The Statesman. — London, England, 1823-03-06 00:00:00

- Yr - pe rson feint-lei his claim upon all these qualifications he was rejected if he were not a Protestant. This was in i tse lf, he conceived, a 'formidable objection to such in stitutions. To allow the object for which these societies was established, it was only necessary to look to the cere loonies they enjoyed as a proof of the spirit in which they were estaulisheil. It was enjoined by the laws that, there sbonid he an annual procession to celebrate the victory obtained by William the Third over James the Second. If the battle- of the Boyne sa as to he celebrated in a country ceitliisiaely Protestoie there could be no ob jection tq isceletwation ; but it shoe!! be recollected that it took place in a country where it could not be ce iterated without recalling to recollection the triumph of the minority, anti engendering those feelinee of mortifi cation which every Catholic must experience on being reminded of lois defeat. Stich a procession was then most irritating, an.' was only cslcelated to perpetuate trocord and disse If the Catholic, who witnessed this ceremony, which reminded him of his defeat at the Boyne. after retiring to his home, endeavoired to sootlt the feelings of mom heation to which this ceremony must give rise, by recollecting the traditions handed down to him of the heroic conduct of his ancestors, and the pros perity they enjoyed—was is to be wondered, if re tiring to his ho lie with such feelings, and endeavouring to calm them by such means, be oecesionally burst forth into a violent expression of his humiliation? — When such u rause existed,—was be to be blamed? — and vet it was reel charged to the Catholic a s a crime, that be cheriseeil those recoll-ctions by which . they hoped to alley the bitterness of their feelings. When this impetetioe was made upon the Catholics, thoilo who made it ought to recollect that they themselves a&4ted the very to-aces of perpetuatine those recogeetions, by an annual celeor igen which brorielit to mind the victory of one party and the defeat of tire other. But his re tiring to his cabin with these feelings was the least evil resultine from those ce,e troniis. They generally ter r.inate.l in bleoth The- ea its :hey raised were such, and se numerotto that no one woo had not live I in Ireland could form a proper idea of them. If you were to ask a Protestant what distinguished him from a Catholic, he would sae his loyalty. Then be woula s iv, if that con stituted the distinction, his condvet should be such as to support the truth of his assertion, and he sLoglrl take care neither in private or public to d r any thing which would not strenethen enil confirm the character he hail asinine What did the Protestants do? Ditl they adopt this course? Was it in the spirit of loyalty to do that which %%out' weaken the loyalty of othe:s ? And yet the Protestants, by the annual procession, reminded the Catholic that the antriiersery of that east w hick placed the Royal Family on the Throne was the annisersary of his defeat. This certainly was not the way to se cure the loyalty of the Catholic, which ought to be the ohject of every loyal man. The areument cent still further, b cause it you permit one essottiation to govern itself by secret maths, yon concha equally to permit atrother. The Catholic ought to hive an equal riebt to do so ,titre the Protestant. But it might be said that the Protrs•ants weir permitted to have thete associatiuns, because they alone were loyal. If the house were of th it opinien, it eettid be declaring that the loyalty of Irclanl was limited to one-tiO hi of its po pulation, but es .ell Pro estatos were not admissible to those associations, it would he still forth-r 'bulgy!! the loyalty of Irelaorf. Ile eould not conceive the reason why these soeictiee should be permitted to one puts , and not the other. If they were allowed for self-defence, wily cot to the Catholie as well as to the Protestant ? if they were allowed for the protection of the lees, had not the Catholic an equal interest and an equal right to trotect them nith toe Protestant? He would state an °thoer instance in reference to these institutions, which was of the most :orlon! ronsideration. •It was admitted that the greater pact of the Yeomanry of Areiawd weirs , Orangemen. It could not be forgotten that this Yeo manry was formed of p-rsons wlinse feelings were nu: in unison with the national feeling, and. therefore, when ever they were called upon to act, they only increased the irritation sketchy exiling, Localise thee majority of the people thought they were prompted to act more from hostility of feel ne, than a ee-ire to preserve or der. But the most imeortant objection to this society was its influence moon the conduct of Government and the admirristration of justice. He would suppose that a Cathotc were put upon his