The Express. — London, England, 1849-03-03 00:00:00

IMPERIAL P. _ HOUSE OF LORDS.—FAIDAY, Itasca 2. The Loan Chtbasonsma leek Ids lOU et i o'skok. =UM imeseum--allt 011W ila poisa* memoral tam Ike As el Omsk m Ihsathell leve ITALI&N AfIAI3S. 11111011011Al1 bed Maenad merle la the Trawls med.llloplkhaewepeges, wilds hewed were Mho, seasely, thabdie lodide UMW et Lesbame bed tel.. the Ana et am* kasejp ...s 40, a ellmeelels r e tas ie i s , Wow. This alPi Terfecea takes rivesee. ol la ine edatiz? tits istibpasts width bed beta slam aot say ao mewl bed right_ to tales seek step se al ova respeasi. balty,►st baa as bobs the report wee witbeat deur &ties. Ta• Marquis if LANSDOWNI did mot bdires the.as at brews bed dome em est which could imply a the set tits ssestast at do issasrmia. Es mai= iskestation IS the estdest. net, lordships sajcstrasd at a quastar past Aye Oink. HOUBI OF COMMONB.—FEDAT. Mat= 2. The Briessa Ica the skis of 4 A• N NIL PEWS fiesmeese sea Ilarkreereeb lei* _esederaMiss et metals Ters seri Ads) ; *Mg leg Seen Ana temealesem ot est eel dreams et sea); Tem. AneemOs, are isms IrY.y Mu , mom rmil Memo& meg teemble. ha); Ina MILKS INIMMIIIIL PittlrlONa. Karns. am writ" spied tnitai a--12r. less spemellme el Used& me ese, eseleeteastkm the ea. Tete le iii thisset salmi emiso.—ltitlif. ‘lllllllll.llreas Am" di. NOM the sate arid; sod op ha ors. kr. tem Pelham% to the one dhst 1111T1111 °n u t saw d It. W. !ATM ream et dm males et artiste to the Illseed el Mai nay. rube the set II all no, S. =Me IBM et t sad le was depoisse ; MINN Os 411116111 at Mists the esemt or eillowllmet the heete was slanged to the snags. Asa. losirr Mora Item the Ohm d Weeds eel parents. DIVISION OF TEE LIVING OF RICHMOND AND KINGSTON-UPON-THAMES BILL. Oa the modes that this bill be read a mead time, Mr. C. LUSHINGTON Menai to the bill as • ism Ms' Mums to moats a flak emdesmseet. Dimmers wow memo la the whirs andel it woad alba, ash Mt t nadir, Ruh Vr il l i t e p its ars ra Out a dem ea the assiZia t sue helm a job of BbrrillidgSMOSO e . Wird, sad aim • isb mite. C Cam. Ha aloud as manl NW it be re ollege, ad a seeped due that d nadir. - saner Mr. °MILBURN &hooded the MU. The parhbas of. Shimmed sad Sisseton were Ws% sad fairly .al.d kg divides. lb. bill areased so Dew eadowatest, out but proposed to pay the iscambeat of th e second parish oi the pew vita. Mr. L. RING said that the bill bad bun agreed to is MI vestry of the parishes at Richmond sad Kingdom. Net a eingl i paribleser had opposed it. as elmsvatioa is explaitatics from Mr. C. Lcui. =MI, the bum divided : • Fir ti. simed reading 36 ~ lisimie 27-9 The bill was then read e meond time aid ordered to be committed. DUBLIN CORPORATION WATERWORKS BILL. L. REYNOLDS moved the second reedieg of this b 11. Mr. OROGAN moved as an ainsthnent, that the bill be read a second time on Toesday, the 13th Muth, the day to which the snood reading of another bill, °casette& with the SIM subject, had bean postponed. Mr. REYNOLDS stated that the object of the bill was to enable the corporation of Dahlia to supply the eitizeu with pure water. They &eked for no new aneennent, ia toadies( to eonoruet the seminary works out of the mate. Ile believed that his hon. colleague's opposition wee wholly political, cad bad no refereace to the intrinsic writs of t►e ESOOSIUr. Mr.E.HERBERT was aware of the existence of two politi• cal parties in Dublin, who violently opposed each other on this and other municipal guesthms, but their straggles wen a matter of perfect indifference to him. His only reason for interfering in this matter was, that he owned some property in Dublin, and that his tenants bad a strove feel statist the hon. member for D.Abin's bill. They oom }kissed of being exfsed to the expense of an mom' sonde, mid wen &MUMS that the m e at o ter might rs he s = set ta tl a t by M i r I::Lte we vac v t a tli to or ih send all the matendi t ng parties before a committee, and therefore should sapped the motion toes pootposesseat. tier W. SOMERVILLE said that the Babied wee being eensidered by Lard Climatic's, with a view te some aeeuuge- meat width might sabot the chines of Dublin Tkis Wag the awe, he should also vote ix postponement. Mr. J. O'CONNELL supported the bill. After en observation from Mr. GROGAN Mr. REYNOLDS persisted in meryiig his motion to a division. The house divided. Par the mend nailing 35 Foe the amendasot 936S DUBLIN IMPROVEMENT BILL._ 11r. RW11101.613 broad a wand time. fir. GROOM( stored, at an assament, that the mama math, lie pressed uattl the 134 h Masai. Samosa wefts pestpssed to 13th Kash. KO= AND LONDON WATESWORNS BILL. Sir D: L. IVANHateral the mewl maks of the Itisby sad Leaks Ws'erworla ad Navigates Oatmeal 11102 opposed the bill. He bassi Sae we so seseally Am this sew wear assay, emada am Ste effirsks, bei seek • espial iss ef seedy Is saisails feek isamelehlop, end led iii dews limaites Lai mod 3 t HIS slim a/ IMISIP-11pae, were able sad vain is supply the ..ad to say extent. It was ass Sas *Ss wen easy ef tits eselker haws is Leeds wrest st wear; bet the huh was sot with the wwls osaa hat whit So Imam* who ratassi to ley the wateserae. The sliest of the abase wee add to be to pro vide a supply of pole mar, but how that was to be SIMS by bra &i Ms was hes the user part of the Thema, ake MOWN oil SIM Jowls eassa—pre the &am& to Os sualty--ge s neer yea seer So sleispdia, be men *a noda =l% smamon would Sada. with *a nevi. i sail err the alba WNW of the Timms sealrem enema ly ell Ss Tentlewans • sal am ft would sealer ate break es ....4. 4 lllW i e s hoped the beers would set needs it. Ile by aeries that it be rasa ausal tbas that St Seals. Mr. Z. PALM= miippselea the wisest. • far D. L. 'VANS emohnlat dist *or ISIS had beam massed did set salt the et tes bill, bet were rather "slim et deli fir ihs ssiallime. _ _ • • MT W. CLAY - egginsi ift. num *ilk kW& I•MMIMMIkiIt Iliad • bM alb* anal rseeksg, lift propme. 'MO So out lay eft its& albs grout.* l.* la ample wank of wally Is weig Mit a yaw boss for *a. a year. D. OMIT Si MIL Wog In Meer of :=lt tbe pi tbe osoWipplo Übe !molt of In the Ma Jarrow ma mid, so water. Tlallains Avila Mr *o most mains . y kid 81 it 1..0, 137.40 Tbit a tras nonordingl nzA rii•N w AFFAIRS. M r * Un iedge 'NMI to sok aoliskidap t :L b: AMOR ossossloi s garden Mahe to Obi i um mess with 1111137. Ilee ebbs& -bsoot i able lord bad de/ y Oldellisa eil lo on lagts It 1 11 t Va l arr i ld li et s foams mak be 5 bsi dosbrod to to Loot PALIIIIIITON odi Ass lig wadi boblissook tie albeemals sal see irlie it mode bojellsisse to me dusa gess it is were, browsed! J - Asa so me le • but Air reellit_ ol . loll *;r l ;at woes I t emma with 6,1 Jabs ginenity they mill amt. bt VIII "" SQUADRON ON TEE WEST COAST OF AIPRICA. Mt. MUNI begged to ash the noble lord *beam any • had beam arrived at between the Pres& sett government* respecting the maintenance ef the ea the Wait Cart of Africa, Ind whether the n osh, Rimy, would be Lid babas the louse t Legit PALMERSTON mid that he we amble le get to lag the mode soon tie table. LORD KINTO'S CREDENTIALS. Mr. BANENS inquired twat. of the ezedentiale tar nished to Lewd Mistoly will,* hie p wen semedieed to the earl elt the Two &Hies ; ad she when throe ere dudish sighed? Lord PALMERSTON /aid it wee impossible to answer ligmemaggliem sifted lire wend* to bib men. Speak. gas Sam memory, he should say that tin oredeatish seat to Mime I. the sutmen of is the math of lieldemisar or October of the year before WA. Thepild set mike, bat when his lordship left If &las ti hmellem semi. (Lord Velmentoa) Weald leek =the mph Omi give a more distinctmo =awes to the ea Waft THE ' ADMIRALTY BILLS. Mr. PATTRN mid that a greet usher of pens& hills made, reports from the Admiralty had bees presented last seseism as well se in the present, mil la wished to kaow what ensaimesam had bean made Mr. RAID replied OM Maenad sepia dims bill% with re the empties of ewe, wall be pressalmi ea vides the witord per Me bell three if lbws epeat la his Mad. Obese we iod. ft it mem (dimple/Alm ta r d Kw delay bad arises, it wee esmeismi by the Adecirdile, who gales , taired• • = z ega g aisee hedge that the pedimiamp besides is the dhalete sold be wadable& de Weragml tall. il m peed , sad by loser own diem Lobed of by P O4 traMlbs. (Rau, hear.) There wmellsepeele k ell FAILURE OP THE ST. PRTIIR'B SAVINGS BANK, DUBLIN. Mr. MRYNOLDB hair sii r t r , the &Mt Ism , mem b e the Chaseallar MI the a arwhim De ma gime aselo k ammo vita the of the St. Pe peel& mimic nn beak, Delft. la ampliame h the whims Mae beam, Ds omit w siedia be had apes the pipit he the ag a i d l e um, LOOS of *shy g eel is hie eassiaa M wadi take the spew*, the fibs of the ease esaseeled with the lime of Ow link m Wiley as predb. see number of gleembem who hal has fide gamey W &se failure wee lAN; the mesa dee to diem wee GAM" ma =7l. seemed to be flatheamiag la mist t% meet their (Rees) It wooer 1101 aille4gathe el the de. palters were wren% est bell En IS yaws the mends *ram kw the relasties of lbe nellseal tab. were aware of the hod of the bask sad never Orbs& elation as the pert of the (Cries of 1, thesetisa.") The spee dos moor sty stops he& bras takes ep to be pre sent Ens be tame 1 most Is do tlepuilsee—vether IN WI/ Ila visit Woollens is rai billi V ilima relMillet Z IA , eel whether he weal sit et le be er inisebbeene eta saint seeterittee of isrdry at the POW The d C at HANCELLOR of the EXCHEQUER salt the i ho. awake ter Roblin wee probably aware that Mr. TIM PAK het lees melds' the seseseary Larkin as& that Plbilis wee nob le ponies cesneetsd with tha the vber datiliptig pumeelea eleerteis boobs, Met le t he fi r b* NJ is &die OM the quads& of be : s e= Ibelniesen Is the **is et Er. TIM PrstA wens asseemy, wilt the view of oath* le a rigid Es= We Oh 10 = 01 Imr e te di. 'Wild tsar Ant the honk seem& le VW els as bawd to prides* them It appetweite lie ( ProaCer of the lA shags': that Rh Merl wee Amen* a stud Ulm la the way of arise. es& heir/ esairelsabiesensi the Wisher to the sser fleehe ee welt Abed bob le be provided to try the tresesissor se le eiserlds the daps of the depositors. ,hear.) Whet be sleek et that appeal would be Is knew sot, bet =s= = lases /midst if a eamslites of that ray is quit y while that Irgil peoessilege were realm THE PRISONIES IN KILMAINHAIL - • - - - Mr. F. — O'CONNOR salmi whether the right his. : gentlemas, the Seermary Ibr the Hems Deptelment. wee aware whether any pepue of a seditious mad Untamable sharaeter had bees Ilinsl en the au pendia Phonon esslned is the sag of Kihesialtus, an& if se, whether be bed my stieslisa to hay them es the table of the Mose I (Lend larsetere.) Sir G. GREY said it was wet consistent with his duty to reply to the question. THE SELECT COMMITTEE ON BRIBERY AT ELECTIONS. Mr. V. SMITH observed tact the his. member kw Dreik wick (Sir J. Pakinpton) bad, la misting the West set mines on the Bribery at Illeedem Rill, pat dews eh his. members who had voted is hum of the mond reading of the measure, end only two whit bad voted against it. He had also included in the ummlttee the names of three hon. members who were mimed is very important committees up stairs. He (Mr. Smith) hoped the bee. baronet would sot plus the appoisMinnk of sea • ecausittee that night. but allow somewhat of a Lager sides to be given of his is order that a km okiestlesable list of aunt aided be selected. Sw J. PAHINGTON believed that every boa.paMasa whom name he tatemied to propose wield and perform his duty. He scald mom the beams that he had sarefelly endeavoured to Wept as is a °muskies se he meld, sad that he had not satielpated the slightest objestioa to be side to any of those ►e was aboat to stoniest*. However, as a doubt had been raised, he would postpone the appointment of the committee until Monday. (Hear.) r ABUSES IN SAVINGS BANKS. Mr. HERBERT begged to ask the right hon. the Chan cellor of the Exchequer a question In ecanexion with the one previously put to him by the hoe. member for Dahlia (Mr. Reynolds). It would be in the recolleetioa of the house that a committee en savings basks bed set to receive evidence, and any hon. gentleman who permed the report of the testimony riven would see that gross abases existed in the system. He believed it was the intention of her Ha. jetty's ministers to introduce a bill as the subject ; and his question wee, when the right hon. gentleman would legis late upon it, in order that an end m ight be pat to the evils which now abounded ? The CHVICELLOR of the EXCHEQUER, replied that a bill wee in wares of preparation, hut, owing to the large Naomi of begins, now before the house, he was not in a position to sey when it would be introduced. THE RfJ6B/AN ARMY IN AUSTRIA. Lord 13. - 13115 - ifil;;l4 ti;i; ;taii;steni hi/ ;limed in man rtre:lof :the public Journals recently, to the sweet that a of the Russian army had proceeded to enter upon the Austrian territories, and bad taken part in the straggle now gabs, en there. lie wished to ask if his noble Mad the iiMiry for Foreign Affair. had remind any informa tion on the @abject, and, if he had, whether he would state It to the hems Lord PALKIISITON said be bed theelved Lira hatiss that the path of tw• el the ems es the When et Wallachia bed lllSallapplisaties le the Madam eme Akers swt the ipeties of these towas=l* Icarian tr to oo prev ps. s a= n ef i ret applleatios two belies of the Earths u I m (Ilear.)Tboy had /ere le the two towns ; be ad ad beam ther Ind ;Imagist dew where ; wad it wee dense the tine they lad empiel these places that earthesseets teak piths betweaa the Austrian hefts aad the liangerlass. EXPLANATION. Lora J. IgVBBBLL iekrmed thehouse that the hog. lumber km Os UalvessiX: rwha lDidgi s s (Mr. Napier) was de sks= of sake sine raiag himself and the dads dtlte sight Win. (Hear, lasar.) Mr. 'API'S odd that la tho muse of the debate the previous swift the stile lard at the head of the asors. Rest had to his Qtr. Napier's) ebervathas as Meg l ad " ost *R&M the olsomelases ho ger- I talky Mt mimed that sash as insulation should has bass amok assist his. (Fies) PA bad Maki to the asks Imes rearm is that eassoka • liskj e = awl he did 103 oa tad, peed,—that es it was by Ni. psyssals at the pert of the 'grossest ter a Mal medidradsa of the pea law, the house tee sot k • Iposidas to Judge. of he pospdely. The asks Ind seessed,. by his ebeerwitas, b AIM that ha (Mr. Sept.?) se mos the* ether pooling of the Irish plass had ben submitted esoak hp seethisratios, sad that, tab ' the whole of the logothsr, the plea wee saw pletoselalihtasttobovebeessosdlerodas sosaftwo. Nor, Oho Misr poetises of Umpire wore pseksed for ussidas ties n. 4 dislamehy was emplamd sad die skims pals Yid, sad then salesequerd pergolas were &pietist as the nook of that Inquiry. The slow he took was tide, that these ether peados had as barbs as the quail= at all ; bat, sea If they were amostal with the proposal beks the hoses, Ikea, II they ware pistaturs d fortiori the whole was pressatore ; sad if the matter were set to b. dually adjusted thou be aid Skit the proposal war premature. (Hew) Hs was obliged to the aobi. iced far haring afforded him this opponsaity to seats, less he skald bo sor now, or at way Ms th...ff an should rest ti ry ps him et a sat maim. (.11=7 SUPPLY. Sir P. BARING said that Skis the holies resokod itself kW a «suttees y, he might be rirwatlod to Asses MS if Ohm her. who bad giros aids eteassimets es /Sig lab that owasittes wadi diem gall Frthay • next, they would this stood SI good a smiths far strike this, es they did {ti* W. HIIMB ailopSd the suggiados, ised peelpesed imadmat gad Mkt. USTROHP Polthhei to RIPPort the of Ow isseileir he Moittrosi, is that his Mejesty's to sash a general Meads! dalassat, sad = 11 :111:1 1 1: eakshies for Slaking the palls fang piesemeaL Sir H. WILLOUGHBY also adopted the thrown oat, sad tootposed tier meradaseat of irla i read il gives patios Wit Friday seat. The house than resolved itself into a ovaraeittee of supply, Yr. Baum. is the shah. A. vote d 21:10,0001., ea sweat, for row of anal es peadiour woo word tr. . Mr. EWER loped Ad by elleveleg this vote to pass without obeeresties, so M. umber who dissented hem it. ma la tbeallgbieet agree lii duoroolipod• E no*: helm) TM Mw dim lima* * Immediately eta moot Iqo oionelllbe tta POOR LAWS (IRELAND.) Laud I. RIIIMILL Mid: die, I rise sow for the wpm of .