EdinburghNLP/nunavut-hansard-plusplus huggingface dataset:
With respect to (interpretation ends) pilot project number one (interpretation) related to collection of arrears, it has been used to lower the figures in four communities throughout Nunavut. The communities in this pilot project are Arviat, Baker Lake, Kugluktuk, and (interpretation ends) Gjoa Haven (interpretation) where this pilot project was done in conjunction with them. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
Mr. Mikkungwak (interpretation): When you identified the communities for the pilot project, as the headquarters with the housing corporation, how have you provided assistance on this matter?
Hon. George Kuksuk (interpretation): Mr. Chairman, we’re talking about the pilot project and it’s for the four communities that are involved.
I don’t understand what kind of assistance the member is referring to. Are asking about financial support or assistance through associations? Which kind of support from the corporation are you asking about?
I would like you to clarify your question. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
Seeing that Arviat, Baker Lake, Gjoa Haven, and Kugluktuk are pilot projects for rental arrears collections and whatnot, how has the headquarter staff of the Nunavut Housing Corporation supported these communities in the pilot project?
Hon. George Kuksuk (interpretation): Mr. Chairman, we’ve had an agreement with the local housing authority and we are working together through the headquarters of the housing corporation. There are face-to-face meetings to see how it is going on an ongoing basis.
We are working with them and we are keeping on top of that in terms of the pilot project on collecting arrears. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
In reference to that, will it vary by each of these four communities as to the length of the pilot project?
Hon. George Kuksuk (interpretation): Mr. Chairman, if I understood the question, the four communities are going to go ahead with the collection of arrears and we have identified these communities as a pilot project. We are just going to continue until its timeframe has ended under this project. It’s a pilot project and these are the four communities that were identified.
If I am understandable, in terms of how it would (interpretation ends) vary (interpretation) or to which end as to where you determine where the stopping point lies, is that what you were asking about or were you referring to the local arrears? If the community arrears are removed from the books, perhaps it is laid out in our documents.
I don’t see it here.
Nonetheless, if the arrears are paid off, it would be taken off that community’s books and it would showcase the proper management of that community in dealing with arrears.
As you know, we are looking at various communities in the same situation.
We want to have more communities taking on this initiative. (interpretation ends) But yes, (interpretation) when they run out of arrears under the pilot project, they would be removed from that project (interpretation ends) Thank you.
The reason for my queries on this subject is because it is obvious that some tenants have arrears and they aren’t all working. Some tenants with arrears are on income support or old age pension plans while some private homeowners moved to public housing due to arrears.
The reason why I am asking about this (interpretation ends) pilot project (interpretation) is to determine the timeline for the completion of the initiative.
Some people’s arrears don’t look like they will ever decrease without attaining employment or they wouldn’t change much.
Even so, if the tenant is on income support, would they receive assistance from the Department of Family Services to bring down their debt under this collections policy? With this being a (interpretation ends) pilot project, (interpretation) are there any new (interpretation ends) collections policy (interpretation) in the works?
However, what we can state here is that using the collections policy allows tenants to pay down their debt and this is quite noticeable.
That is our first impression and as a matter of fact, we have made plans to add up to eight more communities under this pilot project, as it is (interpretation ends) successful, (interpretation) if I said it in English.
This project is running quite well and we want to add (interpretation ends) more communities (interpretation) to this (interpretation ends) pilot project (interpretation) and include them in it. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
I thank the minister for the positive response, seeing that it is an effective collection with these pilot projects.
What are the key elements of the LHO deficit recovery plans?
As to the actual details he is referring to, I personally have no idea of the contents.
If you don’t mind, I would like Ms. Kimball to respond to the member’s question, Mr. Chairman. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
When we work with the LHOs to develop a deficit recovery plan, we look at where they are spending money and relative to what they are funded.
They are funded for a specific number of employees and we compare that to how many employees they actually have to perform the work. That might be a strategy if they have actually employed more people than what they are actually funded to have.
We also work with them on collections. If they can improve their collection rates, it can also draw down their deficits.
We look at other costs that they’re incurring and if there are ways that they could save money there to incur less money than what they’re budgeted for, anything we can do to have them come in under budget to offset.
Generally, there’s a reason why they have created a deficit that is within control. If it’s something uncontrollable, then we would deal with that a different way, but if it’s something that they can control, then we work with them to bring it back into control.
Chairman (Mr. Enook)(interpretation): Thank you, Ms. Kimball. Mr. Mikkungwak.
My colleague was querying the minister on Inuit traditional knowledge.
This position’s IQ advice would be meaningful because some of the current units under construction are facing the prevailing winds.
