The Statesman. — London, England, 1819-03-19 00:00:00

On nor re-sdmissiee we fogad the Hesse in a Commiltrs nn thl. nisi, ..d . Mr. TIERNEY sieblng to bear from the Chi rellor of the Eschequer what permessetit seelleble sum h• eeperted condor the operation of the Rill ? • The CHANCELLOR. of the EXCHEQUER said. in his judgment 3.000.0001. Mr. 1 lERNEY.—The Right Hon. Gentleman save 3.1,00,0°01. Now, as far as my opinion gees, 'Unt x s;egle po,t;• le of it. Mr. M A REILLY whilied is meg lb@ Cheridellor of the Etchroser, whether. en that class of Esche ws., Bilis, for wbicliths Public retrieed so interest at 9•1. per diem on the bandied posed., the Bank of England did ant receive 21d. ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER. as at could sidoestaid, said it took place on bills or.. doe. Mr. MARRO.% said, that it thirtifore appeared, that on the mire hese of Exchequer Billet's@ Bank' ef Engle's', for these they WIC reeeired one-fifth inert lowed than the public creditor. It dill strike him, that ifs difference was seeds, the Bank should receive the smaller rate. The money lent by the Pub lic wee so much capital—the Batik of F.aglinsd bad only to set its mill at work. On lb. assess fpr limiflugthe amount to 6.000,0001. Mr. GRENFELL asktti why the Bill bad that limit ? Why did net the measure embrace the whole of the growing provist• ? Th. CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he followed the precedent of there/ 18013, when Mr. Parties' concluded his negotistions with • the Busk. _ Mr. h 1 A BERLY smelted, as a satisfaction to the -public creditor, that the question as to the amostat of the Bank balances to be mane available, shield be referred to the consideration of the Finance G•mit tee. _ _ _ Mr. lIUSICISSON observed, that the security of the public creditor Wag guaranteed by law, mod coold not be Influenced by any given amount of these balances to be made available. After a fr w further observations from Mr. Gun. fell and the Chvncellor of she &chequer, the clause wee agreed to, end the remitting clauses having bees goo, ehrnugh, the Hoare resented, and the Report of :he Committee was ordered to he received to-morrow. BANKRUPT LAWS. Mr. JOHN SMITH, is as Ting for letire to bring l i ve Silt to amend the fires relating to Bankr•ptcy, rook the oeportenity of stating to many Honsierable Gentlemen, who, be bad no doubt, were ignorant of the fact, that such was the confusion of the existing Code on that subject, that it was very difficult so say to whom It might or might not lie unexpectedly sp. died. He was induced to say this lucistiterpsence of e recent and retraordinary decisieo on the subject, end also with a view to call the attention of the House to the high importance of revising the system —not alone on 'crowd of the importance of it to the commercial world, bet as it involved mime of the most valuable interests of jestice and morality. The Ilsosourable Gentlemen then obtained leave to bring in the Hill. JUNIOR LORDS OF THE ADMIRALTY. Sir M. RIDLEY row, he said, in consequence of the notice he had giver, of moving ass Address to his Royal Highness the Prince Regent to reduce the 'somber of the monitor Lords of the Admiralty. He was sensible of the difficulty he Ist.••:ered under, not merely from a consciousness of i-ssility, bet from a recollection that it would ant he his power to add any thing to the strength of the upsilon(' already employed span this subject. With these feelings operating en him, the difficulty of the undertaking was still lightened bye conviction of its importance. lie bed Retuned himself that the necessity of agita ting this question now would have been prevented in consequence of the opinion expressed upon it derieg • fernier Session of Parliament, by a very consider. able minority in that House. When that opinion was echoed by the Public throughout the country, be felt some hope that it would have induced Ministers. when a vacancy occurred among the Junior Lords of the Admiralty, to advise his .royal Highness the Prince Regent not to make soy immediate appointment for filling it up. He should not have brought forward the question of re duction now, were it not that be felt it his duty an to do, when he perceived that Misiarers were not dir. pored to comply with the wishes of the country. Ile could not but feel surprised et the iddelicate burry with which an individual was lately 'whited i s , a vacant place in the Admiralty. The appnisoment cc. cursed while the discussion of the subjett was p.m!. ing, god when the writ was :noted for' in C411“.- 9 arm., of that appointment, he (Sir M. Ridley) runitately gave notire that he would briny it under the consideration of the House. It would have been bet proper on the part of Government, to with. bold the nomination of the individual alluded to while the propriety of confirming the place to whirls he was raised was under deliberation. The lest time be brought this subject before the House, the Noble Lord opposite (Cestlerengii), induced them ring to seppert his proposition, liveries. he raid it o es likely the matter would be referred to a Committee. Ile could sot bet take this opportunity of espressing his regret that, of late, there seemed a strong in. &Motion to depart from the mood old system, and to throw rather too much of the public huvittese into the bands of Committees.--(llcar . !)--The matter, as the Noble Lord said, was referred to a Committee, to whose Report lie would beg lease s • call their siltation. It was in the month of February he brought the sehject before the Hoes., and the Report made its appesrence in June. In that Re port, the comber end salaries of the Lords of the Admiralty were mentioned, bet with this ob - 'ion, that the Committee was withheld tr,.m recent. mending anything open the subject by a tale decision of the House. The Noble Lord (Castlereagh) was a Member of that Committee; se that at one time the Noble Lord disseaded the House from agitating the' subject, became It was to be referred to a Commit tee, and in the Committee, it was decided that they had no power to take it into consideration, le con. seqcence of a late vote of the Home. This was a standard by which the Report might be valued.— When brought forward it was only as as argument against discussion ; and if the Committee had recom mended that She number of junior Lords should be diminished, there was very little reason to 'sped that their retemeteedatioe would be attended to. Tilt ATATt.qMAN That such would be the case appeared frnin this tier. it was will tsewn that the *limier Lords were comsteure. _ The Comaiselenetwof the Navy Beard I only required to sign sueltollecueseets that were Weis so neaterees, that a Committee recommended , placed before them for that perpme. 'lt was per. an esetninetlee late the necessity of their cooties.' haps neeessary that some owe shoold be appointed once ' before any (date vacancies were filled up.' at the out-pert ; did if necessary, would they send However, contrary to the Report, twenties were , a person who could scarcely distingoists er74.gen filled up. Whatever may be the good qualities, or I ship from a eaail.cooch ?—At this period while the however high the character of the indisideal lately I country was in a slate of profound peace, be consi. l appointed ro a place in the Admiralty, it should net dered that three Sea Lords and pee Lay Lord were hr• done while the matter was ender coesiderdion. It quite competent to the basin's,. There were his was not the chewier of the individese bet the ne- views of the question, and the grounds open whirls entity of the office that could justify the cep. he should press the motion. The question was nue peleinient. He would now beg leave to call the at of considerable importance, because it was Jaspers. .aeration of the House to the Report of the Commit- tire upon the Hesse in protecting the gerierel into. lee attach sit in 1797. It was composed of men of rests of the community to cut of every place where considerable knowledge, of great ',patience, and lit might be elected without inconvenience, and that well inclined to terve the Public. Of this there t with the view of establishing the principle of re mold remain no doubt, when lie mentioned some of henchmen! and economy, and this of all periods was the names. Their late Speaker, the present Lord Col- the season for conducting politic busiems *pots a li cheater; Mr. Dudley Rder. now Lord Harrewby ; tidied scale. It would be well for the House, as Mr. Henry Thornton, and Mr. Charles Yorke, were guardians of the public purse, to 'tierce* a spirit of of that Committer. and they were not likely to re- i discretion, and he implored them before they ease commend any measure injurious to the country, or their votes to take into consideration the stare of the likely to take away from