The Sun. — London, England, 1829-02-21 00:00:00

Gentlemen (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) had stated occupied men's attention, might be the cause why the A tm a former occasion, that it was not intended to re-appoint vantage of reviving the Committee of Finance had been the Finance Committee at present ; that was to say, as he neglected. The Committee had been accused of not hay inferred, not within such a period as would enable • them ing made that progress which they ought to have done, to take the estimates into their consideration. Now, as but be thought a sufficient answer to that accusation would Jr.A Canning had promised to refer the whole financial be the enumeration of the officers in the different depart• state of the country to a Committee—as the Right Hon. ments whom they had examined. He maintained thet the Secretary of Stag for the Home Department had come ' the very inquisition set on foot by this Committee was a down to that House and fulfilled the pledge given Ly the , benefit of itself, for it made men in public offices, who late Minister, and eahl that he anticipated very great had always a tendency to increase their expellees, cautious benefit from the labours of such a Committee—he did ' how they acted. It besides restored to the Treasury that think this resolution on the part of the Government was constitutional control which they ought to possess over all vele. extraordinary. This was the fifth Finance Com- public establishments. He begged to call the attention of mittee that had been appointed. All the preceding i the House to the state of the colonies, not one of which Committees had been allowed to rs7:;ort fully, bet this one i was any thing but a burden to this country. 'l he Corn was stopped, he might almost say, in linrine. The mittee had obtained most luminous returns of the state Finance Committee had beer able to report only upon two of the trade, population, and civil establishments of each or titre, important points. Their whole time had been particular colony, and the ground-work was laid for ocupied in collecting documents and evidence which would some uniform principle of Colonial Government, by which enable them to report on all points, taking service by not only the finances of the Government would be im seevice. The Committee had been attended by eighteen proved, but also the condition of the colony made more or twenty Members during the whole of the Session, flourishing. There was another subject of great import. anti they he'd made such good use of their time, ante under the consideration of the Committee : he alluded that they would in all probability, having arranged and to the system of excessive taxation, which was the cause collected their evidence, been able to report early in the of smuggling. It appeared that this country expended no present Session. Why, then, was the Committee sus- less a sum than 700,0001. in endeavouring to suppress ponder! ? He was not aware that the House was dissatis- smuggling. The duty upon tobacco unmounted to tied with the reports that the Committee had already made. 3,000,0001. a year, and the duty on brandy to 1,500,000/. From the four'll report, in which they were so much in- Now be would put it to the Right Hon. Gentleman, debted to the Right Hon. the Master of the Mint, he was whether it would not be better to raise the suns of sol e that the House must have derived a great insight into 11,000,0001. by some other tax, than by such a one as led the tietencial state of the connote. The first report re- Ito the crime of i stoue ' gling, particularly when the country epected life annuities, and was hastily drawn up , becau s e , was put to so much expense in collecting the tax. With from toe system pursued in granting these annuities, a respect to the subject of the public accounts, be was of heavy charge was found to be imposed upon the country. opinion that the Committee would, without any great dis- The Ordnance Department formed the first subject of the fieulty, have determined on a satisfactory arrangement. If Committee's consideration, and their reason for taking that the practice pursued in France were adopted in this comm on first was, because they had the advantage of the assist- try, it would induce a perfect system of accounts. In mice of the Right Hon. Gentleman, the present Secretary France, within six weeks after the termination of the vear, of War, who bad applied himself as well as he was able to a regular account of the public money wee furnished which edect a retrenchment in that office. He was ready to say had been audited by an efficient and responsible Board. that that M o nt Hon. Gentleman had advanced very consi- With respect to the finances of the country, he believed derabiy indeed. For that reason, and because the CCM- it had been the intention of the Committee to follow up ntittee thought the principle. open which the Ordnance their fourth report by another, in which they would have Department wos constituted were such as ought to form an shown the sources from which the revenue was collected. example to other boards, that report was made to the House He wished to see a C omm itte e o f t h at House appointed to as 4000 as expedient, and it did appear to biro to embrace inquire how much of the gross revenue of 58,000,000/. et * greater part of the subject. The Finance Department wis collected from the pockets of the people. H a yn i e ex - was, however, postponed , a nd the Committee intended to pected this to be made the subject of examination by a report generally on the moat expedient way to deal with Committee, he hail bestowed some time in making himself the public money, and to advise that the persona en- acquainted wi.li the various complicated details connected trusted with it should give proper securities. The Com- with the question, and he had no hesitation in saying that mittee slid as much as it was possible for them to do, it could be proved that the industry of the country had and in that report they showed that they had quite enough been materially injured by the system of taxation now in to occupy them another year. He was sorry to trouble operation. It would be a question worthy of that House the House by reading elttract4 from the :report ; but really, to examine and decide by what meatis the revenue actually when this Committee, which in , td devoted its best wanted could be obtained from the people with the least service to the advantage of the country, was to be put possible injury to the progress of industry, and the accu an end to without the least reason given, or without any mulation of capital, and with the least possible vexation to change of circumstances to warreet mien 1 proceeditign— those who had to furnish it. It would, on examination, for he saw nothing in the cireumttanutes of the time which be found that on some of the enaterials of manufacturers ought to induce the Government to put an e nd to the either in their raw state, or in the early states of prepare committee,—let felt it his duty to show the House what a Lion, no less a suns than 6,000,0001. were annually lost to vast deal of good the continuance of the committee would the consumer. In some instances the tax on th e raw have e ffected. If it was desirable for the country that this article was greater than the cast of manufacture. H e committee should be appointed in Is2B, it was eight and would avoid entering into details, but lie must repeat that just with respect to his Majesty's recommendation, with such a system was most injurious to the progress of wealth. respect to Ministers themselves, that the committee having It w; only by the progress of accumulating capital and collected a great deal of evidence , tftvadd continue to sit, in wealth that this country had been able to surmount her or d e r that the country might be enabled t 9 judge of its difficulties. If Obstructions were opposed to those sources labours. It would even be inexpedient to move for a copy of improvement, we most remain stationary ; whilst, if the ob,trtictlons to the accumulation of wealth were. re of that evidence, as it was mer el y dr y evidence, without any comments arising out of the knowledge which the atoned, we should be enabled to struggle against any ditli oommittee had acquired, and would out be near so useful cuitiee, He did not propose that any sudden reduction as if accompanied by the report.