Star. — London, England, 1829-03-25 00:00:00

... that he wes,thaadviKr at tht.lllMaPp., which 111 Cr. tholic coals not be. .teaterd BAsefiltNit midi them osserives. doubt lie Was Primemeter, and he die m& the Serdtu+•Stamit es* ' s wim, bedew:ribs ision.4A WO), air. TRANI' sild, dm Niels Mitftnothk Geotletmo, se professed to eilow.C.sthalka to be Prime Minist e r s , argued that wi r evid be impossible that tbry sbould be Prime Minbten t he'd *him to that—/A laugh).--thee the DUI was litentled to delude the Cbthelles—(A laugh). laid CHAN DOB said, he had bard nothhig to alter bis Mill i and be thought it desirable to swept the once et Prime Shiner by creme. coIoneiRALRI(MPLIt thought the SecroMt•y.of Mate fee die Pleirwr Department, who eiMatersisoed eadesiatalcal appointments, Issethalso be ezepted. Mr. Secretary Mill, replied, that all be meant to my was, that Ultima ceibelic Minister mold not sign my warrant or appoint. Protesiint Cluireb_ "AWL SOUltilli Mid a frit words* fir opposition tp the wend. n0w....-Theiraiterr was tied elated foe a divides, upon which ilissoliery wets— For the Ausadasept : • . OS 'Arias' it . . • . she ' • Maiodty against the Ansesdnient • ....MO' Chi the question being put woe the edginal clause, • • lir IL.KNATCHBULI. said..that be wits so completely unable Ice caddy his mini td,the propriety. et surrooodiegthe Kies with a -IWalleil of Italian that w should more that, thee the Weeds.' Gammon:4 Inked," the words " or limn* or be of bisidaisdreirmeat lionaerabie Privy" be Mooted. 7be spestiostopen the Amendment being put from the Chair, A1r..G..Q. , 41001LE said; that he wished to say a 1 , 014 Pr, VansWpon his Honourable Friend s vamendment. es which : he entirely concurred. .• He. agreed • with the 1 1 38 . , B oknnet :that the only way in which .particular offsets could be excluded was by express legal prowl. elan. eod,a 4:use !ranted in comprehensive term.. He oft, G, o,,Moore), in his view of the case, went much beyond the.ppwre . which the. Ministers had of advising the Crown. upon particular mea.ures. His Majesty 's Moister: ,were entrusted - with the arrangement and O00doot• of the .public business in that and the other cf Parliament ; and, in reference to this matter, Ile begged r ieave to.call.the attention to that part of his, elpjettes : Speech. in which he recommends Parliament • M tp *op : tn, view the maintenance of the Protestant lestablobed Religion .end the rights and privileges of tee Ciesgy: Now, it was obvious that Ministers pos.' esthed amsosi. extensive power to affect the interests of the Clergy, by, measures both. in Parliament and out of is. For these -reasons he should support the amend. ment.of the Honourable Baronet. Sir C. COLE said, that, although he should support the Government through the remainder of theßill, yet he felt obliged to vote for the present amendment, as be did not think that adequate security was provided against an improper exescise of the •functions of the Mice it filled by a R. man Catholic.—The amendinent was then put. and negatived without a division. The CHAIRMAN then put the question that Roman Catholic, be exciuded from the office of Lord High Ounisnissioner or the. Genetal Assembly of the Kirk of Scotland, upon which -Mr. 111015 RE :moved, as in amendment, that the offices of Governor or Deputy Got ernor of any of his Majesty's Colonies should oe included in •ilre prohibi ton. It was well known that in many of the Colonies AO Protestant religion and Church were in a state which tequised peculiar. case and protection, which could only be afforded by the government of the Colony. it was also known that..being less under the contvil , iot •the Parliament and the Miaistry, the governments tithe COloakt were peculiarly liable to-abase their jutisdec den. With the hope of being abk to protect t...em Irian those donerre he•sepposted the amendment. Tastat said that •greht inconvenient* would saw. him Roman Catholics • filling the situations of tiortrnor.General of India er Crovanors of Bombay Sisti-Madres. „, MORPETH said that the Church of 'England would.hanitsnotbing to fear in any pan of the globe it the, •vtoolid.only send tottsusch men as Heber. w hq, pro teasing.