The Universe Was Created By God

*Round 3 Rebuttals*Pro goes KCA:"Everything that begins to exist has a cause."My response:First off, that's a bare assertion, and quantum mechanics would disagree.https://profmattstrassler.com...Now, my favorite argument for god is in fact this one, the Kalam Cosmological Argument, because it was an attempt to take the infinite regress problem of "everything that exists has a cause" and change it so that god is exempt from the "if it exists, it has a cause" rule; this is a form of special pleading.http://www.logicallyfallacious.com...Before the Kalam argument, was the original cosmological argument that asserted that "everything that exists has a cause." This turns into an infinite regress, because if god exists, according to the assertion, then god must have a cause, and god's cause must have a cause, and god's cause's causes's cause must have a cause etc...So, the Kalam takes an infinitive verb phrase "to begin to exist," applies it to "everything that exists has a cause," and changes the assertion to "everything that BEGINS TO EXIST has a cause," which exempts god from being caused, because, thanks to special pleading, he's always existed and never BEGINS TO exist.This argument is two-fold fallacious.A. It uses circular reasoning, or it begs the question.B. It special pleads god's exemption.A. By saying that things "begin to exist," you automatically create a set of "things that don't begin to exist" and a set of "things that do begin to exist." The problem is that the set of "things that don't begin to exist" ends up only having one thing in it, god, which makes separating "begin to exist things" and "not beginning to exist things" a way to smuggle in god's presumed exemption in the conclusion.The assertion that a thing, god, didn't begin to exist in the premise is simply repeated by saying that god is the only member of the "didn't begin to exist" set in the conclusion, which is begging the question or circular reasoning.http://www.logicallyfallacious.com...B. By asserting that everything began to exist, except for god, you are special pleading god's exemption to the assumed rule. Without an explanation of how god should be considered exempt from the category, exempting him is special pleading, thus it is flawed logic and we can reject the conclusions from such.Pro, other than bare assertions, like "god is uncaused," how is god exempt from the beginning to exist rule that you openly endorse?Pro, could you explain the mechanism by which god accomplishes this exemption?If you can't, then how do you know that this exemption has occurred?Pro continues:"The beginning of time/space began to exist or be put into motion, thus there must be a cause."My response:Much like the process of creation, causation is also temporal.This means that time could not have been caused, because causation itself requires time.It's like saying, "time began to exist as the result of a time event that occurred BEFORE the existence of time."The temporal contradictions of creation and causation at [+0,-0] have not been addressed by Pro.Pro baldly asserts again:"God is a self existing being who was not caused, thus needs no answer for a cause because He is uncaused."My response:Aside from this egregious tautology, Pro simply asserts that god was uncaused and provides no explanation as to how this is the case.I could just as easily assert that flagoiganberries are self existing beings, uncaused, and need no answer, and I would have accomplished the same level of demonstration that Pro has with his asserted god.Pro tried to draw a similarity between designed-by-human computers and the universe.I pointed out that if Pro is going to say that the universe was designed, which I also reject, like computers, then the universe, like computers, was designed by a natural, not supernatural, intelligence.Pro responds:"To be clear, this is a synonymous way of saying "humans created every computer we know of, not God."My response:No, it's another way of pointing out that your "universe is like a computer" analogy doesn't support a supernatural entity like your proposed god.Instead, your analogy shows that natural designs come from natural agents, so if the natural universe was designed, your analogy would indicate that a natural entity was responsible; this is not indicative of a supernatural designer, the type of designer Pro is attempting to affirm.Pro continues:"Computer codes and mediums do not just magically pop into existance."My response:Yeah, natural entities are responsible for these computer codes, hence why computer codes are not "magical."Pro furthers:"[Something magically popping into existence is] synonymous with saying Call of Duty 4 and its Construct randomly happened."My response:Well, again, all of the examples EVER of video games have been shown to be designed by a natural entity, but we only have one example of the universe, and it has not been shown to be designed...the absurdity of the random video game manifestation contradicts the many examples of designed video games and is therefore nontransferable to the universe which has no standard examples with which to compare.Pro retorts:"Con has...declared that there once was no time...time "became" at some point...since Con states there was no time to have a creation event, he is ceding that there could be no start event in the first place, which is illogical, seeing that we do exist."My response:Ah, Pro addressed it finally.Creation and origin are not the same thing.creation - the process of bringing something into existence.http://www.oxforddictionaries.com...origin - the point where something begins.http://www.oxforddictionaries.com...Time therefore had an origin, a POINT called the big bang, yet it did not experience a PROCESS of being created; that process must occur over time and at [+0,-0] there was no stative time or the passage thereof.So, it's NOT illogical to concede an origin, but not a creation.Creation is a series of events and an origin is a point; the terms are different.Pro stays adamant:"Time and space placed in motion in the first place had a cause."My response:Again, this is like saying, "Time was placed in motion in the first place by a time-based action."How can a cause, a thing occurring over time, happen without time?Pro adds:"Without God, time and space never roll into motion...it would take a tremendous amount of energy to put time and space into motion. Where did the energy come from?"My response:I guess Pro ignored all of my round 2...oh well, here it is in a different way.Quantum fluctuations are what nothing is, and this nothing is unstable; nothing cannot remain, so something, energy, is guaranteed.At [+0,-0], spacetime fluctuated in and out of existence with the other fluctuating variables in quantum fluctuations, but once matter became stative [+1,-1], so did space.At this point [+1,-1], space was as small as a virtual sub nuclear particle, so the proportion of stative energy from QF to such small space was massive...so massive that it drove the inflation of space.http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk...Pro reasons:"If we are to believe an energy force put it all into motion, without time, how could this be? Con himself has stated that no creation event could happen without static time. The same applies to whatever his theoretical cause is."My response:Did you look at my 2nd round, Pro?All of the answers are there and sourced.But to save you the scroll...Right, at [+0,-0], unstable quantum fluctuations have space, time, matter, and energy fluctuating in and out of existence such that there is no stative time or the passage thereof, thus no temporal concepts like creation/causation occur.But at [+0,-0], once a virtual sub nuclear particle avoids annihilation from its antiparticle, which is the inherent instability of QF, matter, energy, space and time are then stative [+1,-1] and this is the origin of the universe; it's an origin, not a creation.Stative space at this point is so small that any stative energy is proportionally quite powerful-->inflation.Pro ignores my round 2 some more:"Con must rebuttle by claiming some sort of cause that put time and space into motion in the first place. No matter what that answer is it is unknowable even from the atheistic viewpoint."My response:Though it's not a cause, time and space in the first place is not only knowable, it's been demonstrated by the WMAP from NASA.[+0,-0] Quantum Fluctuations-->[+1,-1] Big Bang.Here's the model again: http://map.gsfc.nasa.gov...Pro gets bold:"If Con gives a theoretical cause of time and space going into motion, he needs evidence of this cause, otherwise it is a faith based assertion, and is no better an answer than a creator god or at best equal to the assertion of a creator in validity."My response:Pro, read my round 2 thoroughly...and check NASA's Big Bang Model that I've provided twice now.Pro finishes:"If time was stationary or "not" at all, this gives a lot of room to the notion of a creator that is timeless."My response:Let me translate."This gives a lot of room to the notion of a user of time-based actions that is timeless."Pro, do you see the contradiction in your assertions?If the creator is timeless, then why is he defined as a user of time i.e. a creator?