Star. — London, England, 1814-11-18 00:00:00

,dr - a* itoei_los the evidence , ther cases of ott te were stated te haveinersinrered to go on unpunished, even when mon made away with their stockings and apparel : When they were permitted to selr even necessaries, then every one nuts! allow that all discipline was at an end. Ano ther order issued by Colonel Quentin directed the of ficers to see that the men's dinners were regular and their persons clean. This was impossible in their state of indiscipline, and the order perfecdy useless. Colonel Quentin's defence attempted to prove nume rous instances of want rico-operation on the part of the officera ; and in a particular case, that he (Colo nel Palmer) had suffered him to remain ignorant, of a medical report which bad been transmitted to Lord Edward Somerset. On the contrary, Colonel Quen- tin was very glad to hush this Matter up. He ytld the Captains, that Mr. Morrison, the surgeon, had produced a report against them ; but he Found they were right, and he was glad, he repeated, W I I( up. But for S conversation which he , (Col Pal mer) hod had with a person in a certain , quarter, whom it was not necessary to name, )* had not in cluded Colonel Quentin's contitict Mr.. Morrison in the charges, otherwise he was 'convinced that he must have been broken before anYtOurcaartial.— As to any blame attaching to him 4CBlonel rainier) in this business, the fact was, that in eonsequence, be supposed, of the public drunkenness and want of dis cipline and health of the med, an order catne to Mr. Morrison to report the medical state of the regiment. Colonel Quentin was then absent, as it frequently happened to him, for a day or two. Mr. Morrison came to him (Colonel Palmer) to inquire what he should do? He replied, that he could not take upon himself to decide, but referred him to Lord Edward Somerset. Beyond this he had nothing to do with the subject. He regretted he should have been corn. polled to trespass already so long on the time of the House. He had called upon Colonel Quentin to prove any want of attention and co-operation on his part. Hi had done every thing in his power to sup port him on every occasion which the service re quire I, for he was too well acquainted with his duty to his regiment ever to neglect it. On his part, Co lonel Quentin, though he knew better than to offer him a personal insult, bad rendered his situation so unpleasant in the reginient, that he had tried . to be placed on the Staff, in order to get out of his way. rhe Honourable Member then read another Regi itn Order, about the number of shirts (four) %which the men were to have. This was as useless aid unfounded as the rest; and he really believed that whenever Colonel Quentin received a reprimand himself, he issued such documents, and inserted them in the orderly book, 'merely to blind and deceive his Colonel, is which, be feared, he hadenceeoled.— The Honourable 'Colonel damned the Oink Bernet to refer to the different seginontaltirders rebid**, the 10th Hussars, while the regiment was on the Fiona frontier ; and the general inferences he- dresv f • the conduct of Colonel Quentin towards the were, that he abstained from severity where it had been merited, and only held out threat' s :Math as that of sending them to bivouac, on the eget** of the order of the 26th of February. By such moans sought for popularity front the men at the expense- ; of the officers, and nothing was more likely to obtain it than censuring punishment, and on some occasions even preventing the indiction of what had been de creed. The man whom be ordered to be taken down when he had received only half his number of lashes said, " Think you, Colonel ; you are a gentleman. The regiment is a good regiment, but I am in a bad troop.' He wished not to lay any particular stress upon this observation ; the man might have been drunk, or a fool ; or, at any rate, his escape from punishment was alone suffieient to make him thank ful. But the circuintance went to thew the Means the Colcmel took to acquire popularity. •Ar to his re mission of the punithnsents of the men l it was indeed his invariable practice. This he cc d,was of itself sufficient to operate against the maintenance of - good order and discipline. If the IWO were convicted of Misconduct, And sentenced to punishment, they ought to receive it, and it wad tie duty of the oft ersto see it inflicted. The misfortune of such conduct was, that instead of beeping up the discipline of the regi ment, it only tended to increase the irregularities, so that when the regiment wits =imbed up the country, the punishments, of necessity, became more general. The Han. Colonel mentioned another instance in point, which was the case of Abbott, who, when conyietidand brought before the Commander for pu nishment, was pardoned 6y T hltn, 'ettteurrit been proved, that this man behaved in such an out rageous and disgraceful manner, that, it was abso lutely necessary to bring him to a Court-Martial.