Star. — London, England, 1806-05-15 00:00:00

PARLIAMBX t;IRr PRCCEEDINGS. HOUSE OF COMMONS. tVISONESDAY, MAY 14. • The Houle refolved itfrif into a Committee en the Malloy Bill, am: on the dare of the SECRETARY at WAR, the Report was then brought up, and the Bill ordered to be read a third time to morrow. Lord HOWICIC brassie ap the Report of the Committee on 4 00100. the Grant to the PM* of Mika. and leave Ma given to bring hs a Bill perfume t. Mr. ALEXANDER fp the Report on the iris Loan Bitt, sod on the Irib • : Jai 1111, which were Ordered to be read a third time tiosnormar, Mr. VANSITTART barbs mooed, that the Houfe refotvc k- W( loth a Committee of Supply. I Sk j. ANDERSON moved, that the Report of the Committee, to whom the Petition frosn'the Govenion of Bethietn Hofpital was referred. be laid before the Committee. The Governors of the Hapital had proved to the Committee, that aoe-balf of the build ing was in ruins, and that third gokild Wit contain more than too patients. k woe, ~,,m re pried to ereft a new Hdpital, capable of astable, etro soo of whom it &mild be hi tee power of Ommenmene th *win the HofpitaL Mr. VA NSITTAIT cooArosid OW Ilatement of Sir J. An• •' derka. The Houk then refolred Weir into a Committee of Supply, and It was rekked, that the turn of mood free of all charges, be mail to the Governors Gide Hofpital, for the purpoke of their ;argots,--R epast to be reol4/Cd to-marrow. On the nuelon of Sir J. NEWPORT, the hilli Stamp Ditto Bifl, the kids Diftlllery Regulation Bill, and the frith Sugar and Teo Duty Bill, were read a Cult time, and ordered to be read a &Teed • time on Friday. Mr. PARNELL tooted for an Account of Bank Notes In de I caboon in Eoetand and treland.r—Ortitred. - 1 The Additional Farce AA Repeal Bill was read aOM he. petted, sod ordered to the Lords. -. ' LORD ST. rummer. 1 Mr. JEFFERY role, plufuant to notice, to call the attention of the Honfe to the papers nciw oh the Table, relative to the Naval Adrninifiration of Lord St. Vincent, whom he Rood pledged to the Houle to prove guilty of culpable !Weed and grofs mircon- due, during the dine he was at the head of the Ad- I • miralty. .He flattered htmfelf that the Hoefc would believe him, when he laid, that he undertook till's difficult ta lk, without any previous confutration With{ any body, but certainly not without having the firongefkgrounds for doing ro. Whether he should have thought it neceffary to bring the queflion this length, was at one time doubtful. But he was fo alto-1 nillsed, and even offended, at the extraVagent cubs giums, and ill-placed praifes of his zealous but mit*• taken friend., that when he felt that the Inttreßs of the country were at Bake, and the exiltence of the nation threatened, he refolved to undertake this talk ) although be was then not aware of its magnitude.— He had no reafon to repent of that determination, and only regretted time this great fubjeft had not fallen into more competent hands. As he advanced In his inquiry into the documents and proofk now on the table, be had been more and ;tore convinced that his fiat opinion had been well founded, and he eequefled the patient attention of the Houle, while he went through thefe documents. Before, however, be entered upon his charges againft Lord St. Vin cent, for unprecedented negleft and mifconduft in tie building and repairing of (hips, during the time of his adminißration, he thought at neceffary to ad vert to the meafures that had been taken by his pre &carers for keeping op the Navy. Having done this, he would inquire what Reps had been taken by that Noble Lord for the fame purpofe i whether he bad followed the example of his predeceffors, and tiled thole exertions which the fituation of our af fairs at that time required? It would be found limn the accounts on the table that between the fears 1 783 and 1793 forty-two (hips of the line and orty-fire frigates had been provided for the Navy. Out of the forty-two (hips of the line 3o were built in the Merchant's Yards, and out of 45 frigates ao were built there. All this was done in the time of peace, though the neceffity was much lefs than it was during. the adminiftration of Lord St. Vincent. It was no torious that great exertions had then been made, when, at the commencement of the late war, in 1793, too (hips of the line, with a proportional number of (mailer veffels, were ready to be put in commiffion. Another part of the account chewed what means had been used to uphold the Navy. It appeared that by building, capture, Ste. between the periods of 1793 and 1 flot, 66 (hips of the line and mss frigates had been added to the