The National Register. — London, England, 1816-03-24 00:00:00

MARCH 24. • prepat rii to sav, that if the House shrunk flout imposing this tax, they would abandon a strung f ea t u r e of finance. The Nvble Lord denied that aN the puldie meetings were for the purpose of opposing the Property-tax ; other ;natters were mised up in the mu 'lion. Out of 90 countit s, only 19 peti tions were from counties. It was, in truth, a div bird question, not half of the counties weve aZaittst the tax. He should con tend, that it was by clamour that the breach of Parliament was attempted to he fastened on the House. -(f/..a , .. hew'.)—The expellees of the country were estimated iu rotund nnuMers at ' :t o m inion:, prospectively at .2.11 millions. The revenue to tweet this was the surplus of the Consolidated Fund, mid th e mi ler items, amounting to '2M ewillious. The plan of Isis Right Ilon. Friend had been, to remit eight millions, thus leaving alp.ott two-thirds of the revenne applicable to the, ex-penditure. Would it be prudent to remit six millions more. Gentlemen had talk ed of referring to the Sinking Fund, which was now something snore titan 11 millions; hut that would lie a tootle of proceeding injitriotta to the best principles of timmee. It the House (lid not give.the Government the aid of this tax this year, you must endure a debt of 1-2. millions, which there was no possibility of avoiding; and he pot it to the good smite of the House and nation,if they would shrink ft ont supporting the Government, and tsi.a their barks on thritssrires. lie, therefore, hatl nu doubt the House would agree to the vote. Mr. Hnot tr t a shoved the recorded pledge of P.illiuinent itself. In the tit sect, of the fottt of the Ling lie *mond these a or.ht—" Be it further enacted, that tlik %et shall con tinue in tree during the war, and for six months after the cot (elusion ofa Definitive Treat) of Peace, rind its longs."—(Loud cries of hear, hear.) Mr. Wit. mnfourer. believed that the House in supporting 'this tax would indeed turn their Int,-k, on /emu He saw no clear and plain neeessity for the tae. llis 'Right Hon. Friend had put it in a clear point of view. and tits gueNtion was, whether the House should east. the money mat ket or ease them selves.--( Hear, Ifrur.) . . _ . .... , _ The House then divided— Aye 4, 401-- Noes, 238—Majority azainst the Tax, 37. -(Loud c4g aim; jialviced the atmeonct ?newt , !1 the flambe, R.) . The Report of the Supply for sealing a provision for the Princess Clitirlotto of Wales, was brought op and agreed to; as was also the Report of the Army Estimates. Adjourned iit'luo o'Cloek. Tt away, M 4R CB 19. Mr. WESTERN presented a petition, signed by a number of the mmt respectable owners and occupiers of land in the (*Min ty N.,l* EsstA, EVlliiitt forth the hardshil,s4inder hich tlkey at present laboured, and praying a re% ision of the present ”'stetti of Ty tins. 'Ulm Hon. Member tool, this oppoi limit!, nt b Wing his opinion that the present s%stem of ty the. was one whir(' was Irighls burthensome to the coltivators of land, and which called loudly fur the interference of the Legislature. Mr. Lot t,u IET agreed iu what hail been stated by the Hon Momber. (Mr. W.) After a fuw w ords from Mr. COKE, tki. 'million was ordered to lie on the table. Mr. I'. :Moon E presented a petition from Rear-admiral 6r:revs, claiming a redress of certain grit.% anees, %%Inch, lie stated, he had sustained by the itmaoper sole and transfer ofx si‘th part attic Valiaina Islands, which he claimed in right of his wife, Arabella Grants, to whose famil% the land in tilles.tioll had been granted by a patent from the t . :row.n.—The petition was ordered to lie on the table. 31r. Com: presented a petition front certain owners and oc cupiers of land in the county of Norfolk, praying Ate Wiese to take into consideration the distressed state of kgriculture. Sir W. NNE presented a petiti tttt (rout certain ow ners and nevi' piers of land in the county of llenbigh, setting forth the hardships under which they at present laboured. Mr. )faun I:11AM MO% eti for a return of all goods seized as contraband, ou board transports, tvithin the last six nxintlis ; awl also for copies of correspondence between Sir Home Pop ham and the Treasury. relatise. to tr,oisports in the service of thivernment, or .pretending to be in Ilw set.% ire of Govern.. went, having contraband goods on board.--After a few words front Mr. Vansittart, the motions were agreed to.