The Statesman. — London, England, 1820-10-09 00:00:00

• • 7M Va. ..• '-..-.- .- THE STATEiM THE QUEEN. gOtJSE OF T.ORDS...-(Twee llioantne.) After prayers, the Peers were called over as nsnat. iv defaulters were Ilse:flint Anson, the Marquis of g o fer, sad the Puke of Argyle. co wl were then called - in. and Dr. HENRY HobL oß pr' %%Iced as a witness, on the part of h er Majesty, and sworn . . basiseil by Mr. 11 it nr.—Did yon leave England 15 the year VII, with her Royal Highness the H u es of Wales, as Physician to her household P—l did. NJ you go with her Royalllighness to Naples? Tr* Pid to 7entlin with her daring the whole of the t w she continued at Naples ?—y es .. What description of vi.itors slid her Royal flightless reeire whi:e %he was at Naples --11"ith very few ex opf,oni, all the nobility, ( foreign as well as New. politas• m o o did her Royal Highness go to from Naples? _T o RAW and Henna. D o pe r on board the elorinde with her Royal grimmer—l did. *6 4 d e scription of visitors did her Royal Highness ret i r e at tienoa?-1 believe all the Euglish nubility then at Gems. Wink her Royal Highness was at Genoa did you oh serre an inclination in her Royal Highness to avoid th e ietr of the English ?—Certainly not. Wliat was the situation, as to publicity, of the home o „.„ p i e d by her Royal Highness at tienoa?—lt was about half a wile from town, but on a spot very thickly inhabited. Do eon know that a person of the name of Bergami was is the wilier of her Royal Highness ?—Ves. Did he at any time dine at the table of her Royal Halmos daring her stay at Genoa At all the places you have mentioned, what, accord- in: to me observation, was the behaviour of her Royal Highly* towards Bergaini ?—Always that of a mistress toads her servant. Rig was that of Bergami towards her Royal High aro —Never any thing but conduct the twist unpre- On1:11; ant respectful. Was there any understanding between you and her Ffryal Hi , 4 hness as to the time you were to stay with bet:—lies. It was understood that I was to remain a year and au half sr two years. Where did you tinit her Royal Ilighness?—At Venire. At trios(' s%r:r3tiOn Wan it that von went on to Ve ?— .1:y to.: o. Whet yon left her Royal Highness at Venice, was it orderstood that yon had ,p,itted her service altogether, or that yen ran to return !—lt WAS understood that I was to retirn. What was the occasion of your leaving her Royal flightless at Venice to go to England ?—At 31ilan, her R. , val Highness rave sue six weeks leave of abseMe to tale a tour in Switzerland, and I expressed a wish that iwead of going to Switzerland, her Royal Highness wnclJ pernit me to go to England, where Inv private :I:r2f'Scaliell for my presence; and then the tineAtiou ere., 'anther I should quit her at 11ilan, or go on to Venire. Do von OW-miser the persons of distinction who vi si!rd lice floral Highness at Genoa ?—ltalians as well F.ag:i.s. &pod enough to Lune some of them 7—Lord Whit woad, Lord Malpas. Lord William Bentinck, and the wavier Officers of the Army and Navy. Cross-esamined by the SoLicivon-tlENnua Da yea remember at limos, Bergami's meeting with to accident do not. At Nr.ples?-1 do. Was be conl;urd to his bed for three or fonr days in consequence was. Du von latow what servant attended bins --Ilajoeci. Vino! Majocci at that time sleep in a small cabinet, or wljoining room belonging to Bergawi do not know. Do you remember a sofa in that cabinet ?—1 do not. Am I to understand that ♦on do not remember one way or the other 2—.1 do not recollect either one way or the other. With r •spect to tne situation of the house at Geneva, you have %%act! that it was iu the subnrbs, that the suburbs wore populous; pray was it not in a court ear rounded by a garden, with some buildings at the back —There was a small garden in front of the house; the terrace, garden, with a wood behind. Were you in the habit of dining every day with her Revd Highness at Naples and Oe►,oa?----At Genoa every day:, at Nap!es not. Ito you remember a masqned Ball at Naples, given ito hooey of the Neapolitan king:-1 was not there. Were you at the Theatre San Carlo., at a Inas- Twat!, was. Wbo dill her Royal Highness go with ?