The Express. — London, England, 1848-02-08 00:00:00

THE EXPRESS, TUESDAY EVENING, FEBRUARY 8,.1848. terfere with the produce of our own colonies. (Hear, boar.) By a sudden and rapid change of legislation, bowies; in 1816, not only was slave-grown sugar introduced in compe tition with free-grown saga, hut instead of a discriminating duty of 12s it wss reduced to 75., and was to diminish year by year until in the coune of pie years Cuba and Brazils were to be placed on precisely the same footing as our own colenies, with this exception, that the former had an unli mited supply of cheap labour, which our own colonies wen Free:mated trom motives of humanity obtaining. He said, then, that the act of 1846 was • bounty to sla very. (Hear, hear, hear.) They were wasting the energies of their seamen upon the enfeebling, pestilential coast of Africa, in an attempt which it was contained was hopeless—for slavery was increasing, spite of all their efforts —they were incurring all this expen.e and sacrifice of human life to put down a traffic which they were now pay ing Cuba and Brazil to eneourege. (Cheers.) Another important consideration was the consequences of the act complained of in reference to our East Indian possessions. In the bleu ritius • large quantity of Bug .r was produced; but the case of India was most remarkable. In the years 1834 .5, the total exports from India were 1.826,0001.; in 1846, the total exports were 4,469,0001. The ,sports of sugar in 1816.7, in stead of 134,000 cwt., were 1,097,000 cwt. But if the price in this country was reduced so low as that sugar in Calcutta would not produce 201., the importetion from that quieter would cease; and let their lordships remember what the couesquences would be in the loss of remittances, the ship: ping employed, and in the manufactures taken from this country in exchange fer sugar from India. Why what quan tity of British manufactured gods did their lordship' suppose were exported to In lia ? The total imports into India in the years 1834 5 were 1,674,000/.. hut in 1816.7 they were 4,240,0001., being an increase of 2,660,0001. In 1834-6 736,0001. was the value of the cotton imported, and is 1846-7 the value •: the cotton imported had in-' creased to 3,087,0001 • and of the whole imports of India, amounting to 2,603,060/., the increase in cotton alone was 2,300,0001. (lieu, hear.) He contended, then, that the supply of sugar from India wee of great importance to this country. (Hear. hear.) The consomption of sugar in this country during the last year had exceeded the usual quantity by 40,000 tone, and it had been attributed to free trade; but the fact was that, encouraged by the promises of protection, our own countr)no-n and culonists had applied their skill and capital, and had produced a greater quantity of sugar than ever they had done before ; and the result of the act of 1846 wou'd be to consign to utter ruin and bankruptcy every one of our Wes: India colonies. The prices in this country had fallen from 355., 361 t, 375., and 38s. per cwt., down to 21s. (he believed it was new 23.1.), all of which was to he attributed to the same cause, involving a loss to the colonists in the last year of 2,40,0001. The prices of sugar, he thought, were fixed now, and there was no hope, therefore. of this loss being redeemed. Although there had been • decrease in the price of West India sugar to so firma an extent, there had been absolutely a rise f from Is. to 2a. per cot, on Cuba sugar, in consequence of its more easy admission into this country. And when it was said that Cuba and Brazil would take our manufactures in return, whet was the fact ? He would take • period if 16 moeths before the passing of the act of 1846, and aka of 16 months since, and be found that whereas our exports to Brazil. Cube, and Porto Itico in the former period hail been '2,309,0001., in the latter they Ned not been more than 2,477,0001., en increase of just 168,000/ Comparing this with our imports to Asia for the same pe riod, the result was, that to India, the West Indies, and British Mauritius there had been a decreer in our export the last 16 months, as compared with the first period, of 1,339,0001., and this was to be set off against an increase to the *lair:labour colonies of 169,0001. (Hear, hear.) He was anxious to show their lordships that our own colonies had suffered and were still suffering by the acts of the leeislature, and th it the crowning injustice under which they must irretrievably sink was the act of 1146, and he thought he hail succeedee in doing so. (Hear, hear.) The petitions prayed for a full supply of African labour—the equalisation of the duties on rum—the admission of molluscs into breweries and distilleries—the removal, either wholly or re.rtially, of the duty en colonial sugar im ported into this con dry ; some of them applied for a loan— the peti iou from Demerara mode application for a loan for thorough drainage—and, he was happy to say, there was only one petition, namely that from Jamaica. which prayed for an alteration of the navigation laws. If, however, every interest was to succumb, he could see no reason why they should stop short in the work of destruction. (Hear, hear.) The West Indians had a right no doubt to say, you have declared there shall be free trade in sugar, and we have a right to demand that all obstruction shall he removed from the mode in which we seed our produce to the market. But they lent sight of the fact that Great Britain had almost the entire carryirg trade of Cuba end Brazil. becaus • those colonies had no astreentile navies of their own; and lie did not, therefore, see Low the West Indies were to be benefited by an alteration of the navigation laws, for if they took away these laws, and cheapened the trade from the West Indies, iv precisely the same ratio would it be reduced from Cube and Brazil. (Hose, hear.) Ti e question of immigration was one of immense importance. He doub'ed whether it was posiilee to obtain such a supply of labour from the African coast as would produce any ma terial reduction of the rate of wages. He was net opposed to such supply, if it could take pl ice without interfering with previous arrangements. When he was in the Colonial office, he had striven to promote the introduttion of hill coolies into the West Indies ; hut he was never very san guine in his hopes of the success of that measure. lie asked for no additional differential duties in favour a colonial produce ; but he was firmly of opinion that whatever palliative was applied it was impossible for the West India c quoits to compete on equal terms with slave produce. ( Hear.) The stuck of sugar now on hand was larger than ever was known. In consequence of the in creased consumption of slave-made sugar, 36.000 tons of our own colonial produce had been rejected. The consequent distress of many merchants was most extensive. The house of Reid, Irving, and Co., had sustained by the fall of prices a less of 100,000/. in one year—or estimating the profit at ten per cent., an actual loss of one million sterling. ( Hear, hear.) Meanwhile the price of sugar in Cuba and Brazil had been raised. Its importation front the East Indies had been stopped ; and though the reduction in the price of sugar might be boasted of, this would be dearly Nought by depriving us of the supply of sugar from our own colonies, and by allowing all our love of liberty and yen , ration of religion to evaporate for the paltry consideration of a penny a pound in the price of sugar. (Hear, hear.) After all, this miserable been +wild not be °loath. d ; but the slave trade would be encouraged, and our own colonies ruined. (Hear.) Nothing could relieve their distress but a post ponement at least of the period at which the differential duty was to be further reduced. Ile, fur one, had not bowed down before the idol of free trade, at whose shrine, it appeared, one great interest after another was to be sacrificed. (Hear.) This idol was a very sorry idol after all, and would perhaps be found to be composed of. even baser materiels than had hitherto been imagined. I Hear:, Earl GREY said he was bound to admit the existence of most severe and painful distress in the colonies; and the noble lord op site could not deplore this more sincerely than he did (Lord Grey). But he entirely dissented from the opinion that this distress was solely attributable to the free-trade measures of government ; and of this he hoped to be able to convince their lordships before be sat down. Though the distress was in part attributable, no doubt, to circumstances peculiar to the West Indies, yet in a large part alto those colonies were but suffering in common with all the trading interests of this country. The fall of rice in many other ar icles had not been leas serious than in sugar; in some kinds of tea, in indigo, rice, sago, and other articles, it bad been scarcely less considerable. (Hear.) For some months aft-r the pawing of the late free tree measures, the sugar market bad not been affected • and tt was only when the general depression occurred, that the serious tell in the price of sugar ensued. At the same time he admitted there was a cause of depression operating in the West Indies, which did not apply to other interest; but when the noble lord attributed this entirely to the free-trade measures, he flatly contradicted his own clients, who dated their distress, not from 1846, but from u much eariier period. Ooe large proprietor said their estates had been profitable up