The British Press; or, Morning Literary Advertiser. — London, England, 1825-02-16 00:00:00

■ ■ ■ that he heard from the 'servant at the library that it was - a beak often inquired after, end very much wished for. (Great imaginer.) Mr. B Mr. Alderman RIDGES said, that he felt called upon to sup port the present measnre, for he was assured that if the Bill now before the House shenld not be passed, it would soon be brought forward in another sliape, and sooner or later it would be carried. e should be inclined to use every exertion in his power to devise a means of effecting the quiet of Ireland, and of meeting the Con stitutional demards of the Catholics. He was not of re et those who considered, .that as soon as men ranked on the side of Ministers they necessarily were opposed to the interests of the Catholics. He ttoold not help deprecating the conduct pursued by lion. Geotienien tin the other side of the House, who seemed to consider that the principles of Gentlemen, the moment they got into office, were af fected by the change, and that they acted in direct contradiction to their former professions. As an instance of this indefensible mode of argument, duty had thought proper to make a most intemperate and violent attack upon the Lord I I i ghChancellor of England; a man whom he (Alderman Bridges) most highly respected and esteemed, not only for his consummate legal knowledge, but also for Ilia great iiitegtity, his unswerving justice, and his public and private virtues, and nib ) he long live to confer the benefit of his judgments on his ho on ntry, which, when he dies, will sustain a loss not soon to be re psid. " Integer vita, aceleris que putus, Non eget Mauri jaeulis neque area." Mr. PASCOE GRENFELL said, that as the Citholic As sociation had been shown to be prejudiciai to the real interestsof the people, and especially to the Catholics of Ireland, and as it had been proved that it had, in point of fact, been known to interfere with the administration of justice in the country, lie was one who condemned these mischievous acts, and who, for one, should be in clined to see some measure adopted for checking these proceedings t be Should therefore vote for the introduction of the Bill now betore the House, with the hope that it would effectually put an end to this illegal and unconstitutional interference on the part of that oody, with due dispensation of the laws among the people of the country. What other conduct he might adopt when the details of the Bill came before the House, would be entirely regulated ac seeding to the nature of the different provisions and enactments of which those details would consist. He had had along parliamentary experience; during the whole course of the three-and-twenty years he bad had the honour of a seat in that House, he had in-' variably and uniformly advocated the Catholic Claims, and he eer cooly should now persevere in that line which he had, for so long a - tublic life, pursued. Whenever and wherever the question of the • •: -bould be argued in his presence, would he be tOwnst --, on the subject. Certain as lie was that nothltste could satisfy, and nothing ought to r,) these demands of the Catholics but the some gentlemen called Catholic Ernancipa- Concession, bat which he would ever call hear,) he should ever contribute his ofnhat House, in aiding them to get and of man, they were most justly en- . the real facts , and contemplate them im- Ai less than six millions of men, the great injured, oppressed, and actually trampled Could such a state exist it—Was It to be ' that these sit millions of Catholics would &mints, and bear patiently this mark of them ? They never would submit ; they anceasingly r..tst ; and he trusted they might continue to re- Mat until these shackles were removed. (Hear, hear.) Coming as he was towards the wane of a long and anxious life, when on the bed of death, his last prayer should be offered up to Almighty God, that if the Catholics did resist they might be successfuL (Hear, hear, hear.) Mr. ROBERTSON said, that If the Catholic Association was illegal andunconatitutional—if the State should be deemed to dp.l rive greater benefit by its suppression than by its being su ff ered to exist, then he shoul d say that the present Bill should proxed ; but if, on the contrary, this Association were capable of conferring greater good than harm by its operations, then he would say it ought to be upheld. It was upon this principle that Government ought to set. This Association had been spoken of in connexion with others, but there was no parallel between this and other WO. I Liatiol7% Each ease ought to be judged of by its own eircum.... stances. The Right Honourable Secretary for Ireland had stated, that the landed gentlemen of Ireland stood opposed to IL: Catholie Rees This, then, was, as it appeared to him, the efficient cause et the Bill now before the House. The grievances of the Homan Ca.; %holies could not be kept out of view in the discussion of this quen. tion ; and one of those grievances he conceived to be the tithe sys. tent which prevailed in that country, and by which the peasantry were oppressed. If the landed gentry did their duty to the pm.. • !vary, we should not now be called upon to put dawn this Associ ation. They seemed rather to encourage than to cppose the spirit that was working among those distressed men. lie (Mr. Robert bur) was of opinion, that these restless feelings among the hien orefers of Irishmen were not owing to the Catholic Clergy—they I were the friends of the peasantry, and did not recenve front them one tenth of the produce of their labour, which they had a right to do. 1 What then became of the excess not received by the Catholic priesthood ?—Why it had been put into the pockets of the tithe owners. Recce arose the oppression and the misery of the pea santry of Ireland. H e did not stop to inquire whether it was the middleman, or the fourth or fifth man, who collected these tithes ; the evil was fairly traceable to the landed interest of Ireland, who did nothing to oppose the exactions that were made under the sanc tion of this system. Here. then, might Honourable Gentlemen see • one of the causes of the.callection of the Catholic Rent. It was to sup* this neglect on the part of the landed interest in doing did: deity, and to return, in some little degree, the' 'money to those from whom that most rigorous a-d oppressive tithe system had drained their hard earnings. 'file Honourable Member for New Ross (Mr. L)ugtterty) had entered into a fall statement of the conduct pursued by the administrators of the bier towards the Catholics. lie (Mr. Robertson) believed that the law was purely and properly administered; but what had that to do with those who had no WOWS by which to obtain the advantages of the law ? After alluding again to the indifference of the landed gentlemen of Ireland to the operations of the tithe system, the Hon. Gentleman declared his belief to be, that concession would heat no earthly good effect, further than by giving them strength to demand more, and more must be given to their. Eainneipation alone would not give peace to Ireland. The lion. Gentleman then al luded to the observations that bad been made on the Revolution of Scotland and the triumph of the Kirk over the Episcopal Church, but which he said was brought about by the total annihilation of the party which kept Scotland in a continual state of disturbence; thn Representatives of that country having entertained the sante sentiments with the people, their interests were consulted, and that was the cause of the quiet of Scotland. The lion. Gentleman, after adverting to some observations made by the Right lion. Gentleman IMr. Plunkett) favourable to the character of the Ca- • th.ilic Priesthood, observed, that if the Legislature did not grain the Catholics those concessions which they Owned they would soon take it; they were growing sarong and powerful, and this country had better concede while it had the power, for the time might come when that power would no tenger exist. From these feelings he' was opposed to the putting down the Association by compulsion. lie war fee putting it down certainly, but by a very different mode from that proposed by the present Bill. He ninth' suppress the Catholic Association by concession, but by no other means. The 31inisters were now strong, and powerful ; there was no tear that there could be any misconstruction of the inotire or ground upon which this concession would