The Express. — London, England, 1853-08-13 00:00:00

IMPERIAL PARLIAMENT. HOUSE OF LORDlL—Faiort, Avaturr 12. The LOAD Caaacattua took hie seat at 6 o'clock PIRACY AND MU HOER ON TUE COAST OP MALACCA. T. Earl of ALBEMARLE moved for copies of all cot respondence sad documents ia 1851,62, between the Weal authorities of Singapore, the Governor-General of India, and the borne authorities, relating to au outrage in which a junk or Cninesa sh.p, belonging to Sing spore, was plun dered, and her crew, to the number of eleven, put to death, under the pretest of piracy, by the rsjsh of Tringamn, • Malay prince, on the coast of Malacca. His object was to Otani compensation for the outrage committed by an independent rajah on the E istern coast of H daces, be ing um of the four plants known as the Eastern Settlement„ Ent (MANVILLE said there would be no objection to the production of tne papers for which the noble ear) bad moved. RUSSIA AND TURKEY. The Earl of 3IALMESBURY aid he had risen pursuant to notice to move for translations of two manifestoes which had been published in the St l'et,rabora Gazelle, and any answer or notice that might have been taken of these documents by the noble earl, the Secretary for Foreign Adair.. Ile, of course, conceded the argument that depre cated premature diacussion, but the production of papers of this kind was not to be plated in the same category as the disclosure of still pending negotiations. He regretted that our government had not noticed these manifestoes as the French government had done in an able a manner, nor could he understand the reasons which could have in assented her Majeaty'a ministers in their silence. There were ample precedents for compliance with the motion he was then about to make. en Lill, when the French Army, under the Duc D'Augoulense, entered Spain, Mr. Canning published papers on the subject within twenty-four hours of the arrival of the intelligence. To come down to a much later period it was not many months sines Lord I. Russell had published the despatches having reference to the Medial airtir in Tuscany. Ile would remind his noble friend that after 38 years of peace the public mind was extremely sen sitive to the least rumour of disturbance in our relations with foreign countries, a fact which was proved by the agitation which hal marked the ry■see of recent events. He feared that the language of tge press during eleven months had made ►strung impression on foreign courts, but above all upon the Court of Russia. If such an impression ex isted, and ha knew that it did exist, how much must it have keen strengthened by the circumstances that followed? Lord Dolby's government resigned on the 28th of Decem ber, and her Bliijesty's present government succeeded. The eyes of all Europe were at once turned on the foreign po licy of the new government, which was canvassed in every Mtn in Europe. Those governments being aware of the previous language of the press, bad also had their atten tion much attracted by speeches mode by two members of the present government,—the First Lord of the Admiralty and the President of the Board of Control. The speakers did not hesitate openly to ceodernn the policy and chars tor of the present Immo of the French, the ally of her Majesty, god to abuse the French people for their choice of that grime ea a ruler. Such speeches must ale have made an lmpresaion on the Emperor of Russia, supposlag him to edlime to the traditions of his family. It was generally admitted that with England and France disunited, Turkey must fall ; and the hope was strengthened by the sroderato leaguer, which we had held on the occasion of Austria's conduct in the Montenegrin question. The noble owl proceeded to recapitulate the transactions of the Bast, all of which an familiar to the public. The policy which the late government adopted towards foreign nations was this, they declared that any attempt to »move the ancient land marks and boundaries which ex isted in Europe would receive a determined resistance on the part of England ; and he thought the present govern nest upon coming into office must have felt the happy results which Wowed the announcement of that policy. That policy had received the alliance of France, and if Turkey had been laved from Ring= aggression he thought this merit of it was doe to France and England. This was not the only fruits which had grown out of the policy first propounded by the late government, but it was enough to satisfy the country that the feeling was both sound and just. It was hardly necessary for him to point out the immense importance of maintaining the lads• pendency of Turkey. He should abstain as little as possible from touching upon that extensive subject. Them wet* Mims politicians, however, who did not begat' (*declare that the maintenance of Turkey was not worth the mat which it involved, while some others went the length of pretesting that if our Indian empire could only be approached through Tarkey it was hardly worth keeping. It was needless to mower each politicians—(hear, hear)—but it was right that he should remind those who held out such language that our trade with Turkey was at least two-thirds better than it was with Russia. There were, however, other con siderations besides those of trade which made it of the ut most importance that the independent* of Turkey should be maintained ; for, if Constantinople should fall into the bands of Russia, there would immediately be three great powers in possession of the Mediterranean, at present it was in possession of England and France, but only let • third power creep in, and two of the power , could combine together to keep the third out. He could not, therefore, conceive anything which was of more im portance to this country than that the *aiming state of things at Constantinople and in the Sea of Marmots should be maintained. (Hear, kw.) Before he sat down, Ise inked their lordships to follow hint through a rapid sketch of what had occurred at Turkey during the last throe or four months. With regard to the crossing of the Pruth, he must my that this was nothing more see less than an set of invasion. It was a violation of the treaty of Adrianople, which recognised the Principa lities as part of the Ottoman Empire, and, therefore, there could be no question as to whom these pro-. hates belonged. On the sth of July the Russians bad not only creamed the Pruth, but they had usurped all the functions of the governments of the Principalities, as that this occupation was quite • penal thing to th►t which existing treatise might be supposed to amities, suck as entering to enforce meat of • claim at to 'oppress as insurrection. There was no analogy between this occupa tion and such • Nee as either of those which he had just motioned, and therefcce he eeuld not help thinking that the government sommitted an error in net at once pronounc ing this act of Reeds to be • ensue b.Ui, and immediately proseediag to enter the Dardanelles. Had the government taken th►t tonne we should have been in a much better position than we were now, set only with respect to the negotiations which were at present going on, but also with regard to the Turkish population of Constantinople, who, during the late occurrences were In such a state of excitement that the wonder was that they did not force the government