Star. — London, England, 1814-06-21 00:00:00

„ I. ~. move for information of all that had taken place rela. • tive to the Abolition, in consequence of the Addresses of that louse, and more particularly of all that had passed during the Negociations for Peace. On the motion of Mr. W. SMITH, a Retails was ordered to be laid before the House of all Ships or Vessels brought to any Tort in the Colonies, and con demned under any of the Acts for the Abolition of the Slave . 1 rade ; specifying the day of their con demnation, the number of Slaves they contained, their sex, their subsequent di;position, &c. Also a similar Return from the High Coot t cf Admiralty in this country. THE PRINCESS CHARLOTTE OF WALES. Sir M. W. RIDLEY rose, and said that, seeing a Right Honouraiile Gentleman in his place, he was anxious to ask him a question relative to a circum stance of the utmost importance to the interests of this ceu.itry. He alluded to the intended tirarriage of 1. r Royal Highness the Princess-Charlotte of ' Wales with the Hereditary Prince of Orange, a re cord of which intended marriage was already on the Journals of that Base. Whenever that question should he brought before Parliament it would, from its extreme importance, necessarily occupy their at tention very largely ; and he was' thertfere the more anxious to know, at this advanced period of the Ses sions whether it was the intention of. Ministers to make any speedy communication to the House upon the subject ? (Hear, hear, hear.) The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he could give no ether :Inset er to tlie - question.of the Hon. Baronet than to say, that the Ministers of , his Royal Highness had received no authority to make any emmutinication to Parliament. "Mr. WHITBREAD rose, and said it was impos sible the answer they had just heard from the Right Honourable Gentleman could satisfy either that House or the country at large—(Wear, hear, hear!)! It had been solemnly announced by the Sovereign Prince of the United Netherlands to his own people, that an alliance was about to take place between his -son and her Royal Highness Princess Charlotte of Wales; and it had been proclaimed by her Royal Highness the Princess of Wales, in her cominunica .., tion to that House, now entered upon their Journals, that the illustrious heir of the Meuse of Orange had announced himself to her as her future son-in-law.— (Hear.) ,Questions upon this most important sn'ject had 'been asked from time to time; but They had never been answeted—they were uniformly evaded by Ministers. 'But he thought the time was now come when that House shoOld no longer safer itself to be treated .with that disrespect (dear, heai.) Mr. BATHURST rose to order. • He -did not think it exactly tight, when Miniiiters had. declared they had no commission to make any dmin ni cftion to the House, that a diseussibn 'should be prema. tamely forced on. Such a practice was both Mimi venient and irregular. 'Mr. WELITBREAD said, that he-would put the matter in a shape which would render irregular, by concluding with a motion. He 'repeated, that the House of Commons had been treated disrespectfully. If Miiiisters,in so important a ease,• and attar such a lapse of time, had no •aumoriry to communicate to the House the state of the proceeding, it became the House to interfere, and to address his Royal High. ness the Prince Regent to give authority for such c , lnmunicAtion. The Right Hononrabie Gentle . man opposite had not denied that the assertion in her Royal Highness the Princess of Wales's letter, of the intended marriage of her Royal daughter with the Hereditary Prince of Orange, 'was true. It had, however, been publicly reported, and was as publicly believed, that the intended marriage; which, with the concurrence of his Royal Highness the Prince Re gent, had been so long proceeding, was suddenly at ; an end. The grounds had even been stated on which it had terminated ; and those grounds were so inti mately connected with the question which 'was to be • brought forward by an Honourable Gentleman to. morrow, that it was of material importance to the ' House to know the fact ; and to be informed, if the intention was put aside, on what grounds that had occurred. It had been generally stated, and it had been generally believed, that circumstances closely ec nnected with the object of the Hon.' Gentleman's motion, were the cause of that which had taken place. It had been stated to-day, in the very streets. that her Royal Highness the Princess Charlotte of Wales bad declined any further proceeding in the intended • . narriage, on account of the situation of her Royal Mother.-.(Loud crier of Hear, hear.) If that was the case, it undsubtedly must endear her Royal Highness to every generous and feeling heart.