be grouted. At a future shun perhaps, the Catholics, who would be gra:ef.:l now, would not he thankful for the boon. tie was, therefore, for putting the A....4r thin down 11 repealing laws, and not by enacting new (Hear, bear Sir Jell NEWPORT said, that be had adolteesed the House AO open, that he was bat very litaltlizttered by the hope of adding anything new to the subject. He rose principally with the inten tion of stating to the House. that after all which he had heard on the question, and after all that he had observed, he was more con e/Mad than mar that while we 000tinued to refuse Emancipation diP the Gethollea, and persevered in getting this Bill passed into a most distinct sad emphatic manner, ate he considered the Priesthood were uniformly the friends of peace and good order. He had also said, or if he had neglected before to do so, he now said, that though he did not consider two thousand priests ' at the head of thirty thousand collectors, as matter for much alarm, concluding that those priests were ready or inclined to become the agents of mischief; yet he considered it one of the most mischievous effects produced by the existence of the Catholic Association, and the collection of the Rent, that it diverted the attention of this valuable body of men front their sacred duties, and involved them in polities and party feelings. Sir J. NEW resumed. He was gratified to hear the ex planations which had fallen from the Right Honourable Gentle men opposite. At all events, it was admitted, that they held con trary opinions, Dot only with respect to the character of the priest hood, but also as regards the influence of the priesthood in pro ' clueing the tranquillity, which it was admitted on all hands now reigned throughout Ireland. But to go to other fac:s—the name of a Mr. Devereux had been mentioned. It was stated, that it was extremely improper for the Catholic Association to receive Mr. Deveveux with warmth and applause*, because lie had been a member of die Catholic Committee in 1792. The House ought to know, however, that in the subsequent year, 1793, the Catholics of Ireland thought it necessary to send a deputation to wait upon his late Majesty, of which deputation Mr. Devereux was one. This deputation was introduced by his Maj esty ' s Ministers, and most graciously received by the King. Gentlemen at the other side of the House, atlected a great veneration for the memory of the late King, and may not the Catholic Association turn round and say to three Gentlemen, we received Mr. Devereux with respect, and he was treated in the same manner by his late Majesty, when he was introduced by a Member belonging to his Majesty's Go. vernment. (Hear, hear.) An Honourable Gentleman opposite had observed, that lie would nut so much censure the Catholic Association, if they had associated at a period a hen Orange So cieties were in strength and activity, but that they had waited until the Orange Societies were beaten down by the Marquis AVel lesiey's Administration. He (Sir J. Newport) denied that this was the fact. When the Catholic Association commenced its die. cussiuns, the Orange Societies were not beaten down; they were then vigorous and triumphant, and their members were to be found boasting that they had doubled their numbers sirfte the House had endeavoured by a legislative enactment to put them down. (Hear.) At this very period, an Honourable Gentleman had stated in that House, that now the oaths were takes away from the system, he saw nothing objectionable in Orangvithe and should become an tereagetuan hipasele It was notorious too, theta leader, an avowed leader, of the Orange Body, was considered in his examina tion to have triumphed over that House. It had been said by somebody on the ether elite of the Howe that the Catho lic nobility had not connected themselves with the Association . and were adverse to that body because of its violence. Be haj read a letter from Lord Fingall one of the principal amongst the Catholic nobility. His Lordship was at Clifton, he (Sir J. Newport) regretted to add, rather in a bad state of health. He asps, " Illness is unfortunate at all times, but peculiarly mortify ing under the peculiar circumstances, we it prevents me from joining my feeble efforts to those of the ether gee denten of the Association at such an important nine." He would say nothing of Lord Fin gall that could not be borne oat by every Ilunourable Gentle:ran in that House, when he observed, that there never was a nobleman or gentleman more moderate and temperate than he had been through life, and through the various agitations to which his country was subjected. Ile was more distinguished for his virtues than his high rank; and he (Sir J. Newport) felt much pleasure in having this opportunity of paying the Noble Lord a tribute which he justly merited. But to return to the question, he would ask those i who were disposed to vote for the enactment .of this new penal law, where they proposed to stop? What was the end and object which they had in view? The relative number of Catholics, compared with that of Protestants, was fearfully increasing in Ireland. They had calculations before them which demonstrated this fact. There was the calculation of Pocock as to the county of Kilkenny, an in land county, in which the Catholics had increased in an extraordi nary proportion. In twenty years the Catholics had nearly doubled. In the enumeration made at the time of the Union, the proportion of Catholics to Protestants was suited to be as five to two. The proportion was now as six to one; and if the House waited for twenty yearn mote, they would tind it to be as twelve to one. It i wouid be impoesi hie then for the House to refuse those cone's clone, the graut of which it now poetponei. And why wait and encounter the perils crested by a refusal to grant those privileges, which must at length be canceled, although they may be for a while withheld? lie would implore the House to consider the expediency of making such concessions now. It was the cause of Ire land, he may say of the empire. because the tranquillity and security i et the country was connected with it. lie hoped he was convinced that this cause had not retrograded, but that it had advanced ; is. deed, he was sure it wouid advance in consequence of the present discussion. One of the most beautiful of our writers had said, j that " our wars were like the mornings of summer, where waning, cleuds contend with growing light." lie (Sir J. Newport) would apply this to Ireland. The clouds were quickly passing away from. and brighter days he trusted were opening to, her. He hoped that, before many months, the House would agree with him upon the uercesity of the meesure of Einancipet ion ; but, be this as it may, be would, in conclusion, assure the llotiee that by passing this Bill, it would do more neucliiel than it would be possible to remedy in a bevies of years. Mr. 1 , ESEY FITZGERALD concurred in much that had I fallen from the lion. Gentleman who had just concluded, yet he supported the Bill ; but he would nut shrink back and give a silent rote, leaving his motives unstated and unexplained. lie regretted the necessity of the measure which Ministers proposed. He thought that no other principle but necessity could justify the introduction of such a Bill. Ile was aware that many Gentlemen at his (Mr. V. Fitzgeraid'e) aide of the House, had been impressed with exag I . iterated accounts which they had received of the injurious ef j frets produced by the Catholic Association. He knew that 1 these statementswere not well founded ; he admitted that the sentiments uttered in the Association should not be eel ', ticieed with severity ; that there was much reason for vio -1 liner ; but yet he thought the Government should be allowed to act for itself, and that it was sufficiently vigorous and active to preserve the tranquillity of the country. Mr. V. Fitz gerald bore testimony to the conduct of the Catholic Magistrates of the county which he represented (Clare), and also stated, that many 1 Catholic Priests had exerted themselves to put down the recent dis turbatices. He defended the administration of justice; but ad. nutted that abuses were sometimes committed. Much had been j done in the way in reformation; no doubt match remained to be done: but he could not suppose that these subjects would nut ex cite the attention of the Government at a proper season. More had already been ee'ected than could have been contemplated