Star. — London, England, 1801-03-17 00:00:00

was enlivened to centbat, unaided, ultli the rebel, paffion thoule fonietimes triumph c fober judgment,and the dictates of rage fliottld triumph over the fweec impultes of humanity and nicrcy. It was fail that thefe cruelties were jufti fied by a noble perfonage then high in office in the country, but this was a grofs milreprefentation of that Noble Pcrfon's fpcech on that fubjea. He had not attempted to vindicate the cruelties, but • had flared that they were in thme degree excuffible in men ftruggling for all that is dearell to than again[ a band of unprincipled and fhvage rebels, and attributed them to their true cattle. Thus much he confidered it neceffary for him to (late on the fubjea of the cruelties of the rebellion. The duns of a court of civil juflice, or the cflablithment of a Credal contmiaion for the trial of offences, he confidered to be altogether impoilible in the flare in which the country was placed. In many parts o r rlie country the evils were of fuck a formidable nature that nothing was adequate to their fuppref• lion but the operation of martial law. In the county of Limerick the fpirit ofrebellionmanifefted itfelf in the molt dangerous manner during four months. The peaceful inhabitants were compelled to fly from their homes, and to take refuge in the town of Limerick arainft the defperate attacks of the rebels thirfting for blood. During this time the loyal fubjeas who fell into their hands a ere tried by a Court Martial, and their fentences exe cuted by vaft bodies of the peafatury, who affan bled from the different parts of the country during the night, and difperfed at the approach of morn • ing. In fuch a late of diforder as this no perfcn sonld have gone into the box as a Juryman ex cept a rebel, who went there with the exprefs in tendon of acquitting the prifoner, however flagrant the proofs of his guilt. At a time when rebellion vas lb organized and fo fittal, no man who confu ;Led his own talety, and - the fafety of a peaceable part of the community, would have advjted the Go vernment to fend the judges into the different parts of the country for the trial of offences. But what, on the other hand, had been the confequence of the meafure now propofed to be renewed : Under its influence a general fpirit of loyalty had been diffufed, the well-difpofed had been encouraged and proteaed—the rebellious had been difpirited and configned to p'tuifhment. If this then was the etre& of the meafure ; if it was allowed en all hands, that in no cafe the power vetted in the Government had been abufed, what argument could be adduced againft its continuance ?- If the evil which this meafure had tended fo materially to countergt, Rill exiled in certain perfons, and it is proved that it had changed the whole face of the country, by converting a (cent of defolation and death Into one of comparative tranquillity and bappinefs, was not on the other hand its continu ance called for by every principle of liberal policy ? If the tranquillity of the country had not been tranfitory, if it had not been proved by repeated experience that places which this day were calm and peaceful, were the next ditturbed and rebel lious, perhaps, indeed, the meafure might now have been laid allele. But among many inlances of the deceitful appearances of tranquillity, the Rate of Wexford was peculiarly (hiking, where the rebellion broke out before its exilence was even fufpetited. Becaufe, under the operation of this law, confpiracy had been defirco , ekl, becaufe loy alty bad been protected and confidence in the Go vernment fecured, it was too much to expea that difaffetlion was annihilated. It was fullicient that all thofe who were bound to the rebellion by fear, have been afforded that degree of proteaion which has enabled them to exprefs their real fentiments; have acquired that degree of fecurity which has allowed them to return to their allegiance, to their Sovereign, and the laws. He was willing to al low, that in nlany cafes the Judges had, during the ball two years, been enabled to perform their duty. But this was not the queftion before the Houk ; the quelion was, could they have done their duty in the diflanded parts of the country ? It had been Paid indeed by one Right Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Ponfonby) that