* porerAloct: anti than - the Rots-n Catholic clergy. hod-notdrisetwarpassed in teal and belt devotion by the aseinhers ot.ihat church. from which through li.e hp bid tatirvly.differed, but which, neither in England not in India, did be ever wish to nappies,. triraHUS.glbSON said, thee diming the time in which he had held the-seals of the Colonial Dep , eintent, be lisad.bad OCCiroirre. to endeavour to iutrosiues into the Councils of the. Government if some of the Colonies a few. ot. the most intelligent. influential, and wealthy inhabitants of the Colony. He was, however, told that it wasimpessible, in the stalest the law, to carry this iuten tion into effect. He believed, however, that. even inde pendently if the causes which had produced this:mm .oM, it would be necessary to introduce into the Colonies a change similar to that which this Bill would produce in the empire at, large. Mr..CHARLES W TNN said that the Bill meld not open die ogees of Governor -Goren* et India. Governor of Bombay. er Governer of Madras in the Nast Ind*, ter Mese area wits ar resget Oho to them. Govviasesitti et Madras was not an epee spline& ender the Crown. fork bad limey keen seceptid by o Gautisawa in that Neese ( Mr. Lushinetoo) win bad not Amon brag/awe le twigs his plow In that Wow.. • 'Lord Y. L. GUWEltePpeorol the anwadasetit. 71./r. TRANT odd (adverting se what bad been said by Lord illetpiddebeitheistiatity bad been assabhsbed In India leas before a Pepahres bawd of. Lord -44111L8Y said. that the Men. Member heralded es, posed naives the ingenue et the Ramie cat** over thii Pinar* to liidla, br -,coesin in bay. sone so far- as to previde that the DI- ! Se" " rbe East. Insliseontravi Would nee be RensauCatimaties, ' *eau* the aireeters bad site power et appointing the whale body efAke .oerdfrove 4 the h-tiitstistied.Cbereb in beta. )lr- THANT said, Ibis* ,bati beeß preosne when thi oath was' and biwas osavinced that oo Catholic could take it. The Ansmeatirit was rhea aseativid without a divibien. .onlbrciseer darderadnilsaiisa 4 Roman cathodes Into Corp.. dius. • , LITHO fi;,R PE ,s4id ants ithstanding. r ( ippc.4 l o o, Mcaltsll.oo. his sire of the House 44 milt On eving i tlteir Apiitions.upon the question, he wittiold.notpe. Oven ..from ,the .discharge of his duo., bot,4o4l , staint to vilte . 4 it) .51.isCherge..ot his duty. He • coadd ; potiagrie With thaMenahlemberlor Woodstoek. Aiat these -.objects were.trifions. Hit ptiociple, un the . 1100111019 "air • . - • •NT tiodallswbsta.seromidlthomestar • • • • CUM 'Ads INF Istinss:foontSeretowas-" • • iii nmeended that any ipterfereom with the municipal "%his vi the Corporations world beeatreusely injurious as) Constitution, :upon which be thought that not even die smalle-t inroads.ought .to be made. A Cor p_efelioll was a .sort of petty,ciorernment, a Species of Republic. It sapid be as.mouifest a breach ,of dse 4:ml4i:la:ion to admit cotholictio Corpswatioas as 110 oartis,in the Galician:4M; and fps this reason, Car , 11Po011mes.had fsequently thedisposal °l ands fat 14•POtose chnrCh.endownnints, and admissions - Haseboolo, „wish aaiensite patronage of purely an eccie ‘aiattina4harackr. Irejand, the inttoduction of :• - •Ca- . *edict to Corporations woulfl be found pecuhjirly ob jectionable. In thetsoupuy.there were 111 Corpora-, •Ussm, and under-these no fewer than 1500 offices. to "th* R bigh fogs weteettached.and yet it was proposed to throw the whole of these open to the Catholics masequersce Wouldbei to transfer power-front the Ytolcatants to the Vet:holies:And the effect of .that Irian ItitokOf vest ,nlistittcyos , lM alundioratitudoo ;whisk it ;mai %bit doh !riLeviny lro4 • sillaos.twpseserse entire. 711pkedashision of Catholics tystiSfd M ccouttaty,to• the elbarters of •Csisporaticaii,"—i. ...~ ... ?.... t r opener/ tet glisi.Ml- 1 4isk se dair 64 f Ol O4 l OO. - I Would instance an Asealresioticeihat mightaoriso. most Corporations& CriplOin Ws. attacked, who woidd he necessarily of tbo Establisheidirstligion. Itta Mayor might, should. this measure. pars into eille4 be fe-Xl• tholic. What, in such a came cOnlibe eloreridirelees. than to see th e Mayor go to one place of ,w ots hip : and Chaplain to another.? The Howoorable Member ceeeleded •by declaring: his Intention. to propose an. amendment, - whisk 'would, he hoped, in some degree give additional security against CatholiC influence. Mr. MOORllinPpOrted the vie* takes of the clause by the. Honourable and Gallant Member who had just sat down. It frequently happened that Mayors and other °Seers of Corporations sere. Ia oie, ilovesoots or trustees of Protestant institotioas and estabhohments. 