Star. — London, England, 1801-05-19 00:00:00

, . hard& in roving - pubSe thanks to every Nicer who had been diftinguifhed for valour and zeal in Egypt, he should fcarcely know where to flop. Ile was as ready as any Noble Lord could be, to acknowledge and to applaud the talents, the cou rage, and zeal of Sir Sidney Smith ; but he under (Food it would be a deviation from the general praftice on there occafions ; and was apprehenfive It would be injurious tu the interefts of the fervice to make a fpecific motion of thanks to any Officer of his rank, particularly when it was confidered that Sir Sidney Smith was not in this inftance the Commander of the Seamanand Marines employed on chore. It was alto desirable that no difference of the commiflions of Captain Cochrane and Sir Sidney Smith, in order to (hew that had they been ' in the Army, they would have been 'ere now in the fituation of Major-Generals, or Brigadier-Ge-, nerals, and therefore that they were entitled to higher confideration in point of rank than the Co lonels of regiments, with whom the Noble Secre tau of State feemed to think them on a level. The LORD CHANCILLOR faid, no terms could prefs the high fenfe he entertained of the merits of Sir Sidney Smith, and he was perfuaded that gallant Officer would feel no pleafure in the adop tion of a motion which might be injurious to the general intereils of the fervice ; but in order that no abfolute negative fhould be givers to a motion of this nature, he Should move the previous queflion. The Dues of CLaassicr perfifted in fupporting his motion, Rating, that no argument had been offered on the other fide to convince him that it ought not to be agreed to. The difference of the votes of the other Houfe of Parliament was no good ground of oppofition. Lord AUCKLAND corroborated the arguments of his Noble Relation, as to the impropriety of al lowing a precedent to be efiablifhed fo contrary to the general cufiom, by voting a motion of Thanks to an, fubordinate Officer. It might lead to the pradice of every Noble Lord riling to move the Thanks of the Houfe to his particular friend or relation in the army or navy ; and who would at tempt the invidious task of queftioning the juflice of thofe claims? On this ground, and under the conviction that the character of Sir Sidney Smith required not the thanks of that Honk, which on a former occaflon it defervedly obtained, to lift it • higher, he was againfi the motion. On that occa fion, he obferved the circumflances were materially differerff from the prcfent, as that brave Officer bad the command in chief of the detachment, and was at a confiderable difiance from any fuperior officer. It could, he conceived, he more grateful to any officer that a Motion of Thanks fhould ori ginate with his Majefty's Minifters, who had the bell opportunity of judging of their merits, and who were refponfihle Tor any propofitions they fubmitted to Parliament. Lords WRIMIORRLAND and Mote:Ravi concur red in applauding the condo& of Sir Sidney Smith, but difapproved of the Motion of Thanks, as like ly to introduce a practice prejudicial to the fervice. Lord Ronnie commented on the obfervations of the Noble Lord (Auckland) refpeding the ufage of the Houfe ; and Rated a cafe in. point with the modest of the Royal Duke, when, on his recom inendation to the late Piet Lord niche Admiralty, a motion of thanks was propofed and agreed to in that Houle to Admiral Cornwallis, who was then In a fubordinate Ration. _ _ _ Lord Sr. VtacsaT (aid, that Captain Cochrane lad three Captains on (bore ailing under him, in onjuntlion with Sir Sidney Smith. The Ma, bf Ctaasues Paid, that as the official 4ifPatches mentioned no other naval officer on fhore than Sir Sidney Smith, he was led to think him the Commander in Chief of the detachment, and firongly entitled to the Thanks of the Houfe. However, as he onderllood from the other fide that no motion of Thanks was to be agreed to, void's at originated with the Noble Secretary of State. and that nothing coming from fuch a bum. Isle individual as himfelf, uneonncSed with admi ni(tration, could have any chance of adoption, and uniedling that a motion of the nature he intro 4uted 11,,,u1d be rejeeed, be would withdraw it. Cot& kicms.r Lid the iUuttrious Duke mdtook `: Itiould appear in the Votes of both Hou(es on this fubjed ; and if the motion recommended by the Illuarious Duke was adopted, they would not correfpond.