— Alluding to the letter of' the Prince Regent, he no ticed the remark, that certain officers bad affixed their names to the letter that had led to the Court -portial,who bad not been with the regimentat the time the 1 3amplaints arose, and adding; that it appeared the o fficees had all co-operated in a compact against th e i r t yperior officer. On this topic the Honourable Colonel sald, duit he only Wished to a*, if the pri vates of a regimenthave any just complaints to nudge - against their officers, they are allowed t o pr ob e shei k ishy should not the officers have the same to b r i ll; co mplaints against their Commander l ini tey were, however, accused of cooing forward in a, body. else were they to tome forward ? or What mu. - nee . aim ham beep mom paper than that which they adopted f With respect to himself, honoured ths.friotpo• dint oP(4l6,lPthe world should ha v e i n .l d o cod him to minseforyerfil against Colonel Quentin, but $ do " m pg foi 4 0 Xpaour and character ofl dicing sptak of the conduct of • .• y 3 any in the country, except, As • yil6frsits.* regiment :. bpt be found , •ge4l, Ats - Lord ComborM piv e a r i t and oat% his teneen‘ iMmitenwhat has hap whatlyediat s t muted . to -ensue ? If the ell!it, U is s ro i t . are tei O. right-about irsy, wha t will tht tkiilffieslave who -', • sad I ' 0 theltlonel "- Q tl uentin ".. Ts - 3-talio — ci . --- -..- i waosafe i rtionsly ' i F ' snot only ishrotul. bet at home, and whs 1 pfilhttdrked of wherever .he had been with ;lie 11904 entioreen at Ipswich; MR 40014 line' $ 44 elif-dawo with it feeliege at the meat,- *and hear such aims and charges thrown , . e against the,C se, without 'titbit% to hews , the complaints enquired Onto ? There wee no alter decree after.uthat had Isappenel . t ch and b i t: 3 7 o 7 e : t ed .,„44 4 , 0 44 h .:e 05 t0 1Y 4 oaly ne w a ll few words more on a POint.thielt could not be passed over. He alluded to.the letter:. Which the officers had signed, and ad dreseed.ao. the Prince Regent, in vindication of their iendots, which letter, he asserted, had been obtained front them by Colonel Quentin, under false pretences rTa4letet he would beg leave to read. He next acpairtof the command of the Prince Regent, which Matte to the dismissal and distribution et the cifiette ? 4114 on this subject he begged leave CO say, that. on hit own accopnt be had no complaint to make ; he had .stated his opinion, and been obliged to 'state it. He bed pot in any way, so committed himself as to be obliged, to brieg- forward these charges; he even regretted-thn part which be found , it necessary to take, which he 4;441494: rt 9 wholly end solely out of regard and respeotiforbil.kother ' officers. He felt the necessity of amb& .the sub ject before the House, and baVAT.P )4 OO 4 O 44 - "a d leave it to the energise of their discretbin. 1 114 1- 600 % Lnourable Gentlenian Oen 440.iqd, 0 OS WI 'Address be preseeted to the _Priareie.iluitent• PriOng . that he would be graciously 'pleased to direct that's. copy of the proceedings of the General Court-Mar thil on Colonel Qualm, of the 10th Hussars, be laid before that House." The motion having been read from the Chair, Mr. MANNERS SUTTON§ after Stins a verbal alteration in the motion, ..,, A, 'the ge neral question. He thought that the :;g i bed emu-. cited at least an unusual degree of-Ainel fince- tawards the Hon. Gentleman. During his, Initintes.lie had entirely misconceived the official duties. of a Judge., Advocate, when he had asserted tinjitbie had recoma , mended the. dismissal of the prosecuting officers.— With that determination he had no camera. T.l), course pursued by the Hon. Gentlemen had .beeo4 most extraordinary. (Ilear,hear.), The motion hail been postponed that reasons for it might beproducei4, and now what were those reasons ? -, (Ilaar, hear.) — It seemed as if the mover had considered it as a mat-, ter of course that the House should interpose—that, the papers should be laid upon the table—and after:- wards that he should submit some motion upon it.-.