Star Trek vs Star Wars (Ultimate Nerd Showdown)

Responses to Con's Counterpoints 1.1- First, you can't tell me when exactly the space race era was, it was a cultue of scientific competition that pervaded decades, not just until we "won" by getting to the moon. Second, Star Trek didn't "capitalize" on the space race, it was an honest expression of the American culture that became fascinated by space. Star Wars on the other hand merely capitalized on Star Trek's success. Star Trek blazed the trail. Originality Advantage-Trek. 1.2- At first, I was outraged when the reboot hit delete on the entire Star Trek history and restarted. But then when I was re-watching the film again, Spock (Leonard Nimoy) said something that helped. He pointed out it was an alternate universe, not a redux, hence why the Original Spock did not cease to exist or dissapear. Further, if you consider how far Star Trek has already moved forward (see my original argument about spin offs) you see that it has more than proven its ability to move forward and leave the original characters far behind. What's neat about the reboot is that it provides an alternate universe in which Vulcan isn't there to be the shining light of reason in the galaxy, effectively plunging the future of the Star Trek-verse into a darkages. And Trek isn't the first to try this. I refer you to the Marvel-universe and their several experiments with alternate universes. Star Trek is well within its rights in the reboot. 1.3- "While Star Trek may have had one film to showcase its self-reinvention, Star Wars has had 30 years of continued success through films, tv shows, merchandising and a dedicated fan base." First off, this is just a false statement. Star Trek didn't reinvent in one film, it's been reinventing all along (see my original argument about spinoffs in Television and the movies). Second, Star Wars has had much commercial success, but none of it was artistic or nerd-worthy. You can't praise Star Wars as superior and merely cite Lucas' financial gluttony as a virtue. George Lucas would sell his soul (and has on several artistic occasions) if it means one more dollar. And the "dedicated fan base" you speak of hoard of little kids, which you freely admit later in your rebuttle. Conclusion: Star Wars has not reinvented, it has imploded. George Lucas has only repackaged and remarketed a familiar merchandise to solicit to a new generation, this doesn't make the series noble, worth-while, or in any sense superior. 2.1- Waving your hand at me and saying "this argument is irrelevant" doesn't work in real life young Jedi. Your just running away from something you have no answer for, and without your make believe force you have no power to overcome it. My point was that Star Trek is more relevant to the human condition because it's universe and theme more closely resemble real life, whereas Star Wars uses an imaginary force to form a critique on anti-democratic government. Trek on the other hand is more interested at its core, indulging the limitless imagination of the viewer and encouraging creative thinking about what might lie ahead of us. Star Wars on the other hand wants to shove a make believe dogma into the socio-philosophical debates of 2,000 years ago and call it sci-fi. I call it boring. Conclusion: Star Trek is more relevant from its core thesis, Star Wars belongs on a make believe history shelf. 3.1- I fail to see how you agreeing with me that Star Wars is juvenile and George Lucas is a soul-less whore does anything to give Star Wars superiorty over Star Trek. You're right, I guess, George Lucas cares so little for the integrity and depth of his story that he will make sweeping cuts in it to ensure he gets more money on toy sales. You're right again, I guess, Star Wars finds that the audience which best matches its content is elementary school kids who are more interested in the glowing green sticks and pod-racers than they are the plot. This points don't help your case, they embarass your supporters. 3.2- Yes I can knock it for being a mainstream success at the cost of maintaining fideltiy to a convincing plot, worthwhile characters, and quality movies. Justin Bieber is a mainstream success too, does that mean he's superior to James Taylor? I think all Star Wars fans winced reading your argument's in this "its cool to be a sellout" line of thought. They hope that the series they have placed so much interest and esteem in is more than just some cheap sales ploy gettings its casting ques from Tyco. Conclusion: We are in agreement that Star Wars is nothing more than a marketing ploy by a greedy George Lucas who targets little kids. The only difference is I think this doesn't make Star Wars better, my opponent would like to have a parade to celebrate. Response to Con's Case 1.1-Darth Vader was an excellent Villain, until Lucas reduced him to a whiny teary-eyed runt in the prequels We were supposed to witness the evolution of pure evil, instead we watched the endless turmoil of an incessant wah-a-thon blabbering about how it sucks to not be taken seriously, sucks to not be allowed to do what you want to do, and sucks to have to listen to others. Darth Vader was devolved from a limitless, fearless, unpredictable bad-A, to a teary-eyed, red-faced, hyperventilating, self-absorbed kid. 1.2-Star Trek did have Kahn, who really was an awesome villain. But unlike Star Wars, Trek is able to bring in fresh and unique villainy. For over 30 years Star Wars fans have dribbled over the menacing Darth Vader and his evil Sith collegues, whil Star Trek has innovated and installed new and freightening challenges for its heroes to face. Kahn, the Klingon, the Borg, the Ramulens, Q, Hugh, the Nexus, the Dominion, the "conspiracy" bugs, all have had their own unique dimensions and dasterdliness which Star Wars bottles up in only one bad-guy, who turns out to be a brat in a black costume. 2.1- Star Trek and Star Wars even out on the extended universe argument. Both have shelves of books written by all manner of authors. Both are able to extend their universe's history and find interesting aspects that develop the story. This is a push. 3.1- As compelling as Boba is, Jar Jar easily cancels him out (and then some). 3.2- 7 of 9.