Star. — London, England, 1821-04-12 00:00:00

111 ~ .4• apposed the moticas,'wonn wa ‘ts s negatived without a division. *%. "".. • PETITIOt? hOII 6 ANINItHIH ‘ SUILTICCT AT LISBON. LUSHIN9TON said, he held in his hand the yetidoit,ef 4.onsas Merritt, a British subject, who "ibinfilained"; tltai giving been resident at Lisbon, he had been brought balm the Inquisition on a false accusation of bigamy ; that his two children had been taken from him, and placed with a Roman Ca tholic Priest, the Superiot of a Portuguese Monas tery ; that his property, in value about £3OOO, had been seized ; and that the authors of these proceed ings had been assisted and countenanced therein by J. Jeffery, Esq. the British Consul at the port of Lis bon. He concluded this statement by praying for such relief as the House in its wisdom should consi der his case entitled to. The Learned Member (Dr. • Luthington) observed, that he could not make him • self responsible for the truth or accuracy of these ••facts ; bat he hoped that his Majesty's Ministers would consider k a part of their duty to institute some inquiry upon the subject.—The Petition was then brought up and read. The Hon. Mr. F. ROBINSON said, that he was as ignorant of the circumstances mentioned in this Petition as the Honourable and Learned Member could be. The only remark which occurred to him at this moment was, that it did not appear whether any representation had been made to the Secretary of State.—The Petition was then ordered to lie upon the table, and to be printed. • CRIMINAL LAWS.. Sir J. MACKINTOSH brought in the three Bills relating to the criminal Laws, for which 1)e had ob tained leave in the course of the evening. They were read a first time, and ordered to be read a second time on Friday, the 4th of May. MESSAGE IFROM THE LORDS. The Lords informed the House, that they had agreed to the Beer Duties, and several Private Bills, without any amendments. Their Lordships requested the House to permit one of their Clerks 'to attend them, with the evidence taken at its Bar of the num bers of the Electors who voted for J. Tidd, Esq. at the last Election for Grampound. They also requested the attendance of Gustavus Rochfort, Esq. a Mem ber of this House, on a Committee of Privileges now sitting upon the claims of Alexander Home, Esq. claiming to be Earl of Marchmont. The House an swered, that they acceded to their Lordships' Message. COMMISSIONERS OF SEWERS. The Order of the Day for the second reading cf , this Bill being read, Mr. DICKINSON' said he would withdraw his Bill for the present Session, and in the course of the next year he would move for a Select Committee to inquire into the state of the low lands throughout the kingdom—( Hear, hear!)—He stated, that great cla mour had been raised against this Bill, owing entirely to a misconception of its object. A conversation then ensued between Mr. JENHIN• SON, Lord G. CAVENDISH, Mr. WROTTESLEY, Sir I. COFFIN, Mr. W. WYNN, and Mr. D. GILBERT, after which the Bill was withdrawn. BANK CASH PAYMENTS. The C H ANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved that the Report of the Committee on this Bill should be taken into consideration to-morrow. Mr. GRENFELL did not rise to make any obser vations on the principle of this Bill which would lead to a discussion at the present moment. He thought, however, that it was a matter of the first importance to get a distinct answer as to whether any negocia tion had been opened between Government and the Bank of Ireland as to the renewal of their Chat ter. He hoped the Right Honourable Gentleman would give an answer now, or fix the consideration of this Report for such a day, and such a time of the day, is would afford full scope -for discussion on the sub ject. It was in 1800 that the last renewal of their Charter was made to the Bank of England; and as there were twelve years yet unexpired of it, and six teen of that of the Bank of Ireland, he thought the House ought in the meantime to consider whether k was expedient to renew either of them. At all events, it was clear, that from 1712 to 1800, there was no instance of the Bank of England applying for a renewal of its Chatter until that Charter was actu ; ally expired. If the Right Honourable Gentleman chose to be silent on the subject, he (Mr. Grenfell) could not do otherwise than think that the report was not untrue, which said that a negotiation had bdFn opened between Government and the Bank of Ireland to the effect he had mentioned. The Report was then ordered to be taken into con sideration to-morrow. BRITISH MUSEUM. Mr. LENNARD, in submitting the motion of which he bad given notice, stated, that his object was to put the House in possession of the number of persons who, in the last five years, had applied for admission to the reading-room of the British Museum without success. It appeared, indeed, by the returns lately made to the House, that the number of admis sions was exactly equal to the number of applica tions, and that the greatest inconvenience to which applicants were subjected by the present regulations was merely a postponement, as