LM Classic: mongeese vs iamadragon

Okay, first, to address my opponent's questions and counter-strategies and whatnot. "The philosophical, profound nature of the existence of the rock fuels part of my argument. I view existence as a tier system. In a battle, we seek to bring an opponent down one tier. This is what constitutes defeat. For any living opponent, a defeat (in general terms) is being killed. For anything that has a life, defeat is the loss of that life. What about, however, something that doesn't have a life in the first place? It stands to reason that the way to defeat a non-living object would be to make it completely non-existent. More on this later." Incorrect. "12) Being knocked out, rendered unusable, or killed is considered defeat. People who are knocked out, rendered unusable or killed cannot be used any more during a match." [1] Technically, because the rock is unusable, it is already defeated. "1. What are the limits on the size of what Kirby can swallow? The source does not specify. It appears to be infinite, and therefore, not in accordance with the rules of the debate." http://www.youtube.com... See Video 1 (1:10). Quite a large range, but far from infinite. "2. Yugi and the Millennium Ring. Can Yugi use the Millennium Ring? To quote my opponent's source, 'The strong people who managed to survive the ring's power are: Mahado, Ryo Bakura, and Dark Marik.'" Given that people who are capable of using one Millennium Item are capable of using many, and Atem is one of the most powerful spirits in the entire anime, he would certainly be able to unlock the powers of the Millennium Ring. "1. It seems to me that if Kirby could swallow three humans in one gulp, he would have done so to a lot of his enemies in the TV show–thus, it seems to me, so far, that Kirby would not be able to swallow all three at once. Also, my opponent states Kirby has a very limited vocabulary. Is it enough to understand commands from my opponent?" Kirby cannot swallow excessively large objects, like the monsters usually imported by King Dedede. However, he will eat the small ones. Kirby cannot speak very well, but he is capable of being instructed, as Tiff does constantly in the show. "3. The Millennium Ring is about the size of Flavor Flav's clock necklaces." What? As interesting as this is to know, it serves no purpose to this debate. "It is not a very 'fine' instrument. How could something so large possibly point out an atom? The answer: it clearly can't." The answer is magic. It always is. If Yugi wants to know where the atom is, then the Millennium Ring will point in the general direction of the atom. Sure, the location would not be exact, but I would be able to narrow the atom's location down to a few square feet, allowing Kirby to easily eat it if necessary. If that does not work, I can always have Link ride on Kirby's Warp Star and hang Kirby off of the side using the Clawshot. Link can then use Kirby as a vacuum-cleaner, taking him all over New York City, eating everything he possibly can. The atom stands no chance. "2. First of all, I doubt Kirby can swallow this rock. It is massive. So, this point is already refuted. However, I'll go on to explain why Kirby's swallowing of the rock is ultimately irrelevant." Oh. You're using a giant rock. By my opponent's picture, it seems that he is using Ayer's Rock. However, Ayer's Rock is extremely large. I doubt that it would actually fit in New York City, especially when it is 1,142 ft. tall [2], and the highest point in New York City is 1,250 feet high [3], Ayer's Rock would have to be located in a large expanse with no building or construction that would tilt Ayer's Rock out of the zone allowed. I doubt that this is even possible. "2. Say Kirby did swallow the rock. What does that mean? The rock now exists inside of Kirby. The rock still exists. Therefore, it is not defeated." However, the rock would be rendered unusable by Team CON, and therefore, the rock would be defeated. "1. The passage of time. It seems, now, that Team PRO will be unable to defeat the rock, as it always exists and is gigantic, or the atom, as it always exists and is seemingly impossible to find. Thus, as time passes, the atom and the rock will remain, but all other mortal, living characters, will grow old and die." Solution: Link uses Bomb Arrows to break Ayer's Rock down into smaller pieces that can be consumed by Kirby. Because eating the rock makes it unusable, the rock is defeated once Kirby eats said smaller pieces. Or, Midna could levitate Ayer's Rock, and move it out of New York City, instantly defeating it. "1. The passage of time. It seems, now, that Team PRO will be unable to defeat the rock, as it always exists and is gigantic, or the atom, as it always exists and is seemingly impossible to find. Thus, as time passes, the atom and the rock will remain, but all other mortal, living characters, will grow old and die." For one thing, Atem does not age while in the Millennium Puzzle. For another, I already can defeat both the rock and the atom. "2. Frankenstein. As you have noticed, mongeese is a part of my team. The team captain must issue commands to all of his team members. Without the team captain, the team is rendered useless. Therefore, mongeese cannot be defeated by any of mongeese's characters, because to do so would create a paradox. mongeese cannot render his own team useless by ordering his own destruction without forfeiting the battle." You misunderstand the role of the team leader. "7. The team leader may not directly participate in the competition, but may only facilitate. The role of the team leader is to explain what the team would do and why it would win against the opposing team." [4] So, you see, I do not command my team. I just explain why it would win. And it would win, whether or not I am defeated mid-way through the battle. Of course, I could be left as the last person to eliminate, thus allowing me to issue commands for after I am defeated. "3. The power of a judge. Is my opponent going to risk destroying MTGandP? He must, in order to win, but such could be construed as utter disrespect towards a judge, possibly warranting a loss in conduct points." MTGandP is not judging this debate. [5] Plus, I would like everybody to know that I mean MTGandP no disrespect, and I am sure that he understands that I am being required to defeat his hypothetical self, which I am sure he would accept. "4. The power of the tournament creator. Same thing as above, except with Logical-Master. Destroying Logical-Master could be construed as a highly, highly punishable offense." Highly punishable offense? Technically, he's already agreed to let you use him in Ultimate Team War, so he has probably acknowledged that his hypothetical self is quite likely going to be defeated in some way, shape, or form. Plus, he's set up the rules that command me to eliminate him. Now, for a recap: 1. Kirby effortlessly swallows MTGandP, mongeese, and Logical-Master, turning into Debate Kirby. 2. Kirby gets rid of his Debate ability. 3. Yugi locates the atom using the Millennium Ring. 4. Kirby eats the atom. 5. Link breaks down Ayer's Rock into much smaller pieces using Bomb Arrows. 6. Kirby eats the smaller pieces that used to make up Ayer's Rock. 7. Kirby leaves New York City, eliminating Kirby and all of Team CON. 8. Team PRO wins! 1. http://www.debate.org... 2. http://en.wikipedia.org... 3. http://www.infoplease.com... 4. http://www.debate.org... 5. http://www.bracketmaker.com...