The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser. — London, England, 1819-03-02 00:00:00

i fitted le mistiness nothing he conc::ved die , live hail cli"ea in r m 97, there were, tie might say, I WO c ould be flout oat or a Committee ; he saw nu dit- periods, and the number of executtuas was greater tieulte i s the way et the Inquiry, hut he conceived during the first period than iii the latier.--. that these maws Came un d er distort an d ,: eietra i e %Val% respect to the Er..strst growth of crime, it hea d, Th ar abate of the subjele wee eeireinely wail to be feituil chiefly milder that ily.cription of delicate, it greatly iutereated the public feeling, offence. denominated larceny. As to burglary raid hat not more, in his opinion, then it ought ; dist robbery, the growth of those crimes was liy no {,,hull, directed to such subjects as the firmed, means commensurate with what it was at former produce . I.i.ltitary effects.—. 11ef10.10.4.91i1l it was worthy of observation, that wa s always safe to The slats of the criminal law would natiirally ga tits- aegravated character which used to mark thole uu der the consideration of a Committee; hot i t was offence* 110 longer distinguished them ; they were n e e est impossible to UAW) Oh that subject with t i not perpor4t.-41 with soi•li einstinistalices of tilrlS -3,.., roibnic i uit the ee il itera l question of gaols. He sinus ertielty mid violence as formerly accompanied did o ut see the teat essity nor the wird or having them. Having stated so much tut the subject of ditferent Ceisamitters appointed to invratigate sub. crone, ill general', lie should now advert to a 110111, nearly cousiecied as to form hot which, he conceived, teretigthened and corroborated Pc" which k " tile r& I 1, adof i • G nil his opinion, that the increase or crime Heise from parts or a general writer. mite laving a Committee. a C mittee for Botany B a y , and other temporary cause*. Amongst the female sex, it quest . e, he thought the better way would b e f o r would be perceived, that the growth of crime the House to collect the teat information as to the hail Merest-eel in a very small proportion, which the mode of transportati on, plainly pits-ried that the increme had prima etiolation of the hu lks, and to re- pally occurred in those classes of the paella she subject of seciatirla r y p unislimetitti, port mem e full and compretwowire view. This tent that had been exposed to great difficulty, was preferable to partial and discordant viewe to he slid whose habits were connected with a war taken by d Iferent Committees mono this most im- like life. There was something gratilyieg in con loneliest 'object. It was the hest and safest way siderite; this part of the subject, as well in content /if tworeeditig-.-it answered all the ends in view, mud plating the manlier in which the prerogirtive of earned inquiry to its uitnnat extent. He could not mercy had been exercised. The principles of hu improve of air attempt to weaken the natural and manity hail been strictly attended to—and mercy mend hog...tree of the law, and by one sweeping had been PO extended as to resider it highly boleti iia„,,e to amo k the Penal Code with disepprobatims cal. The laws had been most leniently carried and fingerer. Ile (Lord Casilerregli) hoped the Hon. into effect. There was not only no increase in the and !availed Gentleman would take smeller view of total number of executious. of late years, computed the sebiect. The course he intruded to 'Melte with preeetleig periods, but there was an actual and would out diminish the difficulties that lay in the positive dimi ssss tion. lie begged to call the sewn. way of reformatiou. The hest reform, the surest lion of the House to this part of the subject, which way of anieliuretion, was nut to inflame the passimie was the more important, when it was recollected let exaggerated statements. This he 211.14V14 lotted that several Gentlemen coneidered our criminal injurious. The mind, from this state of excitation, law as possessing a mint sanguinary character, sinks into indifference, and there is sat energy end had delivered opinions which tended to snake enough' left te attain useful end practicable object's. time peuple believe that the code under which they 1 He would stow advert to the progress of mime, which lived was more severe than that of any other cotes crrtaiuly was distressiug, mild would be alarming if try. The number of trials had greatly increased, i t cou ld u m be in some degree etplamed. For the and the number of convictions, for offences to which last 4or 5 years. the isisesher of criminals, takiisg even the penalty of desalt was attached, had also into account the persona st present under accuse- increaeed very much, but the sentence in few cases tiros in Euglaud awl Wales, were more than don- was carried into execution. For a series of years, lee; and in wolfram prior the 'umber