Star. — London, England, 1819-06-10 00:00:00

of e l 1. 000,060 that 'Wøuld' tot the t . t ,f n ext Vi c ar. CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said . -,;„„ sen t year the sum of E 13,000,000 had been to h a fance the expenditure of the year, with ", o me derived from our ordinary resources. vetr, from the reduced charge of the unfunded tro ... other causes, he hoped the sum to be wonld not exceed E 11,000,000, exclusive of - . . f. . 00 0,000 wanted to repay the Bank advances. ;yen, as row ' .4:11. 1 .,000,(X)0 should be taken from :;iika:g Fond, E 1,000,000 only would remain to ~,,: o wed in the market, if even this could not be That sum of £4,000,000 would be all that vuld be necessary so to raise to complete the •• as far as Ministers could possibly form a tor t iat, or for n ecess a r y ear of peace. Noted it would not be for them or ucces,:ors to come to Parliamenrfor another 0 ..1,1 - new Taxes. Having. fairly met the dif ,ltie, of o.lc country, he trusted the beneficial ef ; o f the step they had resolved upon would be telt, and that they would receive, the ap -I,s, of their Constituents, whatever feelings of , n otary trritation might be provoked in the first ;r ove by the new but unavoidable burdens to which Nvre called upon to submit. He concluded rov ing his first Resolution, which was for a grant (1;,000.000, by way of annuity. \I L CP,ENFELL said, he had intended, either . r j t y or the day before, to have offered some ~.d irv ::,ions on the Finances, hut had given way to He trusted the Committee woad now allow ,:o so. He agreed fully in all which had :31:1-:;c3 or the necessity of a Sinking Fund, but ~',ways been his opinion, that it 'should be a' „:..g Fond formed of a surplus of revenue ; and a gr eat and proud boast for this country, that -..; a war as we had been engaged in, We were t,l say, we had a clear surplus income of :, ; ,tO,OOO :11)c - we our expenditure.—(Hear, hear.) ; a l so :yieed in the necessity of increasing that :plus to five millions. Even the Sinking Fund of would enable us to place ourselves in a :1:1;ion ca . nigh respect in Europe : how much more oi:e of rivo millions? and when that should tre lxconze eight millions, what Power in Europe, world, would dare to trample on our rights, ;(,) i:15:11I us ?—(Hear, hear.) With respect to the 1::, he was happy to say, it had, in every part, his it.,est approbation ; and, what was more, it had the a vrc:aation of the Public.—(Hear, hear.) There were, is red, a few individuals who would have preferred, certain reasons of their own, a Loan of thirty from circumstances which it was unneces a,y tor him to allude to now. He could rot, on tai occasion, avoid adverting to the conduct of the who had, he understood, refused to afford :he Public that accommodation, by making cer n advances on. this occasion, which, through the whole continuance of the war, thty had !ea in the habit of making on similar ones. • fle r.ls not sorry for this conduct on the part of the 1:•.1: for two reasons: first, because he was persua the public would, on this occasion, soon learn how they could do without the Bank, and next because Bank had thereby shewn the disposition which 'ey felt towards the First Lord of the TT easury, and Ri c ;lit Honourable Gentleman who had been so ,r; lent to them throughout the whole of the He understood that though a majority of the t , :.a of Directors had adopted this measure of little- .ued hostility towards his. Majesty's Ministers, who ,3 now dared to dispute their high authority, yet were some. Honourable Directors who had rag.) , opposed it—( Hear, hear.)—The Honourable ttlenun concluded by adverting to the taxes, ih he said would undergo discussion in the pm- of the Dills through the House. Mr. MANNING defended the conduct of the rL of Directors. He was certain the Honourable .r could not have obtained the information he . ^lto the House but by a breach of duty and a. on the part of the informer. As to the . he (Mr. Manning) might have taken in . ..he measure alluded to, he should • ; he was bound by the decision of the . .i4u did not shrink from taking his full share e onsibilily for the measure. The Honourable .tuber then proceeded to defend the conduct of the ek Directors, who, he said, could not, consistent ,:h their duty, under existing circujestances, have sonted to make an advance to the public of ten Is on the Loan, but he denied that the Bank sere actuated by any feelings of hostility towards et Government. Mr. PEARCE (of the Bank) also defended the con 'of the Court of Directors. The charge of the wrable Gentleman was, he said, unfounded, illi- 1, and uncalled for. Mr. MELLISH took the same side. He