It is more reasonable to believe in the Christian God than not to

Thank you, Bible2000! Guilty or not guilty?For the sake of argument, let us pretend we have the authority and ability to prosecute YHWH for the murders of the entire cities of Sodom and Gomorrah (with exception to Lot and his family), the first born children in Egypt as well as Pharaoh and his soldiers at the red sea (associated with the Exodus), and all of humanity (except for Noah and family) in the Flood. What would we need? We would need evidence to prove he did these things before we could call him guilty, right? What kind of evidence would the destruction Sodom and Gomorrah leave behind? First off, we would expect contemporary writings about the destruction of two cities. In other words, eyewitnesses who tell us about this destruction and what they saw. There are none. The Bible tells us these cities were destroyed with fire and brimstone. Genesis 19: 24 Then the Lord rained on Sodom and Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the Lord out of heaven, Brimstone is another name for sulfur, and it is quite easy to spot due to its yellow color. So is there evidence for the existence of cities destroyed in this manner? No. Archeologists have been searching for these cities for almost a hundred years and have found no trace of any cities destroyed with brimstone. We’re striking out here – no evidence. We have two other stories - we can surely find evidence in one of those! How about we move on to the Exodus? We would expect to find Egyptian records mentioning the death of a pharaoh or the death of every first born in the land. There are none. We would expect to find a lot of evidence of 600,000 people living in the desert for 40 years, but again there is no evidence. In fact archeologists have given up on searching for evidence of such a large group of people ever roaming the Sinai desert. “The archeological evidence does not support the story told in the Book of Exodus[3] and most archaeologists have abandoned the investigation of Moses and the Exodus as "a fruitless pursuit""[5] That leaves us will the Flood which is said to have occurred 4000-5000 years ago. If the flood occurred, what kind of evidence would we expect to find? Well, there would be massive amount of evidence. We would expect to find a relatively recent fossil layer which included modern animals (zebras, lions, tigers, wolves, giraffes, etc.) and modern humans. This fossil layer should be worldwide. In addition to this we, should expect to find a worldwide layer of pebbles, boulders, and sludge moved about by the flood. What do we find? Nothing like this – there is no fossil layer with 100,000’s (or even 10,000’s or 1,000’s) of modern fossils, and there is no sludge layer. So again, we have struck out. If the Christian god were on trial for these crimes – we would have to acquit him since there is no evidence by which to prove his guilt. What about the Christian god? Can we prove he exists by these stories in the Bible? Nope. Three major stories with no evidence they ever happened. Now I’m sure Pro will say absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, and that is true *except* when there is a reasonable expectation to find evidence. We expect to find evidence from S&G, from the Exodus, and most especially from the flood, but we do not. God was directly involved in each of these stories. If there stories are false, then it casts serious doubt on the Christian god who is said to have participated in them. Given this lack of evidence for YHWH in general and lack of evidence for the stories he is said to have been involved – I submit it is more reasonable to disbelieve. Common source for flood myths? In the commonalities of some flood myths, my opponent has given us nothing more than pure speculation as ‘evidence’ of the Christian god. The truth of the matter is that, sure, some of the flood stories are similar, in that, there was a flood most of the time. If you want to cherry pick the flood myths to find those that are similar to the Biblical version, that is doable, but it is not intellectually honest and the similarities only go so far. Most of the flood stories do not end up with a family of 8 surviving, some have a brother and sister as the lone survivors and repopulaters of the world, and some have no survivors. Some are global floods like the Biblical version, and some are local floods, and some are narrowly averted floods. There are hundreds (if not thousands) of flood myths, so similarities in a few is not evidence of the Christian god. [1] [2] The Bible is historical? I have no problem conceding there are parts of the Bible that are historical. However, that is not an argument for the Christian god. The fact that real places or real people are mentioned in the Bible does not mean that it is incontrovertible evidence for YHWH. I could sit down and write a totally fictitious story set in WWII and talk of Winston Churchill and General Patton, but the historical accuracy would not make my fiction true. Basically, the historicity of the Bible is irrelevant to the claim of the existence of “God”. This is not a reasonable point for belief in YHWH. Prophecy! No argument for the Christian god would be complete without prophecy. This is one argument that can be quite compelling if the audience is uniformed. Let us cover what a valid prophecy should do to be accepted as authentic: 1. It must actually be a prophecy. Not a documentation of events that is misinterpreted as a prophecy after a similar event occurs later. 2. It must be written before the events that it predicts. 3. The predicted events must actually occur. 4. The prediction must be both falsifiable and verifiable. 5. It must not be overly vague. 6. It must not predict a likely event. 7. It must not be self-fulfilling. [3] That being said, when did the events described in Daniel occur? Alexander the great defeated Persia in approximately 331BC. I don’t think Pro will disagree with this. When was the Book of Daniel written? The scholarly consensus holds it was written around the year ~165 BC – some two hundred years after the event. Thus, we should call it historical rather than prophetical. The Bible is internally consistent The Bible being ‘internally consistent’ is due to men choosing the books of the canon up until the 4the century AD. This is the work of men, and not the work of the Christian god. If Pro, would like to argue God inspired them, he is entitled to that, but without evidence it is a hollow claim. Overall, this claim has nothing to do with reasons to believe in the Christian god. The Bible is the most attacked book in history? If the Qu’ran were the most attacked book in history and then the most distributed, would you change religions? This is more a testament to the fickle nature of humans rather than the power of any god. This is not a reasonable argument. The Bible and science Generally, when someone says science and the Bible are complimentary they are watering down either science or the Bible. Since Pro has mentioned the creation account, and he believes it is literal, we will go there first. The Bible states marine animals came first, then birds, then the land animals. This is not in accord with fossil records or science in general. Birds came after land animals. [3] I believe Pro is reading into the text a bit when he says “God stretches the heavens” refers to the Big Bang. However, it is not surprising that some things may be right, but let’s not draw a circle around it and call it a “bull eye”. What about times when the Bible is wrong? Genesis 30:37-42 talks of Jacob peeling bark off if sticks and placing them in view of copulating animals so the offspring would be striped, speckled, and spotted. This is simply not how genetics works, and it is much more plausible to be the work of ancient ignorance rather than the work of an all-knowing god. The Bible as a guide I will agree there is some good stuff in the Bible, but there is some really bad stuff too. This is another case of cherry picking the data. In the Old Testament, it is easy to find horrible accounts (genocide, infanticide, slavery, etc.), but even in the words of Jesus we can find problematic messages such as, “Turn the other cheek”. This seems noble, but in actuality following this notion will only subject an individual to the mercy of bullies and thugs. What about, “judge not lest you be judged”? Again, it sounds good, but it is difficult to hire a new employee without judging them. Overall, any benefit I get from a book is not an argument for divinity of any kind. More evidence’? Pro states, “Jesus died for a lie? […] I doubt it.” (paraphrased) This is an argument from incredulity. Whether or not Pro believes it is possible is not a logical argument either way. Bible2000 talks of the hundreds of witnesses, but in actuality we have one man *saying* there were hundreds of witnesses, and that is not the same thing. As far as Paul is concerned, he heard a voice on the road to Damascus– is that being an eyewitness to the resurrection of Jesus? If the account were true and we could witness it, then we would probably think Paul had some sort of seizure. I don’t say that to be malicious. Even the people who were with him only saw a flash (which could be explained by any number of natural events) and they obviously did not understand the event as Paul did. As for Jesus and the miracles, I know Pro’s extra-Biblical source exists, but I cannot find it. I suspect it is not contemporary to Jesus. In other words, the source likely got it from word of mouth rather than by seeing it first-hand. I’ll leave that for Pro to sort out.Back to you, Pro! [1] http://en.wikipedia.org... [2] http://www.talkorigins.org... [3] http://wiki.ironchariots.org... [4] http://en.wikipedia.org... [5] http://en.wikipedia.org...