Star. — London, England, 1826-04-19 00:00:00

the whole comma rot 4 pure Irons 1100 to fr6o4 849,364 And for 5 years from to Int 4 . . What was the cause of that remarkable difference? It was because when a - dlmand'Was created from Eng land, the most extensive supplies were obtained by every means throughout the country. Even from Hungary was corn brought, in order to supply the demand. Croatia also sent Its produce by the water. The Vistula vies covered with barks, conveying corn to the port, from &hernia, Silesiaoind all districts on its banks. The high prices eXisted, and' the navigable rivers afforded facilities. From those returns it would appear that if foreign corn should be imported into this coun try, there was not any reason to apprehend that a greater quantity could be imported, while the price continued at from 555. to 505., than about 400,000 quarters, and even if the price should be raised higher, there could 'mit be mere than 500,000 imported, a small quantity \Oben compared with the consumption of this country, 'which amounted to thirteen miliio:is of quarters on o:rally. From the quantity which might be im ported, there was therefore no cause for alarm, and even the prices could not cause any appre hension, as the prices at Warsaw proved. If it was necessary for the improvement of the trade of England, that markets shoold be found for her commodities, why should not she find a market for those of other nations ? It could not be injurious to the landholders, for if corn did not pay, theyecould cultivate rape, flax, or hemp. If America, Russia, and other countries, should declare that they would not take any of the produce, the sup plies of the Produce could be lessened in, proporlion to the deMand ; for the establishments for manufacturing those goods would not be worked when the prod.ice could not be sold. In the cultivation of corn a different case occurred, for then more time became necessary for stopping the production. Mr. Jacobs had made a cal culation of the price for which Polish corn could be brought into the English markets: not the inferior specics of corn produced in some of the maritime pro vinces of Prussia,. which might be sold for 43 - t. but the Polish wheat of good quality, which would cost 48s. I , per quarter on importation into the port of London.— The estimate of Warsaw wheat was— Cost of Wheat at Warsaw • Us. Od. per. qr. Conveyance in boats, loading, and stowing Os. 6d. Freight to Dantsic . ss. Od. Loss by pilfering and damage . 5 od. Expense in drying and warehouseing . 2s. Od. Profit and commission in Dantaic . Is. 6d. Freight to London . as. od. .11•••• Amount on arriving in the English market 465. Od. One of these items would require some explanation ; it was that of the pilfering and damage. The conveyance of the wheat on the Vistula was effected in boats, with-, out any covering, and of such construction, that they wete broken atter the voyage. Pilfering, therefore, existed, and also considerable damage was done to the wheat, for as it was exposed to rain and wet, there was no part which was thoroughly safe. The only covering was the matting together of the shoots of the top grains which vegetated. A cousderable item was therefore made for the loss. by pilfering and damage, and the amount of price on reaching the English markets was 48s. The price of the best wheat from Cracow was somewhat lower. The estimate was as follows: Cost.iof wheat at Cracow . . 235. 6d. per qr. Conveyance by boats, and loading 6d. Freight to Dantaic . 7.. 6d. Loss by pilfering and damage . 3*. Id. Expense ac Dantzic 4s od. Profit on commission I s , 6d. Freight to London od. 453. ed. The expenses-of the freight to London, which was at present effected in Baltic vessels, built for the convey. ance of timber, might be lessened, by their carrying of the corn in English vessels, where the damage done to the grain would be much less. Having thus stated the amount at which the corn imported from Dantzic could be sold here, he would proceed to read from Mr. Jacob's Report h s recommendation for imposing a small duty of ten or twelve shillings per quarter on foreign corn, in order to place that corn on an equality with the produce of this country. The recommenda tion was at the close of his Report. It ought to be recollected, that Mr. Jacobs had been sent out by the L'ircis, of the. Treasury, for the special purpose of in vestigating the subject fully, and of making a Report thereat. The recommendation(in Mr. Jacob's words) says If a duty in this country of 10s. or 12s. per quarter was imposed, it would not allow of such a profit, on the supposition of the price being from 60 to 6 1 / 4 as to in duce very great exertion to increase cultivation in the districts bordering on the Vistula. The chance of a rise occasioned by war, or by a winter so severe as to injure vegetation, or by a rainy season, might induce those of a speculative turn to increase their growth of wheat, hut those who have that turn, and who have the means of indulging it, are so few, that they would produce no sensible increase