Navy, which was at the rate of eight fail of the line and 15 frigates annually, for the (pace of eight years. But it might be Paid that a part of there had been captured and purchafed. He allowed them that argument, and would on account of it make a dedilei,in of one-third, which he confidered as liberal, and more than could be claimed on the ground of the papers on the table—and Rill there was an addition of about fix fail of the line and twelve frigates annually added to the Navy. It mull be allowed, however, that great as thefe exertions were, the Navy had not been left by that Naval Ad miniltratiou in fo high a Rate as st had been left them by their predeceffors. This was molt alarm ingly proved in the year 1801, when, out of t 30 fri gates, 115 Rood in need of repairs, and out of 114 ships of the line a proportionate number likewife Rood in need of repair. From thin it appeared that the annual addhinn of fix (hips of the line and twelve frigates to the Navy, was not fufficient to keep it up at its wonted Randard. Now it was proved that a thin would run no more than 15 year. before the re quired repairs, and therefore ailowing that we had lio (hips of the line at the commencement of the late war, no lefs than fevers fail of the line and twelve frigates annually would be neceffary to keep it up at its original eßablilliment. But even this was only reckoning on the time that a fhip would run, without Liking into account the numerous accidents and ca inilties to which vale's were expofed. Now he would proceed to inquire whether Lord St. Vincent had followed the Reps of his predeceffors, or exertell him• Pelf fo far as to add fix fail of the line and twelve fri gates annually to the Navy. From the papers on the table it appeared that on the 18th of June, 18ot, fifteen (hips of the line were on the Rocks, fix of which were in the King's Yards, and the ref in the Mer chants. There, wills the captures that might have been made, might have added the above-mentioned number to the Navy, if the exertions of the former Navel Adminifiration had been followed op by the Noble Loid. Inflead of this his head had been oc• copied with whimfical projeets to add fifty (hips an nually to the Navy from the King's Yards. He rather wilbed, however, than hoped, that•thrs could be dune. It appeared that ten apps out 9f theft, viz. (even out of at merchants' yards, and three out of the King's Yards, had been completed in the three years in which S 1 the Noble Lord had been at the bead of the Adifir ratty, but all without any great exertion on hilt ntratif bectufe the contrails Lad been made before he 411111 into office. Two were launched before his' renal- nefs had commenced. But he never put in elem. tion the means for building (hips, and in fad lied only built one folitary rif the line between 113crt and 184, and yet he bad forbid all recourfe to the merchants' yards. Though it might at firft appear that he had built three (hips, he had really built only one, for the others were alaudt ready before he came into office. Now, though he had received is fail of the line on the flocks, he only left his predeceffori nine, five of which had been on the Rocks when he came in, and the tea would not be ready till 1807, being three years frotn the period at which he had , quitted o f f i ce. Thule were the means which Lord ' St. Vincent p. , ffeffed, with which he had done almA nothing. With twenty-one fail of the line captured, he would not add to the Navy in fix years more than one halt of what his predeceffors had added, though he had an inlet :al of peace in his favour s and yet the whole number which they had added would not equal the amount required. Now, with regard to the frigates, he had been equally negligent. He had ample means to have equalled his predeceffors in this point, if he had thought proper to employ theM, and yet the total number of fri,, , ates which he added to the navy, during the time of his Adminiftration,. dednding ten frigates captured, amounted only to nineteen. He trifled he had already convinced the Hoare, that the average somber of twelve frigates annually, for eight years, added by his predeceffirts, were not equal to the wale in the navy. In what ' point of view, then, could the undue of Lord St. Vincent be cenfidered, who, at a period when much greater exertions were neceffirry, had literally not added to the navy half the number that they did ? He only added nineteen frigates, when he ought to have added thirty-nine, even upon the lowed' compu. tation. His Lordfhip did not Teem to hare been aware of the neceffity of tome exertion till a Runt time before he quitted office; when tome orders were given, but thefe had not been aged upon till he *as really out. EvEn there orders he attributed to the diffatisfaition which began to appear in that Houk, and the clamours which had been raifed.out of it.