Star. — London, England, 1827-05-26 00:00:00

recollected the m years during which that' Noble ant ed part :in the deliherst -I'o._ll at cesala—when e reeolllkted that he had' ivegpritt endowed with a clearness almost peculiar to himself to explain and simplify the most difficult and "Complicated subject; and, finally, whenfie recollected that no man within these walls claimed and ensqied by his personal character as well al by his strength of mind, a larger share of the confidence of their Lord ships.-.it was impossible that be shoeld not feel the weight which this measure must o have derived from his advocacy—and the immeasurable distant* at which he ins placed from him. This was the main reason which . bad Compelled him to seek their Lordships' indulgence. There was, however, one point Which afforded him some encouragement, it was the deep aid sincere colt viction which he felt in common with what he knew to have been the sentiments of that Noble Friend, that the present measure was calculated to produce great ad vantages to all classes, and to none more than that to which their Lordships belonged, and which looked to, them for the protection of its interests. Whatever might be the impression or doubts in the minds of Noble Lords as to the policy of the measure, he felt a _sand seine expectatioa that those prejudices would be over come, and that the measure would be suffered to pass. He was the mote confident when he knew that his con victims was supported by those Noble Lords who had , lately joined his Majesty's Government, ansthad given their services to their King and their country, without compromising their consistency, muck Ise the,dignity of their character.—(Hear, hear.)—One AU all we were interested in the success of the present measure; yet be knew that much blame was attached to his Majesty's Government, for having agitated the question at all. And indeed many considerations bad arisen to prevent his Majesty's Government from agitating it; but let their Lordships recollect what circumstances had arisen since 1815, and they would see whether it had been wantonly brought forward, or whether it had dot rather been propeiled by a course of circumstances over which his Majesty's Ministers had no controul, and which ori ginated from that very class of persons who were now the most vehement opponents of the measure. After' tie Act of 1815 the ports remained closed till the 15th of November, 1816. They were then opened, after one of the worst' harvests ever known in this country, or in the rest of Europe. They remained open from the 15th of November, 1816, till the 15th of iFebruary, 1818. The harvest of 1817 had also been very indif ferent, and during the whole period, although the ports were open, the price continued at to enormous height till the 16th of February, 1818, when the aver age being below 80t., they were closed for three months. The price then rose again from the cessation of the inapor tationiand the ports were re-opened till the lsthFebruary 1819. The harvest of 1818 had been abundant every where, and yet in spite of its productiveness, the ports were kept open by a small fraction of twopence. The quantity of corn imported Was very considerable, and a large and most inconvenient proportion of it took place between the 15th of November, 1818, and the 15th of February, 1819. What was the effect of these' circumstances on those who were most interested in the results ? It created the utmost dismay, and filled them with hostility against the very principle of that Bill of 1815, which they now looked upon as the palladium of their safety. The most strenuous efforts were made to unite into one focus all the discontented agriculturists, and, through the medium of what he might call an agricultural Parliament, they bad came to an unquali fied resolution of condtnenstion against the principle of the Bill of 1815, not only as not calculated to promote the ends for which it had been passed. but as ptoduc tive of the direct reverse; and they had laid doarn the principle of a permanent admission of Foreign Corn, subject to a duty. Thus did the amicultutists at that period clearly speak their sentiments against the mea sure of 1845, and thus did they take the first step to wards the alteration now proposed, so that they could not justly complain. In 1819 so strong was the gene ral feeling that his Majesty's Government must take the subject into their hands, that questions had been put to ascertain whether it was their intention to do so? At that period, however, no Ministerial interference took place. But the agricultural Parliament was not inac tive. In 1819. 