The Sun. — London, England, 1858-06-02 00:00:00

froni any of our foreign Ministers, be bad immediately forwarded them to his successor in office, and he had not replied to them except to remove misapprehensions as to the course to be pursued by her Majesty's present Go vernment. This was too grave a matter to be lightly passed over, because, instead of its being simply a post prarel ial speech, it partook rola manifestoft o the nation that there existed in this country a cabal of Englishmen and foreigners as bad as that of Charles 11., which embraced the worst period of our history and the greatest national depravity. He (Lord Clarendon) could not imagine anything more likely to outrage the feelings of the people 1 of this country against her Majesty's late Government than for the people to imagine that they had been leagued with foreigners to bring about such nefarious political objects, and he called upon the noble lord to give an explicit explanation to that part of the right hon. gentleman's speech. The Earl of DERBY —Before my noble friend sat down I thought he wag going to conclude with some motion ; and I now hardly know in what manner I should treat the observations he has made, and whether I must not in the first instance intreat the indulgence of the hones if I imitate the irregularity of my noble friend who has made a long speech without any apparent ob ject that I can perceive, unless, indeed, it be to make a personal attack on my right hon. friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer. (Hear, hear.) However, I have to thank my noble friend for having given me intimation yesterday of his intention to bring under the notice of your lordships, however irregularly, the speech delivered by the Chancellor of the Exchequer after a dinner given to him by his constituents ; because, though the course pursued seems to be elevating, perhaps, that post-pran dial speech to the dignity of a State paper—(laughter) — yet it has caused me to have the great gratification of again reading with more attention the whole of that very able and amusing discourse. (Hear, and laughter.) Perhaps my noble friend, in order to put himself in order Will move that a copy of that important State paper he laid on the table of the house. (Laughter.) Of course when the discussion is ended he would be prepared to withdraw the moti n, but such a motion would be the legitimate conclusion of the somewhat illegitimate course be has pursued. (Hear, and laughter.) However, in con sequence of the notice given me by my noble friend, I, following the example of great authorities in another place, and to prevent the possibility of mistake, obtained a copy of the speech in question and made it my duty to examine it agnio, and though I cannot vouch for the authenticity of every expression, I am ready to adopt the report, which proceeds from a quarter which is gene rally correct in its version of public speeches, and to as sume it to be the speech delivered by the Chancellor of the Exchequer. And now I must be permitted to say that, if on the part of my right hon. friend there has been any indiscretion in the course of this post-prandial speech, in entering upon the un necessary discussion of topics which had better not been entered into at all, it sinks into insignificance as compared with the indiscretion which my noble friend has exhibited in the manner in which he has dealt with questions of the utmost delicacy and importance ; and that, too, not before a constituency, not at a festive meeting, not in the natural exultation of a great Parlia mentary sucoess achieved by his party, but in his place in the House of Lords, where he has deliberately and on purpose raked up the recollection of various transac tions which, to my mind, for the interest of Europa had better been consigned to oblivion. (Hear.) Ido not come forward for the purpose of concurring in every sin gle expression or every single word which may have been used, if, indeed, they all were used by my right hon. friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer, but lam pre pared to answer the challenge of my noble friend with respect to many parts of his charge against my right hon. friend. It is said that my right hon, friend, in the first instance, stated that we were at the time we suc ceeded to the Government in a position in which the possibility of a war with France was not only of months and weeks but of hours. Now, my noble friend opposite Las entered into a long and laboured explanation on this subject, and into a somewhat unnecessary discussion, as it appears to me, of all the circumstances which attended a very critical period of the alliance between France and England, and he has sought to involve my right hon. friend in a contradiction, referring, again, irregularly for that purpose, to a statement said to have been made by my right hon. friend in another place. My noble friend has done me the honour to refer to the speech I had the honour to deliver at the opening of Parliament, in which I stated, after the atrociou3 attack on the life of the Em peror, that I thought it a matter of great importance, with the view of testing our good will towards France, that a measure should if possible be introduced, which should at all events have the appearance, if not the effect of putting a check on the machinations of those parsons in this country who so grossly abused the hospitaity they enjoyed here which should not only be a proof of our anxiety for the preservation cf the lite of the Emperor, but al-o for the maintenance of good feeling between the Governments of France and England. I think that my noble friend will hardly venture to say that when I made that statement in this how° he had not expressed in the strongest terms his apprehensions with respect to the relations between .England and France in case no measure of that kind should be introduced into the Thitish Parliament. (Hear, hear.) Ido not desire nor will I attempt to re peat private conversations, but my noble friend opposite will not, I think, deny that he himself, not many days before the debate, stated to me the very critical pott• Lion of our relations with France, and the dangers—the magnitude of which he could not foresee—if no step mere taken by the Britith Government to soothe the irritated feelings of the French people. Upon that statewent, and being desirous of supporting the Government and of maintaining the alliance with France, which I knew to be at that time in danger, I did make the statement to which my noble friend has alluded ; but what my right hon. friend has stated is,—that it was not at the period when the late Government was in office that there was danger of a rupture with France, but when the present Government succeeded to office, upon the rejection and abandonment of the measure introduced by the late Government—spontaneously and without pressure (for I am willing to adopt the statement of my noble friend)—to the passing of which it was notorious that the greatest importance was attached in Franca— when, I say, it was suddenly found impossible that that measure should he proceeded with, and when the expec tations of legislation of so delicate a subject raised by the late Government fell to the ground sod the most irritating language was held on this and tha other side of the Channel, I do not hesitate to say, that if it had not been for great prudence and moderation on the part of those charged with the management of affairs, both here and in France—it is impossible to deny that there was most serious and imminent danger of an immediate rupture between the two countries. And if there were no•, I wish the noble earl will explain why it was that on that very que stion of Milner Gibson's in the other house notices were freely circulated to the friends of the then Government, to the effect that if his motion should be unhappily adopt .d there was imminent danger of war with France! (Hear.) If there was no such danger those notices should not have issued. I see that my noble friend is taking a note of what I say. I do not mean to state that these notices were put in writing, but language was freely held, and apparently cn authority on the part of those who used, and whose hoti• mess it was to bring down voters to support the policy of the then Government. (Hear.) I say, then, that alter the measure of the late Government had fallen to the ground, and after the late Government, which had induced the French Government fo expect the passing of the measure, retired from office, there was a feeling of the greatest pos sible irritation arising from the whole of these transac tions ; and it was not possible to say, without overstrain ing expressions, that certai n ru pt ure an d possible war between England and France might be a question not of weeks or days but of hours 4 (Rear.) Before going fur ther I most say that my noble f r i en d h as, l am ti q ite sure, unintentionally misstat e d th e course pursued by the Chancellor of the Exchequer with respect to the bill, to which he has alluded. The noble earl sail that on the first introduction of the bill it met with the warm and unqualified approval and support of the Chancellor of the Exchequer. My noble friend's memory is somewhat de fective, for, unless mingle at fault;l believe that that measure received the sanction of a large body of the House of Commons as a mark of respect to the French Government and of good will towards France; but the Chancellor of the Exchequer did not allow the opportu nity to pass without stating that he supported the intro duction of. the bill on those specific grounds, and he asserted to himself the right of fully considering the course he should pursue on the second reading of the bill if it should ever arrive at a second reading. So much for the "-cordial support," to use the language of my noble friend opposite, afforded by the Chancellor of the Exche quer to a bill which was afterwards not withdrawn, but abandoned on the second reading. Well, my lords, I say that the Government were entitled to some degree cf o misendstion fur the temperate and moderate course by which they sought to smooth down the angry feeling which existed in this country, and to remove a portion of that formidable irritation which prevailed on the other side tf the