The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser. — London, England, 1810-05-26 00:00:00

of having a religion of a different kind from that established in the country, to such an extent', and in such a condittoti, as the Catho lic Religion in Ireland ? For himself, he slim,. and night when he thought of it . dared day what were the dahgers of But the questi on was not, this religion, but what dangers could arise from the removal of these restrictions? Would it not he con. ceded to hits, that. if the smut Vl°lloll6 were wanted to the Catholics, they would join heartil) indelence of the country ? He begged of them to sysispatlii.s with Ireland, and wiih the feeling.; of Irishmen ; sir look back to history, and they ould see that what the y imposed upon eland—a heretical clergy, US I t WO in the eyes of tee people—vras the very griev ance they themselves restated in many of their nu,- welts, and for which they expelled one of them. The acquiescence of the Irish People its this, cer tainly not without Irequeut coolosutions, was proof that they were tint that stiff-itecked, stub born, end rebellions generation, they were retire mated to b e .—Dist what mischief coati' the taking sway the restrictions 410 I—lt could hot give their clergy m v greater influence, or afford them any additiotial power--ror could it be supposed, toat giving cite Catholic a fair prospect of honour so d reward, would helot e him to join a foi Police, in order to destroy those who opened to hi s eyes this fair viea. As for what had beta said relative to the propagation of the Protestant religion working this change, it was ant, much as he desired it should. calculated for such ail egret. The march of reason in the human reuid ir.is slow ; and, if that was to be looked to us the termination of their troubles, to the finite man the proseription appeared eternal. As fur the propagation of the Cath,dic Religion s it al, aril 'mown that a rel.ginu mode inure converts under peraicution than when counteuaneed by law. Ile believed 'wither the one nor the other would be riiavel or impeded by removing the restrictions. the *abject of' the Veto, he felt it difficult to decide, and it was with apprehension he touched I.'llo delicate a point. From all the considerations, however, that he had been able to give the matter, he could nut help thinking this measure too ur gent to be delayed on any objectiou that could arise about the Veto. Ile was unwilling to notice any part of the Hon. and Learned Judge's speech, wdhout approbation; but he considered the part of it, which noticed the conduct of the English Catho lics, as calculated to render conciliation incite diffi cult. It was unnecessary to enter into all the ad rantages to derived from Catholic Emancipation. Let Comdtmen consider the sacrifices that Ireland had made for mein. Why could riot they meet this With a correspondiug sacrifice ou their liana? The utmost iiccesinty existed for union. Look at the state of Europe, concentrated and contented uniLr the dominion of one man. Look at hit 'monstrous resources—his Ponces ready to obey him—his numerous arinies—bis experienced Ge. ueralt. Could they look without awe anti adtuira titbit at this volcan,„ entrusted, for • while, with power to scourge the earth ? He was aware that he did not take the popular side on this ques tion. Those upon the other side might enjoy it MT himself, he spoke not for popularity, but for protietly, bandy, and lilwrty,—( Hear, Asap./—He had coudeinned Ilinistcrs for their ill-couduated expeditions, yet they might hive plausible urge ineats fur the m; and the great ground of his oppu. mown to them was this, that they were pledged not to tale aay wasuces to ecnciliate the people of tetrad. ht W .SCOTT explained. General Si s farm. viewiog a n d cons id i r i ng the greshos as he had always done, would have little to add to the able speeches that had been made on 0CC4400. lie did not coincide in the rtritiln aseolation of the two. The penal bias were the foundation of the wineries--.they were the founda tion of the dangers of this country, and ought and toast be repealed.