—1 was not aaare until the folluning day th.t she had been there. Were vos present during the whole performanre ? Moot an hour, as far as 1 can recollect, certainly a short time. Aro 1 to understand that von do not know with whom her Royal Highness went to the Theatre that evening? —lrs, you are. Yoe Lve stated that as far as you have observed of the continct of her Royal Highness towards Hergami, it WAS that of a mistress to a servant. Allow me to ask you, hate you, on any one occasion, observed any im propriety as the conduct of her Royal Highness towards tierpon, or have you ever matte any such observation ? --I never dial observe any impropriety. Are Jon acquainted with a Minister at York sm. Having reminded you of that circumstance, allow me to ask you if vow ever elated to any person that you dis approved of du modem of her Royal Highness towards Itergami saver bays. Have vow, Di. Holland, ever informed any one what ever, that yon thought the conduct oilier Royal High "' laaciarect, tr say Ibis, to that effect ?—I have not Ido not ask that pertly .with reference to Hergami, bet whether yotonatle any observation to any individual Whatever der,, ga t ovj from what her conduct on ht to bate be en ?—I an so satis f i ed of the negat i ve, thatl will venture , o linear it. We all know, Dr. Holland, that you have published certain travels; you will excuse me fur calling that to row recollection, bat I now wish to ask whether you have had any occasion to alter any opinion you had wtitten? Mr. IVt Lee objected to this filtration, and the objec tion was topported by the Lord Chancellor. Have yon always entertained the same opinion since ren have hail an opportunity of observing the conduct of her Royal Highness?-1 feel it. quite impossible to state every finetnatton of sty opinions, but 1 hare never had anv change of opinion on this suljoet• bid roe ever state to env one that the conduct at bee Royal highness was each that no one who had any re gard for character wield remain with her, or something to that wives ?-1 art satialleel I did not. Did Pin duty lend you w be oath abort the perboo irthe Primes' 7—Tery little. • You were engaged Nets peineipaNy pier own Ow eir " , or studies r Ala seithiPy mien 'A interfere *kb Prefelsiond etragetobid upwards her UPI MO' atak Was not the principal opportunity of observing the conduct of her Royal Highness, that which was atiorded at ;he time of dinner?—lt was. except as the duties of your profession required, you did not attend her Royal Highness in the forenoon or in the evening, but merely at the time of dining?—Es cepting when her Royal Highness received society In the evening, 1 did not. At that time did Bergansi wait at table?—He did. Both at Naples and Ueuoa?—Both at Naples and Genoa. How long were you at Milan with her Royal High ness before proceeding to Venice ?—About a fortnight. Do you remember any of the family of Berganti en tering the service of the Princess at tienoa ?-1 do not. Do you not remember a female entering the service there, called Fanstina, who was the sister of Bergami ? —1 am not aware of it. 1/0 you mean that you are not aware that Faustina entered the service, or she was not the sister of Bergatui ? —I do not remember her. Was there a little child there, named Victorine?— There was a child, whose name I do not know. Was there a female with the child i—l saw an elderly female, and it was said, that she was the mother of Her- Was she the only female that you .recollect coining with the child to enter the Princess's service at I;entia —She WWI. Do you remember a person called Louis Bergansi en tering the service ?-1 do. In what cgp•trity (lid he enter ? T I cannot answer. Did von see him wait at table ?—1 did. Dist he wear a livery ?—lle did. M what period of your stay at Henna did Louis Bet garni enter the service ?-1 du not recollect. Was it at the beginning or the latter end as far y ou recollect ?—As far as I recollect it was towards the .be ginning. How long (lid Lady Charlotte Campbell continue with her Royal Ilighnesa at Milan?