increased I up to 1805, the number of persons convicted cite three to rue. This stateasent, he said, was truly tally throughout the country was, on the average, alai • g, but three were circumstances which 350 in each vear—at a later period about 1,t50 per gave reasen to hope that they proceeded from sons received sentence of death in the course of temenrery causes. The situation of the country each year. But, if they looked to the earlier ter the last twenty years had undergurie the most perind, they would find , that, with respect to stailect cissuges ;it was not the same country ;it orrelfilt of the persons thus convicted, the Lad settled iu size; the metropolis had incieaseil law was suffered to take its course, while the to size and in poptilatimi ; the cities in the country proportion in the two last years was, in 1417, bad miso increased; there was a visible alteration one in eleven, and in 1818, only one in twelve. in the character of the people. T h e R11111111 . 4C During the whole period, it appeared that the luring system had placed the situation of the administration of the law had been such es to country, and its moral character, in a different I retrench, in a very great degree, the number of different view front what it had been. Looking capital punishments. To simplify and prove this, at time progress of crime, it would be found he would state to the House the number of persons tem belt the number of criminals in England executed its the whole of Great Bream. in the last and Wales would be found in five counties, year, %lath was 97—and no considerable variatiou namely. the counties of Somerset, Middlesex, from that iiiiinber had taken place for many yesie. Surge), (as adjoining the metropolis), %%Ter...telt, and pest. On the other hand, in several different years, York, distmesuislied alike for its space and us ex- the Humber of executions in London and Middle tele. In Muse tire comities would be found *ex mimic, had exceeded the total amount of exe twee than half of what was the extent of crime cutiotis that now took place throughout the entire iii Eiaisiod sill Wales. These counties were the kingdom. A document would he laid before the great maimfaciiireig counties. lit York the ma- Commence that would place this 'subject in the mime are of cotton *hour, which before the war had clearest light. It would embrace *period of peace onseineed in between 3 and 4 indiums, swelled at and of ya, since it went back so far as the year leisetit to the enormous amount of IS millions star- 1749. and stated the number of executions in ling. There were, he said, other circumstances London and Middlesex during each year. He \shish might in some degree account for the growth would take it up at the year 1783, which, as it of crime, particularly within the last four or five was immediately sifter the period of the American years. There were enormous numbers added to the war, currespouded most nearly with the present pe t iole from the army and navy ; cettaiuly not situation of the country. I. Ws than from three to four bombed thastisand lii ine, .the number executed in London and per.uns. He mentioned the fact merely to Middlesex, alone, war .hew the increase of populatien, and so far to I: 1 1 7 4 4 . 66 5 ...... 97 account for the increase of c • . There per- t „ teed siovi were not used to labour, they were not used 1 g 1757 . 92 to subsist upon their industry. and the general And so at went on, in the same ratio. Here it embarrassmetit was increased by the distress would be observed, that in 1785, 97 persons were which pressed upon the country, the difficulty of i , executed in London and Middlesex alone, being procuring employment, and the lowering of wages. exactly time number executed, throughout all Eng- These distresses reduced many to indigence, and land, ill the late year. During that period, only threw them upon parish support—a state which was •le were executed in London mid Middlesex, and ceserary to the pride and feelings of the people ; . the average was not more than 20 for several years this ectsmitilatioti (Asocial difficulty naturally pro- . past. lf, therefore, he had not taken a perfectly slimed an increase of crime. There were other ermieous view of the subject, it would appear, that facts to sheer that the increase of ensue had pro- the laws had exceedingly diminished iii paint of created from temporary resume After the war severity, es would be welt (ruin the comparisou be the people in fact passed from one mode of lime; t tweeze the number of executions that time took place to smother, mild it was at this crisis that the deli- ia London and Middlesex, us well as throughout eeity of SS livellllooll is greater, and that ther e tie whole country, countered with what formerly is the most ilengermis tendency to ermine. The ureurred tit Loudon and Middlesex alone. lie had industry of the people for the last years of the i stated