The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser. — London, England, 1809-06-02 00:00:00

•• 4.".41 - -1 th? aalAtld %belga be Aefrar-41 trJl6l the Virtu& il l * 'night be made from the mitieritrt. Mr. SPSNCRI tir riciwt.r.e to the ad- mission of Welsh J tidge* sato Parliament. fie on. elsaatood that there were How above use I :bed appeals to the Willie of I.orsl• fro so that trla,•ter ; this was a d e lay of justice almost aineuntiog to the denial of it. Mr. ‘V reel; considersol it a siihject or „oreat dif ficulty. With respect to tee Weis!, Judges liar tug seats in Parliament. IL. tiPoght, that if rosy owasure wits to lie a dopt e d for its prevention, it sh:tuld have only a prospective vie", •and slot affect • ouch es tiara at present la Ole Sitaatiall. He was of opinion, that a eld - lie should be inserted, pro , I:eng that no Welah Jsul4e sliouCl possess any other office than that of King's Cutussel. !dr. Wur•rattl , to slid not are what solid reason cosibl be givers , ::ty justice silioal.l not be dietribut ! in the distant counties twice a-year, as well as , • steiers of equal slistasics. If there war an jostles 1- • •acy of salary, he was willing that it should he ,•• •I ! sin. There was allot,lCf circumstance to ~ :1; •1 he wished to allude,. and that was, the .:.:6..1011 of Welsh Judgel to the office of ei s:itntor-Ornersil to the Coomn. He wished to lie it a mason why the same principle, adopted i s r.sigl sod—that of the iml•pentlesicy of judges —.could not be exvottieci to •Wales ? With regard to sinecure 'daces, though all aucient (maga,. were difficult to he removed, yet it was necessary, at some time or other, to remove many. tle Was 1111%011114 to create lust delay which might affect the iiiilortant business to co-ne forward that night, bat felt it unavoidable to state what he had already aloise. Mr. PECCSVSL dial not think that the proper time to go 'Lao many of the Objects proposed.— With respect to the ens:initials of Welsh Judges from leirlisonent. he did ant think it would be adopted at the r eese a t mwatausl, without being sup- p s cil to reflect upon an individual; that measure, 1 t:4erefiore. aught not to have been isstroduciel. 1 -erti H. Pere said, that the *hole of the sine- , core pl a c:ss feel ..ider the soirit of the Resolutions introduced by his Right Honourable Prie.sd. He was eirtronielv surprised that auy regniation into which ,::.es, might eater. should he supposed to be dircctld. igasoat the character of any individual. ttr. VAISSONIBY was sorry that any mention slisetid l-sve beeps noels- respecting sinecure offices in r0.,-•r , of justice, becanse he was desirous thit the moos., eefore thesis alosold pass without any interior \ • 7:* • of an objcctionable nature. ' Aft. , . . f•e words from Mr. Witseneoece. Lo-d !‘ltt tem and Sir VICIRT GIBS.. the 0.1- jtitia; 1110::11.1 was agreed to, and the Report or , - •alerell to lee re.. iv-d tromorrow. SILL RC' r.c.rma SEATS IN PARLIAMENT. The ~ e t NIES. having quitted the Chair, rose to deliver his sentiments upon the Bill. He said that III: was unwilling at all lane* to trespass upon the time of the Committee ; feelm4 allot the iinteeoi lobe y. from the notate of his ofli ne of defending his arguments at any ssibeecrielit siege of the discus. sion, he would nut offer himself to their attention upon the present question, if it slid not appear to Nisi to be one of 3 most IT;esSIRtIt iiirs , r,l4loll. , The question was, weedier "wets its that House should be saleslthe hereafter ? .1, questimh frees the eery sound lif which Only ancestor's womb! certainly hare shrunk. They had now come to that 'base, GOs which retreat was impossi ble ; and. miles, they proceeded to brood and stigmatise the practice by a proliihitory law, they might expect to see seats, in is short while, perhaps in the anon pertol of the present Session, net up to anction. and deposed of. That property had a great inesiesice its oioisstai && i&& g viva luster and sta bility in a state. that it ought to have an influence in a House or Comma" be was ready to admit ; but, then, that the pootetasni of ,property should lay aside their fair preference, and go to an open shameless market, that they ieionld sell their de pendenta, and even their fricisds, to strangers—this lie coririslered not merely as a political evil. hut as one tendirs to debase and to degrade the higher ranks of life—to emitasniossta the general characttr of Parliament, and foriiish weapons to the advo cates of Parliamentary Reform, who. though he believed Clem to be honest is their intentions, were not. he feared, pursuing that course which was most besieficial to the station. Is the ane cleat laisgsiage of our statutes and constitution, elections were declared to Ise free. Many bad linos visited with pnisishment for the violation of that freedom. *Lookiiix to their procesolinga and joristlictioisa, they wools' find such shows in quire-I into mid puuisfied. The cases of Sir Ed ward Seymour and Lord North, were in point; it