—To within three or four days of her Royal Highness's depart:ire. After Lady Charlotte Campbell left was there any lady except Madame Oldi with her Royal Highness 7t—'There was not. how soon after Lady C. Campbell left, did Madame Oldi enter the service`?---As far as I recollect a day or two. Yon dial not travel in the same carriage with her Royal Highness ?---1 did not : I have on some occasions, but not then. I speak of the journey from Milan to Venice ?-- 1 did uot. When Madame Oltli first rame into the service were you aware that she waa the sister of Vergauti :--• I was not. How long after did yon know that site was the sister of liergaini did slot know it while I attended Ler Royal IliFlitiess. What tune elapsed after Madame Olin entered the ser vice that you erased to attend ?----Eight months. When volt arrived at Venice, did her 110y41 Highness go to an hotel ?--S.ist Did her Royal Hitt'mess continue there during her whole resideuee at Vetlice?—She did not. flow long did she remain there?-1 rather think one night. Where did she Ito then?—To a house adjoining the hotel, into Imlging4. Was 51r. William Burrell with you at that time ?—He was. Dui you and Mr. Burrell go to leer Royal Highness, or remain at the Hotel?—We remained. Did voc dine at the house where her Royal Highness removed, or at the Hotel the house to %thick her Royal Highness removed. iVith her Royal Highness ?-IYith her Royal High ness. Do you rerollect whether von dined there every day during tLe time you were at Venice ?—I believe every flay. bid her Rufal Highness quit Venice before yon, or did you leave first ?—I left it first. Dtd you ever after rejoin her Royal Highness ? Never. Do you know If Madame Olui spoke French ?—1 do not know. _ _ . Ihil von ever bear her ?—1 always conversed with her in Italian. Re-examined by Mr. illi.nr. Was her Majesty's house *in Genoa in a conspicuous situation, or a private one —l'onspicitous. How long have von been in England since you left her Royal Highness's service —Si?x years. Hare you Generally resided in England during that period F—l have. have you ever been examined before upon this sub ject ::—Never. By Lord Emit:is:E.—Referring to all the time, and all the places at which you attended the Princess. did you ever observe any thing indecent, immodest, or improper in her bt'havionr have not. By Lord tittev.—Did you at any time observe in the conduct of her Royal Highness any condescension calculated to be disgraceful to the character of this country ?—1 believe I can answer decidedly no.. Was any application mule to you by any person for information respecting the Princess's conduct, during the time you were in her service ?—No application whatever. Some important questions were put by Lord LACIMIR DALC, as to the situation of Bergami's room with respect to that of Dr. Holland, during the illness of the former. Lord Latroaanat.E.—Does Dr. Holland recollect the room he slept in at Genoa ?--I do. In the next room you slept in, did nut Hieronymus sleep there ?--Yes. And William Austin ?—Yes. Where did the great passage lead out of the corri dor towards your room ?--Into the dining-room. Lord ORANTHAM.—Does Dr. Holland remember on the same floor in which Bergami and he slept, whe ther there was a water-closet, as described by a former witness ?-1 cannot say. Here some delay occurred by reading over the croee examination of Dr. Holland. Lord IVINCHILSIA.—Do you know any thing of the Queeti the last six years ?—lt is five years last June, since I left the Princess, since that time, 1 can not say any thing of her. Lord Itos..—Doctor Holland, you have written a book of travels, may 1 ask to whom you dedicated it? 1 -1 did not dedicate it at all. To whom did you intend to dedicate it - t—i did in tend dedicating it. I Will you swear positively that you did not mention to any one that you intended dedicating it to the Qneen ? —1 will. . Does the Queen speak Italian?—When I was with hei she spoke it imperfectly. Can you say how she because acquainted with the Countras of Ofdi ?-1 do not. Did you not tloink it stra how she could MOW lase due service, with kstow who shnwas ? •• :5 There was se MP objection 20-Nair qwestless." We 04141 aothese the suewer. • "• • Did yes sent who she was ?—la sight he. bat I do net exactly recency. • By a Peat.