'Now, he should like to know whether-Abet new lona vation was to be added to that already complained of? Mr. &votary PEEL would make unitary into the points suggested by the Honourable Mention'. ::At pre sent he was not aware of any power *possessed by Me:lifters of Corporations to divot the fonds Irons their original and legal destination t but if his Honourable and Learned Friend could show hi.n any real danger that might be incurred, he would most willingly ree such further security _as the nature of the care might require. He thought, h owever, that the original clause WAS sufficiently rtrong and comprehensive. After a few words from Mr. Moose, the clause was agreed to. The nom clams was—" Provided alio. and be it ensued, that unitise in this Act contained shall be construed to enable any per., sou or persons, otherwise than they are now by law enabled, to. hold, enjoy, or exercise any dice or place of dignity of, le, or be. bussing to the united Church of England and bonne!, or tie Church of Scotland, or any place or once whatever of es bektiegiog to any of the Ecclesiastical Courts of Judicature of this realm, or any Cant of Appeal from or review of the sentences of such Court or Courts; or of or belonging to any Cathedral, or Collegiate or Ec clesiastical Establishment or Foundation within the same; or any aLe or place whatever of or belonging to any of the Universities of this realm ; or any Ulm or place whatever, or by whatever name the same nuy be called, ot, in, or belonging to any of the Colleges or Wits of 'the said Universities, or of the Colleges of Zoo, Westminster, or WIDCWHICf or my College or School of Ecclesiastical foroci s ation within ibi s realm." Colonel SIBTHORPE rose to move, as an amend .ment, the introduction of a clause to prevent any per son professing the Catholic religion from possessing or exercising, in any way, directly or indirectly, any vote, pourer, or controul, in or over the application of any sum or sums of money belonging to, or that might by bequest, donatiou, or otherwise, belong • to such corr. ration ; and sh uld therefore move the insertion of the word " Protestant" before N Ecclesiastical Foundation." That amendment was necessary because the clause, as it at present st •nd, only went to prevent the enjoyment of those benefits. by the Catholics themselves. The Committee would bee it was equally necessarythat they abould not possess the power of bestowing it. He knew a Corporation iu the County of Lincoln (and there might be other, similarly circumstanced) in which the whole management of its funds was vested in the Mayor and about twelve members of the Corporation. Now, it might happen, in the event of this Bill passing, that tour or live Cstbulks might • become members of the Coiporation, and, from the absence of others, have a majolity in voting away the funds which would this& he placed at the disposal of persons hostile to the obje for • bich those funds were created. Mr. Secretary PEEL said the Honourable end Gals lent Membet was one of those who would make assures dna: doubly sure. and had, therefore, proposed to prp. tia the word 4 Protestint" to a ecclesiastical founds. Lion," when, is last, no other ecclesiastical kundatips could be imphesl.- If the Honourable Member %Med to prevent Romeo Catholics from having the power to eoteaway the lands of any Corporation, be should have proposed all aniendnient with such object to the former ciao..., to which only it was applicable. Catena SIBTHORM comehdold of the mode is which bk peerebitioas were received by Honourable Members; bat they shield not deter him from doing hi. duty. They might *wane him, it they would, but sun be would die a Protesunt—(Hear; sad a laugh). The whole Has.. of Commas should set seals& him so lower his tiag—(Hear. hear). . Secretary PEEL disclaimed any such intesties. STANLEY saki. the Honourable sad Gallen Member bad Mike into another trap be bad set for blastoff le introducing the ward 4 Protestant' before the Caws of Kees, Wasuninster, and Winchester, aU et which were Catholic feendadosetttott antral Has. Members-4 4 No, Do ; 11 64 Westminster b a Pro testant foundaties"—(Loud laughter). Colonel iIIETHORPE—The Hoe. Member bas Mlles ism a trap himeelf—(Renewed laughter). The Haa. Member was blind Mose% and we have both fallen lute the ditch tegethert(Laughter). Alter a few words (cam Mr. JEP.HSON 'althea/L=lTO* GEN ERA L, the original claum was Agreed to. The nest clause wets to prevent Roman Catholics from pre %ruing buoy ecclesiastical beset* Mt. Secretary