Star. — London, England, 1830-02-05 00:00:00

and lead to consequences which could not be foreseen. The Noble Earl had made an allusion to the case of a man drowning, as illustrative of the state of that part of the public labouring under the supposed effects of the currency measure, and afterwards had described his Majesty's Ministers as exclaiming to the drowning man, " get out as well as you can." If there were any resemblance to be traced in the condition of those - affected by the currency and that of the drown ing man, he would say that the greatest danger was, that, iike the drowning man, they might catch at straws. He confessed that he, amongst others, felt the pressure com plained of. He was not disposed to turn on those mem bers of administration the observations which they had at a previous period made use of; and provided they save the country now their best assistance and counsel, be was not inclined to envy them the possession of that power which they officially possessed to the benefit of society at large. The Duke of RiertmoN D said that he was sorry to in trade himself at the present moment on the attention of the house, but it might be in the recollection of some of the noble lords present who heard him on a former occa sion, that he had then stated that the wool trade in par ticular was , not, protected in the same ratio as other pro duce. He had then said, anti he now repeated it, that we had ruined the wool grower. The noble lord who had just sat down could not be expected to recollect what he (the noble duke) had said on that occasion with respect to this subject, because, in fact, he did not appear to recol lect what he himself had then said with respect to that im portant branch of our commerce. The wool grower at the present moment had the proceeds of three years produce on his hand, for which, under the existing state of things, he could find no market. But it was not the wool-grower alone, the farmer, the manufacturer, and the landholder, were all involved in the same destiny—all, in fact, on the verge of ruin. Let any man who pays any attention to the subject look round bim, and what is the result with regard to the working classes? Why, that almost the whole of that most industrious portion of the community depend, at the present moment, upon the miserable pit tance of a parish overseer : and were the noble lords under these circumstances, to tell the yeomen of England that there was no remedy. It was owing to these grounds that he, the noble duke, would support the amendment of the noble earl, and he trusted, in doing that, he would not be conceived guilty of assaulting the administration, a tone which had been made use of by two noble lords w ho spoke last. The Earl of CARNAILVON was sure that the senti ments expressed in the King's speech were not in unison with the generous and benevolent feelings which it was well knoWn the Sovereign of this country entertained towards the sufferings of his people. He was confident that the cold-blooded allusions to those distresses con- tained in the royal speech belonged solely to ministers. That speech, which he would consider as the production of government, instead of being a statement of the gene ral calamity, and of holding out hopes of a remedy, was merely a novel expression of ministerial incapacity. It pointed out no remedy, unless indeed telling people, oppressed with evils, that the bearing them with patience was their only remedy. No benefit of experience was de rived from current events : no remedy, which past cir cumstances could have furnished, was even once alluded to. On the contrary, a delusive prospect was held out by persisting in the—he would not bay profligate, bet certainly ruinous—system, every relaxation of which had been found productive of prosperity,—every return to which the invaluable parent of universal distress. The mention of the real cause of that distress was strenuously avoided, and the only remedy held out was, what ? The taking into serious consideration the state of the seasons. Now he on his way home from that house would probably be compelled to take the state of the seasons into consideration, but he could not see how that would throw light on the causes of the distress. He consi dered the state of the seasons a very inadequate and unsa tisfactory cause for the overwhelming distress which at present pervaded so large a portion of the population. To set aside such an argument altogether, he had only to recall to their lordships recollection the sea sons of 1816 and 1817, both of which were infi nitely worse than the late summer could be said to have been. Judging by analogy, according to the doctrine laid down in the king's speech, the succeeding year in 1818 ought to have been exhibited even greater domestic distress than the weather of the past year was said to have produced. Yet the period he alluded to was one of the greatest rising prosperity ; wealth, commerce, and agriculture, were rapidly on the increase,—it seemed like an oasis of the desert. But to what was this attributable, if not to the wise and beneficent measures of the ministers of the day, who had a heart to feel for the misfortunes of the poor, and a