The Statesman. — London, England, 1810-02-17 00:00:00

min f .IMM.M.T1r1.••••••••••• - ^ 'ERIAL P. 4 R LIJMENT. ROUSE or LORDS.—Eamar, Fia. 16. - • It was near the o'clock before the Lord Ceasietra.olt tame Im the House. Lord WALS I NI: II AM presented Petitions, preying (alt relief; from the Debtors eundoetl I. the jails of Halifax, aid KinZslonotposi-141111. Two moods 'Were prevented at the Bar, by Mr.. Big ham, Prow the Commissiouers fur the Reduction of tile Na- Olnal Debt. The Malt Doty Bill was read a third time, and loused. blarqui. WELLESLEY Isrimaht dont) a message from Iris hlajesty, desiring the concurrence a their Lordships In enabling Ms blaiesti to extend further aids to the Goverousest of Portugal"; which were to contist partly of supplies Lt money, and of a force ont exceeding Won° Lei • After slant explanation between Marqnis Wct.t.est.tir and Lord Gain y t 1.1. E, his Lordship 'nosed, and carried a motion fur the production of certain particulars connected INith his hiajesty s message; and the fart:ter consideraliou of t)r message was fixed, purse:tot to the wish of Lord. Grenville. for :Stoma:is next ; a 'lieu, his t...r.ls.iip s4id, he . should go folly jut., the mature of our presto t .•11i trice with l'ortmal; as it we. one of those subjects ;stitch had long pressed op II hi• mild. Wittlessdiv's Divorce Bill *as reported to their Lori ' 'hips. (lathe Order of the nay beiug rind,„ for lb.! second read ing el the Rever s ion Hot, The LORI/ CH A N CLI.LOR left the Woo'sack, and said, . that he had something rath..r.jeopleamot to communicate fo llicle Lordships. It was ahanlwely i 1 vo.iiihle, ow iiig to the si ordiur of the Rill, that their Lord‘h could pass it. p 4 liar) tiILOSVF.NOk had learned, into the rumantor the day, thu objection avoid be taken to the ni-tine which he had brought before their lair hitips. Still he should wait t•. hear what were the obi-Ilion?. that would be taiteu t. the jii 'dile aim, teeniest Lord nit the Woolsack. The Lt/it I) CH AN CE I.Lt)lt, quits Mg the Woolsack, 4 iiii!, that their Lordship, could nut enter into the second sending of tie Bill, even thistle' they tlit4ht feel frietelly to it. Re . ferring to the .lit of 18114, which enact e d the Suspension of finials in Reversion, it would he soea that this Bill, hots ever prostswettly beneficial, strut to tejaler that perpetual, which, la fart, a as nobly temporary, is !tams 1111(111 . 121. 0 : to the priori sinks of the Sulwinting Ileversion•Ae:, which was esen)et in • twee. lie shou:4l he ashamed, strong thoti : zli the phrases , Were, if the Noble Earl considered (*an, to his part, as a tech , a. c ..1 übirction. E.til GttOliVENOll cnul.l nsk coincide stifle the senti turbo Aeluvered by the Noble Idyl Learned Lord. The coun t', rolled for the Itesendon Bill ; stud after all that had • . Leen uroed a;:timt the Bill, still deference was due to the , other•lksu•e of Partiament, is here it had originated, and , through whit,' it had pas.:ed. Tar Ottl.heistg negatived as to i:s second reading', Earl : Gravelciederl fired his intentioa to brio.: forward some mea- Soh without delay, in place of the Bill that ltihi now 1.».t. Upea.the 4,0i1D CHANCELLOR. dzclaring the Bill re jectol, Lora froa‘NlXobjea-ted to its rejection. 'pats LORld-CHANL:ELLOtt, white be wished In abstaia (rem deliveriag ins opinion- upoa tae Buil, referred their Lo. - dships, to that of IIh)8. - . • At ahout 2, tinitatcs oa.st six ts:clock, the Reversion , Bill Illas throwu out ; and toeir. Lordships adjourned till three i , o clods au lUsnuta).. TIOUSE OF COMMONS, FRIDAY, FEs.l6. A Person fines Treasury presented an Account of the • 360 t year's Exp..i.titture of the ContaiisNioner, for Redrew 'titxt of the National itch,. Order.ft to lie on the table. Mr. W ILA furoN presented an .aernuAt of the Surplus of th e %lat. Tars for the hist year o%or t'' sum of 19 mil -li•in at which they were estimated. o.l.reJ to tic un the tank. ' SCOTGIIFINANLES. The 1..03;th ADvoc.tTE of SCOTLAND Vase, ill consutpietice of suate (.1).47 varioos inatle on a (crater night by a Noble L list opposite to him (Lord Mahon), reap t cling the collection of the Property Tax in Scotland, to it-loose the un. haunt-dole impres.irti matte in tho !louse 'by the speech of etc Noble Lord, and t place the sub ject in a just point of tieiv. 'Elie Noble Lord had stated, that the produce of the Property 0r Scutlapil nag much smaller in proportion to other taxes, than Alio like taxi') Esiglottil ; but the . 