The National Register. — London, England, 1809-04-23 00:00:00

APRIL 25.- Lord Liverpool, in replying, used malty .of theaegutueitsttl iready 'so - familiar to those who have heard the grounds upon. which his Majesty's Ministers defend their measures with regard to Spain. With respect to the intimation of blame to their conduct in not waiting, On. result of the enthusiasm of the Spa- , nish people, excited by the aggressions of the enemy, he said that, if thdt. enthusiasm had been suffered, even it' it was hot artial, to experience the tardy support of England, his Ma jesty's Ministers would indeed have deserved the reprobation of every man in the country. The Noble lord having, in a most eloquent and luminous speech, combated all the points of Lord Grey" motion, and contrasted the documents ith his assertions, made a powerful appeal to the Sense Of the House, and augured from their decision a complete exculpation of his Majesty's Go vernment from any share °filial blame so directly imputed to their conduct with - respect to Spanish affairs. Lord Moira took an extended view of the campaign from its origin, and contended that Ministers had acted without any fixed plan, and witlniut cooeert with Spain. Vie). had neglect el the proper moment of sending troops to Spain, and when they did snd them, had established no plan of operations with the Spanish armies, Ministers ought to have calculated when it was likely that additional French (loops would join thorn! in the Ebru. The direct course certainly would have been to have sent our troops there. The difficulty our troops experienced in effecting their junction, might have been seen, and ought to have been prevented. The Noble .Secretary had talked much of the energy of the Spaniards, but that General who had been on the spot, and who laboured under so many difficulties from this very cause, had stated their disunion and general want of attachment to the cause. Mr. Frere was not the person who ought to have been sent - to Spain, considering w hat had taken place before•with respect to that Gentleman in that ccaintry. Lord Sidomoth could not kelp saying, that, in his mind, the arguments 'of the Noble Earl who introduced this motion had the decided preponderance. The Noble Lord then proceed ed to make some observations on the letters from Mr. Frere to Sir.J. Moore, stating it as his opinion from these letters, that whatever might be the zeal of Mr. Frere, he ought to be recalled from the situation which he now theld, particularly 83 his in terefertoce was in'part to be ascribed the painful disasters which our arony..had experienced. The !louse then divided on Earl Orey's motiap. The numbers were-r Non-contents present, 33. Proxie, 62. I Contents pre sent, 50. •Proxies, 42. I Majority ,for Ministers present, 33. Proxies, 20. Adjoitrotpdat Seven o'Clock in the Morning, , 11 1 1 ' HOUSE OF CQ.NO:IONS. "1 • —"r1910!Ilor- • Mondaiy, 4pril The Mill fVt.r building a Bridge across the Thttices front 111? Savoy to thlL'oftpo;ite shore, was read a second litne k ria4 order= ed to he' committed. ABUSES OF tATRAIIMAGE. Lord Fo t.ttv - roN r said, he ishould trouble the litatti very, hviea befire he submitted his motion for their consideration. I-4n ninny fahtises" no ways connected with railitaryinttronage, abuses extending t 4 the church and all the departments of the t.tate, had been disclose() in tile minutes of evidenceliid before the House on the charges against his Royal Highness the Duke of York, that he thought it impossible for the House not to gO into some Ptirther. inquiry, and to endeavour to 'nice how much farther those` abtises extended, as well with a view to punish those who were the anchors of them, as to prevent a recurrence of them in future. The abuses in the patronage of the East India Comp :ply, which had been so recently Iliade public, af forded a strong ground for suspicion that there- existed many other corrupt and criminal transactions of a t;milar nature, which it was the duty of the Mouse to inquire itao, in order that they might adopt proper measures to put a stop to them for the future. He concluded with moving; That a Seleg Com mittee he appointed to inquire into corrupt practices and abuses With regard Wieners of Service for raising men, and in the dis posal of C issions in the Army ; and also to -inquire into corrupt practices and abuses with regard to the disposal of Of fixes in the State, nud to report the sane to the House, from time to time, ai ibex may think proper." The Crt.t!vcEt t.OR of the EXCACQUER said, he felt himself obliged to, oppose the mot ioa,, because he conceived it unneces sary. lie was not. prepared to say that some abuses did not exist, but its , his judipsent s l i ke.eXideleC pfa which thowitibpeS THE gATIONAL REGISTER. 