Star. — London, England, 1828-03-07 00:00:00

all the laws 6 r iv% ettarattge, r that 4s the meld be beltet !,‘ hid bee% y with tibe ity espuibml/4 I the Bat it to notion ore hit 1 atter of the. in Conned, stands fat iwse circunt: owe h pad )n a petition The Ho& observatioai to answer.--; six or serest able to stay,i ier. I ii44i nd Learned the situation id I arn ant require as rish to know, Leasure of the in, go on.) c na — uut deiik I move foe it ey may b e ed. I feel it se to the cit. ssa y to take to he uncle'. had no com. nment on the ivy Council ence of what it Member of to make this Gentleman ite of slavery w." That re others were ing effect laws as may slaves them. le interests of e that his Ma. cute these re i-ent occasion, curable Mem- F the slave, to aliment was ions. It was the series of hem to that !II brought.—. would be gra in Council to s freedom by wing the peti . The Right re this pa. t of d to the coon. espect to that servations had history of the 3 pledged the he freedom of the interest of tch, dated the s to the West es, and direct inder the con fut theran ce of :ch. In that abject of ma- Woodford, the pare the draft those instruc ith the single opon which 4trt any other, tst India body obedience to ft of an Order in that subject Mr. Canning, t, in ttie begin e principles of .o collect toge cement which ndies ; to con• eral slave code n }spry manna t, being found med expedient Id the fact was Mr. Canning. :il of Trinidad, ;es relating to Feet identically VR over to Sir roper to state, nen who were !nt the slaves, ,upposed, more an Proprietors !de at the time I manumission , in the course arhament was of compulsory as it extended. erbice, than the 'Listed the duty ct, condensing e.Spanish law, n home, made )f compulsory the Secretary es were disco cut here were revoke it alto could induce measure, unless met which the le of exercising To] ominous do on the table of it though much ittches to the operation iu varying 1.4 d. Now, be he abolstionibts them to beim 'bin dad. they t cou,J s arcely be said. to exist. As he had befoie shown. i t was completely inoperative. end the interest of the' slave eAS as iiiipr , tected by it is the interest of the nia.ter. BytheS,aaish law,which prevaileJ in •heSpotish C lionies, the right of the mater in Vico bomini, was supposei to have been derived trona the ancient l a w which governed the Spanish master in Europe in respect of his Moorish slaves. At a time when a slave market was in existence, the history of such compulsory manumission errs simply this; the blave, who under this les non seripta (for such it was, as however intik putable its existence, it was extremely difficult to find any written traces of it), bad obtained money enough to purchase his manurnie.ien, went to his master, who appointed two appraisers, who struck between them what they consideted to be a fair price lot the value of the slave; and with this price the master went into the Market to obtain another in his stead, and thus no general or particular inconvenience resulted from such a transaction. In Trinidad, before the cessation of the Slave Trade, this law remained—one very easy in its operation, in consequence of the growing importation tom day to day of slaves into that island from the poorer soils of the West Indies. The master was thus enabled. without any difficulty whatever, to .p.irt with slaves by this process of manumission.— The House would not fail to observe, that when the trade from Africa was stopped altogether, the Whole case was altered in respect both to the master and the slave. Now, the clauses in the Trinidad Order in Counscil required, "that a fair and just value shall be taken of a slave applying for his manumission, and that if any difficulty should arise on this head, the owner of the slave and the proprietor of the slaves of the Colony shall nominate a third party, whose award shall be bind ing." Nothing could appear more simple or less corn elex than this direction in terms. Nothing.could be ima guse.l more difficult of execution. The House would observe, that there was nothing in this order which ascertained or directed the principle on which this lap praisernent of value was to be made —(Hear, hear), Nu o, although, while a market existed to which the master could have repaired to replace his slave, this omission would have been of no consequence, it was one, under present circumstances, and, atter that market had altogether ceased in our Colonies, of the most es sential character. The whole question turned on one single point, therefore, and upon one difficulty of this SOIL, namely, the difficulty of the slavenwner replacing a slave whom he might so lose by manumission thus purchased. In 1823, this country, as he (Mr.Wilmot- Horton) felt bound to observe, was deluged by as.er tions that it was the grossest mistake which had ever been known, to suppose that tree labour would not execute more beneficially for the purposes of the master the duties