—At Clean* I understand you dined almost every day with the Princess ?—Almost every day. 41d Berganii ever sit down at the table on those occasions ?—Never. •You think you dined every day with her Royal Highness ?—1 really believe 1 did. By the Earl of thaftownv.—Did you ever hear her Royal Highness and the Countess of Uldi speak in French ?--I do not recollect that I did. Did you ever hear the Countess of OW speak French at all?--1 do not recollect, I think not. What was the particular dialect of the Italian lan guage which was ob•ervable about that of the Coun tess of Ob ?--It was the dialect of Lombardy. Is that the Italian which is learnt by those who learn the Italian language from hooks?—There is a difference certainly. I mean is that Italian the Italian which is generally spoken by people of quality and education ?—lt certainly is not the pure Italian. Did you ever hear the rounte4 of Oldi speak port Italian:—lt is difficult for me to say. 1 think there was a peculiarity. Das it occurred to von that the ('nnntrss of 01.11 ever spoke pure Italian's--That question it is dilleult to an swer. I bail few opportunities of convcising with the Countess of Obli. 1k a PF-Ell.—DOeS the accent of Lombardy differ from the pure Italian any more than the Scotch arrent whirls is spoken by people of talent and education, differs from the pure English ?—lt is impossible fur me to an swer that question. By the LORII CIIANCELLOR.—VOII have told ns that Bergami never sat at table wills the Princess at Genoa; slid Ise ever sit at table with her Royal Highness any where else ?—Never. By a PEER.-1)111 the Princess ever in your hearing express any dissatisfaction at the situation of her house at lienua ?—1 do not recollect to have heard her distinctly express any dissatisfaction, but I know she went to look at another house for the purpose of taking it. Did she ever assign any reason for wishing to change her residence at liettaa never heard her assign a reason._ 1 understood yon to say, that during the whole of the time you were in the service of her Royal Highness Ilergi )))) i was a menial servant ?—Yes. Hid you ever at any time, or under any circumstance whate%er, remark that her Royal Highness conducted herself in a manner inconsistent with that relation in which her Royal Highness as Princess of %Vales should stand towards her servants ?-1 beg to observe, that her Royal Highness in general was very condescending and affable to her servants • but 1 never observed any dif ference between her behaviour to Bergatui and that to her upper servants. Then I am to understand that you account for the condescension of her Koval Highness towards Bergaini from the circnntstance of her general condescension to all her servants?—Yes, I never observed any difference. By another PM:B.--M what period dial you first enter the service of her Royal Highness when she left Ragland. that was I. I tsl I, I believe ?—Ves, in Au gust 1414. Pe , aro How long did von remain in her service ?-•—.lbout ten months. By the Lord CuaN,•iu.or..---llid and• of the other servants ever dine with her Royal flightless while luu were with her ?--No. Mr. BROUGHAM herr begged their Lordships would he good enough to ask thr witness whether he was iu the receipt of any pen,ion from her Majesty. The Lord CHANCELLOR accordingly put the ques tion. Dr. Holland answered, I have no pension. The witness was then ()tared to withdraw. CHARLES Esq. examined by Mr. DINMAN. Do you generally resii!e at Rome ?—1 do. Were you there in the summer of 117 was. Had von then . the honour of seeing her Royal High ness the Princess of Wales called upon her Royal Highness the day after her arrival. Ile yon know how long her Royal Highness resided at Route was there but 13 days, and therefore do nut know. You left there before her Royal Highness ?---I did. Ilad you the honour of her 'loyal Highness's acquaint ance before that had. Dining the 12 days that you were at Rome, were yon repeatedly at her Royal Highness's house or hotel ? I dined there most days. With her Royal Highness ?---Yes. Cats you inform the House if at that time, persons of high rank visited her Royal Highness ?