Star. — London, England, 1821-01-25 00:00:00

t hi s Petition, that the proceedings against h e r Majesty ser e highly unconstiuitional, and they forcibly de.' ted the omiss ion of her Ma j est y 's name from 6 t urgy. They complained that the sacred offices d religion were made subservient to the political , sa ies of Ministers — (Ckeer s J .—These were the , c t ri ese nts which occupied their minds, and they validly convinced that the agitation which pre alied in the country would not cease until Minis trig should retrace their steps, restore her Majesty's r ime to the Liturzy, and place her in possession of a ll her rights and ‘dignities—( Ikon hear). th e Petition was then brought up, read, and or dered to be printed. A petition was presented from the Borough of t eeer ly, deprecating the proceedings against her MA testy, and praying the restoration of her name to the MA .testy, praying also the attention of the House to the Agricultural interests.—Ordered to be printed. The Sheriffs of London appeared at the Bar with the City Petition. The SPEAKER—Mr. Sheriff Waithmati, what have fa got there? Mr. WAITIIMAN—The Petition of the Lord Mayor, Aldermen, and Commons of the City of London, in C o mmon Council assembled, upon the subject of her 'Majesty, reprobating the proceedings against her, p r aying the restoration o f her name to the Liturgy, and the institution of an inquiry which might lead to the disgrace and dismissal of those Ministers by whom those proceedings were advised ! The SPEAK/in—You may withdraw !—(A general bra took place on the Ministerial side of the (louse.) Mr. Alderman WOOD rose, and moved that the Petition be printed.—Ordered. Sir WILLIAM GUISE presented a Petition to the same effect, from Stroud, in Gloucestershire. Ile had to mention one circumstance connected with this Pe tition, which would skew the feeling that prevailed on the subject. A loyal Address was circulated with great industry before the Petition was proposed, and it received signatwes but slowly ; but as soon as this Petition was handed about for signatures, no fewer than 6,000 names were subsciibed in a few days! This, and a similar Petition from Sudbury, were ordered to be jointed. Mr. LAM BTON presented a Petition from Dur ham, deprecating the proct.ediligs against her Ma jesty, and praying , the restoration of her name to the Liturgy. In iising . to offer a few observations in support of nis Petition, he feared that he should incur the reproach of the Noble Lord opposite, who seemed to think that the time of the House ought Dot to be occupied in discussions upon Petitions.— He confessed, however, that he was of a different way of thinking,. and that, in his opinion, every re spectind'attention ought to be shewn to the Petitions of the P - rople—'—(llear, hear) —ln times when so much reproach was cast on the inadequacy of the Representation of the People, he did not see how the House could add to its dignity and influence, by pre venting Members from stating their own sentiments and those of their Constituents—(lleac, hear).—The Petitioners complained that one set of men arrogated to themselves the exclusive title of the Loyal and Constitutional class. They could not exceed the present Petitioners in Loyal and Constitutional feel ings—(licar, hear, from a Member ander the Gallery). He understood the Honourable Member to contra dict his statement. If he stated what was not the fact, he would submit to be corrected by a declara• tion from the Honourable Gentleman; but he was not to be put down by such irregular cries --(Hear, Lear),—nor to be prevented from expressing openly and fi eely his opinions. The Petitioners stated, that those exclusive loyalists accused all persons of disaf fection who did not coincide in the views of his Ma jesty's present Ministers. Now, as to the sentiments of those loyal Gentlemen, he denied that they ex pressed the general feelings of the Country—(Hear, hear).—He would put it to any individual, whether the ebullition of feeling which had taken place, did • not supply the clearest evidence that not nine-tenihs, but nineteen in twenty parts of the population of the country were engaged in active opposition, not to the Crown, but to his Majesty's Ministers—( Cheers ). When the Noble Lord assumed that the Lion of England, as it was expressed, was roused in favour of himself and his colleagues, he thought it very in consistent that the den of that lion should be found iii little Corporations and Scotch Counties. He prayed to Gou, that the indifference which Ministers !hewed to the voice of the People, might not ulti mately lead to consequences which all must lament. With these sentiments, he moved that the Petition be brought up. Lord CASTLEREAGH begged to assure the lion. Gentleman who had just sat down, that if he supposed that he (Lord Castlereagh) said any thing, or proposed any line of conduct disrespectful to the Petitions of the People, he had quite misun derstood him. Indeed, what he had said, was exactly opi.osite to this. As to what the Honourable Gentle man had imputed to him, and the words which he put in his mouth, he (Lord Castlereagh) did not know but that he ought to have used such words, and they might perhaps have been extremely proper and laudable—(Hear, hear)—but the fact was, that he did ri , lt nse them. Mr.LANIBTON denied that he had put any words in the mouth of the Noble Lord, which it would have been laudable in bins to utter. la the obsetvations which he had made, he alluded to the expressions which the Noble Lord had used with respect to his Honourable Fricad, the Member for Essex, at an early period of the evening. •As to what he said of the " Lion of En land," he did not impute those ex pressions to the Noble Lord. They had been used by a Journal which was devoted to the interests of Ministei s.