into mineurse which mart have rendered a war inevitable. It would have shown the world that a pro- Motive policy towards Turkey was not inconsistent with the spirit dour free institutions ; and thanking their lordships for the attention which they had paid him he must again express his conviction that for the sake of sustaining the interest of our common country in the eye. of the world, the government would have acted more wisely had they been more open in the polity which they were pur suing towards Turkey. (Cheers.) The Earl of CLARENDON—My lords, I certainly was I I not prepared, when my noble friend gave me notice of the question he woe going to put, for so long a speech, very in teresting, certainly, but still so long. and consisting of se many narratives as my noble friend had given. There are parts of his speech which I hope he will not think me dis courteous if I decline to follow. My noble friend has laid dews various prepositions which no one would think of dis puting, and he has also made allusions and statements which, in the present state of again, I think it my public duty not to notice, for the same reason that I hare hereto- fore refused to answer ; and I assure my noble friend that it is very painful to me to hays to give the same answers to questions over and over again, and to decline to lay before your lordships, and the country lave a right to @spoilt, to remove the state of anxious suspense that has so lose lasted, which interferes with all the bosoms transactions of the country, and which has led to feelings of impatience and indigna tion. Aced I assure my noble friend that it is with great reluctance, and hos lathing but a sense of public duty, that I still adhere to that principle which has been the principle of all former governments of this country, and has been iai.etioned by parliament—namely, that of not making communications while negotiations were pending, and of not laying btfore parliament separate despatches or portions of despatches. (Hear, hear.) But with respect to the an- ewer to that circular to which my noble friend has again alluded, I ware him that it is in argument the ease, and in tone not less firm and moderate than the Preach govern meat—of which he has expressed his satisfaction. And it is, as I have said, nothing but a sense of duty that prevents me giving myself the satisfaction of laying that sower on your lordships' table. But her Majesty's government on anxious to do sad say nothiag that can impede the peaceful solution of this embarrassiai quetioa—(shears)— for our object is , and it mast los that of year lordships, the mismanage lipase; hat pease, as I ban amid behre, eft sistent with the national honour and the National frith s and therefore with the national interests. (Hear.} For i i my lords, I an, sure her blajestres govisrefent would fll rem. *est the feelings ~ f the country, and they goad not rely upon any support from your lordshipi or from the public if peace ware purchased on any other tereas. In one portion of my noble friend's speech with reference to the alliance with France, he has reviewed the circumstances that might have influenced, and next the reasons that may have in duced the Emperor of Russia to take the course he did. My noble friend began with a full review of his policy during the time he was himself in offie., against which I ant not prepared to say anything. He has alluded te the abuse which has been directed against himself by the press. That the attacks of certain newspapers—be cause I do not apprehend they all joined in each attaeks—but that the attacks of certain newspapers upon my noble friend (or having laboured to maintain friendly relations with France, have produced any effect in the manner he supppoees on the mind of the Emperor of Rustic, is what I really cannot believe, any more than I can believe that his mind has been influenced, or that his pa hey towards Turkey has been guided by the two speeches to which my noble friend, I am sorry to say, has again alluded. And Ido not think that my noble friend will find many to share his opinion, that expressed in bringing these speeches forward, that they had anything to do with the notion that England and France would not act together, and that it would, therefore, be safe for the Emperor of Russia to pursue his own policy. Ho had had on more than one occasion to state how cordial the alliance between France and England had been; and he rejoiced upon this, as upon every opportunity, to repeat, that assurance. (Hear, hear.) There had been, through out the whole of this Eastern question, the most intimate, cordial, and he might almost say daily, communication be tween the two governments ; they had entertained precisely I the same views of the policy which ought to be adopted, and there had been a complete mutual action up to thi s hour. (Hear, hear.) He thought, with that assurance, that it was impossible for the Emperor of Russia to have believed that his policy in the East had any reference to the alliance between France and England, and the feeling ex isting between them—(hear, bear), for it was impossible for him to have believed that that alliance did not exist and that it was not sincere. (Hear, hear.) The next point to which his noble friend had alluded as having influenced the Emperor of Ramis was the little care and interest we hod appeared to exhibit with regard to Turkey, by not having taken stronger measures for the withdrawal of the Austrian army from Montenegro. That question bad been discussed before their lordships on a former occasion. Her Majesty's government had been in communic►tion with the Austrian government on the subject, and they had not failed to ask for those explanations with respect to Prince Leinengen's minion which they considered necessary. The reply of Austria was that they had every reason to apprehend that there would be a rising of the people, and that her frontier was in danger. She did not dispute the authority of the Sultan over Montenegro, but she stated that the means by which that authority was exercised had become dangerous to the neighbouring powers. And with respect to the retreat of the Turkish army, even after the Sultan bad given orders for the withdrawal of bis forces, ►e (the Earl of Clarendon) was in constant commu nication with the government of Austria to secure the full execution of the terms stipulated for. The next point to which his noble friend had alluded, as a proof that the French and English governments had not been acting cor dially together, was, that at the time the fleets were sent for by Colonel Rose, the French fleet advanced, but the British fleet did not. Prince Leinengben did not can for the dismissal of Fund Effendi ; still, his arrival produced much Ili.Tol in the mind of the Turkish government, and Colonel Rose no doubt wrote to Admiral Dundas, not ex actly to come up to the Bay of Belies, but he recommended that, as his fleet was about to take a summer cruise, that it would be desirable that its departure from Malta should be hastened. Admiral Dundee did not comply with that request, and but a few days after Colonel Rose and the Grand Vizier impressed their satisfaction at his not having done so. tipon the news reaching the French government that the British fleet had been sent for by Colonel Rose, orders were given for the