EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
Speaker: Minister of Health and Social Services. Minister Picco.
And a very warm welcome back to the member.
Mr. Speaker, very quickly then on the question concerning social workers; I think there’s been some confusion exactly on the program that is in place for social workers.
Social workers handle statutory requirements which includes for example, working with courts, laws, and so on.
On the other hand Mr. Speaker, we also have counsellors in communities who are unilingual, who are elders.
A good example is in Clyde River where right now I believe there are 12 more people from across Nunavut from different communities who are being trained in reality therapy and that is a form of counselling that we recognize as a government.
We are certifying them.
So even through Mr. Speaker, the people and the Premier and myself and the member for Clyde River and some of the other members, we went last November before Christmas to Clyde River and were part of a presentation where different people from across Nunavut were certified counsellors, so they can actually counsel people.
So there is a program in place where people who may not have the academic qualifications are actually trained and certified counsellors by our government.
In line with his response, he stated that the individuals who are able to counsel others have been recognised by the government.
If they are recognised as qualified counsellors by the government, how come there was a job that was to be open in Hall Beach, how come the government did not recognize these qualifications and hire the Inuit people as counsellors.
Mr. Speaker, we do have a community wellness counsellor working in Clyde River who has been certified by the government who is Inuk and bilingual.
At the same time, Mr. Speaker, we just recently filled the social services position in Hall Beach if that’s the position the member is talking about.
At that time, Mr. Speaker, through human resources, that person met the qualifications that were advertised, there was a screening and hiring process held and the successful person was hired.
In this case, the person does not speak Inuktitut who is the social worker but as I said earlier Mr. Speaker, we do have counselling services available through the community wellness and mental health worker, whom I might add Mr. Speaker, by all reports is doing an excellent job in the community.
The question that I was trying to ask previously, he gave me a different response so I just asked him a question according to that original response.
I think he responded to me saying that we recognise the individuals that can counsel people given their life experiences, but I want a very brief response with the question that I’m trying to ask.
An Inuk able to deal with life’s issues, who is not educated, but who can do counselling or social work, but since that individual is not certified, is that why the government cannot acknowledge and recognise that person because they are not certified?
Mr. Speaker, first of all Mr. Speaker, as I tried to explain earlier, Mr. Speaker, we have what we call community wellness and community mental health specialists in communities who are hired and certified by the Government of Nunavut.
They undergo one form of training which I explained earlier that is happening right now in Clyde River with several people from different communities.
It’s called reality therapy, and that is for unilingual or bilingual participants.
That is occurring.
Mr. Speaker, the member’s community has a community wellness counsellor who can provide counselling services.
At the same time we have a social worker position, a Social Worker III position in the member’s community.
That position, the social worker, not only counsels people and can counsel people but also provides statutory and other requirements.
If the member is talking about the counselling position, the incumbent person in that position has been in the position for a couple of years and it has been open.
I believe the member was asking about the social worker position and as I explained Mr. Speaker, in this case, there were several applicants for the position.
It was screened by human resources, not health and the successful applicant was a Social Worker III who has experience and that person was hired for the position.
Mr. Speaker, the member is correct that the social worker does not speak in Inuktitut but we do have as I said earlier, a community wellness counsellor in the community who is bilingual.
I’m not talking about the level of education and I am certainly not talking about the academic qualifications of the applicants. I just want you to know that I’m not asking questions in regards to that.
The questions that I was posing before, Mr. Speaker, if I can make it clear enough, Inuit people who are not certified are capable of working as counsellors.
My question is would the government be able to recognize and acknowledge non-certified, unilingual Inuktitut speaking people to become counsellors.
Mr. Speaker, the answer is yes and we are doing it right now.
That is what I have just said.
We have a counselling program going on right now where we are actually certifying people.
People who don’t have their qualifications are actually getting the qualifications in, and for example, in this case, in Clyde River.
