The Express. — London, England, 1849-04-27 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDS.—Tarramy, Aram ES. Tke Loin Clewing:mos took kb sat at 6 o'clock. PRIVATE BUSINESS. SECOND RlADlNO.—Gordea's (Callum Estate) BM. THIRD READlNGS.—Dallisesa Gea sad Water Clair pay; Epsom Rates ; Bale PUBLIC 3131111168. PETITIONS. —By the EARLS EOLINTON, IMMO' Chanel Consetlen ef espd bathe of ikeelaml, IN& Ciag thzookissil=lrisli tate Ileadead ; Desedsin i _ead elks Ein fewer ef theta ter the enesedes Weeeme.— lf COMMIX Men to the up tho avail Sumba elbow linages .—Lard CAMPBELL. MS a Iles met heard, saying for the Missies ef tbe Hee. Ilr. SECOND =ADM.. leembeld Timm el leads (IrelleasO 1111 L COMMITTE3.—Eineke Peeklbition BBL TIMID ILEADINOS. Prbeners Removal (Ireland) 1 1 St John's Newhimileed Ra.beilding ; Gnats of Liked (New Snub Wales) Mlle RETURN ORDERED.—Pom Os Lfranter,Leao the modes el the Berl ef HARROWBY, a ntr,go sals, ether thaw main sorb, belongiag tt all mum trading Swards sad outwards with the pelts el Liverpool, Men the yeses Ma 1620 to 1848, inclir,ffo, p leer b y ; spestl)iag the poets from which tltrp now sag te which the 7 cleared net ; the steam tonne; r o t o be b oy , about frot ye sailing sleda sad the mail damn fres Seaman de leted NWT to mediae prapoina. LEASEHOLD TENURE IL OP L. LANDS (IRELAND) B TM LORD CHANCELLOR moved the sexed inadleg tbis le in bill, bu the gallery. tb• greater portic call o ofing the kis observatio ion at c as were lemillibat al the beam le the gabled, la , it would be necessary for hiss to s plit the rise ef the evils whisk tole measure peered to sassy. The teems el bed la Inks*, with rams* to bon INS WM I=llllL eir lllagmbis, gave rise to great fa. aressimers MI Web* who were cosseted silk bawd men amen el die bet, that a great patios ef 11101 be ties enontry wee held seaminess for Uses ream. ebb is purest y, end this system had given rise to great abuses. The semis we, in fact, the owes of the WA, bet could net mat it as his fee simple ; the essectsnage bad been, th at ray vexatious and expensive Mistier bed taken pleas ; end by an set pined 19 & :0 Os. 111., celled ot The Vow, an seemes wee made to w 1,7 a =That se, brews. seamed le have seemed tea es ; sits were dillinstitaleiteMl the Court el Mae en led held het that alert meet &We, in ask }slimier ewe, whet was he reagemble time whir! slienld slope &halt of application bears the lessor waa judged in rides beg te grant • reseed. This was act the ealy evil, fre the seepien efts granted sub.lemise, aid the eassesease we that it was almost impossible te had eat who wee the sal ems ef tbe ioU. TM noble sad Issued lad thee referred te the minims of Lord Clan, Lord Redeselale, and the Eel el Devon's eseunission--all esedereasory of the *Satin system. Ile object of the present bill wee te eases Item holds la perpetuity Ste freeholds—to make it empalmiey On the owner, from whom he Is.. mast primed. te grant, en certain emulidess, berimle title to the Ilse; sad this would be dos by the eery provided in the bill, as to asid he spumes of a suit. It was proposed that a fee fern rent legend te rescued, which should - be re. enverable by the lord in the same way as any other rent. There were may other details, all tending to effect the mine purpose, with which he would not trouble he his... The whole subject was worthy of emaideratios, and he tutted their lordships would give the bill a second reading. Lard BEAUMONT thought the machinery of the bill we unaseesearily complicated. lie objected to a fee farm mat because it would run ell over the land, and thought it weedd be better that the les or should have a portion of the bad. Lord MONTEACILE felt obliged to his noble and learned friend for the efforts he had made to Improve the state of sal property in Ireland. No one said be more favourable, ge the bill Introduced by the noble and learned lord Ime see. sits than be war, and he also approved of the prised* ef his bill. He thought, however, that es strong a ease seal& be made out against copykold tine» in England se aghast perpetual leases in Ireland; gad he did not believe the bill Mehl effect the object el tagaing emespders of land in Inked late owners. He hoped some assiderable time would slaps before the bill went into eammittes, be eider that the seem et the people of Ireland Med be Maimed an the sablest. The Bail of WICKLOW butted die *ebb gad burned lord would not stead the time se meek is le endeager the panda, of de bill this wake. The asses seemed to be well Wended ; but be thought it wield be deirable to give Se tenants the power of purchasing ea resemble terms. Lord REDESDALE approved et the bill eepremly ea the ground that if parliament wished te free bed in Inked dash's, whisk did est add is Enabled, It Mee be neemeety pus sash a ea m 5. Ha objeeted to tbe gimes reserving timber, Meese ke did sat es how am sea meld leas thither oa another man's estate. Ns the was given by the bill to the lessor for the value of the Lad, *ad this he essidered a defeat Lewd CAMPBELL had been afraid Sat gene alum would be created by the bill. but he had endeassed to quiet it. The principle ef this bill was that when there was • tenure it land which was confessedly mischievous, if that tenure scald be changed without Wary to any person who had an lateral in the land, • change should be made. There could be no doubt that the system of perpetual leases was most mieddevous balk to the tenant and to the lord, and should of the lee importaace that the teases in question be reamed to the satin of what was Galled tenure in some. The bill bad been very carefully persd, sad it meld, he trusted, before loop receive the ford asset. After a law words from Lord MOVNICASEML, The LORD CHANCELLOR replied. TM bill was them reed a sewed time. Lord WHAENCLIFFE moved for certain stares cm the sabjecit She navigation laws.—Agreed to. Theis lordships adjouned at sues o'clock. SOUSE OF OOMMONS.—TnuitsDAT, APRIL N. Thu Sra•zia twat the chair at 4 Welsch. PRIVATE BUSINESS. SECOND READING.—DuIdia, Labours', Blum aid Drogheda Roads Act Continued= sad Ansendraeat Bill. PUBLIC BUSINESS. PETITIONS.—By Mr. FAGAN, from Cork, fa inquiry fate the esudidos of charitable mats is helasil—Mr. DUNCAN (3), from Ayrshire ; Mr. LOCKE, has the aorparatiou of Edieblegb, is favour of the ilwallay Towel hag as Railways BilL—Mr. 811OLLETT. from Paisley. Paloksbews. mad othar . pl2 .... at! Mr. HUMS. hoes Arbroath; Sir 0. GREY, fres ;a gainst the Suoday Travel hag on Railways BiII. 7 :IC.7)I7NCAN, has Apasbire and Dubai; Mr. COWAN, several from Aulttenrcier sad tabor pieties ; Mr. HUME, has Arbroath; a *be Eaciaratke of Bertha, &e., and Mseriages (Sesdead) Bills.-14. DUDES (27), host places Is Lest. au. c 4 oSriwltauul distrea.—Mr. WYLD, tress &ni mbi, far the release cif Mr. Shore ; she has Luna ties' Prised Society, for as sammthasat se the law relat ing to hteatisa.— Ca l . THOMPSON, bees Bradfind; Mr. lI.OIBSON. several. from Lateneldre. is brew of arbi tration treaties. CROWTHER. Orem edisers of lex 40111011.-411/ W. boa Vas Lisiward mire is Sneer toad Diwasn's he peer W tresepsetads• et is that waraiy.— MDtraLiy, hem Stalked, he as alteration of tie eons law s . — lam 11r. A. HASTIM, hum Gleagew. infirm, of the BBL !MICE OF MOTlON.—Paisoic Ducarinti.—Mr. O. PEARSON, an the 11ck of May, to neve Is. • select asaiwills• Ss bagairo Late prises discipline, with the view be tie mispdat al a• sal/am system. PartitArmirriat Rarotta.—Mr. HUME reposed his amities ea the staged of perliasseatary reform hos the let to the 13th ef May. DUBLIN. Asinotrumg, SLANE, AND DROGHEDA ROADS ACT AMENDMENT BILL. Os thematic:a that this bill be read a second tine, Mr. REYNOLDS moved that it be read • mead tins that day sis maths. The Imes added—the amebas were: For the essead reading Agana it The bill was thus read a seemed tine sad ordered to be scinaittad. PUBLIC (SALAAM. Mv. MUM mid le hod Ores settee of the fellawbg Med= . Ilat. es its pima deers toed sad arida alt IMO= era te law raw rla Mr yew 1797. Me it s et Sit beer. whit area lentring the tedrediture i seemer7, eel ad Wardle/ nest Ikea tartist. Oat Is all argelerrelt le Met ellta Or rite. et base eel area& the Warta iambi le= Ihr et weft art IMMO dridiret le *opal& te haste lir Writer Or te res. Thatirtri= et Ode was thr a emir Ma iehime took, dwell le aaM ilisifter wear of pimem ineloyal la the wed et to rate at hare mil ilealloy net celled = "l. delelmrt ere /tea rarrea le lp s liesenter, tress a essessisketion with ens et her Ma he hoed that the subject wee under ra t M die he would not at resist prepeee Ni media. PASSENGERS IN MERCHANT VESSELS. Mr. J. O'CONNELL asked the President of the Beard et Trade whether it wee the Winston of = saes, to Wag in any measure se to wish% th e et passe s~isaels