The Sun. — London, England, 1812-03-25 00:00:00

tn get Ifni to Wilt - upon the Clic;fr . 'mai of Ole Ccitlti• traduce. He went' on t o "M' es . rs. D•in and tro Bland, ao gct invrudions 'how to proceed; and sa* Mr. Pan, vvho'Conc! Avecl the order in qiiesii o n t o be n o le gal Protetiion against an arrest, and diretled hiM not to discharge it till a proper inquiry had been n ' a de• He then went to P. C. JaMes, .Esq. the Wader Sheriff, who said he had "never met with such a cas e ,. an d &sired him to go t o Mr. B urc h e il , t h e Snerilr of Middlesex. • He did so, when lie was told by Mr. Burcliell, that . as the "House Commons' was 'not in the Connry of Surrey, s . l 'e did not k no w t h at i ts jurisdiction extend e d -(3 the place in which Mr, Campbell had been ar rested. He (Mr: Burchell) conceived that it would be 'Proper for him (the witness) t o wa i t b e f ore h e dis charged the arrest, till a new' order was issued for L e attendanc e of M r . Campbell, which' he thought ''might perhaps be made as yesterday. After this he Went back to the - lock-up-house, and saw Mr. Dam Dani pbell. H e 'told him he had bee n t o M essrs . and Crossland s, and that Mr. Dan had refused to discharge the arrest, and also of his having been Lb The Under Sheriffs of -Surrey and Middlesex, &c. 8 :C. The debt for whir2.l) the arrest was made was ' ,6 901. and upwards. He was afraid when the 'older was produced, th'at it was a trick on the part Mr. Campbell, and was afraid to discharge th'e a f tr est, lest it sho u ld b r i ng ruin on himself and - He had not 'tried to ascertain at the House °' Commons if the order were genuine. He had n ever before been nearer the House than the Court ,° l King's B e n c h, i n W estm i nster H a ll . H e h a d ,ntiy got home Ifefore the notice was kerved on 'in), by virtue of which lie attended the House that day, or he mould have sought infotruation in the manner stated by the Speaker—(by application at the House of Commons). Ordered to withdraw. - Mr. EDEN Ilion moved, " That the Privilege of the House be allowed- to Mr. Campbell, and that he be forthwith discharged irons arrest." Mr. WILsoN was as anxious as any man to main ta,in the Privileg e s o f P ar li ament , b ut h e conce i ve d that, as there had been no intention to dispute them n the present occasion, he did not think they should be re(rarcled as infringed by the arrest of Mr. Camp htli. Mr. EDEN felt there could be no doubt on the question before the H .use. As Mr. Campbell had bgett ordered to attend the 'Committee at one, and 'as passing by the Horse Guards at five minutes alter twelve, nothing could be inure probable than th at he had returned for time document he had for gotten. Lle CHANCELLOR Of the EXCH EQU ER said, if the 'its had been bon a fide on his way to the House, 'ts privilege ought unquestionably to be ext e nd e d t® ; but his being found at home might natu -1.44 enough 'tad the Officer to suspea, when the O rder wds ploduced, - that it was some trick, if the than was pa, s liz the Horse-Guards at twelve o'clock and wera home, as he had stated, for a paper which tie had forgotten : all this might be considered as 11 ' Progress, towards his attending the Committee, ftt)d the privilege of the Hou s e ought to• 5e extend rtl to hint. He conceived it must be admitted, un less the veraci y of the witness were questioned, that he was entitled to the privilege the House. l‘Tr. Wrisobt observed, he had been somewhere t'se all the morning previ,us to h;s.passing the Horse uards- at twelve o'clock, on business not conned with the Committee. Mr. LocxuAaT thought, the Order of the House, 'which was in his posSeslion, ought of itself to have Protected him from an arrest. The question was then put and carried, and the arrest disehArged. Mr. EDEN was of opinion that no censure was de served by the unfortunate Sheriff's Officer, and he should therefore net propose to proceed with any verity against his ; but he thought Mr. Dan, the Attorney, i.tight to be ordered at attend to receive a rein - imand for the language which he bad held with respeet to the order. He would, therefore, Move that Mr. Dan be ordered to,attend. The SPEAKER wished to know if the Hon. Gen tleman would pursue this motion before the House decided on giving an order for the attendance of liiudson again to morrow. Mr. STEPHEN, before Mr. Dan, was