Star. — London, England, 1803-03-10 00:00:00

o , Sir, after the II atensents of my-Right Hon. Friend near me, in which he has called the attention of the Houfe to the communication which his Majefit Las been gracioufly pleated to lay before Parlia r , 'meat, I fhould have little to obferve, did I not feel it smell:try to allude to a part of what has fattest from the Hon. Gentleman who (poke left. In al. moll every ohfervation which has been made by the Hon. Gentleman I perfectly concurs but I beg leave to fay, that there is one point, and one only, which appears to me to have been millaken by the Hon. Gentleman. My Right Hon. Friend, in al luding to the caufes of his Majefly's Meffage, the .very cnnfiderable military preparations carrying On in the ports of France and Holland, and the difcuflions of great importance fubfilting between pis Majefly and the French Government, did not confider them altogether as barely forming fuffi ,cient grounds for the concurrence of the Houfe in the Addrefs of Thanks. My Right Hon. Friend felt himfelf jußified in thinking, that either of tilde two grounds was fitfficient to induce the Houle to ".ssOtee to the Addrefs ; but he went further, and declared his opinion, that both of them combined, conftituted powerful reafons for proceeding fur ther, and for adopting meafures of circumfpec. tion, vigilance, and precaution, adequate to the fituation of affairs, and fuited to every poflible exigency. I agree with the Hon. Gentleman op pofite to me, that the Addrefs cannot commit the Houfe, nor any Member who may vote for it ; and it mull be obvious that it does not go to reftrie the fentiments of any Gentleman, with re. (pelt to the confideration of queftions which (hall be brought forward hereafter. Should, howev.r, the differences now exilling between this country and France, in the difthflions mentioned in his Maj e ft y's Meffage, unfortunately lead to the renewal of war, I think it incumbent on me, clearly and explicitly to hate, that it will become the duty of Minifters to lay before the Houfe all the caufes of theie dif ferences, alt the motives by which they have been actuated in the line of conduct they have purfued, and all the fatisfaeory information, even in its molt minute details, which can be obtained. In bringing forward this information, I with to be fully underftond that his Majefty's fervants are not defirous of confining themfelves to the imme diate caufes of fuch an event; but that they will eagerly court a complete inveftigation of their condue from the conclulion of the definitive trea ty to thelateft moment Of peace. I am confident it will appear, after fuch 'an enquiry, that not a (Ingle all has beet done by' therm of which they can have conk to repent. But while, Sir, I take this opportunity of expreffing my fatisfaElimi that the enquiry fhould lie intlituted, I mull 1 ire my conviCtion that there is at prefent no caufe for par ticular inveftigation, and that no advantage what clCT can arifc• from difclofing any circumflanccs conneEted with , .the important difcuflions which fubfifi betwwn his . Majeity and the Government of France. It is unneeelfary for me, Sir, totrouble Tons any longer, ead'lttell conclude with obferv msg. that tits Adarefi'pledges the Honfe to no dung, but to the •refolotion. that they will always concur with his Majetly in fupporting the honour of hiscrown and the effential intereftanf his per ple." Mr. Wiwi:mem allured the Houk he had to: in tention to claim its attention long. He agreed with an Hon. Gentleman who (poke before him, that the Honfe was put into rather an hard fittia-' Con, becaufe it wps called u pon to aft in the dal k; he did not think it was fufficient for the Herae to ire told that hereafter they (hall be in pa - el:lion of the ground on which the prefent proceeding was propofed. The Houfe-ought to be in a lituation where it might have come knowledge of events, in a crifivfoconfnlerable; the Houfe ought to know fornething upon this fubiea, inked of proceeding tpon-aluillityrof-infiumation ; for-upon this mat ter which now occupied its molt ferious attention, the Houfe knew literally nothing; it was told only in general terms, that exertions are neceffary.