Star. — London, England, 1805-03-07 00:00:00

I nowing. But I may be afked, would you have that oble Lord (Melville) appointed the War Minifter ? Oh, No ! he was formerly adept enough in that line. When I rec.:AlL:it our expeditions to Holland, and even to Egypt, where fo much rifle was in curred in fendi,ig our fuch a force, and in the face of fuch an enemy, I am not anxious to fee him attempt to diive our car of military glory.-- But it may be conlidered as a bad argument, that the man who has proved himfelf but ill capable of concluding operation: by land, is ergo incapable of concluding operations at lea. This brings to my re membrance an anecdote of the late Mr. Garrick. He had a Scots friend, named Moncrieff, an eccentric, but ft iendly character, and who generally went by the appellation of Handl Johnny Moncrieff.' He at tempted to bring out a tragedy of four ads,which Mr. Garrick, to whom it was fhewn, advifed him not to omplete, but to lay it by. Next year, however, he 'irmight a comedy of five aft,, which Mr. Garrick -renounced execrable, and plainly told him, that his neither lay in tragedy nor comedy. " Where the effi then," laid Johnny, " can lie ?"—( A grneral laughing through the Houfi.) Mr. Sheridan then proceeded to declare himtelf to be a great friend .to the whole fyftem of the Militia. The high bounties given to the Militia did not arife from the fyßem itself, but from the abide of it. He condemned the modern praelice of removing the men far from their own homes, which tended to leffen their attach :bent to the fervice, and, of courfe, to increafe defer lion; and, when once faith was broken, and they were put in a tituation different from what they expelled when they &ft entered, it was not likely that a Militia could ever be fo loon railed again; and, when parents found that their Eons were in danger, when they en• tered the Militia, or being afterwards entrapped for foreign fervice, this, of itself, created the eaufe of an increafed bounty. "As to railing men for rank," Mr. Sheridan continued, " I admit that, if the army could otherwife be recruired, this method is objedion oiale ; but I do not think that the army, as a body, has (offered in this refptit, for I am fore, that the more property and rank that are introduced into CI: army, the greater will be the fecurity. Why not attempt enlifting men for limited fervice ? But I „ill not dwell on arguments which prefs upon the humanity of the Houle. I fay that it is unconftitu tional to take lads, and put them for life from the enjoyment of the privileges of our free conßitntion. Enliaing for life, no doubt, (lands in the way of re cruiting for the army. If a boy be taken from his parents to ferve for life, is it not farcical to tell him that he is to fight for the bell conflitution upon earth ? If you were to take children in a foreign clime, form them into a corps, tell them to fight for a free country and the bell conflitution, would they not naturally fay, " Delightful! When are we to fee that country ?" The anfwer that they are never to fee that country, nor to enjoy its bleffings, bat that they are to fight for it, how mach would this tend to lower their zeal and weaken their attachment! So I fay, let our foldiers, after a certain number of years of fervice, return under that friendly fhade which proteded them in earlieft life ; let them title of the fruits of that delightful tree, and this will prove the belt fubllitute for any fuch wretch ed fyltem as is contained in the prefent Bill. Be fore I conclude this fubjell, I with to make a Se rious appeal to a defeription of Members is this Houk, who are peculiarly interefted in the repeal of this wretched Bill • I mean the country Gentle men, who Should confider the meafore, in the pre fent inftance, as proceeding de novo. I afk them, will they give their fandion to this additional tax on the landed property of Great Britain , after it has been proved to be a meafure that can never be attended with any of the good effeds that were promifed by it, and has been fhewn to be fraught with the moll atrocious injulike ? Nest to them, and certainly only in the fecond dal's, I muff call upon thofe who were the lupporters, and many of them Members of the late Adminifiration ; I call upon the colleagues of the depofed Minißer, on his colleagues and his friends, amongft whom 1 am entitled to elate a num ber of the country Gentlemen, to preferve their con fiftency, and to be mindful of the arguments they themfelves sited IA year, in oppofition to the a& of which I am now moving the repeal. T, !n common with them, gave that Miniller my feeble fupport as far as it went. I did fo in an