The Statesman. — London, England, 1823-02-11 00:00:00

~ 'KLEMM; Ofr"I'FIE COUN'I'Y OF SURKEt. PARLIAMENTARY REFORM. A Meeting of the Freeholders of the County of Surety took.place yesterday at Epsom, pursuant to a requisitiOn, signed by several of the Nobility, Gentry, and Frees boldest of the County, and presented to the High She riff (Palmer, Esq.) praying him to convene the Free holders of the County, for the purpose of %skim into rouslderation the great and increasing distresses of the ..rottotiy.. intl . the necessity of petitioning the House of cowmen,. for relief from the great and insupportable Aurden of Taxation, by which the nation was oppressed; and also for a speedy and effectual Reform of the Corn well. House of Parliament. Though the day was throughout very rain ~y et the freeholders and inhabitants began to assemble in the square in front of the Spread Eagle, soon after eleven o'clock. Large waitrons were drawn np in the form of a semi-circle for the accommodation of those gentlemen who were expected to take an active part in the proceed ings of the day. At 12 o'clock the principal Gentlemen of the county took their station in the waggons. Among the Noblemen and Gentlemen present, we observed Lord King, Lord Ellenborough, Mr. Denison, 1%/.P., Mr. H. G. Bennet, M.P., Mr. H. Somner, M.P., Islr. Maberlv. M.P., Captain Maberly, M.P., Mr. C. piked. M.P., Ms. Leech, &c. Mr. Cubbett was also prelent. , The Elton SHERIFF, in coming forward to open the Meeting, said be had invited the freeholders to assemble on that occasion in consequence of an application made to bins by a most numerous and respectable body of the Noblemen, Gentlemen, and Freeholders of the county. On receiving that application he felt it bits duty not to lose a moment in complying with the request it con tained. He should feel it further his duty to do every thing in his power to certify by his authority any reso lutions to which the Meeting might come: but having come to preside at the Meeting and not to deliberate or vote upon their proceedings, he hoped they would excuse him if lie declined putting himself in any situation which would render him either positively or constructively a petitioner.' Having brought his mind to this condo ms:ow, he felt himself bound in fairness and candour to state it publicly to the Meeting. Whether he was right or wrong he would not pretend to determine; but he assured the Meeting, that he had no political motive in *making such a decision—it was the result of the honest exercise of his judgmeot. He had done only that which the Meeting had an undonbted right to do, he had exercised a free opinion, the right to which be conceived to be a vital principle of the Constitution (hear, hear,) It was usual on such occasions to request the Meeting to preserve order ; this be would not do; lie felt persuaded that every man present would conduct himself in a manner becoming a freeholder of the county of Surrey. The Requisition was here read. It contained the 81W signatures, among which were those of several Noblemen and other leading Gentlemen of the county. Lard KIND said, that if in the distressed state to ;0•Ieli the country was reduced, any thin could give him satisfaction, he should feel it at perceiving the num ber and respectability of the signatures attached to the R ; because it was the best omen of the ulti mate success of that cense, the advocacy of which they hall undertaken. In the last Petition which they pre tented to the House of Commons, they stated that they would never cease to use all lawful means of calling for o Parliamentary Reform ;—he coasidered that the . appearance of the Meeting then before him proved that they were acting up to their declaration (applause). In their last Petition they stated that the Farmer was unable to cootiosseemploying the labourers necessary to the cultivation of his land ; —that the labourers had become paupers • —that taxation had swept away the whole produce of'the soil (cries of" it is too true"). He asked theta whether from the last year's experience they felt convinced that that statement was well founded ("it }s")? If w,. then the argument was still stronger than it was last year. They bad been told that meatiest was not the cause of the dist which they all felt; what else was the cause.of that distress ? They had now the same soil that they possessed before the war,they had the same prices, and yet they bad four times the taxation (hear, hear !). The taxes, including the expences of col lection, note amounted to 60,000,000/. There was not a single word more than this necessary to con vince them that taxation was the cause of the distress ; so much so, indeed, that the Landholders would have a eery excellent bargain if Government would give them the t fixes raised from time , will, and take its produce to themselves (bear'. and a. laugh). He knew not what was to be the doctrine of. the Treasury this year, but if they adhered to the doctrines uf la s t y ear, be could only say that a scheme more beneficial to the knaves who profited, or the fools who suffered, never had been attempted (hear. hear!). It was difficult in what man, ter to account for the insensibility shewn by Govern ment to the distress of the agricultural community.