Star. — London, England, 1805-06-12 00:00:00

th it with me, when (peaking of events which have b ivened ;everal years ago, it was an habitual mode o expreffion. In this particular cafe the expreffion hi, been the fulled of much acrimonious ingenuity a )4 wit, though I protelt before you it was meant to e tvey what was tantamount to a declaration, that I sever did participate in any profits arifing from an improper application of the public money.' It is faid, however, Sir, that I have always (hewn a great pre & Pion for the office of Treafurer of the Navy, even sea n I have continued to aet as Secretary for the' Hone Department. As a good deal of firers has been laid on this infidnation, and as it is evidently I stended to convey a very improper fufpicion ou my character, it will be neceffary fine me to' offer m reply' t s it, one or two fimple oblervations. I mull fay, t ten, that fo far from having any particular preii -I:Ction for the office of Tree lurer of the Navy, 'I had' ne •er varied in an attachment long fince acquiied, at devoting the whole of my time and my talents to the Arabs of our government in India, and my ori ginal appointment to the Treafaierthip of the Navy wore principally nut of the intimate connellian there was betwixt the affairs of the Navy and the bufittefs 1 of the India Board, over which I piefidetl. As to my acc-ptance of the office of Secretary for the Home Department, I feel it due to myfelf to fay, ' that I accepted it only for a few months, in the abfence of a Noble Lord, who was then abroad on an important million. On his return, I earneltly fo• licited my Sovee eign to allow me to refign, and dedi cate all my attention to the India Board—but he was then gracionfly pleated to command the conti nuance of my fervices. I have to add this, which I c in do with truth, that I never continued one day in that office in conformity to my own inclination.— There is one perfnn prefent, and perhaps others, who know this haternent to he correct. 111 did not retire from that office afterwards, it was,hecaufe the circuits awes of the country, and the inclinations of my gracious Mailer did not admit of it. I have now oc euplea x confiderable part of the time of the Hoare in obferiation , generally calculated to explain My - views of the conchiliOns formed on the matter of the toth Repotr:' 1t !hall now go on td make a few remarks on the ftatements contained in the Report cf the Committee which novi lies on yoUr table. Pttmit thither, 'Sir', lift of all to obferve, that if the Com- MitieChad included in their refearches a wider range, and examindd with greater minutenefs into feveral asoinfs;*they would at once have given the Houfe a fairer vie* of the fubjea, and afforded me a more fa tisfadoiy opportunity. of vindicating my character. As the Report now (lands, however, I (hall trouble you Trivia few remarks. I mull obferve, generally, of the evidente given by Mr. Trotter before the Committee, `that it was given tinder circumftances which do not entitle it to ill that confideratinn, which under other circumtlances muR necefrarily have. attached to it.— It will be recolleaed that Mr. Trotter admits be is not poffiffed of the means of corroborating his Rate. merits by written' ocuments, and that he goes back to accounts of tranfaltions for eight, ten and four teen years. While I Rate this as an otrjedion to his evidence being implicitly received, I may at the fame time add. that I have not the means in my power of in every cafe diftinaly defcribing tranfadinto, which happened at fo dillant a period. lam corn pletely at Trotter's mercy, for I have no %melets to enable me in all cafes to afcertain how far" the accounts be lays before the Committee are corre/G-. That Come of his flatements, however, are materially inaccurate,. I have no hefiration in a ff erting, and be fore I fit down (hall be able to prove inconteftibly that in one inflance his account is totally incorrea. The fief part of his flatement, to which I beg leave to - advert is, that part of his evidence where be (peaks of advancing me a furn of twenty thoufand pounds. Here it is not a little remarkable, that the very next day he hai a different recollection of the tranfadion in his examination before the Committee, for he then adds three thoufand more to the (tun which he had formerly fpecified. When we find loch a differenie hf flateinent even with refped to Inch a fum. I think it may be fairly prefumed, that Mr. Trottei's me mtsry is not now fo good as it was conceived and be lieved to be Tome years ago. Now, the next circum- Rance worthy of remark - in this part of the Rate inent, ii what Mr. Trotter advances refpeCting Mr. Tweedy's rupporsel conne&ion with me while Tree- Curer. 