—The Petition was ordered to be printed. Mr. BENETT presented a Petition from the Nobi lit), Clergy, and Centry, of the County of Wilts, Which was agreed to at a large County Meeting, at avhich the Sheriff presided. It was his ditty to say, that the Petition was signed only by 100 of the Free. holders, a circumstance which was to be imputed to the shortness of the interval which took place be tween the time of the Petition being agreed to and the present moment ; othern ise, be had not the least doubt, that it would have been signed by thousands lithe Freeltold2Es. The prayer of the Petition was, that the House should stop all proceedings against her Majesty, if any were proposed, and should do everything in their power to calm the agitation which ousted in the country, and which would continue to exist, until her INAjcay'o, uamr tva4 restored to the taitttrsy-as - (Hear, hear).—He *as desired by his constituents to support the prayer of the Petition. He did so; not that he thought hiniself obliged to obey their orders—( Hear, hear)—but, because his disposition and his sentiments led him to do so. He did not know what might be the intentions of his Majesty's Ministers towards the Queen, but he did think that their conduct in proroguing the Parlia ment was peculiarly ungracious its it affected her Majesty—(Year, hear).— By that act the- Ministers left her Majesty in a condition in which never was a Queen placed before in this country—(Hear, hear) —in a state which was more anomalous, in fact, than the trial itself—(Hear, hear).—And after leaving her Nlajeity in that strange situation for upwards of eight weeks, he did think that Gentlemen had every right to suspect that Ministers had an intention of making some kind of use of the proceedings which had taken place, either for the purpose of grounding upon them some new measure, or of ap-, plying them in directing the provision to be made for her Majesty—(Hear, hear).— He did not know what opinion some Gentlemen entertained of the proofs which had been gone into ; but he, for one, denied that anything was proved against her Majesty —(Hear, hear).—He thought that her Majesty stood, in the eye of the law and justice, acquitted of the charges that bad been brought against her. But however Gentlemen differed upon that point, all were agreed in this, that it was high time to put a stop to those odious proceedings altogether—(Hear). It was high time, if not in justice to the Queen, at least in justice to the count, y, that the House should take the situation of the country into their consider ation, and endeavour, as far as in them lay, to relieve the distresses of a loyal and suffering People—(Near). —A more loyal People than those of Wiltshire were not to be found in his Majesty's dominions. His en treated of Ministers, if they had any feeling for the honour of the Crown, and he did not doubt that they had—if they had any feeling for the distresses of the People—if they iiad any regard for their own aharakters, that they would contribute, by every means in their power, to put a stop to those proceed ings which excited so much agitation throughout the country—(Hear).—Petition ordered to be printed. Mr. TEiaNI'SON presented a Petition to the same effect from Great Grimsby, in the County of Lincoln. He did nor intend to occupy the time of the House, but for some observations of the Hon. Member for Wiltshire. He confessed that he last night under stood the Noble Lord to say, that the proposition which he was to make, respecting a provision for her Majesty, was the only one which he intended to make on that subject—(llear, hear ! front Lord Castle reugh).—lle was happy to find that he understood the noble Lord correctly. Nose that being the case, he had only to state his decided opinion, that Minis ters had abandoned their duty, by inflicting priva tions upon her Majesty in the first instance, and still more so by continuing those privations in the interval which elapsed between the prorogation and the meet ing of Parliament—(Hear). —lt appeared to him also to be inconsistent with what he understood to be the system on which Ministers acted when they omitted her Majesty's name from the Liturgy, that they did not now restore- it--(Hear).-=That omission took place on the ground that certain charges were made against her Majesty; but the ground was necessarily removed if those charges were not substantiated— (ffear).—Thus, therefore, Ministers were driven to maintain an alternative, either that the charges were substantiated, or that they were not—(Cheers). The Petition was ordered to be printed. Mr. HUME presented similar Petitions from the Boroughs of Banff, Arbroath, Annan, and the In corporated Trades of Aberdeen, in Scotland. He thought it necessary to state, that though Minis ters had Addresses from the Royal Burghs in Scot land, yet no one would deny, that if such a Reform had taken place in those Burghs, as would afford the 'People an opportunity of speaking their sentiments, Ministers would not have received one Address from Scotland, which wculd give any countenance to their measures.