The Statesman. — London, England, 1823-02-22 00:00:00

eyes proposed Fifty per Cent. would effect, was as fol. low, fee' Male Servants Z 139,600 Clerks, Stntmen, Travellers, 41e. %OM Your-wheeled Carriaeee 14e,e00 Two-wheeled Carriages 974,e01 The Mg er Class of Taxed Carts IMO Horses for Riding 32 ketie Lower Duties on I torses,Mules,Bte 7e,500 Ile now came to the consideration of that which was cer tainty one of the most important of Taxes to all classes of the commueity ; he meaut the Diity on Windows. The ge neral principle on whielt he proposed to feel with respect to vii. duty was to r.icitice it fifty per rent. He intended, how ever, to propose the absolute repeal of the duty on nee parti ester tease of individuals who were tit present !tepid to it.— The (louse were aware tat the windows of shops and e ounting-houses. di-tete:oil levet houset,were already exempt tettin the duty, It was his etentioc to propose the extension of that exemption to all it reuntl.floor windows, whether &t -weed to houses or not.— (Hem., hear, hear!) A few years ego the subject•lract horn irought under the consideration of the House, and many reasons had been assigned to show that it operated with peculiar seem ity (as it unquestionably did) upon the smaller classes of tradesmen. It was a tax which ttiose'classes were little able t i bear, obliged as they were to sub tit their goods fur sale in a shop wSndow, and liable as they frequently were to he met by the competition of persons, who, lia:itig moveable shops in which they could freely r wise the beauty of their wares, were enabled by their tee 'Teen from duty to carry on business more ad vantageous.y for themselves,and fee belt from him to say not i more advanteeeeus: v to the consumer.since the principleofatil commerce was to brit!: ,nods into the market at as cheap a price es pussiele. It was clear, however, that this lat ter class of persons had the advantage of the small sta tionary trAdesman from not paying the Window Tax, and therefore he proposed to relieve the latter from the burden of the tax—a reduction which would amount to 'bent 159,0;01 The reduction, therefore, el the As screed Taxes, would amount to 2,232,94101. Ile had not vet adverted to : reland ; but the question of Assessed )'axes in. Ireland was 010 of singular importance. — What lie meaat to propose wills tepee to th-m was at one, to rep• al them all—(hear, hear, hear) — '.. 4, . He was quite cure 'lett the peeler of Englend would not e,lgrudge tht ir paor brothers in !related any little advan tage over themeelves which this abolition of the A ed rot' Taxes in the letter country might give there. There e Pe • could be no tetiestion that the Assessed Taxes operated ,ef , with infinitely more severity in Ireland than in Ile+ tonn e try. They operated, h- meant to say, with peculiar se verity on those persoes in Ireland, wt 0 were so good as te .ply them.—(A laugh.) lie WWI I mite reedy, however, to take away all invidious distinctioes of that nature, by absolu'ely repealing the 'I axes altogether. The whole aunt that the Aseesied Trov' at present produced in Ire } Ind, did not exceed 10),(011. Hut he did net at all con ceive that their repeal it oule, in point of fact, cause any actual dated, ::atiou of the Revenue; fur those who had attendee to the recommendations tit the leommis-ionere anointed to inquire into the a ate of the Iteietiee in .1 i c'attd, would be ae are that the deficiency would be wade good be earryine into effect the suggestion to reputlize the ecs mus of the two countries; the present inequaloy of which eat attethe d by greet increase of expense, • w;th nit ail iucte:ise of Le- eht to [retell I. The s ate of )relend w .s a subject in Whiell he enlist say that he felt the greatest interest. This was pi riraps owing, pertly to hill 1 aving at one tithe of his life spent two years.' In ' D e land, partly to his baying considerable. vonrexitin with that (move!, lately lion the , ),ecueer eireitmeemet 5 in which that country was 34 teeny respects pieced —eircnnistanees jet° d:fferent trent those in ::hick Bright' I hem I herself. No 11140 could be mote stnsible titan himself of the many high and honourable qualities of the peoole of Ireland ; kit . , it was impomiele net to lm aware of the peculiar circein - *tatters ivldelt had so pernicious an effect on social Meier in that comery. There ens no one cireurnitance, how ever. it, the conditien of Ireland respecting which he 1:Ic so warmly as the 'resent state of the Distiller Laws.