The Sun. — London, England, 1846-05-27 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS fay 26. Their Lordships met at ten minutes to Fire o'clock. CORN-LAWS. Several Peers presented a great number of petitions for and against the repeal of the corn-laws. The Duke of RIC FINION D said he had a petition to present to their Lordships on this subject, on which he wished to make a few observations, although he did not intend to make another speech upon the corn-laws. The petition was signed by 1,390 of the tenant-farmers, who had assembled in Willis's Rooms, a few days ago, and who had come to Londjn, from the different counties of England, for the purpose of showing that those who had reported them to have changed their opinions with respect to the corn-laws had stated what was untrue. It appeared to him that the tenantry of this country had nut been fairly dealt with by the advocates of free trade. Their Lordships' table had been crowded, night after night, by petitions from the tenant-farmers of England, all of which were in favour of the present system of protection, and yet they had been repre sented to have changed their opinions on the corn-law queston. His Grace then read the petition. The Duke of RIJ fLAND presented a petition from the occupiers of land in the county of Kent in favour of the repeal of the corn-laws. Earl FITZ WILLIAM presented a petitition to a similar effect. NORTH BRITISH RAILWAY. A NOBLE LORD presented a petition in favour of this undertaking. Lord BEAU3IONT presented two petitions, signed by 460 and 334 of the t enant f armers in E ssex, aga i nst th Corn Bill now pending before their Lordships. Lord ASHBURTON presented a petiticn, with 900 signa tures attached, the prayer of which was to a similar effect. CORN LAWS.—ADJOURNED DEBATE. The order of the day for the adjourned debate having been read, The Earl of WILTON rose and said that he wouldoceur e their Lordship s ' a tt ent i on on ly f o r a short period, and as were of a bservations which he thought it his duty to make eneral nature, he felt that he should have little difficultyin seeping his promise. But upon an occasion like the pre4ent, when interests of such magnitude were in volved interests involving, in the opinion of many. wise, cool, judging, and dispassionate minds, no less considera tions than those of a social revolution—he thought it would best become a humble individual like himself to come forward honestly and frankly to state the course he was about to pursue —(Hear, hear) —and the reasons upon which he grounded the vote he intended to give on the present occasion. He had many years supported those principles which had influenced the counsels of her Majesty's present advisers, and their Lordships would believe that it was with feelings of no common regret that he found himself in the honest discharge of his public duties compelled to oppose the present measure, and it was with feelings of regret that he found himself opposed to the present Government. How much m ire painful, how much more poe s snant must be his feel ings when he found himself opposed, for the first time, and he sincerely hoped the last time in his life, to vote against the Noble and Illustrious Duke. By his counsels and opi nions he was not a- flamed to say that he had been actuated during the whole of his life. Their Lordships would give hi :n full credit for the assurance that it was with the deepest anxiety he came to such a considera tion. He did not intend to eso in'o a detail of the measure ; he would not trouble their Lordships with a lots; detail of acts and figures. They had been so fully stated by his Noble -iend in his eloquent and statesman- like speech that any. ning he could say would but weaken the effect which it had produced on their Lordships' Heuse, and he would confine himself to the two grounds which had been urged in favour of the measure. One of them was the operation of the tariff of 1842, arid even if beneficial effects attended that measure he contended that there should be a limit put to relaxation when it was in favour of free trade. Under the operation of the law of IS-42 they had seen com merce, trade, manufactures, and agriculture flourish in the country. There had been a vast application of capital to agricultural purposes ; but, more than all this, they had seen a snore kindly feeling spring up between the hitherto antagonistic classes of society. —( Hear, hear.) Under the operation of that Bill the country had arrived at a degree of prosperity unexampled. Why, then, quarrel with this state of things, laying aside the great ex perience they had had, and breaking up a great and powerful party ? No satisfactory reason had been given for this pro posed departure from the principle of the Bill of 1812. But the only reason he could conceive for proposing it was the destitetion and scarcity that prevailed in Ireland. They were told by her Majesty's Government that there was a great scarcity, and that the month of May would show the real state of things; but May had arrived, and where was the evi dence promised ? Echo answered where? Certain he was that no sufficient reason had been riven why they should seek to change the commercial system of the country. He could not bring himself to believe that under the operation of this Bill the price of wheat would be lowered in the same proportion as the wages of the labourers. Now if that were the case—if the means of purchasing provisions on the part of those who would be principally affected by the measure were decreased, he woo d implore their Lordships to pause before they proceeded further with it. Re was unwilling to trespass upon their Lordships' time on so trite a subject, but he must be allowed to refer to the manner in which the measure was carried through the other House. It was carried through the House of Commons by a eompact entered into between those parties who entertained the most extreme and dangerous opinions; by the Whigs, who had changed from a fixed duty to no duty at all ; and that third party, who had made a change even more startlin g .—( Hear, h ear .) He wished to addres s a f ew wor d s to those Noble Lords who had, like himself, supported the present Government for many years, but who now, not like himself, proposed to continue that support. If they were satisfied this measure was right and just— if they considered favourable results would follow the passing of thistineasure—if they considered by passing this measure they were not giving a stimulus to an agitation for lowering the position of the aristocracy, then by all means let them vote for it. But if they considered with him, that he was right in the view be had taken, then let them, without fear of clamour from without, and without fear of the imputation of being actuated by selfish motives, vote against the second reading of this Bill, and make use of that legitimate power which the Constitution had invested in them for the preservation of the monarchy. He had now made the few observation; he felt it to be his duty to address to their Lord ships on this important occasion, and it only remained for him to thank the House for the indulgence they had shown him.—( Hear, hear. ) The Duke of CAMBIIIDGE felt it to be a duty to himself and to his owe character to state in a few words the views he entertained, and the line of conduct he felt it to be his duty to take upon this very important occasion. —( Hear, hear. ) He believed he was the oldest Member in that House, having occupied his seat for forty-five years ; but he had never voted in oprosition to the present Government, for where he could not conscientiously vote for them, he had always abstained from voting at all. ( dear, hear.) He was too old to change his sentiments—(Protec tionists' cheers)—and now having stated what were his cenvictiens, they would easily see that he did not intend to vote upon this question.—(:tear, hear.) He had stated frankly and painfully what were his opinions. He could not vote upon this quest on, because he felt that his charalter was at stake.—(Loud cheers and laughter.) If he did not state frankly what he felt, he should be supposed to be lukewarm as to this question, which he consi , lered to be the most impor tant that had ever been brought before the country since he had the honour of a seat in that House. —( Hear, hear.) He went to :he House of Commons to ascertain the opinions of the Right Hon. Baronet at the head of her Majesty's Government, he went there unbiassed—he had no conversation with any body but himself.--( Laughter.) He listened to the reasons which that Right Hon. Gentleman brought forward, and he must acknowled,ge fairly that he could not approve of the seasons which he gave. He would not pretend to add any thing to the speech of his Noble Friend (Lord Stanley). Lord GRAN VILLE said a Noble Lord on the other side complained of the great number of conversions which bad lately been made in his party. He thought he would not complain of that. He considered that, with reference to the speech of the Noble Lord last night, that in matters of com mercial legislation, the last authority they should go to was the wisdom of their ancestors —( Cheem ) When their Lordships considered the g.eat changes which had taken p'ace in this kingdom, the increase in commerce and manufactures, the means of communication so largely increased, the increase in the population itself, he really thought it was idle to go back to the times of Edward IV.—( Cheers.) Much had been said of the unanimity of the farmers upon this question. It was by some admitted that the great excitement and unanimity upon the subject prevailed more in the western parts of the metro polis than in the more rural districts. Others again contended that this progress in free trade among farmers was of great public importance. He did not attach so much importance to that circumstance. He did not think that the opinion of the farmers should have that undivided weight with such an assembly of their Lordships' House. He believed that they were a respectable body, but he did not think, from their general habits and education, that they were fully competent to give an opinion as to the laws which regu late the commercial policy of a great country. There were the country gentlemen —a class more highly and more deservedly looked up to than any other class in the country. The gene rality of them were well-educated men, they were generally well ves sed i n hi story and polite literature, and it so happened h that body not only hat e d po li t i ca l econom i sts b ut political economy, a ow, without the study of political economy how could such a question as this be decided upon. There was another c l ass, and that was the clergy of the Established Church._( Cheers.) if the effect of this Rill should be t o reduce the price e t : e lergy would be compensation a to t ier the first to suffer. Ha thought, too, that that was proposed would not happen so soon classes. Feeling that, he thought it was very creditable to the clergy that they had abstained from all political agitation on the subject. There were then the commercial and manufacturing etas-es. He could not allow that class to be called turbulent, for amongst that class were some of the most eminent men in the country. Mention had already been made as to the rate at which farms had been let and land sold. Now he found that, notwithstanding this measure, poor land in the south counties had readily been let, and placed under the plough. . He trusted that their Lordships would pass this measure, feeling, the words of Mr. Huskisson, that the country should place her re liance on the sources of her wealth, on her agriculture, and that her manufacture, and every branch of her vast trade ; she need not fear the competition of other countr ies ."