channel. But, my lords, I would be guilty of a gross injustice—l wooed be acting in a man ner wholly unworthy of the position which I hel f , of the place in which I stand, and of the audienoa whom I am addressing—if I did not say that by far the greater por tion of the credit which is due for preventing that passi ble rupture, and that probable alienation between the two countries, is due to the firmness, to the good serve, to the judgniont, and to the cordial attachment to the 13 titiPh .i,lliaii, e which, under all circumstances, hav, been .. marite •° t I by the 11'mtrious man who rules over Pi s e . the er n r f France. (Cheer:, )My lords, it would hate been imp(sii;ble for a man to n a'utain mor4 firmly, to: r. bonoura,ly, inure c)o , istabt . y. with more regard to the di , , , Jiity o f this p etry a n d to t h e di gn it y o f hi s 0 so, E‘noraour than the of the F renc h has done - the cordial al liance which ha; 80and so happily su b s i s t e d b e t ween the tmo cuuwriea; longLi t o l a i s i ntimate knoalelge of this country--a kuewlieige hick , is not pos ;tined by Dicey of his countrymen, riiikucticeiVe and nth c Inttrue cloncijn'''qu'ntlY area. P , t 1 1 w r hi a c e . t 004 —tilat is to ue Government Le hay had of the :attributed the just percepth, n .diffloulties under which the Gov and o f th e obstacles which existed toentthheefruelifialbinennrtedoi not unnatural wishes and desires on his part, it 18 owing to his good sense, to his loyalty, and to hi faith that he bas.givtn full Way td that a ccurate p tien of the real pcs:tion of affairs , and has abstained 44; praising claims to which he felt this country could not nd would notassent, and the pri suing of which he billy believed wool i histo been pr. judici tl to that good under. standing whit h happily preys li let.ceen the two coun tries. (Cheers) My Leda, I vmture to ezprtos my confi _ ... • THE SUN, LONDON, WEDNESDAY EVENING, JUNE 2, 1858. dent belief that the Emperor is now as firmly resolved as he ever has been—as firmly resolved as her Majesty's Go vernment certainly are—to maintain, to support, and to strengthen that alliance which is invaluableto both coun tries; and if that alliance has been preserved and that cordial feeling restored after the temporary cloud which recent events cast upon them, although we may perhaps claim some credit for the course we have pursued in this country, the praise, I repeat, is mainly due to the sound judgment, the loyalty, and the good faith of that distin guished man the Emperor of the French. Now, my lords, passing from the language which the Chancellor of the Exchequer is said to have inappropriately used with respect to the state of our relations with France when the Government came into office, my noble friend opposite proceeded to the next passage of the Bucking.• hamshire speech, viz,, that in which the Chancellor of the Exchequer took credit to himself and to his colleagues, not, I think, unduly or unjustly, for the course they pursued with regard to the British engineers of the Cag liari. The noble earl has stated most truly that my noble friend the Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs is en titled to every credit for the course he pursued and the means he used, and used successfully, for the purpose of procuring the liberation of these two men ; and the noble earl has said with great candour that, although unfer twastely the Government with which he was connected were quite in ignorance of the real position of the case until it was too late to interfere with sufficient effect, yet they did what they could to procure some mitigation of the sufferings endured by our fellow -countrymen. Now, I do not deny that the noble earl during the pe riod he held the seals of the Foreign Department did make various representations, and did toa certain extent obtain from the Neapolitan Government a mitigation of the severer portion of that punishment to which inno cent and unconvicted men had been condemned, viz., a long and painful imprisonment. But, my lords, I must be permitted to say that the state of ignorance to which thenoble earlrefere as his excuse for not having done more did not exist later, accerding to his own statement, than the month of December, whereas it was not till February that the change of Government took place. During the last days of the administration of the Foreign Department by the noble earl he undoubtedly requested of the Neapolitan Government that one of the engineers, whose mind had given way under the severity of the punishment to which he had been exposed, should, in consequence of the state of his intellect, be withdrawn from the rigorous captivity to which he had been sub jected, and should be transferred to the British Hospital at Naples', where the British Consul was himself to be security for his production, whenever required, and where the noble earl suggested the Neapolitan Government might place a guard to prevent the possibility of his escape. That is the position in which, upon succeeding to the administration of affairs, we found these two unfor tunate individuals—(bear, hear)—one of them still in prison and still subject to all the hardships of prison life, and the other, whose reason had given way under the severity of his sufferings, withdrawn from prison and placed in an hospital under a guard, or at least the noble earl having suggested that he should be placed under a guard to prevent the possibility of his escape, the British Consul giving personal security for his appearing to un dergo hie trial when his mind should be restored. (Hear.) Now, my lords, in another place—if I may follow the noble earl in a very slight degree in the irregularity which he has committed—a very different line of defence ha, been adopted. The noble viscount lately at the head of the Government ventured, if I am not misheformed, upon the statement that the liberation, if not of both, at least of one of those engineers was due, not to her Ma jesty's present Government, but to the efforts and remon strances of her Majesty's late Government. That is a statement made, not by the noble lord opposite—he has made a very different statement—but by the noble viscount who was at the head of the late Government. The Earl of CLARENDON—My noble friend the member for Tiverton never said that both the engineers were liberated in consequence of the remonstrances of the late Government. The Earl of DERBY—I said one, if not both ; but this shows upon a small scale the inconvenience of these irregular references to what persons have said, or are supposed to have said, in the other House of Pa-liament. Now, my lords, the noble viscount lately at the head of the Government is a person of very advanced age, very vigorous for his age, vigorous beyond the ordinary race of mortals—(e laugh)—but the first sign of advancing age is generally a slight failure of memory, and to that growing infirmity, I think, is to be attributed the as tounding statement that the members of the late G.). vernment, and not those of the present, are the persons to whom one at least of these engineers is indebted for his liberation from a Neapolitan prison. (Hear.) As that statement has been made, let me remind your lord ships of the facts. It was on the 15th Feb. that the noble earl opposite preferred the request to which I Lave already referred—viz., that one of the engineers, whose mind h d given way—there was nothing said of the other -should be transferred from a prison to an hospital, there to be kept tinder a guard, the British consul giv ing personal security for his attendance whenever be might be called upon to undergo his trial. That was one of the last acts of the Administration of the noble earl. When the present Government came into office, my noble friend the S cretary of State for Foreign Affa, re lost no time in despatching Mr. Lyons to Naples, not that he undervalued in the slightest degree the energy, the activity, and the ability which bad been shown pre viously by the acting consul, Mr. Barbar, but because be naturally thought that a person filling an important diplomatic situation, though not at Naples, would pro bably have more influence with the Neapolitan Govern ment. Well, my lords, it was not until the 18th March that Signor Carafa, in consequence of strong repre-enta• thins made by Mr. Lyons on the 16;,h, catainunicated the intelligence that the King of Naples, out of defe- Irence, as he stated, to the British Government, was willing to permit the unconditional return of the engi neer Watt, on account of the state of his health, to this country instead of being kept in Naples; and shortly afterwards, from the same alleged motive—deference to the British Government—a similar indulgence was granted to the other captive, whose health, though not his mind, had also given way under the severity of his suffering'. (Hear, hear.) Her Majesty's present Go vernment had thus the happiness of seeing restored—l shall not say to health—but to their country and their friends, these unfortunate men, although during the whole period ( f the administration of the Foreign De partment. by the noble earl opposite no steps had been taken fo the purpose, at all events, of procuring or promoting their liberation. (Cheers.) These, my lords, are the facts of the case, and again I say, without refer ring to the precise terms, which were perhaps a little in flated, used by the Chancellor of the Exchequer in de scribing the effects produced, that I think my right hon. friend was fully jxetified in claiming for himself and his colleagues the credit of having effected the restoration to their families and friends of these two unfortunate men, after their long and cruel captivity in a Neapolitan pri son. (Cheers.) Now, my lords, the noble earl opposite, not satisfied with the contrast which we are entitled to draw between the course pursued by the present Go. vernment and that adopted by her Majesty's late ad visers, has the confidence to go a step further and to say that Mr. Disraeli ought at all events to have been en abled to state that these persons had obtained an uncon ditional tolease, and that the indemnity which he admits we have very properly asked on their behalf has been conceded by the Government of Naples. The question of indemnity is one which, as my noble friend well knows, is under discussion between this country and Naples. We have made a claim and mean to support it. With regard to the other question, my noble friend (Lord Malenesbury) has been able to inform the noble earl op posite that the release of the engineers has been absolute, enure, and unconditional. My lords, I said-I would not comment upon every particular expression attributed to my right hon. friend, nor defend any language which might appear exaggerated. I do. not think, if speeches made en occasions like this are to be brought under co ricus discussion in both houses of Parliament, and are to be made the subjects of motions or of debates equivalent to motions for two nights longer in one house, and fur a considerable space of time on another night in the other house—l do not think that her Majesty's late G. 1.