Star. — London, England, 1818-05-20 00:00:00

wire tor pmce • I 'n I'ls t hree years would have n • • tin no w to be the term fixed for t he dum etfutlo.l:F:triiarnent; but the events in 1715 made the ote-,,,rent refuse to trust the people with the exer . he e' ective franchise—( hear.)—ln his • ~• it was an act of extreme injus tice and im rink te b r • fin Parliament , under the circumstances even 5 : tr e 1711, to have pas s ed the Septennial Act. Vast t referring to Locke, or any other authority, i.i e t he evident, that no Parliament could have th e pricer of prolonging the period of that trust inch the people had committed to them. One of the reasons given at the time, for the passing of the cep::onial Act was, that tiering the first year the 4,•,e. time of the house of Commons was occupied i deciding on the cases of contested elections. That mon now no longer misted. The Grenville Act had completely put a n end to it. But one of the re:lige:it arguments in favour of returning to Triml y:al Parliaments was the immense increase in the in thence of the Crown. It had indeed been said, that Stir increased influence of public opinion was a suffi cient counterpoise to the influence of the Crown ; but although he beheld with the utmost satisfaction the increased power of public opinion, still he thought some more absolute check was necessary to the in fluence of the Crown. The corruption s existed from the exercise of the influence of the Crown in Elections, was perfectly notorious--(Hear, hear.) — It was, indeed, impossible not to be struck with the ertraordinary situation in which the House was placed when it was obliged to chastise persons of an inferior rank whrawere guilty of interference in Elec tions, while greater culprits in the same way were allowed to go unpunished and unchecked. In such cases it was not the offence itself which the House punished. but the ignorance of the unfortunate indi viduals who did not conform the manner of their in terference to the statutable mode. Till Parliament ar e reformed these abuses would never be rectified ; and the first and most essential reform was to shorten 1;a duration of Parliaments. The people had been mobbed of Triennial Parliaments by the usurpation of ewe House. The occasion of the Septennial Act being temporary ought to have been met by a temporary remedy. The people had an absolute right to have Trienaial Parliaments restored. That they would be hereind by shortening the duration of Parliaments, was proved by experience, for it was always found, that in the last Session of a Parliament, the interests tithe people were most attended to. It had been his midietune, during the time he had sat in the present Parliament, to have generally voted with the =no sty. lad to be therefore turned out into the lobby on diri.ior...;—(Laughter.) On such occasions, during eke .Ir,t Sessions of the Parliament, on looking round, he rec:i b mized none but the well known faces of his frand, hut lately, on several such occasions, on looting round upon those who were his companions, he was surprised to see many new faces--thear.)-- He had leen so astonished, that he sometimes feared le had committed some fatal mistake, and taken the rd: of the question he intended to oppose—(Hear, itar, hrlr! and a laugh.) He was convinced that rery Member in that House, on all occasions, voted "IN couscien:intly ; but it did, somehow or other, happen, that Gentlemen voted very differently frr. their usual practice when they approached to tie period of elections (hear, hear, hear!) He thence inferred, that the most beneficial effects would result from shortening the duration of Parliament. He again repeated, that the House could h ,ve no right to prolong itself. He did not deny that they had the power, but they could not possibly have the right to exercise such a power. He concluded by moving for leave to bring in a Bill to repeal the 2el Act of Geaey L chap. 98, commonly called the Septennial Act—(hear, hear, tear.) Sir SAMUEL ROMILLY rose, and said that he the* this motion could not he opposed on the ground that there would be any danger in agreeing to it. The subject had been so often discussed, that he was not surprised that Members were not disposed to debate it again ; but there was one argument on which he wished to say a very few words. Did any one suppose, that in the first year of the next Session the Ministry would be so well disposed to yield to the wishes of the people, o r the Member s of the house to resist the encroachments of the Ministry ? Le more he reflected on tle subject, the more he I satisfied that it would be a great advantage for the ration, if it had more frequent opportunities of electing its Representatives. Mr. W SMITH agreed with both the Honourable Gentlemen who had preceded him, and hoped there would b e , a t l east f or once , a public expression of sentim respecting tile grossest violation of trust which had ever been committed. He meant the act of a Parliament, which, having been elected for three Years, had voted itself for seven. There might be reasons at the time for prolonging their duration, but there was none for the continuation of such an abuse. Mr. BROUGHAM approved of the object of the Motion, hut could not agree with what had fallen f rom the HunourablGentleman. He would not stop to inquire how the Septen nial Bill h a d brought i n , b ut i t was evidentthat lu this countryd been been saved from Poperyand arbitrary Government by the Whi p,s, who ad brought in that Bill. Asto the right or a Parliament elected for three years to rote an extension of its duration slight hi s H onoura bl e Friend d eny it seven, th l e en' excrt a i s on well of 'my other legislative powe stne would the Union vith Ireland - and Scodand r be . end, because the Parliaments of those countries would not have had Tle right of surrendering their separate existence.