Star. — London, England, 1803-05-25 00:00:00

. , .- L . -- - 0 -21‘ . ' . S s i r: I 4 o I I IV ' '.., i I' ' - '4 - _ , ___ f 4 ,,,, . , 4 : ... , Pi N... is , . 1 4 Pr: (I i 1 . _ NUMBER 45 0 5 ] WEDNESDAY, MAY 25, lBO3. [PRICE SIX-PENCE. l -. .e ha w If* 'I FARLMMENTARr PRoCEEDIsGS. HOUSE OF LORDS, TUESDAY, MAY 14. 1 3 Si ID• 11li; OP Several Private Bills were prefented from the Commi;ne. Some defultory converfation took place refpcciiog one or two provitions in the Militia Ad. Strangers were ordered to withdraw, and on being readmitted, Earl DARNLEY was movies, that certain Papers which had been laid before the Commons, thould be laid before their Lordihips alto. Lord AUCKLAND obferved, that the Noble Lord did not feem to be well acquainted with the forms of the Houle when be thus moved for papers en asefe--the more regular way being to move for them feparately. But, as his Majefty's Minifters did not mean to withheld any informatftin from Noble Lords, he would himfelf take the liberty of moving for the Papers alluded to, we by one, if the Noble Lord bad no objedion. Earl DARNLIT thanked the Noble Lord for having let him right In point of order, and giro for giving him an opportunity of re- Reties the fentinaents be had expreffed laft night, but which, from 'the impatience of the Houle to difpofe of the queftion before it, he apprehended were not severally known. He did with, therefore, to be underitood as having molt cordially fupported the original Addrcfs, from a convidion that it was by unanimity alone the Independence of the country could be preferved. Lord Auc AAAAA moved, that the Communications interchang ed between the Breech sad Americas lkepubiles relative to Lout- Gana be laid before their LordChtps That all Orders and Counter-orders Hiked to Governors and ttittunanders relative to the Cape of Good Hope be laid before thou; Alfo, That all Communications and Orders iffued refpeding the Blends captured daring the war in the Welt Indies be laid oa the Table That the inftrudtions given by M. Tailcyrand to M. Fanvelett at Dublin be laid before their LordihipsrOrdered. Aadjoureed. HOUSE OF COMMONS. We yelterday -explained the circumitances which prevented any account of the proceedings of Monday from being given to ;he public. We underhand that Lord Hawkeibury opened the debate in a fpeech of great preparation and confiderable ability. He con cluded with moving the following Addrefs : That an humble Addrefs be prefented to his Majefty, to return bin Majedy the Thanks of this Houfe for his moft gracious (age and for the Communication of the kweral Papers, which have been laid before them in obedience to his IViajetty's command. To alrere his Majefty of the Jed fade we entertain of his Ma jefty's an:lima and uniform endeavours to prnkrve to his people the Mew of Peace, and Of our perfect confidence In his Ma- Jay's difpolitien esteeming. the ea of war, whenever that as be accomplifhed, with the honour of his s Crown, and die interefts of his people. we have °Versed, with the ftrongeft feelings of indigna tion, that his Majefty's endeavours have been &nitrated by that reakfs fpirit of ambition and domination by which the Govern ment of Prima have been led to advance pro:canons the molt ex travagant and injurious, and to avow dedgns at once inconliftent with theebligstions of good faith, and with the effential interetts of Edda limptre, and that for there indignities and proven does his Maar Ms id vain demanded fatidadlibn and redo:ft That sashimi by thdc fentinsents, we feel that the emit repofed in us by a hews Indio/al people, requires on our part a firm de terminatiou to easeeparate with his Majeßy in calling forth the re fs:arm of the UAW Kingdom for the vigorous fupport of a caufe in which are involved the ?lenity of his Majeftea Crown, the rights and liberties a* people, and all that is dear and valuable to us as a free and independent natio°. Mr. ERSISIII made a very able fpeech; upon which Mr. Pitt rofe and delivered a very brilliant fpeech, unifying the war on the aggrelflons of France, but without defending, and indeed very little touch ing upon the condo& of Minifiers. Mr. Pitt's fpeech is allowed to have been one of the belt he ever de livered. It was in a Rile of greater moderation than had been expo red ; nor did he introduce any matter of irritation towards thofe by whom he had generally been oppofed. Mr. GAILY, in a very argumentative rpeech, ed that there was hill an opening for negotiation, and propofed