—The best pionf of the opinions Omen on this head, was to be found in the Pro.. testauts of Irelanol, who were unanimously in fa vour of Catholic Emancipation. It was a must im portant question, as it not only embraced the in terests of Ireland, but of Great Britain, sod of the world. In it lay the decision, whether we should be a great, free, and independent state, or be ut terly subverted ? For he was sure, were this claim rejected, and Ireland, as it had been for 600 year., w"ce the time of Henry VIII. governed with cruelty, tyranny, and oppression, the consequence mast be the loss of the country. Yet let Gi u- Beaten be warned by.example. The instruments if cruelty to Ireland, in former blurs, had found out their errors too late, and, at last, instead of coercion, recommended kindness and universal toleration.— After eercising the utmokt cruelties that human nature catild mama.° afflict maiskirol, they had hood that every act of oppression only plunged_ theta the deep er i n res i stance end horror. This ass uo wviertiun of his own, but proved from his tory...pier, the Iliciounible Gentleman read, from Non ..un'a History, and fnon a letter from Lord Vendors to Mr. Secretary Cecil, in the reign of Queen Elisabeth, an account of horrible enielties exercised on the liish people, and recom mending the adoption of comiliatoty measureq— Centlemen were not to think that such things had not hoppeael snore the reiy i n of Queen Elia Meth.; for to bis ow n poiso ns ' knowledge, practice s r yua4ly Cruel sod barbarous had been practised in DAM° "„" rl aulaY trans of th e country , under the re i gn of ..eigge 111. and in the year 1798. There. and at Viet tune, be NM honest, industrious, innocent men ll ^lltged from their homer', their 'rives and families ----borne off to prison —tar without law or trial hurried to the triangles or halberts erected in the Exchange of DohliD, the Eagle-yard, Beresfortrs Riding S chool. and Sandys' Pecan, and tied up, f lo l44edr lacerated, tortured, and half-hanged. Where t 's then Ma gna Ch arts and the Bill of Right,*lath declared that the subject should not lie mini:died without a trial by his Peers or the r of the Laud T Ile lied see, hundreds of bodies Imulled, half-naked, and dead in the fields and ttehes—the fathers butchered—the mothers vto the .i.iters sod daughters, nay, the vet y ellilarr° of 1 " yew* of age, polluted by a m i xe d of laelegar t, les iery, consistin g of E ng li s h f en - Ti t " and (ami soldgo eerseasties.--1 Hear. hear too, was under the reign of Lord Cianden, nos • Miniitai of the Crown, • Privy C""" and Secret Adviser to His Majesty.— Meg , , hew. hear I—lt wigs, after all these bog rors, that Mr. • Pitt, like the Statesmen iu the reign of Queen Elizabeth, found out, that it ass time to advise conciliatory measures, lenity, and Catholic Eateneipatioa. Lord Camden was re called. au I Lord eoruvrallie appointed to succeed him, Ishii soon restored tranquillity to the country. lint this act of oblivion mid reutiseion wu. noel' lire ken threngli, and 40,000 Inert were added to the precediug cold butcheries. ! After all this, the Iri•h were true to their King and their couutry. Would then tiny oue say, idler three utuleniable facts, that the Irish were it people not to be trusted, —( cries of hear. hear, hear,)—or entitled to the advantages of our glorious Constitution ? Would they continue to persecute 4,000,000 of their fel. low-anbjects, front whom was made up one-huS of their army, and one-half of their neve—made up too of men of undoubted bravery, a hose conduct against the enemy, though they acre of the seine religion, was es rt. as gtillaut as could by ituseitied. lie would now supplicate the House to grant what they now asked ; if they did nut, he would viols be ready to demand it. The Him. Gentlemen theu adverted to the treaty of Limerick, which he contended had hewn grossly violated within 4 months eller it, couclusion ; and lest the usual ignorance of the House on Irish eulijects should be pleadt d in excuse on this occasion, he at once shortly elanntd from them to be restored to what privileeee they el.- joyed in the reign oiCharles 11. Wily should not Irishmen have these rights ? There were none mere loyal, brave, or desert iiig. If they refused a claim so just, they would repent it ill itiouniiiig over Ilia ruins of the country—destroyed by their menus.