The Express. — London, England, 1850-03-01 00:00:00

b I IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDB.—Thouper t Fin. 28. TOO LOAD Citaitentos tovk his mkt at Mrs o'clock. FRAU DC LENT BANKRUPTS. Lard BROUGHAM referred to eertala rentras which had been prereneed, to show that it was sot is coasequeses of any taut is his till that eartals fraudulent bankrupts bad ~sped from jestin; but It was owing to this tact that no act was is Iperatios between the Chef Angest and the Ilth of October. COLONIAL RIFORIII. 1,771 MONTEAOLE ii.quired as to the information writ* the government might have revived from New South Wake reepectieg the popularity of the one.chambered con• a:tuition which it was pr looped to confer upon that colony. Earl GREY replied that the official deepatebee contained no definite inielligenco on the vu!iject. Front the reports of matins, end articles in the eolmial journals it wee, how ever. evident that the Melilla* had given great eatiefaction to the c3touista. ECCLESIASTICAL COMMISSION HILL. Thr report on this bill was bronlit op and rseeised, after a few o wrvati ws from the Earl of Waldegrave aad the Bishops o St. Ample and Colchester. The bill is ordered ter a third nadir g :hit evening. P.►RT PROCESSIONS (IRELAND) BILL. In moeie4 the second reta•a of the Pine Prom dons kir/lard) Bill, the Morgan at LANSDO WNE explained teat tte situate differed mem tomer Dille passed with • like object, in that the present am was intended to be • punt:Ant me, and co: ordered, like its predectuors, to ex pire at a rte.. period. Lord BROUGHAM approved of the bilL The East at ELLENbOROUGH objected to the method of working some portions of l's machinery, and thought the clause, might bare ben more di itinetly drawn. . . . Lord CAMPEELL. who supported the meseure, rejoiced that it would effectually prohibit all precessions bearing party tip or emblems, without interfering with school, tem. posses, and other Itarniase gatherings. Eon of ROUEN confessed that the bill had been im partially drawn, and not, l:k t the measure of 1840, directed fades:rely ageism the o:women. Awe SOON nostrils from L,rl bloorommo and the Of CLANZICAILDII, The bat wee then road a second time. Tluir :ordshipe sojourned at 7 o'clock. iiOUSE OF COMMONS.—THCRSDAY. FEB. 23. The RCLaaa took tb* chair at a quarter to 4 o'clock. PUBLIC BUSINESS. PETITIONS PRESENTED. NATAL Stil;LOWS—i;`e• Phyticians and 6.rgeons of L:nd n 11 apital, complaining of the treat- MUM of amisAnt our, ai.s 0:: board owls of war t ti their mot beige allowed to a.eee vith the cestortationed PAULIAMICNTAST ittFORK .11NDFRANCHISZ.—By Mr. A. RAJTIE (2). Win is favour of toe one sad extso atom a: the ether. 141W$PATIMIL STAXI. AND ADYIRTIIIMINT Dons.—By Hr. BRIGHT, tr. 2;7 cur.: pritlers ai.d strippers (mill operatives) of Rlch , ialr, tit the abolitionist these duties. Felt eau ASTRAL or THE PATES AHD OEIIII TEETS of Ilisowtanaz —By Mr. CAYLEY from Yorkshire; Mr. WAWN has Sepik tirtd; Mr. GIBSON, from Warrintr tea , for the repta: of a'.l taxes awing ut. dissemination of knowledge. RATING 0/` SIRLL TIXICNIISIII Bin —Br Mr. B. WORZLEY from • V.l.:riot beard ; Mr. GREENE from a place in L•oeublre ; in tarot' of this WI. AZ:eZLTUILILL Oan•ral LTGON from orcestenlkire; Colonel CHATTHRION from Cork; in favour of pro:wilco to apiculture. GAS BILLS. Sir B. HALL, having presented petitions from Camden town and vario= othir pasta of the borough Mary:shone, paving that Is all gas hills notice should bv given same time berate they were referred to the eekct committee of the site os which It was prorated to en= the works, submitted the following meteor ?rat the parties promoting any gm bill do-ing the pneent tertian of parliament do prove, be fore the ezaminere V rtitiots for private bate, at such time as may be by th. sad examiners appointed for the purpose, that nal= I. writing of the intended application has been given to every owner and occupier of a dwelling-house situate =thin 3,J yards of ths b •ur.chry of the proposed works, at least fourteen days before the first =tits of the committee= the bra, and that the examiner d* grant a certficste accord sad that such itertiScaM shall be pr:duc•d, is the brat instance. before the committee on the bill, sad that the said committee do reputes the production of each certificate to the Lowe on the report of the bill." Mr. E. ELLIOT baring seconded the notion, Mr. W. PATTEN observed that the existing standing orders in reference to pa bil's had bees most cue fullyl c:nsidered, although they di i not nquin the locality of M s works to be sp. cifi,d ; but It wetild be most unjust, sow that ths par in bad complied with those standing mien, to establish new case, sad to prevent al: such bills from proceeding, because those new orders had not boss ti4lowed. Hs hoped the bon. baron t would withdraw his mottos. Mr. HUME also Wed 0., leotiot would bs withdmwn. 84 B. HALL connived, alai the anion was withdrawn. AFFAIRS OF CEYLON.—CHARGES AGAINST CAPT. WATSON. Sir G. GREY appeared at ihrinrLi4 reported that her Majesty had rescirsd the alarm. a the home, founded on the racomssendation of the Csilon committee, for the ap pointment of a emamitsicia to ic.coiss on the spot as to the 'Laws *coexist aghast Capt. Wean, and had omosmcied tun I Sir G. Grty) to Bo:insist i.e how, that her Majesty hsd b:ea grack.us:y paned to Eire directions accordion y. THE TEN 1101.71t8 BILL. L - rd ASHLEY gam not 4:4 that n that day (snuff:lit he wsu:l move for leave to bring in a bill to limit Ma working in Mama to ten Noun. PUNISHMENT OF DEATH. Mr. EWART gave notice for an ee•lf day to move for leave to bring in a ►ill to &WIWI' the punishment of death. ENCROACHMENTS ON THE ROYAL palm: Tanana% DUNCAN inquired what steps had been taken I by the Woods tad F07111.L1 C.mmistioners to enforce the provisions of the lease, with r, gird to the prevention of en- ' acoschmena on the Green-pare in the case of the &al of Eli. amore's massfae, entl whether the garden walls of that mansion nastily erected seat tae park and encroaching thereon bad been built with the knowledge and permission of the nessaissionen? Mr. HAY [ER replied that there Fad been no encroach ment; in the case of the gardens to which the noble lord referred. Na doubt there had beta an alteration is the garden itself itvreduced by the architect in the erection of the ornamental walls which Lad been built to give it an Italian character. That erection was no encroachment, though It was inconsistent with the covenants of the lease, and on the Commilionen at the Wads and Forests being made aware of it they directed their architect to C31131311312i t ite with the architect of the Earl of Ellesmere, to arrange with him for the removal ot the erection in qusstion. It bad rat yet been removed, but the two architects were in con salt atioa on the subject, and there was no intention, he be lieve..., on the pert of the noble earl, and certainty none on the pat of the Woods and Forest., to act inconsistently with the covenants of the feat,. (Hear.) Vitcount DL:NCAN then asked for information al to cer tain rumoured encroachments in Greenwich Park, referred to in a letter in • morning pap-r of Saturday last. His gun- Cat woe whether any part el Greenwich Park was about to be et c-oached en to provide residences for the Commiser ionen of Greene ieh Hapital, or for any otta purpose ? Mr. HATTER was much obliged to his noble friend for rtittiegt the question, because he hoped the answer he should a.cs would allay all apprehensions on the pert of the inhabi tants of Greenwich that there was any design or intention n the part of the Contusion men of Woods and Forest. or the Commissioners of Greenwich Hospital to interfere with their comforts cr their property. The Commissioners of Greezwich Hospital had recently Ives carrying out certain imp:tvensentr, by wts'eh they Vinod the duties of the hosp'tal and the comforts of its inmates might be consider ably improved. la the warn of those improvements they designed to erect certain buildings on • portion of the pro tante which lasloeged, not to the Commie loners of liVeods rid Forest., but to the Commissioners of Greenwich Hos path and it was 'oersted that a small ornamental garden, taint the perk, should be aided to the houses 93 about to' be halite Teat portion of the park was under the control and management of the Commies:once.' of Woad/ and Foreqs, and at Sett they P‘Til their assent to the proposed alteratiers, but on a representation being made to them by the thkshitants of the opposite houses that the buildings shout to be erected wail interrupt their view Li the path and their property be interfered with, their remonstrances were eassidered by the commissioners of Welts and Fuftill and the commissioners of Greenwich Hospital ; and atthouteh the latter commissionas had a perfect eight to ant the buillires in the way they had con templated, yet, in defences to the ;violas of the public end the intabitents of the neigbbouthon I, sad believing they could peanuts the accommodation they required elsewhere with