Star. — London, England, 1818-02-10 00:00:00

cases where slaves were actually ford on only because without such a provision aity of the cases that would have been before the tribunals, would have been a cause 1 complaint, but because that principle to contended made the character of the now agreed upon such as would be most Luce the other Powers generally to come Len the French Government resolved upon in, he had no doubt it did so in the largest with the determination of following it up mores as were necessary to make it quite Penal laws were the measures required to ipulated abolition effective ; and these he at had been passed, and of such a nature ,reduce the desired effect. Portugal had example of France in this respect ; and :ognized the principle in the present Treaty. slition was important, those laws of regu dome the Abolition were ten times more for without them the Abolition was but a sat made these regulations of still greater was, that the Slave Trade, as carried on Abolition hail commenced, was stained deeper horrors than before the Abolition lopted by any State. One very important settling the present Treaty had been the tribunal to try offences against the treaty. is, it was evident that a mixed Tribunal, le Judges should be subjects of the nations was by far the best. On this principle, such a tribunal was established. The )jects both of the captors and the captured, the Judges ; and they were empowered srnmarily in questions where the issue was Laves were actually found on board a vessel When the other measures were followed appointment of such a tribunal, he thought allowed on all hands that very little was lone in the way of negotiation. Stilt the te greatest importance was, that the Power agreed to the Abolition should follow it ;illations to enforce it under heavy penalties. the adoption of such regulazians Involeed, :ulty. Arrangements were now in prb his purpose ; and in alluding to these an its he could not omit to notice the great and ability manifested by our Representi- Court of Madrid (Sir Henry Wellesley), the person who fulfilled the official duties temporary absence from the Spanish difficulty of making effectual regulations id he alluded to, might be estimated by how long it was before they had been this country ; and the difficulty must be every country whiCh had extensive corn- I colonial interests to attend to. To prove was not the only object with the Spanish in acceding to the present Treaty, it for him to mention, that the Merchants had offered to the Spanish Govern premium for rejecting the Abolition, a Ames as large as that stipulated to be paid present Treaty for effecting the Abolition hear, hear). As to the pecuniary part of this begged it might be recollected that in the unanimous approbation of the House, was made to Spain of p a premium of 850,0001. of 10,000,000 of dollars, to induce that r abolish the Slave Trade North of the that time the total Abolition of the Slave ;pain was so far from being expected, that even thought of. He therefore hoped that . would come to the question upon the pe , part of the present arrangement with a fair aeration of the advantages obtained , by the and of the sum which the House was willing s a former occasion for much smaller ad- At the same time he felt bound to say, not because the Court of Spain was not of the Abolition that the payment of any stipulated for. He believed that Court to iy desirous of the Abolition ; and the same te, , was convinced, pervaded the other Euro- Courts. Since the Declaration of the Congress a general feeling had been diffused in fa te abolition. It was a sure proof that this was at least as strong in Spain as e'sewhere, great a body in that State as the Council of .dies had declared in favour of it. In settling pecuniary part of the Treaty his Majesty's Go nrnent found themselves very much embarrassed the magnitude of the offer s made by this c ountry Spain in 1815. After such offers, it must natu ly be expected that Spain would be averse to any ms less favourable than those before offered.— t then, on a representation that the state of this miry after an expensive war did not enable it to so large a sum even for so desirable an ob we had purchased safety at so high a that we could not now afford so large a sum as .ly for the attainment of a moral object. It was a representation of these circumstances that Spain agreed to take a sum so much less than that ich we had formerly offered for the same purpose. nth respect to the mode of payment, it was agreed it should be made at different times, and peri with the progress of the Abolition—that a part the sum should be paid in a short time, but the mcipal part not till the Abolition wac effected.