The Sun. — London, England, 1802-04-06 00:00:00

for in explanation of what he Lad to submit it would be his first duty to remind the Committee of the Stipples already voted, which were as follows SUPPLIES. NAvy. Exclusive of OrcinaLcc for Sea Service s 7,7/0,895 o 0 ARMY. Great Britain Ireland - 6,188,204 0 0 7,70%334 Io 1,520,,30 tO 5 ORDNANCE. Great Britain Ireland - 29,166 o o ? 12.5,000 0 0 S 954, 166 0 0 MISCELLANEOUS• Croat Britain . 260,48 z o o Ireland - - 163,207 xi s 4 2 3, 60 9 TS 9i Reduction of the National Debt . Corn Bounties . - - . Deficiences of Malt Duty. 1800 Interest on Exchequer Bills, Discount on Loan, &c. as per Di position Paper - To pay off Exchequer Bills in possession eft the Bank - - - 3,cc0,000 o 0 Deficiency of r,z00,0001. voted for the ser vice of 1801, out of the Duties on Goods itnported'and exported - . Amount of Civil List Debt • 200,000 o o • 1,622,018 o 0 - 400,..)oo o o 1,137,073 0 0 4 to.ooo e - 990,043 0 0 Making the sum already voted in the Committee of Supply - 2 4) 6 54,430 6 24 Whereof theamount of Sums vot ed for Great Britain - zz,506,09z 0 0 Ireland - 1,805,338 o 2 4, 61 4,43 0 0 0 By this it appeared that the period for which these sums were voted for the Navy, Army, Ordnance, and Miscellaneous Services, were for five months only; there would remain seven months more to be voted in the Committee of Supply, but under the present circumstances of this Country, and considering how impossible it was to make arrangements ; or if arrangements were made, how impossible it would be to make them effedual, or such as should be applicable to our situation; it was not his intention to propose now any Resolutions for the remaining seven months for the Navy or the Army ; but in the mean time he could assure the Committee, that every retrenchment that was prafticable should take place, and also that in the mean time very considerable retrenchments should take place, both in the Navy and the Military Ser rice. They should be reduced with as much rapidity as possible, consistently with ate prudence which the Committee were aware, ought to guide the condul of the Executive Government. The Committee would understand distinttly what the prudence was to which he referred. Until the ratifications of the Definitive Treaty were exchanged, which be trusted would take place, and thanked God he had no doubt of it, but we should nut let go the security which we held in our possession, until that event happened. There would therefore remain to be voted for the Navy, Army, Ordnance, &c. for seven months, and some for Miscellaneous Services. The Ways and Means as they now stood were as follow : WAYS AND MEANS. Duties on Pensions, Offices, Sce. and Malt Duties - - - 4. 2,73e,0ve Surplus Subscription on Exclieq. Bills funded 11;0,874 Lean to be provided for by ?retifnri'l:::4o°o7 25,0e0,20 Amount of Ways and Means voted on or before sth of April -2 .7•930.44 M sm.—Remains to be voted. Surplus Consolidated Fund to sth of Jan. 1803. exchequer Bills on Supplies, - 1 8 03 . Lottery. Loan to be contraaed in Ireland. Stock created by Loan 180 z. Capital Stock. 1 4,950,000 0 13,800,000 0 ' Intrrest , 5 per Cent. Consol. Ann. 3 per Cent. Reduced Ann. 3 per Cent. deferred Stock to be added to Consols 1,601,375 0 3: Interest on the Consols and '3S E)375 0 Reduced - - - Ditto on the def. Stock from 862,500 o 0 fan. s, 1808 .. - - Management on the whole - - Stock created by Ex.B.Funct. 11, r38,06z to Interest, together with 7,796 t?., to} L. Ann. - - il. per Cent. thereon - - Management - - - Sto. charged onlncome duties 56,445,0c0 0 Interest thereon - - - Management on ditto - - • 4 8,0 41 5 o 13,658 z o 43 1 , 0 43 0 4i 112,222 12 b 5, 0 99 16 gi 1,713,0,6 13 4 25,621 10 0 97,934,437 lo 3,211,202 o 0 The above Charge to be defrayed by the following Taxes; Malt and Beer 2,000,0c0 Assessed Taxes 1,000,000 Duty on Exports and Imports i,000,000 4.4,000,000 MEM.—The interest on the Deferred Stock, amounting to 48,0411. ss. is to be defrayed out of the Short Annuities, which will expire on the sth of Jan. :803. The terms of the Loan were 65 3 per Cent. Consols, 6o Reduced. Deferred Stock, 61. zgs. 3d. making together z 3 zl. zgs. 3d. for every 1001. of money.. _ _ The 3 per Cent Consols. were taken at 751, being r+ per Cent more than the Market Price at the close of Saturday. The Reduced, generally estimated z per Cent under the Consols, were taken at ri above the Market Price on Saturday also. He did not know that any purpose could be answered by . his taking up the time of the C omm i ttee i n making any commentaries on this Bargain, certainly it was to be considered as perfeCtly satisfaCtory and auspicious to the greatest degree ; and he begged leave to congratulate the Committee, and indeed the Country at large, on this proof of the confideoce of monied persons in the Extent and Stability of the Resources of this Country ; but he should not do justice to those whom he addressed, if he' did not add, it was to the wisdom, fortitude, and perse verance of Parliament, supported by the vigour and energy of a powerful People, true to themselves in the hour of trial, that this and all other advantages we had