out interfering with the comforts or deteriorating the pro perty of anybody, they re s Ito ab mit , * their orig.nai intention, aid erect the bowies not on that but on a different spat (Cheers.) . • Mr. BARNiRD btotred to thaok the ken. gtotleman fox La siva leuthAtary 'tamer. DENMARK AND PRUSSIA. Mr. SANDARS NM notice of a quenila for tomorrow wh:ch was annerstood to refer to the refusal of Prussia to r a•w t►e aro idice with Deem•rk. FEES IN COURTS OF JUSTICE (IRELAND). Mr. SCULLY infrared whether th,-re wee any measure it c attewpl►tica to trkulate the fc!ii paid to the chelts of the Irish courts ? Sit W. SOMERVILLE treied that a bill was in awns praparatioa, bat he could lilt at reuse state the details. POOR LAW (IRELAND) ELECTORAL DIVISIONS. if 1). NORREYS the qu: sues of which he had viz., whether there would be any ohJeetioet cu • tart olptereliest 0 4 refer VD , - len the effect of Use 4trels law el 'Parlament la Zealand tour rAA poor law boaada . ry C Maisiciates, with dircctloos to them to sport to Ma whethar the elywnatira ertslned therein will be appiicable to Inlrd. Also wh , that Milligan considered that than yet:, any eireamaracto peculiar to Inland which should arrant Omar mulls lollowitia a diminution of Vie area of the aleneral Car rus'r hal tak is place in li-viand ; also varlet I.,ey miald give the house ai oppatuaily of v. arming as opinion ou the wrist, of reducing the are ad the electoral dat.aiera la Ireland ? Me O. ORGY replied that it wee not the Intention of the rovernamat to refer the reports •.n the law of settlement in Euiland to the Irish boundary COMIII/1140111M. iaastauels as *fro being no law of settlement in Ireland those reports would not apply. With regard tot)** knit part of the quo. lion, whether goveranient intended to girt an opportunity for express= en opinion as to the reports of tie boundary eownissionery, three reports were ea the table, and in the last reports of the peer law ecoaniseteaors they entered late detail of the 611 , 11•0101 which bad been taken for ellTf) ing than reeenrinandatioos into effete: it was not thereto's the ilVtatioi of the merman to propose any IllJtion on Nu subject. WESTERN AUSTRALIA. Its answer to Sir W Not,c6NVOKTH, The ATTORNEY.OENERAL said that the act giving a government to Western Australia had expired, but the authority of that government still remained. In reply to Mr. ADDIMLET, who asked whether the oxidise Australian goverment had authority to levy Wm, The ATTORNEY-OENERAL said that, by the act of the 10th Oto. IV., that government " had the power to do everything for the prom. lion of good government," mid he added (amid general laughter) that the levying tame was alw-ys admitted to be a part 01 good government. PARLIAMENTARY REFORM. Mr. HUME moved f e leave to bring M a bill to GOMM the rightisml repro/natation, he extending the females to every ntepayer of full age and sound intellect, and by fuming that votes shall be taken by ballot. The demonstrati ins mile by public meetings is favour of reform during the put twelve in inch' encoursged him, not withstanding the adv. rse result of the disirions of the lest two sessions, to pre.' the subject once mote upon the attention of thi house, in the hope that, after mature consideration, they would be induced to lend to it a favourable ear. His object was to restore the con stitution of the house to what it was in principle, and what it was avowed by its supporters to be; and, after due consi deration, he had come to the conclusion that he could not improve the constitution of the house, or bring it beck to its original principle, without extending the elective franchise to a large extent. (Hear.) Uriv.rsalsuffragewasdemanded by the people. He thought every man who I aid taxes ought to be represented—(hear, hear)—that tax ation and representation formed the con'raet of Englishmen, and that he who withheld that deprived gar lishmen el their tights. (Chem.) This was his broad assertion ; this was the point to which he went. Then came the consideration, how to carry out and obtain this c gage from an unwilling power, a power that could grant, but was unwilling to c muds the people's rights. He was obliged to lay down mice rails in order to draw a line of distinction Our present aets of parliament drew a line ef distinction. Tasy had pointed cut who shout 1 pram ss the franchiss , end of what the vaiification ahoul 1 onset. It would be some. what curious if he were to show that the principle on which our present representation rested was very diffetent from that which he held the constitution of this goontry meant. Looking at tho principle on which that house was constituted, and on which popular representation rested, he asked whether the present retamed parliament had not been based on princi ples altogether at variance with that great, general, and admeable one of taxation and reprea.ntation being ca. existent? (Hear.) He held in his hand a letter written by Lord Melbourne to Mr. Drummond in 1532, stating the grounds on which the ROTc/I1 client of that dry intended to carry out the Reform B.U. His lordship saes "In the former tell boroughs were regarded in proportion to their population, but in the present rose the elements upon which the boroughs are to he estimated are by the number of the houses and the amount of the assessed taxes." ' Now, hero woe the principle on which the Reform Bill of 1232 had been effected. He (Mr. Hume) had agreed to that Reform Bill, and had supported it throughout, because he expected it would have given that degree of control to the people over the members of that hou.e which would enable good and cheap t °Yemen% to be achieved. Me now came publicly forward and said that in that rapist he had been much disappointed ; and, therefore, he asked the house to reconsider the basis on which that rerun had bees granted and to extend, if possible, the numbers of the electors who were to have a voice in the election of numbers of the legislature. ((hear, hear) He had already stated that " universal " suffrage was demanded. This was a word not much liked, and very often not well understood, but he did not repudiate it, because, if there was any par ticular mode by which he could obtain the voice of every man in the election of members of pubescent. he Amid only he carrying out the principle of the constitution of this couu'ry, as he could show by quoting the opinions of some of the ablest men of past times. (Hear, bear.) Hs wished to state at the ouseet that, not being able to effect universal suffrage, as he inzuld wish to do, he adopted the nest best course. He took that which was tangible, easy to be carried out, and of whisk so man need be afraid. He therefore begged not to be understood by any hon. member as proposing that which was ideal, or fanciful, or difficult of accomplishment. He merely ask-d of them to agree to his mstien on this dis tinct ground—that taxation and representation should be earricd as far as possible consistent with registrain and a proper check against abase. (War, hear.) He might be said that every man in the country pail taxes whother he was rated or not, and he admitted that, by our present err tem of iadireet taxation, this was true ; but he held it to bar almost impossible to have the principle adopted that every man who smoked tobacco or drank gin should have a vote. He had, therefore, adopted another principle—one which bad not been deemed unworthy the attention of her Majes ty's government in the ease of Ireland—that of taxation and enrolment to the poor law rating. (Hear, hear.) If he meld obtain any more certain data then the poor law he would adopt it. He thought that in proposing his plan to the house he wen bound to point out the facility with which that plan could be carried out ; and if, in adopting the cri terion of the poor rate as the rate to give the franchise, be could show that there was a register kept of all he rJquireil, that no expense would be occasioned butted that aiready incurred, and that every man mussed to the pore rate should have ;the opportunity of voting for the election ! of a member of parliament, and that all this could be done without delay, be should do a great deal towards disarming and removing opposition. (lieu.) Ile should go further; be thought it of importance that every plan of reform and change should be cautiously made, well consi lerid, and not hastily adopted. Anxious as he was for reform, he confessed that he had lived long enough to see many reforms carried that were not improvements; and he would not ask the home to adopt anything which he believed was not salutary, easy of accomplishment, and likely to be advantageous to the mmmunity. His motion would give contentment and peace to tr.' country, by bringing within the pale of the constitution a large number of individuals who were now excluded—of worthy men, equally capable if not more capable of exercising the franchise than those who now enjoyed it. He was called on to answer to what extent hie reform wculd go He would not disturb the feel ings of any man by wishing