Star. — London, England, 1805-03-06 00:00:00

P.IRLIAMENT.IRr PROCEEDINGS. HOUSE. OF LORDS, I TUFSDAY, MARCH S. One of the Mailers in Claccery reported the anfwer of the Ware of Commons to their I.orclt.i.ps' Maar, deftring the per mit:Bon of the Lottfe to the Right Honourable Sir John Stuart. Bart. one of its Members, to atte:d a Committee of their Lord ihips, importing, that the Houfe ha.! panted persuades accor dingly. _ _ Sir John Stuart was afterwards fworo at the bar, with retied to his propolid coldest= before the Committee of their Lordihips, to whole confideratioo the matters Alledgedio charge agaial Mr. Juitice Fox are referred. Mr. Ac EXANDs a brought up from the COMMON, the Addition al PoaAge Duties Bill, and the Ncw Loam Bill, which wcre hve ray rc.,4 a Brit. time. Lord MULGRAVE, teeing a Noble Baron (King) in his place, on whole motion their Lord !hips Rand fummoned for Friday neat, fur the difcuf fion of a fubjea of confiderable importance, obferv ed, that it would tend greatly to the convenience of feveral Noble Lords, were the Noble Baron, should it make no material difference to him, to poOpone his intended motion until the following Monday.— The Noble Secretary adverted to foam degree of in convenience which might attach to his own atten dance on that day, au well as that of certain other Ni‘ble Lords. • Lord KING, in reply, adverted to what had al ready taken place wait' icri;e4l to poßponing the dif cuffion in queffion ; it had been twice poffponed, and very lately, on the requifitiun of a Noble Lord, col league of the Noble Secretary's. His Lordlhip al. luded to the inconvenience it would be to feveral Noble Lords at his fide of the Houfe, were the dit euffion farther poßponed. He was willing to make every reafonable conceflion to the convenience of No ble Lords ; but, as the prefent cafe flood, he fhould, anlefs fome bong reafun fora further poflponement were affigned, adhere to his intention of bringing for ward his motion on Friday. Lord WALSINGHAM acquainted their Lord- Mips, that he Mould have to-morrow, a propofition to fubrnit to the Houfe refpeding a power in the Committee to whom the matters alledgcd in charge againtt Mr. juffice Fox was referred, to report from time to time, &c. And moved that their Lordthips be fummoned on the occafion ;, which was ordered accordingly. Earl FORTESCUE addicfred a few obfervations to their Lordfhips on the point of putting off his in tended motion of this evening, relative to certain dif miffals from the Dock Yard, until to-morrow. This proceeding, he was induced to adopt, in confequence of the abfence of a Noble Vifcnunt (Lord Melville), who, he underllood, would, to-morrow, be able to attend in his place, and from his with to pay every reafonable degree of attention to the pet fonal conve nience of Noble Lords. At the fame time, he wifhed to have it underflood, that the motion was fixed for to-morrow, and to be brought forward at as early an hour as the ufual practice of the licufe would per mit, which, he conceived, would be at half paR four o'clock. He concluded by moving that the Lords be fummoned for to-morrow. Ordered. Acl;ou eel. HOUSE OF COMMONS. Mr. BAKER reported from the Conimitt , e appointed to exa mine the Petition of Mr. Bowyer of the Hillnrie (Wier', Pall Mall. Ag: reably to the faid kepert the Honourable Member neoved sod obtained leave to briny in a Bill for , lirrofts/ of the Gallery. Pietures, and Prints of Mr. Cowycr by lottery. Mr. WILMAMS, from th,T Borid Naval inquiry, prefented at the Bar, purfuant to Order, LeFies of the Corte-foot-Acme be tween the Lords of the Admiralty, and the Conmuiamen of Na val inquiry, refpeCting the P.ipers rehired to the Lid Commit boners on the cafe of Sir Herne Popham, and the date of the re turn of thole Papers to the Lords of the Admiralty, together with a Copy of the Examinations Liken before tue Commiffioners on the (object of there Paoers.—Ordered to he on the table, and on the motion of Mr. S. &tame to be printed. Mr. MAY gave notice that he would ua Friday neat move for leave to bring in a MA for the repeal of the Six per Cent. Duty, to which the Retail Importers of Ireland are at preient fubjeCt. The SPEAKER fuggeitee. to the Honourable Member, that by the underfianding of the Houfc, no other bonne(' was to be brought forwardoo Friday. but the renewed difeugion upon the fubjeft of the Middlefet Eledtion of 1802, refpeeting the Sherdfs. Mr. MAY therefore changed his notice to Thurfdity. Mr. WM. DICKINSON brought in a Bill for the Regulation of the Marine Forces while on thure.