— It would prove, that the subject on which the House were not to touch, as too delicate for their investiga-' tion, had risen to such great political importance that it might, very possibly, operate to prevent this most beneficial and desirable union. In order to ascertain the fact, the Honourable Baronet, his Hon. Friend, had proposed a question to the Right Hon. Gentle . man, whichbad been very unsatisfactorily evaded. He was sure the Right Hon. Gentleman and his col leagues could not be disposed to push ahe discussion Of a subject so interesting and important to the close of the Session ; and nothing was more certain, than after the business of next. week, no great attendance could be expected in Parliament. In the hoperthere fore, of obtaining satisfactory information, or at least with the determination, that his wish to'do so-should be recorded in the Journals, he would move, " that an humble Address be presented to his Royal High • mess the Prince Regent, praying that he would b? graciously pleased to acquaint the House, if there be a treaty of marriage on foot between her Royal High :less the Princess Charlotte of Wales, and the Here ditary Prince of Orange." sir M. W. RIDLEY seconded the motion. He had tiaitered himself, that the answer to the question which lie had put to the Right .Hon. Gentleman, would have proved satisfactory. As that, unfortu nately, had nut been the case, he was gratified to find the subject taken up by one who was so much more-able to do justice to it than himself. 1 - fis Ho. pourable Friend had stated many reasons far ex pecting that the House would be put in possession of some information un the subject; another, -which he (Sir M. W. Ridley) had }ward, and. which still mote convinced' him of thowediency of brioging the subject under the consideration of Parliament was, the it port, that in the event of the marriage taking place, hie Royal Highness might be induced to' quit the ' soulary. This supposition rendered bim more thin ordinarily anxious that the real state and nature of the whole proceeding should be laid before the House. Mr. STEPHEN said, that the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Whitbread) had redeemed himself from the charge of disorder, by reducing his observations to a formal motion. If every thing that was within the rules of order, was also Within the rules of propriety —within the - rules of delicacy—within the rules of public decency—then the Honourable Gentleman's conduct might have been not only orderly, but it might hare been delicate, it might have been decent, and, for aught he knew, it might have been discreet. But if, in defending himself from the charge of disorder, the Hon,urable Gentleman had exposed himself to other imputations—if it should be the opinion of a great majority of the House that he had H not exculpated himself from all impropriety, by the mere reduction of his observations into a fin-dial mo• tion, then, he (Mr. S.) must regard that motion as the .most indiscreet, as the most indelicate, as the most indecent—(order ! order !) Mr. WHITBREAD spoke to order. There were sertain words which he took to be Parliamentarily disorderly. He assured the House and the Hon. and Learned Gentleman, that if the words which hej had used were loch as it was orderly to use in de bate, they would not offend him. " Improper," h e conceived to be a Parliamentary term ; but the use of the word "indecent" was, in his ()Pinion, a trangres sion of the ordinary language of that'House. it was a word which, under any circumstances, he would not have:applied to the Honourable and Learned Gen tleman, and he hoped the House would not allow any Hon. Gentleman to apply it to him (Mr. W.) Mr. STEPHEN expressed his surprise at the inter ruption which he bad experienced, because he was sure it must be in the memory of every one who heard him, that " indecency" was a charge as often ad duced by the other side of the HOuse, against a mo. tion made by their political opponents, as any other. The Honourable Gentleman had said, that he would not impute indecency to him (Mr: S.) and that he misted, in return, not himself to be so charged. But the fact was, that he (Mr. S.) had not applied the word " indecency" to the Honourable Gentleman, but only K. his proposition.. He certainly was n o t aware that it was unparliamentary to state that any ploposition was improper, was indiscreet, and was in decent ; and unless he heard otherwise from the Chair, whose instruction he requested on the subject, he should continue to use such terms, as justly applica ble to the Honourable Gentleman's motion. The SPEAKER observed, that if he had under stood the phrase used by the Honourable and Learn ed Gentleman to be applied personally, he should have thought it highly disorderly ; but as sirrlply des. criptive of any proposition that might be submitted to the House, it did not appear to him to offend against the laws of Parliamentary Debate. Mr.