The United States federal government should provide universal health care to its citizens.

"I said it raises taxes beyond the necessary limit. Read my post next time, don't skim it. As I said, just paying for 10% of the population causes much less of an increase in taxes, so we should do that instead." Same to you - I can still apply the same argument to that. What if your "limit" of taxes has been reached, and the government decides it needs some minor funding for a highway project? Then the taxes will have been raised beyond the "necessary limit". I could go on with many different examples, so you see my point; you can't say this is a consequence of just health care. "Typo, smart one..." I realized that obviously... "Because Johnny can get the health care plan he wants rather than the one the government wants. That's why I emphasized monetarily. I was showing that Johnny doesn't need or want universal health care for himself." OK, so Johnny wants a better health plan than Bobby, so he gets it. Bobby wants it too, but he can't have it, because he's broke. How do you think Bobby feels? According to this whole "equal rights" thing we've been talking about, Bobby deserves the same health care as Johnny. So why shouldn't he get it? Especially if he was born into a position where he can't change his situation easily. "Okay, so the government should also choose what we wear so we don't have to decide that either. Also, it should choose what we eat, drink, buy, do et cetera. I definitely want the government making all my decisions for me. My point is is that Johnny can get the plan that fits his needs, or even get a free plan from his job, rather than paying high taxes to get government health care." I'm not saying the government should make decisions for us, you're over exaggerating it. I'm saying that we should all use one health plan, that covers common problems. Any additional problems can be given by his job, like he said. But basic needs should be given to all people. In fact, this way, since not as many things will be covered by a universal health plan (for example, uncommon things like tornadoes will not be included, but common things like surgery will be), it won't cost as much. Add in the fact that only 10% of the people will get the benefit and it will not monetarily affect the rest, and it's not that bad of a tax raise. "Since you can't comprehend the English language, we may have a problem. I meant they don't need the government to give them health care. Jack and Johnny both don't need government health care, Bobby does, give it to Bobby, and let Jack and Johnny pay lower taxes and get free health care from their jobs, or get health care that pays for spa treatments. My plan has more pros than yours." Well I do have a C or D in English...damnit! XD Oh well, back to the debate. Fine, I'll list the Pros and Cons of each plan. Pros of Universal: + everyone gets it Cons: - tax increase Pros of Non-universal: + no tax increase His plan doesn't have more Pros, but it has less Cons. However, let's analyze it further for a minute. His main benefit is that Bobby will get his free health care, while Johnny's is supplied by his job and covers his specific needs. Now, in a universal plan, everyone gets basic needs, and nobody would get specific benefits. However, Johnny's job can give him the extra benefits he needs. So instead of the job having the burden of providing ALL health care benefits, it only needs to provide the ones specific to that job. Also, everyone starts with an equal amount of health care (equal rights). So in a universal plan, less pressure is put on specific jobs, and everyone starts with equal protection. The only "problem" is a tax increase. However, it can be worked into the budget in place of something else to even it out. "Okay, first, just because it isn't in the Constitution does not mean it isn't a right. Second, you need a stable economy in order to allow people to effectively use their rights. Without a stable economy we fall into a state of nature like situation, and people aren't happy." Exactly. That's why one of the purposes of government is to stabilize the economy. But a stable economy cannot be compared to free speech for example; free speech is a fundamental right that cannot be limited. Economic stability, however, is just necessary to establishing good living conditions. It makes life good. It's not like the government doing a bad job with the economy would be taking away a right; it'd just be a bad government. "That's not what I said. I said that Johnny, if his job does not provide him with free health care, pays the same whether he has universal health care, or whether he is buying health care for himself under my plan. What happens is that people like Jack end up paying the same in a universal system as they did when they bought their own health insurance, but they are getting much less. What's the point of that?" Like I suggested earlier this argument, the job can provide any extra benefits Jack needs. He already gets common protections, though. So they are not getting less. And Bobby is getting more. That's the point of it. And for the record, your example sucks; why would you get free spa treatment with your health insurance? lol "Jack would rather buy his friggin' sweet health care plan than pay obscene taxes so that he gets free health care that isn't anywhere nearly as sweet" No, he would get the basic health care from the government, and then his job would give him the friggin' sweet part. So what he doesn't pay out normally (the unsweet part) would go back in taxes. No gain, no loss. Sweet enough? "So that also means that we must have equal houses, but rich people have to pay more for them? Sounds real fair to me." Did you notice that people who pay more for their houses, have bigger houses? Maybe that's why they pay so much. Rich people pay more, because they get more. Vote Pro because: 1. I have shown why universal health care does not mean paying more and getting less. 2. Universal health care keeps current health care bonuses while providing more care to those who need it.