improper persons to obtain the franchise. He would have a test, and that test should be a mere residents,. He proposed a regist.r to the tax for twelve months, and that every man paying it shout l come wittin " the scot and lot " principle. Ti.. being rated was ell he asked, and what he wanted was, to have a test of the re spectability of the man. Every man, therefore, who was rated to the poor, and who mould lie rated and resident for twelve months in a locality, should be di facto entitled to vote; sad it should be the duty of the officer to send in the name of each voter without trouble, expeise, or delay. (" Hear, hear," and cheers.) The next question he would be asked was, to what extent would this increase the suffrage ? Many had been alarmed at numbers. He was not. He believed that the more the house depended on the people the more trustworthy would be the ursize the people rendered. He also believed that the man who had not a voice given him by the constitution in the election of those who were to pus laws affscting life and property was no free man—he was in the situation eta bondsman and a slave. (" Haar, bear," and cheers.) And, upon this subject he wished to state that ha did not want anything for England which he did not also demand for Scotland and Ireland. (Loud cheers.) In reply, then, to the question as to what extent of suffrage the plan would lead, he begged to °beery:: that he had only been able to obtain correct information as regarded Euglead. That in. formation amounted to this, that in 1841 the population was 15,911,000, or, in round numbers, 16,000,000. Now, what proportion of electors would this give ? Taking every rate payer registered to the rate, taking a etpy of the rate•botks for his date, and striking off the double, treble, and quad ruple votes, he believed the number of men entitled to vote in the Ilaited Kingdom am .seated, at the present moment, to 780,000 or 600,000. This was the ()Maids. Taking the register es it was in the year 1841, he wished the house to understand that he would give by his plan 3,232,762 voters for Kugland and Watts alone. Scotland and Ireland would each produte its proportion; and this war the extent to which he was pee -1 ared to ask the house to enlarge the franchise. (Hear.) fhe question might be witted—weed not the titian exclude many individuals? It wou'd. If he were to take thoAt only who were assessed to the rate, registered as at present, be left out, perhaps, one million more. Artisans and lertgen were equally respectable, end equally, if not better, fitted for the franchise than those who now possess: d it, ai.d he would propose that every lodger might register or be registered to the poor rate for the house in which he lived, and that if he should be so registered for one y.-ar be should be equally competent acd entitled to exercise the franchise as it he were the entire possessor of the basso. (Hear, bear,) This was the extent to which he carried Ids plan of registration ; and now what was the danger arising trim this extension ? Was it not proved to every man who had attended to the history of neighbourinsi "dates that when power was confined to narrow places, and v.° masses of the people were treated not as fro-men but as ecrfs, danger arose from such a mate of things, and anarchy and confusion foi -1 .wed ? lied we not seen in this country the advantages of having seine kind of representation, limited and imperfect as that was? What bad they to fear from the:people ? Wilat would hon. !umbel, say if they were in the situation of the millions who were sow excluded from all political rights and privi lege. ? What would any of them say or do were they in the aitucion of mill one of artir.ns, on whose industry some of the finest manufactures depend, d—(hear, hear) —receiving 11, M. or 31. a week, and who would be called upon to eanl,t is keeping the Qautiti peace should a disturbance break out whilst they were walking the streets? Were not those azi-ans entitled to say, " You call on us to execute the laws, but do you give us any share or interest in making those Laws ? You treat us as eerie, and drive as like cattle, and yet you c4l epos us to support the law. How are we interested is the law ? Yen take money from as in every form, on everything we eat or drink. You take from us our earnings. This one-third or one-fourth of our industry you take, and you rass laws to grind us ,'own. How are we interested in Um law 1" (" Hear, hear," and cheers.) Whilst men of large incomes were taxed a thousandth part, a bun "rub part, er a twentieth part of their earnings, the attis..n was taxed one-fourth of his whole wsges on his consumption of the ordinary articles of TIIE EXPRESS, FRIDAY EVENING, MARCH 1, 1850. soloist's's. Oilers, am mere worthy than the English artissae.llriog is &deem, the Limited States, mid Francs, amid aot be taxed without Ha* moweent ; sad why should not the artisan class of Easlead M plarad ea a similar footing ? (Hear.) The promat system ammearily placed tarp messes of the people fa a condition which elicited de. contest. Was it aoterkleat that the time mu come when these messes would judge id their unjust treatment, and what dependence in limas ademgeemsald be imposed on luau men, particular') it they fiseenall, as they did. a considerable portion of the able-b od ied paaialatien ? (Hear, bear.) It be asked anything wiresnearthe let him be reproached therewith, but be contended that his request was a just one, and that this was an oppoirlame ties, for taking up the question and dealing with It properly. He called upon boo. members to look at the papers on the table purporting to be the correspondence on the affairs of the Cape of coed Hope. He highly approved of the conduct of ha Majesty's g nnnnn meat al respected their decision on the 30th of lama., last. The paper ke held in his band bore the date of the 30th of Jannery, and it consisted of a minute of her Majesty in council, and was the Chaster of the Bill of Rights to the Cohn, of the Cape of Gocd Hope. It purported to give to every Eng lishman, wherever he should settle, all the privileges of the free institutions of this country. (Hear.) Let toe house not be alarmed, then, at reposing confidence in Eng lishmen at home when her Majesty's ministers had already placed confider-es in the mixed population of the Cape of Good !lope. (Cneen.) He thought a fact like this ought to lit. abuse the minds of hon. gentlemen who might be afraid of increasing the number of elscton at home, and that when he found the present government placing confidence in mixed populations abroad he bad a right to demand the ex tension of reform and the granting of the privilege* of Eng land to the people of this country at home. (Louo cheers.) Was an Englishman to be denied bete that which he &Ott e•joy at the C .pe of Good Hope? (Hear, hear.) Were the English leas intelligent, lees diligent, less moral, less worthy of the right of any yin! legislstive powers than the inhabitants of a' yof the co lonies? (Hese, bear.) And if not, why was not the privilege conceded? Another part fas motion required a more equal distribution of the poou• lation according to number.. The government had agreed to erant electeral districts to the Cape, and those 'lee:teal districts were to return the members of parliament. He did not ask them to form electoral districts ; but if they formed a group of two, three, four, or five birouchs. the; would make the representation mare proportionate. It was quite easy to do this. There was no dial. culty in forming the poor-law unions, most of them con sisting of several parishes, and which varied is extent actor •ing to the population, and they might as easily form such electoral districts as he had referred to. At the Cape awl at other places there were to be electoral districts. Her Maj.sty's ministers proposed that there should be three estates in each colony— the governor, the legislantre council, and the repriscntattre es.entbly. He supported the same princi;le in this country : he wished to have the Qn• en, the lords, end the commons • hut he wished that such power shoal I be srparate and d istinct. He wished not to destroy the constitution ; he wished to make it more popelvr, and that the which purported to be the House of Coalmen' should be so in reality, and that the mewbau of it should not be, as in too many caste they were, ' mere nominees of peen—(hear, hear)—not of peers I only, but of the aristocratic ChM. Previous to the 11..brm Rd! scats is that hems were sold like fish in the market. He wished he could say that was not so now. He h.d be fore him 'trona proof—he did not like to charge my indi vidual—but his belief was, that at that moment there were miry in that house who owed their Hata to money pal to individuals to secure their election, and that was as much boruughmongering as the old syatemwu. It was to put an end to this system bat be sought to introduce this bffi. And then with regard to the duration of parliaments, he thought that three years was long enough. He did not think that one year would afford a' sufficient acquaintance with hueiness. At one time he W 4 of opinion that frequent parliaments were better, and be agreed with Major Cartwright, who was for annual parliaments ; but on mature consideration he should be satisfied with triennial parliaments. There wee 'anther point, as to the payment of members. After long consideration he had co re to the opinion that they got little disinterested es-vice, and that was the reason why he bad ot.en cbjetted to any responsible office being put upon any one without pay. He was, therefore, perfectly consistent in saying that any person who undertook ' any duty, if he did that duty honestly and fairly, ought to be paid tar it. He should be satisfied if what was to be ac corded to the colonies ea to the duration of the assembly, the constitution of the assembly, and the payment of members, should be accorded to Ragland, except that he did not agree as to 'he dura.ion of the as irately, as it was to he in some cases five years or ten years. Here they had precedents; they hail Ireland and the colonies. 