EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
You have to be able to represent your people.
I am making laws for my children and the younger generation.
Our elders and our children have to be represented and we can’t just approve something just because we feel that it should be approved.
We have to think of our people out there.
In regards to Bill 12, I feel that we have only been a government for four years and this legislation has been about for quite some time because we are the first term members and all of a sudden we want to pass this kind of legislation right away.
I remember in 1999 when we had a meeting in the cadet hall and when we would go outside to take a break once in a while and some people would come to us and shake our hands.
There was an elder.
He asked me where I came from and I said Gjoa Haven and my name is Puqiqnak and then he said he’s from Hall Beach and he said he remembers all things that I’ve talked about in the House.
We expect to be able to do the right thing and to help the people out there who have elected us but he did not want us to fast track any legislation because this is the very first time that Members of the Legislature has been elected.
They wanted us to take our time to produce good legislation for the people of Nunavut and not to hurry through with the legislation and I always remember that.
Bill 12 is good because it’s going to give everybody equal rights but at the same time it would go against the principles of Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit because if we’re going to allow same sex marriage, it’s going to go against Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit.
We don’t have that kind of thing because when our children were very small, there were arranged marriages.
It is not practised anymore.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman for giving me the opportunity to speak.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you. Mr. Netser.
First of all, I’d like to acknowledge the presence of the elders and you followed along with Mr. Puqiqnak’s sayings where traditionally, couples were arranged when they were children.
So I stand here today and praise the elders for their knowledge.
Mr. Chairman, as the newest member of this House, I am feeling confused seeing this legislation because the smaller communities were not consulted, communities such as Coral Harbour and Chesterfield Inlet.
The government and our Premier stated that there was consultation with eight communities.
However, Nunavut has 28 communities and they are proud of their government.
We are trying to introduce legislation without any consultation and this is not acceptable.
When Bill 35 was introduced, the Wildlife Act, all the communities in Nunavut were consulted as this Bill is important to Inuit.
Bill 12 is also an important piece of legislation but without any consultation I feel this is dangerous to me Mr. Chairman.
(interpretation ends) Mr. Chairman, we are often told in this House that we need to deal with things immediately in order to catch up to the rest of the country.
In other cases we are told that we have not made progress in certain areas because we are still a young territory, with a very young government, only four years old.
In this case, Mr. Chairman, I think that rushing into these areas simply to be able to say that we also have a Human Rights Laws is not the right way to go.
Mr. Chairman, the other Provinces and Territories have had a lot more time than we have had to bring forward legislation to suit their needs and values.
I believe, Mr. Chairman, we need to spend more time to do the right job and do the right thing.
Mr. Chairman, I just mentioned values, and I want to state clearly for the record that my opposition to this Bill is not based on hatred, unlike my friend Jack Anawak mentioned earlier for anyone or any group.
I did not want to see anybody hurt or discriminated.
(interpretation) I have not seen women with women being discriminated against at work Mr. Chairman.
They are not treated in that manner up here.
People are proud of them up here, they work well.
They are provided with housing from our cold harsh arctic environment.
(interpretation ends) Nevertheless the laws we pass, reflect our values, whether Members agree with me or not, they do.
The fundamental law of Canada, the Charter of Rights and Freedoms, recognizes, recognizes, Mr. Jack Anawak, recognizes the supremacy of God in the very first sentence.
It begins by stating, “Whereas Canada is founded upon principles that recognize the supremacy of God, and the rule of law.”
I believe that the laws we pass in Nunavut must also reflect our values
(interpretation) and to include Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit in the process as people feel that it is an important tool.
We are proud and we are happy with Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit.
(Interpretation ends) Mr. Chairman, I am frankly concerned that while we may pass this Bill today, which I hope we do not, we do not know what will become before us tomorrow.
The issue of adoption comes to mind.
Mr. Chairman, I agree that the Government should not force people to live their lives in a certain way. However, I also believe that we, Mr. Chairman, we as a society have the right not to be forced by any one group into giving explicit legitimacy and endorsement of anybody’s life or their lifestyles.
Mr. Chairman, I will not support this Bill.
Next on my list, we have Enoki, Alakannuark, and Havioyak.
You can call me whatever you want today.
Now the time has come and this was introduced at our session in Pangnirtung and it has all of it in the back of our minds the whole time and I am glad it is here.
Now we can finally air our thoughts and a good debate is always welcome in the House.
This Bill’s intent is very good and today we know that, that all of the legislation that we have passed through this House have been written.
We thought we had problems that we have had to deal with and a lot of the legislation was not to protect our rights.
It feels like the laws are imposed on us.
They tell us how to live our life when we, as Inuit, can live without any laws like we have for thousands of years.
The laws have, at times, become a disadvantage to the people because a lot of times they are no use to us whatsoever and yet we are always being told that we should be an open and accountable Government and we are.
I do not know how many people in Nunavut who are tired of being intimidated and why do we need the new legislation so that we can protect those people who are at a disadvantage?
There is already Federal legislation for the protection of human rights and why are we, as Nunavummiut are trying to make new legislation, which is exactly like the Federal legislation.
Why do we need to recognize our rights through this legislation, when in fact, they are already recognized through the Charter of Rights.
And so, that is very hard to grasp for me as an Inuk.
There was some comments made earlier that Inuit were always nice people, no matter what kind of person you are, that they will always be nice and inviting and welcoming to you.
But Inuit do have more important needs and there were a lot of mistreatment of Inuit in the past and then there are also legends that talk about the mistreatment of people, but which end with the triumph over evil and the redemption of the mistreated.
My Colleague stated earlier, I did not agree with him that Inuit have always been mistreated.
Yes, we are well aware of that and so, our ancestors never even had or understood the concept of same sex couples because I’ve never heard of any legends or any stories of any of my ancestors that would have been in a same sex relationship and so I do not believe in this Bill and I don’t believe we should be legislating this type of activity.
As Inuit, this is not our way of life.
I agree with Mr. Puqiqnak’s statements regarding the treatment and giving equal rights to everybody.
Yes, I do like the intent of the Bill where it is not to discriminate anyone and if this Bill is passed, then maybe I could agree with his comments but because the people of Nunavut do not understand the intent of this Bill whatsoever, we shouldn’t be enacting this type of Bill without getting prior consultation with the people of Nunavut.
I can say for sure that if there is no Bill like this, we have another to fall back on.
The people are saying we’re not passing this piece of legislation so that we can seem unwelcoming to those people.
We welcome any type of people into Nunavut and if anyone says that they are being discriminated against, then they can fall back and use the federal legislation for their protection.
So, why are we trying to enact this legislation for Nunavut?
If we’re going to be a territory, which will welcome same sex relationships with a small territory with less than 30 thousand people, are we over regulating ourselves?
Our Coral Harbour Member who stated, there was a hunter in Coral Harbour who wanted to use Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit for traditional hunting and he was denied because it was over legislated and when this was introduced, we had a whole bunch of submissions and we were told that Inuit in Nunavut were in support of the Bill but they haven’t been informed about the contents of this Bill at all.
This Bill’s intent is very good but I don’t think we should be legislating in welcoming those types of relationships and I don’t even want to see them here in Nunavut.
I don’t want to see openly gay people walking around our streets.
It’s less apparent when lesbians are together but Manitok’s father made a statement on CBC radio that we shouldn’t be discussing this topic.
Yes, this, we shouldn’t even be discussing and I say this because I’m representing the views of Igloolik and Hall Beach: they are all in relationships and I don’t see any same sex relationships and if there is, there are maybe two or three.
I don’t care if those people do not vote for me next time around in the election.
Those are the comments I wanted to make because those are my views and I think we working too hastily on this Bill.
We have stated time and again in the House that we should use Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit in the process.
We should recognise Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit and recognise the rights of Inuit.
We don’t need a piece of paper saying okay we’re going to recognise Inuit Qaujimajatuqangit through this process.
The Government of Nunavut has Human Resource Policies that say the protection of different peoples and that you need a piece of paper in order to get that recognition in order to get employment with the government.
That is totally against our beliefs as Inuit.
I will not be supporting this Bill; I’m not shy to say that in front of the public if anybody says derogatory words about me, it doesn’t matter because I wouldn’t be here if man and woman were not together.
If there’s a community set up for same sex couples how are they going to reproduce; they are going to die off eventually.
Fifty years from now perhaps this community would be eradicated because they cannot reproduce.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you Mr. Irqittuq.
Next on my list is, we are on general comments right now and as Ovide stated we have ten minutes for each Member to make general comments and you can go over that since we allowed the Member to go over the time allowed.
And I would also like to thank you for giving me the opportunity for making my statement.
I can see that we have many of our Iqaluit elders here in the House.
I’m starting to think that when we were elected, we were elected by the people out there and since now that we are sitting in the House it seems like we have shunned those people who have voted us into the House.
We are no longer representing our people if we will be supporting this Bill.
I am an elder, I am one of the elders and I’m making my own comments.
I can smile and also acknowledge the elder who is sitting in the witness table and the other elders in the gallery.
Bill 12, the Human Rights Act sounds good in principle.
Even if this Bill isn’t enacted it will eventually come back into the House and be debated again and we cannot stop any individual from their sexual preference.
We are a friendly territory and we are an open territory.
But one thing that I cannot shun is the people who put me in this chair; they are standing behind me and I am their elected spokesperson.
