Star. — London, England, 1830-02-23 00:00:00

;wive as much as the estimate before the commencement of the French war. Mr. MABERLY advised his hon. friend not to preas his amend. :nent to a division, as his so doing would be, as his last division too clearly showed, but a wasting of the time of the house. Sir JOHN WROTTESLEY saw no reason why the quarter master-general's department should be kept up at its present high rate. What was the necessity of keeping a quartermaster.general at Plymouth and another at Portsmouth ? Sir H. HARDINGE begged leave to remind hon. members, that the staff estimates had been reduced 27,0001. within the last two years, though it might be inferred from the tendency of the hon. member for Aberdeen's observations, that the contrary was the fact. The hon. member was in error in stating that no reduction had taken place in the staff department in Ireland, for the present esti. mate contained provision for one adjutant-general, one assistant. adjutant.general, and one brigade. major less than that of last year. He was also in error as to the pay of the adjutant-general, which was in fact more than 1,0004 per annum less than in 1815. The hon. member for Staffordshire (Sir J. iVrottesley) was also in error with respect to the quartermaster-general's department, for, with the exception of one officer, it stood at present on the footing of the establishment in 1792. Colonel DAVIES wished to known what grounds it was pre tended to justify the payment of from six to ten Inspectors of mill. tia in the lonian Isles, as has been the case for the last fifteen years, though, as the right hen. gentleman very well knew, there was no militia of any kind in the island. Sir J. MURRAY said that these inspectors were not paid as in spectors, but as residents. Colonel DAVIES replied that they were paid as residents as well as inspectors. The expense of the military establishments called for ;t minute inquiry—the rather as those colonies did not belong to us, and were a great burden annually to the country. Sir G. MURRAY said that every reduction had been effected which was compatible with our existing relations with those islands, and with the Mediterranean generally. In fact, the estimate was not less than 3,2651. less than that of last year for those islands alone, and they contributed in some degree to the expense of their own military establishments. slalta, in the same way, contributed to the minim) , chest not less than 10,0001. per annum. The hon. member for Aberdeen was in error in supposing that no reduction had been made in the staff of the colonies, fur that of Sierra Leone had been lessened 2,9ool.—that of the Cape, 4,0001--Ceylon, 2,4ooL—Trinidad,SCl4L —Mauritius, SOUL—Newfoundland, 1,2001. ---and several others to the amount of 1.8221. The Canada estimate was not reduced, It being found necessary to maintain a force to pro tect it against the consequences of domestic oppression. Colonel DAV lES was of opinion that the Cape of Good Hope had been always a source of too great an expense, since that colony came into the possession of England. /11JME could not admit, with the right hon. Secretary for the Colonies, that reductions had been made in the military esta blishments of the colonies; for though an item here and there might have been reduced, another was sure to be added, and the round sum in the estimates was the same. He wished to know how the right hon. gentleman could justify the enormous increase that had taken place in the salary of the commander-in-chief within the last forty years. In Lord Amherst's time, the salary was but 8001. per ann. to the Duke of York's it had increased, by degrees, so as to amount to its present charge of 15,0001. per annum. Sir H. lIA RDINGE denied that the reductions had fallen ex clusivtly or peculiarly on the medical department, and said that the pay of tha commander-in-chief of the forces was the same now as it was in 1792. The committee then divided, and the numbers were— For the amendment, 38 I Against it, 122 j Majority, 81. The resolution was then agreed to. The next resolution was then proposed—namely, that the saw of 106,8301. 15s. 3d. be granted for the allowances of the prin cipal officers in the several public departments of Great Britain and Ireland, and for the payment of their deputies, clerks, and contin. gent expenses for the year 1830. 31r. HUME pressed upon the right hon. gentleman opposite the necessity of reducing the expenses of the Paymaster-General's office. The business of that office might be transacted for 5,0001. if a proper system were adopted. He observed that the Judge Ad vocate's salary had been increased in 1817 on account of the large number of corps then kept up ; upon the same principle his salary should now be diminished, in proportion t o t h e reduction which had taken place in the number of corps. Ile thought that by adopting a better system the vote now proposed might be reduced 40,0001. but be would content himself with moving, as an amendment, that it be reduced to the extent of 10,0004 only. Mr. CALCRAFT said that the office which he bad the honour to hold was a most ancient one. Though a very laborious one, yet it was one of great trust and responsibility. He had various duties to perform which occupied a