Star. — London, England, 1817-02-28 00:00:00

assure the House, that had he thought the Hampden Clubs in any way conducive to the attainment of Parb • mentary Reform, lie would have sedulously attended that in London. But so ins gnificant did he cor,ader their efforts, that he bad only attended at twn meetings—one in an open ro nm, to which *vary rune had access, and another, at which only three individuals lad been present. The reason that int rtyt the Members had not attended on the latter olatision was &elated to be the extravagant ideas mithad been suggested by certain individuals with respect to Universal Suffrage and Annual Parlia., mentss In fact, t. e Haa , pin Club was made up of materials se discordant, that to suppose that any thing like a consioracy could originate in it, was most absurd. Not two of them agreed on the subject nt Parliamentary Rios m, or indeed on any other subject. tkime were fir one plan, some ror another. But he solemnly declared before GOD, that he never heard any thing in the Hampden Club which tended to put the Constitution., or the smallcst part of the Constitution, in the slightest danger. He was per suaded that his Honourable Colleague, who was Chairman of that Club, would vouch fur the truth of this declaration. He b lieved that not a single paper had issued from the Hampden Club, which was not written by a venerable individu a l, whose character stood deservedly high with all who were in any way acquainted with him.—'rlte netiti , n was brought up, read, and ordered to Fe on the table. Lot d A RA:RIBALD HAMIL'T'ON presented a Petition from Langlio:me, in Dumfries-shire, praying for " A full and fair representation of the People is Parliament,"'and for Retrenchment."—Ordered to lie cn the table. Mr. JOAN SMITH presented Petitions from va rious parishes in the vicinity of Nottingham, praying fur Economy and Reform. Ord,red to lie 'AI the table. SALT DUTIES AND SMUGGLING. Mr. CA LCRAIir ptp,,t,oki I i. motion, which stood for try-motrust, to the 6 Alt Dalt s. He had not changed his opihion on the subject, Iv he wished to delay the consideration of it—first, binu,e bu.iness of so much more .pressing importance was before the House, at.d secondly, because lie had not quite made op his mind as to the principle of a commutation in lieu of the duty. Unquestionably his intention was to propose the repeal of the duty; but as he was sensiLle of the immense sum accruing from it to the Revenue, he felt that it. was his duty not to snake such a proposition, unless he could thew the Right Honourable the Chancellor of the Exchequer a fair prospect of filling up the gap which would be occasioned by its adoption. He made this statement, because, from the very nume rous letters which he had received, since he had first mentioned the subject, he found that it was one of even more extensive importance than he had origi sally conceived. While he wai . on his legs he wished to move for a paper respecting a struggling transac. tion which had lately taken place, and to whicb his attentiwn had been excited by the circumstance of two Freemen of Rochester being engaged in it. If there was no abjection to the production of the paper, he would move for it at once. It WAS a statement rela tive to the seizure of the smack Elizabeth and Mary, of Rochester, on the 4th of June last, by the Tide Surveyor of Poole. Mr. LUSHINGTON having intimated that he bad no objection to the motion, it was agreed to. PA 111$11 SETTLEsIE ng. Sir EGERTON BRIDGES rose to propose an alteration of the Law of Settlements as for as re goided Cow Pasturage. The object of the Honour able Baronet was, to prevent those persons who pos sessed cow pasturage under the value of £2O a year, from obtaining a settlement. After stating the great hardships to which the labouring classes were sub jected at present, by the refusal of farmers or proprie tors of estates to let to them a small quantity of cow pasturage, lest they should acquire a settlement to which the rent of their tenements alone would not entitle them, the Honourable Baronet moved for leave to being_ in a Ball to alter the laws relative to the removal of the poor in certain cases. Sir C. BURRELL supported the Bill, as calcu• laced materially to benefit the poorer classes. Mr. LOCKHART and Sir C. MONCK recom mended to the Honourable Baronet not to press the Bill alter its introduction, until the Committee on the Poor Laws had male their R. port, as the subject of Parochial Settlements would probably eater o Mate rially into their deliberations. Sir E. KNATCH BULL was of ',similar opinion but observed, that that could be no obstacle to the in troduction of a Bill which was fraught with so much advantage to the community. Leave was then granted to bring its the Bill. Lord STANLEY presented a petition from certain inhabitants of Middleton, in the county of Lancaster, who bad sent a deputy to the meeting assembled in London, for the purpose of obtaining Parliamentary Reform, complaining that they had been calum niated in the Report of the Secret Committee, and •praying . tbat they might be heard at the liar, previous to the passing of the Bill for the Suspension of the Habeas Corpus.