Star. — London, England, 1803-05-21 00:00:00

perufal of the papers which had been laid before the Houle, was not prepareti 11 , decide upon the .h.t cattle of this coontry. It was withi this view thnt he looted los ward to the • tili difcuLlioni tnilay. tlinii 4 lit that very important' d ,ciirvu!,fs were n.,5.% bLfooe the Houle, hut at the' fame time there were chafms in ihem, which ought to te tined up, to citable the Hook to come to a jtidAnient oh the conduit of Milliners. He was up • n aloe grounds againd any delay in the 61 which. might give the enemy reafon to th• Mk that P.aliament entertained fume doubt upon the Intik& Dr. LaweF act agreed with the Right Hon. Cent:Lin:ln „b•, (poke Lin : he hoped the diteut lion on Monday would be confined to the general point of•the justice of the wai, and that the Houfe would not go into the other and ulterior confide ration. Mr. WHITBREAD withed to know whether (ince the departure of Lord Whitworth from Pas is,any frefh communication had been received? Lord H&wKassue.v faid, he had no difficulty in filing. that he had fern a Note, which he fhould have no ohjetlion to lay before the Houle, if it could be regularly done ; lint there had been no Fropofiti‘ n made in any official way, which his Ma y4'6 Minillers would be jullined in laying before t h e Howe. Mr. WHITISILEAD (ail, he wanted to know whe. ther any fubaantial information had been received which it was materialitse Houk lhould be in pof feffion of t whether officially figned, or not, he Ihould certainly move for any fuck information. Lord Hay/assayer raid, that a Note had been P "fented the robßance of which he had no ob pawn to lay before the Houfe. Propofitions were fumetimes prefented in a confiden:ial way. which made it difficult to lay them regularly before the Houle : with regard to the fubilance, however, Miniflets had no objediriato communicate it. It was true that a propolltion had been made upon a poflible ground .:f concluding the bolinefs, but it was upon a ground In inadrnillible that Minificrs could not receive it, and therefore did not dente it to be put into an official Owe. It was a propoli• tion which this country could no: a:cede to, con fiaent with that good faith and open coaduS which Great Britain always held to other countries. Lord Ts are laid, he was fatisfied with the an Aver of the Noble Lord ; but he wifhed to know whether Mr. Talbot had been left in Paris for the purpofe of negotiating with the French Republic? Lord Whitworth had left his Secretary at Paris, and General Andreoffy bad left his Secretary in London. The Houk was told that Mr. Talbot was left behind on domellic purpofes only ; but he could not imagine that the Secrztaries of an Em• barn could be left behind merely to pack up trunks and 'fay bills. _ . . _ L'orci HAWISSIBURT raid, he had no befit ition in raying, that Mr. Talbot was not left in Paris, nor, as far as he knew, M. Portalis in London, for the purpofe of concluding any negotiation what ever. The former was left to take care of different papers belonging to the Embary, and alfo with reference to the Britiffi fobjeds who could not im mediately leave Paris. Mr. Garr would not inquire into the precife nature ot the communication, or whether it was admit ble or not. It was of extreme importance that the Houfe lhould at leall be acquaiuted with the fubttance of it. He could not but fuppofe it to be the counter-projet which was to have been delivered to Lord Whitworth, and he trolled that the abfence of official firm, and its having come through a circuitous channel, would not be made a reaf-n fit refuting to lay the fibilance of it be fore the Houle. Such a mode of communicating information to the Houfe was not unufual, it had been retorted to in the begii.iiing of the lad war. It was alto defirabie to know whether no other communication had been made to Miiiiilers fince Lord Whitworth left Paris. As for delay, he Mould not prefs it, though he entirely agreed with his Hon. Friend, Mr. Sher clan, that there would be more advantage gained by a perk& confident lion of the cafe, than from any over expeditious Or precipitate difcuffion of it. If the Houfe won't(' but paufe, and he hoped they would, the more ample and minute the information that was laid before them, the lefs Rrong might be found the cafe of violence and aggreffion. For however *tong that cafe might have appeared in the fit* inßance, yet fubfequent explanations might, in a rut meafure, have done it away. Thefe were the explanations which lie felt fo anxious to ob tain, becaufe they might materially contribute to guide the Houle in the judgment and opinion they were to pronounce on the prefent critical fituation of the country. But as he was now on his legs, he mull beg leave to ark another queltion of the Noble Lord, and that queßion referred to reports which were this day very generally circulated, and which fccmed to be taken from the French Papers, viz. that the Emperor of Ruffia had interpofed his mediation for the adjutlment of the