The Trinity

For the sake of clarity, it is my position that there are three members of the Godhead, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. The Trinitarian belief is they all somehow mish together into one God as stated by the exact definition Pro gave. Trinity (as stated by Pro) - There are three persons in one God. -------------------- It appears a game of Gish Gallop is afoot. [1] :p "Physical YOU SAID 2. Physically" Yes, yes I did say ‘Physically', and that is because it is precisely what I wanted to say. I made three strong points you have yet to refute, one PHYSICALLY, ETYMOLOGICALLY, and SCRIPTURALLY. Saying that the Trinity doesn't make sense physical doesn't make any sense in itself Pro, you say the Trinity doesn't make sense physically. -------------------- In response to your repute of argument number two. "The general response to this is God is three and one in different senses. He is three in persons." Isn't it by your very definition that God consists of all three persons, because ‘the general response' to why Jesus' followers describe very vividly seeing three different beings, is because there is three Gods, or ‘He is three in persons'? That doesn't seem like a very logical response on your part being if there is three Gods then…. there is no Trinity. -------------------- "Christ did not know the time of the coming while on earth because he lowered himself to our level while he was on earth." Ok… so if Christ (A.K.A God, being Christ is God according to the Trinity) ‘lowered himself to our level while he was on earth', that would mean there was no God during this period? According to the Trinity, God is Jesus, and if Jesus lowered himself to the state of a human, then God lowered himself to the state of a human. So then if he was in the state of a human how was he able to complete so many majestic miracles? Who was he praying to at the garden of Yosemite? How did the universe stay intact for the space of thirty three years with absolutely no guidance from God, who according to Pro, was currently in the state of a Human. The universe was simply on cruise control I guess. -------------------- Your ‘arguments' 1- There is one and only one God. Mark 12:29 "And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:" When first reading this verse, one might take it upon oneself to imply that the Lord our God is one Lord, being there is no other members of the Godhead. This is an incorrect assumption of this verse. Jesus the Christ is simply explaining that the Lord our God is one Lord, and he is in fact the Lord of all other Gods, the Father is the supreme member of the Godhead. However this verse is simply saying God is one Lord. It could continue to say that Jesus is another, the Holy Ghost is another, however it doesn't because this verse has nothing to do with the trinity, for Christ to bring that issue into this would be unfit. The verse, and the next two verses are the first and second greatest commandments of them all, that is the point Jesus is trying to get across. If Jesus was that ‘one Lord', then why would he be referring to himself in the third person? If the Trinity was the correct doctrine, the verse should read "Hear, O Israel; the Lord Me is one Lord." 2-"There are three distinct persons who are God: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one." 1 John 5:7 Absolutely these three are one, however Pro, and the rest of Christianity that feels this means they are one the same person, are mistaken by the word one. I would like to cross reference this with ST John 17:20-23 "Neither pray I for these alone but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. And the Glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me. First of all I would like to point out this is a prayer; he is obviously talking to somebody other than himself addressing him with words such as ‘thou, thee, us, and we". He uses phrases such as ‘thou hast sent me'. Now to my actual point : ), if Pro is right, when John uses the words ‘three are one', it means that they are all the same being, we see in John 17:21 that we too are one with them ‘That they ALL may be one; as thou, Father, art in me…. Even as we are one…"… So that means that when we go to heaven we all mish up into a giant God! We will all be the Trinity! No. He explains that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost ARE in fact all one, one in the same mindset, they have the same mission, they believe the same things, and his saints, those who follow him, will become one with them ‘even as they are one'. They will have the same mindset, they will know that God hast sent Jesus the Christ, and that God loves them (verse 23). I feel I have made my point abnormally clear, and for all those who have taken the time to read this, I thank you. I have addressed every one of Pro's two arguments, and I have defended the few arguments of mine Pro rebutted, I couldn't defend all of them because Pro didn't repute all of them. : (. I urge the readers to VOTE CON. : ). [1] http://www.debate.org... [2] Bible, New and Old Testament, KJV