aseshant vsesele, between sakes piss et the Hnitcd " se esy peas. fhe seestrasse ed each selaralues as °salami es board lie lastesiony aselaw. Mr. LAROUCEIRE Wasted the tan. madams that the movernaent were apply* their best slaseles to the subject. NEW HOUSES OF PARLIAMENT. Mr. COCHRANE asked Mr. Gums whether thise was any probability of the Howe of Cammea Wag see* tie She reception of numbers by the lielliS awe; glow a night not be reedy if a haler pent were mat ter the jaw post • what asoust would sae& oath le he ellheled t mai wheels? s peat sidasts seals Wen set he ellainal b s sore liberal aunt leeks the pent year I Mr. °KERNS NU that the new geese of OSMIUM ib It would be reedy fir the oreepetin el isinthees by the mesh. of 15 0, bee esewhig M Ile preast sivespasste sew of the Alois, era es the View, the sehalment Num few ise/rem stir the nee et wee sew. would be away. 7ba who* b•wwww, et these alms rent be set reedy, sad the ham ellseedier lbw iced he the esemete dation of sessines, by the way of seee et WSW be yond the sesseet hew valet el the perpesaffils per ; there was se doubt thorn the eriMay el the owe De grant this year would be the Imes efa emidutelie titioste airtime. Mfi.cOCHRAILL node sub dipermonem, woad pat it to the soli' lord egpsite whether it would not be taped eat to peat the haprisis. (Hear, hem.) Lord J. RINIKELL eider amesat of peat would rga=meek eiguloesi by sspostive patties of the issues sod espasilleoe kr the par. (Laughter.) Mr. COCHRANE NM he maid onicely tote this l'ce isk NNW/ se his leseiles. Ladd J. RIIIMELL fedi Nay teasel the Nam?. doubt is this. este way ears &amour ofs bul' A g as ie as a seehriel ossomay right be b- alma • WA Uths lree were to vote ao taae ois sad 100," shore for the:" el w an " e t bona ellipittitere would be laset;adowly a smie d. EUSINESS OF TETI nom. Ltd J. ainggillemaia that, mews winsome sodas allisekli ea ON 1 0 Ow vbit s a soma likely to occupy the &Mutes 01 ,,_ 10 '• Mass edit evil, be thought it would be bettor_ fog. ara at &Ms M prime diet the eimatittee on the Beta is a:4 BM amid be peilgosed tfa teaierrow (this d4rtThe bowie hada; ipso through the ocanatities on .y, he should wpm that the report bo received Om PP.:lley, %Rag It it pima& that there enseild be no die t armies ea the esimies. He Amid then props, to take** tidal Nalikellinsodsy, mad the discussion which he under stood ineral podia's& coatemplated could be had then. PARLIAMENTARY OATHS. Lewd J. RTRISELL stated is reply to Mr. Augusta' Shard, that he intended to prowl with the Pulls:seater, Oaths Bill on Monday se'anight. CONTRACT PACKET SERVICE. Oa the mocks of Mr. HEMLIBY a select committee on this subjest was greeted by the goevrameat. POOR LAW AMENDMENT (IRELAND). Lord J. RUBBELL tees roes to Wig forward the bill of which he bad given notice, the hoe. umbers who had priority over him in the order of business, and more especi ally Mr. Olean, having waived their right of pennons. Toe eels lord said—l me, pursuant to the se whisk is on the pryer, to more for leave to bring in • bill to amend the aces kr the more effectual relief of the destitute poor in Ireland. I weed at a former period of the mission, the gamed intre of the amendments which I have to pelisse ha the present Irish poor law ; and it is now neeemey for me to state farther that although the unnesithes that is sew Unify en the subject of Ireland has been yin Ypessemith wry intentions, I have not thought create se tbe umuthen of that committee to come to any with respect to them, as they nil ban to take eel dense epos the subject. What I new wpm, is entirely sa the Ability of her Majesty goverement. nen are some edam palate which 'manse to be lewiththall yen, but I have an 'thought peeper to mash on them ha this messan, as the been will probably be called upon to paw • thiseran with respect to them during the rumen year. TM AM real I most inspection alteration in the Irish poor-law whist I pro pees to offset is the introduction of the principle of a mod- MUM tat. is the eleetetal divisions of the poor- law steins. This must be admitted to be en tiedy satiety to the prindples of the pear-laws, as they me administered in this country. It is assumed se a ORO* in England that pauperism mast first he relieved by • nee for the support of tke confirmed poor, sad next • sets to est to work able-been laborite's. Bet in Ire where the greatest possible depot of distress sad Kandy ilsed mists, there hes bees es sistiesows sad so Mary a peus eame es the mill Summit human sad Ohm peered of gr ipe., ea to create • holes of alarm, sad le peseest the addend's of ON land. Those thelthise ▪ thesmalm the eases of en increased proem of Ms pawl rates. he they osmium a went of seem he the esp. ply of Ile pees' rotas` sod thry drape ram unmet efiesepatioa, sad eeesseuratly earemen Memos Is baseas puma. It wee thwahes essaidered advisable by Ur. Twidetea, the chief eammirasser of the poor-law be belesd, to propose that a thanimunt ate be adopted son there, and what I have :r le pose is, that is them re IaI X mending 6e. in the shall be vied is my me year in any electoral dirk on in Ireland, without at the UM time ailing the other electoral divisions in the mum union to contribute to make up the amount required to the eaten of 2a. in the pound more •• the electoral division en rthis additional rate woold have to contribute Ile la t a h a t ill esil, sral ropprofsg that such electoral divides es 7e. be the pees& for the charges of malataiski the roar in any tea. yen, that electoral division would Iseteemide Date its 6s. lathe pound and thea the additatheillan *opined whilst the other electoral divisions in the =lke 11111dli hews to pay 2s. In addition to the 6s rates impend ups tisk electoral dieisioes. The rates in the earlier per law mime of Ireland are very different. In one inane'. I know at a fernier in an electoral division in a Tipperary miss, nee pays 2s. ed. in the pound, whilst in other divi sions in the same union little or no rates are paid, there be no surplus or unemployed labour In them. I may be told that the effected this enurement will be to Indus 1101119 eke- Coral division to spend all the money they can get by paying their Is. rates. in order that they may tome upon thew neighbouring electoral divines for the additional rate of 2a. But I mann think that this will be the case, for it is obvious that if the poor in any elesteral division can be supported by a de. rate, the rate-payan need not run the expense up to 7s. merely for the purpose of getting their neighbours to pay an extra 2s. rate. I own I think it advisable to levy a rate in an electoral division, which skull net exceed a certain amount. The guardians of the poor have a control over the expenditure, and they would prevent a wasteful outlay. The case is a totally different one from a rate In aid. The main objection which has been urged—and it is one which I confess mirries great weight with it—is this, that there may be in certain unions a total inability to defray the expense of maintaining the poor beyond the amount to which the rates are to be limited, snit therefore, as nn more than 21. sea be levied in any sae year in any poor law anise, there Rust be a deil thew la the as required to feed the poor. Bat. on the ether head, we find now that there are many union in the wen where a 10s. rats is struck, out of which only 4s. is ale to be levied, and what we went to effect is to give the landlords souse security that the rates shall never ex ceed a certain sum, and thereby to give a stimu lus to the cultivation of the land, which the i=t state of the law has entirely taken away. are other amendments which I have to pro pose Y the DM Poor Law. One of them is that the corn mieduans shall have the power of settling the vast liabilities west seen of the poor law unless are now under, by re hash!' the eldest of these sales'. There is a report extant hum the beesdery commideseve appointed last year. I asset sew erase into thee imbleet, hat I may ray t that the an may Se Mop the Mem hp he aides beeradray sod to the peer law mommiiiimilimihe Pam of combs they bats Milt. At IM emss thra, I iEst saythat,havras sidtred . th. _quad's nLtlh+ to ad the spiked ingots* on that oddest. I as ann. to the gssioel ',Won that Mae M preer• with It wish see be gondol to sake any hither dtlia of the peeviser *ism without at the ems thee pm nWhiled workhouses. I *di, however, de . andirstion of that coldest sew, se it ft one whisksinits of a graded shin* I bet I seat at the sees line lay that, ea a gems'silo, whenever a new pew , ire &Mien is erected, a new weelftenes will have se he 'There win ease be a donee iamb* k the I bilissekiles the Poor law Uoseeiefsuts to sulikehie rese ls* mime mod to west sew workkiesse whom aesenny. These will dee be