The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser. — London, England, 1805-05-01 00:00:00

credit on considio it as lion. Gen tile, been • greatest. aside after mijoricy , he retro Aquiry, and pure Noble with his wore very we Came nominat however be greatly Inlay. When icated, and moment ; but I own Jury ; and ' ins," it looks 'ivides his vo himself, as to situation, upon . farcical He tells us, that nothing 'tithe Tenth Report has any ten demos to impeach his charader, though to every other human being it must be evident, I.' , at he is di reOly involved by that Report ; first, in the secret and confidential transattions of Government. which Viscount Melville pleaded ineectoefor his misapplica tion of the public money ; secondly, in the gaiesse which he gave to Viscount Melville ; on the arrears due by Mi. Jellicoe ; and, idly, in the knowledge he must all cling have bad of those different trans editors. thoogh his name was not expressly men tioned by Viserunt .Melville, %ben he refused to explain the natter.- of the secret and confidential bu siness of Government. Under these cis cuinstances, any man must see how necessary it ought to be for pim to clear htroself somewhere, aid answer can didly, whether or not any application had been made to him in the progress of all these illegal trane adions ? Ido not question that it has Leen usual under other Administrations, to circulate soch Treasury Lists, but I have to complain of it pe culiarly under the present circumstances. In the list of this Committee, I find the names of some. who, to excuse themselves from Eleition and other Committees, have been in the habit of smearing at the table of this House, that their attendance upon such committees would be productive of serious inconveniences, and inconsistent with the discharge of their public duties. In this number I put Lord Castlereagh foremost, and after him the Master of the Rolls, and Sir Wm. Scott, the Chief Judge of the Admiralty, who are disqualified upon oath from sitting in committees ! (ii teal cr, of hear Afar ! from Me Treausry sale ft - Me &Rise ) I again repeat that they have sworn themselves to be disonalified from sitting on elation petitions, many of which are determined in a day; and none of which, except a few, such as the Middlesex committee, occupy so much time as will in all probability be required for the present enquiry. One Right Honourable Gent. Sir William Scott, even gave it last session as a sea son for not bringing its a bill, that he could not spare sufficient time from his other public avoca tions. In such a case as this the general sentiment must undoubtedly be, that all the members of the Committee should be efficient and attending mem bers. Ihe Right Ilenouroble Gentleman would, no doubt, v ish that some of his particular friends and associates should attend very punctually ; but he wished also, that their report should have the sanction of other highly respedable names of per sons who could not be expected to attend. Is it not a so one ground of suspicion, that in the form ation of this Committee the Right Honourable Gentleman takes care to have them all of his own nomination! (a ay of no! no ! ) Well the n, surely I may call it of his own recommendation--(Nu! No! ) Is it denied then. and are they afraid to go to the proof ? If they pet mit me to do so, I en• gage to prove it by even the testimony of th.•se who are crying no at the present moment. The Right lion. Gent. has thought proper to screen Vis count Meleiiie fioni this committee, and put loin in the back ground, while be himself stands forward in his place ; but he does it after the manner of people playing at cards, and choosing their own trumps, so that, in this nay, there is no possibility of loss. He looks round him to setoff his colleagues, and the most intimate of his several conneCtions ; but when a charge of such a name is made against a man higher in office, and that prefers his friends to his adversaries, as judges, he certainly takes the safest, though not the fairest method. A man of high honour and feelings, when accused in this manner, one should think, would peculiarly avoid the selec tion of his poiiticai fr irmds, associates, and, perhaps, dependents; and, on this ground, I consider Lord Castlereagh as particularly objeetionable, from his intimacy with that Right Hon. Gent. for such a se ries of years ; from his being a member of the Ca binet, and holding a place at the will of the Crown; Lord Dunlo is ohjeCtionable for the same reason, of Ills being a Fineman. The Master of the Rolls was also an Officer of the Crown, though in a situ mien of greater independence. Lord Castlereagh in paricular seems to have obtained for himself a per. po ual place. When the Right Hon. Gent. resign 1.,s office on the ground that he was not able to carry a Measllre which he thought essential to the interests of the country, the Noble Lord resigned along with him ; but soon disliking a state of inacti e la• joined the Administration, which declared i. t t adverse to the principles on which he before resigned, sn that when Mr. Pitt returned to office, he found him there still, and from that time retained him. 