considerable portion of his time._ Amongst the rest, he presided at the board at Chelsea Hospital; and so constant was his attendance there, that since the prorogation of Parliament he had not had a single spare week to himself. The office at the present moment stood lower than at the time of Mr. Burke's great refomi; for then there two paymasters and two depu. ties. It was painful for any man to talk of himself ; but be was com pelled to say, that he discharged the duties of his office, he was sure, conscientiously, and he hoped, diligently. The house ought to be cautious in meddling with an arrangement which had secured such fidelity of service in the establishment of the pay office. Sir H. PARNELL said, that the right hon. gentleman had made out no case to rebut the charge advanced by the finance eons mittee—namely, that the office which he held was a sinecure office. The right lion. gentleman's deputy told the committee that he exe cuted all the duties of his principal's office. It was, in hie opinion, a serious objection to the establishment that the officers in it pos sessed too uncontrolled a command over the public money. The right honourable gentleman's reference to the period when there were two paymasters, was a common-place fallacy of justifying an existing abuse by the example of one still greater. lie was surprised to hear the honourable gen tleman say he would postpone the consideration of the question whether the business of his office could be better conducted than it was at present. lie thought that this was the time for considering that question. He hoped that ministers would not call upon the house to agree to the vote now before them next year. He was of opinion that the duties of the Treasurer of the Navy, the Treasurer of the Ordnance, and the Paymaster of the Forces, which were now paid at the rate of 55,000'. a year, might be effectually performed fer one.third of that sum. Mr. CALCRAF"r denied that the officers In this department had unlimited control of the public money. Mr. BIABERLY said, If he recollected rightly, the right hon. grstietran, when he sat on the other aide of tne house, disapproved the office which he now held. (a laugh.) iVith respect to the manner in which the business of the office was conducted, he begged to remind the committee that Mr. Sergeant in his evidence before the tinarce comnittee, said, that he had it in his power to go away with front 200,0001. to 250,000/. and the loss could not be dis covered in less than a week. Mr. CA LCRAFT denied that he had ever spoken In disapproba tion of the office which he now held. Mr. 31ABERLY said, he had spoken from recollection only. Mr. CA WEAK(' said that a ll t h e accounts connecte d with his office had been submitted to the inspection of Mr. Abbott and two other gentlemen appointed to inquire into the public establishments, who were perfectly satisfied with their correctness. These was no establishment in which so much justice was dune to the public in :re mode in which its business was transacted. Mr. MAIIERLY said the right hon. gentleman should assume no !malt for submitting the accounts of his department to the in. 'l'eetiun of Mr. Abbott, for he was obliged to do so. M. CALCHAFT denied his having claimed merit on that e-ound. sir H. IMRE/INC:it; stated, that in justice to his right hon. the Payrnauer of the Forces, that as Chairman of the Board, for the payment of the out-pensions, amounting to :.•_'31.0011 amounted to 32 in the year, exclusive of the meeting es: the board art Chelsea Hospital, which made the number of meet. gi his right hon. friend was obliged to attend amount to O, a; - 1 he had known his right lion. frieud fretiusntly come from the :wintry, where he had been foe two or three tLys, to attend throe ar•rw s . These duties, it should be recollected, were exclusive of ' us. :inch he had to discharge tor Paymaster of the forces. 1 1V SON wished to correct the random mansion of the O' ilk tuber opposite.(Mr. 31abetly) with respect to Illerfistsjeent's ottence before the finance committee. Mr.. Salaam's stamen v 44, that if two or three other officers connived with hint he might be able t o draw 200,000/. or 300,001.0. without befog dlicoverod for the space of 24 hours. But the very others whom connivance, according to that evidence it would be memory ro -command, acted as checks against the possibility of such an =moos, in a public estaWishment. Mr. MABE it VII' had made no random asairdon regarding Mt Sergeant's evidence. Ho had stated it according to dew hem of his rccolhation, and he still conceived be had stated it correctly, not. 