The Statesman. — London, England, 1818-04-28 00:00:00

II * to procure sigeatuees by private em.pdro representa tions, the Petitions were not a matter of so r priee.— The advocate% of the Bill dealt in general assertions which it was dilficelt to disprove, bee which had been uniformly disproved when they had beers founded on fungible statements. It was said that children, in cotton-mills -were inferinr to other children—l. in Education; -2: in Morals ;--and, s. its Health.—• It bad been proved in opposition to this, that ,the number ot children employed in mills, who. at tended Sunday Schools- at Manchester, was equal to that of other children ; that their morata"Areie as good, and it would have been strange if habits of order, Weepy, and regularity had produced immorality. As. to their health, if the House, in stead of looking _to opinions without any facts stated in seppart of them, looked to the facts them• selves, an d t o opinions founded on an examination of them, they would find that else statements respecting their health were as devoid of truth, as those respect. ing thvit• illocution and morals. In the Manchester House of Recovery, the patients who had beets em. played its cotton-mills were as one to twelve to those engaged in other occupations. In the Infirmary, in Feb:•1817, the patients who had been employed in cotton-mills were as one to six to others. In March, 1818 , , , the in-patients' who had bees' employed in cot ton-mills wen as one to eleven, the out-patients as one to five or six to those who had been otherwise employed. The Honourable Member quoted also the evidence of Dr. Bordsley, Dr. Symonds, and Dv. hardy, in support of the opinion that the children were healthy. Mr. Ransom, an eminent Surgeon, said, that from thirteen years observation in the Manchester Inhrmary, Ise found the children who had two employed its cotton-mills much less subject to glandular swellings, scrophola, and white swellings, than the weavers. The Surgeon of the Manchester Workhouse stated, that he had bad a prejudice against factories ; bat that if hie experience in the workhouse might be taken as a rest, they were more healthy than other children ;—he supposed, therefore, that cleanliness and ventilation made up for the Iligedrintage6 of their situation. As to the Right Honourable Gentle man's remarks on the statement of deaths in Mr Finlay's factories, it was to he recollected, that the children there were all at the healthiest period of life—[llear, hear 1] —neither was it stated that the numbers mentioned were all who had died. They were ell whose deaths were recollected. Mr. Sendford's evidence had beets referred to, but the most material fact stated by him had been omitted, vit. that when five hundred persons et a Sunday School bad clubbed a certain sum for their support in case of sickness, the sum drawn out in the year by those employed in cotton-mills was 2s. Ofd., the sum drawn out by the others, 3s. ld. for each. The per sons employed in cotton-mills bad not the violent la bouv and occasional long hours, and occasional idle. ness of persons employed in some other branches of manufactures. Their labour was light, their hours and wages uniform—they suffered less than others in bad years. They were better fed and better clothed, and more healthy than other manufactories. Similar attempts to interefere with the labour of manufactories had always heed mischievous. The regulations eats.' blished by Parliament for the Spital. fields weavers had drive, the silk manufacture to Cheshire. If a sinstlar measure to that how proposed for the spinners had been applied to other branches of the cotten trade, what would have been else consequence? When the weavers were working 16 hours a day for small wager, if Parliament had stepped in and said, "you shall only work 10 hours—you shall not receive less than so mach wages," what would have been the conse quence? They would have been starved into re. bellies. Whereto, by their persevering labour at that low rate they had done what no one could have en. ticipated. By the low prices t which they had worked, they had crashed the manufactures of the Continent, and established their own superiority. Ile contended that all the manufactories throughout the kingdom were in very good condition, notwithstanding th. representations of the supporters of the Bill. He alluded particularly to those in Lancaster, where, as appeared from the returns of the Committee ot. the Poor Laws, the number of persons who teceised parochial relief was less than in any other of the counties, with the exception of Cumberland. It they applied their attention to other branches of ma nufacture, they would find as great abases; if they looked even to agriculture, they would find wet sea sons producing chronic diseases; in the misses she. would also discover multiplied causes of complaint. The Speaker himself, sitting in that chair, PR' through more labour in a single tieseion calculated to impair his health, than the people in a well-regulated factory eadured for the whole year.— [A laugh ]— Confinement, he would allow, must have an effect upon the complexion—it had in that House. They had not within their walls the ruddy complexiou of the husbandman, except in a few instances.