The Sun. — London, England, 1802-02-06 00:00:00

IMPERLIL PARLIAIVIENT. HOUSE OF PEERS, FLIDAY', FEB. 5. A great deal of privare business was transaned—such as making arrangements for the hearing of Appeals, receiving Petitions for new Causes, and forwarding ot P The Standing Order of the House, relati-ve to Private Bills from Ireland, was ordered to be taken into consideration on Monday next, and their Lordships summoned on the occa &ion. Lord HOLLAND presented a Petition front certain Insol vent Debtors in the King's Bench Prison, praying for Relief, &c. It was signed, his Lordship observed, by upwards of Zoo Individuals. He moved, that the Petition do lie on the Table, which was ordered accordingly. The Noble Lord then presented Petitions of a similar na ture, from certain persons confined in the County' Gaol of Cardigan ; and also in the Gaol at Ennis, in the.sCouritY of Clare, in Ireland, which were also severally *ordered to lie on-the Table. - , Lord HOLLAND then addressed a few words to a s Noble Earl who sat near him, but in.o low a tone of voice,*as almost to preclude us from, distinguish. ing a word. However,, as •we could coiled, the purport of it was, to learn from his Lordship (MoIRA) whether he persisted in his intention of bringing forward those propositions which he had given notice of previous to the late recss,,repeeting insolvent Debtors. The Earl of MOIR4 replied, that he had cer tainly given notice of his intention of bringing forward, soon after the Rtcess, certain propositions of the tendency alluded to by his Noble Friend, `and the objeEt of which was, as far as prafticable, tp prevent the tecurirence of A:ls of Insolvency.— Those propositions were n ,, t — yet, he said, perfettly matured, but were in that state of forwardness, that he soon hope.d to have the - honour of submitting them to the consideration of the House, Their Lordships then-adjourned rill Monday. HOUSE OF COMMONS, FRIDAY, FEB. 5. A person from the Treasury brought up an ac count, spewing hew the'money granted for the ser vice of last year had been disposed of. Lord GLENBERVIE brought ,up .a Bill for amending so much of the Ad for regulating the Sale of Fish, as relates to Eels. It was read a first time, and was ordered to be read a second time To morrow. Sir H. MILDMAY said it was his intention to move for leave, to bring in a bill to amend the 3zd Geo. 11. commonly called the Lords Ad, An Honourable Gentleman had also given notice of his intention to move for leave to bring in a Bill to. amend the same but he believed their views were by no means the same. He should therefore wish to bring in his Bill, and, afterwards; if the House thought proper, the twO Bills might be con solidated. The state of these unfortunate debtors to whom he wished, by his bill, to extend relief, was too well known to render it necessary for him to take, up the time of the House by commenting upon the subject, he should therefore move for . leave to bring in a Bill to amend the 324 Geo. 11. Lord GLENBERVIE said, he wished the Hon. Baronet would withdraw his Motion, and content himself at present with giving notice'of his Mo tion. The Law in question had remained in force for half a century, end therefore it required some deliberation before it was altered—A very large part of the Community, particuiarly. the Trading part, were very much interested in the subjed, and therefore he hoped the Hon. Baronet would not per_ sist in bringing in the Bill, until those who were interested in it, were apprized of its objet, Mr. STURGES said, that the Bill might be brought in.; and after being printed, the second reading might be postponed for some time.- Sir H. MrizosaAy withdrew his Motion, and 1n it of till Monday. . Lord GLENBERIIIE moved the Order of the Day for going into a Committee, .to„take into con sideranoo the Southern Whale Fishery Bill. The f-louse having resolved itself into a ComMittee, Lord GLENS ERVI E . moved as a Resolution, that it was necessary to amend the said Bill ; which' was . agreed to, mid the House being resumed, the Report was ordered to be received on Monday. Mr. WM. DUNDAS said, that be had, before the recess, given notice of his intention of moving that a Sum of "50,0031. which had been appropriated . to certain Services in Scotland, should be applied to 04; purpose of - building Bridges and making Roads' fmm the middle to the North of SCotland. He wished now to postpone his Motion, because seve ral Gentlemen from that Country, from whose local knowledge the House would derive great advantage, were not arrived in Town. Mr. VA KSITTART brought up an Account of all Places held by Patent, or for Life or Lives.