From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Tue Jan  2 07:54:33 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 07:54:33 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 564] CAAL releases Executive Summary from its 2-year
	ESL Study
Message-ID: <321416A9-E7FB-4412-B8CB-F781B83825E3@caalusa.org>

Colleagues,

As a service to the field, CAAL is releasing the Executive Summary  
from its upcoming report titled PASSING THE TORCH: Strategies for  
Innovation in Community College ESL. It is appended as a PDF file and  
is also available from the CAAL website (www.caalusa.org, scroll down  
the left column to the title). The full report will be published and  
formally released by February. Its authors are Forrest P. Chisman and  
JoAnn Crandall. two foremost experts in ESL and/or community college  
adult education work.

Happy New Year to all.

?

Gail Spangenberg
President
Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Fl
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2362, F: 212-512-2610
www.caalusa.org

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Jan  3 07:18:44 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 07:18:44 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 565]  Discussion on Health List Jan 8-12
Message-ID: <0e7501c72f31$50bec110$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The following announcement is from Julie McKinney, Moderator of the
Health & Literacy Discussion List.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

*************************************
I am pleased to announce a guest speaker discussion next week on the
Health & Literacy Discussion List! 
 
What: Using pictures in low literacy health education materials.

When: January 8-12, 2007

Who: Guest speakers are Len and Ceci Doak and Dr. Peter Houts, health
literacy researchers and advocates.

Where: Online on the Health & Literacy Discussion List 

Why: Members on this list have shown much interest in creating health
education materials appropriate for patients with low literacy skills,
and in the use of pictures to enhance these materials. 
 
Len and Ceci Doak and Dr. Peter Houts have just published an article
called "The role of pictures in improving health communication: A review
of research on attention, comprehension, recall, and adherence." in the
journal "Patient Education and Counseling", and the Doaks are authors of
"Teaching Patients With Low Literacy Skills", which describes some of
the earliest health literacy research, along with practical   techniques
for communicating clearly with patients.
 

Recommended reading: 

Teaching Patients With Low Literacy Skills

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/healthliteracy/doak.html 

"The role of pictures in improving health communication: A review of
research on attention, comprehension, recall, and adherence." Peter S.
Houts, Cecilia C. Doak, Leonard G. Doak, Matthew J. Loscalzo. 
Patient Education and Counseling. 

This is a peer reviewed article assessing the effects of pictures on
health communications. The article presents summarized findings from
reviews of more than 500 journal articles and other publications on this
subject. Unfortunately, it is not available online but can be found in
the journal. The results of this article will be shared during the
discussion. 

Please pass on this announcement to any colleagues who may be interested
in this discussion. Anyone can subscribe for free at
www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/healthliteracy  
 
All the best,
Julie
 
 

Julie McKinney
Discussion List Moderator
World Education/NCSALL
jmckinney at worlded.org

_______________________________________________
National Institute for Literacy 
Moderators mailing list: Moderators at nifl.gov 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/moderators 
Moderator's Resource Page: http://www.nifl.gov/lincs_dlms/contents.html
Moderator's List Archive page:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/private/moderators

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Jan  5 10:57:40 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com)
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 08:57:40 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 566]  AALPD - Join or Renew Membership for 2007!
Message-ID: <20070105085740.25f5a32e926a0964fcd463de8558d100.120f39e357.wbe@email.secureserver.net>

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Jan  5 11:01:01 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com)
Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2007 09:01:01 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 567] Numeracy Review Available from OVAE's Adult
	Numeracy Intiative
Message-ID: <20070105090101.25f5a32e926a0964fcd463de8558d100.ab6dca9f17.wbe@email.secureserver.net>

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From mhefner at cccti.edu  Tue Jan  9 16:18:16 2007
From: mhefner at cccti.edu (Melinda Hefner)
Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:18:16 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 568] Opinions and thoughts about using Work Keys for
	Adult Literacy	Students
Message-ID: <45A3C0480200005D00007DA2@gwise.cccti.edu>

I apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion,
but I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using
Work Keys as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School
students.  Pros?  Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional
use?  Don't recommend it?
 
Thanks in advance for your help.
 
Melinda
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services
 
Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
 
 
 

 
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From mhefner at cccti.edu  Tue Jan  9 16:53:26 2007
From: mhefner at cccti.edu (Melinda Hefner)
Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:53:26 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 569] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work	Keys
	for Adult Literacy	Students
In-Reply-To: <45A3C0480200005D00007DA2@gwise.cccti.edu>
References: <45A3C0480200005D00007DA2@gwise.cccti.edu>
Message-ID: <45A3C8860200005D00007DB7@gwise.cccti.edu>

oops....sorry for the it's/its!!!!!!  :-(

>>> "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu> 01/09/07 4:18 PM >>>
I apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion,
but I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using
Work Keys as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School
students.  Pros?  Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional
use?  Don't recommend it?
 
Thanks in advance for your help.
 
Melinda
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services
 
Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
 
 
 

 

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From pjcross at okcps.org  Tue Jan  9 17:16:06 2007
From: pjcross at okcps.org (Cross, Patricia J.)
Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 16:16:06 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 570] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work Keys
	forAdult Literacy	Students
References: <45A3C0480200005D00007DA2@gwise.cccti.edu>
Message-ID: <A86CC8A1353C3C4694A36C6FFAA999671B24F7@906-be000-e01.staff.oc.ps>

Sorry Melinda, we only have ESL students here in Oklahoma City.
Pat Cross
Even Start Adult Education Specialist

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Melinda Hefner
Sent: Tue 1/9/2007 3:18 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 568] Opinions and thoughts about using Work Keys forAdult Literacy Students

I apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion, but I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using Work Keys as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School students.  Pros?  Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional use?  Don't recommend it?
 
Thanks in advance for your help.
 
Melinda
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services
 
Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
 
 
 

 
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From Karen.Limkemann at fwliteracyalliance.org  Wed Jan 10 09:13:53 2007
From: Karen.Limkemann at fwliteracyalliance.org (Limkemann, Karen)
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 09:13:53 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 571] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work	Keysfor
	Adult Literacy	Students
Message-ID: <CE2433C9A4C39B4E9216463CCBC67D4F07D170@server1.TLA.lan>

We use KeyTrain heavily with ABE, GED, and ESL but do not have access to
WorkKeys.  The workforce development folks handle that testing in
Indiana.  We have found KeyTrain to be a great tool for a variety of
folks.  

You might want to contact someone in Michigan.  It seems I heard that
they are going to use WorkKeys as a high school exit exam. I would
hesitate to use it as a pre-post tool as it is not diagnostic in nature.

Karen Limkemann

The Literacy Alliance 

Fort Wayne, IN

 

 

 

________________________________

From: Melinda Hefner [mailto:mhefner at cccti.edu] 
Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 5:31 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 569] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work
Keysfor Adult Literacy Students

 

oops....sorry for the it's/its!!!!!!  :-(

>>> "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu> 01/09/07 4:18 PM >>>

I apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion,
but I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using
Work Keys as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School
students.  Pros?  Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional
use?  Don't recommend it?

 

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

Melinda

 

Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

 

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266

 

 

 

 

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From mhefner at cccti.edu  Wed Jan 10 10:07:52 2007
From: mhefner at cccti.edu (Melinda Hefner)
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 10:07:52 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 572] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using	Work	Keysfor
	Adult Literacy	Students
In-Reply-To: <CE2433C9A4C39B4E9216463CCBC67D4F07D170@server1.TLA.lan>
References: <CE2433C9A4C39B4E9216463CCBC67D4F07D170@server1.TLA.lan>
Message-ID: <45A4BAF80200005D00007DEF@gwise.cccti.edu>

Karen, thank you so much for this response.  You say that WorkKeys is
not diagnostic in nature and that you would hesitate to use it as a
pre-post test tool.  Can you elaborate?  I would really, really
appreciate it.
 
Melinda
 
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services
 
Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
 
 
 

 

>>> "Limkemann, Karen" <Karen.Limkemann at fwliteracyalliance.org>
01/10/07 9:13 AM >>>

We use KeyTrain heavily with ABE, GED, and ESL but do not have access
to WorkKeys.  The workforce development folks handle that testing in
Indiana.  We have found KeyTrain to be a great tool for a variety of
folks.  You might want to contact someone in Michigan.  It seems I heard
that they are going to use WorkKeys as a high school exit exam. I would
hesitate to use it as a pre-post tool as it is not diagnostic in
nature.Karen LimkemannThe Literacy Alliance Fort Wayne, IN   
From: Melinda Hefner [mailto:mhefner at cccti.edu] 
Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 5:31 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov 
Subject: [Assessment 569] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work
Keysfor Adult Literacy Students
 oops....sorry for the it's/its!!!!!!  :-(

>>> "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu> 01/09/07 4:18 PM >>>I
apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion,
but I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using
Work Keys as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School
students.  Pros?  Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional
use?  Don't recommend it?
 
Thanks in advance for your help.
 
Melinda
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services
 
Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
 
 
 

 

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From barguedas at sfccnm.edu  Wed Jan 10 10:40:14 2007
From: barguedas at sfccnm.edu (Barbara Arguedas)
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 08:40:14 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 573] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using
	Work	KeysforAdult Literacy	Students
Message-ID: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C02F@ex01.sfcc.edu>

In New Mexico, the Governor's Office of Workforce Training and
Development is diligently pursuing WorkKeys, including training and
marketing to businesses.  New Mexico has a Career Readiness Certificate
that is based on the WorkKeys assessment.  ABE programs throughout the
state have had access to WorkKeys for several years specifically for use
with the TANF (Temporary Assistance to Needy Families) students.  Our
state assessment policy allows the use of WorkKeys for NRS levels 4, 5,
and 6.  We use it for assessment purposes on a limited basis.  Some
programs, including ours here in Santa Fe, also use KeyTrain for the
remediation.  Though we have not used either of these products
extensively, overall we have had favorable results.  Given that a
student can earn the Career Readiness Certificate which will assist him
or her in the job search, we think that the use of WorkKeys will
increase.  Of course, the goal of the student is what drives the study
plan.  We do recommend the use of WorkKeys for those who have a goal of
employment.  Good luck.

Barbara Arguedas

ABE Director, Santa Fe Community College, Santa Fe, NM

 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Limkemann, Karen
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 7:14 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 571] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work
KeysforAdult Literacy Students

 

We use KeyTrain heavily with ABE, GED, and ESL but do not have access to
WorkKeys.  The workforce development folks handle that testing in
Indiana.  We have found KeyTrain to be a great tool for a variety of
folks.  

You might want to contact someone in Michigan.  It seems I heard that
they are going to use WorkKeys as a high school exit exam. I would
hesitate to use it as a pre-post tool as it is not diagnostic in nature.

Karen Limkemann

The Literacy Alliance 

Fort Wayne, IN

 

 

 

________________________________

From: Melinda Hefner [mailto:mhefner at cccti.edu] 
Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 5:31 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 569] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work
Keysfor Adult Literacy Students

 

oops....sorry for the it's/its!!!!!!  :-(

>>> "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu> 01/09/07 4:18 PM >>>

I apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion,
but I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using
Work Keys as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School
students.  Pros?  Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional
use?  Don't recommend it?

 

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

Melinda

 

Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

 

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266

 

 

 

 

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From Karen.Limkemann at fwliteracyalliance.org  Wed Jan 10 11:07:37 2007
From: Karen.Limkemann at fwliteracyalliance.org (Limkemann, Karen)
Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 11:07:37 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 574] Re: Opinions and thoughts about
	using	Work	KeysforAdult Literacy	Students
Message-ID: <CE2433C9A4C39B4E9216463CCBC67D4F07D178@server1.TLA.lan>

Melinda,

To the best of my knowledge there is only one form of the WorkKeys
assessment.  It is designed as a screening tool for employment purposes
so that employers will have some assurance of an applicant's skill level
in the different areas.  Also, at least in Indiana, there is no way to
score the test locally.  They are all sent in to ACT for scoring.

The test does not break down specific skill sets; for instance fractions
or percentages. Also, in adult education programs tied to the National
Reporting System, Work Keys is not listed among acceptable assessments.
The KeyTrain software program does allow for some diagnostics regarding
specific skills but we use the TABE in addition to information that can
be pulled from KeyTrain when creating a adult learning plan (ALP) with a
student. In Indiana the state testing policy for adult ed allows only
TABE or CASAS.

Some state are creating employability certifications based on Work Keys
but again that is for employment purposes rather than an educational
credential such as GED or high school graduation test.

Karen

 

 

 

 

________________________________

From: Melinda Hefner [mailto:mhefner at cccti.edu] 
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 10:46 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 572] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work
KeysforAdult Literacy Students

 

Karen, thank you so much for this response.  You say that WorkKeys is
not diagnostic in nature and that you would hesitate to use it as a
pre-post test tool.  Can you elaborate?  I would really, really
appreciate it.

 

Melinda

 

 

Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

 

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266

 

 

 

 

>>> "Limkemann, Karen" <Karen.Limkemann at fwliteracyalliance.org> 01/10/07
9:13 AM >>>

We use KeyTrain heavily with ABE, GED, and ESL but do not have access to
WorkKeys.  The workforce development folks handle that testing in
Indiana.  We have found KeyTrain to be a great tool for a variety of
folks.  

You might want to contact someone in Michigan.  It seems I heard that
they are going to use WorkKeys as a high school exit exam. I would
hesitate to use it as a pre-post tool as it is not diagnostic in nature.

Karen Limkemann

The Literacy Alliance 

Fort Wayne, IN

 

 

 

________________________________

From: Melinda Hefner [mailto:mhefner at cccti.edu] 
Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 5:31 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 569] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work
Keysfor Adult Literacy Students

 

oops....sorry for the it's/its!!!!!!  :-(

>>> "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu> 01/09/07 4:18 PM >>>

I apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion,
but I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using
Work Keys as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School
students.  Pros?  Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional
use?  Don't recommend it?

 

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

Melinda

 

Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

 

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266

 

 

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Jan 11 12:24:13 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 12:24:13 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 575]  Discussion Topics for 2007
Message-ID: <046c01c735a5$50a8e370$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Greetings everyone!  I hope this email finds you well.
 
I wanted to let you know what discussions I am fixing up for us over the
next 6 months or so, and I'm also very interested to hear what types of
discussions you all would like to have on the List.  
 
I plan to generate a discussion next week asking you about the kinds of
in-class assessments you do with students (i.e.:  formative assessment).
I have some resources that were developed in my programs when I was
director back in the 90s that I will share with you, and that I hope
spark your interest to share your own resources, or perhaps generate
your own.  We spend so much time discussing end-of-cycle tests like the
ones required by the NRS (these are considered summative assessments),
so I wanted to shift us back to our classrooms and programs to talk
about what you do on a daily basis with students.  Here are a few
resources for you to check out if you are interested - all are focused
on the use (or lack of use) of formative assessment:
 
Assessment Crisis: The Absence Of Assessment FOR Learning
https://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/k0206sti.htm
 
The Concept of Formative Assessment
http://pareonline.net/getvn.asp?v=8
<http://pareonline.net/getvn.asp?v=8&n=9> &n=9
 
Inside the Black Box: Raising Standards Through Classroom Assessment
http://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/kbla9810.htm
 
A Primer: Diagnostic, Formative, & Summative Assessment
http://www.mmrwsjr.com/assessment.htm
 
The Value of Formative Assessment
http://www.fairtest.org/examarts/winter99/k-forma3.html
 
The other discussions I have in mind will focus on the following:  Using
Data for Program Improvement (panel discussion); Teaching the GED (guest
speakers); and I hope to also include Using Data for Instructional
Improvement as well.
 
What do you think?
 
Now your turn!  What topics, issues and interests do you have that you
would like to see discussed here?  This List is yours so please let me
know how you would like to see it used.  I'll do my best to organize or
generate any/all discussions that are relevant to us here.  Feel free to
respond to the whole List or just to me if you prefer to do that.  I
welcome and encourage your ideas and input.  
 
Thank you so much and looking forward to a chatty 2007!
 
marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From mhefner at cccti.edu  Thu Jan 11 13:12:54 2007
From: mhefner at cccti.edu (Melinda Hefner)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:12:54 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 576] Re: Opinions and thoughts
	about	using	Work	KeysforAdult Literacy	Students
In-Reply-To: <CE2433C9A4C39B4E9216463CCBC67D4F07D178@server1.TLA.lan>
References: <CE2433C9A4C39B4E9216463CCBC67D4F07D178@server1.TLA.lan>
Message-ID: <45A637D60200005D00007EA6@gwise.cccti.edu>

Thanks so much!
 
Melinda

>>> "Limkemann, Karen" <Karen.Limkemann at fwliteracyalliance.org> 01/10/07 11:07 AM >>>

Melinda,To the best of my knowledge there is only one form of the WorkKeys assessment.  It is designed as a screening tool for employment purposes so that employers will have some assurance of an applicant?s skill level in the different areas.  Also, at least in Indiana, there is no way to score the test locally.  They are all sent in to ACT for scoring.The test does not break down specific skill sets; for instance fractions or percentages. Also, in adult education programs tied to the National Reporting System, Work Keys is not listed among acceptable assessments. The KeyTrain software program does allow for some diagnostics regarding specific skills but we use the TABE in addition to information that can be pulled from KeyTrain when creating a adult learning plan (ALP) with a student. In Indiana the state testing policy for adult ed allows only TABE or CASAS.Some state are creating employability certifications based on Work Keys but again that is for employment purposes rather than an educational credential such as GED or high school graduation test.Karen    
From: Melinda Hefner [mailto:mhefner at cccti.edu] 
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 10:46 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 572] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work KeysforAdult Literacy Students
 Karen, thank you so much for this response.  You say that WorkKeys is not diagnostic in nature and that you would hesitate to use it as a pre-post test tool.  Can you elaborate?  I would really, really appreciate it.
 
Melinda
 
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services
 
Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
 
 
 

 

>>> "Limkemann, Karen" <Karen.Limkemann at fwliteracyalliance.org> 01/10/07 9:13 AM >>>
We use KeyTrain heavily with ABE, GED, and ESL but do not have access to WorkKeys.  The workforce development folks handle that testing in Indiana.  We have found KeyTrain to be a great tool for a variety of folks.  You might want to contact someone in Michigan.  It seems I heard that they are going to use WorkKeys as a high school exit exam. I would hesitate to use it as a pre-post tool as it is not diagnostic in nature.Karen LimkemannThe Literacy Alliance Fort Wayne, IN   
From: Melinda Hefner [mailto:mhefner at cccti.edu] 
Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 5:31 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov 
Subject: [Assessment 569] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work Keysfor Adult Literacy Students
 oops....sorry for the it's/its!!!!!!  :-(

>>> "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu> 01/09/07 4:18 PM >>>I apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion, but I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using Work Keys as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School students.  Pros?  Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional use?  Don't recommend it?
 
Thanks in advance for your help.
 
Melinda
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services
 
Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
 
 
 

 

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From jalsails at aol.com  Thu Jan 11 15:35:34 2007
From: jalsails at aol.com (jalsails at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:35:34 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 577] Re: Discussion Topics for 2007
In-Reply-To: <046c01c735a5$50a8e370$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <046c01c735a5$50a8e370$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <8C903D72E15D06F-1340-50CA@MBLK-M38.sysops.aol.com>

Happy New Year, Marie,

Your guidance certainly gives everyone a variety of topics to discuss. 
I'll take a closer look at the collections and get back with you.

Jeri

-----Original Message-----
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Sent: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 11:24 AM
Subject: [Assessment 575]  Discussion Topics for 2007

          Greetings everyone! ?I hope this email finds you well.

 ?

  I wanted to let you know what discussions I am fixing up for us over 
the next 6 months or so, and I?m also very interested to hear what 
types of discussions you all would like to have on the List.?

 ?

  I plan to generate a discussion next week asking you about the kinds 
of in-class assessments you do with students (i.e.:? formative 
assessment).? I have some resources that were developed in my programs 
when I was director back in the 90s that I will share with you, and 
that I hope spark your interest to share your own resources, or perhaps 
generate your own. ?We spend so much time discussing end-of-cycle tests 
like the ones required by the NRS (these are considered summative 
assessments), so I wanted to shift us back to our classrooms and 
programs to talk about what you do on a daily basis with students. 
?Here are a few resources for you to check out if you are interested ? 
all are focused on the use (or lack of use) of formative assessment:

 ?

 Assessment Crisis: The Absence Of Assessment FOR Learning

 https://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/k0206sti.htm

 ?

 The Concept of Formative Assessment

 http://pareonline.net/getvn.asp?v=8&n=9

 ?

 Inside the Black Box: Raising Standards Through Classroom Assessment

 http://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/kbla9810.htm

 ?

 A Primer: Diagnostic, Formative, & Summative Assessment

 http://www.mmrwsjr.com/assessment.htm

 ?

 The Value of Formative Assessment

 http://www.fairtest.org/examarts/winter99/k-forma3.html

 ?

  The other discussions I have in mind will focus on the following:? 
Using Data for Program Improvement (panel discussion); Teaching the GED 
(guest speakers); and I hope to also include Using Data for 
Instructional Improvement as well.

 ?

 What do you think?

 ?

  Now your turn!? What topics, issues and interests do you have that you 
would like to see discussed here? ?This List is yours so please let me 
know how you would like to see it used.? I?ll do my best to organize or 
generate any/all discussions that are relevant to us here.? Feel free 
to respond to the whole List or just to me if you prefer to do that.? I 
welcome and encourage your ideas and input.?

 ?

 Thank you so much and looking forward to a chatty 2007!

 ?

 marie

 ?

 Marie Cora

 marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

 NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

 http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 ?

 ?

   -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

________________________________________________________________________
Check out the new AOL.  Most comprehensive set of free safety and 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Jan 12 09:17:41 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 09:17:41 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 577]  Program Participation in Self Study
Message-ID: <053e01c73654$6c04dfc0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:

The following discussion may be of interest to you.  Sign on to the
discussion at:

Focus on Basics Discussion List 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Focusonbasics

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

********************************************************
I am pleased to announce a guest speaker discussion the week after next
on the FOB list! We will be joined by four researcher/authors from the
recent issue of FOB, who will discuss learner self study in terms of how
programs can support it in different ways, and then look at some
different models of self study. Please pass this on to anyone you know
who may be interested in this discussion. 

When:  January 22-26, 2007

Where: Online on the Focus on Basics Discussion List 
(Anyone can join for free at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Focusonbasics )

What:  Self-Study: Broadening the Concepts of Participation and Program
Support

Steve Reder, NCSALL researcher and director of the Portland Lab School
and Clare Strawn, an analyst on the Longitudinal Study of Adult
Learning, will discuss their article of the same name from the latest
issue of FOB. In addition, NCSALL researchers Molly Robertson, and
Lauren Shoneck will discuss two practical examples of self-study,
distance learning and GED via TV, respectively. 

Who: 

Stephen Reder is University Professor and Chair of the Department of
Applied Linguistics at Portland State University, Portland, Oregon. His
research interests focus on adult literacy and second language
development. He is the Principal Investigator of two NCSALL projects:
the Adult ESOL Labsite project and the Longitudinal Study of Adult
Learning.

Clare Strawn is Assistant Professor at Portland State University,
Portland, Oregon, and an analyst on the Longitudinal Study of Adult
Learning. She is interested in patterns of program participation, the
intersection of learning  and community development, social capital
influences on learning strategies, and technology.

Lauri McLellan Schoneck is a professor at Seminole Community College,
where she teaches ABE and GED math courses. A graduate of Florida State
University, she has her master's in special education and has taught
both K-12 students and adults. She is currently serving a second term on
the Florida Department of Education Practitioners' Task Force on Adults
with Learning Disabilities as a community college representative. 

Molly K. Robertson is the founding director of the Indiana GED ON TV
program. She left high school at 16, earned a GED in 1982, and holds a
bachelor's degree in journalism and a master's in telecommunications.
She lives in Muncie, Indiana, with two large, rowdy, black poodles. 

Recommended Reading (from Focus on Basics, issue 8C): 

Self-Study: Broadening the Concepts of Participation and Program Support
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1152

Distance Leanring as a Backup
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1153

The GED Via TV
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1154 

***************************************************

Julie McKinney
Discussion List Moderator
World Education/NCSALL
jmckinney at worlded.org

From jtaustin1 at core.com  Sat Jan 13 17:21:29 2007
From: jtaustin1 at core.com (james austin)
Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:21:29 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 578]  WorkKeys for ABLE Learners
In-Reply-To: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C02F@ex01.sfcc.edu>
References: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C02F@ex01.sfcc.edu>
Message-ID: <000301c73761$2dcaa880$2efdfea9@JimDownOne>

Folks,

I work in Ohio with ABLE programs as part of the state leadership network,
and would like to tell folks a little bit about our statewide level of
interest similar to that which Barbara mentioned for New Mexico.

Our state was encouraged several years ago to think about a credential and
workplace education.  A committee on which I served developed a process for
interviewing potential vendors of assessments (FOUR:  Work Readiness
Credential of EFF-US Chamber, Skills Max bundle within Ohio, the ERI from
Canada, and Work Keys).  We have completed a field test with 5 programs and
200 some adult learners, and are planning going to scale with the WorkKeys
credential (which was also just endorsed by the Governors Workforce Policy
Board).  I will find out from the powers-that-be in the state if I can share
more with you about our field test.

I liked the fact that ACT went the through the tortuous process of obtaining
NRS approval for the measure.  This makes it more useful, even if perhaps
not as diagnostic.

On the diagnosticity issue of Work Keys brought up by the posting by
Melinda, I do see the system as more of a summative measure than a formative
one.  One of the teachers in the field test, however, indicated that she
thought that giving a TABE first and Work Keys second seemed to be most
logical approach.  This begs the issue of pre-post testing with the "same"
test and so might not always be appropriate with WIA Title II funding
guidance.  It would require an equating process between the two testing
systems before use in a pre-post (gain) situation.

Lastly, I believe that there are many forms of the WorkKeys rather than just
one.  The delivery can be computer-based, and the scoring can be done by you
(remotely) if you have a testing center approved or licensed by ACT.

The cost is fairly comparable, although scoring costs must be considered in
certain cases, and the WorkKeys system is popular with employers in Ohio
(our Adult Workforce Education component has used it almost since it came
out in the 1990s).

 

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Barbara Arguedas
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 10:40 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 573] Re: Opinions and thoughts about usingWork
KeysforAdult Literacy Students

 

In New Mexico, the Governor's Office of Workforce Training and Development
is diligently pursuing WorkKeys, including training and marketing to
businesses.  New Mexico has a Career Readiness Certificate that is based on
the WorkKeys assessment.  ABE programs throughout the state have had access
to WorkKeys for several years specifically for use with the TANF (Temporary
Assistance to Needy Families) students.  Our state assessment policy allows
the use of WorkKeys for NRS levels 4, 5, and 6.  We use it for assessment
purposes on a limited basis.  Some programs, including ours here in Santa
Fe, also use KeyTrain for the remediation.  Though we have not used either
of these products extensively, overall we have had favorable results.  Given
that a student can earn the Career Readiness Certificate which will assist
him or her in the job search, we think that the use of WorkKeys will
increase.  Of course, the goal of the student is what drives the study plan.
We do recommend the use of WorkKeys for those who have a goal of employment.
Good luck.

Barbara Arguedas

ABE Director, Santa Fe Community College, Santa Fe, NM

 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Limkemann, Karen
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 7:14 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 571] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work
KeysforAdult Literacy Students

 

We use KeyTrain heavily with ABE, GED, and ESL but do not have access to
WorkKeys.  The workforce development folks handle that testing in Indiana.
We have found KeyTrain to be a great tool for a variety of folks.  

You might want to contact someone in Michigan.  It seems I heard that they
are going to use WorkKeys as a high school exit exam. I would hesitate to
use it as a pre-post tool as it is not diagnostic in nature.

Karen Limkemann

The Literacy Alliance 

Fort Wayne, IN

 

 

 

  _____  

From: Melinda Hefner [mailto:mhefner at cccti.edu] 
Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 5:31 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 569] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work Keysfor
Adult Literacy Students

 

oops....sorry for the it's/its!!!!!!  :-(

>>> "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu> 01/09/07 4:18 PM >>>

I apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion, but
I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using Work Keys
as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School students.  Pros?
Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional use?  Don't recommend
it?

 

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

Melinda

 

Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

 

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266

 

 

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jan 16 13:47:15 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:47:15 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 579] Re: WorkKeys for ABLE Learners
In-Reply-To: <000301c73761$2dcaa880$2efdfea9@JimDownOne>
Message-ID: <070f01c7399e$be5adbb0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi James and everyone,
Thanks so much for this information, it is very helpful.  
James, you've raised a few very interesting issues in your discussion.
I'm not very familiar with the WorkKeys materials, but what I do know of
them indicates that they attempt to provide a snapshot of people's
cognitive skills/abilities as well as their personal qualities.  What do
you (and others) think about the assessment of personal qualities?  This
is an area that is very difficult to capture/quantify/etc.  Do folks
find this type of assessment helpful?  How do you use this information?
Is it shared with the adult student/worker?
On the note that someone is using the TABE as the pre-test and then
WorkKeys as the post-test - you are entirely correct James when you
question the validity of this mix and match - it is not valid.  This
would not fly with the NRS.  These tests are not equated and cannot be
assumed to provide an accurate measure of gain against each other.  I
think I understand that the person doing this is interested in getting
more of a picture of the skills that the worker already has, and then
comparing how far they can go in terms of working with the WorkKeys
materials - and I suppose this could work - you could be using the
information gleaned from both tests in formative ways.  But that's where
that ends:  you can't use any scores from either test to say anything at
all about the person because you are using 2 different measures - they
cannot be compared to each other.  And you're right James:  you would
have to go thru an extensive, complex equating process in order to use
one for a pre-test and the other for a post-test - and still you would
not get truly accurate information out of this endeavor.  
Perhaps the better combination would be to stick to the one assessment
for purposes of summative assessment (i.e.:  reporting to funders) to be
sure of accuracy, but then use your own or commercially available
assessments, tests, quizzes, etc that can inform your teaching and help
you with further diagnostics of your adult students (formative
assessment).  This feels like a schizophrenic situation I know:  it
feels like the summative and formative trains shall never meet - and
there are ways in which they never will.  But there are also ways in
which these two pieces can indeed inform one another and I have no doubt
that many of you already are doing this.
Thanks,
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of james austin
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 5:21 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Cc: austin.38 at osu.edu
Subject: [Assessment 578] WorkKeys for ABLE Learners
Folks,
I work in Ohio with ABLE programs as part of the state leadership
network, and would like to tell folks a little bit about our statewide
level of interest similar to that which Barbara mentioned for New
Mexico.
Our state was encouraged several years ago to think about a credential
and workplace education.  A committee on which I served developed a
process for interviewing potential vendors of assessments (FOUR:  Work
Readiness Credential of EFF-US Chamber, Skills Max bundle within Ohio,
the ERI from Canada, and Work Keys).  We have completed a field test
with 5 programs and 200 some adult learners, and are planning going to
scale with the WorkKeys credential (which was also just endorsed by the
Governors Workforce Policy Board).  I will find out from the
powers-that-be in the state if I can share more with you about our field
test.
I liked the fact that ACT went the through the tortuous process of
obtaining NRS approval for the measure.  This makes it more useful, even
if perhaps not as diagnostic.
On the diagnosticity issue of Work Keys brought up by the posting by
Melinda, I do see the system as more of a summative measure than a
formative one.  One of the teachers in the field test, however,
indicated that she thought that giving a TABE first and Work Keys second
seemed to be most logical approach.  This begs the issue of pre-post
testing with the "same" test and so might not always be appropriate with
WIA Title II funding guidance.  It would require an equating process
between the two testing systems before use in a pre-post (gain)
situation.
Lastly, I believe that there are many forms of the WorkKeys rather than
just one.  The delivery can be computer-based, and the scoring can be
done by you (remotely) if you have a testing center approved or licensed
by ACT.
The cost is fairly comparable, although scoring costs must be considered
in certain cases, and the WorkKeys system is popular with employers in
Ohio (our Adult Workforce Education component has used it almost since
it came out in the 1990s).
 
 
  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Barbara Arguedas
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 10:40 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 573] Re: Opinions and thoughts about usingWork
KeysforAdult Literacy Students
 
In New Mexico, the Governor's Office of Workforce Training and
Development is diligently pursuing WorkKeys, including training and
marketing to businesses.  New Mexico has a Career Readiness Certificate
that is based on the WorkKeys assessment.  ABE programs throughout the
state have had access to WorkKeys for several years specifically for use
with the TANF (Temporary Assistance to Needy Families) students.  Our
state assessment policy allows the use of WorkKeys for NRS levels 4, 5,
and 6.  We use it for assessment purposes on a limited basis.  Some
programs, including ours here in Santa Fe, also use KeyTrain for the
remediation.  Though we have not used either of these products
extensively, overall we have had favorable results.  Given that a
student can earn the Career Readiness Certificate which will assist him
or her in the job search, we think that the use of WorkKeys will
increase.  Of course, the goal of the student is what drives the study
plan.  We do recommend the use of WorkKeys for those who have a goal of
employment.  Good luck.
Barbara Arguedas
ABE Director, Santa Fe Community College, Santa Fe, NM
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Limkemann, Karen
Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 7:14 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 571] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work
KeysforAdult Literacy Students
 
We use KeyTrain heavily with ABE, GED, and ESL but do not have access to
WorkKeys.  The workforce development folks handle that testing in
Indiana.  We have found KeyTrain to be a great tool for a variety of
folks.  
You might want to contact someone in Michigan.  It seems I heard that
they are going to use WorkKeys as a high school exit exam. I would
hesitate to use it as a pre-post tool as it is not diagnostic in nature.
Karen Limkemann
The Literacy Alliance 
Fort Wayne, IN
 
 
 
  _____  

From: Melinda Hefner [mailto:mhefner at cccti.edu] 
Sent: Tuesday, January 09, 2007 5:31 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 569] Re: Opinions and thoughts about using Work
Keysfor Adult Literacy Students
 
oops....sorry for the it's/its!!!!!!  :-(

>>> "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu> 01/09/07 4:18 PM >>>
I apologize in advance if this duplicates a recent question/discussion,
but I hope you will let me know your opinions and thoughts about using
Work Keys as an assessment tool for ABE, GED, and Adult High School
students.  Pros?  Cons?  Recommend it's use?  Recommend it's conditional
use?  Don't recommend it?
 
Thanks in advance for your help.
 
Melinda
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services
 
Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
 
 
 

 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jan 16 14:00:44 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:00:44 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 580]  Books, Films and TV Videos that Inspire Teachers
Message-ID: <074501c739a0$a0422af0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:

The following post is from David Rosen.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-----

Books, Films and TV Videos that Inspire Teachers

Colleagues,

Recently on the Professional Development and the Poverty, Race and  
Women electronic lists there has been a discussion that was prompted  
by this question:

"I was asked today for a recommendation of a movie or book (such as  
'Stand and Deliver') that would inspire teachers to have high  
expectations for their young adult students, to give 100% each day to  
their teaching. What would you recommend?"

The list of recommended books, films and TV videos now numbers more  
than 30, and is accompanied by an archive of the discussions from  
both lists.  If you would like to see this -- and add your own  
thoughts and recommendations -- it's on the Adult Literacy Education  
Wiki, in the Professional development area:

http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/ 
Books_and_Films_which_Inspire_Teachers

or, for a short form of the URL,

http://tinyurl.com/yj2w6s

I hope you will share the list with your teaching colleagues. I think  
the recommendations -- and some of the comments from the discussion  
-- might make a great article for a state adult education newsletter.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at newsomeassociates.com

From DHohmann at hays489.k12.ks.us  Tue Jan 16 14:22:19 2007
From: DHohmann at hays489.k12.ks.us (Hohmann Donna)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 13:22:19 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 581] Re: Books,
	Films and TV Videos that Inspire Teachers
Message-ID: <290F26CA9AF6094AAD7DEC91ECA7F44403EDA56D@exchange.Internal.Hays489.k12.ks.us>

Lean On Me is an old movie that actually came out when I was in high
school I believe, but it was one that inspired me as a student and now
as an educator.  It was wonderful to witness an entire community come
together to make a difference that brought great strides and success
into the lives of the student population.  I thought it exemplified what
we all aspire to be and what it takes to be a successful learning
community.

Donna Hohmann
Middle School Counselor

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 1:01 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 580] Books, Films and TV Videos that Inspire
Teachers

Colleagues:

The following post is from David Rosen.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-----

Books, Films and TV Videos that Inspire Teachers

Colleagues,

Recently on the Professional Development and the Poverty, Race and  
Women electronic lists there has been a discussion that was prompted  
by this question:

"I was asked today for a recommendation of a movie or book (such as  
'Stand and Deliver') that would inspire teachers to have high  
expectations for their young adult students, to give 100% each day to  
their teaching. What would you recommend?"

The list of recommended books, films and TV videos now numbers more  
than 30, and is accompanied by an archive of the discussions from  
both lists.  If you would like to see this -- and add your own  
thoughts and recommendations -- it's on the Adult Literacy Education  
Wiki, in the Professional development area:

http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/ 
Books_and_Films_which_Inspire_Teachers

or, for a short form of the URL,

http://tinyurl.com/yj2w6s

I hope you will share the list with your teaching colleagues. I think  
the recommendations -- and some of the comments from the discussion  
-- might make a great article for a state adult education newsletter.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at newsomeassociates.com

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jan 16 14:48:17 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:48:17 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 582]  Homegrown assessments
Message-ID: <075c01c739a7$44eb2010$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
I mentioned last week that I wanted to raise a discussion about the
types of testing and assessing that you do on a daily/weekly basis with
adult students.  This is referred to as formative assessment because it
directly informs the teaching and learning process as it happens.  It's
different from summative assessment which tries to deliver a synopsis of
learning over a more lengthy period of time - a semester, or in the case
of ABE, a fiscal or calendar year.
 
We just briefly discussed these two types of assessments in the last
post on WorkKeys.  I finished my thoughts by noting that I am sure that
many practitioners on this list do develop their own "daily use"
assessments or seek out formative assessments that already exist.  I
would like for us to share thoughts and resources on formative
assessment here.
 
Here are some questions to get you thinking:
 
Do you use both formative and summative assessments in your classroom?
If you use both, do they inform one another?  How?
Do you develop your own assessments for use with students?  In which
subject areas?  How do you use them?
Are students involved in daily/weekly assessment?  Do students do any
self-assessment?  What does that look like?
Do you have recommendations for effective formative assessments?  Where
do you look for these resources?  
Did you read any of the suggested resources on formative assessment that
I sent out last week?  Were they helpful?  What did you think?
Would you be willing to share assessments that you have developed with
subscribers on this List?  (We can develop a bank of resources.)
 
Thanks and looking forward to hearing about what you do on a daily basis
to inform your teaching!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jan 16 15:36:34 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:36:34 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 583]  Incorrect URL on resource
Message-ID: <077901c739ae$03dc7220$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

HI everyone,
 
I wanted to alert you that one of the resources on formative assessment
that I sent out to the List last week has a broken URL - here is the
corrected one:
 
The Value of Formative Assessment
Fair Test
http://www.fairtest.org/facts/formulative_assessment.html
 
Thanks very much to the subscriber who brought this to my attention - I
very much appreciate that.
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From jataylor at utk.edu  Wed Jan 17 00:40:00 2007
From: jataylor at utk.edu (Taylor, Jackie)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:40:00 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 584]  Join or Renew Membership with AALPD for 2007
Message-ID: <AB226656DDB79D4D82CC03965C5C2ECBB5FB5D@UTKFSVS5.utk.tennessee.edu>

Hello Everyone!
This January, the Association of Adult Literacy Professional Developers
(AALPD) invites you to join or renew membership with AALPD. So far,
nearly 100 colleagues from 26 states, the District of Columbia, and two
countries have joined or renewed membership for 2007.

Membership is free, and it only takes a moment to complete the short
form. To join or renew membership, please visit:

http://www.aalpd.org/membership_form_withvoting.cfm
<http://www.aalpd.org/membership_form_withvoting.cfm> 

Though you can join or renew membership at any time, we ask that you
renew your membership with AALPD each January. This helps us to maintain
accurate records of our membership, advocate effectively for
professional development, and provide members the best possible
services. We hope to establish strong representation from each state,
and we're posting regular updates to the Professional Development List
regarding the numbers who have joined or renewed thus far (state,
district, or country).

Upon joining or renewing, you also have the opportunity to vote on the
2007 Slate of Officers, and to become more involved with the
organization if you choose.

For more information, please see the AALPD Membership Drive announcement
below.

Thanks so much! Best wishes, Jackie Taylor, Adult Literacy Professional
Development List Moderator, jataylor at utk.edu

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

AALPD: Join or Renew Membership in January 2007

http://www.aalpd.org/membership_form_withvoting.cfm
<http://www.aalpd.org/membership_form_withvoting.cfm> 

AALPD is...

AALPD is a national organization for professional developers with
leadership committed to advancing the field of adult literacy
professional development (http://www.aalpd.org/ <http://www.aalpd.org/>
). AALPD is an affiliate of COABE (Commission on Adult Basic Education)
and is a member of the National Coalition for Literacy.

As a volunteer organization, AALPD:

*        hosts an annual PreConference at COABE and meets at other
professional development events; 

*        co-sponsors the Adult Literacy Professional Development
discussion list in partnership with the National Institute for Literacy
and hosts formal discussion activities targeted to address list
subscriber needs;

*        provides a Professional Development Registry of materials to
which anyone can find and contribute facilitator materials; 

*        provides opportunities for members to become involved in key
priority areas identified by its membership; and

*        advocates for funding for professional development.

Why should you join or renew membership?

As we grow and expand, it helps us to have updated information about our
members in order to advocate effectively for professional development
and provide members with the best possible services. So, we are asking
everyone to renew their memberships by registering as an AALPD member
each year.

Vote While You Join or Renew Membership

While you are joining or renewing membership, you have the opportunity
to vote on the 2007 slate of AALPD officers (Chair, Vice-Chair and
Secretary-Treasurer).

What Does the Future Hold?

The field needs to offer a better, brighter future for teacher
professional development in adult literacy. To achieve this end, AALPD
is engaged in concerted, collaborative efforts to advance the field of
adult literacy professional development in several key areas. One goal
is the adoption of the AALPD PD Policy Recommendations at national,
state, and local levels that support the participation of practitioners
in professional development to help them be effective teachers, tutors,
counselors, and administrators. We advocate for more funding for
professional development, so that these recommendations can be more
fully implemented in programs and states. But we can do more.

Many believe the future holds promise for programs and states that
specifically improve the working conditions necessary to deliver quality
educational services and to support teachers in their professional
growth and learning. As an organization for professional developers,
AALPD could increase efforts in areas that advance the quality of our
profession in new ways. We should all expect AALPD to take leadership in
new and exciting areas for 2007, and provide opportunities for greater
membership involvement.

AALPD Membership Benefits:

*        Membership is free!

*        You can vote for AALPD officers and on special issues that
arise (Only AALPD members will be eligible to vote).

*        We will send you the latest information about upcoming
trainings, events and resources.

*        You can have input into the design of the COABE pre-conference
session next year (2008 in St. Louis).

*        You can choose to participate in advancing key priorities
identified by our members.

*        You can help to strengthen AALPD's voice in advocacy by
demonstrating a strong membership of concerned practitioners committed
to professional development.

Thank you for joining or renewing your membership with AALPD. I look
forward to an active year ahead.

For the AALPD Executive Board,

Jackie Taylor, Adult Literacy Professional Development List Moderator,
jataylor at utk.edu 

Association of Adult Literacy Professional Developers
http://www.aalpd.org/

 

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From kabeall at comcast.net  Wed Jan 17 16:21:33 2007
From: kabeall at comcast.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:21:33 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 585]  New from NCSALL
Message-ID: <010d01c73a7d$7aa8e300$0202a8c0@your4105e587b6>

Hi all,

This new publication does have assessment tools in it, though from the
perspective of getting around in healthcare facilities, not the typical
basic literacy context of which we most frequently think about. I hope that
you find it useful.

 <http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1163> The Health Literacy Environment of
Hospitals and Health Centers: Partners for Action: Making Your Healthcare
Facility Literacy-Friendly
by Rima E. Rudd and Jennie E. Anderson 
The guide and the review tools found within it offer an approach for
analyzing literacy-related barriers to healthcare access and navigation. The
findings of such a review could spark discussions and help shape strategies
to eliminate literacy barriers and enhance health literacy.

For more information and to download the guide, go to:
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1163

 

 

****************

Kaye Beall

World Education

4401 S. Madison St.

Muncie, IN  47302

Tel: 765-717-3942

Fax: 617-482-0617

kaye_beall at worlded.org

http://www.worlded.org

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Jan 18 18:20:25 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 18:20:25 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 586] FW: [Workplace 563] Re: Work-readiness as it
	relates to academic skills(atthe levels of CASAS and TABE or
	WorkKeys),
	technical skills and that third area - what kind of workerwillsomeone
	be? What are the person's soft skills.
Message-ID: <09b801c73b57$3c690ea0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:
 
The following two posts relate to the discussion on WorkKeys.  Our
discussion on the Assessment List was posted on the Workplace Literacy
List with a request for any feedback.  If there are more posts regarding
WorkKeys, I will forward these as well.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
-----Original Message-----
From: workplace-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:workplace-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of David Reeves
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 2:38 PM
To: The Workplace Literacy Discussion List
Subject: [Workplace 563] Re: Work-readiness as it relates to academic
skills(atthe levels of CASAS and TABE or WorkKeys),technical skills and
that third area - what kind of workerwillsomeone be? What are the
person's soft skills.
 
 Alan, I like the broad picture - some questions 1. Could you give some
examples of some specific common soft skills that go to make up the
broad domain/competency area of the soft skills set? ?  2.  What do you
mean when you say that the assessment is ok - which tests do you think
do a good job of validly assessing soft skills? Thanks for your posting
 
  _____  

From: workplace-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:workplace-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Alan Lesure
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 1:24 PM
To: workplace at nifl.gov
Subject: [Workplace 558] Work-readiness as it relates to academic skills
(atthe levels of CASAS and TABE or WorkKeys),technical skills and that
third area - what kind of worker willsomeone be? What are the person's
soft skills.
 