enough, he hoped, to the House, to war partook of a warfame kind ; the sudden changer itnisiess them with the feeling which he him bail cuiseerpietitly hail an effect upon public pros- self eirtertaitied. The reit was, no doubt, pertly and public morals. But though mauy • one of very great magnitude ; so greet indeed Crimes had increased, it was still satisfactory to that the House emitd not cope with it, if it limes, Alert those offences against nature—those did not appear to arise front temporary causes. It -rimer of a blacker die have nut increased. /is had hot certainly taken that direction which their this class of crimes there has been no isscrease ; nature would most revolt at. The great pressure comparing them with a former period, when the on the lower orders of society, and the state of war population was fuss numerous, those enormities i in which this country had so long been plionged, mite o u t been greater ; and in the last year had created great temptations for the commission the convictions were fewer dam the history of the lof crane. jr, to check these evils, they could find country recorded for a great number of years. out srcandery i ..... isliments, sufficiently severe to There had beets no increase of murder—sehere inflict tieit salutary terror on the minds of culprits, had beet' no increase in cutting amid maiming— i which was so necessary to the well-being of society, there load beau nu increase iti cases of bur- i they would, ht dosoleedeue, act as sit effectual core glory, tapes, and assaults. Those crimes that give i restive of vice. But lie understood an Hots. Gen tile must pandit: evidence of moral depravity, and them's' (Mr. Buxton) to maintain, that the great is huh are the must difficult to cocrect, had not, he growth of vice was to be attributed to the contimie soul, increased, hut in many instances were ou the I natisig convulse i n to whicli culprits were intro. decrease. Time-class of .crimes that had most in- I ducal, in the different places where they were im. creased, were Ouse of forgery, larceny, awl robbery. prisomel. It was a matter much to he lamentesl Well tegard to the Crime of forgery, it was hot that such a mess of vice was congregated in those toistined to the Bank of England alone, but had places . ; but how could it he avoided ? He, how. Leer greatly !enclosed upon country notes. As to the ever, isi Id upirove the Hon. Gentleman's proposi. Led. ef Eugland, they had chews much energy tilos, for time purpose of suggeistmg, that the House tolore the Committee, to devise some mode of would act most etrunenusly, if they supposed, and teeveisting the crime of forgery; end he hoped that acted on such a supposition, that the great increase the public would he satisfied with the exertions of of crime did not mist from different causes.... lit silliest seal efficient trody. Great difficulty, I ;Hear, hear.)—ltedixitlitols certainly might, after kis dome, Ise:ongs to the subject ; it is hard their liberation Irten prison. find their way there a to ripply a remedy to the evil. Opening the second time ; hut the number of those who thus Seek, he was sure, would not remove the dif- committed flesh offences would 'let satisfactorily ficelty cisiispienwil of. The Honourable slid Learn- h account for atm extensive gtowth of the evil. He est (Is-misuse:3, be was sure, would admit that must. therefore' cutitend against the Hon. Gentle it eould tie iiii:poesible too to seduce paper currency man's:propositions as comerehreding too limited a as to prevent forgeries. Bat it was consolatory to . view of the subject, since lie seemed to imegine. thnik that thesissember of executions has heen leas that, if they dealt with the state or tic *tots, they for the last eigla or ten years, than they had been dealt with every thing that was necessary, wlisle, ma 64 1 1 .5te eiglit ,r tell ;tears Wore. Since the Batik fact, a Yost number - ,of (outlaw, intimate]; tau- • Committees, messy of il.em perlsma conflicting their views. Ile It toted a ereat and combined view er the subject would be laid herore them—midi whole Ilse I ise.e w.1% . 1.s s omwodoo or Ilse lolottiter or the Com. touter, it wistil.i then lee for itoltsillsotl kiembers to point out %itch regolatioo* :or they wished to lie Cal , . tied into effect. II was his iotentissis in move, in the terms of the notice, for the appointment of a Coo 1111 l ittee to comider this subject ; fir lie had given. in his Hotter, the very WOlll. Of the motion, in order to nthail the moat perfect information to all frartiii. If these cords weir slot blarileirgetly Colll l /11111.11bitit., hr *tee ready In Ow them, to as to ieuilh.r the Committee ciipat:lr of r. cling the oldest he Willis view. But he depreesit.ii, tic outlet, ally attempt to appeal to the 1/410.101111 of the multitude. Ile trusted they would not now be told, for the first time, that threw laws which their fisthers had taught them to rtspect, that the criminal statutes of Eiselund were an oppressive and sanguinary code, which the House of Commons had disclaimed.