—(lle.t..) The Honise knew how large a portion of the revenue of I relen I was derived front tho laws ; but they tate knew eow much dist. oss was produced, how many soei it interests e ere sunlit ed, and how many in c iletiettle evils were occasioned by the unfortunete situ ation in which thin-c Iris placed the Irish people. It was imp. slible to raise the revenue Iv untled on those laws with out alarm. 1 t cc as imps:tittle to raise it without the ale of the Army, and the eensteptent danger of disturbing the e ulilie peace. It was impossible to raise it without mak ing it the duty of the magistrates and landlords to pur sue and bunt out their tenants, men t n•it led to their kindness tool piotection. It was impossible to raise it v, ithotti pie ins; those tenants in direct opposition and Lostility to tee individuals e hum they ought to regard with affection and respect. Ile could not conceive any sestein better calculated than the presetit to insttre the perpetuittieu of an evil of the most grievous and indette fetid elierareer, tee destruction of all kindly feelings, and of all eoutunteity of interest between a people cud their liovernment. Ile trusted that it was P. enbject which etoeld Le most 'deeply and sari, tidy consid. red by the house ; en I that they would at Itteegth unlertake the cask of endeavouring, by an allertaion of the distillery lace of Indeed, to remove the monstrous evil which tel present existed, and to testi:ye—no, he would not say restore, for unhappily I relae:l had neyer enjoyed the ad vantage-- tut to confer tio the lueer clessea ef Ireland, the t ame social order n keel% the pttople of this rennin; knew how to estiniete in ceeeeeenenreuf having so lone enjoyed it. Tens teeliette, it wits Lis intention to propose a mea rote wide!' Ilea;thready undergone a very extensive eon eideration be the Commissioners on the revenue in Ire land, ve hiche comprehended a great reduction in the amount of tote duty of Irish distillation. It was an ex- 1 pertinent well nee tit teeing. It might, or it might not, eeeelteetly affect the revenue. At any rate, let it be leietis Ife nil 3 of opinion that, ultimately, it would toe at all affect the amount of the revenue; but, look ing- at the cut - seen in the light in which he viewed it, even if be thought differently, he would still try the elea periment. Ile did not think Parliatuent would be justi •fi .d in al.etaireng front a trial of the experiment, even if the result seueld be to defeat the calculations which he I a I that eight submitted to the house, and to enable I ',mem-able tientleinen to tell him that the surplus of zi'verne eier expenditure, which he had promised the . ilunity, lad nut been realised. lie would much rather Iteer risc tee um of such a discomfiture, than consent to a 4 onsionelion of the evils which the preseat Distillery Lasts inthierti en In.) tiel.—(hear, beer, bear.)—"l have 'few," said the Big lit Honourable tientlemart, "con cluded tbe duty whelp the official situation that I Lave the loolour to hole necessarily imposed upon me; and I will cum lade by stating to the House the general result of the view which ll at duty has compelled lee to tike of the situation of the country. We Lave an increasing foreign commerce—we have an tertessi• g dionesfic consumptioe, we have an increasing es•e one comfort aitioug till the ela,seg t •f the community ; aim, PS t• e natural consequence of all these, we have an 1 CleeSii r, re trtouti. We are now enabled td apply a per tion of our itereased revenue to the reduction of our debt, we are enabled to apply another portion of our increased revenue to the diminution of our taxation. 1 thief:, 110W tvcr, I may sat, without liesitaticm, that in Mat very re clue:ion ut taxation we shah 1111.1 some eompensatiou to the rtae tie, Styli. Sir, is the result of the ststemeles which I have tat,. ts the ii •et t) of lacing before the Committee. If it tor 4:orrect. who can look riack tit the efforts which we hare wadi: —e Wean look hack to the difficulties with which we Lave contended—who Call look hack at the dangers by whirl' we have- burn yurrouittled—elio can look back et the sacrifices to es ttieh we have coesented, in order to epoilify ourselt es to meet and to triumph over these dang-rs—wtio Call look hack on ail thing., mid who can contemplate the present prosperity of the country, without feeling an in creased eteolitnent for those nub.., mid I hope immortal, - ~..