to 1838, since which period they ceased to be so. This distress might even be traced to a much earlier period ; so long ago as 1833, the noble lord himself had described their condition as one marked by short and delusive periods of prosperity, and long ones of distress ' • this description being supported by • repot of the House of Assembly in Jamaica. Still he must admit that since the emancipation, distress, which before was frequent, had become almost continual ; and it would be d iffieul t to point to a n yth i no like prosperity in thew colonies at a later period. He wished to be candid, and would therefore state his belief that the great muse of this distress was the mistake in our legislation of 183:i—the de. fectiye bill which was passed for the greet and holy purpose of extinguishing slavery. Thie was no new opinion of his. He had predict d the consequences the; had followed. Even the distress hail not been so great as be anticipated, nor the difficulty of continuinir the cultivation of sugar so insupera ble. lie only alluded to this as being absolutely essential to his argument. The measure of 1833 was defective in this : instead of oOvisting the c ruses which were likely to leave the negroes without any adequate stimulus to labour, the measure merely postponed the difficulty . by leaving them in a modified kind of slavery for a certain time, as the noble lord himself now admitted the apprenticeship to have been. Instead of this, some adequate stimulus ought to have been provided for inducing the negroes to labour ; while all that the measure of 1333 hail done was to postpone the crisis. At the time he (Lord Grey) bad declared his conviction that par liament was incomeetent to legislate as it had done, and suggested that they should merely lay down the great prin ciple that each man was free, leaving the local legislatures to adopt the measure to the requirements of the several colonies. He had suggested that the establishment of freedom should be postponed for a year, in opposition to the wish of the noble lord opposite, who proposed it should take place in two months. This was too short a period to allow the local legislatures to make the necessary regulations, which the noble lord had therefore imposed on the imperial parliament. The great and paramount object I of that measure ought to have been to subject the negrocs to some necessity to labour. He did not believe that there was in the negro race any peculiar indisposition to labour, but held that they were accessible to the same motives in ; that respect as white men. It was perfectly obvious that when slavery was entirely abolished, the negroes having be- I fore bad the gratuitous use of • provision ground and hat, and wages equivalent to a shilling a week, they would be able to earn ins single day more than they received from their masters for the labour of a week. The necessary con sequence was • large increase of wages; and what would have happened here, or anywhere else, in such a state of things? Unquestionably the labourer would content him self with a shorter period of labour, and would not be tempted, even by the increased wager, to work so hard as before. (Hear.) Then the competition between the land owners in letting their patches of land would be sure to en able the negro.a to obtain It more cheaply, another motive fee slackening their exertions. And, without mow legislative measure for increasing the price of land to the noire's, be had expressed his conviction that the quantity of sugar produced must suffer • considerable de creme. This objection had also been entertained by another noble lord (Earl Ripon). Still, he had felt that it was a lON evil for the production of sugar to be decreased. than that the great measure then nada, discussion should be perinea. On this point only had he differed from his excellent friends who supported that measure, and who thought that, to a great extent, whatever was bad for the planters was good for the negro... He had entertained a very different opinion, believing that the interest of the one was strictly dependent on the other; arid that opinion he still held. (ficar.) The system of apprenticeship which the Emancipation Act estab bished was in the course of a few years abolished, not by direct legislatioo, but by a =came e which had necessarily the effect of putting en end to it. So little had the colonies them selves desired the apprenticeship, that Antigua had dispensed with it altogether ; and even in Jamaica it was not looked upon with favour. The termination of the apprentice-hip in 1838 was perhaps • more dangerous crisis for the colonise than the emancipation iteelf. The negroes had been told for five years that they were freemen, and heel enjoyed none of ti's advantages they expected. The plasters, on the other hand, had not derived advantage from the change, and there was a general want of confidence in the permanence of the system. Many planters were anxious to make all they could of the compensation during the continuance of the apprentice ship, and then give the concern up. The consequence wee that the estates were not properly attended to, nor was the co mpensation applied in the beet way that it might have been. (Hear, hear.) He would have had it applied, to a large extent, in loans for the extendan of drainage, and other improvements of tho estates. None of them things had bees done, and the consequence was that in 11,38 the change to complete freedom took place u.tder the moat unfavourable circumstances that it was possible to imagine. It also took place without any attempt by any description of legislation ray the colonies to subject the negroes to that moral restraint by which they would be compelled, like the English labourers, to work for their living. Such being the case, it was to him matter of astonishment, not that the consequences had been so disastrous, but that, on the whole, the system had worked se well. These matters had exposed the planters to all saris of difficulties—one arise from the system of taxation, so contrived as to make it the interest of the negro to devote his labour to his own provision ground, instead of working for hire. Another circumstance was one which to tome might appear paradoxical—namely, the existence in this country of protec tive duties in favour of the produce of the colonies. Those duties, he contended. had materially aggravated the difficul ties of the planters. The effect of those duties had be n to limit an adequate supply of labour, which was one of the greatest evils to which the planter was exposed. The higher the price obtained is this country, the higher wages the planter was enabled to pay; and the higher the wages, the less was the amount of labour the negro," need perform in order to live as well as, according to their notions, was ne cessary. This was not mere inference, because positive facts showed that the higher the wages the less was the amount of labour performed, and, consequently, the lees was the amount of produce. A deputation bad waited the other day upon his noble friend at the head of the government in Downiog-street, which deputation he (Earl Grey) had &needed. One of the gentlemen present made a statement as to the cost at which produce had been obtained in St. Kitt's, which had struck him as remarkable. That state ment be had been since furnished with, and it showed that for four y are, commencing eight years ago, a cost of 6,5601. had produced 15,96) cert. of sugar; while, during the last four years, 8,6631. was the cost of producing 14,800 cwt. of sugar; so that while labourcost 2,0001. more in the last four ' years, the quantity produced had fallen by upwards of 1,000 cwt. This proved that as wages roe, the labourer be came independent of his master, and hence the amount of labour done was reduced. Similar facts were stated by Governor Iliggenson of Antigua, and by the Governor of British Guiana, dated Ist January, 1848. Under such circumstances, would anybody tell hire that the system of protection had been beneflciel to the plauten ? On the contrary, he held it to be for the interest of the 'denteta that the legislature should adhere to the wise determination at which it arrived in 1846. Would it he just that the hard worked and over-taxed people of this country should pay 3,000,0001. per annum by the renewal of protec tion iu order to keep up the wages in Demerara to that point which gave the negro-, 2e. Id. for about four or five hours' labour? Without protection the planters would have a greater amount of produce at a cheaper cost, while at the same time there was secured to them a market free from those changes and vicissitudes in price which existed under the proteation system. For these reasons he could not con cur with the noble lord opposite in thinking that the mea eures of 1816 were to be charged with all the difficulties in the West India colonies. Still less did he think that parlia ment multi now to retrace its steps. Even the West India intes, at itself admitted that it would be in vain to du so. It was beyond the power of any parliament to create the nfighteet confidence as to the permanence of any system of protective duties; but it was certainly right that whatever the legislature could do should be attempted. He would now shortly advert to some of the ot-er topics touched upon by the noble lord *pp...site, and contained in the petition which the noble lord had presented. is the first place with regard to emigration from Africa, the opinions expressed