— Nothing could excuse it but an entire ignorance of the actual state of the country. Indeed there was more truth in this last supposition than was generally ima yined ; for if they looked to the lives and habits of the present Minister*, they must perceive that no one of them could know any thing of the actual state of the country unless what lie picked up from some of the clerks in his office.—(Laughter.) Phey required to be taught, to use the words of an eloquent writer, that " in every country the first creditor was the plough, that this WA, an original and indefeasible claim which super seded every other demand." This was the language of the celebrated air. Burke, in speaking of India, at a time when oar Government hill made themeelves mas ters of almost the whole of the produce of its soil.— They were told not only that taxation was nut the cause ' of distress, hut that the redaction of taxation about to ie made, would afford so relief.—(A person in the crowd —" Mr. Peel said so.") He really believed that this was true, for he looked not to the quality, but to the quantity of taxation about to be taken off. Suppose he were ill, and that a physician were to come to him with a grave face and say, " I shall give you some bark, but know it will do you no good." This wool(' depend upon the natureof the case. If a pound of bark were the proper remedy, but that instead of giving that quan tity the physician gave only an ounce, it would of rourse afford no relief. So lie feared it would be with Ministers ; they would give 'the ounce instead • • of the pound, and then say, " take it, but it will be of no use to you." But he contended Ministers hail not last year treated the country with Common honesty.— . They made no reduction, they thought of no reduction, trail they were actually compelled to it by the public juice ; even then before any thing was done, they felt their way, they calculated what would satisfy their sup porters: that Milflll4Bl7ll they gave ; and that minimum they would now give, when they found themselves com p -lied to it. Could any reduction be in tele tl.is year, when we had at least seine prospect of a war before us? 'lf so, then he asked why ass riot that reduction, made last year . ? Why was it not made during the lest six . years? It was dishonest dealing with the country to 'refuse doing so and proved that Ministers never would surrender one penny, unless compelled 'to do so by the voice of the country. They must all have remarked a tircomstance which took piece in the House of Commons last year. Ministers bad resisted the repeated calls of the country fur reflection ; they had resisted the per severing exertions of Mr. lame; they found it was an assault %won that paeronage, which, by a silent compact along themselves, they had determined to preserve ; the damped was a silent one, but by some strange .blunder, some unaccountable improdepee,the thins slipt oat :—a Minister of the Ctown openly declared, thM it was necessary to maks, a stand in defence of that patro nage, as it was necessary to carry on the Goverament. The House of Commons was certainly the only asserts. Illy in which such a declaration could have been madet but there it was received with satisfactioe. He would now pnintont the influence which this patronage gave to Ministers. Lit them - look to the army—they would there find a large portion of effective men, a portion certainly larger than necessary at a period like the present, bit they would find that there were general slicers, staff ofbLersk and other appointments msch.beyond the regular proportion of such an army in this or any other country, and why? Became those things were looked upon as prizes to Members of Parliament. The collection of the Revenue, the Civil List, Foreign Appointments—those several departments were prices to Members of Parlia ment for themselves or their dependents.—(Shame. shame!) Let them look to the Colonies—there were Islands, and Peninsulas, and Promontories, and whole coasts to he governed, and officered, and commanded in various ways, civil and military, affording a rich harvest to the prise speculators of the House of Commons and their friends and dependants. They bad heard of the Fortunate Islands, and they had heard too that Don Quixote bestowed the Government of the Island of Ba ratarir, upon his faithful 'Squire Sancho. That, how ever, was an ideal appointment, but however ideal our appointments might be, it was found that there were real salaries attached to them.