The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser. — London, England, 1807-03-03 00:00:00

!'~~ *all of the House; among whom was Mr. Huskis son, who, upon motion of Lord Castlereagh, ob tained leave of absence tor one week, having been s•thpatnad to attend npon the trial of Sir Home Papham, at Portsmouth. Colonel STANLEY, Chairman of the Commit tee to whom the Malmsbury Eleflion Petition had been referred, reported, that the Sitting Members wc:e duly tithed, and that the Petition was not frivolous or vexatious. Mr. BLACKBURNE, Chairman of the Com mittee upon a similar Petition for the Town of Rochester, also reported that the Sitting Members were duly returned. And further stated, that the right of franchise was vested in a certain description of persons only. Mr. Peter Moore and Mr. Ellisten presented se veral Petitions from certain Curriers and Leather Dealers against the Oak Bark Bill, which were re ferred to the Committee upon that Bill. Mr. Holland, from the Paymaster General's Office, pursuant to order, presented at the Bar of the House, an Account of the Expence, &c. of Clothing the Royal Veteran Battalion, from the Year 180 G to 1807.—Ordered to lie on the Table. Mr. Woodford, from the Treasury, also presented an Account of the distribution of certain Sums since the last Sessions.—Ordered to lie on the Table. Upon motion of Mr. FULLER, Walter Drury, a witness upon the Mridstone Eledion Committee, who had been committed to Newgate for prevarica tion, was ordered to attend at the Bar ; when The SPEAKER, being covered, addressed him nearly as follows : " Walter Drury, the Seled Committee of this House, for examining into the merits of the Petition complaining of an undue elation for the Borough of Maidstone, have reported, that 100 having been• called before them, in order to give testimony to the best of your knowledge and belief, did misbehave grossly, in prevaricating and refusing to answer certain questions, in consequence of which you were committed to the gaol of Newgate. The tri bunal before which you were summoned, is dear to this country ; its privileges 4:e to he nip/aired, and this House will not tract- its siiguity to be violated. You were sworn to answer such questions as were necessary to be put to you, but you thought fit to per severe in prevarication, umil it was manifest, that you aged so purposely and intentionally; you were, therefore, sent to gaol amongst nialtfadors and fe lons. By your Petition it appeals, that yen ac knowledge your offence, and the ends of public justice are answered, and it will be your future duty through lite to redeem your charader. This House, tlirrefure, order that you be discharged, and yon are discharged accordingly." Upon Motion of Mr. FULLER, this Address was ordered to be entered upon the Journals of the Muse. A new Writ was ordered for the Borough of Harvich, in the room of Mr. Freemantle, who, being also eleeted for the Borough of Saltash, had made his Elation for the latter place. DEFAULTERS. _ _ _ Lord HOWICK moved the Order of the Day for ealliog over the names of the absent Members, upon the ballot on Friday last. An Alphabetical List of the absent Members, of very considerable length, was then read by the Ci. rk of the House, when those Members in and near t3wn were ordered to attend, to-morrow, (this day), and Thursday. Those Members, at some distance from town, to attend upon Tuesday (this day) se'n night. lhuse Members, in Scotland, in a fortnight, and, After same conversation beween Lord HOWICK, Cannel BARRY, and Sir HORACE MANN, in the course at which Colonel Barry urged the neces sity and importance of Irish Members attending their assizes, it was ordered, that the absent Irish Members should attend in their places upon this day three weeks. The usual order for the Serjeant-at•Arms to take into his custody such Members as should be absent upon the days so appointed, unless they could pro duce sufficient excuses, was then made. Lord Hose ick presented a Message from His Majesty, similar to that presented to the House of Lords by Lord Grenville. [Foe which see the Proceedings of that House.] 11 was ordered to be referred to the Committee of Supply. Lord HENRY PETTY rose for the purpose of giving notice, that as the Loan was likely to be transaaed tomorrow morning, he should propose certain Resolutions in the Committee of Ways and Means on Wednesday next, and should also lay be fore them a state of the Sap plies and Ways and Means for the present year. In the Committee of Supply upon that day, he should propose as a Re 'elution, that the sum of ao,nool. be granted to His Majesty, to enable him to make good what has been advanced as a subsidy to the King of Prussia. Lord HOWICK nieved, "That this House will to-morrow go into a Committee. to consider of the propriety of appointing bounties to be granted to Captains and others of His Majesty's ships of war, for capturing any vessels loaded with Slaves return ing from the Coast of Africa."—Ordered. He also moved, " That there be laid before the House the monthly Return of the efledive strength of His Majesty's Regular Forces from the lit of imitury. 