A Man Can Never Be A True Women.

First, I will try to charitably interpret your argument and then refute your points. If you feel that I have misunderstood any of these points, then correct me in your second round and we will start on the corrected point anew. To minimize ambiguity, I will use legal names and legal genders for reference purposes for transgender persons, or any other persons. Quotes are taken from argument Round 1 Paragraph 1: Caitlyn Jenner still has her "manhood. " She also has fake boobs. Therefore, Caitlyn Jenner is not a beautiful woman as some have claimed. Paragraph 2: Claims of Heroism attributed to Caitlyn (formerly Bruce Jenner) are made by media sources. These same sources claim that she is a beautiful woman. This is a lie. Caitlyn Jenner is not a woman. Caitlyn Jenner is a deeply troubled man. Above media sources do not believe what they say. Merely, they say these things because it is expected of them. Paragraph 3: Removing one"s genitals does not constitute a change in gender. All a transsexual person can amount to is a facsimile (his words not mine: "often a poor one at that"). Female appearance does not denote womanhood. Paragraph 4: Heterosexual men are unlikely to marry a transsexual woman even after surgery. Heterosexual men are likely repulsed by the idea. This is not due to hate but nature. The idea that transsexuals can be women "is also an insult to true womanhood itself. " Female appearance does not denote womanhood. Paragraph 5: Begins with: "People that are trans tend to be very unstable. Ever met and spoken with any? " My opponent proclaims "every single trans I"ve known or heard speak is clearly quite unstable" It makes no sense to blame this on society. Transsexuals have high rates of suicide and this does not surprise my opponent (read this paragraph carefully, I have had trouble finding a charitable means of phrasing this rant). Paragraph 6: Suicide rates are stated and an article called "High Suicide Risk, Prejudice Plagues Transgender People" is cited as evidence. Final: A blog about a regretful transsexual person is quoted. Refutation: Suicide rates and your impression of individual mental states will not warrant a further mention seeing that you sited a web article, which blatantly contradicts every point you made on the subject. In response to your first assertion, which I hope you don"t lean on as evidence supporting your position, beauty is subjective. Your perception of which is not a criterion for womanhood. Nor can the natural/augmented status of the breasts be a viable criterion. Many non transgender women certainly have implanted breasts, natural breasts, or no breasts at all. We all love boobies! However, they certainly don"t denote womanhood. By "manhood" I presume you mean the penis. While ambiguous genitalia can occur to both males and females, I think Penishood as a criterion generally misses the point. Indeed, throughout your first round argument, I detect and agree with a note of female appearance does not make one a woman. However, I would take this further by pointing out that a female need not be a woman. I believe this to be uncontroversial. For example, a female baby is not called a woman, but rather a baby. A female primary school age child is not called a woman, but rather a girl. Moreover, female is not sufficient condition for womanhood. This begs the question, is it a necessary condition? (I will mercifully skip over the apparent assertion of attractiveness to males denoting womanhood) Womanhood is not predicated on strict adherence to double X-chromosome bearing physical femaleness. Many woman, identified by themselves and others as such, exhibit a variety of physical and genetic traits. To say these women are not women would be at least going against the heard, and more likely an act of bigoted stubbornness. This goes to show that Woman, is not a statement of genital arrangement, nor of chromosome possession. Rather, Woman, is a statement of identity, both to one"s self and to the community. I believe the identity criterion is both justified (see above) and most apt to produce a happy society. What right do we have, in a society of liberty, to make a person"s perception of self conform to our perception of his or her outward appearance? On what authority can we claim to know others more scrupulously than they know themselves? In closing, I ask my friends to relax, end the hurtful rants, have an intelligent conversation, and realize that the rights of others need not come at our expense. If a woman was born as a man, I have no right and no reason to tell her otherwise.