— (Hear, hear.) The Marquis of NORMANBY sail that he was sorry to trouble their Lordships. He would not occupy their time at any length ; for the truth was, he felt himself very un well, and he was urged to take advantage of the opportunity of addressing them, rather than wait to a later period of the evening. And h-' would, in the first place, enter his protest against the 'loquent conclusion of his Noble Friend's speech list night, in which he denominated the Prime Minister of the Crown as the greatest man of the age. In deed the statement was met by a solitary cheer from the Noble Lord upon the Woolsack. himself a zealous supporter and col league of the Right Hon. Gentleman, and a Noble Lord wh o sat near him. My Noble Friend stated his desire to avoid all personal discussion; he fully joined in that desire. It could be no pleasure to enter upon it. But he did wholly differ with the Noble Lord, that the conduct of public men had no refer ence to such a subject as the present, and he did feel inclined to rise last night, even at the late hour, to enter his protest against such a statement. His own opinions on this subject were rather peculiar. He for one did not believe that the in trinsic effect of the measure, whether for good or for evil, would be quite what the conflicting parties expected. Such was his opinion and while he listened with the respect and attention which he was bound to show to the concluding decla ration of the. Illustrio us P r i nce who had addressedthl e House that night, he must express his total dissent from the statement that the institutions of the country and the cause of religion would be influenced by this question. He had nothing in his opinion on this subject to r egret oe recal. He had always voted for the gradual application of the principle of free trade in this country, and had rejoiced at every relaxa tion of the tariff, as he felt it would cause more amicable rela tion between this country and foreign powers. He avowed that he felt it his duty, in the few words which he had to address, to speak against one of the greatest evils which was likely to be attendant upon this question. He regarded it as the duty of every man who felt what was likely to be the bene ficial con-eque nees of this measure, to assist in removing that evil. There had been the most eewggerated references made to the intleenee of this measure on the working claw*, and he 4101114 tie espies himself 23 to mitigate the disappointment, 44044 tuta I pass iato a law, and also to stet'kie eGn" viction, that if it did pan, its effect would not be what was an ticipated, and a more gradual, but not the less certain, disap pointment would be the n suit. Still he thought that the balance of good was in favour of the Bill, and that it would tend to diminish the pressure of misery upon a large portion of their fellow-subjects. He did not mean to say that the Bill would do away with the evils attendant on the necessary lot of nature regarding those who laboured ; but he felt it would be a great means of arresting that degradation which affected a large body of the community, and which could not continue consistent with the safety and credit of the state.—(Hear, hear.) His attention had been principally directed to the condition of the labouring classes during the two years that he administered the internal affairs of the country, and the result of his examination was not to convince him that the corn-laws would do away with these evils, and at any rate that the measure w ould not he of much importance in itself to diminish those evils. A great authority, sir. Adam Smith, had stated, that when the rewa. d , of the labourers w as ample, it was the greatest proof that could b affordedun e r ti oof wasth e moderate,prosperit oft wasth e a countryproof t ; h that a the h e wheneou country r, was stationery ; and that when starvation existed to d any large extent, it was an evidence that the co untr y was goingown In reference to the working classes , the same authorit y said , that their remuneration, at his time, was sufficient for their comfortable maintenance and the education of their children. He also stated that a corn-law then existed, amounting almost to prohibition. What use could he make of this ? H e was not eoing to state that the present evils were produced by the corn laws, but to direct their attention to the causes of the chan g e. It must be admitted , that whatever benefits and advantages machinery might hereafter produce, th ere was no doubt that since its introduction, it had operated to a great extent on the labour market, and had influenced the condition of the labourers. Do not let them suppose that he wished machinery bad not been invented. All h e did say was that from that time up till now the Government should hare watched the transition state arising from the extensive application of mechanical power. What had been one of the effects of this change ? Why, it caused a considerable emigration of their labourers from different districts of the country. Manufacture had now become an abuse of the term, for it was not by strength of hand that these fabrics of England were created ; women and children were called to aid machinery, and consequently the demand for labour in the manufacturing districts was for the very cheapest kind, while the more complicated and arduous and high-priced labours formed exceptions. He contended, then, that the effect of all this had beer: to establish what might be termed a monopoly price. In a report on the con dition of the people, which bore the name of Mr. Chadwick, it was stated that a cottage in Rutlandshire might be had for 50s. per annum while for a miserable apartment in Man chester he would pay 71. Ilya. He cnly adduced this to show that these changes ought to have been considered by Government at the time, because they affected the people of this country more than he expected the present measure would do. What were the statements made in the last sanatory report? Why, it was said that. the cost of preventing disease in 31anchester amounted to 300,e001. per annum, or 1/. per head, if they merely took the population. But it must be remembered that there was a considerable class in that town who were wholly exempted from the diseases which afflicted the lower classes, and therefore in this way the cost was much more than 1/. per head. Now, he would look to another article which pressed ht avily upon the working man. They heard much of the cry of cheap bread, he would just in quire how the labouring man would be affected by it ? An Ss. duty upon corn, according to the report of Mr. Senior, would only be a tax of lid. upon the working man. But what use did he m a k e o f this? hy, he was considering the con duct of the Government, and he told the House that it was clear from these reports that three or four y ears ago they had ample opportunities, without rupturing parties in troducing measures rendering themselves liable to reproaches, for measures which would have proved of more advantage to the poor man than the present Bill. His Noble Friend behind aim read a report last night from Mr. Greg, who, he believed, was a member of the Anti-Corn-law League, and an extensive ma nufacturer, and who gave a melancholy account of the pros pects of the manufacturing districts. He stated that foreign countries were rapidly increasing their power of underselling them, but he (the Marquis of Normanby) could assure their Lordships that while on the continent, a short time ago, he made inquiries of his friends into this. and, to a certain extent, he found that the apprehensions of Mr. Greg were right; but they gave a very different reason for it to that of Mr. Greg himself.—( Hear, hear. ) He said that in the spirit of the utmost kindness to those gentlemen ; it would be better if those gentlemen would apply some part of that ingenuity which they had hitherto exclusively directed in the pursuit of agri culture, in the improvement of land, to their own manufactures. If they would take that advice in good part ( in which spirit he wished to give it), he could assure them, as far as his humble knowledge went, that the danger to be apprehended by the foreign marked was not that they were able to sell cheaper, but that the colour and texture of the cloths was of a very inferior description. He was com pelled, in answer to the observation of his Noble Friend on the preceeding evening, to remark that the present veneration in the manufacturing districts was much more deteriorated, and that the value of their life had diminished five pt r cent. He felt bound to make a few observations with respect to the con duct of the Government on this question. He felt that they had a right to complain when they found themselves thus unex pectedly fogged to come to a decision one way or the other upon a question presented to them, and which they had no right to anticipate. —( Hear, hear.) He complained that the Govern ment had, in bringing forward this measure, aggravated the difficulties, in the peaceable and quiet settlement of this question. —( Hear, hear.) He considered that much higher questions were at stake than merely whether or not these results were likely to be realised. He thought that in all constitutional countries, public character was a sort of common stock ; and that where there was a wanton waste of it, he thought every one interested in the maintenanc of the constitution would suffer considerable loss. They had heard at one time a great deal of that sentiment which once roused the glorious sensibilities of the country. They now heard of nothing but buying in the cheapest and selling in the dearest market. To those who stuck this opinion on their banner, he admitted that there might be some merit in having a cheap minister, upon whose fears they could traffic. They could go into the market, watch his turnings, and deal accordingly. He felt assured that there still existed a strong feeling in the country in favour of the sacredness of the pledges of public men. He thought it would be better for those who wished to make an alteration in Committee to vote at once against the second reading of the Bill. He had a great wish to maintain the legitimale authority of that House ; but he hoped that no unusual course would be taken to support that authority : for he did not think that, after the majority with which this Bill had come up from the other House, they could now successfully interfere with it. He did not attribute vast importance to this measure; and, if it were passed, he should not look upon it as irrevocable. If the evils which some anticipated should result from the measure, their Lordships would have no difficulty in revoking their previous decision. He thought, however, that this measure was-a step in the right direction, and would be attended with much gond, although it had been purchased at the suicidal price of public character. The Earl of CARDIGAN apologised for trespassing on the time of the House so early, but having supported the Govern ment now in office for a period of 25 years, he was anxious to state the reasons why he could not support them on the pre sent occasion. He could not say that he had always been con sistent in every vote which he had given, but this he could say, that he had always voted conscientiously. What, he would ask, had occurred which could justify her Majesty's Government :n proposing such a measure as this ? It was true that temporary distress had existed, but a temporary remedy Was all that was required. The calamity which hr.d occurred in Ireland could not be considered as a sufficient ground for the abolition of all protection to agriculture in this country. Such a cause ought never to have produced such a measure as this. By such a measure as this they would stultify all their former proceedings. e did not pretend to have any greater discernment than others, but he considered the course proposed for them to adopt was most pernicious, and which he considered as derogatory to their character. Their Lordships were shortly coming to a vote upon the subject, and he would ask them, if they were going to reverse all their former votes, what would be the opinion of the country and of the yeomen of England— a fine and gallant rare, who loved honesty and sincerity? And he asked them, would there be any sincerity in adopting a measure which they hod form, rly rejected? He trusted that they would not yield the question without a serious consideration. Lord WINCHELSEA said he did not think he would he doing justice to the great body of the people, who called upon him to represent their opinions in that House, by giving a silent vote upon the question. He would refer there to Scrip ture, in which it was written that when the rulers of a country were found wanting it would be removed from amongst the na tions of the earth. Would they allow the Government of this country to act in such a degrading manner as to give a pre mium to one of the most revolutionary bodies that had ever ex , isted in this Gauntry ? The measure of 1829 was, he regretted to say, arr:ed by treachery and perfidy. If their Lordships sanctioned a principle so subversive of the constitution, they would live to rue the day. If their Lordships gave way to the cries of the members of that seditious body, the Anti-Corn-law League, they would lose the affections and esteem of the sober and intelligent people of this country. No man could be a greater advocate for cheap bread than himself, but if they were to be obliged to depend upon the produce of foreign nations, this country would be ultimately destroyed. This country grew sufficient food for its own people.