Star. — London, England, 1809-05-20 00:00:00

Tbbi day was pablished, in 3 Vols. royal 4to. price Four Guineas and A Kik; extra boards ; or the same Work in one Volume royal Svo. price One Cuiata and a Half, bound, THE COSTUME of the ANCIENTS. By 'CHO SA AS HOPE. This Work consists of Two Hundred En- Eravings to Outline, with nom Prefatory Matter. • Printed for Win. Millar, Allicniarle-stecer. This day was publi3hipd, in decoy Evo, price 13s. hoards, LEME NT S OF ART, a Po1:a - en PAINTING, in 1A Si: Canto::; wi - li Nees and a Preface, including Rtric•ures on the State of the Arts, Criticism, Patronage, and Public Ta6te. By NIARTIN ARCHILR R. A. Printed for William Millcr, Alhemarle-stroet. Of whom nity he had, by the same Author, RHYMES on ART; or, The. Remonstrance of a. Painter, in two Parts; wit% Notes. Third Edi:ion. Price 7s. hoards. itM! TbiJi day n and A H royal 3v T HE cravings to This d LEN six c on the Stai P C RUYIVI two Parts This day 124,14 c, " O H lel Mr. Mat Naldi, and " \Viten at ditto, co " 0 Yot " Alone, Mr. Braila I. Mazziu• A favou G. G. Dm - -. BERLE has occu • has brok, without .1 route ov it was cu the town much ob' is not vel NEW MUSIC.• This day was published, by Gotikl'r.g and Co. Music Sellers, No. 124, /4ew Bonci•s: Iver and 7, Westmorland street, Dublin, " (1H nzver say that I was false of Heart."—A lehrated Glee, sung by Mr. Brilliant, Mr. Vaughan, and Mr. Bellamy, with univerml applause, at Messrs. Naldi, and Braharn's . Concerts, composed by M. P. King-, price Ss. " Where shall the Lover rest ?"—A Glee for three Voices, sung at ditto, composed by J. Mazzinghi l price 3s. " 0 Young Lochinvar."—A Glre,.composed by ditto, price 3s. " Alone, retied beneath some Tree.—.A favourite Air, sung by Mr. Braliam, in Kills, arranged for the Harp and Pianoforte, by J. Mazzinglii, price 4s. A favourite Serenata, for Harp and Pianoforte, coursed by G. G. Ferrari, price 3s. 6d. • FOREIGN lATELLIGEIVCE. GOTTENBURGII MAIL. BERLIN, APRIL 29.—A most singular circumstance has occurred here. The well-known Colonel Schill fias broken up with his regiment, without order, and without.having given previous notice, and taken the route over Potzdam to the borders of the Elbe. As it was customary for the regiment to exercise without the town every evening, its departure did not excite much observation. Our - Governor, General Lestoq, •is not yet returned, and only this afternoon did we learn the route he had taken. .We are very anxious to know the Colonel's object. MAGDEBURG, APRIL '.'9.—Ore.ers have been re. ceived from Cassel to form a national guard of 1500 men for our town ; other places in proportion —every thing is to be upon the war footing. Numbers of armed people have shewn themselves at the small town of Acher : every one is busied with our fortifi cations ; the work is prosecuted even on 4undais. FROM THE HAMBUP qH PAPERS. • • I.—The Tyrolese and Austrians are in Bregentz and Lindan. VIENNA,. APAIL 30.—Another serious affair has occurred_ in Italy. Our troops . near Castle Frando•are directing their .rnarch to Vicenza. BonEr4l4, I.—The Archduke Chatlti has proceeded through Charm towards Badweis, in order . to direct Us . march from thence to Lir.tz, 'Or more easterly on Itlf6 Danube. G?neral Hiller, ,With'the sth and 6th corps of the army, will takz the same direction by another mild. FROM THE FRENCH PAPERS. SeIIAPPILiusEN, APRIL 23.—A1l is in -motion in the Swiss Cantons, to furnish the first contingents which the Landamman has required by his Circular, and to prepare the second to hold itself in readlOss to march. 'Each of these corps will be six thousand strong. The first preiceeds to the Grison country, under the orders of General Watteville, formerly Lan -1 damman of Switzerland, whose head-qUarters are already established at Zurich. TES measure ie.occa- , sioßed by the appearance of the Austrians in theTerol. ' BANKS 0? vie DANUBE, APRIL 29.—We have at length received, by indirect route, news from/ s liest of the 18th of this month, by which we learn that the Russian ships of waithad not then quitted the• Port of Triest. . Au English squadron had arrived in the Adriatic and Northern part, to cb.operate with the expeditions the Austrians propose to make alon.the coasts, particulartrthuSe of Istria and Dalmatia. 7--, Immediately aftet 'the Austrian Cabinet had resolved" to cemrpence hostilities, several Couriers were stilt .'of r to Malta,- and to .Admiral Collingtvood,, comman der in chief of the - British flbet in the Ikteditenunean, I.:Tlettfequetetilac . ..39 English fleet might li t: sent to cruize ' fnlite:NAdtiazic•V s - ..:1f, in order to prevent •any com , . . rnunication of the'Frtlich by sea. Before -the r enewa l :'of hostilities, .the, gu g lish Factors and Commissaries 'lit Malta; whts,hri'Veen informed of the new cOnnec tiops.whicii the &etirfof Vienna had formed with the : Cabinet of Lreadpfi, shipped a great quantity of Eng-1 lish Meichandize and colonial commodities - their general. depot at Malta; to send ;their] to Trit.