Sith In The Sith era and Old Republic were much stronger then the new sith, and jedi in StarWars.

Topic of Debate: Sith In The Sith era and Old Republic were much stronger then the new sith, and jedi in StarWars. I don't believe you fully understood me on this matter, but when I said the old sith were stronger I ment stronger! Note that I did not use the word "powerful" or "better" in the topic of debate, and that is what I ment. Though the old sith were stronger in the ways of the dark side of the force, the new sith were indeed much more cunning and deceptive, but as I stated earlier when it came right down to it all of their cunning and deception could not save them from the fury of the anchiant ones, for if Sidious was to do an all out duel with Traya for example who would win? Traya would because in the heat of battle the palpatine would not have the time to be patient, cunning nor deceptive. His death star couldnt save him then, but where as he had the ability to use the force to control sevral lightsabers in unison like Traya then perhaps he could succede. Point blank, he could not. Not in his younger years and definately not when he was older. Traya is and was his superior, can you deny this fact? "As for Darth Bane being strong, he wore a sheet of force armor over himself. Without it, he was almost defenseless.? Ok first I'll have you know that this is completely inaccurate. Bane did not wear a sheet of force armor, he wore two [which later on multiplied into about onehundred] force absorbing orbalisks that slowly began to envelope his entire body. Though they did grant him a powerful spare reserve of force power, enhanced his physical attributes, supplied him a healing factor and acted as a protective shield, they also housed immesurable drawbacks especially when they were went unfeed. These drawbacks included The almost immpossibilty of ever removing them, cronic pain, muscle spasms, and complete and total loss of senseibility due to the emotion altering chemicals they pumped into the brain to cause the host to ge berserk and mindlessly unleash the force on whatever was near. To say that Bane was not strong even though he bore this burden for over a decade is an incredibally foolish comment. I also find the "Without it, he was almost defenseless." Part false as well. I respect the fact that you were smart enought to say "almost" but even that is inaccurate. I'm assuming you did not read the books. If you did then you would know of how Bane delt with Skirva, [thought he had help], Quordis and Kopesc; especially Kopecs. Bane was still relatively an amature at this point, and for him to have accomplished all this in so little time is staggering. If this is not proof of his strength then nothing is. "Bane saw a tactic and decided to use it, hoping that it would work in the future. It was Palpatine and Vader who TOOK CONTROL (overpowered) the Jedi and the Republic." When you said this can you deny the fact that Sidious was the same way? He saw a tacitic and acted on it as did Bane. Though Bane simply began the rule of two and is not fully credit-worthy of the accomplishments of Vader, Sidious, and his master before him, this does not make him any less brilliant then they. Sidious was no more of a genius then Bane he simply had more opporotunities to exersize his cunning and decption, for example. Lets say your in highschool, and theres a gigantic science exam going on in class. You are an class-clown, and your teacher knows it so your teacher placed your desk in the front of the classroom right in front of his desk. What your teacher doesn't know is that he accidentally left out the answer key on his desk. While he is doing grades on the computer, facing the opposite direction you snatch up the answer sheet and begin copying. When your done, you place it back on his desk, and no one is the wiser. Lets say I've gotta seat at the back of the class. Put in your shoes I would have done the exact same thing, the same way and would have gotten an A+ on the test as well, but no. Fate had other planes and it was you who took home the gold. Does this make me any less intellegant, or cunning then yourself? No it does not. The case is the same with Bane and Sidious. Sidious was simply given opporotunities that Bane was not due to the time he lived in, the allies he made, and the high political ranking he achieved. Bane couldn't do that. After the battle of Ruusan and the rumors of the sith still surviving it was too soon for him to act. He simply couldn't take the action that Vader and Sidious had, it wasn't that he was intellectually incapable of it, it was that it simply wasn't the smartest course of action. That is why he lurked in the shadows and waited rather then hiding in plain sight like the palpatine did. [quick question Is Palpatine Sidious's undercover name or his political ranking?] "The New Sith died 1. The old Sith died a lot. The Old Sith were OLD! They didn't have the practice and experience on Jedi...The Sith of old were stagnant and disorganized, not knowing what to do, and not being able to learn from their mistakes." Are, no correction werent the jedi the same way. Judging from what you said I could go around saying that jedi were just ungrateful, trecherous, dogs who's allegiance would sway at any moment. Guys like Vader, Jacen Solo, Bastila, and Exar Kun could be proof of this. All jedi, all tratiors at one point or another but do we lable them as such. No. Also from this biased point of view you make it seem as if all the old sith were idiots, that too is inaccurate. For there were at least some among them who proved this steriotype wrong. Darth Revan, and Traya were perfect examples. They always had a plan predetermined, always had a motive, and a goal to obtain. The only reason they fell from power was due to the actions of those around them such as Malak or Sion. These are the sith steriotypes, the dark fools who linger around for no other reason but to kick a puppy, or torment a baby. They are the reason for the downfall of the sith, and it is due to their actions that the sith were almost always destined to fail. "Wow, no New Jedi could destroy a dude who passed out and almost DIED because of a turbo laser blast that didn't even hit him directly! *sarcasm* The Millennium Falcon hit Vader's TIE FIGHTER and he survived." You wanna know what else hit Vader? The only diff is that he didn't get over this one. In case you were unaware, it was Obi Wan's lightsaber. Your saying that the old sith were stagnant and unorganized, well let me tell you something you should already know about Vader. In one of the last scenes of revenge of the sith, Obiwan had jumped onto the high ground while Anakin still stood below. His words were; Kenobi: "Its over Anakin! I have the highground. Anakin: You undersetimate the power of the darkside. Kenobi: Don't try it! As you know at this point in the story Anakin jumps into the air in attempts to be on equal footing with his master and decapitate him. It didnt work. Rather then force pull him and slash him with his saber when he was close enough, or use the force to lift the lava and fling it at Obi Wan, he decided, like an idiot to take a leap of faith, [or in this case a leap of idiocy] and lost all his limbs due to it. A prideful and ignorant move, on his part, and he lost what little humanity remained of him as a result. Bane or Kun would not have made a crutial mistake such as this, and you mean to tell me that this guy is not only smarter, but stronger then any traditional sith lord! Yeah right. Oaky dude I'm sorry to say but I'm running out of charecter space. Any minor thing Ive left out I'll make into a comment. As I stated before-hand I'm no Vader hater. In fact he is one of my favorite sith, but he certianly isn't the strongest, or the smartest. When it comes right down to it the truth is that the old sith were more powerful then the sith of the new era. They knew more of ther force and were stronger for it. Any star wars fan could see this plainly.