Star. — London, England, 1817-03-04 00:00:00

pertly these circumstances, whatever else they /night prove, did not prove that there. was any great degree of irreligion in the country. On tile contrary. in his opinion, if there was any tme time at which toe danger of superstition - Was mire to be apprehended than the danger arising from the neglect of religion, it V;25 the pr.-sent. No case had been made out in the Report to justify such a step as the suspension of the habeas Corr:us; and he repeat:ll, that the exist ing laws would hive beeti . quite eulli4ieat to remedy the existing danger, had the: Executive Government d6c their duty. • The itepoit detailed no evidence. It reqi:::ed irophcit conhAeace, without exhibiting . the slightest ground .stn which tint confidence ought to rest. This was a great steal too much to expect from the Lossiships, itiore'eliechilly when such cir z comstames had miser) to shake the authority of the Report. The Noble Earl Lad. treated this part of the subjt::: as of no importance s Had not an offer • been made to &Trove at the liar the existence tithe identical Society, seLieh, according to the Report, was the centre loan which emanated the danger ? Why were ow the S:cretary of the alleged Society, and thi• Lord Miyisr and Mr. Alderman Goodbe here allowed to cone to the Bar to give evidence of the dissolution of the London Union Society this fact was not a material one in the Report, what des..rved to be so called It formed on t! of the foundatiopi one of " the features," as it might perhaps by termed in another place, of the Report. • Sh uken as that Re port was in so material a particular, Parliament Oti_ght no looser to procec .1 upon it as the ground of a Legislative measure. It was true that the Noble Earl talked of a Sheffield Union Society, and of other provincial Union Societies ; but the infrnm..tion which the Committee had obtained of these Societies was evidently of an ex-parte kind, and c• old not be much depended on, if it were considered that the same Committee asserted the existence of the Lon don Union Society, although the President and Se cretary were ready to testify that it had not met for three years. The Noble Earl had made a technical objection to his Noble Friend's motion, by saying, that as his Noble Friend did not object to the Amend ments made by the Commons in this hind, he ought to propose to put off the consideration of them. But the Noble Earl ought to know enough of the nature of the proceedings in drat House to be aware; that, however a part of any measure might not be disap proved of by any Noble Lord, a proposition, by which the whole measure might be got rid ot, al though it bore, in the first instance, only on that part, was completely fair and allowable. Feeling as he ( Earl Grey) did, that the present was the most un-! called fur attack ever made on the liberties of the people, and viewing it a most dangerous precedent w establish, if his Noble Friend pressed the question so a division, he would certainly vote with him, not h:cause he objected to the Amendments, but because he wished to get rid of t h e Bill altoge ther. As to the Amendmer.ts, their Lordships ap peared to him to be placed in a strange situation Did they know precisely in what way the people 01 Scotland were affected by the Bill The Noble and Learned Loral had said that the Bill,, when it left their Lordships' House, was precisely in the form is) which Bills of description had been passed, sod that it was better in its former than in its present shape. He (Earl Grey) must take shank to himself on this subject. He confessed, that when 1 , the Bill was before their Lordships, he had attended entirely to its principle—mischievnns and dangerous as he telt it to bea—and had not adverted to the de tails. This, indeed, be felt iris called upon to do, as the Noble Lai who opened the measure stated, that it was to be cohfiaid to Great Britain, a necessity. for it not existing in Ireland ; and he naturally sup posed that. England and Scotland would be placed, with reference to it, precisely in the same situation. As that, however, was net the case, he thought their Lordships bad a right to complain that their atteri tins had not been directed to the different 'situation in which the two countries were actually placed.