Star. — London, England, 1819-05-25 00:00:00

arecoiery of the advances made tee Government, then' he (Mr. Tierney) would be the first to vote for a total annihilation of the Bank, and for the establishment of another. But while the present connection existed between Government and the Bank, we could enter tain little hopes of a return to Cash Payments. The embarrassments of both arose from reciprocal causes. Render Government independent of the Bank, that is, let the debts incurred by Government be dis charged, and then the Bank would' have no excuse for delaying the Resumption of Cash Payments.— While Government and the Bank continue to de pend upon each other, the public security would be inconvenienced, if not endangered—(Hear, hear.) He (Mr. Tierney) disliked the plan; and he found many Gentlemen, of whose penetration and judg ment he h id a better opinion than his own, also ex press their disapprobation of it. But there was an additional authority which seemed to corroborate his opinion, namely, that of the Public ; for Consols, which ought to have been at this time up to 86, were down this day to 63. He drew a comparison be tween the poor man and the rich, by supposing that -the latter for his £lOO wanted gold, and the former for his £lO wanted also go!d. They both might tell the Bank Directors— ,, We do not like your paper— we do not even like your silver—give us gold, even if it be but for the purpose of burying in our gardens." But you could not make men do that which they had not the means of doing. In the height of. their alarms, the Directors had been refused an audience of the Chancellor of the Exchequer. They were driven from door to door by the Ministers, and had performed a kind of melancholy quaranekie 1— (Hear, hear, hear!) The alarm had been excited by the Ministers themselves—those. who had lived upon alarms for the last two years—(Hear, hear, hear 1) Alarm was to them their daily bread, and no man, he thought, could rely upon persons who were not in fluenced by fixed opinions—(Hear, hear! Apt the Opposition side.) Ile Never saw a set of men making such an appearance as Ministers did on this occasion. They had gone into the Committee without a plan of any kind, and; for any good they did, Gog and Magog might as well have been sitting on each side of the Chair—(Larigkter)--an.l there they might have re mained, had it not been for the ability of the Chair man, who had helped them out of their scrape.—( Con timed laaghter.)—By some good luck a plan came to them, either by the twopennyipost, or some other couverance: immediately they laid hold of it, shouted Te Deem, and thanked GOD for sending them a wheelie which was directly in the teeth of the whole system on which they had acted for the last twenty five years—Wear, Ater 1)--He should recommend the amendment of his Host. Friend, as most likely to conciliate the public mind, and to allay those alarms which had sprung out of the bad management of the Chancellor of the Exchequer—(Hear, hear.)—He should therefore propose, either that the Amendment be adopted, er that the House should adjourn the further consideration of this momenteus question.— (Loud, and continued cheering.) Mr. MANNING considered this subject as one of the fi rst magnitude , especially when the alarm al ready excited was considered. That alarm was prin cipally founded on an apprehension that the Bank war about to contract its issues. He could assure the House acid the Country, that there were no grounds for Übe Warm. The Dank, notwithstanding what had been said, were ready, and even anxious, to return to Cash Payments, as had been proved in 1817, .when,they issued £6,000,000 in Gold. The Bank, he was persuaded, if it retained the confidence of the Piiblic, could soon resume its Cash Payments. --Any want of confidence at this time to the Bank might he attended with the most serious cala mity. He wished it to be clearly uuderstooll, that the Bank Directors were anxious for die resumption of cash payments, and that they never intended to contract their discounts or accommodations to the public. The Honourable Member warned the House against withdrawing its confidence from the Bank, as such a meeure would create the most serious ap prehensions and fears. lie then referred to the Isar titular periods when the Bank had rendered the Country and the Government the greatest services by various