French fleet to move, but this was done at the spur of the moment, without any consultation with her Majesty's government. When the French government communicated their order to her Majesty's government, they frankly told them that the danger did not appear to be imminent, and at that moment they did not deem it necessary that the British fleet should leave Malta. The French government replied that they did not regret having given the order, he cause Toulon was much further west than Malta, and the French fleet being at Salamis, was in • better position to co-operate, if necessary, with the British fleet at Malta. But this did not for • moment throw a shade of difference over the relations which existed be tween the two countries. (Hear, hear.) The result had proved that when they were ordered to Besika Bay, the instructions which were forwarded by the same tele graph were obeyed at the same time, and both fiesta reached their destination within • few hours of each other. (Hear, hear.) With reference to the amurances given to his noble friend by the Emperor of Russia, he (the Earl of Clarendon) could not dive into men's minds, nor always understand their motives, but he could only say that the same assurances had been given to her Majesty's present government by the Emperor of Russia which his noble friend said bad been given to him. (Hear, heat.) No so verign in Europe could have given more solemn assurances of his respect for existing treaties ; and he had seed to say that he considered the maintenance of the Turkish empire as a great principle of European policy, and that it was his desire to maintain it independently. (Hear, hear.) The Russian government had, on more than ono occasion, agreed with her Majesty's government that the dismem berment of the Turkish empire would be a great European calamity. (Hear, hear.) And it was under those gunmen that Prince Menchlkofs mission was sent to Constantino ple, and not because, as his noble friend said, the question of the holy places was settled. It might have bees set tied in the French sense ; but it was that which had made all this disturbance. (Hear, hear.) The Emperor of Rus sia's view was that a privilege had been transferred to the Latin church which the year before had been given to the Greek church, and that it would impair his moral influence among his co-religionists of the Greek church if the matter were not set right. He, therefore, considered it absolutely necessary that it should be ; and, although he said from the beginning that he would not seek to deprive the Latins of the advantages which they had, he stated that he should seek from the Ottani', government some equivalent, and that it should be secured, not as before, by a finnan, whisk expertise, showed mould be violated, but by some explaaatory act which would prevent future dim animate. Therefore this mission of Prince Menchikoff was not undertaken after the question was settled, as his noble friend had said, but for the purpose of settling that quer tion. (Hear, hear.) And it was not so easily settled. Fre quent interviews took place between the Russian ambas sador and the Porte, as well as between the French sad the British ambassador, the latter eating merely as•nsieus carat, and his services were warmly acknowledged by the Russian and Turkish governsairate. (Hear, bur.) It was after that—on the bth of May—that the proposition, which had led to so much difficulty, was made by the Rumba government. Her Majesty's government did not know that proposals would be made which, if acceded ts, would have amounted to little less than • protectorate on the pare of Russia. (Hear, hen•.) They thought, moreover, that Prince Menchikoff would take less than he demanded —and so it turned out. He then made one or two other propositions, which were objected to; and throughout all these negotiations it was satisfactory to her Majesty's government that the Sesta were not before Coiritantinople, because the Turkish government bad been able to act in a free and independent manner, and all pretence for saying th►t they had acted under the dictation of any other power was taken away. (Hear, hear.) On the 22nd of May Prince Menchlkoff left Constantinople, and the passage which bad been read by his noble friend from hie valedic tory latter was no doubt correct. Such language wee, for tunately, very rare In diplomatic correspondence, and he hoped it would long remain an exception to the general rule. (Hear, hear.) After Prince Meaehikoff had quitted Constantinople, a note was sent to Resebid Pacha, requiring him to accept the terms proposed by R•ssie within eight days. That demand woe declined in most courteous terms ; and then, in pursuance of the threat which had been held out, the Danubian principalities were occupied. He had no hesitation in saying that her Majesty's government had looked upon that act as a violation of the treaty. (Hear, hear.) He would not enter farther into that part of the question, because his sense of public duty prevented him from doing so ; but he did aot hesitate to say that it was un questionably • cants beta. (Hear, hear.) Her Majesty's government, however thought st i•eumbent oa them to do everything in their power to avoid the chances of war• (Hear, hear.) They felt that they could not go with a good face to the country to sanction • war, unless they could show that they had exerted and exhausted every effort to maintain peace. (Load cheers.) They did not therefore recommend to the Sultan to exercise his un- ' doubted and unquestionable right to treat the THE EXPRESS, SATURDAY EVENING. AUGUST 13, 1853. ee; of Russia as an net of war. (Hear . , hear.)' Throughout the whole of these negotiations they had not taken • step without the assent of the French goveranseut. There had been communiesktions almost daily by despatches and the electric telegraph, and in nothing had the French government been more entirely united with her Majesty's government, than in the determination not to treat this act of Russia as a ours both. (Hear, hear.) Despatches from Lord Stratford de Redcliffe, which crossed those of her Majesty's government to him, expressiog that view, contained the same sen.iments as being entertained by tbr Porte, and stated that such was the advice he had given to the Sultan. (Hear, hear.) Although negotiations were still pending, he would not hesitate to state to their lordships by what steps they had arrived at their present stage, and what was the present condition of the question, being most anxious to give to the house and the country ill the information which he could safely communicate. (Hear, hear.) After the . . note of Count Neaselrode had been rejected by the Porte, it appeared to her Majesty's govetnment that the uppor tunity had arisen when mutual friends might take the matter up, and treat with the contending parties. The oc cupation of the principalities assumed an open character, and the mediation of Afistria—whether asked or offered he did not exactly know at that moment—took place. The Austrian government made a most fair and reasonable pro- position. They said to the Porte—You have rejected the terms of this note, furnish us with another proposition, which will net be incompatible with the objects sought to be effected by Russia, and we will send it to St. Peters burgh. Some delay