The Sun. — London, England, 1823-10-01 00:00:00

r * O!' - (Z),‘,7*, Nugum:. 9705• Town Hall, Maraat, Svc. 28, 1833. AGENERAL ASSEMBINT of the COM PA.NY of PROPRIETORS of MARGATE PIER, and HARBOUR will be holden at the TOWN HALL, MARGATE,,on MONDAY, the 20th clay of OCTOBER NEXT, at Eleven o'clock in tie forertoon By Order of the Directora. • STEPHEN SAUKETT CHANCELLOR, Clerk. ROYM.-EXCEIANGE Atis'lllANCE OFFICE. Established by Royal Charter, in the Reign of King George the First. September, 1823. IDERSONB, *. whose animal Premiums fall due on the 29th instant, arc hereby informed, that - Receipts are now ready to be delivered at the Compariv's Offices, over the Royal Exchange and in Pall-Mull, as well as by their re ipettire Agents if the several Counties ; and the Parties'as cured arc requested to apply for the Renewal of their Poll on or before the 14th of October'next, as the usual Fif trealDays allowed for Payment, beyond the date of each Po , will then expire. • SAMUEL FENNINO, .Tun. Secretary. Attendance is given, daily, at the MIA ()fli t :es, for the k..kitrance of Ilaildirigs, Goods, Merchandises, and Ships. ,Har'aour, in Duck, or while Building, from Loss or Da- Yire ; and also for the Asstaatwe of, anti granting on. Lives. Eire PolicisilAelljle issued free of Experice to the As- cooed, * here the Aritittui Preluitint autauuts to tic. or up verie4s. 11. EA I, TUItKEY CARPETS: ripilE NOIIII,PrY, GENTRY, and Others, ill ute most respectfully inforined, that several Bales of very superior quality and colours are just imported, and will t be'snld at very reduced prices,' from Eight Guineas upwards, warranted free from damage ; several thousand yards of the very beat 1111,LISSEIS CARPETING, of last year's pat , • teens, at sa. per and ; short lengths and singe pieces from 4s. 6d. per yar d; other sorts of Carpeting Dr - iggets, &c. equally cheap. he best Painted Floor Milts, 25 per cent. under the Manufacturer's prices. Whitehall Carget Warehouse, 31, Charing.eruss. This Day was publiidicti, • In Three Volumes Imperial quai°, price .£2l in boards, Dedicated , by permission, to his Majesty, ACRITICAL INQUIRY into ANCIENT ARMOUR; as' it csitted in EUROPE, but particu. lull( in ENGLAND, from the Norman Conquest to the Reign of King Charles It. , with 's Glossary of Military Terms or the Middle Ages, embellished 'trial 70 coloured and 10 out. Lined plates 20 illuminated Capital Letters, &c. SAIIUEL RUST 111EYRICK, LLD. and F.S.A. London Printed for Robert Jenniigs, 2, Poultry ; and sold by John Gale, 6 , Bruton.street, all other Booksellers. Subscribers are requested to Make Arty applications for tb:-.ir Copies through their BoOkitellers. Ever anxious to Prevent Impositioa, AY and MARTIN respectfully inform the Public they bare, alter much labour, ono at eery cunoidersibit 'splice, (trough to perfection tt ! taltel of such singular construetion and extreme difficulty of execution. that they trust will effectually prevent the niany frauds that are daily practised ou the Public. An attentlf..n to thifol. lowing descriptiqu of the Label will ensure the GENUINE BLACKING prepared by them. A pattern like lace, of a pink colour, corers the principal part of tire Label; the Names of DAY and MARTIN are printed in white letters, edgy' with pink and black, and placed on a white . ground ; the address, 97, High Holborn, is also white letters edged with•pink and black, 'but placid on the lace pattern, the sigpature and price at foot are black-on a white grounds Ike p4bahle and Sirretidits for use are printed as before, black letters on white around. • a';'„ fligh Soptenilier, 1823. Mlt. ()WEN, Mit. MENZIES, THE' PEE'SBYTERY OF lAN.A.BIC AND TILE OENEIAL ASSEMBLY OF SCOTLAND. TO THE EDITOR OF THE OLAPOOW CHRONICLE. Sig—l have read with attention the various communications which have of late appeared in your paper, containing strictures on the character of the villagers of New Lanark, and on the conduct of my father, Mr. Owen • and I fled myself perssnally appealed to , by the Rev. Mr. Welker, in his last letter. ' That Gentleman does me only,jastice in be lieving that I Shall not fear again-to come forward, or shrink from corroborating what I have already asserted. 'Before proceeding to some observations, which I beg leave to oti'er on the two letters which were inserted in your Paper of the 16th inst.:, and answering the more immediate appeal mad.e to me by Iklr. Walker, I must solicit the indulgence of your "Readers, *mad I he betrayed into greater length than I could wish, if 9 shorter reply were consistent with the full and ' 'distinct manner in which the subject requires to be treated. And, to begin with a few remarks on the first of theie letters r.. . M Lamb objects - to* my father's religion, that it ii one which inculcates only charity, and requires merely''* reciproca. tion of kind :muds and kind offices, to the " disruption of emery the by which men have hithert o been bound-and bless ed." The peifect consistency of the concluding commentary I altall not impegn, by inquiring whether that reciprocation be not itself one Of the strongest of those ties, but shall merely .ailr Mr. Lamb whether he has not heard of the almost In stantaneous affects produced on the most. hardened of the Newgate criminals, by a steadily pursued system of kindness ; and whether he had not, at the time he expressed the above opinion, left Cut of view an exposition of the erects of cha rity on the conduct, which he will find in the Scriptures.