differences now fublitling bet Ween the two countries. On this point be was extremely defirous to be accu. sately informed, and he waited to know if any offi cial communication had been made refpeding it ? Lord Hawse:suite profefed his readinefs to afford the Hoak every information in his power ; and he perfectly agreed with the Hon.Gentlemau who (poke lan, that no deficiency in mere point of form fhould preclude him fiom communicating a fad on which the Houle could be enabled to form a judgment. The communication that had been made (ince the departure of LordWbitworth from Paris was conveyed in a way that might jut tify him in concluding that it did not come from the French Government, though in his own mind he had no doubt of its authenticity. Indeed it' was his intention to have Rated it to the Hoofs on Monday next ; nor would he helitate to flute it now, if he was lure it would not provoke any pre mature difciiffion. If A sesser t il try of bear Logo!) The communication that WAS thus made to him in an unofficial mariner had for its °hied to pro p,* an arrangemeia, the ful)llance of which was, that we were to be left in poffeirsun of Malta for Rand number of years, provided France was per. mined to take pollifilon of Otranto andTartniturn tar the fame umber of years. Asti, the ptopofed mediation of the Emperor of Ruth, the report was fo far founded in fad, that his Imperial Ma i jelly, while he feemed difpnfed not to interfere, had generally exprelfed a with for the maintenance of peace ; but it did not appear to him that his Im perial Majclty had fent any precife inftrations for bringing his mediation to any diflina point what ever. The whole appeared to him on the p:ut of the French Gove-rnn-ent to he merely calculated to pi otrat the negotiation and to gain delay. Mr. WH I T BREAD alked whether the Noble Lord had any objeftion to the prociation of the Nr , te? Lord HAW KESBUR Y laid, he requefled a 111011 time to confider and make tome inquiries upon the fuhjeft. Mr. SHERIDAN fubmitted the propriety of hay ing laid before the Houfe an account of the re-, monarances which were made by our Arnbatrador at Paris, and the manner of its reception, on the fubjea of the French troops not having evacuated Holland. Lord Hawatsatray laid, in anfwer to what had been thrown out by the I-lon. Gentleman, that ' Lord Whitworth did not make any diftinet remain. armee upon that fubjea. He was not aware of I any other aufwer to be given to this queflion, for -1 th.:r than that which appeared on the face of the Papers now before the Houfe. i Mr. SHERIDAN Aid appear to him that ' infromation upon this fohjefl was important ; f„ r if it th add appear, that tkele remongrances were treated with dike and or contempt, it was one of the wont arts of France towards this counti y. It w. 4% to be prectitilvd. at all events, that Lord Whitworth obeyed his initri9ions. Thefe infiruc lions were to make r: ane reprefemations ow the fubjeet of the French troops remaining in Holland. Thefe rept efentatioas wereregarded or difregarded on the part of France. Thvie inttruelirins, as they appeared in the Papers boort the Houle, Were to make rerrefcmat ions wit;; model anon and temper. [Here Mr. Sheridan read that pot of the p; hoed Papers which relates to the initritetious given to Lord Whawmth 'Ton this filbjea.] ' Now, hc obferved, there cou:d be no doubt. that Lord Whitworth paid due attention to fuel' initrneti-ns, and made his rerefentations with temper and in,- &ration ; Tl'a ct•trid there be airy (look bit that be reported the manner in wilier . ' his oeptefenia. lions were received—thole were the documents he wanted to fee, for they were not at prefent last,re the Houle. Mr. CANNING fetid, he conferred that this Linea , meat appeared to him to be of the &II importance ' In the whole of the difettflion AS to the cattii tit t iis country againil Fronc.i. It made a material Lature in the con:luta of the Government of this country in the negotiation with France, and there. fore be wilhed to ark his noble friend the Secretary of State, whether or not any formal remonflrane was made on the part of this country, either here to the Ambatftulor, i,r at Paris, on the circumfiance on the (mita of the Ftench,army remaining in Holland against the will of the Batavian govern. ment, and alto againit the provifions of a formal Treaty Lord HAWRESSUILY laid, that he had no diffi culty in flatiog to his Right Hon. Friend, that no formal remontirance was made on that fultjeft, laid lite:will, to the reprefentation made, no for mat anfwer was received. The whole point depen• dal on the general diktat:Eno with the French 'oilier, and it was in this repeat pretty fimilar to what had paired on many other Cubieas, in which there was no total denial of fatistallion, but an evalion on the part ofFrance infiead of fatisfaftion. Mr. SHERIDAN fat& he thought now what lie had anted moil material information for theHoure, that he was more convinced of it, fine be heard the oblervations of the noble Secretary of