EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
The committee did not want to be any confusion as to whether the Statutory Instruments Act should apply in other respects.
The standing committee is grateful to the minister for withdrawing that particular clause from the Bill and it is not in the reprinted Bill.
Those are my comments Mr. Chairman.
Do we have any more comments.
The floor is open for comments and questions on Bill 10.
I would just like to say again that the committee is grateful that you did withdraw the Statutory Instruments Act issue.
We spent many weeks discussing with yourself and your legal counsel.
We did have concern over it and we appreciate the fact that you realised our concern and withdrew it.
Having said that, this legislation is permissive.
The bottom line is that gives a great deal of authority to yourself as a minister, which we understand you should have.
I guess you have dealt with it but once more for the record, if you could explain to the committee what efforts will you undertake to ensure that hamlets are dealt with first when changes are contemplated.
I know you have the authority and the mandate to enter into agreements with third parties.
So, just of reassurance sake to make it clear to the members of the house and the hamlets, that you will indeed be speaking to the hamlets first and foremost to going out and making arrangements to third party groups.
Mr. Chairman first of all a very sincere thanks to the committee and to the chair for his kind words in the opening.
The chairman was correct that we did have some good discussion and debate on the Bill itself.
In respect to Mr. O'Brien’s question, I can commit to the House and this committee, as I have over the last several months and the standing committee review, that the Department of Health and Social Services has moved aggressively to deal in a co-operative approach with the hamlets.
That is why Mr. Chairman, we have held several conference calls and indeed I have made changes to ensure a level of comfort to the committee and to the members of the House.
Once again Mr. Minister we thank you for your revision I guess reflecting our concerns in regards to this act.
The minister indicated that he had spoken to 23 of the communities in Nunavut.
Can the minister confirm as to when these various Hamlets will actually have a functioning body to look after this particular issue.
Mr. Chairman, that is up to each of the individual Hamlets when they set up their Standing Committee of the Hamlet.
But there are exciting stories and good news stories happening right now.
Just this week, I received a letter from Repulse Bay for example, where they have already set up their committee, they're working proactively they have their members in place and so on.
So, that is happening.
We feel that probably by the 15th of May most communities in Nunavut will have the standing committees up and running.
We are in the process right now of putting together the package, the orientation package for each of the committees that we will be delivering in their communities. It deals with advocacy issues, issues of confidentiality and those types of issues that I have spoken with the Mayors about during the meetings that I have held with them over the past several months.
I have another question for the minister.
In the rare case that a community does not set up a functioning body to deliver these services, what would happen then in that case.
How would the minister deal with that.
As I said before, I think fully 95% or 90% of the communities that we have spoken to have committed to setting up these small standing committees on health in their communities.
I have committed to 5 thousand dollars to help with the administration, logistics of these committees.
I have already committed to the Mayors with the Premier during the Baffin Leaders' Summit to review that amount to see if there is a possibility of more money.
As you know Mr. Chairman, you were at that meeting.
Mr. Chairman what we would do in the case of there being no standing committee on health, we'll be looking at dealing directly with the Hamlet, elected people at the Hamlet level to bring any concerns or issues forward.
We also have the opportunity to use our elected officials, our elected members of this House and the other avenues of logistics and advocacy issues being brought forward by other organizations.
For example, NTI could be a local organization.
So, there are several different avenues that we could use to bring forward at the community level.
But the optimum Mr. Chairman, would be having the standing committees of health set up so that communities themselves can direct those types of issues and community concerns at the local level.
First of all, in the first clause, under number five, the members of each board of management shall be deemed to have resigned.
I understand that this is what is written and it is effective on March 31, 2000.
It doesn't indicate as to whom will be deemed to have resigned.
I am uncomfortable with the wording because it would include Hamlet subcommittees or the steering committees.
This seems to me that it could also apply to the other committees because the Boards of Management aren't made clear as to which committee it refers to under the management wording.
Maybe Mr. Picco you can explain this clause as to who or which body it refers to specifically.
Hon. Ed Picco: Mr. Chairman, in clause 5 in English it states that the Boards of Management shall be deemed to have resigned as quoted by the member.
What that is specifically dealing with is the health boards that we have in the three regions.
It has nothing to do with the Hamlets or any other committee or ex-officio committee at the community level or in the member's community or anyone else's community.
It deals specifically with the Boards of Management as outlined in Bill 10, which is before us today.
So I think the member's concerns have been brought forward but in this case they are negated by the fact that Bill 10 only deals with the health boards themselves.
Okay that would be much clearer now.
Also, I wanted to get to this item.
Mr. Chairman, this measly sum of 5 thousand dollars is going to be used for a full year of operations, it's practically useless.
Maybe when there is a Mayor's summit in Hall Beach there was a motion to that effect but I was never in support of that idea even up to today.