---(Tlie Hots, Member here should be ronde its the blanch of taxation to which he had read an extract from the report of the committee, stating alluded. He was only desirous, that if upon in qu iry it the reason why they entered upon the examination of the should appear to be attended with the prejudicial c o ne e _ O r/ Lance Department first ; and also stating that they quences which he lied attributed to it, it should be ma d e did not consider the report as a full or final one. During tbe4:object of gradual reduction. Those Members of the t h e re ading of these extracts there IV:19 some confusion in House who bad belonged to the Committee of Finance mu st t h e H ou se.) —The Hon. Member stated he wished to call he aware, that independently of the great items of expense, the attention of the House to the following clause, as l ie the army and the natn, considerable sums might be saved considered it a very important one. He was soiTy to under other heads. The rnvision of the Colonial System trouble the House by readingextracte , b ut he thou g ht, not- would, lie thought, be attended wit., e large reduction of withstanding that one great and vita l q uestion seemed now taxati.en io this country. There could be min kind of diffi exclusively to occupy the attention of the House, that it eulty in dinsonering new taxes which would produce a was every man's duty to guard the public purse. That sufficient revenue without; pressing on industry. He was was the first time the House was called upon to vote the anxious for the appointment of a Committee, because he public money, arid the House, he thought, ought not to l*t thought these subjects could be much better examined and the occasion pass without comment. He had no wish to di:teemed in a Committee than by t he Government. i t was pr es s himself upon the notice of the Hou s e , and he wo uld quite ern as had been observed by his lion. Friend , t h at e, sit down if they were not disposed to hear him, fi rm ly con - the attention ,4f Ministers Was too muck engrossed in their vinced that he had done his duty. [The lion. )Number here respective tit/put - 44%44a5, to allow them to enter upon those read another extract from the r e port, i n which the Cowl- laborious inquiries witioti etteee the necessary preliminaries mattes bid it down as a principle that no Government to the effecting iff great reform:, Ile would wish to know was juetifued in taking even the smallest sum of money wheeler it was time intention of llioistente to postpone the from the people unless the purpose to wi i ;eni the m oney appoiintenate of time Committee until they had goe eid of was to he applied was clearly established to tie of a deantage I the weighty butineee which at present pressed upon them, to the public.] This appeared to him to be a very 'en- ior whether they ineaot to object altogether to its ap por . tat t statement. The Committee were also guided, lie palaitment ? thought, by proper v iew s with reference to expenditure The CHANCELLOR of the ei t X.CHE tn QUER ob- had fallen and revenue. They thin k it ex p edient to p rovide for the served, that though he concurred in much eee expenditure, a.nd then to make the revenue ;opal to it. from the Hen. Baronet, be did not consider it necttnarYt ' But if the revenue was more than equal to the ettpaodi- on the present occasion, to enter into any d iscussion W it h tore, it became the duty of t he Committee to look minutely respect to the various topics referred to 41 his obserVae into the means of making the expenditure and the revenue Lions, To enter into any detail with respect to those to meet. The Committee therefore followed out that view, pies at a rime when the House were expecting other Irel and they dealt with one great subject, which vita Ho us e portant busing: fi; be brought under their consideration, and the Government had supported for many years—that would be neither lair non convenient. It appeared horn delusion of the sinking fund. The Ministry and the Cont- the s peech of the Hon, Membea - for Abingdon, that what mittee come to the conclusion that this delusion, which be (the ithancellor of the Exchequer) bad before stated i'ad been kept up so long, and which a gnat many gen- had been misunderstood; he was therefore anxione to re tlernen did not believe to be eo complete a deluoion as it peat in a few wetetia what he had before stated, when he , turned out to be, ilwuld 'ee put an end to. Another great was asked whether it wet the intention of Government to obj.ct of inquiry respected the unfunded debt, but the Come move for the revival of the Finance Committee. The mittee did not complete their report on this subject. In Hoc. Member for Abingdon suppote el that he had given to fact, in ell time reports the Committee stated over and o v e r that propoekion a distinct denial. He was eore the Hon. again that they did not deem it meets nary to do mor e than Members who wets present on the occasion woltid confirm report on those important su bj e cts, Wain' pressed on the bins in stating that lie toed not done so. He therm eetneti House iounediately. The army had beets almost entirely that theta was no indisposition ua the part of GoVerument ne glected, not that evidence respecting it was not ob- to enter upon those inquiries which had last Session been tinned, but it was not pursued, and they did not come to confided to the Finaoeue Committee ; but that at the pre the important subject of the consolidation of offices. A sent moment the attention of Government was so much very important branch of the public s e rvice, the navy, was occupied, that they could not do otherwise than postpone nut followed out, because the Committee did not collect the eoneideration of the question to a laee period of the sufficient matter ; but enough came oat to show that a Session. ile also stated, that there existed amongst those very important saving might be effected in the navy de- who had been members of the Finance Committee, a dif partment. It appeared that there were already a ferenee of opinion as co the course it would be proper to sufficient number of ships built, and that no more were pursue. Some woe of opitromo that the Committee should required for the service. It therefore appears, that a con- he re-appointed ; others thought Mat the inquiries could siderab!e saving ought to be effected in the building be better conducted on the mesponsibihity of coverntnent, department. It came out, too, before the Committee, and without the intervention of a Committees and one that the ships were stored in time best possible condition, not Member suggearnet ".hat all the information which had been , damaged and in ill repair, but equal to service without collected by the Cectiontetee should be laid before the hat: or danger. That important fact formed a very Howie, and become matter of g e e/we] discussion. He did strong reason, in his mind, why this Committee ought to not now mean to deliver any opinion tee4b respect to any of he reitiveit ; for this subject, supposing there were no those courses m he thought it better to wait unlit the exist others, would form a sufficient object for their deliberation. ing pressure of business was removed from Government, The House would see, by the Estimates of the Army and and then to consider what course would be most conducive Navy, whets ter any reduction had been effected. With to the publte interest, and