it was called. But when this postponement was continued till the person applying for admission obtained a recommendation from a Trustee, or an officer of the house, it was evi dent that it must in many cases amount to a refusal. All he thought necessary was, that the officers should ascertain that the persons applying for admission were of that respectability and station in fife, which, were they personally known to them, would procure their admission. The names of all the persons who had applied within the last fire years might easily e furnished;; and if no list had been kept of those whose applications had been postponed, as it was called, in the Returns on the table, then another mode must be taken to ascertain their numbers, and he must apply to the persons themselves to come forward. He con cluded by moving for an account of all.such appli cations for admission to the reading-room of the Bri tish Museum a's have bgen postponed, in the last five , years, on the plea that the persons applying should' be furnished with the required reference. Mr. MONCK seconded the motion. Mr. BANKES observed, that the Han. Mover complained of the discretion vested in the officers of the house being too narrow; but surely it was fitting to see that the persons applying were of that descrip tion that oughr to be admitted. He believed there WAS no instance of a proper person being refused ad- •••• •.. mission ; and therefore he hoped the Hon. Gentleman would withdraw his motion. Sir CHARLES LONG challenged the Honour able Gentleman, ' if he had any case of grievance, to state it to the ouse; but at present he could see neither the object of the motion, nor any necessity for it. He was not aware of any better rule that could be adopted, or that the Honourable Gentleman had to suggest. Mr. DICKINSON bat testimony to the facility with which proper persons obtained admission. Mr. H. GURNEY could not help adverting to the opinion which had gone abroad, that the libraries on the Continent, particularly in France, were more easy of access than that of the British Museum.— That this opinion was unfounded, would at once ap pear on adverting to the fact that the library of the British Museum was open six hours a-day, with only a vacation of three weeks in the course of the whole year ; whereas the libraries of Paris were open only four hours a-day, with a vacation of six weeks. Mr. LENNARD was not disposed to press the motion to a division. As the Right Honourable Baronet (Sir C. Long) had challenged him to pro duce a case of hardship, he would mention two out of many that had come to his knowledge. The first was the case of a Gentleman engaged in the profes sion of the law, and who had been a contributor to the Museum. This Gentleman, whose name was Jones, wrote to Mr. Planta, requesting admission to the reading-room, and was answered that a reference was required. The consequence was, that for three months Mr. Jones had been unable to obtain ad mission. The other case was that of the sons of an eminent Professor at Geneva, who wished for ad. mission to see the Manuscript of Rousseau's works, but who received the same answer, and consequently had not been able to procure admission. Mr. BANKES explained. He had made inquiries that very morning, and, to his certain knowledge, there was no such list as that , for which the Hon. Gentleman had moved. Mr. LENNA RD again explained, and expressed a hope that the ;louse would allow his motion to be withdrawn. Mr. BANKES, after‘what had taken place, de clared he must object to that allowance. Mr. DENMAN hoped, after the candid and hand some explanation of the Hon. Gentleman, that the House would skew him that courtesy which he de sired—( of " No, no"). The motion was then put, and negatived without a division. •4- - - • ~ • hen, and gambling. This he knew to be A fact—he knew the names of all the persons who frequented these , nightly meetings. The Clergyman of the Pa.: risk gave it in evidence, that he bad lost eighteen' ' guineas in one night. He really thought, that upon this statement, which he assured the House he was ready to substantiate, and even upon the allegation of the Petition alone, complaining of unexampled se verity and cruelty, he House might grant a Com mittee to investigate the matter. If these assertions turned out not to be true, the Keeper would have the benefit. He then moved, " That a Select Commit mittee be appointed to inquire, and report to this House, what has been, and at present is, the condi tion of the prisoners confined in llchester Jail ; also to examine the scite and state of the building, and re port their observations on the same to this House." Mr. F. BUXTON seconded the motion. He had been charged by Mr. Hunt with having raised the character of the jail, and he readily admitted, that he saw much in the management of the prison that merited the highest praise. If he had been mistaken he would be the first to expose those mistakes. Mr. DICKINSON would give no opposition to the motion, but from what he knew of the Jailor, he should be much surprised if any acts of cruelty should be proved against him. The irregularities in the jail had taken place without the knowledge of the Jailor, and five of the servants had in conse quence been dismissed. From the great number of prisoners sent to the jail, the accommodation was not, in all respects, so desirable as could be wished.