The Express. — London, England, 1849-03-28 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, WEDNESDAY, HOUSE OF COMMONS.—TuEanAy, Hawn 27. The lirzagis took the chair at 4 o'clock. PRIVATE BVSINES& REPORTS CONSIDERED. —Argyll Canal (Abandonment of tin. I dertaidniS ka.); North Western Railway (eateasion of Lancaster breach, abandonment et Witham Leads branch, New.ioad to Settle Mathis, extensional dm to purchased lands and construe:Sim el works) ; Bills. WHIN MINNA — JERED.—Mdthry; Maine Mutiny; 001011 TEE.—Primmer' RMOTIII anima) M. parerwria.—ft Mr. non, hem the ome at Good How Mr. =con South Andras' Sir E. StrITOMy tea thoSitoo g teddy ; Mr. DISRAELI, ken ea hterldeol pe 010551 Mors; Mr. ADDERLET, *am New isehol; sr the latrassa of markt. into them estartlas. 110T113111 0..111011014.—N0r.. Scam.—Mr. DfWIQJ, ca as ohltt day. Y pewooe a whim to mm Wheillonto settees .llesdo. re. Atios to sheered M. Vtibbiebb sot six=Slithe mem la *ash the alphistrotke et the proOmee Autainseer—Mr. STAPPMD, lOW pert at larall. 02011- TIMOR maw for leave to bring in aim rephitlng the boors cd woes Is trbeAesest at eight. Thom tam taans.—Mr. READLAM. on *future day, to wove for hare to Wats a dB on this subject. DUBLIN CONSOLIDATION IMPROVEMBNT, WATBZWORKS, AND SEWERS BILL. Oa the modes felt the second reading of this bill, Mr. T. O'BRIEN moved as an amendment that it be read I a snood time that day six months. Ss J. Y. BULLER snowed that all thew Dahlia bills UMW bo withdrawn, and that the Juana ahead be taken up try peassioat. Mr W. 1103 ORVILLE said the bias had been a lons One Won ths lone, and had lod to peat dilbreacie of ghats. TM Lard Lint/mast had en& to Wag the an Insike psalm ha Dublin to an agreement, end it was Mimi gbh I'M wssll have been accomplished. The Chinn, of thaaratat mei a large portion of the Johanna . won of tbM he masa corporation did not fairly repromat 2 1 1 11 1 1 a gat a the proposed arrangement was that lbe corgasatiqp should be dissolved, the wards row MIRA is& .the body famed in the sun way as the anatty* earperations °titbit sistalTshouLOrd Mr! 221 two other ialboatisl randoess arporation lad 3Clto this anassmost; sad he hod ore this, fibs a etao that dm mast had been A doubling Ilsom Dalin had, howner, dant = li et WEN ansosadas hat peat of the artimgements mai ast be gasephd; as bai now to anassaies that me sproussat taistrna,zzymtho. h.,-, to ad the ohmage of Commens ul ailti eanisostles, what ma hest to bed rs for the Wash of So annyeve. Ia isesolosse vith the ressmaseshase et Os boo. henget Ws J. T. MiUm), ho wa sew im pose to harass , a matore i ter tbe purpose ho hod andel IA This wasla WHY earanal some $3l tho gonesmont adept hat the eirisametense seasaded it. It woad be- Isseemmy to _opply to the strafing orders commities hr lon' to Waimea he WI, whisk he hoped would ho gem. rely aneptate to he sWeees et Dahlia, and taW * osooltirbelosided woad be the men a bealin e e is sa& hem Asa prdiminly to their UM hi, lbe ounnassat should require Siam Om' with. drawal or the regeotion of negotiate bills now helm Vie brass. (Rear, Mar.) Mr. GROGAN rejoieed to hear the determinating one to by the government . Owls/ to the stroog pea= provallog in Dublin, it was almost impossible to RIO an y mestere which should ave genial satisiseliss. • only object wee to get a good bill; gad with the aka el se he curing that, would sines% that any Mahn t a iri ha three bills now before the house should be= the right boa. baronet had introduced his miser. Mr. S. HERBERT thought the only chases of getting a good bill wss fa At gnernment to take the matter ion *dr own Mods. At the same time, he hoped that the three bills new bane the house would not be kept in *Myna, but be lideeted at once. Mr. W. PATON r h ooped that all no throe woad be dealt with in e way. Ids. REYNOLDS did not altogether wje i x of;tho gam; L epess ob =the o r zernme r n es t. re l l le em i t dwr o f sa pcsdss d ska adieus • they were elected by a large body of assubsals , bat arit . by *AO ram psyen and they were therohn Ode better than a self el owad bOdy. Nevatheless, th ey sue el d to ormsider themselves the boginaug, middle, and sada wialsipsl respostability. (Laughter.) This holy, lawonr, gm net approve the bill promised by ble boa. salsa They Marna the ewers. ion With n t o=es= the inane of Dabber ; but this be Mr . ) At the rue time, they proposed to ve to the reasidiei rain an the powers ponnie by she pe a mi WV, sattPl that clioli"iiiNi taxa , whitiinito he Posed • Bills. eitastionr After • few words from Mr. Rinsonne sad the Earl of AZONDEL sad Brant, the gallery wee cleared kr a divi sion, but none took place, the amendment being agreed to. DUBLIN CORPORATION WATERWORKS BILL. Mr. REYNOLDS moved the mooed reading of this bill, and odd he should preen it to a dion. The Wee than divided. 1 - hiarthe St second reading Aging it DUBLIN IMPROVEMENT BILL. This bill was withdrawn. Is reply to Mr. REYNOLDS, sk W. SOMERVILLE stated that the government geoid king in a t ill oa the "abject soots after Suter. HIGHWAYS IN SOUTH WALES. ' In reply to a question by Vier:eon Eimer, as to the in tention d the government respecting the introduction of a mused for the management of highways in South Wales, Mr. C. LEWIS said that a biU had been introduced =the smoke which included all the highways and reads ia Ennd sad North Wales. South Wales was net included in that bill, because it had bees elindy dealt with by • separate act. If thaw bill which hes Introduced received the sanction of parliament the of Ilse* Wales would be assimilated to that of the other ports of the kindest by a separate act. He would peeress the second reading of the bill till Wednesday, April IS. VANCOUVER'S ISLAND. Mr. GLADSTONE wished to know from the hon. gen tleman opposite (Mr. Hawes) whether it was the intention a ber Majesty's government to introduce during the pre ssed sears any bill for the pupae of adding to, or Uter i& my of the provisions of testier/ statutes having Ten ant* No territories of the Hudson's Hu Company in Amnia, with a view of giving facilities to the roomette of Or company, or of any settlement formed under it in Vamoose's'. Island ; and if so whether stick bill would cer- Oily be introduced at an early period. Ma HAWKS said, tho only bill intended* be brought is by the geurnmant w ar a bill about to be introduced into the Hesse of Lords by the noble lord at the head of the eolo nial olleakthe object of which was to establish ones one& enure in Vancouver's Island. At present thelaw nquired that parsecs should be sent o r trial to the courts in Candy, bat as it would be impossible to carry out that act U Van couver's Island was coluiled, it was doomed Ressrary to introduoe a bill for the purpose of withheld/to aura of judicature in that Island. The bill for this purpose would be introduced before Easter. BURIALS IN LARGE TOWNS. In reply to Viscount DUNCAN, Sir G. GREY said, that the government had a bill in pre- parities on this subject. INTRODUCTION OF CONVICTS INTO THE CO , LONY OF THE CAPE OF GOOD HOPE. Mr. ADDERLEY said that, in moving for an address to Ire Majesty to relieve one of her colonies from an affliction which they deeply felt and "nosily resented, he ehOuld re vit that anything which he might teal it necessary to say 'Should be considered as in thealightest degree partaking of the character of a personal attack. Nothing was further from 1 btu intention, in bringing forward a great grievance than to 4 involve in it blame to individuah. Be haply looked on the i colonial department of the exectit:ve as the A B C of a. I problem which was rapidly working to a comelusion—namaly, 1 the destruction of the colonies. Bat, at the mum time, be • did net think that may maples or draw should stone the • mambo of mosiabsse IR atWes absrdsvancoe. (Hear.) 1 W Fee part, he bad the highest et the talent. of the I shosial 'darter, sad be fully ad that he was actuated i by a biglimindod desire to fulfil the oaf and carry out the I object of his depaitmost. He was shad last the question t be was new 'Misdating le the mho of th e house might 4 war from the Met that it was brash' forward by one so • Ode known Is emenexion with rub nalieete, or hm the 1 oubilfal nide 011ie dealing with it; bears the subject I 1 INS ONO whisk night to stand on its own merits, and should fret sized mg with others which had only a collateral • spin ils. However, he was so far fitted I=Nftess • the 'abject, hat he war quits ashant- , by say pectleete,totally uafettand by whathad pushy. 