of sugar cultivation, than slave labour could , execute them. No man living but must wish most heartily, and from the bottom of his soul, that this were the fact; but, unfortunately, it ,was not so. It was for the purpose of pointing out to the House the multiplied difficulties which belonged to this subject, and to show at some future period how those documents would bear on the consideration of this sub ject, that he should move that the minutes of evidence taken before the Privy Council, in the matter of the Demerara and Be, bice Manumission Order in Council, should be laid upon the table of, the House. He was convinced that the minds of Honourable Gentle men would be very much informed and enlightened by the study_ of those minutes, and of the admirable speeches, of die Counsel engaged both on the one side and on the other. The latter were published, and, without perusing them, perhaps no man would be perfectly aware Of the difficulties which he (Mr. Hor ton) had ,spoken. of. The House would perceive, by , the dispatch of Lord Bathurst, that the principle upon which it was intended that the slave appraisement should take place, was the principle of equivalent sullstitution ; that is,. that. if the master lost his slave by reason of his compulsory manumission, he should be enabled, as, nearly as possible, to replace him by an equivalent in value. The. former Resolutions of the House of .Commons iueolved.. two propositions so coufficting, that, in his judgment, no man who cqnsidered their effect could deny that they contemplated, on the one hand, the slaves arriving progresOely at a state of freedom; and, .on -:they pther. ,ond with equal clearness, an avoidiag 4 ; 4,w:birth!. bis so al r iving at such a state, with as equitable provision de vised for the interests of the master. The Right Hon. Gentleman. illustrated the difficulty of this - case by .showing the loss to which the slave owner was subjected by reason of having a valuable slave abstracted frqm bis i estate, the cultivation of which estate supplied him,.,the master, with the whole capital upon which himself and his family were, to be supported. In fact, therefore, his whole difficulty turned upon this ...the Jimited market for slaves. Sugar cultivation, it. was notorious, was carried on upon such an estate larkbpdy of slaves labouring together. It was necessary that their woak should be continuous, sustained with out interruption, and capable of being made available at all periods. The case of such slaves who worked upon a compulsory principle Was very different from that of working classes in a free and densely peopled country like our own, for example, where the labourer would usually be too happy to obtain the greatest pos sible amount of employment, since, to its execution, he would willingly devote the greatest possible amount of his time, as the means of realising the greatest amount of wages. All that he was anxious about was, that Hon. Gentlemen should be aware of the difficulties which surrounded this subject, and not be tempted, in their desire to better the condition of the slave (a desire in which every man of right feeling must participate with them), to legislate rashly or in ignorance upon questions which involved the interests of so many thou seeds amongst us, as well as of the whole of the slave population. The greatest mistake in the world would be to suppose that the slaves should be estimated at a general equal value (a proposition which the Right Hon. Cient.proo eded to exemplify by several analogies drawn from the cultivation of lands both in England and the West Indies, of unequal value, by unequal numbers of hands,and by hands of unequal skill). He contended that . there was no alternative between the failure of all the measures that had yet been suggested for the relief of the slave, and 4 complete purchase of all the property of the colonies and planters in the West ladies, except this of compulsory manumission, this species of appraise', meats. By both Hooves of Parliament they Were called on to do away slavery altogether; on the othee' hand, they were equally required to respect property, 1 and to show a regard for the interests of the master as v ell as for those of the slave; and here was the main difficulty of the problem; for it was no argument to 1 sty that slavery in the abstract was a worse state than a state of freedom. After this House should hays; succeeded in convincing the West. India proprietors' i throughout the colonies that they had both seen and,, weighed the difficulties of • the case, they would have a better ti g ht to expect the consent and concinrence.of the legislative Colonies et Great Britain to those measures which, he must contend, such Colonies couli and ought to carry into effect, , iShOUS prejudice SO their own title interests. He wait sorry that dui Hon. and Learned' Member for Winch,lse4 was not present in his place on the present occasion) although, perhaps, his presence was