Star. — London, England, 1802-05-14 00:00:00

was the intention of Government to adopt the ne. celTary me:dares for having a large Channel Fleet ready for anital fervicc at forty-eight hours notice. With relpea to Leurity having been obtained for not going is war again, he coal.' atfure the Houk that no man willed mine than hiniti:lf that Inch might he cafe. It' it was not In this Country would It tve to c immence a new war under every eircitm• fiance of difadvantaqe. If at the end of three campaigns we recovered v.hat we had given up by the Treaty, he humid think' we had made a moil glorious war. Such ss is the rittots;on in . w hi c h the country flood, and he flattei Itimfellthat the 'tulle would concur v. ith him in the propriety of contidering how we rtsi , .tlit lse f relict the danger that threatched us. Hr feared the fpirit of the Country would be brokoi, unlefs its Counfels wet , : diraled by abler men. He had deemed it neceiLtry to delire the Ijoule to carry a declara tion to the foot of the "florrn-, containnig a Refo. that the I loofa was ready to attend to ever,' praaicable. economy calculated to enable this Country to lAA every future attempt on the part of the crony ; but that in order to do ft), it would be fleet:Tay to have a reale of defence fufficient to meet :he danger. The Noble Lord next adverted to the quelion of the Right of the Paha Flag. in the Navigation of the Eailern Seas, and the claims of Fran,:e and Holland to carry on a free and in dependent trade. He obferved that although this Conutry might be dilpofed to treat fuch claims as ridiculous, Holland and France might not do fn. It it Ciosuld be neceffary to maintain a war in In. diet Inc the fovereignty of the territory, ice (imolai confider filch war as jolt and neceffary; but the opts Ilion was, whether France and Holland would entertain the fame opinion ? pet hapc the very (hip that carried not the orders to give up the fatories to the French, might Icing back an account of ac ttial He depr..cated the confequcnces of a War in India, particularly at a time when the I ..It India Dire lore had Dated that the Company was :90 poor to ;Miro& their own fervants in the if their 'militias. Ihs Lordfhip again adverted to ti.. impolicv of fuffering the Treaties to •eipite, recapitulated his arguments, and ex piefle.... his intention of introducing into the Ad drefs a hope that no time might be loft in fettling by amicable adjultment thole points which had not been arranged by the Definitive Treaty. He concluded by moving, "That at: bumble Addrefs ihould berefented to his Majefty, *Turing his Majefty that this Houle would take into Its moil 'thous confide-ration the Treaty of Peace, which his Majelty had been gracioully pleated to is immunicate That th e Houle acknowledged with all due humility his Majefty's prerogative to make peace or war; and that it riould be its heft duty to maintain inviolate the public faith, as pledged by the Treaty of Peace, and to abaft his Majeßy in performing the engagements which his Majefty had engaged Intact( to adhere to : That the Houle could not conceal its awful apprchenfices at con &tering the fituat ion which had been the refult of the Treaty of Peace : That it could not forbear offering his Mayfly their Thanks for fuels provifinns as had been adopted to avert the danger: That it was impoffille for the Houfc to fee without alarm, the eircumflanecs that had attended the coucinfion of the precnt pea:c, by which facrifices had been made on the part of this country, without any correfpendlng concemon on the part of France : l'hat numerous fulaieds of clothing ince-lefts had been left unfettled: That in the moment of Peace we had ken indubitable and convincing proofs of the ambitious projeCts of our Rival : That thefe confederations had imputed on the Britifh Government the neceffity of meafures of precaution: That the Houle relied on his Majetky's wifdom to be Watchful of the power of France, and humbly thought it neceffary to af (are his htajo fty of its ready and firm fupport in his exertions in refilling every (rah encroachment on the commercial rights Of the Brit ins Empire: That it was defirous of a fyltan of eco nomy conliftent with a naval and military eitabliffunent, ade quate to the st.in c :cr of the country : That It was actuated by a (incur, w'fla 1 . .1- Pe ire, and imprcifed with that lentintent, earncftly witiw.l iris Majenv, by amicable adjuftment, to ar. mare thore points whi:h bad been left unfettkel by the