-1. E 1 to th is meamities the INNS_ the pessimism wie it yams Wok wort to Ude le* gesstien - ref the pme4ster Le boilleiL 211 .7 Sh rzect a* It tail he well Ad the aimeltlee Miedit ral liming weird liens in view, &Odd hi, MYR It essitedees Smaibis here ed! r by their mperienes, B"lll :a .... ..tazio. rest ee ese. I keughe bides flat spa aline s their tre resetteg, eniest prepesidens. One of these min what I Sad te be the em Mm waddle; of the paimiew in Ire km d. :Mkt Met to be se Mebane was desirous is Ibt7 of upon the w as nked the slurp of • 'Oda it might be wry appals, fen i mosiderebie dim, end at all these be =itis a gemit—thell, es far es the ablest bed teem to Mime the by rates collected to Ireland fee tie if the pner, West bee. te it peat degree, been It Ye net been dialed, lower"; that in es=dz i tst digest embus evils hue Mew, muse from seams of loud noMne. bat eases of immeee " twee, whisk e the melees attends rNW ht il minee mines and sdietemb of Ms beam met Miameniey. O rally egmbing. I. ill& it is to be odishied tbt ie = i x io le Inkad the peombur Mimes a wry bmidue. Certainly, in the nem" of • wished lit e in e l uam milimpeted se the isspesiden d dot benign wee raid he Ireland, =1 el lia = llB Z i tint the i g= =mime d In diet wonky wee • mien fee • peke employment es the peep* weeking amnia Ise the espeeess to whisk they meet this • hue. been whites& rather Eminieed res kmeseeed the muster of labium Ia their esegley. It mars .a. te of the geweement, olden* astrery to dm 'meet : • pee lem mies s asehr ir t f ai =ed, ry the el it may smkodt. shoal be Wile skip of relief o the lo ins nediryillut le the shie it at tilt moms ef iosel end to esy mamet—it spates or as, noterithstemdkg the Meagan's Its suit pesidemb that ft woad be impedlint in Ireland to mopes a adman rate, biped width the per Me Neu* mat intend. rizgeslig this wawa nis it was to be ornsidesed It wee to hs in the nature et • mks site ar on dastard dieting eats ; or whether there wee to be any aid 'pm tem a collateral soarer. What I reposed to the ebnalttee vas, that them should be, in the Areapiece, ante et Is. is the beyond which it should not extend in the egAmet, be d m i that, when it 'weeded that ewes collected by a anion rate, to the s▪ tint md net L. In the pound, =skim 7e. alto- Ohm, to whit the e divisions nklat be ntbiect. llpon this =Meet the meamittee were of ogaios, though I tWk they were generally favourable to a marl mum fete, that sane evidence should be takes ✓especting the same which it! wee expedient te dz, Finding seek to be the general *aim of THE EXPRESS, SATURDAY the crommitatiezzalieg las Lat.. coed to laZile. ig i riTINOS• 4 1 1•00111•111 seated le withdra k dat if the' should afes t lia, detain s :lir: Mane • masks, ' 1•40•118. Seel =Eike 0141 home, b. the balsa I p h not, however, intead at the moat thus to skin es the sabjest of the maziama rate. I ma lig lesw Praf t wait for baker widens bin the it la dedadly the opin a the the le. end 2a. be the prams tor na, who? titer the twit of klieg the - krat east kil ling be thalweg expedient lam et mot —that tr a ct skometesete of Inlaid a nuadmia rate k sa d 1 ihre by adeptket it we Wok best 1111111blas with the se ' destkusin mesenageseentaisdreary nerd die pmenales Oda iradvatin sit. Iwm reseed to atm alterations whisk the government bad in wk.* I have not asked the opiales of he AWL 'I eves; at a More period, M Waal haus One of dime attention ft that where Ikea bait bees apieultaral impenemente, there should, not be for a mad* amber of yeses any lesmaied valua tion at moan ot the.. imprenmeata (Hear, Mar.) Marker the teem be seven or tai or for a leapt opi peeled, I sh ould is a past think ea wh ink awe le mask dilemma of ate. ka yam ht. to be utmost Halt. Peaks seem mane mildest oug But= the that asked there is meek dillimisse opinion. attendees have been oessidined, hat MO msseipadellYi whisk thai has hum a Ansa dent at skinks. dead by the diamicas whisk bass Mks plan es hams the ermines meat of the sanded poor law in 1847, and a whisk I withal to Lie way peserrel views to the essmatise-11 fa wish Napa* le the area of taxation. Many are el opielseiv m g a Ibma I believe the majority of the bilk mar here sidV i llts einamittee, that It would be desirable to Ban a mamma begged which the peer sok amid lit go ; that by sash a plan the swam a i would be far mere likely to expend his cap& than if there wen to be an ualimited rate and that ia the ease of the sale of property, a pudemer amid be more readily found if be wen certain that the sede weal he Halted, and that the whole rant would met be swallearalap to support the poor. With the same and ko the same resew, it is considered that the are sir texallim should be mask net. limited, with the view that lasilhdisse Maks re swab limited amount of labourers wishes medal •MWs4 dad being meters of that district mks nik e Z mkt semema desk tat to be gins ddta desk tat up= surrhk, esd singly Z ei t Veins eg t&re, if they wen ad ammel Oboe ether preprieton In their knee- Akio adghbarateed and subject to similar des as as theamikes wens not able to refase all omploymene fe Me labourmi a their district, and thus throw Imam who were employing all the labour in their power an the Inds they possessed, the whole burden of taxation. Wile thesis a very amiable view of the subject, I think it is kapessibk to look at it in all its bowlegs without seine that if tihe pliaciple were adopted that each property should form a seem ana taxation , and be liable 'only for the support of own poor, very great sad serious evils would (Ilene, bear.) In the fleet place, you could not justly ram to the very small proprietors what you grant to the large OMB. In • stun drawn by the clerks of the Limerick union I And ono large property of 3,000 aerie ' and I dial know how you can say that you will protec tt the mars asset properties from being swamped by his neigh. heir, tad yet allow a property of 30 acres to be swamped by the emir of the no*.ghag property of 2,000 or 3,000 mak ' Then would be no justice in sash a preposition; and Nyera storied your subdivison to such an extent as te make 19rest, it b obvious that great confusion would be the Gorm less" and the dildeulties of carrying the poor law into effbkpe many es to make it almost impossible. But there tee Meracmger objections to it ; and one of these objections k that aldaoagh one news of landlords might wish to do their duty by employing a number of labourers on their estate, and by adv capital for its improvement, satiated that they would be ultima ny rewarded by snag the labourers who were so employed happy and cheerful, and their own estates rendered more valuable themselves, Ireland, according to the testimony of Irishme_ there is another class of landlords who would take a very different entree, who look only to the immediate returns they receive ; and whose first nap, upon (ladles that their laud was to bear the taxation of supporting those readopts ea it wise were Winn, or who wanted employment, would be to rid it of what theywould consider an ircumbrane upon is—(her—(her)—to throw the email tenants at will, aad all who he a burden on them, out of employment—thus driving ma* in large ambers frees the agticultural district., as any knit been driven during the last 30 years—(bear, bear)—lato the suburbs of large towns, to live there as men dicants for a short time, end the to perish of disease and starvation. (Hear, hear.) Again, if you adopt the :- meat of making each property subject to its own rates fr the support of its own poor, you would be obliged to estab lish a musk Mister law of settlement eve* than there ends la this whe matey. (Hem empl , km.) oyed You meld find, that If those penes! were by Oak nes kndlorde, err by mull oemplers et laid, attempted ter meek elsewhere to better worm a few miss off, or eves Isis than a few idles, they would be drives task teraidais *sitarist from whisk they we, sad would thankem, sot the he. and ladependent lassuren bathe perk a the katkeMe whe em ployed thew, (Load arks ear "Hear.") Thies ere the erection., Wad as it seem to me the insuperable:akstion which 'toad sgalast the subdivision a the area of taxation which haw bus proposal-by Mae poor law reformers in Inland. news is at di km time no doubt that conies dues 1e lassamaisme grime hem the sire of many of the salons In Wand. Ile emestkiners to wham / alluded hat akikit 111T0 hkal kat salami lido their essilimaimi. They esoryieell the rhos el the south and NON and Abseil et the *yokel CITC111•01110•11 illlbr, y are yet of that the greater subdivielen of ile seek sue were itvembie te the Itsvolopmest sir talvalty, and shy sheiks, premed VW there Shedd be a gnaw divWn dos beretehee be the leap mime al the south. That k squeaks whist oby Ihistyle seastiesed. If the samelase ham Ike whims* dame paean who ban bees -egsgsd