The National Register. — London, England, 1822-06-17 00:00:00

Chancellor of the Exchequer would give up the whole of the tax. Mr. D. GILBERT said the question concerned the whole kingdom, not Cornwall alone. Peeling grateful for the e.oncea' Mons made by the Chancellor of the Laclimper—perhaps he hail made concessiatia ample e iimigh—(cries of no, no) —he was ceece.m.al th.tt this c0ne...06011 was left so he-m.1.'11,1e. He Is melted that the Chance Iler of the Exchequer bad . left cause of complaint in this inalance.—Judging float the qeontities cured in Cornwall, the proposed urnlihctttimt would &mule:, as a tax, to 40,0001. in that county alone. He trusted that the Chancellor of the Exchequer would propose the reduction of the 2s. as it would be most useful; but if the proposition did not come from that quarter—if it came from any other member, he abould resist the reduction. Mr. TRAMAYN E was persuaded that the 2s. duty would be most injurious to the trade, and he saw no way out of the difficulty, but by abandoning such remainder of the tax. Sir M. W. RIDLEY said, that the partial repeal would effect more injury than relief. He also spoke of the injurious tendency of the proposed regulations regarding glass bottle ma nufacturers. He trusted they too would not be persevered in. Sir 11. VIVIAN was persuaded that the Chancellor of the Exchequer was not aware of the vast extent of mischief that would result 'rout continuing a part of the tax. He hoped it would be given up altogether. Mr.bRIGH'S also spoke against the partial repeal of the salt tax. lie contended that here they had an instance of the thoughtless mode of taking of the taxes. It wee removing the burden from some, and planing it on the shouldere of others. Lord A. HAMILTON should reserve himself till theßill was introduced ; hut he was surprised that, proceeding on the articles of (titian, Scotland was not to be exempted from the 2s. tax. He was for the abandonment of the whole tax. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, that pro ceeding on the act of union, it was his intention that Scotch salt should be exempt from duty. AN ith respect to Ireland, he should propose ruuditirctions; 2s. on white salt, and Is. 6d. on rock. He was not disposed to remit—but still he thought the regulations were susceptible of some alleviations. Mr. CALCRAFT observed that the right lion, gent. hail not involved himself in difficulties from a hasty reductian of taxes, but from the hasty imposition of a new salt tax on helpful.— The retention of a pnrtial tax was surrounded with dillicultiec. AS to the boon to Scotland, it was good as far as it went ; but the Scotch liaheries used British salt. It would be better at mice to give up the paltry remnant of the tax. Mr. HUME likewise spoke against retaining the 2s. tax, and said another class, besides those already mentioned, would be injured by it, namely, the bleachers. Mr. WODEIIOtSE condemned the continuation of the tax. Sir J. NEWPORT said, the tax an proposed to be contiuued would be very serious in its operation in Ireland. Mr. CAR l'W RIGHT thought such was the sensation of the country, that it would be better to repeal the tax altogether ; to be enabled to do this, it would be better to suspend the inten tion of repealing bail the leather tax, which be understood would make no changes in the price of leather. Mr. W. Smith, Mr. H. Hutchinson, Sir I. Coffin, and Mr. Curwen, also spoke in favour of the whole repeal. Mr. T. WILSON said, he was not prepared to support the whole repeal, except they would show how the deciency wan to be replaced. He was not for repealing taxes, except it was proved bow they could be replaced. Mr. LEICESTER supported the total rare'. Mr. V. FITZGERALD trusted that Ireland would not he burdened with this tax, for it would be the greatest injury to her sinking trade. Sir H. FERGUSON spoke of the small amount of the salt duty collected from the Scotch fisheries. It was about 14,0001. it did not pay the officers.—Petition brought up anti reed. Mr. G. !SENN El' moved, that the Alehouse Isieensiii,g Bill be recommitted, and that all who attend the committee base •Jices.—Agreed to. Petitions against the remaining salt tax were presented from Great Yarmouth, Arbroath, &c. Mr. MANNING presented a petition from the Corporation of Bridetvell, proving to he heard by counsel against the Prisons Laws' Consoliiintiou Bill.