'thhstitnding the assertion of the hon. gentieelmn....Thw.evidence Lail in fact, when given before the finence tionarnittoa s made setiboa impression, that the Chancellor of the Aixcheeptes upon bits 1, ) say that he should forthwith take some steps to make 4he.publit more secure in future. The CHANCELLOR of the E.XCHEQUER said Abet, on both sides ot the house they were speaking iTOISI their recollection's* to the evidence, and that diesels's allowances illonlvl.be mutually mule. He would agree with the' hon. member Opllpattas That wind b m'Pressiou mad e upon hi s (the. Chlincellat of Ine:lltheilstesi tint y the ev id ence of Serous before, the nomeninse,, twos the m public, money which co u ld b e d rawn as. slll......liargraut n eted , was not su ffi c i ently secured, and y,a Trraeurp . joint was passed, which put k tifiesually oar et . * • lrerelt et Poi it was dwidual to thaw money as ;Italgeentitadeteoesibed t 'for by # required that all draughts for minty sktittid fie signed by twit I Arent of the Treasury ; the Chanc e ll or o f the Eschequer had al. ways the most perfect confidence in the honour and integrity of Mr. Sergeant (hear, hear), but the facility which he stated to exist with respect to the drawing of money in the Treasury it was necessary to put an end to, for the general security. SirJ. BECKETT said, the hon. member for Aberdeen was in. correct in his statement as so the salary of the office which he (Sir J. Beckett) filled—that of Advocate.GeneraL So far from that salary having been increased, it was lower now than it was in 1822 it was then 5,4001. This year the salary was but 4,400/. It should be recollected, that his deputy in Ireland wan paid out of the sum given in the estimate. The offi:e of Judge Advocate was regu lated as it at present stood in 1806. The salary up to that period had depended upon certain fees and emoluments attached to the office; but Lords Grenville and Spencer, justly thinking that a judical o ffi cer should not be paid in end: a manner, made the sa lary a fixed one, and it was than settled (he meant the mere salary, exclusive of the other allowances) at 2,5001. at which amount It remained to the present day. That amount was chosen as equl relent to the salary of a pulse judge then ; but though the salaries of puisne judges bad been. since incret.sed, that of the Judge-Ad. vocate remained the same. Since that time, too, reductions had been made in the officers attached to the court, by which a saving accrued to the public of 1,000/. per annum. A saving of OK a year had been also effected by the reduction of the office of Judge-Advocate in Ireland, and saving 5001. a year by the aim. lition of a similar office in Noah Britain. By the reduction of an assistant deputy in this country another saving had been made of 0001. and in the colonies, by the reductions of offices similar se those attached to the court in this country, a saving of 1,0001. a year had been made. Thus a saving to about the extent 3,700/. had been made for the public. The duties of all those offices had devolved upon the Judge-Advocate in London, and not a sixpence had been added to his salary. Mr. HUME contended that his statement was correct. In 1728 Sir C. Morgan did all the duties of the office for 1,0311. a year. The salary was raised in 1807 to 2,500/. in consequence of the great number of cases that came before that court, owing to the great army we had on foot; but as that reason no longer existed, they should reduce the salary to its former amount. The right honour. able gentleman opposite (Mr. Calcraft) had said that he had never given a vote in opposition to the opinions which he now ex asiin support of the office of paymaster of the forces. Now the was, that when, in the year 1822, he (Mr. Hume) moved an address to his Majesty for the reduction of that and various other establishments, for the purpose of effecting a saving for the public to the amount of 4,000,0001, the right hon. gent lem an spoke and voted in favour of that motion. (Hear, hear.) He did not mean in stating that, to charge the right hon. gentleman with inconeist ency ; for when he supported his (Mr. Hume's) motion, he sat on that side of the house; but it was now his duty, sitting on the opposite side, to oppose the reduction of this office. Mr. CALCRAFT said if he had, upon the occasion alluded to by the hon. member, voted for the reduction of this office, it must have happened from its being lumped together in one sweeping motion with several others, so as to escape his atten tion ; but even when he sat on the other side of the house he had uniformly supported the maintenance of the present military esta blishments of the country, which he considered to be on as low a scale as the public service would admit. Mr. HUME said, before they proceeded to divide he wished to observe that the right hon. baronet below him (Sir H. Parnell) bad said that there were two establishments, one of which this was, costing 90,0001. and that 40,0001. might be saved from the estimate for them. Now he (Mr. Hume) did not go so far as that : he only asked for a saving of 15.0001. out of 106,5301. The committee then divided, when the numbers were— For the amendment Against it _ _ Majority against the amendment —7B The original resolution was then put and carried. The next resolution was 14,4201. for the charge of medicines and surgical materials for his majesty's land forces, and of certain hos pital contingencies for the year 1830. Mr. MABERLY took that opportunity to refer the committee to the evidence of Mr. Satjeont before the finance committee, which he had since procured, and in which the witness stated that he could draw 200,0001. or 230,000 out of the treasury without the chance of a discovery probably for a week, when the accounts would be laid before the inspector. That showed that he (Mr. Moberly) had made no random assertion on the subject. Mr. G. DA SON maintained that the check which