1604, to Ist March, MS t the number of rank and Gle botae upon the Establishment of the Regular Army, distinguishing Cavalry and Infan try, and the foreign from use Briti.h troope."— Also, " A Return of the number of men raised for the Regular Army in each month. from the Ist of January. 1807, distinguishing the number raised by ordinag recrititing, those raised under the Addi tional Force atitt, and those raised for the Militia, and distinguishing Cavalry from Idantry." On the Motion of Mi. TYRWHITT, the ad journed debate upon the Mayo fileition Petition was resumed. Mr. TYRWHITT next moved. "That tli!• Mayo Flation Committee hays leave to adjot.:n to Titursday, the USJ day of April next, on accouut of tLe absenco of some material witnesses in Leland. After a short discussion, this Motiosewas agreed to. WF.STMINSTIER ELECTION. Lewd FOLKESTONE roared t`.a Order of the D•+f for isi.iog into consideration the Petition which he l td presented last week, in behalf of :Limes Paull, Esq. complaining of the improper colt dad of IL D. sinsisisus, Esq. its titropetiog with the Witnesses, who were to be brought I.ckre the Committee to try and determine the roe: its of the Westminster Elettion. Mt. SHERIDAN toe! slid observed, that before proceeding further, he begged to declare to the Home, that be deprecated any Motion that might be proposed for the purpose of withdrawiug this matter from the discussion and deliberate consider ation of the House. He said this, because he un derstood that it was the intention of one Hon. Mem ber to submit a Motion, which might have the effet of preventing that publicity to the subjea in question, which, in his opinion, was most desirable. Mr. PETER MOORE stated, that some of the Gentlemen alluded to in the Petition presented by the Noble Lord, were desirous of being heard in their defence against the foul calumnies put upon them; and they had, therefore, applied to him for proteltion. Be was accordingly induced to present Petitions on their behalves. As to the other Peti tion, which was presented by an Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Biddulph), on behalf of the inhabitants of St. Martin's-le-Grand, the circumstances of its having been withdrawn, and no other one presented in its stead, rendered any counter Petition unneces sary; but he could inform the House, that several of the EleCtors, who were prevailed upon to sign it, were wholly unacquainted with the subjea matter thereof ; and were exceedingly impatient to p:ove this by testimony at the Bar; and were attending in a body for that purpose. "!'he SPEAKER observed, that there was at present a question before the House, as to reading the Order of the Day for taking into consideration the Petition which had been previously presented by the Noble Lord; if, however, the Hen. Member could assign any reasons for presenting the Petitions he alluded to, previous to proceeding further, tie might be allowed to do so at the discretion of the House. Earl TEMPLE said, he thought that every light should be thrown upon the subjea before going into the consideration of the Petition presented by the Noble Lord. It would. therefore, be but rea sonable and proper, that the Petitions which the Hon. Member had in his hands from persons implicated in the affair, should be presented, and read. Mr. FULLER approved of the proposal of hear ing the Petitions of these persons alluded to, they being the regular defendants against whom this charge had been made. Lord FOLKESTONE stated, that he had no ob jedion to withdraw the motion he had made, in order to give the Petitions which the Hon. Gentle man had spoke . % of, the precedency. Mr. Moore then presented a Petition from a person of the name of Henry Burgess, which was read by the Clerk; the substance of it was, that. " as the Petitioner was charged with divers adi and crimes against the Privileges of the Iloase, in the Petition presented by Mr. Paull ; he wished to con front all evidence that might be brought in s.ipport of such calumny ; to prove to the House, that he had never taken any step whatever in the Wiist minster Eleftion, but as the Solicitor of the Right Hen. IL B. Sheridan; and praying to be heard by himself and by witnesses, to detea the perjury that has been pursued, and is pursuing against Iris Client, as well as to protett his own credit and pro. fessional charafter." Mr. MOORE then moved—" That this Peti tion be laid upon the Table." Lord FO LKESTON E said. that'upon heating the Petition read, he had one objeCtiiin vi its Is ing upon the table, and that was, that it was perteafy pre mature to hear the defence, before the allegattons upon the other side were proved by evidence, to the satisfaftion of the House. Mr. SHERIDAN was convinced, that the No ble Lord could mean nothing unfair or dishonour able, in taking the part he had done in this business. He was sure he could never mean that Witnesses should be heard at the Bar, to prove the allegations against him, and deny him, at the same time, the benefit of Witnesses, who have heard conversations upon the subjeft. He cared so little who heard him, and thought it of so little consequence whe ther the Witnesses heard one another's depositions