— It was nothing to their Le:rdslifs that the Bill in it; original state was in the same shape as former Bills had been. The Tuition was,. whether that state was a proper state at wistful For an "explanation en this point their Lordships might seek in vain in What had fallen from the Noble and Learned Lord. The Noble and Learned Lord bad, indeed, said that the Bill was infinitely worse than before, but he had not told them to what respect it was so. Whit was' the sitisitka of toe people of Scotland by the fihll Wore it received any amendment I Was it better' brersetban that of the. people of Englaed I If woes*, why bad it bees so f If the same, would *sir present sitnatios be better t It was rumoured that the amendment would render the law altogether nugatory as it respected Scotland. If ,so, the name had a right to an explanation from the Noble and LearnedLmd of the way in which this would be the case. Tit danger in Scotland had been described to be as great as the danger in England ; and yet their Lordships were now called upon to agree to a mea sure without knowing whether or not it would be ef fectual in Scotland. Under all . thew circumstances be must think that their Lordships were placed in an extraordinary situations and if called upon to ions on,bis Noble Friend's motion lie should support it not iu hostility to the amendments, hut irons his anxiety to take every possible opportunity of getting rid of the 1311 i altogether. Lord DARNLEY said a few words in explAna. Lions after which the Noble Lord's amendment was Ilefatived without a division. rite Amendments made in the Eli) by the .House. .of Commons were then agrted co ; And a message was ordered to be sent to the House of Commons to ac quaint them thrrewrth. Earl GROSVENOR, in consideration et the late., ness of the hour,• sod the this attendance of their Lutd*hips, postponed until to-roorrow semi& his motion relative to Useless o(Sces. . The Earl of DARNLRY . referred to a recess mo da l s of his for the productios of accounts regime., tins the-qusation of Grain exported from Inlaid v au4 .sslvated to the increasing distreues of that:l gauntry, particularly the northers parts, with refs- i i tones to its supply of noes. 1 he subiect he thought, was worthy the molt serious attention of hi s Maw El, ty'aGoveransent, a be trusted, would not f a it tea receive it. The No Earl wished fer istorniatios as to the licentious of iaisters scipectiog the stoppoit of the distilleries, The E..al of LIVERPOOL could assure tb Noble Lord and the Home, that the project. of which all were aware of the importance, was in the most serious consideration of his Majesty's Govern ment, chiefly as it respected both Scotland and Ire land. With respect to the particular measure albs 'led to, be thought that, under the present circorn %m i xes, its , peration world he rather injurious than beneficial, N A it would go to throw immense advan t'ages into the hands of a few individuals, and go to ii , crease the distresses of others. The Noble Earl said a great deal of what was complained of arose from the unfavourable state of the last harvest. Tne Earl of LAUDERDALE admitted that the adoption of Vie measure in question would tend to throw immense pr , fits into the hands of a few indi • viduals ; yet, in another point of view., he did no: think it would be au tnded with those disadvantages which the Noble Earl contemplated ;.and fibserved, it 'would be for the interest of such persons to give the highest prices for the best grain. The Earl of DARNLEY spoke shortly is expla nation. He felt the question of ra much importance, that he should deem it his duty, ere lung, to subinit some propositions on the subject to the I.Luse. Adjourned till to-morrow. HOUSE OF COMMONi. Lord LASCELLIIS po,tponed his motion relative rn the alte ration of the Pont Lawi,aa arrtting the Proprietori of Mine,- 1114 I .ordship did not fix any day for brit:ging till II • nuonur , bl't Wished it to be positively untirr.tood that he would brittg it on this Session, as he portputied it merely in eutnpLNutew2h PAC ral application* which bad Isom mule to Lim by bevtrai praprti tors of mine,. Mr. BENNETT rationed, it Thursday, the 13th !mt. Ma motion reqn..ct Mg the appointment of Mr. Herrin. I Lord SLANI.kty prr•ented a Petition truth the IMianitants of Roythn, ntainst the Habeas eorptit,Suspenaitin Bill, which was read and ordered to Ile on the tattle. A new Writ war ordered tur the Election of a Burgess tonne in this Ptirliaintin fur the Borough of Tavistock, in the roortrof I.ord John CANN ACT. Sir E. KNATCHBULL rose to call the atten tion of the House to the Bill which had been intro duced by an Honourable and Learned Gentleman (Sir S. Rontilly), fur the repeal of the Game Act of last year. As he thought that the total repeal of that Act would be productive of many serious incon veniences, he wished, that instead of the Bill tot the total repeal of the Act, there should be introduced one which would repeal the objectioniLle parts of the Act, while it would modify and continue in force the beneficial provisions of it. It woad' certainly be very proper to impose