— With respect to the Septennial Act itself, wheth er it :ad been we ll to al low wh a t h a d b een a d opte d as a remedy to survive so lung the necessity of the case, a different question, and the vote which he was give for the motion, would show that he tursidered ric h con d uct to be wr ong. Huuse then divided— For the Motto* AgL44t it - Majority 4$ 11? -75 ALIEN DILL. Lord CASTLEREAGH moved that the House re. rive itself into a Committee on the Alien Bill. ?cit. BENNET complained, that on the second ! e2 ding of that Bill not one of the Crown Lawyers 'ought it his duty to say a word in answer to ` 4.P. speeches on his side of the House. The question '44 whether Ministers had abased their power in the execution of this measure, but how many persons prevented from caning to Mis country ? It had been settled that ourAnsbassadors abroad should give no passports to individuals who had not first ob tained one from their own - Governments. If those regulations still existed, he did not wonder that few persons had been sent out of the country. He under sfood that it was customary for many foreigners to apply to this Government to kilt'st whether they should be allowed to reside' amongst us if, they came. over? He wished to know with whomAt stand so di cide who were proper persons to be admitted ? If it: was with the Noble Lord at the head of the Foreign Department, he had no difficulty in stating that he was the most improper person to form such a deci sion, for that Noble Lord was the greatest dupe in existence, and if he were not satisfied with the appel lation of dupe, be must rest contented whh a harsher term. The House were told that the same reasons which had originally led to the passing of the Bill still existed ; but was there any comparison between the stormy period of the French Revolution and the present ? He lamented the degradation of character which such a measure would inflict on the country. He thought that it was stipulated in the Treaty Of the Holy Aliance, that our Police should be submit ted to the police of the arbitrary Governments of Europe, and he bad no doubt that it was in the power of the French, Spanish, or 4ussian Ministers to come to the Fogign Office, and claim as a part, the continuation oracle Alien He then alluded to the case of Mr. Befort, who had been sent out of the country as one of peculiar hardship, and conclu. ! ded by opposing the motion. • Mr. ELLISON defended the Noble Lord 'at the head of the Foreign Department, who was entitled to pstblic gratitude for his great services, and for having 'terminated the most tremendous contest, in which this country had been engaged, by a glorious and advantagequs peace. He considered Ministers justified, from iheirtOnduct„ . in being again entrusted with the pOsters of the propeird measure. Mr. BATHURST contended, that the causes which induced the House to pass this Bill since the war, continued to exist. It was . very different to receive incendiaries who were still forming new in trigues to disturb the world; or to welcome peaceful artisans, driven, as in a former age, from their homes by religious persecution. Unless the House were convinced that none of the former dangerous men remained, there were sufficient grounds to renew the Bill, which would not be exercised against the known hospitality of this country, except in cases of neces sky. As to the objection of the Hon. Gentleman that the measure had prevented many persons from coming to this country, that was the very object of .the Bill. It was intended to deter the mischievous, and to shew that none but the peaceful and the in dustrious would be welcome. As to Mr. Befort, he had first come to this country as a picture dealer.— Having been found guilty Of practices which endan gered the security of ,the country, a passport had given him at his awl request, on condition that he should never =min to.ehia country. He had since returned several thigh' and had- at last , -been sent away under" the provlsieris of the Alien Bill. The Right Hon. Gentleman then stated positively, that the introduction of the measure had not been under taken at the suggestion of any Foreign Minister. But until the effect of the late revolutions had com pletely ceased, it would not be proper to suffer French Refugees to settle-here, without giving to Govern ment some controul over them. Mr. LYTTLETON defended the conduct of Mr. Befort. He did not mean to deny that Government had the right of sending him away, but they ought to have given him more time. As to the present Bill, no reason could be given in its favour that could bear scrutiny. It injured the character and the interests of the nation, because it not only con ferred a despotic power, but one into the exercise of which no inquiry could be instituted. It was a disci pline of slavery to which no freeman ought to submit. Mr. BATHURST explained. Sir S. ROMILLY conceived that nothing had been said since he had expressed his opinion on this Bill, to