Baptism into Christ is the point of salvation, not any time before.

I affirm that a person who believes that Jesus is the Christ, must be baptized into Christ in order to be saved. The baptism I am talking about is (one of water, Total immersion) Thereby no matter how much a person has emotions for God or Jesus, belief alone will not saved a person from their sins. (infant baptism is not in consideration here because a baby is not a believer, and has not sin). This debate is solely focused on adult baptism. That topic can be or another time. Also we are not talking about baptism with the Holy Spirit. Accepted evidence in this debate, must be the Bible. Your understanding and Three quotes from three different sources per round and one of them must be from the bible. Also at the end of rounds 2, 3, 4, 2 questions may be asked and must be answered by the opponent in the next round at the beginning. When asking questions, They must be from the prior argument. 1st Round will be Today, the introduction given must state who you are and what you intend to prove and the beginning of your argument. 2nd round We must answer your given questions, produce any new evidence in this round, plus 3 questions may be asked of your opponent position 3rd round We must answer your given questions, produce any new evidence in this round, plus 3 questions may be asked of your opponent position 4th Round We must answer your given questions, produce any new evidence in this round, plus 3 questions may be asked of your opponent position 5th round We must answer any questions given, and produce the conclusion of our argument. (using only the evidence we produced in rounds 1-4) My Argument begins Hi my name is Tim, and my opponent name is Preacher Andy. I just want to thank Preacher Andy for agreeing to this debate. I am known as Sword master here. I live in Michigan, and am a father of 5 great Children. One is with Jesus and 4 are still here. I have the greatest wife in the world. I have went through a 2 years in a school of preaching, and acquired 130 credit hours. But if the foundation of knowledge I received is off, everything that I learned will be rancid to some degree. So if my opponent does not have the same level of training in the word that I have and he is factual in his beliefs, and I am not, My schooling would have done nothing for me, but make my beliefs rotten. Therefore it is more important to look at what is being said, then to see who said it. In the same way the evidence we use (no matter the honor of the degree, or the popularity of the person we quote, if they are not factual in what they believe, they are as rotten and rancid as any false teacher. Debates are fun, and can be healthy, if attitudes are right, but if attitudes are wrong, debates can be a weapon for Satan to use to destroy the belief of the weak in Christ. So as I approach this debate it is with an attitude of Honoring Christ, Creating belief in the non believer, and teaching the truth as God commands all Christians to do. I also want to honor my opponent Preacher Andy, for his conviction, and courage to stand up for what he believes, and honor me with this debate. In this debate I must prove that 1. belief alone does not save. 2. What actions/obedience, saves a person from their sins must involve baptism. 3. I believe I must also prove that anything less than baptism with the correct understanding, does not make one a Christian, but a follower of the blind, who leads ignorant people to hell with himself. Once I have proved these facts, it will be impossible for anyone who has believed otherwise to continue in that belief, and know they are a Christian. So let's get started. John 3:16 16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. This is a very important verse, we have seen it at ball games and in tracks from various denominations and it is probably the most famous verse in the bible.. Yet for all its fame, it is the most abused and misunderstood verse in the bible. I want to focus on the Word "believes" The Greek word for belief is πιστεύω pisteuō and the root word of this Greek word is πίστις. Now πίστις is a feminine noun, which means 1) conviction of the truth of anything, belief; in the NT of a conviction or belief respecting man's relationship to God and divine things, generally with the included idea of trust and holy fervour born of faith and joined with it relating to God the conviction that God exists and is the creator and ruler of all things, the provider and bestower of eternal salvation through Christ From that word comes πιστεύω pisteuō This word that is used by Jesus in John 3:16, is a verb. Not a name of a trust or emotion, but Jesus used a word that describes an action. Vines Greek dictionary. Moultins lexicon When pisteuō is parse out this is what we find: Tense: Present, Voice: Active, Mood: Participle. The present tense represents a simple statement of fact or reality viewed as occurring in actual time The active voice represents the subject as the doer or performer of the action. The Participle Mood represents "-ing and can be used either like a verb or a noun, as in English, and thus is often termed a "verbal noun." Blue letter bible. Here is the question, Why did Jesus use this particular Greek word? Jesus said pisteuō, Not the feminine noun πίστις? If Jesus did not want any wrong understandings why this word? Jesus is saying belief he want all believers to have is one of action. The Holy Spirit through the pen of James said James 1:22, But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. Thus James and John are not contradictory but in line and in full agreement with each other. Jesus is saying in John to believe in action. James is talking to Jewish Christians and telling them the same thing, IN Matthew Henry's commentary on James 1:22 he says, 3. We are taught what is to be done after hearing (v. 22): But be you doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves. Observe here, (1.) Hearing is in order to doing; the most attentive and the most frequent hearing of the word of God will not avail us, unless we be also doers of it. If we were to hear a sermon every day of the week, and an angel from heaven were the preacher, yet, if we rested in bare hearing, it would never bring us to heaven. Therefore the apostle insists much upon it (and, without doubt, it is indispensably necessary) that we practice what we hear. Jamison, Fausset, and Brown in their commentary on James 1:22." Qualification of the precept, "Be swift to hear": "Be ye doers . . . not hearers only"; not merely "Do the word," but "Be doers" systematically and continually, as if this was your regular business. James here again refers to the Sermon on the Mount ( Mat 7:21-29 )." And finally Matt 7:21-23, 21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!' Therefore When Jesus speaks of belief in John 3:16, he is talking about an obedient belief. One that is more the lip service. He never authorizes only lip service, So in matters of salvation, what did he authorize? Well tonight we will look at What actions/obedience, saves a person from their sins and prove it must involve baptism. Resources used: The New King James bible, Moulton Greek lexicon, the blue letter bible, Vines Greek dictionary, and Mathews Henry's & James, Fausset, Brown commentaries on James. Thank