~ ~.r. THE' STATESMAN. liiititations which have for their basis civil and religion , liberty, and widen are the unbending supporters of our Ha tionai glory and happiness ?"—(The Right Hon. Gentleness sat down amidst long and continued cheers.) dlr. MAIIERLY said, that in following the Right Honourable Gentleman he should request the indolgenco or the house. The Right Honourable Gentlenart was surrounded by all the official accounts, to which he could have recours • at pleasure, an a !vantage of which he (Mr. Moberly) was deprived ; those accounts not having vet been presented to the boo e. Before he adverted to the part of the subject which he considered as of the great est importance, de would offer a few remarks on the cre dit which the Right Honourable Gentleman assumed for making a reducti n in the Estimates of the present year to between a mullion and a million and a half beyond the anti, ipation of the Pittance Couttnittee of 1817. He con fessed not to give the Right Honourable Gentleman credit for this reouction ; hecaese the statement of the Right Honourable Gentleman himself involved a cow plete censure on his slajesty's Government for not having sooner accomplished the reduction. (The Honourable Gentleman here entered into several calculations, which the noise that prevailed in the house prevented us from distinctly hearins, to prove that hail Government at tended to the remit eendations of the Finance C 'tree ten millions would by this time have been save Ito the country) Adverting to whet the Right Honourable Gentleman had said of the reduction of the rap nee of collecting the revenue in Great Britain, which since the year 1818 amounted to 130,0001. and also of the reduc tion of the expense of collecting the revenue in Ireland, which, since the year 1819, amounted only to 3,0001., he contended that a reduction so small did no' evince the exercise of much vigilance in the detection of abuse. —(Hear, hear.) With respect to several of the Esti mates of the Right Honourable Gentleman. not havidg the official accounts he could not speak accurately to them; I hut lie trusted that he should not be thereby precluded from any future observations. The result Of the Right Hon. Gentleman's proposition was to reduce taxation to the amount Of 2,232,0001. He apprehended ilia , the great question between the Right lion. Gentlemen and himself related to the way in which it was advisable to sapport public credit. The Right Honourable Gentleman said that the only way to rapport public r redit was to employ an excess of taxation to the amount of five millions to the redemption id the debt. If he (Mr. laberly) could show that it ea. possible to support public credit with out tat,ci-r - g those five millions trout toe pockets of the peopiic -did that time five millions which the Itt. Honour able Gentleman proposed to apply to the liquidation of the debt might be added to the other two millions, and the whole seven applied to the reduction of taxation, lie thought the houw ought to adopt li;s spew of the subject. Much stress hail bees l igd by ineny persons on what was formerly called the Sinking Fund, as having mainly so; ported public credit. He ha I already stated in that house that it was notorious that the. Sinking Fund, in. %tract cf being 'diminished, had actually increased the debt. If the calculations of a very able roan, Mr. Marshall, were to be trusted, that Gentleman h.d shoe n in a tits poet statement of debtor and creditor, that in stead of having diminished the debt, the Sinking Fond lied created be. wren twenty soil thirty millions of debt 'beyond that which ;timid have existed had it not been established. Hoot that could be said to support public credit which had thus added to the public debt, he (Mr. Maberly)was at a loss to toneeive. But now a new light seemed to have broken in upon the subject. After thirty years experience, it ea' now on all hands allowed that the only ethcient Sinking Fund was a surplus of in. come over expenditure. The Right Honourable Gentle. man had not stated whether the five millions were to go on at compound interest or not. The CHANCELIAMI of the EXCHEQUER