— Such a sentiment would be opt to noluce the loner orders to believe, that a hoot was held out fur the commission of crime in this country—that crimi nals were in future to proceed with 0; •-eater freedom in their depredations than Ilse) had ever before douse! lie called on Gentlemen, for Gull's sake! not to ri/111 down the existing laws of the country, until they hid funned More just statutes, which might be Plaintituted in their place. Ile would propose such a Committee of Inquiry as would not prevent any proper and practicable course of aniendsuent. To that Committee he did not think there could be any rational ground of opposition. and he knew not any object the Learned Gent, could have in view. that would not be fully embraced by the Committee he meant to move for, He therefore urged the Learned Gent, to accede to his proposition, instead of hay ing a number of Committees sitting at the same time, fur the consideration of the same subject. He made this motion, nut in opposition to the Learned Gentleman, but as the wisest and moat just course the (louse could adopt, for effecting this most de licate, difficult, and necessary object. 't he Noble Lord then moved— sleeted with the subject, must be examined, if jam. lice were dour to it. The I louse would, perliiii,s, go along with him in thinking, that the prerogaieve of mercy wits pruilemly retro tell to check the seer iity of the taws, owl that, on the whole, they were most mildly 111iniesiistered. It would be a matter el seri 0000 inquiry, whether, with respect to some t.' the punishments inflicted by the criminal code, the salutary terror atilt winch they were intended to impress the minds of offenders had not erased in operate.. It would be lot them to consider whether Botany Bay had not assumed a character more colo nial, than was consistent with its situation, as a spot, banishment to which was intended to he held out as 11 severe punishment, calculated to produce a saluting terror 1111 the minds of offenders ? hear.)—lt would be iiecessary for the House to decide, when it would he proper to re lieve that place from heing the retort of persons of depraved character 1 It would he prudent fur them to consider when it would be proper to allow that place to enjoy those high benefit* which every corm try iii the world aspired at, and which was pecu. Harty looked for in n country possessing so line a climate and so rich a Hear, hear.)—The humanity with which offenders were sent there—the great care that was taken of their health amid morals ....th e mildews* with which they were treirted—reue dered transportation to Botany Bay no punishment whatever. lurked many who were transported there received their sentence as a favour, and not as a punishment.—(/ - /tar, hear.)—And he would put it to the feelings of the House to consider, whether it was very wise, looking to all the temptations to which their populatimr was exposed, to suffer one part of the punishment attached to the commission of crime to be considered rather as a benefit than an evil ? If circuinstancem had so blunted the feelings of triennials ou this point, it would perhaps be nes emery to make some alteratioo in the law. Having stated the outline of this subject, he did not wish to enter into an argument on the state of the cri minal code. He thought he had shrivel enough to prove that Government had caused the law to be administered, not merely in justice, but in mercy. Believing that the Learned Gentleman (Sir J. Mackintosh) had, is common with himself, but 014 great object, that of doing to their country a most important duty, he deprecated the narrow view, which, as it appeared to him, the Learned Gentleman wished to take of the subject.— That view would, in his mind, have the effect of placing before the public an improper and highly coloured picture of the state of the law—a esu guivary description of their criminal code—merely because the Learned Gentleman found that to many of them the penalty of death was affixed. If that punishment were awarded against crimes that did not appear to the Learned Geutleman worthy of ' such severity, it would he found that they were not often visited with it. Ile knew it might be justly doubted whether it was wise to affix the punishment of death to offences, which. in the operation of the law, were not frequently visited with that degree of severity. This might form a further source of discussion. But there was soother point, of the most difficult, delicate, and anxious consideration, when they were about to deal with crime—namely, that offences might put on a totally different moral anti criminal character, from the manlier in which they were perpetrated—( Hear, hear, hear,)—froth the circumstances with which they were attended— ( Hear, hear,/ —from the violence or forbearance which marked their execution.