Star. — London, England, 1805-01-16 00:00:00

Write were Weed far the Cos* lilted, in the nisi et .ad Carbon, decrafed ; the Devizes, in the reset "(the Right lire. Henry Adangton, called up to the Haute of Peers ; Tows of Duckinglimu, in the room of lord Praby, deceefed; County"( Leitrim. is the room of Lord Clement% now Vircoent Leitrim ; m i dah lgtee and Dealer. M the room of the Right Hem Themes Maitland, appointed Governor of Ceylon ; Welt Lome, in th e room of j unto Baer, kfq. who has accepted of the Chiltern Hundred', Peebles, in Mc room of Sir John Montgemerie, appointed his Ma. jeity's Advocate for Scotland ; and for Edinburgh, in the room of Charks Hope, 14 appointed Lord Janice Clerk for Scotland. Thefe (event motions haring been pot and carried. The SPEAKER rote to acquaint the Hoof', that that Hnsfe had been to the Houle of Lords, where his Majelty had been gracioully pleated to add refs a Speech from the Throne, to his two Houfes of Par liament, of which, to prevent minakes, he bad pro cured a copy. The Speaker then read his Majeay's sn ‘it gracious Speech. The Hun. Mr. DILLON rote.—He knew it was afoul to view the Addrefs moved on occafions like the prefent as merely the echo of the fpeech ; an which had certainly been, with few exceptions, in every infante of motions of this nature. it e ver there was an infante to the contrary, it tbruld not be afforded by him that night; for he molt cordially concurred with his Majelty in every fentiment of his gracious fpeech : and under the circumfiances of the moment, it was doubtlefs ob vious to all, that never was unanimity more defirable than now. One topic in the Speech, he was perfuad id, would be read with more than common inte reft, as the fubjeft on which it retied would caufe unfual joy and fati.faftion. This was that part which related to the communications of a pacific nature, made by France to our Government. The intelli genre of that communication would be received by all claffes of people, with that joy and fatisfailtion indeed, which pacification might well be expefted to induce; though from the neceffary referee obferved, as to the terms of fuch communication, fober men would mingle with their fatisfaltion, caution, with their joy prudence. He Would not, however, dwell longer on that point. We mull wait the refult of Aide meafures which his Majelty in his wifdom had taken, in confequence of the communication of thofe pacific fentiments of our enemy which had been avowed. Yet though it was not more than becom. ing in us to forbear from dircufGon on that topic, it was impoffible not to regard the overtures made as of the utmcft moment. With refpelt to one of the points in the Speech from the Throne, that which related to the war with Spain, the Houle could enter into no difeuffion till the papers were before it. One thing he would fay, that every thing which our Go vernment could do to prevent a rupture with that Power he felt allured our Government had done.— The view given in the Speech of our fituation with regard to the Continent, would (hike Gentlemen as affording the molt flattering and cheering profpoi for Europe. The fentimenv the Emperor of Ruffia was known to entertain afforded the utmoft fatistaftion ; fentiments the more to be relied on, as they were his uniform fentiments. Hence, whatever might be the turn the communications of France would take, he had well-founded reafon to think, that the fafety and fecuri ty of Europe would be permanently advanced by the fentiments and difpofitions of the Continent. Again, the means of defence poffeffed by us were vast. Our force of every defcription was on the molt refpcita ble footing. Laft rummer oar forces were confide nbly augmented, and in no one refixed could our force be faid to be otherwife than powerful, eaten five, and well combined. If we Would turn our eye to another (loader of the empire, we Would find that there too we were formidable. He alluded to Ire land. Ireland was in a molt refpe&able fituation of defence. There were other topics, which, however, were ufual in addreffes of this kind, and on which he Wald not detain the Houfe with many obfervations. —At a future period, the Houfe would deliberately turn its attention to thofe topics, and all the other important fubjeas. But he could not help obferving that the (late of cur public credit was never more profperous. However heavily the burtbeni of the country were felt, however great the expences cf our eltablithments, however the war had added to our burthens, notwithltanding thole inunenk facrifices neceffarily made by us