Star. — London, England, 1802-11-25 00:00:00

I • • aud there was now no chance of - • . • s- • tal connexions, or making any imps '; • 'on the territory of France, as formerly. This was not a moment in which we could avail ourfelves of a conneBion with the Houk of Auf tria ; and the very attempt to form fuch a connec tion would be fatal. to Auftria ' • becaufe France would then endeavour to cripple her ftrength and refources, in order to prevent her from being ufe ful.to us. A great deal had been faid of the Con tinental dominion of France ; but however eaten five that was, he would afk whether England did not alfo poffefs a great and extenfive power in dif ferent parts of the world ; and might not France complain of the extent of our naval power as well as we did of the enlargement of her territory on land ? It had .beeni Rated that a great degree of irritation existed between both countries ; and that, as nothing was publifhed in France without leave of ,the Government, it mull have fanaioncd all the abufe which they contained againft this country. This inference was not to be made. There %%as a time when an imprimatur had been laid on the prefs of this country : and yet newfpapers continuedto hold forth abufes again ft other powers, which were taken no notice of, nor was the Go vernment of the.cpuntry,charged as being the Au thors of them. Of the Englifh paper publifited at Paris he had teen but one number, and that con- tained fo much abuft againft himfelf and his friends that lie laid it Ade, n d never looked at an other number. But .he would a& if no Englifb Journal had flied abufive and irritating language ? He was furry tnobferve, that to the difgrace of the country the groffeft arici molt fcandalous libels were publifhed again ft the French Government,and one paper contained an article which could very eafily be conftrued into an inftigation to affaffinate the Chief Magiftrate of France.—[4 cry of No ! No!]—lt had alfo been urged as a proof of the hoftility of France towards this Country, that Nap per Tandy and other Irifh rebels were protefted in France. The Gentleman who made this obferva• tion fhould have known that an agreement had been entered into between thofe perfons and the Britifh Government. He fhould be glad to know to what place it was underftood that thefe perfons fhould go. Sorely it was no part of their bargain withGovernment,that,after they had embarked on board a Ihip for the purpofe of proceeding to Tome country in a Rate of neutrality with regard to us, they fhould afterwards be prevented from landing on any part of the habitable globe. He could not conceive in what refpeathe bare permiffion to fuch perfons to remain.in France could be confidered as an as of hoftility againft Great Britain. It had 'been faid, that the fpirit of the country ma be railed to freib exertion. The belt way in. his opi nion to effea this would be never to engage the people in any war, unlefs it was abfolutely necef fary to do fo. He looped t:tl the prefent war of words between England and France with the contempt it deferved, and he hoped the warfare would never be carried on with any other wea pons than words. Let the Menikar, the rime:, the Morning pot, and the Argue, continue to abufe one another as much as they choofe, pro vided the bayonet was not drawn. But this, if it was not even likely to producgmirchief,was by no means an honourable proceeding. At the very time when our Ambaffador was making his bow, and paying his refpeas to the Government of France, it was not a very dignified conduit to be ufing opprobriousepithets towards that perfon with whom our own Government was in ,the habits of courte fy. He certainly did, as well as others, think the prefent a very momentous period ; and he could , .not look at the enormous power of France with out dread ; but at the fame time he taw no reafon why the prefent Peace ought not to halt as long as any that had ever been concluded with France. Let us only look at Europe with a vigilant eye, and refill all attempts made upon our indepen dence ; but let us not be too fcrupuloufly nice in our apprehenfions of evils thal might occur in flume times. Let us wait and fee if France thews any defire to attack us. It was Rated that our commerce fuffered a diminution in confeqoence