Star. — London, England, 1824-02-04 00:00:00

domestic affairs all that is prosperous; and if we take a view of nut foreign relations, we hare as much reason to be satisfied. But, my Lords, these subjects have been so well animadverted upon by the Noble Eat', that it becomes unnecessary for me to trespass on your Lord ships' time with what must be a repetition. However, there is one 'topic in his . Majesty's most gracious Speech which it may be allowed me to say a few words upon, as being mote immediately connected with that portion. of the empire - To Which ;Colludes. Ireland, my Lords, I imaginelitoraiWasis been t Onsidered difficult to go• vern s and ato aware that in speaking on the subject, some caution is requisite; ':hut I trust that in under taking to make a' very' few . dlsservations, no feelings of party spirit will operate upoil.me mind ; and I would take this opportunity of exhorting Noble Lords, when the affairs of Ireland are under discussion, to preserve their understandings unshackled from all prejudice. It is quite obvious, my Lords, that there are existing causes for the unhappy state of Ireland—many of them far beyond the contronl of any Ministers that ever yet guided tint political helm of this great nation.. The first grand evil is perhaps to be found in the moral state of the people—a people, I may here observe, without speaking ton much in the superlative, who from their natural endowments ate capable of being made a strength and an ornament to any country. But, my Lords, this fine population does not possess the advan tages which the more happily circumstanced peasantry on this side of the Channel have for centuries enjoyed ; and therefore great allowance should be made for my unfortunate countrymen, who have many difficulties to encounter. It has often struck me how much aware they are of their own deficiencies and wants, and how much alive they are to'the advantages that must arise from a liberal system of education, and a free circula tion of the Scriptures ; but, mylords, this last blessing, I lament to say, is prohibited nearly throughout Ire land, and consequently the grossest bigotry and most abominable superstitions prevail in every part, para lysing both the mind and body, and leaving the wretched creatures a prey to the machinations of every designing man hostile to British connection and to the Established Religion of the Realm. However, upon these points, it is not necessary to say any more at present, though it may be allowable here to remark that the Noble Marquis at the head of the Irish Government has more obstacles to surmount than perhaps he ever could have foreseen, but from which he has never flinched ; on the contrary, he has devoted his splendid talents and utmost exerticms to overcome them, and I trust in the end he may. succeed. Your Lordships cannot be aware, I ap prebasidose the power which is brought forward tothwart the Constitutional efforts'of the Government, and to per. vent the understandings of the people, by which they are kept in a complete state of slavery. In fact, my Lords, there is to be found in Ireland, what may be fairly denominated an " Imperiu»i in Iniperic," which must be got under before we can expect to see that portion of the Empire what it might become from its natural advantages and the fine qualities of its natives. My Lords, the population. of Ireland is imMense, and, generally speaking, without employment; which tre mendous evil, for tremendous it is in its effects, is mainly to be attributed tar a want of resident Laridlords. The property annually drawn from Ireland amounts,- upon a calculation tci•alsove two millitsosi. t . and the ab sentees, who occasion this eriormoirs raui, mil be considered under two heads—the one (if I. may be al lowed to use the expressions) legitimihe, and the other illegitimate. The first, possessing large hereditarf proe perties in England, together with their Irish - estates, j have a fair apology for non-residence; but they should I consider that they have a duty to perform, and should therefore make occasional visits to Ireland, and lay out a portion of their Irish revenues in giving employment to their poor tenants by a variety of wot ks, and in the encouragement of manufactures, which in the end would materially benefit themselves, by the improve ment of their estates; but, above all, my Lords, they should be most particular in the selection of those per sons whom they appoint to the responsible sittiation of agent, who have SC much within their power, and to whom their employers musts look for information, and that upon all points. By some few these matters are at tended to; in the very small number I feel happy in recognising some Noble Lords, who require no advice from me ; but I could wish it might be in their power to prevail upon any of theii friends, who are in similar circumstances with themselves, to act as they do. My Lords, we now come to the second description of absentees, who (not having any hereditary properties in England) have in general no fair apology for deserting their country, and should therefote be exhorted to re turn, and lay out a part at least of their incomes among those from whom they derive them ; and thus make themselves uselul and of more consequence than ever they can expect to he while resident in a distant part of the Empire, or, perhaps, out of it altogether. By the bye, I would here state, and I do so with great plea sure, that a short time previously to my leaving Ireland, I heard of the return of some who had not been resi dent on their estates for many years. I trust their ex ample may have a beneficial effect. Ilasing said this much respecting our absentees, I woulsi bete observe, that of late much has been done for Ireland, much is doing, but much, very much, remains to be done; and I am free to confess that I fed the utmost confidence in the good wishes of his Majesty's Ministers, and in their anxiety for the improvement and ameliora tion of Ireland; but here I mutt decidedly repeat, that much is beyond their cotatotal, and much depends upon our being true to ourselves and attentive to the wants of our tenantry. My Lords, it is a moo pleasing and encou raging circumstance to observe the very general spirit of inquiry which now prevails throughout England as tb the state of Ireland, and the best mode for effecting a radical change in the habits of the people. This op pears to have been principally excited by the vi.itation which it pleased the ALMIGHTY to inflict upon the land in the year 1822, and which, though at the time a most severe scourge, yet must be considered as a blessing, in asmuch as it has drawn forth the philanthropic feelings of England in a manner never to be forgotten, and has ' done more to eradicate old and inveterate prejudices than any act of the Legislature ever could do. Indeed, my Lords, Were it nut for the inflammatory speeches of certain orators scarcely a shade of them would remain. However, one lasting benefit has arisen from this spa it of inquiry, in the formation of several most useful insti tutiont ; and among the number I shall take leave to motion tine as being likely to have much influence; it is designated "The British and Irish Ladies' Society for Improving the Condition of the Female Peasantry in Ireland, " and is under the patronage of two of our 11- lustt ious Princesses and a most amiable and Noble Lady, whose influence I have no doubt will stimulate the ex ertions of those Ladies, who have influence, on both sides of the Channel. My Loriip, thevrincipal.lbje3 of the Society is to' 'we emploftse • • to the female sentry in V* spinni end - 1,612de" ' . 'ng oT flax, and' I in ittentiolt topers al pd dam c and economy.P . The.firs ill Nnuch betnifit our great staple. manufactsee, phd letith together • sliest rapidly improve the condition of the poor creatures for whose relief this Society has been established, and who, heretofore, have been nearly, if not altogether, neglected, and, in their domestic habits, more degraded than can be imagined in this happy land; but as civilization advances this must cease, and the women . will . have their proper sta tion in society. Having thus,..my Lords, taken a very cursor 1 view of some matters in Ireland, I would again entreat Noble Lords to meet all questions upon Irish business with candour, and studiously to avoid in their speeches any expressions that may tend to induce the people to imagine that.their wretchedness proceedsfrom the Government under which they live, which in truth is not the case, but must be looked for nearer frame, and will continue till we find it our own interest, indepen dently of higher principles, to cheriih our peasantry, place them on a level with their British fellow-subjects, and thus rescue them from the power of those dema gogues who would urge them into acts that must even tually bring destruction and perdition on themselves and their families. My Lords, it now becomes my duty to apologize for having encroached upon your Lord ships' time by the introduction of mattes that may not appear altogether relevant ; but I trust some allowance will be made for the feelings of an Irishman, who has taken the opportunity of speaking on a subject that he knows is constantly misrepresented, and too frequently brought forward in the spirit of party. The Marquis of LANSDOWN did not rise to in terrupt the general satisfactions of the House, nor to dis sent from many of the topics which had been urged by the Noble Mover of the Address, and the Noble Viscount who seconded it. It must afford great satisfaction to the country to learn that our improved state arose from the operation of natural causes. Haiing felt formerly the weight of the public burthens in depressing the community at large, but never once despairing of re. novation by the adoption of proper means, he now saw with unmingled satisfaction that portion of the Speech which admitted, with signal fairness, that the reduction in taxes, with increased freedom of trade, had accom plished so much good. The removal of