Star. — London, England, 1825-03-22 00:00:00

..,...'"-- s ' • • istents of these officers exorbitant, but at the same time not such as to put them out of the reach of persons of small income, but of considerable talent. Nothing could be more at valiance with the spirit of our COW Eitution, than that high offices, whether at home or abroad, should be placed out of the reach of all but those of large hereditary fortunes. It was a principle of this Constitution, what he might term its Repub lican principle, that the Sovereign should choose the fittest men, in whatever rank of 17fe they might be found;—(Thar, hear)—but if the recommendation of the llononr able Member was adopted, that principle must be abandoned. The disposition made by the Committee of 1816, merely secured that a man might accept of foreign missions, without absolute ruin to himself. He ( Mr. Canning) was quite sure, when the Honourable Gelitliman reflected upon the subject, that be would) see this tier scription of duty was not SO j ustl y estimated, pttig particula 1 1 stuns for particular services ; such was nut the way in which the interest of the country would he best consulted—(hear, hear). Mr. HUME ptincipaliy objected to the increase in the aggregate amount of the expense of our Diplomatic Establishment. Tare Finance Committee took the charge in 1817, on an average of the three preceding years; and on an Address to his Majesty. the H arse antici parcel that further reductions would he effected. With respect to the importance of the duties of the Consuls General appointed to South America, if proper persons were nominated, he (Mr. Hume) should not quarrel with the Right lion. Secretary on the subject of expense. But he (slr. Hume) would ask the Right lion. Se cretary, did not the Dutch Government last year wish to lower the rank of its representation, and was not such a step opposed by his Majesty's Ministers? Whatever the feelings, however. of Foreign States, all we should look to was our situation, and not keep up an establishment beyond our wants. Among the several other items of which this vote consisted, besides the eztsaordinaries already noticed. he hoped some e xplanation would be afforded respecting the charge for the Commissioners for Claims on Fpaiii. Mr. Secretary CANNING hoped that ultimately the investigation of those cla ins would produce the de-, sired result, hut he must say, as on every other point, when concession was to be made by Spain, it was a very difficult matter to ob.ain the payment of its debts from that Government. Tie of these claims was as follows t—The British Merchants had suffered severe losses from the Navy r f Spain, during the war with its Colonies, and after several ituffectnal remonstrances we sent orders to the English Commander to seize as many Spanish vessels as would compensate for the losses sustained by British subjects. We however sent notice to Spain at the same time of this or.ler, and in conse-' quence our determination was bought off by an ac knowledgment of our right to redress, and of a willing ness to make good the losses incurred. lie (Mr. Can ning) would ask them, when a party consented to in demnify another, would it have been fair to reject that offer, and by a process of summary justice right its own wrongs? The manner, however, in which Spain was treated on this occasion, grew out of a specific conven- Lion between that country and England, by which each bound itself, only after a repeated denial of justice had been received, to take that justice into its own hands.— lo consequence of our demand the Commission in goes tin,' yeas appointed, and proceeded with its labours for a time dui ing the existence of the Government of the Cortes. When the other Government was after wards restored, the Commission was abolished, as well as every other act of the Constitutional Go. vernment, but reinstalled afterwards, and it was only just to remark, that of all the acts of the Cortes, its recognition alone was subsequently obtained. — He (Mr. Secretary Canning) mentioned this as another proof that there was no want of urgency on the part of Government in pressing the claims of our subjects. It should he acknowledged at the same time, that, owing to the change of the Commissioners after the Restoration, a delay of several months elapsed, and even in the course of last year the Commissioners were changed three times, each change attended with a loss of time. But still the investigation was in progress, and out of the 4 or 500,0001. claimed, between 2 and 300,000/. had already been admitted—he wished he could say paid. He hoped, however, that even that consummation would finally take place. After a few words front Air. Baum and Mr. Secretary Cansum in explanation, Mr. HUME observed, that there was another item in the resolution which he wished to notice, namely, 6 4001. towards carrying. into effect the provisions of the treaty of Ghent. It was, he believed, the third or fourth pay. went which bad been made on that head. Mi. Secretary CANNING conceived the present to be only the first, or, at the utmost, the second pay inent on account of that treaty which this country was called