• vernment are those who ought minutely to criticise par ticular forms of expression, or to complain of any little indiscretion of language or of sentiment which may have been committed even by a Minister of the Crown in a postprandial speech upon a festive occasion. (Cheers.) I coul i paint to one or two instances—one more remote and the other not very dis'ant—in which language has been held which, if subjected to the test of severs criti cism and Parliamentary investigation, and if the speeches in which it Occurred had been treated as State papers, as that of my right hon. friend has been by my noble friend opposite, would have been feund not to be such as was best calculated to secure and maintain perfect harmony between this and other countries. (Hear.) My noble friend opposite has cleverly and ingeniously coloured some portions of the speech of my noble friend. I cer atapinalsysisalegoanilidasniaoat _ha fr v a e m ex w pe h c i t c e h d i t him was to im m p a a k s e si m bl o o re to than re frain—to that gradually dissolving view—to the bursting of that great bubble —to that breaking up of the ice of the Neva, which took place with sudden violence, a'trr various cracks and groans and indications of what war; g place—th e graduel withdrawal, one by one, ofsin t g a le e cards fro m t h at carefully constructed edi fice of pasteboard, until at last that which it had emit s one persons so much pains to build up collapsed in a s ingle moment, came to nothing, and fell to the groun 1 , to the utter and irretrievable c on f us i on of its authxi. A laugh.) I did not expect the noble earl to comment on that part of ray right hon. friend's speech. I do not know whether he read it with so much amusement as I did ; but greater than my amusement was my conviction of its truthfulness. I felt eminently convinced the., great as was the wit, great as was the cleverness, great as was the humour of that most graphic description, that which most peculiarly appertained to it was un deniable truth. (Hear, hear, hen-.) There was no ix. sggeration even of colourin g, for no exaggeration coule be app fed to that matchless some at s diiuh —I 'hail r:naeml er it to the list day ( f my I fe—l had the go, d fortto eto be present. But, my lords, there was 00 , - part of the speech of n.y right hon. friend t. which, tsr he was making a running comment, taking down its uro due pretensions and rebuking its boastful language, toe nob'e earl opposite might have referred. Why did I- e riot say something on tie subject of fiance ? fifer' were threelopics to which try right hoe. friend sec al'y referred, and with which be eumm,d up his sin se . . These were foreign affairs, the position 111 winch e e found them, and that in which we stand no e• ; the finances of tie country, the position in which we found teem, and that which they now occupy ; and the policy which her Majesty's Government have recommended for India These were the three topics upon which try right hon. friend in his cehebrated speech at Slough took credit to the Government. Upon two of them my noble friend opp osi t e has ventured to join issue ; upon tie third zyt r, al h ge e ha tt h i boa on , b, . a e s f e ra n i ne ne discreetly da f tah:d o ef o e m a r n ci t d su w t r O s ie t i a cb ) h l y y sn s . oe i l tr d e e n c t i si pa ium H t i eng e d d i i, ityd lie admits the validity of the claim—those financial ar- .~, rangements to which in a position of great and antici. pated difficulty we have had the rare merit of obtaining universal, or almost universal, assent. My noble friend will certainly recollect that the late Government were about to enter upon the discussion of the budget with no very sanguine anticipations as to the resources of the country, or as to the view which might be taken of the measures which they intended to submit to Parliament. If I am correctly informed, no mode of rectifying the disorder of the finances occurred to them better than that which would not have been a very popular measure —a considerable increase of the hie:me-tax. The late Government, and—if there are such persons as the members of a cabal—the cabal, or those who, in the house or out of the house, Euglishmen or foreigners, were looking forward to the destruction of the present Ministry immediately on its formation, anticipated that the budget would be the inevitable destruction of this incompetent Government. (Hear, hear.) It was said, " They have succeeded by an accident in ousting the late Government and getting into place for a mo ment, but it is only for 48 hours." (Cheers.) That was the language held, " Don't be alarmed, this is nothing serious, it is but an affair of 48 hours." Eight and forty hears elapsed, and then it wag, " You will see that the whole thing will fall to the ground, and then will be that glorious and much longed for restoration" which is the main object of noble lords opposite. (A laugh.) Weeks elapsed and there was no indication of the desired consummation, and then it was said, " But there is the budget, they never can get over that. We know the state in which the finances were when we left office. (Renewed laughter.) We are very well out of it, leaving our successors to deal with the budget, which we know, that we should have found an insurmountable difficulty.' We did deal with the budget, and dealt with it in such a manner that, without violating public faith, carrying on the promised reduction of that most obnoxious income tax,--which the late Government had intended to main tain, if not to increase,—we, by the addition of tars, not large in amount, not very important, arid to whiele few persons took any objection, made such an arrange ment as to secure for ourselves a fair surplus for the year. (Hear, hear.) My lords, may Igo a little further ? May I take the liberty of mentioning an other transaction which has not come under public notice ? I refer to the issue of Exchequer-bills. The Exchequer bills t.f last year bore interest at 24d. per diem. 14,000,000/. of bills had to be reissued during the present year, and they have been placed at such a reduced rate of interest as, upon a sum of 517,000/. paid for interest, amounts to a saving of not less than 214,0001, or two-fifths of the whole amount. (Hear, hear.) I cannot say how much of that reduction is to be ascribed to the possibility of raising money on more advantage,us terms than last year ; but it is either to the good management or to the good fortune of my right hon. friend that it is to be ascribed that the coun try has enjoyed the advantage of this great saving. (Hear, hear.) The last topic into which I shall follow my noble friend, becausel will not deal with personal matters—l will not deal with those questions if in trigues and cabals, whether foreign or domestic—l will not deal with those questions of the means, more or less unscrupulous, which have been resorted to for the pur pose of opposing and placing obstacles in the way of the existing Government without areasonable hope of form ing a Ministry to replace it ;—I will proceed to a mat ter, in adverting to which, I think, the noble earl oppo cite has done grievous injustice to the intention and even to the plain language of my right hon, friend, by supposing that the reference to India was meant as an ungenerous and ungentlemanlike attack upon the cha racter, the conduct, and the policy of Lord Canning. What was the language used by my right hon. friend ? He did not say that we bad reconstructed our Indian empire, as he was represented by toy noble friend to have said. What he did say was that we had laid down a policy for India which we believed would be the means of reconstructing its social condition, and that that was a policy of considerate and discriminatiN amnesty is preference to one of confiscation, of violence, and of massacre. Now, Ido not believe that my right hon. friend intended to convey, nor do I think that he can be taken to have conveyed, the charge against Lord Canning that he was in favour of a policy of undiscri minating violence and massacre. (Hear.) Lord Canning did undoubtedly, by the proclamation of which so much has been said in this country, give colour to the opinion that it was his intention to adopt a principle of very t xtensive confiscation ; but a principle of violence, a principle of massacre, never, I am sure, entered the mind of my noble friend the noble viscount at the head of the Government of India, and was never imputed to him by my right hon. friend. But it is notorious to every one that the atrocities which were committed in the earlier period of what I may now call the late revolt in India had excited in the minds of people in this country, had excited in the minds of civilians and of military men in India, a fierceness and a desire for savage ven geance, which Lord Canning was the first to deprecate —(hear)—and which it appeared to her Majesty's Go vernment to be moat impertai.t to put down ; and, not the period when we were remonstrating against the course which Lcrd Canning was, by his proclamation, apparently about to pursue, but one month before, and immediately upon our accession to office, we impressed upon the Governor General, not for his own guidance, but to a-sure him of our support, that we recommended a principle of generous forbearance, of leniency, and of discriminating amnesty in preference to that principle of universal vicleec i and general massacre which we knew was too much pressed