acts of pecuniary accommodation. He in: sisted, that independently of the monies due from Government, the Bank had a sufficiency of assets to pay all the demands which could be brought against them. Ile afterwards gave a brief sketch of the va rious pecuniary distresses of the times, proving how useful and liberal the Bank had always acted. Even' foreigners acknowledged that their commercial mis fortunes would have been greater had it not been for the liberality of the Bink of England—(Hear,hear.)i He avowed himself hostile to some of the Resolutions, particularly to the 4th and sth ; and should vete against that part of the plan which proposed a scale of payments between February, 1819, and May, 1821. . The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER con-, gratulated the country that a Committee had been fixed on so proper Kir the dischat ge of the great duty entrusted to it, and so free from political prejudices. It was also fortunate that they had decided not to enter into the investigation of mere abstract prin ciples, but to be guided in their opinions by expe rience and well established facts. For his part, he wished to refer for his opinions to printed documents, in which they are preserved, rather than to Gentle.. men who would state them without much candour' or civility. Assuming that the object most desirable would be to secure a resumption of cash paynients, , it was now to be determined by what means that could be done most securely and expeditiously. The object of the Amendment was, he thought, to get rid of the original Resolutions, and of the whole plan of the Committee. The Right Houourable Member had said that the Bank was held up to obloquy, but be (the Chancellor of the Exchequer) had been too long conversant with these Gentlemen to doubt of their disposition to fulfil the orders of Parliament, If things were left to themselves, no matter how great might be the exertions which the Battle might make for the resumption of Cash Payments, the Public would be as little prepared for such a measure as they now are unprepared for a resumption of Cash Payments in July next, although .by the law as it existh the Bank is liable to pay itynotex in specie at 'illai . usis, It had been said that public opliuon wik . .`iwith the Bank ; he would admit that public clamour ••bee* excited ; he hoped, however, the result of • $ night's *bate would allay that unfounded alarm ' ha 4 preVailed; it was true a considerable de -5• e pression of the Funds had taken plate, but there was nothing contemplated by the Committee to warrant such an event. The Right Hon. Gentleman then re ferred to the evidence that had been taken before the Committee, and contended that out of 14 gentlemen that had been examined, ten were in favour of the regulations proposed by the Committee. NI% RICARDO rose, amidst loud invitations. He said he was one of those who conceived the Resolu tions calculated to effect their object. From the speech of his Honourable Friend and other evidence, he was induced to think that the Bank wanted to resume Cash-payment, but did not know how to put their wishes in operation. He had heard it declared that the issues of paper had no effect whatever upon the price of bullion. What supported this assertion, or were not proofs in direct contrariety to it ? Now it appeared that the Bank had failed to resume cash payments, year after year, although year after year called upon by that House to do so—(Hear, hear.) It was, therefore, high time th at the matter should I be taken out of their hands, and that the House should feel itself called upon to look to the effecting of that measure. He did not think this a question only be tween the Bank and the Ministers, but more between Ministers and the Bank and the country—(Hear.) He was, therefore, particularly disposed to concur with his Right Hon. Friend in any measure which might be devised to keep the Ministers also under controul. One principle was clear ; that those who had the command of the Circulating Medium of the country had the power of regulating the price of every commodity. This power clearly resided in the hands of the Directors, as controuling the Circu lating Medium, and it was a most formidable one. Why, then, putting the question shortly, for the ap plication of the measure recommended by the Com mittees, the result was, that by withdrawing a certain [ quantity of paper from the circulation, we restored the remainder of it to the value of bullion; which was to raise it '2 or 3 per cent. He Could not, how •ever, go along with the Right Hon. Gentleman in his statement ; for in order to raise the paper cur rency to the value of a metallic one, there must be a demand for gold over and above that actually in the market. As to the plan itself undoubtedly he ap proved of it : for would they leave to the 13,1111: Direc tors, a power of keering out all the meals, and making the currency of piper only? The Bank Di rectors could have no real interest in depreciating the currency ; it was their in:erest to raise it to double its value. They stood in the li ht of .creditors, not of ' debtors ; they were the last whom we should have ex pected to object to the plan. andhe thought nomeans so likely to succeed as those before the House. The Bank Directors, so long as they continued to make large advances to Government, must be liable to get into a situation of distress. They might extend their' advances so far as to quadruple the currency cf the country. Their error was, in supposing that the rate of interest would always point out a proper limit to their issues ; but the rate of interest had been proved both by Hume and Adam Smith to depend, not on the quantity of money, but on the profits of, stock ; even though they did not advance any thing to Government, it was in their power, by an ex cess of discounts, to make the circulation redundant. The Bank Directors were, in the management of their discounts, he had some reason to believe, governed by old habits. One of their rules was, he under stood, to Az a particular limit, beyond which they would not extend their accommodation to any indivi dual. The Honourable Gentleman, however, had said, that the Directors did not confine themselves to this limit, where the individual's credit was undoubt ed. He was certainly for leaving them to conduct all such transactions according to their own discre- Lion and pleasure, provided only that such a check was established as should guard against a redun dancy. The proposed mode of resuming Payments appeared to him the easiest that could be imagined. The Bank would be placed under no restraint at first, nor any sudden necessity of reducing its issues. An opportunity would he afforded of effecting the object in the most gradual manner; and even when Bullion Payments should be made at the Mint price, the in convenience would bp but inconsiderable. If the Bank managed discife:ly, they might open in 1320 with a very small issue of Gold: all they had to do was to diminish their Paper regularly. What indeed he was afraid of was, that they would reduce it too rapidly—(llear). If he were to give them, advice, he should counsel them not to buy any Bullion at present, but rather to sell it, and wait with pa tience, till its price should fall, as it then soon would, to the Mint price of £3 17s. 101 d. per ounce.— He lamented the loss of that part of the original plan which would compel the Bank to purchase gold as well as to pay it on demand. He thought it might serve to operate as a check against what might here after happen, that mas, against their starving the cir culation. Individuals might, indeed, by carrying gold to the Mint, furnish an occasional supply to the circulation. Mr. Mushett, who had given his evi dence with great precision and ability, stated his opinion, that with £300,000 always in the Mint for coinage, about 1:12,000,000 mightsbe added to the currency within the period of a year. lie supposed that this calculation implied, that the sum of three hundred thousand pounds should be constantly kept up by successive quantities, and besides, a year was a long time to wait for such a supply, if it weft ac tually wanted. The Bank Directors could not pos sibly have any desire to thwart the Government; and he did not think, therefore, that they would have objected to the achiption of this part of the plan. With regard to what had fallen from his Right Ho nourable Friend with regard to the gracinated scale of payments, he might refer him to the evidence of Mr. Thornton, as indicative that no serious objec tion was entertained against such a measure.