73 those branches of the empire that justice was about to be extended ashich he asked for Encland and Scotland. Why not put all on the MUM footing? The hon. member then referred to the srech of Lord J. Russell oa the Sts laid., in introduc;ast the colo nial government—a speech which, be said, he had listened to with more pleasure than any i , etek delivered by the noble lord since that in which be introduced the Refarm Bill; for in it tho noble Led wrestled those sentiarcnts which he (Mr. home) knew ho entertained, and which came oat row and then in spi'e of himself, though at lane intervals. In that speech the noble lord said —" There was another and a most remarkable characteristic attending these col inies, and this was, that wherever Englishmen have been sent or have awn to settle, they have carried with theta the freedom and the institution of the mother country. Alter supporting his argument, by adducing copious proofs that the most eminent a:.thoritit uptn constitutional and political questions had admittid the principles upon which his measure was founded, Mr. ILime remarked upon the legal tomplieations involved in our present electoral system, which ad mitted no lets than eighty five varieties of quali fication. (Hear.) He would put an end to them all, and have one single qualification, the being rated to the raiiel of the poor. And now as to the intelligence of the pcopl.. The common observation had been, " educate the people first ;" but he said the best mode of teaching the people was by civirg them enmething wor:h living for. A gen Leman in Scotland, Mr. Henderson, advertised that he would give premiums for the three best essays on the observance of the Sabbath, to be written by some of the working chives. In lets than three months he received ne fewer than 11145 mayo. Three of them Mr. Parkes had published. Ile had read them, and they showed great talent. One of them was by • journeyman pricter, another by a jourreyman shoemaker, and the other by a journeyman machinist. These were samples of the intelligence of the working clam.. With such proofs of intelligence, could it be borne that men capable of writing such essays were to be denied the franchise ? Were bricks to be preferred to brains ? (A laugh.) As Franklin said, was • man to have a vote as bag as his jack as was alive, and, as soon as his jackass was dead, was he to low his vote ? (Cheers and laughter) At present, if a man occupied a house of a certain Tilos he had • vote ; but, if he left the house, he lost his vote. What In absurd state of things ! Ile now came to the inequality el the representation. He contrasted the narrow constitu encies of certain boroughs with the vast electoral bodies d the great (ides, who were yet endowed with no larger share of led eence in the legislature. Followii.g this anomalous condition of things through its immediate consequences, the hon. member, after enforcing the ri,tht of the people to have a legislature which should truly represent their opinions and watch over their interest, concluded by submitting to the house the motion of which he had given notice, for leave to bring is " A bill to amend the national representation by extending the elective franchise, so that every man of full age, and not subject to any mental or legal diashility, who shall have been the resident occupier of • house, or pert of a house as a lodger, for 12 months, and shall have been dull rated to the poor of that parish for that time, shall be registered as an elector, and be entitled to vote for a repre sentative is parliament. Alto, by enacting that votes shall be taken by ballot, that the duration of parliaments shell not exceed three years, and that the proportion of representa tives be mule mere consistent with the amount of population and property." (Hear, hear.) To this he wished to add a clause taking away the property geslifiention of member, to which he connived government could not object, as they had adopted the principle in reference to three-fourths of the colonies. (Cheers.) Sir J. WALMSLEY, in rising to second the motion, said It will be for hon. gentlemen who intend to vote against the present motion to prove, that of all who contribute to the support of the stet:, there should he less than one million who are worthy to possess the elective franchise, or are capable of using it with benefit to theensilves and to the in terests of the country. (Hear, bear.) Until the proof is before me I must assert, that, as a general rule, the unen franchised masses of this country are worthy of the political rights which they claim, and are prepared to exercise them in a matinee compatible with the interests we all desire to guard. (Cheers.) I must be permitted to go one step further, and to say, that whatever may be the result of this debate, it will not he sale much longer to delay the act of justice which is now sought, and could we be assured of safety, the time is fast approaching when the very intelli gence of the millions of this country will make legislation on this question absolutely imperative. (Ch. ere.) When the noble lord the member for the City of London had charge of the Reform Bill, he referred constantly to the nu merous evils and abuses of the then state of the representa tion. I have yet to learn that any one of those evils and abuses, then so powerfully depicted, is absent from our pea sant representative system. (Hear, hear.) Did the noble lord inveigh against nomination boroughs ? We point hies to a list of boroughs, sending members to this house, all of them notorinusly wider the influence of parties, who claim, and do not fail to use, the power of saying who those members shall be. (heer, hear.) hid the noble lord support his measures of reform by appealing to the practice of bribery and corruption at elections, we (point him to the blue books accumulated at the commencement of every parliament from that time to hie present. (Hear, hear.) On the other hand, did the noble lord argue the propriety and justice of giving the fem. chiles to populous towns and districts, 1 will venture to ask him whether the results have not justified his arguments, and whether the fact of so few petitions having been w onted from those enfranchised constituencies is not a good reason in support of a further extenainn of the electoral power, and the enlargement of the constituencies through out the United Kingdom. (Hem., hear.) 1 will ink the noble lord, too, whether the constituencies created by his bill of 1832 have net made some valuable contributicgis to this house ? (Hear, hear.) Possibly hon. gentlemen oppo site may be disposed to quistion this ; but e think those who occupy seats on these benches will allow that the deliberations in this house upon th e most important measures which have been pissed du ring the last eighteen yeasts have been gristly aided by thr, experience, the judgment, and tho Firm's?w of those -gm, owe their parliamentary existence to the bill of the note le lord. (Hear, hear.) Is It then unreasonable to supposo 'that a new mea sure of reform, as generally demanded now as was that to Wank 1 have rotund, would not lAid to %imam &Quilt., sad, tly, 'assonant improvemenb in the °Destitution to how? (Hear. bear.) The people of this great essatsy are growinghy alive to the imperious necessity of re modelling our system of representaticm.