Star. — London, England, 1810-04-11 00:00:00

' L.minATARr PROCEEDINGS. HOUSE OF LORDS, APRIL 10. The lir,ust was fur some time occupied in a Consmittee of 1 its .1, son the Banbury Peerage; after which the Committee w as ordered to sit again en TutAday nett. On the admission of strang.:rs after prayers were read, we found, Message from the Commons, bringing up a number of mcstly private; one of theta wasa Bill for incorporating a Gas Light Coinpany.—'llese Bills were read of course a first time. On the first reading of the Gas Light and inflammable Air Ilill, the Niarciis of BUCKINGHAM humorously alluded to the title ut the Bill. He did not concave that, in the present temper of sumo men's tui:ids, any new contrivance to produce inflammable matter sVi4 necevcary. Vitas regard to the obj.xt of the Bill itself, hi: con l .l only say, that for three years he bad been subject to a purgatory from the experiment, and that if It was to be persi,ted in, most of the bun %es where the experiment was to tic made would be rendered uninhabitable. itr.vusio:%: Lord HOLLAND wished to call the attention of their Lord ships to a Bill now on the tablir, respecting the granting of Places in Rcver•ion. In the absence of the Noble Burl (Grosvenor).who had so ably taken th.: question on a for Mer occasion,he should make nu motion rorcciing the Bill. 'this only, he should think it proper to o'oserve, that 44 some Noble. Lords seemed on that occasion to feel s.lme embarrassment and scruples in proceed ing in the Bill till a nie.sege had been received from his Majesty, signifying his assent to it, he would now warn such Noble Lords to take an early opportunity of knowing his Majesty's pleasure on the subject, and not again come down to offer so strange au excuse for not proceeding in the Bill. Adjourned. HOUSE OF COMMONS. Mr. GOL'LBOI•RNE presented an account of the deficien cies and vacancies to the Local Militia..—Ordered to lie on the table. The Committee on the Marine ray-OMee Bill. on the motion of Mr. ROBERT Wioto, was postponed ?ill this day three weeks. A Message from tiw Lords informed the House that they had agreed to the Southwark Pnor Rates Bill, and several other Pri vate Bills, without any amendment. SIR FRANCIS BURDETT'S LETTER. Mr. CURWEN rose for the purpose of moving the Order of the Day. The SPEAKER observed, that the Hon. Gentle man who moved the adjournment of the debate last n;ght (Mr. W. Wynne) was not present; it was the usual courtesy to wait to know whether he would resume the subject or not ? Sir JOHN NEWPORT said, his Hon. Friend moved the adjournment with the view of giving the House time to lot - ,k at the letter, and he believed, if he were present, it was not his intention to make any motion on the subject. The Order of the Day having been called for, the &T.:AEI:It read the Order, that the debate be now re sumed, and informed the House that the question was, " That ti)e letter of Sir Francis Burdett should be laid on the table." _ Mr. CURAVEN said, he was anxious to catch the Speaker's eye, to deliver a few observations on the letter which was the subject of debate. He most undoubtedly entertained the same principles with those who maintained the authority and supported the privileges of the House. His motives for voting as he did with respect to the former letter of the Ho nourable Baronet, he had explained on a former oc casion, which induced him not to go the length which many Gentlemen did who supported the Motion of th Honourable Gentleman who first brought the bu siness before the House. Ever since he had a scat in Parliament, there was no man more steady than he was in supporting a moderate Parliamentary Reform, the necessity of which he at all periods supported ; but he was persuaded that it was not Reform that the honourable Baronet wished, but something. 'else.— Whether blame may attach to his Majesty's Ministers with respect to the mode of carrying the warrant into execution, yet as he conceived the letter now under discussion only as a part of a system tu vilify and traduce Parliament, he thought that every man who valued the Government and Constitution of the coun try, should, on such An occasion, strengthen the hands of Government. Let them . therefore act right, and they would have support. lie hoped there was but one sentiment with respect to the letter; and, how ever he might regret that it was written, yet no man who did not shut his eyes but must see the motive for which it was written, for the Honourable Baronet had, by his conduct, now opened the eyes of the Pub lie. The House . , in his opinion, would rai , e itself in the esteem of the country, by not noticing the letter ; for supposing it proceeded to extremity, in such case the expulsion of the Honourable Baronet would