All Governments are Criminal Organizations

Pros comparisons of governments and the Mafia - Ability to make laws - " mob boss's rules are the rules and if you break it then that is your own damn fault not the mafia's. " But people dont recognize the Mafia Boss as the legitimate law maker of their land, people on the other hand do recognize governments as legit law makers, meaning that governments are not criminal organizations since they are legally recognized by the people as the lawmakers. - Rights given to people - "Neither do governments. When a government "gives" you a right, it is simply establishing that it can not legally violate that particular "right""Ok then allow me to rephrase. Governments establish that it cannot violate the rights of people. The Mafia does not do that. Therefore a government is not a criminal organization since it establishes that a persons rights cannot be violated. - Consequences for violating laws - " If you give it to me and I don't shoot you, is it then OK? "Youve made the correct choice in that scenario, however as stated above, the Government can only give you choices for punishment that do not violate a persons established right, the Mafia doesnt do that. Therefore a government is not a criminal organization since it can only give punishments that do not infringe on a persons rights. - Crossing state lines - "the mob can kick you out of the ciy is if you're a trouble-maker"But as established before, the mafia isnt the recognized authority of the land and are not the official lawmakers of the land. So once again Governments are not criminal organizations becasue they are recognized as the rightful lawmakers of the land. - Law enforcement does not infringe on peoples rights - " You treat them right, and they'll treat you right. "Pro has completely ignored my argument on this one which was about the limits of authority a government can use against common criminals. A government cannot use extreme measures of force because peoples rights defend from that, however to criminal organizations rights dont mean anything and there is an unlimited range of force they can use. Therefore Governments are not criminal organizations since the range of force a government can use against its people through law enforcement is limited, whereas for criminal organizations, it is not. - Legitimacy to collect taxes - "For a extortion racket to work, we need to collect the protection money"Once again, people dont recognize the mafia as the legal entity that can collect taxes, the government though is. Therefore governments arent criminal organizations since people recognize governments to have the power to collect taxes legally, but criminal organizations do not. ========================================================================================================================================================Governments vs Anarchies - Governments give people rights - "Rights are "unalienable". They do not come from government. Government, if anything. codifies and (alegedly) protects some rights. .. . "Ok then, Governments legally recognize and codify a persons rights, anarchies do not. - Governments acknowledge property rights - "Government cant protect your property by taking it by force. "Governments are not allowed to take ones property without violating the persons rights, anarchies dont do that - Governments provide services to its people - "Not nearly as many services as the free market does. "Pro concedes that anarchies dont give people services. - Governments puts criminals, murderers, and rapists in jail - "US government also murders people in brutal wars, and uses the fear of rape to gain your obedience. "Pro ignores and concedes that governments can imprison criminals, anarhcies dont do that - Governments fund jails to keep criminals in - "It also defines what a "criminal" is, and can put you in jail for not obeying it. "Yeah, because it is legally allowed to do that because people legitimize the government's right to determine what a criminal is whether they agree with their choices are not. Thus this point is conceded too. - Governments respect the right to bear arms - "That is the exact opposite of the truth, much like many other things you've said. "Anarchies are any areas of land under no government rule, therefore anarchies dont recognize any rights of people. This means that anarchies dont recognize the right to bear arms. "Here's the thing, If you were born in a hospital, been to a hospital, seen a dentist, or gone to a school, then the government has spent money on you. .. . So the government does spend money on EVERYONE"I dont know why the Pro is repeating my arguments I used against him to prove him wrong. .. . The point of this is that governments use their income to benefit the people whereas criminal organizations do not do that. Conceded by the Pro. ========================================================================================================================================================If one, then all? "fictional governments have fictional laws which are enforced with fictional law enforcement and claim a monopoly over fictional geographic regions and collect fictional taxes, then they are fictional criminal organizations, "But they have the legal right to do that, much like the ones in real life, since people acknowledge that they have the authority and legal right to do this. "The criteria for criminality explicitly includes the qualities specifically defined in government. "Criminal activity is any activity that violates the laws that prohibit such activity. . http://dictionary.reference.com...Governments are the rightful lawmakers of a region, criminal activity is activity that violates the laws of the state, not the laws an individual sets. Governments cant be criminal organizations since their own actions are limited and cannot violate people rights to an unlimited extent without having to compensate those whose rights have been unintentionally infringed ========================================================================================================================================================So to summarize this debate,Governments legally codify and recognize people's rights. Criminal organizations do notGovernments are the legally recognized law makers of the land, recognized by the people. Criminal organizations are notGovernments use funds to benefit their own people. Criminal organizations do notGovernments are limited by how much force they can use against a person. Criminal organizations are notGovernments are the legally recognized lawmakers of a land. Criminal organizations are not.