Star. — London, England, 1822-05-25 00:00:00

Hose to lake his case into consviss....____ ina ordered to be printed. A Message from the Lords announced their to certain Bills. Mr. BENNET moved the Order of the Day for reading of the Alehouse License BBL ....After a lew words from General Gascores. the Big a second time, and ordered Lobe referred to a Speciair Mr. BERNAL presented a Petition from a Brewer cheater, who stated that all his property was embarked in his brewery, praying that the House would n ot pass any Bill affect ing his interests. Mr. F. PALMER said there was , he believed, not one free house in the city of Rochester. After a few• words from Mr. &mum and Mr. Batts, the Petition was referred to the Committee on the said Biu.. • Mr. BF.RNAL presented two other Petitions Prom bald.. duals against the Bill.—Ordered to lie on the table. Mr. LUSHINGTON also presented P,tition. dim a Brewer against the Bill.—Ordered to lie on'the table. The Recognizance Bill was recommitted on the motion of Mr. N. Csi.vsar.—Report to be considered this day se'snight. Mr. GOULBURN gave notice, that on the 6th of June hie should submit a motion to the House respecting the present Law a Irish Tithes. Mr. C HETWY ND moved the third reading of the Vagrant law Amendment Bill. • After a few words from Mr. GIORGI LAM. the motion was agreed to and. Mr. G. Luis brought up a clause to regulate the Ell as it regarded Players, which clause was agreed to, and added to the Bill. The Bill was then passed. Mr. CU ItTEIS presented two Petitions from certain Owners and Occupiers of Land, in the county of Sussex, complaining of Agricultural Distress, and praying for relief—Ordered to lie on the table. Sir T. LETHBRIDGE presented two Petitions from Owners and Occupiers of Land.in the counties of Oxford and Gloucester, stating that the law about to be passed for the alleged relief of the Agricultural Interest, would afford it no assistance whatever. He called upon the Noble Marquis and the Government to pause before they passed a measure which was against the gene ral feelings of the country. General GASCOYNE begged to be Informed by the Noble Marquis whether he intended to bring forward the measure alluded to by the Honourable Baronet, in the course of the pre sent evening 'I be Marquis of LONDONDERRY said he certainly should bring it forward, unless there should be a discussion of some length upon some Resolutions to be proposed by a Right Ho pourable Friend of his. After a few words from Mr. Ceavera aid Mr. Crams, the Petitions were ordered to lie ou the table. LICENSING SYSTEM. Mr. GREY BENNET presented a Petition from certain Licensed Victuallers, in favour of the Bill al tering the system of licensing public-houses. On the question being put that the Petition be brought up, Mr. CAREW said that, whatever objections he had to many clauses of the Bill, he would not oppose its going to the Committee. Mr. BERNAL said, that he would have many Pe titions to present against the Bill. There were many brewers holders of free public-houses, whose property would he injured by the proposed alteration in the mode of p. 11161114 licenses. Mr. Aide' man SMITH opposed the measure. Mr. LIT TLETON recommended that a clause should be introduced to encourage the sale of beer of a diminished strength. Colonel FRENCH thought that a preference of monopoly had been given to the London brewers for too long a period. Mr. MARRYATT admitted that the Bill would affect the vested interests of many brewers. Mr. HUNIE said, that lie could see no reason why the trade in beer should not be thrown open to pub lic competition. It was full time to break down the monopoly of the brewers. Mr. BROUGHAM said, that it always appeared to him a matter of much difficulty to snake a change in the system of licensing public-houses. But the monopoly should be gradually broken down, without outraging public opinion on the one hand, or injuring individual property on the other. A great deal had been said of the injury likely to be created by enlarging the number of public-houses, but he could see no reason why tippling should be increased by doing so, than that multiplying the mugs or glasses on the tables would double the number of dram-drinkers— (A laugh). He had no objection to accede to the pro position of at once throwing open the retail trade in beer. There was a manifest inconsistency in the pre sent law. He thought that every man ought to be allowed to buy his pot of beer as well as his loaf of lucid where he pleased, and at the price he pleased. , Mr. G. BENNET wished to state what were his views with regard to the Bill. If the House would not refuse that it should be read a second time this