—Ordered to lie on the table. Ald. BRIDGES presented a petition from watch end clock makers te;:ainst the warehousing bill, which the petition strongly condemned as a most ruinous measure. Alderman tVOLID also supported the petition. The peti ti.mers had already experienced great distress ; they bad been rut out from the foreign trade, and this bill went to destroy the home trade. This petition came from Middlesex. Mr. Wi ALI. kCE said, when the 11;11 came forward, he should be prepared to defend it ; now. he thought, was not the proper time to detain the House.---Petition ordered to be printed. Mr. BIRCH presented a petition from Nottiugliatn, com plaining of 'iamb suctions. Mr. W ESTER . rose to bring forward his motion on the subject of the currency. He saw what calamitous results had fitllowed the bill changing the currency, and he could not neg lect bin duty lan far as not to bring the subject before the House. He did not intend, in his complaint's, to arraign the government ; his hon. friends hail supported, if not originated it ; but as there was no infallibility, the ablest men 'night at times commit eggre.zious errors. There never was a snore ca lamitous measure. Statesmen bad never committed a greater error. All the dilliculties of the country resulted from that fatal measure. There were permement evils, such as the poor rates and laws, but they had continued for years. The country had thriven and prospered under them, amid would have pros pered yet but for such bill. It operated injuriously on all classes—the manufacturer and tl•e agriculturist—on all except the fundholder and the ',tibiae. annuitant ; sad if this were true, was he not right in eallitet diet act a most calnanitous meaure ? It affected the industry of the country, anal it was calculated to endanger property. It operated injuriously on all chases of the community; the industry of all was affected by it. If that diminished the currency one half, his income, that had been 6001. was reduced to 2501.; but if the value of the currency was raised one half, the operatiou was in a contrary direction. —From such operation the country had suffered ; all contracts bud been ruinously greeted by the Bill. The raising of the value of money, different from the lowering of ►he %slue of money, was of most destructive operation. He did not :.ay that the ruin was limited to the agriculturist;—it eqoally affected the trader and the merchant ; it lowered the pri •e of stock.-- When the means of raising money were thereby reduced, he could ■ut fulfil the contracts entered into under a different state of the currency ; and to raise th a value of the currency, was to advance all the burdens of the country above all the lase•. He was astonished that this eubjert had been viewed so Mail fcrently. It appeared as if an aivance of 10, Li, or 20 pm cent. of our unparalleled taxation Mere as nothing. The Mi meos,. addition to the public burtiene ought to have been first considered ; but such considerations were neglected, end the fatal bill wits passed. The hon. gent. concluded by moving for the anointment ore committee to enquire into the effect which the act of 1819, for the resumption of eash pay meats be tthe THE NATIONAL ItEGISTER Bank, produced on the manufacturing and commercial iiiiereari of the country. Mr. HICSKISSON replied, at considerably leoVh, to the ar guments of the Member for Essex, which he said were founded on • false theory. That hon. gentleman had argued, that high prices wiro a proof of the prosperity or the country, and that times of fan:: in were those of tortimitil happiness. He denied sicsh a position, and particularly cited the state of the comitry iu 181;:., whet wheat was at the moderato pike of 12.35. a quiatt r, Willis the poor could not get bread, and when all our manufacturing districts were in a state of codosiou, and almost of rebellion ; yet according to the lion. member's opinion and doctrine, this was the moment of highest prosperity for the country, because corn was at the enormous mice of 12.55. a quarter. He condemned the hon. gentleman's proposition altogether, and moved, as an amendment, t' That this house w ill not alter the ►tandard of gold or silver iu fineness, weight, or denomination. Lord A. HAMILTON was not sanguine as to the adoption of any remedy ; still the pressure of the evil was so great, that lie was willing to take every chance ; and he should therefore support the motion of the honourable member for Essex. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY rose amid loud cries of tt Adjourn." If the house was disposed to adjourn (the noble lord said) it would be better to adjourn at once ; at the same time be could have thought it expedient to get throuo the debate if possible, as there might be mischief in allowing it to be supposed even for an hour, that there was ant probability of the motion bring carried. The noble Marquis concluded by declsring that lie saw no cause whatever made out for going into the proposed examination. (Cries of •' Go on, go on.') Mr. BROUGHAM felt with the noble lord as to the expedi ency of concluding the debate, but doubted bow far such a course was practicable under the amendment moved by the right hon. gentleman (Mr. Huskisson.) If the riklit lion. gentleman would witlid ttaw that admendinent. lie (Mr. Brougham) should, at the hazard of sitting thoneiliing later than usual (and the house seemed very squeamish now about sitting a little longer than usual), be inclined to conclude the debate without adjourn. ment ; if nut he thought it would be better to adjourn. Mr. H. G. BEN ETT suggested that the question should he adjourned to Wednesday. Mr. BROUGHAM said. that lie motion of Sir T. Lethbridge on the subject of taxation, would interfere. After some remarks from Lord Londondery, Sir T.Letlibridge and the Attorney-General, the adjourment or Mr. Westeru s motion to Wednesday was agreed to.—Adjourned. WEDNESDAY, JUNF. 12. . Mr. NOLAN postponed till the 27tb inst. his motion for leave to bring in a bill to amend the poor laws. Should lie succeed in his motion, he should not press the bill forward this session, hut should suffer it to continue before the House and the country for consider:Aion. Mr. CALVERT moved for •arious returns of tobacco that had paid duty, and what had been seized, since 1b09. Ordered Mr. GRENFELL gave notice, that when the Naval and Mi litary Bill was brought forward, lie should oppose that clause which proposed to give remuneration to the BAIA for their trouble. The remuneration was to be 30JI. on each, 1,000,0001. The report of the Assessed Taxes Bill was presented. Sir J. NEWPORT obtained leave to bring in a Bill on the subject of the Grand Jury Presentments. Mr. R. MARTIN obtained leave to bring in a bill to regu late the office of coroner of Ireland. Mr. COKE presented a petition from 1111 stead, Norfolk, complaining of agricultural distress, and praying for reform. Mr. T. F. BUXTON withdrew his !nutlet' respecting the capture of the Regain by Mr. Ogilvie. NORTHAM PTO% COUNTY PETITIO't. —Lord ALTHORP pre sented a petition from the County of Northluipton, complaining of agricultural distress ; of the pressure of taxation ; and play ing fur a reform. 'Flue petition had been agreed to at a county meeting, which, however, the Sheriff reiused to call.. lle agreed in the allegations of the petition. The ministers, aithough they reduced some of the taxes, stil kit such rem. nants,,as would require the retention of officers for the patronage. Mr. CA RTW RIGHT said lie should be against the reduction of taxes, except the reductions could be effected with national safety. Those that had been reduced, he questioned much whether they would relieve agriculture. As to the conduct of the Sheriff, though the requisition was signed by 300 or 400 freeholders, there were none of the " gentlemen" of the county amongst the requisitionists. Sir J. NEWPORT expressed his regret to bear such lan guage. Here were 400 freeholders, who had the right of re. turning members, but had not the right, it appeared, of calling a county meeting. Was that correct Mr. COK E said, it was such country " gentlemen" as the one opposite, that led the country into its present difficulties ; those" gentlemen" had supported the just and necessary war;" end what they now suffered they merited. As to the 100 flee holders, he hoped they would not forget what had been uttered aid that they would endeavour to be more hot.ourably and in di pendently represented. Mr. CARTA% 1111aur declared that lie had supported the ministers conscientiously, and that he thought the country had been saved by their condnet. He cousitlered himself as ho nourable and independent as the member opposite. Mr. LEICESTER condemned the conjuct of the Slieriff.