—( Hear, hear.) It might appear a strange statement to some of their Lordships, but he could state as a fact that had come under his own personal observation, that in the very county men tioned the Noble Earl who opened this debate—Lincoln--- there were produced in the year, 1845, hundreds of bushels more wheat than the people of that county could ex pend ; the plentiful supply of that article so reduced the price in the last year that the cattle of the cultivators of the land there were fed w i t h th e b eg t w h eat. S ome m i g h t ask what corn growing countrie s were we to fear if this measure were passed into a law, but he had no hesit a ti on i n say i ng t h at America al one could afford to , supply the inhabitant s of the whole of as much corn as would e nllit States, O 00,00 . 0 f quarters of wheat had been grown in the Ameri-ta last year. He, therefore, maintainedTt7 t tt e land of this country must go out of cultivation. Sir Robert self had admitted that where the farm was small, and the 1,11; amount of capital and skill was trifling, the land might go out of cultivation. He implored their Lordships not to give a vote contrary to their consciences. Several Noble Lords had, however, done so when the Reform Bill was before them, and it had been a matter of sincere regret to them ever since. The Noble Lord concluded by stating that he should give his most determined opposition to the measure. The Earl of CLARENDON believed and hoped that this measure would at once and for ever destroy the protective sys t em . Whether the potato blight produced the conversion, of t h e members of her Majesty's Government in n d a gr e e li a g t h m t e a a t su th re e he knew not, but he must exp ress his unfeigned introduction of so great a measure.—( Hear, hear.) There was scarcely any ma n wliose mind had no t und e r gone some change on the question cfpr ecti.durin,g the last thirty years, a n d h e it on would ask those of their Lordship; who were in favour of p ro _ tection, whether they would venture to reject this Bill? He much regretted the delay that had occurred in demonstrating that this measure was by no mean! a party one. He firmly be lieved that Sir Robert Peel was influenced by none other than conscientious and upright motives. Some of their Lordships might ridicule the argument about the potato failure in Ireland, but he defied them much longer to treat the sad reports.whicl; arrived from that country with such levity. — ( Hear, hear. They would be compelled to adopt such a measure as this. The Noble Duke on the cross benches, and others , declare that they were taken by surprise in this measue. He could only Sir R. that if they were deaf and blind to the intent ions of R. Peel, the country was not.—( Hear, hear.) Upon all ques tions affecting the great interests of the country, we have had a Government strong enough to carry out its measures, and an Opposition unable to thwart it.—( Hear, hear. ) It was not to be supposed 'hat Sir R. Peel threw wide open the gates of free trade merely for the purpose of letting in asses , gums , and other things, and that he intended to keep out the most import ant of all, the food of the people.—(Hear, hear.) Nora; ith standing all the statements of Sir J. Graham of the effects of the high price of provisions on the morals and condition of the people, the protectionists, deaf to all his statements, raised the cry of protection to native industry. Real native industry re quired no protection ; they needed not their new-born sympathies or their worn-out legislation. The manufacturers had as great an interest in. the quiet and welfare of the country as any Noble Lord in the House.—( Hear, hear.) All the in dignation against freedom of trade must therefore return to its source. Ile defied any one to show that the labourers had been better off than they would have been had there been none of these protecting lama. •A Noble Lord had described ?cr.?. chase air and tha biz) sky their want hear. o ) f under which the labourers lived. He did not say P e u r. r — er, ( a wh w e o n rd he ab l o o t o a k t ,,d the at w th ag e es sta o t f e t o h f e th l e abo la u b i education, their hopeless life of toil, their struggles for exist ence, he did not think they could sink any lower than their present situation.— Hear, hear.) With regard to the tenant farmers, he believed that the man who possessed the know !edge of cultivating his ground, who would adopt th e new discoveries,' and not adhere lo the old-fashioned implements of their ancestors, would hare nothing to fear, even if the country were to become inundated by that immense supply of food, which one would really think was to be borne on the waves of the ocean, and delivered gratis at every man's door. —.( Laughter.) Suppose that this inundation were to take place, and that hundreds of thousands of people were to be all at once cursed with an abundant supply of food, he did not hank that even that was a very serious evil. He believed that this question was made entirely a landlord's question, and that all the objection to the measure aro.e from that quarter, There was nothing of this outcry when the du y was touched on cotton, hats, wool, silk, or other things; it was only when wheat, oats, cattle, oxen, and apples were touched, that they heard these bitter complain's against the Government, and heard of men deserting their colours, and deceiving their friends. -- (Hear. hear.) All the opposition to this measure had been -n abortion, whether arising, from speeches, newspapers, or even from that central focus of protectionist wisdom, No. 17, Bond-street—(Laughter)—or whether arising from that grave assemblage lately held in Willis's rooms, when all the expenses were liberally paid of those who wished to spend a day in Lon lon.—( No, no, and Hear, hear.) He did not believe that farmers had generally been seized with the panic to such a de gree, that they immediately disposed of their farms. The con trary had taken place, and if any of their Lordships who now opposed the Bill, were to come forward and say that they would he willing to sell their estates for two years' less purchase than the general value, he thought their only difficulty would be in selecting a purchaser from among the numerous applicants.- 1 Hear, hear.) The present corn-laws, he believed, imposed a tax of 10,000,0061. on the people of this country, not one farthing of which found its way into the Treasury, or even into the pockets of the landowners; if it did, they would ocr ainly have more reason for supporting the present system. He had always exceeded the limits which he proposed to him self, yet he would beg that they would bear with him, while he would advert to the system of meeting hostile tariffs with hostility. The only safe policy for any country to pursue was that of each nation pursuing the course which appeared the best adapted to their own interests, and if England did that they would give an example which other countries must follow. He knew that it would be urged that nations would send their goods to U 3 and demand bullion in return ; but was that possible? Could such a thing continue ?—( Hear, hear.) No; certainly they might send their corn, but they should keep it if they did not choose to adopt an equitable system of exchange. The speeches delivered in the French Chambers might also be quoted, but he would say these speeches were quite right, delivered as they were on the eve of a general election. They did net create any apprehension in his mind, as a nation so en lightened as the French would not be long in discovering that face trade was for their interest. They were about to adopt a policy which would extend their intercourse among nations, and which would shower upon them the blessings of peace. Lord CA RNA RVON said there was never a time when the present measure was likely to inflict such permanent evil upon the country. He could see no indication in any cauntry Europe pointing to free trade. Those countries which had adopted the principle were only minor states. like Naples or Sardinia. The Noble Lord opposite appeared to think that for the period contemplated the vitali'y of the nation was at stake, and that it could only be saved by the opening of the ports. That Noble Lord also was in favour of the fixed duty in 1841, but he admitted at the same time that in a period of scarcity it would be necessary to remove that restriction. But he (Lord Carnarvon) could not understand how, under all the circumstances, any British Minister could propose to a British Parliament such a proposition as the repeal of the corn-laws, under the circumstances he had been describing; and if such a man there were, he did not think they could brand him with sufficient censure ; and it was such a measure as in such a state of things would, he thought, command the sympathies of the people of this country with the people of Ireland for a repeal of the union. With regard to the price of labour, he need not tell their Lordships that the demand was regulated by the sup ply, and if they should take a great quantity of land out of cultivation, the wages of the labouring population would be proportionably reduced ; and whilst the independent farmer might be enabled to withstand the shock, the poor farmer would fall under it. He had heard it said that more tears had been shed over the currency measure of 1819 than had ever flowed from the consequences of the bloodiest field of battle ; but his opinion was that this measure would cause more flow of tears than either. They had heard of lands going out of cul- ivation. His Noble Friend who introduced the Bill last night had spoken of such a circumstance. It had been stated, and confidently stated no later than June last. that in the event of the abolition of the corn-laws, no less than 2,000,000 of acres of the best land in England would be thrown out of cultivation, and 1.000,000 people thrown out of employment. They were now informed that foreign competition would stimulate domestic industry and improve the condition of the country. So far would it be from improving the condition of the country that a friend of his, who before the proposal of the present measure had been prepared to lay out 120,0001. in agricultural pursuits, now paused, stating that although he had not any great apprehension of the ultimate effect of the mea sure, he should feel it his duty to watch the course of the present Bill. There were nuraerous instances of a similar nature, in which gentlemen, who had been prepared to invest considerable sums of money in the cultivation of land, now declined, and with a caution by no means blameable risking any money until the present Bill was decided one way or the other. He did not think that the people of England would be likely to be benefited by free trade at the time when they needed it the most, for in case of any sudden demand for corn being made on the United States, those states might not be prepared to meet it, and of course the high prices would be continued in the time of scarcity. During the last thirty years there hadbeen an increasing demand for corn, yet the price had gradually decreased. During the last 30 years the fall in price had been as much as 34 per cent. In all other instances in which an increased demand for a particular article had taken place, that demand was followed by a slow but sure fall in price. His Noble Friend who introduced the Bill had alluded to the great increase which had taken place in the prosperity of the agricultural interest ; but he ascribed it to the influence of some such measure as he was then introducing. He (Lord Carnarvon) should rather have ascribed it to the influence of the system of protection then existing, and which in his opinion was the only one calculated to benefit the agricultural interest. There was another point to which he had not yet alluded, that was the dependence which the measure would cause on foreign grain. He admitted that during the heaviest war in which England was ever engaged the disturbances did not entirely prevent the importation of foreign eorn into England; but when his friend went into particulars, and referred to the year 1810, he felt it necessary to remark that at that time there happened to an extremely abundant harvest in France. There was also a very scarce harvest in England, and the ut most vigilance could not prevent the surplus provision from find•ng its way into England. Did it not occur to those who so -trenuoitsly supported the present measure, that the same argu ments which existed in its iavour in 1841 existed in 1811) and 1814. and could have been as easily then as now brought for ward in support of any measui e like the present one. He very much regretted that no penalty attached itself to sudden and violent departure from long upheld principles.