arose, and the Austrian government, seeing the great danger that would result from delay, called together the ministers of France, England, Russia, and Prussia, and prepared to take, as the basis of a note, • proposition which had originated with the French government. They proposed that with some slight modifl- cations that should be laid before the Emperor of Russia and the Sultan as the means of settling their differences. Those modifications were referred to London and Faris, and haying been approved, the note was sent to St. Peters. burgh and Constantinople on the 2nd of this mon b. The Russian minister at Vienna had sent the substance of this note to Petersdorff, and it appeared that it was well re ceived, fer on the 3rd of this mouth a telegraphic despatch was sent to Vienna, stating that the note would meet the Emperor's views. Since that he (the Earl of Clarendon) had that very morning heard that Count Nesselrode had said to Sir Hamilton Seymour that that note would be ac cepted. And as that note—slightly modified from a pro posal of the French government—most assuredly contained nothing opposed to the views of the Porte, he could see no reason why it should not be accepted by the Ottoman government. (Hear.) His object was, while these negotiations were pending, and while there was any risk of their not coming to the solution which they all desired, to abstain from a more full discussion, and also from laying any papers on the table which might lead to debate, for he wished to abstain from doing or saying any thing which might endanger that peaceful solution of the question which they all so earnestly wished for. (Hear.) Lord BE AUMONT thought the government had not done what they professed they would do. The demand made by the French with reference to the Holy Places was the only justifiable point in all the proceedings of the Em peror of Russia, who must have felt that any concession made to the Latin church was derogatory to the church of which he was a member, and would lead to a diminution of his influence. It was the duty of this country closely to have watched the demands of Russia. He thought the Porte was justified in refusing those demands ; and it was then that the interference of England and the other conntris friendly to the Porte became necessary—negotiation was at an end, and war was positively declared. Stronger mea sures should, in his opinion, have been directed towards resisting the progress of Russia, rather than an attempt to induce Turkey to make some modified assent to the terms which she had before refused. The frontiers of Turkey were invaded—all the results of war were taking place— and yet the powers,friendly to Turkey remained passive . The noble earl had told them that negotiations were going on, but with whom Not with St. Petersburg, but merely advice to the Sultan to make concessions, and then • mediation with the Emperor of Russia. We under took to do right and to maintain the law of nations, and the result of our neglect was, that the party to suffer was the party who had been injured. Whatever concessions were obtained would be the result of the violence which we should have resisted. An offence against the law of nations had been committed, and the party to benefit by it would be the party who had given the offence. The ministers of this country had acted as mediators with the Emperor of Ruda, not as defenders of the rights of Turkey. The con cessions obtained might not be derogatory or injurious to Turkey, but still a principle had been laid down which in future would be found to be extremely dangerous. In a proper state of things Russia should have been forced, not only to retire behind the Pruth, but to pay all the expenses of the occupation. He believed that if England and France bad acted boldly, there would have been no war. He be lieved that Russia was not prepared for a protracted war, and that Turkey had greater means of resistance than her enemies gave her credit for. On the whole, he could not felicitate her Majesty's government on the result of their negotiations. The Earl of HARDWICHE believed that the pacific toes of late communications with Russia and Turkey would lead to stronger language ultimately than if fitm- Dees had originally been the rule of conduct. The Marquis of CLANRICARDE said that the infor matioo they had received from the noble earl was of very grave importance. They now knew that the negotiations for peace were in a favourable condition. But, still, the important question remained, of what their joint not* con tained? The whole question would, in his opinion, turn upon how the question had been settled. (Hear, hear.) The evacuation of the Principalities ought to be thine diets, and no promises ought to satisfy them. The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH, on the whole, did did not think that the forbearance of her Majesty's go veronica had damaged the Eastern question. The Earl of ABERDEEN thought that his noble friend had given a foil and satisfactory account of the state of the Eastern question. The noble earl op. posit* had given noble lords some very excellent advice. He had always felt that it was for the interest of this country that we should maintain • close alliance with France, and the Mali feeling had actuated the government throughout this difficult question. The noble earl found fault with the government for not having taken more energetic measures in the early sages of this dispute, but it was all very nal to indulge in these prldictions when the crisis was passed. He was satisfied that the beet had been ions that could be dose under all the circumstances, for the coarse whisk had bow tablet was approved of by the four great powers of Europe, and be believed that it wee aleelated to promote the bat iatereste of this eeautry and of Europe. Thera was no guarantee or treaty in existence which compelled this country to enter into an armed atinventien for the protection of Turkey ; bat the interest and honour of this country required that her independence should be maintained, and, whatever might be the result of the canting negotiations, of this their lordships might rest satisfied, that neither the interest nor the honour of the nation would be jeopardised, let alone sacrificed, by her Majesty's government. (Cheers.) The Earl of MALMESBURY spoke a few words by way of reply, and declared that the debate had not changed his opinion that the government would have acted more prudently had they made known their policy In the same way that France had done. It would have set at rest the anxiety of the public upon the Turkish question, and have satisfied the world that we were sincere in our desire to assist the Sultan. (Cheep.) However, as their lordships appeared to be averse to the production of these papers he should not press for them, and, therefore, with the permis sion of their lordships, be would withdraw his motion. The motion was accordingly withdrawn. PARSEE MERCHANTS. Lord MONTSAGLE presented • petition front certain Parsee merchants complainkg of certain acts of the govern ment of India. Earl GRANVILLE, considering that there was no mo tion before the house, would not detain their lordships at any length. Entirely concurring in the fact that the MilkCl had committed an injustice, he could not we that the go. vernment ought to be