The National Register. — London, England, 1820-11-12 00:00:00

502 9suptrial '4Darlianititt. 11••••••• HOUSE OF. LORDS TRIALAW Ilklt MAJEaTV. • . • MOl , iwt I', NOT. The House met at the ;pond hour this morning. After prayers had been read, the list was c4lled over as limas; the number of Peers present was nearly 200. The Marquis of LANSDOW N rose, and said—" My Lords, I assure your Lordships that I tutu not at all dis posed to go at ereat length into the examination Of Ibis figuration; bar 1 feel it nectssaiy to add a few observa tions to lhoge I have already made before. I conic to that more important feature of the case, the character of this measure. lam anxious to make sume observations on the evidence—tint to go through the whole of it, but to advert to those particular points to which some Noble Lords op posite have more immediately referred."—The Noble Marquis here went over a great part of the evidence, pointing out its decrepancies, and declaring that where a witness had been proved to be perjured in any one point, however trivial, the whole of that witness's evidence ought to stand for nothing. He then said, he had heard many Noble Lords declare, with greet appearance of can dour, that they would dismiss front their minds different parts of the evidence, in consideration of the doubtfulness of the veracity of those who gave it; bat lie would tell those Noble Lords that they were hutind nut to dismiss from their consideration one tittle of the evidence, in jus tice to the Queen.—(Hear.)--The case of Senegaglia, and other cases exhibiting the saint- character of falsehood should be kept in the closest remembrance. It should also he remembered that the Counsel for the defence were prohibited front going into general proofs of the existence of a conspiracy, and if in keeping within the rules pre e-ribed to theuu, they had elicited the fact, that somehow or Miler, through all the parts in which her Majesty ree sided, there existed a conviction that those who were ready to give evidence against her would get into the most sure road to fortune. If their Lordships should pre sume from what had come before them that this was the case, and that a machinery and agency existed from the German minister down to the German waiting-maid, (a character as respectable as a German missister engaged in such' a cause)—if they were convinced that such an opinion was created by the examination of the testimony of Sacehi and Cuclti, who seemed to speak so purely from the love of truth, were they not humid to look upon that of Paturlo and Garguilo, a hid' had been subject to such doubt, as likely to be influenced by similar views, and to infer the general probability i—(Hear.)—The Noble Lord then spoke with reference to the absence of the Countess of Oltli and Marielti upon the part of the defence, wit ness( s whom it would have been inexpedient to call, as the time and place which their testimoity could have em braced, had not been sufficiently specified, and, of course, their depositions could slot lead to a distinct conclusion. He was surprised at a wish expressed by some Noble Lords, that Bergand himself should be called to the Bar. —(Loud cries of Hear, hear, hear.)--lie felt no hesitation whatever in sleclai ing, that whether Bergami admitted or denied all the facts charged in the preamble, it would not weigh a feather iu his mind, or in the mind of any other honourable 111:111.—(Hear, hear, bear.)—Not many years had elapsed since, in a case of divorce, it was proposed to call one of the parties to prove his mainexion with the woman who lay under the imputation. Upou that occa sion, a learned situ able Judge declared, that if he were himself called to give evidence with respect to a leinale, to whom he was under such circumstances, he wou!tl con sider himself absolved from the obligation to state the fact against her.—(Hear, hear, hear.)—Captain Houk, it was said, had been called upon a speculation of this nature. He was sworn, but lie was nut believed.—(Hear, hear.) — The Noble Lord then pi oceeded to make some olderva• tious upon the non-production of efficient witnesses by the Crown. He had conceived that, at the commence ment of this inquiry.the cause would have been conducted as the cause of Truth versus the Princess of Wales, and be imagined that there would have been no party, except merely the defendant. To this supposition he had been led by the Noble Lords opposite, who had said, that though, for-the sake of form, they had taken the character of prosecutors, not a tittle of evidence which, in the course of' the investigation, should appear fivourabie to her Royal Highness should be suppressed , lie (the Marquis of Lansdown) called upon their Lordships to look at the manner in which this purpose, so expressed, had been car ried into effect. 'file evideirce of Dr. Holland, who stood in so peculiar a situation with respect to her Majesty—a gentleman in independent circumstances, and incapable of being influenced, might have been supposed to be unex ceptionable witness, atid yet lie was not only nut called, but It appeared that lie had at no period before the inves tigation been asked a single question by those who professed :inch an anxiety to discover the whole truth. there yet remained one circumstance more, which re quired their Lordships' most serious consideration. Pab lo; opinion could not appreciate all the mischiefs of this measure, regarding it as a precedent for the future.