not necessary, since he (Mr. Hoi on) was merely 1 .Irving what observations occurred to him as applicable to the papers he was moving for. As he was provoking no argument, and as he was stating difficulties which he thought it the more necessary to demonstrate while vindicating the conduct of the late and present Go. stemma i■ respect of them, it was of paramount necessity that the West India Colonies should know and feel that we had no other view to consult than their own interess ; and that We determined to carry into effect measures of amelioration ) even though it should he proposed to consider what modifications ought to be made and what ought to be done with this particular clause respecting appraisement. The Right Hon. Gentleman then adverted to -some animadversions of Mr. Brougham on a preceding night upon his (Mr. Horton's) presumed argument in favour of compen sation to the West India Proprietors. He denied that he had maintained the principle in the manner suggested by his Hon. and Learned Friend ; but the analogy which his Hon. and Learned Friend had attempted to establish between their case and the case of private interests, like the Silk Tiede, was really untenable. He (Mr. Horton) had been asked who had ever heard of such a principle as compensation in such a case as the Silk Trade ? But surely the House would at once perceive the wide difference between a question of that nature, and one in which large sacrifices were demanded under the circumstances peculiar to the West india question. Had it been true that free labour could effect the cultivation of sugar, for instance, to the extent at which the advocates for frea 1 +boor calculated that it was capable of doing, slave labour would long since vanished from the West India Islands. Could this be doubted? Good COD ! the West India Proprietor must be insane who would not contemplate with satisfaction, if such a measure were practicable, the substitution of free labour for the labour of slavery, with all its inci• dents. Unfortunately this was not the question, and the House was to consider, not the wishes, but the means of the patties. As long as any equivalent for the va:ue of his slaves could be produced to the master, he (Mr. Horton) should not hesitate to say, that the case of the master was one which did not tell for compensa tion at all; but how impracticable it was to fix this ne• cessary question of equivalency he had already shown. The West Indians, when they complained of our legis lation on this subject, complained that we did not follow up the letter of our own law. This very objection only rendered it the more necessary to ascertain, if possible, some system of appraisement. How was a slave to be replaced who had become expert in the cultivation of one species of produce, raised in a particular soil, if the only substitute to be obtained was another slave, accus tomed to cultivate adifferent produce in a different situa• tion? What was to be done where no slave at all could be found? How was the price of a slave, whose manumis- *ion was to be purchased, to be estimated, when it was found impossible either to purchase znotl.er slave at all, or a.slarre of equal value in the cultivation of the mas ter's estate? He (Mr. Horton) admitted the difficulty, which, thoilgh a contingent one, was most important to be peat considered. The Hon. and Learned Member for Winchelsea had also intimated that be (Mr. Hor. • ton) had expressed an opinion that compensation to the slave-owners should be made before any discus slim on the subject of these Orders was prcceeded with. Now he, in truth, had never said any such thing. The House would see that though, as far as measures of amelioration were concerned, they were free to adopt aoy course they pleased, either by the exertion of their own power, or by recommend- ing strongly where recommendation was the course it might seem more proper to pursue, they should not pledge themselves on a subject of such difficulty to any act of improvident legislation, which might be produc tive of substantive injustice to the West India proprie. tors. When his Hon. and Learned Friend, whose ab sence he so much tegretted, reproached him (Mr. H.) with being opposed to the abolitionists, he must beg to inquire, of what abolitionists? Because he conceived that this House, and the other House of Parliament, were equally pledged to carry into effect thf resolutions 01823; and as for himself, according to his landerstand log of those resolutions, he challenged any man to show Ahat he had ever done anything which had not proposed their accomplishment for its object. These resolu tions certainly contemplated the gradual advance• meat of the slave to a state of freedom, at the same time that they respected the rights of private pro. , party. Now, such terms it was easy to write, but they involved,. in • practice, a most tremendous and respon sible difficulty. Slavery bad been treated by some Gen tlemen as an useles excrescence, and, as such, one that might easily be sacrificed with little injury to the State. It was his conviction that this o as not the case; that no men could be found. in short, to do the labour of the slaves. He himself had taken every pains, and so had the Privy Council, to bring together all evidence which could be obtained, in order to demonstrate the equelity of free labour to slave labour. Instructions were accordingly given to Mr. Common Sergeant Den man and Mr. Sergeant Bosanquet to adduce any evi dence which they could collect on this point, in order to show that the difficulties of the subject were less than the Berbice appellants had represented them to be.