in Ireland, and to the necessity of the system being . assimdated to that of this • country. Hey . thought the Ri g ht flout. Gentleman had ov e rra t e d the destruction of Stills. • Mr. W. PULE said, the Hen. Gentleman would soon have an opportunity- of ascertaining the faef, because the Finance Committee of which that Gen tleman was a Member, had ordered a return upon that %cry subieti. With respe4 to the appointment of Excise Officers, the Government only appointed the Superior; the Board had the entire management and appointment of all the inferior Officers, from the time they were Sopernumery Gauger*.—Tho Resolution 'was agreed to. Mr. W. POLE then moved a Resolution for Re pealing the. Act of the both of the King, for Grant ing a Bounty to Such Retailers of Spirits as sold a certain quantity of Beer. This Act, he said, had merely given 4 bounty (in perjury. Agreed to. Mr. W. PoLE then moved, " That it was the opinion of the Committee, that the se veral duties now chargeanie on Tobacco in Ireland, in the nitteresit transits ot that merchand4e, should be exchanged fora duty ot equal value on the going out of it hom Ifig Custoni-house warehouses." - He also moved, " That it was 'the opinion of the Committee,, that the importation of Tobacco Stock into Ireland should be forbid den in future, giving the merchants a delay of three months lion America, and of one mouth from other part'," These Resolutions were agreed to nem. colt. Mr. W. POLE .gave notice, that on Friday he` would move for leave to bring in a Bill, for the bet• ter examining and auditing Irish Accounts. Mr. MyEas moved fora return of the .inveL,t ments recei - ted from India, distinguishing the diffe rent Presidencies, from the year Int to the year 1808 ; and also fcr a variety of other accounts con nected with the state of the East India Company's affairs. • The Committee on the Bankrupt Members wai postponed to Monday next. Mr. O'HARA' p6stponed, from Nkonchly to Man' day se'nnight, his motion " for au instruction ICV the Irish Finance Committee, to inquire into ti a .. joint debt of the United KingdOm, and to report thereon." The Orders of the Day bein; thits disposed of f the House adjourned at halt past Six. ARRIII/D-1 Guernsey, t jersey, t Heligoland, xrpublin. \ , Vaterford. Duz—i Mdlta t a Guernsey * t jerse), f. Wa— terford. OF SlO KS. THIS DAY AT Tw , Lvco'cLocK. 591 a 15 per Cent. Navy - gof Consols. - TFT E SU N. SOLEM LIVES DICER FALSUNI AUDEAT ? L ONDO N, THURSDAY, APRIL 9, 1812. This morning a - Heligoland Mail arrived. Tbo following is the only article of intelligence which it brings : • HELIGOLAND, APRIL s. —Since last mail, there have been .several arrivali from the. 'opposite coast, and some pisiengets,'who have tied from Ham ttrgh, to a►oid being drawl? in BUONAPARTE'S nos general conscription. By these we learn that NAPOLEON is every d' 3 l expected to take the command of the French arm/ in the interior of Poland in person ; that great clef' tions haVe been lately made to pave and repair. fb 4l " roads through which he is to pass, and that he is 10 hold . a conference with the Emperor of AUSTRIA aC 7'r6ves, on the Rhine, at which place it has been arranged the two Emperors are to meet. It is also stated that the greatest discontent pre° v ails all over. the Continent, in consequence of tbs. late extended conscription. It is very confidently stated, that hostilities have commenced in the North. A letter from Paris, of ' the'3d instant, says, that advice had, that day, bees received, of the Russians having forcibly entered 'Memel on the 23d ult. and possessed themselves a 1 all the Prussian magazines at that place —,an event, which was of course considered as an unequivocal ' 1 commencement' of hostilities. ,No official confir mation of this intelligence has yet been received; but it is in 'every'resped probable.' . From: the intelligence. brought by the Spanish Papers and Letters which arrived yestertiay, we are inclined to think that the French are meditating borne movement of importance in the South of Spain'. By the bold measure adopted by Lora-- WELLINGTON, of besieging Baddjoz, the Fr e nch must, as we before observed, either, collect the greater part of the di.posable force which they have in, the South, and advance to its relief, or they must suffer it to: fall. In th former case, tie army under BA L L A sTErtos• which now amounts to to,ooo men, well equipaed , and the Spanish troops in. Murcia, Valencia, Of