These health committees are going to be given huge responsibilities in representing their communities, once they actually start their work.
This sum of 5 thousand is going to be way too small for their operation and maintenance and administration functions.
I would consider something more in the area to 20 thousand dollars as a grant or contribution to the committees.
We should change the figure from 5 thousand dollars because these committees need to be functioning and able to run properly.
Hon. Ed Picco (interpretation): Yes that measly sum of money that you claim is not so small.
It is a small amount but this amount of 5 thousand dollars is all that there is.
(interpretation ends) Mr. Chairman, I said that I would try to put money on the table.
I have committed with every Mayor that I have met with and there has been some good discussion.
When I met with the Mayors in the Baffin, there was a discussion about putting seven or 8 thousand dollars on the table.
Mr. Chairman, I didn't have that luxury at that time and I don't have that luxury at this time.
However, what I did say, Mr. Chairman, and I say it to this House, to the member, that I would review it.
We would review it as a department, the 5 thousand dollars to see the sustainability and to see what avenues proactively we could take as a government to use that money.
Now after saying that Mr. Chairman, I think it should be pointed out that in some of the communities, some of the Mayors have stated that they will not use that 5 thousand dollars to pay honorariums they would use that to help enhance the committee.
That is fully at the discretion of the individual Hamlets.
So I do say to the member, I thank him for his comments, that I will try to increase that amount after an evaluation of one year of the committees running. After having an opportunity after one year to review with the Mayors, the sustainability and indeed, if that amount of money is acceptable and sustainable, I promise and I commit to the House that we would do that.
Thank you very much for your appropriate response and I believe that you are going to do all you can to review that figure and I do know that is going to go ahead.
That 5 thousand has never been used to date, this is the first time that we have heard about that figure and I am sure that once we go through a year it will be too small.
I would like to see the Minister of Health and Social Services do his best to rectify that matter.
So, those are my two questions Mr. Chairman.
Last person Mr. Alakannuark.
I would like to ask a question of the Minister of Health & Social Services and I would also like to take this opportunity to thank him for meeting with our Standing Committee.
If we are going to be setting up, you said that you would be using the health committees at the community level.
How much authority and how much power do these committees have.
Mr. Chairman, I thank the member for his question and I should say that the member has brought forward some good questions during the debate over the last couple of months at the community level.
The member makes a good point and this has come up in the past, it came up with the Mayors, and the Standing Committee, what types of power would the Standing Committee of Health have.
Mr. Chairman, I say to you that the standing committees on health in each individual Hamlet will have the power that the Hamlet gives it.
If the Hamlet decides that the committee will be limited to advocacy issues for example, then that's what they would be doing.
If the Hamlet decided that they should be dealing with complaints or issues of confidentiality, looking at health promotion, looking at building healthy communities, looking at programs under Health & Social Services at the community level, then they would be allowed to do that.
What we are trying to say, Mr. Chairman, is that we are willing to go further into this devolution of programs and services maybe moving into the committees taking on more responsibility.
But at the present time we look at them as a community resource dealing with health and social issues right at the community level.
My next question is in regards again to the community health committees.
Once they are given those responsibilities and authority, who will be making the decisions on health and social issues.
Would it be the committee or the Hamlet and who is going to be recruiting the health professionals and nurses.
Mr. Chairman, unlike the health boards that were in place before that looked after Bills, invoicing, payment of salaries and so on and so forth.
All those responsibilities now will be done with the Department of Health and that is what we talked about earlier with the cost savings issues.
The committee at the local level, for example in the Keewatin region, some of the committees that are in place actually get involved in the hiring of staff.
For example, we would have some of the members of the health committee in situations where they would be interviewing nurses, social workers, and so on.
The committee would not actually be doing the hiring themselves it would be the Department of Health & Social Services at the local region, but I see the committee playing a role in deciding who will be working in their community, for example in local hires, with CHR's and so on.
That could be done directly with and in co-operation with the health committee.
We see the health committees focusing on promotion.
For example, if teenage pregnancies, Mr. Chairman, were a problem or a concern in a given community then that's where the health committee might say look we have to deal with this issue. Then they would go to the member or me as the minister and ask us for resources to help deal with that issue at the community level.
That would be an example of what the health committee could be doing.
They could be cessation of tobacco or it could be other issues.
You want me to slow down there, or keep going Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Chairman, I think I have finished my response to the member and I am available for any other responses.
Chairperson (interpretation): The minister has finished.
General comments or questions.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): Just a comment and to respond to Mr. Alakannuark's question.
Looking at the proposed Bill here we tried to put something in there where the local governments would have more authority now should this Bill go through. Then they would be able to take on more responsibility and take on programs, like the suicide prevention programs for example.
But the Hamlets at the community level could start up such programs, that is just an example and a supplementary to the answer that was given to Mr. Alakannuark.