anther dune enabling she souses of !mid pospiely in Inland to dant a poputies of the pens' rise psi& es their land bon hintares sod Nab- omit assumed ea their rentals, and I the pewees to elbet *0 theisge es the poieciple that as theme estileimonh eel =e in* without any refereaes to the Lei being with a ins rate, and whoa the law wee May Motet hen what it sow Is, it is only fek Is woke die pens& of the lend pay equally all berth's. that base skis been *posed ea it. ratite jointures sell mellisnente we, denies, be regulated *wording to Wei I hike WHIMS ea OM lead. I propose to Rohe an ingoselesil alleselies In the oeiginel Irish poer-law, in respect to the I =Mastics Son the sate in spa so ' th e I II wee knob& that YU the rates druid be by es* pleb the lendiord and the tenant : bat es east I bee set ben posened, I popes it *ell be 'edded thee I the Ins* shell k Ware pay belt the este, bat that it be levied epos the whole of the sent foe irbidi he is liable. The best way of waft the Milinades end *silos that have best posh* will be to glee the tame the power of der I bake the ether half of la isle hen the natal, and es *Dew el so hother baud* whets:ens With in wet te the impareeneeds k ankh& mad in ems. kg annisildbegs es Id* Imaged NW% it his bees hued that the erten of demr#ng peers** ups hams* ware el these bah* the east et delenkg haikeis ken The essersdearn *sad" w* in been be* the pew* of one=g ape so* kepasemens from being Ma to the Me of seven yeas after they *ell bees = mak I essesive en ledneenent will he le hope* the of hone end W os& onstfag fors bnifilega Imam alteedkali& preeent law which I peeping to :aka is, that press he the of enema el - peer rata shall have the sleet of a 1 :11 .9 2 dense, ad diet le shell be belt se el equal nds• saw with &Jelinski el die wieder esowle. Asaiher of Ike pushier) of this hill will side to the cat palmy isle of hails for the sneers of poor stn. The quakes le, mho is liable for the peor's-rats., sad who, es the 'Or ern tiel bend, is themesa laving j an intent le the had/ It y smut Is nil Is be task kid. moods. whisk - is esotherse,shwalil bush ust to pay** moonlbe M pestreeles. I have not thought poor to deal with thin =k this Dill, bat I base requested sy hon. mad 1 11 11deak the edisher-goserel, le kens a predelea k = wasi neens, wbeemby the ale el laud, uo andi as in %Ina be regulated. I prepese.es as usagesemat of the Mee, that the ism shau ben the Prone of =L e t a civil NB halm" and of hasalletsly u=g tonant. I Wiese I base new tbe eke payload*. el tbk nuelnie, but the WO sews selleteral poise whids as I have eke*, Meted, it is sot ny Week* to iodide within lite penes bill. In ny bad Inind le quite equal le** nelationnee et has pore in soon et MI wry }sheiks Isle* I wee einpokod W hallos koh l.g ago some her Joe r ay . bst, that the numbs of &inhale' pose as the is Inlaid last rear was se gnomes See 70,000: ht laalaail,is the year up the wee woo. The proportion k Inked is sr ably esseecr, sandhi te the smug a/ neseinguLsos in Megised, bat them the sonsity sad findeiwilie pee grog eirdwilisk period is than aeon* Irolaad will more n* fir Thfinlite it is, I mod widsa that under the nee y eineeiskase of the inm3so mad potato-rot, the ramilese et ele-beked be enspieted eat of the Bold= Iso. at ell ee be Ivanhoe& et. My build the *she yens, Wend has skews keredf to be quits able to sipper. her ewe pew, and with then obiersibes I beg Lew to sees kr have to being in the bill whisk I have dessibed. - - The gentles beim( seseeded sad pat from the dude, Mr. STAFFORD add the gnat halt whkh had chaise- Meisel doe muse* Iris! ' ot - Wry! * me t a t a me I N A boss eto upped pagoo'_,__ ....k aa So buns el •`" •••°"'••••••-• Trim* , dlfild this ips• .e auto ; se the.% owingeg be ho u slidass l so . '. a ssumed. oiling had be ss esd. ile omens& 1 . ..e• the peeper*. between eaplial and upeaMe.; err, d Weer wer the population was wry rapidly rerallowleg ap what of meta wee yet left ( Hear , hear.) That bdag Rlt weal be impetrate for the mask lord to go as palish- Ind up his Irish peer law, be the very simple nano, that there would be sbertly no material left for hiss to trek upes. leek us already the can at present in a pat of Inland, and he evoke advisedly when he aid that through out one her* el the whole ormady the 1184111 w sums sompletslyembereded• sad Mine by sztranesuudgeloggehas the lives @Me Meddles souldbe w 6ussewei. negegloleed commenced klespmekby dealing aneletbsgmesatgur tied, that of the medium rate; and beundeseleaddle agile l o w to may that though he was remind Upset *e= of a .anima. rate, the me Mae Me a bound to the nun of se. annul &via= er ht. oaks ode, That was a very *portent point ; but the noble lad did not say, and it was a great omission, what was to be dew when the rates in say *stored division exceeded ye. is the pouad. (Hear, hear .) When that maximum should be restaged and th e Is. should be ashausted, than be wonted to know from what grant was the poverty of the district to be supported. In connexion with this part of the subject, hew ever, he mast *pus it apes the noble lord that there was one. thing of infinitely greater importance even than the amount at which the meant= rate might be fixed, and that was, its catmint (Hear, hug.) Let them fix the rate at what they pleand, but whatever they did they mud willed it. With reaped to the area of taxation the nail lord stated, that he intended on the whole he adopt the report of the boundary commbelemes Whether they adopted that report or not, apposed to him (Mr. Stafford) to be practical. a matter of little SPEW quests, as he did not erectly see to what it tended; but be must repeat what he had said on former ocoolons, that us. less the area of taxation were made far smaller than it wee at present, they would fail altogether in seeming erg geed effects from the poor law. (Hear, hear.) The may mane tonsure the good working of the poor law was to make it • adman, to labour, and unless they did that, they would swamp the property long before they removed the poverty of Ireland. The noble lord did not state that he prop to alter the in of the wines; and whilst on this port of the question he was reminded that the right boa. baronet the member for Taatworth, in his speech upon the rate is aid, complained that the unions had not repaid the debt et 1,100,0001. whist was owing for work..onme. Hewithed the house to recollect however the cinuatetanees wader whisk these workhouse were built. They were erected on the Iret introduction of the poor law, without the slightest reterence to load guidance as to their site, their in. or construction. Subsequently they were found to he exceedingly ill-built, and many of them bad to be enlarged, so that a great part of the money which might have been devoted to the re-payment of the loan was upended in enlarging the workhouses. (Hear, hear.) Haley determined upon increasing the num ber of mine, as recommended by Captain Larcom, and building additional workhouses, then he asked where was the mean to come from? He certainly thought it would be hard, first to give the poor law commissioner power to pro nouns with reference to Abe alteration of anions without consulting the guardius, and power to compel the guar dians to raise money for building workhonees, and then for the house to turn nand upon the guardians and complain that they would not return what they had borrowed from the imperial treasury. With the view of preventing this, be should rouse a clause Ia committee pro viding that the opinion ot the guardians should be taken in referees, to proposed new unions, and that if they these to make new unions they should be auth•rised to 'negotiate Maas as best they might for that purpose. (Hear, Lear.) He understood the noble lord to say that the rate hence forth wee to be equally divided between the occupier and the owner of the land, adopting the system at present ht force in Scotland. In his opinion, however, it would be preferable that the tax should bear some proportion to the amount of rent paid, and that persons occupying at above a certain rent should pay the whole of the rate. He had un derstood that in any future bill for the amendment of the peer law there was to be a clause giving additional facilities be emigration, and enabling electoral divisions if they =lt to levy an emigration rate. The noble lord had to allude to any such clause, but he hoped that it had net seeped the noble lord's attention. (Cheers.) Re lining mess 'phi before be mat down t o the sire of the arca of treed.. be weld starve that he bad the authority 'of the alleNNlali. artably not a protectionist Marna, for suing that the narrowing of the area of taxation must be reword as the *iodation of any amelioration of the peer kw. What he end those who