I want to be the one to make decisions for them; I came here to represent the people in my riding.
I have to keep in mind the needs and the wishes of the people who put me here and I will not support this Bill if the people in my riding oppose it.
If I shun my people, I would see it as being a parent who is asked a question by a child and then just turns around and slaps them.
We could reconsider these types of Bills only after we have made a solid foundation for Nunavut.
We have been here for a little over four years, but it feels like we just were elected yesterday.
This has been an extremely rapid phase.
I do know that there is a misunderstanding out there but it is not a tradition to accept gays and lesbians or the issue of same sex marriages; it is something that came from the south.
I want to reassure the people out there that I ‘m not opposed to anybody by race or colour but when it comes to this, it is something that I cannot accept.
The reason why I’m saying that is that we have to deliberate on these types of issues only after Nunavut has itself on its feet.
We haven’t even fully considered this Bill.
We had a meeting here on this Bill but we didn’t go to any of the communities to consult with the people.
There is a misunderstanding out there.
I would like to say that I will be opposing this Bill.
I’ll make a short comment on this to be able to participate in the discussions that are happening here.
It’s getting late in the evening.
I haven’t forgotten what I said earlier on.
Two men or two ladies, if they are to be married, it is not the way of Inuit culture.
That’s not Inuit tradition.
This is what I mentioned.
If this is not our tradition, why are we pushing this issue?
This piece of legislation, to accept it or to not accept it, this is what we’re discussing today.
I’ve also mentioned, someone had mentioned from Kugluktuk, because he was discriminated by the government, he ran into problems.
This is what he said, where am I to go now because I’m discriminated against by government or others.
I want to say that somebody has mistreated me.
I want to tell someone and say how can this mistreatment by government or others, how can it be rectified?
He also mentioned the issue of fair practise.
Maybe we’ll go and see someone to bring this up but to date, he hasn’t had a response.
This piece of Legislation that we are putting together, working on, it is for those who are having a hard time, maybe that is, maybe this is a way to go.
This is a road that they can take.
Put two men, two ladies issues aside and let us say those Inuit that are having hard times and having problems, will have an avenue and maybe today, things can be rectified that are of that nature.
I want to mention that yes; I have looked at this document but have not fully understood it.
They mentioned the issue of sexual orientation; Inuit tradition was not that way.
That is why I am not happy with this issue of sexual orientation, what is it?
Because of not knowing this issue and my thoughts coming from my heart and thinking of those people in Kugluktuk, maybe those ones who need an avenue because I have been mistreated, there is an avenue for me to rectify the situation.
And on the other hand, same sex marriages will become a problem also.
But in this piece of Legislation, unless things are made very clearly, I will ask the Minister what does this imply, the sexual orientation issue or the wording?
When we mention these kinds of wording, Inuit tradition does not cover those and looking at this piece of Legislation, I have problems with it and I will be asking the Minister some questions for clarification.
There are people out there who are listening and or are looking at this Legislation.
There are many questions that are left unanswered; this is how it is for me.
I will be asking questions because I want to make sure that I understand.
As Uriash mentioned earlier and I, who put me here?
When I hear this from those in Kugluktuk, I am just a voice for them.
I will be their voice and be asking questions.
What is this piece, what does this say, what does this mean?
And we will be making things clearer.
They have also mentioned to me, Donald, if you do not fully understand, do not say yes or no.
There are questions that need to be answered as for me, my thoughts, if people in Kugluktuk did not put me here, then I would have my own thoughts.
But because I was put here by those in Kugluktuk, I want to represent them.
They have said to me, make things clearer, ask questions before you vote.
I do not want to further confuse the people, but I would like to look at the intent of the Bill, this Bill gives equality to the people of Nunavut.
I would like to ask if you would let me, Mr. Chairman, talk about the people who put me in here and to also touch up on some of their thoughts.
This is a Bill for Nunavut, for the people that we represent.
It is not going to be directed to anybody outside Nunavut.
I will not say I am speaking on behalf of a religious body, or say that I am a religious person; I cannot say, because I am religious, that person is wrong according to this legislations.
We all know that only on Judgement Day, we will know whether we did right or wrong.
It is not today.
And even if I try to use that, it would be wrong.
The Lord is Lord and only on Judgement Day will we find out where we stand and where we are going to go.
That will be the day of Judgement.
Today, Mr. Chairman, I will be very open and frank on this issue.
We have to stop discrimination today.
We have to provide a brighter future for our children, grand children, and great grand children.
As legislators we are already hearing opposition, we are hearing people that we represent do not know what to make of this at this moment.
We are saying that the people out there are misinformed and probably the reason is that there is no communication between the Member of the Legislative Assembly and the people in their community.
I went to Pangnirtung to talk to the people in my riding, and we also heard that this Bill was first introduced a year ago.