1820. and 1821, it procured a mass of more than 1,200 Petitions, all complaining in the most unequivocal manner of the principle, and condemning the Act of 1815. Was not this a strong indication of the agricultural mind on that subject? This was fore the restoration of a metallic currency, and at teat period his Majesty's Government thought it inexpedient to comply with the object of the Petitions. But in 1820 all that anxiety about the law of 1815 continued in its full force, and a motion was made in the other House for a Committee of Inquiry, on the grounds laid down in the petitions. It had been his lot at the time to oppose the motion, but the Government had been unsuccessful, and the Committee had been carried. It was limited, it was true, to the question of averages, but it was clear that further resistance was impos sible, and in 1821, when the proposition had been renewed, his Majesty's Government felt it impracti- cable to refuse, and the Committee was granted. And right it was to grant it, for in the state of mind of the parties concerned they would not have done their duty if they had resisted investigation. It was the result of this inquiry which had led to the adoption of the prin ciple of the present Bill. The Report of the Committee condemned directly that of the Act of 1815, and a clause was introduced in that Report, which though it was not thought expedient to carry it into effect at the time, aimed to a future alteration in principle. In 1822 the Committee had been revived. •It had not dissented from the opinions expressed by its predecessor, though it only introduced as a practical measure a certain mo dification of the law of 1815. It did not say, however. that either that modification, or that law itself, wereto be considered as the permanent and established prin. ciple of the Corn Laws. It confirmed. on the contrary, the principle laid down, and suggested a - change merely as a step to a greater alteration. The country was still under the laws of 1822; or rather under the Act of 1815, for until the priced wheat attained eighty shillings per quarter, the former was not to enter into operation.— And how could it now possibly come into operation unless the intolerable pressure of a price of 80s. should be ir,flicted for sir weeks upon the count!, ? No man could think of such an infliction without dismay. When he bad moved the third reading of the Bill of 1822, a Member of the Agricultural Body, and one of those who possessed most esperience had risen to give his parting malediction to the law. He might therefore appeal to • bit authority in support of the change now proposed. • Neither was is the Agricultural Body alone who had petitioned as the time, other interests had sent up nume rous Petitions, and on a question affecting the subsistence of the people, could the Government have turned a deaf !ear ? ro taking the subject into consideration, they had' done-therefore nothing but what wis their duty. instead bf unnecessarily and 'wantonly tampering with the ques tion. Many circurnstanses had taken place, which greatly changed the situation of things from what it was in 1815. There was amongst others, the altera tion in the currency. In 1815 the Bank Restriction Act was in force, and in 1819 the utmost pressure was felt by its repeal, and the return to a metallic currency. But was that pressure to be compared with the mischief which would have resulted from the continuance( f a sys tem,whicls would never have been establi,hed,had it been apdt 'ibis to anticipate all its consequences ? He hoped and trusted, that it would be the last time that this country would purchase temporary ease at Abe sacrifice of so much principle, and so much public benefit— (Cheers). Great stress was laid on the amount of taus tion. But what was that amount at present, compared with what it was in I 815? At the latter period the whole charge for the Unfunded Debt and Sinking Fund was 47 millions, whilst now it was no. more than St m 'lions, making_ a redaction of thirteen millions in twelve .years. There had been besides between twenty and thirty millions of taxes reduced since the was, and that reduction had operated, and was intended to ope. rate, to the benefit of the cultivators of the soil, in order to enable them to bring their commodities ata Junket with leu risk. Their Lordships ought nor to lose sight of the great change which had taken place: and no man could say that the question of taxation had nothing to do with the subject, or if he said so, he ran counter to what was stated in every Petition noW lyiog on their Lordships table. The question was not between pro tection and no protection ; it regarded only the mode and extent of protection to be granted. The present measure was not the fruit of abstract, dry and un tried theories. It was quite the reverse. It was the law of 1815, which was the gteatest innovation till then effected, for it had introduced the principle of prohibi tion, which had never been fully admitted before. The present Bill was a recurrence to that ancient system under which agriculture had flourished for more than a century, and by which it had been raised to a pitch which transcended the whole world together. It was not fair, therefore, to say that it was the work of some cold