• Vast numbers see deeply isprossed with a sense of the wrong that de done to them by the denial el any treks in the election of these to whose laws they must yield obedience, and whose tazation, however excessive, they are compelled to bear. This sense of injury will be deepened by delay ; and it would therefore be bat following the dictates of prudence to make timely concessions. (Hear, hear.) Of those who possess the franchise there are many who deeply sympathies with their unprinlegi d fellow subjects, and are content so longer to enjoy a political dis tinction of which others are as capable and as deserving as then selves. (Hear, bear.) I admit there are others who wculd be content with the system ea It is, if they could see those pnirical results which they deem themselves entitled to expect in the legislation of this house. But the votes of this house upon quesions in which these climes take a deep interest are generally so moth at variance with what the con dition, the wants, and the destinies of this country demand, that they are fast becoming favourable to the throwing open the portal' of the constitution to the people at large, as the only means U the attainment of that pr per administration of affairs which the desire to see naked. (Hear, hear.) Fee myself I think it is not only expedient, but jest that her Majesty's intelligent and attached subjects sheuld poises. something more than the privilege of paying the taxes which it pleases this house to impose. (Hear, hear) I ask, therefore, fur the extension of the auttrage as a debt due to those valuable portions of our population, and agree with those who seek the extension of the stamp° sea means to amend. The pro ceeding' of the loot two sessions have convinced the people, the electors not lees than the non.elector,, that no materiel alleviation of the national burdens can be expected from this house seat present constituted. Bhsll it be said that in this country alone, Englishmen are unworthy of the rights of citizenship? Wh we track them, es emigrants to dis tant regions,. we find them fully capable of discharging not only the social, but ell the political duties. (Hear, hear.) In the United States, they are at once admitted without queoion, and almost without probation, to the immunities and functions of citizens. Who are those who have carried our civilisation, our arts, and our commerce to fore'gn lands? Who are those who have peopled the wilderneas— have tilled the soil, and raised town, and cities in the remote dependencies of the British crown, and ere now asking and obtaining representative and responsible government? Are they not, the majority of them, men who is their native land and at the seat of empire are toasted as unworthy to have a vote for the return of membsn to this house ? (Hear, hear.) Shall it be said to the honest artisan of this country that while here they shell be excluded from the franchise, but that it they ay.!' quit these stucco they shell find it at the Cape, in the Canada', or in Australia ? (Cheers.) When we find the thousands of our colonial brethren extorting eelfgovernment from the bands of the Btitleh legislature, shall it be said it is denied to the million at home ? The noble lord has announced emphatic illy that it is not the intuition of the government to bring forward any measure for an extension of the franchise during the present 'onion. lam glad the noble lord has been discreet enough to say only thjs ec.eion, for I tell him that which he already knows, that It is but a question of time. (Cheers.) He may be sceptics/ as to the public feeling upon this mat ter; but the result of a somewhat extended observation has led me to the conclusion that there is as large an amount of unanimity upon this question as was ever known to be mani fested upon any other. If the noble lord require additional evidence of the theirs of the people for parliamentary Worm I think I may premise him that he will have it—l think I I may promise the noble lord more, that whenever he shall feel disposed to venture upon a proposal to admit those to the poseesion of the franchise who ore worthy of the boon, whatever may be she scantiness of the support given to him by the members of this house he will be sus tained by the great body or the people, and by them be ena bled to retain that high position which as the author of such a measure he would deserve to fill (Cheers.) But, what. ever may be the inclinations of her Majesty's government or the feelings of thin house I rut satisfied the time is not dis tant when tae pe opt* will speak with a voice which no mi nister, and no parliament will be able to disregard. (Hear.) It will be an omnipotent voice, because it wi.l be the voice of justice and of reason uttered in the spirit of loyalty and truth. (Loud cheers.) It will be the voice of a people whose intelligence, whine industry, and whose skill are the glory at once of this par'nt country and of every region over which the sceptre of her Majesty is swayed. (Hear, beer.) It will be the voice of a people who Lave d imperishable monuments of their piety, their virtue and their patriotism, and when that voice shall have been heard, answered, cud 1 believe the time wi'l have 'arrived (fir a rt.4w end • better slat, of things —a time whey there will be a consi derate attenti-os to the just irate-eats of el classes, without partiality eel without distinction. Thanking the house fur their kind indulgence, I leave this great question to their judgment, and that of an enlightened country. Mr. Hume, said Sir Joshua, in conclusion, had shuwn how unequally the population were represented; he would add some sta tistics, showing hew unequally property was represented. For this purpose he quoted from the s ork of Mr. A. Mat key some calculations, pr ivinz that while half the members of that house represented an aggregate of between six cad seven millions, the other half represented not lesa than 78 millions. The question having been put, - - - - - • - Sir G. GREY said that whatever might bt the opinion of the house with regard to the merits of the motion submitted to it, he thought kis hon. friend was entitled to the credit of consistency is bringing it forward now as he had done on former occasions. He believed that his hon. friend and the hon. gentleman who see ,niled the motion in a manner whisk rendered any apology from him unnecessary—(hear, hear) — and with a spirit and ability which reflected great credit upon him—(hear, hear)—were both actuated by the single desire of promoting what they believed to be the nest interests of the country, and of adding strength and permanency to i•s institutions. (Hear, hear.) Differing, however, from them as to the results of the ramose which had been she dowed forth rather than distinctly brought before them, he felt hound now, as on former occasions, not to consent to the motion, but to meet it with a decided negative. (Hear ) The motion submitted by the hon. gentleman was nearly ider.tical with the one he proposed last year. But as the question was not whether there should be any extension of the suffrage—as it was not oae relating to the finality or de. tails of the Reform Bill—u it was n- t the question whether the terms and conditions on which the elective franchise was to be exercised should be reconsidered with a view to its enlarg'ment, he would not refer to these points, or expreu any opinion upon them. Ile was anxious to state this, lest he should be considered now or at any future time, as opposed to every and any consideration of the suffrage with a view to its extension—that extension being consistent with the constitution as settled at the time of the Reform Bill. (lieu, hear.) The qu.ation now was whether t►ey would entertain a proposition more extersive and sweeping in its effects and intention than was adopted by parliamentafter a severe struggle in both houses and in the country, in 1839. His hon. friend ogled on them to remodel the whole constitution of that house, and to alter the basis on which the whole fabric of the electoral system rested. His hon. friend said that he was an advocate tor universal suffrage, and that all persons who paid taxes eh ould be pug teased of the franchise ; bat he afterwards qualified that by saying that taxation and representation should g•o together as far as was consistent with peeper checks against abuses. In the proposition to qualified he (Sir G. Grey) agreed; for it was the oasis on which the constitution was formed, and on which the electoral system rested. His objection to tne proposition et has honourable !rend was that he asked them to remove: these checks, and to admit such a large and indefinite extension of the suffrage as would be inconsistent with efficient checks against &bust a. In proposing " that every man of full are and not subject to any mental or legal :disability, who shall have been the nt occupier of a house, or part of a house Si a lodger, for 12 months, and shall ha.e been duly rated to the poor of the parish for that time, shall be regist, red as au elector and be entitled to vote for a representative in parliament," he took away what had hitherto been considered tho indispensable conuitinn of exercising the elective franchise—the possession of some property or other. (Hear.) At least the terms of his motion did not imply the possession of any property in the sense in which that word was generally used, fur he proposed that any lodger who claimed to be rated to the poor, although he paid no rate, or although it had been paid by the landlcrd for him, should be entitled to the franchise. An owner of a house might therefore till it with lodgers who claimed to be rated, and though they never paid any rate