Star. — London, England, 1819-04-08 00:00:00

►M i , i • 't 1 1 , . •• A --% • - • • tLIA . IVIEN.T4Ity PROCEEDINGS. HOUSE OF LORDS, APRIL 7. . 1 . • • CoupOM/ Sliaß7 heard reormitt&dse Scots Cause. " ••• * 'end ermaspeind - Mark." After which their Lordship/; ea' the motion of the Loan Cunicsaaos, Armed the judgmelit the Scots Court. The Case of " Wks v. Walker." being Called on for judg- rent the Howe pronounced its dedsion, which was to reverse - th judgment of the Court below. The Earl of Bsanrossi and Lord Deets took the osthi and their seats. The Royal Assent was declared by Commission to the Coke and Gas Light Bill, and to three other Acts of a private or local description. • The lima Commissioners were, the Lose Cnexciamm, the Fort of SPIATTIMIUST, and Lord leoninosata. Earl FORTESCUE presented a Petition, from the Church wardens and Overseen of the Parish of Stoke Davetell, in the County of - Devon, against the Poor Settlement Bll.—This Peti tion, howevir, the Noble Eakl consented to withdraw, on its being intimated from the Woolsack, that the Bill petitioned against not being yet before their Lordships House, it could not regulirly be received. Thomas's Divorce Bill passed through a Committee of the whole House, and was reported withoth any amendment. The Innkeepers Rates; and the Freight Distribution Bills were read the third time and passed. The Irish Bank Further Restriction and the Chancery Clerks' Bills, as ilso a few private Bills, were brought up from the Com a ons by Mr. Lesnmeme and others, and lead the ant time. • The Earl of LIVERPOOL, on the occasion of the former Bill, observed, that it was inadvertently omitted yesterday to wove toe the suspension of therelevant Standing Orders, with a view to the immediate peeing of eke Bill their Lordships bad heard read. Tho Meant* priteedetlexactly on the bone ground as that with .respect to. OW Bank of England,'•whicti passed through all its stages yeiteerday ; and be, therefore, nlerhi, the circumstances, trusted their Lordships would feel no ohjee. tie+. to his motion for taking thin Orders into coosideratimi to morrow, with a view to their suspeeilon as fat as related to the Irish Bank Further Restriction . Bill. 'he Noble Lord having so moved, and that the Lords be surinnone¢ . for tomorrow, it was ordered accordingly. and the Hattie forthwith adjointod. HOUSE OF COMMONS. The !Apt' of the BLAME Rob, after the usual entsuiesies, was admitted, when he intimated, that the House et Lords - re: quested the attendance of the Ikon. the House of Commons, to witt.ess the Royal Assent, by Commissiois, to several Bilis. • The Sestets, accompanied by all the Members present, re potted thither. On his return, be stated, that by request of the Ifoue of Lords, he and the Members present had • witnessed the Royal Assent, by Commission, to the Coke and Gas Light Bill, and some private Bills. A Petition was presented from the London Dock Company, against tire Grand Junction Calial Bill. It was read, and or dered to lie on the table. Mr. M. A. TAYLOR gave notice, that on Tuesday, the 11th of May, he would submit to the House a motion for the Re moval of the usual Place of Meeting in cases of Bankruptcies. LONDON FIRE CLERGY BILL. _ • . A P;..•t/Lioc was presented from the Churchwarden and Inks idrirts of Se. Cornhill, against the London Fire Ciergy MIL • Arather.....Petition was presented on the same subject s from . the Inhabitants, &e. of the Parish of St. Augustine and St. Faith, against the said Bill. It was stated, that the Rector; b ::ales the er t ioynsent of ,sonic rick benefices, and . an 'ample stip.zr.d, had kt out his houses as warehouses, for on e of which L: received X 43 a year. A third Petition was presented (tern the 'Churchwarden and eettale Inhabitants of St. Stivlim's, Culeman-street, against the same Bill. A faurth.Petitior. teas presented from the Churchwarden and others of St.*George 'the Ilastyr, against the same Bill. A firth Petition was presented from the Churchwarden and other Inhabitants of St. Swithin, against the smile Bill. They were ell reel, and ordered to be reErred to the Coutalittee. WATER COMPANIES. ~; '' Mr. M. A. TAYLOR, previous to the subsequent motion, moved, that the House should order three Notices to be posted on the Church doors in the Pa rish of St. Mary-la-bonne, of the Bill about to be b: ought into Parliament for the better regulating the supply of Water for that Parish•; and that those no tices should be regularly served in the manner in structed during the months of April and May. This mode, the Hon. Member hoped, would fully answer the do sired communication to all the householders of the nature of the intended Bill. _ _ Mr. M. A.TAYLOR, without farther preliminary, moved, that leave be given to bring in a Bill for better supplying with Water the Pansh of Mary-la bonne, and certain parts of Middlesex, through the toedium of the West Middlesex and Grand Junction C final Companies, and to fix the maximum of their rates, so as to render their charges more moderate. Mr. J. SMITH wished to learn from the Honour able Member the objects of the Bill. Mr. M. A. TAYLOR, with much cheerfulness and promptitude, complied with the Honourable Gentle men's reqsest by a brief and general statement of the natures and object of the intended Bill. In the parish of Mary-la-bonne, the Water Companies had con.' ducted themselves with such uncontroulable caprice and cupidity, as to render a regular supply of water ecxt to an impossibility, unless the inhabitants con sented to pay the advanced and exorbitant charges made upon them. The Honourable Member was anxious, therefore, to remove this system of extortion and tyranny by some Parliamentary expedient ; and' the strong sensAtion expressed by the Water Compa nies since-his proposition for a new Company, under the•management and controul of the parish of Mary la- bonne, sufficiently evinced the propriety of his plan. But although the two Water Companies mentioned, had offered to supply the inhabitants on moderate terms, yet after the inconvenience and disappoint ment experienced, the inhabitants had concurred with him (Mr. Taylor) irtopinion, that their only safety was by the provision of a Bill. Other Companies, fear ful of the result of a Parliamentary inquiry, had al ready lowered their tone as well as. terms. A depu tation from the New River Company, the oldest, and, perhaps, he might also say, the most respecta ble, had waited upon him that morning. They ap-, proved of the measure, and thought that the persons aggrieved had no other remedy than by the protec tion of an Act of Parliament. He ought, in justice to that great and respectable firm, to notice, that not withstanding the frequent advanc -charges by the other Water Companies, the ,' River Company had never advanced a single . He had also to rotice, that the llirectoes a roprietors of the lf.:er were now wait ing withtenxiety the issue of the present Bill ; and they had it in contemplation to come forward next year with a new regulating sys tem, fot.a better and more permanent understanding between that Company and those whom they supplied. 'lle chief object of this Bill might be said to com similar principles to those now so laudably A plan of corn etition had been found It had net, in fdct, been a regular and cition which had been pursued, but one running the race of ruin against another. SMITH thanked the Honourable Gentle- information. The objectb of the Dill ' were highly laudable, and deserved the support of the House. Hit was so satitified with the principles of the Bill, that lie &oil& duty to vote for it througE all its stages. The motion was then agreed to. Mr. M. A. TAT- Loa brought in the Bill. It was read a first time, and 'ordered for .a second reading. XiIaIUNDIS ZLWXION COXMITTEt. Mr. ROBINSON, as Chairman of the Committee, appeared at the Bar, and reported, that he had that morning come diwit - to dis Charge his duty with the other Members of the Committee ; but that after waiting it - - constderable time, they learnt that Mr. . Beckford, one of their number, was absent from_sud den illness. They had proceeded to the examination of the Physician, who was now in attendance, and from that Gentleman were informed that the particu lar day for Mr. Beckford's return was doubtful. In concurrence with him, it was the opinion of the Com mittee, that they ought to apprise the House of the accident which had deprived them of the assistance of one of their Members, and obtain leave to proceed in their investigation. The Report, to the effect now described, was'brought up and read, after which The SPEAKER asked, W Dr. PowELt. was in at tendance? On being answered in the affiimative, the Doctor was ordered to the Bar. Tka SPEAKER-+Have you wended Mr. Beckford as a medical man ?—Dr. Powst.t.—Yes‘ he is now suffering ustli.r a cutistderable fever. The SPEAKER.—Ifow soon do you think that Mr. Beck lord. can attend ?—Dr. Porn:J.