—[A laughl—The temperature of the factories was stated to be very high. Mr. Molesworth had represented it as not more 74 degrees, even for the finest spinning; but even taking it from 70 to 80, the excess was not very great, particularly whets it was recollected that the numbers employed in this fine spinning, which required so much heat, did not exceed 600 or 700 persons. One of the great evils of the Bill was, that it went to encourage a spirit of combination in the workmen. The Petitions in favour of it went to provoke that spirit, and were obtained, in most in stances, from disorderly workmen in public-house committees. If they agreed to this they would be assailed with applications from every other manufac tory, and it would be impossible to draw a distin guishing line between them. Mr. B. WILBRAHAM stated, that the Petitions were signed by the Clergy and Magistrates, who were sell acquainted with the facts represented; and that the evidence of the Medical Gentlemen was in favour of the regulation proposed. The possibility of similar applications from other manufactories should have no effect with the House, if they thought that its the present instance it was right to adopt it.— After what the House had already done in the case of Chimney-sweepers, he hoped they would not use glect the case of people, who though they were more removed from their observation, had not less claims upon their humanity. Mr. W. SMITH thought that the best way to pm. vent combinations amongst workmen was by redress ing their real emotes. Ile believed that the sues- lit7f4P THE STAI : sure would ..not • iniere the, cyttott . iFectories, and therefore he would support it. The Hnese was called en to legislate ;on two . tantiible petals...the ages of the persons employed, and the boars em- Cloyment. He ag r eed i n th e utility of employing hildren, but vivid not. egree that it was proper t• employ leftists for a longer time each _day than was req. , ired from adults in the most wholesome occo. pa tions. Mr. FlNLAY.opposed the Bill, and niaintained that it would not have the effect which wa s i n t en d e d by the Moser. Instead of operating as a re li e f t o he childretremployed in factories, it .would drive theist to other permits morelabortous and unhealthy. The only. Petition from Scotland came, he observed, from Mr. Owen's manufacturers, whose working hours had been reduced to ten hours and-s-half a-day. They 'were naturally anxious that the same regulation should become general. It was to be recollected, however, that it was by the labour of oar People we were enabled to go n ith such atlean. tars into the •foreign market ; and we should be careful, lest by legislating upon impressions and feel- togs, we should endanger the interests of the coun try in so important a matter. Mr..J. SMITH spoke in favour of the Bill, and stated that the diminution of working hours was at tended with no disadvantage in the establishment of Met Owen at Lsnark, where the peoi.le did as much in ten hours and-a-half as was dune by any other factory in fifteen. Mr: FINLAY explained. Mr. ROBINSON had no apprehension that the Bill wriold be injurious to the particular trade, and feared only its extension to other trades. lie should object generally to the interference of Parliament, hut in this instance, he thought, tnat even by the admi4sion, a sufficient ell4e was made oat. Lord STANLEY attempted to address the House. hot its impatience prevented hint from twine heirtl; a division wits then called for, and the Gallery was cleared aceordiugly. The numbers were— For the Amendment 26 I API I I , II it 91 When we were re-admitted to the Gallery, we found the House in a Committee on the Bile, and Mr. FINLAY protesting against proceeding at this late hour ; he moved that th • Chairman should re port progress, and ask leave to sit again. After a con►ersation of con•i.'erable length, in which Mr. Lambton, Sir F. Barden, Mr. Peel, Lord Stants7, Cir. J. Macintosh, and Mr. Lenin, took a share, it was agreed ►hat the Chairnan should report progress, and that the Bill should be re-committed this day. Sir ROBERT PEEL observed, that having given way once or twice to the opponents of the measare, he hoped that upon the present understanding no ob jection would be made. on the renewal of the discus sion, to the Speaker's leaving the Chair. The Labourers' Wages Bill was rend a second time, and ordered to be conattitted no Wednesday. The Report of the Saving 13.stoks Amendment Bill was received, and the Bill ordered to be re-committed this day se'nnight. Upon the motion for the second reading of the Loa.l Bill, Mr. GRENFELL observed, that there west chute in this Bill, of which he believed few who heard him were aware—namely, that upon the mere deposit of three per cent. stock towards the new Loin, the Bank were to receive t;1001. fur etch and upon the deposit of Exchequer Bills 400 1 . pe► m►l lion. This was an esureineance of remoner lion for whet could scarcely be called a 'rouble, gale notice of his intention to oppose mom decidedly in the Committee, the adoption of a clause so incooti•t. cut with public justice and squity. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, this clause was so materially interwoven wish the Bill, that he felt it hit duty to support it. NEW LOAN. Mr. GRENFELL asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether it was intended that thaw, who subscribed towards the new Loan should be at liberty to fund the whole of their subscription, or only a part, as it suited their inclination ? The CHANCELLOR, of the EXCHEQUER veplied, that it would he at the option of the sub scribers to fund the whole or any part of their sub scription. Mr. GRENFELL said, that a great deal of agi tation Ind this day been created among the monied interest in the City, by such conduct on the part of the Bank, as appeared likely- to interfere very much with the Right Iloootirahle Gentleman's new plait, for the Officers of the Bilk had declared, that of the lb'. three per cents. which were to be lodged to morrow, they would not accept any deposit, but in the names of the subscriber- themselves. Now as it happened that many subscrihers held stock in the names of their Bankers, while others were out of town, great inconvenience was likely to result from this regnlation ; which, iodee.l, if enforced, must render several unable to make good their deposits. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said it was true that a Gentleman from the City had, just before he came to the House, complained to him of the regulation alluded to by the lionourahle Gentleman. The Officers of the Batik were cer. taiuly correct in refusing to accept a deposit of stock from any but the subscriber himself, or some one acting for him under a power of attorney. But the inconvenience apprehended by the Rouourable Gen. demon, he would endeavour to remedy by the intro duction of a clause into the Loan Bill Meantime he calculated that the progress of the subscription would not be impeded by what, after all, although correct in its motive, was but a mere matter of form. The Bill was read a second time, aad committed for this day. The other Orders of the Day were disposed of, and the House adjourned at hell after One o'Clock. Scots EcoNosty.-I'he Bill respecting the Once of Lord Justice General of Scotland is now prioted, from which it appears, that Ministers have no inten tion of abolishing this acknowledged sinecure; but that, on the death of the Duke of Montrose, the pre sent possessor, who is to receive the fell salary of 20001. a-year during his life, it is to be given to the Lord President of the Court of Session, for the time r being, with the diminished &story of 10001. The income of the Lord Prerjdent will. thee amount to 56001. per annum, which is 10001.. a-year more than the salary of the Chief Justice of England, who has also to Faisal the laborious duty of the Circuits... -~ I.rc APPE 4 4.Ia, of Dl i tti t i E tlovu .bift oft - JAMES O'REILLY. BROTUER 01111:0 HEIR AT paw OF BRYAN O I REILLY, ESQ .DYCEttlfp, MAPIPICLL,ART— THOAS CLANCUY, , DEFENDANT- I• Thursday, at the 4itting the Court rifilEihes Bench, the Defendant was called up for jatrigmevit ; the Appellant appeared in ;Arson. )-: The CRI . EY JUITICE stated the .Declaration and Appeal, an Fl the plea of the Defendant, that he was Not Guilty, and theil he would pro -e the same by his body. To dist ()let the Appellant has put in a counter-plea. of an indictment found for th: , PRIMP offence; and no doubt according to the authorities in Stamford, Hawkins, and 4141e- 1 -such plea, if properly pleaded, is a good bar to the weer of Wale!. The question is, whether it has been pro perly pleaded in this instance. Many excepkions have been taken to that counter-plea—but theie is one which has struck the Court, and which has not been adverted to by Counsel on either side. I do not mean, observed his Lordship, to say what weight it may have, but we do not think it would he proper to decide upoo it either way without giving Coun sel on both ;Ides on opportunity of considering it.— Aticording to the precedent in Rasta!, the Appellant, after. sting the fact of an indictment being found, prays a writ of Certiorari, directed to the Clerk of the Peace, : o bring up the indictment. That indict. ment his accordingly been brought op and put upon the reri.td, before demurrer, filed with proper aver mett.s its to identity of persons and crime, hut it Inerels says that the indictment and presentment was " fund and made" by 46 good and lawful men" of the county of W...meath, sworn, &c.; and doe, not set forth OF names of the Grand Jurors who (no 1,(1 the' ill. F nn various authorities,which his Lordship cmti -..4d, it does not appear necessary to mention the names of the Grand Jurors; but it should ap pear that the bill of indictment was found at least by twelve men. Now, whether the word Grand July, ex ri termini signifies at least twelve men, is a question which we would wish to be argued without at present (ourselves) declaring an opinion either way, or on the topics already urged. Counsel for the Appellant will also consider whether, if the same be erroneous for want of mentioning that the indict. meat was found by twelve men at least, the record can be amended in such instinct., and will make such application for that purpose as he may think proper. In the mean time the Prisoner must be remanded. Mr. At.t.rx —My Lnrd, I feel the force of what your Lordship hos said, and humbly think the matter well deserves an argument. There are cases in ap= peal were amendments hove been permitted, and if auy nmendment could he made in any case, I con• ceive tl.is is that ease—because the Returning Officer shnul'l have mentioned those names. The omiggion, if at all material, is the act of the Officer and not of Counsel, and there is *notching to amend by. Mr. M'NALLY.