Battlefield 3 is better than MW3

Thanks for the response, and sorry for my late reply. In addressing your second mentioning of "realism" in this debate, I must point out the last argument I made in the opening round. I made the statement that since you had not "provided any grounds for which realism equals superiority in the gaming industry", that "realism" could not be considered a legitimate factor in determining what game is better. You conceded this point to me by agreeing that "realism is not the end all be all of video games". Even though you followed by claiming that realism sets "the difference between these two games", and went on to give examples of this, your failure to deny my assertion that realism is irrelevant in game superiority has now voided any argument you may make of Battlefield 3 being better than Modern Warfare 3 due to realism. I think we can both agree that financial success really doesn't prove anything about how good a game is, so I'll just briefly talk about the awards Battlefield 3 has won. These awards, although quite bountiful, have all been won from events such as E3, Tokyo Game Show, and Gamescom. Although there is no reason that DICE shouldn't be proud of all these awards, the fact of the matter is that these honors awarded to Battlefield 3 are honors that do NOT reflect the final product of the game. They instead reflect the presentation of the non-retail version of the game. Since this debate refers to which final version of the game will be better, I claim that although Battlefield 3's impressive amount of awards may show that the game will have a promising release, it does NOT show superiority over Modern Warfare 3. I'll now move on to your statement about the destructible environments present in Battlefield 3. You claim that the only reason this feature gives BF3 an edge over MW3 is because it allows the player to kill campers easier. For those of you who don't know video game lingo, a "camper" is a player who remains stationary in a well-placed spot and waits for other players to run past him so he can obtain an easy kill. This is considered to be very cheap and frustrating in the video game world, and is drastically shunned upon. You state that because vehicles can be used to blow up the building a camper is in, it is easier to kill a camper. This implies that since Modern Warfare 3 lacks vehicular combat, it is therefore harder to kill a camper in that game. The problem with this logic is that it is very situational. You make the assumption that all campers camp in buildings, which is definitely not always the case. Campers camp in areas that they consider "safe". Battlefield players know that being inside a building while vehicles are accessible to the enemy is one of the most vulnerable positions they can be in. Campers, therefore, are prone to camp in a much "safer" area, where the threat of vehicles is not as present. Your argument of destructible environments reducing the severity of camping in Battlefield 3 indeed applies to only specific situations. So what about Modern Warfare 3? Is it harder to kill a camper in this game? No, it is not, and the reason for this is simple. The game provides SEVERAL tools to deal with this issue. Support killstreaks include three specific utilities to alleviate the possibility of campers. These are the UAV (shows the dots of enemies on the whole team's radar), the Recon Drone (targets enemies so the whole team can see their location), and the Advanced UAV (shows position AND direction of the enemy team on the radar). Perhaps you may argue that these are also circumstantial since they are killstreaks. However, there are also tools given to players that do not involve the aggregation of kills: The flash-bang grenade and stun grenade. These two tactical grenades help disrupt campers by hindering their vision and movement. If you were just killed by a camper hiding in a room, all it takes to exact your revenge is a tactical grenade thrown inside followed by a barrage of bullets into the helpless noob. These handy tools are NOT present in Battlefield 3. Camping is NOT harder to deal with in Modern Warfare 3. Now, on to the four main points I created to determine the superior game. 1) Playability Your argument is that the Modern Warfare is a "pick up and play" game, while Battlefield games have a steeper learning curve. I will agree with you on this point: Battlefield definitely takes a longer time to get accustomed enough to do well. However, the beauty of the Call of Duty games is that they are easy to play, but difficult to master. This is similar to the sport of bowling. Anyone can have a good time bowling, but those who bowl often and invest more work and time into the sport will always out-perform those who just play casually. Bowling is definitely more playable than a sport such as fencing, and Modern Warfare 3 is definitely more playable than Battlefield 3. You even concede that MW3 is more "party friendly" than BF3. You go on to claim that "if you want to feel as of you are a real soldier on the battlefield", that Battlefield 3 has the advantage. However, referring back to the topic of realism being irrelevant to superiority, this claim has no impact. 2) Entertainment You don't really make any arguments here, but instead state that "the amount of entertainment you get from these games are based on your play style". In comparing the two games to each other, you say that "both games have the same modes" (campaign, two-player mission coop, and multiplayer), but "Modern Warfare 3 goes a little farther by having a survival mode". Based on the evidence you yourself have provided, Modern Warfare 3 has, numerically, a larger quantity of entertainment value. I have my own reasoning for why MW3 provides more entertainment, but since you have already tipped the scale in MW3's favor, and since I am running low on characters remaining, I'll save my arguments for the final round if I need them. 3) Gameplay Variance This is the only quality that you really seem to dispute Battlefield 3 winning. Your argument for this is that Battlefield has distinct classes and vehicular combat, while Modern Warfare 3 is just "running and gunning". The counter to the distinct classes of Battlefield are simply the custom-created classes in Modern Warfare. With the various perks, the classes can be differentiated just as much (if not more than) Battlefield 3. The real point of your argument here is the vehicle-play in Battlefield. Yes, Call of Duty does not have vehicular combat. Battlefield is more varied in THIS sense. However, in the big picture, Modern Warfare 3 is indeed more varied in gameplay than Battlefield 3. How could this be? Simple: Modern Warfare 3 has GREATLY more game modes than Battlefield 3. Let's look at the number of game modes BF3 will contain: - Conquest - Rush - Team Deathmatch Now, Modern Warfare 3's game modes: Public: - Team Deathmatch - Free For All - Domination - Demolition - Sabotage - Headquarters - Capture the Flag - Search and Destroy - Kill Confirmed - Team Defender Private: - Infection - Drop Zone - Team Juggernaut - Juggernaut - Gun Game - One in the Chamber It is crystal clear that Modern Warfare 3 offers a MUCH more diverse and varied selection of game types. Sure, BF3 may have vehicles to switch things up a little, but MW3 without question contains more variance in its gameplay. You may be stuck "running and gunning", but you certainly have much more to do in the multiplayer. 4) Online Community Your opening sentence in debating this point started with "this is where I will admit Modern Warfare 3 wins". Although you go on to compare Battlelog to CoD Elite, this is voided because you have conceded this point to me entirely. I have nothing to refute here. I have now shown why MW3 is superior to BF3 on the basis of these four points.