— Some Noble Lord, who had spoken in support of the Bill, had quoted cases of Bilis fur altering the succession.— Would those who did so admit that a case of presumption was sufficient to alter the succession to the Crown ? Would they skew what there was in the case for this bill, which was •not equally upplicosle to a case affecting the SAICLES aIOII ? The object of this bill was said to be. to save the country from the great evil with which it was threatened by the operation of her Majesty's example on the morals of the country. He alluded to nobody—he looked only to the general hypothesis that Kings and Quietus of va rious characters insist succeed to the 'fbrune of these realms—and were their Lordships to be told that when any number of individuals chose to see in the couthict of any individnal, either iu possession of the regal dignity, or iii the immediate line of successioti to it, woat in their inindslwasan unbecoming example—were they to be told that this was to be made a ground fur deposing and de ',riving them?—Hear, hear.)—Was that a sort of prece dent with which the supporters of this bill wished to enrich the constitutional history of the country? If it was not, oil what grutitid could their Lordships advance further in this ;oat:ceding t Once lay this down as a con stitutional practice. and let three or four more such pre cedents arrive, and we shutiol come at once to Elective Atmarclis ? Their Lordships might be started at the terra, lint the fact was undoubted. It was the whole prin ciple of Elective Monarchy to look at the effect of the personal character of the indiviuual entrusted with the reins of power. Hereditary monarchy rested on a notion that the Constitution had provided guards which made Y.. 1, 4 . THE NATIONAL REGISTER the pe:si nal character of to alonliarifh a wetter of Indire ference.—(llear, hear.) Once remove the Jinn—once estairliah the tight of infinity bile the mend Cleo of the sovereige, and there' *mild uever be wanting persons to iniftertahe *eh inlitiries, aid by - them to endarter and convulse the cosintry. The Noble Marquis now made an eloquent appeal to those of their Lordships who might be disposed to vote for the second reading of the Bill, in the hope that it might afterwards be mitigated ; and maintained, that to rely on any such hope, would only lead to irreparable inconsistency. Up to this moment the House stood clear of imputation : a few hours will decide whether they would send down their names to posterity with the infamy of having, on a bare presumption, passed an act to degrade and to punish a Sovereign of their country !—( His Lordship sat down amidst loud cheers). The Duke of NORTHUMBERLAND could not con sent to give a silent vote on so painful and important a subject. But after attending to the whole of the evie deuce, to the speeches of Counsel, and to the arguments of Noble Lords, he felt in his conscience convinced that a long course of tudecent familiarities and of adulterous interconse had subsied between the Princess of Wales and her servant Bergaini. With this impression he could not consent that her Majesty should remain Queen Consort of England, and at the head of the females of this chaste and moral country. He, therefore, felt no hesitation in voting for the Bill as it now stood, and must therefore give his vote for the second rending. Lord HOWARD would not consent to give a verdict against her Majesty on the evidence of Dumont, Majocci, Itsstelli and arieclii,ell of whom were discarded servants, Krees Wad been compelled to give evidence against the Queen, and the Baron d'Ende, who would be an evidence for her Majesty, had not been brought ever to this coun try. Taking into consideration these facts, he could not vote for the Bill. This was a legislative measure, and, without yielding to popular clamour, lie must say, that no law that was very objectionable should be enacted. The House of Commons, be believed, would never pass the Bill, and deeming it inexpedient, and that the charges bad not been proved, be would vote against the second reading. The Earl of ENNISKILLEN.—" My Lords, basing been one of those who voted with the Noble Earl at the head of theTreasnry on the first reading of this Bill, and having attended to the whole of the evidence, and en deavoured to understand it, I conceive it to be such a mass of co n tradiction and suspicion, that I would nut con vict any person on it, and,therefore, I give my vote against the second reading." Lord CALTHORPE was not surprised that, on a ques tion which, front its very nature, admitted of every shade of moral and political consideratiou, Noble Peers should differ in the particular view they took of it. Had the case against her Majesty beep fully proved, and thet her conduct hail been as liceutione as it was represented, yet, UlliCbS it had been proved that she had voluntarily re. signed her connubial rights, which was not the case, lie, even then, must think that the present was not the proper mode of proceeding! He would usk their Lordships if this was the time to expose Kingly power; or to pass a Bill that would throw odium on his Majesty its a husband, as a King—or as the head oldie state. Was this the time to ask the Royal Assent to a measure of such au impor tant nature