— For, if they persisted la their scheme of granting I no rebel t 'lreland. whateivould he the coris:eptence of invasion ? Invasion, too, most certainly take place as soon as the conquest of Spain took. place, eliich no malt could now d o ubt weeld very speedily be achieved. Then, with Ile, is at ,Vigo, Comeau, 1 Ferrol; and other ports, a few hours' sail from the shorts of Ireland, they must look fur fearful coo sequences. if they did not take meets to wine the people. He tumid nut stop to inqiiire what, kinds of fleets these were ; they would be sufficient to sub vert Ireland, and detach her front Euglaucl, if they took such 'elms to have her population aerated against them. Of what did this populatisn con. mist? As it appeared from the testimony of 'mit re' of the persons, staled Directors, at the time the rebellion was preparing in that country, it amounted to 300,000 men. ready to take up arms against Eng lend. Indeed these Direetorswanted no great siiil to enable Ireland to deliver herself; &I they asked front France for that purpose was 10,000 men, sod 40,000 stand of arms. If ever they were driven to this extremity, they would free themselves from F.egland, tied either become united to France, or an independent state, under her protection. They would then threateu and overthrow England.—rel lorsgh.)—They might laugh now ; theeime woitl.l come tl.ey iiould be sorry for it. By such a change Ireland had every thing to gain and nothing to lose—By it they would abolieh their penal laws—They would get rail of tythes—.They would pay off sixteen Millions of debt they owed England —They would do away that worst tied most detest alekt of all establishriteuts, the Lieutenantcy of Ireland—They would get free from the system of Peusimis and Sinecures— They would. as they were well entitled to do, from their soil and situa tion, hecoine the depot, unit uniy of Europe, but of , bulls—They would 'eremite a military nation, either on the plan of the old militia, or of yeomanry— They would be free and independent—and against them what could England do with her fleet,. ;it'd armie 4 This was no vieitmary scheme ; it required only 48 hours to carry it into effect, by a general teeing of the people. They would soon seize the depots cud arsenals, overcome tel resistance, and keep the most valuable of them as hos tages. He believed from his soul that all this was practicable, for they might get truth from the wicked, and it was the account given by these Directors, who had taken pains to ascer tain all that it was in their power to dn. For himself he knew what he stated.—hie had better information from Ireland t h an any nem in that House. There was °sly another lion. Gentleman who received such information; and lie had mut mete any use of it for several years. The 300,e00 men was on the calculation of I in 13 to take tip arms, and the number ofinhabimets might fairly be taken et 6,000,0001. He then noticed the conduct of Mr. Grattan and Mr. Ponsonhy, who he thought had suffered themselves to be misled, eight years ago. by the Secretary for Ireland, when they suffered - the Insurrection Bill to pass. As they were now informed by him of the tuisrepreseatallen on which it was founded, he was sure their love of their country would scrure him their assistance on a future day, when lie should move fur its repeal. There was no French party in Ireland at that tinte; there was no French party io it now. The only interest in the country wits oue he hoped always to see is it—it was the Irish intertst.— In this country lie trusted there would also ever be an English party—a party that would never bow to King., Lords. or Commoos, but stand or fall with the Constitution. (Hear! Liar!/ With respect to this grant being against the coronation oath, he was sure. if the matter was fairly and openly laid before His Majesty, he would never think it any violation to consult so much the welfare of his subj. cto. Three of the greatest men this country ever saw, the illu.trions triumvirate of Pitt, Fox, end Ilurke. they thought it no violation, and sup ported Catholic Emancipetion. But if it even was a violation, let them repeal the present oath. and frame • new one, more congenial to the spirit, temper, and enlightened nature of the times. Had not the Parliament of George 111. es good a right to make this alteration as the Parliament of James I. to frame the original oath ? As to the veto; he was not competent to judge upon it, nor would be give an opinion oe it. He would not set up his opinion, were it hostile, spinet those of four millions of men, who understood their own religion better than any one else could do. He could see no oheection to the present measure; and evenafbe had object ions. he would sacrifice them, and go with the gears. ?I body for emancipetios, with or without the veto. lie then read the 'Tipperary it e imitations, recommending a domestic arrangement; and impressed upon the House