—( Hear, hear. ) The Government had gone to the battle-field of election under the banner of protection, and they now suddenly changed their opinions, and came forward and proposed a reduction of duty which was virtually no protection at all.—( Hear, hear-) If his Noble Friend had professed the principles which he had so lately and so suddenly professed, on going before his agricul tural constituency, they never would have wielded their fran chises to return a candidate in avowed opposition to their own opinions. There never w a a Government so well able to do good, or possessed the power of being so really useful as the present Government, and how had they exercised that power? Had the counsels of his Friend, the Noble Duke, and his Noble Friend the Secretary for the Colonies, been listened to in November last, how much better would it have been for the country at the present moment, and how much better would it be for it in future. Were such principles as the present of long growth ? No ; for not very long since the (louse of Commons had decided by a very large majority against such principles as the present ; and now they had decided, by a majority equally large, in favour of these prin ciples—the majority being called by his Noble Friend a mark of the strong sense of the country. Ought not her Majesty's Government, instead of leading the Commons into such a measure as the present, to have said to them at once, that they had changed their opinions, and have asked them if their constituences had changed theirs ? Ought not such a measure as this to have been referred to the decision of the English people in general, whose interests were so deeply concerned in it? Did not they hear the voices and opinions of the yeomanry who had existed for so many centuries under their families? No, they let that cry come to them in vain, and they only prayed that they might not be virtually blotted out of the representation of their country. They did not ask them to come to any final decision on this mensure, they only asked that they might not be suddenly ex. posed to the operation of a law which was likely to involve to so enormous an extent their lands, and the lands of every man in the country. A Noble Earl at the conclusion of his speech had said that no prolonged discussion ought to interfere with the speedy passing of this measure. If a measure were to he considered as passed before it came to their Lordships House they had better not discuss it at all, but throw away the mask of debate ; and they would better consult their own dignity by hereafter standing aside in humble and obedient silence to the edicts that came to them. Were they prepared to show to the country that they could scornfully reject at the hand of one set of men that which they would unwillingly accept at the hands of another ? Would they show that they were to legislate by party measures, and in deference to party ? If they did so their day of strength was passed, and they would prove to the world, and to their new masters, the League, that they were only fit to encumber with with useless splendour the land which they no longer benefited. Several Noble Lords here started up, and a scene of some confusion ensued, in the midst of which, Lord NIALNISBURY commenced speaking in a loud tone o'r t 11 1 iv e r i o r i; ee ; b o sl r eo d Lordships rpedffse .. e as t id ually to surmount the clamour which sur rounded him. After much laughter, order was restored. ad dressed their Lordshipsst e h l datotcheeeas timesh possible,&d r during gibt but th a ehra lastlien having four uorn a address r a e r s s s , he d dense eswoulde the venture e t h e a trespass o i n nt t o he a m s sm no a w ll , a a c n o d mp h a e ss w a o s u p l o d ss c ib o l n e - . He would answer the observations of the Noble Earl who had called the present Bill a landlords' question. In his own parish, which consisted of 42,000 acres, there were only five proprie tors be,ide himself who possessed more than 500 acres, and there were 246 who possessed only 15 acres, and on those poor men the fatal consequences of the measure would fall. He would not remind their Lordships of the sentiments of Adam Smith,ti Ile Ricardo, bg g e and t to or remind Sired the Robert Right Peel Rev.in 1 1 1 ; 1:2 1 aoticinneesatntirtoh:hni that tonnqtdtuhttehhetsocey dl2lfiHix: from ec e ude r : e eob d rtneo to trthnh: di their Thenncgoemr c e l tes.rgbo Nobley Lta o hpo n e; itdrrhe then eenpnr apprehended tlw.l were dependent incomes were h m d e e e p a o e tt f n e the treaty concluded in the time of Queen rick the Great. Th e latter monarch closed the port of D antzie of corn. dishonest against the English, and deprived thishon emoofutrhable e su i e anyster introducing yea t r o li s e i , s he measure should. m fl e e ti d v i e d s notfe tae e i r t i omp me i ii u n t But it was strange that after the lap se o f discover for that period the country had been misgoverned. Was that the minister for whom they would sacrifice their feelings and their cons ciences? — ( Hear, hear.) The Bill had been sent up to that House by a majority of the House of Commons, but he denied that it was a clear majority. He should feel i t his dut y as an En g lish Peer to bow to the un disputed majority. of his countrymen. Earl of H A DDl..'s GTOS said his anxiety to address the of the LI of the subject. e could assure the House general nature te .t reluctance he rose o House did not arise from . the feeling that he had n the present expediency, and in. , that public opinion and co *s e Earl who hail just sat down, be preserved together. As ns t i he occasion. He entirely concurred in the opinion of the Nobl that it was with the area . tency of character shou d voleed no moral or political _ question was merely avowing a change of opinion. difficulty or disgrace in before the formation of the He had for a number of years, even. f evolution, he f e l t no a matter o r present Government, been of opinion 11 upon the subject of the g that there was a great deal of exaggerated feeling prevail: depended upon protec that he had net er goue so corn:laws, and never, he assured their L o rdships,lead he thought that the interests of agriculture t ion. (Hear, hear.) It was true witi, far as *4 vi.y he hold opir.lol in • principles of the Bill, but he had frequently expressed in private to many of his friends, that a repeal of the corn-laws would not prove very injurious to agriculture, were it not for the panic which must necessarily follow the adoption of such a measure. ( Hear, hear.) Entertaining such opinions then years ago, he had no diflicul' y in November last, under he then existing circumstances, in agreeing to a proposal for opening the ports, but he 'seed not go into the details of what occurred about that period, and it was only necessary for him to confirm the statement of ' his Noble Friend (Lord Stanley) with respect to what passed in the then existing Cabinet.—( Hear, hear.) He must admit, however, that the state of Ireland alone was not a suffi cient justification for so extensive a measure as throwing open the ports ; but his real opinions upon this question had been such, thdt had his Right Hon. Friend at the head of the Government stated, some years ago, that his opinion ul on this matter had undergone a change, he should have been ready then to have gone fully into the question —(Hear, Lear. ) But their Lordships must remember that. this Bill was not brought forward solely for the purpose of relieving Ireland, for there were other, and, if possible, mera pressing circumstances which called for its adoption. There were strong apprehensions of a stagnation prevailing amongst the many manufactures of the country, in deed strong symptoms of such a stagnation had in November last already exhibited themselves, and the question for the then Government to consider was, whether this Bill should be in troduced with the view of reviving the trade of the country by parties who had always eutertainted free trade opinions, or by the Ministry who were then in office. He, amongst others, thought it would have been much better for the party with high the Noble Earl opposite k Earl Grey) was connected, to introduce the measure, and the consequence was, Sir Robert Peel's Government was broken up. An attempt was then made, as their Lordships must be well aware, to form a Whig Administration, but the attempt failed, and the former Government were compelled to collect their forces to gether and form a new Ministry. Under these circumstances and in the then state of the country, he readily consented to , take office again with his Right Hon. Friend, the First Lord of • the Treasury, but he most solemnly protested that it was for the sake of office, but because he felt and sincerely so that in rejoining the Government he was aiding others in benefiting his country. No office that he could be appointed to would compensate for the loss he would sustain if the predictions of his Noble Friends on the cross benches were realised. He considered, however, that the evils anticipated would not happen, nor would the anarchy and ruin prophesied ever come to pass. The Noble Duke ( Richmond) prophesied that the most dis astrous results would follow. The Noble Duke was followed by the Noble Duke beside him, and also by a Noble Lord ( Stanley) who made a speech of great parliamentary talent. It was a speech which displayed great conservative principles. —( Laughter.) The Liverpool correspondent of the Noble Lord talked great nonsens.e.—(Loud laughter.) If he ( Lord Haddington) considered the course proposed , to be pursued by his Noble Friends, was as he stated from a desire to yield to the clamour and agitation of the Anti-Corn law League, he would not acquiesce in it. But he t bought it was not. He believed the country was favourable to free trade principles, and he believed also that a large portion of the landed interest concurred in that opinion. They were told, however, to appeal to the country.—( Hear, hear.) ft was all very well for irresponsible men to talk of that. appeal ; but such questions as those which related to the food of the people were not fit subjects for popular appeals.—( Hear, hear.) It had been said, also, that the Ministers had misled the people in 1841, in not telling them what they intended to do.—( Hear, hear.) But he denied the charge. What had the originator of these great changes in view in proposing them? He was not a man to be accused of want of caution or preeipitancy. His conduct could have proceeded, as his Noble Friend (Lord Brougham) said last night, from no other motive than the strongest sense of public duty and the most conscientious con viction.—( Hear, hear.) His Noble Friend, stung by the eloquent eulogium of his Noble and Learned Friend on the previous evening, addressed himself particularly to the Noble Lord on the cross benches. He thought it would have been more becoming had he strictly adhered to the resolution which he had previously formed, as to avoiding all penonaiities. Cer tain Noble Lords had said that they would prefer total and imme diate repeal ; and if that were so, he conceived that it was the duty of such Noble Lords to give their support to this measure. —( Hear, hear. ) He conceived that the great object of the cot n-law was to prevent fluctuation, and to secure steadiness in prices, make us independent of foreign countries. Now, rich all the attention that he had been able to pay to this question, he could not find that the corn-law had answered any one II those results. He did formerly believe that the corn law did, to a certain degree, contribute to the improvement of the land, and that opinion he still retained.