— . hundred thousand pounds was the total sum to paid, and he thought the amount would not be cared unreasonable. It was to be considered that lean one half of the amount of this sum would, in case, have bee n pay a bl e f rom t hi s country to Baia as the value of vessels captured which had not ecmdeamed. All claims, in respect to such ves -5) were released, on consideration of this sum of ~ 000/. so that, in fact, the suns paid for the Abo :on amounted to no more than 200,0001. (Hear.) latever difference of opinion might arise on any La . of this Treaty, he trusted that no question re tatting the present state of South America would mixed up in the present discussion. Future op en:tides would occur, when that subject might be 'aaappropriately treated of. But, on the present he was particularly desirous that a feeling cordiality mi g h t b e shewn towards the Spanish iv ernir.eat for what it had done in this Treaty ; ' the Rouse woula look at the commercial saeri-, made by Spain ; that they would consider Spain, treeing to this Treaty, as having entered into a cud of union with us on the great subject of Abo. fin. It would he unfair, in every poem of view, 1 ° zit up an- tales:ion cencerning the state of Satoh with the pre.Feat ais t uss.onbecause it would prevent a proper view from being taken oP either Subject. What he considered the most important part of the Treaty, as that which would have the strongest operation in attaining the ultimate object, was the mutual right of search as established brit. So long as the Spanish flag was a protection to the Slave trader, it would be in vain to expect that any thing effectual could be done to put an end to the traffic, except merely in our part of the West Indies, for in the Spanish colonies, and in the southern parts of the United States, it would have found an asylum, and would have been carried en probably with more horrible atrocities than ever. It therefore seemed to him, and ht hoped it would be the opinion of the House, that the stipulations in the present Treaty were of such a nature as tended very closely to that final success of the Abolition which was not far distant. —lt was his intention first, to move a Resolution stating it to be the opinion of the Committee, that it ,was expedient measures should be taken for carrying this Treaty into execution. Secondly, to move that Bills be brought in for that purpose ; and he would follow up these two motions by a motion in the Com mittee of Supply, that the sum of 400,0001. be grant ed to carry the Treaty into effect. With respect to the second part of the motion, it would be necessary, on account of the right of search which was to be granted, being such as would so far affect the pre rogative of the Crown, that the authority of an Act of Parliament would be necessary. To such an Act, made with such views, he could not anticipate any objection. It would be a great example to the world, that the Power, which of all others in the world is the most jealous of its maritime rights, should be ready to make those rights give way for the purpose of preventing their being made a cloak for the perpetration of those horrible crimes, which were inseparable from the Slave Trade. The Noble Lord concluded amid cheers from all parts of the House, by moving a Resolution, that The Coen mittee deem it expedient that measures should be taken to carry this Treaty into execution." Sir GILBERT HEATHCOTE was sorry to dis turb the unanimity of the House, but feeling as he 'did the distressed state of the country, he could hot consent that the sum of 400,0001. should be paid for any purpose to a foreign Court. He would wish the House to consider, that if this sum of 400,0001. were laid out in Great Britain among the helpless and the poor, it would afford a relief to the extent of 251. to no less than 16,000 persons, or 501. a piece to 8000 persons--and yet a sum which might be dis posed of se advantageously to the poorer part of the people of Great Britain was to be paid away to a fo reign Court, which, if he knew any things of the people of England, was far from the most popular. It was said, indeed, that in consideration of this sum the Slave Trade was to be abolished. No man more heartily detested that unknown traffic than he did. But it really did appear that Spain had the power of enforcing that Abolition, for which she stipulated on the present occasion. Without entering into a discussion on the state of South America, he would only observe, that it was notorious that the colonies of Spain in that quarter were in a state of revolt, and might beome independent States. If these colonies succeeded in the contest, what would remain to Spain ? Only Cuba and some other such small de pendencies. If thisshould tutu out to be the case, this Treaty would be very far from being the means tithe Abolition which it was held out it would effect.