La tank, the Mar diets& ctivbises, they may be sebesi Li 'haste!. owes he. already been taken; they say amyl* ems ellieellues la that course. That is a ties be s It dellbselha sad &melee, bet ne s t* set be allyelsg tie yawl* to which I Imo adverted. tbsse aissadmee et the preesat else total diadem, more mold* eselideelag that they ware mei for a different peer /ow would be ree sombk sad juin, hat mek a as I ban just Mad the eirjestiens Is weak bee swims evil sad peal the 'gift et the law. (Hear, bier.) There are some ether eateadmnts to whisk I ne ed set new more pertkakely allude—with the exeepties sine to which the govennesat hale given Oak orardss, and en which I a t ia c to slate It his hem segps*l that She MOM of the pima pm law, it is met thin Imes hod Is leks& which were not in althall law, should be subject as the tors of rake to the poor sate. (Hear ' br oi l Now whit in to vest it would be quite fa Ids to subject the& le It 11a ran being a sharp that must my be Ns mkt% set Asks rated for the ezehermr, bet he Leal IMlmmediate effeet d narks* neelgages liatla to it mad be the withdrawal of the saw lest, and onestarat &anis baked of benefit. But with nepierte Jingly *rim the cam k different. Where they have set been mode la eostangialka of a poor-law, bit Ist the least that the loadinner would have a certain 1•13114 from the sell, earl ehersioathat a carton etargecculdibkly be put on the lan A as a asgLwsnt, it would he just sad prac ticable that thin sloymbl bosom dedemtias ea sigma of the rate. But Ido think Weal beyond the sett pocre- /meats hitherto ma ma it de. It bast @bead sow Mown thee the pesky midis settlesenes will be made emeakily, and I Oman" think tart there sisal be a re. 'daLien he mat th e m saltiest Ie the rate. how ever, ia a het w OM under crer erseliesedea en a Lie sesuiss. maw pelt of the saket which has lid to a great deal el doubt, but remselfsg whisk some prevklen met be made. I slab to land Meseppied for • ensiderabk time, now lying mole, and an whisk these were onsideesbk mean of peer rate due. I believe it would tend to the future occupation and enkinticra ettimelsad, thcise imam were to be for one ressfatoL (Hese, hear.) Isar peetatir, to state that white k pertienkrly the of mantles, that renoludia is mike: the mane yam Imre paid by env =lnked a smagielte a rese dilemmas lbe penile MA ill Silk Mill% IOW•140 I ping am ear the rad thereal, Sawa; kit arena ma Is pia to a @sprats aiiimt at the Raft of him/, In the name et Le ta Mot mama a shit savision bai and, aadall be applied In sash mom espeniunmt +kb _ _ IL the meet oldie sommiedcmers is a letter addressed by them %Lewd Clemedee, dated 11th Deo., 1848, is *hick ° Taft whew et ulna ISt Mee re parr= redo la origerel espenerie hoe the rordollia r peedier AMINO& mere i & seed oar oar ragas leer It lora, la err the prase rarer of order nada rarirablo. bat la dlat of =arm mire ibrodsl aorienveraalo =4 awl the aralataia at las moo am be rater Weer sit Otago nisiderg Irma s i g y b t li i awn ra is wide as mart le aroma gaga_ pee of the wort h:mot 'lathe 00810111111401111 M WOMAN. Ina Warr Ile Ira art ratorlia=grepla WA eat Mr r arerglatizeCt weget; toe tie worldera irrarrobllia la taw raw isherled le arot a warldstrio Wire re aatni rpm*" adortro order will be again r The *pinks gibe esassiseiseers, therefore, is, that est of 131 union this. are net more that 10 he whkh they expect mese Mena 614 will he required. As I said on a termer sesselen, we meat le sonsidering this question sever put oat alight tim elegem of the pest biters in the supply of that whisk has bees the stopple hod et the ese..(Heur, bear.) It is, thershre, impossible tor es to ee.uWat them animas as ariblag is the lOW is which they were in 18367, when The peer-law eamoshelemses of inquiry made their report. At ea wer e , however wretched it ndght have append that they were, kusdreds of families had le Misseabb* mud sables, eseeisting of only one room —the* make as bum ahmed most grievously fur the mem by the yeimehe Of that toed apes whisk thee sub- IMMO, depsehed—(ltear, ben)—ter, be it remembered, that them people sever resolved, sad sever expected to re • n, to wages le the merle of the yew se valid enable them to live, b. tar @testily ; and they were, therefore, forced to depend epee the little crop of potatoes seljoidog W wretched calims they inhabited (Rear, bear.) Within the lest yea. we have seen repeated is as aggravated shape this calamitous failure, which at various times had Aided Ireland ; onee is the middle of hit century, sad oleo in 1822, when great relief was afforded by psi liameat. The question, therefore, 'ogees to be, whether that relief shall hi In any shape continued, OT whether parliament will think it wise to make no provi sion whatever for that relied, but to allow those miseries and the inhabitants to take Ike miserable themes that they may have of surviving till seat harvest without asking any effort whatever to tar them. (Hear, hear.) The house h it felt, and naturally kit, that the efforts made by the people of this Sibb4 -7; Wei tit, 01 (Ides, 'bud II giceral return of nature . the "grants and loins of nuns Tor waits eletepfedbedirtnatite nude)* ISA oar, aSd 1348, from which ft apposes that there was ad/mama, under Mr. Labouchere's letter, /00,0001; for reclaiming and draining, 1170,0001. ; ordains seaboard of worts, 180,0001.; harbours to., 100,0001 ; railways. 620,0001. ; navigation improve: mess 100,0001. ; for the river Shelters, 123,0001.; which, with another item of 200,0001 (for what purpose he did not know), made no less a mies than 2,193,0001. advanced within three pernfieketpandeetive worts in Ireland. Hei n , hear.) Moreover there still remained 1,000,0001. under the Lead Improvement Act not yet applied for; sad width would be applied for from time to time, far 'alai rag and draining, mating altogether 3,193,0001. I think, sir to this statmeent that it cannot be said that the go;rieennella Or padismant have neglected all works of • reprodnedea Palate, mei that the whole amount of money voted bee been eateamed kw perpoeea of charity. (Rear, hear.) It bee beet eland la this house, and with great hue, that alma* home pants have been made, and that if it was right tio ee.ti .e this system of relief in any way It would be batjenathet Ireland should contribute her share equally to that fend. In looking to the burdens of the law in baked and England I certainly pie that these it sot so great a burden in any part of Irked as in many puts of England. Taking the beginning of the guardians' returns for Ireland, I fiat that in three unions in Antrim the rate is le. 3d., Is. 101., la 74d. ; In two unions in Armagh it is le. 416., 2s. 10d. ; in the county Down it averages le. 3d. or Is. 4d. ; in Fermanagh, 26. 646., 2s. lid. ; in Londonderry, Is. 346., le. 94d.; in several sounds in Lehman it is equally low; in Kildare, fa three unions, it is 24., Is. 74d., ls. 64d. ; and in Meath, Is. 21., 24, 2e. 141. 45., Is. 1046. These are the suss paid under the poor law in several parts of Ireland, so that it cannot be said respecting those pule at leen that they are sunk, destroyed, and ruined by the poor law. (Rear, Merl On the con it as does oppear, cow them with stay parts of E d, that they as le Ci r r i g r ued than the colons of W , Suess, and other perm of England. (Hear, hear.) It does not seem, there fore, impossible that they should bear some additional bar. den for the sate of those distressed unions. (Hear, hear.) When I propose, however, that there should be a rate in aid conceded in Ireland generally for the sake of the distressed districts, I ass met by the argument that the poor rats being a local burden it was no sore applicable to the county Down than to Middlesex, when intended to rapport the purposes of Mayo or Sligo; that it would be quite es just to impose an additional poor seta on Lancashire for the purposes of Norfolk, as ea the county Down for the poor of the West of Ireland. There would be mueh justice in this argnesent, if it could be said that Ireland was altogether taxed to the same amount as England, that she contributed to the national exchequer in the same degree and proportion to her wealth, and that all the taxes to which the English people were subject the Irish people were also subject to (Beer, hoer) But it is not so. It was put forward with great emphasis by the hon. member for Northamptonshire, when we