—The motion was here put and agreed to unanimoufly. Earl ST. VINCENT Rated, that the Seamen and Marines on fhort in Egypt were commanded by the Hon. Capt. Cochrane, an Officer fenior in rank to Sir Sidney Smith, to whom, however, he was every ready to fay no Officer in the fervice was fuperior in merit. The Duke of CLARINCI, in reply to the objec . tions of Lord Hobart, as to the rank of Sir Sidney Smith on this occafion, quoted the recent cafe of Col. Stewart, who was particularly fpecified in the vote of thanks, for his gallant conduit off Copenhagen. He therefore moved 4 , that the Thanks of the Houle should be given to the Hon. Captain Cochrane and Sir Sidney Smith :" the character of the former ever entitling him to the approbation of that Houfe and the country. The Earl of MOIRA paid a handfomecompliment to the charaderof Captain Cochrane. He denied,in the name of his profeffion,that anyofficer in the ar my would be capable of feeling any jealoufy, as had been infinuated as poffihle, if the motion of the illuftlious Duke fhould be adopted. They admired fortitude and talents with too much lincerity to repine at any diflindion that might be attached to thofe who poffeffed them in a degree fo eminent as Captain Cochrane and Sir Sidney Smith.' Lord BORRINODON obferved, that as the name of Captain Cochrane was not mentioned in the Gazette, and as it feemed the opinion of the Houfe that a vote of thanks fhould not be granted to Sir Sidney Smith, without conneding it with the name of an officer, perhaps very deferving, but who was not fo mentioned in the official account as to war rant the Houfe in taking fuck : particular notice of him, he would oppofe the motion. Lord Kamm oppofed the Motion of Thanks as injudicious In the mode, though he added his tri bute of approbation to the conduit and charafter of the meritorious officers alluded to. The Doer of CLARINCI remarked on the date Mtn intleh if he imagined thee obferiations whicb ' fell from him did not, in his opinion, deferve the molt refpeaful confideration ; but the opinion or no perfon, however high in rank and importance, fhould induce him to depart from his fenfe of pub lic duty. He was happy the illuftrious Duke had withdrawn his Motion, and affured him it was with great relatance he gave it any oppofition. After fome further remarks from Lords Rom ney, Holland, and Hobart, the Motion of the Duke of Clarence was withdrawn, and it was ordered that the Lord Chancellor fhould tranfmit the ufual Votes of Thanks. Lord SuFFOLIC rote to move, that a Monument fhould be et efted in St. Paul's Cathedral, to the memory of Sir Ralph Abercromby ; but on the Lord Chancellor Rating that as the Motion would involve the expenditure of the public money, it could not originate in that Houfe, his Lordihip did not perfift in the Motion. INSOLVENT DEBTORS' BILL• The Infolvency Bill was recommitted. The LORD CH•HCIILLOR moved his promifed amendments relative to the exemption of perfons confined for crier. cos. and malicious profecutions ; adding a claufe, that if the Plaintiffs in fuch aEtions (hould - be dead, and fhould not have left an autho rity to their Executors, Adminiftrators or Affigns, to grant or withhold their confent to the liberation of the prifoners, thofe claufes lhould not operate againft them. The amendments were agreed to. The Houfe being refumed, the report of the Committee was ordered to be received to-morrow. The confideration of his Majelly's Mefrage re• lative to Portugal was deferred till to-morrow. HOUSE OF COMMONS. The Chancellor of the Exchequer petitioned the Committee of Way. and Means to Wednefday next. The third reading of the Clergy ExcluEon Bill was put off till to-morrow. The Houfc in a Committee went through the Hair Powder and Armorial Bearings Bill, and the Sugar Drawback Bill. To be reported to-morrow. Mr. H. BROWN moved, that the Chancellor of the Exche quer be added to the Committee appointed to cocGder of im proving the Port of Glafgow. A Meflage from the Lords intimated their Lorddtipe con fent to the Militia Cloathing Bill, the Clergy Horfe Duty Ex emption Bill, the Bank Notc Forgery Bill, and fevesal private Bills. Sir FRANCIS BURDETT pretested a Petition from II rbllinj man, a prifoner for debt, in the four Courts, Marthaltea, Dub ling, Rating his circumitanees, letting Forth, that though they were of peculiar hardthip, he would yet not be Winded under the provifiona of the Bill for the relief of Infolvent Debtors, now before Parliament, and praying that when that Bill than come before the Houle, it may take his cafe into coefideratiou.