give a license to disorder for fourteen days, without the in terference of the military ; for though he expressed a wish not to sit in Parliament, yet if the Electors of Westminster thought fit to re-elect him, he could not refuse to sit. He did not feel himself bound to make any motion that would lead to any future irritation of the public feeling, he wished the business to be ad journed sine die, and concluded by moving, " That the farther consideration of the letter be adjourned to this day six months." Mr. DAVIS GIDDY rose to second the motion. He said, when he voted against sending the Honour able Baronet to the Tower, it was because he thought it better, in the first instance, not proceed to extre mity, as he thought he would interfere until he called down the censure of the House and the country. The conduct of the Honourable Baronet was most atro cious. He did not know what epithet to apply to this letter ; but he was of opinion that the better way be to solder it to pass unnofi.:ed, as the best means ef ire at: - .l:iii!r his object. Mr. ADAM was of opinion, that such a mode of treating the letter was as*advisable as any other.— Tiie le! ter was of that sort, that whatever other steps might be :Act', would not alter the situation in which the I lon. Baronet was now placed. For his own part, he was ready as any man to bind himself to: the suppoi t Government in times of difficulty and clanger, and id support of the privileges of the House; . but when he mede this pledge, he could not but de stare that what had recently happened was not dif (malt to foresee. Ile thought the conduct of his Ma jeity's Ministers esceedingly culpable. The scene which took place in the metropolis for . the last four days was of a most affiicting • nature, and fOr whiCh, is Lis opinion, his Majesty's Ministers were answer able. of No, iso.) They had, with respect to tl.e Honourable Baronet, full a fortnight to look into all the laws of the country for the purpose of pro ceeding according to the pure principle of thelaw, and ; i search for precedents. An adjournment was moved to give them time to deliberate, daring which they should have considered the - i6te ofihe'cotiritfy. It was the bounden duty of the Secretary of State for the lime Derartment to have known the gate of the public mind, and as a great act was to be ante , ise to decide at once in so extremely delicate a thing ? was bound most emphatically to provide the I.2l.cilisibo-11hit tteifhing could he more unfair or abstrrd than to carry it into effect. What was the consocittenoe ?-- aectibe to Ministers the disorders which had taken Ministers, until a late hour on Saturday outlet; *lee. Let it be remembered under what circurn doubted the efficacy .of the warrant, or wisethß., k stances the Gentlemen on the opposite side Were giving ought to be carried into effect or not. There were their opinions ; they were sittin now perfectly at their doubts and di ffi culties in the minds of Ministers as tol easel the event had passed — t h ey h ad .no responslbi the nature and extent of the warrant, and to their ility—(Licar,)--:pci moral responsibility for th eir opi imbecility and indecision he attributed all the mis - nionsestbcy were giving their dicta as if upon •a slues chief. As to the nature of the warrant, he had him- i tint of science, or any other the most abstract subject; 1 self no doubt. It was a warrant for comniiteing a land yet tke House *ere to believe that for forty person in execution adjudged guilty of a crime. The I eight hours the Ministers had made no exertion. It case stood on the law of Parliament, which WAS foun- I was true, they f e lt that it was improper to interpose ded on reason. The p r ivileges o f t h e House of w ith a ny f orce t hat w a s t o countervail the due and Commons were for the prete6tion of the Rights and i common operation eF law; the 7 had 110 right to in the security of the subject, and a warrant of the terfere with ally Officer not. their own. ,On the pre- Speaker entitled the House to the assistance of all I sent subject he should give hii opinion that it would the Sheriffs, Magistrates, and officers , in every coup- be neither expedient nor necessary to. adopt any Mea ty . and every part of the country. The *arrant, sure of seve'rity-e-Init a Middle 'coarse appeared to be therefore, when founded on reason, was as efficacious most suitable to du: dignity of the House. When at Wimbledon as in town, in Kent, in Surrey, or any they had received a letter of thit kind, passing, it over part of the kingdom. It was the duty of those Who in silence was a very ets' itiOecOl proot Of dl click ;it had any view in their measures to come down to the was in all cases right to look our duty steadily in the House with their minds stored with-every thing ne- face: It appeared to . him right, in the present in cessary for their accomplishment. But how could it stance, to notice the letter, but to go no farther. gc The be accounted for in Ministers, that 24 hours before punishment inflicted on Sir Francis Burdett, has been the execution they were not certain of their right to proposed (said the Chancellor if the tkeliequer) by break open a door ? He did not blame the Attorney m y se lf.....