Derek Jeter is overrated

== Re: OFFENSE == Pro asks what I consider to be consistent. Clearly one does not expect Jeter or anyone else to perform the same in every game. As Pro said, there will be good games and bad. However what I meant regarding Jeter's consistency was his consistency to be above average offensively year after year. For instance, the league batting average is somewhere around .266 [1] but Jeter finished last season with the 3rd highest batting average in the American League with .334 [2]. So, to answer Pro's questions, doing well consistently to me means performing among the elite offensive players every season (well above average) which Jeter has proven he can do. Jeter is just 1 of 6 players to have earned 2,700 hits, 1,500 runs scored, 220 home runs, 300 stolen bases, and 1,000 RBI's. His postseason numbers are equally impressive as in 138 games Jeter has a batting average of .313 with 20 home runs and 55 RBI's [3]. Additionally, while Pro mentions that Jeter's wOBA numbers are slightly behind his last year's averages, let us not forget that baseball season has JUST STARTED -- we're not even half-way through, and we can expect that Jeter and the Yankees will be playing well into the fall. If you look back at his progression throughout the season, we can see that he tends to improve as the season continues overall raising his averages by the end. In short, all we have to do is look to Jeter's offensive accomplishments which have garnered not only himself praise, but his performance and overall leadership which has helped boost his team to the top by both attracting new talent, proving to be a good captain and friend, and overall just continuing to impress New York's tough fans and management year after year. Some more notables are worth-mentionings are the fact that Jeter ranks 2nd in team history with games played; 1st in at-barts; 4th in runs scored; FIRST IN HITS; 3rd in doubles, 10th in HRs and RBIs and FIFTH IN BATTING AVERAGE [3]. Again, this is the NY Yankees we're talking about -- they certainly have had their fair share of superstars to compete with. == re: THE CLUTCH == Pro points out that clutch situations occur all throughout the season and not just the post-season. I would agree with that, though it's kind of irrelevant. He also says that arguments against The Clutch refer to one's batting average overall remaining the same regardless of whether or not a clutch situation arises. First and foremost, I would like to see proof of this assertion, or rather an explanation of the link (#2) that Pro provided because I can't seem to find where his source cites this. Second, something like this is only calcuable if one finds themself recording the performance of a player over many clutch situations over many seasons. I highly doubt that adequate research and stats have been done on this sort of thing; maybe if I see some tangible evidence I can have a better idea of what I'm supposed to refute. As far as what I have been saying, one's overall personality and comfort (which tends to come with experience and familiarity in big situations i.e. the Post Season) definitely has a mental impact on the way one plays the game. Even if one's numbers remain consistent, a person's attitude in the clutch often refers to their poise and ability to either be effected or not effected by the level of importance their individual performance carries in a particular situation. Specifically, clutch playing refers to one's ability to remain level-headed in tough situations, or who you'd like to see have the pressure in a game-making situation (such as Kobe Bryant when you're down by 2 with 2 seconds on the clock, or Rivera pitching when it's a 2 out bottom of the 9th scenario for New York) [4]. One thing I did notice about the source Pro uses consistently in his last round is that it cites Jeter as among the best shortstops in the MLB. It notes, "If the season ended today, Jeter would have the best ISO he's had in eleven years(!), so it's safe to say that he may even approach his career high in home runs this year. A twenty-twenty season would make Jeter a solid top option, and depending on Rollins' final batting average and steals total, and Tulowitzki's home run total, he may even be a top-3 shortstop by the end of the year" [5]. The site ranks him as the 4th best SS at the moment though he has the 2nd best OBA. In regard to Jeter vs. A-Rod situations or clutch situations, I'm not quite sure why my opponent tries to prove that A-Rod is better. I don't think I've ever said otherwise. In fact I've embraced A-Rod from Day 1 unlike most Yankee fans - many of whom are still warming up to him. A-Rod is a phenomenal player, but again that's irrelevant to this debate. It's not about proving that Jeter's the best (which I've never contended) but rather the fact that he's not overrated. In other words, I am trying to prove that he deserves the praise and recognition he gets. I would stand by that even if the Clutch didn't exist. Nevertheless I stand by the position that Clutch situations exist and some players handle it better than others. Regardless, there are certain players you'd like to see have the pressure on them in certain situations specifically because of their ability to remain collected. Even if the stats and numbers turn out to be the same as Pro implies, it doesn't matter because Derek Jeter is still one of those people you'd trust in that kind of tough situation which is exactly why players consider him consistent and Captain Clutch. == re: DEFENSE == Jeter has admittedly lost a step as he aged. However, he was considered one of the best defensive players not too long ago. His range used to be 40 points above the league's other SS's. In 2009, his numbers improved and his performance was regarded as above average [6]. Additionally, again Pro's own source seems to consider the 3rd best defensive SS of the 2009 season [7]. How can Pro say he continues to fall short year after year when he's actually considered among the best? Pro's speculation about whether or not Jeter deserved the Golden Glove awards or not is irrelevant; there is always controversy and typically the award is not given to the most deserving player. The fact is that Jeter won 3 of them, and Pro saying that he won only because of his play resulting in a bloody nose is again nothing but speculation. Moreover Jeter's assessment is correct in responding to these criticisms when he notes things like how formulas aren't always terribly accurate; for instance whether you're behind a pitcher prone to throw ground-outs or fly balls for instance effects numbers. == re: TEAM/CONCLUSION == Pro says that the factors I mentioned indicating Jeter's greatness are irrelevant because they cannot be measured. However Pro's numbers and assumptions cannot be measured or proven either. For instance he presumes that A-Rod would have been the better Yankee SS, but he cannot prove this as nobody knows what could have happened or what would have happened had the circumstances been different. The bottom line is that Jeter is valued for things other than his performance as a player which I've explained at length, though his performance has been memorable to say the least. He's embraced and praised for exactly what he is: classy and consistent. He's not the best player but a model player. [1] http://en.wikipedia.org... [2] http://espn.go.com... [3] http://outsidetheboxscore.blogspot.com... [4] http://espn.go.com... [5] http://www.fangraphs.com... [6] http://sports.yahoo.com... [7] http://www.fangraphs.com...