trial, and that the sheriff who impanelleti the jure, the ;ludic, the whole panel, and the jury lay which he teas to be tried, were Orange men. Th iugh he did not mean to suggest that any of the parties would he guilty of En act of injustice, yet if the individual, howeler deservedly, were found guilty, what would be Iris feelings? Would he not say he uai unjustly dealt with: And was it not na tural to suppose that he would lather leave been tried by authorities of a different party ? Even in that house, where they r. ere divided into parties, no one—at least no honest man—could conscientiously say that he did not sometimes feel great difficulty in preventing his mind from being warped on party quesnuns; and then was not that country in all unfortunate state, where a body of men associated on I arty reclin e s should be in si tuation- which en.ibled them to promote it justice. No country could ever be hal py where confirleur e was not placed . in an impartial administratiou of the hoes. If a Catholic were to be tried by an Orange Judge and an Orange Jury, however correct the pro, eedings, and how ever conscientious the verdict, whet would be the moral effect? Would it not be weakened by the conviction that the Julge and .lure were of a party hound together by principles which held him up to hostility? This eat a a ate of things which greatly dinfoislied the weight, the authority, and the influeuce of the laws. In 1813, it would be recollected, that the President of the Board of Control (Mr. Wynn) brought forward a motion relative to Orange Societit a. Upon that occasion Ire complained of their introduction into England, and described them, but in much better terno, in the same spirit that he (Mr. A.) now described them. On ilea occasion also the Secretary fur the Home Department (Mr. Peel) expressed liinrirlf against the existence of those societies io Eng land, that they ought to be discountenanced, and were so cuatteoptible in England that the mere expression of the la use to that effect would at once put an end to them. al. Noble Lord also then consented to put them down in Enamel, and upon this understateliog the motion was withdrawn. He stele.' this for the purp use of giving the Right Hononrable Gentleman an opportunity of shoeing whether he entertained the some oeinions re gardiug these societies in lieland. When he consented to put them down in England, where they were so con temptible and had se lit , le int:remise. what ought he to Mirk of them in I relan I. where all circumstances com bined to increase ten-falrf whatever evil existed in the na ture of the institution itself. f-le could not persuade him self that he omit,' net have the vote of the Bight Hon.- thantli titan to-night, because he surely eolith not think t sat they ought to he abolished in Eagiaud an I tolerated Ireland. tic might be tel I, from the ittument Lem Sitimontli conveyed the pi.olde of Ireland the expres sion of the King's wish that all animosities should sub side, and all }alies become tett oncited, that from that moment the epeositien of the Orangemen to the King's Government increased. t the person who would tell biro tlioes e ouse whit party he may, if he admitted the- L ref Sidthouth's letter produced sack au e:fec, he d d him as much service es if the case were differeot, for what was it but to declare that Oraneemen were opposed to the King and Parliament, and thecefore ought ta be put dowa ? He would kor glad to know if fresh members were to be enrolled to oppose whatever measerrs seat may now think proper to seeure the peace of Ire. land; if so, it only strengthened his Argument still fur tber for the necessity of thi extinction of this sooietp STATESMAN. TI But shoal I they succeed in the opWie . thett the troth come could co. out, that Ireland . t governed by a Lord Lieutenant carrying into execution the will of the King's Itlinisters, hut by a lend Lieutenant acting under the cutroul and influence of Orangemen in Ireland.— (Hear, hear.) If inch should unfortunately be the ease , it would only prove the inference, that the same jealoos spirit which sheeted the recall of Earl Fitswilliatn —that the same jealous spirit which effected the recall of the Marquis of Cornwallis, whose justice ant wisdom lie should always applaud, notwithstanding the reprosefies cast upon him by others, that the same spirit elt:ch fur nished him with his last argument for the Union, yet lived in the Orangemen of the present day. When air. Pitt first proposed the Union in that house, he felt him self oppressed by that party of which Orangemen were now the representatives, and stated as an argument for its necessity, "that if measures which woul d . secure the happiness and tranquillity °Preload were to be adopted, it could only be in an impartial Legislature, removed I from the seat of contending parties—so placed as not no be influenced by