Star. — London, England, 1822-07-03 00:00:00

to the same extent. It wai felt both in that House, and in the country, that Ministers had not done, in the course of the present Session; what they ought to have done to relieve the people—( Hear, hear), For the late scheme which Ministers had brought for ward, with respect to the Naval and Military Pen sions, he regarded it as a mere juggle, and as being wholly at variance with those principles to which they had announced it to be their, determination to adhere. To what he had already said, in favour of the repeal of the Window Tax, he begged to add a quotation from a speech made by the Noble Marquis. The Noble Lord, on the 3d of April, 1821, had said, 6t if he thought it possible, which he did not, to repeal taxes to the amount of £2,000,000, he would prefer rei-ealing the Window Tax to repealing the Malt Tax." The Malt Tax being given up, it was now, PI el ,s ' hardly fair to call fo r the Wind ow T ax to be given up too ; but if he had shewn, as he thought he had done, that the amount, which was £2,565,275, might advantageously be taken from another fund, he th,ll 4 ht the country ought to have the relief for which he contended. He concluded by moving certain Re solutions, in substance as follows: Ist. That it appears to this House, that the present amount of taxation is so burdensome and oppressive, as to make it the duty u: this House to adopt every means by which, without de triment to the State, that taxation may be reduced. " 2J. That the benefits supposed to be derived from the esta tliNhmeut of a Sinking Fund are illusory ; and that to impose or continue any additional burdens on the People, for the purpose of its support, is highly inexpedient and unwise. " 3d. That the tax levied on windows in Great Britain is un just, unequal in its operation, and most tsppresaive, to those espe cially who are least able to bear it; and that it appears to this House, that the said tax should be forthwith and immediately repraleel." 'The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, that the proposition of the Hon. Gentleman went to the destruction of the Sinking Fund and the annihi lation of public credit—( Ifear ).—lf anything could make it more inexpedient, or more to be rejected by that House, it was, that it would be a most unjust and most faithless departure-from all those pledges which the House had so recently and so solemnly _ _ given to the Public. Upon the question of the Sink ing fund the House had repeatedly and deliberately . . . _ de7ided; an as the first Ite%olution of the Hoti. Gentleman was merely a truism, he should meet it, as such propositions were usually met, by the pre vious question. To the rest he should oppose a most decided negative. With regard to the practical part of them, he would admit that the repeal of the Win dow Tas would relieve the Public, perhaps, more than the removal of any other part of the public bur then.. It was one of the heaviest of those remaining, and had been greatly augmented within the last thirty_ year.. It had recently been repealed in Ireland,where the P.o v erty Tax, being unknown, the repeal of it was ult.:cm:Jed with any benefit. She had never been much subject to the weight of direct taxation. —The effect of the Union had been to increase non- residence ; and this was particularly felt in Dublin, where hooses ~f a superior class were let, in conse quence, to tenants of an inferior order. The impo verished inhabitants, to avoid the tax, had resorted to the expedient of stopping the windows, and thereby had rendered the houses dark and unhealthy. In Great Britain no such effects had been produced by the window tax, and the coosequences of taxation generally had not been to lessen the enjoyments of the inhabitants, or 'to diminish the consumption of the country. By the Excise returns, it appeared that the consumption had increased in all but three dis tricts, which were particularly affected by the hop duty.. He contended that no further considerable re-' duction of taxation ought to be looked for, and that the House had shewn every reasonable disposition to relieve. In the present Session three and a half mil lions had been repealed ; and since the war, not less than seventeen millions; so that the wonder was, not that so little, but that so much had been done— . _ (Hear, /.ear).—He was certain that the House would not attempt to go, in this respect, beyond what was safe and expedient. The Honourable Gentleman fancied he had discovered another resource in the . establishments. It was very easy to say that they should be further :educed, but it was also nece- sary to point out how the expense of them could be diminished. What might be done in future Ses sions he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) could not multi' ate; but in the present, it seemed to him that the House had gone far enough—(Hear, hear). —lt ought to be t ecollected, that the charges on the Consolidated Fund were not at all affected by the re duction in the price of commodities, and the rest made but a small part of the national expenditure. To the lion. Gentleman's allegation of want in the counti y , he (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) opposed the simple and undeniable fact that, excepting in the pe culiar case of agriculture, there was no general