acted with him intended bll NIMMUIeII sad to squad by was, that it should be sn in dultam MOM boundary enamissionen as nearly as possible to assimilate the electoral divisions in Inland to the aver age sin of parishes in England. (Hear, hear.) He did not wish to interpose further to prevent the rate in aid being proceeded with ; but he had felt bound to throw out the ob• servations be had made for the consideration of the noble lord and the house. ( Hear, hear.) Mr. FAGAN admitted that the poor-law, as at present working in some districts of Ireland, was eating into the capital, and that the proportion between population and capital was daily becoming widened ; but he thought that' that bad arisen from the abnormal condition in which Ireland was placed after several years of famine. (Hear, hear.) If they had not had a poor law in Ireland for the last three years how would the population et the country have been preserved ? The noble lord bad again introduced the vexed question of the area of taxatin. Some of the swat intelligent witnesses who had been examined before the °Dm missy altogether opposed the view adopted by the :ea • lord. It was perfectly true that the area of taxation might be a stimulus to employment, but it might also be a stimulus to elearanees. If introduced into the ooutry it must be accompanied by the law of settlement. Lord BERNARD said that as to the area of tandem, he thought that question to be the root of the whole mischief. He trusted that the noble lord would take measures to carry out railways to *veep:to of the country where they did not at present east. Mr. P. f3CROIGI said that the improvements introduced by the noble lord had Menace to shifting the burden of taxation, to improvement in the collection of the rates, and the administration of the law as regarded the rats payer ; but what he wanted to see was some improvement in the law as regarded the interests of the poor themselves. It was *useable to deny that the poor-law as at present adminietered, was a most inefficient protection to the poor. He would oaly allude to the immense evictions ring en, in some puts of Ireland, and he saw no rowel for shearing them horrible eases. What wore the facts m t• the Kibosh Union as reported by the poor law inspector ? Fourteen thousand human beings had best turned out of their bums and left without shelter of a el ai r klad, and no power existed of affording relief to these h beings by giving th em shelter of any de scription. e boards et guardians might gin outdoor re lief in food, but they mold not provide lodging. Daring the whole at lad year 9,000 or 10,000 of these - beings bad been trying tosiseltor themselves under hurdles or in dry ditches. He hoped the noble lord would take into desitieration the MUM, of allowing something in the way of lodging or some somas of procuring shelter for the hosteler Mr. Mr. N. /12111111 ET erreaded that sod*, bad gfvp a greater impedes to the clearance system than the greet dm at the &stool adems The in England arrest about 2,000 is each, each, while is Irelan uses d some scatekted as many as 50 000 MM. He wanted to know why it was that i such inequality was wooridered necessary ? With respect to the present ball, he feared that its only effect would be to aggravate the evils already existing. For his part he would Shy knee rather have the law as it stood at prima. (Hear.) lir. H. GRATTAN said that there were certainly some goad points in the noble lord's measure, but it was not sal ghat to take them out of their difficulty. The noble lord had, to semi extent, admitted this; and had alluded to seethe MIL Why had not the noble lead submitted his white ere at ones to the Mum i Some tatmut seen be dime, sr destrustion would e rompares. The pidlypeople were loving,loving, and the ra Win slaking to tbair level. In reanaught T th wee. all beakrupth to Meurer they were needy so, e Pepe was sprain to Limn end Ulster. Talk of migrates I Had way ere wee herd et • oreany with hattesa milling et awes ef stable lead he et whisk were out of ealtiesties, and ends:alba suggsrat se • remedy I What theeiro t :ted was empleprat at hems, sad kr was the et Cleplein lesiedy and all who were :re at an giros_ on the edger. The mein it the Niel et Leland was shouresim. Wherever than wen a miler prepektary the peeE i rere asellped, was preperwm, and were eentented. , bser.)- Why not riles the bob mammy be Irish by • tar spa etreetess ? Bad • tax bed been proposed many years before by the km. masher fir Montrose, and would now he mess amebas ties ever. As to kissing Sne ll* spirals to settle In Ireland, he hared that that wee • moot shimmied project. (Hear, hear.) DM the t her brand p eeper to emu out his new plat If e r al Al of that of ZhuJames ? What was to be W the new proprietary ? The right kon. baroset Imil Meld them that; bat if they wanted - an answer they Weld find it by goingg to Covent garden Theatre, is the 5, White Horse of the Peppers." Having traduced the land. leis, sad beaten down the value of the land, they now to take it hose them altogether—to drive them out, t if they liked, or to boll if they deserved it. Did they • k the Irish people would submit to be so treated ? Did they suppose that by sub a course they would ever be able to dispense with the promos of an army et 411,1011 NM is Ireland ? They talked to the Irish people of **Metes et eatreliancie, but they took from them the mesas of self reliance. Biz B. PEEL—Sir, I am sorry that I have baud the pitof the hon. gentleman. lam extremely sorry that y miaortune to have bra jpriesseduring the delivery Act speech ; but having band it, I should be still men eery It I allowed it to pass without *bogie make some oh' senedime spas it—(hear4ear zat —ead thing! I was most un willing to Warps@ soy to be Lon. and learned teatime& the Solicitor he Wining , forward a smarm whia I knave to be et be to Laked—the new bill lbw ihearkg tre si rbleor=:m. brad estate in that 'se ntry, _ I keug ht heus, would prude me bass IMO UM khan erred to have the op- Melatof restityleg some peamierspeseretions which all told•—••••• VW IRlWAglariala which have pekes& with regard to dr sespieliens I ratared to offer ens *tsar essestaa for the relief end impressment ot Ire toog—oson theos)—magestiens whist I oared k se aptrit of posy beam ir bike le ambler= *moent Nars liiihr )mil dnifft* . in* a et the deepest sympathy for the seisrbegardition dent entry, and la she irk hope el elmtributier something to the per manent undierstien et Ike Li* people. (Meek) But, one • of al the snimenespben white Mr take ghee, Le only one I shall wise b Ibill et the his. pantlemen vhs bee just spoken--s abliesegMla el Ss MEN& ilifeligas, sad seamor -- which is Winkled.** mks a deep feeling la Initial, sad Wilk I wield ese possibly listen to end mania afloat, for fres that the lateness woeld be draws that havisg laud suss it,--he s viaci umar berm eist preler isossodou t when i t . was that epoke l mi me d rema in ed iss* lsr that so.e,doS, that Ikr s. o..nt acquiesced ie its trath. (Cheers.) The hon. Rudman sews to @appose that I made some preparition, in a enti re& spirkler the ptepees of the Roman catho lic vies them of their pretest holdinp, for the pn'pase of la Wag a protestant population In their stead—l seed scarcely assure the Muse that that we. the list intends. that could have entered my mind. The very last thief I should propose—the very last idea in my mind ho to substitute for the Rowe Catholic poreatioa is hiked ens of a different religion or different race. My hope wen to elevate the Ronne Whelk and improve his teed not Mgab MOO ISM political advantage by g him, led ialeadosing at his expense the mem ben of any other mood. (Cheers.) When did the hon. member hear from me that in case there should be a redis- Winks of property, the protestant. should have the ? (Hear, hear.) Was net I aware that there was = a ir Roman catholic capital In Ireland which cannot lad vast in consequence of the uncertain tenure of land Wes I not aware that olio of the great evils shown by the Ear( of Devon's consulates to exist in Ireland was that capital made in trade and manufactures had no means of developing itself In the inicrovement of the land —that those who had made fortunes in commerce and in trade had no opportunity of investing the-. fortunes in the land ? And did the hon. gentleman teepee that if facilities wen given her so applying this capital, the Roman ca. Anis merchant of Cork or Waterford would be excluded Items making those investments which he cannot make now all askant of the barbarous tenure by which the land is held? (Hear.) The hon. gentlemen says wish to drive oat the D ebility and landed gentry of Ireland — Mr. (RATTAN—That was the effect of the plea. Mr R. PIIIIL—No sir, I wish to drive oat no man. (Loud