Star. — London, England, 1821-03-20 00:00:00

an d t he circulation of country paper.might have been dins: . s hed still more than that of the Bank. The int eject o f parliament in 1819 had been fully realised, d w hat bad been • contemplated for 1823, would take place in 1821 . 'lf not e s were in circulation that vere difficult to be count e rf eited, there would be no " i a. e d o f a ny alteration oa the plan chalked out by the C om mittee. But he'hoped a note might be invented, t h a t would either defy imitation, or that, at least, co ld not be counterfeited without much - difficulty. lire Bank would now have the power of substituting „id for paper, at the same time that those who pre ferred pa per would have their free option. Ile hoped that notes more difficult. of imitation, both with re spect to the £1 and the £5 notes,. would be invented. No alteration relative to country circulation was nude by the present Bill. He was happy to be able to gate, that of the ten millions due by, Government to the Bank, the greater part had been paid .by in stalments, and the whole debt would be extinguished • on the sth of April. It bad-once been intended to hare increased the amount of the sum to which silver !night be made a legal tender ; but that idea had, u pon mature deliberation, been subsequently aban doned. The same steps taken with respect to the Rink of England, were proposed to he adopted in the case of the Bank of Ireland. The Right Honourable Gentleman concluded by moving for leave to bring in a Bill to accelerate Cash Payments on the part of the Bank of England. Mr. BARING said, that if a proper course had b een ta k en previously, he fully concurred in the views of the Right Hon. Gentleman as to the acce leration of Cash Payments ; but he did not put much faith in the graduated scale of Cash Payments, to which some Gentlemen attached so much importance. Ile apprehended that the plan of the Right Hon. Gentleman would not lessen the forgery of small votes. All were agreed that no greater evil could befal. a country than a varying circulation; but the subject was one of ouch importance, that it might be proper to reconsider it. At one time he enter tained much more alarm on the subject of the re sumption of Cash Payments, than the result had• warranted. But much distress prevailed all over the country, and the tran,ition from war to, peace could rot produce such effects at the close of six years. No instance bad formerly occurred of a progressive n ine haring taken place in the case of money. In a long and expensive war the country had been expend ing, not the income, but its capital. Should it take place in a small town that-the landed proprietors ex pended their capital, it would produce a great tem porary affluence, to be followed by corresponding distress. The country had not reached the top of the hill, nor was it, as a matter of course, about to return to its former state. It appeared to him that the depreciation of money bad been under-rated, nor had the variation in the currency been attended to. The difference of value had not taken place in the articles themselves, but in the measure of value that had been applied to them—(Hear).--To estimate the full extent of the depreciation was impossible. The great plenty of the precious metals had led to the de preciation of them. That had been still further in creased by a paper currency, even when convertible into gold and silver, and much more when that paper WAS not so convertible.—The facility, too, of obtain ing credit, added to that depreciation; as when a man could obtain credit at a country-bank for 1:200 or £3OO, it had the same effect as if it had been in his possession. For the first year after the suspension of Cash Payments, the difference in value between paper and gold, had been little felt; as gold was then abundant. The difference began to be percep tible in 1806, and continued to increase progressively. As the price of all commodities bad risen, that was a proof of the depreciation. From 1785 to 1798, the price of wheat had been 551. or 565. and in the following years to 1820, the average had been 85s. or 90s. The old price had returned; but what in 1785 had been a remunerating price, was one that low the farmer could not live upon, from the in creased expense of all arti,cles connected with the management of the farm, caused by the overwhelm ing magnitude of the National Debt. In the return to a metallic currency (said Mr. - Baring) great care was to be taken not to go beyond the strict limits that good faith absolutely required. Had there been no Public Debt, he should have sanctioned a deprecia tion ; which, under the present circumstances, he could not consent to sin with good faith to the public creditor. The annuitant was then receiving a larger interest than the debtor could afford to pay, and than the Country could afford from the exertions of her indus try. The House had been told that the expense of living depended on the value of gold and silver; but habits had been introduced that it was extremely bard to overcome. If he was to give a post-boy half-a-crown where he had formerly given three shillings, and should attempt to explain to him that half-a-crown was now equal to three shillings for merly, he would probably be told he was a shabby fellow. The same habits would still, for a long time, continue under a different state of things. If no other good should result from this discussion, it would at least spew posterity that we were now floundering, not from any natural necessity, but from our own misdeeds. He was of opinion that the subject should be sent up stairs to a Committee, to experience a mature reconsideration. At the time of engage ments between individuals, the resumption of cash payments had never come into :he account. The value attached to the pound sierling was what it bore in the commerce of common life. The average value for ten preceding years would be a fair standard to determine the future value of the circulating me dium. One remedy he would propose was, to make perpetual payments in bullion instead of coin, as had been recommended by an Hon. Friend (Mr. Ricardo). Paper would then be the circulating medium, and the Bank would be prevented from throwing out too • much paper, from the liability to pay in bullion. four or five millions in the Bank would be sufficient for the machinery of the system. Under that system the Bank would never be exposed to a run of a great remount, to which it was liable under the present .tystem. As the country could not do without paper for daily use, a great run of paper could never be made upon the Bank. By that means the expense of coinage, and the wear and tear of the currency, vrottld be saved to the country. That had for cen total been the practice of the Bank of Hamburgh. ~h e o n ly f in ruidable objection was the forgery of • ank•notes. Bat that question had not yet had fair PLY. The attempt bad been made to discover st note that could not be imitated, instead of one that was only' difficult of imitation. Nothing could possibly be more clumsy than the present Bank-note.. At the Bank of France there had been only one for gery at the time of the occupation of Parisi)) , the Allies, when the file plates having been destroyed, a provisional plate had been substituted, and then a forgery had taken place. But in France, the lowest Bank-nete.was.of the value of £l2O. Forgery was also extremely rare in America. A gold token might also be introduced into circulation. We should act with perfect good faith by taking silver as a standard. The former tender of silver was legal by tale, to the amount of 1.:25, and by weight, to ispy amount. Up to 1797, gold and silver were the legal tender of the country ; and, at the, present day, the former state of the tender might easily be restored. Silver appeared to him to be a preferable standard to gold. Under the system of bullion payments, there was no inconvenience from the two standards, though there might in the case of coin. The two metals together would form a better standard than one of them singly, and prevent the variation that one of them singly would be liable to. As a practical question, no difficulty would arise from the joint operation of the two standards. His remedies were the intro duction of the Ricardo system, and the operation of the two standards. He should move a Resolu tion, " That it was expedient to reconsider the Act of the 59th of the late King, Chap. 49, to alleviate the pressure that would result from the strict execu tion of that law." - • Mr. RICARDO thought that the power cf re striction of Cash Payments was one of a very formi dable nature. By regulating the quantity, the Bank Directors had the power of determining the value of the circulating medium. His Honourable Friend (Mr. Baring) had gone upon theories, though he pro fessed that he despised all theories: for in the year 1819 he said, before a Committee, that we should have only one standard. When asked sr by he thought so? he answered, because he understood that machi nery was going out to South America, which would increase the production of silver; and therefore the standard, in his opinion, ought to be gold. His Ho nourable Friend, who affected to be no theorist, con sidered the distresses of the Agriculturists, &c. of this country, all arose from the alteration of the cur rency of the country. But what was the fact ? The currency had not fallen more than 10 per cent ; and even his standard—gold—hal fallen in value since the peace. In comparing the_money of France and other countries with that of England, as well as the corn and other commodities, they would be found all to have fallen in value as well as they had in this country. He doubted whether the proposi tion of his Honourable Friend was correct, namely, that we had expended a great part of our capital during the war ; on the contrary, he believed that there were such savings made in the country, as more than counterbalanced the expenditure of capi tal during the war. His Honourable Friend had asked why we should have a purer standard than the rest of the world ? He (Mr. Ricardo) would answer that question by asking another, viz. Why should we not have a purer standard than other countries ? It mattered much to us to have a pure standard, as far as regarded other countries ; but in our own it amounted to nothing how the money was depreciated. The use of a proposed golden token he deprecated, because, by a gold token he understood a species of coin with a smaller quantity of gold in it than the rest of the coin of the land. This, therefore, would be of no use in foreign countries. The only species of gold tokens which he could agree to must be those which were nearly of the standard value of the sovereigns. He thought it would be difficult for speculators and jobbers to alter the value of money if we had two me thods of paying in money. He saw no facility of fered for forgery in the plan of the Right Honour- I able Gentleman. At the same time, he believed that the only security for preventing the forgery of Bank notes, was by adopting a system of metallic currency, such as existed previous to 1797. All the issues of Bank paper lately had been made to ensure to the Bank a quantity of bullion. He should like now to see the laws, as they respected usury, repealed; and, in his opinion, no time could be more favour able for it than the present. This he should like to see done on the part of the Bank. Mr. PEARSE thought it extraordinary, that now they were about to return to Cash Payments, those who had so particularly advocated that system should now be the first to object, or rather to start objec tions to it. There was no other purchaser of gold than the Bank of England; and was it fair, that the Bank, which was the sufferer by the issue of Paper Currency during the last few years, should not be al lowed now to pay in Cash? Mr. PEEL considered that it was evident that this was the time for a return to a metallic currency ; be cause, since the Bank was liable to be called on to pay in gold, there had been a reduction in the issue of Bank notes ; and a proof had been shewn that the gold currency might now be adopted without any chance of the gold coin being taken out of the coun try. He thought Mr. Ricario's plait was the best, if a proper remedy could . be found for the preven tion of the forgery of Bank notes. He did not know what the Committee on Bank Notes had lately done, but he understood that the Bank of Ireland had a me thod, by very simple machinery, to prevent forge ries, by accurate, mathematical, globular figures.— This plan, if effectual, would be ten times more efficacious than that of the Bank of England.— He could not agree to the adoption of a double stan dard of currency ; even if it were protected by the ideal unity, on the abstract notion of a Bank-note.— It was very natural for us, when in a state of dis tress, to throw out of sight the real causes of it. In 1814, the House came to a Resolution, tint in 1816 Cash Payments should be resumed ; the same took place in 1818, and 1819 ; and now (after all the distress under which the country laboured), he did not regret the conclusion to which the Cash Payment Committee came. When that Committee was going through its labours, they found it impossible to re turn to a gold currency, which was at that time very much depreciated in value. They found, that the proposition of returning to a metallic standard would have then deprived the Bank of the power of being of service to the Public by loans of its capital. But if foreign countries had begun to improve their metallic currencies, we must have done the same, or else we must have gone still further down the stream. 1 He thought that it would be imprudent to agree to the Iproposition of the lion. Gentleman (Mr. Baring). Mr. F. LEWIS thought there was no ground for delaying any further the resumption of. Cash Pay ments; and he hoped they would see the necessity of establishing a standard for the Currency: he wished, however, that the present standard of the Currency should be altered, because no one could tell what might be the consequence of it. lie did not doubt 1 but a'note could be framed to prevent forgery in all votes of•£s and upwards ; but not so with respect to £1 notes, considering the frequency of their circula tion, and among the lower orders. No one had yet suggested a system by which forgery might be de tected by the working classes. He sincerely wished that a period should come for the resumption of Cash Payments, and. that therefore the issue of £1 notes should be withdrawn. Mr. CRIPP.S did not believe that any evil had arisen from the Bank issues. If there hid been an evil, it arose from apprehension more than from reality. The Bank had been as cautious in its issues in proportion to its extent (and much more so) as Country Banks. The Bank could not otherwise have benefited the Public or individuals by discounting good bills. He, however, agreed that now was the time to make a ,tared in favour of Cash Payments. this was not the time, he agreed that he did not know when it would come. The Hon. Member observed, he saw nothing to apprehend in resuming Cash Pay ments. The reduction of the circulating medium would have no ill effect, if the price of commodities fell in pro2ortion. If wheat was £2O a load, a man must have £2O to pay for it ; but if the load of wheat was only £lO, then £lO would go as far as £2O in the other case. Under all the circumstances, he was in favour of resuming Cash Payments. Mr. ELLICE had doubts that adopting the pro position for paying in two metallic currencies would be attended with very considerable difficulties. He considered the present system as an evil, but he thought the country were bound to abide by this evil lather than fly to ills which they knew not of. He was of opinion if ever there could be a time fitted for resuming Cash Payments in full, it must be at a time like the present, when we were at peace with all the world. The estimate was, that £25,000,000 