EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
So assuming we can get all the information we have been asking for.
It is our plan to let the divisional education’s know where the position will be allocated before the end of April.
Mr. Chairman I did some looking in through my files during the break and I found the information that I was looking for regarding the teachers here in Iqaluit.
In Iqaluit right now we have 63 teachers.
Many our classrooms are overcrowded.
There is some to high 20’s for people teacher ratios right now.
The minister indicated earlier that these new teachers will be on top of the teachers that we have on the actual teachers we have of right now.
How are you going to base the distribution of these teachers to ensure that Iqaluit is going to be looking at again at least 63 teachers next year, and more if the numbers are warranted based on extraordinary funding.
I like to make two comments.
We like to find out first where the real needs are in all of Nunavut.
We will get that from divisional councils of those three regions.
I can not just comment on one community like Iqaluit whether they have the greatest need right now in comparison to other communities.
We will get that from the divisional boards.
Secondly, I agree with everything Mr. Tootoo has said about his comment about there will be deficiencies in the funding for the department of education.
But with the same breath I will assure him that this was our first year after we inherited the budget process from the GNWT and the programs like formulas and needs and strengths of our programs.
We were not being at full capacity in the last 6 months for example.
We are becoming to a full capacity to do the work.
I think the member would also appreciate this is the year of change.
The year of reviewing everything so what we do is in fact good for Nunavut.
I share similar comments that the member was making.
That we have to look at what the real needs are.
How do we make our Bathurst Mandate more into reality.
As far as education is concerned but I am happy that the government has indicated in fact twice that the savings for the divisional boards.
For example, minor capitals that we were able to announce yesterday, setting up a library in the middle school, you know, these kind of things.
We have to wait until we get the auditor’s report to know exactly what the surplus may be or what the savings are.
That is why I am very reluctant to include estimated surpluses, because they are only estimates in this budget.
Therefore our budget is real in a sense that this is what has been approved for this year not counting any potential surpluses that we possibly hope there will be from those two areas; the divisional boards, dissolution of divisional boards and the surplus of any of those boards after July 1.
Maybe for clarification all the members, and I use the Iqaluit number because that’s the number I have in front of me, I guess to re-phrase it I should say that, can all the Members in this House including the Member from Cambridge Bay, be comfortable in knowing that they will not lose teachers they have in their communities right now and I don’t know, I can’t guess the number in any of the communities, but I know here there are 63 teachers.
The classes are booming and we’ve had closures because teachers can’t make it and there are no subs.
The classes are overcrowded and just to feel comfortable, to make the teachers and the parents and all of us members comfortable; the numbers that we have right now aren’t going to decrease and this 12-14 teachers are going to be on top of those numbers based on whatever numbers are warranted by your review not only for here but for all the communities.
We have to find the numbers, we have to find the numbers first, because some communities the numbers may go down.
Because is a lot of people moving to Iqaluit for example and some other decentralized communities, so, I’d like to, you know, get the report first at least indication of where the numbers have gone up and where the numbers are going up, where they maybe going down.
I assure you this government, the Cabinet, when I have been meeting with them is absolutely sincere about wanting to do the right thing in the area of education for children.
Therefore, I am confident they will not let any of us parents or students down.
Under Business Plans of Education, there were some decreases in some funding areas and when the Minister of Finance, when I was asking him why they didn’t put enough money for cultural programs and here we see here under 9-11 and there is also another decrease in funding.
The contribution. (interpretation ends) it decreased from 1.142 million to 1.398 million.
Sorry. (interpretation) Why is there a decrease here again.
Whenever you are ready Mr. Minister, you can make your response.
If you are going to have a briefing there perhaps we can take a short break.
Whenever you are ready to respond Mr. Minister.
Yes, perhaps going back to cultural programs grants and contributions is, we have put in 400 thousand dollars there.
There are also some breakdowns on these two.
Under page 9-16 (interpretation ends) it says that on behalf of 3rd parties including the work for on 3rd parties there’s human resources development strategies with DIAND about 610 thousand (Interpretation) I just want to know what this will be used for.
I just want to know what the funding will be used for.
I am just wondering what the money that has been allocated will be used for in the future years.
Just a reminder when we get to our page numbers if you would like to ask your questions I would prefer if you would refer to documents that are in front of you and state which page you are at.
However, I will let the Minister of Education respond to your question.
So, it is open for response.
This funding is expected from the Federal government.
Maybe I can get Mr. Moody to explain more.
Mr. Moody: Mr. Chairman.
