Once Saved Always Saved

You cannot truly know if somebody is saved, in the temporary sense, this is true. And that ambiguity is perhaps an apt reason not to put the bullet in their heads. However, it does hold true that "saved people" are not saved until they are saved and dead. As such, they can only ever be saved once. They are either saved or not saved. Please, note, the argument against temporary salvation is a secondary one, and your objection is simply epistemological. Moreover, it supports my argument. If accepting Jesus as some point makes a person saved, then you can put a bullet in their head. If that is the qualification for salvation, it is finished. However, if their salvation is not temporary... that is the reason you cannot know. You argue that your beliefs are not drawn from a couple verses and yet the entire Bible. This is an acceptable view. However, where do you get this view from in the entire Bible? I'll concede that perhaps some passage here or there may be taken out of context and may not be acceptable for an argument. However, where is the refutation? Free Will is a doctrine which was invented out of nothing, whole-cloth, in the 14th century. There is little to no Biblical evidence for it, and absolutely none cited by you. You have done nothing to refute the Calvinist view. I only cited a few, and those were not refuted. I am to believe that though the Bible says it, you hold it as false for some reason? Where was this support you suggested existed? The entire Bible asserts the doctrine of Free Will? Where? How? I read it and saw a lot of counter-evidence to this claim, from God "hardening the Pharaoh's heart" to change his mind to the cited quotes about divine election. * John 15:16: "You did not choose me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit and that your fruit should abide, so that whatever you ask the Father in my name, he may give it to you." * Acts 13:48: "And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed." * Philippians 1:29: "For it has been granted to you that for the sake of Christ you should not only believe in him but also suffer for his sake" * 1 Thessalonians 1:4-5: "For we know, brothers loved by God, that he has chosen you, because our gospel came to you not only in word, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction. You know what kind of men we proved to be among you for your sake." * 2 Thessalonians 2:13: "But we ought always to give thanks to God for you, brothers beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the firstfruits to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth." * 2 Timothy 1:9: "who saved us and called us to a holy calling, not because of our works but because of his own purpose and grace, which he gave us in Christ Jesus before the ages began," Predestination establishes that a person is only saved once. The eternity of heaven shows that it is a salvation which lasts "always". You are Once Saved Always Saved, and you don't really know until you're dead. You are only Saved, when you're dead and saved. I took the for side of the argument and argued it. I have not been dishonest. I have accepted, for the sake of debate, the existence of God as well as the truth of the Bible. I do not need to accept something to argue in favor of it. Your note that I am an atheist is true and yet irrelevant. Yes, I am an atheist. I believe that gods are, your God included, more fake than cartoons (I can actually see cartoons!), however this has nothing to do with the argument. My points stand on their own merits. This comment is simply an ad hominem. My arguments about predestinations are taken from Calvinism. The Calvinist arguments are Biblically grounded and on much more firm ground than the bland assertion that free will exists. Calvinism is consistent as well as Biblically supported. The Bible speaks volumes of the fact that people are "elected" to accept God, and you yourself have admitted that God knows who will and will not be saved. You are misrepresented the second point of Five Point Calvinism. It is not that people are doomed from the outset and cannot be saved. It is that salvation has nothing to do with you and that God elects those who are saved. It is for the mercy of God by which people are given grace (the Bible says exactly that). It is God's Judgment. You asserted many things. However, you never sought to establish any of them. I presented a cogent argument, with Biblical verses in support, you asserted your assertion with more assertions. I established my points, you failed to establish your points. Once Saved Always Saved. You may be backsliding all your life, but salvation isn't a temporary thing, it is, by definition, eternal. You are not saved, until you are saved and dead. That is salvation. That is the only salvation. That is the eternal salvation, the one salvation: Once Saved Always Saved. You have neither presented a cogent argument for your case, nor have you refuted my argument. I have met the burden of proof, and have presented arguments which you have failed to respond, or address in a cogent manner. You have made assertions and put forward fallacy. Your argument cannot succeed. Thank you for your topic and argument. Have a good day. Tatarize.