said a few cords across the table which were inaudible in the Gallery. Mr. MA MALY proceeded. The abandonment of the principle on which the old Sinking Fund had been esta blished, had converted all the public annuities iwo annul ties for ever. As the old Sinking Fund, therefore, had nut reduced the debt, it eas unfair to conclude that the inaiteenance of public credit dill not require the reduction of the Behr. If so, instead of appli ing the five million,' to the support of a Sinking Fund, why t.ot apply it in another manner not new in principle nor in practice ? Ile would cull the attention of the l ouimittee to what Mr. Pitt had said of the Act for the redemption of the Land Tax, which lie passed, not withstanding the numerous ob jections that were made to it in that House. It wasstated y Mr. Pitt that the principle of the Bill was so simple, ' • and its advantages so certain, that he could not cone ive what objection could he made to it. Now it would he re collected that when Pitt passed the Land Tax Redemp tion Bill the amount was about two millions, subseeient lv, during a period of about 25 years, 700,0001. was re deemed. and there remained unredeemed between 12 and 1.300,0001. At present the operation of the act was re tarded by the high price of redemption which occasioned a sacrifice in the first instance of Iol.,and in the second of 201. per cent. In consequence, during the last three years it had gone on so languidly, that it would take, on an average, 500 years to redeem the tax. Are , rding to his plan, as contained in the Ileoslution which Le would have the honour of submitting to the Hollow, about -11.300.0001. of debt would be cancelled, which would he more than could be effected by the application of an effi cient Sinking Fund of five minium during seven vears.—What, then, he would ask, could be the ne ce.sity of keeping tip taxes to the amount of that five mil ions? The Right Honourable Gentleman had argued very much to show that the people were not distressed, nut were in a comparative state ofatiluence and prosperity. Ile agreed with him that the people general. ly ac re nut so witch impoverish, d as they were sow- time ago, bat still he must contend, that there was a large, class of the population not quite in a state of either pa sitive or comparative affluence whom a remission of taxes Must relieve, (hear, hear!) but he did not conceive the reduction of taxes by the application of the Sinking Fund fur the next seven years would satisfy them. He ens of opinion, that the operation of the Land Tax re demption Bill could be much f teilitated by the cotafer ing not only votes for the country, but creating qttalifi.l cations for the Magistracy, and holding forth other in ducements to the public ; he only wished to grant that which the people hail a right to demand without disho nour or inconvenience to public credit, or injury to the character of the nation ; he was sure that if lie could spew' the Revenue of the country would be increased, while its burthens were diminished, the house would go along with him in his proposition ; he eat prepared to prove to the Right Honourable Gentleman that the re duction of seven millions of takes would not be pro. (Fictive of an equivalent loss to die State. The Remis sion of Taxes eo a be operaive upon the population, so as to incr. ate the number and the consumption, and he thought this would be felt to •he anoint - at iedet of One million. With re:lfeet to Ireland, he believed it to he mulch within the proper estimate, that 400,0001. coal I be saved in tae collection of the revenue. Tue Coonitts stoners to that country lie highly. ring ectrd is individuals, and he thought they had done the du y of their appoint. teent with fidelity and honour. At the sane time he mein say, that while he agreed with every word of their manly, faithful and honest Ilepert, It- must eons'• der that it conveyed the most direct and decisive censure upon the conduct of Ministers, who took no steps previ ously to alter that system by whirls the Revenue in that country was ro!leeted at the rate of 22 per Cent., a tbtng not to be borne (hear, hear!), so that it appealed Minis ters had at length been compelled to do, it h it they ou ght to have accomplished volunt wily long before. Front that source be anticipated a sating of about 400,0001. The Right lintsAirahle 0 n•lee^in stated s !quiets. At seven iniil'oop, au t a pru o utt onalil • re :ut lion nl All.e lied Taves. Ho 11..1 nl4O stated, Oat 2.0,114/u bzht he savint in add; tion in the eollert'ol of he 1' oc-• the Customs alone. Bnt he vtonld trot c-nselt to np any h►snch of than Totes eoltild-t.le, herann. patron age was ronrersied in the support of the Es ablislimeiii. H• ho• ed on comideralion such a prinrip!