the penalties of the Act of last year against persons going erased at night for the purpose of destroying game. As he did not antici pate any objection to such a Bill, he moved for leave to bring in a Bill for the prevention of going armed at night for the purpose of destroying game, and for repealing the Act of last year, relating to Rogues and Vagabonds. —The motion was agreed to, and the Billbrouightiiiand read a fitst time. Sir E. RNATtH BULL then said, that he did not intend to hurry the . Bill throu,4ll the Heuse s and', therefore would not appoint a very early day for the second reading. Sir S. ROMILLY hoped that the Bill would be read a second time on some early day, as it would be very improper that the Game Act of last year, which it was on all hands agreed should be repealed,, should be allowed to remain in force when the up proaching Qaarter Sessions commenced. The 2d reading was then fixed for Wednesday neat. 1 Mr. M. FITZGERALD rose to move for some papers relative to the Fisheries of Ireland. From the experience of the existing laws, relative to ,the. Fisheries, he said it was quite clear that so lo ng es they continued in torte, no proper fishery could be ezptcted on the coasts of Ireland. He said his mind was so completely made up am this subject, that un less some of his Majesty's Ministers brought tor wasif sonic measure relative to it, be would himself find it is duty soon to cell the attention of the House to it. He then moved that these be laid before the House copies of the Reports. made to the Irish House of Commons in 178* and 1785, relative to the Irish Fisheries.—The motion was agreed to. Mr. COURTNEY (at the request of Mr. M. FVUOIJIALU) s agreed to postpone the second reading of the Irish Grand Juries Bill till such time as it should be convenient fair the Irish Members to attend. LASCASIOMB PETITIOX. Mr. WILBRAHAM BOOTLErose for the pur pose of presenting a Petition, numerously signed by the Magistrates, Clergy, Freeholders, and other inha bitants of the Hundred of Blackburn, ib the County Palatial: of Lancaster, expressing their abhorrence of the conduct of those who, under the mask of Reform, were eadeavouriog to subvert the Constitution—who had emissaries at work all over the kingdom,. eadea souring, by every art, to inflame the populace, and stir them op to acts of violence, and carrying about Petitions seedy made for the purpose of procuring' the people by any means to sign them. The Peti tion prayed the House not to consider that the feel ings of the great body of the people were expressed in such Petitions. The Honourable Gentleman then stated that the Meeting at which this Petition was agreed to, was most numerously and respectably at tended, and that it might be considered as expressing , the sentiments of the great body of the inhabitants. ot Lancashire. He then mentioned that this Meeting was first appointed to be held in the Town Hall at Preston, but that on the day fixed for its taking' , place, the Hall.doors were no sooner opened than a great body of the populace rushed in and filled the Hall, to the exclusion of the more respectable part of the people ; and that when the place or assembly was tints filled, an Address was agreed to, which was quits contrary to the general feeling of the' people. He moved that the Petition be brought up. This Petition was then brought up and read, ' On the question that it should lie on the table, Lord STANLEY protested against its being sup.' posed that this was the petition of the people of Lan. cubit., or that it expressed the sentiments of any other persons belonging to that county than those by whom it was signed.- Ho did not mean to deny that the meeting at which this petition was agveed to, was composed of very respectable persons, but be could Laid, say that be bad never heard of that meeting, nor did he understand that there had been any other public meeting of the itsbabitants of Laucisshire than that other mentioned by-the Honourable Gonti e lp an , I He therefore could not understand why this petition as to be coesideted as that of the County of law erste( is peers!. The other impedes; so fns, from being composed of the lowest of the populac e , was most numerously and respectably attended; it was', the piblic meeting of the county. held pursuant to a requisition signed by the High Sheriff of the county end the Address agreed to at it was signed by the High Sheriff. The House would therefore judge, whether that Address or this Petition was to be c,n sidered as containing the most t iir expression of the sentiments of the people of Lancashire in gtneral. He had not the slightest uhlection to the present pc , titian being laid on the table. Mr. CAWTHORN maintained that