by the noble lord were precisely those I which he (Lad Grey) entertained with respect to that sub-1 ject, and he thought the measures that the government had adopted were as much as they c old be in that direction. Following the views of the noble lord, he (Earl Grey) had endeavoured to extend to the West Indies all the Africans taken on bawl slave ships. These men not only soon im proved in civilisation when in the colonies, but also con tributed to the alvaacereent of the colonies, while on the other hand, if they were left at Sierra Leone, their case would be very different. It was impossible to contemplate the feature which Sierra Leone presented, without the most melancholy feelingi—all attempts to improve the negroes there had most lamentably foiled. Its local disadvantages were so great the west of sufficient good land was so manifest, and above al its dread! ul climate operated against its advancement and improvement.' To him (Eorl Grey) it was alooletely painful when he was called upon to till up the vacancies which so often occurred in the civil establishment necessary to be kept up there, sad he could not bear to send out °liters and missionaries to a place where he knew their deaths would he almost certain. (Hear, hear.) On all grounds it was of vest importance that all captured slaves should be sent to the West Indies. The colonies hitherto had been able and willing to pay the ex penses of their transit, but, leaking to the (listens whichllo% prevailed among them, he thought it but fair that this ex pense should in future be borne by the British instead of the colonial treasuries. (Hear, hear.) These captured negroes would only be sent from British settlements on the African coast, or from the Kroo coast, where the slave trade did not exist, and in order to preclude the possibility of abuse, it had been provided that they could only be conveyed to the West Indies under the superintending control of a British naval officer. From such a system of immigration he ( Earl Grey) entertained great hopes. It was proposed to give • return pa sage to a certain number after serving a certain time in the colonies, and from this it was antici pated that those who returned would report to their countrymen in Africa the high wages they had obtained, and thus an encouragement would be given to others to go out. As an instance of the success of this ! system, he would mention that on the first voyage of the Growler, she took back 39 negro men from Demerara-29 of whom paid into the hands of the crown, to be repaid them on their arrival in Africa, no less a sum than 1 1 5711. 15e. 10d., which they had accumulated by their in dustry in that colony. This showed not only the high rate of wages, but that the Kroo men, whose affection for their native land was most extraordinary, had • great desire speedily to acquire a cum of money to take back with them on their return to Africa. The return of such men must have a considerable effect in stimulating emigration, and in introducing civilisation and knowledge among their countrymen. But to gave the expense of maintaining steamers to convey them, the government had found it was possible to make arrangements, by which merchant ships bound to the West Indies would at a moderate coat take Africa on their way, and convey immi grants to the colonies!. In cue of a failure to obtain such, passengers, her Majesty's government had made arrange ments to compensate the owners by a moderate payment, Under this arrangement two ships , had gone out to Jamaica, four to British Guiana, and two to Trinidad. There was an other point which, however, only refs-rred to two of the colo nies. tier Majesty's government proposed to ask the sane tion of parliament for a grant of 200,0001. to British Guiana and Trinidad. The reasons for that proposi:ion were these. In 1834 the noble lord opposite (Lord Stanley) gave his sanction to the adoption by these colonies of a plan for raising money by loans, for the purpose of Indian immigration. (Earl Gre))confessed that looking at the cost of that kneel gattoon.,it and i t th w e gi ve o rit f.r temporary too e iya advantagescrcu character a which nd i afforded, the case, he did not think it wise or prudent to charge ,that be i n g expense of it on the present resources of the country. lie therefore lamented that the noble lord had been induced (reluctantly, he believed) to &mei-to that course of proceed ing. In the last two yearn loans had been raised us terms not die-advantageous; but some weeks ago an attempt had been made to raise further loans for the expenses of the immigration now in progress, but no offers on any terms had been made. Under these circumstances the government were of opinion that however strong the objections to 1 ad vance money by way of loan to the colonies—a system liable to abuse—a loan to this extent should be granted. It was also proposed to recommend to parliament that the repay menus of certain loans advanced tome years ago to some of the colonies which had suffered from hurricanes, earthquakes, and other disasters, should be postponed. The first of hese loans had been to Barbadoes, St. Vincent, St. Lucie, and Dominica, and amounted to 948,1501. ; and it was proposed to postpone the repayment for • further period of five years from the time specified in the act of 1840 of the amount now remaining unpaid—viz., 657,0001. The same was proposed to be done with respect to the loan of 135,0001. to Antigua, Montserrat, and Nevis, of which 102,0001. remained unpaid. The next measure which would be proposed would be one for the admission of molasses for the use of distillers in this country. On this subject the noble lord opposite (Lord Stanley) had been very severe, and said: "How was it passible any trade could flourish when the legidature did one thing one year to undo it the next?" He had said: " Last year you refused to admit molasses for the UN of distillers, and you regulated the duty on rum; and this year you intend to disturb it." If the facts were as the noble lord had stated them he (Earl Grey) admitted that the government would deserve the censure the noble lord had passed upon them; but if the noble lord had consulted Hansard, he would have found that the facts were utterly different. Last year the Chancellor of the Exchequer stated that there were some difficeltin in the excise with respect to the admission of molasses for distiller', but that the excise were then en gaged in inquiries on the subject, and he expressed his hope and belief that the result of those inquiries would be, that molasses might be admitted, and if so he plodpd himself this session to effect it. Those 'equines had now been prosecuted and completed, and it had been found that means not open to abase or fraud might be adopted for the hatrodoctia of molasses for distilleries, and ace oordingly that would be dense. The leonine. respeet im its admisuoa fog the use of brewers - weirs not souip and, thereon, that • matter would of neemitty over. Wlth rqeardt to the hies dud. the matter wee ea • the sane, hat tkat 'chide question voila properly be die. ceased la the eseasaitese appointed by the dim L honor of whammed, before which both the foreign and British dis tillers might be heard, and the duties made to bear alike u pon both. Such were the measures which the government contemplated for the relief of the West India colonise. The noble lord said they were insufficient, and that without pro tection their solomee would fall into ruin. He (Earl Grey) should be sweating in candour if he pretended that the mea sures which any government or any parliament could adopt would have any great or material effict in allaying the dis tress, or of raising the colonies from their present petition. What had protection done when the noble lord was responsible at the colonial-otflce t Notwithstanding protection complaints of distress for five years reached this country. And In 1841 ' the government with which the noble lord was connected completely and successfully broke in upon the He given to colonial against slave-grown sugar. He (Earl Grey) was surprised that the noble lord could keep his countenance when be told the house that the measures of 1844 did not practically expose the colonies to competition with slave-grown sugars. The right hon. baronet the author of that measure said, in January, 1946, befare the present Set was thought of, that the amount of free labour I brought into competition with British coloaial sugar had not at all equalled these expectations. He conceived that etate ' meet of Sir It. l'eel put an end to all confusion on the sub ject, and made it perfectly idle to attempt to make any die : tinction between sugar the produce of free and of slave I labour. He admitted that it did not lie in the power of any gov. rnment or of parliament, in any measures they could adopt, to make any branch of industry prosperous. That must depend on other circumstances, and on individual enterprise, energy, and skill; (hear, hear) and that being I so, the fact prevcd a j usti fication for her Majesty's government, as well as for the noble lord. Ile thought they were had friends of the West Duties who told them that they had nothing to do but despair, and that slave labour was essen tially and necessarily cheaper than free labour. lie denied it upon the highest authority, for there was no distinguished writer or philosopher, ancient or modern, who di I not assert that slave labour in the end was the more costly of the two. Such was the opinion of Hume ' Dr. Franklin, and • boat of other writers; and he must say that nothing had happened to shako his conviction in that truth. Ile firmly believed that an all-wise Providence had decreed that that which was morally wrong could not in the end be profitable. But he went further, and appealed to experience, which would be found to prove that free labour, when not encumbered with protection, but with things left to their natural winter, had invariably gained the victory. In America the slave states were unable to compete with the free-labour states in any one article which the climate of those free states enabled teens to grow. The same might he said of the free labour of the East Indies, as applied to the article of indigo; and as applied to sugar he believed that if it had been encouraged sooner it would, in the long run, have ren dered emancipation in the West Indies unnecessary, by the voluntary abandonment of slave labour. He was in a posi tion to show that, even at the present moment, free labour in the West Indies was cheaper than slave labour immedi ately envious to emancipation. The noble earl, in supp-rt of this view, quoted Dr. Jay, of Jamaica, who stated that piece-work before emancipation avenged from 41. 