— Every facility was given with this view, but the result was totally unsatisfactory. He could as little admit to his Hon. and Learned Friend, that this was a question to be disposed of by any arithmetical references to those points of the Resolutions of this House which had been attended to, or neglected by the Legislative Assemblies. It would be well to conciliate, by every fair, reasonable, .and deliberate consideration of the various difficulties attaching to the case, the proprietors of slaves in the West Indies, before the House attempted to legislate upon it. Above all, it was necessary, if it was meant permanently to maintain the interests either of the slave or his master,not to put-them in collision with each ether. No pecuniary advantage could accrue to the master, no benefit to the slave, if these parties should be so brought into collision by hasty or indiscreet legislation. That planter best consulted his own interests, beyond ques tion, who most consulted the interests of his slaves. In respect of the latter, coercion was a mode of treatment _which must now be sure to fail—a conclusion which the Right Honourable Gentleman came to, from consi dering the very different state and circumstances under which the creole slave was now placed—in a condition of slavery in which he had been born, and in which he bad always lived, from those in which the slaver , newly imported from Africa, and suddenly exchanging hate of freedom for a forced slavery, was formerly placed. In the case of the latter, his feelings west Accited by the contract of the state from which he .bad been carried away, and the freedom from which be had been borne, with the servile labours and the .bondage upon which he was reluctantly compelled to enter. The creole wasnot only unconscious of a con trast so calculated to arouse his angry passions, but was gradually merging (distant as was the time which the West India proprietor assigned for the accomplishment of the change) into t state of liberty. Ht. did not mean to '•inditate or enter into any de. fence of the Coloniat•Legisleturei; all that he wisl , ed to be understood by the House as saying was, that they would do well, in proportion to their poweroo set the example of fo r bea rance at t hi s cr i t i ca l M o ment. There was a dispositi on i n t h ose Colonies—lb Demerara and Berbice it had b e en e xpress l y d ec l are d— to as s ist in pro tuoting the views and measures of Government; there fore, additionally on that account, he thought they ooght, in their legislation, to show a disposition towards the protection of property. More would be done towards the attainment of their own wishes, if they were to act with practical forbearance towards the equitable in terests of the parties. It should be recollected, that in this matter ere were not affected in purse or in person in extending the operation of our benevolence—(Hear) — and although that consideration would not, he well knew, deter the House from pe;forming their duty towards the Empire at large, he thought it ought to weigh in the balance where we were dealing with the rights and interests of those who were affected by this question in purse and in person, and who might not happen to take the same view of the subject as them selves. The Right Hon. Gentleman concluded, amidst' the cheers of the House, with thanks for the attention which had been paid to him, by moving that-- " An humble Address be presented to his Majesty, to give orders that the Papers referrrod to in the opening of the speech be laid on the table on the House." Mr. K. DOUGLAS seconded the motion, and con tended that the House would do well to be cautious how it pro ceeded in any question connected with the Colonies in the absence of full information. Lord NUGENT said, he should not prolong a de bate on a question on which there was no difference of opinion in tke House; as all were agreed that the papers should be laid be fore the House. lie merely rose fur the purpose or enteriog his protest against some of the principles laid down by his Hight Honourable Friend. When his Honourable Friend said that the slaves were a property guaranteed by Parliament, be (Lord Nugent) could not forget that there was a power higher than Parliament; and that Parliament could never give a just claim