the necessity of at tempting this. lie thanked them for the patient attentiou with which he had beets beard—called on them to look at the interests of Ireland, as if they were the interests of England, and then they would Lc uni!ed, invulnerable, and aufe fro:n all fear of int:llion. Ile concluded with an aninnted rtcapi tu,ntion of hi. twain arguments and injunctions putt the Howie. Lord deicatee said, as much as he omit,' wish to conciliate the minds of his cou itry inea. and as ioncli us lie regarded inUly hut viduais of the Ca tholic lteligiuo, he could nut give his support to the in ohm. when he eausideied the tate rraulti tions that. hail been entered. hot) by the Catholic Body in Dublin, the purp,rt of which was to deny all Maui-lice of the Crown in the nopointmint of their Bishops. Alter such re,olutiona being sent forth to the world, he thouelit emancipation would be dangerous ; and even if it was grente I, he did not thick it would he of any immediate lemetit, unless Gentlemen would live more upon their es tates, and amongst their tenantry. lie wished some harrier was thrown on to prevent the wort of all evils, the emigration of the Nobility and Gen try of Ireland. He concluded by saying, the tows tion should have his negative. Mr. SHAW followed on the same side ; and said, while they demanded couceission, he was sorry they themselves were so-slow in conceding. lie would give his decided vote lig thirst It. Mr. Secretary Rance maid, he felt anxious to state the grounds on which lie should give his vote that night. Even those who were considered the greatest clue:nylons of the question, oily, it Is ion po-s.ble to grant it without cnneesition—and the Ceiholics Will not concede. When thus ipiestion was brought forward too years a;;e, the Right Goo. Gentleman (Mr. PoosoulaY) arclgredi that IlleT were ready to give. the Cruerii is direct negative in the appointiuent of their bishop.. lie milted him,. then, who within bed I • ? and he answered, the ac credited vent of the Catholics (Dr. 'Milner). Tina self same se , reirlited agent has since come forward and declared he would lose his life before he would coacede it. had not a doubt but the night Hon. Gentleman was deceived; but he would Owls have an opportunity of explaining. The day before the present session, Lord Greiiiille puldisheil.st let, when it was georrelly reported lie was to hate been at the head of the Governinout, in atisaer to the Catholics. lie would not take up the tinie of the House with any arguments, but acouie-cad iu those of the Noble Lord, for which reason he would vote egaiust the present queaticm. Lord Ducatha said, the motion should have his support ; he was of opinion, that all Ms Ma jesty's sit' jeers, of whatever religious persuasion, should enjoy the same rights aad privileges. Mr. Po:isms- commenced, at the late hour of twelve, a epeeeli so Leilliant, display iug s much eloquence and argument, that even to attempt to write it, at au protracted a period of the night, would hr WI injustice, to that great orator. Adverting to what the Hon. Secretary had said with regard to his (Mr. Ponsonby's) beige authoeised by ate accredited agent of the Catholic Bishop. to mike proposals is their mine, he cleaned that such obse 'ration was founded in fact—lle had merely stated that the Catholics were disposed to give the minim allot' of the bishops to the Crown, iu return for !how full participation in the privileges of the Comoitit tion. lie said that he *honk' state the ati , honey upon which all the observations he had made to the House upon the subject, had been founded.— He tiTen detailed to the House at very long but in teresting history of the correspondence and coliver tedious between himself, Dr. Milner, and Lied Flogs! ; the result of which clearly proved that the honourable Member had never advanced a single proposition in the Howe, or rustle any observatioa whatever, with rag tail to the Catholic Claims, except such es were fully sanctioned by the authority of Ur. Nlilner. and Lord Fingal; and the general tendency of his remarks went to prove that there had been a degree of vacillation io the conduct of Dr. Milner, amid to point out that the Doctor had receded from the ground upon which lie had originally induced him (Mr. Poissouby) to come forward in support of the Catholic Question. Hating stated to the Hoare, at great length, the letters of Dr. Matter, sod his own in 111111Wer to them, and several publications connected with therm, lie trusted the House would give him credit for nut havingrashly advanced any propositio this subject, without sufficient authority. With re spect to the question of the Veto, he had been re gulated iu his conduct !Riccardi:lo to the opinions of others. He then proceeded to draw a comp.'