Star wars - On balance the jedi are evil

"Greatkitteh, my allegiance is to the republic, to DEMOCRACY!!!!!" -a Jedi Most of the arguments that greatkitteh brings up can be refuted. He does bring up a few good ones, because as I have said the Jedi are not perfect. However, the argument is that on balance they are good. There's still 2 rounds, so I may put up more points. Right now I'll just post rebuttals and counter this guy's rebuttals. 1.BRAINWASHING- Jedi are known to use mind control, brain-washing, and other skills of the mind, but consider the intent and outcome. First off, force-users are usually given up by their parents willingly and are taken by force rarely. The Sith are known to do it a lot though, such as with Darth Maul and Cad Bane taking force users. The best way to become a Jedi is to become detached from the world, and this can best be done by detaching right at birth. You can see that this produces good Jedi. Jedi who have entered the order at too old of an age, such as Luke or Anakin, ESPECIALLY Anakin, had major problems with being a good Jedi. In order to become the best Jedi possible, it's best to be taken at birth. 2.THEY SERVE THEMSELVES- When do they ever pledge neutrality? They want to keep the peace, and standing around doing nothing during a war does not keep peace. They fought for the good side, remember, they pledge themselves to the republic, not neutrality. The republic is not perfect, comparable to the U.S. in the 1860s. The South felt unrepresented, so they broke off from the Union. Even though the North should've given more thought to the South, the Union was still the good side, and the Southern rebels were bad. Like the Confederacy, the Separatists were pro-slave labor and taking over worlds that wanted to stay in the Republic. The Jedi were defending. 3.UNDERMINING DEMOCRACY- I will address each point: -A lot of people were seduced by Palpatine, not just Jedi. In fact he was not a bad leader at the time. Also, you were wrong, they did not like when Jar Jar motioned emergency powers to him. Mace Windu wanted him to give them up right after the war. -Spying is not undemocratic, and keep in mind, he WAS a suspected Sith Lord. -True, they were not endorsed by the Senate, but the Jedi are basically police of the Republic and can make this arrest. Also, is the Senate, under control of Palpatine, supposed to vote to arrest him? That's not how democracy works. -I've already said, Mace shouldn't have tried to kill Sideous, it was not the Jedi Way. I've also heard that Mace uses some dark side powers, which is an infringement of the Jedi Order. Like I said, they are not perfect. -You got a point, he is a criminal, but the Jedi are no more, and understand it was for the greater good, Han after all destroyed the Death Star -Jedi have judicial power to kill, but only in defense. -Yes, Navy SEALS can't do that to Trump, because Trump is doing nothing wrong. However, if he was secretly aligned with ISIS, they could to be honest. SORSEAU - REBUTTAL (Rebuttal to Rebuttal) 1. Jedi fight as a last resort. Name the instance, you are being very unspecific. Jedi do fight for the interests, which is predominantly the common good. Sometimes they may not fight for good (Anakin), but that is un-Jedi like. "They fought the separatists right until Vader fought them, in which obi wan switched sides almost immidieately." I don't understand this line, please explain. Also, your claim that they fight for those who can't defend themselves less than just slaughtering who is in there way is just false. Examples from movies: Naboo, Gungans, Senator Padme', Republic Worlds taken over by Separatists, Alderann, Cloud City, Ewoks. There are many more in Clone Wars, but already I outnumber yours. Also, Anakin should not have killed the Tusken Raiders. However, he acted out of anger, and thus he was more Sith than Jedi at that moment. Luke is not a traditional Jedi, and he never kills just to kill, only in defense. Name a time when he does, other than the pig guards in VI, I admit that was Sith-like... The 3 Jedi knew Palpatine was a Sith, and thus skilled in combat. Too obvious. Your claim that Yoda killed the Scout Trooper and Gree without knowing there intent is BS. He can easily force mind read them, and he had previously felt through the force the mass amounts of Jedi death by Order 66. It was not paranoia, he knew their intent. Obi-Wan chopped off Zam Wessel's hand because she was aiming her pistol at him, he felt it through the Force. That was an act of defense and mercy, he could've killed her. jedi do mind-tricks a lot, but usually it is for good In the case of Waldo, it was to get off of Tatooine to protect the Queen. 2. Jedi Code- No killing I have already said, Jedi are not supposed to kill unless in defense. When Jedi kill people otherwise, it is in direct contrast of the Jedi Order, and thus it cannot be counted against the Jedi. That's like a U.S. soldier killing Vietnam civilians. Because of that, is the whole U.S. Army bad? -Obi-Wan maimed Maul in self-defense. He saw an opening and took it. If he would not have sliced him in half, Maul would've attacked him again. (P.S. Maul did not die, according to CW. I know, I know, I think that's stupid, too., but it is cannon. -Anakin acted in direct violation of Jedi code by killing Dooku Unlike Maul, he could not fight anymore (his hands were cut off) -The sand people slaughter was more Darth Vader than Anakin. -After all, Jango was shooting at him. He could've cut off his hands, but he has a missile that can be fired through his helmet. So killing him was not altogether wrong. -He acted out of Jedi code when he tried to kill Palpatine. -As stated before, Yoda knew they were enemies. And if he deflected them, then what? They would keep shooting at him, he would keep deflecting, and it was just go on forever. He ended it in defense. -Your last point is dumb, no offense. Anakin is seduced, and he hated Padme at that point. Even if he did see his kids, what would make him go back to Jedi? In Episode V he sees Luke, but he wants Luke to JOIN the Sith... -Rey is not yet a Jedi, therefore she does not know the Jedi way. -Luke did kill the Gamorean Guards unjustly, I will concede that. (Well, actually, he could've just force choked them a little, as Vader did in Episode IV to the Death Star guy. We don't know if they died). Once again, Jedi kill in defense, and when they don't, they are not following the Jedi Way. Obi-Wan killed Maul and Grievous in self-defense. Luke killed those on board the Death Star, yes, but think if he HADN'T. Many more would die. All of those who died on the first death star are technically killed in self-defense. I like your closing remark about Stalin and Hitler and Cali gang warfare. However, it is in vain, as I have just refuted that the Jedi are evil. They are good. "...The Jedi Knights were the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic..." -Obi-Wan, A New Hope Sources: 1. http://starwars.wikia.com...