Star. — London, England, 1817-02-25 00:00:00

I oreiustry energy of the Government was directed, Titers might have been manifested some partial in clination to public disturbances during two years of scarcity ; but in the enactments of that period they were never contemplated,' The principles of the French Revolution, and those alone, were the great fountain and origin of the system then pursued... .(aflear).—This consideration led to topics that he felt could not be disagreeable to the sell-complacency of the Noble Lords opposite. What, he would then, were the grand principles of our modern policy v when our army in Spain wa-engaged in its succe, sion of 'triumphs—when the Nations of the Coats ' sent, in imitation of nor ample, wire deterniined to make a struggle for their intftpendence ? It was this—that we had actually extinguished the spirit of Jacobinism —that V. limey ex. original differences might have existed as to the justice of the war, the univer sal feeling of England and of Europe was, that the war in its progress :tad assumed a new complexion—. that the aggressions a the military government of France had Made it'a war for liberty, for justice, for the rights of rations—that the experience the people . of EuYope had felt of the tendency and result of the prifici; les of the Revolution—of the sanguinary ex- 1 cesses in which they terminated, and the tremendous despotism ty which they were succeeded, had at length recalled the people of the Continent to sounder views, and made them feel, that they, the people, bad also, .with their Sovereigns, a common right in legitimate government and public order ( Hear, hear). In one word, that our successes had completely ex. tinguished Jacobinitm -for ewer. But then came the Peace—that settlement of Europe as it was called a Peace never equalled in the production of more cruel wrongs—a settlement that has directly, and with every dist epic' of justice, Lid prostrate every prin ciple that heretofore characterised the Law of Nations .—.that transferred nations without regard to sympa. • thy or interests-that tied people toge:.er, not even connected by the most remote affection,- that outrag ed all those principles and declarations en which the Powers of L'brope professed to act. When these things happened, then it was that the subdued spirit, . that so long desolated the earth, again rose—then it was thatJacobinism spoke again, and something to speak at, and, hydra-beaded, resumed its pristine strength.—(Hear, hear.) —Were there no other cir cum.tances that tended to give life and strength to iu exertions ? We were told on a former occasion by the Noble Lord, that by the ordinances of Puovo natics, that war was favourable to certain permits of commerce. The converse of that proposition went . to prove. that under the Christian dispensation, peace must be destructive in the proportion as.war was te. Adria' to our trade. Yet had England no claims upon the Nations of Europe? _ Could she not have said after the glorious successes of th.wwar, when she had in her hands tire means of securing her demands .—We have purchased for your Governments, exist.. ence—for your People, jodependence ? It was British means that rescued you—it• was arms secured . your release. Our resources arise from our commer cial prosperity —:it was that prosperity restored your strength—supplied you Treasury with sub'sidies.— And Ow before those great benefits ate ratified, we demand that commercial prciereat and intercourse, the resources of which have been so available to . your own security Wear, hear ) and on which the means of our own sesuscilation after such sa.rifice. deptnd. The Minister that omitted such demands, andsuch an orportunity, has to answer in no light • degree to the aggravated distresses of his country (Hear, bear, -v.) The result has been general di.. recolicctii all ,' efforr. iouteot. The hoc people . Ing the :ts they bad nude, and aware of the sources from whence these efforts flowed, have looked with astonishment and indigo:viol' at an arrangement in 'Lich no one, stipulation in favour. of British prosperity was gua ranteed. No other commerce bas followed this settle ment of Europe, save the African Slave Trak—. (Haw. hear.) He now came to the particular evil, and to the proposed remedy toe it. It was stated, that Societies existed throughout the nation, whole object was to misrepresent and overthrow Fathering". .If such were the case, what vrgs tile natural ink+ ence ? Was it not, that Ministers 'should hasten to apply to Parliament-as the propei Place for bread.' gation and redress? Was not-Parliament the proper • Instrument fis dissipatigg-the popular delusion, for giving additional strength, if wanted, to the haat* .of the Executive? Report stated, that the first ateeting..