those possessing property . or soviets a Legislature which would give way neither to the haughty presumption of the few, nor open the door to popular influence." Ireland was now in the same situalon, and he was satisfied it could have no remedy but front a Legislature standing aloof from all party con tendon. He had hitherto abstained from a most import ant point, the legality of these Institutions. If they looked only to the statute of the .50:h of the late King, be knew it would he extremely difficult to put a construc tion upon it, but he was relieved from the necessity of confining himself to this statute by the opinion of the present Chief Justice of the King's Bench, in Irelantk who declared the oath of Orangemen to be illegal. On, a trial which he wonld,not now name, for certain reason?, it etas stated that a witness, who was an Orangeman, ought cot to he believed, because he was pl seed between two oaths, one of which he should violate if he hold the troth. The Judge, in delivering his opinion, stated (hy pothetically it was true.) that there was no proof that such an oath was taken, and be did not•believe that it was; but if such an oath were taken, the witness was placed between two inconsistent obligations, one of which was certainly illegal, and was therefore bound in a Coart of Justice to adhere only to the legal obligation, and trample under foot the other. With such authority lie (Mr. A.) had no hesitation in pronouncing the 0- raugeman's oath illegal. Ile would have wished not to have mixe I up the question with the introduction of law, bat finding such distinct and decided authority to sup port him, he was entitled 'o think that these oaths were Me l t:it. If so, then, what steps hive been taken to put do iii this society ?—(Hear, hear.) Had not its ille gality brim discovered till now: :f illegal under the statute, it ions' have been illegal ever since the statute Wei pased, and yet no steps had been taken to put down this institution. ills object was that the House should now adopt some measure to put it down, which he thought the motion with which he intended to conclude would affect. His proposition was, that an address should be presented to the Crown, calling is atten tion to the constitution of associations formed upon exclusive principles, and pledging the 'louse to con cur with his Majesty in all lawful measures for main taining and enforcing the laws in Ireland, and fir securing to it • the benefit of the Constitution. This was the object of his motion. He admitted that Government would have a powerful body to contend with; but the expression of the opinion of Parliament that these societies ought to be put down, would at once rdestroy their strength. He thought it would be quite sufficient if Parliament declared its opinion, and he would leave the execution of whatever measures it might be necessary to adopt to Government. The house mist perceive, from what he stared, that these societies, as long as they were suffered to exist, sonst_plove a serious j obstacle to the tranquillity of 'rebind. 'This was there-1 fore an important spsestion, mit only for Ireland, but also for Enolanil. At the Union it was held out to Ireland hoW much it it child be improved b' transfer- I ring capital to it from this country; but who would venture to transfer capital to that cuentre, when, on all discussion upon. it io this house, Meinimss sectned to rival each other in swing the degree to which it was agitated. WWI would transfer capital to a country where no one would live who could live out of it ? This was the cause of so many absentees, and they must I continue as 'stair as no person can be f suns' in the coon try to purchase their properties, which will never hap pen till a return of tranquillity will induce persons to transfer capital there. Why was it necessary to keep so large an army in Ireland to maintain the peace of the country? Was the existence of Orange Societies. the cause. For this reason alone he was anxious to prevail upon the house to express its opinion upon their vicious tendency. It was in vain to say that they could not he put down: if Government were intent upon the point, (hear, hear,) and showed a fixed and decided determina tion to put them down, they would a. on become extinct for the general opinions that prevailed in Ireland was that these societies were encouraged by Governmentond that those who were not members of them were thought disloyal and beheld with suspicion. If they were ille gal, as he entertained no doubt they were, there could nut he any difficulty in putting them down. The house ' shoald consider that the Union was yet on its trial, and that the advantages which were promised as the result, were not yet been realized; and if ever a body of separa tists should arise in that country, they would then be called upon to show those blessings which followed what was said to be so -valuable a measure. Year after year had passed away, and yet they had not taken place. Ile therefore entreated the house not to continue in that state which would give any Separatist the opportunity of stating all the advantages which were promised by Mr. Pitt as the consequence of the Union, and calling upon it to point ant one which had been realized. 