In the following, I'd like to add a perspective to recent discussions re
WorkKeys for ABLELearners and, perhaps, broaden the scope of this
discussion. Our organization's focus is soft skills and our basic
premise is that:
 
1.    Every job involves 3 sets of competencies:
*	Academic skills 
*       Technical/occupational skills 
*       Workplace behaviors or soft skills 
       People need adequate or job-defined levels of each of these skill
sets.
 
There is relatively little objective measurement of people's workplace
behaviors in most ABE courses and, therefore, there is relatively little
focus on developing these skills. This is unfortunate because the very
best way to develop soft skills is through their integration into
academic (ABE/GED, etc.) and career courses. Soft skill assessment is
easy - current technology has done it fairly, validly and predictively
millions of times. Developing soft skills, changing people's behavior
falls under the category of heavy lifting and this is the focus of much
of our work with workforce professionals.
 
2.      Different jobs require different levels of soft, academic and
technical skills. 
 
3.    It is helpful to know learners' competency levels (for academic,
technical and soft skills) at the start of a program so that, by
post-assessment, one can determine the extent to which soft skills have
been enhanced.
 
Our approach to certificates, credentials and transcripts is summarized
as follows:
 
*         An effective certificate provides good and credible
information as to what people know and can do.  Hiring organizations can
often compensate if an individual does not have a particular skill set -
but they must know what these competencies are. Employers may hire
individuals because they value the skills that have been demonstrated,
even if the applicant failed to demonstrate competence in all areas.  
*         Failing to credential an individual who may have failed to
demonstrate competence in one or a few selected areas covered by a broad
certificate is wasteful and may create an unnecessary employment barrier
for an otherwise employable individual.
*         Different jobs require different skills and skill levels.
Indeed, the same job title in one organization may require relatively
low levels of certain skills, while a higher level of performance may be
required by the same job in a different firm.
*         A one-size certificate does not fit all because it does not
respond to local, regional or national realities. Certificates work best
when they exist in an environment that provides changing and current
information about local employers' needs.  Skills required this year by
an organization might not match those needed next year. Certificates,
like employers' requirements, must be responsive to changing conditions.
 
Finally, certificates are most effective - and most portable - when they
encourage and record individuals' skills growth over time. Our approach
to assessment places heavy emphasis on employers - in three ways:
 
1.       Benchmarking:  This process engages the employer in identifying
soft, academic and/or technical skills specific to jobs available within
their industry or company.  Resulting information enables workforce
providers to tailor training programs to the unique needs of the
industry/employer/job.
 
2.       Selection: People with clear evidence of the alignment of their
skills with those sought by the employer can move more quickly - and
less expensively - through the application processes.
 
3.       Post-employment: It is the rare individual who has all of the
skills needed for a particular job. Probationary periods provide an
opportunity for supervisors to work with new hires to develop specific
skill sets.  Both the employer and the employee benefit from reduced
turnover and improved supervisor performance.
 
 
Systematically including soft skills benefits all workforce stakeholders
in the following ways:
 
For youth and other job seekers
 
*	A realistic job preview:  Video- or DVD- or Internet-based
assessment creates more realistic job expectations for employees, thus
increasing the likelihood of job satisfaction
*	Training and development needs are specific and objective
*	An understanding of their current skills sets in comparison with
those required of jobs in the community:  future workers receive data on
their skills gap that must be closed to qualify for specific jobs
*	A clear competitive advantage as they enter the job market armed
with clear and documented evidence of their specific soft skills 
*	Finally, with unique insight into their own skill development
needs, they can provide employers and supervisors with clear and
specific information for planning on-the-job training and development.
For workforce professionals
 
*	Pre-and post-assessment data measures the effectiveness of work
readiness training and development.  
*	Continuous program improvement can be based on performance data
that demonstrates the extent to which internal and external programs are
enabling individuals to move from pre-assessed soft skill levels to
post-assessment.  Effective programs develop people whose skills
approximate employers' benchmarked specifications.
*	The ability to deliver customized applicant referrals and
retention support strengthens and enhances relationships with employers
and positions workforce development organizations to be perceived as a
valuable business development resource.
And, for those that hire
 
*	Benchmarking incumbent workers' soft skills enables the
establishment of clearer "specs;" employers and those providing
applicants know the soft skills required - skills that result in better
job matching and reduced turnover. 
*	Benchmarking is also a reality check: are incumbents as
effective as they need to be.
*	Less time devoted to selection
*	Increased productivity by selecting candidates who have the
greatest likelihood of success on-the-job
*	Accuracy in identifying the developmental needs of incumbent
workers.  Developmental resources are more efficiently used when video
assessments pinpoint the specific strengths and training needs of
individuals, groups, departments, regions or entire organizations 
*	Post-employment information and support for supervisors of entry
level workers that enables them to effectively coach and develop new
workers - during probation and long-term.  Supervisors become more
effective.
*	Reduced turnover
*	Connection to a complementary HR resource within the community
that is aligned with employers' needs
Using the above as an organizing framework for workforce and economic
development in a community is, I believe, a somewhat new and harmonizing
approach that complements other efforts to document what individuals
know and can do. 
 
I appreciate the opportunity to share this information with this
Discussion List and would be pleased to respond to questions these ideas
may prompt.
 
Alan Lesure
Learning Resources
alesure at learning-resources.com
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Alan B. Lesure, President
Learning Resources, Inc.
1117 E. Putnam Avenue, # 260
Riverside, CT 06878
 
Phone: 203-637-5047
Fax:     203-637-2786
E-Mail: alesure at learning-resources.com
 
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From mhefner at cccti.edu  Thu Jan 18 15:44:47 2007
From: mhefner at cccti.edu (Melinda Hefner)
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:44:47 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 587]   Re: WorkKeys for ABLE Learners
In-Reply-To: <070f01c7399e$be5adbb0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <000301c73761$2dcaa880$2efdfea9@JimDownOne>
	<070f01c7399e$be5adbb0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <45AF95EF0200005D00008171@gwise.cccti.edu>

Thanks to all for the information/discussion aboaut using WorkKeys for
ABE students!!
 
 
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services
 
Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
 
 
 

 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Jan 19 10:37:30 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:37:30 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 588]  Formative assessment examples
Message-ID: <0a1601c73bdf$bb87e660$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
Wow, no takers on the formative assessment question.  There's a wealth
of ideas and info to share here so I'm throwing out my prompt to you.
 
Here are some examples of the types of daily/weekly, ongoing, formative
assessment that I would do with adult students to get a sense of where
they were in their learning process, and what they needed to work on.  I
am trained in both teaching ESOL and Basic Literacy, so I'm drawing from
both those venues.  I'm sure many of these examples are quite familiar
to you.
 
For reading:  
-I liked to have students read out loud sometimes so I could hear how
they pronounced words, get a sense of their understanding of
punctuation, get an idea of their fluency; I also liked to ask
comprehension questions after an out-loud reading so I could see if the
person needed to use all their concentration to decipher/articulate the
text, or it they were able to comprehend the text at the same time.
 
For writing:
-I always liked to use dialog journals in the classic way of not overtly
correcting errors, but rather writing back with the same language but in
corrected fashion.  You can see over a period of time when the person's
writing starts to change and the person begins to notice correct forms
and use them.  This progression is fairly slow and so you can really get
a sense of the learning journey for that person.  
 
For speaking:
-I always began class with the same routine which was often a set of
casual questions thrown out to whomever would like to respond (i.e.:
how was your weekend?  What did you do? etc).  I can see who speaks
right up, and who does not; you can see over time how that dynamic
starts to change because the students have the expectation after a while
that this will happen and they start mentally preparing for it.  They
will often ask each other as well once this has been established.  I
sort of feel that in an ESOL class, especially one focused on
speaking/listening, formative assessment happens anytime anyone opens
their mouth (or doesn't) - but wouldn't that be really hard to
document?!
 
For pronunciation:
-There are so many formative things you can do with pronunciation; I ask
students to bring in their own pocket mirror so that they can look at
their mouths while they are practicing sounds.  I ask them to look in
their mirror and see if what they see looks like what I am doing; they
also monitor their progress during class.
 
For self-assessment:
-Student self-assessment is really powerful - people can really take
control of their own learning if they are guided to do self-assessment;
once they learn how, they don't need much guidance anymore; this is
especially important in today's world of Distance Learning, and for
those students who stop out of programs but wish to carry on their study
by themselves.  Here's an idea if you are asking people to provide
definitions of words/terms or to discuss the meaning of a particular
concept:  ask them to first write what they think is the correct
response, even if they are not sure; then provide them with where to
find the correct answers so they can go there and add the correct
response to their own and the question at hand.  This makes the activity
much more of a critical thinking process and it is organized to provide
a self-assessment.
 
So that's a few examples for you - I hope that it prompts you to add
your own ideas, or ask questions.  
 
Thanks!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jan 23 11:03:16 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:03:16 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 589]  Your classroom today
Message-ID: <0ba901c73f07$fec3bc30$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi out there!
 
Ok, how about this:
 
How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  Do you strictly
follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality of the present
situation?  If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop
your lesson plan?  Describe how you do this.
 
For those folks working in the GED realm:  how do you know where to
start with your adult students?  Just from the practice test or pre-test
or do you do other things as well?  Once the student is placed in an
appropriate level, how do you know what to do today with her?  How do
you know what she needs?
 
Thanks!! for any of your thoughts!!
 
marie
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jan 23 11:24:18 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:24:18 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 590]  WE LEARN Conference Schedule Available
Message-ID: <0bc301c73f0a$ef034420$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

 
4th Annual WE LEARN (Net)Working Conference an Women and Literacy
Threads of Experience: Creative Spaces for Women's Learning
March 9-10, 2007 
Boston MA at Northeastern University
Registration & Travel details: http://www.litwomen.org/conference.html

We have now posted the Program Schedule Grid and Workshop Descriptions.

We have also added the application for funding support.

Early bird conference registration deadline (with 15% discount): Feb. 2,
2007
Deadline to make reservations at the Midtown Hotel to receive conference
price: February 5, 2007
Pre-registration deadline: Feb. 23, 2007

We still have some spaces available in the Pre-Conference Seminar -- 
The Impact of Violence on Learning: Building Connections to Deepen
Understanding
March 8, 2007, 
in conjunction with the WE LEARN Annual Conference, in Boston MA at
Northeastern University
For application go to:
http://www.litwomen.org/conferences/2007/seminar_app.doc
For flyer, go to:
http://www.litwomen.org/conferences/2007/flyer_color.pdf

For more information, please contact:
Mev Miller

WE LEARN
Women Expanding: Literacy Education Action Resource Network
www.litwomen.org/welearn.html

Mev Miller, Ed.D., Director
182 Riverside Ave.
Cranston, RI 02910
401-383-4374
welearn at litwomen.org
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From sreid at workbase.org.nz  Tue Jan 23 12:19:51 2007
From: sreid at workbase.org.nz (Susan Reid)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 06:19:51 +1300
Subject: [Assessment 591] Re: Your classroom today
Message-ID: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA542@secure.workbase.org.nz>

Hi Marie 
Happy New Year to you and thank you for persevering with us. 
 
I have been reading your posts and want to respond to the earlier one about forms of formative assessment.  
I find that often my 'formative assessment' is unplanned 
 
I was doing some professional development with our teachers last week and I gave them a scenario which was based on something I did some time ago when I gave a group of workplace employees I was working with a task to do workplace observations for an hour a day and keep a diary about them following a certain format. All the employees were in roles where part of their job tasks was  to fill in a shift log ( the format I required)  and so I had no qualms about asking them to do this task which was part of a training programme for a Quality assurance role. They were meant to fill in their diaries and hand them into me each week so I could look at them and then discuss them wiht eack of the group. . 
 
Well at the end of week one three people hadn't handed in their diaries and one of them approached me to say he had terrible handwriting and spelling and couldn't do the task. It transpired that he had a workmate fill in the shift log for him every shift. When I followed up the other two it turned out they had similar  issues but not necessarily such a creative response. 
As formative assessment is assessment for teaching then the task  I had asked the group to do  turned out to be formative assessment as I then had to change my approach quite significantly for these three employees. At the beginning  I had planned that the diaries themselves would be the formative assessment activity by contributing to a portfolio of writing. 
 
For me there was also some stuff about making assumptions about learners' ability to do the task but htis experience made me more aware that formative assessment opportunites arise all the time ( planned and unplanned) and need to be recorded. 
 
I suppose that  the biggest lesson I have learned from colleagues is the labelling of these activities as formative assessment and then recording it and discussing it with the learners. Often we do it but we don't name it as such. 
 
kind regards Susan Reid 
Manager Learning and Development 
Workbase the New Zealand Centee for Workforce Literacy 
www.workbase.org.nz
 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Wed 24/01/2007 5:03 a.m.
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 589] Your classroom today

Hi out there!
 
Ok, how about this:
 
How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  Do you strictly follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality of the present situation?  If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop your lesson plan?  Describe how you do this.
 
For those folks working in the GED realm:  how do you know where to start with your adult students?  Just from the practice test or pre-test or do you do other things as well?  Once the student is placed in an appropriate level, how do you know what to do today with her?  How do you know what she needs?
 
Thanks!! for any of your thoughts!!
 
marie
 
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From MField at midsouthcc.edu  Tue Jan 23 13:51:04 2007
From: MField at midsouthcc.edu (Field, Mary)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 12:51:04 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 592] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <0ba901c73f07$fec3bc30$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <0ba901c73f07$fec3bc30$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <A6B222AB0C61F347BA3178BA70C934E1011D123B@LAKOTA.midsouthcc.edu>

We have a set syllabi of assignments and "course objectives" which all
instructors are to follow. Instructors have some leeway on how they
teach the class but  similar tests and points have to be given in all
sections-the idea being you get the same content in any section you
might take (sort of a quality control thing). We are a community college
so some things are "lock step". However, the issue becomes what if your
class needs more background or catch up work (different needs). I do the
old "monitor and adjust" with activities because we all know that what
works with one group does all work with the next. We have used some pre
and post tests in some areas (developmental writing and reading) but
more and more each instructor is picking one of the course objectives
and "assessing" it for a semester and then reporting results to the Dean
of Instruction at the end of the semester.

 

In a somewhat related area, I would like to hear from anyone who teaches
the same course online and face to face and how you handle assignments,
etc. There is a philosophy being promoted with us that the online and
face to face classes should be identical with types of assignments,
activities, etc. Thanks!

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:03 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 589] Your classroom today

 

Hi out there!

 

Ok, how about this:

 

How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  Do you strictly
follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality of the present
situation?  If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop
your lesson plan?  Describe how you do this.

 

For those folks working in the GED realm:  how do you know where to
start with your adult students?  Just from the practice test or pre-test
or do you do other things as well?  Once the student is placed in an
appropriate level, how do you know what to do today with her?  How do
you know what she needs?

 

Thanks!! for any of your thoughts!!

 

marie

 

 

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

_______________________________________________________________________
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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Tue Jan 23 14:44:26 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 11:44:26 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 593] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <A6B222AB0C61F347BA3178BA70C934E1011D123B@LAKOTA.midsouthcc.edu>
References: <0ba901c73f07$fec3bc30$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
	<A6B222AB0C61F347BA3178BA70C934E1011D123B@LAKOTA.midsouthcc.edu>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E440@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

What you have described is the art of ABE teaching.  How do you start
your multi-level classroom off to a great start, while meeting the goals
and needs of each learner?  Materials need to fit their skills and be
useful and current as well as align with your program goals and course
outlines....yipee...and how do you train new staff to do this "magic"?
Making each class room identical doesn't fit what I've seen for 37
years, as each group of students has variable needs and strengths.  We
are peer learners too; how would we each feel if all classes never were
specific to our joys and needs? We all need success and challenge,
affirmation, caring and push.

va

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Field, Mary
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:51 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 592] Re: Your classroom today

 

We have a set syllabi of assignments and "course objectives" which all
instructors are to follow. Instructors have some leeway on how they
teach the class but  similar tests and points have to be given in all
sections-the idea being you get the same content in any section you
might take (sort of a quality control thing). We are a community college
so some things are "lock step". However, the issue becomes what if your
class needs more background or catch up work (different needs). I do the
old "monitor and adjust" with activities because we all know that what
works with one group does all work with the next. We have used some pre
and post tests in some areas (developmental writing and reading) but
more and more each instructor is picking one of the course objectives
and "assessing" it for a semester and then reporting results to the Dean
of Instruction at the end of the semester.

 

In a somewhat related area, I would like to hear from anyone who teaches
the same course online and face to face and how you handle assignments,
etc. There is a philosophy being promoted with us that the online and
face to face classes should be identical with types of assignments,
activities, etc. Thanks!

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:03 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 589] Your classroom today

 

Hi out there!

 

Ok, how about this:

 

How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  Do you strictly
follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality of the present
situation?  If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop
your lesson plan?  Describe how you do this.

 

For those folks working in the GED realm:  how do you know where to
start with your adult students?  Just from the practice test or pre-test
or do you do other things as well?  Once the student is placed in an
appropriate level, how do you know what to do today with her?  How do
you know what she needs?

 

Thanks!! for any of your thoughts!!

 

marie

 

 

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

_______________________________________________________________________
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jan 23 15:32:02 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 15:32:02 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 594] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E440@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Message-ID: <0c7a01c73f2d$8a844170$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Virginia,
 
Thanks for this - can you answer some of your own questions for us?!
How DO you start off your multi-level classroom?  How do you gauge where
everyone is?  How do you figure out which materials will fit their
skills?
 
I would love to hear other subscribers answer the questions that
Virginia poses here.
 
Thanks!

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Virginia Tardaewether
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:44 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 593] Re: Your classroom today
 
What you have described is the art of ABE teaching.  How do you start
your multi-level classroom off to a great start, while meeting the goals
and needs of each learner?  Materials need to fit their skills and be
useful and current as well as align with your program goals and course
outlines..yipee.and how do you train new staff to do this "magic"?
Making each class room identical doesn't fit what I've seen for 37
years, as each group of students has variable needs and strengths.  We
are peer learners too; how would we each feel if all classes never were
specific to our joys and needs? We all need success and challenge,
affirmation, caring and push.
va
 
  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Field, Mary
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:51 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 592] Re: Your classroom today
 
We have a set syllabi of assignments and "course objectives" which all
instructors are to follow. Instructors have some leeway on how they
teach the class but  similar tests and points have to be given in all
sections-the idea being you get the same content in any section you
might take (sort of a quality control thing). We are a community college
so some things are "lock step". However, the issue becomes what if your
class needs more background or catch up work (different needs). I do the
old "monitor and adjust" with activities because we all know that what
works with one group does all work with the next. We have used some pre
and post tests in some areas (developmental writing and reading) but
more and more each instructor is picking one of the course objectives
and "assessing" it for a semester and then reporting results to the Dean
of Instruction at the end of the semester.
 
In a somewhat related area, I would like to hear from anyone who teaches
the same course online and face to face and how you handle assignments,
etc. There is a philosophy being promoted with us that the online and
face to face classes should be identical with types of assignments,
activities, etc. Thanks!
 
  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:03 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 589] Your classroom today
 
Hi out there!
 
Ok, how about this:
 
How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  Do you strictly
follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality of the present
situation?  If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop
your lesson plan?  Describe how you do this.
 
For those folks working in the GED realm:  how do you know where to
start with your adult students?  Just from the practice test or pre-test
or do you do other things as well?  Once the student is placed in an
appropriate level, how do you know what to do today with her?  How do
you know what she needs?
 
Thanks!! for any of your thoughts!!
 
marie
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 

_______________________________________________________________________
Scanned for viruses by MessageLabs SkyScan!
_______________________________________________________________________

_______________________________________________________________________
This MSCC e-mail has been scanned for viruses by MessageLabs SkyScan!
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From Jeanette.Schandelmeier at lposd.org  Tue Jan 23 15:52:29 2007
From: Jeanette.Schandelmeier at lposd.org (Jeanette Schandelmeier)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 12:52:29 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 595] Re: Your classroom today
References: <0ba901c73f07$fec3bc30$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <AC492FF682363043AD608BA595992B6301D3A309@do1mex.lposd.org>

I'm a special educator, currently at the elementary level, but I've
taught at all levels including juvenile detention.  My informal on-going
assessments are standards/curriculum-based; I suppose what you'd call
formative.   I then write my IEP goals based on our state standards.
When I co-plan and co-teach with general ed., we group the students
based on the same types of assessments.  We obtain even more information
during the direct instruction time, where we're asking each student to
respond to the instruction.  While they are working independently we
make contact with each student to see how they're responding to the
instruction.  At the end of the lesson we, the teachers, discuss whether
more instruction is needed (for the class as a whole or for individuals)
or whether we can move on to the next skill in the curriculum.

All of this is dependent upon a "good" (i.e. research-based, sequential,
etc.) curriculum.

Jeanette 

 

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 8:03 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 589] Your classroom today

 

Hi out there!

 

Ok, how about this:

 

How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  Do you strictly
follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality of the present
situation?  If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop
your lesson plan?  Describe how you do this.

 

For those folks working in the GED realm:  how do you know where to
start with your adult students?  Just from the practice test or pre-test
or do you do other things as well?  Once the student is placed in an
appropriate level, how do you know what to do today with her?  How do
you know what she needs?

 

Thanks!! for any of your thoughts!!

 

marie

 

 

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Tue Jan 23 16:11:43 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 14:11:43 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 596] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E440@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
References: <0ba901c73f07$fec3bc30$0202a8c0@LITNOW>	<A6B222AB0C61F347BA3178BA70C934E1011D123B@LAKOTA.midsouthcc.edu>,
	<D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E440@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Message-ID: <OFF58ED350.4FCA4461-ON0725726C.00746E06-0725726C.00746E07@yc.edu>

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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Tue Jan 23 16:26:11 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 13:26:11 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 597] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <0c7a01c73f2d$8a844170$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E440@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
	<0c7a01c73f2d$8a844170$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E443@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

How DO you start off your multi-level classroom?  How do you gauge where
everyone is?  How do you figure out which materials will fit their
skills? We also give both online and face-to-face students assignments
in Skills Tutor and Aztec. We use the CASAS score to locate what level
to place them in for this software program. Face-to-face students also
get placed in group lessons for writing or math. We have credit and
non-credit students who attend the group lessons.  We have two levels of
math and writing.  There are only two of us so it is difficult to do
more than that.  The large numbers of teens enrolled have benefited from
the groups a lot as they are so social. The instructor and instructional
assistant work to create a whole class lessons for these sessions; these
lessons try to meet the needs of the group in the class. Each semester
we will have different needs and will tailor the lessons accordingly.
Oregon and Chemeketa have Standards, and we aim to meet these with both
the individualized and whole group lessons.

 

We adjust our curriculum as we do follow up CASAS and Official Practice
testing. When we find a student advancing, we feel we are being
successful with meeting his/her needs. We also encourage them move ahead
when they find the work we have assigned to them to be easy.  When we
find a student is not advancing, we adjust the curriculum to see how we
can better meet his/her needs. We try to get students to work with each
other.

 

We offer opportunities for feedback in the form of spelling quizzes,
writing essays and editing each other's work, doing small group work,
etc. to make sure the students are getting what is being taught during
the class period. We also spot check work done out of workbooks and
review scores on the software lessons. Our program really does a lot
with informal, formative and standardized assessment, and I think that
helps the students stay on task and accomplish their goals.

 

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 12:32 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 594] Re: Your classroom today

 

Hi Virginia,

 

Thanks for this - can you answer some of your own questions for us?!  

 

I would love to hear other subscribers answer the questions that
Virginia poses here.

 

Thanks!

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Virginia Tardaewether
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:44 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 593] Re: Your classroom today

 

What you have described is the art of ABE teaching.  How do you start
your multi-level classroom off to a great start, while meeting the goals
and needs of each learner?  Materials need to fit their skills and be
useful and current as well as align with your program goals and course
outlines....yipee...and how do you train new staff to do this "magic"?
Making each class room identical doesn't fit what I've seen for 37
years, as each group of students has variable needs and strengths.  We
are peer learners too; how would we each feel if all classes never were
specific to our joys and needs? We all need success and challenge,
affirmation, caring and push.

va

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Field, Mary
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:51 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 592] Re: Your classroom today

 

We have a set syllabi of assignments and "course objectives" which all
instructors are to follow. Instructors have some leeway on how they
teach the class but  similar tests and points have to be given in all
sections-the idea being you get the same content in any section you
might take (sort of a quality control thing). We are a community college
so some things are "lock step". However, the issue becomes what if your
class needs more background or catch up work (different needs). I do the
old "monitor and adjust" with activities because we all know that what
works with one group does all work with the next. We have used some pre
and post tests in some areas (developmental writing and reading) but
more and more each instructor is picking one of the course objectives
and "assessing" it for a semester and then reporting results to the Dean
of Instruction at the end of the semester.

 

In a somewhat related area, I would like to hear from anyone who teaches
the same course online and face to face and how you handle assignments,
etc. There is a philosophy being promoted with us that the online and
face to face classes should be identical with types of assignments,
activities, etc. Thanks!

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:03 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 589] Your classroom today

 

Hi out there!

 

Ok, how about this:

 

How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  Do you strictly
follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality of the present
situation?  If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop
your lesson plan?  Describe how you do this.

 

For those folks working in the GED realm:  how do you know where to
start with your adult students?  Just from the practice test or pre-test
or do you do other things as well?  Once the student is placed in an
appropriate level, how do you know what to do today with her?  How do
you know what she needs?

 

Thanks!! for any of your thoughts!!

 

marie

 

 

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

_______________________________________________________________________
Scanned for viruses by MessageLabs SkyScan!
_______________________________________________________________________

_______________________________________________________________________
This MSCC e-mail has been scanned for viruses by MessageLabs SkyScan!
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From bryan at cal.org  Tue Jan 23 17:02:33 2007
From: bryan at cal.org (Bryan Woerner)
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 17:02:33 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 599] Re: Your classroom today
Message-ID: <7E0B624DDF68104F92C38648A4D93D8F0229755F@MAIL.cal.local>

How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  
 
I teach for the Adult ESOL Program at Montgomery College in Maryland. I
use several things to help put together curriculum for my class
including state content standards, program goals, CASAS test
information, my own observations, and student requests. Mostly I use the
CASAS information as a guide as it shows their strengths and weaknesses
and because our program uses the competencies as benchmarks to meet the
state's content standards.
 
Do you strictly follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality
of the present situation? 
 
I generally tend to follow a lesson plan, but as I gain more experience,
I'm learning to be flexible when things are working right and if
something comes up - such as a teachable moment or impromptu discussion.
I try to keep to the plan, but sometimes you have to have a little
variety in your routine to keep the students interested.
 
If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop your lesson
plan?  Describe how you do this.
 
If I have time and paper, I like to create my own materials, otherwise I
try and use the textbooks, supplemental materials, and realia on hand to
make my lesson plans.
 
I try to follow the Communicative Approach which basically says that
language is a tool and as a teacher, it is my duty to help learners use
language to solve their problems in the everyday world. Along with that
idea I follow some "blueprints" for lesson design that help learners
learn how to learn, while providing enough scaffolding along the way.
You can view these blueprints at American University TESOL's website
http://www.american.edu/tesol/Lessonplans.htm. 
 
The Communicative Approach also means trying to use authentic language
(or near-authentic) as opposed to the often contrived textbook language.
Examples: using real job ads from the newspaper, recording your own
dialogues (I suggest getting the Olympus VN-2100PC ~$50 to $60), having
students create their own dialogues, having students fill out real
applications, etc. It takes a lot of time at first to find and create
some of these things, but you build up quite a library after awhile and
you can often use them with multiple levels. And while I'm not a big fan
of textbook dialogues and exercises, they often make great controlled
exercises or the dialogues can be used in other ways the textbook
authors intended.
 
Bryan Woerner 
Adult ESL Assessment Operations 
bryan at cal.org <mailto:bryan at cal.org> 
 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 11:03 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 589] Your classroom today

Hi out there!
 
Ok, how about this:
 
How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  Do you strictly
follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality of the present
situation?  If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop
your lesson plan?  Describe how you do this.
 
For those folks working in the GED realm:  how do you know where to
start with your adult students?  Just from the practice test or pre-test
or do you do other things as well?  Once the student is placed in an
appropriate level, how do you know what to do today with her?  How do
you know what she needs?
 
Thanks!! for any of your thoughts!!
 
marie
 
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From KHinson at almanid.com  Tue Jan 23 19:18:30 2007
From: KHinson at almanid.com (Katrina Hinson)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 01:18:30 +0100
Subject: [Assessment 598] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <0ba901c73f07$fec3bc30$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <0ba901c73f07$fec3bc30$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <45B65F84.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>

I have a multi level, multi entry GED Lab. When my students come in, I
look at their TABE scores and talk to them about where they actually
stopped learning - what they've been doing workwise and try to gather
information to give me a better picture of what someone may really know.
 I use Pre-tests in the Steck-Vaughn and Contemporary GED and Pre-GED
books. I also use the Achieving TABE success books that have some
excellent Pre-Tests that I like better than the GED Pre Test when it
comes to reading because it give me a better picture of the "skill" area
that a student may be having difficulty with in terms of Reading - such
as Main Ideas, Inferences etc. I adapt a lot of my assessment measures
up and down for any given new student. I don't want to frustrate them
off the top and if I see them struggling with something, I'll approach
them and tell them to "let's try something else - let's back up a bit
and see if this is a bit better place for you to start."  My class is a
mixture of independent and self paced learning with some group
instruction thrown in. We do a writing journal as a class every day and
we do a math journal every day as a way of coming together as a class. I
also have my students work on MySkillsTutor, A+, Work Keys and
McGrawHill's Top 50 Skills CD. The practice tests for the latter give a
really good "study" plan for students and they can print off their
information for their score and see their own progress. They've enjoyed
doing those exercises.

I do a overall lesson plan - an outline for the day so to speak just in
case I'm not there and someone needs to fill in for me.  The lesson plan
is always a big picture and the students fit into that big picture or
better yet, the big picture fits around my students because I modify any
given day based on the needs and wants and desires of my students.

Also, I do teach online classes. They are all TABE tested just as we do
for any other student. GED students work on MySkillsTutor and A+Anywhere
and do the assessments involved in each program.  AHS students are a bit
different.  I've been working on creating blackboard classes for AHS but
we also currently use A+Anywhere for an online component of our AHS
program. Each class has a syllabus and objectives that need to be met.
The online assignments are not necessarily the same as they would be if
the student were taking the same class in person. The whole idea is to
provide an alternative means of instruction for students we might
otherwise lose or who might otherwise have to quit or stop out for
whatever reason he or she is facing. The online classes are designed for
students that truly show an aptitude to learn on their own and at their
own pace. They're given contact information for me as an instructor and
the hours I'll be available online to help them both during school hours
and outside school hours. They have to check in with me once a week and
I monitor their progress via reports and assignments and if I see a
problem I will contact a student and bring them in for face to face
counseling. So far it's working well. 

I keep track of what each student is working on day to day, week to
week. I do my own version of an IEP for each student so that if for some
reason I'm not there, they know what to do and where to go and keep
moving ahead. I update their plans as they complete lessons, gain
confidence, pass GED practice tests or GED tests or simply progress
levels up on the TABE. It's more work in the beginning but it works
better organizationally for me in the long run and the students like
being able to see what they're doing, where they are and where they're
going.

Regards,
Katrina Hinson

>>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 1/23/2007 11:03 am
>>>
Hi out there!
 
Ok, how about this:
 
How do you know what to do in your classroom today?  Do you strictly
follow some plan, or do you take cues from the reality of the present
situation?  If you follow a plan (strictly or not), how do you develop
your lesson plan?  Describe how you do this.
 
For those folks working in the GED realm:  how do you know where to
start with your adult students?  Just from the practice test or
pre-test
or do you do other things as well?  Once the student is placed in an
appropriate level, how do you know what to do today with her?  How do
you know what she needs?
 
Thanks!! for any of your thoughts!!
 
marie
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Jan 24 14:26:40 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 14:26:40 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 600]  Your classroom today
Message-ID: <0d4801c73fed$9396ef90$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
Thanks for these great ideas and suggestions.  Keep them coming!
 
(Let me know if you find the use of bold below helpful or annoying - I
was trying to highlight certain sections so that you could skip over
things if you want to.)
 
I'm struck by just how much everyone seems to do in terms of diagnostics
and placement.  I guess it could be argued that appropriate diagnostic
placement is crucial in terms of making or breaking an adult student's
experience.  
 
Some replies to folks who've posted:
 
Susan - I really like the idea of using scenarios in professional
development.  I think that providing a real situation for people to
respond to is really helpful in the learning process.  Do you use this
regularly with people?  Where do you get your scenarios from?  Real
experiences or things you've heard about?  Others - do you use scenarios
with either staff or students?  What's that like?
 
Jeannette - you brought up IEPs (Individualized Education Plans).  These
are so useful in terms of providing the guidance needed.  I know that
they are used widely (always?) in special education - but do folks not
working in special ed use them as well?  I know Katrina mentioned that
she does.  I also love the idea of the teacher group discussions for
determining student progress!  There's nothing more powerful than
talking things through with colleagues.
 
 Tina - you talked about pre-tests that you develop at your program.  Do
you do this on your own or with others in the program?  Do you have
pre-tests for various levels or content areas?  Others - do you develop
your own pre-tests and what does this look like?
 
Katrina - you also mentioned IEPs, but also you talked about the fact
that students have access to these and can use them as guides, is that
correct?  This is a really great form of student self-assessment.
Others - do you have your students engage in self-assessment?  What does
that look like?
 
Bryan - thanks for this great resource (Lesson Plan Blueprints, TESOL) -
it looks very intriguing.  Often you need to be a TESOL member to access
their resources, but it appears that this one anyone can go to.  There
are a ton of useful resources at this site including white papers on
rationale, bibliographies, real lessons, among other things.  Anyone
else use this and care to comment?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From bryan at cal.org  Wed Jan 24 14:34:05 2007
From: bryan at cal.org (Bryan Woerner)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 14:34:05 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 601] Re: Your classroom today
Message-ID: <7E0B624DDF68104F92C38648A4D93D8F022978E6@MAIL.cal.local>

Hi everyone,
 
The information I posted about is actually through the American
University TESOL program, which is where I got my masters degree. The
information is copyrighted, but it is free to use by anyone and you
don't have to be a student to download it.
 
Bryan

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 2:27 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 600] Your classroom today

Hi everyone,
 
Thanks for these great ideas and suggestions.  Keep them coming!
 
(Let me know if you find the use of bold below helpful or annoying - I
was trying to highlight certain sections so that you could skip over
things if you want to.)
 
I'm struck by just how much everyone seems to do in terms of diagnostics
and placement.  I guess it could be argued that appropriate diagnostic
placement is crucial in terms of making or breaking an adult student's
experience.  
 
Some replies to folks who've posted:
 
Susan - I really like the idea of using scenarios in professional
development.  I think that providing a real situation for people to
respond to is really helpful in the learning process.  Do you use this
regularly with people?  Where do you get your scenarios from?  Real
experiences or things you've heard about?  Others - do you use scenarios
with either staff or students?  What's that like?
 
Jeannette - you brought up IEPs (Individualized Education Plans).  These
are so useful in terms of providing the guidance needed.  I know that
they are used widely (always?) in special education - but do folks not
working in special ed use them as well?  I know Katrina mentioned that
she does.  I also love the idea of the teacher group discussions for
determining student progress!  There's nothing more powerful than
talking things through with colleagues.
 
 Tina - you talked about pre-tests that you develop at your program.  Do
you do this on your own or with others in the program?  Do you have
pre-tests for various levels or content areas?  Others - do you develop
your own pre-tests and what does this look like?
 
Katrina - you also mentioned IEPs, but also you talked about the fact
that students have access to these and can use them as guides, is that
correct?  This is a really great form of student self-assessment.
Others - do you have your students engage in self-assessment?  What does
that look like?
 
Bryan - thanks for this great resource (Lesson Plan Blueprints, TESOL) -
it looks very intriguing.  Often you need to be a TESOL member to access
their resources, but it appears that this one anyone can go to.  There
are a ton of useful resources at this site including white papers on
rationale, bibliographies, real lessons, among other things.  Anyone
else use this and care to comment?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Wed Jan 24 20:51:31 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 18:51:31 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 602] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <7E0B624DDF68104F92C38648A4D93D8F022978E6@MAIL.cal.local>
References: <7E0B624DDF68104F92C38648A4D93D8F022978E6@MAIL.cal.local>
Message-ID: <OFF09D84A8.7D4F7DFF-ON0725726E.000A35EF-0725726E.000A35F1@yc.edu>

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From pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us  Thu Jan 25 09:52:03 2007
From: pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us (JO PAMMENT)
Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 09:52:03 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 603]   Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <7E0B624DDF68104F92C38648A4D93D8F022978E6@MAIL.cal.local>
References: <7E0B624DDF68104F92C38648A4D93D8F022978E6@MAIL.cal.local>
Message-ID: <45B87DC30200009E00008380@10.1.0.15>

Thanks, for the referral, Bryan.  I checked it out, and it looks
interesting.
Jo Pamment

Jo Pamment
Director Adult Ed. ESL
Haslett Public Schools
1118 S. Harrison 
East Lansing, Michigan 48823

TEL:  517 337-8353
FAX:  517 337-3195
E-Mail:  pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us

>>> "Bryan Woerner" <bryan at cal.org> 1/24/2007 2:34:05 PM >>>
Hi everyone,
 
The information I posted about is actually through the American
University TESOL program, which is where I got my masters degree. The
information is copyrighted, but it is free to use by anyone and you
don't have to be a student to download it.
 
Bryan

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]

On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2007 2:27 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
Subject: [Assessment 600] Your classroom today

Hi everyone,
 
Thanks for these great ideas and suggestions.  Keep them coming!
 
(Let me know if you find the use of bold below helpful or annoying - I
was trying to highlight certain sections so that you could skip over
things if you want to.)
 
I'm struck by just how much everyone seems to do in terms of
diagnostics
and placement.  I guess it could be argued that appropriate diagnostic
placement is crucial in terms of making or breaking an adult student's
experience.  
 
Some replies to folks who've posted:
 
Susan - I really like the idea of using scenarios in professional
development.  I think that providing a real situation for people to
respond to is really helpful in the learning process.  Do you use this
regularly with people?  Where do you get your scenarios from?  Real
experiences or things you've heard about?  Others - do you use
scenarios
with either staff or students?  What's that like?
 
Jeannette - you brought up IEPs (Individualized Education Plans). 
These
are so useful in terms of providing the guidance needed.  I know that
they are used widely (always?) in special education - but do folks not
working in special ed use them as well?  I know Katrina mentioned that
she does.  I also love the idea of the teacher group discussions for
determining student progress!  There's nothing more powerful than
talking things through with colleagues.
 
 Tina - you talked about pre-tests that you develop at your program. 
Do
you do this on your own or with others in the program?  Do you have
pre-tests for various levels or content areas?  Others - do you
develop
your own pre-tests and what does this look like?
 
Katrina - you also mentioned IEPs, but also you talked about the fact
that students have access to these and can use them as guides, is that
correct?  This is a really great form of student self-assessment.
Others - do you have your students engage in self-assessment?  What
does
that look like?
 
Bryan - thanks for this great resource (Lesson Plan Blueprints, TESOL)
-
it looks very intriguing.  Often you need to be a TESOL member to
access
their resources, but it appears that this one anyone can go to.  There
are a ton of useful resources at this site including white papers on
rationale, bibliographies, real lessons, among other things.  Anyone
else use this and care to comment?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

From KHinson at almanid.com  Thu Jan 25 14:02:49 2007
From: KHinson at almanid.com (Katrina Hinson)
Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:02:49 +0100
Subject: [Assessment 604] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <0d4801c73fed$9396ef90$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <0d4801c73fed$9396ef90$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <45B8B885.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>

Yes, students have access to them. It's an individualized education plan
fitted to that student. It helps keep the student on target and focused
as to what step he or she is in the program - where they are in terms of
reaching individual goals.  

Regards,
Katrina Hinson

>>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 1/24/2007 2:26 pm
>>>
Hi everyone,
 
Thanks for these great ideas and suggestions.  Keep them coming!
 
(Let me know if you find the use of bold below helpful or annoying - I
was trying to highlight certain sections so that you could skip over
things if you want to.)
 
I'm struck by just how much everyone seems to do in terms of
diagnostics
and placement.  I guess it could be argued that appropriate diagnostic
placement is crucial in terms of making or breaking an adult student's
experience.  
 
Some replies to folks who've posted:
 
Susan - I really like the idea of using scenarios in professional
development.  I think that providing a real situation for people to
respond to is really helpful in the learning process.  Do you use this
regularly with people?  Where do you get your scenarios from?  Real
experiences or things you've heard about?  Others - do you use
scenarios
with either staff or students?  What's that like?
 
Jeannette - you brought up IEPs (Individualized Education Plans). 
These
are so useful in terms of providing the guidance needed.  I know that
they are used widely (always?) in special education - but do folks not
working in special ed use them as well?  I know Katrina mentioned that
she does.  I also love the idea of the teacher group discussions for
determining student progress!  There's nothing more powerful than
talking things through with colleagues.
 
 Tina - you talked about pre-tests that you develop at your program. 
Do
you do this on your own or with others in the program?  Do you have
pre-tests for various levels or content areas?  Others - do you
develop
your own pre-tests and what does this look like?
 
Katrina - you also mentioned IEPs, but also you talked about the fact
that students have access to these and can use them as guides, is that
correct?  This is a really great form of student self-assessment.
Others - do you have your students engage in self-assessment?  What
does
that look like?
 
Bryan - thanks for this great resource (Lesson Plan Blueprints, TESOL)
-
it looks very intriguing.  Often you need to be a TESOL member to
access
their resources, but it appears that this one anyone can go to.  There
are a ton of useful resources at this site including white papers on
rationale, bibliographies, real lessons, among other things.  Anyone
else use this and care to comment?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

From sreid at workbase.org.nz  Fri Jan 26 19:00:21 2007
From: sreid at workbase.org.nz (Susan Reid)
Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 13:00:21 +1300
Subject: [Assessment 605] Re: Your classroom today
Message-ID: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz>

Hi Marie 
 
We use scenarios all the time  in professional development - they help make concepts real and participants can relate what they have been working on to a real live situation. 
Usually I use my own or other colleagues' personal experiences 
Scenarios are very flexible too - a former colleague of mine taught me to how to start them off in quite a simple way and then either make them layered by adding more information or by getting the participants to add more information - that way you find out what they are doing and are able to ask rich questions about why they chose to add that information 
 
Prior to that I had spent a lot of time writing quite complex and rich scenarios and sometimes they didn't relate to the participants' experiences so this way they build the scenario too  and have a strong sense of ownership 
 
I find scenarios really useful in making explicit the wide range of opportunities that exist for formative assessment - we put  a lot of emphasis on observation and recording as formative assessment rather than 'testing' per se 
Observation requires some knowledge on behalf of the teacher and a commitment to enquiry - when they see something that they are not sure about then they ask someone or work out what was happening 
 
When I was first involved in PD I came across participants who had to comment about every aspect of the course giving little examples. Initially I found this extremely irritating until it finally dawned on me that this  was their comprehension strategy and while others might internalise what they are learning some people haven't developed that as a strategy yet. 
 
In New Zealand we call IEPs Individual Learning Plans (ILPs) and every learner in a literacy programme is meant to have one - regarded as good practice. Certainly our practice is that they are developed  with the learner - they have a copy of them and that the goals in the ILPs are regularly reviewed. 
In the UK part of their  Skills for Strategy was ther mandatory use of ILPs - there have been a number of issues around ILPs with low level ESOL learners 
 
 see http://www.nrdc.org.uk/publications_details.asp?ID=19
 
regards Susan Reid 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Thu 25/01/2007 8:26 a.m.
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 600] Your classroom today

Hi everyone,
 
Thanks for these great ideas and suggestions.  Keep them coming!
 
(Let me know if you find the use of bold below helpful or annoying - I was trying to highlight certain sections so that you could skip over things if you want to.)
 
I'm struck by just how much everyone seems to do in terms of diagnostics and placement.  I guess it could be argued that appropriate diagnostic placement is crucial in terms of making or breaking an adult student's experience.  
 
Some replies to folks who've posted:
 
Susan - I really like the idea of using scenarios in professional development.  I think that providing a real situation for people to respond to is really helpful in the learning process.  Do you use this regularly with people?  Where do you get your scenarios from?  Real experiences or things you've heard about?  Others - do you use scenarios with either staff or students?  What's that like?
 
Jeannette - you brought up IEPs (Individualized Education Plans).  These are so useful in terms of providing the guidance needed.  I know that they are used widely (always?) in special education - but do folks not working in special ed use them as well?  I know Katrina mentioned that she does.  I also love the idea of the teacher group discussions for determining student progress!  There's nothing more powerful than talking things through with colleagues.
 
 Tina - you talked about pre-tests that you develop at your program.  Do you do this on your own or with others in the program?  Do you have pre-tests for various levels or content areas?  Others - do you develop your own pre-tests and what does this look like?
 
Katrina - you also mentioned IEPs, but also you talked about the fact that students have access to these and can use them as guides, is that correct?  This is a really great form of student self-assessment.  Others - do you have your students engage in self-assessment?  What does that look like?
 
Bryan - thanks for this great resource (Lesson Plan Blueprints, TESOL) - it looks very intriguing.  Often you need to be a TESOL member to access their resources, but it appears that this one anyone can go to.  There are a ton of useful resources at this site including white papers on rationale, bibliographies, real lessons, among other things.  Anyone else use this and care to comment?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From djrosen at comcast.net  Sat Jan 27 08:49:24 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David Rosen)
Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 08:49:24 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 606] Systematic formative ways to record what students
	learn and share this information
In-Reply-To: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz>
References: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz>
Message-ID: <DCED373B-73E6-44FA-B02E-12AE683C8B4E@comcast.net>

Susan Reid, and others who use formative assessment,

I am interested in learning more about teachers' systems for keeping  
track of what students are learning and sharing this information with  
them. What paper-and-pencil strategies do you use?  What computer- 
managed or computer-aided strategies? Do you record information  
during the class, after the class, keep it all in your head? Does  
anyone share formative assessment information with students by  
regular one-on-one conferencing, by e-mailing them, in other ways?