the necessary and salutary country, and be with confidence anticipated, teat power of the Crown. In this Report It was stated, his motion would he supported by a triumphant sea. bat the Committee thooght it their duty to observe, , jority. Ile thee snowed that an hatable Address be that there were six. Commissioners of the Nisi, be. I presented to his Royal Ittihad' the Prince Regent, sides the principal ; that no reduction was likely tol that his Royal Highness would be plumed to r. take place at present ; but that the Coodesttee the number of the Junior Lords of the Ada natty, thought it worthy of consideration, whether, if such es far as was consistent with the present state of the a reduction of the Nave took rise* as must diminish esentry et this reams of irrofnen.l peace. the besierca of the Onice, the member of Commis. Sir GEORGE COCK BURN would not have elopers end Clerks might net also be reduced.— rises on the present occasion, If the Honourable Bs. Ceevernment, in one respect, conformed to the Re- ronet bad not made a direct attack of an act of im part; bet whom did they dismiss? Was it those who' justice in the appointment of a Chaplain at Pons' were unnecessary sad quite useless? They reduced mouth. the clerks from 50 to 30 ; but in every other respect Sir M. W. RIDLEY said be had been mistaken. eetrencleneet arid economy gave way to the stronger Sir 0. COCKBURN proceeded. Ile had ender. lalleence of patronage. The !tininess of the office was stood the Henoerable Baronet to say, that the Chap., diminished, as appeared clearly by the diminution of !sin at Portsmouth had been appointed in cease. I the dere& Another proof of it was, that formerly I tweet of the influence he possessed in that borough; Iva Boards were held every week ; and they were this, however, was tint the case, anti be would state sow reduced to three.—(deer !)—This was ample the poetical'', to the Howe. After considerable peeof of a diminution of business. In the year 1797, discussions on the subject the Board decided that 1 140,000 seamen were voted foi the service of the three senior Chaplains should be appointed, one at year. Up to 1814, the number varier! from 140,000 Portsmouth, one at Plymouth, and one at Chatham ; to 1.10,000 mess, and there were 1000 sail in vita. after it had been thus determined, dispatches were mission. The number of seamen now were 40,030, dot dishing 'a return of the three sellers, and in the end all the ships of war in commission were only M. list received, the Gentleman at the heed was the one Yet for this number of seamen and Alps, tbete were who had been appointed to the Portsmouth station. as many Junior Lords of the Admiralty as when there This being the fact, he w Geld ask whether, he were 120,000 seamen, and 1000 ships in commission. could wee any decency base opposed the sp. They were of course either too few in the former po. pointmeat, because that Gentleman happened to be. ✓iod, or too many at present. There was no eons. long to Portsmouth ?—[Hear, hear!) —The lion. plaint of there beteg too few. It was right to pre. I Baronet had remarked upon the reductions that had CL't: te then, that sit Junior Lords were considered soy- I been made .in the Navy , a lt hou g h he believed the ficreirs ; oud that if sufficient when the Naval este. statement waled overrated ; them at present in corn biisliment was so large, there could be no necessity mission were divided Into 10 or 14 stations, to each for continuing them at present. It was tree, that Go. of which a Commentier.in-Chief was appointed, on vernment had made many redectioate in the Navy.— whom the miner tidiness devolved ; with thcse the They carried it perhaps further thee good policy re- Board had to support a centimes! correspondence, cloned. It was to be regretted that it was not kept added to which there were 9,oooofficers, dispersed sip to the fullest event, for it was the niters! tie. over all the quarters of the globe, with whoa a cot fence of the country ; and many persons who loved respondence was carried on ; for the Officers of the that country could not bat lament to see soother Navy differed frees thole of the Army; they were li service preferred to it. high as that service deserved able to be celled into immediate serstce, end it was to be valued. He hoped, if future circumstances consquently Necessary that their every movement should render war neavoidoble, Goverment would could be known; there were a.su numerous applies sent find it difficult to meet their twenties on that elle. lions made that required constant attention. During ment where the British Navy bad acquired so mach the war, the efforts of the Officers were directed to. glory.