most consonant with the wishes respect to what was a sufficient number of men, time Corn- of the House. mittee could reef/um:lend nothing, because they were na, Mr. HUME said that the Finance Committeelng been in possession of that information which the Government appointed with the view of reducing taxation. Upon that was in possession of. The Committee could not recoin- untlersean4ing no effort was made last semteton its that Hoo,se mead to the House what the peace establishment should be, to reduce the hardens of the people. He feared that Mi- . becauie they did not know that we were at peace ; but the rosters were now eineet to allow another session to pass Committee would act very differently this year with re- over in the same unproCitafs manner. He could assure spree to that subject, the Right non. Gentlemen (the Se- the Holm he had no disposition to erow obstructions in cretary for the Home Department) hawing declared ill that the way of ',llinisters at the present ffiOttlaiLlt, when they House that this country had never ;teen in engine! a state were about to confer an important benefit on their eooetern; with r e spect cc iimreign relations for the last 20 years. Of but be could not avocet eepressing regret at not observing, ' course the Committee would now take into coneidoretion on their parts, any evidence u a real wish to economize. an estimate for the time of peace, and would inf o rm the The House had a right to know wheelete the declaration in House of the numbers they thought sufficient for a p erma .. i his Meer:i/on. Speech at the opening of the ;;:etsion and the nent peaneestablithment. If that were thie ease, let us consider intention of Vin; re coincided. He thought that Mtpi lion, their estimate would have agreed with th e est i ma t e st e rs were bound, before cassia; called upon the House to about to be submitted to the House. The Hoont will agree to a rote of 6,000,0001., te sake a general state hardly credit the difference of the umbers in th e arow m e nt o f the m e asures of economy which the./ bed resorted and navy at present, sad what they were in 1822. If the tn ip every depattnient of the state. So far as he' nt:A country was never more tranquil than it is at present, h e judge freno he estimates laid upon the table, the reductions thought the army and navy eetablisheneat ought at least to which heti been n'Teetted wete a owns trifle, and not such be reduced to the smallest number it had ever amounted es would au th or ise a 'Minititter to take credit for economy. ta cant the war, which was in the year 1822. Ti's num- Of what use was an inereaeing :avenue to this country ? h ers o f the army in 11322 were 71,779, and in 16.,/.8, Whilst the revenue went on increasing, 04e:tiers never 90,519, making a differetwet of 18,740. The numbers of mecteteed A single farthing. Reduction' were only vai'd. 9 , the /levy in 1822 were 21,teit.0, and in 1825, 30,000, when the reetenne fell short ; the moment it increased not' making an increase of almost one-tit,id, Evidence came a word of eeentomnnvatt heard. In the last speech but one out before the Committee, by which it was dearly proved, i from the Thron e , when cllstrns p i .evailed and the people that if we were in the state in which we are W e l we are I were clamorous for the reduetionor tanetton t the King de now, the whole of the establishment in the Mediterran assn. I 'dared that very considerable retretiehtnents bad teens ;natio, might be dispelled with ; yet there w as not much reduen I wail that those retrenchments would he carried still terther. lion proposed in the Navy Estimates. tftke intention was iln the last :,,n ) eyal Speech, however, not a word of this kind persisted in of putting au end to the Committee, the coin- ; was to be found, tenernly because there had Leen an increase try must look to its own efforts in future to obtain ant , re- 1 of 2,000,000/. in the revenoz,—..en unfortunate increase, du c tiun in taxation. He considered that eight or Mao i lie considered it, because it woulif tom elmenccasiou of keep clerks might perform the duty in the Navy pay- office, for i ion ee t e onnece.ssary ettablishinents. The ifount wne: t alled which 40 or 30 were now employed. Again, the c onso- ,to vote oppon men for a peace establishment. The Vitiation of offices, the Volunteer Establishment, the Cieil ! measures now iu.peoteress would allow Ministers to take Establishment in Ireland, the pluralities of offices, and the i 1r,t,000 or 20,000 men front peuland. Previous to 1793 general consideration of the best sriode of dealing with the ;bete were never more than 8,000 or .9,000 men kept in nioneY raised for the purpose of paying th e i n t e r e st cmi th e ' Ireland. 11 Ow existing distress and diecontene were re . public debt, and of pursuing its course safe through all its i moved, he knew (ine circumstances which required us ty ra mification., until it reached the creditors ha l ide, were : maintain more then 12,Oente ;n en in that country , instead of o bjects of deliberation to the committee, which they bad the present f o rce anwti enng to SP,$)9O men. The esti -eery much at heart. Th er e was grea t and useless expert- ' mates for 182; and the three following years were less dieitie in the-Dock-yard an d i n the coast and water gnartl, than those for the prezeut year. What confidence, then, Whittle lee hitt no doubt the.Ceitninittee would have rectum- could be placed in economical professions of Ministers? Xuentie.l the House to retrench.. Parliament ought to remove3,ooo,ooo/ , of taxes this year, Sir - HENRY PARNELL supposed tleit the cotutidera- in order to set the energies of the nation free. Time Hon. tion Of that great toestion which at present so exclusively Member concluded by statiug, that though lie was uri- ginally opposed to the appointment of the Finance Com elittee, he thought it would be now acting unfairly to words it, Parliament, and the country, if it were not al lowed to conclude its labours. Mr. MABERLY asked whether lie was to understand the Right Hon. Gentleman to say, that the revival of the Finance Committee was postponed, or merely the consider ation of the propriety of the revival ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he had stated that at present the appointment of the Finance Committee would be inconvenient, both to the House and the Government. He also stated that various suggestions had been made as to the manner in which economical ar rangements might be effected, but be thought it better to postpone to a later period of the Session the adoption of one of those suggestions. Mr. BARING was anxious that the House should resolve itself into a Committee of Supply, in order to afford the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite (Sir H. Hardinge) an opportunity of explaining the intentions of Government. With respect to the Finance Committee, it Lad been proposed and appointed under the pressure of severe distress. Fortunately the circumstances of the country were now altered, and we had a real surplus of revenue amounting to about 3,500,0001. It was not to be understood that a Finance Committee was to be reap pointed as a matter of course, though it was well known that many Finance Committees went over several sessions of Parliament. If Government were seriously employed on the work of reduction, no doubt they had a large mass of materials to go upon ; and if they did betake themselves in earnest to the work, he could not object to the Com mittee not being reappointed —as, in that case, many members would be relieved from a very tedious and irksome duty. At the present time, knowing how much Govern ment was occupied with a most momentous question,and how little attention it could give to the business of a corn mittee,—for if the committee were to be reappointed, Government must of course go in to it, he was disposed to make every allowance for the delay, but when he said this, he should add, that he still ex pected that some reductions should be in preparation.