as an Amendment to leave out from the firil paragraph to the end of the queftion in order to infers there words : u To affure his Majeßy of our firm determination to co-operate with his Majeßy in calling forth the refourees of the United Kingdom, for the vigorous profecution of the war in which we are involved, and to exprefs to his Majeßy the fatis fadion with which 'his faithful Commons have re ceived his Majefly's gracious declaration, that he is willing to afford, as far as may be conflftent with his own honour, and the intereß of his people, every facility to any jult arrangement by which the blef lings of Peace may be redorecrto his loyal rubjeds." Mr. Wilberforce, the Secretary at War, Lord Car tlereagh, &c. (poke, and the adjournment of the de bate was propofed by Mr. W. Smith, and at lalt agreed to. We take tip the debate, as refumed. TUESDAY, MAY 34. The Order of the Day was then moved for refum ing the debate °flail night on the Addrefs to his Ma jetty refpeding the iffue of the late negociation,and as loon as the Addrefs and the Amendment propofed thereto were read from the Chair, Mr. T. Giamatti.' role to take the fiat opportu ;thy of ex prefling his featiments on this trul y important quellion now fubmitted to the confideration of the ' Houfe. He was anxious thus early to declare his opinion, left he Mould be unable to obtain a hear ing at a later Rage of the dircui fi on. In the view which he was difpored to take of the fubjed in the fiat initance, he did not imagine there was much room for expatiating upon it, as there was in his mind one powerful and irrefiftible motive which Should fo confine the debate as not to leave any range for what was not fo clsfely conneded with the mo tion. No doubt a fubjed fo momentous, a queßion fo ext d and involved, mull embrace a great va riety olohenfible topics ; and for the convenience of debate it miht perhaps be proper to con fi ne 'it to one. But, f or his part, when he viewed the critical fituation of the country, be felt impelled by a com manding link of duty to attend to one great caufe, a caufe that hood fo eminently over all others, and fo much beyond the reach of any other conliderationi that thofe who felt as he did Inuit look upon that motive alone as of futficient weight todetermine them in the difcharge of the great and preifing duty which they now had to His Majeßy has acquaint ed the Hoare wit h that of intuits and indigni ties, and eneroaehments on the part of the French Government, which has compelled his Majeßy to en ter into a war. If there-be any Gentleman who he litotes to believe that there does not coil! a juR ground of war to provoke his Majeßy to enter again into hof tilities, they may think themfelves juftiSed in examin lag the quellion in a different point of view; but A thofe who, with him, malt difcover in the conduct of the French Government a juft caufe of war, and the unavoidable neceliity of refilling that conduit, will doubtlefs feel it their firft duty to remove from the prefent difcuflion every thing that can prevent the Houle from coming Ito a prong, unequivocal, and unanimous expreflion of their readinefs to furnith his Majefly with every poflible means of manfully fight ing that jolt caufe, and not to liften to any other to pic of ditcuflion which may (land in the way of that firft duty which the Houle is folemnly called upon to difcharge. He had been among the firft to complain that information had been withheld from the Houle refpeding the Situation of the Country : he Should now be among the firft to congratulate them on fee ing this fubjeft of complaint removed,and Parliament reftored to its juft rights, by receiving the informa tion that was now on the table. He might at firft be defirous to include in hisview all the fubjefts which that information comprehended, but he felt it fo far a tranfcendant duty firft to examine, whether there was juft caufe of war or note that he was anxious the difcuffion might be confined to that queftion only, unembarraffed by any collateral confiderations. The next point to be confidered, after eftablifhing a juft caufe and right of war againft the French Govern. ment was, whether it was expedient to profecute it ? The Declaration alerts, " that the period which has elapfed fince the conclulion of the definitive treaty has been marked with one continued feries of aggref fion, violence and infult, on the part of the French Government ; and that their proceedings appear to have been altogether incontinent