Based on Inuit Qaujimajatuqangat and the prospect of IQ incorporation into the Nunavut Housing Corporation, with a position specific to this, the application of IQ related to local conditions and of not facing the local prevailing winds, such as in our case… .
The north winds are the prevailing winds in Baker Lake. The blizzards tend to originate from the north and if the units face north, this automatically increases the fuel needs of the unit.
That is where IQ would be absolutely valuable to your operations and this position would benefit from Inuit Qaujimajatuqangat particularly related to the proper placement of buildings.
Will this position be responsible for decisions like this?
This is part of what we, the Nunavut Housing Corporation, design, including the placement of units and the face of the units.
Yes, I concur with the comments you voiced, as we have heard on many occasions of either the doors or windows facing the sun to take advantage of the natural light to lower lighting needs. These are the kind of issues we have heard. Other issues brought up as advice from the local associations hit upon every aspect of our operations and, where it is feasible, to use that local advice.
However, there are other obstacles we can also run into in the municipal built-up areas, as the lots are under the municipal administrations, and sometimes lot selection is limited.
We also have to review the lots to determine if the lot size fits our construction project.
Invariably, the lot landscaping or placement determines where the unit will face because we have to fit the unit into the lot.
This advice would be useful both to the hamlets and the Department of CG&S, as sometimes they are inadvertently the obstacle to how we want to construct the project, as they have to work with the municipal block lands and land development.
NHC isn’t involved in the aspect of municipal lands management, as CG&S and the hamlets are the final arbiters of the development of their municipal lands. (interpretation ends) Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I want to move to another topic related to the Nunavut Housing Corporation (interpretation ends) headquarters. (interpretation) I queried the responsible minister about this (interpretation ends) new rent scale (interpretation) and in my questions, I asked about the impacts to the housing corporation. (interpretation ends) The new rent scale, I believe, was to remove some disincentives to employment.
With the new rent scale, has it had an impact?
With respect to his question on the (interpretation ends) rent scale, (interpretation) it was a new scale when it was first implemented for the monthly debt repayment.
I can read (interpretation ends) that a small number of high income tenants experienced a rental increase as a result. (interpretation) There were fewer units that saw an increase in their new rent scale, Mr. Chairman.
Am I understandable here?
With this new rent scale and seeing that Baker Lake is one of the communities that have a pilot project, have you seen an increase in tenant arrears go up or go down with their rental arrears?
This pilot was just commenced recently and it is in its first year. We have to complete an (interpretation ends) audit (interpretation) on the pilot project and perhaps as early as June 2015, we may have a clearer picture of the trends. (interpretation ends) Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Mikkungwak said that he was done.
At this time, we will take a 10-minute break. We will come back.
I still have a number of names on my list.
We will take a 10-minute break. I believe the (interpretation ends) Hon. Minister (interpretation) needs to take a break.
>>Committee recessed at 17:37 and resumed at 17:49
Chairman (interpretation): Let us reconvene our review.
Members, an idea just came to me to see if it will be easier and more consistent to move to page L-3 in the English version, with the separate pages N-IV-2 and N-IV-3, including 4 and 5.
They are separate documents, but they are all contained as items within page L-3.
If we were to not jump back and forth, it may allow for a smoother review by remaining on a singular page, if members can just identify the other documents under this page where you wish to ask questions on. If members agree that we can remain on page L-3 to ask questions and if anyone has any questions to start with, please raise your hand.
At this time, based on the listing of names of members with four names remaining and if any other members have questions, please raise your hand.
We will remain on page L-3 and members can identify the item within the page they are referring to.
We will now proceed in that manner and as we move onwards, let us move on to the next name, Mr. Joanasie.
I will start with your departmental business plan on page NHC-5 under policy and planning. The figures listed there show the largest increases out of the total package. This is practically double the increase in comparison to the others, increasing from $659,000 to $1,265,000 in your latest figures.
My first question is: why is there an increase?
I thank the member for that observant question regarding the reason for this increase.
There are going to be (interpretation ends) new PYs (interpretation) that have to be funded and that is the primary reason for the increase. There are 21 new positions within this line item.
That is the main reason for that increase.
Mr. Joanasie (interpretation): Thank you. (interpretation ends) I wanted to ask on the research that NHC undertakes regarding social, economic, and cultural impacts that housing has.
Is this an ongoing initiative?
Hon. George Kuksuk (interpretation): Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I would like Mr. Brown to respond to that question, Mr. Chairman, if it’s okay with you.
Mr. Brown: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Given the severity of the housing crisis, we need a lot more data, a lot more information on the different areas, and so we are always looking for research projects that we can tap into that can help us get those answers that we are looking for.