—Rd a Ertl., and ordered to be read a fecund time to-morrow. Sir JOHN B. WARREN parented a Petition from the Corpo ration and certain inhabitant, of Nottingham, againft the Core Bill of Taft &Moos —Ordered to lie on the table . Mr. YOUNG, from the Commilloncre of Cuittrns, prefented at the Bar purfuant to ord‘r, an account of the Tonnage and number of Ships employed in the Welt India Trade.—Ordcred to Ea on the Table. Mr. ALEXANDER brought up the Report of the Expiring Laws Committee, which was mu; and agreed to, and on that Riklotion which relates to the Trade of the Ifle of Mann, leave was given to bring in a Bill. Mr. FOSTER prefented, purfbant to order, Accounts of the Extraordinary and Ordinary Revenues of Ireland, for the year 1804 ;together with other ACCOLIAL—Ordered tour on the table. A Megage from the Lords ftatcd their LordiLips' Arcot to the Surrey Iron Railway Bill, and level private Bills. Here tome paufe took place In the progrefs of bullacfs. owing as was fuppored, to the 'Hence a Mr. Pitt. IMLAY. MS TINS tinusit OF COMMONS. Mr. C. W. WYNNE refe r and obferved that a cer• taio hour was appointed for the commencement of public bufinefs, but that notwithfianding thib unbufinefs WAS proceeded generally upon until much later This delay was fo extremely inconvenient to feveral Mem. bees that he Would feel it his duty to move the reading of the Orders of the Day on thin as well as on every other occafion when filch delay Would occur. Mr. FULLER juflified the 'obfervation of the Honourable Gentleman, and dated that, in conk quence of the irregularity complained of, he was feldr.m able to get a dinner more than once a week —(a laugh.) Mr. HUSK ISSON oVerved, that no time was loft in the dilatory of bufinef, today. The little panic which had occurred Arnie from the remelting at the Bar for force papers he meant to prefent to the Hofe. Mr. C. W. WYNNE laid, that, although, according to Order, public Winer thauld commence at four o'clock, yet it WAS now become the eutiom to pott pone it generally until half after tive. This was the more tube complained of, as it was known that no Houle could be made at four o'clock totters forty Members were prefect; and if thole Members amid attend, they would have to wait for above an hour before any Im fi cers was proceeded on. Mr. JAMES MAK FIN conceived this to be a •ery fit and proper fubjea of complains. H e 1,,,d long noticed the wane or time that had taken place jn c , oreoucnce of the &ay , alluded to, and was much alloniflted that no Member had before called rho at tention of the Houle to it. Such delay appeared to him to be ditrelpeeful to the Hottfe in general, ;..:d pa: c,.ularly to mac Chair. The SECRETARY at WAR hid that it had ay. r-r been in hi, reeollettion the pratiice to proceed upon paLlic bufinefs until five o'clock. He denied that there bad been any ground of complaint to-day whatever might have taken place on a former day, when the attention of the Houfe was called to this fub j ett. Any paufe in the progrefs of bufinefs to. day, *role entirely from the interruption given by this converfation to his Honourable Friend, who was jult about to prefent fame papers to the Houfe. CORN HILL. Petitions were Relented by Lord Aactiman Ha wisros from Lanark, Ruthcrglen, and other place's in Scotland, praying the Itcpe4l of the Corn At of laft SelSon. The SECRETARY at WAR took oceafion to call the attention of the•Houfe to the fubjeB of thole Petitions. It appeared to him that the Petitioners complained of the evils of the Bill, which, in point of fad, had not yet come into action. This Bill was not to operate until Corn was at a certain price; and as no fuch cafe had yet occurred, he rather thosight the people were deluded, and perfnaded to feel a grievance of which they had yet had no experience. Lord ARCHIBALD HAMILTON vindicated the right of the people to petition even where the evil of which they complained was but likely to arife. In this cafe, however, the evil was adually experi enced. The very paffing of the Ad had done cod fiderable mifchief. It had created an alarm that had not yet fub&ded. It had raifed the price of Cora. But, even fuppofing that it had not