— These'espeditions haate,eince continued wlthoutinter ruption.,-• 'There were on4te . 18th inst..strortAbanSU English merc,hant vessels,in the porti4flrriest, and a still greater number were expected. According to an Edict of thelmperor of. Austria, • all shipsinsti vessels, except those of Fraii . C . ' i and the States subject to French influence; are at''ty . to enter the pert of Triest, or any othe r :A us s ,an pOrt. t wer Advices halt Iken received from Vienna; ihi*Ch-state that there is a eery great fluctuation in tlit . B Ehane . and value of the State Pap er . A s they flatter ed them selves at that tinittillit the Archduke Charles would' easily advance tereie Rhine, and that the French had scarcely any forces to oppose him, the exchan;e had' . risen ; but it is probable that it will soon expenence a considerable fall. Intelligence had been received at Vienna of .. .the , commencement of hostilit ies on t h e Danube, between f.:e army of Prince Prosorowsky and the 'rusks. The Turks have been defeated. We expect the details of these affairs.-_ Moniteer, May 9. FRANKFORT, MAY 2.—The Grand Duke of Wurtz b,.itgli is gone with his family toWetzler. The French Minister, M. I-fez-singer, has folltiked his Highness. The Citadel of Wurtzburgh, called the Marsenberg, , has a numerous garrison,.js in the best state of defence, and well provided with ammunition and provisions. The report is without foundation, that the A ustr i ans bad made thei r a p pearance i n the vicinity of Wurtz-1 burgh. In a few days Franconia will no , longer be I exposed to any incursion on th e i r part . I.eiesic, APRIL 26.—1 t appears that their Majesties, 1 who are much pleased w i t h t hi s c i ty, will remain here i, as loti„? . as circumstances shall render it convenient. 1 The French Minister has been here since the 19th. - • ' The 'greatest traliqui.lity reigns at Dresden,. and bo ~sisess i s carr i e d ou :is ir nal. A national guard, , es tablished inmg,diately :..fter the departure of the . • army, effectually pre,terfes order. All our troops are ruesrekos•tg Franconia, Rad approaching the Danube. T~±~~• _.~, PARLIAMENTARY PROCEEDINGS. .•• - HOUSE OE LORDS, MAY 19. Lord Viscount. MOUNTJOY tgok the oaths and his seat. The Customs Warehouse Bill, and some private LiUs, were brought up from the Commons, by Messrs. Wharton, Simmer, Benyod, Symonds, Sit - James Graham, and other Members, and read a first time. TOULETT'S DIVORCE TILL. Mr. Serjeant I. r Ns was again heard on behalforthe Petitioner, and additionzi w:tnesses were examined. Further evidence bt•inr, deemed necessarT, Or. the Motion of the LORD CHANCELLOR, the consider ation of the Bill was postponed till 'Thursday. IRIS/I INSOLVENT DEBTORS' BILL. This Bill passed through a Committee, was reported, and, cn the Motion Of Earl GREY, ordered to be read a third time the first day after tae Recce. • CRUELTY TO ANIMALS. The committa,l of the Bill for preventing wanton and malicious Cruelty to Anitra!s was, on the Motion of Lord ERSKINE, postponed till Wednesday se'nnight, and the Lords ordered to be summoned.—Adjaurned till to-morrow (this day). . HOUSE OF COMMONS. The Lottery El!I was read a first, and ordered to be read a se cond time on Wednesday. 'The Assize Fees Bill was reported, and ordered to be read a th;rd timeon Wednesday•next. The Cbtrity Donation Bill was committed.—Report receiv4, • and ordered to be further considered on . Wedneiday next. ' The House recolved itself into a Committee on the Act refit ting to Gunpowder, &c. Ste. Mr. ROSE moved in the Committee, that leave he asked to bring in a Bill to enable the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland to pro- hibit the Exportation of Gunpowder, 'etc. &c. Agreed to.--Rr. ported to the House; and leave given to bring in the Bill. • Mr. WTIAR'IGN brought up the Report of the Irish Glebe House Committee. It erlutions read and agreed to, and a Bill ordered accordingly. Mr. VANSITTARt moved for an Account of all Sums sent frr.ni Great Britain to Portugal, or advanced in any way by this Country for the use of the Prince Regent, since January,* 1807, - up to the latest period—Ordered. The Loan Bill was read a second time, and ordered to be tom mitted to-morrow. Mr. FOSTER moved the further consideration of the Report of the Irish Beer Bill. Mr. HUTCHINSON and Mr. PARNELL stated their coti currence in the principles of the Bill; but thought that the notice allowed to the Brewers, of the alteration of the law, wai too short. Mr. FOSTER stated, that the Bill had the concurrence of the Brewers. The Bill was ordered to be read a third time on Wednesday. • Mr. Currie, from the Judge Advocate General's Office, pre seated an Account of the Sums appearing in the Army Extraor dinaries of 1908, to have been made to Mr. Ryder, with the ap plication of such sums. Ordered to lie on the table. The Martinique Trade Bill was Ipmmitted. Report received, and the Bill ordered to he read a third time cm Wednesday. Geperal GASCOIGNE presented a Petition from the Salt Tra.4 ders of Liverpool, praying that some regulation should be adoptedt respecting , Eay Salt in Ireland. After a few words from Mr. FOSTYI and Mr. HUTCHINSON, wbo were adverse to what they understood to be the object ache Petition, it was ordered to lie on the table. Lord MILTON moved the second reading of the Bill fur allow ing Judges to try Civil Causes in their own Counties. Read a second time, and ordered to be committed on Wednesday. Mr: DUNDAS gave notice for to-morrow of a Motion for a Committee on the Act for regulating the Post Cffice at Dublin. Mr. CREEVEY moved, That the Minutes of the Treasury respecting the House in Downing -street for the President of the Board of Controul, be priated.—Ordered.; WOOLLEN MANUFACTURE: The Woollen Manufacture Bill was committed. Mr. ROSE stated, that the object of this Bill was to repeal no less than thirty-two Acts of Parliament, and to alter and arnApd . several others. He could never have thought o f introdlicinEallt Na measure on his own authority; it was founded en the reports of Committees which had sit for several years. The use of ma thinery was still to be retained.—keport on Wednesday next. GAS LIGHTS. ' Mr. WILBERFORCE moved for the printing of the Minutes of the evidence on the Gas Lights. This he did because it was a subject of great importance to the manufactures of the country. Mr. H. BROWN seconded the Motion. Mt. SHAW LEFEVRE supported it. The SPEAKER observed, that it was not usual to print the Minutes of Evidence on private Bills, but where these were more connected with important public matter the House would depart from the general rule. The evidence was then ordered to be laid before the• House, with A view to be printed. IRISH TYTHICS . • Mr.PARNELL moved that the Petition of the Free holders of the King's County and County of Kerry, presented last &won, against Tythes, b e ' read . , These being read, Mr. Parnell said, that other Irislc, Counties had expressed their opinieus to the same el fect by their resolutions.. In cossequence:of these opinions he would submit. 'a motion on this subject. He said, that not only 014, general popidation, but even the majority of theirish Clergy, desired an alte ration in the system of tythes.. The Clergy Nese in fact. equally aggrieved, with-the COmmon people. The generality of Clergy in Ireland were not the op pressors, although some instances of oppression from • 'the Clergy. of the Established Church might be pro= duced. Generally speaking, the Clergy did not leyy nearly the *nth to which they were entitled. Oii an average they only raised from one-half to one-third of their dues.. These petitions were not from the body. .of the Irish Catholics. On the contrary, theythd de isted systematically from having any thing to do with meetings on this subject.- In the course of last Ses sion hehad given notice of a motion on these petitions. But wishing the subject should be taken up by his Majesty's Ministers, he had chosen t o l eave i t to them; but understanding that they intended to do nothing this Year,, he would now move for leave to bring in a *Bill to enable the Incuinbents to grant leases of 21 -years:to their parishioners... Front what the Right Hon. G e ontlemai (Mr. Pereval) had said to him on • a forme4,9Ecasic n 4 tad some reason to c a l cu l ate . Upon his sijaport. the agriculture of Ireland would denve esi&tial advantage- from this- measure. .To prove' this, •Ise, quoted Dr. Smith and• Di.• Bailey on the influence of tythes on a,, hurl. lie also Stated some . practical instances frorrthe work of Mr. Thom son-oa the agriculture of Herefordshire; and observed that the injury _to agriculture in Ireland was much greater than in England, owing 'to certain local cir , cumstsnces, such as the bringing of ugelesi land ii*o cultivation. The.present mode of Collecting tythoa, too, in Ireland, was very oppressive and liable to all evils.of an uncertain tax. This formed a scene of greateroppression in -Ireland than any that existed in I any other country. The divison of labour had not so far advanced in Ireland, but that the very lowest or , ders were occupiers of land, and the Clergymen could I not, therefore, collect the tythes himself, but was nil ! der the necessity of em ploy ing a proctor, against whose • oppression the people could, from their poverty, obtain no redress. Ey means of vexatious .proctsses and • , other modes of oppression, such as threats of holding up refractory persons as disloyal, the collector had a despotic power over these poor people. He then ad .verted the disturbances in Ireland, and inentioned ~ ,1 . 