—( Hear, hear. ) But he did maintain that the change which was now proposed was much more likely to produce steadiness in prices, and pre vent fluctuation in the present law. It was utterly impossible, as long as they depend on the weather for their harvests, to se cure equal and unfluctuating prices in corn. It was the ten dency of the sliding-scale, and "Weed of all protection. to accu mulate a vast quantity of cot ri in this country ; and then, at the most inconvenient moment to the farmers ; the prices were reduced by the g reat impot Winn He believed that in one year alone 12 000,000 quarters of corn were admitted into the mar ket. His Noble Friend who had last spoken instanced the conduct of Frederick the Great about the closing of the port of Dant zic in the year 1770, but lie (the Earl of Haddington) firmly believed that not the slightest fear should be entertained by the people of this country as to the closing of the foreign ports. For the last 49 years this country had enormous impor tations of grain. His Noble Friend who had so distinguished himself last, went hack to the olden times, and quoted the pre amble of an Act of Edward IV. It was true they had always some protection, but they had never been able to keep any one system of protection long. The great increase of the popula tion of the country, and various other causes, had rendered these changes necessary from time to time. He considered that if this Bill were to pass, every benevolent heart would rejoice at seeing the poor supplied with corn at a low price. He did not think that the property of the farmer depended on the high price of corn. A Noble Lord on the other side said this measure would not be passed by their Lordships without taking the sense of the country upon the subject. The times and circumstances under which this Bill was brought before their Lordships must not be lost sight of. He believed their Lordships would be entering into a hopeless conflict if they strove to maintain their present corn-laws. If they could appeal to the sense of the country he believed that there would ' be an immense majority in favour of the corn-laws. The Go vernment had been accused of acting under the influence of the League—they had done no such thing. He disliked as much as any Noble Lord any system of organised agitation ; but he still considered that the great power of that body should net be overlooked by any party in the country. The thousands and thousands of pounds subscribed to the Anti Corn-law League for the•purpose of obtaining a repeal of the measure, might be taken as a mass of evidence denoting the feelings of the people upon the subject before them, and he trusted their Lordships would not refuse to weigh it when they came to a vote. And now with respect to the Right Hon. Btranet, he would say there never was a Minister at the head of affairs more interested for the public weal, and there certainly never was a more upright and incorruptable man placed at the helm of the state than Sir Robert Peel. It was objected to them that they had not explained to the House what were the views which they entertained of the effect of these measures. Now he considered a more preposterous assertion was never made to the House.— ( I fear, hear). They could not be ex pected to name what would be the exact price of corn. They did not pretend to do so. Their Lordships had the conse • quinces of the measure fully before them. They were even detailed by the very fact of its introduction to their House ; and he would conclude by thanking their Lordships for the favour with which they had heard him, and he would record his vote in favour of the measure, convinced as he was of the benefits which would arise to the country from it._( Hear. ) Lord NORMAN BY said his Nab', Friend had completely misrepresented him, and had imputed to him motives which would be most dishonouralye. What he did say was, that he preferred a fixed duty, and that was the only thing in which he differed from his party. He also said, that being stung by some observations which were made by the Noble Lord last night, that he (Lord Normanby) had become most personal in his observations. The EARL of HARDWICKE said, he would begin his address to the House in the same manner that many of his Noble Friends had done, namely, by expressing the regret he felt at being compelled to address them at that late hour of the night, but that he had been driven to do so by circumstances of the last importance, over which he could exercise no control; and that nothing hut the deep sense of the duty he owed to his could compel him to enter upon. He had no d o ubt but those ,)se Noble Lords who had preceded him in addressing their Lordships against this measure, had done so from a feel ing that they were doing that which was most conducive to the best interests of the country ; with those observations he would now proceed to address himself to the subject matter of the debate. He did not believe that any of their Lordships were more interested in the passing of this measure than the humblest man in the kingdom. Nay, more, he would go so far as to say that he did think that the lower in the scale of society those were who sought for this measure the more were they interested, and that the rich men would be the least affected by it. He would ask, were not the parties who were urging on this measure the aristocracy of the country? And were not the opinions of those men in accordance with the opi nions of the most democratic countries in the world ? The Noble Lord then read an extract from the American Times newspaper in justification of his argument. He then went on to say, Had this country flourished eider the protection system ? His Noble Friend who spoke last bag given them merely speculative points, but he did not adrenal ice point in support of the posi tion taken by the Government. Now they on that side of the House had one thing to look to in evidence of the good that had accrued under the protection system. They had raised the character of the country, they had increased her exports, and give a facilities for introducing imports to a greater extent than had ever been known before. The produce of the country had been proved times and oft to have kept pace with the prosperity of her Majesty's subjects, and he cone ended that the revenue had in the same way kept pace with tife produce and prosperity of the empire. He could show their Lordships that the prices of the necessaries of life, other than bread, had preserved a fair proportion with the articles he had referred to. The Noble Lord then adverted to the contracts taken with Chelsea Hospital, at different periods, and argued therefrom that very low prices calved at present in respect to every necessary of life. In ad dition to everything else, the capital employed in agriculture, hail employed, as his Noble Friend stated on the previous evening, a very considerable fleet, with a great number of sea men—he meant in the guano trade. He hail taken great pains to ascertain the condition of the people residing in his neighbour hood, as to th e i r circumstances in former times, an he found that in those days the poor never saw wheaten bread, and they spun their own clothes. A great improvement had taken place, they were now better housed, fed and clothed than they were then. Great quantities of wheat were now raised that had no existence then. He begged to impress on the minds of their Lordships that there was no calling in which the profits were less than in agriculture, and he believed them to be such as to render it impossible to pay higher wages than were now paid. He believed in the agricultural districts wages oscillated with the price of food, which was not so to the same extent in the manufacturing dis tricts. He was certain that if this measure passed, it would affect in a serious degree the agricultural interests of the Country, and lead to most deplorable results ; and that it would operate injuaiously upon the labouring classes.—( Hear, hear.) chef H luae e drai r,o, could lnnys ptohrnoe r ev e re f a e dit t r et hwo t to at st another n,aartnthadeli tt price r.aitceuv fn: wouldwot h f hee t a h tr i this atrek e th subject, te phr leaveei andc price to 00 rf a citpanu v trt r yne y decreased, a a i pamphlet d, and ui is fa fact written t eq equally y A h lr e . td ßa o rk d e a r i . nosteh The e ing as in the agricultural districts. Heg good not g d , e a p n t P r a ua o i fm s n at e i ri l ht ret t L h o o r n ti v, s h h t ips he a m t ig t h h t at el l a a i t m e honoeur thing,of the tha e t ven th in e but their of this country had greatly increased under a protective policy. Y necessity s tayd heardfor the their r f 1, Lordships d famine sh I t r o e a l a d r v e e l rt as to a i reason he whyN Noble et Lord referred f r e e rr s e h d ou tn ld st b at e ist p ic a s ss t e o d sh in o t p t a .ha l t a t w h , ,, ebxupt,,Srtisr fßnonnberltrePlaenedlmhheaaadd greatlyread y eaxbcaeneddoende the this e position,imports it andtha that thereforecou country, try h: n r t e l t was h e r e little fnr e o h N ß a r o o b a u l li e g l hal:a:ant:nide; t i L h e mo i l fpadorh t nrg b it,: : (nni t et , a s it fir as the argument advanced by his Noble uA and Learners Friend, Friend on the previous evening ( Lord ' completely fell to the ground. He th sliding, scale hear.) Besides, in the read this opinion in favour of the iend, whose opinions, owing to his brilliant talents, were c h had distinctly declared of great w declared last night that F oble and Learned Friend, because his Immense number Noble and Learned Friend had made, and the large am• unt of 1 3t1 loess he roust have transacted he was always a fr e e ie e-t t ;ader.— (Hear,.. y 9 mat ban fogcttes titi3 &p00h...04110w.) This Isis in the course of long life, Noble and Learned Friend gave them the price of wheat in Dantzic, and the rates of freight charged for bringing it to this coutyry. Lord BROUGHAM begged pardon for interrupting his Noble Friend, but perhaps he would he saving him a good dal of trouble by stating that the figures he gave were the calculations of others and not of himself.—( Hear, hear. What he said was in this sense, " You who oppose the Bill say the prices of wheat in Danteic and the rates of freight are so and so" and not in the sense of the F. gures being his own conclusions or his own calculations.—( Hear, hear.) The Earl of HARDWICK under these circumstances would pass on to another part of his Noble and Learned Friend's speech.—( Hear, hear.) The variations of the fluetuation in this price of corn in i'hilade phia arid other countries as com pared with England were far greater, and showed that the effect of protection eas not injurious. It was said that re ducing the rents would he accomplishing the whole matter. He would sty, in reference to that proposit ism, that if the income of their Lordships were reduced only one-fourth, the consequences to this country, and even to the manufcctss - ing intere to, would be most disastrous. He would quote a letter from a political economist, with the view of showing the pernicious effects of such a doctrine. (The Noble Lord then quoted a letter written by Col .net Torrens to Mr. Seymour. in which he stated that the Anti-Corn-law Leaeue were well aware that the reduction of rents would not produce any cor responding benefits, but the reverse, upon the agricultural or manufac•uring classes.) That, continued the Noble lord, was the opinion of a great political economist, and it was one in which he perfectly concurred, that upon the working, classes a reduction in rents would necessarily entail a pro portionate fall in the value of their industry. It was said that its pendenee on foreign countries for their supplies was of no importance. His Noble Friend near him ( Lord Stanley) had cut the ground from under him so completely on this point that nothing was left to him to add to it. He must say, however, that ht - hart still some confi dence in the wisdom of their ancestors; and though their opi nion might not be considered of much value in these days, he must say that the independence of this country from foreign influence and foreign assistance formed a most important fea ture in every statesman's consideration. This was the case with regard to corn, as well as every other matter. In the set tlement of the great question relative to the Pretender, in the last century it was thought right to carry out this prin ciple as far as possible, and to put no monarch on the throne who belonged to any foreign or Popish country. In the sen tence pronounced at that time by Lord Hardwick on Lord Lovat, that opinion was very strongly expressed. He alluded to those things merely for the