'Throughout the whole of his evidence, an impreffion is created, that Mr. Tweedy abed with refpeet to me, in fomething of a confidential capaci ty. At the end of his evidence, however, lie de clares dillinaly, that he conftdered Mr. Tweedy as nothing beyond a fimple meffenger ; on this point my own recolleetion is paled, and that is, that Mr. Tweedy on no occafion whatever, ever acted beyond the capacity of a meffenger, and that I never had, With refpea to him, any confidential communication on any peCuniary concern, in the whole courfe of my ' emanation with the Navy Office. I think it proper for me to (late this, becaufe, from a certain part of Trotter's evidence, it might be infinuated that my connexion at any time with this Tweedy, was of that confidential defcription, which might induce a fufpi cion that he was a ufeful perfon for condoling pecu niary affairs of a delicate nature. But, the queftion does not reft on my affertion only, but is fully con firmed by the evidence of the younger Tweedy, who on his examination denies all knowledge of any con. fidential intercourfe with refped to pecuniary affairs between his father and me; or indeed of any connec tion of his father in Somerfet Houle, but as a mere • common mefrenger. His books too were erarcined, and nnt a tittle of evidence to rapport Inch a fort of connection at all.exifted. Here then a part of Trotter's evidence was found to be matei bosky incorrea and con fared. With raped to a (urn of ten thoufand pounds, laid to be advanced, I do not mean to ;flake any ob jedinn to the fad ci the advance. though it is imr.of fible for me to fay in what manner it was applied.— The Houle are aware, that very loon after I becatne connected with Adminiftration, I was the confiden tial advifer of the Crown with refped to the affairs of Scotland. Ido not fay that I was officially invefted with this character till I was appointed Secretary of State for the Home Department*, but long previous to that period, I was virtually invefled with that im portant funaiou. In the courfe of the advice which I thought it my duty to give, I certainly might have pointed out modes in which this non of ten thoufand pounds might be idefally laid ont in Scotland, brit certainly I shall never hold mjfelf bound to difclofe to circuutilances of this application. Neither pri sate homer nor public duty could authotifefueh A' difeloture. When I was called before the. Clarninif* ,fioners 9f Naval Inquiry, I certainly did refute to give an account of this, and a further fum of . forty thoufand pounds advanced and expended for confi dential fervices of Government, and should have held najfelf culpable indeed if I fqffered my fenfe pf duty tothe public to be overcorne by.any other confi *ration. If 1 were to difclofe fame of thefe confiden tial tranfaOions, then indeed much of that obloquy. which has beensthrown on my head would affurne the charader of jullice. Ai .to what Mr. trotter has ; ahought fit to advance about his occalional advancet' to me, I fhonld certainly fay, that never till now could! have -conceived that any fireir tranfadions ever, ersoleitiace. Thatte should have adeasee4 me /urns' of from ten to twenty thoufan d pounds at a time, is, ) from the date of our tranfadions, altogether incom preirenfible, and could not indeed-have taken place., Tn put the Houfe in polteffion of fome inforetratio,n' of the advance of twenty-three thoufand pounds, it will be necelfary for me to refer to the eircumflances of the Loyalty Loan. The Houk will remember, that, when that Loan was propofed, it was judged proper that per fons in high official fituations ftpuld join their names to the fnbfcription, .with a view of encouraging fo patriotic a 'meaure. Among others of his Majefiy's Minifters at that period, I 1 engaged for a certain funs, and to the beik of my I ecolleelion the money for paying the firs ! inftal. ment was fent from Scotland. Previous to the time when the fecond inftalment was to be paid the Rocks had fallen, and it was by me thought proper that the money (horrid be raifed by lonic ether means.— Through the medium of Mr. Coutts the money was advanced, but certainly not without ample fecurity. A power of attorney was immediately prepared on my part, not only authorizing thole by whom the money was advanced to draw the dividends, but to fell out as Cron as a favourable opportunity prefented itfelf. With raped to any intereft for money ad vanced by Trotter on my account, it never appeared to me an objelt of any confederation, fince, knowing that in the conrfe of fourteen years confiderahly up wards of ao,oool. of my private property had pallid through - his handv, and therefore' the balance, if there was any, could not he confiderable. From the confufion in the mode of keeping the accounts, this balance could not eafily be afcertained. This, how ever, I am quite perfuaded, that advances of ten or twenty thouland pounds never could at one period have earned in Mr. Trotter's favour on the general account.