want in the kingdom—(Hear, hear)—and to his allegation of the impossibility of paying taxes, he likewise op posed the simple and undeniable fact, that the taxes were paid, and paid without difficulty, because resort was so rarely had to legal process—(flear, hear). — Tile House Tax and the Window Tax might be said to balance each other : the latter certainly pressed most heavily in the country, and the former most lightly ; while in London and in large towns the re verse was the case. Upon the whole view of the state of ne realm, he thought it might be fairly asserted, that no country in Europe had profited so much Icy the return of peace, for in no country in Europe had so large a remission of taxation been made. There was therefore but little reason in the repeated com plaints of the extreme weight of the public burdens. He did not know that the INindow Tax in some sue. ceeding Session might not fairly come under the view of Parliament for abolition ; but at present he could neither approve of the arguments nor of the con clusion of the Hon. Gentleman. Mr. M ABEItLY would never be silent when asper sions were thrown on that (the Opposition) side of the House, like those which had fallen from the Right Hon. Gentleman. He had accused them of wishing to overturn public credit: this charge he would repel. That side of the House had certainly been very anxious for the reduction of taxation ; but not to the prejudice of any particular set of men, or to the injury of the public creditor. They wished, of the sixty millions taken from the People, that the public creditor should fit st take out his thirty mil lions ; but they complained that the course which had been taken by the Government was' inconsistent and unwi e, and that the money which Ministers con tended they expended in good government was not so expended—(llear, hcar).—He 1214111tAilled that good faith ought t o be kept w i t h the pu bli c cre di tor .. Had the battle of Waterloo been lost, where would his capital have been? Since it was gained, he had a right to the advantage consequent upon it, as in the other case he must have sustained the loss. It was said the people did not complain of the taxes. Why, this was because they knew it was useless to complain. What was desired on that side of the House was this, that more should not be taken from the people than was necessary. He and those with whom he had the honour to act, were satisfied that the country might be better governed, an d at less expense. The state of the country was now such, that taking the average state of the whole country, he did not believe that any rent was paid on the soil—(Hear, hear). The Right Hon. Gentlemen opposite might say " Hear, hear !" but he (Mr. Maberly) was a farmer, and knew what he had stated to be correct—(Hear). He be lieved that what was paid as rent was in reality capital, and not, properly speaking, rent. The taxei now paid, he contended, pressed more heavily on the present means of the country than the taxes did on its former income, before they had been taken off to the amount of £17,000,000. The present expenditure of the coun try amounted to £24,000,000. The dead charge, he admitted, could not be touched, but deductin g this from the total there remained seventeen millions and a half to work upon, and he had no doubt that if they went resolutely to work some millions might be saved. In 1792, the whale expense of the country, Ireland included, was under eight millions. Take that, and add the four millions and a half for the dead charge, and then it would be seen that the country was governed at an expense of twelve mil lions more than was thought necessary in the year 1792. He contended that if the subject were con sidered a material reduction might be effected.— The Right Hon. Gentleman had spoken of the im portance of a Sinking Fund : but it appeared from his own papers that he had only had a Sinking Fund during the last two years. Since 1792 the real Sink ing Fund had only amounted to about £4,000,000. This was that which they were told was to support public Credit. Those who sat on that side of the House sere as anxious for the support of public cre dit and for a Sinking Fund as Ministers could be : but they wished for a real Sinking Fund, and not such a one as they had hitherto had. They wished for a red Sinking Fund, ani they had opposed the mea sure of the Government which went to destroy that which.had formerly been established. Mr. WYNN did not mean. to deny the distress of the agricultural intere-ts : at the same time, when the leases of farms had expired, there was generally great competition for them. Things had in a great measure been brought back to the state of 1792. Mr. M A BERLY explained, that lie had spoken of the average of the whole soil of the kingdom. Mr. ROBINSON compared the rate of interest formerly paid on the loans raised for the service of the country with the higher interest paid for loans during the last war, and lamented the unfavourable terms on which the latter had been negociated. He disapproved of the art angement made in the course of the present Session, by which the Public Debt had been augmented, and our burdens put in the way of descending to posterity, as our ance,tors had unworthily handed down theirs to us—(Hear, hear). He looked with much apprehension to the conse