• would h. abandoned. He (Mr. M.) ishis convinced that much greater s.vinrr might he made in the collectio t th.n th Right Hon ntrable ticn•leman hail anticipate t. He b Faced that in England and Scotland the saving in tb• collection of the Beer Duties might he two hundred thousand pounds, the present rate - being Nine per Crni. Hy the savings whir h be had stated, and others in the Army and Navy and other departments, he was con vinced they might go much lower, and that at nu distant time there was a prospect of an.ine eeeee of the Revenue of four millions, from th• sources u lie had stated. There was no longer, he contended, a real necessity 01 railing on the people for the five millions of taxes. He never had an intention of robbing the public creditor— no man was more anxious than he that public credit should be supported. The public eresiitor hail a fair clai,n upon the country, and he was sorry it should go abroad that he (Mr. M.) wi-hesi to imp sir that claim ; he rams prepared to show that seven millions of taxes migi,t be repealed, and yet the public credit lie as well support ed a" now he would now solndt Resolutions. Hi re Mr. °HOIDEN, the Chairman of the Com mittee, itated, that such proceeding would be informal, and Mr. MARERIN said, he wont I read the Resolutions as explanatory of his object, wbieli lie did as follows: " I. That by the Resolutions voted by this House in the year 1819, it waid••rm expedient that inefficient Sink ing Fund should he created to Cie amount of 6 millions. 2. That at the time in nsiestion. it WAX agreed unani mously, that the only Shaking Fund which can be tfneient. is. that which is produced by a surplus of income over ex pendi tu re. "3. That as far as can be enrected frota the papers laid upon the Table of the Douse. there actually exists a sum of about five million;, applicable tJ the reduction of the Na tional Debt. " 4. That in addition to Mese fire millions, applicable to the reduction of the debt, there is at the disposition of Par• liament, arising from the increased productiveness of several branches of Revenue, and the various plans of reform and economy in the administration of the country, proposed to be carried into execution this year, a sum of about 200.004, "6. That it appears. therefore, that s total sum or 7,ioo,ottot. ari..iug from the above mentioned cowers, Is applicable to the maintenance of puhlic credit. and to the relief of agricultural or other distress, by remission of taxation. - - •• ti. That although It was determined, that the capital stock purchased by the Commiszioners kr the redemption of the National Debt. with this efficient Sinking Fund, should betransferred to their account, it was nevertheless understood, that tne interest payable upon stock so pur chased. should either determine at the time of purchase, or be paid over and heroine part of the Consolidated Fund. •• 7. That taking SW. as the price of 1001. in 3 per Cent. ('onsol stock, it appears that tire millions of money annually laid out during. the space of seven years. would retleein about t3,7S't,lKKtl. of Three per Cent. Annuities, but should we re ain at peace it would redeem a much smaller sae. _ " S. That in the year 1794, for the support of public cre dit, there was passed en Act for the redemption and pur chase of Land Tax, which act, from the exorbitant conditions attached to such redemption and purchase, has in a great measure filled in effecting the destined object. **P. That notwithstanding the obetncleet thus created, such has been the stosa3ety of th • public to redeem their land. am" to purchase landed securities, that the seen redeemed and purchased amounts to 71)0.0001. and upwards. •• 10. That If so large a proportion of the Lend Tax has been retteesteed and purchased, at a secrifice, in the first in stance of 101. and in the second of 201. per cent. it is but rosonnble to conclude that the remaining balance of 1e230.7011, would be similarly redeemed and purchased