—Not for several day s ; but nven that short-time is uncertain. . . . The Doctor was then ordered to withdraw. Mr. ROBINSON then moved, that Mr. Beckford be excused his future attendance on the Committee. --Agreed to. REMOVAL OF THE HAT MARKET. Mr. GEORGE lAMB, as the result of the Report from the Committee appointed to examine into the isseriti - of the •Petition, some-days ago. piesented for the removal' of the present place of the market corn nonly called tbe. Ilay-market," moved for leave to bring in a Bill operably to the prayer of the Petition. • Mr. fLOLnk. SUMNER declared himmlf hostile to the propoied alteration. Ile had heard that it was in contempla4On to remove the market to the Re y-park, .or to ;me extreme •of Mary-la- . b e ' '' - - Pin - nne. Thellottourable Member thought that such a proposition blight not to receive the sanction of the . I House, as it would be very incbnvenient to the parties Concerned. Such an eligible situation as St. George's fields, or that of Pimlico, would be far more prefer able: But he totally disapproved of the Regency ark, or any Other place so remote as the extremity of ary-la-bonne.- - For these reasons he should oppose it through all its stages. *Mr. GEORGE LAMB persisted in maintaining, - that the object of the )3'ill, embraced very laudable improvements. The Haymarket, as it now stood, was -not only a public nuisance, but blocked up one of the greatest thoroughfares in London. Although its contiguity to the Opera House might be used as a fashionable argument, yet he did not object to the market as it now stood on that account. It was the interruption whichli t prod uc edby being placed so:near the top of the street commonly called the Haymarket. The ingres to and egress from Lonclon were thus disagreeably obstructed. The improvement intended would not only be highly beneficial to the inhabi tants, but greatly contribute to their health, and prove very ornamental to the city. lie should , there fore think it incumbent upon him, as a public duty, to urge the measure. Mr. BYNG thought, that the Bill might be delayed for five or six months at least, in order that the par ties interested might be fully apprised of the conse quences, especially so far as regarded the particular place of remoyal. From every view, the Honour able Gentleman declared that he would take the sense of the House on the question. Mr. MELLISH indicated similar sentiments. Mr. Alderman WOOD said, that the whole merits of die question depended upon this fact, whether a sufficient provision had been made for the parties that were supposed to be suffe ers by the removal proposed. If a provision were made according to principles of fair dealing, the truth of such a state ment would induce many Members to vote for the, Bill, and perhaps satisfy the two Honourable Mem bers for the County of Middlesex, who had just sat down. It had been reported to him in the lobby, that the market was intended to be removed to the Regency Park. To this alteration he ohjectod. And surely some place more contiguous, and more con venient might be easily suggested. The question was then put, when the House di vided, and the numbers were—Ayes 87—Noe► 33. Majority S 4. prehend sim announced. ineffectual. fair competit • Com r p i a jnyshrti?2, CAMBERWELL COMMON INCLOSURE BILL. Mr. HOME SUMNER, although Chairman of the Committee who had deliberated on the Bill for the Inclosure cf Camber ell Common, yet had dif fered from them widely. He had made his report exactly as directed by the Committee. But as he continued of opinion that the subject had experien ced great injustice, he should move that the Bill be re-committed. Mr. Alderman WOOD was fully persuaded that a Bill for the inclosure of such a place as Camberwell Common, so healthful to the citizens of London, ought not to be countenanced by the House. The 'worthy-Alderman had been a Member of the Com mittee, and affirmed, that the party themselves had not proved that the ground thus proposed to be in closed amounted to forty acres—not even 15 acres. Thus fat there was a difference ir. the account. The salubrity of the air of Camberwell Common was particularly gratifying to the people of. Southwark and London ; and it would be a great abridgment of their innocent recreations if they were dep r i ve d o f the beneficial effects of this Commor. Children and people of all descriptions resorted thither for the en joyment of the air. Sometimes there were 10,009 1 children assembled there from the various Charitable Institutions. But a strong argument against the in- 1 closure was, the unanimous opinions of the wh o l e inhabitants aro un d Camberwell Common, who, if the Bill be persisted in, would petition against it. The inhabitants of London, as well as South war k, were particularly intereste d the continuance of the Common, as now open for the benefit of the com munity at large. They had now the privilege of turning out their horses or donkies on the Common, and might amuse themselves variously in couples, daring the holiday giuttbols-44 tough.),TheCona. mime had heard both parties. The worthy Alder., Pan law no 10 1 3 d derivable