—Ordered to lit on the table. SUMMAND. . The Order of the Day having been read for bring. ing Thomas Jefferics to the Bar for the f tupobe of discharging him, Lord W. Rosana. moved that be be then brought to the Bar. On hie appearance the SPEAK= addressed him to the following effect : " Thomas lefferies—The Select Committee of this House, ap. Foisted to try and determine the validity of the Litt Electra; for the Borough of Wootton-Basset, having reported that you, being called as a witness before them, had been minty of gross preys nation, fur that offence this Hoeft tothodtted you to the emu won jail for hedging all such of ender& In the Committees of this House established by law to prosecute these Warsaw utmost favour and protection are always shewn to the witneWW sum stoned to appear before•thsm. Of that iadolgence you, is your • examination, experienced abundant pr oo f. lt e p e ared‘ admo nished of the sacred obligation of your oath, and of your duty to Goo and sour country, you nevertheless persisted in your cri tuiral endeavours to defeat the ends of justice in the cause which was under trial, Such prat ices always were, and always will be unavailing. The temple of your punishment, which followed without delay the coningssion of your crime, will, I hope, prove a nursling to those who may henceforward be required to give, their testimony before these tnbunals; and the notoriety of your case, whcreitiever you may present yourself for the remainder of your life, will teach all men to knew that imprisonment sod ig• nunilny must be the consequence of as imitation of your conduct. At length, however, you have been brought to a just acme of your error; and, in consideration of your penitence, this House has ordered that you be discharged ; and you are discharged ac curdirigly, first paying your tees.—Sedeaut, remove him from the Bar.' On ILC motion of the cHiIIiCILLOR of the Enure QUER, the Speaker's reprimand was ordered to be en tered on the Journals'. " SPENCEA N SOCIETY. Mr. BENNET held in his hand a Petitiort couched in respectful language, which lie wished to present to the House. At tl►e same time, he thought it ne cessary to declare, that until within these few days he did not know that such a person existed in the world. It purported to be from Thomas Evans, of New castle-stre, t, in the parish of St. Clement Danes, but now a prisoner in the House of Correction for the County of Middlesex. This person was Librarian to ta Sect who called themselves Spenceans. He stated in his Petition, that in 179 S he was arrested under a warrant of the Duke of Portland's, and confined for three yens in different prisons, during the suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act. His friends were de barred from all access to him—he saw no one—he was denied all opportunities of reading and writing, which, as he was a literary man, was to him a severe grievance. He was shut up in a solitary cell.— Under all these circumstances his health considerably suffered ; the wonder indeed to him (Mr. Bennet) was, that he retained his reason. Those who con ducted Lunatic Asylums were acquainted with many cases in which long solitary confinement had produced iv Inky. The Petitioner then proceeded to state, that he, with his son, who is under twenty years of Age, had lately bees arrested. He was Librarian to the Spencean Society ; but he declared that that So ciety had tied no commit: ication with any other So ciety in any part of the country on the subject of Par-, liamentary Reform. The prayer of the petitioner was, that the House would not pass the Bill for sus• pending the Habeas Corpus, without further inquiry; because the urfortunate man knew t!