— There was, therefore, no good ground for making a call upon the pockets of the people for this 44)0,0001. It would no longer do for this country to be the pay master of Europe. At the same times he wished it to be understood that he considered the traffic in slaves as most detestable and inhuman—that no man more cordially approved of all measures for its total abolition ; that no man, more honoured the efforts of an Honourable Gentleman (Mr. Wilberforce), who might be said to have devoted his whole life to the attainment of that object, and had thereby immorta lised his name. But he could not consent to any grant of-the . public money to a foreign Court, even for the purpose of putting down the Slave Trade.— If our coffers were replenished, the case would be very •different, and he would allow the Noble Lord to take a million if he pleased ; but as things now stood he would object to the advance even of four hundred thousand pence. He would, if he followed up his feeling on this point, move an Address to his Royal Highness the Prince Regent, praying that this , Tieaty, as far as it related to the payment of four hundred thousand pounds to the Court of Spain, might nia. be fulfilled. But as he did not mean to move an amendment he would content himself with- thus entering his protest against granting such a sum. Mr. WILBERFORCE said that the Honourable Baronet who spoke last did not fairly state the ques tion. It was not whether the House should vote 400,0001. to the Court of Spain, or .501. to each of 13,000 poor persons of the people of England. He would appeal to the good sense of the Honourable Baronet, whether putting the question so was not making it seem as if the sum of 400,0001. if not grant ed to Spain, would be granted to the people ofriland ? On the contrary, the question was whether such a sum should be advanced to obtain a great moral be nefit—to obtain a great commercial advantage to the nation at large ? The Treaty was made, and must either be accepted subject to the condition of paying the money, or rejected altogether.—(Hear, hear.) — It was also to be considered that if this sum were not paid, the Abolition by Spain would not be obtained. But in point of fact, as his Noble Friend (Lord Cas tlereagh), had explained, only one half of this sum of 400,0001. was an actual payment, for to the other half Spain would have been entitled as the value of :captures uncondemned, even if this Treaty had not been made. The question as to the money then was reduced to the sum 0f200,0001. As to the whole Treaty, it met with his most hearty approbation. —When he considered the long course of diplomatic attention which the Noble Lord had bestowed on this great subject, and the great ability and success which had attended his efforts in the cause, he could not but feel how much was due to the zeal and the ta-i lents of the Noble Lord. For his own part, be was , sanguine enough to expect that he might live to see j this country reap the benefits of a commercial inter course with that people who had been so long the victims of so barbarous a trade. Even already was such. an intercourse begun. It was the fashion to disparage the principal Colony on the coast of Africa ^Bat when he considered that there was there a com munity now ivnc•lr.:ing to I o,oooor 11,000 fret pee 'sons, mo!tly negroes, he could not but look forward to the erteasket of such e.settlernent, and to the pro digious comar.rcsl ;r acriantaF which would be re theby obt+Pft uch of, success which had attended the nvoc t ilition wi Spain must be attri buted to whit bad: been done at the Congress of Vienna. It was the Declaration that issued from thence which made Spain and Portugal completely ashamed of the traffic. He could not think the sum of two hundred thousand pounds (fir in fact it was no more) was a great price for the Abolition by Spain, secured in the present Treaty., as it would proba bly be necessary to dispose of the larger part of that sum as an indemnity to her Merchants.