at all, they would he entitled to HI. Tote without being subject to any test of the postetsien of any sort of property. Such a propoeitien is equivalent to one which proposed no restriction at all,sueh as w. aedvocitted by the hon. and learned member for Nottingham. The hon. gentleman said that in former timer such was the system in many parts of the country. But the scot and lot franchise to which be alluded, was combined with eel i.c evidence of property in the power to pay. The hon. gentleman was not quite correct in his estimate of the pre sent number of voters its this country. Ile said that the numh,•rs of voters for the whole United Kingdom, including Ireland, was 800,000. Mr. HUME—Striking off the double votes. Sir G. GREY—The last returns laid before parliament showed that the number for Great Britain clone was 911,0.10 out of an adult male population of 4.508,0,1 d. His hots. friend Asia that the constituency weuld be incre sea to 9,600,000 if they took the numb rof ints ihite.l houses. But he apprehend. d that some of these houses were in double occupation, end many of them were occupied by Canal,. who paid taxes both direct and indirect. Whether his hon. friend would fixttad the franchise to females he did not know. Mr. have no °Nation. (Rear, hear, and laughter.) Sir G. GREY—Ilia hon. fricn.l would then make that a part of the nest reform bill. (Laughter.) Mr. HUME—It is done in Greenock. (Langhttr.) Sir G. GREY did not think that the frerchise was era rc i‘ed by the ladies of Greenock, for the election of memtors to parliament; but he certainly did net se- how they could be justly excluded from that fight under the plata of the b o a. gentleman. (Hear, hear.) If ho had examined the number with care, he did not think be would find any inch dinproportira u ho stated between the increase of population and the increase of the electoral body. On the contrary, a very rapid increase bad taten place in some dietricts. Take the two divisions of Lanca shire. for ex .mpb•. The number of voters in 1833 inns 161,32; in 1837, 27,445; and in 1815, the date of the last return, the number was 3.5,476. which is more than double the number in 1833. Ia the Writ Riding of Yorkshire the number of voters in 1833 wee 18,a56; in 1837, 29.078; and in 1816 it was 30,165. The number of electors in Liverpool in PO3 wee 11;200; in 1837, 13,819; in 1846, 17,016. In Matn.heiter 019 number 81 *Wan In 1833 wal 0,703; 1887, 11,185; in 1846,14,841. There was no analogy between this country and its colonies. But It the analogy was to hold good in ores Melanin, it should hold good in all; sad as they were to have an elective second chamber in the Cape, the hba. gentleman should be prepared to substitute for • hereditary House of Lords a second elective chamber. (Hear, hear.) Mr. HUME-1 have not the least objection. (.! Hear," and laughter.) Sir G. OBEY—Hishon. friend was certainly veryopen and candid, and it they adopted his proposition they would do so with their eyes open; for his hon. frisad said that he had no objection to universal suffrage, that be had no objection to @Mending the elective franchise to women, and that he had no cbjection to an elective House of Lords. (Hear. hear.) Now, however just the title of his hon. friend to the confi dence of the people of this country, he did not think he would be a safe guide for them in that house. (Hear, hear.) He thought it better to stand by the ancient constitution of the kingdom, and the principles on which it was bssee, than adopt the new system on which his hon. friend would place it. (Hear, hear.) He would not allude to the question of the ballot or et triennial parliaments, because his hon. friend had passed them over lightly, and as they were to be made subjects for special motions he would reserve any obser vations he had to make till they came in that shape before the house. He would :bendy observe that the bon. gentle man had not used any argument to reverse the decision which the house had come to last year respecting triennial parliaments. He did not clearly understand the meaning end intentions of the hen. gentleman when he said that he wished to make the proportion of representatives more consistent with the amount of population and property. lie would only say that he thought any system which would divide the country into equal electoral districts—which required that an equal number of the populatior. should con cur in returning an equal number of members—would destroy one of the safeguards of the constitution, which consisted in havine the varied iuteresta of the country fairly represented in parliament, which it would be impossible to strain under the system of electoral districts. (Hear.) lie did not mean to deny that great injustice might be found in some cases with regard to the number of members returned from different parts of the country, not only as regarded population, but as regar ted property in connexion wi h population. Bat if they adopted the system of equal electoral districts, they must be premed for ore of these results—either Uey must increase the number of represen tetives in that house to such an extent as would render it inconvenient, it not impossible, for it to transact the business of the country, or they must alter the balance of interests now represented in that house, and transfer to the metropolis and other large districts, the representatives of whom they would deprive smaller and less wealloy places. (Hear, hear.) He hoped the boom would refuse to allow his hon. friend to lay his bill on the table of the house, fur the principle on witch it was based would reader the constitution purely democratic, whilst they bed only a limited monarchy and a House of Lords that was acted upon by public opinion and partook of the same feelings and interests as the other portions of the community, which exercised its due shore, and no more than in due share now of authsrity—("Oa!")—hut this house would exercise more than its due share under the purely demo. critic constitution which this measure would inaueurate— a share which wetilil be inconsistent with the working of the constitution as it now existed. He concerted with the hon. gentlemaa in being thankful for living und. r a conati tutiou of tee en, Lords, anti Commons ; but thinking that his motion would be dangerous to that constitution he asked the house to oppose and reject it. (Hear, hear.) Mr. F. O'CONNOR promised to vote for the motion, but still avowed himself a champion of the charter. Ile vin dicated himself anal his party with great mew from the charge of having endangered lately or in times past the quiet of the country. Mr. P. WOOD, after reading the motion of Mr. Hume of that yr nine, as also the universal suffrage motion introduced by Mr. F. O'Connor in the last session, to show that they were essentielly different, pr iceeded to say that he supported the motion of the hon. member for Montrose because it was opposed to every principle contained in the measure of Mr. O'Connor. (Hear, hear.) The motion of the hon. member for Montrose wPI no abstract or theoretical one, but one based on the rights and principles of the institutions of the country. (Hear, hear.) lie thought it would be much more satisfectory_to the house in general, as indeed it ieou'd be to him (Mr. Wood), if the gm. rnment, instead of telling the house what they did not approve of as reform, would tell them what they did approve of—(hear, hem) ; and he doubted not the house would be extremely glad if they brought forward a reform motion, even though it did not go near as far as the mtasuret hen before the house. He (Mr. Wood) admitted that one of his reasons for supporting the present measure was that the people mirht he protected from filling into the views and notions of such gentlemen at the hon. member for Nottingham. (Hem ) lie did not mean to impute impropriety of motive to that hon. ceete min. His verdict of him coincided with that pronounced in a court of law on a recent occasion, where the hde member ap peared as suitor against a newspaper proprietor for having seemed him of deluding the public. Tree jury in that case, decided teat though the public was deluded, Mr. O'Connor was personally honest; aid in the some way did he (Mr. Wood) believe thtt whilst the hon. member politically de luded his followers he was personally honest. (Hear, hear.) The motion of the hon. member for Montrose widely differed from the abstracted theories of tie hon. member for Nottinghamshire, who preached the doctrine that " taxation without representation was tyranny, and should be resisted: that the labourer should be the first partaker of the fruits of his own labour," and such like abstractions, which he (51r. Wood) repudiated, and with which he was eisgusted. (Hear, hear.) Tue motion of the hon. member for Montrose was consistent with constitutional doctrine, and was the natural growth of their institution. . (Hear, hear) It was adapted to the habits of the people, and to the laws under which they lived. The principles of the hon. member for Montrose, embodied in