The Sun. — London, England, 1812-01-10 00:00:00

LIIIPERIiL EARL LTMENT HOUSE OF PEERS, THURSDAY, JAN. y A number of Only.; (which chiefly were for the withdrawing cf-,ceTtaimS (its appeals) were mad-2 respecting .he •jiidicial busint-ss The App.-al Kerr v. L:nes, one of tho,e co9necied W:C, the great Roxburgh Cause,, were withdrawn by consent of parties. A.Pet Ilion, in one of the pending Appeal Cabses, for further titrie - t6i I Pa g er. before the House, was presented hy Lop! Walstngham. The -1,Git.13! Ci-tANct.Loa.quated The Woolsack, and briefly o6ser.ved to their' Lord.:hipS, that the House bad made an, „Order that the P.-o . tieS in Ap peal Causes should 14y "the necessary Papers'and Do cuments belure the *Use within a given perioJ a regulatiPn which ; he thought, was productive of salutary etreerq, There may, - however, be reason able excuses offered in particular cases for extend ing that time; how far that was thecase in the pro ceeciaig befcre them, he could not say. He there fos,e moved, that the consideration ofthe Petition be deferred till Monday next, which was. ordered an ccrdingly. Mr. Coi, from the Commissioners of Military Inquiry, presented the 16th and 17th Reports of tha. Board, which respected the Office of Ordnance. —Ordered to he upon the Table. Mr. KNOWLES from the Navy Office, presented Accoun4s respecting the timber used in the service of the N ivy, and the different prices of the same, pursuant to their Lordships' order of May 1809. — Ordered to lie on the table, On the motion of the Earl LAUDERDALE, Ac counts were ordered to be laid betote the House, of the average ,nuotber of Bank of Enland Notes in circulation in the years 1810 and 1811, 'distingui-h -ing such as were above and below the sum of 51. Also t he amount of those in circulation on the 25th day of each Month, within the last six months. And also so account of ttie number of Promissory Notes in circulation from the' years 1804 to 1811, inclu sive: with certain specifications of the respective amounts of tile former. CATHOLICS OF IRELAND. Lord G:RENVI LLB seated, that in purswince of tl e &sire absrit . (Earl Fitz A 'I lion)) he had to.movii to disCharge.theorder:lol sow moning ,heir Lordships for..to-morrow .. ,se'nniglit, upon a sunit,ct of great national importance, and to make a &tarlar order for Friday,, the 24th lost. His Noble Friend regretted the ne'Lessity of the propos ed delay. He carnet) , concutrcd. nil him as to the eventful crisis' to. which', the straits of. Ireland were brought, but it was ,thought too early a day, had been named •in the first instance for a .full at teirdarace of the Irish Representative Peers; ,the postponement was made not only out of personal re spect to these Noble Lords, but also upon public grounds, for the purpt.Ee of affording him an oppor tunity ,of delive.ring their sentiments and opinions on - this"ireat question. Their assistance also in the - discuiSion would be of considerable benefit and advantage, on account of their experience and ob servation, as the nearest spectators of the.present awful crisis of their country,—a crisis in the issue of which they were more immediately, though not more deeply interested than the other Noble Metn bers of that House. It was on these grounds that the delay of one week was proposed in bringing 'forward the discussion. The Noble Lord having moved to that effect, the Peers were ordered to be summoned tor Friday the 24th instant. FINANCES OF THE EMPIRE. Lord GRENVILLE expressed his wish to call the attention of the House out oitly generally but seri ously to this very ituportant topic, and to move in the first instance for certain information relative to the Finances of the Country. He was induced to come forward thus early, principally in consequence of his seeing a statement which most probably was that day in the hands of all their Lordships. He did not think it manly in any indiviciii4 to deceive himself, or an act of patriotism to deceive others, with respect to the financial slate of the country. It was a topic which called for the earliest and . most serious attention of Parliament and the country, and ln that view the Noble Lord moved for a variety of documents of the subject, as the amount and pro duce of the Consolidated kuod, the War Taxes, the Revenue of Ireland, Src. for certain periods, and as tar as the same could be made up. The Earl of LIVEBPOOL observed, he had no in tention to oppose the motions of the Noble Baron, Which merely went to accounts respecting the public finances, and which would, in course, have been laid before the House. Neither had he any inten tion at present of entering into a discussion of the sibject. But to observe, that though it was nut re gular to observe upon, or notice what passed else where, he wound venture to say, that it would not appear from these accounts, or flow any thing be sides, that any one in authority, either had deceived themselves, or were disposed to deceive others with regard to the real state of the finances of the coun try, He was equally desirous with the Noble Baron, that the fullest information shOuld be laid before the I{ouse on the sobjed, and therefore concurred in,the otion. • The question was then put, and the docu ments ordcred to be laid before the House accord ingly. STATE OF HIS MAJESTY'S HEAL Earl CAMDE N (as President of the Council) pre- Seated copies of the Reports made by his Majesty's Council to the Lords of his Majesty's Privy Council, tespeding the actuil state of his Majesty's Health, since that laid before their Lordships tqwards the dose of the las; Session, viz.