held responsible in the matter. Cer tain British subjects had advanced money to the Nisem, and now 'ought to obtain it back through the presence of the government, notwithstanding that by the Indian law it was expressly declared that government would not interfere in such cease. If they were to interfere in this they would have to interfere in every other debt due from the Nisam. The government of India had long ago felt the impolicy of this, end hence bad arisen the regulation not to interfere to procure the payment of debts due from native princes. That the case was one of hardship he admitted ; but the hardship was between the Nixam and the petitioners, and not between them and the Indian government. After a conversation, Lord MONTEAGLE briefly replied, and the subject then dropped. PILOTAGE BILL. Lord STANLEY OFALaliaI moved the second reading of this bill. The Eul of HARDWICKE said if the navigation laws had remained as they were, there would hare beta the same Mame in shipping which had taken piste, and which he thought was to be attributed in a great measure to the gold discoveries in Australia. With regard to the port of Liverpool, there were features of • peculiar character. The sands were cuustan , ly shifting, and it was impossible for any person whu was not educated a pilot, and who was I not constantly on the spot, to know or keep up a knowledge of the Channel. The shipping interest there were in alarm at this bill. No lex than 39,000 vessels had entered in and gone out of the port of Liverpool within the last six months, and under the present system only three casualties had occurred. Now, however, they wen/going to put the' ' pilotage into the hands of persons who might be absent I I from the port for months together, and who could not' therefore keep up • knowledge of the Channel. After a conversation, The Earl of HARROWBY objected to the measure being extended to Liverpool, and maid that not only the pilots, but the underwriters, merchants, and shipowners of that port bad petitioned against it. Lord STANLEY defended the bill as it stood. The bill was then read • second time. IRISH BISHOPRICS The Marquis of CLANRICARDE snored for a return of the revenue of all the sees of the established church in Ireland, and of the horses and lands belonging to each. The return was ordered. 1 HAMES EMBANKMENT BILL. This bill passed through committee. MERCHANT SHIPPING BILL. On the order of the day for going into committee on this bill, Lord COLCHESTER pride some general observations, complaining that under the measure an undue disadvantage would accrue to the British sailer in competition with the foreign semen. The noble lord concluded by moving the omission of the clause. After a few words from Earl WALDEGRATE, The Earl of HARDWICK E objected to any interference with the coasting trade of the country. The Earl of ELLENBOROUGH regretted that a bill of such great importance sbouid have been brought up at a time when all discussion was impossible. The effect of the measure would be most dangerous upon a class of men upon whom the efficiency of the naval service mainly de pended, for it would iutroduce foreigners into the coasting trade upon whom we must rely for the manning of our navy. The house then went into committee on the bill. Clauses from 1 to 30 inclusive were agreed to without amendment. Loid COLCHESTER objected to clause 31, and moved its rejection. The committee divided, when there appeared : For the clause lB Against it 6-13 The clause was accordingly agreed to, as were also the remaining clauses of the bill, and the house resumed. DRAINAGE OF LANDS (IRELAND) ACTS AMENDMENT BILL. This bill was pased through committee. POOR RELIEF ACT CONTINUANCE BILL. This bill was read a third time and passed. DUTIES ON HORSES LET FOR HIRE BILL. This bill passed iitioVa g ti - committee. GENERAL BOARD OF HEALTH BILL. This bill was mad a third time and passed. PUBLIC LIBRARIES (IRELAND AND SCOTLAND) BILL. This bill wu read a third time and passed. GOVERNMENT OF INDIA BILL. This bill was read a third time and passed. UNIVERSITIES (SCOTLAND) BILL. This bill was read a second time. COURT OF COMMON LAW (IRELAND) BILL. The amendments in this bill were brought up and agreed to. BURIALS BEYOND THE METROPOLIS BILL. This ►ill was read a second time. EMPLOYMENT OF CHILDREN IN FACTORIES BILL. The bill was read a second time. The Assessed Ts:es Bill, the Inieranee on Lives Bill, and the Sheriffs (Scotland) Bill, severally passed through committee. The Public Works Acts Amendment (Ireland) Bill was read a second time. Their lordships adjourned at two o'clock. HOUSE OF COMMONS.—FRIDAY, Atm. 12. The S took the chair at 4 o'clock. PRIVATE BUSINESS. - - CONSIDERATION OP LORDS' AMEN DMENTS.—Lite As sociation of Scotland Bill; Liverpool, Crosby, and South. port Railway Bill; London and North Western Railway (Crewe to Shrewsbury) Bill; Oxford, Worcester, and 'Wolverhampton Railway (Extension of Time, Re.) Bill; Saint Georges Harbour Bill ; Wellington and Severn Junction Railway Bill; Westminster Improvements (Dwel lings of the Working Classes) Bill. THIRD READlNG.—Pemberton's Estate Bill. PUBLIC BUSINESS. SALE OF AUSTRALIAN LAND. Sir G. GOODMAN . begged to inquire of the Under- Secretary for the Colonies, if it would not be desirable that increased facilities should be given for the sale of land in the Australian colonies? Mr. PEEL had no hesitation in saying that it was de sirable that every proper and practicable facility should be given for the acquisition of land in the Australian colonies. He understood the hon. gentleman to contemplate a reduc tion in the upset price of land. At present, the price was fixed by set of parliament, and he wee not aware that it was too high, as at sales by auction land fetched 11. an acre. A proposition had been made by the govern ment to the Australian legislature which if accepted would leave it to the legislature to decide on the price at which land was to be sold. AGRICULTURAL STATISTICS. ...... Mr. GREGSON begged to ask the President of the Board of Trade, if he had any plan in operation or in prepara tion for the pupae of obtaining and circulating periodical returns on the statistics of agriculture. Mr. CARD WELL said he was then about to lay on the table returns prepared by the Bighland Society of Swtland and their Secretary, Mr. Maxwell, which had been obtained with the concurrence of nearly every tenant farmer in Roc burghshire, Sutherlandebire and Haddingtonshire, with re. gard to the produce of their crops, and other agricultural statistics. The plan had, therefore been began in Scotland, under most favourable auspices. With regard to England, his right hon. friend the President of the Peor-law Board. had put himself in communication with Sir John Walsham, with a view to returns from Norfolk, and he was also in communication with Mr. Weals, with regard to Red ford, so that he hoped next year the results of inquiries which were made would be seen. THE EASTERN QUESTION. Mr. LAYARD begged to in uire of the government on what day the noble lord themember for London would give the explanation en the Eastern question to the house which he had promised some days ego. Lord PALMERSTON was unable to answer the qua tion at the present moment. His noble friend would re turn to town to-morrow, and perhaps the hon. gentleman would communicate with him privately before Monday. THE DANISH SUCCESSION. - - - Mr. BLACKBT T begged to ask whether the govern ment would have any objection to lay before parliament such portions of the correspondence relating to the =mis sion to the Danish crown as can be communicated without detriment to the public service. Lord PALMERSTON said the correspondence in ques tion was very voluminous, extending to about 6,000 pages folio, and the only public inconvenience in producing it would be the expense of printing a vast mar of cones pondence which was not commensurate in point of interest, as it contained a number of details which, however important at the time, had lost all interest when the main question wts settled. The out line of the original object of this country was this, that whereas, as things stood, the succession to the Daniels throne was in the female line, the succession to Holstein is the male line, and the succession to Schleswig disputed, and on the death of the Danish King and his uncle, the sucessaion to Denmark would f o one way, that to Holstein another, and that to Schleswig another, it was thought important for the interests of Europe and of England that the states which were called in common parlance the Danish mo narchy should be kept together. It was necessary to obtain a renunciation of the female succession to Denmark, of the male succession to Holstein, and to combine the whole of these claims in a person who possessed egos' rights to all portions of the monarchy, and that was done by the treaty in question. If there was any document such u that relat ing to the renunciation of Russia, which the hon. gentle. man would mention, he would produce such as would satisfy his wishes without going to the expense of producing them all. Perhape the hon. gentleman would specify any docu ment he wished. Mr. DLACKETT said the only one he could mention was the circular of the Danish Minister for Foreign Affairs of last May ; but ►e would communicate with the noble lord. . The orders of the day were thee proceeded with. LAW OF EVIDENCE AMENDMENT BILL. This bill was road a third time. On the motion Ant the bill do pas, Mr. J. S. WORTLEY drew attention to the fact that by this bill wives were made competent witnesses in civil cases where their husbands were concerned, end he urged that the same principle should be extended to criminal cases, contending that there was often as much involved as regarded a husband's interest in civil as criminal cases. He hoped the subject would be dealt with next year, as well as that of substituting affirmations for oaths in cases of reli gious scruples; and which the Attorney-General had inti ' mated his intention of including is this bill. The SOLICITOR-GENERAL intimated that the sub ject would meet with the attention of the government, as well as many others suggested in the report of the Common Law Commissioners. Aft , r a few words from Mr. J. G. PHILLIMOItIe, The bill passed. COPIES OF SPECIFICATIONS REPEAL BILL. This bill was read a third time. CHANCERY SUITORS FURTHER RELIEF BILL. This bill was read • third time. 'ICAL LEASING ACT AMENDMENT BILL. ---. Oa the motion of Lord PALYIaaTON, this bill was post poned to next session. CATION BILL. On the orde;;lii;Jia;7o;7lWiAirdrZtrng, Mr. S. WORTLEY said that he had no opposition to offer to this bill. On the whole he highly approved of it. Mr. HEATING urged objections to some of the clauses. Be .particularly objected to the dame empowering the r Home Secretary to great discretionary tickets of leave. He did not object to attempts at the reformation of criminals ; but reformation was not the only object of a sentence. (Hear, bear.) Lord PALMERSTON said the matter had received the most deliberate consideration, and the clauses were deliberately urged. The system the hon. gentleman ob- jected to wu only novel as regards this country ; it was a system which had been tried with the best results in Aus tralis. Mr. WALPOLE thought that the responsibility, in such a matter as this, rested with the minister; and he would, therefore, content himself with having suggested, without now preuing, the alterations in queetion. Mr. SPOONER trusted that the noble lord would bear in miad the suggestion which his right hon. friend (Mr. Walpole) had made upon the subject, viz., to have the con victs in some place specially set apart, where, under the very eye of the government, efficient measures for their reformation could be taken. Mr. J. 0. PHILLIMORE entirely concurred in the observations of the boo. member (Mr. Spooner). Mr. BARROW proposed in the 12th clause to leave out the wind " four, " and insert the word " two." By this alteration, from t wo to ten years of penal servitude might be inflicted, instead of the limits being four and ten years. Mr. T. CHAMBERS, adverting to the subject which had been discussed in the earlier part of this debate, thought that the objections against the ticket of leave clause of the bill were reducible to two heads ; hut, that they introduced • new system, and secondly, that the system so introduced was a vicious one. Mr. NEWDEGATE did not view the abolition of trans portation with pleasure. Some very intelligent Americans with whom he had conversed on this subject had expressed their regret that, from its situation as a continent, Arne tint could not rid itself of its criminal population as Eng land had done. This measure would deprive England en tirely of its natural advantages in this respect, and thus we were voluntarily depriving ourselves of that which another nation would most gladly possess. Mr. EWART thought the reformation of criminals we , to be effected rather by dispersing than congregating them. If this bill were carried it would entail the necessity of a surveillance being exercised similar to that of the Paris police. lie should hope that when these criminals had been reformed as far as they could be in this country, the colonies would no longer have that extreme repugnance to receive them that they had now. Mr. HUME observed that we had arrived at that state that the colonies would no longer receive the convicts, and government must do the best they could with them. He thought the house ought not to throw difficulties in their way. Sir J:PAKINOTON expressed his regret that the sug gestions he made the other night with reference to extend ing the period of tiansportation had not been adopted. The bill was they read a third time and paned. CORRUPT PRACTICES AT ELECTIONS BILL. Mr. WALPOLE, in moving the second reading of this bill, said he did so with the purpose rather of engaging the attention of the house than with any expectation of passing the bill at this period of the session. The object of the bill was best explained by the title of it. It was to consolidate and amend the law for the prevention of corrupt practices at elections; to consolidate the law and therefore to sim plify it; to amend the law and therefore to improve it, by preventing, as far as might be, all those corrupt and dis honourable practices which at all interfered with the free exercise of the franchise. He defined bribery under three heads, first, any person who agreed to give any sum of money, office, place, or employment, or any person who lent or agreed to lend any sum of money to any person to induce him to vote or refrain from