EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
The minister indicated that the students in the FANS program, the parents, and those other people would be happy with what’s coming out. What about the students who currently aren’t eligible for the FANS program? Will they be happy when that message comes out?
I think the members know that sometimes, I go on with too many long answers. I’m trying to keep my answers short because of the situation with the line-up in the COW, so I don’t want to get into a big explanation.
Mr. Chairman, just very quickly, again the issue with the ABE students that the member talks about is that when they’re involved in an upgrading program, for example, then they’re not FANS eligible because it’s not a certificate or a diploma program. So we had to look at some type of a mechanism around that. We have other avenues of funding for them and that includes Kakivak, and so on, and many of our students have been able to access that.
There are also other monies that we’re able to help out with to provide that training.
That’s about all I can say about that right now.
I think the minister has said enough about that right now and I thank him for his comments.  Another thing, Mr. Chairman, the minister indicated that the number of apprentices throughout the territory has taken a significant increase and I think that’s a good sign on that.
Given that, my question is: under the Apprenticeship Programs, the funding for that has actually decreased by about $21,000. If they’re seeing such an increase in apprentices throughout the territory, why is there a decrease in that line item?
That’s just a line item change to decrease the salaries to their actual budget adjustment.
Whose salaries?
Are those salaries that are just going out; the money that’s being paid to the apprentices or to the staff within the department?
Hon. Ed. Picco: The program administrative staff amounts for the budget adjustment.
Also under the area there is Adult and Trades Education in which the minister said that there have been a lot more uptake and they’re really moving forward in these areas, but there’s a $60,000 decrease in that budget.
I’m just wondering if the minister could explain why.
Can the member clarify where he sees the $60,000 decrease so that we can look for it in the administrative files?
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you, Minister Picco. (interpretation ends) I believe it’s in the business plan on page G-21, if I’m correct.
Actually, I think we have identified the amount that the member is talking about. We did speak earlier about the $20,000 amount, which is the budget adjustment and I think we clarified that.
I think the amount the member spoke about was $60,000. Is that correct?
Just on G-21, the first question I asked was about the $21,000 decrease under Apprenticeship Programs. The second question I asked about the $60,000 decrease was in the Adult and Trades Education on the same page.
Hopefully that clarifies it for the minister.
Hon. Ed. Picco: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate the member’s clarification.
Again, for brevity, a $5,000 decrease adjusts salary to actual benefit calculation, and then a decrease of $75,000, which was a permanent reallocation from our ABE programming to Literacy.
That was one of the concerns raised by the community to put more money into literacy, so that’s what we did and that was to Literacy Region Two. At the same time, there was $20,000 added, which was an internal fund reallocation to ABE Reg 4 from the Income Support Day Care Subsidy.
The amount comes out to be the -$60,000.
It’s actually not a decrease in the line item or to the apprentices; it’s under that budget item but there have been some internal reallocations, for example, from ABE to Literacy and that’s something that we did hear from the committee.
I know that when you look at the next page here, there is a $75,000 increase to Literacy, but he said he took it away from ABE. I’m just wondering what cuts have been made with the Adult Basic Education program or funding if that’s where they took it from. Where did they cut with that $75,000 in that program?
No, there wasn’t a cut in the program. Again, it’s an increase in Literacy of $75,000, which was a permanent reallocation from the Adult and Trades Education, or ATE, for Adult Basic Education and that was for region two, and that again, went to Literacy. We’re trying to make up some of the cuts that were made to the Literacy Board that the member and everyone are familiar with.
So that’s the difference.
We did an internal permanent reallocation for ABE to Literacy at $75,000 and that was part of the $60,000 we talked about, and then the increase in Literacy, which was the $75,000 permanent reallocation from Adult and Trades Education, ABE Region Two, to Literacy.
I don’t understand the minister.
He says it was a permanent transfer from ABE of $75,000 to Literacy. I am aware of all the cuts that have happened to literacy, but it looks like there has been a cut to ABE at $75,000. If that’s what the minister is indicating, that’s what I was questioning.
I think, Mr. Chairman, I made a typo there; ATE is Adult and Trades Education, to ABE Region Two G&C. What it is is it’s an increase of $75,000 to the ABE programming.
At the top, when we talked about earlier, the $60,000, that was the minus $60,000, I said that there was a $75,000 permanent reallocation from ABE to the Literacy, and that was for the literacy programs and council.
Then what we did to offset that is we actually took from Adult Trades and Education, where we had some extra funding, and replaced the $75,000 so they equal each other out.  The member is correct because when you look at the top line, which is the -$60,000, we have explained that one, and then the $75,000 plus and that evens the $75,000 decreased from ABE to Literacy, and then we would go back and we would take it from another core item area.