--- "Charity stffereth long, and is kind; charity envteth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up ; (loth not behave herself unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily pro voked; thinlieth no evil; rejoiceth not in iniquity, but re. gsolceth in the truth ; heareth all things, believeth all things , opeth all thin, endureth all things." Any one therefore who professes a religion even of mere charity, and acts con.. SigebtlY With such a profession, will suffer many things be. fore he results to extreme measures; and even then, his interference *ill be in the spirit of kindness; ho will nut envy his neiebour'S character, nor his neighbour's success; he will never taunt himself, as considering his testimony alone worthy of criit, nor be so puffed up as at once to reject the testimony of 'those who may differ with him in opinion • he will not behaviihimself unseemly, or ever descend to low ab u se, for be will nut be easily provoked, and even violence, on the Part of his opponents, will not call forth similar conduet on his part ; lie will . never seek either his own aggrandizement, or that of his party, iv ; the expence of others ; he will not thick evil of any one, exec; it with the - most unquestionable prods before him. nor e ' er insinuate any thing to the disa dvantage of a single ft; creature, it any, even the slightest dout, remain in his 1 that such insinuation may unjustly asperse tile chart r of 'that fellow-creature; he will never re joice in tl niquity, either of his friends or his enemies, but will rejoice in the truth of whatever tends to • vindicate their prim iples or their conduct; ,lie will bear with his opponents; he will hope and believe the best, and will en dure much rather than injure any one. Now surely a religion, / the practical influence of which is to form such a character, sisould not be put , down unexamined, or rejected as being merely a 1.4 ligion col charity. Ido esteem and profess such a religion. 1 know that it has effectually excluded from my mind those "claviical reminiscences," lets pure and charitable than poetical, ' hich have invaded that of .Nlr. lamb. I, too, have walked out on a Sunday evening ;. but, in the quiet and cheer , tut denulinour of the villagers, and in the happy faces of the children; and young people, I have discovered no trace, either of itepre , per mirth or " unseemly dalliance;' and. simply be cause I did not, in cull individual I met, look for, or expect to find it. had I been tattled upon to assign a reason for such cialet dlieerfulness, I should have sought for it in the dream: atanciii which had exempted these people front the operation of the inivident motives to anxiety or dejection, and in the ex liiii ting effects' of a fine summer's evening . , when all nature is s til l and besutiful. I myself experienced the same cheerful fee,„:,„3; and charity forbad my attributing the existence of these, in the minds of others, to a different caus er e from that which created them in my own. I blush for the clergyman in wliose mind, some other motive seemed necessary ; and who comid 'yen wren a still blacker insinuation against the female part of our population—an insinuation that I cannot believe was countenanced or approved of by any other member than himself, of the body to which he belortgs, and far which I should be sorry ever to lose my present respect. Mr. Lamb concluded this paragraph, which I trust he has, before now, repented of having written, with a ttite observa tion : " Verbum sat sapie.nti. ' A word is indeed enough, Mr. Lamb, either with the wise or with the foolish, to insinuate what volumes cannot prove. May I ask what would have been your own feelings, had I insinuated as much on hearsay against your parishioners, you yourself being at the same time morally certain that it was a charge utterly unfounded, particularly it I acknowledged that a Sunday evening walk. or a passing report, was the authority on which I had made it. • And here I must remark how much trouble ail the Gen tlemen who haye attacked us would have saved themselves, had they been disposed to put a natural and candid construction on the conduct of the villagers, and on that of those who have sup ported my father's plans, and advocated Isis principles. A little penetration would then have enabled them to discover many things, which seem entirely to have escaped their obser ration. As for instance they. would have considered.: That the schools have always been open to all strangers, that no attempt was ever made to conceal what was going on from any one who would take the trouble to make the necessary enquiries ; that my father never dieguisad even his private opinions, although he was well aware that their promulgation might 'each* the opposition he now meets with. and create"n - codueis l and 41$' trust in die minds of many of our neighbours, which mot b equally unpleasant to them and to us. Thee would have asked themselves, whether a person, who halt uniformly acted thus, was likely to conceal or hush up any thing which has beeh done here. • They could not have failed to discover that, even had my father's principles allowed him to deceive the public with regard to his real opinions, he certainly would never have made the statement that, to admitting the Bible into the schools, he did RO, " not indeed because he regarded it as a proper school-book, but in compliance with' what he conceived to be the wishes of the parents." No, had there been any desire to deceive the world, my father would have carefully withheld that opinion, and taken to himself the credit of having wished that the youngest children should regu larly read the scriptures, and of having rhos produce in our population that extreme regard for religion which they daily evince. In short, these gentleman would never have accused ,him of affecting popular views or popular conduct, because the imputation is most completely at variance with every other see don of his life. Such is the " presumptive evidence" against the supposition, that my father ever issued any prohibitory order, an evidence which appeared to the teachers so strong, that only one of theta obeyed the supposed prohibition; and so decisive to Mr. Clegg that he at once, without deeming it necessary to consult