The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser. — London, England, 1808-05-11 00:00:00

mittce, and because I see an utitlerhanil' deter. not, I admit, an avowed one, tope, as and to that COUlillittet. (lino hour! from this (Ippesitiu4 Bench.) 'l'he orewitt Bill Isar another comineudatiou : The Adams% of the City of Lon en is ia its favour, pod otlivr f;orisoratiows breathe the saute spirit. 11'here a ninianre then is so., . pular, :Noble Lords ought to be sure that thc l ir op ration is rot influenced by prejudice or leassion. 1 should Uinta that it mu-t have o r i K i l ud e d to some tnisentimptiou of as of a revolutionaty tendency, ar.d pea-laps the e%preasion of reform, which 1 applied to it on a tower OCCOMOo, may have contributed to excite that ulacm ; but I had TO such meaning. 1 only meant, that the gteater au abu..e is, the sooner it is net:ow:ay to int: AU end to it. as delays only increased ti m e dieivolty. It was in thitt sense I used the word reform." The Eirl'of Mutsu did not thud: that time Bill ought to be rejected - on account of the rejeation of • the foriuer measure, but that it °tight to la...dis cussed upon its own userits. His of to it was, that it could not effect what it proposed to do, and that 110 ground was made out for it. He expected to hear that it would have produced a pc. culinary easing, but no itch attempt was 111:14iP.— lit lisped lie had never sliewn such au anxiety for places for hiinaelf or his connexions, its to subject him to the suepicion of Advocating n sore in the (:o restitution, that drained its strength. If lie a us to be the ailvenate of such a cause, it must he from mental perverseness, or some defect in his mural feeling. What he teamed was, that some connexion should be made out betweYSl the alleged abuse and the proposed remedy, from whence he might see whether the latter was adequate to the purpose. Ile thought he could make nut a lieut.r case in defence of that which was presumed an evil, than hail been mink out in opposition to it. Ile thought the exercise of the Prerogut:ve iii grunt ing Iteversimis a as not extninigance, but ceconoiny. In the t ale of merit so striking into reostire reward, Jtt was pecuniary saving to grout reversiou, in stead of giving money. A Noble Earl (Grosvenor; bad urged the ivecesai ty of correcting old abuses, And he might be charged with defending this prac tire, as oar Of lung stainliitg. At the commence ment of the practice it was, lie admitted, censu nide; because it was giving to the then Kiug both the whole existing patrosiuge and the reversion ; but if, after a lapse of 300 years, the Crown is kit nothing but reversions to grant ; if resersious are all that are left to support the splendour of the Crown, and give it its due weight in the etfusti tation; then it is indecorous riot only% the Crown, but to the rountay, to take away from the Cmnn all dist the country alio.; s for its support. The friends of the Bill have boa.,ted its popularity. It was that delusion which was Htteuipted to be prac tised upon the public he made his princii.al objection. It might have been well to have corrected those abuses ire the first instance, bnt to stop now would be to extinguish the power of tile Crown. It was rust true that it ws.s recomini ruled by the Throne in the speech at the commencement of each toeS. nom The speeches receiumend erconomy, but this was want and waste. Ile shonid rather think that the 'mason, is a cover for oilier inuovatious ; and without meaning any reflection upon the iser sous who Inn I,;lit it in, that, with regard to the ishject proposed, it is merely delusive. His Lord ship expressed his wish that Ilia Majesty'r present Ministers had come forward more decidedly iu expressing their sentiments respecting the pre sent Bill. They had, it is tree, (one Rt. Ilon. Gent. iu particular,) bent their intention to what wascalled the Regulation of the Assessed Faxes, or, more properly, to imposing an addition of taxes, which not only pressed hard upon individuals, but be- Caine an additional heavy burden upon the r oldie at large.: and, by so doing, they had made a kind of set-oft; to divert the attention of the public from the present object of this Bill, which went to the alleviation of the public burdens. by the abolition of sinecure places. His Lordship, then proceeded to call the attention of the I loose to what he con lathers] one of their most sacred duties, to guard against the effects of impeder demote, and to erect a Psllsdieut to the Prerogative of the