quences of some of the measures which had been adcpted, and was of opinion that it was not by a further reduction of taxation that the difficulties of the country could be removed. Mr. HUME did not take the gloomy view of our situation which had just been taken of it by the Hon. Gentleman who had sat down. He believed the resources of the country were sufficient to make it rise superior to all its difficulties. Let those resources be properly managed, and this might become the happiest country in the civil ,zed world. But with this statement he must couple the declaration, that our affairs were not so administered as to promise to con duct us to such a result. The system acted upon for the last twenty-five or thirty years had brought the• country to its present situation. He complained of the manner in which its finances were managed. The confusion which prevailed with respect to them, was strikingly exemplified on the preceding night, %%hen three or four Gentlemen, who spoke on the Budget, had all taken different views of that which ought to have been so plain that no men who had learned the common rules of arithmetic should be able to differ about it. He however congratulated the House that, next year, a new and more simple system- would be introsiuced, and that what the Right Hon. Gentleman described to be the sham Sinking Eurrd,would be done away—(llear, hear ; Laughter ; and cries of " No !") He would state, from the Chancellor of the Exche quer's own words, what a real Sinking Fund meant. He (Mr. Hume) and his friends had been contending, that the Right Hon. Gentleman's Sinking Fund was not a real Sinking Fund ; and the Right Hon. Gen tleman himself admitted, this year, that a real Sinking Fund could only be formed from a surplus over the expendi.ure. Where was this surplus?—and what had the Right Hon. Gentleman been doing but lend ing himself to a complete humbug, which was a dis. grace ta the British Parliament—(Hear, and laughter). He contended that it was as perfect a humbug as ever was practised on any set of men—(Hear). They were, he understood, to get rid of it. He hoped such would prove to be the fact ; and as he had much rather indulge in pleasing anticipations for the future, than in melancholy observations on the past,he should say nothing farther on the subject. On this occasion, A new light appeared to have broken in on the President of the Board of Controul, and sorry he was that almost all the landed Gentlemen had left the House when the Right Hon. President made his observations.— When the Hon. Member for Abingdon (Mr. Moberly) spoke of agricultural distress, the President of the Board of Controul stood up and declared that there was no such thing. Why did not the Right Hon. Gentleman, when the Report of the Agricultural Committee was laid on the table, and when it ap peared from that Report that the rents of the farmers were paid from the capital, and not from profit— why did he not then stand up and combat the state ments contained in the Report ?—( Hear, hear). — It often happened that the greatest sinner wished to appear the greatest saint. This was the case with the Right Hon. Chancellor• of the Exchequer upon this subject. He was always trying out against in juring public credit, %Ode he had heel.% the greatest sinner against it that ever sat on the Treasury Bench --(lfrar j hcar).—The Hon. Member thed proceeded • • . . . to contend that no gatisfattori reductions bad made, and that various arrangements might be in the Army to effect savings. With regard t tax before the House, that was the tax which people to live abroad—(Hear, hear).—'The House and Window Taxes were involuntary taxes, which no man could avoid but at the expense of his health. If this measure was good for Ireland, it would be good for England. He called upon every Member for Ire = land who voted for the repeal of the Irish Window Tax, to give his vote for the present motion. If he did not do so, he was no Irishman —(A laugh).—He then stated the amount of this tax to have increased 900 per cent. and argued, that as the increase had been occasioned by the continuance of the war, it ought in justice to be reduced in time of peace. The only means of obtaining relief to the Landed Interest was to reduce general taxation. The repeal of this Tax would afford much more relief to Landed Gen tlemen than the repeal of the Malt Tax, and he trusted the House would compel Ministers to take it off. Mr. MONCK contended that the reduction of taxation, instead of having an injurious operation upon public credit, would uphold it, and be as bene ficial to the fundholder as any other class. He ex pressed his intention of giving his strangest support to the motion. Mr. DENNIS BROWNE agreed with the Hon. Member for Montrose, that the taking off the House and Window Tax would increase the revenue, by in ducing the return of absentees to this country ; but at the same time, he must object to it at the present. time because the reduction of such an amount of in come would go to shake the public credit. • Mr. CALCRAFT thought this a tax the most de sirable of all others to be got rid of, next to that which he had combated for years, and which he now con gratulated the country upon being about to lose. He thanked his Honourable Friend for the manner in which he haJ brought forward the motion, and