dieses.) I said distinctly that I did not propose that there ski& les say violation of the rights of propsproperty in Ireland; but what I with is this—if there are in some parts of the country persona who are mere nominal protestors, who have no reel interest in the land—man who derive a small berme from it, which is frittered away. not in improving that land, but in law expenses in Dublin—(hear, bear) — that if we as obtain facilities for rani* then from that enabenterkg condition, end transferring their estates to other perlieserhe will perform the duties which the pos. noise el land impale, I am net Injuring, but benefiting these bee Needs, eW at the same time conferring a great ad enines me the country, by enabling men with sew capital, web lOW hopes, new aspirations, and new feelings with re seed to the application of capital, to become the occupier' , to all Mien to which they can occupy, consistent with a due repied to the rights of property, of that encumbered and practically vacant soil. (Cheers.) Injure the Roman ca tholic peasantry of Irelaad by the immure I proposed! Why, did not I hear the right hon. gentleman the Chancellor of the Exchequer say the other night that after four years of SUCCII4III famine no lees than 15,000 persons in one union were driven from their houses and thrown upon the world helpl. se and homeless ? (Hear, hear.) Is that the state of things the bon. gentleman (Mr. Gretna) would wish to re. tan ? (Cheers.) I ask you now, in Algiers or in the Punjaub, after some successful military operation', or la any part of the civilised or barbarous world, will you show me a country in which 16,000 people have been thine helpless end homeless from their dwellings and exposed le the inclemency of the weather ? (Hear, hear.) And tide in one union only. I ask, will you show me a parallel to that case in any part of the world ? (Hear, hear.) When I heard that statement I dwelt upon it is my mind in the hope that it could not be true, and that some contradiction would be given to it. (Hear, hear.) Let us consider the strength of these people diminished by four successive years of suffering and starvei Lion, and that not in twenty or ten, but in one union, 1.5,000 human beings were driven out by ejectment. and legal processes, helpless and homeless upon the world ; and when in such a state of things I off red sums- tiona, my main object being to remove from the minds of the people of England, prejudices which might not unnatu rally remain after the Arne expenditure which had taken place—(bear, hear)—l feared that alter the expenditure of some nine or ten millions to rescue the people of Ireland from their difficulties, Irene might be an unwillingn ess tocontemplate the real magnitude of the su 'eft —(hear, heir ) — and my object was to remove that prej u iee. (Cheers from both Weal I cared nothing about, my plan, or about my suggestion, my object was to harem on the mind of the House of Com mons at the time, that, notwithstanding your vat oditure, it wee your interest, not only In point ounite, but that it was your interest in point of policy, ail as on pecuniary considerations ' • that it was your cats tenet to apply yourselves to this condition of Ireland, fa eseiparison with which every other consiletatiork believe no, is subordinate. (Much cheering.) 81 far as English men are concerned, look at the prospect for the future. There is no question so important—not the navigation laws, nor any other question—of all the questions that can be brought under our consideration, not one approaches this in point of importance. (Hear, hear.) And what I mid was, if yen can, consistently with what is just to those who are the nominal proprietors, but really the ie eambrances of the estate —if you can facilitate the transfer of this land to others who have the means to enter, and who will enter, upon It with new views gad new hopes, not only will you benefit those who are in this miseeable condition on account of the encumbered position of these estates, and the existing legal difficulties of their transfer,but you may pos sibly lay the foundation, not for immediate—for I contemplated that—but for the ultimate,permanent improve meat and better order of things. (Hear, hear.) And, sir, after the fullest reflection, I retain m conviction, that all your other measures—your rates in ai y d, your alterationsin the poor law, your advances for railways—will all do posi tively nothing, unless you can remedy that which I believe to be the great social evil of Ireland—(hear, hear)—the difficulty of effecting the transfer of land to the pos session of those who are competent to discharge those ditties which the possession of land involves. (Cheers.) When I spoke of the settlement of Ulster I knew per fectly well the construction which would probably be placed on my words. I knew there would be those who would say you are proposing now in the 19th century that which might have been tolerated in the 17th. I knew that it would be said, what are you to do ; do you propou to drive out the Roman catholles to Connaught or to Hell ? to Connanght certainly not ; for that is the very district with which it is prop:sed to deal; and the ether plus wee the last I intended—(hear, and a laugh) aad I said that I wee aware that the fatal blot in the pion of James 1., was that it established religioae distinctions, and Ev ia s m rligious preferences; that it sought to expel the esthetic inhabitants, in order. to introduce those of seeker relish*, on whose allegiance ft wee supposed there were greater elan.; and I said this foe the , express purpose e i s v f&reveating the possibility of being subjected to the charge new, after an interval of three weeks, the hon. gen. dome; prefers that I had some sinister object in view—that I desired to expel the Roman Whelks, for the purpose of substituting a protestant population. (Hear.) Sir, I had no each object—(chans)—but what I wished was by mistier/ a demand for labour to give to the Roman catholic peasant the opportunity of obtaining self independ ent.. (Cheers.) The object I had wee to secure to him, if potable, Is. 6d., perhaps Is. a day ; and that, after all, is the foundation of all other improvements. (Hear, hear.) I sever believed the doctrine by which HAM attempt to re lieve thensalves from the obligation which attaches to them; I never believed that the Celtic population have an inherent standalone hi their character, and that the Irish labourers an sexless to avoid work. I take those men who come over hen time to time to obtain labour in this country, and I ask any 'Wiseman who has met then on the nail, or is the field, and conversed with them, as I do, Wider he has not left then with feelings of admiratin of flak err speedo' politeness, their natural intelligence, end with the envied= that the God of nature could sever have Wended rash nun be esrfs4 ((Hear, hear.) It has beset end that they are a turbulent people, sad that no laws em restrain se improve them. I ask, can you who see them is tins onaties, where they go to seek fn employment, find um more ebedisnt to the law—more prudent or torteuiag under, lem sorry to my, frogesatly much provocation ? can you lad me. mere intle or, or more desirous to save and re- mit we part of their earnings to their families at hams, et to pay their rest, sad to keep their families inc. the week bean? (Boar.) Is not this the unbend experiment of every Emilie member who has nanny' who with these men ? (Heal I diae, me Ibmi, than Marine that sledifeleses and inactivity are the dmillialle of the Celtic pepaistine. (Haar, hen) I =to be feeding a letter at the wry der the hen. with Broke to expel tile kennel% gni I : l =hi n. English protestant pregeieteis in their semi. I wee mile; letter—one of 7= hundreds I resin daily king an account of an E s mope y, and of the of their capital to rkh peopesq, and of the onesqieencee which followed. This liana English , who, I be lieve, got possession of their land at the time I have alluded to already—that of James I. This is an amen of the pro ceedings of the Drapers' Company—a moray which is entitled to a large estate under the settlement at James I. It appears that this Drapers' Company for a lag time bad been in the habit of granting leases renewable from time to time to a single family of the name of Rowley. In 1817, however, the leans fell out, and the company refused to re new it to the Rowley family. This company of English merchants, residing in London, with no intimate knowledge al Ireland, but inflamed by the spirit of Englishmen, and by the mass of justice of Englishmen, determined to make ea 'wir about the property. The state I. which they head is _ deseribed la the first fermi of deputation which they mat ow to being is 1817— The balk at Or nine belMbes ode be lessirlasratis polat el is ▪ ram It bat yam sabdadial are very mall. Moats a salsa mai suastimas aps as ark Wee( sad watatlyaloa at balm. Tam akin me sari arsa g aL s amat mastirsas with draw, at atbrir dale tab mat as sat us bat rangy walarillabt. she ssawast Ice the am. dam is a Isis la tree Nat Is mot he a caloney, et ether tine the doss serves es Or elinnel fro the sit of the ma* sad , bat not inhemellp, these e • minim Wane nit Welt is to o t oweled lo Ile me of des the boa, eel that pen le wild on le e On Is% hon. the peek es Tr yr& AM fink eons of leilieelq thee deleribel They grew amen, hat min pelseer. end nee Omens to elf& they friswerh ee ether nem Woo to be V ar with o r em is mo tits le ak j =old& le ssesin et Ito aura tare pow wilea sa ratitr ille moo is sa e tits tam Is wild* the mop; Mew en mow Nob. Th Lea niseenn to dem le rpm. ni men of any sort me ewer awn Rase of lbe new ambit Wit .I"aanisill. amisasianw ia: his bai sipssi be si mai s: ; obsimere eteit ua llePi L boolidip ti le mits alr 7 : bassay ielk ille ntrge lnin is s : allB: ers. 41inignaketbeilfellestampithet6=sdliellimumblernal; her ant e• awiars. as be lartval tam am: vas Us am OM Nig dleasenesed. Thiry ant as vat with . 