--Ad juitrned. SiEDNESDAY, - ,\lAlt Ell 20. bin Bong brought in a Bill for building u new Church in the Parish oksit. Pancras, which was read a first time. Mr. W. Burrell presented a petition from the Rape of Arun del ; and Geo. Ferguson one I Forfar, praying the House tot Ake into its serious consideration the present distressed state rd gricultural Interest, and tlif laws relatit eto the I)istilleries. Laid on the table. ( n the motion of Mr. Mellish. the New River and West Mid dlsex Water-work Rill was ordered to be rca.l a sreund time this day six months. Mr. BIM t:111M presented a petition signed by 5000 mei , elitmts and tradesmen of the city of Acestininster and Mr. comma one front Mary -le-Botinc,itgaiiist the Insult cut Debt ors* Act. The former gentleman stated, that thane , the three years this Act had been in active operation, persons hail been televised whose debts ttttt to ; and the amount or the compositien they bad _paid was I I4ft., or between a *mirth and a tilt a ova farthing iii the pound! 31r..A IMItcltti311111; admitted what the Hun. Gentleman had eta t ea, calk(' for the most serious enquiry; Lie lie conjured the noose tto listen to the at-counts, which were exaggerated, until a Committee bad looked into the subject. At all et outs it oftenliappetied, that the creditor was inure in fault than the debtor by his own carelessness. SI r A NI rept tiled his former statement. The petit was laid on the table. REPEAL OF THE W R MALT -TAX. VANSITIAiII rose null stated, that he should 011 Monday next, in the Committee of Ways and Means, move to continue the several War Duties of Cartons and Excise, with the excep tion ut the Malt-tax. No doubt surprise would be exc i ted, that Le should relinquish this tax, after having so recently , by the derisionof Parliament, berm oldi;:eil to forego the Property- Tax. But since that decision had liven come to—whether vs isely or not it was not fur him to ilt•tt rmine- —it was of litll.i consequence whether a larger or .smaller sum was obtained by loon. 'the onjeet he had in tic. it. in relinquishing the Mar Malt Duty, NA , to rise relief to the suffering tenantry of the cutinti). ; rcljing on the wistla n and energy Or to make good the deficiency-4 Hear, hear .9—tie should not, after the. L oma ttttt ication, consider himself ut liberty to make any blither concussions in respect to the agricultural interest, Era to relieve them ft out the Horse-tax ; which, in the event of the Property-tax taking place, he had stated he should do. Not lthoind he consider himself Lome% to relinquish any of the other resources of the country.—The Rt. Hon. Gentleman then soz rested t o the lino. Gentleman rNlr. WkSTI.:IIN 1 the neces•ity of postponing his notice of motion fur a Committee, on tile agri cultural distresses of the c ountry to some di:tant Mr. Coal: rejoiced that the Ht. Hon.Colitleman had d ee m e d t) exluvlie ut to allow the %Val. :Malt tax to expire. Ile Marne hat the agricultural ieterest hail looked for relief the first do:, TIIr NATIONAL REGTSTER. f esperiailv the relinquishment of this tax. whi wa, the• first step to a great relief. At the same time he did not , oink that the Revenue would lose so much a' might be imagined, the tax nut prolueiti4 more than two millions. Mr. BRAND wished to know whether tbe Malt-tax did not ex: , ite on the aliof July. Mr. VAN4ITTART replied in the affirmative, and observed that lie should submit a motion with respect to the stock on haiiil. Mr. PONSONBY rejoiced that Ministers had abandoned the tax. To that abandonment they Intel been driven by the peo ple of England. Without their loud and general voice the In come-tax would not base been got rid of, and he trusted the defrat of Ministers in that respect would be an eternal lesson to the people of England.—( Laud crier of hear, heat ! ) 'rimy might be assured that their Representatives would attend to their call, and compel Ministers to listen to the voice of justice and of reason—( /I, ar, hear !'t Lord Cssrtineacit conceived the Rt. Hon. Gentleman could not hate been in the House when his Rt. lion. Friend had made the communication respecting the Malt-tax, or he would not have attributed to the exertions of the people, the relingnishment of a means of taxation which was conceded only to the distresses of the agricultural interest. With re. sport to the Propurty-tax, he was prepared to contend that it was a wise, just, and politic. measure, intended to relieve the agricultural interest, and the lowerorders of the people.