EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
We know that there is going to be an amalgamation of the three regional health boards, who's going to pay for the deficit after their dissolution.
Once the health boards are amalgamated with the government department on April 1 of 2000, we would as a government assume those liabilities and the assets that the boards hold within their current structures.
On April 1, 2000 if, like you said, the deficit would become ours and we're estimating a 20 million dollar deficit, isn’t it going to create hardship at that time?
Mr. Speaker I don't believe that we are dealing with a 20 million dollar deficit.
As you know that is one of the figures that has kind of been tossed out there as a potential worst case scenario by my colleague who is not here today.
I think I indicated that we are as a government doing some extensive analyses right now to know exactly what makes up the deficit and what makes up some of the pressures that are facing the health boards in respect to their expenditures.
We are hoping to have that work wrapped up in a couple of weeks and that will give us a better idea of some of the options we might put forward as a government.
At this time I'd like to have a recess for 15 minutes.
>>Break
Speaker (interpretation): Item 7. Written Questions.
Petition 02 - 1(3): Opposition to Time Zone Change
I have a petition regarding the one time zone Mr. Speaker.
This petition has 163 signatures from the community of Sanikiluaq and Mr. Speaker, the people of Sanikiluaq are opposed to the proposed one time zone.
Petition 03 - 1(3): Opposition to Time Zone Change
I have a petition from the community of Kimmirut regarding the proposal for one time zone.
This petition has 135 signatures.
Mr. Speaker I will be giving these petitions to you about opposition from the community of Kimmirut.
Petition 04 - 1(3): Opposition to Time Zone Change
Mr. Speaker, I would like to table a petition regarding the following; proposal for going into one time zone.
We have 280 signatures from the community of Pond Inlet and Mr. Speaker, the people of Pond Inlet would like to keep to Eastern Standard Time.
Item 12: Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills
Bill 2 - An Act to Amend the Workers' Compensation Act
Mr. Akesuk: Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I wish to report that Bill 2, An Act to Amend the Workers' Compensation Act has been reviewed by the Standing Committee of Government Operations and Services and that the bill is ready for consideration by the Committee of the Whole.
Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to waive Rule 68 (5) and have Bill 2 move into Committee of the Whole today.
Speaker (interpretation): Qujannamiik, Mr. Akesuk.
The member would like to receive consent from the House to waive 68 (5) and he would like to move bill 2 to Committee of the Whole today.
Any nays.
Mr. Akesuk you have consent.
Reports of Committees on the review of bills.
Item 13, tabling of documents.
Tabled Document 8 - 1(3): Gjoa Haven Oil and Gas Study
Hon. Manitok Thompson: Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to table this document from the Uqsuqtuq, Gjoa Haven, study on the oil and gas from September 1999.
There were concerns from the community of Uqsuqtuq.
Tabling of documents.
Item 15, Notice of Motions for First Reading of Bills.
Item 16: Motions
Motion 1 - 1(3): Report of Chief Electoral Officer Referred to Ajauqtiit
Report of the Chief Electoral Officer.
Whereas the Report of the Chief Electoral Officer on the Election of the First Legislative Assembly of Nunavut has been tabled; and
Whereas the report contains recommendations for improving the election process for future Nunavut elections;
Now, therefore, I move, seconded by the Honourable Member from Cambridge Bay, that tabled document 1-1 (3), “Election of the First Legislative Assembly of Nunavut, 1999 – A New Beginning”, be referred to the Standing Committee of Ajauqtiit for detailed consideration; and
Further, that the standing committee report it's findings and recommendations to the Legislative Assembly during the spring sitting of next year.
Mr. McLean your motion is in order.
Motion is passed.
Item 19, Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and other Matters - Bill 2, An Act to Amend the Workers' Compensation Act; Bill 5, Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 1, 1999/2000; Minister's Statement 22 – 1 (3), with Mr. Puqiqnak in the Chair.
At this time we'll go into Committee of the Whole to discuss bill 2 and 5.
I would like to ask what the committee's wish is.