of the Peace that was becaufe the war had caufed a great increafe of commerce to this Country,) which mull have ceafed at the termination of the war: and if there was any ground to complain of such diminution, it was only an argument againft making peace at all. This Country, which had for ages dealt lb much in prohibitions, had no great reafon to complain of France for having pro hibited the importation of our rnanufaaures. We bad no right to interfere in a fulled of this kind, at a time when we were at peace. He was Cure that thofe prohibitions were equally injurious to both nations ; and if they law their true interefts they would take than off. Mr. Fox concluded with giving his affent to the Addrefs. Mr. Aacnnatt faid, that the union, which an lion. Baronet had termed a subjugation; was un doubtedly thefullugation of the difaffeaed and faaious fpirits,which had fo long defolated Ireland. Mr. Wimonam began with remarking, that he could have withed that power of memory and dex terity of debate which tome Gentlemen poffeffed, in order to enable him to follow the fpeeeh of the Hon. Gentleman, a fpeech which, like every thing of his, was calculated to make, and which had made, a ftrong impreffion ; a fpeech of great bril liancy ; but of - a brilliancy without force, as almoft every thing it contained was fallacious. Mr. W. Rated, that an attempt had been made to rlliate the violence of the early part of the Frenc revo lution, by afcribing them to a feries of injury ex cited by the coalitson of defpots fur reftoring the ancient Government. ' He denied, however, that loth proceedings were owing to a coalition formed for the' affiftance of Government that had eiifted for fo many centuries f a government which, in reali ty, was confonant to the willies of a great pan of the 4ieople of France, and which was overthrown by fo foals rebellion: The hiflory of the French revolution fcheme of uuiverfal monarchy was ',wn of the revolution,and was of its firft authors tad leaders. .4 Rate of France at all refembled refillance of the Dutch to the slomi-' th.it was sagely* refiftance nate other nations. He remarked, with fn rife, that the fixed& of the Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Fox) who had always been the apologia of the French Government, thould have been heard with fuch de cided marks of approbation by Minifters, who had themfelves (hared or approved the meafuresagainft which he (Mr. Fox) had always inveighed. This made him more defirous to expofe the pernicious i tendency of the fpeech. He admittedthat the paper alluded to b y the Hon. Gentleman was contemptible, it was, however,inefficient. The war of France was not a paper war ; it was a war of meafures, of deeds, molt calamitous to Europe. But furely, if the mind of the country was to be prepared againft the dan ger which the French war of meafures threatened, it was necelfary that it tbould be informed of what paired in France. With refpea to what had been Paid of the 44 aggreffions" of France, he believed the word aggreffions had not lken ufed, at leaf hs the fenfe given to it by the Hon. Gentleman. — Without afloat aggreffions there mightbeaftscom mitted by another State which' might juftify war. It was faid too, that the alts complained of on the part of the French Government had exiled at the 1 time of the Treaty ; but, even admitting that to he true, the argument founded on them, if it d not apply' to Minifters now, would fill apply to the dangerous fituation of the country owing to the peace. He contended that the plan of indemnities forced on Germany was infinitely more fevere than could have been expeaed from the Treaty of Lu nevillei for it utterly deftroyed the Germanic Body. —lt was asked, what was the cure even for the danger if admitted ; was it war ?—He would fay, that in the comparifon of war as the cure with peace, as the cure it might fairly be contended that every thing we (hould not lofe would be gain. It wastoprevent,nottocuri,thathewilhed.—He com plained of the language held out by the Hon. Gen tleman and his friends for the la it ten years,faying, that if a Committee fitting at Paris could have pre fcribed the condua molt ferviceable to their caufe, it would have been fomething fimilar to what had atually been followed by fome here.