10s. to 51. 80. the acre. and now only from 21. 14s. to 31. 2e. Her Majesty's government had been told that they ought not to quote what was not official authority ; last this evidence of Dr. Jay was c irroburetel by a despatch et' Major Graham of the 7th April last, so far as stating that free la bour was not dearer than slave labour. Looking to these circumstances, he ( E Grey) did not despair of the West India colonies. lie did not look for their prosperity in any measures that parliament could adopt, but in a change in the state of aociety. Such a change wee already going on in Jamaica. Ile had recently reis trod a memorial from the western part of that island, in which the memorialists said that they had invested capital in the land to the extent of 142.0001., and that with one exception they had pur chased or leased their property since the Emancipa tion Act. That showed what a change was going on there in the state of society; and he believed that in the course of a few years more they would pet the soil of Jamaica cultivated by resident landlords, by holders or lessees of the land. So far from the prospects of Jamaica being bad at the present moment, he was aware of no part of the British dominions which off, red so favourable an opportunity for the investment of capital. He believed that a man of science, or five or six such men intending to act to concert, going to Jamaica, not despising local rope. rience, but availing theme lees of ail the aid they could get from it, applying those great principles of science on which all cultivation most mainly depend, having recourse to irri gation and those other means which, in foreign colonies, hail been adopted with so much mucessis—applying their capital in this manner, he firmly believed they woul I have a fairer prospect of realising a fortune than in any other mode open to them in the British dominions. But it was not to be expected that a manufacture of so peculiars nature c be profitably carried on by sa.nts who had not that freedom of action, or that constant incentive to action, self-interest which belonged only to proprietors. The noble earl having pointed to what had been accomplished in the growth of Meet-root sugar in France, concluded by appeal ng to their lordships whether he had not fairly proved that the distress of the West Indian colonies was nut attributable to legis lation in her Maj. sty's govt rat:tient. (Hear, hear ) Some explanations having passed between Lord STANLEY and the noble earl, The Bishop of OXFORD said he held in his hand a rti lion from the council and assembly of Barbadoes, the prayer of which was very much the same as that read by the noble lord opposite (Stanley), complaining of the same disasters and pointing to the Caine cure. The question was not a fiscal one. If it were he would have left the consideration of it entirely to the lay lords. I: involved much higher principles, and amongst them the principle of protection ; which, in thin instance, he main tained ought not to be abolish , d. He ceneeived that affording protection to the West India planter was only carrying out our own principle of having nothing to do with the slave trade, and that retuning that protection was a glues breach of justice both to the planter and negro. The noble earl had not answered—because hecould not—the argument of the noble lord in asking this question—" if the general depression of merchandise caused a sinking of the price of sugar, why did the price of Cuba sugar rise at the same moment ?" The noble earl told them that JURt as protecting duties sank, the price of labour sank, and that therefore the West India proprietors, look ing to the effect of protecting duties, gave preposterously high wages ; that, those duties being removed, they would no longer be able to pay such wages ; that they would have to make their labourers work more, and give them sugar cheaper, but that after all they would have enough to enable them to live comfortably. That mode of reasoning amounted kasst to this—that the West Indian proprietor should never now anything of prosperity, and must always be kept upon the verge of ruin, in order to make the black man work as he ought. The question was not merely one of protection to property, which had been proposed by the minister, and assented to by parliament. A greater security still had been given, namely, a pledge by the morals and religion of England, that she would thenceforth have nothing more to do with the slave trade, for the wiping away of which stain such men as l'itt and Fox had zealously prepared the way. Thus was England pledged by a bond stronger than any parchment agreement, and by an obligation more binding than the promise of any minister, never more to have any thing to do with the accursed slave trade. And yet was she now, in plain English, sharing the profits of the Cuba planter. (Cheers from Llrd Stanley and others.) It was said that she was justified in doing so, because, if she dad not, other count.ies would. That was an argu ment which the people of England would not endure to have urged upon parliament, and his answer to it was, If evil Is to be done, let us not he the doers of it." The noble earl had told them that it was an old asstielavery argument, that free labour was cheaper than slave-labour, and, therefore, that it was inconsistent for an anti- slavery man to say that our West India colonies could not compete with Cuba or Brazil. But the noble earl unintentionally misstated the argument, because it had been applied to emancipation, and not to abolition, between which there was a material difference. To his mind, there fore, the question camp to this—should the English nation, after all its sacrificer and labours to abolish the slavo trade — should it now, for the sake of having sugar one penny a pound cheaper, be content to share in the profits and the shame of the Cuba planter; for, great as were the horrors of the slaw) trade in former times, they were infinitely greater now. The importation of one sex alone, and the determination to work them out and not reproduce slaves—the infliction of the lash—the hunting by bloodhounds—were amongst the enormities attendant on that system which this country was called upon by the government to support. If they could not recall that prosperity to the West Indian colonies which they might have preserved, let them at least avoid further involving themselves by treaty in meshes from which they might hereafter find it impossible to disentangle themselves, but which they might now buret by a single stroke. lithe principles of the government measure were successful the abolition struggle would become a disgrace instead of an honour to the country—our squadron engaged on the African coast would be merely the means of adding to the cruelties and the horrors of the slave trade and our treaties with foreign powers for the suppression of the slave trade would be nothing more than an insulting and degrad ing hypocrisy. (Hear, bear.) Lord ASHBURTON, who was scarcely audible in the gallery, was understood to contend that unless protection were continued I. the West India planters, as against the slave-labour produce of Cuba and the Brazils during the experiment of supplying them with free labour they would be consigned to utter and irreparable ruin. The several petitions were then ordered to lie on the table, and their lordships adjourned at a few minutes past 10. HOUSE OF COMMONS. 7 MoNDAT, FEB. 7. The 8 vv took the chair at 4 o'clock. Several new members took the oaths. PUBLIC BUSINESS. PETITIONS.—Mr. Sheriff HILL appeared at the bar, and presented two petitions from the unpuratioa of London. in favour of the Thames Cooternney Rill and City Sewers BW. Petition be lamer of the Jewish Disabilities Bill were promoted by the Earl et Amnon and Sr sate from members of the lens satholic body; Mr. Tenasnr, two petitions from pier he Cheibire ud Laaesedre; Copt. Banner, three petition hoe amitemilemal Mr. Wonsan, from Macclesfield, Mannino, sad sibw piens; Kr. Lyinuseior the, from %%Axminster ; Lord J. Roam; bra WS aralsiv et English bar, 7,916 householders of Southwork an ma in . 