LM Classic: Logical-Master vs ToastofDestiny

=========== RE: FTL Travel | =========== CON attempts the mask the faultiness of his argument by insisting that he is merely referring to the idea that the environment matters (i.e., if they are on Jupiter, they will die immediately due to lack of oxygen). I agree with him; the environment does matter, but if a character has shown themselves to bypass what is deemed as the laws of physics, this is to be accepted. Just as if characters have shown themselves to bypass the necessity for oxygen, it is to be accepted. Until CON can explain to us why fictional properties somehow follow the laws of what we deem reality, you are to dismiss his point. ============ RE: Warp Snipe | ============ Extend. =========== RE: Force Sight | =========== Extend =========== Battle Strategy | =========== A) CON insist that I am equally reliant on jean Grey being dead as he is her being alive. As I had mentioned in the previous round, I might consider coming back to arguing against his strategies used to take down the rest of my team. Seeing as how I have the time and space, I think I shall do just that. Amazo: -Amazo simply takes a look at Revan and BOOM, he has just as much resistance to telepathy/telekinesis as Revan does. In the highly unlikely event she manages to deal with Revan, she'd still get found and killed. Both Amazo and Revan could easil do the same thing at the same time. Sora: -Note 1:26 on the first vid to the right as it is a testament of Hercule's strength (he manages to hold the frigging sky), while not even an adult or fully trained by Phil. Now notice how a serious Sora shrugs off punches from someone this strong and WINS. Case and point: A mere few tons of force is NOTHING to Sora. "Popping" Sora or disabling him telekinentically is out of the question.. - I've got no evidence demonstrating how sufficiently Sora can resist telepathy, though given that it's already been agreed as to where his speed potential stands, Sora could simply move around the city fast enough to avoid Jean Grey's detection (or at least fast enough for her not to be able to lock on to him). Batman: - Batman's will power would enable him to stave off a mental assault by Jean Grey. EVIDENCE: ----------------------------------------------------------------| Resists a high tech military's mind control machine for 26 hours and with help comes up with a plan to break free http://img18.imagevenue.com... http://img142.imagevenue.com... http://img43.imagevenue.com... http://img12.imagevenue.com... He is able to keep Martian Manhunter's brother out of his mind (JLA Classified #45) http://img339.imageshack.us... http://img228.imageshack.us... http://img339.imageshack.us... Breaks free from the imaginal world that mentally enslaved the JLA and the Spectre saving them in the process (JLA/Spectre: Soul War #2) http://img15.imagevenue.com... http://img18.imagevenue.com... http://img20.imagevenue.com... http://www.picsaway.com... Plenty more instances of Batman's amazing will power can be found here: http://agent0x7.tripod.com... ------------------------------------------------------------------| Batman can resist mind control and other telepaths techniques thanks to sheer will power and has shown himself as having enough will power to counter some of the best the DC universe has to offer. With the aid of Amazo or Revan, he'd know Jean Grey's location, could boom tube to her location and take her down while still managing to resist her powers. -Incidentally, his will power could be used to stave off a telekinesis assault as well. EVIDENCE: ---------------------------------| Batman withstands a massive punch from Superman through sheer will power (who was ordered to kill batman). http://img121.imagevenue.com... http://img12.imagevenue.com... ----------------------------------| Spider-man: -Spider-Man also has a level of will power enabling him to resist telepathy: http://img364.imageshack.us... http://img395.imageshack.us... Granted, there's nothing to suggest that he is on the level of Batman when it comes to will power, but there'd be no doubt that he'd be able to show at least some resistance while at his best. -Once more, a mere few tons of force would be insufficient: http://img337.imageshack.us... http://img443.imageshack.us... Ock collapses a building on Spider-Man. He is barely phased. http://www.youtube.com... http://www.youtube.com... http://www.youtube.com... B) Now lets get to CON's responses to my numbered points. 1) No, Force Sight is an instant viewing tool. Observe 3:52 of the third video; you can do it at the push of a button in the games. What my opponent is referring to is a certain form of force sense. Fortunately, I'm merely relying on visual augmentation as well as the ability see through objects and detect life forms. 2) Doesn't matter how it's done (i.e. the force guiding Jedi). As for force speed, it certainly effects mental abilities AND physical abilities. Notice how the walls "slow down" upon using force speed at 0:52 in the 4th video. The only way the moving walls would appear to slow down would be if the mind had mentally quickened. You should also be able to notice that time seems to slowdown during the actual battle with Desann in said video (you'll notice that Kyle appears to be moving faster whereas everything else, including Dessann appears to be moving slower). The fact that force speed isn't used continuously is of no consequence. I just insisted that it be used to conclusively uphold the position that Revan could find and kill Jean faster than she could react. 3) It doesn't matter that he did not stop it (which wasn't his goal btw). What matters is that the force powers of the apprentice (someone far less powerful than Revan) made it possible to produce enough force to manipulate something of such incredible weight Also, we're talking about an object that maxes out at 36,000 metric tons in weight: http://starwars.wikia.com.... This is not even taking into account the ships propulsion system. A few tons and that don't even compare. Jean Grey may as well give Revan a massage. The distraction point is irrelevant since Revan would only be focused on Jean Grey (contrary to the Apprentice being focused on the star destroyer AND the tie fighters). 4) Extend. As for Jean being an Omega level, this isn't a big deal at all. Revan was described as being like looking into the heart of the force on more than one occasion. C) Additional CON strategies: I've made points demonstrating that Jean Grey's powers would not prove effective on any member of my team (to rebut 1-5) and shall now just deal with 6-10 6) With Revan's powers, Jean's mindcontrol attempt results in failure. 7) Brit could not cover her entire body merely through embracing her. Sora could still hit any exposed area (such as her head). 8) I ask CON to cite the manga chapters that depicts this being used so I may better respond in the next round. 9) Same as above 10) Sameas above 11) Same as above http://www.youtube.com...