gained are to be ascribed. On the subjeCt of the Tax on Income, he said he should be extremely sorry to suppose that any Gen.. tlemml should impute to him any unworthy motive, by which his condud was actuated ; he could assure the House that the step which he was about to take in this particular, -was the result of his own thought, and that not only from what he had felt in his own breast for a considerable time, but that which he hid communicated to others, who, if necessary, would declare and vouch it for him ; and he was sure the Hon. Gentleman opposite to him, would do him the justice to ray, that in January last he spoke with reserve upon that subjeet, and begged that nQ inference should be draw:: as to the course whicif might be thought advisable by the Executive _. ~. .: ~ ~ . (Government to pursue; all Tie said, or meant to say, I at that time was, that the Income Tax was a measure much too important for the House to let go during the continuance of the War, and he believed the Hon. Gentleman then understood him clearly up o n that subject. He should be sorry also if the measure he was about to take, was the result of a change in his opinion, as to the policy of continuing this Tax had the War continued, for, upon that subject, he knew he differed from many Hon. Members of that House, for whose judgment he had great respell, and for whose principles he had' -great esteem, as well as from many very worthy and intelligent individuals in the Country : he was, however, bound to de clare his own opinion, and to add, it was his thorough and entire conviction, that it was to the wisdom which originated that Tax, and the firmness which induced the House to persist in it, the Coun try was indebted for the comfort we now had; for it was by that system we were enabled to surmount the difficulties with which, during the last three years, we had to struggle ; and it was from that convitaion also he now recommended that this bur_ then should not be left to rest on the shoulders of the Public in time of Peace, because it should be re served for the important occasions which, he trust ed, would not soon occur, but which might occur hereafter, and for which we should look forward as a possible event, and for which we should always be ready to provide. In that sense of the matter, he should always look to this mode of impost to be carried into effect, with little difference from that which now subsisted, except as to such modifications as might render it more efficient: he thought it worthy of the credit and the charatter of this Coun try, to look forward to such a resource, in the painful event of being obliged to struggle for its honour, and maintain its independence against hostile force, and when, no doubt, if it should be the fate of this Country, at some future day, to be called upon to put forth its t faculties, it would not he found wanting to itself. Not that he appre hended such a condition likely to be our lot soon ; but he thought it his duty to state the sentiments he entertained on this subject—sentiments which he believed he should never change. He had now, however, the satisfaCtion of proposing an exonera tion to the extent of this impost for the People of this Country. He had stated, it was his painful duty to suggest to the Committee, the Taxes by which he proposed, that interest was to be provided for 97,934,4371. and he should commence this head of what he had to submit to the Committee with observing, what indeed the Committee would be aware of, that it was impossible to satisfy the claim of interest on such a sum, without proposing Taxes which must, from the nature-of things, bear very hard on the People of this Country. He should only attempt to deceive the Committee, in which he should be miserably deceived himself, if he either thought or endeavoured to speak otherwise. All he would, upon that subject, ask of the Committee was, to follow up the principle which had governed otr conduCt of late years, and particularly in the course of the present War, that of looking at our Debts and Engagements, and the whole of our affairs, fairly its the face, and to consider of the best means of furnishing the interest to the capi. tat of the Debt. rt was in that view he had to consider the subjeCt at present, and to sub. mit to the Committee the means by which that interest should be provided, and when he had done so, the Committee would consider the pro priety of such means; and, he had no doubt, would adopt them, unless it should be found that the same purpose could be answered by imposing something that would be less heavy on the People; but he need not say that, in order to answer the purpose, they must be equally effectual with those he had to pro pose e nor need he say, that if his measures were found to be effeZtual, and none other could be found equally so, and less burthensome, they would be adopted, for that the mere consideration that the Taxes must fall with weight upon the People, 'could not be any reason for objeeting to them. That must be a general objeCtion to all Taxes. There- , fore, without further preface, he should proceed to lay before the Committee, THE TAXES by which he proposed to