Star. — London, England, 1822-02-16 00:00:00

I• of seven or eight millions of taxes, it was much to asoomb that from the numerous c, through which it must pass, not above one-. would reach the pockets of the real cultivator. State must therefore make a sacrifice of sixi seventeen millions, or not give relief to the e; 5 per cent. But it was plain the difference farmer would not be so material as to desers sacrifice. He must look for relief, not to the repeal • of taxation, but to the - great law of Nature. He re . pe aed, that it was?not tax,ation that affected the far mer—Mark-lane influenced him more. Taxation was but a corner of the question, and that he had demonstratively shewn. His view of this was sup ported by the assertion of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman (Mr. Brougham), that even if the land• lord gave up the whole of hierent it 'would not assitti the farmer. Was it not therefore an insult to the, common sense of the country to say, in the same • breath, that the redaction of taxation could alonte relieve him ? He knew it would be said, " where is relief to come from ?•' His answer was, Si whe* it' always does come from"—capital was never long unproductive. The laws of political economy offered the farmers a better source of hope than the confiseo• • tion of taxes—they were in the hands of PaoymeNes, and would be relieved by the due 'course of Nature. What state were the manufactures in two years ago? If the farmer was Ignorant of his true interests—of • the prinCiples of political economy—and even could Parliament be so infatuated as to remove him from . the class of contributors to the State, it would not ft uctify to him. The benefit intended to be given him would he taken from him; by an increased the pro dime, when it would be taken by the landlord, or he • Would loie it in the concession of that price which he . now demanded. And this would be the punishment of Parlament and the agriculturist, for yielding to the delusive misrepresentation of relief accruing from exception from taxation, and hoping to take this, or any other class, out of the operation of the laws of nature—(Hear, hear). He would next, as clearly and shortly as possible, put the House in possession of the view which his Mljesty's Ministers took of the financial state of the country, and the means they looked forward to of making it tend to the general • prosperity. And it would be satisfactory to the House to know, that up to the latest period, the Re -venue continued to shew an increase on a correspond ing 'Quarter last Year. Up to the 13th of February, being five weeks of the present Quarter, there was an increase of Ec2o`4,ooo—(Hear). The best course he could take to put the House in full possession of the 'views of Government, would be, by first apprising them of the extent of reduction they had been able to make since Parliament last met—to shew, under that system of reduction, what would - be the state of the income and expenditure, and what actual sur plus had been realized ; and that would lead him to -the question, of what would be the best application of the means thus derived for the interests of the country. He would make his statements in round' numbers, for although it was his intention soon to: move for the estimates of the different branches to' be laid before the House, he thought he could not too soon let them know his general idea on this in-' teresting and important subject—(Hear, hear). He• should state what it was intended to call upon the; House to vote as the supplies for the year, and •the amounts under the different heads might then be compared with former years, giving a clear in sight of the course they were pursuing —(Hear). — Thus the Estimate of Supply that would be required for the Army, ordinaries and extraordinaries, was £7,748,000. Last year it was £8,736,000, being a di minution of nearly a million (Hear, hear.)—The Navy Estimates, last year, amounted to £6,382,000; this year it would be £5,500,000, making a diminution of £Boo,ooo—(Hear, hear).—The Ordnance, last year was £1 ,094,000; this year it would be £1,200,000; but it wculd be recollected that, last year, consider. able aid was derived in this department from the sale of stores, which eh cumstance, taken into calcu lation, made a real diminution equal to £lOO,OOO. The Miscellaneous Estimates for the last year were £1,800,000, this year they would only amount to £1,700,000. The interest of Exchequer Bills, which was last year £1,386,000, would be £1,290,000. Thus the total supply for last year was £19,398,000, for this £17,438,000; making a clear reduction 01E1,950,000 —(Hear).