The Sun. — London, England, 1807-07-03 00:00:00

131 P E IA.I, ARLL4M.ENT HOUSE OF PEERS, TIIURSIJAY s JULY `2 • Lord I-1014,,AND re§ented a . Petition from the Debtors contioed ,in the Qastle of 'Chester; praying for relief.--Ordered.tolteon the Table. Lord REDESDALE presented a Bill for empowering the summoning ,of Cppyholders by Attorney, in cuitomary. Courts which wai.read'a first time. Slit folliq STUART: HAwKeszu ay presented a Message from his-- Majesty, intimating Majdsty's wish that an an nuity of t 0001. per annum should be*ranted, to Ma jor -General Sir John Stuart,: k: B. for the term of his natural life,. .as a testimony : of approbation of his condua in the ,brilliant and glorious aaion fought on the Plains of Abide,. ana desiring the concurrence of the House`in sua'grmit. On the. Motion of Lord ,Il4wl“;sautty, his Ma jesty's most gracious Message was ordered to be tap ken into consideration to-morrow.' ' 1 5 1),IVATE BILLS. The T,oun CHANDELLOR proposed the motions which he laid before - the House on Tuesday, relative to Private Bills interrupted in their . progress by the Pissolution ; which were all agreed to.—Upon one of the widow; being put , , Lord HOLLAND said, he did not mean to objet to the motion ; great inconveniencies had undoubtedly resulted from the late abrupt Dissolution, but he :thought the Noble,aud Learned Lprd had suggested the' best mode of remedying them with respe& to Private Bills. He thought however; that in point of regularity, a list of Private Bills, which had been interrupted in their progress by the Dissolution, bliotild be laid before the House. His Lord Ship Moved for a list of this description ; whieli motion was agreed to, and the list haVing :been previouSly prepared by the clerk, was present •ed, and ordered to lie on the table. _ Lord \VALsi twli Am presented a great number of renewed Petitions for Prkiate ; which were referred to Committees. Adjourned till to-morrow (this day). • HOUSE OF COMMONS, THVIUDAY,.JULY . nuow.s. obtained leave, to •bring in a Bill for ereaing a - Theatre at Birmingham. ELFCTION PETITIOy, A Petition` was 'presented from W. Fact!. Esq. conipt4ining of an undue EleeliOn for -.,theßortrugh of S;altasli. Ordered in be taken into Consideration on Tuesday, ..141y. 4.---Also, a Peti lion 'front Su,uorsoN, Esq. complaining of an undue Elc&ion for the cotinty of Sussex. -derect to be taken into consideration on Wednesday, July Mr. CRSEVRY gave, notice, that on i Monday sett ,night he should move for Copies of allinispatdles apd, Letters' relative to the late unfortunate transac tion at VellOre. EvENTim OF SMUGGLING. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said; the provimons already adopted for the Preven tion of Smuggling, were eveiciel by new devices, Which ,vould render new remedies neeesiary on the pastor the Legislature, till the craft of •the offender ";_ithould.be exhausted. The last provision for the secknitv 9( the revenue was that by, which it'. was i 9 export spirits ftom the IslandS .of Gnorn,ex :111 , 1 Jersey in casks under a certain size. prol, hail' been evaded by carrying to sea „ . ,with die ,large full-tasks, a number of small empty ones, , into which the spirits were shifted at sea,, and then 'sitit*gted 'on shore as form , .,rly. To prevent this, would be One of the obACts of the Bill he meant to' propose.. If that measure. also _should prOve,,itiett'ttetual,. it would 'be necessary to meet the evil With a still stronger retnedlq which he would be prepared to propose, i,f it should be necessary—. It may, perhaps, be necessary to . go the length of limithig, or even prohibiting altogether, for a time, • the exportation of spirits from Guernsey and Jersey; and as:the whole., of that trade consisted in. smug- • gling, it was better to prohibit' it altogether, however ,unwillingly so severe a measure would be adopted,. 'than .to surfer the enormous defalcation theßevenue . now suffered by it, amounting to :little, short of .70,0.001. In addition to the total prohibition of the use of small casks, he meant to propose to allow rewards to those of the military who should dete& qthuggiin, He Moved, and leave was given to bring in a Bill accordingly. Mr..IIUSKISSON,. with a 'view to shew the • vast amount of the injury dime to . thereventle by this srituggling, uwed, that there be laid before , the " Homo an Account of the number of vesiels that had cleared out frOrti Ghernsey and Jersey, in the months of January, February, Mareh, and April lait, tbr l'onoiogn and other. Ports, laden with Brandy, Rum, Geneva, and :Tobacco: It was necessary to make oath, at clearing out, that the goods were to be landed at the Port fie which the vessel c'tc.;ared'; but they were all landed in Britain. It 'was. thus 'not only fraud a)one 'that the Legislature was preventing, bet fraud supported by petjury.—The &counts were ordered. ARMY CLOTHING. Alr. ROSE meant to move, that there be laid be fore the House copies of the Paymaster. , General'h Ac counts relative to the Clothing of the Royal Veteran 'Battalions, and Of all Letters that had.passed upon' that subja , l, froth' Aug. 1 , fso4, to Feb. i, t HO. His, reason far making this Motion was, that when he had formerly made a similar Motion from the other side of the House, several Papers had been •withheld, which were Mit essential to give the House a full and fur vie« of a matter' highly I,vorthy of .its at tention, 'and involving the public interest in a very coosikrable degree. ".When he had been appointed one .of the Paym,isters-Qeneral, ' his attention . had .been- direaed to find out what savings could be made in . that department of the public service, and aocuiding to the , suggestion of the. Committee of .Finance,. of which the Speaker had, in a manner strhortOurable to,hinisclf, and so meinl to the coun try, aett;,a Chainicm, .he found that the clothing was the tumid! in which that saving was most;.prac, tic;thle, Th'e marin6s Were cl*ed by one person at ts. tid. a suit''for the . Frivates. :The Royal Veteran Rattalion were clothed by Mr. Dickie, at 7s, 9d. a SUM. Thus there appeared a possibility Mr. Courtenav, ro'supply these Battalions at 11. 3s. a Suit, according to a pattern, the excellence of which was acknowledged by Mr. Dickie himself, and by the other army clothiers. He had accord- • ingly contracted with I.lr. Courtenay for 11. '33. But the contract had been taken away this year ,by the 'Noble Lord opposite, and given to Mr. Dickie and Mr: Box (this transaction was jocularly called the job with the Dickie Box), at an advanded the price at which they contra&ed being 11. 4s. 9d. • his was a loss of is. gd. a snit to the country, or 19001. and upWards, on the whole clothing of the • Veteran Battalions. No complaint had been made on reference to the Cemmanding Officers, except that the suits were in some instances too small, and , then they were immediately changed on application. (Here Mr.,Rose read the Letters stating these fads.) These Letters had not been presented by the Noble Lord among the Papers ordered on his Motion. The object of the present Motion was to have them pre sented now, in order to give a full and titir view, of this important subject; a subject well worthy of` the attention of the, House, as this particular transaction was of that of the ComMittee of Finance, or the Committee of Military Inquiry. He moved that the Accounts be laid before the House. Lord'TEMPLE thought the Right Hon. Gentle man' might more properly have referred the whole of this Matter, which he thought so worthy of the in vestigation of the Finance CoMmittee; or the Com mittee of Military Inquiry, to either of these Com anittee4 but as the Right Honourable Geetleman had thought lit to bring it before the House in such an accusing, manner, it would be necessary for hiih to go into a particular, detail for his own vindica-, tion. The letters alluded to by the Right Hon. Gentleman were hot laid before the House,• because the substance of them was contained in the minute of the Pay-Office, which was laid before the House. It was true, the letters of the Cornmanding Officers were in general to the effed stated by the Right Hon. Gentleman. But he had received other letters of a pri vate nature, stating the badness of the materials, and of the making up, and the smallness of the size. of Mr. Courtenay's clothing, 'in such strong terms, thathe felt it his ditty to make a particular examination:— This examination he made by comparing a suit of Mr. Couilenay's in wear with a suit of a man be longing to a recruiting paky in town, and one of the Guards; On the examination, the complaints of. Mr. Courtenay's clothing appeared well founded, and he thought it his duty to contra& with the next. lowest bidder, , Mr. Box, at tl. 4s. 9d. tb& other biddings being 11. 7s. 3d. and fL Bs. ad. He thought the difference more than compensated by the' superiority in materials, workmanship, and size, large clothing being particularly necessary to the comfort of old and wounded invalids. The 'addi tional expence of 100. be was sure would not be :thought ill-bestowed in procuring such comforts to ,persons who had SQ strong 'a claim to them. The Noble Lord read a letter, from Major Vowel; 'cent manding the 2d Veteran Battalion ; and - one from the Quarter-master oldie Battalion in the 'fewer, stating strongly the defects imputed to Mr. Courtenay's clothing. One of these letters stated, that of 1,000 .suits, only (300,were large enough 'to be used, and that On ,applicatign Mr. Courtepay„ cloth could not be obtained for the necessary enlargement. Under all these circumstances,. he thought it his duty to make the change in the contractat the ad vanced price now before the House. ~,He Wished the transaction to' be inquired into by either the Finance ,ComMittee or the. Committee' ref Nlpit:ary Inquiry, though he thought the Right Hon.. Gentle man ought to propose a particular' Committee of Inquiry into this trantaCtion,'as he had brought it in such an acdusing form before the House. He wished the Papers to be produced. Mr. LONG said, that now, by a regulationof the late Board of Treasury, the clothing was contracted `for by adVertifiement.' 'The person' who agreed to .furnish at the lowest 'price, according to a pattern' suit shown' by the dothing Board, had 'the centred, giving security for the performance of his, engage ments. The statements of the Commanding Offi cers were in dire& opposition to the change toot. had been made in the cootraa. 'Hii:•hoped the 'Noble ' Lord would lay his private doCumetits . before 'the Committee 'of Finance. The change hi the don- , tract had been made, however, . before the'answ,era, Ofthe Officers had been received. Lord 110IVICK complained, that those charges were preferred without giving his Noble Friend the . opportunity of a fair trial.. From the' infointation his Noble Friend had received.; he was not Only jus tified in transferring the contra& ai be had done„ but , he would have been highly culpable if he had not transferred it. He knew not, whether the cloth-, fag of the Marines was furnished by Mr. Celine tiay---3ht he had heard, while at the Admiralty,* very general complaints of the Mar* clothing. ." Mr. PERCEVAL said; the Noble 1.:,0rd had to • blame - hithself for any hardship he found:,in the charges preferred against hitn.--The Noble, Lord had left in the Office docoments direCtly in,epposi lion to the transfer he had made of the . contraet and he kept in his pocket the documents that-gave any colour of propriety to it. , Mr. WiNnualt thought the Right Hon. Gentle man opposite ought to have brought: a dired charge, to allow his Noble Friend a fair trial, and the com plete acquittal to which 'be was entitled, Mr. JourrieroNe thought every contract for the public service 'should be made with the lowest bidder. Mr. YVIIDERPORCE spoke to the same effed,--- There was alWays security for the due performance of the contra& • Lord H. Perry read the minute of the Pay-office, to shew it contained the substance of the letters, t he withholding of which was complained of, He 'thought it would be sometimes, and perhaps oftener, proper to give some - advance:. in price, , sir order to secure the supply , of a better article than could be had at time very cheapest rate. Ile expatiated on th'e deleas in, the clothing furnished by Mr. Coartenay, General TAsll.E'ruN thought it n'rong in the Noble Lord to have relied on the report ;of one Major and one Quarter-Master, in opposition to all the Com manding Officers, A Genthaman on the opposite side, of the House (Mr. Calcraft) had said, this should be an inquiring Parliament. The Gentlemen oppo- Ike had furnished many Subjeds,deserving in luiry, and this Was one of them. Mr. HUSKISSON thought the inspection of the' Board of Clothing the proper teat for all articles in vate information, in opposition to public information, in a case in which a public inquiry could be insti tuted. Mr. COCHRANE JoHNST . ONE 010110 t this as com plete a job as auy he had= ever heard of, and he hoped that it would draw the attention of the House to the subject of the clothing of the army. _ The Motion for the production of the Papers was then agreed to. The SECRETARY AT WAR presented the Army Estimates, and gave notice