when the work began. Though the interference of the Catholic Association might have eheen eatreniely useful, as was held by Hon. Glade men opposite, it certainly was quite unnecessary. Abuses may have existed, but he looked for correction to the wholesome opera tion of the laws. The Government was sufficient to insure the peace of the country, and did not require adventitious aid. It was no answer to say, that because the individuals were acquitted against whom the Catholic Association interfered, this interference was innocent. fly proclaiming anticipated guilt, and influencing the minds of the judges and jurols, they had acted in a manner which he could not opium e. Their conduct was not affected by the event of the trials. Ile believed there was growing up, and had grown up, a pub he opinion in Ireland, that the local anti general administration of the country had materially improved, and this had its natural result in the tranquillity of the century. He considered the present question as sue that trust produce fortunate effects to Ireland, because, front its great magnitude. and the attention with which it had been dis cussed, it brought Ireland within the sphere of general considera tion. Ile was anxious to call the attention of the House to one par ticular point; he meant the inquiry that had been last year gone into relative teethe state of Ireland, and the renewal of which was so strongly recommended by the Committee. In his opinion the greatest good had remitted trom this inquiry, and he was sure that nothing would be so consolatory to the people of Ireland, as the knowledge that their state was still under inquiry by the English Under ionic shape or other, as long as the union of the Roman Ca tholics remained. Whether the Rill were or were not patted. the Roman Catholic' would find some means of informing the people of this country, that his Majesty's Ministers had chosen to have six millions of discontented subjects. lie thought the Right lion. Gentleman (Mr. V. Fitzgerald). in his observations, had argued only half the question. With regard to the Association itself, he would fairly admit that he considered it greatly inconvenient ; but he felt certain that it was necessary only to change the nature of the laws to remove the evils. lie would not agreeln the position, that the Catholic Association could affect the question of Catholic Eman. cipation. Every one knew that it was Impossible for things to re main in Ireland as they were : there was only one way of get ting rid of the evil complained of, sod that was, by getting rid of the grievances of which they had to complain. lie did not even think that the Catholic Association could defer. Catholic Emancipation ; but he would express his firm belief to the contrary, and that their efforts would rather hasten it. lie understood that they were sup plied with funds to carry forward their cause by the contributions of the people, and this must mainly forward the measure. His view of the case was, that the attempt to put down the Catholic Association by the means proposed must fail, but he knew that there was another and a better mode of doing so—by granting emancipation to the Catholics. His Honourable Friend ( the Chan. cellor of the Exchequer) had yesterday said, that if emancipation were granted to the Catholics the Association would still exist. He (Lard Althorp) believed that such would not be the case—that it was indeed impossible for it to be so. AVhen the Irish Volunteers of 1792 assembled for redress, while their grievances were real and substantial, so long it was found impossible to put them down, and they succeeded in carrying their object ; but when, during the year following, they attempted to carry measures that were not consonant with the geleral wish of the people, from that moment the power of the Parliament returned, and they were put down with ease. Mr. WILLIAM LAMB observerLithat the Right Honourable Member (Vesey Fitzgerald) had certainly condemned the Catholic Association ; but he had condemned it in such measured terms as to make his d , ion of it almost problematical. He con sidered their however, of a most objectionable nature, and hay direct lendeocy to break up the foundations of good order; and thereiniabily bad crowded in their proceedings every thing that could be considered objectionable, and that was likely to cause alarm. He was reudy to make all allowances for the Catholic As sociation ; the irritation the Catholic body had endured—the per tinacity with which they had for a length of time urged their claims and been disappointed, led him to look with great kindness on that assembly ; but when he considered who the leader of that A ssotiation was, that be was a man of /nature age, in full practice es an experienced advocate, accustomed to all the applause that elo quence produced--he himself being the master of pure eloquence— and who, therefore, was not likely to be led away by the dazzling praise of • popular assembly. That gentleman's habits were those of an advocate, which required, demanded, and taught prudence. It was impossible for hint to urge an excuse for such a man, as if he had been a raw boy, unaccustomed to all the trickery of ap plause and debate. Mr. O'Connell understood the law, and knew well how far the Association accorded with it. de en tertained the opinion that he bad expressed on the first night of the Session, that it was unfit that any Priesthood should bring their spiritual power to bear on a political question ; and he equally hoped that the debate would not partake of a polemical or controversial character. lie had never heard pre cisely the grounds upon which the Association considered their powers to extend; but he thought the collecting money, and sit. ting to hear grievances, gave a permanent existence to the aisem. bly ; at least in that sense no one could doubt the members of it wished it to be taken. A metaphor sometimes carried with it greater force than argument, and on that account he supposed it was that a Right Hon. Gentleman had called public meetings the safety-valves that carried off danger; but the question was, whether the perpetual irritation produced by the proceeding of the Catholic Association were not more likely to carry down the flames to the furnace below that made the cauldron boil ; lie thought that it would be better, for the sake of public decency, that the prosecu tions that hail been alluded to should be kept out of Court. for could :el thing be more likely to produce the evils of the Constitu tional Association, which had been so touch deprecated in that House than the Acts of the Catholic Assembly ? 'l'he mischief had always been on similar occasions, and would be the same in this that civil actions were brought in a vexatious manner against in dividuals, and little actions were brought into importance.— nether evil from this Association was that it caused the administration of justice to be spoken lightly of; and he confessed that he was surprised at the opinions that had born uttered on that point. He knew full well what was always said when that House sent any man to trial. It was then thrown out its an insinuation against the House that a fellow-subject was sent to trial with the House of Commons ; bat as it related to the course intended to be pursued by the -Issociation, hew much more vexatioue were the proceedings ? for they would send persons to trial amongst* ptople heated with injuries either real or imaginary, and ripe for rebellion ; if they were not so he would withdraw his assertion. But he believed it was not with respect to the danger, but the tit and proper time for putting it down that any doubt existed. The Hon. Slember then adverted to the remarks of Mr. Tierney on a former evening as to the vacancies that would occur in the Cabi. net if an Administration were attempted to he formed by the party opposing the Catholic claims, and concluded by observing, that he hoped a future Ministry would never be so shackled as to be obliged to go out of power on the question as in 111(17, and he equally hoped that a settled hatred and animosity against the Catholics would never exist in any Cabinet. Sir F. BURDETT immediately rose upon Mr. Lamb's sitting down, but ha was for some time quite inaudible in the gallery, in conseqaence of the nntse and confusion that took place upon Mem. hers taking their places. The first words that we heard, the lion. Baronet observed, that at the sante time he in common with other Members