strongly tprobated the conduct of the person who could have re n the information alluded to by the honourable Member. If he (Mr. Mellish) knew that individual would himself, to-morrow, move that he should tly be turned out of Court. He could not, at same time, refrain from suggesting to the Hon. - user, that it was not quite justifiable to listen to :amnion which could not be given but by the in : being guiity of a gross breach of duty and of .4.lence, and afterwards coming down, and by a .aent made in that House, subject the individual ccsure. The Honourable Member then proceeded the Bank against the charge preferred it of having made immense profits, which he said were wholly unfounded. One con 1, however, the Court of Directors had, and 'was a conviction, that notwithstanding the charges against them by the Honourable Member, the Jle generally cor.sidered that the Bank had, : 0 -g:: ,, at the whole of its immense and extensive » actions, done its duty to the country—(hear.) Auld be ready to meet the Honourable Gentle ea any of the charges he had brought against lade, whenever the Honourable Gentleman con , it prope r t o b r i ng it fo r ward. ‘ I I'.GRENFELL in explanation, defended himself A the charge of having improperly mentioned ivision of opinion among the Court of Directors. information was given to him by a Bank Direc 'l the public street; when three or four other !eniii-me n were standing by, and no charge of se -1.*./.was given with i t ; be therefore had felt him- T •, : , tif.ed in mentioning it again. S'r JOHN NEWPORT comidered the Bank had subjected tilentselves.to the censure cast on, the t I ..he r r r ico rL 9 to , 7 • re ' C.I(1 1 ( (: 3 011. Ce Sink, sr: 01 etc :•':11 1 • % .11 I ir„ ty: ;iii es ( 01 be inient• :ance i .iereoP by mavil , c, \!r. ' Tr•e j 1. • rf 3 I '` : ac ..; also • u L ir e I,et i s Lin, b. altrobai r certi gyy• tor tas occ; fink. P wa ad% Lit the :!el in ris not Id the; • the; ce Ban tie.y foil sir. F ltirt ul non w rroagly fintleir h rre., of Mr. ; • .1 • . !ink D rid th, onsentc zillions %tre ac. &:e Gov Mr. ract of Honour isr.d, a Mr.! !tproba tren ti :iemb e wou' Cstanti 1 SAM .401171: '.4:ernc %.;:: :bile in•ac ce tan i 6 e 8.1, kiercd Mr. Ana 4 div tsae is 4 entit. t c y, P4 f , 6 . . 'them by his H`nburable I' rigid; they had certainly done no more than they were justified in doing, that I is, exercised a discretionary power as to the course they should adopt on this occasion. The Right Hon. I Gentleman, alluding to the new Taxes, suggested the propriety of imposing a duty on Distilleries in I Ireland, to counterbalance the duty on Malt. Mr. PROTHEROE approved the plan of the Chancellor of the Exchequer in the general outline, although he had not yet considered it in the minutia. I Mr. BENNETT strongly opposed the imposition of any new Taxes on the people, who were already weighed down, oppressed and crushed by taxation. To tax a people so situated, was folly sublimed to madness—(Hear, hear).—Still there were to be found ' 329 Members in that Ilouse who voted for them ; but indifferent as they now seemed to the interests of the people, he engaged, when they met their consti tuents, 'they would be making apologies for the part, they had taken—(Hear, hear).—lt was evident it was a new Parliament, for if such a measure was propo sed at the end of a Session, when Members were going to look their friends in the face, they would not be quite so hasty in giving their assent to it. Mr. MANSFIELD had not intended to offer any observations on this occasion, but from what had fallen from the Right lion. Gentleman just set down. He agreed with hint that the country was oppressed, and not able to pay taxes. lie, therefore, called on the House to do its duty, and to e na bl e linisters to' impose a fair, moderate, Property Tax--(heer, hear). A tax which should fall on persons best able to pay it—(hear, hear). A tax, in short, which would fall on that House—(hear, hear). He would not conceal. his sentiments ; and having uttered them, he should feel no more fear in meeting his Constituents to morrow than the Honourable Gentleman would do —(hear, hear). If, however, the House would not do. its duty and tax itself, as money must be raised, he saw no taxes less objectionable than those proposed. A NIEMBER said, he agreed in what had fallen front the last Speaker, relative to a Property Tax.— The next preferable plan was that now proposed by the Right Hon. bentleman. He approved of it ge nerally, though in detail there were some objections. He particularly objected to the tax on wool. Mr. J. P. GRANT recommended, that the same measures. should be taken with respect to the Sinking Fund of Ireland as had been adopted here. He much feared the Right Hon. Gentleman, in holding out a hope that no future Loan would be necessary, took too sanguine a view of the finances of the country. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER trusted he had not taken too sanguine a review of our • income ; it was true our Revenue fell off last quarter, as compared with the similar quarter last year, 1107,000. He stated this circumstance on a former 1 night, but he had now the pleasure to say, that the scale had turned the other way. In reply to a ques • tion of the Learned Gentleman, he had to state, that 1 a large payment of duties by the East India Company was made last week, but that had not been carried to account. Sir ROBERT WILSON said that therd-vias a cer tain limit, beyond which, if the people were pressed, they would be driven to desperation. Ministers might hug themselves in their fancied security whilst they had armies of foot and dragoons to execute their fiats, but there were not wanting preceden. • of great convulsions when people were goaded too tar. Taxa tion, like every other suffering, had its period of en durance, and if it was pushed beyond that, there was, no answering for tho consequences.—(Hear, hear.) Let them look to the examples of France and Prussia, where, roused by the extortions of their Governors, the people rose on the* and vindicated themselves. (Hear.) GOD forbid that such effects should follow here! but it was not wise to tempt them. He thought great savings might be made, as well at home as in the 1, Colonies, particularly the Cape of Good Hope and the Isle of Ceylon, the latter of which cost the coun try £1,500,000 in getting possession of it, and every year costs one or £200 , 000 to keep t . It was only this day that accounts arrived that the Legislature of Lower Canada had refused to grant extraordinary Taxes for the use of the Province, and they did it wisely. He thought the circumstances of this coun try called as loudly on that house to resist all in crease of Taxation, and with hat feeling plectged himself, if no one else was found to do it, to divide the Committee on each Tax. Mr. CALCRAFT was also against the Taxes, and would oppose them in their progress on every fair ground. He considered that the present was a most unfit time for imposing them. He thought the terms of the Loan were unfavourable to the country. Ile denied the charge, that Opposition had goaded Ministers to place the country in the situation in which it was by exposure. The Public knew all the circumstances as well before as they had done since* The Hon. Member still recommended economy, and reduction in the Army and Ordnance Estimates. Mr. Alderman WOOD could not agree to tax the people further than they were at present. He parti cularly objected to the Malt Tax. He was more especially surprised at the supineness of country Gen tlemen on that head. He understood, however, that it arose from a compact between them and the Chan cellor of the Exchequer, by which it was settled they should have a tax on Wool. He should feel it his duty to oppose all the taxes as they were proposed. Mr. RICARDO would not consent to a Property Tax, 'as had been proposed, but he would cheerfully submit to great temporary sacrifices, to remove, if possible, the millstone now about the neck of the country. He could not sit down, without expressing his thanks to the Chancellor of the Exchequer, for the manner in which he had conducted the affairs of the country for these few days past—(A laugh.)—A few days since the Funds were at 65 ; yet he had this l day contracted for a Loan at 70 ; but this was prin cipally occasioned by the Right Hon. Gentleman having adopted the advic'e of his Hon. Friend (Mr. I Grenfell). He (Mr. Ricardo) had been represented as saying, that Government had got all they had a right to from the Bank. This was a misrepresenta tion ; he thqpght the Right Hon. Gentleman should get all he could from the Bank at all times. Mr. GRENFELL said it was a proof that the Fund-holder did not think the application of the Sinking Fund a breach of public faith, for when on Friday it was known on the Stock &Change, the Funds rose from 60 to 69. Mr. RICARDO put a question to the Chancellor of the Exchequer, if the Sinking Fund was to be ap plied-to the 16,000,000 Eor next year? The CPTANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUE . R, in his reply, said it was intended to raise £12,000,001 in the way he had done this year,and then there would be wanted only I:4,000,000 from the Sinking Fund. Some more conversation took place between Mr. GRENFRLI. and the CHANCELLOR of the Excitz4wat, when the first Resolution of raising £12,030,000 by Annuities, Etc. was put and carried. Mr. GRENFELL asked, if an/ arrangement had been made with the Bank as to the £BOO fee they re ceived on every million for transacting the business ? The CHAIq'CELLOR of the EXCHEQUER re plied there had not. The question being put upon the Lottery Tax, Mr. CRIPPS, amid loud cheering from the Oppo sition side of the House, stood up to oppose it. There being a cry of Question ! the House divided, when the numbers appeared—Ayes 117—Noes' 9 Majority in fa v o ur o f Mi n i s t ers 68. The new Duties were agreed to. TAX ON MALT AND TOBACCO, On the Resolution for imposing the proposed duty on Malt and Tobacco being read— Mr. GOOCH said, it gave him pain, after having supported the Finance Resokitions to, find himself called on to oppose one of the principal Resolutions founded on them. He could not, however, refrain from saying, that the Petitions of the Agriculturists had been disregarded ; and they were now about to be further taxed. It was indeed said that the Corn Bill was a protection to the Farmer. On the con trary he should say it was, under the present system, a dead letter ; as the foreign .dealer was underselling the English grower, so much as to ruin him. The rtlght Hon. Gentleman had said, the Malt Tax would not injure 'the agricultural, or any other body. He differed so materially from his Right Hod. Friend, as to think it oppressive, and would therefore oppose it in every stage. Mr. BUXTON rose to vindicate the brewers from the imputations cast upon them by Me Chancellor of the Exchequer. He owned that he felt exceeding great indignation on this subject, but that he would not exceed the bounds of that respect which was due to the House and the Right Honourable Gentleman, if he gave the most direct contradiction which the English language could afford, to the statement which had been made relative to the brewers, by the Chancellor of the Exchequer on Monday night. Mr. BROGDEN (the Chairman) rose to order. It was a rule that it was irregyAar for any Member to allude to language which had been used by any other Member on a former debate. It was of course for the' Committee to decide whether they would act on this-rule. Mr. MARTIN (of Galway) thought it would be very inconvenient for the House to act upon this rule —(Cries of Question, question ! ) Mr. BUXTON said, that if any Honourable Mem ber on any former occasion made a statement irr.- puting the high price of porter to the rapacity of the brewers, that statement was unfounded. The brewers were a calumniated and devoted race of men.— (Laughler.) The truth was, that on several occasions, when the price of malt had risen 20s. per quarter, they had raised the beer only 10s. This was not done, he must admit, from any feeling of compas sion towards the public, but was the effect of compe tition. As to the general taxes which were now pro posed, he entertained opinions, in one respect, dif ferent from the Honourable Members opposite ; in Other respects, different from Honourable Members near him ; and, in other respects, different from al most every man in the country.—(Laughter.) How iwer ludicrous this might appear, he thought it his duty to state it plainly ' • and he was not afraid to avow, that he thought this one of the most proper periods for raising new taxes. It was indispenslibly . necessary for the security of the country, that an adequate revenue should be raised. But he decidedly objected to the Malt Tax, as falling almost exclu sively upon the lower orders. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER said, that none of the taxes which he had proposed were intended to fall upon the poor for the purpose of securing the property of the rich. The great object of these tars was ultimate relief and immediate security to the whole nation—(Loud cheering.)—As to what had been said with so much warmth by the HonOurable Gentleman who spoke last, he must ob serve, that he had cast no • such aspersions upon .brewers as was supposed. If indeed it could be sup posed ti ;it he was in any degree concerned in the private calumnies against that class, then he could understand the warmth of the Honourable Gentle- Juan. But he was not aware that he had made any statement which called for any warmth beyond dif ference of opinion. All the statements which he had mdde'were from the best authority. He had said that the country had not experienced the relief which was expected from the removal of the War Malt Tax ; and as an instance of this he • Observed, that the price of porter had not been reduced. At the same time it was rather strange that he had been twice instru mental in bringing out the secret, that the price of porter was to be reduced. Mr. WODEHOUSE must oppose the tax, as tend ing to affect the Landed interest. Mr. CALVERT thought .that the taxes proposed by the Chancellor of the Exchequer were the most objectionable that could be proposed. That on malt was particularly objectionable, as affecting the lower orders exclusively ; for he was sorry to say that the liquors manufactured from malt were not so much consumed by the higher classes as he could wish.