nothing was fo much calculated to reflore tranquillity to the country, as the adoption of a flftem of mild and humane policy. The Right I-Moumble Gentle man did not mean by this recommendation, to re commend the abandoqusent of the zpeafures on which depended the proteßion of the fubjea. The brit principle of Government was rarely to afford protection to thofe who wilted to rally round its Randard. If then it is proved that the medure in queition has been the means of enabling the people to rally round the landard of loy alty ; if it is proved that it has animated the pod and infpireij the guilty with difmay • it it is proved dig it is a meafure at once calculated: to afford proteaion againft the rebel within and the enemy without, there could Curtly be no firouger motives to in duce the Houle to agree to the continuance of its operation. The likeließ means of encouraging a foreign enemy was that difiraetion should prevail in the country ; and he put it therefore with con fidaice to the Houfe, whether this was a time to abandon a meafure which had gone far to put an end to this diftratftion, which had gone far to effea the complete refforation of whatever is dearell in civil fociety ? Mr. MART'S (of Galway) laid that from the lath Rated by an Honourable Baronet ( Sir Lan. rence Parfons), he thought hiinfelf jufliiied in drawing a conclufion diametrically oppolite to that drawn by the Honourable Baronet. He lays that Iceland is tranquil,and theretbre the mature now pupated is unneceffary. But he (Mr. Martin) tuna be permitted to argue in a contrary fenle : If it he true that Ireland is tranquil, that happy 'fleet is owing to the operation of this Bill ; it therzfore fhonld be continued. The Honourable Gentleman then proceeded to vindicate the Go vernment of Ireland from the imputation of cruel ty thrown upon it, in permitting individuals to be tortured in order to extort confelfrons from them. It might be true that in Come inftances Cowie mea fures were ufed to come at the dircorery of certain enormities; bat it u well known that an order was Wined by Marquis Cornwallis, forbidding any tang like torture from being employed to induce individuals to make confeffions to criminate them hives. He would a& the Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Tay ) who made the afl.ition that torture was refintcj to tier that ropoti:, vbethcr any law in Ireland, aull,,ri:in g mar, to torture another in order to c t .'itch a confdlion from him ? He would again ark him, whether there was any claufe in the relent Pill cialferring filch a power upon the huh Goverurnent ? If the Honourable Gentleman had not male the tirll fertion from ignorance (ignorance lie meant 01 y in this particular), he trailed at leatt be lhonhi and wer kiln as a fcnfible rind rational man. Will that Honourable Gentleman pertift, then, in his relalution of moving a claufe agaiaft a clatife which is trot contained in this Bill ? He furcly adfild not have attended to the contents of the Bill, when he came forward with fuch a notice. Mr. Coo ItTEN AY complimented the frith Mem• bers for the temper, good fenle, and moderation, which they had difplayed throughout the long de bate upon this delicate queftion, and for the in formation they had afforded the Houle to guide their judgments in deciding on it. He was far from denying that martial law might not have been neceffary while the rebellion raged ; but now, when it appeared to be quite luppreled— when it was acknowledged that the Judges went on the circuits as uftal, and that judice was ad miniftered iu the accuftomed forms without any interruption or moleftation, why have recourfe to a meafurc that could tend only to create irritation and (lit - content ? If it was true, as had been flated, that in certain diftriCts neither jurors nor witneffes could Venture to do their duty without expoting their perlimal fafety, why not erea a tribunal in thole parts where tranquillity prevailed, and where the trial might be proceeded on without being liable to the fficulties uit It which, in the di limbed parts, it was fitid to he oh:true - led ? He recolleCted that about thirty years a; ; ii, when be was in Ire land, there were then in that country what were called It Vic Bvs, 1-I,wr:-.9r•0al I:;ys, and