An Unembodied Mind is Very Complex

This is simply exploring a hypothetical since we obviously can say nothing about a disembodied mind and have no evidence that any such a thing does or can exist. Our agreed upon BoP is shared. The human brain is a product of 3.6 billion years of evolution [1] and is the most complex processor of information we are aware of. In spite of this we cannot create the most basic living cells and we do not fully understand how the universe began so we can expect any creator mind to be far more complex. Con has conceded that this mind would have very complex thoughts and actions while asserting simplicity. I would like to add some context and clarifications: My full sentence was, “As an aside, a disembodied mind is just about the most complex thing I can think of and there is no reason to suspect that this is an explanation for the universe.” I was not responding to the Occam’s Razor arguments specifically but to Con’s assertion that a disembodied mind would be simple. There is no reason to suspect that this is true. It’s more likely that a disembodied mind that creates universes would be very complex. Terms I would like to add to the ‘complex’ definition that complex is obviously applied also to actions and thoughts (as Con has mentioned complex ideas) while Con’s definition only mentions physical examples. Also, I am obviously not suggesting that that a God mind would be subject to psychic conflict or has an emotional ‘complex.’ I was talking about a complex functioning mind capable of complex thoughts (along with universe creating powers) and not a poor psychological state. As to the ‘simple’ definition, I am not denying that God’s mind would be in unity or saying that it would be divided in its intentions. Burden This is what it boils down to. My position is that a disembodied mind that creates universes, life, the laws of physics etc would likely be very complex. Con must explain why this disembodied mind would be simple. Brains are our only frame of reference for a disembodied mind and are extremely complex To understand what a disembodied mind would look like we can only compare with the minds we are aware of. The most complex minds we are aware of (ours) are a product of 3.6 billion years of evolution [1]. There are around 200 billion nerve cells that are connected by hundreds of trillions of synapses [2]. The prefrontal cortex alone has in the range of 125 trillion synapses or 1,500 times the stars in the Milky Way Galaxy. Each synapse contains both memory and processing power containing 1,000 on/off switches. A single brain contains more switches for memory storage and processing than all the computers, Internet connections and routers on earth. “Christof Koch, chief scientific officer of the Allen Institute for Brain Science, calls the brain "the most complex object in the known universe [4],”” The more complex the information available the more complex the mind The mind, or our consciousness, is completely dependent on our brain [4] and information is carried from our senses as individual electrical impulses along a large network [6] and each piece of information stored requires an altered structure of the synapses in your brain [7]. This means that the more complex memory or processing power the more complex the brain. More complex thoughts and brain functions are also linked to more complex features of the brain [5]. A disembodied mind would need some kind of switch or hardwired change to store each individual piece of information. This is how our brain, any electronic memory storage device or even written information is stored. It would also need a framework to transfer information and extensive processing power. The mind would have to store every mind-boggling fact about the universe and be able to process this information in the creation of the universe. It would have to create the entirety of existence without the aid of a body or physical force, which would only add an extremely high level of complexity. Even as complex as they are, our minds are very limited Our minds are arguably the most complex thing in the existence and yet we do not have a clear grasp on how the universe is formed or what it even what it is made of. We have not been able to create matter, or energy and we understand very little about the universe. Current theories estimate that dark matter makes up 84.5% of the universe but we have never observed it directly and it’s existence is only theorized by measuring second hand data [3]. After two hundred thousand years the collaborative effort of humanity [1] we have not been able to create a single living cell or an artificial mind even close to our own. Our minds, as complex as they are, and with the collaborative effort over many years we are no where near creating or even understanding a universe. A mind that could make a universe would be enormously more complex than our own which is arguably already the most complex thing we are aware of. - “But leave that aside, an unembodied mind is a remarkably simple entity.” This quote and the following paragraph are mainly what I objected to originally. This is simply a brazen assertion without any reference to everything we know about minds. First, we have never examined a disembodied mind so we would know absolutely nothing about it except to reference minds that we are aware of. You give no reason for your assumption that a disembodied mind would have complex thoughts but not be complex as far as the necessary hardware. Why do you assume the exact opposite of what we know to be true about other minds? How would complex thoughts be stored and intricate processes function without a complex structure? Con has completely disregarded complex thoughts and actions in his evaluation You have conceded that a mind that creates universes would have complex thoughts and actions while asserting that this does not mean complexity. Why do you make this broad omission in your assessment? In the completely doubtful event that the mind exists mainly as a set of complex thoughts and actions then this is complex in and of itself. By, a mind is ‘complex,’ what did you assume I was referring to if not complexity including the intricacy of thoughts and actions? If, say, I have a friend that I describe as ‘very complex’ I am not referring to his intricate cell structure I am talking about his complicated thought processes and behavior. When I say that a book is very complex I am not referring to intricate parts and mechanisms. I am saying the book includes many complex ideas. If I refer to an actor as complex I am referring to complicated nuanced actions in the performance of a role. I see no justification for allowing for a God with complex thoughts and actions and then asserting the being is not complex. - Con has simply asserted that a disembodied mind that can produce a universe would be simple disregarding everything we know about minds. Even with the highly intricate structure of our own minds we are no where near the ability to create a universe so it is likely that a mind capable of this would virtually be light years ahead of us as far as complexity. For some reason con assumes I was not referring to complex thoughts and actions when I referred to this God concept as complex. I don’t see why Con has conceded this high level of complexity while insisting this God would be simple. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org... [2] http://news.cnet.com... [3] http://en.wikipedia.org... [4] http://www.npr.org... [5] http://www.salon.com... [6] http://www.news-medical.net... [7] http://science.howstuffworks.com... [8] http://science.howstuffworks.com...