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Sat Jan 27 13:26:19 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 11:26:19 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 607] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz>
References: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz>
Message-ID: <OFC7287494.3EAC3E7F-ON07257270.0065499E-07257270.006549A0@yc.edu>

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Sat Jan 27 16:11:54 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 16:11:54 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 608]  National Reading Conference
Message-ID: <01ad01c74257$c5ee3860$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

The following post is from Erik Jacobson.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-------------------------

Research Award Opportunity

National Reading Conference - J. Michael Parker Award

The National Reading Conference awards the J. Michael Parker Award to  
encourage research in adult literacy. The award is given to graduate  
students and untenured professors who present research on adult  
learning or education at the annual conference. Recipients of the  
award will receive $300 towards their conference expenses and will be  
recognized during a general session of the conference. The award was  
established in 2001 in honor of J. Michael Parker, winner of National  
Reading Conference's Student Research Award.

The call for papers is available online now at www.nrconline.org.  
When submitting your proposal please indicate that you will be  
applying for the J. Michael Parker Award (noted at the bottom of the  
personal information page). Applicants will be required to submit the  
full paper (25 pages or less) electronically by October 1st, 2007.   
Committee members will rate the submissions on the following criteria:

1.	The research is capable of making a significant contribution to

theory and/or practice of adult learning and instruction.

2.	The methodology is appropriate to the research question and of  
sufficient rigor.

3.	Implications of the research are of a scope needed to impact the

field.

I encourage you to apply to the conference and for the award. If you  
have any questions, please feel free to contact me at the address below.

Thank you.

Erik Jacobson, Chair
NRC J. Michael Parker Award
jacobsone at mail.montclair.edu

From sreid at workbase.org.nz  Sun Jan 28 03:43:50 2007
From: sreid at workbase.org.nz (Susan Reid)
Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 21:43:50 +1300
Subject: [Assessment 609] Re: Systematic formative ways to record what
	studentslearn and share this information
Message-ID: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA56D@secure.workbase.org.nz>

 

Hi David 

we have a  new custom designed database that teachers use to input all sorts of data 

each teacher has a laptop - while they are out on site in workplaces they use it to access teaching material etc - they have cards from one of our local Telco providers so they can access the internet and their emails. When they are in the office ( usually only one day a week) they use a wireless network. 

The database  includes the learner's Individual Learning Plan ( and goals) and the records for each session - what was planned, what was delivered, comments from the learners and the teacher. It also includes data about programme goals, curriculum, key milestones, learner details as well as diagnostic  assessment data and  formative and summative assessment data as it is collected

Each 8 weeks the learner's ILP is flagged and the teacher reviews it with the learner. If they want to review it earlier they just change the dates in the data base 

Each learner has a paper copy of the ILP in  any event

Most of the teachers input data during the session - usually at the end but if they have a spare minute while they are working with a learner they will input it then - otherwise they do it at the end of the day or on the odd occasion on the day they are in the office 

 ( almost all of our teachers work 1:1 because workplaces can only release learners one at a time so it doesn't adversely impact on production )

Almost all of the information we share with learners is done face to face but on some occasions teachers will email learners at work or home. 

The quality of data varies from teacher to teacher but it is steadily improving as the teachers themselves are coached through the system. 

Hope this is the information you wanted 

Kind regards Susan Reid 

 

 

 

 

 

Susan Reid, and others who use formative assessment,

I am interested in learning more about teachers' systems for keeping 
track of what students are learning and sharing this information with 
them. What paper-and-pencil strategies do you use?  What computer-
managed or computer-aided strategies? Do you record information 
during the class, after the class, keep it all in your head? Does 
anyone share formative assessment information with students by 
regular one-on-one conferencing, by e-mailing them, in other ways?

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From mjjerdems at yahoo.com  Mon Jan 29 09:40:56 2007
From: mjjerdems at yahoo.com (Mary Jane Jerde)
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 06:40:56 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Assessment 610] Re: Homegrown assessments
In-Reply-To: <075c01c739a7$44eb2010$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <20070129144056.56839.qmail@web54001.mail.yahoo.com>

Sorry about the low response. You had great ideas in your follow-up e-mail. Time just presses in January.

Mary Jane Jerde

Marie Cora <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:          
               Clean   Clean   DocumentEmail                            MicrosoftInternetExplorer4     st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }         /* Style Definitions */   table.MsoNormalTable  {mso-style-name:"Table Normal";  mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0;  mso-tstyle-colband-size:0;  mso-style-noshow:yes;  mso-style-parent:"";  mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt;  mso-para-margin:0in;  mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt;  mso-pagination:widow-orphan;  font-size:10.0pt;  font-family:"Times New Roman";}       Hi everyone,
   
  I mentioned last week that I wanted to raise a discussion about the types of testing and assessing that you do on a daily/weekly basis with adult students.  This is referred to as formative assessment because it directly informs the teaching and learning process as it happens.  It?s different from summative assessment which tries to deliver a synopsis of learning over a more lengthy period of time ? a semester, or in the case of ABE, a fiscal or calendar year.
   
  We just briefly discussed these two types of assessments in the last post on WorkKeys.  I finished my thoughts by noting that I am sure that many practitioners on this list do develop their own ?daily use? assessments or seek out formative assessments that already exist.  I would like for us to share thoughts and resources on formative assessment here.
   
  Here are some questions to get you thinking:
   
  Do you use both formative and summative assessments in your classroom?  If you use both, do they inform one another?  How?
  Do you develop your own assessments for use with students?  In which subject areas?  How do you use them?
  Are students involved in daily/weekly assessment?  Do students do any self-assessment?  What does that look like?
  Do you have recommendations for effective formative assessments?  Where do you look for these resources?  
  Did you read any of the suggested resources on formative assessment that I sent out last week?  Were they helpful?  What did you think?
  Would you be willing to share assessments that you have developed with subscribers on this List?  (We can develop a bank of resources.)
   
  Thanks and looking forward to hearing about what you do on a daily basis to inform your teaching!
   
  Marie Cora
  Assessment Discussion List Moderator
   
   
   
  Marie Cora
  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
  NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
  http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
   
   
  
  -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 
---------------------------------
Have a burning question? Go to Yahoo! Answers and get answers from real people who know.
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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Mon Jan 29 11:45:36 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 08:45:36 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 611] Re: Your classroom today
In-Reply-To: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz>
References: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E45D@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

Besides the items listed below, we've added a Tuition Waiver Approval
process which entails: pre and post tests, meeting with an advisor,
completion of the college placement test, a goal setting process and
attendance.

Va

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Susan Reid
Sent: Friday, January 26, 2007 4:00 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: RE: [Assessment 600] Your classroom today

 

Hi Marie 

 

We use scenarios all the time  in professional development - they help
make concepts real and participants can relate what they have been
working on to a real live situation. 

Usually I use my own or other colleagues' personal experiences 

Scenarios are very flexible too - a former colleague of mine taught me
to how to start them off in quite a simple way and then either make them
layered by adding more information or by getting the participants to add
more information - that way you find out what they are doing and are
able to ask rich questions about why they chose to add that information 

 

Prior to that I had spent a lot of time writing quite complex and rich
scenarios and sometimes they didn't relate to the participants'
experiences so this way they build the scenario too  and have a strong
sense of ownership 

 

I find scenarios really useful in making explicit the wide range of
opportunities that exist for formative assessment - we put  a lot of
emphasis on observation and recording as formative assessment rather
than 'testing' per se 

Observation requires some knowledge on behalf of the teacher and a
commitment to enquiry - when they see something that they are not sure
about then they ask someone or work out what was happening 

 

When I was first involved in PD I came across participants who had to
comment about every aspect of the course giving little examples.
Initially I found this extremely irritating until it finally dawned on
me that this  was their comprehension strategy and while others might
internalise what they are learning some people haven't developed that as
a strategy yet. 

 

In New Zealand we call IEPs Individual Learning Plans (ILPs) and every
learner in a literacy programme is meant to have one - regarded as good
practice. Certainly our practice is that they are developed  with the
learner - they have a copy of them and that the goals in the ILPs are
regularly reviewed. 

In the UK part of their  Skills for Strategy was ther mandatory use of
ILPs - there have been a number of issues around ILPs with low level
ESOL learners 

 

 see http://www.nrdc.org.uk/publications_details.asp?ID=19

 

regards Susan Reid 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Thu 25/01/2007 8:26 a.m.
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 600] Your classroom today

Hi everyone,

 

Thanks for these great ideas and suggestions.  Keep them coming!

 

(Let me know if you find the use of bold below helpful or annoying - I
was trying to highlight certain sections so that you could skip over
things if you want to.)

 

I'm struck by just how much everyone seems to do in terms of diagnostics
and placement.  I guess it could be argued that appropriate diagnostic
placement is crucial in terms of making or breaking an adult student's
experience.  

 

Some replies to folks who've posted:

 

Susan - I really like the idea of using scenarios in professional
development.  I think that providing a real situation for people to
respond to is really helpful in the learning process.  Do you use this
regularly with people?  Where do you get your scenarios from?  Real
experiences or things you've heard about?  Others - do you use scenarios
with either staff or students?  What's that like?

 

Jeannette - you brought up IEPs (Individualized Education Plans).  These
are so useful in terms of providing the guidance needed.  I know that
they are used widely (always?) in special education - but do folks not
working in special ed use them as well?  I know Katrina mentioned that
she does.  I also love the idea of the teacher group discussions for
determining student progress!  There's nothing more powerful than
talking things through with colleagues.

 

 Tina - you talked about pre-tests that you develop at your program.  Do
you do this on your own or with others in the program?  Do you have
pre-tests for various levels or content areas?  Others - do you develop
your own pre-tests and what does this look like?

 

Katrina - you also mentioned IEPs, but also you talked about the fact
that students have access to these and can use them as guides, is that
correct?  This is a really great form of student self-assessment.
Others - do you have your students engage in self-assessment?  What does
that look like?

 

Bryan - thanks for this great resource (Lesson Plan Blueprints, TESOL) -
it looks very intriguing.  Often you need to be a TESOL member to access
their resources, but it appears that this one anyone can go to.  There
are a ton of useful resources at this site including white papers on
rationale, bibliographies, real lessons, among other things.  Anyone
else use this and care to comment?

 

Thanks!

 

Marie

 

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Mon Jan 29 12:09:26 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 09:09:26 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 612] Re: Systematic formative ways to record what
	students learn and share this information
In-Reply-To: <DCED373B-73E6-44FA-B02E-12AE683C8B4E@comcast.net>
References: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz>
	<DCED373B-73E6-44FA-B02E-12AE683C8B4E@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E460@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

Susan
We have a computer site where students can access assignments and use
the email.  All students get an email account when they register so that
simplifies the matter.  As the instructor, I have access to their email
account from the registration records.

The most useful tool we've developed is a daily tracking sheet where we
track: OPT scores, CASAS pre and post scores, Agency data, and GED tests
completed.

For our GED OPTIONS students, we have a weekly attendance sheet,
progress, and track information needed by the school district for
completion of their end of year report: age, ethnic info, completion
dates, enrollment dates, and gender.  We complete this progress report
in Excel so the hours cumulate and so that we can send it electronically
to the school district.

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of David Rosen
Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 5:49 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 606] Systematic formative ways to record what
studentslearn and share this information

Susan Reid, and others who use formative assessment,

I am interested in learning more about teachers' systems for keeping  
track of what students are learning and sharing this information with  
them. What paper-and-pencil strategies do you use?  What computer- 
managed or computer-aided strategies? Do you record information  
during the class, after the class, keep it all in your head? Does  
anyone share formative assessment information with students by  
regular one-on-one conferencing, by e-mailing them, in other ways?

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From djrosen at comcast.net  Mon Jan 29 12:52:25 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David Rosen)
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:52:25 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 612] Re: Systematic formative ways to record what
	students learn and share this information
In-Reply-To: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E460@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
References: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz>
	<DCED373B-73E6-44FA-B02E-12AE683C8B4E@comcast.net>
	<D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E460@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Message-ID: <9095EA2F-B982-4BA4-96B1-1DEC56EE941E@comcast.net>

Susan and Virginia,

You appear to have sophisticated systems for recording and keeping  
track of student progress.  I wonder if you could tell us more about  
how teachers share the information with students, and how students  
get involved with using the data to make decisions about their learning.

I would like to hear from others who think they have good systems  
(not necessarily computerized) for tracking and sharing information  
for student decision making about their learning.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Jan 29, 2007, at 12:09 PM, Virginia Tardaewether wrote:

> Susan
> We have a computer site where students can access assignments and use
> the email.  All students get an email account when they register so  
> that
> simplifies the matter.  As the instructor, I have access to their  
> email
> account from the registration records.
>
> The most useful tool we've developed is a daily tracking sheet  
> where we
> track: OPT scores, CASAS pre and post scores, Agency data, and GED  
> tests
> completed.
>
> For our GED OPTIONS students, we have a weekly attendance sheet,
> progress, and track information needed by the school district for
> completion of their end of year report: age, ethnic info, completion
> dates, enrollment dates, and gender.  We complete this progress report
> in Excel so the hours cumulate and so that we can send it  
> electronically
> to the school district.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of David Rosen
> Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 5:49 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 606] Systematic formative ways to record what
> studentslearn and share this information
>
> Susan Reid, and others who use formative assessment,
>
> I am interested in learning more about teachers' systems for keeping
> track of what students are learning and sharing this information with
> them. What paper-and-pencil strategies do you use?  What computer-
> managed or computer-aided strategies? Do you record information
> during the class, after the class, keep it all in your head? Does
> anyone share formative assessment information with students by
> regular one-on-one conferencing, by e-mailing them, in other ways?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Mon Jan 29 13:22:34 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 10:22:34 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 613] Re: Systematic formative ways to record what
	students learn and share this information
In-Reply-To: <9095EA2F-B982-4BA4-96B1-1DEC56EE941E@comcast.net>
References: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3EA569@secure.workbase.org.nz><DCED373B-73E6-44FA-B02E-12AE683C8B4E@comcast.net><D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E460@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
	<9095EA2F-B982-4BA4-96B1-1DEC56EE941E@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E464@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

Well generally, students know their ethnic origins, gender and age so we
don't talk about that much :)
Pre and post test scores are talked about in small and large groups so
that all students understand the system of progress.  Each student is
given their own personal scores and an individual learning plan that is
developed with staff and the student.  This plan changes through time,
but it helps tracks goal accomplishments and testing scores.  Students
also work on resumes, complete job searches, complete FAFSA forms and
attend job interviews while enrolled.
Va

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of David Rosen
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 9:52 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 612] Re: Systematic formative ways to record
whatstudents learn and share this information

Susan and Virginia,

You appear to have sophisticated systems for recording and keeping  
track of student progress.  I wonder if you could tell us more about  
how teachers share the information with students, and how students  
get involved with using the data to make decisions about their learning.

I would like to hear from others who think they have good systems  
(not necessarily computerized) for tracking and sharing information  
for student decision making about their learning.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Jan 29, 2007, at 12:09 PM, Virginia Tardaewether wrote:

> Susan
> We have a computer site where students can access assignments and use
> the email.  All students get an email account when they register so  
> that
> simplifies the matter.  As the instructor, I have access to their  
> email
> account from the registration records.
>
> The most useful tool we've developed is a daily tracking sheet  
> where we
> track: OPT scores, CASAS pre and post scores, Agency data, and GED  
> tests
> completed.
>
> For our GED OPTIONS students, we have a weekly attendance sheet,
> progress, and track information needed by the school district for
> completion of their end of year report: age, ethnic info, completion
> dates, enrollment dates, and gender.  We complete this progress report
> in Excel so the hours cumulate and so that we can send it  
> electronically
> to the school district.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of David Rosen
> Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 5:49 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 606] Systematic formative ways to record what
> studentslearn and share this information
>
> Susan Reid, and others who use formative assessment,
>
> I am interested in learning more about teachers' systems for keeping
> track of what students are learning and sharing this information with
> them. What paper-and-pencil strategies do you use?  What computer-
> managed or computer-aided strategies? Do you record information
> during the class, after the class, keep it all in your head? Does
> anyone share formative assessment information with students by
> regular one-on-one conferencing, by e-mailing them, in other ways?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From sreid at workbase.org.nz  Mon Jan 29 15:34:11 2007
From: sreid at workbase.org.nz (Susan Reid)
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 09:34:11 +1300
Subject: [Assessment 614] Re: Systematic formative ways to record
	whatstudents learn and share this information
Message-ID: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3FFF41@secure.workbase.org.nz>

Hi Virginia and David 
As I said we work mostly 1:1 so it is a very different set up 
 
What we do discuss with the learner is here are the texts you have to
read/write etc at work or have mentioned in your goals 

Now these texts  have these features which means that you need to know
this sort of information and be approaching texts in this sort of way
and your assessment showed that you have got these sorts of skills and
so you can do this and/or  we need to work on this  - we also work on
transfer to the learner's other contexts - home, community or other
goals etc - some might identify that they want to do a qualification and
so this is another context in terms of what prereqs are and what they
have and what they need to develop 

This is a very bald statement of what is a complex process as you all
know 

We have just started to use the draft Foundation Learning Progressions
which were released in NZ last year and they owe a lot to  the EFF
Standards and approaches
http://www.tec.govt.nz/downloads/a2z_publications/foundation_learning_pr
ogressions.pdf
Unfortunately the language used in them  is not that accessible for all
learners ( learners aren't the audience) so we need to 'translate' a lot
which is a shame as I think learners knowing where they are at and being
able to work that out themselves is critical to the concept of
independent  lifelong learning 

At this stage in NZ we do not have any prescribed tool that we have to
use as pre and post tests 

Hope this is gives some idea of the partnership we try and promote -
imperfectly most of the time but the intent is strong and clear 

Regards Susan

Susan Reid
Manager, Learning and  Development 
Workbase: The New Zealand Centre for Workforce Literacy Development 
2 Vermont Street, Ponsonby - PO Box 56571, Dominion Road, Auckland 1030
Phone: 09 361 3800 - Fax: 09 376 3700           
Website: www.workbase.org.nz - Email: sreid at workbase.org.nz
See New Zealand Literacy Portal 
www.nzliteracyportal.org.nz

Caution - This email and its contents contain privileged information
that is intended solely for the recipient.  If you are not the intended
recipient you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
distribution or reproduction of this email is prohibited.  If you have
received this email in error please notify admin at workbase.org.nz
immediately.  Any views expressed in this email are of the sender and
may not necessarily reflect the views of Workbase: The New Zealand
Centre for Workforce Literacy Development.

 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Virginia Tardaewether
Sent: Tuesday, 30 January 2007 7:23 a.m.
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 613] Re: Systematic formative ways to record
whatstudents learn and share this information

Well generally, students know their ethnic origins, gender and age so we
don't talk about that much :) Pre and post test scores are talked about
in small and large groups so that all students understand the system of
progress.  Each student is given their own personal scores and an
individual learning plan that is developed with staff and the student.
This plan changes through time, but it helps tracks goal accomplishments
and testing scores.  Students also work on resumes, complete job
searches, complete FAFSA forms and attend job interviews while enrolled.
Va

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of David Rosen
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 9:52 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 612] Re: Systematic formative ways to record
whatstudents learn and share this information

Susan and Virginia,

You appear to have sophisticated systems for recording and keeping track
of student progress.  I wonder if you could tell us more about how
teachers share the information with students, and how students get
involved with using the data to make decisions about their learning.

I would like to hear from others who think they have good systems (not
necessarily computerized) for tracking and sharing information for
student decision making about their learning.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Jan 29, 2007, at 12:09 PM, Virginia Tardaewether wrote:

> Susan
> We have a computer site where students can access assignments and use 
> the email.  All students get an email account when they register so 
> that simplifies the matter.  As the instructor, I have access to their

> email account from the registration records.
>
> The most useful tool we've developed is a daily tracking sheet where 
> we
> track: OPT scores, CASAS pre and post scores, Agency data, and GED 
> tests completed.
>
> For our GED OPTIONS students, we have a weekly attendance sheet, 
> progress, and track information needed by the school district for 
> completion of their end of year report: age, ethnic info, completion 
> dates, enrollment dates, and gender.  We complete this progress report

> in Excel so the hours cumulate and so that we can send it 
> electronically to the school district.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of David Rosen
> Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 5:49 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 606] Systematic formative ways to record what 
> studentslearn and share this information
>
> Susan Reid, and others who use formative assessment,
>
> I am interested in learning more about teachers' systems for keeping 
> track of what students are learning and sharing this information with 
> them. What paper-and-pencil strategies do you use?  What computer- 
> managed or computer-aided strategies? Do you record information during

> the class, after the class, keep it all in your head? Does anyone 
> share formative assessment information with students by regular 
> one-on-one conferencing, by e-mailing them, in other ways?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
-------------------------------
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Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From ktashjian at yahoo.com  Mon Jan 29 20:44:24 2007
From: ktashjian at yahoo.com (karisa tashjian)
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 17:44:24 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Assessment 615] Re: Systematic formative ways to record what
	students learn and share this information
In-Reply-To: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E464@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Message-ID: <20070130014424.14264.qmail@web52715.mail.yahoo.com>

I'm very interested in seeing the format of individual learning plans.  Would anyone be willing to share?
   
  Thank you,
  Karisa Tashjian
  Literacy Program Coordinator
  Rhode Island Family Literacy Initiative

Virginia Tardaewether <tarv at chemeketa.edu> wrote:
  Well generally, students know their ethnic origins, gender and age so we
don't talk about that much :)
Pre and post test scores are talked about in small and large groups so
that all students understand the system of progress. Each student is
given their own personal scores and an individual learning plan that is
developed with staff and the student. This plan changes through time,
but it helps tracks goal accomplishments and testing scores. Students
also work on resumes, complete job searches, complete FAFSA forms and
attend job interviews while enrolled.
Va

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of David Rosen
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 9:52 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 612] Re: Systematic formative ways to record
whatstudents learn and share this information

Susan and Virginia,

You appear to have sophisticated systems for recording and keeping 
track of student progress. I wonder if you could tell us more about 
how teachers share the information with students, and how students 
get involved with using the data to make decisions about their learning.

I would like to hear from others who think they have good systems 
(not necessarily computerized) for tracking and sharing information 
for student decision making about their learning.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Jan 29, 2007, at 12:09 PM, Virginia Tardaewether wrote:

> Susan
> We have a computer site where students can access assignments and use
> the email. All students get an email account when they register so 
> that
> simplifies the matter. As the instructor, I have access to their 
> email
> account from the registration records.
>
> The most useful tool we've developed is a daily tracking sheet 
> where we
> track: OPT scores, CASAS pre and post scores, Agency data, and GED 
> tests
> completed.
>
> For our GED OPTIONS students, we have a weekly attendance sheet,
> progress, and track information needed by the school district for
> completion of their end of year report: age, ethnic info, completion
> dates, enrollment dates, and gender. We complete this progress report
> in Excel so the hours cumulate and so that we can send it 
> electronically
> to the school district.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of David Rosen
> Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 5:49 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 606] Systematic formative ways to record what
> studentslearn and share this information
>
> Susan Reid, and others who use formative assessment,
>
> I am interested in learning more about teachers' systems for keeping
> track of what students are learning and sharing this information with
> them. What paper-and-pencil strategies do you use? What computer-
> managed or computer-aided strategies? Do you record information
> during the class, after the class, keep it all in your head? Does
> anyone share formative assessment information with students by
> regular one-on-one conferencing, by e-mailing them, in other ways?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 
---------------------------------
Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your question on Yahoo! Answers.
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jan 30 14:18:05 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 14:18:05 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 616]  Seeking IEPs
Message-ID: <019201c744a3$5e921b20$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Karisa and all,
 
I was looking around for some examples/samples of IEPs but I came up
pretty empty-handed.  I found a number of fairly interesting resources
out there that provide background rationale, use, and so forth, but no
samples that I could locate.
 
I started with Gallaudet because I was familiar with those IEPs - we
used a version of them in the Deaf Literacy Program in RI - but all I
could find were references to IDEA and its application - which was
really interesting and explanatory so I thought perhaps this might be of
interest to others. 
 
The next resource is from the No Child Left Behind Act - thought folks
might also find this interesting.
 
The next resources are from public schools - 2 of them are focused on
secondary level.  I thought these looked a bit interesting - the last
one seemed pretty good but unfortunately it's a power point so that's a
tough one.  I added it in just in case.
 
So do people make their own IEPs or do you get them from somewhere?  If
you get them someplace, where is that?
 
Gallaudet University
How the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (IDEA) Applies to
Deaf and Hard of Hearing Students
See Section IV:  Individualized Education Programs
http://clerccenter2.gallaudet.edu/KidsWorldDeafNet/e-docs/IDEA/index.htm
l
 
A Guide to the Individualized Education Program
NCLB - Ed.Gov
http://www.ed.gov/parents/needs/speced/iepguide/index.html
 
Designing Individualized Education Program (IEP) Transition Plans. 
ERIC Digest.
http://www.ericdigests.org/2001-4/iep.html
 
Columbia Career Center
Columbia Public Schools
http://www.career-center.org/secondary/studentservices/iep.htm
 
 <http://www.pen.k12.va.us/VDOE/sped/iep/presentation-sept-05.ppt>
Standards driven individualized education program 
Virginia Department of Education
Power point
www.pen.k12.va.us/VDOE/sped/
<http://www.pen.k12.va.us/VDOE/sped/iep/presentation-sept-05.ppt>
iep/presentation-sept-05.ppt
 
Thanks!
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From jody_angelone3 at owens.edu  Tue Jan 30 15:21:38 2007
From: jody_angelone3 at owens.edu (Jody Angelone)
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 15:21:38 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 617] Re: Seeking IEPs
Message-ID: <s5bf6287.055@destiny.owens.edu>

In Ohio ABLE, the programs use ILPs (Individual Learning Plans) for
their adult students as opposed to IEPs.  The state ABLE office requires
that each student has a portfolio and one required component of the
portfolio is an ILP.  The ILP contains basic student and class
information, entry date/orientation, NRS primary and secondary goal,
student long-term and short-term goal, steps and activities to meet
goals, comments section, learning styles inventory results, LD screening
results (if applicable). The portfolio additionally contains student
work to document beginning, and progress toward mastery of standards and
benchmarks. Student portfolios must be reviewed and updated at least
every 90 calendar days. The portfolio system is used to help students
and teachers gauge learning and target instruction. There is a booklet
that highlights several different types ILPs and the portfolio system
that is used by ABLE programs in Ohio. You can connect to it through the
following link: 
http://www.ode.state.oh.us/GD/Templates/Pages/ODE/ODEDetail.aspx?page=3&TopicRelationID=966&ContentID=16072&Content=16183

Jody L. Angelone
NW ABLE Resource Center

>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 1/30/2007 2:18 PM >>>
Hi Karisa and all,
 
I was looking around for some examples/samples of IEPs but I came up
pretty empty-handed.  I found a number of fairly interesting resources
out there that provide background rationale, use, and so forth, but no
samples that I could locate.
 
I started with Gallaudet because I was familiar with those IEPs - we
used a version of them in the Deaf Literacy Program in RI - but all I
could find were references to IDEA and its application - which was
really interesting and explanatory so I thought perhaps this might be
of
interest to others. 
 
The next resource is from the No Child Left Behind Act - thought folks
might also find this interesting.
 
The next resources are from public schools - 2 of them are focused on
secondary level.  I thought these looked a bit interesting - the last
one seemed pretty good but unfortunately it's a power point so that's
a
tough one.  I added it in just in case.
 
So do people make their own IEPs or do you get them from somewhere? 
If
you get them someplace, where is that?
 
Gallaudet University
How the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (IDEA) Applies to
Deaf and Hard of Hearing Students
See Section IV:  Individualized Education Programs
http://clerccenter2.gallaudet.edu/KidsWorldDeafNet/e-docs/IDEA/index.htm

l
 
A Guide to the Individualized Education Program
NCLB - Ed.Gov
http://www.ed.gov/parents/needs/speced/iepguide/index.html 
 
Designing Individualized Education Program (IEP) Transition Plans. 
ERIC Digest.
http://www.ericdigests.org/2001-4/iep.html 
 
Columbia Career Center
Columbia Public Schools
http://www.career-center.org/secondary/studentservices/iep.htm 
 
 <http://www.pen.k12.va.us/VDOE/sped/iep/presentation-sept-05.ppt>
Standards driven individualized education program 
Virginia Department of Education
Power point
www.pen.k12.va.us/VDOE/sped/ 
<http://www.pen.k12.va.us/VDOE/sped/iep/presentation-sept-05.ppt>
iep/presentation-sept-05.ppt
 
Thanks!
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

From sreid at workbase.org.nz  Tue Jan 30 16:57:01 2007
From: sreid at workbase.org.nz (Susan Reid)
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:57:01 +1300
Subject: [Assessment 618] Re: Systematic formative ways to record
	whatstudents learn and share this information
Message-ID: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3FFF85@secure.workbase.org.nz>

Always helps if you attach the document 
 
Hi Karisha 
here is one example taken from a resource we wrote for the New Zealand
vocational teachers who wanted to integrate literacy skill development
into their trade course 
I have copied the ILP into a Word document and enclose the url for the
full PDF
 I realise we called it a literacy goal achievement plan to distinguish
it from the ILP that vocational teachers would use anyway 
In NZ teachers are called tutors - volunteer tuors are called volunteers
- I realise this is different from the US
http://www.workbase.org.nz/Document.aspx?Doc=Settingliteracygoals&record
ingprogress.pdf
 
regards Susan Reid 

Manager, Learning and  Development 

 

Workbase: The New Zealand Centre for Workforce Literacy Development 

2 Vermont Street, Ponsonby - PO Box 56571, Dominion Road, Auckland 1030
Phone: 09 361 3800 - Fax: 09 376 3700           
Website: www.workbase.org.nz <http://www.workbase.org.nz/>  - Email: 
sreid at workbase.org.nz

See New Zealand Literacy Portal 

www.nzliteracyportal.org.nz
 
Caution - This email and its contents contain privileged information
that is intended solely for the recipient.  If you are not the intended
recipient you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
distribution or reproduction of this email is prohibited.  If you have
received this email in error please notify admin at workbase.org.nz
<mailto:admin at workbase.org.nz>  immediately.  Any views expressed in
this email are of the sender and may not necessarily reflect the views
of Workbase: The New Zealand Centre for Workforce Literacy Development.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of karisa tashjian
Sent: Tuesday, 30 January 2007 2:44 p.m.
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 615] Re: Systematic formative ways to record
whatstudents learn and share this information

I'm very interested in seeing the format of individual learning plans.
Would anyone be willing to share?
 
Thank you,
Karisa Tashjian
Literacy Program Coordinator
Rhode Island Family Literacy Initiative

Virginia Tardaewether <tarv at chemeketa.edu> wrote:

	Well generally, students know their ethnic origins, gender and
age so we
	don't talk about that much :)
	Pre and post test scores are talked about in small and large
groups so
	that all students understand the system of progress. Each
student is
	given their own personal scores and an individual learning plan
that is
	developed with staff and the student. This plan changes through
time,
	but it helps tracks goal accomplishments and testing scores.
Students
	also work on resumes, complete job searches, complete FAFSA
forms and
	attend job interviews while enrolled.
	Va
	
	-----Original Message-----
	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
	On Behalf Of David Rosen
	Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 9:52 AM
	To: The Assessment Discussion List
	Subject: [Assessment 612] Re: Systematic formative ways to
record
	whatstudents learn and share this information
	
	Susan and Virginia,
	
	You appear to have sophisticated systems for recording and
keeping 
	track of student progress. I wonder if you could tell us more
about 
	how teachers share the information with students, and how
students 
	get involved with using the data to make decisions about their
learning.
	
	I would like to hear from others who think they have good
systems 
	(not necessarily computerized) for tracking and sharing
information 
	for student decision making about their learning.
	
	David J. Rosen
	djrosen at comcast.net
	
	
	On Jan 29, 2007, at 12:09 PM, Virginia Tardaewether wrote:
	
	> Susan
	> We have a computer site where students can access assignments
and use
	> the email. All students get an email account when they
register so 
	> that
	> simplifies the matter. As the instructor, I have access to
their 
	> email
	> account from the registration records.
	>
	> The most useful tool we've developed is a daily tracking sheet

	> where we
	> track: OPT scores, CASAS pre and post scores, Agency data, and
GED 
	> tests
	> completed.
	>
	> For our GED OPTIONS students, we have a weekly attendance
sheet,
	> progress, and track information needed by the school district
for
	> completion of their end of year report: age, ethnic info,
completion
	> dates, enrollment dates, and gender. We complete this progress
report
	> in Excel so the hours cumulate and so that we can send it 
	> electronically
	> to the school district.
	>
	> -----Original Message-----
	> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
	> On Behalf Of David Rosen
	> Sent: Saturday, January 27, 2007 5:49 AM
	> To: The Assessment Discussion List
	> Subject: [Assessment 606] Systematic formative ways to record
what
	> studentslearn and share this information
	>
	> Susan Reid, and others who use formative assessment,
	>
	> I am interested in learning more about teachers' systems for
keeping
	> track of what students are learning and sharing this
information with
	> them. What paper-and-pencil strategies do you use? What
computer-
	> managed or computer-aided strategies? Do you record
information
	> during the class, after the class, keep it all in your head?
Does
	> anyone share formative assessment information with students by
	> regular one-on-one conferencing, by e-mailing them, in other
ways?
	>
	>
	> David J. Rosen
	> djrosen at comcast.net
	>
	>
	>
	> -------------------------------
	> National Institute for Literacy
	> Assessment mailing list
	> Assessment at nifl.gov
	> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to
	> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	> -------------------------------
	> National Institute for Literacy
	> Assessment mailing list
	> Assessment at nifl.gov
	> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to 
	> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	
	
	
	
	
	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to
	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	

________________________________

Need a quick answer? Get one in minutes from people who know. Ask your
question on Yahoo! Answers
<http://answers.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTFvbGNhMGE3BF9TAzM5NjU0NTEwOARfcwMz
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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Tue Jan 30 21:04:45 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 19:04:45 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 619] Re: Systematic formative ways to record
 what	students learn and share this information
In-Reply-To: <20070130014424.14264.qmail@web52715.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20070130014424.14264.qmail@web52715.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <OF4EF6EC87.76AFCBC2-ON07257274.000B6BF6-07257274.000B6C12@yc.edu>

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From TTownsend at dtihq.com  Wed Jan 31 09:06:09 2007
From: TTownsend at dtihq.com (Townsend, Tara)
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 09:06:09 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 620]  National STAR Training Network - (cross-posted)
Message-ID: <CA4FA75701668E4E8D6703C760BD207AB98EE5@s000pex03.HaverstickConsulting.com>

The U.S. Department of Education's Office of Vocational and Adult
Education is pleased to announce the launch of the National STAR
Training Network Web site.  The Web site contains information on the
Student Achievement in Reading (STAR) initiative, created to assist
states and local programs in making systemic and instructional changes
required to improve the reading achievement of intermediate-level adult
learners (G.L.E. 4.0-8.9).  STAR provides teachers and administrators
with Web-based tools that translate reading research into practice and
high quality training and technical assistance to build capacity for
reading reform.   

The National STAR Training Network is offering two training and
technical assistance packages to states and local programs.  The new Web
site describes these services and provides an array of tools to help you
learn about and plan to implement evidence-based reading instruction.

We invite you to visit the Web site at http://www.startoolkit.org
<http://www.startoolkit.org/>  to learn more about how you can improve
adult learners' reading achievement.

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Jan 31 10:20:21 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 10:20:21 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 621]  More AIEPs
Message-ID: <000001c7454b$531223f0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,
 
The above attachments are some examples of IEPs from Rochelle Kenyon,
Moderator Extraordinaire of the Learning Disabilities Discussion List
(join her list at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Learningdisabilities).
 
One of the documents is more lengthy - about 19 pages or so - and is an
excerpt from a larger document that Rochelle developed a couple of years
ago.  IEPs for Corrections Education are at the end of this document
(it's the one entitled "IEP").
 
Marie
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Jan 31 12:58:11 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 12:58:11 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 622]  Another resource
Message-ID: <003601c74561$6007d9e0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
Thanks to all who are sharing their ideas, resources, and IEPs - this is
wonderful stuff!
 
I'm attaching a set of guidelines that were developed by myself and
staff at the Swearer Center for Public Service adult ed programs during
the latter end of the 1990s.  We used these for placement and for
on-going or formative assessment.  The guidelines are referred to as
Rubrics - which I think is interesting because there are no levels to
any of the guidelines.  We would keep records of this information on
Student Profile sheets which were basically simple forms containing a
student's relevant personal and educational info, and where teachers
could write out in brief narrative about the student's work, using the
"rubric" as a guide (I can't find a Student Profile sheet sample, but
I'm still looking.).
 
See what you think!
 
Marie 
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Feb  1 13:58:36 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2007 13:58:36 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 623]  Pre/Post in NZ?
Message-ID: <014201c74632$fb28c250$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Susan and everyone,
 
Susan - you said in one of your posts a few days ago:
 
"At this stage in NZ we do not have any prescribed tool that we have to
use as pre and post tests."
 
Can you tell us what programs use to report with there?  And who do you
report to?  Do programs get government funding?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Feb  1 14:08:53 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2007 14:08:53 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 624]  Reporting with Formative Assessment
Message-ID: <015901c74634$6aeb7cd0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi,
 
Does anyone use methods of formative assessment for reporting (to
funders or others)?  So for example, instead of reporting scores on
TABE, CASAS, BEST, etc. you report with portfolios or some other type of
evaluation?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz  Thu Feb  1 16:49:18 2007
From: alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz (Alison Sutton)
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 10:49:18 +1300
Subject: [Assessment 625]  assessment in Nz
Message-ID: <006401c7464a$d39833c0$0a00a8c0@CriticalInsight>

Hi Marie, Alison Sutton here, I am an adult literacy researcher from NZ who
lurks on this discussion list a lot.   NZ is in an interesting position
because we do not have any nationally mandated testing for adult literacy
and foundation learning - but it is coming!

 

Yes programmes do get government funding. At present providers have choice
about the assessment and reporting methods they use. One reason is that we
have few dedicated literacy programmes as such; most offer literacy skills
development as part of achieving other qualifications. 

 

 Pre-employment labour market programmes have to meet outcomes related to
people moving on to further education and training or employment and
achievement of credits in our competency based national qualifications
framework. They can do all that without necessarily demonstrating any
literacy gain.

 

Programmes run by polytechnics (your community colleges) each work to an
internally developed and moderated assessment systems and often do not have
to show any literacy gain over and above course credit achievement. 

 

Those programmes that do get specific funding for literacy thru a dedicated
fund do have to demonstrate literacy gain - in a variety of ways but mostly
based around progress against individual learning plans or specially
designed before and after assessments - not nationally standardised..

 

The government does want more  systematic evidence that the increased
funding into adult literacy is resulting in gain - but they at this stage
are not pushing 'testing' as such. I am working with the University of
Auckland on a government contract scoping how to develop a computer based
interactive assessment system for adult literacy. The model we are looking
at gives teachers and learners lots of information about progress and is
much more formative in scope that the testing and reporting regimes most of
your funders use. 

 

 

Alison Sutton, Critical Insight

52a Bolton St Blockhouse Bay Auckland NZ

alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz

Phone +64 9 627 4415 

Mob 021 279 6804

 

 

 

 

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From sreid at workbase.org.nz  Thu Feb  1 17:12:16 2007
From: sreid at workbase.org.nz (Susan Reid)
Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2007 11:12:16 +1300
Subject: [Assessment 626] Re: assessment in Nz
Message-ID: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3FFFD2@secure.workbase.org.nz>

Hi Marie and others 
 
Alison has succinctly described the situation in New Zealand and added
additional information from projects she is involved in  
 
in terms of detail if a programme is funded for literacy gains then they
are expected to measure them but the approaches to measurement are very
diverse.
A couple of  programmes use the ETS PDQ online assessment, others
develop their own assessments either as a result of training or by
copying something someone else is using. Some download online materials
regardless of the context ( and then wonder why their learners don't
understand questions that refer to other countries' landmarks e.g. Big
Ben). Some who have been trained as  primary school teachers use a range
of assessments norm referenced for children (despite the efforts of
adult literacy organisations to get rid of these sorts of reading age
assessments). There are also a couple of tests ( one is called Probe)
that have been developed in New Zealand but I think they may have had
their base in the US 
Sometimes the same test is used pre mid and post course without real
understanding about issues around people getting more familiar with the
tests etc 
 
There is a real range of tools and practices used ranging from very good
to some that are inappropriate for adult learners 
 
regards Susan 

 

 

Susan Reid

Manager, Learning and Development 

 

Workbase: The New Zealand Centre for Workforce Literacy Development 

2 Vermont Street, Ponsonby - PO Box 56571, Dominion Road, Auckland 1030
Phone: 09 361 3800 - Fax: 09 376 3700           
Website: www.workbase.org.nz <http://www.workbase.org.nz/>  - Email:
sreid at workbase.org.nz

See New Zealand Literacy Portal 

www.nzliteracyportal.org.nz
 
Caution - This email and its contents contain privileged information
that is intended solely for the recipient.  If you are not the intended
recipient you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
distribution or reproduction of this email is prohibited.  If you have
received this email in error please notify admin at workbase.org.nz
<mailto:admin at workbase.org.nz>  immediately.  Any views expressed in
this email are of the sender and may not necessarily reflect the views
of Workbase: The New Zealand Centre for Workforce Literacy Development.

 

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Alison Sutton
Sent: Friday, 2 February 2007 10:49 a.m.
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 625] assessment in Nz

Hi Marie, Alison Sutton here, I am an adult literacy researcher from NZ
who lurks on this discussion list a lot.   NZ is in an interesting
position because we do not have any nationally mandated testing for
adult literacy and foundation learning - but it is coming!

 

Yes programmes do get government funding. At present providers have
choice about the assessment and reporting methods they use. One reason
is that we have few dedicated literacy programmes as such; most offer
literacy skills development as part of achieving other qualifications. 

 

 Pre-employment labour market programmes have to meet outcomes related
to people moving on to further education and training or employment and
achievement of credits in our competency based national qualifications
framework. They can do all that without necessarily demonstrating any
literacy gain.

 

Programmes run by polytechnics (your community colleges) each work to an
internally developed and moderated assessment systems and often do not
have to show any literacy gain over and above course credit achievement.

 

Those programmes that do get specific funding for literacy thru a
dedicated fund do have to demonstrate literacy gain - in a variety of
ways but mostly based around progress against individual learning plans
or specially designed before and after assessments - not nationally
standardised..

 

The government does want more  systematic evidence that the increased
funding into adult literacy is resulting in gain - but they at this
stage  are not pushing 'testing' as such. I am working with the
University of Auckland on a government contract scoping how to develop a
computer based interactive assessment system for adult literacy. The
model we are looking at gives teachers and learners lots of information
about progress and is much more formative in scope that the testing and
reporting regimes most of your funders use. 

 

 

Alison Sutton, Critical Insight

52a Bolton St Blockhouse Bay Auckland NZ

alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz

Phone +64 9 627 4415 

Mob 021 279 6804

 

 

 

 

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From bcmrose at telus.net  Thu Feb  1 20:50:55 2007
From: bcmrose at telus.net (Marg Rose)
Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2007 17:50:55 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 627] Stages portfolio system to assess and recognize
	progress in literacy skills
In-Reply-To: <015901c74634$6aeb7cd0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <NIBBJOMGKLCFFJPIEBKGAEPODFAA.bcmrose@telus.net>

Several provinces in Canada recognize adult learning in a functionally-based
portfolio system. Manitoba uses the Stages  of Learning and Literacy for
levels 1, 2, or 3 (closely correlated to IALS levels) to evaluate learner
progress. You can peruse the tasks in reading, writing, numeracy, and
technology at each level, and the facilitator's guide at:
http://www.edu.gov.mb.ca/ael/all/publications/stages/stages.html  Adult
learners can also obtain dual credits at the Stage 3 level towards a Mature
High School diploma, linked also to community college entrance
qualifications.

Ontario uses an articulated system and demonstrations of progress as well.
Go to www.nald.ca for a list of contacts in each province to investigate.
Some full-text documents are on-line there, including the Manitoba basic
primer "Creative Student assessment".

To talk more about the idea of dual credits, you may wish to talk to Sylvia
Provenski, a graduate student investigating this area:
SylviaP at westman.wave.ca. She also directs an adult learning centre in the
province.

Marg Rose, Victoria, BC
Former Executive DIrector of the provincial literacy coalition
Graduate student in M. Ad. Ed.

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Feb  5 10:21:38 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 10:21:38 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 628] Re: assessment in Nz
In-Reply-To: <006401c7464a$d39833c0$0a00a8c0@CriticalInsight>
Message-ID: <02e101c74939$557d7f80$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Alison,
 
Thanks so much for this reply, it's really interesting.
 
I'm a bit confused though, how folks can still achieve certain
competencies while not necessarily making gains in literacy.  Maybe you
could describe that a little more?
 
And how exciting!  It sounds like NZ is going for the formative
assessment approach to reporting!  Building accountability systems is
such hard work and takes loads of time, patience, money and a diverse
array of people to be involved.  You will have to keep us informed of
your progress - it sounds like a model system.  
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Alison Sutton
Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 4:49 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 625] assessment in Nz
 
Hi Marie, Alison Sutton here, I am an adult literacy researcher from NZ
who lurks on this discussion list a lot.   NZ is in an interesting
position because we do not have any nationally mandated testing for
adult literacy and foundation learning - but it is coming!
 
Yes programmes do get government funding. At present providers have
choice about the assessment and reporting methods they use. One reason
is that we have few dedicated literacy programmes as such; most offer
literacy skills development as part of achieving other qualifications. 
 
 Pre-employment labour market programmes have to meet outcomes related
to people moving on to further education and training or employment and
achievement of credits in our competency based national qualifications
framework. They can do all that without necessarily demonstrating any
literacy gain.
 
Programmes run by polytechnics (your community colleges) each work to an
internally developed and moderated assessment systems and often do not
have to show any literacy gain over and above course credit achievement.