--(Hear, hear, and a laugh.) Those were the abuses which they ought to pull down and abate, bat which could be only abated by an effectual Reform in Parliament. These abuses were the main cause of the present distresses—they arose out of our funding system during a long war, *ad with a depreciated currency. Our funding system was cer• tainly bad enough—other countries, it was true, bad paid the expences of their wars by depreciating their currency, but it was not to be found in the history of the world, that any country besides ourselves had brought into action those two destructive operations, a funding system and a depreciated currency. By this means we found It easy to enter into and support a war, but we now felt thteffects of the facility so afforded to us. He now came to a part of the subject which had much engaged public attention, and upon which he wished to say a few words—he meant the Public Debt. It was perfec ly true that ne cessity had no law, but even in the extremity of the country's distress, they would wish to do justice to every man—to do as they would wish to be done by. H. felt, too, that ender all the existing circumstances of the country, it would be neither wise nor polite to give Ministers too much encouragement. by recommend ing a reduction of the National Debt. He feared if they did so, Ministers would be glad to take them at their word: they already knew how anxious Ministers were to stretch forth their long arms, in order to fill their coffers, and therefore be feared they would be anxious to avail themselves of any pretext to relieve themselves from their engagements ;—indeed, be very much feared that if the Kentish Petition bad been put to a vote by ballot in the House of Commons, it would have gone hard with the public creditor (hear ! and a laugh].—Nor did the character oldish Ministers were in the habit of vaunting tend to dispel this fear. He re membered having heard of a man who, in speaking of himself, said, " 1 feel my honour and character stand so high, that I icould never be guilty of a mean or dirty action,—unless it were damnably to my advantage Danghing]."—lle feared, too, that if the proposed re auction were to take place, Ministers would apply the money to any thing but to the public benefit [hear hear]. —Before they touched the property of the public cred.tor, they were bound to reduce all offices, to abolish all useless places, in a word, to inquire into and economise in every tie parturent of the public service, without sparing a penuy to any man upon any pretence. The Irish Church Establishment, for instance, was enormous, it was beyond all idea, and certainly not necessary to be supported, at its prevent rate, for any goof purpose. In speaking thus, be wished to draw a diatinction between the ex emplary working clergy and the rectors, the . golden prebends and the wealthy bishops, with livings is com mend/rm. There was no Church on the Continent, the Esteblislituent of which had not been reduced. The English Church was the only Church in Europe which had escaped—He always considered the Church as a part of the Establishment of the country, and as such the Government bad a right to pay its functionaries in land or in pensions as it pleased. So strongly was this felt that Mr. Pitt intended to bring in la bill a ff ecting Church property, but lie was frightened out of it.— When all the resources of the country were necessary to its safety, the Church ought certainly to contribute its share. He would now state two or three facts. ex tracted from a book lately published, called (as we un derstood) " A Description of the House of Commons." He found that in the last Session. out of 40 Counties, 25 Members voted for Ministers, and 37 against them, in 69 cities and places where Elections were open 57 voted for Ministers, and 107 against. Io 99 cities and places where the election was resolved into individuals, 151 voted for Ministers, and twelve against them. From this it was clear, that io all places where elections were open, there was to be found a preponderance of hien'. bets who sympathised with, and voted in sapport of the interests of the people. A motion was made last year for a reduction of the Salt Tax—(hear. hear, hear,) — The Ministers at first resisted, and the question was then negatived.