the inspec tion of the accounts afforded in that case had been left out of sight ,in the former statement of the hon. member. Mr. HUME said, the finance committee had been of opinion that reductions ought to be effected In the medical departments of the army ; and if their recommendation had been attended to, re ductions might certainly have been effected in that portion of our military expenditure. He conceived it injurious that each branch of the public service should have its medicines contracted for in a separate way. He was convinced that by such a plan the House left the public open to great expence. Such was the opinion of the finance committee. Every branch of the public service should be supplied with medical stores in one uniform manner. He had no objection to the vote this year; but he thought that it was one which required the immediate attention of Government. The vote was then agreed to. On the resolution to grant 80,8121. Bs. Id. to defray the charge for volunteers in England and Ireland, for the year 1890. Mr. O'CONNELL rose to object to the vote, so far as related to Ireland. He thought that the army in Ireland, during what he might, perhaps, be permitted to call the late civil commotions of that country, had performed its duty, from the highest officer down to the lowest so. baltern, in the most exemplary and praiseworthy manner. He sug gested to the right hon. gent. opposite that it was necessary to recol. leer that a large portion of that army had been employed in the north of Ireland torpurposcs into which he would not enter. The conduct of the yeomanry in that part of the country he could not praise. It was supposed to have been kept up for purposes not of protection, but of oppression. lie submitted that it was a de. l scription of force which might be well spared. In the province ofl Connaught, where the population was almost entirely Catholic, the amount of yeomanry was but an unit. In the province of Munster it was only a decimal : in the province of Leinster it was a hun dted ; but in the province of Ulster, where the population was chiefly Presbyterian, it was a thousand . If the yeomanry were di. minished there, the army might be diminished too ; for the pre. I seam of the army was wanted for no other , object than to protect the people from their outrage. For these reasons be should more that this vote be reduced to 50,8121. Bs. ld. Sir G. HILL said, that if the yeomanry force could be spared, he should hive no objection to the proposed reduction. He could not, however, submit to the insinuation of the hon. and learned member for Clare, that disturbances had originated in Ireland from the con. duct of the yeomanry corps. As a proof that the yeomanry corps in the north of Ireland had merited well of their country, he would merely state that:the insurrection act had travelled through every county in Ireland, save the nine counties in the province of Ulster. air. S. RICE supported the amendment, on the ground of eco. nomy, and of the internal tranquillity of Ireland. He believed that the existence of the constabulary force, which was in itself a military force, was sufficient to justify a diminution of the yeomanry force. Lord F. L. GOWER mid, that it was only doing bare justice to the hon. and learned member for Clare to declare, that be had touched upon the subject of the Irish yeomanry with a moderation which must be highly serviceable to his view of the question. He wu of opinion that any inconsiderate meddling with that body at the present moment would produce an irritation of feeling in Ire. land, which it was desirable to avoid. He admitted that the time had at last arrived when this question ought to be looked at. He should be sorry if the boa member for Clare pressed his amend. meat, for he had no objection to take the object matter of it into immediate sonsideration. dlr. RICE said, that after such an admission from the organ of the Irish government, he should suggest to his hon. and learned friend the propriety of leaving the reduction in the hands of the minlstr Mr. BROWNLOW could not intend any thing disrespectful to the yeomanry, in whose tanks be had had the honour of serving, but be thought that the time had at length arrived when, in point of economy, it ouzht to be disbanded. Mr. O'CONNELL was most ready to withdraw his amendment and would prefer the reposition for the reduction of the y coming from the other eide of the house rashes than from 4 = Ile denied every intention to traduce the yeomanry of Ireland. • He' hoped that nothing which had fallen from him that night would have the slightest tendency to embitter the queen& between• the two parties in the north of Ireland. Jr. TRANT desired the government to be. nations •how they 'reduced a force in Ireland which had rendered.such inestimable per. vices to the country. lilt HUME submitted eb the eight bon. Secretary for the' Home Doper anent the propriety of Wain, the amount of the English yeomanry'. Let them either be disbanded, or continued at their own expense. Mr. PEEL mid, that in the speech which the bonosuable mem ber •for Aberdeen hag dehvesed on a former evening, •be -bad accused him of noting in commotion to the ale which Lord Lansdowne had laid down for the redaction of the. yeomanry corps. He appealed