blooded theorist. If that was the principle on which he (Viscount G.) proceeded, he should be guilty of an act of suicidal folly; for he would be destroying him self with their Lordships and all his connections. What who'd they all h... without agriculture No ; if the measure now proposed was the mere speculation of a cold-blooded philusop'.er, he should not be found amongst those who advocated the change. He was sa tisfied, therefore, that instead of being deserving of re proach,his Majesty%Gove nment were enti led to praise, for having brought the question under the consideration of Parliament. His Lords' ip wished to shew, that the law which it was proposed to alter involved conse quences prejudicial to all the agricultural classes. Iti exposed them to an endless succession of alternate pro hibitions and unlimited importations, and thus made it impossible for the merchant in foreign corn, and the grower of home grain, in know exactly in what situa tion they were likely to be. The very fact of placing the importation price high gave a corresponding stimu lus to all those who wished to avail themselves of the time when the ports should be open, as the law now stood, for three months,so that foreign corn might then pour in lake a torrent without any limitation whatever. All the Pe titions presented in 1819 ascribed the distresses of the Agriculturists to the quantity of foreign corn which had rushed in_from the 15th of N4v. 1818, to the 15th F.b. 1819. Their Lordships had therefore a practical proolof the evils of that system, to guard against which the pro. sent alterations were proposed. It might be said that these objections had been met by the Act of 1822. He con tended that it was no such thing. For in fact whet was that law, supposing it to have come into operation, and the ports to be closed till Corn reached the average price of 705.? They would then open, and Foreign Corn would come in at a duty of 17s. for the-first three months. The object of this was to check immediate importation. But how would it have that effect? The price of Corn abroad might • be fairly calculated at thirty shillings per quarter; ten shillings mote must be set down for the expenses of bringing it over, which, with the duty, would make .57.. per quarter, and this at a time when English corn sold at 70s Would this afford any protection to the home grower? A duty of thirty or forty shillings might indeed check imports (but that would be against the principle of the law), whilst one of seventeen shillings was totally inopera tive. The Corn Law of 1822 had therefore introduced no other improvement than that of lowering the impor tation price from eighty to seventy shillings. Another course might have been to impose at all times a high permanent dutywithout any average or calculation what ever. But if a high duty could be borne %hen the price of corn was low, it would become intolerable when it should be high. A different mode was to give the Kong's I Government the power of altering the duty according to circumstance;; but this would be putting in the hands of a Government a power to dabble in every article creating great interest in the country, which might beabused. Should such a Bill be carried, it would be impossible for the Government to act under it, and it must be re pealed almost as soon as passed. If a fixed duty was not adopted, there was nothing to look to but a gra duated scale of duties, and that was the principle of the Bill before the House. By the law of 1815, some of the duties fell according to the price of corn from 245. to balf-a-crown. This was too sudden a transition. It offered so many advantages to fraud that it was scarcely possible to resist the temptation, unless a gra duated scale were adopted, by which a certain quality of price would be produced. He wished to avoid mis chief as much as possible, and he always shought that Corn Laws only involved a choice of positive evils : for what man could say that it was not an evil to interfere with the subsistence of the people ? But feeling it ne cessary to take away from the grower the full benefit of a high price in a time of scarcity, it was equally ne cessary that be should be protected against-tire opera tion of a Very low price. It was not requisite for h i m to examine all the items of the B II : its principle was clear, and would speak for itself. He should only touch a few points, and amongst others, the extrava gant apprehensions which were entertained of the pot t of ()Jess i—apprehensions which appeared the more extravagant the deeper they were looked into. Much bad been written, and pamphlets bid been published, to discuss that question, and the late Committee bad shown, by the nature of its examinations, the jealousy and fear with which it viewed Odessa. But for all these feelings there was not the slightest foundation. What ever mig h t happen with rennet to Dantzic and the North of Germany, any apprehension on the side of