—[hear]—They afterwards gave it up of themselves. Upon the motion for the redaction of the Tax, the majority against the reduction was 169 of these. there were 14 County Members and 61 place men. In the Minority of 165 there were 42 County Members, so that the 14 County Members for Ministers preponderated against the 42 County Members who op posed them. In the saute pamphlet, it appeared, that 80 Members of the House of Commons received IEIO,OOOI. a year of the public money between them. After this statement it must be confessed that economy was not among the public virtues of the present Ministry. The people sent Members to Parliament to watch over their interests, but the Members once in, thought it better to look round and attend to their own. The only remedy for these complicated evils was a Reform of the House of Commons. The Noble Lord, after thanking the Meeting for the attention with which he had been beard, proposed that the following Petition (which he read) should be adopted by the Meeting : " TO THE HONOURABLE THE MOUSE OR VOIENONI: " The bumble Petition of the suffering Freeholders, Landowners, and Occupiers of Land ia the County of Surrey. " Snswava—Thst your Petitioners, after ebduring all the aggravated distresses which from day to day have pressed upon tbem with increasing weight since they last ex posed the state of their affairs before your Honourable House, in the month of February last, now again with all humility, approach your Honourable House, and pray for that relief which your Honourable House is alone able to afford. " Your Petitioners most humbly ventnre to remind your Honourable House, that experience has unfortunately con• firmed all the opinions contained in their former Petition; that the Farmers are at this time still less able to afford the labour necessary to due cultivation ; that the labourers in far greater numbers are compelled to become paupers ; that the further fall in the price of produce, which your Peti tioners anticipated, has actually taken place • and that the whole, or nearly the whole, of the gross pro duce is absorbed in taxes, tithes, wages. rates, and expenses attending the cultivation of the led. " That the relief which your Honourable lions, was p'eased to afford last year, is most inadequate to the press ing necessities of your Petitioners, who 'are again compelled, most humbly to implore your Ilenourable ~.. 1' tiEsTATEsMAN House to make n further and much • burden of Taxation, and particularly to rep eal the House and Window Tax, and the duties on Malt a nd on other ar ticles of the first necessity. grea t e r reduetion the " Your Petitioners entertain the most decided opinion that their present distress would never have been known, if the representation of the people had been consonant to the tong settled laws and Constitution of their country 111, 1 understand that a niajo7ity of the members of your Honour this House is returned. by a small number of individuals, Who have appropriated to themselves and to their own pri vate benefit, those rights which belong to the people at large. This unwarrantable conversion of a great public trust into a private property, has produced an endless train of abuses iu every department of the Government, both at home and abroad, every where apparent in the vicious system or boundless profusion. maintained for the sake of the Increase of pistroonge ; for this object, the public service and the public servants are paid at the dearest, and not at the cheap est rate, for which those services could be performed and fairly remenerateA, and the interest of those individuals who have usurped the property of returning Members to Sit in your Honourable lionise, or of those who exercie the trade of procuriag the return of Members, is preferred above every other consideration. " ln the Army a host of Generals and Field Officers, utterly disproportioned to the effective establishment, and unknown in any other country, and a nunerous ex?ensi% e Staff, are pelt) out of the produce of the Taxzs levird upon your humble and suffering Petitioners, for the benefit of the Members of your Honourable House,and of the other House of Parliament, or of their near connexions. • "In the Coionies a legion of Governors and Officers, en joying splendid appointments, and a geueral studied sy,tem of extravagance is maintained, and defrayed in great part from the produce of the Taxes levied upon your humble a*d suffering Petitioners, for the sake of patronage, and for Me benefit of the Members of your Honourable House, cud of the other House of Parliament, and of their near con- nellons. " In the Civil List, under the class of Foreign Ministers , most extravagant and unnecessary expense in the ordi nary and extraordinary charges, in the appointments of Ambassadors and Ministers. with very largely increased salaries and outfits, is incurred and defrayed from the produce of the Taxes levied upon your humble