—(Loud crirs of he ar, hear!) Rut the rich had relieved themselves from burtheit. and therefore he must protest against the decision of Parliament, which he must ronsider as unwise ; if they had at muted to the moil tied impositios as proposed by his Rt. lion. Fe cud, the people would have been more relieved than other s% is •--( Ileur, !fear!) Mt. Goud a expressed his congratulations in common with the I hope on the abandonment of the Malt-tax. He also wished to state that 3linisters hitherto had received his support, but for the Eunice he should only support them so lung as they adopted and persevered in a ss stein of economy.—( Hear, loar ! ) 1114U611A M 1101/Cll, that those Gentlemen se bee generally ipporteil Ministers would take a lesson from the Hon. Gen ts man who spoke last, and oniy give sappou t when it could be given honestly—thenthe country might be saved, awl the Crown compelled to do its tlat.y to the natiou —(lfaft, h ear!) Lord Last:m.l.Es coneeised it was not p orient to announce. to the cc untrv, that because. they had sue, ecded in petitioning the Income-tax. they were to petit on agaiust all others. It nicest be obvious to the lion. and I ea neil Gentleman, that there were a number of v‘penees to win i up the war, and cOll - there :mist be a guest 111'111. n I ti r money. Mr. limn a; t.st had 110 such ide ! had not wished the peop:e to petition against all taxes. 3lr. Ross: could not sit stet, and hear that the Property-tax equally affeeted t h u poor us the rich. He must deny the posi tiou the great landholder and stockholder were more relieved by its repeal than oily other class of the commimity. It was ti lie that it Was objectio::ahle, inasmuch as It m ide the private affairs of the trading part of tho public subject to inspection ; but in vs ery other point of view it was cue t so. He was per boasted the good acuse of the country would come round in time, and they would find the tax to b:. a Rued one, and infi nitely leas oppressive than any other—l h eat, heed ) AGIIIi:ULTORAL DISTRESSES.. Mr. Ct nwaa presented a petition from the landholders of C berland, stating the agrituriiral iiistres-es of the country. The lion. Gentleman stated the great distresses of the enmity in particular fr which this peitiati 1 reeeeded, and consi dened that the Noble Lord (mold not be aware of the general state oh the agriculturat Well had miser' in a great measure ont of the waist of a circulating ruction'', and front the increase of the importation of wheat and grain, antecedent to the year 1813. He contended, that thcre were at this moni t or cure men out of employment than at any peril of scarcity. 'Die pressure of taxation had borne so oil the ride, that they could not tied ciiiployment for the poor. .The abandon ment of the Malt-tax was a r:lief to the fainter ; but he still found himself aggr:eved from the pressure of thee Horse-tax; and he hoped Ministers would take that pant of the sobject into consideration. _ ..... ...._....... Mr. LONG WELLENL IA declared, that no man felt more than himself for the sle-tres , es of the agricultural interests. But when the Income nod lislt-taxes were removed, what snore did the people want ? :Moist( is wens iutitled to the thanks of the country for what they hail done. .I , ..vrEirN expressed his satisfaction that the Ma!Wax was to be repealed. Lord CtsTuitiractt triiste 1 the House and the country VI oulasee it in the light in whi c h it wa• ilteiMedt. a• a great effort to relieve the distress of the lut.cr classes of the re ile. The petition was then re( e'ved and referred to the Agri cultural Committee. Lord SLGENT, after a few worths, moved fur an account of the number of Clerks, and the amount of slier sittapes, as exist ' ing in the Admiralty in the year 1815 and lAri and also the nuinlit•r of persons horse on the Adusiralty licablislanent, and the aakosaut of CjiliplOgiGioll granted to superanaum.ed Clerks since NI Mr. (:stohen di l not see the necessity for the Return for which Ilse Noble Lord had snored, sing e all sh • information lie asked for would be found in the Estintatts already laid ou the table. • Lur.l Nuorwr'sinotion a ;reed to. JUVENILE APPOINTMENTS. Lord 71111.T0n mo. ed for a ropy of thr• appointment of Master George, as Serreury to the Province of Nova Scotia ; and also that the retura snookd state the uge of the young geutlenutu at the time of his appointmeat. Mr. Ituot nu AII M allo to add to the Retort) the urn' • of the ' , eland from uhieh the yotutg g ntlemun ma. takeu.— (is 'angle.) _ - 1.141 MILTON also ino‘ed tbr the app Item nt of another :Master tieurge to the sank office, with a a atanent of his age, anti the flame of los deputy. -Ok ilei ed. sEcRET.