was t 'se general language of all their prnceedings, up to the. peesseilt time, time it ass eridtie" l 'led punishable to subvert that freedom. In the like nianacr, it appeared Coat it was equally an offence at common law, in the Courts below, and tlist it was a principle recogosizod there, that elections procur ed by such influence, should he held void. There were instances in which a previous contract was made between the candidates, and though us s electors were privy to it, yet, as an agreement was entered into, the election went for nothing. They should do what their ancestors had done before them. When the common law was found to he insufficient, they should apply prohibitory statutes. If they applied themselves with sincerity to the task, they might depend upon istirceeding. tie could not approve ofthat part of the Hou. Gen tkinan's Bill, which went to refer to the jurisdic tion of other Courts. what should lie decided there only. With regard to the oath, he was inclined to quarrel 'lather alimit the form, than sissy thing else. He agreed with Sir William Blackstone, that an oath administered to the elected would be- far wore efficacious than one administered to electors. He agreed, that the person found guilty of giving a bribe 'should be rendered incapable of a seat ; also that the person also received it shoold lie subject, together wsth th e giver, to a 1....31ty ; thot they should lie deemed guilty of II misdemeanour. II. 1 ;ton the whole, he was asvairma that the priociole of the Bill should he eistahliahed; it was a torasoire inch-- penseibly nseeraory to the honour of the floosie anal of the roontry. Mr. IllitletY 41. thringht, that if the !loose was of opinion 'hat the low should now be ,o, it was scarcely iscressury to niqiiire what it was he fre.e. Th e . D e c i el , of ~,,le alluded to shsitilil be prevented; hut in order to prevent it, it was net 11 1 1/14 1 pRiimpumporm - 1 only flimsiest) , to nita:sh the who h:ol the diurnal of the whole place, hut also he who had a 'Maur isiterest, awl h.: was Idtewisie of mon:on, that a reaaril slinilld be ; given to the hi. 1 1 .111 ,- r. u l taii the same t:t.it of Imilsery. To Inel.c it triable in tie! Courts of hew would give an unceriaiii tenure to serum') Wet fiuumei which lie would lie sorry to see established. It would place it at the discretion of the Courts, whether the twat should be retained or forfeited. It wad sieves amary to smasider the nature of the Offeuee; it was our in whieli two persons, or iierliiipe three, were, at most, cOneer:1•11: the person disappointed in the election would sheep' be willing to dispute the means of his electnin who had succeeded. There was *outlier loancli of the offence . to which he would allude—that of procuring offices for those who voted. lie wet persuaded, that the snore they considered, the Fiore they would see how impossible it was to snake provisions against such so offence, without placing honest and fair transactions in consio lens ble daft ger. Offices must exist; the nomination to those offices moot exist roinewhere ; and wherever that was, there would-he influence ;it was impossible to present it, and dangerons to piusisto it. There wad our great difficulty attached to the Bill, it mi 4 ht to to prevent the sale of proimty, to prevent the defraying of election expeoses, aid even the pay ing of an agent. With respect to the oath, the difficulty of deacriliing the liaenee pe,,Aeateit x great object to it ; fie could not better illus trate tint than by the Treating Act, within whose compass there was so Vitreole a difficulty to bring the offence ; if the offence iias not. more clearly defined, punishment should not be a timber'. lie concluded with moving ua amend ment, attsching the hoe of sriell. to :my person convicted of such traffic as the ail went to prevent ; and providing that the Act Joon Id not extend to the g,ving or money for lands upon a Irma fide situ, nor the payinent of any money JeKatly incurrLd at election-. Nlr. Cuawew said, that ulcer tlie union:ire and eloquent speech with which the 11 , a. Opened, nu one could !ie of opinion that the Bill was ;;;;;; eces wiry ; however inadequate he 4: :eiVetl a, Of modi fied by the Right Honourable Gentleman, he was still willing to receive any thing. Though it fell short of what he .rirhed, he was willing, et so late a period of the `Section, to accept it.— ii , tut coatend for the wordint, of the oath, out ne wishi sunNtance Os It to he adopted. It would, in in. toe ed at proleettoo. Ile had HO hesitation Lt leaving ttle qu-stioa to the Committer. Posit-twee raid, that tee- Ai at to the pro position of the Right lion. oppocie. (Mr. Perceval,) whoever 'rued Or the Minis ter of file day, wag have t sok monopoly of scats in Parliament. TM. h.. never approve of, nor could he see any reason why the penalty ought not to be extended throughout the abate of the Parliament ; for it would be lint a slight pu nishment to title a mum for one mtfeilee, and leave hint to sit in the same Parliament aftersrards...