evening, he would afterwards have it referred to a Committee up stairs, and there such alterations might be made, as the Committee thought necessary. Ile admitted there were many difficulties in the - final ar rangement of this measure. The monopoly of the brewers had grown to such an extent that it was 'producing to invade the property of the trade without *producing a still greater evil than at present exists ; indeed the evil had risen to such a height that he entertained no rational hope of completely removing it; but he wished it to be understood, however,thongh it was difficult for Parliament to devise any effectual measure, that the Magistrates had the remedy en .tirely in their own hands, if they only put, into exe cution the powers with which they were invested. In Wiltshire, where the Magistrates had done their duty, evil was completely corrected; and he would .mate, for the information of those Magistrates in, .other counties who have neglected this part of their „duty, how the Magistrates of Wiltshire had removed **, . evil. Whenever they perceived a monopoly grow. Isig up, and the brewers getting into the possession olthe public-houses, that moment they opened a new .4buse in opposition, which at once operated as a tor ctive of the monopoly. The consequence of this i iiirKinct on the part of the Magistrates has been, that Aytite evils which were felt elsewhere, did not exist at -l a n in Wiltshire. In order to give the House some An of the great monopoly which the brewers had ti ihi's .tiade,:he would state to the House some of • 4hose•districts over which the brewers had a complete controul. In those districts it was not one public liortse, O. two, .which were in .their possession, but . it garli all,. an d . .Cnoqueittly one unwholesome mix surewas.impaed upon the inhabitants of those places. In Portsmouth there were 93l public - houses , of which ' 26S were in the possession of the brewers and Magis trates. He did not complain generally that public houses should be in the possession of Magistrates, but In large towns , such as Portsmouthoheleading Ma gistrates were in general either brewers themselves, or were in some way connected with the trade, and in such cases a Monopoly in their hands was prejudi-1 'vial to the Public. In Portsmouth there wereonly 29 public-houses free; the rest were in the possession of the spirit trade. to King's Lynn, in the County of congestion In thoie Con Odes where there were pm' bi eweries, there was also a monopoly ; ior 'there the inahster stepped in and enjoyed the sartk fttdnopoly the public brewer did in the other instance: In theneighbour hood of London there were 180 public-houses, all' of which were in the hands of the brewer.' except lg. 'ln the eighteen districts which were under the Excise, there were 8,8.59 public-hosses in the possession of the brewers. Thus. they had-a proportion of five to one of all the public•housesin these districts in their hinds. • This was a great grievance whkh reqnired an effective remedy. He proposed to five a greater freedom of .the trade, as a remedy Idiely to remove the evil; but, from.the opposition of Ark.hrewers he found himself obliged to give up that clause. ilre. brewers were no small persons ; next to the opposi tion of Government none was mere formidable than that of the brewers. If he were to persist, he could expect little support from Government, and perhaps not much at his own side of the House except from the Hon. Member for Montrose and a few other!. His intention was, that after the second reading of the Bill, it should be referred to a Committee, which could strike out that clause compelling Alagistrates to grant licenses. This he cdnsented to do, in the hope that the excellent measure of his Hon. and Learned Friend (Mr. Brougham) would be carried into effect. His Bill would then compass only two instead of three objects; first to pet snore discipline in the trade, and, secondly, to give se:urity to the property of the publican, for which there was none according to the ptesent system. The Hon. Gen tleman concluded by moving that the Petition be laid on the table. Mr. HUME said that, in Scotland, there were no restrictions to the number of alehouses, and no evil was known to arise from the multiplication of them. It was attended with this advantage, that the ale was always cheap and good. He was persuaded, if the same practice was introduced into England, it would be attended with the same advantage as in Scotland. Mr. F. PALMER said if his Hon. Friend withdrew the .clause compelling Magistrates to grant licenses, he might as well withdraw the Bill altogether. The Petition was laid on the table, and ordered to be printed.. THE