that he would to-morrow move certain Resolutions respeding-them. `.. Lord Howicx enquiied i whether there were dise tin& Estimates of the additional .Expences that would arise from restoring. the Allowances , to Volunteers, and froM the Establishment of Inspecting Field Of ficers ? The SECRETARY AT .WAR replied, , that the Esti mates were similar to those of the last year. Lord HoWfox observed, that where "a` new"ex pence was incurred, it was usual to prepare a fresh Estimate. Mr. HiJSKISSON Old not think . such a Separate.Es timate necessary, but .was.competent to the Noble Lord to. move for it. The SPEAKER apOrellelidCd' to be the usage of Parliament, to. require Estimates of the totals of the sums voted towards the Supply, but that the details rested with the. Crown. Mr. HUSKLSSON mentioned that the total 'Of the Volunteer Estimate, including those new Expences, amounted 1,4p0,0001. 7 Lord HOviICK. still insisted on the propriety of a separate Estimate. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER remarked, that a separate Estimate of the nature required by the Noble Lord could not now ba produced, as the amount of the additional expenee was at present a matter of conjeaure. He proposed- that all the Estimates, but those which related to the Volun teers, should be voted to-morrow,; but as on the Volunteer EstiMatas a difference of opinion prevail. - - ed; the consideration of them *should be post/xi:led to a more-distant day. • After a few words from General FITZPATRICK, The SECRETARY at WAR - gave notice, that - he would to-morrow move all the Estimates, except those that related to the Volunteers. Mr. AsnETor brought up the Ordnance Esti mates, and gave notice, that he would to-morrow move certain Resolutions respeating them. Mr. ROBERT WAttU brought up the Navy Esti mates, and gave notice, that he would to-morrow move certain ResolUtions respating them., Lord H. PETTY postponed his notice - of a Mo tion which stood for to-morrow to Wednesday next. THE SHERIFFS OF•CAITHNESS, if4c. AND LORD • CULLEN. Mr. AD4M rilse to make his promised 'Motion 1 i on the above subjects, • He entered into a.descrip- -I, tion of the office of Sheriff Depute in Scotland.: it was a seledion of local jurisdiction of the highest importanee, and one in which it was extremely ne cessaly that the duty shOuld be performed with as much dispatch as possible. ' The Shrievaltiei of 'Sutherland and Caithness were formerly united ; but, in consequence of the inaccessibility of the for mer county, it had been deemed necessary to sepa rate them, and to appoint a Sheriff for each. This occasioned anexpence of only 3501. a year. Slither,' land was a county. containing' 26,000 inhabiiant3, and he appealed to all who..knew Scotland, 'whether the appOintment of a separate Sheriff Depute did not stand recommended on public grounds of. ad vantage.? He then; explained the situation of the counties of Kinross and Clackmannon; neither of which had a Sheriff Depute. The Sheriff Depute of Stirling had jurisdiction in Clackmannon,and the Sheriff Depute of Fife in Kinross'. Iti. the latter county, as long as he remembered, the Sheriff De pute never did himself discharge the duty of his of ice;, but appointeda . substitute for that purpose, who, though a Very respeta'bleiliaii, possessed no .legal information. , It became necessary to rtmedy these evils, and nn public, principles of '.inlay She riffs'Depute were atiliointed let those two. counties of Clackmannon and • Kin' r., To' &fed' this, it became necessary to ob;ain !i.e ferricatreSigitions of the Sheriffs ofFile and,Stirling, who. were alter. Wards .re-appointe6 with their salaries. He next proceeded to the subjed'of the warrant for , granting a . pension to Lord Cullen, and expressed his regret that the subject should come forward in Akpresent. shape; more especially, -as, on: that day, or on the next, the Baron of the Courts of Exchequer in Scot land would come 'to a" deferniinatiOn upon it. ..1-le ptiss(l4,the,highest eulogitim on 'his Noble Friend ; and declared, that a more enlightened scholar, a More profound. laWyer, a mere agreeable compattion, and, a more agreeable gentletium never existed... He • would shortly'state the circumstatees under Which . the warrant was granted, and he was sure he Would satisfy the House what was proposed to be done was net mere than ought to be done. In 061ober, 1805, "be received an intimation from Lord