with my father at all, countermanded an alleged order, Which he knew could never have been really given. As to the positive evidence, it now becomes necessary that it should be directly brought forward. The only two teachers with whom the committee of the Prea t ti:ey had any conversa tion during their last visit to. our schoolss, inform me that they intend forwarding you a statement, containing the principal facts which have come under their observation. Front Mr.. Metttlell, who was heatl.master at the period when the mistake originated, you will receive a letter which, he tells me, was pre sented to you for insertion about the time my father's letter ap. peered, but which you then declined publishing, as being ren. dered unnecessary by that letter. These documents would have appeared at once, had we been aware of the degree of scepti cism evinced by the Rev. Gentlemen who have taken up this matter, a scepticism that I fear Molt be ottributed to the want of that charitable construction, which I have already remarked that they withhold, when judging of the actions of their oppo. news. Otherwise they would have inferred that those who AVOW principles, unsupported either by the general voice of the people, or by the authority of the church, when such an avowal cannot answer one interested purpose, but exposes to the most, heavy and grievous charges,—ate the last persons who can, with any shadow of justice, be accused of insincerity. Nothing but the most strict regard to truth and to sincerity could have in. diced them to act as they have done. And; being themselyes sincere, they are unwilling to impute want of sincerity to others. We have never, for instance, insinuated that the let tere in which our characters and conduct are aspersed, are hot the productions of those whose signatures are *teethed to them, because whatever our opponents may imagine to the contrary, we are conscious how groundless the charge is against oit vitiate. Sie have never hastily meddled with the partimilsr private opi. nions of any of these gentlemen, because we were willing to believe that whatever they might be, they bath adopted them after maturely weighing the evidence of their truth and • falsehood, as we had done before adopting any of ours. We considered such allusions as irrelevant to the point in ques tion. Not so sonic of our adversaries. lam accused of having " unhesitatingly avowed my disbelief both in the Old anti New Testament," and of " considering the Scriptures as a coin. pilation of falsehood, a history of injustice, violence, and treachery, calculated to mislead and pervert the human under standing." - Nor is this the first time that such a charge has been publicly made against me. TIII now I deemed it unne cessary to reply to it, both on account of its irrelevancy, and because I thought the public would be neither interested nor edified by lesrning what were my private opinions ; but a longer silence would be construed either into a tacit admission of the truth of this statement, or imputed to a fear of frankly anti honeitly avowing my real statements. To avoid the false deductions which nught be made both to my own and to my father's disadvantage to either case, I shall venture upon what, under other circumstances, might have !seen considered an un necessary and obtnisiva expression of my sentiments. I have heard many arguments advanced for and against the authen ticity of the Scriptures, and I do acknowledge myself as yet unable to decide between them. Indeed, I consider it pre sumptuous in a reon of my age to decide dogmatically on a subject upon whh the greatest minds the world has produced are at issue--a eubject, the importance of which, in what ever other respects I may be ih error, I have never either un dervalued or overlooked ; and upon which, I hope, at some future period, I shall be enabled to form a more decided opinion. Whether I may be allowed to doubt, on such a subject, I consider to be a question .similar to that of whether I may be alloued to Mink at 011. I admit it to be a possible case that I might be prevented from expressing these sentiments, but I am equally conscious, that nothing but arguments, which shall convince me of 'their error, can ever prevent my holding them. I may be accused, for I know the spirit that is abroad, of beggingahe question, but I myself feel—and those who can distinguish sincerity front hypocrisy, will believe the asser tion—that were this the last tnoment of my existence, 1 could give no other opinion. I may add that were there many sincere Christiana, and 1 trust there are not, who would seem to evince so little charity or candour in their proceeding*, as I cannot help observing in the letters which are now before us, I should be obliged either toutttribute their conduct to a most unfortu. nate combination of circumstances like the present, which had hidden the truth completely from their eyes, or I might be tempted thence to deduce, however reluctantly, an argument against a system in which such conduct and such language could originate. The sentiments imputed to me, or any similar opinions, I can distinctly and positively deny ever having uttered ; and that simply because I have been taught to regard the most rigid adherence to truth as the greatest of virtues, and because I have never been in the habit of expressing any other than my reap sentiments and opinions. • I now come to the point which regards 'alr. Menzies's " ex postulation." This is obviously a question of memory be tween Mr. Menzies and my father, because no third person was p r esent at the time. Now that I can say on the subject, from personal knowledge, is, that my father never mentioned any such expostulation `to me, which I think he would have done, had it produced on his mind the impression which I should have anticipated. 