'fhe Hon. lient. concluded by moving the fol lowing resolution:— " Resolved, That his Majesty's faithful Commons, deeply deploring the dissensions in. Irelan t which for a length of time have agitated and convulsed that country, and which, amongst other evils, have led to the formation of societies founded upon exclusive and unconstitutional principles, beg leave to assure: his Majesty of their cordial and zealous concurrence in all measures fur maintaining and enforcing the laws, for giving to the people the full benefit of the Con stitution, and for aiding his Majesty's paternal solicitude In promoting concord and onion Iti Ireland." Mr. GOULBURN assured the twine, that he never rose to address it with feelings of stronger anxiety than those he felt on entering on the subject under discussion. This anxiety was foundod on no idea of personal consi deration to himself, nor on any difficulty he hail in ex pressing his opinions, bet on al apprehensioa that a sub. ject which excited so much attention in Ireland, and which hail been to mach misrepresented for the purpose of intlaminz passions already so agitated—an evil which ever,- good man in and out of Parliament would-be anx ious to remove—v.o4bl he mixed up with the one whim, w a s an ler discussion. lie therefore thought the hon. and learned gent would have yielded to the suggestion of his hon. and learned Friend, and postponed his Imo lion till the whole subject was fairly before Parliament. He trusted. however, that the fears he entertained upon this subject were unfounded ; and here he could not h .11p paying a tribure to the lion, and learned Gentleman for Ivoitling any allusion which could prejudice that ques tion, and he hoped that all who followed in the debate could he guided by the same forling, and not bring she conduct of the inch Government into the question et present. In much that had fallen from the bun. and learned gent. he had no hesitation in swing that he con • tarred is a more or less degree. He lied no hesitation in saying, that such societies were great inconveni. enci, and viers calculat'd to create suspicion sosone the members xif those societies. and hear-butlin4 - s young': those who were not members. If in ordinary smiety a principle of exclusion ton arils any particular east was to be a.l.tph•d, the excluded nould rrta•d the• exclusiat:is•s with te•lings of jealousy and hatred while ti.e la ter would link upon tile twiner with contempt and dis•eirard. If •uch feelings were en•!en dere.' by the principle of exclusion in ordinary society. how touch stronget must they be in politic ii societies acting upon the same prinripl and connected by secret obligations. All concurred in admitting tha: the fedings produced by exclusion from any society were more or less violent as the principle of exclusion was valued. It was, therefore, that exclusion on account of relizions opinions produced the most violent feelings, beraus•! r •lit;ion was that pr,nripla nhich all men most valued.—lle ad mitted ti itu the honourable member the evils of any so ciety formed on a principle of exclusion, when its object was of a secret nature. Hat in making this admission, he meant to apply it rather to the in .lion th in to the speech of the hon. member—for the house would see that the ino:inn extended gereralle to ail secret societies, whereas the speech confined itsedt solely to the Orange Society in It-elan I. But while he (Mr. Hon Nun) felt tile danger that might rr,ult from secret associations, he was still most anxious to diary a I' ne of 6N:lm t on between the danger to be apprehended fr utu t his partial; sr Society and other secret societies of an opposite tendency, He was qui . e sure that the Ho•t. Member 'alit agree stith him. Oat there was a gre.tt distinction to he drawn between secret societies in (rbin". The Orange Institution was aftogetlier distinct from s icieries I.ra:rid f.” the express porpoao of subvertinz the tioverntuen%—(llear, hear.) f Isere were various societies in Ir. land, so lie formed tor a good, and many more for a bed purpose. Some oi them were bound by an malt to support the law, and maintain the tranquillity and peece of the errantry. He was therefore anions the 'mese should , ee how different xere the s that regulated different as sociations. He cmild cot f is:tett that the principles of the Orange Institution were lia'ale to grave objections ; yet be could not also forget that the Members of it hid always Shown themselves reedy to come forward ieixdee fence