upon to pay. By one art cle of the treaty of Gtreat, we undertook to indemnify certain citizens of the United States for injuries suffered by them, in what IA ere not considered a just exercise of belligerent rights ; a.d by another article we agreed, if any obstacle should occur in regard to the firmer, that the Empe ror of Russia should decide tl e disputed point AS um pire. The Emperor of Russia had decided against this country, but as tile decision had only been communi cated the year before last, he (Mr. Secretary Canning) believed the ' , resent was the first time the liquidation of the demand was submitted to Pailiament, and he might likewise add, that it was the last rime but one when they should come before the House on the subject. Mr. HUME contended that they ought to have be fore them the Report to which allusion had been made, before they were called upon to vote the suns demanded. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER con demned the impatience of the Hon. Member for Abet deen. The matter to which he addressed himself was under the consideration of Government, and unless the House were t repared to say that the inquiry would he carried on be•ter in other hands they could not join in the complaint of the Honourable Gentleman. He auured him it was much easier to find out faults than all at once to frame sa ttstactury remedies. Mr..HUME of jected to the charees made for light houses and particularly deprecated " private" light-houses, whose demands were extravagant. He could mat understand how the Crown granted patents to individuals to charge tire public as they pleased. Mr.W A LLA CE said the,. light-houses were private property, with which the Crown could not interfere. Mr. HU.- KiS ON promised that at the renewal of the leases of these light-houses, care should he taken of the public interests. After some words from 51r. CUSTUS and Mr. Hums, the vote was agreed to. Mr. HUME objected to the vote of 1.0344. for tr cleaning aid Te 11.11• ing the nionumeats in Sr. raid's." Ile thought that as the Dean and Chapter charged the public for seeing these monuments, they ought at least to expend that money in repairing them. Ile declared he would divide the Committee upon this grant, unless a strong case was made out fur fire Dean and Chapter. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said he could not give the minute intormation required by ' the Hon. Gentleman. It was well knayt n that various hinds in the hands of the Dean and Chapter, were ap propriated to the repair of this pile. He thought it hut " fair that the country, which placed public monuments in St Paul's, should pay for the repairs of them. With regard to Westminster Abbey, he certainly. had heard great complaints as to the amount of the fees de manded for exhibition an 4 the want of proper accom '' moiiation in this respect . to the public. But lie Nell knew that the Treastirj hid no power to summon the Dean and (Ismer to lowa the fees. Mr. HOME said he was happy to heat these senti. - ments with respect to Westminster Abbey, which every liberal mind must entertain. Mr. W. Smrrn l ess. happOo fitratthat this subject was diked in Parliamenelivery year, tie - the conduct of the Dean Mid - Chapter it wads/Whew week in ever respect. Sti J. SEBRIG saitt'that lie really felt , ashamed w hei'isking-Totelgners entreeWhtminstie•Atbey a at the sordici i lliberal regulations by which they were ffounteied. Mr. HUM E objected to a sum of 3.501. for a Mr. Finlayson, in consideration of certain calculations for the public service made by him. He wished to know what these calculatfons were fur which the public were called upon to pay so much? The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, the cal -ulatirns were des.iled to be of the greatest public service. They were dirt cted to ascertain the cor. rectness ot all the public tables which had hitherto been acted upon in estimating Life Annuities—the North ampton tables amongst the rest. He was a most laborious man, with a mind well fitted to a task of this kind ; nothing could be more important, and be had already de tected some very material errors, especially as to the duration of female life, which was longer th an generally supposed: He could mot undertake to say when he should have completed his work— but of his diligence he had no doubt. .• Mr. HUME next objected to a sum of 12871. to, James Walker, of Berbice, f,:r the management of a number of slaves. The statement of this case, he said, would prove that those who were advocates tot the do. trine, that the labour of free men was more prattle. tive than the labour of slaves, were totally erroneous in their principle. This Mr. Walker had had the manage ma nt of a body ot slaves, who were of the most vain able description, being all mechanics; be had been ordered to let them out on hire ; and the result was, that they did not acquire a sufliciency for their own maintenance, and that they were a constant charge upon the English public. Those slaves bad been given up to the management of the Member fur Bramber, and his system of free labour had proved totally fallacious. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER stated, that when the Colony of Berbice tad been taken, the slaves had belonged to the Dutch Government, and had been teansterred to our public authorities. They bad been subm'thed to the experiment of ascertaining whe ther the Negroes could not be made mote profitable by a system of free labour than by one of coercion. Unfortunately, those 11/Ittihad superintended the experiment bad been grossly ilia posed upon by their agents, which was the cause of the experiments having failed. There was considerable difficulty in knowing how to dispose of these slaves. Mr. HUME observed, that it would be better to ma numit these Negroes than to make them an annual charge upon the English public. The Government . were pressing upon individual proprietors the necessity and duty of manumitting their slaves, and whet' they themselves were the'possesaors of suck a species of property, they ought at least to put in practice the doe. trines they wished to impose upon others. On the motion of Mr. BERRIES, a Resolution, granting .C 820,000 for the interest of Irish Exchequer Bills, was agreed to. The &gamut having resumed the Chair, the Report was brought up, and ordered to be received to-morrow. COLONIAL COMMERCE. Mr. HUSKISSON then moved that the House resolve itself into a Committee upon the American and West Indian Trade The House having resolved Itself into the said Committee, Mr.HUSKISSON rose.—Although, he observed, the Resolutions with which he should conclude would be strictly in conformance with the recommendation con tained in the Speech delivered from the Throne at the commencement of the Session, and although fortunately as he thought, a favourable disposition existed for the removal of restrictions, he feared he was under the tie cessity of requesting for some little length of time the indulgence of the Committee. When he reflected upon the many interests that might be concerned in this ques tion, the alarm which might be excited, the predilections or prejudices that might be excited by what he had to submit to the Committee, he thought it more becoming on his part to go at length into the subject, than to follow any example of conciseness. When he said this, he as sured the House that if the alterations in our commercial system, which it was his intention to advocate, should be found at variance with the ancient sentiments of the, House with reference to colonial interests and policy, it was not because he thought our ancient policy neces-, sarily erroneous, nor because he considered innovation as necessarily good ; but because he thought the changes which had taken place in the world made it incumbent upon them, who were practical statesmen, to look to these changes, to the effect of them, and the grievances, they had created in our ancient system , a nd p rovide remedies to meet them. It was only in this respect ,that he was an innovator. He was not anxious to try the effect of new principles when no new circumstances' called for their application, feeling, as every day's ex perience taught him to feel, that with the complex machinery of this country by which the daily revolu tions of the world placed some interest at stake, it be came them to weigh well the meaning and end of every institution before they ventured upon effecting a change. With this view, he should submit to the Committee, first, the necessity of a change in their commercial policy with respect to the Colonies ; next, the expe diency of removing the duties upon raw materials used in our own manufactures; and also into the sys tem of prohibitory duties in respect of all imported manufactured articles, the produce of other countries ; and thirdly, whether, from a revision of all these mat ters, they could not acquire the means of establishing some arrangements more beneficial to the commercial and shipping interests, and to the navigation of this empire —(bear, hear). It would have been, he at first. thought, most convenient to take these several matters altogether; but he found that such a course would inevitably lead him into some details, which, particu larly at so late an hour, and under the dread he felt of committing too long a trespass on the time of the House (Hear, hear), he had afterwards thought fit to postpoi.e. lie proposed, therefore, to defer the two latter matters lot the present, and to confine himself to the consideration of our colonial policy only—that division of the general subject, indeed, which might, joist now, be considered the most important and the most interesting. Every Gentleman who heard him must be aware that the system of colonial policy which, had hitherto prevailed in all European States in respect of their colonies, and in Spain and Holland, particu larly in regard to their dependencies in the new world, had be n this—to exclude such col , mies (tom all com merce except that which should be .cArried on with them to and front the p-rent State—(Hearl. He ap prehended that the exclusive system had, in all European States, been considered to be the very essence of their co onial policy. In the enforcement of it—he should be apt to say, in the rigid and even inhospitable