Star. — London, England, 1816-03-15 00:00:00

~r by entering into mialtte : 111trticulors, or it= l thereby the unanimity of that voce which he paced. He would only state, mod not in words as of course, but as the result of sure and correct informa tion, that with respect, to the illustrious . person no whom it was the intention of his Royal Highness the Prince Regenito *bestow hit dauhter in marriage, there was but one sentiment on the whole continent of Europe. He spoke not with respect to the Family to which he was allied by blood and government. but in reference to the opinion of all those who knew him, of his.equals, of those above him, and those bey low him, all of whom concurred in the same levant able opinion of his conduct, principles, and character. The present Was not the time.for considering what the provision should be; but every attention would Floubtless be paid- to what was due to the rank of the exalted persons, and to .the credit of the country. , without useless profusion or extravagance. There was another observation which he would make. Whatever provision Parliament should order, it ought to be granted in such a manner as to afford * full and free enjoyment of it. He was led to make that remark, because he had known that in some other cases, when a suflicient provision had been voted, great inconvenience had arisen from the inat tention of Parliament to that circumstance. He could state, from the illustrious parties themselves, u Was their anxious desire :to confine their exp-nsei within the provision which Parliament might think proper to make. He therefore relied with confidence that Parliament, without overlooking economy, would make such a 'liberal provision in the preavut case 11 the nature of the subject demanded. His Lordship concluded with moving-- 64 That an bumble Address be presented to Lis Royal High: ness the Prince Regent, returning the Thanks of the House fee: his widow communication, and to express their entire satisfac tion with the marriage of her Royal Highness the Princess Char loefi Abgalta to a Protestant Prince of so illustrious a House-- an event which must be satisfactory to all classes of his Majesty's subjects, and conducive to.titt best interests of the country—and to assure his Royal Highness, that he might rely wash confidence am tbe ecosatrrence of the House of Lords in such measures as Might be necessary to conclude this marriage, and to demon strate the afi'ectienste seal and d u tilul regard of the Holm to wards his Royal Hishoess and the Rnyal Family, as well as its disposition to pay every proper attention to what was due to the honour, and dignity of the Crown." The question having been put upon the Address by the LORD CHANCELLOR, it was .greed to without a dissenting voice. • Marquis WELLESLEY.—Agreed to, new. die.— Adjourned. HOUSE Or COMMONS: Mr. J. L.Coma brought up the Report of the Dublin, Re touch, and Corregh Road Bill, and ob;siced leave to bring in a Bill in pursuer:Cc thereof. Mr. Joon SON, ftotn *he London Dock Company, presented an Account of the Receipts and Di hur s__,,sements of the said Com pany, from SOth Noveutbero 814, to 30th November, 1813; also s keport relative to the Irogresi of the Works. An Account of the Income and Charges of the Consolidated Fend, up to .sth February, 1816, was given in and ortlered to be printed. PROPERTY - TAX. A Petition against the Property Tit, and another against the Insolvent Debtois' Act were presented from New Mahon. Colonel FOLEY 'presented a 'Petition from the Owners and Occupiers of Land in the County of Hereford agaLn.t the Property Tar. General THORNTON said, the only reason which could be given for the imposition of such a Tax was the necessity for it. It had been of great service to the country in the time of war, but in a time of peace, if it could possibly be done without, it ought not to be renewed. It had been said that it did not fall on the lower orders, but in his opinion it fell more on them than on any other persons, because it subjected them to the very worst of els, the want of employ. ment. It had been well sa id by Mr. Burke, alit the rich were Trustees for the benefit of the poor, that the hoards of the rich were the Banking Houses of the lower classes. One of the strongest objections against the Tax, was, that it held out to the trading and in part of the community, a temptation to fraud. He had suggested a Tax, which be thou;tlit might produce net less than 11700,000, a sum which would go