Star. — London, England, 1821-10-27 00:00:00

COURT OF COMMON COUNCIL Yesterday a Court of Common Council was held, to consider the propriety of voting the Thanks of the Corporation, and Freedom of the City, to JOSEPH Huse; Esq. M.P. for his Parliamentary conduct, and for the dispatch of other business. AEPRAT AT KNIGHTSBRIDGE. Mr. Alderman WAITUMAN begged to offer a few observations. He was aware that this Court was summoned for a special purpose, and be should be the last man in it to introduce any irrelevant subject which was likely to give rise to a discussion. But the subject upon which he was now about to speak, involved a question of Privilege, and was; therefore, entitled to their most serious attention. He had pro.- viously proposed to lay before the Court the corre spondence which had passed between bim and Earl Bathurst, and he would have done so at an earlier period, were it not that he was out of town when the last Court was held, and the Court before had been . so suddenly convened that he did not hear of it until late in the evening of the day on which it was held. He wished now to lay before the Court the Papers on this subject, leaving it to them to act as they thought fit with respect to them. When he (Alderman yeah man) complained of the proceedings of the 26th of August, his complaint was passed over. A charge of neglect of duty was, however, made against him by the Noble Lord. It was said that the mob were in a state of riot, and that he did not exert himself to preserve the peace, but that a Police Magistrate was obliged to interfere. All this was broadly stated, and yet no inquiry had been instituted. One of the letters which he held in his hand, had been sent to him in order to pin him down to dates, for the purpose of substantiating the charges alleged against him. The letter, and his answer to it, were short, and he would therefore read them : • Whitehall,. August 30, 1821. Sta--At a late hour last night, I received your• letter of yesterday, in which you fix si: o'clock on Sunday afternoon as the time when the outrage took place, which you represented in your former letter to have been committed on the Civil Power by the Life Guards. " I have only to desire that you will state the precise time, when you withdrew from Kuightsbildge, after tranquillity had been perfectly restored ; unless you should have any objection to make such a statement. I am, Sir, " Your most obedient humble servant, a Sheriff Waithman. " BATHURST." Ts this letter, though he perceived its tendency, he immediately returned the following answer: (cow). "MY Loan—l can have no objection to give your Lordship *very information in my power, but it Is difficult to speak with exact precision as to time. I have already stated that it was six o'clock when the affray at Knightsbridge took place ; it might have been a quarter of an hour after. 1 left Hyde Park-corner, as nearly as I can state, about a quarter before eight o'clock. a I have the honour to be. " Your Lordship's most obedient humble serpnt. (Signed) " ROST. WAITHM AN. " Bridge-street, Aug. 30, 1821. " To the Right Hon. Earl Bathurst, &c." The worthy Alderman then complained, that though a secret inquiry had been set on toot into that busi ness, he had not been called upon to substantiate his statement. Instead of which, he had good reason to know that the Object of that inquiry was principally to criminate him ; and he had equally good reason to know that that had totally failed. He had no doubt of being able fully to identify the person who had presented the carbine against him ; and he had also the ramrod Rung at the head of a woman, marked and numbered. Here was a gross denial of justice, and it would be for the Court to say whether it would , not take some steps, for its own credit and honour, to bring the matter before the Court. Mr. FAVELL proposed that these Papers be referred to the Committee of General Purposes, to examine and report, after they had been entered on the Journals. Mr. S. Dixori was glad that the Papers on both sides would be laid before the Committee ; but he feared they would not easily get Lord Bathurst be fore the Committee. Mr. J. Gilligan supported the proposition of Mr. Pavel'. The documents were then ordered to be entered on the Journals, and then referred to the Committee of General Purposes. FREEDOM OP THE CITY TO JOSEPH HUMR, 'ESQ. M.P. The Requisition for calling the Special Court was then read. Mr. FAvaLL, prior to making his intended motion, begged that the Minutes of the Court for granting the Freedom of the City to Earl Camden, should be read. The Minutes were read. They stated, that on the 3J November, 1819, the Freedom of the City, &c. bad been granted to Earl Camden, for having so liberally resigned a large portion of his income as a