voting ; the second head was payment of money,whether as head money or in compliance with any practice or usage; and the third head related to persons receiving the bribe under the same circumstances as in the two former heads related to persons who gave or offered the bribe. Corrupt treating he defined under two heads—tbe first was, any person providing meat, drink, or provisions for the purpose of corruptly influencing the person to whom it was given to vote ; the second head was receiving this meat, drink, or provision. With regard to intimidation and undue influence, the bill provided that any person who shall by any kind of intimidation, threat, abduction, violence, fraud, concealment, 'or other device, impede, prevent, or otherwise interfere with the free exercise of the franchise of any voter who shall thereby be induced to give his vote, or refrain from giving his vote, shall be deemed guilty of having exercised intimidation and undue influence within the meaning of the act. And he proposed to inflict the penalty of 601. upon the conviction of any of these offences, to be recovered by any person who sued for the penalty. He pro posed to repeat the penalties of 5001. and 1,0001., as expe rience showed no one sued for them, and he substituted a penalty of 601., and he hoped that when a committee re ported that the offences had been committed, the house would act on its sessional orders, and direct a proses cution. One way of deterring from these offences was by depriving the parties of the advantage they hoped to gain from them. He proposed, with regard to the electors, that they should be deprived of the franchise; and with regard to the candidate, that he should be incapacitated from sitting in parliament; that on a conviction in • court of law the candidate should be disqualified from sitting in parliament for seven years; that the conviction should be transmitted by the judge to the Speaker, who should cause the name of the person so convicted to be entered in a book, to be called the disqualification book, to be kept by the officers of the house ; and that if an objection on this ground were taken against a voter the revising barrister should write spinet his name the cameo of disqualification. It would thus become known in the place where the offence was committed, and public opinion would be brought to bear on the parties so offending. Such was a brief outline of the bill which he proposed should now be read a second time, and which he thought would have the effect of pre venting the offences epaulet which it was directed. He should re-introduce the measure next session, believing that it would prove of great public advantage. Mr. HUME said the bill was one, that would require very careful consideration. He hoped that it would be re ferred to a select committee. Mr. WALPOLE suggested that there might be eases where the agents were not voters. In that case it might be necessary to resort to imprisonment. Mr. HUME concurred in the propriety of this. Candi dates guilty of bribery be would disqualify from sitting for two parliaments. He believed this would be a radical cure. The offence wu one against parliament and the nation, and the prosecutions ought therefore to be conducted at the public expense. The county courts would be the most cheap and speedy tribunals. He believed that this bill would lay the foundation of an inquiry which must lead to an important change. Col. SIBTHOIiP said he had witnessed many bills brought in pretending to secure the purity of elections, but none founded on sound principles. It had been insinuated that he only sat in that house by purchasing his seat. (Laughter.) He denied this, and asserted that neither he nor any of his family bad ever received any favour from a government. It could not therefore be said that he was not en independent member. (Laughter.) Looking at the provisions of this bill, and the declarations it contained, he world ask how it would affect the treasury bench. For his own part he had been guilty of bribery ; but now it seemed an order for • new coat or a new pair of boots,:given to &voter, might subject him to punishment. (Laughter.) The effect of the bill would be to produce an enure alienation between man and man. It might do very well for a candidate coming down from the clouds, who never saw the city of Lincoln. (Great laughter.) He might be placed in a very different situation from such a man as that, owing to the claims that were made upon him—for he considered them claims. He hoped his right hon. friend would consider thus matters. He was surprised that he should propose the second reading of such a bill, thereby pledging the' house toits principles at the very close of the session. This was not fair towards members generally, or their oonsth taints. He should most unquestionably oppose the second 1 reading. He supposed that the offer of a glass of wine to a friend, or a cup of coffee, would now be considered treating, by this pun House of Commons ; or perhaps bribery. Mr. BRADY—So it is. Col. BIBTHORP—Then all I have to say is, I shall do it. (Great laughter.) The gallant colonel proceeded to contend that the bill was of an inquisitorial @hustler • but he would apply to it the classical maxim, Es nails nail/a, —(laughter)—or rather he would say, it was like suing • beggar and catching a louse. (Great laughter.) Some hon. members who were great sticklers for the purity of that house, did not consider it at all impure to get • good place for a relation. He was astonished that his right hon. friend should have proposed such • bill; in many pare it was unintelligible, in others unadviasble. He was certain it would be condemned by the constituencies generally. The bill was then read a second time, and ordered to be committed on that day fortnight. VACCINATION iITENSIONBILL —.. —.— The house went into committee on this bill, Mr. Wilson in the chair. The chases were agreed to, and the bill was reported. PETTY SESSIONS (IRELAND) BILL. Mr. F. FRENCH moved the discharge of the order for the second reading of this bill. Agreed to. Order discharged accerdingly. SUMMARY JURISDICTION (IRELANDYBILL. — This bill was read a second time. MILITIA PAY BILL This bill, as amended, was considered, and axed for third rending. PASSENGERS ACT AMENDMENT BILL. Read a third time and passed. COAL—CITY OF LONDON. On the motion of Mr. HLDPIILD (for Mr Duncombe) a return was ordered of the amount collected by way of toll by the corporation of the City of London, or by their les sees on account of the said toll, on the cuts and waggons of non-freemen, from the lit day of January, 1852, to the present time, together with the sum paid bT such lessees to the oorporation, and the purposes to which the same is applied. The house then adjourned to this day. Ettn..—Sir H. Ferguson Davie, Bart., has paired for the remainder of the *tenon with Sir John Duckworth, Bart. TILE NAVAL REVIEW AT P -PORTS MOUTH, Auo. 12.