( H ear , Near)—lmean supported by myself ; General for advising the mode of carrying the war- the Honourable Baronet *as guilty of resisting the rant into -execution, but if it had been done in the anthoiity -of the House, aid thereby etilianci;:::.; his first instance, the House would not now have on its crime. The letter noir read, his, I think, tu4dJ :in Journals the doubts and apprehensions entertained of !addition to his offence • ' yet as he is now sub oted to the legality of the warrant. He had no objection to the punishment which the House fixed on hit him, I the motion, but he could not refrain from expressing shall move a Resolution to the following effe.c: : his !sentiments. He was of opinion that the privi- " That it is tie opinion of this Ho . use that the said Lacer is a leges of the House of Commons stood as high, and high aggravation Of the offence of Sir Vrau4a Burdett against as unite f s ached, as if their vindication had been pro- le riv ean ileget o h u at se s ; ir b i u .ra t, n it cis age rdc ari t i t ig b f as rom e t n cool u t t te t t at o f A t r h n e t s li t perly executed, and be thought the failure was im- to the ower, the House will not proceed to take any farther no- . putable to Ministers. tice of the Letter." I Sir JOHN ANSTRUTHER said, he never en- —The consideration of the Letter might be material,, tertained a doubt as to the right and privileges of the if at any future time the Honourable Baronet should House for issuing a warrant, nor did he think that by himself, or any Member of that House, petition any doubt remained as to the mode of executing it. for his liberation ; the Letter might then be brought He did not think any imputation could be applied to forward with propriety. He (the Chancellor of the Ministers (Hear, hear,) in whose hand Government Exchequer) never felt more strongly the necessity of must now be supported ; though their measures were unanimity than on this occasion ; but if any Gentle not the best, yet since te question was, whether we man should think his opinion erroneous in any parti shall have a Government our not ? the most unanimous cider, lie was willing to do whatever might reconcile support should be afforded—(Loud cheers) —however all opinions. He would recommend that the original improper it was to bring things to such a pass. Did motion should be withdrawn. the Honourable Gentlemen mean, because the mea- Sir JOHN ANSTRUTHER rose, toprotest that sures pursued were not right, that the Constituti sn of he was only anxious, again and again, to be unanimous. the country was to he sacrificed ? ( Hear, hear.)— Mr. WHITBREAD said, he wished at that mo- However he disliked Ministers, he would rather their ment to offer himself to the Speaker's notice, because, places were hereditary, than that the Constitution however unanimity might be desired by the Right of the country should be overthrown. For the Right Hon. Gentleman, he found it necessary to say, that Honourable Gentleman opposite, he entertained the he could not be unanimous, nor could he think of greatest respect ; and believed they were not incom- countenancing for a moment the Resolution of the petent in point of talent, to a certain extent ; at pre- Right Hon. Gentleman, by withlsoldireg Isis inmsed- sent they should not be deserted. With respect to the ate opposition to it. He was glad to see an opinien motion, be did not think it consistent with the dig- prevail in the House, that they bad gone far enough nity of the House to notice such a letter ; he was of in this business, and that the sooner the matter was opinion it would he better to get rid of the question laid to rest, the better it would be for the House and entirely, and to pass it by with the silent contempt it for the country ; but though he approved the motion merited —( Loud cheers.) of the Honourable Gentleman for an adjournment of The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER the debate to this day six months, be could by no regretted, that on a subject where unanimity of sen- , means agree with him in what he had said relative te timent was so becoming the House, any thing i bis rallying round his Majesty's Government in con should be suffered to arise likely to impede that una- sequence of the unfortunate events which had so lately ' nimity. In his situation, he did not think that the taken place. The sudden change in the lion. Gen-, 1 House would be satisfied by his not observing upon tleman's opinion was rather matter of surprise to him ; the partial views which had been taken of the subject. but he was much more surprised at that which had i It had been even said that it was the fault of Minis- taken place in those of the Right Hon. Gentlemen op. tees that there had been disturbances in the streets posite whim. From the warmth with which the Right for those four days ; he could not conceive with what Hon. Gentleman who had just sat down, and his col. spirit of since' ity Gentlemen could have made those league who sat by him, had expressed thernseleco the remarks ; but he found that they were merely anxi- House might very naturally be led to suppose that oat's to take advantage of every passing accident they bad done their duty ; but he thought quite other which might give them an opportunity of attacking wise, and with the leave of the House he would en- Ministers ; but what wa,uld a fair and candid judge. deavour to thew that they had most grossly failed in ment sae, with all the circumstances before it? When .doing their duty. The Right Hon. Gentleman op one of the Sheriffs of London was telling the people posite had just told the House, flea he foresaw all that of the impropriety of bringing forward the military i conduct of Sir Francis Burdett which had since taken force, what would have been said if they had desired place, from the very first introduction of this business the Officer of that I louse to make use of force ? He before the House; and yet when the Speaker's war was I not the officer of his Majesty's Government ; rant came to be issued, lie was not, nor weie any of his act would have been made theirs, if blood had I Isis colleagues, prepared with the p r ope r m eans o f car been shed, and murder ensued, before the strong nc- rying it into execution.—( dear, h:ar, hear, from the cessity of it appeared. What would have been the 1 Aliniiterial side (f ter House.) The Right Honourable judgment, the just judgment of the House on the cc- Gentleman had told the Howe, that the Speaker's casion ?—(1-kei.)—But, for the full performance of warrant had not been resisted at any . fi Teter period. their duty,. there was no want of courage in his Ma- If he meant this as an excuse for, or paltiation of his jesty's Ministers. He had no idea of vaunting any conduct, it would not avail ; fiw lie ought at the same peculiar courage ; but he would not be tit—no man ‘ time to have known, that if it had not been actually could be fit for any public station, in or out of that resisted, it had been held in, and treated with the tit- House, who, seeing his line of duty, would turn most contempt. He ought to have known that a per. away from it. He had foreseen the whole course son lad positively refused to obey it, and had told the through which the conduct of Sir Francis Burdett messenger, that if he meant to execute it, he must would run. The last insulting letter to the Speaker come with a much greater force than he had. then told him no more than he had already expected. It with him. It was therefore the peculiar duty of the had been said, that his interpretation of Sir Francis's Right Hon. Gentleman to be prepared at ail points ; first letter was uncandid ; but now there was no want and as he was so eager for the extremity of punish of agreement in its meaning. The course of the Bii- ment, he should have omitted nothing that might tish Government, as the spirit of .British Law, was give effect to the warrant that was to carry it into 'to avoid all use of force till that use was unavoida- execution. On the subject of warrants, he was free ble, still takinn care that the public security was not and ready to give his decided opinion, that the Spea endangered !fear, hear, frvin the Oftitasirion.) The ker's warrants, of all others, ought to be om n ipotent. i cheering on c Opposite side could not deter him —ln fact, if it was not so, it was nothing at all, from declaring the principles on which he conceived and had better be kept in 'his closet quiet and it was the duty of k British Minister to act. KnoW- silent, than be brought forward for the purpose of ing the nature of tt mob in this city, Would any one creating doubts and reiiiig dilliCultiee as to the lege say that it was possible to meet their first violence lity or the-power that was attached to it. He, for one, every where at once ? or criminate Ministers for n o t was a friend to a Reform,in the Commons House of instantaneously coming upon them wherever they Parliament ; he had been long so, but was more con might be commencing any act of riot, breaking win-: winced of its