- -But the question was not so much about the pecu niary part of the arrangement. The gist of the' whole was, whether the Slave Trade should be abo lished or not? He could not but look forward to the time when the various powers, acting in conceit, would completely effect the Abolition, and when the Slave Trade would be called by the name which it really deserved—Piracy—and not only called by the name, but visited by the punishment—(hear, hear.) — Even on a dry commercial calculation, he was Con vinced that the sum stipulated by the present Treaty would produce advantages, to us of a value more than commensurate to as amount. But above all, when it was considered that a higher and nobler ob ject was to be attained, surely no objection would be , made to it. The sum of all was this—that if it 'was at all intended to go on in the work of abolition, some such arrangement as that under consideration was absolutely necessary. It was not enough for us to have discontinued the traffic, if others were to carry it on. It was not until it was universally abo lished that the commercial advantages of the trade could be felt, by opening the resources of Africeto the nations of Europe for their mutual benefit. En tertaining these views, he could only say, he entirely approved of the Treaty ; and he trusted enough had been said to prove that it was advantageous and wise, and honourable to this nation—(hear, hear.) Sir OSWALD MOSELEY said, that no man felt more strongly than himself the obligations which every true friend of humanity owed to the Honour able Gentleman who spoke last, for his constant and unremitting exertions to put down the most disgrace ful traffie in Slaves ; but of the same time he felt 'that in the present situation of the country, the con dition annexed to the present Treaty involved a pe cuniary sacrifice which we were not in a state to make. The present Treaty was no more than an acceleration of that Abolition which Spain had, at the Congress of Vienna, promised should take place in eight years. He would ask whether, in the pre ' sent state of our finances, it would not have been I better to allow the eight years to expire than to pur chase the acceleration of abolition at such a price as £400,000 ? The pre sent condition of Spain, with relation to her colonies, afforded no very satisfactory grounds to expect that she would be able to effect that Abolition to which by this Treaty she was bound. And then, forsooth, if the colonies were successful in their struggle, and established their independence, we must have new treaties for Abo lition with them, and pay a new price for it.— As to the advantage which the Honourable Gentle man (Mr. \Wilberforce) expected from the trade with Africa, he could not help thinking they were over rated. He would ask, whether ranch money and' many lives had not been sacrificed in endeavouring to establish a colony at Sierra Leone?—(" No, no ! &one several parts of the House.)—lf the Honourable Gentleman examined his memoranda in his closet, he believed he would find this statement correct. As to the other parts of this Treaty, he did not object; but thinking that the stipulation in it for the payment of 400,000/. was one of the most impolitic, nefarious, and ruinous, ever entered into with any foreign power, he should feel it his duty to take the sense of thel House upon it. , Lord CASTLEREAGH said, the Honourable Ba ronet who spoke last was mistaken, in stating that Spain had agreed, at the Congress of Vienna, to abo lish the Slave Trade in eight years. There was no such agreement or engagement, although that period' was the one mentioned as that within which Spain ' esight probably be able to effect that abolition. Sir O. MOSELEY still thought it was not our duty to teach Spain humanity. Sir JAMES MACKINTOSH would have been! contented to give a silent vote in favour of this Treaty, were it not for the sentiments expressed by the two Honourable Baronets who spoke on this ques tion. He concurred with both of those Honourable Baronets in their views of economy. He concurred also in their wishes for the emancipation of South America, and if he did not say more on those sub jects, it was because he thought no higher one could ' engage the attention of the House than the Abolition of the Slave Trade. The most important part of the itsesent Treaty was, that it not only bound Spain to, the abolition, bin provided the means of enforcing that abalitiaa. He wondered very much that the Honourable Baronet who spoke last, thinking, as he seemed to do, of the good faith of foreign govern should not see the i rtance of this part of the Ti, eitkr which.gare trs power of enforcing fulShnent. He could na,t, utt . concur in the greater part of' what had been sai d . y the Noble Lord (Cas mre dereagh) on this subject. He thought that ,the Bri tish flag, which had never been lowered to any Power, to which we had always clung as a point of national honour, now rose higher than ever, as bending only to the rights and duties of humanity—(Hear, hear). —Our jealousy on that subject was gone, where the interests of hirmanity interfered. Our pride was sus pended. That which had resisted the powerful and the mighty, was now lowered to assist the feeble and the defenceless—the hapless victims of barbarity— those who perhaps would never know the sacrifice which we made on their behalf—(hear, hear). He