purpose of showing the anxiety felt by their ancestors with regard to keep ing this country independent of foreign influence. It seemed to him that the question of dependence on foreigners was, of all others, the most important in the discussion on this measure. He would ask their Lordships to consider the great. cost and expense to which this country had been subjected in consequence of the interference of foreign powers. He would entreat their Lordships to take into consideration the inter ference of Hanover, for in,tance and when he sw.ke of flan over, he believed that no greater political blessing had been con ferred on this country by that Illustrious Princess that now reigned over us, than that through her instrumentality the king dom of Hanover had been severed from us. He mentioned Hanover for the purpose of showing that this country had always suffered from the interferenca of foreign powers with the affairs of this country. In 1688 we had not ational debt. In 1697 we had a sic btof 21,500,0001. In 1714 the debt was 34,000,000/ In 1736 it was 50,000,000/. In 1748 we had a debt of 78,000,090/. In 1756, the commencement of the seven years' war, it. was 75,000,010/. In 1763 we had a war. and the debt amounted to 193,000,0001. From 1777 to 1815 it increased to 828,000,0001. In consequence of the war into which we were drawn by our connexion with Hanover, the debt. was raised from 75,00-t,OOOl. to 139.000,001)1. The national deist had been created by continental wars and continental interfe rence. And was the condition of this country altered sir, the period when the debt was created ? He contend d that the whole of the condition of England was totally changed. He had now done. He believed he had touched upon every part of the subject which was of any importance, and he should be sorry to be the instrument of unnecessarily protracting this debate, but he must be permitted to conclude the observations which he had to make in the same way as other Noble Lords who had taken part in this debate—that was by calling their Lordships' attention to the great humility of the state and position of their Lordships' Howe under the existing circumstances of the country. He would say that their Lerd ships were now placed in a very curious and important position in reference to this question. It was pet tectly notorious, awl he would repeat it over and over again, that the present Par liament was assembled under the Government of the Noble Lords opposite, upon a special and particular question. It had bet-n returned for the purpose of protecting the agricultural interests of this country. He for his own part had given his most hearty support to the Conservative Government, and he was prepared to vindicate the character of himself, and those with whom he had acted. It was understood and believed that no measure would be brought forward by trie present Gevern ment which would have for its object the alteration of the present system of protection to agriculture. Sir Rooert Peel, on the first of January, 1840, used these words—" Agriculture is imaroved since 1834—d0 you take credit for the improve ment? It is owing to your fostering hand, and to the manly and decided tone on the corn-laws." Sir Robert Peel said that when addressing those gentlemen who acted with his Noble Friend opposite. He said in the same speech—:." I did previously, and I repeat it, that I now consider a liberal pro tection to domestic legislature indispensable." Now those were the speeches which Sir Robert Peel did not contemplate would be quoted against him in so brief a period. Sir Robert Peel a few years ago had said that he considered protection necessary to the preservation of the interests of the country at large as well as of those engaged in agriculture. That Right Hon. Gentleman had said, at the commencement of this ses. sion, that it would not be prudent to appeal to the country until the great question of Ireland was set at rest—( No, no) — and he called upon their Lordships to compel the Government to appeal to the country.—(Cheers). He had no hesitation in saying that it became the imperative ditty of their Lordships' House to let this question go to the people of England tr the purpose of deciding whether they were to have this new system palmed upon the country.—( Hear, hear.) It became their Lordships' duty to exercise the power which they possessed for protecting the interests of the poor people of this country who would be the most affected by the changes which were proposed to take place. It would be most im portant for their Lordships to preserve the good opinion of the people of this country in their Lordships' House, and that they should dismiss this measure upon the second reading, for the purpose of permitting the people of this country to express their opinion upon it.—(Cheers.) He could assure their Lordships as an humble individual of that House, that in his opinion, the only manner in which he could perform his public duty would be by voting against the second reading - of this Bill.—( The Noble Lord concluded amid loud cries of " Adjourn," from all parts of the House.) Lord BROUGHAM rose to explain—He said, your Lord ships will certainly allow me an explanation. lam quite aware that nothing can be more wearisome to your Lordships than explanations generally are. I can assure you, however, that this shall be a short one. Nothing could be more ridiculous than for me to be ashamed of having changed my opinions, with reference to the sliding-scale, during a period of 19 years. I wish just to state that I thought there was something ominous in my much esteemed Friend, bearing such an authoritative Part, as though he were stalking the quarter deck, and I were under his command, or perhaps I must rather say, treating rite as though I were an enemy under his guns.—( Laughter.) But when the Noble Lord began to read, what was it that he read ? It was that I was interrupted in what I was going to say, and that I said nothing.—(Laughter.) I was curious enough to inquire as to what this interruption arose from, and looked ac cordingly in these documents ( Hansard). The debate to which the Noble Lord referred me, was a debate of the 21st of March, 1827. My much-esteemed Friend, Lord Althorp, gave his support to the proposition of Mr. Canning, and said that it was a measure which, so far from producing mischusvous re sults. would produce great and lasting benefits to the country. both as e•garded its commerce, its trade, and its agriculture. He ( Lord Althorp) then proceeded to defend the proposed measure, and considered it as an improvement on the measure of 1815, and then proceeded to say, that a more general arrangement upon a higher and more per • manent footing would he desirable for the nation. " You must," said he, " see the n• cessity of placing the corn laws upon a more permanent footing." Some persons may think that Lord Althorn referee d at the time to an alteration in the then existing sliding-scale,but. I happen to know that his opinion was, that a more enlarged measure was desired ; and here I must say to your Lordships, that these reports arts not so full and accurate as the reports now are. The nonsense and ridicule which is here printed, some of it my own, is scarcely conceivable. In several instances tte word " oat " is kept out, and in another case the word "not " is inserted where it shonld not be. My Noble Friend Lord Wilton, on that occasion, rose to express his approbation of the me sure then before the Committee, without considering it perfect in its then present shape, or that it could be made better by inserting some amendments in Committee. This is quite consistent with the present conduct of my Noble Lords in this House, who might say, We would, in fact, rather not have the Bill, but we may, perhaps, introduce same amend ments in Committee. In reference to this proposition itself, I differed from some Hon. Gentlemen who had gone before me. These were agricultural Members. There were Lord Western, Colonel Wood, Mr. Port man, and others. Upon that occasion I said—now these are my words:— Although I would not now pledge myself to any opinion either of approval or disapproval, still there was one observation which I wished to make for the purpose of administering some alight comfort to those Honourable Gentlemen (ag ricultural Members) who had upon all occasions shown themselves at all times ready to take alarm at anything which they considered innovation." Then came the debate of March 9, and the whole of the argument was in favour of free trade, and I said (continued the Noble and Learned Lord, reading from Hansard) that whas ever were my sentiments concerning free trade, I should confine them to my own bosom, in order to escape the hostility of those who were opposed to its principle. Now was that an argument against the principle of free trade ?—( Hear, hear.) And it was not until I went farther in my advocacy of the advantages to be derived from free trade that I was interrupted by the coughing of which the reporter speaks. It was not without some diffi culties that I afterwards obtained a hearing, and I then ex pressed my hearty concurrence in the sliding-scale as a step in the right direction, and being founded on the principle of com mercial reform, for the Government had recently entered then upon an advocacy of the principles of free trade.—( Hear, hear.) And now what becomes of the Noble Lord's state ment ?—( Hear, hear.) The Earl of WICKLOW and Earl GREY rose at the same time. The Earl of WICKLOW moved the adjoarnmeat of the debate to Thursday next. _ Earl GREY moved the simple adjournment of the debate. A dispute here arose as to the precedency of the motion. The Earl of WICKLOW said he would persevere in his motion, and would take the sense of the House upon the point. Lord BROUGHAM said, I must move an amendment. The House, on this important matter, ought to sit on 'Wednes day. I will make this proposition, however, that the debate be concluded on Thursday. What will prevent us from sitting up till six o'clock in the morning. The Earl of WICKLOW said that he did not see anything to prevent their concluding the debate on Thursday night, or rather on Friday morning. Earl GREY said he believed that their practice was first to move that a debate be adjourned, and then to ascertain to what day it was to be adjourned. But considering the great import ; anie of this debate, and the anxiety with which the result of it was looked forward to by the country, ho slid think it would not be fitting to let _the country have it to say that this Hottse preferred m ) to and a mere amusement, (for it w_ Wednesday was not i.t;rn this debate for mere nooth Grant Dkbate.bui f t e e oh ') Yes, he would say, it arrtwehenagmedsaigtrnldeodanettdet usualh r : a nea l s i n lnos t fe e u: r hsr, ef s t t t hah s eenaa o sti td , h,o h umaf e stuet c hrw o n:a u :si‘ n ds. taa r d y yoe . inb, r:Wt l ce a t te. s idc,,. hade nothingbd e y n e : r y s b a , at d t h dh a: tme i posse•sion of the li s e io ofi r f i t i t /! :) , (s / the to a d d. iem until it had determined. and to nsthing wore. But if this deb ate were ag t wt o iniles b ucl e lane:n a mwk d uei j eld o rhe' u tmwt r : n oel e un d l;t:i t Cs o ic;ui rhitrsday, and riot end on that day, then it should be adjourned over the Whitsuntide holy days. The Marquis of CLANRICA RDE understood that the reason his Nob'e Frisnd ( Earl Grey) had moved the adjourn ment, was b"cau'e he wished to b, in the House on resumiug the debate. He could not Ste why they should not on Friday, after havir.g 4ttended the divine PrVieL The Duke of WELLINGTON said he could Fee no ob jection to the House Aitting• on Wednesday if they wshed to do so; but it had al, ays been the practice of the. Howe not to sit. on Friday, which was the anniversary of the restoration. Lord ASHBURTON was anxious to say a few words be fore this discuss , on shou.d close; but he had no objection to its to vninating on Thtusdly. The Earl of WICKLOW said he had put the motion in the way he did, because he learned that day that it was the in tention of the Noble Earl ( Earl Grey) to move that night at the dose of the debate, that the House do sit on Wednesday. He ( Lord Wicklow) therefore determined to have pre cedence of the Nole Earl, and therefore he thought it list to make he motion he had done. Having been put in posses‘Aon of the llou,ei he would not consent to give way to the Noble Earl, or waive the usual practice of the House unless they decided according to the suggestion of the Noble Marquis opposite. Should the motion he carried, he ( Lord Wicklow ) would claim his right to open the debate on Thursday. The D.ike of RICHMOND slid, perhaps the Noble Earl would go en now, and his Noble Friend could open the cl.iikte od Thursday evening. Earl GREY would give precedence now to the Noble Earl, and open the debate then.