— He confessed himself to be utterly astonished at the alarm which had gone forth, because, a reduction which was to raise the value of the paper to a par with gold (the difference being now only 3 per cent. and. the amount of the reduction, therefore, not ne cessarily exceeding £1,500,000) was to be brought about in the course-of four years—(hear, hear). - He could °sly attribute it to the indiscreet conduct of the Bank Directors, and to the remonstrance which they had addressbd to Government, and in which they ac , pally sotititiegi tit alai-As-00r,, hefty.). The Hon. Gentleman. (Mr.,gatuting) had Complaine4 of cOa dence being witb drawn from the Bank ; hut the House had not withdriwn it on account of their want of pro bity, but op account of their ignorance of political But what had been their conduct? They bad e ni c ran cnil s.or ( be d in ig g u p g r h ePare n d e t r o resume their th p ei le r payment s. But conti nued their advances to the Chancellor of the Exche quer, in spite of the a pproaching period when the restriction was to expire. Yet it would be said that they had done this for the public interest ; but the protec titionwasofthtahtenpfuhbisliemianjteesrtesyts Ministers —( Hear, was i notte(lin busi ness;irer isters hear). The Honourable Director had talked of the accommodation which they had furnished to Go vernment, and the sacrifices they had made at dif ferent times for the Country at large—(hear, hear). Now he gave them no credit whatever for those sa crifices. It was their duty to attend to the"business and promote the interests of the Bank Proprietors.-- He had been much astonished at the small amount of their savings, having previously conceived that it was at least £5,000,000. This was now explained, for they had thrown away a million here and a mil lion there, for the purposes, as it appeared, of pro tecting the public. With regard to reductions in 1796. which the Honourable Director had referred to as a sort of warning that the circulation might be hereafter cramped in the same way, he must observe, that in 1796 the case was extremely different. The price of gold was then below the Mint price, but a panic prevailed, and the bank was induced to lessen its issues. It had heen asked, why should not the poor man with only £lO get gold for it if he wished, as well as the rich rlSan ? To this he answered, that they did the same benefit to the poor man by restor ing the whole currency to its proper value, and by making one thousand pounds worth what it purport ed to be, instead of what it now really was, worth only £970. Besides, the poor man, if he were very desirous of gold, might carry his £lO note to a gold smith's, and procure with a very trifling difference, the full proportion of what the Bank itself paid.— To revert to the subject of the advances to Govern ment, he must ask why were they made? He could only ascribe it to the strong propensity of the Bank Directors to act as I\linisters—( laugh).—lf they L would give up this anxiety about the state, and at tend only to their own interests, things would go on much better--(//car, heal).—A most fearful and de structivei depreciationwe had hreacdo,actl.eod, and netim he tim e was happy taken p lace, but from that to reflect that we had so tar retraced our step's. We had nearly got home, and he hoped the Eight Ho ' nourable Gentleman would lend them hi; as,..itance to enable them to reach it safety. He Ivciild venture to state, that in a very few weeks all alarm would be forgotten, and at the end of the year we should all be surprised to reflect that any alarm had ever prevailed at a prospect of a variation of 3 per cent. in the value of the circulating medium. His own general opi nion was, that an unfavourable state of exchange mutt always proceed from a redundant currency. If corn were imported and paid for in bullion, it was a proof that bullion was the cheapest commodity.