—[/Isar, bear, heart] —In such an event, be wards one object—the common eerie,' of the coon. much feared they could Dot easily conect a body of try ; but sow their talent, were directed le prim. seamen solicieut for the public service. With re. ciples of science, and namberlss were the plans for apect to Junior Lords of the Admiralty there was no Improvement of rigging, sails, bulk', and not cos. cease for eppreltension. They need not fear, in fined to these points, bet tbeir enquiries were "s -lime of necessity, to base as many josior Lords of tended to discoveries in astronomy ; it was tree, the Admiralty as they wanted. The colliery would many of the propositions were not olopted, yet they produce them without the least difficeity. While required attention, and were taken into considers. the Board of Admiralty continued so numerous, lion. Gentlemen who, like himself, had passed e Government, in other respects, bad recourse to great part of their lives la the sea service, meet m a redaction that might be spar ed—he alluded to ceive the necessity of a competent number of advisers. the Chaplains. A remonstrance was made on the He would ask the House, whether they ever knew subject • and the answer 'ensured war, that the re- two profession a l men a g reeon a professional subject; doted Chaplains shook! have a preference its port up. and to convince them of this, he might refer them to pointments to do harbour duty. This determination the conflicting opinions of physicians. The Lords of was just ; but how was it adhered to? lo Ports. the Admiralty, anthem to conduce to the public mouth an individual was eppeluted who had no claim letterset, had adopted • regular mode of proceeding.— at all. Ile did Not know v eracity the grounds of this Certain days were appointed for discussions, and appointment, but believed they might be looked others for correspondence. He could assure the for in the last Election. It could not be dieted Howse, that from the moment of his appointment en. that Government 'honed a disposition to act sport 111 the present, his !meagre had been incessant; so a system of economy end retrenchment, grime mesh se, that it was difficslt for him to take a walk in cases where it interfered with painterly. Ile even for half an hour ; and his colleagues IMO ill believed It to be a fact, that the person to whom he equal attendance, 'seeming they were not detained just alluded. received his appointment in commitment so late in the treating. lie felt the responsibility efelectioneeting exertions? What motive could there attaching to the tidies of the office, sod was be for continuing so many Lords of the Admiralty persuaded that three Sea Lords and three Lay snider present circumstance'. The fact was, that they Lords were absolutely Necessity. If the numb", had hardly say business except merely to receive was reduced, the difficulties that should be obviated I their eateries, and to egoist each ether in doing No. would occur ; and to conduct hosier's on an ad. l thing..-(Mr.Croker arfkd.)—The llonoerable Geo. 'adaptd plats, it was absolutely eecessety that demon might laugh. He should be glad to beer him there should be a decided majority one way or the esplrin elm the laborite of the Board were. The other.—(Loargeter.)—Any alteration would be basis epou which the Board of Admiralty woe con. highly prejudicial to the public interest, and the sp.' strutted, was in consequence of a Committee held tem bed been found obsoletely sectosary during a pe. thereupon during the reign of henry VIII. since tied of epwsrds of 100 years, and bad been lustre which period there were many instances where the mental in effectuallycoodscting lb t ryibroegb an Commissioners of the Admiralty were composed of a arduous war. During that period, ships were sent to sea smaller ounsher ; in 1704 there were four, in 1706 in a most imperfect condition; but now it was thedety l four, in 1714 five, in 1717 five, in 1775 five Lord es it bad been the end f the Lords of t►e 1 1 Sniti • ich. the First Lord ; in 1789, Earl Chetbarri Admiralty, to place the fleet in the most efficient state; at that time the First