— (Laughter.)—The tax on tea, tobacco, and the other articles, were objectionably for the same reason, be cause hey would fall chiefly upon the lower orders. Into the general subject, however, he would not enter at present, as his object in rising was to repel a charge afade on a former night by the Right Honourable Gentleman (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) against the brewers; for which he had not excused himself to night with the candour either of an official person, of of a MeMber of the Houk. Mr. HUSKISSON said he was not at all surprised at the indignation with which the Honourable Gen tleman who spoke last, and another Honourable Gen tleman, had expressed themselves on the subject of the imputations against the Brewers; but it was re markable, that all en which his Right Honourable Friend had founded his opinion of the expediency of the Tax on Malt remained uncontradicted by those Gentlemen—namely, that the imposition of this Tax would not raise the •price of Porter'—(Hear. hear!) With regard to else price of Rec.*, he was five to al •-• • -.- 1.. S.: - lair, th at If the pronoced - TAr„wese not imposed, these Gentlemen. must AO hetrone'df their ZoniPenietit competition meetings, for the purpose of ieducitif(tlie price —( hear, hear, Lear!) Mr. G. LAMB thought all the proposed Taxes were oppressiv'e. • Fiom the langiage of the Chan* cellor of the Exchequer, to a question he had put, it w,as the opinion of many that a tas on Msltiwas eitih in contemplation. The direct effect of a tax on Milt must he to raise the price of beer to the con sumers, and 0..4 linver classes would be deprived of that necessary of life. Sin should the price not would the quality continue the same ?—( Hear, hear). The interest of the Crown was not to he put in com petition t , r;th the welfare of the people. Mr. CALVF.ItT, in allusion to the sentiments of many tientlemen, begge.l leave to say, that while they condemned the porter for its alleged bad qua lity, it was in every body's mouth !—(Loud laughter.) Mr. BROUGHAM said, that, from the statement of the Honourable Gentleman, it was impossible to see whence the taxes could be raised ; and in the present. state of the country, no Minister would state that he intended to raise a tax of two millions on the growers of barley. It would .appear impossible that the whole would fall on the rap - acions Brewer, or the no less rapacious distiller. The authority of Mr. Barclay had been appealed to ; but, should the tax fall on the Brewer, it would take from Mr. Barclay the sum of £45,000 from the profits of his concern ! The fact was, that the tax must ultimately fall on the consumer, and that would soon appear in a dimi nished consumption. On the present occasion the Chancellor of the' Exchequer would be futmd as much a theorist as on the Bullion Quesrion, The, fall in the price of beer had been owing to the repeal of the Income Tax, and the following rise had b caused by the bad harvest. The price of beer wo e u e ll only continue at the present' rate white such• an in flux of Foreign Bailey poured into the market.— Should no new Tax be imposed, the price of Beer would fall. The neglect of the agncaltoral in terest appeared clearly in the proposed Taxes.— He had no objection to raising the price of spirits bi taxation, so as to place them beyond the reach of the lower orders ; and at the same time to lower the tax on the Constitutional beverage of beer. The other articles of taxation were as injudicious as the tax on malt ; and the money raised would operpte much more powerfully in the hands of• the people ,than at the disposal of the Minister. He should vote most sincerely against the Resolutions. Sir JOHN NEWPORT thought the taxes on many of the articles were very unequally imposed,' and would fall'most heavily on the lower orders of the, community—(Hear, hear.) Mr. COKE (of Norfolk) declared, that till he saw sincere retrenchment on the part of Ministers, he would not vote a single shilling!—(Hear, hear, hear, from the Opposition.) It would prove highly inju rious to the country. He had seen a Memorial from a respectable body of Landholders of Norfolk, corn.: plaimng bitterly of the hardships which they endured, and which hardships would be greatly aggravated by the pains and penalties of this new tax on Malt.