4 the present case, at lust, the colonies would acknowledge 4 li that they were not indebted to party spirit for the chance of i ars board in the lame. He spoke of that large and grow- terfalaut in the empire, on e the part of those who were i waiting tees how this country would fulfil, at 4 1 Wastes; be peat destiny—and ia no respect was it i them ia ter s i ta ls its great colonel empire—whether i 11 1 ',..,:a It its is the panel ot growing nation— whether it would treat atheism se children or aa slaves— I whither it would suture them co des/rade them—whether 1 it Wald perfect their youthful growth for the future, or • stunt the growth by Infecting their At with the weal earn.- a • time of its own deempitude. He he Ir consult the patinae of, the bates sod interest el the quallen by shortly rides the um be bed; to make. • Hie sass was *o—But Osen bakes &sided es a sew ea- I k @soviet dissWe, soda that sapielment thhertation of useless to New Seth Weak with Margent et the legislative council of thee:dew, and was mew th e m i nt e r a trr i i i t or ta tot the only wi tiali ot ts t r e fig of the ! skidelli SWIM reremonstrances, of the ',ban gelenz at il l e 1 eg womb' me stop to estimate the vase of the asomene ad hustbs mama of New South Wain, bet fhb lis might I =that It was obtained on the snare dist for every a fres emigrant should also be sent et The base • path el the astract wee Raver curial out. The ohm W the ash* without the free andsrants, and be mut mg they donna tbe treatment they hafreosived the the peva% es such despicable terms. Meth) a ir= herr has Issue to imegthe tbe degree of diementeth width the yahoo sashed in the colony, treadsfoal that is bed se sees feud riproseion in that WNW doe* tiao manor apriess width the celoniel gevatheest therm fre ea suatiodios of public °pries in 611 seissy. He either sisal thei the justthratioa im this toesselhot an the pot at the sails lord was stirthai is they MI - given a smirk sum of messy to soodase the Liz war. they bad a right ,to demariesies return dun the ahoy. He appealed to bane DOW the ht2 si s i t Imam *sir dogemilmais In oak a messer ; he with the Nudes et Westin meat aim for pupas @Allis open it in. the flat boamse ;be te s T r tea lit sostrit hie mien esti oeseseress of the noble bah lAA, amen in toselles. e a= i t o e their love el lenthr, be magesisithellimir love of - sal Omagh As te Ms Male* Wall a that die mull =L . :nigWe sloth teem the mg,' et her dem. itt A ttme hair ~dash bed lona cow bf . B. we deslieue that tide gashes shaMeliMesta tri Zme a qualm =of alesiel ai med **St amid be hops teem the et sermelery puslimeste alikel is waled to the des asi to them, In S who mime haburiled in the w rath valley et the semmay, mot to this uas hes whit that et she gbilissephy of y '..ms' vat. q He that the t e c o irarilese might not be orlolead, I lligat which he te being peembesty 'beton the bum elaseld be lambi am* fr es theithatal spired*. He said this, net bemuse be of Isi es swede the question of esessdroy s . as, le ems wan to admit, for the sake el eigumeo - t, that hie aloha us ant sat to the Cape would be at the Isms duo add to the selesias es servants, mad wail De a Neel Maims, to this wasetry. He would Oa side that it the airebes at the Caps owed to re. meert rate, hie argument wank! fah lie the grosnegsmid that if the p,emment cashed eat the asemenra in eot to all the whisks the great phut et Ms ore w fail. Hav img simitted Stu Sees mile. to raise the quad= et seethathy punishments eienli le te Rath beside the quotilmo. (Hem) He them& they Oahe deal with the ashat osestien, ma a quids. to the col*. sir. MI thueght tbsy shed& p Meer ioto the social asses c hime, and saisalms to Nimes the number of their eishoth lather than viewthe irealthemt of their mulcts in sum:alms with the selemhe. Es wadi now pocued to peers his Megalith the Cetera Doprotarat— sumely, *et bed sow he tie fiat doe sestesseicts to the Caps, meA they bad Awe es apilmet the IMO t . d n a.. aft, He woad dos_ Awes that the C ape, se sii their w ires, had the most sloth is this mod ll* hli rested to game *0 aids tet all— this transothes N ile noble was not zajwity il Oat boas, it would be a 1 alai "Md. If die thitherath policy of the noble , ,Ile lave theft thought. It secreary to pram the Ffeat that isms Wesenuoitat essmed to estet with I mud le hem the thet limit some Majous_ the some a phis boys bees sate _th es birth in Table Bay by • pidiamthregie ossirly is Ms iswiln. Although this was UM a sending out of convicts, the eolosists at the Cape migeogly rensoassrated egoism it, end the plat was erne a Wail. Ms. torreepohleam edn& took paw Wi l ms two sammadee sodgetarbe 'of state and Mr. Moutsga• re zZit the thapitereent of pewee eureka is th e . ti labour gangs,• might - Jibe give riga to the that the convict system existed t o netimeat the Cape; but that was not the fact. . .Conviete Imo now sent out far the filet time. But that wee not all. It weagersisted is against the remon strances of the coloaiMa. Nor was that all, for by a most in puking exaggeration_ of insult, simultaneously with the an aouncement of the pi* a gentleman was sent out, by way of • curious pathological experiment , sations which it would produce in the colony. There was little doubt let on that rine ; for the largest meeting that. ever assembled in Cape Town met for the parpoce of remon strating whist it. (Hem, hear.) He had caked for papers ea this point which vete .in this country for the lad two moons, but he was told they never existed. (Hear, hear.) He was now referring to the communication of the governor. He asked for the communication over and over again, but he could not get it. Hs viably might have iled the document A, when its real name was B, and there fore he was told that it never existed. (Hear, bear.) At one of the largest meetings ever known in the colony a number of reeolutioos were unanimously adopted. In these it was declared that the measure of the government deeply effected the eltaracter of the colony ; that it would prove ex ceediegly dangerous to the lives and property of the inhabi tants, and retard their improvement, and would also deter emigrants of pod character from going out ; that there were native tribes on the borders which would render the measure highly dangerous ; and th at the colonies adhered therefore to the determination expressed by them in 1842 to remooerate agairst what was contemplated. Tho.mosting fatale'. suggested that if any convicts 'hand arrive before her Majesty's pleasure bad been ascertained, they should be kept on hoard transports ; and they came to a wianionous resolution not to employ a single convict. The Caps of Good Hope had never, they said, fern its first settlement, received from Europe ore any portion of ita popula tion from prisms or petal establishmees, but on the wo man. had always required evidence of good chaster as a condition of residence. They stressed surprise that her Majesty's Secretary of State should thee deal with their most vital interests without communicating wish the legisla tive council of the colony,. and in direct opposition to the opinion of the governor himself, who sympathised in their remonstrance ; and they hoped that whet ques tions of purely domestic policy affective( -the in habitants of the colony came under consideration in future, what was contemplated would be communicated to her Majesty's loyal subjects, through the einistitutiosial than nob, before it was finally resolved upon. That was the se cond document. The third was a memorial of the colonists kthe governor himsel which they apeed to his well own sympathy witht heir remonstranc p which e wich he nand lame reed to the house. One might have thought that the Teeeption of three such communications would have produced Noe influence on the colonial minister. No sash thing. Oa the 16th of February the noble lord announced that he had carried his measure into effect, utterly diereguding the indignation which it must excite, and feeling, perhaps, that if there were not miles enough of nto diesipate the oomplaints of the colonists there wu at e ast strength enough to stifle them. He, for one, would not consent to vote a shilling to quell the spirit which such a proceeding was cal culated to rouse. He would now prove that this colony had special grounds for claiming the right to remonstrate against an Whalen of this kind. The colony of the Cape of Good Hope was an old and most respectable Dutch settlemen.. It originated similarly to, and almost simultaneously with, the emigrations to New England i and by a singular coincidence it received an infusion of a similar character to that which was ezherieneed in New England through the revocation of the edict of Nantes, when a largo body of French protestant refugees—persona of intelligent minds, industrious habits, and austere morale, joined themselves to the colonists, and he believed that to this day many of the colonists retained muck of their original character, contrasting strongly with some money-tusking settlements which were devoted almost exclusively to material interests. The