or not, that he would not propose to clear the gal lery ot strangers, merely for the purpose of exclud ing any of the Witnesses who might be amongst them, from hearing any previous examination. He was arraigned by himself and his Agents, of having tampered with the Witnesses, and therefore the House should certainly hear the person: so arraign ed as speedily as possible. Lord HOWICK said, that, according to strift justice, the persons so charged, should be heard at the Bar, in their own defence, at the very moment they were so accused. He s'intild, therefore, ap prove that the Petitions now alluded to should lie upon the Table. Lord FOLKESTONE explained, by saying, that he by no means wished to exclude the indivi duals implicated in this buanzst, from being heard fully in their defence ; but the presenting of these Petitions seemed so Ilia to be premature. He, however, should have no objeftion to comply with whatever appeared to be the wish of the House. Mr. BIDDULPH said, that by the course which the Noble Lord had taken, he appeared to have thrown bimself nrcin the House as to the mode of condua'ng it. I: was, no doubt, a grave and se limn business, and so unusual in its nature, that the mover ot it was well entitled to the indulgence, ad vice, asaistanee. ani proteftion of every member in the Houae. They were to look upon themselves in the light of , a jury, and, if possible, to guard the general rights of the people, in regaid to the free dom of elediaos. He was, by no means prepared to support the Noble Lord in the discussion of this subjea, but he thought the House seemed inclined to agree to the Motion at present before them, and chi reinre he approved of the Noble Lord's acquie acem.x. The t etition of Mr. Burgess was accordingly allowed to be laid on the Table. The next Petition presented and read, was that of Jame! Wallace, who also prayed that he and his Witnosses might be permitted to attend at the ;Ls., to di,prive the var,ous allegations made against him. This was also ordered to lie on the Table. _ _ _ Mr. P. Moore then presented another Petition, which was signed by Frederick Homan and Alex ander Johnston. It was also laid upon the Table. Mr. SiiERWAN expressed his surprise that the Noble Lard, had aot called (onward all the wit nesses expressed in these Petitions, is well as in his own. He wished to ask the Hon. Gentleman who had presented the oti.er one, urn Friday last, whether he meant to reilew 4, and bring forward persons from St. Martin's Le Grande, to prove the allegations. He would inform him that he had persons waiting in the Lobby, who were prepared to prove that there never Was a more scandalous and infamous fraud than what had ireen pro ised upon the persons who had signed that Petition. Mr. BIDDULPH said, he did not ex,ieet to have been called on to answer any question of that nature. He had already speeilicahy said, that he was not answerable fin- its contents; au,: he d i d oat conceive that he had, by presenting it, iiiClllrtd .an unusual degree of responsibility. Mr. WHITBREAD said, he had understood the Hon. Gentleman, who spoke last, to have already so expressed himself. Mr. SHERIDAN added, that he was glad to find that the Hon. Gentleman had not got people who were willing again to sign a Petition, for a similar purpose with the former one. He had felt so impatient, that he had already taken the precau tion of providing his witnesses. The order of the day was then read for taking Mr. Paull's Petition into consideration, and the next question pet from the Chair, was, That the witnesses do attend." Lord iHOWICK said, that he could not help confessing, that he had considerable doubt, as to the mode of proceeding which thq House ought to adopt. Upon inquiry and research, he bad found a case, in the reign of King William, where there was an examination of witnesses, upoa a complaint that witnesses had been tampered with ; but there was a considerable distinttion to be taken betwixt that and the present case ; the former was at a time when Elation Petitions were tried by the whole House, by couesel and witnesses et the Bar ; but, as he was willing that this question should be heard in a manner that would satisfy the public mind, as to no imprnpo. means being used to deprive the Pe titioner of that justice which the gravity and seiirmsness of the charge merited, he should not objeft to follow that case as a precedent.