— The Houfe indeed knew that very confiderable ar maments had been tfiade,and a great change made in the fyftem of what was called Peace. He mull therefore enter a fpecies of Protefl againfi the Iliac now adopted, the neceffity, being in his opinion. fuch as to call for it, and requiring exer tion : that the force propofed to be' ufed fhould be Vied merely as defence; now all fpecies of force might be fo ufed. efpecially in the firft inftance, bat it-was here bribe IA importance. when great force waa.necelrary, to know what that force was, becaufe prudence might-require force of different forts in different circuntfiances: there was tome' that was in its nature defenfive. and defenfire only; that mull be the cafe of the Militia; but for the interpretation of the prefent vote, nothing more need be faid. than that the Hook concurred in it. They pledged themfelves to nothing Itnt that which had been already Rated. and in that no man could have any difficulty. Here he fhould have ended,if it had not been tor tome oblervations made on the other fide of the Houle. It wai faid, on a former.ocealion, by an• Hon. Gentleman, (Mr. Fox) that Peace was his policy and fira (faid Mr. Windharit) and that War was mine. la I am, at prefent, in no fiate to fay, I can be in no 'late to fay. whether War would be expedient or not? if it were necerfary to come to an opinion. no conclufion could be drawn from the coquet of thole who were the molt vehement oppofers of the Peace, what their opinion would be now. That they flinulcl be luppoled to be glad of what was now propofcd, that they exulted in it, would catch with impatience at WIT prof; ea at the reoesval.of the War, would he a conclufion as fit& in melon ing, as unfounded in feet." The very reverie was the faa ; he who was a vehement oppofer of the Peace of Amiens, %silo had no reafon now to alter the opinion be gore then, hpt abotadant realms to, adhere to it, might neverthtlefs not conclude now' that war could be made with advantage; be might think otherwrfes in Pr2PAnirl: i n the "" 111.111111 1 his mind at the time he did oppofe the Peace. He !night Fe the leis ready to catch at War now than he w as th en , beeanfe he might be of opinion that we had 101 l the opportunity which might have been then afforded, and therefore Perfects entertaining the opinions which he did, would coafider this as a very ferious matter. An Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Fox) had often (aid, that Do evils mold be Rated which Were Onwal le the evils of War. He be lieved that it now began to be futpeaed, perhaps felt, that there were dangers in Peace as well at in War, and they might go on as rapidly too in that date as the evils of War, anti might lead a Country into that (late in which no War could flop them. Now he would beg leave to obferve to the Noble Lord who (poke Taft, that there was a double refponfibility attached to a Minifter—that °Croaking an improper Peace, and alto that of making an improper War ; the danger of the one might in fome cafes, be equal to the danger of the other. Configning this, as he did, completely to his Majefty's Miniffers, he could only remind them of their refponfibility, and that it applied to either fide, the alternative of Peace or War. Mr. Stl ERMAN rote after Mr. Windham, and raid, that finding the Houfe unanimous in its dif pofition to fupport the Addrefs, although trivial dißinEtions had been taken as to the grounds on which it ought to be fupported, he thoold have been well content In have 'given hi, fluent vote of approbation to it, but for fome fentiments and exprellions in the fpeech of the Right Honour. able Gentleman who had jun fat down, which (truck him as the molt extraordinary and repre henfible he had - ever heard in Parliament. The Right Hun. Gentleman had appeared to day in a (late of new and tunifual anxiety, to deprecate the idea that he and thofe who had thought and bed with him, becaufe they had been avowedly honile to the peace, and therefore avowedly for the.con• tinuation of the war, (hould now he other%%ili: eonfidered than as the men the mon zealoufly dif-1 pored to maintain the peace. Nay, the Hon. Gentleman had gone farther, for he had main tained that thofe who had condemned the peace , on his principles were peculiarly entitled to the credit of being the perfons now moil ri.luaant to the renewal of war. Mr. Sheridan faid he would not now pante to examine the