—it was ordered to lie on the Table. There was laid before the Route an account of the value of all Exports from and Imports into the kingdom of Great Bri tain during the lalt year; which was ordered to lie on the Table. The S informed the Houk that he had received a let ter from Sir Hype P expreifive of the high fettle he en terta in ed of the honour which had been conferred on him, by the Vote of Thanks to him, and the Officers, dm. (erring un der hint, now that be has become an old man, and been em ployed above fifty years in the terries of his country, THANIII_TO THI ARMY 111 IGYPT. The CHANCILIOR of Ilse Excnsoysit.—" Sir, I rife in confequence of the notice I gave on Friday lag, to move a Vote of Thanks to the brave offs. cers and men who fo nobly diftinguithed themfelves in Egypt. I have referred to the Journals of the Houfe for precedents upon occafions fimilar to the prefent, when the Houfe had the melancholy and painful tans of paying a tribute to the memory of a brave and gallant officer, and voting Thanks to thole who ferved under him ; and I find the fire at of the Houfe on a fimilar occafion, when the brave Wolfe fell, was to pay a tribute to the me mory of that gallant officer. It was his fate, like that of the gallant officer whole lots we have now to deplore, to fall in the caufe of his country, whilft the army he commanded was vidorious. On the merits of Sir Ralph Abercromby, I need not fay one word, they are fpoken of in fuch terms by his fucceffor, Major-General Htitchinfon, as muft make his name as dear to his country as to the army he commanded. He has bravely doled a long and virtuous life, and the tongue of (Under has never reached him. I have in my hand a let ter from an officer ferving in Egypt, expreffive of the bravery and good conduit of the army, and their regret for the lots of their gallant and humane Commander. [The Chancellor of the Exchequer here read the letter.] I (hall only add. Sir, that his Majefty with that paternal regard for his fub *ls which has ever manifefted itfelf, but particu larly on fuch melancholy occafions as the prefent, has directed that the Standard taken from the French in the battle in which the brave General Abercromby fell, (ball be placed over his monu ment (fhould this Houfe order one) in commemo ration of the event which deprived his country of the Cervices of a man who never drew his (word to deftroy, or to fubdue-3ut to fave, to reftore, and to ellahlifla. And never was there a moment when the fteadinefs and bravery of the Britifh army was more fully evinced—never was there a moment when more effential fervices were rendered by it to its country, or when it more added to its fame than on that day. The Houfe will fee the eftimation this officer was held in by referring to the letter of his fuceefford Major. General Hutchinfon." He then Paid, be thought the country had every thing to exped from the courage and abilities of the Ge neral who fucceeded to the command of the army, and he trufted the lofs of the individual was that alone which would be to be deplored. [The chan cellor of the Exchequer then read another letter from an officer in the army in Egypt, which Rated, " the irrefiftible courage of the Britifh forces in Egypt, and paid a jug tribute to the brave men who (hewed themfelves a match for the flower of the French army—for the conquerors of Italy."] I hope, Sir, we (ball always hear in mind that the objeft of every great naval and military viaory is the attainment of in honourable peace; and that. however brilliant it may be, it ought not to in." duce Us to demand more than what is due to us as la nation. Should it, on the other hand, be our misfortune to meet„&reverfe, I hope we (hall bear it as we ought, aid - tiever confent to any terms which are not continent with the honour and dig nity of the nation." He concluded with expreffing his gratitude to die army and navy, and moved— That an hnmbk Addigi be prefatted to his &Warm pesyiog tbt W kfajtssw %mild be patioull? &did Walks 0 a Maim* vibe wailed ks tie Catie&al &Ma of Is:Paat, to the Weary of the ever to be regretted Sir RAL en Aar %- caws at . , Knight of the Bath, who, by tes confummate ability and valour, fuccefsfully effected a landing is Egypt, although oppofed by veteran and well-difciplined troops,equal in point of number to thole under his command, who unfortunately re ceived a mortal wound early in the adtion, on the Uft of March tan; notwithftanding which he remained in the field of bat tie direding the operations of the army, to which may besattribut ed the Needs of the day ; and to allure his MAJIITY that this Houk will make good the expence of the fame."