head to apply an effi cient remedy before it was too tate ? Government became alarmed for the effect of their own operations, and issued £7,000,000 of Exchequer bills, with a view to meet the exigency. Three millions of small notes were also circu lated by the Bank of England, which was accompanied by a corresponding issue from private banks in proportion. This single fact, in his opinion, ought to silence auy plea, resting on no better foundation than the wetness of the pre ceding season. He much lamented that so important a 'subject, ,on which the happiness, prosperity, health, and lives of millions were dependent, should have been treated 26 lightly by these whose duty demanded a very differ ent couiae of conduct. Th.e nobie.yucoe . ' nprhe bad just spekeni bad expressed his determination to vote for. no inquiry, as it would only prove illusory; and illusory he admmitted it certainly would be, if the House of Lords should confess the same incapacity of which his ma jesty's ministers already stood self-convicted. If the noble lords in office could propose no measure of assist ance at such a juncture, when the cries of a suffering nation assailed their ears, they were not the ministers who could save the country, At, the same time. he did not mean to insinuate that this wavto be referred to a want - of capacity, whatever other dekiencies the present government might be vharged with. On the subject of the currency laws he would speak his sentiments freely, notwithstanding the reluctance which was so visible on the part of others, both within doors and abroad. Many entertained opinions similar to his own, although defer ence to one leader or another prevente d from speak ing out. Some also hoped that the powerful band of go vernment would be extended to relieve the public (rota the intolerable evils so improperly termed temporary in the officio,/ document then under their consideration. It would be easy to prove that every measure in other times, and other countrief, which bad for its object the contrac tion of the circulation, produced uniformly public distress. Formerly; distress which so originated passed away in a few yearn; now, however, the kingdom was plaited ,thesrent chetinistances; as the peadivtioti of the instals had diminished, whileagrionitand and oponnetb4o mom* had multiplied. The chimiatista maw folds of a nature oonuneositrate wllftdr demsai. Manyetilis - aohlileidii whom he addriesebbillietilribeady oblipd to abate their incomes by 20 or 30 pet mat. bat. accord ing to the system punned by gammas, they might make a still further reduction of twenty or thirty per cent. more without producing any permanently beneficial effect, so long as the principal source of mischief remained =- touched. For his own part he was entirely at a loss to discover why so high a standard of currency had ever been adopted. The principle could never be maintained or justified to the satisfaction of any man of judgment, who was unbiassed by interest or prejudice. He had, indeed, beard of a book which was written by a statesman at a time when the subject of national currency was but little known or undeistood. In that work it was contended that opulent and important nations should have a gold standard, while little states ought to adhere to a silver ono. There was, in truth, but small analogy between this subject and cases which were sometimes unadvisedly compared with it. If a private individual were to go abroad with the intention of making purchases of no great value he would put only silver in his pocket; but if his design was to expend on a greater scale, he would supply him self with gold. But no similarity of calculation could ap ply to an extensive and powerful kingdom. When a panic occurred, it was always greater and more general in a larger country than in a smaller; the wealth in the former ought therefore to be represented by that metal as a standard which was easier procured than gold, and was also to be had in larger quantities. In no other country was gold exclusively a standard, nor did he believe that itirould at this moment be obtained in any quarter of the world to meetan immediate and general demand. Besides, gold was more open to combination than any other metal, which would be sufficiently demonstrated in a sudden exigence by the great dealers in money on the Stock Exchange. He would propose a silver standard, and have gold for circulation with a view only to conve nience. The resources of the country would then be emancipated from the artificial fetters in which they were bound, and it would be shown, to the confusion of poli tical economists, that they could be made the means of feeding as well as starving the population of the country. What was the condition of the English people now ? Why, 30,000,0001. of taxes bad been apparently taken off, an ostensible abatement of front 84,000,000/. to 56,000,000/. had been made, and yet the pressure was found to be about the same as before. Were they in the present times, after 15 years of peace, to be told that they must t h a t a property tax, pay all the war taxes,—in short, all had been levied at the heaviest period of national expenditure : now, too,while economy and