*On the lubjed of the forty thoufand pounds advanced to the lu'ufe of Boyd and Bepfield at a very trying crifis, I (hall notnov, make many obfervations, ash is not at relent the futrjed urged dire/fly agaiqll my charader. 1 certainly have only a wade of Of t ference with Mr. Pitt, as teilhe eireundiances which gave rife to that tradadion. I undoobtedly . did she my advice in' favour of the foiopriely of the _ad vance, and I take my full &ire of the merit or the 'criminality of the bufinefs. The • communication Of Mr. Raikes to Mr. Pitt of the fums of money dravtu oat of ;he Bank for fervices not Naval, or fat the per pole of being lodged in the hands of a private banker, was made known to me at the period when it took place, and a converfation, though of very Thant con tinuance, ensued on the fubje.sl. In what particular manner 1 exprefed myfelf to Mr. Pitt, I cannot at this dittairce of time remember ; but, as far as try recollection goes, i molt have reprefented the ru mour as merely idle, and in that light, 1 may qn. donbtedly have deferibed it. At the time I made this representation, I certainly had fuch a bona jade im preffion on my mind, and with this convretion I fairly flared my fentiments. The belief on my mind was, that by the proper conftrudion of the Aft of Parliament no violation of law had taken place, and no lois to the public had been curtained. The lots fuftained to the public by the defalcation of Jellicoe has been imputed to me as a matter of blame. I afire you, hoivever, and the Houle. thlt I never hate felt in the whole of this bufinefs fo much at cafe as in this tranfiretion. The defalcation it is well known was antecedent to my conneetion wit!. office, and therefore to me no fort of negligence or crimina lity can fairly be imputed: The releafe I obtained from the debt due to the public, under such (lances, I confidered not as a matter at aU of favour. but of arid Office : and, if I had not obtained it, I fhould have had good grounds for Paying, that I had experienced at the hands of thepublic harlh and fe !ere treatment. There is, before I leave this fubjeft, one point on which I' feel it peculiarly incumbent on me to make one or two obfervations. The Mirka to which I refer is the Releafe, Rated to have been executed be twixt me and Mr. Trotter, for the dellrudion of all documents relative to our mutual tranfaelions. I feel it the more necelfary to fay a few words on this point, as I know the exigence of fuch a document has ere; ared a very unfavourable impreffion in the minds of fome individuals of the molt honourable and candid charaders. I am fenfible, Sir, that the exigence of Inch a document has been corral-tied into an evidence of my guilty participation with Trotter in the mifap plication of the public money. If, however, either the evidence or the nature of the thing is looked to; this firfpicion will appear to be totally void of truth. Let Gentlemen confider • where the deed was exe cuted. It was fent down to me for execution in Scot land, when at a diflance of upwards of four hundred miles. How it came I cannot now afcertain, whether it was fent in a frank, or whether it was brought by a man of bufinefs efpecially employed for that put.. pore. This only I r‘colltet, that it was ligned at my ton's honfe in the country, and that the only two witnefies were two menial fervants. If I am afked whether any converfation ever took place on this fuhjeft with Trotter? I anfwer readily and explicitly, No • and confident I am, if the fame quell - lon were raked him, he would give a fimilar anfwer. If I were again eked whether I ever gave Mr. Spottifwood or his fon any order to prepare Arch an instrument ? I should anfwer unequivocally, No ; and I am fuze they would confirm the affeveration. Is it poflible then, I defire any man to confider with himfelf,' to conceive that, if fuch a document was of fo vafi im. i:partance, it 'Mould never have been eanvallbd in con verfation betwixt the parties principally concerned ? If it was fn et/andel, why was it not fettled by a per fonal interview, infiead of the mode which I have deferibed ? Surely, if there were guilty conneftirme betwixt the two parties, and they were mutoallfr a:s - tid of vouchers appearing againft them, common fenfe would have taught them .to