with every principle of good faith, moderation and jutlice." Indeed the grounds of complaint and of war are fo numerous that the greaten difficulty attending the difcuffion of them arifes from their very abundance. Yet, numer ous as they are, and ably as they have been dinuffed, it becomes every man to State the grounds on which he revs the juftice of our caufe. For his part, he looked upon the mere aft of feuding over perfons in the apparent character ofCommercialCommillioners, who, under the mark of peace and amity, and while they claimed and enjoyed the rights of hofpitality and the regard and attentions of the country, treacher oufly converted thofe very marksof civility into means of deftroying that country from which they received them. Could any condud be more bonne and un principled, and did it not of itfelf furnifh a jun caufe of war, and Would it not in the firft inftance have been relented as Such ? cry ofbear! hear!) He did not mean at prefent to cancan the condua of Mini. (ten; on the contrary, he was Studious to abftain from mingling that fub jed with the que Ilion now more diftinftly before the Hottfe. All he elated was, that in his mind the eircum fiance be had juft touched upon was of itfelf a jolt caufe of War. On the linens of ag greffion and aggra ndizement purfued by the French Government,Would not now dilate : Though their condo& with refped to Piedmont, to Swit zerland, due. was neceffarily involved in the pre fent difiuffion. All and each of there inftances of provocation afforded a fufficient caufe of war, and the ftrongeft and moft indifputable proofs of the am bition and fpirit of aggrandifement which aduated the French Government. Much weaker grounds of complaint would in former times have round the indignation of the country, and provoked it to a war. But it will be Paid that the condua of France with refped to Holland, Piedmont, and Switzer land, Would net be regarded as a caufe of war by thofe who fupported the Treaty of Amiens. The Strength of that caufe is much weakened by refle&ing that when the Treaty of Amiens was concluded, there could be no doubt of the influence which France exerted in Holland, Switzerland, etc. and here he might be permitted to remark on the great argu ment which was urged in recommendation of that treaty, much Reefs was laid on the tone and temper difplayed by France at that period. It was obferved that a pacific difpofitiou began to arife in France, and that a fair ex Ration might be conceived that the would henceforth ceafe to porfue plans of ambition and aggrandizement. But where were the proofs of that pacific temper and difpofition which was fo con fidently to be relied upon? Were they to be found in the punfluality and fidelity with which France ob ferved canting treaties ; were they to be found in' her treatment of Holland and Switzerland ; or in her annexation of Piedmont? or rather, have not all there arguments their full original weight againft the propriety of the Treaty, and does not the whole of that part of the condud of France furniSh a Strong and irrefiftible cattle of war, filch as would have been aged upon in former times, and which he trail ed would now be manfully and fuecefsfully taken up? But, if there provocations be not amyl enough, may we not turn our attention to what has palled in Egypt ? Is not the condo& of France, in that re (pelt, a dired breach of the Trea of Amiens ? By that Treaty France has guarante ed the integrity of the Turkith dominions; and that not only with a view to Turkey Wilt; but with a view to. the future fecurity of our own pat-Moos. But on what could that fecurity be now laid to reit ? What proof had we that France had abandoned all idea of attacking Egypt, and of extending through Egypt her holtile attacks upon India ? Was the proof of that fecurity to be found in Sebaftiani's Report? Or ratber,did not that Report remove all doubt refpeding the defigns of France upon that country ? Indeed, where any doubt could remain upon that point, it were idle to attempt convidion. It was in vain to fay that Se baßiani was employed on a commercial miffion only. Did not Bonaparte, in his converfation with Lord Whitworth, repre fent and acknowledge him as fent on a military miffion t And did not his ambaffador hare defcribe him in the fame light ? Here then aga i n ai l i is another infraftion of the Treaty of Amiens. are not the fame views betrayed in his condo& to wards the (even Moods, to which Seballiani not only pmmifes the political