provide the means of rais ing the Supply. MALT, HOPS, AND BEER. The first Tak he had to propose was a Tax on Malt and Beer ; or rather,, he should say, on Malt, Hops, and Beer—On Malt, one shil_ ling and a farthing per bushel; on Hops, zd. l 4 -. and 8-zoths per pound, to make it, 3d. He pro posed to repeal the present allowance to the Com mon Brewers, granted when Lord NORTH was Chancellor of the Exchequer ; an allowance was then made, in the nature of a drawback, of is. 4d. This he should propose to repeal. He should propose two shillings per barrel on strong Beer, subjed to a drawback, this year, of sixpence, in consequence of the difficulties with which the trade had to contend, and would have to contend. The effea of this additional duty, on each barrel of Beer, would be the next year ss. I id. but (luting the present year, ss. sd. He was willing to hope, that this Tax would be as little liable to objeetion as any, or at least, that the objedions would not be such as would deter the Committee from voting the Resolution which he should propose on that head of Taxes ; not that he meant to say the interest of the Brewer ought not to be considered, certainly it ought, and he trusted it would appear that he had considered it, and this he believed would be mani fest, when the Committee came to consider the dif ference between the price of Barley at this moment, and that of some time ago. He was aware of the very general opinion which prevailed when the Brewers raised the price of their Strong Beer to 4-1-d. per pot, in consequence of the high price of Malt, and an erroneous opinion it was. He was aware also that the Brewers should not he placed in a situation wherein they could not stand the com petition of private brewing, or in which the trade of a common Brewer might be materially injured ; he hoped there would be no just foundation for complaint in that particular, on the part of the com mon Brewer. The private individual was also to be the subjed of this taxation ; this was a subje6t to which he could not look without anxiety, as it involved the interests of the Public materially, as well as those of the common Brewer. It was to him ,a painful consideration, to increase the price of this necessary article of life, Malt-liquor : the pro portion, however, as it bore on the common Brewer and the private individual, he hoped would appear to have been so managed, as that the inducement to brew at home would not be diminished, so as to discourage the praCtice, nor on the other hand so increased as materially to injure the public Brewer ; so that on a general view of this part of the subje(l, no great difficulty would be introduced. But here again he must beg leave to call to the recolleCtion of the Committee, and which he wished to apply to the commencement and the close of this and some other Propositions ; that although he pursued the impres sion which the sense he had of his own duty imposed on him, in proposing the repeal of the income Bill as a Tax, the pressure of which ought not to be felt in. time of Peace, yet that the deficiency which such a repeal must create was considerable, and that the means to fill up that blank, So created, must, to a con siderable degree, be onerous on the mass of the Public ; and he was deceived, if this was not a con vietion on every enlarged mind in this Country.— The operation of the Duty on Beer, . he expected to he such as would enable the Brewer to sell for i Ss. that beer which at present he sold at 165.; under this head, he meant to do away in taxation the distinction which had subsisted between Table and Small Beer ; and in doing this, he proposed at once to correct a great deal of fraud, and put an end to a pernicious beverage which had lately been used. A great deal of &pall Beer had been mixt with strong, for the purpose of bringing the whole of it under the lowest duty; and by which pradice certain noxious ingredients were introduced into the Beer. He should propose to attach the duty on Strong Beer and Table only, so denominated. He was sanguine enough to hope, that this would have no undue ef feet op the trade ; on 'the contrary, that it would corre& a number of abuses, and .benefit the Re venue at the same time, by the regulations which were to be introduced into ir. Taking this duty under the regulations which were to be introduced into it, together with the duty on Malt and Hops, he would venture to estimate the whole at z,000,0001. per annum. ASSESSED TAXES. The next branch, or head of Taxes be had to submit to the Committee, was not a new Tax, but an augmentation of the Assessed Taxes ;. and here again he must take leave to remind the Committee of the Income Tax, and the Repeal of it. He did not mean to that those who paid to the Income Bill, would be affe6led, in like manner, by the Assessed Taxes; but surely it could not be expeEted that those who were to be now excused from the pressure of the Income Bill, were to feel nothing after the Pepeal of it : certainly those who contributed to one, must be so situ ated, generally speaking, as to contribute con siderably to the other—certainly then those who contributed largely to the Assessed Taxes, must feel, and