— Every attention had been paid to the accommcdation of Mr. Hunt, and a well had been lately sunk for the use of the prisoners. The bed of the river was feet below the foundation of the jail. A female Quaker had been put in solitary confinement by her own wish. He should think a Commission would be better than a Committee. Dr. LUSHINGTON had made inquiries, and, as the result had not been satisfactory, he was in favour of further investigation. When he was last at ll chester, he had examined the Jail, and thought the mode Of employing the prisoners reflected much cre dit on the Jailor. He had heard charges of cruel treatment in the prison, and he was unable to make up his mind. He, therefore, wished for inquiry. In the Borough Compter, two women had been de tained eleven days, half-naked. That was - one of the greatest abuses he had ever heard of. When such instances had taken place, he thought inquiry indis pensably necessary. Mr. BATHURST was in favour of inquiry from the facts that had been stated, and which had not been contradicted. He thought it would be proper to iAquire into the structure of the Jail, as well as its internal management, as some improvements might be suggested. Mr. H. G. BENNETT said, that the statements formerly made by the Honourable Alderman had been flatly contradicted, but had now been fully ad mitted—(Hear, hear). He thought the House should not resign the power out of their own hands, and he hoped that a Commission would not be appointed. He happened to know something of a Commission in a similar case (Lincoln Castle). That inquiry was a perfect mockery—(Hear, heat). Sir T. LETHI3RIDGE was in favour of inquiry by a Commission. Much attention had been paid by the Magistrates to the management of this Jail. Mr. CREEVEY should vote fora Committee. A Commission was only putting patronage in the hands of the Crown. He wished to avoid giving Ministers an opportunity of creating new places; the old ones were ssufficiently expensive to the country—(Hear). Sir M. CHOLNIONDELEY said, that the Hon. Member for Shrewsbury was not justified in calling the Commission of Inquiry relative to Lincoln Castle a mockery. He would be glad to know on what grounds he made that charge? He knew one of the' Members of that Commission, who was a Magistrate, and a most honourable man. He objected to the source whence Mr. Bennett drew his information; he believed he had that information from Mr. Finnerty. Mr. G BENNETT stated, that he had no com munication with Mr. Finnerty on the subject, but he believed him to be entitled to as much personal cre dit as the Hon. Gentleman himself—(Cheers).—His opinion would have as much weight with him on the subject as that of the Hon. Gentleman, and whatever his authority was, it was equally good with his own. . Sir R. HERON confirmed the statement of Mr. Bennett as to the Lincoln Commission, and sup ported the principle of inquiry by Committee. Mr. D. BROWNE objected to the interference of that House in every babbling complaint about pri sons, and therefore he opposed the motion. Mr. FIUME said, that all had admitted that strong grounds had been laid for a Committee ;las no less than five servants had been dismissed. He would re commend the last speaker to learn the object of a motion before he opposed it—( Hear, hear). Mr. D. BROWNE, in explanation, stated, that he did not mean to discountenance the interposition of the House upon any serious and material case of op pression, but lie must oppose any attention to bab bling or trifling complaints. Mr. Alderman WOOD said, that the last speaker had been only two minutes in the House when he had given his opinion of what he could know nothing about—(Hear, hear).—He had 32 witnesses to bear out his facts. He should prefer a Committee to a Com mission; but if three Members of that House would. go as a Commission, he should agree to it readily. Mr. ROBINSON said, that for many reasons a Commission would be the preferable mode, in order to put both parties on an equal footing. Mr. Alderman WOOD observed, that he had been unable to obtain any information on the subject of the _person who had been confined at the suit of the Crown in Ilchester Jail. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, that the individual formerly alluded to had not been detained at the suit of the Crown, but of the Parish. Mr. HARBORD would protest against any paid Commissions. Mr. HUSKISSON said , the Commissioners were only paid their expenses. Mr. GOULBURN moved, as an Amendment, that a Commission should be appointed instead of a Committee, as the Member for Somerset was pre vented, by the forms of the House, from moving an Amendment. Mr. MARBORD would suggest that, in the first instance, a Committee might be appointed ; out of which, if necessary, a Commission might grow. oattwwzat UOSPITA L. Mr. HUME begged to be informed by the Right Honourable Gentleman opposite (the Chancellor of the Exchequer), whether it was the intention of his Majesty's Ministers to fill up the vacancy which had just taken place in the office of Receiver to Green wich Hospital, without previous inquiry ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER re plied, that in the occurrence of the vacancy in ques tion, he believed the appointment was in the hands of the Commissioners, but he could not, without in quiry, give any distinct answer to the Honourable Gentleman's question. Mr. HUME thought himself bound to ask this question, when he recollected that it had, on a late occasion, been admitted by Hon. Gentlemen on the other side, that there might be a better system of government adopted for that Institution. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER wished to know from the Hon. Member, whether he was willing to postpone his motion, which stood for to-morrow, for the disfranchisement of certain Offices of Government, in consequence of the total inability of a Noble Friend of his (Lord Castlereagh) to at tend the House? Mr. HUME....." When the Right Honourable Gentleman answers my question, 1 will reply to his."—(A laugh;. ILCHESTER JAIL. Mr. Alderman WOOD presented a Petition from a person of the name of Hillier, a prisoner in Ilches ter Jail, complaining of maltreatment on the part of the Governor, who had inflicted treatment of a most cruel and unwarrantable kind on him, for a trivial disorder in his conduct, arising out of a game at hus ' tle-cap.—The Petition was read, and laid on the table. Mr. Alderman WOOD then rose to prefer the mo tion of which he had given notice, for a Committee on the subject of the Petition he had just presented. He wished the House to understand, that he did not bring charges without being able to substantiate them, and that he was prepared to do so on the pre• sent occasion, by the evidence of prisoners and others from the Jail of Ilchester. He understood that no objection would be made to the appointment of a Committee of Inquiry. The objects with which this Committee would have to charge itself, according to the complaints which had come to him, were, in the first place, the construction of the Jail itself, which 1 1 was situated near a river, and in other respects so in judiciously selected, that last winter it was covered with water fourteen or fifteen inches deep, and so damp was the whole Jail, that typhus fever was very 'prevalent. With all this unhealthiness of situation, there was no Infirmary attached to the building.- 1 Another fault of construction was, that there was no place distinct from the other prisoners for the female debtors, two of whom were at this moment confined with the worst characters for their associates ; and one female debtor, a respectable Quakeress, was kept in solitary confinement, because she did not chose to be similarly placed in the Jail. Another grievance much felt and complained of was, that the common sewer of the town was so near the river, that it had frequently broken in upon the supply of water to the Jail. Some of this water had been brought to him to London, and it certainly was of a most noisome na ture. With respect to the complaint against the Go vernor, oicourse it would be understood that he stated that merely in his capacity es Member of Parliament, and not in any way pledging himself to support it from his own personal knowledge. All he had to do, was to satisfy himself that the allegations came re spectably supported, which he had done. He un derstood, also, that great severity existed with regard to the rules for admitting the wives of the prisoners, who were only allowed to see them intermingled with the other prisoners, where they were locked up from five in . the evening till eight the following morn ing, without any proper convenience for the wants of nature. A great annoyance to the persons confined' in this prison, too, was found in the Governor keep mg his house open all night, fostering riot, drunken-, - Mr. DICKINSON would oppose the su ggest ' on of the last speller , as wh o ll y i rregular. ti„ ,tat o . ment made as to the Borough Com pter was perfect', correct, and the attention of the Public hld called tb it by a Morning Paper, which the Court of Aldermen had threatened to prosecute, though they did not choose to carry it into execution. Mr. Alderman WOOD was quite ready to m eet that question whenever it should be brought forward. Mr. CREEVEY adverted to the Commission ap. pointed five years ago to inquire into the fees of th e Courts of Justice, each of whoni had since enjoyed £1,500 a-year. Dr. LUSHINGTON said, that the labour of t h e present Commission would be closed in a m onth He should support the Amendm ent . A s to the two . women committed to the Compter, after they h a d been enlarged a dispute had arisen between ae Court of Aldermen and the Parish as to the expem; of their clothing. Mr. BATHURST supported the Amendment. Mr. F. BUXTON would propose that the Honour. able Alderman should be one of the Commissioner as he had-been