— Suppose all the Bank notes to be paid in gold, would not gold become in fi nitely cheaper ? If our paper had been of any intrinsic value, it would, having be come cheap from excess, have been exported also— (Hear.) He thought it right here to pay the tribute of his approbation to the late excellent regulations of the , Mint. He entirely approved of making gold the standard, and of keeping silver as a token cur rency. It appeared to him to be a solid improve ment in the system of our coinage. Nothing could be clearer than that Government had the power, by limiting the quantity, to regulate the value of the silver. The Hon. Gentleman, (Mr. J. P. Grant) in ! deed had observed, that the silver coin might be ' imitated abroad; supposing this to be the fact, the value of the silver coin might be lessened, but that of the gold would not therefore be raised. Silver was not alegal tender above.tos. and gold could be demanded. it was true that £lO5 might be offered in silver in stead of £lO3 in gold; but this could have no effect in altering the relation between gold and all other commodities. He should be happy to argue this question with: the Hon. Member (Mr. Grant), or the' , Old Merchant,"—(a laugh)—(n some occasion when it would be less irrelevant to the subject under consideration.—(The Hon. Member sat (tutu, mnicht loud and general cheering from, all sides of the House.) Mr. Alderman HEYGATE opposed the Report He was only surprised how we had contrived to go on with so incompetent a monied ciicuLstion for so many years—(Cries off Question.) • Lord CASTLEREAGH rose and proposed, as there was no pi obability of their being able to come to any satisfactory division on this important subject that evenil;g, that the debate should he adjourned until to-morrow, with an understanding that this sub ject should then take precedence of all others.—The motion was agreed to una rcce, and the Debate ad journed accordingly. The Mouse then resumed, and the other Orders of the Day being disposed of, the House adjourned at Two o'clock. BANK REPORT AND EVIDENCE.—The Minutes talon before the Secret Committee efthe House of Commons is now re-printed by Mr. CLEMENT, No. 192, Strand, in 380 Svo. pages, at the price of 7s. It consists of the Evidence of Six Bank Directors, including the Go vernor and Deputy-Governor of the Bank of Eng land, together with that of Eighteen of the First Commercial Characters in this Country. This Re port, illustrated by such a body of valuable evidence, is perhaps the most important Official Document to ' the Mercantile, Manufacturing, and • Agricultural Interests of the United Kingdom that ever was pub lished. Bow-axsarr.--Yesterday a man of the name of Dehary was ex amined at Bow -street, who had been found in the Duke of YOU'S house, near 64 bed-chamber, after his Royal Highness had re tired to rest. lle was discovered by the Page, as he also was going to bed, 'and had be entered only a minute later, be would have got uninterruptedly to the Duxes chamber. He had climbed over the garden wall from the Green Park by means of a large stone tied to a rope, which he threw over the wall. His plea was, that he had written in vain to the Duke, informing him of his distress; and having been denied admittance by the porter at the front door, he had recourse to the expedient de scribed, in order to have an interview with his Royal Highness. The Doi bad consented in the first instance to his liberatioe, (the man appearing delirious) upon , :ondition of his returning to his Lome, Whicli; however, not having done, Le was yesterday committed to Br idewell as a vagrant. STATE OF THE ODDS.-BETTING-ROOM, MAY 24. DERBY. 3 to 1 apt Pledge 7 to 1 apt Sir Topaz 4. to 2 apt Sultan 10 to 1 agat F.uphratts 13 to 2 apt Louisa 14 to 1 agst Quail 7 to 1 agat Dominic 20 to 1 sist any other. THE' EVENITs 6 LONDON. TUESDAY, MAY 25, hfl9. THE FUNOS. PRICE OF STOCKS THIS DAT AT ONE O.C. Bank Stock 212 214 3 per Cent. Reduced 664 654 3 per Cent. Consols 67if 6C Si per Cent. 744 74-4 Cent. S3l 5 per Cent. Na•y 101i1 9M Bank Long Annuities 16 15-16 17 India Stock 206 205 206 India Bonds 5 pre. 10 dis. Exchequer Bills (2d.) 2 7 6 dis. Consols for Acct. 67} 674 661. The di sciwinn in the House of Common , on the Bank Report, or rather on the proposed by the Committee, and :chic' night submitted to the House, v!as intei luminous. Tile first three Resolinir.ns v unanimously, on the motion of Mr. ,the fourth was read, that relatirg t p, Bullimi,in stamped ingots in gnat tiffs 60 ounces, at £.l. ls. per ounce, Mr. E his intention to propote several Amend Was followed by Mr. J. P. GRANT, tack on the Mint Regulations ; to why Pima replied in a very able speech. Mr. Ttutuzy defended the Bank, an swercd by the CHANCELLOR of the Excir MANwrNo, the Bank liirector, opposed tion, and was replied tc by Mr. Blasco°. of Mr. ,lIANNING'S speech deserves parti( tion at this moment :._,alluding to Cie pre , he said it was founded on•apprehension t' WAS about to contract its