—ln compar: ing the war with peace as the cure, he contended that peace had enlarged the fphere of Bonaparte's ambition, by allowing it to extend to every quarter of the globe, while war had confined it to Europe. 1 1 The peace had facilitated his attacks on Piedmont, Italy and Switzerland, becaufe in time of war Bo naparte, fearing the advantage if might have given to our arms and our caufe, might have forborn from fuch aggreffions. Peace too had given to France St. Domingo, Louifiana, the Cape, the Mediterranean, Sec.; and at the time when this torrent was let lode on the whole world, we threw up our caps in token of joy, as if on the opening of the New Docks. Adverting to what Mr. Fox had faid, refpeaing the inequality of the population of France and England, he obferved that applied to every war with France, but in faa qt was very poffible that from our fituation, and for defence, our population might be adequate to cope with- that of France. It was true that war, as well as peace, might be a bad cure for the dangers that threatened ; bqt what was to be done with a bad fituation ? Every-remedy might be in adequate. As to the advantages of peace for cot& m erce, the que ft ion was,what fecurity we had for that commerce and the wealth it gave ? If poverty was a fecurity again ft Kobbery,furely wealth was in itfelf as bad proteaion againft the robber. Principles had been quoted from Machiavel, and examples from hiftory, to thew that France was weakened by her conquefts; that the would break in pieces like the Roman Empire ; but what confolation did this give ? The Roman Empire had fubfifted 400 years in all its extent; and if France were to over.run all Europe, if furely was no great relief to think, that by fome accidents in the courfe of 400 years it might again be refcued 1 After purfuing the comparifon between the fafety of peace and the fafety of war, at confiderable length, from which he inferred that war would have enabled is to fecure more, than peace gave us a chance of fecuring, he adverted with feverity to the lan guqe which had been held as to continental con neetions ; that we were too hone( to deal with the Princes of the Continent, &c. He faid, that the complaints againft the Continental Powers in this war were ill-founded. We had given mo ney, but furely it would not be faid that, doing fe, we had done more than Auftria, who had contributed the bravery and the blood of her armies. It was not true that Auftria abandoned us. She gave up the conceit, not yielding, but as it were driven out of the line. He reprobated the unfeeling language of thofe who faid Auftria had done nothing in comparifon with us. A day might come when fuch reproaches from us would be re membered by the Continental Powers. Nothing could more tend to alienate thofe powers from us, and a day might come when it might be necelfary for us to look for their co-operation or their aid. With refpeet to what had been faid again& all deep laid fchemes, and all plans in concert with other powers, being unadvifable, and that we should trutt to chance, it was reverting the old maxim, slam manes akfiy,fit Prandia; it was abandoning wifdom, making a furrender of reafon, and refign ing ourfelves to chance. r. WiLssaroacs explained, and faid that he only meant that, confidering the uncertainty of all complicated plans, particularly when they depend. ed on the co-operation of other powers, he thought them a bad remedy for remote dangers, and a cer tain, inevitable danger' °all:knot to be Titled for a doubtful advantage of u precarious plans. The CHAN c a LLoi of the Exc a eon Ell raid, that France had not gained by the peace thofe things which the Right Hon. Gentleman had (fated. She fill had not taken polfeillon of Lonifiana : it was to be proved whether (he had gained St. Domingo; 'there was a Briti(h fleet in the Mediterranean fil ficient to check her in that quarter, and there was no fort of danger that the torrent would fpread to India. The effeft of again replunging the country into war, would be to make war perpetual. A Noble Lord had faid that it was impoffible but that hoftilities thould be renewed. The Houfe would do him the juaice to recollea that thortly after • the Preliminary Treaty he had potitive -Ily alerted, it waa not from any deficiency of , - were abundant, and if the honour of the country fhould be again touched—if its fecurity Mould be endangered—we had in our power a fuffi ciency vE refources to carry on s frefh war for feveral years. He would Mk, whether the dif ference between the terms contained in the projea at Lifle, and thofe agreed ,on at Amiens, would make any material alteration in the means of the French Government for carrying on another war ? But the Noble Lord had at length given the Houle clearly to underhand what his objea was. It ap peared that he wanted to get the prefent Minißers .removed from office k and with that view, he thought proper, in terms no way could/cut. with civility, to reprefent them as incapable of con clueing the public affairs, and as deftitute of energy and vigour. Would die Noble Lord con- tinue to charge with incapacity thofe men under whofe direaicm the Baltic fleet had failed, and made fo fuccefsful an enterprize ? who had fent fuch powerful reinforcements to Egypt, and that, with fuch expedition as to effea the complete conqueft of that country ; and who had after wards canted the port of Cadiz to be blockaded' with fo much vigour and efficacy? He would deny the charge of the Noble Lord, that there was any want of vigour on the part of Minifters.— If the charge, therefore, againft them was the difgraceful as of having made peace, he, for his own part, mull, with fatisfaition plead guilty to that charge. But he tufpeEtecl that the whole ground of this charge, which came from the Noble Lord, was the confidence placed by his I jetty in his prefent. fervants, as it appeared that their only crin. -2 was that of having reftored to the people the bleffings of peace ; and, after all the lamentation that had been made about the places given up to France, and the extenfion of territory on her part, the whole amount -of the different complaints teemed to be, that the fleets of 'Great .' Brita)n could not navigate through the interior of the Continent • for it was evident to every body that in thole Places where alone redrefs could be had, our forces could riot °petite either in peace' or war. Some obfervations had been made on the' paper-war lately carried on between this'country ' and France. With refpeEt to Ibis country he thought it was highly indecent and unmanly, to ufe the language of exaf petatkm towards that Govern ment, with which we were at peace • but at the fame time fuch was his regard for the ' freedom of ;hat Conftitution under which we lived, that he would not lay fiis finger on the Britilh Prefs or, ' abridge its liberty in the flightell degree, with any ' view to fupprefs thofe publications to *ll4 he alluded. There was not one confequenee re fulting from thofe publications, which Wilt Set light and infignificant compared to fuck ati ofd tge.~ He mull obferve that the preffes of both countries abufed each other, and fentimenti of difguft were excited on both Mess He could affure the Houfe that it would be the Rudy of Minifters to Rear clear between hoflility on the one hand, and humiliat ing.compromiks on the other—that they would maintain the honour of the country, and always keep a Ready eye on the prefervation of peace, without expofing theinfelves thofe unjuft impu tations thrown out againft them. - Mt. WINDHAM explained. Lord Ts DIPLI repeated his affertion, which was, that while the prefent Minihers continued in of five, there could be no (atm in time of war, nor fecurity during peace. Sir Janes PULTINZY raid, he faw nothing at this time to Make him thihk a Rate of hoftility ne ceffary. The CHANCELLOR of the Exclisopla faid, an Hon. Member had in the condi of that night's debate aLked him, what would be the economy of Peace ? He would anfwer—about twenty;five millions. _ _ Lord MORPETII Paid, there was a material dif ference between the Proje& of Lille and the Treaty of Amiens. Lord HAWKIISIMY contended there was but a flight difference, and whatever it might be, that Projeft was only the firft 'propofition, which might afterwards be altered; and therefore it could not be confidered as an ultimatum. • Mr. CANNING Paid, from the confidential fitua tion in which he flood at the time of the negocia tions at Lille, he could affure the Houfe that the Prole& made by his Majefty's late Minifters was that which