Heall-y. Bop: Jurors and witneffe were then alto in timidated ; but what conduit did the Brownlows and Connollys, thole revered names, adopt upon that emergency ? They applied to Lord Town- Iltend, then his Majelty's teprcfentative in that kingdom ;—and what was the relitlt? Was martial law then proclaimed ? On the contrary, did w't ' moderation, wifdom, and lenity, dittinguith the Government of that illustrious Nobleman ? Was it not under that Government that the firft ray of liberty dawned upon Ireland in the palling of the OCtennial Bill ? And has not the grateful recolleftion of the benefits conferred upon Ireland by his adrninifttation, been ever fincc annually celebrated by the Irifh nation with th.tt fervour of honeft conviviality for which the It ifh are fo jultly remarkable ? It has been acknowledged by molt Gentlemen from that country who have fpoken on the prefent qucftion, that there was now bit( one court martial in Ireland: If that was the cafe, could there be any real neceffity for a law to atifolute, ty rannical, and oppreffive as that now propoled ? The wifdom of Marquis Cornwallis had Jane more to wards tranquilizing Ireland than all the trials that had been inflituted by martial law. And indeed,if re [Wring that unfort ulnae countr y to :rang ttilli ey could be the effeCl of any fuch law, why have lent fo great a number of his Majefty's belt troops to do it ?- 1 The Habeas Corpus Ad is alto to continue fufpend ed in Ireland ; and if a Gentleman goes from hence to that country, where is his fecurity for his per fonal liberty ? may he not be tried by a martial tribunal and fhot ? Are there the blefEngs that were held out as retuning from the Union? Was it not promifed that the Imperial Parliament should make no diftinCtion between the two coun tries ? In this, and not only in this, are the Peo ple of Ireland to be difappointed :—the Roman Catholics, it teems, are alto to be difappoiated.— But he anzioufly trulted that no artifice, no in trigue, would be (uttered to prevent that qusftinn from coming before Parliament,and when it did, he as earneftlyhoped that it would be difcuffed with thole feelings of generofity which thould diftinguifh the difpotition of thole of that Houfe towards the people of Ireland. The Honourable Gentleman then proceeded to thew that his Hon. Friend (Mr. Taylor) was perfalli well founded in his affertions, which were abundantly confirmed by the orders which were acknowledged to have been iffued by Marquis Cornwallis. thefe orders ful ly proved the eziftence of the 'senile of torture in Ireland. Then why accufe his Hon. :friend of, having made a grouudlefs affection t - Col-LONGFIELD (Member for Cork) faid, that he had this day received a letter intimating, that two refpetlable and alive Magiaratet Kid been fired at, and with difficulty ;leaped from a horde of banditti. The mail-coachqs wine even now at tacked by bands of rebels, more numerous, and as well armed as the regular troops. Gentlemen might take upon them to fay, that the country was tranquil, but thefe tiets proved the contrary. The only Gentleman who made finch an affertion, with a fluulow of excule, was one (Sir L. Parfons) who admitted that he had nut been in Ireland thefe two months. He would take upon him to fay, that that country was now in a worfe condition than it was on the 23e: of May 11798, the day up on which the halt rebellion broke out. The rebels complained that they were then taken by fUrprife, and that they were forced into aajon before all their forces were in rcadinefs. It was from this circumftance that they dated all their misfortunes; and this was a fillip& on which they ( poke moll freely. They laid that they would never quit their purfuit until they got what they wanted ; and on being :Liked what they wanted, the reply was—a feparation from England. On a review of all thole circumstances, he felt it a matter of Cm-price, that any kith Member mould be found to rife in his place, and to (tate that country to be in a flare of tranquillity. Mr. DAWN3N obferved, that it had been raid, that by this Bill the Houle was called upon to cure A grievance which did not caia. He would not (peak ;it much length upon the matter. but he would deliver his leutiments in as few words as be was able. He lhould be Gary to•approve of the principle of fuch a Bill as this.