—Agreed to. He then moved the Thanks of the Houfe to the feveral officers, which were fimilar to thofe voted in the Houfe of Lords, for which fee our Report. Sir J. Put:rem er bore seitimony to the merits of Sir Ralph Abercromby. Thofe who knew him well would, he Paid, lament him molt. The ex pedition which be had undertaken, demanded all the abilities he polkaed ; it prefented innumerable difficulties which few were capable of encounter ing ; and the fervices he had rendered his country at the dole of a glorious life, were fuch as to de mand its utmoft gratitude. He could, by what he should fay, add nothing to the fame of that dif tinguiihed officer, whofe lofs he molt fincerely la mented. But he thought he ihould not difcharge his duty, if he did not take that opportunity to pay the tribute due to his exalted virtues. To the of ficers and men employed on that hazardous fer vice, it was not in his power to do jullice • too much could not be laid, and the Vote of Thanks to them had his warmeft fupport. Mr. jou ss Paid, he was as ready as any man in that Houfe to vote a Monument to the memory of the diftinguifhed officer Sir Ralph Abercromby : But if the treaty of El-Arifch had been confirmed, the Houle would not now have to perform that pain ful talk, nor to lament the lots of fo many of their brave countrymen who fell in Egypt. This army he could call by no other name than the Army of Vidlims. The nectffity of the expedition to Egypt was caufed by his Majefty's late Minifters, and he would do every thing in his power to bring them to condign punifhment. The different motions were then put and agreed to. SUBSIDY TO PORTUGAL. Lord Hawaii:ay moved, That the Houle thould refolve itfelf into a Committee of Supply, to take into confideration his Majelly's Metrage relative to the Subfidy to be granted to Portugal. The SPEAKIII having left the Chair, and the Meffage being read, Lord HAWMIBUiIr Paid he hoped the Meffage of his Majefty would not meet with any general oppofition. Whatever might have been the opinion of Gentlemen relative to other Subfidies, this was one which he thought could not be oppofed upon any ground. Whether Subfidies in general were right or wrong he fhould not now take up the time of the Houfe in arguing : but thus much be would fay, that in all the wars in which this country was ever engaged thofe were the moft be neficial where the granted fubfidies. The Ameri can war, where fubfidies were not granted, was the molt unfuccefsful this country ever few. There might be a difference of opinion as to the fubfidies granted to Rutfia, Praia and Auftiia—but a fubfidy to our ancient and f aithful Ally, Portugal, who for upwards of a century bad adhered religi °tiny to its treaties with this country, he thought there could not be an objeftion te. He hoped the Houle would do every thing in their power to pre vent its being over-run by the French for its at tachment to this country, which was the only ob jedion to Portugal making a peace. It was not the with of his hhjelly's Minifters to prevent Por tugal from making a peace for itfelf; but if a fife peace could not be made, it was their with to grant that Power fuch relief as might enable her to defend herfelf againft her enemies. His Ma jelly had a right, if he thought proper, to abfolve Portugal from all treaties, if a juft peace could be obtained, but that was extremely doubtful. As proof of it, he fhould refer the Hours to the con duet of the French at Naples. The fulificly was I not abfolutely intended for the purpofes of refift ance, but if driven to that extremity, it would put her into a fituation to defend herfelf. It might be Rated to the Houfe, that the (urn was too (mall to be of any etfential fervice. He admitted