regulation which re quired certificates of good character in the case of strangers resembled some of the laws of New England, and though that regulation might provoke a sneer, it certainly proved the existence of sensitive minds and of • moral and religious tone in the community, which ought to be respected and not outraged. There were other Pounds on which the Cape ought not to be experi mented upon es a penal colony. The colonise mentioned the neighbourhood of barbarous tribes—a bad neigh bourhood for convicts, as all experience proved ma —and th ice peculiar features of the country.country. „ hich ke an vasion of convictsbear &large proportion to thewholecommu. nity. They stated their own unfitness for the experiment most happily by saying that they were not prepared with gaols to remove the contamination of convicts. lie would now proceed to prove that the sanctioning of this musses on the part of the house would be a rearrgrade move ment. There were two theories of coloniaation ; one, that oath dependency was a mere slave and utensil ;lithe mother country, the other that it was the off spring and child of the mother country, and es such worthy of the parent's care. The colonists of the Cape of Good Hope, like those who went out with Lord Baltimore and with Penn, could claim our sympathy on amount of simi larity of la n guage, of religion, and of origin. De Tocqueville had observed, with his usual sagacity, that all our colonies had flourished or declined in proportion to the liberality or illiberality of the terms of their first establishment ; end this country had shown its desire to rise to • higher system of colonisattim in the eases of Port Phillip and New Zealand. This comae, had formerly tried the patience of the Americans in the same way as it was now trying that of the Cape of Good Hope. The parental inte rests were alone thought of; the filiel ream:erases was dis regarded. The Cape of Good Hope was not, perhaps, strong enough to emancipate itself as America did, and the noble lord might use the difference in that respect, if he pleased, .V way epalliative for what he was d o i n g. America emu reed heresies she said, " I am willing to be year child, lag I am too sensible to be year slave ;' and when she had @errata from England, we set to work to establish elsewhere the convict cesepcola which she refined any looser to supply. Carlyle had related with fitting dis gust, that when Louis XV. found that all remedies failed to cure the diseases which he hid contracted by his I vices, he resorted to the most selfish and brutal expedient ever heard of. Finding that be could not restore health to his vitiated body by ordinary Means, he had recourse to virgin purity in order to secure his object. Mutate amine, de to fabula norresr. It might be said, "What are we to do to carry out Oar system of punishments ?" He was not in Ole slightest degree discemiag the questionof transportation; but he must say, that by sanotiosing the noble lord's measure they would be adopting to the full extent a debasing systek of colonisation. (Hear, hear.) Before they did that let them count the cost. If they meant to make their colonists slaves they might consistently treat them as slaves ; but in that case they might bps to keep them altogether. (Hear, hear.) A generous mode of treating the colonists would, he believed, in the end prove the cheapest. It they were to adopt this plan let them adopt it impartially._ Let them not select a week colony, but let Cana&, the Teem Indies, or New Zealand, be subjected to the infliction. Now, what did the noble lord assign as • justification for this measure ? He said that the government had ' If certain sum on the Rider war, and it was, there- right that they should avail themselves of the Cape. If justification were sufficient, how had it boon carried eat? In a despatch sent out to New South Wales the noble haul the Secretary for the Colonies had instructed the go 1 mast of that colony w to employ 74 8 f a similar argument—to lay, la dbl... " We ha spent • great dral on the be or Pik red Hide therefore only right that you adi sh ng ould use Ow espotes." First, convicts were seat to create • amemity Isr a gaol, sod then the gaol was used as a plea for twain convicts. (Laughter.) In like meaner it was the keliff of the mother co untry which created I the =ass war, and then the ripeness of that war msztedig es an teems for sending out convicts. It re the saes of a landlord claiming compensation from his tenant for damage dente by his game to the tensat's pro perty. (Laughter.) In a despatch to Sir Henry Pottinger, the noble lord himself described the war as a Molest to be lamented, involving • Md. destruction of privaMproperty, an interruption of the proceed puisaits of the colonises, and all the lamentable disasters indolent to • war Irish a bar barous people. It was heed], to be wondered at that, after a war of that dander, the Weabar should have claimed cm- Cr, and that Match's should have been supported by il leadaser ; and thesis% Lord Grey, in his •reply, would sot admit the slain, he never thought of putting in a claim on the Mbar side. That bad occurred sines. He ap pealed to hos. madams opposite, whether the Iscrilicaties est up was not En mese ingsaleas One ever heed eL He drab , believed that there was searoslyeac hasnlentionem en the treasury-Mash who wield sot Wilt to Mid edema he tech en enema% and that the mile niplealicastapt leel his blood rising at the thought that 'the govilmegat had been mole remeasible Ise that whisk 'woe so of the (maple of this esaatry. He felt - whet he appealed to the seam of the house crae Onee-feerthe of the house would be with him.,-lie epathy mere thaat esseel t W Would Gut be could, tram. pert • few hen.i I. the Cape! (Grei f laughter.) earatts mince demiess a r en g s. ren t „. Ors gees east mita subsets i Let Ma. members place themselves for ere - menteat li the potties ot thine colonhts. Let them cceadve of a tartars wens that that of Tantalus. It was *ld of men in spited with the seatimente of English freedom unable to get their grim:sem heard, their complaints unheeded, while they were main themaelves ming the tombs of frustrated esergire. Did Uri house wish the government of the Cape to be regulated by public opinion 1 If so, let them not ea public opinion err:tend in the colony. (liens, re i ral s as Re looked to the public opinion of that house. He to Ma. membe whether they would save • colo- Z ka members is adaister, and lose a colonial empire; whether they Timid sauctan en absolute tyranny, which, without a mo tion like that of which he lad given Reties, would never naive a cheek, sad suffer a system to continue which would eat as a canon tote the vitals even of the mother country. The words of the motion were quaint, and •ht Marshes provoke • sneer; bat he had adopted them hesrges they wore employed by the colonists themagme. The be.. nen her Jima maned : net en bumble Wren be preennled teller tlf. lgsrleg r ikat bar maw/ en le weeks* elereo. eat et itimee the bonesellepdleantimelvelltee ether ette Nis reereforaa aria~ Weir that Ili blew% impsairotei NAM Rif b. Noma lie lieweeeesidlletien d big nide • imeleelo for the sow *eel MEIN" el the mar restr, awhile es prison" free tai s i r Win et Oiler et tam. Ilk G. GREY mall if the bra. Ira thst he bad bra much esimahat if be had hum bra a awe abbot at Ire lams of this reties co at the subject whisk lab latielard. He fully admitted the importance et*, saided, nil he emennal in of the hen, gentle- Melee remarks la seferenes le . It was his duty, beaver, to worn the home of dr orreatalaets which might malt km a rash, hasty, mad Ilbeemliered adoption of the re- 211111tiened ? Mr. ADDERLET said he meant the memorials. Sir G. GREY used the hon. gentleman must be aware that his hou. friend (Mr. Hawes) could not produce extracts from newspapers. (Hear. hear.) lie could only produce what had been received 'officially from the governor of the colony. (Heir, hear.) reeling that, if transportation were to be continued, they should look not only to their own con venience, but also to the ceneenience of the colonise, his noble friend addressed a circular to the governors of the va rious oolonies,requeting them respectively to report the opi nions of the inhabitaste on the subject, and to state whether they were willing to receive convicts who might obtain employment, the government being desirous not to take any step in the matter without first conciliate the colonists themselves. The hon. gentleman sa4 that not only did not the noble lord consult the i n of the Cape, but he persevered and persisted in sending out con victs. Now he would make this admission to the hon. gentleman, that, after sending this circular letter, his noble friend did, under peculiar circumstances, wi ngthout waiti tor an answer from the Governed of the Ceps of Good Hope, direct that a ship I should proceed from Bermuda to that colony. But his noble friend had not persisted in sending convicts subse qnently to the receipt of the remonstrance to which the hon. gentleman had referred. All the arrangements were mad. before the remonstrance was received, and he (Sir G. Grey) was not at all disposed to uy that his noble friend would be I prepared to persist, in opposition to a decided expression of opinion on the part of the colonists. lie had felt it his duty to consult the colonists, in order to ascertain their opinion. He would shortly state the circumstances under which the ship referred to lead been ordered to carry certain convicts from Bermuda to the Cope. He had explained en • 'recent occasion *every great difficulties which had impeded of late the carrying out the system of transportation, qui.