belief is theism

As Pro hasn’t presented a coherent argument in Round 1, or outlined any requirements for the debate, I’ll only start off with a few basic points. As Con, I will be arguing that belief is not the same as theism, and I suggest the following definitions paraphrased from Google and/or Dictionary.com: Belief: 1) an opinion or conviction, 2) confidence in the truth or existence of something not immediately susceptible to rigorous proof, 3) confidence, faith, or trust Disbelief: 1) inability or refusal to accept a claim, 2) lack of faith in something Theism: the belief in at least one deity (sometimes specifically the belief in only one personal creator deity) Argument 1: Belief is not a subset of theism, but theism is a subset of belief. There are infinite possible beliefs one could hold which are either unrelated to theism, or contradictory to theism. However, theism, being the belief that there is a god, is, as just stated, a belief. Therefore, while theism is a belief, belief is not theism as not all beliefs are theistic. One relevant example is the anti-theist position, which is the belief that there is no god. I wonder whether Pro will argue that anti-theism is theism. Comment 1: This debate is an example of the importance of stating your proposition carefully, precisely, and correctly, defining terms, and correct usage of the English language. I doubt that the proposition, as stated, as what Pro meant to say (indeed, Pro’s first round hardly seems more than tangentially related to the proposition). I invite Pro to attempt to restate the proposition and the original argument in order to communicate the intended meaning. Response to Pro It is unclear what you are attempting to communicate in Round 1, but I will do my best to respond from a rational perspective. “there are only 3 possible positions for me to have on any imaginary claim, belief, disbelief, or acceptance i dont know” For any given claim, one can believe it, or not believe it. Some may include states of knowledge as well as states of belief, but I suspect these were omitted for some reason related to the term “imaginary claim”, which you left undefined, even though it has no common usage or meaning in this context that I am aware of. Given the working definition of disbelief, acceptance that one does not know something is generally a form of disbelief (although, it is possible for someone to accept that they do not know something yet still believe it on faith – but this distinction is likely more to do with way Pro’s first statement conflates belief and knowledge). Please keep in mind that disbelief is not equivalent to belief in some alternative or opposite claim. I.e., disbelief in the claim that a god exists is not the same as belief that a god does not exist. It can also just be lack of faith in a god for the very fact that one accepts that they do not know whether there is a god. “i dont know=i have to imagine it” While this statement has no real discernible meaning, I will attempt a response. Clearly the two phrases are not equivalent. There are things we know, for example the existence of quarks, which we have to imagine, as we cannot observe them directly. So the equivalence cannot be bidirectional. In the other direction, does lack of knowledge in something mean that we have to imagine that thing? It may be true that in order to consider something we do not know, we are required to imagine something related to it, or to imagine a world in which that thing is true/exists. But to simply not know something doesn’t require us to imagine it. Are you forced to imagine all of the things that you are not yet even aware that you don’t know? “belief=false, as i have to imagine it” Again, it is unclear what this means. May I ask what exactly you mean when you use the equality symbol, ‘=’? And what does it mean to say that belief=false? Does that mean everything that is believed is false? This can easily be demonstrated to be a false statement. Does it mean that the word ‘belief’ is equivalent in meaning to the word ‘false’? I cannot really respond to this statement without it being communicated more coherently. “am i holding a rock in my hand as i type this? you have to imagine it” I don’t, and I didn’t. I can, but my brain does not force me to against my will. But if you were holding a rock while typing, please be informed that it is much easier to type with your hands free. To Pro: Please clarify your proposition and your arguments. State what you mean by the words you use, how you're using them, and what you mean when you use '='. Or do you believe that what you need to communicate cannot be stated in normal English?