- m He had a little mistaken the mode of proceeding...l The first question was, whether the House had en] right to exercise a judgment, and not whether it apt proved or disapproved of the sentence * of the Court Martial ? (Hear.) The speech had not been less extraordinary than the pectatien, Whether the honesty or the intelligence' of the Members of the Court Martial was to be attacked, or whether it was a joint assault on both, it was difficult. to escertaia, Ibis it was quite clear that the House could not yen: 'gyre to decide, because they had heard only cattail Of the case. (Thar, Flee.) If the question were again to betrixds it would be fit that he (Mr. M. Sutton) should read the,other hairof the procseclingt The publication of the trial, which most periont had read, relieved him from followinic the Hon. 14entle- MOO through the greater part of ins address, bin nn,, ' lees it was meant to iiepeach the integrity of the Judges appointed, by giving full credit to the cx park statement just heard,. no grtiund had been laiff.fbr acceding to the motion. The true point at issue. ' which well deserved to be weighed, was whether the. House had any authority to offer an opinion, or to give ,dicisioo ? Justiee to the individual might re quite that the whole casc.9f ;he defendant should be detailed—ihat both sideosight be heard ;--but the House would not, upon a speech like that just deli vered, consisting principally of the reply of Colonel Palmer, think fit to call in question the deliberate nu fence of a Court, which had formed Its judgment, after haying all the. benefit of hearing that reply - , 1 with the additional advantage of attending to the evi dence adduced in contradiction. As all persons coiddnow,satisfy themselves by means of the printed ismaiess Mr. M. Sutton would not enter into the ques. !mss further .than was, necessary, not to justify, be owe a justification was not required—not to defend, fur no defense could be wanted—but to explain . the grounds en which the Court Martial had fount dad its decision. Of the First Charge, which com prised three poiets r the Court had declared that two pOintswese not proved, and that one only, which re gaited negligence in giving ordtrs to the men, was established—Was it not enough so satisfy the House to tell them, that such was the solemn decision of the Court ? or if any further confirmation were neces sary, end the integrity or talents of the Members of the Court were doubted, he begged to refer the Ho. nourabie Gentleman to the names of the Members - --.9d entirely of General O ffi cers, to many.:o . ----7 — tr, ---.- aii -r7 4 - 4 - 1 . the 1 7 fousi expressang e grata for en, services. Nothing was more natural than that the prosecutor should be dissatisfied with the sentence, and the Honolirable Gentleman did not form an ex tion to the.general rule, that the prosecutor was rcpt an impartial judge in his ern case. (fink, hear. .. • It was not singular that tin opinions of the pressen tor and of the Court should be discordant. The 2d Charge, if not direct, contained strosigimplied actu saiions of a want of personal courage ; and it had been endeavoured to be established in evidence, that . !hen the resirnent was ti red upon, Colonel Quentin mined . in his horse, and opened the ranks that be 'might get into the rear for safety. ,The Court put a negative upon this accusation, and he (*, 14.39 t. Loa) baring advised the Prince Regent,to konlitlix the sentence, was so far responsible, 404 was reads to submit to the consequences. The 3d Charger was an unelligoised assertion, of the cowardice of Colonel Quentin—that immediately the firing began hodis. amen* irons the head of , his troops, in short,that Ise resimini. The evidence for the defendant proved that 10 not left his troops until th ey were covered k' thi', ' tof . the Duke of Brunswick bell ' end until . keen dippaphed elsewhere by order. of tetr ostrst4. ~..‘• , Fourth charge um ! '• • • •, 4* effese pas a. 'Want or ilksci iin 1 :. ~-. 1 .•.!, . i. ..„. 41P?... I.c , ...al:, 1 1 • ' ; ' Nailf/43% . . s • • 1 IsomWellington sentsaymen-itabioileclemies i**. character ,Of the relciintiltelatit to 4 -peovided a re, reedy which restated it io im rfarnigr IWO of excel lences and bad expressed bib ditappeabation of the ne eigente of •Colopel.Quensin. lyord , Combetmere had Load that had not peace satrivedhe should, however, ,hive deemed it fit to take senior' notice of the con. , thated inattentions of Colonel Quentin, and it was *jugular that the very cause that had induced Cotabermere to forego his charges had in duced .the prosecutors to commence their proceed big:: (Hear, hear, hear.) The Court Martial was of opinion thaesufficient punishment had been inflict ed by Lord Wellington, but they could not find the fact otherwise, and they were consequently obliged in declare him guilty of negligence in keeping up the discipline of the regiment . For this the Prince Re gent bad confirmed the sentence of a reprimand.