that the furn was not as large as under other circurn fiances he might have been inclined to aid that country with, but the large fums of money fent out of the country for the purchafe of Corn, had made it necerary to withhold a larger fupply to Portugal. He, however, begged to obfcrve, that in Portugal the furn was not fo very inconfider able, fince it would enable that country to fup port an army of 20,000 men for fix months. He then moved "That the funs of 300,0001. be granted to his Majefty as a fubfidy fur Portugal, to enable her to defend berfelf againft the mvafion with which The was threatened." Mr. Gass , Paid, no reafon had been alfigned by the Noble Lord for the Subfidy the Committee wu called upon to vote. He, however, had no with to expofe an old and faithful Ally by with holding the fum demanded, if he confidered it would have the defired etre& ; but this he very much doubted. He did not mean to contend that fubfidies were in all cafes unwire ; they depended entirely upon circumilances. He hoped his Lord ' (hip did not mean to follow the example of his Majefly's late Mufflers, whom he confidered to have fquandered a great deal of the public money in unneceffary fubfidies. For what purpofe, he would elk, was this fubfidy to be granted ?—if it was to enable Portugal to make a fuccefsful fence, he doubted its being fufficient ; and if it was to buy a peace, it was literally putting money into the coffers of Bonaparte. The threat ;spina Portugal was not of a new date. This country muff have for a long tisne expoffed the Attack of Portugal) fusee lan limner, General Berthier was lent from France to Spain, for the purpofe of concerting meafures againil Portugal; at the clofe of Leff year, Bonaparte's brother, attended by a French General, went alfo to Spiin upon the fame errand. At this period, a great army wu colleSed for the invafion of Portugal, and yet no application for a fubady w as m a d e to that Houle; but the Houfe is now applied to for aid for that country, when the hope from refdlance caamot be very ',leafing. What, he Aced, could Porte. gal do againft the whole army of Spain, aided hy from so- to 30,000 French troops, unatliited h ) this country, except by a fnbfidy of 300,0001. He thought Portugal ought not to have been left in i , prefent defencelefs (Late ; and he thought his Ma. jetty's late Minifters highly culpable in withd raw . ing the troops from Portugal at a period when the molt flood in need of them. \Vita France had occafion for all her men, we fent Generals Stewart and Frafer with a large army to defend Portugal ; but when 'France had fubdued all her enemies on the Continent, and had a large army, and had no employment for it, Portugal is found to be with out a fingle Briti(h foldier. He concurred in the unanimous vote of Thanks to the Army in Egypt, but he anted how it came to be employed there ? He mutt agree with his Hon. Friend (Mr. Jones), that if the Treaty of El Arifch had been confirm ed, there would not have been any neceflity to have Cent our brave troops to that country. Much blood and treafure would have been fpared, and •thofe men could now have rendered elfential tier. vice in defending our faithful and ancient Ally Portugal. He thought his Majelly's Minifters highly culpable in having fent the whole of on: dilpofable force to Egypt, the conqueft of which he confidered very doubtful; and by leaving P( 7. tugal unprotected, the country was expofcd to as event which might be as great an ohttacle to Peace as Eygpt. The prefent fubfidy was confluent with the conduft of his Majefly's late Minifters, who were always too late in their aids and fubfidiec ; and he was perfuaded no man in that Honfe, or the Country, would fay, it would obtain the ob. jed intended : at belt it could only buy off the enemy. Mr. Parr-14 In the notice which I feel myfelf called upon to take of the obfervationa that have fallen from the Honourable Gentleman who ob. jeds to the vote propofed by my noble Friend, I beg leave to affure the committee that I (hall no: trouble them at any length.