Would you like to take a brief break before we go ahead.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Chairman, it is my understanding that we would get into Bill 2 - Amendment of the Workers' Compensation Act, but whenever the committee is ready.
Chairperson (interpretation): Okay, everybody agrees?
What is the committee’s wish.
Did you want to take a brief break before we go ahead.
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Chairman, I would just like to go ahead without a break.
All agreed?
Nays?
I apologize, if you would like to move right into Bill 2 then we'll go ahead.
We'll open up the floor for debate afterwards.
You want to go ahead to the witness table.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Thank you Mr. Minister.
Bill 2 is in regards to the WCB.
They're in your white binders, second page.
Chairperson (interpretation): Do you have any opening remarks?
We'll proceed.
The purpose of the amendment of the Workers’ Compensation Act is to address the problem identified with the section dealing with third party actions in motor vehicle accidents.
The difficulty with the section as currently written is that it allows injured workers to sue their own employers and co-workers in motor vehicle related accidents.
This goes against the first principle of workers' compensation legislation that an injured worker cannot sue his or her own employer.
Mr. Chairman the proposed amendment does not affect the ability of workers to be treated fairly.
Workers will continue to be covered by workers' compensation and have access to a series of reviews and appeals if they are not satisfied with the compensation they receive.
Mr. Chairman, Bill 2 is intended to address an unforeseen issue arising from Section 12 of the Workers' Compensation Act.
This amendment will ensure that our act is consistent with the principles of Workers' compensation across Canada.
Did you want one of your staff members to go up there with you at the witness table.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Yes Mr. Chairman there are two individuals here from Workers' Compensation to appear as witnesses.
Chairperson (interpretation): Okay, if you would go up please.
Okay, before they go up I would like to ask the members if our lawyer could also sit up at the witness table if it's okay with the members.
Okay, come up and Mr. Minister you sit with the WCB people and our legal advisor.
Mr. Minister, I would like to ask you if you could introduce the Workers' Compensation Board representatives.
To my right is Mr. Jerry Mire, President of the Workers' Compensation Board.
To my left, Mr. Michael Triggs, legal counsel with the Workers' Compensation Board.
Welcome to the Committee of the Whole.
We will now open up the floor for discussion on Bill 2.
I apologize my back is to you.
My question is in regards to the issue that you touched upon regarding an automobile accident.
Some of the workers have problems.
Sometimes they might be able to make more money but they have a lot of barriers created by these bills especially in the smaller communities.
Have you considered this problem that's created in the communities.
Minister if you would like to respond or if one of the people at the witness table would like to respond to that question.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: If I understand the question correctly, I'll try to answer it.
This amendment would not impact on an individuals right to workers' compensation benefits as a result of any work related accident that might take place.
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): Would it be more clear if I say that in the smaller communities, only people with licenses can drive taxis and you need a special class if you want to become a taxi driver.
Is this going to affect that in the smaller communities, Mr. Ng.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Mr. Chairman, I don't believe so because that regulation for livery licenses, taxi licenses is under the jurisdiction of transportation and some municipal bylaws that effect it as well, but it wouldn't in respect to any aspect of the Workers' Compensation Act unless there was an accident in which a taxi driver were injured during work from his occupation and that's when any claim that he or she might put forward would be dealt with by the workers' compensation board.
But again that wouldn't, it's my understanding that this amendment wouldn't affect that circumstance.
While we’re considering Bill 2, we're looking at amendments to Bill 2 in regards to the Workers' Compensation Act.
In respect to transportation accidents arising out of and during workers' employment.
Any further questions.
Yes, thank you for that clarification.
I have another question in regards to the smaller communities.
There are barely any employment opportunities in the smaller communities and it creates a problem when you’re trying to buy insurance.
Especially for the small businesses.
They pay monthly dues on an annual basis or on a monthly basis and they pay out a lot over the year.
That is a problem especially for the smaller communities.
People who are trying to establish small businesses tend to pay all their revenue to the workers' compensation board and nothing comes back to their own business.
Is there something we can do to alleviate this problem.
