EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
Not so much on the detail for the amounts of 3 million, 170 thousand, but we have total main estimates 2001-2002 of 5 million, 65 thousand. Can I have clarification from the accounting point of view on that not previously authorized 3 million, 170 thousand.
In other words those projects for the 3 million, 170 thousand have not been completed but the actual budget for that time was 8 million 335 thousand, If I am correct.
Chairperson:(interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Arvaluk.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: No, Mr. Chairman. the member is incorrect that 8 million, 335 thousand will be the adjusted capital budget after approval of the supplementary appropriation.
The current budget that's been approved back in March is 5 million, 165 thousand and if we add in today's supplementary appropriation that was not previously authorized of 3 million, 170 thousand it gets us to the 8.3 million.
But the minister stated before that the monies have already been approved in 2001-2002.
Let me rephrase my question, there was a budget in 2000-2001 that would have included 3 million, 170 thousand.
This is where the confusion arises because our main estimates for 2001-2002 is 5 million, 165 thousand. So we don't really know unless we subtract from the 8 million 335 thousand the 3 million, 170 thousand it will give us a true picture as to what the short fall was or unspent money for those projects.
Is there any way to find out, for example the Baker Lake tank farm of 804 thousand on that same page.
In this case we really don't know what has been done in Baker Lake, unless we look at the previous main estimates from 2000-2001, and we don't even know if anything's been done in Baker Lake, or fifty percent done in Baker Lake.
Is there any way to have a better picture for expediency reasons, especially the supplementary ones, so that I will know what's been done, how much is being done and how much is required for supplementary appropriations due to lack of completion or something that has not started at all that will require our supplementary appropriations today.
Mr. Chairman, I have some of the details of each of the capital projects. Like for Baker Lake it was 2 million, 541 thousand dollars appropriated during 2000-2001. So that would suggest that 2/3 of the project has been completed during the past fiscal year and one third of it remains to be carried out or finalized over the current year.
Chairperson: (interpretation): Thank you, Minister Ng. Any more. Mr. McLean.
James's question was what I was going to ask but I just want to get back to it.
I'm really not too familiar with these carry-overs.
But on these carry-overs, you just quoted Baker Lake as 2 million 541 thousand dollars being spent, and I remember writing letters to Public Works in regards to what the total project cost for that tank farm at that time and I think it was in the ball park of 3.2 million.
So on all these projects that come to total of 3 million and 170 thousand dollars, is this what we budgeted for back in the last fiscal year and it's a carry over because projects weren't completed due to weather or the way the project was tendered out over a one or two year period.
In this 3 million, 170 thousand dollars are there any cost over runs or change orders or extras and things like that or is this just a budget figure carried over and put into this figure.
Chairperson: Thank you, Mr. McLean. Mr. Ng.
By and large these would be the projects that were approved last year. But having said that, there could’ve, as members know, I mean during the course of construction, there are things that come up, and there are change orders that are being made if they discover there’s additional problems and that.
But having said that, when they do make those requests, the scope of the work can exceed the money that’s approved by the legislature. So you know, unless it comes back here for a supplementary appropriation and it has to go over budget that has to be approved by the House.
Chairperson: Thank you, Mr. Ng. Mr. McLean.
So, what you are basically saying, if these projects that aren’t completed yet and there’s a list of carry-over dollars, if there’s more money needed for each individual project that will be another supplementary appropriation.
Only in the circumstance where it would go over the approved amount.
For example, using Baker Lake as an example, speaking about that, if it was learned that they would require more than 804 thousand dollars now that should be approved today for that project, then they would have to come back, we would have to come back for a supplementary appropriation to the House, for the additional dollars.
Page 8 a related question asked earlier by my colleague Mr. Arvaluk. When I read the Baker Lake tank farm, all these tank farms are all different costs.
One is 28 thousand, the other one is 1 million, 77 thousand. It is really hard to follow just what these things are, the old tank farms, the cost is so very different.
Maybe you could clarify some of that so that I can know what’s in this document.