Lord, there were sir • in and he believed that it was at this moment its a mere the coulie of that year Sir F Drake was remove d I perfect condition thee it bad even beets before. Great death, and frees December 1789, to November 1790, attention had been paid to keep them tree from the the number of the Commissieeers was only five. dry rot, and to preserve the ships, so as to be ready (,)" referring to the documents within his command— for immediate service, Jai case if a renewal of the war. (although the Right Hon. Gentleman, he was aware, These I &Mkt occupied much time and Men. hail contradicted the statement ' bet he, of course, lion. Besides It was not to be espected that the Com. could only judge from the recor ds of the House)— missioners could always pass the year free from sick yet, from the documents to which be bad access, I nest ; and it was necessary that such an emergency there were never any specific estimates, they were might he provided spent. Ile apologised for basing included in the item of the midweek , ' of the Navy, I introduced himself to the notice of the Home, nor end this had been the course for limey yeses pest. would he, bed he not bees personally called upon. Another objection had been stated, that it was tie- Sir ISAAC COFFIN would ask the Right lion. cessary that the documents required to be signed by I Gentleman, whether tbe First Lind of the Admiralty three 'Commissioners: this difficulty might easily be had signed five documents, excepting the receipts fur sormounted by his Royal Highness the Prieto Re-' his salary ? Of what was the Beard now composed ? gent signifying, that the signature of two should be If that would restore it to the efficiency it formerly sufficient. Besides, general documents were signed possessed, he should not complain. by the Secretary, and it was only upon particular Sir G. COCKBURN having been asked a direct occasions that the signateres of the majority of the i question, replied, that the First Lord attended in his Commissioners was requisite; could any ma. be- turn, and was always punctual in his attendance. lie," that the First Laird of the Admiralty weld I Sir M. RIDLEY, io eaplenation, said, that he had allow the Junior Lords to she upon there the' written to Portsmouth, and was informed that the &potability polio!, 'attach's' to himself; for facts were as be had stated them to it,e House. • FA LGSART en.,, amidst ad cries of iltresifo rt,eprestion !--ife thnught tffielevech of the Hon. rra . ' oppositelended to show. that there had Median! Ni•efficAs of the Admiral'' , during the war. Ile bed dioptajerl the multiplicity of busi. nets that envied, the correspondence with the Com. maniere on the ten or twelve station A • sod the or reossry vonnsonication with the 8006 Neve! Offierrs. Notwithstanding this statement, he could got be p.r. seeded. that the business was not reduced 'Jae. th e resterstioe of peace. Whrn this subject had beaus formerly discut.se•f, it bed been argued that rhea., Offices were necessary es a school of elore , ion, requisite as a preparation for public haloes., but no men coold behest the person, pies of an equal quantity it business.—The patron age end iefluenee of the Crown was too Wended, at.:l where it was possible to reduce a place without injury, it was the imperative duty of the Hoes, to carry it into efrect ; sod could it be said that any danger would result Item the redaction of the two Officers now proposed! It would be degrading to the country if such a palpable imposition could he overlooked. perticelerly when promises of economy he.l here held forth; but if foilsmen/test was to be Confined to mere talking upon the subject. the Hoots would do well to vote in she large majorities antici. patrol by the Gollaut Admiral. It appeared that when specific retrenchment was proposed, either that it was not proper, or th.t the time was ill chosen. The fart eat, that no perticialsr objection prevailed, unless it touched the power of the Administration. He had no doubt of the laborious m a ti on s o f the Gallant Admiral; be bad not the pleasure *1 his cc apsainteace sufficient to know whether he could walk for half an hour in the day, but he need set be alarmed for the health of the Junior Lords, who found time to walk and to ride in Hyde Park every day. As to the offices being ac cessary, as initiatory to public basin's% be could sot forbear alluding to a certain Noble