this petition expressed the sentiments of by far the greater parr ot the people tit Lanzaslote ; and c•alf•iimed the. 1 statement made by his I - I-now:able Friend (Mr. Wil lbraham) as to the other meeting. Tne Hall at which then other meeting was held was alirinq entirely tiled by people of the lowest order, and the Ad.ir:ss era. gin Airy moved there was rejected, and an amend. ment to it moved, and carried by the majority. It ' would be great injustice to the greet body of the Ipeople of Lancashire to consider such an Address as 1 e:ipressive of their feelings s an Address carried at a meeting of the lower Indus., who, he endesstood, i were harangued by a mischievous person of the name of Casey, an Irish renegado—(llear, Lair, and crier of Order, from the illoceition)—Le was rot afraid to repeat it—an Irish tenegedo and a jacobin•-• (Hear, h:ar, wed Order).-.What the amecdmert was he did i not exactly !crow, but he was sure it did not s:seek 1 the f,•elings of the freeholders of Preston ; and he i would venture to say, that there were not twenty , Itreeholderi who voted for it, although it was carried. "lhe petition now before the House, on the colitraty., i was agreed to at a numerous and most respectable ' meeting of the Magistrates, Clergy, and Freeholders, and he would pledge himself that it spoke the feel ings of the great majority of the inhabitants tit the County of Lancaster. Mr. BROUGHAM said, it had often been ob served, that to be praised by him who is the object of all men's commendations is seldom the lot of any one, even of the most deserving. Certainly it had not been the lot of that worthy man, Mr. C asry.— But a more respectable member of the commercial world, in which he long was, did not exist on 'Change, or in any other place wh.:re commercial men are in the habit of meeting. He certainly had been unfortunate. but so far from thinking his inis fortunes any cause of reproach, he ( NU. 8., ugharo) thought they ought rather to have t.cr...ened him from the attack of the Honourable Geode:um. Whether thatGentkman had acted a mischievous part on the occasion alluded to, depended on the optaion which each single man might have formed. as to the princi. pies of which Mr. Casey had been a" poaerlol and so successful an advocate, for powerful he certainty was, and his success could not be denied; for it he had not beau successful, his name would nit have been mentioned in the titute this night. But to call him a renegado—(//ear, hear, hear, fro,: the (Wm tifion) was so monstrous, and would be so inconve nient, if applied to all those who left Ireland, or, who left their principles— (hear, Lear, hear), that he really wondered very much that the honourable Member for Lancashire, with all his Parliamentary experience, should have used such language. Such an attack upon an individual for whom he (Mr. Brougham) would here s chtim praise for his uniform, consistent, and manly conduct in public (and in pri vate life his character was not loss praiseworthy), was. to say the least of it. very extraordinary. Nat Ives extraordinary was the attack made upon the meeting at Preston, because the Address, which was then agreed to, did not meet the wishes of the Mover and Seconder of the original Address. He spoke from good infdrmation when he said that that meeting at Preston bad been most numerously and respectably attended. And if the Address agreed to at it was not signed by twenty freeholders, as the Honourable Gentleman had rashly, and as he (Mr. Brougham) thought, erroneously asserted, then the High Sherd had acted a boost extraordinary part in signing that Address. His (Mr. Brougham's) au thority, without meaning any disrespect to the Hon. Gentleman, west as high as the authority of that Hu nourable Gentleman s and, as to a question of tact, was worthy of as 'rat credit, and 'lion* it he Affirmed that the meeting at which the Address bad been agreed to, wai numerously and respectably attended ; and that the Address was agreed to by a great Wk. jurity of that meetiag, and she proof of this was, that the High Sheriff had affixed his name to that Address— s (Rear, hear.) • Mr. BAKING observed, that the Rome was lia ble to be imposed on by petitions, signed by the lowest rabble, .and . purporting to express the sense of a great proportion of the people of different counties— (Near, hu.) He therefore thought it highly desir able that there should be some Legislative enactment to regulate County Meetings, called for the purpose of petitioning Parliament, u he knew himself several instances in-whish a few active and mischieious iii cubism were going abbut collecting signatures from the lowest rabble, to Petitiims drawn up by them selves, and purporting to be