--This is a criminal case, and I can consent to amendment. If I did, I must with. drew the demurre►. ThP COURT.— thivP you any objection to eongeni that the Prittener be remanded until the second day of nest Term ? Mr. M•NALLY—I have already aaifl I can can. sp t ,t t•• n t oh;,,,—for and l think I can prove, 'hat there have bean already three disconti nuance:. Mr. ALLEN—The rerord, as mode up, will show whether "r not such diser , nrinualtre has taken place. The Court have declared that they will not at present give judg.nent, 4.0, at my own peril, I more the Court that the P , i‘t/ner may be remarrarrd until the ' ,proud day of neat Term, that the Court may fur 'her rooro,ler the case before they pronounce judg men , and that I may have an orportunity of consi dering the points which the Court has been pleased to I.ag,test. hfoiion granted, and the Prisoner accordingly re. minded. LAW INTELLIGENCE. COURT OF KING'S BENCH, APRIL 27. THE JUNO r FRANCIS GORE, VSQ. Mr. Serjei.nt COPLEY espressed itisrearet that in this cas• the Prosecutor, Dr. Thorpe, had not been able to come to any understanding with the Defendant, Dr. Thorpe insisting that General Core should sign tie name to a paper, stating that he did not believe any of the cliree4 in the libel to be true: to thi. proposal General Gore could not assent; he did not wish to re.assett what was stated in the libel, but to remain neuter. Mr SC IIILETT obaerved, that the cue on a pre. sinus day had stood over, in orsler that Get,. Gore might declare that he hid had no concern in the cir culation of the pamphlet in question, excepting as far as was sworn 1/POll the trial. Mr. Seripaht CAPLET replied, that the condition t i e had mentioned hail been superadded in a paper olTered to General Gore, and he was consequently under the necessity of applying for tht , judcraent of the Court upon the motion he made on Saturday week for a new trial , on the ground that the commu nication by General Gore to Mr. Serjentit Firth (the publication alleged in the indictment) was privileged and official, Serjearit Firth being at that time Attor ney-General of Canada. Lord ELLENE.IROUGH said, that under the circom strticel, it might be expedient to grant a rule Nisi for a new trial. IN THE MATTER OP GEORGE PAGE, A BANKRUPT. On a former day Mr. NIARRYAT ohlaine I R writ of Habeas Corpus, to bring up the body of George Page (this name was by mistake printed John Payne, in the Statesman yesterday), a bankrupt, on the ground that he had been informally committed, first. by Mr. Birnie, the Magistrate, and otroeward% by certain Commissioners under an award of blnkrtiptcy ; the objection to the commitment by Mr. Birth. was, that it did not pnrsue the terms required by the Sta tute, and the abjection to that of the commissioners was that it referred to certain questions which the bankrupt had refused In answer, when, in fact, no questions had been pot to him either in writing undar the Ist Jac. I. or via' voce. under the sth Geo. 11. The Habeas Corpus was granted on the 18th Awl!, end while it was pending the C .mmissioners issued a new warrant to the keeper el Ne.acate. The bankrupt L _ay.sig - 0 'II trio day placed upon the Roar ) Mr. M4ltitiCAT to.)lty , otojections iu sup- • w ..- . . 1 ' r *„ • port 9f his motion, that. he be disc errcl, e Vie/ that, supposing the two mit commitments to bi - • illegal, the defect could not be remedied pending the discussion of the writ: the Commissioners could not build a good .detainer (supposing their second warrant to be so) upon .1 illegal..COmmi!teeyyt. fie submitted, however, that even the detainer itself, issued since the granting of the, writ, wee inasmuch as the commissioners did not state their julisdiction, by betting out 'our refetrlog t 6 thred. judication of bankruptcy ageing( Page. Lord ELLENe t aitouvir observed that. supposing all the proceedings defectise under the llith sect. of the ;sth George 11, the Court had the power, If it saw region,' to tecisawnit the beekoupt, and ter meted the wterrant. Mr. MAISISTAT contended that the 18th sect. only reffrred to informalities in the warrant, and not 0 suisstantisl ohljections like those taken in this ease; HE also tirged - that the Court could not take oodles of the adjudication of bankruptcy. The Court was however, I.f opinion, that ti•e • jection was . one of form, and not of substsirce h m4 that, as the hanimsiptcy was admitted by Page lie alhitsvit, the Court could take notice of it. ales MARkYAT then took an ot.jectitip to st question, which in the second warrant •.f thiferownshl.