propmed a former grant, that theta were taxes to a very large amount paid in this country which were not paid at all in Ireland. He stated their amount at 11,000.0001., but I have seen a statement from which it appears that we pay seen more than that. We pay an theme-tax of 5,300,0001., a land-tax of 1,150,0001., aroma taxes to the extent of 3.400,0001., making, in direst taxation alone, 9,850,0001. ; and we pay to the excise, taxes on bricks, soap, de., 2,3000001, making altogether 12,150,0001. (Loud (Cheer.)l think it Is Int just to any, that an additional taxation on this country of upwards of 12,000,0001 entirely alters the case with regard to the local tandem which we wish to impose for the benefit of the western districts of Ire land. I and boa. genth men saying very readily at this moment, impoS ups us exactly the same taxes as Eng land, and then we will consent to anything that is do. evaded. That is sadly said—(bear, hear) ; but if we cams to propose the income tax, if we said that instead of 300,0001. we would charge Ireland with about 1000,0001., so that instead of 6d., something like Is. and le. 6i. would be sated, I think we would find thou hon. gentlemen changing their opinions very fast, and having made professions togret rid of the present proposal, they would than object with Mire u much fierceness and pertinacity to the one subetitut•d at their own request. (Hear, hear.) Besides the 71. in the pound in the one cue would be levied off the tenants of, all piteous whose incomes were over 1501. ; whereas in the 6d. rate the occupier would have to pay 3d., and charge the other 3d. to the landlord. In the other ease he would charge the entire 7d. So that such persons would have to pay 7d. in the pound instead of 3d. With regard to the preposition itself, I certainly have no peculiar fond ness for the mode of rating it involved, more than for any other. Bet I believe if you withdraw it, and substitute an income.tax, we should find in another shape the same okitiodous—that we are charging all Ire land for the relief of one part, and the same argument, that the imperial exchequer was answerable for it. But, air, the objestiose go farther than this; it is said, and we were told last *ht, that it is a nutter of feeling, affect ing even the loyalty of the loyal protestant, of Ulster. (Hear, hear.) Now, I de not think that those who represent ULM; can represent her fairly, when they assert that her loyalty will be impaired by such a proposition as this. It is no gees don of right. And, not being so, I cannot believe that the loyalty of Ulster is of that nature that it will be hiapaim i lit the imposition of a tax of this kind, for the relied who are ( destitute and su ff ering the extras tri - 71 misery. Hear, hear.) Bat, eir, I am told that this measure is likely to lead to a permaemit upon du income of Ireland, sad that a ret d rC aid, a perpetual rate in aid, will be the eons,. quotes of the proposal. Now_ let us look at what is the tatted situation of again. We have twenty miens now, either L e or Lltely to be in, a state of very great distress. nun is as reran that I know why that distress &MU In MN 111 antlasease for many years longer. My :7=l'is that est of two things moat infallibly happen: 4:will find that, the return of good and plentiful hareeststhere will be sidlideet food and employment for the people in those distils* sad that there will be such a change of culture and ends ea employment of capital in thou dis tricts, that the people may be plumed in • state of comparative comfort, and then you are relieved from the burden in that manner; er des you will find that the people, seeing that they have so of the restoration of the food upon which the dep p i el, will migrate to othe districts, will migrate to ether of Ireland, will migrate to Scotland, win migrate to " Hear, hear,' and laughter) —will emigrate te ear co lonies, to our Australian colonies, and to the United States of Ametica. That is what you find they have dear to a great extent, in the last three menthe. It no t without example that great calasities have befallen a people, is consequesce of a failure either of their mesperions or of their means of livelihood: Not many years ago a great population was maintained in some of the western Wu of Scotland by the gathering of kelp ; this was gredu a ll m y dhpisesd by ether manures, sad afterwasillebyelmatioalmettens . that those people co That mode nebralibeod bee noTbeen ani restored to them. Great misery was endured bat there is no leaner, there meld not be any longer , that people exintienUg is the western islands without the means by - width they found, enbeisted. Nay, more; we fled in suet& team of thiseenatry, and in several pieces en the esetinent, that various humekas of meaufecture have:eaboisted sad flourished ter a dew, that those bras-hem of mantifite_ have Wisely um** the plisses in width. they wore hlhhed e that greet miessyhas been endured kg a time, bet that afliewenis the pZ ate lhosa those mannt4tures have employed /MS to other districts, where there was seem other or the lam employ ment found for them; and mentaally theme islasities left no trams behind them. fi s t a l s kilove, sir, will it be with re spect to this calamity some of the southern and western districts of Ireland. livelihood of the people having been entirely setimated . apla the culture of the po tato, end that food having that food muse beck to es, mime they Sad that there is the same mode of eabeittanno that they haws hitherto hed,—you will find, after a time, that other districts will have,—not the harden of their subsistence, but will have the benefit of their employ ment. (Bar, hear.) I have now, sir, stated the reasons upon which I posed the proposition that I have to Mate to the hose. I believe that, if you agree to this propositios, after the coesent of the home has been obtained, if we dad it InONINITT. item the amounts of increasing destite dia,—.• shall he jeetilied in adriag some advance from this hum, behre the rate is eatually collected, with whisk we monlit supply the more premise wants of the potpie. At all events, I think it is the duty ol' an 4=amenthe t to lay the cue before the House of caina hear)—to ask the House of Commons wksithereispem , ready. Mmost 41 Owns's, by which we peoleth to meet this mos of missy and wretchedness ; detthtip'ffae Mesa elf Cammens, if thry do not take our seams, emesidisethst titre ere ether meats which ought to be fat gesibreses; or whether, lastly, it should be t h e dNMew will end sentare of the House of Commons th a t no moms be made te Milne this distress and destitu tion. (Mear,hcor.) As I understood an hes. gentleman w h o a rea lost night, and who resisted the motion for the Speaker leaving the chair, the last seemed to be the view which he took of this question. For my part, sir, I own I cannot take that view. 1 own I think, - although you should limit your aid although you should take care that it be spent as frugally sad economically as possible, yet, consider ing that the whole social state of Ireland is undergoing a great transition, sad that you may rave some of the misery and many of the deaths w hich are the consequence of that tiamelliest ky ielerpleiet with relief of this kind,—l am con- Meat that the hum - was wont at once to the propOsition I SOW make. (Hear, hear.) Mr. STAFFORD said, experience had proved to hint that the policy he had advocated two yawl ago, and ad vocated now, was the only true policy for Ireland. He held that whatever was done with regard to &andel natters in Ireland, they ought never to Ices sight of the culture of that great principle the non-existence of which was the oases of all helead'intioariee—theuiple of self demising*. Moot In eilnidaaef Ina taw course, ona *shaken te *states of his own touchline, he had hint night emu& **Speaker's leaving the *hair, and 6110114 eaThistliames, this seams, in every ciao of its stars. Meer. With reimenes to the government plan for remedyin evil of Imbed he was convuiced that When they met perWmat they bad se play at all. It was not till the committee on the I Peso Law oren appointed that the noble lord at the lend of the government had declared his intuition of kph* sem* resolutions before that com mittee. Ts settle - lead had said that distress in parti euler dist:lets, arising from local causes, was net altogether Freadented ; and be bad referred in proof to the p.gatheras