-the first overt act (as it was as . vetted) of actual tresson--took place• m long ago as the 18th day of November last. Oa this peat. - aeon it was said, that the most inflammatory langu ag e _ was used to excite the people, and to vilify the Go. versemeat. Yet the Noble Lord says,.that it was only three weeks before the meeting of Parliament that be had any notice that this meeting was treasonable. But sorelton the 2 of December the doubts of the Noble 'Loft wait have been removed ; for on that • Occasion, allshe adjuncts of revolution were in full Imbibition—hi-coloured flags, tricoloured cockades, sad caps of liberty f What would their Lordships • chinch, when they learned that the principal agitator at both these meetings had been in dose correspoo dente with the Noble Secretary ; nay, had waited in • =on the Noble - Viscount, and had of course received with all that courtesy for which the, . .• Noble Viscount was celebrated ? But what would •. their Lordships say, when they heard that the Noble. Viscount-bad, with all solemnity, laid his hand upon , • his heart, and assured the principal agitator that . he would lay before the Prince Regent the proceedings • ". of that first meeting which had since been declared %AD be treasonable —Visor, kw, and a laue.)— s, ler his own pact be could not help thinking, that the areond meeting must have been called wider the aus ; pites of his Noble Friend (Lord Sidmooth), who had been induced to lend his official aid to his new also - cis*, the agitator—(aleetk)—for *laicise could be inferred front that sweet intercourse between those. “copnblic characters I (a Lath.) To be sure, while • AM principal person of the. drama was thus its . :itinyed . in heaping merited eulogies on his Noble Ally, it did so happen tharaw.insorrectionary shoo. • --lOW is snot* part' of the field excited and led fertb an entry to frustrate all those schemes for the • skompsißity which had been concerted with • oehoitin.isodiestralithip (a Angus.) But what wa s theta* 410• •Had the Noble Secretary dane-all - tbst.be 4aaldf„ . Had. be done all that h e ought ? Had be not. o, the contrary, in the very thick of his oewly4iscoltered treason, further pro rogued the Farßement, instead of calling it together ? Mad he not gone counter to the uniform practice of the Constitutioo, by thus barring the doors of Parlia ment in a time of public danger, when they ought more especially to have bon opened ? But what use did the Noble Secretary , make of the laws then in force? Their lArttships mould be astonished - to hear that, though the provisions of several statutes were in full efficacy, not one bad been applied. The Re port hid noticed, with proper horror, the outrage on the Prince Regent ; an outrage as detestable, when ithe . personal qnalities of the Prince were considered, - aa it was alarming, on the ground of its being di : 'rem.] against the Sovereign. Why. then, had not the Noble Secretary come down before with a propo -1 sition, which all could understand, and to which all ' would readily agree, that the person of the Prince Regent might be more effectually protected? As doubts existed whether the Act relating to the King could comprehend the Regent, a by had not Minis ters taken the earliest opportunity of extending its provisions to the acting Sovereign ? They sheweJ a prodigious hurry to acquire a power of arresting people at pleasure; they were in the most violent haste to withdraw the great palladium of British liberty, but they were slow and temperate, and deliberate enough, in bringing forward any mea stires for the better protection of the Royal person. He thought it an omission that no such Bill bad been brought forward, and certainly he, for one, should not have hesitated to give his consent to it; nor was he disposed to object to a Bill for the regulation of Public Meetings, for he was convinced that some re straint was essential to the liberty of the people them selves. He was sure that there was no Lord in that House who would not lend his assistance to both these objects. But the specific produced {his night by the Noble S:cretary was ill adapted to either of these purposes : it was, besides, objectionable on the very grounds on which former specifics of the same nature were supported: He could not' but pronounce it monstrous, that at such a time as this every man's' liberty should be put in jeopardy, while bills of in demnity would always be ready for those who abused this power. It was intolerable, that a raw snore sacred than