of the country. Ile could not ferret that in times of hazard and difficulty, the p •1 , 11-is who ouw enrolled themselves as members of Orange Lodges had lent their prompt aid to Government and upheld the Constitution. For having done so, they deserved an I bail receive tile approbation of floret nment Anil of the coentry. Thoiigh they might disepprove of seine things is the Orange In stitutions, yet they ought not to uvetlo tk time previous good conduct of its inenihr re, nor eoutotin I them with persons from whom they were every N ay distinct. lie tray Om aware that the good ch trader of a person who transgressed the law affurded no argument imbis de fence; and if any Orangeman was guilty of en act which the law did not sanction, be (Mr. O) would be • the I ist person to sten I up jut that Iroise and require an exemption in his favour. He coil( I wish that the honourable member had forborne to revert to the eariy periods, when outrazes were committed in Ireland. The hon. member haul, hoe ever, reverted to these in re ference to the Orange Asrociation, but he (Mr. (i.) Wami'l sure it would he better for Pa lieniert not to go back t. them. The general complaint in Ir land a as, that there remained on the mind, of the different classes in that country, too strong en impression of party transar tiene.lie wished that any thing likely to niake it stronger shuntl he avoided. There might have been: in those tranmections •h of cruelty to condemn, and much of severity, to regret, but the detail of either could not be in the slightest degree profitable at this time, w It:le, on the contrery,it might do serious Hey. 'llse hon. Member ith recounting the outrazes committed at one titne in the county of Armagli,reail the disclaimer of certain persons sto their }caving any participation in them. Sorely. there was no man who he,.r.l that disclaimer lint roust • say, that the body of Yee:mance who hal ma le it were every way entitled to approbaiion. The lion. Member had still, that a strong feeling had been manifested in Eng. lend against the establishment cf an Orange Institution here, and lie called upon a Right Hon. Friend of his tit adop: the scums line ut conduct with respect to le. land,as he had done with respect to this country upon a recent oc casion. He (Mr. (1.) agreed entirely in the propriety of the course which his Right lion. Friend lia,l pursued at that time, and he was convinced that to persevere is such a course was the hest mode of counteracting the evils complained of. The lion. Member had said, that Orange Societies were kept up in Ireland from party feeling, but he had not told the house how party feeling was to be allayed; lie had only E ine on descanting on the consti tution of the Soeiettes themselves. lie could nut by any means agree in the proposed address to the Throne ; for there was no man so inexperienced in Parliamentary usage but must see that it implied unwillingness en the part of the Irish Government to du tittle duty.—(llrar, hear.) Addresses of such a nature had never been agreed to, unless where there was an obvious reluctance on the pert of the officers of the Crown to carry the laws into effect. But he would defy any man to say that 'lmre was any reluctance on the part of the olileers of the Crown in Ireland to enforce the laws with impartiality, if the Hun. Member could cast any imputation on the Irish Go vernment fur having protected Orangemen, or if he could show that any Cetholic was subject to penalties from which Orangemen were exempted, then lie (Mr. G.) would say that there would be grounds for Parliamentary interference. But in the absence of such grounds, and in the absence of all suspicion of partiality , he coul d never giSe his assent to a proposition which conveyed censure along with hear.) He would say that the pr. sent Government of Ireland led, from the very first moment, viewed secret societies with the greatest jea limy and apprehension One of the first acts of the officers of the Crown in Ireland was to offer a de termined opposition to societies bound together for the purpose of subverting the Government. The Habeas Corpus Act was in consequence suspended; and though it had not been deemed expedient to renew the suspension after the limited period had expired, yet the authenticated proofs of the existence of such Societies still in the countryonstifi.d the Irish Government in call ing Ler Parliamentary interference. Utile hon. member, before lie brought forward this motion, had allowed him (Mr. 6.) time, lie wouhl have submiled to the house a measure which the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland had in c,m tempi ition for the suppression of Secret Societies. One of its objects was to assimilate the law in Ireland to that which existed in this country in 1799. With respect to Societies in correspondence wi h a foreign enemy, there was, however, a 010(1We:ion to be made In it; fur lie by no means would say that there wereattny in Ireland any Societies that were in Correspondence oil' foreigner,. In the month of November lest.,it was foul' I upon the trial of some persons who belonged to treasunaide a.e..