Teller of the Exchequer, in consideration of the public distresses. Mr. FAVELL said he had requested the Minutes of this grant should be read, not because the case was exactly parallel with that which he was about to bring forward, but because he wished to remind the Court how anxiously they had been upon the watch to reward every individual who had exerted himself to decrease the public expenditure, or increase the public revenue. He felt that in bringing forward this motion he was fulfilling the dying request of a ,friend, by whom it was first introduced, and who with his latest breath entreated him to persevere in it. He need not remind the Court that Mr. Hurde, the %object of this motion, had been, and still was, the Champion of economy and retrenchment, when the nation was in all quarters groaning under ks heavy burdens, and calling for relief. He then was the foremost to point out where - velief could be applied, where the burden could be lightened. He (Mr. Fa well) could appeal to the Records of their Court in proof of the many-petitions which they had from year to year presented to Parliament, praying for Retrenchment and Reform. How, then, could they refuse to reward that man who had unceasingly exerted himself to realise the prayer of their petitions? There was no want of precedents to sanction the pro ceeding which be was about to recommend. Among the records of the Court, it appeared that in the year 1776 the thanks of the Court were voted to the Rev. Dr. Birch, for a pamphlet which be had wring: in, favour of Civil Liberty. He bad the mere plassore in bringing forward this motion, because it would convince the Public that this Co urt did not delight, as was falsely imputed to it, in the habit of passing votes of censure and disapprobation, but that they were glad of an pport ty of conferring its honours' upon an Hooowble Gentleman who had faithfully discharged the duty which he owed to the country. The motion he was about to submit was one in which the community at large was interested ; for at a time when an Officer of high rank in the Army, and a Magistrate at the head of the Police, had been de graded by his Majesty's Government, because they had not shewn themselves sufficiently subservient to the measures of the Court, it was more peculiarly incumbent upon them to mark their gratitude for eminent public services. He spoke of a Gentleman, this day, of no ordinary character, in regard to his assiduity, firmness, and unwearied exertions in inves tigating all those points which were connected with the Revenue and Finances of the country, and which had enabled hilt), in the course of a short Parliamen tary career, to effect -as much as would have done honour to a long life of public service. He trusted that no objection would.be made to the motion, on the ground that other Gentlemen had supported the measures proposed by Mr. flume, and were there fore equally entitled to their thanks. He was ready to give every praise to the band of illustrious and ex cellent men who had supported him; but it could not be denied that Mr. Hume's wonderful labours and indefatigable exertions peculiarly entitled him to the thanks of that Court. When a similar honour was conferred upon the three eminent lawyers who had distinguished themselves in defending her late Ma jesty, it was observed, that three other lawyers had ' also been retained in her cause; but the propriety of confining the honour conferred by the Court to those who had most distinguished themselves was then ad mitted, and he hoped therefore be should not now be met by a similar objection. He felt that he should not do justice to the motion which he had under taken, if - be did not enter for a few minutes into the history of Mr. Home's Parliamentary conduct. Such was the effect produced by the labours of this extra ordinary and excellent Gentleman, that Ministers had been checked in their profligate career, and it was a common answer to the applications of their partizans to say, We would willingly accede to your request, but if we were to grant it we should infallibly bring. Mr. Hume upon us r —(A laugh.)—The worthy Mern ber then proceeded to read to the Court a Paper de tailing the Parliamentary services of Mr. Hume: " He opposed the Three Millions of Taxes, in 1819, and then recommended by retrenchment to make a real Sinking Fund. " He has advocated, on every occasion, the removal of the re strictions on foreign Commerce, which at present so Much cramp the prosperity of the country. 