in the general surplus, I see no reason to believe, that with such a duty as I have mentioned for England, and a price from 60 to 64, and with some similar regulation in France, that the surplus corn produced in Poland, including all the countries near enough to the Vistula to send their Corn to that stream, would materially increase a common season, or very much, if at all, exceed the average pro duce of that country ; the greater part of this might probably be wheat, and if the duty were alike on all the qualities of that grain, none would be sent here but that part which is the driest, heaviest, and whitest. The inferior descriptions would not pay for importation un less the average in England was much more than 645." This opinion upon a Free Trade in Corn, from an indi. vidual(Mr. William Jacob), who was once decidedly hostile to any such freedom, must be allowed to have the greatest weight. He had recorded his opinions in opposition to any such measure, by a work published in 1814-.. he had expressed his continuance in the same cortviction before the Committee of 1821—and it was therefore a proof both of his sincerity, and of the force of the facts which had come under his knowledge during the period of his inquiries, that he bad, in the very face of his former declarations, given such decided testimony in favour of a syltens directly opposed to that which he had foreiserly advocated. The present average price was *out 88 - shillings, but he had no hesitation in de clarin& that the Agriculturists—and he was himself an Agricultuiist—would be well protected at an average price of iiss. There was, he was convinced, no landed proprietor or farmer who would not, if he looked to the at ste of the country,and the security which it would give hisyroperty, be content with that price for his grain, or even something lower, provided that he could give permanence to the present state of things, and obtain security for the payment of his rent? If the price was lower, the income from land would become still more available; and he put it to the landed proprietors whe ther the regular payments of such pikes, and the com parative cheapness of every thing else, would not be Compensate . I amount oftent,whicn no real benefit to those who received it. If they persisted in their present course bat for a time, it required no great penetration to discover that they would be, ere long, afflicted with the most frightful miseries. For his part, as long as he had the honour of a seat in that House, he would continue to raise his voice against a system which he had periodically held up to their condemna tion, and which he hoped yet to see give way before the united force of reason, common sense, sound policy, and every consideration which regulated the principles I d trade with regard to all other productions. If they considered the effect of their at one time calling in a large supply of grain from foreign countries in anti• cipaiion of or from the effect of a dearth-_.a supply which continued long after the causes which caused the dearth had ceased to exist; and if they contemplated the long train of evils in the shape of high tithes, high rents, and high poor rates, which were created by such , a bounty upon that importation ; and if they turned their attention to the ruin and misery inflicted upon the agricoltoral interests, and every other interest in the kingdom—viten the fear of that dearth has subsided, tad when they make an attempt to return to their former state of prohibition—if they considered these things. and feinted that such bad been their condition not very long since, be confessed they Must have stronger nerves than he had who would look back with ' Olt emotion upon the continuance of a course which might, by any rZtity,prodtsce a return of that apalling state of misery and Upou every principle, therefore. of common sense, cam eon honesty, and liberal feeling, he called upon them now to rescue the country from the evils to ',Lich it must be subjected if the pre soot Corn Laws were allowed to remain unaltered. To advance that nest desirable object to the utmost extent of his power, be would wow oeiclude by moving," That the House do resolve itself into a Committee of the whole House, to take into its consideration use present state of the Corn Laws." Mr. G. PHILIPS could not see any reason why corn should be exempted from the principles of free trade, particularly as the tendency of manufactures was to become cheaper while corn became dearer, a strong reason, in his opinion, why the importation of the latter should be permitted in preference to the former. Some merit had been claimed for the landed interest, un ac count of the greater quantity of labour employed in the ;production of iheii commodities. He doubted the ac curacy of the statement. The annual amount of ma nufactured cotton was 24. millions, to produce which it was calculated that labour had been employed in one way or another to the amount of 14 millions. So that to compare with the employment of labour at the rate of 25 per cent. according to the