Revelations: A False Prophecy

Before I address last round, I must address what Pro calls Assertion 1. Revelation can and will be singled out without extra-biblical evidence, regardless of the continuity of other books, minus the 4 published Gospels. As THE core resource to the Christian faith, the Gospels are considered irrefutable on questions of faith or doctrine. Your assertion that that the other books of the Bible must in full agreement with each other in order to single out Revelation has no founding, Revelation is the "final" testament, and supposedly contains the last words of Christ. As Christianity puts Christ's words above all others, so then must we put all books containing his words above all others as well. It is one thing to have a book of false prophecy, it is another thing entirely to have a book containing false words of a Deity. As long as the Gospels stand with each other in agreement, showing no discrepancy between each other as to Christ's words and actions, Revelation may be singled out and cross-referenced with the Gospels. Assertion 1 as it stands, is too broad, and does not take into account discrepancies that exist as a result of two separate faiths, Judaism and Christianity. In essence, Jesus Christ is my witness, His words and actions will be compared, from Gospel to Revelation. I will take this round to respond to my opponents rebuttals and to present my new arguments. 1. Silent Jesus Without calling into question other books of the Bible, I cannot dispute Con on this point. While I do not agree with Cons conclusion, my point is invalidated, failing to prove Assertion 2. 2. Jesus the Last Prophet Con correctly states that there is not a specific definition for "all things" found in the Bible, as debate rules disallow, we cannot go into the meaning of the word "all things". This is my failing. As to Con's introduction of Agabus, this man foretold a famine, a great dearth. I can also foretell a time of great dearth, it will happen in the next 100 years. Agabus foretold a common-place event, he exposed no great mystery. He is nothing more than a weather forecaster, at the time, such profession did not exist. What one man calls a prophet others may apply many different labels. Humans predict things all the time. When one of us happens to be correct, we often express this, tell others. Agabus has nothing to show, no sign of Divine inspiration. We must remember that the Bible is also a history book, any author would describe Agabus' actions based solely on their personal experiences in life. Nothing in the Bible shows that Agabus is anything more than just a good gambler. --- 3. The Future Mt 6:33-34 (GNV) 33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness, and all these things shall be ministered unto you. 34 Care not then for the morrow, for the morrow shall care for itself: the day hath enough with his own grief. (KJV) 33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you. 34 Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof. --- Verse 33 tells us what are goal is and what happens when we reach it. Verse 34 admonishes us to live a day at a time. Revelation immerses us in fear and the "thought for morrow" like no other possible future event in history could ever do. We spend so much time, money and energy contemplating Revelation and the Apocalypse that we forget verse 34. We have been told by Christ to cease and desist, and yet we disobey. Scholars and aspiring book authors have jumped happily between the pages of Revelation for years, most obvious in this, Peter S Ruckman (end days theologian) and Tim Lahaye (author of Left Behind). The book of Revelation is a cash cow, monopolized for years by movie studios and previously the subject of an enormous novel series, one aimed at adults and the other aimed at children, Left Behind: The Kids. I present bad fruit number two; greed. 4. Bad Doctrine I will now focus on the 7 churches described to us in Revelation. I must point out that in each of the 7 churches, John pronounces judgement on each member collectively, guilt by association. Revelation speaks of no respect for the individuals of each of these churches. This is contrary to Mt 18:1-14. --- Mt 18:1-14 (KJV) (emphasis on verse 10) 1 At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying, Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven? 2 And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them, 3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. 4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5 And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me. 6 But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea. 7 Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh! 8 Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life halt or maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire. 9 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: it is better for thee to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire. 10 Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. 11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. 12 How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray? 13 And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray. 14 Even so it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish. --- The Church of Symrna: Must be faithful until death: Rev 2:10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. But Jn 11:25-26 (KJV) says differently: 25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live: 26 And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this? Christ of the Gospels offers no revocation of salvation. You either have it or you do not. --- The Church of Pergamos: Accused of being Satan's seat, rebuked for eating food offered to false idols. Rev 2:14-15 13 I know thy works, and where thou dwellest, even where Satan's seat is. .. 14 . .. to eat things sacrificed unto idols. .. However, Mat 15:17-18(KJV) says in the words of Christ: 17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught? 18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man. It is worth noting that the book of Acts does speak out about food given to idols, the discussion in Acts came from the first conference in Jerusalem, not from Jesus and Paul later says this is permitted in 1 Cor 8. --- I present the third fruit, variance (Gal 5:20 "Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,") I am running out of room, so I must end