• indepen ...tinily of the temporary suspension of transpntation to an Diemen's Land. The pecular circumstances of Ireland during the past two years had eccasioned a large incr.ase in the number of transportations from that coun try, for whereas the ge of transportations from Ireland previously had not exceeded 600 per annum. the number in 1847 reached 2,698 ; the returns for 1848 were not yet made. lie had been placed in peculiar embar rassment by the remonstrances made to him, not only by the C o lonial-office, but by the colonies, against the transmission of convicts to those colonies; to which the only answer he could make was, that as logs as transportation remained a portion ot the law of the laningd; aid so long as men were trans- ported, the minister fill he filled must as a matter of course wad these convicts somewhere. Ile hid received also ninon • tranoes from the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland and from individual Irish members, stating that the gaols in Ireland were overcrowded in coneequence of the number of convicts lately sentenced. He had en deavoured to remedy the evil ft' j hettblishing depots in various pl.ces, of which that at Spice Island would shortly be in a condition to hold 1,400 convicts, while several others in different districts would contain an aggregate of 2,000 more. The house would recollect t hat two years ago an act was passed, permitting Irish con victs, as well as convicts from Great Britain, to be sent to Bermuda and Gibraltar. In pursuance of this act, 700 Irish convicts bad been sent in 1847 to Bermuda. On the 22nd of June, 1848, Captain Elliott, the governor of Ber muda, wrote to Earl Grey, entreating the companionate consideration of the government for the case of • certain amber of the Irish printers transported to that island. Cep. Elliott pointed out theta( the 700 cleaving forwanledby the Medway and Bengaline, a large number were who had, under the peculiar cireumnances of Ireland at the tithe, been sentenced for steeling . food to save themselves from starving, or for politico-agranan offences committed to a gnat extent under the inflammatory incitements of syste matic agitators. Many of these convicts it was stated were mere boys, and the greeter portion of them poisons who ex hibited no innate depravity, but on the contrary, a disposi tea to conduct themselves well. Capt. Elliott proposed tat be should be empowered to appoint a committee with power ea select so many of these convicts as should appear entitled I l to the comparative indulgence of being conveyed from Ber- Enda. on tickets °Heave, to Van Diemen's Land and elsewhere. Earl Grey having consulted him (Sir G. Grey) on the sub ject of this suggestion, he concurred with his noble friend in thinking that to the cases indicated the indulgence sought m i gh t not only safely but advantsgeously be extended. Gan letterswhith came from B•711111(111 shortly afterwards, thentod more clearly that many of the Irish convicts were nere youths, not to be considered fit otjects to be mixed lup with the ordinary convict population. Twelve of them for example were under 16 years of . age, and there was one, a boy of 1 3 , who had been sentenid to transportation for 16 y oars for eitespetealing. (Hear, hear.) These lads Capt. Elliott bad ordered to be kept separate from the rest of the pet and not to be allowed to work in gangs with them. Capt. Elliott,* pursuance of his instructions, appointed a committee, whith selected a certain number of sonnets from the particular class of prisoners indicated in the first in stance, adding to these a certain number of other woven, whose combat • since their arrival in the Wand had been good, and win, le common with the others, seemed well adapted for making the contemplated experiment in e a manner the least offensive to the feelings of the colonists, and the molt beneficial to the convict' themselves. Pre vious to the departure of the convicts a selected, the governor receind a communication from the Rev. Mr. Kennedy, the Roman catholic chaplain to the Irish eon wins, requesting that nine oases specially recommended by him might be added to the number already selected, and this request wee complied with. It might be a satisfaction Ito those who feared that a mond taint would be inflicted en the Cape by the i n troduction of these men into the colony, lo iseen the statement of Mr. Kennedy in relation to the persons recommended by him. " Dave every reason to be have " said the rev. gentleman, that these men will be neod . sted faithful subjects of the queen and valuable mem hen if society, in the plate whither they are about to he Met. The prisoners lately sent here, and to whom year indulgence applies, were sentenced under peculiar circus stansea, for ateelinii food in a state of famine, and for political ethane sommitted under the instigation of other people." (Hear, hew.) He (Sir G. Grey) did not read this extract with any eke of extenuating the actual offences of the con victs in rination ; it was possible that under the peculiar eireassumosa of Ireland at the time, these sentenced ware pen memo than they might have been under tsary. eisemsestanoes ; lint to have placed them at liberty would have produced an impression of the impu nity of ease which the government could not consistently with its manifest duty encourage. (Hear, hear.) Then wee the .hitherto send them ; and, upon a re ins al ali - tbe abonthenose el tke ease, it had been deemed most expedients transmit them to the Cape, the convicts so tneenitted being all of them men mining within the de scription to which he Withered ; and he trusted that there salt wouldbewholly toremovelbess—he must call them nag gerated--appreheasion *bleb the seknists appeared to enter tain. on the subjeet. Iskondasthisyled been, and judiciously dbtributed over the ere Malan oontrol,he Weeny hope that omelets tht they tedithselly were, they would grove themselves vet assunkin to the colony. (Hear, leer.) One other smith not exactly, perhaps, coming under the general delieiteny had eke beet fuwarded to the Cape, for this reason, that his beet& was each as not to enable him to remain in Beranek eamistently with the preservation of his life—be referred to John Mitchel. It was doubtful, , however, hem the latest amounts of his health, whether he I would melt the Cape alive. As to future arrangements, MA Grey wan in no degree desirous of acting counter to the resawastrasom of the Cape colonists on the subject, shoul d th ey, on rethelien, and after expellees* had of the convicts already tramthiterd to the Cape, renew those remonstrances. (Hear, hear.) Earl Grey had never entertained any desire M nem the entinuanee of the system in the Cape, against the entinuod feelicgofthe colonists. (Hear, hear.) It would, inked, sisarly be not worth while to make the attempt, at the manse of a content dispute with a colony ',respectably naap:sed as that of the Cape. While disposed, however, IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. - HOUSE OF LORDS.—TrEsDAT, MABCU 27. TM Loam CitoncsLios took bk seat at 6 °Week. PUBLIC MOM SECOND READDIO.—Potty floooloss EMU) IEADINCL—Out DJOII lyupn flesh. PEITIOIIII.—Dy Ow Earl ti b flabar. Foyle, kir peetestioa to oirletatunt—ebs, d from dereymes Widows% we tbs —Earl of ERNE, from the haelitane ra rite ha thn sway et Alldars. payleg she hem le to the wilful friary of Meow of a "bee Mt heed, creams RoLsense maws to petsa oresetelhoo— Ma AR f , an Dowioublays s oog alyreen and the wiamoy of Mats, whoa a nee =TEfit ORDNIUM.—On the maim si Zed III2WILLIAI 4 , cmle andeserion of former rooms Matto a paths weeks In NOTIEIta OF MOTlON.—Laranes lemano.—The y e p of WATERFORD.= • . Meek aIISOOWWWISt teamed to karat reef sets themse ri rtht eiwarry, under the mineasset the tamminse d sem. edamstra. nosseom Iteeserwrns or Resareoar.