in the Western Islands. Bat them acidly acquainted with these islands would be able to mews his lordship that the distress there was far from bobs wholly removed. It ought also to be remembered that though the dinars might be in some degree anidegons to that in Connaught, there was no precedent in the western islands her a rate in aid. The noble lord had expressed his belief that either the distress would vanish er the people would migrate. This they had already donelargely, m those who contributed to the poor tines in Manchester and Liverpool well knew. (Hear, hear.) As for migrating to North America, that was quits out of their power; the rate in aid would not entitle them to do this ; but may would migrate to England, and many to the piece who the weary were at rest (Hear.) He hoped some minister would supply the remarkable omissions of the noble lord, as to the amount this sixpenny rate would rata. and the length if time over which its distribution would extend, and the amount of distress which it was l:Cgto remedy. It was said to be pee s rate would produce about 592,000/. • of which near 400,0001. would be presently absorbed. Wh at then was to be dens if, ecstasy to all ministerial expectation, the dis tress should not disappear ? His objectionsto the government plan were these—that it was unjust difficult of execution, and that it would fail of its object He hoped the right hon. baronet would explain the peculiarly pros circum stances in that wintry which now ind him to sleet for tazatioa that peculiar kind of property which had been meet burdened and most oppressed, and was 'most nearly brought down to absolute prostration. With great respect for the intentions of the noble lord, that did not seem to him to be absolutely just. The noble lard said that there would be great resistance if Ito had raid that he was about to propose an hamar-tax to Ireland. What he complained of was, that the noble lord never gave Ireland the alternative. L et it not be said that Ireland n asal the inooms•tax. She never had en opportunity of pregame* an opinion. As an Irish proprietor he would urge the benefit and advantage of equal taxation. (Hear.) If the income-tax had been extended to Ireland every fainter who paid lass than 3001. a year would be exempt. (Hear, hear.) Under the poor-law system ev. ry farmer who was rated at 51. was taxed. (HHesa.) Whilst they refused on the one hand to offer to Ireland the alternative of an income tax, they, on the other hand, declined to take the bold and manly course of bringing this question forward as a government question in the Sat instance till they had *baited the additional advantage which a committee of their own selection gave them. (Hear, hear.) He blamed them strongly for the mode in which they dealt with this question, bemuse they gave an opportunity to those who wiskedto throw the burden of mantaining the poor of Ireland on the imperial exchequer. Having 'avidity= unfair net to propose to Ireland the alternative of an income tax, or the im position of a rate on a 'peeks of property which was most de pressed, he would now refer to the application of themml.. One reason why he desired to see Ireland in a just of taxation with this country, was that noon. you'd velts - Zi: consequence of her suffering this distress, to advance to Ireland such money as would be deemed adequate to meet say great emergency. Thus they would have aid from the na tional funds under the sautiny of the representatives of the people. (Hear, hair.) Now they proposed a rate in aid for local purposes, to be levied by local machinery. This was a difference of great Importance. (Hear, hear.) How did they propel's, to check the profuse expenditure of this money? Would they gid rid of jobbing ? He apprehended they would not have that strict @mutiny in the application of the money which they would have if paid from the exchequer. Very few of those before or behind him would take that in terest In the expenditure of this money, which they would if it came out of the pockets of their constituent,. His wish was to interest every English member in the expenditure of the money. Therefore he would prefer public grants from the imperial treasury, but he did not wish for a single farthing from the treasury except on the condition that both countries were equally taxed. That was one objection to the government plan. The noble lord went over the arguments against a property rating. He (Mr. Stafford) did not mean to deny that there was some force in them. The noble lord said that the principle would tend to moo rage the destines system. Of all the arguments against the small area that showed the most complete, he would not say ignorance, but want of knowledge of the present poor law. A residence of thirty mouths out of thirty-six gave a mum a m ight to be charged in that locality where he resided for that time. Now if the property area were established, and a landlord were to tura out his poor tenants, they would be charged to him. If his property consisted of 100 acres, and those constituted the whole division, he would have to pay the whole Is. rate for every pauper ejccted ; if the division consisted of 150 acres belonging to two proprietors, then a rate of Bd. would be levied on each ; if it consisted of 300 agree, belonging to three proprietor,, then each would hays to pay 4d. for every pauper ejected. How did matron stead at present ? A noble lord, whom be would not name, though it was on the tip of his tongue, ejected between 30 and 40 families from his estate, in the county of Limerick, which was near his (Mr. Stafford's). As a magistrate he had one morning to vet to preserve the peas in consequence, and the very next he had, as chair man of the board of guardians, to sign an order on himself for their maintenance. (Laughter, and " Hear, heat.") The noble lord said that the electoral divisions were to be reconsidered ; that,. he supposed, was a soft word for di minished, just as the right boo. baronet (Sir R. Peel) used to say that he would adjust the cern laws when he meant their repeal. (Laughter, and '• Hear, hear.") But the difficulty was where to draw the boundary line. There were two &strings on the subject. One wee, that by the large area they would sustain the freedom of the labour. WeU, that plan had been tried in Connaught for 18 months, as on corpore sin. Was it not so unsuccessful in that province as to induce the three other provinces to decline having the experiment extended to them? The other principle ea that of making the division coterminous with property. It was said that this would restrict the freedo m of the labourers. He begged of hon. gentlemen not to be sawed by mere word,. Words which had a meaning in this country had not the same meaning in a country situated as Ireland was. In the north • Ireland the principle of divisions coterminous with pro arty, had worked well, and had developed the resources of that part of the country. Gentlemen said that the English poor law system was applied to Ireland. It was a mere jingle of words. All the disadvantages of the English poor law were applied to Ireland, but the best parte of the system were kept back. The noble lord must be aware that both Melanie and Ricardo declared that were it not for the smallness of the area of tuition—the smallness of the parishes (which meant electoral divisions in Ireland)—the English poor-laws could never have worked in England. (Hear , hear.) That was the great advantage which the English poor law had over the Irish. Another was, that the Whole of the rate la England fell on the occupiers • whereas in Ireland, sometimes as much as two-thirds% and sometimes even the whole rate, fell on the landlord. What they said, therefore, was, " If yea give 'us the English poor-law, give no also the English . area of taxation.' s (Hear, hear.) Now, as far as he could ascertain, the area in England was about 2000 acres, excluding the extra-parochial lands which were not accurately known. Would the noble lord direct the bonadery commissioaers to assimilate as much as possible the size of the Irish electoral divisions to the size of the English parishes? (Hear.) That was to say, that the area should not be above 2000 saes nor much under 1000. It might happen that this meld not be always stringently observed, but it should be carried out es nearly as possible. Until they did this their arrangements for the relief of pauperism in Ireland