— Petition rend and ordered to he printed. TOBACCO TRADE. —Lord BELCR.'IVE, in presenting ape titian hem tobacco merchants of Chester. praying for the re duction of the duty, observed on the injuries that were sustained by the revenue in consequence of smuggling. According to his calculation the Chancellor of the Exchequer had lost ..:J,Odul. a year. Mr. H. GUR NEY supported the prayer of the petition. Mr. LUSHINGTON said, in rontradiclion to what had been stated, that within the last year the smuggling of tobacco had diminished, and the duty on it increased. Sir J. NEWPORT replied, that he should like to bare the accounts. . _„..._..... The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER was persuaded that the smuggling trade was not so prosperous as it had been. The duly on sonic articles might be lowered, perhaps with ad santage to the rev eclat. ; but he did not think that would be the case with tobaeco.—Petition brought up, read, and ordered to be printed. The second report of the Holyhead Roads Committee was presented, and ordered to he plink (I. The Land Res enne Hill (Ireland) was read a second time. The cnnw•ittee on the Irish Constables Bill was 11.44101110 till the 21st inst. Sir J. N EW PORT moved the 2.1 reading of the payment of Rents, Ireland, Rill. He wished the bil to stand ot er to be considered. It was a hill entirely prospeciii e. It was never meant to apply to e•isting eontructs.—lt was agreed to be read a second time this day three mouths. Mr. C. H EN N ET moved that the order of the day be read for the resumption of the debate on cash paylill,oll.—Agreeil to.— The motion tad atneudmeut ha% ing hem read by the Speaker, 187 Mr. G. BENNET rose, and nest moved that the resolativiaa of May It 1811,, be read. Tney uachired a one pound note and a shilblig to he equal to • games. Hating been read, he proceeded to speak in suppoit of the motion a; the boil. mem ber fur Essex (Mr. Western). It was a qJestitni of great ini pormee, and he approached it vita reluctance. Had lie ep pruced of the bill originally. sitting •-lat di:elite/1 res.ets had fellowed its enactments, b_ should not hare shrunk from tuatifu.iy coining firmssid and avowing what was 11.1 m tits ease. lie declared flirt they ought now to appoint a committee to in. quire into the operation of the act. The mutiou had here ably brought Lrward, and he was astonished how the noble lord and the righ. lion, gent. could patiently keep their state and hear the smtramesits of calamities that had bcen brought far ward. But all these difficulties resulted from those fatal mea sures which began with putting of the put.dic creditor, Weil proceeded with chenting the public debtor. To accomplish each things—to pass such a bill as was now complained of was reserved for lain Maj esty's ministers. What was the site alien of persona who b ad ' entered into contracts sieve 1813? It was ruinous in the extreme. The contracts were now is fact neatly doubled. He was for the committee, to see whe ther something like a balance could not be struck, to soh* contracts nearer what they were intended to b. whoa catered into. It was said that the parties entered into the emstriste with the knowledge of the change that bad takes place.—Sinai might feel persuaded of it, but the public knew nothing shoat the matter, for the Chancellor of the Exchequer aid the Holum had declared that there was no depreciation.—(Hear, boar.) — The ministers' n unes, who had passed such measures. ought to be as familiar to men's minds as " household words." Mr. GURNEY spoke against the motion and the atsisedment. Mr. RICARDO trusted that no step would be adopted to affect the existing law regarding cash payments. lie admitted that great difficulties had resulted from the efforts to cetera to sound principles of currency ; and he was not sorry that they lied arisen; they would prevent that MAN from again so seriously effecting the currency. The hill of 1819 ought to be supported. Sir F. BURDETT said the present motion was calculated to he most useful. The debate must be beneficial, and he thought it was impossible for the House to separate without doing something to rescue the country from its difficulties. Many of the taxes, and a great proportion of the debt bad arisen under a depreciated currency ; and yet all those contracts were to be fulfilled wit. the altered currencv. As such was the case. where was the wonder that difficulties amongst all the produc tive c asses should have arisen? The hon. hart. contended the proposit..in of his hon. friend was most correct. lie had made gold, corn, and labour his measure, and he knew of no other measure which could he adopted. As to the question being one of difficulty. lie awficowledged it was so, but ministers, by their conduct, bad got the country into difficulties, and they were bound to find a mode of relief. Mr. ATM 001) ettributed ail the calamities of the country to the misconduct and errors of government. He agreed with his lion. fri..nd as to the necessity of inquiry, and therefore, if on no other ground, he should support the motion. As to the cmendinent proposed by tine right lion. gentleman, he must op pose it, as it went to commit and pledge the Noose to a certain extent against any future consideration of the subject. The bon. member entered at lenkth into a review of the subject, pointing out the evils arising from Mr. Peel's bill, and coo eluded by forcibly urging the adoption of Mr. Western's motion. Mr. Peel and the Marquis of Londonderry opposed the mo tion, and after Mr. Brougham had apoken at great length and in support of it, Mr. WES TERN rose amid cries of " question," and replied Shortly. The galleiy was then cleared for ad' 'on, when there ap peared for time atimendiueut 19$--Against it 39—Majority 164. The House then adjourned at a quarter past three o'clock. 38ensosit. JUstir. 13. CHETWYND mooed, that the Lords' Amendment to the Vagrant Laws' Hill, the principle of which Tent to confine the operation of the Bill to England, be agreed to. They were read nn.l r,:reed to. Sir E. KNATCHBULL presented two petitions from the hop-growers of Kent • ainst any alteration of the Zi-ith Geo. 3, respecting the marking of hop sacks, pockets, &c. After sonic remarks from Mr. Imshington, Mr. Caloraft, and Mr. Motuck, who spoke against the rennired change of the act; and Mr. Curteis, who ►aid the change was called for, as the art lied been founded of misrepresentations, and that dosser. hops were superior to those of licut, the petitions were read and ordered to he printed. Mr. CUR LEIS then withdrew his motion on this subject ; hot nest session li' 611011111 bring forward the whole question. Mr. ABERCROMBIE postponed, from Ihe2Uth to the 25th inst. his motion respecting government officers, as connected with the pithite press of Scotland. Sir T. LEIMBRIDGE nitildrew, for the present session. his notice IC mote resolutions respecting a- ' ricultural taxation. The further cncsideration of 11,e Stamp Duties Bill Report was postponed till Monday. The Tonnage Duties Repeal Dill went through a omninittee. litepoA to morrow. 'I he report of the Committee on the Welsh coal act was reed s agreed to, and bill ordered accordingly. Mr. HUME moved for the Expense of the Iriab Record Commission, since loth. Mr. Alderman %% OW) rose to submit his promised motioe respecting llchester jail. (Secretar3) PEEL slid the msgistrates of Somerset had appointed a Committee to enquire into the condect respeuting the jail. and the propriety of removing it ; wool.' it not there fore he injurious to press forward his moth's, oleo enquiry was taking place. Mr. Dickinson and Mr. G. Bennet also wished the motiem to be postponed for die present. Mr. Alderman WOOD said, he could have ee objection bst that of promoting complete investigslion.—Re intended to move; resolutions approving of all that the cominissionees bad stated in their report, but he should comply with the wish of the House. He should early in the next session bring forward the condos' of the utagistrates.--t Hear.) The notice of motion was then wholly sitbdrawo for the pre sent session. IHISII COSISTAIILES . BROI:GRAM asked whet would be the probable extreme of carrying, into execution the Irish Conambles . Bill? Mr. Plunkett and Mr. Goulburn replied that estimates could not be made out. FIRST FREITS, GI/ULM:RN wished the hon. Baronet l,Sir J. Newport), to put oil bs motion un this subject. Mr. HUME said, if the motion were to be postponed, be trusted that Ihe for the Boatel would nut be requiassi. Mr. GOULBURN said, if any were taken, it would only be a part. Motion potOpolled. • ( For centivesation spec pige 190.)