protation of the Fir& Cooful, but Mr. Romeo 'HO holds out his protedion to the catholics, on condition that they put up their prayers for the happinefs of Bonaparte ? Does not the whole of this coodad on the part of France, with retard to Egypt, a condud avowed by the Firft donful and his ambaffador in this country, afford an unequivocal proof of the hoftile intentions of the French Govern ment, and their total difregard of their guarantee of the integrity of the Turkifh dominions ? Does it not alfo appear, that they, have fuggefted to a great nor- I them Power the probable partition of the Tutkiih empire? and is there not ample evidence to prove that in cafe of that partition, France espetts to get poffeflion of Egypt ? Indeed that is a project which (he takes no pains to conceal. Here then is a pofitive and abfolute breach of the Treaty of Amiens, which furnilhes a ftrong, and legitimate caufe of war ; and when a hoftile difpofition is thus manifefted by the French Government, are we not juftified in adopting every meafure that can tend to our fecurity With a view to the fecurity of Egypt, we fhould therefore retain Malta. But it is laid, we are bound by treaty to evacuate it. Granted that we are, if France had not violated that Treaty ; but as France has violated the Treaty, we fhould be jultified in retaking it, if we did not atually poffefs it ; and if fo, we are jullified in retaining it, although by a 'previous Treaty we had confented to evacuate it. But he fhould not here enter into the minutiz of the toth article of the trea ty of Amiens—the fame difficulties now attended the execution of it, which he had obferved and infifted upon when the Treaty was fit-ft under confideration. Indeed the very impoffibility to execute that article juftifies us in retaining the iflaud. Thus much he walled to fay oldie many inftances upon which the juftice of the war might fairly be grounded—he had now a word or two to fay refpeding its expediency. If a war is again embarked in, our fituation, it is Paid, will be dangerous, and the confequences would be injurious to our cafe and comforts. Were we not fully prepared to meet thefe privations, we thould deceive ourfelves. We have no choice left but a choice of evils. But before we change peace for war, we mould examine what we lofe—ls it peace we cx. change for war ? Surely not, but a doubtful uncer. taro truce. We facrifice nothing ufeful or valuable, but endeavour to refcue ourfelves from a fituation, fuch a fituation of fufpence, agitation, and anxiety, as the country has been condemaed to for the haft two months, a fituation involving in it all the dangers and expence of war, without any of the advantages or comforts of peace. From that fituation, if we with to extricate ourfelves, we muft now bring to the conflid every thing that heart, mind, and means can exert, and little doubt can be entertained of its fuccefs. We already may difcover the effeds of what a fpirited conduit, and a firm and refolute attitude may produce. We have teen Louifiana already given up. Will that furrender be attributed to a return of *Jake and moderation in the mind of the great con queror ? By thofe who obferve rightly, it will not — No--the real caufe of it are the preparations we are making; and inftead of its being a proof of itiftice and moderation, it is, on the contrary, an unequivocal indication of an hoftile mind—its °hied is to deprive us of the alliance of America. Now a word upon the propofed amendment.. He could not fee how it differed from the original motion, and it appeared to him that at the prefent moment there was no duty more incumbent on every man in that Houk than to endeavour to fpeak the fenfe of Parliament, and of the country, with one unanimous voice. Much was to be gained by that unanimity, add there was nothing which he would not willingly facrifice to- obtain it. As there was no real and material difference in it from the Addrefs propofed, he was fur rifed, and fineerely lamented, that it fhould be perflfted in. It could only have the effect of weakening the general declaration of what every Britifh heart thould feel on an occafion like the prefent. The country was placed in an arduous and dangerous fituation. But fuch was his confidence in the mind, heart, and fenfe of Eng liffimen, that be was fatisfied they would furnill means equal to the exigencies of the cafe, and that their caufe would ultimately triumph. If the coow try proved true to Will, and Parliament was true to the