4 1Z coutd che proved did not rest on sttelei , ..nt ground t., lea'' I.) Il i • punishment nfinir presto's who reany !rid the dispo-al of otra 0-. The Right Hun. Cienticroatt said, Gentlemen might lati:,;it, but he considered the subject in t- set ioi-s a point of view to partake of their merriment. lie conceived it poi rly inadvisable and inexpedient, at a moment like the rreent, to set on foot no inquiry so indefinite in its object as that proposed by the Noble Lord. The motion of the N Lord v.oulit not lead to the conviction of any offender whom the Ifooie would feel itsc' f caltt i upon to punish. It would be :i deviatitot from the ordinary course of Parliamentary pr.r-eedings, be cause there n;.s nothing speci•c in its object ; ntld 1101)41)11e advantage could be expectedliorn it, but touch public inconve nience would arise out of it. Lord Anu ittuALu llAttlvros • supported the motion. Lord FOLKCiTONE said, he could not permit the arguments of the Chancellor of the' Excheqeuer to pass without oue or two ob;ervations. If the Right lion. Gentinnan %I - a , : of opinioa that abuses did not exist, he should support his motion for the appointment of a Committee, bec;:use, if they Jo not, it wt old relieve the public mind, who thick other.% ise, and prove 074 they do not ; and if it wt.:l.!! proved that they do exist. k would relieve the public mio 4 to se- that steps were taken Se punish Or offenders. The Noble Lord coiwialed with observing, h:tt if or thing could raise the mind to a dangerous ferment, it woulA be tle opposition of the Chancelltr; of the Exchequer to ids pr 'position, w ho was hiatself . the friend and associate of the perst suspected, and, in his beli..f guilty of .gross maker ntions and corruptions in their public employments. Lord irEN Ft Y PETTY differed front the Chancellor of the Exchequer as to his view of the subject, hut could not support the motion of the Noble Lord, unless there was some more soeciti , Ernund wade nut than he hal allekr,eil. He con:[ lered motion as 100 general, and that 03 COMM . !. tee shou'd be et:-• trusted- with such large powers. He would ieel disposed to stip port the Noble Lord on any motion for an enquiry, which w;.s rounded on any special allegation, and particularly so in the present state of the public mind., when he thought something ought to be done to satisfy the public. But he was an enemy to ,general inquiries, because he never knew an instance where they produced any practical benefits. Mr. WitiTnntan believed the general feeling out of doors was, that if such a Committee were appointed. a vast va riety of corrupt practices would be brought to light. The Bill introduced by the Right Honourable Gentleman he thought not likely to meet all these abuses that were in existence. ant therefore there was a necessity for further inquiry. If the' delinquents could not be punished by-law, let them be punish ed as others had been, by the contempt and execration of their country, (Hear, hear ! ) lie coneeiveti it peculiarly proper, while fhe public mind was in such a stare of aOtation a- it was in at present, to apprdnt a Committee of twent -one pet WM, with such powers as the Noble Lord had proposed. Utley e ould not be accusers, but would have to lay before the Hawse suet material* as came before them, upon which the House woul I afterwards have to form a ,indgineet. The Hoe. Me.i,!)er con cluded.w ith expreosing his hearty concurrence in the Motion of the Noble Lord. Mr. Secretary CANNING thought it impolitic in Any state of. the public mind to excite in it expectations, let .the consequence be what it may, where there was no prospect of their being realized. Indeed, it would he impossible for him consistently with what he felt to he his duty, and the duty of every man who valued the form of the kovernment of this country as it now stood. not to give this Motion his desidcd negative. In opposing it, he felt it necessary, however, to state, that he was not opposing specific i. quiry into spe cific abuse, but that it was the specific moti,,a before them which he deprecated. Ills opposition to the one, did INA imply objection to the other. Ili, Right llooourable Friend was represented (hut he was sure it was unintentional) to have , thrown something like a screen over particular abuses, by apply ing a remedy in a legislative form to certain illegal and corrupt practices that had been proved to exit. There were remedies able and sufficient to check the progress of abuses, when they are under the consideration of Parliament consequently he did not conceive it to be the duty of the House to apply new remedies, if old ones were able to remove the evils of which the Noble Lord complained. Was it to the discussion of the whole syStem of the constitution—the conduct of the men w • • bad filled the administration of Government for the last centui., , and the measures which characterised their career—that he ' v%ould direct the attention of this; Committee ? imputations I