agreed to at numerous and respectable Meetings of the inhabitants of Coun ties—(Hear, hear.) The right of petition would be best secured by some Legislative enactment, to pre vent such impositions. Mr. BIRCH denied that the Petition no* before the House could be considered as expressing the sen timents of any greater part of the people of Lancashire than those who signed it, who were not all, but some ; of the magistrates, cl e r g y, f ree h o ld ers , an d ot h ers, of : the Hunched of Blackburn. Now lie would be plat! to know how many of those others were .. • • cotton-spinners, and such like,o j•ltirricytneo th7C: l l7 ( in is a rc s •t t O r e s , , I d rum uac!. them sign by dint, perhaps, Mr. Cawthorn.) The Honourable Gentleman the,: i spoke in favour of the character of Mr. Casey, %%hid) i is vindicated from the imputations a the HO. • ' 1e I . ....)arau Gentleman (.Mr. Cawthorn.) Mr. WILBRAHAM BOOTLE explained. The Petition was then ordered to lie on the table. pßplol.ki, zeATE slit. HORNER. • Lord M in rising to mo ve th a t• a ne w writ be issued for the election of a Member for the Borough of St. Manes, in the room of the. late . Francis Horner, Esq. believed that he might'lle al lowed (although it might perhaps be rather an un usual cMuse) to trespass for a short while on the time of the House—(lhar, hear.) He said unusual, be cause, without instituting any comparison, he wished tO say a few, words as to the character.of his departed friead—(Neer, hear. hear.) That Gentlemkri hav ing been fax some time unable, 'from bad health, to apply to the labours of his profession, or to hie I'ar liamentary duties, wen induced to try the effect of . milder climate. But the hope failed, and the remedy was unavailing. He fell A victim to a langoishine dis.e.e. Yet, under the pressure of heavy indisno.i. t i m e he preserved ited•rrenishrd the serenity et i 'cram, and the vie our aild firmness of his milli. It he (Lied Misrp: th) nt:plit he petreitted, wittioto traveling to. far into OA: path of private lite, to Ile lice titcoe virtues which embel.:i.hett the private cha , ratter of his it lent', he might say, that :IS a son no I as a brother, he was the most exemplary —as aft tend, the most faithful and kind. These ware view.: which I e knew could not come within the coesidere thin of - the House ; but when they were (as in thin case) interwoven with a public clic :icier, they becarna etabhe propt•ry—(Erar. hear.) But as to the pull;.. character of his friend, lie might confidently app, ~ to that profession- of which he had been se eitte• et:ivied an ornament—he might appeal to this House. where he was alweys heard with feeli ng , c r admiration— (Hear, hear, hear, from €t I tides of th e Howe.) He might be allowed rectal!) , to say, that he had raised the edifice of his owe fair fumy on tie firm basis of rectitude and conscientious honour. Ar dent its the pursuit of trtrh—tealous in the cause re' buumeity, he was inflexible in that of punier ; and the expression of his opini , •ns in this house, he em. played that citable and simple, but at the same time, nervous and affecting style, which seemed toe in. bine the fame and precision of legal *regiment with Ithe irfinemeist and elegance of philosophy. It would nut be necennaty for him tri say any dell as to his political opinions, to conciliate or 'to prosoke ob. ser-ations from Members on the other side of the Heuse—( Hear, hear.) But lie was sure, that what ever tlifferetice there might have been in their pr- Ltical opinions. it must now be forgotten—.(Hare. h ear , h ear .) They would allow that the man ah. se Liss ttey now depiored, had carver, by au) means, armed at undue popularity—(H.7or, hear. hear.)-- It would be allowed that the expressit•ii A his opi. nions, however manly and devil: d. was never tinc tured with any thing like I,e:urinal ii.veclivr. (Aar.; And yet, successful as his exertions had bet a in that House and elsewhere, considering the contracted span of his life, they could early be considered as the liar. liiitgers of his future fame—as off rding ar earnest of what was to be expected from the maturity of his talents. But al as ! his cart er was prematurely closed.. His death was a lush to his family. a loss to his friends, ' a fuss to his country, in any times i f no ordinary magnitude, but in times like the ;resent must severely to be eel,. He had studied the b ructure i 1 our Con. oitution, and deeply contt:nplated ever) branch of the polsecs el hes countiy, sometimes with the view of exposing its dt Teets, and sometimes to point out its iierfectiutis. Amidst the deepness of our sorrow for such a loss, it was SOW Coll3olAtitn to think, that a min not possessed of hereditary tank or fortune. should, by his own talents, be able to vindicate to himself a situation in sactety, of which th. se barn to the highest honours and the greatest wealth mutt have been proud. (Hear, hear ) The Noble Lord concluded amid chests horn alt parts of the House, by beggiug•pardon, not for havine introduced the sub ! ct, but for having done it su iineerftctly. He then moved .