country, there could not be a doubt bat that we fhould come out of the contell glorious and fuccefsful. Mr. WHIT11111.1•D warmly fupported the amend ment of his Hon. Friend, Mr. Grey. The Hon. Gentleman who (poke laft earneftly called for unani mity. He was equally anxious for fubftantial unani. mity, and as defirous as any man that his Majefty fhould be fupported with the lives and fortunes of his fubjeds, if war was inevitable. He was ready to fa , crifice every thing but honour and confcience, and he did not fear to put it to the Hon. Gentleman who (poke laft, and to the Right Hon. Gentleman under the gallery (Mr. Pitt), whole fpeech of laft night had made fo powerful an impreffion upon the Houk, whether they imagined that they could, with a fafe confcience, give a vote of approbation to the eondud of Minifteri? It was impoffible that he could concur in fuels a vote, unlefs he were convinced that Mini. tiers were uniform in their endeavours to maintain peace ; unlefs the whole of their conduit was to be approved of, how could he approve of the propofed Addrefs? Thole who really wiffied for unanimity fhould vote for the amendment. The amendment went to pledge the lives and fortunes of every man in fupport of the caufe of the country; but it abftain ed from delivering any opinion on the cemdud of Minifters; that condo& was far from giving him fatisfatlion, and be was therefore averfe from con founding it with the prefent queftion. He was not for narrowing the view that fhould Se taken of it; nor did he conceive how it could be difcuffed ab ftradeslly from the condo& of Minifters; it was ne ceffary to confider the Reps they had taken in the courfe of the negociation in order to judge of the re fult ; nor could a jolt idea be formed of the mcafures that were now to be putfued, without a reference to the management of the negociation. In thefe obferv ations he was not satiated by any thing like party fpirit, he was anxious only to promote the real inte• Tells of the country, that anxiety was much increafed when he law the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Pitt) in his place, and when he heard him deliver that molt brilliast ipeeell, which wade to powerful as impreflion upon the Houfe. He expeaed much the opinion which that Right Hon. Gentleman wi exprefs, and deep was his regret at the view wl the Right Hon. Gentleman had taken of the fubj For if the fate of Empires might be faid to hang the lips of any one individual, it might be laid to pend on the part which the Right Hon. Gentlet has taken in the prefent quertion, a part which ft [merely regretted was ft) different from that in wl he thought himfelf jut - tined in viewing it. For part, if the country was now again involved in though much was to be expeCted from the fpirit valour of the nation, yet he could not contempt without horror the confequences that might am it. was therefore lorry indeed that the Rig Hon. Gentleman's opinion had not been in favour peace, and that his wifdom and talents were not crud to maintain it. He was not furprifed to 1 thefe who continually called for war, contend there now ezifted jolt grounds of war. Indeed t have been afferting the fame thing ever fence conclufion of the Treaty of Amiens. But thofc concluded that peace, fhould be fomcwhat more ous to maintain it. Much has been faid, as a groi of war, of the infults offered to this county; France. He could affure the Houfe, that no could be more alive than he was to any infulr could be offered to the honour of the nation, ant was ready to confefs that the French Governmei bad been rather lavifh of them ; but why did Minifters demand and obtain fatisfadtion at the t thefe indignities were put upon the country ? not have then appealed to the fpirit of the country If they wifhed for a caufe of war, why not then 1 demanded fatisfaCtion, and if it was not grant why not have proceeded to force? But alma in e , inttatce a hope was held out that the permanence peace might be relied on. In the debate, howr. on his Majefly's fpeech on the opening of Parliamet he did not derive much fatisfaaion from the opinic then expreffed by the Honourable the Chancellor the Exchequer, and at the dole of that debate preffed him in dire& terms to deliver fome opinion on the then fituation of the country. The ant was, that no danger was then apprehended for premanency of the Treaty of Amiens. Yet, at time application had been made to Minifters for fiftance, to the Swifs, and arms and money fumifhed to