PEEL sai4 that respecting this clause be had an addition to propose, which would. he trusted, piopitiate his Hun. Fi tend, the Member for Code Castle (Mi. G. Baiikes), whose speech on the point he bad pars moistly attended to. The clause at present, Pro vided that nothing herein contained shall extend or be consirued to extend to enable any person profess ing the Raman Cetholic religion to exercise any right OU presentation whatever," and that whenever the right of presentation was vested in Catholic, that Jim a Consmi•sitin. to be appointed by the Crown, should exercise such right. His Hon. Friend bad sug gested that the Ministers el the Croon might be C.a. tholics, and ,might appoint a Com Mission favourable to their own view's. To meet that objection he (Mr. See. Peel) would move an amendment, providing that id the case in question, instead of vesting the sight of promo tation ins canstrission, ii should devolve upon the Archbishop of Canterbury for the time being. 'Mr. =COURT had kneaded so hero proposed a canoe to . that precise acct. and should therefore give to the inandelset his auppen.t.tThe (Mute, as thee asimaded, was then agreed to. The oast clause 4 4 Provided able , sad be it tardier mama, im it shall not be law ful for any puma preteeelei the Roman Csikska refigioe s .directly or indirectly, tfiadelest the Crowe is the ammo. aunt or disposal of any Ace or reformist, lay or ecciislastfol,lia the united Church of England and Ireland or March of Scedoad; and that If any person shall peasant te advise his Majesty, bbl heirs, or seceseare, or the Lord Uestesant, er load Deputy, or other: shpt Cfoversor oc.Gtaverogre lrelaad, teething or caw/ft any sub spolnuasst sr siisyessl, bii.ahall, betas ;emitted mope by din Nano of law, be deemed &thy eta high mistisimeaminr,' and disqualified ter ever. from holding may elks, dell or neilkarb: under the Crown." Mi. TRANT asked what security .was there that a Catholic Minister .might not go into the closet of the Ring and advise him to do that which would be sub votive of the Constitution? How would such condlitt become known ? What evidence could be obtained it; it on which to convict the offending Minister? *• :Mr secretary PEEL asked, is reply, what security we had at present that the. Minister would not 'go into the King's closet and advise his Majesty to 'delver Lb' country into.the hands of the French? The proposed law said Roman Catholics should not give *dike • to this effect alluded to by the Honourable Member for - Are ves ; and certainly theerWobid. be the.saWfacilify'ot reeentionaf bad advice then as.therietisteJ at preeeeht Mr. TRANI' said, it tbit Right Moosemble Gaidenmewai fig*, *et there was so setradty at skit wield ap elsepthess and have see ireserky leibawif, aistait kid the savoury._ Sr R. IN 01181propesedi the Isdilldes-it iosidserkilb ottis e r %Mr: MA. dpe_pesvhise se punk lemma use! *Belle& t " 161 ,1 0.11 !" *4 1 pact to the el VW Wardellegissei Tb. elapse se sasseded was then agreed le. • tre4owNitig ra:sralbst ill( ewital t."l- ' 11" " 16. • • Wilerisis deo ilgbt tat tide Of ArliAlsbeph to their re. sVW of lisheeps to their *ire, end of.. Deans to will in Seemed as kelielaaa, kiwi b.'', settled eat essaalislisd by law; be 'it therefore maned, that him Mil Aar she mat of this Act it shall sot be lew,lll for any won than the petsoe thereinto authorised bj law io assume or Aps the same, Kyle, or thlo of Archbishop le prov_ince. Bide" deny Illshoprie, or Doan of 'my Deanery In BRAM or Iruland. and fiery versus se offssalog shall 1 for awry web dome forfeit 31 Pal *vine at ano huadred po m ade r it INGLIS asked abetter it was meankthat the fine should be imposed on every occasion that the offence was committed.or that a person who had once paid the fine should . be ever afterwards entitled to bold the title? The SOLICITOR -GENERAL replied that far every time the title was assumed the offence would carry the consequences with it. • Mr. MOORE said that the mischief arose not from the assumption of the title on the part of the individual, but from its being bestowed by R,oenpq Codiolics. la reply I. a moo front Sir s Mr. VBSEY PIiZGERALI.Viaid that in Scotland. Roman Cath olics did not assume:4bl tide. of Bush*, but Merely of Vicars Apostolic. Tao Marquis of CHANDOS thought it. would, be better to omit the clause altogether.. Mr. TRANT said it mereiy offered the Protestants, the humbug of security , with the additional di s advan. Cage