Christianity

Thank you for the compliment, I do try to present frustrating arguments. Yes, I may be all over the place but only because I'm not sure what we're debating, but you gave us a few good morsels. First, let's start with your assumptive statement hidden in one showing perhaps a tinge of Deism? Regardless I must call you out-you cannot slip a creator past me as though it's a given. How is it a given? Why must the Universe need a Creator at all? Why must there be a beginning to life itself? We see every manifestation of life, from micro-organisms to Universes has a beginning and an end, a birth and a death. Birth and death can be assumed, we all experience them, both first hand and second hand-so that's a reasonable assumptive statement that shouldn't require verification. However, the assumption of a creator has no basis at all outside your backward stoneage myths due to ignorance. They thought thunder was the anger of the head god, Yahweh. Others thought Poseiden would cause Hurricanes. And Atlas held up the sky on his shoulders.... They thought the world was flat, held up by pillars, others thought held up by turtles.... And the stars were just holes in the curtain of night, shining the light of heaven through..... and even today christians look up when praying to their god aloud.... yet that makes no sense-since there is no up. Hell is trickier-it still has to be below, and with seismology and spectroscopy and other sciences, well we know there's no hell down there.... With all that in mind, I don't think there is a religion with a creator that hasn't been proven false in enough ways to discount all of it. All evidence points to infinity, a never ending cycle of life.... that whatever we think is large is really small compared to something else... endlessly both directs (small and big). The moment we get complacent thinking we got to the end of knowledge, we find more-sub atomic particles or now they are trying to prove Multiverses..... Again, all this points to no creator-no beginning, and no end of life itself... just cycles of birth and death. The argument for a creator usually goes like this, like yours, my favorite to capture it most simply is, "Just look at all this stuff!" As though stuff proves a creator. The underlying argument is of course-everything needs a creator. But the argument thereby disproves itself as everything would include the creator and we find then a complication that contradicts the claim- IF the universe needs a creator, then so does the creator, which suddenly makes the position of creator seem perfectly illlogical as no creator could exist by its own accord under this law of creator necessity becomes a silly claim no matter what. Endless creators or none are then the only logical outcomes and one of them is silly and one is not. Next you assert a few claims that seem rooted in chrsitianity. Like the inherent claim that murder is 'wrong' and that helping others is 'good'. I disagree with the first and call 'lacking foundation' on the 2nd. First, no action has a value by its own accord-it is NOT wrong or bad to kill. Actually, sometimes murder is the only moral thing to do. What matters is not what you do, but what motivated you to do it. If it is that which causes the least harm it's likely the right thing to do in any situation even if 'it' is murder. Second, I agree it's good to help people but I must assert that you don't know why. Nor does the bible-it never explains why. As a matter of fact-in the entire book, nearly 2000 pages I believe, not once does it tell you a reward or punishment for practicing the 2nd commanment, ie 'golden rule' which again is not a rule without said punishment or reward and without nothing at all to motivate its use-what do you know, christians rarely ever do it. So I now would challenge you to reflect on your assumptions and question them-starting with your assumption of a creator as necessity-please explain that claim, you know with logic and junk. And also to question if there are moral absolutes? Not just because culture dictates so much-but rather because there do appear to be certain universal truths. For example, any claim that puts control of one's life outside one's control is just fatalism. This is true with any all powerful god-one is simply shifting their burden of life onto the ether or god or something else... ie avoiding responsibility. This is true of many atheists too, but only if what they believe does the same thing-that is, leads to fatalism. For example, the current trend in quantum physics is 'pre-determinism' which is basically intelligent design without a creator if you ask me. Whatever it is, it asserts we have no control, our dna drives us to do every little single thing we do-meaning we are helpless, see, again fatalism. I would make the claim that any belief that leads to fatalism, which is almost all of them-is immoral. The only moral philosophy is one that puts you in the role of responsibility for your whole world. And world here is infinite, it means your reality, not Earth. The bigger your life, the more things in it you see as yours to shape and improve. I only know of one such philosophy and it has no gods or any other outside forces, and no other entity or thing to blame for misfortune nor to credit for fortune. Christianity is the most immoral philosophy in history precisely because it avoids responsiblity the most of any and worse-spends its time trying to get others to sit down and pass the buck too.