State and, therefore, he moved, " That an humble act drefs be prefeoted to his Majelty, prayin_g he will 'be racirmay pleafed to give direftionr&r lards before the Houfe an account of the manner io which Lord Whitworth's reprefenration was re ceived by the French government, on the fubjet of their not having withdrawn their troomfrom the Batavian Republic." The CHANCE LIAM of the Escrtegyea faid, he hoped the Horn. Gentleman would not perful in his mutton, tinier a difkinft underßatoriag that if the documents to which it referred, were fuch as might be produced, they &told be laid before the Horde on Monday neat, for he would not have it be imagined that hecaufe there had been no com munication upon this fubje& it therefore had not been under the confederation of government. Nor was it to he fa concluded, becanfe there might be no communication upon that fubjea from my Lord Whitworth. Government had alfo a Minifler at the Hague, and he had the belt reaAin to ex pea that the French troops fhould be withdrawn from Holland jolt before the moment on which his frfajelly's melfage came to Parliament, and which had terminated in holtibties. He meant this not as an argument, for argument it was none, but he meant it to prevent fome obfervations.— He had already aid, that we had another Mini fter at the Hae, and that a Reprefentation was made to the F rench Government from the Bata. vian Government, and that at one time there was every reafon to believe that the reprefentation would have been attended with rum& If the Hon. Gentleman would for the prefent withdraw his motion, his Maiefty's Minilters would confider of the matter, and if the documents referred to were in the Office of his Noble Friend (Lord Hawkelbury) all poffible and regular information Ihould be laid before the Houle. Mr. &faunae laid. he could not perfiß in his Motion after what he had heard from the Right Hon. Gentleman, although the information he had called for was of the utmoß importance ; but here again he could not help repeating, that this was an additional redo* for delaying. for a few days. the general dikulDon of the &Nett Lord HAW ~,,,,,, faid. he fhonld not have , any ohjeEtions to the propofed delay, if he were not apprehenfive of tome ferious inconveniences from it, luch as had been already Rated—namely, that it might appear as if there was in the Houfe. an unwiiiingnefs to come to the dirculGrin of this important fubjelt. He meant to maintain one general point in this matter, namely, that tatough. oat the difenffion, there was, - on the part of the French Government, a difpofition not to refule fatisfsnory anlw•er_, on various topics, but to evade them. The CHANCRLLON of the LXCHtQt'FR olifi.rved, that there might be Orme Papers relating to the Communication, between the French and thellinch Governments which ought not to be produced. Mr. Cs e. laid, he undertinod that although Lot d Whitworth had not communicated to Go• yernment that which was now the fubjed of de hate, yet, that our Minifter at the Hague, Mr. Lidoti, had done fo. Mr. CANNING Paid, if the Communication of l Mr. Lifton was fati.faelory to Government, and fo important as it now teemed to be on the fub- jeft of the French Troops evacuating Holland, Knitters would have much to do in their endea vours to convince Parliament of the propriety of with•holdiug that Communication. If Mr. Lillon had received affurances that the French Troops would be withdrawn from Holland, and he tvanf mitted th•rt information to the Minifters of this Country, Lately they ought now to produce that information to Parliament. Mr. Jommsrour referred to certain information in the Papers og the Table relating to Malta. DoElor Lawrascr callcd to order, and laid, he conceiv,:i the Hon. Member was irregular at pre fent in alluding to Malta, becaufe stoother qtref tion was before the Houle. The SPEAKER laid, that he certainly did under hand that the l'rfution of the 'immutable Gentle man (Mr. Sheridan) had been waved. 1 . 11:tt at prefent there was nn Qm.ftion befme the finufe, and that therefore Mr_Pinfim might nnw proc eed. Mr. JOHN TON k then adverted to that pa: tof the Documents cn the 'fable which related to the re tufal of the Empert.r of Ruda to garritim Malta, and aficed for femme further Documents upon that Lord Hstogrseuttv obfcrved, that there WAS N diftind propaition that his 7.l3jefty's Government Mould garrifon the iflattd of Malta, and that the lime principle which actuated the Emperor of Ituffia, &owned his condr.tt at this moment. He thunght, however, that in regard to the various Motions which were making, that fome previous n .tice Ihouhi be afforded to the pet fon who was' likely to furnifh the information required, in order to lave the Houle a great deal of trouble; and on the ptefent oceation he would wills the Honourable Member to delay infilting on any fuch Motion now, feting what he had already laid, might be lufficient as a previous notice for fome future op portunity.. Gent al GA SCOYN a role, he faid, during this im