% It Y OF THE ADMIRALTY. Mr. MET/It e, said, he had now to bring forward a gurstion of a most beritius nature, namely, to enquire into the circum smiler+s attending the itlClTibe of the solac,es of the Secretary and Under secretary to the Admirady. In bringing forward this rrestion, hr should also advert to the increase made to the salaries of the Commissioners of Cteaoms and I:seise in Scot land; and drawing the attention of the House to this subject, he truited he should not he suspected of any wish to cavil with the measures or the Noble Lord and ha COOCHIIIeII. On the contr.d y, he wished to see public serviet s rewarded, but the 0111 IS laid with Chem ; they it ere to prove that these mereases of salaties, especially tlia du S. , cretaries of the Admiralty were coasistent with ecommy and the duty they owed to the public. The Han. Biennier thin prov , edeil to ci,mment on the advance which ha l been made to the salary' of the Seerttary of the Admiralty of lut:A a yi.ar and on the . - )1 Order in Council directing that the salary should Le 1::( sale e in time of peace as in time of oar. The reason asAgned that no decrease took place in the salaries of Secretaries of other offices, and that all ought to be treated alike; this objee- Cain might easily have been obviated by allowing the reduetime in the salary of the Secretary to the Admiralty, and to extend it also to all the other pnhlie Secretarii,. The objection In ifielnality would theishave been done away.--Wee hear.)—The Hon. Gentleman concluded by moving a Resolution, declaring that the House highly approved of the Order in Council of the 15th of June 1800, but considered the suhsequent order of the 23.1 olJune, Islls, as a misapplication °like public money. lord CASTLEREAGH world never quarrel with any gentle. man for putting yeestions regularly, especially when, as the Hon. Member said in this ease, the ones prohandi laid on Minis ters. lie also agreed with the Hon. Member, that this was a very important question, as related to the general question of econoiny, aid eli increase upon the particular office was but small. He could tin:refine, at present, give. the House but a very imperfect outline of what had been dune, what was doing, anti what was intended to be dime. The current details wreak/ be laid before the House in a few drys. lie wools' now state, roughly, that the reduction in the War-Oftiee world he about 10001. In the War Department there would also be a very considerable deduction --seven clerks and one under secretary. In the Paymaster-General's office, the establishmenta abroad would be reduced .;1,0001. a year; and a further saving of 70001. was contemplated, and a reduction of II clerks would make a whole saving of 11,0001. In the Civil branch of tie Con 111 l is:ariat there would he a reduction of upwards of 12:40001. In Hu . Storekeeper's Office a reduction of 60001 had already taken place; and a further reduction of 3,tuoi. was is contemplation. In the Barrack Departuumt, a saving of 71901. bad already been adopted, and other reductions were determined on. In the Admiralty, the salaries hail been re• deuced 501101. and a farther reduction of 20001. would immediate ly take place. In the Navy Department, 5000 persons bad been diseinulred, and a saving of 102,0001. introduced. In the the N'ictuallifig-Office, a reduction of 25,0001. had been made, and a saving of 25,0001. inure hail been marked out. The. Transport E.itablislainent would be almost entirely reduced. The Ordnance, and some other offices, were not ite this slate meat; but the rough statement lie had just made prothes'ed a total saving of 371 ; 0001.; a further saving upon these offices of til,oool. %sus contemplated, making in all 650,0001. indepen dent of those offices not included in the returns. lie trusted this statement %%meld proie. tuat his Majesty's Government were not entirely occupied in increasing salaries —' llear , heir, heuro—With respect to the increase of saki es given to the Co 11111 l iNsioners of Excise, it dui not originate now; but was agitated in 1896. when a genelen e h on the other aide of the Douse were ill suffice. The then uotrin l iss l oners made an ap plication tier ate increase of salary, which was slot Ihcn complied with. renewed their application to air. Perceval, earl that gantleman, whilst he o ithiaeld an immediate increase, held out hopes, ultnost amounting to a proud-e. that with the re• turn ut peace, the advance should be made. The duties of these gentlemen were