—( Laughter. ) Loid BROUGHAM hoped, if they adjourned till Thursday, they would endeavour to finish the debate that night. But as that might prove fallacious, he would iroimate, in order that it might be perfectly understood, that should the debate not he brought to a close he should move the adjourn mint till the day after. That would require them to attend church. But he could not see what harm attending the s ermon could do them, and there was no reason why Noble Lords should have any objection on that account. Lord CAMPBELL said it appeared 'hat the present dis pute was a struggle between 'iwo parties, which could only be determined by the majority of the Peers ; and as the settle ment of precedence might be attended by some difficulty, he would, in order to get rid of it, move that the Noble Lord, Ear 1 Grey, be now heard.—( Loud cheers.) The Earl of WICKLOW rose in a very excited state, and with violent gesticulation protested against the course now taken. He was proceeding to address the House when, from the cries of " Order, order," and noise that prevailed, he was obliged to sit down. . The LORD CHANCELLOR put Lord Campbell's amend ment, which was agreed to. Earl GREY then, amidst considerable laughter and cheers, moved that the debate be adjourned. The Earl of WICKLOW—UntiI Thursday next. The motion, with the addition of Lord Wicklow, was then pnt and agreed to, and the House adjourned at Two o'Clock till Thursday next. HOUSE OF COILUVIONS, May 26. The SPEAKER took the Chair at Four o'clock. MORAYSHIRE RAILWAY. The report on this Bill was brought up and agreed to, and the Bill ordered to be engrossed. GREAT NORTH OF SCOTLAND RAILWAY. The report on this Bill including the Fasten. Extension, was brought up and agreed to, and the Bill ordered to be engrossed. EDINBURGH AND NORTHERN RAILWAY. 'The report on this Bill (Branches from the Dundee and Arbroath Railway and Tay Ferry Improvement) was brought up, and the Bit ordered to be engrossed. NORTH KENT RAILWAY. Mr. RICE, on the further consideration of the report of the South Eastern Railway ( Greenwich Railway to Chilhain, near Canterbury with branches, No. 2,) Bill, moved that the Bill, together with the North Kent Railway Bill, be re-com mitted to the full Committee as orkinally constructed. The North Kent Railway had been condemned before its merits had been thoroughly investigated by the Committee ; and the South Eastern Company, which was the only company that could properly carry out the line, would be perfectly jostified, under the present circumstances, in studying their own in terests in preference to the convenience of the public, by not cart ying out the contemplated extension of their line. Mr. PROT EROE defended the decision of the Committee, of which he was chairman, on the North Kent Railway. As chairman, he had felt it his painful duty to give a casting vote against the further progress of the Bill, as it contemplated the construction of a railwa% through part of Greenwich Park. Upon this instance. as upon many others, be found the benefit of the reports of the Beard of Trade; and the Committee considered that the South-Eastern line was far preferable to the North Kent. The Committee hail been sitting from the middle of March to the middle of May, and they had given the whole scheme their utmost attention ; and he deprecated the investigation of such subjects in the House, as it would tend very much to weaken the au.hority of the Committee. Mr. BAILLIE supported the motion. The Committee had passed a Bill which gave power to the Admiralty to stop the progress of the railway at whatever point they chose. He did not know what the shareholders would say to such a Bill. Sir ROBERT INGLIS said he was aware of the inconve nience which would arise from a serut ny of the decisions of Committees, but unless it could be proved that Committees were immaculate, he considered that the House was the last tribunal of appeal. He believed that a cisturbance sufficient to destroy the accuracy of an astronomical observation would be produced by the passing of railway trains. He thought the Bill, if recommitted, should be referred to another Committee. He grounded his objections against the Bill, not beciuse it did not afford a direct communication to the coast, but the in jury it would cause to science in passing so close to the Ob:er vatory. Sir JOHN RAE REID presented a petition from Dover, signed by the mayor and burgesses, in favour of the line. Fir GEORGE COCKBURN said that an application had been made by the North Kent Railway Company to the Admi ralty to ascertain whether they had any objection to the railway passing through the park. Vast powers had been given to the Admiralty to regulate the trains, or to step them altogether. The Admiralty had no objection to allow the line to pass through Greenwich Park, provided the interests and the observations of the Observatory were not affected. The Company had assented to make such regulations as would prevent this mischief,sand the Admiralty had accordingly with drawn their opposition. Mr. T. DUNCOMBE—The fact - was that this matter had passed through the Committee by every small majority, consist ing in fact of himself, who it was well known was able to act in a double capacity, and it was on the faith of his statement that this decision had been come to.(Laughter.) The Hon. Gentleman it appeared had a very great taste for the pic turesque, and had accordingly proposed the carrying of this line through Greenwich Park. He had accordingly gone down to survey the line himself, and had no doubt dined there—(Laughter)—with all the appliances of a gentlemanly entertainment. ( Continued laughter.) On his return he had waited upon the Admiralty to give the results of his observations, and it was upon his representation, and he might say, that of the South Eastern Company, that the Honourable and Gallant Admiral's report was founded. The truth was, that the Smith Eastern Company were at the bottom of this decision of the Admiralty ; for they were themselves desirous of making this line. Now, it should be observed that Professor Airy had not been called before the Committee at all, but he had expre-sed his opinion that in the experiments he had made the transit of the trains would in no way affect the observa tions of the Observatory. The North Kent Company had employed Professor Robinson and another gentleman to make experiments, and they had given it in as their decided opinion that no public inconvenience would ensue. The North Kent Company, therefore, had decided upon running their trains through the park by means of a tunnel. Lord EMLYN was a member of the Committee, and he had art ived at his decision on public grounds solely. He could not see any reason why the Bill should be committed again. They had not refused to hear any evidence, nor had any alle gation been made that such was the case. In fine, he con sidered a recommitment of the Bill would not lead to any public good, and he would, in consequence, object to it. Mr. HUME considered that the members of the Committee had not acted wisely or properly in their conduct, and he would therefore vote for the motion. Mr. PLUMPTRE said that the Astronomer Royal had satis fled himself that no injury would result to the Observatory if the line were constructed, and at any rate the South-Eastern Company had a"ceded to the conditions required from them, being satisfied that the danger apprehended would not arise. Lord GRANVILLE SOMERSET moved that the debate he adjauraed for a fortnight, in order that the Aemiralty might have further time to consider. Mr. C. Wt 4)0 seconded the motion. Mr. J. 0 CONNELL protes'ed againe some observations that had been made in consequence of the Hon. Chairman having consulted the Admiralty on the subject. He did so at the especial request of the Committee. Mr. JER VI S did not object to the adjournment of the debate. This matter ought not unquestionably to be left open be tween the North Kent and S•iuth- Eastern. The whole matter, including the North Kent Bill, should be again remitted to the Committee, in order that the discrepancy complained of might be explained and got rid of. After a short discussion the further consideration of the subject was deferred for a fortnight. NORTH KENT RAILWAY. Mr. REID presented a petition from Dover, in favour of this Bill. Several Reports of Railway Committees were brought up. CALEDONIAN INSURANCE COMPANY. This Bill was read a third time and na.sed. BRISTOL WATER WORKS. This Bill was also read a third time and passed. Mr. H. BERKELEY moved that the petition of George Whieldon, Esq., be referred to the Committee to whom the London and Birmingham Railway (Coventry to Nuneaton) Bill stands referred, and that the petitioner be heard by his counsel, agents,and witnesses, notwithstanding his petition was not presented three clear days before the day appointed for the first meeting o the Committee. EAST AND WEST YORKSHIRE JUNCTION RAIL- WAY BILL Mr. LAWSON moved that this Bill, be further considered. Sir G. CLERK wished to call the attention of the House to the maximum charges in this Bill, which were higher than those generally charged. Mr. LAWSON said be was not aware that such was the fact. The Bill was then adjourned ; and the same How. MEMBER moved the second reading of the Knaresborough and Leeds and Thirsk Railway Bills, and the Harrogate Gas Bills, which were agreed to. On the motion of Mr. LAWSON, also, the Dublin and Kirepton Railway Extension Bill was read a second time. Mr. EW ART brought up the report of the Manchester and Birmingham Extension Railway Bill. Lord DALAIENEY brought up the report of the London and Birmingham Extension Railway Bill. Sir C. DOUGLASS brought up that of the Reading, Guild ford and Reigate Railway Bill. Mr. E. Venison, Lord Morpeth, Mr. Hindle'', M oI r: Ag lionbv, and several other Members, brought up reports rail way tills. Mr. SPOONER moved that the standing or der No. 12 1 be suspended, in the case of the amendments prop osed to lie made St a mford, and Birming on the third reading of the Boston, been given in the Private hamilailway Bill, of which notice had Bill Office. KENNINGTON LANE LIGHTING BILL. On the motion of Mr. HA WES,this Bill was read a second time. Mr. GREENEsaid useless to oppose the progress o f this Bill, but a great i p üblic t w as inconvenience arose from th e anomaly in the clauses of private Bills, of which a not a bl e ex ample was present ed in that before the House ; and he thought a grea t improvement might be made in the practice of our - pri vate legislation , if some uniform rule we re t o be adooted for framing the clauses of private Bills, which interfered with Pro perty. After a few words from Mr. HAWES, Mr. HUME said the House ought to put a stop to this irre gular kind of legislation. In one town in the kingdom sixty private Acts were in force ; and two Acts were passed in one year which contradicted each other ; and, therefore, the general law of the land was over-riAlen by enactments passed without sufficient deliberation. There ware two authorities in the same town, which awarded different punishment for the same otrmce. He con , idiled that these facts were suffi cient to justifying him in calling upon the House , top the further progress of this WI until the Committee were enabled to make their report, which would take place in about fourteen days.