So what happens is, Mr. Chairman, in the budget process, you have several different categories within one line item and that’s what we have done. We have shifted monies from one where we might have had a surplus in the past, we were able to use those monies and put it into an area where we thought there could be more drawdown on it. So that’s what has occurred here.
I know when we look at the grants and contributions for ABE, there’s actually nothing this year in the revised main estimates and there’s nothing for last year’s or this current fiscal year, but the initial amount was $75,000. The minister, I believe, indicated that that’s a permanent reallocation to literacy programs.
Is the responsibility to do what that $75,000 did for Adult Basic Education now rests under literacy programs?
I’ll ask Deputy Minister Okpik to clarify on the transfer from the ABE to Literacy and the amounts. Again, I want to assure the member and the members that we’re not ‘Robbing Peter to pay Paul,’ as it were; we’re rebalancing the amounts within the budget framework.
I would like to elaborate on the $60,000 decrease that the minister just talked about.
There was a $5,000 decrease to pay our staff from steps one to six, but when they’re going to skip a year, we have to adjust their pay scales. We have to set their pay grid when we’re going into a new year.
The budget has also decreased by $75,000, which is from the regions. The ABE/Literacy was used for community services. It has been moved to Grants and Contributions, but it’s still going to be used for ABE/Literacy.
To reiterate, we moved it under Grants and Contributions so we could still fund the Literacy Council. I hope that explains it.
I’ll have to decipher it in the Hansard tomorrow I guess.
My last question before I run out of time for the minister or his officials is in this area, I believe it’s in grants and contributions, there is a little over $17 million set aside for Nunavut Arctic College, which is over $1 million increase from the amount they have listed in their business plan that was budgeted last year for this current fiscal year.
I’m just wondering if the minister could give us a breakdown of where the extra funds were going to at the college.
I’ll ask the President of the Nunavut Arctic College to answer that question.
Those funds are set aside for the initial development of the curriculum, then piloting it.
So these are all curriculum development, teaching resources, and hiring the staff to both develop the curriculum and to teach the students when they start.
Chairman: Thank you, Mr. Vandermeulen.
Before we go to our next person to ask questions, we’ll take a 15-minute break.
>>Committee recessed at 14:48 and resumed at 15:09
Chairman (Mr. Barnabas): I call the committee meeting back to order. (interpretation) Mr. Peterson, you wanted to ask some questions.
I wanted to get some clarification on some answers earlier with respect to the role of the department in working with the Department of Economic Development and Transportation on the mine training. I didn’t quite understand what your role is and what you’re trying to accomplish there.
What we’re trying to do there, in working collaboratively with our sister department, is to move forward with part of the Mine Training Strategy and it’s not a mine training facility; we’re talking actually the programs that would be offered, for example, in the member’s community of Cambridge Bay.
I was kind of confused by the terminology.
As the minister is aware, the Kitikmeot has lobbied for quite a few years for a mine training centre or facility.
Initially, we attempted to secure the Lupin mine site. So if there was a mine training site, we would certainly want to be considered for something like that.
The minister’s answer leads me to my next question. He mentioned the Millwright Training Program earlier in an answer and I’m trying to understand what the role of the trade shop in Kiilinik High School is with respect to providing mine training.
How do you separate the role of the trade shop to provide training for high school students versus providing training for adults who want to work in the mining sector?
There are some generic qualities when we look at the training attributes of bringing forward some of the mine training programs that we’re talking about.
In this case, when we’re talking about the Millwright Program and having to focus on mine training, we’re able to deliver that program through the auspices of Nunavut Arctic College in Cambridge Bay.
What the extra work that we have done with the trade shop at the high school is to give us the opportunity to have that auxiliary facility to use also in conjunction with the training program.
A couple years ago, the minister and I met with some mining companies about their requirements for the training of current and future employees, and the minister had mentioned that facility would be available.
We got off to a rocky start, if the minister recalls; it was delayed. I don’t think the facility was completed until the end of August of 2007.
Can the minister tell me what the situation is now with respect to providing mine training courses through that trade shop in the Kiilinik High School?
There are a lot of exciting things happening in the Kitikmeot with the MOU we actually have signed that we talked about actually in the House yesterday, and also with the KEDC, so that’s continuing. Work is continuing on the program development of the Millwright Program and the other mining related programs, so that’s occurring as we speak.
I was in Cambridge Bay with the member in the fall and the member is correct; the site work has been completed now in the facility in the school in Cambridge Bay. Several hundreds of thousands of dollars have been spent in that facility to upgrade it and provide some of the mechanics, the tools, and so on to provide the training.
I thank the minister but can the minister be more specific; can he tell me what courses and programs are being offered in that facility currently with respect to the mining sector in the Kitikmeot?