BOWDITCHES. Mr. HOBHOUSE presented a Petition from Messrs. Bowditch;complaining of the hardships to which they had been subjected by the proceedings instituted against them in the matter of Maria Glenn; and in presenting the Petition, commented in strong terms on the conduct of Mr. Justice Best, and the language used by that Learned Judge in refusing the applica tion of the petitioners for a new trial. The Marquis of LONDONDERRY was ready to I admit that the Hon. Meniber had done no more than his duty in bringing forward this Petition ; but he would put it to the Hon. Gentleman's. own mind to say, whether he bad not gone beyond his duty in his comments on the Learned Judge (Best) to whom he had alluded ? Mr. HOBHOUSE said he intended no imputation of corrupt motives to Mr. Justice Best : he had only said what he had done to sheer the Learned Judge that he was, like other men, fallible. • Mr. C..WYNN thought the Hon. Member ought to have given nofice to Mr. Justice Best of his inten tion to bring forward this charge against him. Mr. HOBHOUSE again replied, that he brought no charge against Mr. Justice Best, but that of being, like other mortals, liable to err; and that the Court bad shewn itself so in this case by discharging Mary Whitby, who had been convicted of perjury, and had been the cause of the Bowditches sufferings. The SOLICITOR-GENERAL said, that Mary Whitby was discharged with the consent of the pro secutors' Counsel. After some further conversation, the Petition was received, and ordered to be printed. ,absequettly read by detylit making the quarterly payments and receiving the dividends of theannuity would be vested, from the sth April, 1822, in trustees• to he named by railia mint, and the whole would be conducted with as small a charge: for management its possible—an ad vantage whichivonld reiult from the appointment of trustees. The'stsm of 2,8009001. had been assumed. as the proper amount of annuity, although perhaps it might have been smaller if contracted for by any private body, suppOsing the rate of interest to be, little more than three and a half per cent. In making ifie contract on the part of the Public, it was not ne. iesiary to be particular as to the precise sum, al tholigh •his Noble Friend (the Marquis of London., deity), in stating the general plan to the House, had very properly assumed a particular price. The cal culation had been made upon the Three per Cent.. Consols, being at the supposed price of 821. But taking them at 751. the amount would be 2,862,8001 about 62,0001. more than the sum proposed in the original statement. With the rate of interest at four and a quarter per cent. at which it was fair to assume it, with reference to the late great financial operation, the sum would be 2,902, 0 001. and perhaps that would have been a fair ratio for any contract in this case. He mentioned this, .because they had taken it at 100,0001. less than it would have been in the event of any other arrangement having been entered into With a private party. But they did not agree to re mit taxes to that amount. 'The remainder of the proceedings as to the conduct of the plan was very important. The annuity would be placed in the hands of trustees to be nominated by the Bill. , He should propose that the trustees be the sort 'of per sons nho had hitherto been connected with the issue and payment of these pensions. These were--6-the First Lord of the Treasury, the Chancellor of the Exchequer, the Paymaster-General of the Forces, the Master-General of the Ordnance, the Treasuier .of 'the Navy, and the Governor and Deputy-Goverpor of the Bank of •England. As the payments were made through the Bank in some Measure,' it was highly desirable that a free and confidential cimmu pication should subsist. The second and third Revd*- - tr , ims were then read by the Right Honourable Gen tleman, as follows : . ~ . .. . " 2. That it is the opinion of this Committee, that the said Trusters should pay into the Excheques the several anGuat Aunts hereinafter mentioned, by four equal quarterly instalments, on or before the 15th January, 15th April, the 15th July, and the 20th October ; the first payment thereof to be made on the 20th of October, 1822: .• 1, ~ Ist Year, ending 15th , X 24thYeartendingt5th X July, 1823 4,900,000 I July, 1846. 1,580,000 2d 1824 4,700,000 25th 1847 . . 1,130,000 34 1825 , 4,540,000 26th 1548 1,630,000 • 4th .1526 4,410,000 27th 1849 1,530,000 5•11 1827 4,290,090 28th 1850 1,430,000 6th 1828 4,119,000 29th 1351 1,340,000 7th . 1529, . 4,00000 30th 1852 1,250,000 Bth 1130' ' 3,860,000 51st 115.; 1,170,000 oth 1131 3,720,000 32d 1854 1,080,000 10th 1839 3,590,000 53d 1855 1,000,000 11th 1833 3,450,000 34th 1856 920,000 12th 1834 • 3,310,000 35th 1857 860,000 13th . 