enforce. anent—ot such a po.tcy, Spain, perhaps, of all those Powers, had be. n the most strict, and, if he might I use the term, most exclusive—(Hear, hear, hear). But there were other Powers of Europe who had atter• wards manifest-d that they were not less rigid and less jealous in maintiming the same principle. Indeed, if he was not much nris aken, so u liver alhad this rational s} stem ot.a colonial policy been considered, that it had teen h e ld to b e a p irt if the inrernatio al la* , of Eu rope. And, accordingl), it oas laid down as the rule of the Prize Court on this subject, at wine time during the corainume of the seven sears' war, that no colony belonging to a State at war with another, could avail it trade with our Colonies In the West Indies in a cettOire self of the intervention of neutral vessels Mom on trade. number of articles. *By anode r Act they waet:owed with iny otherbOt the parentState,betauselt was deemed AO trarie directly with the C olonies, and t h ence tor ships. Titus the United States. -Europe in British that the neutral might be oltimately engagedin supply theentthy of that mg . . pa teip Stale. To this euent had the [ miaht trade with them. its a limited number of rfila Of.tlie old coloniol,4olio, oilitates been c arried. article:, in ships of the United Scoter, and with re. , i -- • lit'hact no changes, hOewduldiash*-;no ettraordinary s p ect to Euro p ean ports, in Eh his* ships. The House and m o mentous changes—occurred within the List few would perceive, that in conceding to the .U.otted year in the character and condition Of these colonies ? States such an intercourse, .iis . their . own ships, o ith Let them look at the Brazils—what had been their he t Colones. ? it might hove - . been slowly expec.ed that situation since 1808, when the Royal Family of Portu- they would have regarded % privilege not violas,/ gal migrated there? What was the altered situation of •to any other country . in the light of an indulgence, as. St. Dothingo? What was the increase o f enter p rize and they could not chum iitho ofW w right, the B a it i they offered uo t importance which had taken plac e in those vast coon- thing in return. Yet United States passed a low whicle When he considered how these changes might ope- made British ships coming - from the Colonies Into then' rate upon our own Colonies , h e saw cause sufficient until the sof the United States should be od orts, liable to duties in the same way with forei g n shi r e, to call upon the House to e nter into an inquiry, until shipmitteJ, whether, amidst such changes, no change ought to with their own productions into the Colonies, just as ii take place in our own Colonies ?—(Hear, hear)— they were the productions of our Colonies, or of Graaf and whether some change which should include these Britain herself. This was a pretension which no countries in our trade, might not be beneficial to our time or commercial power ever before was, e that the staple l:timed or cone Colonies themselves; whether , o ur having extended free ceded. The substantial demand trade so far, we ought not to ca rr y it still further ; and commodities of Great Britain should h ave no prOteCISOIr whether, if in the long run our Colonies should suffer by in our Colonies beyond the protection given to tie like the continuance of this monopoly of their products, we commodities of the United States. It Gieot Biitoin had , should nor, weaken their attachment thereby to the Pa- asked that the sugars of Jamaica and Louisiana should rent State? He called upon the House to reflect upon be placed on the same footing in the port of New Yoi k o the increase of commercial enterprise, which the revolts- it would have been treated by the A mericans as absurd. tion of nearly one-third of the whole country, from the After the Act of Congress was received in Eng and,• mouth of the River St. Lawrence to Cape Horn, had the, e was but one of two courses left for the Govern. created ; and whether, with reference to the vast marl- ment to pursue--either to forbid the intercourse alto time possessions both insular and continentalof late years gether, or to protect our commerce by light duties oro brought into operation, some alteration was not neces- the American ships. This would have been very Meow sary ? Great Britain had, in many instances, benefited venient, and would have limited the benefits of the' greatlyby relaxing towards her Colonies and dependen- intercourse to the consumers of the We,t Indic-. They cies the severityof her commercial system. He would first did not put on thcoe duties, as they had it in purpose take the case of Ireland. Every one was aware, that up to to submit the present alteration in the system. It was • the year 1780, Ireland had been treated, in all respects, now the intention of Government to put all (Alter cowl like a Colony. Without examining into any other tries on the same footing with the United States, and if sources of her poverty and misery, he might at least as- this latter Power was dissatisfied, why the Colonies. sert that, until the year 1780, she was, in all things re- must endeavour to do without its intercourse. Should. garding