independent, and. I tril , an honourable m a n ner , w i t h out detaching me in the leaf& from my Hon. Friend near me (Mr. Fox), nor from any of thole other friends with whom I am proud to have uniformly ailed, and whole principles I flail never abandon, I fupported him, becaufe I confidered him to have ailed generally with a view to what he conlidered to be the good of the country, with an honeft difpolition, and with a proper refped for the found principles of the Coralitution ; but moll of all did I fupport him becaufe I conftdered him as a bar to •he return of the Right Honourable Gentle man oppolite me to power. I now appeal to all thofe who :bed then merely' upon Similar views with my• (elf, to concur with me now in voting for the repeal of a meafure which has already totally failed, and which they themfelves have previoufly condemned. I furely cannot expeß them, after all the reproba tion expreffed of this execrable law, before it had a trial, now having been proved an ineffective, cruel, and oppreffive meafure, to turn round upon me fud denly, and, without affignirig any new reafon, fay, • This is a good, a jolt, and a very humane law I'— I implore of them not to ad in fuch a manner as to make us afhamed of having oppofed the meafure on is firß propofal. It would not be regular in me to ...1.1.1e to any thing which might have palled in de r rte in another place, where I am told a Noble (Sidmouth) did not Speak of this meafure iii loch a manner as I might have expelled from him ; but, perhaps, Noble Lords, when transferred to the saber Houle, may not think themfelves to much Fledged to what has pallid here, as we do who re main. Let all there deferiptions of Gentlemen to whom I have alluded, put their hands on their hearts, and fay, as men of honour, whether, if the late recon siltation had not taken place between the Noble Lord alluded to, and the Right Hon. Gentleman oppofite they would not vote with me on the prefent vieftion ? If fo, how can they reconcile any oppoli bon to any motion, with the opinions they before to loudly proclaimed, and which, after the trial, has jodified the condemnation they before pronounced 0,-in it? Let every Gentleman reficit, that the extents of this country, from the nature of the wit, Z which we art engaged, is drawing towatds a teals, and that, unfortnnately, the enntinuance of hofti tides will impute upon us , the unavoidable neceffity of levying many additional burdens on our fellow fubjeds ; that, in fine, there can be no ceffarion of thefe unvailing taxes, until the arrival of the now feemingly diftant period of peace ; and with thefe im: preffions on their minds, let them be careful of the burthens they now impofe, and be cautious that they may not be fuch as peculiarly to aggravate the feel ings of the people. I remember the day when the character of the independent Country Gentlemen, for whom certainly no man can have more refped than I have, flood much higher in this Houfe, and in the Country, than it does at prefent. I hope they will this night recoiled, that their rank and re putation never were diminithed, till they were funk during the feventeen years of the former adminiftra• tinn of the author of this meafure, whofe corrupt and unprincipled fyßem of bellowing titles to the number of more than one moiety of the other branch of the Legiflature, at the fame time, lowered the ancient dignity of the Peerage, and impaired and undermined the independence of the Houfe of Commons, and the confidence repofed in it by the people of the country. I know that it is fometimes reprefented as invidious to deal in diftintions between' one defcription of Member, and another; but, it would be unmanly in me, feeling as I do, to abitain from them, when, by detachingfrom this Houfe, thofe to whom the mafs of the people look with molt vene ration and confidence, there i; a gradual introdudion into the conftitution of the anomaly of a popular of fembly, uncontronlable by the fentiments of the peo ple.: I therefore once more conjure the country Gen tlemen to keep themfelves, on this occafion, aloof from the political prejudices or the bulling of parties. Let them call to mind that, in the midi of the dan gers that furrouttd us, it is only by gaining the confi dence of the people that we can gland upon an im pregnable ground, and meet any circumkaeces that may poffibly arife without fear or apprehenfion. It by feenring to ourfelvesthisconfidence,that we can belt Genre the co-operation and affiance of thole powers on the continent who may be difpofed to make a common caufe with us; by convincing them that, in (lead of haring no more than treaties with the Mi 