4 ' He has submitted, for three successive years, motions to re duce the expense of Collection of the Revenue in the Excise and Customs, and general Revenues. " He has shewn that in Scotland and Ireland the expenses of collection have been doubled, and that there are between four and five millions paid for the collection of the Revenues, of which one-third at the least might be saved, by returning to rea sonable salaries and reduced establishments. " As an example of what might be done, he pointed out, the sixty-five sinecure offices of Receivers-General, and ninety-five Distributors of Stamps, for three successive years, and only suc ceeded by perseverance in the last Session to get a Committee appointed, which recommended their abolition, saving A::5,650 out of £117,900. " By this means 160 sinecure offices will be abolished, and, exclusive of the corrupt patronage, as many thousand pounds be saved annually. A Commission is now sitting in Scotland to inquire into the Stamps. " In 1819, 1820, and 1821, be proposed to the House the reduction of salaries and establishments. in proportion to the reduction of the price of provisions, &c. and although rejected in the House of Commons, has been adopted by the Treasury since then. " Ile opposed the Civil List on the present enormous male, and proposed its reduction : be moved for returns to prove its extravagance, but his motions were rejected. " He brought the expenses of the Colonies before the House each year to induce the Government to economy ; and the Re turns to his motions first brought the Gibraltar. the Ceylon, St. Helena, and other accounts, before the Public. The expenses of the Cof6nles of Great Britain amount to upwards of three mil lions sterling, and have been brought to view by 'Mr. Ilume. " Heligoland establishment, of £lO,OOO a-year, has been abo lished, and half a million might be as easily saved immediately in the other Colonies. _ _ - He has for successive years tried to reduce the expense of the lonian Islands of £140,000, which is continued contrary to Treaties, and solely for patronage. " Until last Session, the Debates on the Army and Navy Es. dilates seldom took up two or three nights in all. Mr. Hume, by his statements and exposures for three months, rendered the country fully aware of the useless expenditure, and drew from the country at large a call for retrenchment. " He attacked the large Standing Army, and by his exposures has shewed the unnecessary number and the extravagance of every department ; and although Lords Palmerston and Castle reagh declared that a single man could not be reduced, 12,000 have been ordered to be disbanded, whilst he has shewn chat 25,000 Regulars might be disbanded. " In the number of the Staff, in the number of the Half-pay Officers, the extravagant expenses of the Military College, /cc. although out-voted on every motion, his statements stood uncon tradicted, and be mainly compelled the Ministers to join in an Address to the Crown to reduce the Army. " He exposed the extravagance of that department in a manner never before done; -hewed the application of public money and i patronage to the Voters of Quecaborough in an extraordinary degree. " His statements have been all confirmed by the Returns he moved for, and great reductions have been ordered in the branches he pointed out, although all were stated to be impossi ble, and he was out-voted in the Houle of Commons. " He pointed out the useless and extravagant expenditure in the large establishments of Officers in the Dock-yards, in build ing ships, when we have already twice as many as all the world. " He summed up all the practicable reductions in the Public Expenditure that could be made immediately, to the amount of nearly £5,000,000, having previously pointed out all the items in I detail, with the proofs °this proposal " If the country bad not been rowed bi Mr. Hume 's exer tions, the Ministers would not, In all probability, have lidded this small tax. _ _ " It was equally novel to see on. Member, by his Individual exertions, supported by but a few in the Howe, effect sush a changv, as it was to see the manner be eared the Ministers, and obliged *MN at the close of the 8 -ftt to adopt his ream ' mendation ; and at the same time state, that Mr. Hume had never lest his temper, although Mr. Ward, Lord Palmerston, and others, bad often attempted, by rudeness and ridicule, to draw him from his plans." There was one more Paper which he would trouble the Court by reading, front which it appeared that Mr. Hume was prepared to propose a measure for making a reduction in our establishments to the amount of £4,288,000. He had minutely specified all the items in this oakulation, and the result was, that the whole of the taxes upon candles, soap, salt, and leather, might be taken off. The worthy Mem ber next adverted to the remarkable coincidence be ' tartar the motion for an Address to his Majesty, which was proposed by Mr. Hume, and that which was subsequently adopted by his Majesty's Ministers. The object of this proceeding was evidently to take away all the