'Noble Load had drawn his costiltoion from errn peons prentini.s. For ittsCatice, the Noble Lord's statement of the amount of the S,•otelt property taa was taken from the returns of the year 1806, IA licit the tax was collected at the rate of 61 per seat. which he contrasted with the amount of the property tax in England, collected at a rate of I() percent. Another groood upon which the dead , of the tax in Scotland arose, not taken into the cunsi. deration of the Noble Lord, was, that a very considerable part of the tax assessed on Scotch property was not collected io Soutland, but in ')gland, and carried to the account of English collection, and thus appeared in a double pronto-- tiotk against the credit of Scotland. But he should more fur documents which would prove to the llonse that in the year 1803, when the Pro perty Tag was laid in Scotland at 10 per cent. Om amount of the collection was SOO,OOl. which, With the amount 'of taxes Nom' 4E1 . 41(114 its the E n glish funds belonging to Scotch proprietors, wo od add another '200,0001. maijog together 1,000,0:)0 1 . Formerly, it was true, very little Scotch money found its way into the English funds. But from the increased and increasing wealth of Scotland in latter year., there wall coasiderable influx of money front that country i n t o England, and large stints were vested in Bri- , tish foods ; the is bole Ito:cone Tax upon which being dud acted in England, was carried to Ear,- lish aceunnts, though paid by the inhabitants of Scotland. The tax no military pay . and allow ance to Scotch Oiluers was also.deducted in. Eng. h o d ; an d there were a number of manofacturing houses in Scutlaml, the proprietors of which, liv. i.s. Eughwelt r paid thu Pruitt:sly - Tat there fur convettictice ; so that the:tax 'assessed in Scotland was mere If upon the local property., It was very difficult to ascertain the pre'cise which Scotland did pay under this head ; but comparing the sum of 500,0001. returned for 1808, by the documents on the table, as collected fur Sea:Alma, and allowing only 230,0101. for tax no Scotch funded property, both would amount to more than one-eleventh of the sum paid by England; which was bat 11,073,0001. without deductions; and this would be a fair proportion for Scotland to pay, whether as compared with 1 the amwiit of the tax in England, or in cornpa. risen with the total of other' assessed taxes col. lectud in Scotland. The Learned Advocate con cluded, by moving for an account .of the net amount of the Property Tax in Scotland, : from its commencement in 1803, to the latest period the same could be made up, distinguishing each year ; and also thewm•unt of aimed taxes collected in Scotland from the commencement of 1800, dis. ttnguishing in like manner. Cord MAHON expressed much satisfaction at t!te stateaunit by thelearned Lord Advocate. But a t h um ph ballad stated that the Property Tax was stet cotleolsd at tea per cent. in Scotland, until t=o6; and that • its python is that year • 1 • 1. I pi • 1 41.1.1.1.111111.1.111.1wwwwwww"...77.7---„77,-- • - TRIP. STAIIISMAN: , , 800,0001. the return lald 'aspen the tabin stated the . collection to be only 324,0091. The Noble . Lord thought the subject of Scotch Reventle was high ly Impel-rant, and celiac' for the notice of the I House. There were several important objects of taxation, fur instance thwartiele of Geer, ui which the difiertmee between the apparent comuno o tion of Scotland and Englaod was so enormous, and so oat of all apparent probability', that he thought a Committee should be appoilited to Unpin: into the extraordinary difference between tk:: revenues of Scotland and those af England. Mr. H. THORNTON said, that the collections in Scotland proceeded so slowly, that in the Com mittee of Finance, of which he had the humour to be a Member, up to June of the last year, the returns of the Income tax (ruin Scotland only cam dawn to 1806. He imagined that. the reason was, that rents were nut paid in Scotland so regu larly as in England. The fact however was, that the taxes collected there travelled very bluely late this country. • • Sir. P. MURRAY supported what had been said by the Lord Advocate. Mr. HORN ER, thought, that the rents were paid as regularly in Scotland as in England ; but that.the deficiency of collection arose from a bad "systota:of ass •ssment. The