his motion of that evening, did not go to seek universel sang*, but required that every man of age, end not morally or iateliectually di. ntitled, possessing certain qualifications, such as 12 months' residence and rating, should be entitled to the franchise. (Hear, hear.) In fact that doctrine had been tale down by a great constitutionel lawyer, Sir W. Blackstone, who started on the same principles, and then pointed his yealifi• ations. (liter, hear.) Things certainty could not remain much longer in their present position. It was must unreasonable that out of a population of 41 mil lions of male adults in this country, only 900,000 of them should be entitled to the franchise, including the double votes. (Hear, hear.) Would it be soil that the re maining 34 millions were unfit to exercise the frsrchise ? (Hear, hear.) Or was it possible that the development that had taken place since the passing of the Helena Act would be counted as notning ? (near, hear.) Within the eighteen years that had passed over since the passing of the Reform Act there had been ere. ted 1,500 churches ; and he (Mr. Wood) would be much ashamed of that fact if he thought it had nothing to do with improvirg the habits of the people. (Hear, hear.) They knew that great efforts had been made in the direction rat education. The Nati .nel Schools educated upwards of a million of children; ant toe dissenters, in proportion, were not behind hand. And was all that to go for nothing ? (Hear, hear.) Mr. DRUMMOND could not concur in the sentiment that we should admire talent wherever it was found. He had a contempt for talent as for other things according as it was empl eyed, And whin the hon. and learned memba tor Oxford had to see one class set against another, and observations made calculated to separate them still more, his (Mr. Drum. mond) answer was that a set of proteseimal agitators had been going through the country maddening th 3 . pas3-iocs of the people by falsely declaring that the landed a r istocracy of that house had used the power they possessed to injure trade and manufacture and enhanc3 their own ketuues. The were b y t i ‘.l :to: e i n any cl;ar.re was false, and he could contradict it there where he could be met if it were true. Wi:h re:wet to the motion he was sorry the noble lord had not fulfilled the rumour which they had heard, by extending his measure respecting the Irish franchise to England. (Rear, hear.) Ile was sorry, also, that the hon. mover, in the tint instariee, hal so mixed up the franchise with other things, lee had he sopa rated them he (Mr. Drummond) might have given him Ms individual support. The old whig dxtrine was that the so vereign ruled by the n grace of Btu hes's," now it ran " by the grace of Manchester." For his part to hated equally both sentiments. On tne whips the hun. member proceeded to pour out fierce invectives, founded ou a summary of their history for li:i0 years, and concluding with a declaration that they had violated the constitution and betrayed the crown—leaving the Queen's throne nothing mere than a president's chair. In the measure now brought forward they were hut reaping what they had sown. That measure would be carried, and 'NOM alter that, for the career the government had . entered en would land them in a pure di mocracy. Mr. ROEBUCK thought the cmntry was Indebted to the hon, member tor Montrose for bringing forward this =arida , and that the tight hon. baronet opposite (Sir O. Grey) had not dealt fairly with it. 'floe hon, member for Montrose said that that house having, from time to time, sawed the mode of 11 representation, and increased the number of electors, to now asked it to do so, and the right honourable gentleman's answer was, that they . wculd thereby overturn the constitution by miasieg . a chamber so entire:y representing the democratic principle. The tight hon. gentleman . d . ealt . with the prop°. sitims much after the fashion of aMA pros lawyer. Re did not inert it fairly, hut heat round it, cavilled and carped at it. °lsar, hear) lle said it was opposed to the Eng lish constitution. N isv what was that? kr he (Mr. 100. buck) hsd searched altar it for many years without being able to lied it. Ile had seen a most remarkable instance of a direct change hang made in our system of vpresents, (ion by the noble lord who sat li.aide the right hon. ecidlerugn, and he recullecte I that at the time it was charged against him that he was istrodwing a now priesciple, by giving the franchise to 101. houteltelders, a tting wh dly unknown to the constitution of the calvary. Ile cool 1 nit understand the principle of 13:s hon. friend flat represents. lion and taxation should go teat ths r. Thvy never hod gone and never 'a wild go together.; Ilia tr .enthne d .i t eecrti ,„ :o .i,hi ng to alter the representation by extendi Ag fran chise was, that . there wee a :a.ite hall of our feßovr country men who fancied themselves agge.oreg because th e y were not admitted to the exercise 4 that franchise. In 1830 that au r a e u r4, e r te d ns p io l n et t net th it e . that cla-s was largo and. vivre powiriul than new. The people, in ex to lv'e the d m 15 r1 7, at e t e. the working class , a hail coy Tell /'.upe for from an unreformed pubs otameunt of taxation which was supposed greatmsofranchise which etnhht.neta st,hi,euterwnTe interest ort u ei l i; d sna! antry. lie did not think that the burthens way remarkable, and would go to burthen this co that he coisidered that they were mush lighter thra in most countries. It was said that the hou'a3 represented the varied interests of the counts:, and the word democracy wits used. Now I ha washed to know what that meant. Although he i (Mx. lto:bu.k) admitted that the v ti.sl inters as of the I ' COantr7 were hutiractly rcptesentcd, ha dallied that representeeL He ould ask t they were directly Inn hiturwcalf aßteththrthal:llll had they that confidence labouring classes, to allow them to vote for rep salted titres in that house. lie would ask them was it "en t on •-• much to have the right hon. gentleman (S r O. Or s yj ne— ap and promise contusion worse than confounded should only allow an increase in the amount of enligb °l ed' n they toted for a representative in parliament, Did right h °E D a ; hest that ffi t w h a a ha t o t sd h he e bo y uyi wire i hh r e e " character intelligent? i 114 hi, Own the peep 6 - Re would no doubt be the first to get up in his pail an eulogiture on the labouring classes of thisPenttraal The government were always ready t o support the laubiter. lag classes re far as eultieium on their intellig , ic e bat when they came to talk about giving them pnw , r, (hey immediatelr became • frightened, (Cheers.) R e • hi ; Roebuck) was not • bit frigh t ened ( by ‘ t ); i i class of his telloweountryreen ; he b e li eve d the to be a sober, wellinfortned, and Industrie race. They were rot people like those aernss the water_ their feelings wire not to be e reit. by the same meant , They had a regard to the decision of the m • • loot, • t h ey yielded to such decision when it w:s Properly pronou'e • end they did not take to fighting a. coon en they fectuilt themselves in • minority. Whom did they meas. it ssn d Naked, by the labouring population ? Lodgers' deed, said the right honourable gentleman (Si, Grey). But what was the propusifion the crr -, it was this—that mesa, to be coemelered entitled to a we, should be firer rt aliuthnatatihnetesdhubnykerlaime ek.,be,wiangsh,umneonauyeoidedth.er mirne, and should have bad a dwedire in a ho use for a year either as lodgers or occupiers. He wer. t f urt h er that that: it was necessary thgt the voter sho u ld have some die. Ungahhing mark, i mu; that was to he done by rlcistration. And I e went further, by saying that he would have co vagabonds — that meant, men without any settled place of reddence— trusted with a vote. lie would have all wir e " regist• red and rated for the poor. One objection which the enemies to universal suffrage had constantly befure their eyes arose Irom their fancying the, this labouring claw, when allowed to vote, would have a preponderance in the House of Commons on account of their preponderance in the sate, aid would cuns•qu thy do away with tee Rouse of I; rue and the Queen. Th:s tion gave occasion to loy..lry everywhere. The light hon. gentleman talLed of the I (outing population, and he sho , il like to ask him wheth , r ne came within thet eateirore. Its should like to hi sz the hon. member for Nottingham ex plain what the labouring population were. \Vu the hot. member fey Oxford to be considered a labouring loath when it was known that he i.b need all day and the greater port of the night ? Was Lot he a levouring man ? A n d was it not like the mode in which the whole of this country was made up, whose diatinetio-4 wire r. presented by a shade drawn moo a piece of paper, which h:gen wi'h one colour and eLdrel with another, in such a msnuer a. one could not tell where ore began and the 0t..,r rt:ded ? They may draw such • line, Intoning with the p , ,,re awl lowest labourer, and going gradually up to the tig...