if uo sacrifice was nrce.ssarv. " I I. That it appears that 1,239,701/. of Land Tax, thus redeemed and purchased, and paid for in 3 per Cent. Con solidated Annuitiee, would cancel a sum, in such annuities, of about 41.3:30,0001. being wore than th; amount that would be pur:hased by the regular investment of the Sink ing Fund, in Stock, for the space of seven years, if we re main at peace. " 12. That it appears that this method of reducing debt by no means differs in its substance from that which was adopted by the House in the Resolutions of 1919, the essen tial attributes of both plans being the maintenance of public credit, by the diminution of the quantity of debt. " IS. That as the mode (.4 redeeming the National Debt by redemption and purchase of Land 'Fax injures no class of proprietors, end will absorb a quantity of debt nearly equal to that which would be redeemed by an efficient Sink ing Fun.) of five millions, annually laid out during seven years, it is expedient to substitute it for the Sinking Fund adopted in the Resolutions of the House of 1619. " 14. That by this substitution there may he remitted to the people, in alleviation of their distress, seven millions of taxes." The Honourable Member continued, that if he bad mistaken the musk of relieving public credit, it was not from want of inclination to relieve it as effie:tually as any Member of that house could wish do do ; and sure he Iva., that in stating this plan, he was convinced, that if carried into execution it would effect the object pro posed, and if lost, it would he lost through want of ability in the person who bad the honour to propose it.—(Cheers from the Opposition.) Mr. RICARDO, who next addressed the House, was inaudible during the first two or three sentences of his speech. The MIL Aleauber went on to express his as tisfaction at having heard the learned, able and excel lent speech of the Right Honourable the Chancellor of the Exchequer. They haul heard that schools of economy ought nut to be encouraged, but never haul political economy so great a triumph as in the speech of that Right flonourahle Gentletnar,—(Cheers)—aml never had a Minister, filling that situation, advanced such ex cellent principles of sound philosophy anti common sense.—(liear.)—'f here was only one dillerence between that hon. gent. and himself, and that was with respect to the clear surplus. Ha (Mr. R.)thad stated last year, that in the Ast respecting the pensions they were only transferring from one hand to ano , lier, and that when the plan wits carried into execu!ion, tuey could only relieve the taxes by a clear sinkirg fond of 33.100,000/., in,t-ad of 5,000.00/. This waS the only dill-relive between the Right Hon. Gentleman an I him self; he was prepared to go along uith hint ia every other respect. he alio sec, the importance of dimieish hug the debt; but it uas under the impressioa Chit a Sinking Fund was 111)PliCabl. • to that purpose, but *hick, from all the expetienee witieh 11 , 1 bad had of it, lie thought blurs-151 e (hear, hear, hear!). lu his opinion the only hot le of diminishing the terrific debt was by a pr .p urtionitte co utrilmtion from the cap t.l of the coun try (hear). Awl if the greater iterrilice were vrecticalile, es hy not co:atrihtre the sin ,l'er am twit of ca u .i tut: lie Lacked 'titan Faxes in two pain sof view ; ore cl iss wet-. ra'se 1 to pay oil' a deh , , and the ot'mr to defr ty o'er expenditure.—The termer were p .id hack to the tunu tr and the latter for ever Lett to it. Tide was a die- Unction which had nut bee -h hitherto c learly ander:4oml. Ile believed the reduction of the debt to he practicable at this moment ; butt he was convinced at tbe same time that they could nut have a Sinkinz Fund ku pt sacred fer the parpm.e. in support ut th's opinion, he n ishe.l to cell the a - termer' of the house to a pamphlet, purported b set to.warti by Ministers (cries of 'nu, nut,' on the Treasury lieutehes, and most emrhatteally by Mr. Canning anul Mr. Robin on); tottwhetner it was !lie wotkaf Ministers or not, it contained the arguments which Mirnst:Ts generelly use.t, and therefore he was warrant d in replying to them. In that pamphlet it was stated, that the Sinking Fund had two' r._ . , ~~ or three objects t one was the paying off the debt due to this public, and so tar there should be rso other purpose; the other was