• sinners was stated to have been put to the trasikrupt's it respected 'helium of 16001. which it was alleged the bankrupt had received from the silo of his stock as silk-mercer in Cranbourne•ally. Mr. Marryal ar. geed from the form of th• question, that it wis in. tended to entrap the bankrupt, which Lord C J. de Grey had held to be illegal. He insisted also, that though, under the Statute Jai. is the bankrupt might be committed for refosiee to answer' written integre. Footles, yet . he could not be committed for refusing to answer rico roce qnestions, Hutch less for refusing tto be sworn, which was what the bankrupt had done in this case. The Court, however, 'sifter hewing Mr. ANDILEWS on the same side, and without hearing . Mr. ScARLErr and Mr. Citirry on the other side, recommitted .the bankrupt, on the ground that, supposing the werranta to be illegal (which did not appear), the Court had the power of amending them, anti mitring 'Lem More format, according to the provisions of the Statute. At two o'clock Lord ELLENsoitouott sat at Nisi Prins. DUTCH MAIL. --.•- FROM THE FRENCH FRONTIRIII.—We Free front Catrihrav, that several of the Doke of Wellitigtou's Aid-de-(;amps are already gone to London, a9dthat the Duke va as espected to go these before the the month. It was affirmed that the issue of the gociatiens will be communicated to the Chamber. be. fore the end of the Sessinn ; and it was hoped that the communication would not belong delayed Many or the cantonment, of the troops of the right wing of the Army of Occupation, that is of the Bri. tich tf 00 0. hove been cilsoged for the relief of the in. : habitants of the country —a meas u re for w hi c h they are highly indebted to the Doke Wellington.--s F-orn the centre motor detachments P essian troops have returned home. but they have • P. n osmediately reptarell by an equ .1 number of troops tr 'm the Prat,. bleu Provinces on the Rhine. BRUsSELI, APRIL T2.—The correspondence he. I viPPil Paris and the Hagr.e continue. to he spry fre. quent, it is stated to relate in a great rreaaure to the _e s D 11. ! enquiry, whe'her the attempt upon the 111 k f Wet . lington was planned in the Netherlands. The At. torney •General has caused several persons its this sty to he minutely interrogated. The Frenchmen who have been put into close confinement are not yet released, and nothing seems to be yet decided upon respecting them. Centilitre, who is accused at Paris of having fired the pistol, belonged come time ago to a company of French players here, who per. formed a few times in the Park, but were soon obliged to cease by orders from superior authority. By letters received yesterday from Bilinear, dated the 18th instant, it appears, that the numerous sea• eels from the Baltic detained there, wind.bound, for England, laid at last been enabled to put to sea.—X vessel laden with grain was Inst on the B'h instant, near Ystadt, hut the crew was happily saved. The Neapolitan Gazette contradicts the reports of numerous robberies in the Roman States, and adds, that a few outrages which have been committed took. place on the Neapolitan frontier. Ac to the interior of Nitres, the roads are rendered perfectly secure by military posts. The operations undertaken, in common by the Austrian and Sicilian General Staff along the coast of the Adriatic, from the river Front° to Cape Leuca, a distance of above 4.)() miles, for the purpose of laying down a maritime chart, are nearly terminated. Yesterday, as a Gentleman from the country was about to enter Tattersall's Repository for horses at Hyde PArk.cortier, a friend cautioned him to take care of his pockets; the Gentleman instantly disco. vered that his pocketbook, containing noto-: and niils to the amount of shout 20001, 4C s : h^ re. collected, that the last time lie had it was in a hack. noy-coach, and that he had pot it on the seat of the coach. He discharged the coach at the e•id of Piccadilly, hut (lid not know the number of it ; be ran him k to Piccadilly with all possible speed, but couid find no trace of the coach; he pur(oed his en. &airport, hut in vain, for a considerable time. At length he went to Bow-street (Are, to give informs. tiro, of his great loss. It was their four o'clock ; and Adkins, the officer, started to use bis exertion's for the recovery of the treasure, and was so forte• nate as to have the pocket-honk, with the whole. of the valuable contents, in his posses4on at a quarter h.fore five o'clock. On the officer presenting the lost property to the owner, his joy must he more pai.ily conceived than described ,• and he at the same limo expressed his admiration of the exertions of the officer. It does not appear whether he pee Lim any 'deg ,ate reward. We have this week to announce to our ntimerooe readers, that the Grand Jrtry, at the Livery tot Quarter Sessions, which commented on Mewls y last, found a true bill against Jesciph Nadin, Modle.th and J. Prinnott, Police Oifir , rs of thif town, for a Conspiracy. Aoy comment in this (set, woo for the pres'nt be considered itnproper.---(Man• Chester Observer.) ' S 1 1' . . t ; t t - : . . 1;, 4 1 ,