—(Hear, hear.) — If, in looking to this part of the subject, they were to endeavour to graduate the scale of punishment, so as to meet every species of crime, under all the different circumstances of its perpetration, it would be a perfection, or rather an imperfection of legis lation, which would entirely abolish the exercise of mercy. If they were not prepared to graduate the criminal scale, from the worst features of offence, down to those of the lowest and mildest deaciiptiou, what a difficult and delicate task it was to say at whet point they would pitch the punishment. If they pitched it too low, they would do away the beneficial effect of example, which was of so much importance, at the same time that they created the strongest incentive not to add cruelty or violence to the original crime. If they plowed it too high, per haps the law would not he carried into effect, and an inducement was at the same time held out to the perpetration of violence. He believed that the tawnier in which highway-robbery was committed in this country, us compared with the cruelty which attended it in others, was to be traced to the merciful manner in which the laws were atimi 'littered here. Abroad, murder mind robbery were constant concomitants—here the eery reverse was the case, for the criminal knew he hail a considera ble chance of escaping death if he behaved with litimaility, but that his execution was inevitable if he were betrayed into cruelly or violence. If they were to graduate this scale of punishment, instead of leaving it to the mercy of the Crown, under the representation of the Judges, to pardon, or to lighten the severity of a sentence when circuits silences called for it, they would remove one of the greatest inducements amongst criminals, not to proceed with cruelty and violence. He would ignite address himself to the Learned Gentleman in the hope that he had no separate feeling' on this question, in the belief that he thought as lie (Lord Castlereagh) did, and that he had but ohe motive, namely, to look to the whole of tins tines lion, and to devise proper punishments for different species of triune. If that were his feeling, he would submit to him and to the House, that the object.could only be attained by taking a great and .comprehensive view of the subject—and, howewer they might split their Committee into sections, for the purpose of bringing the whole question into one common centre, they would find that ample.' would nut be tiff . ..cure. if the Committee were split into separate election', they would deprive themselves probably of the assistance .of those men, who would have K orea their minds and their attention to the whole of the sub ject, instead of contimug their investigation to one narrow branch of it. Therefore it was that he pressed ma the House the uecessity of adopting such a Committee as he wait about tocall fur. He Aid not seek, by the appointment of a Committee to accomplish any thing that sea lint perfectly kiwi. 431 e. If it were coccerved that the numbers of the Committee were too few fur so greeting olOct, he would willingly move to have them extended from time to time. But he hoped the House would not have different (tenuous poured OP st frpm venoms "That a Committee be appointed to inquire into the state and description of gaols and other places of cuufinruieut, and loin the best method of providing fur the reformation, as well as the safe cusiudy and punishment of offenders." Sir .1. MACKINTOSH said, lie rose, not because he wished to say slay thing on the present motion, but because lie might be considered as wanting► in courtesy to the Noble Lord, who had appealed per sonally to him, if he did not make one or two ob servation' on this subject. The Noble Lord, in the course of his speech, had said a great deal about the motion, which his Lordship supposed be (Sir J. hlackintosih) intended to make on the following night, but fie had offered very little in support of his own proposition. He would not, however, make any statement, or introduce any argument, con nected with his promised motion, until the proper time for discussion arrived. Unless lie could theu spew the necessity of inquiring into the state of a part of the Criminal Law, wholly dif ferent from any object of investigation, which the Committee moved for by the Noble Lord appear ed to have in view, the House would, of course, deal with his 'Ilona; as it would deserve, by rej.•c•t ing it. But lie confidealy trusted, that he would he able to spew them that there was strong ground for such an inquiry—and iu order to be perfectly understood, l►e would now state, that lie would to morrow move, " That a Select Committee be ap pointed to consider so much of the criminal law as relates to capital punishment for felonies."—{!