a considerable way towards supplying the wants of Government, this was a Tax on the property of Absentees, who by leaving their country at a crisis like the present, occasioned, in the diminution of con sumption, a great loss to agriculture. It was, in his opinion, a fair and proper Tax. His vote on the sub ject of the Property Tax should be guided by an im partial consideration of the arguments to be brought forward in justification of such a Tax, durspg such a calamity as the present. The modification would, in his opinion, make the Tax worse. It would cer tainly be a great calamity if such a Tax were to be continued. • Mr Alderman SMI'T'H expressed his disapproba. tion of the renewal of the Tax, and declared his de termination to vote against it. Mr. CALVERT said, the Honourable General (Thornton) had expressed himself in a marwer be yond his comprehension, and he-now rose for the pur pose of giving hini.an opportunity of explaining his meaning. He had expressed himself in strong terms against the Tax, and yet he lett the House in doubt as to the manner in which he would vote. He wished - therefore to give the gallant General an opportunity to set the House and the country right, as to how he would give his vote. • General THORNTON said, unless he •saw that the honour and prosperity of the country absolutely demanded the renewal of the Property Tax, he cer tmnly should not vote for it. But he had not yet fuily mute up his mind on the subject. He certainly was most anxious that Ministers should give way to the wishes of the people, but his vote would defend very much on the arguments which should be brought forward in the discussions shortly to come on. it he found that the reliewal was not justified by neces. airy, he should vote against the Tax ; if he found it necessary tor the public credit, and the honour of the e,,untiy, he would very unwillingly give his vote in favour of it—and if he had any doubt on the sub ject he would withdraw himself from the House without. voting. . • Mr. BRAND said, he held in his hand a Petition from the N ;biemed, Gentlemen, and other Inhabi tant, pf the County of Hertford, adovteil at a m=eting irgui.oly convened and most respectably attended:— The .Petitionert observed,: that in the financial dial. ..ulties of the country, during a war of unexampled - they hid subStikted _ _razes,' in the hopeethaewith.4 Itof the nisr, they would be at once niWieti i -TY- Ohr them. The petitioners did not pray for therelief !of any War Talcs in partimilar; but against all ge. tierally ; and of that isspectablii meeting already mentioned by hint, there was not one person who did not concur in the sentiments of the petition. They stated their convictios, that oothing but an-exact and rigid system of economy, could extricate the country from its present distress; and that they more particle.' larly expected. from the promises in the Speech from Lihe Throne, that some economical measure" - would have been adopted. They couldnot, therefore, but 'share in Abe disappointment felt at present by many of his Majesty's most loyal and respectable subjects, on finding that no sinecures had been abolished, no .economical measures had. been adopted, and that the, emoluments of public officers had not been reduced. As all other articles had falleb in price, it was proper -that the emoluments of office should be reduced also. What would they feel when they learned not only that there had been no. reductiose but that an in crease of the salaries in almost all the departments had taken place ? Had the ancient salaries been re tained, the value would have been increased iu pro portion to the reduction in price of all other articles. The Petition was mcst respectfully worded, but the Petitioners did not the less keenly feel the disappoint ment of all their just hopes and expectations. They prayed for a reduction of our establishments, to what was sulEc•ent for the protection and security of the nation, Ind stated their conviction. that there could be no salva_rien for the country. but in introducing the most rigid economy into every branch of our ex penditure. They prayed also for a reduction of sala ries, which :tad oily been rai oat to their present heioht in coesequence of the increase in. price of all the necessaries et lite ; ana that measure* should be r adopted for previntarg in future any excess taking place in the Civil I. se Mr. BA itCLAY presenoet . `etition, signed by a large body of Inhabitants of Parish of