Mr. Minister Ng.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: He's referring to more general matters in regards to workers' compensation premiums, assessments and that, which are geared towards the exposure.
Based on the volume of a business that is smaller, they'd have less employees and by the same token they'd have smaller premiums than one that did more business. But it's not really, respectfully, part of the amendment that we're proposing right now Mr. Chairman.
Are we making an amendment to the Workers' Compensation Act because the smaller communities are not included.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: I give it to Mr. Mire to answer this one.
Chairperson: I would like to remind the House and to remind the members that we are following these white binders.
I believe you have a copy in front of you.
We're following the binders that we have in front of you.
Maybe I'm not making myself clear.
This act will effect a lot of people out there if we agree to this amendment.
Like I was saying, the smaller communities have employees even in the smaller communities, everybody out there works, whether it's a smaller community or not.
What I'm trying to say here is we're taking out a lot of money for the worker's compensation board and I don't know how to make it any clearer but is that going to be covered under this act.
Mr. Minister are you going to be responding to that.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Mr. Minister, the Honourable Member brings up valid points but I guess the points he's bringing up are more in respect to the whole issue of Workers' Compensation Board coverage and the Workers' Compensation Act.
This specific amendment that we're proposing, as I indicated in my opening comments, deals with the difficulty in the current legislation in allowing individuals to sue their employers or co-workers if they were to be injured.
Where the basic Workers' Compensation Act is that the coverage is provided to protect employees and protect employers from that possibility but by the same token, individuals that have been injured while at work would get adequate compensation as a result of the premiums that are paid to the Workers' Compensation Board.
So this is more of a specific amendment versus the whole WCB Act I guess and I don’t know if that answers the members question, it's getting a bit confusing Mr. Chairman.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Ng. Please wait while I go with the names I have.
Just to try to add some focus and clarity to the issue, maybe the minister or his staff could give us an example so that the member could better understand what we're doing in reference to this amendment.
I think there will be other times where we can discuss in general the concerns that we have about premiums and payments and issues in general about Workers' Compensation.
My first question would be relating to other jurisdictions, we're looking at changing this.
What happens in other jurisdictions in reference to this clause or this amendment and if you could give an example to the members of how this would apply if somebody were to get hurt on the job that would want to sue their employer but at the same time they're also getting compensated through workers' compensation so it would almost be like double dipping.
Is that fair to say.
Mr. Mire: Perhaps, as an example…
Chairperson (interpretation): One moment please, as the Chair, I would like you to recognize the Chair before you make your comments.
Only after you recognize the chair, I'll give you the go-ahead.
I apologize, I cannot say your name.
If you would go ahead please.
Mr. Mire: Thank you Mr. Chairman.
My name is Mire.
If I may provide an example for the member.
If I own a truck here in Iqaluit, and I ask Mr. O'Brien to drive that truck and Mr. McLean to be the co-driver, and they're making a delivery down the main street and they run into a truck which is owned by you, Mr. Chairman, and being driven by one of your workers.
The way the legislation used to read in the NWT was quite distinct in Canada and that legislation would have allowed us as the Workers' Compensation Board, on behalf of Mr. McLean who has been injured in a collision between these two vehicles, to sue the owner and the driver of the other vehicle but not the owner and the other worker of the vehicle in which Mr. McLean was riding.
The GNWT Board passed an amendment by way of a private member’s bill in November 1998, which allowed Mr. McLean as the injured worker and us acting on his behalf to sue not only the driver and the owner of the other vehicle involved in the accident but also the owner and the other driver in the vehicle in which Mr. McLean was riding.
As the minister indicated, this would be contrary to the principles on which workers’ compensation operates and that principle is that the employer pays assessments to the board so he can avoid being sued by his workers.
In paying those assessments, he also protects any other workers who work for him from liability as a result of that accident involving his worker.
So the change went much further than is desirable and what we're asking this assembly to do now is to amend the act so that in my example, Mr. McLean who's the injured worker and the Workers' Compensation Board acting on his behalf could sue the driver and the operator of the other vehicle but not the owner of the vehicle in which he was involved in the accident and the driver of the vehicle sitting along side him. If that's acceptable Mr. Chairman.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Mire.