SOLICITOR•GENERAL-Aor Scotland had tie .i.itiafaction to inform his Hum. Friend, that this subject had attracted the attention of Go vernment, and was at present under the considers.. lion of Ministers. Mr. HUSKISSON Ramiro! the. House that, while he had the honour of holding an office under the Board of Treasury, its attention had been called to the subject, in consequence of the small remittances received from Scotland on account of the revenue of that Country. . Mr, HORNER explained. The LORD ADVOCATE of SCOTLAND, 'in answer to the call of .the llon. Gentleman op posite (Mr. Horner), stated, that the lardy col leation of the revenue in Scotland arose from t wo causes : the first was, that they had not had the advantage of the same system of parochial, lISSCiti raent, nor of Commissioners for the Affairs of Taxes, when the property tax was imposed there * as existed in England. Thoy had consequently not the same machinery (or the ready collection of the•tax, when superintended by only a single per son in each county. Another cause arose, not on ly from the slower payment of rents, lint from the adoption of a more strict and rigid mode of ascertaining the rent and value of property, cordiug to the Property-tax Act fur Scotland, than existed in England. Sir JOHN A NSTRUTHER admitted that rents were paid more slowly iu Scotland than in Elogland, but that was no mason why the revenue should nut be collected with more dispatch than it I actually was. lie paid his Property Tax in Scot land within two months after he paid it in this country. He had no hesitation to state that lie could see no reason e by the revenue should not he collected withalie same regularity, strictness, and -accuracy in Scotland as,in England. The subject was under the consideration of Government, to whom, he was perseaded, nu blame attached. • • The motion was they put and agreed to ; as also the next motion of the Lord Advocate— " That there be laid before the Rouse 1111 Account of the Amount of the net aNse3smeuts of all the, !Pities called As wiled Taxes In Scotland, from the '246301 May, AA to the latest period to which the same could be made out, visaing each year." A Message from the Lords informed the. House, that their Lord hips had agreed to the Malt and Pension Duty Bills without any, at:minim:ma. PAPERS. _ _ _ ham tri attend, Of% Monday next, the 'Committee of that House ap - poluted to inquire into the con. duct and policy of the • late Expedition to the scheldt. Captain Codrington, of the Royal Navy, was, on the *nation of Major ALLEN, ordered to attend the seine Committee.. On the motion of General LOFT, it was or., dared, that an humble Address be presented to hit Majesty that ho wontd be graciously pleased to give directions that there be laid before that' House the Copy of a Piper or Narrative pre. seated to. Isis Majesty by John.. E trl of Chatham, relative to the proceeding of the Army iu the. late Expetklion to the S:heldt. The instructions which had he: n hid by Lord Gardner before the Committee enquiring into the ! Widcheren Expedition, were, on the mufion of Mr. Nhereromhie, referred to a Select Co;ninittee, to examine their contents, and to re l .ort what parts were rekrant to the Inquiry pen:;ing before the House, and what ought to be printed in the minutes. The gnome upon sa hich This motion was brought forward, was, that the instructions to Lord Gardner w ern rem in eariutlS I teri from diferent - Officers, and must, necessarily, • Feistrain matters unconnected with the Inquiry, Which it would be improper to publish in the mi. notes. Ordered; on the motion of-Mr. Henry Martin, • that there be laid before the House au Account of • the Exchequer Bills now outstanding, ass far as the same can bu made out, specifying the several Acts under which they were issued, and the Nita upon which they were charged. Mr. IVIIIITBREA D after skirt cunversa. tit)* with the Chancepor the Exchequer, un the propriety of making the motion instanter, gave notice of a motion, for, Copies of all Instructions' which had been sent to Lord Viscount Wellington, cdative to the couduct of the campaign in Porto. gal and Spain ; also Copies of all dispatches re. ceived from that Officer, from the t4th to the `2Bth of July, 1809; and Copies of all Dispatches received from him, dated Talavera, August Ist, 1809. Lord G. 1,. GOWER observed, that the Pa pers, for which he was about to move, were neces sary td be brought under the consideration of the H.riise, before it could conic to a decision upon the Army Estimates; and as he understood that un id,jection would lie suade•to their production, he should content himself with simply moving, " Tiizs there be ttid before the House a Return of the Nonther pull [Unita the 011e?rts employed on the Military Stag• in the different Districts in this Country, specifying the Amount of their Staff Pity and Allowancei, toother with a Retorts of i!se Number of Trno,., in each Di:rtrict."