EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
On page 7-12, it should read the Municipal Operating Assistance Program.
Perhaps if we can hand these out you'll be clearer on it.
If I can ask Mike to elaborate on it.
Chairperson (interpretation): Go ahead Mr. Ferris.
Mr. Ferris: Mr. Chairman, the power corporation has a rider where they charge 0.34 cents per kilowatt hour to cover the additional costs of the power plants or moving power plants or building power plants.
This diesel fuel subsidy is to help offset those charges that the communities have been receiving for that rider.
It's a carry over from the Government of the Northwest Territories days and there were two increases.
One they were given money in 2000-2001 just before the end of the fiscal year and the balance is being given to them in the 2001-2002 budget if approved here.
So that they'll have the money to pay that fuel subsidy rider in their communities.
Mr. Arvaluk: Thank you Mr. Chairman, does this diesel fuel stabilization rider represent the extra costs resulting from the fuel price increase to the power corporation and the power corporation passes the costs down to the consumer, like the municipalities.
And, as a result, Community Government & Transportation has to give the municipalities 127 thousand dollars more a year as a result of that 13.9 cent increase and the 5 cent increase, I believe.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): Yes, that's correct.
Chairperson (interpretation): Do you have any further questions.
Mr. Havioyak (interpretation): It's too bad I stepped out for a bit.
I didn't catch some of the comments made.
For land use planning.
Staff for Kugluktuk, first of all. I want to ask this question about the 4.7 million dollars.
Is that for 100% staffing.
I was going to ask that question on it here.
Is Kugluktuk fully staffed.
The intent of the department is to finalize the staffing in the communities that fall under the decentralization model.
Kugluktuk is understaffed at the present time.
We have just finished a couple of competitions and should be making job offers, and I think there is at least one more to be advertised in the communities.
But we are getting close to being fully staffed in our Community Planning & Lands.
We are three short.
There are other positions as well, in Baker Lake and some of the other communities, Cape Dorset, that need to be staffed.
Some of those fall under this Community Government area.
Mr. Havioyak (interpretation): I just wanted to hear the answer.
I wanted to comment further on grants and contributions.
I want clarification on the equalization.
What is this, 78 thousand.
It is not clear what this means.
The only tax-based municipality that we have at the present time is the Town of Iqaluit.
They get their money from this government in two ways.
On page 7-9, we pay a grant in lieu of taxes, which is not necessarily 100% of the property taxes that would be due and payable based on our property holdings.
The other is through the equalization grant which gives them again, some dollars to help operate the municipality similar to what hamlets are receiving through their funding formula.
It also covers water/sewer operations here within the town.
So it is simply to recognize that there is a different funding formula for funding tax-based municipalities and as we only have one, that’s the dollars that are required.
Iqaluit is the only tax-based community.
I just wanted some clarification on this.
On 7-12, I have asked questions about northern games, activities and northern games, about community fund raising so that they can participate in games in other communities.
The 103 thousand seems a bit small.
Is that correct, it seems rather small if you consider all the communities throughout Nunavut.
Airfares are very expensive.
The cost was the same last year.
Have you carefully considered increasing it.
Because participants need to travel.
People enjoy these types of activities, the youth, the elders.
When they get together they enjoy those kinds of activities.
This should be an amount that should be increased.
This 103 thousand how is this, how is this figure divided up.
Chairperson (interpretation): To conduct the meeting better, if there are no further questions from this page we will go on to the next page.
Please ask as to the page we are dealing with.
Perhaps before he responds Mr. Havioyak, I will let you know that you have gone back to page 7-12 several times.
These pages are information items and 7-8 is another information item.
We will start from there and go on to the pages.
I do not think we completed page 7-9 but I will allow Mr. Anawak to respond to the question that was posed under 7-12.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): Yes, we can look into it.
If we can find other sources but at this time this 103 thousand is divided up for the summer games and annually in the three regions or it could be used for July 1 Canada Day celebrations.
The way it is divided up 50 thousand is for Qikiqtaaluk, 25 thousand Kivalliq and 28 thousand Kitikmeot.
That is how it is divided up into the three regions.
In regards to the member's comments.
Yes, I will look into it to find out if we can look for additional funds in the upcoming years.
Mr. Havioyak (interpretation): Sorry.
It is part of 7-7.
We will be dealing with this later on.
I’ll wait.
Chairperson (interpretation): If there are no further questions on 7-9. 7-10.
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): I am sorry, I could not hear properly.
I wanted to ask a question, another question on page 7-9 and you do not want to go back to that page.