—The Petitions w ere ordered to be printed. Mr. ESTCOURT presented a Petition to the same effect, signed by 400 inhabitants of the Borough of Devizes. He gave a brief summary of the heads of the Petition, and said he had no doubt it expressed the sentiments of the place. Mr. R. GORDON was surprised that the Honour able Member who presented this Petition did not say one word in support of it. Indeed, the probability was, that when it came to the question, he would oppose the prayer of it. At the same time, he was aware that the inhabitants of Devizes had no right to expect their Members would support any Petition which they might wish to have presented to this House. Those Hon. Members were, in fact, the Re presentatives not of the people of Devizes, but of some twelve or thirteen Aldermen who returned them—( Hear, hear).—This was a perfect illustration of the kind of support which the Noble Lord reckoned upon last night, when he expressed so strong a hope of having the confidence of the flodse and the Coun try. The Noble Lord, no doubt, had, and would continue to have, the confidence of the Members for Devizes. But what now appeared to be the feeling of the people of Devizes ?—(Loud cheers.)--What were the sentiments of those persons who signed this Petition ?—(llear, hear.)—Did the Noble Lord be lieve that he had the confidence of the Public of De vines? He thought, in fact, that he (Mr. Gordon) was more the Representative of the inhabitants of, that place than either of the Honourable Members who were returned for it—(A laugh)—for he repre sented a place (C:icklade) where several inhabitants of Devises had votes. And he also accorded in their , sentiments, for he would give his strongest support to the prayer of this Petition—(Hear, hear). Mr. J. PEA RSE contended for the right of the Member to huid his own opinions, though it was his duty, when requested, to deliver a Petition to this House, the prayer of which he might be inclined to oppose. He denied that the 400 Petitioners spoke the sense of the whole town.. There were many re spectable persons who, he knew, did not concur in this Petition, who were willing to sign a Petition, but very different from this in its terms, and who were persons of much more weight and respectability. Sir FitANCIS Buitmar.observed, that if the Honourable Member who had just sat down, alluded to his Constituents, the twelve or thirteen Aldermen of the Borough, no doubt could be entertained that the persons who signed this Petition were not, per , haps, generally speaking, quite equal to those worthy . . Gentlemen in oseghl—(Laugh ter). But •he agreed with the I-lonourable Member near him, in taking this as a very fair specimen of the species of confi dence which the Ministers.reekoned upsn, when they talked of the House and the Country. Passing over, however, those worthy Aldermen, of whom the Ho nourable Member appeared to be so faithful a Repre sentative —(A laugh)—he hoped that the House would pay every attention to the prayer of the Petition, that the question which so long agitated the Country would be put an end to, and that the House' would have time to apply its attention to other subiects which were of infinitely greater importance—(llear). In reference to what the Noble Lord said last night, he agreed in the understanding which was expressed of that passage in his speech which referred to her Majesty. But he confessed he would be happy to hear the Noble Lord explain himself more clearly as to the mode of proceeding which was intended to be adopted. He certainly understood the Noble Lord to say, that Ministers gave up all intention of any further proceedings against the Queen. If that was so, undoubtedly it would prove very consolatory, and would ise productive of great advantages to the Country. And that being the case, he did not see why any discussion should take place on the subject. The corollary which followed, was one than which nothing could be more simple and natural, namely, that everything should be replaced in Its due position. Alter the failure of Ministers in carrying through their Bill, after the prosecution had broke down un der them, it would be a little bard that any Gentle man should doubt that everything should be carried to its natural termination— (Hear, hear). Under these circumstances, he hoped that Gentlemen would not allow themselves to make insinuations, as if any feeling of hostility still remained ; and he hoped that this course would meet with the approbation of the exclusive Loyalists of the country—(Hear, hear)—as well as of those who thought from the beginning, that no proceedings ought to have been instituted against her Majesty at all. The Noble Lord seemed to him not much disposed to enter into that subject, as if he touched it with some feelings of regret. But he still hoped it would he fully explained, and that the in dignation of the Country would not be excited again by the adoption of a mode of proceeding which tended neither to acquit nor to condemn--(Hear, hear). He hoped that the Ministers were determined to pursue a different course, one which would up hold the dignity of the Crown, and give tranquillity to the Country, that no future occasions for discus sing this subject would arise, and that the King would be permitted to give place to that sense of jus tice by which he was animated, and which