—This was the actual reduction, exclusive of £BO,OOO transferred to the Navy Estimates, in stead of being supported from other sources. The estimates for 1820, amounted to £21,083,900, com pared with which the reduction in the present year was 3,355,0001. Comparing the aggregate of the Army, Navy, Ordnance, and Miscellaneous Esti mates of the present year, with the amount fixed by the Finance Committee of 1819, it appeared to be £1,107,000. There was a saving of neatly two mil lions over last year, and 3,600,0004 over the year 1820. He would point the attention of the House to what proportion this two millions was a saving of. There were five millions connected with the Army over which Government had no controul, and which, therefore, leaving a dead weight, the whole amount under the power of Government must be taken at thirteen millions, making the saving of two millions 1-6th or 1-7th of the whole—Weer, hear)—Having presented to the mind .of the House what the true Estimates of the year were, he ought to state, on the *other hand, that there would be two extraordinary - charges this year. One would be on account of the disturbances in Ireland, for which it was intended to present a distinct Estimate, to the amount of £350,000; and the second was a grant imposed to be Made for Greenwich Hospital of - £320,000. These aerotild not, 'however, long continue to' obscure the Estitnates. The disturbances in Ireland, he was happy to say, would, according to every appear ance, be confined within a very limited period ; and it was in the contemplation of the Noble Lord at the head of the Admiralty, to absorb the charge for Greenwich Hospital into the body of the Estimates. He should have stated, that this sum for Greeuwich became chargeable from the cessation of those sources of Revenue which accrued to it during the war. The Noble Marquis then proceeded to call the attention of die House to the state of the Income and Expen diture, and•to'shew the surplus of the former, having fsfrit directed the Clet k to read a Resolution to whicfi the House had come, founded' upon the Report of "'mance Committee of 1819. The' Resolution A, that it was'necessary to have a clear Sink- Und to the'amuunt of five millions; and that in ,000... ,how• ever, the extraordinaries which mem ...ering t he last yiiir, and which' *could not Meueggain, - ort. the transfer of the Customs an& Excise coast _blqrkadx to the Navy 40,000,e.. and the, reslao‘iona in ,cute: . d or superannuation, f.,ramounting to £150,000,,t0 r et £230,000, there approved an income or £ 56. ;000, —But tilers the Horse Tax being equal to WOO, which was,. given up last year, •and a payment "Oft French indemnities, £BOO,OOO, • which, to the honour of France, had been;paid, main* £600,000 on that score ; and £219,000 for d Pnblic whik, together amounting Co £999,000, were. to be dedncted from the sum of £56,227,000. This left a clear Revenue of A:55,228,090. Of the Expenditure there were per manent and other charges on the Consblidated Fund, amounting t0.£31;650,000. The Interest en Exche quer Bills was £4500,000, and the Estimates of the -Army, Navy, Ordnance, and Greenwich Hospital, as before stated, made a total expenditure, eiclusive cif extraordinaries of £49,618,000,. and with the addi- , Lion of 0.50,000 for Ireland, £49;968,000; deduct-' ing therefore the expenditure, £49,968,000, from the total income, £55,228,000, there remained a clear surplus of revenue of £5,260,000, covering both the extraordinary and ordinary expenses of the years On this subject he should make no other observation than as regarded India, with respect to which he expected to be able to prevail on the Company to admit a par• ticipation in some charges which had hitherto fallen wholly upon this country. The East India Company supported a body of twenty-three thousand troops, which this country afforded them annually, but they did not bear any part in supporting the Invalids they sent home from that country. It was evidently just that they should do this, and although he had not yet been successful, he could never believe he should long continue otherwise. He was sure that Honour. able Body would feel too much pleasure in contri buting to the burdens of the State, during the present distressed state of the country, to perevere much longer in refusing to admit that just claim. Be vies ing the statement he had just laid before the House, he thought he,should not do justice to the House, nor to his Right Hon. Friend (the Chancellor of the Exchequer), if he did not congratulate them on the proud eminence on which they stood. In com pliance with the Resolution they had just heard read, notwithstanding the pressure of distress on the coun try, his Right Hon. Friend was able to present Par liament a clear, undi?puted, serviceable surplus reve nee of five millions. He had the gratification and the proud honour, as the Finance Minister