St. John, Southware, against the Property Tax, and s large Military Establishment. Mr. METHUEN presented a Petition from the Manufacturers of Bradford, in the county of Wilts, against the Insolven: Debtors' Act. Sir GEORGE h;LERK. plesented a Petition from the Owners .n:l Occupiers of land in the parish of Ratho, in the c.ainty of `Edinburgh, praying that the Property 'l'ax should nU4, be c.sitinued, and ex pressing a hope, that if the exigencies of the country should require its renewal, the House would adopt such modifications as would put agriculturists on a level whir the rest of the community. Mr. FINLAY presented a Petition from the bo rough of Rutherglen .igairist the Property Tex. Mr. HO WO RTH presented a Petition from the borough of Eveshaniakenst the Property Tax. It Was, in his opinion. a Tax which the most urgent ne. cessity could alone justify. The people, in submit ting to such a burden, confidently expected that it wou:d cease with the war; and the proposed renewal in a time of peace was a measure which filled them with a just and well-founded alarm. He certainly could not see any necessity for the impo.ition of a tax like this during a period of unprecedented dis tress, and in opposition to the wishes of the people. The discussions which hid already taken place, in his opinion, had been productive of great benefit ; and he was determined. therefore, if Ins health per. mitted him, nut to give a silent vote on a question of such imentacce to the country. This system of taxation, whilst it draitiad the pockets of the people, added incalculably to the irtituence of the Crown ; the' ' inquisitonal powers cantided to the Commissioners had a direct tendency to tee introduction of arbitrary power ; and the principle of the tax was wholly in compatible with, and utterly repugnant to, the prin ciples of a free Constitution. Mr. CALVERT. seeing an Honourable Gentle. man, the Membcr for Surrey, in his place, wished to set himself right with respect to what had been stated by that Honourable Gentleman on presenting the Petitioh from the County of Surrey. He had not been present on the occasion alluded tee,—he had made the most diligent inquiries, and he found that the House dia not then contain above SO persons.— The Honourable Member was reported in the news -1 papers to have stated, that the petition was carried by a large majority of the meeting at Epsom. He himself had been at the meetin g ,. and he could say, that though one or two Gentlemen spoke'iu favour of the Property Tax and the proposed Establishment, yet when the question was first put, only one Gentle man held up his hand against the Petition, but be afterwards did not hold it up, and the question was carded unanimously. Mr. HOLME SUMNER appealed to every person acquainted with the business of the House, if any imputation could with propriety attach to him, of having purposely presented the Petitibn when it war empty. As, to any misrepretentations in news -1 papers of what he said in that House, he would not deign to make any answer on such a subject but he appealed to any of the Honourable Members oppo site, who were in the House on the occasion alluded to, whether the manner iu which he mentioned the petition, was worthy or unworthy of the respectable meeting at which it was adopted. Mr. CALYER 1' merely wished to give the Ho nourable Member an opportunity of explaining the proceedings of the meeting in a different way. • Mr. BENNET bore testimony to the full state ment di the proceedings of the Meeting made by the Houourable Mentber for Surrey. , Mr. W. SMITH presented a Petition from the Churchwardens, &c. of Mitcham, against the Pro perty Tax. Mr. CROKER presented a Return to an order of the House, requiring certain papers relative to the lonian Islands. INSOLVENT DEBTORS' ACT. Mr. LOCKHART, in bringing forward the mo tiotr of which he had given notice, for the suspension ut proceedings under the Insolvent Debtors' Act, unquestionably telt that he was discharging a most unpleasant duty. The glneral call of the country, and a sense of duty, caged him, however, to bring before the House a law which had produced the great est mischief in the country. That law had not been at first proposedas a measure in v.ltich its author had the fullest confidence, but as a law of experiment, fromwhich better eff ects were expected than those whichhad actually resulted from it. It was nut ne- MagnitU - . ;lignite whether •thr debt was eriFinally allowed ; it was for his 'eutprise, That it had continued up wards of 600 yekis, iod that k halt been ecknow. ledrd by innumerable Acts of Parliament. In every civil community; the judgments of Courts ',tight to be enforced by tome consequences adequate to ensure obtelienceto them. Br* as the la* at present stead, the judgments of (inert: were deprived of their jest authority. 