The Statesman. — London, England, 1819-07-13 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMKNT. HOUSE OF LORDS. it/LT It 1. the estmbeery Caw, jodiroenl wet glees anted Ds legalitt of the Eros or 1 rue. panted by the late Duke of faoreniberry if. Sc ulaad. B t this den tin.. eilta•klevahlr Sam tor She emery Mt by the le Ifthe .nit be epprorrinted In the refoodlog of Ike vow sum ar Saes 'revived latt Met no the rielorteral4o weary Far seri, Preset.] The LORD CHAN CLL. LOH, silk referent. le the stale ..1 the law of Statham/ spout this paint. gave ..tie: of hi. intention to brine I. $ Bill earl' sit Sesuow, la order I rewicw• the /Debts I. whick at reseal the gretilob was involved. " .ate *dart judeatrats 'reweave la Appeals. TI e Rolla twat ems walled by efietwei-siaa la lbe Dehr.m.' 'Rill, the Intolrene Dermare (Primo.) Bill, the Clio 'liable Farad. 11.11, the Still Firs (itelswil) Bill. Dad a member a *be v. The Colawbeinove were. the Lard Cwateeller, lbe Marquis W heti...oer, wed the Larl of Shafteaburtr. The Chiatelwe Bell. lute Amweihmetw Sal aim 'mimed Coe the Howse tot Commons ha Mr. Drogdea ad tithes Mentwn, sad the Aumumbaeuisareed la. An Arnaud of the praiser 04 ibe Reines, Charge ea the Camelidated Feed. tr. was pretested by Mr. lb/lark. Papers tram the Eavt Indta•baase by Mr. Maws ; and aa Aerosol of the Praise, of Free ea Have Prize Arena:::, by Mr. Hancock. —Ordered to He upon the table. The Approprietloo Bill was reads third lime sad yawed. Lard I/ newer Siderwth preateted • Report Nowt the Coo witwe au Ike State or Prluma.—Ordered to lie apse the table sad to be riated.-eAdjeatsed liar tridents, (ibis duty). HOUSE OF COMMONS. Oa the Speaker taking the Chair, the following sew writs were moved for :—for Milboorne Port, in the mom of Mr. R. M. Casberd, who has accepted the dice of a Welch ledge; for the Borough of Eye, in the room of Sir Robert Gifford, who has been appointed his Majesty's Attorney-General ; for Ashburton ' Mr. Serjestst Copley having accepted the elks of Selicitor-General • and for Edinburgh (city), the Right lion. W. Dendes hiving been no minated Keeper of the Registers of Sailors, in Scotland. Mr. M. A. TAYLOR brought up the Report 441 the Steam-smoke Committee. At an early stage of the neat Session, be should prosecute this enquiry. Be bed no doubt they would soon be able to get rid of what was acknowledged on all hands to be a great plisses*, sot only la Leaden, bat is all the ether manufsetering districts. Mr. CHICHESTER brought la a Bill to provide for the more Equitable Atiesseteut of Mosies to be seised by bleb Greed Jury Preseatments.—Reed a lirsr, and ordered to be 'reed a snood time this day se'nnight. A Message from the fords brought their Lordships' assent to the Charitable Fooodstions, the Pauper Lunatics, Small Stills, and Exchequer Bills Bills,l and other Bills of • private emote. Their Lordships requested also to be furnished with Copies of Reports of the Select Committee, 1817 and 1818, on the Bankrupt Laws, the Select Committee on the C,imioal Lows, and of the Select Committed on the Poor Ls we. On the moths of the CHANCELLOR t.f the EXCHEQUER, their Lordship.' Messengers were called in, famished with the Reports of the Com. imam, on the Bankrupt Lows, and directed to acquaint their lovdships, that for se mesh of their Message as regarded the sending of the other Re pouts. this House would soma by a Museum of Its owe. The Usher of the Block Rod brought • Message from the Lords, deviriog rise •timulaoce of the House at the bar of the House of Peen. The Spiker, eccompanied by avers) Members, aseerdiegly west up to tire Lords ; and at about half. pest three, The SPEAKER, having mewled the Chair, In formed the Ilene that be had heard-the Rays! Assent Riven (by Commission) to several Bills (for chick see the Lord? Report). A person from the Navy Prise.olSee appeared at the bar, with a statement of the Fees paid on Prise.ssomey. SCOTCH BURGOS. Lard ARCRliiiLDlfiifitoN brim& op the Report of as Committee on the Royal Burghs of Scollop& Ow the question that the ante be printed, Mr. W. KEITH DOUGLAS said, that be' thought it was "shoofly desirable that the printing of this Report should be deferred till the seat Ses sion of Parliament, open an