heard with great pleasure from the Noble Lord, that 411 the European Powers had resolved to put an end Fto the Slave Trade ; he had heard with particular „pleasure the Noble Lord's statements respecting the conduct of France, because some doubts had been thrown upon the heartiness of her concurrence, or her acting up to her stipulations respecting the Abo lition. Those doubts arose from the letter of Prince Talleyrand, iaJuly, 1815, announcing that the Slave Trade was to be discontinued ; and the Treaty in November following, which stated that the Trade was abolished in all the territories of France ; and yet it afterwards appeared on certain proceedings in thesAdrniralty Court, that up to January, 181 S, no actual measure bad been adopted for carrying Ott Abolition into execution, excepting one partial Cohn nial regulation. Those who knew nothing of thit diplomatic arrangements implied from these circune , stances that there was a want of good faith on the part of France respecting the Abolition. He could not but notice the laudable and early activity rnani , fested by the Court of the Netherlands in the cause of Abolition—the more laudable when it was consi dered that the Colonial system of that Power being it* proportion far more extensive than any-other in the world, it necessarily involved a more considerable commercial sacrifice by that Power than any other.- -He should vote heartily in favour of the present Treaty, because it established the right of mutual search, and because it followed up the pl ed g es of the House in its repeated Addresses to the Throne to pro. ceed in the great work of the Abolition. Connected with the right of search as established in this treaty, were the principles laid down in a late celebrated decision by a most Learned and Right Hon. Gentle man (Sir William Scott).4thom it was not too much to call the highest authority in Europe upon questions of international law. (Hear, hear.) The decision to which he alluded, was in the case of the ship Louis, and as some misunderstanding prevailed as to the principles of that decision, he took this opportunity of stating what he conceived to be the principles laid down in it. As he understood it, a cruiser otherwise duly authorized, was empowered to detain any ship, under whatever colours, if there was strong ground of suspicion that there were slaves on board ; and if the suspicion turned out to be just, the Hag fraudu• lently assumed by such a vessel was to be no protec tion, nor would it prevent her condemnation. The detention would be at the Officer's peril on the cir cumstances of the case ; but under such circumstan , ces it would be lawful. ' Mr. CHARLES GRANT, jun, thought that the judgment alluded to by Honourable and Learned Gentleman who spoke last, admitted of no misunder standing of the principles laid down in it. if he might venture to add any thing to what was so elo quently said in laying down those principles, it Would be by referring to the right of belligerents as agrinst neutrals. Under whatever semblance a vessel might appear, if there was ground to think that she was a neutral transgressing, the belligerent has a power to detain and search—a power, indeed, to be exercised at the risk of the ?arty so detaining and searching, but the power and: the "right was unquestionable. The check to insolent and vexatious inquiries was not by prohibiting all inquiry, but by following, up by punishment such as were vexations. With respect to the Treaty before the House, the only objection made to it was on the ground of the money which' was to be paid to Spain. To what might be said oldie ap plication of the money by Spain, or to money being the only thing which could induce that Court to agree to the Abolition, it wa s enough to refer to the offer of the Havannah Merchants, who offered 2,000,0001. for the continuance of that traffic which Spain had now agreed to abolish for 400;000/.- -When he looked at the . Treaties *bleb had been lately made, as relating to the Slave Trade; and. corn pared them with those of former times, the compari son was most consoling to humanity. About a hun dred years ago, our whole diplomatic skill was em ployed in securing to ourselves the privilege of being carriers to the rest of Europe in the Slave traffic.