Athens vs. Sparta (athens lets just say is pro, and Sparta is con)

Ok , so on to your 1st contention... 1. How can we tell if these babies are weak and have desieses?!?! All Sparta wanted was strong LOOKING babies !!!! Like today, Stephen hawking was considered a "defect " but look at all he has done; exuberance!!!! As I stated before you have no idea what these people an become! Ok, so killing babies is morally correct you say? You might argue about abortion, but year babies were alive! It's like murdering a live person!!! And murder is not right as well! Athens didn't have to kill people in order to be remembered ! On to your other negated point education... Now you ate implying that Athens was only book smart ...but this is simply not true. They used their intellect to help them create one of the best navys of the ancient world at the time. Also, what Spartans are rememebered today?!?! None ! Many Athenians are remembered example : Plato, Socates, thucydides, Perklys, and many more! Any famous Spartan philosophers of politicians... No, they were so focused on phisical education that they didn't even want to write any of their history down! Also, didn't ideas CREATE armies, yes! Ideas are the foundation to everything we have today, and Athens had the first true democracy that we use today! Did Sparta give us any of that , no! Think about Platos allegory of a cave... You are tying to find the light (truth. No one has reached the light yet..) and your obstacle to getting out of the cave into the light is the puppet master and the shadows casting false light. Everyone thus far has lost to the puppet master ... The puppet master holds the knowledge to control everyone's thoughts! So yes knowledge is power! With knowledge you can control everyone's thoughts . Think about Stalin or Hitler, yes, they used their knowledge as power... And Sparta doesn't have any of this knowledge . Book smart was not all of Athens knowledge either... Plato used his philosophy to create "street smarts " in a sense that he could go around with his smarts and squeeze his way out of things by using his genius techniques. On your third point you state that we dont need markets... Well...I'm sorry but you are utterly and sadly mistaken my friend. If all the markets tanked right now we would all be in major difficulty!!!! Rome fell because if it's economic downfall, and so did most of the ancient words and empires INCLUDING Sparta! When you have stealing as your only sorce of income...it gets a little complicated... What I'd Sparta DIDN'T conquer the land...then they would be seriously dead! If you didn't know Sparta did not get along "just fine" the had myriads of starvations within their empire and many died from mellownurishment ... Yeah! When you are training all day and you come home to little food you become weak and sick and eventually you die. And Sparta DID have all the gold and treasures , but the government said that no one was allowed to touch it! They weren't allowed to use it it go near it! Now that is saying something. But yes, Sparta's downfall was their economic problems. Now thank you for debating with me my fellow debater! I hope you can refute this very soon, we are going along in this debate quite swimmingly!