to have human beings regarded as property, against the voice of N ore and of Gon. When the slave owners claimed compensation for their slaves, as their property, he would deny his right, because be never could have a right to make his fellow-men his property —(Hear, hear!) Mr. W. WHITMORE said. s he was quite convinced that unless compulsory manu ' 'on was enforced, it was worse than useless to agitate the question of ameliorating the condition of the slaves. It was not true that West India products could not be produced by free labour. Let them look at the East, at Mexico, and at St. Domingo, where sugar was produced in large quantities by free labour—(hear, hear). Mr. W. SMITH said he felt it his duty to protest against the doctrine, that man could be the property of his fellow man. But he would not contend that the owners of slaves bad not a right to compensation from the nation who had sanctioned their unjust claims to make man their property. Mr. BARING said, be had heard one Hon. Friend support the rights of man, and another Hon. Friend cite the words of Goo. With those topics he did not wish to interfere. He should only say, he thought the Colonial Legislatures would be astonished when they beard how the subject of their losses was discussed. He wished to remind his Hon. Friends how their arguments stood with respect to the resolutions of Parliament. The resolutions of the House of Commons and the House of Lords had been passed upon the understanding that manumission was to be gradual, and without the viola tion of property. Much had been said on the hardships endured by the negroes, but it would be found that the labouring classes in Europe, working for the benefit of their employers, suffered more severely than the black agriculturist, whose real state was misrepresented, and who was supposed to be tt eated with abominable cruelty. Those charges and misrepresentations he positively de. nied. If, however, any Member thought fit to question the accuracy of such statements, he was considered a prejudiced man: one who ate at the planter's table, or drank his punch.—The Hon. Gentlemen who opposed the West India Proprietors spoke of wrongs and in jurious treatment, without any better grounds than their own imagination. As to the necessaries and :he wants of life, he could say there were few of the labouring classes in Europe upon a footing with the slaves on a well-regulated plantation. He would take the negroes of Antigua and back them for moral feeling against the peasantry of St. Giles in London, and other parts. The Right Hon. Gentleman had stated that his Ma jesty's Gioveronsent laboured under great difficulty in meeting the prejudice on this subject. He was an ad vocate for gradual emancipation, but he thought if the slaves were set at liberty without order and method, it would do them more harm than good. The abolitionists called for emancipation forthwith, and said, Delay not a minute. If it were true that the slaves were suffering under abominable cruelty, there could be no question that they ought to be liberated immediately; but was it so? They were not cruelly treated, and gradual manu mission was the best course that could be taken. The question of compensation was of considerable import. auce, and should be fairly considered. If manumission took pla.e to a considerable extent, the cultivation of sugar was gone. if the number of labourers necessary for the cultivation of sugar upon a plantation was re duced so low that cul:ivatton could not go on, the owner of the estate would lose the u.e of negro labour, which made it productive. Theo came the application of free labour. The Honourable Member expressed a strong doubt whether free labour and slave labour would go together. In America they could not get free labourers for such work. He felt, upon a general view of what was due to the Wept India Proprietor, that Parliament should pause before they adopted any measure which .might fall heavy and with injustice on that body. Mr. Secretary HUSKISSON said that he certainly was of opinion, that amongst all the difficulties o hich the Government had to contend with, in endeavouring to carry into effect the Resolutions of the House, them were none more serious than those which would arise from sentiments -such as those expressed by his Hon. 