The National Register. — London, England, 1822-05-06 00:00:00

a war...common sense did not permit such a calculation OS that war which had recently been terminated. (Hear, hear.)—Having gone into some further details illustrative of these several points, his lordship concluded with moving a resolution embodying his plan for advancing 1,000.0001. on corn warehoused, to relieve the fannin g interests, drc. Mr. WESTERN replied to the noble lord, and blamed Lion for going into topics not connected milli the agt ietil :oral question. It was now &rpm ent that the noble loud and his colleagues saw the folly of the measure of I bit), cad wished to retrace their steps. Hr (-meted at detail into it reply to the several arguments of the noble told, and contended that the proposed plan wort ,1 not afford (chef to the country. Mr. RICARDO said, lie differed from the noble mat ( - pis on totally important points, and , as all amendment uu his tesol whin, he proposed Ihr following : " That it is expedient to provide that the foreign corn now under lentil in the United Kingdom may lie taken out for home consiimpe.ott, whenever the average mice of wheat, ascertained in the usual mode, shall exceed tiss. a quarter, mom the payment of the following duties : Wheat, I:)s. a quarter; Rye, Pease, and Brans, 9s. Gd. a quarter; Bailey, Beer, or Bigg, Ws. a quarter; Oats, Ls. a quarter. "'That whenever the average price of wheat, ascer tained in the usual mode, shall exceed 70s. a gain ter, the Italie in corn shall henceforth be permanently free, but subject to the following duties upon importation :—Of Wheat, 20s. a quarter ; Rye, Peas, and Beans, 131. 311. a quirt ter ; Barley, Beer, or Bigg, 10s. a quarter; Oats, 6s. bd. a quarter. "'That at the expiration of one year front the time at which the above ditties on corn imported shall be in 0pe .411311, they be reduced as follows:—On Wheat, Is. a quarter; Rye, Peas, and Beans, bd, a quarter; Barley, Beer, or Bice, 6d. a quarter ; Oats, 4d. a quarter. " That a like (eduction of duties be made in every subsequent year, until the duty on the importation of Wheat be 10s. a pat ter; Rye, Peas, and Beaus, Gs. 7(1. a quarter; Barley, Beer, or Bigg, 3s. a quarter ; Oats, 3s. 4d. a qr., at which rams they shall henceforth he fixed. "'lust a drawback or bounty be allowed on the export ation of corn to fineigh comories. On Wheat, 7s. a quarter; Barley, Beer, and Bags , Is. Gd. a quarter ; Oats, 9s. 44. a quarter; and that such drawback or bounty in like Initialer as the importation duty be fixed." A very long debate took place Oil these propositions, in which Mr. Biougham, Mr. linskisson, Sir R. Wilson, and the Chancellor of the Exchequer, spoke at considerable length.—lt was afterwards agreed to postpode the debate till Wednesday evening. 'flue house then resumed, the chairman reported pro gress, anti asked leave to sit again on Wednesday. The committee on the Superannuation bill was post poned tilllVednesday. other orders of the day were then disposed of, and the house adjourned at half past one. UESDAY, ♦FIIIL 30. Petitions against the leatlier idX were presented from Northumberland, Carmarthen, Bristol, Dallea%ter, Edin burgh, Liverpool, and the raw hide (leaks s of Leadeuhall market. Petitions against the Catholic claims were presented from the burgh of Stirling, the synod of Stirling, Denning (Stirlingshire), Paisley, Glasgow, the University of Ox ford, Sir 'l'. LETHBRiDGE supported the prayer of these petitions. it the motion of to-night were carried, he should consider that it would be the complete accomplish ment of the question. There would have been crowds of petitions against the motion, had not the distress of the country occupied men's minds. He, however, would warn the house against believing that the country was prepared for conceding the claim*. lie would also gnard the house against being captivated by the right hon. gentleman's (Mr. Canning's) eloquence. (Hear, and a laugh.) He was serious. He had a few nights ago been an instance of that captivation. (Laughter.) lie had intended to support a noble lord's (Lord J. Russell) motion, but when lie had heard the right hon. gent.'s speech, lie was so captivated, that he s'iandoned his original intention, and voted against the motion, (Hear, and langliter.) Hut he still ilionglit that such motion ought to base been carried —(cheers);—there ought to be ass amendment of the re presentation of the people; their prayers and complaints on this subject ought to experience consideration. ( Loud clieers.)—The hon. member then repeated his objections to the Catholic claims, Mr. SCAKLETT ob. d, that when the hon. bart. bad heard the right boil. gentleman's speech, his vote might again be calculated on as one elect of that addiess —((Near, hear.) Mr. JA NIES presented • petition from Carlisle against the criminal code, praying for its revision. Air. 'IENSYSUN postponed till .lay 43d his motion on the subject of the game laws. Mr. SYKES postponed till Thursday, May 9, his motion for the repeal of the tax on tallow. Mr. SC'AIILETT obtained leave to bring in a bill to prevent the removal of the poor. The learned gentleman salt, he should postpone all disflis•ion on the present bill till some future stage of the measure. He was prepared to titter on the discussion at any time. Mr. I'. URI:NiI:ELL wished to know whether the Hank charter would be renewed in the terms which distin guished the present inst runient ; and whether 1.0001. would be cunUnued to the Bank for " house The CHANCELI,4ICoiihe LIHE‘I UER replied, that he sow 110 reason lur altering the present wino of the charter. Mr. I'. ORENFELL gave notice, that he should oppose any extension of the charter. ander any circumstances. Mr. ELLICE asked whether it was the intention of this Government to follow the example of the United States, bud acknowledge the independence of SOSIth America? Lord LOS Dt tNI)Eltlill replied, that he was not ac quainted with what had been done by the United States. `there was already a bill before this house to regulate the Wet course of our merchants with the Antri icon Maio. As to any question of any political tendency, he lira out an) answet to give. Mr. 1101;110USE said, that he should bring forward his motion fur the repeal of the window tax Oil May 2.id. Lot d J. RUSSELL moved, that eel taint returns segat d og newspaper stamps, .x:c. previomly ordered, be made /In tow Oh. CATHOLIC PEERS. Mr. CANNING rose, porsoant to notice, to bring for ward has nod' to repeal the disabilities ar-ri n g the Koolau Catholic i'vcra. Ile was pet bumf( d of the j attics.: THE NATIONAL REGISTER and policy of this motion, though he admitted that he ap proa:hed the questiou with considerable anxiety, because, if his motion failed, he had no refuge. His present pro. position was for leave to bring in a bill to repeal the existing disabilities. It had been tnet with the statement that his proceeding was an insidious attempt to obtain an unconscious concession of the treat question. That it was a part of the questiou he admintal, hilt 111 denied that other portion. 4J Ili.- question were to tie ,iipporic.l by similar arguments. 'rile pi esent plopo•itions%,, complete in itself; it did not ievols e those considerations which affected other parts of the subject. To prevent the con sideration of the question was an attempt to check the progress of thought and the flight of time—for they were approaching the consummation of the great objects be had in siew.—(llear, hear, hear.)—The supporters at ter claims hail been chat ged with being too indefiet'tte, with soaring to the heights of general principles, but now he should apply for the repeal of a particular act. lie should limit himself honestly to the consideralion of that panticn lar act—not that lie could deny, that if hilt question were carried, there would be a dinmeition of the disabilities selecting the Roman Catholics. If he succeed. it, it was to be hoped that it would not he matter of regi et that one topic of declamation would be withdrawn, any more than it ought to be matter of regret that suer e concessions had formerly been made to the Catholics ; enabling them to hold property, commissiuna, dec. The right hon, gent then stated, that lie did not appear as the advocate of any pally; he had not been urged to this motion by Ilic per sons