A specific example that we are involved in right now, in collaboration with the Department of Health, is on a project with University of Laval looking at the impact of new housing on tenants that were living in formerly overcrowded conditions. The importance of this kind of research is to justify more funding and more increases in funding for new housing.
We need to be able to quantify with actual numbers to be able to say that the impact of this new housing has this effect.
That is one project that we are looking at.
Mr. Joanasie (interpretation): Thank you. I would also like to thank him for the response. (interpretation ends) I see that it is being conducted through Laval University.
I’m wondering what communities you are doing this research in.
It’s part of that, so I would like to ask Mr. Brown to respond, if it’s okay with you.
We are targeting the program in six communities in Nunavut. I believe there are Kugluktuk, Taloyoak, Rankin Inlet, Whale Cove, perhaps, Clyde River, and Iqaluit.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Brown.
Mr. Joanasie (interpretation): Thank you. (interpretation ends) Thank you for that response.
I want to move on to public housing, if I may.
There are over 5,000 public housing units that the housing corporation manages for public housing.
I’m wondering: do you have figures of how many people live in those 5,000 units?
For all of Nunavut, the total number of people living in units is 19,138 people at this time. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
Mr. Joanasie (interpretation): Thank you. (interpretation ends) It was touched upon about the arrears. (interpretation) In regard to the collection of arrears, I believe the arrears are over $25 million.
I would like to ask: have you been collecting the $25 million since 1999? If you can explain that further as to how long these arrears have been accumulating.
I thank him for that question.
According to our understanding, when it was the Northwest Territories before division, the housing corporation started taking that responsibility.
That is the extent of the response I can provide.
Another issue that I want to refer to is perhaps just to voice my support for the comments and questions from my colleagues related to the collection of arrears from tenants.
I would urge the department to consider every option they possibly can, especially the Nunavut Housing Corporation to meet our needs. Now, this $25 million arrear figure is for this year and I wonder if your department has any forecasts for next year.
Additionally, another piece of interesting information I heard from one of the responses earlier is there was mention of a figure in the opening comments.
I believe it was a 90.1 percent collection rate of the total rental receivables, yet it also stated that no one expects the collections to ever reach (interpretation ends) 100 percent. (interpretation) That is how I understood the opening comments.
With respect to that comment, does the department ever expect the recovery of arrears to reach 100 percent? I refer specifically to the Nunavut Housing Corporation’s arrears collection program.
If that is possible, that would be the best scenario. Nevertheless, we know that will be practically impossible to attain. We do have a (interpretation ends) target of 97 percent (interpretation) and that is our target level for the arrears collection. (interpretation ends) Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Joanasie (interpretation): Why not aim for 100 percent? I guess I would have asked that next. Nonetheless, it is what it is.
Let me move to another topic here related to public housing. As an example, there are particular expenses required to be paid for the operation of the household, such as utilities and fuel costs, which have escalated compared to last year. I wonder which factor is driving the escalation of these costs, if I can ask the question to the minister, Mr. Chairman.
The biggest increase that we experienced last year was water delivery charges to the units.
That was a totally unexpected answer, as I was thinking of another factor, but it turned out to be water delivery.
Will the officials look into this issue, especially the various water rates in the communities and what savings could be realized by using less water? I was thinking of water conservation efforts in the communities. Is this part of the overall housing efficiency review, Mr. Chairman?
This issue is again outside of our mandate. In terms of water and sewage rates, we don’t have control over those expenses, as that is a municipal operational issue. There isn’t a general standard, such as using (interpretation ends) per litre (interpretation) and this is part of the issue.
I can’t respond other than that, unfortunately. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
Perhaps I should have directed that to the Department of Community and Government Services, but I note it for future queries.
Let me move to the next topic here, staff housing, as this figure was notable to me. There are 1,424 staff housing units or units rented by the public service.
How many employees are housed in these units?
I asked earlier about the (interpretation ends) public housing (interpretation) tenancy rates. I wonder how many GN employees are using this number of units.
These are two different scales, as staff housing is specific to housing government employees, but with respect to the number of tenants, unfortunately we don’t have that information available.
There are big differences in the numbers, as the numbers range from high to individuals in the units.
I apologize we don’t have that information regarding the number of people using these units. I seemed to understand his question as asking for figures, but we don’t have the specific information for that. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
As a good reminder for future meetings, perhaps you can provide this kind of information beforehand.
With decisions related to the number of units used by GN employees, perhaps the 1,424 units may only have 1,000 employees renting them and I’m just commenting on it.