Throne. when its just rights were attacked by the popular branch of the Leguillitul-e. Such, under 'Reticular circum stances. he considered to be the right of the Crown, with regard to the disposel of places in reversion; mid he notild net but be of opinion, that the public sentiment lead been mooch misled upon the subject, end tonal led to eistertain very exaggerated expecte tioae as to the effects of this measure, as if they supposed that the Bill before the House would prove any favourable acquisition to the public. The Iliad of MORTON said, he did not wish to take up much of the time of the House in express ing his sentiments re-vetting the object of the pre sent Bill. In itself, he thought it would prove in efficacious, Had disappoint the expectations of its promoters. But not only so, his chief objection to the 11111, lee must erifie.s, arose from his viewing it as an is•tack npuli the ',larder x and independence of that Howe of Parliament. Ile, therefore, called upon their Lordships to make a sta n d iri the present instance, enlists's-nog, as he did, that the circumstance attetelnie the introduce.tnn of the pre sent Bill, mod the manner iu which it was pressed upon their Lordehips, after two sisuilar ones. which had been brought up from the forum- House, were rejected, diseovered a spirit of encroachment, which their I..ordships were bound to rein* from every principle of cotaistency 111S41 regard to their Own independence, us well as to the *mud priaciples of the Constitution. He could not Depurate this Bill from the view of the concomitant circumstances at tending its introduction into that House, from the whole of which eirenuistinces. »hit+ his Lordship recapitulated sat some length he declared it as his opinion. that there was a fixed determination in the other House of Parliament to attempt to fume their Lordships to adopt nu opinion in direct op position to what they had forinerly and expressly declared. Upon tine vowel, if there were no other, he should give his express negative to :hie Bill, as he considered it to be a direct attack upon t h e p r ' n ife tz e s and independence of their Lonlships' House. The sooner, therefore, that a stand was Made grille such increasing encroachments, the bett er fo. the (:osistitiition of the country. Lord Hot t. 4 en argued ut somelength in favour t sc the 1 4 / 1 1, and pii..utd oist the varying and mien : ae-t a•.!liteents the Noble Lnhis (Resiesdale Siorto eild of the Noble limed (Moire:. The fanner Noble Lords considered the present Bill as tending to the destruction of the l'onstitution; ou the other !mud, the Noble Earl consi dered the present Bill as a (MI of delusion ; that it held out, and would produce, no substantial re form; and that it held out a mistaken pledge to. this effect to the public. fly It ft it to thole Noble Lords, who scierallj oppo-eil the Bill, to aeule the differences existing betttet-it them on the sub ject. He had on hesitation - in arkitowlet,ting the cousisteuce of those Noble Lords who objected to the Bill ou account of the clamour ap i sh loud been raised • against reversionary grants; ut the same time, he must always think, that the sentiments of the people, when st roitgliexprearetLastbil fuel been in the print instance, from London, 'oreester, &c. ought to carry along uith them astrung recoup. mentlutton in favour of the preskut Bill. &Bowing that the present measure was inefficacious and in &Went, still he could not help thinking that the rejectioteof it world prove impolitic and unwire:— ere the Noble lord, in illustration of his argu ment. entered into au hoitorical discussion of th e cooduct of. the Cortes iu Spain, in the reign of Charles V., and likewise of the British Parliament. in the mime, of Charles I. and James 11. sliewing thereby the flamer arising from Parliament's re sisting tie wishes of the people at large. Lend Sorteas spoke in favour of the Bill. consi dering that it would tenth to strike et the root of that secret influence, which was so injurious to the Feet helmets of the nation. lie also seethed it sue cess, to prevent that Impeller discontent which he was afraid the repeutell rejection of this measure by their Lordships, would occasion. The question being repeateille called "for, it was then put, whets the second reading of the Bill a/ VI carried without a division, and ordered to be reported to-morrow.