of the House was delighted with the ingenuity of the speech of the lion. Member who had just sat down, but he consi clued his inferences unfair and his premises false and extraneous to the subject. lie had taken notice of the proceedings that had oc curred in the assembly, and commented, as others had done, upon the words of Mr. O'Connell in a manner that facts did not warrant. Disconnected sentences of that gentleman's had been taken rap during the debate, and brought forward as charges against hint, and that too when it was impossible for him to give an expla nation of them. Arguments had been imputed to him in a manner that no writing could bear the test of, and no hook that ever was written, not even that which they all respected and revered—the Bible—could contend against. If detached passages of the Bible were taken they might he made to convey blasphemy,—as that great and true-hearted Engliahman, Sydney, had truly said, when a wicked Judge and a stupid jury convicted hint, and this might be applied to the speeches of 111 r. O'ConnelL Ile said that he might take the Bible and pick nut a passage which said there was no God, and he might quote the Bible as containing blasphemous passages, and so it would appear, without reference to the context. He should be ready to agree with Gentlemen wboliad adverted to Mr. O'Connell's speech, if they contained jesuitical ingenuity, but he maintained there' was nothing of the kind expressed or implied in them. They contained nothing but manly, open, candid sentiments. There was nothing behind die curtain in item, nothing of reservation. And what could be inferred from the passage that had been so much taunted at, "By the hate that you bear the Orangemen ?" But how did lie elm that sentence ? Did that manifest hostility ? " By the hate you bear the Orangemen, do no act of violence ; follaw the precepts of the Gospel in that true sense of purity, that he feared no men could lay his hand upon his heart and say that he had so acted." Rut the setmet machinations against Mr. O'Con nell ; the unfair mode pursued in attacking garbled extracts of his speech, reminded him of those beautiful lines of a poet but little read, Dr. Armstrong, " An open candid foe I could not hate, Nor would insult the base in low estate; Hut private malice freely to forgive. 'Tie something late to be so primitive." It certainly was a new doctrine to hold out, that oppression was not to be hated, hut those gentlemen who had taken exception at Mr. O'Connell's speeches, and taken detached passages to prove that Ae him that coaduct ad. e Orangemen assembly like the O'Connell. determined iustify an am hadp. • Gentleman the not I re- Ire- ...a the including . views measure , f the high POB - that die -I:ari —.al, , English . , —n communi daring with, and supporting the Association, could he apprehend danger from it ? Some persons thought that the Association had shown too much temper, and had been too tardy in their operations; that they ought to have bestirred themselves sooner o snake their cause respected; but, perhaps they had pursued a sounder patriotism by adopting the more moderate course.— Gentlemen on the other side had addressed themselves in their arguments to every thing but the particular point in question. The principal charge adduced by the lion. Gentleman to whom he had last alluded, and indeed the ground which had been most urged and relied upon by the supporters of this measure, was, the alleged interference of the Catholic Association with the administration of justice, and the mischievous consequences re sulting, and likely to result, from such a tampering with the operation of the laws. Anti Gentlemen had said, directing their observations to that side of the House, " How can you, who have disapproved of the Bridge-street Society, support the Catholic Association? You disapproved of that for its inter ference with the duties of the Officers of the State, and by I what process of reasoning can you reconcile to such opposition your present approval of the acts of this Association ? Your argument cuts against yourself." In answer to this, he would reply, that lie for one had supported the Constitutional Asso ciation, not from approbation of its motives and actions, but against, and in preference to, the operations of State prosecu tions and e.r.o.fficio informations. The fact was, he considered the Bridge-street Society as the lesser devil of the two. He was prepared to assert the conduct of that Society met his particular disapprobation. Their conduct was unpardonable. Their em ployment of spies, and the mode in which they urged on their charges of filth and scurrility, it was impossible to justify; yet he felt no hesitation in boldly asserting that, such as it was, he much preferred it to the exercise of the powers of the Attorney. General. But the Catholic Association did nolhing of this kind— they did not prosecute for political offences and libels, the meaning of which was generally so indeterminate, and in which men of the best character might become implicated. He would inform the House what they really did propose to themselves to do, and what they had successfully executed. They had attempted to provide their oppressed fellow-countrymen with the meant' of defence against aggression, and an opportunity of obtaining ed ens when natured. In doing this, particularly in Ireland, who could say they had attempted any thing unconstitutional or uncalled-for by the necessities of the time and the country s They did not at tempt to prejudge or prejudice; but when a case of supposed in. justice was submitted to their consideration, as one demanding in. quiry, they subjected it to the investigation of a Committee ap. polished for the purpose, who examined into the merits of the case, but presumed to pronounce no determination upon the matter, further than sending the case before a Grand Jury, aed into is court of their country, if there appeared to them to exist grounds capable of warranting a further investigation. And what was there pernicious or unconstitutional in ell this ? Ile had exported, front the grave tone with which allegations of this nature had been wade, to have heard of perjured witnesses, or bribed juries, its sonic other course of injustim to check and counteract the salu tary operation of the laws. But what was really the cats ? In the very instance adduced by the Secretary of State for Ireland, the circumstances were in favour of the Catholic - Association, and justice had been done. The lion. Member had stated as much as suited his own purpose, and he (Sir Francis Burdett) was at a loss to knew how he could reconcile such conduct with the principles of candour and fairness which should influence the minis of men discussing considerations so important. His Majesty's Mi nista, hest offered no proofs, and laid no documents upon the table of that House, and yet they expected the Home to legis late in the dark. But if the House must be content to rely upon bare and unsupported statements, he would protest against the Honourable Gentleman being heard. He could have no voice in the matter—he had put himself and his case completely out of Court by his conduct. l ie should therefore feel himselfjus titled in reiterating his protest against the evidence of that Gentle man. But he was inclined to fear that this was not the right view to take of this important case—a case of such vital interest to the well being of the state. Ile used those expressions without exaggera tnan, and was prepared to assert, that this was not merely an Irish, but an English question--a question of more importance than any since the Revolution of 1688. Ile did not feel disposed to join in an anticipation of the melancholy consequences which had been pre dicted as likely to ensue 11'0111 the adoption of this measure in Ire land. His Majesty's Attorney-General for Ireland had put a question to hint on a former evening, to which he was, perhaps, incited by the particular attention he (Sir Francis Burdett) was paying him at the moment—an attention which, lie was free to ad. mit, was excited by other causes than the powerful eloquence of the Honourable and Learned Gentleman ;—not that he meant to say his abilities were not of a nature calculated to draw the particular attention of every Member of that House to ' every expression of his sentiments. The Learned Gentleman had inquired whether he (the Member for Westminster) thought the Roman Catholics would not submit to the proposed