We have people from all across Nunavut, who are actually taking a certification course.
The member is correct, if they don’t have the qualifications, if they apply for a counselling position, or a community wellness position, Mr. Speaker, we will make that course available so they could actually be certified.
That is one of the successes that we have had over the last couple of years.
So the answer to the member’s questions is yes.
Question 108 – 1(6): Lapsed Appropriations
Last week, Mr. Speaker, I was asking the minister in regards to his Budget Address, and he went over the summary of our fiscal position for Nunavut and he had indicated when I asked him where the roughly thirty-two million dollars in lapses that they are expecting in this year and I asked him where they are coming from and he had indicated basically government-wide is where these lapses were coming from.
I would like to ask the minister, those lapses that are, let’s say, we will just specify the O&M lapses, seventeen million dollars, what year are they expecting those lapses to occur.
Are they occurring in the 2002-2003 fiscal year or are they from the previous years?
Mr. Speaker, the lapses are for the 2001-2002 operating year.
That is what we were reporting on.
So those lapses are from last year’s funding.
Last year, if you see the revised estimates show fifteen million dollars in lapses from 2001-2002.
So I was just wondering are those from last year’s lapses that we are looking at, and those other ones of fifteen million dollars are those from the previous years?
On these lapses, basically are we always a year behind?
Mr. Speaker, I think that I tried to explain to the Honourable Member that the way that we have been operating, every year we have had lapses, because all the departments haven’t been able to expend all the dollars that have been appropriated to them and others have gone over their appropriation.
But by and large government-wide there has been under expenditures.
It is reported on the past financial years.
The member is correct, in that there was for the 2001-2002 year, we are expecting seventeen million dollars, and as he indicated for the prior year before that there was fifteen million for lapses for O&M.
I guess maybe having such a substantial amount of lapses might be the reason why we don’t have a contingency reserve built into this year’s Budget that my colleague was asking about earlier.
In light of that if we know that we are going to be lapsing that much, that amount of money, why haven’t the minister or the government looked at maybe allocating those monies that they know are lapsed from the year before to one time funding programs like they did with daycares last year, I believe it was.
There are all kinds of groups and organizations out there that are always getting told we don’t have any money for you.
I was wondering why the government never looked at allocating a certain portion of those lapses that they’re estimating for things like that.
Because as I’d indicated in the past, the normal course of business when you do the fiscal framework of the government you anticipate certain lapses and just like you anticipate there is going to be some extraordinary supplementary appropriations that come forward on a year by year basis.
So, one is more than likely to offset the other.
So, I guess, what the minister’s saying for all intents and purposes, this is basically a contingency reserve for the government.
No, that’s not the case.
As I indicated to Mr. Arvaluk’s question earlier, on the same matter as far as a contingency reserve.
I suggested and I reiterate that there is sufficient funding in our accumulated operating surplus to not require a specific contingency fund for this current fiscal year and that’s why we didn’t put one forward.
Question 109 – 1(6): Fees for Money Transfers to Patients in Boarding Homes
I’m not exactly sure when it was but Gloria Penner was the manager of the Uglivik in Winnipeg for the patients.
I’m not really sure if there were fees taken from the sender or if there were fees taken from the recipient for money transfers.
When we would send money to family members in their times of need, we are made to pay 15 dollars through the Co-op or Northern and once the transfer arrives at it’s destination they then deduct 5 dollars.
I now hear that if a person sent money, if the amount is under 100 dollars the amount deducted is 2 dollars and 100 and over they are deducted 5 dollars.
Was that part of the agreement that was reached at that time?
Mr. Speaker, I really appreciate the support I get from the MLA for Amittuq over there on the other side.
Mr. Speaker, first of all, let me say that my understanding was that agreement was not between the Government of Nunavut, and indeed the precursor to that agreement was the Government of Northwest Territories.