Questions, comments.
On item number 4, it talks here about hospital insurance.
Could you elaborate further on the types of insurance that we are talking about here.
I am asking this question for clarification.
Chairperson (interpretation): You can't reprimand me, Mr. Iqaqrialu.
Mr. Chairman, is the member referring to (4) on page 2.
Okay, thank you Mr. Chairman, we have found it.
In response to the member, under that section under medical practitioners, it is just pointing out that doctors under the Hospital Insurance and Health & Social Services Act, are not deemed to be public servants or public employees, under the Public Service Act, I believe.
Possibly, I could elaborate on this question further.
Doctors and prescription drugs, different types of prescription drugs, I would assume that prescription drugs are included in the hospital insurance, what about the prescription drugs.
Hon. Ed Picco: Mr. Chairman, the member, like I said under this Act, the medical practitioners under (4), I am just pointing out for greater clarity, that doctors are not considered public employees.
The issue of prescription drugs and so on is outside the scope of the Bill that we are discussing today.
It falls under the Non-Insured Health Benefits, that are provided by the Federal Government.
The member is correct those items for Inuit, under that agreement that we have with the Federal Government, are provided free of charge.
That is outside the scope of this Bill.
Chairperson (interpretation): General comments or questions.
Is there anything further.
Would you like to go clause by clause then.
Bill 10, page 1.
An Act to Amend the Boards of Management Dissolution Act.
Chairperson (interpretation): Clause 2.
Chairperson (interpretation): Clause 3.
Chairperson (interpretation): Clause number 4.
Chairperson (interpretation): Bill 10 – An Act to Amend the Boards of Management Dissolution Act.
As a whole.
Chairperson (interpretation): Bill 10 is now ready for third reading.
Thank you Mr. Picco and your staff member for appearing before the House.
Thank you very much members for keeping this as brief as possible.
We will take a ten-minute break and decide what we are going to be doing when we get back.
Ten minute break.
>>Committee recessed at 4.36 p.m. and resumed at 4.55 p.m.
Bill 14 - Interim Appropriation Act
We are ready to proceed with Bill 14.
If the minister would come to the witness table with the witnesses unless you want to make your opening remarks first.
I have some brief opening comments.
This Bill authorises the government to make operations & maintenance expenditures and capital expenditures for the 2000-2001 fiscal year from April 1 2000 to May 31 2000.
It will allow the government to function until the Legislative Assembly has finished debate of the appropriation act.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Minister Ng. Perhaps you can go to the witness table.
Mr. Ng has presented his opening remarks.
If he can be seated with his witnesses.
Thank you for coming before the committee.
Mr. Minister if you can introduce you witnesses for the record.
To my right is Bob Vardy, the deputy minister.
To my left is Mr. Roger Perchard Director of Expenditure management.
Both are with the department of Finance and Administration.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you Minister Ng. I would also like to recognize our legal counsel who is on hand as we need his advice.
At this time we can proceed with general comments or questions to the Bill.
Do we have any comments or questions from the members.
Mr. Chairman I believe in previous discussions with the minister that he indicated that the Bill would come to the committee of the whole with the detail by department and what the expenditures are for.
I am just wondering if we can go through it item by item and do it like that.
Do we have any general comments.
Do we go directly to Bill 14 for consideration of the clauses of this Bill.
That's my question, Mr. Chairman.
Chairperson (interpretation): Proceed, Mr. Iqaqrialu.
On page 1 under section 2.
This clause reads this act applies to the period of April 1 to May 31, 2000 within the fiscal year ending on March 31, 2001.
This is the way it reads.
It seems to end May 31 and then it ends again on March 31, 2001.
I think there has to be a correction under that wording.
If so I would like to get this corrected.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Thank you Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman the clause is correct.
What we are requesting is authority to spend money for the Government from April 1 to May 31 of 2000.
Within the operating year of April 1, 2000 to May 31, 2001.
I'm going to rephrase my question further.
In the fiscal year 99-2000, I am wondering if we are going to get that money from that fiscal year.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Mr. Chairman, I'm not sure about honourable member's question.
He referred to the current fiscal year, I believe 99-2000.
If that is the case, if there are any unspent funds from this year and it would carry over into the next year.
If that was his question.
I apologize, Mr. Chairman.
Within the fiscal year 2000-2001.
He was talking about appropriations.
Is that coming from that fiscal year's money.
That’s my question.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Yes, the member is correct.
I thank him for clarifying that.
It's correct yes.
I wonder if the briefing was done yet concerning the money that we are finished dealing with.
We haven’t gone to the main estimates and I see there is going to be a substantial amount already removed for April and May.
I am wondering if our budget for the new fiscal year is going to be short because we’re going to take this money out of that budget to be.