- WHITBREAD, on the understanding that the word was not intended to be personal, expressed himself quite satisfied with the Speaker's decision. Mr. STEPHEN repeatel, that his observations were not intended to apply to the Honourable Gen tleman, but to his proposition : which he would againd say, was most indiscreet, most indelicate, and most indecent. And this he would assert, not only with i•gar4l to the psuposition itself, but with regard some of the circumstances stated by the Honourable Gentleman in support of it. What the fact was the House knew not. The Honourable Gentle man assumed it ; but was Parliament, upon the strength of that assumption, riot only to break in upon the sanctity and delicacy of conjugal rela tions, but also upon all those of a parental nature ? As well as being most indelicate, the proposition made by the Honourable Gentleman was most wan ton ; for he himself stated that the intended engage ment, which was the object of it, had been relit). quisixd. Would it be to treat rank and sex with re spect to drag into public view all the delicate circum stances of a proceeding, which, according to the Ho. nourable Gentleman's own declaration, was not likely to be completed ? What would the Honourable Gen tleman think of such a p roposition it it regarded hi s sister or his daughter? Was it compatible with the attention due to the delicacy of the female character, to expose all the circumstances of an abortive nego. ciation, such as that which the Honourable Gentle man had described ? And this, after it had been dos. tinctly stated by the Chancellor of the Exchequer, that his Majesty's Ministers were authorised not :o make . any communication to Parliament on the sub. jest (kar, hear.). —He understood the cause of the cheer from the Honourable Gentlemen opposite. He had inadvertently misplaced a word—he had said, that his Majesty's Ministers were authorited not to make any communication, instead of having said, that they were not authorised to make any communica tion. He was not afraid of any such wretched hosti. lity, however Glamourous. —lt would only recoil on those from whom it proceeded. If ever there was a motion which. required a regular notice ; if ever there was a case in which the House ought to have time for consideration ; if ever there was a subject on whiCh Ministers Shbuld have an opportunity afforded them for digesting their answer, it was the present. It was under the impression of this conviction, that. although he saw his Right lion. Friend, (the Chan cellor of the Exchequer) preparing to rise, he had ventured to claim the attention of the House. It was most unfair to take his Majesty's Ministers in this manner by surprise and suddenly to place them in a situation of difficulty ; for no othet purpose than to afford the Honourable Gentleman a vehicle for ob servations which it would have been much better he had never uttered. Mr. ROBINSON was of opinion, that much un netessartwarmth had been exhibited in this discus discussion which took plate solely because onellapourable Gentleman having asked a question, raiid i lratifig . been told that his Majesty's Ministers Were not authorised to make any communication to Parliament on the subject, another Honourable Gen- Ilethan thought proper to make a motion relative to a piOceeding, of which the House, as a House of Par liament, had DO knowledge whatever. If his Royal . Highness the Prince - Regent had made any commu nication to the House on the. subject, and if a consi derahleperiod had elapsed since that communication, ;here might be some ground to call on Parliament to acquiesce in the' Honourable Gentleman's motion. But. as far as he knew, the House, as a House, were not aware even of the existence of such a negociation as that which had been alluded to. No wol se reason could possibly be brought forward to induce the House to interfere in such a delicate subject, than tories, which, according to the Honourable Gentle man, were hawked about the streets with respect to it; except, indeed, it were that singular' one de. scribed by the Honourable ll.tronet as particularly operative on his mind—namely, the report, that it the marriage were concluded, her itoyal Highness would be induced to leave the country. Surely, when it was asserted that the negociation for the marriage was broken off, this last reasun for inquiring into the sub ject became extremely futile and absurd. There could be no necessity for any precipitation or warmth in the business. if the Honourable Gentleman thought in the present stage of the proceeding (whatever it might be) that it was expedient tor. Parliament to in terfere, at. least let him give the House time to cool, and Ministers, who were responsible for the advice