orJered to attend, wished to observe that there had appeared Ito intention on his part to infringe the priviieges °f the House. lie would put it to them, if when the amount of the debt was considered, it could be expeaed that any man would take upon I:.,uself the heavy responsibility of ordering a discharge of the !"treat, unless he was certain th a t th e or d er wou ld justify his doing so. Mr. TIERNEY thought Mr. Dan ought at any rate to be called to their Bar, add told bow the lAW stood to that respea. Mr. C.ADAIis offered a few words on the subjea, but was nut distinctly heard in the gallery. The CHANCELLOR Of the EXCHEQUER said it was question of fad, and was of opinion that no prima facie case was made against . Mr. Dan, and that, as it did not appear he - had any disposition to treat the the privileges of the House with contempt, it was nut necessary that he should be ordered to attend. Mr. TIERNEY thought if nothing farther were (lone, and it appeared on their Journals that no steps viere taken in consequence of such a breach of pri 'ilege,At torn ies might hereafter refer to this case, and tell those offendiorina similar._ manner, that it was Of no consequence, and no notice would be taken of it by the House. Mr. OWLN, when the responsibility of the man Who discharged an arrest'was considered, thought a fair excuse appeared for Mr. Dan. It seemed there was no Christian name mentioned in the order, and therefore it might well be suspected that it was in tended for another Mr. Campbell, and that the Person arrested attempted improperly to . take ad .vantage of it. He thought enough had been done, to assert the privileges of the House, and -hoped they would give the parties concerned no further • trouble. - . Colonel - 13ismao understood Mr. Dan had said, " Don't mind the order of the H.use, but keep your prisoner." He thought he could not say this ignorance, and that consequently a farther in cy was necessary. [The Short-baud writer's notes of .the evidence Were here read.) Ur. PONsoNBY agreed that th i s was a question of faa;but thought the attendance of .I.l.lr.ain necessary., as he had doubted w !tether 'or pot an order. of -the House could lenti , . . .. If he stdiild- apkar to have doubled not the area . ... of an order of the House, but whether the order produced were genuine, or if he had doubted Who. , ther Mr. Campbell was the person entitled to its proteEtion ; he thouqht there would be but one opr nion in the House, that he should be - discha.ged.— Since, however, Mr. Dan had been stated to have doubts on the subject, it was proper that he should be ordered to attend to state on what those doubts were founded. The 'SOLICITOR-GENERAL thought it appeared that_.ll/Ir. Dan, considering the circumstances alto. gethr, wished to have the opinion of Counsel, be fore he discharged the person; but if it was thought necessary to have an explanation ftom his own mouth, as to whether he disputed the authority of the House, or only the authenticity of the instru ment, he should have no objection to- his being Mr. W. WYNNE said, the, a& was a manifest breach of privilege, and those who state the- case mast favourably .for Mr. D.m, must own that there was at least great doubt in his expressions. If the motion before the House was, that he should be taken into custody,'what had been stated by the Gentlemen opposite would have great weight, but they did notgo the length of disproving the proprie ty of au order for his attendance. The motion was then agreed to, and Mr. Dan ordered to attend to-Morrow: Mr. Hindson was also ordered to attend again. Another motion was made for the attendance of Mr. Burcheli ; but, after a few words from Mr. \Vynne and Mr. Lockhart, who suggested that his opinion should be looked on as a private one, he not being concerned in the case itself, the motion was not pressed. Mr. PONScNBY moved for an account of the num ber of Bank of En4land Notes presented for pay ment since the suspension of payments in specie, and refused upon the ground of having been forged. • Mr. BARING slid he saw no objettion to present. ing such Rt-turns; but thought it would be better if the Right Hon. Gentleman would give notice of it for to•tuorrow. Mr. PONSONEY stated that he had no obje&ion, provided the Right Honourable Gentleman oppo site would fix the s-:cond reading of the Bill re speaing the Paper Currency for Thursday. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEOUER assented, and Mr. Ponsonby gave no►ice'tpr to-worro A'. BREACH OF PRIVILEGE Mr. EDEN said henad received a letter from Mr. Palmer, a wit n ess . attenthng a-Committee of that House, complaining of havh),; been' arrested He did not know that the case was marked by circum stances so aggravating as those which charatlerized the former one; however, he should move, that John Palmer and Alexander Grace (the Officer who executed the writ) should attend - the House to morrow. The motion was agreed to. SINECURE OFFICES. Mr..BANKES, on moving for leave to bring in a Bill for the abolition of Sinectire Offices, arid other arrangements connected with that subject, entered at some length into a detail of his plan, which, bi: , - sides the great leading object, was intended to ex tend some salutary regulations to several inefficient offices, and offices discharged by deputy. He dis- 7 claimed the idea of deriving any important assist ance towards the support of war, and the allevi— ation at the burthens of the people, from the savings likely to accrue from the measure he .should pro pose; such representation& weal: exaggerated, and arose from no other sources than ignorance or ma lice. Neither would he promise,.that the ceconomy, even to the extent to which it might be fairly expeled, would .operate immediately, for there were many vested ihterests. which were always held sacred. TL 'great benefit, therefore, was to . be found in the princinie, and - in the future con watiences. The necessary increase in the establish ments and revenues of thy. Country had. brought on an increase of expenditure, brit it did not follow that offices should be retained which were only burthen sone, About being in any . manner beneficial to the doblic. If he could chew that there - was another mode of remuneratirg services, and that what:he should propose to substitute was better than that he would take away, the House, he hoped, would adopt the alteration. The service should be meri torious. and faithiully discharged, and some limit should be fixed as to the period to which that ser vice should extend.' What the limit should be, would come - tore properly when the Bill was'intro- &Iced, and the different principles embraed in his plan open to discussion. The principle of .super animation, which was adopted in the customs, he would enlarge, so as to meet those services ; and the fund out of which they should be paid, was that which would accumulate by the.abolitiort of. Sin ecure 'Offices. As all those offices could not tall in immediately, the plan might operate for a short time as an increase of expense, but as he had ale ready stated, it ‘t otild be found in the end to be economical and beneficial. There were not many sinecures, to which some description of dute.was not attached, but those would be consolidated with other offices. The Bill which -he propoSed had. thing in it original. It followed the system of Mr. Burke ; it was of the same description with that which Mr. Pitt had applied in all the largq depart ments of the Customs. It was also his intention to reduce the Irish Pension List, which he thought greatly disproportionate to its revenues. After some further observations, chiefly with re ference to Offices of Law, which he stated required much regulation, he conclued with moving for leave to bring in a Bill for abolishing sinecures, regulat ing offices discharged by. depUty, and providing other me ins for the remuneration of services.— Leave given. _ . _ CAPTAIN KING. Lord FOLKESTONE tose to present a Petition which he thought of much importan , :e to the fa -11/4vousite service of the nation, as well as to the vidual, who was a Naval Officer, of the name of King. He had gone out as Lieutenant on the expe dition to the Cape of Go: d Hope, under. Sir Home Popliim, and shared • the prize-money on that occa sion. From thence he . preceeded to BuetL.s Ayres 'as Captain of the Diadem, and at that pi ice had *kted on'shdre as •Lientenant.:Colonei of Marines. He bad been acknowledged in those different offices by hi, Majesty's Governtnerit, and 'passed all his accounts as Captain of tii , e Diadem. Under these circumstance 4 lie was-led to 'expect'his share of the . . . 