— When he refigned his office, he left only one frigate upon the Rocks ; nine bad been contracted fort but far only had been actually begun,before the country wax happily relieved, by his refignation, from the alarming fituation in which it was placed by his re• miffnefs and neglect. The Houfe, therefore, would do him the jut - lice to believe that he had good imds for the invettigation of this bnfinefs. Havingiui out all this, he was naturally led to look into the mks of this great failure ; to inquire whether we bad been more than ufually fuccefsfid in our cap tures ; whether the political fituation of the country was more than commonly Life and advantageous, fo as to :ender exertion on our part lets necelfary ? Whether our enemies had been lazy and negligent in their preparations; and were only employed in build. ing what the Honourable Admiral over the way, (Markham) had called cockle (hells, things too con temptible for a Britifh navy to engage—or whether the fituation of the country was not fuch as required much greater exertions (ban had been made at any former period ? He found, that between 1793 and 1831, lizty-fix (hips of the line had been provided for the navy by his predecefTors, and that twenty-one had been taken from it—(he requefted the particular at tention of the Houk to this, that it might be Peen how the navy was dwindling into nothing) fo that the clear addition was 45 (hips in eight years. He found that I>tl frigates had been provided by them, and that 53 had been taken away, leaving the clear addition of 68 ; whereas; under the Adminidration . of Lord St. Vincent, fourteen had been added, and eleven taken away, leaving a clear addition of three fh;p in three years and two months; and as to the gates, twenty-two had been added and thirty taken away, fo that the decreafe was eight frigates. Now he appealed to the Houfe, whether the Noble Lord had any grounds to fuppofe that exertion was left necef fary at the time he was in office, than it was during the adminiftration of his predeceffors ? Was not the conduct of the Noble Lord criminal ? He was not ignorant of the necellity which exifted for great ex ertions, for he himfelf had dated, in his letter to the Comptroller of the Navy, that there was the mod urgent necellity ; and if he had been ignorant of it, his ignorance would have been criminal.— So much was he convinced of the neceffity of adding by every poffible means, to the Iftrength of the navy, that he himfelf laid, that he fcarcely ever converted with the Comptroller of the Navy without introduc ing this fajta ; and when he wrote in a few days after, he accompanied this declaration with a (harp re buke to the Comptroller, for fome fuppofed rerniff nefs on his part. He would read this correipon dence, in order that the Houle might be in full pot feflion tithe fad. (Here he read fome letters which puffed between Lord St. Vincent and Sir Andrew Hammond, refpeding the building of 7+ gun (hips by contrail, which clofed with a ref ufal to accept the tenders that had been made to build at e6l. per ton.) This was what paired during fourteen days between the 29th of December, iBoz, and 13th of January, 1803. After all this, would it not altonifh the Houle to find, that during a year and a half tub. fervent to thin period, and about three months be fore the war began, no reafon had been given for rejecting the tenders, and no one (hip procured ? This was indeed very unaccountable. He would leave to the friends of the Noble Lord to make his defence, and to date the reafons and circumltances that ren dered exertion unneceffary when he was in office.— Bin it might be raid, that there were objections to building drips in the merchants' yards. This certain ly, as appeared by the correfpondence which he had read, had not been objected to at firft. If the Noble Lord had changed his mind, it fcemed to be in a great meafure owing to caprice and whim. When his acmes of adding fifty fail of the line annually, to the navy, (bould he dated to the Houk, he had no doubt they would prove a grofs fallacy and imrrofi tion, like the calculation of the Honourable Gentle man, who put rupees for pounds Reding, with a view to depreciate the character of a gallant officer (Sir Home Popham) but while he was employed in his whims and caprices, he had taken no Reps to procure (hips—not for want of flips to lay them down, for at the time