—Adjourned. NOtTEE or COMMONS. The Chairman of the Gs:summand I..hetinn Committee repo: lee' that the tientlenien Named in the r..tints we r e nut attic elected, and that the ilutiuoraMt: Anzoudian C , :thraae anti %%snails Holmes, Esi "en &tic circled, and that the richt of Election wee vein, d in the Mayor and Burcessce rehi dent and aon•n.:dcnt. T;.c Drpnt Ors}, of the Crown attended Li) order ot the House, sad imam& I the rei ern Ihe thrthir runriderdiou of the Report of the Lunatics Rill us. layered twit Thursday, us the motion of Mr. W. W NTY7C T._ _ The Militia Pay Pill oaa read a third time, and passed. The lin& Pay Bill was read a third tilae, and parsed. The Militia Ailjutaute Bill was mad a third time, and The tilt se million and one million and *half laehrgai r Bills Pdls, s ii. 1 ,, 11.11/11itt d, and Report to Le taken tato tan.•:dt ration to- morrow. Mr. H t rat!.. , s nsuvrd thr or+ r of the day fur the Cone rnittal of Ow Bill for itopossag elutier an ready made corks iinpurted. it was his intention to lower, as a resit:titian, in the 11111 l that there should he had a duty of two shillings eecuv pound oeicht of such corks, with view of pioti etint: tiie raw ntaterte. The re•nlntruu was thru earr:eil, aril the rrport oas ordered to be Liken into cio.si deraiii.ii . I in the 'notion of Mr. WYWWW, the farther consideration of the report MI the Pauper and Ctinietal Lunatics Bill, was !Hotpot. tl until Thonoisr moo. M r %VI, cc to broil :tilt up the report of the Committee on the alt• license dein..., which are agreed to, and a•L'itl war ordered to he larought in at the resolutions. Mr. [luau titan ',permuted s the annual additions to the Nati 111 l al richt, add annual charges Lidded to tire &reit to lit on the Slit 1101 TE POPIIAM. - - - Mr. I,usitterroN .441 far papers relative to the proceedings of the Court of le m i es bench, in the cause of Paxton awl others v. Popham. Ile stated lie a:mid not make any comment., as he understood the motion was not intended to" be oppusvd. Sir llosts POPHAM next rose, bat 'peace in so very low a tone, as to he sourcels audible in the gallery. We, however, niiderstoi:d bin to ay. that for his part lie had no objection to the produc tion of the papers moved for the Hon. Gentle titan--although they referred to a transaction to tally of a private nature. Ile stated, that about twenty years ago he had been engaged is acme niertunitile spceulximis, to one of which the papers now moved for had a reference. With respect to the plea of illegality, which had been entered ou the IN • ,ird, imtlie proceedings of this cause, iu the Court of King's Bench, lie protested his ignorance of such a circumstance, until within a very short period. The cause of difference he had repeatedly solicited to have settled by no amicable arrange mem, or by a refineute to en honourable arbitra tine. He beg‘eil the attention of the lionse to the letter of a Mr. M'Arther. which he read, and which declared the readiness of that person to make affidavit that hr (Sir Hoinr Pophatn) VMS totally unacqueiiiited, either directly or indirectly. with the setting up of such a plea. And he had only, upon his honour as a Man, to declare to that House, that such was the fact. Such en assertion, lie trusted, was sufficient to clear his character in the consideration of that House, and was it perfect abjuration of 'soy moral guilt. It was rather a sur prising circumstance, that on erery question af fecting him. the principles of honour and law were put, by those who arraigtun hint, in a contradictory positi o n. Thus, when the law was in his favour, the objections against him ware,grounded upon the dictates of honour—and when honour ass on his side, he was then opposed upon the prneisious of the law. Mr. LLIBINOTON considered the gallant Cap tain mistakeu in his view of the motives by winch he was actuated in moving for these papers. It was by no means his intesitiou to comical.' the gal lant officer for profiting by any plea, which the law of the, land, as applieshle to his par ticular case, allowed him. The object of the motion, and the necessity for protineingthose papers, were to prove to the lionse, that not only an illegal act had been committed, but that the gallant Offi cer had pursued a ',nitro of thi". kind of traffic, in opprerition to the lan of the Land. With respect to Mr. 111*Awliar, he emp.idered the gallaut in thefte proceeding-. equally ( .o m ,e e t e d with lira ; and lie had only to observe, that it was not a little extraordinary to find the very alio rested his own defence on his ignorance of the iolutinn o f the law, should himself set up upon record the plea of illegality. The great duty