'Any person, after being in custody for three months, might apply to an Insolvent Debtors' Court for relief Arum imprisonment, on the simple condition of giving up all his property. The person imprisoned - had an option whether he would apply for that relief or stay in prison and wa4te his ,affects there. More persons were centanted to pris.as at their own choice, then. by compulsion. That wasl the reason why our jails were now fuller than ever.— It was impossible to conceive that creditors in the present state of the law, should be more rigorous than formerly. He,woeld not dwell on the inefficacy of the law, in so far as regarded conveyances of pro perty. The system was altogether such, as must is 4ve the effect of putting, into the mind of any person, whether well principled or not, when he began to hail, a desire not of retrieving himself by increased exer tions, or of stopphig short whilst any part of his, property was left, but to put off the evil day as long as he could, till ail his property was completely wasted. No discretion was allowed as to who were or whrr were not considered worthy of relief. It a person fraudulently wasted his effects in risoe, that person was to be subjected to a longer imprisonment; but this fraudulent wasting was a matter which could not be very easily defined.- There were also certain cases in which prisoners could not be discharged, till after five years imprisonm'uit, such as breach of nst, embezzlement, obtaining coedit on false pretences. Any other fraudulent deed subjected the person com mitting it to five years confinement ; but it had been decided, that if the 'fraud did not approach to a fe lony, a discharge could not be refused. Nine-tenths of the persons who made use of fraudulent means escaped. There was a class of judgments arising ex eklisto and not es emeeracies. A man might be reduced to poverty by the unwarrantable proceedings of ano ther, and yet be unable to obtain any redress from him. XVith the exception of criminal conversation and malicious prosecutions. all those classes of wrongs which ranked under the title he had just mentioned, might be said to be exoner.,ted. A man might conic on another's property tif:y times over; and though the dodge might certify that the trespass:4 were wil ful, the ecrsin offenzli , q; was eati:led to his release at the end of three months, whatever mie,ht be the de gree of injury sose!ieed by the suffering person. A man might retain the property of another—lre might defend himself arainst an ejectment—he might keep another out of his property two or three )ears, and yet obtain a yellase at the end of three months. In point of fact, there was no law existing to compel the performance of .covenant,,or affording redress for wrongs. The wholesome and unrelenting sere. city of our laws, with regard to imprisonment for debt, bad operated in a must beneficial manner. This security had.been broken through by crecasional In solvent Acts; but there was this difference between them and a standing Insolvent Act, that at pres.xit every man knew the worst, whereas no man couli tell under the other whether he would he included in any Act or not—he miibt not have owed beyond a certain sum, and be must have been imprisoned a , certain time before. In refutation of the opinion of Mi. Burke, that there was no connection between the Counting House and the Jaif, he would appear to the numerous Petitions on the table from most of the trading towns in the country. What was the remedy he proposed l He should propose, that at present the Commissioners of Insolvent Courts be prevented iron receiving any more petitions from insolvent Deb mi. He thought it better to get rid of the pre sent law than to suffer the present system of disho nesty to be pursued with impunity. The measure which it might ultimately bc proper to adopt was J measure for future discussion. Various plans had been proposed for the purpose of discriminating be tween those to whom the indulgence of the law should be extended. One that had been proposed was to diminish the term after which Insolvent Deb tors should be discharged according. to the amount of poundage which they might pay on their debts.