Marquis who Lihad been introduced ender that swegestiou; hot it was certeioly 'other 'Weir. that after he had been twelve months in ernce, and hod received his edeu tine, that he should be dismissed, and a Hammel be introduced without an Admiralty education. The 'skint. as Car as argument was concerned, he coo siderrd to be disposed of ; hot how via Junior Lord. could be necessary, nitre the ?levy originally con notes! of Itiau ships, out! 1-10,000 seamen, bat now reduced to 127 ors.ols, hr acs ate loss to conceive; sod when it was considered that peace generally pre. Tailed, be anticipated th .t the motion of his Ilea. Friend must be cart led by a largo majority ; nor could he beiieve, unless he saw it, that the House could oppose the propologi retrenchment. Mr. GRAHAM was engines to support the pria ciple of o my, because he considered by that alone the country would be enshi.-d to surmount hi difficeltieo. lie should be notion of the power of the Crown, but he ihneeht it bad too much inctesa.d, sod ought to be diminished. He was persuaded that the present Administration had boat the public confidence, end resisted every at. tempt to reduce those espences by which their is. Gera* wee supported. He thought an Administre. Lion might be folioed to conduct the business de. peudeot alone upon public opinion, instead of ore that was plated by the patronage of the Crevr• be yond its Inluente. Upon these principles the melee bed his cordial approbatirso and support. Mr. CANNING epnko in a low tone of voice, bet ooderstood kin to say, that he should oppose the motion. Lord 3. RUSSELL remarked, that the grounds oil which tins question bad bees formerly resisted Wet, epee the priteciple of edecating yoeng meta, bat now Ibis argesmet was abandoned, and it was found that 8000 Offices, were engaged in sew discoveries, amongst *Yids the orient* of eatroneney was intruded. The Lords of the Admiralty too had to decide upon the right of nations, hence it was necessary that they should receive a complete till, education, land have the works of Cyclist and PetTendert by heart.— It had bees said that two professional meta could not be sent to the ostports, because they seldom speed, and therefore as a remedy another ac companied them who was altogether Ipiorsat of tee business. It was however apparent that the messages of the Ministers had undergoes a considerable change.--Formerly say attempt In enquire into th- state of the Bask, or into the Criminal Law was strenseesly opposed, bet letterly,Cosomittees bad been appointed OS theme sees. sal subjects, and if the present usotioa was resist. ed. what wosid it be but soling to the coustry that se con cede t o as enquiry into the stale of the Bast a and into the Criminal law, bet as Ministers, we Idepend net os public opinion, nor the affectioeate attachment of the subject, bet we are supported end will protect tier ;toner supported by the patronage and places in the gift of the Crona.—(lleat,hear!) Mr. T. L. W. POLE did not consider that the intimate of the Crrwn was too myth iscreesed,Aed felt persuaded, if the lino. Member's opposite would consider the question dispiminnately, they wield form a different ovision. Of this he felt penueded, that many sot ti6ced their ;nitrate opinion to the Aries of popolailty. Strangers were ordered to withdraw, and the Reese divided, 'Mott there were— Noes atii I Ases Pit I Majorit♦ acetate the Mabee SI. The remaining Orders of the Day wet, then dis posed of, and the llosiio adjourned at Tee .'Clock. ILIKIJADOES PAPERS. We yesletday received lirrbadoes Papers to the tfith of J v. In the finale of Assembly, en the 49 , 11 of Dorember, a letter was read by the Clerk from Mr. Jordan, accompanying • pietism of Elsin Lord Itarewond, presented to the Colony by his de teendant, the pretest Noblemma of that mese. A role of thank *as immediately passed by t ft* Assert lily, and n trquest that his Lordship would sit for own picture, to be painted at the tiptoes of the Crrinny. _ . A Proclamation by Lnid Comberutere, (Merle( a rsemid of one hundred pounds, was used on the 3d of January, for the di•coeery of certain persons who bad malicionsly reported that the primaeval his Majesty's 311 Writ India Regiment had a disposition NI revolt and mutiny. The Proclamation seen, that the regiment has " borne the highest character for strict diniaine, courage, mod sebettlimalioll, whether in garrisoa or is the bold."