induce him to alter.it. Re was not surprised at the silence of the Gentlemen opposite, for they knee( that their strength lay in votes, .and not in argu ments—(hear, hear.) In the little they had said, however, they had disclaimed having listened to the representations of foreign Governments ; but when they came to explain, it was evident they must have done so, for what was the object of their Bill?' Not to protect this country, but to protect foreign Governments, by refusing an asylum to those who might be represented as being hostile to them. It was said that the measure would only be directed against bad Men; so it might be if Ministers could know the truth of the case ; but how were they to ascertain it? Must they not act on secret informa tion, which could receive no proof? As to the in dividuals who had escaped from the barbarities of I Louis the XlVth, was it of Charles the Second, or James the Second, that they had asked an asylam.? No, they had sought it in the British Constitution and what they knew to be the law of this country; and could there be doubted that if the Ministers of those Monarchs had been armed with the powers of an Alien Bill, crowds of French Protestants would have been suf fered to find a refuge on our shores ? With respect 'to the protection granted to French Priests and Emi grants during the last twenty-five years, it was only granted to one party and nothing more. For it had not been extended to those who, after having em braced popular opinions, had been driven from their country by as cruel a persecution as that which bad been directed against the Royalists. There was a class which the Bill would affect with the greatest severity and injustice. He meant the foreigners who for many years had been settled in this country, who had assisted in carrying on the war, and con tributed to the Property-Tax and all other public burdens. What crime had they committed to be thus put at once out of the protection of the law?— It was said, that if these powers were to be granted, they could not be in better hands than in those of the Noble Secretary of State for the Home Department (Lord Sidmouth.) He (Sir Samuel Romilly) was against tyranny in any hands. It was not his busi ness to pay compliments to any man, and therefore he said that he thought these powers in very bad hands—(hear, hear). He respected the private cha racter of that Noble Lord, he was ready to acknow ledge his integrity and worth as a private individual ; but the Noble Lord now stood before them as a pub lic man, and in that character he (Sir S. itomilly) could not.give him any approbation. He had neva seen in him Mr regard for liberty; he luid never wit-1 nessed in that Noble Lord any veneration or respect for • the good sound principles of our recorded constitution. When he considered the manner in which YleNoble Lord had suspended the Habeas Corpus Act—when he reflected on his refusal to hear the petitions of the unfortunate persons who had been imprisoned under that Suspension—when he remembered, that, after ell, he had sought to cover the acts of himself and n 1 colleagues by a Bill of Indemnity, founded on the Report of a Secret Committee, chosen by them selves, and furnished only with such evidence as they' chose to adduce--there was no man in whose hands he should be more unwilling to entrust the exercise of the powers of the Alien Bill--(hear, hear) Let the House too remember, that his Majesty's Ministers had on all occasions refused an inquiry into the man lier in which those powers had been exercised. This was a most fatal blow to the character of this coun try ; and Ile could not but reflect, that when we should have lost all our liberties, we should not even have the compassion of any nation in the world; be cause it would be said, that a people who were so re gardless of the liberties of others, did not deserve to enjoy their own—(Loud. cheering.) Mr. Serjeaut COPLEY strongly advocated the measure, and denied that it all infringed on the Con stitution. The inevitable consequence of relinquish ing the measure must be, that this country must be thrown open to all who may be banished from their own, on account of the atrocity and practical infamy of their political conduct : they were men who were inflamed with the most bitter animosity against this country men without morality or religion—(hear)— who still wished to propagate the desperate principles of the French Revolution. This was the description of persons whom the Gentlemen opposite wished to be admitted to live in this country without restraint, or without controul ; but he, for one, was not willing to try the exiieriment of what quantity of poison the body could inhale without destroying the constitu tion.—(Hear, hear, hear.)