of Irritation to the Catholics. The Bill eifofded substantial political power,while it piohibited the title of 41 my Lord Bishop." The question carried that the clams should be pert of is was** put aod .' On the titles* being read imposing a penalty of fifty pounds on any Roman Catholic . ecclesiastic who cies eke any of the rites or ceremooies of the Roman Catholic religion, or wear the habits of his ordei, save' within the the it places of worship of the Roman Ca tholic religion or in private hou+es, Mr. Secretary PEEL slid that this clause would, he had no doubt, give great satisfaction to religi.us Pan. tenants, at the same time that it would meet with the appiob .tmo of R-aman Catholics. HOLDSWORTH alluded to the appointment of the Chaplain to the House of Commons, arid of chaplains to the navy. If Catholic chaplains were al lowed to be appointed to the navy it wouldisaise a se cond interest so every vessel. He kite* it. •ould gile great satistactiop to have it undastood that this clause prevented the possibility of such a circumstance. Mr. Secretary PEEL observed List the Bill would mate 110 alteiation in the tasting law with regard to the appointment of Captains Chaplains; and it the Speaker appoinied a Raman Catholic Chaplain, he thought the Crown would not be dispoied towanctioet the sessional order appropriating a salary. Mi.TRANT said, that when there were many Roman catboltc Menthes, in the House, it would not be at all improbable th at they should desire that the Speaker might appoint a Catholic Chaplaist-The clause was than agreed to. On the reading of the clause directing the regime. Lion of the Jesuits and others belonging so monastic orders, and their 'Wash* from this kingdom, Mr. MONCK i.bjected to the severity of the clause, which 'needed the ancient law of this kingdom in rela tion to tounastic orders. The clause as it at present stood would include the Knights of Malta. which was composed of some of the first families in Europe. Any member of that Order landing us England would be guilty of a misdemeanour under the clause. Mi. SPRING RICE also opposed the clause. He was sorry to see new penalties imposed by a Bill, the object of which was to remove Other odious penalties. contended that persons belonging to monastic 0,41•19 could do no injury to the Protestat,t establishments of this country . tiler, wets some fat orders to . bell and established for charitable purposes which had founded schools, and the members of which were band by vows which this hell would affect. - He *sold, deaden., propose as an amendment, that those persons who were not ordained - should be exempted from the operation of the Bill, or, in other words, that it should not affect lay persons, though bound by monadic vows. He there.. foie moved that the words w not being laymen" should be inn: ted. Mr. STANLEY said he mast protest against this clans*. I'o6 county (Lancashire) the JeAnts bad is aced themselvei warmly in the cause of education. : ind had also, in times of distress, shown the greatest:kind nest to the poor, whose sufferings they strenuouily ea cited themselves to mitigate; and therefore feeling that this clause would injure so useful an institution, he felt hound to protest against its adoption. Mr. W. WYNN felt a great objection• to the clause. ' which would exclude learned men from visiting ibis country if they belonged to the monastic order.. • • Secretary of State ought to have power &son lien license the residence of these individuals in England. at such times and for such periods as hi deckled ex • pedieut. Under the clause, as it now stood, however, there was nu riception; nor no *sustieniiin of the Act admissible. It was well known that many individuals,' remarkable for scientific knowledge, ind now resident in diretent parts of the Continent, were members of ligious orderV. The order of the enedictinei contained : , many eminent men, amongst whom be. would mentio n ' Angelo Mai. whose name as an antiquary was barrens to every one. It would be mist disgraceful to this' country if a learned individual Of this desciiptioa syai: to be driven from Our shOres because he happened to belong to a monastic order. * Mr. P. THOhIPSON' thought' the exclusion of itic Jesuits from this country would be attendawith mitigated good. That ostler was always opposed to: civil and religious libesty. and this was felt in every' Roman Catholic country. In France a great struggle had long been' r e tried on to