--( Hear, hear. After a shell dtscu:sion the further consideration of the B:11 was pe,tponed for a fort night. The following Bills were read a second time : Edinburgh and Northern Railway ( Branches from the Dundee , and Arbroath Railway and Tay Ferry Improvement). Edinburgh and Northern Railw‘y ( Strathearn Deviation ). Edinburgh and Northern - Raiivvay (Neviport Railway and Saint Andrew's Branch). Artnatik awl Forfar Itailwai! NoriTll KENT RAILWAY. Sir ROBERT INGLIS wished to knew whether hie Right Hon Frivnit at the head of the Government would have any objection to the evidence of scientific men being taken during the interval of the postponement of the North Kent Railway Bill? Sir ROBERT PEEL replied, that in a.communication he had received from the Admiralty. they had expressed a wish that evey investigation calculated to throw light on the subject should be gone into. He ( Sir Robert Peel) concurred in their wish. Mr. SMITH O'BRIEN moved for copies of the corres pond, nee in which he had been engaged during his late incar ceration. and also for a copy of the letter which he bad ad dressed to the Speaker. ADJOURNMENT OF THE HOUSE. Sir R. PEEL moved, that the House at its rising do adjourn till Thur.clay next, and, in reply to an observation of an Hon. Member. continued to say, that on a former occasion, he had stated it as his intention to move the adjournment of the House from Friday to the Thurday following; but some Hon. Gentlemen having intimated to him that it would suit their convenience better if the House were adjourned from Friday until the following Friday, he had thought proper to comply with their intimation. Lord JOHN RUSSELL expressed his concurrence with the motion of the Right Hon. Gentleman. WEST INDIA COLONIES. Mr. HUME intimated his intention of bringing forward, on Friday, next his re , olutinns with respect to the agricultural resources of the British West India colonies, and to the re strictive policy pursued towards those Colonies. VAN DIE‘IEN'S LAND. Mr. EWART moved that it was expedient that the present system of making the colony of Van Die men's Land a general receptacle for convicts should cease ; and that it was expedient, that transportation be no longer maintained as a punishment, but be continued only as a supplement to the previous punishment of imprisonment. The Hon. Member then proceeded to quote a variety of doe.u ments to show that up to 1840 the population, the shipping, Ate imports and exports, the places of worship and education of Van Diemen's Land, had gradually been increasing, and that the colony had then arrived at its greatest state of prosperity. A change, however, then took place, which caused the most prejudicial effects. The moral consequences that resulted soon manifested themselves, and the abominable and unutterable scenes which were at present to be witnesses' in that island defied description or even conception. The Hon. Member was about to quote some statements he had before him relative to this moral degradation, when An Hors. MEMBER. moved that the House be counted. Strangers were ordered to a ithdraw, and there being only 27 Members present, the House adjourned till Thursday. LAW INTELLIGENCE. COURT OF QUEEN'S BENCH, May 26. (Sittings in Banco.) . . - LOWE V. PENN. The Court gave judgment in this tree to-day. It was argued fully on Friday, and was one in which was involved the question of an alleged infringement of a patent invontion for propelling steam vessels by insane of an improvement upon the original Archimedian screw. The public are already familiar with the fa-ts of the case, as they have already been published several times. The Court granted a rule for a new trial, and then proceeded to try cases at Nisi Prins. They were all either undefended cases, or actions upon bills of ex champ of no interest to any bet the parties concerned. POLICE INTELLIGENCE. MANSION-HOUSE. The following ea s excited a great deal of public interest. Thomas Richards, (Policeman 486,) and Henry Kirby, money-taker to the London and Westminster Steam-boat Company (wooden boats), were summoned before Alderman Gibbs, for having used insulting and obscene words to Mr. Charles Funge, an otlicer of the Vice-Chancellor of England. Mr. Shadwell, the son of the Vice-Chancellor, and several other gentlemen were present during the investigation. Kirby, upon being asked whether he was guiity or not guilty, said "Partly guilty and partly not guilty." Mr. hinge stated that on Friday last he took the boat (the Primrose) from Westminster to Landon •bridge, and waited 4 , 11 the dumb lighter on which he had landed for half an hour or more, and upon leaving it he was accosted by Policeman 456, who said to him " You had better be oft; the other one is gone. We have many such as you about here, and you had better go." Witness asked what the policeman meant by addressing him in that mariner, and said If I have done any thing wrong by remaining about the lighter, you should have came and spoken to me in a proper manner, and told me that I was doing wrong." Witness left the place, but not feeling eatistiel returned with a penny in his hand, went to Kirby, the money-taker, and offered him the penny, determined to return to Westminster, and to find out the meaning of such conduct. Kirby, however, refused to take the money, and b erred that he had warned the witness off before. Alderman Gums—Had Kirby told you to leave the place before? Mr. Funge—lle, as well as the policeman, had warned me off. Kirby said, "The other one is gone, you are a pickpocket." lof course indignantly denied the truth of the accusation, told him that I was known to many people in the City, and mentioned Mr. Geldham's name, as a gentle man who was probably known to him. He said he did not care. I offered hint my ca. d, but he said he did not want my card, and he refused to take it. I then requested the police man to go with me to several gentlemen, to whom I referred, in the City, but he refused to gs, stating that it was out of his beat. I was refused permission to go on hoard. On Saturday Mr. Peters, Mr. Goldham, jun., and myself, went down to the pier to see whether Kirby inteded to make any acknowledg ment or apology for his conduct, but that person said he did not at all care about it, refused to give his name, or the name of the secretary to the company. to whom application might he made for redress, and behaved in an extremely gross and unbecoming manner. Aldermats Gines—What have you to say in answer to the charge, Kirby ? Kirby—l was, my Lord, busily en gaged in taking money for the London and Westminster Steam-boat Company, when this policeman (Richards) came and said that one of the swell mob was on the lighter, and he then pointed out the gentleman who made the complaint as another of the swell mob. I heard an altercation between the gentleman and the policeman, and when the gentleman offered the money to pay his passage to Westminster, refused to take it, as the officer had told me he was a pickpocket. Alderman GlBBs—Policeman, what have you to say ? Richards—l was called down by the pier master to make two persons leave the pier, and he pointed out one whom knew well, Bill Dunn one of the gang at the Elephant and Castle. He also pointed to the gentleman who has made the complaint. I asked Bill Dunn it he knew the complainant; and he said that he knew no party whether he knew them or not. I told the gentleman, thinking that he was a com panion of the person I knew to be one of the swell m b, that lie had no business to wait there, and I then went to Kirby, mad told him to mention to the captain that one of the swell mob, meaning the other person, whom I knew to be a bad character, was about the place; but I never said the gentle . - man was one of the class. Kirby—l certainly said the gentleman was a pickpocket; and I said so upon the information of Richards, who declared that such certainly was the case. Alderman GIBBS (to the policeman)—Did you see a pick pocket speaking to this gentlemsn? Richards—No; but I cad produce a witness who did. Edward Jones, (the policeman's witness) who stated that he was a wateh-maker in Bermondsey, and he was on the pier at the time the circumstance occurred. He heard not a word of abuse, but he saw a person close to the gen tleman, and he thought be saw them speak together. The other person, whom he supposed to be a pickpocket, he saw moving about the gentleman very much for a long time, but he was not sure that they spoke together. Mr. Goldham, jun., said, that on the Saturday of the oc currence, Kirby, upon bring called upon by him and other friends of Mr. Funge, behaved in the most bullying and in solent manner, refused to give his name, or the name of the secretary, to apologise or explain, and said again that Mr. Fine was a pick-ie cket. Kirby solemnly declared that he did not know Mr. Gold am at the time. The policeman called Another p rson, who, he said, was capable of giving evidence for the defence. Thomas Still, who stated as wall as he could, that he was pier-macer at the Old Shades pier, when the transaction took Dine, then stogy d terwar.l. Alderman GIBBS—W,II, what have you to say ? Witness —I have to say that it was on Sunday last. Alderman Glans-011 Sunday !ast ! Witness—Yes ;on Sunday it was that it happened.—(Great laughter.) Alderman GIBBS—WeII, I certainly shall not take your evidence as to a transaction of Sunday for what happened on, Fm law. (Witness looked stupidly at the Bench.) Alderman GIBBS—Are you quite sober? Witness—Sober ! oh, dear, yes.—(Laughter.) Alderman GIBBS—As I have said upon former occasions, while it is the duty of the magistrates to protect the police in the just and proper discharge of their duty, it is equally his duty to inflict punishment for the very injurious offence of exceeding the bounds prescribed to the force. It is evi dent that you, Richards, have acted in this case-in a very unwarrantable manner. You saw a person, whom you knew to be a thief, following about this gentleman, of whom you knew nothing, and in all probability tor the purpose of rob ing him, and at the same time that you let the notorious thief go, you condemn this gentleman as a pi c kp oc k e t, a nd refuse to let him:avail himself of the opportunity, by identi fication, to show that there was no foundation for the suspicion. Kirby has, through your representation, narrowly escaped a serious difficulty, but as he acted upon information which, if correct, would have completely sanctioned his con duct, I discharge him. Richards—My Lord, I never told Kirby the gentleman was a pickpocket, for I never knew any thing of the kind. I never knew the gentleman. Alderman GIBBS—I fine you, Richards, twenty for this very gross act, and I hope the decision will shillings arefii have its effect upon those individuals of the force who too for ward. Kirby—l humbly beg the gentleman accept my apology I offer it to him e sit% re t h justice- room. Mr. Funge and his friends then BO TV- TREE 7: gentleman's If he will at the bar for final examination, charged Farr was of iNeird.eajlo-sbeopxh containingd,aovfakioenty: Ann Newland, with receiving the charged with stealing a of articles, the them to have been stolen. same, well knowing conducted the prosecution, and Mr. Mr. 13allantine . tague-square ; and Maril property Robin son attended for the prisoners. Some further evidence in corroboration of that given on the previous examination having been heard, Mr. Mathew Blackiston, an engineer, residing in Trafal gar-square, stated that he also was travelling on Good Fri day by the mail train, and left the Euston• square station at about a quarter before nine o'clock, having the case of en gineering implements which be left on the platform ; and on arriving at Birmingham he missed it nor did he again see it until it was i n p ossession of the (file' ers. proved The property h av i ng been by the officers to have been found i n Sloane-street, the prisoners were fully com mitted, bail having been refused for their appearance. BIRTHS On the lith inst., at Athol-crescent, Edinburgh, the lady of Captain Lyon, of a daughter. On the 20th inst., at the Nunnery, Isle of Man, the Itdy of Lieute nant-o,lmnd (lade Taubman, of a son. On the 22d inst., the lady of Edward Turst Carver, Eeq., of a daight,.r. On the 22d inst., at Forest ll.mse, ll:lnfield, the lady of Captain F Moor, of a son. nIED. of On HI , 24th , Richmond-park, the Countess Dowag er Dunmore. Reif" On the 221 , f March,at Chukkoke, Ensign James Laing, 15th meat of hull: try. On the 21;111 of sarch, at Kassowlee, Lieutenant-Colonel 3lgiregS Barr. C. 8.. 29th Regiment. on the 20th Inst., the Rev. Joshua Hird, D.D., Rector of Moncton, and Vie:ir 01 Eflingliam, Hants, aged 77. OA the 22..! hist , at Choltenhant, Miss Frances Gillman. On tin , 2241 lust., at llnrworth, near Darlington, 31k4s Mars aged 42. a'f On the 23d at Tunbridge-wells, Catherine Alexandrina , of Dr. Nelson. On t!'t '24th inst., at rimlar, Captain William Jones , o f her Ma jesty', ship : enelope. r • init., in Van!, r.. 4 -li-tt,we, -10,eatti, A. 1 - onng.. ",c 250! t., no: , iie ot Mr. Jun Back, of Queen s. r 0.4 !,:)I,:ion . by lititraDO TOITNU, of No. 112, Strand, l'ilute;', at The Sun Office, Nu. 112, Strand. in cue .rreolnet of the SaTen 111 e COLILIty Q ZlOAltiog. Weditigir , . TilE SUN, LONDON, WEDNESDAY EVENING, MAY 27, 1846.