0 . OTAtIrTON, from Roman catholke of PORIMOWI; lard IL osona. go, from Highgate, Melees, Fulham, ke.; lard DOVICAII. three petition from Bath; Col. Pawns, foto worm& ; H. Coz ens, from Guildford ; Mr. Comooax, due BIOIMOOkm ; Mr. E. Itosts., Brim Biotteswade ; Kr. Amami" from Illonteme, Itagbio•APeriinille, Norwood, sulifiit gam; Kr. W. Hamm, Mimi petitions ken Lanmshin; Mr. J. Chan ewe lbeeethe Jew., ma tram the dirporodons soCanis hoes 3.asqloafts of Mon; Mr. Mrsasau s lOnallrldriorh w lia. ; H. Vows* tiseallsilbed; Dr. hownwr .hu r=g,sgssmfra, D A" mcednd= ether Arm I Want, front ths • Mt. IP_ .isom mires petitions hoes Owl ; = l t kl=born Winalantilr ; 002011111Thelefloir, hose Illespy, and erici_glesne; Mr. B. from Damilltdge ; Mr. 0. Cseito. Rom 4,11119 Inhabitants of sraimea, sa94oser pleats; O. Weems, from " Mel ikon fi sit Worcester ; Lid D. tintsar,freaa the Vestry of it. glary leboes. mad Roman whelks and others of Isietieh.terme ; Mr. If. door, MOM Ipsoich; Kir.WaLrea, Smai mogerslMal floadlig; Mr. W. J. Fos, J ps tl* from Oldham s ag giber puree; Mr. Y. L Rowan, from the Jews of Sheerness sad Reseedstor from Icodwidgo and other placer hi Kent, and from the motor and churchwardens of Gravesend; Mr. Homo, from Weil.; Mr. Meyers, from Birmingham (2), and from Westhead ; Lad Haar BodTVICX , 57), from Oxford and einewhere Mr• Balmer, from Bury ; Mr. °Joao (3), horn FAinburgh ; Coionel War s:its (4), from Wale.; Mr. Corms); (4). from Caro...von, Borough. bridge, ha.; Mr. C. Pearson, from Lambeth ; Lord M. from lieywccd, Diversion, and Other places; Mr. Herm, from Chipper". b.,, ; en d suns, places; Mr. Tursco., front °compact (t); Mr. RICTNOLLOA (4), from Dublin; Mr. Massa Giros (6), from Munches ter, one signed by 3.t,000 persons, end one nom Liverpool signed by 23.60 n worms; Mr. S. C.AWPOILD ; from Rochdale and other places; Mr. W. Cowraa, from Hertford; Sir W. Cur, from the Tower Hamlets, signed by 13,700 pennon ; Mr. Ilanenr. (3), from places not heard; Mr. /Moons,. (2), from COX 10110; the ATTU.III,G.AILAL ; frem Chester; Mr.:4[l.'llloAT; from Warwickshire; Mr. °sooner, from Pinabul, signed by 9,000 person.; Mr. Morrsrr, from Dartmouth and other places ; Lord Esumarron, from Yar mouth and another place in the We of Wight, and from the Valvernity of Cambridge agreed to In the Rents House; Lord Winnow, from Lloacaster sad several other platen; the CHANCRLIOR or TIM ESCROW/AA ; from Halal ; Mr. PAT, mow, from places not heard and by O'Guasour Memos, from Killaloe aod another place in Inland; Sir G. Otter, from *men in Northumber. land •nd Rutlandithire • Mr. C. LFIVIA, from Leicemer ; Mr. lions. NAN, from platen in Cuiriberbrad and Westmoreland; Mr. E. J. Orem. us, from Chahlre ' • Dr. Bowers°, from Kingston and another place; Mr. C. ItCl.roa, from Liakeard and from Pennulec ; Lord p lace; from Stockton and other places; Mr. Eamon*, from Warrington and other places; Sir W. &moot r.7r, from Canterbury; and by Mr. F. BARING, from Portamouth.—Nurnerous petitions against the bill were presented by Sir It. Isaias, from Wanion. places fa England, Scotland, and Ireton I ; Mr. LOCKIIAItT ; four Retaken from places in Scotland ; Mr J. 1. Booms, from Exeter and other plum; Mr. LAW. from Great Stone, in Norfolk ; Mr. Darom twenty petitions from parishes in Kent; Mr. C. W. Mawr so, from Newport; Mr. IL D11.111103D, from various Saws In Surrey ; Lord LIIWNI.ANAII. from Dumfriesshire ; Ord IiOLLAXION and Mr. Isoitinu from piece: not heard ; Mr. H.LKT from place. In t)xfordiddreCand Berkshire; Mr. Ptrorras, several f rom plasm in Kent ; Mr. MACKIINNON, from Lymington ; Lord O.BLIAMIM, from places In Northumberland; Sir W. Immo:, from a place in Somenetahlre ; and by Lord R. LANNOI ; from Chlchestar.-111r. Moss, • petition from Bristol miaow env alteration to the Navigation Lawn; and from Pomfret by Mr. M. Woman against soy tomme In the military establishment. RETURNS ORDERED.—On the motion of Mr. Geo 0,, TIAZIOU• returns relative to the supply of Dublin with water, and detailed accounts of the rants, income, sad expenditure on account thereof. NOTICES Or MOTION-Cane or Me. Itsmon.—Mr. M. Mons% on en early day Mean the attention of the home to the Care of Mr. Huron, a British merchant at Coo•tantinople, alleging grievances to which be has beet, &lanceted by the agent' of the Austria.' govern. rotor RAJAH or SATTAILA.—Sir G. STAV:fTON ; on Monday next to move for torreapoodenoe relative to theme* of the late Ex-Rajah of Sonars. MILITAILT !WWII. AT THE CAPT..—Mr. firma, Vas day to more for an account of the amounts voted for the ordinary service of the Cope of Good Hope in 1•41) and 1847, and AIM for a return of the application of the sum expended in the war moue of that colony. Mr noon TGL—Lord Dynes.v, on an early day to more fur a total repeal of the window tax. Tua KONA?. CATHOLIC' Plitt-ATM—SIT IL INGLIS thiAday tOpreNent a petition from the Dean and Chapter of Westminster, against the rourptitions of the Bishop of Rome on the integrity of the British onintitution and the liberties of the British people. SELECT COMMITTEE ON STANDING ORDERS. The following hon. members were appointed :—Sir Wil liam Heathcote, Mr, Ord, Sir Robert Ferguson, Mr. Greene, Mr. Wilson Patten, Sir John Yarde Buller, Mr. Aglionby, Captain Jones, Mr. Home Drummond, Mr. Wrightson, and Mr. Elliot. COMMITTEE OF SELECTION. The fallowing hon. members were appointed on this com mittee:—Sir William Ileatticote, Sir Robert Ferguson, Mr. Wilson Patten, Mr. Sotheron, and Mr. Evelyn Denison, and the chairman of the select committee on standing orders. MONMOUTHSHIRE ELECTION PETITION. • Mr. S. WORTLEY moved the consideration of the peti tion of Lord Granville Somerset, u to the rocognisaocts entered into in the cue of the county of Monmouth election petition. Sir G. GREY said, that although he had very strongly opposed the reference of the Cheltenham petition, yet as the house had decided against him he should not offer any oppo• sition to the several motions upon the paper to refer hke petitions to the same committee. The motion was then agreed to. LEICESTER ELECTION PETITION. Mr. Serp ant TALE OURD moved that the petition of Sir Joshua Wilmsley and Richard Gardner, Esg (pr seated on the 4th of February), relating to the recognissnees entered into in the case of the Leicester election petition, be referred to the select committee on the petition of Sir Willoughby Jones, relating to the Cheltenham elretion. The motion having be, n agreed to, Mr. PACK K presented a petition from electors of Leicester, praying that they might be heard before the com mittee. Oa the motion of the hon. member the petition was ordered to be printed with the votes. DUBLIN ELECTION PETITION. Mr. C. ANSTEY moved to refer the petition of John Rept°blr, Esq., M.P. (presented the 3rd of February), to the select committee on the petition of Sir Willoughby Jonee, relating to the Cheltenham election. Sir G. GREY thought there had been already an oppor tunity for disputing any defect in the description of a party entering into recegnisances, and if the hon. member looked into the act he would find that the examiner's decision was final against all parties. Mr. REYNOLDS wished to date that throughout this matter he had acted upon the advice of eminent legal autho rity. But as there appeared to be a doubt about the matter he was prep►red to defer to the opinion of the house. Mr. ANSTEY then withdrew the motion. BODMIN ELECTION PETITION. Mr. OSBORNE moved that the petition of James Wyld, Esq., M.P. (presented 3d February), complaining of the re• cognisance, entered into in respect of the petition against the return for the borough of Bodmin, be referred to the com mittee appointed to inquire into the petition of Sir Wil loughby Jones.—itissed to. LONGFORD ELECTION PETITION. Mr. A.NBTint Moved that the petition of R. Fox, Esq., bl.l' for Longford (presenttd 4th February), relating to tile recognisance/ entered into in the ciae of the Longford borough, be rettrred to the same committee. The lion. member stated that in this case the objection was, that there was nothing to show the solvency of the surety.—Motion agreed to. WALSALL ELECTION PETITION. Mr. BAlNESe;sdea — ;;iilar motion with reference to the petition of the Hon. E. R. Littleton, hl P., and the motion was aitreed to. LORD-LIEUTENANCY OF GLOUCESTERSHIRE. Mr. G. BERKELEY asked whether two petitions sent from Gloucestershire to the office of the Home Secretary ior presentation to the Queen had been received ? Sir G. GREY ga.d petitions frequently came to the Home.office of which the Secretary of State had no per sonal cognisance. He had inquired about those to which the hon. member alluded, and he found that by an omission the usualacknowledgment of the receipt had been neglected to be sent. DUBLIN CORPORATION AND LIVE CATTLE. Mr. GROGAN placed is the Speaker's hands a motion for a return, which was about to be read, when Mr. J. REYNOLDS raid he had something to say. The SPEAKER.—Perhapstbe hon. member bad better bear the motion. It is for •' A return of the number of live cattle." (Great laughter.) Mr. J. REYNOLDS.—Oh I beg pardon, sir. I thought it had something to do with the corporation of the city of Dublin. (Shouts of laughter.) The SPEAKER.—Does the hon member oppose the re turn 1 It so it cannot now be moved. Mr. REYNOLDS.