retrenchment were adopted in every depart ment of the public service? The noble duke at the head of the government had made promises of still greater re ductions. Iu this respect, he was free to acknowledge that no minister had greater power or more honest inten tions. He was quite willing to give that illustrious in dividual abundant credit for his ability and integrity, but he might retrench and economise until he should even peril the existence of our institutions, and yet the dis tress of the manufacturing and agricultural population, he could assure him, would not be the more ameliorated by exertions of such a nature. One of the evils attendant upon the working of the present system was the course of conduct which it imposed upon bankers. They could not, consistently with their interest, afford the slightest accommodation to farmers, who might suffer by a wet and backward season. The crop, although abundant, would necessarily require a longer period before it could be brought to market. The farmer, on presenting him self to the banker, demands a check for £lOO, and pro mises to,pay the amount with interest, offering,* corn ricks for security. This proposal, however, is invariably refused, as the nature of the circulation prevents the banker from profitting by acceding to it. His issues are in 51. notes, and, on an average from seven to eight days after their issue, those 51. notes are returned on hint for small change, which he is obliged to pay in gold. The only argument advanced in favour of this circulation ap peared to be their supposed effect in preventing traders ' , to any great amount on fictitious capital from going to market ; and, consequently, so far it protected fair deal ing, and encouraged the interests of trade. This asser tion, nevertheless, was not true, in his opinion, to the extent alleged. He had seen returns made in 1825, which justified the inference, and led him to believe that its operation in this respect was very much over-rated. His lordship went on to recommend a silver standard, disa vowing having attended any county meeting where the, subjects had been discussed, and stated his conviction that the distresses complained of were not of a temporary character, nor arising from accidental causes. There was, however, another point of the king's speech, which he could not forbear adverting to in terms of approbation and satisfaction. He meant the assurance of a reform in the courts of law : (hear.) This was a matter worthy of being undertaken by his majesty's government, and he had no doubt the announcement would be hailed with one common feeling of gratified expectation by every member of the community. With respect to a remedy , for the distresses under which the country was suffering, he be lieved the noble duke opposite would be most glad to apply one, If he knew it; but though the noble duke might not be able to devise one, still it was necessary that a remedy ithould be applied, and that speedily. It was impossible that the poorer classes could be suffered to continue in the state in which they were now suffering. If that class had no confidence in the ministry, they had confidence in Parliament ; but even in that their con fidence would not long continue, unlesa they found that serious attempts were made to relieve the distress under which they laboured. Another topic M , which he was anxious to call the attention of their lordshiPit owes that in which be considered that the honour of thistotiltry had been compromised, rind its glory tarnishert.„. He al luded to the conduct we had adopted towards thole brave and loyal men who'had endeavoured to land at 'llnistim, to add their force to that which was already there, acting in the name of their lawful sovereign, the young Queen.of Portugal. The noble earl here proceeded at some length to contend that ministers, while professing a strict neutrality, as between the party of Don Miguel and the constitutional ists, or rather that of the lawful Queen of Portugal, had shown a decided partiality to the usurper, and had mate rially assisted him in his outrageous violation of the rights 'of the young Queen. If they had acted, be observed, on the principles of strict neutrality, it might have been fair ; but they had departed from it, and in every way showed a decided partiality for Don Miguel. They had, in fact, acted as constables for his protection: The noble lord, after observing that lie had been prevented from bringing this subject forward in the latter partof last ses sion, proceeded to contend that the conduct of government, in preventing the landing of the Portuguese, who went out unarme d to join the force of their lawful Queen at Terc - ,arcs a decided Violation of that neutrality en which minis. eirso Mss professed to act, and was en interposition unwarranted by the law of nations. We certainly were, not bound.to Assist in conveying them there, but he defied any mutt') prove that we were justified . in preventing an maim& forila from landing on that island. Even itgovertuttent knew that these men were efterwartle to ba alt ass and sent to attaik Portugal, still ho would. eonne- acting strictly as noutral,s, we weretesund J us ,_ He would ash