fur the general defence, yet the fund was at this momat increafing, and had, in an almo(t unparralleled manner, increafed, for the sedultion of the national debt. Under thefe cir cumftances, and having dwelt hut nightly on the principal points in his Majelly's Speech, he Mould now conclude by moving an Addrela to his Majelty, humbly thanking him for his molt gracious Speech. —The Hon. Gentleman accordingly concluded by moving an Addrefs, which was, as anal, an echo of the Speech. The SPEAKER havinp,put the queftion, Mr. CHARLES ADAMS rote to fecond the mo tion. The fpeech his Majelty had been gracioully pleated that day to addicts to them from the Throne called for the unanimous thanks of every man in that Haute, and of the country. What we were told in the fpeech, of the fituatlon of our force, and means of national and general defence, was indeed flattering, but not at all more flattering than inn. Our force was, to adopt the language of his Hon. Friend, in a molt refpeltable (late. It never was fo mach fo. We had been threatened with en inva• lion of our Chores fur the conquelt of our Wand, and we nut only defended ourfelves, but blockaded every port of our enemy, from the Tenet to the Adriatic. It was true, we had a new enemy, an enemy, he tc.ireit, milled by weak councils, overawed by the nitiirce., and intimidated by the Mandates of a del: ti4iic ally. This enemy bad been treated by us with uncommon lenity. Spain, though carrying on pro leas, or abetting intcrefts, the molt hollile to us, had experienced a forbearance at our bands, of which certainly there had been no example given by any nation of which he had ever heard or read. This was our conduit towards that nation, when !he was carrying on againit us mealhres of an undoubted warlike tendency. We were not, furely, to. remain indifferent to thefe things for ever. We were not to behold Spain combining the matte, if not of fitc cefiful, doubtlefs, of alarming refillawee, while ottr ttndernefs seas a criminal forbearance, fmking into putillanimity. From the conduit of Spain, from what Spain did, we had no alternative but to op pure force to force. ( A cry of hear! bear 1 from the L'hancellor of the Exchequer.) Thus far of the conduit of Spain. He Would fay no mote of it, intil the requifite doenments &mkt be laid befoft 'he Houk. In regard to the communications from .t.e enemy, they were of a charaftex *Was Wan be had no era to detain' the Hours any longer, be felt. however. ought to be noticed. They formed a onnt feature of his Majeity's fpiech • ' and the lle e i and the Country would view them under a point which could not but lead men to appreciate them as in the higheft fenfe important. He was happy at thofe communications ; GOD grant the communications might be fincerel he hoped they were. He knew we amid treat them with mode- ration, wifdom, and franknefs, ritalkd only by our fincerity. But whatever &add happtn, be Would "encore to predia, that this nation %vas ttt►er in a prouder Rate, commercial, Isancial, and. military, than at that moment when be had the honour to be addreflieg the Houk. Our finances --- vre our armies refpatable, and the profpett of our in tereas on the Continent fuck as ought to Batter every hope. Altogether, he felt confident. that the Houle would vote, with him, to carry up its afar. ances of its- firm and Ready (upport of his the Throne, and the Empire. in this crifis, the mutt momentous that Great Britain or Europe ever cape- Mr. FOX rote—He &mild trouble the Houfe with but very few words. What he meant to fay, Would produce no oppornion. He thould dire& hiire marks io one or two points. Before doing fo, it occurred to him as proper, however, to obferve that two omiffions appeared to him in his Majefly's (peed), and one in the addrefs. This omimon he would notice ara. While we were uninformed what thole tonfidential fubjefts, or confidential interferences were, which demanded our applying to the powers of the Conti nent, or rendering them in any &ape parties to the communications of France, we were dented to at- lure bis blajelly, that we approved his deterasina tion not to explain the nature of thole communica tions, until he has had intercourfe with certain powers. Now, though if this were undertlood gene. rally, or if he underitood it, there might be no differ ence of opinion, yet as he did not - know, and was not permitted to know, thole circumltances which called for intercourfe with other powers, be molt think that the Addrefs pledged the Houfe to too much ; pledging it to approbation of the determina tion not to