produced that effeet, if the object of the Bill were exceptionable, it was of couife Inch as the people were entitled to deprecate, and again& which it was their right, in tereft, and duty to petition. Sir WM. ELFORD Hated the oble& of the 48 to which the Petitions referred to be, to promote agriculture by encouraging the farmers. Bat as the Ad had not yet been in operation, he maintained that the price of Corn was not fairly attributable to it, and that Corn would have been, from various cir cemliances, at its prefent rate, if that Alt had never exited. This he thought it neceffary to mention, as a great deluaon had gone forth among the people, that the exigence of this Ad had produced an en hancement in the price of Corn. The Petitions were ordered to lie on the Table. 5.010 SIILVILLI. Mr. HUSKISSON moved the discharge of the Orders refpating the Lordllsips of Fife ancl Stra thern, with a view to move for the prods Lion of do coments more accurately dercriptive of the objeEt to which the Honourable Gentleman referred, upon whore motion tbofe Orders were made. Mr. GREY raid, he underflood that the motions inferted in the Orders alluded to were not fufficient ly accurate. The Orders being difcharged, Mr. HUSKISSON moved for a Copy of any Leafe granted to the Hon. John Hope, in Trull for Jane Vifcountefs Melville, of the Lordfhips of Fife and Strathern. Alfo an account of the Intromifflon of John Crawford; the Rents and Arrears due upon the faid Lordihip ; the Charges and Difcharges re fpeaing the fame, &c.—Ordered; and thole accounts were afterwards prefented by Mr. Hnflcilron, and ordered to lie on the Table, and to be printed. MUTINY BILL. The SECRETARY at WAR proceeded to move the third Reading of the Mutiny Bill. In making this motion he was afraid that he fhould difappoint the expeaatien of the Honourable Officer on the other fide (General Fitzpatrick), as he was not pre pared to admit the propofitions which that Honour. able Officer recommended on a former day. For hirnfelf he was ready to confzfs, that thofe propofi tions appeared to be perfealy reafonable. They were, according to his recelleCtion. that the Mem bcrs of Regimental Courts Martial fhould be fworn, that they fhould be anthorifed to adminifter oaths to witnelles, &c. and that no Prefident of fuch a Conic Martial fhould be under a t years of age. However, although they were unexceptionable in his opinion, there were many officers of confiderable experience and high rank, who entertained doubts of the pro p iety of introducing fuch innovations into the old eitablifhed fyfiem of the army. To the doubts of fuch perfons be thought it proper to defer, although he was free to own, that in the objeaions they ad vanced he faw no force. Yet it was due to them to allow time for fuller deliberation on the fubj et, and with a view to that he would propof e a flight altera tion in this Bill, which could not be conveniently de layed in its progrefs, to this effeft, a that it might be altered or amended within the Seffion." This al teration would, he hoped, meet the eoncerrence of the Hon. Officer, as it would afford an opportunity of introducing the amendments he fuggefted. General FITZPATRICK laid, - that in confe quence of the copference he had had with the Right Honourable Gentleman, and the obvious Office and neceffity of the propofitions he fuggefted, which met that Right Hon. Gentleman's entire concurrence, he had thought it unnecefrary to trefpafs on the atten tion of the Houle, by Rating the grounds upon which he was urged to fulnnit thoie propofitions. Thofe grounds were filch as he had very little doubt would convince tlie majority of the Houle of the propriety of adopting the amendments he propofed. He had, indeed, never heard any feridusobjeition urged againa them. It therefore !truck him as rather extraordi nary, after the declared coincidence of the Right Ho nourable Gentleman, to be told that Tome military officers entertained doubts upon the fubjea. No doubt was expreffed by any lerfon of that Houle; not a fentence of objeftion was heard from any Mem ber ; and yet thofe falutary improvements; for the adoption of which policy, humauity and juftice equally called. were to be rejefted or delayed, be cattle thole military officers doubted. How, he would elk, were the objeaions of loch military perfons to be brought before the Houfe in a parliamentary