What has happened Mr. Speaker, by convention, is that when people wanted to transfer money they went to the local coop or Northern Stores and they were able to transfer the money from the local coop or the local store if there was no bank present, to Winnipeg, to ACL or to Northern Stores in Winnipeg where the Kivalliq Boarding Home is.
Now that was my understanding and when you sent the money through the private company there was an associated fee.
I believe the fee was below 100 dollars, it was 15 dollars, 10 dollars for the store and 5 for the sender a total of 15 dollars.
And if it was above 100 dollars, I believe the fee was 20 dollars.
Those fees amount to change Mr. Speaker, but that was not an arrangement of the government.
My understanding is it was an arrangement with the local businesses in communities that did not have a bank.
The minister completely misinterpreted my question.
We already know those fees are being charged by the Co-op or the Northern Stores.
However, the centre itself, I’m told the centre itself in Winnipeg is now charging over and above that for their collection of it on behalf of the patients.
My question was not, was that part of the negotiation, it’s not.
If that was part of the negotiations, was your policy, when you negotiate with someone to work for you on contract, can they on top of that, make extra money from your monies or from your services.
What’s the policy on that?
Mr. Speaker, this is the first time that I have heard that about the contract holder with the boarding home in Winnipeg, and I want to make sure that this is an accusation being made that we’re perfectly clear on what’s being said in this House.
Mr. Speaker, the government has no policy, procedure, guidelines with a contractor for the transference of money.
The Government of Nunavut is not a bank.
Mr. Speaker, if a patient or the family member of a patient wishes to transfer money to Winnipeg and they transfer it to the facilitator or the runner of the Winnipeg Boarding Home and the person receiving or sending the money has to pay a fee, Mr. Speaker, I’m not aware of what that fee would be and who is charging it.
It is certainly not a policy of the Government of Nunavut.
I understand that when the patient is being picked up that the airport, there is no extra charge from this company.
When they’re being taken to the hospital there is no extra charge.
When they’re being taken from the hospital back to the boarding home, there’s no extra charge.
When they, because these are a part of your negotiated agreement, contract, so, anything that is not negotiated that the patient requires for his or her wellbeing while down in the transient centre, does that contractor in the centre have a right to charge whatever he or she feels like.
Mr. Speaker, in the contract that we have with the boarding home, there is a contract providing transportation services.
Mr. Speaker, the member is correct, when a patient arrives, in this case, in Winnipeg, and is brought to the boarding home, that is covered.
If the patient wants to leave the boarding home and go to the hospital, that cost is covered and when the patient’s finished their hospital services and needs to be transported from Winnipeg, back to the airport, that cost is covered.
However, Mr. Speaker, if the boarding home also arranges for example, trips to local shopping malls and so on, they don’t charge for that cost.
However, if Mr. Speaker, a person says, I have money on the other side of Winnipeg, will you take me over there and then the operator of the van or the boarding home has been charging patients, Mr. Speaker that is not something that we have contracted for.
Mr. Speaker, if that’s the allegation that the member is making, then Mr. Speaker, we will look into that because that to us, as a government, would not be acceptable that you would be charging above and beyond the cost of picking up the money.
We’re in the business Mr. Speaker, as a government, of making sure that our patients who are sent down get the very best treatment that is available including transportation services.
Mr. Speaker, to be double dipping and double charging, if that is the case, Mr. Speaker, we would put a stop to it.
If you find out, I’m not talking about rich people who go down to Winnipeg and can afford to go to town and go to the Royal Bank and charge the government for it or the contractor for it, whatever gas they spent.
I’m talking about the people who had to leave in a hurry from home, in emergency cases.
You know and I know, in the small communities like Coral Harbour the stores are not open at the best of times, let alone having a bank there to do transfers.
Was this an oversight?
This should be one of the measures that the government could have taken to ensure a small service like this; it makes a lot of difference sometimes, if it is done properly.
When you find out if this is being done, can you correct it and report back to the House?
Mr. Speaker, we take the allegation that the member makes very seriously.
