Dota 2 v. League of Legends

(I never once believed they were refutations, by the way :P)I shall now begin my refutation. To start I shall summarize each of opponent's arguments and refute. Point 1: Complexity/More StrategyEssentially this topic conveys the following points:Runes/Masteries - basics and how it adds a deeper level of understanding to LoLRoles - the basic roles in both gamesMatchups - More interesting with runes/masteriesPoint 2: ItemsDepth - Items have "more depth" than items in DotaBasic Items - Opponent shows examples of items, and a list of items on the wikiPassives/Actives - Items with passives/actives, explaining some passives/actives like Zhonya's and OhmwreckerPoint 3: SpellsEffects - Talking about the various aspects of the spells in LoL and how they require deep understanding to use properlyUlts - Mainly focuses on ults with champs like Yasuo (who is my favorite LoL champ) and MalphitePoint 4: Lane MatchupsBasics - Explaining the importance of laning and that it can determine the gameCS - Talks about the importance of CS and how viable it is to turn the game around. Point 5: TeamfightsImportance - Teamfights are needed in games as you cannot "carry" in higher elo sometimes. Point 6: MapTalks about how LoL has jungle camps and is smaller allowing gameplay to be faster than Dota 2'sPoint 7: SkinsTalks about how P2W "isn't present" in LoLProceeds to explain this is how Dota 2 is different from LoL; skins which truly change a characterPoint 8: More fun/more competitiveTalks about how it is the most competitive due to the aforementioned featuresMentions MMR and ELOMentions the competivie scene and how it's a lot biggerPoint 9: FunYou can "have fun" in normsExplains that LoL is more popular, and that playercount is a big factor of if a game is liked or notPoint 10: "Sexually aesthetic and pleasing characters" *cringes*Shows LoL skins which people seem to think are "sexy"I shall now refute to each of these points. Not to offend opponent, but many of his arguments talking about "depth/complexity" are hardly viable in comparison with Dota 2, with the exception of runes/masteries. As well, he lists many common factors of both games, such as CS, teamfights, and strategies, which are far more present in Dota 2. So quite a few arguments can be dropped from the start, as they are present in both games. Those arguments are:the basic roles in both gamesItems with passives/actives, explaining some passives/actives like Zhonya's and OhmwreckerTalking about the various aspects of the spells in LoL and how they require deep understanding to use properlyAll of Points 4 & 5These have been marked through, signifying they are not important in the following arguments. This leaves opponent with quite a few claims still. I shall refute those. Point 1: Complexity/More StrategyI sincerely hope opponent read my arguments in my post regarding how Dota 2 has more strategy than LoL. However, opponent does make a serious point when it comes to runes/masteries. Even summoner spells can be taken into account here. But, this is all refutable with point 3 of my previous argument - Equal Playing Field. In LoL, a lot depends on leveling up in the game. For instance, level 5 me (even though he has lots of MOBA experience) cannot use Flash just yet. I have to wait to level 12 in order to acquire this spell. While still relatively early in terms of leveling, the thing that separates Dota 2 from LoL is the equal playing field. They don't care about your level. As long as you can play, you have access to what every other single player has, from level 1 to max level. With the exception of cosmetics and inventory items (through Steam, items you earn yourself by playing the game). Speaking of which. .. Counter Argument 1: Steam IntegrationDota 2 is only accessible through Steam, and because of this it has lots of Steam features such as:1. Voice communication (none of that in LoL unless you install Curse Voice)2. Community Market (where you can buy skins cheaper than market price)3. Steam overlay (which is a hub connecting you to information about the game as well as Steam itself & the web) 4. Community Workshop (extremely important as LoL does no such thing, where the community can make models/skins that can potentially be put into the game)With this hub of communication that LoL doesn't offer, it allows for better communication amongst teammates and just a central hub that LoL doesn't offer. But back to the refutations. Point 2: ItemsI already refuted this in my previous argument but I shall state reasons that Dota 2 items are better.1. Quite simply they are more powerful. Dagon, Butterfly, and Daedalus are good examples of this.2. They cost more, requiring the person to work more to obtain their desired items3. They have more effects added onto them than most LoL itemsPoint 3: SpellsSpells in Dota 2 are WAAAAAY more powerful than spells in LoL. Let me give you three examples:1. Nether Ward - Pugna"Pugna places a nether ward that fires mana flares at enemy heroes who dare to cast spells, while also causing them to lose mana. Nether Ward deals damage equal to the damage multiplier times the mana spent by the enemy hero. Lasts 30 seconds. " [1]2. Rupture - Bloodseeker"Causes an enemy unit's skin to rupture. If the unit moves, it takes a percentage of the distance traveled as damage. The damage is dealt through spell immunity. " [2]3. Finger of Death - Lion"Rips at an enemy unit, trying to turn it inside-out. Deals massive damage. " [3] (this "massive damage" is up to 1025)These are just 3 examples of spells that are WAY more powerful than anything in LoL. I guarantee you if moves like these were in LoL, every person would use the character they were on. Point 6: Map LayoutJungle camps are much more predictable in LoL. However the Dota 2 jungle camps are arguably much harder to kill than the LoL jungle camps, and they provide more of a reward. As well, creep stacking is evident in Dota 2 to get double the gold from a camp, by having double the monsters. Thus the work will be harder on the junglers, but they will get more of a reward that LoL's jungle camps which now take forever to respawn. As well, the longer map punishes those who end up going back to base. While it does take longer to rotate, it means a longer time for the other person to be caught out, and requires more strategy and coordination than a smaller map. As well, larger maps provide more variety. I know that I've gotten lost on the Dota 2 map before due to the sheer amount that actually IS there. But with LoL that was never the case. While this may seem good for LoL, it means for Dota that there are totally new areas to discover, but with LoL, it's the same old same old, with no real differences in gameplay. Point 7: SkinsThis can sorta be tied in with point 10 so I'll adress it here. "Nothing about leagues is Pay to win"Uhh. You have the option to buy characters with real money and have a higher champion pool and more to choose from, having an advantage over those who don't spend any money on the game. If that's not P2W then I don't know what is anymore. As for the skins, Dota offers skins too, but they're merely parts of skins. If you wish to buy a full set, 99% of the time it's cheaper than a majority of LoL skins, which are 975 RP, or about 9-ish dollars. Dota 2 skins mainly vary around the 2-6 dollar range which is significantly cheaper. While it isn't a complete model change it is indeed a change. As well, JUST LOOK AT DEADLY KENNEN. Riot LITERALLY just put that model in MS Paint and tried to make a skin out of it. I'm sorry, but many LoL players complain about "Dota fanboys buying tons of skins" yet some people buy a skin that SOMEWHAT resembles Deadpool. As for the skins that are "sexually & aesthetically pleasing" that's simply Riot's attempt to drag figures that would consider these skins "sexy" into the trap of the game simply from the skins and how a character looks. It's a sad attempt to get people to play the game. Point 8: Fun/CompetitiveFirst of all, "fun". I can have fun doing any other activity, it doesn't really matter. Just saying a game is more "fun" is very subjective. Naturally people will have different tastes as to what is "fun". Just because more people play a game doesn't make it better. I could say "Call of Duty is good because tons of people play it" yet I know that's a lie. CoD: Ghosts had a very bad rating, even though some considered it "fun" and a lot of people played it. Just because people enjoy something or have fun with it doesn't make a game "good". Naturally good games will be a lot easier to have fun with, however I can have just as much fun with "Sonic Flash Racing RX" or some game like that. It won't matter the game, but if I have fun with it I have fun. More people playing a game does not represent it being "fun", or "good". Just more people play it. Again, many good games will have more people playing it. However games like Warframe (which are high in depth but not super popular) are still good and have a lot of nice features! Long story short, playercount doesn't equal fun. Now onto the competitive scene. I don't deny the competitive scene in LoL is a LOT better than in Dota 2. However, the incentive to win is a lot higher in the esports of Dota 2. The Internationals tournament in 2014 had over a 10 MILLION DOLLAR PRIZE POOL. That is MASSIVE in comparison to what LoL offers. With this incentive, it strives the players to try harder instead of potentially slacking off like "it isn't a big deal". Long story short, many of opponent's presented arguments in R2 are invalid and were successfully refuted. I wish opponent good luck in the next round. Sources:[1] . http://www.dota2.gamepedia.com...[2] . http://www.dota2.gamepedia.com...[3] . http://www.dota2.gamepedia.com...