fettle the brifittek by a mutual agreement to deßroy documents of Co' dangerous a defcription. Ts it to be believed that if Any foul proceedipp exified, that men of honour, like ; Mr. Spottifwood and his fun were to be let into the; feeret and pot in poffefflon of the very document by which the record of that guilt,of which the partieiwere 1 afraid, thould be perpetuated ? Whitt, however, rep- 1 dery .the frptiofition 'Rill more ablurd, is, that the 1 deed contained a caufe of Regifkration, and here an 1 infiturnent, nominally intended to flicker guilt,' was to be put on the records of a Conn, where on ,any future oceefion it might be appealed to as an in firument of condemnation. Botitis laid as a ground of fufpiciqn, that the document was drawn up about theprecife time that the Nevel Commenonets were: appointed. - This, Sir, is Cutely a avenge fort of con elution. if the appointment Of the Naval Conunif-1 Toners filed - Mr. Trotter and myfelf with filch. fudden clifna7_, the expedient we fell on to get rid of! our fears, vai one pf a very notable .defceiption. In-' Read of quietly ecinfigning our papers to the lames,, and this evading all difcbvery, we draw up a bond of releafe .vitii& thefe formidable Commiffonert get poffeltion of, and thus give rite to a thoulaed fuf ',winos pchich.Could not otherwife have citified. In every view of the fubjed, therefore, the exiftenee of the deed of releafe is no ground of fufpicion. Its very exiltence ja a proof that the vouchers dedroyed were not nf a nature which at all proved A participation of the profits of public money, improperly applied to purpofes of private advantage. Whether nega tively or politively contidered, the cetileaCe of the deed is the reverie of a ground of (ufpicion. I %hall not much longer occupy the atteption of the Houle. I can affure thole Hon. Gentlemen who have been molt forward in attacking me, and the Houfe gene. rally, that my fpirits may continue to be, as they have been already, cruelly afflided by that perfe cation which has affeiled me, but, if they think that they will 'he able to bear me down by their violence, they wilt find themfelves greatly deceived. My feelings have been, indeed, dreldfolfy lacerated. —My moll fiffegtiooate 'limits, agd my neareft and demoti relatives, hair pertoken dimity of my fuller logs—Ada:jogs Doi aliule aggravated by reSeding who were force of thofe by whore hands the blovis were inflifted,t—Situated as I am, however, I have La befitation in fayieg, that I am prepared for the re full, whatever may be its nature. I Arita that my character, now Co: unjultly traduced, Will loon come to be underilood is its true colours. I trait the time is rapidly approaching, when my accufers will be put to Menet, and the &alias I have rendered the coon• try be fully acknowledged. If, however, I Ibould ' s not lire to fee my charade, fully exonerated from the load of calumny under which it is now oppreffed ;1 even were Ito fink down to the tomb calumniated as a public defaulter, I fhould die in the petted con oidion that pofierity would do me juilice, and that tbe'pen of the impartial hifforith would refcue my name from unmerited obloquy. Before I retire, I Mull fay a very few words oo the nature of the mo •tion which is to be fnbmitted to the Houle this day. If it is adopted, it will . place me in one of the bioft extraordinary fituations that ever fell to the tot of a homan being. I am told, Sir, that all that has hitherto taken place is pot to be confidered, if a punidiment, as at all adequate to the magnitude of my offence. Is it no punilhment, Sir, to be fiig matifed as a perfon unfit for any flotation of public troll, unfit to be admitted to any participation in the councils of his Sovereign ? Is it no puniflunent to have the sigma of the higbCourt of Parliament pronounced againit me, and that Ifigma publifhed from one end of the kingdom to another? Even, Sir, if the motion of the Impeathment were fuccefsful, what heavier punillo Tent could be inflided, than that which I have alrea dy endured ? Does any man fay that what I have fuf fered is not pimilliment ? Does any man pretend to fay, than an attack on my fame, my honour, my feelings, my charaigter and my poßerity, is no pu. niflutrent f Surety this is adding infult to perfecu tion, and aggirivation to fuffering. But in addition to all that nave already fuffered, have not this Houfe ' ordered the Attorney• General to profecute me for rellitution of any profits foppofed to be derived from the participation of the benefits arifing from the toirapplico;ion of the public money.? Is this no pu. nifhtnent lsit nothing to one looking forward to fpend his left folitude and