Odessa was wholly visionary. lie was surprised indeed that any alarm should be entertained by any one wbo. recollected the circumstances of distance; the naturea the navigation, and the climate connected •ith OJessa. It appeared in fact by the evidence before the Commie tee, that to obtain a cargo from that place it was neces sary to send a ship from this country, and that the voyage there and back would take eight months. Now would any man in his senses, with a market daily vary ing, enter into such a speculation? Why, he could not be paid unless he got a scarcity price. Besides there existed a regular demand in the Mediterranean on OJessa for all the - fit for sale, and the consequences _corn_ of the English trader meeting the Italiao on that market would be, that the low price would immediately disap pear. Equally exaggerated were the fears entertained by individuals of an overpowering importation from the British Colonies in North America. A few years since a Bill had been introduced to give additional faci lities to the trade in coin with those colonies. This Bill, be conceived, was founded on a good principle, for why not encourage our own fellow subjects-•-tho>e who spoke our language, who were imbued with the SAM principles, and had proved their loyal attachment at the hour of danger by arraying themselves and bleed ing in defence of their King and coutrry ? Why not treat them as we did Ireland,or at least like brothers? He did not say that the objections then started arose from prrjuaice or hostility to our colonial fellow sub jects. They arose chiefly from the fear that the American corn might be poured into the home market through Canada. What was the effect of the measure ? In the course of the first year 90,000 quarters of corn had been imported from Canada, and its thelast year only 26,000. The danger from that loaner was therefore also imaginary. He trusted that their Lordships would not reject the-Bill because they might fancy they saw in it consequences as le likely to be teal zed as those iespecting Odessa and Canada. Some doubts were entertained as to the period at which the duty should be paid ; but in this he thought that no other principle could be followed than that practised in this country— that every articl • of foreign growth or manulacture be freely warehoused. This was at once a wise and a valuable principle ; for it had always been an impor tant object to tender this country what it was now he come—the Emporium of the Commerce of the World! To depart from that principle would be to deprise the State of one of the most valuable supports of its inter._ nal strength and external power, and to strike a molt fatal blow at the root of its prosperity. If corn were not warehoused here, would it not be warehoused on the opposite coast, by Holland, the Netherlands; Mat France? and would not As importation be as rapid-as if it lay in bond on oar side? To abol•sh the war, housing of corn in this country would be to lase an portant adva' take, and not to give any benefit what ever to .those whom it was wished to protect. If it should be intended to exclude the warehousing of corn altogether, that Would be to go against the principle of the Bill, which had been voted at its second reading . and to endeavour to do that by a side wind whi ch it would be fairer and mote honourable to attempt openly. He• now had only to press upon their Lord ships the propriety of a candid, fair. and temperate discussion. It was tine, that their Lordships might naturally consider them elves in a certain degree as the . Representatives of the Agricultural class, and that war no reproach to them. It was consistent with the Con. :titration that the Aristocracy of the country should be connected with the land. But lie would not do thexa the injuaice to suppose that whilst they gave support,' protection, and he would admit, favour, to the agrictth to ists,the'y would be insensible to the claims and interest; .ei other classes. It would be a libel on their Lordships edit avoid be a libel on English Gentlemen to say that they were actuated by selfish motives. He should dis charge his duty with-the full conviction that the course which he proposed was the one best calculated to pro mote the interests of all classes of the community. He never would have advocated it if he had looked at it in a different point of view. Other interests were low watching attentively the course which their Lordships would pursue, and they had just claims to the consi derate attention of the House. Their Lordships were aware of the degree of distress and calamity which bad passed over so many classes of the community. Never had it been more heavy, and never had it produced fewer complaints. This was a subject on which the pissions of men might be excited, but he could say of those for whose interests he claimed their Lordships at tention, they deserved it by the fortitude and resignation with which they had borne the privations to which they had been exposed—privations which he did not, and which it would be wrong to ascribe to the existing Corn Laws. To those laws no portion of the distress could be fairly attributed ; but he was convinced that the success of the present measure would promote the real and permanent interests of all classes of the com munity.