Detain nee Treaty, The Dut e of Ns-num:it raid, the motion which the Noble Lord had jolt made went to threw the Itrongeil cenfure on his Majefty's prefinit Mini tiers that could be conceived; and fo far was he from voting any thing like cenfure againft them, he gave them his thanks for the bleffings they had conferred on the Country by the reftoration of Peace, which if it was not as good a Peace as could he wifhed for, it was in his opinion as good, under all the circumfiances, as could have been expcaed or obtained. If that fpeech which formed tile Noble Lord's Motion was carried to the foot of the throne, it would have the effeft of calling upon the Country to go to war again; it would be the fame as telling Erance that we meant to dircufs every point over again with a drawn (word. He did not fee that difference between the Preli minary and Definitive Treaties which the Noble Lord had (laud. In regard to Malta, there were none, for it was placed under the protation of a third and a neutral power, which was bound by every tie of gratitude for her prefervation to this country, and would not be very likely to filter the intereft of France to predominate in the Eland.— He could not fee any great importance that could he attached to the Ifle of Elba, and he hoped this errantry would not go to war again for (mall dd . - pines in the Mediterranean. The Noble Duke then cnnci'ided with moving an Amendment to the Ad ctrefs, to leave nut all of it that cenfured the Treaty of Peace, and prefent another Addrefs, hi: Majefty, Titan that Boat would take the Definitive Treaty of Pace bun eonfideration That the Houa acknowledged his Prifaj-fly's prerogative relative to peace and war: That they fro: it to he their bounden duty to maintain as far as lay in 4r power, the public faith of heir country; and that they v , nub! uto!i readily aflift his Majefty in making fuels arrange. mists a. aweld b. neceffary for enabling him to carry his en shin s.sie.t." • Lo: it PEVA AM raid, it would be neceffary for the I Lane to come to (once decision on this fubjee, in older to have it known whether the country was it p e ace or at ? The Nobie Lord who opened* the debate had confidered t:ii: Peace as nothing mole than a truce. The Noble Lord during the • of his fpeech, had avowed himfelf an comp ; to any Peace it all—[Lord Grenville here role and denied he had tiled any Inch expreflion ; his addrefs contained a contras y sentiment.]—l.ord rctioned : he contended the Noble Lord had argued in a manner which went to thew that Peace mutt be diladvantageous. The Noble Lord had alio argued, that whatever see gave up to Hits , other country was a firrender to Fiance ; which was not the fad. With refprEt to Malta, it flioula be rcLoilelted that it was to be open w al. 'hips of all nations. It would have i,een better have placed that illand under the protection of Ruti than Naples; but !till the latter power would have a Itrong interest in protea; , ig it twin any at t:mpt of France. Mier various other olift:t vations in fupport of the Treaty. his Lordthip voncittned with moving an AJdrets to his Majdly, That the Houle do exprefs Its approbati.ui of tie Ist' Treat F of Peace; and that although the I lour, lamented th, cAtunitious events that dittradted the Continent of I.urop;, it was with confide ruble fatisi AdVon they ()braved t hut Or honotit and freurity of tit, fe kingelools had been prefervol. and cleat the c mlltre hail been coot ioually eneresfing iu its refnurces, and in its means of atierting it; honour and its independence ; and the Monts would o Won his Majefty that they would do svery thing in th. it. power to improve the Millings of Peace, trultin.! At the fame time that his Majcity would employ that virilunet and attention which the lituAtion of Europe tientimiccl, and which was neccirary fnithc chAvi.a.a and incl.:pendency 01 this country." Lord MULGRAVS faid, there was not a part of the Addrefs moved by Lord Grenville, which he was not ready to oppofe. Although the peace was not Inch as he could with for, it was one which he fhould prefer to a continuance of the war. The arguments relative to the infecurity of Malta were unfounded in fasts. That ;nand putrefied an im pregnable fortrefs, which would in future render it impoflible for the French to take it by force, and they never could have taken it had any refill:lnc: been made when attacked in 1798. The inhabi tants of the iflands were betides much better al- feted to the Englith than they were