and suffering Petitioners, for the sake of the increase of patronage, for the benefit of the Members of your Honourable House, and of the other House of Parliameut, and of their near con nexions. ---------- In the revenue a large addition is made to the pnblie burdens pressing so severely npon your humble and suffer ing Petitioners, in c.ousequenee of the expen,ive mode of collection and management eirp.oyed in that department. which alone absorbs the sum of four millions ; ■ misap plication of the national resources retained for the sake of patronage fur the benefit of the near connexions nod supporters of the Members of your Honourable House. " Your Petitioners humbly represent to your Honour able House, that the pressing difficulties of the country urgently require that all these numerous abuses in the ad ministration ofpublic affairs, so injurious to your humble Petitioners, but so advantageous to the Members of your Honourable House, he speedily and thoroughly reformed, and the expenses of the state reduced to the stale of former and happier times. •' In a Parliament fully and fairly representing the people, your humble petitioners place their on.y hopes of salvation from impending rain ; they believe that an Assembly com posed of the real Representatives of the nation will alone be able to carry into effect a general system of severe eco nomy, and an unsparing retrenchment of the Civil and Mili tary Establishments, and of lit Oltices, Places, Sinecures, and Pensions, not merited by public services. " Your petitioners are confident that a reformed House of Commons will have the virtue and ability to apply the whole of the national resources to the relief of the public necessi ties, and rather than consummate the ruin of the Landed In terest, to de►ive resources from the sale of the Crown Lands. snd from the messes of test large mass of public properly at present employed in supporting the enormous Church Establishment in England and Ireland, which nay be re duced to a more moderate scale, without detriment to true religion or mo►ality. Your bumble petitioners suffering under the Intolerable weight of taxation in.pose.i upon them by the Acts of an unreformed Parliament, hat a reformed House of Commons will be able to apply the best remedy for the past, and at the same time to afford the only security for the future: they therefore most humbly pray your Honourable House to establialLett effectual Reform. nobbett's Addition to the Petition.) "Without which your petitioners can see no hope of that equitable adjustment with regard to the Public Debt. end with regard to all contratts between man and man, which Is absolutely necessary to the defence of the country against foreign foes, and to the restoration of Internal tranquillity." " And your petitioners will ever pray." The Petition was received with repeated cheers. Mr. Leacu seconded the motion. After the able and eloquent speech of the Noble Lord, it would appear unnecessary to add a single word upon the question of Reform. Bet when be looked to the distresses by which they were surrounded—when he considered that they had been petitioning year after year without any atten tion being shown to their wants or wishes, he, as a practical farmer, was anxious to point out how things were at present, and how II y were likely to be, unless some speedy. sad permanent relief was applied. lie had been for some time farming 500 acres of land, and for the benefit of landlords and tenants, and particularly those landlords who were not practical farmers, !.e wished to state the result of last year's experience. By tilt most accurate account he found, that at the end of the year, without reckoning one farthing of rent, the expenses were as nearly as possible equal to the produce of the farm. If this was so in his case, it was, he was sure, the case generally with all the farmers in the kingdom. This being so, the landowners who received rents received them out of the capitals of the tenants. —(Hear, hear.) It was said in the House of Commons that the landed interest was recovering, that rents were reduced to the standard of 179'2, and it was hoped that every thing would go on well. Were their rents reduced to the standard of 1792 ?