A Christian Cannot Lose His Salvation

As it is the last round I would like to state my position clearly.1. We are saved by grace (God’s kindness that we don’t deserve) Through faith (Complete trust or confidence) This faith is a gift from God. [Eph 2:8]NOTE - Belief in a set of precepts is not enough. James 2:19 (NASB) You believe that God is one. You do well; the demons also believe, and shudder.2. Discussions of eternal security often hit these common pitfalls including: a) Defining salvation narrowly as those (known only to God) who make it to the end. In this position, anyone who falls away is dismissed with the phrase “they were never really saved to begin with.” by the narrow definition of this position. One (of many) problems with this position is that the definition is not biblical. It also leaves people wondering if they are really “saved to begin with.” This fear seems to be in exact contradiction of the supposed goal of this position (that believers know they are secure) b) Defining salvation too broadly as everyone who claims to be a Christian. In this position, many who show little evidence of Christian character, faith and works are considered to be Christian. This is also a position against the clear teaching of scripture. In time, some of these so called believers go from claiming a Christian position to some other position. The main problem with this is that Christianity is not about affirming some doctrinal position or intellectual assent to a set of beliefs. c) Forgetting that salvation is primarily a work of God leads to many errors. It is about being “in Christ” - Rom 8:1 “Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.” Being “in Christ” includes the presence of the Holy Spirit - Rom 8:9 “However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.” This includes God’s choosing, sometimes called election, and it includes us abiding in Him. 1 John 4:1313 By this we know that we abide in Him and He in us, because He has given us of His Spirit.3. God offers freedom of choice. From the garden of Eden [Gen 2:15-17] to final judgment [Rev 20:7-9] this is God’s way. Why would God, on this one issue, remove the freedom to choose? I do not believe that salvation is a fragile thing. I simply see no evidence that God removes the freedom to choose or even rebel.4. You can trust God. “He is able to guard what I have entrusted to Him until that day. ” [2 Tim 1:12] The people who step out of that secure position are those who no longer entrust themselves to Him. They are the ones who persist in running from God’s grace. My experience is that many who run from God are brought back.2 Tim 1:8-12 (NASB)8 Therefore do not be ashamed of the testimony of our Lord or of me His prisoner, but join with me in suffering for the gospel according to the power of God, 9 who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was granted us in Christ Jesus from all eternity, 10 but now has been revealed by the appearing of our Savior Christ Jesus, who abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel, 11 for which I was appointed a preacher and an apostle and a teacher. 12 For this reason I also suffer these things, but I am not ashamed; for I know whom I have believed and I am convinced that He is able to guard what I have entrusted to Him until that day. Thanks to Pro for the great topic.Great to debate with friends.I hope you stop reading now, . . . . (VOTE CON) but for those who want to see my response to PRO’s round 4 thoughts I will persevere.Pro R4P1 - “Con would be right in saying that I do not accept the said definition” The time for PRO to present a definition or respond to my definition is before the final round. I must presume on the voters to accept the common dictionary definition rather than allowing PRO to define the word differently. Christian - one who professes belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ. The time for PRO to offer a definition would be in round 1, 2 or 3.Pro R4P1 - “Con did not answer the question, "Did Charles Templeton believe in any of the essential doctrines?"” In case I was not clear enough, Charles Templeton believed and taught all “the essential doctrines” as referenced by PRO.Pro R4P2 - “ were David's enemies believers?” David was not a believer in Jesus. His enemies were not believers in Jesus. I was simply pointing out that both the New Testament and the Old Testament speak of God’s book of life. Both NT and OT talk about the results of not having your name in the book of life. The Bible talks about removing names from the book. [1] PRO tries to say that these refer to physical life (as though God killed the body right then) but these people lived on. I leave it to the readers to look at these scriptures and decide if it is referring to physical life or to something eternal and spiritual. [2] In Genesis 6/7 it is clearly physical. After Exodus it is clearly not physical.Pro R4P3 - Pro references 1 Cor. 5:1-5 (round 3) - I did not use this as an argument for my position so I am not sure why Pro has brought this up. Let me give 2 comments on this scripture. a) Most scholars think 2 Cor 2:1-11 refers to this same situation. He repented and the people were told to affirm their love for him as well. b) Trying to link 1 Cor 5:1-5 about a particular sin of a particular man with Rev 2:5 is sloppy scholarship. Rev 2:5 is Jesus’ words to the church in Ephesus (Not Corinth).Pro R4P4 - “Is there a middle ground/a lukewarm position in an eternal sense? Is it possible for one to be not saved and to be not unsaved at the same time?” I need clarification. I’m not sure what you are trying to say, and there are no more rounds to help me understand your position. Pro references http://www.godandscience.org... in saying that “ the Greek word for crown is a reference to rewards, not salvation”. This is a mistake. The Greek word for crown actually refers to (surprise) a crown. It is the job of the reader to interpret what the writer meant. The quote cited by PRO says “The Greek word for crown, stephanos, according to Thayer, has the meaning "metaphorically the eternal blessedness which will be given as a prize to the genuine servants of God and Christ: the crown (wreath) which is the reward of the righteousness.” Anyone can redefine a word to “metaphorically” mean something that supports their preconceived position.Pro R4P5 - “ it is safe to say that the "handed over to the torturers" part must be the disciplining of believers for their sins (5). If this refers to salvation being lost, then how could such people be referred to as servants anymore?” You are making a circular argument here. You can only say “we know that they would only get judged for their rewards instead of salvation” if you have presumed your version of eternal security. The words of Jesus make clear that this is NOT discipline. He (the wicked servant) now had responsibility for the entire debt. “And his lord, moved with anger, handed him over to the torturers until he should repay all that was owed him.” [Mt 18:34 NASB]Pro R4P6 - Again the circular argument and redefinition of Christian from the natural and common meaning of the word. If you wanted to use such an unusual definition, you should have at least presented it in round 1, 2, or 3. [1] http://www.biblegateway.com...[2] http://www.biblegateway.com...