'the Noble Lord is not to be shaken by any tempest or storm ; nothing less than an earthquake can root him from his firm station. Either here or it: Ireland he is equally immoveable fromofEce. Ido not • *cense the Noble Lord of not aaing upon the princi ples be professes ; bat I contend that he is the most unfit person in the world to investigate the crnidua of man who has ever 'hewn himself to be his fiat feiend, whether in or out of Administration. Friend ship I admic to be the best bond' of union between mean and man ; but nothing can be more disqualify• ine fir a Judge. There is also another reason which hats( disqualify the Noble Lord for such an office. Tie report charges the application t . Naval money 4 . In purposes not Naval ; and as the Noble Lord has himself been charged with an improper use of the public niusey in Irelaud, he cannot be expeaed to _ . P • .ik r‘ l , . .• I . , oikk ajopted on thlts ri )efiefts great et It •r-iself . itile i. 01 `,eit- !land, consid tillily discredit.'. . •11. The Right tic tleman has, foi .I .le ' ttr.t pi-A t of his lii the political associate, _Auld in habits of the intimacy with Lord iTiscount Melville ; as the guilt of the lair was declared by the ........a this House, wih yon, Sir, at its head, It:rely steps forwakil, and boldly braves emit •still maintains, Lat. the hands of that punt roan o i l are clean. This condo& together challenging en iry into his own conditd, vi mu 7li the air magnanimity ; h it , when to ballot for a nmmittee , and he ttiiists on ing them him lf, he may be assured, that. he may succeid here, his conduct will hi discreditable, in the opinion of die country lie boldly tell us, . 1 Yeu say I am implico lam ready t go to trial, at any women must have th appointment of my own di Isti for that pu -, shall circulate my lists," like a kind sham fight, where he di vid lunteers in o bodies, and maucettvres hi Major, at die bead of rime of them. The upon the whole, is truly ludicrous and tar v feel as the public mould do upon such an accusation . I do oRt say this lightig il ys heard qt-Right Hon. I.; s Gentlepion now near hi W Mr. pee) get up' in his OaCe, and acteseOthe le dof net pply ing- d . public money ial land for the rose of cor ß.pting the Irish Parliament to acgtlette in the proposed Union. I can not susped that the . Right - ltsll. Gentle Mai ' would hive made this chat ge without being tihle to prove it ; and if the, Noble Lord had wished to deny it, let Mr. Foster be examined. The Noble Lord, however, I fancy, will not urge such an investigation ; for when the same charge was repeated here last niglit o he thoug ht proper to sit mute. One great disadva nta ge to the Right Hon. Gentleman is, that if the Report Oahe Committee should acquit him in the most honour able manner, when he selected such judges, the people would not believe it to be accurate or honest. I think, Sir, I have now said enough to slew the impropriety of this Committee being norninotod by the Right Hon. Gent. lam aware that the mason I have to make is an extraordinary otieo"not coon its i 1 nature, but on account of its not being precedented. Two hundred and twenty-one votes were the greatest 1 number for any one Member, and that montier was 1 I given for my name. I certainly felt myself quolificd for the Juts when I inserted my name in the Bill g von in by tnyself ; and yet I must request of the House to rt vise their judgment, and consider whether I i am to be looked upon most as a persecutor or a pro: secutor. I have now no wish to be on that jory,( l with all its cramping limitations, and the omisssollo I of some, and alteration of other words which I lin- , troduced into my motion. But after all, if it be thought proper that my name should renoZn, it will never he a disagreeable task to me to employ my best endeavours for bringing delinquency to punish ment I was left in a minority last night, but I have the satisfaction of thinking, that if our minority has even been