Mr. Chairman, the reason why, you know, all the figures are different, there’s different, first of all, beginning figures for each project are different, depending on the scope of the work that’s required that was approved last year or previous years. Then because certain contracts may proceed more rapidly than others, as far as the delivery aspect, there might be some, that are almost finished.
Obviously if you look at the Hall Beach Pipeline scenario, 28 thousand isn’t a significant amount, so there’s probably just minor warranty work remaining in that particular project. But if you compare it to the Baker Lake tank farm, 804 thousand out of 2.5 million, it’s about of third of the project still left to go on that one.
So I mean, it all depends, and the reason why there isn’t quite frankly, isn’t more detail is, because we’ve already gone through the detailed review, the substantiation of each of these projects and I understand that Ms. Williams, you weren’t with us at that time, but during last year’s review of the capital appropriations, each of the projects were reviewed in detail by the standing committee process and by the House when we approved the budget.
Now if members want us to change that, obviously there’ll be a bit more work required, we could, you know, rearrange this supplementary appropriation supplement for you, the information package, and give you more detail if that’s what members want.
But basically the members are generally familiar with the projects, even though it may have been a year ago that we did approve these.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, Minister Ng. Total petroleum products, 3 million, 170 thousand.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you. Opposed.
Total department, 3 million 170 thousand.
Opposed. Carried.
Turning to page 9, Community Government and Transportation, capital, not previously authorized.
Community Government, 8 million, 318 thousand.
On the Iqaluit sewage treatment facility is this the result of money not being spent as result of delays due to a poor design that we were told was too thin, or something along that line.
What was the reason for delaying or not completing the project, is it a multi-year project.
Mr. Chairman, I don't have that detail of that particular project, you know that is a question that's more appropriately answered by the Minister responsible for Community Government and Transportation.
I could find out about that for the member to answer his question.
Chairperson: (interpretation): Thank you, Minister Ng. Comments.
Questions. We're on page 9.
Total Community Government, 8 million, 318 thousand.
Chairperson: (interpretation): Opposed.
Turning to page 10.
Community Government and Transportation, capital, not previously authorized. Transportation, 2 million, 704 thousand.
The English and the Inuktitut are not the same.
In the Inuktitut it states that there's going to be a docking facility made in Hall Beach but in the English one it says Clyde River.
I don't recall a Hall Beach docking facility so I would have to assume that it's the Clyde River airport terminal development because I do recall quite lengthy discussions about that particular capital project.
I apologize for the error in the Inuktitut information provided.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, Minister Ng. Mr. Irqittuq thank you for pointing that out.
Total transportation, 2 million, 474 thousand. Any comments, questions.
Page 10, Nanisivik highway upgrade. Is that to the airport or is that within the community of Nanisivik.
Is that from Arctic Bay to the airport or what road are you talking about here.
Mr. Chairman, I don't have that specific information and again it would be the Community Government & Transportation minister that would be responsible to provide that. But I'll commit to advising him about that and getting back to the member on that.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, Minister Ng. Anything else.
We are still on the same page, 2 million, 474 thousand. If there are no further questions or comments.
Total department, 10 million, 792 thousand. Any comments or questions.
Turning over to page 11. Department of Education, capital, not previously authorized. Total corporate services, 4 million, 70 thousand.
Comments. Agreed.
Total department, 4 million 70 thousand. Agreed.
Turning to page 12.
Department of Health and Social Services, capital, not previously authorized. Total directorate, 2 million, 364 thousand.
Mr. Arvaluk: Mr. Chairman.
We were really gung-ho especially for the Minister of Health about Nunavut Tele-health and how important it is to have the right diagnosis. I guess we were gung-ho about getting it done fast so that some of the patients can be diagnosed properly and secondly there will be less requirement to fly them out if they can be diagnosed directly from the community using Nunavut Tele-health.
Why is there a delay in this project.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Arvaluk. Minister Ng.
I know the Minister of Health is chomping at the bit to answer this question, so I'll refer that question to him.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, Minister Ng. Minister of Health and Social Services.
