EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
My understanding is two and one, and that changes every year. Confirmation.
The Kitikmeot Wildlife Board, I believe, makes a decision on that.
Mr. Akoak: Thank you, Minister.
I would just like to know how it was between the two communities.
I believe that in one year, Gjoa Haven is allowed two and Cambridge Bay one, and then the next year, Cambridge Bay would get the two and Gjoa Haven would get the one.
I just want confirmation on that.
Hon. Johnny Mike: I’ll get my deputy minister to answer that one.
Mr. Nirlungayuk (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you, Mr. Akoak. (interpretation ends) That is correct.
The Kitikmeot Regional Wildlife Board, between Cambridge Bay and Gjoa Haven, has decided that over the past few years. It rotates annually.
On the same page, third bullet, at the very bottom, it says that “An IQ study is currently being planned…” I want you to know that we have our own scientists.
They don’t have any certificates to show for it, but they are knowledgeable.
I’m assuming, reading that line, that Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit was never used before 2014-15.
I also thank Mr. Akoak. (interpretation ends) Yes, that’s correct.
Our biologist is working closely with hunters and trappers of Gjoa Haven and Cambridge Bay.
When they are doing a survey, they’re asking questions about what the hunters are seeing.
That’s taken into consideration and taking hunters as well into the survey. A more in-depth IQ study, as you know, there have been some IQ studies in Gjoa Haven.
That is the plan. We want to incorporate the traditional knowledge. (interpretation) Thank you.
With that, we are seeing a lot more polar bears coming into the community of Gjoa Haven within the last year.
The IQ specialists are saying that there is a lot more out there than what your biologists are saying.
Is the 2015-16 the second year of the survey?
Hon. Minister of Environment, Mr. Mike.  Hon. Johnny Mike (interpretation): The answer is yes.
Chairman: Mr. Akoak.
Mr. Akoak: I don’t see anything for the third year. There’s nothing mentioned in 2016-17 and that would be the third year, I’m assuming. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Minister of Environment, Mr. Mike.  Hon. Johnny Mike (interpretation): If my deputy minister can respond to that question.
Chairman: Thank you. Mr. Nirlungayuk.
Mr. Nirlungayuk: As the ADM alluded to earlier, to get good survey results done, we would like to do a three-year study. It will continue to the third year in 2016-17. (interpretation) Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you very much. Mr. Akoak.
Mr. Akoak: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just have one more question. When is it that the community of Gjoa Haven found out when the total allowable harvest… ?
When will they be told that it will increase? Is it this year or the next year? Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you very much. Minister Mike.
If my deputy minister can respond to that question.
Thank you, Mr. Akoak. (interpretation ends) As the ADM alluded to, there is a request for decision currently before NWMB before the results are done, so it’s at NWMB’s discretion for the moment.
We’re not sure what the results will be to the minister.
However, once the scientific study has been completed along with an IQ study, there will be a second decision made.
They still have another year, next year, and once the reports are done, it usually takes about a year, but we will see what we can do because Gjoa Haven has been impacted for a while. (interpretation) Thank you.
Following the list of names, I didn’t see any other show of hands, so I’ll recognize Mr. Enook.
Second go-around, Mr. Enook.
As part of my earlier line of questioning, in order to complete the questions and to be clear in my own understanding, in my last question, I stated that Baffin Island residents may have the option to go hunting caribou elsewhere, perhaps to the Queen Elizabeth islands in the High Arctic.
They are far removed from Baffin Island.
In particular, what I want to speak to in this preamble is the mainland past Hall Beach, that Inuit call the land of Canada, especially by Igloolik and Hall Beach residents.
I know that is an area where our hunters can go caribou hunting, at least the communities within reach of the mainland. It is very difficult to attempt that trip, but with no other choice, that may be their only option.
Have you taken into consideration the possible impacts of the Baffin Island moratorium on caribou populations elsewhere, such as the caribou herds in the Kivalliq?
