The Council on Foreign Relations (The CFR) is a shady organization.

Now Bee, listen, there's organization which is always appreciated… and then there's this spreading out thing that you do which makes something that should be 1 page into 3. Lol, I implore you to see that there is a difference. =P Do Founders Really Matter: My opponent has claimed that the beliefs of Colonel House are irrelevant to the organization he babied into existence, he claims it's not important to know any history or background (political or otherwise) because it just doesn't matter in terms of the present. Well, well – if only people such as employers thought that way, no? No longer would pedophiles be afraid to go and apply for work at daycare centers, how awesome… The fact of the matter is: history does matter. Connections matter, involvement matters and most importantly, the beliefs of a person who creates something matters to that something they create. House's belief was this, "America is the most undemocratic of democratic countries… Our constitution and our laws have served us well for the first hundred years of our existence, but under the conditions of today they are not only obsolete, but even grotesque."(1) This debate is about if the CFR is a shady organization, it's not about if the CFR is really a Marxist monster trying to devour all of us into social dictatorship so try not to let Bee distract you with that. The CFR Makes Recommendations: Yes, the CFR makes recommendations that almost always become lawful policy. Bee has agreed with me that the organization is primarily white rich businessmen who clearly have a heavy hand in shaping our political past, present and future. He would have you believe that that's because these people are so enlightened and this organization so diverse and dynamic that our government just can't resist the goodness that is their advice… Yet, he has already agreed that this organization is far from diverse and dynamic in conceding that it's mostly made up of white rich men, you see it? It's really these corporate big cats who are running our country so it doesn't matter which president we elect to be the figurehead. After all, their "recommendations" are sure realized more than anything our presidents have ever promised to deliver. The Admiral's Quote …explains exactly why that is. That quote isn't explaining some fair debating process, it's explaining a shadow government that's running our country and how they're accomplishing it. Hence the, "CFR shadow government" part. The CFR Isn't Shady 'Cause The Website Says It Isn't: "Just becasue they say it does not mean it is true, I admit that. However, the material I have cited from them does in fact resemble reality. If it was factually incorrect, it would be rather easy to point it out, would it not? Why, yes it is easy to point out. I have provided link after link pointing it out. The CFR is full of half truths when it comes to its explanation of itself and that is why there's so much material on how what they're saying and doing is wrong. You, however… have only cited information from the page itself -- so again we go right back to, "The CFR isn't shady because it says it isn't." We already know that the they don't want us thinking they're shady, but thank you anyway. Big Business: "First, could it be that Big Business is interested in the CFR because Big Business thrives on sound foreign policy?" -- What's your definition of sound foreign policy? Would you consider the decision to go into Iraq an expression of sound foreign policy? Big business is sure benefiting from our occupation there, so I guess to them it was indeed just that. "What helps America helps Big Business more than anyone, since they're so... big." – Hmm, does war benefit America? It sure benefits international bankers and the like. What benefits this country as a whole and what benefits big business are two different things and they always have been. Then you go on to label me a conspiracy theorist because I disagree with and am not regurgitating what the CFR site says… They're the ones who proclaim they have such a diverse membership, take it up with them why they can't just declare themselves an organization of corporate white rich men as they've always been and always will be. Secret Board Meetings: I never said that since we don't know for sure that they're not hurting us to just assume that they are (I have specified two reasons why they are), I was simply pointing out that they're secretive. What a tool for the public at large when half of the things they discuss aren't even disclosed to us. 1. They Undermine Our Democracy: See "The CFR Makes Recommendations:" The people elect government officials to represent them and their interests, but the CFR and organizations like it are who actually represent America. What they want is what they get and what we want is irrelevant. For how many years have we seen this proven to us? 2. The CFR Aims To Abolish Our Sovereignty: Bee's only response to this was that in the face of a threat, it *is* a good idea to give up sovereignty…… I don't agree? "The sovereignty fetish is still so strong in the public mind, that there would appear to be little chance of winning popular assent to American membership in anything approaching a super-state organization. Much will depend on the kind of approach that is used in further popular education." – 1994 Council on Foreign Relations Report. (4) Now, I can offer plenty of quotes from former CFR insiders and qualified individuals as to the truth of what the CFR thinks of our sovereignty such as, Admiral Chester Ward (I only sited one of his quotes), Carrol Quigley, James Macgregor, Curtis Dall, more troubling CFR reports themselves and so on (also 4)… But I want to focus on the one I pulled out here as it relates to the Council on Foreign Relations, Canadian Council of Chief Executives, and the Consejo Mexicano de Ausuntos Internacionales sponsored press release of "The North American Community" in 2005. What this report is doing is making more recommendations as to how we should strengthen NAFTA until there's little difference between our three countries. We have the presidential candidates of today going on about strengthening our border, and yet here we have evidence that what our white rich men who are running the country really want is the very opposite. I can't draw you an entirely inclusive picture of this because I'll run out of characters and everybody will get tired of me before then anyway, but here's this site that cuts to the chase, Beemor -- http://www.renewamerica.us... And the report that it's drawing off of is here: http://www.cfr.org... And the official report that I'm talking about is here: http://www.cfr.org... For the official report, go down to page 24 and skim over it at least until page 28 and further if you'd like. Conclusions: The CFR is a secretive organization that is full of half truths when it comes to its explanation of itself. Its influential members are the sort with lots of money to pump into the "think tank" in order to have it spitting back out at them the ways and means in which to achieve their personal and corporate objectives. These corporate objectives have nothing but the best interest of the white elite in mind and not the best interest of America in general. Most of their recommendations are made into law and half of the time we don't even know what they are before it's already too late. The CFR is in favour of an ever strengthening and connected North American Community that can only stop at one place… A North American Union. Therefore –they definitely undermine our sovereignty and that's obviously pretty shady and hurtful to the American public. (1) http://www.canadafreepress.com... (2) http://www.fdrs.org...