continency of this claim, if compared with the Hon. Gentleman's former declarations on this fubjet ; but he called on the Houfe to look at the argument fet up this day. We that oppofed the peace, raid the Ho. nourable Gentleman, mut} be prefumed to he the perfons molt relitaant to renew the war, becaufe our Itrongett motive and argument for condemn. ing the peace was, that it left us no means of re lenting future injuries, or on whatever provoca tion, of renewing future hoilility. But he went 1 1 further hill, tor he declared that even if our ex. thence as a nation was the qiieftion, the peace had left us without abilita to meet the conteft. This pufillanimous doarine Mr. Sheridan reprobated in terms of animated indignation (aarnapasiied Zy 4plauding cheer: from allparte sfehelioufs.)" What, air, he laid, is this language to hold at fuch a moment. as •he prefent I have beard, indeed, that the FUR Conful of France has modeftly pro claimed to the raffia thrones of Europe, that England is no longer able to contend tingle handed with France—hut I did not expea to hear this fen timent rc and acquiefced in by a Member of the Britith Parliament."—(Lowf rtad Ja w ., cry of bear! hear!)—Mr. Sheridan proceeded to fay, that whateni were the motives of that new rein lance t , war. o t hich teemed fo fuddenly to have teic.d the Right Hon. Gentleman, his reluc tance could not he more amen and fincere than his two was. He deprecated war from every feeling of h's heart, and every fuggettion of his realm'. He adjured Minifters to try to their ex tent what temper, what conciliation, what even concelEon, without forfeiture of honour, cpuld do; but if all there fincerely attempted fhould fail, and the dire necenity of renewing the war fhould be forced on us, he would not endure for a moment to be told, that the energies of the country were fo eshaufted, that we had no courfe left but fubmif lion. No, he trotted that in fpite of the audacious boaft of the Firft Cantu!, that it would be mani felted to him, and even to the Right Hon. Gen tleman, that there were ftill left fpirit and refounces in &kith hearts, not merely to protea thesxy/eare of their country, but to avenge the flightellinfuk upon its honour. He trolled that the Marian example let that day by the fir(l of his Majelly's fubjeas voSold be eantidered as a fignal to every other fubjea throughout the Britilh dominions—a fignal that they limpid feel the importance of the crdis, that they mould, like him, lay afide all per tonal confiderations, and even all public confideta. thins of Infer intereft, in order to meet with for titude auJ unanimity, the peril of that fituation, whatever it (hall become, which holt ile and inlatiate ambition may place us in, and which our modera tion and forbearance have not been able ro avert. Mr. Wiegman pbferveyl. in explanation, that. his natements did not warrant the inferences drawn from them by the Right Hon. Gentleman. Mr. Caionrito." Sir, the Right Hon. Gen tleman has told as, that in the event of a war, he will lay before the Houfe the funle(l information concerning the ccmdua purfued by his Majefty's Mishkin. But he has not told us, that under any other eircumftances, fuch a communication will be made to the Houfe. There appears to be no intention of communicating the grounds of the pre terit alarm, which has Rotten the country to its very foundation ; and pervaded all ranks of pet:). ple. Not the lean idea has been given as to the Naval fituation in which we (land. This, I fay, is hard dealing with a generous people, who have a right to know fomething more than has been cam:mole:tied. The people in genetal have (hewn a readinefs to adopt the (mignon' of the Govern ment f and thole feelings of loyalty and attach ment (booth not be met by a greater degree of re ferve than the moll defpotic Government ever maintained. Conlidering the anxiety with which the event we are now debating upon, is 'oohed up to by the public ; I contend it isnot a proper mode of proceeding for Minillers. to avoid all explana tion concerning it." The Cnaticastoa of the Excasemea rote to explain. The Right Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Canning) bad affumed, that no communication was to be made by his Majelly's Milliners, but un der the alternative of war; but be bad forgot to late what was