Chairperson (interpretation): I will allow you to ask a question under page 7-9 and please complete all your questions from that page because we have been on this page for quite some time.
About grants in lieu of taxes.
A grant to municipal corporations equal to the assigned mill rate applied to assess government properties.
I want further clarification on that.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): Perhaps if I could ask Mike to clarify that.
Chairperson (interpretation): Go ahead, Mr. Ferris.
Mr. Mike Ferris: Mr. Chairman, in Nunavut I mentioned Iqaluit is the only tax based municipality at the present time.
That government sets its own mill rate and establishes what various property owners within the community would pay in terms of property taxes.
Our government has agreed to pay a sum of property taxes based on a formula that has us pay for government staff house units for example 100 percent.
For schools it is a different rate it’s 25 percent less than what the full rate is.
It is how our government pays for the property that we own within the municipality and it provides the municipality then with some revenue.
They also get a grant in lieu from the federal government and they get property taxes from all other homeowners or building business owners within town so it is our cost of having the number of buildings that we have within this tax based municipality.
Yes, do I understand that this is not for communities other than Iqaluit.
The grant in lieu is only paid in Iqaluit.
In the other communities within Nunavut there is what's called a general taxation district.
The minister of finance sets the mill rate and collects taxes so there is a difference in the formula for how those are paid.
Under 7-10, I have questions on that page.
Chairperson (interpretation): If there are no questions under 7-9, we'll move to 7-10.
I think the minister made it clear to me earlier on but the amount of diesel fuel stabilization rider of 127 thousand dollars and there's also 695 thousand dollars on the previous page for fuel price adjustment and there's a diesel fuel stabilization rider on page 7-10.
What's the difference.
Mr. Minister, can you hear me.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The first one of 695 thousand dollars is for the fuel increase that just happened recently and the 127 thousand dollars is for the diesel fuel stabilization rider.
Because of the increase in the operating costs, that 127 thousand dollars is used for that purpose for the communities and it's for diesel fuel but the other one is for the fuel price adjustment.
The amount of 695 thousand on page 7-10 is for heating fuel, diesel fuel for power.
Chairperson (interpretation): Yes, the minister made it quite clear in his explanation.
Is it for heating fuel or is it for power.
I'm not really sure which one he means.
Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. Minister, can you clarify that for the member.
The difference between whether it's for heating fuel or for power.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): The 127 thousand dollars is for power only.
Diesel fuel for power.
The 695 thousand dollars is for the fuel price increase.
The 695 thousand dollars is for fuel price increases and this one on page 7-10 is for diesel fuel so in 2000- 2001, we gave 124 thousand dollars for electricity that went up in price in the amount of .034 cents.
That is what it was for in the communities.
But at this time for the coming year we want to put in 127 thousand dollars to provide a grant to Nunavut municipalities to offset the incremental operating costs.
I think I understand now a little bit.
That 127 thousand dollars is for power, it's got nothing to do with the hamlet buildings.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): You have to remember what we're talking about right now is only for the hamlets.
These are to offset the costs of operating the hamlets.
It's for the hamlets’ use.
Chairperson (interpretation): Line 7-10.
Any more questions on 7-10.
I have no more names. 7-11. 7-11.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): This was mentioned by one of the members, the member for Tunnuniq.
The translation that was wrong in the main estimates, he wanted to get a copy of the correct translation before he approves the main estimates.
It's under 7-12.
I just want to make sure the translation is correct at this time.
Under 7-12, it states that the municipal operating assistance program, that there's a little bit of an addition here.
I just want to make sure the translation is okayed before we put it in the main estimates.
Perhaps if I can give it out first and if the members feel that it's a correct translation, then we can put it in.
Chairperson (interpretation): We're on page 7-11 at this time.
Are there any questions from the members 7-12. 7-12.
I forgot to ask a question on 7-11.
Chairperson (interpretation): Okay, go ahead Mr. Iqaqrialu.
On the contributions, transfers from other government departments, an initiative to transfer resources from various departments to municipalities.
This will allow municipalities to have one funding agency from which to receive their payments.
Program allocations will be negotiated between the municipality and their funding department.
There's 3 million 685 thousand dollars.
I just wondered whether that amount of money will be divvied between the communities.
Those dollars are flowing to various communities based on community empowerment agreements or community transfer initiative agreements where communities have agreed with the departments of this government to take over services. So there are agreements in place and this money comes from those departments through the main estimate process and then is paid as part of the monthly or the quarterly contribution to the hamlet.
The communities know who is getting the money because they have already entered into an agreement but this is showing what we would be passing through our budget to those communities.
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Chairman for the clarification.
I think there are other members that would like to ask questions.