the noble viscount (Melvifte) at 'the , of the Admiralty, if be had ever heard of each a naval or . that, military armament as an unarmed vessel containing slx hundred unarmed men ? He hoped their lordships would receive some satisfactory explanation on this subject— if it could be given. He had seen the letter of the noble duke to the noble earl at the head of the foreign depart ment on this subject. He could account for a commu nication of this kind between the noble duke and the earl, by a wish on the part of the former to let his noble friend, whom he had kindly relieved for a short time from the business of his department, see what he bad been doing for him in his absence. The noble duke seemed also to take upon himself the responsibility of another noble friend, who was at the head of the admiralty. He avowed the whole act as his own, and as if he alone were responsibb. " The whole act," said he, " is mine"— Me, me, odium qui fed : to me eenvertite fetrum." The noble duke seemed to take on him onthis occasion,tbs part of an actor of all work. There was one circumstance which had resulted from this interposition of ours, to pre vent the landing of the Portuguese at Terceira, which, though it did not relieve us from the disgrace attached to it, was in some degree calculated to lessen the regret at such conduct, for the absence of that force which we had prevented from landing, enhanced the glory of one of the most distinguished military achievements that had been heard of for many years. He alluded to the heroic defence of the island by the Count de Villa Flor against the expedition despatched to attack it by Miguel. After a warm eulogium on the brave conduct of the force under the command of Count de Villa Flor on that occasion, the noble earl proceeded to object to the conduct of mi nisters in departing from the neutrality they professed, by allowing the British troops to act as a sort of protection to the Miguelites at Lisbon. At that time the friends of the constitution were in sufficient strength to hare main tained it against all the force which the usurper could command. All that was asked of the British authorities then in Lisbon was, that the British armed force there should not interfere, but should remain strictly as neutrals quiet in their quarters ; but it was intimated that if the constitutionalists proceeded to forcible measures, the British force would be called out to act against them. It was that answer that was the means of destroying the spirit of the constitutional party, and which rendered so many thousand brave and loyal Portuguese now exiles from their native country. He believed that in the pa pers to which he had alluded, he could not find any cor roboration or contradiction of this statement, but he had no doubt that the facts were as he had stated them. There was no doubt that it was at the request of Don Miguel that our troops were allowed to remain in the country longer, and there could be as little doubt that but for the protection thus afforded him, that usurper would have been driven from the country in disgrace, and the authority of the lawful sovereign of the kingdom fully acknowledged. We might with perfect consistency have acted on that occasion in a manner which would have put the question at rest, and prevented the perfidi ous usurpation which had taken place, and the dread ful disasters which had followed from it to so many thousand brave and loyal Portuguese. He did not mean to attribute this conduct of ministers to any affec tion for Don Miguel, or to any love for the sort of govern ment which he had established ; but the fact was, they felt themselves involved by the state of the country at home, and they seemed disinclined to add to their dif ficulties by taking measures which they ought to have taken with respect to foreign relations. . They saw the state in which the resources of the country were placed, and they had not the manlinets to apply the proper re medy. But the distresses of the country were now so generally felt by all classes, that if the ministry did not find a remedy, the country would have a ministry by which some remedy would be devised. He was disposed to think that the remedy might be devised without much dif ficulty by a ministry who should set themselves in ear nest to work about it ; but unless that was speedily done, he could see nothing await us but a rapid diminution of that power and influence which we once possessed. With respect to the amendment, he would own that he did not expect much as the result of a . parliamentary inquiry.. The public looked to Government for relief, and they must have a government that would do its duty by the country fairly and manfully. Ministers, he believed, would say that they wore ready to administer a remedy, but they could not distinguish any that was practicable; but if they did not, be trusted others would be found who would try it. The noble lord concluded by declaring, that he could not give his assent to an address which pledged them to matters which he believed to be incon sistent with the truth. The Duke of WELLINGTON :-If I had any doubt as to the propriety of my determination not to submit to the proposition of