Mr. Speaker, we will look into it immediately and find out exactly what has been happening and report to the member and to the House on that situation.
I would like to recognise in the gallery, my constituents, well known individuals from Rankin Inlet, friends, Paul Murphy and Helen Klengenberg.
As well as their assistant Mike Seales to our left and on the right is Joe Kusido. I would like to recognise them.
I am sorry. I would like to get permission to return to item 5. Recognition of Visitors in the Gallery.
There are no nays. Proceed, Mr. Anawak.
Hon. Jack Anawak (interpretation): I’m sorry I’m an Inuk.
I would like to recognise my constituents from Rankin Inlet, who have their own business and everybody knows, I think everybody knows them, Paul Murphy and Helen Klengenberg and the person that they work with is Mike Seales on the left hand side.
On the right hand side is Joe Kusido.
Petition 003 – 1(6): Petition About Bad Gasoline
This petition I would like to table is from the community of Sanikiluaq and there are 204 signatures from people opposing the bad gas situation.
As the Member for Sanikiluaq, I would like to table this in this House.
Speaker: Item 11. Petitions.
Item 13. Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills.
Item 14. Tabling of Documents.
Tabled Document 013 – 1(6): Ruled Out of Order
Mr. Speaker, today I would like to table a letter that was sent home with all the students to the parents here in Iqaluit from the Iqaluit District Education Authority outlining some of the concerns that they have with the proposed Education Act.
Tabled Document 014 – 1(6): IDEA Press Release on Comments in the Assembly
Mr. Speaker, I’d also like to table a press release that was issued on May 2, from the Iqaluit District Education Authority in regards to comments made here in the House to education and compensation.
Speaker: Just a reminder to all members that we’ve discussed before all documents being tabled should be signed.
Letters that is.
As a result Mr. Tootoo, your letter regarding the Iqaluit District Education Authority will be ruled out of order.
Bill 9 – An Act to Amend the Property Assessment & Taxation Act – Second Reading
Hon. Manitok Thompson: I move, seconded by the Honourable Member for Baffin South that Bill 9, An Act to Amend the Property Assessment and Taxation Act, be read for the second time.
The proposed amendment to the Property Assessment and Taxation Act will extend the life of the general assessment to October 31, 2004.
The current assessed value of assessable property within the general taxation area will remain in effect until that time.
Given the increased numbers of properties that have been developed in the last three years, the amendment will allow the Government of Nunavut time to add these properties and conduct a thorough update of the general assessment.
The amendment will also allow the government to continue to generate revenues through property taxes.
The Bill has had second reading and accordingly the bill is referred to a committee.
Bill 2 – Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 4, 1999-2000 – Second Reading
Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the Honourable Member for Hudson’s Bay that Bill 2, Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 4, 1999-2000, be read for the second time.
Mr. Speaker, the purpose of this bill is to formally approve amounts expended by departments in 1999 – 2000 fiscal years in the amount of 337 thousand dollars.
This request will comply with the Financial Administration Act and the Auditor General’s recommendation that all expenditures be appropriated through the Legislative Assembly.
The bill has second reading and accordingly the bill is referred to a committee.
Bill 3 – Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 3, 2000-2001 – Second Reading
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Mr. Speaker, I move seconded by the Honourable Member for Pangnirtung, that Bill 3, Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 3, 2000-2001 be read for the second time.
Mr. Speaker, the purpose of this bill is to formally approve amounts expended by the departments in the 2000/2001 fiscal year in the amount of 33 million 34 thousand dollars.
The bill has had second reading and accordingly the bill stands referred to a committee.
Bill 4 – Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 4, 2001-2002 – Second Reading
Hon. Kelvin Ng: Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded the by the Honourable Member for Rankin Inlet North, that Bill 4, Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 4, 2001/2002 be read for the second time.
Mr. Speaker, the purpose of this bill is to seek legislative approval for additional appropriation requirements resulting from increased expenditures in the amount of 6 million 248 thousand dollars incurred by departments for the 2001/2002 fiscal year.
Bill 5 – Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 1, 2002-2003 – Second Reading
Hon. Kelvin Ng: I move, seconded by the Honourable Member for Baffin South, that Bill 5, Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 1, 2002/2003 be read for the second time.
Mr. Speaker, the purpose of this bill is to seek legislative approval for capital carryovers in the amount of 24 million 440 thousand dollars from 2001/2002 to allow for the capital to be used in this fiscal year 2002/2003.
In addition, increased funding requirements are requested for other capital projects including 1.66 million dollars to provide funding for the replacement of the Baker Lake community learning centre and 6.381 million dollars to provide the Nunavut Housing Corporation with funding to purchase and furnish 37 staff housing units in Iqaluit.
Members, from the same motion.
Would the members please pay attention so we can get through this.
The bill has had second reading and accordingly the bill stands referred to committee.
Bill 2, Bill 3, Bill 4, Bill 5, Bill 6 and Minister’s Statement 020-1 (6).
According to the authority vested in me by Motion 002 - 1(6) the Committee of the Whole will stay in session until it reports itself out, with Mr. Iqaqrialu in the Chair.
Before we proceed, I’d like to ask members to join me in the Members’ Lounge for coffee.
>>House recessed at 3.19 p.m. and resumed at 3.50 p.m.
Chairperson (Mr. Iqaqrialu) (interpretation): Thank you, we can start now.
We are on the Department of Education and I would like to call the meeting to order.
Bills 2, 3, 4, 5 and 6, Ministers’ Statement 020 - 1(6).
Mr. Chairman, I would like to continue with the Department of Education main estimates review, Bill 6.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, Enoki.
Are we in agreement that we deal with Bill 6, Education.
Would the Minister of Education, Peter Kilabuk, please step to the stand with his officials, and after introductions of his officials, we may proceed.
Honourable Minister, please go ahead.
We have, to my left Tom Rich, my Deputy Minister and to my right Ian Rose, the Director of Policy and Planning.
Right now we are on page 9-11, Main Estimates for 2002-2003.
I would like to ask if I can have the opportunity to respond to some previous questions from the members.
This is in respect to some questions for which I did not have an answer at the time, Mr. Chairman.
I will give you the opportunity to respond to the questions.
Last week, after I made my opening comments, there was a question from one of the members and I said I would provide them with a detailed response.
The question was how many Department of Education staff are employed in the communities.
There are 47.5 positions in the Department of Education offices.
In the Baffin Region, in the Pangnirtung office, there are 13 positions; there are 5.5 positions here in Iqaluit, as well as single positions in the communities of Sanikiluaq, Igloolik, Clyde River, and a part-time worker in Kimmirut.
In the Kivalliq Region, in the Rankin Inlet office, there are 11 positions.
We also have two people in Arviat, single positions in Repulse Bay and Coral Harbour and Chesterfield Inlet has a part-time position.
In the Kitikmeot region, we have one office in Cambridge Bay, with 10 positions. Out of these 47.5 positions there are 5 vacant positions available.
Mr. Chairman, I was asked another question about the number of school counsellors and assistant counsellors.
This year, there are slightly over 20 counsellors in the schools and on top of that there are over 80 assistants that work with special needs people.
Mr. Chairman, in respect to the human resources aspect of the department of education, I would like to also provide further information on these positions and the increases we have faced.
For quite some time, starting in October 1999, there were about 122 positions.
From September 2001, there have been 923 positions created after the Divisional Boards of Education were dissolved.
This was in July of 2000 and further, the department started to deal with the District Education Authorities and their regional staff.
There are 787 positions in 42 schools being funded by the three regional centres.
From there out of 787, there are 136 positions left over in the Department of Education from 2001.
We can use this example; there were 122 positions in 1999 including the principals.