he had in view was, to prove to Parliament and the country, that stuns of money had beeu paid to iistliv:chlais, and particularly to the gallant 06r-er, out o f t h e d ro i t , oT the Admiralty, presumed as comptaraitsvue hit 'hisses, arising en tile part of the personsso compen sated, from au illegal course of proeceilitig. Sir HOME POPHAM replied, that it the Hon. Gentleman would be good enough to peruse his memorial with attention, be would find that he was not altogether, at the time when he engaged in the concerns of the antic., convinced of the illegality of that _proccidiug ; and ia his opi nion, the assuuteuance which he had received iu India, almost amounted to au abrogation. And, with respect to the plea of illegality, even if it was true, which was tiot the case, that he bad advised it, still it was to Ir recollected that it was long subse quent to the execution of the original measure. The motion for the production of the papers wa.s then put and carried. Mr. 'AMIN utuN then moved, " That there he laid before that House a Copy of the Memorial of Sir (Lime Popham, praying payment for the pro ceeds of the Etruscs."—Ordered. MESSAGE FROM HIS MAJESTY. The CHANCELLOR of the ExotEnttit brought down from Ills Majesty the following Message : ------ GEORGE REX: the Majesty ends it neremory to state to the House of ('our us, that in consequence of the disastrous defeat of the Prussian army, in August, itt4i, attended with the inc. linieholy death of the then reigning Duke of Brunswick, and the subsequent occupation of his territory by the Frem Ilts 3lajesty's sister, the widow of that illustrious Prince, was compelled to seek au asylum in His Mojesty's dornioions. Immediately on her amiss!, au establishment wm peel/Wed for her, wiled to her exulted rank, and pro- portioned to the extent of her misfortnues, out of the. Civil I.ist. But as nu provisim has been made to make that per itonea:, Has Majesty lool.s to his fo.iliful Commons he a continuance of the csiablishimoit, anal relies upon their hays alty clitoral to appropriate a fund fur defraying the expease► of the soma. The elt.tscitt.t.ott of the EXCHEQUER then ~,,, Ted. " That this Mevon i e be referred to the Committee of Supply to-morrow." ASSESSED TAXES. Mr. WMARTUNI brought up tiie Report on tlie Asseset.xl Taxes Bill. Colonel WANDSLL wisl:ed to know, from the ('it ,cellar of the Exchequer, whether it VMS with tit the 'meaning of that hill, that furnished houses, though hot inhabited, vlinuld be I.abjeat to the pay ment of the duties ? His reason for seeking tlii4 information was that in some districts it wits consi dered they were, w iiihht in others a different opiuiou preceded. The Cliattes:Lt.ua of the Ezettrouta stated, that he would make it his business to make in quiries and then afford the Honourable Gentle wan the information that he sought. It was im possible, at first view, to give a defined answer to such a general question. He further stated, that it was his intention, ou a future day, to bring in a bill fur regulating the collection of the ilutito, and also yontai aaaa ig clauses, tending to relieve, in wane eases, due regard being had to the secu rity of the revenue. Mr. Tress's. thought it rather curious that a tax should tir.t be imirotird on the subject, anti that subsequently he must take his 'Aimee of getting at act of regulatioa for the collection of those ditties. The Report iris then agreed to, and the hill ordered to be reurl a third t . •on Thursday neat. LAND REVENUE OF THE CROWN: Mr. BIEOPLIPAI moved for refernng to • special Committee. the opinions of His Majesty's Attorney au.) Kolicitor- General, iu the year 1772. on th e . sth of the preariat king. with respect to the nlipli anima of the demised hereditary Revenues of the Crown to the aggregate fund. The Hompurahle Member referred to the progressive increase of this revenue, since the accession of His present Ma jesty, and contended that it was Dow of such tin * ;entente as to justify the present motion.