►at he might otherwise be placed precisely in the same situation as that in which he totst►d himself in 1798. Pethi.m w.ts then brought up, read, and or dered to lie on the table. Mr. BENNET moved for an account of the Sala ry and all other emoluments received by the Inspec tor of the City of London, under the Property 'cal Act for the last three years, eliding January 5, 1817. Ordered. Sir EGERTON BRYDGES brought in a Bill to alter the LetWil relative to the removal of the Poor in ccrtsiu cases, which was read a first time, and or dered to be read a second time this day fortnight, and printed. Mr. PROTHEROE seeing the Right Honourable the Chancellor of the Exchequer in his place, wished to put a question to him respecting the falling off in the Duty on British Wines, which he understood to have lately taken place. He said that the diminu tion in the consumption of .British Wines had been chiefly occasioned by the great importation of Cape Wines. He understood that it was the intention of his Majesty's Government to lay a duty on Cape Wine equal to the present duty on British Wines; but this, h r conceived, would not afford a sufficient pro tection to the British Wine.dealers. He suggested, therefore, a diminution in the duty on British Wine, and some regulations respecting licences. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, it was true that a great decrease in the manu facture of British Wines had lately taken place; and this falling off au undoubtedly partly owing to the favour which had been shewn to the Wine imported from our colony of the Cape of Good Hope. The cultivation of the vine had been materially extended At the Cape of Good Hope, in consequence of the protection it had enjoyed during the last two years. It had been now thought advisable, however, to lay some duty on the importation of. Care Wine, cone. sponding to the duty on British Wines. As to the other remedies proposed by the Honourable Gentle. man, he was not at present prepared to give him a distinct answer. Lord RANCLIFFE presented a Petition from Stapleton, praying for Retrenchment and Parliamen tary Reform. Mr. LAMUTON moved for certain accounts, with the view of shewina the increases which had lately taken place in the Salaries and Emoluments of the Post•Master-General, and,other Officers of the Post Office Establishment ; but, on the suggestion of the Chancellor of the Exchequer, that the object of the Honourable Gentleman would be b: tier accom. plished by an alteration in his Motion, he consented to withdraw it for the present. PLTITION !ROM ZATLi. Sir FRANCIS BURDETT said, he held in his hands a Petition against the Suspension of the Ha beas Corpus Act ; and he had no doubt, if longer time was given to the country to express their senti ments on the subject, they would receive many more. This Petition was pretty numerously signed. It came from the City of Bath. It had been sent up in great haste, in the apprehension lest it should come too late. The Gentleman who transmitted the Petition to him, "had informed him, that the Petition Isy only a few hours at his house, and that if they,had had time, they could have had more than 10,000,signatures. Mr. Serjeant ONSLOW said, the House would do him the justice to believe that he also had a supersti tious veneration (dr the Habeas Corpus Act. He had in- some degree strewn his attachment to that Chatter of our Liberties, by bringing in a Bill slime time ago to render the Bill more efficient in its ope ration. But he considered the laws in being as inade quate to the object of protecting the Government, in the present circumstances of the country. Mr. BROUGHAM was not a little astonished at the course taken by the Learned Serjeant to prove his superstitious reverence for the Habeas Corpus Act. Having brought is a Bill to reader its previsions more effectual after making it more valuable.—he spewed his superstitious vetieration for it by suspend ing it altogether for four months. He wished, that instead of a superstitious veneration, he had substitu ted a reasonable veneration for it—(Lamester)—aad then be was sure they would have had the suit •tanee of his talents in itt defence.—The Petition was then read, and ordered to lie onthe table. THIC MINT. Mr. BROUGIdAM wished to ask the Right Ho nourable Gentleman opposite when they were to have the advantage of the attendance of ' the Right Ho. nourable the Master of the Mint . as h e h a d - a ques tion to pot to him on a subject connected with his department? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he had no doubt that he would make his appear ance in the House in the course of the evening. Mr. BROUGHAM said,, he entertained not the • [ smallest doubt that the Right Hononrable Master and Wader of the Mint would come here at the conking time of night ; increasing the tale by the ad dition of one vote, but what he wanted was the at tendance of the Right Honourable Gentleman, at a time when they could receive the benefit of his in formation, when they would have an increase in weight as well as tale—( Laugh). Mr. B. BAT HURST said, he would, in the course of the evening, have ample opportunity for patting any question to his Right Honourable Friend. Mr. BROUGHAM said he could not - well put a question during the debate on the Sucpensicn of the Habeas Corpus Act, on the subject of the Working of the Miut. Mr. HILEY ADDINGTON stated, that his Right Honourable Friend bad been in the House before the debate began. Sir JOIIN NEWPORT wished to knnw whether, in the Commissariat Department, any other than their own personal securities was given by Commis saries for the sums which passed through their hands? In these offices there was more reason for taking se curities than in any other. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER answered, that no other than their own personal se curities was given by Commissaries; but thought it might be advisable to adopt some alteration. SUSPENSION OF THE HABEAS CORPUS ACT. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER moved. thattheSpeaker leave the Chair. Mr. GRENFELL did not wish to take up the time of the House, but was desirous of saying, that after having given this question his best attention and consideration, his present situation was not unmixed with pain and difficulty, as he found himself com pelled to differ from many of those friends with whom be had long cordially acted, and with whom he hoped still to be connected —(llear, hear, hear.) His con. viction might be erroneous; but he would say, it was honest, sincere, and conscientious. He felt it his duty, therefore, to support the Bill, as tending to secure the liberties and promote the interests of the country. Mr. CURWEN said, that notwithstanding the strong opinion declared by the House last night, it was impossible for him to forget what were the strong feelings of those who opposed a similar measure above 20 years ago. Most of the great characters of that day were now removed for ever from the stage. But the impressions of that time remained in him unim paired ; and he felt it his duty, though his opposition was hopeless, to mark his opinion to the House and the country. There was a very great difference be tween the state of the country now and its state at a former period, when parties ran so high, when the country was under peculiar difficulties, and when per nicious opinions were said to be spreading so widely. He had been closely engaged in all the oppositions to the measure at that time,andhe saw no reason to regret it. The results of the policy then pursued justified in his mind those who were in the opposition. Could it be forgotten by any body, that an attempt was made in those days, which, if successful, would have left us neither liberty nor security ?—he meant the attempt at constructive treason. He remembered well the virtue of the Judge, and the manliness and inte grity of the Juries : all the circumstances justified the objections he had entertained to intrusting such a power as this into the hands of Ministers. Never in any serious-discussion in that House had he-witnessed such a total deficiency of ar g u m ent i n t h e defence of any measure, as was evinced last night by the advo cates of the suspension. He particularly alluded to the speech of the learned Lord Advocate of Scot land, who, by his own statement, bad clearly shewn, that by means of the laws as they stood, be had been enabled to arrest a number of conspirators or ring leaders of the diiaffected. If this proceeding was so easily effected. what could Ministers want with this bill of suspension ? This was conclusive, that it could not be wanted for any useful purpose, and that the existing laws rendered it needless. He thought that the law officers of the Crown had shewn no grounds to entitle Gover n m ent to t h e a id o f additio ' nal laws, since in England they had not yet tried the efficiency of those which exist. He, for one, would not agree to the suspension. He pointedly referred to the year 1794, and the proceedings then adopted ; the effects of which were to place every man who dared to oppose the plans of Ministers in the dange rous situation of a person suspected of hostility to the Government and constitution of the country—(Hear.l He particularly well remembered one instance of a hundred Gentlemen of respectability, in the North of England, who met together on the 4th of No vember to celebrate the Revolution; a spy of Mr. I Reeves's was sent down there, and every word that was uttered by the Gentlemen present, from affection to the Revolution which placed the present Royal Family upon the throne, was noticed. Wbat then happened ? Why, that the spy reported to his em• ploy,: that there was a great deal of disaffection and treasult—(Hear).