. risou between the situation in which the Pope was placed, prior to the French Hevolutom. with what it had been reduced to since that event; remarking, that in consequence of the acts of the Emperor of France, the Pope had become slings titer dependent upon France, and subservient to her will ; aad from theme by deduction inferred the danger of allowing any it stem that could by possibility give a pretence for foreign nomination among the Catholic Bishops. lie was of opinion, however, that the Catholics were entitled to have every thing granted them which was chnsistent with the security of the Government to which they appealed ; and fur his part he had no ap prenenaions of French ascendancy, which ought to withhold him from granting to the Catholics their claims to partake in the benefit of the British Con poitution.—lle thought they had a right to exer cise their religion as their forefathers hail professed it.—lie was of opiniop that an arrangement might be male between the Catholics stud the Protestants, equally satisfactory to both : but he seemed to think that there were many who had preferred the pre sent claims of t he Catholice, wishing at the same time that they might be rejected. He argued that the subject of the Viso was nothing more than a pre tence for resisting the Catholic Claims; and that the Administration were determined to resist them at all events. He regretted that Isis Honour able Friend behind him. General Mathew, had not expressed himself in language more temperate. Ile agreed with him. that there was no danger to be apprehended from giving Ireland what she de. mantled, but, on the contrary, that it would add to the security and stsbility of the Empire. All that was now demanded was, that the House would con sent to go lino a Committee. Haring take° a ge lato-al review, he adverted to the Sate of Europe. placed as it was at present under the power and doosiuion of a single paraoit ; oar those cursor dinary loco, whom Providerice created once its two or three thousand years, to prodetee greet and ma traordiny revolution.; ile.cribed him as nopande leled, not only as * military alma, but a 11l ttl fur general action ; he considered him to he the great est mutt that had, for many centuries. "l'Peorcd oA the face of the earth ;he would net rut , r into the • ronaiderution of his moral character, for lie thought . his viers equal to hie talents. Thii character lie couceived was nut only ambitions hiut,elf, bet go verned a nation wh o were ecoally es; and thirefure he (Mr. Puma:milt) dreaded what "40 Probetble be the result, it' France, with sec h wane gild • energies, should attempt the Mention aid cooqueat . of Ireland. He was of me :1 1 0c , that Is order to pee. vent the worst that might happen, it would 'well' .become the Lei isle we to make the first '• winces to the Irish Catliolice ; to stste. in • the_ tint place. what we would grout, and them hear what they would concede. alluded to and deptea • • cute.' the effects of the Unio.i, and eNressed h.s apprehensions, lest. in. case the C itibulici should • be disappoinunl, with rape t tw the conditinu on • hich that measure was agreed to, they might vet. - sort to means of ohtainiag th e ir rglit., hi g hly d en . , r• herons to the interests of this co.intry ; and he feared they might find but too much eileourageuient in the ability and resJurre, of the 1.7, Emp,nr. Fla then referred to the pledge wii.ch His Mejesty hail been advised to . dernand of his Mini:trot, that they would not recommend t o him the adoption -of say system favourable to the Claim. of the Callao. - lies, Ile conceived it the .most niteoustetutiooel advice that had been given to any King. sant* the reign of James IL He concluifed by referring to the eonseqa, lice.' which in the earlier mitts of the. reign of Ili, irre.rut il4j-•sty had resulted lons his attending to the advice of his Ministers, in oppo.s. sition to the opinion of Parliament and iii people ; by so &dug he had 104 America. :tad lied accele rated the ruin of every State on .the Continent. lie .. trusted that Mini,tm would give him that nitres which sio.ild prevent him Com losing Ireland. He way of optiouti that isollw,g but kitithiess and cone ciliation would preserve, Ireland to tido comity, nod that *nee and vi , dence would only provoke it into a at rte of de.