as the degradation of the Queen Consort of the Throne it Under such circumstances, lie could not' vote for the Bill, or suffer it to go a single step farther to wards its conclusion. His Lordship concluded by de claring his determination to vote against the Bill. Tire Mai quis of sTmToitt), in a short speech, said he would vote against the second reading of the Bill. Lord DE CLIFFORD considered the whole of the es i dence for the prosecution tended with falsehood—that in lookine at the question, he could not help ;Wye; ting to the diderences which had existed for several years between the accused and the illustrious personage must newly allied to her—and that enouek bed been stated to prove that her Majesty could hut remain in this country with advantage and comfort to herself. He valid not but feel that ties Bill would be rejected in some stage or oilier ; (Loud cries of hear !) and, in his opinion, it would be adviseable to get rid of it at the present moment—( Hear, hear.)—llis Lordship coucluded with declaring his resulatiou to vote agenist the second rending of the Bill. Lord GRANTHAM said that 011011 this great question lie differed (ruin those with whom he genteelly voted. It built been said at the beginning of these proceedings that the house snould be governed in their deci,iou by unsespected evidence.—(llear, hear.) He had attended to the evidence most minutely, but could not give it that cheracter.—( Heir) —lf the case were a common one, upon which a verdict of Guilty or Not Guilty were to be pronounced, he would have to consider that there had been a great deal of contradictory evidence ; but he would also have to took at the grave lad heavy anspicions with which the accused 'was over wheline.l. Although lie would say hut content, lie could not lay his hand upon his tweet aud say Not Guilty.—(hear, hear.) Lord LILLSSINGTON was determaied to vote against the second reading of the Bill. Lord GOSFOR said, to pursue the measure would be, in Lis opi 33333 n, extremely inexpedient. Ile was not afraid of popular clamour, but lie felt convinced, that the feeling or the loyal part oldie comiminity was decidedly against tee measure.—(hour.)—lle could not see how any man could vote for the Bill without the Divorca clause— (Dear, hear)—und he could not see how any mail could vote fur the Bill with that clause.—(A laugh, and cries of hear, liens.)—lle ended by slating that lie would vote against the second wading. The Duke of ATHOL assured their Lrupships he never rose with so heavy a heart. He html attended to the evt . deuce and the argunieute and lie must suy, that lie considered the Queee's guilt proved by her own evidence. If he did mot state this to the House, feeling es lie did, lie slistild nut think himself worthy to remain within the wens of Parliament.— ' Ile hoped tee Bill e mad he teed a second time, and he should do all in his pouter to r treet that object. The Duke of S 9 it EItME7 expressed his dissatisfaction at the eviden.'e against the Queen, and reprobated the inter ference of Foreign Puaers, who had not mily been employed ohteiu evidence siktititit her eleicsty, bet to withhold evidence le her favour.—(Hear, hear )-1 celled se the House to consider that her Royal Itigline%s wvis n foreien Princess, and had heel educated abroad ; nit.l that her outli ners hail been uotorious for ;liter freedom. Ile wheel tea that her ciindurt had beret extraordinary, imprudent, awl hardly to he accounted for; but there was 'melee; in the evi• deuce which could lead to a conclusion of guilt. The Noble Duke concluded by stating that tic dissented ultre;etate from the Bill. Lord GREN VILLE WO bvund to my t'idt afte. a long fi a examination of all the evidence, that the strongest judicial proof of guilt had been established, that antadulierom course had been %Deb too sulbricotly proved.r(Hear !) lie had herd muck of Cie molar feeling op *he subject ; but dm* all the mischiefs si tth which the state silaPthreatened, he saw no greater than what would result from a sudden and abrupt tersniontion of the present proceeding, instead of going through with it to a just and satisfactory conclusion. The Earl of bIOsSLYN ruse amidst loud calls fur the question. Whets he saw agents employed to corrupt wit uesses, and i ewards hi-Id out in proportion to the force of the charges made, mutt he not look at such evidence with great suspicion 1 The greatest portion of the charges had been abandoned by the advocates for the prosecution,and yet they clung to evidence w hich they acknowledged to be suspected. 'file circumstance of Alin.sters p, emitting the Princess to live three years abroad, after they had become acquainted with her conduct, appeared as if they connived at it. The Bill was not thought expedient when the scandal was fresh, nor when the Princess lived three years in Italy t its expediency only commenced on her arrival in this country. If the divorce clause was thrown net, and the degradation of the Queen persevered in, then might she be loaded with the most odious epithAs, and )et she, by such a decision still de clared to be good enough to be the wife of the King.