statement of his Hon. Friend, he had produced a case in which em ployment was afforded in the ratio of about 60 per cent. If, as was pretended, the Corn Laws kept up the price of corn 20 per cent. above what it would otherwise be, it must follow from what he had before stated, that the poor labourers in the cotton trade, who spent nearly the whole of their wages in food, paid an annual tax to the agricultural interest of not less than two millions. It was contended that 20s. protecting duty upon wheat and 10s. upon other descriptions df grain, were no more than nearly adequate to place the British upon an equa lity with the foreign grower. He learned from a speech published some years ago by his Honourable Friend, the Member for Essex, that the quantity , of wheat grown in England was ten millions of quarters, and of other descriptions of grain thirty=two millions. It would result, then, from the :hewing of the agricul tural class themselves, that the people of this country paid them in effect a tax of 20s. upon ten millions of quarters of wheat, which would be ten millions sterling; sod of 10s. upon thirty-two millions of other grain, which would be sixteen millions more, making in the whole no less a sum than 26 millions sterling. (Hear). He believed that one party greatly exaggerated the evils to be expected from a repeal of the existing law, and that the other • as greatly exaggerated the benefits the repeal would produce. The effect he was persuaded would be much less than was expected by either party. The agriculture of this country was in a much more advanced state than in any part of the Continent. Of this a judgment might be formed from the circumstance that whilst on the Continent, according to the statement of Mr. Jacob, four fifths of the population were em t ployed in agriculture, no more than one third of the _people of England were so employed. The poor rates were not, as had been represented, paid exclusively by the land. The returns for which be had moved shewed that out of six millions, two were paid from other sources. Of that portion of the, poor rates paid by the land, much was composed of the wa ges o f l a b our .— This system of paying wages out of the poor rates tMould, he hoped, soon be abolished. It had a most deteriorating effect upon the character of the labouring dosses. A free trade would also prevent excessive fluctuations of price. The present state of the law pro duced dissatisfaction amongst artisans, and disposed them to emigration; if it were altered, perhaps other nations, and particularly the United States; might be induced to relax their commercial restrictions. He thought a pledge had been given that the whole subject would be taken up by the Administration. He should I 'rejoice at the substitution of a duty of 10s. or )2i. for the present complicated regulations. The highest authorities, amongst whom he could mention Mr. Ri cardo, Mr. Blake, and Mr. Tooke, thought that 7s. 6d: would be i duty fully sulclent to countervail the peculiar burikof of land tax, poor rates, and tytbes, to which the lend-owners were anlajUet. He should have no objection to ifs. The Hon. Member sosduded by seconding the motion. (The moment be sat down, these was a loud and general call for Mr. Huskisoon). Mr. HMISSON.—Sir, ill rising to reply to the observation, of the Hon. Member, I do not intend to follow him through the various and important details into which he has entered. My only object is to dis suade the House from entering at present into any dis cussion of the Corn Laws, inasmuch as it can only ter minate in inconvenience and disappointment. It appears to me that a general understanding has existed, that it would not be desirable to enter during the present Ses sion upon the discussion of certain questions with re ference to their final adjustment. This understanding had certainly not been founded upon any pre-con certed agreement, but from a general coincidence of opinion among all parties that such a discussion cannot, in the present circumstances of Parliament, and of the country, render justice to the great qttes tions themselves, or to the public interests. That, therefore, it will be a wiser course to leave these im portant questions, as it were, in' abeyance, until they can obtain in a new Parliament that full and mature . consideration to which they are entitled. The He n . Member for Bridgnorth has stated that the absence of certain information, respecting the intentions of Govern nr:ut in regard to the Corn Laws, has checked the in-*, ftf.to ftsta • 7 ,near use e (the - e 3 his . place, at the that his Majesty's Go __ the question of the during the present s• Sion; and a similar d ec l arat i on was ma de in the Session of UM. If, Sir, there is any oncquestion more than another which it isuafit for us to entertain—which it is unfit for us to agitate in this House—.which it is unfit for us to set afloatia the country, unless we are prepared to go through with it—unless we think that the time has arrived unless we think that the present opportunity is a fit and convenient opportunity fo r di scuss i on — t h at question is the most momentous one of the present state and system of our Corn Laws. I say momentous, Sir, for it connects itself with the subsistence and comforts of the great mass of the population, for it connects itself with the well-being and prosperity of a class most nu merous, and, in many respects, most important, either by their right of property in the soil, or by their capital employed in the cultivation of the soil—l mean that class which depends for their situation in so ciety upon the cultivation and produce of the land.