upon him by many of those, both military men and civilians, by whom be was sur roended. (Hear.) My lords, I say this, that when my right hon. friend was speaking of . the course which the Government had pursued, or intended to pursue ; when he was vindicating our conduct before his assembled c,n- . stituents; when Le was taking credit for those things , for which be thought the Government could fairly claim praise, there was no subject upon which be might more coefiJently appeal to the general good feel ing, to the sound sense, and to the deliberate convictions of the people of this c untry in favour, of our policy than wh e n he said we h a d laid down as the rule for the government of India discrimi native amnesty in contradistinction to universal c ,nfis cation, massacre, and violence. (Hear.) And if my noble friend quarrels with the expression that that policy, so declared, had obtained the approval of England and the admiration of Europe, " the admiration of Europe" might perhaps have been a theoretical addition to that which I believe to be the simple and naked truth. That policy has at all events obtained the unqualified ap proval of the people of England ; and it is a remarkable circumstance that in the whole course of the discussions on 'this question in this and the other House of Fa lia ment, while many persons have blamed, and many more have regretted, the publication of the private despatch to Lord Canning, their is no human being in this or the other House of Parliament who has ventured to stand up in his place and, as against the principles and docti ioes laid down in that desparcb, to maintain and uphold the doctrines and principles apparently•laid down in the pro clamation of Lord Canning. (Cheers.) Even the friends of Lord Canning in this house have stated distinct!) , that if such were the meaning to be attached to the 'pro clamation no terms would be too strong to use in con demnathn of it ; and in the other house no human being has risen for the purpose of defending the proclamation itself in the plain, natural sense which, in the absence of any explenation, it necessarily bore in the minds of her Majesty's Government. (Cheers.) Well, then the noble earl adverts to the censure which has been passed in Europe with regard to the transactions relating to the Kingdocn of Oude. My lords you are quite aware that the language used on that subject was used in a despatch which was intended to meet the eye of the Governor-General alone, and that all the circumstances there stated were so stated hr the purpose of showing to Lord Canning, the broad line or distittc:ion which ought to be drawn between those misguidel followers of the deposed King of Oude and the rest of the population. My lords, I cannot but regret that my noble friend opposite should, in the exercise of his discretion, have again referred to and given additional publicity to statements and to arguments used in a very different sense, and that he has used them in a manner which I feel will much aggra vate the danger of tniscon,truction put upon the private despatch. I can emphatically say, except with regard to the policy of confiscation, which we disapprove, and except as violence and massacre might, though not in ; tentionAlly, be the consequence of a protracted resistance arising out of that confiscation on the part of persons driven to despair, it was not the intention of my right hon. friend, and I and sure it is not the intention of bur Majesty's Government, in the slightest degree to impute to - Lord Canning or to east in his teeth that revengful, barbarous, and bloodthirsty spirit which on the con trary, he has been the first to reprobate, but which it was absolute'y necessary, if we wished to give Lord Canning a real support, should take the earliest opportunity of dim couraging. (Cheere.) I thiak I have gone through all the topics contained in the statement of my noble friend to which it is necrusary or becoming in me to refer. I must say that, although I have not shrunk from explain• ing and vindicating the statements made and the lan guage held by my right hon. friend, not in every parti cular term, but in substance and fact, and although I do not deny that the language of public men holdine high office is to be resorts carefu ly and closely watched and criticised than the language of those hold ing less responsible appointments, yet I do think that although the language used and the opinions ex pressed by my right hon. friend night have coiled forth some casual criticism, and a passing notice }rim those who disapproved them, a great deal more has been made of this speech than is consistent with the dignil of .ither r f the house., or with the importance of the ques tines to which it refers. (Cheers ) ' I have not, how ever, shrunk from vindicating an absent friend, and 1 think my noble friend might have done well to recollect that that hon. gentleman on two successive evenings has beer, attacked ou the same subject in his place in Par liament, %here he had a right to speak, and that he ha:; there given to hie opponent, first one and tin. n the other, such an exp!ar.ation and such art answer a- neither they nor the country will speedily forget. (Loud cheers.) E It 1 G RA. ..:4 VILLE—The noble earl in a solemn tone and macner has expressed I is surprise that my nobld friend (he Earl of Clarendon) ahead have exhibited such an amount of indscretion as'to rake up old events which had touch better be for; otters, But, I ask, was it my noble flieo's fault that he raked up those ever to which the fader of the Government in the other Home of Parliament made the grounds of a speech delivered at 'a meeting of his constiter•nts, in the presence of highly killed reporters, and replete with foolish charges against my noble friend and all those connected with the late Government ? (Cheers) I contend that my noble friend had no other course to pursue than to give a - aimple nar rative of face, and to show where the truth lay. (Hear.) I think,my noble friend was more thin jUstified course be has taken, and that it would have been kde reliction. of his duty to this house and the public jibe had neglected to take that course. (Hear.) The noble earl has gone over many parts of the Slough speech which were not alluded to by my noble friend. He has adverted, among other things, to Mr. Disraeli's amusing description of the scene in the other House of Parliament on the conclusion of the Indian debate on the night of Monday week. I can assure the noble earl that on reading that part of the r:ght hon. gentleman's speech, I was as highly entertained as he appears to have been. I was then traveling in a railway carriage, and I handed the paper containing the report to ono of the noble lord's suppertere, and peinting his attention to that part of the speech, I remarked that it was one of the most amusing fictions that I had ever read in my life. (A. laugh.) But the noble earl stated that he was par ticularly delighted with the truth of that description. (Hear, bear.) Now, it did not strike me in that way, and I certainly don't think the public who read the speech, and the explanation of it given by the right hon. gentleman hi.nself, will take the Fame view of its truth as the noble earl has done. (A laugh.) Mr. Disraeli in hia speech at Slough indulged in a feeling of self-glorification as to his financial measures ; but I think if there is one point more than another on which that speech may be challenged, it is that very part of it. (Cheers.) One would have thought on reading his speech that the late Government had reduced the country to irretrievable ruin and that the present goverfiment had stepped in and Fet everything to rights. (A. laugh.) But how have they done this ? Why on the very simple principle of not muddling away their money in paying their debts (laughter), and postponing to a future oc casion those liabilities which it would have been more stet ;manlike to meet in a more bold and direct manner. (Cheers.) The noble earl also claimed credit for a re duction of the rate of interest on Exchequetebills, but he might as well have taken credit for the glorious sun which has shone this day (a laugh), for that reduction of interest is owing to the improved state of the country, and one government is no more entitled to boast of it than another. (Hear, hear.) My noble friend first asked this question of the noble earl, whether he would subscribe to the statement of Mr. Disraeli, that the question of a war between this country and France was one not of days but of hours on the accession of the pre sent government. The noble earl endeavoured to meet that question with the very greatest difficulty. He was determined not to abandon the defence of an absent friend, yet that is a question which he more or lees evaded. The noble earl says he is jus'ified in saying so, because the late Government brought the whole matter into con fusion by not carrying the bill with which they had tantalised the French Government, and thus created the difficulty of the position. But whose fault was it that we did not carry the bill ? (Hear.) The noble earl raid that Mr. Disraeli guarded himself in the approval which he gave of the bill in the first instance, but what did The Chancellor of Ireland ? What did Mr. Walpole ? They fellowed the same sours° as the noble earl had done in indicating and urging upon the Government the very bill, and more than the bill, which we afterwards introduced, and which was thrown out upon a similar motion to one they had previously opposed—l will not say in conse quence ot, but in strange coincidence with the fact that a large number of Liberals voted against the bill, and that a junction with those Liberals would be the means of putting the then Government in a minority. The noble eeil talked of " tentalising " the French Government. Now, I think that although credit is due to the late Go vernment for the manner in which they conducted all affaire, yet special credit is due to them for their manage ment of foreign affairs, and for their forbearance from raising questions that might endanger our relations with foreign Powers. Now the q.uestion is at rest, but I way ask the noble earl, who talks of tantalising the French Government, what has become of the bill which he said would depend