Derek Jeter is overrated

My opponents argument is valiable, but has one fatal mistake. He says I must prove that people think too highly of him before I can make an assumption. But the mistake he makes is coming into this debate. Throughout this round, he has been arguing how Derek Jeter is not overrated. Had this argument been his only argument, it would be a good one, but there is a major contradiction. Think of it this way: Round 1 Pro: Derek Jeter is overrated Round 1 Con: Jeter is very good and should be recognized highly. "He also had a very strong argument for being the AL MVP in both 1999 and 2006" "He was voted 38th in top 100 celebrities (2005) and even has his own cologne. " "He is the captain of the Yankees. That is a hard achievement and they don't just give it out. " Round 2 Pro: He is not good and hence overrated Round 2 Con: People don't think highly of him so he can't be overrated. But Wait: In round 1 you proved to me people think highly of him? So don't evaluate this argument, it is a complete contradiction and should be thrown out. But, just for this debate, I will talk about his stats in the years he was an all-star, because the public thinks he is one of the best in baseball. The years are 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2006, 2007. No way can people think he is not good in these years, because they voted HIM BEST IN BASEBALL. Since the con concedes defense, RBIs, HRs, No MVPs, Average (yes, still has hits), stolen bases, and On base percentage, I believe that is enough evidence saying that he isn't good, and hence overrated. So, for these reasons, you should vote pro now. The only things he has is OPS+ and hits. OPS+: "many people have EVER done that? Not many, I believe there are three. That is still a humongous talent. " Well, he is still 87th all time. That is exactly what I'm talking about. People say 'oh derek jeter is so good he got some statistic one year in 3rd place. ' That doesn't justify him being a good player. Hits: You conceded average. This again supports my argument that even though he has a number of hits, he plays almost every game of the year. Anyone's bound to get some kind of record if they play enough games. I beileve average is more important, because it is a ratio. Since he conceded average, I win this argument. Don't let him bring up average in the last speech, that would be unfair, as he gets the last speech. Runs: Whoopydy do, he touched home plate in the millions of times he went at bat. He's only 87th. This yet again supports my argument that he gets at bat a lot of times, so he'll get a record. Who has the most hits in MLB? Pete Rose. Do you know who has the most games played in MLB? PETE ROSE. Answers: 1. I did not say he was not the leader, I said that we don't know how that affects a team and how much of a leader he is. 2. Bringing in Revenue makes him overrated because I believe he doesn't deserve it, and most people do. 3. Yes, my second argument does check this one. He is overrated and has nothing to do with his team's winning percentage. 4. Yes, I do think I should win because you didn't answer everything. If all you have his hits and OPS, I beileve those aren't significant enough to say he is a good player and not overrated. 5. "He is in no way BAD at these things (just not great), but the question isn't "Is he bad at these things? ". .. Rather the REAL question is: "Do people believe that he is good at things he isn't? " Well, yes, it kind of is that first question. Since he went to all of these all star games, and he's bad, that makes him overrated. 6. "Also, you said I dropped the RBI thing, when I most certainly did not. " here's what you said about it. "RBI's are important, and Jeter isn't drowning in them (although he doesn't have a slim number either), but he does have a high run's scored number " Sounds like you conceded that. You never said that batting order argument in your first speech. 7. I most certainly do understand adjusted batting titles. What I am saying is that we need to look at the stats right now, and not adjust anything. Did he win three batting titles? No he did not. 8. "Do people believe to be the unanimous MVP? Unless they do, he cannot be overrated. " I never said is Derek Jeter the most overrated player in baseball, nor did I say he was a great player. He never got an MVP because they came to their senses, looked at his stats, and realized he is not that good. That doesn't change the fact that the fans thought he was the best SS in baseball and voted him to and ASG. 9. As I said, we should not rely upon future statistics because we never know what is going to happen, or what has happened. Look to stats RIGHT NOW. 10. "a good team makes him be able to hit more? " Um yeah, if they get on base, that is not an out. 3 outs in an inning. They can get through the lineup more, allowing for more AB 11. "Well, I just argued that, historically, the position isn't for power hitting. does anyone allege that he is the best homerun hitter ever? " You never said this Power-average hitter argument until now. All you said was 'SS aren't power hitters'. I proved that the are. Nomar, Cal Ripken, A-Rod. 12. "never said the Yankees were terrible, but I don't think they are good. They are a wild-card team, and they are old. " Ummm yeah the Yankees are good. Their great. I proved that. Ok, their old. And wild card. THEY STILL MAKE IT TO THE PLAYOFFS YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR. The only reason he is somewhat good is that his team is good. Vote Pro on this argument. So, I should win this debate, because I have proved that people think highly of him, because he was elected to 8 all-stars, and I only took facts from those years. I have proven that in fact, he is not a good player, and the only thing the con has arguments on is hits, OPS, and Runs. But, since these are all because he plays so many games, they should not be evaluated. There is a major contradiction by the Con, and they have very little offense against my case.