— But when I state that this question is a momentous question, and surrounded with difficulty, I beg leave to ask, are there not difficulties which grow out of the situation in which this country has been placed, since the law which regulates the Foreign Corn Trade was changed? It is no easy matter, no trifling undertaking, at any time, but more especially at this advanced period of the Session, and in the present 'state of Par liament, to consider that which most be maturely 'con sidered before any sound conclusion can be formed upon this question, to consider what is the amount of the direct charge upon the land, in consequence of the peculiar establishments of the country. It is admitted on all hands that the landed interest, or therm employed in cultivating the soil, are enti led to compensation and protection. I own,' Sir, the amount of that corn • pensation is not the only ground of' difficulty with me; for it must be clear to every one, that if for some time a ruinous system in 'any branch of foreign trade has been pursued, and I, for one, have no hesitation in saying that a system of absolute prohibition in this or in any other branch of foreign trade, is a vicious system —I say, that if a ruinous system has for some time been acted upon, it becomes our duty cautiously to tread back our steps with reference to the consequences which such a system has entailed upon us; that course of pro ceeding, I contend, is sound policy, not only for the in terests of the parties more immediately affected, but for the interests of the consumers of corn. Let not Gen tlemen deceive themselves by entertaining an opinions that any sudden change, which would affect the pecu niary engagements of the landed interests—which would Materially affect the value of leases—materially affect all descriptions of landed settlements, and which sud den change would be an act of injustice towards the parties who are the object of the change—woeld be pro ductive of any immediate relief--(Hear.)— On the con trary, I am fully persuaded that such sudden changes, independently of the injustice which they would work to- , wards those parties, would do more than any other mea sure that could be devised in the present state of the coun try, to aggravate the difficulties that already exist l — My Hon. Friend opposite has made frequent refereirces to papers and documents; but they •hoppen not to- be before the House. They relate to-a very important part of the subject: to the changes which have taken - place in the situation of the Northern Nations, and those who were competent to supply corn ; and particularly, to the changes produced by the interdiction of the-corn trade, established by the law 'of France. The difficulties have been increased by the aceumulatienof corn, which has been the result of that prohibition r and which has brought the parties to ruin who have grown it. I did feel it my duty, after the last Session of Parliament, to direct the Gentleman who has drawn up the Report —I allude to Mr. Jacob, a person, whose fitness and dili gence cannot be praised too highly—to proceed to all the capitals of countries connected with the supply of corn. The information which that Report furnishes, cannot be always perfect, or quite conclusive upon the subject ; but it is, at least as far as it goes, a most valuable addi tion to the information which we already possess ; and I say that we ought not to come to a decision on this question before we have had an opportunity of reading this Report. There is also a most valuable Appendix to die Report; and this very circumstance, therefore, is a reason why the country should have an opportie nity of acquiring and weighing the information which the Report contains ; and I do sincerely believe, that if it be read without those extravagant fears and ap prehensions which I know to prevail throughout a great part of the country, and without those prejudices which sometimes reject all evidence in matters of this descrip tion; it will enable us to decide the question better than we can possibly decide it at the present moment.— Gentlemen ought not to exclude entirely from their consideration the que: tion of price; and this question of price, I must beg leave to observe, intimately con nects itself with the state of our money system. In the feverish and unsettled state in which our currency has been, and in which, 1 regret to say, it continues to be, can any man think the present a desirable or fit mo. ment (joined to ether circumstances) to enter upon the subject ?—lf we decide filly, can we dismiss from our minds the state of our currency, which is the very soul and element of price. It therefore is desirable not now to proceed to this discussion. Sir, I think I have stated sense good -grounds which at all times would make it desirable that we should have more leisure, and better opportunities, for entering on this inquiry ; but I freely owes that there cannot be a more unfit moment than the present for this discussion. It is a period when every body must be aware that the public business of the Session, as far at least as it originates with Government, is already in a very advanced state; and every body is expecting an impending election. The present is unquestionably an ill chosen time, and when the Honourable Gen. datum reproaches me so vehemently with having departed from the pledge which I have given, let tne ask, What is the pledge which 1 have givea ? merely that it the necessary information could be obtained upon the subject in time, and lithe question could be brought forward early in the Session, I hoped we might arrive at a satisfactory adj us t ment of t h e subject. The pledge I gave ,was qualified by, or rather it was dependent oil, two very material and indispensably necessary circum stances. Neither of these has happened, for we are not now at the beginning of the Session, and the requisite information hits not ,beets obtained early enough, but cireunistaaces are to prevent our entering into the sub ject at the presenteristi, they would not be conclusive, in my mind, if anrchangeor relief could be given to the distress whic.h , Qpfa'sbaea; 44:.anuntry foe .th er e does I exist in the maned rehiring i districts, and n other , . 'pot.. -9t tin- rower }, IMI • Riety - 3e-- uh- -- a Wry considerable degree of disti ( H e ,jr, itearis bitt I cannot fi n d any nth ' ci; a ft er the, best efussii., et i duration which I h ave e l, . di e subject, I t i s thy firm bpinion that the measure plipdsed will hot obly Ina crease the difficulties and distresses of the country, but it will destroy the best hopes of their ultimate termi, nation. (Hear, • hear). Fur, in the difficulties under which the manufacturing and Commercial interests of the country are now so unhappily labouring, and con- ' sidering the state of the foreign marke - i, the best rdief for the country is the unimpaired consumption between the internal consumers of the kingdom. Let me not be misunderstood. I mean to say, that I think prohibition - with respect to corn not only to be a most is - national andpernicious m easure , b ut i t i s a tenfold greater eVa than prohibition with reference to any other article whit , ever. (Hear).—This is my molt firm conviction; but, nevertheless, I do say, that any immediare'or very sud den change in the condition of the agricultural classes would aggravate the distresses of a;l the other classes. But I have no difficulty whatever in stating, and I sure it in the most unequivocal and decided terms, that lam most thoroughly opposed to all further prohibitions, and I think a speedy reprobation of this law is called tor, in order to prevent those evils which the Hon. Gentleman has pointed our, and to guard against their recurrence ; but in the present state of the country, the public mind ought not to be agitated upcn the 'idol*. My wish is, that the que tion should stand as it'ackw stands. I give my assurance, and I hope the House will take that assurance—that in the next Session of Parliament the intentions of his Majesty's Govern ment upon the subject will be known. 'My Hon. Friend has argued the question of free trade, as if it were the absolute remov a l o f a ll diffietilties throbn in the war of the supPlf otforeign productions to.the inhabitants of this country. Thi s is not my v i ew of the question, and we are talking a totally - different language upon the subject. The Hon. Gentleman has talked of free trade in sugar—of free trade in timber —and offset trade in various other articles. But there are two distinct grounds of imposing duties upon articles of trade —one of which, at least, the Hop. Gentleman seers to have (merit:diced. One ground of imposing Buttes upon trade is t o t a ll y di st i nct f rom t h e system either of prohibition or protection. I allude to taxation or revenue, which.in this country ii material, in order to meet the . public expenses, and to p a y t h e i nterest and charges open the debt. The duties on timber are laid on in 'order to raise the revenue. The duties on sugar are sources of almost the largest revenue which the country receives; and this duty is not laid on, as the Hon. Gentl eman imagines, as' any .protection to the sugar trade. When we come to the discussion of the relative duties laid upon East and West India sugar, I shall be ready to show that the protection to the West India sugars is more nominal than real. I do not know why protecting duties should not be granted to a certain degree - oo the productions of this country,or upon whatever might be produced by British skill, or by