— The Honourable Colonel had complained of that pan of the sentence that accused his brother Officers of not co-operating with their Colonel. It would not be fit that he (Mr. M. Sutton) should state the grounds which had led the Court to make that decla ration, but the Hon. Member ought to be the last to object to it, since it was evident from the case of Mr. Morrison, to explain which he had laboured in vain, proved' that be did not co-operate by giving his an. parr officer die information that Lord Edward So. merset had declared it was his duty to commu nicate. The reason he assigned for not doing so *sae terms upon Ithiebbe and Colonel Quentin welse.-41fmr, hear.) Another case was quite as con , elusive. The junior Officers complained that they had , not due support from their Colonel...one Captain was lasked,whether in his troop there was not great irregu laity tHe answered, Yes. The next question was, whether he had made representations to Colonel Quentin %mon the subject as often as he would have ofone to any other Officer ? The reply was, No, be. ; cause i did not expect they would be taken any notice ,of.—.(Hear.) Did not this prove beyond question, !that there was not that cooperation which was abso lutely necessary for the due organisation of . the regi ment ?--(Hear.), The Prince Regent is advised. to ; approve and confirm the sentence, which is complied I With, but could the matter end there ? Could Colonel Quentin. after what had passed, expect more co-ope- Otionfrom the Officers than before ? Was it possible ; that they should remain in the same regiment ? Then ; the question, which was to leave the regiment ?—the [ partly unjustly accused of absolute cowardice, or the party who had unjustly accused him ?—(liear, hear ,f) Did common justice require the removal of the pro. motors or of Colonel Quentin ? He had no hesitation in saying that there was not an instance in the his. tory of martial law, where officers falsely exhibiting charges of cowardice against their superior, had not been dismissed the service—here they were only re. movid into Other regiments. It had been doubted by sops persons, whether, since the charges had been 'ally proved , the Subsequent censure on the pro so, rs were proper; but since the granting of Court Vs was theprerogative of the Crown, and since by weighty charges, which were unfounded, being pgeferrect, his Majesty might be induced to grant a Court Martial, which on charges of inferior conse qoeucehe might be advisetto refuse. There was a case,a/hich he should q t uote,d which was directly 'inipant, and it would not be 4 s oling himself, since it CladOecurred loud before Ita was appointed to the office. The case was contained in a letter from Sir C. Morgan ;o the Duke, of York, containing the plea sure of his Majesty on the . sentence of a Court Mar tial, held at Newport, in the Isle of Wight, on Lieu fl• eet-Colonel Morgan. The letter stated, that it was to pleasure of his Maje sty to confirm the sentence of the Court by which Colonel Ross was foiled guile) , on the first charge, and ordered to be reprimanded, by the promulgation of the reprimand in a public Order, for having employed two persons as his ser vants who were rated and paid as corporals : his Ma ' jesty also agreed with the opinion of the Court in its strictures on the conduct of the prosecutors —(Hear, hear,) —and on this occasion his Majesty recollected with displeasure the conduct of Colonel Ross himself, On a former occasion, in preferring unfounded charges against Major Ottley ; and took occasion to observe, that the preferring accusations which roc uld not be maintained, was not only inconvenient and injurious to the service, but disgraceful to the Of. Beers who brought them forward. The Commander In Chief was directed to inform the Officers engaged bi the prosecution, that his Majesty had no further Occasion for their services _; and since it was expedient for the purpose of preserving harmony in the 85th re giment, that Colonel Ross 12 cited not continue to serve 'awe ' the Commander - iii,.