weighty; they collected opt% it rd. ut 4* millions of revenue, and the sum collected by the commission • ers of I'Vi‘r bad increased gl millions since any advance had been made to their salaries. This had greatly increased their boom's, and upon the grounds of increased labour it was that his Majesty's Government haul acceded to a Chilli long since made and well reeeiv ed. With respect to the neat question, he was of opinion the Hun. Member had nut adopted a riOtt course ; in his opinion the proper course to have pursued would have been to object to the vete when the Navy Estimates cam e before the House; and then, if it should appeiar that the pro- Posed vote of salary was too much, to reduce it. With respect to the advance, lie found himself bound to say, that no appliea• tion whatever was 'natio by hi. Hon. Friend (Mr. Croker) on the subject : on the contrary, he, as far as his own individual , voice went, objected to it, as thinking it :night call for personal observations on himself; the fact was, that the adv mire was mate by the advice ut the first Lord of the Treasure, the first Lord of the Admiralty, and the Chancellor of the Exchequer, who, after doe ronsideration, determined tint in every view of jos- tiee the advance 1/11L:11, to be made. The offiee . 4 Secretary to the Admit ally was one of thy most important in the State— one of great labour, and by no means less so in peace than is war; and he must main !Treat, that, as far as his Hon. Friend was concerned, the subject was fully open to discussion, as be had taken no sn p whatever to obtain any addition to his ..4141 . The Noble Lord, therefore, concluded by Moving as au amend ment, that the ether Orders of the Dim be now read. Mr. IL MAR nu was out at all satisfied with the csplanation of the Noble Lord, and trust. d the House would not be turned aside tioui entertaining the motion by the speech they had just heard. Mr, ROBINSON tlefenil , 4l the mea.nre. ft raiiiht indeed he said that this salary of •Inaol. a year W:t% too min It at any time but as the Julies of this office were equally efficient in time of peace as in time of war, he could see 110 reason why a dart rear° I shintlil be matte, or that the salary should be amok more at one time than at :mother. Mr. !Stew:Gili3l said, the Noble Lord had desired, on a for. tiler night, that the House WuOil wait till be coalel leave an op portunity of e‘plaiiiing this circumstance, and till he comet • enter on Ili i deltii.te. 'floe Noble Lord had said, his statement of retrencliment was only a rreigti sk cult : he; waniel t 0:, there titre. criticise it closely; but he elitist advert tee the hist article hi the Noble Lord s list of retrenchment. Tiis wit the War Office, an office erected life the purposes of wit unls, and which, t h ere f ore, h e (Mr. B.) hail expected to hear it was v..- tirely dour away. The Noble Lord, to his great 111.0101)011a 'toga, stated, that a reducti en of *teen 41A:sand oar meter a i ,r,— lary hid taki: ti place. So much for retretivioni•nt in that wows ter. Hid there was one article of retrenclime•nt to a hicli t c Noble Lord had adverted in lofty terms, and that wets the Ail minilty and Navy. Here the Noble Lord said. a redue•tion lit upwards or .inou Offieers had token place, and a •,i‘ dig had been made of near 100,0001. 'flns indeed looked like it.iiiess ; and he I 11. i was most highly gratified to he at so much had i hcen done; but opon enquiry how did the fact titer out i• Whes th at u pwards u1 . .50110 of these officers were poor artifieeni, aha had for their labours in the Dock•vards received Is, or led. ;I L (Inv. This was a mockery. The lion. Member then ails erteal to the reduction of the Censinissariat, and coatenidti., di 1 it was still more trilling than that its the N svy Departmeot. 'flee Hon. Gout. said, he begged now to be u:idorstosall us ii.ca. i .g nothing of pi rsonal ilisnspeet either to Mr. Croker or to sir. Barrow ; but he most say, that dins taking money I.llt of ti le pockets of the !oxidic to put illtJ their,, wan ao less than a gees, scandalous, and profligate job. Mr. l's:Ei. said, it w is with a feeling of indignation that he ha d h ear d the iiiifieuileird :111111111iWit iiiipnl - .vitals of t he Hon. Gentleman between the increase of salary now proposed and other circumstances unconnected with the subject. It w ~t ; anfiir to represi nt this us a scand a l ous job. He rontende I t h at this w..s a question of principle, whether the salaries of Civil Officers should be less in time of peace than in thus of war.