already in Ilchester Jail—(Laughter He believed the two females in the Compter h a d been clothed by private charity. Mr. Alderman W 001) declined being one of 6, Commissioners. The question was then put, and the Amendm ent carried without a division. ARMY ESTIMATES. The House then went into a Committee of Supply . on the Army Estimates. Lord PALMERSTON moved £6,8.54 for the A 4. jutant-General and his Of f icers. Mr. HUME wished to know for what this charge was? Why should there be Clerks kept up in Office, at an expense of £5,000 a-year to the Pult1; ; ? In 1792, the Adjutant-General was ailowed £500:3 pay the whole expense of his Clerks, stationery, 24 1 all. He therefore proposed to reduce it by 1:166!. Lord PALMERSTON said, the duties of the A. jutant-Geneta.'s Office were zotally distinct from those of the Commander-in-Chief's Office. He mu st re , peat what he had said so often, that it was really non sense to talk of paying offices as in 1792; for would the House wish the business of the Army to be d one as in that year? He then shewed the great increase of business between the year 1792 and the present year, in the Adjutant-General's °dice; and declared it impossible to conduct the business of the office at a lower rate with advantage to the Public and to the soldiers, who now knew that if they had any claim it would be attended to. Colonel DAVIES contended, that when the Up 'cant-General had all the business of the Volunteers and Militia passing through his t-'ce, the expense s of it was not so large. Mr. HUME denied that he ever wished to reduce the expenses of these various items of the Army to the same sums as in 1792. All lip objected to was, the keeping four Adjutants-General (tor he called all the Deputies so), to inspect Military Colle;:es, with efficient men under to make out the Retwns. Lord PALMERSTON said, the llonotrable Gen tleman had the year 1792 constantly in his mouth; and was for ever returning to that year as a , ticidard. Mr. H. G. BENNETT said, the N.ble Lord had censured the conduct of the Government's own E. nance Committee, from the Reports of which, they on his side of the House moved their attempts at re trenchment. He accused Ministers of giving garbled and reduced accounts to the Public of the expenses of the various Offices of Government. The questice he now asked was whether the House would reduce one shilling in the present public distress? Lord PALMERSTON said, that Gentlemen were in the habit of moving for accounts, but not to such an amount as, were necessary to cover all the expenses of the different Offices of Government. Mr. J. SMITH thought, that an Hon. Baronet, formerly a Clerk in the War-Office, who had a pen sion of £4OO 2-year as a superannuation from that duty, ought not to have the government of the West India Islands. Lord PALMERSTON said, the office war gra; lished in 1808, and it was usual to grant a compen sation for loss of office. Mr. TREMAYNE defended the conduct of the Finance Committee.—The Committee then divided, For the original Motion - - es Against it - - - • 54 Majority Lord PALME R.STOIsT then moved £1,251 for the Adjutant-General's Office.--Agreed to. He then moved £6,192 for the Quarter-Master-General's Office. Mr. 14 DME said he did not know what the Qum* Master-General could have to do in time of pewee when he had comparatively little to do even in tine of war. That office exceeded in its expense by are that of the year 1804. He then moved to reduce the sum now proposed to £4,692. Lord PALMERSTON said, there was no Assistant Adjutant-General in Great Britain. This office of Quarter-Master-General was exactly, as to numbasof Staff and expense, the same as in 1792. Therefore the Hon. Gentleman was completely canght in bit own toil. Mr. HUME said he was not caught in his own toil, for there were five Assistant-Quarter-Masters-General now, and there were none of them in 1792. Lord PALMERSTON said, these District Officeri were totally distinct from the office of Quarter• Master• General at the Horse Guards. Colonel DAVIES said, the troops were only moved about once a-year ; and, therefore, there could be hardly anything to do in this office. Sir H. VIVIAN defended the establishment of de Quartermaster-General's office. The duties of til e Assistant-Quartermasters were of an active and ice' portant description. They were stationed at r tftS. mouth, Plymouth, Liverpool, Bristol, and Pontefract, the first four were ports of embarkation ; and the dunes, now performed by five, were formerly discharged by thirteen ; and as to the establishment at Head-caw ters, the strictest economy had been introduced by the Commander-in-Chief. Colonel DAVIES repeated his objections ;* rind 0: " tended that only one of the five Assistants was Deco. sary, namely, the one at Pontefract. Sir It. FERGUSON thought any Aid-de -Camp could superintend the embarkation of troops at-prr sent at all the ports mentioned. The gallant Gece . rai complained that the troops were s e nt Out tothe oc 9l i Indies at improper periods. He had been informed. that, in 1519, that beautiful Regiment, the 934 " -- . -r , - 1