160 Mk *NC sea 'oo h ben 6e seem af tint ost trees renniee of the euelinca of lb, ee. Ode es tisnolbed la the thoot met Onnholeble, sat o of cob. THE-. EXPRESS, EWIDAY EVENING' Aa'Rit 2 1 1, 1849, "dads' isfiseem seliame. oak enialie ado , " bave been easallatril Orr dale lOW. The Imes hoe been wand t h e Awed. kieseesi epees at Widow Me beenlatednosa, the elseed and isehlfills4leram awe Wm weft ita the 'adapts's. et Oa& gmeseamils be ask di sea leigreeNiNele, eel air erneilag tots- Oa et ad ememahays hiss dbalL ad here heat seed by= Masai exteinde ddistioes clamber. es well se trod had leen moikeal en now la a iloaridag cop st Betsy me% ths el mimes tag add Merle= fres ear hamlet Ws a promoted tells. Bat did die eonspeny passed in any safari= spirit? Yet they wed protestant' deeply attached. no doubt, to the k to= Did they neglect the wants sad claims of those aid firma than ? tio; the better lays: A Made &ask prabytedin wastkapheose bees Ism m ti at tho of the elioleolt, sal Mini isebilistlise midi he ft* Imelemset at the Mom ulnae &mak sail an masa Way pel e a . the aminsy to orb mildiast et eras to passe et Ilas lam ohs hit la the town by L edil ema i day en anl der mak sepisser wad; mil the amens tt les imemeed se mei es nada the selefAiddist al a twaaeh from add the Ildhit hooka I alight velar be edge somponies who palms Folterti to Ireland tinder shad skentsetances—the fidunongers', I am informed have taken the same oonise—and so far from en couraging notation spirit I look forward to great advantages as likely to arise from such an arrangement as introducing new capitol end energy into the country, and it is my firm conviction that the relation of the Boman catholic tenant with the holder of the soil will be greatly improved by it, end that a cordial cooperation between them, which is necessary for the well being of both, will be secured. As I happened to be reading this letter when the hon. gen. demo attributed to me the desire to substitute a protestant for the Roman catholic population, I could not resist the temptation of rising to repel the charge, and to rectify the misconceptions which have not been confined to the hon. gen tleman; but I trust I have satisfied him that the last object in my mind was the motive which the hon. gentleman has attributed to me. 1 will not longer interpose to prevent the hon. and learned Solicitor-General from stating what are the views of the government and what measures they have in contemplation ; therefore I will not notice any other of the misconceptions which have been uttered ; but I felt it to be impossible, having heard to great a mit-statement of my intentions as that I wished to drive out the catholic tenantry and put a protestant to :sentry on the soil, I felt that I could not, on the first oppor tunity afforded me, remain silent without giving it the flattest contradiction. (Cheers.) After a few words of explanation Item Ur. GRATTAN and Sir Paw., Mr. J. O'CONNELL said it was idle to talk of imposing a tax of as. in the pound in Ireland, as that so-termed pound had dwindled down to 13s. Sir Robert Peel's plan for the regeneration of the distressed portions of lirel.sud stood out in bold relief se compared with the paltry, peduling, tinker ing measures of the government, and worthy of immediate consideration by the legislature. Mr. O'FLAHERTY speaking from the opposition benches, said he could no longer support the ministry, because they would not wait for the report of the committee of the Irish poor laws before bringing forward this measure. Proposi. none for coercing Ireland had been successively and success fully brought forward by all parties, Ireland had been delu ded on all sides. and any section of the house tbat really in. tended to benefit his country, should have his support. Mr. BRIGHT was of opinion that the hon. gentleman who had st resumed hie seat, had done the house some in. justice. lie (Mr. Bright) admitted with him that coercion had been the rule rather than measures of real justice to that country. The right hon. baronet the member fur Tamworth had that night fully admitted, though not in so many words, that much of the present evil of Ireland was attributable to bad laws. All who had taken office, and all who held office, might take some blame to themselves in this matter. The right bon. baronet was doing now what was calculated to atone in some measure for that share in the mischief which he had in his long pohtical life been instrumental with others in inflicting; and he (Mr. Bright) believed that the noble lord at the head of the government— who, en the other aide of the house, had promised a great deal, aad who, on that, the ministerial side, had not done much—(hear, hear)—was new convinced that a more energetic coarse of action than had before been adopted wee now rendered necessary for Ireland. (Hear, hear.) For himself he could say that although he bel ieved he had found as much fault with the house as any hon. member in past times for its legislation with regard to the sister country, and es?ecially with referenes to land, he was willing now to forget pest differences—(hear, hear)—to let bygones be bygones — ( hear , hear) — and he hoped one aide of the house would not waste time in blaming the other, but that they would 1 one and all leave party squebbles alone, and. proceed at once to an honest consideration of this imp ntant sub jute (Hear, hear.) If he were disposed to find fault, lie could retort, not upon the hon. gentleman (Mr. O'Flap betty), perhaps because he was a young member of the bouts, but upon the Irish members gene rally, because, though they had been prone to find fault witk everybody, they had been 13 unfortunate in those' propositions they had attempted to submit to the house I that they were not agreed amongst themselves with respect to the propriety of them. This was one of the greaten misfortunes Ireland laboured under, and ho attributed it, in a great measure, to the state of the re presentation in that country, for the reform bill as regarded Ireland had been a sham and nothing more. (Hear, hear.) And though the Irish members at present in the house were excellent in their way—(" hear," and laughter)—yet he thought that if there was a free and full representation of the people of Ireland, the condition of the Irish representation would then be very considerably im proved. On several former occasions he had spoken to the Irish members on this subject. They admitted that they had not been successful in proposing measures to the house. Even this eerier' they were divided. (Hear, hear.) He thought the hon. gentleman (Mr. O'Fleherty) need not have gone over to the protectionist side of the house for the seasons he had stated, because when good measures ems- nated from either side, he (Mr. Bright) hoped that he should be always ready to support them, irrespective al party. (Hear, hear.) He thanked the right hon. bi roan :or the spiel. .3 had delivered on a former occasion, and itso for the speech of that eight, for, though there was no thing absolutely new in what - he had said before or now, yet truths the most common, if they were stated by the right hon. baronet or by the noble lord at the head of the govern meet, possessed an influence not only in Ireland, but fa Great Britain, and throughout the world ; tad the whole world, under such circumstances, were inclined to believe that to be astute which men of their character were disposed to recommend. He confessed that in his opinion, now, they had paned the time of difficulty with regard to Ireland, and that in future they