 
Those programmes that do get specific funding for literacy thru a
dedicated fund do have to demonstrate literacy gain - in a variety of
ways but mostly based around progress against individual learning plans
or specially designed before and after assessments - not nationally
standardised..
 
The government does want more  systematic evidence that the increased
funding into adult literacy is resulting in gain - but they at this
stage  are not pushing 'testing' as such. I am working with the
University of Auckland on a government contract scoping how to develop a
computer based interactive assessment system for adult literacy. The
model we are looking at gives teachers and learners lots of information
about progress and is much more formative in scope that the testing and
reporting regimes most of your funders use. 
 
 
Alison Sutton, Critical Insight
52a Bolton St Blockhouse Bay Auckland NZ
 <mailto:alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz>
alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz
Phone +64 9 627 4415 
Mob 021 279 6804
 
 
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Feb  5 10:27:24 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 10:27:24 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 629] Re: assessment in Nz
In-Reply-To: <14794889A1E3AF419042F64CC5425A1E3FFFD2@secure.workbase.org.nz>
Message-ID: <02e601c7493a$2392c2e0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

HI Susan, thanks for this.
 
You have hit a crucial aspect of building an assessment/accountability
system and that is professional development!  Without that, even the
best systems and materials can falter.
 
I feel like we practitioners in the U.S. are getting much better at a
lot of the points Susan makes in her post below.  We still have work to
do in order to run a tight ship, but I think we're better as an entire
group with this stuff than even just 4 or 5 years ago.  Would people
agree with that or no?
 
What types of opportunities (or mandates for that matter) are in place
in NZ for necessary ProD for things like assessment?
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Susan Reid
Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 5:12 PM
To: alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz; The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 626] Re: assessment in Nz
 
Hi Marie and others 
 
Alison has succinctly described the situation in New Zealand and added
additional information from projects she is involved in  
 
in terms of detail if a programme is funded for literacy gains then they
are expected to measure them but the approaches to measurement are very
diverse.
A couple of  programmes use the ETS PDQ online assessment, others
develop their own assessments either as a result of training or by
copying something someone else is using. Some download online materials
regardless of the context ( and then wonder why their learners don't
understand questions that refer to other countries' landmarks e.g. Big
Ben). Some who have been trained as  primary school teachers use a range
of assessments norm referenced for children (despite the efforts of
adult literacy organisations to get rid of these sorts of reading age
assessments). There are also a couple of tests ( one is called Probe)
that have been developed in New Zealand but I think they may have had
their base in the US 
Sometimes the same test is used pre mid and post course without real
understanding about issues around people getting more familiar with the
tests etc 
 
There is a real range of tools and practices used ranging from very good
to some that are inappropriate for adult learners 
 
regards Susan 
 
 
Susan Reid
Manager, Learning and Development 
 
Workbase: The New Zealand Centre for Workforce Literacy Development 
2 Vermont Street, Ponsonby - PO Box 56571, Dominion Road, Auckland 1030
Phone: 09 361 3800 - Fax: 09 376 3700           
Website:  <http://www.workbase.org.nz/> www.workbase.org.nz - Email:
<mailto:sreid at workbase.org.nz> sreid at workbase.org.nz
See New Zealand Literacy Portal 
www.nzliteracyportal.org.nz
 
Caution - This email and its contents contain privileged information
that is intended solely for the recipient.  If you are not the intended
recipient you are hereby notified that any use, dissemination,
distribution or reproduction of this email is prohibited.  If you have
received this email in error please notify
<mailto:admin at workbase.org.nz> admin at workbase.org.nz immediately.  Any
views expressed in this email are of the sender and may not necessarily
reflect the views of Workbase: The New Zealand Centre for Workforce
Literacy Development.
 
 
 
  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Alison Sutton
Sent: Friday, 2 February 2007 10:49 a.m.
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 625] assessment in Nz
Hi Marie, Alison Sutton here, I am an adult literacy researcher from NZ
who lurks on this discussion list a lot.   NZ is in an interesting
position because we do not have any nationally mandated testing for
adult literacy and foundation learning - but it is coming!
 
Yes programmes do get government funding. At present providers have
choice about the assessment and reporting methods they use. One reason
is that we have few dedicated literacy programmes as such; most offer
literacy skills development as part of achieving other qualifications. 
 
 Pre-employment labour market programmes have to meet outcomes related
to people moving on to further education and training or employment and
achievement of credits in our competency based national qualifications
framework. They can do all that without necessarily demonstrating any
literacy gain.
 
Programmes run by polytechnics (your community colleges) each work to an
internally developed and moderated assessment systems and often do not
have to show any literacy gain over and above course credit achievement.

 
Those programmes that do get specific funding for literacy thru a
dedicated fund do have to demonstrate literacy gain - in a variety of
ways but mostly based around progress against individual learning plans
or specially designed before and after assessments - not nationally
standardised..
 
The government does want more  systematic evidence that the increased
funding into adult literacy is resulting in gain - but they at this
stage  are not pushing 'testing' as such. I am working with the
University of Auckland on a government contract scoping how to develop a
computer based interactive assessment system for adult literacy. The
model we are looking at gives teachers and learners lots of information
about progress and is much more formative in scope that the testing and
reporting regimes most of your funders use. 
 
 
Alison Sutton, Critical Insight
52a Bolton St Blockhouse Bay Auckland NZ
 <mailto:alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz>
alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz
Phone +64 9 627 4415 
Mob 021 279 6804
 
 
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Feb  5 10:34:59 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 10:34:59 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 630] Re: Stages portfolio system to assess and
	recognizeprogress in literacy skills
In-Reply-To: <NIBBJOMGKLCFFJPIEBKGAEPODFAA.bcmrose@telus.net>
Message-ID: <02eb01c7493b$329b5fd0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Marg, thanks so much for this information.  There are a number of
interesting and useful resources at the sites you provided.
 
Here's the URL for the IALS (International Adult Literacy Survey):
http://www.statcan.ca/english/Dli/Data/Ftp/ials.htm
 
Marie
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marg Rose
Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 8:51 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 627] Stages portfolio system to assess and
recognizeprogress in literacy skills
 
Several provinces in Canada recognize adult learning in a
functionally-based portfolio system. Manitoba uses the Stages  of
Learning and Literacy for levels 1, 2, or 3 (closely correlated to IALS
levels) to evaluate learner progress. You can peruse the tasks in
reading, writing, numeracy, and technology at each level, and the
facilitator's guide at:
http://www.edu.gov.mb.ca/ael/all/publications/stages/stages.html  Adult
learners can also obtain dual credits at the Stage 3 level towards a
Mature High School diploma, linked also to community college entrance
qualifications. 
 
Ontario uses an articulated system and demonstrations of progress as
well. Go to www.nald.ca for a list of contacts in each province to
investigate. Some full-text documents are on-line there, including the
Manitoba basic primer "Creative Student assessment". 
 
To talk more about the idea of dual credits, you may wish to talk to
Sylvia Provenski, a graduate student investigating this area:
SylviaP at westman.wave.ca. She also directs an adult learning centre in
the province. 
 
Marg Rose, Victoria, BC
Former Executive DIrector of the provincial literacy coalition
Graduate student in M. Ad. Ed.
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Feb  5 14:34:17 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 14:34:17 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 631]  Another IEP
Message-ID: <035101c7495c$a0855520$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

 
 
Here is a copy of our IEEPP in its draft form.
 
Susan K. O'Connor
Brooklyn Public Library
Literacy Program Manager
 
Susan K. O'Connor
Literacy Program Manager
(718) 832-3560 x 5   (718) 832-9032 fax   (917) 848-2176 Cell
 
 
A library must reflect what is best in a community and reach out  to all
people. If citizens are to safeguard civil liberties, elect wise
officials, make sense of the news and negotiate public policy with other
citizens in an ever more diverse society-libraries must be strong.
 
 
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From grotlueschen at uni-bremen.de  Mon Feb  5 16:34:15 2007
From: grotlueschen at uni-bremen.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Grotl=FCschen?=)
Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2007 22:34:15 +0100
Subject: [Assessment 632]  Assessment in GER
Message-ID: <20070205213350.8E5AC55A40@mailgate1.zfn.uni-bremen.de>

Hello everybody, 

 

sorry for not writing fluently in English. I am a German researcher and
lurking here since the beginning of the year. I learn a lot from your
round-the-world-discussion and I really appreciate your work and exchange of
tools. I do not know the ?netiquette? here and if I ask too much questions
or make anyone feel uncomfortable, please take it as a ?beginners? mistake?,
thank you!

 

Well, in your latest mails I thought ?this really describes what we face
here? ? lots of classes, but no clear ways of assessment. As we speak
German, we cannot use the ETS PDQ ? does anything alike exist in other
languages? Are there other nations on this list who face the same problem?
Do you use standardised tests to check literacy gains?

 

Anyway, we face very much the same problem in GER as well, like Alison said
for NZ. You can attend a literacy class, learn nothing (if you feel bored)
and in case you get a job later, this would count as ?success? of the
literacy training. The most important figure for literacy legitimation is
employment. But nobody checks whether your employment has anything to do
with literacy. You can be a dishwasher ? it would count as success.

 

Of course everyday practice is different and adults do learn a lot in the
classes and they like the atmosphere (mostly offered by ?Volkshochschule? ?
kind of public institution for adult education). But if authorities question
the efficiency of these classes and talk about shortening the funding, there
is little in our hands to prove that these classes are successful.

 

Adult learners here fear the testing situation, that?s why we have little
experience with adult assessment (neither summative nor formative). How do
you meet the fears of the learners against tests? Don?t they have any? What
if you use ETS PDQ, don?t people refuse to participate? Do you hand the
results to the participants or do you (as teachers, institution,
researchers) keep them for reporting? 

 

Tons of questions, sorry for that -

 

Yours, 

Anke Grotl?schen 

 

 

 

 

Prof. Dr. Anke Grotl?schen

Juniorprofessur f?r Lebenslanges Lernen

grotlueschen at uni-bremen.de

Universit?t Bremen

Fachbereich Erziehungs- und Bildungswissenschaften

Bibliothekstra?e, GW2 Raum A 2100

28359 Bremen

www.ifeb.uni-bremen.de

 

Tel. 0421-218-3083 oder 0421-8383 519

Mobil: 0176-2384 7995

 

 

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From alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz  Mon Feb  5 17:58:21 2007
From: alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz (Alison Sutton)
Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 11:58:21 +1300
Subject: [Assessment 633] Re: assessment in Nz
In-Reply-To: <02e101c74939$557d7f80$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <004d01c74979$22740dd0$0a00a8c0@CriticalInsight>

Marie, the content areas many people study for in NZ are vocational -
hairdressing, auto-electrical, paint manufacturing, rather than general
education. To successfully achieve their credits in their area of study they
may well improve their literacy. A literacy specialist may work with their
vocational tutor to assist in them getting their vocational credits. But If
the structure of their course does not contain any explicit outcome
statements related to literacy (and lots don't) there is no need to
'measure' their literacy gain.  If there are no explicit requirements for
literacy skills in the training system, training providers can compensate by
reducing the amount that has to be read in training, simplifying training
materials etc, working orally as much as possible - and place less emphasis
on deliberate acts of literacy teaching to address the skills gap. 

 

Yes, I think that if our Ministry of Education take on board the idea of a
computer based interactive assessment engine, that provides both tutors and
learners with lots of information about the skills a learner has and ideas
on where to go next we will have done something really exciting. But the
decision is some months off.  Will keep in touch about it.

 

 

Alison Sutton, Critical Insight

52a Bolton St Blockhouse Bay Auckland NZ

alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz

Phone +64 9 627 4415 

Mob 021 279 6804

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, 6 February 2007 4:22 a.m.
To: alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz; 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 628] Re: assessment in Nz

 

Hi Alison,

 

Thanks so much for this reply, it's really interesting.

 

I'm a bit confused though, how folks can still achieve certain competencies
while not necessarily making gains in literacy.  Maybe you could describe
that a little more?

 

And how exciting!  It sounds like NZ is going for the formative assessment
approach to reporting!  Building accountability systems is such hard work
and takes loads of time, patience, money and a diverse array of people to be
involved.  You will have to keep us informed of your progress - it sounds
like a model system.  

 

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Alison Sutton
Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2007 4:49 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 625] assessment in Nz

 

Hi Marie, Alison Sutton here, I am an adult literacy researcher from NZ who
lurks on this discussion list a lot.   NZ is in an interesting position
because we do not have any nationally mandated testing for adult literacy
and foundation learning - but it is coming!

 

Yes programmes do get government funding. At present providers have choice
about the assessment and reporting methods they use. One reason is that we
have few dedicated literacy programmes as such; most offer literacy skills
development as part of achieving other qualifications. 

 

 Pre-employment labour market programmes have to meet outcomes related to
people moving on to further education and training or employment and
achievement of credits in our competency based national qualifications
framework. They can do all that without necessarily demonstrating any
literacy gain.

 

Programmes run by polytechnics (your community colleges) each work to an
internally developed and moderated assessment systems and often do not have
to show any literacy gain over and above course credit achievement. 

 

Those programmes that do get specific funding for literacy thru a dedicated
fund do have to demonstrate literacy gain - in a variety of ways but mostly
based around progress against individual learning plans or specially
designed before and after assessments - not nationally standardised..

 

The government does want more  systematic evidence that the increased
funding into adult literacy is resulting in gain - but they at this stage
are not pushing 'testing' as such. I am working with the University of
Auckland on a government contract scoping how to develop a computer based
interactive assessment system for adult literacy. The model we are looking
at gives teachers and learners lots of information about progress and is
much more formative in scope that the testing and reporting regimes most of
your funders use. 

 

 

Alison Sutton, Critical Insight

52a Bolton St Blockhouse Bay Auckland NZ

 <mailto:alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz>
alison.sutton at criticalinsight.co.nz

Phone +64 9 627 4415 

Mob 021 279 6804

 

 

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Feb  6 11:50:28 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 11:50:28 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 634] Re: Assessment in GER
In-Reply-To: <20070205213350.8E5AC55A40@mailgate1.zfn.uni-bremen.de>
Message-ID: <03c601c74a0e$e8a51900$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Anke,
Thank you so much for your post!   If you go to the LINCS Assessment
Special Collection you?ll find a few resources there that could be of
interest to you.
Go to:   <http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/>
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
And click on the green Students icon.
At that page are resources focused on the student as test-taker.
There?s one that comes to mind:
<http://sabes.org/resources/adventures/vol16/16hambleton.htm> How to Do
Your Best on Standardized Tests: Some Suggestions for Adult Learners
that provides some information on minimizing test anxiety.
Does anyone have suggestions around test anxiety for Anke?
Also, you wrote:  ?As we speak German, we cannot use the ETS PDQ ? does
anything alike exist in other languages? Are there other nations on this
list who face the same problem? Do you use standardised tests to check
literacy gains??
 
Can any subscribers speak to Anke?s questions here?  I?m wondering if
perhaps you might find some information on this at the UNESCO website
(http://www.unesco.org/education/efa/efa_2000_assess/index.shtml), but I
don?t know for sure.  I know that I have recently heard about or read
about a foreign language literacy assessment, but I had no luck
searching around for this.  Does anyone on the List know about these
assessments?
 
Thanks!

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Grotl?schen
Sent: Monday, February 05, 2007 4:34 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 632] Assessment in GER
 
Hello everybody, 
 
sorry for not writing fluently in English. I am a German researcher and
lurking here since the beginning of the year. I learn a lot from your
round-the-world-discussion and I really appreciate your work and
exchange of tools. I do not know the ?netiquette? here and if I ask too
much questions or make anyone feel uncomfortable, please take it as a
?beginners? mistake?, thank you!
 
Well, in your latest mails I thought ?this really describes what we face
here? ? lots of classes, but no clear ways of assessment. As we speak
German, we cannot use the ETS PDQ ? does anything alike exist in other
languages? Are there other nations on this list who face the same
problem? Do you use standardised tests to check literacy gains?
 
Anyway, we face very much the same problem in GER as well, like Alison
said for NZ. You can attend a literacy class, learn nothing (if you feel
bored) and in case you get a job later, this would count as ?success? of
the literacy training. The most important figure for literacy
legitimation is employment. But nobody checks whether your employment
has anything to do with literacy. You can be a dishwasher ? it would
count as success.
 
Of course everyday practice is different and adults do learn a lot in
the classes and they like the atmosphere (mostly offered by
?Volkshochschule? ? kind of public institution for adult education). But
if authorities question the efficiency of these classes and talk about
shortening the funding, there is little in our hands to prove that these
classes are successful.
 
Adult learners here fear the testing situation, that?s why we have
little experience with adult assessment (neither summative nor
formative). How do you meet the fears of the learners against tests?
Don?t they have any? What if you use ETS PDQ, don?t people refuse to
participate? Do you hand the results to the participants or do you (as
teachers, institution, researchers) keep them for reporting? 
 
Tons of questions, sorry for that -
 
Yours, 
Anke Grotl?schen 
 
 
 
 
Prof. Dr. Anke Grotl?schen
Juniorprofessur f?r Lebenslanges Lernen
grotlueschen at uni-bremen.de
Universit?t Bremen
Fachbereich Erziehungs- und Bildungswissenschaften
Bibliothekstra?e, GW2 Raum A 2100
28359 Bremen
www.ifeb.uni-bremen.de
 
Tel. 0421-218-3083 oder 0421-8383 519
Mobil: 0176-2384 7995
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Feb  6 12:52:44 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 12:52:44 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 635]  Native Language Literacy Screening Device
Message-ID: <03e901c74a17$9ba69f80$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

HI again,
 
I found the resource I mentioned earlier that assesses literacy in
languages other than English.  It's from the Hudson River Center for
Program Development in Glenmont, NY - I tried to go to their website,
but the server was down (http://www.hudrivctr.org
<http://www.hudrivctr.org/> ).
 
But I found the resource on ERIC at:
http://tinyurl.com/3amy4x
 
Anyone familiar with this tool?  Let us know what you think.  
 
Thanks,
Marie
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Feb  6 12:57:12 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 12:57:12 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 636]  Telephone assessment of literacy?
Message-ID: <03f201c74a18$3b4c5fc0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
Does anyone know of a literacy assessment that can be administered via
phone?
 
Thanks,
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From lwilkins at mills.edu  Tue Feb  6 13:45:28 2007
From: lwilkins at mills.edu (Lynne Wilkins)
Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2007 10:45:28 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 637]  L1 screening tools for learning disabilities
In-Reply-To: <03e901c74a17$9ba69f80$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <03e901c74a17$9ba69f80$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <45C8CCC8.9010303@mills.edu>

Dear colleagues,

If anyone has information or resources that help to identify learning 
disabilities in first languages, specifically Cantonese and Spanish (at 
this time), please let me know.

Much thanks,
Lynne Wilkins

-- 
Lynne Wilkins, Associate Director for Programs
English Center for International Women at Mills College
P.O. Box 9968, Oakland, CA 94613
(510)430-2285
lwilkins at mills.edu 

From ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu  Tue Feb  6 15:08:18 2007
From: ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu (Daphne Greenberg)
Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2007 15:08:18 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 638] Re: Telephone assessment of literacy?
In-Reply-To: <03f201c74a18$3b4c5fc0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <03f201c74a18$3b4c5fc0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <45C899E202000031000158F2@mailsrv4.gsu.edu>

What aspect of literacy are you trying to measure?

>>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 2/6/2007 12:57 PM
>>>
Hi everyone,
 
Does anyone know of a literacy assessment that can be administered via
phone?
 
Thanks,
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Feb  6 15:17:14 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 15:17:14 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 639]  Guest on PovertyRaceWomen List
Message-ID: <044601c74a2b$cb621380$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:

The following announcement is from Daphne Greenberg, Moderator of the
PovertyRaceWomen and Literacy Discussion List.  

**********

Please invite your friends and colleagues to join us during this
"discussion." If they want to temporarily join us, they can subscribe
and then later unsubscribe at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/povertyracewomen

-----

It is my great honor and pleasure to announce that from Monday Feb.
12th through Friday Feb. 16th, Dominique Chlup will be facilitating a
discussion on the PovertyRaceWomen and Literacy list on:

Bars, Boundaries, and Barriers Researching Women's Spaces

Dominique Chlup is an assistant professor of adult education and the
director of the Texas Center for the Advancement of Literacy and
Learning (TCALL) at Texas A&M University.She got her "calling" to be an
adult educator after volunteering for a year at the Valhalla Women's
Jail in New York. She taught in the "Right to Write" program.  While her
career has taken her into several other adult classrooms, she finds she
returns
again and again to her work with women student-inmates.  She wrote a
dissertation on the history of the educational programs and practices at
the Framingham Reformatory for Women in Massachusetts, and she continues
to research contemporary prison programs.  As a part of her research
with women inmates, she has encountered both literal and figurative
bars.  As such, she is always interested in dialoging with others about
their own experiences researching and working in women's spaces.  To
learn more about her work, you can read 
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=828 
and
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=826 

Daphne

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Feb  6 15:21:54 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 15:21:54 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 640] Re: Telephone assessment of literacy?
In-Reply-To: <45C899E202000031000158F2@mailsrv4.gsu.edu>
Message-ID: <044701c74a2c$71c39cd0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Daphne and everyone,

The request is for a tool that can be used as a reading assessment, but
that can be administered via the telephone for purposes of a larger
study.  

Marie

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Daphne Greenberg
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2007 3:08 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 638] Re: Telephone assessment of literacy?

What aspect of literacy are you trying to measure?

>>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 2/6/2007 12:57 PM
>>>
Hi everyone,
 
Does anyone know of a literacy assessment that can be administered via
phone?
 
Thanks,
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

From andrew.pleasant at gmail.com  Tue Feb  6 19:25:54 2007
From: andrew.pleasant at gmail.com (Andrew Pleasant)
Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2007 19:25:54 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 641] Re: Telephone assessment of literacy?
In-Reply-To: <044701c74a2c$71c39cd0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <45C899E202000031000158F2@mailsrv4.gsu.edu>
	<044701c74a2c$71c39cd0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <42b6c33e0702061625i2799b516j433e3670a3cb0707@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

Thomas Schticht wrote a very nice analysis published as a NCES working
paper titled "Using Telephone and Mail Surveys as a Supplement or
Alternative to Door-to-Door Surveys in the Assessment of Adult
Literacy"  I dont' have the URL right at hand, but a Google search
with the title should find it for you.

Andrew Pleasant

On 2/6/07, Marie Cora <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:
> Hi Daphne and everyone,
>
> The request is for a tool that can be used as a reading assessment, but
> that can be administered via the telephone for purposes of a larger
> study.
>
> Marie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Daphne Greenberg
> Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2007 3:08 PM
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 638] Re: Telephone assessment of literacy?
>
> What aspect of literacy are you trying to measure?
>
> >>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 2/6/2007 12:57 PM
> >>>
> Hi everyone,
>
> Does anyone know of a literacy assessment that can be administered via
> phone?
>
> Thanks,
> Marie
>
> Marie Cora
>  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Feb  7 06:52:58 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 06:52:58 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 642] Re: Telephone assessment of literacy?
In-Reply-To: <42b6c33e0702061625i2799b516j433e3670a3cb0707@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <04a701c74aae$83a5baf0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Andrew - right you are!  Here are the resources from Tom you
mentioned.  Enjoy!

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
*****

Re: Assessing adult literacy by telephone. The following paper from NCES
can be downloaded at the NCES web site. It reviews literature on the use
of telephones to assess literacy and other cognitive skills.
(http://nces.ed.gov/pubsearch/pubsinfo.asp?pubid=200006)

See also the following two papers:

Sticht, T., Hofstetter, R., and Hofstetter, C. (1996). Assessing adult
literacy by telephone.  Journal of Literacy Research, 28, 525-559.

Hofstetter, R., Sticht, T., and Hofstetter, C. (1999). Knowledge,
literacy and power. Communication Research, 26, 58-80.

Tom Sticht

Title:
	Using Telephone and Mail Surveys as a Supplement or Alternative
to Door-to-Door Surveys in the Assessment of Adult Literacy

Description:	This paper discusses the use of telephone surveys as a
substitute for, or addition to, the use of door-to-door surveys in
assessing adult literacy ability. Part 1 addresses issues of validity in
adult literacy assessment. Part 2 is a review of related research that
has used telephone and mail surveys to assess the cognitive abilities of
adults. Part 3 discusses the theoretical model of literacy that the
National Assessments of Adult Literacy (NAAL) and International Adult
Literacy Survey (IALS) have used and how that model can be modified to
incorporate a developmental and componential model of literacy that also
includes the oral language aspects of literacy given in the Adult
Education and Family Literacy Act of 1998. Finally, Part 4 addresses
several issues about the use of telephone and mail surveys, including
concerns about using these survey methods in such a way as to make
continuity in trend data from previous surveys of adult literacy
possible. Online Availability:
	Download, view and print the report as a pdf file.  (301KB)

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Andrew Pleasant
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2007 7:26 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 641] Re: Telephone assessment of literacy?

Hi,

Thomas Schticht wrote a very nice analysis published as a NCES working
paper titled "Using Telephone and Mail Surveys as a Supplement or
Alternative to Door-to-Door Surveys in the Assessment of Adult
Literacy"  I dont' have the URL right at hand, but a Google search
with the title should find it for you.

Andrew Pleasant

On 2/6/07, Marie Cora <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:
> Hi Daphne and everyone,
>
> The request is for a tool that can be used as a reading assessment,
but
> that can be administered via the telephone for purposes of a larger
> study.
>
> Marie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Daphne Greenberg
> Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2007 3:08 PM
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 638] Re: Telephone assessment of literacy?
>
> What aspect of literacy are you trying to measure?
>
> >>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 2/6/2007 12:57 PM
> >>>
> Hi everyone,
>
> Does anyone know of a literacy assessment that can be administered via
> phone?
>
> Thanks,
> Marie
>
> Marie Cora
>  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Feb  7 07:25:41 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 07:25:41 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 643]  Formative assessment at the ALE Wiki
Message-ID: <04ad01c74ab3$15b93850$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
I have organized a lot of the information from the discussion we had on
formative assessment and have posted this for your use at the ALE Wiki
Assessment section.  Go to:
http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Assessment_Information and click
on section 7 Formative Assessment.
 
There are 3 areas:  I extracted a lot of the ideas for the classroom
that people contributed, and organized them under topical headings;
another area has the referenced tools and materials that people said
they use in class; the final area is a list of on-line resources for
formative assessment.  Anyone who contributed to that discussion has
been acknowledged.  If I missed your name, or you would like your name
removed, please contact me.  
 
You can add any information you would like to the Wiki - it is very
simple.  In fact I hope that you do add information, ideas, resources,
etc. to the Wiki - that is what it is for.  If you have any questions,
please don't hesitate to ask!
 
Thanks!
 
marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From mpatters at ku.edu  Tue Feb  6 12:46:38 2007
From: mpatters at ku.edu (Margaret Patterson)
Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2007 11:46:38 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 644]  Save the dates for COABE 2008
In-Reply-To: <C1ECE90D.4310%mpatters@ku.edu>
Message-ID: <C1EE1B1E.4398%mpatters@ku.edu>

Greetings to all adult education colleagues from your COABE 2008 planning
committee! As you plan for professional development in the coming months, we
invite you to save the dates for our upcoming conference, co-sponsored with
Missouri Association for Adult Continuing and Community Education - Show Me
Success: Empowerment through Diversity - in St Louis, Missouri, April 28 to
May 1, 2008. You and your co-workers won't want to miss this rare
opportunity to attend a national adult education conference held in your
local region. We invite you to join the planning of the conference -
volunteers are most welcome! Please contact Lorene James, Conference
Co-Chair, at ljames at kcmsd.net, or 816-418-8205, or MaryAnn Kramer,
Conference Co-Chair, at MaryAnn.Kramer at slps.org, or 314-367-5000. Check our
conference website, www.coabeconference.org,
<http://www.coabeconference.org,>  for more information. We look forward to
meeting you in St. Louis in 2008!

Margaret Patterson, Ph.D.
Assistant Project Coordinator/Research Associate
Improving Adult Literacy Instruction
University of Kansas
Center for Research on Learning
Division of Adult Studies
Joseph R. Pearson Hall
1122 West Campus Dr., Room 708A
Lawrence, KS 66045-3101
Phone 785.864.7089
Fax 785.864.5728

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From john.benseman at criticalinsight.co.nz  Wed Feb  7 14:12:05 2007
From: john.benseman at criticalinsight.co.nz (John Benseman)
Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 08:12:05 +1300
Subject: [Assessment 645] Re: Save the dates for COABE 2008
In-Reply-To: <C1EE1B1E.4398%mpatters@ku.edu>
Message-ID: <003801c74aeb$db6afba0$0a00a8c0@critical1>

Margaret - Your URL doesn't work

John

John Benseman PhD
 
Director of Research & Evaluation, Upskilling NZ
(based at Department of Labour)
DDI 04 915 4633 - Cell: 021 0489 143
 
*   john.benseman at criticalinsight.co.nz
(   0064 9 627 4415
7 0064 9 627 4418
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Margaret Patterson
Sent: Wednesday, 7 February 2007 6:47 a.m.
To: Margaret Patterson
Subject: [Assessment 644] Save the dates for COABE 2008

Greetings to all adult education colleagues from your COABE 2008 planning
committee! As you plan for professional development in the coming months, we
invite you to save the dates for our upcoming conference, co-sponsored with
Missouri Association for Adult Continuing and Community Education - Show Me
Success: Empowerment through Diversity - in St Louis, Missouri, April 28 to
May 1, 2008. You and your co-workers won't want to miss this rare
opportunity to attend a national adult education conference held in your
local region. We invite you to join the planning of the conference -
volunteers are most welcome! Please contact Lorene James, Conference
Co-Chair, at ljames at kcmsd.net, or 816-418-8205, or MaryAnn Kramer,
Conference Co-Chair, at MaryAnn.Kramer at slps.org, or 314-367-5000. Check our
conference website, www.coabeconference.org,
<http://www.coabeconference.org,>  for more information. We look forward to
meeting you in St. Louis in 2008!

Margaret Patterson, Ph.D.
Assistant Project Coordinator/Research Associate
Improving Adult Literacy Instruction
University of Kansas
Center for Research on Learning
Division of Adult Studies
Joseph R. Pearson Hall
1122 West Campus Dr., Room 708A
Lawrence, KS 66045-3101
Phone 785.864.7089
Fax 785.864.5728

From pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us  Wed Feb  7 15:08:16 2007
From: pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us (JO PAMMENT)
Date: Wed, 07 Feb 2007 15:08:16 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 646] Re: Formative assessment at the ALE Wiki
In-Reply-To: <04ad01c74ab3$15b93850$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <04ad01c74ab3$15b93850$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <45C9EB600200009E0000920F@10.1.0.15>

Thank you for doing all of this.
Jo Pamment

Jo Pamment
Director Adult Ed. ESL
Haslett Public Schools
1118 S. Harrison 
East Lansing, Michigan 48823

TEL:  517 337-8353
FAX:  517 337-3195
E-Mail:  pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us

>>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 2/7/2007 7:25:41 AM
>>>
Hi everyone,
 
I have organized a lot of the information from the discussion we had
on
formative assessment and have posted this for your use at the ALE Wiki
Assessment section.  Go to:
http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Assessment_Information and
click
on section 7 Formative Assessment.
 
There are 3 areas:  I extracted a lot of the ideas for the classroom
that people contributed, and organized them under topical headings;
another area has the referenced tools and materials that people said
they use in class; the final area is a list of on-line resources for
formative assessment.  Anyone who contributed to that discussion has
been acknowledged.  If I missed your name, or you would like your name
removed, please contact me.  
 
You can add any information you would like to the Wiki - it is very
simple.  In fact I hope that you do add information, ideas, resources,
etc. to the Wiki - that is what it is for.  If you have any questions,
please don't hesitate to ask!
 
Thanks!
 
marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

From mpatters at ku.edu  Wed Feb  7 16:08:12 2007
From: mpatters at ku.edu (Margaret Patterson)
Date: Wed, 07 Feb 2007 15:08:12 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 647] Re: Save the dates for COABE 2008
In-Reply-To: <003801c74aeb$db6afba0$0a00a8c0@critical1>
Message-ID: <C1EF9BDC.43FE%mpatters@ku.edu>

Hello, John (and other colleagues),
Thanks for looking for it! The COABE 2008 webmaster assures me the website
at www.coabeconference.org will be up and running the first week of March.
Please check back again then. Thank you,
Margaret

On 2/7/07 1:12 PM, "John Benseman" <john.benseman at criticalinsight.co.nz>
wrote:

> Margaret - Your URL doesn't work
> 
> John
> 
> John Benseman PhD
>  
> Director of Research & Evaluation, Upskilling NZ
> (based at Department of Labour)
> DDI 04 915 4633 - Cell: 021 0489 143
>  
> *   john.benseman at criticalinsight.co.nz
> (   0064 9 627 4415
> 7 0064 9 627 4418
>  
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
> Behalf Of Margaret Patterson
> Sent: Wednesday, 7 February 2007 6:47 a.m.
> To: Margaret Patterson
> Subject: [Assessment 644] Save the dates for COABE 2008
> 
> 
> Greetings to all adult education colleagues from your COABE 2008 planning
> committee! As you plan for professional development in the coming months, we
> invite you to save the dates for our upcoming conference, co-sponsored with
> Missouri Association for Adult Continuing and Community Education - Show Me
> Success: Empowerment through Diversity - in St Louis, Missouri, April 28 to
> May 1, 2008. You and your co-workers won't want to miss this rare
> opportunity to attend a national adult education conference held in your
> local region. We invite you to join the planning of the conference -
> volunteers are most welcome! Please contact Lorene James, Conference
> Co-Chair, at ljames at kcmsd.net, or 816-418-8205, or MaryAnn Kramer,
> Conference Co-Chair, at MaryAnn.Kramer at slps.org, or 314-367-5000. Check our
> conference website, www.coabeconference.org,
> <http://www.coabeconference.org,>  for more information. We look forward to
> meeting you in St. Louis in 2008!
> 
> 
> Margaret Patterson, Ph.D.
> Assistant Project Coordinator/Research Associate
> Improving Adult Literacy Instruction
> University of Kansas
> Center for Research on Learning
> Division of Adult Studies
> Joseph R. Pearson Hall
> 1122 West Campus Dr., Room 708A
> Lawrence, KS 66045-3101
> Phone 785.864.7089
> Fax 785.864.5728
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Feb  7 16:58:23 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 16:58:23 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 648]  STAR Struck for Reading Instruction
Message-ID: <057501c74b03$16beda20$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The following post is from Tom Sticht.  What are people's thoughts on
the STAR Project and/or on Tom's comments as well?

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

******

February 6, 2007

STAR Struck: The Federal STAR (STudent  Achievement in Reading) Project:
Why
Now?

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Recently the U. S. Department of Education, Office of Vocational and
Adult
Education (OVAE), Division of Adult Education and Literacy (DAEL)
announced
the STAR web site and professional development activity. The web site
provides the following information about STAR:

Quote:"What is STAR?
STAR is a comprehensive toolkit and training package to help Adult Basic
Education (ABE) instructors use evidence-based reading instruction in
the
classroom. For more information, see About STAR.
What is the National STAR Training Network?
The National STAR Training Network (NSTN) encompasses national and state
experts in reading instruction, state and federal policymakers, and
practitioners. All are working in partnership with the U.S. Department
of
Education to use evidence-based reading instruction and the STAR model
to
improve adult reading. For more information see Contact the Network.
Why STAR?
STAR delivers the tools and techniques teachers need to help adult
learners
read and achieve."End Quote

In and of itself, the idea of tools and techniques to help adult
learners
read and achieve is not very notable because there are already numerous
tools and techniques , commercial programs, etc. that aim to do the same
thing. But repeatedly the STAR web site says it aims at assisting adult
educators to use "evidence-based" reading instruction.  It describes
"evidence-based" and says: Quote:"Evidence-based reading instruction
(EBRI)
integrates findings from the best available reading research with
practitioner wisdom to inform instructional decisions. .With EBRI,
teachers
use diagnostic assessment procedures to gauge the strengths and
weaknesses
of each learner and target reading instruction accordingly. .Teachers
that
use EBRI help learners improve their skills in each of the four
components
of reading - alphabetics, vocabulary, fluency, and comprehension - by
explaining new concepts, modeling strategies, and providing feedback
when
learners practice."End Quote

However, the STAR web site provides no evidence that following its
evidence-based approach will improve adult reading instruction over what
is
already being done by adult literacy educators. I have searched for
scientific research indicating that a focus on alphabetics (code
emphasis
in Jeanne Chall's terms) with adults with low literacy produced better
learning outcomes than some other, perhaps whole language (meaning
emphasis
in Jeanne Chall's  terms) approach. But I have found no  such research.
No
such research is cited on the STAR web site, and the report on
principles
of adult reading instruction that is mentioned does not include any such
research, either.

The evidence that the STAR web site mentions also includes "professional
wisdom," however no citation of professional wisdom is given. I have
looked
at historical approaches to teaching adults to read to find professional
wisdom in using either code or meaning emphases. Cora Wilson Stewart in
1911 and beyond did not like the alphabetics approach and clearly stated
that adults should be taught using the "word' approach. Reports of her
work
indicate that more than 180,000 adults learned to read following her
"whole
language" approach. But in World War I, J. Duncan Spaeth took a strong
phonics approach to teaching reading to soldiers. Then in World War II,
Paul Witty took a strong "word", "whole language" approach, and indeed
teachers in Special Training Units got demerits if they emphasized
phonics
too much. It is reported that over a quarter million soldiers learned to
read using this meaning emphasis approach.

Septima Poinsette Clark favored a whole language approach in teaching
some
10,000 teachers to teach 700,000 adults to read and write to vote in the
early civil rights movement. Frank Laubach strongly favored a code
emphasis
while Ruth Colvin, founder of Literacy Volunteers of America  favored a
whole language approach (interestingly, Laubach and Colvin have merged
into
one organization, ProLiteracy Worldwide).

This type of variable historical data on professional wisdom, and the
lack
of any solid research that I have found on the relative effectiveness
with
adults of the code or meaning emphases leaves me without any good data
to
help make decisions about the use of these two approaches. I know that
Jeanne Chall favored the code approach in her clinical work but her
reported gains did not seem to be much better, if at all better, than
what
other adult literacy programs reported. As I read the STAR web page, it
appears that the STAR approach has been developed in large part by
former
students of Jeanne at Harvard.

It seems to me that the evidence base for the effectiveness of the STAR
approach to adult literacy education is lacking, in both professional
wisdom and scientific research. This suggests that the national
dissemination effort funded by the federal government is premature. I
think
that before such an expensive (over $31,400 for 45 adult educators to
learn
the STAR approach) national dissemination effort is undertaken there
should
be research conducted to show that the STAR approach is more effective
than
other approaches to teaching reading with adults.

Too often national efforts by the federal government have been
undertaken
and millions of dollars have been spent to disseminate the efforts, only
to
see them fade away with little apparent long-lasting improvement to the
Adult Education and Literacy System (AELS) of the United States. Will
STAR
go this way, too?

Whatever happened to the Adult Performance Level (APL) project?
Whatever happened to the Equipped for the Future (EFF) project?

Are we about to be STAR struck?

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valey View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Wed Feb  7 19:48:19 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2007 17:48:19 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 649] Re: STAR Struck for Reading Instruction
In-Reply-To: <057501c74b03$16beda20$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <057501c74b03$16beda20$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <OF13FC34BC.94DAAFAF-ON0725727C.00046C9D-0725727C.00046C9F@yc.edu>

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From alantoops at cs.com  Thu Feb  8 11:41:44 2007
From: alantoops at cs.com (Alan Toops)
Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2007 11:41:44 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 650] Re: STAR Struck for Reading Instruction
In-Reply-To: <OF13FC34BC.94DAAFAF-ON0725727C.00046C9D-0725727C.00046C9F@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <C1F0BCF8.1AF7D%alantoops@cs.com>

Tina,

You have hit on the core of the matter. Its all about what the student needs
to be successful. Matters not what label we put on it. Both have value, both
are useful if we determine the right fit for our students.

Alan Toops
Executive Director
Ohio Literacy Network
(614) 505-0717
atoops at ohioliteracynetwork.org
http://www.ohioliteracynetwork.org

On 2/7/07 7:48 PM, "Tina_Luffman at yc.edu" <Tina_Luffman at yc.edu> wrote:

> Marie,
>  
> In college I did research into whole language versus phonics for Reading
> acquisition in elementary schools. The reason for my interest in this research
> was watching my older two children learn how to read well with a more
> phonics-based program. When my younger two children entered elementary school,
> the district switched to whole language. When I visited their classrooms, the
> teacher stood in front of the room with a large book and had the children
> "read" along with the text of a book they had memorized. I had a fit. These
> kids had no idea what the words said on that book. By the time these kids got
> to second grade, the teachers were similarly having a fit wondering why many
> of their second graders could barely read. My son, unfortunately,was one of
> them, and the only reading he could do was from a one month summer school
> program he went to that was phonics-based. His sister did not read as well as
> her older siblings, either.
>  
> In my research I did learn that some children do learn better with whole
> language, and that whole language does seem to create faster reading
> comprehension rates. Other children tend to learn best with phonetic decoding
> skills, learning the sounds of the letters, and then building words from that.
> Phonics, however, does tend to create slower readers, according to the whole
> language information I had read.
>  
> I do not know if this resesarch is valid in adult education; however, I am
> personally biased toward phonics-based reading methods, yet I do not rule out
> entirely the value of some whole language. I am interested in learning what
> STAR has to offer. I do not discount what Tom is saying because he has been
> around long enough, as have many of the rest of the NIFL list practitioners,
> to have seen many programs come and go. I am new enough to Adult Education to
> be willing to give this new program a chance.
>  
> Tina
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Tina Luffman
> Coordinator, Developmental Education
> Verde Valley Campus
> 928-634-6544
> tina_luffman at yc.edu
> =
> 
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Feb  8 12:03:43 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 12:03:43 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 651]  Seeking article submissions
Message-ID: <062201c74ba3$1726a6f0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:

Please see the following opportunity to contribute to the 2007 issue of
the International Journal of Literacy and Numeracy Studies.  I encourage
all subscribers on the List to consider this, as the focus of the
publication speaks directly to the issues that we discuss here in this
forum.  The editors are very much interested in seeking practitioners to
contribute papers.  

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

------------------------------------------------------------
Special Issue Announcement

The editors of International Journal of Literacy and Numeracy Studies
are pleased to announce that Dr. Alisa Belzer of Rutgers University and
Dr. Ralf St. Clair of University of Glasgow will edit a special issue of
LNS to be published in 2007. This issue will focus on how national
accountability systems are influencing practice at the program and
classroom levels.  The guest editors are seeking submissions of papers
that explore the choices and compromises and the costs and benefits of
increased demands for standardized accountability and reporting
procedures.  They are also interested in papers that document how
teachers and learners are developing and maintaining "responsive"
practices in this time when increasingly narrow accountability and
curricular systems seem to be reducing the options open to educators and
learners.  They would like especially to urge practitioners to
contribute, either as solo authors or in collaboration with university
researchers or policy makers. 

Please submit papers to Dr. Belzer or Dr. St. Clair by June 30, 2007 at
the latest. If you would like to contact our guest editors directly,
email them at belzera at rci.rutgers.edu and/or rstclair at educ.gla.ac.uk.

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Feb  8 16:30:07 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 16:30:07 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 652]   Re: STAR Struck for Reading Instruction
Message-ID: <067801c74bc8$4ea09e40$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:
 
The following post is from Michelle Meeks.  The discussion on the STAR
program has sparked a lot of interest on other discussion lists as well.
On the NLA (National Literacy Advocacy List), the discussion is highly
focused on reading instruction and what research the instruction is
based on.  The ARCS and Assessment Strategies and Reading Profiles is
also discussed.  There is also a discussion thread on the Adult Literacy
Professional Development List.
 
ASRP/ARCS is at http://www.nifl.gov/readingprofiles/index.htm
 
Subscribe or view the archives of the NLA at
http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla/
 
Subscribe or view the archives of the Adult Literacy Professional
Development List at
(http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Professionaldevelopment)  
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
******
                                         
The STAR program seems very similar to the ARCS information located on
the NIFL website.  Using the ARCS website in conjunction with Susan
McShane's book - Applying Research in Reading Instruction for Adults is
awesome!  I would suggest everyone take a look at these 2 resources as
well as the STAR.   Locating which of the 4 components of reading an
adult is struggling with will help you streamline instruction and not
spend time playing detective as to what the student needs.  
 
Michelle Meeks, Director
San Juan College Project Read
203 W. Main
Farmington, NM  87401
(505) 326-3503
meeksm at sanjuancollege.edu
GOT STRENGTHS? - Adaptability, Communication, Positivity, Relator, and
Strategic
 
"Serenity Now!"
            Frank Costanza

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 5:48 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 649] Re: STAR Struck for Reading Instruction
 
Marie,
 
In college I did research into whole language versus phonics for Reading
acquisition in elementary schools. The reason for my interest in this
research was watching my older two children learn how to read well with
a more phonics-based program. When my younger two children entered
elementary school, the district switched to whole language. When I
visited their classrooms, the teacher stood in front of the room with a
large book and had the children "read" along with the text of a book
they had memorized. I had a fit. These kids had no idea what the words
said on that book. By the time these kids got to second grade, the
teachers were similarly having a fit wondering why many of their second
graders could barely read. My son, unfortunately,was one of them, and
the only reading he could do was from a one month summer school program
he went to that was phonics-based. His sister did not read as well as
her older siblings, either.
 
In my research I did learn that some children do learn better with whole
language, and that whole language does seem to create faster reading
comprehension rates. Other children tend to learn best with phonetic
decoding skills, learning the sounds of the letters, and then building
words from that. Phonics, however, does tend to create slower readers,
according to the whole language information I had read. 
 
I do not know if this resesarch is valid in adult education; however, I
am personally biased toward phonics-based reading methods, yet I do not
rule out entirely the value of some whole language. I am interested in
learning what STAR has to offer. I do not discount what Tom is saying
because he has been around long enough, as have many of the rest of the
NIFL list practitioners, to have seen many programs come and go. I am
new enough to Adult Education to be willing to give this new program a
chance.
 
Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Feb  8 16:42:00 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2007 16:42:00 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 653]  FW: [Workplace 583] Re: Workplace Standards
Message-ID: <068701c74bc9$f775a320$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues, 

Perhaps this exchange on Work Keys and the Work Readiness Credential is
of interest to folks on the list.  This discussion is taking place on
the Workplace Literacy Discussion List; subscribe or view the archives
at http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Workplace/

Marie Cora

******************************

> We seem to have two sets of standards in Workplace Literacy.  Some 
> states are adopting the WorkKeys Career Readiness Certificate.  Other 
> states are adopting the National Work Readiness Credential.  Is one 
> preferable to the other?  Why create the National Work Readiness 
> Credential when WorkKeys is already so well established?  I would like
> to see some discussion on this issue.
>  
> Thank you,
> Jennifer
>   
> Jennifer Coplin
> Aztec Learning Software / East Coast Learning
> 6071 Bob Daniel Road
> Oxford, NC 27565
> Ph 888 615 8301
> Fx 919 603 1878
> jennifer at eastcoastlearning.com <mailto:jennifer at eastcoastlearning.com>
> www.aztecsoftware.com <http://www.aztecsoftware.com/>
>

*********************************

I asked Tonya Crum, Director of Workforce Development & Training at 
Kentucky Educational Television to respond to Jennifer's question, and 
here is her response:

> It's not a good idea to compare the two.  They are two different
> assessments.
> 
> WorkKeys Career Readiness Certificate assesses in the areas of Applied
> Math, Reading for Information and Locating Information.
> 
> The National Work Readiness Credential (NWC) assesses Communication,
> Interpersonal, Decision Making, and Lifelong Learning Skills for entry
> level jobs.  NWC is more attainable for the students we serve in our
> adult education programs.
> 
> As to whether WorkKeys is so well established, it is not so in all
> areas or states.
> 
> (This is from a Kentucky practitioner's point of view.)

Joyce Probus

***********************************

There's a recent report available that looks at various work readiness
credentials/certificates including Work Keys and NWRC. 

See the Report online at
http://www.jff.org/JFF_KC_Pages.php?WhichLevel=1&lv1_id=4&lv2_id=0&lv3_i
d=0KC_M_ID=315

A Survey of Selected Work Readiness Certificates (Jobs for the Future,
2007)

The United Way of Rhode Island asked JFF to prepare a scan of work
readiness certificates that have emerged throughout the United States in
recent years. A Survey of Selected Work Readiness Certificate Models, by
JFF's Norma Rey-Alicea and Geri Scott, summarizes five of the nation's
many work readiness certificates, which are representative of the
diverse range of such initiatives in terms of target population,
certification requirements, geography, and other factors. The report
highlights issues that stakeholders should consider in determining which
approaches would most benefit their state's unique demographics,
economy, and political landscape.

Mindy Detzler 

National Youth Employment Coalition 
ph: 202-659-1064 
md at nyec.org 
  

 

From aalba1 at cox.net  Fri Feb  9 00:03:13 2007
From: aalba1 at cox.net (AL)
Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2007 00:03:13 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 653]  Efficacy of TABE Verses CASAS ????
Message-ID: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKOEFLCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>

Dear Educators,

   I am an adult educator for the Rhode Island Department of Corrections.
Presently we use the TABE 7/8, without the TABE Locator.  I am wondering on
the efficacy of using such an instrument as a method to place students in
either special education classes or regular GED classes.  The Standard we
use at our department is that if a student has overall TABE test report
scores of 6.0 or greater he or she is placed in the general adult education
classes. If a student's scores are below 6.0 he or she is placed in a
special education class.  Is the use of the aforementioned test an effective
instrument for discerning a student's class placement.

   Also, I have been told our department  the State of RI may be switching
to CASAS at the start of the next school year for adult education classes
and for student class placement.  I was wondering on the efficacy of CASAS
for placing students in either ABE (special education classes) or GED as
compared to the TABE battery for such an analysis.

   In addition I was wondering,  which instrument CASAS or TABE is best for
use as a diagnostic aid?  Specifically, which student test report either
TABE or CASAS give the teacher better guidance with respect to analyzing the
areas of students' strengths and weaknesses?

               Thanks in advance for your feedback,   Albert Alba, Jr. PhD.

From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Mon Feb 12 11:59:48 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 08:59:48 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 654] Re: Efficacy of TABE Verses CASAS ????
In-Reply-To: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKOEFLCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>
References: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKOEFLCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E4F6@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

The TABE vs CASAS conversation has been going on since, what 1988 or
so....personally I find the CASAS much more user friendly but many of my
colleagues lean heavily toward TABE because it is more academic in
nature.  Both can serve as high stakes tests.  There are correlation
studies that have been done based on TABE and CASAS scores (using the
scores to show how well a student will do on a GED).  I think that you
will find CASAS at least as accurate as the current method you are using
for student placement
Va

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of AL
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 9:03 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Cc: aalba1 at cox.net
Subject: [Assessment 653] Efficacy of TABE Verses CASAS ????

Dear Educators,

   I am an adult educator for the Rhode Island Department of
Corrections.
Presently we use the TABE 7/8, without the TABE Locator.  I am wondering
on
the efficacy of using such an instrument as a method to place students
in
either special education classes or regular GED classes.  The Standard
we
use at our department is that if a student has overall TABE test report
scores of 6.0 or greater he or she is placed in the general adult
education
classes. If a student's scores are below 6.0 he or she is placed in a
special education class.  Is the use of the aforementioned test an
effective
instrument for discerning a student's class placement.

   Also, I have been told our department  the State of RI may be
switching
to CASAS at the start of the next school year for adult education
classes
and for student class placement.  I was wondering on the efficacy of
CASAS
for placing students in either ABE (special education classes) or GED as
compared to the TABE battery for such an analysis.

   In addition I was wondering,  which instrument CASAS or TABE is best
for
use as a diagnostic aid?  Specifically, which student test report either
TABE or CASAS give the teacher better guidance with respect to analyzing
the
areas of students' strengths and weaknesses?

               Thanks in advance for your feedback,   Albert Alba, Jr.
PhD.

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From kabeall at comcast.net  Mon Feb 12 12:52:26 2007
From: kabeall at comcast.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 12:52:26 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 655]  New from NCSALL
Message-ID: <007701c74ece$92868f30$0202a8c0@your4105e587b6>

Health Literacy Study Circle+ Facilitators Training

The purpose of this training guide is to help experienced professional
developers and others organize and conduct a one-day session to train and
orient those who will serve as facilitators of a HALL/NCSALL Health Literacy
Study Circle+. A Health and Adult Literacy and Learning (HALL)/National
Center for Study of Adult Learning and Literacy (NCSALL) Health Literacy
Study Circle+ is a professional development activity for adult basic
education (ABE), adult secondary education (ASE), or adult English for
Speakers of Other Languages (ESOL) practitioners. This guide includes the
information and materials you will need to conduct the training, but not
background information on planning and facilitating training. Facilitators
of the Health Literacy Study Circle+ Facilitators Training should be
experienced trainers. For more information and to download the training
guide, go to the NCSALL Web site: http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1169

 

 

****************

Kaye Beall

World Education

4401 S. Madison St.

Muncie, IN  47302

Tel: 765-717-3942

Fax: 617-482-0617

kaye_beall at worlded.org

http://www.worlded.org

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Feb 14 07:33:17 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:33:17 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 656]  more on formative assessment
Message-ID: <038401c75034$4e364750$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
I wanted to let you know that I've added more information taken from our
discussion on formative assessment to the ALE Wiki Assessment section.
Go to:
http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Assessment_Information
and click on Formative Assessment.  I added some Quotes of Note from the
discussion, and I'm in the process of building a section on samples of
IEP/ILP/ISPs - cyber links are up there now, but the sections with
samples from colleagues are only blank pages so far - I need to make the
files PDF and post them in their proper format which will take me just a
bit of learning first.
 
If (when!) you go to the Wiki, consider signing in as a user.  You need
to do that anyway if you are going to add or change text.  But even if
you just go and use the resources there, sign in so we know who's
becoming part of the ALE Wiki community.
 
I always make proper acknowledgements in terms of persons and resources,
but if you do not want your name or materials posted, please contact me
right away.  
 
Thanks,
marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From kabeall at comcast.net  Wed Feb 14 13:24:17 2007
From: kabeall at comcast.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 13:24:17 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 657]  New from NCSALL
Message-ID: <008701c75065$5a337830$0202a8c0@your4105e587b6>

Adult Literacy Research: Opportunities and Challenges by John Comings and
Lisa Soricone
This occasional paper has two goals that support the building of a stronger
research base for the adult literacy field. The first goal is to interest
researchers in pursuing rigorous scientific research in this field. Despite
the many challenges to research, this field offers researchers some
opportunities to have a positive impact on education, increase the research
base, and advance their careers. The second goal is to identify these
challenges and approaches to overcoming them so that future research could
design more successful studies. Addressing these challenges to research is a
critical step toward building a larger and stronger foundation of evidence
to support practitioner decisions. 

To download the paper, go to the NCSALL Web site: www.ncsall.net/?id=26#opps

 

Evaluating and Interpreting Research Syntheses in Adult Learning and
Literacy by Harris Cooper
This occasional paper introduces the methods of research synthesis and
meta-analysis to researchers and consumers of research in the field of adult
learning and literacy. The first section defines key terms and offers a
brief history of how the methodologies developed. The second section
provides a conceptualization of research synthesis that views it no
differently from other research endeavors in the social sciences. Then, the
tasks of research synthesis are presented within the context of a
hypothetical example drawn from the literature on adult learning and
literacy. 

To download the paper, go to the NCSALL Web site:
www.ncsall.net/?id=26#syntheses

 

 

****************

Kaye Beall

World Education

4401 S. Madison St.

Muncie, IN  47302

Tel: 765-717-3942

Fax: 617-482-0617

kaye_beall at worlded.org

http://www.worlded.org

 

 

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From john.r.warrior at cox.net  Thu Feb 15 02:28:36 2007
From: john.r.warrior at cox.net (John Warrior)
Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2007 01:28:36 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 658] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 17, Issue 12
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1.1171472400.24806.assessment@nifl.gov>
References: <mailman.1.1171472400.24806.assessment@nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <000101c750d2$e832b520$0301a8c0@john1u8j50rbx5>

I have a question for those of you on this list. My school is considering
implementing an electronic portfolio to manage and track the progress of our
ESL students within our program. I have some personal experience with the
system provided by Chalk and Wire, but beyond that I am in the dark about
other providers and software options. 

Our plans are to incorporate student data as well as artifact files, such as
text, pdf, video and audio files. We have options to either go client side
or server side with the data files. I will appreciate any information and
experiences that any of you may have about software and ways to enhance the
effectiveness. 

Thank you,

John Warrior
Tulsa Community College
John.r.warrior at cox.net

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of assessment-request at nifl.gov
Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2007 11:00 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 17, Issue 12

Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
	assessment at nifl.gov

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
	assessment-request at nifl.gov

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	assessment-owner at nifl.gov

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."

Today's Topics:

   1. [Assessment 655]  New from NCSALL (Kaye Beall)
   2. [Assessment 656]  more on formative assessment (Marie Cora)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 12:52:26 -0500
From: "Kaye Beall" <kabeall at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 655]  New from NCSALL
To: <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <007701c74ece$92868f30$0202a8c0 at your4105e587b6>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Health Literacy Study Circle+ Facilitators Training

The purpose of this training guide is to help experienced professional
developers and others organize and conduct a one-day session to train and
orient those who will serve as facilitators of a HALL/NCSALL Health Literacy
Study Circle+. A Health and Adult Literacy and Learning (HALL)/National
Center for Study of Adult Learning and Literacy (NCSALL) Health Literacy
Study Circle+ is a professional development activity for adult basic
education (ABE), adult secondary education (ASE), or adult English for
Speakers of Other Languages (ESOL) practitioners. This guide includes the
information and materials you will need to conduct the training, but not
background information on planning and facilitating training. Facilitators
of the Health Literacy Study Circle+ Facilitators Training should be
experienced trainers. For more information and to download the training
guide, go to the NCSALL Web site: http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1169

 

 

****************

Kaye Beall

World Education

4401 S. Madison St.

Muncie, IN  47302

Tel: 765-717-3942

Fax: 617-482-0617

kaye_beall at worlded.org

http://www.worlded.org

 

 

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------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2007 07:33:17 -0500
From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
Subject: [Assessment 656]  more on formative assessment
To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <038401c75034$4e364750$0202a8c0 at LITNOW>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi everyone,
 
I wanted to let you know that I've added more information taken from our
discussion on formative assessment to the ALE Wiki Assessment section.
Go to:
http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Assessment_Information
and click on Formative Assessment.  I added some Quotes of Note from the
discussion, and I'm in the process of building a section on samples of
IEP/ILP/ISPs - cyber links are up there now, but the sections with
samples from colleagues are only blank pages so far - I need to make the
files PDF and post them in their proper format which will take me just a
bit of learning first.
 
If (when!) you go to the Wiki, consider signing in as a user.  You need
to do that anyway if you are going to add or change text.  But even if
you just go and use the resources there, sign in so we know who's
becoming part of the ALE Wiki community.
 
I always make proper acknowledgements in terms of persons and resources,
but if you do not want your name or materials posted, please contact me
right away.  
 
Thanks,
marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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------------------------------

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

End of Assessment Digest, Vol 17, Issue 12
******************************************

From aalba1 at cox.net  Sat Feb 17 09:53:07 2007
From: aalba1 at cox.net (AL)
Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:53:07 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 659]  Models Of Teaching
Message-ID: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKCEIHCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>

Dear Educators,

  I have used Some aspects of Standards Based Instruction in the
correctional classroom and I am seeking additional strategies.  If you could
describe methods that you have found successful to incorporate Standards
Based Instruction that is aligned with the Social Constructivist Approach it
would be helpful.  The Social Constructivist Approach involves students
engaged in active problem solving by participating in debates, cooperative
work, real life problems, open ended dialogue, and higher level questioning.
If you have any type of curricula, instructional practices, or resources
that you use to foster students' creating thinking and the goals of the
Social Constructivist Approach it would be appreciated if you could share
such methods.

                                    Sincerely, AL ALba, PhD

From akohring at utk.edu  Mon Feb 19 10:37:12 2007
From: akohring at utk.edu (Kohring, Aaron M)
Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 10:37:12 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 660] Re: Models Of Teaching
In-Reply-To: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKCEIHCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>
References: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKCEIHCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>
Message-ID: <9E03E4AF0E0DC54AA38E089CFF95FBD24F10E1@UTKFSVS2.utk.tennessee.edu>

Al,

The EFF Teaching/Learning Toolkit has a number of standards-based tools
and resources that you may find useful:
http://eff.cls.utk.edu/toolkit/default.htm

Aaron

Aaron Kohring
Research Associate
UT Center for Literacy Studies
600 Henley St, Ste 312
Knoxville, TN 37996-4135
Ph: 865-974-4258
Main: 865-974-4109
Fax: 865-974-3857
akohring at utk.edu
 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of AL
Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2007 9:53 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 659] Models Of Teaching

Dear Educators,

  I have used Some aspects of Standards Based Instruction in the
correctional classroom and I am seeking additional strategies.  If you
could
describe methods that you have found successful to incorporate Standards
Based Instruction that is aligned with the Social Constructivist
Approach it
would be helpful.  The Social Constructivist Approach involves students
engaged in active problem solving by participating in debates,
cooperative
work, real life problems, open ended dialogue, and higher level
questioning.
If you have any type of curricula, instructional practices, or resources
that you use to foster students' creating thinking and the goals of the
Social Constructivist Approach it would be appreciated if you could
share
such methods.

                                    Sincerely, AL ALba, PhD

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From jtaustin1 at core.com  Mon Feb 19 19:03:47 2007
From: jtaustin1 at core.com (james austin)
Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2007 19:03:47 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 661]  STAR Struck for Reading Instruction
In-Reply-To: <057501c74b03$16beda20$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <057501c74b03$16beda20$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <001d01c75482$99dc45e0$2efdfea9@JimDownOne>

Marie and Tom,

Thanks for the post.  

I work in Ohio which is implementing this STAR program at multiple sites.
Thus far I have not seen much on evaluation so I don't have a good sense for
how the program's impact will be documented.  It would seem to make sense to
start with teachers and move on to students. For example, we have provided
pilot site programs with a measure of adult reading interest that was
created from a well-validated instrument developed by M. Cecil Smith at NIU.

But the evaluation of effectiveness might (must?) presume that the
intervention has some evidence basis in the first place, either a logic
model or a theory-based approach.  The folks at ETS seem to be working
diligently in the theory area, and John Sabatini is one of their researchers
that I have met and understood.

One additional point:  Does Tom's critique extend more broadly than the area
of alphabetics, which appears to be a small component of STAR.  I would be
interested in the assessment toolkit called Bader.  What about the
reliability and validity of these instruments?

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Wednesday, February 07, 2007 4:58 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 648] STAR Struck for Reading Instruction

Colleagues,

The following post is from Tom Sticht.  What are people's thoughts on
the STAR Project and/or on Tom's comments as well?

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

******

February 6, 2007

STAR Struck: The Federal STAR (STudent  Achievement in Reading) Project:
Why
Now?

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Recently the U. S. Department of Education, Office of Vocational and
Adult
Education (OVAE), Division of Adult Education and Literacy (DAEL)
announced
the STAR web site and professional development activity. The web site
provides the following information about STAR:

Quote:"What is STAR?
STAR is a comprehensive toolkit and training package to help Adult Basic
Education (ABE) instructors use evidence-based reading instruction in
the
classroom. For more information, see About STAR.
What is the National STAR Training Network?
The National STAR Training Network (NSTN) encompasses national and state
experts in reading instruction, state and federal policymakers, and
practitioners. All are working in partnership with the U.S. Department
of
Education to use evidence-based reading instruction and the STAR model
to
improve adult reading. For more information see Contact the Network.
Why STAR?
STAR delivers the tools and techniques teachers need to help adult
learners
read and achieve."End Quote

In and of itself, the idea of tools and techniques to help adult
learners
read and achieve is not very notable because there are already numerous
tools and techniques , commercial programs, etc. that aim to do the same
thing. But repeatedly the STAR web site says it aims at assisting adult
educators to use "evidence-based" reading instruction.  It describes
"evidence-based" and says: Quote:"Evidence-based reading instruction
(EBRI)
integrates findings from the best available reading research with
practitioner wisdom to inform instructional decisions. .With EBRI,
teachers
use diagnostic assessment procedures to gauge the strengths and
weaknesses
of each learner and target reading instruction accordingly. .Teachers
that
use EBRI help learners improve their skills in each of the four
components
of reading - alphabetics, vocabulary, fluency, and comprehension - by
explaining new concepts, modeling strategies, and providing feedback
when
learners practice."End Quote

However, the STAR web site provides no evidence that following its
evidence-based approach will improve adult reading instruction over what
is
already being done by adult literacy educators. I have searched for
scientific research indicating that a focus on alphabetics (code
emphasis
in Jeanne Chall's terms) with adults with low literacy produced better
learning outcomes than some other, perhaps whole language (meaning
emphasis
in Jeanne Chall's  terms) approach. But I have found no  such research.
No
such research is cited on the STAR web site, and the report on
principles
of adult reading instruction that is mentioned does not include any such
research, either.

The evidence that the STAR web site mentions also includes "professional
wisdom," however no citation of professional wisdom is given. I have
looked
at historical approaches to teaching adults to read to find professional
wisdom in using either code or meaning emphases. Cora Wilson Stewart in
1911 and beyond did not like the alphabetics approach and clearly stated
that adults should be taught using the "word' approach. Reports of her
work
indicate that more than 180,000 adults learned to read following her
"whole
language" approach. But in World War I, J. Duncan Spaeth took a strong
phonics approach to teaching reading to soldiers. Then in World War II,
Paul Witty took a strong "word", "whole language" approach, and indeed
teachers in Special Training Units got demerits if they emphasized
phonics
too much. It is reported that over a quarter million soldiers learned to
read using this meaning emphasis approach.

Septima Poinsette Clark favored a whole language approach in teaching
some
10,000 teachers to teach 700,000 adults to read and write to vote in the
early civil rights movement. Frank Laubach strongly favored a code
emphasis
while Ruth Colvin, founder of Literacy Volunteers of America  favored a
whole language approach (interestingly, Laubach and Colvin have merged
into
one organization, ProLiteracy Worldwide).

This type of variable historical data on professional wisdom, and the
lack
of any solid research that I have found on the relative effectiveness
with
adults of the code or meaning emphases leaves me without any good data
to
help make decisions about the use of these two approaches. I know that
Jeanne Chall favored the code approach in her clinical work but her
reported gains did not seem to be much better, if at all better, than
what
other adult literacy programs reported. As I read the STAR web page, it
appears that the STAR approach has been developed in large part by
former
students of Jeanne at Harvard.

It seems to me that the evidence base for the effectiveness of the STAR
approach to adult literacy education is lacking, in both professional
wisdom and scientific research. This suggests that the national
dissemination effort funded by the federal government is premature. I
think
that before such an expensive (over $31,400 for 45 adult educators to
learn
the STAR approach) national dissemination effort is undertaken there
should
be research conducted to show that the STAR approach is more effective
than
other approaches to teaching reading with adults.

Too often national efforts by the federal government have been
undertaken
and millions of dollars have been spent to disseminate the efforts, only
to
see them fade away with little apparent long-lasting improvement to the
Adult Education and Literacy System (AELS) of the United States. Will
STAR
go this way, too?

Whatever happened to the Adult Performance Level (APL) project?
Whatever happened to the Equipped for the Future (EFF) project?

Are we about to be STAR struck?

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valey View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Feb 20 10:03:17 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 10:03:17 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 662] Guest Moderator on Family Literacy Discussion List
Message-ID: <01b001c75500$4148f5d0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The following post is from Gail Price, Moderator of the Family Literacy
Discussion List.  If you are interested in this discussion and are not a
member of the list, you can subscribe to the list at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Familyliteracy

*******

Don Seaman, Ph.D., will join the Family Literacy Discussion List as
guest moderator next Tuesday and Wednesday, February 27 and 28. His
topic will be evaluation-expected outcomes and intended audiences. 

Dr. Seaman is a Professor Emeritus and former Research Scientist,
College of Education, Texas A&M University. He and his wife, Anna,
provide technical assistance and evaluation services to a number of Even
Start family literacy programs in Texas.

His own professional research focuses on (1) the impact, both
short-range and long-range, of family literacy programs upon the lives
of families who participate in them, and (2) the return on investment
from Even Start family literacy in Texas. He has collaborated with Texas
LEARNS in two recent research studies that documented the positive
impact of the Even Start family literacy program on participating
parents and children in Texas.

Other of Dr. Seaman's accomplishments include

*        Served as a consultant/evaluator for projects involving family
literacy, adult education, workforce literacy programs, and for the
Barbara Bush-Texas initiative.

*        Consulted with adult and family literacy projects in Australia,
Canada, The Peoples' Republic of China, Ecuador, England, Germany,
Kenya, Mexico, Peru, Scotland, Sri Lanka, and Zimbabwe.

*        Founded the Texas Center for the Advancement of Literacy and
Learning (TCALL) at Texas A&M. TCALL is a self-supporting center for
adult and family literacy that houses various externally-funded
projects.

*        Elected the first sole president of the American Association
for Adult and Continuing Education in 1984.

*        Completed a five-month professional internship at the National
Center for Family Literacy during which he evaluated, through on-site
research, the Kenan Model for Family Literacy in 1991. That model is
utilized in many family literacy programs throughout the U.S.

*        Taught, with his wife, what is believed to have been one of the
first graduate courses in family literacy in the U.S. in spring 1992.

*        Inducted into the International Adult and Continuing Education
Hall of Fame in 1998.

 
If you are not a subscriber to the Family Literacy Discussion List and
would like to join to be part of the Don Seaman discussion, please click
on the following link and follow the directions for subscribing.

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Familyliteracy

Gail J. Price

Multimedia Specialist

National Center for Family Literacy

325 W. Main Street, Suite 300

Louisville, KY 40202

gprice at famlit.org

502 584-1133, ext. 112

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Feb 20 15:23:10 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 15:23:10 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 663]  STAR Struck
Message-ID: <022301c7552c$f0ffdad0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The following is from Tom Sticht, in response to James Austin's post
from earlier today.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

******

Colleagues: I am not surprised to find those who have worked on the STAR
project offering testimonials as to how it has benefited them and others
they have worked with. I recall a product called Hooked on Phonics that
had
numerous testimonials on radio and TV about how it worked for them and
others they knew. But  it was eventually driven into bankruptcy by the
federal government's FCC because it did not have solid research to
support
the many testimonials.  This bias in favor of a program frequently
happens
when people participate in some educational endeavor and it is one of
the
reasons that solid research is needed to ferret out what the actual
value
of the endeavor is.

I am a bit more puzzled why there is not more concern about
the fact that the STAR program was not tested in solid research before
going national. For one thing, NCSALL, the organization that had the
primary
role in bringing forth the products being disseminated by the STAR
program
has been at the forefront of those calling for evidence-based adult
literacy education. So to find that the government that funds the NCSALL
thinks it is OK to depend upon K-12 based research rather than
adult-based research in support of the STAR program is troubling.

Also, contrary to what many may think, there is
not universal agreement on how children learn to read. Reports from the
National Reading Panel and elsewhere that have made claims about the
so-called "components" of reading have been challenged by many reading
professionals (see Jim Trelease's web site:
www.trelease-on-reading.com/whatsnu_nrp_ssr.html for instance). So it is
not clear that there is solid knowledge about how children learn to read
to
be applied to adult literacy education.

All this movement to spread STAR across the nation, at a charge of over
$31,000 for 45 teachers, when there is no evidence-base behind it is
also
disconcerting because the so-called 'components" of reading are not
there.
Contrary to what is claimed, comprehension, for instance, is not a
component of reading, it is a product of language processing, prior
knowledge, and thinking. All that can be and is done by oral language
with
no reading. Further, vocabulary is also a component of language, not
reading. And fluency is not a component of reading but rather a quality
of
a reading performance. There is no "fluency" to be taught. Fluency must
develop through extensive practice. It can even be argued that fluency
does
not aid comprehension, but rather that comprehension aids fluency.

So if the federal government is going to insist that all of us in the
field
provide evidence-based instruction, shouldn't the same federal
government
provide the necessary research to support the efficacy of the STAR
program
as a more effective approach to teaching reading with (not TO) adults
before it goes national? As things stand now, the STAR program is not so
much a part of the federal government's evidence-based education
initiatives as it is its faith-based initiatives.
Tom Sticht

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Feb 20 16:35:57 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 16:35:57 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 664]  Discussion on FOB list: Transitions
Message-ID: <022e01c75537$1c2ad5c0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:  the following discussion will take place on the Focus on
Basics Discussion List.  To subscribe go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Focusonbasics.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

************************************

February 26 - March 2

Transition from GED to Postsecondary Education

This will focus on the results of a study by NCSALL researcher John
Tyler of Brown University and colleague Magnus Lofstrom of the
University of Texas at Dallas. The study found a low rate of enrollment
in postsecondary education among GED holders as compared with high
school graduates, and is described in Tyler's article in FOB 8C, "Is the
GED an Effective Route to Postsecondary Education?". Barbara Garner,
editor of Focus on Basics, will introduce the findings, and then Cynthia
Zafft, Director of the National College Transitions Network, and Sandy
Goodman, Director, New England College Transition Project
at World Education, Inc. will discuss promising strategies that are
being done to address this issue.

Recommended Reading:

Is the GED an Effective Route to Postsecondary Education?
A Conversation with John Tyler
by Barbara Garner
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1155

Recognizing that high school is not enough, growing numbers of adult
basic education programs (ABE) are emphasizing the transition to
postsecondary education. What impact does earning a certificate of
General Educational Development (GED) have on the post secondary
enrollment of high school dropouts? Brown University professor and
NCSALL researcher John Tyler and a colleague, Magnus Lofstrom of the
University of Texas at Dallas, examined this question using data from
Texas. Focus on Basics asked John Tyler to summarize the results and
discuss the questions they raise.

Focus on Basics, Transitions Issue (6D)
http://www.ncsall.net/index.php?id=154  
This contains several articles about different aspects of transitions.

Guest Speakers:

Barb Garner was the editor of all 31 issues of "Focus on Basics", and
co-author with Sara Fass of "Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices
about the GED and Your Future." Having studied statistics with
researcher John Tyler, she enjoys working with him to make sure his
research findings reach the adult basic education community.

Cynthia Zafft, MA, is the director of the National College Transition
Network (NCTN), a network to support ABE staff, programs, and state
programs in establishing and strengthening ABE-to-college transition
services through technical assistance, professional development,
collegial sharing, advocacy and increased visibility for this critical
sector of the adult basic education system.  Prior to coming to World
Education, Cynthia coordinated several federally-funded postsecondary
education transition projects for the Institute for Community Inclusion
(ICI) at the University of Massachusetts at Boston.  The ICI is part of
a national network of university-affiliated centers that offers
training, conducts research, and provides assistance to organizations to
promote inclusion of people with disabilities in school, work, and
community activities.

Sandy Goodman has been the Director of the New England College
Transition Project at the New England Literacy Resource Center/World
Education since November 2006. Prior to joining the College Transitions
team, she directed a career ladders project under the Skillworks
initiative called Partnership for
Automotive Career Education (PACE) and facilitated collaboration between
community based organizations, post-secondary and secondary education
institutions, and private sector employers. Before PACE, she directed a
community based ABE program in Boston that served approximately 400
people each year, and was also active in a number of city and statewide
planning and advocacy efforts. She has a BA in Women's Studies/Social
Thought and Political Economy from UMass, Amherst and an MPA from the
Kennedy School of Government.
When: Feb.26-March 2.

Julie McKinney
Discussion List Moderator
World Education/NCSALL
jmckinney at worlded.org

From DHohmann at hays489.k12.ks.us  Thu Feb 22 12:49:52 2007
From: DHohmann at hays489.k12.ks.us (Hohmann Donna)
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:49:52 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 665] Re: Discussion on FOB list: Transitions
Message-ID: <290F26CA9AF6094AAD7DEC91ECA7F44404595939@exchange.Internal.Hays489.k12.ks.us>

I definitely would see how there would be less students with a GED in
postsecondary education than there are high school graduates.  One of
the greatest high school dropout factors according to research is
whether or not a student sees a connection between what they are
learning in school and life after school (such as a school to career
goal).  Therefore, effective career counseling and academic counseling
where students can learn the requirements of entering a postsecondary
education, options of financial aid, various careers at different levels
of training and education, etc. is necessary to promote students staying
in school and entering postsecondary environments.  Another obvious
factor is that often students who have left high school did not feel
comfortable in the school environment and/or did not feel successful.
Many of those students take a brief GED prep class, take the test, and
pass, and never attain any type of counseling services about future
options for education.  If students did not feel comfortable in high
school it is very imaginable that they might fear returning to a school
environment.  However, there are many strong vocational postsecondary
programs that do not utilize the traditional school type setting and/or
teaching approaches that many students who left high school might find
very rewarding and beneficial.  There needs to be a way to encourage and
promote these students to consider this type of training as a vital
option.  Many technical programs result in salaries that are often
stronger than some bachelor degree programs.  Technical skills often
bring increased job security.  

Donna Hohmann,
School Counselor, NCC

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 3:36 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 664] Discussion on FOB list: Transitions

Colleagues:  the following discussion will take place on the Focus on
Basics Discussion List.  To subscribe go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Focusonbasics.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

************************************

February 26 - March 2

Transition from GED to Postsecondary Education

This will focus on the results of a study by NCSALL researcher John
Tyler of Brown University and colleague Magnus Lofstrom of the
University of Texas at Dallas. The study found a low rate of enrollment
in postsecondary education among GED holders as compared with high
school graduates, and is described in Tyler's article in FOB 8C, "Is the
GED an Effective Route to Postsecondary Education?". Barbara Garner,
editor of Focus on Basics, will introduce the findings, and then Cynthia
Zafft, Director of the National College Transitions Network, and Sandy
Goodman, Director, New England College Transition Project
at World Education, Inc. will discuss promising strategies that are
being done to address this issue.

Recommended Reading:

Is the GED an Effective Route to Postsecondary Education?
A Conversation with John Tyler
by Barbara Garner
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1155

Recognizing that high school is not enough, growing numbers of adult
basic education programs (ABE) are emphasizing the transition to
postsecondary education. What impact does earning a certificate of
General Educational Development (GED) have on the post secondary
enrollment of high school dropouts? Brown University professor and
NCSALL researcher John Tyler and a colleague, Magnus Lofstrom of the
University of Texas at Dallas, examined this question using data from
Texas. Focus on Basics asked John Tyler to summarize the results and
discuss the questions they raise.

Focus on Basics, Transitions Issue (6D)
http://www.ncsall.net/index.php?id=154  
This contains several articles about different aspects of transitions.

Guest Speakers:

Barb Garner was the editor of all 31 issues of "Focus on Basics", and
co-author with Sara Fass of "Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices
about the GED and Your Future." Having studied statistics with
researcher John Tyler, she enjoys working with him to make sure his
research findings reach the adult basic education community.

Cynthia Zafft, MA, is the director of the National College Transition
Network (NCTN), a network to support ABE staff, programs, and state
programs in establishing and strengthening ABE-to-college transition
services through technical assistance, professional development,
collegial sharing, advocacy and increased visibility for this critical
sector of the adult basic education system.  Prior to coming to World
Education, Cynthia coordinated several federally-funded postsecondary
education transition projects for the Institute for Community Inclusion
(ICI) at the University of Massachusetts at Boston.  The ICI is part of
a national network of university-affiliated centers that offers
training, conducts research, and provides assistance to organizations to
promote inclusion of people with disabilities in school, work, and
community activities.

Sandy Goodman has been the Director of the New England College
Transition Project at the New England Literacy Resource Center/World
Education since November 2006. Prior to joining the College Transitions
team, she directed a career ladders project under the Skillworks
initiative called Partnership for
Automotive Career Education (PACE) and facilitated collaboration between
community based organizations, post-secondary and secondary education
institutions, and private sector employers. Before PACE, she directed a
community based ABE program in Boston that served approximately 400
people each year, and was also active in a number of city and statewide
planning and advocacy efforts. She has a BA in Women's Studies/Social
Thought and Political Economy from UMass, Amherst and an MPA from the
Kennedy School of Government.
When: Feb.26-March 2.

Julie McKinney
Discussion List Moderator
World Education/NCSALL
jmckinney at worlded.org

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From DHohmann at hays489.k12.ks.us  Thu Feb 22 12:54:03 2007
From: DHohmann at hays489.k12.ks.us (Hohmann Donna)
Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2007 11:54:03 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 666] Re: STAR Struck
Message-ID: <290F26CA9AF6094AAD7DEC91ECA7F4440459593B@exchange.Internal.Hays489.k12.ks.us>

As a parent whose child has been evaluated multiple times using the STAR
reading program and participating in AR, I question the validity of the
STAR program, because her scores seems to bounce around significantly
from one test session to the next.  It's a nice screening instrument,
but I surely would not make major judgments using only it.  

Donna Hohmann
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2007 2:23 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 663] STAR Struck

Colleagues,

The following is from Tom Sticht, in response to James Austin's post
from earlier today.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

******

Colleagues: I am not surprised to find those who have worked on the STAR
project offering testimonials as to how it has benefited them and others
they have worked with. I recall a product called Hooked on Phonics that
had
numerous testimonials on radio and TV about how it worked for them and
others they knew. But  it was eventually driven into bankruptcy by the
federal government's FCC because it did not have solid research to
support
the many testimonials.  This bias in favor of a program frequently
happens
when people participate in some educational endeavor and it is one of
the
reasons that solid research is needed to ferret out what the actual
value
of the endeavor is.

I am a bit more puzzled why there is not more concern about
the fact that the STAR program was not tested in solid research before
going national. For one thing, NCSALL, the organization that had the
primary
role in bringing forth the products being disseminated by the STAR
program
has been at the forefront of those calling for evidence-based adult
literacy education. So to find that the government that funds the NCSALL
thinks it is OK to depend upon K-12 based research rather than
adult-based research in support of the STAR program is troubling.

Also, contrary to what many may think, there is
not universal agreement on how children learn to read. Reports from the
National Reading Panel and elsewhere that have made claims about the
so-called "components" of reading have been challenged by many reading
professionals (see Jim Trelease's web site:
www.trelease-on-reading.com/whatsnu_nrp_ssr.html for instance). So it is
not clear that there is solid knowledge about how children learn to read
to
be applied to adult literacy education.

All this movement to spread STAR across the nation, at a charge of over
$31,000 for 45 teachers, when there is no evidence-base behind it is
also
disconcerting because the so-called 'components" of reading are not
there.
Contrary to what is claimed, comprehension, for instance, is not a
component of reading, it is a product of language processing, prior
knowledge, and thinking. All that can be and is done by oral language
with
no reading. Further, vocabulary is also a component of language, not
reading. And fluency is not a component of reading but rather a quality
of
a reading performance. There is no "fluency" to be taught. Fluency must
develop through extensive practice. It can even be argued that fluency
does
not aid comprehension, but rather that comprehension aids fluency.

So if the federal government is going to insist that all of us in the
field
provide evidence-based instruction, shouldn't the same federal
government
provide the necessary research to support the efficacy of the STAR
program
as a more effective approach to teaching reading with (not TO) adults
before it goes national? As things stand now, the STAR program is not so
much a part of the federal government's evidence-based education
initiatives as it is its faith-based initiatives.
Tom Sticht

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From aalba1 at cox.net  Sun Feb 25 08:40:10 2007
From: aalba1 at cox.net (AL)
Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 08:40:10 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 667]  Maintaining Our Instructional Role
Message-ID: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKOELLCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>

Dear Educators and Correctional Professionals,

I am involved in a correctional educators' class examining models of
teaching, classroom instruction, and instructional practices.  Using
computers and other types of instructional devices in a multi-level
classroom can effect an instructor's role.  As a member of educated
professionals we are wondering if you could provide a response to the
following question:

How  do we maintain our instructional role in a multi-level classroom using
computers/instructional materials/instructional practices  ?

              Thanks In Advance For Your Feedback,  Sincerely, Albert Alba,
Jr, PhD.

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Sun Feb 25 11:43:30 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2007 11:43:30 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 668]  Online Prof Dev course
Message-ID: <009501c758fc$15584de0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The following opportunity from Tom Sticht for an on-line course of self
study in ABE may be of interest to many of you on the List.  

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

**********

February 23, 2007

Adult Education and Literacy in the United States:
A Syllabus and Resources for an Online Course of Self-Study

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Each year many people start work in adult education and literacy
development
without much background in the field. Others who have worked in the
field
for a while may wish to deepen their knowledge of the field. To give
people
a chance to learn more about the field and its history, policies,
practices
and issues that it deals with I have developed this syllabus for
self-study. It provides guidance to 12 reports of mine which are
available
for free downloading online. Reading one report a week will provide a
one
semester, 12 week course of self-study. Except for number 1.1, these
resources are located online at www.nald.ca at the Library pages for the
site. To find any of these resources search the NALD Library pages using
Sticht for my last name, or google my name and the title of the report.

Syllabus and Resources

Part 1: History of and Perspective on the Adult Education and Literacy
System (AELS) of the United States

1.1. The Rise of the Adult Education and Literacy System in the United
States: 1600-2000. [ A 400 year history of activities leading to the
Adult
Education Act of 1966 and the emergence of the present day AELS with
organizations and individuals involved in this rise. Online at
www.ncsall.net/?id=576].

1.2. Beyond 2000: Future Directions for Adult Education.  [Looks at
social,
demographic, science, economic and technology trends with implications
for
the AELS; examines government and legislative trends with implications
for
the future of the AELS.]

1.3. The  Adult Education  and Literacy System (AELS) in the United
States:
Moving From the Margins to the Mainstream of Education. [Includes the
growing value of the Adult Education  and Literacy System (AELS)  in the
new millennium; value of AELS for improving adults' and children's
health,
learning and schooling; need for mainstreaming the AELS in U.S.
education;
strengthening the AELS.]

Part 2. Testing, Assessment, and Accountability in the AELS.

2.1. Adult Literacy in the United States: A Compendium of Quantitative
Data
With Interpretive Comments.  [Presents a developmental theory of
literacy
and history of and items from standardized tests in the U.S. including
military tests from World War I to 1990s and all mass literacy tests for
adults from 1930s to the National Adult Literacy Survey (NALS) of 1993,
which is similar to the NAAL of 2003. Presents data on relationships of
parents education to the literacy of their children; relationships of
adult literacy to occupations; and samples of pre- and post-test gains
for
over 30 programs, including longitudinal growth curves for some
programs.]

2.2. Accountability in Adult Literacy Education: Focus on Workplace
Literacy
Resources for Program Design, Assessment, Testing, & Evaluation.
[Provides
knowledge resources for designing, delivering and evaluating workplace
literacy programs; discusses testing and accountability in adult
literacy
programs in the Workforce Education Act of 1998 still in effect as of
2007;
determining how many adults are lacking in workforce literacy: the
national
and international adult literacy surveys.]

Part 3. Curriculum Theory With Case Studies Illustrating Applications to
Adult Education and Literacy Programs.

3.1. Functional Context Education: Making learning relevant (1997
edition).
[Eight chapters including The Power of Adult Literacy Education; Some
Challenges of Diversity for Adult Literacy Education. Views On
Contemporary
Cognitive Science; Introduction to Functional Context Education;
Functional
Context Education and Literacy Instruction; and four case studies in
applying Functional Context Education to the design of programs that
integrate (or embed, contextualize) basic skills and vocational or
parenting education. (workplace literacy, family literacy).]

3.2. Functional Context Education: Making Learning Relevant in the 21st
Century (2005 edition). [Functional Context Education (FCE) materials
available online in several nations; the Adult Literacy and Life skills
(ALL) survey, National Adult Assessment of Literacy (NAAL) survey; FCE
in
historical perspective, (1860-Present) including Paulo Freire and
Learner
Centered, Participatory Literacy Education. Methodologies used in adult
literacy research for determining what is relevant to youth and adult
learners; five case studies illustrating the application of FCE in
parenting, vocational training, and health literacy.]

Part 4. Listening and Reading Theory and Practice With  Adult Learners

4.1. Auding and Reading: A Developmental Model. [This is the first book
applying modern cognitive science to oracy (listening to and speaking
language) and its transfer to literacy development with children and
adults. It presents an early version of Gough's "simple model of
reading"
stating that Reading=Decoding+Comprehension (measured by listening). It
provides an extensive review of research on language development,
relationships of listening to reading, and the evaluation of four
hypotheses
derived from the simple model presented in the book.

4.2. Teaching Reading With Adults. [This paper discusses literacy as the
mastery of graphics technology. It shows how the basic elements of the
graphic medium - its relative permanence, its ability to be arrayed in
space, and its use of the properties of light - work together to permit
literates to generate (write) and access (read) massive collections of
knowledge; to analyze and synthesize discrete information into coherent
bodies of knowledge, and to perform complex procedures with accuracy and
efficiency.

4.3. Seven Pioneering Adult Literacy Educators in the History of
Teaching
Reading With Adults in the United States.  [Throughout the 20th century
both Synthetic and Analytic methods of teaching reading were favored by
different adult literacy educators. Favoring the Synthetic or "code"
methods are Harriet A. Jacobs, J. Duncan Spaeth  and Frank Laubach.
Favoring the Analytic or "meaning making " methods are Cora Wilson
Stewart, Paul Witty, Francis P. Robinson, and Septima Poinsette Clark.
This
paper discusses teaching innovations introduced by each of these
pioneers in
adult literacy education.]

5. Policy Papers

5.1. Toward a Multiple Life Cycles Education Policy: Investing in the
Education of Adults to Improve the Educability of Children. [This paper
argues for education policy that recognizes that literacy is transferred
across generations from parents to their children. Therefore, we need to
have a much larger investment in the education of youth and adults who
are
parents or who will be parents. Adult literacy education affects
multiple
life cycles. An extensive review is presented of research on early
childhood education, relationships of parent's education to children's
literacy, parenting and preschool effectiveness, and other issues.]

5.2 Reforming Adult Literacy Education: Transforming Local Programs Into
National Systems In Canada, the United Kingdom & the United States.
[Activities are underway in these three nations for transforming adult
literacy education from a variety of disparate programs into organized
systems of education for adults. Activities include:1. Scale of Need:
determining how many adults are in need of adult basic skills education.
2.
Access to Provision: determining how many adults are aware of, have
access
to and enroll in adult literacy education provision. 3. Nature of
Provision: determining the nature of the delivery system of adult
literacy
provision. 4. Quality of Provision: determining the need for improved
quality. 5. Accountability of Provision: improving methods for
determining
student learning and other outcomes.]

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Feb 26 08:55:33 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 08:55:33 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 669]  IEPs at the ALE Wiki
Message-ID: <00fe01c759ad$c9505d90$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:
 
I just wanted to let you know that the samples of IEPs/ILPs/ISPs that
folks shared during our classroom assessment discussion are now
formatted in PDF and available for your use at the ALE Wiki.
 
Go to the Formative Assessment section of the Assessment area at:
http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Formative_Assessment
 
and click on "IEPs and ILPs" - the PDF files are at the bottom of that
page.
 
If anyone has more to add, I would love to help you out!!  Contact me if
you have further resources to share.  
 
As always:  if you do use any of the materials at the ALE Wiki - please
drop me a note and let me know what you used and how you used it.  
 
Thanks!!!
 
marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Mon Feb 26 15:39:41 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 12:39:41 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 670] Re: Maintaining Our Instructional Role
In-Reply-To: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKOELLCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>
References: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKOELLCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E592@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

How do we maintain our instructional role in a multi-level classroom
using computers/instructional materials/instructional practices ?