—He Iliould be for. ry to attempt to jultify filch a principle. The Bill, therefore, in his opinion, could not be julb. Lied ou hs owa mszita. He ins Care slat ;.ord \eh., tli: forwaod,lool to, tevetence for lii!!:r..• l int: to Z!!,• 1-3111171. ),, nis1 .0 111.1 !• be la julliti•ed. I.Vhat th, ii titir•'' 1;111? II it,. of Irelatl, aod that on: , ‘Lit- the • jultification of the meat - ire. It it was ntee!ilir) in the pi•eint Rate tt irelond to pr••leeve t rar quiility Lf ILA: . I .'ottra: y. it ;vas to he jolli:ied ; othent•iti.: it a Mon:Ler ftid, that he reprefeeted a great trt.l pi pithrlis County in Ireland, and if he v..as to he guided by his own knowledge and oblervation, after having mixed and converfed much with his Coon:tents, and received from them a great deal of important in formation, he fhould not hefitatc to fay, that the Bill was not founded on any necerfity whatever : but he was not that fort of Politician, who would vote on the means he had of being perfonally ac quainted with a thing, in toter defiance of any in fwmation which the Debates in that Houfe gave hint. In the courfe of that D e bat e , h t h a d heard' many honourable Members declare, that to their perfonal knowledge, feveral parts of Ireland were in a hate to render this Bill necetraiy, and there fore he litould not oppoie it, although he himfelf did not know of any emergency that required it. He thould, therefore, vote for the Bill, but he was happy to oblerve, that there was a probability of come ports of it being altered in tlfe Committee; filch, for instance, as that of providing that none , of the Parties who were to fit m Judgment on the Coitrts-Martial to be authorized by this Bill,lhould he under the age of twenty-one. This was cer- • tainly a provi which analogy required. In all the 'titles of life that were to be de, ided by a Ju ry, the i.ow required that the Jurors ilvaild be ascent inn: yea t s of age.—Even in the cafe of a man hein: convicted of a crime, Judnieht ttpi•n bilo mutt he atrefted, if it Mould appear that of his jut y was under aye; and it this x‘ as the fZule of Law in cafes ALte the life of the holi vidoal was forfeited by convia:on, it ritt,7l: to lie applied to a Court-Martial, in tanner :L.:: that Coort flvield be made as nearly ana!ogous to L:k ii Jorifpriolenve asthe nature of the thing wotth: mit. H.: hoped, therefore, that due care ‘sould be taken of thi:. ptii.it in the Committee; it was a 'Elea in the preli.nt mode of coniiituting Courts. Martial, which oughlt - to be remedied. having laid halt, he be•:••!_ired it to he undcraoud, that he had no perfonal knowledge of any circumflanees which made this Bill nee.effary, but that he gave Gentlemen credit for linccrity, who declared, upon their knowledge, that it was neceffary, and therefore he thould not oppofe this Bill. Mr. ALEXANDER laid, that the confpiracy in Ire land, and which it was the ohjeel of this Bill to defeat, as appeared by the Preamble, was more extcnfive than, without ilrons evidence, could have been believed. The confpiracy had its Agents through every corner of Ireland, and it was orga nized in an extraordinary manner—The objea of that confpiracy was to leparatc Ireland from Eng land, and to form a connation between Ireland and France.. He felt the evils of attempts to carry fuch an objea into circa, in the unhappy difpori tion of thofe who wifhed it, and in their aftions. He felt that Inch a confpiracy did now exit' to a vall extent in Ireland, though it was not at prefect in its full force ; and, when lo many other Gentle men had Bated the 'weeny of this IA!, " GOD for bid," taid he, " that I fltould with fur any harfh meafures againft the people of Ireland ; they are contrary to my nature, but the controcerfy is be tween us and the Jacobins of Ireland, and we mull rule themor the)- will fl (!rule and then deilroy us." NV I.STV.C.:: A OblerVe4l, that this v:as a mea fure tuf neetlity, arifing from the Rate of Ireland ; and Gentletnnt were not to look into old books upon this fubjeet, but into Let.. as they were auw exhibited to vizrr. The past cf Irchlnd from wh:ch he came, being the northern, was nonquil, butt Lc underitood the tooth tt. he othLruile ; and from the hate of Ireland in that quarter, he was con vinced, from very