they had been determined not to depart from, and therefore was in fait their ultimatum; and it was that on which (fhould it fail) they tended to reft their defence before their country. Mr. BAAGGE raid he was aftonifhed to hear an Hon. Gentleman, who was not at the. time he al luded to in an fficial fituation, fpeak to a fia which the late Minifter, who was *Kent, vats :done competent to explain. Why that Right . Honour. able Gentleman was not in his place , he could not conjeaure, except for the reafiins difciofed by a Noble Lord, whole objet was to remove the pre fent Minifters. The Report was then agreed to, and the Ad. , drefs was ordered to be prefented to His Majefty by the Whole Houfe. An order was alb made that thole Members who were of his Majefty's Privy Council fhould, on the following day, wait on His Majefty, to know when His Mikity would be pleafed to receive the Addrefs.—Several Accounts were then moved for, and ordered. Mr. Vett sITTART gave notice (in the abfence of the Chancellor of the Exchequer) that the Chan cellor of the Exchequer would move to morrow, for leave to bring in a Bill for the better eftablifh ing and regulating the Militia in Ireland. Mr. V&HSITTAIT then moved for the following Accounts, which were feverally ordered. An ac count of the net produce of the permanent taxes for the years ending the loth of Odtober a and the ioth of Otiober, tBoa, diftinguithing each year. An account of the an2ount of Bounties paid on the importation of Corn and rice for the fame periods. And an Account of the amount of Ex chequer Bills ;trued under the At of the 4.1 ft Geo. 111. chapter 4th, now outflanding and unprovi ded for. At One o'Clock this morning the }lode ad- LONDON. THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 25. PRICE OF STOCKS THIS DAY AT ONE o.cLoeit 3 per Cast. Confnle 674f—01d s . pa C. tali — New 5 per Cast. ppir—Long Aug. I * --Omnium t k DUBLIN, NOVIIMBER EL.—Government S per C. 96}. The public arc now in poireffion oc His W I Tv's Speech on opening the new Parliament, a, the debates that followed. Any comment on eithi cannot be necelfary to thofe who have been in habits of remarking the cautions phrafeology fervable at all times in diplomatic language. Sot people expected, but unreafonably, that His M, jasry's Speech, or thole of his Minifters, thou] openly avow unqualified fubmiflion to Frew ufurpation or infiant hoftilitie,s. The line of cc due which Government ought to follow, rn ; not yet be obvious to Minifters themfelves, as muft in a great nieafure depend on the turn whi the prefent negotiations may take ; and all th could be expeeed was, that they would be cautic not to commit themfelves by any expreffions thi might make ufe of. One point, however, cam efcape obfervation. If no ground for a pofil rdptare had exifted, it is plain that the langu: of His Majefty's fpeech would have been congr. tulatory refpeeting the amicable difpofitionf thole with whom we were lately at war. By a vzifel arrived at Portfmouth we learn, Demerara, Surinam, Berbice,' and Efquibo, wv in the potfeffion of our troops, fo late as the ultimo. By this conveyance, difpatches were brought . for Government. The Prefentations tc His MAJESTY ; yam at the Levee, ware-- Lord Lovrrnaa, on coming to his title. Lord ROttltAT TOTTIN NAM. Captain STIRRET of the Guards, by Lord Cathcart. Lea GLENDORZ on his arrival from Ireland. Mr. Boaxes, by the Lord in Waiting. Mr. Dor:costar, by the Earl of Dartmouth. Mr. Townszon, by Sir W. Scott Mr. Poi-rotas Secretary to the French Ambafador, ac • concluded by General Andra:Ws Aid-de-Camps. The Hon. Mr. Leans, by his father, Lord Melbourne. The Rev. Mr. TA taoz, introduced by the Duke of Beaufort, kiffed the King's hand, on his preferrnect to the Deanery of Exeter. _ _ _ After the Levee His MAJESTY received the Ad drefs of the Lords in the Great Council Chamber. Lord Aar/EN and Vifcount NscsoN attended, as the Mover and Seconder. The KING then held a Council, after which M. OTTO had an audience of leave, previous to his return to France. We underfland that a Petition is preparing againft the Return for Berwick-on-Tweed. Delay: and Bhaiders will be oftener performed this week, than during the whole feafon :—for in fiance, Perfons not knowing, or not recolleiting, that a fuss