—(No, no !) Theo, if not, they must go on paying their rents out of their capitals, and even it the rents were reduced to the standard of 1792, it would afford them no relief, unless they were better farmers than he was. If this were not done, the landlords would begin to find a deficiency, and then they would be induced to join hand in hand with the Reformers in pointing out excessive taxation as the cause of their distresses. He had forgotten to state, that his farm, though unproductive, was free from that odious and objectionable tax, called tithes. He used these terms without meaning any offence to the clergy ; he was most anxious to see them amply provided for, bat in a fairer or more equitable manner. The Hon. Gentleman, after alluding to the origin of tithes, ad vetted to Blackstone's description of the British Con stitution, in support of his argument as to what the House of Commons ought to be. That Learned Judge and ConstttntionalLawyer,sfter describing the functions of the various branches of the Constitution, proceeded as follows : Thus every branch of our civil polity supports and is supported, regulates and is regulated by the rest; fur the two Houses naturally drawing in two directions of opposite interest, and the prerogative in another still different from them both, they mutually keep each other from exceeding their proper limits; while the whole is prevented 'from separation, and artificially connected together by the mixed nature of the Crown, which is a part of the Legislative, and the sole Executive Magis- trate. Like three distinct powers in mechanics, they jointly imnpet the machine of (lovernment in a direction ' different from what either, acting by itself, would have done; but at the same dine in a direction partaking of each, and formed out of all ; a direction which consti tute: the true line of the liberty and happiness of the comnanity."—V al I, page 15:2. Tits stir wed whst the COI ititUtil4 OU4iii but where were the difietept pulling. to he seen in our Con stittition ? Did one House pull one wiry add the otbog another; and the Crown a third? No: they all went quietly together in support of th e Govern ment. In the same writer be found the following description of the House of Commons : " The Commons consist of all such men of property ,ds in , e the e ry kingdomone which teh as have fri n s o t a seatsvoic voice in i n t the rtHoweiaui, Parliament, either 4r personally or by his Representatives. In a free state every taan.sbo is supposed a free agent. ought to be in some measure his own Governor ; and therefore a branch at least of the legislative power should reside in the whole body of the people. And this power. when th.e territories of the State are small, aid its citizens easily known. should be exercised by the people le their agg s ru• gate or collective capacity, as was wisely °visited in the petty Republics of Greece, and the first rudiments of the Roman State."—Pages lsd and 9. Here they saw what the House of Commons alight id he, but he would ask whether it was 113 at present ? it,,i the body of the people any more controul over tha Hueso of Commons than the French people had ? The whole power and controul of Parliament were in the bands of the Government. Mt, Blackstone. speaking of the great power of Parliament, sage— " So that it is a metric most essential to the liberties of this It; vtlons that such Members he delegated to thi s important trust, as are most eminent for their probity, their fortitude and their knowledge: for it was a known apothegm of the great Lord Treasurer Burleish, that • England could never be ruined bat by a Parliament;' and as Sir Mat. Hale observes. this being the high est and greaten Court, over which none other can have jurisdiction in the kingdom, if by any means a misgo vernment should any way fall upon it, the subjects (dais kingdom are left without all manner of remedy. T o th e same purpose the President Montestprieu, though I trust too hastily presages that as Rome, Spaeth, and Carthage, have lost their liberty and perished—so the Constitu tion of England will in time lose its liberty, will perish —it will perish whenever the legislative Power shall become more -orrupt than the Esreutivs."—Ptge rise lion, lien leinan, after some further observatium, which want of tpace prevents us from* inserting, con• Bladed by giving his cordial support to the Petition. The HIGH SHERIFF was about to put the roes:ion, when Sir. Commas came forward to aildregs the lifeline. He was received with load applause. Wiflr the petition prepared by the Noble Lord, and every ;tart of it, he perfectly agreed. Hot it appeared to hem that there was one thing, and that too, a material thing, emitted in the Petition. He meant a reference to td present handed system. The Noble Lord, with his utdisl anxiety, and a very I tudabie anxiety it was, feared t:. trust in the hands of Ministers any thing which wonl.l give them the power of doing mischief. lie (tlr. Col.