—I do, air. IRELAND. Mr. SCULLY, in the absence of Mr. J. O'Connell, asked, pursuant to notice, " whether, considering the enormous and every-day growing increase of destitution in many parts of Ireland, the nearly total want of means among her small farmers and agricultural labourers to purchase food and maintain their families, and the inability of the poor law to support the overwhelming pauperism of the country, the government had not same measure ready for the providing of relief by means of food or employment, and thus for pre venting the wholesale wasting and destruction of human life among the poorer classes of Ireland ?" Sir G. GREY called the attention of the house to the inconvenience of putting such notices upon the paper— (hear, hear) —notices containing a aeries of assumptions, which must necessarily lead to a long debate. With re terrace to the question, without entering into its preamble or the inferences to be deduced from it, he had only to repeat what he had add before—that the government were not pre pared to propose the resumption of the system of last year fur the relief of the poor in Ireland, either by renewing pub- lic works or by a general distribution of food. (Hear, hear.) At the same time it was right that the hun. member and the house should know that the necessities of the Irish poor were not at the present time altogether neglected. JEWISH DISABILITIES BILL. In reference to the petition ?reamed by Lord Palmerton, from the University of Cambridge, Mr. GOULBURN said that the noble viscount had been misinformed on the point, for the petition agreed to by the body in question had been presented by himself, lad was against the bill. (A laugh.) On the question that the bill be now read a second time, Mr. STAFFORD proceeded to move, pursuant to notice, that the bill be read a second time that day six months. He contended that there was comparatively little feeling out of the house on this subjrst, and that the propo sition was one which almost entirely ought to be discussed, as an abstract principle. It was no question of religious perse cution, of religious toleration; that question had been set tled by the concession to the Jews of the civil liberties which they already:enjoyed. Those liberties he had no denim to recil, but while he was willing to admit the Jews to a full participation in the benefits of our legislation as fellow-sub jects administered for, he conceived that it would be wholly contrary to our duty and interests as Christians to admit those who were the enduring antagonists of Christianity to a share in the legislation itself. The hon. member don eluded by moving that the bill be read a second time that day six months. Lord BURGHLEY seconded the amendment, and said that in hi• estimation the question before the house was one of no small importance, for it was whether the house was or was not to possess a ristian character. He regretted very much that the very form of the words necessarily inscribed on the oath " on the faith of a true Christian," did not suf ficiently show to the noble lord (J. Russell) that by proposing to omit them from that oath he would inevitably offend a vast number of the Christian community. But it would be heard from the noble lord that when the form of oath now ' extant had been imposed during the reign of James, there was no reference whatever contemplated to the @Rua , lion of the Jews. What he would say on that /abject wet, that the oath had hitherto excluded Jews, and what reason was there why it should now be altered ? The answer was that a particular individual of that nation could not take his seat unless the law was altered. If that was done, the door of the house was opened at once to Turks, Mussulmea, or indeed to whoever might peons money or influenee enough to induce pasple to send them to that place. He hoped it would not be considered that he was actuated by a hostile spirit towards the Jews. He had net read their history in any such spirit. and he trusted his opposition to the hill would not be ascribed to a want of Christian charity. lie begged leave to second the amendment. Mr. P. WOOD said that he had come to the conclusion, as ! well on social grounds as on those of Christianity, and as a member of the Church of England, that it was high time so disgraceful a memento of iutelerance as the bill before the house was framed for the purpose of removing, should be !swept from the statute book. 1 wenty years same he bad signed a petition for effecting that which the noble lord (J. Russell) now proposed to the house to sanction. That religion had nothing to do with polities, was an adage which, though constantly cited, was not altogether true, for reli gious opinions, which ought neither to qualify nor disqualify any one fur holding a political station, still did have that effect. One of the arguments used spinet the bill was, that Christianity was part and parcel of the common law of England. He begged to deny that proposition, in so far as the present question we, concerned. The hon. and learned gentleman then took a review of the va rious statutes and decisions bearing upon the question, and contended that, until the time of Cromwell, the social and political condition of the Jews as such was a eassu miasma both in respect to the common and the statute law. The declaration "on the faith of a Christian " was intro duced merely as a protection against the Jesuits, who were supposed, rightly or wrongly, to have been implicated in the gunpowder plot. And yet it was on that de duration that the Jews were at this day held excluded from the legislature. (Hear, hear.) But to show the animus aad true meaning of the declaration, he would remind the house that when in the reign of William 111. an act was pared against unitarians, it spoke of " any persons making protease' of Christianity who should deny the doctrine of the holy Trinity." The Jews never made profession of Christianity; and therefore the very act which excluded the unitarians must he held as admitting the Jews. (Hear, hear.) But since that time there had been numerous cases in which the Jews were relieved from making the declaratiou. So late as the year 1831, his late Majesty sanc tioned an act of the Jamaica legislature, admit ting the Jews to all privileges of citizenship, and in 1837 they were in like manner relieved from all civil dis abilities in Canada. Those colonial acts were all received sub :dente" by the imperial parliament, and there was no alarm about unchristiauesbig Canada or Jamaica. (Hear, hear.) We had no tear of admitting Jews into colonial legislatures, while we refused to admit two or three gentle men of that pennation into the home parliament. Ile considered that there was a vast fallacy in the phrase, " We are a Christian people, and aught to have a Christian legislature." Our parliament could never be looked upon as • Christian parliament in the exclusive sense of the term. (Hear,beer.) From the reign of Edward I. down to that of Charles ii. the English might have been called an exclusively Christian people, but from that time, having admitted the Jews to live and settle among us, we hail no right to treat them otherwise than as natural born citizens—that was to say, on the Christian principle, "Do as you would be done unto." (Hear, hear.) He was not one of those who contended that between Jew and Christian there was no difference. There was a wide difference ; but, as it had pleased the Almighty to throw for the present a veil over the Jew's heart, while the language of his own writers gave promise el a brighter future, let not the British p arliament continue those mists by a narrow and exclusive legislation. One word inure. It had been said that, if we admitted the Jews, the next step would be the admission of Mahomedans and Hiadoos. He saw no reason why not. (Ironical cheers tram the opposition.) It might appear absurd in this country ; but transfer the question to India, and if a local legislature were about to be established, could fhlindoos or Mahoms dens t• excluded ? ( Hear, hear.) We had tried exclusion long enough with the Roman catholic., and be would ask whethir the lung period of exclusion had con verted one member of that penuseion ? He believed the principle of exclusion to be an unchristian principle, and th iiefire he called uaon tl e house as a Christian parliament, "Er. Itec ° 4llT'Auzl'ltewr o c Ud ia ne ra ver tio ami ti t th e a a t r ell e nVanity was not part and parcel of the law of the land. The house had been congratulated on the apathy with which the present bill had been received ; but he looked epee this as • very terrible sign of the times. The bon. member concluded by salting his intention to oppose the bill. Mr. MILS ES, in supporting the bill, denied that its ad vocates were indifferent to Christianity. Ile thoueht it was poseihle—indeed the case of severel distinguished men hen proved the fact, that it was possible—to reconcile very des p rligious feeling with liberality in this matter. (Hear, hear.) He should regret it the passing of the bill proved r. pugnant to the feelings of the people ; but he would appeal to what had lately occurred, tied ask a hether they had shown fair active hostility to the measure ? (Hear, hear.) Times were greatly changed within the tut 20 years, and he thought the house would be acting wisely is legislating in the spirit of the age. He did not think that the form of prayer with which they began their proceedings in that house should be spoken lightly o: ; and when they prayed that they might not be actuated by private feelings he considered that they would be carrying out that feeling and acting in the true character of a Christian legislature by passing this mea sure. lie agreed with the bun, gentleman who spoke last that great benefit