Plant-Based Diets are just as good if not better than Animal-Based Diets/diets with animal products

Thank you for you thoughts.Since you are PRO and have the BOP I will simply respond to your round 3 statements.1. The tone of this debate seems to have become hostile. I ask for a respectful tone.2. You state - “I’m lectured about credible sources” - (round 3 line 1) My request for sources was a response to your statement in round 1 “I'm not citing sources because I don't feel like looking all of them up -- however, I do feel confident that my opinions have been fairly well-researched.” - lets compare the sources used in round 1 and round 2 Round PRO CON 1. 0 9 2. 5 113. You suggest that Wikipedia is not a valid source - Wikipedia was used for definitions of PBD and AFS in my round 1 This is because you failed to define terms for the debate. Looking for a dictionary to define terms used in the title to your debate was unsatisfactory. - You dismissed my information on pineapple growing because it came from wikipedia. Do you have conflicting data? “Three-quarters of pineapples sold in Europe are grown in Costa Rica, where pineapple production is highly industrialized. Growers typically use 20 kg of pesticides per hectare in each growing cycle” Which part of this statement do you refute?http://www.guardian.co.uk...4. You reference “the journal of nutrition”I think you are misrepresenting or misunderstanding the content. a) it states that animal or plant protein increase urinary calcium equally - “Therefore increasing intake of purified proteins from either animal or plant sources similarly increases urinary calcium. ” b) it suggests that the calcium in milk compensates for protein related calcium loss. - “the high amount of calcium in milk compensates for urinary calcium losses generated by milk protein.” c) it suggests that high potassium levels “will decrease urinary calcium.” d) it says that meat protein is high in phosphate which helps offset the calcium loss that is normal for too much protein - “The hypocalciuric effect of the high phosphate associated with the amino acids of meat at least partially offsets the hypercalciuric effect of the protein.”Their conclusion is ““Excess” dietary protein from either animal or plant proteins may be detrimental to bone health, but its effect will be modified by other nutrients in the food and total diet.”This is about excess dietary protein - from either plant or animal sources. Dietary Animal and Plant Protein and Human Bone Health: A Whole Foods Approach by Linda K. Massey - ©2003 The American Society for Nutritional Scienceshttp://jn.nutrition.org...As I researched further I found 87 scholarly articles that referenced your “source” on google scholar. Some spoke of the conflicting opinions. Worse, the paper you cite is a minority, or even fringe opinion.Not only did you misunderstand (or misrepresent) the content of Massey’s research, but it came under fire in the peer review process.“In sharp opposition to experimental and clinical evidence, it has been alleged that proteins, particularly those from animal sources, might be deleterious for bone health” . . . “The main purpose of this review is to analyze the evidence that refutes a relation of causality between the elements of this putative patho-physiological “cascade” that purports that animal proteins are causally associated with an increased incidence of osteoporotic fractures.”http://www.tandfonline.com...The consensus of much research seems to be “It does appear that protein from animal sources is an important source of protein for humans from infancy until mature adulthood.”International Society of Sports Nutrition Symposium, June 18-19, 2005, Las Vegas NV, USA - Symposium - Macronutrient Utilization During Exercise: Implications For Performance And Supplementation PROTEIN – WHICH IS BEST? http://www.jssm.org...5. You frequently speak of excess or rich diets. Excess anything is unhealthy. We are talking about moderate / balanced diets of two kinds a) A plant-based diet (PBD) is based on vegetables, grains, legumes and fruit, b Animal Food Sources (AFS) include many food items that comes from an animal source such as meat, milk, fish, eggs, cheese and yogurt. We are not talking about starvation diets or super obese diets. We are debating healthy diets with and without AFS6. You speak of processed cheese as if it was a healthy part of anything. That is like promoting candy apples or sugar cubes as representative of vegetarian food.7. You seem concerned with Osteoporosis - Here are ways to reduce bone density loss Get regular exercise, especially weight-bearing and muscle strengthening exercise. Get vitamin D, whether through diet, exposure to sunshine, or supplements. Consuming enough calcium to reduce the amount the body has to borrow from bone. Consuming adequate vitamin K, found in green, leafy vegetables. Not getting too much preformed vitamin A. Note - there are dangers in excess protein, and cola is very bad. - http://www.hsph.harvard.edu...This, however had nothing to do with AFS diets. You need to prove that a diet without AFS is as good or better than a diet with AFS.7. You mention “U.S. News wrote in their “Best Plant Based Diets” article: Top marks went to the Mediterranean Diet (Nutritionally sound, Diverse foods and flavors, Lots of grunt work, Moderately pricey) - It is more expensive than our families current shopping plan. I like that it includes “eating fish and seafood at least a couple of times a week”Second place went to The Flexitarian Diet (Flexible, Lots of (tasty) recipes , Emphasis on home-cooking) - The claim here is weight loss, and it allows for AFS.The vegetarian diet was tied for 4th place.This is good evidence FOR AFS diets.8. The American Institute for Cancer Research says: “Plant-based foods like vegetables, fruits, whole grains, and beans should cover two thirds or more of the plate. - this leaves 1/3 of the plate for AFS9. “Please stop repeating myths about vegetarian/veganism you’ve heard over and over ” No myths - my daughter was a vegan for 5-6 years. Her health suffered. Menstrual problems, headaches, depression. She simply could not get enough iron which may have been a problem with her microbiome. On a diet that includes AFS she is much healthier.10. Great Huff Post link“As I coach people on becoming vegan, one common refrain I hear is that it's too expensive. When funds are low, the cheap burger or basket of chicken can appear to be the best value -- the most calories for the lowest price. We've been aggressively peddled the idea that a healthy diet is an expensive diet, something only for rich folks. And our experience seems to bear that out.”http://www.huffingtonpost.com...Let me conclude with this.I am not saying a PBD is always bad.I am saying that a balanced diet works well with a wide range of AFS and PBD foods.You frequently cite American bad diet habits.I agree that many Americans are incredibly obese and unhealthy.That does not change the fact that a PBD is often more work, more expensive, less local and in some cases less ethical. In my setting (East Coast Canada) eating local is a healthy mix of fish, milk, eggs, fruit, grains, greens and meat. Much of what I eat is grown by people I know. I get a little too much starch (a good friend has a potato farm). Lobsters are too rich ($ and cholesterol) for me so I don’t make use of that harvest. Fresh fish in season is wonderful, and I hope to catch some this week. Clams & muscles can be harvested year round, but summer/fall is best. I have not often eaten moose, deer, goat or lamb except with my native or Muslim friends.A balanced diet is better than an artificially restricted dietVote CON