explain at prefent the nature of the cbm munications in quellion. But as to this explanation in itfelf, he, for one, mua confefs that he law no ne ceffity for any explanation, but what appeared al ready on the face of the fpeech : for his Majety there expreffes himfelf clearly, making profeCfions of a with for peace. His Majelty lays direly, that he entertains this with, but can give no farther expla• nation until he has confulted certain powers, not allies indeed, but powers with which he has certain difcuffions, certain confidential intercourfe. As he had it was impotfible to judge of the propriety of all this, till we knew the nature of that confiden• tial intercourfe, though if be knew it, he might per. haps be one to approve ; but bow could the Houk, or he, approve of a flatement, the occstion and cir cumflances of which they did not know ? The omit. fion in the Addrefs he Roulet not mention. He owned he did cape°. when he firtt learned the name of the Honourable Gentleman who was to snore the Addrefs, that omiffion could not occur. To what he alluded was the emancipation of the Catholics. The Honourable Mover had indeed mentioned Ire land, but not a word of Catholic Emancipation.— The hopes cf the Catholics were much increafed when the Right Hon. Gentleman loft entered on office; but unfortunately, office changes completions and colours, fo that men are prefen tly not to be met with the fame faces. We were told that the Union would heal up all wounds. would be a defence and_ fecurity againit all dangers; but it was to Catholic Emancipation to which that Union was to lead, that we were taught mainly to look for our great defence in Ireland. The belt defence is a union of fend. meat; the belt foundation for the union of countries, is the union of the people in affection to their Go vernment. The bell defence for Ireland would be this union, to which the emancipation of the Catho lics could alone pave the ways and he had expeaed, that for thefe, and other mafons very obvious, the Hon. mover of the Addrefs would have introduced the fubjea of the Catholics of Ireland. Thtre were other omit ions. but of a different ntoure there oc. curred in the Speech. To be fore. they were omit. lions lets important, but yet remarkable. He had always underßood that when a Minillechad, during the recefs of Parliament, taken tneafbris for the de fence of the country, that the Speech contained com pliments to the Minilter, or congrattilations to the nation, on the matures adopted. and the effeas produced. When he confidered the sights he had fat up, and the time employed in the difcuffion of the lira meafures, as Om' faid, and others denied, of the new Adminiltration. in this country, be did expel that the Houfe &odd not have been told, in general terms, of the excellence of our Volunteers, the bravery of our Navy,the general armed ilrength of the State, the fpirit of the people, and the like ; but that we should have been, on the contrary told, of the effeas of thefe wife and falutary meafures Tibia conftituted the difference between an aisniniftration of imbecility or not ; which difference, we were told. would be ken in the gcod effeas produced, and the advantages the country derived. Hadthe country de• rived advantages ? He believed it had not. He rather thought, noble was of opinion, that thofe meafures had completely failed. One of two things mull be done, however ; either it mull be proved, that the meafures in quellion have been fuccefsful, and have provided the requifne means of ineirealing our armed force, and of defending the country, or another bill mutt be deviled and brought in for thole porpofes.-4- There is nothing in the speech to point oat what. if i necelLary, loch a bill ought to contain. So that he wit fearful his Majelty would at laR feel °Wised to adopt the fuggeßions of others, of thofe of his own Ade, inßead of the fuggeßions of Minifters. He remembered that his loggeßioes, and thofe of the Right Hon. Gentleman, were once In unifun al lb the means of defence, in one tefped ; but when the Rho Hon. Gentleman was told by his opponents, that his foggeftions were unavailing, it might ban appeared tU of sa of pontion : he has changtd po fitsos, tied what is the ei of his meaftwe for the detente and fectnity of the cotmtry i why nothing at Dropping this MO, there was one fehtence in the Speech, ea which he would make one, and bet , one Seenark: This was, that which glanced at the war with Spam, He Ihould not go into the ditaii of this topic, until the pews &Mild be before the node it temild he waw&, itt the *Wild of the Materials. 