necessity from 'the prOceedings of the', slows, or burning of houses, or even assassination ? last two months than h e h a d eve r been before. He . There was no'neglect in the superior powers. Whew still lived in the hope of seeing a reform; and if it 1 'the Mag istrates required force, the force ' was ready for should take place, what would that-reform be without them ; but whatever his (the Chancellor of the Ex- the omnip otence of the Spea'ker's Warrant ? Wh a t . ' chequer's) fears and anxieties might have been for would'he'the prOtection Of the HOuse, if ever its pri the danger of individuals, and the injury which might. vileges, which are the -privileges of the people, should be done to their property, there never was a moment be attacked ? It - had long been asserted, and the °pis when there was less tb be feared for the country 'or, nion was very generally entertained, that the Crown the Constitution. He must say that there was no had gained and possessed a c.onsiderahle influence 'if i l delay on the part 'of 'Ministers. The Officer en- * thatliouse, SuppOie a refo rm s h ou ld b e t h e means ' trusted with the warrant—an Officer not under the' of getting rid of that influence, what security wouldthe nomination of Ministers--might have hesitated : Househave tgainsianifut ure . attempts o f t h e Crown, in doing his duty ; but this was not to be ' the, if it was not foethe omnipote nce o f t h e S pea k er ' s crime of Government. He should, - on his ovin; . wairarit'l lie, for I‘s - o wn part, had always thought u opinion, have had no difficulty in saying that the, it legal, and where ,it was -properly 'issued, that it authority of the House, justified its o ff i cer In breaking ought to beomnipotent. The Right Hon. Gentleman - open a door ; but if that officer hesitated, upon a fear . 00pottte e acid the Sectit4ry of State who sat by him, of incurring the unfortunate consequences of resist- . seemed to take great crechet&theinselves for having ance ; and it the doubt arose whether resistance might, taken speedy and proper naeasures to luppreis the not be legal, would it have been wise, in the imbecility riots which had taken place ; and yet the Serjeant had of an individual judgment, to have taken it upon itself expressly said at the bar, that till the merning ef yes- tertiary he nester had sufficient atsistande to enable him to execute the Speaker's warrant. The Right Ho nourable—(Thar, hear, from the Ministerial side) if Gentlemen would listen to the end of the eentence, they would hear what he meant to say. The Right Hon. Gentleman and his colleagues had suffered the tO thei:itfm. rim i;ai i dnii i nat n yi st u tieffterim nist r ie npolito u ngr t iw e i ta. d ehm: e :e n l.r thir loT t a ni e i a t t ry r h y d ahn e l a ae : d t e F s la tt l i nr i ld e n e d : n i n trY k C k e e f l y fr : .- i e .e : in l ' 1 : (. 1 . 1 . 1 rn a te tta to il th t inexperienced, unlearned, harrassed and I - learning,lt the. with task s t allk o the I fatigued Officer of the House, to carry it into erect'. tion by his own . means.' He *as, however, glad to find from the Right Wit: Gentleman vho spoke last, that during the l , thiSle of the time these disturbances I lasted, there was tad pldt not 4ppearance of a plor i which in any_ endangered . the public !security , e! ... e the safety of the State. ..He Wag tiO more an apoln. gist for the coodua.of Sir Francis Burdett than !.er was for that of ICll36ter I. if, Sir F r a nc i s reahy thought the • I,pedieri . .::Yrralt illegal, h e was co l , scientiously right in resiitihg it ; but he thought i , e. might ;Save a , ne it iii sah 4 :4,.- as to make it corn. plite, ;lad jet scarcely friaore floor a nominal resi st . ante, sse fn. tl.bsreforc he thought Sir ninti s ! m a acted wrong ;boot if Sir Francis himself thmight other , wise, and choc? to Make a mere stubborn resistance, Mil-1 no,; ht oht to - have been prepared for it, an d to . . ' have put An end to the business a long time before they I had done so. The 'fiat Honourable Gen t k mai ; , , eta those around hiM, might en•learour to throw all the Wine s en the Serjeant at Arms, an un l earne d ' aim of the House, without any precedent in his office to guide him. But could the Howe be in the ' least degree seirited at his hesitating to execute a warrant that he knew would be resisted ; in th e d o i ng which, if a death ensued, he rendered himself liable to an indictment for murder ? when the learned late Attorney General was the First Lord of the Treasure, . and the other learned Gentleman near him, who had quitted the law for political pursuits, as well as the learned Secretary of State, were all so unpreparea as to the law of the subject, that the learned late Att•e ney General, on the