upon the answer which Count Walewski might return to the Government despatch, Tee Earl of DERBY—I said nothing of the sort. I said that when we received the answer it would be time enough to decide upon the course we should pursue. Earl GR C—Well, surely that comes to the same thing. (A. laugh.) Another question asked by my noble friend was as to the explanation of a most serious accusation brought against some individuals of having formed a cabel with some foreigners with a view to up setting the Queen's Government. To that question the noble earl has given ❑o answer—no hypothesis presented itself to him, and he declared he would not enter into it. I, therefore, have a right to believe that either the noble earl does not understand what his colleague has stated, or, understanding it, he entirely repudiates the charge as false and unfounded. (Hear.) The next question touched upon by the noble earl was India, and upon that subject there is but one point to which I would refer. The noble earl says that no one in either house, whether a friend of Lord Canning or not, has dared to rise and defend the proclamation. Now, I deny that to be the fact. ([fear, hear.) I say there are those who are convinced the proclamation was perfectly right, but who have said they could not defend that mit representa tion cf the proclamation which was put forth by those who attacked Lord Canning. lam prepared to abide by that declaration. (Hear, hear.) As to the whole ea-ic of India lam happy to say that Lord Canning's characterstands too high to be affected by any post-pran dial speech uttered in a tavern at Slough. The provider of the entertainment, as I sea by the papers, was mine host "Braga." (Loud laughter.) I say no such speech can affect the high position of Lord Canning. I have heard the noble earl declare his intention of sup porting Lord Canning, and I place the fullest confidence in that declaration, and if supported by the Government of the present day, and by the public opinion of the country, I believe Lord Canning will require no defence from speeches such as that we have been considering. (Hear, hear.) Ido not know that there was anything further that fell from the noble earl which requires len g thened comment from me, but I must express my thanks to my noble friend who, by his temperate, mode rate, and conclusive speech hiss aff)rded us an opportu nity not only of demolishing the statements made at the famous Slough dinner, but also of enlightening the pub lic upon a Riirit upon which serious misconceptions had existed. (Cheers-) The Earl of MALMESBURY—There are only one or two points, chiefly relating to our foreign affairs, upon which I wish to touch, because I think the noble earl (Clarendon) has incorrectly stated the facts relating to them. It appears to me somewhat absurd that we should have criticisms upon a speech delivered at a pub lic dinner—upon a speech which the noble earl did not hear, but an explanation of which he asks from my noble friend, who also did not hoar it. When explanations were asked in the other house, it was only reasonable and fair, because the person who uttered the speech was present in that house, and could steak for himself ; but to ask those who knew nothing of the speech to explain its expressions is absurd. The noble earl has alluded to one part of that speech, in which reference was made to disrweernents which existed three mouths ago between this Government and the Government of France. Now, it was qui e correct to say the position of the two coun tries at that particular time was rrost critical—that we were upon the verge of war, for when I saw the French tang g s as ote of th e graves t dan ger, I found that he re ag a m r b d s d s a t d h or, r , position upont , y f and he never saw me without expressing his belief in distinct terms that we bad arrived at a crisis of most imminent danger. Lord CLARENDON—If you lid not go on with the bill. The Earl of MALMESBUR 1"--The noble earl says the danger would arise if we did not go on with tbs bill. Let the country know that the noble earl who was de• prived of office because the nation did not choose to sub mit to his bill—let them know tiat the noble earl is still of the same mind, and if he were again in office he would it vas no fiction on the part reintrodw:e that hill. I say of the Chancellor of the Ex6equer to say that the moment he reArred t was a most dangerous crisis fur the alliance between England and France. Another ob servation cf the noble earl was extraordinary and in correct. He stated that he beird and believed that the French.ambassador had_cornolained of a breach if faith. Lord CLARENDON—I &Aid no such thing; I said it was the talk of the town. The Earl rf LMESBURY—If the noble earl did not believe it, why did he mention it ? This house does not usually occupy itself in discussing rumours. But I am glad to be able to declara that the rumour is not cor rect. ,It is only two days age that in a journal supposed to be intimately cmnected with the late Premier it was state• that it was in cansequence of a breach o; faith on our part that Count Persigcy quitted this country. I have no hesitation in saying that is:completely incorrect, and M. de Perßig,ny would he the first to join me in the declaration. It was nothicg done, said, or written by this Government which named him to leave this country, but some di agreement witi his principal in Paris. There is only one other point open which I 'a isle to say a few words, and that is the que:tion of the English engineers at N,iples. In the speech cf the noble viscount in another place be is reported to br.ve said, " As regards one of those men, he had been set free and handed over to the care of the British Consul before the change of Ministry occurred ; but had lo,en re- , cued from the dungeons they had pro7ioudy occ 'pied and placed in a comparatively light place of courntrntrit before the present Govern client came into offic e ." Nos,my lords, these men being t r i e d fir their lives, and we found both as regards one of these men I will rea d an ex t rac t f rom a coinmunica tion from Mr. Lyo ns , d a t e d M arc h 24 :—" Park has this day been rehased f rom p r i son uponbail." Ode o! th9in wad deprived of his reason, and the other broken in heal h, but since we have been in (Zee they have both been urconditionaliy liberated by the Neapolitan Go vernincrit. I suppose, my lords, we ought to be tx trainely thankful for the lesson on the neeessity o f cul • • tivatio is : Lia!,its of pcblic discretion which we have tlis evei.ing received; bat I would beg tho noble lord, at whese hands we lime been f tvoured with so Ingch vod advice, to hear in mind for the faturethe common maxim which says that tho4a who live in crystal 'palaces should not throw Ft A. laugh.) [A noble lord—" In glass hou es."] My n01,1 , 3•1 . n-rid may live in a gays house, hut I aria pot (vitt sure that it may nut with more pro priety be sail of tie noble lord at the head of the late (.43v,r,rne.it that he lives in a crysial palace, for he is absolutely upon ail sides surrounded by glass. ([tear, bear, and Ir,u,:lltk.r.) I recollect a tme, and that no very distant p eri,d, the nchle lord seemed completely to have f , :rgotteti —I should perhars rather say despised —those rubs o f discretion which have tc-:ight been so _ - 43Tophltio &Ily recommend fir the a,:iow ion of public men. (Hear.) We me,tall remember ho .e that alliancP, upe n the not 1e vi-count to whew I al!uile set so high a value, was greatly imperilled by the indi,creet langua 4e wbLh he used, aud how some two yeer4 ago, at a Lord Mayor's dii n• r, be made a speech whi. h called f , ..r ex• planation upon the part of the French Government. (Hear, hear.) Fortunately for the noble lord the French ambassador happened at the time to be absent in Paris. and was not present at the dint er, for if he had been he must have felt. it to he his duty to walk out of the room • (Cheery.) 'Fiero was also another occasion on which, if I mistake not, tLe noble viscount showed an equal con• tempt fur those' rules of discretion of which the noble earl opposite is so earnest an a3vocate. Your lordehipe have seen that address —worse than a speech, because it was written—to the electors of Tiverton, in which so much good taste and good feeling were displayed, and i❑ which the noble viscount thought proper to brand the majority of the members of both Houses of Parliament as men who were ready to make the disgrace of their country a stepping stone to office. (Cheers.) Now, I cannot help thinking that a noble earl who serves under a leader who is accustomed to make use of Buell language as that might very well have refrained from inflicting on us that severe castigation which he has this evening ad ministered. (Cheers.) For my part I am of opinion that nothing has been said by my right hon. friend the Chan cellor of the Exchequer in the speech in question which taken line by line or word by word, can either in tone or taste, or in its tendency to produce grave public con sequences, be justly charged with being equally open to reprehension as much which has fallen frem Lord Pal merston himself. (Cheers.) __ Lord STANLEY of AL . DERLEY, referring to the question which had been put by the noble earl who bad just spoken as to whether her Majesty's late Go vernment would, if they were to return to office to morrow, proceed with the Conspiracy Bill, said he had no hesitation in stating that they would proceed with that measure, and quite as little hesitation in expressing his opinion that they must, in persevering in that course, receive the support of the noble earl at the head of the Government, who had observed, after his accession to office, that the proper time to deal with such a measure was after a fitting answer had been returned to the de spatch of Count Walewski. He might also remind their lordships that the present Secretary of State for the Home Department had, in the discussion which bad takes place upin the bill in the other house of Parlia ment, declared it to be Lis determination—the honour of England having, as he deemed it to be necessary, been in the first instance vindicated by means of an answer to the despatch of the French Government—to give hie cordial support to the bill before the house. (Hear.) It