repofe, to becompelled to endure all the anxieties and proceedings in a Court of Law ? Is it nothing to look forward, at the ch'fe of life, to peifectition and beggary ? But I will not infiti further on thefe points. I leave them to the feelings and candour of the Houfe. But who , I beteech the Houk to confider, would, in cafe th; impeachment were carried, be my judges ? The Houle are aware that many Nobletords have inter cited themfelves warmly againil me, in different parts f of the kingdom. Are thefe Noble Lords now fit to - be my impartial Judges I—.lt is a fufficient objedion againfi a juryman, that his partiality and prejudice are afcertained. Surely then violence of prejudice is fully as wrong an objedion againft a Judge. I !hall fuppofe another mode of trial which they might have figured to themfelves. Would the men who, by every means in their power, have endea voured to poifon the minds of the people egainft me by fpeeches at Palace yard, or by harangtics at the Common Hall, with the very fame pertuns to com pote the Jury by whom I am afterwards to be judg ed ? Men whole feelings anti prejudices are already pnifoned- againdlirne. This indeed induces me to be lieve that the rumours which I have heard, of a pro pofal to impeach me, were never let ionfly entertain ed. Feelings fuel) as there can never be fuppofed to agnate the people of this country, nor the reptefea tatives of the people in this Houle. This leads me to another confideration, femewhat fonder in its na tore. A civil procefs has been ordered to be inflitu ted againft me for the recovery of money,. Is it meant that both proceffes fhould go on at the fame. time t That the perfons examined in the one fhould be transferred to give their evidence in the other, jai as eircumitances might fcem to warrant 1. That the Attorney General might r with the evidence which, he had been able to obtain in the civil fuir, and put it into the hands of the perfon managing the itn• :peachment ? Or, wire verja, if any fads came out in ette'emfrfe of the impeachment, were they, without more 'ceremony, to be again brought forward in the civil ration ? I alit, is iirecoricileable with any one feeling of juilice that (itch a multiplicity of proceed ings Humid be allowed to go on at the fame time ? Di- that; for the inflidion of one jolt and adequate QhmEnt, feparate and different fpecies of pro '''i Ihduld• be inßitated ? Would it not hive been faint that the whole of the bullnefsfhonld hal, been taken together; that one trial, one judgmet.:, and, if neceffary, one punilhment fhould have b een infliaed ? If I am thus to be marked our, I truit I (hall not be a folitary objea of a punifnment unet ampled in its nature. and which cannot be focetioned without endangering the fafety of Come of the gaol honourable families for rank, talent and charaaer is the kingdom." Immediately after concluding his Speech. 'Lord Vifcount Metvicts withdrew. And after force little paufe, Mr. WHITBREAD role, and addreffed the Houfe in afpeech of which the following is meetly an outline: ,* It mutt have afforded a great fatisfaftion to the ,Houfe. ,and I flectare it has afforded great fatistoetion to me, as the .perfon to whofe lot it has fallen to oii ginate the proceedings again(! the Noble Lord, that, The has hot at lah tad liberty, he has, however, roken an opoortoolty to enter on Iris .defetwe. I olio ma be allowed to fay, that it around Use loan Lit store fatistaetoey to enc. if, oorifiltentlyarrith the f orms of the Hoge. the Noble Lord could have been pre fent to hear What !hall be salledgod .apinft him. ,I would have expeaed after the affertions of innocence which the Noble Lord has made, *gate mould have been p repared to have pointed out tome means by which the truth of his affertions might have been b roug h t to trial. As his affertions ate contrary to the evidence taken on oath before the Coon mifionses of Naval Inquiry, to that taken before the Beloit Committee, and even in a great 'ileac= to Isis own I evidence, the Noble Lord can hardly topple that we -atoll be induced to peter his orefeit arartions. woe. corn ponied by proof of any kind. I notsrallytuppofed, the Noble Lord 'being fo confident in his innocence, that he would have been antions to hove gone challis ,trial. His (pees!), however, delivered in this Houfe, _glows, that 'he is pot willing to enter into any fuck iovejtigotion. He tells you. that oa trial can now itofiver the cods of jolt ice. You cannot impeach him ; the Peers have prejudged him. You cannot proceed agaiutt hint ot Clitnnion Law ; the Juries of this cottony, to far as the Noble Lord is concerned, ate cootominated. Becaufe the condodt of the