the fa& that no pledge had been liven to the contrary. For his own part he thought it due to the fituation which he held. as well as to his feelings, to fay, that he difdained the rererve imputed to him ; a refer re witch never fhould take place when communication prover continent with his Linty, and the public intereft. Mr. GRIIIVILLE—It does not appear that any difference of opinion is likely to take mace arm the addrefs now before the Houle ; I !hall, these fore, trouble the Houfe with very-few words. I apprehend that my Right Hnn. Friend has beer mifconccived ; he appeared to me to alk, whetli-i it was in the alternative of a war only, that Mi nitters meant to make communications to the Houk concerning their concha ? and the aufwei he has received, has ferved fill more to judify ltim in putting that quellion. N.) m Ili has a eleatCl objeaion than I have, to a difcuffinn that can in any manner retard the refolinion of this night.— I confefs, however, that I feel a great degree of embarraffment, from the (late of ignorance in which the Honk is placc-: ; and I cannot hell thinking that the vote now propofed, although it pledges the Houfe to nothing, mutt tole a great deal of its effed from that very date of ignorance, and that the advantage of it is confiderably leifen ed in confequence of its being f, little c.mnected with what may te called tangible opinion. No man can be more eager than myfeif, to carry up to the foot of the Throne the fentiments contained in that addref, ; and my mind is Kill more recon ciled to it, becauft I Junk the meafures of vigour now about to be adopted, will be more likely than any other to produce kiting tranquillity. The Ai-roamer GENERAL concurred with all the Hon. Members who had previoufly fpoken, that the Addrefs did not pledge the Houfe to any thing beyond a general a ff urance of a determina. tion to fupport every meafure, the objed of which was to flipper? the honour of his Majefly's Go. vernment, and the fecurity of his dominionr. He was rather furprited at hearing fume Gentlemen' inlilling fo much on the neeetlity of explanation He really did not fee that the Houfe were hardly dealt with in having no fpecific explanation given of the grounds of an Addrefs, which, in fall, pledged them to nothing but what their generalkluty. to their Sovereign and their country fully war ranted His Majelly had informed the Houk that' very confiderable preparations were going on in I , the ports of France and Holland, and that addi tional preparations were in confequence neceffary. This general affurance was a fufficient ground of primary proceeding, and further explanation was in the firft inftance totally unneceffary. The ex i ftente of points of difpute is known, and the ado!). tion of thefe meafures of preparation might acce• lerate the adjunment of thole differences, and in this view explanation was equally unneceffary to induce Members to agree to the Addrefs. Expla nation under the prefent circumftances might pro duce confequences much to be deprecated, without at all affining the Houk, on coming to a decifion on the motion for the Addrefs. Mininers, in the event of the termination of the negociation, on a renewal of hollilities, had pledged themfelves to give a full explanation, and with this affurance the Houk ought to remain fatisfied. But an Hon. Member (Mr. Canning) had accufed Mininers of refuting to give explanation in cafe the matters riow in difpute were amicably adjured. Now, it wag certain that Minifters had made no fuch ar fertion. Whether it might be politic to afford this explanation under filch circumftancee. would de. pend on points with which Minifters could not bit be the ben acquainted, and, therefore, mon cam, Me of forming a judgment. But whether they . afforded the explanation or not, the right of Mem bers to move for h was not in the leak degree ag. fettled. Every Member might move for what ea planation he conceived to be requifite ; and if the Houfe entered into his views, he would have full fatisfaftion. An Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Wind ham had raid a good deal of the calamities refulta ing the Definitive Treaty of Peace, and par ticularly the inability to which it had reduced us of renewing hoftilities with anyprofpea of advantage. On this point he - differed radically with