/ear.) —That was the part of the cnininal law to which he meant to direct the attention of the House ii, the discussion of to-morrow evening. With re spect to the admonitions or exhortations of the Noble Lnrd, who had warned him against using any arts to inflame the passions of the multitude. he could assure him that such admonitions were perfectly unnecessary.—(Hew, hear.)—He should think it highly improper, if he possessed talent sufficient to arouse and talents the passions of men, to call forth those feelings on a great and serious public question, which could only be de. tided by calm awl temperate deliberation.—(!!ear, !tsar.) —He would avoid having recourse to soy such ;node, which he condenwed as heartily as the Noble Lord did.—(Hear, hear.)—Neither on this, pr on any other question, would he deviate froni course which marked the honour and reverence in which he held the laws of the countiy—a reverence which he most deeply felt—and which he conceived he would best whew by the motion l►e meant to bring before the House to-morrow.—(Hear, hear.) Mr. LAWSON said, the subject divided itself into three great brooches—punishment by death, by transportation, and by imprisonment. The question was, whether those three points could bet. ter be investigated I►y one, or by several Comcnit tees ? Notwithstauding the arguments of the Learned Gentleman opposite, he conceived those subjects were so intimately connected, that the in vestigation of one must ne,ceasarily embrace the in. mestigation of all. The questions were so spliced together, there was such a trio jowl(' in IMO counet tMn between them, that they could not be considered separately. They must be treated as one grand tots!, not as three distinct subjects— they must be looked on, not as individuals, but as con►lionent parts of the same body. The Learned Gentleman might have three separate Commit. tees, but the subject of their investigatiou would be the same—for each of them would have to inquire into the whole of the three subject. Thus they would have the urine labour over and over again. It evidently appeart al to lain,, that the formation of three Committers would be ni,proper—for, by adopting such a sjotem, they would only have the same Report three times over. In this distance the &Miami of labour would have an eflcct .different from what it usually had, since, instead of dimini►hing, it would increase trouble. The Hon. Gentleman then proceeded to deprecate the ilk,- politic humanity which, of late years, was so busy to revising our Criminal Code. Let them break off the point from the spear of justice, and see, whether in that niutilated state, it was so well ca pable of inspiring terror. He would venture to predict, that if the stews of the .Learned (reutle• man were carried into effect, the sentence from the Bench would ouly be considered as a legs! fictiosi si—mirrl, like other lictious, would be null and of no effect. Mr. BJINNKTT said, the paper which the Noble Lori) said would be {ail b t fur• the counnittre, • . • consisted, lie believes!, of two siivisima-trof. it It-trited (II the state or the pripients, and the niiii.ltes of pt mons etentaispod in them, the Uttitett Ktitgrlottl - sod next, :tit t h e I lite. at.tl rrgufslitui. c )))))) ecterl with their malingruirrit. then cespooder what the Committee bail to totpitro "inn. They had to exa►nine the state t.l the gaols of England, Ireland, stall S as ithuai - ►tst! what their accommodations were, il,►u(fi , lent Of 110 E—A IA to demi die their (anti., taint die 11110.1114 011 - providing Inc the 'souther of criminal., which were in their pow, r. They lirsidrb, after they had trisected the•, to Isiiik the 'treat question of local of is the Noble Lord load said nothing, hot winch f••tut ed 110 light part of the ►u'iiect.-(l!tns.)-Jhev were also imperatively capes! Nis t, examine the fund► appropriated to the ►upport of the gaol' , tit Scodatl..-for lie had !peen itilsomed, and Indeed when he visited the gaol. of that euuuiry Ise fool reas son to know, that their Lad state was OAK ink t o th e want of soffit:lent fund•. A or! again,thr:, vitalist those to look to the Elate of the Irish gaols, where beady the same difficulty exi•trd. They vv , poid next 14-, called on to examine the reghlaitou., which were comprked in a great number of statute., many of them hardly liionap. It took him and a former (.; 1111 l nutter an entire Ses►ion to teileitre into Ills ►tale of two or thiee gaols. Al a hat time then would the labours of this Committee cease I Or did the Noble Lord Meats to cut nut these int 'let is of investigation I If he did, his plan w..u:sl ohly be a voyage ol• discovery. amidst a v.iriety of diffi culties, from which no benefit would iesult. If, besides those points he had meittinned, tlie Com mittee proceeded to inquire into the criminal laps. instead of one Selsion, it would take an entire Septennial Parliament to filtivls Iheir labour's. The state of the gaols. the 'situation of Bay, the whole system of the ti anspoi tannin haws, demanded notice. Ili. I.cartied Friend I(Sir J. Nlachilitosli) had given mottle tor a motto's relative to the laws inflicting the in-natty or death. lie (Mr. B.) bi Id propot.ethae, the WlVae the oratomortatisio laws sliculer belstuividered. Was the Noble Lord aware, wlo•u lie teopo.erl his innt•tnt, that there were no lea.. him 7:3's stattiteti of Annum...l law ?