1 observe, too, that although Mr. Menzies, in his first letter, states that he " expostulated with Mr. Owen on the interdiction of the Scriptures, on which oc casion, so far from denying or endeavouring to explain it away, by alleging misapprehension on the part of. the teachers, he justified his conduct ;'• yet he subsequently, through the me dium of Mr. Lamb, explains to tet that this expottialation and justification consisted in his (Mr. Menzies'e) inquiring; whether Mr. Owen " had prohibited the Scriptures from being read in the school," anti in my father's replying, " I will direct the Superintendent to inform you what is done." Now, with regard to Mr. Lamb's strictures on the facts which my father considered it necessity to state concerning Menzies 's clerical visits to the village. These facts were ad duced, not from any wish to atinek Mr. 341'e characterin a cle rical capacity, in which case Mr. L's defence, and the reasons he gives why Mr. Mallets has for some time been obliged to , \\\VII.P, ,-4 \s'' 'I!--..' •'`...,' LtN ' frt•—•.-=-.' (0 --, i .--,... ,-:..---',. 1.. ... -' ~, 4 '14 1 ...... : .;: : :,0„ , , i„„..,: , ... 0 -,4, . Pr . -- - 41 ~A. -' , its, 4 - AZ ~ ~, ..-- • ' 0 Alit . :::: :; ;- :1 : 1 ....,41,,, .:1 4 1 , , , .. ,, r ^ : ,, i.,,, ,, r 1 ,, , ir,, , ..i: ; .i. I `., V ZiTIZIOA , . . :',:' - I, • :.:.. , SUN. WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 1, 1823. dbcontinue his usual visitations, weilid have item Wo per place, but merely Co show that Mr. Mete4i.ee could not be considered a competent judge eithe( of the moral state of the village, or of the management of our schools. Now, it is evi dent that the question here of competency or incompetency, is in nowise affected by the reasons, whether good or hod, which occasioned an alteration in Mr. Menziea's former plan of pro ceedings. Mr. - Lamb objects to the system pursued in our schools. The school-house is, to be mire, he says,.a eery commodious one, and the school is liberally supported by the conmeny ; the children are 'taught singing And denCing, the usefulness of which he acknowledges; and he was eadsneti with their pro. grass, till within a short time, since which their religious and moral instruction particularly, has been sadly neglected, a " new fashioned and facinating mode" has been adopted of instructing the children in " a few showy things." such as an. cient and modern history, geography and natural history. To natural hbeory he especially objects, tta " teaching children facts concerning the habits of !Wile foreign animals, which they have no chance of ever seeing." Ile concludes by expressing his opinion " that such information will only disqualify them for discharging with contentment acrd fidelity the duties; of the station which they may be destined to occupy " Mr. Lamb is quite 'killing that the lower claws should learn to read and write, for this is not actual inforrnation,,battnerely the medium through which informaticin may hisocquired ; only he ninst object to their ever applying it to such a purpose, because the knowledge of any facts, which tin not come under their imme diate observation, can only serve to make theta dishonest and discontented. Mr. Lamb's ideas, on the subject of education, I see, do not quite coincide with my own. I have jug completed a short account of our schools, illustrative of the system of inatrifc don pursued there, which 1 intend to publish immediately, and which will give the public an opportunity of forming a more correct judgment. of the principles and practices of that oyster% I fear that if Mr. Lamb should ever take the trouble to look into this pamphlet, he will think we have been making sad innovations on the good old system of teaching ; for he will there find conversation and sensible signs--modes of instruction, In his opinion, most superficial and mittrious—eecommended as hiving been found by experience to be eminently useful in conveying real knowledge to the minds of children. That Mr. Lamb's present opinions on this subject are not derived from any adequate examination of the effects of our system, I can testify, for we could induce the Committee to re main to, hear one of the lectures which are daily given to the children on Natural history and Geography,. only by promising that it should not continue more than ten minutes or a quarter of an hour. They declined examining any. of the children on 'those subjects, although I invited them to do so, in order that they might be enabled to ascertain whether the information they possessed was merely "dazzling and superficial," or really solid and useful. No one charge which has yet been made against us appears to me more singular than that 'preferred by Mr. Lamb against Mr. Clegg and myself, whom he accuses of having " tampered with Mr. Menzies about the alteration of documents entrusted to his care." I can scarcely persuade thyself that Mr. Lamb ever believed what he here asserts ; anti I can most fully corro. -borate the simple statement of the matter given in 'Mr. Clegg's letter, which appeared in your Paper of last Thursday. It had been fortunate for the Presbytery and Mr. Menzies, had their report of the facts corresponded with the statement which we then node. I shall now offer a few observations on the latter of the Rev. 3fr. Walker. _ - - This gentleman takes at once a different ground from that assumed by Mr. Lamb. Ile does not first state my father's opinion, and then dismiss, the argument by merely designating them " radicalism with a vengeance:" but he argues that the best proof of their fallacy is, ' that there have not been found trey persons who could see.a nd appreciate the excellence of Mr. awen's views." I have forwarded to Mr. Walker, for his p rusal, a copy of the proceedings of the British and Foreign Philanthrope Soeieao, containing a long list of distinguished and enliOnened Wividstals, who have not only seen and ape p ediated the excellence of thole views, but have evinced the atocerity of their sentiments, by putting down their names as suhscribeni for considerable sums, towards the establishment of the first community. Even did no 4uttli document. exist, (andof its existence I: presume Mr. Walker must have been :ignorant), I on sae now he could substantiate his assertion, molest be fit,'.. :thee roughly acquainted with the private sentient:nu of all nay 0... thee's supporters, as to deduce his opinioh Mon that know ledge. He surely did not found the assertion on the circum stance that my father has not printed and circulated a list of all those who are favourable to his views, or who approve of his principles P In addition to the above statement, " that there are not to he found two persons who have seen and appreeiated the ex cellence of Mr. Owen's views," Mr. Walker affirms that " those who agree with Mr. Owen's proposals will be found al most solely In England and Ireland." The two assertions seem to cue to be not perfectly consistent ; but we shall assume that they are so, and that the latter requires refutation. I shell therefore be obliged, Mr. Editor, by your insertion, at a convenient opportunity, of a document, a copy of which I will tend you, It IS the report of a Committee of the County of I.ariark, received at a meeting held at Hamilton, when the County decided on petitioning parliament In favour of my fa ther's plans. It will, I feat, be a subject of deep regret with Mr. Walker, that the gentlemen composing this Committee are natives of Scotland, and persons of high consideration in The County of Lanark, and that they have expressed, in the most , unqualified manner, their complete conviction of the excellence of many of Mr. Owen's views. A petition more respectably signed than the one to which I have alluded, has not often, I believe, been presented to the British Parliament ; and what will appear still more extraordinary and laMentable to Mr. Walker, the names of several clergymen residing in this neigh bourhood and in other parts of the County were subscribed to it. . Mr. Walker proceeds to direct the attention of the public to a mandate which the Presbytery addressed to the teachers of the New Lanark school, setting forth that " agreeably to an Act and Resolution of the (lettere! Assembly, they strict ly required and enjoined them to cause the Holy Scriptures to be read, as a regular exercise by the children under their care. And that they moreover required and enjoined that the Shorter Catechism, agreed on by the Assembly of Di vines at Westmineter, be taught in that school." And this mandate, Mr. Walker observes, " evidently proves the anxiety of she Presbytery to guard both the teacher& and Mr. Owen, against practices, which were beliewd to be contrary, both to the law of the land, and to the law of the church." Now, however little my father inightbe inclined to recognise any such right of dictation as is here assumed, he could scarcely have acted contrary to the injunctions. contained in that docu ment. It enjoined the reading of thescriptures, and the teach ing of the Catechism. But even the Preebytery themselves did not venture to say how many times e-week that instruction should .be given. That the children did read the scriptures three times a-week and that the tea' teehism was taught once a-week, viz. on Sundays it is not necessary aga in to repeat.— Unless e therefore, my father had felt dis , out of a pure trie dons of the Presby tery of contradiction, to countermand e orders which the the hetrue teachers had all alortgreceived , tery were sure to be Adhered to ; an adherence which, I hope, they will not undervalue on that account. •• . i now cornet, the visits which the Presbytery made to cur schools on the eeth October end 7th May last. Anti here I shall premise that I happened to take notes, soon after these visits occurred, of the proceedings relating to both, ' being aware that they might become the alt of a disenssion like the present 1 that it was from these notes that the verbatim conversation, quoted by Mr. Clegg' as having paced at their former visit, and for the accuracy of which I pledge myself, was taken; and that it is from the same sourc e that the follow, ing statement of facts, e epeding the visit of 7th May last, is derived. Should I, in any one instance, exaggerate, or even give a false colouring to 4 single fact, I speak under the cot rection of the masters, end of those who were present in , the ech te e at the time. - Mies Howell, be it remembered, had ceesed to be employed tut the establishment, - The gentlemen composing the Committee of Presbytery en tered the new e rne e nt e e u about five- reinutes; before I arrived to receive them, and found the diadem's at their usual occupa tions. lam informed that in coming into the school, they in. sternly proceeded in a body to one of the teachers, Mr. John Davideon, and speaking ail together's anti with coesiderable violence of language and manner, Inquired, " whether the teachers had been apprized of this intended visit." They were answered in the affirmative. " How then had they ven. owed to neglect having t he children arranged ready to recei ve t h em w i t h t heir Bibles in their hands, th a t they might each read a verse or two as panel? The teachers in. formed tbcm thee I hind directed (which wits indeed the case) that each class should proceed in the' ordinary way, that the gemlemen might have a fair opportunity of seeing and judging of the daily routine of our fiction], previously to the formai exs amisation, which was the object of their visit. One of the corn mittec propotted instantly to send for nut, but that was over ruled by the rest, and they contented themitelies, in the mean time, with hearing a class of boys read the Bible, which one of the teacher* allowed them to do, on its lieing solemnly demanded " in a greater name than that of