—(The Noble Lord resumed his seat amidst enthusiastic cheering.) • The Earl of MALMESBURY said in rising, that though his Noble Friend had not been long a Member of that House, he probably knew his (the Earl of Malmeshtiry's) sentiments on the subject before them, by the discussions of the last two years. On no occa sion had he displayed anything like party spirit— (Hear, hear). He agreed with the Noble Viscount that it was not to be considered as a party, but as a great i national question—(Cheers). He should discuss it as such. With respect to the coalition before him, he should express no opinion as to its nature. The bicker ings and heart-buraings of the present day would have passed away and the individuals themselves would have mouldered in their graves, when the effects of the pre sent Bill would be still felt, if it passed; for such he kwas convinced, would be the result of a depa r tu r e f ro m the principle of the Corn Laws. He regretted that the absence of his Noble Friend (the Earl of Lauderdale) should have prevented the Resolutions which had been prepared from being proposed ;" but as they were not before the House, he should oppose the Bill on its prin ciple. He considered that the measure was really dated from 1825, when the President of the Board of Trade _made his celebrated speech in favour of free trade, and intimated that it might be extended to Corn as to any other article. He (the Earl of NI ilmesbury) was not a stickler for any particular system : be would have consented to alter and amend the existing °Ai to almost any extent. Nothing, in fact, had been done in 1822 by letting that clause remain, which prevented the . Act from coming into operation. Why had it not been repealed? His Noble Friend had omitted to state what had happened since 1822. The Noble Earl then sheaved that for several years the average price of Corn had Rented between 565., 665., and 515.-9 d., and had never given a fair price of 60s. He did not lay the fault of .these low prices on the system itself, but on those who had tampered-with They were partly the fruit of, Mr. Peel's Bill, which had done much mischief. till it liras repaired by another Act. The Canada Corn Dill, .lso had done harm. It was true that in the sem*/ year the importation from that quarter had decreased from 90,000 to 26,C00 quarters, but that was no rot e to,. the futsfre. The importation of corn from Ir e l and, which in 1887 was only 45,000 qparters, had in lug increased to 569,000, more than ten times its original amount ; and that from Canada might do the same, the country was productive, and cultivation would i n . crease. It was true that its population was not . equ.l to that of Ireland, and that was one reason why hearoida not encourage Canada versus Ireland. Should our pre. sent difficulties with the United States be removed, Ca., nada, who now exported to the West Indies, might then be cut off from that branch and send us Ingle supplies borne. The Noble Earl then described the prod raises given by the Earl of Liverpool in 1826,that or thing should be done calculated to affect the agricalttnistse and complained that at ter the* assurances,he had notomy admitted all the bonded corn, but had allowed 500,0* quarters to enter, for the relief of the manufacture% whom he had said that he would leave to the charityof the public, to whom he had not appealed vain ; fur those who had most held out to them the hand cfcharity, were those very landowners who were so unjustly as. sailed. The next measure was the only proper one, h e meant the issuing of an Order in Council for admitting oats and grain as wanted ; for he thought a perfect sys tem might be established if it Were possible to admit foreign produce by instalments, cr in limited qu4ntitiek Suppose, for instance, the average to be taken monthly. if in September the price was 665. let the law allow au importation of Corn not exceeding 300,000 q.larters.