13 at if on the gesmil qttellion of that war, he chore to be fileat, he could not, with re gard to Come of the eircurnltaaces which' preceded it. The circumaance molt in his recallealtin, *as that of the feizure of the Spanilh frigates He was afraid this reiture would prove not eery of jallifita lion. To fay the leak it did appear to hitt an unfairly ad. It was never the time for commit ting fuch ads when we were reproaching France with her outrages and iriolenee. It was not a time whei we mete urging those outrages and that vio lence, as aggravated grounds of war; we &cold flan" clear front filch charges, when we are reproach ing France. Undoubtedly France has been guilty of outrages. and ,of violations of the law of nations, which no hunianeman can but lament, and which no honeft man will approve. We !boilid feel com pletely difappoiated, however, if while at war—if while part of the Round of war was the condua of France to othet nations, charges of outrages were brought againft ourfelves. We are now in a new war ; and though the Honourable Seconder and he Might not have thought alike concerning the princi ple of the la war, or even fuppofing they were both of opinion that that was juft, yet be alma be al lowed, in confidesing this new war, to confider the queftion of jultice. He mull examine accordingly, our new canfe of war. In beginning a new war, it was material that the objea &mild be jut' and mode rate. When we are engaged; we Ihould be careful riot to be guilty of outrage, or violence. It ought not to 1* in the power of the world to infinuate that outrages were committed on one fide and on the other—for then, as to the nations of the Continent (thufe nations whofe independence and freedom we profefs to with to reftore), would view themfelves as from our common injultice, outrages, and violence, involved in a common danger; fo ready to exclaim, that they could not help themfelves, that they could not help being facrificed, whatever was the event of the war between the great powers. Our interell and our duty, prefcribed the reverie of violence and out rage. We ought to be not only jutl, but moderate; nay, even our equity and our jultice thould be fame thing uncommon ; for even in tome refpeets to appear to exceed tnerejullice, to exetcife a gencrofity above it, might be advantageous to our caufe, and benetl. dal to our interefis. We might ad wifely, and (kill ad with a generAity beyond arid juftice, and par ticularly in the application and exercife of power. To thefe obtervations he would not add more at that time. As Coon is Mr. Fox fat down, The CIIANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER rote and fpoke ()softly io reply. He did not conceive it necetiary, at that time, to trouble the Houle with many obfervations, but he thought it neceirary to al lude to a few things which had fallen from the Hon. Gentleman in the courfe of his fiseech. The Hon. Gentleman bad expteffed tome degree of furprife that the nature of thofe communications with tome of the Continental Powers alluded to in his Majefty's Speech had not been more diflinEtly explained to the Houle. He had declared it to be impoffible to judge of the neceflity of making a communication of the recent overture of the French Government, with out knowing on what terms our relations with there Powers now Rood. He confelred he thought that the Speech did Rate what was fatly kfficient to war rant fuck a communication. It Rated diiiindly, that confidential communications did fubfiß betwixt his Majeßy and tome of the Continental Powers; and it gave the Hoofe afrurances of the magnanimous fentiments entertained by the Emperor of Rullia, re lative to the higheft interefts of Europe, as well sts the fecurity and independence of this Country. AU thofe then who agreed that in forming any Peace we should look to the fituation of the Continent. and think of the moft effeEtual means of efiablifking thofe ancient relations which French ambition had over- thrown, MR be of opinion that the Speech had dif clofed all that it was now neceffary to difcover, and would acquiefee in the expediency of being content ed with what his Majelly had laid before the Houfe. He admitted that a period would come when the Houfe would have a fair right to demand much more ample information, but he flattered himfelf they were fully aware that circum Rances might exill which would render it equally imprudent and iinpulitic to enter into a minute or particular defcription of our relations with the Ccntinental Powers. He hoped, therefore, that the