1835 3,180,000 56th 1858 780,000 14th 1856 3,050,000 37th 1859 720,000 15th 183/ 2,910,000 38th 1860 660,000 16th 1838 2,790,000 39th 1861 100,000 17th 1839 2,660,000 40th 1862 540,000 18th 1840 2,530,000 41st 1863 490,000 19th 1841 2,410,000 42d 1864 440,000 20th 1842 2,290,000 43d 1865 590,000 21st 1843 2,170,000 .44th 1866 350,000 22d 1844 2,060,000 45th 1867 300,000 2.1 d 1845 1,950,000 or such part thereof as may be and applied conformably to —And that the said several necessary{ sheidd be appro the said Resolutions. " 5. 'That it is the opinion of this Committee, that for the purpose of enabling the said Trustees to male the several pay ments hereinbtforenientioned, at the Ei xchequer. at the several periods aforesaid, they should be empowered, froM tithe to time, to sell and dispose of so much of the said Annuity as may be ne cessary for that purpose, but so as that no greater amount of An nuity should he sold or disposed of. in any one year, than would be sufficient to raise the sums necessary to complete the whole of the payments to be made within the year, or to discharge and pay off the Principal and Interest of any E xchequer 'Bills which may have been issued on account of such payments." It was desirable that the power to issue Exchequer Bills should be , given to the Treasury, in order to elude the necessity of going into the market when in an unfavourable state for the sale of any part of - the annuity. Accordingly this was proposed in the 4th, Resolution, with the power of resorting to other funds. for the payment of the interest upon sucli adiances. The Right Hon. Gentleman then proceeded to mime the fourth Resolution to the Committee: " That it to the opinion of this Coinmittee' that for the purpose of enabling the said Trustees the more re;dily.to.provido the means nesessuy for making the said payments, in the most convenient and economical manner, the Commissioners of his Majesty's Treasury should be empowered to issue, to the said Trustees, Exehequet Bills to an amount nut excee ding the sums necessary for completing, from time to time, the said payinents . ; which Exchequer Bills, together with the interest thereupon should, from time to time, be discharged and satisfied bZ the said Trustees out of any monies to arise by the 'sale of the add An nuities, or out of the dividindi thereof; and that, untll suck/fer ment. the interest accruing on slick Exchequer Bills may be paid out of any supplips voted by Parliament." The first half-yearly dividend, amounting.to the sum of 1;1,400,000, would be paid on the 20th Oc-, tober, commencing froM the sth.April; -but the true tees would have a quarterlypayment of 'pension to make before this, and for -the 20th of October, 4:75,000 over and above the portion of dividend -re ceived, would be required to meet the demand of the , pensions. For the January quarter it would be ne cessaty to be prepared with a million of money,,frorip .one.source or other. On the sth of April followiat another half-yearly dividend would be paid; and On the sth of July again there would -be - another' trip ment of' a million s to make. In the Octotier arid April quarters there would be no difficulty, but. provision I must be made for-the payments in Januaryand ' The whole difficulty would consist • in 15'rorriding,f4 1 the first years. In three years the amount or the pensions wouldl..he reduced to £4,500,000 ; in. five, years to £4,100,000 ; and in seven years it would be • E 4,000,000: The annuity in the hands of the.C4sm , missioners after a certain time would meet the amount of the pensions, and therefore there' would . be nothing to provide when that period should arrive. Among the various 'points of blew in-which this - . ay. rangemeut was important ) was Its relation to the .. pried& of a Slaking Fund, to the o f sera odßiosis ; and or part of that world from that feed by.this arrangement, but the mi.wonletremain In the bands of the Com. ir to the - itsti.onte . `tea: This eeir thane. provided its own extiactlak is lest years, it t h e . time that ft uhtedorpermasent charge to the burdens of the cesatry. There was a future charge if half-pay and rmioa, to is .iocatred, which would lei be ideal tpr L l ' this plan. Althotigh a sum ar timid he s saved to the Public mute .elly, y t it a p ; • of thin Would be reserved to heel the grti Cliarge for half-psry which must coon orise. It was ifficult to estimate the probable insoant of this charge, which must depend upon the rapidity of promotions and tither causes not easily calculated. But it was proposed to reserve 1;400,000 a year out of the sating to the Public to be