for going on with the war, by an accumulation at momponnd interest. whenever the enemy pleased to attack us. Bat he would call upon Ministers to state what the real object of the Sinking Fund was? Was it to be applied by ...emptied interest to the reduction of the debt, or was it for t ► e purposes of war? I the of the objects should be distinctly explyined, and Ministers ought to make an honest avowal. —lf I. were necessary to repeal aggression it was more coefoitctlnnal that Ministers should come down to that House and call for a war expenditure to be regularly voted, than to apply a fond appropriated to the paying off a public d. bt to repecling a foreign enemy. He had felt it his duty to make these few observations in support of the prierlp!es which he had Althea , ' advocated, and explanatory of that . . tile of conduct which It was his determinitton to itteport. Mr. A: BARING said he had felt considerable plea- Yore at hearing the able and eloquent statement of the Kiehl Hu gaurahle the Chancellor of the Exchequer. — Nit dug could he more explicit or clear, and as far as he understood that Right lion. Gen:leman, lie felt con vinced that nothing could be more sound oe satisfactory to the country. He did, howese-, conceive with the Homalsonher fir Porta•lingt n (atr.Ricearda,) that the SinkingFun4.aa it now stilud,wnst he rated at 3,000,0001. lost ad of 5 000,9001. but he was pleased to find, that we had a permanent Sinkime Fend of even 3,ooo,eiHtl. by which there might he produ , •ed a remiss on of taxes to' the amount of 2,2110.11f0i. In viewing the situ itioe of • the country, he could not suet) use , that even a Sinkiog Fund (which was a term in great disrepute) could go ota without a surplus Revenue, so as to support the public credit of the nation, or its independrnee in the world:—et . But the Hon. Member was for sweeping it away altoge ther, on account of the expences necessary to maiettin it. He did not know any ground for exceeding to that tyro. sition beyond the advice of the Right Bon. Member himself. He would now ray a word about that out awe calumniated principle the Old Sinking Fund if air: ts i eg tended to our repreaeh in that principle, it ea., that we li id allowed it to obtain a bad name. Howeve!, in the commencement no Statesman could have foreseen the protracted war in which this country wassuhseqmmen.- ly plunged. Previously to the French revolution these was no war in which the English were engaged, of more than five or six years duration ; and generally, before that period. the distress of our fiaances put a termination to hostilities. The country, by the establishment of the Sinking Fund, alas enable I to go en vetch longer, and to maintain the system of extr4ordinary wartare with unparalleled ener ; :y and success. It was not tim e Sinking Fund to which the country could rationally ob ject, hut to a system of mismanagement totally distinct Ifrom the principle of its original institution (hear hear a sys•em which, while it created a nominal Sinking Fund of 16,Mt0,0001. or 11,0011,0001., left no stuff: cleat capital to liquidate the public debt in the man ner originally proposed. The Ilosoureble Mem b-r fur Aberdeen (Alr. Hume) had attemot ed to sheer, in the Resolutions which he had formerly sub mitted to the house, the absurdity of time Sinking Fond ; hut which objection applied to the Sinking Fund when fallacious, and not real. He (Mr. Baring) wou'd • alio see the country in pYssessiun of a Sinking Fund ot esee 4,1100,00111.. or 3,1100,010 b, or 2,500,0001. if applied by compound intriest to the reduction of the debt, Bete without any such fund. The opposition to the Sinking Fond, he was convinced, arose from mistake, as if tt:e system of mimeo timil interest had never been contemplated in its original 'fortnetion. Bat that system of compolett • interest Wit't 100014 for time purpose of nut disturbieg the taxes every year. The Hunourahle Member ha I stated. th mt one o ,sand p tunds annually applied womull only have the Caine effect as 1,0001. at compound interest in discharge of the debt. But it was clear that- , 11 tt mem mnlating ieterest preelnded the necessity of a 'limiter stun moving in the shape of taxation. He was not fora eine of 200,000/. or:m00,900f. being thrown upon the Table to Le scratuned for every yeir by every interns: that cunceiven it had a right to divide the spoil. What he wished t see established was a real and efficieut Sinking Fu• to the amount of 5,900.1100 f. in its original and legs - mate operation, Many Goalie:eel might ask *hat us.; the c'e tit continuing a Sinking Fund of 4 000.1100!. 