— He, however, cautioned the House in regard to adopting, rashly, any guide to their future proced ings. Since the passing of Mr. Grenville's Mt, it had been the praelice of the House to abstain from entertaining any question at its Bar, which might defeat the ends of that salutary law, which establish ed a Committee as the most proper Tribunal. As the practice of referring Eleetion cases to Com mittees had gene on so long, it would be iirs proper to interfere, materially, with the original principle of their establishment. and, therefore, she present examination ought to be confined striftly as to the charge of tampering with the witnesses, avoiding every question that tended to affect the merits of the case. Ile thought, therefore, that if Counsel ware at all to be admitted. it should only be in order to examine the witnesses, and nit to eater into any pleadings at the bar. The. House had a right to interpose its authority, in or der to preserve the purity of its proceedings, in the same manlier that a Court of Law, such as that of the King's Bench, had. Whatever doubts he might feel, as CO the propriety of adopting the case he had alluded to as a precedent, yet, being dis'nced to give th i s question every degree o' publicity, he should propose the adoption of it ; and, in order that the House might be informed of its nature, he should siliegest the propriety of having the Resolu tion of the House, in the case to which he alluded, read by the Clerk. (Here the Clerk accordingly read from the Journals, the resolution of the House in a case of tampering witnesses who were to be examined in re gard to the merits of an elation in the county of lts ) • Lord lIOWICK reminded the House, that this case had occurred before the passing of the Gren ville Aft. 'I he SPEAKER observed, that at that time the House most recollee, that elation cases were usually sent to be tried by a Committee of Privileges. Mr. T. GRENVILLE said, he though: the pre sent case was one, which might be looked upon as being entirely new, and therefore the House ought not to lose sight of a very important consideration, that of establishing a precedent, that would be likely hereafter to have much weight and influence. l le had a great deal of doubt, as to the correaness of the proceedings, as far as they had already gone. The House ought to have hesitated much, before they adapted any step which went to trench upon or take away that which by law was left to the determination of a Commutes. It would create an extreme stiificulty, by separating those questions which the House had already determined ought to be referred exclusively to a Committee. There appeared to be no doubt that a Crusimittee might be authorised to make a special report upon the subject of the improper means taken in regard to tampering with witnesses, should it happen that there had been any such used. Public and substantial jut. Lice would thereby be completely effened, the more especially as the Members upon a Committee rested upon oaths, administered to them, in regard to the particular subject under their consideration. The House, he thought, ouL t not, therefore, to entertain this proceeding, but refer it to their Committee, where it would be discussed with much better effeft. Should the House, however, be of a different opi. nion, yet there was another important question, as to whether they should allow it to be discussed, by admitting Counsel to be heard at the bar. He thought, that at all events, the examination ought to he kept entirely in their own hands. He was not wishing to he presumptuous in thus pressing his opinion upon the Honse ; but the situation in which he stood seemed to impose upon him the ae cmsity of stating his sentiments and views of the subject. Another matter of doubt would he, as to the propriety of allowing the Counsel to plead at the ear, supposing that the House agreed to permit them to examine the witnesses. He should contend, fur the same reasons, that it was equally impraEli eahle, and utterly subversive of that legal mole of procedure which had been already legally appointed. Mr..,EIGH stated, that bad the offence charged in this Petition no connetlinn with any other mat ter, to be otherwise decided, he should see no ob. jeCtion to their entertaining it ; if they could look to no other coasequence than the punishment or ac quittal of the parsons ircp:icatcd, be should be one of the knit to agree to the pine tug:rented by the N t . ble Lord, who had brought the minter betore el:. es, The charge of tampering mast either be mike gene, or nut be made good, and in either ease the Gentle. men to be ail/newest as si Committee to try said determine the merits of the original Petition, me et ' enter upon their detyotrith some confiderablit de. gree of prepossession in their minds. He shred e therefore, eppreve of referring the whole matter te ' the determination of one Committee, who, he L e i every reason to think, would give a fair and to. partial decision Mr. PERCEVA I, said, this was a question wiii,t l had beets very properly •aid so b • likely to esorbee t a precedent. Considering the course which the House hid Arcady adopted in this very business, he should be much astonished, indeed, were they to think of abandoning it to another kind of trihunal. The question had already been deter mined 25 to t?. calling in of Counsel and witnesses; yet the I Jon. Coe opposite seemed stile inclined to discusser, es. argue the original point, at so whether the • :• s . ought to entertain the charge at all. That o , , first questioa which the House ought to leeve eidered ; and, indeed, he conceived t !try b , ready determined it. The House had ale . i given authority to summon witnesses t„.. th:ni, (or the purpose of being heard. Order of the Day had already been rea•!, ~ j therefore they wete now in the course of illqui,r, as to the subject muter set the Petition. He apsti. heeded there could be very little difficulty in ever. coming the arguments of the Right Hun. C-..: c. man opposite, and satisfying him of the necessies ie the House entrrseining this Petition. Hi s (aie. Glenville's) objellion seemed to be, that thrie 'would be some danger of interfering with f!