Mr. Chairman, I won't take 10 minutes Mr. McLean, it's a good question from Mr. Arvaluk. It gives me an opportunity to explain why we've lapsed that 1 million dollars.
Mr. Chairman, as you know we just received 3.7 million dollars from the Federal Government under the CHIT proposal.
To get the 3.7 million dollars from the Federal Government we have to be able to match that and with the support of the members here, we were able to lapse that money this year, so now when that money came forward from the CHIT proposal from Federal Government which we announced in the Assembly last month, that 1 million dollars will be used as part of our proposal to leverage the 3.7 million from the federal government. That is the reason for lapsing, it will be used.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, Minister of Health and Social Services. I'm sure that member is happy that he got a response. Any further comments or questions.
We're still on total directorate 2 million, 364 thousand.
Chairperson: (interpretation): Thank you. Opposed.
Total department, 2 million, 364 thousand. Agreed.
Turning to page 13.
Department of Sustainable Development, capital, not previously authorized.
Total Sustainable Development, 1 million 513 thousand. Comments.
I'm just a little bit puzzled about various Nunavut Park surveys from Heritage Development from the Katanillik Park all the way down to Kugluktuk Bloody Falls.
They are very, very meagre amounts of 12 thousand to 84 thousand, I just cannot see how these can be carried over the approved budget when the communities were eager to have their campgrounds and historic parks and upgrade their campgrounds etc.
Why are there so many carried over from all these communities for very meagre amounts that could have been handled very easily by the regions.
Unfortunately the Minister of Sustainable Development is at some other meetings but I can say in my recollection, right now our government is negotiating with NTI on Inuit Benefit Agreements for parks and that's part of the hold up of some of the actual expenditure of funding. To have the agreement finalized.
All these little projects have to be individually negotiated by Nunavut Tunngavik . Does NTI know that the outdoor recreation and the tourism programs are very important to the communities. What would be the approximate length of time that these little meagre things would be negotiated between the Government of Nunavut and NTI.
Mr. Chairman, when I mentioned the Impact Benefit Agreements, it's particular to actual territorial parks.
I think there are a lot of others that may not qualify under that category so instead of speaking to it, you know I'm not fully familiar with it, it might be more appropriate for me to ask the Sustainable Development Minister to provide the information so we could pass it back to the members.
If we're not going to complete the clause by clause and if we're going to have to wait for the Minister of Sustainable Development we will not come to an agreement on this portion.
No, we already approved these projects, these are just carried over, we already approved them, there's no reason why we have to wait for the Sustainable Development Minister but we would appreciate maybe later on explanations on the schedule of negotiations etc.
Why they were being delayed etc, etc.
I don't think we need to delay because we already approved them.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, I heard you wrong the first time.
Minister Ng. Would you like to respond.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: No thanks, I would agree with what the member said and I'll commit to providing the information through the Minister of Sustainable Development for any unanswered questions that have been raised.
I'll just make my comments brief and I'll get into the minister in question period, this looks like a departmental bungle, a total bungle.
You know if they are going to put, if we're going to approve money in the capital plan and put millions of dollars into parks and then we approve it, we should be told ahead of time and I'm on that standing committee that this all could be held up if NTI doesn't decide or the Federal Government or whatever the organization decides that, you know, they're a lot slower at the gate than us, you know now that we've committed 4 million, 313 thousand dollars in capital projects.
I think as the Minister of Finance, if we're going to tie this money up for 2 or 3 years waiting for somebody to get his act together and we were saying that it is one of the biggest priorities in this government, why not give it to the Housing Minister to build public housing units.
I can tell you now, if they don't get their act together we're going to carry it over again, and again.
And I still say if we ask what people in Nunavut want, parks or houses then they'll tell us houses.
So I'm going into question period tomorrow about this and I'll ask the minister about what his staff are doing, or what are they doing to speed the process up to build these parks rather than tie up million and millions of dollars in capital, waiting for somebody to get out of the gate to do something about it.
It’s not appropriate and its not acceptable to me as an MLA in the government that’s saying, okay whenever they decide they want to do something, it's just another bungle in this department.