less than 50, the great majority of the people of Lngland, Ireland, and Scotland, would certainly be on our side. Good God ! Sir, is there such a dearth of men of talents, integrity, and in dependence amongst us, that we cannot form a Committee to enquire into the misapplication of the public money, without having recourse to place men ? Is the respedohle class of Country Gentlemen extinguished ? If not, then, I put it to the shame of the Right Hon. Gentleman and his supporters, to cast such a slur on this House, for the purpose of 1 screening delinquencies, instead of leaving the Corn- mittee to be chosen by the House at large. Instead of the Master of the Rolls and other places/len, may i not others be found, inferior perhaps in le doling and talents, But equally competent for this enquiry ? and ! the more eligible, as the people would have faith in them. I shall, in the first instance, move to strike out the name of Lord Castlereagh, and substitute for it that of an Hon. Gentleman, who, though orce offing together, has long ceased to be my po- Itt!cal friend—l mean Mr. Baker, Me Member for the county of Hertford, whose late elelion I ac tively opposed. but in whose talents, integrity, aid independence, I have every reliance." t t The MASTER of the ROLLS said, that he did not consider this in the same light as an Eleltion Committee, whose proceedings would be stopped by the absence of any Membso. lie never repre sented his time to be so occupied, as that lie could not occasionally spare a Jae for the execution of his Parliamentary duties. He had frequently :so attend ed. He did not object to serve on the Civil List Committee ; and was last year upon that for enquir ing into the growth of Scotch bailey. He attended it occasionaliy ; and, though some of the evidence was taken in his absence, he gave his assistance in the drawing up of the Report. He never declined 2,3 y public duty. unless when he was occupied in! some other ; and had served in the Secret Commit ' tee, in 1794. Having said thus much , he did not know that the Hooeuraile Gentleman applied any of his other observations to him ; but, at ! any rate, he must say, that though he sat many years in the House, he never occupied one moment of its time in speaking of himself. The rule (:1 his conduit depended on his chanolter. He did not disdain party attachments, nor should he think the better of a man, conneded as he was, if he slid so ; but he would never suffer personal friendship to have any influence on the integrity o: his decisions. I never attempted to give an 7 authority to any obser vations of mine, nor gave them for more than they might be intrinsically worth. He confessed that this was a very unpleasant topic, and hoped he should never be driven to it again. As he never gave a vote for the convenience of the moment, or such as his conscience did not approve, so would he find no difficulty in going into this Committee, in which he was conscious that he should discharge his duty to the best of his judgment. It wonld not he friend ship, but, in his mind. quite the contrary, to attempt to screen any man, when there were proofs against him. He said he should abstain from arguing the immediate question before them, and apologised for being oblioed to say so much in his ownivindication. Mr. 1.1,' HI FBREAD assured the Right limo Gendeman, that in what he thought it necessary to state in support of his Motion. he had not the slight est intention of offering him any personal disrespect whatever. Mr. FOX said, that the influence which an indi vidual may have personally, or from chandler, was I often fairly exerted upon the common usage found ed on the pi inciples of the Constitution ; but there was a vast difference between the influence of an individual and the influence of the Treasury, and if that was said to be fair, he could riot subscribe to the doctrine. He was ready to admit that had Mr. Whitbread circulated a list, he thought he should have adopted it, but had he been the person accused, and had himself, like the Minister, moved for an instruction to the com mittee to enquire into his conch's% he should have been ashamed, and would scorn to circulate any lists. If his lion. Friends, Mr. Grey or Mr. Whitbread. had, in such a case, proposed a list in his favour, he should have reproached them with an intention to affront him. If they adopted the odious task of cir culating lists, the least that could be expelled was, that it should be done openly. It could never be horst that persons sitting in the same cabinet with the First Lord of t• e Treasury