— The objection stated to the oath was upon the ground that it could not be clearly understoeml, and that an individual might find scruples of coast:truce nn taking it ; he should itzree with the Right Houourable Gentleman, that an Act of Parliutnetit might admit of various con structions; but betine this oath should be put, it ought to be clear to what fact he is to swear; or it ought to be sliewn, that no offence could he com mitted at common law upon the subject. House were therefore binind to frame the oath, so as to make it perfectly plain awl initellogiiile to every one. The umendurent licensed to amount to an entire new Bill ; and in order to ascertain which clause was preferable, lie thought that both of them should be printed, end allowed to stand side by aide of each other, And be reconsidered together. He felt that the character of the House of Commoiss was more ut stake upon this question than any other, for they had been told that these things had always prevudell ; but surely that could be no cause for 'their future con:itmance. In his opinion nothing could shake so much the conti s dente of the public against the House of Com mons, u the supposition that matters of 'inch trust were to be made matters of bargain. if they really intended to do good, they ought to strike the Treasury out of the market ns well as individuals, by a dense so clear and comprehensive, that every one might safely swear he had not taken any bribe. Sir Joan ANSTROTIOR congratulated the House in having the Bill so far admitted, as to be ac knowledged that it was necessary. lit could not agree with the clause that had been proposed in place of the original one, its he eulogist the hitter was the better of the two. Without such a clause, great opportunities would undoubtedly be given dirr evasion ; and therefore it was necessary to insert in it every species of contract, tither expressed nr implied, or any reward whatever, either direct or indirect. It shoerld extend not only to the voter, but also to.the person giving or promising any re ward to him. Mr. Master aoaed with what had been stated by the last speaker. The oath was oae which was not so likely to be taken by the lower as by the higher toilers of society, and therefore the sameitn portanc.e was to be attached to it. Great seen nty might be obtained to the country towards pu rity of election, if no man were to be allowed to take his seat without swearing, in the face of the country, that, bona frie, he Ind not procured his election by any cutrupt practices what eve r. If the difficuhy started by the Chancellor of the Escheyier were to hold good—as to the im possibility Fri prattling against any office heaig given, in some way or other—the whole Bill would he worse than negetoory, as the effect of it would be to throw all the boroughs into the hands of those who were willing to bestow them upon their favonntes. He sutv no difficulty that might not be clearly done away by the verdict of a jury.— Without that guard were to be inserted, he would rather Unpin's. his Hair, Friend to withdraw his Bill altogether, as it was roily pretentlioig to treat the public with something to protect the pointy of Election, although it only placed all coinpetitioti in the halide of the Treasury. Ile could not see that the learnt.; these diffieullies to the de vi-ion of a Court of Law, was at all deporting from their own oriv.leges, new more than wes done iu regard to the act iur exciudiu s contmeteri from tdat Morse; in ~.~fer-~ - -r-- - tvh:ch caw, a Court tit Law dart minid the tetra amount of the penalties, foe every time each so indtridual Mightliiiirt voted. lie wouid much ra ther have three difficulties decided by a Court of Law, than by a COMMitterof th:lt Mr. Roc - % argued favoirr of the amended clans, es he OM , l ily dep existed the oath eruposed by the Hill. If earrupt practices were arrioly aired, much of the difficulty would be dune away; but this, he thought, was itiriesiaible. Mr. W. Wes s thought that, under the exist ing circuoisteeces to much Parliament stood, if they did not weird the provisions of this Bill to bargaining or exchanging offices for seats in Parties merit, it would be more injurious than beneficial. If the Bill had riot a clause in it to prevent that traffic, every inali would feel himself mere autho rised than before to continue it. %Ve had long known the evil that existed as to bribery by money, and we had lately seen an instance, where a Minister of the Crown had bartered n seat to Parliament for an Wier ;ea offence which theflouse hail evinced itself unwilling to justify, but at the rime time unwilling to pentetr. Was any further evidence necessary o f the existing evils Surely not; brit if they tressed such a Bill, it would wily tend to justify theist. The difficulty as to ewer- Lenin what was to be deemed corrupt practices, in rier,ard to bribery, by granting offices, could as well be settled by a jury, is airy other species of bribery and cor•uption. Mr. B. Bartle are