—The Report made on the sth of OZ:tober last, and that of the sth of the present mon th. We, the underwritten, Members of the Coun cil appointed to assist her Majesty, in the execution of the. trusts committed to her Majesty by virtue of the Statute passed in the 5 tst year of his Majesty's Reign, entituleJ, An Act to provide for the Ad. ministration of the Royal Authority, and for the cate of his Nfljesty's Royal person during the continu ance of his Majesty's illness, and for the resumption of the exercise of the Royal Authority by his Ma jesty ;' having duly met together on this 4th day of ...11nuary, 1812, at the Queen's Lodge, near to Windsor Castle, and having called be.fore us, and , examined upon oath the Physicians and, other per. sons attendant upon his Majesty, and having ascer tained the State of his Mjesty'.: Health, by all such ways and means as appeared to us to be ttecessary for that purpose ; do hereby de,:lire and certify, that the state of his Maies . sy's Health at the time of this. out fleeting is not suiA as to enal* his Maje,ty to resume the personal exercise cat his Royal -Au thority.. ""Tliat,his M , jostx's Bo 'lly H-alt h appears to us to be as goblifaS at Lilly of - tlw , p,rl.:kL 01 our iormer Report a. --, , :i.-.. • - "That his iNikjesty's Men Health appears to us .• not to De worse than at the period of our last Re port. " That all the Physicians attending his Majesty agree id stating, that they think his Majes:y's com plete and final recovery improbable, dithering, how ever, as to the degree of such improbability, some of them expressing themselves as not despairing, others as not entirely desp.ii:ing, and 01. e of 'thew representing that he cannot help despairing of such recovery. (Signed) " C. CANTUAR. " E. EBOR. NIONTBOSR. . 4 ‘ WINCEIELSEA. " AYLLSFURD. " ELDON. " ELLENBOROUGH. " W. GRANT." " - Shortly after the above Report bad been read in the presence of all the Ph: sicians, and one of the Members_of the Council had left Windsor, the Phy sician alluded to in the last Clause of the Report stat ed in writing to the other Members of the Council, then remaining at Witidsor. That he had unguard edly made use of an- expression w Inch he was ap-. prehensive might carry a meaning far beyond wlukt he intended to express,: and requested to be allowed to it, and atisnred the Council, that' whilst thought the final recovery of his Majeity very improbable, he by 110 means desuairect of it." " The Members of the C , uncit to whom the above statement was made, having sworn the Phy sician alluded to, to the truth thereof,. afterward, communicated the same to the whole Council assembled this sth day of January, who have deem . - ed it right to subjoin tins fact to the above declara tion. • T • (Signed) "C. CANTUAR. , " E. EBOR. " Movraoszt; ' " WINCIIBLSRA. " AYLSSFORD: " ELDON. " ELLENBOROUGU. " W. GRANT: St. James's sqnare, Tan. S. It 12. " A true Copy, JAMES BULLBR.". The Reports were ordered to lie on the table. The Earl of LIVERPOOL stated, that in pursuance of what'he had mentioned on a further evening, he should move for the appointment of a Select Com mittee to examine his Mljesry's Physicians reipect. , ing the actual and pending state of his Majesty's health. The Reports of her Majesty's Council on that subject had been laid before the. House by hit Noble Friend ; but the HoUse stood upon a diffe rent footing from what it did last Session, in that respeet. The first ad it. was then necessitated to proceed upon, was a report made by his Majesty's Privy Council. Au authority of that kind was just ly considered as an authentic ground for ulterior proceeding ; but in that particular case it must be regarded as an inchoate proceeding on the part of that body, and one upon which they had no regular jurisdiction. Parliament no* stood in a different situation. Her Majesty's Council, by the authori ty of law, had a distinct and legal jurisdiction on the subject, and the reports laid upon the table were to be considered as proceeding from a body so authorised. Were it not necessary, however, from" circumstances; to provide for certain farther at ran;ements, no ulterior proceeding of 'the kind to which he l!ad just alluded, would be requisite. But as it now became necessary to call the attention of Parliament to the whole subject to wilier the do cument so far referred, it was considered both be coming and proper to take up the subject, and to proceed entirely on its own judgmmt and on its own authority ; under this irripression, he should move their Lordships, " Thai a Select Committee be ap pointed to examine the Physicians' attending upon his Majesty as to the state of 'his Majesty's health, since • the last examination of his Majesty's Phy sicians, in the last S scion of Parliument, and that the 'Committee do consist of ,twenty-one Lords." The Noble Secretary kaving Moved 'to this ef fect, it was ordered accordingly ;' as also, that the said Committee she uld be appointed by way of ballot, and that the Lords 'should deliver in their Nits to 'the Clerk before the next sitting of the House. The Earl of LIVERPOOL then observed, that as he had omitted a'motion tor.sumtuoning the Lot& on his proposed motion, tor the Thanks of the House to the Goeruor-General of India, Sir Sa muel Auchruuty, &c. he should now tnovF, "That their Lordships be summoned for that- purpose for to-nwrow," which was ordered accordingly.—Aq jourued, HOUSE OF COMMONS, THURSDAY, JAN. 9. A New Writ was ordered for the Borough of West Looe, the room of James Buller, Esq. who since his election had accepted the office of Clerk of his Majesty's Most Honourable Privy Council. On the Motion of Sir S. ROMILLV, an humble Address was ordered to be presented to his Royal Highness the Prince Regent, praying, that he would be pleased to order, that there be laid before the House, an account of the number of male and fe male convicts in 1810, distinguishing the offences for which they had been convicted, &c. THE REGENT'S ANSWER 'l'o THE ADDRESS. Laid JOHN Tx YNNE appeared at the bar, and in formed the House, that his Royal Highness the Prince Regent had been waited on with the Address of both Houses of Parliament, to which his Royal Highness had been graciously pleased to return the following Answer : " I thank you for this dutiful and loyal Address. Your assurances of the continuance of your support, in the great cause ia which we arc engaged, are highly gratifying to me ; and I have' the grealestssa tisiktion in receiving the new proof of )our affec tion and loyally to tic King, my Fath e r, which is afforded by, your readiness" to provide imply and suitably for his comfort :Ind dignity, untier the pies sure of the severe cattnity With Which it has pleS ed the Almighty to afflict him." WOOTTON BASSET. • Mr. D. GIDDY presented a Petition from Mr. Apersall against the return of R. - Knighi, - E rot the Borough of Wootton Basset, which was' order ed to be taken i n to cons ide rat i on next Tuesddy fort night. - On the motion of MI 7 . Ross. an account wac or dered to -be laid be:Ore the House of the cotopara tive state of the population of the CoUnties of Great Britain, in the years 1801 and 1811, shewing the inurea§e or diminutions thereof. Lord VOLKSTONE presented a Petition from Mary Ann Dixon,. who was cited for defamation in the Consisiorial Court of Bristol, and being.unable to employ a Proctor, was con&inned in costs, and suts scquetitly excommunicated at the age of tB, and who had in consequence been lying for two years in the Newgate sof Bristol, being wholly without the meahs of paying the costs,which now .'mounted to 301;praying relief. Ordered to lie on the table. WATE RFORD. Sir J. NEWPORT presented a Petition from the Merchants composing the Chamber of Commerce at Waterford; complaining of certain inconveniences . sustained by them in their EXport Trade, and ex pre,sed his hope that the Board Of Trade would see the necessity of adopting measures to r eme dy t h e evil alluded to. The CHANCELLOR of theExcacatica assured the Hon. Baronet, that particular attention wool.' be paid to this subject. , The Petition was then ordered to -lie :on the Ta Ule. • DEBTORS IN THE ISLE OF MAN. Mr. HORNER presented a Petition (rot - 1i the Deb tors confined in Casle Etusben, in the Isle of Man, praying for a I articipat ion in the advantages of the Engli4b Insolvent DebtOrs' Act. ' - - Ordered to lie on able. FINANCES (IF IRELAND. Sir Jon:g N.awf.Jier rose in compliance with his notice, to-move- for the, appointment of the Corn : mittee on Irish Finance. Recommended as this subject was to the consideration of Parliament in the speech from the Throne ; he should not have thought it necessary to trouble the, House with - many words on the subject, were it not that it ap-• peered to him that he was .called to say whyle, a private individual, took upon himself a -task which see±ed mote naturally to devolve on a rneruher of Administration. In crder to •do this,. the-House, would have the goodneas to call to their recolleelien the proceedings of the last Session. In the Speech from the Throne, the commencement of that Session, notice was taken of the great defalcaticn in the re-. venue of Ireland. He had himself during 4everal . preceding Sessions fruitlessly . endeavoured to call the attention of Parliament to what he conceived to. be a gross mismanagement of that revenue.. The, evil proceeded until at - length the defalcation hec:rme , S 0 considerable, )hat, as he hard just observed, Ca- vernment'deerated it necessary that it should be men-. tioned in th 9 Speech from the Throne; But although thus noticed in the Speech from the Throne, Minis ters abstained from introducing the subject in the House until the latter end of March, when he (Sir John Newport) conceiving that no fur ther delay ought to be allowed, proposed cer tain Resolutions respetting it. It appearing, however, to be the general opinion, that these Re solutions were premature, and that they ought to hive been forwarded on the Report of a Committee, he, in compliance with the sense of the House, post poned his Resolutions, and moved for the appoint ment of a Comrilittee to examine into the state of the Finances of Ireland, and to report their opinion thereon. This motion of his was negatived by a large majority, in which tuajori:y- were comprised the Chancellor of the Exchequer for England, and the Chancellor of the Exchequer for Ireland. Yet only six days afterwards the Chancellor of the Ex chequer for Ireland came forward, and proposed the appointment of precisely the same Committee, which proposition was immediately acceded to..— The Committee proceeded in their researches, 'and in the speech at.the close of the Session, credit was taken for the measure. In the Speech at the corn- mencement of the present Session, the re-appoint ment oldie Committee was 'recommended. Under these circunistances, he put it, to the justice of the House, whether, as the original proposer of such a Committee, he was not now entitled, in preference to the Hon. Centletnan opposite,. to move .for its re appointment. He would only add, that in the Report of the Conitnitiee about to be formed he trusted that the error in the Report of the Committee of the lasi Session would not be,repeated. If that had b..en done in an4rish Parlianient which last Session - had been done to a ,British Pailiament; it would hdve been called a blunder; for although the Report was presented on the 14th of-June, and purported to be printed on that day, it contained evidence described as-having been taken on the Ist of July. It was most, extraordinary that after a Report had been presented,.. and ordered to he printed, that there should be subsequent and, partial meetings of a Com mittee (many Members of it having - left the coup try) for the purpose of making it Up at t h e i r di scre- lion. He trusted that such a circumstance would not recur, and concluded by moving, " That" the .several accounts presented last Session be referred to a Select Committee, instructed to inquire into the, increase and redemption of-the funded debt'o'f land, the total revenue, &c. fur the last 21 years, end ing Jan. 5, 1 8 12. • The CHANCELLOR Of the EXCHEQUER asscred the Hon. Baronet, that if he thought it material to his fame that he should have the honour of moving the appointment of this Committee (although hecould by no means pay the Hon. Baronet such a bad com pliment as to suppo.e that his political reputation stood in need of such assistance), he, for one, would be very gl td to affofd him the opportunity of estab lishing his character. As to what passed last Ses sion on the subject, he certainly could not presume to recollect it so distincty as the Hon. Baronet; but as far as he did recollect, the facts were, that the Hon. Baronet proposed distinct Resolutions respect ing the revenue of Ireland that it appeared to the House, that it would be better to pr ece d e t h ese Re solutio •s by an inquiry ; that in the debate on that subject, he (the Chancellor ofahe'Exchequet) gave no!ice of his intention to move for the appointment of a Committee for that purpose, as soon as the Hon. Baronet's Resolutions,should be disposed of ; that nevertheless the:Hon. Baronet made a direct, attack upon (die' Chancellor of the Exchequer's) fame by t iking the business out of his hands, and by him sLlf inovin lor the al - Ton:talent of the Committee . ; tit it the Hon.-.. Baronet's motion was negatived, be cai:se it had been made - without notice ; and lastly t bat an Hon Friend of his had again brought forward the motion on due notice, when it was agreed :He repeated; however, that he- had no objection whatever to the proposition now made by the Hon. Baronet, apprehending it was not likely that there wo,ild be any difference between them, with respect to the appointment Of the Committ: e, as he did not understand that there Was any objection to the, members composing the last ; although it might be necessary to make an alteration of two, with respect to any Hon. Gentleman who might not naiv be its Parliament. With respect to what thelion..Baronei. had said on the subject of some of the evidence in the Report of the last Session, hearing 4 date - later than the period at which the Report professed to be printed; an Hon. Friend of his, who was not -pre sent, was more cOmpetent,to speak on that subj , e-t than himself; but even he recollected that there was a 'sort of discretion i :iven to the Chairman of the Committee to correct such errors as might be obvious and important, and , be was persuaded. that the members of the Committee, who weredescribed by the Hon.' Bart. as having left the country, aid not leave it under the linpressiop that the Report was fully and finelly agreed upon. The motiott'tor the apppointme't of a Committee was then agreed to, and after some convet§ation be tween the ChancellOr of the Exchequer and Sir S. Newport, the memberS of the last Committee were ra-appointed,, with the exception of Mr. Morris Fitzgerald, /or whom- Mr. Hutchinsota, was substi tuted. CHARITABLE. QONATIONS. • Mr. LOCKHALLT, after'stating the importance of exercising the utmost vigilance whit respe& to charitable donations, the best mode of doing %ville i n was, in his . opinion, by git'ing the greatest publicity to their existence; and, a fter detailin g a t consider able length,- the means which it was his intention to propose for. that purpose, moved (or, and obtain ed leave to bring . in a BA tor the registry of Chari table Din iLions, and -for pros iding a more sum. trlary remedy for the correction ofAbuses therein. FINANCE: ,Mr. FKEENIANTLE moved tfit. there be laid be fore the :House a return of the income and charges of the Co4ulidated,Fund.: for the year - 4 ending - t h sth of : January t and the sth of .riauary SI an account of the , amounta the war taxes atria& .eac.h period, The CHANCELLOR of the EXCIIECLUER observed, that the Hon. Gentleman had done him the honour to.eommunicate ro him the motion which he had just submittt.xl to the with others Of a similar nature, which -he understood it was his intention also to prop:.se. respea tar two of these three m o ti ons , be had I no hesitatioix -in- objeffing.. - to - thern; because - they would- prodnee only what would be found in the annual accounts, that by law must be raid before Parliament. Whets. those accounts s h ou ld come b e f ore the House, the Hon, Gentleman: might extra& those parts which he required, and on them . found any motion, that he thought proper. As to' the third motion,. he had told the Hon. Gentleman that , if he would - wait twenty-four hours, he would 'inquire whether the papers to be produced by it were in the same predi— cament as those to which 'he had just alluded, arid if nor, that he would consent to their immediate produ&i on. - Mr. TIERNEY said, that he understood his Hon. Friend to wish nor for the details of the accounts, but for the result. It was well known that the de-, tailed accounts were , never presented until a very late period of the Session, and he contended that such a mode of opposition as that resorted to by the Right 'Hon. Gentleman, would put a stop to all . motions for pa;.ers relative to Finance. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHRQUER denied that these accounts were presented at a period 63 late as that described by the Hon. Gentleman. H e had no objection whatever to the production of the information, but he saw no reason :for departing front the bidinary course. Mr. HORNER thought the opposition of the Right Hon. Gentleman quite novel in its kind. During short experience of Parliament, he' bad every Ses sion seen motions agreed to, for papers in distinCt anticipation of the annual accounts. The Papers Moved for by his Hon. Friend were indispensable, in order to remove the anxieiy which the Mutilated statements in the public prints respecting the Re venue, had occasioned in the public mind. It was well known' i hat a large volume of accounts was •osually presented about March; that it was then sent to' the printers, and, that it was tow a r d s the end o the Se's,ion !Afore the 'Jou - se obtained that financial information so desirable at an earlier period; It was singliTar - that while theßight Hdn. Gentleman was opposing the present miotion, his Noble Colleagues had, as he understood, acceded to a si one in' the other House. The CtiAgcELLiia.df the EXCHEQUER repeated that he had no objetion to the production of the "inforniatiOp; bu tha't if the ordinary course was sufficient fpr that purpose, it appeared to hill) to be idle to depart from it. It the Hon.:Gentleman. would withdiaw his motion, .and give notice of it for to•moirow, by that lime he should be enabled to 'acertain how far the above observation was applift cable to it. Mr. FE EEMANTLE consented to withdraw his mo tion for the present, and to give notice of it for to morrow, but not fbr the reasons alleged by the Right Hon. Gentleman. He distrusted the finan cial statement which the Right Hon. Gentleman had yesterday' made ; and he was anxious before that most important subjea,the state ot the finances, should come to be dicussed, that the House slid* be in possession of all possible information. with rat sped to it. HIS NIAIESTY'S HEALTEL. Mr. Secretary Ryosa rose, for the purpose, of moving the appointment of a Lull Mince to ex amine the Physicians, touching t le state of his Ma. jesty's health. It had been consiierLd questiobOblel 4el i t lar