restrictions on the freedom of trade, although long resisted by 'mein. dice, had succeeded in producing the renovation of trade beyond what even the most sanguine of its ad vO - had anticipated. The relaxation for instance of those restrictions which fettered the trade between Great Britain and Ireland was now petitioned fur by the par ties once most inimical to all relaxations; so awake were the people of the North of Ireland to those advaatages which' had resulted from the removal of restrictions in only one year. Here then was evidently one operating cause of our improvement, which ought never to be forgotten. The next proxithate cause, the reduction of taxes, was an immediate relief, by setting Free expendi ture and increasing demand. With respect to our foreign relations, it might rather have become his Majesty's Ministers to have deprecated an allusion to the termina tion 6f the war in Spain, instead of just noticing the situation of herformer Colonies. The example of the Prench Government went to affect the right of all inde pendent States to improve their own Constitutions in 'arty way. When they saw that countries could be invaded for the, purpose, and under the pretence, of putting down. Constitutions, and that a military occupation was consequent on such proeeedings, it was difficult to know, judging from the Speech, whether his Majesty's Minis ters did or did not approve of such measures, or whether the predicament of Spain were not gratifying to them. He thought, when speaking upon that subject, that it would have been becoming in Ministers to have put into the mouth of his Majesty other language than that which could only be described as an attack upon the institutions of a country, and prevent its people from obtaining their freedom, from which only could result that degree of perfection in their system of Govern ment of which it was susceptible. Ministers professed their dislike to Ultraism, and yet they expressed their friendship for the most odious and pernicious of Ul traism—that which was founded upon military power. It s% as the duty of Ministers, as advisers of the Crown and guardians of the interests of the country, not to be silent upon that point, but to declare that a great act of injustice had been done, that the law of Europe, the law of nations, had been departed from. Let not Mi nisters say that that infringement upon the rights of a nation would end there: on the contrary, a hundred similar acts of injustice would follow, because one had succeeded. Let them not imagine that a state of things could not arise by which this country could be affected, and that the state of things established in Spain was too remote to call for the expression of our feelings upon it. After the overthrow of Bonaparte, it was de clared that the independence of the different countries of Europe, and the happiness of the people, were fixed upon a solid basis ; on the contrary,' we bad since found that the consequence of the defeat of Bonaparte was to place the fate of Europe in the hands of four or five Kings, who had exercised their power in an arbitrary, indeed a tyrannical manner. Could he be contradicted when he should say, that in no country under their do-1 minion, did there remain a portion of independence? Was there a State in Europe which had not felt the i nfinence of those Monarchs, and of the principles on which they acted, and which might not be called upon to alter or abandon its Constitution, to waive its rights, and suffer itself to be controuled by those despotic Powers, even at the dictates of their caprice? He did not feel him self called upon by the statements in the Speech which had that day been delivered, to declare that the situa tion of Europe was satisfactory. In many parts of the Continent there existed grounds of complaint against those wept Powers ; even the once independent and pa cific Republic of Switzerland had been subjected to their interference—an interference of a nature which, if directed against this country,we should Teem outrage ous and insulting. Was it not an attack virtually upon this country—was it not an attempt to establish a sys tem of coercion, to take away the independence of ano ther State? and in doing so did it not destroy that principle upon which this country bad always acted, that of maintaining the balance of power by supporting the weak against the strong ? If the state of Europe were such as he had described—and if the many minor States were to be subjected to the orders of the few greater Powers which he had described, hOw could he : be called upon to express his satisfaction at such a po • sition ? But he turned with pleasure and real satislac -1 tion to the liberal principles upon which, with respect • to the South American States we had begun to act. Ile , saw with no common degree of satisfaction the pi in , ciple of free trade at length acknowledged and acted 1 upon ; because upon the cultivation of commerce, upon Oat ireat-psi9c , , Of the glObt wh at country to nip' mor nations , o r lie' fel t taken ria•th at p; hidtis'ought nt they had genie 1 r Itiejt pared to avoid; but he could not help regretting That that step had not been taken at a much earlier period. by which this country would have manifested that which_ it was equally its duty and its interest to do the right and the disposition to act independently. He felt great satisfaction at the free and fearless conduct cf the United States of America upon that subject, which was at once becoMing its character and its power. There was.jn it no dissimulation, no ambiguity, no hesitation ; the sentiments of its Government were avowed with a candour and a firmness becoming its situation and its strength ; and believing that in every point of view it was important that the interests and the independence of those rising States should be protected, he was yet to learn why, in their infant state, we had not interposed between them and the blows of their enemy the shield which it was our duty to interpose between a weaker and a stronger . Power. Connected with the systematic interference with the liberties of every State in Europe, by the great Continental Powers, appeared to be a most iniquitous system of exclusion with respect to trade, coupled with a determination to exclude the manufactures and the pro duce of this country from the whole continent of En rope, as far as lay within their power. From that cir cumstance an additional motive.for our cultivation of a connection with the South American States might be deduced. When it should be known that linty years ago the population of North America was only three millions ; that it is at present ten millions; that accord ing to the latest census the population of South Ame rica amounts to sixteen millions, independently of the Brazils, which contain four millions; taking then those sixteen millions, and calculating their increase of popu lation upon the same ratioas that of the United 'States, it might be expected that in forty years the population of South America would exceed fifty millions : and when it should be further known that that population was a population of a peculiarly consuming character with re ference to European manufactures, of which it yaas cal culated that each individual consumed to the amount of £2 sterling per annum ; when all these things should be known, would the importance of our friendly con nection with, and our protection of, those infant but rising States be denied ? Yet, in order to obtain all the advantages that might thence result, he would hot con sent to abandon that high and honourable course which this country ought to follow ; at the same time he de clared that he had yet to learn what were the reasons that prevented us from having embraced an earlier, and consequently a more favourable moment for taking that step so necessary to the credit and honour of the country. But Great Britain was not only interested in the establishment of the independence of the South American Governments, but it was equally her interest, indeed it became her duty, to see that it should be esta blished as early as possible, and that it be firmly and immoveably fixed. On that part of the Speech he had felt it his duty thus to speak his sentiments. There re mained many other topics, but which did not so impe ratively call for notice. One of these was a subject al luded to by a Noble Lord who had preceded him, with whom he agreed, that it was a topic of peculiar deli cacy; and he further fully concurred with that Noble Lord, that with reference to that subject muchought to be done, yet, that as little as possible should be said. On the othersubjects touched upon in the Speech, many other opportunities and occasions for discussink ;hem would occur; he should not, therefore, now dilate*Ppo them. But there was a subject of peculiar interest and import ance on which he could not be silent—he meant Ire land. He fully agreed with the Noble Lord who had seconded the Address, that a good deal had hien 'done towards effecting her tranquillity; but he wished that the Noble Lord at the head of the Government of that count; y could have held out a prospect of a remedy for evils the root of which lay much deeper than wasgenerally believed. On two points connected with that' coun try, namely, tithes and police, he was free to admit that much benefit had been conferred upon Ireland by the Acts of the last Session. With respect to tithes he agreed with the Noble Lord that a great opening had been made, and an approximation between the parties pre viously opposed had been effected—he trusted those de sirable efforts would be found to result more generally; yet he hoped that other and additional measures would be taken to ensure the happiness and tranquillity of that important portion of the Empire. He had now nothing further to say ; it was not his intention to move any amendment to the Address ; however, he could not but lament that Ministers had not more broadly and candidly avowed the sentiments by which he was sure they were actuated. •the Earl of LIVERPOOL.