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This article is being rewritten at Jack Abramoff/AbramoffRefactor. Please take note of the existing notes and outline, and follow in the spirit of that rewrite/refactor. Comments welcome. Thanks, -

 Archives 
 Archive 1 Friday 12th August 2005  Talk:Jack Abramoff/Archive 1 I made some substantial edits to the page and archived the entire earlier talk since it was mostly to do items since dealt with. 

COPYVIO
This article and it's sister screed are embarrassments to wikipedia.  They're essentially the same and both reflect the authors politocal hatred and zeal.  Both also have severe irredemable copyright problems and are and embarrasment to wikipedia.  They need to be deleted immediately.   

Alot of this article DOES seem to be a blatent copyvio.  Tyco, as below, was edited (the text was accurate, but half the news story was pasted in here).  You cannot just wholesale paste in paragraphs of text from a news story, attribute a link, and it not be a copywrite violation.  It's called Plagerism. 
  
 Tyco 
Almost the whole tyco section is a blatent rip from the WAPO article.  I've removed  part of it, as it needs to be re-written. 

I think I've cleaned much of the CopyVio stuff up, hopefully.  There is alot of non-essential stuff in this article about peripheral people, and not about Abramoff, however.  It needs to be cleaned up more, as the article meanders alot here and there.  

I reverted some things you took out (outside the Tyco section), like in the ""Early years"" section and in the intro about DeLay. That material is not copyright infringement because it is properly sourced when directly quoted.  

It still needs to be rewritten to not be a direct copy paste unless you are going to quote it.  Just providing a link is not attribution, and copying entire paragraphs out of an article is plagiarism, not 'fair use' unless you are quoting. Also, if you are going to say 'the los angeles times reports' you need to source the times, not a 
secondary source (i.e. democracy now).

I modified the quote and attributed properly.

 

The speech from Tom DeLay is a direct quote (it's in quotations) so of course it is taken word-for-word from the source. I'll tweak the setup to the quote a little better as per your request. Here's the primary source for the other thing.  

No problem.  If I see something that is probable CopyVio I tend to chop it out first, and then rework it (I don't usually just leave it out, if the quote is accurate).  Btw have you found a link for the franken quote, I can't find anything other than on blogs.  Honestly I'm not sure what the relevence to an article on Abramoff is, really, anyway.

 The ""forced abortions"" part was originally reported by Brian Ross at ABC News for 20/20 on March 13, 1998. It also appears in Al Franken's book The Truth (with jokes)'' in the ""Tom DeLay Saipan Sex Tour and Jack Abramoff Casino Getaway"" chapter. Since we've agreed that primary sources are key, i've change the attribution in the article.  

 The Indian tribes scandal 
 
This area is a mess, I have tried to clean it up a bit and structure it better. It may be best to create a new page on the tribes scam and point the Reed, Norquist etc pages to it.

Basically we need fewer facts and more context. At the moment the page is simply a list of transactions that may or may not have been legit with a strong implication that they were not legit. 

I moved the whole scandal to its own page. This makes much more sense since although Abramoff is a major player in that scandal there are several others who are significant players, in particular Ralph Reed. I am not doing this to hide the scandal, I think that people looking for info on i