Star. — London, England, 1810-12-22 00:00:00

• , . . - observe times elei r e 49ll o 6 : 4l . lll gewitle &mu- haw rob . .. • I'M, •Ijaee ' * hielber, , the Statiteeald ace scenic the unauthorised numb* (Mr. Yorke) reso rtedeee s ewOuld not be commie Psdiament ate a tele ts whirls dal/ ?Vet e/ldistesse - .te of teite'redisiaye The Right Him. Gentlemah afar - in r e nt o f w eigh! easemeertattossloah die, .t-e necessarg e testt a s ts sd e g. ss prope r le-stated' 'Militate,' and cdestedellit proceed- ' ell spirits from the vasty deep, but will they come • . . tof the Revolution . It had bee* , con of conduce e • emetto4these of let eare sege., Wit came before Perltement elien (by whgot s se-theee officers no positive duties to discharge e Throne was full, but that, was only epic the .but those 4 iiiiiierfispa64 - Restotatiou end fel:lethal:4 we Met he eltiinate. el ;edged )sehenle heetwei. aise they no oaths of tem to restrict them ? Are i w o of the Constitution,. whish 'considered King at the Revolution. With - . ~of. all theeeeing our responsibility , and if an appeal at is . .01„ their consciences in possession, or at the controul of I fag • ia l It could not be denied, however, that the they came to theresolutioneWhie legelited the course ture time should, be necessary (I mean when postilalee the Chancellor of the Exchequer ? Let me adv se him . , 'give functions were suspended and impaired...- of proceeding on tbilkoccesioe, and on which the pre- other persons may have greater sway), I hope that not to be too presumptuous. He may and himself e approve d highly. of the short methodpeopesed by 'lent recetadmeeirlitehottomeds But though this was the candont, the honour, and the justice of Parlia. deceived. This Great Miniaer, who has led us to •t i e e h t Honourable Friend (Mr. l'oesonby), and these-me, etilt the.GOVernment could. noteee any thing -Meat will be dealt out to us. (Hear, hear.) When commercial prosperity and military renown. may. ,ag e t t hat the Chancellor might refuse to put 'the desirable in • that mode proposed by hint—they. law we, requett of Parliament that indemnity for our however, possibly find, from the splendour of his at Seal to that which had been proposed to the nothing but insuperable bars to theobject to he ac. , actions which we think is our due, I trust and hope career, willing instruments in every department to ouse. After some turther'observations, h e conchs- complished, if the mode - of proceedingby Bill• was that the imperious consideration of having uttea for uphold the power he has wantonly usurped. From . , w i t h o pposing the. Report. - .. . adopted. They seemed to forget l lit the opinion they the kingdom's welfare will insure us that indern. the repeated impunity which every violation of our gr. Hazy ADDINGTON adverted to serhat had formed of their own case, that the Address was nits which we may have to request —( Loud cries of interests have met, we have become so familiar with 4 f a ll en from an Honourable Baronet (Sir John liable to all those objections which they. had stated Rear, hear.) On that day, should it arrive, I will -outrage, that very possibly the Ministers of the day i over t). That Honourable . Baronet, in speaking against the Bill.' They were happy. in attacking the din myself on the mercy of this House, and cheer- - may be able to effect that which, if Mr. Pitt. wi th n t th e . p rec edent of 1788, had 'statedi that we were legality of the latter mode. when the arguments they. fully submit to the judgment of it—(Lead cries of , whole nation at his b ac k , had d one , in 1788, he would e r a sta te of war, and that we were then in pro- furnished to shew • that it was *illegal, recoiled on Hear, hear).—A question has been pin to me about not be allowed to continue in the d'reetion 0r ou r . , n d peace. This:was the very season why he wish- themielves, and:were only applicable to the Adereso the evacuation of Portugal, iehether in the event of mites one des , longer. One word as to the c'li srxe ~ .to follow the preeedent of 1188. - A precedent 'of It was only chenging . Bill for 'Address, and Ad- an order being sent to. my Lord Wellington (should made against me, of having asked in indelicate et natur e was not for one time or. another, -but all dress for.Biil, and the same arguments of the Gen- necessity require him so to do) for the immediate !question respecting the person s by who s e a dvi c e ter- . met t we do not legiste heemourable Deronet too ad., said that a Bill was Riegel.- Was- it so ? Why the teelone Ter the present time, tlemen would apply. equally: to both. It had been . evacuation of that kingdom, that gallant Officer ° taro Physicians a ere called to attend his M a j est y.... t for posterity. .The would be bound to obey that order ? to that question He has, let it he recollected, made the ch ea rge, a n d p e i n te rms by .wesmeaies hecoming, to theage very argument that they had used•shewed the contrary I reply: that there could be no difficulty in such a forced me to the necessity of the eaplana t io n —, our Sovereign. Htesetideatie were to recollect that to be the fact. They admitted that the two Houses I case of sending out orders, and is there any man who What if it should turn out, notwithstandi n g all t hi s was now 22 years oldesedeHe i s 22 years older— were in a case of necessit., and that. every admission would believe that the gallant Officer would refuse to affected regariefer privatefeelings—all that sympathy if h e is sn, he has give9lee Honourable Baronet of the necessity laid the foundation for she legality I comply with that order ? But this, Sir, is a mere for human infirmity of which we hear so mu c h-. • himself additiOnal re:smite° bless-his mild and, of the act. Under the calamitous circumstances in 1 imaginary case. Although the King's Sign M enu a I that puttin g th e case hyp ot h et i ca ll y , an un h appy pe. ternal re i gn . With respeato what was stated as which the country is placed by the a ffl iction of the ! cannot be obtained, yet I say that the Officers in every tient stretched upon his bed of affliction, with hi s te . , the fi tness of the Prince of Wales for Regene.he Sovereign, the legality was made manifest. When ' other department of the state are bounseto obey. If 1 maining faculties elite to the fea r of b e i ng c . e n ly believed him to be; most fit for . the offiee, it was supposed that a Chancellor might refuse to de- it were necessary, for instance, in the department over I mined to the care of an individual personally A ren d. , h e b e li e ved him to be fit for it 22 years agar--.-liver up the Great Seal in a case like the present which I have the honour of presiding, that money sus to him, should most fervently impl or e, an d t h at H onour able Member (Mr. W. Elliot) had said, under a Bill,. might he not also refuse if the House should be issued from the Exchequer, should I, Sir, his of family placed around his bed, s h ou ld all , the was not in this House in 1788; but that from were to agree to address his Royal Highness tQ hesitate to order the officers of the Exchequer to issue unite in the application of not a g a i n su bj ect i ng hi es that h e c o uld learn of the proceedings of that pe. take upon him the Regency ? Was the one more money because I should risk my own personal sem• to such care. What, I ask, must be th e f ee li ngs of t h e y then met with.his disapprohation,and they illegal than the other ? If the two Houses were to rite ? (Near, Afar.) And should I not be jurtified ' those who could refuse such a request—and was it w met equally with his disapprobation .' He would pass a Bill , he did not believe that the Chancellor in so doing, when that mo n ey had' been actually voted not more natural to suppose that t he malady of the . that Honourable Member , thaohe (Mr. Adding . w oul d refuse. If in o ne c as e there was no inealiS o f by Parliament ?. If Ido not apply. it to the purposes patient seas more likely to b e i ncrease d than alleviated e ) was t h e n a Member of this House ; and howns enforcing it, so - neither was there. any means i:: the for which it has been so voted, I should conceive by the presence ? Mr. Whitbread, afte r a var i et y of most strongly impressed w ith the wi s d o m of the other case. Even supposing the House.wes to vote an that Parliament would hold me d ee ply crimi na l.— other Oservationa concluded with assuring the House procee din g s, and with admiration of the men Address, the result must be that an Act must pass ( Loud cries of Hear, hear.) I have no doubt the Tel. of his intention even in the case of hi s et e j el e i t s s p ee d, ho directed them. The. precedent of that period for confirming the Regent. Much h a d b een sa id re . hers of the Exchequer, though at first they might de- recovery, to provide the means of guarding against • mur to the order, would upon my taking the respon. the difficulties which' may arise from a relapse, and s a most valuable one ; ands great as was the gala - specting the voted the Parliament of Ireland , but it e y w hi c h gave rise to it, we were net the less to was not any discredit to that Parliament that the Re- , sibility myself, not refuse compliance with it ~ of saving the public interests f ro m b e i ng aga i n isn. the great advantages which accrued front suck a ent of their choosing was not elected ; they might they would consequently throw the responsibility paired by the vile fraud which had been, for the last ecedent to the country. The 'pre ce dent of the Re- pave had him prestdcover that. part of the Empire, on the right pe r so n . Would it be endured that a seven weeks, practised upon' the country. ution had no analogy to the present exigency, and though.tht l triglisik Aarliainelft did • not agree in the mutiny in the army orfleet should be endangered for Mr. ADAM animadverted with considerable force hen he said this, he was glad he could rest iton the Addreet s . Tho K lght Ho n . G en tl em an th e n adve rted want of the application of any part of the money ap. on the dangerous consequences to be apprehended uthority of a g reat and b r illia n t et a toeman sow no to the - chary made by the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. propriated to their use ? I will leave it to the friends of from a system of prospective responsibility. The mode , ore i that statesman was Mr; Fox. He had - heard Whitbread) on the last discussion, viz- that in leol, the Gentlemen opposite to insinuate by a smile, that' of claiming indemnity diienot apply to a cased { novel, -., i n 1788, state expressly what he now himself although his Ivealissey was afflicted with a return of his the proposition is ridiculous. (Hear, hear.) I see no- unexpected, and extraordinary o c cur rence , h ate case e ye—that there wait no analogy between the Re- malady, no notice was made to the Houses of Parlia- 1 thing ridiculous in it ; and I am sure that even here, foreseen, in which the act was premeditated ; if t hi s eution and the period of 1788; and of course went. In that Particular, W. Perceval observed, the though I might chance to meet with some not very . - system was to be avowed and tolerated, the first act of ere could be no analogy: between the Revolution Hon. Gentleman was mistaken , for the first was no. partial judges, yet, under these circumstances I should the Legislature, the moment Parli a me n t was restore d. . ,d th e p r esent. period. With respect to limita. torious to the House, though for reasons, which at that receive indemnity. (Hear, hear.) The Right Hon. ought to be to appoint a ressehreeine for the E xecutive , insect the Regency, there was not one :aviary. time were perhepsperfectly corrottp the House refused Gentleman next adverted to the arguments used re- in the event If the King at any fut u r e t i me b e i ng a lt. stance in the annals of Great Britain of a Regent's to pay attedtion A() it. It was true . also that his Ma- specting the restricting, which he condemned as pre- dieted by the same calamity ; this pr o spe ct i ve sofa of . . 't g a pp o int e d without limitations. The Regent' Jestf.ehertlY reeetteteeli and .eetene time after relapsed. mature , and trusted that when he asked for the fair, responsibility vrastbnknowil to the Constitution and .as always been saddled with a permanent Coatteile The relapse wet to soon e that the Chancellor, who was, unbiassed, and unprejudiced judgment of the House liable to the greatest abuses—so s u c h p ower (mg ! t ; . permanency of such. -a Council secures a perpe.' then just quitting office. could not dispossess himself, upon the question, when it was properly before them, eo be heard of as might be claimed under such a sys- , lopposition and It is therefore a perpetual linlita-' of the Peals ; and the Chief Justice of the Common he should obtain it , and it would be found in fact that tern. The evid e nce o f D r . Willi s h a d bees alluded ion.—He wished to 'recall to the attention Of the Pleas, 'who had been appointed to succeed him, was their arguments had no weight. Haviegdiscussed these to ; what did that evidence state : that on the 6th of I oust two paints a The first, that all we have belittle' ConspeUed to remain in the office which he then held. topics, the Right Hon. Gentleman proceeded : " As November, the day on which Dr. Willis fi rst saw t h e is to p ro vid e for a temporary occasion ; the iteonde The Master of the Rolls, who was to succeed the to the p hysicians, the Hon. Gentleman wishes to King, his Majesty was then unconscious of surroun d. et we appoint a deputy, and nothing more--tea del... thiefeustice, was also necessitated to remain in office. know, and he asked the last night why such a physi- ing objects. It was on the first of t h e same mont h s Fate, or whatever•other name may be affixed to the In 1804 e the other period to which that Honourable cian was ap p ointed—why another, to whom the King and on the 15th, that the Right H ose Gentleman idea. He heartily concurred in committing that trust Gentleman had alluded, though it was true there was had a rooted aversion, was called in, and several prevailed on the House to adjo urn . over eac h tints • tohis R o y a l Highness; but at the same time, he some little return, yet his Majesty was competent,as questions of the like nature ; and he said that he put fortnight, on the high probability o f hi s Majesty's 'shed it to be committed to huts with limitation%-.., had been proved on the exam ettation of the Physici- those questions in the Committee, but they were over. speedy recovery. Thus a month had been lost. But is was no jetlousy. If we limit the Prince, 'We ans, to execute • public business. CMr. Perceval re. ruled. T o th es e questions, Sir, 1 reply, that the Corn. if these prospective responsibilities were to be admitted. . et en public principles--we act for the benefit of Jeered to the examination to shew the fact to be so.] mittee would not have been much enlightened in their what would be the use of those checks which the Con- , • elite , . • sWhat was the mason, said the Right Honourable inquiries, if those questions had lima answered ;it he stitution had ordained should exist ? When wou ld b e • Lord PORCHESTER maintained that both 'Gentleman, which induced the Government of that I had been informed that this physician was appointed the necessity at all of the Sign Manual ? Bold as was ouses of Parliament were legally competeet to Pro- day to decline making it Public ? Why it was found ;by that person, or that physician by another. The the doctrine of the Right Hon. Geademaa, it was yet vide for the deficiency in the Executive. • The Noble that no such national inconvenience could result, con- Housewill, I hope,not impute to meanyintentionaldis. worthy of observation, that whether from a eifference Lord combated the arguments adduced by the Right nected with the appointment of a Regent, that compel- respect, if I decline to answer those questions till the' of strength as to tutees, or as t o p ru d eacea t h ere Hon. Gentleman ('Mr.' Perceval) on the former led them to pause for a great while befere they con- . House commands me. (Loud cries of Hear, hear.)— were others in the same Cabinet w i t h t h at Ri g h t e evening, and contended that the analogy in point of sensed finally to place any other person in the exercise i I shall not enter into them if the House feel that there Hon. Gentleman who were not so f orwar d to b eani e ' principle was exactly the same now as in the Revco of the royal function. That the feeling of Parliament is no necessity for entering into the question, or that such responsibility. Heknewof his o wn i rnow i e d get e as s hition ; that en that occasion the functions of royalty was so, I can very justly collect. ( Hear, hear.)— . there is something unnecessarile indelicate in the the Chancellor of England would not p u t hi s r ee l to 6 *ere extinct ; so now, it woe requisite to preside for In obedience to that feeling, we have thought it our I question . — ( Loud crier of Hear, hear.) —If Gentlemen a commission of the peace. He ad m i tte d t h e geese r the absence of the exercise of those functions which duty to pause, and we have sought that 'delay which can say any thing in disparagement of the character tion to be a question of di ffi culty, a question of news. e the unfortunate malady of the Sovereign has occa - from time to time has drawn down upon us the ani- 1 and habits of those persons, Or that they are such sky, in both cases ; whether of Bill or Add ress , ? er - e sinned. He denied that the opposition in 178$ was, madversions of the Gentlemen opposite. In doing j persons as the country is not satisfied with, or that liement acts, and Parliament only ac t s , with thei dil- l- is the Right Hon. Gentleman had asserted, o the that, did we shut our eyes to the responsibility which . they have ill-treated the King—that his Majesty has Terence, that in the one it acted w i t h ou t interferin g it disgraceful offspring of patty fury." The ground of attaches to the conduct so chosen ? Certainly not, ' been dependent on them — then those allegations will with the functions of the Crown, and in the oth e r f i4 7 • objection which the Right Hon. Gentleman made to nor were we unacquained with the inconvenience. If I require an answer, and the House•of course will ex. ercised those functions. - the precedent of the Parliament of Ireland. in point that was not the feeling of the Government and the . pect oneeand I shall be ready to give all the explana. Tbe CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, i ll r if address to his Royal Highness, was, he believed, .Parliament at drat time, I don't know what was-- 1 non on the subject which at present I don't consider explanation, said that he begged le av e to di sc l a i m t h e I fir these reasons , that they would not adept the We have been in that situation I avow, and I desire I myself bound to do."—(Loud and repeated erica of arrogance with which he ha been charged; hi s vo t es s line of proceeding Of the Irish Parliament, because to take all the responsibility. Sir, the situation of a Hear, Hear.) and deportment had been observed upon, he watt than an was debate. he ece might isary to that Parliament would not do homage to th e mea - Government is such, that in cases of this kind, I con - Mr. W. ELLIOTT and Mr. W. WYNNE seve . afraid, but too j ustl y . He acknowledged that some. voice warmthpitchof conveytimes' to i n a ▪ condu c t of the Irish Parliament ? Werethe proceed. and to the two Houses of Parliament. ( Loud crier point and animation, commented upon the expres. his sentiments to every corner of the House, bet ;te r " lags rescinded? Certainly not. It was fair, therefore, of hear, hear.) I feel also, Sir, that in another point sons, able, bold, and unprecedented, which the Chan. not arrogance, if he at all knew himself, and sensible • ei teconclude,that such disapproval was not manifested. of view we are responsible. I mean with respect to cellor of the Exchequer had that n i ght made to the he was of many infirmities. H e h um bl y appre h e a - a Il e contended, in an elaborate speech, for the necessity the most sacred interests of the public, should it hap- country. Would to GOD that every Member of Par - ded, t h a t a rr og a nce or presumption were not emee I elfproceeding by Address. pen that in case of necessity it would be impossible to Lament from England, Ireland, and Scotland, could the number of his many Faults—(Hear, h ear , h ear a Mr. LOCKHART stated that there were three obtain the King's authority for any proceeding or have heard it—could have heard a Minister of the It was impossible that such an individ ua l as hi m 1 Precedents, viz. that in the reign of Charles the First, act to which his Sign Manual should be placed, I Crown , in the face of Parliament, proclaim his pos.., could be capable of tteating the House of coinages the period of the Revolution (which could not bear should consider myself bound to use that authority. session of the royal attributes , and boldly triumph in. with arrogance. But he would be g l eave to o b serves on the present case, because there was not in point of ( Laud cries of hear, hear.) Gentlemen may say this his usurpation.--(Hear, hear.)—Would Mr. Pitt, in that if a louder tone than was necessary to b e au dibl e lee 1 fact any Monarch) and the precedent of 1788 . The is assuming the exercise of the Monarchy, but I the plenitude of his power , have ventured en such a and more earnest manner than w as u sua l, were to ' Th r o ne now being full, could not be saidas applying- do say that if any department. of the Executive course ? Would he hive dared to tell a British Hous e received as indications of arrogance, b ot h o f t h e H o . ' at Point to the precedent at the Revolution. To Government required, under thesi circumstances, of Commois, that in any interruption of the functions nourable Gentlemen opposite (Messrs. Whitb rea d an d ' amply With that precedent would in the House be a the King's Sign Manual, that Officer would be most of th e S overei gn ,. the rights of the King descended Adam) might now and then come in f or t h e i r s h are o f e dereliction of the duty which, as Representatives of deeply responsible who should neglect to require of to the servant ? He would not ; and shall it been- the imputation—((el laugh.) lave.) 9 the People, they owed to their constituents. any subordinate Officer in the Executive the execu- dured that the Chancellor of the Exchequer of this day Mr. WHITBREAD acknowledged, that, among The CHANCELLOR of the - EXCHEQUER tion of any act which was necessary (Hear, hear!) shall invest himself with powers subversive of every his many defects, his voice was somet i me s l ou d er c h a=r , r, Wee to reply to the arguments which had been ad- Sir,. I say again, if any of the Members of the Go. eonstitutional principle ?