The trinity is a false teaching

1) God says he is the one and only _____________________________ +You attack this by saying, "The fact that three separate things not only CAN be one but very often ARE one clearly negates your argument that 'God describing Himself as One means He cannot also be three.' - Now, the mistake with this argument is that your argument only works if I was saying "God says he is God." He's not just saying he's God[...] He's saying there are no other forms, he's the ONLY God. Now, onto the "side note of the contention (if you will)" +You sare saying"""Is there ice in the world now? Sure there's some in my freezer right now. Is there water in the world now? Sure there's some in a glass in front of me. Is there steam in the world now? Sure there's some coming off of the kettle. All the water in all of the universe is in one of these three states. It's still ONE body of water.""" -This is a logical fallacy. This statement makes perfect since, and is true. However, it is irrelivant to what i'm stating. I'll put it this way. Let's say God is H20. Now, if ONE solution of H2O changes from Ice into liquid, then from liquid into gas (THE VERY SAME SOLUTION OF H2O)... you can say YES GOD IS ALL THREE IN ONE. BUT, when you have one solution of H20 in its water state, and a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT SOLUTION of H20 in its ice state right next to each other in each others presence at the same time, it creates the 2 H20's oppose to just one (MEANING THERE ISN'T ONE GOD BUT THERE ARE PLURAL). And there is where the problem lies. If God is all three into one, they most certainly can't all be present at the same time; because if they are, then there is 3 God's and not one! This said, they would only be able to be around ONE AT A TIME. This is where the problem sets in inside of the bible. God reveals himself to Jesus and the others when Jesus is baptized by his cousin in the river. Jesus pleads to God while in the garden before he is captured by the romans to NOT UNDERGO HIS TREATMENT IF HE DOESN'T HAVE TO, and he pleads to God while on the cross. Surely if they are the same person, THERE IS NO WAY THAT THEY ARE BEGGING EACH OTHER TO NOT MAKE THE OTHER DO SOMETHING, CONVERSATING WITH EACH OTHER, OR REVEALING THEMSELVES TO EACH OTHER (unless there is more than 1 God)!! The simple fact that they would be able to communicate back and forth means that they aren't 2 or 3 in 1, but 2 or 3 in 2 or 3. ___________________________________ 2) Bible writers would make it clear that they are all one ___________________________________ Your definition of Christ is flawed. By your definition, EVERY PROPHET, every disciple (if you believe jesus is God), and every person that talked to God and was told to do something by God, IS CHRIST. Christ is defined as-messiah (which is): any expected deliverer http://www.google.com... or 1capitalized a: the expected king and deliverer of the Jews b: jesus 1 2: a professed or accepted leader of some hope or cause http://www.merriam-webster.com... even the name "Jesus" originated before Jesus The Christ. So in a sense, everyone of them was God. This said, I'll post my argument again. God is the messenger of the word to his people, so he was referenced to accordingly. The scripture you provided doesn't say JESUS Christ, just Christ." It is also widely accepted that there were MANY other blasphemers of "God's Son" at this time.... This next question isn't part of the debate, but, what singles this one man out? I'll Concede that Jesus was a VERY effective prophet, even the most succesful leader of all time. However, I will not concede that he is God. ___________________________________________________ 3) No one else in the bible is called the ALMIGHTY ___________________________________________________ This first time you argued against this contention, the argument didn't fit this one, but it did the 5th Contention. I refuted the argument from you on your last post in the 1st contention. So since you've failed to go against THIS contention, i'll post the original text back up here: JESUS called God "the only true God." (John 17:3) Never did he refer to God as a deity of plural persons. That is why nowhere in the Bible is anyone but Jehovah called Almighty. Otherwise, it voids the meaning of the word "almighty." Neither Jesus nor the holy spirit is ever called that, for Jehovah alone is supreme. ________________________________________________ 4) God couldn't be tempted to join a cause against himself ________________________________________________ + You've stated """If He is separate and Has free will and became a man then the choice to rebel was open to Him. He resisted that temptation and, as with any resistance, He suffered.""" - Now, lets say he does indeed switch sides. Then what? Jesus is with the Devil while God and the Holy Spirit are still in Heaven? This, AGAIN, is evidence of either there being 3 seperate gods (that aren't one), or that Jesus isn't a "God" at all. You say the key to understanding this is knowing that Jesus became fully human without sinning. But, there is no such thing as "FULLY" human without sinning. First off, I don't even think Jesus The Prophet (what he should go by) was sinnless, and I don't understand how you think he was. HIS LIFE IS MISSING FROM AGE 12 TO AGE 33!! The ages where people go out and "have fun (sin)" are completely left out of the bible. How can you ignore the fact that, that may mean he wasn't "oh so holy" as we expected? If you were to read a book about me where it said "David Angelo Snell Jr has stated he is God. He healed people, fixed people, and cured people," then it left out all of my years from 12 to the year before i die and said He was SINLESS, WOULD YOU THEN BE COMPELLED TO BELIEVE IT? What if I got a group of 12 friends (Romi, Scott, Michael, Tonish, Johnny, Cody, Ramen, Austin, Shavey, Sean, Chris, and Tommy) to vouch for me, then I also added in a few family members and random people I've had a positive impact on to vouch also, would you believe it then? _________________________________________________ 5) Jesus being God would be counterproductive to his Cause _________________________________________________ + you've stated, "What kind of man would He be if He did not need to pray to God etc like the rest of us?" By this what I'm guessing you mean is "What kind of 'image' of a man would he be if he didn't pray like the rest of us" - He'd be the same kind of man who has superpowers and never sinned. (according to you) He knows he is God, and if you say he's stated that he IS god, then he doesn't have to pray. All that would be doing is confusing his followers (like you). Come on now, think logically for a second (in your own view), someone is telling you he is GOOOOOD!!! THE CREATOR OF AAAALL, then turns around and prays to God when he is in his times of need? Does that add up to you? Would you believe me if I did it? Why not? Then why would you believe someone who did it? You also say "We Christians are very certain of the Trinity. Nothing makes sense without it." Howver not all christians believe in Jesus being God. All you have to do is believe that Jesus is the son of God (not exactly that he is him) ____________________________ 6) Jesus was created by God ____________________________ Evidence where it says that jesus is created by God is present in my last post!! Look and read! Now are you disagreeing with your bible Mr. D? ____________________________ Extra arguments: >>>You must refute each piece of scripture I have presented which clearly shows Jesus Christ is God. I'M PRO! you have to refute all of MY arguments.. NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND!! Why? Simply because without all of mine and just a few, it still stands. Without all of yours and just a few, its a weak argument