EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
We’re going to be putting out lots of ads and spots in newspapers, in TVs, other materials and resources out there to educate people about the dangers of binge drinking, drink responsibly, and educate them over time, especially the younger people who, as we always say, are our future.
We’re doing this with good intentions, not to make a lot of money or anything.
It’s something that the task force, in their research, has said that Greenland had great success, Northern Quebec has had good success, and we believe it’s something that we should try.
Over the years it’s the stark reality that there’s a serious drinking problem in Nunavut. Most of that is attributable to the hard liquor, bootleggers supplying hard liquor, and binge drinking.
Welcome, Minister Peterson and your staff.
Mr. Chairman, one of the responses, if I heard the minister correctly, referred to evaluating the impacts of beer and wine on the local community.
Can you clarify if you meant just in Iqaluit, or will the department and the government as a whole be considering the impacts on outlying communities? Cape Dorset and Kimmirut are one of the closest communities to Iqaluit.
There’s easier access.
It’s the hub for the Baffin region. How far are you going to be monitoring this beer and wine outlet?
The primary impact will be on the city of Iqaluit, so that’s where we would be primarily concerned. It is in Iqaluit.
More than likely most of the customer accounts that are approved will be from Iqaluit.
If we hear concerns from the other communities, we would take those concerns into consideration when we’re doing our evaluation. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I think many people will be having a close eye on the effects of this opening of a beer and wine store. Can you state if there’s specific… ? I was looking at the report that I was waving earlier today, taking steps to reduce alcohol harm, and on the last page it talks about monitoring and evaluation.
Will there be specific staff? Can you clarify if there’s individual staff or how many that will be tasked with looking at... ?
The first people that come to mind are the RCMP.
We know that they compile statistics on crimes and if it’s related to alcohol.
Yesterday the minister was talking about the ride-along with some of the members here in Iqaluit.
I’m sure some of the calls or maybe all of them were alcohol-related.
How is that going to be compiled in terms of monitoring the effects, not only here in Iqaluit but also in other communities outside of Iqaluit?
When I did the RCMP ride-along back in April 2010, we started at 6:00 and I went off shift at 4:00.
Most of the issues that developed that we were involved in were people that were in bars or just left bars and they were going to parties. It had nothing to do with the liquor from a warehouse or from a beer and wine store.
My point is the people who were already drinking that night were in the bars, they were at parties, they got their alcohol from somewhere, but yes, there were problems with alcohol.
When I was on that shift, from what I could visibly see, the alcohol was not beer or wine; it was the hard stuff.
To answer his question, we would use existing resources within our Department of Finance, which includes the Nunavut Liquor Commission, and we do have a working relationship with the RCMP to exchange information on liquor purchases and other information in our territory.
Does he have an idea of... ? I’m going back to this report. On the last page it says and it talks about the government, through different departments, will take steps to monitor, evaluate, and track the success of the actions set out in this document, meaning when they’re opening the beer and wine store, the successes that they’re going to be tracking but also the challenge is in what people are expecting out of this opening.
Mr. Shooyook, Mr. Okalik, and Mr. Enook, everyone has concerns about the negative effects that might come out of it.
Does the minister have an idea of how many, let’s say, staff or people in the government will be monitoring this opening of the beer and wine store?
Mr. Chairman, I’ll again go back in time, not very far this time, but we did our extensive community consultations in Iqaluit.
I won’t get into all the details.
We had the plebiscite on April 20, 2015. There were close to 1,500 people that came out on that day, 40 percent of the eligible voters, and 78 percent of those people voted in favour of the Government of Nunavut opening up a beer and wine store, government-regulated, as per the recommendations of the Nunavut Liquor Task Force.
There are a lot of positive feelings in town about a beer and wine store.
The city council was involved with their motions supporting the plebiscite at the time.
They approved our variances recently or yesterday to renovate the liquor warehouse.
Mr. Chairman, there are a lot of positive and optimistic people in Iqaluit.