'lifters and with Government to depend upon, they ate making an alliance with the hearts and hands of the people of this country; and, molt of all, it is by this reliance on the hearts of our brave country men, that we can hope, with a jull confidence, to be able to Pt bounds to the veil and daring ambition of an overbearing, perfidious, alive, and eaterprif ing enemy; who employs againft us, with unparal leled craft and animofity, the fame inftruments that have already overwhelmed the molt ancient and mag nificent monarchy in the world, and, by doing Co, have probably fair ever deftroyed the liberties and happinefs of a polluted, brave, enlightened, and ge nerous nation. I now, Sir, move for leave to bring in a Bill for the Repeal of the Defence Ad of mall year." _ _ _ The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQ.yER -44 In riling, Sir, to fubmit to the Houfe the reafons which induce me wholly to diffent in opinion from the Hon. Gentleman who has jolt fat down, I do not conceive that it is necefary for me to follow him in all the parts of his fpeech ; of a fpeech, which was certainly leis one in fupport of the precife motion now before the Houk, than it was in the form of general and indiferiminate accufatiins againft thofe enjoying at prefent, or who have recently enjoyed, the confi dence of his Majefty in the adminiftration of the go vernment. Only a very (mall part indeed of the fpeech of the Hen. Gentleman had any relation what ever to the quellion. A few of the topics did, how. ever, materially relate to it ; but the whole related but little to the various topics on which he has been pleated fo long to 'dwell. The conclufion of his fpeech had no reference to the queftion ; the commence ment had fcarce more ; and as to the collateral mat ter it was totally ii relevant. The Hon. Gentleman has, neverthelefs, made Tome Dbfervations to which I Sir, think it my duty fho r tly to rep l y . B ut fi r s o f a ll I mutt call the attention of the Houfe to one or two preambles with which the Honourable Gentleman has opened his fpeech this night ; fuppofing certain things to have palled among his opponents, which can have palled no where but in his own imagination. The Hon. Gentleman has laid, that the notice of the motion he has kart made, was received by us with fur prize, if not with indignation ; that on this fide of the Houfe we were in a (tate of trepidation and alarm when we heard that notice given. Now, certainly, there was, on this fide of the Houfe, no fuch thing as either furprife or indignation bianifefted. I believe, that in point of fad, the firft notice given by the Hon. Gentleman of his intention to move the Hoafe on the queflion of this evening, was not given within, but without the Houle ; for I think I have undentood, that the Hon. Gentleman proclaimed his defign in the lobby before announcing it in his place. How parliamentary this was, he will determine. When be did give his notice in the Houle, fo far, however, from our ezpreffing furprize and indignation, or, in truth, any other marked feeling, that there was on his own tide a great cry railed, and the occurrence was hailed by the Hon. Gentleman's friends with acclamations; whila on this fide not one word was uttered. It is true, we could not give our concur rence to the motion of the Right Hon. Gentleman (Mr. Windham), ably, eloquently, and convincingly as the Hon. Gentleman thinks that Right Honoura ble Gentleman fupported his motion ; but the Hon. Gentleman too gave that motion a fupport which he did not think it neeeflary to vindicate by argument. Still the Hon. Gentleman took pages of notes at the time ; but no doubt he expeded to have hailed a hap. pier moment, when under more favourable circum fiances he might amufe and entertain the Houle with the refults of his meditations. The Honourable Gen tleman has, however, been mach millaken in fancy in4 that we have hailed his appearance in the field with di(may, any more than we heard his notice with furprife and indignation. But as to the latter, the fad is, that we Paid not one word, nor intimated any difpofition, ankh by a certain ezpreffion of our readi nefs to meet the Hon. Gentleman and his Friends, whenever it should fuit him and them to bring their propofition before the Houle. The Hon. Gentleman happens at prefent to concur in opinion with a Right Hon. Gentleman, with whom I have ailed, and for many years concurred in opinion ; who, as to all my perfonal feelings, and difpofitions, I (till regard as my Right Hon. Friend, hut of whom I cannot politically (peak in language fo &iced to my willies. But at to the cordiality of the two Honour able Gentlemen, why, Sir, if