would only acmes population by diminishing the stimulus to exertion, Till they did this, any bill for the rule of Jneumbered estates must be vales, far no person would purchase in a division which sesdated of 17,000 acres, and where, consequently, he could not calculate upon any return upon his capita/. (Hear, hear.) The question of the union wee very different tram that of the electoral division'. The two must be kept quite distinct, though the boundary emnatiasion tried most unfairly to confound them. Let it be considered that it there were to be new unions there must be new masters, and sew chaplains, and a new staff of oficiab. Where was the money to coins from for the building of these new union? The state was to lend It. He warned hon. gentlemen to take are how they advanced the money. But if new unions were to ha made, let not those electoral divisions that were now united together, and wished to con tinue so, be separated. He wadi objea to Limerick for in stance being sectr w fi s om the other electoral divisions, at the will of the oontsksioners. But in saying this he did not wish to understood se pronouncing any opinion with regard to large mans is the country. If the home let the seed time go ly there would be mere poverty and misery than there had hems already; and, in. stead*: a rate of fd. in disposed it would be necessary to have one of double or treble that amount. The evidence eves by Mr. Galata before the Irish poor-law committee ekes's& thuds* imposition of this rate would he very unjust. Hon. members fended that they were "Wag to impose a rate of ad. in the pound. But what wee to be the valuation ? Did they wish the rate to vary from 2d. to 2s. ? Did they wish it to be collected through a series of arbitrary and unequal valuations ? As men of business, did they not w eave that the kinwerce millainsees of the rate depended on =lilt of valustiss ? (Rear, hear.) He tended that members wadi therm the expression of their opinion on this edmme until they had read the evidence which had hese kid that day en the table of the house. Her liejesty'smat had often taunted Irish members with their He (Mr. Stafford) had euLges . Led Zffiof lamatisa end a smaller area. What he e llir eeernmeat with was not the proceeding uponTO =but upon no principle at all, with regard to Ire did not believe they had a singlearrangement made with rope* to the poor law before the assembling of parlia ment; be thine* believe they had, as a cabinet, made up desk Mlle en a //tie question connected with it. There were differences and discords amongst them on that subject, the effect of which was tomtits the whole cabinet effete. If ever them were a government devoid of resources within it self, the government in power was in that }eddies ; and, therefore, though he must str ong ly resist their plan, yet, taking pity on th eir great destitution of plan, he had ventured to throw out serums suggestions with regard to this rate in aid. Mr. J. O'CONNELL reminded the hon. member who had just spoken that he bad not attempt ed i to meet the argu ment of the noble lord (Lid J. l 1 ), that to reds,» the area would be to offer a prendara for extermination. Even the spa& of the noble lord, however, was not satisfactory. It afforded very little eneoaragementtothe friends of Ireland, and contained no outline of the large and comprehensive measures which the haw bad been led to expect. The noble lord had presented two alternatives with regard to the future condition of Ireland. The first supposed that through some magic agency, the noun of which he had not de scribed, the potato might be motored end the Irish peasant be enabled ultimately to obtain a better description of food, but he bad not indicated any plan of legislation by which the audition of the Irish people wadi to be thus elevated. The second alternative was the sweeping away of the present ge natation and the planting of the country anew Be h o w that this particular measure would be operative for en 1401 inopeenthe fee good; but he would not commit h a decided opposition until he had learned whethe o v a honourable member opposite had anythina to in lien of it. With regard to the pr op to i rrd . he mot Nahum that he scarcely knew what comes to take. He !sew that in the present disposition of the hefts the menu must have some pretext when nid e m s any aid *sea be given to Ireland. Bat he esseel ewe what wee proposed would destroy the poor rate-payee, Who in these eases was always forgotten, though the resell of le o oversight wean multiply the numbeed paupers. Tit= tem of Ireland was little else than a comm u nity o f and poor tenants ; a middle slam could scarcely be mid to exist ; and, under such circumstances, the coarse pro Pond • could not but operate injuriously. He bad understood the noble lord to say that annuitann were to be sabjected to a ' special tax, and that, if an income tax were established, is would in their sate be exceptional. It was impossible to dn. ' • cuss the matter advasitegeouly without knowing needy • what the guenuasst had to propose. The noble lend Isee thrown out a hint of a future equalisation of taxation he Ireland. Ireland, said the noble lord, was not es present taxed is proportion to her resources. Was that representation rawest ? The right hen, the member for Tamweeth, when proposing en income tag for England in 1842 stated the fiend ability of Ireland to be, in comparison with that of this country, as one to nine. If that woes so, Ireland should of course be taxed only to the =test of one-niath. Now what was the fact ? On examin ing the taxes from which the rename in both countries was derived, it =peered that the Irish people were only exempted from terse which tampon& one-fourth of the revenue, sae that the taxes which composed the remaining three-fourths were paid lathe same proportion in Ireland as in England. The argument of the noble lord, therefore, would not bear examination. Honourable gentlemen were led astray by the fact that Ireland supplied only 4,000,0001, while England supplied 36,000,0001. The produce of taxation was less only because the ability to con sume WWI less. (Hear.) He did not deny that might be considered a hardship to the people of Ulster that they should be called upon to pay this rate in aid ; but the pea. liar advantages which they had enjoyed had prepared th em to sustain the burden. He thought it would be fair at melt a period to raise a contribution from the church prop erty in Ireland. The church itself was the church of a =aft minority. In 1834 its members were calculated et seven or eight hundred thousand. Hs did not believe that the number now exceeded 700,000. Was it net mon strous that upwards of 800,0001. should be given annually t o sigh a church ? Though he had no wish to interfere with vested rights, he thought the government might fairly bor row money on the security of the property in the hands of the Ecclesiastical Corembeionen, leaving it to be repaid out of the proceeds of lapsed benefit... Again, could aoythine be more fair than that absentees should be taxed 1 It had been said teat amongst the absentee Irish proprietors were some of the best landlords in Europe. Granting this, he asked whether they would he worse landlords it they were at home. He demanded that Ireland should be credited the amount of income tax paid here by Irishmen from Irish sources, 350,00 W. per annum. He demanded, further, that Inland should be credited the ue arising from crown rents then certainly not less than 60,0001. per annum, on the security of which alone the half million spoken of could readily be borrowed, without having recourse to any new tuna. As to a poor-law in place of that he would remove, he bed none to propose. He objected to the whole principle of pen. awe. England had grown prosperou notin consequence other poor-law but in despite of her poor-law. It was, indeed, bee poor law which had checked her prosperity ; and as to in land, her poor law had wholly completed that proem= which so many other causes had tended to prolate. The hon. member rend a statement from the suffragan VAR* of the archdiocese of TIMM, setting forth the distress of the population there. What had occasioned all this distress? What the misery which was gradually overwhelming the whole Irish people ? Why, the legislation of the imperial parliament. The English talked as though they bad been the saving of Ireland, whereas they had