The Universe Was Created By God

Thanks Pro for your response. I maintain that the universe was not created, because of the temporal problems of such a claim. Without a universe at [+0,-0], there is no stative time in order to correctly declare that a temporal process, creation, occurred; no time, no creation, no creator. But Pro doesn't seem to see it that way... *Round 1 Rebuttal* Pro asserts: "Without God we get a regress in infinite causality. Meaning, we must accept infinite history, which is synonymous with the logic of saying everyone has a mother, but there is no first mother. We have history, but no first history. We have events, but no first event." My response: Nope. I've explained, that without god, the universe has an origin, and, because there is no stative time in [+0,-0] quantum fluctuations, there is no infinity of time; time began when the universe began, so I guess this is our "first mother." Pro asks: "Which came first, the chicken or the egg? Ironically, everyone always says the chicken." My response: Well, you didn't ask me before your assertion about everyone. The egg came first, because mutations that lead to speciation occur in the zygote, which is inside the egg. Therefore, the predecessor to the chicken had a mutation occur within the egg that makes that egg a chicken egg, which lead to the first chicken. The egg came first. Pro continues: "Many scientists have stated that if the fundamental physical constants were to vary even so slightly, the establishment of matter, astronomical constructs, elemental diversity, and life, as humans know it would have never happened. Reality is beyond a miracle." My response: No, you're just calling an after-the-fact result a miracle. This doesn't show there must be a creator, it just shows that the low odds of existence happened. Low odds do not necessitate purposiveness. *Round 2 Rebuttal* Pro claims: "There is no empty space. There is a "bubbling soup" of quantum field fluctuations that come and go quickly." My response: I agree, and in this state at [+0,-0], there is no stative time. Instead, time is just another variable that "comes and goes quickly" with the other fluctuating variables. So when there was no universe, [+0,-0], time did not remain; it fluctuated. Pro adds: "In the double slit experiment we see an interesting phenomenon of quantum strangeness. When nonobserved electrons cause patterns of waves. When observed, their behavior and pattern changes based on observation." My response: Yup. I fail to see what this has to do with quantum fluctuations or the creation of the universe/stative time, but the double slit experiment shows that particles can be both a particle and a wavelength. Pro then claims: "SPACE TIME DOES NOT RESTRICT THE LORD" My response: Aside from this being a bare assertion, the lack of spacetime restricts creation, a process that REQUIRES time to have occurred. No time, no creation, no creator, no created universe. Pro attempts to support this assertion with the bible: "In the book of John, Jesus Christ made a statement concerning time and its relation to Him...in our sense of time Christ walked the Earth after Moses and Elijah had been dead and gone a long time." My response: Pro, why should we consider the bible authoritative on matters of time or the universe? So what if the bible says that "Moses face was shining like the sun, and the Children of Israel put a veil over his face?" What does any of this have to do with the creation of the universe? Pro makes another bare assertion: "There is one way known to satisfy the paradox of infinite causes. If you can name another, go ahead." My response: [+0,-0] Quantum Fluctuations --> [+1,-1] Big Bang. Check my round 2 for sources on this. Pro continues: "If you examine a computer and its constructs, you would know an intelligence created it." My response: Yeah, and every example of a computer we've ever known is designed by a natural, not supernatural, entity. So, applying this rule to the universe, you should conclude that something natural, not supernatural like god, was responsible. Also, we have only one example of a universe, unlike our many examples of computers from which we can deduce commonalities; or maybe Pro can find another universe that indicates his claim. Pro piles on: "Our reality is controlled by computer code, and not just any code...it isn"t just random 1"s and 0"s either. Bizarrely, the code they found is code which is used in computer browser operating system software." My response: Despite theawakenment.com's lack of credibility on matters of the universe or existence, simply because some codes resemble human-created codes doesn't mean that these codes were designed or indicate a designer, unless Pro is claiming that Microsoft and Google created the universe. Pro goes on about genetic code: "Genomes use the genetic code to write two completely separate languages. The first explains how proteins are made, and the other commands the cell on how genes will be controlled." My response: Ok, well when you have a debate about the origins of life, then maybe you could bring this up, but in a debate about the universe, this is irrelevant. Pro then provides a clip from the Matrix to explain "What is real?" All the clip shows is that there was a fictional movie made with Keanu Reeves...that's it. Then Pro mentions: "Einstein...demonstrated time as having a point." My response: Yeah, like the Big Bang. Pro adds: "Picture Christ as the point, the singularity if you will." My response: Ok, but this puts Jesus as the result, not the cause. Pro furthers: "In Genesis God spoke reality into existance with a burst of light, similar to the Big Bang model." My response: Nothing about the Big Bang model involves speaking anything...that Genesis mentions light and light is an elementary particle is coincidence and not indicative of Genesis's authoritativeness on matters of the universe. Pro finishes: "This created medium belongs to Him, was created for Him, and is under His authority." My response: How can this "medium" be created when this "medium" is the origin of time? How can you call it creation, when there was no time for the process of creation to occur without the "medium" itself? I'm not attacking god, I'm attacking the TEMPORAL process of creation occurring without time...it's inherently nonsensical. Pro should attempt to address the temporal problems of calling the origin of time "creation." How do you discern creator from created without time? I reject this resolution, because, without stative time, temporal processes cannot occur.