-,e question, which was to follow, in regard to the ' 1 4 11teetion iiself. Now lie by no means wished to discuss whether the Committee woule be comp etent to consider this charge, but he begged the lionise to recellea, that there were two &ejects in the he• titian, the one to punish those individuals who hate offended against the privileges of the House, esd the other to prevent the recurrence of the offence which has been committed to the injury of the Pr. titiener. If the allegations in the Petition were true, then it was still open to those who have been guilty to commit the same offence, till the 14th of April, when the merth of the Eleaion are to be tar veetigated. It had likewise been stated, that as important letter remained still in the pos. session of one of the persons implicated. Was it not of importance to have that letter produced, he fere that period arrived ? Would this previous ne quit y not give the party an opportunity to remove it ? Would it rot prove how he had been dealt web, and how the several witncoses have been k•pt back, or sent out of the way ? Undoubtediy it would tend to illustrate the whole proceed ings ; and enable the Committee to admini ster substantial justice. The House would, there. fore, advert to this, that what they had dire was nothing more than what justice reet ired.— As to the other question, whether they should per. slit the allegatiems to he made gond by Counsel at the Bar; how far they might be limited in the er. tent of their duty was another consiJeratien, bet that they should be admitted in behalf of the Pen. firmer, he could not hesitate in determining in the affirmative. The objea of the Petitioner therefore wets clearly this,not only to punish the individuals; het to procure justice to himself. In that view he looked uston the precedent that bad been stated, ought ta fel tulate the proceedings upon this present necesien. It was an intermediate kind of proceeding betssin the presenting the Petition and the trial of its meri t s, and one whkh could be tried and determined by no other tribunal, than by the House itself. *1 he House had already done so much upon the business, that they could not retraa. They had already rot ceived other Petitions upon the other side of tee question, praying that Counsel should be heard, and that witnesses should be examined. He apprehended that if the Petitioners on the one side were nn he allowed to be heard by themselves, or that Counsel. the Petitioner on the other, ought to be heard also. Ilse Counsel might, indeed, be ap prized, tLat they must confine themselves to the allegations in the Petition. There did not seem therefote to be that degree of difficulty which the Right Hon, Gentleman ascribed to this part of the subjea. As to the inconvenience which has bees hinted at by another Hon. Gentleman, as being likely to arise flocs the Committee being prepes sewed against one or other of the candidates. ti at was a consequence w tech it was impossible to pet'. vent ; he hoped therefore, that the House would set the propriety of entertaining the Petition, and of hearing Counsel make goon the allegations at the bar. Mr. T. GRENVIL LE said, in explanation, this he thought the Hon. Llentlernate had mistaken be meaning. His view of the question was, that oil wit not the mein convenient times for enter:a:nal it, as it was impossible to pursue the one trial wide out interfering with the other. Lord H. PETTY thought that the evident , might,be reduced within a very isarrow compass. The House were called to nalarkt the inco:;szai epees of both the mode* that had been pointed out. On the one hand, the House wee a certainly re t le well qualified fie ereeriag into thl t enquiry, so ere of its own Committees; ben to n is was to be ba lanced, on the other hand, the inconvenience or delaying to hear the serious cherg• is in the Petitisee until such time as the Eledion Cot iornittee could be appointed, which would lead, in faa, to present this question from being settled is 'the course of tire present Session. If the House did no: interfere, these un.lue praelic. s, if true, wou rd frustrate the efforts of the Committee to ascertailt the merits of the Election. Itt eth regard to the objeCtion tha . the previous examination of whiles as would t end to recite a Ines in the minds of th, s Committee: this was no more than what occun'ed in " r3 I, other Tribunal, where a previous era tnination hot witnesses was entered into. Urns the ' whole , thought the House could not hesitate t i liirnf -- . _ and thee upon the ground that it had a irea c r !' ceived the Petition, and, in faa, sanaioned the ciple of hearing witnesses in support of the 'aleg s. tions of the Petition. Mr. illEft IDAN said, he rose to knee, t.? c ir . argument of the Right Hon. Gentlemen i Grenville), so tar as it went to defer entering L ea this exam . ination. He wished, above all thiees, , • ,0 1 .112 1