of his quitting office, 13 out of zo were un occupied. He had wantonly difcharged the work. men, and forced that to leek another fervice, and even to go ever to one enemies. Thf illiberality of his conduit had difgtdied every one, when the navy was going to deßrudion. In order to prove the mi. Citable Rate in which the navy was, he bad only to read the letters from the officers at Plymouth, now on the table, relative to the neceffity of procuring timber within a month of the time when preCs war rants were ;fitted. (He here read Come letters to Lord St. Vincent, from the officers at Plymouth, Rating the necafity of a fupply of timber.) He I afked, whether this was the mode in which our na• val works were to be carried on ? Having thus proved the culpable and fltameful mice • of Lord St. 'Vincent, lie would now Rate the effefts that had refulred from it. In conrequenee ,of the ten ders of the merchant blades at 261. per ton, being related, the country had •IoR zoo,oool. ; for bit Cue calor had been obliged to give 361. per ton for ten 74 gun (hips. This had been the effe& of his ill. judged economy. He highly cornmended Lord Mel ville and Lord Barham, who had preferred the navy from ruin. Had the contracted fyßem of Lord St. Vincent been perfißed in, we fhould not now have to boat of the battle of Trafalgar, and of the victo ries of Sir Richard Strachan, of Admiral Duck. worth, and Sir John BorlafeWarren. !Mind of this, our inferier. blockading fquadrons would have had to fly befee the combined fleets, who might have ra vaged our defencelas colonies at their erie without fear of oppofition. As an Englithman lie thuddered at the rifle which we had tun. We might have been reduced to the molt degraded Rate, and forced so accept of any terms of peace which the ambitious and unprincipled tyrant of the Continent• might have thought proper to grant or impure. He meant not to fay any thing againtt the corralion of abufes which the Noble Lord had projated; but he thought him criminal in not meeting the exigencies of the times in the manner he ought to have done. His fcbemes and alterations had not been approved of.— The Commiffioners of the Navy had declared their readineth to adopt any plan lie might propofe ; but the Noble Lord took care not to illne any pofitive orders that might bring refpo'nfibility on birnfelf.— Inflead of ;o fail of the line annually. he had only provided three (hips in three years. What then be came of their boating of what *as intended to be done ? There was no grciund foi boating where no thing had been done. The prefent date of the Navy deferved the rejoin confideration of the country, and more particularly of the Noble Lord who was now at the head of the Admiralty. He thought he had now fully jutlified the eiprellion which he had for merly made ore of, that Lord St. Vincent was not intentionally, but eventually, one of the greateft ene mies this country ever had. He requefled the at tention of the Houfc for fume time longer, while he Rated the nature of the repairs which had been mach. In &Sot there were fifteen (hip. in ordinary, ten.of which required repairs; and in 1803 no lefs than one hundred and twenty fail required repairs. There were feven claffes of repairs, in a Peale down from very large to very fmall. Fourteen required very large repairs, and of thcfe the Noble Lord had not repaired one—of the middling clafres he had repaired but few—and of thole which required but very Cmall repairs he had repaired the whole. Altogether be bad only repaired twenty-fix fail out of one hundred and twenty which Rood in need of repairs. But the proportion of the work done was far Mort of the pro portion this twenty-fix fail bore to the one hundred and twenty, on account of his having taken princi pally thofe which Rood in need of the kali repair.' This would be teen from the proportion of the ex pence. The whole expence had been 1t13,0001. whereat, if the one hundred and twenty vellels had been repaired, the expence would have been 918,0001. fo that the proportion was one to eight, and at the rate at which the Noble Lord was proceeding, 20 years would be neceffary to complete the repairs of all thefe veffels. The Noble Lord had not been awakenid from his lethargy till within a month of the breaking nut of the war, and by his parfimonious meafures he had thrown every impediment in the way of the navy that could in the event of heltilities, render it adequate to anfwer its purpofes. He had fent away our gallant (cameo into other Cervices, and compelled them to man the fleets of our enemies.