important and ferious informa tion, that this meafitre was abfolutely ncceifary; and as fuch he thould give it his hearty fupport. He hoped mice the day chest ali the people of Ire land would look back with horror at the whole conduet and principles of thofe who had been the caufe of the calamity that Country had fuffered. Sir F. BURDETT Paid, that he had hitherto lib- Itained from delivering any opinion upon the pre tint queition, being anxious to hear the fenti menu of thole Gentlemen whufe local knowledge lb much better enabled them to fpeak upon it w.. 11 fatisfaelion and convietion to the lioufe. But, after having lue Rowed all the attention in his power on what had fallen from them, he found !heir Ratements and arguinents lie contradietory, that he felt it very difficult to make up his mind upon fuch grounjs. In deciding upon it, he thould therefore rather adhere to thole general principles which had hitherto direeted his political conduet. If, then, he heard that difcontent prevailed, not only in particular parts, but almotl in every part of Ireland, he thought himfelf juilified in infer ring that this general dfifeentnit mutt have a gene nerd c..iy?, and that cauk he looked upon to be Oppretlion. Will this meafure do away the grounds, of d:frontent ; or arc there the effeas that were to hs erpeeted from the Union ? Some II yle the di:luirbances in Irelar.d a Jacobin rebel lion; others call it a Pupa rebellion—an attempt to caul:dill, a Pepin' Hierarchy in tbat-Country ; others again reprefent the jurors and witnelfes as greedy for blood, and reprefent this as a meafurc of knit, to Feta that funguntary difpofition ; while others argue in favour of it, as ore that is to p r o_ ted jurors and witnetfes in the confcientious charge of their duty ? From fuch various flate ments what rational conclufion can be drawn ? For his part he was difpofed to adopt the dillinc• tion made by an Honourable Friend of his on a former occafion, and to recommend having re. courfe rather to isartial fora than to iswfiarlevv. All agree refpeaing the good died produced by the former, and confers that it put down the re bellion and reflored tranquillity. But the drift of their argument would then go to continue this mode ofadminiitering jufliee for ever. But here he Should not be tempted to rip open the bleeding wounds of Ireland, or refer to the cruel tranfac. Lions that had oaten plats is thataitiatteaate coo& t il,hown-er, conter!o# !hat what wa• fail !:•.: of tortore, was lai.l with truth; and on tol.iaJ be rou'i refer to the opinion d..-lieered oil that i"!‘„e.t the ttreatr I :Ind wilca man in the (Mr. Fos), with all his manly eloquence and titrcihie icakining, he c:pald not obt aM of this 11,11C2 to rime to a vote &Jet-mining that torttir WAS wit an unc,,ntiitutional meafure— tbe niosed by him was negatived niter having ken or poled by the Right Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Pitt), who argued in favour of that ri;torous meafttre on the fame grounds on which it was flipported by Lord Clare, in Ireland —aad to the flianic of a Bina Parliament they acquicfced in the onion of a Britifh Minifier who did not blurt: to avow fuck a fentiment. But againh this fentiment and the meafurc it would jirilify, he mull proteli as a meatiire as unjuit as it was viulent. And here he would not liefitate (for he knew he addreited a liberal and eniighterted :111Cm!):v) to prrpote the condal of Bonaparte as a niodA. I low did he reilore tranquillity to La Vendee ?—By firti employing martial force—and nest by retorting to lenity and mercy. Thefe &Add be the tics that ibonld hind England and Ireland together—on thefe principles lhould the Union he ccmentA ; principles far better than a mere parchment of Union would ever dilate. Let the Houle, therefore. endeavour to place Ireland in fuck a flate, as not to compel her to look for relief from France ; if they are fo inclined, they I will begin rot with giving her martial law, which has been fo ..bufed, but by treatink h.r with a ;Mk jullace and a little mercy, ss hien the has hitherto not known : if Inch he not the difpolitiim of the Houf'e, tbey may have to make the mclan. chol y h cflenion that they will be sating in the Uni- Ld Parliament of a difunited country. Mr. PIT rue to declare that no Push opinion as that