which they might give on the subject, opportunity to afford to it all the consideration which its importance demanded. Sir M. W. RIDLEY explained. What he had stated was, that he understood, in the event of the marriage h.wing taken place, her Royal Highness would have quitted the country—a circumstance of such importance, that the sooner it was brought for ward in Parliament the better. Mr. HORNER agreed entirely with his Honour able Friend (Mr. Whitbread) as to the extreme im portance of the subject, both as affecting the illustri ous character more immediately concerned,. and as involving in it some of the greatest interests of the State. But while he agreed with his Hon. Friend as to the importance of the question, it was impos sible for him to deny the truth of what had been said by others as to the propriety of greater deliberation, and an extended notice of the discussion. He was not presumptuous enough to suppose that his Hon.', Friend stood in need of his advice to shape his Par liamentary conduct ; but he earnestly recommended to him to' postpone his motion until the House should be better prepared, and in better temper to discuss it; letting that which had passed stand for a 'notice, not doubting, that whenever it might be brought forward, he (Mr. Homer), viewing the subject in the same light as that in which it was seen by his Honourable Friend, should concur most cordially in his proposition. Mr. WHITBREAD declared, that there was no one to whose advice he would sooner listen than his Honourable and Learned Friend who had just spoken, and no one to whose advice he was less dis posed to attend than the Honourable and Learned Gentleman opposite. As to the qualities of modera tion, propriety, and discretion, he would go to the Honourable Gentleman opposite (Mr. Robinson) for them—he would go for them to his Honourable and Learned *Friend behind him (Mr. Horner) ; but in his search, he would avoid and run out of the way of the Honourable and Learned Gentleman opposite (Mr. Stephen). He would abstain from noticing a word of what had fallen from that Honourable and Learned Gentleman. He (Mr. Whitbread) said he wished to forget it ; but he could assure him that he did not care a straw about it. With respect to the suddenness of his motion, it should be recoh lected that the occasion was as sudden. His Honour able Friend, without the slightest concert with him, had put a question to the Right Hon. Gentleman opposite, on which that Right Han. Gentleman had thought proper to remain mute. Upon this he (Mr. Whitbread) had availed himself of one of the most useful and important privileges of a Member of that House—that of raising an trnmediat, question—in order to enable him to make the observations which appeared to him to. be necessary on the subject.— Having done this, he was perfectly ready to wave any further proceeding, never having seriously meant to take the question -out of his Honourable Friend's hands. With the leave of the Hoaso, therefore, If! would withdraw his motion. The motion was accordinOy withdrawn. PRINCESS OF WALES. _ ~..__.. In answer to a qu.•stiun from Mr. Possobinv, Mr. M!TRLJZN declared his determination to persevere in bringing forward, to-morrow, his motion relative to her Royal Highness the Princess of Wales. FOREIGNT TROOPS. Mr. W. WYNNE wished to know the exact num ber of the foreign troops which, according to his Roy4l Highness the Prince Regent's gracious com munication, were about to be lAnded in this country, for the purpose of being re-embarked to return to Russia ? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER Answered, he was not aware that any of them had yet landed. SPIRIT INTERCOURSE. The House having resolved itself into a Committee on the Spirit Intercourse Act, The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER stated, that it was his intention to introduce a Bill for the purpose of rendering the benefits of the Act to Great Britain and to Ireland as reciprocal as possible. He moved a Resolution in conformity to this intention. Mr. WILLIAM SMITH wished to know whe ther in the Bill to . be • brought in by the Right Hon. Gentleman, spirits already made in It eland wools! be permitted to be brought into this country ? If so, the , reciprocity professed to be the object of this Bill, would amount to this, that the spirits already made in Ire- - land might be imported into Great Britain, whereas the spirits already made in Great Britain could not be imported into Ireland. Sir JOHN NEWPORT said the Honourable Gentleman had observed that there would not be the same liberty to the English manufacturer of spirits, under this Bill, as to the Irish—Why not so ? He would tell the Honourable Gentleman the reason : it was because the British manufacturer of spirits, hay ing had the enjoyment of a monopoly in