the Hon. Gentleman. He was difpofed to think that the opiiissadf doe artistry in favour of a war was t bell pledge of its being carried on with fpirit and fuccefs. Ifett*tionately the negociations pending betwixt thetsiq gOvernmentiOtouldbe broken off without itniabliridjultment. and if Minifters fhould be tible Kftaaviiencit the Houk antitheCoun try that iallead of provoking hollilities, they had made every faerifice thou of difhosour tsprociire the continuance of peace, he had neit'aie !linnett doubt that the country would cordially go along with them in profecuting the war, and he had ho difficulty in flating that he entertained no dread of the remit of fuch a conten. The unanimity and the energy of the people would fully make up for the fupenor number and ftrength of the enemies with whom we might have to contend. He mulled that the' condo& of Government would be found diftinguifbed by a proper continuation of tempe rance, moderation and firmnefs. To the continu ance of peace they would look forward with anxi ous defire, and to the unfortunate renewal of hof tilities without unmanly dread. The Right Hon. Gentleman, after infilling at fume length on this topic, and ftrongly recommending unanimity, fat I down by giving his cordial vote for the motion. . Dr. Lawasacs rote *min a general cry of tetlion, Ouxylion.—As loon as he could obtain a hearing, he proceeded to notice the obfervations 'which fell from the Right Hon. and Learned Gentleman who had preceded him in the debate, particularly thofe which related to the (objets of it:spoil. now under difcuffion between the two Go vernments. 'l'hefe, he contended, although not publicly announced in that Houle, might be fo Rated, that no difference of opinion amid stile as to the propriety of making them the matter of contention; for. in hh view of the cafe, that was a preliminary confideration for the public to decide upon, before it plunged itself, and all Europe, mot probably, into a war, more ardent, more deftrue five, and more mifchievous in its effe&s, than any that ever defolated the antient or modern world. He could not certainly call upon Miniiters to diC dote. at prefent. any matter unfit. in this Rage of the bufmefs. for the public eye ; but ho waited to be informed, whether they did intend to difclofe thefe fubjeas at any time? It was not the habits of either his Majetly's Minden who are now in ' Wese r os thure trtho preecZed tlie*l, to he very commtinica:ive upon any ftilijeei ; and he he did not very ardently antici7.itte any (+Wet:ince of eonchil now. But, wh u.es et rule of prt•cedu:e they miitrltt adopt, it wai his e twin npinion, that tie public would not cndir conc.l.).!t future. Thzy molt ard 1./ , ght *nsi fat: aeon what grounds ur uron a• s molt go war, noel t;.•% or called tti on. atter fie% to main• t tin a cow:ea t;:c i.spetire re f their t-eal;:•e, 'heir happinefs, tnd their Wind. It v.ias very titre, and he trolled it was an irlerect pi inciple :T1 Engliflimen, net to he ea; prorntnied to hot: n tr he eartiy led to forego their quiet. .\t the fame tim: he was as certaia, thay, when -ince roofed. they were not to he trampled pn w•di the vain boasting of any power upon earii, ti-ir yet to be tertitied with the extent of ft ray 4:mi influence tl..tt power might pallet:; Its Far be coincided ith an Honourable Gentle man ( We-. Sheridan) who had c!..prei:ed the fame fentiments. But when the duly confide:TO the contemience of ritifilig thz I,f filch a na tion as this, they would agree with him, that no thing fhuet of the molt fultilanti.cl reafons Mould be 0161ted to pitingc it into fl:ch a war as lie dc ferihed. There wits no man, in or out of that Houle, who more ardently &fired peace than he did ; and, paradoxical as it might appear, there was no man who calculated lea upon the certainty of that of Amiens than he did ; and concerned was he to fay, that the events and the cirettmllances . - occurring that very night jultified his anticipations. His arguments againit that peace were, that it was not to be depended upon. Peace was his obje#, it was his molt zealous wills ; and as the motion pi' this nigbt, by a prompt and vigorous preparation for war . (and vigorous he hoped it would be) mult tend more to accomplifh a filed, lasting, and cer tain peace, indead of a dubious, furpictous, and dangerous one, he would rapport it in common with his friends around him, who were the home friends of an honourable as well as a permanent Peace. The quellion on the Addrefs was then pawned carried new. ton. It was agreed to, on the motion of the Coat. ce L Loa of the Exc H EQoEa, thit the Addrefs (hoed be prefented to his Majefty by fuch Members As Were of his Majefty's Privy Council. 