-st labourer who eat in that house, in the shape of the 5. lord (Lord J. Russell). (Laughter.) Who could 5:1 7 weer. the Brain commenced and where they ecded ? lie intr. ated tr.e house and the noble lord opposite especially :0 toe c refill how they resisted the desires of those who were 1,07, h onest l y , and justly entitled to the privileges they w yea, as ':y con ceding them in time, the country would to: be subjected to a dangerous revolution. (Chet tr.) Lord J. RUSSELL vindicated the passage of the P, forms Bill from the elienges laid by Mr. Drummond. The hon. member bad " invented a motive" f.l. their conduct, std untruly asserted that the intended merely to wreak rm. ges..ce up in the tory party, who had kept them so long out of power. Himself and his colleagues of teat till had for yens brought forward annual motions for ref rot, and hod adv•- cited its principles in days when reformers were few and calumented. The charge, he declared, did credit to the invention of the member for Surrey. Lard J ata Russell then went on to say as fellows. Tee proposition made tonight begins by stating that every person, though he may or may not pay rates or taxes, yet if he is a lodger in a house, that b t should have a right of voting for a member of par,..intent. It appears to ea. • in the first instance, if the hon. gentleman's object was c.erre.2. out by an act of parliament, it would be ...pea to innumerable Dead.. West would prevent any num', rsf persons being placed on the regi,ter as rated, though they hod no right whatever to be there ? Suppose ttere was a house with six or seven lodgers in it. The landleol was rated, and every one else nat. The lodgers had nothit t) do with the rates; but by the present motion, they mig...t toe all placed on the register upon their owu dement:: , • 3 rated, while there would be uo obligation on them payto It does sneer to me that this is as near stair:re : the as toy Ilan that does not profess to ba universal suirag, cot rtes those d teL still The d eviolisebeC'tuYpon to the the hPosuYsaViir'd. well in. (Hest.) Tne hon. gentleman him, If avows teat he is in favour of the people's charter; be declares that he is satl fied with its principles. In ell the pu'dic meetiii,, which I bate seen any :count, the partisans of the Lon. gentleman have associated with thou of the hon. member for Nottingham (Mr. F. O'Connor), have declared that they were in favour of t' - ,e same obj<et, and av:wel that they were w. eking for the rams end. I( :tit is FO, how am I to distinguish the proposal of the 11. m. eec.i man (Mr. florae), from that which the advocate: of tai, chimer have made. The boo. and learn'.d member for Shstatl.i s " why should you distrust the people • why should n.: have full confidence in the whole body of the people, tel permit them to vote at the elections fir members of psr..a rcent " (Hear, hear.) It does seem as if it were ungenerous to say that I have not full confidence in tee great body of he people, of whom the bon. and learned gen tleman says, that whenever they are praised on this s..i ci the house that praise is sure to be echoed from the other. I quite agree that their conduct as working men deserve the prase given them, and that their gener 1 con duct is deserving of high commendati h:er• but am I to argue from that conduct that u st oat follow, if a suffrage amounting almost to universal luthage, if the power of t lecting members of parliament were zivett them, that their choice would be a wise one ? Ant I t , say that because they ere deserving, the consequence wi.i be that they will elect members cf parliament, in whom the ulti mate decision of all the great q leciocs relatitg to empire is vested, who would discharge their duty in a mater to pmars . for their country - the empire% is tla ruiing of which this bows' is cal:el t) hear SJ great s part? I must rattan fully 'ea e.r.lidly I believe - that they would not. (Hear. hear.) I believe they would be misled —(oh, oh)—and I have seen instat as Which ind..ee me !o think so. I believe :hat men teting then that twenty or thirty minions of taxes are annually raised f r the pay ment of the intense on a debt—that they were under La obligation to pay it, and that these thirty co:1: , ons of talcs might be taken away at once by repudiating the debt—l be. licve that such men wou:d get followers and obtain a sea , in the house. I believe that percale a ivoeating the total repeal of the new poor-law, and return to the old law, which had it not been •oo.eshed I think would have led to a 504:1111ITTulittbri in this c .uotry, and .1.6..6:4 that that measure would prove beneficial to the people ; I be lieve that persons such u these would gain the votes of those varies of the working &asses who have hitherto not pos sessed the sutFrege. Such being my opinion I cannot agree to the proposal of the hors. gentleman Hume), Ito hon. gentleman the member or Oxford(Nlr. P. aloud) sus, " You have brought forward a bill with respect to the LA fraochise," and some other hon. gentlemen Cave said. " tau have brought forward armature with respect to the wh of Ireland, which contains principles not dissitui!ar :4 :hose advocated by the hon. mem%)er ler Montrose. Wile. s.th refried to Ireland, we have brought forward a 'ill wh,..h..1 it is passed in its present shape, will give votes to ab.nit 250,000 potions out of a population of two milieu of mare adults; not avery,Atterent proportion from that wh.ch •4 adjudged by the present set, if anything the proportou is rather less under that bill than the prvortion of the population who have votes in England and W.1.3`4 U:1 Ur the Retort's Act. (Hear.) If that is the cue, no pat..:.,1 can be drawn between it and the proposition now betore •`:e house. Something h.s been said with respect to the C tre Good Hope, and the measures .butt to be proposed t s : o represent diem of that colony, but the represento:i colony has cnly to deal with its local concerns. It ha , the great imperial widens to discuss which n: to: came be tore the Mouse of Commons of :to Uni•ed Kingdom, and therefore the subject being :or:. a different kind of repr. 'rotation is Po quir d. Lion of of the hon. pattern on for hiving the right et s • to 'wry tiger has been ably deserVord by Mr. J.,:ice '- fourd on a former crossbars, when he said that this pr made it a kind of select suffrage not for men 1111.: who held houses. but for thew whom heusso •• (Laughter.) Having made this change, the hocnri''. o gentlemen (Mr. Hume) then goes on to tor .h• , t alterations he would prop se in the e -ual•es sn.: baroug's which au to ser d memb , re :o t. 4 house. With respeet to this question I must sir tootcho hon. gentleman's explanation on this uon other oe:ast. , , was very unsatisfactory. • oLoughter.) Ico rejoi n: ire wo I understand the proposal of the hon. member for Notttnem (Mr. P. O'Connor) and the supporters of t` , .e ch it:, r. 1 htlievo the bon memh r for M , ,s. , :ed in drawing up. That plan sus let tits country toe ttv.dca into "loaf districts—lot every - tO,N,r or %0.. ;lib:A:awe have a vote—and let that plan extend r the c . Although I think that plan iujurieus. and less bk.:y to produce a national representation than the I' ln at prest,d. operation, I must say that it is drawn up wi h apporen: equality and fairness ; but the hon. gentlenoar , the ber for Montrose (Mr Ilume), and the hoc. geatleovn seconl d tura, only state " here are a great number 0: • :A bnroughs which have votes, while a number cf large 4.•`;l'. possessong a much greater populat:oo. are entirely to v. seated." If wo come to the inequality of the 14039 i 3t • we still find that it exists elsewhero oleo. In drowx.: u a that act we endeavoured—preservirg ancient privileges v . ': pre preserving ancient Counties 41..ilwour—to give foie representation to the whole, yet I ink when you come t.) consider your representation according to sortie just rule. , eft will he obliged to consider the case off the ma ntic. as wi o the boroughs. (Rear.) I do not understand Ire wt: be fair to eaTo "here are 100,000 people collected togeth•J :3 a manufacturing town, who return only two member,. irk that because there are 200,000 in an acricuhural entice they do not deserve four members. If there is to an equality, let us have it c arried out. (•• liter,' supporters of the proposal.) I will show the lion..:mto the state of the case as it is at present. There is N. tun.: '," with 53,000 inhabitants, it seeds two m embers to par'...,' meet while North Devonshire, with 170,000, cn:y two members. Lt iccster has sffOotol inhabitants, sett two members; while S •uth 11:vonshire, with 207.0. 0 only the saute natiocr. Oldham loss 12(00 inbabi•aata ml sends two members; while Darsetshirs, 5 •5:, no store. Wolverhampton, si ith a popul a t ion of So k~wl Bradford, with 31.000. send each two members:, North Lineoinshire, with 17 ,) ,000, and South Lince•••• •••••••• with 135,000 inhabitants, only Fend the unto (Rear, bear.) If we are to consider inolutLact, ii 5‘ 4 lrom i x I:, 41 )