• That a new Writ be issued for the electian ‘,/ a Member to serve in the present Parliament for the Borough of St. Masse., is the room of Francis Horner, Esq. deceased." ' Ms. CANNING.—Of all the cases in which that course had been pursued which his Noble Frieud had entered upon this night, and u hich he had gone through with so much elosetence and g. od taste, be. could I ecollect no inst once its which it could be so sore to conciliate the good will of Members on all sides of the House—(Hear, hear, hear.) He (Mr. Canning) had not the happiness of the personal and private ac. quaintance of him whose loss they now lamented— he knew him only in ibis House ; and for the ris e n last years he had not the good fortune to witness Is:: more splendid and mature efforts. But he had a:- aay s admired the learning and acuteness which Is displayed—hi. temperate and manly eloquence—de genuine warmth of his feelings, when into warmth la was bera)ed—and, added to all these. the modesty with which he bore his faculties, which, accompanied by that firmness and bononr which were so conspe. cuous in his character, cenciliated e.e good-will, and commanded the respect of all, whether in the die charge of his profeel.nal or P.oliementai y dirties— (aster, hear.) He could nut conclue:e without adop ting the oeservatien of Isis Noble Friend, that it would he ungracious to nee any remembrance of differences in political opimens well the ether feelings erei:ed os tf.is eccasion. But When he heard this 11Jrough now for the second time brought forward at vacate by the loss of splendid talents, he ought, as some consnlai tion for ,the theoretical defects of our Coustitieite. sbew that it worked well when it sent into this Hem men who, gifted by nature with high tams. ?Mgr.: these have en opportunity of developing or matures . these. so as to be.:ome the sustainers of the couticus and of the glory o• t' air counny —(11w, hree,itar.) Mr. MANN E kL3 ;.u . r . r(iN said, that i: h .d been his fortune for several years to have enjoyed the `t:- vale friendslhp of that distinguished men, whose lets the House and she Country had now to•deplore. N o change of cirentristances could diminish the regard, the rove:fence, the affection, which he felt for dad e:• teenier man. What V•eNable Lied had 40 elocoei".7 st.oed would enalilie the House to appreciate more 1 doeply the loss whi.h it had sustaintd. It was tie: • • l ady to the.e timer, !vein all times, that the loss d such a combination of integrity and of :-*.ents was a evere public calamity—(Hear, hear; hear.) Ti.' ii;eht Heneurable G.ntleman who spoke last i '" 1 1 .1meri'od that ho did not kno a the private chmetche iof Mr. Horner; bu: tere was no man who did Ott i itpuw parr is private life, who had not witnessed tlu m.:ny •vit tuts that adorned his private life, that geed guess what a chains be had left its the circle of his friends. There never lived a man of whom it coed more truly- be said, that where he was known in pa tio lite he was respected and admired—in private life tie was esteemed and loved. He was anxious that the House should hear him say these few words. I s 4. discharge of a debt, nut so much of go&tude as c• justice, to the memory of so dear a friend—(Cian from all /welt of the House.) Mr. C. W YNNE.—Atter what have he , n o loodr said, he was afraid it might appear prestenruouste: any one to say more. His Noble Friend had dwelt with the feeling natural to every friend of Mr. 14T' user on his. character, whieh exhibited the rare lehmq . of carrying all the sun:intl and gentleness of feclisr ?AC whiel t p ilt:::_ir i :: : :;:p l e, i a.i c tli, Sir linPP' wit!) i wordi v . :nue hl (= him. ' the 1 mind anti Tot the i pra t cnar meth untie d: Pei years F rcas count OA grcat hem , trt:if ti c_icce him. :wait kid b ntch rapid str w hti u :v i c g s ae h . edtica kind- becal that riti , e (Ilea MI • coulJ oildir OM 11 nun) Edict his el urnat to wl sisini u tiro been limit yet f Erect ('Au Mr howl come , liimst ; to the snetitt ever i 1 on or to tic; count )(45. au the the E Ado' pendt If to be ag a loss iris pt riend Heal Li IPu e cl :pre ho I ad i e p i come i har le k t 70 MI Esch ethic! recei Stocl telly sew JIM 'cite c cipit. Gent nut u ' 11 aid, Wei I, Li tt r trop 4 O lei TI in AL to l e 1 for LI hid all d tiou be it M 1144 Paid *Plot the f T tom all.