portant dilcidfion, for the purpofc of moving for certain papers relative to the ifland of Malta, and the Italian Republic, previous to the figning of the Preliminaries of Peace, and this he did in pnr ittance of the notice be had formerly given. He laid he Ihould not now find it neceffary to go much at length into the matters embraced by tbe pa pers he alluded to, owing to the motion of an Hon. Member embracing feveral of thofe very pa pers he wilhed. There were certain points which however might differ, and to thefe be thought it neceffary to call the attention of the Houle. It had been Rated by the Secretary of State, that he thould on Mender only produce loch papers as had reference Jo the period fubfequent to the Definitive Treaty, but thole which he pow wilhed for were previons to *hat period. Theft, hrfaid, *ere inti mately conneaed with the others, and enlefs the Houle knew the nature of both, they could have but a confined and narrow view of the fubjea.— The motions were four I three of them of the na ture he had now defcribed. and though there bad been objetlions made to them on a former occa lion. be mulled thefe objeiions would not be heard upon another occafion. The &II motion he pro: poled was" for ccpies of all retnonftrantes of the Maltefe, with the anfwers thereto, from the tit of Oaober, ificit, to the lag day of March. with a copy of General Graham's manifefto at that time." On what ground any of thefe could be refilled, he was at a lots to conceive ; and he thought it the more material to move for fuch papers, teeing that throughout the whole of the correfpondence relative to Malta a very material alluflon had been made to that point, and it appeared from thence to be the foie or chief obliacle to peace. The next mo tion he would make was, " for a copy of all re prelentations and remontirances made by the Bri tifh Government, refpeaing the affomption of the Italian Republic and the lOAnd of Elba, and the annexation of Piedmont as an integral part of the French Republic, fubfequent to the 'treaty of Amiens." There, he Paid, appeared to him to be as neceiTary as the others, being alto frequently mentioned in the correfpondence. His next mo. tion was," for a copy of all orders or counter or deri iffued to any Governor of iflatuls in the Well Indies, fence the conchefion of the Peace, relative to the evacuation of the fame." This, he laid, was in order to compare the dates with thole of the papers now fubmitted to the Houle ; and it will be a mat ter of confederation, whether it would not have been as proper to retain thole Mande, as it was to retain Malta ? We might, perhaps. find that there were not fufficient grounds to retain them, or we might perhaps find caufe to lament that any of I thole places were given up. The motion which , he would make was, he Paid, of a nature which had been already anticipated, but he fubmitted it to the , Hoof, for their opinion and ccnfideration, it was,'' " for any letters or information received from Mr. Llano, containing the reprefentations or remon firances made relpeaing the armament in the Ba tavian ports." In his opinion, notwithßanding all that had been Paid, there could be no danger likely to arife in communicating any thing which came from Mr. Ligon, and unlefs tome explana tion was afforded on this point, he and others would be inclined to think that reports of fuch an armament acre merely for the purpofe of an ex cafe mean out the Militia. At any rare, it would thew that his Majeßy's Minifters knew pretty well what was to be the relish of the negotiation. Lord Hawsasayxv obferved, that there was no fort of iuformation refpeffing the Weft India !lauds, which his Majeity's Government could liars the kali swiss ter wiAboldisg. As to ties motion refpeding the Nfaltefe commuricuinns, an tecedent to the Tria:y of Amit.ns, if it were to be liflened to, he did not know %%ien the difctif lions w: , uld flop, as it would open an tittiiely new field. He begged leave to read to the H ine the answer which had been returned by the Maitele to the notice they received from t! , G •veroment, that they were no longer to form a part of the Empire of his Britannic Neils , . This letter, he itifornied the Houle, had been deiivered to hit j flajetty's Secretary of State on the id of April, after the conclulion of the Definitt ve Treaty, and was.exprellive of tl:e tamoll friendfliip and grati tude on the part of the ',Ureic toward, this coon -1 try. Ile objected to all the motions except the firft, relative to the Wclt Indic., became no Pal liamen tars, ground had been fated to chew that any pof• fible good would acerne from the invedigation. Mr. WINDHAM Laid. he conceived that national dignity and honour, and nati , n.ll Linty and intereft, were 11:theicnt parli..ment.try ground, to jtalify the predations. With regArd to the Pipets rela rive to Mlit.t,which matcri.,ily teaarded the rights and intereas of the in'taidtall, he thei.glit that there were vety ennt:alittr t y accounts i•t th:!t:atif atft;ms at that (init, and iihieed tuch as wee.. oft: fatly opnolite•to one anolter. The CHANCF.LLOR of doe EYCHE , ySIt appre hended, chat when his lion. Friend had mention ed twat there wzre no Parliamentary grounds, he meant that there were non.: fofficient to make thefe matters applicAb!c to the difeiSion for Monday. It h.!s hated by the lino. Nicinber, that there was a certain dewee cf rnifcondal on the part of h's .Majffy's Government, as to the treatment of the Mattne, when makin3 cilium:mica:ions to Mi.: nittet sat the Lite Treaty. lie has, however, been &I:rived in this particular, for there were no in di.tnitii:s offered ; no infulting I,i,timerit was ever uttered by a fing!e: Member of the 13:i. Govern ment; nor did he himfelf ev-r h,ar of fah an allegation till now. He thought the predation of any papers cm the fubjelt v.as perfeelly impro per at the relent moment, and therefore obje ct ed to the motions with the fame exception as Lord . Hawkiabury had previoufly Dr. LAwasact contended, that the documents now moved for, were matetially conneCted with the Papers that were to form the fuhjea of difeuf lion on Monday next; and that it was neceittry for the Houle to know what were the sentiments of the people belonging to a place which we Bill kept in our poireffion. Mr. GI .00sty Laid, the papers then moved for were of the (=on importance, fo far as regarded the charaCter and honour of this Country, and therefore he would fupport the motion for the pro. duff ion of them. Colonel GR•HAK Paid, that as he was in Coma refpeds yerfonally involved in the prefent queftion, he thought it incumbent on him to fay a fewwords. When be had the honour to command in the Ifland of Malta, be did publills an addles to the inhabi tants: but be had no inftrudions from Govern meat to do any fuch thing. He had only receiv ed a general order from General Fox to a& in that relpeft as he thould think proper. He there. fore thought the produdion of that Paper would be totally ufelefs, unfelt, they were moved for the pur pore of throwing blame upon. himfelf. The Sec aaaaaa AT Wait obferved, that it wag generally admitted the Papers now moved for could not apply to the queltion which was to CORD* on next Monday. He would not fay bet that on Come future occalion the Papers might le moved for, in order to enquire whether t e honour and charoder of the Coentry had been injured. Mr. WARD thought it abfolutely neceffary that thefe infamous lies which had been propagated concerning Lord Hobart (hould be done away.— It was impoffible to fuppok he would have told the Maltefe deputies to come to his haute to (peak to him, but not to thew themfelves at his office left be thould give offence to the French Government. He wished to know from his Majefty'i Ministers what foundation th ere was for fuch a difgraceful ireport The CHANCELLOR 07 Tnt Excompla faid,the only anfwer he had to make was, to repeat what he had already Rated in the courfe of the debate : ' tiamay.that he neva.r heard the imputation thrown out until he came dawn to the Houle that day. Mr. Casesino (aid, he attached much more im portance to the incidental quellion arifing out of the Motion before the Houle, than the objed for which the Motion had been made The additional light which thole Papers might throw epos 'the correfpondence was trifling, compared to the man ner in which they now involved the honour of the Country ; and as the Right Hon. Gentleman had Rated that thefe Papers might hereafter be made the °Weft of a feparate Motion, he felt no anxiety for the produdion of them at this time. He could not help eXpreffing his indignation at the reports that bad gone abroad concerning the condo& eifa Noble Secretary of State, who was a Member of another Houk, and he trufted in Goo they would * on a proper enquiry, appear to have been all a fabrication. _ _ _ _ • The SICIITART at Walt obferved, he did not fay that he &mild hereafter agree to any motion that might be made for the produeltitsd of Papers. but that the motion then before the Hoofe, as not being connotted with the debate of Monday neat. would come more properly in the alape of a feps. rate motion hereafter. and he obje9ed to it now, on the ground that no motion for Papers, which were intended as the ground of a charge againft a Milliner, ()mold be made without a previous no• tice. It was inconGftent with the praOice of the Houfe to do fo. _ _ _ Lord Casr AAAAA Gm obferved, that the promo. tens of the prefent motion, when they found it ha no application to the debate on Monday nest, changed their ground, and converted it into a charge again& his Noble Friend, who was now is another Houfe of Parliament. If this motion was at all proper, it ought to he a motion to lay a I ground for a criminal charge Aga;nd Lord Hubert. In refuting the prefent motion, he begged to ba andel-flood as not pledging himielf to agree to it when it Ihould be made again. He would now barely content himfelf with obterving, that if there was say fosadatio is tiba upon of the =ids M L . . . , w I I I = . ,