her commerce, navigation, manufactures, , such be the case, he should lament it greatly; not it internal industry, and disposition of her productions, was probable that the United States had adopted her held upon the same footing as a Colony. In the year course, became she tl ought the Colonies could not do 1788, certain propositions were brought forward in the without her trade. Looking to the state of conimerce British House of Commons, with the view to work and navigation, Great Britain was not justified in with- . some relaxation in the regulations concerning the trade holding from other countries the advantages we had• to the West India Islands. It was proposed that she conceded to America. Why should Denmark or Sae. might import her own sugars from the West Indies, den be excluded from them? No; .t became us to and export her own glass. It was urged in objet- be as liberal to Europe as we had been to the growing tion that Ireland had already received sufficient market of that great Power, the United S.ates. Terre boons from Great Britain, and that to grant her any could not be the slightest objection in the Committee' more would be ruinous to the commerce of the coun- against giving to the friendly nations of Europe, at least try. Now in what did these boons consist? During to those which would reciprocate with us the pi ivio the earlier part of the American war, we had allowed leges of commerce, all that we had granted to America.. Ireland to export to the Colonies her butter and beef. He thought that we should go even somewhat tui Cher. There was another boon worth mentioning to the House. In his judgment the trade between those Powers and the -As Ireland had at that time a separate army, which Colonies ought (with some modificatsons and prohibi army was paid by herself, and was at that very period tions) to be placed on the same footing as the trade . fighting our battles in America, we passed a law, per- with Jersey and Guernsey, or Ireland. He wool:1 only matting Ireland to clothe, with her own manufactures, prohibit fire-arms, hotrurnents of war, and the stare such portions of her own army as were paid by herself productions of those C. lonies—sugar and ruin. He —(Hear). These were the boons, and how were they would confine the prohibition to the sugar and tune met? All classes in the country, the ship-owners, met- Colonies. We should permit a free inter course to every chants, manufacturers, and traders united in petitioning friendly nation, subject to the s true regulations as the the House to an extent nearly unparalleled. The pro- trade with other parts of Great Britain ; that is, the positions were ultimately thrown out. Having taken ship and cargo to belong to those nations. The result the trouble to examine some of those Petitions, he would then be, that we should retain the commerce be would read a few passages from them, in order that tween Colony and Colony, the direct and circuitous the House might learn the extent of the alarm which trade between the Colonies and tit s country and the' then prevailed, and the fallacy of the predictions which coasting trade. We should give every facility to the' were made. In the Petitions from Glasgow, it was tree intercourse between those Colonies and the rest of prayed 46 that no present and no future advantages the is orld. To effect this, it would he necessary to might be granted to Ireland, which could in the slightest enlarge the list of articles which the Colonies were degree be of disadvantage to Great Britain." In this allowed to receive from other countries, and we must sentiment he fully agreed, but the Petitioners went on impose on thee articles a moderate port duty. At pie-. to say, " that Glasgow had an hereditary right to the sent there was on some of these articles a duty of sugar trade"—(Hear, hear, hear). The Petitions from seven and a half per cent. ad valorem.. He proposed* Manchester considered the propositions as tending to to change this duty to a different scale. The affect the questions of loyalty and allegiance. Those appropriation of these duties was to be left in the from Liverpool asserted, that "if the propositions were hands of the Coloni .1 Legislatures. The revenue' adopted, that town and port would be reduced very arising from this free trade was to form the re-• speedily to their original insignificance"—(A laugh.)— venue of the Colonies. The effect of this. would , be lt was not surprising that such statements and the to take away from them all jealousy respecting tile . alarm they excited in the country prevented the propos concession of these privileges to other Sta ess--.. sitions from being carried. In 1779 a more limited With a view likewise to benefit the commerce both of proposition was submitted, to allow Ireland to buy her the Colonies and the Mother Country, he proposed! to. own sugar merely, in the Colonies, and even this was establish, in the more convenient' ports of the Colonies, lost. But in the same year , the Am erican war changed the whole advantage of the warehousing system as it its character, and assumed a more alarming aspect. State existed in Great Britain. The goods