and Chancellor of the Exchequer, should give an unbiassed decision on the aubjed ; and, if the Right Hon Gentleman could be contented with an acquittal by judges so constituted. all he should say was, that he wished him joy of his deliverance. The CH ANC El .I.OR of the VAC ll l'.Qtll.ll. " , It certainly sir; sounds exceedtigly well from the total( smite f•entlemen to accuse "a malt of being pop his trial before there is any charge,•end of heist* conviaed before he is tut upon his trial. They are welcome to say reproachfully —" You will not cons nt to put upon your jury those who, if they were on it, you could challenge for cause. You do 'not exclude from the Committee all that majority who, for a series of years, were disposed to think well cif you, and you idd not confine yourself' to these who have been in the habit and dispoSition of constantly Oinking ill of you. For my own part, I know nothing of titat romantic honour which would induce me to court the perilous distinflion of their approbation, wheiotbe Parliament has had recourse to no novel modell.selefting a Committee. I can not consent to yiehron this occasion to the old and exploded segnMentiOvellich have so - often been ad vanced against the general usage MI the ohjec tows now made, might „as well have been offered Is-fore the Coenniiitee was appointed. The Hon. Gentlemen were at liberty, it they thought proper so to do, to have moved by way of initreflion, that I no man in office snoutd be on the Connnittee, ` and that all these whb are excused themselves on my eleflion or other committees .should he ineligible upon this. They might have included in the same proscribe] 'class all those with whom. I ever had the honour to be in habits of private intimacy, 'or connected with in political situations or opinions. . But after doing all these, it could, indeed, be very novel, as well as harsh, if every ono who had ever the misfortune to be one of my solleagues or my friends, should be deprived of the privileges which they have had in common with every other Member of Parliament. I cannot conceive how the ingenuity of those gentlemen can discover any analogy be tween such an appointment as this and an Election iCommittee, in which the non-attendance of any one member, even for five Minutes, must, by law, ' break up the proceedings of the slay, and be. pro ductive of an immediate adjournment. In all other committees we are in the daily habit of providing against the consequeoces of non-attendance by naming a certain number of the Members as mi lficient to constitute a ossarrier. In the various branches that come under the consideration of this I House, it would be unreasonable to contend that on a subjeft of law, of finance, or of politics, the public shoutd•be deprived of the assistance of those most conversant with those subjeas, who by this rule i would be excluded, if they could not constantly give 1 up the whole of titeir mornings to that single occu pation. They cautiously advise us to look to what the public might expeft from us (cries of hear.' hear! (emu tile opposition quarter) ; but I think it better to look to what the public ought to expeiil, without much attending to that party cry which as sumes the name of popular opinion. Enquiries should ever he instituted for the ends of public jus tice, and, it has been generally allowed, that the best mode of obtaining it is be combining biases, so that -one shell's( meet its opposite, and truth and justice be elucidated by the collisiiim of the two. Du Gen ' tlemen think they aft fairly, when they require that we shotird exclude WI the talen'ti inione.si to of the House, indloclude theca on theotlaer.e. Tht objet] of the present motion seems to be to induce us to re nounce the principle &ballots ettogether ; 'midi cer tainly, if we are to havb a separate motion, and de bate upon every name, it would be mote desirable never to have .a ballot at all. .They talk of influ ence, as if no such thing ought ever to have exist ence. Will they allow nothing for the influence of argument, the influence of suggestion, or the influ ence of opinion ? These hifloences must ever sub sist iu the natural and social intercourse between man and roan, but ought not to he cionhoinded with undue or improper influence. Thus much, Sr.l . I thought it my duty to say in viniicatiou of the House, and in support of the usual course of Par liamentary proceeding." Mr. FOX explained, that he had given no pinion respating the guilt of the flight Hun. 