Mr. Owen." I must, however, do these entlemen the justice to say, that on my entrance into the s chool, five minutes afterwards, accompanied by Mr. • Clegg, every sympton of anger or vio lence had disappeared, and they conversed with us, without even expressing any disapprobation of my h a ving ordered that no change in the regular school proceeding should be made. Th ey then heard several other classes read, and alike,' whether they could repeat the Shorter Vaitechisni. Vre said we did not know whether they could all do so or not, and added, that the can chitin was . taught to them only on Sundays. The conurittet however, on being invited to do so, proceeded to examine the children s on this point. They began with one of those next to them. who, Mr. Walker and Mr. Lamb both admit, answered to their satisfaction, Mr. Walker. hoirever, says " that not one of the 75th children, whom we in. vited to conic forward, and whom we call upon the teacher to bßttg forward. would undertake to repeat a Word of that cate. Om it 11414," Now, it' truth did not esact from me the asser. dim, I should not inform Mr. Walker, as I novedoottat he no longer recollects what neither the teachers. nor Mr. Clegg, nor myself, have forgotten, viz., that no. sach invitation, on the "art of the Committee, Well ever nta‘le, eitier to the ehMiren or to Me teachers. The real reason why no (idler boy was examined, he may perhaps recollect, when I :nate to him the following cir cumstance :—When the little boy above-mentioned had an. swered the questions put to him front the catechism, they en.. paired of him whether he was not taught these things at home ? They gathered from his answer, that his grandmother was in the habit of giving hint such instruction. I fear the poor little fellow must have been confused by the intbnidstii3g manner of the Rev. Gentlemen ; for his grandmother has since positively disclaimed the merit of having given hint any eatechetleal in struction whatever, being perfectly satisfied with that which he received in our schools. Of this, however, the Committee could not be aware at the time, and therefore I fear they con eluded, notwithstanding my unwillingness, that they ahould receive so false atn impression; aged ray entleavotirs, to prevent their doing so, that the Catqldstti was proscribed in the New Institution, and that there/ire it was useless to examine any other child on that point. They then proceeded to sey, that at least we did not .even profess to teach the catechism on week days, and expressed their atoonialiment that we should dare to proceed so directly contrary to the law of the land, bringing up these poorchildren without religious or moral instruction; and asked what I could expect from children so trained, when they reached manhood ? I replied, as nearly as I can recollect, " that we had never concealed what was done in the schools, and that therefore had they taken the trouble to inquire of any of us, they would long since have been informed that the ca techism was not taught on week days ; that I was perfectly on. conscious of our having acted contrary to any law ; that I knew of no children whose morals were more strictly attended to ; and that I certainly did expect them to become very superior men and women ; 'beside*, that it was entirely a matter of opi nion whether children under ten years of age could be bone. fited by being taught to repeat the Catecliisni." I added, "that they must be aware that this was it private and not a pa. rochial school; and that if they were at liberty to interfere here, they were. so equally inaho case of any private tutor.". They , admitted the accuracy of the inference; but asserted, " that they had full authority to insist on every private tutor's teeth- I ing his pupils the catechism." I confess that when I consi dered the number of different religious sects, Quakers, Roman ! Catholim, even Episcopalians, and other dissenters who might not consider this catechism the best, and who might yet, if they ' lived in Scothuid, lie thus forced to adopt it, I could by no means reconcile a supposition that such a power was actually placed in the hands of the Clergy, with that liberty of conscience which I had always believed that we enjoyed in Great Britain. I told the Presbytery that I doubted the existence of such a power, that therefore we had no intention of altering our ors. . sent arrangements, and that indeed we had already gone further than we were warranted in doing by the articles of part. tienthip. I distitictly explained whence the report of the pro. bibitory °Wet. regarding the Scriptures, originated. Sequel of the tloinnaittee expreased theiretelves to me quite oath/Jed as to the Scriptures being stacedly read twice a-week, but they all complained that it was not enough to teach the Catechism on Sundays only ; and added that they should be obliged to re port the case to the General Ameinbly. They did so ; and in consequence of their report, the Com mittee of the. General Assembly took up the matter warmly. They said, " Your Committee state with regret that the Lanark Presbytery had been unsucceasffil in resisting the at. tempts made by Mr. Owen, to exclude the Bible from the schools under his superintendence." I profess myself still ut. terly at a loss to conceive, how 'loch a I rep ort could be made thus officially to such an Assembly. That it was believed is evident. Mr. Lapelie thought " it was high time that the proper authorities should interfere at New Lanark, to prevent the Scriptures from being treated with contempt." And others spoke in an equally violent and decided manner. Now, had I been in Mr. Menzies's place, or in that of any of the Members of the Presbytery Committee, I should certainty have con. sidered it my duty instantly to come forward, and to state for the infomiation of the General Assembly and of the public, that although they might not