would have a more sensible species of legislation adopted for that country. (Hear, bear.) Lord J. RUSSELL said there was one course which hon. members of that house might have taken, though it was somewhat incoavenient—namely, to discuss the several pro. visions of the present bill, and to point out their merits or demerits. Another course was, not to discuss the merits of the bill, but to have allowed him an opportunity of bringing it io, and then to permit the hon. and learned gentleman the Solicitor-General to explain the nature of the measure he was about to introduce, to facilitate the sale of encumbered estates in Ireland. But a third course had been to attack the government for not having introdeeed measures of a cer tain nature • and that he could not think a very reseonable course. (dear, hear.) He suggested, as it seemed to be the general wish of the house, that - l eave should be given to Inn in the bill, upon the understanding that its provisions should afterwards be discussed in detail, and that his hon. and learned friend the Solicitor-General should be allowed to ex plain the merits of his measure. (Hear, hear.) Sir H. W. BARRON said that he would not have troubled the house were it not for the attack which had been made the Irish members by the hon. member fee sae►eaer (Mr. Bright.) That attack would appear in the newspapers, and he (Sir H. W. Barron) was anxious that the antidote and the poison should be circulated at one and the same time. It had been enunciated in that house in • eery dictatorial manner, that the Irish members were not at Alto be attended to—(" Oh." and laughter) ; but that, for ma, Manchester was the school to guide the British mace mad the Irish representatives. Now, he could not agree to Manchester doctrine might ' be vary pidatable at Memekeeter, and it might be very agreeable in other so. =Mks in the north of England; but the hon. member fee Manchester ought to know that differences of opinion existed everywhere,' not mongol Isiah member alone, but among English members also. Without going further than the bench he saw sitting under him—(great laughter)—he might ask whether the hon. and right hon, gentlemen there were all speed in matters of public p olicy? He would tell these Manchester gentlemen th at they were excessively selforufficient—(laughter)—that their arguments had no foundation but that of the most absurd vanity— (loud laughter)—and that thinking themselves superior to all the rest of the world they believed that they could throw their taunts about spinet everyone who deed to differ from the Manchester school. He would tell the hon. member (111 r. Bright) that the Manchester policy had brought Ire land, in a great measure, to a state of despair, misery, and ruin, and that the following out of that policy was likely to lead to further ruin and misery in that oountey. (Cheers from the protectionists.) England might survive the shock by falling back upon her enormous riches, capital, and ma nufactures, but the landlords, tenants, labourers ' ind all in Ireland who had nothing to rely upon except the land, would be involved in one common ruin brought upon them by the Manchester school. (Renewed cheers from the pro tectionists.) Lave was then given to bring in the bill. SALE OF ENCUMBERED ESTATES (IRELAND) BILL. The SOLICITOB.GENikAL, in moving for leave to bring in a bill to facilitate the sale of encumbered estates in Ireland, said it would be necessary to explain and render in telligible the nature of the law at present with reference to the sale of encumbered estates in the sister country. The object of the law wu to effect the sale of these estates by means of two different plans united in the same Nll. One of them was by sale under the authority of the Court of Chancery, and the other was by sale, not under the authority of the Court of Chancery, but under which the porgies, money should be paid into the Coirt of Chancery, and then repaid after the estate had been sold. Now, both these would, up to the present time, to be wholly ffswfss6anl. Re believed that, totally independent of the IMINSTO itself, there had been peculiar circumstances 01:111111101411 with Ireland width bad made it very difficult for any ingesaire whatever te guessed. It wu essential to the seesaw ei ay plan that a slue of purchasers should ex'st, ' and there lad been very great diftulty, even in ordinary mass, of with clear titles, and willing to seU, being able te of their lands during the last twelve months ; and he did not attribute the failure of the bill altogether to the difficulties created by the measure itself. There were undoubtedly considerable difficulties imposed by its provisions, and great impediments had thereby been cleated. The impossibility of giving an immediate inch feasible title was one difficulty, but there wifosettigre:dohil;semelthrinitpoinurtibeiestattthefottlty netted with the payment into the Court of Chung and ai pet Unsinary impanel. He had endeavoured to abate these 0 evils by resorting to a nurse which undoubted' •V was are '0 mew, which had been suggested by several gentlemen, 'ad awcz fu "labli"ea nc t t i lons aluidwillaillire n bis o bs e n perf lisrl'inn o ed rin .dewor ed thitiche in mew°Dflai m . o a u t lil t dd ers euabhed i nb r the Court of Chancery, unfettered by the rules of proced ure • now existing, and without the expense arcing from fees, and also without that antiquated system which could not be mediately removed from the court. This noun wes net 1 without precedent, and in every case in which it was tried it seemed to have succeeded advantageously. The preeedent with which he was mist familiar was that of the West India • 1 commission. (Hear.) That commission had had t, dietri hate 20,000,000 i. among the owners of the West India estates, aid they had bad to perform duties analogous to • thou which would have to be discharged in Ireland. They had had to inquire who were the real owners, beams • the compensation was to Le given to the owners according to the extent of property, and they had performed their duties not only without blame, but with great rapidity and little expanse, and had given great satisection not only to those whose rights they adjudicated upon, but to the country as • large. He proposed to appoint a commission in Ireland, to consist of two paid commissioner and a secretary—that they should form a net of rules for their own guidance—that the.. rules should be submitted to the Privy Council in Ireland, and that when sanctioned by that council, and laid upon the table of the house, they should have the sam e force se if embodied in the act. These rules might be varied and altered; and when the commission was est.blished fn ' this manner, it would be their business to proceed to the principal duty they would have to perform, and they would be fettered from imposing any fees whatever on suitors. In considering the importance of this cemtnission and their duties, he did not propose to appoint it permanently, or foe more than a very short period, in order to:ste how it pro greased ; bat parliament, if necerieary, might prolong ite existence. He proposed that it should deal with matters pertaining to its proviuce in all cases of appl Cation made within three years; but it might be necessary that it should last some time longe r—perhaps for a period of two years after the final application for a sale should be made. He would invest it with all the points the Court of Chancery now possessed for the production of titles, 'out he did not propose that it should have any Amnions or duties to perform, except where applications were made. But wherever applications were made by the owners cr 10- cent:waivers of estates in Ireland, the commissioners should thereupon proceed to a preliminary inquiry ; and forthwith after that inquiry to sell the property. When tie y sold a property they should have full and complete power te sell it in such manner and portions as they might deem beneficial, just as that power was now exercised by the Court of Chan cery. It was proposed that the conveyance sht tad be in the form specified in a schedule of the act, and should so vent the promrtyiin the purchaser as to give him a good and indehasi ble title, that that conveyance should in fact form the TA of his title, beyond which it would not be necessary to step at any future time. (Hear, hear.) It was proposed also that the commission should have the same power of putting the purchasers in possession of the land as a sheriff now had in the execution of a writ of possession, and that it should not be necessary to bring actions of ejectment. (Hear, hear.) So far then as the measure related to the putties: r he should be put in possession se soon asjpossible, and by a title so simple as to render eviction upon title