to the French. He did not think s the ifland would be more fecure in the hands of Ruffia than of Naples ; nor thould he leave the people to themfelves. It was not very likely the people would put the ifland into the hand sof die French, the etre/hoc %hole fraternity had been already felt all over the Continent of Europe. With raped to the events that took place in Italy between the figning of the Preliminary and Definitive Treaties, he acknowledged there was fon e difference between the Cifalpine Republic under the influence of France, and the Italian Re public under the controul of the Firli Conful. But hewould atk, whether the difference was of inch im portance as that the chance of gettinari.l of it would be a fufficient ground for breaking ott the treaty and renewing the war? The Noble Lord next alluded to the claims of the Prince of Orange, who, in this age of revolution, might probably be again eflabliffied in Holland. But he would afk if this country had done as much is it either could or was bound to do for that Prince, whofe misfortunes were occa honed, as much by his defending his own rights as thofe of Great-Britain ? With regard to our Sovereignty in India, there very Treaties con. cerning the non-renewal of which fo much com plaint was made, had tended to abridge rather than confirm it. In that refped we now :land on a better foundation : and he could not fee that any apprehentions were to be entertained from a few Frenchmen traverfing from one factory to another in India. He would rather go at once on the broad principle of right to exercifc Sovereignty in India, than on the force of treaties. He faw no danger likely to arife from the ceffion ofLoniftana to France ; becaufe in the fiat place, there was no riding or harbour for (hips at New Orleans: in the next place there was no prob4bility of the French making an attack at any time on Mexico, becaufe the country between Louifiaua and Mexico was impaffable. Lord Aucazawn faid, he had been prevented from offering all he had intended to offer to their Lordthips by the late hour of the night, and the arguments already advanced in defence of the Peace ; he would therefore confine himfelf to the non-renewal of Treaties. He then read extra.ls from each of the Treaties,' from the Treaty of Leipiic down to the Treaty of 1787, to Thew how inapplicable they were to the prefent political po fition and eircumflances. His Lordilsip very fully and fatisfadorily explained all the particulars that preceded the figning of the Treaty negotiated by him in 1787, by which the right of Great Britain to the Sovereignty of India, and the Navigation of the Indian Seat, was molt explicitly, unequi vocally, and fatisfadorily recognized and acknow ledged by France, and he mewed that that right flood as firm and as fate now as it did before the war. The Earl of CARNAAFON complained that he I had heard of no explanation of the variations be tween the Preliminaries and the Definitive Treaty. He warmly reprobated the latter, and concluded with declaring, that he lhould vote for the original Addrefs. Earl WESTMORELAND made a long . and anima ted fpeech in juftification of the Defin itive Treaty, • and in fupport of the Amendment. Lord ELLENBOROVG li made a warm and ani mated fixed) in deferice of the Definitive Treaty, panegyrized in firong terms the prefent Miniflers, for having reftored the hidings of Peace, and at tacked Lord Grenville's argument in the molt pointed manner, in many of its great points ; that part of it which referred to the non-renewal of the Ancient Treaties in particular, declaring that all thofe Treaties were grown obfolete and Inapplica ble from the change of political circumftances in molt of the poifeffrons of the different powers of Europe ; to have revived the ancient Tteaties would have been regenerating all the abfurdity, nonienfe, and kitty that they generally entertained. He concei ved the ftriking of foreign colours to Englillt IlOps of war, not of fuck confequenec as it appeared to be to a Noble Lord (Grenville) ; and concluded a very eloquent and energetic fpeech,by entlinflailicalle thaiking his Majelly's Minifters for having been the lIICilliS of terminating the miferies of war, and procuring the country what he con felled himtelflufficiently unfafitionable to admire— " The Bleffings of Peace." Lord CLIFTON (Earl DA111111V) Paid, he had chearfully given his vote for the Preliminaries, but he could not give it for,the Definitive Treaty, on account of its variations froth the Preliminaries. Earl of Ross:AN anfwered Lord Ellenborough as to what he had laid, rather contemptunntly, of our having omitted to Will on the Dutch lower ing their colours to the Dritith flag, and (hewed that it was not trivial or ludicrous, but a matter of great and lesions importance; he laid our right • to the fovereittity of the feas originated lb long once as the beginning of the i6tli czattiry ; that is th e t ime of Tim:, the Firft, the 1".