-lard sTAIIILIFT. on Wash apnea • politica hen Slooltotrt, ccoltPlallgalt a• *Worn wr arab eugktrake la WA Waugh. PETTY SESSIONS BILL. Lord CAIiPEELL, la scovitig the teoond reeding a Ede bill, said its °Diet% was to place dies iod baseughs me the emus footirg as essaties with regard to pep seedess; and to enable the magistrates to same saitalleglases is eddel to bold their petty serden. The 'die sod lemma limi t Stem the retorns while bulls= pidented en lbe swam if the Marquis of slistary, spend several listened el the fa ellamuieuce to which inaglitnies had been subjected for Eat want of proper amosusedadoo. The Val propcsed that the expenses should be paid out of the county rate. TM Illegals of SALISBURY said this bill was brought is far the bluetit of certain gentler:ea who were very useful to the eouatr y, but who were wended in providing paces for the potty seeded to the number of 730 throughout the satire ands,. The noble marquis complained of the great oat which it mast entail on the 'stemma. The smallest east &the erection of any of these Wlys would be bOOl. ; and under any circumstances it ought not to be paid out of the Nasty rate, but It &call be a charge ea the consolidated feud. Ile did not think any matted been made out for the =of tkis ; he therefdz st led to move that it • second time that day six Tee led of MALE/10MM said the noble and bursa feed bed slimes • moss unfortuaats time fee Wash, be want 'stet a useseere. He eland like ram the "dm of had Wades seftensed, far it had become aimed intolerable x The peer sate and aunty rate in hie own wish of Club% Chards bid issemeed to as derides siM within the lit . twelve yeses; sod he was sot is dined le she magistrates • further ebeineskamey pewee to increase them rates until the ra per :tram diesel rotes bal been amer.ded. He thenght peeped, shouM be liable to the payment of rates as well as reed ',sporty. Personal property was that which was generally shies, notwithstanding which the cost of Illeistaisisi she gesh was thrown entirely oa the land. After a ftw weeds ban Dud Comm, Lard STANLEY thought Owe was so subject more worthy deb& lershilips * ornsidnatioa than the rapid d ame of esudy:sates. I. his own county, these rates bad rhea from TIMM he 1823 to 179,0001. is 1849 ; sad it must be remembered that they were asieseed by the local magi. steaks, without any influence being exercised over each se moment by the ratepayer". The rates were thus levied without any constitutios , check, and it was a matter which required serious coesideratius. The bill was oaly dm, but still it gave the magistrates the power to hareem the county rates to erect buildings kw their own ocesefort and convenience. They ought to guard carefally spinet profuse and lavish expenditure; and it was • matter which deserved the attention of the goverment, whether they would not erase that clause which authorised the magistrates to erect buildings where they did not now exist, and restrict them to the hiring of suitable places. A provision should also be inserted in the bill, that notice should be given at the quarter swims of the intentioa of the magistrates to hire any building. The object of the bill seemed to be a laudable one, bet it west beyond the n ecessity of the cage. Lard BEAUMONT said no cue would object to the first pert of the bill, extending certain acts to city and borough magistrate', which now applied only to the magi ° . of amities ; and the other question was a mere matter of pounds, shillings, and pence. If it was a comp ulsor y bill he should feel bound to oppove it—hut it was not so ; it was, in feat, framed an the model of the bill apply i n g to lock-up houses, with which no doubt many of their dshipe were well acquinted. After a few words from the Earl of HARROWS! and Lord CAWPSILL, which WOO inaudible in the gallery, The blarquis of SALISBURY, upon the understanding that eons anstadmints would be introduced ft ittee, withdrew his amcndasent, and the bill was reed m esse d time. AUSTRALIA. Lord MONTEAOLE, pursuent to notice, asked whether it be the intention of the government to Jadedness a bill during the present sari= for sifted.g ellanges in the consti tution of Australia ? Whether, in the neat that such is the intention of the Secretary of State, despatches or other pa pers will be laid before valiant: nr, showing whether such constitution's' changes Dave been sabosittei to the legislative council and made known to her Itilejeety's subjects in Aus tralia ? Sul OBEY said it was intended to introduce such a meassre. The papers on the subject had been hid on the table of the other house of pulianaest, in compliance with as address to the crown ; sat tbs. immanent bad reason to believe that the contemplated bill would meet with the views of the people of Australia. He had endeavoured to Wad the House of Commons to relax the rule which vested his kis introducing the Dill in their lardehips' house, but his efforts were wholly unsuccessful, otherwise that , bill would now be before their lordships. But it wet not deemed prudent to bring it in at the present moment in the other hove, is consequence of the pressure of business. Lord MONTEAOLE said that under those circumstances he hoped his noble friend would produce, as soon as possible, the papers which had been laid before the other house. Their lordships then at a quarts? before seven o'clock ad- theof elotiv'• Ia EDgland the nneefelpel qualification w as lower then Ireland ; ego eseesquenes wee, that instead of there being 20,000 m in Dublin, there were Daly 2,900, although there wife 111,000 occupation , 'Dressed to the poor-rate at 800,0001. At runt, Dublin was tatted by seven wards, sin of whom were solteleeted to collect 200,0001. a year of taxation, then were 69 tas•oollecton • and sack ward had its solicitor be board of ofilcen. In ihe use of justice and mercy, Ise asked that Dahlia should be emancipated from this tyranny. (Hear, bear.) Buds wee the object of the bill he resoled, on behalf of the corooratioe. Nererthelem, he was disposed to accede to ths request of ths right hen See =Jar Island, end would consent that both the bills be postponed till the government bill was into ; and if it w - es found to mortise the broad prisciple of no Szabo. without representation, it should have his support. He hoped the right bon. the lord mayor of Dublin would withdraw the amendment he bad proposed foe the reading of the bill a wooed time that day sir months. Mr. T. O'BRIEN consented to do see, on condition of both W hills being postponed. Mr. GROGAN wee willing to suspend, bat not to with• draw, his bill. The Berl of LINCOLN did cot think it would be BM* the government bill a fair chance, if any ote of the three bills now on the paper were allowed to remain. Mr. NUMB was in favour of postponing the bins; to V they were rejected altogether, per baps sondes mere= be dose this session. He suggested that the sewed might be postponed for three weeks with the view of giving the government time to prepare their bill. Sir W. SOMERVILLE said he had so* his offer in tbel scat sincere and bona fide spirit; but It was en indispensa ble sedition, that the present bills should be either with drawn or rejected. (Hear, tear.) Mr. J. O'CONNELL said this was placing the iniablb.l ants of Dublin in an awkward position. The corporrion ef Dublin, retuned by the free election of the burgesses, had been for 10 yen liessly (spited by some, who themselves tios mat respectable of the inhabitants, but whi t however, had net boss able to bring any charge of aegis* of duty lutanist dot asepteetics. One of these bills was peonolad by the compaetaina, another by the Chamber of Ossomemer, sad the Wady an indtillual. If id's, Weyer, withdrawn and if the govotsatest bill was not opposed,* master; of these tine would be placed is avery Meadvastegeous 'G, MARCH 28, 18f9. saludep ; and she to ache semarke on the charges whiskered been brewed sneldle friend at the head if the Onion office. la bat _am; be must *ay that it was Viva write that he had hea ts the hen. gentleman state at the emailieseseteat of hie speech that hoshnull ea etade item b 4 oonsiderstion. the gut idea what they were to do with coatis's, • as well as that of we seassi punishments; 'and his surprise was in- Waged when he hoard the hon. gentleman express him self 41,6148111 y against the whole system of transportation, which he described as a debased system of colonisation. (User, heat.) If, after such a speech, the house adopted the motion, it would pronounc e a verdict against the con tinuum of transportation. (Bear, hear.) Did the hon. gentleman intend to propose abut nvicts should no longer be slat to any of the colonise, should be landed on some foreign shore and there left to shift for themselves ? I (Hear, • ear.) Be did not understand the hon. prole- I man to object to the system of personal restraint. But did he wish to see • return to the