— Such a proceeding would be unjust to the King. Notwith. standing the public opinion, and the probability of the House of Commons rilectiaig the Bill, he must notice the hardship of the Queen, in being subjected to this troublesome trial, under such manifest disadvantages, and which were a strong aggravation of the hardships to which she was subjected. At the condos' of Lord Kusslyo's speech, there was a gen'ral cry of" Question, question! Withdraw, withdraw 1" llis Royal Highness the Duke of Clarence, from one of the galleries, appeared most anxious to come to a division, ea claiming lowliy , " Withdraw 1" and making a motion with his hand for strangers to quit their Lordships bar. Lord HULL A N I) robe during the cry ol " Question !" and " Withdraw 1" to direct the attention of the Howe to is point which appeared to h s Lordship to have escaped their notice. It was not necessary for strangers to withdraw before the House clone to a division. The Noble Lords, ' according to previous arrangement, were to vote without leaving their places, and if any Peer called for a division, after the Noble and Learned Lord on the Woolsack declared whether the question was carried or not, titre strangers, according to the usual practiee, must c ithdraw. The Earl of LI VERN/01. said it would be the duty of the Lord Chancellor, as Speaker of that House, to stale on wLich side he II gilt the majority rested ; hot us it was most probable the House could conic to a division, he coo 1, ceived. the proper course would be to exclu•se *trailers forthwith. The House below the liar was then cleared of strangers. and the door being closed, they proceed,d to a division about three o'clock. The crowd of persons without waited with a strong feeling of expectation to hear the numbers announced. Several bets were made. Some who professed to be in the secret were disposed to take the majority at ;iu. Others at 25 ; but the [venter part of the speculators looked for something near the majority predicted by Mr. llobbouse at the St. jittllCS'S Mee:ing, natueiy. about 61 or 6:1. At half-past three o'clock the dour-keepers announced the numbers to the public to be— For the second reading of the 11111--Contents 123 Not Cuotents 95 Majority for the second reading 24 The House theu adjourned till ten o'clock tomorrow morning, when A motion will be mule to go into a Com• mittee upon the provision* of the Bill. TUESDAY, NOV- 7. The Lord Chancellor took his seat on the Woolsack a few minntes before ten o'clock, when prayers were read by the Bishop of Bristol, sod the list of Peers called over Lord BACKE then love to present a Protest from her Majesty, and said—" My Lord*, since I came down to the House this 'awning, a Protest from her Majesty has been put into my hands. Not having taken any share in the debates on this painful and important question, and en tertaining, as I do, strong feelings on the subject, I ought perhips, to make some apology for now addressing your Lordships. But my opinions, my Lords, were not in duenced by what has passed at the Bar of this House. My objection to Bills of Paine and Penalties for acts lung since committed, was so even, that no evidence that could be brought forward would, in my opinion, justify resorting to such a measure. Having hail this Protest placed in my hands, I will make one or two observations upon it. Whatever opinions I may have had as to the nature of this proceeding, I concur most cordially in the first part ocher Majesty's Protest, that her acknowledged prosecutors have voted against liar on this trial. I know that precedent* may be bun I for such votes, and it is left to the individuals themselves to decide on the propriety of prosecutors acting as juror,'; hut the country will form an opinion upon it which it is not difficult to anticipate. Her Nlajesty further complains, that ROOD, of the parties who hove given their voices against her, have not attended the trial during her defence. (Hear, hear.) I will not say they had nu right to vote, if they could reconcile inch an act to their consciences. Her Majesty then protests, before God, Bret she is wholly innocent of the crime laid to her charge, and declares that she will abstain from ell thriller appeal to your Lordships, reserving to herself the further vimileation of her character in another place. I tiow, my Lords, will read THE PROTEST. " 'f he Queen has learnt the decision of the Lords upon tile Bill ito , .v before them. In the face of P.uliament, of her Family, ;tett of her Country, she dues solemnly protest against it. 'noose who asowed themselves her Prosree tors, have pit slimed Ili sit in judgment upon the ette"ti° ll between tile Queen and themselves. Peers have given their voice+ ;glint her, who Ita.l heard the whole evi dence for the tilmige, anti absented themselves during her Al ace. Others have come to the discussion from the Scared Comm/the with minds biassed by a mass of slanders, which her enemies have not dared to bring forward in the lit " The Queen does not avail herself of her right to ap pear before the Committee; fur to her the details of the DiVilstite must lie a matter of indifference; and, toeless the count' of these unexampled proceedings should bring the Bill !Afore the other branch of the Legislature, she will roeke no reference whatever to the treatment experienced by her during the last twenty-five years. " She nosy, must deliberately, and before God, asserts that she is wholly innocent of the crime laid to her charge ; and she awaits, with unabated confidence, the final result of this miparalleled investigation! pIl• rue