Chairperson (interpretation): Hon. Kelvin Ng.
Mr. Chairman if you look at clause 6 of this Bill, once the regular main estimates that haven't been debated yet, when the main estimates and the capital estimates are approved the spending authority of this Bill is wiped out.
This is just an interim measure to allow the government to operate until the budget is passed.
The main budget.
Our budget then the appropriation is for 121 million dollars for the 2 months.
Just within that 2 months is that my correct understanding.
If we don't spend that same amount are we just going to lose that money that is allocated under the appropriations.
If we don't use the money it becomes part of the budget of each of the departments.
As I indicated once the main estimates that we have to review yet are finalized and are approved then the budget will supersede anything on this appropriation act.
Chairperson (interpretation): I have no names on my list.
We had a name but he removed his name from the list.
Mr. Chairman again this is just for the record.
The minister indicated in earlier meetings that something that’s identified or started off by this Act whether it is on the program side or capital side, in the event that it didn't get approved through the main estimates it would be dropped.
Mr. Chairman I did indicate that during a standing committee review.
Mr. Chairman if we could go through each clause I wouldn't mind if we go through each item by item on page 2.
Chairperson (interpretation): Are we agreed clause by clause.
Thank you I was given glasses I forget from whom.
Section 1 on Bill 14.
Interim Appropriation Act.
April 1 to May 31 2000.
Clause 1 agreed.
Clause 2, Mr. Tootoo.
Item by item, I thought we were going to go through the numbers on page 2.
Item by item.
Not the clauses.
Okay all the clauses on the front and no use to go through the numbers on the back.. I thought we were going through the numbers first.
Chairperson (interpretation): Do you agree with Mr. Tootoo's suggestion.
The amounts appropriated for the period April 1 to May 31 2000.
Vote 1, operations & maintenance.
Items 1 to 12, operations & maintenance.
Mr. Chairman on that vote 1 operations & maintenance dollars.
I just was wondering if I could ask the Minister of Finance to go through each department and explain what those dollars are going to be used for.
Mr. Chairman if I may, maybe I can do all 12 of them and answer questions afterwards.
If that is okay with the committee.
For the first three, Legislative Assembly, Executive and Intergovernmental Affairs, Finance and Administration, basically it is two twelfths of spending.
April and May in other words, two months pro-rated or 16.7% give or take a half a percentage point.
So, it's pretty straightforward.
Item 4, Mr. Chairman is Human Resources and that one is a bit lower than the 16.7%.
It's actually 13.5% of their yearly appropriation for operations & maintenance.
The reason for that Mr. Chairman is because there is no need for relocation costs early on in the year.
The bulk of hiring will be later during the summer type of thing when families generally finished school and prepare to make such moves.
For Justice, Item 5, Item 6 Public Works, those 2 amounts again are roughly the 2 twelfths of their yearly appropriations.
Item 7, Community Government and Transportation is a bit higher, roughly 20% of their appropriations requested, Mr. Chairman.
Primarily it is because of contributions to Municipalities that they have to do quarterly versus monthly.
So there is some additional up front needs there.
Mr. Chairman, Item 8 Culture, Language, Elders & Youth is at 15 %, Item 9 for Education it's a bit higher than the 2 twelfths.
They are roughly at 22%, 30 million dollars.
Again, this is primarily because of quarterly contributions to Divisional Boards of Education that they give out in advance.
Item 10, Health and Social Services is pretty well at the 16% mark.. Sustainable Development is one that is about 25 % of their appropriation.
Again, it would be in respect to some contributions in advance.
Item 12, the Housing Corporation falls right into the 17% range.
Mr. Chairman. That’s basically the break up percentage wise for each of the funded departments and corporations and it's for salaries and benefits and operating expenses for the first 2 months of operation.
Chairperson (interpretation): General comments. Mr. Tootoo.
Mr. Chairman I think most of it is pretty straightforward.
Just on number 12 on the Housing Corporation.
In the Minister's budget address he talked about some leasing of new units.
I am just wondering if any funds for those leases are included in this interim amount.
Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. Ng. Which one you will respond.
Mr. Chairman I don't have that specific detail for each request as I indicated, I gave each department.
We put together the information.
I don't know if the minister has the specifics either.
Whether or not there are specific amounts for that.
I have specifics for the capital appropriations.
I knew that there was more of an interest there.
So, for the operations & maintenance end of things, given generally the 16% or the 2 twelfths budget, we didn't get into too much detail.
We didn't ask for too much detail, quite frankly from each of the departments on that.
I know there was more interest as I indicated on the capital end of things.
Mr. Chairman I guess I was worried about the leases for projects that may not be approved.
I can see it's assuming continual leases.
I guess my concern is that they will be new leases signed before the whole program itself being approved in the House.
I know it would be pretty tough once those leases are signed to get out of them.