77, rsr , Frp ~: . ~;~, • . • where a Multitude of test deluded per:. having been persuaded to deliver up their arms, and swear allegiance to his I 4jtsity i had. t cleclared on their' oaths that the only reasnp , for their taking arms was their being goaded to madness by this system of collecting tythes or proctorships. Mr. r'arnell then . combated the argument thap thecomrnutation of tythes was nothing more than putting an additional sum in the pockets of the land-owners. The difference was that rent was a portion of the net produce after all ex pences paid. 'rythes, on the contrary,, were a consi derable portion of the gross proditeei and in many cases so much curtailed the estittated - Pfofits of ittia: provernent as to operate as a prohibition.. Mr. Par nell next observed that the sviteiti.was most mjnrioui to the interests of religion, that it - encouraged seces sion front the-Established church, and that in fact only I one-tenth of the popuhnion of Ireland belonged to the Established Choi...h.—He also thought k committation highly expedient on political grounds, rand. said that had it not been for the oppression of tythe-proctor ship the calamities of the last eleven years 'in Ireland would never have been heard of. He also reminded the House that expectations of an alteration in the present tythe-system had been held out to the people of Ireland at the Union. If he thought there was any chance of the House agreeing with him he would immediately propose an entire conuriutaxiOn of tythes for a corn rent ; but as he supposed the Frouse would not at present go that length,. he would only propose that Clergymen should be enabled to grant leases of years, which would be productive of great though limited advantages He accordingly concluded by moving for leave to hripg in a Bill to that effect. The CHANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER felt it incumbent on him to state his reasons for dissent ing from the motion. He wished that the Honourable Member had.more fully explained the nature and ob ject of his bill ; whether it was with a view to an amelioration, or a total abolition of the system of tithes; and if the latter, to what *purposes the reve nues of the clergy were to be diverted. The subject was' one of most important consideration, and which required that' it, should be maturely weighed before it was adopted. He was desirous to, know what was to be the substitute for tithes, , as well as the basis of the principle of commutaXion He was convinced that the abolitian:of tithes atra i lld not in the least degree improve the condition of'the tenant, and that he would pay that rent in an aggravated propoition to the land lord, that he now' paid' to the clergyman. He con tended there was no exaction in the system of tithes :is it existed in Ireland. The occupier of the lamd does not in fact pay one half of what he was obliged by law to do. • He was averse to any commission to ascertain the value of tithes ; the effects of which he was persuaded would be to raise. the amount thereof. In fact the remedy proposed by the Hon. Member was as bad as the evil he proposed to remedy. It would improve. the rent of the landlord, but would be of no adsointage to the tenant. The bill besides was unnecessary. It gave no power to the clergyman that he did not possess at present. As .the law Low stood, there was nothing to prevent an incumbent from letting his tithes during the whOle period of his in cumbency. He thought it best to negative the mo tion at the outset, than to countenance expectations that could not be realized. The conclusion that he drew from much application to the subject was, that nothing could be usefully done on it. Mr. TIGHE lamented the disappointment that Ireland would feel when . she should hear that this measure was abandoned, and that the Chancellor of the Exchequer declared he was obliged to give it up as being impracticable. With respect to the pledge mentioned by his Honourable Friend, he must •say a few words. He did think it binding, because the Government of that day had industriously circulated it into every part of the sister kingdom, thereby taking it upon themselves. It even contained terms stronger still than those stated by his Hon. Friend, as adverting to the claims of the Catholics of Ireland, and a provision for their clergy; and Mr. Pitt was made ; t.oay, that these were the grounds upon the fulfilment eof which he_ventured to propose an union 1 between- ; the tip countries. Would it be said he *enntpa beifinin his promise—or that he meant to dell* the peOpie of Ireland ? Did the present dis. ina * jiiiitedAdmstmtioir imagine they had more strength than he pOssessid to effect the latter ? or did they con- Sider the present a fit mppnent, when clouds overhung the political hotkon ? He declared he did not stand up for one plan iiftfre thiin . anothei, being instructed to support any plait, as being better than the present J system. It 'would be recollected, that in Ireland there were three religions recognized by the law of the land, and it was requisite that all their Ministers should be decently maintained. In this respect she differed materially from England, and therefore he ecUild.not agree to the necessity of extending the alte raiion-proposed to this country. In Ireland also the prior found themselves fOrced to pay whatever was. demaided 9f them in the shape of commutation of tithe, or expect to hear a thunder more dreaded by them than the French artillery ! , -the censuresiMitted by the Canons of the Church, in the shape of c itation s . , This was the more ha r d u pon them, as t h e d octr i nes: of the Church of England had not been preached to them in the mild language of the gospel, but enforced at the point of the British bayonets, p?trticularly in the time of Elizabeth. Upon . 1100 . 61 V, 'he warned Ministers, that if they refused-to redeem the. r ud g e made on the subject, they might expect to find the table of that 'House *covered with petitions from all pnrti if that kingdoo, praying a repearof that which would relieve them trot:fall further care on the sub ject of gat pledge. . Hon. D. BROWNE thought it was the most se ' rious duty of Government to attend to the evils arising out of the present systetn of tithes in Ireland. He was friendly to the motion of the Mon. Member, and to any proposition which had for its object the amelio ration of the state of the rich peasant. He feared it was too late in t h e S ess i o .to . enter with due delibe ration on so importantaret Jict ;,but if it was brought 1 111 forward early in the nei t , ‘ i t .' should have his sup port. . . . Mr. GRATTAN reprob tied the whole cf the pre. sent sygem of tithes— , they c seated the tithe-proctor, I and he was the greatest and Arst pernicious litigant upon earth--he cheats two wap,' for he takes morel than his. dye from the farmer,; and the Parson does not receive that which he is entid ed to. The Protes tant Church establishment should be popular in Ireknd, 1. - mcauNe it supported the Protestan r. - .ipterest in the ccun- f or . . .. 'm+,: but if public odium fell upen the Proctor, Prat naturally transferred itself to the Parson, and througS him it reached to the Government. The question it;eif was to be debated on two grounds, both as respectin g the measure itself proposed, and as leading to a system. of commutation. To the latter hee professed he 1,,,a been always friendly—lie was also friendly to t h e Church establishment, yet he could not but think that the nature of tithes eerved only to render the clergy disrespectetl. : He would not diminish their income, although he considered it abundantly ample—but he w( uld not have it remain uncertain. He al, lowed there was .difricuity in applying a remedy to the :evil, but he would not allow it was impossible.-- If Gentlemen svill not inquire, they cannot expect to be informed ; and the only "Altv he knew of to acquire infizmation, seas to go into a Committee, and therei n I to learn the state of the Irish Church. If the Ri g h t I Ho:iourable Gentleman had good grounds for th e change iu his sentirneine, he thought he was equally welt-founded in adhering to his. It was idle and ridi. culons to talk of inquiring into the real value of tithe s , for, if they did so, they should equally inquire i nto their application, and the purposes for which they were originally granted ; and, in that e vent , he ap. prehended the Clergy would be found t o b e no great gainers by this inquiry ; the true obje c t o f i nquiry wenild be, what was a tit and proper support f or t h e I Clergy ? and upon that inquiry he was su re t h ey would not be left less rich ; and he did not wish they should be more so. In respect to Ireland, it should be recol lected, that the Catholics pay to two churches the one from choice, the other from necessity ; an d that without receiving any spiritual compensation whatever. —Another hardship in tythes was, that they were not merely a tithe upon the produce of the land, but also, .