Magna Charta itself should be thrown aside, and that even the legal rights of the'orpressed should be defeated by the fres:i opprets'on of an act of indemnity. In former times, actual war or actual tebellion had alone been considered a justification of such a suspension of an Englishman's dearest right..a., Now externally all was quiet, unless indeed the clan gers of that zkri&e: peace (so cried up by the Noble Lords) were equal to all the horrors of the French Revolution. And as to Ireland, there, according to Ministerial a:counts, all was quiet, though, to tell ch. truth, he (the Marquis Wellesley) could not' help assenting to the saying of a facetious friend who bad just left that country, that ss it was as quiet as gun powder I" At all *vests, Ministers shoidd be cau• tious in their proceedings: they should feel that the present waster of the nation required to be treated with the utmost delitacy, and that-every mode should be taken to convince the people that the Parliapseot did not outstep the just limits of necessity. As yet, I he had seen no evidence which could lead him to think that the danger was of aufficient form and dig. nity to require that personal liberty should be violated liolorc he concluded lie most say on: word, and that l , was, that while the House was passing an act for the repressioo of sedition, it should not forget the causes which had first stirred up the discontent of the peo ple. They should recollect the advice of Lord Bacon, that 44 the sorest way to prevent 'editions is to take away the matter of them." They should in this spirit thew a readiness, increased rather than re laxed, to reduce all extravagant expenses, to remove all unnecessary burdens. No permanent good, no real security, could'accrue to the State, if the Parra. =cot from alarm, however jest, should suffcr its at tention to be diverted from :he gteat object of pdblie retrenchment. (Neer, hear.) • The Earl of lAVE 4 RPOOL contended, that it was aot-a case of arecedents, but tbat the real clues. tioo wt.` whether there existed at the present moment a sufficient cause for the proposed measure ? His Lordship then proceeded to argue, in answer to the statement of the Noble Marquis who preceded him; that the two years immediately succeeding the peace. had displayed our commerce in a flourishing gate,' and that the distresses of the country originated in' the depression of out agriculture, Which was further, necessarily felt in our domestic trade. In answer to the observation, that Parliament should have beep called together sooner, if the country were really in the situation represented, he said, that it was not un-' ,til within three weeks of the Meeting of Parliament Government had obtained precise infordiation upon which they could act, or propose a legislative mea sure ; and even since fhe .Committee had sat, some important information had been Obtained. In fact, more danger would have been incurred by an earlier meeting of Parliament, than there was beadk to be expected ; and he could mention many cases in which Members of Counties were implored not to quit the country even now, so necessary was the ardor:ice of their presence considered to the public safety. The House had., in the Report before it, evidence of a virulent conspiracy, spread over the country by clubs, by secret societies, secret oaths, and seditious publi cations, for the overthrow of the nisei.; Govern ment. This, he coat. nded, was • a sefficsent caws for the presentmeasure. The conspiracy was more malignant than that of 1796, because its members had learned a lesson from their predecessors, and were the more formidable, as being more aspect and practised in the business. Earl GREY—In a less exhausted state, and at an earlier hour - of the debate, he should have been led to enter more fully into thi s most important ques tion ; but it ikfuld now be out of his power to do jus tice to what he felt, or to acquit himself to the satis faction of his own mind, in. defending the canes of the people against the most unnecessary and most ;to called-tor act that any Miniater of the Crown, in any period of our history, had ever ventured to propose to Parliament. H. must contend, with his Noble IPriend (Marquis Wellesley) that in his belief a ealia. ' derable part of the dissatistution and tremotelme *at so generally prevailed had beim lbs. eimge 4 4 Ow =and he should tie sorry to dusk ' • he Wok-that tbe Oa* of liberty was indi . .hearts of ilaAdoes e . —.The Noble ,Ibord4 . )30 Ai iid,- 0 4 4 * peace was geode** taidireal so Ivied g lo p; and , teetaialY, as far as respecteds ear ernts—as far as the glory of 'the Vikstrious Oe tieral