- By the report of the Surveyor-General of Laud Heyentre, it was computed to produce a saw of 100,0001. annually. N hat other charges wer now made on this fund, ought to lor a ediuject of inyilai;ation ; praticsderly as the act of the legislature, iti the he gdming of His Majesty's reign, had made its des twat ion precise. and, in ISs opinion, no other charges ought to he allowed but those of insnagrineist. Mr. Rose denied that the annual einount was near so much as was stated by the Honourable Gentleman. They were ut present only computed at 35,00u1. per ammo, :object to • yearly ehurge of from lu. to li,oool. fie eionsideied ti.. Coin., snifter of Finwice fully competent to any invests. Ration of this subject, without the appoiutioeut of a special Committee. Mr. BIDDULPH Made some observations in replv, and declare.' his inteminti to take the sense of dm I Ininte on his motion. h i a division it was nega tived, A”s, I2—.Nuts, 4—Mlom.y, 23. STIPENDIARY CCRATES' BILL. Oo the snot — die Ex- CIIEQVCR that the Stipendiary Curates' Bill be reed • Ntetwit titer. Lord Por.tutsixa rose to express his sentiments en the measure, as he felt it his duty to canvass the merits of a subject in which the interests of so re spectable* part of the commouaity were iinuieali e:ely cooccrued. The present Bill he considered an invasion of the rights anal property of 'tie MeV. lie conshlered the lfill remitted on a false limit conk. namely, that the winnow* of the Altai mit*: of a comic should be 2501. per IIIIUMIS; aS well might it he thought necessary to raise a local mili tia, cousisting of men, six feet two inches in height: for though all might admit the propriety told desirableness of haring such an establishment for the Clergy, and such a local army to die....utl the conistry, yet might it lie equally a mutter of doubt whether there were a sufficient stock of ec clesiastical property to supply such an establish ment for the Chung', as whetter there were a aufil yield population, of six fret two inches high, to fill the ranks of the local militia to the amount of 400,000 Well. All would, no doubt, conapire to wish the two projects might be completed :though all might not have the sasae confidence in the powa belity of their completion. By the present act the House was to assume flint the provision for the de puty should. exceed the average of the supply for the total nomber of efficient elera. Such a lei niewee was, iu his ~p inion, rather a m aximum. lie was ready to contend, with the Honourable Mover, oo the general principle, whether this blllll Should he a salaam. Ile e 43 inclined to believe it should not ; tirst from the pnverty of the benefices them selves, and oiet from the great number of poor persons le A el e . isailetced ts titke'epnlees f or t h. pis ti filksig op these cu. es , mud to :,;ur ea t h e de it, with Itt sales, , s was all object oc 4. • Ills. advantage. Many of those who itow e t ten ! . •the clerical Slate; poset-sed no more p ..): 31 1 perty thine the-coat int yvhicls they were called to the holy offices* and it jrkild certainly not Lie at . sued that perititet of this descriptiou should be facilitated in their progress to that pro. fermium ; nay, it was the direct interest of th e country to pre% cut the door. being more witlo 4 optima to persons of this description. It seemed to them, he acknowledged, like tic' increase iu the value of a few prin., in the clerical lottery, with out diminishing the number of Idunkt. H e thought the present indueemetits end.oelvantaget held out by the Church, saficient to make a M at , happy in u clerical function. Was there any tie s j cessity to employ such powerful machinery its that suggested by the present Bill, for the commetioa of an end so trivial and unsuleitsuitiali It auggen e g a parti a l reform, while the radical defects were mk. fered to continue. He was ashamed of the saint', rigour that had introduced itself into Bit Lipid s . tore, pressing so hardly and mimeo:tinily on the poor infirm incumbent of a living or benefice, com pelling him either to reside on the living, and per form its duties at his adruneell and helpless ag e , or be subject to the provisions of this Act. The nature and gauntest menus of their service: slioeld be taken into consideration ; and in their old age they should not be oppressed by the operation as any legislative Art. The idiom ances for t;ti tate had been gradually Merest:nig nose the time of Queen Anne, at which period it was stated ut .sni. per roineow. He wished to know whether, in point of use, the Incumbent would have the power to assume or refuse the Curate's stipeurt, as ap . poioted by the Bisleip, should the Curate be u:s. willing to reside on the Curacy ? Three mouths were, lie observed, ,signed by the Bill fur the 10. cumbent to choose whether t he would reside on his benefice or not. If one day were luA in his determination, the consequeuce was, he must as sign the person he had 1. ;.at reason to object to, as his assessor. Were the posts of the church so hke those of a garrison, that