— He would not now enter into the detail into which the Hon. Member for Aberdeen had gone—nor concur with him in his suggestion as to the application of what he ex pected of a surplus revenue. We were subject to those fluctuations, by which in one year there was a corsider able improvement, and another a great deficiency; and, under such circumstances, it would not he safe or politic to make such an application of a surplus for one year, par ticularly with such a revenue as we had, and above all with such a mass of debt. When the Hon. Member talked of reducing so large a portion of our force as 20,000 men, he could not concur with him. He was not prepared to propose any reduction of our force, except perhips a few regiments of cavalry. As to what had been said of the number of clerks employed in some of the public depart ment, and the assertion that the work of 35 or 36 clerks could be done by eight, he would only say that if such were the fact, the mode of doing business in those offices deserved consideration. He had no doubt that the great number of clerks in some of the departments tended to en cumber the business, make it less intelligible, and serve to facilitate frauds which might be more effectually prevented were the business conducted in a more simple manner. He had little doubt that such defalcations as hid been seen in the office of Paymaster of the Navy, (and upon this subject he would soon move for information, for he did not now know even the name of the defaulter), and also at Green wich Hospital, would he found to have arisen from the present practice of encumbering offices with useless checks and forms, which removed the more direct and immediate controul of the head of the office, or which at least ren dered it less effectual than it would otherwise be found. Reverting to the re-appointment of the Finance Committee he would ' add, that though it had been objected that such Committees threw in a great degree the responsibility of Mi nisters upon the House, still he thought that the salutary controul thus exercised by the House was very useful to the public, and that it was for the advantage of the country that this power of the House should from time to time be called into operation. Lord ALTHORP observe I, that if Government, with the materials for working which they possessed in the in formation obtained by the Finance Committee, intended to enter upon the business of reduction themselves, they could do it more effectually than any Finance Committee. If the Committee should be re-appointed, they ought nut to examine the estimates of last years. These should be left to the responsibility of the Ministers of the Crown.-- This was not his opinion in the early part of last year, but he had since then seen reason to change it on this point.— He would not then go into any detail, but would content himself with saying, that a general statement of the finan cial state of the country was what they had a right to expect through the Committee. The motion for the Speaker's leaving the Chair was I tien parried, and the House having gone into the COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY, . . Sir H. HARDINGF, rose to move the Estimates. H e began by saying that in presenting the estimates to the com mittee, he would confine himself principally to noticing the difference in the items between the past and the present year, and to giving such explanations of each item of charge as would make them intelligible to Hon. Members. He would say a word as to the whole force to be kept for the year—that amounted to 89,723 men, exclusive of the forces on service in India. If that farce had been kept up, according to the view taken of it by the Hon. Mernher fur Aber deen, with reference to the state of Great Britain, or in anticipation of the settlement of the question with respect to Ireland, Hon. Members would no doubt expect that L amsiderable diminution n ight now be made, particularly as the teenquillity at home was confirmed by assurances from the Throne: thpt no interruption wile likely to take place in the elate of our feeeign relations. But Hon. Members would recollect that the force kept pp for some years past had not so much a reference to our state at hums 3.e,' Do the relief of gat risons abroad, and that it was in the soot a f f ;lose garrisons that a reduction could be ex pected; if A i-0 , 213p mild be male. On this part he would state that there was a dimioation this year of our force by 1,200 men, by the reduction of stafi corps, by four com panies: from the African Corps, and this was ea: elusive of the retly,a;iin of 5,000 men by taking 50 from each of the Yegiments. 71,;e ae:Paction of expence of this last would be 196,p001. this year. It was 80,000/. in the last, mak ing a difference of 20,`,'00/. 'The e . ,:;;•Qutage of this gra , dual mode of diminishing the amount of foi,ce ; by smell re ductions from each regiment, was this---that it saved in a great degree the expense whitd, would he atter.-ies. in the disbanding of a large number at once.; for 1::a 77ust pecassarily include a number of young livaa 7/1 1 1 . -1} would thus come upon the pension lis t. As te the Staff corps, It wae fonod that we could do without those twelve compan'ga.a. They wpre reduced in this way—seven companies were allowed to yulnnteer alto the corps of Sappers and Miners, and frio ave,re taken into the Ordnance. This gradual reduction would ale() create a great saving in the way of pension. The next iiNG cf readuction was that of four companies of 400 men from the African ,;.::ous. This created a saving of 9,0001. There was also a dinainuti,aual a: ; , ,out 900/. in the stati of the waggon-train by the reduction of a raa;aer, and a paymaster, and some minor reductions. In the corps iu ties Est Indi,es there Ivies a reduction of 5,800, making a diminutio4 of ,expen,ce of 128,p0p1,; but then it should be considered that thii sum wearld pot be wholly !eyed to the public, because a provision should be &lade [Tr apane of those who were returning home. The whole diminution of feaeae of 1929, as compared with 1827, would be 12,000 men, and a,5 camoared with last year, more than 8,000. There would I.' a dimix,:etjon of expense amounting to 73,0001. On the miscellaneous Cis swap and contingencies, —such as oil and emery money , marching raoriei, aria target rallowances, &c., there would be a saving on the reductions of 6,8881. The. next charge in the estimates was the staff in Great Britain and abroae:. This amounted to 117,136/., on which a diminution of expense had bean -41,10419 76•-• e • • Mod; s af this reduction originated with'the Commander-hi- Chief himself, J r u reduction of a large portion of the medical staffs, which meaeaare was nine!' assisted by the co-uperatien of the Director-General of the Medical pe part:neut. In the charge for " public departments, 4 %%41414 now amounted to 105,9281., there was a reduction of '4,92-91. 1 hie yeae. It was but doing justice to the Noble Lord (Palruereton) eh,/ bad ~-. l 7 . ! ! eded him in office, to state, that the greater pall; of tins ;4: was r e eldt of arrangements made by him before he pitied 'L . flaii,Va . ,o4 here he might add, with reference to what fell from the ; n a p, 2,!esnber for Callington (Mr. A. Baring) on the euqect'Orthe fed action of clerks, that there had been in the last year of ttra war - W..? leFise in ti l e office of the Se cretary of War, and of that ournber'9l tr4,i hey, ea dae a d, Yet with that reduced number there existed 'tie'aVe;;.tial -, despatch in the arrangements of the accounts, ao that there was o arrear. This could not have been effected without the most aatiere e.-.f.erions on the part of his Noble Friend, and in any thing wh:cti lit ca4d pow do in the way of reduction or regulation, he should be only giaaaini the field which his Noble Friend had reaped.