—After the very able manner in which the different topics referred to in the Royal Speech had been treated by the Noble Lord who had moved the Address, and the no less able speech of the Noble Seconder, lie should 'not have 'felt himself called upon to follow them on those various points ; hut as the Noble Marquis who had just sat down had thought proper to advert to those topics, he (the Earl of Liverpool) could not suffer the Muse to come to a vote upon the subject without replying to the arguments of the Noble Marquis. On the first point, he could satisfy their Lordships that there existed no difference of opi nion between him and the Noble 'Marquis. He would say, not for the purpose of declamation however, that no former period of this country's history could be fixed on in which it had enjoyed a greater state of pro sperity than it did at present—(Hear, hear, hear).— ' He fully concurred with the Noble Marquis, in rejoicing that the distress which had existed in agriculture had been removed by the operation of natural causes alone. Noble Lords would recollect how his Majesty's Minis ters had been pressed for legal enactments to secure that very desirable object; it was therefore a most ma terial and important circumstance, that the recovery from distress of the agricultural interest had been el fected, not by Acts of Parliament, but that it had grown out of natural causes only. It was well .known to the country, and had been most ably stated by the Noble Mover of the Address, that during the arduous struggle in which we had been engaged we could not have made the-extraordinary exertions we did, and which were' so imperatively called for, but at immense - expense, nor without incurring a great weight of debt,• the- pressure of which had been afterwards revercly felt. But similar effects had always ken expel ienced, even aftet the most successful wars. But even the expenditure lions witith those efforts proceeded had biought compensation to the country, for some of its amount, As had been proved by the Accounts laid upon the table at dif- I Imes, by which it Was proved that ill.' ing n•the agricultural and other interests of the lad increased in a most extraordinary degre e . ,at great expenditure was stopped—when a mber of our Army and our Navy had been ick upon thevopelaejon— e hen the eemand is Tinkles of-produce ''and mamifactthe tad emu', ,it' was natural - to expect thargtta and extensive distress2nstneverty sheets' be felt. But inde. ,pendently of the distresses ogre* attendant upon a 'Transition fi om a state of war to one ortteace, there as another difficulty which this country had to encounter --the return,to metallic . ctirrency. Although.lie s kel t convinced that the great and successful struggle in which we had engaged could not have been made with: out a suspension of cash payments, yet he felt alenAlja t it was our duty to return to a metallic currency ::.seDqe, as possible, and that this should he effected by preserv. ing also the national faith. We had recovered Irons those great and distressing effects. We had returned to a metallic currency without a breach of faith With the public creditor. He thanked GoD that we ha I 's o returned to it, and that we had not only survived our distresses, but that we had attained to a height of pica. sperity 'never before eqiialled. Our conduct thrnuelieet the whole of those affairs shewed that the integrity we had maintained—the justice of the principles, on %%Melt we had acted—the good faith we had maintained with the pablic•creditor, had enabled us to overcome all our difficultiei, and trade and agriculture had completely recovered —(Hear, lieai ). He had felt himself carer upon to allude to this point, because he thoughtitoo mesa could not be said upon it. • Although he did not coht>. der it necessary to follow. the Address through all its branches, yet to that part of it which speaks of our.k. ternal state being more satisfactery than that of our fo re,ign relations, and patticularly irises reference to a sob. ject so much discussed during ;he last Session of Pael4. /Ilan (the invasion of Spain), it might be necessary for ltin't to advert, it would perhaps be sufficient for him to Say, that everything Ullith had seen then stated by him . . 'self and the-Noble Friends *rho sat near him, had been 'more than proved by the events that had since occurred )near).—fle had deprecated the invasion of Spaiu, not merely on the abstract:principle that no court try had a right to interfere in the internal affairs Of end thee, but that lie thought Ftitnce had made out no case frir her* particular interference. lie had stated :rho that Spain ought to. be left to herself; butt in stating so, he had added, that when the daiager of• interference dill arise, it was the duty of those at the head of the Spanislt Government tOmakeconcessions—not to France, but to Spain herself, by consenting to such a modification of the Constitution as would reinsure the objections against it. We gave out advice' to . that - effect ; and he would . welds those who had tlietrbeen of the popular party in SPaie, whether they *ere not now sorry that they had not taken; that advice'? Was there any 'roan who, viewing the manner in which the French army had been received,ln Spain, would now say that 'he was sorry we had not interfered? for it was now evident that the:grent mass of the Spanish people were opposed to the Censtitutiee, for they had hailed the French sohliers as deliverers.