All Governments are Criminal Organizations

For this round, will simply test con's arguments out by using the same arguments for a known criminal institution as a baseline - the question is "does the same line of argument justify the actions of the mafia?". Since we know the actions of the mafia are not justifible or legitimate, we can assume any argument which justfies or legitimizes the criminal actions of the mafia are not valid. For this thought experiment, I will assume that the mob boss makes sizable donations to the orphanage he was raised in. Think of the orphans"First off a law is a law and if you break it then that is your own damn fault not the governments." First off a mob boss's rules are the rules and if you break it then that is your own damn fault not the mafia's. You must first assume that the rules are legitimate before you can assume that the violence used to enforce those rules is justified. This is circular reasoning."criminal organizations dont give people rights"Neither do governments. When a government "gives" you a right, it is simply establishing that it can not legally violate that particular "right", buy any right that isn't codified is on the table, hence the state violating your property rights and rights of movement.'Yeah if asking nicely and giving you an option to choose youre own fate is counted as violence'If the mafia asks you nicely and gives you an option to choose whether you pay protection, aren't you choosing you're own fate? If I point a gun to your head and demand your wallet, and you give it to me, I'm giving you a choice, right? If you give it to me and I don't shoot you, is it then OK? It's not a "violent" or "coercive" act if I don't shoot you?"The reason they can deny you access is if youre a smuggler or a criminal or someone wanted for committing a crime. If youre not a criminal or a smuggler then youre allowed to go around anywhere."Stating a motivation is not justification for the act they are motivated to do, even if that motivation is "good". The reason the mob can kick you out of the ciy is if you're a trouble-maker. If you don't make any trouble, and keep your nose clean, you don't got nothing to worry about."You cannot assume that [all governments are criminal organizations] just because 1 might qualify that all others do qualify."Like I said before, based on the definition of 'crime', exluding any exeptions, all governments, as defined in this argument, are, de-facto, criminal organizations. It is axiomatic, like saying "all apples are fruits", and defining an apple as a "fruit which grows on an apple tree". The criteria for criminality explicitly includes the qualities specifically defined in government."You have yet to give proof that they are indeed criminal organizations."If these fictional governments have fictional laws which are enforced with fictional law enforcement and claim a monopoly over fictional geographic regions and collect fictional taxes, then they are fictional criminal organizations, unless you define "crime" as "not crime" or "not crime when fictional governments do it"."Law enforcement still acknowledges that people have rights, that law enforcement is limited in how they treat people, and that law enforcement lives by codes and laws that they have to obey."The mob knows that people deserve respect, and there are certain things that they just won't do. You treat them right, and they'll treat you right. There's even "honor among theves"."for a government to work it needs taxes"For a extortion racket to work, we need to collect the protection money. Think of the orphans."you have still not offered evidence showing that each and every one of these are criminal organizations. "You are shifting the onus. In essence, you are stating that I must deliver an infinite number of counter-arguments to these examples. You are doing this because, I suspect, you don't understand the axiomatic nature of my argument. My argument works with all possible governments in all possible universes, as long as they meet the criteria.You have asserted several times that I have offered "no proof" that governments are criminal organizations. To say this is to miss the point etirely. If I say that all apples are fruits and define apple as a fruit, then, yes, ALL apples are fruits, definately and definitively. You are saying that there are fictional apples, and put the onus on me to prove that all fictional apples are fruits, when you ignore the definition of "apple" stated to avoid exactly that kind of confusion.The rest of your argument is a repetition of the same points - "yeah, but...". Yeah, but governments pay for good things. Yeah, but governments punish bad people. Yeah, but governments give us free goodies. Yeah, but governments protect us from evil warlords. This may all be entirely true, but it is also irrelevant, as I am not saying that providing these services is a criminal act any more than the mob boss giving money to an orphanage is a criminal act. It's not what they do with their money and power (most of the time), it's how they get the money, and how they keep their power. You also choose to argue against some of my rhetorical statements I made during the round you forfieted. I could engage in those extraneous argument, but it would take too long and detract from the point.Your final diatribe against anarchism is an ad hominum attack. Yes, I'm an "anarchist" because I don't believe in morally justifiable INITIATIONS of force. Just calling me an "anarchist" is a de-facto straw man since you obviously have a misunderstanding of my position, so can not possibly address my arguments which defend them. I could be a satanist, child-molesting drug-dealing murderous psychopath, but that wouldn't change the substance of my argument."Governments give people rights"Rights are "unalienable". They do not come from government. Government, if anything. codifies and (alegedly) protects some rights at the expense of violation other rights"."Governments acknowledge people's property rights"Government can not protect your property by taking it by force."Governments provide services to its people"Not nearly as many services as the free market does."Governments puts criminals, murderers, and rapists in jail"Success rate is about 10% in the US. US government also murders people in brutal wars, and uses the fear of rape to gain your obedience."Governments fund jails to keep criminals in"It also defines what a "criminal" is, and can put you in jail for not obeying it."Governments acknowledge the right to bear arms, Anarchies dont"That is the exact opposite of the truth, much like many other things you've said. Here's the thing, If you were born in a hospital, been to a hospital, seen a dentist, or gone to a school, then the government has spent money on you.... So the government does spend money on EVERYONE