Feminism is and has achieved equality. 3rd wave feminism is oppressive.

"Feminism has achieved equality. Third wave feminism is oppressive." That's what we're meant to be discussing, remember? Nothing else. Let's debate what we're meant to debate, not some incoherent, off-topic stuff you're spitting at me. We can discuss issues only pertaining to the West if you REALLY want to. Please let's have a rational, open minded debate about this. At the moment you're being very closed minded. Please try to open your mind. This topic has two areas that we can talk about. Area 1: HAS feminism achieved equality? Area 2: IS TWF oppressive? Area 1: Feminist movements in the past have achieved SOME equality. I've given you examples of this in the previous round. However, previous feminist movements have NOT achieved many other areas of equality. For example, only 29% of the UK elected House of Commons are women. Only 18% of Congress are women in the US. That isn't equal. Given the split in the country is roughly 50/50, this is clearly not equal. Feminists aren't saying that women should rule the world. Feminists want women to be equally represented. Ireland had full same-sex marriage before the US. Ireland is a modern country in the modern world; not a backwards one. Inability to get an abortion is a big issue for Irish women. Paid maternity leave in the US is another inequality that feminists clearly haven't achieved. Why should it be the mother who looks after the child at the detriment of her job? Because the sexist culture in the US says that mothers look after the children, fathers make the money. It deprives a mother from being able to make as much money as a man and harms their chances of promotion. This isn't equal. In France, both mothers and fathers get paid parental leave to look after their child. That's more equal. But this doesn't mean feminism has achieved equality. There are many more countries that don't have anything like France. Women might not HAVE to look after the kids, but they often do because there's no alternative. The pay gap exists. You may point to a few well paid women but that doesn't mean all women earn the same. The links above are evidence of that. Even in jobs that are dominated by women, men get paid more. Please download the PDF: http://www.iwpr.org... This compares full-time male/female workers. Please READ IT. More evidence for the blatant inequality between men/women: "Women are far more economically independent and socially autonomous, representing 42% of the UK workforce and 55% of university graduates. YET women are still less likely than men to be associated with leadership positions in the UK: they account for 22% of MPs and peers, 20% of university professors, 6.1% of FTSE 100 executive positions, and 3% of board chairpersons. This stark inequality is consistently reflected in pay gaps, despite the introduction of the Equal Pay Act in 1975. Income inequality has risen faster in the UK than any other OCED country and today women earn on average "140,000 less than men over their working careers." http://www.theguardian.com... These are just areas that have been legislated on. There are many areas that can't be legislated on, such as gendered stereotypes. To say that gendered stereotypes don't exist is false. They exist. Gendered stereotypes limits equality because people assume women should do one thing and men another. "Simply, gender stereotypes are generalizations about the roles of each gender. Gender roles are generally neither positive nor negative; they are simply inaccurate generalizations of the male and female attributes. Since each person has individual desires, thoughts, and feelings, regardless of their gender, these stereotypes are incredibly simplistic and do not at all describe the attributes of every person of each gender." http://www.healthguidance.org... You can find a list of the most common gender stereotypes. To say they don't exist is wrong. They do exist. Here's a list of 15 reasons why we still need feminism focusing on the US. Please read it: http://offthewrittenpath.com... 2 parts I want to draw extra attention to are: Talking about maths and science, there's an unconscious bias against women, probably because they're seen as "male" subjects. "When tests and applications are made anonymous, women score higher than they did if the reviewer knew their gender." http://www.slate.com... And this: Transgender women still lack many legal rights and face biases in society. "In many places, someone can still be fired for merely being transgender." http://www.huffingtonpost.com... Feminism clearly hasn't achieved equality. It's achieved a bit, but still has a long way to go. I've given lots of modern day examples why feminism is still needed and how they haven't reached equality. Let's move to the next area. Area 2: "Third wave feminism is oppressive." Firstly, your understanding of TWF (& feminism generally) is false. It is wrong. You clearly don't know what TWF is. My comments in the last round were mainly to do with TWF. If you think they were irrelevant, you clearly don't understand TWF. The ideas behind feminism CAN change as different people emphasise different ideas. Let me try and inform you. Here's what http://everydayfeminism.com... has to say about TWF: "Bottom line, the goal is homogenous: Feminism aims for gender equality within a currently patriarchal society." TWF is about allowing us to be comfortable being who we are, with our own individual desires and interests. A woman can be feminine, but she shouldn't have to be. She can also be masculine. It is the woman's personal choice. TWF tries to get women (and men) to see that it's their own choice how to act. TWF tries to get people to understand that no one is bound by gendered stereotypes that limit how they can act. Feminism isn't outdated. TWF focuses on different ideas within feminism - problems in the real world. We don't use a different "-ism" for it because it's still feminism. It still has the same core beliefs - that women (and thereby men, too) should be equal with one another. It holds the beliefs that both sexes and all genders should be equal. Simone de Beauvoir said: "A woman is not born, she is made." It is societal influences that feed into a female's mind that tells her to be feminine and conform to the gender stereotype that fits a "woman". While I'm not sure that you'll understand this, I hope you try to understand that societal influences effect how a person behaves. These influences make a person think that "As a woman, I should be at home looking after the kids" or think "As a man, I should be the one earning money". Just because there's no law saying women must be the stay-at-home parent, society deems it so. EXAMPLE: the US doesn't have a law that someone must leave a tip. However, if you don't leave a tip in a restaurant, you will be socially stigmatised. SIMILARLY, if a woman doesn't act like a woman, she will be stigmatised. TWF wants to try and break down social norms and gender stereotypes to allow people to act and behave how they like. They want freedom. Not oppression. You haven't given ANY examples of how TWF is oppressive. You gave one woman who tried to defend gay rights activists. That's not oppressive, that's liberating for the gay rights activists. The other example was of a woman who banned cisgender men. The woman wasn't a TWF. You seem to think that any female person is a TWF. They are not. A person can be female without having to be a feminist. Please give relevant, rational responses. The previous rounds you did not. Please do so now.