Has this consideration been included in your deliberations on the matter?
If Baffin Island residents were to start harvesting from those herds, due to our population size, we could conceivably harvest a lot of caribou from those herds, although we can’t predict the numbers, especially with the increased cargo rates for country food shipments.
Has this been taken into consideration as part of the overall impacts?
Hon. Johnny Mike (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This issue has been brought up as a concern from the Kivalliq Wildlife Board and that this is disconcerting to them due to the possible impact on the caribou in their region.
I believe it has been several years now, perhaps as many as six years since Baffin Island residents started to order caribou from that region.
Also, with the growing concern about the caribou population in the Baffin region, the Kivalliq Wildlife Board has sent correspondence outlining their concerns.
Another question I want to ask relates to some of the issues brought up by other members.
We often hear various reasons people spout about the decline in the Baffin Island caribou population. Different theories abound for the crash in the population and they could all be factors that contributed to this decline or perhaps only a few caused this problem.
I personally don’t have a clue to the actual reason.
I wonder if the abundance of wolves in the Baffin region is partially to blame for this population decline. Was this taken into consideration?
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you very much. Mr. Mike.
Indeed, in listening to IQ and caribou historical abundances, we have heard of past declines and escalation of populations inhabiting our island. In the early 1990s, the South Baffin caribou were actually all around Iqaluit as they migrated through this area. In those days, you could often see caribou resting between the schools and buildings.
We have heard of various factors from hunters. Yes, Inuit hunters and wolves both contribute to population declines. However, caribou have cyclic periods of population increases and declines.
The historical data indicates that populations have crashed in the past and then rebounded in later years.
In meeting with my executive colleagues from Canada, they are all saying the same thing. They aren’t sure of the reasons, but caribou populations are decreasing throughout our country and it seems to be more commonplace now. When I meet with my colleagues in other jurisdictions, that’s what they all say.
They report that their caribou populations are declining and they believe it has to do with the wolf population. However, the caribou have their own natural process that they go through and that’s what they’re going through.
I believe that in Canada, we are undergoing the downturn in the caribou population cycle and elsewhere in the arctic regions.
I think we will be in this cycle for a while, but I don’t think it’s just due to the harvesting of the caribou; it’s part of the natural process.
In considering the caribou moratorium, every effort was made to deliberate on these issues, as we all know.
However, what we don’t know is how long the moratorium will last, as that is part of Minister Mike’s ministerial authority.
At this time, with the caribou moratorium in effect in the Baffin region, as per your earlier comments that it seems some laws are made to be broken, that seems to be the purpose.
Let me quote an article in the Nunatsiaq News that was written in the March 11 edition. I will only read part of the article which talks about an interview with your departmental officials.
Actually, they were reputed to have stated this.
I will start off with an alleged remark from Mr. Gissing. I suppose he responded to a question where he was asked a hypothetical situation whereby an Inuk harvests a caribou and his response was that this would have to be reviewed on a case-by-case basis.
I imagine they used an elder as an example, who is out on the land and facing starvation without any other food source. They may have to harvest a caribou to stave off starvation.
“That elder would not likely face any consequences, Gissing said, but others could face fines or wind up in court facing charges under Nunavut’s Wildlife Act.”
It also states that “Pinksen seemed a little less generous.” He stated that “This is a big step for the government to take. It’s certainly controversial but, it is now the law of the land.”
That’s what Mr. Pinksen said.
There ends my quotations.
Wow, our government is so dictatorial in stating that this is the law of the land.
Which legislation prevails?
Your two officials seem to be saying two different things, that if the offender is an elder, then it may not be an issue if they harvest a caribou while Mr. Pinksen seems to be insinuating that all cases will be sent to court.
What is the process going to be? If we catch a caribou out of season or while the moratorium is in effect, are you going to treat the elders differently from the younger harvesters?
Is that the way it’s going to be?
Thank you, nukassakuluuk.
We will think about that and I’m going to make a decision when I have to make it after I get a recommendation from NWMB.