expated to be found in the fpeech of the Honourable Gentleman to-night, notwithflanding his profeißons, I much doubt. whe ther haling friendfhip, or permanent formations will ever arife, amid engagements fo difEmilar, and from elements fo difcordant. The Honourable Gentleman has difclaimed the idea of oppofing materially the doftrines or fentimcnts of the Right Honourable Gen tleman ; but this he took care to do away in a fubfe qnent preamble, by rendeting his forbearance condi tional. He has told us, that there was not one prin ciple in the fpeech of the Right Hon. Gentleman that he does not more or lets approve, although in point of fat, Sir, there was notone principle in it, that he has not unequivocally difapproved. In many glaring parts of his fpeech, this can be deteCted. The Hon. Gentleman tells us, that he approves of a varied force ; the Right Hon. Gentleman again, holds it as a firs principle, that the military force fhould be uniform. The Hon. Gentleman approves of our having an army for general fervice, one for limited fervice, the Militia, old and fupplementary, the .Army of Referve. and the Volunteers : thefe diftri butions the Right Hon. Gentleman vilifies; they are ingredients of our force, which are decried by him, but in which the Hon. Gentleman who fpoke to-night takes pride, nay even glories. Why, Sir, the Hon. Gentleman, we could all perceive, was not able to reftrain his fervent difaporobaticn of any other fyf tem. Notwithflanding this, I have no reafon to fop pore, that there is not too much good humour pre valent in the difpofitions of thole two new friends, for any obfervations of mine to make mitchicf between them. I do know it is not by any means my inten tion by any nbfervations of mine, to make mifchief l As to one of the Hon. Gentlemen (Mr. Windham) it is a little remarkable, that the fyttem of a various military force was at one period approved and fup ported by himfelf. Although now condemned by him, he formerly contended for its wifdom. The Militia, Augmentation of the Militia, Supplementary Militia, Additional Cavalry, all thefe .meafures he fupported and approved, when he was only a Mem ber of the cabinet, and Secretary at War ! I will not enter into the difcuffion here, whatever I may be in duced to do in a more advanced Rage of my fpeefh, of the opinions of Gentlemen refpating the degree of confidence that may be fafely repofed in any of the Members of this Houfe. I will only fay, that, when Gentlemen who have once approved of meafures which they now condemn ; when they afk the Houfe to rely in a peculiar degree on their wifdom ; when they do fo at the moment that we know that while Members of the Cabinet thofe meafures were never once queftioned by them, much lets reprobated— when thefe things ftrike us, we cannot give implicit credence to the feltadvifed panegyrics of Honourable Gentlemen. The Right Hon. Gentleman, in par ticular differs from himfelf. If he will only look into a fingle page of the journals,-he will find, that the 'Bill for railing men in the counties and parifhos, for the augmentation of the Militia, the Cavalry, fup. plementary and others, together with many more meafures, all tending to render our force throughout of a various defcription and charaaer, were every one of them meafures in which the Right Hon.Gen denten was either jointly concerned, or partly au thorized. This far as to the confiftency of the new friend of the Hon. Gentleman who has moved you, Sir, for the repeal of the Mt for the National De fence. In regard to the Hon Gentleman's digreffions, again, they were numerous ; the principal of which would admit of very Tull invaigation, but for obvi ous reafons I (hall not notice more than one or two of them. The queftion . in debate is, however, near ly, whether it would be right or not to repeal the Additional Force Aft? In difculfing this queftion, it will not be necenary for me to call on the Houle to decide, whether the AO has anfwered in its full ex tent, but whether, confidering the time when the meafure took place, it is evinced that it is at once' a praaicable and ferviceable meafure—not whether I it has already anfwered every expeetation of fanguine natures concerning it, but whether it is likely, by its operation, to effea, in continuance, falutary accef fions to our force, and to render thofe fources whence our force (hall be increafed, alike produaive and permanent. Thefe, Sir, I humbly think, are the quellions which it is the duty of every Member of Parliament to decide on, if he purpofes deciding in a way worthy of the charater of Parliament, and of his own honour and conliftency. He will decide with