from such a project. It uld not asisiver the avaricious views of those who acted as champions foe the indosbre, as the expense of it would.swallow op the whole profits. He hoped drat the „House would not consent to the Bill. It was an impolitic measure to encourage the inclosure of Commons around or in the vicinity of the Metro polis, as it deprived the people who had been busily engaged during the whole week, of their rustic re creations. The two proprietors, for whose benefit the inelosure was about to be made, were not so deeply interested in it as was imagined—the one was indiffe rent alma it, and the other was a minor, who was not consulted on the subject. Besides the petitioners now alluded to, he believed that the Hrids of all the Charitable Institusions in London would unite in a formidable petition or remonstrance agaiot the tenour of this Bill. Mr. MARRYATT entertained simile opinions to those avowed by the Honourable and worthy Alder man. The commons around London could not be termed waste ground, for they were constantly in the occupancy of the people. They had been em phatically called 0 , the lungs of Metropolis," of which Camberwell Common formed so essential a part. The Commons near London were sources of health and invigoration, and ought not to be aban doned to the cupidity of avaricious adventurers.— The pleastires derivable from short excursions en the Commons to tho s e who were confined nearly the whole seek, wc:e indescribable, except by those who improved and enjoyed their health by such de-, lightful recreations. A strong argument against the Inclosure Bill arose from the innocent pursuits of the field in preference to the contamination of public houser, He . should vote against the re-commitment of the Bill, in the hope that it would have the effect of getting rid of it altogether. Sir JAMES GRAHAM had heard that twelve Gentlemen had come down to vote against the Bill. These twelve Gentlemen, he could say, knew no thing about it ! They had not been informed of the nature or principles of the project, and therefore were unfit to vote on the subject. The truth of the contents of the Bill were proved before the Comrr it tee; and the professions of the preamble Lad also been fully certified by surveyors. Instead of the nu merous petitioners mentioned by the Honourable Members, only two had made their appearance. With regard to the number of chilorea who resorted to the Common now under consideration—such, per haps as those from the Deaf and Dumb School, and Other Institutions—the Committee knew nothing about it--they had received no such evidence. Mr. DENNISON avowed himself inimical to the Bill. If Camberwell Common was an object of in terest to the people of London and Southwark, the House ought not to pass a Bill for its inclnsure. The Honourable Baronet who had just sat down, ought to recollect that many people of London and South wark, who once a week, at least - , required some rural ,recreations, could not, in imitation of the Honour able Baronet, ride out in Hyde Park or the Regent's Park, finely caparisoned on a noble steed—(Laugh ter).—lnstead of the Honourable. Baronet going on a hunting party on Easter Monday, let him repair to Camberwell Common, where he would see thousands of children charmingly amused by the healthful re creations of the field—(Near, hear)—To preserve the health of the people of London and Southwark, and to check the spirit of avarice clearly demonstrated by the - formation of this unpopular Bill, he should vote against it. Mr. C. CALVERT said, that as the majority of the evidence had been against the Bill, and as it was a measure that could never, be approved of by the people, he should vote against it. Mr. Alderman HEYGATE observed, that as the Bill was against the innocent recreations and happi ness of the people, it should have his opposition. ' Mr. HOME SUMNER, in order to prove the utility of the Bill, entered into the particulars of the evidence. He complained, however of the Clerk who attended the Committee, as incapable of dis charging his duty with truth and facility. Mr. Alderman WOOD, commenting on the Ho nourable Member's complaint against the Clerk, said, that he was not to blame, as there had been no evi dence to take down. The Clerk could therefore have committed no error, as insinuated by the Ho nourable Member. The House then divided—Ayes, 56—Noes, 85— Majority, 27.—During the exclusion of strangers, a Motion was made, " That the Bill be read this day three months ;' which was carried, and the Bill is consequently lost. ADJOURNMENT AND ABMS. Lord CASTLEREAGH took that opportunity of recurring to his announcement on Monday, relative to his intended Motion on this day for the Adjourn ment of the House during the Recess. But as it had since been found necessary that the House should sit to-morrow, to receive back from th e L or d s t h e B an k of Irdland Restriction Bill, and afterwards to witness its auction by the Royal Assent, his Lordship, to meet the exigency of the moment, would also post- pone his intended Motion till to-morrow. The No ble Lord at the same time gave notice, that on Tues day, the 3d of May, he sh ou ld move or the Revival of the Committee on Charitable Donations. Sir E. KNATCHBULL hoped that the Noble Lord would favour him with naming the earliest day after the Recess intended for the recommence ment of dicussions on public affairs ? This informa tion would be highly satisfactory to many Members who might have objects of pursuit in the country, or might be engaged on private affairs. Lord CASTLEREAGH replied, that although he should propose that the House should meet on Wed nesday (we presume, Wednesday sennight) little or no business would be transacted the first week. The public business would therefore commence on the Monday following. The SPEAKER stated. the necessity of the House meeting on Wednesday, as a ballot stood for the fol \owing day, namely Thursday. THE ALIEN ACT. Mr. C. NUTCHINSON gave notice, that on the 7th of May he should move for the repeal of certain parts of the Alien Act. HUSBANDRY HORSES. S:r G MONCK moved, that there be laid before the House an Account of the Amount of the Pro duce of the Tax au.Labowing wad Husband r y Masi. for the year 1819.--tladond. Mr. BENNET PlN said A , l h t e c roTrn p l. nrrtanee t i eaancenaAdindrieitsismtboro hisofßftomYalalellciognho,vanesobuietil.,t;ecstsertett.l:,ee::in o Regent, to stop the sailing of a vessel ‘' • convey t n o mov e Bay. Is was not his intention, in the smallest gree, to pass any censure on any public respect to any thing in the arrangement of r}:, wl—he was quite aware he should be anstver t • , • • though in former times very great abuses • in the conveyance of prisoners to New South yet, by certain recent regulations which had place, many of those abuses had been renit:: _ a much better system than what had forrne-i, wailed was now esta gr b the li ea sh t e ili d. osldsivit ß do u u t athi h se is cs against the system of Transportation ;,sell, • I p v t parn:cliu m ct ise iv ry e of great wlthout effecting any of the objects for which is intended. He objected to the Transportation victs. , —first r from the effects produced on that; the passage--and, secondly, from the state in . • they were placed on their arrieal at New He should confine his observations solely re ' Convicts. His great objection to the sending , Convicts to Botany Bay was, that the p / ,,, s sending them had a necessary tendency to and debase them. Whatever means his Dial Government might adopt—whatever - higitt t;:t precautions appointed in the regt,:atislis uhich been made—unless they could prevent all ir:e• between the females aid the crew—that tern of prostitution which dc tsed still tenser si who were already bat too low is the scale of nt,:i lity, would rill be carried on—aad the minds morals of the convicts would becompleteiy corru on their reaching New South Wales. tic o'ap:. • also to the system of Tr nispo:tation on fi:is that as all punishment ought to have for objcct example or the refolanation of the ciiminul, su ' from transportation, at the present mooted, ing as an exarnp::..:r v...; well known that it eagerly courted by alines: oil the convicts. it. pottation might, ir—lced, operate as a punish:l:n: those who left some ties behind them, who wet! 1 , from their family—but all the f, iendless and r+eser. criminals did not look on transportation in the of a punishment, but as a benefit. It was a far to some but a cruel grievance to others. Titere cea: be no greater objection to a punishment than it, i t , quality. The next objection was its inefEcacy in of way example. It war impossible for any ' to refuse their assent to what was stated by an i. nent French writer—that the ordinary class of ma-. kind were only affected by what took place near tiler, and that what took place one thousand miles off?:: , s as much a matter cf indifference to them as what took place one thousand years ago. He wished to state the proportions in which the two sexes had been sent out to New South Wales. Front 17:: to 1818, there had been sent there 2,957 comer., while upwards of thirteen thousand males had bun sent in the same period. One great objection to tin system was the absence of all classific very same ship were sent out person! manner of crimes, and sentenced to of transportation. Frcm 1816 to had been sent out; of these, 121 iported for seven years: Now there sron whatever made for bringing these Notwithstanding the instructions sent Bathurst in 1812, it was certain, time, no provision whatever had sending home those whose period The women were compelled to stay. other way in which they could return by per - tonal prostitution—(Cries (?; Hr They might return home in King's sbi pretty and young, but not otherwise, mg their passage. A number of the t ported were transported for life. They capital convicts; but the sentence of executed, but commuted for transportation for ht-. Now those who were transported for life were sent out in the same ship, and asscciated with those wha were transported only for seven years, and for minor offences. The Statute of the 19th of the King was driwn up by Sir William Blackstone, assisted by Mr. Howard. It was contempt ted by the framers of this Act, that persons sentenced for seven years should • hardly be sent out at all. These were deemed fit persons to be kept in Correction Houses and Peni- tentiaries, on account of the great expense of trans portation, and the difficulty of returning home; and it accordingly happened that few persons, for a num ber of years after passing the Act, sentenced only for seven years, were actually sent out. But now, with respect to female convicts, all those transported for seven years went out. The consequence was, that persons, convicted of the most trivial of&nces, were in effect subject to the same punishment with tme convicted of capital offences. But one great ob;e:- tion to the sending out any more women to I.fa South Wales arose out of the state of that Cc:onr. It was impossible, indeed, for any person who looked into the question of that Colony—for it could no longer be considered as a Penal Settlement, hav:r.g now become a Colony—not to be aware that it by no means a place where the morals of the ccn eicts could be improved. He owned that the Cur:- mittee up stairs had had ample testimony that Gc eernment were making important changes in th:s rs vect. But till he saw what was the effect of thoe changes, he could not consent to send out a frese cargo of women to New South Wales. He rr..:A complain also of the manner in which women were brought from country gaols to one spot, for the pey pose of being put on board the vessels destined for New. South Wales. One unfortunate girl had been brought from Cambridge, so bound in chains that it was necessary to saw them asunder. Another had been brought in a state of torture all the way frcrl Carlisle. When once on board, no distinction sva s observed between the small and the great offender: the girl whose passion for finery had prompted her to commit a petty theft, was placed in the same bed with the shameless prostitute who robbed on system. He held in his hand a letter written by Mr. Marsden, Chaplain-General in New South Wales, and stating that promiscuous intercourse between the sean;.ed . and female convicts had prevailed on boar d a s•-•? which had carried out a great number o f womel. . u tr r previously' trained under the care of Mrs. Fry others to habits of morality and decorum. Th e facer commanding the vessel had enforced stn ; arrival at St. ijcitaa, but thec&34 erettancecf Dtt a lighness the vessel destit iz d tb convicts to $ o Go t the smallest public office r gement of thi s be mamma I.: do .t abuses prey, tb New Sou t h %,v ;% which had ttk 1 11 nen : had forrnetiy his objection r• ttio i‘sell, he COUntry, 3n 2 Is subjected to is for which it nsportation of c k . !need on than; , the state in .1:: sl It New IS solely zc he sending s : hat the ptccrss ndency to son„- cans his Majest‘ . ' tl s.cr -night ~..tons sthich vent all ir:t.reou r . —that ',;e2er......1 i still lower thr.._ the scale of moia. 1 ad the rninst a:— I mpleteiy corrupt; ales. He tin on tots gr , r , tia tve for ohjzct e ctiminal, sO fa: ent momevt, sem ' known that it ras convicts. TrAts. as a punishment :o em, who werf t.'na • nzlless and r 4 tlcill 7tation in the 1 It was a J . :ova! Ithers. There lament than it, it. its inefficacy in •_*3 for any Gentlemez s stated by an Frr. • inary class of ma-. ak place near thez, isand miles off'?::s to them as what o. He wished to he two sexes had 'ales. From ITty: ere 2,957 worm, ad males had burl :at objection to try! ssification. In th• ms convicted of all to different periods 1818, 202 women 1 were only ma- ere was no provi• these v. omen bad. sent cut by Ler' 1, that up to thi; d been made for )d was expired.— ty. There was na return home but r Hear, hear, kw.) s ships if they were ise, except by p'y- the persons trar.- They were called of the law was not aportation for Itfr. for life were sent 1 !