—l think, if ever I I heard a plain diftind ftatement, on clear ground, laid intelligibly before the Houk, fo as to leave no doubt what we are called upon to do, either in point of Faith, Policy, or Honour, it was the ftatement of my noble Friend ; but -I mutt fay, that the Hon. Gentleman in the courfe of his fpeech, went into an argument that proceeded to the extreme, although in the beginningcf his fpeech he maintained, that it is a llibjed on which the Extreme will not apply, that each cafe of a Sub. fidy fhould be decided on its own eircumftances ; and yet he thought fit to fay, that all the Grants of Parliament on that fubjed, were without any motive except the pleafure of granting Subfidici, that this pleafure was to us a fufficient reafon to grant a Subtlety, and that we never looked at the confequences—Now, Sir, I will fay, that if an; Gentleman will look back to the Hiftory of this War, he will find, that whatever has been the fate of the Continent, we have given to the dif ferent Powers the bell chance for their lafety, and that the money we have laid out on there occa fions, was the bull way of laying it out, and con ftituted the cheapell bargains on our part in the prefent War. I am perfedly ready to go into that Queflion with the Honourable Gentleman whenever he pleafes.—The Honourable Gentle. man lays, he has no objedion to make 'Tahiti the particular Subfidy now under the confideration of the Houfe ; but under the femblance of difcat: fang this gseftion, he takes an opportunity of re newing his attacks upon his Majefty's late Mini. tiers. He takes the opportunity of collaterally making charges againft us, though notice has been repeatedly given of a fpecific Motion on Oa; fubjeft, which Motion has never yet been brought forward. I do, Sir, moll ftrongly prote( agatna the injultice of fuck proceedings, but I will nu. ther be drawn by there kind of obfervations to do a thing fo irregular to the Houfe, nor fo unjufi to my Colleagues and myfelf, as to make their con do& and mine, upon this important Qpeftion, the fubjed of collateral Debate.—lf thefeT.ve.ntlemen really think they can fubliantiate their charges aging us,they flandpledged to the Houfe to bring them forwar d,and they cannot want an opportunity of fo doing; but I contend that they do not do their duty as Members of Parliament, they do not 20 with candour to us, when they depart from the fubjea in Debate, and either compel us to violate the orders of the Houfe by following their exam. pie, or by our (Hence to appear to acquiefce in the Jolliet of the accufation. I fhould rather prefer the latter, and I hope Gentlemen will take Come regular opportunity of bringing forward thole Charges. With refped to the fituation of Pcr• to ,he conneds it with the Expedition to Egypt. and rays, that if the latter had not been attempted. Portugal would have been fate; but in the latter part of his Speech he rays, that even if the Eg) P' tian Expedition had not been undertaken, he would not recommend that the Forces engaged in it fhould be employed in defence of Portugal. Leaving then the importance of Egypt out of his conlideration, he makes it a charge againft the King's late Minifters, that we are prevent ed from alEfting Portugal, becaufe fo large a force has been fent to - Egypt ; and he lays, that if that force had not been fent to Egypt, would not recommend their being employed ia the defence of Portugal. This is the en %htened, the vigorous and Statefman.like pallyy uhich he would recommend in oppofition to that SIM ployed by the late Adminiftration, who, from delays of which they were guilty, he flays, tli' y failed ; but who, I fay, notwithftanding Ilbas Melt):, and their uniform failures, have Come Weise sier contrived, amid( the wreck of E-n -=lse defolatioo of Europe, to deprive our of almoft all their Colonial PolfeCfions-- ea reduce, alsnoft to annihilation, their Maritime ilennstb—to deprive them of, and to appropriate torfelves, the whole of their Commerce. end to maintain in fatuity our Territories in every part lithe Globe, nide, Sir, are the fucceEcs with vi rich the late and tardy efforts of the left Ad:M alik-atlas have been crowned. It is to theft Sue• ries that the Hon. Gentleman owes the oppocr alty he now makes ufe of, to talk in this place with retrof_piselive criticifm of the conduit of the War. But I with to a& the Hon. hew are geoid avoid fending a force C c:Ural& " pletel nano Bete deny to th We i an of thenl Calif thotil ?lett Xgyi &Tic th langi Him, late, effeB .?pio ing i fiffen whic chic altog as stS gudgi - has 11 the c occui tau : - telpe• temp tion tent c Was t Mini! but is Pr°Pc -