•rcol Grotitts wtut. au „able hook againft onr o , fot to maintain it, And t hat- the tn. lefs 1c3r1.1:,1 gas,: it it'll a ar..l complete anfwer. lir At ntert.:.l that for die fira time in his Ule he mot. g iv e ilis vot. Ag.iii:ll the wishes of hi s noble Ft it u . (Lord Grtms ilk); but there were %‘•lds in thi AdAreis, moved by his Noble Frietid, which It, could not Vo!Q. for. ..... _ _ - Ile Lou) Citasercunt, in an elahorate fred. of tv..o hours and a half, defended the Definitiv • •I'reatv, admitting neverthelefs that he had heard fiom his Noble Friend many folid obje±tius to it. :m.:emputiesi by many more wholly tnisvoi thy, iu his niind. of the quarter they came from. In fill! detail he met and anfwered all the vend c- . tious of variations from the Preliminaries, and of tu:al omitTions of feveral points Rated to be ini vrtant, and contended that they were either in finificant in themfelees, impracticable, or not att . : in the leait by their being omitted. Earl CAM BtIFN alligned his teafons for not find ing hinVelf able to vote with his Noble Friend (Lord Grenville) for his Addrefs, and declared that he neither approved of the Preliminaries, and lets of the Definitive Treaty, but the Tieaty being concluded, he thought it better to luppot t it. The Duke of RICHMOND warmly commended the fpe , ..ch of the Noble Lord who opened the de bate, (Lord Grenville) but did not approve of the conduct of the war in all its parts. He thought the public tm;ney had been lavithly fquandcrcd in running after every petty German Prince to b..!v him to take fome of our cafh, not but ha approved of titbridies, when wifely applied,' and when th.ir troops were to a& under our command. He alio pointed out other prodigal expendinires, and at length, after fortie eulogiums on the condila of his Miiiitters, laid, he would do any thing thort of voting for the Amendment moved by the Secretary of State in their 'import. Lord HOBART in a (bort fpeech, by an explana tion of two or three fitas, anfwcrcd feveral of the itrungea oblations Rated by Lord Grenville. He particularly contended that the Noble Lord had fpoken abfitrdly, when he contended that the pof fellion of the command of the River Arawari by the French would endanger Britilh ihips in their attempts to enter Rio Janeiro, by (hewing that the courfe of the River Arawari ran a different way towards Paita, and Rio Janeiro lay many degrees lower than the River Amazon. His Lordfhip added other elucidations in favour r • the Treaty. Lord GRENVILLE, in explanation, denied that he had been guilty of the abfurdity imputed to him ; he had mentioned Rio Janeiro becauf he well knew where it lay, but had faith that the French poffetEon of the part of Guiana boandcd by the River Arawari, would, during a war, ena ble them to oblige the Portuguefe to (hut Britifh (hips out from the Bra7ils,where it was fnmetimes ufeful for our Chips for India to call, water, and obtain provitions ; and then we could put in no where nearer than Madagafcar, where we fhould find but poor accommodation. A good deal of altercation arofe about the pro per method of putting the queflion, on which Lord Rosseva, Lord ALVANLEY, Earl RADNOR ' Earl STANHOPE, the Duke of RICHMOND , and the LORD CHAscELLOR, took part, and fpoke each more than once; at length it was fettled that the Lord Chan cellor Ihould put it, that all the words in this Ad drefs, after the words, " An humble Addrefs to his Majcily," be left out, in order to make room . f - Jr Lord Pclham's Amendment, which was longer than the Duke of Norfolk's, and took nut the words of the Addrcfs originally moved, from nearer to the beginning of it, than the Duke of Norfolk's did; was entitled to precede it. The Duke had offered to withdraw his Amend ment, but Earl Stanhope fpoke againft it. The LORD CHANCELLOR then put the ouellion, to leave out all the words of the original Addref , after the words " May it pleafe your Majeily," and to infect Lord Pelham Amendment.