issues, arid Howe that there w..snci ground for sion. We give Mr. :ifarstNa's itatemf gi ee of credit. On the motion of Lord C. the Debate was Adjourr.e..l till this ever, The result of this diS:uss'cl haz! with great anxiety, to see what ea - ect it duce in the money market ; and 'long. there was a considerable bustle this morning te! what effect the question, in its present state, have on the Funds. Long before the hour of bi the Stock Exchange was crowded to excess, anti seemed to be a general expectation that would open at 66, but even belote the time of siness had fully arrived an eminent broker 100,000 at 67, which gave an instant impul_ opening market. The price instantly went to 67k, fell again to 67k, at v.hich pi]te they w.:re the Commissioners made their purchases, which did in the Reduced at 661 from the jcbbeni rally. It was evident from the quantity of sold out by Powers of Attorney that some degree alarm had reached the country holders. Bulk S' was sold at 211 but rose again to 212-214. Consols fluctuated liter in the day froth 67} to 66i, 66k. Exchequer Bills fell to 7s. discount s recovered Is. and the 5 per Cents. have fallen bell par, from a report very generally circulated, that , Minister means to fund in the 4 and 5 per Cent,. The Paris Papers of Saturday arrived this morn'. The Journal de Paris, with which the Report gina:cd of the KING'S Coronation having beer. for tEe ‘2sth of August next, persists, in spite of contradictions of the other Journals, in the ness of its statement. It affirms that all :he sary orders for the ceremony have been given. that a Commission, which had been appointed :c gulate every thing connected with the solemnity, already terminated its labours. The Chamber of Deputies have had another discussion on the Budget. A supplementary aria of credit to the amount of 2.500,000 francs, for it demnity to English subjects in vi::ue o: a Conve: tion of the Ist September, l SIT, was not pasted out a good deal If reluctance. list - Gs::' de minded that the Treaty alluded to shouldte prt* duced, and observed, that in Erg!anc: a Chazce:lc: of tl:e Exchequer would never have ventured t 3 move such a grant in a Ccrnm;r.e3 of Supply vitt• out having previously laid a copy of the Treaty be fore the House. M. LAINK explained, that the sum in question hri been granted as indemnity for the property of Ent lish subjects sequestered at Bourdeaux in 1814 ; . a:; . 4 M. Dassou.as, who happened to be on the M i r es terial Bench, produced a copy of the Treaty, was , being read, the question of the grant was, atter soze conversation, passed without a division. The Council General of the Bank of France hat issued an intimation that, after the Ist of June nes; the Bank will only grant Discounts at the rate c Four per Cent. on paper of SO days and upwards. Five per Cents. Friday-661r. 85c. llas THE DUCHESS OF KENT.—The following Bu was issued yesterday afternoon : " MONDAY, !NH'S 0.C7/Ve, r.:'. " Her Royal Highness the Duchess of Rehr, and her ilfact, continue in a favourable state." Prince LEOPOLD of SAIE-CODOURG „arrive,' rtl Friday last at Paris, on his way to England. Poimiowni, MAY 24.-Wiild E.N.R.--Arrived the Fe'.. (transport.) from Guernsey; Prudent, Qtativoti; aad from Waterford; Mao, from Swiderland.--Sailed the Richard, for llavre ; and FAlward, Htvis, for Waterford. DIED. The Bart of Stamford and Warrington, Lord Lieutenant or the County of Chester LONDON s fisted art pssislish --- ed by Links Kat, Pickett. Titritplc-kos. L tt.cct SCI 111% lAA ti IteKoluti ux :11 Were ; al :resting tvere ca Pd) l Thrls not I; :Lutt f:ani dme M. R e awl was as lIEQUEL fl y 1 the Rest!, o. Oiie • att- that the Ba assure.:: le-t ever; L . .Asztzta.t.J it v:cu:si ;h .A ruing to . : state, W(:: lur of busi. - :css, ani that Conseil e time of bu- 3roker boo • - impulse to the lit to 67i, bat w.:re wt."' es, which they jcbbens Ltity of Stoc ome degree Bank Ste: 12-214. at 61 to 67, discount s t fallen belt, lated, that per Cent , . this morn' :g le Report cri. ig beer. filt: ir, spite of tit in the correct. all :he neces. en giver., aid )poir.ted to re seerr.ritl . , another day's rlentary arid , francs, for is GI a ConveD pa.eci linuoszT I;ouldbe p a Chat:cc: l c: e ventured t: Supply_ with. Abe Treaty be s question hri party of Ent :inlBl4;aJ on the lii: it freaty, ras, atter soze t. Vranre have i I I : ~! . ~~~ t~