—The sailing ships Queen (116), Prince Regent (90), and London (90), came up to 8 - pithead lut night after the review, and joined the fleet. To-day the vessels plaited in commission pro tens. for the review have been put out of commission, and those that came round front other porta are ordered to return. The only accident that occurred during the review consisted in three seamen belonging to the Prince Regent falling overboard. They were, however, picked up. tate ervrtot. TO CC It It Kt PON 1 4.N ••w 1.0 POltlie " COrtiatli4; Cgt.rdie. " la published tarry aad . In my For a Teit....nit%t. , Intended for " The Lapreta." lia4r pap re am,: ht. I; the (Moe, tY, iskyariratrear, aa lay of pate,rtos. 1110/1 WATYII. AT LONDON 111:,11;,: Tim 114.3 —Moratag, Arrow —h. lib. 11‘. T —lloratiag. Sh. Sem. ..... Att. W.A. LONDON, SATURDAY, AUGI' •~ T 13. ANOTHER desperate effort was made la.t night in I the House of Peers to get from Illoi-tors some papers on the Eastern Question. But in vain. In this instance two Tory Lords were the leaders of this Parliamentary forlorn hope. They did their best to scale that solid structure of mysterious silence in which the ABLunEES Cabinet have ensconced their acts. Lord MALMES.. BURY went over all the reasons he could fluster to show why the FOREIGN SECRETARY should ho com muuicatire, quoting with great effect n,e example of CANNING amongst by-gone Statesmen and Lord JOHN RUSSELL amongst living ones to sh3W that State papers about foreign affair, have not always been concealed from the knowledge of l'arliament whilst important nego- tiations were pending. Lord JOHN RUSSELL pub lished the State paper about the MADIAI—why does not the Earl of ABERDEEN print the note sent to NESSELROGR ? To this very plain question, since no reply is vouchsafed—it can only be surmised that a response would be little complimentary to our Cabinet . The note to Tuscany was honourabl e t o it s aut h or and needed no concealment, whilst the missive to Russia may probably not come under the same de scription. This is one way of accountio.; for the pertinacity of Ministerial silence in this case. Lord IlAnnwteices few words were very much to the point, and the remarks of other noble speakers went to show how generally the view of the Eastern question, long urged in these columns, has been adopted. There seems now no doubt whatever that the settle. ment wo are now promised might have been long since secured had a tone of firmness been adopted when Russia's burglarious designs were first disco- vered. Had the combined fleets gone to Ilesika Bay when the insolence of MENCIIIKOFP was first mani fested in Constantinople we should have had no pas sage of tho Pruth. The belief that the Court and Cabinet of England were not prepared to take a firm stand, in conjunction with France, for the maintenance of treaties, led the CZAR (they say) to venture on his long eontem plated advance towards Constantinople. But why was not this error cleared up at once ? Why were the first symptoms of Russian aggression &Bowel to pass unchecked ? Enough, that they did so pass, and the Autocrat pushed on ; and now those who refuse to give information of their action in the matter seem to think that getting the Cossacks out of the Principalities is as easy a task as it would have been to keep them first of all out of Turkey. They seemingly cejoy the comfortable belief that tocompel the Autoc.at to retreat is as simple an affair as it would have been to check his aggression had a firm attitude been taken when the first steps towards that aggression were made. We shall see. Meanwhile the report of what was said last night, and the latest news received from abroad, will both be read with interest as illustrating the progress towards solution of this great European squabble of Russian versus Turk. Whilst sympathising with Lord MALmEsnunr's attempt to gain information from the Ministers, there is, however, one other part of his speech that calla for anything but commendation. The ex-Foreign Secretary strives to put upon the press a portion of she onus of the present state of affairs. He would have us believe that, because the English news• papers were honestly out-spoken, the Emperor of ALL TIIE RUSSIAS became burglarious—be. cause the press of Loadon spoke truth the Mus covite was urged to aggression. He takes credit to himself moreover for his prompt sympathy with the hero of the coup-d'etat and he would fain persuade us that to himself and to the efforts of the DERBY-DISRAELITF.S is due the cordial agreement I now apparently subsisting between the Courts of St. James's and of the Tuileries. In this he is doubly wrong. The press did not create any dis-union, and the Tories did not do any good. Let us first ask Lord MALMESBURY whether any very intense cordiality does exist between the Courts of England and France? It has long been supposed that COBURG and ORLEANS are morn popular names in most court circles than BONAPARTE. And next, let us repeat that all the press ever said after the coup-d'etat was in condemnation of the cruelty and injustice of that act. Not one word was ever uttered against the people of France—against the great and intelligent French nation. The at tacks of the press were against a ruler who had increased his power by a bold, bad act; and the sym pathy was universal for the sufferers by that act. Yet this condemnation of Louis NAPOLEON never led a single journal to urge an interference with the rule which said that the de facto ruler of a friendly nation shall be so recognised by this country. And more than this, it must be remembered that from the moment when the French nation seemed to condone the crime of the Second of De cember the English journal' ceased their hostile criticism of its author. It was at once admitted that the people of the sister-country were the best judges in their own case, and the vote having been given for NAPOLEON 111., his authority was no longer chal lenged. The cordiality of feeling that ought to exist, and that does truly exist, between the peoples of this country and of France has never been questioned by the most pertinacious of the denouncers of Louis NAPOLEON. The true interests of England and France are one, and should so ever be admitted and acted upon. Indeed, whenever it has happened that differences have existed between them, those dif ferences have always arisen from the interested ma chinations of courts, families, or coteries, and never from any genuine want of sympathy or community of interests between the men of the two coun tries. For any partisan Peer, therefore, to say that the press had led foreign powers to believe England and France to be estranged the one from the other is simply absurd, unless we understand Lord MALMESBURY to mean that courts and people are ever one and the same ; that foreign powers know nothing whatever about the matter; and that, when in doubt on such a point, an English Tory Mi nistry does nothing to remove any false impression that may exist. The Courts of the two countries may have feelings adverse the one to the other, but the true interests of England and of France are one —and the great bulk of the people of both nations are wise enough to know it. Nor Lord MALMESEVRY —nor Lord CLARENDOX—nor any other peer, can claim credit for Napoleonic alliances. The present union be tween England and France on the Eastern question is due to the good sense of the two most civilised nations of Europe, and to their instinctive aver sion to the inroads of Barbarism—that union being strengthened by the mutual interests of the two Courts. Os Wednesday morning, when the universal mind of Great Britain, with sonic exceptions, was busied in anticipation of the coming review at Spit