the noble earl who proposed the amendment, that doubt would have been removed by the observations which have been made by the noble earl who has just spoken, particularly in the latter part of his speech. Instead of confining himself to the subject matter of his majesty's speech, and to the address proposed by my noble friend—instead of re ferring to these topics, and to these only, the noble earl has found it necessary or expedient to revert to transactions which took place two years ago. He has blamed the government for not having preserved a real neutrality between Don Alive! and his niece; and in en deavouring to show that there was some ground for his censne, he has reverted to these long past transactions, without giving the least notice that he intended to take the present opportunity of bringing• these matters under discussion. He expressed an earnest anxiety that the stillest should be attended fo, and •dismesed in , the , course of the lea session, when we- 'would have been prepared with the proper documental and the best information to elucidate the question which he has called up to-night, and the transactions to which he refers. He has not kept to the topics mentioned in his Majesty's weecb, and in the address in answer to it, which form the subject now under the consideration of yoUriordships, but has turned aside to the discussion of matters upon which there is no information, or, at least, only partial in formation, before the house, ad. has, argued on supposed facts which are not in despatches to. be found on your, lordships' table, or in any public office, that-I know of. There was no such communication made to us as the. noble earl alludes to. It is true that Don Miguel did desire that the British troops might remain in Por tugal ; but it is not true that the communication was made to us in the manner mentioned by the noble earl ) that lam aware of. The Noble Earl says that we did not preserve a real neutrality with 'respect to the patriots who. were assembled at Oporto, in order to make an effort in favour of their legitimate sovereign ; and that we opposed them, and would not, suffer the* . favourite Acme to join them. But the fact is, .that the treopnat Oporto were not opposed by us, nor assisted. They were in them selves /sufficiently numerous, andsuffidently.well equipped with all the awl necessary for, the operation, and wet* joined.by •the very. orlawif boa t thw noble sari witis6l l ae.of hasping haw damn.. Bret,, as come, of themselves.. : had expressealit, they with4mk bscauN. they 01 .* thdk the wispie, ; counvy was.. otaipat i 11,t Woe. fact /Which' had appeared 'in the correirpebienee. 'We have not the proper documents before tbe bones at pre- sent, to show precisely in what manner his majesty's government acted as to the question of neutrality. But I - say that we were rigidly and strictly neutral bet ween Don Miguel and his niece, and between the parties in the civil war of Portugal. We had certainly a commercial treaty with Don Miguel, and consequently in terests at stake, which it was incumbent on us to ma i n . tarn, and we were bound to neutrality. We could not, therefore, suffer the Portuguese troo ps , _ which w ere assembled at Plymouth, to attack Terceira, or Ma deira, or the Azores, or Portugal, or any part of the dominions which acknowledged the sway of Don Mi guel, nor permit the neutrality to be violated. Th e noble lord talks of the convoy that was given to the , Portuguese squadron, when they were turned aside from Terceira, and animadverted on the cruelty at tending that proceeding. Perhaps it is true that a man wee killed on that occasion, although I do not know that there is accurate or certain information as to the fact; but be that as it may, we were not pi blame for it. We were obliged to maintain our neutrality, and were completely justified in what we did by the law of na tions (hear, hear! from Lord Holland.) I say that we were compelled to act in order to preserve our neutrality, and that in what we did we were fully justified by the law of nations. Then the noble lord alludes to a correspondence, which he says I conducted instead of my noble friend (Earl of Aberdeen,) whose official and constitutional duty it was, as the earl said, to manage it. But the correspondence alluded to was in my hands, and most properly so, as long as the person with whom it was carried on bore no official character in this country. His official character was not acknowledged, but when a person did come to this country in an acknow ledged official character, then the correspondence was transferred to my noble friend, and conducted in the usual form. lam not prepared with the proper papers and documents relative to these subjects, and I speak merely from recollection. But the last topic of the noble earl's speech is the most important of all, although in that respect he has paid but little attention to the recom mendation in his majesty's speech. In that speech his majesty says, that " It is from a deep solici tude for the permanent interests of his people that his Majesty is impressed with the necessity of acting with extreme caution in reference to the important subject of proposing measures