prevent the Jesuits from monopolizing the establishments for or educatiin of youth; had ibis opposition on the part of the people of rance was the result of experience, and of a knowledge Of the character of the Jesuits. I f clause had been introduced Ica substantive measure. wholly independent of the genetalseneaaore..of which he entirely approved, it thould'have his entirnapprobatioo. lo his opinion it was the best part of the Bill, and be gave It his talon hearty. support. bIr.LABOUCIJERE heard the opinions r f the. Hon. Member for Dover (Mr‘r.Thompson) with regret. He did not lc : seethe Jesuits, bothe objected to any class of "persons 'being eieluded from this country alto 'con ducted themselves with propriety. Nothing could re coocile him to skis clause, which was contras y to the free; open, , ltill hospitable 'character of the Edglisb Constitiiiidn.' There were many scientific and learned pen. IlleOlhefli of religious ordess.and it wctild be paltry aurdifisgraceful to exclude them friim vision a r•England by this Bill. Tutks, pngans. and infidels wire admissi- Me to this imattry; and it was highly aiscreditlible only tir'eleinde ibis'• bound by religious vows. , The ofili • krwhich be (Mr. L.) had ever seen in this country were someleries ' monks . of the order at St: Bernird..-- in-common wig bib'. tad• Woo ia• de ttell to tbi•MspPtilitf of those poison' abrOad ; sod if =roue ofthomozprossed a desire to visit this country , • 3" .•.• .. • • .0a scientific or I ,era y pursuits, soh !tai(, . 1 4 Ai .s.k. man roust feel on beiugnbliged to We Oat i of sly of hi s b r o t he l hood tatter tii - Rogland; tiletOrhos" MY ft liable to floe and imptisphasent, merely becaise, iliiir" belonged to a religious order. Mr. Secretary PEEL defended the clause. Theimas sent 1311 was a measure of Concession 'to 'the ilinisso Catholics, and should be' met ay persons 'iodating that religion in the same spirit. The existence of monastic orders was by no means necessary to the elisiencenr maintersaiiee of the Roman Catholic religion, or the, Roman Catholic Chore& There was a vide distinction between the members of. monastic orders and the sects lar Clergy. The' laws of Erie slid were always !Nosed to Monastic orders, • and' distingoishil between . lig members of those ordets and the secular 'Clergy. Woe's the measure pasuedsfor the relit( of the It unati Catholic Clergy in 1793, the laws against the mortar is orders to maned in hike, bat they were evaded by meters of secret trusts, which was an additional reason why there should be some direct enactment on the stitject—thvit), Every foreign country had manifesieJ a jeal4usy of the Jesuits; and, as had been we 1' observe) by the Member for Dover, in France I great Airtig.tle had been *carried on to prevent the members of that order from inotiopo.isinis the eJucation of the people. If tie Jesuits were excluded fionl other countries, it was natural to suppose that they weoull resort to this; and it was too much to expect that this order should meet that encouragement and protection in a Pro estant gauntly ~hicks was denied to them in It 'Mao CAIN:Mc Pe countries. It was cons/ascent with good policy that every precaution should be, taken with respece co the introduction of those religious orders into this country ; and. cousides ins the nature of thisßill; every Satishiction ought to be given to those who entertained .apprehen sions as to the citn.equences of those mmtastic oicle . ta being established here. These was a law already in t vs:- vice for the pr. vention of Jesuit establishae.et.ts, but it was not found effective. - There was nothing ittiolet sin, Lowever, in the proposed clause. Those Fes sons ii pre sent se.ident in this country were allowed to remain upon the registration 'of their risme., which was iii t 4 very severe penalty ; and we were only ',Mooing the example 4 almost every Catholic country in preveating them from settling here. It vie House could be aware of the anxiety and aliprehensioo entsst ;lured in some eseidibourt ouds where Jesuits had arrived, with large funds, and with the intentioaof establishing themselves, the necessity for some provision on the subject would be is ore obvibus. As to the benefit derived from the exer tions of those persons in prom sting education, as referred to by the Hon. Member for Limerick (Ms. Spring Rice), if persons wished to promote education it was by no means necessary Oat they should bind themtelves by monastic