— In 18oz he had advertifed the fele of (even hundred tons of hemp, which had probably gone to the fleets of our enemies, merely in order to avoid the paltry expence of a Rote houfe, and in confequence of this, in a Ilion time after, it was found neceffary to pur chafe 552 tons of hemp, at a very advanced price. The papers moved for by the Honourable Admiral over the way, made his cafe ftronger, for there it appeared that there were twenty chips more than he reckoned upon in the fervice at the time when the Noble Lord came into office. There were provided when it was necefrary to refill the formidable confe deracy of the Northern Powers. This, however, we owed to Lord Spencer. It appeared when Lord Sr. Vincent came into office, the number of (hips was !to, with an additional twenty that might be put in corn 'nation upon an emergency. But when he quitted office. he left only eighty-eight fail of the line, though he certainly was not very particular as to the Rate of the (hips ; for though his fucceffors, by great exer tions, added t z (hips to the Nary, they had the mor• tification to find that they only replaced 12 other which it was necefrary to repair. The Navy, how. ever, had been highly improved under that merito rious Nobleman, Lord Barham, and he hoped the Noble Lord who was at prefent at the head of the Admiralty would follow his example. The Hon. Gentleman then proceeded to confider the fupply of timber for the Navy, dining the time when Lord St. Vincent was in office. Inftead of 32,000 loads which had been nfually fupplied, only tsuooo had been fupplied, food after the Noble Lord had come to pre tide at the Admiralty, and at lag only 4000 loads were annually furnifhed, at a time when the con fumption was 30,000. He underflood that it was intended to attribute the failure of the fqpply to the Navy Board ; but the fame Navy Board had exifled before and trace, and, in fa&, he had no doubt that it was owing to the Admiralty Board. The regula tions refpaling the timber to be received into the dock wce 7 , e a r n r d p s he e ra, ely thought execu t u ed ne ; sc b e ti p t ti bl w o h na ent c iie nh y • w e e n re tl e m z y e rwi e fl t o i cu t ed l adn td i a h n ec: ex vexatious roernefee e m ;kntaoni another tr itr haeb yr ri r t e, market.totey t the wo nlT The e r e tt fr de merchant, e a r the who of the unnecelfary rigour introduced by the Noble Lord was, that the fupply hal been almoit entirely flop. ped, as the quantity refuted exceeded all bounds.— He contended that though inferior timber had been before received, it had only been paid for as fuch, • and that it anfwered various purpoles equally as well • alt timber of a better defcription,and at the fame time %, leffiened the confumption of prime timber. In . 1804 no timber could be purchafed, and this was a date in which the Noble Lord had left the Admiralty when he quitted office, an event which he was per. fuaded had laved the Navy of this country. He I truded he had fully proved the,charges which he had brought forward againa Lord Sr. Vincent, and though he hadbitherto ilated fads without any cont. menu, he trufted he woold be indulged in a few rib. • fervations. The Naval Hillory 'of this country did ~ nowt any time nor in any lunation, much lets in Poch a fituation as the Noble Loid found the country in, ever record fuch an initance of criminal negleti. If it had continued much longer, the Navy of this , country wool/ have been ruined. It ought not then to be admitted that the Noble f.r,rd bad laid the foundation of any of our naval vidories, yet th.tr Noble Lord had been now appointed iodic greatell command that had ever been given to a Naval Offi cer. Ve might dcferve this, but certainly not on . account of any thing which he had done while at the head of the Admiralty. He did not quake his merits as a naval officer ; but theft our not to be !et off againfl the mifchievous greets o bit civil ad , mininration. He miffed, then, that he Ibould not ,be accufed of calumniating the Noble Lord. If the Noble Lord's charafter was blafted, it was not blafted by him •, he had only Rated fads ; and if the Noble Lord fell, be was precipitated by himfelf.