metallic currency would be sufficient for all purposes. —The Bank were already in possession of half that sum, and provision might be made for the other pait. He trusted, under all the circumstances, the amend ment of his Hon. Friend would be withdrawn, and the Chancellor of the Exchequer's motion agreed to without a division. Lord FOLKESTONE opposed the Bill going into a Committee, and defended the proposition of Mr. Baring, for an alteration in the standard. Mr. HLISKISSON considered altering the stand ard, under any circumstances, would be unjust to the public creditor and impolitic to the State. Mr. BARING replied, and defended his proposi tion; a double standard was not new, it was what had existed from the reign of Elizabeth down to 1797. After a few words from the CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, the original question was agreed to with out a division. A similar Resolution was agreed to with respect to Ireland. The House resumed, the Report was received, and Bills were ordered accordingly. GRA NIPOUND DISFRANCHISEMENT. Mr. STUART WORTLEY moved the third read• ing of the Grampound Disfranchisement Bill. Mr. SYKES opposed the Bill. The town of Leeds contained about 80,000 persons, but by this Bill not more than 1000 out of the 80,000 would have a right to vote. He considered it would be better to leave the right of election to the Borough of Grampound than to send it to Leeds under such circumstances.— He wished this Bill to be withdrawn, and a new Bill brought in, giving the right to the County. of York to send four 'Members, instead of two, as it did at present. He concluded by moving, that the Bill be read a third time this day six months. Lord JOHN RUSSELL defended himself against the charge to which he had been subjected, of having abandoned the Bill. He first proposed to make Leeds a scot-and-lot Borough ; but this being opposed, he then proposed to limit the right of voting to persons paying rents of £5 a-year. He afterwards proposed to raise the sum to £lO ; but an Honourable Gentle. man proposed, as an amendment, £2O. This took away, in his mind, the popular character of the Bill, and destroyed the object of it ; and under these cir cumstances he had given up the conduct of the Bill. He still, however, considered it so valuable a measure, that should the Hon. Member persist in dividing the House, he would vote for the Bill. Mr. MARTIN opposed it; and contended that the majority of the Electors ofGrampound were innocent. The Noble Lord who brought forward this Bill con sidered them as innocent, and proposed to give them an equivalent somewhere.. That equivalent had not been given to them, and therefore the Noble Lord was bound to give the Bill a negative, and place Grampound in the situation in which it originally was, especially as no complaint had recently been preferred against that Borough. Mr. S. WOBTLEY defended the Bill. It was said that the present plan neither gave satisfaction to one party nor another ; he could assure Hon. Members that persons of all parties expressed their satisfaction to him, and above all things desired to be freed from the nuisance of mob elections. He hoped that, if the Bill passed in that House, there would be no exercise of influence or interest to reject it in another place. Mr. SWANN maintained that Grampound would not have been disfranchised if it had been under the controul of aristocratic influence, and expressed him self opposed to the Bill. Sir M. W. RIDLEY said a few words in defence of the conduct of Lord John Russell, in introducing the Bill. The third reading of the Bill was then carried without a division. Upon the question that the Bill do pass, Mr. TENNYSON moved as an Amendment, that a pas sage relating to the Members of the House, contained in the Preamble of the Bill, should be expun6d, on the ground that it was irregular to recogotut any specific number as constituting the Parliatr.ent. Mr. H. TWISS opposed the Amendment.• After a short conversation, in which Lord J. Ressitt.t., Mr. F. PALMER, Mr. R. SMITH, Mr. S. WORTLEY, and Mr. COURT.. NE y kilned, the Amendment was agreed to, and the Bill, as amended, passed. The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the House adjourned at Two o'Ckick. VORZ ASSIZES. —... 7 ,. • • MURDER. I ' • , William Thompson was indicted for maliciously killing his wile. The 1011 owing witnesses gave evi. deuce in si:npert of the pri ovation:. • I, Eiiza Dobson ; live.! et , about 400 yards from die prisoner's house. Oa the rorrning of the 118th el February, witite.s and her busbaril heard a mournful noise when they were in bed. At .nice o'clock that morning. the prisoner came to their house and s-tid —" a bad misfortune happened... our Betty's 'dead." Witness and her husband accompanied the prisoner home ; as they were crwsitu; the right, tile prisoner said, that Pretty had been cleaning • a delf rack down, the day before, where was a razor,'.WhiClt . she hid secreted, and with which she cut her thiv4t. When they arrived at the house, witness went up stairs, and timid the deceased laid acioss the bed, t without her clothes, having nothing but a iiigh:-cap and a piece of flannel on; her throat was cut; the prisoner never spoke; the deceased was of a remarkably cheerful disposition. Sarah Hall was fetched to the prisoner's house on the 18th of February. She