this country, in defiance of the articles of Union, and having sold all hi: spirits, be had none left to send to Ireland. However, until the Bill was before the I - louse it would .be impossible for them to enter into al y discussion. He thought the Right Hon. Gentleman had vcry properly and wisely declined to continue the Suspen sion Bill any longer ; . for if the Suspension Bill were to be continued at all, it must be continued till next Session. But this was so monstrous an idea, that on the part of that country, which had no longer a Par liament of its own, and had trusted itself to the good faith of another, he hoped that it would never be en tertained. V.very honest man in the House was bound to interpret the Act of Union with a leaning towards that country which had no longer a separate Par liament. T ptoposed that they should amend the schedule of the Act of Union in as regarded Scotland ; and that the spirits on hand iu Great twin might be allowed A drawback to enable them to be exported. Mr. HIJSKISSON thonght they ought to see Lis Right Honourable Friend's plan, before proreedill g to discuss it. If they did not levy a duty in behind in proportion to the strength of the spirits, instead of the quantity, there could be nothing like a.recipro city. He must, in justice to the English distiller, say, that they had not manufacture.) for Ireland, and that they had manufactured spirits for this country on the faith that there could be no intercourse be tween the two countries till they were on af,uting of reciprocity. Mr. FITZGERALD was at a loss to understand how it could be considered as reciprocity, that one country should be bound to conform to the systemrst another. England had no tight to demand fsum . thi Irish manufacturer to depart from that sy :cm whiz!: wassestablished at the time of the Union, and sant: tioned by the Union. The Enplish distillers bad no ground to look for any longer continuance of the SUS pension Act. _ _ _ • Mr. HUSKISSON did not wish to interfere se!th the Irish mode of manufacturing of spirits. -Hs 1,42. merely stated, that till they took into consideratte:, the strength, and not the quantity of the spirits, toe::: could be no reciprocity. If this was approximated as far as was possible, he would not object to it ; but if any measure injurious to the English distiller was introduced, he would do every thing in his poser to allow them to have an opportunity of carrying on a fair rivalship. Sir JOHN NEWPORT said, as far as he could see, nothing would serve the English Distillers, but an abrogation of the union, in so far as regarded the intercourse with spirits. He was sorry not to see a Noble Lord in his place ( Lord Castlereagh). That Noble Lord had told him, that in a conversation with Mr. Pitt on the subject of the clause regarding the spirits, Mr. Pitt had told him, that he was aware Ire land had an advantage over England by this clause, and this was given, being as a compensation for a class of manufacturers which would bi iniered by the Union. This effect, therefore, was fat eseen by those who framed the Act of Union ; and -it it was in contemplation when both Parliaments were in exist ence, it was not fair now, under any pretext, to do away with that benefit. lie had heard it stated, by a Gentleman of North Britain, in a Committee up stairs, that it was true Ireland had such a right under the Union as she now-claimed, but she was bound to surrender that right for the advantage of the Eng lish and Scotch Distillers. He felt himself called on to stand up in behalf of the country of which he WAS 1 Representative, and which was inadequately iepre ' seined in that House. Ii the Act of Union should be infringed, then, indeed, should he feel as onelvho had supported that Union, which he had in so doing, sacrificed his country to England. ' Mr. WILLIAM SMILII said it was unparlia mentary to refer to conversations with Mr. Pitt four teen years ago. Would Mr. Pitt state in conversation what he would not state in that House ? And it he had avowed in the House, that with respeee.to the manufacture of the greatest imphrtance to the reve nue and the landed 'merest of the country, he meant to give Ireland an advantage over England, how would it have been received from one end to another of the House ? The arguments used in behalf of the English distiller were addressed ad juititiam, but those of the Right Hon. Baronet were addressed ..ad mirari cordiasi merely. Sir JOHN NEWPORT s tid he would not corn-. mit Ireland to the miscricordia of Great Britain, or any nation on the face of the,globe. The House resumed, when leave was given to bring in a Bill to regulate the Intercourse of Spirits' between Great Britain and Ireland. LAW INTELLIGENCE. COURT OF KING'S BENCH, JUNE CO. THE RING V. DE BERENGER, LORD CtX;IIRANE, AND OTHERS. Mr. GURNEY