of the country , I 1 after having carried it through difficulties of finance unexampled in this or any other country, to be able; not only to equalize the expenditure, but to *realize a credit, founded on a clear basis of five millions sur plus—as it rested with Parliament to use this great instrument to regenerate the prosperity of the nation. ...it would now be for them to consider the policy of the proposition cf the Honourable and Learned Gentle. man opposite (Mr. Brongham) with regard to the Sinking Fund. To do this, in his opinion, would be to do away with that which had been their mainstay in difficulty ; at once to dry up the sources of public and private prosperity. Whether they would chuse to apply this surplus to support the principles already , laid down and acted upon, appropriate it to the re duction of taxation, or draw further upon those re- urces which the country, notwithstanding taxation possessed, it would be for the House to decide. The principal object which his Majesty's Ministers had al ways kept in view was to support the high credit of the country ; and they confidently looked forward to diminishing the burdens of the country by reducing the high rate of interest. He was happy to state that there was a fund of 155,000,0001. in the Five per Cents. and not less than 75,000,000/. in the Four per Cents. The combined interest of these two great masses amounted to 10,700,0001. annually. Acting upon the great principle of supporting the public credit, if the situation of the market should once bring the Three per Cent. Stock to such a point as to render it eligible to reduce the higher stock to the level of three per cent. it was their intention to do so, by which a considerable saving would be effected. That they ought not to despair of this, he called upon the House to recollect, that six years after Mr. Pitt created his Sinking Fund, the Three per Cents. which were as low as 58, rose to 9'7 and a fraction ; and he did not expect any great interval would elapse before they should be able, if not to lower it to three per cent. at least to bring it nearer to the measure. If this were accomplished, there would be a saving of interest, and a consequent increase in the Revenue of 9,700,000/.—(Hear) No reduction of this kind, however, could take place, so long as the credit of the country did continue to remain unshaken, as it was to the,honour of the Le gislature to maintain those principles upon which the prosperity of the country was founded. Those who knew anything of the landed interest would know how little it would serve them to destroy their faith in the national credit. If this were not maintained, the interest never would go below the usual rate; and certainly nothing could be more beneficial to the landed interest than the facility of obtaining money at low interest in every department of industry— (Hear, hear, hear).—He conjured the House to consider what they had already had the manliness to face; and, if the moral principle was still strong by means of which they had re-established the monied standard, from which he hoped the country would never again depart—(Hear, hear)—he called upon them with unerring hand to establish the standar() of public prosperity—(Hear, hear).—Standing upon that five millions of surplus, he had to state, th at it w a s the intention of his Majesty's Government to enter into negociations for the reduction of the higher rate of interest—(Hcar, hear).—Observe, necessity warall that was urged by the Honourable and Learned Gen tleman, as a ground for sacrificing the national faith. Necessity was the tyrant's plea, and whether it peeped from under the gown of a Professional Gentleman or came from the mouth of a Conqueror, was equally obnoxious to the principles of honour and morality, and he viewed it with equal horror—( Hear, hear). — It was not the intention of GdeernMent to annex con :ing Fund—(_ .). cre the'ptgasurtrof lineal° apply - it to cllkalirect Jelief of. the • subject by a remittance. of taxation, it would then become a question as tow re the'ficluttitin. '- It be i ng thus considered as a dry qUestion' finttnaallscility, after the *host aniions.and matiro deliberation' he was of opinion leituti-as the Mak Duty was the last laid Ots,t and amongst these abontlivisich there *as 'much , an s f 4 6 the COUtitll, is klikectftitsfdered a tax parttsd lady -affecting the agricultural interest, and as it would be the lest pledge they could give of thele sympathy itsthe'snftrings of the people, that *mild' be tliettstWitiitted—ffiear, - hear).