understsading that the subject would thee be takes late its immediate coma. devotion. Mr. KENNEDY thought the course proposed by Iris Honourable Friend nes most eat taordinary. The @Petition of the whole country had been directed with "stress interest to the 'sheers of this Commit tee. The evidence was taken (notwithstanding the objections on this particular, egged by his Honoura ble Friend) in the most "unlit!, fair, and impartial manner. Besides, no sulllcirnit ground had been as signed why the Public shottid not have the benefit of Immediate and unreserved pehlicity upon all the de tails of this subject, as *seal in such cases. Therefore be, for one. should certainly support the original motion for the tainting of these Papers. Mr K EITII DOUGLAS, in reply, eh d, that it ass not his Intention to move soy amendment to the motion, bet merely to stunt the other cows* to the Noble Lord . Lord BINNING said a few words which were In audible. Lord ARCIIIBALD HAMILTON rote to de clare, that weither es en individnet, nor es Chair... of the Committee, could be feel himself justified ie acceding to the meantime' of the Hon. Gentleman appeal , e. Mr. lIUME thought the adeptieo of such a course would he quire improper. Mr. K. DOUGLAS was proceeding to address the Hoes., when The SPEAKER spoke to order. Lord BINNING wishing (as we understood) to give his flimeersble Friend en opportunity of eg. primittg his sentimeots more folly epos the qeestion, sieved as an ammulment, " that the Illness will take the Report into further cousideratioe early in the Suasion." Mr. K. DOUGLAS, observing that he bid lately stand single in his opinions is this Committee, con. tendril, that it emitd he highly improper to allow the Report in go 'breed without sense esplanatitro, at this adveoced period of the Swims, sod when so many Members, who were greatly interested in the gentlest, god would have been disposed to carmine is with the greatest sun/why, were eel of town. The Cnermittee, 6ewest ss), met et hours which sue eztemely isewatenient weans el aloe Is the . THE STATESMAN, worming. they frequently sat till live, di, ead e'en seven is the evening. As Ifoneetable Friend, be bad se shut from a feeling of conviction of its being quite proper, often Interfered la the Committee, end told the 111 Itnes wi that they oas t not compete the ... _ Commitlee•s Iles by astainginto lon ezplanations, by way of eatmatlon. Allading to the chap brought agalest the Magistrates fftr Neigh espeedl• turn of the public money, and dm allegation contain ed in soots •f the Petitions, that the finances of Edinburgh wire in a bankrupt wale, the Hon. Gen- balsa ainetved, that ha did oot think the ease to be by any means fully mad* out, so as to justify its up. pear* in the Report. Mr. ABERCROMBIE amortised it did appear to him that the Hoe. Gentleman had pursued a coarse, and ens that, If adopted, would lead to lbe most unpleasant coesequences. The object of the motion which bad now been pet into the hands of the Speaker was, in fact, to show that the Com mittee bad done every Wag which was wrong, abonduable, and iniquitous. The lion. Gent. wished, apparently, to revive a discussion which he bad main tained with great pertinacity—and, no doubt with great ability io the Committee up stairs.. He (Mr. Abercrombie) trusted, that there was not one single individual who heard him, who wield support this singular meesere. One raises in support of it, as signed by the Hon. Gentleman was not less tattler dimity. lie said that the Committee had exerted it- self with a degrees of assiduity sod application which hardly any Committee bad ever done before. It was unnecessary to remind the lion. Gentleman, that in fact persons of coeseqeence and high in office, the principal Magistrate. of Edinburgh, had been cited before the Committee, in order to be examined The Hon. Gentleman talked of many Ilan. Members being out of town, who would have been prepared to deal with this question with zeal, interest. and assiduity. Now, *bat did these zealous, arsirlious, interested Gentlemen do? Why, they retired We., the Is. boors of the Committee had attained their final condo. siert, to their reentry-seetr.