'Gentleman. Mr. SHERIDAN observed,. that the debate was proceeding in a strain of more warmth than natu rally belonged to such a subje.f; but it was no great wonder that it should be so, when the question was, which side was best defending the honour and dia meter of Parliament ? The Right Hon. Gentleman thought proper to represent every thing on this sub let, which passed out of doors, a party cry, ASSUIII - the name of popular opinion. Rot were the resolutions of the city of London, and its peti , ion ; were similar resolutions, from other parts of the kingdom, to be properly denominated a party cry ? He also said, that were his Jury otherwise consti tuted, he would be justified in challenging for cause ! What cause ? All the cause hitherto shewn was against the prose. t members of the Committee, who were distitOltly challenged on that ground. Flis HIM. Friends did really challenge for cause, and had also given the proof of it. They stated, in ' proof; that men holding places at the will of the Crown should not be appointed to decide upon such a question any more titan person, living in the habits of private friendship and personal intimacy with the ' Honourable Gentleman (hear! bear!). This was one of the principal ohjetions to the Noble Lord (Castlereagh). whose friendship with him did not appear to he diminished by any changes in Admi nistration, and who was probably the chief bistro merit of the recent reconciliation, for the second time, with his predecessor in office, as no person could be better adapted to pot an end to that astenitain ire, than the Noble Lord, who was the bosom friend of both of them. The Hight Honourable Gentle man thought it would he a hardship in him to ex clude his friends from the Committee, but their tie ing his friends Was a suflirierit objeftion to him. After the great number of i eats, florin!% which he was at the head of the Administration of the cows try, it must necessarily follow that he moist have a great numbsr of persons in that House attached to him, As well by gratitude. or places and favours, as by the ties of pi ivate friendship. H- could there fore be at no loss for perso is who had no bias against him . ; but let the present Committee acquit him in what manner !hey would, they were to con. stinted that they could never restore him to public estimation. Why Sh , tll3 the case be different be tween this and East India delinquency ? By Aft of Parliament, both Houses were compelled to ballot fur Commiuees for East India, and yet it WAS so vressly provided that it any Members wino celoseu -4 414.4 77." who held places at the will ofihe Crown. till* names should be struck of the-list ; and who was the framer and proposer of that Bill ? Why, that very Lord Melville who prosecuted heretofore the delinquency of others with the mo.t rigorous severity, though he did not now disdain to be come himself a delinciaent ; nor silts the Right Honourable Gentleman ashamed to use all his influence to proteet him from the punishment_he merited. Here it was not an East India delinquent, but the First Lord of the Treasury, whose condua a Committee was to decide !Ton. He had himself a few nights since warned that Right Hon. Gent. that he was on his trial, but he seemed to spurn at any imputation avainst himself, though he continued to defend Viscount Melville and Mr. Trotter. .1 he Right Hon. Gentleman prescribed three points for the committee to inquire into ; first, whether he had any information of the money having been unbc.e. Fully drawn from the Bank ? but that was not de nied even by the Bank Direftors. Secondly, whe ther the Naval money was not diverted from its proper application to those delicate and confidential Services mentionerk by Viscount Melville ? This, he fancied, could not well admit of any sienial, and the consequence was inevitable, that subalterns sehuld always be guilty of the same malpraBices, they saw their subalterns engaged in. I'be third point related to the discharge he had given to Vis count Melville, for the money embezzled by Mr. Jellicoe. When his Honourable Fri eeiti( Mi. Whitbread) plainly told him, that he was impli cated in the charge, he made no objeftion at the time to its being considered in that light. So far his conduCt appeared to be honest ; but his magna nimity vanished, when he came to the choice of the judg-s ' whose formation was such, that he may pretty fairly be said to have drawn up their cer ii t. By, this mode of proceeding, the Right Hon. Gentleman may assure himself, that whatever may be their decision, it could not clear up his charaCdT. Mr. H. LASCELLES said, he wished to tillable the House with but a very few