I haven't noticed that computer assisted instruction changes my role;
instead it gives me more time for one on one and less need for long
lectures.  It also gives students who are homebound some options for
interaction.  Some students love working on computers and some can't
stand it.  CAI does help with computer skills a bit too and increases
computer comfort.
va

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of AL
Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2007 5:40 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 667] Maintaining Our Instructional Role

Dear Educators and Correctional Professionals,

I am involved in a correctional educators' class examining models of
teaching, classroom instruction, and instructional practices.  Using
computers and other types of instructional devices in a multi-level
classroom can effect an instructor's role.  As a member of educated
professionals we are wondering if you could provide a response to the
following question:

How  do we maintain our instructional role in a multi-level classroom
using
computers/instructional materials/instructional practices  ?

              Thanks In Advance For Your Feedback,  Sincerely, Albert
Alba,
Jr, PhD.

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Mon Feb 26 11:00:39 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 11:00:39 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 671]  PASSING THE TORCH: CAAL's ESL Report Released
Message-ID: <373E4887-9F3B-4058-A31E-0A090F3D33B4@caalusa.org>

New York, NY  (February 26, 2007) -- The Council for Advancement of  
Adult Literacy today released PASSING THE TORCH: Strategies for  
Innovation in Community College ESL. This 153 page report is the  
result of two years of intensive work by a research team from the  
five colleges studied in the project and by the project's study and  
research directors: Dr. Forrest P. Chisman of CAAL and Dr. JoAnn  
Crandall of the University of Maryland (Baltimore County).  Drs.  
Chisman and Crandall bring vast prior ESL experience to the study.  
The highly textured report contains extensive descriptions of  
exemplary ESL programs and practices in use at five institutions --  
all nominated by a national cadre of their peers -- Bunker Hill  
Community College (Charlestown, MA), City College of San Francisco  
(San Francisco, CA), College of Lake County (Grayslake, IL), Seminole  
Community College (Sanford, FL), and Yakima Valley Community College  
(Yakima, WA).

Primary funding for the project came from The William and Flora  
Hewlett Foundation. Supplemental support was given by the Ford  
Foundation, The McGraw-Hill Companies, the Dollar General  
Corporation, and Harold W. McGraw, Jr.

The study examines a rich variety of innovative and successful  
programs and strategies in use in the institutions, with a focus on  
non-credit ESL services. It concentrates on generating learning  
gains, retaining students, and bringing about transititons to future  
education. The report is for written for both designers of community  
college ESL service and policymakers and private funders. Among the  
effective strategies looked at are high intensity instruction,  
learning outside the classroom, and the use of "learner-centered  
thematic" curricular. Special attention is given to curricular  
integration, co-enrollment, vocational ESL (VESL) programs, and the  
Spanish GED. Issues of faculty training, development, and quality are  
examined, and recommendations are given for 'engineering innovation'  
in ESL colleges and programs. A main section of the report deals with  
costs and funding issues, and calls for substantially greater and  
more targeted funding for adult ESL.

A standalone Executive Summary of the report is available at the CAAL  
website (www.caalusa.org). The full report is attached (including the  
Executive Summary as an appendix item) It is also available at the  
CAAL website. It will be easily accessible to persons with a high  
speed Internet connection. It is also available at cost ($20 plus  
postage, prepaid) by regular mail directly from CAAL  
(bheitner at caalusa.org). Multiple copies (10 or more) will be eligible  
for a discount.

VERY LONG DOCUMENT (2.2 MB)

PERSONS WITH A LOW-SPEED CONNECTION MAY WISH TO FOREGO THE DOWNLOAD  
AND ORDER A HARD COPY FROM CAAL AS PER ABOVE INSTRUCTIONS.

?

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From hulc5651 at utica.edu  Mon Feb 26 14:46:02 2007
From: hulc5651 at utica.edu (Caryn Hulchanski)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 14:46:02 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 672]  Handwritng
Message-ID: <f589840a4143.45e2f2aa@utica.edu>

I am a student at Utica College in New York and three of my classmates and I are beginning a research project on the handwriting legibility of immigrants/refugees prior to entering the education program at the local refugee center.  We are in the process of writing our literature review and are looking for any and all information on handwriting assessments for adults.

Thank you so much,
Caryn Hulchanski
hulc5651 at utica.edu

From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Mon Feb 26 17:21:17 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 15:21:17 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 673] Re: Maintaining Our Instructional Role
In-Reply-To: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E592@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
References: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKOELLCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>,
	<D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E592@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Message-ID: <OFD439B592.3D865E2D-ON0725728E.007ACCA8-0725728E.007ACCA9@yc.edu>

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From bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net  Tue Feb 27 00:12:23 2007
From: bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net (Bonnie Odiorne)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 21:12:23 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Assessment 674] Re: Online Prof Dev course
Message-ID: <20070227051223.43212.qmail@web83313.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

Is there a cost, grading, or CEUs associated with this course. It souds wonderful, even though I'm currently not in an adult education program per se, but a lot of our college students are under prepared; there's a huge skills gap that faculty initiatives are beginning to address; if anyone has any research related not just to "multi-level" but more like "differentiated"--in terms of metacognitive skills levels in "being a good student," being intrinsically motivated, as well as more measurable "conventional" skills. We're trying to add to a college success seminar for freshmen a lot of self-assessment in "soft skills" and align them with college success and career success. 

----- Original Message --
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2007 11:43:30 AM
Subject: [Assessment 668] Online Prof Dev course

Colleagues,

The following opportunity from Tom Sticht for an on-line course of self
study in ABE may be of interest to many of you on the List.  

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

**********

February 23, 2007

Adult Education and Literacy in the United States:
A Syllabus and Resources for an Online Course of Self-Study

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Each year many people start work in adult education and literacy
development
without much background in the field. Others who have worked in the
field
for a while may wish to deepen their knowledge of the field. To give
people
a chance to learn more about the field and its history, policies,
practices
and issues that it deals with I have developed this syllabus for
self-study. It provides guidance to 12 reports of mine which are
available
for free downloading online. Reading one report a week will provide a
one
semester, 12 week course of self-study. Except for number 1.1, these
resources are located online at www.nald.ca at the Library pages for the
site. To find any of these resources search the NALD Library pages using
Sticht for my last name, or google my name and the title of the report.

Syllabus and Resources

Part 1: History of and Perspective on the Adult Education and Literacy
System (AELS) of the United States

1.1. The Rise of the Adult Education and Literacy System in the United
States: 1600-2000. [ A 400 year history of activities leading to the
Adult
Education Act of 1966 and the emergence of the present day AELS with
organizations and individuals involved in this rise. Online at
www.ncsall.net/?id=576].

1.2. Beyond 2000: Future Directions for Adult Education.  [Looks at
social,
demographic, science, economic and technology trends with implications
for
the AELS; examines government and legislative trends with implications
for
the future of the AELS.]

1.3. The  Adult Education  and Literacy System (AELS) in the United
States:
Moving From the Margins to the Mainstream of Education. [Includes the
growing value of the Adult Education  and Literacy System (AELS)  in the
new millennium; value of AELS for improving adults' and children's
health,
learning and schooling; need for mainstreaming the AELS in U.S.
education;
strengthening the AELS.]

Part 2. Testing, Assessment, and Accountability in the AELS.

2.1. Adult Literacy in the United States: A Compendium of Quantitative
Data
With Interpretive Comments.  [Presents a developmental theory of
literacy
and history of and items from standardized tests in the U.S. including
military tests from World War I to 1990s and all mass literacy tests for
adults from 1930s to the National Adult Literacy Survey (NALS) of 1993,
which is similar to the NAAL of 2003. Presents data on relationships of
parents education to the literacy of their children; relationships of
adult literacy to occupations; and samples of pre- and post-test gains
for
over 30 programs, including longitudinal growth curves for some
programs.]

2.2. Accountability in Adult Literacy Education: Focus on Workplace
Literacy
Resources for Program Design, Assessment, Testing, & Evaluation.
[Provides
knowledge resources for designing, delivering and evaluating workplace
literacy programs; discusses testing and accountability in adult
literacy
programs in the Workforce Education Act of 1998 still in effect as of
2007;
determining how many adults are lacking in workforce literacy: the
national
and international adult literacy surveys.]

Part 3. Curriculum Theory With Case Studies Illustrating Applications to
Adult Education and Literacy Programs.

3.1. Functional Context Education: Making learning relevant (1997
edition).
[Eight chapters including The Power of Adult Literacy Education; Some
Challenges of Diversity for Adult Literacy Education. Views On
Contemporary
Cognitive Science; Introduction to Functional Context Education;
Functional
Context Education and Literacy Instruction; and four case studies in
applying Functional Context Education to the design of programs that
integrate (or embed, contextualize) basic skills and vocational or
parenting education. (workplace literacy, family literacy).]

3.2. Functional Context Education: Making Learning Relevant in the 21st
Century (2005 edition). [Functional Context Education (FCE) materials
available online in several nations; the Adult Literacy and Life skills
(ALL) survey, National Adult Assessment of Literacy (NAAL) survey; FCE
in
historical perspective, (1860-Present) including Paulo Freire and
Learner
Centered, Participatory Literacy Education. Methodologies used in adult
literacy research for determining what is relevant to youth and adult
learners; five case studies illustrating the application of FCE in
parenting, vocational training, and health literacy.]

Part 4. Listening and Reading Theory and Practice With  Adult Learners

4.1. Auding and Reading: A Developmental Model. [This is the first book
applying modern cognitive science to oracy (listening to and speaking
language) and its transfer to literacy development with children and
adults. It presents an early version of Gough's "simple model of
reading"
stating that Reading=Decoding+Comprehension (measured by listening). It
provides an extensive review of research on language development,
relationships of listening to reading, and the evaluation of four
hypotheses
derived from the simple model presented in the book.

4.2. Teaching Reading With Adults. [This paper discusses literacy as the
mastery of graphics technology. It shows how the basic elements of the
graphic medium - its relative permanence, its ability to be arrayed in
space, and its use of the properties of light - work together to permit
literates to generate (write) and access (read) massive collections of
knowledge; to analyze and synthesize discrete information into coherent
bodies of knowledge, and to perform complex procedures with accuracy and
efficiency.

4.3. Seven Pioneering Adult Literacy Educators in the History of
Teaching
Reading With Adults in the United States.  [Throughout the 20th century
both Synthetic and Analytic methods of teaching reading were favored by
different adult literacy educators. Favoring the Synthetic or "code"
methods are Harriet A. Jacobs, J. Duncan Spaeth  and Frank Laubach.
Favoring the Analytic or "meaning making " methods are Cora Wilson
Stewart, Paul Witty, Francis P. Robinson, and Septima Poinsette Clark.
This
paper discusses teaching innovations introduced by each of these
pioneers in
adult literacy education.]

5. Policy Papers

5.1. Toward a Multiple Life Cycles Education Policy: Investing in the
Education of Adults to Improve the Educability of Children. [This paper
argues for education policy that recognizes that literacy is transferred
across generations from parents to their children. Therefore, we need to
have a much larger investment in the education of youth and adults who
are
parents or who will be parents. Adult literacy education affects
multiple
life cycles. An extensive review is presented of research on early
childhood education, relationships of parent's education to children's
literacy, parenting and preschool effectiveness, and other issues.]

5.2 Reforming Adult Literacy Education: Transforming Local Programs Into
National Systems In Canada, the United Kingdom & the United States.
[Activities are underway in these three nations for transforming adult
literacy education from a variety of disparate programs into organized
systems of education for adults. Activities include:1. Scale of Need:
determining how many adults are in need of adult basic skills education.
2.
Access to Provision: determining how many adults are aware of, have
access
to and enroll in adult literacy education provision. 3. Nature of
Provision: determining the nature of the delivery system of adult
literacy
provision. 4. Quality of Provision: determining the need for improved
quality. 5. Accountability of Provision: improving methods for
determining
student learning and other outcomes.]

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
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From NAASLN at aol.com  Mon Feb 26 23:03:47 2007
From: NAASLN at aol.com (NAASLN at aol.com)
Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2007 23:03:47 EST
Subject: [Assessment 675] NAASLN at COABE! Students with Special Needs
	Sessions
Message-ID: <bd1.e8d9cec.331507a3@aol.com>

The National Association for Adults with Special Learning Needs is pleased to 
be partnering with COABE at the national conference in Philadelphia.   This 
year NAASLN will offer two half day pre-conference sessions and, through out 
the conference, a full strand of workshops directed at expanding participants' 
information concerning the adults they serve with special learning needs.

The pre-conferences will focus on both the theoretical and practical.   Dr. 
Melissa Arnott will present ?Transitioning Students with Special Learning Needs 
into Post Secondary Programs, Vocational Training, and Employment? and Robyn 
A. Rennick will focus on teaching techniques for developing more effective 
study techniques.   

The NAASLN strand throughout the conference will consist of 9 workshop 
sessions addressing teaching techniques (writing skills, memory tools), special 
areas (serving offenders, dyslexia, ESOL, mental health issues) and increasing 
productivity for adults with special learning needs (building persistence, 
mentoring, accommodations).

**************************************
 AOL now offers free email to everyone. 
 Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com.
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From christig at learninglabinc.org  Tue Feb 27 12:52:14 2007
From: christig at learninglabinc.org (Christi Graff)
Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2007 10:52:14 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 676] Re: Maintaining Our Instructional Role
In-Reply-To: <AMEHIOFADIDNDJIFDGKKOELLCAAA.aalba1@cox.net>
Message-ID: <DIEJIBCDHFDDFODDKAHKCEINCLAA.christig@learninglabinc.org>

Dr. Alba,
At our community-based literacy center, we see our teachers
having a facilitator role rather than a traditional
instructional role.  We prefer our teachers to be "the guide
at the side" rather than "the sage on stage".  Our classes
are staffed by a paid teacher and 2 or 3 trained volunteer
tutors.  We allow our computer programs to "lead" the
instruction because it enables our teachers and tutors to
provide remediation and enhancement to each student.  We
also keep our classes small - 12-14 students - and do some
small group work so each student usually works with a
teacher or tutor nearly every class.
Christi Graff
Education Director
Learning Lab, Inc.
Boise, Idaho

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of AL
Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2007 6:40 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 667] Maintaining Our Instructional Role

Dear Educators and Correctional Professionals,

I am involved in a correctional educators' class examining
models of
teaching, classroom instruction, and instructional
practices.  Using
computers and other types of instructional devices in a
multi-level
classroom can effect an instructor's role.  As a member of
educated
professionals we are wondering if you could provide a
response to the
following question:

How  do we maintain our instructional role in a multi-level
classroom using
computers/instructional materials/instructional practices  ?

              Thanks In Advance For Your Feedback,
Sincerely, Albert Alba,
Jr, PhD.

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please
go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Feb 28 14:33:30 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2007 14:33:30 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 677]   Re: Online Prof Dev course cost, CEUs, etc.
Message-ID: <02e301c75b6f$54503ab0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

I asked Tom to respond to Bonnie's question about cost and grades, etc.
for the course:

Regarding the self-study course, there is no cost, no grades, and no
CEUs from me, though any institution or organization that wants to give
some credits can feel free to do so. 

Tom Sticht

>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Bonnie Odiorne
> Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2007 12:12 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 674] Re: Online Prof Dev course
>
> Is there a cost, grading, or CEUs associated with this course. It
souds
> wonderful, even though I'm currently not in an adult education program
> per se, but a lot of our college students are under prepared; there's
a
> huge skills gap that faculty initiatives are beginning to address; if
> anyone has any research related not just to "multi-level" but more
like
> "differentiated"--in terms of metacognitive skills levels in "being a
> good student," being intrinsically motivated, as well as more
measurable
> "conventional" skills. We're trying to add to a college success
seminar
> for freshmen a lot of self-assessment in "soft skills" and align them
> with college success and career success.
> ----- Original Message --
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov
> Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2007 11:43:30 AM
> Subject: [Assessment 668] Online Prof Dev course
> Colleagues,
>
> The following opportunity from Tom Sticht for an on-line course of
self
> study in ABE may be of interest to many of you on the List.
>
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> **********
>
> February 23, 2007
>
> Adult Education and Literacy in the United States:
> A Syllabus and Resources for an Online Course of Self-Study
>
> Tom Sticht
> International Consultant in Adult Education
>
> Each year many people start work in adult education and literacy
> development
> without much background in the field. Others who have worked in the
> field
> for a while may wish to deepen their knowledge of the field. To give
> people
> a chance to learn more about the field and its history, policies,
> practices
> and issues that it deals with I have developed this syllabus for
> self-study. It provides guidance to 12 reports of mine which are
> available
> for free downloading online. Reading one report a week will provide a
> one
> semester, 12 week course of self-study. Except for number 1.1, these
> resources are located online at www.nald.ca <http://www.nald.ca/>  at
> the Library pages for the
> site. To find any of these resources search the NALD Library pages
using
> Sticht for my last name, or google my name and the title of the
report.
>
> Syllabus and Resources
>
> Part 1: History of and Perspective on the Adult Education and Literacy
> System (AELS) of the United States
>
> 1.1. The Rise of the Adult Education and Literacy System in the United
> States: 1600-2000. [ A 400 year history of activities leading to the
> Adult
> Education Act of 1966 and the emergence of the present day AELS with
> organizations and individuals involved in this rise. Online at
> www.ncsall.net/?id=576].
>
> 1.2. Beyond 2000: Future Directions for Adult Education.  [Looks at
> social,
> demographic, science, economic and technology trends with implications
> for
> the AELS; examines government and legislative trends with implications
> for
> the future of the AELS.]
>
> 1.3. The  Adult Education  and Literacy System (AELS) in the United
> States:
> Moving From the Margins to the Mainstream of Education. [Includes the
> growing value of the Adult Education  and Literacy System (AELS)  in
the
> new millennium; value of AELS for improving adults' and children's
> health,
> learning and schooling; need for mainstreaming the AELS in U.S.
> education;
> strengthening the AELS.]
>
> Part 2. Testing, Assessment, and Accountability in the AELS.
>
> 2.1. Adult Literacy in the United States: A Compendium of Quantitative
> Data
> With Interpretive Comments.  [Presents a developmental theory of
> literacy
> and history of and items from standardized tests in the U.S. including
> military tests from World War I to 1990s and all mass literacy tests
for
> adults from 1930s to the National Adult Literacy Survey (NALS) of
1993,
> which is similar to the NAAL of 2003. Presents data on relationships
of
> parents education to the literacy of their children; relationships of
> adult literacy to occupations; and samples of pre- and post-test gains
> for
> over 30 programs, including longitudinal growth curves for some
> programs.]
>
> 2.2. Accountability in Adult Literacy Education: Focus on Workplace
> Literacy
> Resources for Program Design, Assessment, Testing, & Evaluation.
> [Provides
> knowledge resources for designing, delivering and evaluating workplace
> literacy programs; discusses testing and accountability in adult
> literacy
> programs in the Workforce Education Act of 1998 still in effect as of
> 2007;
> determining how many adults are lacking in workforce literacy: the
> national
> and international adult literacy surveys.]
>
> Part 3. Curriculum Theory With Case Studies Illustrating Applications
to
> Adult Education and Literacy Programs.
>
> 3.1. Functional Context Education: Making learning relevant (1997
> edition).
> [Eight chapters including The Power of Adult Literacy Education; Some
> Challenges of Diversity for Adult Literacy Education. Views On
> Contemporary
> Cognitive Science; Introduction to Functional Context Education;
> Functional
> Context Education and Literacy Instruction; and four case studies in
> applying Functional Context Education to the design of programs that
> integrate (or embed, contextualize) basic skills and vocational or
> parenting education. (workplace literacy, family literacy).]
>
> 3.2. Functional Context Education: Making Learning Relevant in the
21st
> Century (2005 edition). [Functional Context Education (FCE) materials
> available online in several nations; the Adult Literacy and Life
skills
> (ALL) survey, National Adult Assessment of Literacy (NAAL) survey; FCE
> in
> historical perspective, (1860-Present) including Paulo Freire and
> Learner
> Centered, Participatory Literacy Education. Methodologies used in
adult
> literacy research for determining what is relevant to youth and adult
> learners; five case studies illustrating the application of FCE in
> parenting, vocational training, and health literacy.]
>
> Part 4. Listening and Reading Theory and Practice With  Adult Learners
>
> 4.1. Auding and Reading: A Developmental Model. [This is the first
book
> applying modern cognitive science to oracy (listening to and speaking
> language) and its transfer to literacy development with children and
> adults. It presents an early version of Gough's "simple model of
> reading"
> stating that Reading=Decoding+Comprehension (measured by listening).
It
> provides an extensive review of research on language development,
> relationships of listening to reading, and the evaluation of four
> hypotheses
> derived from the simple model presented in the book.
>
> 4.2. Teaching Reading With Adults. [This paper discusses literacy as
the
> mastery of graphics technology. It shows how the basic elements of the
> graphic medium - its relative permanence, its ability to be arrayed in
> space, and its use of the properties of light - work together to
permit
> literates to generate (write) and access (read) massive collections of
> knowledge; to analyze and synthesize discrete information into
coherent
> bodies of knowledge, and to perform complex procedures with accuracy
and
> efficiency.
>
> 4.3. Seven Pioneering Adult Literacy Educators in the History of
> Teaching
> Reading With Adults in the United States.  [Throughout the 20th
century
> both Synthetic and Analytic methods of teaching reading were favored
by
> different adult literacy educators. Favoring the Synthetic or "code"
> methods are Harriet A. Jacobs, J. Duncan Spaeth  and Frank Laubach.
> Favoring the Analytic or "meaning making " methods are Cora Wilson
> Stewart, Paul Witty, Francis P. Robinson, and Septima Poinsette Clark.
> This
> paper discusses teaching innovations introduced by each of these
> pioneers in
> adult literacy education.]
>
> 5. Policy Papers
>
> 5.1. Toward a Multiple Life Cycles Education Policy: Investing in the
> Education of Adults to Improve the Educability of Children. [This
paper
> argues for education policy that recognizes that literacy is
transferred
> across generations from parents to their children. Therefore, we need
to
> have a much larger investment in the education of youth and adults who
> are
> parents or who will be parents. Adult literacy education affects
> multiple
> life cycles. An extensive review is presented of research on early
> childhood education, relationships of parent's education to children's
> literacy, parenting and preschool effectiveness, and other issues.]
>
> 5.2 Reforming Adult Literacy Education: Transforming Local Programs
Into
> National Systems In Canada, the United Kingdom & the United States.
> [Activities are underway in these three nations for transforming adult
> literacy education from a variety of disparate programs into organized
> systems of education for adults. Activities include:1. Scale of Need:
> determining how many adults are in need of adult basic skills
education.
> 2.
> Access to Provision: determining how many adults are aware of, have
> access
> to and enroll in adult literacy education provision. 3. Nature of
> Provision: determining the nature of the delivery system of adult
> literacy
> provision. 4. Quality of Provision: determining the need for improved
> quality. 5. Accountability of Provision: improving methods for
> determining
> student learning and other outcomes.]
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Mar  1 13:40:43 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2007 13:40:43 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 678]  Update on speaking schedule
Message-ID: <03cb01c75c31$1f134d20$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:  The following announcement is from Tom Sticht.

**********

Update on speaking engagements for 2007.

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

For those who have contacted me to find out if, when, and where I might
be
speaking in their area the following shows where I am presently
scheduled
to be in 2007.

1. [completed] January 21-28, 2007: Dublin, Ireland, four presentations
for
the National Adult Literacy Agency (NALA). Contact: Bnichinneide at nala.ie

2. March 4, 2007: Orlando, Florida. National Family Literacy Conference
concurrent session. Contact: Shannon Baete (sbaete at famlit.org)

3. March 8, 2007: Springfield, Illinois. IACEA annual conference keynote
and
two breakout sessions. Contact: Laura Bercovitz
(lbercovitz at thecenterweb.org)

4. March 26, 2007: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. COABE conference network
luncheon and a breakout session. Contact: www.coabe.org information on
the
2007 conference.

5. June 11 2007: Fayetteville, Arkansas - Keynote for the South Central
Literacy Action Conference. Contact: Kerri Miles
(kerri-woklearn at sbcglobal.net)

6. August 1-3, 2007: North Carolina Community College Basic Skills
Conference. Contact: Karen Brown (kbrown at nccommunitycolleges.edu)

7. December 11-13, 2007: Phoenix, Arizona, Arizona Adult Education State
Conference. Contact: James Roe (james.roe at az.ed.gov)

I always enjoy meeting folks from various discussion lists at these
presentations and have a chance to put faces with names. I look forward
to
seeing many of you at one or more of these sessions. Thanks for your
interest.

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Mar  2 13:00:40 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2007 13:00:40 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 679]  New study: "Adult Education in America"
Message-ID: <048801c75cf4$b0edab50$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:
 
The following information comes from Jackie Taylor, Moderator of the
Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List (subscribe at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Professionaldevelopment)
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
******
 
Below is information on a new study from the Office of Vocational and
Adult Education (OVAE), the Educational Testing Services (ETS), and the
National Center for Education Statistics. 
>From OVAE's "Thursday Notes:"
Adult Education in America, a new study funded by OVAE, was released by
the Educational Testing Service (ETS) February 27, providing a
comprehensive picture of federally supported adult education activities
in the U.S.  Data from more than 6,000 adult learners in 1,200 programs
nationwide revealed that a large share of learners demonstrated skills
in the lowest level on proficiency scales.  This is the first nationally
representative study of learners and programs using comparable measures
to assess participants' literacy and numeracy skills.  The survey is the
first allowing researchers to compare adult education students' skills
to those of the general adult population.  The study also marks the
first time a large-scale measure of literacy skills was conducted in
both Spanish and English.  An interactive data tool also is available.
Get the study and tool at  http://www.ets.org 
Abstract and Full Report of the Adult Education Program Survey (AEPS):
 
<http://www.ets.org/portal/site/ets/menuitem.c988ba0e5dd572bada20bc47c39
21509/?vgnextoid=f52a51bf36dd0110VgnVCM10000022f95190RCRD&vgnextchannel=
6773e3b5f64f4010VgnVCM10000022f95190RCRD>
http://www.ets.org/portal/site/ets/menuitem.c988ba0e5dd572bada20bc47c392
1509/?vgnextoid=f52a51bf36dd0110VgnVCM10000022f95190RCRD&vgnextchannel=6
773e3b5f64f4010VgnVCM10000022f95190RCRD 
Or try:  <http://tinyurl.com/3y8ps7> http://tinyurl.com/3y8ps7 
Literacy Tool from ETS:
<http://www.ets.org/portal/site/ets/menuitem.c988ba0e5dd572bada20bc47c39
21509/?vgnextoid=249eaf5e44df4010VgnVCM10000022f95190RCRD&vgnextchannel=
6773e3b5f64f4010VgnVCM10000022f95190RCRD>
http://www.ets.org/portal/site/ets/menuitem.c988ba0e5dd572bada20bc47c392
1509/?vgnextoid=249eaf5e44df4010VgnVCM10000022f95190RCRD&vgnextchannel=6
773e3b5f64f4010VgnVCM10000022f95190RCRD 
Or try: 
 <http://tinyurl.com/yt2lg3> http://tinyurl.com/yt2lg3 
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From mdaniels at proliteracy.org  Mon Mar  5 11:49:50 2007
From: mdaniels at proliteracy.org (mdaniels)
Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 11:49:50 -0500 
Subject: [Assessment 680] Accountability training: applications due March 16
Message-ID: <221E918332E818488687199E5CBD74CE05E5D747@keats.proliteracy.org>

Dear Colleague, 
 
ProLiteracy is pleased to announce that the first of three trainings being
produced through the Dollar General/ProLiteracy Performance Accountability
Initiative will be presented in six cities this spring: 
-- Santa Ana, CA   April 16-17
-- St. Paul, MN    April 23-24
-- Knoxville, TN   April 30-May 1
-- Houston, TX     May 3-4
-- Hartford, CT    May 7-8
-- Portland, OR    May 10-11
 
The nine-hour training on Data Collection and Management will help programs
identify their accountability system gaps while it shares promising
practices related to:
-- assessment
-- data collection
-- data storage and retrieval
-- building a culture of accountability and improvement within the program
 
Much of the content of the training is drawn from exemplary literacy and
adult education programs across the country.
 
Programs that participate in the training will be asked to implement one or
more of the promising practices over the nine months following the training.
Participating programs will share their challenges, experiences, and
successful strategies as part of the print pieces that ProLiteracy will
distribute nationally at the end of the project. Stipends of $750 and $1500
are available to support two levels of program participation in the project.
 
If you are interested in attending Data Collection and Management, please
request the application and guidelines via e-mail to info at proliteracy.org. 
 
To be considered for participation, your program must submit its completed
application via e-mail (snail mail or faxes CANNOT be accepted) by March 16,
2007. Up to 120 programs will be selected and invited to send two people
from each program to the training. 
 
For more information about Data Collection and Management or about the
initiative in general, please contact me at mdaniels at proliteracy.org.  
 
If you know of other programs that may be interested in this training
opportunity, please share this message with them.
 
Thank you,
 
Melanie Daniels, Project Manager
ProLiteracy America
mdaniels at proliteracy.org

From kabeall at comcast.net  Thu Mar  8 14:39:03 2007
From: kabeall at comcast.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2007 14:39:03 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 681]  New from NCSALL
Message-ID: <00e301c761b9$6ee16de0$0202a8c0@your4105e587b6>

The Relationship of the Component Skills of Reading to IALS Performance:
Tipping Points and Five Classes of Adult Literacy Learners 

By John Strucker, Kentaro Yamamoto, and Irwin Kirsch 

As its title indicates, this study's aim was to understand the relationship
of the component skills of reading, such as word recognition, vocabulary,
and spelling, to large-scale measures of literacy, such as the 1992 National
Adult Literacy Survey (NALS) (Kirsch, Jungleblut, Jenkins, & Kolstad, 1993)
and the closely related International Adult Literacy Survey (IALS)
(Tuijnman, 2001).

To download the report, go to the NCSALL Web site:
http://www.ncsall.net/index.php?id=29#29

 

 

****************

Kaye Beall

World Education

4401 S. Madison St.

Muncie, IN  47302

Tel: 765-717-3942

Fax: 617-482-0617

kaye_beall at worlded.org

http://www.worlded.org

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Mar 12 13:45:38 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 13:45:38 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 682]  Education, Skills, Lost Wages
Message-ID: <015c01c764ce$4035d9a0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The following post is from Tom Sticht.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

**********

March 10, 2007

Higher Education Credentials, Higher Skills, and Lost Purchasing Power:
A Dilemma for Workforce Development Policy and Practice

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Not long ago the thinking in the Adult Education and Literacy System
(AELS)
of the United States was that adults with literacy skills below the high
school level and who lacked a high school diploma could enter into ABE
(adult basic education), learn enough to work up to ASE (adult secondary
education), and then study hard to get a high school diploma or General
Educational Development (GED) certificate. That was the end of the
education provision in the AELS. In effect, this sequence of ABE to ASE
to
"graduation" was meant to replicate the K-12 system of the public
schools
for children. In ABE the adults got primary school and middle school
education (completion of the 8th grade) then in ASE they got secondary
(high) school education (9th to 12th grades) and then they graduated
from
high school or its "equivalent" in the case of the GED.

In the last few years this view of the AELS has changed. In many
programs it
is no longer considered sufficient for the AELS to provide a K-12
"equivalency" education and provide a high school diploma or GED
certificate. Instead, many are calling for the AELS to provide a college
preparatory education so that AELS students can get their HS diploma or
GED
and then qualify for and transition into college, and acquire a two- or
four-year college degree.

The reason generally stated for wanting to shift the goal of the AELS
from
the terminal GED to the "transitional" GED is because some labor market 
analysts think it is necessary for adults to have post-secondary
education
and a higher education degree of some kind to earn enough to be
self-sufficient in today's economy. For adults to meet college entry
requirements means that they must perform well above the minimal passing
scores for the GED, which have typically been set ".so that about
one-third
of the norming sample would not meet the passing threshold" (Tyler,
2005, p.
47). In this case, the "norming sample" refers to high school students
who
took the GED as part of its development.

The Education/Literacy Skill Trade-Off

The idea that one needs a higher education degree to be successful in
today's labor market economy is complicated by the findings by Kirsch,
Braun, Yamamoto, &  Sum (2007) of the Educational Testing Service. They
present data showing that the mean weekly earnings of U. S. full-time
employed adults ages 16 and older vary by both education level and Prose
literacy level as measured by the National Adult Literacy Survey (NALS)
of
1992.

Interestingly, some adults with two year college degrees were earning
$386
weekly while some other adults with only 9-12 years of education, and no
high school diploma, earned $414 weekly. So in this case adults with
less
education earned more than those with two year degrees. Why? The two
year
degree holders were in NALS literacy level 1, the lowest level of
literacy,
while those with less than a high school education were in NALS literacy
level 3, the mid-level of literacy for adults in the NALS. Here, then,
having a higher level of literacy was more important than having
completed
high school and gone on to post-secondary education and getting a two
year
college degree. Skill and not education credentials appear to be the
factor
producing higher income here.

On the other hand, some adults at NALS literacy level 4, the next to the
highest level of literacy, earned $493 weekly, while some at NALS level
1
earned $586 weekly. Why? The level 4 literates had only a high school
diploma while the level 1 literates had somehow acquired four year or
higher education degrees. So a higher education degree for those near
the
bottom of the literacy scale can offset the benefits of having literacy
skills near the top of the scale for those without a higher education
degree. Degrees and not skills seem to be in play here.

Real Income and Education Credentials

Barton (2000) reported that more people have completed high school and
acquired some college over the last quarter century yet real hourly
wages
(i.e., adjusted for inflation)  for both men and women with less than
high
school, high school, and some college have declined. For men, even
college
graduate's real hourly wages declined 4 percent, while for women they
increased. Only for those with advanced degrees have real hourly wages
increased for both men and women (p. 34).

Kirsch, Braun, Yamamoto, & Sum (2007) present data showing that in
constant
2005 dollars ("real income") the mean lifetime earnings of 18 to 64 year
old males in the United States has declined from 1979 to 2004, except
for
those with a Master's Degree or higher. For those men without a high
school
diploma or GED, the drop in lifetime earnings was -39 percent, for those
with a high school diploma but no college, the decline was -29 percent,
for
those with 1-3 years of college, including an Associate's Degree the
decline
was -13 percent and for those with a Bachelor's degree the decline was
-1.2
percent. For those with a Master's degree, the increase from 1979 to
2004
was +15 percent (Table A12 p. 31).

These data suggest that if more and more men attain higher levels of
education, then in wages adjusted for annual inflation from 1979, there
is
likely to be an additional drop in the lifetime wages for men with
education up through a Bachelor's degree. Following this trend, if more
and
more men attain a Master's degree, then we should observe a decline in
the
inflation adjusted wages for those men with Master's degrees in the
coming
years. Presumably, as Barton's (2000) report suggests, as more and more
women acquire higher education degrees this will eventually have some
deleterious effect on women's real income at higher education levels,
too.

These kinds of trade-offs among skills and credentials and their effects
on
income call for caution in our approach to workforce development
policies
and practices. We need to make certain that our educational efforts lead
to
both better skills and higher education credentials for maximum returns
on
investments in education. But we also need to be concerned that by
enlarging the pool of both a better educated and more highly literate
workforce, there are real increases in the economic purchasing power for
those who make a considerable investment of time and effort in achieving
both higher credentials and higher skills. Otherwise we run the risk of
seeing more and more highly educated and skilled citizens without the
capacity for self-sufficiency nor the sustainability of the means of
providing not just for themselves but also for their families.

We are presently in the United Nation's Decade of Sustainable
Development
and the United Nation's Decade of Literacy.

References

Barton, P. (2000, January). What Jobs Require: Literacy, Education, and
Training, 1940-2006. Princeton, NJ: Educational Testing Service

Kirsch, I., Braun, H., Yamamoto, K., &  Sum, A. (2007, January).
America's
Perfect Storm: Three Forces Changing Our Nation's Future. Princeton, NJ:
Educational Testing Service.

Tyler, J. (2005). The General Educational Development (GED) Credential:
History, Current Research, and Directions for Policy and Practice. In:
Comings, J., Garner, B., & Smith, C. (Eds.). Review of Adult Learning
and
Literacy: Volume 5. Mahwah, NJ: Lawrence Erlbaum Associates, Publishers.

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92109-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Mar 13 10:37:16 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2007 10:37:16 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 683] Call for articles: Taking Action to Stay in Class
Message-ID: <020401c7657d$196d2850$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The following announcement is from Silja Kallenbach, of the New England
Literacy Resource Center.  This issue of the Change Agent could be of
interest to some of you on the List.  The issue of persistence is
directly affected by assessment.  Some of the motivators that help
students stay in class include:  good diagnostic and on-going
assessments that can provide formative information for both the teacher
and student; processes and activities for helping students identify
their goals for coming to class; classroom structures that allow
students to watch their progress toward their goals; classroom tools,
such as rubrics, that allow students to take command of their own
learning.

Perhaps some of you might be interested in writing or being a committee
member for this issue.  

Also, I would be interested in hearing what types of assessment-related
activities you do in your programs and classrooms that speak to the
issue of student persistence.

Thanks!

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

****************

Hello,
The theme of the fall 2007 issue of The Change Agent is Taking Action to
Stay in Class.  Unlike the many wonderful writings on learner
persistence that are already available from NCSALL and elsewhere, this
issue of The Change Agent is about the external challenges (working too
hard, health issues, lack of transportation or child care) that make it
hard to keep coming to class and the ways that students are taking
leadership to address those difficulties. I hope this angle resonates
with some you and your students and that you will consider responding.  

Perhaps you are interested in serving on the editorial board for this
issue? If so, let me know. I've attached a description of what that
involves. The first meeting will be scheduled for late March/early
April. 

Please circulate this call for articles for the next issue of The Change
Agent to other adult educators and students. It is attached in two
formats. 
Thank you!
Silja 

*********************************************
Silja Kallenbach, Director
New England Literacy Resource Center
World Education
44 Farnsworth Street
Boston, MA 02210
tel. 617-482-9485
fax. 617-482-0617
skallenbach at worlded.org
www.nelrc.org

Get free resources about ABE/ESOL-to-college transitions at
www.collegetransition.org 
Teach critical thinking  with The Change Agent, a social justice
publication for the adult education community, available at
www.nelrc.org/changeagent

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From mdaniels at proliteracy.org  Wed Mar 14 13:43:50 2007
From: mdaniels at proliteracy.org (mdaniels)
Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2007 12:43:50 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 684] Accountability training opportunity - March 16
	application deadli	ne
Message-ID: <221E918332E818488687199E5CBD74CE05E5D7B7@keats.proliteracy.org>

Dear Colleague, 
 
If you are planning to submit an application to participate in Data
Collection and Management, the first of three trainings being produced
through the Dollar General / ProLiteracy Performance Accountability
Initiative, please remember that the application deadline is this Friday,
March 16.

The training will be presented in six cities this spring:
-- Santa Ana, CA - April 16-17
-- St. Paul, MN - April 23-24
-- Knoxville, TN - April 30-May 1
-- Houston, TX - May 3-4
-- Hartford, CT - May 7-8
-- Portland, OR - May 10-11

The nine-hour training on Data Collection and Management will help programs
identify their accountability system gaps while it shares promising
practices related to:
-- assessment
-- data collection
-- data storage and retrieval
-- building a culture of accountability and improvement within the program
 
Much of the content of the training is drawn from exemplary literacy and
adult education programs across the country.

Programs that participate in the training will be asked to implement one or
more of the promising practices over the nine months following the training.
Participating programs will share their challenges, experiences, and
successful strategies as part of the print pieces that ProLiteracy will
distribute nationally at the end of the project. Stipends of $750 and $1500
are available to support two levels of program participation in the project;
there is no fee for the training.
 
If you are interested in attending Data Collection and Management, please
request the application guidelines and form via e-mail to
mdaniels at proliteracy.org. 
 
To be considered for participation, your program must submit its completed
application via e-mail (snail mail or faxes CANNOT be accepted) by March 16,
2007, to the e-mail address given above. Up to 120 programs will be selected
and invited to send two people from each program to the training. 
 
For more information about Data Collection and Management or about the
initiative in general, please contact me at the e-mail address given above.

 
If you know of other programs that may be interested in this training
opportunity, please share this message with them.
 
Thank you,
 
Melanie Daniels, Project Manager
Dollar General/ProLiteracy Performance Accountability Initiative
ProLiteracy Worldwide
mdaniels at proliteracy.org
http://www.proliteracy.org

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Mar 15 10:06:17 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 10:06:17 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 685] FW: [FocusOnBasics 809] FOB Article-of-the-Week:
	Project-Based Learning and the GED
Message-ID: <03b801c7670b$1a4b9290$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The following discussion is just getting started on the FOB Discussion
List.  To subscribe, go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/focusonbasics

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

**********

Hi Everyone,

This week's FOB Article-of-the-Week speaks to several questions we have
touched on lately: project-based learning, how to maintain an
instructional role in individualized-style classes, how to help students
actually learn the material (and the soft skills) instead of just trying
to pass the test, and creating a thirst for knowledge. It is from issue
2B, which is all about the GED.

Project-Based Learning and the GED
by Anson M. Green
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=408

This is an account of one teacher's journey using amibitious and
effective student-based projects within his GED class. He was able to
blend the GED skills work with these exciting projects, which inspired
the students to gain confidence, motivation and workforce skills along
with the test skills, and at the same time connect with their community
in a meaningful way. There are resources listed at the end.

I apologize for the typos in the online version. (Hint: often the "fi"
in a word is missing, e.g. "nd"=find, and "ve"= five. Sorry!)

Click on the "Student Stories" link at the very bottom of the article
for examples of the student presentations that were part of this
project!

Please read this and tell the list what you think. Has anyone else out
there used the Project FORWARD life skills curriculum, or something
similar? What experiences have others had with project-based learning in
GED programs?

All the best,
Julie

Julie McKinney
Discussion List Moderator
World Education/NCSALL
jmckinney at worlded.org

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Mar 15 10:52:34 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 10:52:34 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 686] Cross-post: innovation in shaping accountability
Message-ID: <03de01c76711$911d9b10$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Good day colleagues, I hope this email finds you well.  
 
I am cross-posting the following 2 emails from the Adult Literacy
Professional Development Discussion List.  The catalyst for this
discussion was not assessment, but rather creativity and innovation in
our work.  This topic prompted the writer to share a rich and detailed
description of how the teachers in her program became centrally involved
in shaping accountability - via classroom, or formative, assessment.
This story is a great example of how a program took the top-down model,
stood it on its head, and made it a bottom-up model.  They appear to
already be reaping the many benefits of this endeavor. 
 
I'm posting it here because I think it's a very inspirational story that
is not just a story - they are doing it.  I also would like to hear what
questions you might have about any of what Bonnita writes.  I'll wager
that there are other programs out there that have done similar things,
or at least pieces of something similar - perhaps not on such a grand
scale.   Ask yourself, "could my program do something like this?  Or a
part of what is described here?"  Why or why not?
 
Let us hear from you.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
From: professionaldevelopment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:professionaldevelopment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Bonnita
Solberg
Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 10:56 PM
To: The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List
Subject: [ProfessionalDevelopment 914] Re: The role of self-study in PD
 
Greetings All:

I have read with interest the discussion on this broad subject of
teacher creativity and innovation.  I find it is a not insurmountable
balance to encourage creativity/innovation while meeting the demands of
funding/accountability.  My belief is that an informed administration
can create a safe and structured space for innovation and creativity to
take root and blossom.  Here is my experience.

Ten years ago, just as research was being published on PD, we began to
hear rumblings about staff meetings and workshops.  Unaware of the
research, separately and then collectively, teachers acknowledged that
while they enjoyed conferences and spending time with colleagues from
other districts, and although they brought home exciting ideas about
methods and processes, they seldom followed through on them.  Staff
meetings were even more problematical--we were being talked at and
encouraged by example and any means at administration's disposal to
complete our paperwork, attend important meetings, be involved in more
PD where we sat and listened but did not implement what we heard. It
soon surfaced that what we wanted was to learn from our colleagues by
example and mentoring, to share ideas and try them out in the classroom,
then come together and share some more.  Administration was reluctant to
use staff meetings for anything other than hammering home our
responsibility with paperwork and deadlines, but they read the research
and were persuaded.

This year for the first time in the 31 years I have worked in Oakland,
the PD retreat weekend two weeks ago was truly run by and for teachers.
There were no outside presenters, no motivational speakers, no long
lists of important program goals.  The theme was selected by teachers at
last year's retreat--ongoing assessment in the classroom.  The
presentations were Poster Boards of our best assessments, made by our
teachers. The next three staff meetings will be devoted to piloting and
amending the assessments we chose at each level, sharing our
experiences, fine tuning them and moving toward an assessment system
program wide.

What could have been resistance to implementation of an imposed
program-wide assessment system was turned round in this safe and
structured space created by a committee of teachers with administrative
guidance in which teachers were leaders.  Creativity and innovation
blossomed.  Teachers gave their experience the highest marks in the 5
year history of OACE retreats. During pre-retreat staff meetings, at
which we broke into small groups, staff commented that at last teachers
were being heard.  And dare I say it, teachers want to attend staff
meetings; attendance is at a record high.  They are willing to take
risks presenting to their colleagues, validated by the knowledge that
their work is appreciated, that it will not be left to melt away but
will flourish in the hands of caring colleagues.

Administration is more than pleased.  Teachers are learning what
constitutes good assessment without being preached to and without the
cost of consultants.  They are being softly persuaded by fellow teachers
to incorporate assessment into their daily practice, assessments that
can be tracked and recorded, that will meet state requirements for
accountability standards that are surely coming.  We are innovators in
the data and funding game, having involved teachers in the design of an
assessment system and by having fostering the leadership skills of
teachers.

An experience of one kind of creativity and innovation as an adult ed
teacher. 

Bonnita Solberg, Teacher on Special Assignment
Oakland Adult and Career Education

******
 
Good Sunny Sunday Afternoon Jackie and All!
I am happy to respond to your request andIwould like to chronicle our
experiences with this innovative PD not only for this list but for my
edification as well.