for the relief of any portion of his sub jects." But the noble earl does not attend to this recom mendation, nor does be take time to consider the question, but he comes forward at once with a measure of relief, and that measure is of no less consequence than an alteration in the currency. The noble earl calls on your lordships to act directly contrary to the advice of his Majesty, and at once to pledge yourselves without inquiry to an altera tion in the currency. The noble earl talks of the Speech from the Throne, as if it manifested a neglect of, and indifference to, the present distressed state of the coun try. There is no man that can more deeply feel or more sincerely lament those distresses than I do ; and it would be difficult for any man who should hold the situation which I at present fill, without being well aware of such distresses when they exist, and without deeply and sin cerely regretting them. The Noble Earl says, that his Majesty in his speech attributes these distresses to the seasons. But what does his Majesty really say? He says, " That he feels assured that the two Houses of Parliament will concur with him in assigning due weight to the effect of unfavourable seasons, and to the operation of other causes which are beyond the reach of legislative controul or remedy." Surely the noble earl does not mean to deny that due weight ought to be assigned to those causes ; and I cannot conceive how the noble earl can draw any inference from these words implying an indifference on the part of his Majesty or of his Ministers to the dis tresses of his subjects. I must now call your Lord ships' attention to another most important consi deration connected with the distress. There is another class of distress, quite distinct from that already refer red to, which really exists to a considerable degree among the manufacturers. But I should like to know whether this has not been caused by the employment of machinery and the application of steam to various branches of manufacture. Competition, too, has arisen abroad ; there is great desire in all people to become manufacturers, and there are new manufactures esta blished in all the countries of the world. Now, I beg leave to ask if the employment of machinery abroad, and the employment of steam to all manufacturing purposes, is not calculated to contribute to the distress of our manufacturers ? This is one of the causes re ferred to by his majesty in his speech, and your lordships' must consider whether this is or not one of the causes over which parliament could not possibly have any con troul. Can parliament, my lords, prevent the competition of foreigners ? Can this house interfere to prevent the application of machine' y and steam to manufacturers ? or can there be a doubt that the application of steam and the employment of machinery, with the co:u petition of foreigners, have made it necessary for the manufactirers to give the mon they employ as small wages as possible ? All these circumstances have coin bined to produce the distress complained of. The noble earl opposite says that the distress is general, and universal, and unexampled. lam afraid the distress is general, but at the same time there are some symptoms in the country which show, notwithstanding the distress, that the country is advancing in prosperity ! I say that this is proved by documents. If the exports of Great Britain have gone on in increasing for some years—it .y ; were- greater last year than soy former year—it the amount of our exports are pow greater than ever they were before—l say, not only that these are the strongest symptoms of the prosperity of the country increasing, but that the distress cannot be so great and unexampled as the noble earl would make it. There is not a rail-road, nor a common road, nor a canal in the country,. on which the traf f ic has not increased errerryear during the last few pews, and particularly in the lase year. It may be true that thereis a diminution of the manufacturers' profits—it may be true that the profits arcuot se great as they were—but if theta were as profit there would be no employment ; but the traffic n iwasune eo xa m in e. unexampled{ which were de ta c ould not poss from possibly i. tale p lt ia7 unless s true that the advantages are not so great as they were ten or twenty years ago, but still there were advantages; pod where such as extensive and increasing traffic exists, them °Minot be such extreme distress as the noble earl liwients. There is another oircumstanee well worthy ,ief your Lordships' attention. There is a large 4 .lr.es of retail dealers- in this country—are they in &- tress ? They fill every town, aria._ almost every village ase.able•to pay large rents for fins _new bowies . I ask , if this is a sign of distress ? Or is it a sign pf distresithet they are able.to build fine new houses in isireritpart.of every town? These are facts, my lords; and, Pay. what you please, theyprove, netwithetaoffing the die testcineense pastc.of-thecountry, that op the whole the Mali! and that dine steams Pan.Plis.not laWO4- distress. New,va lords, I to sari few words'dn the rowdies by the noble earl, who moms to have completely misunderstood the se-