words indeed, to which he was induced by what had fallen from the Hon. Gent. opposite. fie had Laid that he thought the Committee was very objectionable from the mode in which it had been ballotted for, and that all the Members might be supposed to be partially inclined. He did not wish to go into a Committee concerning which such impressions prevailed, and he thought a necessary to ask whether the lion. Gentleman had any objeCtion to him ? Mr. WHITBREAD assured the lion. Gentle. man that to all those to whom he had any public objection. he had mentioned his otajedions, and that he never could have entertained the slightest to him I individually. On the contrary, he appealed to him self, to say whether he had not asked his advice :Ai to the names, he should himself put down is the list, and his consent to insert his own name? Mr. H. LASCELLES acknovrfeclged the Hen. Gentleman had done so, and he felt himself much obliged by the compliment ; but he did not allude to him, felt to what had been said b- Mr. Sheridan. i s h m a a t ll h e i s s t , n ,b , % i io nl n d to id th n e at H g o o n. Mr. SHERIDAN disclaimed all idea of the t G o e tl r • k le tle Co m m an m , i aa te:- .l . ' i. 'i l to the mode in which it had been apiminzed tay the i Right lion . rn on. G,:ntlean. Mr. FULII- bas -*el • . ..% • M *sue, '''t sped for the Hon. meinbers who composed the Committee, he was afraid, from the way in which it had been appointi:d, the Public would not thick, it so impartial as it ought to be. It was known, he' said, as well as the son at noonday, that his side of the House ( the oppo%i:i6ti) wished the Right Hon. Gentleman out of care ; and it was as nail knOVIS that he would endeavour to keep in as Inng as he could. lie was sort y to see him proceeding in such a way, to obtain All inquiry into his condud. He , thought the Committee he had recommended the other night would have been a much fairer one, `ien of taking one alternately front each side of t:.e House, and all those to whom he had since men tioned it were of the same opinion. Why were net a l the names of two lion. Gentlemen below in this list ; Geo:lei:nen of the most noble and independent prin ciples, and who had fir many yeats past supported the measures of the Right Hon. Gentleman ? He mentioned Mr. Banker by name (and there was cry of 0,71er ! 0)414 r! I . We believe the other Gen tleman alluded to was Mr. Wilberforce. He pas etraid, he paid, their names were left out, 'lsesatoe they had dared to vote ageing him on a late me morable question. He exhorted those Gentlemen, however, to go nn, and one day nr ether toe coun try would must assssredls reward them. Mr. CANNING defended the Com 'nitre,. a` Iv* - ing appointed in tile usual parliamentary rtio .....apl said, that it was in every rosped free from t.i....1r pellation of a packed jury. which had been apnlea w it by Mr. Sheridan. He insisted that it WAS the dr sire of his Right Honourable Friend to meet fuliy and fairly every charge. against him that can teen g row out of the 10th Report. If he , as Minister, ! possessed that preponderating and corm:landing On fluence that Gentlemen ou the opposite side of the l'icallefasitended, his best way mould be to have a discussion on each name according to their own i pose', for by such discussion his interest wculd more apparent, anal of course more extens ve. l _ . Hon. Gent. opposite (Mr. S heridan) had in red, from what had fallen from his Right 1i0.41 aisle Friend, that he viewed the proceedinvs of tl House on the subject of the lOtit Repo rt as a^ ahli cry. assoming the name of pop ular opinion; t h Right Honourable Friend said no such things that the Honourable Gentleman opposite had tik advantage of it, and used that qu,istion and dec . ', \ for their own purposes, in order to disseat his nig Honourable Fiielid. He did not blame them , raising this acensatinn, but he hlsed the I ' l ' 4 would nee its tendency, and not allow th em be be dazzled and deceived by these false pretences. Mr. Fus.o•ft explained. Mr. JEKYLL thought that in the course of proceedings, he, and his Friends, rich whom he t ed, had reasms to complain of want ul cainicairf l ' the Right honourable G. ntlenum on t he other ti of the House. The only question now bneni House was, whether the INotde Lord oppo ~ t e le fit person to be on that Committe, situated sea c netted as he was with the Right Hon.! Gera. ?1 him, on whose condu.4. as First Lord of the I, sury, that Committee wasto sit in the nalr' Jury. The Right Honourabl e Gentleman UeG it seemed, entirely forgotten the suly Mai"