who comtnanded our troops, and the bra very of the troops- themselves, were concerned, th circumstances of this puce were unprecedented in our annals: But, in his opinion, equal to the glory and renown of our arms was the disgrace of the ne gotiations. The Noble Lord had s rid, these negotia tions had secured independence and freedom to the other nations of Europe which they never enjoyed be fore. Where were we to look for this care tor the in dependence of other Stases; Was it in Genoa? Was it in Venice ? Was it in Saxon) ? The Nable Lord had attempted to justify a charge of not having as sembled Parliament sooner; and he ( Earl Grey) begged the House to attend to his detente on this subject. What, said he, should we have called Par liament together while we had not sufficient evidence before us - to justify coercive measures? And was this the only apology that Nibble Earl had to offer to their Lordships ? Was the suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act, that great and glorious bul wark of onr liherties—were restraints on the s 4f the people of Eagland, the wily duties of Parliament in these times of distress ? The duties of Parliament consisted rather, in his opi nion, in manifesting s se hit of conciliation—in spew ing a disposition to do all that was possible to relieve the general pressure—in plying attention to the re spectful remonstrances of the people—in evincing an anxiety to mitigete their sufferings, by a steady ob servance of retrenchment and economy. It had ben said, that even in the year of the Revolution it was necessary to resort to similar measures. He agreed, that in that year a teteporary sospeurien of our liber ties took place, and it was a time of all others which justified such a proceeding. There was then an exile from the throre, still suppratr d by great and power ful persons in both coutories—there wasthen a reign not generally recognized, and the enemy was ready to be assisted by the most powerful foreign aid. But, our ancestors never consented to part with this power for more than a atonth at a time—( Year, hear.) In 105 the circumstances of the country were to tally different from what they are at present. A plot was then formed for the assassination of King Wil liam : and the character of the persons and the pro babilities of its success, could nut be compared with the danger that was now said to exist. And yet, when the country was threatened with all those dan gers, in that very year did our ancestors pass that very statute regulating the trial for treason, which provides that it shall have greater advantages than other trials, and which is now one of the greatest securities of the British Constitution. He did not Nish to go through the'other precedents, but to state generally, that this was the fit st time it had ever been proposed to pass a law to suspend the Habeas Corpus Act, except in cases of foreign and domestic war. Where was the danger which QOM threatened us ? Their Lordships had before them the plot and the actors; they assembled in Spa fields, and were never *followed by more than 2 or SW persons, who dis persed tile moment an alarm of a dragoon was heard. They did not even wait for any operations of the troops sent by General Lord Viscount Sidmouth, and certainly Bunhill-fields never saw a brewer comman der. =(Laeghter.) One or two-shops were however, plundered, and one individual was wounded. The chief bombers of the Spafields plot had been detected, and he hoped wruld be tried as soon as possible. Seditious publications might be punished under the act of 1797, which provides for the preservation of the King's person. Why bad not Ministers done their duty and repressed those peblications? Was it because we had an incompetent Attorney-General, and a negligent Secretary of State (hear,) that extraordinary powers %vete to be 'given to the Crown ?- Ministers had power enough already to prevent taking secret oaths and seditious meetings. Was the British Constitution, as he had read in a • celebrated Witter, as variable as the weather ? Was it only fit to sail Non the smooth surface of a sum mer iv a ;" and when " the tempest rages and the weirlsviud risers," was it not able to carry us through our dangers ? Such was not his opinion of the British Constitution. Upon these grounds he should give his dissent to the second reading of this Bitl ; and should not have thought himself worthy of a seat is that Hawse, if he had not raised his voieeatgainst a measure, which, in his conscience, he thought would he one of the most fatal in its consequences that had seer been adopted by Parliament. The Duke of SUSSEX observed, that he wts