—Mr. Reeves wrote to an officer who bad been present; and whose proper and manly reply to Mr. Reeves was, that -if any thing disloyal or disaffected had occurred, he should nut have re quired Mr. Reeves's inquiries or advice to know what he ought to do. Supposing a letter of this descrip. tion put into the green bag, totally contrary to truth ; full of misrepresentations and calumnies, for expres sions used in warm affection for that great event which alone gave to the reigning family their title to the throne of these realms I—a title of which he hoped and trusted they would always remember the true foundation; but of which, it they abandoned the principles, he could hope for them only the fate of those whom they succeeded I—(Hear)--- He remembered very well that for some time Mr. Pkt would not yield to the goadings of Mr. Burke; but was inclined to think the factious contemptible; but then came the great object of putting down all hopes of reform in the representation ; and this, more than any other object, governed the measures of the day. Now a similar measure was called for to an swer a similar object, which, it was thought, would by this means be defeated; but he believed all honest men, from one end of the country to the other, wished for reform ; and they- could not expect public sec u rity, or public peace, without a change in the repre sentation of that House—(Hear). He would say, in the words of Mr. Pitt himself, that without it they could neither expect redress for the past, nor security for the future—(Hear). Could not any man read the preamble of that bill, which declared that the sale of seats in that House was notorious, and as Mr. Speaker had insill and 64°i)* expro,trnheigtesteixrhr manyelnis t ho u ght t:o ur.s it h im s elf, ; : ; notorious friendsthen °otiowuse preambleren displeased ° b n u ' t d , afoYr? hisa t H o s e w u c n k h n p e s a t w i r spewed what was wanted, and laid a foredoom ' for further proceedings better times. The bill enacted nothing to defeat the great object—V[l4r). Was not the country right, then, with the authorities they had favour of their opinions, to say did exist an influence within those walls which cnitld not unite the House and the People together as they ought to le ? It was impossible to have that link : , in such circumstances. He remembered, on a farmer occasion, having mentioned that £20,000 had beer) laid out to purchase seats in that House the 3 was told he was mistaken in that instance in the sum,. for the amount was only £18,500. He admitted the correction, if that was any gratification to parties, and was only sorry that so much money is t.' . been laid out for such a purpose, for it was far rai much. It must appear a mockery to say, that could have gone on so many years in such an , es mous and wasteful expenditure of the public no m y, had there been a Reform in the Representstlot, io Portia merit—(Hear, doer)—What was to be expected from a Parlament under undue influence? Mire put an eto4 to the expensive American war ? Witt it merely the wisdom, patriotism, and virtue of the House ? No, it was the sense of the people. WhA: was it that prevented a troublesome and r Jiculoas war with Russia ? Was it the Parliament rneriis No; it was the strong expression of the peopte's feelings. Whit was it then that could alon e erp h.„! e corruption, and do away Places and Pensions given, not even for set vices, but fur worse than no service ; at all ? Every grant made tr a public service 11. ',considered as sacred as private property. Put, Wil e he readily admitted that, lie did not c mct:ee the House was prevented from ihik utg 'if tkie which were made to reward services crite:•tly Aims to the true interests of the coantry—(ifear.)