—The Bill now in agita tion was directed to all the circumstances of our ac tual situation, and it was our duty to take care that this country should not be attacked through the sides of other States, which might ultimately affect our domestic tranquillity—a tranquillity Which depended on the system adopted by other countries. In 1816, when this measure was last before the House, Gen tlemen opposite held precisely the same language ; and they also held the same in 1793 ; but events had shewn that their judgment was not infallible, when they told us we had nothing to apprehend. There was nothing in any of the Acts of Parliament that in the slightest degree contravened the positions con tended fbr by any of the Gentlemen on his side of the House. The Hon. and Learned Gentleman then re ferred to instances as tar back as the time of Henry IV. to shew that the power of sending Aliens Out of the country was always exercised by the Crown. The Bill, therefore, was not brought in to give the Crown any new authority, as any Alien might have been sent out of the country without the operation of this Bill ; for, by the common law, the King has the power to send them away--only it must be done by, • the tedious method of indictment. He concluded • by entreating the House to consider whether they were • in that situation to throw off the guards and securi ties which successive Parliaments had, in similar cir- cumstaiices, considered necessary for the security of these realms.--( Hear, Hear.) Sir JAMES MACKINTOSH protested against the y doctrines of the Hon. and Learned Gentleman. The question of the Law was wholly immaterial ; but the Gentlemen opposite sought to extend the power of the Crown, and it was for them to shew that circum stances required this extension. The Hon. Gentle man who spike last had only established the prero gative in question by quoting an instance four hun dred years ago, when the King had the power of pressing men for the army by laud, and ..hen the Act De heretice comburendo existed ; and as to the cases dug out of the State Paper Office since the tine of Elizabeth, they amounted to nothing. He defied I the Hon. and Learned Gentleman to prove that for . two hundred and forty years back there bad bee n any instance of the banishing aliens by proclama tion. There was no doubt that the Executive had the power of doing any thing for the 'security of the State, and therefore it had that of banishing aliens—, but was it ever exercised by proclamation P—(hear.), He then defended the consistency of the Gentlemen on his side, and said he believed that scarcely one of them who had voted against the Act in 1793 was now in the House, or had been in 1816: and what-' ever might be thought by impartial posterity, he would say, that not too much was done in 1793 to' resist the increasing influence of the Crown at that period. He felt great curiosity to know what cir cumstances had occurred that in the slightest degree , affected the opinions given by the Gentlemen who opposed the Bill in 1816. It was a Bill intended to oppress any unfortunate individual who had fled from a despotic Government, and to send him back into the jaws of his enemy. He thought the most dan gerous prir.ciple was the resting of this Bill on the moral and political character of certain individuals; for it would follow that when we received foreign exiles in future, we must be held to approve of their moral condLct, and thus act in hostility to the Go vernment that had exiled them. After making seve ral historical allusions, to shew that such' a measure was unprecedented in times of peace, he deprecated what he conceived to be an indifference in the House to the fate of unfortunate men, the victims of fo reign tyranny, and a sort of contempt for every thing founded on principles of liberty and justice. The law seemed to be made to prevent the admission of three Newspapers, and S 8 French exiles into this empire. Suppose any future tyrants banished thousands of persons, and they took refuge in this country, if the Ambassador of the Sovereign who had expelled them demanded that they should be sent away, what would be the answer of the British Minister ? Would he say, as Lord Liverpool did to Andreossi when he de manded the delivery up of M. Peltier, - that Ministers had not the power to commit such an act ? In tilt.- mer times we were despised by the Turks, Algerines, and other despots, on account of the liberty we en joyed and divided with all the people of the earth who set foot on our shores ; and to be so despised by tyrants and slaves we accounted our glory. • But henceforth if a foreigner were not given up, the Am, bassador might say, " Cannot you pass . an Alien Bill?" The Minister might answer, " not in titueuE peace." But the Ambassador might reply, " sr it r was in 1816 and 1818 ;,it is a part of your system • you did , it to preserve quiet in 1818; and what pre. vents you in 1819, but that you were then friendly to such and such Power, and you are now hostile to us. If you pas. an Act then to exclude three Newspapers and thirty-eight Exiles, there can be no reason why you should not pass one now." Supposing (continued the Honourable and Learned Gentleman), the con. test in South America were to be decided against the Independenti, which Goo forbid, and that a few un fortunate men found refuge in this country, would not Spain accuse us of an inimical disposition? If Messrs. Arguelles and Fontada were to escape from their dungeons, and come here, those Gentlemen, the leaders of a Government which we recognised, we should be in the same predicament, or should only have the horrible alternative of expelling those' excellent persons. The Honourable and Learned Gentleman next adverted to the Treaty of 1811, in, which the Emperor of Russia recognized the Cones, and recapitulating the events which hurled Bona parte from power, commiserated those two unfortir ' nate Gentlemen, who ordered a Te DeAs to be surg throughout Spain, for an event which was to plunge them into a dungeon, and their country in slavery.