Cullen, that having spent, a day 'with the Duke of Portland at Bulstrucht, his Grace expressed a wish. to COLDlnn nicato with him (Mr: Adam) on the, subjed of a pension for Lord Pullen'for life, with a reversion to. his daughter. The change.of Adiniaitraiinn, which: soon after took 1)1a-ee l -prevented the conviction of. this business. In 1806, it was natural for Lord Cullen, who had' been connected with the late Ad "ministration, to bring his case again under considera tion. He did not contend that in any case it is tit to grant a pension to.a Judge for, life;, bUt he con tended that the Crown should have the power of doing's° i and he contended, . that in cases in ,which a Judge was involuntarily involved in einbarrasa , • ments, it was incumbent on the Crown to-endeavour ,to relieve him: ' Lord , Cullen- was the eldest son of ' Dr. Cullen, one of the greatestrnen 'that 'Scotland ever produced, and who had raised.the reputation of the Medical. School of Edinburgh,' irk the height at which it thee- stood. Dr. Colleni , however, died poor, and left a large family; the 'younger branches of that family were in a great'aieasute provided for by the pnblie.:; bdt Letd. Cullen, the elde s t son, could nut guardithnsell frd`tii , the effeet of the em barrassments which iesi;etitled to him from 'his fa ther; and was- in consequence obliged to give up two-thirds of the revenue of his situatien, to relieve himself in sonic degree from those embarrassments; J.' 4c so c ircumstances were taken into consideration by the Lute Ministers; and there was every reason to snppose brat in Angust last' the *affair was coin pleted. However, owing to official delays, th`e.War . . Cullen for life, with a provision of 2061, agar to Mrs.-. Cullen, was one of the last acts of the late Ad. ministration. From that period until Mlndny last he had heard nothing more about it. He, had no idea that thewarrant was for any thing else but -a provision. for life • he was sure Lord Grenville meant it to be for life. If when the grant was pro dbtecl it should appear on the face of it that it was during pleasure, he would contend that. it was an . error ; the very . circumstance of the reversion mus t. shevv•itwas an error. As - he had before mentioned, the Barpns of the Court of Eltchequer in Scotland .were at this time employed in considering the sub- jest, and • he deeply regretted that it had been men tioned in the House of Commons until their Report had been made. As it was, however, he thought it his duty to Move, that an humble Address be pre' sewed to his Majesty, praying that he Would be gra ciously pleased to cause to be laid-before the House a Copy - of the Order appointing Sheriffs Depute to Ute. Counties of Clackmannon. and Kinross.; and -also a-Copy of the Warrant forgrantinge Pension-to Lord Cullen. ' .. .. . . The LORD ADVOCATE ofSCOTLAND was desirous that tlie letters and applications of the Sheriffs Depute for these Counties should be laid be -fore.• the House. Without meaning to throw any imputation on the respectable individuals who had occupied the new offices,. be termed their appoint ment _an . unnecessary or _wanton expellee. To • prove this; he entered into a history of the Sheriffs Depute of Scotland ; they were divided . into five , classes ; each - class receiving a salary pyoportionate '. to its labour, :by the new arrangement, the Sheriff of Sutherland, who was placed lu-the last class but l4 one, because no peculiar difficulty attended his shut. . :!' tion, wasto receive a higher salary th an someoft hose' .: in the first class ! The Sheriffs of Stirlitig , and Fife had, it seems, resigned, to give an opportunity tbr :„ri the new arrangements. He would like to. know if `•,' they were not solicited to do so ? •With . respect .•-, ' to - the pension granted to Lord Cullen, he-. would not follow the Learned Gentleman in his . detail on:, • that subject, but he was. surprised that if it wag`; thought advisable to take such a step, it was odt•II. donein such a manner as to preclude the neceg- •••••,!,. thy of bringing it under the 'consideration of the e .V't House of Commons. He - concluded by 'some se- -..