— There were no people so jealous of foreign interference as the Spaniards.. In his (Lord Liverpool's) speech last April he said, that however much the SpaniaedChatea foreigners, they hated the Consataitionintich mot ; . .eed it had since been proved, that the Constitutional' party in Spain was very small when compared with theme lation of that country. He considered the conduct of the French Generals, the French Rulers, and aboveall of that illustrious Prince who was placed at the head of the invading armii, to have been mild, moderate, and just; for lie (Lord Liverpool) would say, however 'he might have condemned the invasion of Spain on.poinci ple, yet would he say of that Pi ince, that the ability, moderation. and discietion which marked his career in that country, gave great hopes of his governing with eqUal talents 'and dispositions that co miry over which it was not too much to say he was destined pro-. bably, and of right, to reign. The efforts of France had been directed to check the spirit of ultraism, and to assist chat party which in Spain was opposed to that spirit; and with respect to Or non-interference to pre. vent such results, he would. declare that he had nb more notion of sending 'British -bayonets to make peo ple free against their. will, than he had to assist in con ! , tinuing them in slavery—( Cheers): He came next.to a subject of considerable importance. The Noble Lord had said, that he did not disapprove of what , had' been said in the Speech, but wished that more had been said ; 'but in a general expose of that nature, he (Lord Li verpool) could not see what more could be said. Dur ing the last war, their Lordships would recollect a con siderable difference of opinion had existed whether we should embark fully in the cause of Spain, by assisting her to expel the French, or whether we should limit our assistance to her South American possessions, and leave the cause of Spain to herself. The latter was not the course followed by this country. We entered heert, and hand into the war in Spain, and by the efforts, the talents, and the brilliant achievements of his Noble Friend near him (the Duke of Wellington), the contest .was ultimately brought to-a fortunate conclusion. Be fore that war, had finished, the Spanish South American. Colonies had' declared their own independence; then, also, we offered. to Spain our :mediation; but which she, unfortunately for herseil, declined ; had she done otherwise—had she availed herself' f our proffered me diation—she might have saved half • her Colonies . : by following a different course she had lost the whole. This point naturally led him to that part of the Speech which referred to the South American Governments; we have taken the first step towards establishing a last, ing connection with them, by sending out Consuls thi ther. The object of the Speech which their Lordships had heard that day was to do away the impression that we were under obligations to Spain, or to,any other country or Power, not to take any step towards recog nising the independence,of the South American States ; we arc toially flee and unfettered, and we postpone the recognition of those States only until we shall be assuted that the Governpients of them are fixed and. settled ;, and the priticifat Obletts . of the Commissioners whom we have sent out are to ascertain and report to Govern menreverything connected with the state of those coun tries; .for however independent those States may be ac j;rcio, there must - and will be felt ambiguity and uncertainty respecting them, until the Governments. shall be settled. On another subject (our West India Colonies) he hoped we should do all that we owed to all the great - interests involved—that which we owe to the Negro population—that which we tree to those whom we hid encouraged to become settlers in the Colonies — that which we ewe to this country—in short, to all the great. interests concerned, that we should not discuss that subject with heat or interaperance—(Hear, hear). With respect to Ireland, everything said by the - Noble Marquis was entitled peculiarly to consideration. For ciple, with the inha • nwof any iparigr ferent tint( rhatever, must de le the power_ of this the last win i ?, liaintaitethlt 'it that in its country hi Ins which shp h hi rto lid. , t . l /When tha satisfied irth rst p Ilkt ha n great num aath, be *as n 1 / 4 d •to , Kr that, i- thrown ba• riot to have none titer ; indeed' he hoped (malipti! rat flier - than : . [lfel'fbiln Sel ties' were rpre-* stMenti7c -1 1 9 1 1 • • L • I I • • • • • • • 1 S. 1 "