I will ask questions later.
Chairperson (interpretation): We are under 7-11.
If you have further questions on page 7-11, you can go ahead at this time.
To the 768 thousand equalization to provide contributions to assist municipal taxing authorities in provision of municipal services to the community residents.
To that section, I just wondered whether that 127 thousand is, it just seems like it is the same thing from the previous page.
Is that part of that previous page.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): Perhaps Mike can answer that question.  Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. Ferris.
Mr. Ferris: Mr. Chairman, that 768 thousand dollars is an equalization payment and paid to the only taxed based municipality in Nunavut, the Town of Iqaluit.
That is how they receive, plus the grant in lieu I mentioned before, the money to operate their municipal operations.
This equalization grant would be recognition of what we call in the hamlet, the hamlet funding formula. For taxed based municipalities it is called an equalization grant.
It provides them with some money to operate but it does not provide them with 100% of the dollars to run the municipality.
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): I understand that and under the water and sewage services block funding 5 million.
In my constituency in Qikiqtarjuaq and Clyde River there is, in one of the communities there is a reservoir and if there was upgrading to be done would that money come out of this 5 million.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): This is just towards water and sewage services.
If there was upgrading that needed to done we would look for funds in a different area.
Just to clarify we are on main estimates not capital estimates.
Are there any questions under 7-11.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): Under the 768 thousand dollars equalization.
It is the same as last year, the 2000-2001.
Could you clarify what that is used for.
Like Mike stated earlier, this money is to provide contributions to assist municipal taxing authorities.
In Iqaluit, we assist partly in Iqaluit and the money that is provided to Iqaluit comes from this one.
We don't assist Iqaluit 100%.
Page 7-11, transfer from other government departments.
This is community empowerment transfers.
Is this like, municipality of Baker Lake has pretty well taken everything under community empowerment.
When Manitok Thompson was former minister of the old Government of the Northwest Territories, she was a big advocate of community empowerment and she really did a good job in my community making sure that there was a smooth transition of power from the territorial government to the municipal government.
I think Mr. Ng was involved in it also when he was in MACA.
When it got down to the real transfer of power, it was done by Minister Thompson.
It's not a knock on the department.
But it's almost two years to the day that we've created Nunavut.
Has there been a change in philosophy in regards to a transfer agreement to a memorandum of understanding.
Because I got a call from my SAO saying that they're not transfer agreements anymore, they're MOUs.
Hon. Jack Anawak: As far as Community Governments are concerned, we would like to do more in terms of enabling a community to take over some of the responsibilities the Government of the Northwest Territories previously had.
We would like to start discussions with any community that wants to take over the department of Public Works, Social Services, however, the discussion should be wider than just transferring over the responsibilities of Public Works and other government departments.
In any discussion, we would be prepared to discuss if a community, how they want to move forward on this particular issue because we would want to do more than just empower the community to handle the government of NWT or the areas that the Government of the Northwest Territories had.
But no, we would be wanting to talk to any community that wants to a have a discussion on how and what kind of agreement should be in place with any community between the Government of Nunavut and that particular municipality.
When we did community empowerment in our community over a five year period, there was lots of support from the central government in regards to training to bring the municipality up to a level that they could take over these responsibilities but there is also a training component built in with this and it worked out really well in our community.
Has this department considered more training for the communities that want to take over additional responsibilities.
What we would like to do is ensure that if we're going to get into an agreement of turning over the responsibilities or what responsibilities the government may have, over to the hamlet, we'd want to make sure that the hamlet understands exactly what it's getting into.
And we will do what we can to make sure that the community is ready and has the ability to take over any program that they might want to.
If there is training required then we would make sure that training is provided.
On that, is there anybody in your department that is designated to go talk to the municipalities once every six months, or once a year to explain to them that community empowerment is a positive thing.
Maybe the communities, if they want to build capacities, and extra training dollars, is there somebody in your department that maybe could go out and talk to them.
Be proactive rather than wait for a community to decide maybe it's a good idea to take over Public Works, or Housing, or another department.
Mike Ferris.
Mr. Ferris: We do have a division within the department that is working on that, it's also within the Bathurst Mandate.
I think the only difference would be is the terminology which is the Bathurst Mandate talks about capacity building plans for communities wellness plans, and economic plans.
It is in a departmental committee made up of the three major departments where our mandate ended up from the Bathurst Mandate to move that initiative ahead. If we look on page 7-12, in the main estimates you'll see there, community development funds, at 1.5 million.
These are dollars to allow communities and we're still getting a number of communities asking for it, funds to look at, administratively taking over programs.
So it's still moving ahead and I think though the one thing that may be a bit confusing and we will be clarifying that with the communities.
We're calling it community development because of the way it is worded in the Bathurst Mandate, but it's still designed to allow communities to move ahead, to take on greater authority and development.
In the Bathurst Mandate it does talk about that when those communities have developed those plans, that this government would then look at funding, the resources to allow the community to deliver on those particular areas they've undertaken to want to deliver on.
And that just ties in with the 3 million 685 thousand, that we're currently flowing through to communities that already have undertaken a form of empowerment. That's up a bit from last year because there's another one, I can't remember now whether it was Pond Inlet was one that we just recently signed off the paper work on and it's gone through transfer from that department to our department to be flowed through to the community.
There is a plan, I like to see a plan.
Regarding the community empowerment transfers, I know the municipality in Baker Lake, I'm not quite sure but I think that SAO was adamant that since they took over a certain department from the government, there's been no increase in operations of the department, is this correct.
I guess that's the problem when the communities were taking over, there was a figure given to the communities and that hasn't changed over the last while.
I think it would be up to each individual department that it has an agreement with.
Of course what we would be prepared to do as a department that oversees the operations would be prepared to assist the community that may require some assistance in seeing what they can do to increase their amount of funding they get from each of the different departments through that empowerment agreement.
So we would be prepared to assist to see what can be done.
When I'm done with this meeting today, I'm going to go back to Baker Lake and beat up on the SAO because he's given me the impression that we're the big bad government of Nunavut and not being nice to them in regards to the increasing of their agreement.
This department is the lead department on community empowerment so if the municipality in my community felt that over the last 4-5 years that the departments haven't been honest in keeping up with the increase in their operations, and they can show that by their accounting, can they come to your department and show these costs and would your department be willing to assist them in trying to receive additional funding from the department involved.
Chairperson (interpretation): Minister Anawak
Hon. Jack Anawak: Mr. Chairman, as I said, we would prepared to help assist in whatever way we can, to try and get more financing.
However, keep in mind that the agreement when they were transferred was with that particular department and the government authority.
The Community Government & Transportation would only be sort of in-between rather than be able to provide any assistance, additional increase, if the agreement is with some other department, other than Community Government & Transportation.
I don't want to get into a debate here in regards to agreements that were signed by the Government of the Northwest Territories, you know, it's not forever.
Would your department work with our municipality if the municipality figured that they were coming up short on some of these agreements.
Would your department be willing to assist the municipality in probably negotiating a new contract or a new agreement.
Or a new MOU, whatever they are called now.
As a matter of fact we've had one call from one community where they'd like to see if they can get more funding for that agreement that they have.
So I've told that community that we would be pushing for what they're trying to do, to the appropriate department but we'd also be prepared to assist the community to figure out how to see if they could get more funding under that particular agreement.
This will be my final question for community empowerment.
So the minister will be receptive to the municipality's administration coming in and dealing with his officials on maybe revisiting these agreements to see that they’re honest.
I don't think it's the intent of the municipality to come in here and say they want a 20% increase across the board but when we sign these agreements and I was a member of the hamlet council at the time, we were signing in good faith, both parties.
I don't think it was the intent to rob the government of the NWT at the time with these agreements.
The community wanted to empower itself and develop capacity and show leadership in developing that community.
So will the minister commit that his officials, working with the municipality of Baker Lake, to maybe just, revisiting these agreements to make them more in tune with time.
Hon. Jack Anawak: We will work with all municipalities that have those agreements in place if those particular communities want to re-visit their agreements that they have.
Since Nunavut came in April 1, 1999, I know that this is just a generic question.
Has there been many municipalities take on community empowerment roles.
Or has it sort of just levelled off since April 1.
Hon. Jack Anawak: It has levelled off or the fact that we are looking at various issues within the department such as a financing review, a legislative review.
It might be that some of the communities may be waiting to see what was the outcome of those reviews and maybe decide to move forward after that but at this point no there has not been as many as it has previously.
Mr. McLean: This may be another unfair question but has there been any municipalities giving you back responsibility of any agreements because of funding, lower funding levels.
Hon. Jack Anawak: No, as I said I just had one other community phone me to say that they would like to review their agreement and if there was no further funding then maybe they would like to give it back but at this point we have not had any give us back our responsibilities.
Chairperson (interpretation): We are on 7-11.
Mr. Iqaqrialu wants to ask more questions.
Just briefly.
That 5 million dollars that is towards water and sewage services block funding.
Does the hamlet, if they were to ask for this money, is it flexible to used it for other areas.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): They do not apply for this funding.