-Chief was directed to in. formhim, that it was his Majestirs pleaspre that he shotild retire, from that regins_ent i . hut that he should be at liberty to sell his commission, he having pur chased the same. The reason why Colonel Ross was dismissed was obvious, from the mention which was made in the early part of the letter of 'the charges formerly pieferredagainsi Major ttttley. The Right Honourable Gentleman then proceeded to observe, •at eh . • stated the reasons why the Officers could, not remain iiiiiifie Wring Corciner le, the same regt-4 went, and he had produced acaseinwjtich officers,who, had partially proved the charges they had preferred, had.been dismissed from the service. That the care, therefore, was not severe on the Officers of the 10th waif; evident, however honourable their feelings: might have been, and though they were, no doubt, sincere in iheir'expression of their feelings on the occasion, however wrong they were in the mode they' had taken of manifesting them. Those who were not connectce, with the case would not think that the officers had been injused, but rather relieved from an unplesand situation. It had been said by the Honourable Geutle.t man (Colonel Palmer), ahy were all the Officeri,io suffer since all were obliged to sign the letter, because , if one or two only had - come forward they woul have been dismissed the service ? He begged tha the Honourable Gentleman would not cast any su imputation, without proof, on the military adviser of the Pripce Regent; for he Could assure the Ho 4 nourable Gentleman, that whether the Officers ha 4 been one or thirty, the case would have been precisely the same. It had been also said—..why dismiss the of. ficen from the regiment merely for writing . a letter ? that. they bad not wished for a Court Mar tial. The , case was, as the officers had truly stated in their let 'ter, that they would not take on themselves to judge what course was prow ui be Pursued. For what could the officers have wished but for a Court Mar. ilia? Wiley were net the iovilentary accusers of Co. Qiimio, and would• tworally be apag4 se tosthue that they bad oat forth la the •Jaami charges contained in the letter is qsestios. #i 1 1 ,4 been asked if the officers were not to complain is this way ? Were there no complaints at all to be nude against a Commanding Officer But if the Honour- able Gentleman (Colonel Palmer) had asked his opi. nion, though certainly he wasnot so COUVOICUIt wish matters of military discipline as the Honourable Gcn tleakao, he should have thought the proper course to have pursued would have been to have retureed the letter to the officers. and desired them to reduce it to specific charges, which he should have forwarded, and not carried himself to the Commander in Chief. It bad been said, th It the letter in question was not ultimately intended to have been brought forward, but that Colonel Quentin got possession of it by im properly making use of the name of the Prince Re. gent. Whether or not OAS were the case, there could be no doubt that it was perfectly superflocus in Col. Quentin to make use of the name . of his Royal nets, because he was justified in calling for that ler ter, or of making it matter of charge against the og.. ficers, that they had signed it. Was it to be home • that one Lieutenant-Colonel was tostell the other thit he had a letter in his pocket, signed by the officers o i the regiment, containing charges against his characii ter and honour, and that yet he was not entitled to require that it should be produced ? Thus, whether • he had done right in form, in substance be had not done wrong. —The. Honourable geatlesnian, in talk ins of the 4th charge, had brought a variety of ac. cusetions against Colonel Quentin, and he was sues prised to hear that the instances in which Cohn* Quentin had :hewn his -lenity by remitting the r sere e truces of men who had been brought to the halbert, were hailed by Gentlemen oa the other side of the House as facts to his prejudice—(Hear, hear.) k seemed that he (Mr. M. Sutton) had ch anged sides, with those Hooourable Gentlemen—(Hear, hear.)—. When the Honourable Gentleman (Colonel Palmer) had commented with so much acrimony on Colonel Quentin for his conduct as an officer, was he await that his own course was contrary to the regulations of the army ? [Mr. M. Sutton here read an order of Sir J. Craig, issued at Quebec, and which had beta adopted into the General Orders issued from the Horse Guards, condemning in strong terms a meet; l ing of the gerjeants of a regiment ot fusileers in Ca. nada, who had passed a vote of thanks and appro. bation to the Adjutant who had been removed into another regiment. The order stated, that though Sr J. Craig did justice to the i F ood intention of the set leant!, he could not but disapprove their presumiig to meet to deliberate on the conduct of a superior of. fitter. He also condemned the conduct of the Come mending Officer who had approved the meeting.