You stated that I have to make a decision on that, which is true, and I thank the MLA, Joe Enook.
The process has been, when there’s a moratorium anywhere, when someone has no choice but to harvest, and that’s the way I understand it from way back, even if there’s a moratorium, you’re able to harvest in emergency circumstances.
My assistant deputy minister can explain that further with your permission, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Nirlungayuk. (interpretation) I’m sorry.
Under Nunavut’s Wildlife Act, a person is always allowed to kill an animal in self-defence or to prevent starvation.
The law has always provided for that.
In the event somebody was in a starvation situation and they needed the hunt to survive, the law provides for that and it always has.
However, because of the moratorium on Baffin Island caribou, if we become aware of anybody hunting Baffin Island caribou, we will conduct an investigation.
Our obligation is to conduct that investigation to find out the circumstances of that hunt, and then the department would make a decision on whether or not to pursue charges.
Since we have a moratorium on Baffin Island, I know that people will not harvest caribou because we’re told not to.
In the same article that I quoted from, one of your officials stated that “Starting March 16, representatives from the environment department and from NTI will travel to each Baffin community for consultations on a long-term management plan for Baffin caribou, Gissing said.”
Can you give us some information on what this means, having consultations with the people?
My Assistant Deputy Minister, Mr. Pinksen, will respond to that.
Chairman: Thank you. Mr. Pinksen.
As the minister has described, the Nunavut Wildlife Management Board is holding its public hearing this week on Baffin caribou to review the minister’s decision and also, they’re expected to make a decision on the future management of the caribou.
In addition to that, the Department of Environment committed to drafting a management plan for Baffin Island caribou. We have drafted that plan and it’s being distributed to the HTOs.
The upcoming consultations are on that draft management plan, which we’re seeking input and guidance on how to approach Baffin Island caribou management in the coming years. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
As the master plan that you’re drafting is coming just from your department, is that why you’re finally going to convey it to the communities?
It has not been heard by the communities, so this is what the department is going to do and this is what you think should happen. Is that what’s happening?
Chairman: Thank you. Minister of Environment, Minister Mike.
Hon. Johnny Mike (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. My assistant deputy minister will give you the details on that.
In November of 2014, we held a large Baffin Island caribou workshop with representation from all the Baffin Island communities and the Qikiqtaaluk Wildlife Board, as well as Nunavut Tunngavik Incorporated and the Nunavut Wildlife Management Board.
It was at that workshop that the department was tasked with drafting a management plan based on the discussions that took place at the workshop.
We were tasked with that role to draft the management plan based on the workshop and then to distribute it.
We went away, we prepared the draft, and it’s now being discussed and shared with the HTOs.
It also states here, “Gissing said he hopes to visit all communities by the end of March, and to submit a long-term management plan to the NWMB by the end of 2015.”
I want to ask a question about the next statement. It states, “Setting a sustainable long-term harvesting quota depends on knowing how many bulls, cows and calves make up the caribou herds on Baffin Island, Gissing said.”
Do I understand that all of Baffin Island, starting from now and I don’t know to when, before the end of the year, will be surveyed or consulted?
You said that you would like to submit a management plan by the end of 2015.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you very much. (interpretation ends) Hon. Minister of Environment, Mr. Mike.
My Assistant Deputy Minister, Mr. Pinksen, will respond to that question.
The staff person who gave that interview indicated to me that the newspaper article does not accurately reflect what he stated to the reporter.
I would just caution that maybe the report in the newspaper is not reflective of his statements.
Aside from that, we are developing a long-term management plan and monitoring plan for Baffin Island caribou and I’m sure you’re aware that we have requested additional ongoing funding to fund ongoing research to better monitor Baffin Island caribou.
The intent is that we will consult with the communities by the end of March and complete the management plan by the end of the year, noting that the management plan requires the approval of the Nunavut Wildlife Management Board.
Chairman: Thank you. Refrain from naming people who are not at the witness table.