-31any. Can you mention their 1141111 • 5 The Baroness Atteltione. who was appointed by the Uosernment to attend ou her Royal highness, as dame erhuanc e r. iVere there any other persons of rank appointed to attend her !loyal Highness ":—The Duchess Sae charoni. Was her Royal Highness attended by a guard of honour always ?—Yes; and all other honours were paid to her, such as a box, at the Theatre, &c. the same as the other Royal personages, when resilient at Rome. When yon dined with her Royal Highness, do you remember other persons of rank at the table 1-1 es, I remember Lord Kilworth--the .Ibbe Taylor was a con stant guest. Were there other persons of rank who Paid their re spects to the Princess :—Tbe individuals of rank came to pay evening visits. Was Rergamt at that time Chamberlain ?—He was. Did he in this cliarsetec dine with her Royal High ness at table ?—lie did. Have you often seen her Royal Highness and her Chamterlain, Bergen'', in company together ?—Fre quently. Did you ever see the smallest impropriety of conduct between those individuals ?—Never. Does that answer apply to your observations of their conduct at Rome only, or when yon have had opportu aities of seeing them elsewhere ?—Perfectly. • Did yon pay your respects at Pesaro in 1819?-0n. my !Timm to Venice I called at a house near Pesaro. How long did you remain there ?—Two days, her Royal Highness was out when 1 called. bat she sent a carriage with one of her equerries and 11r..W. Austin. to desire that I would visit her that evening. Did yon go ?—I did. At what hour did you arrive?—Between seven and eight in the evening.-1 remained to tappet and din returned to the Inn. Did roe pay your respects to her the followlag day —Her Reyal Ilighnns sent a carriage with an marry to desire that he should abew we every thin worth ssu-, in, at Pesaro. Did yeti dine t h ere that eveniag ?—Yes, • . Have Vow shies had the bottom , of siplog MOO- Qusea_uf 1 . liaW her WWII NW 110. 'Hued at MduisChi . • Sisk the minds ind the day d the uoistb if peed• Ns?—Ft was in February, diet darks*. 'likes Oath! .mo Had she then a/11010011 the title and dignity of Wee I of England k—Site had. Ha I . IP two ladies of honour to attend her there :— She hall not. Had she any altar,' of honour in attendance at her hotel ?--She had tiolir: Nevertheless, did any persons of rank do themselves the honour to pay their respects to her Maajesty ?—There were as I heard. I saw their names down in a book. Did you ever see any thing in the conduct of bre Royal 'Highness towards Itergami M hich appeared to you derogatory from the dignity of the English crown; or which nag calculated to wound the moral fee!ings rt the country?—Never. Independent of that did you ever see any one thing in her Majesty's conduct towards Brigand, either iti r:•tte or public to which a just exception could h.: t .ken ? The ATTORNET-OENER.U. objected that the reneril conduct of the parties could not be made rnatter of evi dence. 31r. DE:vactst said, that arse qnestion* were aeked not loolcing to the parties thett:%elves, Imt reference to the charges in the Bill. That Bill charged her Majesty, with improper and unhecomin, behaviour and lattefliarity with Ilergami, and he had here a witness who had three distitset opportunities of observing that conduct, and he maintained he Iva% jt:i tilled inputting questions to hlui nu the subject. The LORD CUANCELLOK saw no objection :o question. The ATTORNEY-URN ERAL'I only objection to :lie flues tiou was as a leading question. que, , tion repeatel-1 never slid. !low many times did you dine with her 3lajesty at Rome ?—On the first occasion, three or four times. As many as three or four times ?—Quite as many. Besides those whom yon have named, you letre state! that other persons called on her Majesty at that time ynu called ; can you enumerate their nasnes?