The planning for this project on assessment in the classroom began a
year ago at an ESL teachers' retreat where teachers were asked what they
wanted to focus on in PD.  28 responses (a majority) out of
approximately 65 were for assessment that would inform decisions to
promote or retain, inform the teacher if they were meeting level
standards and what, if any, adjustments to instruction were needed, and
inform students of their progress.  In focus groups, students had been
asked by outside consultants in their L1 what was working for them in
Oakland Adult and Career Education (OACE) and what could be improved.
One repeated request was to see, not just know, what their progress is
and what was required to move to the next level.  Using this OACE data
as a foundation, 3 committees were formed: Best Practices and Power
Standards run solely by teachers, and Professional Development headed by
an administrator with another administrator as consultant.

Best Practices (BP) committee investigated the best practices of other
districts to determine if there were assessments, curriculum, syllabai,
level standards, that OACE could draw on.  My first request from this
discussion list was to ask for this information from out of state
programs.  Except for a brief response from Texas, no one responded;
perhaps there were too many questions and it was too involved to do so.
We found that the programs we contacted in state had no useful
information to share; in fact, most asked if we would share with them
what we compiled because they also are interested in on going assessment
in the classroom.  I want to stop here to explain that we assess using
CASAS and EL Civics evaluations; however, we are investigating on-going
classroom assessments that evaluate if the student is meeting his/her
goals and if the teacher is teaching to the standards. These are
assessments to be used in the classroom on a daily or weekely basis and
are not required for funding at this time.  The Best Practices committee
had been formed to gather this information so we would not have to
reinvent the wheel of assessment and to guide the PD committee in its
quest to involve teachers in deciding which assessments to use at each
level.  Without any outside information to guide us, we proceeded to
"invent our own assessment wheel."

The Power Standards (PS) committee was charged with setting level
standards:  Literacy, Beginning Low, Beginning High, Intermediate Low
and High combined, and multi level classes.  PS set up an exercise
whereby teachers at each level met during the first PD day of the year
to specify what standards teachers would address at each level, and what
students could expect to be covered at the level as well specifying for
the student what would be expected of them to move to the next level.
The power standards decided upon by the teachers at each level were made
into posters and distributed to each class to reference, daily
hopefully, to guide both instruction and students.  These standards are
under constant scrutiny by teachers and will be revised as needed,
probably by the end of this school year.  The PS are informed by and
meet state standards but are different from the state's.  Each OACE
level has four standards: reading, writing, speaking and listening;
i.e., standards do not address content but language skills.

I should also explain that in Oakland we have both contracted teachers
(about 50 in ESL) and hourly, part time teachers, about 100 in ESL.
Contracted teachers are required to complete 18 hours of PD yearly for
which they are paid on the salary schedule according the numbers of
years of service and education they have.  Hourly part timers are paid a
set rate of $22.45 an hour for participation.  When contract teachers
exceed the 18 hours, they are also paid at this rate.  We do not expect
our teachers to volunteer free for these committees or for participation
in PD.

The PD committee began its work in November, meeting twice monthly for 3
hour sessions.  It took approximately 6 weeks for us to "gel" as a
committee and set up a working process: One participant takes notes on a
laptop that are projected onto the wall, working notes are approved and
changed during the meeting.  This duty is shared by 3 members.  I took
on the task of facilitator.  Teachers are released from their classes
and a substitute provided for participation on the committee, or if not
teaching during those hours, teachers are paid at $22.45 per hour.
Teachers are encouraged to attend as they find time, so although there
is a core of consistent participants, there are also teachers who drop
in as schedules allow.  This can be challenging as we must back track
and cover what we have accomplished for the drop ins, but it is an
important way to educate teachers about the process.

We mounted the retreat I described in the email below and will not
reiterate that here.  During this time (Jan and Feb) we met weekly to
finalize the schedule for the weekend.  After the retreat, we realized
that although teachers want to focus on assessment, many do not know
what constitutes an assessment.  The poster board sessions described
below were actually best practice classroom activities with no way of
recording progress/results to show both students or another teacher to
whom the student may be promoted.  We focused on how to educate teachers
on what constitutes a good assessment without "an instructor" conducting
a class in which teachers listen passively and without giving them
articles to dissect and bring back to the full group as is suggested by
our state CALPRO in service training.  We found a more satisfactory way
than the traditional academic instruction:  Tomorrow at our faculty
meeeting we will break into 7 groups by level (literacy has 3 groups
because they constitute the largest number).  Each group will have a
facilitator who is a PD committee member.  Each participant will be
given a list of questions ("what do I think?") to ask themselves as they
pilot assessments during the following month.  In this manner, we are
educating teachers what constitutes a good assessment.  

I put out my request for information to this list group last weekend
before our committee meeting.  I spent hours on the internet with a lot
of guidance from this list participants and compiled two folders for the
committee members:  1.) What constitutes a good assessment and 2.)
samples of assessment forms.  I gave the full committee the folder on
samples, but not the folder on what constitutes a good assessment.  I
want to stop here to say that we had presented the state standards for
what constitutes a good assessment at the retreat weekend; it was very
academic and required using information gap type of interaction amongst
the participants.  While it guided the selection of what assessments
would be piloted, it did not accomplish the goal of having teachers
select an assessment form that could be used as a record for teacher and
student.  The ESL faculty meeting tomorrow will be solely dedicated to
this task, as will the next two faculty meetings, with a maximum of 10
minutes used for admionistration announcements.

The committee is reluctant to hand out copies of samples of assessment
forms at the faculty meeting because there are many teachers who are not
willing to "interrupt" classroom instruction by using a form to record
their assessments.  We as committee members were continually advising
teachers during their poster making sessions before the retereat (which
they also got paid for) that indeed they do assess, they simply haven't
formalized their assessments into a system and onto paper.  That hurdle
is almost history, but not quite.  Now teachers are faced with the task
of how they can assess daily/weekly without adding more paperwork to
burden their already full schedules.  But the committee is not "doing"
this for the teachers nor is administration forcing it upon them;
rather, the teachers are developing assessment tools they can use
easily.

The other folder, what constitutes a good assessment, was used by the PD
subcommittee that set up the "think it over" sheet for teachers to use
as they pilot their chosen assessments.  I did not hand out that folder
to the full committee because it seemed to overburden them with
"academics and research"; they were not that interested when I presented
it.  I believe the folder on samples of assessment tools will be used
tomorrow at the staff meeting by the facilitators if they need to refer
to them to show teachers the myriad of types of tools.  The groups are
all at different levels in their quest to develop assessment tools.
Some have gone to the heart of the problem and are setting up rubrics.
Others are still struggling with basics:  Do we have to do this?  Is it
being imposed by administration?  How will I have time to do this and
CASAS and EL Civics Evaluations on top of it?  Will the state accept our
assessment tools when it comes time to be accountable to the state, as
we have been told is coming down the road?

I must add that I was the only committee member who researched on the
web or brought this information to the committe, except for our PD
adminsitrator who brought a book on authentic assessment tools (can't
recall the title).  We did not use any research but relied on data
obtained from our faculty members and their professional wisdom to both
start the process and move it along.

Sorry Jackie!  This is longer than I expected but I don't know how to
answer your question in a shorter essay.  I will ask for permission to
post the "think it over" sheet we designed and will also list the
resources I found sometime next week.  Thanks for the words of
encouragement and for the support I have received from all of you, if
not directly, then indirectly as I read all your lists. 

Bonnita Solberg, Teacher on Special Assignment
Oakland Adult and Career Education
     

 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Mar 15 11:16:15 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2007 11:16:15 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 687]  Fluid and Crystallized Literacy
Message-ID: <041001c76714$e09c3950$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The following post is from Tom Sticht.

********

March 13, 2007

Fluid and Crystallized Literacy: Implications for Adult Literacy
Assessment
and Instruction

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Psychometric research on intelligence over the last half century has
resulted in a trend to draw a distinction between the knowledge aspect
and
the processing skills aspects of intelligence. Beginning in the 1940s
and
continuing up to the 1990s, the British psychologist, Raymond B. Cattell
and various collaborators, and later many independent investigators,
made
the distinction between "fluid intelligence" and "crystallized
intelligence." Cattell (1983) states, "Fluid intelligence is involved in
tests that have very little cultural content, whereas crystallized
intelligence loads abilities that have obviously been acquired, such as
verbal and numerical ability, mechanical aptitude, social skills,  and
so
on. The age curve of these two abilities is quite different. They both
increase up to the age of about 15 or 16, and slightly thereafter, to
the
early 20s perhaps. But thereafter fluid intelligence steadily declines
whereas crystallized intelligence stays high" (p. 23).

Cognitive psychologists have re-framed the "fluid" and "crystallized"
aspects of cognition into a model of a human cognitive system made-up of
a
long term memory which constitutes a knowledge base ("crystallized
intelligence") for the person, a working memory which engages various
processes ("fluid intelligence") that are going on at a given time using
information picked-up from both the long term memory's knowledge base
and a
sensory system that picks-up information from the external world that
the
person is in. Today, over thirty years of research has validated the
usefulness of this simple three-part model (long term memory, working
memory, sensory system) as a heuristic tool for thinking about human
cognition (Healy & McNamara, 1996).

The model is important because it helps to develop a theory of literacy
as 
information processing skills (reading as decoding printed to spoken
language)  and comprehension (using the knowledge base to create
meaning)
that can inform  the development of new knowledge-based assessment tools
and new approaches to adult education.

The International Adult Literacy Survey (IALS), the new Adult Literacy
and
Lifeskills (ALL) survey, the National Adult Literacy  Survey (NALS) of
1993
and the new 2003 National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) all used
"real
world" tasks to assess literacy ability cross the life span from 16 to
65
and beyond. Such test items are complex information processing tasks
that
engage unknown mixtures of knowledge and processes. For this reason it
is
not clear what they assess or what their instructional implications are
(Venezky, 1992, p.4).

Sticht, Hofstetter, & Hofstetter (1996) used the simple model of the
human 
cognitive system given above to analyze performance on the NALS. It was 
concluded that the NALS places large demands on working memory processes
("fluid  intelligence").  The decline in fluid intelligence is what may
account for some of the large declines in  performance by older adults
on
the NALS and similar tests. To test this hypothesis, an assessment of
knowledge ("crystallized intelligence") was developed and used to assess
adult's cultural  knowledge of vocabulary, authors, magazines and famous
people. The knowledge  test was administered by telephone and each item
was
separate and required only  a "yes" or "no" answer, keeping the load on
working memory ("fluid  intelligence") very low.

Both the telephone-based knowledge test scores  and NALS door-to-door
survey
 test scores were transformed to standard scores with a mean of 100 and
a 
standard deviation of 15. The results showed clearly that  younger
adults
did  better on the NALS with its heavy emphasis on working memory
processes
("fluid  literacy") and older adults did better than younger adults on
the
knowledge base  ("crystallized literacy") assessment that was given by
telephone.

Consistent with the foregoing theorizing and empirical demonstration,
Tamassia, Lennon, Yamamoto, & Kirsch (2007) report data from a survey of
the literacy skills of adults in the Adult Education and Literacy System
(AELS) of the United States. Once again they found that performance on
the
literacy tasks declined with increased age, that is, the higher the age
of
the adults, the lower their test scores became. They state that, ".the
negative relationship between age and performance is consistent with
findings from previous studies of adults (i.e., IALS, ALL, and NAAL;
NCES
2005; OECD and Statistics Canada 2000, 2005)." They go on to say,
"Explanations of these previous findings have included (a) the effects
of
aging on the cognitive performance of older adults, (b) younger adults
having received more recent and extended schooling, and (c) the finding
that fluid intelligence may decrease with age causing older adults to
have
more difficulties in dealing with complex tasks (Douchemane and Fontaine
2003; OECD and Statistics Canada 2000, 2005)"(p. 107).

Strucker, Yamamoto, & Kirsch (2005) assessed short term, working memory
for
a sample of adults who also completed Prose and Document literacy tasks
from the IALS. They found a positive relationship between performance on
the working memory task and the literacy tasks, showing that adults with
better short term memories performed better on the IALS. Again, this is
consistent with the idea that the literacy tasks involve a complex set
of
skills and knowledge, including the capacity to manage information well
in
working memory or "fluid literacy."

Given the differences between younger and older adults on "fluid
literacy" 
and "crystallized literacy"  there is reason to question the validity of
using  "real world" tasks like those on the Prose, Document and
Quantitative scales of the IALS, ALL, NALS, and  NAAL to represent the
literacy abilities of adults across the life span. In  general, when
assessing the literacy of adults, it seems wise to keep in mind the
differences between short term, working memory or "fluid" aspects of
literacy, such as  fluency in reading with its emphasis upon efficiency
of
processing, and the  "crystallized" or long term memory, knowledge
aspects
of reading.

It is also important to keep in mind these differences between fluid and

crystallized literacy in teaching and learning. While it is possible to
teach  knowledge, such as vocabulary, facts, principles, concepts, and
rules (e.g., Marzano, 2004), it is not  possible to directly teach fluid
processing. Fluidity of information processing, such as fluency in
reading,
cannot be directly taught. Rather, it must be  developed through
extensive,
guided,  practice. Though I know of no research on  this theoretical
framework regarding the differences between fluid and  crystallized
literacy and instructional practices in adult literacy programs, it can
be
hypothesized that all learners are likely to make much faster
improvements
in crystallized literacy than in fluid literacy, and this should be
especially  true for older learners, say those over 45 to 50 years of
age.

References

Cattell, R. (1983) Intelligence and National Achievement. Washington,
DC:
The Cliveden Press.

Healy, A. & McNamara, D. (1996) Verbal Learning and Memory: Does the
Modal
Model Still Work? In J. Spence, J. Darley, & D. Foss (Eds.), Annual
Review
of Psychology, 47,143-172.

Marzano, R. J. (2004, August). Building Background Knowledge For
Academic
Achievement: Research On What Works In Schools. Washington, DC: Assn.
For
Supervision & Curriculum.

Sticht, T., Hofstetter, & Hofstetter (1996) Assessing Adult Literacy By
Telephone. Journal of Literacy Research, 28, 525-559

Strucker, J., Yamamoto, K. & Kirsch, I. (2005, May). The Relationship of
the
Component Skills of Reading to Performance on the International Adult
Literacy Survey (IALS). Cambridge, MA: National Center for the Study of
Adult Learning and Literacy.

Tamassia, C., Lennon, M., Yamamoto, K. & Kirsch, I. (2007). Adult
Education
in America: A First Look at Results From the Adult Education Program and
Learner Surveys. Princeton, NJ: Educational Testing Service.

Venezky, R. (1992, May) Matching Literacy Testing with Social Policy:
What
Are the Alternatives? Philadelphia, PA: National Center on Adult
Literacy.

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: 96190 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Mar 20 14:42:49 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2007 14:42:49 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 688]  COABE sessions announcement
Message-ID: <076901c76b1f$90c27610$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:
 
Attached is a list of the National Institute for Literacy (NIFL) and
LINCS sessions that will be offered next week at COABE in Philadelphia.
If you are going, please consider attending one of these sessions.  We
are extremely interested in getting your feedback and ideas on the
projects that are developed and run by the National Institute for
Literacy, and this would be a great opportunity for this.  
 
There is a session on using research in your practice, as well as
reports by distinguished researchers on their work in adult reading
instruction.
 
One of the sessions will discuss the new Regional Resource Center
Collections that are now being developed.  Some of you may be familiar
with the former version of the Special Collections that were previously
sponsored by the Institute.  This is your opportunity to help shape and
define the content of the Collections - which will be developed and
maintained for your use.
 
In terms of the Discussion Lists, you are a captive audience, but by
your own choice, so you must be getting something useful out of being on
a NIFL List.  We really want to know what that is and how we might be
able to improve the experience for you.  Below is more of a description
of the session on Using the Discussion Lists as Professional
Development.  Ok, it is also meant to entice you.  :-)
 
Looking forward to seeing you at COABE next week.
 
marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
**********
 
Going to COABE this year?  Interested in learning how you can use your
computer for your own and your staff's professional development!?  Then
please join us for our double session:
 
Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Learning: Using the National Institute
for Literacy's Discussion Lists as Professional Development
Presenters:        Jackie Taylor, Adult Literacy Professional
Development List
Daphne Greenberg, Poverty, Race, Women & Literacy Discussion List
Marie Cora, Assessment Discussion List
 
Tuesday, March 27
Salon 3
1:45 p.m. - 3:00 p.m. 
4:15 p.m. - 5:30 p.m. 
 
Why attend?
 
It's a chance to meet 3 NIFL Moderators (and perhaps more!)
It's a chance for us to meet some subscribers
It's a chance for us to get your immediate ideas and feedback on the
NIFL Discussion Lists , how you use them, and how you would like to use
them
 
It's a Double Session!
 
Session I will teach you how to most effectively interface with the
technology so you are adept at using it.  Hands-on opportunities for
customizing subscriptions and interacting with the discussion lists will
be provided.
 
Session II focuses on how you can use the Lists as professional
development.  Tools and strategies will be shared and provided that can
help you develop and carry out your own PD plan - for yourself, or for
staff.
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Mar 20 14:48:59 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2007 14:48:59 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 689]  FW: [AAACE-NLA] query on assessment
Message-ID: <076f01c76b20$6db74000$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,
 
The following email is cross-posted from the NLA Discussion List.  Below
George Demetrion is requesting information on the New Readers Press
Voyager series, and if this might work in conjunction with, for example,
the DAR.
 
Any thoughts or ideas?  Has anyone used the Voyager series?  What do you
think?
 
What about mixing and matching tools?  Does anyone do this without
affecting the integrity of the tools or getting into the syndrome of
"test overkill"?
 
Thanks! and looking forward to your replies,
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
Colleagues,
 
Next fall our program will be implementing the New Readers Press Voyager
series.  This includes a placement assessment that looks like it could
also be used as a pre and post test, similar, perhaps to the LVA created
Read Test.  Currently, in addition to the CASAS pre and post we have
used the DAR for a few years.  In many respects the Voyager Placement is
similar to the DAR, though it has two advantages over it:  the reading
passages are more authentic to adult experience and comprehension
questions are built in even at the lowest levels.
 
>From a purely program perspective I can see several advantages of using
the Voyager over the DAR; as the basis to place students in the
respective groups, to better tie assessment and instruction; the adult
themes of the reading passages, and the emphasis on comprehension at all
levels.  It is a better indicator of our balanced or integrative
approach to literacy whereas the DAR, originated by Jean Chall, is much
more geared to word identification and word meaning
 
Ideally, one could use both.  Practically speaking it would be overkill
whether at intake or at some other time, considering also that our
students take the pre and post CASAS on an annual basis.
 
Here's the question, which, perhaps Marie might also place on the
assessment list--what would be lost and gained by doing so?
 
My take is that what is lost is a well respected assessment in the DAR
that might garner a certain level of public credibility that a
curriculum-based placement test, not designed for a pre and post, but
which could easily fit within such a use.  The gain is a more
authentic-based assessment  based on the curriculum in use.
 
If we were not using CASAS or some other widely recognized assessment I
would be more reluctant to pull the DAR out, which has served us well,
notwithstanding its perhaps overemphasis on phonemic analysis and word
identification.  However, since we do have CASAS, also an assessment at
best only partially tied to our curriculum focus I am inclined to make
the shift, though I am very much seeking the collective wisdom of the
field.
 
I would say, write to me of line, except I think he issue is important
and relevant enough for list-based discusion.
 
George Demetrion
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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Tue Mar 20 14:51:22 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2007 11:51:22 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 690] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] query on assessment
In-Reply-To: <076f01c76b20$6db74000$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <076f01c76b20$6db74000$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C0345E6A1@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

We use Voyager in our class with transition ESL to ABE students.  These
students also participate in group work in math and writing and work in
skills tutor.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, March 20, 2007 11:49 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 689] FW: [AAACE-NLA] query on assessment

 

Colleagues,

 

The following email is cross-posted from the NLA Discussion List.  Below
George Demetrion is requesting information on the New Readers Press
Voyager series, and if this might work in conjunction with, for example,
the DAR.

 

Any thoughts or ideas?  Has anyone used the Voyager series?  What do you
think?

 

What about mixing and matching tools?  Does anyone do this without
affecting the integrity of the tools or getting into the syndrome of
"test overkill"?

 

Thanks! and looking forward to your replies,

 

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 

**********

 

Colleagues,

 

Next fall our program will be implementing the New Readers Press Voyager
series.  This includes a placement assessment that looks like it could
also be used as a pre and post test, similar, perhaps to the LVA created
Read Test.  Currently, in addition to the CASAS pre and post we have
used the DAR for a few years.  In many respects the Voyager Placement is
similar to the DAR, though it has two advantages over it:  the reading
passages are more authentic to adult experience and comprehension
questions are built in even at the lowest levels.

 

>From a purely program perspective I can see several advantages of using
the Voyager over the DAR; as the basis to place students in the
respective groups, to better tie assessment and instruction; the adult
themes of the reading passages, and the emphasis on comprehension at all
levels.  It is a better indicator of our balanced or integrative
approach to literacy whereas the DAR, originated by Jean Chall, is much
more geared to word identification and word meaning

 

Ideally, one could use both.  Practically speaking it would be overkill
whether at intake or at some other time, considering also that our
students take the pre and post CASAS on an annual basis.

 

Here's the question, which, perhaps Marie might also place on the
assessment list--what would be lost and gained by doing so?

 

My take is that what is lost is a well respected assessment in the DAR
that might garner a certain level of public credibility that a
curriculum-based placement test, not designed for a pre and post, but
which could easily fit within such a use.  The gain is a more
authentic-based assessment  based on the curriculum in use.

 

If we were not using CASAS or some other widely recognized assessment I
would be more reluctant to pull the DAR out, which has served us well,
notwithstanding its perhaps overemphasis on phonemic analysis and word
identification.  However, since we do have CASAS, also an assessment at
best only partially tied to our curriculum focus I am inclined to make
the shift, though I am very much seeking the collective wisdom of the
field.

 

I would say, write to me of line, except I think he issue is important
and relevant enough for list-based discusion.

 

George Demetrion

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Mar 20 17:42:46 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 20 Mar 2007 17:42:46 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 691]  Research-based presentations at COABE
Message-ID: <07e501c76b38$b352d800$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hello all,
 
Below are a couple more sessions that might be of interest to those of
you attending COABE in Philadelphia next week.  
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
COABE 2007, Philadelphia
Sheraton Philadelphia City Center Hotel
 
Pre-Conference Presentation, 9AM - 4PM, Sunday, March 25
Title: Authors Present a Close Look At Their Research-Based Resources
for Adult Literacy Instruction: A Project of the NIFL/NCSALL Adult
Literacy Research Working Group John Kruidenier, Mary Ziegler, Rosalind
Davidson, and Susan McShane 
 
Abstract: Authors of three professional development resources will
present in-depth looks at their resources for research-based adult
reading instruction. This will include demonstrations and activities
from an introductory text for teachers, a website, and an assessment of
teacher knowledge. A Resource Guide to government-funded resources will
also be presented.
 
Second presentation:
 
Tuesday, March 27, 1:45 PM - 3:00 PM, Logans 2 
An Update to the NIFL/NCSALL Adult literacy Research Working Group's
Review of Adult Reading Instruction Research: Implications for Practice 
John Kruidenier
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From jataylor at utk.edu  Wed Mar 21 10:58:00 2007
From: jataylor at utk.edu (Taylor, Jackie)
Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2007 10:58:00 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 692] Register now for ProLiteracy's Northwest Regional
	Institute!
Message-ID: <AB226656DDB79D4D82CC03965C5C2ECB0116CD44@UTKFSVS5.utk.tennessee.edu>

Dear List Colleagues:

The following message is posted on behalf of Kathy St. John, Regional
Institute Coordinator for ProLiteracy America. I thought you would be
interested to know that the deadline to apply to participate in the
Dollar General/ProLiteracy Performance Accountability Project has been
extended to March 31,2007. Looks like they have some exciting workshops
lined up for project participants that should be of interest to a broad
audience.

 

Have a great day! Best wishes, Jackie Taylor, Adult Literacy
Professional Development List Moderator, jataylor at utk.edu 

==========================================================

 

Register now for ProLiteracy's Northwest Regional Institute!

 

May 10-11, 2007

 

University Place, Portland, Oregon

(http://www.pdx.edu/cegs/uplace.html)

 

 

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ** * * * * * * * * *
* * * * * * 

 

Featuring two 9-hour, intensive, hands-on workshops:

 

The ABCs of Adult Student Engagement: Active Learning, Building
Community, and Contextualized Instruction

 

Performance Accountability Initiative: Data Collection and Management

The Performance Accountability Initiative is funded by the Dollar
General Literacy Foundation. 

 

Please note: The Performance Accountability Initiative training is part
of the Dollar General/ProLiteracy Performance Accountability Project.
Programs must be accepted as project participants in order to attend.
Contact Melanie Daniels (mdaniels at proliteracy.org) for special
application materials.

 

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * ** * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * 

 

Please visit ProLiteracy's website at

 

www.proliteracy.org/news/index.asp?aid=229 

 

to register and download the Northwest Regional Institute brochure
containing detailed information about the Institute.

 

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * 

 

The deadline to apply to participate in the Dollar General/ProLiteracy
Performance Accountability Project has been extended to March 31,2007.
The deadline to register for the ABCs of Adult Student Engagement is May
1, 2007. The deadline to register for the discounted hotel room rate is
April 27,2007. Space is limited so be sure to register early!

 

 

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * 

 

This professional development opportunity is supported by:

 

Dollar General Literacy Foundation

Anchorage Literacy Project

Literacy Network of Washington

 

 

 

Kathy St. John

Regional Institute Coordinator

ProLiteracy America

 

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Mar 22 14:03:31 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2007 14:03:31 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 693]  Position Announcement
Message-ID: <003d01c76cac$67985640$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Position Announcement
 
Director of the Center for Literacy Studies at The University of
Tennessee
 
The Center for Literacy Studies, located within the College of
Education, Health and Human Sciences at the University of Tennessee -
Knoxville, is seeking a Director to begin August or September, 2007. The
University of Tennessee - Knoxville, the flagship institution of the UT
system, welcomes people of all races, genders, creeds, cultures, and
sexual orientations, and values intellectual curiosity, pursuit of
knowledge, and academic freedom and integrity.
 
The mission of the Center for Literacy Studies is to support and advance
literacy education across the lifespan. The Center conducts research,
professional development, program evaluation and other work within
family, community, and workplace literacy contexts.
 
The Director oversees the work of the Center, raises funds through
grants and contracts, writes grant proposals and develops budgets,
approves expenditures of funds, negotiates subcontracts, hires and
discharges personnel, acts as principal investigator for grants, and
oversees a staff of thirty to assure project work is conducted in
accordance with contractual agreements with outside funders. Working
collaboratively with the Center's Senior Management Team, the Director
develops strategic plans, markets the Center, and integrates work with
the College of Education, Health and Human Sciences.  The Director
oversees a budget that is in excess of $3 million annually.  Currently,
major funders include the National Institute for Literacy, the Tennessee
Department of Labor and Workforce Development, the Tennessee Department
of Education, and the National Science Foundation. 
 
Qualifications.  A Master's degree and a minimum of five years'
management experience, plus at least five years experience in the field
of education and/or adult literacy is required.  Demonstrated success in
developing funding and evidence of strong administrative, interpersonal
and communication skills are also required. A Doctorate, with a working
knowledge of professional development, technology, program evaluation
and curriculum development is preferred. Experience working in a
University setting is desired. Experience in fiscal management,
including grants, contracts and fee for service is desired, along with
the ability to work efficiently and effectively within a collaborative
setting.  
 
How to Apply.  Interested applicants should send a letter of interest
and resume or curriculum vita, including the names and contact
information for three references, to Connie White, Search Committee
Chair, at clwhite at utk.edu <mailto:clwhite at utk.edu>.  Please follow with
paper copies
to:  Dr. Connie White, Associate Director, The University of Tennessee,
Center for Literacy Studies, 600 Henley Street, Suite 312, Knoxville, TN
37996 - 4135.  
 
The search committee will begin its review of applications on April 16,
2007; however, applications will be accepted until the position is
filled. A competitive salary is offered commensurate with experience.
More information about the Center for Literacy Studies can be found at
http://www.cls.utk.edu/ <http://www.cls.utk.edu/> .
 
The University of Tennessee is an EEO/AA/Title VI/Title IX/Section
504/ADA/ADEA institution in the provision of its education and
employment programs and services.
 
 
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Mar 29 11:29:51 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2007 11:29:51 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 694] FW: [FocusOnBasics 853] FOB Article-of-the-Week:
	Program Standards
Message-ID: <011001c77217$18ad66e0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:

Perhaps some of you are interested in this discussion that is occurring
now on the Focus on Basics Discussion List.  Go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Focusonbasics
to subscribe or to read the archives.

See below!

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-----Original Message-----
From: focusonbasics-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:focusonbasics-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Julie McKinney
Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2007 6:15 PM
To: focusonbasics at nifl.gov
Subject: [FocusOnBasics 853] FOB Article-of-the-Week: Program Standards

Hi Everyone,

A list member recently wrote in and wanted to discuss Standards of
Academic Progress.

She says: "My college is in the process of revising its SOAP policy and
procedures for Adult  Education. The current statement is so vague it's
useless. We are  interested in learning what SOAP policies and
procedures Adult  Education programs around the country have in place.
How do they  handle chronic repeaters? What happens to students who are
simply not  
making any progress?"

This week's FOB Article, from issue 3C can serve as a beginning to
discuss this.

A User's Guide to Standards-Based Educational Reform:  From Theory to
Practice
by Regie Stites
http://www.ncsall.net/index.php?id=352

Please share your ideas!

All the best,
Julie

Julie McKinney
Discussion List Moderator
World Education/NCSALL
jmckinney at worlded.org

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Mar 30 15:27:32 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2007 15:27:32 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 695] Using Data for Program Improvement: Save the Date!
Message-ID: <026301c77301$776bbf20$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  I hope this email
finds you well.
 
I wanted to let you know that I have organized a panel guest discussion
on the topic of Using Data for Program Improvement for the week of April
16.   I will be sending out a formal announcement in a week or so
introducing the guest panel, and providing you with some questions to
think about and resources to look at to stimulate your interest and
spark your questions and discussion.
 
If you think of questions that you would like to ask panel members, feel
free to send me these ahead of time and I will forward them to
panelists, or feel free to post any questions yourself once the
discussion begins.  Also, we would love to hear what you might be doing
to improve your program's practice by using data (and this refers to
various types of data:  from tests/assessments, from demographic info,
from anecdotal/narrative reports, etc.), so please be encouraged to
share your experiences and perspectives during the discussion so that we
can make it rich.  We all have something to teach to each other, and we
all have something to learn from one another. 
 
Looking forward to hearing from you all then - so save the date!
 
Thanks!
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Apr  2 13:18:54 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2007 13:18:54 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 696] What Works for Adult ESL Students? A Special
	Topics Discussion
Message-ID: <03c601c7754a$fdd56980$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hello everyone,

The following post is from David Rosen, Moderator of the Special Topics
Discussion List.

**********

Dear Colleague,

I am very pleased to announce a special discussion on "What Works for 
Adult ESL Students" with the principal authors of the study, Heide  
Spruck Wrigley and Larry Condelli.  The discussion will begin April  
9th and continue through April 15th. Below you will find brief  
biographies of the authors, and (links to) some short and longer  
pieces about the research.  This is one of the major studies of adult 
ESL/ESOL in our field, and a wonderful opportunity to discuss the  
study and its findings with the authors.  I hope you will take time  
before the discussion to read the study and to formulate your  
questions for the authors.  You may send your questions beginning now 
although they will be held until April 9th when the discussion begins.

Information on Subscribing

If you are not subscribed to the National Institute for Literacy's  
Special Topics discussion list, where this discussion will be held,  
you can subscribe at any time, by going to

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics 

Follow the simple instructions, select the "subscribe" button, and  
you will then be sent an email requesting confirmation of your  
subscription. You must immediately reply to that email in order to be 
subscribed. You can unsubscribe when the discussion ends, or stay  
subscribed and wait for the next discussion. On the Special Topics  
discussion list you will receive no email messages between
discussions.

If you are subscribed, please pass this information on to colleagues  
who you think might be interested in the discussion

Biographies of the Guest Researchers

Dr. Heide Spruck Wrigley is Senior Researcher for Language, Literacy  
and Learning with LiteracyWork Associates, a small independent firm  
conducting research and professional development work in the United  
States and in Canada. She has been key in every federally funded  
national research study on adult ESL and acted as the subject matter  
expert in the What Works for Adult ESL Students study. She has  
written a number of books and articles related to adult ESL Literacy, 
including "Bringing Literacy to Life" a handbook for practitioners,
"Communicating in the Real World", a textbook on workplace ESL, and
most recently the "Language of Opportunity" a report for the Center 
on Law and Social Policy; and "Capturing What Counts"  a chapter in
"Adult Biliteracy: Socio-cultural and Programmatic Responses" (Erlbaum
2007).

Dr.  Wrigley currently is a non-resident fellow with the Migration  
Policy Institute in Washington, D.C. where she focuses on immigrant  
integration and policy issues related to adult ESL, employment and  
family literacy. She has served on a number of advisory boards and  
expert panels, including the National Academy of Sciences, the  
National Center for the Study of Adult Learning and Literacy, and  
(currently) the National Institute for Literacy and the National  
Center for Educational Statistics.

In an effort to make research accessible to practitioners, Dr.  
Wrigley is involved in a number of professional development efforts  
across the U.S. These include a four year ongoing staff development  
effort in Socorro, Texas to help teachers integrate family literacy,  
EL Civics, and technology. She also heads up several professional  
development Institutes (including a virtual course) for both new  
teachers and master teachers throughout Texas, focused on teaching  
English as a Second Language to adults. She has delivered numerous  
talks and key notes at conferences both within the U.S. and  
internationally. Dr. Wrigley holds a PhD in Education with a focus on 
Language, Literacy, and Learning and an MA in Applied Linguistics.

Dr. Larry Condelli is a managing director of the Adult Education and  
Literacy Program in the Education and Human Development Division at  
the American Institutes for Research. His work includes research on  
adult ESL students, accountability, and conducting professional  
development and technical assistance for adult educators. He recently 
directed the What Works Study for Adult ESL Literacy Students, the  
first large-scale empirical study of the effectiveness of  
instructional practices for adult ESL students, and is currently  
directing a study of the impact of explicit literacy instruction on  
low-literate adult ESOL learners for the U.S. Department of  
Education.  He is also the project director for the National  
Reporting System and was instrumental in developing this national  
accountability system for federally funded adult education and  
literacy program. Dr. Condelli's other projects include development  
of a performance-based reading assessment for low-literate adults for 
the National Assessment of Adult Literacy, funded by the National  
Center for Educational Statistics. He is a staff development and data 
consultant for the states of Alabama, California, Georgia and Utah  
and provides training and technical assistance to adult education  
staff in several states. Dr. Condelli holds a Ph.D. in Psychology  
from the University of California.

Readings to prepare for the Discussion

Below are links to readings (1 and 2) and attached documents  (3 and  
4) that will help you to prepare for the discussion. (Note, some  
people may not be able to open 3 and 4.  If you have difficulty, and  
would like me to email these to you, let me know.  
( djrosen1 at comcast.net )

1. A short NCSALL Focus on Basics article on What Works for Adult ESL 

Students
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=189 

2. Instruction, Language and Literacy: What Works Study for Adult ESL 

Literacy Students
http://lotos.library.uu.nl/publish/articles/000176/bookpart.pdf 

3. A long, but not too theoretical paper on the What Works ESL study  
presented in England (See first attachment below.)

4. A paper on the What Works for Adult ESL Students study presented  
in Tilburg, Netherlands
(See second attachment below.)

I look forward to your joining this discussion.

David J. Rosen
National Institute for Literacy Special Topics List Moderator
djrosen1 at comcast.net 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Apr  2 13:23:05 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2007 13:23:05 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 697]  NAAL Data Use Training
Message-ID: <03ca01c7754b$93d51200$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

Perhaps some of you are interested in the following training which
focuses on using the National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) data
files and tools for research and policy analyses.  

Please see below.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

*************************************

Using the National Assessment of Adult Literacy Data file and Tools For
Research, Secondary Analyses and Policy Development (NAAL Data Set
Training)

Description:

The National Center for Education Statistics (NCES), in the U.S.
Department
of Education's Institute of Education Sciences (IES), will sponsor a
3-day
advanced studies seminar on the use of the National Assessment of Adult
Literacy (NAAL) data files and tools for research and policy analyses.
The
2003 NAAL measured the English literacy of America's adults living in
households and prisons. Results are reported in terms of scale score
averages on three literacy scales: prose, document, and quantitative, as
well as literacy levels that are described as Below Basic, Basic,
Intermediate, and Proficient.

Type: Workshop/Training & Technical Assistance

Audience:
This seminar is open to institutional researchers and planners,
education
practitioners, policymakers, and association members, as well as faculty
and
advanced graduate students from colleges and universities nationwide.

Location:
Academy for Educational Development (AED)
1825 Connecticut Avenue, NW
Washington, DC 20009-5721
(202) 884-8583

Dates: August 6-8, 2007

Organization: National Center for Education Statistics

More Information: NAAL Data Set Training Seminar Announcement
http://nces.ed.gov/whatsnew/conferences/PDF/NAAL_Training__Announcement.
pdf
 

 

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Apr  4 12:35:25 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2007 12:35:25 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 698] New NAAL Publication on Literacy in Everyday Life
Message-ID: <05b101c776d7$3fc77170$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

The National Center for Education Statistics (NCES) just released
Literacy
in Everyday Life, the most recent publication of the 2003 National
Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL).  This report provides extensive
information on the literacy of American adults age 16 and older and
changes
in their performance since 1992.  Furthermore, it examines the
relationship
between literacy and several demographic variables including education,
occupation, and income.

 

Findings include the following:

 

*         Women have closed the gap with men in Quantitative literacy.
They
are doing better than men in Document and Prose literacy. 

*         Younger and older adults have lower literacy than adults in
other
age groups.  

*         Median weekly earnings increased with each level of literacy. 

*         At each higher level of Prose literacy, more adults were
employed
full time.  

*         Approximately 51 percent of adults with Below Basic Document
literacy and 43 percent with Below Basic Quantitative literacy believed
their job opportunities were limited a lot by their lack of computer
skills.

*         The percentage of parents who never helped their school-age
child
with homework declined at each higher Prose literacy level. 

*         Approximately half of US citizens of voting age with Below
Basic
Prose and Document literacy reported voting in the presidential election
of
2000 compared with 84 percent of citizens with Proficient Prose and
Document
literacy. 
 

To download, view and print the publication as a PDF file, please visit:

http://nces.ed.gov/pubsearch/pubsinfo.asp?pubid=2007480 

 

Jaleh Behroozi Soroui

Education Statistics Services Institute 

American Institutes for Research 

1990 K Street, NW Suite 500 

Washington, DC 20006

Phone: 202/403-6958

email: jsoroui at air.org

 

 

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Apr  4 15:32:56 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2007 15:32:56 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 699] Discussion on CASAS on Adult English Language List
Message-ID: <05d901c776f0$0c9af920$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
Perhaps some of you are interested in the discussion taking place right
now on the Adult English Language Learners Discussion List focused on
the CASAS.  The discussion stems from subscriber feedback on sessions
attended at either of the recent national conferences, TESOL or COABE.
 
Go to  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Englishlanguage to read the
archives:  click on Read Current Posted Messages at the top of the page;
look for (or use the search button) posts with the subject heading
"Surviving the CASAS?"  
 
If you have thoughts regarding that discussion and would like to share
them here (or there!), that would be great.
 
Thanks,
 
marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Apr  5 09:01:09 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2007 09:01:09 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 700]  FCE Works in ABE and ESOL
Message-ID: <060a01c77782$7c65ab00$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues, the following post is from Tom Sticht.  In it, Tom reviews
some of the literature supporting Functional Context Education (FCE)
principles, including the study on What Works Study For Adult ESL
Literacy Students by Larry Condelli and Heide Wrigley, which will be
presented as a Guest Discussion on the Special Topics Discussion List
next week (http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics; see post
from Monday, April 2).  

The principles provide a framework for assessing a student's strengths
and needs, and for subsequently developing appropriate curricula, as
informed by the student.  What are your thoughts on FCE and its
principles?  

Do you find that you follow these principles 'automatically' in your
work, or do you need to be conscious of them in order to incorporate
them into your teaching and/or program?

Do you feel that the FCE principles are appropriate in all contexts of
adult literacy?  Why or why not?

Thanks for your thoughts,

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

**********

Celebrating 20 Years of Functional Context Education: 1987-2007

April 3, 2007

Functional Context Education Principles Show "What Works" in  ABE and
ESOL
Instruction

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

The year 2007 is the twentieth anniversary of the formulation of
Functional
Context Education principles (Sticht, Armstrong, Hickey, & Caylor,
1987).
These principles were based on extensive research on how the U. S.
military
could annually enlist tens of thousands of young adults with literacy
skills
below the 30th percentile, about the 6th grade, with little or no work
experience, and in a matter of just a few weeks transform them into
automobile mechanics, medical corpsmen, clerical staff, commercial
cooks,
and other skilled and semi-skilled workers.

The review lead to the formulation of six principles that facilitate
learning on entry into a course,  learning throughout the course, and
transfer into the contexts for which the learning is meant to apply.

o1. Make sure students understand the purpose of the program and the
usefulness of the knowledge and skills to be learned.

o2. Consider the knowledge that students bring with them and build new
knowledge on the basis of this old knowledge.

o3. Develop and sequence new lessons so they build on prior knowledge
gained
in previous lessons.

o4. Integrate instruction in basic skills (reading, math) into programs
as
the course poses demands for these skills that potential students may
not
possess.

o5. Derive objectives from careful analysis of the realistic knowledge
and
skill needed in the work, home, or other community contexts in which the
learner lives.

o6. Use, to the extent possible, learning contexts, tasks, materials,
and
procedures taken from the future situation in which the learner will be
functioning.

Since 1987 some "silver standard," quasi-experimental studies have been
found that provide evidence for the usefulness of the six FCE principles
in
civilian programs of Adult Basic Education (ABE) and English for
Speakers of
Other Languages (ESOL).

Research on Integrated Vocational and ESOL Instruction

Sticht, McDonald, & Erickson, (1998) compared an Electronics Assembly
Vocational English as a Second Language (VESL) class which integrated
vocational and ESOL together, a Vocational class in Electronics Assembly
(no ESOL instruction) and a conventional ESOL class, not vocationally
related. In all three courses pre- and post-test data were obtained on a
vocational vocabulary test related to electronics training and a general
literacy test (the Adult Basic Learning Exam-ABLE). The data showed that
the integrated VOCED+VESL program had greater gains on the vocational
vocabulary test than either of the comparison groups, as well as a gain
rate per 100 hours of instruction some 65 percent higher for general
reading (ABLE) than the general ESL program, and over 300 percent
greater
than the VOCED program.

Altogether, the data on the FCE VESL+ VOCED program indicated that it
produced greater retention, greater course completion, and higher gains
in
learning than did the comparison courses of general ESL or a
conventional
electronics vocational education course. Other data also indicated that
placements of students in the VOCED+ESOL program into electronics jobs
was
high, almost 100 percent, and many were placed by the ninth week of the
course. This reflects the importance of FCE principles 5 and 6 in
helping
students transfer new knowledge and skills from the classroom to the
world
of work.

United Kingdom Research on Embedded Language, Literacy, Numeracy (LLN)
in
Vocational Courses

Casey, et. al (2006) reported research with 1,916 learners in 79
vocational
courses with varying amounts of embedded language, literacy or numeracy
(LLN) (FCE principle #4).  Using a four point scale courses were rated
as
non-embedded, partly embedded, mostly embedded, and fully embedded. This
provides a form of quasi-experimental design with a treatment group
(fully
embedded) and three comparison groups.

The authors reported that,  "On the embedded courses retention was 16
per
cent higher..The embedded courses also had higher success rates than the
non-embedded courses. . For learners on the fully-embedded courses, 93
per
cent of those with an identified literacy need achieved a literacy/ESOL
qualification, compared to only 50 per cent for those on non-embedded
courses. On the fully embedded courses, 43 per cent more learners
achieved
literacy qualifications. .For learners on the fully-embedded courses, 93
per cent of those with an identified numeracy need achieved a
numeracy/maths qualification, compared to 70 per cent for those on
non-embedded courses. On the fully embedded courses, 23 per cent more
learners achieved numeracy qualifications." (p. 5)

The United States' What Works Study For Adult ESL Literacy Students

Condelli & Wrigley (2004) discuss research for the U. S. Department of
Education to identify effective instructional practices ("what works")
for
adults needing basic literacy instruction along with ESOL. Among other
findings, they reported two major instructional factors related to
achievement in literacy and oral language that are consistent with FCE
principles.

First, in what the authors called"connection to the outside," they found
that  "students in classes where teachers made connections to the
"outside"
or real world, had more growth in reading development measured both by
general reading and "real world" reading. This is consistent with FCE
principles because it makes the purpose of the learning apparent, it
supports learning in the functional context of "real world" materials,
and
it shows how the learning relates to the person's life outside the
classroom.

A second major finding was that, "students in classes where teachers
used
students' native language for clarification during instruction (e.g., to
explain concepts and provide instructions on class work) had faster
growth
in reading comprehension and oral communication skills." This is
consistent
with FCE principles because it helps the teacher explain the purposes of
what is being learned and it makes it possible to draw upon the
learner's
prior knowledge of the native language as a means of learning new
knowledge
of the English language.

In summary, at the present time, the Functional Context Education
principles
are supported by the largest body of scientific, quasi-experimental
research
on adult vocational, English language, literacy and numeracy instruction
in
the field of adult education. They provide a solid foundation for
evidence-based instruction in the Adult Education and Literacy System of
the United States and other English-speaking industrialized nations.

References

Casey, H. et. al (2006, November). "You wouldn't expect a maths teacher
to
teach plastering." online at www.nrdc.org.uk.

Condelli, L. & Wrigley, H.  (2004) Real World Research: Combining
Qualitative and Quantitative Research for Adult ESL. Paper presented at
the
National Research and Development Centre (NRDC) Second International
Conference for Adult Literacy and Numeracy, Loughborough, England.
Downloaded from the internet April 3, 2007 from
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/professionaldevelopment/attachments/200704
01/dea5b0a7/attachment-0002.doc

Sticht, T.,  McDonald, B., & Erickson, P. (1998). Passports to Paradise:
The
Struggle To Teach and To Learn on the Margins of Adult Education. El
Cajon,
CA: Applied Behavioral and Cognitive Sciences, Inc., (available online
at
www.searchERIC.org ).