to his hanrable friend the member for Limerick. whether he had not strictly foliated up the rub whiehled been lett In theallite of his noble predenenta .. Whets is.Lutil •Lanstionie lift ,oilion,She.expense of the yeoman" fern amountedito 46,0001., and it was now redueed 10.peT ecnt. TIN* were only 22 corps , in the Matmfacitering (Haulm. lietheti *de la eulogize • the yeemanry.'worpe • in :Ordtantk• wid‘ itentionek I .as a putout! their: spay:than in 1814.whenanmenmer NereA ) Rohr Elks,. Elks,. hadmolua ssaal thebterudens, *" . l P. otemants, to any pan of Ireland. The right henp=enso. eluded with expressing his readiness to make inquiry into elsepsta prissy of reducing d e yeomanry of Ireland, as bad hem dose in England, but he was oot prepared to agree to an immediate reduction. Mr. R. GORDON observed that the yeomanry wen not the fittest corp. to put down local disturbances. He could not help recollecung—he wished he could not recollect—the occurrences at Manchester. , Mr. PEEL said there were yeomanry officers in the house, to whom he would appeal, in confirmation of his assertion that fuU confidence might be placed in those corps, who would never refuse to put down disturbances, to defend the laws, or to co-operwe in any legal object. (Hear.) It his Majesty were to issue his orders to-morrow, the hon. gentleman would find that not a single corps would desert their colours. Mr. LAMB concurred in this opinion. Still he thought that they were the worst corps to employ in quelling disturbances, as was proved at Manchester. The cheapest force was the regular Isom r but he considered there was quite force enough in the monary. Mr. GORDON said that much dissatisfaction prevailed in the ezatt , owing to the manner in which its distresses had been by Ministers. He might even say that there was a rev,- lutionary spirit. (no, no!) Mr. PEEL observed, that whatever opinion the hon. member might entertain of a revolutionary spirit being in the country, he pined as entire confidence in the yeomanry as in the regular force. The Marquis of CHANDOS, as an officer of yeomanry, bees testimony to their excellent spirit. Mr. HUME called the attention of the committee to the resolu don before it. He complained that of six members who had rotcd 'saw his general motion, but had pledged themselves to be pre sent and vote with him on the individual items, not one wait present. He moved as an amendment, that the vote be reduced to 17,8081. A division then took place. The numbers were-- For the amendment Against it Majority against the simeshiment 6O The original resolution was dna spool to. The Chairman was then ordeal to import progress, and the house resumed. GAME LAWS. The Marquis of CHANDOS moved for leave to bring in a bill to amend the laws for the preservation of game. It was his Mien. tion to repeal all the existing laws on this subject, and embody the whole in a single act. One of his objects was to legalise the sale of game under restrictions similar to those in Mr. Bankes's bill of last session. Mr. O'CONNELL said he should propose to put an end to the game laws altogether. Sir T. FREEMANTLE observed that the noble lord's bill was the first step towards the attainment of that desirable object. Leave was then given to bring in the bill. The Marquis of CHANDOS brought in the bill, which was read a first time, and ordered to be read a second time on Tuesday, the Bth of and to be printed. DRAMATIC WRITINGS. Mr. LAIB obtained leave to bring in a bill to alter and amend the provisions of the act 54 Geo. 111. c. 156, with tespeet to dra matic writings. The object of the bill was to take away from the managers of theatres the right of acting plays without the consent of the authors, and to prevent dramatic pieces which had been acted at one theatre from being performed in others, without the like consent. Adjourned at a quarter to one o'clock. MINORITIES. Minority of Twenty-seven on Mr. Humes motion to reduce the Army Estimates £500,000. Bentinck, Lord G. Guest, J. J. Marshall. Wm. Blake. Sir F. Gordon, R. Monet, J. B. Woodford, Marquis of Heron, Sir Robert O'Connell, D. Birch, J. Heathcote, Sir W. Warburton, Henry Browniow, C. Honywood, W. P. Wilbraham, G. Bright, H. liobbouse, J. C. Wood, John Buxton, T. Ingoldby,Sir.W. Wyvill, M. Davies, Colonel Lambert, J. Dickinson, .--- hiaberly, John Teller. Dawson, A. Marshall, John Hume, Joseph Minority of Twenty-three who voted against the Estimate of £42,000 for English Yeomanry. Blondford, Marg. of Moberly, John Warburton, H. Byron, Thomas hlarjoribanks, S. Whitbread, SamL Calvert, C. Marshall, W. Wood, Alderman Dawson, Alex. Macdonald. Sir J. Wood, J. Duncombe, T. Morpeth, Lord Wilson, Sir Robert Gordon, Robert hlonck, J. B. Ingoldby, Sir Wm. O'Connell, D. Jepbeoo, C. 0. Ptotheroe, E. Lamb, Hon. G. Rice, S. Teller. Hume, J. Members in the Minority of Thirty-eight, for the reduction of the Staff from £109,547 to £94,347, who were not in the first Di. vision. Althorn. Lord Jepbson, C. 0. Whitbread, Henry Bernal, R. Marjoribanks, S. Whitbread. 