- cea.ions, that country could not possible he secured unless stronger powers were placed in 'Mir hands of the Govern ment. Accordingly Lute Lord Lieutenant called for, and obtained them Taoligh. as lie had already observed, the Orange institution IV,B distinct from the other., yet as ell Secret Societies were had in principle, Government did not intend to exempt any particular association from the operatiott of the proposed lax.--(Lood cheers.) Such being the view of the Government upon this suliject, he hoped it would be seen that they had not been inatten tive to their duty, and that the hciuse would not concur in the expediency of the present motion. lie should therefore move the previous question by way of amend. went. lie considered that the motion could do no good, while it implied blame on the part of the Government of Ireland, and that though it was calcnlated upoh as a btnefit, its effects were likely to be mischrintous. S.; J. NEWPORT said, That if he con idrred the Address as intended to convey &censure upon the Irisll Gnverimient, he would not support. it. It was wills • Erect pleasure that he heard—he was sure that house— shattis hon. and learned friend (Mr. Abercrotaby) would hear %jib feelings of great satisfaction Hata wan the in-. tension of -the Irish tiovernruent to recommend to that house to extend the Att of 1799 to Ireland. That was . the way to proceed ; it wasidle to draw distinctions be• t.veen secret societies; to say this society has been insti tuted for good purposes—that for bad; it was idle to duke secret societies [hear, he.ir, heart]. They must sll embarrass the Government,and endanger public tranquil ty.—elt was the mischief and the curse of Ireland, that for centuries she was governed by means of division ; it was the duty, it was the policy of the Legislature, to ab jure that-course. He hailed the deviation from that prac itce—tle hoped that the spirit of conciliation would be fostered; which wouli remove from Ireland the source of her weakness, of her distractions, and disgrace. With this view he hoped that all secret Societies would be put down. Mr. DAWSON said that in the sentiments that had fallen from his Right Hon. Friend (Mr. (Jou'burn) he agreed. The Orange Societies, the Protestants of Ire land, iwere subject to much misrepresentation. The Honourable Gentleman had alluded to the early perio of the Association—that Association originated in titres of great confusion. In 1793 the country was torn by the ravages of contending factions, and the Protestants, alarmed at the danger, entered line an association for their individual defence ; they attached themselves to the principles of the Constitution as established in 1106. by the Prince of Otange. Hence the origin of thee name. As their numbers increased, their loyalty in creased also, and checked the audacity of the seditious societies. There could be thus far no objection to the societies. Bet when they became thus numeroes, soma • of the gentlemen who composed them conceived the idea - of methodizing them, by establishing rules and regela- • lion:. sod secret signals, by which they might be know to o.te another, and prevent the intrusion of improper . persons. To this part alone he objected (hear); secret oaths and obligations were in violation, not only of the • .spirit but of the letter of the law ; and however patrioi the spirit might he which dicated such regulations, they might he turned to the worst purposes. The hoe. and learned mover trould therefore have his approbetion in any measure to present altogether secret oath.. (Lease, hear.) But was that the sole object of the honourable . and learned mover ? Did he not foresee how his motion would be received in Ireland, that it would be receive i • by the O rangemen es an imputation on their Socie ties (hear, hear, from the Opposition), that it would be considere I by the Protestants as a daringattack upon their opinions. Secret societies were to be condemned,. lint there e as a great distinction to he observed between loy alty and dielevalty. With the single exception of their laCcrelioathei lie agreed with the men who were des:gna- - 'ted as Irishmen, and he challenged anyone to find in atiy of their proceedings a disposition to disloyalty and rian. The hon. gent. then proceeded at considerable length to vindicate the character of Orangemen by reference ter . the various scenes in which they had borne a part from the 'ear linn; but now said the Catholics magnifir t every accidental disturbance in which the Orangern vs were imolicateil in:o a preconcerted plan for the mere throw of the Constitution, and they