calculated to be interesied ; and he was glad to state that lie had this day received a letter from the Catholic Peers, setting forth such bet. All the responsibility was his own. As In the objection that it might be disrespect ful to their lordships to originate ouch a bill in the House of Commons, lie had only to say, that the act of Ilan, which lie proposed to repeal, had originated iii that house, at a time too when the oath of supremacy excluded mem bers from the Commons, and when the bitting of the Ca tholic Peers Was recognized by parliament. He contended that his scheme was not •• wild and visionary ;" he did not desire to re-construct the House of Lords ; he only wished to restore the House of Lords to its original constitution. His pi (position was not to innovate, but to restme —to give to an innocent poste' ity those rights, of which, by crutch anti unjust pretexts, they 114.1 beendeprived. (I (ear, hear.)—'!tie reform, too, was safe—for, if carried, it would add positively six peers to the 'timer house, and perhaps six Irish peers at some ftituie period. It was, therefore, not likely to be very al:envious. The right hon. gent. then took a general review of the chat deter of the laws that had been levelled against the Romeo Catho lics fium the period of the Reformation, which principle was not relaxed when William 111. Caine to the throne, because, it being the religion of the exiled Monarch, it was the best object to render the Catholics powerless.— There had become a disputed succession ; but all those rim cumstances and difficulties nu longer existed. There was now no cause for alarm—and indeed it was wonder ful, although so many laws had been pis.sed against the Catholics from the time of the Reformation, how few Anti-Celhoiic laws lemaiiitil to be repealed, except those that passed in lite reign of Chinks 11. Much had been done to redress grievances, for mail most cruel and unjust laws had been eepealed ; therefute the consideration of the restrictive laws was limited to Charles 11.1 reign ; butt, fortunately for his cause, 1111101 of the dcclaniatory portion of the case was spared him. It did not affect the limited question now before the hone. It could not be denied, as accounting for the measures of Chalks ll.'s reign, that there was in the parliament a dread of Charles 11., a thread that lie would favour measures to promote the Catholic religion, and to secure a Catholic succession. Now no such dread existed—now tinge was no reason for withholding front them whet had hero violently with drawn troun their ancestors. He therefore anticipated that his motion would experience the support of that house. (Hear, hear.) He concluded with moving for leave to bring in a bill to repeal the act of lti7B of Charles H.'s reign, depriving the Catholic peers of the right to sit in the House of Lords. Mr. A. ELLIS seconded the motion. Mr. (Secretary) PEEL opposed the motion, contending that if the hill went carried, it would Introduce greuter ano malies than at present existed. The introductiou of Scotch Peers, for instance. would be a violation of the act of union ; but if the catholic peers were admitted into the upper, what pretest would there be fur refusing to admit Catholics to be qualified to occupy seats in that House )— Aod the o•jection applied more strongly to seats in the Upper House, where ilia members had more immediately to attend to spiritual all'airs ; iu the Louver Ilituse, their at tention weir more insinediatt ly directed to tensional mat t. rs. A time nut very dis:isitt was fixed for taking the entire subject of catholic Cntaneipatiun into consideration; nod to adopt the proposition of the right lion. gent. now would be useless. since it would only give to the catholic peers the privilc;;e of sitting in Parliament during the vaca tion, when they could not exercise that privilege. As to the statements of the right lioti. gent. he contended they acre not correct; the exelusi 0000 of the Cat holie peers, from Wags in parliament, did not arise out of the duine,llC tireunistetnes det:iiled by ilic Cult him. gentleman, but out of the fact, well established, of nos existing disposition to overturn the protestant government, as was imtaiteed by the secret trent) with Louis the Fourteenth, by which taus country was to he sold fat 200,0001.; a sum not half so great as we were now in the habit of expeuiliog on an prudential y house or it Scotch canal. Lord (OW ER supported the motion. Lord N UriENT follows d on the same side, sod contended that the C4lllll.liti Mere worthy of brio.; ti toted. Mr. WARM; supported the motion. Mr. M A I(T I hi. of Galway, uas in favour of the motion. —The comfit( t of tlep,e alto now opposed the ratholics, put bun in maul ul abut hettuttlol table or the •• Wulf, nod the lamb."