5.1100,01101. or %vie:• effectual relief could be afforded frost it, nook the country laboered under r debt of upwar:.te of 800,000,09111. ? •lo ties he would answer, that a stee.ey and permanent Sinliirg Fund to the amount of 5,000,0110/. would give a stability to public credit, and at the same time enable Ministers to obtain a supply fur any defend which, under peculiar circumstances, they might fie' it necessary to make upon the country (lea-, hear!). By the o e eration of an efficient Sinking Fent:, Government would hr enabled to reduce the 4 per cerit!.. to 3 per cents.; it would in short citable them to estalmi such a system as would give them the power of ineeline• all the demands wleeti the 'mink services might require. It had been urged, and strongly urged, that the agricultural interests were surely distressed; true they were severity distressed ; hut those who proposed. the abolition of time Sinking Fund as a means of relieving them, were mistaken. Any relief which the abolition of the Sinking Fund, sup posing it to be applied to the agricultural distresses, would be poor and paltry ; whir, on time other hand, it would have the effect of directing the thating capital of the country into over and perhaps immure eistailt channels. Should this be the case, no persons wonld suffer more severely than those agriculturists, roe whose benefit the measure was proposed. —(Rear, hear.) Having said so much, he now felt it neces sary to ask the Right lion. the Chancellor of the Exchequer in what shape it was intended to continue the operations of the Sinking Fund? The CII e X cur.ort of the EXCHEQUER sad he bad forgutteim to mention met it was his intention to propose a measure which would have the effect or simplifying the ope rations of the Sinking Fund.—(Bear, hear.) Mr. RORER TeON made sums observations which were not perfectly audible in the Gallery ; we tinderstoed the Honooreble Member to contend in favour of the II!'- cessity of supporting the Landed Interest—al I ritere:t upon which, alter all, the Govern:molt must rely for its re euarces.—(Hear, hear ) dlr. HIJAIE . commenced by observing that lie never Lenard a statement from Alimmisters with more pleasure than he had heard that of the Right lion. Gent. opposite (near, hear.) IM could not, however, help expressing something like re. ret, at hearing it stee I, that the Sink ing Fund yin, as i• was now constituted, calculated of support public credit. Ile contended that the present Sinking Fund placed in time pourer of Mitmis'ers a !Mid Ile moues which it was not likely, if not cer:ain, they would apply to any thing but its pro?er us- (hear, hear ) arid contended that the hen st p would be to give the country relief from Taxation to the amount of the 111114 now protemseui to be kept as a Sinking Fula Let this lie done, aid Alittisters milt with every confidence rely upon the exertions of the country, should circoom stances arise to coil Ahem forth (hear, hear trout the Opposition :) Ile joined With the Chancellor of the Excheyeer in the %%jab to mei 'mean the public credit. In every situation faith ought to t e kept, and he trusted that the Landed Interest would not seek relief by any act that iv oolil he irjeriuus to rite other interests of the country, hut-Gm:it they would minim their efforts in forcing upon the. Alinismc a redaction ot taxes. The other Sp'eakers in the Co onmittee wtre IlMr. T. Wi:son, Sir Henry Parnell, Lard lifulkestone, M r.G. Bea net, Lord Alilton, S.r lt , liert W ilson, Mr. Wodehottse, au lal r..lteunett. 'rite Charlie lor el tee Exchequer r.- plied to some "hi ovaions et Air. tlimmmtlimouse on the Malt d airs, when the Resolatlo us were agreed to, and the House resettled: On the niotien of 11r. LUSH I NfiTON, it was ordered that the Howe should resolve its , It into a Committee on the Assessed Toes oe Moemlav, when the measures al ;need to in the . eretemeet "of the Client ellor of the &eche qeer would he broneet Mew urml iu; detail. Ti e other Orders of time Day were milspoted vf, and the Howse a dj murned at lielf-2ast Tea. • ' 1 ", ~~~ 4 ; , or r:+-J q: d ; 4~ v i ..% . t . .11