— He concluded by reading a thing of motions, form. • ing a fort of luminary of the matters contained in his fpeechoirhich clofed with one accufing Lord St, Vincent with profs mircondult and a derelidion of his duty. His objeCt in bringing forward tbefe motions was, to fhew that what he hamlet( had faid of Earl St Vincent had not been Paid rattily, and that the eulogiums bellowed upon him by hit ntifharn friends were unfounded. He was ready to proceed in any way the Houle might direct. He moved, that the Houle do refolvc itfelf into a Committee to confider there charges. Mr. DENT role to fecond the motion, not that he agreed with the Honourable Mover in the accufations which he had laid againft the Noble Lord, and not pledging hitnfelf to go on a angle dep further with him in the bufinefs, but limply for the purport of haring the matter fet at reft. • J , A dila:rutty here arofe 26 to. iho ftieiti of the mo. tionthe SPEAKER at the fame time remarking the unprecedented cite Om fiance of a Gentleman read ing his fpeech in that Houle, and begged that the ez .nple of the Honourable Member might mot bit regarded as a precedent. .4 . . . Lord HOWICK wifhed to kilo* hot, the Roil. Gendenian meant to proceed, if the Houle fhould gd into the Committee Mr. JEFFERY laid, he bad no with of his own oq . the fubjeft. He had only done his duty in bringing the matter forward, and he left it to the Heide to proceed as it thould incline. Lord HOW ECK faid, it was not fufficient for the Honourable Gentleman to 4t he had done his duty, and left it to the Hattie. He had come there with a written fpeecli which he had read, and whith. for any thing he knew, he might get printed, and which might convey an impreffion prejudicial to the cha.. tatter of the Noble Lord. The Ratements in the Honourable hlember's fpeech were perfeilly contra• vertible, and he knew could very loon be controverts& The queftion was then pia, that the Hoofs do folve into a Committee, to confider the papers on thi table relative to the conduit of the Earl St. Vincent, Admiral MARKHAM confidered the therms now attempted to be fattened on the Noble Earl, 101 be the molt unfounded ever exhibited. Not only had the Honourable Member come with a written attack againli the Noble Lsrd, but he had ftudionfly avoid ed to tell in what the charge confißed. If the Hon. Admiral had known what he only knew this morning, he would not have troubled the Houle with that great mars of papers now lying on their table. which he bad moved for. The &(t part of the Hon. Gentle man's charge went to the general building of flaps and, to Phew that the Noble Earl had not built in a proportion equal to that of former Admiralty 'he referred to the period from 1793 to 18 1 ot ud a doing fo he had Rated the number added to the Bri an, Navy daring that period of eight years to be 66. This he confelfed to be the fad ; but, at the fame time he could not help noticing, that it was unfair to Rate all thefe under the head building i or that they could at all ente, into confederation, where the queftion only was, as to building in the King's or in Merchant's yards. During the three years the Noblll Earl was at the head of the Admiralty Board, thee) was an interval of 18 month: of peace. fo that it was but fair, in treating on this Cubit& to take the (hips actually built during there two periods. In this view of the cafe it would be found, that during eight years which the Honourable Gentleman had pitched on, there were built twenty-four fall, and during the three years of Lord St. Vincent's Naval Adminiftration, there were built ten fail. So the Houle might fee if there was any deficiency during Lord St. Vincent's three years. Tina Lord St. Vincent was not liable for any delay in finifhing (hips after they were or dered to he laid dna n ; and that the province of the Admiralty Board was ooly to order the fize and di mentions, and to trial to the Navy Board for the execu tion, he illultrated by refers :ng to many cafes in point, as appearing on the face of the papers on the table. Betides the (hips which were building, he (hewed that the frigates had encreafeel from 182 to 195, and tl'e Noble Earl had alto contrived to man 20 fail of el.. line more than during the pet iod alluded to. Yet the was called no exertion. Alter an expentive war, Ow number of flaps requiring repairs mutt naturally be immenfe ; and that it was fo in the prefent cafe was apparent. from ss hat the. Hon. Member himfelf had Rated, namely, that there were but is fail in ordinary, all the rent requiting to be repaired. It was com plained by the Hon. Member, that a confiderable numhei at flaps had been broken up, and others fold. Was it, however, to be differed as Li objeitioa to the conduct of a Fi=g Lord of the Admita!ty, that he had done fo ? The deltas, as is uf la', in (itch cafes, molt have been made, out and tranfmitted to the Navy Board ; and, when broken up, the materials would be employed in the repair of other's. If there (hips had not been broken ep and fold, what would have been faid when only rabbilh w • friend r Would' not that have bren $ matter of .:siasination ; - ". "4 I