—Or dered to lie on the Table. The CHANCELLOR. of the EXCHEQUER moved the Order of the Day for the House. to re solve itself into a Committee of the whole House, 'to consider of a Supply to be granted to His Ma jesty. The Order being read, and the Accounts laid before the Rouse of the' Extraordinaries of the Army, and the Navy debt, as it stood on the 31st of December last ; and also certain expences of paying the Militia, &c. on embodying them in pursuance of His Majesty's Warrant, &c. being re ferred to this Committee ; the House resolved itself into a Committee of the whole House accordingly, IS(Ir. AL c:XARDER in the Chair. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER then prOceeded to open the Extraordinaries of the Army, . &c. agreeably to his notice. He observed, that the Committee, in pursgarwq of the Order of the liouse, was not only in possession ,of accounts stating the manner in which the z,500,0001. grant ed last Session of Parliament, for defraying. extra ordinary expellees, had been applied, but likewise in possession of an account presented to the House in obedience to another of its orders, - shewing..the manner in which a sum of money raised on a Vote.. of Credit, had been expended ; and Hi Maje s ty had also thought proper to order, that there be laid before the House an account of- the expences Qf the beygnd . 0 . 144 which yeas, in,cl9ded in the. EAt 1 mate or the last year. It was for the purpose of considering these accounts, as well as the amount of the Debt of the Navy, as it stood at the 'close of the last year, the Committee. was now sitting. Undoubtedly Gentlemen had turned their attention to the accounts to which he had just now alluded, and particularly to the items of which the first branch was composed. With reference to the sum of 2, e00,0001,0r with reference to tlieVote ofCredit, which was submitted to the discretion of Govern.. ment,he was concerned to state the excess in the Army was .1,84.7,D001. The various articles of which this excess was.composed might be reckOned under different heads. The sums paid to Mr. WOOO, De. puty Commissary General on the Continent, amount ed to e 60,0001. ; but •he begged to have it under stOod, that although he felt it incumbent on him, in obedience to the orders of the House, to ad vert' to, the papers now before the• Committee, specifying the items to which he should allude, and to them only, he felt himself also liable to be called on- by any Member of the Commit,. tee, to give any explanation of other ex penditures which grew opt of these particular heads of ser vice, although not specified in these Papers. He thought it his duty 'to exp Len, whenever ,he was properly .called upon, any Expenditure under the head of Extraordinaries of the Army, of the discus sion of which he 'had given notice, although that might embrace items' which had - not been referred to the Committee, for it was his objet to give as ample infOrMation as he was able, of the heads of public Expenditure. Now, he would observe, that e:thoogli the sum, of z6o;000l. advanced to Mr. 1 . 7 1. oo , Deputy on-unissory_GenerAt.on the Con tinent,--was great, it was yet a necessary expence for satisfying the,,demands existing against us; on account of Subsidiary Treaties - with the ELECTOR of BAN ARIA, and the - puke of WI tiTEMB ERG, together zvitli Others whose names had been already mention- - ed, and-also-to-satisfy the demands of the Swiss. Corps and the Corps under the command of the PaINC E of Cothe: - Ht - presumed it would not be Cenght necessary, in general, to enter into a detail of the precautionary measures of Government to prevent any of these dehiands exceeding their proper limit ; but he thought it his duty to inform the Committee, that in this instance; every measure was taken which prudence seemed to suggest, by a seledion'of men . of the most tried tharader for vigilance, • know ledge, and economy, The individual who was . seleded, by whose :authority and certificate alone . the drafts were drawn to satisfy these demands on the Cantinent—these various demands, for such they were--was Mr. WI c itHAsa, -a Gentleman whose character ea7ied with it convilion of the propriety of the Account—ea Gentleman of known experience, tried, unquestioned diligence, and equal 'ly 'unqhe'stiohed probity. Both OAS Gentleman and the other, who was the Deputy Commissary-Gene ral, Mr. WooD e :Whose name he had mentioned already,. were entitled, as far as .he was able to , judge, to great commendation for their' conclud in this part of the service of their Country ; but not withstanding this was the just • character of those Gentlemen, yet .no Bill was honoured, nor could it be lull - toured; without the subjed matter of it hay- , ing ushleprone an examination on the. part of the Comptrollers of the Airhy Accotints, so that the Ac_ count of the Distribution of the sum of 2,500e0ee1.. and the whole o f the Charges in the-Actiounts of the Distribution of the other sums he had mentioned, had undergone . the inspettion of the Carnptrollers': . of the Army Accounts; andas a further security against etny possible- mistakes,, these Accounts wexe still further liable to the investigation of the Audi tors of Public Accounts e so that the Committee would see that every precaution that could: be sup_ posed to be useful, had been taken in looking into the application of this money,. which was applied to defray the expences of Services. which had been pre viously approved of by Parliament. He was aware, however, that an excess to the amount which he had stated, must attraCl the attention of the Committee, and, therefore, he was extremely desirous of ascer_ mining what, according to the opinion of those best qualified to form it, and to 'whom these Accotints had been suliMitted, was the nature of - the Services to which the 'expendittape chiefly applied. In the Bavarian Corps, it must be acknowledged, qie Estimate tell short of the adual expence by 10;0001, but - with reference to three other Carps, the ad, vantage was on the. side of the Public, the Merit of which he attributed : to Mr. WicKHAM: • Having gone over the itemsof:arese Services,'Mr: ADD' NG TON proceeded to observe, that as to the Gentle_ mart who was Commissary-, it must not - -be taken that he was answerable for the expenditure of these sums; he was answerable ()Ay for the - - issues of them; the rest was under the ;controhl he had al ready-stated, and upon each of these heads the Pub lie had the advantage Of thegreatdiligence and abi lity which had, been laudably' employed in examin ing these Aceounti : and here. he could not help call ing the attention of the Committee to a Letter froth the -Comptrollers of the Army Accounts to .the Lords of the Treasury, shewing the utmost dili gence in those Gentlemen, as to the' nspedion of the Accounts of Mr. WICKHAM, and bearing the most honourable testimony for him, as to ihe ,accit- • racy-and fidelity of those Accounts. [Here Mr. ADDI NCTO is: read the Letter, ending with an expression of the opinion of these Gentlemen, highly favour able to the merit of IVir. WICKHAM, as a Public Officer.] Mr. Apo' NGTON then' proceeded to. observe, that he had the SatisfaCtion of seeing, that a large propor tion of the Service of the Troops on the Continent, fell considerably below the Estimate, There were two other.heads of Expenditure; on which he should say a few words. The largest was that of Bills drawn from. Egypt, in the Spring 'and - Autumn of the preceding year. It amounted to the sum .of 1,5+0,0001.—a sum, which he freely acknowledged, greatly exceeded any expeetations he -had enter tained, and wliich he expressed when he had the' honour of addressing the House the last . Session of Parliament. But .he *as conVinced,,.and he did not. desire to sink it, that if there should appear to be any want of economy in the expenditure of the mo ney appropriated to -that Service, unparalleled as the glory . was which ire acquired there,. the ex- , `pence would, and he wished it, ',be examined with .as much jealousy, as' if, instead of honour and triumph, Great Dritelin had Iriet with disappoint, merit :upon th4r. Exfetiiiion. The person cm. 'Tinged in the Commissarial Power in Egypt, was a person of tried abilities and approved in tegrity; but whoie life was unfortunately lost in the service of his Country—hi meant Mr: Wforz ; all who had - known That Officer gave him an..high eharaaer for diligence and integrity. The Expen diture of that Service was chiefly 'in the hands of that excellent Officer, and there was no control over. - his - Accounts:--Ancf he - would here - take an opportunity of 'obserVingi that as to the service in. Egypt, his expeaation. Was disappointed chiefly from the length of+the service ; it was . the - Opihion of the 'host experienced persons, that this' would not have been a service of 'very : considerable dura tion. This was the opinion of that great and dis tinguished man who ,commanded the Army- in Egypt—who lost): his life there, ,and who lost it gloriously. He had thought that our 'operations ouiithat occasion Would have been shorter' than they turned out to he. ' But as the operation was longer than was expefled,' the expence accumulated beyond the expo Cation of those who were best qualified to judge . upon it ; • but 'when it was considered that'. this- Expenditure, although great; was under the immediate diration of Mr. Mo-rz, and' that the whole had also been under the minute inves tigation of the Comptrollers of the Army-Accounts, the Committee' had as good a' security , as the nature of the Case would permit, against all useless or improvident expenditure. - Another article claimed now the attention of the Committee. The expences incurred in the West •Indies,' and - whieh' were defrayed by the payment of bills drawn by the Commissary there, upon which there-was an excess, beyond the estimate s of 420,3701., Fle.had no hesitation, in acknoWledging, that he contemplated these charges with considera-. ble anxiety. It' might be said; and said truly, that a- very considerable expence Was „incurred by • an' equipment of forct-against -the Danish Welt India Islands, and also.' from, the enormous price of provisiOns 'there, especially when eilis• expence was incurred, particularly ttat.of Meat,:which was double the :price it was here ; these were considerations certainly of great weight but without- meaning, on his own part, to insinuate that any thing could be urged to the disadvantage of the Commissary, .or any other persons concerned in the disburse mentse or in any: other part of the eXpenditur't un -der _this head of service, -.believing them to - be.per ,. fettly honourable men.-_ He spoke highly of the merits - of-General TR icar,-..who commanded at the capture of the Danish West India Islands,, and also. of all the Military service there, bat still he thought: the measure adopted by Government.on the subjea, of 'the expenditure in the West Indies was prOper; and he had no doubt would be approved,of by the Committee. His Majesty's Ministers had thought proper to cause a Special Commission' to be issued, and which was now on the point of being sent to the West Indies, for the purpose of making all necessary inquiries on the -spot respecting these expenditures, the result of which would be trans mitted •to Government, and should unquestion ably be laid before . the House. ' He wits' not - aware of the necessity of stating more' than he , had done on the Papers now before the Commit- tee. It was his .objet -to put the Committee in full possession of all the expences of 'the last Year on the subjeas to which their attention was called, that they might at once see the state of Public Ac counts, and that nothing should be left behind,- But , -now that he 'was up, perhaps the Committee might be saved some trouble, if he referred to some other Accounts,- not. immediately conneaed with those of which he had been speaking: It appeared, by a Paper' before the - Committee, that the Debt of ' the Navy, on the 3rs - t of December last, amounted to 9,o7e,o7ol.—The.Sum voted the preceding year was 8,78e,0001. The sum voted 'generally- for the Navy, was, Millions, butout of that a great part was applied in the payment-of .various charges, such as therSalaries and Wages of Artificers.--L-Work men in the Dock Yards—and the remainder to pay off Bills. at 90 Days . , for different demands, under the head of -Viaualling; Scc. A certain 'repot . - tion was always appropriated to each 'of - these heads. [Here he stated. the Items Of Excess in the viaual-, ling the Navy, - Transport, &c. as alsci the parts On which there was a saving from the Estimate] --and then proceeded to-observe,' that, with regard to the Navy ;,the -Committee would recollea the amotwt of the:hips of the Line for this period, and what was thg augmentation of Shipping : of various de-' . seriptions, of Craft for the proteaion of the mouths' of Rivers, and the•like ; and considering all these things,, he said, it was' not only matter - Of satisfac. tion,.. but -surprize, -that the exceeding, or the dif ference between the Balance in the hands of:the Treasurer of the Navy, and the sum received