merit from Mr. - Hume, and to place it to the account of his Majesty's Ministers. At the same time, it was not his (Mr. Payees) wish to de- 1 preciate the Government, if they were willing to go hand-in-hand, and work in co-partnership with Mr. Hume. Whether measures of retrenchment ema nated from Ministers, or from an individual opposed -to them, was of little consequence, provided the great object of a reduction of the ptstlie expenditure were' effected. The worthy Member concluded by moving the Thanks of the Court to J. Hume, Esq. M.P. for Aberdeen, for his indefatigable exertions in promoting every object which might tend to the diminution of the public expenditure. Mr. Elms seconded the motion. Mr. S. Throw said, that though he was labouring under severe indisposition, he felt that he had an im perious duty to perform, and had attended, therefore, in his place, to oppose the motion of the worthy Gen tleman mho had just sat down. In so doing, be could assure the Court that he was actuated by motives as pure as those to which the worthy Member laid claim. He was ready to admit the persevering industry of Mr. HuMe, and that a great deal of good might aritie from what he had recommended in the way of re trenchment. It was equally certain, however, that his excessive zeal had carried him beyond the bounds which men of sound and sober judgment could ap prove. Every one was aware that, in consequence of the wars in which we had been so long engaged, the country was necessarily burthened with very heavy expenses. The Officers on half-pay, both in the Army and Navy, were entitled to remuneration for their services, and , had an honourable and legal claim upon the country. He could not help thinking that the object of Mr. Hume's persevering exertions in Parliament, was rather to embarrass the Govern ment than to promote the public interests. He had called for more papers in one Session than all the Members of the House of Commons had done for many years —(Hear, hear).—He had, in fact, lost sight of all discriminaticn, and in his (Mr. Dixon's) opinion, he would have done himself greater credit if he had called for fewer papers. He believed Mr. Hume had called for more papers than would serve the particular purpsfs of all the Members of that Court for many years—(Loud disapprobation).—Mr. Hume was not the only person who was desirous of reducing the expenditure of the country ; and the worthy Gentleman (Mr. Favell) had been forced to admit that there WAS a disposition on the part of Mi nisters to second his example. It would be impossi ble to reduce the salaries of Public Officers to the scale of the year 1797, at a very early period, be cause no person could now live upon the same annual income as in 1797. Peculation would be the inevi table consequence of premature reduction, and he hoped, therefore, that there was no intention of carry ing retrenchment to any extravagant length. It would be better if some worthy Members, instead of troubling themselves with the public expenditure, would look to that of their own Corporation. As to the merits of Mr. Hume, they were greatly over rated, and much had been ascribed to him which, in point of fact, he had borrowed from Mr. Creevey. Mr. Creevey had collected all the information in an excellent pamphlet, of which Mr. Hume had subse lquently availed himself. He intreated Gentlemen not to make the votes of thanks conferred by that Court too cheap. The worthy Gentleman had called upon the clerk to read the vote of thanks passed by that Court to Lord Camden; but he had not ventured to make a comparison between the two individuals. Lord Camden had made a great personal pecuniary sacrifice, and had conferred a real, substantial benefit upon his country. Though he expected to be in a minority, he still felt it his duty to oppose the motion; for he conceived that- Mr. Hume had neither been long enough a public character, nor done such emi nent service to his country, as could entitle him to the thanks of that Court, and the freedom of the City. Mr. GRIFFITHS supported the motion. _ _ Mr. T. N. WILLIA . IIS asked, whether it was the in tention of the worthy Member to follow up his motion for a vote of thanks by a motion for conferring the freedom of the City ? Mr. FAVPLL replied, that it was certainly his in tention, if his first motion were carried, to move that the freedom of the City be conferred upon Mr. Hume ; but in what particular manner, whether in a box of gold, or of heart of oak, he should leave to the Court. Mr. T. N. Wi Lt.t us said that, as this was the case, I he should certainly oppose the motion. He admitted ' that a considerable degree of praise was due to Mr. ' Hume, but he could not go the whole length of the measure. It was extremely easy to find fault with Administration, and to call upon them for a reduc tion of the public expenditure; but if they went into sweeping retrenchment, where, he would ask, could the sovereign place his finger to reward his merito rious servants ? He knew nothing of Mr. Hume, and had no wish to disparage him, but it appeared to him extremely probable that he did not go to very 1 pure sources for his information. How, indeed, could he obtain it, but from discharged clerks and servants 'of the different public offices? The worthy Member was proceeding to arraign the conduct of a Member of the Council, whom he accused of wasting the money of the Corporation, and assembling a junta for the purpose of carrying a particular object, when he *as interrupted by loud cries of " Order !" Mr. Alderman WAITHMAN rose to order. It was the paramount duty of every Member to uphold the honour and dignity of the Court. He had seen with sorrow, for he was not present at the last Court, the account of the disgusting proceedings which had taken place on that occasion, and he thought even the 'worthy Gentleman must have felt some shame at reading the Report of his own language in the Newspapers. Mr. T. N. WlLLimis said, he should be wanting in the duty which he owed to civilized society, if he did not do his duty like a man ; nor would be be ,deterred from that line of conduct by any statements in the Newspapers. lie repeated, that the worthy Member to whom he alluded seemed to have a pre dilection for voting away the money of the Corpora tion ; and that, in defiance of a standing order, and contrary to all practice, he had called upon the Council to vote away a sum of money, and at the same time emblazon the thanks of the Court to Mr. Waithman. He should oppose the motion, because, he conceived the object of Mr. Hume's parliamentary conduct was more to hamper the wheels of Govern ment than to de good to his fellow-citizens. Mr. Alderman WAITEIMAN said it was his inten tion to have remained silent on the present occasion, and he now rose merely for the purpose of replying to some observations which had been made in the course of the debate; for nothing in the shape of an argument had been urged against the motion. He confessed that he telt somewhat awkward in attempt ing to pauegyrise any Gentleman ; and this task was the less necessary, as It had already been p e f r , , in so clear, concise, and able a r..!anner by h . t-2 ' IS W0 : 6 : Friend, that it was impossible for any man, w h a , • his political sentiments might be, to any 4, Leve, the shape of opposition. It had been sa;,2 public servants of those emoluments to " object of Mr. Hume's measures wa s to t 6"; labours had justly entitled theomb.ligelcdoitti,f.hiiih:lol.t't!le: he gave Mr. Hume credit for just and h or ' s PIT; ht motives ; but it was enough for him to knoni r t had acted beneficially for the Public ; and his motives were good or bad, be (Mr. Waith as an individual, was equally observations had been male upon Lord Canni linquishment of the emolume n t s o f h is officen'ste' whatever might be the merit of that relinvi it should be recollected that it wa s preceded l:; Petitions of that Corporation, cotnplaininm .nlO wasteful expenditure of the publi c mon t h e el, and b complaints of distress from all parts of th e ki ng A public benefit, however, was de r i ved from Camden's resignation of the emoluments of his lership, and a public acknowledgment was his With regard to the political cond uct o f NIL lla-rte. he was not a mere pal tisan, upholding the ant • U of a particular party ; but he had taken that laborious course, which no man that entered th e sra s' of Parliament had ever taken before. Re had li e ' self been an eye-witness of some of his exertion s , r .; he had seen the base attempts which had been rs,;, in the House of Commons to ridicule and phtS ti . down. It was not by the impression which he n , within the walls of the House that his labni. r c,;: i succeeded; no, it was his rigid examia.,z:;rl,. the finances of the country, and his capsule 44' extravagant expenditure of the public money thatf. made an impression upon the public mind, r s :. length compelled the House to give him a teluct• I hearing. It was nut in great debate , ,, in whit„ . .l: splendid but useless display of talent vvas made, that Mr. Hume had signalized Itim•eif;t had taken an humbler walk, but one which n as i finitely more beneficial to his counti y, by siniz night after night, and investigating with patier,:z unwearied perseverance every item of the public r, penditure, until the eyes:of the Public were and Parliament was at length induced to Lac:, subject into serious consideration. Let the P 4 then stand up for this man, for unless they shot that they approved of the conduct of able and interested public men, and were determined