apprw priated to this purpose. He considered that in lest than eleven years the Siuking Fund will have arrived at that which was proposed to be its maximum a compound interest, viz. to the proposition of one per cent. or the whole debt. He proposed, therefore, that £400,00 should be added annually to the Sink. ing Fund, to accumulate at compound interest till it vas wanted to meet the growing charge, as he had stated, for half-pay. It was plain, therefore, that this plan mud, in some way er another, operate in the reduction of unfunded debt. He had stated that there would be a saving of 2,200,0001. by this ar rangement, and he proposed to give 1,800,0001. to the Public in the shape of remission oftaxes—(Hear, hear).—The remaining 400.0001. would be aptfrepri. ated- as hi had before stated. It might, 'perhaps, be considered as premature for him to go into a state. meht.of the taxes he should propose to diminish.— Such 'a course might wear the semblance of 'pre sumption, in assuming the sanction of the House to the plan he was then only laying before them. But, as he was desirous of bringing the Whole plan of his Majesty :Government under the view of the House, and knew how.'interesting this branch of it was to persons 'out 'ord.otirs, 'and - to - Hthiciurable Members who felt with, them; lie would 'take the liberty of proCeeding to that part of his subject without reserve (Hear, hear).—He had selected such taxes for redul tioo-arappearedto hilts most likely to meet the feel rrigs'or Die country, and what *as more, afford sub stantial telief at the same time. He believed there wasirit# little difference of opinion either in the Pe iitionyliteicsited Yo' that House, or in the sentiments of Haii. Mein tiers, as to its being desirable that the Salt Tax should be reduced—(Hear,hear). Ile had taken the liberty to object to a motion of the lion. Member For Warehain (Mr. Calcraft) at the begin. ,ri . ing of the Sessiori for the - reduction of this tax, be cause he thought the mode in which he proposed to effect that reduction would- be embarrassing and in jurious to the trade in that article, and also because it was connected with an attack on the public credi tor, but not from any partiality for . the tax itseE. The amount of duty at present was 15s. on the bushel of salt, and he should propose to give up 13s. of :ha, leaiing a duty of 2s. a bushel, which he intended should be equalized throughout the-United Kingdom, including Ireland—(Hear). —ln doing this, however, it was necessary to consider the interests of the trat'e; and it was obvious that the remission of 13s. wed be ruinous to the dealers in the article, and all udders whose commodities bore a portion of it, if it we:e not removed to a certain limited period. Altlicugh, therefore, it was his intention to move the lleso:u.:on directly, he did not contemplate the reduction of ibis duty before the sth of January next. The stock now in hand would by that time be disposed of, and by an arrangement with the Excise all further difficul ties might be obviated. Though the Public would wait, they would-always have this benefit in view, and meanwhile traderswould be able to adjust their interests With regard to Scotland, it was his intention to reduce the duty in that country from 6s. to 2s. in order that there might be a free trade of the article throughout the empire —(Hear, hear).—He should also propose that all exemption's and allowances upon salt be re pealed, except in cases of exportation to foreign ports. —For the purposes of exportation he should propose that salt be allowed to go duty free; but for no other purpoirK By . equalizing the duty with the Irish, Mach fraud:viotild be prevented. British salt ex , ported to Ireland would go duty free, and the trade of every port of the United Kingdom would be free and unfettered—(Hear, his)).-13y this arrangement, therefore, it was plaits that the fisheries would greatly benefit. - For the protection of the British salt-maker it would be necessary to pot a duty of 2s. 3d. on foreign salt for the fisheries. The arrant of reduction of taxation accruing from this would be 1,300,0001. leaving a duty of 200,0001. in the aggregate to Le levied On that article. The duty Would continue to be collected bT.the Excise, but, Once paid, it would be free to go through all the internal parts of the kingdom—(Hear.). Sir JOHN NEWPORT asked what were the Right Hon. Gentleman's views with regard to foreign salt in Ireland P . ' The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, there would be no alteration observed towards Ire land. -The next article to be affected was on the other side. of the Channel, and he confessed he was the :more disposed to concede something to Ireland, as the reiseal .of the Sall Duty in this country would be tatliar prejudicial than otherwise to that country.