—The who were in attendance, and many other of the Romps nobility. Many of the Cardinal's Ladies. I met Car dinal Gonsalvi on the stairs in her lajesty's hung e. If there were many other persons their hrsi lei those, you can enumerate some of them:—fler Met• jesty generally saw company in the e%euirg, and I dined with her. When you say that many other persons eall•:J, J. yon mean that you heard so, ur do you speak fro:n your own personal knowledge': --nom any personal knowledve, I sass there one evening, and I saw them as I was goint;• past on others. On the evening, or evenings on which you were there, can you name any other person of ill+tine•ion whom you saw, besides those you have meti:iunvl :•-• I cannot. Ili 1119 you paid a visit to her Royal Higlc:e.s at Dial Bergansi sup with you and It..r Royal Hignness at Pesaro ?L-He And dine the next day ?—He Can you mention the persons who dined at her Royal Highness's table at Pesaro ?—There was Vas sali. Bergami, Madame Oldi, and William Austin, ant two other persons with whom I was unacquainted. Was Louis Bergami nie of those other persons:— I cannot say he was. 1 am nut sure that 1 a:n a..- qu.Cuted with his person. Then the only occasions on which yan saw her Roial Hip hness, were at Rome awl PesirJ ?—They were. Reexamined by Mr. OLN max. Had you the honor of being actin:tinted nitli her RUFAI Highness before she left England ? s - I had. Hy a Para.—Did you feel any objection to sit at title with Rergami ?-1 cannot say I did. When did you, leave Rome taste—ln April last. fly Lord Isycarocrt..—ln Isl 7, when you were in the habit of visitiur her Royal Highness at Rome, did you we any English ladies who called at her house?—lt was at a time when there were not many English at Ittnbe I did not see any English ladies. fly Lord M. 4 NMI:MR.—YOU have stated, that in In.o, at Koine, her Royal Highness took the style and uignity of Queen of England? The Loan Illtaxcat.Lon. This (million has already been stated. Do you know that application had been made to the Government of Rome for a passport for her Majesty the Queen of England ?--I know that an application was made to the British Consul. Do you know whether application was mad.. to have her Majesty designated as the Queen of England know there was. . By Mr. KIWI:011AM through the Lord Chancellor.-•- How do you know this i—lier Majesty told me. This must he struck oat. By Lord F.ALIIocTII.•—When you dined and *upped in company with the Countess oili, *ere you in troduced to het ?-1 was introduced to her the first tinte. What were her manners 2-•—They were unobtrusive and natural. .: Did you consider them u those of an Italian lady ?•—• I did not consider them otherwise. Was the Italian abe stoke good, —pare Italian ?—She yoke with the accent of Lombardy. Yon did not think that indicative of vulgarity ?—All I persons have it, who come from Lombardy. Hy Lord Ltraeroot..—Was the Italian *hr spoke gre. statically correct ?—1 am not sufficiently versed in dm 1 ' language to answer that question. . Did you ever discover any thing incorrect to your 1' ' • knowledge ?—No. The witness then withdrew. The name of the gentleman stated in another part of our paper as haiing employed a person to di‘. lAbote seditious hand bills, is Franklin. When called 'pm this morning, he did not appear at the Police- Ace, Hew-street. A Ur. Williams, meetly passed word yesterday for the appearance of Mr. (441)1111o, the Majestrate, Mr. Baker, being satisfied. with that • *al,. The charges brought against him by Mr..Pear eon ate of a most serious nature. Mr. P. is indefali gable in his endeavont to secure him. It Is said that ,eneett curious circumstances are connected with this A strong rumor is *hat that a peesowage of die **Mos is likely to be rebooted to the Tower 'on a se ldom, charge of High Truism. Who the woolly, is • • we damn pretend to point MO. Nor have we learnt Vim and • where tkt *duct 1111 toritic4 the charge is Istkieigi, is *Hedged to have beat mommitted. Time following 'article - is from thd last &matJavetsal. What eat . stssairldeil it attipiord to Whigs to oblivion?—" A ' • rszerptitto, *occurred at ChieheilitsP . v •lfltett Rio ... tti .pimoil-dirough thattll, sts litt,11141;r09 1 , Mmritaneetll4o &oil •we *fret we cannot maim -. 3.:•• iboaiMidellieloyatioe of ; we shall, therefore, to wt., tlo osoillit of those triton it may concern, conoigu it to ; - I. -., .:~ ::, • .4- • • • r • ". • L' • .‘ . • r. . r Pa_lry.4l ~~ ------ ..... -.~~-.r_ .~. . . ~ -_, . - -.11,1111 ~---- :x.. IP r JP II p /