was most likely to promote his own dignity, and that of his Family, by restoring her Majesty to all her rights. Lord CASTLEREAGH did not wish to anticipate the discussion which was to take place on this subject. The Honourable Baronet seemed to suppose that the Government bad altered some intentions which they had conceived since his Noble Friend withdrew the Bill in the other House. He could assure the Hon. Baronet, that the Government bad not altered, nor did it now give up any intention which was enter tained, from the withdrawing of the Bill to this mo ment. They then determined to propose no other measures, and in that determination they had since remained—( Hear, hear). Mr. ESTCOURT denied that his Constituents were confined, as an Honourable Member stated, to twelve Aldermen. He was elected not by twelve, but by six and thirty persons—(Hear, and loud laughter).— He denied that in making their election of Members his Constituents were influenced by any unworthy' motives—(Laughter).—When he was sent here, he did not conceive that he was to represent a single Borough, but to take care of the interests of the whole Empire—(Hear, hear). Sir F. BURDETT explained, and at the same time pressed the Noble Lord to say, whether any further proceedings of any kind were in contemplation. Lord CASTLEREAGH disclaiined the intention of instituting any further proceedings of a hostile character. Mr. BROUGHAM was ready to believe that no new proceedings were intended, in the way of trial, at any time, since the late proceedings were stopt. But it would appear, that all other proceedings, in dependent of trial, were still to go on—(Hear; hear), as if the late trial had proceeded,to its natural termi nation, and punishment was inflicted as if it had ended in conviction—( Loud cheers). Lord CASTLEREAGH would not anticipate the course which was intended. The Honourable and Learned Gentleman assumed that it would be one of punishment; but he had no grounds to lead to 'such a conclusion. Lord JOHN RUSSELL, referring to a speech of the Noble Lord in the last Session, contended, that he distinctly said her Majesty's name was omitted from the Liturgy on account of the charges made against her. Now those charges were not persisted in, and yet they acted as if they considered her guilty. The Petition was then ordered to be printed. Dr. LUSHINGTON presented a Petition to the same effect from Ilchester. He referred to what the Noble Lord opposite had said last Session, as to the meeting of the House, that, even if the Bill did not come down, the llouse should meet, to make provi sion for her Majesty. Lord CASTLEREAGH assured the Honourable and Learned Member, that he said no such thing. Lord FOLKESTONE attested, that, at the time, be understood the Noble Lord to have said words to that effect. He supported the prayer of the Petition. Dr. LUSHINGTON was bound to believe he had misunderstood the Noble Lord at the time; but be hoped the Noble Lord would use language which was perfectly clear, and not liable to be misinterpreted. The Petition was ordered to be printed. Sir I'. ACKLAND presented a Petition to the same effect from Axminster, in Devonshire. Ordered to be printed. Sir T. ACKLAND presented a Petition from Col lumpton, similar to those presented with respect to her Majesty.—Laid on the table. - Mr. Alderman HEYGATE presented a Petition, of similar import, from Sudbury. He stated, that it' was respectful in its language and sentiments, re spectful to Parliament, and the Sovereign. This was an occasion when every man, who wished well to the Constitution, should speal: out. He declared his entire disapprobation of the late measures against the Queen..—but at the same time, was not prepared to agree with ihe Petitioners that her Majesty dc. served to he restored to all her rights and dignidei of Queen, and he heard, with pleasure, the: intiins; tion that the qtr.:Won would be laid for evrr ih Obli vion. Nor was it the question of her guilt or inn(); • cence that he alluded 'to in this cloclahition, so intact' as the line of political conduct she thought proper tb pursue, in contaidictitin to the advice of her legal advisers—(Heat). On he arrival in this country' she announced, very properly, that .she would not mix up her just cause with any political opinion. But this declaration was soon after fonowed by a let ter to the King, which contained sentiments that would be improper as addressed to a pri7ate Gentle• man, but to a Sovereign would, if written by any other person, justly call down the punishment of the law ! This was succeeded by a series of attaets, in Answers to Addresses, on both Houses of Pa'7liament, and on the King, holding out, as an encouragement to cer tain classes in this country, that :f the Bill passed the two Houses, it might be a question how far thr People might be called upon to acquie.xe in it ? Irt addition to this, direct encouragemeet was held out Ito the military, paid by this House, to interfere with the administration of justice—(Cheers).—lle coact not agree with the opinion, that these things should be looked over, although he was very desirous of taking into account many circumstances of extenu ation. Had she, in a moment of indignation, given vent to her feelings in any severe reflections upon the authorities of the country, it might be forgotten; bilt when these reflections were repeated five hun dred times, it carried too much the appearance of design to allow the supposition that such sentiments were not adopted until after mature deliberation-- Wen:l.