The Bible is an immoral bit of utter crap.

If a book tells you that the holocaust was good and commanded by God, that book is immoral. If it tells you to continue murdering, condones slavery, and give commands which are absolutely immoral. Then it is immoral. I previously noted that slavery was argued from a very strong religious position. Had there been the smallest fraction to suggest that slavery wasn't God-sanctioned then a number of the pious southerners would have been in an indefensible position. However, theologically they were right: The Bible condones slavery. How about homosexuality today? Much of the anti-gay bigotry comes from religion. They specific cite Leviticus 20:13 repeatedly, and they are right. From a Biblical standpoint the argument is solid, homosexuals are to be put to death "their blood is upon them"; That is horrific. It's immoral, unjust, and bigoted. Further, the central doctrine of Christianity is immoral. The idea of blood sacrifice and sins of parents on their children are completely immoral and absolutely central. Jesus sacrifices himself to himself in order to give himself permission to forgive his creations for his mistakes. It's blood sacrifice to wash away sins other people committed (while not knowing right from wrong!). -- "And God's people do keep the Sabbath Day when they go to church. It does not apply to non-Christians/Jews." Jews (typically orthodox) keep the Sabbath, on Saturday (it's actually called Sabbath in many languages), they don't do any work as they are commanded by God. Outside of the 7th day Adventists and the Sabbathists, Christians largely ignore this. -- "-- This is a rule in every culture even those long predating this rule. (See Hammurapi)." ".... You also give no evidence for a culture that precedes this." I told you very specifically "See Hammurapi". http://en.wikipedia.org... The code of laws specifically outlaws murder and stealing as well as making a number of very practical provisions. It predates the Bible. -- "6) Thou shall not kill." "It is actually, "You must not murder."" I'm obviously using the KJV and it translated ratsach as kill. Also, it's used elsewhere as a lion killing a man. Though, none of this is relevant. -- "It doesn't say to kill adulterers; it just says not to become one." Leviticus 20:10 " 'If a man commits adultery with another man's wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death. -- It's unconstitutional to enforce 80% of the ten commandments, largely because of the separation of church and state. The first Amendment says that the government has no right to interfere with anything religious. The actual phrase doesn't appear, but the intention and spirit of the law, is dripping with it. You can't really be free to practice religion if the government is free to press religious ideas and beliefs upon you: such as Worship the God of the OT. --- "America is a child of a Protestant movement in which people fled Europe to escape religious prosecution." A couple of early American colonies were setup because puritans lost the English Civil War and were no longer able to persecute people as freely as they wanted to: the fled European liberalism. If you want to check this, look at the rules they passed after setting up their colony. They were some of the most religiously constrictive ever to the point of near theocracy. The era is called the era of religious intolerance. -- "The Enlightenment was still a movement towards inner religion, not a secular movement." Many Enlightenment thinkers were deists and individualists. It was a movement away from the dogmas of the Bible, influence of the Church and tyranny of the Monarchies. It was the founding of this country, not on the doctrines of the Bible, but on the thoughts and philosophy of men. -- "--Classical Antiquity, so long considered the 'dark' age for its lack of Christianity..." "I thought you said that that was supposed to be a government WITH Christianity..." You misapprehend, it says: "Classical Antiquity, so long considered the "dark" age for its lack of Christianity, was now seen by Petrarch as the age of "light" because of its cultural achievements, while Petrarch's time, allegedly lacking such cultural achievements, was seen as the age of darkness." Petrarch was the first to see the Grecian-Roman era as an "age of light" rather an "age of darkness" due to the lack of Christianity. The "dark" age, referred to in the passage was the non-Christian ages 'evil age' when most cultural and scientific occurred. Petrarch flipped the metaphor on it's head and referred to the new Christian age as "dark" due to the lack of cultural advancement. -- "All that says is that they both will have similar punishment." No. Jesus is clearly making a point: Lust is adultery. Anger at your brother is murder. He's clearly saying they are thought crimes and you need to keep your inner self in check. -- "I use Merriam-Webster." http://www.merriam-webster.com... 2. sometimes vulgar : nonsense, rubbish ; also : stuff 4b From context, there's no argument to suggest I mean literally feces. -- "You honestly expect me to watch 50 minutes of video that you claim to support your argument?" The Bible's a pretty long book. It takes a while to go over all the archeological evidence against various points. No Garden of Eden, no global flood, no Jews in Egypt, no conquest of Israel, no empire of Solomon and David. There's a lot of stuff in there while not being a part of history and Dr. Avalos does a good job. -- "Bible contains wise sayings, which is enough to show that it is not worthless." The Bible has nice thin pages which are quite useful. I never said it was completely worthless. I said it was an immoral bit of utter crap. From thought crimes to genocides, sex slaves, daughter selling, kid beating, etc. Even Mein Kampf has some good parts (even if also largely a work of fiction to aggrandize the past), even though it's immoral crap too. -- "I'm pretty sure the rod was supposed to be a metaphor for discipline." "23:13 Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die." - Yeah, because it doesn't directly say "beat him with the rod" -- Wait, it does! -- "Is there a Proverb that says any of these things? You cannot dismiss them as crap for not addressing some subjects that you want; you already admitted that they are often wise, and wisdom is not crap." I said that the Bible was immoral crap, not completely crap. The fact that the Bible says thought crimes are okay, is an argument that the Bible is immoral crap. The fact that the Bible includes some common sayings of the culture doesn't negate the fact that the Bible is immoral crap. Even the wisest man is an immoral cad, when he's raping a girl whose family he just slaughtered (on the direct orders of God). -- "Sometime in the distant past, God gave some Israelites some one-time instructions. He never said they were laws, because they were instructions." Genocide! Today only! Order now! Murder this town, kill their men, rape their little girls. Did you kill all the children? No. Oh, God's pissed now. Go back and make sure you've killed all the kids. Remember, two enslaved girls for raping each. Don't be greedy. -- "The Ten Commandments teach NOT to murder, and it does not say to kill the rule breakers, because they will already suffer on the Day of Judgment." You think the ten commandments weren't to be enforced? They were really just the ten suggestions? Even though it proscribed the punishments for sabbathbreaking, adultery, etc as death? There's a long story about people grabbing somebody for picking up sticks, bringing him to Moses, and then murdering the guy. It clearly does say kill them.