Prayer is a failure to reason honestly and is the perfection of narcissism.

Pro has BOP it seems so I will mainly refuteSo Pros proposition is that the act of prayer( witch would mean all religions that do so.) lacks reasoning,also honesty, lastly is the perfection of narcissism. I disagree with all three motions.I will underline pros quotes and refute them.The title of this debate means that people who pray aren't using proper reasoning skills and they are enacting in a practice that allows for them to momentarily borrow narcissistic characteristics without the guilt or convictions of doing so.First of all those who believe in something came to believe that belief based on logic. Be it faulty probable logic with the possibility of being false or genuine logic that can't be refutted. In other words, all beliefs are based on inductive or deductive reasoning. Humans don't believe in things for no reason. At some point, using some form of reasoning to affirm what they believe they used reasoning skills to come to a conclusion. Even if the argument of religion is an inductive argument, inductive arguments are still formed using reasoning skills. Let's focus on Christianity. For example (A) is a regular person. (B) is a typical Christian. Below is a typical question.Ex-1A- Why do you believe in a god you cannot see? It makes no sense.B- Scientists believe gravity exists. Can we see it?A- But that's different that has been proven to exist based on its activity.B- Same thing with god he is established by the actions he does, the philosophies he fullfills, the miracles he makes happen, and the amazing things he does and has done for his followers. A- Oh i see. It makes a little bit more sense now.As you see reasoning was used to explain both persons beliefs. This is not theoretical. Conversations like these always happen and religious people are always explaining the reasoning behind why we should believe in their religion. So as we can see those who are religious do use reasoning skills.Now the question is do they use reasoning skills while praying? Well lets examine a couple reasons why people pray. According to one source there are 5 types of prayers. Praise,Thanksgiving,Confession,Supplication, and Intercessory.http://www.sundayschoollessons.com...All of these prayers use reasoning. Their bibles witch they have a reason to believe is the guidance from their creator tells them to pray. it tells them why,how,where,when, and what to pray about. All prayer has a reason it is coming out of a persons mouth or is being said in ones brain. It is a classic case of cause and effect. Prayers don't happen for no reason. Those who pray have used their mental powers and have formed conclusions. Those conclusions rationalise to themselves their prayers. Obviously reasoning is being used. The rationality of this reasoning is a different debate matter.Moving on I'm not going to debate pros list of assumptions because it's not necessary to do so and we will assume those 3 assumptions are true for the sake of this debate and because we can neither prove or disprove those points. Is it reasonable to think that there is a deity to control your wishes if he is already in control, knows the outcome, and his will shall be done? No.Wishes? are you referring to prayer? Are you suggesting that god controls a persons prayers, Or are you trying to suggest predestination? Please clear this up for me so I can refute this properly.Religious prayer walls off sections of the brain that allows for sane individuals to expect reasonable outcomes. This is a evidence lacking and baseless claim. There is no prayer phenomenon that makes certain areas of the brain not work. There are no studies to suggest this. there simply is no evidence that this is true. So as far as I can tell this is an flawed assumption.I do agree that people pray for things that seem to not be normal. Perhaps that could be used in the case against god. However the matter of if a prayer comes true or not is not important in this debate. The fact is that these prayers are still being made through humans using reasoning skills. Be it wrong or right reasoning skills is irrelevant.Is that are reasonable, are not subject to personal religious belief.I ask pro to correct this statement. This seems to be the main idea of the paragraph I extracted this from. Since I can't this part then I cant understand the entire paragraph.it is no secret that prayer is generally for the curing of personal problems.Is that a reasonable conclusion to be formed? Is that sound judgement or good sense? Is it ok to assume that because it is encompassed by your religion? I agree that the statement you just made is not based on sound judgement or good sense just like you said.. Prayer is used to help oneself and others, to praise god, to strengthen faith, and to implant faith in others. These are many unpersonal reasons for payer.Well, if it happens across the board then yes. If not, no. This moves me into my next conclusion. Prayer is the perfection of narcissism. I don't really understand what you mean by this? How are you using this as a weighing device to reach a conclusion and why is his method reasonable? To suggest that there is an omnipresent, omnipotent, omniscient, omnibenevolent being at work who talks to you specifically and will change his mind if you present him a personal problem is narcissistic. More importantly, to suggest that said being will help you with your minute personal problems, while living in the same world with starving & diseased children who are dying everyday with no help, is morally reprehensible self-centeredness.Again you are wrong to assume all prayers are about ones self. Moses recorded a prayer he made to god to spare the sinners. OTHER POEPLE. As i will prove this point fails. If I can prove people pray for others the claim of narcissism fails.Moses Prayer, Interceding For Israel Again Exodus 32:31-32 NIV 31 So Moses went back to the LORD and said, "Oh, what a great sin these people have committed! They have made themselves gods of gold. 32 But now, please forgive their sin-but if not, then blot me out of the book you have written." There are atleast 5-10more examples recorded in the bible displayed by this webpage below. Even more are recorded in the additional source.http://psalm121.ca...http://www.spirithome.com... or when someone like myself points out the rather obvious and compelling evidence that God must be cruel and unjust because he visits suffering on innocent people of a scope and scale that would embarrass the most ambitious psychopath, we're told that God is mysterious or that God works in mysterious ways. This is how you play tennis without the net."~SHMy response is slightly irrelevant but the presence of evil and injustice and suffering is justified in the bible. People may not agree with it but it is described why god allows all of it. Also religious people are not open minded they are trained to ignore anything that does not support their religion. So it doesn't matter how much you reason with them they will stubbornly defend their believes. They have a reason to.