Neither the chicken nor the egg came first; they are dependently arisen.

"This makes the assumption that any Chicken can breed with all Chickens and no Ancestral birds, and vice versa. If this is not the case, we have no reason to formally make either category." im not sure i'm following you on this. can you explain it more? perhaps con is trying to argue, that the chicken and eggs are dependant on each other, and we can't define chicken. maybe, if we take the approach of not defining chicken. but then we are simply ignoring what we see are clearly chicken, and that tehre are clearly nonchicken ancestors, and that there must be a way to separate them. if we do try to separate them, we must draw a line. whether they can breed with modern chickens is the least arbitary most accurat approach. "If there is only one Chicken in the world that hatched from the first Chicken egg, who does the Chicken breed with? Obviously not other Chickens, but far-right Chicken Hybrids. Would the offspring of the first Chicken and aforementioned Chicken Hybrid be in between its parents on the Chicken spectrum? Would the son be more like the ancestors than the father?" i'm still having a problem followng you, but will do the best i can. a first chicken would breed wth chickens proper (those who can breed with our modern chickens)and chicken hybrids. and yes, the first chicken would be mroe like the chicken ancesters than modern chickens. but this is simply the consequnce of us having to define a point of chicken. "I'm trying to point out that the point at which evolving Chickens can no longer breed with Ancestral birds has some degree of inderminacy. A process as macroscopic as evolution does not "turn over" in terms of speciation all at once, but gradually, until the population on the far right of the spectrum is sufficiently large and stable that everyone in the population is virtually certain to breed with a genetic neighbor." i actually forsook my DNA points, but they might be worth keeping. when we consider human, homo sapiens, and neanderthals as examples. we see that interbreeding occurred, but they were distinct species, albeit hominid species. this means that tehre are more specific criteria that could be used, psysiologically etc, to distinguish them. often, i know scientist do use DNA distinguishments. i would suppose it's not an exact science. but, as with my DNA regression points, it has to be drawn soemwhere. perhaps the best approach, though, is to not go along with those accepted technicques of speciation, atl east in regards to this debate. we need clear lines of differientiation, and it doesn't get any more clear than whether they can breed or not. again, this admits that perhaps a far back chicken can breed with modern chickens. and perhaps its offsrping can't, there's so much variability. but there is indisputably one first chicken that could breed with modern chickens, and that chicken came in the form of an egg. perhaps my digression into DNA etc was not the optimal approach. it is worth considerating. it would seem will continue to argue that there's just an inherent degree of indeterminancy and that the chicken and egg are dependant on each other. this sacrifices too much in terms of definitiveness though, that if we at all try to define this stuff, we have no choice but to find a way to draw a line. otherwise we are left with clear chickens, clear not chicken ancesters, and no way to distinguish anything in between.