'Stead of which he I,4fi named in the Wntrent for tbe distediution of the piise-money Only as Lieutenarit King, and received his proportion according to that ranlk. Beirig the father of a Considerable•familY, and thinking the subject to be of great importance to the iNiavy, .he had petitioned the Treasury, acid last of all came forAard to apply to that House. The case appeared to him so hard, that he should only move that the Petition should lie Upon t he tank, in the hope that Ministers would recommend some relief: if that was not done, he should adopt sonic furl her proceeding _• The SPEAKER said, that as tba Petition complain ed of pecuniary loss, it would be for the House tit consider how tar that was to be understood as an ap, plication for money. Lord FOLKESTONE Said; that it Complained also that the pradtice of the Navy was de Parted from in this instance, and it would be competent to a Corn mitt,e, if any should be appointed, to inquire into the conduit of Ministers, and move a censure on them if they appeared to deserve it. The motion was also necessary to the charader of the Officer himself. The SPEAKER said, he understood from the I\,ro ble Lord, that the Petition coalplained of pecuniary loss and other things. It would be for the House to decide whether all applic4tions for money. might not be introduced upon the same occasion. Lord FOLKESTONE said, that the idea of its being an application for money, was a comment of his own (Lord Folkestone's), and he hoped would not be interpreted to the disadvantage of the, person whose Petition he presented. The ad, he believed," was done for the purpose of putting money in Sir Home Pdpham's pocket. It was true, that Sir H. Popham had hoisted the pendant illegally, but what could that Gentleman have ?lone Was h e t o di 4 . obey his superior officer, who had commanded hiril to at as Captain ? If any person should safer for the illegal ad, it should be the person who had com mitted it. The SPEAKER said, that as the prayer for remu nerat&on w as only a comment of the Noble Lord, he felt himself at liberty to put the question. Mr. Rose said, tho ease was one of considerable hardship, but he did not know in -• what way the House could deal with it. It was a matter not de cided by Mmisters, but, he believed, was heard be fore the Privy Council for many days; anctit was at their particular recommendation that Captain king was not permitted to have a share as Captain, of the ship. It was not for the benefit of Sir Home Popf ham; or any other man. He had never beard an Officer- better spoken of than Captain King, but he could not sanCtion the principle of applying to the House for relief in such cases. As to the present step being necessary to. his charaaer, he had never heard any thing against .it, nor did he think it pos sib:e that it could be implicated. Mr. STEPHEN rose to correa an accidental mTs statement of his Right Honourable Friend.• Counsd had certainly nvt been heard in this case before the Privy Co:lnca. He then entered into .a legal dis quisition to prove, that the case was not a law case, that it came under the Prize AO, to be decided under the prerogative. The Commcdore had no power to appoint a Captain, and Captain King hav ing been thus illegally appointed, did not come within the ti - cope of the proclamation for the distri bution of prize-money, under the assumed title to which he had no right. There was no apprehen sion, that this principle of exclusion would extend to any other Officers, as it was grounded merely on the illegality or 'Captain Kin's appointnient. _ _ WHITBREAD •••• • •. Mr, WHITBREAD considered it a case of excessive hardship, that when an improper as had, been done ny fir H. Popham, he should be remunerated at the expellee of Capt. King. , Mr. Rose explained. L • • C}JANCL.LOR • of t h e. EXCHEQUER appre hended that the Petition was (or money; and as a Petition for money, it could not be received by the House without a previous recommendation on the part of his Majesty. The Noble Lord, by whom it bad been introduced, had rightly stated, that there . was no actual demand for money in the prayer of the Petition, but at the same time he had properly admitted that pecuniary remuneration was the ulti mate aim, and necessary consequence of the petition. Such, certainly, was the true construction to be put upon the petition, and no one could - possibly enter tain a different opinion.. Gentlemen on the other side were in .error to contend that there was no other mode of bringing the subject under the consideration of Parliament. On a statement. of the fads , con tained in the petition, they might Move for papers to elucidate those facts; and if the House thought a sufficient ground was laid for the produaien of the papers, they would afford sufficient means of judg- - Mg of the true character of the .proceeding alluded. to. - Whatever might fall from Honourable Gentle men in the heat of debate, he was convinc e d than did not really themselves believe that there was any prefneditated injustice in the present • case.---•• It • certainly, was a case which had been attended with considerable difficulty. It had long occupied the attention of the Privy Council. They had corn , pared the conflicting memorials .on the subject, but they had- certainly not heard Counsel. The Law Officers Of the Crown had been consulted by Go vernment ; and the result of all those deliberations and consultations was, a determination to set aside the illegal arpointment altogether, without any re ference to the charaaerof Capt. King; and to leave the parties 'in the same situation as. if that appoint ment had never taken Ace. As to L'Espoir, the ap pointment of Capt. King to that ship proceeded from the same - source as his appointment to the Diadem, and consequently was equally illegal. He re ceived his share of the prize-money as a Lieute, nant, which was his legal rank. He was very ready to own that Captain King having long aaedas C ,p -lain, might feel himself disappointed in his expecta tions of receiving a larger share of prize-money than that which lie adually did receive. He ex pressed his regret that such a meritorious Officer should experience any Mortification; but he von fessed •that the case did not appear to him to be one of such hardship as to demand relief from the Droiis of Admiralty. Had his opinion been different on this. subjed, nothing would have been more easy than to have remunerated Captain King from that • fund, without doing any injuty to Sir Home Pop ham; to whom he had been so strangely accused of sacrificing Captain King's interests. He trusted the House would pause before they authorised the bring ing of prize causes before them. They must be on the Prerogative; Int they were not aware of the multiplicity of perplexing husinessin which such a proceeding would necessarily involve them. He begged to caution Gentlemen ag-linst abandoning themselves to the first fechngs of liberality ; unless sind , ..ed.. a gross abuse and opp ress i on were_ deafly established. He trusted that the House wou!d agree with .rhim. in rejecting petition, on the ground which he haul before soted, . viz. that it was a, petition tor money, .not tecommended by the Crown ; leavittg the (inestion open co discus shin in .any other way, should the Case appear to de mand tt. Mr. WHITBREAD eNpl Mrs PONSONBY contended . that if every petition coMplaining cif oppression in point of money, were to be considered as a dirt applicatirm for moniiy, requiring the recommendati o n of the Crown, the !louse would soon be at a loss to know what peti. lions they were at liberty to entertain. litter some further observations he concluded, by expressing a hope that this question would be iitertained by the House when it should Come before them, in a form freed frOm - itspreSent Sir C POLE said, that if CaptainiKing had been only a passenger on b o a r d the Diadem, and hid been Sent on shire to, cOmtuand the marines, al Lieutenant Colonel; he wonld have been entitled to share as a Capt. lin of the Navy. Mr. YuilKes obs . erved, that the question was, whether the p -ti:ion or substantially for a grant of th e public ,moneyor - not . . As to the appoint- Ment by AdMiral Sir Home Popham, all such no. initiations could be bkit temporary, and must be subject to the ultimate decision of the Board of Admiralty. Though he admitted tbat Captain King's was a bald case, .yet there was not the smallest ground for, ascribing the conduct which had been pursued towards that Officer to partial and un just motives. Lord COCHRANE contended that Captain King , WAS entitled to all the advantages of the rank the duties of which he had performed; and that the de cision of the Privy Council on his case ought to be reserved. It was the inadequacy of the rewards held out to Naval Officers that had kept hire_ (Lord