• of necessity, upon the labour in the attainment of that produce. The uncertainty of that produce was likewise the foundation of disputes every year, unless they did that by.agreentent which should be done br Act of Parliament. He had himself, at two different periods, proposed what he considered a remedy for the•evil, and he thought either ofthem was prefera ble to the present system ; in like manner he consi dered the present Bill as proposed at lea.st feasible.— At the period of the existence of that description of disturbers called White Boys, he had proposed, and a clergyman had adopted a system of comtnutaziai, by which he had obtained an income considerably larger, and with mutual saeisfaction, than he cond have obtained by the regular mode of leveing his tithes. The system of leases he by sic means consi dered as impracticable ; and they' would certainFi hive the good effect of enabling the Ltriner to follow and enjoy his industry without the dread of any fresh demand being made upon that industry. He consi dered the principle a good one, and commutation eligible, as securing to the farmer the greatest blessing he was capable of receiving—a security against tie. certainty. Mr. MAT.! .ICE FITZGER,ALD supported the motion, and in doing xo, represented the hardships of a million of the people of Ireland, who were exposed to greater burdens in regard to tithes, than the people of England ; and in Ireland no -poor rates and ro paupers were, supported at the public expence, while those here were supported by poor rates and in work. houses. • Mr. MACNAUGHTEN argued against the nto tion. Hie should be glad to hear of any plan thatw.:s likely to effect a change that could add to the corn. forts of those paying tithes, but he had as yet heard of none that could meet with bis approbation. He recommended to Gentlemen not to bring forward any trwasure of this sort until they could prepare a proper substitute for that which they meant to remedy. Mr. CROAKER spoke against we motion'. Colonel H UTC HlNSQNsuppoitedit. He thought the tithe syszem in England was perfect in comparison to that of Ireland, and although t'ie present proposi• tion did not go to remedy the evil, yet it pledged the House, that early in next session they would turn their attention to it. Mr. FR ENC Amov ed the previous-question, as he saw no prospect the House beitT *We to discuss the measure during this session, andrat was only encou• raging a feeling which they cauldiaot gratify. Upon the previous question 'being put from Chair, • Mr. WILtERFORCE rose, and stated h anxiety that some remedy should•be adopted for the evils complained of, but he saw no prospect of dec. ting any thing effectual during the present Session. — The House were at present much in want of infor mation upon the subject of Irish policy, a circum stance which was much to be . rcgretted but as it could not proceed to propose a remedy, he should wish this question to be dis?osed of by the prerio.is question, rather than an actual negative. _ Mr. CANNING thought it artrio unted to the same thing, .whethi;r the House disposed blithis question by a direct nega.tive, or by the previous q'trdst;on being pat, as it was evident to him, that the time; propriety, or texpediencyof the measure, hijld out no prospectt ot its being possible to remedy the • evils complained 'adoring this Session. • It was not by sudden fits nor starts that any great evil could be got rid of ; —bitt there must necessarily be many donsiacrations of all its bearings, and much disc Asi3n upon every point, and every interest affected by a change, previous to its adoption. Although . the union of the two coon• tries had' identiSid the interests of them both, yet stsll there was a necessity far nice discrimination befere any. alteration of a particAir systeM should take place as to, or so as to assimilate it with that of the other, as much depended upon local circumstances. He should. vote for the previous question, although it was not usual to propose it upon the bringing in a bill, as he did not object to the motion upon principle. however, he thought, that it had been *proposed with a few to infringe upon the • established • church, he should certainty object to the measure upon its prin• ciples. I • Mr. PONS ONBY said there was 'no reason to ap prehend that the measure, for remedying the evils complained of could infringe upon the Protestant Church, as it was one. of the essential provisions of the Union that that shotild be maintained as the esta blished religiart of the land. He understood that the generality of the ecclesiastical bodies in Ireland were all in favour of a change in the system of collecting tithes, and it was only a few of the higher order %V objected to it. ! Mr. PARIZELL, in reply, said it was astonis4is3.