in' the Exchequer, in the :year 18cir, out Of the Supplies granted for the Service of the 'present year, did not amount to more than • tet78,2261,.' The whole merit of this he leave , to attribute entirely and exclusively to -those who had the care of the Naval -• Department of the Force or tfieCounery. As to' the excess under the head of Viaualling; which we understood him to state at r, , ,e98,6001: he observed,'" that a very larguroportion it„,was applied . to - the expences of part of the Army, and that a large'. proportion of the Army was • afloat this year, and "taking all circumstances together, the charges of. Vianalling must be greater this last . year than any - . one during the War. It was not possible, under the present Circumstances,. to ascertain how far - it', would be prudent to thedebt of the N'aVy. Mien would depend on the period when . the re trenehtnent was .to commence, .and. when the Coun try might be enabled to relieve itself from the expence 'of the' Naval Service:= 7 -Until it was ascer tained what was to be, the total amount, of .our . Naval Establishinent, it could, not be ealcula; ed what would be the probable amount Of our Navy, Debt, as iimight be suffered to remain., He should, Itowiever'; submit to the Committee, the propriety of voting : to His .Majesty the sum. of 2,000,0001. -towards 'discharging the debt. of the Navy. As to the Exttaordinaries of the Army, .he should propose a sum` o the full amount of the excess. He there fore - Moved, "'That it is the opinion of this Com- Mittee that a sum not exceeding 1,847,1741. be ~ granted to His Majesty towards defraying the •Ex penees' incurred and paid by the Right Hon. the .Paymaster-General of His Majesty's Forces, in the :year ;801, and not provided , for by Parliament." , P The Question being put, . Mr. ROBSON said - , it.would 'be. necessary f or '' him to, enter rather at large into this s ubjed- --I ; 'July last, when there was a, Vote of Credit gran ted; he thought it would be. necessary to grant a la r ge, sum, but he Was told that . the sum then gran re ' would answer every purpose; he - was, howev e , ' H now surprised to find that the Army Extraordiffa r . l _, Ti es amounted-, to , 5,600,0001. , and , the. time* wh''' had been given 'to Members to consider the pape rs ' was short beyond example. ~. The manner in WU'', the House had been led on,, was a. matter of s'erioas alarm, for it w'as not long ago since the Ci-f Ar r Of tlae, Excit uou git aipplied for s tilig ian . of money, When there were not above ten Memb e f s in the 1-101i5e.. , -L-Nobody, lie believed, expeded t his proposition would be made,t'?:-.gb,i,till the secre tari o of - the Treasury, caritedowp;, last, night, and gaY notice that the CHANcsi.Lo-kof - the. ExcHri2" it tneant to move , for the Extraordinaries of the Army We had - 10 , ,y,he supposed, got an economical A d - .ministration, but . he should expert something oi era 'than a panegyric opoO. the COmMissaries ; fbr in; stance,' he wished to have a more correct s taterse i n e . Than the Papers which had been l a id before t'' House, which .were almost entirely, without dat es; so that it was impossible to tell, which p a rt of the t ° expence was - incurred before the Union, a nd ig.g 4 had been, incurred since. • There w as , in those L3 f , pers.a charge for Foreign Corps : lasi year,_ w", e o 'be applied. to know -.whether we had any Fore 4,, Corps in our service,. fie could not get a satisfot . t °r ` g . ansiVer ; but now, Parliamedt was called upon to F.,', f large sums for them. He confessed he w a s now I ,'"t, Ahi..0,1 t;. th;nl2: -..,-,.. 41x.,i,i —I T Is -. ~ z. ' , dorms " fi ll . Peace-with-the expence of-a_V. , :ar,-..since he had se' what BONAPARTE had done with regard to the C l 5; , alpirie Republic.. _The Ministers c'ertaioly could r' r ' is have known BONAPAR.TF.'S intention, or they nO r t . ' would have made the Peace ; for one, he would 0 ° have approved of the Peace, if he had known ''' It was undoubtedly an event of much importa nce ' , .: lie6Lit we had )now no security for - the ra c " . til There appeared to hitn' to he many charges in Army Extraordinaries which belonged to the 0% l List,: what, for:instance,. had the money given l 7 Ambassadors to . do witlithe Army Extraordinar i l f : There were large. sums •of money paid to - 1 " WyNpFiAm, our Minister at Florence_;. to ,S.ir)4 HANI 1 LTON, the, Envoy at: NOities . ,&.c. r they' sums might be proper, but . he- wanted to lo ° what they . had. to do _with 4 , 11 e, Army .Extraor d W, c ; ries. . Theteappea red als.o, to -.:lic 'a . -charge A l so astonished and alarmed him ; this was, a bill dra` ro by- a -Mr. BAL E, at Malta, for 67-,c001.