system which had produced such fearful results in Van Diemen's Land ? Did he Irish to see crowded into one colony err ry year four or five thousand convicts, who had not undergone any reforma tory proms, corrupting each other , and at len g th being Vented loess on society ? (Hear, hear.) All he (Sir G. Grey) asked of the house was, that if they determined that transportation should be discontinued, they would not abolish it by • side wind. (Hear, hear.) If they exempt d the Car., they must exempt other colouree also. (Hear, hear.) He did sot deny the evils of transportation. Erns mast arise from the infusion into any society of a class of ' risme like those to whom the motion referred. Under the system pursued the object aimed at was the reform of that I gays, and to send out to different colonies a small number—us 11 as compared with those who were an nually liberated in this country—thus avoiding the evils which bad arisen from sending out a large mats to ore colony, and, by inducing the colonists to receive them, giving them a chance of becoming useful members of society. (Hear, hear.) The hon. member said he had spoken without reference to the men which bad been moved for the other evening. He (Sir G. Grey) regretted that he had doue so; for bad he seen them, he would bare abstained from s , me imputations which he had cast on his noble friend (Earl Gray). There was one imputation to which ice should not have thought it worth while to advert had it net been received with a cheer. (Hear, hear.) Ho teld in his hand the original despatch cont.ining the three memorials referred to by the hon. gentleman, dated respectively the 19th and 22nd of Decem ber, and the sth of January, and which we: c received cm the 14th of March. Those despatches were about to be laid on the table, and had the hon. gentleman waited be would hare perctived that the imputation which he had thrown out was sot warranted. Mr. ADDERLEY said the papers to which he had alluded were in the Morning Chrolsiels of the 20th of January, and Lord Grey bed stated them to have been in his pcsseasion on the 15th of. February. Sir 0. GREY could only say that they were all received by his noble friend on the 14th of March. Did the hon. gentleman mean to say that the despatches of the governor were in lord Grey's possession at the time which he had to do full justice to the bentrarable, energetic, upright character of the Cape collets's, he could not help reminding the honourable gentleman who bad gone with sock unmixed eulogy through their past his tory, with the ararent impression that all there had been innocence and freedom, that domestic slavery was only abolished &Übe Cape when it was aboished rn the West ladies. (Hear, hear.) Most deeply sholid he deplore, most decidedly deprecate, anything that savoured of retrogression in colonisation. He was fully sensible how desirable it was for the colonies to have the best possible class of colonists, by whom to diffuse, throughout all the dependencies of Great Britain, the habits, ideas, principles, and language of our country. It was precisely this desire which actuated his noble friend in the principle which he wished to carry out in the distribution of our convicts in our colonies. As to the extent of transport ation, let him remind the bon. gentle man himself, as a chairman of quarter sessions, that every . sentence of transportation pronounced at quarter sessions imposed upon the government the necessity of finding a place of transpor tation for the convict, and thus complicated more and more the difficulty of the case. (Hear, hear.) At the same time, be Mould earnestly desire to remove the impression that all, or the larger portion, of our criminal population was transferred to the colonies. Such was by no means the case. The number of male and female prisoners sentenced to transportation, in England,Wales, and Scotland, in 1847, was 2,726, of whom 326 were from aid age and other circumstances reported not removable, so that the total number of persons sent abroad as convicts in that year was 2,400. What, ois the oilier hand, had been the number of persons sentecced in the same year, and in the same counties, to various terms of imprisonment, varying from a week to three years ? The number of persons sentenced to various terms of imprison ment that year was 15,956, and persons summarily convicted by the magistrates 68,641; the whole of whom, of course, remained at home, to be sent forth amongst society at the expirati nt of their various sentences. He oonsideted trenspertation a valuable punishment to retain; but it could not be carried into effect ' ranks& the number of persons to be transported were kept within reasonable limits, and unless, beyond those limit., some other mode was observed of disposiog of our convict popula- tion. (Heir, hear.) He quite admitted that it was most desirable the fewest possible criminals should be at large, mixing with society, and, as a matter of course, tainting it with crime ; but the difficulty was how to avoid it. Yon could not set rid of the difficulty by the aid of capitol punishments, and you could not very well institute a general system of perpetual imprissnmeret of all persons woes convicted of an offence. He trusted the hovel would not, by acceding to the motion, prevent the government from distributing ern convicts amongst OW coltnirs, in the manner of MUMS least calculated to annoy the colonies themselves, and best adapted to restore the con victs to society. (Hear, bear ) Mr. HUME said the simple question was, would govern ment insist upon sending convicts to our colonies against the express desire of those colonies? The hoc. member who raised this important point had carefully endeavoured to keep the question of transportation separate from the ques tion before the house, but the hon. member had felt it ne cessary to introduce that question, with reference to the difficulties created by the overcrowded state of our gaols. He (Mr. Hume) bad for many years past end's. Inured to impress this particular subject upon the successive governments of the country. Let him now repeat ems:ibid. tally that the grand question of all in relation to this subject was bow to lessen the amount of crime in this country. (Hear, hear.) He should support the motion before the house, because he was satisfied that, if carried, it would force the government to apply itself to the most effective means of reducing the amount of crime, and as one of the most' effective means to the extension of education to all classes—to each individual of the community. (Hear, hear.) lie did not condemn transportation as • principle, bat he certainly considered that the hones should exact from the government &distinct assurance that convicts should not he forced upon colonies 'against the will of those colonies. He had no hesitation in eapresslng the belief, that under a proper system the transmission of convicts to consenting colonies might be rendered most beneficial at once to the convicts and to the colonies; but at present chore was no minister here, no department, whose business it was to make a proper classification of prisoners previous to their departure. The whole thing was rank confusion. What was eminently needed war, a Minister of Justice, one of whom leading duties it should be to superin tend such a classification of prisoners. (Hear, hear.) Had there been such a minister here, he would never have sent out to Bermuda as convicts, as there had been sent, numbers of bays of tender age, quite incapable of the hard labour to which convicts in that island were subjected. How was it premed to remedy that overflow of oar pole which every where prevail ? It would never do, when men bad once been sentenced by the laws, to let the Lord Lieu tenant of Ireland, or the Home Secretary in England, discharge them from prison merely because there was no room for them in the gaols. (Hear, hear.) Hire were we spend ing six or sev n millions a year for religious instruction; niftily this expenditure ought to be so managed ae to reduce the amount of crime amongst us. There must be something done, and, in order to compel the government to do this something, he should vote for the motion. Major BLACK ALL concurred in the opinion that some tbiog should be done to effect a proper classification of pri soners in the bulks and in the gaols. As to the immediate question before the house, it did not appear to him " that the introduction of such convicts as those who had been described by the right hon. gentleman could be injurious to the colonists of the Cape in the way they apprehended; on the contrary, it seemed to him that the colory would benefit by the accession. (Hear, hear.) The extended boundaries we had attained beyond Port Natal rendered necessary a liege additional amount of labour in the