imputed to l:nn be the llcno;:rabl..! Gentle man I elparin_t ti!e v!'e of te.rture had been deliver. e 3 by lion on the oreation alluded to. So far from it, he was not even relent at the debate in whic4 that qoeflion was di:chifed. Sir F. Buitos-r-r tail, that to the belt of his re. collection he had heard the Right Honourable. Gen. tlernan argue foinewhat to that effea, but if thele were not his fntiments, he now rejoiced to learn it. The Sri. tociot took occalion to oblerve, how ir re.;tilar it was to refer to pail debates, and hoped it would be' abflain:d from. Mr. SHERIDAN Laid that no reference was made to the debates of the prefent lemon, but to thofe even of a different Parliament. Mr. Pirr obferved it was fill more extraordi nary, for the allufion is made nit to what paired on a former feflion, or a former Parliament, but to opinions which never have been uttered. Mr. SHERIDAN contended that the Right Ho nourable Gentleman had no reafon to triumph in the mistake, for it he had not exprefred the fend ment imputed to him in that precifc debate, film. thing very timilar had been delivered by him on other ominous. Lord De EtaoyiEar. role to give his moll de iupport to this meafure, which he conficlered ac eil:ential to the fecurity of Ireland, and, in his opinion, it would have been fortunate for Ireland, it recourfe had .bcen had to it at an earlier period. Ile would not have troubled the Houfe, but that tome obfervations had fallen from time Gentle men, which be could not flax to pats unnoticed. An ki-.nourable Bartnot had propoled, that there humid be but ore Law for the two countries. Now, before the fame La - .r could be applicable.to both, Countries, it would be necetrary either to create a Rebellion in Englar :1, or to put down thzt which c vitted in Irehind.:—Other Gentlemen had declared, that there were no eitt:rts-ma:tial Cuing in Ireland, and Jw:ors and IC $ could di:char7e their ditty he etathl by no means afTent to thefe alitaiionq, for he c. aid .hat:, not cue but fifty inhances of perfons being murdered for hay. lag faithfully performed their duty as Jurors or Witneffes ; and as to courts-martial, they had al way-scot:Mined to tit.—lt thould be recollected, tliat perfons could only be tried by the Courts of Law twice a-year, as there were only two Circuits, but the filety of Ireland required that off, ndcrs of the nature that Ireland was infefted with, fhould be fpcedily brought to junice.—With relpat to the tranquillity which was font:fed to exill in Ireland, he could only fay, that in July Lift they burnt his !mufc to the ground ; he fuppofed they intended it as a compliment to him, for it was upon his hirth•day. His l.ord(hip then proceeded to hate other intlances of difturbances and infurretnion.— Thout Iron a quedion of this kind he was cf opinion that great deference ought to be paid to the opit-.7 In; of Gentlemen coming from Ireland, yet he was far from withing that Ireland thould legihate for h:rfelf, hr one of the greaten advan tages that Ireland, in his opinion, would derive from the Union, would be her having the benctit of Englith Legiflature. His Lordlhip concl u d e d with Laying, that fome Gentlemen of this Country Rill perfitied in Rating Ireland to be in a tranquil nate ; now if a few of thufe Gentlemen would pro mife to go over to Ireland and relish: in any part helhould mention, he would vote with them againtt the Bill. Mr. T. Joars conndered the Bill as highly un ell and irr petit ic. It V... 11 part of afy Ron by v..b;cll Minitiers rcduecd the country to death's doer, and nolo; the Ij Rent w.ts fpeedily abandoned, ruin •,vtot The quettion was then loudly called for, and the '.•:li cleared. The Howe, however, did not divide.. The Motion, sv: unlerfhrd, wog:Ili-era to, dm Bill was reAd time, and orducd to be committe,:. pr T: , 17 r.nr LI 111 IRrLiND. The ltepcs7t r ins the OM 7e of Nlaller ~1 ::•i.t rrel.trkt, r • :s brcii2;lt. On the Moti.in •'. • amcndmc:t:s be r.ad fe. cond time, Mr. M. A. TAILCIR rofc, and cerfitred the fill in rzry fevers. The tvhulc tran t ietion h e denominated a job. Two Noble Lords. who had no claim for comp:M . .olml, were to receive the pro mifed reward fur their vote on the quetion of Union. The pretence was Slimly. 'There wasn9 occafton for tic Chancellor cant% over tu ;his