- -4be i Co' was also a sum of half a million drawn for by his. ' RANtskY. He 'wished to know for -Wh a t s ervice t ac , charge'had been:ineurred ; because there was o ° i f count of it in the Paper- before'the House, nol i a i l o date to. it. Th er e_ a pp eare d a l so to h ave - been c3 ) 0 ., drawn, though to a sma ll amount , f rom St' i 'b i r mingo : he, thought that General MAITLAND , . 10 giving up:that Island, bad put an end to the dr ain , k from that quarter, - but now it appeared that theY we gao to be nibbling again. The Army Extraor es ; varies for the Bahama Islands, amounted to s° than 26,0001. which was a most 'extraordil l ere , of charge, for there was - but one Regiment r t b t he and that was a skeleton one. The charge o f <n i c Y Extraordinariei f o r Jamaica, was 1 / 9 , 0 001.) ' ' he could by no means acco unt f or ,. I t was c os netessary to examine th ese a c coonv,-, -- and I t 05 0 particularly h ar d u po n I re l an d; because-they tics to have • two-seventeenths of this enormous sum or pay. It ''appeared that . the bills drawn e pf the' Commissary in the ,West Indies - tad 10 seeded the Estimate by near half a million' 1 1:e order to account.. for this enormous excessL us i , House ought to have something more than a r„ 5 0.• ble account of: the good charader of the CO 111111 ,..,:;11° ries ; t hey might h e ve ry wor thy me n , for w`7 . o ar knew ; but he ,knew that they generally we n- 11° poor, and came hoMe very rich : and, therefore'cp was riot inclined to allow the Minister all the Cl bro which he appeared to think himself entitled t ° ', to Cause he ought immediately to have , put - a' st c r t hP this unbounded ekpenditure. The Charges f°lcp Extroordinaries of Halifax, Nova Scotia, and the nada, we appeared enormous, - considering i fyi force had in. thlit quarter,- I ; aid riot sig[ l o ,6 l .17e could not go on in this. manner. - Gest' e o pir must look into the Public - AcoQunts, and 'if s d to syStem of 'Refirrin was obt,adoved :with' tee 0, the Expenditure, the Bank would not ltrog,,, r e able to pay' the . Dividends. There was a long is' ' Charge also for the Black Corps :—He v' T t/ to know, • in what state . these Corps •Wer e r Nyliethei they were• to be : disbanded, or s h ell fifer they .were ~to be sold ? ,though he di° Ili! it. - quite - enough for a , •Man to be sold once 11 'to 'life. There was a charge of 200,0001 paid t 0 Yf-of? MINTO. He, wished to knoW ; what that vas ai p 'That Noble Lord had retired from his s j . /W I 0 and he was..sorry,forit, became he did not . 0 9 this mode of superannuating, persons upon per° 0 5 ,- `while 'they were able to do their duty. Ther e ,/ a - suns of 1 1 7,0004 drawn. for by , Lord -EL 6 IN t . to 'this also was without any date, and he wisll;iict 0 t ,! •• ask the.Attorney-0-eneral, whether- such 'a kl 7/ Paper would be admitted in 'a Court . of JuOri cc i 'lll : Mr z ROBSON then proceeded to comment se $ l9, Charges •of Money paid to. Foreign , Prince s ' 0) i also to a sum paid to Captain D'AuvEito:' 15,,0001. , • • . 10 Mr..k/ARTIN said, he wished to eXre eg le 110 thanks to the Hon. Gentleman for the tr°, li v h c on' had taken in investigating this subjea, for fl e . t. ,por 3 fessed he never was more• struck than he w as • 0 0 1 examining that . Paper. A -General. Elea l6 - fl i , now approaching, and be .hoped • •the,People.f Their only choose such persons as would rake care - c . -• io' interests, and particularly of their • pecuni'' o oi terests, He hoped, that what had passed, ii oil, 'disgust, the people from entering.., into 4. 1 )° 11s - ,a h " . unnecessary Wars, and with 'this 4-seandal° us c 04 5 ' r of laying out the publie..money:' He. - did' n u ,,,fst to say any thing personal, but he would nor s . ro 'rra; Ministers in the lkimp,„ If . MiniSters OcaeLl J er e% c perly, lie would support any Motion to % / Ivo r 1 them;. and, in the mean rime, he would s o j _,'; 1 such of their measures as he thought g ood ) ° , 'P r ,pose such as he thought of, a contrary n3 r U re il ' ou g 11 . would not have troubled the House, hot lie . t t i 0 0 the Hon. Gentleman had not been treated wi tio r i reSpea to which he was entitled..- His-01)5er I r ,a • i