approve of Air. Owen's proceed ings at New Lanark, yet they must correct a mis-apprehension on the part of that Reverend body, in conceiving that the Scriptures were not only not read there, but actually treated with contempt; neither of which suppositions was founded on fact, as they themselves could testify. As no such statement was made, I conceived it to be my duty, in my father's absence, instantly to enter my protest against this report of the General Assembly's Committee, which did, in a letter to the Editor of the Edinburgh Star, of the oth of June last. The clause in the article of partnership, relating to th e Schools, to which Mr. Walker allude is as follows :—" No re. beaus instruction, or lessons on religion, shall he used besides the Scriptures, according to the authorized version, or extract s therefrom without note or comment." Mr. Walker not unfair. ly deduces from this article a charge of rather a novel nature against my father. It is ; That Mr. Owen has hitherto given the children in these Schools more religious instruction than he was authorized by the articles of partnership to give them ; for he directed the Catheehism to be taught on Sunday& That the letter signed b,y_ the teachers did not appear sortie time since, is my fault. They mentioned to me some weeke their intention of publishlng such u declaration,, but I ad vlsed then; against it as unnecessary. In conclusion—your renders have probably already anticipet. et' that it is not our intention to notice any'allegations, Itowewr unfounded, whielt may be conveyed through anonymous Outli ne's; for they know that he who feat% to attack, except under a mask, le unworthy of a reply from those who have umforrnly put their names to every statement which they have given to the public. I am, Sir, your obedient servant, ROBERT DALE OWEN. New Lanark, 20th Sept. 1823. P.S. Lest Mr. Lamb should comphin of my having neglect ed to take notice of a circumstance, to which he had deposed from personal knowledge, I shall just allude to the case of the pig, which Mr. Lamb was so unfortunate as to sell to the Com pany, at a loss to himself. If he will take the trouble to call at the connting-house of Mr. Mason, by whom the Village Store is conducted, he will see the receipt for the money he got for the pig in ciuestion t and will find that be WWI paid. for it et the rate. -not or t,s. as he says, but of fts. a stone. The receipt is signed for Mr. Lamb by a William Todd, who may be able to refresh that gentleman's memory as to the transaction. With regard to other matters, Mr. Mason will, at the game time, I am sure, have much pleasure In r ovin g to Mr. IJamh, from au thentic documents, the extreme inaccuracy of persons . , who ad vance opinions without being in possession of the requisite data. TO TUE EDITOR OF THE OLASGOW CHRONICLE. Sin e —We beg leave, through the medium of your Paper, distinctly to state the following tactic, connected with the ques tion at issue, between Mr. Owen, and the Presbytery of Lanark. Mr. Owen never ordered either of us to discontinue the mail ing of Scriptures in our classes, nor did either of us ever eon. dude from any conversation with him that he wished us to do so. Our supposition, that such was Mr. Oweres wish, mope entirely from a communication made to us by Mr. Mendell. Mr. Lamb sop we have assorted that the (mita was positive ly Issued;---such a representation would have been completely %41 , 1warrantAtil s Neither of us ever made any such. Mr. Owen is said to have expressed his opinion to one of us, PRICE SEVENPaNC4. t. that the Bible contained muff worse than useless." in titi letter of lilies Howell, from which this is Tinted, Thlmas Davidson is mentioned sot bring that individual. Ile ho retry distinctly denies that thowespteasieri s or Any , otbtr situiler ptessiop, or any words which might be supposed to cortry any such sentiment s were ever used by qtr. Owen in sp.:baking to him. hr. Lamb states that at the examination of the 3choc4, :18th Oct. 1822, there was it deplorable deficiency eninpaied with former exhibitions." We can state, On the :nthtr hand, that several of the members of the COrtinioser exprvaetal their satisfaction on witneuing the progress die children had inath. in reading, which was the only branch of education in wh!c:: they exa mined them at all. Mr. Walker states that he has been induced, from °Dover eations with us, to believe that the reading of the Scriptures in the schools was not ordered, but merely permitted, and that we were not allowed to teach the Catechism at all. We would distinctly state to the public, that both th Scripttirts arid; the Catechism have always formed part of the ret,:ular anti established instruction given to the children, the former or, week days, and the latter on Sabbath, from which instru,.. don, we should not have considered ourselves auhortatd • visiting. We never either gave, or intended to giya, the Com mince any other statement than this. Mr. Walker aska Mr. Clegg, and ISlr.Owais s jurtier,." thoit3 the contract bind row teazel - 6d* the Itible roans latimution or if it does not, have ye laud found a clause in it, forbidding the children to taw tout to memory any passages from that ye , lame, or psalms, or hymns of any description. Wlustevvr tars the answer, I have merely to state, that all the teachers in formed us that they were not permitted to teach the childrenr any thing of the kind. More, then, we have evidence before us that the children are not suffered to occupy their minds, or to store their memories with any sacred or religious subject." To this wo reply,—the children in our classes commit to me • mory and have always done so; in the Sabbath school, paisisges of scripture, and psalms and hymns. We declare that neither of us stated to any one member or' the Committee any thing ter the contrary,—and that their memories must fail them, wn!ri they