gave it his hearty support. Mr. MAXWELL rose amidst loud cries of 44 Ques tion I" Being the Representative of a hundred thou sand constituents, he trusted that he might receive the attention of t he House for a few minutes. He con sidered that Ministers had brought themselves into great difficulty, by what they called returning to a ound system of currency. If it were true that the distress of asricalture was caused by too great an a'sundance of supply over the demand, it was their duty to endeavour to increase the demand. The Right Hon. Gentleman opposite refused to adopt means of bringing back absentees to this country, when a plan was recommended for so doing, and said that it would be a hardship upon those Gentlemen to make them return. He was therefore bound to reduce the tales from that enormous amount, which rendered it im possible for Gentlemen to live in this country. He contended that the Army was kept up to an unneces sary extent. If it was wanted at all now, it was only against those Country Gentlemen who had so richly deserved the distress which now fell upon them. It certainly was not wanted for the labouring classes, for they were now well paid and well fed. He thought the expenditure for the service of the Army might well be reduced froni £8,000,000 to £5,003,060 and he should therefore support the motion. HOBrIOUSE replied. He thanked the House for the indulgence they had granted him, and for the support which he had received. There was one pot don of the House, however, generally known by the description of Country Geuttemen, who he thought might at least have expressed the grounds upon which they did or did not support his motion. He thought their conduct upon this occasion very likely to confirm the Public in the suspicion with which it had been accustomed to regard them. He could not help contrasting it with the noise and clamour which they set up, both in and out of that Hotise, upon all questions which they considered as affecting their own immediate interests—(Hear, hear).—lle thought the Right Hon. Chancellor of the Exchequer had not answered the strongest parts of the argument which he had submitted to the House. The House then divided— For the Motion - . - Against it - - - - Majority against the Motion THE IRISH INSURRECTION ACT. When strangers were again admitted into the gal lery. Mr GOULBURN was on his legs, moving for reave to bring in a Bill for continuing the Irish In sur r ection Act. The Hon. Gentleman said, at this late hour of the night he would refrain from entering into any statement as to the reasons which operated with his Majesty's Government to propose a renewal of this Bill. He would now merely move for leave to bring in the Bill, and take discussion on a future stage. Sir R. WILSON was ready to accede to what ap peared to be the sense of the House, and reserve what he had to say on the measure for a future day, en tering his protest now, however, against renewing the Bill altogether. Lord FOLKESTONE said that he would take the liberty of now addressing a few words to the House, as he would not have another opportunity of explain. ing his sentiments on the proposed measure. lie would protest against it on the same grounds that he opposed it at the opening of the Session. The House had at that time agreed to a Suspension of the Ha beas Corpus Act, and to an Insurrection Act, in Ire land, solely out of confidence in the Government here and in the Administration in that country. The for mer Act was not called into operation in a single in stance. It was, therefore, needless to have passed it, and although no necessity appeared for its continu ance, it still remained on the Statute Book against the whole of that country—(//ear, hear). —The in formation on which the Act was allowed to pass was vague and indistinct, still it had beep agreed to solely on the pledge being given that the whole state of Ireland would be taken into consideration during the Session. That pledge was still unredeemed by the Government; and when the subject was taken up by some Gentleman at his side of the House; it was negatived by the other—(Hear, hear, hear). — It had been stated that Ireland was in actual rebelfi olion, to induce an acquiescence to the measure on the former occasion; but that assertion was contradicted materially by the declaration of the Attorney-General (Mr. Plunkett), who said the country was not in a state of rebellion, but one of a contemptible conspi racy, which, if not attended to, might lead to ulti mate danger to the State. In the dispatches from the Noble Marquis, and in the paper laid on the table, there was nothing to warrant the House to agree to - 59 - 146 • --87 S. Which would probably be erne a long cantinuance: Mr. GOULBURN interrupted the Noble Lord, to inform him that the Act was intended to be but for one year. Lord FOLKSTONE resumed.