feel onerously, the addition which he should propose to make to this species of Duty— upon which he should not now enlarge, his purpose being to proceed upon a scale of progression, the average increase produce of which.. he estimated about one-third of its present amount ; 'the parti culars of which would come to be specified hereafter. There was, however, one subjeft on which he would glance as he passed. A large number of Journey men Tradesmen were employed as Servants—they remained in the houses of their Employers, and did the duty of Servants, but under the title of Journey men, &c. they were not taxable, while they in reality performed the labour of Servants, by which means a considerable evasion took place of the Duty on Domestic Servants. He should pro. pose a regulation upon this matter, and he ap prehended, persons who could ;Hord to keep such domestics were not improper objeds of taxation, since this of itself was something like a criterion of property. He should propose' to charge for each of these persons mos. per annum. The produce of such an impost he could not be expe&ed to state with accuracy, - because he could not calCulate upon its amount with confidence, but he should presume itito be roo,ocol. Taking this sum and the rest of the addition to the Assessed Taxes, he would ven ture to set down the whole under this head, at the sum of 1,0°0,0001. per annum. IMPORTS AND EXPORTS. He had now to propose another Tax, with a different sensation from that which he felt on the former, which was • regret, for now he pro posed a measure without any' reluaance, because he had the pleasure to know it was approved of by the most considerate part of those on whom it was to fall.: he meant a Tax upon Imports and Exports—a substitute for the Convoy Duty. He had held conferences and received communica tions with several well informed individuals and pub lic-spirited men, who had given to him much useful information upon this subject, and whose co-opera tion he had reason to exped in the measure he was about to propose, and 'which he believed would be brought forwatd in a shape that would not be found to be materially inconvenient to the branch of trade on which it was to operate. He proposed to get rid altogether of the present mode of taking the Duty, to do away the system of ascertaining it ad valorem, in some cases, and to make'certain regu lations in others, as explained by a schedule which comprised sco articles of Duty, which would be conveyed all at one view. The Duty on Imports, with certain modifications, was to be increased, and that upon Exports to be diminished.- This could not he said to be a Duty that would operate to the injury of trade, for it had been already tried for three years, and during that period our trade had rapidly increased. He was aware it might be contended, that we are not to look with confidence for the continuance of the advantages of trade we had during the War. He was not disposed to enter into that question minutely at present ; but he was ready to say, that from the best information he could obtain, and with all the refledion he had been able to make on that subjett, he was not disposed to fall into the despondency which some Gentlemen seemed to feel upon it ; but on the contrary, the prospeCt, as it appeared to him, was very flattering : and here he should take occasion to observe, that it was his inten tion to recommend the adoption of a system which ' took place in 1786, for the purpose of . Conso'ida !in l e the Customhouse Duties, and which wouel e av e t i double advantage of rendering any vexatious de duCtive, and putting an end to m lays which take place under the present system from which plan it was stated to him,. in a way that left no doubt in his mind of the truth of it, that the Merchants would derive great advantagee—; the duty more pro- He estimated the produce of this duty at the sum ° I of i,000,0001. The amount therefore of the ways and Means, for defr a ying the interest of 97,9341437 i would be as follows : Malt and leer • - 2,c00,000 Assessed Taxes ' 1,000,000 Duty on Imports and Exports , 1,000,00 y In all - 4,000;000 By this there was an excess beyond what was want' ed .(that amounting only to 3,211,20214 of near 800,0001. By which some Gentlemen would be in . : duced to say, perhaps, that as this was more than was wanted for the Public Service, it should not be adopted to this extent : he was not aware of a n y error, either in his expectation otehis calculation, but he was confident, that if there was any error; it was an error on the right side ; and though he ha" expressed himself with full confidence upon the P re , sent state of things, yet it was to be prepared with a sum beyond that which was absolutely necessallei Upon the subject of the produce of the Consoli dat Fund, he requested, for a few moments, the patie n attention of the Committee. It was nor his ' lnc : - Lion to go with mi nuteness i nto t h at S Obje ft nowt nor to ask the opinion of the Committee on tt it present. He knew that the case was grave and a un d : portant, and calculations could not be correa l Y m ht upon it without considerable labour, and he th°L l he should not