said, he would support the amendment, although he thous/hi it did not go far enough. Mr. fIAWANI BIOVEPIR said, he was of opinion the oath went t r 'cclude all codscientinits persons from a seat in that House ; under which considera 'loll he disapproved of the Bill altogether. The SPEAKER said, he was highly honoured by his being asked to set birth an oath wheal would meet the approbation of both sides ofthe tiouse;but from his relative situetiun it was imeossilile he could give it that atteation which it &eared ; he therefore most respectfully declined it. He thought it his duty to state, that there were two methods for the Committee to proceed; our, the customary mode, that the Bill should be printed as amended— the other, that the hill should be printed with the amendments. The latter would give the House an opportunity of considering them, and forming one that would meet with the gerseral coucurrence of the House. Mr. PRIMEVAL rose, and went over the same ground that lie did in his limner apeerh, and said, NII honest min, hr mast allow, that every Mi nister knew when a Parliament was goiug to be dissolved, and that he would grant effizes to those .vhoin he knew would support Men on that occasion. There wire several kinds of acts olrfrierelship that passed between the elector and the elected, which would prevent the elected flora takiag the oath, on which account he brought forward his arnendmerit. Mr. hattsomne rose, merely•to suggest the pro priety of avoiding further discussion at that hour ; and that Gentlemen. who had amendments to pro pose, should ofho them, that they might, toge ther with throw elready suggested, be printed; when they would come altogether before the (louse, and could their be triter taken into considenitiou• Colonel Ilurrasi sitcom oral, that the argumeuhu in eloquently mid fareibly nr.tvd by the spei 4 l, had recorealed bins to the Bill upon many savor tent points. Mr. W. Smelt expressed himself at considerable length ; the lateness of the hour prevents its grime into a detail; lie was an enemy to having recourse to oaths uvon all occasions; he approved of the oath I.z.oposed in the present instance, but would nut have it subject them to the penalties of perjury. No disgrace attached to.persons corniest into Par liament through bribery, nor would an Act of Parliament make rtsgreee attach ; but a false oath was always disgraceful; therefore an honourable oath, without the proposed penalties. was wrist he thought would he beneficial. Notwithstandtug the advice of the Hon. Gentlemen (Mr. Poiesouby). be thought proper to spea► ou the proposed mea , sure. The Hon. Member then commented on the interference of firers in elections, although con trary to a standing order of that House ; indeed it was a notorious fact, that Inoue Peens owed their elevation to such exertions. and they never fail ed to exert themselves to the istcamt. His grand objection to the present measure was, that al though it was intended to prevent the sale of seats, it del not go to prevent the Members them selves being sold ; there was no oath against it ; and, thoueli he considered the bill illusory, still the Hon. Gentleman deserved thanks for bringing it in, as It would load to other *looms of entree lion. Mr. Pitt, in his plan of reform, began at the right end ; he would not take away the power of purchasing seats, hut take away the Members who had purchased them. Even though the present Bill should net go to the other House, he still thought the advantages would be greater to the public than commonly fall to the lot of one man to obtain ; and concluded by congratulating his lion. Friend on having introduced it. Mr. HAWKINS BROWTIR explained. Mr. DENIS BR•JWNE expressed his intention of taking the sense of the Committee, to expunge the oath. Mr. CURVIER said, it was understood that it was not to lie persisted in. Mr. Ttrawav hoped the Hon. Member would net press for • division at that late hour. Mr. Dents Baowmc withdrew his oppoeition. Mr. LOCKHART thong ht the Bill fell very short of what the defective state of the representation reqiiiresi. As the oath was framed, ans honest man would take it, who hail accepted • Single shilling. The leer ought to be settled on the point; and he therefore gave notice of hi •intentian to propose a clause to allow u etipulated sum to each elector, for every mile he CROW to vote ; he did tint expect to carry such a point ; butt the ti irr pemosing it would have the effect of extending the law upon the subject. A converkatinn then took place acres the table, between Mr. Pere: end, Mr. Cunven, the Speaker, Col. Barry, and %lr. C. %V. Wynne, upon the mode of printing the bill; when the House resumued, the Report was lirwight up, and the Itill ordered to be printed, and taken iuto farther consideration on Tuewliy next. Mr. lien:n[3l3x brought in the Vote of credit sill, Atidl was read a lest tiers. tad ordered for a second reading. The Windsor Forest Sale Bill *se read a first time, •nd ordeord to be read a Gar.oad time ins • Tuesday oral, and to be ;Hinted. The emoutissinorrs of Accounts Bill ass read a third tie:lean:l passed. Mr. Wfteerom brought up the ]♦apart •f the Irish Post Roads Mil, and the Report of the Agents' General Bill, which were *err:ally agrred to, and the Bills orderid to be read a third time this day. The whet Orders of the Day were then d , 4l)rwed of, and at MIZE CiCLuCIL thus toortaug the House wiinnritod i kORAIGA % TLI.LIGENCA. .... EIGHTH BULLETIN OP THE MUNCH ARMY. This Bulletin is dated Vienna, May 16.