-- At the Treaty of Aix-la-Chapelle, we were hig gling to secure to ourselves the benefits of,:that pri vilege for the four years of it that then remained. And at the Treaty of Madrid, in 1750, we took a large sum as the price of those benefits' for the two remaining years that they were to continue. -In short, for the last hundred and fifty years, Africa was only mentioned in any IYeaty as the theatrrforearrying on this horrible traffic. So late even as the Treaty of the year 1783, after it had allotted to the Con tracting Powers their various stations on the coast of Africa, it is stated that the rest of the coast of that country should be frequented as usual ; that was to say, for the purposes of the Slave Trade. The contrast exhibited by recent Treaties was to be attributed to the march which the efforts of the Ho nourable Gentleman (Mr. Wilberforce) had given to public opinion. The efforts of the Honourable Gen tleman had succeeded—his victory was the victor y of peace. It used to be the pride of thit nation, that in the Charter of its liberties, provision was made for the freedom and protection of foreign merchants. It was now a higher pride, that in our Treaties the freedom and protection of the African was a chief article in our Treaties with foreign nations-:—(hear). Mr. BENNET professed himself friendly to the Treaty. He took occasion to chew that France had not acted up to the provisions for the abolition which she had entered into in the Treaty of November, 1815. Every one knew the faithlessness of the race which at present g overned France (though he rejoiced that her former Chief was where Ise now lay); and he thought that the country had a right to expect from the Noble Lord an explanation of the manner in which the abolition of the Slave Trade was carried on by France. He concurred entirely in the Noble Lord's measure. Lord CASTLEREAGH blamed the comments made on the conduct of the French Government, as tending to discourage that Government in its efforts to put down the Slave Trade. He was not enough of a French lawyer to know whether in that king dom, as in Portugal, any engagement entered into with a foreign Power was considered as forming part of the law of the country. But he knew that the department of the navy in France was in the practice of acting under the existing engagement, and issuing orders to the ports to give it effect. If those orders had hot been always strictly obeyed, it was unfair to lay the blame on the Government. He q uote d t h e case of the Governor of the Colony of Bourbon, who had been deprived of his situation for not having been sufficiently attentive in repressing the Slave Trade. He also mentioned that the FrenCh Ambas sador had applied, by order of his Court, for a col.. lection of all the laws in this country respecting that traffic, in order to amend those of France, On the same subject. Mr. GORDON said, he was willing to' acknow ledge the great benefits which, in all probability, would arise from this Treaty ; and even admitting that the sum of 400,0001. was to be given only on the ch:nce, be thought that the country would ad vance it, on the Chance of being deceived. The Noble Lord had stand, that the Stave Trade would be abolished by Spiin and Portugal; but the Bosse , no tot only w complexity of g ht before the tonuaual corm which he con; g ement now to induce th ic When the i tolition, and with th rich measures ~e , penal I the stipulate • no doubt had gn at produce t vied the eau! •, recognized tie Abolition to enforce I portant, for wit What ma .irtance was, c e the Aboliti la much deeper • been adopted estion in settlir nging a tribur As to this, it v hereof the Judg • • anted, was , such . .Iv-subjects be . to be the .11 decide sununai er Slaves w not? When by the appoin must be allows to be done ix •sat of the grey ich had agree • by regulauot press the adc h difficulty. for this pn ••gements ['gene and ab e at the Cour , • also by the F 0 'rig his tern ...tn. The diffic the kind he ; • 'dering how opted in this c same in ester] cial and cola money was ernment in enough for Is the Havannah t, as a prem five times a der the present hear, hear, hea reaty, he beggi IS, with the ur offer was marl a loan of IC try to abol At that ti ride by Spain N was not even Rouse would • ry part of ideration of rimy, and of tl • give or; a for mtages. At ti • it was not :rons of the was stipulat • sincerely desi eling, he was Courts. S I Vianna a ge: au of the abol iag was at le • so great a Indies had pecuniary p ernrnent found y the magnitu o Spain in 181 ly be expect erms less favc :at then, on ountry after t • vance so larg —that we ce that we cc errnerly for the • a representa d agreed tc hich we had I ntth respect t it should • with the the sum she • nncipal part I mar hundr.d t paid, and 1 med turreasi a'- least one hal 7 ease, have Spain as the va beta condmr.ne Is, Wert role 'CO•000/. so th. •mon amounted Thateyer differ part of this T specting the p: s e mixed up in ?atm:ales wou 'tire appropri.: occasion, he w. of coadiality Crovernm.eai fc flat the lloase izes made by a agreeing to s od of union Qon. It w 0.41 to mit up an- c 14 te:.•:a with t w I. • o , * I I • i . I 4 4 i