at any future time impossible. (Hear, hear.) It wes proposed that the ]purehase-money should be pia into the Bank of Ireland in the name of the commissi mere, and should be disposed of and divided amongst tee various persons entitled to it forthwith' and without any del ‘y. It was considered impolitic) to keep . the money for any l e ngth of time, as that would be introducing a new element in the relation between metgegee and mortgagor, and peeing the former in a position which he convected f tr. There fore was it deemed incumbeat on the commission to divide the proceeds of the sale of the property at once. Now in several eases there would be doubt as to the parties truly entitled to the money, and in their taw the commissioners must proceed to investigate sod determine the rights of persons respecting the pro. petty. Respecting several of the persons there would be no question, and those persons would receive their money at once. But as there would he questions as to who were entitled to particular incumbrancis, a part of the money would be set apart to satisfy that claim, and the rest of the money divided as he had stated. It was thorn. cally, although scarcely practically, possible that the lend of some person unknown, or not present in court, might be disposed of by sale; but it was thought sufficient to guard against so remote a possibility, by trusting to the scrutiny and close investigation of the commissioners. It was not in tended to retain any fund as a security spinet the contingent possibility of dipotong of the property of somebody of whom the court knew nothing ; for although titles in Ire land were not generally what were called good marketable titles, yet there was not much difficulty in ascertaining ill whom they were vested. The commissioners would, there fore, proceed to adjudicate upon matters with tolerable security that they would not dispose of the property of any person who was not heard before them. He said this more confidently, because in the case of the West India commis sion there was not, he believed, a single instance in the large estates examined into andldisposed of, at an amount reach ing many thousands, of any person whatever having com plained of the manner in which his property was cliepered of, or of the money having been wrongly paid. If, however, such a case should arise, lie supposed it possible that parlia ment would deal with it ; but there was not sufficient probs. bility of its arising to justify them in fettering with • pro- vision on the subject the measure he was about to introduce, and which he was sure the house felt to be essential towards effecting the regeneration of Ireland. (Cheers from both sides of the house.) For the purpose of adjudicating upon die puted cases, the commissioners should have the power of sending such cases for the opinion of the courts of law, or directing an issue to be tried by law, the'expense of litigation being confined to the particular parties interested. The commissioners would have this advantage in a great many cams of this description already examined into by the Court of Chancery; as it would be the duty of the commissioners to consider themselves bound by the judicial decision of the Court of Chancery, and as they would also have the power of adopting any preliminary inquiry which might be found in the Court of Chancery not finally completed. There must be a species of coneurrentjuriedietion between the commission and the Court of Chancery. As the government were creating a special tribunal for the purposes aimed at by the bill, they considered that it would not be effectual unless they completely vested in it all the functions and powers possessed by the Court of Chancery. They accordingly pro posed not only that it should not be prevented from acting in uses now pending in the Court of Chancery, but that it should have power to act also in all cues where decrees for sale had already:been made but not yet carried into effect. It was proposed that those decrees should be carried into effect by the commissioners; that where proceedings for sale were pending in the Cou rt of Chancery, and application was made to the commissioner themselves to effect the sale, the Court of Chancery should cease to take further measures, so far as related directly to the sale of the property. But in all matters relating to, the suit it was to be in the power of the Court of Chancery to decide whether they thought it better to go on with or suspend them until the sale wee effected. The commissioners were n , except when application was made to them, to interfere with the proceed ings of the Court of Chancery, but when they did interfere they would have full joriedction, and the power of the Court of Chanceey, duringsuch period of interference, would be stayed. It was thought necessary to grant an appeal from the commissioner', and in that respect the government were adopting the precedent of the West India commission. For this purpose they would give to a certain number of the privy council in Ire la nd, to be selected by the Lord Lieu tenant, the form of a judicial committee. Many members of the judicial committee in Ireland were men of great legal eminence and ability, and amply competent to form such a court of appeal. It was proposed by a provision in the bill that the appeal should be so far restricted that the commis sionen should have the power of saying whether the case was a fit ease for an appeal. The experience of all einem' acquainted with the proosedinge of our courts of justice lawgin them that no one was:more desirous that there should he an appeal where there were reasonable questions of doubt, than the judge who tried the MUM. (Hear, hear.) In frivolous eases therefore, introduced for the purposes al delay, the decision of the commissioners &garnet appeal should be final. These were the general provisions and objects of the commission respecting the functions of which he did not deem it necessary to go at greater length into the details, se they would come more properly before the house after the bill, which would be distributed in a few weeks, had been exa mined by hon. members. The beneficial effect of the commission would be, forthwith to give te every acre of land sold under it a better title a title which could not be questioned beyond the date of the certificate of sale. It would be a great misfortune if, after a lapse of some 30 or 40 years, estates thus emancipated, he might say by this commission, should fall back, into the ewe confusion they were now in, with this difference, that they would have 30 or 40 years of additional iucumbranees. Tear Tear, hear.) The better to provide agamst this, it wee , to introduce a measure respecting judgments,whith would prevent them from being assignable at law, or attempt by some other provision to reduce them to a better systems so that they might not be a species of permanent charge on property, as at present—(hear, hear)—for a common mods of raising money was by a bond, confessing juAtotesis which judgment was registered, and created a general in cumbrance upon the whole of the property. In addi tion to that, the government had for some time been con sidering whether it would not be possible to introduce as improved system of registration in Ireland. (Hear, hear. He could not say that any measure upon that subject would be introduced this session, as the commission now sitting sea' it had not yet made their report, although it was espeeted they shortly would ; and it wm the feeling of the govern ment that they could not effectively legislate for Ireland if they did not first release the land from its pr.sent inns brances. (Hear, hear.) But once that were dine, they cone sidered it essential that steps should be taken to prevent it front again failing into the same state. (lieu, bear.) The advantage of the present measure would not merely be the freeing of the land from its present incunilxr.d st. te. The direct and immediate object of it, and which be believed to he the great motive of her Majesty's government in bringing lii forward, was, what the right hon. baronet had a lluded to !ha suggesting tonne • measure of this destrietin, that it might create opportunities for the iofirn of c..pital 010 s.nd to be wholesomely expended in the due employment of labour. It was desirable to afford the greatest security sad relief to all incumbrancers, not making thim liable to refund or repay that which they were paid under tie commission: and trusting to the commission to dispose of the justly, he hoped and believed they might re oonebly ere that the result of the measure would be the edlectual sale of incumbered estetes, the bringing Onto the market a huge quantity of land, and the 2.1 e of that Ma beneficially, whether fen the real or misdeal Owners. 2