—lt was, there fore, the intention of his - Right Hon. Frieod (the Chtuitellor of the Exchequer), - when the annual Malt Tax came before the frouse, to move that the word Molt be struck out, - which would have the 'effeceOf taking off the duty of one shilling a bushel oo article, and , accomplish a relief from taxation to the 'amount of nearly 1,308,1100, exclusive of Ireltutd, according to the working of the tax—("Wear, bdtr). —Next Session it was .anticipated there would be a further remission of taxes, to the amount of a million —(Hear).—He hoped the House would forgive him, if he ventured to go one step further in tracing the progress of the system, supposing, of course, that they would not; with a suicidal band, destroy it them- selves before it had scope to work. Always allowing for the intervention of unforeseen events, the prospect before them promised a fuither annual relief from taxation of better than half a million, exclusive of the prospect of redeeming the Four and Five per Cents. The million to be remitted next year would be partly made up by the 'saving of the extraordinary charges this year for Greenwich Hospital and Ireland. As far as he could imagine, in the next six years they would be able to remit to the amount of seven mil lions in annual taxes, and they will have reduced the debt by five millions a-year, being thirty millions sterling on the whole. By the course which he sug gested, great advantages would be derived from the application of it to the Sinking Fund, but which would be lost, with the Sinking Fund itself, if the plan of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman were adopted. diminishing the Five per Cents. great relief would be afforded tothe country, and it was intended to afford immediate relief, as be had already stated, by repealing the Additional Malt Duty, amounting to about £1,500,000. Having given the House a general statement of the financial situation of the country, having stated the amount of the income and expenditure, and the measures which, according to the view of his Majesty's Government, would be most likely to fructify and benefit the nation, not at the expense of the credit and character of the State, but in a manner perfectly consistent with that good faith which it had ever been the policy of Ministers to pre- , serve inviolate, he would contend that the measures they suggested would afford more copious relief than could be obtained from any of the destructive pro-, jects of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman. But he. should not do his duty if he were not to direct the at: tention of the House to those collateral means which might be found to improve the position of the coun try on a sound and solid system,-which, improving it in all its branches; would not fail to accelerate the ar rival of that day which would afford efficient relief to the agricultural interest. This brought him to a subject that he knew to be one of anxious interest both in that House and out of doors, the currency of the country. • Scarcely 'a Petition had been laid upon their table which did not contain some suggestion on the alteration of the currency, which was referred to as one of the causes of the present distress—(Hear). On this subject he went along with the Honourable Baronet opposite; and he now desired to enter his protest—his most solemn and unqualified protest, against doing anything that might tend in the small est degree to shake that system, which, so much to the honour of Parliament, and so much to the ho nour of the moral character of the country, had been re-established and consecrated by the Bill brought in by his Right Hon. Friend (Mr Peel). Though there might have been some shades of difference be tween his opinion and that of the Right Hon. Gen tleman at the time, as to the particular circum stances under which the Bill should be introduced, and the grounds by which the measure should be ac companied, no man could be more awake to the im portance of restoring our currency than he was, and no man could feel more strongly than he did that the decision to which Parliament had .come ought never to be shaken or set aside under any circum stances. Feeling thus, if there were anything in that which he had now to propound that could be mis taken for an attempt to prevail on the House to lay a sacrilegious hand on that sacred measure, he was anxious to make it known that he would be the last to give his sanction to such a proceeding. But he felt that that which he had to suggest had in reality „nothing to do with the currency of the country, when he stated it to be the opinion of the Government that great relief might be afforded by an arrange ment which would in a' slight degree augment the unfunded debt. The House, who knew the amount of the unfunded debt, would see that that to which be alluded was not to be resorted to for the accommodatien of the Government. It mat tered nothing to his Right Honourable Friend whether he obtained four millions