—ff lie was tight in making these imputations on her Majesty, he thought it would be a matter of some consideration with the House how far they ought to agree to any measure which might have the appearance of sanctioning the promulgation of such sentiments. He thought the moment was ar rived when this anxious question should be buried in oblivion—when the Parliament should have an op portunity of giving its undivided attention to the legitimate concerns of the country—and when we would cease to become the ridicule of foreign nations, by the degree of importance we gave to matters which did not merit it. Mr. HUME challenged the Honourable Alderman to point out what passage in 11 , ,r Majesty's letter to the King he alluded to, as the foundation of the charge which he brought against her. It was un manly and unjust to the last degree, to raise charges against a person who had not the opportunity of im mediate defence, of grave offences and not to give anything in the shape of a reason for such charges— (Hear). He was as much dispo ,ed as any man to Tespect the institutions of the country, and he de clared that there was not a sentiment in that letter which was inconsistent with his own—(Loud cheers from the Treasury Benches). He expected nothing else in using this expression than cheers from those who approved of the unmanly persecution of a des• sorted woman !—(lfear, hear). He did not think, that after Ministers had trampled upon her, at the mo ment that she was in the dust—the victim of the meanest arts of persecution—he did not think there was a man dastardly enough to wish to press upon her further !—(Hear, hear). no worthy Alderman (Heygate) admitted that the Queen was wronged— he deprecated the treatment of her by Ministers, and yet he would wish to punish her by keeping her name out of the Liturgy. The Honourable Gentle man dwelt upon the situation of her Majesty, and recapitulated the te:.iei of indignities offered to her Majesty by the Ministers. Mr. Alderman HEYGATE disclaimed any other wish in the observations he had used; than to state the reasons why he differed from the opinions stated in the Petition of his constituents. This open and can did conduct, he hoped, would not be considered as unmanly nor did it savour much of the hole and corner system. In vindication of himself, for having charged her Majesty with promulgatng very perni cious political sentiments, he, after declaring his want of sufficient recollection to state any particular pas sage in the Queen's letter, with the exception of this -1" Your Court is a scene of low debauchery”—cited passages from divers of her answers to Addresses as follow : " This Bill, if persevered in, will undoubtedly lead to a civil war"--(Cheersfront the Opposition). " There are times when it ought to be understood that the interests of the Army are not distinct from those of the rest of the People"--(Clicersfrons the Opposition). " When the Sovereign on the Throne is the slave of and remarkable only for his In another answer, the Government dared to be " an insolent domination." " I will not, except by actual force, submit to any sentence not pronounced by a Court of Justice."—(Cheers front the Op position). " If the Bill of Pains and Penalties Fss the two Houses of Parliament, perhaps it may be proposed to the people how far it ought to be obeyed."—(Chocrsfrvin the Opposition). To the Artizans.—" It is owing to the hard-heartedness of the Oppressor that the labourer, who sweats in daily toil, should re tire to his home at night without the benefit of his industry." Such were a few of the many passages he could cite to justify his censures. With respect to his opi nion of the Queen's letter, he knew it was sanctioned by the declaration of a distinguished Peer in the other House, to whom he could not regularly allude. If lie were convinced that there was nothing disre spectful to Parliament or the King in her Majesty's Answers, he would willingly vote for the restitution of her name to the Liturgy. Mr.LOCKHART deprecated any attempt to with. hold from her Majesty any part of her rights and dignities, and at the same time to give her a large pecuniary allowance. Such a line of treatment, be sides its incongruity, might lead as a matter of ne cessity to a series of consequences—a tendency to Which, when manifested by the published sentiments of her Majesty, became a great subject of rebuke.— For if her Majesty were denied the company of those, who with the operation of her own good sense would be her security and the secu r it y her hands, wo rityoftheStat uld eshe with large pecuniary means i n be come the object of the designs of those in a more extensive way than hitherto—whose principles she too foolishly abetted. " Lord NUGENT animadverted, in severe term!, on the worthy Alderman (Heygatc), who, he said, had had the fortitude to bring forward a charge of the most heinous nature against her Majesty, without a single document, or a single word, in iris tecullec tion, to warrant this accusation—(Hear, hear).—lle (Lord Nugent) disclaimed any intention of defending the answers given in the name of the Queen to Ad- of the country was dc- Olt !ht en: NV be 111 I h tb • to T de or m PI kr at 111 Il aT or. • . 0 es 0 hi th• v 0 • t la 10 d ; L ol f • a 1 10 I 13 i TI C C i 1 11 0, I S 3. I a