-(lltur, hear.) -As this was the Isct, lee could see nu end to the labour, of the Committee. Four or five gehtkuscui silting in one torrivr of a room, and six or veven 111 tsll4lllor, particular parts of tint sattp... eutyect, were not likely to come tither to a speed) or a tnirect ileci,ion. Such a proceeding was COl'Miry to the rules of the House, as vvel :.$ iitube of cornrow) sense. Ile under.tuotl the perbou vent out by Government, was authoribed to itiquire, whether a new Botany lily might not be estsbissli7 ed elsewhere, as the rtate of coloisizstitits ise hew South Wales rendered bmitAntieut there ou potash mem whatoer. If it were the intention of Gorers,.. men to alter the p}stem, it would be right fur the !louse to comidter well the expense. Perli.ips those unfortunate persons might be krnt to placer tier rer home, instead of toeing shipped to the other side of the globe. 1-le might have iiii-untlerrootid the Noble Lord on this part of the sulijecr, but certainly Ise was not miritilten with re•spect to what he Inns heard elsewhere, *loch wag, OA the person sent nut to Botany Bay was to inquire whether IFOIEr usher place might not be found to which convicts he transported. • Lord CAPTLEREAGII, itl explanation, mid, It was at present a matter of deliberailon, whether' borne new regulation should not hr rariii.tl into rfrret with respect to the Colony of Botany t any doubted whether that 111 fee had not nut-Crown the propriety of transporting people thither— no d it W 3.4 debated, whether some 'flan 'oft be Ifillii.l for relirviug the Cult fy from receivioy convicts. 1t was conternplated to send them to a place nearer home, which could he done at ahe eximme. Mr. W. WYNN felt as strongly as the film. Gen tleman (Mr. licit ett) that this inquiry could not be got through in any reasoolible time. Out lie had a %till stronger objection to it, nu the sore of justice. He objected to the appointment o f a Com mittee to whom was referred 00 vet y lacgr u scope of inquiry. This objection uppliefl 0;111 tooth greater force whim the object* of uttiuity were not specified, when no special tlirectom was giveif slit the subject. He thooglit it was one of the worst practices of modal. day a, to refer to the Cumhitht. Liall of Committers that which ought to be per fisrmed by the House itsrlf.l—(tiece, hear.) —Ti,e Noble Lord admitted it 'night be expedient, that the ddleuent branclie* of it.tlutry should b e gifi r ig on simultaneously—that the C iiiii muter should partite itself Milo different subdi‘isions, collect all the information on various —anti bring it into one focus. Ile agreed in tile prol.riety of this course, but he would have 11. e House to appoint those different Sub•Committie.. it wits their fluty. —(Near, hear.) —Nothing, he conceived, offs at tended with worse effects, than appointing Com mitters to examine into very extrusive subjrcis. They might propose regulations tfilh telef trice- to them, but they always left enough behind, to fir' in all excuse to the House fur appointing them St spiels after Session. While they continued to existei.ce, they prevented individual, ,probers from proitiiiiii. l 4 minims; of the subj. eta they were appoint( to inquire into. If a Nltniber did intrinime a motion touching ou the subjects of their it.- , (limy, he wag immediately called to accoulit If t " interfering with the labiates of the Co 000000 In his opinion. this question ought to lie discussed in a Committee of the thole Howse, since thew was not a single Member ,whose experiein e or lA,- servation witwld out doable hots to form an opitilnit on it. Ile conceived it was ilium itupossible ft.!. °lie Committee, tyro in the course of au entire Parliament, to finish the liminess about to he re ferred to that fur whir* the Noble Lord had moved. —(Hear.)—He doubted very much whethe r tire inol 00000 of which his Learned Potent, hail g ot en 11111 lice fur tomorrow, was a correct tote. He thought even the subject of the laws inflicting the prosier of death, ought to be considered LI a Committee of the whole Howie. it td.n was, matter of o pinion, on which every Mwasber .f that House load wone degree of experience. Tins Committee mould be called an to inquire into the whole statutes at large. The subject was not ex prevalyreterred to 'bens, nor, ceom the words of the motion they woofs! Musca t cainelude, that their intitivrydara: tome-JO:Hs that far. Maify subjects, lie b. 1 ve , would! Arr flume Men rr,,i , it Attic, rt.st icuet f•.+4 'Prove bed becu aware of their g . 1.,