might be derived from endeavouring to emalgamate the Hebrew race with the rest of the nation. The decision of that house would have a great effect upon foreign nations. The Jews in other countries were not in that position which they ought to cccupy. They were re cently admitted to many offices of the Prussian Diet, and were excluded from legislative honours only by a majority of three. It they, then, came to that conclusion at which he hoped they would arrive, it might have a most beneficial effect on other nations with respect to the Jews. (Year.) Lord MAHON said, that in stating his reasons tor voting against the measure before the house, he trusted that not a word would escape from him disrespectful to the members of the Jewish reli;ion. Ile was ready to admit the private worth and extensive charity of many of that body; but these were not sufficient grounds to induce them to abrogate their Christian constitution. (Hear, hear.) If they were to admit the Jews within the w.. 111 of parliament, they could not stop there. They would be obliged to admit persons of any religion or no religion. Give the Jews the liberty of ob taining seats in that house, and on what grounds could they refuse admission to the Mahomsdan, the Hinders, or the professed Deist. The noble lord, indeed, declared that reli gious belief should be no bar to any person's taking a seat in that house; but he heard many of the supporters of the mea sure say in private, that though they were willing to make this concession to the Jews from respect to their character, they were not prepared to go farther. He begged to tell those gentlemen, that if they gave way now they must give way to the whole extent. It had been said that the question of creed should be left between the constituency and the member they choose to elect. Such an argument was not conforma ble to the system of the constitution. In the case of qualifi cation, for instance, it might with equal justice be said that it was for the electors to consider whether they would have a rich or a poor member. But the principle of the constitu tion was otherwise, for it imposed a certain qual.fication as indispensable. He might also instance the oath of allegiance for the same purpose. And in this consisted the answer to the argument which had been put forward in a recent pamphlet by the Archbishop of Dublin, who said that this measure ought not to be considered as one entitling certain persons to become members of parliament, but as one removing a disqualification which prevented Christians from electing certain persons ; and that it was a great scandal to think the exclusion of Jews necessary for the security of Christianity, because, if the principle of the constitution was acknowledged in the case of the qualification of members end the oats of allegi ance, why should it be inconsistent to acknowledge it in the case of a solemn recognition of the Christian faith ? (Hear, hear.) Then it was said that the numbers of Jews who could obtain mats in the legislature must necessarily IN so small that the privilege of admitting them could do no harm. He was not quite perettde.l that the number in the legisla ture must be so very small, because, though few is number, their wealth gave them gr at influence. But, admitting the fact for the sake of argument, that was no reason why they should violate a principle. If they were to look to imme diate consequences, and not to wide principles, there was no act which might not be successfully defended. Pascal, in his " Provincial Letters," showed that the worst crimes might be defended on this principle. A principle, therefore, was to be maintained because it was principle, and should not be violated bevies* some in.tances might be adduced in which its viola'ion might do no harm. (Hear, hear.) Mach stress had been Laid on the case of Gibbon, as pruviag that their forma were of no as-ail to exclude persons the most hos tile to Christianity. On the same ground it might be argued, when there were pretenders to the crown, that the oath of allegiance was of no use because the jaeobites had taken it. But the oath was of this value, that neither honourable jacobitis or honourable infidels would take it. (Hear, hear.) And if they took it, they must at least hide their infidelity, and would not be able to propagate it, u Condorcet, who held similar opinions to Gib bon, was able to do in the French assembly. At present, if a member of that house spoke disrespectfully of the Re deemer, the Speaker would be justified in interfering ; but if the oath were withdrawn he would have co power of doing so; and the inevitable consequence would be to lower the tone of debate in that house. (Hear.) He had voted for the admis sion of Jews into corporate offices; but that was quite consist ent with his resistance to the present measure, as there was a wide difference hetween an alderman end a minister of state. Another ground on which he resisted the measure wu that it would tend to make the public believe that they were indifferent to religion in that house. This consideration ought net to influence them if the Jews were entitled to what they claimed; but if they were not so entitled it was a very grave consideration, and should make them pause before they consented to the measure. (Hear, hear.) For the reasons he had stated he would give his vete against it. Sir W. MOLESWORTH said that there was one part of the question which had been entirely overlooked by previous speakers, and which required those who would reject the measure of the noble lord to propose somethiag in its stead, for the law could not remain in its present anomalous state. They must adopt one of two alternatives—either adopt the measure of the noble lord, or pass a law &slaying all elections of persons who did not profess the Christian religion void. As the law stood at present every person was eligible to be a mem ber of parliament who was not subject to certain restrictions and disqualifications—those restrictions and dliqualifications de-1 pending on the law and custom of parliament. The belief is the Jewish religion was not one of those restrictions, and Baron Rothschild was therefore legally bound to serve in parliament. By the statute for the trial of election petitions, every member appointed on these committees was obliged to serve, and Baron Rothschild's name was on an election panel. 800ffir or later the* ha would arum that he would I be appointed to serve on a committee, and .t he did me attend ha would be taken into custody by the iserje ut .iy, arms. Of the three oaths required t he taken by mumbeea he might and would take the oath of allegianee "uprernacy according to the Jewish form, but he would net take the oath of abjuration because he was required to dos' "on the true faith of a Christian." The house, bow had no power to declare his seat vacant for refusing to t a k e the oath of abjuration, and he might sit in the house dung the debate, the act of the 6 Geo. 111., c. 63, attaching ta g penalty not to sitting in the house hut to voting in it. Theu was no law or custom of parliament by which he could be expelled on account of his religion. And if he were so ea. pelted there was nothing to prevent the citizen. of Lenies from re-electing him. Here therefore was a dilemma from which they could nut escape, except by passing the mea, sure of the noble lord, or making void, by act of yaw Bement, all elections of persons not professing Chrieisatte, The plea under which this measure was opposed was th e lest remnant of intolerance. But the time was emu who a England must set the example of liberality to the world. Mr. 11. 8. WALPOLE thought that the reasons for ad. mining the Jews to parliament did not predominate over the arguments against the measure. The problem they hod now to solve was, whether a country ought or ouebt not to be governed by thou who profe.aed its national religion. Christianity was a fundemen!al law is the constitution of our state ; and it that were so, such a law never should bo I altered, except at the desire of a very large majority of the I people, and unless their own wisdom deliberately approved the change. Had religion nothing to do with the affair" of a legislature? Why the very writ under whi c h they wire summoned desired their attendence to advise her Mansty eg the religion of the realm. How could a Jew legislate Ise that relgion, when a sincere adherence to his own fro* necessarily debarred him from blending his opinions with the religion of the county)? But was it established that the majority of the people desired the change? Historically they nev r had desir:d that the Jews should take a part is public affairs, and whatever society you went into now yo u would find the same feeling still prevailing. And thie brought him back to his find proposition, that sufficiently preponderating reseals' had not been given for the alters. lion. It wee said that they had gone so tar that they mud inevitably ge one step further. But the distinction between duce who made laws and those who were to execute them when made, was broad and well defined. The executors of We laws had only to carry out the intent of tee law me m.. but the makers of the laws were guided by their own feelings- The executor of the laws need not be a christian-- it sufficed that he should he a good citizen ; but not m with the law maker. But then it was urged that, inasmack as you admitted a Jew to be one of the electors, why not allow him to be one of the elected ? But that