went up stairs, and Found the deceased laid as described.by the. last witness; • the bed was very bloody ; f,und a shift tur: in two or three places, and the left sleeve was turned e rang side out. The shift was covered with blood ; there • was also a clean shift amongst the blankets, also bloody ; also a clean shirt, a pair of clean sheets. and a pair of pillow-cases; five of the prisonei's jackets were en the bed, and a short fustian coat, ail bloody; • found a razor on the pillow, open and bloody. There was , a man's dirty shirt on the bed, the left sleeve completely covered.with blood ; the right arm sleeve had some blood en it; in an adjoining room, there was a pair of breeches laid in a corner, with streaks of blood in the inside. Witness asked the pri:oner if his wife had slept well that night? He said, " No, not very." G. Dobson went on the morning of the murder to the prisoner's house, and saw the prisoner. He had no shirt on, and seemed pensive. Witness told him he was without a shirt. lle said, " Yes, lam ;" but gave no reason for being so. Had known him several years, and always appeared to possess his reason.— Mrs. Thompson was a cheerful woman. P. Thorpe, a labourer at Appleton, about three o'clock on Monday morning, was summoned to G. Dobson's, where he found the prisoner on his knees on the bed, praying for GOD to have mercy on him, as he was a great sinner. Witness was left alone with him about two hours; during the whole of the time he kept praying for mercy. He asked the witness if he recollected a passage of the Scripture, which said there was no mercy for a murderer? witness replied, no. About five o'clock the prisoner fell asleep; at eight, he fell out of the bed on the floor; he would not go to bed again, but walked backward and for ward in his shirt ; he soon after left him with G. Dobson. Next night, at nine o'clock he was sent for to T. Field's house; continued all the night with him, and the prisoner called him from the other two, to go up to him. He said, " I murdered my wife with a razor." Witness not wishing to hear more,. left him, and sent one of the other men to him.— The prisoner again called the witness. He repeated his assertions, and witness said, some people• thought he had done it when she was asleep, and some thought when she was awake—he immediately re plied, she was awake ; that there was a .little dif ference between them about a lost parcel. She said she had something to communicate to him, which he would not be surprised at—that was, that she was far gone with child. He turned upon her, and s ILI it was not by him ; she declared it was. At that time she was cleaning the house, and had occasion to clean down a deli' rack, on which was an old razor; she took it in her hand. It then struck his mind to take his new razor, which he did from a drawer, and hid it in his breeches pocket. He took it to bed with him. When they had got to bed, the difference kept up be tween them. He used her roughly with both hands ; she said, " Oh ! William, how am I to get this night over with you—if I get this over, how shall I get another? I have been with you all this time to bear every burden, and will bear this if you will cast it upon me." He then took hold of her and pulled her to him. She came into his arms, as loving as ever she did in her life, and threw her head back upon his shoulder. Having a fair opportunity, he took the razor which he had bid, and pressed it into her throat. Ile said it was true ; it was a pity he had not more government over himself. R. Harrison, a Surgeon, examined the body of the deceased, and found a wound in the Throat, 2; inches long, and 1 } deep; the windpipe was severed through; the edges of the wound were cleatly cut, and diffe rent from all cases of suicide he had ever heard of. In cases of suicide, the wound is generally either nearer one ear or the other; in this case, it was cut clear from one ear to the other ear. After receiving this wound, he should think she could not move her self a yard. _ _ _ The prisoner, in his defence, said it was quite a mystery to him; he was not his own man; he could give no account of it. After a minute's consultation, the Jury pronounced the verdict of—Guilty. His Lordship, in the most impressive manner, im mediately sentenced him to be executed on Monday (yesterday) and his body to be delivered to the surgeons for dissection. A horrid murder was perpetrated on Thursday, at a place called Fair Mile Bottom, about nine miles from Chichester, on the Pulborough road. A female, who had just left the service of Mr: Itudwick, •of Madehurst, was accompanied by the shepherd towards the house of her parents, who, having occas i on to fold his sheep, left her, with a promise of overtaking her; while so doing, he met a man in a sailor's dress, with two bundles, which the shepherd recognised as the property of the young woman. On demanding 'the reason of their being in the sailor's possession, he was abruptly answeied, and an altercation arising, the sailor struck at the shepherd, who succeeded by a blow of a crook in feTng him to the ground.— Tkis bring seen by Mr. ltudwick from the brow of a bill, he instantly gallopped his horse to the spur, when the man was secured, and is now lodged in jiorshain jail. The body of the female was in a hollow, with two gashes in the throat, quite dead. I I