toiT hold them, there would be no chance of effects. a reduction of our expenditure, or of remetirC: the grievances under which the country laboured: Notwithstanding all the opposition which Mr.llun had met with, after all the attacks which krilben made upon his private character, and his biter sF tuation in life, he still continued to perseven in lK; useful labours, Until he compelled a reluctantAdmi. nistration to come forward and adopt the sew position which he had submitted to Parliaments 6 .out success. Could any man be so credulonsasreL to believe, that if he had not persevered in calf; for papers and. Committees of Inquiry, his Majes-; Ministers, or Mr. Bankes, would have brcughta• ward a proposition for retrenchment, as an am!. ment of Mr. Hume's motion? or that, if Mr. flumes motion had been shaped in precisely the same terms as that of Ministers, it would hare been adopted by them? As to great political debates in the Rouse (1 Commons, they were worth nothing to the Veople; the object of them was merely to ascertain the rels• tive strength of the two parties, and the teapot them was not of the slightest importance toughs. ple. It was only from such useful labours as Mt, Hume's that the People could derive real andens tial benefit. The Honourable Alderman, Anse further observations, concluded by expressing al; i t not only that the vote would pass, but that it rx4 pass in a triumphant manner. Mr. OLDHAM was perfectly satisfied that thee of thanks should be passed, but he could not kra to granting the freedom of the City in a plata If the conduct of Mr. Hume (which he admitteiu highly meritorious) was to be thus rewarded, wbilal they not noticed a Fox, a Whitbread, a Romillyiv the Abolitionists of the Slave Trade? He must- JI tte lu that though he concurred in the vote of thanks,! was opposed to granting the freedom of the DT this occasion. Mr. Alderman BROWNE said, that this vote, many others, had been proposed with a view toop pose the Administration of the country—CVo! N. —The Hon. Mover had spoken of the vote in ' of Earl Camden, as if a case in point, but the ground fail under him, he gave up the ; The one was the case of a Noble Persona, had made a great personal sacrifice to the of his country ; the other, that of a G. great recommendation was his universal every measure of Government; a hostility nised, perhaps, than that of any others of What Mr. Hutne had done it was the duty man to do—he had watched over the _ and expenditure. He had advocated remnant% but Ministers had always wished to retrench* Mr. Hume was fortunate, insomuch as the psi of his opposition was one when Ministers woo bled to carry their measures of economy boar. But whatever good had been done by Mr. this way, had been more than undone by matory language at Public Meetings. Wit passed at the Public Meeting the day before, he ventured to prejudge the conduct of wards Sir Robert Wilson.—[Mr. FAYELL the Honourable Member was present, language of which he complained ?j--1 Browne was happy to say that he was not He should have been ashamed to be seen ' at such a Meeting—(Hear, hear).—He the Gentleman opposite (Mr. Favell) had cut , spicuous figure at the Meeting. What be the Meeting had reached him through the Papers, and if he (Alderman Browne) - in quoting what was thee stated to have (Mr. Favell) would set him right. Mr.. made to say, that the act of depriving Sir Wilson of his commission was despotic and cal. He (Mr. Browne) maintained that Mr. bad no right to use such language. It sending to inflame the public mind, and to seeds of discontent: it was language which to be used before Ministers had an fending their conduct in Parliament. - - Alderman proceeded to point out several other of Mr. Ilume's speech, which, he contender; WV Lc.... CM' !rman, ahem L expressing 11.1 but that it is:ii to fled that thee ). could not acts e " ty in a golhiba. al I he admittoirs !warded, abyial fi td, a Komilli,e ; 71 ? He must • • j a )te of thanks,' mof the City A' it this vote, ith a view to try—(No! in 1 he vote in fa ' )int, but fii* r !up the an* I Personage, c ! to the intone of 3entleman sae „ rersal hostility' 2 itility betterce? hers of his part!. '. tl the Mitre/ ere! t: be public tame i ed tettenchso to retrench; ed . 4 t i ch as the psi Einisters were* onomy into de. , u by Mr. Hate one by his ith' 1 . 5 , Wino la a 'day before, ka '' v ct of Ministers/ I F AVE LL ash,' d , m t,, and heard' PP 3 -Mr. AI. • s e was net le' get r ., ! be seen anew: .. I ,He had heald ' . II) had cut a C°, ' 4 What be kele ° d ,rough the P 4ll wne inerut 6 ) was , •v ;0 have pis • . Alt. litirse til ) riving Sir Rer! a ,potic andstrua • d drat Mr. Hoy It was laps — Y i id, and to soei: ;e which ont; I opportauiti lent. The K O E r several other 1: • e contended; i