Saturday evening, advised the Serjeant to sake thc opinion of the present Attorney-. Ge.leral, which was not given till Sunday night ; and yet they expected the Serjeant to know more late thin all of them rut together. They mii:ht, howeve r , throw all the blame on the Serjeant ; might say he should have been prepared with e precednts ; that he should he a judge Beth of law and gospel ; yet, he i •thouoht, that, except themselves, no one, eith er i n that HohSf: for oat of it, would be of the same epini !n. 1 The Right Hon. Gentleman had said the SOertffs differed with the Magistrates. When had they done this Mr. C lman sa:. s that they readily offered lo ne 'nret*V as•ioaece in o.eir po. , fer the moment h e as k ed . it. in it hat, then, did the Sheriffs differ from the I Magistrates ? The tact was, the civil p,-=ever was I "frays ready to do its ditty, and it vas the duty of ' Ministers to see that the military should be ready to tid them, whenever that aid might be found nem : ary. Faur days, however, had been suffered to !lapse ; and all London continied in a state of alarm during that time, from the doubts and difilcultke raised by Ministers as to the execution of a warrant which might have been performed in as many hours. The HonourAble Gentleman behind hirat who began this dabate had talked of rallying round the Govern ment. It' using the word Government, dial he mean .to rally raund the rrtnere Ministers? The secirjs ' were> in !eel t o o oaten confOunded and identified with each other. If, however, he meant to rally roand the present Mieistere, ha cautioned the I-lonoinahle Gentleman to he on his guard, fist they were a node and if he leaned on them they could not support him. They were pusillanimity and imbecility eembined. If he meant to rally round the Law and the Const:. tution, round the speaker's warrant, when properly issued, he (Mr. Wlabread ) would CliCen - liity join hime but if his rallying point was to be the pfesent Ministers he might set off es soon as lie pleased. He (Mr. Whit bread) would stay where he was, and beg leave to decline any such connectien. He advr:ed to what bad fallen franc Mr. etirwen rehoive to the danger of having an election for Westminster, and assured the Honourable Gentleman he was mistrken on that head ; for he believed such an election might now be held in that city with as much safety and as little an noyance to the inhabitants as in any other city in the kingdom. He did nut, however, think it would be 1 Avis ible to try the experiment on the present OCC3. i i sion. Ile would ads is: the Eouse• to remember the i case of Wilkes, and nut run into the sante errors.— What liel could not but much lament was, that Mi nisters, be these vacillations and delay, had, in the minds of mauv, brought into doubt the legality oldie warrant, v hitch they would never have d ired to doubt of but for the imb ..!cil ity of their proceedings. The Right Honourable Gentleman had made a slip in sayi',ilte proposed the commitment. He ceireeted himself, however, immediately. He might, however, have proposed it to some one &se to move it. He would now ask the Honourable Baronet who did propose the commitment, whether lie did not wish dirt this • matter had not Leen pushed to such este:m.4y ? He would ask the Member for Srmervohira, avlrm lie did not then see in his place, it*he did not wish he 1):4 never meddled withit ? Tie might, hnirever; have some future opportunity of asking that question, and receiving an answer from the Hononrab;e MenTher. He hoped, however, that Gentlemen would not suf.' fer the fervour of the moment to lead them tssvaY hereafter to catch at any pamphlets or wrinees the: might'be published on the present subject, anal; I L' a late Member of that House tic induced to bring forward such miserable publilations as that of Gale lines, which had laid the foundation of all thosedtarsh nrea sum which -had taken place, and the various mise ries and misfortunes that had been the consequence of them. If his Honourable Friend behind hm.(Mr• 1 . meat, he hoped they -would not put the sword into Curwen) and others would rally round the Govern thelands of tFe present Ministers, who were 'mete children of imbecilitY, and alt, gettojr unable t o wield it 'for a ny wor thy purpoaes. They had -too much identified their •names 'wish that of the 0 - 0- erentment ; but he hoped the House . would not sme tion theta in such fin usurpation ; lee: would look on them as 'he did-s-Mxisters totally inadequate to the task of administeringthe affairs of Gcremete , it. 'He helped sib time would' be lost . in 'waking the :tie cessary inquiries into 'the re& act of the melarl .. , 1 events which had been transacted in the coulee ut tale. four last days; that the deaths which had unleTrily I_