Islamic culture and Islam are immoral

Ok, like I said I didn't want to get into debates about what is a fallacy, I don't agree with your definition or accusations made about my arguments being fallacious. If we fully examined this argument, your whole argument is a fallacy, asserting a whole faith that is spread across numerous different countries with varying laws and cultures to be immoral. "It could be argued that all cultures are immoral, Islam for one is not a single culture, and is no different to any other." Is not an admission of immorality, it says 'it could be argued'. My aim was to show that what is moral to you is only what your culture asserts it to be. Even your own culture has religions that hold toxic views towards homosexuals, and the ongoing abortion debate shows morality differs even within one countries culture. What you think is moral now, wasn't the case 20 years ago, never mind 1000 years ago. The same is said for all cultures and countries. Therefore in the strict definition of the argument "Islamic culture and Islam are immoral" it depends on your morals. If you are a muslim in tunisia, you would say no of course we are not immoral. If they held extreme views, like somebody who hates Islam does, then they would call western culture immoral. I do not condone actions that persecute others, but by classifying Islam as a whole are you not persecuting those among them who do not hold extreme views yourself? Again with my arguments about homosexuality was to show that the whole world was once like it is in Islam, and views in support of homosexuality are actually only held by a very small percentage of the global population. All religions have demonstrated this. The answer to this is not bashing them and calling them evil, but offering education and our supposed enlightened views. If we are to go back before Mohammed we would see Islamic culture was once the hub of the world for knowledge and influenced much of western thought, before they were trapped into a new ideology. Religion in western culture is still the root cause of much intolerance, we understand this but on a mass scale religion keeps up the hatred, not only for opposing religions but other politics also, which is what it all is really. You missed [a1]. I believe. When looking at Sunni and Shia, they have many sects within those areas also. History shows us Islam is as rich in history and as diverse as our culture, we just don't learn much about it [a2]. Cultures are progressing in these areas that you speak of, but to expect them to conform to a minority world view held by enlightened westerners is why America gets as much hate as it does, for thinking they are judge, jury and executioner. [a1]. https://en.wikipedia.org... [a2]. https://en.wikipedia.org... I agree that story had some controversial countries to add on to the list, although the acts of governments do not account for the people of the country. It was referring to Saudi Arabia as the amount of tourists it gets per year and very little violence comes from it. I'm British, christian by birth, but to hold me accountable for the actions of my government, it's religious history or laws is unfair. The same can be said of any national. It was once legal for me to smoke in Pubs, it is not anymore. Was I immoral for doing it back then? If muslim women, or men who have lived in these families their whole lives following the same teachings passed down for generations, why would that person believe they are doing anything wrong? As I say, our culture was once the same, only enlightened thinkers evolved our thought over time, usually through scientific progress. To say there are not Muslims who wish for changing attitudes and it has not improved from the past is insulting at best, as you can see in my previous arguments with the Ahmadiyya movement. Sufism, considered for a long time to be the most peaceful of the Islamic schools can be seen being argued about in recent times: http://kashmirreader.com... Sufism is strongly linked with pantheism, which is accepting of science such as space and evolution. Things conservative Americans are even against. At no point do I say Islam is not immoral by the human rights values held by majority in the west. However their values do not mean their argument is correct, your values do not speak for everybody. I think your hatred toward Islam is immoral, you might not. It does not make me right. The incidents you refer to are all in specific countries, and clearly show that it differs from place to place. Islam in one country in not determined by the actions in another. This makes the whole argument a fallacy, and is nothing more than dangerous rhetoric created by hate groups.