—(l-fear, hear.) in all , : charge for medicines, amounting to 16,560/., there would be a, (;intion of 1,200/. In the expense of the 11-a 11 , • volunteer corps these wouiq I,u-: d i iireinution of 5,000/. and upwards. In the charge I,lege ; there would be a diminution of nearly 3,060/., and next ' year it would amount to about 4,0001., out of a gia;ss sum r,l 12,9601. ; and there was a prospect of its being ; brought to a snin of 8,000/. in the course of a short time. - The diminution had been made by the reduction of one ~:, • number of troops employed inaur colonies, and very justly. He would say that if the pubic wished to be relieved from the taxation which oppresses it, it must force the Go vernment to act differently wards the colonies.—(Here the Hon. Member made a fullpause, in consequence of the basy hum of voices - engaged in conversation within the House.)—He was sorry to disturb the conversation in which so many Gentlemen wire so pleasantly engaged, but the question to which he ws venturing to call their at tention was of the very griatest importance, for in his opinion it involved the ccintimance of the assessed taxes. (Hear, and a laugh.) Yes, he maintained, that if we were relieved from the 3,000,000/ 'which we now paid to support the Colonial Governments, we night get rid of g,000,000/. of odious taxes, whirls pressed hard upon the middling classes of society. Nln should we have 5,000 men in the Canadas? Sir H. HARDINGE intimated that we hail not 3,000 OM I F major, one captain, one assistant-surgeon, five profes sors, and some minor reductions ; but the whole diminution would not appear in the present estimates, for some of the salaries were to be paid up to March. • There was also the retirement of a Lieutenant-Governor, who had held the appointment 27 years, and was always active in the discharge of his duties. lie was succeeded by another officer, who unly received his military pay (with the addition of a guinea per day) for the extra duty of his new station. In the charge of " army pay of general officers," which this year amounted to 136,0001., there had been a reduction of 10,000/. In that of full pay for retired officers, now amounting to 109,000/., there was a reduction of 3,000/. Thus, on every item nearly, there was some reduction. A considerable one was effected by re ductions of the medical staff, and a great part by the ex tinction of junior members of the half-pay. The House would recollect, that in 1825, 800 officers had been allow- . . ed to sell on half-pay, and it was objected at the time that I inert there. that measure would add to the encumbrance of the pension ► Mr. HUME said that the amount of our force in North fund, by throwing so many junior lives upon it ; but if it 1 America was 5,000 men, and the Canadas were in North would add aornettlat to the weight in that respect, it should America. The rest of our possessions in that quarter were be recollected that there were, in the case of the younger islands, and, except front tlie seals and whales, he knew not lives, fewer wives ur widows likely to become a burden to what invaders they had to fear. There must be some the country. It should also be considered, that those other reasons than those which had yet been mentioned for who sold out were obliged to sell at the lowest price, keeping up so large a force In our Colonies. He thought while those who purchased were compelled to pay the that the real teatime was to be found in the internal state of highest. By this means a stun of 80,000/. had been saved our Colonies, in which the Governors were generally to Government. Instead of vesting that sum in the general found at variance with the people. Ile contended that the fund, he had recommended that it should be applied to statement of the Gallant Officer opposite did not lead him the extinction of 70 lieutenancies and 70 ensigncies— to anticipate a reduction worthy of the House, and such as thus purchasing, as it were, for that sum, annuities to the the country had a right to expect. As Government ought amount of 9,000/. a year. The advantage of this mode rather to be strengthened titan weakened in the pre of applying the money above that of investing the mo- sent emergency, lie would not oppose the present vote ; but new must be obvious=. Besides the benefit thus derived of he could not refrain from protesting against it as larger cancelling 140 commissions, they got rid of the obloquy of than the wants of the country either sanctioned or required. having so many persons in the army who had not done He would avail himself of the present opportunity to do duty. The next item of charge was the pensions, and an act of justice to the Gallant Officer who now filled the this was one of the most important of all. The total situation of Secretary for the Colonies. When that Gal amount of pensions this year was 1,39-4,9031., front which lant Officer was first appointed, he took an opportunity of sum were large deductions to be made—for casualties in deprecating his appointment. His reason for so doing was the present year—poundage on out-pensioners, and balance this—he was anxious to see the Colonies governed by the in hands, thus leaving to be provided for this year principles of civil policy, and not ruled by the iron rod of 1,278,403/. In the page of the estimates in which this military government. He was happy to say, that since the charge was made, he had inserted a memorandum explain- Gallant Officer haul been Colonial Secretary, the system of ing that 4,103 men had been carried front the pension lis , , governing the Colonies had been greatly improved. He to the militia account, to which they more properly be- anticipated what had not taken place.—(Hear,and a laugh.) longed ; but the diminution thus occasioned would be a He had reason to believe that the orders which he (Sir G. real not a mysterious one. It would be seen from last Murray) had transmitted both to Canada and the Cape of year's list, that the number of pensioners had increased, and Good Hope, were much wiser and much better than those that the casualties were not so nultierone. He thought, in of his predecessor, from whom he had expected much better looking at the whole system, that it required revision. H e things.—(Hear.) did not mean that in any revision any thing should be done Mr. ROBINSON said, that the Hon. Member fir Aber to break faith with the soldier, or to destroy the enga g e- deen was not satisfied in his opening speech with having meats made in 1806 ; but, on the other hand, though lie attacked the Colonies, but he had also followed up his at would not break faith with them, he thought we ought tack in his second speech, notwithstanding the explain to do that which the commissioners had no discretion to tions he had received upon the subject. He says that the do—namely, to apportion the reward according to the country has to pay 3,000,000/, of direct taxes, annually merit of the individual. In looking over the arrangements fag :ire support of the Colonies ; but in making this state made on the subject of pensions in 180E5, he thought they ment, he keeps out of view the great, though indirect as ware founded wholly on erroneous principles. The Finance sistance, received front the colonial resources in their con- Committee of 1817, in adverting to this subject, stated their sumption of British manufactures, and support of the re opinion that the charge of pensions hail then reached their dundant population which so frequently emigrate from greatest height. At that time there were 64,000 pen- hence. To take up the subject upon narrow grounds was sinners on the lint—at present there wereB2,ooo—making to create an uncandid and unfair view of it. a difference in the charge of 384,000/. a year. Th e Sir GEORGE MURRAY concurred entirely in the plan which he sitould propose would give to the soldier a opinion of the Hon. Member who had spoken last, that the reward and a retiring pension in prop.. two to his period colonial system was inseparably connected with some of the of service. At the present time the price of a soldier's best interests of the country, with its trade and manufac discharge was 30/. fur cavalry, and 20i. for infantry.