from the Bank or not, with the object he had in view, and Gon knew it was not contemplated with a view of favouring the Bank. He felt that it might be of some importance to the Bank that he should state this, and that he should also state it to be his belief that the Bank might have refused that which in the present instance' they were ready to do; if it •had been solicited as an accommodation to the Minister. He had to announce that the Bank bad consented'to advance on Exchequer Bills, issued at an interest of S per cent. a sum not exceeding (bur millions, to be repaid by instalments, and to be liable to be called in at a short notice. Circumstanced as the Bank was, it was nothing to their discredit that they coupled the condition he Ihttl just stated with the meditated ad vance. 'they had. been called upon by Pasliament to • theyitawrtodel:laiStiS•edgit6:: important much irnea doubt h r a e l Pet exisesa. that su ffi cient gold tna could meet the demand that would be m a k moment cash payments were resumed, circumstances, they had done before, in such a m a prepared to meet the demand that mit t all points. Their conduct merited I Though they had demanded payme lat .nttlions due from she Public so them, in the opinion of the Government, by mind they carried their pretensions farthe r t h an necessary,w wasi m)os it ed w on as t felth th e m , t h e y t h a t e 'that of restoring the ancient currency of the hall ow; demand that every security should be afforded to er stole them to perform the task which-they had to Claim. It was most gratifying to witness the , r when they saw that the mighty change h a d b een fected, not without producing considerable certainly, but without being attended with , lar convulsion; but above all it was gratifying to _ that there was such a disposition in the country rouse paper; so far Were the people from bei ng disposed to call for gold in preference to paper; so high was the public credit, that he believed he was correct %Olen), stated that wherever gold bad been sent to the • 'vines, it had manifested a disposition to retr That inordinate desire to possess gold, which been apprehended, was not found to exist, and in many—in most instances, seemed to be 'He had thought it right to say thus much, in justiF cation of the Government and the Bank, and in planation of the circumstances under which it proposed to make a slight addition to the Unfint,i, Debt, in order to relieve the agricultural interest, as issue of Exchequer Bills, to be called in at a sin notice. He thought it must be seen, that the nature of the measure was such as to afford a hope that it would meet the difficulty with effect. If any man traced 'the course of the exchanges, he wool see that for some time past such a stream, he mi say such a torrent of gold had poured in upon that there was more danger of the exchanges being unfixed by the momentum of this rapid influx, than by almost any other circumstance at present to he anticipated. More gold had come into the c( than at any former time, and this was the more markable, seeing the operation this country bad sr tained with respect to its currency was coinci.. with similar measures in other parts. The general standard of the world was much above its ordinary level, and he Would therefore contend, that the mea sure now suggested would be most salutary in its ef fects, even it the 4,000,0001. of Exchequer Bills came into general circulation. It would indeed not only feed the circulation—and it was always to be re membered, that this would take place under the con troul of our existing gold standard, but it must faci litate all the Money transactions of the country, and especially those •in •which the Government were likely soon, to be engaged, with a view of reJucing the Five per Cents. The-measure then would prove one of relief to the agricultural classes, and do good in various ways, without - endangering any one of the, great interests of the country—(lFlear). The Honourable and Learned Gentleman, on a former night, had very broadly laid down his positions, that nothing but a diminution of taxation could relieve the country, and he had especially called on the House to set•their faces against any proposition for afford ing relief to the agricultural classes by means of a loan. He (the Marquis of Londonderry) 61 not mean to contend against the Honourable and Learned Gentleman that to resort to a loan was consistent with the ordinary march of affairs in a community like that of this country. Such a measure was ever regarded as an exception to the rule and not the rule itself, and he could only propose to refer to it on the special merits of the case and not on the general prin ciple. He, however, was not so wedded to general principles, but that in certain