— As to the acts of bad men in the country. these I n tl were not the allies of Reform—they were t'se promo. ters of the system of those who opposed all Itelottn. The first suspension of the Habeas Corpus A(t :cos to get Mr. Pitt out of the difficulties that attended him in the question of reform. So now the object was, to make use of circumstances to avoid rectal, and sanction the establishment of an arniy too great for the country to hold or to pay ; and to blind the nation as to its real state. These plots and eloens were the only means by which to get the enormous expenses of the country tolerated. If Ministers were really aware of the true situation of the country, he thought we should have examined carefully it.to the state of our colonies, and, by making every possible retrenchment, have lopped off our ee l :erne: by n Whenever they came fairly to grapple wilt the Chancellor of the Exchequer, it wrnti be seen, that we shall still have 20 millions of expenditure, is various ways, above our resources. Wert net thee things enough to draw the attention of the navos This Bill was said to be owing to the discontent of the people. No; the people had been exemplau, patient, and forbearing. The House might see how the legal officers in many places attempted to prevent the people from holding legal alectiegs.—. He agreed in what fell from th e Honourable Baronet' (Sir F. Burdett), that dangers arose in the coontry from the country gentlemen sleeping on their poste, from not doing their duty sufficiently to the le op!e, and leaving matters of importance to interior !Inst.,' hoar).—The influence of the Cro wn ';: + stg be met with wherever they turned, a nd in ah . inst. every instance; and under the b u rd e ns a nd dill:rill ties of the country it had increased tenfold--(11: : 1;, hear).—lt extinguished high spirit, and destroyed re `dependence of character both 'Within that House ar.! out of it—(Hear, hear.)—That vast influence must be cut down, or we could scarcely hope to be relhaaei and revived. He had particularly listened to tl: Solicitor-General iast night, of whose character, lents, and knowledge, no one had a :tight.: opin,tu than himself. If any /scaly could have wad,: uut a good argument fur the suspension, he exvected it from that Learned Gentleman ; but lie was (Wite de• ficient in producing conviction on his mind. To sa/ that there was difficulty in procuring convictions cording to law, was no argument to prove the :tt , cessity of suspending the laws. He should vainly hope to stop this measure ; but he would 5.1 y, that it dangers did exist, it was well calculated to inete.tv• distrust and to banish confidence in the peepfe— (llear,hear.)—lt might, he admitted, he necessary. alter all, to the Ministers, if they were to proceed upon their system, if they were to make their stand, as it bad been called, and to refuse to knock off one • other useless place, after dismissing so many brayt men who had fought our battles a ll over the work.. No doubt the dismissal of many of these brave mes was painful to Minister s them se lves ; but what might these men say ? They might say, why not keep two or 300 of them, rather than insist in keeping tee. useless Lords of the Admiralty, whose busine..s could be transacted by automatons ?—(ldear.) The per, pie were not to be blamed for withdrawing their conf deuce from Parliament: he should have dove the same himself. He felt it his duty to make these of setvations, though at first he did not intend to.detsts m the in H de o d u o se f m til o e re ac tA ti a v n e p a a fw r e the m too om k es on ts— a h io n r t n f i se er iti o snail, he immediately said he had not forgottetp: He recollected, that when Lord Sidmouth came Lao power, be entertained hopes that the Coastlines would be restored, and the previous system alms. doned. On that account he certainly regretted. ( 11 ' Gentlemen for whom he had the highest respect. his side of the House, had joined with Mr. Pat tt displace the Noble Lord's administratioz- lie delayed the House longer than he ought, but be sticilte always, uninfluenced by p art y, spea k out hi s nurs! No man was ever more sincerely attached te ; • stitution than he from this attach:nen! he both the suspension of it, proposed by the changes that certain reformers, who sti,Tol": the doctrines of universal su ff rage and ennui! : Lt.''' Lions, were desirous of making. He opposed the * it• ter, nor because he suspected their honesty,. but IN. cause he dcubted their wisdom. He repro'nted tht demand of power advanced by Ministers to pteaette the public tranquillity against their designs, Iwo" he was convinced that such measures were not tweet' sary. He was convinced that the results would not to effect public security, but to produce alsrn.: not to deter Jacobins, it they e z i s t e d, Iron) st , e';' , Touring to accomplish their designs, but to e 1 7 1 , Is I . 1 w 1 q I 1s i- i I I I 4 I d 1 ...... i r. . J II e - - ' J It e • • e a 11 t u A • J A. ✓ . r. e I* I , ° 1 r. 1 • t 1 i