—On the shelling of the Hon. Secretary it was needless to continue it for a year longer, when, for the five months it was - in operation, it was found not to be • f any use. A: great deal had been said of the, benefit, to be con ferred on Ireland by the new Government.. He did not tinierstand the meaning of the expression. The Lord Lieutenant might have been changed, but were not the same Noble Lords still at the head of the Ad ministration here, who bad for years the-direction of the policy to be observed to %lads that country ? There was Lord Liverpool and the Earrpf West. moreland, as well as the Noble Lord opposite, whir was bedecked with a blue ribbon given by his Sove reign as a reward for his service, to the country. They were for a longtime acquainted with the evils of that country, and had the power to have directed a bene ficial policy towards it. The disturbances were then said to have their origin in the subject of tithes, and that of Caibolic Emancipation. It the lacer was a cause, what a pretty way were they in.—One half the Government at one side, and one half at the other side of the question ! It was quite ludicrous to see the way things ere carried cr.i. There was a Lord Lieu. tenant against those claims, with # Secretary favour able to them at one time, and at another moment the Lord Lieutenant in their favour, and the Sect etary in avowed hostility. After all the professions that had been made, there was no plan proposed but the pre. sei,t measure of brute force. Mr. PLUNKETT would not go into the question; he would merely explain a misapprehension of the Noble Lord as to some observations of his on a for mer occasion. It was merely in consequence of an Hon. Member then saying, that there was a religious war in Iseland, that he had stated that the insurrec tionary movements were contemptible. It the Noble Lord thought there was anything inconsistent with the declaration of the Administration on the subject, he had utterly mistaken_his expressions._ After a few wordc from Colonel i3Aewm.t., Mr. Pitt., Mr. Asaacaosisv, ‘ , .r. V. l'iszotaeLn, and Mr. DENMAN, leave was given to bring in the Rill.. Mr. GOULBUILN said he should take the Bill into consi deration on Thursday next. The Report of the Ways and Means was brought up, and the Resolutions were agreed to. The other Orders of the Day were then disposed of, and the House adjourned at a Quarter to One o'Clock. According to a Return laid before Parliament, the total amount of Bank of England Notes in circulation nn the 25th .of last month, was £16,401,4,;0; of which £13,964,350 was in Notes of f 5 and upwards; A 1,481,050 in Rink Post Bills ; and £956,050 in Notes under £5. _ It appears, by a Return to the House of Commons, that during the last seven years a sum of £38,590 I Ps. Bd. has been paid by the county of Middlesex, for expenses of witnesses attending to give evidence at the Old Bailey. In the year 1820, there was an excess of £l5OO over the general average, owing, we pre sume, to the trial of Thistlewoosi and others, which took place in that year. The cottage in Kew Gardens, in Which the Royal Party par took of an early dinner on Friday, is situated near the Pagoda, but Is so inclosed by tree , and shrubs, that it is hot perceivable till a near approach. It is thatched, and has a most delightful and romantic appearance ; it contains a choice collection of all Hogarth'icelebrated prints. It is said to have been built forty or fifty years since by command of the late Kosc. The Duchess of GLOUCKSTKa, the Princess ALGUSTA, and the Prince and Princess of DICISMAIM, rode in a carriage from Kew Gardens to Richmond Gardens. Mr. Arnim, the principal gardener, was in attendance to conduct the party over the Botanical Gar. dens, which are supposed IT be the first in the world. Th.: Royal strangers expressed themselves highly gratified. A little before five o'clock the Royal party embarked on board the Admiralty barge for London. Tuesday se'linight, John SPICay, a fine boy, nine years of age, bad his right arm torn and shattered, at the New Tay -street spinning mill, Dundee, in such a manner as - to render immediate amputation above the elbow necessary. During the operation he behaved with the utmost composure ; and when the operation was over, he asked, '• Is it cuttit aff noo?" " Yes, my :.ear, it's now over." " That's very gude ; that's very gude." Tne boy was conveyed to the Infirmary, and is doing well. His mother, a poor widow, has several helpless children to provide for. THE AMERICAN NOVELIST.—We ate tequested to state, that new Editions of BROWN'S Tales, Wieland and Ormond, are now ready for delivery. A popular Journal makes the following tewarks on these interesting performances: BaowN's novels are of a very peculiar kind, and afford a sin. gular example of the successful application of certain principles of effect, by which our attention is, at the outset, powerfully raised, and our sympathy, during the entire progress of the work, intensely fixed upon persons who are rendered interest ing, not so much from their individual qualifications, as from the strange situations in which a fatal series of untoward accidents has involved them. This mode of arresting the reader's interest and curiosity, is more or less adopted in every work of fiction— but the first time that it was systematically employed as the main-spring of the interestas the general pervading prin ciple of the whole—was in Godwin's " Adventures of Caleb Williams." 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For particulars apply to Mr. KEMP, Estate and House Agent, No. 57, Judd-street, near Brunswick. square, Kew Road. to ar th to I'c wi sic w 1 tb ad th, qu T 1 to re PC bt 111 th hi of du tri tti co of jug Ii re, th th 13 th at LI iv (It (3 i (11 of tt tt tI b 11 Y t 4 ti I. b t 1 tl tl I t 1 I