8. Cavendish, W. Blacauley, J. Whitmore, W. Buncombe, Thomas Morpeth, Lord Wood, Alderman Ebrington, Lord Members in the Minority of Forty-two, for the reduction of tbe Paymaster-General's and Public Departments from £406,5z0 to £91,530, who week not in the first or second Division. Burdett, Sir F. Howard, H. Rice, Spring Calvert, Chas. Martin, J. Smith, H.o. R. Colborne, R. Macdonald, Sir J. Sefton, Lord Euston, Lord Parnell, Sir H. Wilson, Sir R. MEETING AT THE MANSION-HOUSE. Yesterday a numerous and respectable meeting was held in the Egyptian.hall,Mansion-house,of the merchants,bankers,shipowners, manufacturers, and traders of the city of London, to take into con sideration the general distress, and to petition Parliament to institute an immediate inquiry into the causes thereof, and for the adoption of such measures as may best tend to an effectual and speedy removal of the same, The LORD Maros took the chair. His Lordship stated, that he called the meeting in consequence of a requisition presented to him : the object of the meeting was one of the greatest importance to the community at large, and ought to be discussed with great coolness and temper. tic would leave the'subject in their hands. He then lead the requisition. Mr. Lzoo said, that the present distress induced him to come forward to support the object of the meeting, in applying to Parlia ment upw the subject of the unparalleled distress, which could not be contradicted ; in fact, there was no branch of trade free from it, the manufacturer, the shipowner, the merchant, the agriculturist, all justly complained of the situation in which they were placed by the excessive system of government. He was enabled to speak more positively of the trade with which he was connected, and to state, without fear of contradiction, that the tradesmen in his business were reduced to the greatest distress, and that those who were in the habit of earning from 10e. to lb. a week were now driven to the necessity of breaking stones for 2s. ; that the privation and want endured by the working classes ultimately compelled and drove them to poaching and robbery ; that the pau. per houses in London and throughout the country were filled with • persons who formerly enjoyed the comforts of life, and *rho were now forced to feek an asylum for the want of em p t; this was attributable to the excessive taxation, the bad k eE: of the sudden alteration in the currency, and the injudicious laws relating to:free trade, which, instead of improving the commerce of the country, had almost annihilated it. He then read the following re- I.4hat this meeting feel themselves called upon to represent to both Houses of Parliament the great depression and consequent din tress that now exidin the mercantile, trading, manufacturing, and shipping conce r n! of this city and the metropolis, and which boar with such peculiar severity upon the industrious and labouring chums. 2. That the existing distress is not assignable to any tempepay cause, or limited to any particular part of the empire, but extends Mlle agricultural and all the productive classes of the community-- dad there has been for some time pest an unprecedented and rapidly lax Bing depreciation in all articles of manufacture and products •of 'beer, to • such an extent that thousands of beads lam. been imps. pat of employment, while. others have only been able to ski a precarious and insurkient subsistence. • • & Thai this meeting declare it as •their decided. opinion, that a !heel!' cause of all these evils is the enormous and overwhelming flame et taxation, rendered nearly double in effect and oppressive apwals.bt the &bastion of the .currency, which has withdrawn toga general circulation and productive employments large.amount of capital, and concentrated the same in the hands of comparatively few isdirkkialk. thereby - causing the taxes to approximate to the is of the people, and in defect of profitsto their capital, ng the whole system of commercial enterprise, and paralysing WM Mutes Malmo et tbe.souatry. •4. That ano.her prominent cause of the pinent distress, and by, w a ltleb these evils had been greatly aggravated, are those laws which me wise confidently mid would impute, thettradearid:manutactuses at ibccountud by establishing a. teciprocity of trade with other na. Lions, but whkb, as other nation's Yaire not stleiltedk shaft pa .balit °ponied most. injarieuslp, antl•augssentalr the •public diem*" by allowing /oreign labour to enter into .eotripetititin with &lash labour In the home market of this-country. Shattsitey semi k the more setameary to twatetritek gritwantwe Imels .... t a Parliantent, as his Majesty's oyr:rumens seem to be so tt4tll the nal suite and- - of the 'roomy u. and 7Ze " Tis — e; have admitted, in the speech from the throne, that dia. l'actuses MSS existed la some places," they have stated, from Actitious and fallacious custom-house valuations, an inaease of exports, as " indications of active commerce," while it is notorious that tl:c Re ntal value of exports has fallen off, to the amount of several minions a year, for several years put, and have often yielded no profit able return. 8. That they have seen with no less surprise the retail trade re presented as in a prosperous state, while melancholy proofs to the contrary are weekly presented by the long lists of bankrupts and in solvents, and still more numerous compositions with cieditors. 