of all the woad& necessity then forced us to yield as a matter not to be were to be alloWed to be warehoused there for re-ex refused, that which we might earlier have granted as a portation. This arrangement, in the present state of matter of grace. In 1782 we were obliged to make Spanish America, would be of immense service. *The another concession, and we repealed the Act which wants of that country were numerous, and required to gave us the power to legislate for Ireland. Whatever be frequently supplied. The market was often glutted advantages had been conferred on Ireland had been by a sudden supply. It was necessary, thereto**, foe equally beneficial to England. He would ask his own the benefit of trade, that the warehousing system should enlightened constituents of Liverpool to look back, and be introduced. This system had been of great utility tell him whether the freedom of intercourse with Ire- to the corn merce of the United Stater, which had adopted land had not been one of the mo st im p ortant sources of it at New Orleans. Such was the general natur e . - o f their unexampled prosperity ? Turning from Ireland his proposition. The effects would be different in the to the case of our North American P rovinces as the y Sugar Colonies and the North American Provinces. , existed some fifty years ago, he would not dwell on In the Sugar Colonies the facilities would he greater the painful topic of that war which excited none of and more economical, the supply cheaper, and the those ideas of greatness and of glory which generally disposal of surplus produce more advahtageous. These associated themselves with the rec ollection of our wars ; were not the only advantages connected with the chonge. but he would ask the Committee wh ether, wh e n they Besides these it would have a tendency to facilitate regarded the separation of one of a commercial sort, the introduction of others. It would create a new the interest of our commerce and navigation had not class of inhabitants in the Sugar Colonies. Houses. been most essentially benefited ?—(Hear, hear, hear).—, of agency • would be estObilshed, merchants would It was worth the while of the Committee to enquire be actively engaged in watching the markets, a whether similar advantages might not be derived from new description of commerce would spring up, and' those Colonies still in our possession, without resorting new channels of industry and agriculture mai kid out. to a political separation. This was an important con sidetation. When we looked to the pr esent condition Perhaps the change might give rise to other p roduc. lions than sugar only. There was no reason why these of the United States, and at the other new States spring ing up in South America, it must be evident that gnat Islands should not produce i n di g o, s i l k, and other articles., It was his intention to submit i to the i Hoteie changes had been made, and were now making, in our measures for the encouragement of o th er p roductions, commercial relations. He hoped that he should not be to infuse into the population of the Colonies a greater accused of any unfriendly feeling toward* ths United proportion of whites, and of an order different b one Y that of mere overseers. That alo ne wo ols ! be doili States, when he said that it was our duty to make ever possible exertion to increase and strengthen our com es much for the interest and prosperity of the colonies, It mercial relations in every feosibie way. Looking to the was impos experience of the past, he drew one certain conclusion , able for him to say when the se-advanta g ec would take place. But that uncertainty was no reosers which was, that systems of monopoly and exclusion why they would tw i ned greatly to impede and cramp the prosperity of not take place sooner or later. No one the colonies ; and irons this great principle lie derived could hove predicted, in 1813, when the m ono p ol y ye" the East India trade was broken up , ho w soon Botany another, that such a system must be equally prejudicial would derive any benefits from the relaxation. An.. 11 to the parent State. Whatever oromoted the prosperity y e t both Great Br et the colonies, must promote that of the m o ther Britain and the East Indies had de tived, and would continue to derive the most imo country. After submi bog mese general observations, he would call the attention of the Committee to the portant advantages from that measure , A n o p etv present sea eof our Colonial System—to the relaxations trade with a thriving oountry was tar bet ter than a s trict monopoly under the idea of making sash mo alreody made in the old system of exclusion , and to the further telaxations which he should feel it his duty to nopoly exclusively beneficial to the m other count y .— recommend. By the Acts of the 3d and 4th of George Cr The wants of mankind increase with the means of pa t ya ng them, anti cherry ...etc wi means eqUal to the ire the Fourth, we had relaxed the old system so far as to t tioduction of o. liberal system Of trade. If them Out pc': mit the United Statesof Americato carry on a direct civics wete true in the case oh the West India Colonies.