construction of public works in that daemon, and he conceived that the employment of inelo seen for some years on these works, under strict discipline, would at once greatly benefit the colony, and enable the convicts themselves to n-enter society under creditable circumetanger. (Hoer, hear.) Mr. AOLIONBY thought that eleatever Mitieht kg the im mediate fate of this motion, its dimeomien would domuch good. It was minds' that the Home of Commons should pay more , and more attention toour coloaial interests, interests in which the public at large knew itself to be deeply conoerned. (Hear, hear.) It appeared to him that the right hon. gentleman was dispersed to admit the general proposition conveyed by the motion. (No, no!) He certainly had collected this impression from the right hon. gentleman's speech. (Hear.) The experiment that had been tried on what were termed the Parkhurst boys, who were sent to Australia in 1843, ought to teach the government • lesson. These " seedlings of crime," as they were termed, so far from responding to the expectation that had been formed from their ear. ful train ing in the Parkhurst prison, exhibited every degree of re- Moment is vice and wickedness as soon as they arrived at their destination. The report which had been sent home to the go vernment by Yr. G. Clarke, the protector of aborigines in Australis, stated that the arrival of these Parkhurst boys in that colony had proved more injurious than was imaginable; they absconded from their employments and went to live in the bush with the natives, who th ought they derived considerabadvantage from havi ee Europeans mongst them , but f all they obtaine as a d wper ng o wl edge or vice ; and it was a common trick for these boys to write obscene words on paper end to give them to the natives, who heeded them in at tho shops as explanatory of what they wanted' to purchase. Of the two methods of dealing with convicts it was by far the more dangerous plan to transport them, instead of retaining them at home where they would always remain under the surveillance of ex perienced and competent officers. Mr. SCOTT saidtbat although the'government might have the power of sending convicts to any of the colonies, it was not wise to exercise that power against the w is hes an d desires of the colonists themselves. (Hear.) It was one thing to nand out conviats and to throw them upon the g . eneral la bour market, and another to employ them exclusively upon public works. The colonists did not find fault with that mode of dealing with convicts. What they denied was the right of the government to turn loose upon society in the colonies convicts who had completed their term of trans portation, a practice whereby the whole fabric of society was isontaminated and 'polluted, and that was the object of the motion of the hon. member for North Staffordshire. It would be a much fairer plan towards the colonists if the convicts, after completing their terms, were to be made to work out the amount of their passege-money, in ordee to de fray. the expense of their removal to England, previously to *tor liberation. Another plan ought to be pursued, in all eases where the colonists themselves did not interfere and ex press a wish that individual convicts should be permitted to Tustin amonget them. The constantly increasing amount of grime and destitution in England would always cause a vast annual amount of convicts for transportation to exist. This was a subject which demanded the most se rious attention of the Home Seoretary, whose endistroun ought to be directed towards preventing the colonies from bang contaminated by a periodical influx of convicts. In Van Diemen's Lend the convict population wet three-fourths of the whole number of inhabitants. Lord J. RUSSELL said be should not have risen had not the bon member for Cockcrmouth misunderstood and mis stated whit had been said by his right hon. friend the Home Secretary. The hon. member seemed to think that as the purport of the resolution was to stop the transmission of convicts to those colonies where their admission was objected to, his r4ht honourable friend bad agreed to that construction. His right hon. friend had objected to the motion because of the terms used in it. The expression " this hitherto unpolluted colony," if assented to, might I lead to an inference that transportation to the colonies was to be abolished. That was a very fair inference on the part of bk.right bon Mend. But what he had really said was, that if after convicts had beta sent to the Cape they were obleoted he, and if when a trial had been fairly made, the colonists Will continued to object to their reception, then and in that muss it would not be deemed advisable to continue to send convicts thither. He (Lord J. Rumen) trusted this would be perfectly satisfactory. The hon. member for Cothermouth expressed an opinion, that if bereaftelany ether colonies INTO to object to the transportation of con vict& to their locality, the government would be bound not to send any thither. He did not assent to that opinion. With regard to the general question of secondary punish ments, it was far too vast to be entered upon at that moment. The hon. member for Berwickshire bad expressed an opinion which was the reveres of that generally entertained. The general opinion was, that when a convict's term of imprison ment bad expired, ha usually found great difficulty in obtaining employment, owing to the vast supply of labour, and therefore it was advisable that moth persons should be transported to a colony when labour was mares and where the advantage Of character was not denied to them. But the hon. member was for throwing all such persons on the home market for labour. For, said he, after their term of transportation has expired, let them be made to work out the amount of their passsge money, and thue be trans mined to England at their own expense, where they would earn their bread. Mr. SCOTT observed that he had midst suck thing. lima J. RUSSELL at lent so understood th e h i. number. Mr. SCOTT.—What I said was, that the tontin e he made to urn their expenses as they were ■made nil'''. Bermuda and Gibraltar. Lord J. RUSSELL.—Such certainly w oo t h e ;',..t Bermuda and oihrettar, but it wu net desirabl e t e the system to Australia or the other colonies. It" L . . 1 to hold out inducements to comic's to stay in those n iZt after the terms of their sentences had expired, sod there were Wrong reasons why they should do ro, did exist a feeling against them. He had insea m Zt cases where convicts had found a great difficulty l a CAI employment after their libera ion. One man is whom he knew to be a good and religious pi reon. f irte,...„ meat after his sentence had excited, and hi e y orm 7. B t Mates, finding out where he was employed, g en e a t.." tion, as they invariably did, to his employ er a t . having been a convict, the consequence of was his discharge from his situation sun his retaliate le f ormer hgh;ts. Under these circumnacces, as tha l ona _ ber had obtained all he hoped for or intended by ha i ": he trusted he would not persist in praising it to a dinm7 which he must of necessity be opposed by h er B ah ... t vernment. Mr. DISRAELI hoped, after the mincer in whin motion hod been met, that his hon. friend would an in his motion. The question of secondary p could not be opened on the present mutton, mit re parts of the motion had been met, he most ray, is a fair, and honourable way by the ger ommee 7 o trusted the government would not, with the question of transp• nation .he a r Z a . 