was under those circumstances clear, be thought, that the colleagues of the noble earl must aid in the passing of a measure, of which he seemed to entertain so great a horror, should it ever be introduced. (Hear, hear.) The subject then dropped, and their lordships ad journed at a quarter to 8 o'clock. HOUSE OF COMMONS. —(YESTERDAY. ) The SPECAKER took the chair at four o'clock. PRIVATE BUSINESS. The following bills were read a third time and passed —Ayr and Dalmellington Railway ; Birkenhead Im provement Commissioners (Bondholders' Arrangements); Cromford and High Peak Railway; East Kent Rail way (Dover Extension) ; Manchester Corpora'ion Water; Manchester, Sheffield, and Lincolnshire Rail way (Newton to Compstall) ; Newport, Abergavenny, and Hera , rd Railway ; and Tramore Ernb tukment. MANCHESTER, SHEFFIELD, AND LINCOLN SHIRE AND GREAT NORTHERN RAILWAY BTL L. Mr. SPOONER maved that the minutes of the pro ceedingi of the committee on the Manchester, Sheffield, and Lincolnshire and Great Northern Railway Com panies Bill, in Group 8 of Railway and Canal Bills, be printed, at the expense of the parties applying for the same, and distributed with the votes ; that th© minutes of the evidence taken before the said committee be laid before this house. —Agreed to. The South Devon and Tavistock Railway Bill was further considered aad ordered to be read a third time. CHURCH OF ENGLAND SPECIAL SERVICES BILL. Mr. DEEDES moved that the order of the day for the second reading of the Church of England Special Services 13111 be read, f , r the purpose of being dis charged. (Hear, hear.)—Agreed to. Mr. DEEDES then moved that the bill be withdrawn. —Agreed to. Newgato every editor of o neecepep r who charged loon, members with partiality they would soon not have a prison large enough to hold them. (gear, and laughter.) This was not an offence of sufficient gravity for Mr. Vv likes to be sent to Newgate. It also partook of the character of partizanship. (Hear, hear.) He (Mr. Gibson) bad lately been charged of partisanship in supporting Lord Derby's Government—(hear, hear, and laughter)—but he should not think r f calling an editor of a newspaper fir 'such a charge. He had no objec tion to Mr. Wilkes being called to the bar of the house, and asked if he retracted or not the whole of the article in question. Mr. BOUVERIE supported the amendment of the Solicitor General. Mr. ROEBUCK, whilst expressing his contempt for anything the press might say of him, urged that the gravity of the offence charged against Mr. Wilkes was such that he ought not to be discharged without making a full retractation of theScharges containedjin the article in question. Mr. GLADSTONE drew a distinction between cor rupt partisanship and partisanship. It was often their pleasure to read attacks in the press on their partisan ship—(laughter)—which no doubt were open to actions in a court of law, but hon. gentlemen, instead of taking that course, were content to rest on the general feeling of the people against such attacks. He admitted it was necessary the press should have great powers (but they ought to be guarded), in order to protect the rights and liberties of the people, and he cautioned the house how they proceeded in such cases as this, where the charge of corrupt motives had been withdrawn. The Solicitor-General's amendment was carried, and the matter stands over. CAPTAIN PEEL Admiral WALCOTT inquired whether the Admiralty had received any official information in reference to the melancholy death of Captain Peel ? Sir J. PAKINGTON said that no information bad been received beyond that which appeared in the news papers yesterday. MILITARY DEPATMENTS. Captain VIVIAN called the attention of the house to the necessity of more clearly defining the responsibility and duties of the various military departments, and moved the following resoluti on : —"Th a t, although the recent consolidation of the different departments of Ord• nance, Commissariat, and Secretary of War has, to a certain extent, improved the general administration of military affairs, a divided reap nsibility still exists ; and tbat. in order to promote greater efficiency, the depart ments of the Horse Guards and War-office should be placed under the control of one responsible minister." General PEEL was of opinion that the existing sys tem was more calculated to prove beneficial to the army than the plan recommended by his hon. and gallant friend. At present the Horse Guards acted free alto gether from party bias, which could hardly be the case with a minister who would have to retire on every change of Government. He therefore opposed the motion. Lord A. V. TEMPEST contended that the present organisation of the army was not what it ought to be, and advocated the necessity cf placing it on a similar footing to that of the navy, Mr. HORSMAN supported the motion. Mr. B. JOHNSTONE also supported the motion, b ing opposed to divided responsibility. It was said that two heads were better than one, but in the case of the army he preferred one head, for then they would know on whom the responsibility would rest. At present he was sent from the War-office to the Horse Guards, and from the Horse Guards to the War-office, without being able to find out which of those departments should have given him the information he required. Sir F. SMITH approved of the present arrangement, for which the Minister of War was really responsible. Mr. S. HERBERT was opposed to the motion, which would in effect place the duties of the Commander-in- Chief in the hands of a civilian. He did not think that there was a divided responsibility at the present moment, for the Secretary of State for War was responsible for everything connected with the army. Colonel NORTH also oppesed the motion. Sir IV. CODRINGTON thought the present system superior to any which had been suggested in the course of the discussion. Lord PALMERSTON opposed the motion, thinking that the line of demarcation between the two offices was sufficiently definite, and that to give the power to a civi lian would be des'ructive of the interests of the service. The house then divided— For the resolution lO6 Against it Majority in favourof the resolution —2 The result was received with immense cheering on the back benches on the Opposition aide of the house. THT SUEZ CANAL. Mr. ROEBUCK called the attention of the house to the subject of the Suez Canal, and moved--"That J in the opinion of this house the power and influence of this country ought not to be used in order to induce the Sul tan to withhold his assent to the project of making a canal across the Isthmus of Suez." Thu hon. and learned gentleman said his motion related only to a canal; but involved in that question was nothing less -than the hon our of England. He contended that it was fur the inte reet of England more than of any other country that the Suez Canal should be made, and that Lord Palm ers t on was wrong in using the influence of this country to in duce the Sultan to withhold his sanction to the plan, under the plea that the pr ject was that of a French company., He believed that this policy had more to do in we tkening the cordial feeling between this country and France than any king else which had occurred likely to cause Ee.trangement. Mr. GRIFFITH moved, as an amendment, "That in any course that this house may sanction in furtherance of the construction of such a canal, it is expedient that care be taken that the despotic powers of the Egyptian Government be not allowed to he made use of by the promoters of such project to obtain the required labour from the 'faille' e at an inadequate remuneration, by those compulsory means familiar t r the practice of that Government, so as to produce the effects of slavery under the guise of paid labour." Lord HADDO thought the amendment was a very uncourteous one to the ruler of Egypt, and should, there fore, not be adopted by the house. Mr. STEPHENSON said that Mr. Roebuck had dealt in generalities, not in facts. He did not believe that the engineering difficulties could be overcome, and if they could, he much doubted if the canal would be found to be the shortest way to India, for it never could com pete with the railway. Mr. S. FITZGERALD opposed the motion on poli tical grounds, in which the interests of this country were deeply interested, for it was scarcely good policy to give to other countries such facilities of reaching our East Indian possession?. Mr. M. GIBSON regretted that the present Govern. ment had in this instance adopted the policy of Lott] Palm: rston, and asked if Government would lay the correspondence upon the subject between this country and Turkey upon the table ? Lord PALMERSTON said he did not mean to retire finally. (A laugh.) Mr. Roebuck had complained that he could not learn the reasons which had induced the Go vernment to oppose his scheme ; but those reasons had been filly stated in the house. It was one of the greatest bubbles that had ever been attempted to be imposed on the credulity of this country. (Hear, hear.) Though it might be made at a great sacrifice of money and human life, as regarded remuneration it was nothing less than a bubble. Tao public meetings referred to by Mr. Gibson were no thing like spontaneous expressions of opinion ; they bad been got up be tie promoters of the scheme, and though they had produced resolutions, the necessary subscrip tions had not been forthcoming. (Hear, hear.) Mr, Stephenson had explained the difficulty of subsisting the labourers employed on such a work ; he bad also shown that even if the canal were made the progress would be quicker by the railway than it could be by the canal As the winds blew f a-eix months in one direction, the passage of vessels in the other would be seriously obstructed. It was quite a mistake to say that the Government had been employed 15 years in preventing the Sultan from acceding to this measure ; but the Government of Turkey was as much opposed to it as was the Government of England. Knowing that tire Ottoman Government was pressed by other powers to sanction the scheme, the Government of this country had sought to dissuade them. Mr. Gibson was for maintaining the independ• ence of Turkey, but he said nothing of the integrity of Turkey, which was quite as essential to be preserved. We