EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
I know the department isn’t funded very well for programs and services and the demands that are put on it by the communities.
But could the minister give me a brief outline as to what programs are now in place to do the sorts of thing in the communities to try and bring the elders and youth together.
Speaker: Ma'na, Mr. McLean.
I think in answering that question, that in communities or in Nunavut as a whole, I think I want to see elders and youth having a conference together at some time in the regions.
I think that could bring a lot of the elders and youth together in the regions.
That’s a good first step bringing the elders and youth together for conferences.
We hear a lot about the wisdom of our elders and I for one listen to them quite a bit in my community.
I also listen to the youth.
There has been some talk in the past about an elders’ day in Nunavut.
Has this department thought about bringing forward an elders’ day in Nunavut.
Not as of today, but I will take your advice about having recognition for the elders in Nunavut.
I am glad that the minister is considering it.
Would he also consider inviting some elders into our Legislative Assembly for sittings from other communities.
Because I think it is nice to have elders involved in the Legislative Assembly.
Speaker: Ma'na.
Hon. Peter Kattuk: Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I would consider that.
This Friday there will be elders together from the Baffin region.
So I am expecting a lot of elders this coming Friday, possible over 20 elders will be in the legislature this coming Friday.
Item 6 on the order paper.
Question 197 – 1(5): Payment for Grave Workers
I will give that minister a break.
During our sittings I was raising questions for the Minister of Health & Social Services and I have met with the minister.
He said that there was money allocated for the individuals that worked on the project to relocate the graves.
The money has to be spent before the end of March.
When he said that I informed the individuals that they would be receiving the money.
Can he give me an update because the end of the month is just around the corner.
Speaker (interpretation): Minister for Health & Social Services.
Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the member’s question.
Mr. Speaker, this question has been going on now for several years.
At the present time after the member’s questions here in this House, we are now, with the Department of Health & Social Services, as well as Intergovernmental Affairs and the Executive, trying to get to the bottom of the situation.
Originally, when we spoke to the member Mr. Speaker, the indication was that local government had authorized the movement of graves.
Mr. Speaker, it is my understanding now that because it was prior to April 1, 1999, the Nunavut Government wasn’t even in place, 1968, what mechanisms can we find as a government, again being aware of the precedents and so on, to try to help the individuals in moving the graves.
I promised the member that we would have a response to him before the end of the month and Mr. Speaker, I am still committed to doing that.
It is March 27 today and we are going to be sitting to the end of the week.
We only have four more days.
He said that they have been working on this for a while now, does he not have a response for me today.
Mr. Speaker, the short answer is no.
I have tried to explain, I don’t know how more clear I can be Mr. Speaker.
The member earlier talked about the form and I talked about the contribution agreement that we have in place that we can do for healing and so on.
That’s the way I envisioned it.
Mr. Speaker, he first asked the Minister for Community Government, somehow it shifted to me in the NWT and I was there for four years listening to the questions from the previous Member for Amittuq.
It always went to Intergovernmental Affairs and the Executive because it was prior to that government being set up.
It is the same situation here.
How do you try to help the individuals involved without setting a precedent.
That’s the concern the government has.
So that is not a short answer that you can get.
But as I said, I will have a written response for the member before March 31, on his original questions as I promised in this House.
But that’s the best thing that I can say now Mr. Speaker.
When Mr. Anawak was the minister we started working on this and I have been raising this concern ever since.
He requested some documentation from me and I was able to give it to him.
I was told that the Minister of Health & Social Services, and the former Minister of Justice were going to be working together.
I know that the member has replied to my questions saying that they found some money and that the only problems they were having were the documents showing what was done were not available.
I was told that the money was available.
Today is March 27 and he has replied again that he will give me a written reply.
Is there a problem. Is that why we need to reply on paper.
Mr. Speaker, originally I believe and I believe the Hansard will show that I said that I would get a written response to the member before March 31st.
I am committed to doing that.
Mr. Speaker, I think we have to just back up.
Originally, with this file Mr. Speaker, there has been a lot of research done on it from the NWT and we have a staff person who is involved in researching this for a number of years now.
I believe it pointed to the Americans, it had something to do with because of the DEW line sites, with moving it.
The member says that is not the case.
Someone else said it was the Catholic Church because of the priest that was there.
Someone else says that is not the case.
They have gone through local government to see what official orders requested the graves to be moved.
So Mr. Speaker, first before the government sets a precedent I am trying to explain why it can't be settled that fast. Before the government sets a precedent and pays out money, you have to find out who authorized, who instructed the people to move graves.
Were they promised to be paid to do that, and should it be the Nunavut Government to say because you promised something 30 years ago that you pay it.
That is the precedent.
There are legal circumstances surrounding this.
Every conversation that we have had I tried to say I understand that it was a very emotional thing.
The member did an excellent statement explaining the emotional problems associated with digging up the graves and reburying them.
I think everyone in the House sympathizes with that.
But it is not just a case of paying out money because of that.
Is there something that we could do through a healing program.
Are there grants that we could give the Hamlet so that they could have actual healing and bring closure to this incident that happened in 1968 or 1967.
Again, the date is arbitrary here.
So that is what I have been trying to answer to the member.
Speaker (interpretation): If you are going to be asking questions please keep it to the point.
Our Speaker has also told us that the responses should be to the point.
Mr. Irqittuq: It has nothing to do with the American government. (interpretation) If you didn't understand I thought just to be clear, I'd say it in English.
The American government said we need to relocate one grave so that they can make a building on that site.
They just bulldozed it away and that is a different story.
The Americans did not have anything to do with the relocation of the graves.
I can even show you where the sites were.
They had to move the graves because they wanted to build houses over there.
When we are talking about healing, even if you give money to the hamlet, myself and from what I know they’re over 60 years old and I think they are over it.
They just want to get compensated for relocating the graves. I think it would be kind of useless to heal them.
I think the elders said that to me.
You said that Mr. Anawak and you had a meeting and you said you had found 30 thousand dollars and that the people who dug the graves could be compensated with that as long as there was documentation.
So what is your problem.
What is holding you back.
I know exactly what you are saying and I know what you are trying to say.
But I don't think we should blame the Americans.
I lived in that community and I saw what happened.
Speaker (interpretation): Thank you. Minister Picco.
Hon. Ed Picco: Mr. Speaker, all I tried to point out was that there are different stories out there.
You have given us one story, the member has given us one story.
There were different stories for four years while I was sitting in another House listening to different stories.
There has been an investigation, we have had a person who has contacted all the authorities and this is the information that they have brought to us.
All I am saying to the member is that before this government, your government, the member’s government and our government, the people of Nunavut’s government, before they pay out money, we pay out any money, should we be doing, is it our responsibility for something that happened 30 years ago.
Mr. Speaker, that’s the precedent I talked about.
The member has talked about the conversation that he had with Mr. Anawak and me, we talked about closure.
I have a fund within the government of the Department of Health & Social Services, I think it is 30 thousand dollars, that’s the money we talked about.
We didn’t say here yes, here is a blank cheque and you can take the 30 thousand.
That never, no one said that.
What we said is, or I said it here, I would like to pay them today, Mr. Speaker, I would pay them right now if I had the money.
But we have to make sure of the precedent, we have to look at the legal circumstances and should the government pay money for something that they weren’t responsible for, we weren’t even there 30 years ago.
Should the member be bringing this to NTI, should it go to the Aboriginal Healing Fund, is there another resource, is there another access.
Mr. Speaker, that’s what the government is trying to find out.
You don’t find out those types of answers in an hour or a day or a minute.
Mr. Speaker, I understand what the member is saying, I know some of the people that are involved.
I said and I said it earlier again, I would pay it if I could, but Mr. Speaker, we have to look at the precedent and that’s what we are trying to do in the government, and we have to be fair.
There may be other instances like this across Nunavut.
What would happen then.
So that’s what we are trying to find out Mr. Speaker.
Question 198 – 1(5): Elders’ Meeting Agenda
I don’t know which minister to direct this question to, but I will direct it to the Minister of Culture, Language, Elders & Youth.
The minister said that there is going to be an elders’ conference, some elders from the Baffin, Kitikmeot and the Keewatin.
We know that elders, using their traditional customs aren’t given any work to do.
They have policies that they have to adhere to during that conference.
Is it possible for these elders to have an informal meeting so that they can give out their information so that we will find out exactly what traditions and culture that they still retain.
It is up to us to get that information.
I think they should have an informal session so that we can get the information that the elders have, so that we will find out the true customs that the Inuit and the elders have.
It is always better to make your questions brief and to the point.
We have been having meetings for many, many years.
We know the customs or the procedures of our meetings.
We give every delegate an opportunity to say whatever they want to say during those proceedings.
Also there are various organizations from the communities that go to those meetings and they make reports to the delegations that are sitting there.
They also give options.
The elders can say anything that they want during those conferences and I have been a board member for many, many years for various organizations and I am sure that they will get all the information that they require and they will be able to say anything that they want.
Speaker (interpretation): Thank you. Supplementary. Mr. Iqaqrialu.
I have been on boards as well for many, many years, but I have never been to a meeting where the delegations can say anything that they want.
We have the Robert’s Rules of Order and we have procedures and everything else.
The meetings are co-ordinated by co-ordinators and they have agendas and they have specific things that they can say during specific times.
I think that the elders should be given the freedom to say anything that they want so that they can tell us what they know.
It might be story telling but we do have to do that now because the elders are growing fewer, they should be given the opportunity to say anything that they want.
Do you agree, Mr. Minister.
Well you don’t even agree to it.
It is already a custom of any meetings.
The delegation can say anything they want that’s what I said before.
I know that in the Baffin region, the conference that I mentioned will be open to the elders.
They will be able to voice their concerns and their opinions.
We have already told the delegations that we invited.
I know there may be something more we can do, but the delegations will have an agenda, and the time and everything else will be set, but the elders have been asked prior to the meeting and prior to their arrival, what they want to see on the agenda.
It is a procedure that we always follow.
As Members of the Legislative Assembly, we have a specific agenda that we have to follow.
We have the Orders of the Day that we see every day and I am sure that when the elders are coming, they will see exactly the same thing, like you have to stick to the agenda.
They should be given the opportunity to say anything they want.
So I am asking the minister if they elders can have an informal meeting and be able to say anything without having a set agenda that they have to follow.
This is alien to the elders.
A long time ago since we were an oral custom we talked about everything, lifestyles, whatever, they didn’t have a specific agenda that they had to follow.
So I would like to give the elders an opportunity to say whatever they want and have the meeting in the Inuit custom.
Maybe that way we will be able to hear something that we don’t know today and maybe it will enrich our lifestyle today.
That’s my question if you just agree I will be very pleased.
Well the member said that the Orders of the Day is something that chains you and you have to deal with specific things at specific times.
We are a Nunavut Government and we have to follow the Orders of the Day, it is a procedure that we have to follow as a government.
This has nothing to do with the elders’ conference that I mentioned.
The delegates will come from the communities and they have to know exactly what is going to be discussed prior to their arrival.
We have to set an agenda.
The Orders of the Day have nothing to do with the elders’ conference.
It is something that we have to follow through as a procedure of the Government of Nunavut.
I am very pleased with the Orders of the Day.
But what I am trying to say is that the elders should say anything they want without specific rules.
That is all I am trying to say.
I just used this agenda as an example of how we have to stay on the subject.
I am hoping that the elders will have an informal meeting and talk about anything they want.
The people who run the meetings will be there as co-ordinators during the elders’ conference.
The co-ordinators will be telling the elders what topic that they are going to be discussing and the Chairperson will direct the members on topics that they are going to talk about.
But it is up to the elders what topics they will be discussing.
It is up to the Chairperson at the elders’ conference.
According to our time question period is over.
Ms. Williams (interpretation): I just want to get back to Item 5.
Speaker (interpretation): The member is asking for unanimous consent to go back to Item 5.
If there are no nays. Ms. Williams.
I would like to recognize an individual in the Gallery.
My brother is here Celestino Makpah from Rankin Inlet and I would like to recognize him.
I am sorry we mistook him for the other Celestine.
I wanted to go back to Item 5 as well. I am happy that Ms. Williams wanted to go back.
Since we are on that item, I would like to recognize the individuals from the Hamlet of Rankin Inlet as well as the Mayor of Rankin Inlet and the councillors.
The ministers will be meeting with these individuals and I want them to be given whatever they want because we have a new budget and it would be nice to give them what they want. We have been hearing Celestine Erkijuk a lot here in Iqaluit. We always think that he is the only Celestine.
First of all, I would like to introduce the Mayor of Rankin Inlet Jack Kavituk, he taught cultural education in the Rankin Inlet school before I became a minister. I am happy to introduce Jack Kavituk as well as Celestino Makpah.
Although he is in the Keewatin region, he is originally from the Baffin region, that’s why he is the brother of Ms. Williams.
Also a councillor for the Hamlet and as well my brother in law, Louis Taparti, also used to be on CBC Radio and he knows Inuktitut and English. I would like to welcome him and as well, especially I would like to introduce Ron Roach who used to work with Sustainable Development but who is now the SAO for Rankin Inlet.
We are still on item 5.
My colleague and I usually fight over who is going to introduce the people from Rankin Inlet.
Those people that are here I represent them because they are from my riding.
I am happy to say that as the Member for Rankin Inlet North, I would like to introduce the people from my riding.
Tikiq, Jack Kavituk, is the Mayor of Rankin Inlet and I have known him for quite some time, ever since there was a mine in Rankin Inlet he has been living there.
As well, Celestino Makpah, who has worked in the Kivalliq Region from quite some time.
He was involved with the beginning of the hamlet status in Kivalliq and as well, Louis Taparti, is from Rankin Inlet and has been involved with the media for quite some time.
I know that the Hamlet Council for Rankin Inlet is involved with empowerment and the SAO for Rankin Inlet is an in-law, he has a lot of in-laws in Chesterfield Inlet and in Rankin Inlet, which is done that way for non-Inuit people.
These people will be meeting with some of the ministers and with the members as well.
I would like to welcome the visitors once again to our chambers.
I am sorry, I skipped item 7.
Item 8, once again.
Tabled Document 019 – 1(5): Nunavut Public Housing Rent Scale Review
Today I would like to table a document entitled, “Nunavut Public Housing Rent Scale Review”.
Mr. Speaker, as per my recent commitment to table this document, I am happy to be able to share this information with all members of this House.
Mr. Speaker, the Rankin Inlet conference was attended by up to 70 people and I will keep the members updated as we progress in our review of the Nunavut Public Housing Rent Scale.
In accordance with the authority vested in me by Motion 002 – 1(5), the committee of the whole will stay in session until it reports itself out, with Mr. Irqittuq in the Chair.
Does the committee wish to deal with the Department of Finance.
We would like to continue this morning with Bill 1, Appropriations Act, to deal with the Department of Finance & Administration and once completed, we would like to deal with the Department of Human Resources.
Chairperson (interpretation): Does the committee agree that we deal with Bill 1, Appropriation Act, 2001-2002, and we will begin with the Department of Finance & Administration.
Would the minister please seat himself at the witness table.
Does the committee agree that the minister’s officials join him at the witness table.
Sergeant-At-Arms, please bring in the officials.
Thank you, Mr. Ng. Please introduce your officials please.
I didn’t recognize you.
With me is my Deputy Minister Bob Vardy.
We can move on.
There are no capital items for this department.
We will go on to the main estimates.
Page 3-6.
Finance & Administration, branch summary.
Total operations, 2 million 726 thousand.
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): It is more of a comment, Mr. Chairman.
Are you going to give us ten minutes for general comments, Mr. Chairman.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: It depends on how you want to handle it, Mr. Chairman.
It’s not up to me.
If it were up to me we would be finished.
Chairperson (interpretation): Yesterday I wasn’t clear when we started dealing with the department.
I was wondering if we left off with general comments.
If not we will do general comments, if not then we will move on.
Yes, we adjourned yesterday under general comments.
So therefore, I would like to make general comments.
Although I am not an expert in finance, but last year what we experienced was we had to approve the Supplementary Appropriation Act 2000-2001.
In view of this and in view of the future, if we will be approving Supplementary Appropriations, I was wondering if we would be getting into a deficit situation because in Nunavut the cost of living is increasing.
For Nunavut government expenditures, the way I see it and I have been considering this for a while and I feel that we do have a bit of a problem because in the communities they would like to start dealing with and incorporating Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit.
The communities and the residents of Nunavut according to their way we have our documents translated.
Yes, there is funding available to have the documents translated.
With the various departments at the community level, I was wondering if you have interpreter translators at the community level or if you provide funding for translations of the correspondence.
I was wondering if your department can be looking into this and be more sensitive because the communities require the use of Inuktitut language and English.
I was wondering if we could get the communities to recognize this under your department.
Our various projects under Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit with the Bathurst Mandate.
It seems like we are not really incorporating Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit into the system.
Perhaps due to funding, the way the funding is set or due to lack of funding under this item.
I was wondering if you can consider this and be more sensitive towards this and I wanted just to briefly comment on that.
That was a general comment.
Are there any other general comments.
If there are no further general comments.
We will move on to the pages and ask questions.
I don't think there are any general comments.
We will move on to page 3-6.
Finance and Administration, branch summary.
Total operations and maintenance, 2 million 726 thousand.
Mr. Tootoo: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I guess one could consider the directorate as the brains of the department, the oil and the gears that make it work.
Mr. Chairman, yesterday in the minister's opening comments he indicated that the department is going to be involved and has indicated in the past before a program review.
Yesterday, I believe my ears kind of perked up a little bit when I also heard him say a program and expenditure review.
I was wondering if I could ask the minister if he could elaborate on that and maybe identify if any areas have been identified to take a look at.
The member raises a good point.
Members know we have talked about a program review of the Government of Nunavut.
Of course, a major portion of that is expenditure review, given that we need the fiscal resources to deliver our programs.
Right now, we are in the process, in consultation with EIA, the Financial Management Board is in the process of finalizing a decision paper that will go forward to the Cabinet/FMB on how to proceed.
Once we have that decision confirmed then it will be myself that will bring it forward to the regular members’ caucus in trying to explain how we want to proceed to obtain some additional input from the members.
Then we will move forward Mr. Chairman.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, Minister Ng. Additional questions.
In your statement you made some general comments as to what will be reviewed in different departments.
Do you have anything specifically in mind as to what departments will be a priority for review.