— The General Order, in adopting the sentiments of this distinguished fficer, remarked, that " the cir cumstance of any class of military persons assembling to deliberate onthe conduct of their superior otficer,was an assumption of that authority which belonged to the King alone, or to the persons entrusted by them with the command ; such conduct was equa lly cull able in all ranks."] He should- not have. Warned the transmission ot the letter, but the manner in which it had been transmitted. The feeling among the officers seemed to. have been a with that an investigation phould pike place; but by signing the letter they be. dame accus er s. Some of those who signed that lei ter must have been misled, *since there were some of the officers who signed had not been in the Pen'n. gala, Stated in the charges, or at all. These office s na doubt, only meant that there were some charges, iihiCh they wished should be cleared up, and 11: would not bindahem dowts to the technical rule, that dopy meant to say that they could maintain charges against Colonel Quentin, without knowing any thing about the matter • but the conduct of th e Horse Guards, if notice had not been taken of such a pro ceeding, would not have been defensible He shoul .1 state shortly the grounds on which he rested his op position to the production of the proceedings. He did not refuse hit concurrence on account of auy appre hension of future discussions. He was prepared to justify every part of those proceeding:, both pi e vioaEly and subsequently to the sentence—but the question of the propriety of calling for the sentence of Court Martials was one of great importance. That it was within the power of the House to take notice of any illegal sentence, he world not deny, but to cell for the proceedings on any Court Martial, with out the most pressing necessity, would be most in convettient to the public service. In the case whe e a Court Menial had voted thanks, as in the case of Lord Gambier, or taken other steps pot suppos d to be within their province, the preiceedings with propriety be called for ; but if in the cue belbre the House the pi oceedings were granted, they could never be refused—( Hear, hear,) and the House would be converted into a Court of Appeal—(llcer, tesr.) Whatever the deesion of the House was, he should bow to it, but he would confidently say, that if 44. arition was carried the Ilouse would have done more by that one step to undermine and destroy the best interest of the military service, thin they had done he 40-the Measures which they had, been :Akio; 3 After year to pramote -them— ( Hear, )seer.) jrc .0?* .I*asOrts lot had sta:ed he should oppose the prothlczica „of the papers called for.--s(Lced cheers.) Mr. TIER NEI' said, the Hou;e would not b:suo prised that he should take the first opportunity to state his sentiments on the motion. He was gait" awate of the delicacy which should he observe.: id interfering with the decision of any Court, whether .military or civil, and he should never support a luotint for the production of the proceedings, but on seal= good parliamentary reason. But there was no case i 3 which the proceedings were more urgently called flf then on the present occasion:. for if the present oci tion were not agreed to, it would be attleast neces:.l! when the next Mutiny Bill was introduced to itioo some clause to prevent officers, who preferred charg when theyfailed in substantiatingthensto their full Le tent, from being indiscriminately censured and w" verely punished, without an opportunity of be i * heard in their defence (hear, hear !) It could not be 'denied but that by the law as at present adminiaereis if any officers attacked another who was a fereent: (hear, hear 1) they . should, without. an opportenity of defence, or of spewing who were more guilty or less guilty, be subjeeted to severe punishment. Tben_i it was chat six and twenty gentl e men of the cgs u g. ratter in the country were punished. The severe lie' nishment inflicted on these officer not only applied the Captains or subalterns, but to s the "allot Culosel a4,l' discipline of t,l),elite% aiiiicacuitAeit fro4l}:ip!, BO of them were 'in the hospital at . a tinsc - VipP , r c the regiment had landed at Lisbon, And their artiii,l, in a place whcri th ey might procure wiap E , was certainly a period an which they were opatl A, to 5211!9!.! excesses i" drinking ' l ‘ l *%,r ' ll figib it ri, did not average more than es - or seven sick. C*P e l Queutme OrtYa fiftYr all, eighty,, iTet4 .. 1 the hospital, and that chieff_Ethitiaah diseasea.: . .:::. ..!.., inflif ontriiiciiiia -Th eHriiiourAhle gaols" :I pia, read some other tarts of 4e eridenee iti qhfcli furl, ... I