had sent out expeditions for that object; and every year that passed showed more strongly the necessity of maintaining the connection of Turkey and Egypt, and preventing Egypt from feeling into the hands of any power opposed to us. (Hear, hear.) Since the siege of Alexandria, every point of the coast of Egypt bad been most scientifically fortified by ensineers and funds supplied by another country. Were an army of 20,000 men to occupy that line of forts, Egypt would be per fectly impregnable to any army from Turkey. There remained only one passage for a Turkish army into B2ypt, along the shores of the Mediterranean ; and the object of this scheme was to bar that passage. Were the ruler desirous to shake off his aregiance to Turkey, the existence of this canal would greatly favour the object, and render the retention of Egypt by Turkey much more precarious. That was the argument whi c h th e Government of this country had urged on Turkey. I t was also contrary to the interest of England that this canal should be made, which might be barred to this country, our ships being sent round by the Cape, while it was open to another power, and gave them ready acc es s to India. (Hear, hear.) We should not shut our eyes to these facts, though we might not be actually within a few hours of war. (A laugh.) After this scheme had been practically scouted by all the commercial men of h e co untry—(co)—Yes, "damned with faint praise." The only result . eif affirming this res o l u ti on would be to give a " pailiameutary title" to the scheme, and send up the shares in the market. (Hear, hear.) He hoped the house would not be deluded into Ai y such cour-e, but would believe that there would not have been a con tinued opposition by successive Governments unless the scheme were really opposed to the interests of the cow.- try. (Hear ) Mr. J. E WART said that the scheme was regarded as a bubble in Liverpool, where he believed a single share would not be subscribed for. Mr. GLADSIONE contended that it was not f,r the house to decade whether the scheme was or was not a bubble. The question WAS, whether they should put an end to thie vici - ius system of arbitrary and gratuitous masons against it ? By those reasons the intera:t of Eng land was put in odp,sition to that of the world, arid all Europe denounced our opposition as unwarrantable and seiti,h. He denied that the conbection of Turkey and Egypt depended upon marching an army across the Isthmus c f Stu z. 'By opposing the scheme, on the ground of °doping new dangers to India, they put the interests of oar Indian empire against those of inaokind. How ;Nat would have been the advabtage to us if this canal had been open last rar, to facilitate-the transmission of our troops. It would be England who would obtain the control of the canal, as the first maritime nation in the world. Let them not attempt to follow a policy which tbey must abandon in time. _ _ The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER asked what evid-nee there was that the power and influence of England had been exercised in a manner that called for a resolution of that house ? One would suppose that means had been taken to constrain the Sultan to with hold his consent to the project, or that there were papers on the table, showing an intention of taking such a course ? There was no evidence of that sort. When Go vernment thought the project was of an injurious ten dency, it was not an undue interference to oppose it; and he was unaware of any step of the late or present Govern ment to constrain the Sultan. To pass this resolution would be to give the sanction of this house to the pro ject, and whatever their ultimate opinion, it would be unwise to bind themself to a pr o j ec t of doubtful, and in the opinion of many, a pernicious measure. They should not leave out of sight the feelings of the Turkish Govern ment. It had been assumed that they were either neu tral or favourable. But the discussion had been a series of assumptions; that Turkey was constrained by England, that foreign nations were against us, &c. They were told not to take a cou rse h o st i l e to France, but there bad been on the part of France no expression of feeling of that decided character which bad been implied. The French Government had not desired to give to their own opinion any weight beyond what it was entitled to in fair argument. There were grave political considera tions in the question which must not be made light of. He would not say that political considerations must not sometimes yield to moral considerations, and if he could see that the general felicity of mankind would be so much advanced no doubt the political considerations must yield. But these were speculations, and the poli tical reasons were facts. The integrity of Turkey would be affected, and the Turkish Government were acutely sensitive to the danger. It would also entail the neces sity of vastly increased armaments on our part, which was a point worth considering in opposition to philan thropic results of a doubtful nature. (Hear, hear.) Lord JOHN RUSSELL said it was clear that great power and influence had been used by the late Govern ment to induce the Sultan to withhold his consent. (Hear.) It bad always been avowed , by Lord Palmer ston, and was not even now denied. If this were a bubble project, if there were insurmountable physical obstacles, and if the Sultan of his own accord objected, there was no need for the power and influence of Eng land to be used against it. As to the alleged injury to English interests, he contended that in peace our policy was that of the purest competition in trade, and in war s whatever would be the Effect of a canal, the same would apply to a railway. • Mr. H. DRITiIMOND supported the policiy which had been hitherto pursued by various Governments of this country, for he believed it to be the true British policy. He therefore opposed the motion. Mr. BRIGHT asked if the correspondence would be produced, as in that case Mr. Roebuck might be in duced to withdraw big motion. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said ha would answer the question if put to him this day. After some observations from Mr. ROEBUCK in reply, the amendment of Mr. Griffith was negatived without I division, and the house then divided on the original motion : Ayes Noes Majority against Mr. Roebuck's motion---228 CHEQUES UPON BANKERS. The ATTORNEY-GENERAL introduced a bill altering the law with reference to cheques upon bankers. LANDED ESTATES IN IRELAND. Mr. Bf7Tr obtained leave to introduce a bill simplify ing the titles to landed estates in Ireland. CHURCH RATES ABOLITION BILL, Sir J. TRELAWNEY moved that this bill be read A third time. Mr. H. DRUMMOND moved that the debate be ad• journed (it was half-past one o'clock). Sir J. TRELAWNY said the subject had been tho roughly discussed, and there was therefore no reason why they should not even at that advanced hour read the bill a third time. (Cheers.) Mr. NE WDEGATE supported the motion for ad- . journment, and declared it to be his opinion that gen tlemen opposite had come to the determination of en deavouring to overthrow that august assembly tha House of Lords by an exhibition of brute force. (Ob, oh, and laughter.) Mr. BRIGHT thought it was perfectly useless to ad' journ the debate, as the result would be the same in the end. Mr. GLADSTONE thought it only reasonable that the motion for adjournment should be acceded to. Lord J. RUSSELL also supported the proposal for the adjournment, although he was quite ready to divide then. In any case, it seemed to him that there was but little chance of the bill becoming law during the pre sent session. (Cries of Divide.) Mr. ROEBUCK wanted t ) know whether th• Go vernment could give a day for continuing the debate if they consented to its adjournment for the present ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER ccr• tainly joined in the opinion that it was unreasonable to a•k the houso to divide upon so important a question at such an hour. At the same time he could not give 1 11 1 ) a day for the adjourned debate. (Oh, oh.) Mr. HUGUESSEN contilered any further discussion a mere farce. The house then divided— Ayes . Noes 150 Majority against adjournment... 47 Mr. F. HITYtE moved that the house do now adjourn. (" Oh, ob.") Mr. COLLIER pronounced the opposition to the bill to be factious. (Cheers.) Sir J. TRELA.%VNEY declared himself determined to prcoeed with the bill that night. (Cheers.) Mr. DRUMMOND, although perfectly aware the bill must ultimately be carried, would persevere in rap porting the motion for adjournment. Sir C. NAPIER would promise his hon. friend who had charge of the bill, that if necessary he would stay in his place until 10 o'clock in the morning to support Wins (Loud cheers). After a long discussion, in: which a great number of members took part, The house divided— Ayes ... Noes TS 136 Majority against adjournment... 58 Mr. S. ESTCOITRT then proposed that the debate should be adjourned until Tuesday next at 12 o'clock, which was agreed to. The house then adjourned at 20 minutes to three. HAINATILT FOREST. Mr. CAIRD gave notice that, on this day month, he should call the attenti u of the house to the expendi ture that had been incurred by the Woods and Forests, in reference to Ilainault Forest. THE ISLAND OF JERSEY. Mr. HADFIELD asked the Secretary of State for the Home Department whether it was the intention of her Majesty's Government to carry out the recommen dations of the comm6stoners, appointed in 1846, for the reform of the criminal laws of the island of Jersey, and to abolish the H )yal Court in that Want, which the said commissioners, in said year, declared not to be deserving of public confidence : Whether it was their intention to issue a commission of in quiry into the civil laws of Jersey and the mode of ad ministering them, in accordance with the declared inten tion and promise of Government in the year 1345, by the then Home Secretary ; or whether it was their in tention to take any measures forassimilating the laws of Jersey to the laws of England ? Mr. WALPOLE sa'd the attention of the Secretary _ _ _ _ of State had been, and al ways would called to many great and grievous defects in the law of Jersey, and steps would be taken for their improvement. An order in council had failed to enforce the recommendation of the commissioners, and the only way in which it could bs done would be by, an act of Parliament, which, in all probability, would be to bring the house into collision with the states of Jersey, which was not desirable. STAMPS ON CHEQUES. Mr. NICOLL asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer if his attention had been directed to the commercial in• convenience likely to be caused by hankers refusing to honour cheques when drawers had omitted to write their initials on edhesive stamps, but which were otherwise cancelled, sufficiently to accord with the intention of the act, and if it was contemplated to enable persons who had given valuable consideration for such checks to attach, or to cancel, adhesive stamps in lieu of the drawers ; also, if it wouli be proimp;ly sought to amend the law relating to crossed checks, so as to make the crossing to a banker an essential part of the check. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said the practice of the Bank of England was to refuse payment of a check without the stamp was cancelled. With regard to the latter part of the question her Maj ssty's Government bad no intention to propose any alteration in the law. Where a stamp was virtually canceled, so that it could not be used again, the Bank of England a l wa y s p a id th e cheque. The matter of cross cheques would, in all pro bability, settle itself. THE CORMACKS. Mr. BRADY asked whether there was any truth in a statement which had appeared in the Irish journals, to the effect that a person named Burke, the principal evi dence in the case of the Coruoacks, lately executed at Thurles for the murder of Mr, Ellis, had since confessed, while in the hands of the authorities, that his evidence upon their trial had been falie, and given under coer cion ; whether any investigations had taken place into the circumstances, and what had since been done with Burke ? The ATTORNEY-GENERAL for IRELAND be lieved no such confession had been made by Burke. In vestizations had been made into the statement, but it bad been found to be unfounded. He declined to state where Burke now wag. He had no doubt Burke was protectel by the polite till be left Ireland. DRAWING CHECKS. Mr. CAIRD asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether drafts or orders on bankers in the form of " Et hit my account 101.," or " Pay myself 101.," but not including the words " Bearer on demand," might be drawn at and paid over the bank counter without a penn y stamp; and whether, notwithstanding the recent act, such unstamped checks were legal ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said drafts or orders to drawers were liable to the stamp, except where they were drawn by the person and paid to him at the same time over the counter. BOARDING AMERICAN VESSELS. Mr. LINDSAY asked the Under-Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs if it was the case that merchant ves sels belonging to the a a e: detained engaged the with Havannab, or West Coat of Afri ca , h a d b een ficrrueidseirn:7,abnoda,ridfesdo% se a r ched , by what authority, or under whose instructions the c mirnanders of these ships had so acted. Mr. S. FITZGERALD said the Government had re ceived no official, knowledge of such circumstances hav ing taken place. A eta ernent had been forwarded to her Majesty's Government by their representative at Washington, taken from a New Orleans newspape r , but no ,ifficial communication had been made by him to her Majesty's Government ; they were anxious to pre voat such Occurrences, but the difficulty arose from actual slavers hoisting the American colours. (Rear bear.) Orders had been sent by former B toads of Admiralty, to our cruisers off the American coast, to use the greatest caution in these matters, and these in. structions would be careful y repeated by her Ma jesty's present Government, without lo.s of time. THE lONIAN ISLANDS. In reply to a qnsi,tion from Gen. CODRINGTON relative to the payment of 1,5001. and 8001., Gen. PEEL said that the above sums formed no part of the 20,0001. paid to this country by the lonian Llands. BREACH OF PREVILEGF, Mr. M. GIBSON moved that the order for the dis• charge of Mr. W. Wilkes should be read.—Agreed to. Mr. GIBSON then moved that Mr. W. Wilkes should be discharged. By his petition to that house, he had withdrawn the particular imputation of corrupt motives against Mr, Clive, for which he was committed to the custody of the Sergeant.at-A rine. He therefore moved that Mr. Wilkes should be discharged on p tyment of the usual fees. Mr. ROEBUCK contended that Mr. Wilkes did not by his petition withdraw the general charge of corrup tion against the committee in question, and in which the honour of that house was concerned. Until Mr. Wilkes made a full retractation, he (Mr. Roebuck) should oppose his discharge from the custody of the sergeant at-Lines. (Hear, bear.) Mr. CLAY also urged that Mr. W. Wilkes sbo&d net be discharged until he had made a full retractation of the charges at the bar of the house. The SOLICITOR GEN ERAL thought the house was not in a position to arrive at the conclusion asked ef them by the right hen. gentleman the member for Ashton - under-Lyne. B f .re Mr. \V. Wilkes was di, .Tharged, he (the Solicitor-General) considered he ought tee be called upon to make a full retractation of the charges c•mtaieed in the article in question. He there f ire move,' as art amendment that the consideraoion of Mr. W. Wilkee's petition be discharged. (Hear.) Mr. KNATCHBULL-H UGUESSEN Suggested that Mr. W. Wilkes should be called to the bar of the house, end a-ked if he retracted fully the charges contained in the artice, and if not, the house would then know how to deal with him. Mr. M. GIBSON said there could be no doubt Mr W. Wilkes intended to withdraw any charge of corruption against Mr. Clive. He contended that this was a partiality, and not of corrup tion ; and if the house were to send to Country Markets. LIVERPOOL, JUNE 1. Thera was a limited attendance of buyers this morning' , and, as a consequence, the business was confined to need, purchasers for passing daily consumption. No change vial made in the price of any article in the grain trade. Th• fine weather puts a collapse upon business activity. NEWCASTLE-JUNE 1. Business in English and foreign wheat dull, and buyer/ require a decline, which factors refuse to concede, and sales consequently restricted to a few retail lots, at flail the rates of Saturday last. Flour in better demand' Barley neglected. Oats in slow sale, and the turn lower. Beans and peas without inquiry. LEEDS, JUNE 1. • The weather being now extremely fine causes a dull trade' The arrival of wheat is large, millers try to buy on loWes, terms, but a n y d ec li ne o f momen t i s resisted—the trawl' is, therefore, slow, and no advance on Friday's rates "s bo established. Barley unaltered. Oats and beans qui" as dear. Other articles as before. Averages for the week : Wheat, 43s 5d I Oats, 25s 'ad I Peas, —a Od. Barley, 34a OP Beans, 430 3id Rye, —a Od. NORWICH CATTLE-MAY 29. We had a large show of Scots, short horns, and. Irish to-day. Trade slow, but improved during the afternoon* Fat beasts,* Od to 78 6d ; prime, 8s Od per stone; beint about same as last week. Sh eep, 30s to 35s per head, and good store pig s, 15s to 20s. F a t por k , 6s to 6 s 6d P•r stone of 1411; trade dull. PROVISION MARKET. Beef, per lb ' fid to 7d I Butter p pt. is id to Is 2J l . iutton, per lb. .. 6d to 7d Eggs, pe r 18, Os Od to is 03 Lamb, d o ., Os 8d to On 9d I Hens, p pair Os Od to Os 01 Veal, per lb ... 6Ad to Os 7d I Chickens,do.4s Od to 5s 6 1 , Pork, per 1b...0s 5 4d to 6 Ducks, do., 4s 6d to 6v. 61 Salmon, per lb ... ...Os Od Ducklings,do 2s Od to 2s ' 6 Grouse, per brace.....os to Os Turkeys, each Os Od to p i 01 Tallow, p stone, Os to —s 03 Potatoes, per pt., .—d to 121 BIRT BROMLEY—On the Ist inst., at the residence of her father, the Attorney-General, Mrs. Bromley, of a daughter. BRAUFILL —On the 29th ult., at Peterstone Court, Breoon• the wife of Captain B rau fill , 4 th Light DrageOils, of • son. PETRE—On the 31st ult., at Thorndon, the Lady Pete of a son. MAItRIAGES. NEWDIGATE—GARNIER —On the Ist inst., at Trieqr Church, 31,rylebone, Major Edward Newdigate, Brigade, to Annie, second daughter of the Rev. TWO' and Lady Caroline Gamier. SALTER —TENTZEN—Ou the 2d het, at St. Karat:l lolr the-fields, by the R ev . G. W. Humphries, vicar, Job ilt second son of Mr. R. Salter, Park Farm, BradnimehP Devon, to Miss Harriett Brooks, eldest daughter of 07° ' J. Jentzen, E uro p ean Hotel, Coventry-street, LeicestOr square. DEATHS. BELLFIELD —On the 30th ult., at • Prituley-hill, county of Devon, the Rev. F. Bellfield, aged 75. BROOK—On the 26th ult., at Edinburgh, Commander A. M. Brock, R N., aged 30. BARNARD—On the 22d ult., at Painswick, Glocestershi reo Colonel Henry C. Barnard, Bengal Army, aged 47. CouLsoN— Oa the 31st ult., at St. John's-wood, . 1.0 . 14e1l Coulson, Esq., late of Dorset-square, aged 59, Honcsox—On the 30th ult., at Debden Rectory, the Re v ' Henry Hodgson, M.A., rector. of NOWELL —On the 30th ult., Samuel Nowell, FA' , Cambridge Villas, Richmond-hill, and Lower Balgrave' place, Pimlico. aged 51. SEWELL —On the 31st ult., Mr. Charles Sewell, late e ! Sydenham, an 1 13, Charles-street, Westbourne-terr ain aged 3 '. - -7 LONDON Printed and Published by MIIRDO YOU l4 . ri " of No. 112, Strand, Printer, at Th 4 Sun Mc 9. 11 ,.. 44 112, Strand, in the Precinct of the Savoy, in, thir i.gea Sv of Adiddleses, Wednesday, June 2, 1858. Mc t•_. Tin t tb ( 31 3.-sti k inalaaio n ' Introd uced ; !uanaeraus corn mencisti ' 4O . IL DA 3, 17( LECTURES 'Mart pm Ope " o tlll o:deo ASS't e "' on Muni thi k tsin • , oliclo betn„ 44 4CITA hoy e COQ 4,1414 r Transf% °' next ti t tlititi jti elt o ffice IL L 4 4 14 Tw e l . 1 4 °o lD] AT, Ac e -kerz lc th e dental ,TRAVELI he Polick )4-7 t ellase are Tine Ins= th altlons.un -Total P Claims in ': Annual do4lth es aatld Co7 P DIY 'at thl 44 7, 7, D 11111.1_ Bat 41Al‘r] tat il t Jnst e x • V 3s trata e BIL " trs, Ma and pi The „„ 4 "la - kr: s i — cc-es.* t,;,„ i t Ly ( op e 11,: i tr o ac c 4 is " M atra roa NnpV i arges t atte th tne r k_ an nal 4t zi t 07 . 3 1 n 44.1c41,); ' a -