I think that's how you pronounce your name.
That was probably a little more detail than what I was looking for but going back to my original question, the issue here is that if somebody were injured in a vehicle, would they not be covered by compensation.
Mr. Mire.
Mr. Mire: If there are injured workers, they will always be covered no matter who may be ultimately liable for any harm that was caused to them.
Chairperson: Thank you. Mr. O'Brien.
Mr. O'Brien: And the purpose, just to simplify matters, the reason why employers buy into and pay fees for workers' compensation is to protect themselves and if we were to allow injured workers to also sue the driver or employer, that would defeat the whole intent of workers' compensation.
This is just to make sure that the various companies that pay into it are getting a fair deal and they’re not getting sued because the workers' compensation package is going to pay for the injuries and whatever is necessary to assist that person that got injured to get them back to health and also whatever monies are necessary to pay out for the accident.
It's really a duplication by having this in there, you're paying twice.
Mr. Mire: Mr. Chairman, yes there is that potential and you're correct in assuming that this legislation would avoid that possibility.
Mr. O'Brien: One last question, if I'm not mistaken, we changed this, made this amendment to the act when we were the GNWT.
I think I recall being involved in that for that very reason but now that we're Nunavut, we have to change it again for this government.
How does it relate to other jurisdictions. Are we the only ones or one of the few that have this double standard in the act.
Chairperson: Thank you Mr. O'Brien., Mr. Mire, if you can respond.
The way the legislation reads now would make it different from any other jurisdiction in Canada.
The way we are proposing to amend it would make it similar to a majority of other jurisdictions in Canada.
Not all jurisdictions will have legislation which reads exactly the same as this.
But it is safe to say that the smaller jurisdictions in Canada will all have legislation similar to what we're asking you to make yours into.
Mr. O'Brien: Mr. Chairman this is my last question.
I agree with this amendment and I'll be supporting it, I’m just curious. I know we inherited the various acts and regulations from the GNWT when we became Nunavut.
If we did, that amendment would be included, so why are we doing it again.
Mr. Mire: The act which you inherited actually, the amendment to which the member is referring was passed by the GNWT in November of 1998 and it was that amendment which created the problem.
That problem has since been corrected by the GNWT when it passed an amendment the same as this one in September, just a month ago.
The problem has been corrected in the NWT and it remains for this government to deal with.
I was going to make a point of order, we aren’t going to be dealing with the Workers’ Compensation Act, it’s huge.
This is just an amendment.
If you look at the summary, I wanted to make a point of order to Mr. Iqaqrialu, he was asking questions that are contained in the whole Act.
If he would like to get into the Workers’ Compensation Act in full he could look into that and he could also use a private member’s bill.
This is an amendment to the Workers’ Compensation Act and Mr. Ng read the summary, the purpose.
Perhaps if we keep on that line we can complete this in no time.
Chairperson (interpretation): That was just a comment and a point of order.
Hon. Manitok Thompson (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Arvaluk said what I was going to say.
Perhaps if Mr. Ng spoke in Inuktitut he would say that this bill amends the Workers’ Compensation Act to protect the co-workers of a worker and an employer of a worker from lawsuits in respect to transportation accidents arising out of and during the course of the worker's employment so that we can be equal to the provinces.
In regards to the comments I had made earlier to the bill, this bill is not going to have an impact on what I had stated, but if it's not going to have an impact on the concern I had in regards to the general matter of premiums will I have an opportunity to make amendments on the general matter of premiums later on?
So now I understand what we're dealing with at this point.
I myself don't like the contents of the whole Workers’ Compensation Act because some of the clauses are a barrier to some of the smaller communities.
Chairperson (interpretation): Is that your question.
Can one of the people down here respond, because he asked the question that in the smaller communities there are many barriers that we face in this act.
I think that Mr. Iqaqrialu is asking whether it's going to have an impact on his concerns.