Let me move on to a different topic again, (interpretation ends) homeownership. (interpretation) My question disappeared, so let me stop here for now and give someone else an opportunity to ask questions.
I need to prepare my question. I doubt I will have another opportunity today, but I hope I will tomorrow.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I’ll stop here for now.
The question you almost voiced was about homeownership; perhaps I can finish that question for you. Why can’t NHC strive for 100 percent attainment here?
As you stated, your target is set at 97 percent.
It makes me very curious as to why your department feels that is unattainable. Why is that impossible?
With respect to collection of arrears, if I understood your question, it is the target we set at 97 percent.
Your question as to why this isn’t set at 100 percent is a good one.
Mr. Chairman, I would like Ms. Kimball to respond if she has the information on whether we can strive for 100 percent debt collection. (interpretation ends) Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Ms. Kimball, can you respond to that?
Just to clarify, the funding that we provide the LHOs has them striving for 97 percent because we expect them to collect 97 percent. That is how we fund them.
However, we do work with them to collect 100 percent and in some cases, more than 100 percent, if they are able to collect this year’s assessment plus some of prior years’ assessments.
We actually have a number of them. We have four of them last year that collected more than 100 percent. We do try to collect as much as possible.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you for explaining that, Ms. Kimball.
I have a list of names and I know you are patiently waiting for your turn, which is stretching out, but I still have the following names: Mr. Akoak, Mr. Sammurtok, Mr. Hickes, Ms. Angnakak, and Mr. Mikkungwak. If you can be patient, I’m just giving you a heads up that there are that many names on my list.
I think I just have one question.
You’re asking our tenants to save money on utilities; you’re asking them to save.
I believe that some people do try, but the conditions of their units are not all that great to make them save.
If they have conditions that are pretty bad with walls that are open to the outside, windows are pretty bad, and doors are bad, before you can ask them to save money on utilities, would you be able to fix up the units and maybe help them that way?
When you have a nice building to look after, they will find ways to save for the government.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Akoak. Minister Kuksuk.
Yes, this issue surrounding housing renovations is quite an expensive process. As we have related from time to time, it averages around $25,000 just to maintain a unit and that amount increases dramatically.
We look at various methods related to proper maintenance or tenant care and various publications have been provided and this has proved beneficial. The tenants are provided basic maintenance information on the proper temperature ranges for summer and winter, winterizing your windows and ensuring their closure, common sense instructions that are designed for the tenant and that was a subject of (interpretation ends) a campaign (interpretation) through NHC.
It became obvious that these had an impact, as it benefits both our department and the tenant in the public unit.
We will continue to work together as a corporation with our LHO partners to ensure that the tenant fulfills their tenancy responsibilities that Mr. Akoak is referring to. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
I believe if you do renovate, it will help keep the temperature down and it will help keep the power down.
I think that’s all I’m asking for, if you can, and that’s all I have.
Chairman (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Akoak. (interpretation ends) Hon. Minister, (interpretation) would you like to comment on that?
A brief comment, yes, I totally agree with my colleague and further, the matters within (interpretation ends) M&I (interpretation) are always reviewed for further improvement in the maintenance of the units. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
Mr. Sammurtok (interpretation): Thank you, Mr. Chairman. (interpretation ends) Affordable housing programs and public housing regarding local housing associations, they look after all the maintenance and repairs and they get the budget for that for the year, but I understood there is no budgeting for emergency issues or standby for the staff to work after hours.
If I understood the member’s question properly, the (interpretation ends) budget (interpretation) is set by the local housing authority that the member is asking about. If they are going to deal with (interpretation ends) emergencies or callouts, (interpretation) if I understood his question on the public housing units, the local housing association is supposed to budget for (interpretation ends) emergency callouts (interpretation) as part of their operations funds. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
Mr. Sammurtok: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. (interpretation) I am unsure how to ask the next question as that confuses me. However, I was informed by my constituents in the community (interpretation ends) that it’s not budgeted.
There is no budget for emergency callouts or standby pay. (interpretation) I wonder if this can be reconsidered. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
Perhaps Ms. Kimball can explain it and break it down if that’s okay with you, Mr. Chairman. (interpretation ends) Thank you.
The funding formula that is used to fund the LHOs looks at the number of units they are supporting and calculates an employee payroll budget, basically a budget for all staffing needs which would include things like standby, overtime, etcetera.
Part of it as well is there is a plan for preventative maintenance. If the preventative maintenance is done, then there should be less demand or emergency calls.
As long as the overall operation of maintenance program is functioning, then it should work within the funding formula provided.
I just have a few more questions under this category. Mr. Joanasie kind of touched on some of the research activity that is being assisted with or participated with NHC.