I’m done.
As I indicated earlier for various reasons, we don’t know all the complexities or their reasons for every single project and why it would come forth as a capital carry-over.
But Mr. McLean probably has some legitimate concerns and I would say that the minister would be more than happy to speak to some of the issues that have been raised today.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Ng. Anything else.
I’m very glad to see that some of the projects for my community are finally going ahead.
Sustainable Development, 1 million 513 thousand.
Total department, 1 million 513 thousand.
We’ll go back to page 2.
Operations and maintenance, 160 thousand.
Mr. Arvaluk: I think it's from page 6, for Justice.
Is this money coming from the Federal Government, a little bit over 4 million 566 thousand.
Is it a 100% percent federal contribution or agreement or is there some portion that is, that you have to match.
You said it was half and half, can I get a little bit more explanation on that.
Mr. Chairman, the appropriation amount for operations and maintenance is 160 thousand dollars and yes that is all a federal contribution. It’s a Vote 4-5 money for work performed on behalf of other parties for us.
We’ll go back to the operations and maintenance, 160 thousand.
Page 3. Summary of appropriations. Total capital appropriation, 22 million 26 thousand.
I wanted to ask a question before we approved the bill as a whole.
There’s money set aside for building docks and schools and so on that we just went through.
Are the contracts going to be tendered after this has been approved.
Mr. Chairman, some of the projects that have been approved on the last year's capital are already out for tender.
So they are at different stages of the tendering and contracting process.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): The question that I was going to pose is in regards to the Uluyuk School in Pond Inlet.
It cost a little over 2 million dollars and I was thinking that we're about the middle of May and if it's going to be contracted to purchase materials and so on, you have to schedule it so that you can bring the supplies, the lumber and so on, by ship and it's now already the middle of May.
We might not catch the sealift season and that's why I posed that question to you, if I go back to the question that I posed to you earlier.
Has it been tendered already, has it been advertised in the papers and if you ask the Minister of Public Works to answer that question, it will please me immensely, if she answered that question or the Minister of Finance.
I can't say today whether it has been or hasn’t been out for public tender but what I can say is that I know the minister is taking notes on this matter so I'm sure she'll check with her officials to see what the status is with that particular project.
Chairperson: (interpretation): Thank you, Minister Ng. Mr. Nutarak.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): I apologize, I'm sure we'll be talking about this when we go into the bill as a whole. But the reason why I wanted to bring that up is like I said it is about the middle of May and I am trying to find out some information on where the addition of the Uluyuk stands.
I asked that question of the Minister of Education and he said that advertisement was going out very soon. He didn't tell me a date but that was the response that I got from the Minister of Education, and that came from his capital projects co-ordinator Mr. Lorne Levy. Now it's here again and I'm concerned that we might not catch the sealift season if it wasn't tendered out already.
That's why I ask this question because we desperately need that addition to our school, this is more of a comment than anything else.
I'll just leave it at that Mr. Chairman, before we get side tracked.
Thank you very much for giving me this opportunity.
Chairperson (interpretation): Thank you. Minister Ng if you would like to respond.
I think we share the member’s concern on that project and I know that in our usual way the minister will respond as soon as possible to the member on that matter.
Capital appropriation, 22 million 26 thousand.
Total appropriation, 22 million 186 thousand.
At this time turn to Bill 11, Supplementary Appropriation Act No. 1, 2001-2002.
I just want to comment on this.
We are almost finished with this bill.
It is in syllabics but not in Innuinaqtun.
Next time I would request that these types of documents are printed in Innuinaqtun also.
I note the member’s comments and we'll try and do our best.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): I'll pass, I'll talk about this during the standing committee meeting.
Chairperson (interpretation): Bill 11, clause by clause.
It should be in your packages.
Bill 11, page 1.
Chairperson (interpretation): Clause 1.
Chairperson (interpretation): Turning over to page 3.
Supplementary Appropriation.
Total operations and maintenance, 160 thousand.
Chairperson (interpretation): Elections, vote 2.
Capital, 22 million 226 thousand.