Mr. Enook (interpretation): Mr. Chairman, my question is, and I also know that my angajuksakuluk, Minister Mike, might not be able to respond to the question I’m about to ask, but let me ask it anyway.
Since the Nunavut Wildlife Management Board is having a hearing at this time, how long do you feel that you will wait for them to give you a report?
If you can’t answer it, then I understand that you might not be able to give me an answer.
After any kind of wildlife public hearing that is established by NWMB, usually it’s about three months or over, for sure, if not five or six months. It usually takes about that long before we get a report or recommendation from any hearing.
That’s what I feel if this proceeded without any problems because I know that there are different types of hearings and some of them are quite difficult.
I can’t state when it would be, but it will be up to NWMB to decide on that.
Following your statement, it may be five months that have to pass. Is there no way I can harvest a caribou this summer according to the law?
Chairman: Thank you. Minister of Environment, Mr. Mike.
Hon. Johnny Mike (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I’m just one of the people waiting to hear from NWMB, so I cannot answer that question. I’m sorry.
Is the minister saying that the caribou moratorium may change before he hears about it or is it only after he hears about it that the moratorium will be changed?
All I said was that I am one of the people waiting for a decision of the Nunavut Wildlife Management Board.
The caribou moratorium will not change before I hear from NWMB.
If it is going to be five months, it will be all summer.
You say that you are waiting to hear from NWMB and nothing will change unless you hear from them.
I doubt if I will harvest a caribou this summer.
The law won’t let me.
For my last question, I believe I can ask questions about the O&M contributions.
The bottom one is Other Expenses, $821,000. That is quite a lot of money.
What are the plans for that money?
I’m sorry, I’m not sure what page the question is based on.
Can he explain?
Chairman: The question that he is asking is on Distribution of Operations and Maintenance Budget on page I-7, Other Expenses.
My apologies, our papers were in disarray.
I would like my assistant deputy minister to respond to that.
Other expenses include staff travel and a number of other associated expenses, including our annual training conference.
I believe the minister, in a written response to the standing committee, explained the finance guidelines that were followed in explaining what is included in the $821,000.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you very much. (interpretation ends) I have recognized everyone who wishes to ask questions on this page and as such, we will move on.
Corporate Management. Total Operations and Maintenance, to be Voted. $4,408,000. Agreed?
Moving on to I-5.
Branch Summary. Environment.
In the past, like the past several years, polar bears have been selling on the market quite well. I have noticed in the past couple of auctions that the polar bear furs aren’t selling as well as they used to be.
I’m just wondering if the minister can explain what accounts for that.
The price of furs fluctuates and that is normal.
This past winter, trying to sell the furs was more difficult.
For the ones that go through the government fur sales, we run it the way we want to and the prices rise.
We will only know in June.
We’re holding off on auctioning them until June because the prices are too low right now.
If the prices can go up, then it would be better for everybody.
The purchase prices have been low and we know that, but because we can hold off, we’re holding off right now and waiting for the prices to go up.
As the minister stated, they’re holding off until June to try and sell the bear skins on auction again.
What is going to be happening in June to make you think that the furs will sell better in June than they are at the present time?
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you very much. (interpretation ends) Minister of Environment, Minister Mike.
All I’m saying is that in June, the auction sales will happen again, and if the prices can go higher a little bit or any time if the prices go up a little bit, we’re just hoping the prices will go up a little bit.
In the minister’s opening comments, he talked about putting more funding into the purchase of sealskins from harvesters, which I think is a good idea because sealskins and hunting seals is very important to most of our communities.
I’m just wondering what your department is doing with other furs.
For example, when I was reviewing the auction, I was in North Bay, Ontario. It said that over the past several auctions, 100 percent of their white fox furs are being sold and they’re being sold at fairly good prices.
My question would be: what is your department doing to promote the harvesting and purchasing of other furs?
In your reference to sealskin prices, we would like the prices to go up if we can be approved and so we are asking for more money because of that.