them, which might well be interpreted an ad of hoftiliti—but when it appeared that other Power would concur with Minifters in affifting the caufc of Switzerland, all further attempts in behalf of the Swifs were given up. The fame irrefolution and uncertainty marked the coodua of Minifters fpeding the evacuation of the Cape of Good Hi and on this fubjed no light had as yet been thro , Notwithftanding all thefe contradictory meaf hopes continued to be held out by Minifters, there was no apprehenfion that the Peace of Amiens would fo loon be broken; and there hopes the Right Hon. Gentleman (the Chancellor of the Excheque again infinuated on the loth December, in his mous flourifh on the financial profperity of the ci try ; and again, on a later occafion, when a motion was made refpeding the Eftablifhment of his Royal Highnefs the Prince of Wales—it was therefore dd. ficult to fay when a real provocation was given, recurring to hoftilities ? But, the Hon. Gentleman (11r. Grenville), afks what the country gives up going to war? He fhould only ate him in return, what were the feelings and opinion of the country when war was announced r On this point, it was hi opinion, that if every human being in the count.. were polled, it would be found that not one of then would confent to receive an infult from France, or allow it to go unpunithed ; but on the other hand, let their opinion be canvaffed on the fubjea of • conduct of Government refpeding the renewal hoftilities, and let them be allied, whether in their confcience they believe, that Minders have done their power to redrefs the infults they may have ceived, and to avert the renewal of war, their anfwet would be, they have not. The Honourable Gen. fleman then proceeded to enumerate the different grounds that were adduced to ju ft ify the war, the lending of commercial commidloners on perfidious pretences, the demand refpeding i the liberty of dr prefs, and the fending of obnoxious individuals of the country in violation of the laws of hofpitality, all of which, either fhould have been treated with (corn and contempt, or fhould have inftantly been its quired into and explained. Even the aggrandit ment of France as a ground of war, could not w be juftified by the negotiators of the Treaty of __ miens ; for at the moment that treaty was figit France enjoyed the fame power and influence in Hol. land, in Switzerland, and in Italy. that the now e joys. The German indemnities have of late been - introduced, but though the whole of that fyftem f plunder and robbery bas been to long in prepare. tion, yet Minifters never adverted to it till it accomplitbed. Surely the Houfe will gravely cons der, before they content to plungethe country ane' into a war without any fpecific objea. If the coy try is to go to war, the objea of the war film& diftindly explained, and the people fhould koi whether it was not predicable to attain that obj without going to war ? The Hon. Member here took a view of the tray of M. Sebaftiani, of the nature of hisipamphlet, a the probable objeift of his million. In this, he fa that there was nothing of new matter to prefent the Houle. conlidering it as a political anion. fi Right Hon. Gentleman oppofite him had told Houfe at the time of figning the treaty of Amiens terms, if not in words, that Egypt was well Inn to be a favourite objea with the Firft Could. A, molt alluredly, if Egypt was then well known to 7 favourite object with the Chief Confill, the laurels which the Britifh troops had gathered in that coml. try, mutt inevitably tend to inspire his military . afpiring fpirit with a ftronger &fire, and more ardent zea l for the accomplilhment of that favourite object. Malta, which was now ferionfly contended for, a particularly by the Hon• Gentleman who (pada I • i t 1 r ? I %.• front wonld which bjea. ig on to de- eman :h he which r his war, : and [plate • " ttend tight our of ea- hear that they e the who anxi- .ound y by matt r that id het meat : I not time Why ntry have nte d every ice of eller. I nava. nions or of to he inioa afwer ✓ the tthat af. were ' coed at no •ebalf utioa rs re- lawn. that miens tight leer) is 'fa. coup. otioa Loyal dif- , a, for marl tp by tll2ll. =try as his entry theta e, or sand, f the al of their ae all • re. afiret Gen. Brent • the dims f the s out w• ith la in- dite. well rot re en. been es of para. was :onfi. anew :own- Id be nnw„ rbje.ft avels and laid, nt to for a tt st Is, its :own And be %trek :atm. • and rdent bjea. and Ito 11/ • 411