— But this was liable to objection, because debts might have been contracted with very honest intentions, on which the debtors were able to pay but a small poundage. His opinion was, there should be some broad principle laid down in the law, and in acting on this principle a large discretion should be allowed to the Judges. He said " Judges," because he thought the discretion should not be left to a single Judge, high .as the character of the Learned Judge was who now administered the affairs of the Insol. vent Court. The principle which should be e%ta. Wished in the law was, that the discharge of the pri. soner should depend on his having acted justly to. wards his creditors, and a bench of Judges would be the best persons to give their opinims as to the prin. ciple, and determine the best means of carrying it into effect. In the menu time, the measure which he had to propose was, to suspend. the operations'of the Commissioners appointed under the Act, by re straining them from receiving any more Petitions from Insolvent Debtors, and. thus pot an end to the system of falsehood, perjury, embezzlement, and in justice, which was now carried Ot: If he was asked why he brought forward this measure at a time when so much public business was before the House, he should answer, that the operation of the Insolvent Act aggravated the public evils, :yid tended to shut up the hearts and phrses of these who bad it in their posier to lend. He concluded by moving for l e ave to bring in a Bill to suspend the power of the Com missioners appointed under/the Insolvent Debtors' Act, from receiving Petitions • fur the discharge of Insolvent Debtors. Sir SAMUEL. ROMILLY said he did not object to the motion because it would draw the attention of the House to tho Insolvent Debtors' Act, and the manner in which it had b.en eiecuted. lie had no doubt that such abuses and treads bad bean com mitted that the bites position of the Lt.:•lsiature was loudly called for. At the same tinge lie thought it would be highly improper to precipitate :lie repeal of the Act without inquiring into the reaftvines l r the evil complained of, or availing themselves of this in. formatioli to •whikh .the. House - might nuw • have access, foe the purpose of bringing in the Measure tki .. . • .. • *ilk+ &e Honourable and Learne d , alluded ; before the Home returned tem of itnprisonment for d;f)t, i t Iv( km to sze whit that system was. Th e power of unlimited impris n.:lent - end when he I:al once seized bi obliged to continue to coA !t t : hitn to dibchaige him ftnrn Yrison WOOL die debt. Parliament WAS in the habil every t..vo nr there years by a - trial' Pict, vd•ich added to the s)itea), the :.wing all contracts between .ndividp pa, Law. it was his opinion, th o le House Irt.eirted to such a sysi exlmifte ceeditors•whn "td been die present Act—the precessional mi portunities of obsetving in what nt. Live, aud the Learned Jodge app oi Act, who, he had recbon to believe ittai':s as to the defects of the L. , petsoaded that there was any thin ) character which rendered this tir w!)ich a curio bmortnn, in some cable. There had bee* an idea f. had taken a great part ir. that be altogether diaelainted•—lie tilt it wai inttoduced into the Hsn! not one person was against the Bill having been on some amendments which ti ad proposed. tiir W. GARROW soncurred as to tb t pat . portance of the subject, and the propriety O t to ,: for a Committee, witri the Honourable and Lti l - 4 Ponleman (Sir Samuel Rom;Ily ). Li tr is %Ay 1 - 1 stevented from moving for•a onani;tee by d e k icy 'towards th a t Hon. aNd LearneJ Geotlemein—t:rie I ftioye, ust;ve)—but it the Cntuinittte was moved igt tee would second it. Sir S. ROMILLY said he-had not moved fo r a .Committee because it would be impossible fur i ll to attend to it. The ArcORNEY•GENERAL said, he was afraid he should be prevented also from attending that Committee. He would consult, howevtr, with the Learned Gentleman oa the subject. Mr. BROUGHAM said he agreed as to the in. propriety of the existing Law, and the necessity of putting an end to the trauds which would m g trade by the rots. But he thought it was prteipitai to propose the repeal of the measure before the is, criiry had taken place. Mr. LUC iiHAR r said the bringing in the b which be proposed would not prevent, but wo.lid pe.lite the inquiry of the Cummittee, and eft the House a hold on the subject. Mr. ABERCROMBY