information furnifhed by the speech would, in the mean time, be received as faiiifadory under all circutnflances. As to the other points to which the Hon. Gentleman had alluded, being eon melted with fubjefts which might, ip all probability, at no remote period, engage the attention of the Houfe, W thought it unneceffary for him to go now into any length of difcutfion. He tould not help raying a few words on what the Honourable Gentleman had term ed omiffions in the Speech. The Honourable Gentle. man had begun will exprelling his aßonifliment that the Rate of Ireland was not even alluded to ; and had argued, that till the fituation of the Irini Catho lics was taken into contideration, that country never could enjoy any thing like permanent tranquillity or repofe. In the broad view which the Honourable Gentleman took of the quetuion, it wa► isigotlible for Ireland ever to enjoy the fmalleit advantage from the Union, till the meafures which he appeared defirous of recommending were aflually puttied. For his part he had a very different view of the fubjell, for though Ireland, certainly, had not derived all the advantages froM the Union, which that meafure was capable of affording, he would Maintain that great advantages had already attended it, and many others might flileedily be expelled. But he begged leave to are, how it came to pall, that though four years bad elapfed fillet the Union, thofe meafures which the Honourable Gentleman now fo loudly called for. had never been even once recommended ? What was there at the pretest moment which rendered theta meafures to neeeffary now, that did not formerly fuggeft the propriety of their adoption ? If he himfelf bad entertained the fame *it'll whigh the Honoura ble Gentleman profeffed to entertain, be could not eonfißetnly have feared the fubjea to have remain. ed Co long dbrekant. Whit reams induced him. Who had very . different views of the (Wiled,. to (of fer it to remain dormant. he ihOuld:on a future oC cafion hale an opportunity dilating, and he flatter ed hitt:A.lf, that the Houle and the tetuntey would give tarn NCB: fbr continency, *hen he had Rated the redone *hick Indeeed h kill to think that the tainglogt=ortitant at thee! prefent Mat bit ittittidlo the BM 'which he had lalltoo introdoeed for the Defence of the Country, and bad cantered a with to know, whether force other more efficient Bill was not to be fubftituted in its room. This was not the time for that difcuffion, but be felt bimfelf called on even on the relent oceafion. to Rate that he had feet no rea- .._ ...- fon to alter his opinion of the grounds on which that Bill was founded, and though be admitted that its effells, in adding to the numbers of our military force, had indeed been exceedingly (mall, nothing that had happened, confidering all the circumaaneei under which the Bill was propofed, and the principles on which it proceeded, induced him to think that it was not a meafure which ought to be relinquilbed, at leaf( in all its leading features. He was ready at any time to meet the Honourable Ge nt l eman and his friends in reviewing the Rate of the country in all its various relations. He was ready in particu lar to meet the Hon. Gentleman refpating the Rate of our military force, and the improved condition on which it now Rood, compared to what it was laR fef lion. He was ready to 111CIV that at the prefent mo• ment we had a regular difpckable force far more con fiderable than many gentlemen teemed to be aware of. But, while he raid this, he was alfo perfettlt willing to agree with th e f e Gentlemen, that this re gular difpofable force fhoulii be Rill further augment ed. He would not all attempt to difpute that means quite independent of the Bill which had been alluded to, might with great propriety be employed for aug menting our regular difpofabk force to an extent which could render it highly ferviceable k whether em ployed for objefts conflated with our (mutate inte tells, or the interells and independence of the Conti nent. On the fubjeft of the rupture with Spain, the Hon. Gentleman had very prudently declined offer ing any opinion till the documents referred to in the Speech from the Throne were laid before the Houle. He had, however, in alluding to the detention of the • Spanilb frigates, thrown out a fort of fulpicion that this was a violent and unjuiiifiable proceeding. In a very (tort time, he was perfuaded that the fion.Gen tleman and his friends would fee reafon to alter that opinion, and confefs that their fufpicions were erro neous. He fully agreed with the Hon. Gentleman