7. That in their opinion the diminished means of the people can not sustain the sante weight of taxes, bearing as they do upon all the necessaries of life—that the present state of the country demands every possible reduction of the national burdens, and the removal of the moat oppressive taxes—that the proposed reductions of the Chancellor of the Exchequer are quite inadequate to the allevistion of the present suffering, and cannot satisfy the expectations of the public ; and it is with deep coot rn they find, after 15 'Jean of pia found peace, enormous military and civil establishments art: still kept up, a profuse expenditure in places, pensions, and aph i s int meets still to be continued, many of them necessary o.ily f.yr pur poses of patronage and Parliamentary influence. 8. That the unparalleled oppression upon the agricultural interests affects all classes of the people, and to the distress of this the le.td ing interests of the country, a considerable portion of the enth.o - easement and losses of your petitioners may be attributed. 9. That petitions be presented to both Hosiscs of Parliament, praying, that they will take all these matters into their serious eon. sideration, and that they will immediately inquire into the cause of these evils, and adopt the most prompt and efficacious measures to remedy the same. Mr. YOUNG said, that the distress was general, and pervaded the whole community, and that it became essentially necessary to remove the impression created by a statement made in another place, where it was stated that the distress was an. fined to particular districts. Every man must come to the couclusion that the distress was general, and every description of trade bore him out in the statement. The subject unth the consideration of the meeting was one of great magnitude and was likely to give rise to different opinions; but for the sake of unanimity he would refrain from saying any thing calculated to weaken the effect of any measure that might be adopted by the meeting. They should unite and use all their influence to impress upon parliamens the necessity of immediately investigating the cause of:the evils under which the country suffered. It was not the reduction of 1,000,000/. or 1.200,0001. a year that would relieve the present dune's. He cordially agreed in the spirit of the resolu tions, and begged to second them. Mr. PERRIN° supported the resolutions. Mr. WADDING, a silk-manufacturer, maid that he had much in formation to lay before the meeting, and trusted that the noble Duke at the head of His Majesty's Government would not designate the present meeting a farce (cheers), as the subject upon which they met to discuss was one of great importance, and in which every mai. in England was deeply concerned. They met to deliberate upon the cause of the general and unparalleled distress that pervaded rvt ry branch of trade. (Cheers.) The overseen in avers( parishes were without funds. In the parish of Shoreditch the overseers drew upon the treasurer for 4201. who refused to pay it unless they became responsible to him for the amount, as he had already advanced 2,5001. to the pariah. The result was, that they were obliged to apply to the magistrates of worship-street district for warrants of distress to the amount of 1,2001. Was this distress or not % (Cheers.) In the parish of Bethnal-green, the poverty and wretched ness of the poor it was impossible to describe: it had been gradually increasing since 1825 to the present time. There were in that pa rish 1,370 paupers in the workhouse, and 5,040 persons who re ceived relief besides. In Nortonfalgate the poor rates had increased, from the same period, from 11,0001. to 19,0001. Various were the uses assigned foe this distress. After the war the late lord Castlereagh attributed the distress to the sudden transi tion from war to peace ; very soon after Lord Liverpool attri buted it to a superabundant harvest.—(Cheers.) He never read any thing like that declaration of the noble lord's. It amounted to this that the fruits of the earth were a curse (Hear, bear.) Then came Malthus, who attributed the distress and I poverty of tbs people to a superabundant population, praying with uplifted eyes to heaven, that *very thing should be unfruitful. (Cheers.) A member of the House of Commons brought a bill into Parliament last week, to prevent the manufacturer fron paying the labourer in goods. Was not, that alone a proof of the utstreued condition of the manufacturer ? The noble Duke, the other day, told the most august assembly in the empire, that machinery and I steam were the causes of our distress. (Oleos and laughter.) The list of bankrupts published weekly in the Gazette pre sented a frightful statement of the general distress, and attain!y ithe noble Duke could not fairly attribute the failure of so many traders, whose pursuits were totally unconnected with ma chinery and steam, to any such cause as he assigned. Within a very short period his Grace would find that there had been 13 auctioneers, 43 builders, 20 booksellers, :41 coal-merchants, 30 cord-weavers, 01 grocers, 34 innkeepers, 100 merchants, 33 tai. less, bankrupts. Did his Grace mean to say that all those per sons had been ruined by steam ? (Cheers,) and the tailors also ? (Cheers and laughter.) They had unfortunately arrived at that period when industry was not rewarded. He regretted to say that it was the case with him : he was in the habit of working from morning till night without meeting the reward he was entitled to, and In fact for the last two years be had been living upon his capital. Retrenchment was the only way in which the distress of the country could be alleviated (great cheering), 'commencing with the crown down to the bbiMetart. (Chats.) He regretted that the noble example set illarquis Camden had not been followed by other aristocrats, who extracted enormous sums from the people. His Majesty, in his speech at the opening of Parliament, said, " that h e continues to receive from all foreign powers the strongest assurances of their desire to maintain and cultivate the most friendly relations with this country." If that was true, why kees u i t ap such an immense stand by army ? (Cheers.) He believed ministers would not have made the recent paltry reductions, if they had thought they should have been enabled to collect it. Alderman WAITE Maw addressed the meeting at coosiderable length, and recommended unity and firmness, as essential to pro cure redress for the grievances they so justly complained of. Mr. Nicnotsott said, that be did not come there with a speech ready made. The worthy alderman who spoke last ought to have reserved his speech for another place, and have left the citizens to make their own complaints. [lt is quite impossible to describe the scene of uproar and confusion that took place, and continued, during the period this gentleman was speaking, and reading a petition which he moved aeon amendment to the resolutions, and which was seconded by some person in the crowd.) Mr. HUNT now presented himself to thee:owing amidst themes' uproarious acclamations. He said that he should inform his fellow. citizens that that was the first time that he had the honour of enter ing the lialL—(a laugh.) lie felt deeply the compliments which his fellow.citisens paid him, in thus calling upon him to express his few opinions on the important question before them. Ile hoped that if, in expressing his opinion on this subject, he might F y n to (hirer in his opinion with any body else—he hoped he sWii be heard with patience and temperance, and that he would be allowed to express his sentiments freely and as an Englishman, and not be put down as the gentleman was who preceded him. If he had atssaisd the Meeting without expressing a single opinion, he never. their/84dr that he had gained somethiog in hearing the may, shniabdorward, convincing, eloquent, English and Irish speech.— (lereetter)—which they had that day head frost the gentleman behind hum. In that gentleman they witnessed the true RAMP ims ENlishman, &Muer . sites gentleman happeosd to be bus in Ireland. He shoved be had a heart to symPathtie is the distresses of Englishmen I an& no man could have more powerfully drawn a picture of thou• distresses than he had done. With regard to the causes of the dialects, they had heard a good deal in the resolutions. Some attributed the distress to the excessive tax. slims—some to the change in the currency I whilst others attributed it to the free trade. Now, the resolutions proposed attributed the die. tress to the two great causes; namely, to free trade and excessive taxation. Culd any man for a nutrient doubt that excessive tax. Won was die-cause of the distress He would ask them what was the cause of that excessive taxation E Hear, hear, hear.) They • ought to go to the cause at once. What was the cause ? lie -•- • • the time when the very roof of the Hall in which he vat diets addressing them, was nearly rent by the shouts sad uproarious cheering of those persons who supported and ad. 'bested the Pitt system of the day, and cried out foe was—a war got up for no other purpose than that of preventing a Radial Reform in the House of Cosunoas—(Cheers.) That war was no doubt the great earn of their distress; but at the earns time there were other coneomitant causes, all bear. ing towards one point. The change in the currency, no doubt, operated as a cause, but that ntinous war eat the great cause of their present distress. If such, *lnn, was the cause, should the' citizens of London, the most req.ecnshie and intelligent portion of the community, retire from that Hall wiriout espressin ' what they thought was the great cause of the present unpomlkled distress or the county, and whit they considered the remiedy•to be? The worthy) (Waltham%) in addressing th ese, said that he had more public meceuip , than any man of his day. Now he (Mr. Hunt) thought that the worthy Aldennan meet have been altogether ignorant that he (Mn Heat) t e as In existence, or that he. was present st the outing when * made that eUtte• mast— (a laugh.) Fur may years he had made it bit be aine* to attend every public meeting ; and be had bees present at them 1 1U, with the empties of cos—he nicest the meeting of tors Cont. anon tills which, uthil lately. he he not the reellbrtune 'to irelehnitted. The' pr.ttentart who proposed' and seermild the L resolution considered, that upon the p c.teat.stecasios t or: ought Ito be' i general• tioan!mhy, in •order u. edics the porticoes, geou. Nor, he was a man who wo.tld never. shandom a prb Opts Iter a temporary unanimity. These resolutions, he considered, did