There is a lot of demand for sealskins in the Baffin, especially the tanned ones.
Many Nunavummiut hunters sell sealskins and it has to do with the possible raising price for sealskins.
It would mean more hunters would actively hunt. Hunters feed the community with seal meat both to family and other residents.
We believe too that the price for sealskins should go up. If our plans can be approved, it will start April 1.
My assistant deputy minister will answer the second part to the question, with your permission, Mr. Chairman.
We have two programs that support harvesters of long furs. There is one, for example, for white fox and cross fox that provides a guaranteed minimum price.
If there is a market decline, which does happen in the fur markets, the hunters are guaranteed to get a minimum price so that when, as it regularly does, the market crashes, the hunters don’t lose out in that particular year.
The other program we have is for wolves and individuals who sell wolves in a given year, depending on the volume they sell, they receive a bonus subsidy later in the following year in the fall time.
Those are the two programs we have that support harvesters of long fur.
As Mr. Pinksen stated, they have programs where they guarantee prices for other furs, such as foxes.
What are you doing to promote this in the communities?
Are you advertising in the communities in any way or promoting it somehow so that it encourages more people to go out there and trap these kinds of furs that are in high demand at the present time?
My assistant deputy minister will respond, with your permission, Mr. Chairman.
At this time, we do not have a program to encourage trappers.
However, you will note in our business plan that we have indicated that we want to develop a hunter education and training program.
Encouraging and promoting trapping and hunting as a lifestyle and a way life is a part of that planned program.
One final question: when do you anticipate having this plan put into action?
The minister has redirected to his official, Mr. Pinksen.
Mr. Pinksen: Mr. Chairman, I’m just trying to look it up.
My memory tells me that it’s in the 2015-16 fiscal year, but I can check the business plan.
Chairman: Thank you. (interpretation) He is checking for us.
Yes, it is for development in 2015-16, for implementation in 2016-17.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you very much. (interpretation ends) Before I move to the next person, we will take a 15-minute break.
>>Committee recessed at 12:30 and resumed at 12:48
Chairman (interpretation): We will now resume our committee meeting.
Environment. (interpretation ends) Branch Summary.
I-5. (interpretation) Following my list of names, Mr. Shooyook.
I would like to ask some questions to the Minister of Environment, our colleague’s angajuksakuluk.
I will be asking questions on the priorities for 2015-16.
In the business plan, one of the priorities for 2015-16 is to “Continue development of a grizzly bear management plan for Nunavut. (…) While Nunavut does not currently have the legislative ability under the Nunavut Act to regulate management of grizzly bears, a draft management plan is in development that will be based on voluntary compliance.”
Good afternoon. My Deputy Minister, Mr. Nirlungayuk, will respond to that question.
Thank you, Mr. Shooyook.
Maybe the Inuktitut wasn’t written properly, but I think he was referring to grizzly bears.
Mr. Shooyook (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Chairman.
It’s not written in my dialect.
I didn’t know that it had the “&i” sound instead of “li.”
It states here that they’re going to “regulate management of grizzly bears” and probably set up a quota. Is your department making plans to set up a quota system for grizzly bears?
Is that the plan of your department or is it some other kind of management plan for grizzly bears?
The minister has redirected to Mr. Nirlungayuk.
I thank Mr. Shooyook for that question. There are grizzly bears in the Kivalliq and Kitikmeot regions.
As a government, we have no management plans for grizzly bears. We are going to be working with the hunters and trappers organizations in those regions to possibly introduce a formal management plan for grizzly bears in Nunavut.
I also thank Mr. Nirlungayuk for that response.
As you’re developing grizzly bears, the polar bears are moving everywhere.
We can’t tell them where to go because they go wherever they please.
If they come to Baffin Island, what would happen? Would we be allowed to hunt grizzly bears or would that be forbidden by law?
I will refer this to my deputy minister. Thank you.
The Kitikmeot region has always had grizzly bears.