I recognize that there are people that are concerned.
Again, I’m going to keep harping on this.
This is beer and wine.
This is low alcohol content beer and wine.
It’s not vodka. It’s not Johnny Walker.
It’s none of that stuff. It’s none of the hard stuff like 40 percent.
This is low content alcohol, affordable beer and wine.
Again, it’s too early to tell.
We’re using our existing resources going forward to monitor.
We haven’t opened up the beer and wine store. We’re preparing now the application process for the customer accounts.
We will be working with our partners on how we’re going to monitor and evaluate the ongoing operation of the beer and wine store and what kind of data we will be collecting to help us evaluate the success or failure of the beer and wine store three years after it opens.
I didn’t hear a response to my question. Does the department or the government as a whole have a number like how many employees will be under the responsibility or part of their role is to monitor the effects of the opening of the beer and wine store?
Can you say if there are a number of employees in the Department of Finance or the Department of Justice or the government as a whole?
I thought I did answer the question.
I said that we will use existing resources.
We’re renovating the existing liquor warehouse and that operates under the auspices of the Nunavut Liquor Commission. They have their staff. I met the staff out there.
We also have policy people in the Department of Finance that can work closely with the Nunavut Liquor Commission.
We do have partnerships and a relationship with the RCMP to exchange information.
I’ll leave that for a bit.
The communities I represent, my constituency being Cape Dorset and Kimmirut, will be clearly affected and other outlying communities.
Can the minister say why those communities did not participate in a vote?
We know there was a plebiscite here in Iqaluit, but it will affect other outlying communities.
Can he respond to that?
It wasn’t a regional plebiscite.
It wasn’t a territorial plebiscite. It was a community plebiscite and you have to be an eligible voter of the city of Iqaluit to vote in a plebiscite for this community.
We all know that Iqaluit is the capital of Nunavut, the hub for the Baffin region.
Anyone who goes south has to go through Iqaluit. If you’re going anywhere from the smaller communities or from anywhere in the Baffin, you have to go through Iqaluit to get anywhere.
I guess in a sense we are part of Iqaluit. It’s the hub and headquarters.
There are so many conferences and events held here.
Other communities will be affected either way.
I’m trying to get at why the communities outside of Iqaluit didn’t participate in a plebiscite.
Under the Liquor Act, the individual communities can apply for their own if they get 20 names on a petition. If Cape Dorset wants to have a plebiscite related to liquor, then they get 20 names on a petition and it’s local. It’s the same with Kimmirut or any community.
In Iqaluit there was a petition that I just forget the exact number. There were 99 names on a petition asking the Government of Nunavut to hold a plebiscite on the question of opening a beer and wine store in Iqaluit.
The City of Iqaluit verified that the 99 names or most of the 99 names on that petition were eligible voters of Iqaluit.
We asked the question from the Government of Nunavut to the City of Iqaluit, “Do you support us holding a plebiscite on the question of opening a beer and wine store in Iqaluit?” The City of Iqaluit passed a motion saying, “Yes, we support the Government of Nunavut holding a plebiscite on the question of opening a beer and store in Iqaluit.” That’s exactly what we did.
We worked with Elections Nunavut, there was a consultation process, and we had elections and held the vote on April 20, 2015. We didn’t tell people how to vote.
They came out, the eligible voters that showed up that day, and 78 percent of them said, “We support the opening of a beer and wine store in Iqaluit.”
I’m wondering too now: what is the opinion of the law enforcement agency, the RCMP “V” Division? We know that they have a lot of call-outs with alcohol-related incidents.
We know there are many local vendors for alcohol, the establishments here. I think the minister explained that there is a whole list of places where you can get it. Now there is going to be an extra option to access alcohol.
We know it’s beer and wine, but at the same time it’s alcohol nonetheless.
The RCMP, to my understanding, has said that whenever there is more alcohol, it creates more call-outs and there is more unrest. Have they had a position on the beer and wine store opening? What feedback have they provided?
When we put the Nunavut Liquor Task Force together, one of the members of the task force was a representative of the RCMP.
As I said, the task force went around all the communities in Nunavut.
They didn’t miss a single community, Mr. Chairman. They went to every community. They gave us two reports, what we heard and then the recommendations.
One of the recommendations was to open a beer and wine store specifically to disrupt bootleggers and reduce the binge drinking. The RCMP was part of the task force. They put that recommendation forward.
I think the RCMP is very cognizant of the fact that the most serious issue to Nunavut is the hard alcohol. I have talked about it.
I have seen the effects of hard alcohol myself on many of my friends and others in Cambridge Bay. We’re not selling 60-ounce bottles of Smirnoff; we’re selling 12-can cases of beer up to 500 millilitres a can and two bottles of wine.
In my quick calculation, that’s probably one-quarter of the alcohol content of a 60-ounce bottle of Smirnoff.
The RCMP, given their choice, probably wants to see a reduction in the purchase of hard alcohol. They would like to see an elimination of bootleggers. They deal all the time with people who binge drink large bottles.
Knowing what I know from the RCMP and talking to them over the years, they understand the spirit and intent of the beer and wine store is to disrupt the bootleggers and reduce the binge drinking from hard alcohol.
We understand and we know from all the best research that we have done in the task force has shown that beer and wine stores will have that intended effect.
I think I’m good for now. I’m lost for more questions. (interpretation) Thank you.
We’re on page C-4. (interpretation ends) Finance. Corporate Management.
Although I am not an Iqaluit resident nor from the Baffin region, I still wish to comment on the beer and wine store.
Iqaluit is the capital of Nunavut and the headquarters for most departments, so all Inuit may be impacted by this development that our minister spoke to.
Let me first start with welcoming the minister and his officials.
As per the minister’s response, this store will be a pilot project, but I really don’t know the details.
What many northern residents are concerned with is alcohol abuse has led to the loss of life, but I am unaware of whether the numbers are high or not.
The concern shared by many people and continually voiced relates to our experiences.
However, if our future generations of young people are properly taught about alcohol and responsible drinking, they can make an educated lifestyle choice based on the rights and freedoms of our laws.
Now, I would like to clearly understand if this store will be self-funded, as operational funds will be required. Will this be a privately operated store or will the government operate the store for the pilot project?
I have not heard this detail, so I would like to get that clarified.
Mr. Chairman, the task force recommended that it be a government owned and regulated beer and wine store and that’s exactly what it will be.
I don’t partake in the consumption of the hard liquor, although I am an occasional user of the weaker variety. Between the higher proofed liquor and the alcohol content for beer and wine and the insinuation that it won’t affect drinkers as quickly, I can’t determine that.
With respect to the associated dangers of daily beer or wine consumption, what impact does that have? I have lost my train of thought.
Are there any associated health issues associated with beer and wine that can affect the body?
I would like to get further clarification, although I am aware that the minister is no doctor.
I just want to be completely aware if there are any associated dangers. If he knows the answer, he can answer it, but I’ll understand if he can’t answer it, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
It’s a good question. I guess it would all depend on how much beer you drink. We have all heard of the beer gut.
If you drink too much beer, you’re going to get a beer gut and your body changes. If you were to drink large quantities of beer, you would probably pass out or get sick. We also heard that drinking a couple of glasses of wine a day is supposedly good for your heart.
I mean I’m not a doctor. I’m not a scientist. There are pros and cons.
Again, what we’re trying to do here is advocate and educate for socially responsible drinking. Don’t go down and get your case of beer and drink it all at once, but if you do, it’s only a case. It’s better to drink a bottle of beer every hour and that’s 12 ounces, but don’t drink 12 bottles over an hour, and that kind of stuff.
It all depends on how much you drink. If you drink to excess, then it’s probably not going to be good for your health.
Again, the higher alcohol content in the alcohol... .
When you drink a lot of hard alcohol, everybody has heard of cirrhosis of the liver. Your liver receives the alcohol and it processes it. It can do serious damage to your internal organs if you drink enough or a long enough time, especially the hard stuff.
The reason why I’m asking is we have really been a prohibited community, but the people who support prohibition are dying off.
Their concerns are still valid as they fear what will happen with the lifting of prohibition.
Thinking of that, that is why I’m asking this question.
If there is to be a plebiscite in Kugaaruk, I would to be assured that the plebiscite question is clear enough for everyone to understand, otherwise it will cause confusion and the vote results will be a farce not reflective of the true wishes of Kugaaruk residents.
This is just a general comment and that’s my last one, Mr. Chairman.
I don’t think it’s a question, but if Minister Peterson wishes, you have the floor.
Hon. Keith Peterson: No, minister or Mr. Chairman, I don’t have a comment.
I have called you Chairman, Speaker, and minister.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you. (interpretation ends) As long as we get the work done, eh?
(interpretation) We are on Finance. Corporate Management. Total Operations and Maintenance, to be Voted. $4,475,000.
Turn the page. C-5.
It reads, Finance. Fiscal Management.
The most recent annual report of the Nunavut Liquor Commission indicates that one of the issues that were discussed at a recent meeting of the Association of Liquor Licensing Authorities of Canada was the coming decriminalization of marijuana and the possible involvement of liquor licensing authorities in the sale, distribution, and regulation of marijuana.
On November 1, 2016 you stated in the Legislative Assembly that the Department of Finance, the Department of Justice, and the Department of Health had formed a working group to address the issue of marijuana legalization and distribution in Nunavut.
What have been the conclusions and recommendations of the working group?
This item came up at a federal-provincial-territorial justice ministers’ meeting in Halifax in October.
The ministers discussed the impending legislation from the federal government and the impact that they have in our respective jurisdictions. Of course, as the ministers of justice, we were urging the Government of Canada that if this federal legislation comes through, we would have to have a period of time before we could adjust to that legislation.
I talked to the parliamentary secretary to the minister of justice who was here last month. Just in a private conversation, I asked him, “How is that looking?” He said, “Start preparing.”
Our joint committee of the three territories met with the task force to provide our input. That was last August.
I think the report only came out in December. We are reviewing it. The internal government departments are still preliminary.
We’re working on reviewing the report.
We have an eye on the legislation. It’s going to be a challenge in Nunavut, I’m sure you can appreciate, because we only have two liquor warehouses in Nunavut.
If this legislation gets passed, how do we set it up to distribute? I probably have a million questions that I could think up and I have no answers for you right now.
It’s totally foreign territory for all provinces and territories at this moment.
My question here would be if marijuana were to be decriminalized within Nunavut, each and every community within Nunavut... . Some communities are prohibited, some communities are restricted, and some communities are open with alcohol for their respective communities, which is the outcome of a plebiscite vote.
If that were the case, would there be plebiscites regarding marijuana once you get the ruling from the federal government coming into our territory?
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you. Minister Peterson, I’ll give you the discretion to respond, but (interpretation ends) it’s almost hypothetical. (interpretation) I’ll leave it up to you to respond. Minister Peterson.
I thank Mr. Mikkungwak for the question. It’s a good question.
Again, as I said earlier, I’ve got lots of questions myself.
As you said, it’s almost hypothetical.
The legislation hasn’t been passed. We don’t even know if it’s going to be passed.
We can’t presuppose that it will be passed. They have a majority government in Ottawa, so there’s a good chance it will get passed.
As I said, as the ministers of justice, we have spoken that if it does get passed, we would need a few years in our respective jurisdictions to figure out how we’re going to deal with the distribution.
Those kinds of questions you asked about plebiscites in local communities, those are questions we’re going to have to figure out.
I can’t sit here today and tell you what the answer is going to be.
Mr. Mikkungwak: Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for allowing that question to pass through.
At the same time, with the established working group, the Department of Finance, the Department of Justice, and the Department of Health, I guess this would be my next question here: when you look at this, what recommendations are you submitting to the federal government on behalf of Nunavut as a working group and any consultations with our Member of Parliament?
Our recommendations will probably be around the implementation of the Act once the feds make their decision on how it will be implemented in Nunavut.
Total Operations and Maintenance, to be Voted. $7,292,000.
I want to just go back to the government’s 2014 Budget Address where it announced that the government would, and I quote, “review processes this year for monitoring grants and contributions to ensure that we receive good value from these agreements.”
Your department’s draft 2017-2020 business plan indicates that one of its priorities is to conduct the phase 2 audit of grants and contributions of the GN departments.
Minister Peterson, before you respond, I would like to recognize a visitor in the gallery who used to be an MLA.
Mr. Shewchuk, welcome to the House.
Minister Peterson, if you didn’t forget the question.
Welcome, Mr. Shewchuk.
My memory is getting kind of foggy, but I can certainly remember something that was asked two minutes ago.
Mr. Chairman, fortunately I have brought Mr. Chown here. I would like him to answer that question.
The phase 2 audits that are being referred to are currently underway and we’re anticipating those to be done within the not-too-distant future.
Those audits will be looking at the grants and contributions programs from the perspective of whether or not the departments are complying with their grants and contributions policies as far as allocating the funds in accordance with those policies and as to whether or not they’re monitoring the recipients to ensure that they’re spending the funds in accordance with those policies.
In addition part of this audit work will be looking at whether the departments that run these programs are properly monitoring the programs to ensure that they’re providing the intended outcomes, determining whether or not they’re assessing the effectiveness of those programs.
It would be the departments responsible for determining whether the programs are providing the benefits that they were expecting. We will be looking to see whether or not they have measures in place to measure and report on the effectiveness of those programs.
How does the government currently measure and evaluate the effectiveness of its grants and contributions expenditures at the moment, if they do?
I thank Mr. Rumbolt for the question. Mr. Chairman, that’s what the audit is for, to see if departments are doing that.
I know that the audit report is not done yet, but I’m just wondering: on average how many audits does the government anticipate that you will do each year on these grants and contributions?
Mr. Chown tells me that we’re looking at six to seven departments as part of the audit.
We’re on C-6.
Your department’s draft 2017-18 main estimates and 2017-2020 business plan reflect a number of organizational changes, including the conversion of the internal audit function from a branch to a division in the Comptrollership Branch.
Why is this reorganization being undertaken, and what is it intended to accomplish?
Hon. Keith Peterson: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I’m going to have Mr. Chown answer that question.
Having been in the department for a while, I’ve got a bit of the history with respect to internal audits. When I first came to the department around 10 years ago, internal audit was a direct reporting to the comptroller general.
As part of our restructuring a few years back when we merged with Human Resources and we were reallocating functions within the department, one of the decisions we made at the time was to move the internal audit function under the deputy minister.
Again, as we have looked at things over the last few years and we have done our restructuring, moving all the human resources functions together, part of that restructuring and rebalancing was a decision to move the function back under the comptroller general.
If you were to look at other jurisdictions, the internal audit function shows up in different places. There’s no one perfect answer for it, but certainly there’s a good fit for that under the comptroller general.
When you evaluate Internal Audit Services’ effectiveness in carrying out its mission and identifying opportunities to enhance, as the official indicated, its management and work processes, as well as its value to the Government of Nunavut, what conclusions has this evaluation reached?
I’m not sure if I understand the question clearly, but if you’re asking if Internal Audit Services is valuable to the government, it’s extremely valuable to the government.
They do a wide range of audits ranging from performance audits to compliance audits, forensic audits, and operational audits. They can be at the request of the department or we can do them ourselves and go in on a specific issue.