- bett) too, knowing them. would be sorry to place acv power or any money within their reach. Tile Noldt- Lord, too, wished a reduction of hive, but that was ft , t possible to any amount, unkis they reduced the de: t also (hear, hear !) He did not wish to do injustice is any one ; he did not wish to call upon Mini tiers to d . that which was unlawful, any such proceeding wouid only defeat its object. The reduction which he proposed in the National Debt, of course imagined a Reformed Parliament, in whom some confidence might be placed. Mr. Cobbett, after some further remarks, adverted to ill:. distress caused by the alteration in the currency. T: e bushel of u heat was the true standard. They borrow e t one bushel of wheat and were now obliged to pay thrr.: in return. He called upon them to leak at the magni• tude of the debt ; it was impossible to pay the interest of it; and at the same time keep up the establishment necessary for the protection of the country. The interest of the debt, including the expense ofeolieeting, •nmanted to 47,000,0001. And if they could pay that sum, it only §-- guided a little pinch more to extract from them what they paid at present. The landbeitter, the farmer, Re. 'shouter, were suffering in :degree never before known. Whoever knew a labourer working fur th - ree *MIR/Ts per week—(" they work for 25."3. awl after were they t., he told of a breach of faith with the public credit .r This was the language used at the time of the Frenc't Revolution. It had been well said, that the nation: I faith was first due to the landholder and tenant, and tad to the creditor of the State. Now, let the Meeting cot• alder what bad been the effect of the last 30 years cf sinking fowl? The landholders, who borrowed at 5 per cent., bad been,in addition, paying l-1,1100,01 . 1. for several years, which was, to use the oat phrase, " to be laid out in the market," that was to say, to be so laid out as to increase the value of the creditor s property; it was, in fact, giving him a kind of boon-, for the sinking fund could only be so considered. 11'. Cobbett concluded by moving the fallowing words an addition to the Petition :—" Without which veer Petitioners can see no hope of that equitable adjustme' , t with regard to the public debt, and with regard to a contracts between man sad. man, which is aboolutv'y necessary to the defence of the country against foreigu foes, and to the restoration of its internal trai,qu - lite." Lord &us:Donovan next presented himself to the Meeting. He said that be saw nothing in the nature of the Petition which had been read uliitb could indite& persons holding power, as the Petitioners stated, to coot • ply with it (clamuse and disapprobation). Lord Ellen borough said he appeared there in discharge of his duty; bat if the Meeting were net inclined to hear, he assured them he was not at all anxious to address them. His Lordship here retired, but by the advice of Mr. Grey Bennet and other gentlemen, be again came forward. He said that the only point on which he wished to ad dress the Meeting was with respect to the Amendment of the Gentleman who had just sat down. Against that Amendment lie entered his solemn protest. It wi,v natural that be (Mr. Cobbett) should wish to deal with the public creditor iu the same manner as he bad dealt with his own (hisses and cries of " that is us• fair"). Mr. Cooneyr.—Let the Noble Lord be heard. Lord ELLEtasononon.—An adjustment, as it was called, with the public creditor, would he nothing hot force ou the one side, and weakness on the other. NM' could such an act be fairly called national relief ;it would be only taking from the public creditor in order to give to the landholder-•it would be only giving advantage to one class to the ruin ~f another. Such were not the notions of justice and honesty in other end better times. England had been hi :herto famed for her faith, tier honesty and justice, and he could assure theta that any deviation from those principles could not serve them—he could assure them that what they learnt in their youth, " honesty is the;best policy," was strictly true. He protested against the Amendment of Mr. Cobbett, and he hoped that on the grounds of public faith and common hunesty,it would be rejected with M. dignation. 'the Honourable Mr. G. BENNET next came for ward, and was received with the loudest and warme.t expressions of regard. The Honourable Gentleman said, that as he had seconded the motion of Mr. Cobbett, and as the Noble Lord next him (Lord King) knew he had suggested, long before the Petition had been O'" nii t ted to the County, to introduce a panne similar to that'contained in the amendment—indeed, as he hsd used the very words " equitable adjustment," he felt it due to his character, and to the character of the Free holders, to explain himself. Had he ventured to SO:" port any proposition, opposed to the principles of iotrg• Pity an d of honour, it would follow that be intended 10 disgrace himself and the County too. He rose to repel :. . * 1 i i 1 i ia