— It was lamentable that the Ministers should be so de ficient of means as tp resort to the little crooked po licy of depriving the lower classes of their wholesome beverage. He had no objection to an additional duty on spirits, but' he wished that Ministers withdrew that on malt ; and, CO i f ollg as he saw the country go verned as it was by those in power, he would vote against any additional taxes on a people already too much oppressed.—(Hear, hear, frotothe Opposition.) The Committee then divided upon the Malt Reookition, and the numbers were—Ayei,l9B—Noes, 97—Majority, 1014-.-The Resolution was accordingly carried. Strangers were excluded from 'the gallery for nearly two hones, and during their exclusion much conversation took place in the Committee. L'pon a motion for an Adjournment, made by. Mr. Boairry, another division took place, an 4 tlre trurberiverg—Ayes 40-0 Noes, 185—Majority, 145. ' 1 A third division also occurred upon a similar motion of Ad journment. The numbers were--Ayes,s7Noes; 191—Ma. jority, 1:.4. When strangers re-entered the gallery, Mr. J. P. GRAM' was speaking from the Ministerial side of the House. Mr. Boounnsm, Mr. Lisurrox, and some other leading Members of the Oppo sition were seated on the Treasury Bench, while Mr. ClllOlOlO. Lord CASTLILIMAGH, and the CUANCLUAL of. the Rxcitzktrast were ranged on the Opposition side of the Jlssuae. Mr. J. I'. GRANT commented in strong language upon the impolicy of imposing a new Tax ow. Tea, which :would fall ea I heavily upon that class of individuals who were Scarcely able to bear the burdens with which they were already oppressed— ( Loud cries e" times/it-0a! Question!") The House might be impatient; but se felt it to be his duty, however late it might be, to oppose with all his power these impositions. He conclu ded with moving an Amendment, that instead of 100 per cent, 96 per cent. he inserteil in the Resoldtion. Mr. CANNING could not understand the object of the Gen tlemen on the other side in prolonging this discussion. Mr. HUME recommended that the Amendment be with drawn, in the present state of the House. Mr. BROUGHAM slid not agree in the propriety of with drawing the Amendment altogether, but he thought it would be better to postpone taking the sense of the House upon it un til the Report was brought up. He wished Honourable Gen tlemen would reflect before .they agreed to such a Resolution. The Chancellor of the Exchequer did not seem to know the real state of the tea market ; there had been a reduction in the sale price of tea of sixpence in the pound ; and yet this was the very moment chosen to impose a new Tax. After a few observations from the CIiANCZLLOIL of the Ex- cnnours, • s Mr. J. P. GRANT said, he should not press a division on the amendment at present. The amendment was then negatived, and the original resolution agreed to. The remaining Resolutions, imposing additional duties on To bacco, Peppet , Coffee, Cocoa, and Spirits, were then put succes sively; and r. J. P. Gm ANT moved an amendment to each of them (except that relating to Pepper), the abject of which was to fix the duties at the present rates. 'file aimndments were all negatived without divisions, and the original Resolutions were agreed to. Mr. BROGDIEN reported progress; and the House having resumed, the Report was ordered to be received this day. The othdr Order's of the Day were then disposed of, and the House adjourned at Half -past Two. HIGHWAY Romaasst.—Sunday evening a poor wont: . n of the name of Jane Grey, was attacked near Hounslow Heath, by four desperate ruPans, who robbed her of two one-pound Bank of England notes, fifteen shillings in silver; stripped her of her cloak, botmet, and stays, took the shoes andwockings off her feet, beat her most unmercifully, and would in all pro bability have murdered her, but perceiving a coach advancing they ran off with their plunder, leaving her in a state of itudky. When the coach came up to where she lay, not being able to stand up from the beating she received, she called out murder ! but the Coachman and Guard supposing sbe was a manias, drove on without taking the smallest notice of her. In this situation she was found by some humane persons, who afforded her ever, assistance; she stated sher was on her way to Wooliviels, to s& a son of hers, who is a egidter in the Sl:d Regiment of not_ attended yesterday at Hatton-gatdvn Police Office, 'gave- a description of the villains, and of the Arad rubbed id, Irons which we are la slisLctaticas that At, soon brought to,,justi‘c. -..: .1 • 1 1 1 11 1 I 1 1 i t . 1 1 . '4l/ here the :447 l strewivw: