Star. — London, England, 1816-03-02 00:00:00

~~«R~: 7 . T -"; "'~~ J • HOUSE OF LORDS, MARCH 1. ,Mr. Ateeez frees the Treasury, presented at the Bar, an .4oeteunt of do idalksOblby France so this Country. agreeably to the Treaty of Farb; and also bather .dooteeneUts relative to the claims on the score et French Prisoners. The Mak antbefuger Deities, and the Biers Millions Beebe. leer BMW tall., weer rend the third dine and passed. Tba 011 , 11-Rooliesits INN *eat through a Committee, and Was reportodlnilbout any sinendotert. •_ • _ I , ilto)itet, PItoPEATT TAX. Lord IaNG presented A Petition from the inhabi tants of the Cprdwaintis' Ward against the continu ance, under any modification!, of the Income or Pro perty Tat, which ' conceived to be not only bar. _ _ . the repaymint of the money, the bad made himself liable to be sued in his own Courts. It turned out afterwards, however, that Austria was set able to fulfil her engagements $ she had been un• 'animate. After the blade of Austerlitz she had ..tamed many losses; she had lost Italy and the Tyrol, and s it might seem unseasonable at such a juncture to be rigorous in demanding the payment of her debts. Bat if the loss of her possessions was a reason for withholding *fair claim, the recovery of them, and with additions, was surely an equal sea son for urging that claim. The debt due to this they , deviate cud intolerable, but a palpable violation of • a solensn pledge which hadbeen given to the Public under the suction of Parliament. • Lord FORTESCUE presented a 'Petition from the Leindowners and others, of Tiverton, in the county of Devon, against the Property Tax. The complaints, his Lordship observed, wire urged with the utmost decorum, and with ',profound respect to the dignity of th at House and if the Legislature; but they urged, that while the tax called the Pro. perry Tax professed to elect 10 per cent. it operated, to effect, in double that ratio upon Landed Property; and they added, that not only Agriculture in all its, branches, but Commerce and Manufactures, and even the Revenue itself, were injured ultimately by' - • the measure. The Petitioners complained of tbe, great inequality with which the taxes bore upon them, and of the manner in which they were levied, particularly the Malt Tax and the Poors-tates, which were insufferably partial and grievous. The Petition having been read by the Clerk, was ordered to lie on the Table. MIMS IN Till CIVIL LIST. Before the Order of the Day should be entered into, the Marquis of LANSDOWNE was desirous to call the attention of their Lordships to a subject not only important in itself, but as immediately con nected with the dignity of chat House, inasmuch u the proceeding to which be should advert, was in defiance of a distinct order which their Lordships bad made for their own information. It had been ordered, as their Lordships could not fail to reed ' Ica, that no augmentation on the Civil List should lake place without due notice, and a prr.per applies. Con to Parliament; but he thought the shorter way Sbr his purpose would be, to des.- the Clerk to mid the first clause of the 55th of the li;tig. The clause being read, which required the notice of twenty days before any addition should be made to the Civil List, the Noble Marquis telt it Incumbent, on him to c4l country was riot lea than between thirteen add four teen millions sterling ; end while Austria, sed of Naples, was levying heavy exactions on tr i p:o s ple there, was she to be exempted frum the fair and le gitimate demands of England What, said the Noble Lord, had been the conduct of all the other Powers of Europe ? They had all distinctly stated and scrupulously required the payment of what they conceived or stated to be due to them e and they had 'been paid or remunerated in the general distribution of property, all but this country. Russia - had het indemnities ; Austria bad her indemnities, howsoever obtained or supplied, in Poland or elsewhere. Such a - tenaciousness of individual rights among the M. :asters of the several States, surely could nut have escaped the notice of the British Negotiators and yet it had so happened, that while all the other Powers of the fraternity had .been amply or super fluously reimbursed, this country alone was left to sit down with the loss of no less than twenty-eight millions sterling, a sum far exceeding all that France had been called upon to furnish, far beyond the 700 millions of francs which was deemed a proper com pensation to the rest of united Europe for all the miseries and devastations ascribed to the fury and ra pacity of France during twenty-five years of violence and plunder. Such a gratuitous surrender by Mi nisters of the just claims of this country, was a part of the new system on which it seemed to be their de sire and their pride to act. Such conduct might, by some persons, be termed liberality, but he should rather call it arrant blundering, if, indeed, it did not deserve a much harsher name. The Noble Lord concluded by moving—a That an account be laid before the House of the measures, if any, which Mi nisters had taken in order to obtain payment from Austria, and other Powers. of the money advanced to them from time to time, by this esontry in the way of Loan." The Earl of LIVERPOOL did net think it would the attention of the Howe to what be could not inn 'muskier a gross departure from their duty on the part of Ministers, and as grow a disregard to, the orders of their Lordships, in that excess which had taken place in the Civil List, as exhibited in the do cuments an the Table. The Earl of LIVERPOOL admitted that some be nec,.ssary to take up much of their 'Lordships' time on a question the main substance of which, and the main facts connected with it, must be fully in the recollection of the House. The Austrian loan took place in 1799. At that time there was no ap prehension in the mind of any man that the terms of it would not be strictly and fully mewed. He need irregularity bad occurred in the instance alluded to. By sow inadvervnce the circumstance eettainly had tot come r.gularly before Parliament ?n the pre. scribed time, but he should in at short time make such I statement of the transaction as be made no doubt *mud satisfy the House. The Marquis of LANSDOWNE was ready to admit that Pie Noble Lord could readily armpit him self of any intentional disregard to the orders of the }louse ; but when an order was expressly mode for the informazion of their Lorthhips, it certainly ap peared erraordidary that taie watt- have: ben disr. garLled by the Noble Eatl liirns;..h. lle should have expected from that Noble Lord a eift.:reat and More rrsfectful couese of proceeding. He should have eel ected that the Noble Earl would come down to the 1-14 , US.t with a Message from the Crown, ac counting tor a proceeding so extraordinary, at a time when calls upon the people were meditated by Mini eters grievous and vexatious beyond ex:itnple. He should have expected, that while returns of the most rigid nature were to be exacted from the people, the Ministers at least would have shewn some con siderate regard to the decent observance of State economy. 1 - Lori HOLLAND had heard the observations of I ': bis Noble Friend, as will as the reply of the Noble Earl opposite, with duo attention; but he could not. accept of the slender terms is inadvertency" anti "irregularity," as an atonement for actual disobe dience if a distinct and )sitive order of the House; not advert to the events which succeeded. In two Fears afterwards lvatilities commenced between rance and Austria. Was that, the Noble Lord in quired, a proper time for urging a claim by, this coon. try against Austria ? He would ask sny man, whe ther any blame could then be attached to a Noble Lord who was in Administration. for the different course of policy which he pursued ? In 18U2 again there occurred an opportunity for creating, by means ut Austria, a hopeful diversion against France, and was there at that time one word said by Noble Lords on the other side of the House to oppose such an en. deavour ? But after the efforts which Austria had sub.equently made, after the capture of Vienna, he would ask. whetht r it would have been wise, equi table, or politic, to embarrass Austria with a pecu niary claim ? So far was Parliament at that time from entertaining any such sentiment, that a Right Honourable Geutleman at present 'no more (Mr. Fox) recommended an additional aid of half a mil lion to that Power. A similar feeling prevailed at a subsequent period, when, in 1809, the Noble Marquis opposite (Lansdowne) was in office. In 1813 their Ladships all knew, that after the expulsion of Bona parte lcum Russia every man was doubtful and Anxious to discover what part Austria would take.— To be here, it matters were suited to such a purpose, he would take the course which a Noble Lord(Gren-, vile) had taken in 1798, and bergained for a doe and just division of expenses with our Ally :—but when the fate of Eus hung a thread, be and he trusted that the Noble Earl would name a d.Ly when he should be prepared to vindicate his con duct to the satisfaction of the House. The Earl of LIVERPOOL was very willing to satisfy either of the Noble Lords and the. House, but could mope ig upon . would not, nor would the Noble Lord to whom he had adverted, make any such cold and calculating proposition. But If things appeared as the Noble Lord seemed to represent them, why had he not brought forward his inqu i ry to the last Session ? It not then name a precise day for the purpose. Lord HOLLAND, as he considered the act k eel' to be illegal, could not but reprd'all delay in the explanation of it as aitgal also. With what propriety, or with what regirit to decorum or com mon decency could Ministers commit an act like, that brought forward by his Noble Friend, . while they were meditating and taking all means of car-' Tying into effect, at a moment of profound peace, the continuance or renewal of a tax, grinding, op• pressive, and odious, beyond all precedent, and which could never have been tolerated or submit ted to, but on the acknowledged . plea of necessity from the alarming and pressing exigencies of an nu precedented warfare. alarms RIMIVIIIISIaiTh. The Order of the Day being read for entering on the subject of Lord King's motion, that Noble Lord rose. He should net take up much of their Lord ships' time upon a subject, the main whereof was impossible for Ministers, while the liberties of Europe were depending on the most vigorous and prompt exertions of all the means within their power, to enter into any such stipulations as the Noble Lord seemed to suggest. In the whole progress of the war, there was no Power which had sheen more alacrity, zeal and efficiency than Austria had, and even when subdued, she had arisen again with ad. mirable and heroic promptitude. Much had been sat,' about privations and sufferings. It. was true this country had suffered much ; but what were our sufferings compared with those of Austria, her capi. tal twice taken, and her fairest provinces wrested from /Its'? In the division and allotment of what had been levied on France, Russia, tisough needy herself, had duly considered the superior and snore pressing claims of Austria; and all mankind must concur in the opinion, that it would have been improper and unfair to press on Austria. Indeed, there would hardly be found a man who at that time would have points _ were sufficiently in the recollection of them all ; he meant the sums which from time to time had been advanced by this country to her Allies, in the Wu) of loans, but which had never been paid. Those . sums, advanced br the zeal sod generosity of this country, under circumstances of great national dif- Seek/ and general distress, had reached to a very onions and enormous extent ; and large balances, if not the principal amount, remained yet undischarged. To the motion which he should make, he hoped Mi nisters would feel no obstinate objection. It was his wish to bring before the }louse , in one compact view, she whole of the subject of the debts and arrears due 9 by Austria and . Itussia to this country. As to A us. ma, he well remembered, as no doubt their Lord. l ships generally would, that when the measure was , first proposed, of a loan to that Power, great stress was l a id on We responsibility aztd mum, attactie4 been bold enough to urge such a proceeding. As to Russia, the agreement with that Power was before the house ; and he believed that some credit would be thought due to his Majesty's Government for that [ arrangement. He should particularly mention Hot. land, and the stipulation by which the security of chat country bad been provided for. After the French armies had evacuated Russia—had beta driven beyond the Vistula and the Oder, would It !sieve been wise or politic to stated on negotiation There were, indeed, some persons, many be might sty, some of them in the R us sian armie s , w h o wou ld 'have recommended negotiation s but the Sovereign of that country chose to advance with a prompt and magnanimous spirit at the head of the Confederates, until the deliverance of Europe was made decisive and complete. Such promptitude, and such a cougar watt requisite, not only for the welfare end • . . .• • t . . ---6-----.--6---• - --- 'lle .to it: sada, all Mee smelt 10 'give craft to the eil Europe at large, but even for France her-1 , .PARLIAMENTART PIIOCEB,DING.t. statement, it was thought by some quite impereasoo‘ se . Let Noble Lords look back collie state of to have it superinduced in the ereitinent o that, for Holland and of Antwerp, which would evince not i - Emperor only the - but the - which actu ..ty _ policy, _ , strict justice the Allies, Lord HOLLAND could not help remarking, that the Noble Earl had mistaken or passed by the meaning of his Noble Friend. He charged his Noble Friend with abstaining too long, and then only urg ing his objections when the danger was over. His I Noble Friend had not made his motion for the ar .raignment or crimination of Ministers, but barely for an account of what steps had been taken- by his Ma jesty's Government for the payment of all the debts which were due to the country. The Noble Earl, indeed, had 'awed into a long detail of what M►ni- eat J or stars had done and what they h.td not done. He had justified not only the present Administration but all preceding Adtninistrations, but yet had given no answer to his Noble Friend. He agreed with the Noble Earl, that it might have been wigraciotri and ungenerous to solicit payment at a moment when our Allies were embarrassed and distressed. But when the contest was•over, and the danger and the distresses no longer existing, it was time for thi. country to look for her rightful claims. Reference had been made-to the conduct of Ms. Pitt and other Ministers, but nothing WAS applicable to the present state of things as set forth by his Noble Friend. In the former instance our Ally was distressed, and it was necessary for the common cause to leave her un embarrassed by our demands. But because forbear ance in a state of embarrassment was just and pru dent, was the same forbearance to be used at a time of ease and prosperity ? There were two or three reasons which might prevent the urging a claim for debt—one was the inability of the debtor lo pay— another, the condition of the creditor, who might not want the money. Neither of those cases applied at present. Austria was in unusual prosperity, with accession as well as restoration of territory, and with her restorations and accessions rendered more vain able than they had been before. But Ministers were extremely anxious to restore every thing with increas• ed value to crowned and legitimate Sovereigns, and to leave all other States and all other conditions of people to dwell in their necessity. Venice and Genoa were abandoned to a foreign yoke, and this country was to be told she was not to expect the payment of the debts that were due to her, notwithstanding the grievous and alarming distresses of the country, which had been so well set forth in several Petitions on the table, and particularly that which had been presented 'by his Noble Friend (Lord Fortescue). The Noble Lord continued to express his strong disapprobation tutshine. at the conduct of Guvernment in relinqk ing the claims they had on foreign Powers for the payment of debts. Supposing some unforeseen contest should agaih occur. we might be compelled by hard neces sity to break our faith with British creditors. Was it to be understood that we should then give to fo reir creditors the advantages we denied to our own ign —that we were to preserve every kind of faith to wards foreigners, and were not to call on them to preserve any fai► . h towards us ? Why then should we not demand payment of the debt due by Austria to us ? We were also about to give up a debt of about seven millions due to us by France, while we stipulated that France should pay the sums . owing , to private individuals in this country. It was, in fact, monstrous to suppose thlt we should net insist on the payment of the large sums in qnv.ition. Earl BATHURST conceived that it would have been most impolitic in us to have insivted on Austria to pay us money at the time we were endeavouring to bring her into a confederacy that was so essential to the safety of Europe. If we bad done so, Au .tria would have been less anxious to coalesce with us. Ths Marquis of LANSDOWNE contended that we ought at this moment to insist on the payment of the vast sum which we lent to Austria eighteen years ago. That Government had, by our aid, recovered her lost provinces, and made great aggrandizement of territory ; and there were just grounds for demand ing the payment of the loan, at least we ought to in sist on the payment of the interest. II it was right to give up our claims on Austria, it would be equally so to give up our securities which were deposited in the chests of the Bank of Engl.ind. He fully agreed with his Noble Friend, that it was a most extraerdi nary circumstance on - our part to have relinquished our claikl on the French Gorr Jernment. on the prin ciple of their making *good to British subjects the money which they held in the French Funds. It was not only an injurious, but it was a most impolitic measure, because it would operate as a perpetual en louragement to British subjects to put their money in foreign funds, and thus deprive oiir own country of the advantages that must arse from persons keeping their capitals within this country. The motion was then pat and negatived without, a. dieision.—Adjourned to toltiuday. HOUSE OF COMMONS. Mr. AIitBUTHNOT presented an Account of itt Burns of Meaty due to this country, by France, is consequence of the That)! eanelndad at Paris In Decembe r ue last, together with the Inward sums already paid by the French Government. Also an Account of Money, Arms, Ammunirion, and Warlihe Boras, oil every description, famished by the British Government toll*n, from the year len to the present period. AW an Account at the Number of kerma, In Ihitlsb Pay, weft in diSerent Parts of Europe. The Papers were laid on the table, and ordered to be printed. Mr. laysno. from the Commissiociers of the Customs, pre. ,s anted an Account of the Sheep.' and Lambs' Wool tmported g a t e Or e m Blume from Foreign Countries, during the year endiug of January Juts—Lrd on the table. Mr. Josuson, from the office of the Chief Secretary for Ire. land, presented the Fourth R e eport of the Commission ers f ur AudiUng Iland. Publk Aceoutsts in . _ Also a return ei the Reg► mans ess the Iriab - Bstablishmea. ' • and as account of the nu m b er of troops maintained to lreland,ln the years 1701 ao(11.700. Laid on the table. Mr. lots, from the Office of the Inspector of Cora Returns, presented an Account of the Average Prices of Barley, Oats, and Rye, from January 1819 to musk—Laid od the table. Sir C. BURRELL obtained leave to bring in a Bill for ren dering more seam the Harbour of Shoreham, in the County of Kent. Mr. Sedate ONSLOW brought to a Bill fur the more effec tually securing the Liberty of the Subjece.—Read the Ant, and ordered to be reed the second time en Monday, the Bth of April, and to be printed. On the motion of Mr. HUSKISSON, the Crown Rents Bill was read a second time, and ordered to be committed on Friday senoight. Mr. GOULBURN presented Copies or Extracts of all such Laws as have been enacted in the Cokusies,reiatitre cache Import cation of Sinai—Laid on the table. The Hon. ()enflame elm presented an Account of all Offices, Civil or Military, the appointment to which is vested in the Crews / in the Wanda of Berbice s Tobago, St, Lucia ; the Isle of/ • • Now, !Vats, the Toning I.tand s, e te, verb the pertain:Hz to the 8.1111C.-I.aid on the 'ably, i,„4 4 01 printed. gitt ... Mr. WE3T.ERN presented cue Rremt rt_ isinted to inqu , rs into the offlce of e m„ ut I to, and Late wits ttortn writs IN. r ot ,; _ * r said office hatotitio nand Weletuiusier. 144. L. ARMY ESTIMATE;, The CHANCELLOR th e FX" , stated, that the Nook Sec•etiry 01 St 14 S titt -', Affairs, though senont te,..overed, cieutly convalescent Vb c. diiwa In • evening without incuriing consideratil, hoped, however, that he would be pm eri g't Monday next, to take a part in the iin,,t7 1' on the Army Evinrates, whi c h h e ihouid beg leave to postpone to that day. ' The notice was postponed accordi ng l y. K BAN ADVANCE SILL. The second reading of the B ir k was, on the motion of the CHANC 0 I EXCHEQUER, posyoned till Vle,l ntsja lt t:, WAYS AND MEANs poned The til C l Monday next..Amittee of ays an ' tiltan t W CALL Or TII The CHANCELLOR of t. e EX:Ht, observed, that, as notice had been ve t ., t h e House on MAlday, very little liir e. ," result from c tiling over the names co qt on the present °c.c.:Lion, as they woidd io r .. , pear in their places on Monday ne xt , i 4 moved, " That the ottli. fur callin , t o, of the Absentees be dii•chargeil."—i t „ Ndk ccr:ve..\ noN WI CD AIIEKIC:. On the motion of tl:e CHANcEI 4.O4 EXCHEQUER, ti:- Committee on thec,.. with America was put cif till Weillitliay On the motion of Mr. LONG, cea ttnn 'rected to be issued for the Du- :ugh of Itit,tl. 'Cornwall, in the room of Messrs. Franci at4 Buller, who have vacated their beats. LICENSUD VICTUALLERS. General LOrrus presented a Petition Licensed Victu *Hers and Innkeepers of a, of Great Yarmouth, against the adshuo s j licenses.—Laid on the table. A similar Petition was als , i presented fromk keepers cf the Hundred of Burford, in Li oo l 4 'Laid on the tab's. PROPERTY TAX - AGRICULTURAL MINNA Mr. GOOCH presented Perinea; tram tee . tants of the town of Buy St. Edmenes,ek dred of Stanford, and another village, praying that the Property Tax may Lot be requesting relief from the distress occ.l,:ceed depressed state of the agricultur a l intertit; mending retrenchment in every dcartr) .3 tt vernment ; and deprecating a wee. lisbment in time of peace.—Laid cn ti:. u!4. Admiral C. SMITH presented a Pet. the inhabitants of Cordwainers' Ward, 4g.ial renewal of the Property Tax,—L:lid on th e t . 4 Sir MARTIN FOLKES prus,:ntai a from the Land-owners in the netgLiloUlhOd bridge, complaining of the prese , ,til'AlessAr 4 the agricultural intmst, an.l House.—Laid on the table. Sir H. CAVENDISH presentei Peitirsra l the Property Tax, from tha town and bale Derby.—Laid on the table. Lord MILTON presented Prtitiottspio Property Tax, and also pointing ou: the state of agriculture, from 6evir.il diitta county of York.—L:tid on !he vale. Mr. BYNG presented a Petiti , .n lrorst. tants of the liberty ol Nortov-Faigate, ag. Property Tax. He also resent:A s nalar Pei front the parishes of Acton and St. Itinhor,in green.—Lard on the table. CITY OF OXFORD PETITION. Mr. ATKYNS WRIGHT, in presenting tionot certain Tradesmen, and others, in,Ate the City of Oxford, against the reneoll . cflid petty Tax, begged leave to c.iil the attetist House to what those Petit;niters assigned Aa of their present distress. That Cat:ae, they be, the universal depression of the agricslad terest—(Hear, hear.) This was a sbbject dl mount importance. He knew that many Do habitants of the city of Oxford could liotpari petty Tax, without utterly rUiu;ng the • cause their trade, as the petitioners had tidy • had been very much affected by the impris of the agricultural interest, from which they vioubly derived their support. He could hats , conceived that the di stress amongst the agrictil was so great if be had not witnessed it lintel a melancholy prospect, for those who ladled habit of viewing rural economy and Wool its branches, to see young and healthy peoik out of employment, and obliged to rece'reiJ those fuuds which were intended for tlefi infirm.—(Cries of hear, hear, hear.) le S don of affairs, the Property Tax, if reseed , not be productive—nad, therefore, it ;1 11 ' • that some other resource should be oPfle a ' had been suggested, that the Chanerllx et chequer might procure a losn from the ' change, but this he declined, because be would be thnnseans of raising the Stocks Wright) conceived, that the suggestion cl in 1876, which was adopted by Mr. Pitt, resorted to. He alluded to the propriell on the Sinking Fund, in aid of any loaallu! be deemed necessary—( Hear.) There tai ther mode by which the exigencirs of the tile , be met. That mode was, by Ministers the pledge of econoity which they had gio House at the commencement of the Sessielyi By adopting, iu every department of Go the strictest, the most, scrupulous ecelnowl'l In conclusion, the Henourable Gentians!' Parliament to relieve the agricultural iota it was too late. Mr. LOCKHART said it was unneceswe to add to that true arid touching inctine.ii which was to be found in this Petition. P o tained the most earnest anxiety that PA rhawco . concur in every measure necesury for * l 7 the agriculturalists. He agreed with tbe_i able Gentleman in the observation he h adwr , it was imperative on the Legislature to ;;.-4 body, while it was. yet susceptible of 11 101 _,, relief were delayed much longer, none ow„ forded that would be found edectual—LlNgrt'i This ought to be the sore deeply illf r. " • • , tra , ir d 3esi rut ir t 0 n‘ ihli( his the inn wot sell sat the es sh the a ll) 1101 fJCI the en! LW