—Con tents too, Proxies 22, 122—Not Contents 16. Lord Pelham's Motion is therefore the Motion voted. _ _ _ Lord HOLLAND moved, while Rangers were abfent—A Motion of Cenfure on thofe Minifler; who ad riled his Majefty to refute to accept Bona parte's offer in 1799. The Duke of MONTROSI argued again( it, and moved that it be rejected.—Reje&ed accordingly. Adjourned at part Seven o'clock this morning to Monday next. HOUSE OF COMMONS. A Maar from the Lords informed the Houfe that their Lordfhips had agreed to the Duke of SuffeesAnnuity Bid, with out an Amendment; as alfo to that of the Duke of Cambridge; Hampton Inclofure, and the Swinfcoe Inelofute Ads. The Marine Mutiny 13111 was read a (email time, and committed for Sir Henry Peyton took the oaths and his feat for Cambridge. The Hoak in a Committee of Supply voted the fum of idoooacl. to be railed by way of Annuity or Debenture for the fervice of Ireland. The Clerk read a paper, containing the terms on which the Loan bad been contracte d, which have already appeared in our Paper. The Bill for extending the Franking of Letters, Sze. to all parts of the United Kingdom, was read a kit, and ordered to be read a fecond time to-morrow. The Puit-Olfice Bill, and the Mutiny Bill, were read a ra- coed time, find committed for to-morroW. Mr. ALP.IA /unit brought up the Report of the COMllltittCC of Supply..—Refolutions agreed to, and a NU orden.d. DEFINITIVa TREATY. Mr. WINDHAM, purfuant to notice, rofe to call the attention of the Houfe to the Definitive Treaty between this country and the French Republic.— He obferved, that from the different difcuflions which had taken place on feparate points of detail, fence the day when he &ft gave notice of his pre fent motion, it would he unneceffary for him to go fo much at large into fubordinate confederations, and to occupy the time of the Houle fo fully as he fhould otherwife have felt it his duty to clth— This he confidered a matter of confiderable ad vantage in every point of view; but more eecially with rcfpeet to much valuable information fp which the Votife had acquired, in confequence of thofe detailed and fpecific difcuffions. Many points, on which it would otherivife have been incumbent upon him to expatiate at length, were now clear• ed up, and fettled : he amid, therefore, confine the prefent inveiligation to leadiag and prominent . objeos, The first point bn which h e ihould elm r, an] wh,..1. w.,s ceitait4 a confideratini; r; :i .! .iiiflieft Mimi' t *nee, related to the attic!. .•t* • !. . l'i ea-v refpeeir; Malta. He Lad on a foi iii..c tight cl..fcart• 2i or. ! . !w intidiotts li f e w hi c h m i .t . , 1,,. 'se rn.l%le n' .i...: 71,r - tr4i.ty of :hat illand. Great I:1 i. :a=n it soi .C.lat..,t. ..:1,1 virtually without 4 Ilk., ; whihi Fr.iiiel, on the oiler hand,li.sd all the mir.(4, and many a the 2t eater I'l , Wen of the Coutin, in, _a:hely at her digs-fai. In cafe of any rupeuie, '.'r.inee would have a maritime force in the port o f ,:dait e ti elite to arty that we coold maintain' thcl e. :!at this wt.• r.,it all t.them:•itobjedionable feature a -he whole traot . ..dien was themanner in which tae di, ; oit y - :+lltl ititpi , Mtace tit the Order were totally .lenroyed. It fli.all,l be conildered,that if there was, in the whole fyiltm of European Governments, a 1:„ . ,1, „i.,:„ aid Ar. c i a tlou which matured tip anti maintained the ancient falutary principles of Europe—in inciples Oct %%ilia: jute and regular go. .vernments were bottomed—it was the Order of 1 Maitefe Knights. Now oLfcrve the manner in which France leeks to undermine the value of that iallitution, and to abrogate the whole of its uti lity. She introduces orders and regulations of fo Ixfe and lax a nature, that the refpesiability of the Order, as foinuled on the nicett fence ot ho nour, is completely done away. So effedoaily, indeed, had France fucceeded in this attempt, that the approved veterans of the Order, from the de mocratic fy Rem now laid down, refuted to have any connection with their new affociates. The Order, which might he confidered as a little vial, containing the effential principles of conflituted authority, was through French artifice and con: trivance diluted, not merely with water, but with the worn: of water—with water taken from the puddle, from the common fewer. Every meafitre. in tad, re:The:ling Alta, was calculated to throw it into the hands of France. It was true, indeed, that by the ternis of the Trea:y, Malta war. to be h oarri Cooed by Neapolitan troops. But what fignified that provision ? Malta was to be in the hands of a garrifim, that garrifon to be fupplied from Na ples, whiff' Naples itfelf was virtually in the hands of France. In his eflimation and view of the fubjed, this was even worfe than if we had at once furrcndcred Malta to France. In that cafe we might have made a virtue of the cation, and on the credit of contenting ourfelves to an ad, which, there was but too much reafon to appre hend, would eventually take place without our content, and have carried tome other point in our favour, as a fet-offagainft that cellion. The next point to which he fhould call the attention of the Houfe, and a highly important point it molt de cidedly was, related to the reftoration of the Cape of Good H0,...e to the Dutch. He had already animadverted on the terms in which that relit). ration was worded. The phrafe, " in full to vereignty" carried with it more confequence than might at first fight appear. What fecurity had we, that the Dutch, in a fit of generolity,, might not make it over to France ? What fe curity that France might not find out the expe diency of taking it into her own kind keeping ? As a point of communication between this coun try and our Eaftern Empire it was an object of • primary importance. it was the halfwayhoufe, and not merely a commodious, but the only ca• vern, if he might be permitted the metaphor, we had to ftcp and bait at in the courfe of our journey. He now came to another matter of equal confide ration, the boundary of French Guiana; and he waa glad to avail himfelf of this opportunity.to correa an error into which he had been led on a former evening,in fuppoling that the fraud he complained of,as committed by France,had been done without the privity and knowledge of our Government. He was ready to admit ilia; our Government had re• monftrated on this fobjeti, and that another ar rangement took place in confequence. But what was the nature of that new arrangement ? Was it an arrangement attended with any advantage? No, it was merely a piece of trickery and fineffe. The °Ned of the French Government was not to ob. tain a portion of wild and uncultivated land, but to have the command of the great and mighty River of the Amazoni. This objets they had com pletely attained ; and in this point of view he cer tainly was fully juflified in aliening, that the boundary, as fettled now, was not one jot better, with refped to the interefts of this country, than the boundary which the French had contented to relinquifh. And when he coupled with this tran ladion the ceCion of Leuiliana, he could not but feel aggravated reafon of alarm. The French were now in potteditai of a fourth part of the whole globe, and were matters of the two greateft rivers in the Univerle, the Amazon and Miffiffippi.— Thu s, in fad, they held in their hands the keys of both North and South America. Was this no ob. je& of deep and feriousrefleetion ? Were the Houfe aware of the immenfe importance of thefe two ar ticles ? We teemed to fet no bounds to our prodiga lity in making concellions to France. We fcattered pearls as profufely, and as indifferently, as barley corns. France well knew the value of what we lb inconfiderately threw away. Under every change of circurnitances, France never loft fight of her grand. and favourite objed. It was univerfal em pire that the aimed at, and the vans fhe purfucd were admirably adapted to accomplifh that ambi tions pnrpote.. This was her view in abrogating the univerfal law of Europe, as eftablilhed f; . .:* ages. It was not Co much incumbent upon him. al . complaining of the non-renewal of ancient treaties. Ito prove the extent of the danger likely m accru . ! therefrom, as it was incumbent upon Admitail!::. titan to thew that no danger exifted. It certain!! was in the higlieft degree improvident in the Go. vernment of any country to do away precautiwrary mealnres before they had firft maturely weigh:4 and analy fed all potiihle confequences—htfi , :e they had minutely lifted the contingent refult.— With raised to our empire in the Eaft, this Too lure was certainly fraught with inveterate alarm. Wlmt fecurity had we that 'France, now ernanr!• paced from all re:lraint in this particular, worl.! not eagerly leize the firft favourable opportunity to renew her ancient pretenfions ? A Right Her Gentleman, indeed, (Mr. Dundas) appeared to t:I• certain very different opinions on this fubjed, ay.'. like another Ajax, mistook us, harnacfs cattle, i.• Cu many Trojans. But it should be remembere,t,