there was no relanatnai to he e,iveit in the attendatire of its Members I 11'its it supposed that the moment the Person had left his house, an evil spirit took possessiou; hut the moment lie returned the enchautment wits at end, and all things were restored to their original state ? Ile thought it extraordin ary thut should the incumbent by nny means be detain. d on his progress to his benefice, that there must it)-tautly be saddled on hits a man whom he had every reason to dislike, as being the Anti-p.e.e within his hieing, though nominally only his Cu. rate, or as a Ltenticuiau of too proeineal a mode of living was stanetimes found to be accompanied en his own estate by a tipstaff or common bailiff—such a mode of treatment he considered injurious to the interests of' the Clergy. Ile thou& the Hon. Member, in extending the provision to -2SOi. annually, had overshot the mark vastly, The Clergy, as the Hight Hun. Member himself knew, frotu the success which liis application had when the generul cry of " The Church in danger" wits raised so rapidly and effectually through out the kingdom, possessed II very extensive in fintioce, and therefore should not be lightly treated crest by a Minister of State. The induce ' tarots to enter the clerical function were, he con eidered, sufficiently great to the * idle orders of society ; mid Com time middle ranks were to be dr two the g reat resource, and intelligence of the kingdom. Ettint thut order, exertion and energy had milieu, the spirit of British indepeutleuce and British liberty. It was therefore wrong to raise is that body of men a hope that was not likely to he realised, and which, if realised, it was probable would never prove of uriventime to the Church Fartahlialiwent. The clause. wiliels gave power to the Bishops were of unwind rigour sod severity, whilet tile•e its &vet:reit' the Clergy - wise lax and fertile; front these considerations he was iuchned to move, as an ametidnient, " That on the hind', being moved to i.e committed en a cerium day, the wools' that tiny three months lie imbetitated:" 'Mr. 11'1'i ell SW supported the aineudnieut of his Noble Friend. tie thoa3ht the principle of the Bill we** erroneous, and the means of effectiug it improper end injuiliciotou Not that he opptaeol the propriety of the alteration in favour of toe Clergy--lout he saw, with his Noble Friend, Ito means of remedy mug the eviL lie admitted the I..egislatore ass vouipeteut to mote any change., it this'll* proper ; but all those changes might uotwithstateliug, be ittespeslient. Het/sought the principle of treating the clergy as were pubbe functionaries was extremely dangerous. Their prrewrty, he easisidereil„ should be inviolate. Ile . was no friend to the new innossiting principle o f these diet-, renderiug the elitireh's possessions subject to any lunovation iii politics, or ministerial caporal. It was, no doubt, true, that, for the holding places of emolument under the prevent establishment of the Church, there were certain dutust to bet fuldlled--jet it was rather a matter of thitilit e witty what degree of jiistice the. Legisla ture mightiaterfere in the atijuvtmeut or allotment of those dugs,. 'flit Conch should be very jea lous of Any sorties of encroaelsitectit, from the r.-- collection of the smuttier iii who h it had beet) treated during the• emote of the religious rewslutsue of this country, when the Chtneli was gradual:; stripped of allow.; AI its valuable pririleees, imm.,- iiities, awl wealth. It would affect but a v. ry MaUll pertiou of the church eolunounitY. sod . tcl• hops not improve the roodition of tiny . . The bill displeyeti a wish to innovate, aithout clip- Tort-ring ability . to return or reffrom the grey mice it complai.nd . of. While pluralities wee admitted, it was ridiculous to talk of ro foreiog tile malmsey of the elerge, cacti.' the muse law 'would provide slime tarsus . 4 making the iiicumhent present in two different places at once. Ile entitentie.l, that the addition e, salter would never render the Curate respect tuba • if he were uut alreoly so. The plan of inerettou e the incline of the Curate, for the purpose of too 1-Ming l:ini with the nseasui of displaybig a 1.0.1. , - table dise.osition, suited to toe clerical clotrati , -, might have availed the Mover of the Bill in ins inor.: , uncivilized state of the world, whoa t!'erit were no other means of procuring ssvietavver end snit-our for tlo: weary traveller.; but hespitaloy ass not a tirtuc of the present times ; to it II maim , t • • J