enactment? Ile (Sir Francis Burdett) could not undertake to say what would be the effect of such measures upon the feelings of six millions of people. Ile would content himself with saying, that seeing the acts of the Association, looking to the high names enrolled among its members, and taking into consideration its principles and pro. gress, he would have replied to the lion. Gentleman's question, , ' that be (Sir Francis Burdett) entertained a strong hope and ex pectation, and it was, he might add, his ardent prayer, that the Catholics of Ireland would abstain from entering into any resistance towards any measures which might be adopted by that House ; he', trusted they would adopt no such dangerous anti unseemly conduct. This would have been his answer to the lion. Gentleman at the moment, but lie was now prepared with a better, furnished to him by the Association itself. He came down to the House to answer the question, and in doing so, he was but echoing the voice--and he might call it, the wisdom of the Association itself. That Association assembled since the news of these piojected mea sures had reached their ears, and their determination hail been one every way worthy of themselves and their cause: it was obedience to the law when enacted ; and the olds , claim they preferred was, that they might be heard at the Bar of diet !louse, in explanation of their principles, and in vindication of their conduct. lie would cell this language loyal and prudent; and, under the circumstances of the country, he felt justified in using every effort in behalf of the Roman Catholics, not of Ireland alone, but of the United Kingdom. It had been said, that it was impossible to form a Cabinet united on the subject of the Catholic claims, but he was prepared to maintain, that had the friends of the Catholics who now held places in the Cabinet retained their principles, and refused to accept office with. out the granting of that question ban attached to it, they would have succeeded in their object. The Government could not have gone on ; they might have done as Gentlemen were, in the case of a serious difference of opinion, in the habit of doing with Committees above stairs—namely, knocking the brains out of the Committee: they could have knocked the brains out of the Administration, which could not have stood or existed without them. He would not pretend to charge upon those Gentlemen an apestacy from the measures which they had once so strenuously advocated, but he would say , had the alternative been put of the Anti-Catholic part of the Administration submitting, they must have submitted. Bu u bad not been puts and the consequence was, the enlightened hilfs submitted to the unenlightened part of the Cabinet, and darkness covered the face of the land. The conduct of the opposers of Ca tholic Emancipation had been different. The Right Honourable the Secretary for the Home Department would hot, unlike his , Honourable colleague, constitute a portion of a Cabinet where the Catholic claims were to be granted. He (Sir F, Burdett) would not pretend to draw any inference from this conduct, which was at least consistent, and that was more than could be said of the fa. vourers of the Catholics. All he would add upon the subject was, that there appeared in the conduct of the two parties, to say table se of it, as great a difference in mural as in political princgile. Threw& the activity of one part, and the irtliffnence of the other, questions of the most vital importance were to remain stationary at best make the least possible progress. The union—if it might be so denomi nated which was not • union--ef such a Cabinet, was like the junction of the living with the dealt; and he could not pretend to public life, ruree,ea. Wlie Catholics ehould be argued maintain the same opinions nothing would satisfy, node stiiify (hear, hear, hear,) tl granting of that which roni tiob, whits denominated Cc Cathode Rights, Wear, I exertions, both in and oat o what by die laws of God a titled to. Let us look at tb partially. Here were no let majority of Ireland, injure upon by one million ! COll . expected, or even wished, th nett under such unjust . restn ignominy stamped upon the siould unceasingly resist ; a: b \ IhiIkhIiNIIIIMIMM.MMIMINIIMIniMMMINIMMEIN . . . . . -. ' . ... ',, .., , - . „ .. - • . ~ „ . • . . ' ' . , . .... .. •ei t. - . ••• . . . . ... ~ . . •••!' SI . , r r ., '.' " • . . ' `fi' \ , . ..l , • r - , '.. . ‘,. •• . l . . . • . . .k. . s . . i . Zr. ... • i . 11 / 4 . --.• i./t/s7 '' "sr a .1' • ••• ' i'v• , \ . • . . ea , ..:1 ...a ,'S • ...-X • ~a r • ' r'7. . • r".., ... 4 ..i riiiimitiagratooLosigisigasamedemiwkwaraimmagi %ele - st ~. • f.' • • , ..., ' temLopin : I . it - ri • ,' b. • NY ' lIE tlirriBN . TittBSi . - ~.. itk4iri _ . 4 .„.. Aim *a asseisi g =ipleglimit he ma Mudd be esielegl i so: a ..... of • Meese of Cemotems. He knew that nothinif tsow ised thot heen caw s, they ort to he excepted, tract be icall p fzistabied ie It. Theadebssted sat vr/ be elm allial is lisw ase all , sollablii be dill lam er show .--- i - f - r - v elf en it weft Beeso n d ll4 i "l it. =IC a : g rid% Irie . r'.' 4 " -- le, T- ;;r' 7 • ?.. ." • stlavaresa of wikielo gi lretat ° b:d iu to sti com ce. p i lls wall be passed ammessi - migh t we app ... agol not follow • and if it did am and the loony strugi emp rbieb ids .* (, unsedeed_lay die Osmenimme of In uiry-and he knew that no rat. "Ilesilreasion's woes V o ra, , of Ilk ' biota et* the R ss~ by wham libel Mss Malec, a• - .. s. 7. 1. : . mildreith ascomm t=iisd by tba • Association, that the House . &ran' sons km senile ... ...., • . ? siM ak bese all, be eemoidemi AM _wmeleg emass. mirk mod fenefelly exposed. Has* • MOS mold nit bo SWAM Will - this Asesefollii - Nweroeld my, as an Bs imidhleoll the owns MIMOSA bpdista As= l e m il , i - the'Catholle Associeno' a asbiell, istiold beanies& two thee llama dist the prebilings danger *bleb • ' Hoe. Member lied said ao the posomdlicidght, that he was an an appeal to them to pursue a meadiadmpl object by ealco . • • •t• Min Id tide usury elm the pea el HA was weer nod enemy els all Aseeentiees He us leseausese. any Association means ; but Hon. Gentlemen modem emit sly we damps from Mr . •-. ... ( *id taste Sit one paint to *hide Ms saw fearful than anything ens - thated ever occurred - wise` his most Pemba a matisaw•Ameelatiou He did sot, however, concur the Catholic Association, and the Isnot timid of them thrieght that . , . w .,h ei g . . , .M. yto call gas issuseke a the Sum He would sopeniuse. It Ira, listbiog %rook of lbex Ws be the *aim a the 0.. Mamba far Armagh (Mr. Brownlow) its proceedings were of a questionable nature , mei their sendiall • not en account tr on the liaise, and MU thither peek% Needy used in bat lithe that the liall sow intiedued into the Berme wee =Bed for by the reminded him of the passage that Hamlet uttered wise he ad. the de , Which had Mbar* pme to such a Isefflai Was awn el -blet OPP , . i the eisda•. • . y *suet of the Cobol* Assecieties only. He believed, if the 'armed to the Ghost- 4:r ... .-.-- • bot Ants Paying a fen Seed* en oft pilot i the saes sa, es t for bete we Were a tat Ohm's Asiecietiebehol eat Wends that the Catholic Association "Be thou a spirit of health or goblin damned, • '''' - .an argidenut had bees /Miro iron it spina the Bill. floe Ora homes, who foamed an the - lift. (he would net my that it would sot be in existence) would net so Bring wnh thee airs from heaveo er Maas boa bell, inent Willed of intimidation iit nos midi, if yea pass this hits you Whilst dm ephishiss Ohne he glapeft the jut ismaol.the completely bare embedited Gm poop* Hs was for putting down Be thy intents wicked or charitable, will raise * it ; the people of /Maid Mil emesintere it. rhumies, the tai' el nth a mu as that heir 'yeepiesiU all Associations, on r t e h i e e and that they led to many evils, Thou cont'st in such a questionable shape, Now, it apparel tint there was se nett apprehesseion be maw. session potion say aftwastegeopelion, l ' i r b r ih • and could be productive little good. He could sot concur That I will speak to thee." muted. fee sea los touting of the Association, at whites Land ill - toosularink took am diSteek No . In in the opinion cep ley some Hautuable Gentlemen, Was there any thing wicked in all that Mr. O'Connell had said lam melded, a udon was pasted declaring their inesetios at heisted may be aefortoi. of that the Cadeelie_nuestion woad not now pan, oe that the sense respecting the Orangemen ? Was it like the conduct of " a a bide le in) eau t may eideti had to succumb se ha =rig heitalliols AM w reed a gust of the people el Reiland wag against it. He thought, however, goblin datnn'd," as some Gentlemen seemed so think, to endeavotu • ' • nbriiiiimite eimemee &edit to thee essela; evil. Bat why was a Rill t nature sought to be in- that the Catholic Assimintiso„ by its unguarded conduct, had given to restrain the Catholics from violence towards the Orangemen ? '''. -ti the Asendlaido + l, The Hen. • without any dacurseetterp utilises ?II Right Honour- a handle to the mania ef Catholic Emancipation, and had fine Surely, then, it was not candid or fair, in an assembly like the • , , roped , * bad said , that . th e Government relied aished its opponsate with emulsions against it; but he saw House of Commons, to cavil at expressions of Mr. O'Connell, U. teMilek' no die le the it e' , inseeee fit the obviation Usk doe upsramorieus facts-facts r rodeos uto supersede the De- nothing ill .the Mate of things le wake him despair that the mu- when he had no opportunity of explaining himself. And what, ' • were swami hoe jpitiest by as Hawaii comity eteay ;other ce. But what were these epee wads,* granted. He deemed it ca ll ed for, not only by jas • he would ask, was there in any other part of Mr. O'Connell's " appalls James Mt Mies* ) ; tint -as.. seitheseembisted=4o,ldr What was the feted' of tics bed by sommity; be deemed success inevitable ;it might be conduct that was open to exception from his most determined ‘ 1141 ',, {j. ; ; • - tlie whisaremat *Now neleriecy attached to one at those hien -be meant, the effect kif the retarded, but it muM not be prevented even by the violent conduct opponents ? Surely it could not be necessary to justify at • • • -s r.:. Os o . cruse. side ; he vitedi was nod *anions of the Romeoddedolie • Priesthood I. producing teen- of the Qedielis Association. Connected as be was by blood, and expression that broke forth from a heart bursting with wrongs. . s ., to omelo n se ewege e g o s a ag apati te e The mug moth( do Sell to place ittjuxt . sn the e tea of friendship, he might almost say, by name, with Cacho _ (Hear, hear.) The lion. Gentleman who had spoken last had . .. on the_principiethat ! sees sepal*. opinion of the Seca/tare foe Ireland, and the Under y for that be felt it his duty to give his vote against endeavoured to throw an air of ridicule over public meetings ~ '' * ' Its • • ) Tide was reedy • Oder rattelltat aarsaaddit . the Home Herrman. Observe*, sopperiety. the in fence t h i :MIL assured that by putting down this Catholic As. but he would remind him that the late Mr. Burke considered ••; :' it . ".. ) - to be add tow ow ifirobild'inemiley, of *me opirtions. TMs enanalla for leihold (Mr. Gronlbouns) socialioe all other Associations would be suppressed, and that such it necessary to have those assemblies that the Hon. Gentlemar -•.- ' and " 'could make pabeimeee' sow theetertesse• stied that the Roman Catholic Meats Wets Midi to lOW Mt icmy a measure would therefore be the most likely to forward the ques. had scoffed at. lie considered them the safety-valves of the sons •'., . ••• quarrelling in a Op. totenlasid swim •of Sweety thousand Cathodic ; collation. and that they_ kitexerted don of Catholic Emancipation. The vote, therefore, he should Constitution. Bet the lion. Gentleman had asked. was it no .st • : e was anxious that di goat pasedos et limmeei• eh, Ildimmee which they Teemed in 0 Manner whit* the Right give against the Association. so fir from prejudicing the claims of the furnace, and not the safety-valve ?He (Sir Francis) re. not be mixed ap ia On Male, he setresselseml bleseemble &Meter COY not Opprove. The Attorser.Othend the Roman Catholics, would be the most effectual means to for. plied, " No." lie saw the furnace beneath, and that was Ire, , , most „Tel. Atlas of efte mo s e of.. Ameedifitipi..im iisoloalsog that Me ROMS* Catholic Pritithood• were a ward them . lard. (He still hoped that the Catholics of Ireland and En land ail • tt, Mats a fair ground tif jeelMlijr. Be Apilii^ Mamma We wbbillabess foully calsamiated, and that theft enteduct on Lord ALTHORP said, that lie had paid the utmost attention to would observe a course of conduct, notwithstanding their cOum Sid tle • Ali to refute the very otriad, adiumthe amilhilaY it. eeweiallsealiww was meet maltoeious. Hut what said the Under- the speech ottbs Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. V. Fitzgerald), but mated character, that would teach those who were opposed t raiWi silde, Ily opposing to it the templets, saw of doe • deandam al Sion? shat the Influence of the Catholic Priesthood let bad not been able to discover in that speech a sin& argument them that they not only spoke the sentiment' and had chi There was attemgre topic to which he wield alludes liven tea woe meet baleful aid malignant, and exerted for the most pernie in favour of the measure now before the House-not a single argu• confidence of sir millions of the people of Ireland, includini eine mos tinadroned by an Hon. and Learned Geadomen 0p... ens, plumage. ems tho eridebee of Gentlemen connected man in "'Apposed the mode proposed for putting down the Cacho- the nobility, gentry, and clergy-with Protestants as well a iss a im posit* ( ineshlagtrm) last night-a ageing th e Ulm - t a illike*** ads soon obe fact, and yet the House lie Association--the proposal that they should be dealt with by a Catholics at the head of the list of persons favouring their view , versity Clob . (A laugh.) It WAS really a ' s subject, but was millokepeta so. on the parole evidence of the Government, Bill of pains and penalna. It was necessary that the Bill intro. and pretensions, as would tend to throw out the paltry measure he felt himself, aa Member for the Univeilley, bound to notice it. rather Aso ea ts. ducal into the House by his Majesty's Ministers should be the then before the Houle. When he saw the name of th, The Hon. and Leaned Gentleman said, that a eau* book of a Me. GOU RN begge d to explain the did not make the beat mode of putting down this Association ; and not only the best Earl Fltzwilliam, whose integrity, generosity, and he l l very improper description, " The Mandible of Harriet Wilson," statement witlembicio the Honourable Baronet had charged him; mode, but, as the Bill mu one against the liberties of the subject, character, were only exceeded by the ample fortune he pos thousand ot t h at t it oo should b t t o t t h t e itero un o ly as so o :t h of er I:lug it tor down.lany tto Gi t 7 o n. seseed b l o and to distribute d around e t §:Tit tclapuygitair laughter ), ;Z s )! e or w d e er s ea rejected. bY ( i ' l l ' i o b n :in elkedplraseciumerir'.l)l whits Now, rot r re g h tit un e d red th"" ts c°lB39.Y tetl y i aa n the c d u a ll n e g c e Tt on of Catholic Rent. . Association,lirilforwatsbeheputbolicbr good, stlib. be had taken the trouble to inquire , and found that there was no Alt. PLUNKETrYso desired to be better understood than it Catholic Emancipation. The Bill 'outle t ' the way-byb ertirs of th e its mo tives were of a mischievous ten dency, or likely to dig Such book to be found in the library. ( Cheers and laughter from appeared from what bad fallen from the Honourable Baronet that subject in a peculiar manner ; but though it might be the means of turb the general tranquility ? When he saw such men as the Eat the Ministerial benchm.) At the mine time he was free to admit, Ibe had been. He bed said, and he begged again to repeat, in the potting down the Association is its present form, it must continue, lof Fingall representing the Irish Catholics, and the Earl Fitt .e. .. ... e.--e •vooe ai.samss ....1 ...Janie manner_ that he considered the Cacho- under some shape or other, as long as the union of the Roman Ca. I william, at the h,sd of the English Protestants, each communi . . . , , • hthlidEs what species a pews wad saga writ a . setinni. „etsittp! 'Flittheeenth it weee p yew e mi f i l i a sir mc os :.:7; Decilla es WOO the essail iset ban only ens Coma In he eandithsi I bet bow the" _Wire twth 'l2ll=ft• line w divide* sibs Pm*/ 0 1116 " en i x4 11114 to, and shoe it w in a ss =t b beouty t bet rioligity. But the line ad& thedillisilisd doe IsP" atims • wee a very asisind owl wy„„iia se, particularly the prowist, aid is wasart. Seeing all this, be set *S is. vitts . mat up be theedbles doe existing situation of found In the description ef ear wet Psi. to represent to the mind's eye ass ef hie Oa nations, and in lines exhibiting elemenese i CigialPo ta al i su g g s than dame which constituted the Cabinet, 'be says—. " To whom these mast aims, Ile rules a moment: Chaos smOire aka, And by decision mare embroils the fray By which he reigns s " *rat him, high , Chance governs AL Looking at the appropriateness adds siseeription, lie must say thought that 'Oar the - Cabinet unit bow En for die *Pith W dim the descriptions Inds use ef se it bid of plandrial kr , matien et the Fromm& ejsztin end etas of thingp, ap sera when wad Nth& g ht i power Idea yes alio to of Zsbisentr:post=s. tbe WW. disesawer 4thmenee the theses enemy existed in the seratry =dent to raise us present Woad= be knew net, hot Wiped It did. It laid been said of Wend, that " what wawa, weerebare else, was as two if applied to Ireland." He moment, was an exception to that obse i r i r& t ,e s et=is W eel surprise that the present moment, when aid to have returned to that country, and the inha bitants were beginning to subside into a calm, end all were beginning to enable - Ireland to partake of the tide of ty which was so abundantly Bowing through this kingdom, he Ina dis posed to wonder why thisjunoture should be the one theme re pro mulgate, through the Speech from the Throne, the necessity of adopting measures of coercion, he might say oppression, Whist that country. Ile could not disguise his surprise at such an eseur. ranee as that the King should be advised to select this witiallat time of acknowledged tranquillity and prosperity for the recommit. dation of such measures. The Right Honourable the Chancellor of the Exchequer had said, no Gentleman ventured upon a defence of the Association. It was not usual for a man to defend what no man attacked, and in the present instance it was not easy to discover any thing which stood in need of a defence. The case the Right Honourable Secretary for Ireland had attempted to make out against the Association, weak as it was, had not stood a moment—it had been shattered to atoms—and, as if it had not received a sufficient refutation from that side of the House, his own friends had helped to destroy it. The speech of the Member for Clare ( Mr. Vesey Fitzgerald) to whom be felt obliged for the full ex pression of his honest and undisguised sentiments, had actu ally blown into the air the theories of the Honourable Se cretary. What did the lion. Member say? lie had mentioned a ease which had been brought into Court through the means of the Association, the conduct of which, and of their agent in the prose cution, had received the public and well-merited commendation of the Bench itself. There was a great benefit likely to be rendered by such prosecutions to the minds of the Catholice; they woldel bee one means of bringing to the test many loose and general calum nies long prevalent in Dish society. It an individual were to in form another, lie had had his pocket picked in paesing through St. Giles's, it would require no extraordinary degree of credulity to believe him, without any one thinking it necessary to investigate the particular facts of the case. Such was the prejudice that ex isted against that quarter of the metropolis. In lil:e manner many things were taken for granted in Ireland, but it might be as well that they should be inquired into ; if they were true, they should be remedied—if calumnies, it would be necessary to refute them 7 in either case they should be brought to the test of a public leer tigation. If any thing thing were necessary to prove the hoot- of the Association, it would be their conduct in thus subniittint the touchstone of open investigation, what had hitherto formed miseries and the prejudices of Ireland. What would the Orange Gentlemen of Ireland say . were he to calumniate them as the Atso ciation had been calumn iated ? But in one word, the best way to put an end to the Catholic Association, would be by holding out the fairest prospect of conceding the Catholic Claims. Many Gen tlemen have expressed their opinion in favour of those claims, though they determine to vote for the present Bill. The Right Honourable Secretary for Fotelgn Affairs had declared himself hostile to the Catholic Association, on the ground of its mischievous effect upon the Catholic cause; lie had considered it as an incube upon that cause, and would, therefore, put it down. What s the House to think after such a statement ? %Vete the shades , Gloucester Lodge so deep 7 Was the Honourable Secretary see ignorant of 'want was passing around, and really immersed in such Cimmerian darkness, as to suppose that the Catho lic Association was not labouring fur the Caiholic caul and identified with the Irish people? But, if he had et former period expressed that opinion, it was to be hoped thfAte tarpon-General had opened his eyes on the subject ; for he had stand that it wss the sympathy existing between the Association and the people at large, and the influence attempted to be exercised by that body, that had roused the jealousy ul the Government in spite their standing army, which he wield pronounce a disgrace to e Constitutional principles of the realm. Government appeared apprehend the Association would acquire a power paramount to own in Ireland. But how are his Majesty's Ministers entitled claim the concurrence of this House in their opinions on the in jeer, unsupported as their opinions are by soy documentary , genre, when they themselves are not agreed among themselves their own sentiments? lie submitted to the House that the present was a measure affecting not Ireland alone, but England, and the English Constitution. If the Association be unconstitutional Ireland, it would be equally unconstitutional in England. But the House should remember that this abused Association was not implicated in the teas alleged. It should be borne in mind there were two points to be considered ; the first, and the material one was, whether the Association was illegal? another question he been started, whether the acts of the body bed keen legal ? but would submit that was not the subject-matter of consideration, legal Association might commit illegal acts, and vice versa. was persuaded the Association was not of an illegal nature, and ths opinion bad been confirmed by the conduct of the Irish Attorney. General, and the issue of it. tie ha.i attempted to fasten upon dividusls attending the Association an illegal character, but failed :—A Grand Jury had rejected his appeal, and ignored bills presented against Mr. 0-Connell. This was a proof Association did not violate the provisions of any existing It was not the lionoureble Member's intention to say that , Attorney-General had acted improperly in sending the caw before a Jury; but he would say, without fear of effectual contradiction, the Association was not an illegal society. But the Honourable and Learned Gentleman had said, no restraint upon liberty was conten plated by the present measure. He will confine the people. but will not Interfere with their liberty ; he will prevent them from e pressing what is displeasing to him, but not meddle with their fres dam of speech. lie (Sir Francis Burdett) could not understand the meaning of the Honourable and Learned 31cmber's sophistry, but must look upon the measure as the first step against genuine constitutional liberty, and the unalienable rights of the subjects o these realms. The Hon. Gent. had added another piece of informs tion to the former : he had announced to the House that the mea sure was to be only a temporary one. lie hoped it would prove r and that the Catholics would offer no opposition to the execution the enactment; but if they did not possess a sounder discretion an more temperate feeling than the Cabinet of the country, it woulc prove otherwise, and the Act now before the House, if passed. would have a successor worse than itself. He hoped and tzuste' the wisdom of the Roman Catholics of Ireland would sive •" country from the experience of such a crisis es would be likely t.. ensue. Hie Majesty's Attorney-General for Ireland had eulogised the conduct of the Roman Catholic priesthood, and, he believed, deservedly ; but how was that culogium to be reconciled with the speeches of the Member for Derry and others, who held another tone, and appeared to express whet he might be permitted to call the Orange sense of things ? The sentiments of these gentlemen had been totally contradictory to those of the Honourable and Learned Mantes But he was disposed to placenevery cc a idence his authority, particularly ui on such a subject. No authority ex. Aced in that House which was entitled to more attention, or could be said to rank so high. From his long experience of the country, and official situation, lie must have it in his power to speak decidedly upon such points. Ile must know what ethers can only suspect, and must be acquainted with all '- particulars of the facts he states. He (Mr. Plunkett) borne honourable testimony to the conduct of the Roman tholic clergy, and no doubt they deserved it. He (Sir Francis) I disposed to give the lion. and Learned Gentleman credit sincerity, and manly conduct in thus coming forward with testimony on this _;eCt. Ile was likewise inclined to admit 1 belief of the lion. Member's sincerity in his advocacy of Catholic Claims. If he had ever entertained a doubt on the su ject—and perhaps the ',earned Gentleman would pardon the exist. ence of a daubs in his mind, when he recollected how he himself hail at one period doubted the sincerity of his colleague (Mr. Canning) on the same question—if he ever entertained a doubt, he repeated, it was set at rest and resolved by the speech of the Hon. Member. But he must be allowed to say, he felt more disposed to concur with the Member for Galway, alto had stated his determination oppose the proposed enscuuent, because he apprehended Its ei fects upon the minds of his sensitive countrymen. He confessed he thought such a view of the state of Ireland, and the possible effects of the contemplated measure, much more statesmanlike than the opinions entertained by the Attorney. General for Ireland. We had already lost one colony by the ignorance ar.d infatuation of a besotted Ministry. '4 had already been shorn of one of the brightest ornaments of our crown by oppressive legislation • foe' there was one evil greater than any other, which could be fal country, he considered the loss of America—the lopping off of mi g hty linib of the empire, as the most to be deplored—tarnislim Its reputation, and casting a shade upon the glories of the county.. But of ell the evils which we had already suffered--ef all the evils which even could be brought into contemplation, from -lookiri back at the many disastrous incidents which had befallen this cons• try in the course of the late war, he would consider the loss of Ir land to be the greatest, he would look upon all as a feather in balance compared to it. (Cheers.) He would call to the remdlec tion of the Learned Attorney-General fur Ireland en historical (- which bore strongly upon our present circumstances. When - great and mighty people, whose name will live in the recollectiot of every age, when the Romans were contending with the Fidurate in their endeavours to reduce every neighbouring nation under the colonial yoke—when the indurates had revolted and been subdues'. and when delegates had been sent to the Serge to deprecate the' wrath, they were asked what punishment should to inflicted - . . , 1 0 • • am UM :met had y • be 1 14111114"t"w abhe :811: ..\ ~ .wailltnkwbenMe7ectw;hi.noisitigiestilibutrmeuntiPmellcaliaetBll3phteticisnilgelti!lewrh:gicellid""ioluthatnyfytP.potoaenlihdni.rbeereillotnlirttn-uwdeanht?tblsvalSdheeierra:ll:.dinondnn:litialorntciCrintoytiw.::, set ee d+u e itensi~s of their hostility to appeal to one justice o for the relief of their C unnatural bondage. (Ch entire concurrence in th dm, bee fa Galway, who h • of low cwt to entrust him glityl if !ie could not induce th the Ma whose mswytlar~l li eat i See been lel attt over all the ditllculeiea Id to '4id . wilt to shrink fro Sh were deity ;dirs. his ability-be could ans., pro- • be the more happy to lend 7 of Mt convinced, from these {the persumions of his mat li s rm v ie Pelle :nc ds e , ,. fr b b o till tit n :te of oo w n o s v ac u i l c d l : i b il o e n tri o i ellnat - session from every side of tele. g• 1 when he would be able to .. ,Gent leman had said, h : 1 :etntie tto alk ou oofn the House i deserted fence it ns OM, -is advancing ; ;amst Oentiern ra an tedin tuhawchtutipoe himself,enft,hretbs tight advanced Hie had Pullea what re The Hon. Baronet sat icient of the House. elPed . . (St r, 51r. Secretary . CANNl ex- to the following effect :-• &Chi , . beyond the usual limits, derable a confusion-that led a if the arisen from the length and rose- have been disinclined to on of but with a view to take the tiered hi he tion before the House, it Run- . with my address, bearing o in. me, to endeavour to discs ough lulity the parts to which attention t igen, aPertive magnitudes. The it ex. ' ' mode in which we should many the nature and character I well mold Speech ; in answer to whi nem ; specific thing certainly, b noes- • 1 . the evil thus directly brou meaty . n g to ~ ... f ops tio p i red , ho d w th ev we er idt , hisc tl t i hu er ess e siou h nh a i s oecf t.t ii t h e range AL°. this night, the whole of wh ray to (gg Leas Rion; and to all these there ward, in a very prominent aims, harden), the question res Hight mself Mention of which I for;.t events 1 'tonally relating to myself, I mhos . / en the attevion of the Hou t was necessity, though at a late les of ry so indulgence with regard to cried subjept of debate into four atho- tion before the House, c ac, i . 11 ne . a If secondly, with regard to tlAt, the Catholic Question ; t gaud the Government; and fou d the r that itsPect to the existence o ite of spirit of the Constitution, o the t4erre has not been, so tar ed tO =MTNe of the debate, any to its led to to apply a negative to t enb , The question the House has evi_ i having received in the Spe as in tetra to which that Speech c resent . 1 the pledged ourselves to consid al in remedy, we shall now pros But after question, but to recei s not there 1 suggested for that purpose? one, a had :t that, ilPee chyet to true Crows tof e e nyt i e t cht t h e kt that s s i r o s ia ( :le ' ttw e xi s t in g cdt d ec e i v ed i i n li a et i t , shiesi creat e , yoce ‘ t hese i . .. ,c A;e i l tot ~i with ut h e . for a He I that rney. it is that these Associations in in- • t had untrueiti s t i 'e . i h a r t t h r le t h t e i coursemisledw7consequence,lih.t with tthnsisr o h e sp i t ; heecp n il s to t tra i age o cridtso n oti a anc l dallobe, i e.y m iocictu p e.poes,t r rhu o i tnerw v i I the r the law. ac i tt t oo:bel is coyoispbant o p i tie l io.nso r icu:npt d ,eo u ssfto t ian y dthec. t t o imi l , ea and re t t dlr. wrote :don, le and item. ut he n es. free. stand istg, these t A he u°6 6,l l s:e i rfao i rnoT o . 111.1111 e ns of onus- mea- re so, it, acconlin on of baiankleurlystercleretlniontedgicigiemmbnny77l"gdegobecnuhrateerorol, the l' self-appointed, self-constit n and would used, thoseimbit Laudably, wiledc a i end courts i n ab s o t wublen ' t li t ° t nist Chia s n ot: iftaliAforee willjn a l atasseg u eustwot take im i l s a h ee - a s y :l:ot - ::ei l o o str m pit t e: cacti red e t'le .1v to ilised ”ted, h the Itself to bring to justice ; in other call . : a l ath.th ft e er th rauani a th t t itiimo el s o si t n h a e id c er hara atio ct n er it o ti f Merl t. and p si l d ea er th is a , t wyeu i h t ie is tbd i cier nco oth ns aii i t st A e e n xt t is is t lee in e ex. , could 1 ' the >owes what notions must have the a l the had I Ca. Ith th sia a hli t Hti al "Nbe ch ) WAS it for h his t his if the 1 sub. the debate. I speak of t exist- --......... emanating from th if had ning) 'rued, from it the general charecte n om . starce, that it is what I hay Malt on to that what I have done ? If 3 er- ased course of debate-if it tsible of argument--if it had mike detation, retracted and 41 land. anon take advantage of the in( if the expression occurs in a deli for it appears by proceedings that I thh f that that the obvious effect of t rhino that deliberation the w h o intr., sorely we =7 consider an ' evils showing the aWirnitB of t okiri eons. hatted it to their countryme f Ire 1 site have felt this, and th in tit. , vain, to extricate the Auoci one 1 i . k now them take somuch I fact 1 ''; .. wordy as plain in their nelt n th e j t - . (Chem.) in:_ We have been t renal . that H. Yar nell) , the Dien unto , this - expression had not er the sad"tnthe English. (A tan . ; duet: the ssattion must be r thei vi e -, I d awn ...__ . """ "most every on 4 -6 , '' • Wlh alPitles his endeavoured ,10 1 1 r mnia":edro"leceededhictihghtwv •