— tures, and that any plan of economy at all founded on their What he intended to propose was this—that in case of a relinquishment would materially deteriorate the greatness service of seven years, the price paid fur a discharge should of England. Besides this abandonment of the Colonies, Ire be the same as at present, and that fir a service extending knew there were other projects which had been surged for a few years beyinud that period, the price should be within the reduction of the military expenditure. It had been 41. or 51. the saute. At the end of fifteen years the sol. said in the Finance Committee, that the force in the West dier should be entitled to a free discharge; at the mid of Indies might be reduced to a police force for mere defence, sixteen years he should be entitled to a free discharge not Now to this Ire would reply, that the rendering them a po bearing a pensien, and to a gratuity amounting '2- half a lice force, in addition to the other military duties, would year's pay; at the end of seventeen years he should be en- be anything rather than economy, front the wear and tear titled to a free discharge and to a gratuity amounting to a to which the men would be nece-earily exposed. 'lints year's ;rev; at the end of eighteen years lie should be enti- were given of the employment of a police like that in 're tied to a free discharge, and a gratuity of two years' pay. land, but be thought such a system not likely to be opera- By this plan he would be enabled at the end of a given tive in the Colonies. There was another suggestion,—he time to o bt a in his discharge, with a gratuity whenever Ire alluded to that of garrisoning these possessions with colo thought proper to demand it ; and if lie were st a tioned in nial troops, provided on the spot ; against such a course a country where land was to he settled, he should be end- he must totally protest, as detrimental and unfavour• tled moreover to a grant of land, and to all the advantages able to the interests they were bound to preserve. It reserved for military settlers. Now it was clear that if was said that there ought not to be any increase of force, 4,000 men could be induced to get their discharge by this with reference to the safety of the Canadian frontier. Now plan, it would be greatly for the advantage of the service; he willingly supposed that the United States had not any hostile intentions towards Canada, but be still thought, for you would substitute for men who had been 12 or 15 years in the army, and who were 35 years of age and up- considering the great and rising power which America pre wards, 4,000 recruits inn the prime of life, who had no rented, it would be highly unwise to diminish the force up claim whatever on the pension list. He contended, that held in the neighbouring frontier. Some allusion had been by anticipating the discharge of the soldier in this manlier made to the discussions which had taken place between the your would gain two advantages, you would give to the men local authorities in Canada and their principals. He readily what they would consider an indulgence, and you would admitted that at such discussions differences had occurred, relieve the pension list of an amount of pensions which in but was equally sure these had arisen not front the faults of tine course of ten years would amount to 200,000/. annually. individuals so much as from the working of an injudicious system, which had been long in operation. The quarrel He proposed, that in all these cases the option should be given to the collier, li ible, however, to the regula- with the late Governor had arisen from hickerings of old tion of the commander of the corps in which he served ; date, and was at length thrust by circumstances into pub and he further paopused for the protection of the soldier lie notice. He hoped, however, that time, aided by a bet from any moment:try disgust or caprice, which might in- ter system, would work a remedy for these evils, and he duce him to wish for his discharge, that no soldier believed also it would have been impolitic to have coneed should receive his discharge without giving a week's ed e all that had been called for by some of the inhabitants. previous notice. sty this plan he anticipated that a large He offered these few observations merely its explanation of diminution would soon be effected in the amount of the what had fallen from some Hon. Gentlemen opposite. Pension List,---that the recruiting for the army would be Lord PALMERSTON, in allusion to what had fallen greatly facilitated, and that desertions would be checked : from the Hon. Member for Aberdeen, respecting the cal and he further imagined, that independently of the titan_ culation discussed in the Finance Committee, wished to be permitted to explain the principles on which these calcula cial relief which it would afford, it was calculated to pro duce a great improve vent in the character of tire army. dons had been made. These had been made, and were in lie did not think it necessary to enter farther into the de- deed explained es such in the Finance Committee, as found tails of this arrengenuent at present; only he moot say,' ed upon the supposition that the regular force abroad must that connected with this system of free discharges, a rya- lie fully relieved once in 10 years. To effect this, it would teni of conditional pensions must be adopted, and that flue be necessary to bend out in the proportion of I-I Oth Of the slight injuries small gratuities must he paid. By the ar- whole force each year ; and provision most be made at rangerneot which was made in 1800, it was provided, that home for keeping the reinforcements up to that scale. This a soldier, for the loss of a finger pr toe, should be pensioned wee the principle of his calculation, and upon it he had for life ; and when the pension was once granted, the Corn- acted in the Finance Committee. Besides the basis of this missioners had no further coutroul over it. Now it ap- calculation, they must always bear in mind, that ngland peered to him, that by giving a soldier wino had received has great relations in other countries, large general interests such an injury his discharge at once, or the option of which she is bound to maintain independent of her imineiti zervieg in a veteran battalion, great relief would be oh- ate colonial forces, and the necessity of keeping up the reliefs tained to the eel-vice, The next item in the estimates to for diem at borne. She ought surely to have a disposable which he wished to call the attention of the Committee, force ever ready at home for snossible emergencies, l i ike that was the charge for Military Asylum, which tbis y ea' , for instance wh i c h occurred two years ago, wh en i t be amounted to 9 4,155/. 13s. B d. There was a diminution ('sine necessary to send, at a moment's notice . 