In the Kitikmeot region, the KIA, as well as the Kitikmeot Economic Development Commission, Miramar, Hope Bay, and the Nunavut Arctic College with Department of Education have signed off the MOU that we have talked about.
We’re working on, right now, the Introduction to Mining Program which will commence in Cambridge Bay and Kugluktuk this semester. There were some delays in commencing the program due to some of the curriculum revisions that we have been working on to make it more user-friendly, as it were, for Nunavut.
The college is partnering with KEDC as well as Newmont to use their staff as instructors for a portion of the delivery that we just talked about. As well, the Mineral Exploration Field Assistant Program is going to be delivered in Cambridge Bay and Kugluktuk, and we hope to partner with the mining companies so that the students can actually do a field practicum when they’re finished with prospective employers.
At the same time, we’re running a Camp Cook Program in Cambridge Bay, and again, that is to work with the mining companies because we have heard the need for extra resources to be put in place.
I wonder if the minister could give me a copy of what he was just referring to.
Can you commit to giving it to me, Mr. Minister?
The minister has mentioned, on a couple of occasions already, the Memorandum of Understanding, or MOU, when I heard the Minister’s Statement the other day.
Could you expand a bit on what that MOU is; who is involved, how it works, and how they provide support to the students?
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Peterson. Minister Picco.
Hon. Ed. Picco: I think, Mr. Chairman, the credit is due and the member has to take the credit on the MOU or if they would have an opportunity in the Kitikmeot. I did meet with the Miramar people and we talked about training opportunities.
And as a direct result of that, with the KEDC, we were able to work out this Training Memorandum of Understanding and an agreement with Miramar, who are a major player in the Kitikmeot and there are other players there also that we would like to use this as a template.  Basically, what we’re saying is that the Nunavut Arctic College and the Department of Education in the Kitikmeot, with our partners, Miramar and KEDC, would work together to facilitate training as well as work on some of the vocational programs that are needed for residents in the Kitikmeot region.
So that’s what we’re seeing and Miramar has said, “Look, we have staff that can be provided as instructors,” for example, and we would be able to use that expertise. We have the work sites where we will be able to do some on-the-site, or OJT, or on-the-job training programs, so that’s also there. We would be able to provide some of the academic side of things as well as some of the learning institutions.
Basically, that’s where we are.
The genesis of the MOU comes out of the meeting that we had in the Kitikmeot with Mr. Peterson and the mining companies.
I’m just wondering if the minister has given consideration to take a lead in establishing a Nunavut Mine Training Committee similar to what the Northwest Territories has - they have a Northwest Territories Mine Training Committee.
You could have a committee that all the stakeholders are involved in, not just the Department of Economic Development or Education but there could be the Department of Economic Development and Transportation and other government departments in there. Of course, you have the mining sector, the Kitikmeot Inuit Association, and other stakeholders that have an interest in mining.
So then you could fund that committee and then the committee could use their contacts across Canada and in the north to support the trainees once they come off the programs to find employment, and then additional training as they proceed in their careers.
Hon. Ed. Picco: I think the member has made a good point.
There are so many opportunities out there with the mining industry right now in Nunavut and my staff upstairs have been working at putting this in my calendar for April 8 and 10 here in Iqaluit, which is the Nunavut Mining Symposium, and during the Nunavut Mining Symposium here in Iqaluit on April 8 to10, the Department of Economic Development, as well as the Department of Education and Nunavut Arctic College are working together and discussing a territorial plan for delivering mine training.
I think that mine training roundtable, which is planned for the Nunavut Mining Symposium in Iqaluit here April 8 to10, 2008, will probably be the catalyst for what the member has suggested.
Minister Peterson.
I thank the minister for that; it’s good to hear.
I know, from reading the Economic Development and Transportation Business Plan, they have a statement in there that in the next five years, there will be 1,700 people hired for the mining sector. I think it could potentially be more but it’s going to take a lot of work to train the people for it, and then provide them with an ongoing training, and then to encourage and to continue in that career.
I think it will involve a lot of stakeholders and it would be good to get everybody around the table and sharing our ideas.
My next question, Mr. Chairman, is: in their priority for 2008, the minister’s saying that they’re going to “Continue to work on the development of mature high school diploma.”
Could the minister provide an update on the initiative that started last year and is it going to continue on this year?
We’re quite excited about this program and we had a chance to discuss it earlier in the committee.
I think Mr. Tootoo was asking questions on the mature graduation diploma that allows for students who, for whatever reason, were not able to complete high school at the usual age of 16, 17, or 18.
By combining the Mature High School Graduation Diploma with the equivalencies, which we have in place - the GED or the GED grade equivalent exams - we’re able to bring that diploma forward.
We’re still working on some of the curriculum and some of the credit areas of that.
So we hope to be in a position this fall to be able to begin to roll out that program.