Can you respond to his concern please.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: I don't think that it will have that big of an impact on the smaller communities, this particular amendment that is being proposed.
I would like to state to the member in respect to premiums, premiums are not legislated in the WCB Act.
The independent board of directors sets those premiums based on advice they get on expectations of accident rates and that type of thing.
Whose Board.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: The Worker's Compensation Board, the board of directors.
I have no more names on my list at this time.
We are now on general comments for bill 2, general comments for bill 2.
Would you like to work on the bill clause by clause?
Bill 2 is An Act to Amend the Worker's Compensation Act.
Clause One, agreed?
Chairperson (interpretation) Clause two, Agreed?
Chairperson (interpretation): Bill as a whole.
Bill 2 as whole, I would like to ask if we can conclude with bill 2.
Are we ready to give the bill third reading.
Chairperson (interpretation): Bill is concluded.
What's the wish of the committee?
Mr. Iqaqrialu (interpretation): I would like to adjourn for the day.
Chairperson (interpretation): Please be seated, I had forgotten to mention.
I would like to thank you for coming to the witness table and making your presentation to the committee of the whole on bill 2, thank you for coming to the witness table and for your responses, thank you.
Hon. Kelvin Ng; I would like to thank everybody and thank the witnesses and Mr. Iqaqrialu for all his questions.
Chairperson (interpretation): A member of the legislative assembly, Mr. Iqaqrialu, wanted to adjourn for the day, what's the wish of the committee.
Mr. Chairman, Bill 5 Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 1 - 99/2000.
I would like the government operations committee to deliberate on this as a committee before we put it in front of the committee of the whole.
Chairperson (interpretation): According to our rules I would like to mention that the first person who raised his arm was Mr. Iqaqrialu and I think he wanted to adjourn for the day.
What is the wish of the committee.
Ok. according to the House rules, I'm going to have a show of hands, if you want to adjourn for the day or not.
For all those in favour of adjourning for the day.
Those who want to continue the meeting.
The majority of the members are in favour of adjourning for the day.
We do have a report to make for the Speaker.
Thank you for coming over here today and attending the meeting.
Yes, I keep forgetting I'm sorry, I would like to thank the legal counsel for Nunavut Government, thank you for being here.
Speaker (interpretation): I call the meeting back to order.
We're on item 20, report of the committee of the whole.
Your committee has been considering bill 2 and would like to report that bill 2 is ready for third reading and Mr. Speaker I move that the report of the committee of the whole be concurred with.
Speaker: To the motion. Question has been called. All those in favour?
First of all, meeting of the Standing Committee on Government Operations and Services in the Nanuq Board room at 5:15 today.
Tomorrow, October 27, meeting of regular caucus at 9:00 a.m. in the Nanuq Board room.
At 10 a.m. the Standing Committee on Community Empowerment and Sustainable Development, also at the Nanuq Board room.
Orders of the day, Wednesday, October 27, 1999.
Bill 5 Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 1, 1999/2000
Minister's Statement 22 - 1 (3)
Before we adjourn for the day, I'd like to take this opportunity to thank the pages, I do apologize right now if I mispronounce their names.
These pages have been assisting us for the last six days and this is their last day with us.
They are all students from the Inukshuk High School here in Iqaluit.
They are Bernel Kusugak, Stephanie Rose, Elaine Lloyd, Andrew Morrison, Jennie Susie, Fauna Kingdon.
I wish you all the best in your studies and hope to see you in this House again.
On behalf of all the members, thank you very much.
This House stands adjourned until Wednesday, October 27th 1999 at 1:30 p.m. Sergeant at Arms.
>>House adjourned at 5.02 p.m.
WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 27, 1999
Pages 142 - 184
Deputy Premier; Minister of Finance and Administration; Minister of Human Resources; Government House Leader
Opening Prayer 142
Ministers’ Statements 142
Members’ Statements 147
Returns to Oral Questions 151
Recognition of Visitors in the Gallery 151
Oral Questions 153
Petitions. 164
Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills 164
First Reading of Bills 165
Second Reading of Bills 165