form ? and the mere flatement of their ob4eeions, unaccompanied by any reafon for tech objeaions, was not, he contended, a parliamentary ground for the delay or the promotion of any meafure. The time required in the opinion of the Right Hon. Gen tle/nab, to deliberate upon the propofitions he had felt it his duty to recommend, was attainable in his judgment without propofing the alteration the Right Honourable Gentleman alluded to. There was no neceffity to hurry the Bill through the Houfe. This was only the fifth of the month, and aide was yet time enough to pats it, even ghouls! the Right Hon. Galatia/11i% cordon to poitpone the thiiil icad lag %MB fame day neat week. For himfelf, he waft fay, that he felt he was at prident rather awkwardly cireamnaneed. He had declined to prepare the Chafes he withed to introduce into the Bill, relying that the Right Honourable Gentleman would bring them forward. The Right Hon. Gentleman would, howeve►, he ?Tufted, agree to poftpone his motion— particularly as no inconvenience could refult from fuch poftponement. He alfo trufted that the Right Honourable Gentleman would not withhold his af- Nance from him in drawing up the necefary claufes —further, that the Right Honourable Gentleman would manfully maintain bis declared opinion, and fecond his endeavours to promote the adoption of thole Claufes. Colonel STUART thought the principle of the prnpoitions recommended by the Honourable Offi cer ought to be carried further, and that the degrees of ptusithment to be inflicted by Regimental Ccurts Martial ought to he limited. The number of Mem bers on inch Courts Martial ought, in his opinion, to be in no csfe lets than liven, unlefs where a Field Of ficer prefided, and In inch cafe not let than five. This was a regulation which appeared to him highly ne neffary, but he particularly enforced the propriety of prohibiting the fentences of Regimental Courts Mar tial front infliaing beyond a certain degree of punifii men!, not more than a or Soo lithe:. The SECRETARY at WAR. erpreffed his rea dinefs to affift the Honourable Officer in drawing up the claufes with refpea to the propofitions•he men tioned, and in which he for concurred. He al. fo a ff ented to his with for poftponing the motion, and'lliould therefore move the third reading on Mon day next. Sir EYRE COOTE cordially approved the pro pokions of the Honourable Officer, and thought that no officer fhould be admitted' a dember of any Court Martial who was under twenty-one years of age. This alteration would, be was perfuaded, be very grateful to the feelings and conducive to the in terefts of the army. The order for the third reading Of the Bill was poftponed till Monday. PARISH ILL. Mr. WINDHAM afked whether any inquiry bad been made with refpeet to the Report from the coun ty of Surrey of the men raifed under the Additional Defence Bill ? The CHANCELLOR of the ERCHE(WER re plied, that there was a miflake in the return on the table ; and that millake arofe from fome men who bad enlilled for general terrace, having been put on the lift raifed under the Additional Defence Aft. This mißake corretted, reduced the number for the coun ty of Surrey to ss. Lord WILLIAM RUSSELL Rated, that at the laft general meeting for the county of Surrey, there was a return made of only 14 railed under the Ad ditional Defence Aft. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER Paid that the Raternent he had juft made, was found ed upon information received from the nfpetior Ge neral's Office, where he had diredled inquiry to be made on the fubjea. The Pleafure Horfe Duty Bill was read a third time and paged. MIDDLISIX ag.acTiov. Lord MARSHA Di brought up the Report of the Committee appointed to try the merits of the petition from the Middlefez Ele6ors, complaining of the return for Middlefex. The Report was read, and the following are its re• folution s : That George Bonito* Efq. was sot duly returned for t►e Laid County ; that Sir ?rands Burdett, Bart. ought to have been returned. That neither the petition of the Freeholders, nor the Intrados nude to it,was frivolous Sr vexatious. The Report being agreed to, it was ordered, on the motion of Lord Mae IMAM, that the Clerk of the Crown fhould attend to-morrow, to cancel the name of G. B. Mainwsping, and Wert that of Sir Francis Burdett. cALT TAX. On the motion that the CHAIRMAN fhould leave