— But if they were delivered from the dungeon, what would now become of them ? They would still con sider England as the asylum of liberty ; but they would find under the Alien Bill that they would only become a subject of quarrel between England and Spain. Contrasting the conduct of Russia on many occasions with that of this country, he observed that the general opinion now seemed to be, that Muscovy was at the head of a liberal and humane policy, and England at the head of a prejudiced, monarchical, and aristocratical party. But he would say that such a system was not consistent with the wisdom and policy of this country—(Hear, hear, hear.) The ATTORNEY-GENERAL argued that, but for this Bill, we should not have the same power as was possessed by every other State ; and that the power of the King, respecting Aliens, was authorked by Magna Charta. As the King had the power of recalling his subjects by proclamation, it was natural that he should have the power of seuding away Aliens, and he would venture to say, no Lawyer out of the House would deny it. It was only to enable the Crown to decide who should or who should not stay in the country; and the only question, was, whe ther it would be wise at once to take off all restric tion of this sort ? As far as he recollected from read ing the debates, the same reasonings against the Bin were used in 1793 as now ; but there was hardly any penon who was not convinced by the events that followed, that that measure was one of the principal means of saving the country. The Honourable and Learned Gentleman argued at some length in favour of the expediency of the measure, and contended that it violated no principle of our laws, but added security to the country. A division took place, when the numbers were-- Ayes Nues Alajut ity - 67 The House then went into the Committee, when Mr. BARHAM moved that the blank respecting the time of the Bill be filled up with one year, in stead of two.—A division took place on the question: Ayes News Majority for two years Mr. J. P. GRANT proposed a clause that it should be in the power of any Alien who might receive an order of removal to specify the country, part, or place to which he wished to be removed, and that he should be permitted to transport himself in any ship that might bC ready to sail. 51r. BROGbEN said the clause could not be re ceived, consistently with the forms of the House, no motion for an instniction to the Committee to amend the bill having been previously made. Mr. GRANT, though he spoke with little confi dence in his knowledge of the forms of the House, Was„of opinion a clause like that which he had pro posed might be received in the Committee. The SPEAKER was of opinion it was imprmible for the clause to he received in the Committee, but it could be moved an the Report or on the third reading of the Bill. • . • Mr. GRANT consented to move his clause on a future stage of the Bill. Sir SAMUEL ROMILLY wished to move a clause to except from the operation °Abe Bill such foreigners as had been resident in this country from the Ist of January, 1814. Mr. LIROGDEN was opinion this clause could mit be received, and the sense of the Committee appearing against it, the Hon. and Learned Gentleman declined moving it on the present occasion. The House resumed, and the Report was ordered to be received to-morrow, with an understanding that ' the Bill should not be read a third time till Friday. The Irish Fever Holpital Bill was brought in, read a first and second thrte t _and ordered t o be committed on Friday. Sir W. CURTIS put off his motion on the City Pctitinn till Thursday:' The Reports of the Committees of. Ways and Means and Sup ply, were brought up and agreed to. • The other Orders oldie Day were &vino' of, and the House adjourned at Twelve &Clock. • Sir D.WEDDEABURN I Bart. the preseni-Metnber of Parliament.lar the Perth district of Boroughs, having resigned, ARCII. +realm., Esq. of BlythswooeL has offered himself as his successor, and has already commenced an active canvass in Perth. A few days ago, an Independent Son of Vulcan, clad in the home-spun costume of his native hills, was very po litely addressed—hat in hand—by a.candidate for his vote at an ensuing election; thinking the gentler man who paid him so much attention was mistaken, and looking round to see if he were addressing any other person, with some deference accosted the can didate thus— ,, Was ye speaking to me, Sir r—beinx answered in the affirmative, And duly apprised of his intentions, he shook his head, rather knowingly, and answered—"'When we see twa or three o ye, we'll be speaking about it!" PORTEIL—We are concerned whist that the Inver tation into the evils of the Licensing System, as affecting the price and quality of the national beve rage, makes but slow progress before the Committee of the House of Commons, to whom it was referred the week before last. Witnesses were examined every day; and most important disclosures were made; but during the last week the sittings of the Committee were suspended altogether. In a few weeks more,. it is understood, Parliament will be dispolvesl t and thin the inqiiirY will be at an end. • 'P. t . 1 pi 1 i i i i 1 . 1 i - 1 11 1),1 1 i i .' • i 1 • il l ! .1 i 1 ' 1 kI ki - ' 1 ° I 1 A _ . . i ) • t'. • . i i ,": , I I • , i k 1 0 . ' I 1 ' 1 1 4 1 :' . ; .. . i . . ', • 0 .I'4) i .- i e T I 1 .1. . , 1. 1 , 1 f $. r t r . . f• . I 1 ' •r ' . • i .• t l' .. h I 1 • I , • ) 4 l. 1 1 11 1 ~, 0., f .• ..: E . I i ; 4 ii: