EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
Citizen involvement in budget development.
The Committee was intrigued at the draft business plans reference to providing for public information in the budget formulation process.
The Committee will be supportive of efforts to hold community workshops in which members participate in hearing the view of the public.
The Committee also recommends that the Department make an effort to provide clear budget information to elders and the public.
The Committee appreciated receiving a detailed briefing on Federal/Nunavut fiscal relations.
The Committee is supportive of the Departments' mandate to aggressively pursue revenue enhancement opportunities with the Government of Canada.
The Committee was also advised that one of the issues being examined by the Department is that of increased Territorial controls of royalties from natural resource development. The Committee was advised that the Department is financing a number of one-time start up costs associated with the creation of Nunavut.
The Committee was also advised that these costs are offset in the FFA.
The Committee recommends that the Department continue to make strong efforts in these areas.
The Committee would also like to be regularly updated as the Department identifies one- time or unforeseen costs associated with establishing the new Government.
The Committee would like to receive a full accounting of these costs to the Government of Nunavut.
The Committee recognizes, as stated, that the report on recommendations of the division of assets and liabilities of the GNWT, that the final determination of the division of assets and liabilities will be in relation to information as of March 31, 1999, and that this information might not be completely available until some months thereafter.
The Committee also recognizes that a number of issues may not have been finalized yet.
The Committee takes a strong interest in these issues and requests regular updates as information emerges.
Upcoming negotiations with Unions.
The Department in collaboration with Human Resources has responsibility for negotiating public service agreements.
The Committee understands the Nunavut Teachers Federation agreement expires August 31 of this year, and that of the Nunavut Employees Union on March 31, 2000.
The Committee recommends that it be consulted prior to the Government developing a position on major bargaining issues. The Committee would also like to be kept updated on developments in respect to pay equity issues.
The Committee has requested a detailed list of costs on all our government services being contracted back to the GNWT for the year 2000 fiscal year.
Mr. Chairman, I have four motions.
Committee Motion 1 – 1 (2) : Citizen Engagement in Budget
Mr. Chairman I move that the Committee recommends that the Department of Finance ensure that clear budget information in English and Inuktitut be provided to Nunavut Communities.
Mr. Chairman.
Chairperson : (interpretation) : To the motion.
The motion is carried.
Committee Motion 2 – 1 (2): Formula Financing Agreement
Mr. Akesuk: (interpretation) : Thank you Mr. Chairman. The second motion.
Mr. Chairman, I move that this committee recommends that the Department of Finance provide the Committee with regular updates as it identifies one-time or unforeseen start-up costs associated with establishing the new government.  Chairperson : (interpretation) : To the motion.
Carried.
Committee Motion 3 – 1 (2): Prior Consultation on Major Bargaining
Mr. Akesuk : Thank you.
Third motion, Mr. Chairman, is that the committee be consulted prior to the Government taking a position on major bargaining issues with pubic service unions.
Chairperson : (interpretation) : To the motion, questions or comments to the motion.
All in favour?
Mr. Premier Okalik?
Hon. Paul Okalik: I just have a concern that some of them will be confidential issues and some of them will be urgent cases so it might be quite hard to go this way.
I just wanted you to be aware of that fact.
Chairperson (interpretation): I apologize, I had already asked if the members agreed.
Mr. Akesuk would you like to respond?
Mr. Akesuk: (interpretation): Yes.
Was the motion carried?
Chairperson: (interpretation): I had already asked if you wanted to vote on the motion, but in regards to Okalik’s comment would you like to reply to his question or comment?
Mr. Akesuk (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Chairman; Yes, as members of the Legislative Assembly, or the regular members, we would like to get more opportunity to give input on important issues before the Government decides on them.
In the beginning the goals of the Government were that the Government would be open and that there would be a close working relationship, that is what we are trying to establish right now, that is what we agreed to in the beginning.
Thank you Mr. Chairman.
Chairperson: (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Akesuk.
Hon. James Arvaluk: (interpretation) : I just wanted to ask, I don’t think the Premier was clear that any time when the Government is going to negotiate, which the motion stated the Government is going to negotiate with the Union, that they should be open, and the Government stated from the beginning that they want to have open, transparent government and since that is the statement of the Government, what kind of goals and objectives would the Government have before they had an agreement with the Union.
I would like to get clarification on the motion.
Chairperson: (interpretation) : Thank you Arvaluk.
In regards to the motion, perhaps you could read your motion again, they can understand your motion, for the bilingual speaking people.
Mr. Akesuk (interpretation) : Thank you Mr. Chairman.
The motions’ intent is that the Department consult with the Committees and update the Committees on the negotiation process, and this position is so that we can have input on the negotiations.
Chairperson: There is a motion on the table.
If there are no further questions on the motion, all those in favour to the motion?
Perhaps if you would raise your hands so they would be more discernible, how you voted?
Perhaps if we use a piece of paper.
All those in favour of the motion?
Those against?
Abstentions?
Committee Motion 4 – 1 (2): Mid Year Progress Report
Mr. Akesuk: Thank you Mr. Chairman.
The last motion in respect to Government Operations and Services.
That the Department provide a mid year progress report to the standing committee for review in October of this year.
Chairperson (interpretation): Comments and questions to the motion.
In respect to the motion, all those in favour?
Abstentions, all those against.
I am making a few mistakes, as this is my first time.
Mr. Akesuk, do you have any further items?
Mr. Akesuk (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Chairman, that is all.
Chairperson (interpretation): Comments to the Department of Finance and Administration.
Mr. Iqaqrialu: (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Chairman.
I would prefer that maybe after they make a report I will have a few things to state or should I pose my question now?
Chairperson (interpretation): The Minister already made his report and now it is open for comments and questions Mr. Iqaqrialu.
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Chairman.
In respect to the deficits that they alluded to which is the 4 million dollars for the OIC.
We were told where it had come from, and it affects the Nunavut Government because even before we were up and running there was a deficit outstanding.
Now that we are the Nunavut Government, I feel that we should not have to pay that amount owing, and I would like to get further clarification as to the deficit we ran up to in the Office of the Interim Commissioner.
Chairperson: (interpretation): Minister Ng?
As I indicated earlier, under the transitional funding agreement that the Interim Commissioner had signed off, the Government of Nunavut had the legal obligations to assume the unpaid financial obligations of the Offices of the Interim Commissioner once the Government of Nunavut was established, and once the Office of the Interim Commissioner wound down on the 31stt.
Chairperson(interpretation): Mr. Iqaqrialu did that answer your question or do you have any further comments?
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): For those of us who are new MLAs, now that we have been burdened with these payables, and we have not dealt with this at all in any manner, and if we were to pay it, that to me, to the people of Nunavut would not be very beneficial.
That way it is creating a problem unless it is clarified both to the MLAs because they have to understand for what the payables have been incurred.
Because we never did the work of the Office of the Interim Commissioner, so I just wanted to state that again, Mr. Chairman.
Chairperson: (interpretation): Mr. Ng.
Mr. Chairman, once the final audit is complete and the accounting for the financial affairs of the Office of the Interim Commissioner there will be a breakdown of the expenditures under that office.
Chairperson (interpretation): Further comments Mr. Iqaqrialu.
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): We have not agreed as MLA's, and we were not involved at all in this endeavour and in respect to the financial details, before there is an agreement shown I would not want to make a payment on this and as MLA's and unless we understand each other as to what the operational costs were when they are in front of us on paper, I would want to review this again in our future meetings.
I would like to see that in our future meetings.
Chairperson (interpretation): Is that just a comment or do you want to answer that Mr. Minister.
Mr. Chairman we have little choice in the matter.
Unfortunately it is a legal agreement.
The Office of the Interim Commissioner had the mandate through the Nunavut Act to operate and do the preparatory work for the establishment of the Government of Nunavut.
Once the Government of Nunavut took office on April 1st, became a legal entity, the Office of the Interim Commission dissolved.
So the Office of the Interim Commissioner acted as the Government representative prior to April 1st, and the argument is that the obligations incurred, the legal obligations incurred as a result of the Office of the Interim Commissioners operations, became the obligations of the Government of Nunavut.
I mean, obviously it would have been ideal if that wasn’t the situation, but unfortunately that is the matter that we have to deal with and the legal obligation is there.
Chairperson: Mr. Iqaqrialu.
In respect to the same item or within the same arena, in respect to the deficit of the OIC which was stated to be 4.4 million dollars.
In respect to the funds that had to be taken out for example, some of the capital projects that we have planned had to be taken out to meet the 4.4 million dollar budget.
Was that the case, where we had to take away capital projects in order to pay this 4.4 million-dollar deficit?
Hon. Kelvin Ng: No Mr. Chairman that wasn’t the case.
What this affects is the opening balance of the Government of Nunavut.
In effect it is a liability that is offset against the assets that would be coming over from the division of the assets and liabilities with the G.N.W.T. It doesn’t affect the current year, the 99/2000 fiscal year per se.
Chairperson: Mr. Tootoo.
Mr. Tootoo: I guess my question is just wondering, in the report the audit that the Minister alluded to, will there be in there explanation as to how such a sizeable deficit was obtained?
I know that we all know that the Federal Government had federal advisors right at the highest levels, I was wondering how, if they were aware of this, how they let it get to the level it was.
If that will be pointed out in the report.
Chairperson (interpretation): Which of you would like to answer this question?
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Okay, Mr. Chairman, Mr. Chairman we don’t know, I mean what’s going to be in the final report, I mean we have no say it’s the Auditor General of Canada, that undertakes the audit and it’ll be his staff that prepare the Report.
So we will have to wait just like anybody else the outcome of what’s in that and what kind of comments or recommendations that they might have.
Mr. Tootoo: If you're just going to wait is there something that the Department will be asking their federal counterparts as to how they let it slide for the 4.4 million dollars over?
Thank you Mr. Chairman.  Hon. Kelvin Ng: Thank you Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Chairman, the staff of the Department of Finance & Administration are involved somewhat in that they do meet with the Auditor Generals' staff that are doing the Audit and obviously have an opportunity to go over some of the content of the expenditures. They also have a chance to dialogue with the Auditor Generals' staff as they move forward analyzing the report. Thank you.
Chairperson interpretation): Mr. Tootoo
Mr. Tootoo: Thank you Mr. Chairman. I guess that still doesn’t answer. Will the Department be approaching the Department that was responsible in DIAND for ascertaining if they were aware they were going to run this deficit and how they allowed it to happen?
Chairperson: Mr. Ng  Hon. Kelvin Ng: Thank you Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Chairman, there has been some discussions, but I think also that the Premier has brought up the issue with the Minister of DIAND and spoken to her about it.
But as it stands now, until the final results are in, I think things are kind of in a state of waiting until the final report is out Mr. Chairman.
Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. McLean
Mr. McLean: Mr. Minister, on that 4 million dollar debt how are we carrying it on our books right now, as an accrued liability?
Is it an accrued liability or have we already assumed it and paid it, is there going to be any movement to try to collect it?
Chairperson (interpretation): Kelvin Ng, perhaps either you or one of your staff can answer the question?
Mr. Chairman it is an accrued liability.
As I indicated it’ll off set some of the assets that we have coming over from the GNWT in the division of assets and liabilities.
There are plans to go forward and try to recoup some of those costs.
Whether or not we're successful there’s another matter I guess, but it's certainly an issue.
Like I indicated, the Premiers has already brought it up and I plan to bring it up in the future and I’m sure any other Cabinet Members that may be having negotiations or discussions with some of the federal counterparts.
It is something that we will be aware of as a Government and I’m sure Members of this Assembly you're aware of it as well.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Mr. McLean.
Please recognize the chair, because you’ll have to recognize me as I am the Chair.
Mr. McLean: I apologize Mr. Chairperson.
Mr. Minister, if it is an accrued liability and that’s how we’re carrying it, does this budget, which is a zero budget, reflect that or if it does not, does that mean we're going to have a 4 million dollar deficit?
Chairperson (interpretation): Minister or his Deputy or his Assistant Deputy Minister.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Mr. Chairman thank you.
Mr. Chairman it isn’t a 99/2000 year expenditure.
It’s an opening balance liability, because this is the first time we set up and it’s an opening balance sheet item.
If you could look at the technical accounting side of things that’s why I indicated that the deficit will be off set, it’ll be taken off the positive balance that we'll be bringing over from the Government of the Northwest Territories in the divisions of assets and liabilities.
It’ll reduce that balance that was coming over though as far as the opening balance goes.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Minister.
Mr. O’Brien: Thank you Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Minister you’ve indicated in your budget, in reference to revenues, it includes 3 million dollars in revenue from property taxes of school levies.
Will this money go back into general revenue or does it go back to the communities where we generated it from?
Chairperson (interpretation): Minister of Finance & Administration.
I really want to give you an Inuktitut name.
As long as it’s a good one.
Mr. Chairman, all revenues that the members see there go into the general consolidated revenue fund and are disbursed based on appropriations through the Assembly and the recommendations of the Government.
Chairperson: Mr. O’Brien
Another tax question.
In reference to the payroll Tax.
Can you tell the Members as to what your plans are, is it to keep the payroll tax as it is or to review it in light of the fact that the cost for collecting this tax may not warrant the actual collection.
I guess, Mr. Chairman, in respect of taxation every year, and we haven’t had the opportunity this year obviously with the development of the budget, as all the Members know, but for the upcoming budget, this tax would be reviewed just like all the other taxes that this government imposes on individuals, corporations or consumers throughout Nunavut.
As it stands now though this tax was designed as a tax by the GNWT to try to capture some of the leakage of the revenues of individuals that were working in the Northwest Territories but weren’t residing there and were receiving services.
In that perspective, I think the theory behind the tax is a sound one, it's just a matter of, as the member indicated, what's the cost of administering it. The other advantage of this payroll tax, quite frankly, is that it’s a benefit.
It returns more to lower income earners than what it takes in.
They get a rebate back and I believe that it’s 1 ¼ % instead of 1% for the lower income earners within the Territory.
So that’s another issue that would have to be taken into consideration of the review of this specific tax.
Mr. Minister are you considering any new tax reform initiatives over the next year.
Chairperson: (interpretation): Minister of Finance & Administration. Mr. Ng
It’s probably a bit premature to be thinking about that at this day, so if we try to get this budget out of the way and then try to develop some strategic priorities as a Cabinet and as a Caucus. I think certainly during the course of the year many of us will have the opportunity to reflect on what they feel is appropriate or inappropriate in respect of taxation or revenue generation.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Mr. O’Brien.
Mr. Alakannuark (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Chairman.
I want to pose this question to Minister of Finance & Administration or his, I don’t know who’s responsible for this.
Respect to the Hamlets, they usually have funding for one fiscal year to be used within that year and the budget have been cut throughout the year and I guess my question is related to that.
Are the Hamlets, I think some of them are leery because their budgets are getting cut and they're concerned that their budgets might be cut for their operational funding.
Now in respect to this issue what is your prognosis for the funding for the Hamlets next year, will the budgets be cut or will they remain as they are? I would like to find that out if I could.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Alakannuark, you may answer this if you wish or we could wait for a response until we get to the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs.
I think I tried to indicate in my opening comments that we’ve tried to provide as much stability as possible during the course of this years operation.
So in effect we didn’t take any reductions in trying to keep the existing programs in place, but the Chairman is probably correct in that this question is more appropriate when the Minister of Community Government, Housing and Transportation comes before you.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Ng. That’s it.
Mr. Tootoo: Thank you Mr. Minister your budget address sets out an important goal of the Government of the Nunavut to have a balanced budget, this is very important.
How will your Department ensure that other Departments do not go over their budget?
Chairperson (interpretation): Minister of Finance & Administration. Mr. Ng.
Mr. Chairman, we plan to be monitoring the expenditures on a regular basis of the other Departments.
In fact right now we’re providing a lot of the Financial Support Services for those Departments, because they don’t have their Financial management sections up and running fully yet.
Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. Tootoo.
Mr. Tootoo: Thank you Mr. Chairman.
Even though your Department is looking after the other Departments, which I’m sure your staff are happy about, in regards to the other Agencies and other Organizations such as the Regional Health Boards, Legal Services, Hamlets, do these organizations ever have deficits.
Chairperson (interpretation): Minister of Finance & Administration, Mr. Ng
I think we all know the answer to that one, I mean unfortunately you know a lot of organizations, Municipalities and Boards do get in to financial difficulties, sometimes not of their own doing, because of unexpected difficulties and sometimes because of poor management and sometimes because their Boards want to spend more than they have in revenues.
So, yes there are situations where that happens.
Those types of deficits will they have an impact on the Government of the Nunavuts’ budgets, as ultimately they receive their funding from the Government.
Chairperson (interpretation): Minister of Finance and Administration. Mr. Ng
Mr. Chairman, generally those types of Boards and Agencies are responsible for their own finances, if they get into a deficit position normally they're responsible for putting in place a deficit reduction plan that has to be approved, usually by whichever the Department is working with them.
So there's no direct legal liability to the Government of Nunavut, but obviously, since they are organizations that we’re supporting we would work with them and we would try to get them out of that situation.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Ng. Mr. Tootoo
I don’t see an example of the Boards of Education and Health, once they're eliminated will debts, if they have any at that time, be assumed by the Government of Nunavut, by the respective Departments and will that have an effect on the budget.
Chairperson (interpretation): Minister Ng.
Mr. Chairman, obviously if we are to take over responsibilities for those specific Boards, we would assume the liabilities or the assets in that kind of circumstances for their operations.
Chairperson (interpretation): I guess this is a last question.
I guess in light of all that, has your Department or have you considered introducing balanced budget legislation?
Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. Ng
Mr. Chairman, as some Members know, the Northwest Territories and other jurisdiction have balanced budget legislation and that could restrict going into too much deficit.
It is something we can look at, at some point.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Ng. Mr. Iqaqrialu.
I forget about two years ago, when the GNWT started cutting budgets, they cut a lot of the budgets and there are a lot of the employees, who lost holiday pay and who lost other benefits as a result of budget cutting.
Now the Nunavut Government as you are looking at the operations, we have to look at the holiday pay and benefits.
What are your plans for re-implementing the benefits packages our employees use to have.
Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. Minister you may answer this or if you prefer it just be deferred to the Human Resources Minister.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: I’ll speak on his behalf I think.
Mr. Chairman, there are no plans to reinstate any of the benefits that were eroded when the Government of the Northwest Territories underwent their deficit strategy in trying to curtail their spending.
I think it’s safe to say that we know that there's expectations amongst the two major unions.
Once the collective bargaining process begins, will have to wait until the positions are formally tabled and the negotiations are hopefully, successfully, concluded.
But it’s really premature at this time and even if we did have an inkling of what we were proposing, I mean this wouldn’t be the appropriate forum to bring that forward Mr. Chairman.