Noble Lord has been' fuch as to excite the indignation and to *route the refentment of every hooch man wbo has had an opportonity of contidering it. therefore the couotry is to be arraigned ; therefore, the Noble Lord, profiting by the enormity of his rffeoce, is to avoid punithment ! But, even fuppofing that a Tri bunatnot liable to the obje.9ions urge,' by the Noble Lord could have been found, all the argument of -his l a nrd th ip, as to ;be impoffibility a proceeding againft him, remained entire. Your proceedings-- the proceedings of the Houle of Commons—have, according to the ideas of the Noble Lord, been fuels ai to preclude the polEbility of any farther invelliga lion. I however maintain the contrary; and I call on the Hon. and Learned Gentleman oppofite to tae, to watch what I have to fay on this point, and to thew in what terra my ideas are erroneous.. Then is, however, a thing to which I mutt alludelo.partng: . An Hon. Gentleman. on a former night, aked ill !peke as the organ of the Committee ? That gaeftioft was turely unnecefary-, I had not let a word drop which could denote fo. If the Committee had an or gan it mutt be their Chairman. But though the god lion was unneceffory, it was not put without adefign. It was obvioufly meant to infer, that I was bringing forward my ornien contrary to the opinion of the Committee. This I deny. The Committee have ex-- Bread no opinion on the Cul t ic& ; and I. as as jade . penclent Member of this-I.lole, and asamentber °tam Committee, feel myfelf vtortanted in fulunittiug M the confideration of the Houfe the motion which I (hall this night have the honour to make. It cannot but be in the recollection of the Houle, that it was my with. after the original refolutians were voteddeclare tory of the condua of Lord Melville, that a Com mittee humid be appointed to enquire into his parti cipation in the emolument orifing from the pee of the public money. The Houle interfered, mid the remit as to the participation of the Noble Lord was eh- Rained from. The rehriaions then thrown on the Committee were afterwards found to be inefficient, and againft the coutfe of jollice. A civil Ink was then moved, and a criminal anion being moved to be fobflituted for it, the amendment war neived.— This was the hate of proceedings which bad taken place. The Noble Lord maintains that in this fitua ring the Houfe are precluded from proceeding to in peacbruent. If bis affertion. however, be good for any thing, I would with to know how the privileges of this Houfe would hand with rcfpcift to the right of the Crown ? The Crown toight,ot any time, dire& a civil fait to be brought, and. it would. at once, ac cording to the Itatement of the NobleLprd, bar your impeachment,! But are there not frequent iollauces of two aaions proceeding at the fame time for the f• ne offence ?*As in the cafe of an affault, in which both compenfetion to the party injured, and puoifit ment for the outrage committed, might legally bete miired ? A civil anion is for a compeofation io mosey. A criminal profectirion, or an impeachment, is. for punifltment of the offender. And, I again affert, that we will not difcharge our duty to the public, if we think that money can in this cafe prove any thing like. .a compenfation. But what is there ko prevent the Houle from abandoning the order which they have already adopted, and as they have &I-coverer:Li:roe thing more atrocious than they were at Ern moue of, and from which their fulpicions haw been arensehes ed, to order an impeachment to go forward. Ind the' civil aetion either to be wholly abardanect or to he fulpenderi till the impeaelinseart is at as end ? The Noble Lord has laid, Will you , do in my cafe what you haw never done in any other ? I. alike:, No. In the cafe of Mr. Haiongs there was a Mail fait de .pending againit him in Chancery, at the fame time that the impeachment: was proceeding. Lord Lough borough ordered proceedings in the civil fuit to be forpended tili the impeachment was at an end. I Fireffitne the Honourable and Learned Gentleman oppogte has not yet made very c.,nfidetable progrefi in the bufinefs ; nor willany delay be attended to him with great inconvenience. Wish refpea to the appeal made by the Motile Lord to the feelings of the Houle, I. hope it will not be ts.,ppofed that I do not feel. as I ought fr r any man t I rank, family and talent, who is involved in loch oicgracetel charges as thole which un:ortuitately do attach to the Noble Loud. But it is impidfible foe me ro allow my feel ings to interfese.with my. duty, The defence let u; by the Noble Loed is. fo• Lox *bort of what I (hoot,' have expcicd, that I-coafafait rather furnilbes topics