moved for the judgment of the Court • on the defendants in this case. They were accordingly called on, when Random de Betenger, Lord Cochrane. It. Cathorne 'Butt, John Peter Holloway, Ralph Sandon, and Henry Lyte, appeared to their names ; and the Ho -t. Andrew Cochrane Johnstone, and AlexanclucM.Rao failed :o appear.. Mr. Serjeant BEST then informed the Court that he appeared on the present occasion, only fur Mr. 13utt ; and before he submitted to them a motion in arrest of Judgment, he thought it proper to observe that there had been a failure on the trial to adduce proof of a material averment in the indictment, in a count to which all the other e, - .tints in the indictm.:tit had reference, namely, that for two years and uP wards there had been teat between his Majesty and his Allies on the one part, and Bonaparte, tue Rul:r of France, on the other past. - Lord ELLEssoitutioti pi estnned that toe many sta. Lutes had passed since the breaking'out of the ‘‘.,r between this county and Prance, to make the ca s tence of such a war a matter requiring proof. Mr. Serjeant BEsT presumed, however, that this was net the case with respect to our Allies : they lia.l become so tocirecently to have afforded much upper.. tunity for their junction with us in the contest against France being recognised in many statutes. • Lord'Et..u.snonotoit said, the observation had been very properly thrown out fur the consideration ut Con; t, ~f Mr. Serjeant Bsr having st ited this objection now begged to move an arrest of ju.igment on the part of Dlr. Butt alone. • Lord ELLENBOAOL:UII said, he had been informei,. on the ttial, that the LeartleJ Srrjeant turn appease.: fur the first, second, and third defendants (us th.: record. Mr. Setjeant Brxr appeared nownwrely foe Mr. Batt All the defendants were acquitted on the two first counts in the indictment. I.otd Eslasiurtovon observed. thit it was rather novel for a Counsel to ren )unce any of the parties for whom he bad appeared on the trial, the Court being thereby subjected to the inconvenience el hear• iug Counsel for each defencluit separately. Mr. Serjeant Bas•r was not authorised on the part of Lord Cochrane to move an arrest of judgment, therefore there could be no such 'inconveniency As that to which his Lordship had alluded. He Prtnee" tiled then to state the grc have judgment arrested. dictment charged the to produce a great rise ii securities, the persons in bine to raise false repor subjects in Kent, &c. an an increase and rise in I •iew to injure all his M 91st of February, skew! funds. His objecticn there was no crime :tau ment, known to the I.t * dictment did specify a c persons against whom lave been committed, flit's , ought to have bee' niitted that there was in.hc.mcnt : and, sect stated, that it was too sites these, a third obje to be, to raise the prii kingdom. ' Now, sine, two countries had be the funds in question w ment securities of that called Great Britain. uliich the doctrine of carried : but this, he th log advance, as an infe unless to raise the prig conspire to raise the crime ; and that to n something averred wli Mr. Justice Le BLA to be, to raise the pile( Lord EL LENEOROUC the defendants had sr) Mr. Serjeant lirsr price of the funds rui be r , therwise. But et neither be one th'ng rc on the recorj to show any fraud, and if sue submitted, it must be a case, even where a nal, the end must b. looked into the case' that none could be to averred to be mo.cnie fled class of individu plated only two suskj, of a criminal prosz.cu or the keeping of ret, Modern times, he 444 r on a great deal fart carried tl:e length of to form a charge of t lul. In support of cases of the King an ling, and the King Al in this ease, that the I price of the funds wi' personsspecitic ally m be different. Lord ELLEN1101:01. of things that they by possibility, might Mr. Scrjeant Bast framing an indictme within the law, was Lord actsanam thing was some ansi in point fact, . Mr Se: jeans Bt gate countenance 1 sushi by vssiitility color, on , r gambler ti.e patties tujured, cases he Astor. L ,, rd ELLEN man the tonsequi.ntial is Mr. :;eIjeACII BE>. complete without tl but still there must Mr. Just ce I).‘m on the terry day on practice. Mr. Justice BAIL' chased on that day, complete on the par sollawful conspirac) ket day to rai-e tlic tiny, SO that no on, deterred from pure' Lord ELLVNBOito was multitudinous, the names of indivi Mr. S.T,oant ISls that the funds, whit Great 13:itsin, cool the union with Irel, this kin4dom, mine. .ell as Greys 13:itai Lord au - swot, fuirdsot G: eat 13 it funds of this kingdo I.‘rvice or the t‘bol,: Mr. PARK, on th, get stet ported A situ Mr: zierjearit Pr I. :AIIJ J:e. on this roil:. Lord Cochrane I en this point, t. 1.. Ott ir L.r.ls!tips jodgme . 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