the application of British capital. I mean only to say, that the peculiar or favourable productions of this 'country ought"te'be • put upon the - grounds ota Pair cOMpetition with aitiOar . prOdeetians - of other countries. The Principle ,is i to . cotiessereil'sbea4antages that other tenntries mayhave I so that the productions of each may enter the ditferent buirkets - uponeqoal tern* What are the printi Ott of all : the measures relating tcilree trade'which I have fah the ! honour of sobmitting to P ar li ament ? N ot free tra de, in ! the sense in which'some might state the term; but trade free from all detiei, etcepting those which are nftes tart to give the trader of direrent ciruntries.:4,Mual footing in the markers, and so protect. them from:the - 4x. eloaivs advantages which many.nations would with to I establish in'their own favour. in the Silk 'Trecle i r-the old prohibitory duties, to the . erent Of repivitig 'the country from the injuncrus effects of suinggling,,, upon which the old rate of duties operated at se high a bounty, that k was absolutely impossible to suppress It.. The smuggling was equally injurious to the manufacturer and to the revenue, and therefore the protecting duty was not withdrawn; but it was modified so as :o' dace the British Manufacturer in a state to compete with Foreigners. Whatever might have been the fears and alarms which had been entertained' by persqua in terested in the silk . trade, lam convinced' that those persons are now satisfied that the present - rate of duties is sufficient for the protection - of their interests.— Mr. Webb Hall stated'that It was Infllcient to put to agriculturist. in a fair state of competition-.so impost upon one trade ditties of ten, on another duties of fi fteen per tent. This'll. been 'hone: and under these circumstances I do not now feel it aocessnry to go into the question ; butennfine myself to the principles ,a.ndl.sneve niences of the case, Whi c h ren d er it tallat that' iie shout ! Wed further in the discussion. I shall, the re fore, mare `the' n ions question. , , . ;!. -a The arsaxas then put the question, amidst tut adterasieleries of the House. Lord MlLTOlfsaid,that if he Was now 411 a. ',Rioted at the flusher po st p onemeot of this great. q4estspol by his Majesty's - Government, be could not but. look for the same disappointment on future occasions, biome the same argume n t s b l igh t b e ' nsed,.and itufeAct ex pected, from Session to Sesaloo. He 'confepnd be thought the Right Hon. Gentleman had not compli mented the House, when he stated.th/k they were not competent to discuss the question, beiause of the • im pending dissolutiOn of Parliament. It appe+ccd,trifiim that the sooner the question was dealt onth,the *Ater, and that it ought to be a good reason lot prolonging the 3c:ion. • By the course which the GpeConseakhad taken, every thing Wan, left - in, suspcnip, „ -Who could know what the value orrenta, and leases .would be, whe n hi s Majesty's Ministers wrapped up in mysterious language or in silence what their in tentions were. He did not believe thnt a fair consi deration of the question, and an adjustment upon equit able principles would be injurious to the landed interest. Certainly they would be obliged to reduce their rents, but that would be made up to them by a correspr sating reduction in the price of corn and all other articles of provision. He denied that t!re farmer at d the agricul tural labourer were interested in the high price of fors; and when landed Gentlemen pretended to bopro:ecting agriculture, and the farmer, and labourer, they were in fact pleading their own cause, They we r e t h e only parties who benefited by the high price of corn. It appeared to him, that if there was, a . time whco the qleersctiiaoin distressought to ; be becauseh considered,eit believed w was t a h t e a r e t impt cu law m in snag in the commercial code of this coun tr y more inineious to its commerce than the Corn Laws, whi c h s h ut us out friar, almost all the neater ports. of Europe .144 Irons the Baltic. In whatever point of. view he contemplated this law, it was equally ()him ionabll ; he f sand Its im. politic, unjust, and dnchrtstati.: It was tinelThkifiani because it enhanced to the ptisir. Ihe price of the open saries of life. In short these law; were not_lo be maintained by any argument, .short, of fatio.oil inde pendence ; and he apprehended that no one would say preferable to a•biaal.ef. ;simile, *hl the* •Itala* tosespoiti ski& in i _midi : I. bet 1 411 nowsinaqhigh, the _re.* ved but lair the rightillit Houle th at spy Itittlao. Pei tb l'q It . away :With the left.--4flear.)-4Rf Iwo - old:ask .teq ftir reteigii ALI* declared, them, - whether the security to. property, the .adianiogt ceeteweeemitot of the &Woo, tin bestowed on manufactures, the general activity given to vernmentdid bot intend to bring I the whole commerce of the country, would nut amply Corn Laws before Parliament duri compensate for a nominal mount of rent,which produced don : and a tirniiim A... 1..........-- ...- __ I • . . _ - IT