„ - .vere remarks on the creation by his Majesty's rate Ministers of new Professorships in the Universitrof :' Edintiuigh—ahat of Medical Jurisprudence, and that . ~ of Military Surgery. . • • 6• Mr, CIIA RLES WYNNE defended the inatint- • tion of the two new Professorships. There , was'' . ., scarcely a College on.the Continent which - had not. ; •-,• 'lone had a Professor of Jurisprudpoce, and the e& .:- i'Otitiges allaying a distinCt Professor of • Military •,1 -Surgery Were. obvious. • :: : • 4 Mr. COCPPANE JOHNSTOATE declared, that i a' more honest, uptight, and able Judge, ilfan Mr. Williamson ' the Sheriff Depute. of Stirling; could .tsog.exist. - .- He happeuedi to. .be. with . him_ xylie o lie received a letter from Lord Spencer, requiring . 110 to resign, pro ternpore, in order that a distinct Sheriff I t might be appointed foe Clackmaiman. Mr. liVil' `'... -•liantsotr,d,cplaisetl•to;ltim, that such . ,an appointment was wholly . unnecessary, and exclaimed, in his Northern dialed, " Guile God, Maister Johnstone, ~did yuu ever see sic a job P l —(A loud latigh.)--• -: e. With respect to the pension granted to Lord Callen, A .he reversion to Mrs. Cull e n w as a grass insult 10 the morals and feelings of the, people of Scotland. ; Mr. DUNDAS never heard of the least necessity for "the appointment of. (he ' new Sheriffs.' •As to Lord Cullen 's pension, the.cliaraCier of that teartiFd , Lord certainly stood very high; but when he was - thin seleCled from a body of - men, and - shewn Iv' ouliay, indnlgencies, he thoughrit,iudikpensible that more speCific grounds should be •, tneasure than whatlad iitherto ,i) ;, e i e t tl ate a ti dv :;r ce s il i . tch a ' Mr. LAING defended the • appointment •pf the ' Sheri& The question was not, Whethet the Sheriffs of Sijrling and Fife declared that there was nbtldng to, do in Clackmannatt aiiirkijiiiiii;Thlt - Tvlieilier the people 'of-Clackinannan..and Kinross. were satin- Ifled - tvith the; coming there to do any thing for . thorn: .He had never understood that ,Lord Cullen was a very particallar friend to the last . Adininistration, and he could. not therefore see tl,l o justice of imputing the grant which he had receive to party motives. Adverting to the •argutnenti . urged by a Learned Lord again s t th e appo i ntmen t of the twO . new Professorships at Edinburgh, be o)aseived; that similar arguments mi g ht h ave been, ,applied - with equal' force again s t t h e appo i ntment o f Dr. Blair, as Regius Professor of The Belles Lento' i or of Dr. Walker, as Regius Professor of Nature' History. Those appointments might as well be Called jobs.as.the present ; but ha confessed he wni 7 dot surprised that men Who had belonged to an Ad" ministration the-most unfriendly to Literature - that _ever existed, and by whom genius of every ,dee scription had been left to pine in want—he was " L surprised that such men should condemn conduct so• opposite to their own. . . Sir P. MuattaY Matte a few observations w i lsicit:] we could not collect, as did th e Marquis of 'teen '; , FIBLI), whom , we un d e r stood to state, that 11P.r- 4 Noble Relation had not been aware that - the Petl i ki , , , ,, 4 , d m i r e ll e ti a z :t r i O . ; f t ' l l t V :he le S T ll .P° tiolearuad• Judge was in co:A - emplation. - - ' ,--, e of the distance Of the residence of the Sheriff;•l s : e p ri tj tfs A .i' l4 n -s ;u ( ti l e 'f r e l l i l it d l e d a ,li t t h ::oos h e P 4 3 y, a e l ti t ; . . - tice was not only delayed, but not done. Tbd Conn t !. was 80 miles from sea to sea so miles Tri,the * .Oth ct bad a population of 26,000 inhab4ilti, and ought to have a particular Sheriff. Lord , Real,f - who liad a large property in it, had 42voted his-111- for the last five years to procure that alteration, 0, hclamented that whilst lie had the oppartuuitY' from his connection with Ministers, be had not en deavoured •to accomplish so desirable an obrea- He had : said thus much juat to give. a warning to' the Right Honourable Gentlemen opposite s , that 4 . 1110 meant this woman's war of recrimination, .for the, purpose of gaining popularity, they would not fine , • it succeed. The SOLICITOR GENERAL for Scotland con' tended that the duties of the Stirievalty were--no'. as before done by deputy, and that ' eminent person ,who bad been appointed Sheriff of Slitherland re _sided in Edinburgh, and could not have given his presence in the• County for 'the time required, by ,Aet of Parliament. As the matter-had been broO t tiefore the House, he thought it right to be fullY) 1......1 , may,' and - thoroughly sifted, and therefore. 'b e .' . • UMW as an atuendinent, - that thero be laid t)el°le V i,t ~. i i i t 47'