—(A lion. and Learned Gentleman concluded by supporting the original motion. Mr. PETER MOORE wished to have the benefit of reeding the evidence daring the recess, so that he might time perfectly prepared to speak to this sub. jest nest Session. Sir R. FERGUSiON bore testimony to the great esertions, constant application, and invariable ite• partiality of the Committee. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER wished to sews , to his Hon. Friend (Mr. K. Doug lac), that the costae be wee for persei..4 was wow 'cedented. When a Committee had once gone on to make its report, it was not usual to oppose the print. log of I'. I Sit JOHN MARJORIBANKi thought that the ! Committee had not dismissed the individual, alleded I to as soon as might have been, when the Chamber ' lain of Edinburgh had been detained in London up wards of xis weeks, although his examinations alto gether did not take up more than levee days. He was an aged elan, to• , seventy years old, and laboor ins ender bodily lofiraeltses. The fends of the city of Edinburgh were in the first order, good and 101. vest. He geoid not hesitate to lend the city 10,0001. or even 20,000. —if he had it.—(A laugh.)—And if he could net advance that sum, he would williegly give his own security, so far as it might go. Mr. J. P. GRAN I' defended the conduct of the Committee. lie hoped that the Hoe. Baronet lobo spoke list, before he ventured to interpose his se. verity for the solvency of the fends of the City of Edlabergh, wield at least make himself a little bet ter acqesinted with their actual condition, than those appeared to hate done who had for some years pre sided over them.—[A laugh.] Lord BINNING, with the leave of the Haase, withdrew its amendment. But when lioectereble Gentlemen talked of the aspersions cast upon the Committee by his lion. Friend, he (Lord Binning) must say that he lord eodersteod from other Members, that the evidence had been taken in the berried man. net which had been described.—[liser, hear!] — Members of that very Committee had fold him (toad crier of Aear. ! and name, came !]— II- officered that Members et 'bat Committee had `told him so, again; lief he moat certainly should not name theG.ntlernen.—Ameedment withdraws,. Mr. SINCLAIR thought it his defy state, that in the coarse of his 'ltemiser.* on this Committee, he never saw an), the slightest, *simples of that in justice and precipitation charted artingt it. Lord ARCHIBALD HAMILTON thoeght the Repeatable Members who hail served upon the Com mittee, sod who were trim present, as capable of forming a correct judgment on the subject, as any of those whose absence had been referred to, and whose ertherity the Noble Lord bad cited as the ground. work of his observations. It world not have been necessary for so many witness to attend, bad not the Lord Provost refused to communicate the accounts that were in his !minoring, as well as to attend per. morally et the desire of the Committee. Lord BINNING shortly erpisined : end con tended that be had been guilty of no misrepreseota. Lion. The question that the Report should be printed, was then put, and carried in the sffirmative. SPANIIIII FRIGATE. Mr. M. A. TAYLOR observed, that he had a question to put to his Majesty's Ministers. lie bad reed with the almost surprise that a Migrant outrage bad been committed by a Spanish Moe on one of our vessels. Ile treated that the British Govern vernmeet bad massifeseed a becoming spirit at such as aggression : but his chief object in new rising was to enquire whether any communication bad been received similar in its impart to the printed account : whether, if die account were so confirmed, the facts bad been accurately stated, and also whether any steps bad been taken thereupon? Letd CASTLEREAGH, In a low Ingot of voice, replied (as far as we were able to collect observa tions) that the circusistaaces described rested on de positions taken in a foreign Corot, and had reached the knowledge of this Ghvernment 'brevet the Court of Madrid. His Majesty's Miesiten had n.l omitted to lake such steps as were deemed necessary on this occasion. lie believed there was spo sea son to t!ouht the accuracyof the statement as it bail been published. Mr. C. HUTCHINSON presutttl a relitimit _ 'toed by o groat body of tbo poorer elalses of per- Isou