a view to afcertaining the means of railing our Mili taryForce to that 'dilatable Itate in which, as to dif potable facilities, it ought to be, and to which, in reference to the fame (Nee, I. Sir, molt devoutly with to raife it. The Hon. Gentleman has told us, that the National Defence A& willnot, has not, and cannot raife men—that it is only calculated to raife a tax. He fays, he hopes I do not mean to continue ;it folely as a tax meafure. Now Sir, the fadt is, that 'I have taken pains to inform th e Houfe, whenever this meafure has been ftrialy before it, that of all things, I hall intended to convert this into a law of revenue. The Hon. Gentleman has, however, not been content-with furmifes, but has made a queltion, with as great readinefs as he has himfelf anfwered it ; and demanding to know of me, if I do not intend this as a law for railing a pecuniary aid, has anfwer ed for me, that molt certainly I do. The truth is otherwife. This never was meant to be a pecuniary meafure. I have over and over difclaimed the inten tion of at all rendering it a pecuniary meafure, nor &all it ever be argued by me as a pecuniary meafure, nnlefs it can be (hewn, that by fo converting it from what was the original defign of its inflitution,its great objea, namely, that of railing men, can be obtained in a way more efficacioully, more expeditioufly, and more certainly than (hall be deemed otherwife prac ticable. The Hon. Gentleman has imagined a thou rand chimerical fancies refpating my fuppofed in tention of making the National Defence Aft a tax law. He thinks I mean nothing by it but to raife a pe cuniary aid. He has, in fupport of this unauthorifed notion, devifed arguments altogether his own, only that he might have it eafily in his power triumph antly to anfwer them. This is not unlike the inge nuity of the fool we read of fomewhere, or rather, of that jefter of a great perfonage of antiquity, who panelled a wonderful felicity in talking to himfelf. Exclaimed the jefter, " I fay the fiats ,tsay fall 1" and, anfwers he, o Right, my good felt; and fo they will." The Honourable Gentleman thinks that the Defence Aft may become a mere meafure of pecuniary (apply, and that his bypotbeks timid not be fufpended - 14 argument, he bounds to his conclufiun, and tells us at once that it will. But, Sir, no fuch paltry, frivolous, and difgraceful pre text, as that to which he fuppofes I will have re cour re, (hall ever be retorted to by me. Every thing of a pecuniary meafure I utterly difclaim, and is difclanned. The Honourable Gentleman knows this :he knew it when he flared the contrary. He only Rated the gratuitous didum he has, becaufe be ing his own, it was what he could with the fame hardihood of affertion maintain. He only (laurel what he could refute, that he might divert the atten tion of the Houfe from what he could not refute. Sir, I have many reafons, and all of them on good grounds, for thinking that this meafure will not only prove ufeful, but become efficient towards increafing our military force. Yet Ido not fay that in this opinion I can be infallible. I know I am able to err. Many things in our fyllenr are not a little calculated to difappoint our hopes of the prac tical refult of fimilar meafures. If at any time it fail, if it ceafe to be a military tax on the counties, and fo on the country, I-will at once give it np as a pecuniary meafure ; for fuch a tax would be wholly incompatible with thole principles of taxation recog nized among us, which alone are wife, and befide which none other would be jug or enlightened. But it the effect of the tax fhould be to raife men, of which the country has an abundance qualified for mi. litary fervice, 1 will draw a totally different concla fion ; and even render this a meafure of taxation, that is, of military taxation. 'g The Honourable Gentleman has thought fit to depreciate this meartire, as, in his judgment (if, in• deed, be has exercifed his judgment at all on the Cub. jeft), not fo mild as fome of thofe of my predecelfor, which likewife contained a kale of fines, As far as thole meafures were pecuniary, they were, however, not entitled to the praife of greater mildnefs. In truth, this meafure is much milder, as a pecuniary meafure, than the one which preceded it. It is infi nitely better than the fyftem of ordinary recruiting. In this fenfe, I will view it as a queltion of time. I (hall not take a tedious view of this quellion. Gen tlemen will readily call to mind the history of the Bill. The Bill did not commence its operations till late in the autumn ; it was in September that the firft movement was made to render it operative.