-- If on the lit of October the average gill was 66i. let 300,000 more quarters berintroduced, and so on. lit five months as much Wheat Might thus be ad sited as would secure the country against a scarcity aol th e market against a glut. He complained that the present Bill was a complete Money-Bill, thus bearing on its boot the motto—Noli me tangere, the purport of which in that House was well understood. Ile also objected to the as a commercial Bill, because it contained a reciprocity clause, and when corn was wanted it must be had, and there could be no reciprocity. He should not object to a remunerating price of 60s. but he did not th nk it.e pro- posed scale likely to produce it, taking its departure as it did from the vet/ point which it was wished to secure. He then :hewed by several returns and calculationsout of Mr. Kelly's work, that even the highest priced bleep cora, with all the expenses of bringing it over, and the duties, could sell in the English market for 535.61. which would ever prevent the native growers from ob. raining a price of 60s. He objected to the scale cf re. duction, by which the duty was to decrease tam shillings when the price rose only one. Ile wished that the re. duction should be only of one shilling up as high at seven shillings, after which it might diminish in the ratio of three shillings, till it expired altogether. He contended that Odessa might inguence our market by throwing upon it the whole produce of the Baltic coos. tries, which used to be Conveyed to those parts now supplied by Odessa. He objected to the warehousing system as applied to the Home Market, and only approved of it for re-exportation. He stated that the average price of British grain in the last fire years of the war, was 995. per quarter. During tilt six first years of peace it went down to 765. and during the six last to 565. sheaving a depreciation of landed property in seventeen years of full forty fors per cent. He therefore had a right to call upon their Lordships to save that kind of property from complete destruction. He then Mewed that agriculturists had the Parochial Clergy to support, and recommended that Scotland should be included within the averages. He then concluded by moving as an amendment, Thai the House resolve itself into a Commitee that day i three months." The Earl of ROSEBERRY thought that there vete errors on both sides of the opposers and advocates of the present system, but was disposed to support the Bill now before their Lordships. The first point to which he should call their arention, was the assump tion, that it was a great hardship to force the poorer orders to eat dear bread, and that their condition would be improved, in the same proportion as the prices of corn was reduced. If the price of food was per manently reduced, assuming that the, supply and de mand of labour continued the same, wages would be lowered in proportion. Thus the manufacturer would not gain, while the agriculturist must have his coodi. tion decidedly deteriorated by the vast importation of foreign . grain. The second principle adopted by per eons who advocated the new system—. 2 principle which he considered erroneous, because pushed into an ex treme—was, the farmers and landlords were as deeply interested in having the prices of corn low, as the rest of the community. The entire proposition, he thought, was unsound ; he did not believe it was true, that the vendor of grain was interested in the cheapness of the commodity; at the same time he admitted, that farm ers were more interested in obtaining an advance ea the price of corn than landlords. He should not trouble their Lordships with one other doctrine on the same side of the question, which he considered equally erroneous, it was the proposition, to.plsce a large portion of the population in a state entirely dependent on the foreigner for a supply of corn, that would be to produce that commodity at a cheaper rate than if the entire population were obliged to depend upon the supply afforded by this country. This would be placing a large body of the people at the mercy of the foreign grower, and would, no doubt. be disadvantageous to the supply which could be brought into the markets. He had troubled their Lord ships with some doctrines adopted by one side, which he considered exaggerated, and of which he disapproved. He would not detain them long with remarks upon some opposite opinions, equally erroneous in their nature. It could easily be proved that the existing law was oily to be maintained by constant relaxations and changes. By the law of 1815 and 182'2, 3,318,000 quarters of foreign wheat had been admitted into this country. This fact proved that the exclusive system could not have been maintained. Having taken some of the es• treme points upon both sides, and endeavoui el to refute them, he was at liberty to say that he thought 'LA the Bill which was now before their Lordships had this advantage, that it stood between both extremes, and was calculated to benefit all classes of the community — one branch of w hich could not suffer without onotner being sure to suffer in its turn. One advantage had been derived already horn the very introduction of the Bat Which had conciliated the animosities previously existing between two interests, that aught not to be separaied-- the agricultural and commercial classes. He was sorry to be obliged to say that these classes had been set in array against each other, but he confidently hoped the present measure wool) have the effect of reconciling them. Alter taking a view of the various bearings 0 1 the question, he distinctly *rosiest his opinion, that if . •