— ,The'bigh rose of duty in this country was an adyan- Akirio Ireland, but he was sure thatgenerou,sf collie svould - stot wish to' possess an advantage to the deti - i. cf tiient s oliheirlellOw-subjects, and therefore it was shat4..lidltfOire. this measure should be coil nWalfraksoosething contemporaneous and pece rrsarit.ppliciible. to Ireland—(Hear, hear). The 'lletieeittiew thak there was nothing in which the feel ings ilf 'lreland *ere more unanimous than in desiring ,tlre repeal, of the. Window Tax—and it was his inten tion to propose a complete repeal of that duty from the6th of-July nest—(Hear, 'hear).—lts addition to that he should also propose to take off • the Health puty—an impost'efat had been removed in this country since the time of Williani the Third, as a us improper in its nature—(Hear, hear)... -The amount 'of the Windosi and Hearth-duty remitted weuld hardly exceed 250,0001. The next article was one on rhich there was a considerable feeling in the Pub -lic but onron which it was necessary, to have some little explanation—he alluded to the duty ou leather Lehi an the able, : : I Brighton i ,, . . . . _ i " h . ' there rh"tbeat" atteri; A u .'.•' On Il e: . - ry'' 's '' ' ' - ber thhi r t s aint the int . paces, M 111 and Read- V' . ',t it, it er .—` • ' ~... i s o t , 0404( 1 Ir , g ,- .. the pri done even , ' • c • "• - • .. " 1 3 ','" 1 for the ,;,, al ,l ipg, witre in the bends pf the,trwwers.. . There was ne hoped, 'm - - 4. en ' .i be tam from I miss _._ ••,. -. , • • ~ . anniunt of live no dart of the kingdom from which he did not - cle• pie Ito, ohjection wool - ' made to .., hew t A ve fa ini on cw, tb. BI was reed stecetve similar . informagemp but;the number he had Pena iliedgCcanal i t tee ' • t *tated was quite suecient i ex at go. Just , to 4ve the House ..Inn,ile . t 4 Iriv i4 i n g I": 't•hose payments. The Right itrilionei . •to d ; , a . m r,, rkr d la his some congestion of the monopoly :of the brewers. linangtlibleV itlentnin then read big first Itebninann molt provided _.... .3.--......L..f.i.,....;e,_ sobsequent4 read by the Chairman The det T 4 ._ "me time that ................ ...... 1.....—J....e. ..../ 0t... PLAN FOR THE REMISSION OF TAXES. Qn the motion of the CHANCELLOR of the EICHE• Hula, the House went into a Committee on the Naval and Military Pensions and Civil Superannuation. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said that in rising to call the attention of the House to this subject, he need only briefly recal to their recollec tion the pi inciples of the Resolutions they had come to on the 3d of the present month. By these the House bad recognized the Naval and Military Pen sions, granted upon the authority of Parliament, as a debt to which the good faith of the Public was pledged, and were as much bound to discharge, as any other portion of public debt. The House had also re 7 cognized the principle of so apportioning this part of the public debt, in such a manner as to relieve the nation from the full weight of it for a certain her of years, by converting it into a fixed annuity for a term of forty-five years. After the. House had' agreed to their Resolution, it was understood that it was the intention of Parliament that the measure should be conducted on the principleof open compe tition, in order that the whole proceeding might be carried on with the utmost candour. He contessed, that for his own part he never had been very sanguine is his expectations that any party except some of the great public bodies would become the contractors.for a scheme of such magnitude. The results proved 41* accuracy of his notions; for although much negocia tion and communications of different descriptions_ had taken place, part of which was before the Public, no arrangement had been concluded of the nature which he had been authorized by that House to make. He now, therefore, came forward to lay before the . House the proposal for another mode of effecting an objeit' in every respect so desirable under the present cir cumstances of the country. The plan he was about to offer for their approbation and sanction would be found to possess.many advantages over that before agreed upon. It was proposed that the Public should itself become the contracting party upon the present occasion ; and the advantages of this would he, that by-keeping the payments in die hands of . Govern ment the party would become responsible to• that House and to his Majesty's Treasury,, at the game time that the risk would fall, where in justice it ought k. , !l i! .11 tl