'MC CH AtICE LLOII of theEzcHeg,,EL gave Tlo6Cie that in the Committee, of Supply on Ft idry next, he thould propofe a vote of ten thoufAnd Seamen ? in addition to the number already voted for I.bc fervice of the prefent year. • IRISH RIVSIIVI PSIMTVATIOIIIIIII.Ia The Order of the Day for the Houk =falai itfelf into a Committee on the above- I R .lIIPS read, Mr. CORRT obferked;tharhe rote TO hillbritrthet Houle, That, fince he had Bed given notiellphebial had feveral objections made to the Bill by a Mime ber of friends, both public and private, particular ly from that part of the United Kingdom, which the Bill went mod materially to ailed, as to dui time of notice chiefly ; this ftsortnefs of notice In the prefent felEon, he malt entirely aferibe to the non-attendance of the 'rifts Members; atehe km* time that he mentioned this,. he begged ;hello* to underftand, that his =petition of this circiun- Rance was not intended to throw any blame on hii countrymen, but merely as a Rater:sent of .nett Fod.—He did not pretedd to fay that theft flee . ments were entirely coned.: he did mtp . fay that Tome of them might not with.r: ' on objeded to ;in fad, Gentlemen could M 7 t flip ' e 12 that the calculations were all made on the leheefide drawn up•by him; he had applied to fochpegarts • as be deemed met competent, and thumb& al, could belt rely on for that pnrpofe, and lih every other tranfadion which embraced fo many objeds, and depended fo much on calculation, was liable to error. In confequence of the fevers! ap•plka- • tions which he now ftatedwand the arguments. which had been ufed by Come Hon. Members. of. that Houfe, he meant to fubinit to the approha. Von of the Honk his intention to withdraw the eneaftire for the prefent, and only to vote the fame,' that is the old taxes for one year, and in the Mei -1 manner as formerly prevailed with the frith l'ar., 4 liament. If any further propofition was neceffary,, he had refereed a Claufe to amend or alter accord ingly.- He fhould not longer detain the Hnedik4 than by moving, That the Order for gding hiftgl a Conimittee on the Irina Dritpedilill he notellir.' chagted. ; •.. lir:lil with r. Uric' NAM perfeftly a lus Righk i Hon. Friend as to the neceoity the Perpetbation, and thought too meth praife confto nfifistiltifiskl to him for his candour awd - libeetaiiria• Withdrawal ing the snafu= oa Mel/rounds hit bud lime& - .., Colonel Beowast...faid„ -he =Lifted the Right. : Hon. Gentleman woirld have there Schedules print ed, and laid hefore the Merchants of tke 'City It .. Debliti, and other plibeilsal towns, aa Ireibrinik• • ter of intricate lealatinks; and porlitOkifir di rafted to what coocarmd,djeic imerells, he though; i that they were theheft ;edges. .„ • Mr. AT RTII II declared, an, ill iiii opinion, diet • were a fofficient avian of Mercantile men Ni the Houle who Were flitly competent to the meld.- (landing of any bufinefs of that car a limilar oetere, Mr. Lea ohferred; Oat it was 44 decide9.9oi- pion that a peratiaent expenclitiirelhoydd be fu plied j plied by a fyftem of germanenftatithin : hisoify oh: / edion was to the tittle, as wifbing that ' evert • Irilli Member mighthave an opportunity to payoff. ' and fuificiently underhand, et lay tbk cops which. h id been printed for his life beforchis Conflituents,. if he thnught fit. He concluded by thanking the Right Hon. Mover furbis attention to the opinion* and interefts of the Gentlemen of Ireland. • -• Ns Mr. Colter affured his countrymen ehat•if.enee his uniform defire to give entire fatisfaksos o f them in every thing that concerned tsar intone : to The Order was then withdrawn, Ihe:teve4ar Ads were patted through a Committee, ihd the' Report ordered to be received to.mistrow.. .. • . The kith Chalking Ad paled through a COOK tni t tee, and the Report was ordereo TO be received to.morrow. The Committees of Ways and Means and ellt Supply. we pillponed to Friday.—AdjavassiL