—that he shall assume to perhaps, was necessary. There were nan d thi ngs i ti ' duced in favour of the Address. He was not dis- vernment hesitated to command that the act should himself the controuhover the public purse, apply the which he would wish to rival the Right H on . G en- r he said, to • take up much of the time of- the be done; I mean, of the Seal.—(Hear, hear) I—That public money when and how he shall think proper, tlemen. He would wish to rival him in acuteness, but I h rl e e u d s:, being perfectly satisfied with the general line is the feeling which I have of my situation, and as and, upon a pretended responsibility, trample upon above all things in hi s ra pid t rans i t i ons f rom t h e r o f t, co nduct which Geadeuten on the other side of the such I think it but an act of duty to avow it.- .(Leue that Throne which he is sworn to support, which, by greatest warmth of debate to the greatest d egree o f ' muse had adopted. There was one or two points , crier ti . /sear, hear.)—As to the questions which have his very actions, he is now crumbling into dust! — good - humour. If he spoke of arrogance, he certainly r Which he could not, however, pass over, and which, been put to me respecting Sweden and America, (Hem hear)—if he can establish that there existed did not mean personal arrogance, but that degree of ' I I they had been so earnestly pressedon him, he was when the time comes when it will be necessary for a full and unavoidable necessity even for this cou rse , political arrogance which made him now pledge his ' "We to answer. Th e G en tlemen opposite were me to answer those questions, I shall be prepared; though my political adversary, (said Mt. Whit. responsibility so deeply. Under this r e s p ons ibili t y 1 r truing a line, by which they would place-the but till then I hope, the House will excuse me, espe- bread), I trust that I have justice and magnanimity Ministers might take advantage of a mental malady :souse in a most aukward situation ; foi while they cially if no inconvenience can, arise by my delaying enough in my nature to give my ssnction to an ap. in the King, to usurp all 'the powers of the State.— ' 6 e _strenuously advocated t he propriety of addreesing the answer--(New, hear.)—Now. Sir, with respect to peal for his indemnity. But when he talks in the ar- The House divided on the previous que st i on , A yes Let. Royal Highness, t hey, by their arguments, would those delays, about which so much has been said—, rogant and assuming tone of this night, I tell him that, 15—Noes 98—Majority es. 7 i n the situ a tion . of th e animal with couple of pan- why, they have been openly proposed from time to when that day of inquiry comes, and come it must, The second and third Resolutions were t h en lime d I ' l i en on his back, n o t k nowi n j. w hich bundle of time. I have never, in any covered manner, pro- Iris tone on this nightwill compel me to view his cone to, and the Report received.--Adjourned a t tiliLg ng o,s° to chuse. With respect to what the:Gentlemen posed, from fortnight to fortnight. delays, but under duct with a more scrutinizing eye. The coura ge o f PAST ONE to this day. 1 "a urged of the second resolution being uneeeeeta" the homiest expectation,. Which we all vet, anxiously the Cabinet, as it seems on des night to be more fully After the Gallery was cleared, Mr. Wvxx asked r !Jibe vs as ready to admit that it would have beer' so, hoped might be realised. that his Majesty would exhibited, appears also much concentrated. Perhaps. Mr. - P IRCEVALI whether, en the event of the Ho uas de • - question had been brought forward on the subject be so far recovered, as to dis p ense with the necessieei tp temper the temerity of the Right Hon. Gentleman, agreeing to the Restrictions which would deprive th e st • , 'flight. In looking back to the proceeding ups* of the present measure. Haar, kear.)—...Whe% r tbe eassaterpoise is to be bad amongst his colleaguq„ kezent.of the nomination of the Offerers of the House. ' l'hich that resolution wu founded, by omitting mal l hzapaso s ,that. dagamived, of which T 4pptisiddin . . . even in his Administration. there may 8e holZ be proposal to l'ullow the plan given IXXiat of , h t llitery a doubt would be thrown upon the founclae• MOO CAQ U I 4 hi f i Ng brl n ir 4l4 Pr 4I PPPOOPoci ,'' • fte individual, who would.por venture without by Aar,,il/tt in 1788, of alloying to the .en , '...__ "at Precedent. Those who objected too it as : , _ _._.spos the state - of alsa Kisses. healthy -4a 11•4 e advice of his Soveteirs to put the Great Seal to additioael !nal estahlielumente end inspOsiOl4ll:l44‘lll