— About the [4th of November, 1804, recruiting par ties were fent out, and the Bill then became an ace tively operative meafure. I may be alked why I fe parate the dircuffion, when another topic, that of the productive efficiency of the meafure, and not what was its luperiority in the incidental circumflance of recruiting, is properly the topic for difcuffion in this place. I anfaer willingly, that if Gentlemen wilt look at the period from July. 1804, to March, 1805, or from July, 1804, to November 584, they will perceive, that the meafure has done molt ellen. tial fervice hitherto, as having facilitated in a man ner peculiar to itfelf, the recruiting of the army. Look at the ftatement of the talk three months, and then fay what opinion you will choofe to form of the political veracity, or arithmetical precifion, or above all, of the military reading, reflection, and expert. ence of the Hon. Mover of the queftion, before you. In the period of the laft three months, Sir, we have not railed fewer than at the rate of zoo men pet week, adding to the military force of the country from rs,ooo to 14,000 men per annum. This number we have in that proportion added to our force ; and yet the Hon. Gentleman, and I fuppofe his Hon. Friends, are pleafed to think, that the meafure in queftion is nothing better than wane paper, a wretched mifera ble Aft, which the Legiflature cannot be too pre cipitate in repealing. In the laft twelve or fourteen weeks, it is a fact, Sir, that we have railed politive ly at the rate of 585 men, very little lets than soci per week, which the returns on your table evince. of which none butone indolent of refearch, as thrHon. Gentleman, would have been thus long unapprized ; and with this fats proved to us. the Hon. Gentle man, without fcarcely condefcending to argue the expediency of it, calls upon us to repeal our National Defence Aa. If this Ad yield us, in three months of raw experiment, from 9,000 to 10.000 men, I would Sir.whether that is not a meafure in the utznoll de. gree important, when the great complaint is, that we want means of recruiting our military force ? Whe ther fuel: a meafure ought to be prima facie contemn ed/ held up to the country and the world as one not only not fit to be any longer acted upon, but which the Britifh Senate ought to ftigmatii.e with unqualified cmprobtium, and repeal without debate The Hon. Gentleman lays, that it has not railed one man, that it has rucceeded, and can fucceed, not in railing men, but fines ; and that it ought, for chore reafons, to be given up. Does the Hon. Gentleman mean to fay that goon or ropoo men in the year railed by the ALL, is not confiderable ? What I is recruiting the army nothing? Will that, Sir. be nothing when completed ? The meafure has already operated a molt fignal, and as falutary as fignal, change on the ftate of our recruiting. In fact, it nearly doubles the recruiting of the country. The Hon. Gentleman would, I am quite lure, not allow it to be thought that they do not love their country with a love railed wholly above party paffions. Yet what do the Honourable Gentlemen think of a mo tion for the repeal of a law which is every day ad ding to the difpofable efficient force of the country.. —But if our meafure be not adequate, why do they not fuggeft fuch as they imagine would prove fo ? To do juftice to them, they teem no ways difpofed to clog Government with any loch acts of patriotifm. If they have filch meafures in (lore, it would appear that they have resolved not to make them a contribution to their country. Be this as it may, here the queftion (lands (imply on the fad. The Houfe unanimoufly agrees that it is necelfary to find more than ordinary means of recruiting our army. Now if, by the pre fent meafure, we have found extraordinary means to• wards accomplithing that end, if we have found thefts extraordinary means not only without increafing but by diminifhing the expences of recruiting, though fill the fyftem cannot be perfect, yet the At furnace means of a very powerful efficiency, and of very ge• neral application. As far as expence is any way a queition, I have told you, Sir, and repeat here, with. out the apprehenfion of being contradided, that with greatly diminifhed expence we have .doubled our re. cr uiting. I would afk them if it be a continent wearily' to call on the Houfe to repeal that Ad, efpectally in the prefent circumftances ? We ought to give this meafure a fair trial. I will not (late the precife pe. dad who we ought to delta from our experiment 1 1 1 fl 1 . I 1 1 ... b i ' 1 ,i '4 i t ? • i iI I , : 1 ' f !}' 1 1 n. ~.I ig i , h I. it i !;' (i 1 1 , 1 1 1 11 ?' 111 i ' f 4 ' V 1 I. ' . i . .1