On balance, Justin Bieber is a worse influence on teenagers than Miley Cyrus

Tvellalot's Arguments1. Something to Aspire toHere is the problem, you actually compiled every single incident that I could find Beiber has been involved in, hence my accusation you're committing Misleading Vividness; that is, you've got these couple of incidents and you're implying that this is just a few of the dozens that exist when that simply isn't true.This, unfortunately, is actually false. For the sake of time I prevented myself from providing further crimes committed by Justin, and just posted the once that were known by popularity. But to prove my point, I will list examples of more of his "feats".1. Banned at an indoor skydiving facilityJustin Bieber was at an indoor skydiving facility. He arrived close to closing hours demanding him and his friends get a chance to go even though the place was ready to shut down for the day. They agreed saying that he needed to pay 1600$. They also made him an offer that he could upload an instagram of himself making a shoutout for the company. Justin Bieber chose the second option. After being rowdy, and rude to the staff, and not even tipping the place for staying after hours to accommodate his needs, Justin Bieber failed to upload the instagram picture not upholding his end of the deal. The indoor skydiving facility banned Bieber for life from this incident! (13)2. Illegally brought pet monkey to GermanyThis one is pretty self explanatory. See the link for more details. Also watch the videos in each link as they give more background on the incidents. (14)3. Posted a pic of him drinking to instagram.Justin bieber only 19 years old, posted a picture of him drinking to the Internet. A crime for someone underage. such as himself. (15)4. More FightingJustin Bieber got into a scuffle with his neighbor who was concerned about the loud partying and music Bieber was constantly displaying. Justin Bieber even went as far as to make physical contact and threats to his neighbor. (16)5. More sneakingJustin Beiber tries to sneak into a night club under age. (17) This apparently doesn't stop him, as later he attempts to sneak Jaden Smith into club as well. Keep in mind Jaden is only 14 at the time. This is both irresponsible and wrong. (18)For sake of argument space, I am going to stop here. Unfortunately, there are many more instances I could find of Bieber's crimes. These aren't isolated incidents; It appears Justin Beiber has a problem following rules. Even if these were just Isolated incidents, however, they still by far exceed the crimes of Miley Cyrus (which are arguably crimes in the first place), making him a worse influence.Starting out small.This is another argument that really doesn't effect the debate I feel. I didn't focus that much attention to this, and ended the argument with what was important; aspiration factors don't influence factors. I doubt that teens will be less negatively effected by Bieber just because he started out poor. Most people don't think about that. They see two popular teen pop stars, and their actions; and most of the time will think they are cool for the things they do, given their popular position in society. This is where the line of negative influence is drawn. Transitioning.I understand my opponents point completely. My counter was basically that here good deeds from this show continuing for so long, are more likely what she will be remembered by, than this one music video that my opponent cites. Also if teens look for the meaning behind the video she made, they can probably actually find more good influence. Again the video is all about embracing being yourself, and who you are.My arguments1. Justin Bieber's Crimes.Two of these incidents (attacking a paparazzi and drugs being found in the tour bus) are unresolved. That is, they are 'alleged' incidents. I would say a picture of a joint in your hands, is a pretty resolved issue. And do you really think all these fight accusations are false? There are multiple cases of him trying to hurt people, evidence that he hates paparazzi, and a video of him clearly trying to fight someone. Bad week or not, this guy is freaking violent.1. Aggression towards the paparazziMy opponents main rebuttal to this is that Justin was only re-acting to rude people. I acknowledged this, and have since the beginning of this debate. He had a reason for doing what he did, but does that make what he did a "good excuse"? Remember both of these individuals make 1000X's the amount of money that most Americas in their lifetime. Their Job and everything they do is an influence on teens; All of their money comes from their public public appearance and growing popularity. With this being said, they should be mindful of how they react to the public. Is it so hard to turn the other cheek to someone who calls you a rude name, when you know you have more money, power and freedom than you? The fact that he re-acts to people with violence only adds insult to injury. Suck it up Bieber, you have already won the fight by being rich and pretty.Do you think that fans of Jimi Hendrix are going to overdose themselves on heroin to be like their idol? That isn't how influence works. Fans tend to focus irrationally on the positive. Bieber's fans are a prime example of this.Where do you think that all the bad habits teens get into now a days even come from? Do you think they just made up the saggin' pants, the slang words, and the crazy behaviors? Maybe some, but if you idolized someone enough, and thought everything they did was cool, and were naive enough to believe it, wouldn't you replicate their actions? This is why teens do a lot of the stupid crap they do.2. Peeing in a mop bucketMy opponent has conceded this point.3. Smoking a jointLet us concur that this point counts against both teens given my opponents evidence. 4. Groping a FanThe fan may have been too naive to understand what was going on. But the way Bieber's hand was cupped in the picture looks like he clearly had different intentions. It looks like he was trying to go for a sexual move to try and dis-guise it as innocent. 5. SpeedingI didn't drop this point; My opponent made a justification for why Justin speeding was okay. My point was again that his reasons didn't matter. Speeding is against the law, despite his hate of paparazzi. ConclusionOverall, we need to weigh which person's actions are worse. I have pointed out more than a few of Justin's. So far all we have on Miley is that she was a bit weird in a music video, and that she smoked a Joint. Justin is guilty of both of these and much much more, as I have shown. I think I have won this debate because ultimately I have not only found more things that Justin has done bad, but the gravity of his actions are much worse. Justin has had more court cases than I can count, and has paid most of them off. But what teens are learning from this is that they can do crazy things, and can get away with them. The harsh and simple truth is that they can't though. If they do these things that Bieber does, they can find themselves in trouble. Bieber has exceed the age where he can get away certain things; he is an adult. Teens must learn that they cannot replicate his actions.With that said, I wish my opponent luck in the voting period. This was fun, but I hope I have proved myself up a step on ryuu's ladder. Thanks!13. http://okmagazine.com...14. http://okmagazine.com...15. http://okmagazine.com...16. http://okmagazine.com...17. http://hollywoodlife.com...18. http://www.sheknows.com...