was not satisfied that a Bill should be intr.)tiuced to repeal the law altogether, to the pi inc;ple of which he still adhered, drogh he thought it raviited modification r he tha:u 4 ht it would ultimately be best to adopt an amendment that a Committee be appointed, and mean time he shatild move that the debate on the question bc adjanotd till to.moi row. After a few words from Sir C. POLE, Mr. PROTHEROE said, some most flagrant abuses had been committed under the present Ac!. A father and son were actually in prison on the aft of another son. so sC 1 brii ot of t od r j r d r ou d uc C rtni Aoi adjourning h L tei E i ed ß enb E i eu, G .c. H tei td d h e d bi e r d r id t n see y he a c th z o :a e n c e n :iv eui t e o t t e . quay. It v:as not usual to oppose the introduction of a bill, unless there was some insurmountable ob. jection io the principle of it. After a short coriversation between Sir S. Romi!ly, Mr. Abercrom*, the Attori.ey.Getieral, a,iii Lott Castlereagh, the :amendment was withdrawn, ansi Sir S. ROMILLY moved an amendment—"that a Committee be appointed to enquire into the effects of the 5Sd of the King, entitled an Act for the relief of Insolvent Debtors." Mr. LOCKHART said, that if it got abioadtbd Vie House was eves. cioubitul as to the evil of tae pieserit law, it. would give the reins to dishonestyand fraud. He should therefore persevere in his mains The House then divided—For toe AnaidaWlr 82—Fur the Motion, 71—Majority 11. The Committee was accindiogly appointed. MARRIAGF. OF l'Hlt CHARLOTTE. Lord CAS MERE:IC:EI appeared at the Da with the Message from the Prince Regent, ,elativeto the man iage ut her Ro)al Highness the Priors Charlotte.—See House of Lord:. Lord CASTLEREAGH sail, the course aswilf pursued on similar occasions, was to appcint early day for going into a Committee on a Menai , relating to a circumstance so- auspicious as tfat which had jest been communicated to the House — But while they did this, their affection and the Jeep Interest which they took in all that se nearly cow& ned that illustrious family, by whom we had now the happiness to be governed, and whose sway bad * largely contributed to the happiness slid liberties d Logfislarren, had alwa)s suggested on t he L omat an eapression of grittitude ler the Mes.age which had beta brought down, coupled with an assurance Oa they would proceed without delay to take it law their most serious consideration, to order to - Inaki ouch piovision as might appear suitable to the bisk tanks of the parties, and consistent with the diet, Of the nation. On the present occasion he sontiln' tncl no ditEculty in persuading the House to take this course on that aus:iicious and gratifying event whit be had been autherized to communicate this (14. — No argumeot was necessary on his part to wsketber attachment to that Illastlious Personage, who nos so gloriously presided over the Government of this country, or to that diitiliguii.hed individual Who " the tai)jent a the present Message. The aliases about to be contracted was one which pronn , etin be not less conducive to the comfort and happ Pt* of the parties, than the advantage had glory ot tht nation. He klt it impossible w abstain twin co,. gratulating the Hoare on the chum:Ler of that int vidaal who was now abreast to be united to the Itfla Family of •Ergland ly marriage. In speaking!), this subject it would ill becoine him to offer any east like flattery to nitre Leopold, but he spyke .1 1 " hearing ut those 'fiat torahs correa him if he eve' rated any thing, %viten asscrted, that then' ma but cue opiniou on h., onerits eiroulbout Ect - op I . and twit his Fincipres, his :rootlets. and I"' tats 4/ commanded a,;ll3ratiOtt o and .IttiOlced him to 11 : 141 : 1 . those titialifications winch &tett tins lot dot:total!. jai,. anent, and istrlch e.te necessary to fatal d Able consort for the Priricesi Clia:lotte of Wig* It PC . . n 4 d C t e o n i ttihe old.sv% wo;t,i h e fi The debts ] over his crod:pe, pis per son he vas icy lot lif e , b een :Id en :Id b e to ive u ? abit of imegrleing one e g il nporaty Insive ar ix he scand a l of vie. attif Itsal4 by an /asle retore, that tot o P e ' ter ' item, they thritili twit n defrauded tildn: men who htd pp, pi 'tarts it was bcc pointed u:ldtr ve, had made re; • tw. He WaS Kt ng in t h e EVA he only COlntfy en Ipe, was not app. prmilerit that he the preterit Atte e had never seen it ~ l Ils e , at which :inie 11, the Gnly 6644 the •••L' ' r•••IAa....