conewora In trade, consisting of Menefee tgrers, Shopkeeper., and Labourers, of the tows which be repreeented. . The Petition, aher o few words how Mr. P. MOORE, was then read ordered to lie on the table, and to be printed. Mr. B. BATHURST brought op the Report of the Committee appointed to enquire into the state of Jails. It was merely laid on the table, and ordered to be printed. RED RIVER lETTLENIF.NT. Mr. GOULBURN laid on the ibis paperu or. dered by the Haim, condating of official eonameni. cations received from the Governors of Upper end Lower Canada, relative to tbe destruction of the Red River Settlement. These parvrs. die mem of which approved to ex cite some merriment in the Boost, were also ordered to bo printed. PENRYN AND RARNSTAPLE. Sir C. BURRELL observed, that es a Bill which had passed that Howe, for regolating future elec tions in the borough of Pesor)o, had beta passed over withost nodes by the Lords, be thooght it bet nnnnn tont to their own dignity to move for the sat spensi•m of the writ to she, boroligh till 14 days after the nest Session of Parliament ; and he now moved that the writ Ira onspended accordingly. Dr. PIIILLIMOIi after • few obaernti-no, which were not distinctly hoard in the gantry, made • similar motion as respected the borough of Barn staple. The tpursiion for suspending earls writ was put, and carried. AVM SqVITS: The CH AN CEl.l:iilt of the EXCIIt.QUER thee row. per wow to awits. to wore that no hettilile Address be presented to the Protat Regent. peas lag that be world be gratioitty Cite to direct Oust the follow lag tame he paid and assuring bine that the Home w 0.11.1 wake Rood the wine. lle proposed also. 'bat the Address •Itoold i.. the let en•taisce pray 'Wit Lis Royal Righters% world be pleated to roofer woe dtgo.ty is the Ch.ttels Oil the Res. Christopher Wort.tworth, Chapala to that Hoeg.. o J. Ile .edes. I'•q.. r kairm36 of the Coo-Mimi £1.200 To Mr L Closet Clerk. reek sew at world, toge ther with bit f •ev, atnec.t 5,5 . 0 Tn Mr. Rickman, world Clerk, seek saw as would I.ke canoe► amsout In To Mr. J. 1)..... for roenpittng na lode' to the Jewesses, hem the period of the Union shit trehaad... COO Some adequate compessatioo to the OM. lading Committees. Mr Wickham. for preparing a digest of the eel &ewe , aken befo.e the Committee ea tditeatiost... 150 To Mr. N. Carlisle, Secretary to the Commisahla foe eago Wing iwisthe Abeam, of Chalks/4i ....... ....... 111,01) To Joao Smith. Esq. a Member of that House, and Choitson of ihe Committee on the Haskres Law. in rinse's ee of certain ea primes to which be bad been K 1 1 immins pat. awl for payment of a ren son al. su to as 3 Nears. Kaye, Ffeilli.l6l, tad CO. After • few words from the CIIANCELLOII of the EX. CH L UEH.themttioawnagreedto. hlr. HUN' E a.id, that to the absence of his Noble Prieltd (Lord A. Haeriltou), he bad to sebmit to the noose a motion similar to the last, namely, that an Address be presented to the Prince Regent for a seas net exceeding 2,0001. to defray the expellees of the, witnesses 'swooped by the Committee on the Royal Berths of S;citlan , l. The Committee had been ob. Hired to collect information from places bOO miles distant. A great nensber of the Petitioners had come In Linden to be estminell, and they made on charge ; bur the no* was different with respect to the Town. Clerk of Aberdeen, and the Magistrates of several other borers, whose weedier., bad been ordered by the Commi.ree. Mr. LONG said, that no Member then in the House bad the means of aseerteining whether or sot this was a proper sem, and he thoeght that the meant of it night et least i• have had the suction o f the Chairman. Mr. HU E slid, the Noble Chairman had con. meeicated with she Chencellor of the Eacheqver on the subject, se& being obliged to lease the House, had pot the motion into his (Mr Hease's) band with. set any esplanation. In one point of view, there was on similarity bet seen this grant and that which had been last voted, for in ibis case us Solicitor had Men employed by the Committee. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, that the Noble Lord being obliged to be absent, bad requested the lion. Member for Aberdeen to make the present motion for him. He certainly thooght that persons summoned nn stabile business, and sot attending on their own Petition', were entitled to re. menerrion for their ettendince. Mr. B. BATHURST thought it would be better if the Treasury were to lay down a settled rale en this suhjeet. Mr. HUME thought the only object should be to fie the charges at the lowest scale possible, bet that it would be hard to refuse to individuals the payment of those eapenees which they bad been compelled to Mr. GRENFELL was of opinion, that the case of a Committee employing Solicitors ought not to be regarded as a precedent. Sir J. M A KJORI BA NKS said, that in the !PIMP of the enquiry there had beets lavish espenditore some where, at.d he would pledge himself to produce institutes. Mr. F. DOUGLAS denied that thee, had been any espencr iscorred by the Committee that could have been prevented. Mr. J. P. GRANT reeretted that be had only entered the House as the lion. Baronet (Sir J. Mar. jitribasks) was sitting down. In answer to what had been said of wasteful eapence, he could inform the Honourable Baronet, that certain persons who had attended the Committee bad made most exorbitant charges. Sir J. MARJORI BANKS repeated that there had born a waste of eapeoce, and he was prepared to prove it. ' Mr. J. P. GRANT declared, that the charge, if made against the Committee, was unfounded. The motion was then aKreed to. CAPE OF ROOD IMPF. Tbe CII A N E1.1.0R t Ito EXt, II EQU ER mid, be had to propose anoi..er Address, to thr object el elicit be should briefly call the atieniinn of the House. The Right llonourableGentleiban then ad. vetted to lb* attempts u Lich bad been mule to in. deco persons disposed to emigrate to settle at the Cape of Good Hopei sad stated that he prop , ed the pro met Address for 'be purpose of ?alibiing Goveremehi to the that eecouregoment on a lats.r stale. He coacehed that thi. colony held out greeter indeco. mesh to moistest+ than any of the colonies in North America • because (mums, wires, oace Gard nn the OA of !A Gips of GM Dope s would always 6ad tbessoelves is possession of the weans of sebai•tenee, while she genial aaindneot of the clitaillt, and the fertility of the soli, rendered I:itle clastore ne. emery. The principal place chosen for the reception of emigrants was ea the soeth•east coral, end peso seated a food harbour, with easy other local silvan. tag's. It certaiul) wag not proposed to carry not persons whollyclestiloto of the means of 9rovi.ling for themselves That'esperleuent bad been tried, bet bad been fogad to be g alterided with great Incarnate- Moues. A mall depntit would therefore be required from then before leasing this cowry, ea a security for their providiry for tbemsetres when they arrived at the colony. The caantry was peculiarly f- able to the graying of tering, sorts of trait; and, spun the whole, there could be no doubt dist per. sans, as 1..'. u 1011441. nook, And 111'4,140,ns env. fortsblr. 11. enneledpd by mooing en nrlA...so r+, a seat, not exceeding 50,0001. to t» issued free deli to lime, ender such orgelatinna as might he thought novenae', for the eisenoraureent of persons dials .sed to settle in his Majesty's colony at the Caplet Good 'lope. Mr. HOME approved of the motion, bet regretted that it did not go farther HP tbnischt thee the pa. fishes should he obliged to subscribe, is order to send oar abie•bodird men who cook! not get einploimeot in this country. He conceived it would be no great relief to the country, he iis present &outraged elate, if only persons of capital were tent not of it. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, it was part of .e plan that parishes sh..uld be allowed to sul.scribe ; but any thing like compel. sort' gobsctiptioo coud not be thought of.--((lce', hear!) Aldermen WOOD observed, that there was in this country a great quantity of waste laud; in one piece no less than 80,000 , which, if cultivated, j would give roploymeot to many 'shooters. and yield a considerable I'INPOde to Government. He thought that people should sot be sent out of the country, when there were tho memos of employing them et home, eapecially as the money proposed to be sent along with them would be lost to this kingdom. Mr. C. HUTCHINSO'N approved of the grant. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER made a remark across the table, which ass instilible in the gallery. Mr. WILLIAMS was convinced that this coon try possessed within itself the memos of employment for all its inhabitants, end nothing more was faces• spry than to colligate those lands which at present were waste. Sir J. MARJORIBANKS made a few remark., after which the motion eat agreed to. Mr. HUME wished to oak a Right Hon. Gentle. man oppnlite (Mt. Coonlna), if any further infnervig. lion bad been received respecting the condoct of Sit ' Thomas II!slop at the fort of Talerier ? Mr. CANNING was understood to reply in tkil negative. FINANCE RESOLUTIONS. Sir H. PARNELL, in roiling to move the Order of the Day fnr reasoning the debate on the Resole. lions which he had formerly kid on the table, thoeght It unnecessary for him to ente► into the ge. aural questinn of the finances of the country. Is was convinced that if an investigatinn were serious ly entered into, with the view of redecing the peblie expenditure, very important redactions might be elected In various deputises's. The Committee of Finance, in their last WTl's, bad calcolated upon redaction of 200.0031. upon the expenditure for 1820, bat they had ont in that cslcelation taken into mount any retrenchment of public office'. The Right Hon. Gentleman opposite, In his statements, hurl held oat roe prospect of seek retrenchments.—. Yet he was prepared to maintain. that in every branch of those offices a considerable saving might be made. The collection of the revenue at present cost the Public 7 per rent.; by reducing it to 5 per cent. 1,203,0001. anal(' be saved. Whatever might be the merits or defects of bit Resolationo, he had spared no Isboer in making them as corrert as posit. ; end he bad bete careful not to make the sett. ral statements more favourable to his views than the strictest accuracy warranted. Ille had stated the money paid to the Bask as paid for mangling gene. rally; it neght to have been for managing the public debt. He bad stated the number of •seeaten at r 19,000, the number ought to have been 40.000. He bad been led into a mistake also, in calculating the eapences in the ofice of the Secreh►y at War. The 'aptness ■nder this head for 1798 had bum stated at 80001., when they ought to have been stated at 51,0001. Bat veil the sem voted the fourth , year of peace. 55,0001.. was 40001. more than it bad been In 1798, which bad been the third year of , the war. In stating the increase of the Civil List, , it night to have been mated to have I ed frem 900,0001. to 1,030,0001. 11. should not now enter more fellyinto the subject, bet on a more , convenient occasion he should prove that his Were awes were correot. Mr. C. LONG disclaimed any imputation easiest the Horn. Bart. of hawing intended to mislead Om House in any respect. The lion. Hart. had isistitoted a compsricon of Customs and Escise; and the infer. One, to be made was, that the one • as ewe:ugly well collec:ed, and the other eutremelv ill To make loch a comperison fair, the till, ;a . compared ought to stand upon the tame principle; but no fair compsrison could be instituted between thing, so different as the Customs and Eacese- the nue amount. ing nail to 10,000,0001., while the other aasnented I to 40,000,0001. In the charges of collection things slet, charged which hid nothing In tin with them—. se eh Es 'co 011CP.1 soloing from N.•iiminn ll,l ""•Q". routine Lows. and Worphou•ing Gonda. 'l', Bart. Lad ecintiaird th•chaig-a of 1810 and 1819. Bar in 1811 of lees had been enacted, ulich threw !Are charges upon the collection of the Revenue. 'the Hon. Donne, hod • token many of his ointments from she Report of the Commi.too of Amount. in 1788 1! r considerable Loprore rnetsts bed boon made dc,inK the last 30 ' errs. The Hon Brunner had 'row,. a consolidation of the Cl...Pleog. Now, Dot less roan three MVP'S! AO/ of Crootejdotino bad posed; on e in 1807. end tro• which had been introduced by Di. ROI Hon. Fiend 'hi' , PI,. The Ai I of 1807 hail been slid by Os 11.. n. B srnnet to hoer prodoced no bereft:. because the Tre•soc, bad interPred and taken into their nen lag soy merit le biloaeir, he mild may that be bed hands tho disposal of setchorr o. Without arrogat- 4 . .