5,000 risen of 3,700/. in this item as compared with the estimate of to Po rtu g al. It must be always politic and prudent, th at last Year t and tine propesitioli which he should have to mune nations, s d, ii t o o t p id re ti se l ; , •;e a lt 4 e r i st i l et o d ssa w f i e l e r nt e: place In th e sca l e r e f the nature h e h a d subniit to their consideration waa to limit the tier of children to one thousend instead of 1,300, described, to watch events. She must, in fact, have such tire. pelage Which were supported there at present. a power to withstand contingent alterations in the transac- The charge fur I;, , idows! nensiena this year was 143,111 e , tione of other countries. and in this item there Was an tocee4e or 8281, gee ,. the Mr. MA 13ERLY explained, that as he cotnprehended charge of last year. The charge of allowances on the corn- the returns which were issued from Whitehall, the differ passionatelist, and of pensions to wounded officers, amounted epee amounted to 14,000 men between the present di,spo to 1ai 5 e,,0i14, 1 .. I n this item there had been a diminution of sable force and t hat of 1822 . Hit cattle' not understand 6,400/. for the elinwaarces to i.:;e allildeea of dec e a se d o fli- how a saving was to be effected by the reduction upoq the cers. He might here mention diet the ituinigenee to diem Past India staliiinsfirtlent, elthoegh Le ;lid itot. sea Why the front his 'Majesty's royal bounty was limitetito'4o,ool4 Indian company should he exempt foie the v i eight caused and that he anticipated in another year a further diminution by the invaliding in their servieen The plan of the Hon. :if l e oool. on this head of expenditure. In the superannu- and Gallant Officer which had obtained his (Mr. Ma ation allowanee' s theft Wat; this ;Tar ruf increase of 863/., berlys) entire approval, was his arremogioeie; fi,:e. the gra but the Committee'Most he aware tha t , it witc qui t e itopira- 4"ai realuctioF , 4 the f;e9Poil vOliliAltlenti w tictr of all Ode for the Government to Mate any reductions in the tit* he liad pe6iott,lY seen, incluJing of course his own, was si i r tifi 4 n . ite l lit ß he p p i r N efr E ab r l e e i o e n 2 e t . c4 ..tlc... ' lio 0 01e olitary public offices without increasing, for a time at least, the tbroiqii the telso , ,e of the , esdittatea of thp al fiervicea fur ainpm - 4 . of supe;.annuated allowances. Ile had now gope the year, and he had shown diat the dei;r`eate was uetie l 6l 4 lance, ai in?. - ta'l iilrii , r4 tte'iPtTo.ed it io his cipening speech, nil 0194 that It was so much larger than the estimate of on every estimate except two,--he alluded to the g ran t f or 1 1822, which they all knew had been taken in its then re widows' pensions and to the superannuated list. The Right duced form, as an experiment, one that had since been Hon. Gentleman then made a generid recapitulation of his i n p l it l , ii d e t x e . t o a us o il o: v ert o ii f ee th o e f ;n ia e t 4 O be 'li o e p c g ee i , n :lo t ! t e i., ,e .e ce i e , d g i found to have entirely failed, and to have brought :Vti.'2?:4- tatt-ilept:.7, aotFeo9,cleded i amid general cheering., by nine_ aive consplaiets of ite ;:-.eziee r ey fre i t i the colonies, in the duty. He Of the men, and defects in the performance He still insisted that there was a contingent ployed in the territorial poisevikz.,; of tie Ent India Coto- saying by the redaction Qf thf TY:1 , 29 Inert in I ndia , With i ri in k en g t 9 le l l 4 l?_ C) : 7t a l r ic iP t g l puny, he voted fir the service of the ensuing year. ' tespeot i:o the number of troops required for the colonies, colonel 11. DAVIES, notwithstanding the clear and what he had stated was this—of 103 battalions of the line, able t.iteinetii.. G r e the Gallant Officer opposite, viewed 54 were available for the colonies, and 20 for the East these estimates with any Nog but get:alert:en. , are ho I n di o , l e aving about 25 for home service, when it was heard with great alarm the statement, 'that it was Tinpos- considered that there mist be always an ayerage of four eijile te enect any gr eater reduction of our military este- hetteliens on their passage. He then proceeded tp jueiify blishtnentsi, as the fore.e 0.?,..,e• voted has wanted, not for our the amount of force to be kept up according to these esti home service, hut for our colonial garrisons. He wa. of :n4t:!s, both upon the necessity of the regular garrisons opinion that the whole garrisons of the colonies should be r and contingent""lifs. kept up by colonial corps. Ile hoped that the Finance Mr. MAIWIILY repeated that he was still unable to ii.:rte‘ would be re appointed, and that some indivi- comprehend the exact state of the accounts, from the offi duals would thin yiiiq p i t ir;;:gd ;;pol it who xyere con- , : dal pap,(:-. which Ile had in his hand, from it lie op!y necteti with the services of the army, navy, and ordnance, I i.oii6ae4 that the forte now eeteeded try 14,00'0 men the into which it was ordered to inquire. number estimated in 1822, and he was rut a loss to appre- Sir 11. RAttNELL objected to the large amount of bend where the comparative saving could be explained. force which we now kept up in tire colonies, and wished Sir HENRY HARDINGE replied, that in point of ae iie ;: - ,fv;ne4 oglesthee it w as riot i n tended to 'educe it. • fact tire increase now was only 9, 2 99 more men th a n i n Mr. fl OIL nGtwithiland4 'iiia aneet vith VilliC.l iB2, because 'Coe other 5,,90t) tier, wetet net boroe span the Hon- Memter for Callington hail said' that he Would theie estimates, nut were, as Ire had explained, transferred not deal in proposals for reducing 20,000 or 25,000 men to another branch of the account. was prepared to show that in 1822, 1823, 1824, and j Mr. lIUME was still unable to comprehend this part 1825 the whole military force of the country did not ex- . of the Hon. and Gallant Officer's statement, judging fruits reel OP,Ofefs mesa. in those yeas Wp had pot ;pore than the present fprin of the acconnt,i. With reference to the 20,000 men employed in the navy' and 5,00 p in the ar- nimarge of tine Hon. Member for `Worcester (Mr. Robinson) tillery ; and now we had 39,000 infantry, and more than he had never talked of getting rid of the colonies. All he 30,000 men employed in the navy. Ile had never heard had urged was the propriety of improving their internal any complaint made against the manner in which the arrangements with a view to an economy of their expert public service had been -erfonned in those years ; and, ditnl're therefore fie thonglit'that; • asth . e country was now in such. Mr. ALEXANDER BARING expressed himself disse nt profound state of peace, we might safely venture to re. tisfied at the impeiteet information which had been oh duce the num b er of „,„ for the year f ro m 89,000 ta taincd upon parts of tire military expenditure in the Fi -69,000. His Gallant Friend below had objected to the nance Committee. Ile perfectly asreed in the necessity of 4'1 1 4 maintaining an efficient colonial force, and that to weaken it might hereafter possibly invite aggression. The cavalry regiments had however no connexion with the foreign re lief. Why then at the present period not reduce these cavalry corps ? Mr. INIONCK could not help looking at the extravagant scale on which the military expenditure of this country ap peared to have been conducted. If Russia, with her 600,000 troops, had paid as England did, her standing army would have entailed upon her a debt of 40,000,000/. annually, and not left a ruble in the Imperial treasury. Neither Russia nor France bad, however, great es their armies were, entailed upon their people such an expen diture as England had. This was most extraordinary , when the people of Great Britain could boast of a free Constitution, and a representative Government. He wag afraid, however, that upon close inviry, the British people would not be fonnd to have the share in their Legislature which was theoretically supposed, and that their representa tives were too prone to look at their own personal interests. Sir 11. VIVIAN—If it should be considered necessary to have any cavalry at all, did not see the possibility of reducing that part of our military force below the present standard. Colonel DAVIES thought the measure proposed by the Secretary at War relative to the discharge of men an ex' tremely good one. After an observation from Mr. LEYCESTER, which (lid not reach the gallery, Sir H. HARDINGE observed that the plan of alloW -- ing men to obtain their discharge after a certain period of service would prove highly beneficial to the army in va rious ways. It was to he entirely optional on the part of the men to apply for their discharge or not. The plan he proposed was, in fact, no innovation. Iu principle it w 3,4 the same as that of Mr. Wyndham. The vote was then agreed to. On the question that a sum not exceeding 3,186,759./. 