'Friend, Mr. W. Smith, and by the Noble Lord (Nugent). He did not think that, horn maintaining the principle that there we, e no vested rights (for vested they were), in this kind of property, however unfortunate it might be, the colonists threw more difficulties in the way of every negotiation between them and the Government with respect to amelioration, than from any other cause whatever; and while he said than be should also say, that all those difficulties were aigravated by the equally extreme views taken on the other side by his Honour able Friend who spoke lair. The people and the House both concurred in the desire to see something done by which the state of slavery should be ameliorated, and he therefore lamented when be heard, what might make it appear to those connected with the West Indies, that they were not recognised to possess a legal right in their slaves. He knew that they had the same right—that it was defined and limited by the same laws, as they had to other property ; at the same time that he agreed with his Honourable Friend (Mr. W. Smith), that they stood in a _different point of view, as owners of thi , property, as compared with any other—(Hear, hear). At the same time, he would not have that Honourable Gentleman suppose that the principle of compensation was to be departed from if they were ,to part with this as to how they had dealt with it, were to be permitted . property, or that any inquiry, under such circumstances, Laying arid, all *hatted rtglite.. the ftes• lotions of Par. Lament treated the; ncgiOes ies . tetted property ; bot the *ante time had the object of eff-cting each a gra dual change in them as would raise them to the coa., dition of the other subjects of the enui,t; y. The Right Honourable Gentleman went on to say, that he thought his Right Honourable Friend (Mr. W. Horton) and his Honourable Friend (Mr. Baring) had themselves an swered their own arguments. The question of compul sory manumission had its origin in Trinidad, where it was adopted from the Spanish law, and no difficulty could exist to it in a Spanish island, inasmuch as the deficiency created by it could always be filled up .by a fresh importation of slaves from Africa ; but that being at an end, then it would not be consistent with the other clause of the resolution, that respect ing compensation, respecting which a difficulty was to be overcome, namely, that the moral qualities, the skill, and value of the slave, greatly overbalanced the price he would bring in the market. Under the old law of Spain, the parties to replace these skilful educated negroes were the untutored savages of Africa , wherefore, if he was bound to assume that there was a difficulty in replacing a slave, yet also his owner was in a better situation, as those from whom be could now be replaced were the educated. and he might call them apprenticed slaves of our own Islands. Here the Right Honourable Gentleman contrasted the pre sent intelligence and condition of the slaves in the West India Islands with the state they were in be- fore the abolition of the slave trade, and said a :hange for the better had taken place since 1807, greater than had ever occurred in any part of the world in the same space of time. He had had an opportunity, within a few days, of learning from the high authority of the Bishop of Jamaica, much upon the subject. and he felt pleasure in assuring the House, that that Prelate's report was highly satisfactory, both as respected the present state of the negroes, and the progress that was made in amelioration. He, therefore, so far agreed with his Hon. Friend (Mr. Baring) that it was better both for the negroes and for the interests of humanity, if Go •ernment in its interference did not disturb a state of things which was every day getting better, sod which, if rashly meddled with, would only lead. to expense ssithout benefit. His Honourable Friend had said that there were great numbers of negroes in Antigua as well informed as the lower classes in this country, and he would ask whether, such being the case, be was not authorised in siying that they were entitled to such means of progressive im provement as would give theM claims to the rights of subjects? That, he thought, ought to be accorded them, and the first measure for that purpose that ought to be adopted, was to allow the evidence of such persons. That was one means of progressive improvement which should be conceded, and suffering it to go on gradually and progressively would be far better than the adoption of any such measures, which would cows pel the necessity of a large compensation, and then ruin the Colonies. He would not detain the House by going through all the arguments which had been urged, but said that the mode of compensation by appraisement did not present such insuperable difficulties to his mind as itdid to that of others. It was admitted, that if ode slave was sold another might be found ; and the analogy between a large and a small farm he thought fallacious, because the value of a domestic animal was not greater on one than on the other. He did believe that compulsory manumission would have one effect, namely, that when it proceeded to any extent, those slaves now used for c:0- mestic purposes, would be forced, despite even of the wishes of their owners, to labour in the sugar plantations. Whenever the period arrived, in which, from slaves being manumitted invito domino, that sugar cultivation should be abandoned, then, an' not till then, it v.:4 that the principle of compensation beyond appraise ment should be allowed. But it was also known th.t even at present the appraisers