been her (Intranet. He did not speak of their private individual ben. volence which had been most nobly exhibited towards the individual people of Ireland; but for their conduct towards Ireland, nationally', he protested against it as utter tyranny and oppression. He demanded for the people of Ireland a jut system of landlord and tenant, amounting to something at all events approaching tenant right, so that the industrious email tenant might, by the prospect of reaping his own harvest, be induced to sow that harvest, instead of spending his little earnings on a desperate emigratios. Viscount BERNARD said, in opposing the resolutions of the noble lord, he was not actuakd by any personal or pecuniary motives. The house had been told that if they did not aunt to the proposed rate in aid, the people of Ireland would perish by thousands. Upon whom would rest the responsibility sup posing what was said should prove to be tree ? He mud reply, that in his opinion, so long lie the government re mained in office, so long were they responsible for the safety of the people of Ireland. The hon, member for Limerick had proposed to make the church property of Irelend con tribute to the maintenance of the poor. But it was no satisfactory solution of the difficulty in which the country was plead to have the appropriation clause rennet in another form or for the house to be told that because the church of Ireland was possessed of property It ought to be sacrificed to a rate in aid of the poor la= The amount of exemption which Ireland enjoyed from taxation was stated tosmount to 11,000,0001. a year. But if the income tax was extended to that country it would not realise 600,0001., whilst the landed property of Ireland was burthened with 3,700,0001. of annual interest, as the amount of advances on the rental of 13,000,0001. It was said very truly that the valuation of the different unions was very defective and partial. This was tree, and it was even now a fact, that Mr. Griffiths's vales. tion, although not yet completed, was far higher than the rentals in the unions warranted, so much had pro perty sunk within the last few years, and so rapidly us it still decreasing. There were only 45 of the unions out of debt according to the papers laid on the table, and if any additional rate was imposed on then unions they would be placed in the greatest difficulty. The noble lord had touched very lightly on one of the chief causes of the distress which prevailed in the unions, namely, the total loss of the staple of the Irish people's f ood by the ruin of the potato crop. The province of Ulster had been spoken of during the discussion on the present oar won ; he must add his testimony to that of other hon. members, and remind the house that to the loyalty of Ulster was mainly due the stability of the legislative union. . Mr. W. T. FACiAN condemned the endeavours of the noble lord to cream jealousy and to sow divension amongst dames in Ireland by praising the loyalty of the province of Ulster at the expense of the remainder of Ireland. That was the way to set class against elan--a course which the noble lord so much deprecated is other hon. members. The hon. member for Limerick had denounced the poor laws in Ireland, but he would like to know what Ireland would have dons during the last two years but for the poor laws. England was as much interested in the condition of Ireland as Ireland was herself ; and he contended that on WPM principle of Ireland should be relieved out of the im perial treasury. He had often been met by the argument that if Ireland were to be relieved out of the impend trea sury, she ought to contribute to the general expenditure by means of the assessed taxes ; but this, he asserted, would be a direct violation of the act of union, and would be, in fad, calling upon Ireland to pay more than eke was able to pay, and more than she was in justice felled upon to contribute. He was in favour of a national rate in aid ; but be wu of opinion that the present measure required many modifies tams, and he believed that those who would be called use to contribute would be found in many cases to be as poor ai those for whom the contributions were levied. Still, for his own part, he must confess that, but for its inquisitorial dr ratter, he should prefer an universal income tax to this na tional rata fn aid. - Mr. BANHBS said that there were some very ominous soutanes@ which fell from the noble lord at the head of the gavernment at the conclusion of his speech, when he Weal broadly that after all we had been called on to pay, we wars to advance the money and take oar chance for the amity. And what was the security of the noble lord ? The security for the money was the rate in aid, which some Irish mem bers said they could not :pay, and which others said they would not pay. This was the position itt which they were placed by her Majesty's government, and he must say that his hoe. friends who took the precaution to have • preliminary explanation from the noble lord, were wise in the course they punned, for if the noble lord had made the statement then which he made now, he (Mr. Bantu) doubted whether he would hare got his committee. It wee a difficult matter for those who acceded to 50,0001. to be implicated in a vote on a security which the Irish repudiated. lie had understood that the vote of 60,0001. was to meet the difficult emergency of these peculiar times, when they were to colan der the proposition of relief. If that were not sufficient, why did they not ask for • larger sum, which might have been sufficient; but, above all, why did they not all parliament together at an early period, when, from the papers which were laid on the table, it appeas ed that from the 29 th Sept they were aware of the emergency ? That being the case, how could they charge persons with delay, when they asked only for the delay of a few hours, to moulder the nature of the proposition ? When government did call parliament together, they did not think at their dutyto_put in her Majesty ' s Speech any one expres sion which could lead the house to believe that the state or condition of Ireland was of the nature which they now pro fessed it to be. Such delay was chargeable upon the ministers of the crown, and not upon those who performed their duty, representing constituencies not yet reduced to the condition of thou in Ire land, to exercise the right of considering the nature of the proposition submitted to the house. He must say that when called on to advance a Anther large sum of moaey to meet the immediate exigenciee of the' wants of the people of Ireland he was called on to look at the security offered to his constituents and he said that the rate in aid was an insuffi cient one. He was one of those who voted in the last session for a property tax in Ireland. He thought it was but an act of justice ; he wished the act had passed, end these fiscal difficulties would not occur. As to the mused taxes, it was a different question. There was every inducement to en mange those who had property in Ireland to live there, and nothing would induce him to propose sr seamed taxes. As at present advised, he could not say that he thought that the people of England ought to be called upon to snake further advances anima on most approved security. The security which government offered was one which be could sot Inept. They must bring forward some other plan. Mr. MONSELL trusted that hon. gentlemen would pause before they consented tothe proposition submitted to them by ent, for he thought he should be able to show toem ft ° l7n s t r :Ajast. The ministerial proposition was to lay an addi tional tax on all rateable property for the relief of certain discredited districts. lie objected to that proposition — first, on the ground of its insufficiency for the pupae. in tended. Did any one believe that 350,0001., the sans which lit wu expected the rate would produce, would be Baldest EVENING, MARCH a., 1 ,9.. .m tit* in a iridelstissasihltir s ill 'A ' I mai l, t ei e ave lE ak ear*, .1 1 Ido not el Mg It e. w . I wee Oren again tho. brobieb; people, of Mlievel es k I , Imp,. rellentett sac A nothing Whe dose thipeeLL( I Mink were Mims eir, tint that ; imi ll i deld—Albleri.) Bat I must remind those ham that that. were also great ezertioes nude to stimulate. the indutry of Ire- Watsplant bis _in a better gosition to withstand faults at the sued datum. Meer hear.) I hold in my