—1 t states us sulutance, that the inhabitants of Vienne. 'greatly praise the conduct of the Archduke. who ',fused to support the Government in the re volutionary measnres ordered II the Ern erne Francis, and that the Archduke Nlatimilean was therefore Ali:minted to command in his stead.— This young Prance, who swore to bery himself under the ruins of Viemsa, no winner leant that the French had crossed the Danube to cot off his retreat, than he surrendered the town, without ..:view troneferrit.g the command to any other person. The itii.forturnes which have thus hefallen the House of Lorraine were foresees by all totelfigent men. of whatever principles—Maar...l4li, the nines de Ligue, Ohl Count Wallis, the dr.. treed Count Cobenteel (who was the chief promoter of the war in 1804), endeavoured to prevent the present war ; but the pride of the Em;%eror Francis, the hatred of the Archduke Charles against Rits,ia, the je a s lousy he felt on seeing Russia and Emote trictly united, the English gold which purchased • ve Mi. nister Stadion, the levity of the women, the hypo. crisy and false reports of hletternich, all coutrilmted to bring about this senseless and treacherous war. The Emperor has res sewed the heavy cavalry of General Nansouty, 5000 strong, and has given to the bravest Wirer of each regiment the title of Baron, and to the bravest Cnirasaier a decoration of the Le4ion of Honour, with 1200 franks. We found at Vienna 500 pieces of cannon, a great number of carriages, and IlDabtlise (pante.. tics of halls, &c. The Austrian Monarchy issued snore than 300 millions of paper to support the preps, this war, and the number of hills 1.% t...r..4:41..is amounts to more than 115a0 in During the bombardment of Vienna, noly shoot ten Invoice were destroyed, and the peo;.l. reitiwk, that this misfortune fell upon tie. most trainers promoters of the war. The few days' rest . h the army has had, has berm of. great.adensistagees...- - - Fhe weather is fine, and we have *rarer any sick. The wine distributed to the troops is in abuudance, a r excellent quality. . .. PARIS, MAY es. We lea. from Spain that General Sebastia , occupies the province of La Mancha. The Deka, of &Mune is at Merida. The official accounts from Valladolid of the 121111: inst. contain an account of the dispositions of . th* t Duke of Ek!iirfren, who occupiei General Kel!eraiun has greatly reinforced at Lugo, with the Duke of Treviso and Get. [Lin net. Several columns inu-t by this time hate penetrated into the Asturias, and these measures will complete the deliverance of the whole of the Northern part of Spain. The German papers contain the Russiin dec:a ration against Austria. It begins by stating, that peace betweren France and Austria is entirely at an end—that all the " means used to induce Austria to discontinue her preparations, were fruitless—that she would not aceept the guarantee of Russia for the integrity of the Austrian States—that she has developed am bitious designs, and that war has broken out by the invasion of foreign States, even before a &- aeration of war in the accustomed manner. Iu consequence, the Russian Minister hiss been ordered to quit Vienna, and all relations been put an end to between the two Courts. PASSAU, MAY 18. Part of the Austrian army, under General ler, passed the Danube on the 9th, and has joined the Archduke Charles, who was advancing frcru Mateo:ma to support the Capital. The - French troops have already extended themselves towards Moravia : the Austrians, in Magary, are at Rein. burg, near Presburg, mud the French at R.-gels brun.—Davoust is marching towsnls Budweis. 1 Yesterday, the anniversary marling of the elm rity children belonging to the different 'chiefs in . . the utetropolis,' took place at St. Paul's lathe- !--- dral ; there were assembled upon the occabion ' :- - about 14,000 children ; althorgh ten from each ' school were kept at home en account of a num- her of children having fainted last year ; but, notwithstanding this regulation, de or seven girls fainted yesterday, owing to the heat attt the rest Itngth of time they were sit. Their chaneting the Repo/null its . Service had a very grand effect. The ". read by the Rev. Mr. H•res, and the sermon was ... preached by the Rev. Ole aLss D'Avosse. The ~ sesembly was honoured with the presence of Offs Duke of CAMIIILIDOE, the LoaD MAYOR, Lou MAvoaass, several Aldermtu. the Sheriffs, and many personages of distinction ; sind there we;s 'opposed to be present about 16,000 persons.