cases where great dis tress was experienced from depression of the markets, and other temporary causes, he would be content di rectly to resort to a loan where it could be immedi ately applied to the relief of the sufferers, under ade quate securities for the repayment. Without such se curities he could never sanction the advance of a loan. —lt had been a consideration with Government whether relief might be afforded by a loan so applied as to relieve the farmer from bringing his stock pre maturely to market. This had been one of the chief causes of distress : the farmer having had his rent reduced by his landlord, that the latter might get something regularly paid, was compelled to take his stock to market in order to make up his rent, and to pay the interest or: money borrowed at a time whea the market was kept down by the mass of produce thrown- on it from all quarters. In corroboration of this statement, he could add that the quantity of corn recently brought to the London market, had been double what had ever been brought before.— On due consideration it had not been thought rig':t to attempt offering that sort of relief to which he had alluded, but acting on a more limited view it was thought by Government that considerable advantage might result from .adopting a measure that would diminish the local pressure under which the agricul turist now, in many instances, laboured. Though it was difficult to deal with landlords, impossible to deal with tenants in their individual capacities, yet it might be practicable to advance sums to parishes on the credit of the parochial rates, which, advanced to Chem in their corporate characters, and used for cor porate purposes, might be the means of affording re lief to all classes. The Government, therefore, would hot object to employ a laige portion, if not the whole the'aNinie to be Made, in the way alluded to. — Right Hon. Friend would, on a future night, submit a proposition to the House for enabling the Commissioners of Public Works to' apply relief on a more extensive scale; by advancing sums to parishes on the credit of their rates, tobe repaid in four or five years, not exceeding one • year's assessment—(Hear). This mode of proceeding would, irthis oßinion, afford relief, but he should - confess that Ministers Would be happy if Government could see their way to a more direct mode of assisting the agriculture of the coun try. There was only one other great branch of thit subject" to Which he had to call the attention of the House—he meant the system of protecting duties.— lie had fairly stated in the last Session, that those he did not oppose the appointment of the Committee, he could not see his way through it sass to he enabled to hope digit hi labours would prove benetiedal to the ' - the Fin • declare) . lis Full "--=---: order to estabVsh that, ;Ludt qa-ry ter raise ! Tee . . s d r ati ti b lis negoaiation, .• . should atit e execute a very i not too millions ofaddltional talet. :rah . .I,ible Ma,: '' ' - - '.. . . ing Parliament i. i . practicability of :halm& ogrvede , that it was.in pstriastts wise Otanci ' 1 , lrsight to _ I . e t bad been feared one•ha/f laid *awn In this 'Resolut4ta, t ihiiliajksty's •_, ' s and the :` , n .. .nr e procured to mee Ir. The 'nistel i lladacte4in all they had' it arefertini - 'We £1,400,000, 1. if lt •Id iii r it, the moan p:t :Lela or to tW finance at the.sountrvp. ti the statement ht dektion of Par . .. Apply 'to rditilleie. these ch.( .xtent of was *out to *lke, he should takithe Revenue ' if • - oi the country. ailhieent sht4ad i[arignsi. acting now as the e to the -last year for the basis of hi; calculations, The I n , tion to sympathixe with the country, they would nes as to be prepi Tye this come for 'lB2l was £55,887,000. Adding to this, how. give the whole of it towards the relief of the Public, be'll'ilde at all p ...........1 ewer_ the extraordinaries which. oceurfed daring tht hfiil not didideit4litli the Sinking Fund—(Hear).— reproach. Thouj meri t e d ~„1 payment and rho s ing such d er than w is a'di t ty Ave country temselves to vied to eva. had a *tilt s tne tes* tad been t•r: Yle press any por. ying to find orq.ry to use . disposed to igh Was the ea when h e to the pro.' fl return— which had and pape r e preferre.!. I, in justit:, , and in cr, Web it v at e Unfun( l ,,i interest, b y in at a shor t hat the very Ford a hope ect. If any s, he would rt, he might An upon us, angcs being influx, th4a resent to he the country he more re- try had sus- coincident The general its ordinary rat the mea. try in its ef- r Bills came d not only s to be re- der the coa- t must faci- 3untry, and iment were of reJucing could prcre es, and do gering any ry—( Hear). on a former mitinnc. th,r . i ;_„ ~ -.1 -7"7 -I • • ! ^.!