be at - ling rightly, if he were to 11:;' timate a wish, muc h less to express an expett ati ii of having an opinion upo n t hi s matter until it t e° ,, - 0 be considered; but it was necessary that he 5ilC - rhe state the reason he had f or h av i ng deviated from;, usual course, in this particular. He knew he : a te treading on tender a n d sacred ground. He 'v as - , - est there was not in that HOuse, nor in this count r y'' in the world, an individual more deeply i m P r e. e %id than himself with a conviction that the Sink" was the sheet anchor of this Country, and ha," our consolation on the subjed of Finance ; a n . e - the were to make a proposition, which could', "", ro e slightest degree, shake that Fund, or retard ' t , s s ," he greys in the redemption of the Public D e ",',' t ee should meet, and he should deserve to meet) , t " - proach. of every man who felt as he ought to "°:, of as himself he was sure did, for the true inter h e- ,1 t o his Country. The operation of the plan h e "i ore submit would be the subjed of discussion o n a , a r xe day : the objedof it was not to retard, but t° „btie celerate the plan for the re d u diO n of the ' e l ' , Debt ; and without goi ng i nto i t w i t h minnten::o, reserving that, as he had said, for another ocean' _ he would only state enough to call the att entio ' hat Gentlemen to the general nature o f the subjea , 1 00 „ each Member might have an opportunity °f sidering it, as he should, maturely - and deli se tet, ly in his closet. The Committee would ree °, " - t h'e that in 1786 the plan was first submitted t ° consideration of the House, and then a Bid the re ; by whiCh One Million wa s appropriated to , . 0 , • dation of the National D e b t . All the componn" terest of this sum was made to accumulate, and it W' i vested in the hands o f C omm issioners who 5110 7 c receive the annui t y thus accumulating, unt:d.olos whole should am ount to the sum of four mil li annually ; and wh en t h at p er i o d arrived, it wo gal r declared to be in the powei of Parliament _ whether that should continue to increase, or be 3 F ; ' , plied in the redudion of Taxes. In the year it was provided that one per cent, of cverY t he or .further sum borrowed, should be applii d ''~• a s, same manner as the million was in leS6 ti lat oo of to operate as a Sinking F un d f o r the. extinc q e ,-0 of such Loan, in like manner as the other Ft"' - 0 . - ' applied to the redudion of the Debt. IN°': ortr tended to propose that these two powerfu h ' d , anti c ' ative Sinking Funds should be consolidatediona work their purpose together, for the re dt er para. - the whole Debt as it now stood, and, how ev t . at t he doxical it might appear, yet it was true , ~be d whole of the Debt could thus ex be 'Ling" - 1 ati . less time, that was, in a shorter p enes" the to by keeping each to i ts operat i on , a ccording w h o le former system, because by the new plan t he by the Fund would continue to accumulate, where a a s id c ease old plan, the operati o n o f accumu l at ion " lie ad , when it amounted to 4,000,0001. UP ° iteo sv vantages of the latter s y stem h e exPa ll ' ttion great ability, by which, he said, the 0 0 forty-five the whole Debt would b e accomp li s hed in . Aefe ci as years, a Debt which must now be tops ide t t hat upwards of 500,000,00 0 1. H e w as confi aeo to he if this statement he had made should prove ld n o t v ov accurate, and unless he thought so, he " bioh i u have stated it to the Committee, it wa s • and, deserving of attention : hi s g r eat objea w a • b, ot ice he should expatiate upo n i t h e r ea fter, to d0:1;00 fo to the present time, and also to make pr ovls :d cha r the welfare of our posterity. It might he- s' i be re' the benefit to be derived to the Public bond thad duftion of taxes, after the Sinking' ,%, this attained its maximum, would be prevente a , e ' o clell plan, but it should be considered, that, rode) 000 14 of this plan, there would he to he provided 9°° a; e to support the Fund of One per Cent. for duftion of the Capit a l accru ed since the h i a r st r c tva s rr vision was made f or suc h re duection. ee e f o rhi''' one other subject on which it was necessary ott y to say a few word s , an d on w hich, he was s e ,„ an' say, he was not able to g ive the satistaCtuu r lle .4 e a CO c sorer he could have wished. H e erg av Duty that was payable on Salt. He Ile v , ; st et' any assurance upon that subjen, but he had ha . ' " in the course of the present See.Jion, v t 4; hopes he should be able to get rid of th i g e t r od to w i t h No man felt more than he did, a desir e be done 101 of such a duty as this, when could tgriCes, safety. But under the present circumb , until we saw the effed of Peace, a nd ,a tio some other things were considered/ he o u s l ireer t he c think that he should be justified in pro' ) to th ee rse arL repeal of this Duty—He did 100 k Ju r ve d I `, A5 period when this Country might be re ' le b e ‘ 4% e re3pea; but he would not allow that the i t to h o ; so very oppressive a one as some had s? on the lower order of the c ommoo' r Y ol:v c thew' wished more seri ous ly than he did to oil