vows. Vows of celibacy, or vows of pover ty, had su.ely nothing to do with the promotion of educa tion, or. as f.tr as he could see. with the exercise of the Roman Catholic religion. The Constitmion and the law 44 . this country was oppweJ to per sons binding themselves by secret vows. The -clause had givers great sistisiactisn to those who had hitherto offered a conscientious opposition to the claims of the Roman Catholics. and. for his part. he could int consent to withdraw it, when R man Catholic States had thought it necessary to exercise the same kind of jealoul with iespect to particular orders. Lord SA NDON said tie chase appeared to bias to be contrary to every priatipte 64 ' 114440k * Mr. H. GB AT FAN defended +he Jesiiii• from the imputatioiis can up.in them by the Hon. Member for Dower. Though so much had been read-about the Je suits in Deland.there were only lour now in that count, T. Mr. L. FOSTER sop. oiled the cl +use. on the ground that. in pop litiun as the Jesuits were disco+++ eked in France they Would reaon to England. if not pievcnted . bi mine •uch measure as the present. Sir SAr ILSON. though adverse to Monastic Ordeie. thought that Governs eat ought to charge it-ell w . th• the responsibility of admitting persiins .4' the d se, iption contemplated by the clause, when they presented them. seises under ascisinstances not likely to be productive of ill effects. Mr. HUSKISSON said the Jesuits were bound, not only by a secret engagement. but by an nhligation •of Oise.lime to ti foreign P.wer. He furtlier•observed that 'those orders were remarkable for "leading suit) great rapidity,*and 'for • proPorilonably eat - ending their in ', adente. t Daly was be'opposed to the Jesuits, but to ewer, species' of monastic institution All the en lightened Catholies on the Continent admitted that the remise of the Roman Catholic religion was perfecCy ;practicable without the assistance of monastic commu nities: He would, therefore, give his decided support to the fiVii clause. Mr. (RANT said that was the onlj part of the Bill that could be called any thing like e security. He 'thought it of so much inspertatsce that it could net be too cautiously or deliberately discussed. Ile would. theielose, suggestthe espediency of adjourning the Com mittee. •. H. Was ansioui that hiimself. and those who thought with him, sflatil3 obtain a full and fair hearing on a Mauer of so much.impottance. Mr. Secretary PEEL said, that it certainly had been the practice .of the House, in such case., to adjourn at twelve, or halt past twelve o'clock, when there was no probability of bringing the business e f tile C•Unnlittre to a close ha that night. However, in this case he thought it Wai a Mesita' might voiy advantageously be dispensed with. It appeared to him unsatisfactory to proceed by such short discussions as had been rcommetided.— When the Committee began its labours this event„ g , pot more than between sixty and seventy members were present. and those who came in about eight or n'ne o'cl , ck were some time before they understood what was going forward. They 114c1 ahead, been two days nu the Bill. and he thought they could not p J better than proceed with it till two, or even three Aloek. As to the present clause. and the wish ex pressed by his Hon. Friend opposite tq be beard on it. he was sure there existed in every (`'gentleman a dis position to attend to the observations or his Honourable Friend. and on that particular point he could breed° desire to adjourn, seeing that be fully approved of the _ clause. Mr. TRANT aid he would go on, and the moment Any impatience was manifested he would move an ad journment. • Sir S. KNATCHBULL was willing thin' to proceed. He whited to know for what days the R•ght Honourable Gentleman intended to fig the sobs. quent stages of "halal? pie. PER foTo bring up ups R i pest mimosa for thejarpwe of baying k primed. and use* to adopt it on Friar. and to **atilt . a Wed time es Woodsy. . _ ' HANKER would prefer Tuesday. (furls. " K day, . TheCHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUNa Md. Abel he show would maw foe that—it was a =mgr .." ' !pen to ob- Caked SIBTHORPIC whhed forKZ=nast,' win to faaior opportunity for i reendwll After a few worsts flan r. L Roca and Mr. Wunnte.Hosinan, . Mr. flowsrairy PEZl:itald he would consider of alieespidtedy starergag %sem Nesabers of rellgioes orderrilhaltbat tie *pewee ff allirdiat inch ECSININ to trotowame Ideation of his. his. .