I went to see the people of Pangnirtung, and today I stand here with the direction provided from my constituents.
However, when I am asked to vote I am unsure as my constituents have two opinions.
Mr. Chairman, if we say in the House that we are doing the wrong thing, then we have put a stop to this Bill.
We can’t do that.
We also heard that we have to vote representing the people who put us in this House.
In that light, and looking at the Human Rights Act, we should not base it on that.
What we hear out there is contradictory and we are confusing the people out there.
We have to look at the intent of the Act and we do know that there has to be equality and protection to all the people of Nunavut.
As this is a very important Bill, I know that some of us have asked the people out there which way we should vote.
As I said, Mr. Chairman, if this Bill is going to be put to a vote, I will know which way to go.
There are some people who are saying that we should delay this.
I do not want to see a delay in this Bill.
If we put a delay on it for another five years and then enact it in five years time, then we will finally find out that there has to be an amendment done again, five years later and the intent of the Bill would have lost its meaning.
I’m very pleased Mr. Chairman, that during Committee of the Whole, that I’m able to voice my thoughts on this Bill as the Member of the Legislative Assembly for Pangnirtung.
The reason why I wanted to voice my opinion is because this Bill promotes equality and fairness and we hear that there are many people out there that oppose this Bill and the rights of gays and lesbians.
That is not the intent of this Bill.
This Bill promotes equality for Nunavummiut and I’m more concerned about my children, my grandchildren because they are our strength.
But then again, even though that’s the case, there are a lot of households and children and grandchildren that need that protection.
I don’t see how we should deny them the protection.
Our children and our grandchildren need protection.
Do we want to deny them the protection?
This is something that I would be very embarrassed about as a government.
I would be more concerned about my family who live under our roof.
There are our children and our grandchildren who will be taking over our place in the future.
The people have the right to live their lives the way they want.
This Bill, even though I don’t get a 100 percent support for it, the support for this Bill was outweighed by those who did not support it because they understood the intent of the Bill in promoting equality.
Chairman (interpretation): Would you like to take a break or did you want to keep going.
Okay, we’ll keep going.
There will be other things that we’ll have to deal with.
Mr. Nutarak, Ms. Thompson and Mr. Kattuk.
Mr. Nutarak (interpretation): Very briefly Mr. Chairman, because even if I make a lengthy speech, it’s not going to fix anything.
When we were dealing with the Education Act, we went to several communities to find out what the wishes of the people of Nunavut were and with Bill 35, the Wildlife Act, again, we went to several communities to get a feel of what the thoughts of the people were about the Bills that we were considering.
Bill 12, that we’re currently discussing, I can say that I don’t know much about the contents of this Bill because I am not a Member of the Committee that considered Bill 12.
I can say that the residents of Pond Inlet share the same opinion.
I hear bits and pieces about this Bill now and then.
I can say that I’m just as misinformed or just as ignorant about this Bill as many of people of Nunavut.
I think this is the first time that we’re publicly discussing this Bill and in just an hour I have found out more about this Bill than an hour ago.
I would like to know where the people of Pond Inlet stand before I make a decision on this Bill.
And the other issue I wanted to bring up was gays and lesbians and there are some people who are saying that this is not part of Inuit tradition and there are Inuktitut terms for gays and lesbians; they have names because of course there must have been gays and lesbians a long, long time ago; we didn’t even know they had specific terminology, but there is.
I will oppose Bill 12 unless there are further consultations with communities.
There are many people in Iqaluit who said that they weren’t really clear on the legislation right now the way it is because they were not consulted.
I thank them for attending the House tonight because they too are constituents of some Members here.
I think everybody knows what my stand is on this legislation.
I have been misquoted on Nunatsiaq News and in the media saying that I oppose the Bill with reference to same sex issues.
In 1981 the Federal Government of Canada already dealt with the sexual orientation portion of the legislation and in Inuktitut it states wanting to have a partner whether it is a male or a female, at least there is terminology for it now.
But sometimes even the English terminology is not quite clear.
If I want to have two husbands or if I want to have six husbands or if I want to live with all females, or if I am a man and I want to have 4 wives or do I want to go with younger men when I am an older woman just to be able to be with them, to me that’s what I see as sexual orientation.
Sexual orientation is misunderstood now and has lost meaning.
If it was in the legislation I would not approve the Bill, but because it is here I will not support it.
(interpretation ends) In 1981 the Government of Canada rejected the terms of sexual orientation because they could not define it and we know that.
Up to today it has not been defined properly except by the gay community.
We have been told that the Bill is very good; I believe that it is very good except for that clause, sexual orientation.
The committee has not done a very good job consulting, they did that for the Elections Act, the same committee, and they travelled all over the place with the Elections Act.