—•• You lawn'," said the wolf, you muddy tne ater."—.• • That is itupoattiltle." replied the. Lath, •• as the Attant runs flout you to Tueu at was ?um father. or your grandrailter, ur some of your uncestto s, you dii I) puppy ,Sll eat you.—(A laugh.) Alt. Pl. UN K Ll"f supported the motion. lie %vas reads to admit that in the ►Mika or Chalks 11. the Catholics Mere dlsallected itsuards the Throne, and it tdrunti. ay... at 111 it Bose absolutely uccessar) t hot Ito use in the piesent day could tut) them wits any diuttlection tot the pail or the cutho lics towards the cattail% (los eromeat. Mr. WET I f ULL, said, that h.-feint - ore no proirrwit ion for Con.'ef>lllll to the catholic,. had ever hcru loon hi for ward without mate colasitrshala becuitt —heir 1)10 .I•Clirit%—lap should tarrctoor ~, ~ tie bolion. M. CAN Nl:sai wt , J, he &tumid carroar of reel) 139 very brietly—son n u objection he hail to combat sight be dis. posed of in very few •ords—the bill he proposed to iotro• duce it wet salt incioached on the privileges of the other huu•e of Parliament, as it went the length of/Omitting to orals in that House individuals a lio are now earluiledlt) this he only need reply, that lite Bill he sought in repeal ori ginated in the House of Commons. The right Wu. gent. prat eeJed with great ability to answer every other argument a hie It had in ea ruist•ti against hi, mat ion, after %Inch tie dir Med, a lien the ;mullet-. ere--fur the motion, 249 ugaiieit it. 214 —majority far the motion, 3. The other ortlera at the day were disposed of, and the House adjourned at one o'clock. wEDNEsniar, NtV' I. Mr. I.I7tiIIiNGTON presented the returns innocently* of Victuallers' Licences granted and refused in districts within \liddle,ea. Mr. LA NIIITON, in presenting a petition against the Leather Tax, expressed the hope that the hon. member (Mr. Beaumont) whose motion fur the repeal of that tax stood for to night, would postpone that motion till :he plans of the noble marquis were fully k Ito A ii. He had uu indisposition to support such motion, but he thought it might for the pi esent be postponed. Mr. H. Suomi r, Sir E. Kuatclibtill and Mr. G. Bennet, expressed a similar opinion. Mr. ELLICE viewed the propositions of the noble mar quis as the virtual repeal of the financial measures pro. posed at the commencement of the session; and as they were only contiontatiolla of the joggling schemes that had heretofore been suggested, lie considered that it would be disgraceful to them as men who pretended to manage the cuticcerns of this country, to adopt what had been pin. posed by the noble lord. He however wished that this motion should lie postponed. Mr. BEAUMONT said, he should acquiesce in the %visit that had been so generally intimated, and lie there lore postponed his motion tor the repeal of the Leather Tax rill Thursday, the lath inst.—(Hear, heart ) The petition was then read ; it was from the taunt's and curriers of Deirtiam. Ordered to be piloted. Mr. 11. SUMNER, presented a petition from Guilford. complaining of the Leather Tax. Mt. SCARLET I' brought in the bill to prevent the re moval of the poor. Sir H. WILSON expressed his approbation of the bill. It was different from the lion. rucinber's former bill I it was humane ; it was calculated to he highly useful. He availed hint •elf of this opportunity to condemn some clauses of the Vagrant Laws Consolidation Bill. Mt. MANSFIELD hoped the second reading wonl,l he postponed to a distant day, to admit time fur its coeside ration. After home conversation, in which Mr. Cierwen, Mr. CAleraft, etc. took part, the bill was read a first time.