were astonieheit that the Protestaots were net conciliated. Conciliation had been making rapid strides; butt party spirit now burned ssith a ti rcer flame than ever, and it would .continue •o blaze, if motions were brought forward, which compel led Gentlemen, in poke in themselves and to those whom they r. commended. to bring forward facts which could not fail to create collision. Mr:MAURICE FITZGERALD said there were some . stateitieh:s in the speech of his hnn. friend (Mr. Dawson), • which required to be ceetrailicted. • He should not s•- . .) into the obscure origin of the Orange Associations, 1. - . et • that they seining out of the disaffection of the Catlini's. roe theion of Ireland, Li' denied. The Directors of the' • Uninel It isluiwn hint given evidence, that there was net • a single Bathetic into that body down to the winter of l79'd (heir, hear!). His honourable friend had told them that the Orange Associations originated in 171.ra, and they had, in point of fact, almost driven the. Catholics fso:n the County of Armagh, before a single Catholic had been enrolled among the United Irishmen (hear, hear:). His hun. friend had said, however, why did not the lion. and learnel mover direct his observa tions against other secret societies, as well as agairen. the Orangemen ? His hon. friend bad himself stated this reason—they were already under prosecution (hear, hear!). His right lion. and learned friend (Mr. Plunkett) was now hanging and transporting them (a laugh). lint the Orange Societies were too strong, if not for Parliament, for the existing law and the present Government of Ireland (hear). The motion was directed against the Orange associations, not that theirobjects were treasonable, but that, perhaps with loyal intentions, they called forth counter associations, inflamed terrors, excited • passions,and kept I reland in continual age ation and alarm. The hon. member bad stated that th • Rebellion bad b-titt put down by Orangemen; and that they were the only loyal subject.. How this assertion could be supported lie did now lanow. The Rebellion, put down in ljnet. was put down by all na atties—by King's tioops—by the veemanry, and the militia, amonntiner to 25,000 men, a great part of whom were Catholics. It was his tniefor- Gine to be somewhat older than the hon. member, and he recollected all these things. lie had on that occasion served with Catholics—been surrounded with Catholic's, and had witnessed many of their deedsiof bravery—. (hear.) His Majesty ha I recognized their zeal in this cause, and ex preesed his gratitude f tr. their exertions, and now the boa c eras told that Rebellion teas down exch.,- sienly by Orangemen (hear.) He adverted to this to show to the house in what manner this prejudice actu ated even generous and enlithtened minds; and what then might they expect would be the feelings of the igl1+1• rant and bigotted, of those who came daily into contact wilt the Catholics who were stiginatise.l as disloyal: • Let the house but turn their view to the two countries, and they would observe a strong con rest between Ire land and Enniand. Whatever disputes might prevail here, however, the people might be split into parties, whenever any great qitesiion came before them for deci sion,'Whonever an important event excited general inte rest, a spirit of unanimity was observed which, was truly national. In Irelanil, however, every thing resolvel itself into factions, an 1 his motive in supporting the pre sent motion seas to allay and cheek animosities. 'Pie Irish are a eehement people, and •if a notion prevails that you countenance I action before Ling they with break out in some serious calamity. The lion. Member then proceeded to v•tt licate the conduct of the present Lord Lieutenant, and to eel •g:ze the character of Lord Corn: wallis; for their en•leavours to put down the factioue, - • not cog par;ieularle tile pieties of the present day in Dublin, and concluded %aim saying, that lie was disposed. to support the motion of his learned friend ; but lie did not wish hint to push the measure, if a pledge were given oil the part of Gonemineitt that a measure shoelai be Sehmitted to the house for extending the provisithis of the 49th of the late Ring to Ireland. (The honout able member sat down amidst considerable cheering.) a• Mr. Secretary . atter vindicating himself from the suspicion of partiality on the question before the house, said, that in discussing it iir'sliould refer to unite general 'and 'constitutional principles than the other Members had referred to. The object of the motion was in putedown party attimosities and do 'sweet with imps,- per associations. The Hon. tilentletnan says taxi vow, _fleet Ise wants to mu down the Or ange Snctetiel,_ last he wants to do this, by known loos, hy the aseradacti of W.tiat alone' tin ithretrekise. • but. it ia hatbSible in ,~ ~. ~ 1 i . I