argument proceeded on the assumption that the qualification fora franchise and the qualification for an office were the same. But the qualification of the franchise belonged to every man as a subject, but the office was a m-tter of trust not to he held by right for the benefit of the individual, but to be held by sufferance for the benefit of the nation. (lieu, hairy But the noble lord opposite had urged one farther argument—that all who bore the burdens of a state ought It share its honours and its privil , gee. The best answer to this was this very case. If all who bore the burdens of a state were entitled to share its honours, why exclude the Jew from the office of Lord Chancellor or Lord Lieutenant Why, there were a thousand tests of exclusion from parliament even at the present time—the tests of age, of sex, of property, of office, or of country. Age was not always a disqualification. Mr. Fox sat for the borough he (the hon. member) represented before be was 20. It another Mr. Fox were to arise "how hard," they might say, "to exclude him !" Property! How many men there were competent to legislate in this country who had not sottUent estate to quality them for a s at in that house. Then take the case of a naturalised alien : that individual was exyludi d, under the law., from a seat in parliament, and yet they proposed to admit a Jew, who, so far from being their own countryman, either by birth tr by law, was a native of no country, had no land r xcept that whereunto he looked with hope that God in his own good time would restore his. (Cheirs.) But the next great argument was, that this par fitment was an expansive parliament; that at one time it was exclusively church of England, but that dissenters had been admitted, Roman catholic' had been admived, and why not Jews ? True it was that they were, in a religious point of view, a divi•led people, but they were up to the present time at least a Christian people. Theirdifferences were in no respect analogous to the .venial differences betwe, n deism and Christianity, and he thougat it well worth con sidering whether a unity was not given them by the mode of life prescribed u ,der the New Testament, which It was desirable at any sacrifice of feeling to preserve. He would willingly here conclude, but as others .had introduced not merely questions of texpediency and principle, but matter of feeling, he could not retrain from one word upon Chet point also. It there were one people more than another to whom he would extend indulgence, that people were the Jewish people; and it was not until he had considered the subject well Mat he felt it incumbent to rote as lie proposed to vote. When he reflected on their peculiar history—on all they had been, and on all they were,—rich in recollections of the past, and rich also in their anticipations of the future—and when he bore in mind, as he was bound to bear in mind, that this people had, as it were, the promise that at some period they would again be the fa , • tied people of God : when he considered these things, he owned thst he felt Inc the Jews so deep a sympathy, that he would ext, nd for them every indulgence that a Christian member of a Christian legislature could con scientiously extend. (Cheers.) But believing as be did that Christianity was so interwoven with the principles of the state, that they caul- ; not be 'separated the one from the other:—and fearing, as he did, the detrimental effect of such a measure as that which was proposed, he would not consent to destroy or weaken that national character, based as it was upon Christian precept. which had an greatly con tributed to the moral and political elevation of the nation. The hon. and learned member concluded with expreseing his conviction that es our national prosperity lay deep sunk in our national religion, any blow struck at our national re ligion would shake the pillars of our national prosperity. Mr. SHELL said that had the hon. and learned gen tleman been a member of the parliament in which the right hon. member fur Tamworth brought forward his measure for ca..holic emancipation, the speech he had just delivered would have been almost en apposite on that as on this occasion. The hon. and learned gentleman, with all his habits of forensic discrimination, could sc arcely point out any arguments in hs speech which might not haie 'been urged, with equal effect, on either occasion. ( Hear, hear.) The hon. and learned gentleman had referred to that part of the writ calling them together, which bore especial re ference to the Anglican church. He would ask whether this point was not as applicable to the unitarians, to the baptist', to the independents, to the Roman catholic'.' (Hear, hear.) A great part of the hon. and learned gentleman's speech, indeed, might have been used with equal force against Lord Lyndburot'e proposition for tte municipal en franchisement of the Jews. The question fir the house, however, was whether, having gone so far, they ought not to go further, and efface from the statute book the remnant of intolerance which still disgraced it in rela tion to our Jewish fellow-subjects. It appeared to him that from the liability to duties the enjoyment of rights ought not to be dissociated, and that as every Jew born in Eng ' land was bound to every duty appertaining to a British sub ject, he was of right entitled to every privilege that a British subject enjoyed. (Hear, hear.) lie was aware that the disabilities imposed on Jews were simply coiled privrions, but all privations resolved themselves into the character of penalties, and to cite mind of the Jew the priva tion now sought to be removed presented itself in the harshest aspect. He could speak as a quasi witness in the matter. Often, ere the act of "29 was conceded, he had sat under the gallery of St. Stephen's Chapel, and witnessed the agonies under which the great soul whose energies had effected Catholic emancipation writhed, until that emancipation was obtained. O'Connell, the champion of truth and reason, was morally at the head of millions, writhing, like himself, under injustice. The Jews of tkis country numbered not their millions; their force eon- I slated solely in the arguments of truth and reason ; but with an assembly, representing, as that kouse did, not merely the intellect, but the great-mindedness also of the nation, those arguments could not hut avail. What was the mean ing, of this Hebrew-phobia ? (" Hear, hear," and a laugh.) Did they tremble for the church The church might, indeed, have some reason for fear in our eight millions of Ramos catholic', our three mil lieu' of methodists, our million and a half of new catholice ; she might have something to fear from sectarianism assailing her without, and from spurious popery and mutiny within —(hear, hear)—but from the neutral, apathetic, tranquil, unproulytising synagigue, be assured she had nothing to fear. (Hear, bur.) It was said that the introduction of Jews into the house would unchristianise the house. In his opinion, the Christianity of the house depended on the Christianity of the country. (Hear, hear.) The Christianity of the country— he meant by Christianity the belief in Christ risen from the dead—was fixed ia, and inseparably intertwined with, the affections of the people. He considered the Christianity of these islands to he as stable as the Wanda themselves (hear, Year) end that so long as the constitution of England lasted, so long as parliament itself endured, so long would the house —the burnished and unbroken mirror of the national mind —reflect the religious feeling of the nation. (Hear, bear.) Herein he viewed the true security of the Christian faith of England, aril not in a formal test, at which, indeed, the honest man w' pause, but which the sardonic sceptic would contemptuously overleap. (Hear, hear.) ference had been made to the illustrious name of Gibbon a still higher name might have been adduced in illustration, that of Bolingbroke, a man who, rich in external accom plishment, full to overflowing of intellectual endowment, trod down in scorn the test which would have ex cluded the Jew, and made of that house the stopping-atone to the pinnaile of power. There was no war rant in Scripture far this imposition of a temporal penalty with the view of propagating divine truth; there was no such dogma found in the mouth of Him who laid dun his life for mankind, and whose last words were an invocation of mercy on thou who had saerific.d Him, seeing that " they knew net what they did." But alas for frail and fragile human nature, no sooner bad the professors of Christianity become associated with tem poral authority, than they turned the severities which they themselves had suffered agaiut their Jewish brethren. The reformation did nothing for the Jews, all were still against them—Catholics, Lutherans, Calvinists, Protestants, all whe had torn to pieces the seamless garment of the Saviour had alike terribly sinned in this regard. But it was some consolation to a Roman catholic to know that in Roman catholic countries at exception was now made in their favour. In Belgium and in Francs all distinction between Christian and Jew bad bean abolished. (Hear.) He trusted tat protestant Eng land would follow that bright example. (Hear, hear.) A great deal of the prejudice which had existed at one time in this country was beginning to disperse. London had made a noble manifestation of its feeling. Was the house prepared to throw back the Jew on London, in radar that London r