that at all times, but efpecially at the prefent moment, it was highly necelfary to keep np the high charader of the country for moderation, juftice, and honour, and he was firmly convinced, that when the whole of the late tranfafiions with Spain were explained, the de tention of the frigates would not at all appear, in the fmalleft degree, a departure from the &Weft rules of moderation or juitice. At the time theft frigates were detained, he was perfuaded it would be feen that his Majefty might have feized them by an of of open hoftility ; fur Spain was at that time fubflantially guilty of ails of open hoftility again& this country. It was the objea of his Majefty, how ever, as long as poffible, to keep open a door for re conciliation ; but it was at the fame time what his ditty required of him, not to fuller the Spina Go vernment to gather new Arength, while negociations were carrying on betwixt the two countries. On the whole, he had no difficulty in laying, that when tha whole bufinefs was fully confidered, his *jelly's conduta to Spain would be found marked with uni form moderation, forbearance, and even tendernets, fo far as confifient with the honour of his Crown and the profperity and fafety of his dominions. Having thus adverted to there topics, in reply to the Honour. able Gentleman, he thought it unnecau7 further to take. up the time of the Houle. All theft topics would, at a future period, be again brought under. their review, and would doubdefs create a great deal of difcuffion. When the proper time arrived, be thould have no &fire to avoid the difcuidon ; but at precast it would be altogether extraneous as well as unneceffary. Mr. FOX, in explanation why he had not brought forward the fubjeft of Catholic emancipation, Rated that it was perfealy well underftood t ha t any man bringing forward this queftion unconneaed with Government, would have had very little chance of gaining the object. It was betides very doubtful how far the meafure would be acceptable to the Catholic Body, if not taken up, as a matter of jultice and lid y, by the Executive Government. Mr. PITT laid a few words in explanation. Mr. WINDHAM vindicated the conduit of his Hon. Friend (Mr. Fox) as perfelly confillent. He had not brought forward the fubjeft of Catholic Emancipation during the exiftence of a Cabinet avowedly hoftile to that meafure ; nay, whole very elevation to power was founded on their oppation to it : but it was very different when the Cabinet profefed a defire to have this =afore brought about, and when the perfon at the head of the Cabinet ted given an open avowed opinion in favour both of its policy and its juftice. This was fufficient to juitify the confiftency of his Honourable Friend in recom mending the fubjeft to the Right Hon. Gentleman at the prefect moment. But leaving this topic, the Right Hon. Gentleman made tome obfervations on the information conveyed by the Speech, refpeaing the Rate of our Continental Connexions. He was free to acknowledge, that he thought the information on this fubjea extremely fcanty and unfatisfaltory., He had 'limited foroething diftina and fpeeifie, but he had been difappointed. The Houfc were indeed told oldie wife and dignified manifeßation of the interctt entertained by the Emperor of Raffia, for the inde pendence of the Continent ; but the Houle had no means of knowing to what extent that Sovereign was ifpoled to co operate Frith us agaitill France, or what exertions he was willing to make for the reftoration of the ancient balance of power in Europe. Asa however, a profpea of further information wet held out; as the Houle were led to believe that &tithe tory documents would be afforded—be bad the left hefitation in agreeing to the Addrefi. Having Rated this generally, the Honourable Gentleman went on to make a few remarks on the language of the Ad, drefs relative to the rupture with Spain. He was ra ther afraid that the language conveyed fomething too mach like in approbation of the rupture, even • before the Houle were in polrefflort of thcalontnntott • necetrary to found an opinion. Perhaps he was mut. taken in this, but the words founded in his ears tery touch as if this were their import, and he was there. .fore anxious to guard againil any idea that the Hottfe gave the flightett faatton either to the rtipttire with Spain or the detention of the Spasith frigates. ThOngh in the ahfence of all documents the Hoofs could nos brand this laft Rep with &nal &approbation, yeLho ee beg lefve to contend that ',pi inedtbet had a. r t eiprifi his feelings on the matter as it now