At the same time, we still also have in place the GED diploma, which is nationally and internationally recognized. What we’re trying to suggest is that we would like to more of a Mature High School Graduation Diploma that would be more or less Nunavutized.
Mr. Peterson: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I thank the minister for that explanation.
Can the minister indicate how many mature adults that he thinks might be interested in a Mature High School Graduation Diploma?
We have looked at where the opportunities may be, but to move forward and do this will take time; you just can’t do it on a Monday afternoon and a Friday evening. It depends on if the person is working, not working, if they have a full-time job, are they a mother, so we don’t really have a firm guestimate of how many people would be eligible.
What we have said and what we have found out is that this is something that has come back to the department from our schools, some of our staff, and some of our career development people who suggested that there is some opportunity. We have looked into it and we believe it is, and as I said earlier, we would like to be in a position this fall to be able to roll it out, but again, it depends on some of the other work that we need to do.
If an adult had a Mature High School Graduation Diploma, if they wanted to continue their education and attend Arctic College, would that diploma allow them to get into the college courses?
I was just speaking to Mr. Vandermeulen from the college and Ms. Okpik. For any type of program that we’re going to put in place, we don’t want to give someone a certificate or a piece of paper for the sake of giving them a certificate or a piece of paper.
They need to be able to use that piece of paper and that’s the plan with the Mature High School Graduation Certificate.
We know that several businesses across the country, for example, will accept the GED. So we want to be able to do the same thing with this Mature High School Graduation Diploma that we’re working on.
I look forward to getting some further information on that as you develop it.
The next priority is to “Work with the Nunavut Housing Trust on region specific implementation strategies.” The word that jumped out at me was “region.”
Can the minister clarify what the differences are between the three regions with respect to the training that is required under the Nunavut Housing Trust?
Using the verbiage of regions is a bit of a misnomer. Basically, what we’re saying is when we’re talking about the housing trust, different communities are at different stages of construction because of the different timelines with sealift. So that’s what we were trying to point out on timelines and timeframes with the training that’s moving forward - late shipping, early shipping, and construction time schedules.
Perhaps, the minister could give us some details on what specific training initiatives they’re going to work on for the regions with respect to the Nunavut Housing Trust.
Hon. Ed. Picco: Part of what we’re doing under the Nunavut Housing Trust is to be able to ensure that if we’re going to build houses is to fly more people in at the community level and give them some of the basic skills and knowledge that they need so that you’re creating a house, like a legacy project with skilled employees being left behind.
We delivered ten pre-trades courses up until May 31, 2007 with the Nunavut Arctic College. We also have pre-trade courses for another 15 communities moving forward.
We have courses that are currently underway, for example, in the Kitikmeot, in Kugluktuk, and Taloyoak. In the Kivalliq, we have Repulse Bay, Coral Harbour, and Whale Cove. In the Baffin region, we have Igloolik, Pangnirtung, Clyde River, Hall Beach, and Sanikiluaq.
Those are a minimum of 12 weeks and a maximum of 14 weeks programming that are being run under the auspices of this. So we’re trying to increase not only local capacity but local training as well.
Mr. Peterson: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I thank the minister that answer.
Do the students who are working on these training courses get a certificate acknowledging their skills that they have learned and the training that they took?
When they finish that type of program, they would seek notification and accreditation of that program that they have received, so that may be a certificate.
Earlier today, I asked the Premier about how devolution negotiations were going here. I was concerned about the training that’s necessary to be ready for devolution when the agreement is signed.
So I’m wondering, minister, if the Department of Education or the Nunavut Arctic College is involved at all in the devolution discussions with respect to preparing Nunavummiut for technical types of jobs in the federal or territorial governments when the agreement is signed.
Yes, we are part of the Devolution Working Group.
I thank the minister; that’s good to know.
I also commented to the Premier that we’re probably going to require several millions of dollars to provide the training for our residents, and I’m thinking, starting right away and not starting four years from now when an agreement is signed.
Has the Department of Education estimated how much additional training funds will be required to undertake the training of 300 or 400 Nunavummiut for those jobs that will be created when the Devolution Agreement is signed?
We’re part of the working group, so we have input in some of these areas. It’s a bit premature right now to suggest how many jobs may or may not be available directly because of devolution. Those numbers, or those estimates, or those guesstimates have not come forward.
We would have to do it by job category and so on, so we haven’t done that. That would be part of the next rollout phase as the devolution talks continue.
I have been hearing figures in the 400 to 500 job range here and it’s for skilled individuals with technical skills that could work for all the different organizations, not just the Government of Nunavut but for the federal government, regional Inuit associations, and NTI.
To fill those positions, we’re going to have to have trained people and we need to start training them right away. I’m wondering if that message is being conveyed to the federal government.