15s. sd. be granted to his Majesty to defray the charge of the land forces, for service in Great Britain, Ireland, and the stations abroad, excepting the regiments employed is the territorial possessions of the East India Company, from the 25th of December, 1828, to the 24th of December , 1829, both inclusive, Mr. HUME objected to the large sum of money annuallY expended, he might say thrown away, in the recruiting de partment. Sir HENRY HARDINGE expressed his surprise 3t the Hon. Member's dissatisfaction at so necessary, and, as it had been proved, so unavoidable an expenditure. Mr. A. BARING complained of the excessive numbers of the cavalry. Sir E. KNATCHBULL said it had been contended tha t it was necessary to keep up the cavalry to its present amount, in order to assist in the suppression"of smuggling. He contended that that was not a fair ground fur which t° keep up the cavalry. Sir H. VIVIAN observed, that a great number of ineu belonging to this force were constantly called off to bu pprese smuggling ; and reiterated his opinion that its presen t amount could not conveniently be reduced. Mr. A. BARING objected to the practice of keeping UP a force of 8,000 cavalry merely fur the purpose of being able to send 5,000 abroad. Sir H. HARDINGE contended that the numbers of the cavalry were not disproportionate, when compared witb those of the infantry. That force was now only 700 horses more in amount than in 1793 ; but our infantry was much greater at present than it was at that period--so much IA indeed, that the proportion of cavalry was smaller as cone pared with the infantry than it then was. If we looked t 4 foreign armies, we found that our cavalry was entirely die: proportionate to them in point of numbers, as compare' with the infantry. It was necessary to keep a consider" able amount of this force ; and the horse artillery, though it might not happen to be immediately required, must als o be kept up, because it was a force exceedingly difficult to be raised in an emergency. Mr. HUME asked whether it was necessary to keep up the riding-house establishment at so large an expense 0 4 was at present devoted to t hat purpose. That expense hod increased considerably : last f ear it was 1,100/.—its Pre' ceding years it had been about 1,2001., but this year it amounted to 1,478/. Sir It VIVIAN could only say his opinion ',IA ahs3YS been, that if we were to hare a hotly of eaw c ary, they ought to consist of the best horsemen ; bit these advant4e 4 could not be obtained without the establishment of a riding' school. Mr. HUME observed, that these might be reasons far the original institution of a riding-school, but now tha t ; every regiment had been taught on the same principle, an d possessed a riding -master of its own, the riding-school rvo 9 no longer necessary. The vote was agreed to. The question being put on the resolution, tieat a gn,%44 . not exceeding 117,1361 . 16s. be granted t o l a d s M a j es ty, '- defray the charge of general staff officers, and officers of the hospitals, serving with his Majesty's forces in Great Bri" tain, Ireland, and on foreign stat:aas, excepting India, fen • the year 1829, Mr. HUME, when, he looked hack on the stall, before the French war, and found the expense of our present esta' blishment doubled in that respect, felt satisfied a larger so° was expended than was necessary in this department. Sir H. HARDINGE had already stated there 102, 1 , bee' a diminution in the expenses of the staff this year, as eon' pared with that of last year, to the amount of 19,7 0 , 1 ' Mr. HUME objected to the gr e at e xp ense entail,' " the country by the office of Commander-in-Chief, and the establishment connected with it. 'Wh at was t h e t4se of having four Adjutant-General; together with their sever al deputies, and so many of in the Quarter-master Ge' neral's department? Sir H. HARDINGE said, the criticism of the Hon' Meniber was not a just one. The Adjutant and Quartet' master-General in question were those belonging to tb e whole army, and their duties were neither few nor triflingi With regard to other charges in this estimate, the Gener a Officers of districts were three of infantry and one of c r valry in the whole South of Britain. One of these wa: stationed at Portsmouth, a second at Plymouth, and a in the manufact:aring districts. Surely this was uP,I - cessive. lc I re l an d th ere were five Major-Gener and less W. - in - Aber, considering the duties they had to Perf nr " would be insufficient. He thought it would be adoli tt `. o d that there could not be less than one General Officer Scotland ; and as to the Staff abroad, let the H9O, Metnfr,', paint out any instance of excess ur superfluity in it if 'l 4 were in his power. After further observation from Mr. ifuNtE, fl: vuteW 3) agreed to. On the question that a sum of 1,925 t. ip s , 2d. b e N granted to his Majesty, to defray the charge of the aIIO P ances to the print:ll:id oi.licers of the several public I)e ' partmepta, their deputies, clerks, Load contingent expene° for the year IS2g. Mr. HUME confessed he did expect that Governme ttl would have proposed a large reduction in the Pay-Mast er ' General's Depart men t, w hi c h appeare d to hi m to be 0 0- only perfectly useless, but worse dim e useless. Mr. CALCItAFT would °Or no opinion on that poillt, but he would challenge inquiry into the present administra +fizz: of she duties of the office. After• a few words from Sir It PARNELL and Lord PALMERFerON, ttio resolutioan was agreed to. , - ;10,06tt Is. ed. was next voted to defray the tlAvte Of Metiio.l and surgi(sal materials, and hospital 0 011 ' geticiee, £60,958 9s. rid., for the charge of tl,e volunteer corp ., was the next resolution, Mr. HUME, objected to the expense of 10 brigade 03- jars .rs superfluous. Mr. W. PEEL contended that every practicable reel° d e ; tion consistent with the public benefit had been pla t , within the Inst few years in the N . olunteer departm en Riesce the lat of Feb. 1828, not less than 15 corps been consolidated. Mr. MABERLY maintained that further reduction /139 very practicable. e Mr. TRANT hoped that no more reduction would b made in any of the constitutional forces of the country. The resolution was agreed to, £10,029. 7s. 2d., for the charge of the Royal Wilit ari College at Sandhurst, was next moved by Sir flend Hard inge. Mr. P. PALMER bore testimony to the humane A n i l , valuable services of the two resident surgeons at the Cf r „ lege to the poor in tho neighbourhood of Sandhurst. " u r regretted that the small number had been reduced IA P . medical officer. • , Sir H. HARDINGE said, the reductiet - i was In Pi.ee portion to the number of cadets, who were at present Y,,%e 216, but who were upwards of 400 when two rev ue surgeon.; lad been annexed to the College. Mr. HUME had visited the college since lie list ad, o dressed the House on its expenses, and he was enabled CO say that its arrangement was as perfect as pert:aps it p ol r . i i , bly could be.—(Hear, hear . )_ li deed he wished the to' f tution extended, so as to admit of a greater number .va military students. He wished that no officer would be 1 . , future appointed to a commission in the army w itho° , having passed such an examination as would ensure a P r . ! . per elementary military education, which .:hey would Plu , "; ewe at Sandhurst College. He had recommended thei,r'_, system to the East India Company, who imitated the 1] ' venni - lent in sending out raw un ducated cadets to the C O ' Li° lonies, Sir G. MURRAY ecntended, that while he admitted oi , e , inestimable advantages of education to all prolefAioo4, `~ ~ ^f