Cochrane) so long ashore for although he would never become the robber of his c,untry,.. he did no see why he should not have a fair share of the plunder of the enemy. Adverting to the peti tion front General Sarrazin, which be had been prevented from presenting, he expressed his regret that. Ministers had not had the energy to put that experienced General's plans into execution. Mr. P. MooRE supported the motion. Admiral HARVEY, on the contrary, while he ad mitted the hardship of the case, and the merits of Captain King, was of opinion, that the petition must be considered as for a grant of public money. Mr. CROKER opposed, and Mr. BASTARD sup ported the bringing up the petition. Lord FOLKESTONE, after an observatiom from the Chancellor of the Exchequer, w;thdrew the peti tion 4, and moved that there be laid before the House, " Copies of any Memorials or Papers, forwarded by Grptain King to his Majesty, or the Board of Ad miralty, respe6ting his Claims to the Prize Money, resulting from the capture of , Buenos Ayres ; as also the opinion olthe Law Officers of the Crown on the Same." Mr. YORK objeded to the motion, on the perinci. ple that the House ought not to entertain it without further groundi. The debate, on the motion of Mr. WHITBREAD, was adjourned until the Bth of April. CAPTAIN TOMLINSON. Mr. 'WESTERN rose to move for the produaion of certain papers relative to tire prosecution and trial of Capt. Nicholas Tomlinson, of the Royal Navy.— The Hon. Gentleman observed, the sole motive which he had in bringing the subjed before the House was, in order to vindicate the character of a brave and gallant Officer, and to °him redress for the injuries which he had sustained in consequence of being uijustly prosecuted. He slated, that - Captain Tomlinson was formerly Commander of the 'letter gun-brig; that it became necessary to have some some repairs made in the vessel, which run into Dartmouth, where the repairs were done, and the documents were transmitted to the MI:). Board, and upon those documents was grounded the accusation—that Capt. T. bad conspired vt ith one Tanner, a shipwright; to defraud the GAternmenr, by making extraordinary charges for the repairs of his vessel, which charges were to be substantiated by a torgery of the blacksmith's account of work. The sum charged being 981. when in point of taft only. 2gl. was expended. The Hon. G ent l eman complained that the prosecution was not insiitutea arising from ma li ce i n the Navy until fifteen yeais after the t ransa di oa took plaCe, B in gr u c t l, ed on ac ita c s ount of complaints made by that Of ficer that he was not supplied with ,thesnecessary stores for an enterprize to which he was appointed in the Scheldt during the summer of 1809 ; com mented on the proceedings with respect to his ar• rest on the charge, and proceeded to notice the re port o' the trial at the' Old Bailey, and the speech of the Attorney General, which, he contended, was not to be justified ; as for the mere statement, the • Learned Judge who presided direded an acquittal ; he therefore contended, that as there was nothing on the trial to conned him with Tanner, the ship wright, at Dartmouth, the prosecution was a cruet one. The motive for running ir.to Dartmouth was not stated, but on account of the whir! not allow ing him to make Plymouth. Capt. T. had ma , le application, as well as Tanner, to the Solicitor of the Navy Board, and to one of the Commissioners, to be heard, but were refused. Having dwelt at con siderab!e length on the hardship of the e.se, he con• . eluded with moving for 1 4 Copies of all Letters and Informations to the Navy Board, which induced that Board to order a Prosecution to be instituted'apinst capt. Tomlinson and W. Tanner." Mr. CROKER denied that there was any delay or. negled in the. Navy Board, in not having furnished the stores required, consequently that they could not be accused of malice to the prosecution.-- There bad been some years back a sort of mercan tile and ship-building eonnrction between C3pt. Tomlinson and Tanner, subs equent to which Tan ner becatne a bankrOpt. The asignees made a' de mand of a debt due from the Capt. to the litter which demand he resisted, stating that he had no tr3nsac• lion with Taifner so far back as 1795. The as signees brought their action, and- it was necessary to prove the signature cat. the Cantain to