Aim that we did. We art, Sir, Your obtaiiest *MUM. THOMAS- DAVIDSON. .10IIN DAVIDSON. New Lanark, 19th September, 11.123. TO TIIE EDITOR OF TUC GLASGOW CHRONICLE. Sin—My name having repeatedly appeared, in conneeticm with the unfortunate miemiderstanding which has been of ler e so often alluded to by the Presbytery of Lanerk, evidently re. quires from me a more explicit declaration than I have yet given publicly. The fact, at-cording to the best of my recollection, is simpl this t—ln , March, 11r12, Mr. Owen, being about to de. , part fur London, had occasion to speak to me, touching school matters, in course of conversation, that gentleman said it would be neissary to confine the use of the Catechism by the children to the Sabbath day, in consquence of the variety which he intended their future instruction should embrace ; and he remarked that the Sabbath wad: the most proper day for using both the Bible and Catechism. Subsequently, in thinking over the matter, I . was unfortunately induced, though not without a iteruple, to view this remark in a light, in. which I am tow pettedly eon. vineed Mr. Owen did not intend it, viz. in that or an order which I was to act upon. It was acting under thbt idea that the SeriptureSt were suspended in one class for about a fortnight. The misapprelienvion itself, as it appears- to mei was a vet*/ simple ones and has since been most. satisfactorily explainesi and prejudice only OM a*xsettnt to I.IW ins the - Crintitta of these, who Cap make such an incident the groand, of anocetenstian like the present it is not without much imeasinese hat , : since witnessed the very improper advantage rarlti> 3t has, been taken of this mistake; and. I feel that„ howeverdisereditable to my own apprehension, a sense of justice to. Mr. Owen tle mande this statement from me; in giving it, declare. myself entirely independent of that gentlemen, the only existing obli. gation being that of personal attachment, which it ix my duty to cherish, in return for the uniform kindness experienced from hint during a number of years. Before.coneluding, permit me to remark that the report. pre sented to the Oeneral Assembly in May last, on the authority of the Presbytery of Lanark, stated that the Scriptures wer.7!. not used in the New Lasiark Schools. let opposition to this report, .1 do positively affimi that, storing my connection with New Lanark Schools, those gentlemen never found the Scrip tures excluded when visiting them ; and when a report came to their Cars that they had been prohibited. the cause of the temporary and partial suspension was candidly explained to reply to their inquiries on the subject, so to to leave them not the smallest grounds for reporting that the Scriptures were not used in New I.‘anark Schools. I ant, Sir, your most obedient servant, GEN. 1,. 'I‘I.I4UDELL. PARLIAMENT. IIOUSF: OF 14ORDS, S Fr. 30. At two o'clock this day Parliament was further prorogued, by Commission, to the 25th of November. The Commis sioners were the Earl of Shaftesbury, Lord St. Hel ens , jMrd Ardoi, and Lord Bexley. The Lord Chancellor was nit present. Mr. Bellamy, with the Clerks and Offieeri of the house of Commons, attended at the bar. The Commission was read by the Earl or Shaftesbury. From the LONDON GA ZirrTr, Sept. 30. Whitehall, Sept. fl '7 • 1811 The King has been pleased to direct letters pilot to be passed under the Great rz.ell of the United Kingdom of Great Britain 'and Ireland, for granting the dignity of n Baronet cf tho said United Kingthun to the following Gentlemen, and to the heirs male of their bodies lawfully begotten, vis. r - Charles Forbes, of New and Kitinglassie, in the eottrity of Aberdeen, Esq. Thomas Reid, of rwell-grove, In the county of Surrey, am of Oroystone-park, in the coun ty of Dt11 . 15 Mt*, gao. George Abercrombie Robinson, of Itatt's-hOwe, in Mc county of Sotomet„ Er.q. Wm. lZaillic, ofPolhemnlet, in the couu ty of Linlithgow, Esi. t Sept, 30-, 1023. Th e King. 11ee b Henry lac pleased to appoint Canning, Esq. to be his Majesty's Agent and Consul in the circle of itOVL r Saxony and the free cities of Hamburg, Bremtn, and Leabccic, - ' . r—, ' ..,,,t r'' • A ' a a I , - , . ,1,,, .- . - r ....- ' ~.._, -- ~.,_ _ , , 4'.•1 , o .fit• ft, BANKILUPT. Thou.. Atkinson, Ludgate-hill, cahloet-maker, to sarrender Oct. 20, 21, Nov. U, at the ”ankropte Coon, Hatitighall. street. Solicitors, Illersrs. Horsley autl Wilson, Liaeo Inn-1411s. DIV I DEN LK Oct. 21, G. Wright, St. Alartin'tt-larkf, hoot and rhnr.,faciar —Nov. Il i W. l'otts, Sheerness., linen.drapvr—Ovi. F. Atkinson, Kirbymoonide, Yorkshire, rOTil-Illerehants--4)c!. 28, .1. Pitstow„ Earl's Essex, millnr—Oet. L J. Re. hertson, Neiveastle-tipou-Tyne, silversrnith--(iet. 211, - flornt and J..Staekholise, Liverpool, roerthants—Oct. 21, . 1 - Richardson, liingston.upon..lltill, cor:1-der,lir.-0..t. 21, T. Jenkins, 14anvithen i Glamorganoldre, dealer. I.:ERTIVIGATES, J. !lardy, Stratford-upon-Avon, 11 7 .10 4i >lltm-rtur ehAnt—T. Lean, I4lyrr pool, corteb.mai r-- I. ?la;:riC011- 401141 terrace, NV hit ecl iiel-Yfkiti, flour-faetor. PA wrxr, i I'S Dl--.' Ll.',: D. G. Clark, jun.. I). 0. Tligp, uts,3 tc. it. Pt.taky, tlorellr*. ter, printers--J. Nicola awl J. klain T ,„ N tead.road, timber-ntereltante.4.Steverls. SigantAtreet„ and s it y vns , Ex et e x „i trea , vic.tu.T.llers Attyt, , e i d J. Cuttar, Paul-meat, Siwrediteh, oarnman Campbell, W. Ilatuilain, J. CAOPrr, J. Spalding anel C. Csunphal. Port.4l4sgow, ttixartreallen.--,j, pozkin s 8. Robins. Netaport-Atreet, heitexter4(l,lare, siork 4 ln..eold. tonitlii—J. and R. () Aver. lark. R. Rit'elce, and A. Manby, Llaraeler, Stallordaltint, coa)..merd Ant ,c, ,r 0 in. 4r as regards A. ilanby,--S. and C. D.,bovrato, t ji t k..irtn..larw.. road, yawnbroktrt , -T; flail, litalt)enAllte„, 11/604-ftrrer. wholesale a t atera-S. Knight and J. Rider, JtaiSclit, I.a nnt .9llire,