The items on this page, two of the four lines here are likely to change during the year.
It’s money coming in from outside the Government of Nunavut.
There’s one for Human Resource Strategy, we are in the process of working with the Government of Canada, that figure is not a firm figure but we hope to have that or more and it will be dedicated to training for people coming to the public service.
What we hope that would be for but that’s not firm.
Similarly just to illustrate the first line on that page the labour market development agreement is also money coming in from the Government of Canada, in fact we expect the number to increase significantly, waiting for a formal opportunity to do so.
My name is Alakannuark not Alakannuk.
My question is regarding the number of students in the communities after they complete the elementary schools programs the graduates that would like to go onto universities and colleges for higher learning.
However, some of them are not used to going out of the communities and leaving their families.
Some people who go to colleges and universities do get homesick, I’m just wondering if the department has looked to this serious concern, has the department have any plans for future university type facilities in the future in Nunavut.
I think the Member knows that in previous years they did have post secondary programs in place, however, this was also a concern for some parents in the communities for that reason they decided to put up grade 12 extensions in the communities.
After having extended grades in the communities the Department of Education has also decided to review some of the post -secondary programs to see if they could also be used in the schools.
We all know we cannot have such programs in all the schools but we are thinking about setting up some type of regional post-secondary education facilities.
There are two schools or two universities, Nova Scotia universities that the Government of Nunavut has made an agreement with to see if we would be able to send students to.
We were talking with them to see if we could have a two-way orientation program and an introduction to colleges.
There’s also one in Ottawa, there are some students that are taking university courses in the Human Resources department and there’s quite a few students that came from Nunavut attending the universities in the south.
I know we reviewed these documents and we did approve them obviously, but I am not entirely satisfied.
The documents that were tabled are a priority and I have been asking what the surplus numbers are.
Today the Department of Education indicates they have a surplus of 9.1 million dollars, if the information is accurate.
At the same time there seemed to be insufficient funds last year because I have been asking the government about a capital project.
They should be friendly in their responses but they have not agreed to do this capital project in my riding and yet they have apparently a surplus of 9.1 million dollars
I am not entirely satisfied with that information.
The other thing is here in these main estimates in the documents we were provided in this binder I know that we have already reviewed the documents but I have to make my own comments.
I understand that they were to build a school in Cambridge Bay that would cost 14.2 million dollars.
Chairperson (interpretation): I’m sorry, that paper you were referring to, I don’t believe that paper has been table in the House and you have to keep notice of that, if it has not been tabled formally in the House, you cannot refer to it.
That’s for your information, I apologize, but that is in the rules.
If you have other questions we are more than welcome to accommodate you.
Mr. Irqittuq (interpretation): Okay Mr. Chairman, my apologies.
This document was placed before me.
In the school that burnt down in Cambridge Bay, I think that the insurance coverage of 9 million dollars plus and now I understand that figure has risen to 14 million dollars being allocated for the building of that school.
Why is it so expensive.
If you wish to respond.
First, perhaps this school, when it burned down, the initial insurance was at a set amount.
But every year as houses or buildings get older they depreciate.
Should they be sold, also called amortisation, and because that figure keeps changing the amount for insurance purposes also decreases.
If there is an accident like a fire, then you can use the coverage to make a new building and at the same time make a bigger building because that school was too small as it was.
Wherever there are schools that burn down if we try to build the exact same thing you have to factor in that the building was getting older the insurance is always based on the condition, the date, and the age of the building.
For example if you buy a brand new vehicle, let’s just say it cost 40 thousand your insurance would be a certain amount, if you buy a vehicle say for 2 thousand then the insurance would be a lot smaller.
Insurance is always comparable to the buying price.
You would have difficulty getting a brand new vehicle if anything happened to your old vehicle and if we want to build a new school we have to use the figures for 99/2000.
But if we want to make it usable to 2005 we would be wiser to build for the future, for the future requirements and so the insurance would change.
So there is 231 thousand dollars for it’s design was in excess of 682 thousand dollars and then for the design 1.2495 million dollars and we explained the insurance coverage and there was also an agreement that the Hamlet and the community along with the Education Council if they want to get a bigger gymnasium it was agreed the Hamlet would pay in part of the costs for the re-building of the gymnasium.
I believe we would pay the 75% ratio of that and so we made an agreement to that effect.
So, these figures that were set aside for the designing of the building and all the other aspects of the building is about 14 million dollars in total.
Maybe I will save my general comments for later.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): Concerning lack of teachers.
I understood the response and the explanation provided concerning the Iqaluit teachers saying there is a certain number of teachers will be provided for Iqaluit and they talked about the student teacher ratio.
I understand there is a continuing increase of students enrolled for classes every year and because of this increase, we need to have an equal proportion of teachers in response to the needs of the students enrolling.
There was a question as to how many teacher positions would be created after the 1 million dollar allocation I understood the response to be 12-14 teacher positions.
That was the question and the question was also where would those positions be but the indication is we can’t get that information until April and so my question is this that the number of students enrolling in schools are ever increasing, I wonder what happens then.
Hon. James Arvaluk (interpretation): As the student enrolment numbers increase we have to have a direct proportion of teachers and we do not cut teacher positions while the increases occur.
Just to point out Mr. Minister, perhaps you should try to keep your microphone closer, because sometimes we do not get all the information you are saying.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): I knew that he would respond in that the teachers' positions aren't eliminated but he said that there is X number of positions in Iqaluit and I represent the community of Pond Inlet and I understand that they want to eliminate one and a half teacher positions.
This means a full time teacher and a part time teacher.
Those positions are in the plan to be eliminated.
Now what does that mean, Mr. Minister, you said the teacher positions are not eliminated and I was told in previous responses that these one and ½ positions would be eliminated.
Does he know about that.
If that is the case, that is a good question.
The Baffin Divisional Board of Education can give us that information and we can probably give him that information tomorrow while we are still in these discussions.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): Although we try to ask questions during question period we never seem to have enough time.
We have numerous questions so I thought this would be the best forum to get responses.
I am hoping that as soon as he receives his information I would like a response as soon as possible to see if they plan to eliminate that 1 ½ positions because I am getting mixed messages.
The ratio of students enrolling are increasing, teacher positions seem to be eliminated, so much so that there is overcrowding and we have to have grade 3 students in three different classes.
I know he understands my reference to the 1.5 positions.
He has to take a good look at these figures because it is a big concern.
I thought that by using this forum I would be getting responses and I would appreciate if he would respond to me during a forum like this in Committee of the Whole.
Mr. Arvaluk indicated that he will get information from the Baffin Divisional Board of Education and he will respond to you formally in the House.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): I am sorry Mr. Chairman, I said two things.
He can do it in this forum through committee of the whole, or through a written form but I requested that he respond to me in committee of the whole.
Chairperson (interpretation): We understand your request Mr. Nutarak.
Does the Minister of Education wish to respond further.
Hon. James Arvaluk (interpretation): Mr. Chairman, I agree with his request.
My question is concerning the elders and youth division.
I know that the Department of Education should be working with that division.
What kinds of learning programs do you plan to promote within those two departments.
Hon. James Arvaluk (interpretation): Mr. Chairman, for the students that are either graduated or not graduated.
Which one is he referring to.
Mr. Akesuk (interpretation): I am talking about grade 12 graduates.
I would think that it would be easier for them to access post-secondary programs because we do not have very many students entering University type levels.
Mr. Minister if you understand the question.
Hon. James Arvaluk (interpretation): Yes, I keep moving away from my microphone.
Mr. Chairman we are going to try and do something about that and we want to do our review under the income support programs as I have mentioned.
We will also be looking at the student financial assistance programs.
Those will be undertaken as we are reviewing them to see where we can make improvements, because whoever is interested in higher learning must be considered seriously by the Government Departments and we are doing a review to find out how we can make improvements.
We are going to promote the universities, such as Dalhousie or Carleton.
There are a number of universities that we are starting to work together with and we will be sending some more people down to the universities.
We helped them out in, particularly St. Mary's University, we will be taking grade 11 and grade 12 students for orientation at the universities.
We will inform all the communities that they will have an opportunity to come and see the universities for a two-week visit to see how well they might be able to adjust to university learning.
We want to encourage their preparedness before their graduation.
The reason being when you deal with complex subjects certain academic levels are required.
For those that are interested in attending college, then their subjects are usually more general but you need specific credits for specific subjects that you wish to learn in universities.
So what we want to do is encourage high school students to start considering well in advance where they want to go for post-secondary programs, so they can prepare whether they want to go through general programs or through academic programs.
For subjects such as languages, or math levels, you need certain credits if you want to pursue being a lawyer or a doctor you need certain credits that will be recognized or accepted at university levels.
We want to get this information out to students, give them information as to what credits they will need in order to go to university and college.
I am sure all this will cost money too.
I am wondering just how much you plan on using for this review.
I am sorry I missed the first part of his question. If he could repeat it.
I am sure that there will be funding required to undergo this review.
How much does he estimate he will need to do the review.
Hon. James Arvaluk (interpretation): Mr. Chairman, I thought he was referring to income support programs.
Is he referring to the review of the income support programs.
Mr. Akesuk (interpretation): He was just talking about doing a review as to which schools will be reviewed.
That is my questions.
This is just going to be a promotional thing.
We want to get information out to the communities. We want students to know if you are interested in going to university this is what you have to do to prepare to go.
You have to decide what kind of career you want to work toward and we have an agreement with St. Mary's University where we can do a two week preliminary introduction to that university with the students.
However, we use our staff to work this out.
We only pay for the student's per diems and living arrangements.
So that is what we provide but as for the promotion, our current staff does that.
My question is in 9 – 14 in your binders.
My question is in regards to the different programs that are provided through field operations for example, career counselling, student financial assistance support, occupational program support, day-care support, early childhood education support, adult basic education, literacy support, labour market development program and community library support.
For the year 2000 under the revised estimates there is 365, compensation and benefits.
I apologize. It is on page 9 – 14 in your binders.
My question is why there is a three million dollar increase and in grants and contributions there is a decrease from 90 thousand to 75 thousand and other expenses have been increased from 24 million to 25 million.
These are three questions that I have under field operations.
It is in regards to the major increases and decreases.
Your questions are in the Main Estimates.
I appreciate your questions but they are right in the Main Estimates.
We will be dealing with these items by item when the time comes.
Right now we are under general questions and general comments.
We will get into the Main Estimates at the appropriate time.
If you would like to respond to the member's questions.
Mr. Barnabas (interpretation): Yes, I would like to respond.
There is a three million dollar increase in here.
I do know that we will get into the Main Estimates at the appropriate time but I do have this question.
Hon. James Arvaluk (interpretation): Mr. Chairman, the increase by 3.3 million dollars was on another page last year.
We moved it from that to another department and I could ask one of our staff to answer that question.
Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. Barnabas.
He could probably give us a detailed report when we get into the Main Estimates.
It's okay we do not have to get into it right now but I will bring that up again at the Main Estimates.
We will be getting into the Main Estimates.
Mr. Havioyak (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Chairman…. technical difficulties…
Our elders need to be used in our educational system.
In Kugluktuk, they have requested this, maybe not only in Kugluktuk but also in other communities, to use elders in the school system so that they can pass on their traditional knowledge and that will be a great asset to our young people.
There will be more people looking for employment, how will these young people, once they begin to find employment, how will programs be directed to them towards their enhancement.
Chairperson (interpretation): Minister of Education.
This question is for personnel. It is in regards to personnel.
His question is about using elders in the education system.
Yes, if they are teachers and if they are certified.
I do not believe that is the direction of his question.
I believe his question is more about casual employment of the elders and for instructors in cultural programs.
They are not here but we could use the elders using the Enter program.
We did that in Arviat, I believe we used four elders who we enrolled into the Enter program.
Mr. Havioyak: Thank you Mr. Chairman.
The reason I was asking is that you are saying the department may be targeting at least 85 percent Inuit in the future. Some of that 85 percent we would like to see as elders in permanent positions instead of having to hire them on a casual basis.
It is something that we need to do in schools.
Like I said earlier on, my communities are saying at least, having elders teaching at the schools, teaching our youth the traditional way of life and also getting their identity back from the elders, it is working towards community wellness.
I am just saying that I would like to see some of the elders involved in this.
You mentioned casual work but we have to put them in the future more into permanent positions.
Again, I would just like to see that.
Are there some plans for that.
Koanna.
Mr. Chairman, I totally agree with you.
We do not want to stop any elders who want to become certified teachers.
But we do not have any plans on any programs specifically geared for unilingual people.
(interpretation ends) I am sorry I had forgotten that the member had switched from Inuinnaqtun.
I totally agree with him that we would like to see elders in the NTEP programs. In the regular NTEP programs but we don't have developed sophistication for specialists other than the language specialists that we have trained and now we have hired, two in permanent and two in casual in Arviat headquarters for curriculum development programs.
We do not disagree, but we also have to think about the students who will be receiving the instruction from the elders.
Not all people are instructors.
I think when we have a little bit more authority over the DEAs then they will have to recommend to us what is the best community for them in their schools.
At the moment we are going through the divisional boards, as to how the staffing, especially the local staffing, is being done.