pre. sent at the greatest part of the examinations of the Rioters, and the result be had heard was this :—The whole subscription amounted to the enormous sum of ten pounds, which was collected to defray the ex penses of handbills for -calling the Meeting. The waggon went with a debt of 101. which. was still un paid. The ammunition was pot in at the top of Chancery-lane, and was contained in an old stocking. There were about 50 balls, none of which fitted the pistols, and one pound of powder. Such was this mighty plan of insurrection ; but he could not allow mole-Fills to be magnified into mountains. This was l a subject -nearly as serious as votiag lite and death, guilty or not guilty; and it was impossible to vote away the liberlies of Englishmen it; this manner.— The duty of an honest man was only to vete on that side on which his conscience lies. and therefore hal should sit down in voting against the measure.— illear, hear, hear.) Lord GRENVILLE said, the question came to die simple issue—whether the amount of 'the necessity bp. Mich as really to justify the eaoptios of this mea sure ? On looking at this subject, .he did not think it necessary to go into a sort c 4 comparative scale of the dangers of the present moment with the dangers of former pi n ed:; because. in the fluctuating state 'of society and nations, be thought it hardly possible to select one or two, striking circumstances, and M . say that the absence of some circumstance in this case, which there was in another, must put out of consideration those evils which it was necCssaiy to goad against. Never, till the present ;nowt, was, the hope entertained in this country of.ijyiaching the minds of the gre a t mass of the people, not 4 ft c rillis or that sort of religion, but from all religiofsw The seditious writers of the present day, who deluged the country, and filled the air with their ignorant and wicked protractions, did not make, it a question by whom the Government shod& be administered, but • *bather a Government should mist a; all ? whether the *hole frame and constitution°, the c.puntry was lON e 0 corrupt as not to coil. for 4 mere Reform of radiants:l but soak a lefotnt is would asssoutit Le a complete insortection. It was not fru the seen:',. of this or that individual, or of this or that chile persons, but it was for the security of die wboleenk munity that he thought it necessary that Parlistn er . should interfere to arm Ministers with those poe tr which, he feared, were the only means left to pr, tect the sialeryand security of th e n at i on . He deepi,' regretted that it sheuld b e necessar y to suspend th'4 .habeas Corpus Act, even for the shortest period ; bin, since that Was necessary,he was happy that the suspension had not been extended beyond a petite when the subject might be recousideted byttheeptraeii: sent Parliament. The Doke of GLOUCESTER was sorry od rhe.r Lordships even for a moment Voger at this late hour; but he could not reconcile it to himself to give • a silent vote on this most important question, man could possibly be more unwilling than he was% support any measure fcr the suspension of the IL bras Cot pm Act ; hut lie was convinced of the neeeisit) tt the measure, under the present circurbrances of the country, aid would therefore join Ws Neble in voting for the second reading of this IEI, tee m . tint!, at the same time, that he was conirl:ea to differ from so many other Noble and rispecte.: friends. Lord HOLLAND did not mean to discuss el subject at any length in the present exhausted site of the House, and rose to say a few words, merit because, on a question of such magnitude, he co;; , not rest satisfied with giving a silent vote. The t. neral subject had been so well explained on both s:J s of.the House, that it was unnecessary to mut to With respect to the course adopted in 1794, it wcel4 be recollected that other measures had then been rt. sorted to. The Habeas Corps Act was not o ven _ ded in-1795 ; nor during the dissolution of ment ; and he hoped it never would be saspendee is such circurnstarces. It should be observed, that though the complaint now was, that there was a da cay of all religion among the people, the increase of the tlethadists had often been lammed i n teat House. The two things were incompatible, and if Methodism had spread to so great an tenet amens' the people, that very circumstance created a very strung degree of doubt as to the necessity of the pre sent mcefsure. Upon the whole, he cirsld nut think _ _ himself justified in voting for the ld reading toe Lillie present, for three previous requisites sere wanting. In the lint place, it had rot been shewn that eshting laws were i. , adsquate to answer the purpose-241v, it had not b ern shewn that they had been enforced, such as they were—a tact so obvious, that his 14.. V, Friend (1... rd Grenville) admitted that he Was ua,- ble for the circumstance-3(117, it did not appear that this was the proper mode to meet the es . : The Hoots then divided so the motion for the second rev 1.7 of thoihd—Content...... ...... 54 Non-Centent.........v• Proxies.. ..... «....9a tiozies 4V +~'!s Majority ........ —...1 I S While straagers !ere excluded, the bill warread Stand tiny, OMMilted, reported, read a third time and passed. Adjuurued at Tiro o'Clock. MUSE OF COMMONS, PEBRUAILV 4r. At a quarter before four o'clock the Usher of the Black Rod appeared at the Bar, and summoned the Howe to reptr to the House of Lords, to bear the Royal Assent given to various lii;l%. At their return the Sremt stated, that the Royal Assent Ord ,been &co to several Public and Private Bills. Mr. BROODAN brought up the Report of the C.oncnittoe sp• pointed to inspect the Journals of the Hoessof Lot.l..—Ordered to lie on the 'fable. Mr. 11. ADDINGTON presented Returns of the number of Person. ihmmttted tor (Arturo:B relative to Game. under the 4AL of the King.—Ordcred to lie on the Table. Mr, OASKEI.I, presented a Petitiott from the Inli3titrits of Wakefield in favour of Parliamentary Returni.—DrJered IA fie on the 'fable. Mr. BROGDEN presented the Report of the Committee of Sup;ltes. Tho Resolution for granting £5410,1M0 on Account d the Army Estimates. was agr.ed to, and leave given to brug in a Bill. Sir R. HERON presented a Petition in fasiPour of Annual U.& dons and Universal Suffrage, Isom the Inhabitants ut raJortoo : ft Rearewshire.—Ordered to lie On the 1 able. Mr. SHAW presented a Petition frost the eadtller., Cot Li.. tnakers, and Harness *takers of the City of Dublin, artiust um Tim ea Wheel Cartilages and Horses.--Ordired to he au the 'fable. Sir JOHN NEWPORT moved fors stonsnaty retu►n of cite particula frauds And forgtiles committed uo the Stamp OZCV ui Ireland for !he last five years. He understood that tot if XI 50,000 a year had been paid on that meat m br the last lbe years in that country. Chen the Papers should be produced, the iiiksise would i.e that it Mash, parantourst duty to proms purchasers of property. Four distributors of the Stamp Oflise is trviand had Viten convicted and sentenced. He also moved le the roxolt of the inquiries 1134 prosecutions founded upon them, and the probable amount of the forgeries during the period nu m tioned.— Ordered. sir 11. Nk.WPOR r then mowed foe Returns of the amount d Fees taken in striking Dockets of Baokruptey,uut of office Lcvry in Ireland, from the 119th of December, ism, to the la, of Stptrather, ists.—Ordered. Mr. GOOCH ;,resented a Petition from Woodford, for a ciente ur the POor Lawa.—Ordered to lie ou the table. PRISONS. Mr. BENNETT, seeing - The Right Hon. Gentle man in his place, wished to know whether any Re port had yet been made by the Commissioners af pointed two years since to examine the state of the Marshalsea and other Prisons ? _ _ 1 Mr. H. ADDINOTON had replied on a former day to the same question, that no Report had yet been made. He did not know why he shottld be pressed upon the subject, as the office to wl.,cit ►.e belonged was not responsible in such matters. l!e understood, however, .that the respectable indivi4lu-i At the bead of the Commission had visited the Msr dullest during the last few weeks, and he was aut4e rised to say, that the Report might be expected in a very short period. Mr. BENNETT complained that two years had passed, and the Report was not yet produced. ►ie contended that it was the duty of the Home Office, to see that the'Commissioners executed the uult reposed in them. He wanted the Report, in o►der to enable him to biing forward a Bill tor die reguta , lion of Prisons. 5 COMMITTEE OF FINANCE, Sir JOHN NEWPORT had been placed, by the good opinion of the House, on the Committee a 1. , pointed to inquire into the expenditure of the ccury I 7. He felt that honour as he ought, but he found :•:s state'' his health such as to disable him I ram b? t o ii eroti s m *.sse effective Member which the Cornmirce . titlL L e a. He could not answer the confidence te!aeh .., I , • the ouse had placed in him if he retained his sot in the Committee. Under these circumstances, it A were the will'of the House, he would resign that se.: -into its hands. Mr. CALCRAFT then moved, that, ir. crtig queoce of ill health, Sir John Newport should be iii.• charged from the Committee. After a few words from Mr. DAVI GV.iinr. , or 1 ib be thl is be I" be