of as,oool. is attainable by the Firft Startin Lottery Ticket, on Monday next, will lofe th at chance by Delay:, while many thonfands . will deprive themfelves of that Golden Opportu• nity by Blunders, in purchafing their Tickets and Shares at the wrong Office. POPE'S Lottery Of. fice, Royal Exchange, clofe by the Bank of Eng. land, is the propitious fpot, which fo juftly and pre eminentlybears the title of "The Fortunate,Office." The firft drawn Ticket in the State Lottery, to begin drawing Monday next, will be entitled to Twenty-five Thoufand Pounds. The firft drawn laft Lottery was fold by SWIFT and Co. No. il, Poultry, who have alfo (hared And fold nine other Capitals fence November laft. On Monday next the Lottery begins drawing. Mr. N:cnoLsoe's Tickets and Shares, that have been fo juftly celebrated for producing Capital Prizes, are only to be had at No. :6, Cornhill, op. pofite the front gate of the Bank.—Note : The Frft-drawn Ticket is 25,0001. and the Firft-drawn the fourth Day, will alfo be 25,0001. Saturday fe'nnight as Samuel Peame was driving a cart from Portfinonth to Chichefter, in getting down near Bedhampton, hisloot flipped, and he fell under the wheel, by which he was fo much brulfed, that he died the fame evening. Tuefday morning James Clarage, a bricklayer, fell from a fcaffold in Horfemonger-lanc, Stones End, Borough, and was killed on the fpot : he has left a wife and two (mall children to lament his Ida. l'efterviay Sir WILLIAM SCOTT made a report to His /vim jam of William Codling, under fentence of death in New gate, convidted-at the laft. Admiralty &Mons, for wilfully and felonloully deftroyingand elating away a certain veffel,of which he was Mafter, upon the high fea, within the Jurifdidtion of the Admiralty of England, with intent and defign to prejudice Ro bert Sheddon and others, who had underwritten a policy of in• furanee upon the Paid reel; when he was ordered fir caeca. Alp po Saturday next, at Execution Dock. ' • Hialleld, the impoftor, who has for fosse time been adver• 'tired, has laciallaken ist• a place called the Lamb and Flag, about ii-nalles from Swantea. -. • In confesjuence of Lord Ws tieSELS ta's Letter to Mr,Boto, defcribing that a man and woman had been traced on the 16th haft. to q rendon, near Leieefter, fuppofed to have been con• cerned in the murder of Mr. Steele, on Hounflow Heath--, William Bunton and Elisabeth Bunton, his wife, the two per ks:nib defcribed, underwent a long examination at Bow.itreet oa Tuefday .14. Sir WILLIAM PA Rao Ns fu gefted to Mr. BOND, that Letters fhould be written to the Mayors of Cam bridge and Norwich refpedling the Prifoners, who were r?• =tided for a further examinadon to-morrow before the fad Magiftrates. The Vreide, Scherman, from Amfterdam, for the Cape of Good Hope and Bativia, is, we arc concerned to !tate, loft off Hythe, near Dover, and of 380 foldiers, crew, and pal; fengers, only sr, are faved. One hundred bodies had yefterdai been walhed afhore. Potty suouvu, Nov. se...This day arrived the Columba, from the Weft Indies, bound to London ; alfo the Ant cutter, Singer maßer, for Havre • and a brig for Dunkirk. Paired by, the !hip Leander, Capt. George White, from Pe• marara; and Martha, Roche, front Grenada. Capt. difWhite landed here, and fet off for Town this evening with patches for Government. Nov. 33.-mArrivecl th e Diligent, itore-lhigs from Deal, with naval lions; the Huffar frigate, with ma rines from Plymouth ; the Autumn Coop, from the Rivers with volunteer frame% and failed again for the Downs .... Sailed, the Arrow Hoop, and Jackal; Bloodhound, and Mariner gun-brigs; and the Carysfort, out of harbour to the Nore.•••• The Antelope lately launched here has been put into coma lion. Wind W. blows hard. LONDON : Printed foil the Proprietors, by JOHN DANIEL, (of Maiden-lane, Covent-Garden) at the STAR PRINTING' Orrice, Nn. a, Carey-(treet ; and publithed by LEVEL IfINT.of Canterbury-place,Lambeth) at Na i)Carer 4reet ys ST 4I•011, 1 01 Temple-Bac. proved that the fcherni coeval with the Aza dar in the eonternplatioa of He denied that the Rat the ca* of the refißant niork et 8904 hecaufe ____ ,' ' JES. and her the oh. )me WA. iuld nch :on- nay is it hich that ious they nnot 1 lible cage 2 gra. is of that Were 18th were a • rday, 1