— Ordered to be read a second time Monday, May 13. Mr. JAMES preheated a petition from Carlisle, praying for a speedy and effectual reform of the house. This petitioners contended that they were entitled, by the con. *minion, to have a full and free representation. Ilia the house, as at present constituted, did not meet their views of the constitution. T:rey saw the necessity of reform— for they had seen the people's liberties and the Press restricted, and they had seen an obstinate refusal of all inquiries of the wittol outrages committed at Manchester. l'hey also spoke of the dist r to w hick the country Iced been exposed, and he mainly attributed them to Mr. Peel's bill, which in fact, he contended, had denoted the weight of taxation. He (Mr. James) was persuaded that the country had no hope but &um an extensive reduction of tradition, to the amount of 25 or 30,0J0,0301.—(Hear.) He was glad some had joined him in that opinion—but be had no hope of thu requisite reductions without * re formed house. Petition ordered to be printed. Sir J. MACKIN rosH oohed whether the South American Independence had been rceuisuisen, or *lutistr iutereuerse had been warranted. Lord LONDONDERRY replied, that there had been no formal recognition; there had been a de fartoiretmaaition. as all the world knew ; but he trusted that the Governmem: worthd not be unnecessarily embarrassed nu this subject.— E'en the American Government had not recot,niised such its. dependence; a message bad only recommended it. air It. WILSON said, he saw u notice on the book for the renewal of the Alien BM ; be was astonished that such an odious and anti-European bill was to be renewed. He therefore moved fur returns of persons sent out of the country under the net. Mr. 11011110 USE said, he should oppose such bill ; wad if the noble Lord would hull coodescetsd to argue the sies lion. he should move perpetual utijournmcuts. Retains ordered. M ARTIN (of Galway) moved for leave to bring lit a bill to enable criiiiinito to hit% e counsel lii plead for theta. Mr. LOC KII A I' struntly opposed the mutioo. Leave n to bling in the hill. Sir R. SHA W postponed li:s motion fur the repeal of the Irish Window Tax to the WI cost. lie postponed thit ma lion at the reque.l of nms.sters, lit enable the °obi, lord and the Chancellor of the Evcheqiier mote fully to uufold their plaint to the House and the Coinitry.-11e, however, still tell per•uaded of the importance of hit mutiou ; and lie trusted that the `l)% n neat would not fail to consider it. The Itione having resolved int., a committee to consider a provi.ifin for the fume payments of naval, military, sad other pens' The CIIANCELLOR of the LXCIIEQU ER brought for ward his proposed plait for the ace iiiii of this object. lie concluded with moving a series of resolutions„ w lOch roe hodied Ins plan, lie entered into details to show the value and bearings of his plan, us set (milt iii thine resolutions; and stated that it was calculated that the extinction of the pemiiiiis would occupy a period of 45 years. It was calcu lated that they would gradually decrease according to a cer tain ratio t—ilsteL, after 10 years, tho-e pemions which w ere now 5,000,141)1. would he three leillions stud a half; af!er :10 sear., tau sat lliwif and a gum let ; niter 30 years, one million stud it quarter ; a ter 41) ;earl., 541,4311.; and after 45 years, SOti,t l / I .li. It was alas considered that the opera two of the proposed scheme would be a great NIS inn is. lira 1141111 C ; and that it *mild atlas most usefully disembarrass he nuance act quanta, and aus.u.ll r•ttinattes of the country.— lit COlll ills mos i lig the folio. big resolutiwna :- 14s ,Ly EU-1 —.that it is the opiuisu of this committal's that the amount of military tool smith, pensions, and civil au.d.raninia , ion-, may be em boated sit about b,000,000. ::. I oat it Is the llillllllll.l ut this canal tire, that ale sum, calculate,' as au maiiiity guaranteed by may be considered as a hut taeii, forming a charge upon the public income of the country, for the Uses of the (Per cnitiaziutithi sit page 142.)