•erinined hostility. [We desire it to be understood, that this is only vesy brief and imperfect sketch of one of the mat • luminous speeches ever delivered on this %object.] Mr. PFRCFaxt. exprnised his twist . ..talon of the manner the Itight Hon. Gentlemen (Mr. Poosanb4 had exp'sine.l; bat thoualit he ought not to have kept the public to long tinder a edited. He. theis entered into the merits of the care, and contended, that lie was as justifiable in charging the Catholics with intolerance, as they him; for they refwed to cede a single particle, and even there had sheen ' they could not be haltered ; for chili reason he would give hie decided opposition to their pet•tion. Mr. WlllrliftEAD took a full review of the sub. • ject, and of the arguments of the Hon. Gentleman who preceded him. Ile entreated of the House to consider alto were fighting their battles. 'they were Catholics; who manned their Rees. men of the same persuasion. Ile wus told that when the Host • passed our soldiers in Sicily, they presented arms ; • and should they have toleration in eiery couutry . but their own? He concluded u most eloquent end animated speech, by ileelsein4 himself the fit•-•nd of the Catholics, and he aould be their ad,socate as long as he esker!. Mr. CA NISINU assured the 'lions* that he had never given a pledge to ally matt, or any wet of mew, on this' great and momentous question.' lie hoped the time would tome when this union between Pro.. testants and Catholics would hike place ; but it could not he contended that tide was the time, alien one of parties could not a4ree amongst themindi co. He was pure the Right Hon. Gear. Mr. Grattan. did ant bring forward the motion with the idea that • it would be carried, but in performeoce of a duty imposed upon him. It should therelure have his negative. Mr. licaagee in a short (Teeth supported the motion.—( Loud okra gutsier's, grsestion.l Mr. IIuTCIIINSua iu..ved, r• That the debate should lie aitiotrned to Thurstlay. - -(Loird cries of go on, go on.) Mr. PARNELL seconded the motion. Mr. S. DVIID•11 said that 'Flint-.day was ap. pointed for the consideration ut East India affairs, and it would be recollected that he had Postpowed it several times, fur the eccotomodation of the non. Geritli man. Wu.SHITII thought the East India bo.i rie s s nfthe greatest consequence, and mazy perms were waiting with the greatest se.aiety to know the re. stilt. He thought it would be better to conclude the present question then, for in his opinion thily had heard enough alt. Mr. HUTCHINSON said, there were many Gentle. men who were most materially interested, and wished to deliver their sentiment., that they miv l 4 go forth to the public ; if Thursday was occupied, he would take the next open day.—( Cries of go on. go on). Mr. SNSIIID•N thought, when Gentlemen from Ireland wished I. express their sentiments up. on such a momentous iriestion, it was the duty of the House to agree to Inc postponement. The debate was adjourned to Friday next, The other orders of the day were then sli.posed of, and the Howse adjourned at HALF PAST FOCH. O'CLOCK. till this day. . _ AMARICA. CONGRECII. SENATIVINRCH M. The Bill to alter and amend tiie Act fixing the Military Peace Establishment. was mid a third time and passed. The Senate resumed the consideration of the Bill appropriating a sum of money for the purpose of pro*, Ming munitions of war. HOUSE OE REPILESBISTATKES-..FRIVAY, 1.1111101 20. Mr. W. ALSTON, from the Cotnmittee appointed to report abut business is necessary to be done the present &rimy. and alter the day proper for Con gress to adjourn. made a repast of the busines. br. fore the House neeessary to be completed. and the folio Awe Regolution Resolved, by the Soup and [loupe of Representatives of the United States, Tbat the l'resiettnt of the &oats, tot th. Speaker of the Hasse of Rept*. 'natives, be, awl thty are beret), withal-iced to adjourn tbLat I.speetete Honor ea tk acrd o April sect. Mr. LOTS 1130,0 to postpone the eavvitlesation or the Resolution until Ntlint.tty nett.—the ques tion was taken by ayes and noes, and carried-a.. aytafil. noes SC Mr. RA %Mit lif gave notice, that . to shothi, on of thi rsl lic dri thi to wit the YeIL 1141 tat Prt boi SN od aa l't to be 13 ( inn II Is' th 11,1 0 , )1 , 11 gei Sill Ytlt so) It, lira col Via had this the ►1