—Also " Copies of nay Reports which may have peen received by his Majesty's Secretary of State relative to tke services and discipline of the Manx Fencib les." The CHANCELLOR of the EXCIIEQUER 'spresented evrtain Papers relative to the Loan granted last year to the Prince Regent of Porte. gal,ll cemmand 'of his Majesty.--Ordered to lie on the table. MESSAGE FROM HIS MAJESTY. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER . then brdught up from tho Bar a Message from hist Najesty, in nearly the following words : " G. Majesty thinks it proper to acquaint the Hott.e of ('ommon!' that his Majesty Yas authorised the issue. of some pectiniary advances to the Porlitimm‘goveromeati , In s u pport of ftFin ilifitielt;ilius against the common delay in that country. His Majesty being desirous of continuing that I support, has directed that an arrangement shall be made fur the thainteriance of a body of Portuguese troops, not tweed log thirty thousand men ; and his Majesty trusts that his faith ful Cuinsaora will enable bias to fulfil that agreement." Mr. HUTCHINSON, as we uuderstood, gaye notice for hiuuday, of a motion relative .to n gallant Officer, who had distingilished himself at the bead of a Portuguege corps. , Sir FRANCIS BURDETT rose to move,. " that there be laid before the )rosese the Minutes of the Court Martial upon the Honourable War. wick Lake, tate Captain of bis Majesty's ship Ulysses." He did not know whether any ob. jecsion, would be made to the motion, but inhere should, he should turn his suction into a notice fur Monday next. 7 t After a short conversation between Mr. Ward, Mr. Charles Adams, Sir Frantis 'Burdett, and the Chancellor of the Exchequer, the motion was agroelk.to, on its being understood that . th e Paper was c eded for by Sir Francis Burdett, with a view to make it the foundation of some ulterior pro ceeding in that noose. On the motiots of:lbtr. 'HEIM EY, a Message was ordered .to.,tia, Lprds, to request that 'their Lordships w9uld T s leave to Jelin Earl of Chat - e .' • - _ -'_.- LORD WELLINGTON'S PENSION. • . ' The House;'-on the motion of 'the Chancellor of I the Exchequer, resolved into a Committee on his Majesty's most gracious Message, relative to the grant of a pension of 20001. per anima,,/. Lard Viscount Weliington.' The CHANCELLOR, of the EXCHEQUER rose, and said, !hal in consequence of his Majcs ty's most gracious Message, recommending to that House the grant of a Peniiati 49 - Lord , Viscount Wellington, it would not he ifeedwary .for Itim to trespas4 lung upon the time of thi•Committee, in order to impress them with thoproptiety of adopt. ing the Motion he hail to propose. He could cer.. tainly nut anticipate any objection to the motion,. which would have the effect of inducing the House to o it hhoti its concurrence ; but in order to vendee the grounds upon which his motion was founded' more clear, he should, in the first place, state to the Committee' the circerasiances under which . it was brought forward; and unless the HonW should depart from Its uniform and established praMice in all similar cases, he was .persuatled it. 1 would not dissent from the proposition' with which'he should eynclode. Wise facts.were these; Ms Majesty, it . soon as the intelligence had beets received if ,the brilliant, glorious, and - decitivisl tictory of Talaiera, bad ?conferred upon the gat.' Rant Officer who coniumnded in that memorable . action, the honour of a title—an honour W., which all those who devoted their talents and lives to military pursnits, looked up with the most ardent ;and laudable anxiety—an' honour, the proudeft distinction that can be conferred on a brave sol dier—the highest object of ,his generous am. -bition ; and at the same time the best . reward of, mbinent services...-[Wear, hear n---fit con. ferring this mark of his Royal approbation and favour, his Majesty has thought it right to re. commend by hot Message to 'Parliament, that. it should be accompanied by a grant of some pecu niary pension, in the same warmer as was usual in all such cases. Li consider* the propriety, and estimating the justice of the advice' which had' beeti given to his Majesty in both instances, it might perhaps be proper to confine the House (la the simple consideration of the distinguished and wiled merit of the Noble Viscount upon the particular occasion. But it would neither be just to his Majesty nor to Lunt Wellington, that this should be looked upon in the,sanse light as the case .of an Officer for the first time presenting himself, by his services, to the notice of ' his Sovereign and the admiration of his countrymen, in estimat ing the claims of 14ril Wellington to the divine. that* conferred upon liini, and the, provision pro. poseil to accompany it, they should loOk to what he had been-'—consider his past conduct, sial ate. rive, from his former distinguished services, strong accessary grounds for his present honours and re wards. .fttenr, twee!) - But trieer b eveo by the test of his late services, Mdes did that gallant Of ficer preiint himself to his Sovereign and his coon. try ?• He had, by the glorious operations he had conducted, and the victories he achieved, he could nut say raised, but certainly most eminently sustained the military renown of ar.oy, and the unfailing lustre of the British name and chiracter. • He presented him4elf to his Ma jesty, as the• ditinguisbed Commander, who had already &tended the glory of the British arms . over the pehinsula of India: he presented him.. self - as the conqiieror of Soolt—an:l the General, who, by the ilgnal victories he gained ita Porto gal, expelled - the Frcech from that country, and rescued a kingettain, the rightful inheritance of our ally, from the grasp of the enemy. ' In short, he presented hiMself to his Majesty with such an ar. cumulation of merits—such an aggregate of cmi. neat services=siteli an unvaried c ireer, an uni form teneur of victory and triumph, as could not fail toribtein for him the moil signal . mark of his Majesty's favour, and the unlimited gra.: !Etude. of his country.—(Dear, hew-, hear !) Looking, therefore, to all these ton'sideratiou•—!- looking also to the vote of thanks, which liikd been :lased by that House, and which must b e eonsi rod as expressive of its sostiments, he could not steppes" any motet's objection to his motion. The . : • . : • ,_Ai •__ . ......,..dm k~ ~ -~ , , .1. - • - be € bea vote df thanks, he Must admit had eyey some opposition 1 yet the general seats' of House was yo strongly in its favour, ,li st a ttw:h.icith who n i ht ar ,tub tier, w e t o o u u c i :(I)ilmtooestitstbireosill. sufficientyo°troig,i ca:tes:el os s b f k l impression on the House. lithe House, thet lt .41k1 nut disapprove of that tote, whels —4l required as the foundation fur his mode: ,4 there ass instance upon record th at would ;211, Parliament in refusing the grant of hi e • 179 posed ? amount of that pension tip s la rs ,r* year to Lord ‘tellingtoti, t o d escend to ir. next heirs its sum ession horn the ti t l e II devolve. This provision was 110 mo re u m . been griotted to Lord I, ike ; it was precis ; • WM; OS the pension that hail !seen granted to 7 H hod nson [flear, hear !] ; precisely th e : ast us :sid been Nettled noon L or d Minces% [flee. hear, hear, hear?]; precisely t h e same a s given to Lord Ciillsegw nod po o r. Its the same as !g id been settled noon tise ; h t .of (.suers! Sir It.slph A liercromby. ff hear, hear, hear t be is, - 2 position idiotic'. Gesitlebnen, it gas hotAisigare or his wish to take upon him lbs• ungracious office of entering into id l.• compariss: but if the task were imposed epos' him, he rs,j assure the lion. Gentlemen opposite, that he w o o have no cause to shrink from it. up.in strength of the instances to which he had retr en c o, and o Welt were five in nmulser, he ihouie rti the defence of the proportion of pensian wh' chk meant to propose. Massy other cases, he had doubt, could be produced in support of e s amount of the intended granti which would ali o that it Was consisting with the uniform peados Parliament in rewarding the services of distingsio, ed Officers. lie would defy any Gentleman thew any case to the contrary; unless, pe r i sA in the instance of Officers of opulence, to elus the amount of the provision must have bees,' less value, than the honours orthe Peerage. Upe, what ground any 'opposition could he mach i s the grant of the Pension in this case, he was g a loss to conceive. W 44 it on the ground oto s limey that it was to be refused ? Were Gentles% then prepared to say, that on the occasion of wall services, such grants as that under consideration ,should be refused upon such a ground ? principle of. narro w economy ought to be Inferd to arrest the grant of such Pensions and Rewi, as were calculated not alone to recompense pet services, but to kindle an active emulation in meg branch of the public service, &mica!l forth thsesas strenuous exertions and ambirion of gallantandes. terprizhig individuals? Nothing could be *, a nti pOwerful iticitenient to zeal, activity, and esertim than the prospect of such distinction as had boo conferred upon Lord Wellington. But the bareti. ,thrisas hot sufficient, sinless accompanied by Wile . siviequate. provision iu the form of a Pension. re withhold i llse pension, therefore, he emits*: would be injurious to the individual, injurioas le the public service, and itscostsistent with the jsce rice and' liberality of Parliament. Having enosish to impress the Committee with the paw pricty of the grant, he should not trfspus legit on theirlime ) .but move, f 4 net It is the opintoh or that Comnsitipubdasilse. 0 1 2,431. peronaues.be settled on• Lord and uts the two next heirs to his title in succession, &e." On the question being put upon this SOON% Mr. HOWARD rose to oppose it; but spoke in too low a ton° to be audible iu the galkrri : We understood him to have dwelt strongly mi emphatiCally on the impropriety of the advance of the army to Talavera, and to have uried.• tlgt retreat and disasters which folloired the wife,/ grounds fur withholding the pension. Mr. CALCRAFT thew rose and obsersed, that the able speech of the Honourable Geathnist who preceded him, had rendered it, en for him to go as much at length as belts lateadst . into the question. He congtatulated that Rt. nourable Gentleman and thelionse, on the um. siees of eloquence it acquired in hat lion. Gen tleman. Though what he had to say might sot coincide with the seniiitteuts of the. majority of that house, or with the public, yd no consider, .mien of that kind should deter him from doi*t what lie considered to be his duty. • The Rigltt . Hon. Gentleman ooposite (the Chancellor of tba Exchequer) had asserted, that, because lik jelitY had been advised to advance Lord Wciliade'. ton to the Peerage, it would be a deviation froa the uniform practice of that House nut to add to that lionouy the grant of a pension. Surely the Right Honourable Gentleman could not think ill malting any comparison between the service+ of Lord Wellington and the services of the di. tinguishett Officers to whine cases he had referreit, in order to justify the amount of pension prepood ,to be granted. He could not compare the battles of _Talavera with the victories of Mien. Did the Right Honourable Gentleman mean to say s that the claims of Lord Wellington were equal to those of Sir Ralph Abercrumby, who closed a long life of eminent and meritorious service, by crowns_ ing it with a l signal and brilli an t vict o ry ? (11e4t: hear!) For himself, lie could hot consider either it tlic actions for which Lord Wellington was to he rewarded, as a victory. (Bear ! hear!). Re . would repest Coe assertion, that neither had been followed by any of the consequences of success, neither had they the characteristic of ricoary; bat, on the, contrary, both exhibited every symptom of a : defeat ! (near, hear, hear !) Again he would , repeat his•stationent. Fsxamitie the battle of Ta: lavera. Did you advance ? •Disliou not, on the contrary, retreat in the most disgraceful manner, • and under the must calamitous circumstances (!tear, hear !) yogi not leave at 'relaters sisse.tcsolli part of your army ? As to the 'amount of loss in battle, that c ou ld b e no.proof of tic- . • tory or defeat. But h• should o yes contend, that the advance of Lord Wellin g t o n t o a situation is which his army was in dang e r o f sterling, en" ' he should fight against sup e rior numbers, or mho *disgraceful !light, was a g r e at snilittry ere Or. , The (Mlle had not keen of his deist. 'lle.** otiligettto beta; and if it had not bocci to the tiess, hravery, and discipline oaf the colantim »Q laft he seal forwar+to stfoport the aslraaced ditistuell '