11 1 grounds of expenditure, whether it were for &Refi re ."' for any other casual occurrence that might tem 41.1 question of secondary punishments and of tam e , ought to be dealt with upon general principles. (a4, -- ,' conversation respecting the publieuien of the ratine t hß resolutions transmitted from the Caps of Gerd B y ; specting the transportation of convicts thither), Mr. HEYWOOD stated that there was one coke} sli m which desired the transportation thither of comics, yg a colony was the Mosquito settlement in Junks. (dh e o 4 There was a great dread of transportation ma var d io e u t s e c e lasse E lerci e ee of abenngelifischiesocetrieecty, effect. He this he ewas masi l= l. 4 11 2 motion. hoe Mr. IiDDERLEY begged to peipenctdolortebeitedndiagazioeio.n.gasitruhtelitlh:.,l;;;,_4:lli.eli ° H P e Pciii had te b i ro w ug h et v fo e r ry wa u rd m h P is era m te oti n on pl in oneseq t his , e2 , 4 " --" o * ti. o pe, ph eth ap o lo gi s e colonistsh e x iste d l tt f h tw. h gft oot a er ehrn d i a s; ihm e icaev x o t v: h en s i tr i rritati on a most hjanhcuiet itpoo eso readymyt ade. whenever i u r lDtedot ohhner: right vi tthh c ee t i e ngr d reh c mt ri oh m nsou in u. l i s t: f eu ro seh m moua t ni h d e ub.pc m du th thy er eoe n co ssu un idendb j try eetT o wdbystiii:ao4 :, 6.: 2 , „_ se ninoetii,ith! he ( Mr . A di v i de dd e r perseverel e t e yh y em ) ha w od s sati s fieds ue beifnuyuoitr,i: nnneiooitbirmwsmaihem i t i mi ,.. itmisteethed:uninia foil- ,tray ly es d Sir G. GREY said he had already stated that leonine ' to be clearly understood that the government did an ni: it odeimble to continue to send convicts to the Cusedg u d - Hop, regardless of the wishes of the colonies Belige — in , given any distinct pledge upon the Idlest, es g s i." - gentleman seemed to understand, but he meld N. g i ii „pee wee n t o t t n i ti n t te io n a d s e u d to th to the Cape, in opposition to the remonetramm d tio a Inlets there. Every consideration would be gives eel stop transportation to any given colony . R osen, sift, prd to the Cape there could be no misundersualbl. The motion was then withdrawn by leave. MINISTERS' MONEY (IRELAND), house to take into consideration the lo w Mang lithe et ihi t a r x . W ailed F A ' DI A N i t i s te rs' mo v edM to the repeal of so mush thereof as relates to Miff nee tax ,• and further, to take into elnsideration the Wel Will. 4, c. 114, called the ' Church Temporalities/is:it the purpose of amending the same, so as to ' ga l a substitute out of the revenues of the e go stoners, as a provision (or the protestant mialiensiseli corporate towns in Ireland, in lieu of the annual wawa ceived by them under and by virtue at the Let 17 & I s Ce.a, c. 7." The hon. gentleman read a number ot lett/stem testant and Roman catholic clerg men in Cabala! Dublin, and various other parts of Ireland, cosameegl this impost, and stating that the Remus catieliselep les tir population would never be reconciled to the plyeadt in any form. He felt it incumbent upon him te me% matter upon the consideration of the house, as end aware of the opposition of the Roman catholic el sechicti the great MIS of the Irish population to the ter , el that her blejesty's go vernment were deternisedig 0 tertere with it, he it ma who had first suggeited eimi mint of the Church Temporalities Act, by se 'tante oat of the revenues of the semi goners as a provision for ministers' money. dad Item source of gratification to him that the select comiten pointed by the house to inquire into the 'object tato roborated his views. From the commencement thistnn obnoxious in Ireland. It was passed in cons•queow offs partiality of Charles 11., and alto;tether reguissf the religious opinions of the people of that couty. S Rev. Mr. Hellas:is, whose letter was reed to theism,. a protestant clerzyman of the greatest respectability, eis recommended the abolition of the tar. In Jeep Nit till gentleman, the letters read represented that the dna of collecting it were so great, that in many intestate not paid at all, and could not be enforced. Solna testimony of the very men who were interested in then, of that obnoxious tax. The protestant clergy theme* pared to be all unanimous in recommending its Ws while the Roman casholica-both clergy and ley wal tested against its continuance in any shape or fon .: objected to transferring the liability from the ocesperst landlord or lessor. As they alleged, if any of theelpo to the tax were removed, it would be gine, it adee be perpetuated ,• and that of itself they eeteetasilett! jectionable. The grounds of their objection were proper certainly. They objected to it as an Mies tax, imposed for the support of a mielaro whom they received no spiritual instructios whams . Roman catholies of Ireland have no idea of subro' impcsition of this tax to support in effluence a clergy of a church from whose tenets they . &hogs But, independent of the feelings and opinions of catholice of Ireland, there were various griet out of the mode in which the tax was levied specially objectionable. By the law in Ireland Oct, when once a house wasvalued, eventhough , been 100 yeas. ago, that valuation continued, pme of ministers' money, although the pruperti Men deeneaesd to less than half the value in Yes, even though the property might have teem =dill tke old a g to i t. valuation continued, sad mordin In corporate town' . groat hardship, because the poor were most and in Ireland it was well known that the almost all the corporate towns were Roman e He did not wish to trespass too much on the hou se could cite hundreds of similar instances to prove tl tics of this tax, arising out of the system of vale collection. He would merely me ntion one other to the mode of collection, and he was sure the hos agree with him in disapproving of it. The tan cell power to go to any poor man's house without any tort to distrain, and without notice he edgy poor man's effects for land than half their Mae. were anxious to perpetuate the tax should, st prepared to modify the valuation, and render 1 altert less objectionable. Why should not the ther cast upon the landlords, and the - fees, if the substitute suggested was not a clergy of the protestant church were remittal!. stances, scarcely any portion of the tas. sad I' ~ had not declared that it must be paid to • burgess to his franchise, they would receive ad He maintained that the sale of perpetuities shoed dered as income, and if that principle was whistle', Church Temporalities Act admitted it), it we ekly there would be an ample surplus for providial' for ministers' money. Every encouragement !e• to the tenant to purchase the perpetuity. was this : The owlesiutical commissioners . sum of 100,000/. of the government; they bed and they still owed government 40,0001. Osei for borrowing this money was to psy it one t If government admitted that ministers' - mice, and if they were disposed to est their committee, they were bound at oral sum [litre an hon. member moved counted. Strangers were ordered to settle found that 40 members, the required nut and the house resumed.] lie had ' if the house consented to this re to have the bill printed and submitted .. the house. He begged to move, in con mitt.. of the whole house do to-morrow tion the subject of ministers' money in Mr. J. O'CONNELL seconded the • Mr. GROGAN said that the quest self into this, that ministers' money was statutory enactment. The truth was, t h willing to pay anything they could avoid, vernment, to obtain a fresh tax, had or property of the established church, the l sanction the proposition of leaving 6 00 • provision or maintenance. The committee, of a majority of members entertaining the' member for Cork, had made a report boldly maintained was based on r sophism. Some of the witnesses de the inequalities or injustice of the tax to cause it would render the tax less obnoniom had arrived at a resolution that the boat 'loners were adequate to the existiog Mid was clear that they were no t adequate to There wore grievances attending the I which he was anxious to see rectified. - the motion was, in his opinion, not to resort rpmf for a iratte o nth e ee d if to o rfw, settlement t u i n t r ek j on en c e guo o fds of the , a wwh t o va su Wee thatia 0 ne when riff , deny was adopted. Under these that the house would pause before Lion of the hon. member for Cork. . inse i l O i S tucoonh ß .ensi O lyty ll (dHusl N erareartedi E sthi,o th bihn i w u oE g h.o) h onil t aglyliil th rhew a tak t esuni t pi bi : s cr u bm w : :: ,.. , o r of religious liberty, not argued in the pa thmeanheethomatierghbolr.idomeld'opstlelasarhaberlivaknee.dhoittodemrheeadbeel)rdeubrreed2::b°?n Ili ,t as en Wig r • tidos trbelne ea of sabwillelli flumes endiwnll pinions thell 'owl pima* levied AA. . Ireland spleen nthoughittle =tinned, is e to property e value lathe have *ems Ilet nued, end Ow see town Oats Were neat de sun that the le ero Boman • on the ha" te el to peeve 61 , patent el vale& in one ether elo s sure the bowel , The tar colo cute without We otice he ernhl their flier. TM' dytuld, at all reW ad render the or? add not the Ind the 0000 0 7 1 ma not earl receiving, I he tar, receiving, be paid 0 se: old receive etuitits shoath' le was adwittell.; it), it wealit or • ' providiel ragement e 'etuity. The winners had t, 10 ,1 • they hadto B4 '., ,0001. °IA", ay it OW t 0..":, igen' went/ Il i % t de cseel c*, it once tow" ggTe d that 01 ,.. ; to withdraw, w red nusher_lr. bad pc•* o- 0 is motion in , tted te tits ' go in conclesita. torrel , * ll° '" sy in Irslend: the modal. raestion nmplf ney oaf ,01‘ a was chef had 10* th_thg'Mg." -- ;rug ow :000000 r..- inieg WI! port OW o d n ecial ettit y li b. t a i be obsoSi. 011 11 t the reoul Gdng degas** g g g the g cc ti tteL 1 .118 gK tot to row* different cheese° t when I/ ti a lewth et . f a subm w it ( o a &W costes" to e it ac;*d'a loth • c. tos o it this was a as g lop raped" 6f 0 1 e ntice e a it mostoer. w o n up , in the Pelw""" r ai knot the In ar —an blue-booh i d rea d it linos rat oi r t d c f