the Chair, in order to go into a Committee on the Salt Tax Bill, Mr. JOHNSTONE rote, not he raid to repeat the general arguments on this meafure, which the Houfe had beard fo forcibly urged yetlerday, but to call the attention of Gentlemen to the operation of the Salt Tax in Scotland. When this tax was impofed in 1795, it was reduced in Scotland from 6s. 6d. to 4s. per buthel. This reduaion took place in confequence of a confideration of the peculiar circumflances of the people of that country. Now he wilbed to under -1 Rand how it was propofed to draw the additional tax I contained in this Bill from a country fo circumftan ced. If in 1795 it was incapable of paying more than 4s. per bufhel, why was it now deemed capable of affording 9s. ? Confidering, indeed, the lunation of Scotland fully and fairly, it was his opinion that it would be much wifer to remit the Salt Duty in that country altogether. That duty produced but 4c,0001. per annum, and there was a bounty allowed from the Excite amounting to 29,0001. which, with a confiderable hour.ty from the Cutloms, exceeded the produce of the tax. For there reafons he fubmit- WI that a repeal of the duty as to Scotland would be not lets advantageous to the Revenue than to the people of Scotland. If fo, then how could Mi flitter& jutlify the impofition of a farther Salt Tax upon that country. Mr. HUSKISSON Rated the reafon for the former reduaion of the Salt Tax in favour of Scotland to be this, that as the Scotch people manufaanred their Salt from tea water, they were fubjel to an increa fed expence for fuel. On that account this allowance was made, which was Rill propofed to continue, and Re contended therefore that the people of Scotland had no reafon to complain. As to the produce of the revenue arifing from the Salt Duty in Scotland con trolled with the bounty, be admitted that it Wall not conlidefable—but then its reduced amount proceeded from the frauds that were known to exiß, and the fmuggling with Ireland. IF, 'however, the Honour able-Gentleman would look into the Bill before the Houle, he would fee that fuch provifions were intro duced into it as were calculated effeaually to prevent thole frauds in future. ' A disifion took place upon the motion—Ayes 158, Nnes 58—Majority too. • 011 our return to the . Gallery the Honfe had come out of the CoMmittee, and the Report was ordered to be. brought up tO.morrow. HAMM TAX. The Houfe refolval into a Committee on the Pr., petty Tax Bill. Lord TEMPLE gave notice, that he would to. morrow move for the exemption of Military Officers, below a certain rank, from the payment of this tax. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER an nounced his intention of oppofing any propation for the exemption of any dais of men from this tax, as contrary to the fpirit and equity of the meafure, and calculated to undermine the whole contribution. Sir JOHN NEWPORT called the attention of the Committee to this tax, as it afFe&ed the property in the funds belonging to perfons refideot in Ireland. This he conceived to be contrary to the principle of the Union, which propofed to leave the rcfources of each country applicable to the treafory of that country. It would be alto contrary to the policy which diaated an exemption in favour of the funded proprity of Foreigners, which arofe from a with In inducr Foreigners to vett their money in our funds. The operation of this tax with refpea to perfons rc fident in Ireland would, he obferved, be Mill more feverefor this reafon, that according to the Aft, the Fright's Agent would be obliged to make a return of the whole property of his principal, and thus the fame perion might be Cubic& to the payment of the fame tax in both countries. Under thofe circuna fiances the Honourable Baronet propofed a clank to exempt from the tax fuch property in the fonds its ,belonged to perfons who pay the hearth money and window tax in Ireland. Idr. ALEXANDER did not think the object of the Honourable Baronet attainable in the way he propofed. Sir JOHN NEWPORT Rated that when he before mentioned the fubjed, he was told that the Commit tee would be the proper place to bring forward this propofition. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER obferved, that the propofition of the Honourable Baronet could not be entertained, as no previous in. firuaion to the Committee had been voted. As to the propofition itfelf, he was furprifed to hear it Rated, that it involved a violation of the principle of the Union. It was not lets agreeable to that principle than to the precepts of common equity, that the pro. perty in each country thould be fubjea to the taxa tion, and appropriate to the treafury of that country. This was prec:fely what this tax, ()bluffed to by the Honourable Baronet, propofed; and, on the fame principle, the property in the funds of Ireland, be longing to perfons refident in this country, would be rubjed to the taxation, and applicable to the purpofes of that country. fhould it be thought proper to lay a tax on fuch funds. By the fame parity of rea foning the land in each country would, in cafe of a land tax, be rubjea to the tax impored in that country. He recollcaed that the Irith Parliament had laid an additional tax on the lind of abfentees ; and therefore they proceeded upon quite a contrary principle to that on which the propofition of the Ho nourable Baronet was grounded. Indeed, he never heard of any project of exemption, fimilar to that propofed by the Honourable Baronet. Sir J. NEWPORT perfifled in maintaining that it was contrary to the principle of the Union to draw there refourees from the ufe of Ireland which would be otherwife fent into it. Independently of this ground of objetion, however, he claimed the ex emption he propofed, upon the fame principle as that which induced the Houfe to exempt the funded pro perty of foreigners. Unlefs the property of thelat. ter were deemed more leered than that of the Irifh, he taw no reafon why this propofition mould be re fined. If the Hon. Gentleman fhould perfiß in op. poling his object, he declared that he 'avoid move to expunge from the Bill, the exemption in favour of Forogners. Mr. BANKS moved the introduction of a claufe to exempt from the operation of the tax, Each property as is veiled in the hands of trudees for charitable purpofes only, upon proof being made before the CommiXoners of loch fact. After tome converfation q in which it was under. Rood that this exemption is to be made applicable ttk both the old and the additional tax, the motion was agreed to. Sir JOHN NEWPORT moved, that the exemp tion in favour of foreigners fhonld be expunged. Mr. HUSIUSSON obferved, that this would be to lay on a new tax, and that therefore it mutt orilk nate in a Committee of Ways and Means. The motion was withdrawn. The feveral claufes were gone through ; the Houfe returned, and the report was ordered to be brought up to-morrow. Mr. HUSKISSON• brought in a Bill for laying on a Duty on Horfes employed in Agriculture, &c. Read a &Li, and on the motion that it thould be read a fecond time to-morrow, Mr. JOHNSTONE foggefled, that as another im portant fubjeft flood for difeufilon to-morrow, it might be inconvenient to bring this forward alto. After a few words from Mr. ALaxamost and Mr. Huse issos, the fecond reading was fixed for Thurf day. Mr. Hustrissow prefented, purfuant to order, an Account of the Balances due from the Receiver Ge neral of Scotland, John Hamilton, Efq. Ordered to lie on the Table, and to be printed. A fimilar order was made as to the Copy which the Honourable Member prefented, of his Majef ty's Warrant, granting an Additional Salary to Lord Melville, as Lord Privy Seal of Scotland.— Adjourned. UST OF THE MINORITY, WOO NOTED AGAINST TOE SECOND READING OT TUC SAL': v i't ' 111 1., ON MONDAY MIGHT. Adair, R. Fos, Hon. C. J. Newport, Sir JoLn Bagened, Wakes. Francis, P. . North, Dudley Barclay, George Geary, Sit William Ord, William Batlow, H, Giddy, '' OfFulfton, Lord Brogden,i. Gregor, F. POnfonby, Right Banbury, Sir C. Grenfell, Pafcoe Hon. W. B. Cakraft, J. (Teller) Grey, Hon. Charles Proby, Vitcount Cavendith, W. Hamilton, Lord 4. Pulteney, Sir W. Combe,H.C.(Teller) Huesca, Wm. Lewis Ruffelt, Lord Wm. Cook, Bryan Hark, R. Scott, Jofrph Creevef, Thomas le:II, J. Scodatoote, J. D D:l n eg). Bowes obnitone, Geneve Stanley, Lori H00.G.H.1,. gtoo, W. C. Temple, Earl Ellenuat W. Latosiehe, J. Towufend, Lord J Ebeingtan. Lord I otooehe, It. Walpole, Hon. 0. Fellowes, P. ' Law rence, French Weftern,C C. Fitzgerald, Right Lemon J. " Whithreasi. s. Hon. J. Lemon, Sir W. Williams, 0 w..n Fitzpatrick, Right M'Mahon, J. Williams, J. 11. lion. R. Martin, J. Wynn, C. W. W Foley, Hon. A. Moore, P. Young, Sir W. Foley, T. Morp eth, Lori