at Trinidad had acted quite differently; and the consequence was, that when. the order of Government was refused to be put in practice there, the necessity arose from other inter ference. He begged the House to look to the Reso lutions of 1828, which embraced two points. The first was an amelioration of the condition of the slaves, and the other pact referred to the gradual change froth slavery to freedom, and for that purpose nothing was ever suggested but compulsory manumission; and he begged of those connected with the West Indies not to run away with the idea that unless Parliament inteifered, the Government would depart from the pursuance of the system of compulsory mAnurnis sion, of course accompanied by compensatiun. They were bound, he was perfectly free to idmit, to at tempt some mode of melioration of the slave popula tion, net rapidly, of course, but surely and steadily.— Done it must be, though he could not say in any time to be specified—but sooner or later a change must, it course, be effected in their civil condition. He would not longer occupy the attention of thee House, nor should he have trespassed upon its indulgence. even to the extent that he had done, were it not that in the si tuation in which he stood, he felt bound to make the observations. he had done. Mr. BARING and Mr.W. SMITH explained. Mr. F. BUXTON considered the question to have been discussed with caution until an Hon. Member commenced reading a lesson to those who did not take the same view as him self. The Hon. Member had conveyed charges of rulsr.presenta don. In like manner he was charged on a former occasion with nth-statement, in sating there was use made of the cart-whip in the Colonies. He was told the whip was never used, and soon after came the proof that the cart-whip Lad been used, and that Gevern theist bad ordered it to be abolished. When the fri, ads of emanci. radon asked for manumission, they were met by the call fur cant ' pensation. An Hon. Member had described the Blacks to be the Mat of Christians, and on a footing with the peasantry of England. ilia wished the Hon. Gentleman to explain one point; if they were ao well fed, so well clothed, and so moral, how did it happen that they were the only people on earth whose Number decreased at a rate which would depopulate the whole earth in slaty years? Wi t h respect to compensation, he would not forget that the property of Planters was derived from crime —(A cry of No, not crime!) r< as it not felony ? Could any man suppose that a Planter in the Kest Indies tore men, women, and children from their families, and ex posed them to the horrors of the middle passage, without knowing It was a crime? The Government bad participated in crimes of that description, but they stood upon a different footing. One wished to make restitution of the stolen property, and the other said -. No; I will not consent unless you give me compensation. The Slave had a right to say. You have robbed me of my freedom, and you most give me liberty. He was not for emancipation forthwith. btaivner a y c h n t i so tiu d n e t b n re ase c d e sn ive d b li t u sa c t r a t l y i ! e n d u th t : he negro, that be f might suchun happy not brings should be ameliorated. He should speak the plain truth, namely, the planter might have a claim for property, but the negro had a prior claim to liberty. Mr. BERNAL supported the interest of the West India Proprietors. He was not mere the Hon. Member for Wey. month had spoken out in a manly. candid manner, b.cause it was nrcessa: y the West India planter should know the sentiments s.f marry Member on the subject. The Hon. Member had talked G t compensatiou, but be bad put the rights of the negro higher than those of the planter. That was not the course likely to sati.fy the Colonists. They were a body • that would not be trampled on. Having been appealed to for explanation why the Black population decree d, he could only say that the old African race wts nut et duct, and so long as it contaminated the Creole, there would be a diminution of the Black population. The Assembly of Jamaica had done muck to ameliorate the condition of the slaves. They had gone further than they were warranted by Lord Bathurst's instrtiktions. They bad made the Blacks competent to give eviden.te in a Court of Justice. Free men had been convicted on their testimony, but the refusal of his Majesty's Council to confirm the Law ofhiMAIII , f • K 1 .1 I • 1. . 1 I w : ', ' • l '.. i l :1 ; . 1 • t. , 1 t ir . i. ~...t . . , , f ...i: i ~... . • ~i 1; -. •,,_ i id; r 1 . -.. i : :,., ~ I •:. ~,..i, ~ ~ ) • •i .t , itfid, 0 , i •., ..f A , • :•.. 4 -i 1 - j .t. i,... . .•• .. . , ... tf • ; • . • i, . p 1 • : . 1 f 1-1.: 11 ry • ' . , ,' • 1, .., .1. ~.:t . ~ • , . 1 ... 1 4 i• i.. I. ~, • ~„.... • .ii / .1 i .._ 1 i. 1 • . , x . ..if ; ~ , . .. . , • . • 4 11 ' I‘, I 1 I :.• 'i• 1 . II , A •• ' :...." 9 . . . 7 . , . . ' •1 1 : . I t • . i f r , ~ k . 1 • 1 i : . .."'".....''