Chairperson (interpretation): Total appropriation, 22 million 186 thousand.
Chairperson (interpretation): Bill 11 is now completed.
Bill 11, bill as a whole.
Does the committee agree that Bill 11 is ready for third reading.
Chairperson (interpretation): I'd like to thank Minister Ng and his official Bob Vardy for appearing before the committee.
I will give the minister a chance for closing remarks.
Hon. Kelvin Ng: I'd like to thank the committee members and Mr. Vardy for their assistance with this bill.
Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. Irqittuq, what is the wish of the committee.
I would like to rise and report progress.
Chairperson (interpretation): Mr. Irqittuq has made a motion to report progress. It is not debatable.
Thank you to members and the staff and interpreters and the law clerk.
Thanks to everyone for your assistance.
Your committee has been considering Bill 11 and would like to report that Bill 11 is ready for third reading and Mr. Speaker, I move that the report of the Committee of the Whole be concurred with.
There's a motion on the floor, is there a seconder for the motion.
Mr. Irqittuq seconds the motion.
I would like to request unanimous consent to return to item 18 on the Orders of the Day.
Speaker: The member is seeking unanimous consent to return to Item 18.
There are no nays, please proceed Mr. Picco.
Revert to Item 18: Second Reading of Bills
Bill 8 - An Act to Amend Certain Acts Concerning Health Professions - Second Reading
Mr. Speaker I move, seconded by the Honourable Member for Hudson's Bay that Bill 8 - An Act to Amend Certain Acts Concerning Health Professions be read for the second time.
Mr. Speaker, Bill 8 amends the Medical Professions Act and Dental Professions Act. These amendments will allow Nunavut to be responsible for its own registration and licensing of health professionals working here in Nunavut.
Mr. Speaker, this will also allow us to stop relying on the NWT to perform those activities.
Bill 8 has had second reading and accordingly is referred to a committee.
Meeting tomorrow morning at 9 o'clock of the Standing Committee on Culture, Education and Health in the KIA Boardroom.
Orders of the Day for Thursday May 24, 2001:
Motion 006 – 1(5)
Before we adjourn for the day, just a notice that Minister Ng has asked the members to stay back for just a few moments after the closing of the House.
This House stands adjourned until May 24, 2001 at 1.30 p.m.
>>House adjourned at 5.10 p.m.
Thursday May 24, 2001
Pages 1471 - 1556
Sergeant-At-Arms  Martina Anavilok
Opening Prayer 1471
Ministers’ Statements 1471
Members' Statements 1475
Recognition of Visitors in the Gallery 1484
Oral Questions 1489
Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills 1502
Tabling of Documents 1502
Motions 1502
Second Reading of Bills 1503
Revert to Ministers' Statements 1504
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters 1506
Report of the Committee of the Whole 1555
Third Reading of Bills 1555
Orders of the Day 1556
Thursday May 24, 2001 1471
079 – 1(5): Government of Nunavut Unveils Inuit Values CD/Poster Project (Okalik) 1471
080 – 1(5): Phase II Decentralization Announcement (Okalik) 1472
081 – 1(5): Status of Territorial Parks Inuit Impact & Benefits Agreements (Akesuk) 1473
082 – 1(5): Granular Materials Transfer (Thompson) 1474
083 – 1(5): Art for the Government of Nunavut Buildings (Akesuk) 1475
084 – 1(5): Canada Summer Games 2001 (Anawak) 1504
210 – 1(5): Executive Masters Program Graduates – Helen Klengenberg & Beatrice Bernhart (Havioyak) 1475
211 – 1(5): Suicide Prevention Awareness Week (Iqaqrialu) 1476
212 – 1(5): Public Service Agreement with GN (Tootoo) 1477
213 – 1(5): Suicide Prevention Awareness Walk (Anawak) 1478
214 – 1(5): Mining in Nunavut and the Closure of Polaris Mine (Williams) 1479
215 – 1(5): Housing Shortage and Overcrowding (Puqiqnak) 1479
216 – 1(5): Training Programs and Future Mine Operations (McLean) 1480