Sticht, T., Armstrong, W., Hickey, D., & Caylor, J. (1987). Cast-off
youth:
policies and training methods from the military experience. NY: Praeger.

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Apr  5 09:05:36 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2007 09:05:36 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 701] New from CAELA - brief on using content standards
	in adult ESL instruction
Message-ID: <061501c77783$1af47d00$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

The following post, from Miriam Burt, may be of interest to some of you.

Marie Cora

***************************

Using content standards in adult ESL instruction was a topic of interest
at TESOL and COABE and is certainly a topic of interest and importance
to the field. The Center for Adult Emglish Language Acquisition (CAELA)
has just published a brief on the subject, "Using Adult ESL Content
Standards."  This brief, by CAELA staff members Kirsten Schaetzel and
Sarah Young, begins with historical information about content standards
and then describes the processes that adult ESL teachers and program
administrators can follow to successfully incorporate standards into
lesson planning, classroom activities, performance assessment, and
professional development. The brief is available for downloading in html
or in pdf on CAELA's Web site at
http://www.cal.org/caela/esl_resources/briefs/usingcontstandards.html  

There are two other briefs on standards on the CAELA Web site:

"Using Content Standards" supplements the information from an earlier
CAELA brief on "Understanding Adult ESL Content Standards," by Cristine
Smith and Sarah Young, which is also available in html and in pdf  at  
http://www.cal.org/caela/esl_resources/briefs/contentstandards.html. 

To complete the set, there is also a CAELA brief on program standards
and adult ESL Instruction. "Using the ESL Program Standards to Evaluate
and Improve Adult ESL Programs," by Joy Peyton is available on CAELA's
Web site at
http://www.cal.org/caela/esl_resources/briefs/eslprogstandards.html.

Miriam Burt
***********
Center for Adult English Language Acquisition
Center for Applied Linguistics
4646 40th Street NW
Washington, DC 20016
(202) 362-0700, ext. 556 (phone)
(202) 363-7204 (fax) 
miriam at cal.org (email)

From howard at riral.org  Thu Apr  5 10:31:43 2007
From: howard at riral.org (Howard Dooley)
Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2007 10:31:43 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 702] Re: Discussion on CASAS on Adult English Language
	List
In-Reply-To: <05d901c776f0$0c9af920$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <05d901c776f0$0c9af920$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <0BF2D0726318524ABEF6D58E7BB3CCEB0268C5@pdc.Riral.local>

Marie - I went to the discussion, as I was intrigued/dismayed by the
thread title "Surviving the CASAS". This is a misnomer for the
discussion. Attached is one response, from CASAS.

 

On behalf of Jane Eguez, CASAS: 

We were also intrigued by the title. The presenter extended an
invitation to me to attend her poster session - which I did. The
presenter works in a large urban school district. In her classroom, she
administers the statewide-mandated assessment (CASAS) to meet NRS
requirements, plus local district-developed assessments, as well as her
own teacher-developed assessments. She feels she is spending too much
time testing. 

During the poster session, the presenter acknowledged publicly that she
likes the CASAS assessment, and that the CASAS test itself isn't the
problem - since it assesses basic skills in the context of essential
life skills she feels her students need. In fact, her poster
demonstrated creative ways for students to acquire real language
practice (via life skill competencies) outside the classroom. 

We agree that it is a challenge for local programs to balance the
collection of good formative and summative assessment information to
help students and improve programs.

 

 

My program in RI uses the CASAS, and for learners who attend up to 100
hours we pretest and then post test once or twice. Those with
significant hours beyond that post test regularly, as improvements are
noted by the instructor and learner. We feel that by more fully aligning
our learning with the CASAS, we reduce the amount of testing that we
have to do. We also find that most learners do not resent or reject
assessments that clearly show them what they have learned and what they
need to learn next, given their current learning goals and next steps
past the program. Of course, if instructors are negative or do not see
connections - or worse, there are not connections - then that negativity
is soon shared by the learners. That is true for any material and for
any assessment - the CASAS, publisher- and teacher-developed ones.

 

The majority of our learners are with us for six months to a year,
before they move on or stop out. They have no issue with us working
together and motivating them to succeed as much as they can in that
short time, or assessing them at least monthly, either by informal or
formal assessments, to make sure for them and for us that they are
progressing significantly each time they are in our learning
environment. That is why they are here, and that is why we are, too.

 

Howard L. Dooley, Jr.

RIRAL / Woonsocket, RI

 

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2007 3:33 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 699] Discussion on CASAS on Adult English Language
List

 

Hi everyone,

 

Perhaps some of you are interested in the discussion taking place right
now on the Adult English Language Learners Discussion List focused on
the CASAS.  The discussion stems from subscriber feedback on sessions
attended at either of the recent national conferences, TESOL or COABE.

 

Go to  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Englishlanguage to read the
archives:  click on Read Current Posted Messages at the top of the page;
look for (or use the search button) posts with the subject heading
"Surviving the CASAS?"  

 

If you have thoughts regarding that discussion and would like to share
them here (or there!), that would be great.

 

Thanks,

 

marie

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Apr  6 09:13:07 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2007 09:13:07 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 703]  Using Data for Program Improvement
Message-ID: <005c01c7784d$528066b0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues, please see the full announcement for the discussion on Using
Data for Program Improvement.  If you have questions or comments for our
guests ahead of time, please feel free to send me these and I will
forward them to the panel members.  You should also feel free to post
questions, comments and your own experiences yourself - we are looking
forward to hearing from you.  
Thanks!
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
**********
Discussion Announcement 
Dear Colleagues, 
I'm pleased to announce the following Panel Guest Discussion, which will
be held during the week of April 16 - 20.
Topic: Using Data for Program Improvement 
Guests will discuss the work they have done in using data to improve the
quality of adult literacy programming.  We will hear about the use of
data in small and large programs, as well as at the state and national
levels.  Panelists are interested in your questions and eager to hear
about your use of data, as well as share their own experiences, so
please ask questions and share your stories.  
Recommended preparations for this discussion 
Please use the following guiding questions to help you share how you use
data in your program (or classroom), or how you would like to:
 
*	Do you use data in your program?  What type?  How?  What have
been the results?
*	What information (data) would you like to track and why?  
*	What data would you like to learn how to use?
 
Resources of interest:
 
Using Data Effectively by Donna Cornellier:  see attached Power Point
Presentation.
This PowerPoint outlines a basic framework for identifying, using, and
monitoring data; excellent guiding questions are provided as well as a
case study for practicing the application of the framework.
 
 
NRS Publications on data
http://www.nrsweb.org/pubs/
This site has a wealth of resources including the NRS Implementation
Guidelines; NRS Tips offering information on building data systems, and
setting goals and standards; and  Training Guides that provide practical
information and tools that can be used to build and use data systems
effectively.    
 
 
Learning to be an NRS Data Detective
http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/StateDataDetectives.aspx
This training explores how an effective data detective: 
*	Understands the process and psychology of data collection;
*	Examines data including assessment, goal setting, and follow-up
data;
*	Asks further questions of the data; and
*	Makes changes in processes and policies to improve data quality
and program services.
	 
NRS State and Local Report Cards
http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/insights/report_cards.aspx
Report cards can be a powerful and effective tool for accountability and
program improvement if properly used and implemented. There are many
types of report cards, but for the purposes of NRS, our focus is on
report cards that assess performance. Report cards that allow meaningful
evaluation have the following characteristics: 
*	Include outcome and other data,
*	Provide a basis for evaluation of that data, and
*	Present contextual data or interpretive information that aid
interpretation and promote understanding.
Report cards can be used in several different ways to 
*	Evaluate program quality,
*	Promote program improvement, and
*	Inform and advocate for the program.
	 
Guest Participants: 
Toni Borge is the director of the Adult Education & Transitions Program
at Bunker Hill Community College in Boston, Massachusetts. She has a
master's degree in educational administration. Toni is a member of the
TESOL task force that is advising the U.S. Department of Homeland
Security, Office of Citizenship, on redesigning the citizenship test
that is being piloted in 2007.  In May, Toni will present a TESOL
Virtual Seminar entitled "Assessment and Learning: Balancing Program
Performance and Instruction" in which she will discuss effective ways to
manage and balance instruction to meet state and national performance
standards.
 
Dr. Larry Condelli is a managing director of the Adult Education and
Literacy Program in the Education and Human Development Division at the
American Institutes for Research. His work includes research on adult
ESL students, accountability, and conducting professional development
and technical assistance for adult educators. He recently directed the
What Works Study for Adult ESL Literacy Students, the first large-scale
empirical study of the effectiveness of instructional practices for
adult ESL
students, and is currently directing a study of the impact of explicit
literacy instruction on low-literate adult ESOL learners for the U.S.
Department of Education.  He is also the project director for the
National Reporting System and was instrumental in developing this
national accountability system for federally funded adult education and
literacy program. Dr. Condelli's other projects include development of a
performance-based reading assessment for low-literate adults for the
National Assessment of Adult Literacy, funded by the National Center for
Educational Statistics. He is a staff development and data consultant
for the states of Alabama, California, Georgia and Utah and provides
training and technical assistance to adult education staff in several
states. Dr. Condelli holds a Ph.D. in Psychology from the University of
California.
 
Donna Cornellier is the Project Manager for the student level data
system in Massachusetts.  In this role, her responsibilities include
managing the System for Managing Accountability and Results Through
Technology (SMARTT) development team; designing NRS training materials,
and providing training and technical assistance to the local programs on
using NRS data for program improvement. Presentations included how
assessment data is tracked in the student level database and what
reports are available to help programs implement the NRS policies.
Formerly she was the Director of a local ABE program in Massachusetts.
She holds a Masters degree in Educational Leadership and Management.
 
Ajit Gopalakrishnan is an Education Consultant with the Connecticut
State Department of Education's Bureau of Early Childhood, Career and
Adult Education. He manages adult education projects in the areas of
statewide assessment, data management, program accountability, and
technology.
 
Rosemary I. Matt has recently been appointed to the newly developed
position of NRS Liaison for New York State.  In this role, her
responsibilities include NRS training, data management, and desk
monitoring of all New York State programs.  Prior to this position,
Rosemary has been in education throughout her career, first as a
secondary education mathematics teacher for fifteen years and then as
the director of the New York State staff development consortium in the
mid state.  
 
Karen Mundie has been an adult education professional for over thirty
years. She is the associate director of the Greater Pittsburgh Literacy
Council, a large community-based education organization (42 professional
staff members, 550 volunteers, and 2000 students). She is also the
director of the Southwest Professional Development Center, where she was
the lead trainer in the area of using data for decision-making for three
years.  Karen is a past president of the Pennsylvania Association for
Adult and Continuing Education (PAACE) and was Pennsylvania's
Outstanding Adult Educator for 2005. She holds two masters' degrees from
the University of Virginia. 
Joanie Rethlake, native Texan, is the state director for adult education
for Texas LEARNS, the state office for adult education in Houston, Texas
and has responsibility for administering the state's adult education
program and directing the technical assistance and professional
development offered to adult education and family literacy programs
across Texas.  Formerly, she was the director of adult education at
Harris County Department of Education and past president of the Texas
Association for Literacy and Adult Education (TALAE). 
Sandy Strunk is Program Director for Community Education at Lancaster
Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13. In this role, she provides leadership for
several educational programs including Adult Basic Education, the Adult
Education Southeast Professional Development Center, Early Reading
First, English as a Second Language, Family Literacy, Head Start, Organ
and Tissue Donation Awareness Education and Workforce Education. Sandy
has been an adult education practitioner for over twenty years. She is a
past president of the PA Association for Adult Continuing Education,
provided leadership to Pennsylvania's adult education program
improvement training system for six years (1997 - 2003) and continues to
provide leadership for Pennsylvania's family literacy program
improvement initiative (SEQUAL). She serves on the advisory board of the
Goodling Institute for Research in Family Literacy and is particularly
interested in educational interventions that focus on the family unit.
Sandy has a B.S. in education from Lock Haven University and a M.Ed. in
Training and Development from Penn State University.
 
Luanne Teller is the Director of Massasoit Community College's Stoughton
ABE (ESOL) and Transitions to College Programs.  She was involved in
establishing and developing of both programs.  Prior to these positions,
she was the Coordinator of an Office Skills Job Training Program, which
provided employment skills training to empower women to transition off
of public assistance into full-time careers.  She holds a degree in
secondary education (French and Spanish).  She has served on a variety
of board and committees, as both a volunteer and elected official.  She
is currently a member of the Board of Directors for the Greater Plymouth
County United Way.  She has extensive experience using research data and
communicating with a wide range of constituencies to develop effective
program plans, and to promote the commitment to continuous improvement.
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Apr  6 09:38:24 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2007 09:38:24 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 704]  Work/career readiness? Discussion next week!
Message-ID: <007901c77850$dac997f0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues, 

The following Guest Discussion will take place next week on the
Workplace Literacy Discussion List.  To subscribe or read the archives,
go to:  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Workplace/

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So you've heard of the Work Readiness Credential.  
Or is it called the National Work Readiness Credential?  
Wait! Maybe that was the Career Readiness Credential you were thinking
of.  
Or the Career Readiness Certification?  Workforce Skills Certification? 

If this is all just too confusing, but you really need to know, join in
the discussion next week on the Workplace Literacy Discussion List.
Several guests have agreed to share their expertise and answer
questions, and there's a great new resource out online that identifies
and then compares and contrasts the various work readiness certificates
that are out there. The resource, the work of Norma Rey-Alicea and Geri
Scott, is "A Survey of Selected Work Readiness Certificates" and you can
download it from http://www.jff.org/Documents/WorkReadiness.pdf .  Norma
and Geri, the authors, are two of the guests who have agreed to answer
questions in helping us understand the purposes and issues surrounding
work readiness certificates.  

Other guests have first-hand experience with and knowledge about the
three most widely recognized work readiness certificates: 

Louis Soares, Executive Director of the National Work Readiness Council
Lansing Davis (Lanse), Senior Policy Analyst with the NJ State
Employment and Training Commission, the State WIB.
Judith Titzel, Adult Education Specialist, RI Adult Education
Professional Development Center
Jane Eguez, Director of Program Planning, CASAS
Melissa Dayton, Workforce Program Specialist, CASAS
Traci Lepicki, Project Coordinator, Ohio's Career Readiness Credential,
The Ohio State University Center on Education and Training for
Employment
Adrienne Glandon, Ohio's Career Readiness Credential, The Ohio State
University Center on Education and Training for Employment

Look for additional information and resources on the Workplace
Discussion List soon to give you additional background information and
resources.  If you want to join us for this discussion, subscribe to the
list at http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Workplace/ .  If you want
to unsubscribe after the discussion, go back to that same page (but we
hope you will want to stay with us!)

Donna Brian, Moderator
Workplace Literacy Discussion List
Center for Literacy at The University of Tennessee
djgbrian at utk.edu

From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Mon Apr  9 15:37:32 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Mon, 9 Apr 2007 15:37:32 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 705] Additions to National Commission on Adult Literacy
Message-ID: <2D03C78B-00FE-4796-A8E0-59DA360EE964@caalusa.org>

Colleagues,

I'm pleased to tell you that the following individuals have recently  
joined the National Commission on Adult Literacy: Morton Bahr  
(President Emeritus, Communications Workers of America); The Hon.  
Gerald Baliles (former Governor of Virginia, presently Director,  
Miller Center of Public Affairs, University of Virginia); George  
Kessinger (President & CEO, Goodwill Industries International, Inc.);  
and Juan Olivarez (President, Grand Rapids Community College &  
Member, NIFL Advisory Board).

In addition, we have a new honorary commissioner: the Hon. Ruth  
Minner (Governor of Delaware).

With the possible exception of one more corporate CEO, all  
commissioners are now on board.

The next meeting of the Commission takes place April 17th in New York  
City.

Gail S

Gail Spangenberg
President
Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Fl
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2362, F: 212-512-2610
www.caalusa.org

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Apr 11 14:50:14 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2007 14:50:14 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 706] World Literacy and Nonformal Education at the ALE
	Wiki
Message-ID: <01fe01c77c6a$3e59f950$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

The Adult Literacy Education Wiki

http://wiki.literacytent.org 

 is a useful resource for adult education teachers and other
practitioners, and for researchers.  The ALE Wiki now has over 800
subscribers (it's free to subscribe) and nearly 900 pages of
information, organized in 32 topics.  Below is a list of topics, but
today I would especially like to call your attention to World Literacy
and Nonformal Education,
 
http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/World_Literacy_and_Nonformal_Educ
ation 

and to invite you to add to this page.

David J. Rosen
Wikiteer and ALE Wiki Organizer
djrosen at comcast.net
*	Accountability
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Accountability>  
*	Action Research
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Action_Research>  
*	Adult Learners' Self-Study
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Adult_Learners%27_Self-Study>  
*	Adult Literacy
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Adult_Literacy_Professional_Deve
lopment>  Professional Development 
*	Assessment Information
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Assessment_Information>  
*	Basic Literacy
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Basic_Literacy>  
*	Classroom Practices that Work
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Classroom_Practices_that_Work>  
*	Corrections Education
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Corrections_Education>  
*	Curriculum Development
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Curriculum_Development>  
*	Developing
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Developing_Professional_Wisdom_a
nd_Research>  Professional Wisdom and Research 
*	English for Speakers of
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/English_for_Speakers_of_Other_La
nguages>  Other Languages 
*	Evidence Based Adult Education
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Evidence_Based_Adult_Education>

*	Family Literacy
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Family_Literacy>  
*	GED Research
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/GED_Research>  
*	Health Literacy
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Health_Literacy>  
*	Learner Persistence
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Learner_Persistence>  
*	Learner Perspectives
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Learner_Perspectives>  
*	Learning Disabilities
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Learning_Disabilities>  
*	Numeracy Research and Practice
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Numeracy_Research_and_Practice>

*	Participatory and
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Participatory_and_Emancipatory_E
ducation>  Emancipatory Education 
*	Program Design
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Program_Design>  
*	Project Based Learning
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Project_Based_Learning>  
*	Public Policy
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Public_Policy>  
*	Reading <http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Reading>  
*	Return on Investment
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Return_on_Investment>  
*	Standards <http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Standards>  
*	Technology <http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Technology>  
*	Transition_to_College
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Transition_to_College>  
*	Workforce, Workplace and
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Workforce%2C_Workplace_and_Worke
r_Education>  Worker Education 
*	Women and Literacy
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Women_and_Literacy>  
*	World Literacy and
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/World_Literacy_and_Nonformal_Edu
cation>  Nonformal Education 
*	Young Adult Literacy
<http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Young_Adult_Literacy>  

 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Sun Apr 15 09:56:59 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 09:56:59 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 707]  Test Construction Workshop, July 16-18,
	2007 at CETE/OSU
Message-ID: <01dc01c77f65$f0531670$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

 
Test Construction Workshop, July 16-18, 2007 - CETE/OSU*
Constructing valid, reliable assessments (tests) of job specific
knowledge and skill is critical to effective and defensible human
resource practice. 
Knowledge and skill assessments are used for many personnel-related
functions, including
. Individual certification and licensure,
. Personnel selection and placement, and
. Training needs assessment or diagnosis.
A carefully-designed systematic approach to test construction maximizes
return on investment and contributes to candidate satisfaction and
motivation. Poorly designed assessments often yield erroneous and
damaging results, leading to employee or candidate dissatisfaction,
ineffective credentialing decisions and possible exposure to litigation.

Because practice or job analysis serve as the foundation to any
occupationally-specific test development process, our test development
workshop builds on information gathered from such analysis procedures.
Our workshops are designed to complement multiple methods of
occupational or practice analysis, from simple to complex.
To learn more about the Test Construction Workshop process and how to
register, please read our brochure
<http://www.cete.org/AssessmentSP/images/ElectronicTCWBrochureJuly2007.p
df>  (pdf). For additional information, please contact Kathy Summerfield
at 614-688-4000 or summerfield.1 at osu.edu. <mailto:summerfield.1 at osu.edu>

The Center on Education and Training for Employment
The Ohio State University
1900 Kenny Road
Columbus, OH 43210
www.cete.org
* If we receive insufficient registrations for the July 16-18, 2007
workshop, it will be rescheduled.
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Sun Apr 15 10:15:10 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 10:15:10 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 708]  Assessing Adult Literacy
Message-ID: <01e101c77f68$7ad0d060$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues, 

Below Tom discusses 3 areas of assessing adult literacy:  at the
national level, at the program level, and at the individual level.  Tom
notes that all these types of assessments are in use today to determine
the effectiveness of our delivery systems and the quality of our
programming, but he also notes that the results of these efforts still
remain unclear; we need more research in these areas.  

What are your thoughts on Tom's discussion?  Many of us do believe that
more research is needed, but without the Adult Literacy research arm
(NCSALL), how can we proceed with studies and research that can help
inform the future of our work?  

Toward the end of his discussion, Tom notes that many of us are looking
at what is happening in the classroom (formative assessment) to
understand how what happens at that level can inform and shape what
happens on the broader levels, but making these connections is neither
clear nor simple.  

What are your thoughts on this?  Do you think we should start with the
classroom and branch out to the broader levels, or is this unrealistic?

I will be interested to see if any of our panel guests in next week's
discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement touches on any of the
points that Tom makes in this post.

Thanks,

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

**********

April 12, 2007

Strategies for Evaluating the Effectiveness of Adult Literacy Programs:
An Update From 1990

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Over a decade and a half ago, in April of 1990,  I participated in a
National Conference on State Literacy Initiatives in Harrisburg,
Pennsylvania. At the conference, which was co-sponsored by the National
Governor's Association, the U. S. Department of Education, Project
Literacy
U.S. and three organizations in Pennsylvania, I was asked to present a
plenary session on the topic of "Strategies for Evaluating Effectiveness
of
Programs."

In my presentation I discussed three areas of assessment of adult
literacy.
The first was at the national level, such as what we have today in the
National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL). These types of assessments
are aimed at giving us an idea of the literacy skills of adults
regardless
of how or where they may have acquired these skills.

A second arena for assessment is in the evaluation of programs. Here, we
evaluate programs to see if the programs are meeting standards, to see
if
they are maintaining their quality, and to see if programs are improving
in
their effectiveness. My presentation focused on this second area of
assessment of literacy.

The third arena for assessment that I discussed was the assessment of
individuals for instructional decision making. I noted that individuals
are
assessed to see where they should be placed in an instructional program,
to
diagnose their specific needs, to determine instructional materials and
methods, and to certify that learning has taken place.

Today, all of these types of assessment of adult literacy skills are
widespread. At the national level since 1990 we have had two national
assessments of adult literacy, the National Adult Literacy Survey (NALS)
of
1993 and a decade later the National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL)
of
2003. Despite the repeated reporting of 30, 60, or 90 million adults
with
literacy skills judged inadequate by the U. S. Department of Education
and
the National Governor's Association in both 1993 and 2003, some 95
percent
of adults reported that they did not think they have a literacy problem
and
federal policies in the management of adult literacy programs appear to
have
lead to a loss of some one million enrollments in programs since 1993.
Additionally, investments in the Adult Education and Literacy System
(AELS)
today barely exceed $200 per enrollee, less than 3 percent of the $6500
provided for each child in the federal Head Start program. All this
suggest
that we need to rethink the nature of our national assessment of adult
literacy and what our national and state policies ought to be in the
light
of what new assessments reveal.

Today, in keeping with my second use of assessment, that is, to see if
programs are meeting standards, to see if they are maintaining their
quality, and to see if programs are improving in their effectiveness,
there
is a National Reporting System (NRS) that collects data on learning
gains
and several outcomes such as secondary degrees/certificates awarded,
transition into further education/training, employment and so forth.
However, there are not yet national standards for quality nor comparable
national assessment tools that would make valid comparisons of how well
different programs and different states are performing in both
maintaining
acceptable quality standards and monitoring their programs so that drops
in
performance can be corrected and steps can be taken to improve
performance.
Further, the NRS data on learning do not include pre- and post-test
scores
so that  gains in learning can be estimated more accurately. Resources
also
need to be made available that would permit the numerous programs to
return
that dropped out of the AELS, taking some million enrollments with them,
when the NRS demands for data collection were imposed across the nation.

The third arena for assessment that I discussed in 1990 was the
assessment
of individuals for instructional decision making. Today there is a
wide-ranging discourse on various discussion lists on formative
assessment
for instructional decision making, assessment for learning disabilities,
diagnostics in assessing components of reading ability, and other
aspects
of instructional decision making. Whether or not this discussion and
dialogue is actually improving instructional practices in the AELS is
not
known to me. However, if classroom decision making is supposed to lead
to
improvements in learning which are then captured in program assessments
using pre- and post-test data on standardized tests, as the present NRS
calls for, and if the latter is to lead to improved scores by adults on
the
national assessments, then the recent NAAL data suggest that any
improvements in the AELS classrooms over the decade from 1993 to 2003
did
not bubble-up to the national level. There were as many adults in the
lowest level of literacy in 2003 as there were in 1993.

To repeat my conclusion from the 1990 conference, "As pedantic as it may
sound, more research is needed to develop strategies for the assessment
of
programs that can improve adult literacy in the coming decade."

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Sun Apr 15 10:22:30 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 10:22:30 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 709]  Upcoming Discussions Announcement:  bundled
Message-ID: <01e201c77f69$811f6340$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues: 
Below you will find information on four upcoming guest discussions for
April.  Moderators of the National Institute for Literacy's Discussion
Lists are experimenting with this new format for announcing upcoming
discussions rather than send individual announcements, in order to cut
down on your email and to provide a more organized mechanism for sharing
opportunities.  Please let me know if you prefer this format over the
individual announcements.
 
The full text for each discussion announcement follows below.
 
Note that I have NOT included the attachments for our discussion next
week on Using Data for Program Improvement because I will be sending out
a reminder soon that contains all necessary info and resources.
 
Thanks!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
1) Topic: Using Data for Program Improvement
Where Held: Assessment Discussion List
To participate, subscribe:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment 
When: April 16 - 20
Preparation: See attached Power Point
 
2) Topic: ESL and Workplace List Discussion 
Where Held: Adult English Language Learners List
To participate, subscribe:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Englishlanguage 
When: April 16-20, 2007
 
3) Topic: Discussion on Hand-Held Devices in the Classroom 
Where Held: Technology & Literacy Discussion List
When: April 17-19
To participate, subscribe:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Technology 
 
4) Topic: Planning Health Literacy Awareness Events
Where held: Health & Literacy Discussion List
When: April 23-27, 2007
To participate, subscribe: www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/healthliteracy
 
 
 

1) Topic: Using Data for Program Improvement
Where Held: Assessment Discussion List
When: April 16 - 20
To participate, subscribe:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment 
Preparation: See attached Power Point
Discussion Announcement 
Dear Colleagues, 
I'm pleased to announce the following Panel Guest Discussion, which will
be held during the week of April 16 - 20.
Topic: Using Data for Program Improvement 
Guests will discuss the work they have done in using data to improve the
quality of adult literacy programming.  We will hear about the use of
data in small and large programs, as well as at the state and national
levels.  Panelists are interested in your questions and eager to hear
about your use of data, as well as share their own experiences, so
please ask questions and share your stories.  
Recommended preparations for this discussion 
Please use the following guiding questions to help you share how you use
data in your program (or classroom), or how you would like to:
 
*	Do you use data in your program?  What type?  How?  What have
been the results? 
*	What information (data) would you like to track and why?  
*	What data would you like to learn how to use? 
 
Resources of interest:
 
Using Data Effectively by Donna Cornellier:  see attached Power Point
Presentation.
This PowerPoint outlines a basic framework for identifying, using, and
monitoring data; excellent guiding questions are provided as well as a
case study for practicing the application of the framework.
 
 
NRS Publications on data
http://www.nrsweb.org/pubs/
This site has a wealth of resources including the NRS Implementation
Guidelines; NRS Tips offering information on building data systems, and
setting goals and standards; and  Training Guides that provide practical
information and tools that can be used to build and use data systems
effectively.    
 
 
Learning to be an NRS Data Detective
http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/StateDataDetectives.aspx
This training explores how an effective data detective: 
*	Understands the process and psychology of data collection; 
*	Examines data including assessment, goal setting, and follow-up
data; 
*	Asks further questions of the data; and 
*         Makes changes in processes and policies to improve data
quality and program services. 
NRS State and Local Report Cards
http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/insights/report_cards.aspx
Report cards can be a powerful and effective tool for accountability and
program improvement if properly used and implemented. There are many
types of report cards, but for the purposes of NRS, our focus is on
report cards that assess performance. Report cards that allow meaningful
evaluation have the following characteristics: 
*         Include outcome and other data, 
*         Provide a basis for evaluation of that data, and 
*         Present contextual data or interpretive information that aid
interpretation and promote understanding. 
Report cards can be used in several different ways to 
*         Evaluate program quality, 
*         Promote program improvement, and 
*         Inform and advocate for the program. 
Guest Participants: 
Toni Borge is the director of the Adult Education & Transitions Program
at Bunker Hill Community College in Boston, Massachusetts. She has a
master's degree in educational administration. Toni is a member of the
TESOL task force that is advising the U.S. Department of Homeland
Security, Office of Citizenship, on redesigning the citizenship test
that is being piloted in 2007.  In May, Toni will present a TESOL
Virtual Seminar entitled "Assessment and Learning: Balancing Program
Performance and Instruction" in which she will discuss effective ways to
manage and balance instruction to meet state and national performance
standards.
 
Dr. Larry Condelli is a managing director of the Adult Education and
Literacy Program in the Education and Human Development Division at the
American Institutes for Research. His work includes research on adult
ESL students, accountability, and conducting professional development
and technical assistance for adult educators. He recently directed the
What Works Study for Adult ESL Literacy Students, the first large-scale
empirical study of the effectiveness of instructional practices for
adult ESL
students, and is currently directing a study of the impact of explicit
literacy instruction on low-literate adult ESOL learners for the U.S.
Department of Education.  He is also the project director for the
National Reporting System and was instrumental in developing this
national accountability system for federally funded adult education and
literacy program. Dr. Condelli's other projects include development of a
performance-based reading assessment for low-literate adults for the
National Assessment of Adult Literacy, funded by the National Center for
Educational Statistics. He is a staff development and data consultant
for the states of Alabama, California, Georgia and Utah and provides
training and technical assistance to adult education staff in several
states. Dr. Condelli holds a Ph.D. in Psychology from the University of
California.
 
Donna Cornellier is the Project Manager for the student level data
system in Massachusetts.  In this role, her responsibilities include
managing the System for Managing Accountability and Results Through
Technology (SMARTT) development team; designing NRS training materials,
and providing training and technical assistance to the local programs on
using NRS data for program improvement. Presentations included how
assessment data is tracked in the student level database and what
reports are available to help programs implement the NRS policies.
Formerly she was the Director of a local ABE program in Massachusetts.
She holds a Masters degree in Educational Leadership and Management.
 
Ajit Gopalakrishnan is an Education Consultant with the Connecticut
State Department of Education's Bureau of Early Childhood, Career and
Adult Education. He manages adult education projects in the areas of
statewide assessment, data management, program accountability, and
technology.
 
Rosemary I. Matt has recently been appointed to the newly developed
position of NRS Liaison for New York State.  In this role, her
responsibilities include NRS training, data management, and desk
monitoring of all New York State programs.  Prior to this position,
Rosemary has been in education throughout her career, first as a
secondary education mathematics teacher for fifteen years and then as
the director of the New York State staff development consortium in the
mid state.  
 
Karen Mundie has been an adult education professional for over thirty
years. She is the associate director of the Greater Pittsburgh Literacy
Council, a large community-based education organization (42 professional
staff members, 550 volunteers, and 2000 students). She is also the
director of the Southwest Professional Development Center, where she was
the lead trainer in the area of using data for decision-making for three
years.  Karen is a past president of the Pennsylvania Association for
Adult and Continuing Education (PAACE) and was Pennsylvania's
Outstanding Adult Educator for 2005. She holds two masters' degrees from
the University of Virginia. 
Joanie Rethlake, native Texan, is the state director for adult education
for Texas LEARNS, the state office for adult education in Houston, Texas
and has responsibility for administering the state's adult education
program and directing the technical assistance and professional
development offered to adult education and family literacy programs
across Texas.  Formerly, she was the director of adult education at
Harris County Department of Education and past president of the Texas
Association for Literacy and Adult Education (TALAE). 
Sandy Strunk is Program Director for Community Education at Lancaster
Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13. In this role, she provides leadership for
several educational programs including Adult Basic Education, the Adult
Education Southeast Professional Development Center, Early Reading
First, English as a Second Language, Family Literacy, Head Start, Organ
and Tissue Donation Awareness Education and Workforce Education. Sandy
has been an adult education practitioner for over twenty years. She is a
past president of the PA Association for Adult Continuing Education,
provided leadership to Pennsylvania's adult education program
improvement training system for six years (1997 - 2003) and continues to
provide leadership for Pennsylvania's family literacy program
improvement initiative (SEQUAL). She serves on the advisory board of the
Goodling Institute for Research in Family Literacy and is particularly
interested in educational interventions that focus on the family unit.
Sandy has a B.S. in education from Lock Haven University and a M.Ed. in
Training and Development from Penn State University.
 
Luanne Teller is the Director of Massasoit Community College's Stoughton
ABE (ESOL) and Transitions to College Programs.  She was involved in
establishing and developing of both programs.  Prior to these positions,
she was the Coordinator of an Office Skills Job Training Program, which
provided employment skills training to empower women to transition off
of public assistance into full-time careers.  She holds a degree in
secondary education (French and Spanish).  She has served on a variety
of board and committees, as both a volunteer and elected official.  She
is currently a member of the Board of Directors for the Greater Plymouth
County United Way.  She has extensive experience using research data and
communicating with a wide range of constituencies to develop effective
program plans, and to promote the commitment to continuous improvement.
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
2) Topic: ESL and Workplace List Discussion 
Where Held: Adult English Language Learners List
To participate, subscribe:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Englishlanguage 
When: April 16-20, 2007
 
Discussion Announcement
 
Dear subscribers,
 
I am happy to announce that next week, April 16-20, 2007 Miriam Burt and
Sharon McKay, my colleagues at CAELA, will facilitate a discussion on
issues related to adult ESL and workplace education. 
 
The goal of this focused discussion is to spark a sharing of ideas and
information among the group, especially between those many of you on the
list who have been involved in immigrant workplace education since the
early 1990's (or before) and those who are newer to Immigrant workplace
education. 
 
For more information and background resources for the discussion, please
see below.
 
Lynda Terrill
Adult English language discussion list, moderator
lterrill at cal.org
 
 

Background 

Although the terminology (e.g., VESL. workplace, workforce), venues, and
funding sources may change, the need for effective classes and programs
targeted to meet the needs of immigrant workers and their employers has
remained the same since the early 1980's.  As immigrants join the
workforce, especially in areas experiencing new and rapid growth in
immigrant population such as Georgia, Nebraska, South Carolina,
administrators, teachers, and employers are asking for help. At least
some of the answers can be found by searching the archives from earlier
workplace initiatives.
 

Possible questions to begin the discussion

 

*	What are some of the issues related to improving Immigrant
workers English language skills?
 
*	What are some of the lessons learned from earlier workplace
initiatives?
 
*	What are effective ways of planning, implementing, and
evaluating adult ESL workplace programs?
 
*	How can one get workers, employers, and instructors all on the
same page-so everyone knows what outcomes to expect from the class?
 
*	What curricula, books, and other resources work well in
immigrant workplace classes?
 

Background Reading

To set the stage for next week's discussion, please consider reading one
or more of the following short articles:
 
*	Issues in Improving Immigrant Workers' English Language Skills
http://www.cal.org/caela/esl_resources/digests/Workplaceissues.html 
 
*	English That Works: Preparing Adult English Language Learners
for Success in the Workforce and Community
http://www.cal.org/caela/esl_resources/digests/Englishwks.html
 
*	What are factors to consider when planning for, setting up, and
evaluating a workplace program for immigrant workers? (from Ask CAELA,
December, 2006)            http://www.cal.org/caela/ask_caela/
  
Facilitators
Miriam Burt has worked in the field of adult ESL instruction since 1975.
She has taught, trained teachers, written curricula, and directed
programs both in the United States and abroad. From 1990-1994, she was
the director of the Skills Enhancement Training Program (SET) of the
Food and Beverage Workers Union Local 32 & Employers Benefits Fund, a
U.S.-Department-of- Education-funded workplace-education program that
provided instruction in basic skills, GED, ESL, and communication skills
to cafeteria worker in Washington DC. She has provided technical
assistance to workplace ESL programs in several states including Texas,
where she was an advisory board member for Adult Bilingual Center
Institute, funded by the U.S. Department of Labor to provide educational
services to dislocated workers in El Paso. She has also provided
training to trainers and training directors of the International
Laborers Organization. She is on the advisory board for the Project on
Employers, Immigrant Workers, Intermediaries and Skills Training, The
Center for Workforce Success, National Association of Manufacturers. Her
publications on the immigrant workplace education include briefs (Issues
<http://www.cal.org/caela/esl_resources/digests/Workplaceissues.html>
in Improving Immigrant Workers' English Language Skills, Evaluating
<http://www.cal.org/caela/esl_resources/digests/Burt.html>  Workplace
ESL Programs,
<http://www.cal.org/caela/esl_resources/digests/cheklst.html> and
Assessing Workplace Performance Problems: A Checklist) and monographs (A
Guide for <http://www.seniorserviceamerica.org/news/cal_guide.html>
Providers: Engaging Immigrant Seniors in Community Service and
Employment Programs  and Workplace ESL Instruction:
<http://www.literacynet.org/eslwp/home.html>  Interviews from the
Field.) 
 
 
Sharon McKay has twenty years experience in adult ESL instruction with
the Arlington Education and Employment Program (REEP) in Arlington,
Virginia.  In addition to teaching general ESL, TOEFL prep, and family
literacy, Sharon worked as an ESL instructor and site coordinator in
workplace programs conducted in hotels, property management companies,
landscaping, hospital  and retirement centers. She wrote and
collaborated on multiple curricula and her TESOL Masters' paper is on
the topic of curriculum development for Workplace ESL. She contributed
this work under a national demonstration grant developed to connect
workers with ESL literacy instruction. Sharon is the co-author of the
workforce text with video series, English Works! (Addison Wesley).
 
 
3) Topic: Discussion on Hand-Held Devices in the Classroom 
Where Held: Technology & Literacy Discussion List
When: April 17-19
To participate, subscribe:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Technology
Discussion Announcement 
Dear Technology List Colleagues, 

This January the Tech list went through a process of identifying 
discussion topics we would like to explore this year. Many of you had 
requested a discussion on the use of cell phones, hand-held and portable

devices (like Palm Pilots) in education settings. 

As such, I am very happy to announce that the Technology list will be 
engaging in a special discussion on the use of hand-held and portable 
devices in the classroom. Marilyn Williams, an instructor who 
participated in a practitioner research project on the use of hand-helds

to support student learning will join the tech list to share her three 
years of experience in integrating this technology in to her classroom. 

Marilyn, will join the Tech list from April 17th through April 19th. 
More information will come in the days leading up to the discussion but 
for now, please save the dates. 

Following is a brief introduction that Marilyn asked me to share with 
you all: 

Bio: Hi there! My name is Marilyn Williams and I am a middle school 
teacher in Eugene, Oregon. I've been involved with a number of research 
projects through the University of Oregon and have enjoyed finding new 
ways to incorporate technology into my classroom. Although I'm 
definitely not a 'technie' I've been using handheld computers for the 
last few years and have found them to be a fantastic way to boost 
student involvement and learning. 

Discussion: As educators, we are always striving to better meet the 
needs of all our students. In my inclusion language arts/social studies 
classes, I have found that using handhelds helped to do just that. I 
was so excited to see how this technology motivated my students as well 
as allowed them be more successful in their reading and writing. I'm 
looking forward to discussing this technology application with you. 

Regards, 

Mariann 

Mariann Fedele 
Associate Director, 
NYC Regional Adult Education Network 
Literacy Assistance Center 

Moderator, 
NIFL Technology and Literacy Discussion List 
32 Broadway 10th Floor 
New York, New York 10004 
212-803-3325 
mariannf at lacnyc.org <http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/technology>

www.lacnyc.org <http://www.lacnyc.org/> 
 
 
4) Topic: Planning Health Literacy Awareness Events
Where held: Health & Literacy Discussion List
When: April 23-27, 2007
To participate, subscribe: www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/healthliteracy
 
Guest: Helen Osborne, founder of Health Literacy Month and author of the
"Health Literacy Month Handbook: The Event Planning Guide for Health
Literacy Advocates"
 
Discussion Announcement
 
October is Health Literacy Month, a time when health literacy advocates
around the world promote the importance of making health information
understandable. This annual event actually started with a posting Helen
Osborne made to the Health & Literacy Discussion List in 1999.
Now is the time to start making your plans for Health Literacy Month
2007. Helen will join us for an informative discussion about how you can
help raise local awareness about health literacy this October.
Helen has recently completed the "Health Literacy Month Handbook: The
Event Planning Guide for Health Literacy Advocates" and will share some
of her expertise in this type of event planning including creating a
vision, building a team, running events, and measuring success. We hope
that this discussion will be a forum for health literacy advocates
everywhere to exchange ideas, share resources, and learn from one
another.   
About the guest Speaker:
Recognized as an expert in health literacy, Helen Osborne M.Ed., OTR/L
helps health professionals communicate in ways patients and their
families can understand. She is president of her own business, Health
Literacy Consulting, based in Natick, Massachusetts. Helen is also the
founder of Health Literacy Month - a worldwide campaign to raise
awareness about the importance of understandable health information. 
 
Helen speaks, consults, and writes about health literacy. She is in her
eighth year as a columnist for the Boston Globe's On Call magazine,
writing about patient education and healthcare communication. In
addition to the new Health Literacy Month Handbook, Helen is also the
author of several other books including the award-winning Health
Literacy from A to Z: Practical Ways to Communicate Your Health Message
published by Jones & Bartlett. To learn more about Helen's work, please
visit the Health Literacy Consulting website at www.healthliteracy.com.
 
Recommended Reading:
 
Health Literacy Month Website
http://www.healthliteracy.com/hl_month.asp
This website includes a searchable database of Health Literacy Month
events as well as a form to submit how your organization is
participating. The website has resources including a free downloadable
Health Literacy Month logo.  
 
In Other Words.It's Time to Get Involved in Health Literacy Month
http://www.healthliteracy.com/article.asp?PageID=3752
Published as a column in "On Call Magazine", this article by Helen
Osborne outlines some basics of getting involved in Health Literacy
Month.
 
In Other Words.Why Health Literacy Matters
http://www.healthliteracy.com/article.asp?PageID=3791
This article includes accounts from patients, providers and policy
makers of why we all need to address health literacy.
 
In Other Words.Measuring the Effectiveness of Health Literacy
Interventions
http://www.healthliteracy.com/article.asp?PageID=3753
This article focuses on why it is important to measure the effectiveness
of your health communication efforts. 
 
We hope you can join us for this discussion! Please forward this
announcement to all your colleagues and friends interested in learning
more about awareness-raising events.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Apr 16 07:28:59 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 07:28:59 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 710]  Using Data for Program Improvement begins today!
Message-ID: <025601c7801a$6dd5ed70$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.  
 
Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I
have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this.
 
Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this
is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages.
 
I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use
data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers, please
post your questions and share your own experiences using data.  What
type of data would you like to track and why?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
Discussion Announcement 
Dear Colleagues, 
I'm pleased to announce the following Panel Guest Discussion, which will
be held during the week of April 16 - 20.
Topic: Using Data for Program Improvement 
Guests will discuss the work they have done in using data to improve the
quality of adult literacy programming.  We will hear about the use of
data in small and large programs, as well as at the state and national
levels.  Panelists are interested in your questions and eager to hear
about your use of data, as well as share their own experiences, so
please ask questions and share your stories.  
Recommended preparations for this discussion 
Please use the following guiding questions to help you share how you use
data in your program (or classroom), or how you would like to:
 
*	Do you use data in your program?  What type?  How?  What have
been the results?
*	What information (data) would you like to track and why?  
*	What data would you like to learn how to use?
 
Resources of interest:
 
Using Data Effectively by Donna Cornellier:  see attached Power Point
Presentation.
This PowerPoint outlines a basic framework for identifying, using, and
monitoring data; excellent guiding questions are provided as well as a
case study for practicing the application of the framework.
 
 
Developing & Disseminating Report Cards, Report Card Rubric, Rolling Out
the Report Card.   See attached Power Point Presentations from
University of the State of New York, State Education Department and the
Literacy Assistance Center (LAC).  These presentations outline the
development of a Report Card for measuring the performance of literacy
programming within the state of NY.  A detailed look at scoring the
elements of program performance is provided; presenters also review
their process for informing/ working with stakeholders on the use of
report cards, and report on the first year results of the initiative.
 
 
NRS Publications on data
http://www.nrsweb.org/pubs/
This site has a wealth of resources including the NRS Implementation
Guidelines; NRS Tips offering information on building data systems, and
setting goals and standards; and  Training Guides that provide practical
information and tools that can be used to build and use data systems
effectively.    
 
 
Learning to be an NRS Data Detective
http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/StateDataDetectives.aspx
This training explores how an effective data detective: 
*	Understands the process and psychology of data collection;
*	Examines data including assessment, goal setting, and follow-up
data;
*	Asks further questions of the data; and
*	Makes changes in processes and policies to improve data quality
and program services.
	 
NRS State and Local Report Cards
http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/insights/report_cards.aspx
Report cards can be a powerful and effective tool for accountability and
program improvement if properly used and implemented. There are many
types of report cards, but for the purposes of NRS, our focus is on
report cards that assess performance. Report cards that allow meaningful
evaluation have the following characteristics: 
*	Include outcome and other data,
*	Provide a basis for evaluation of that data, and
*	Present contextual data or interpretive information that aid
interpretation and promote understanding.
Report cards can be used in several different ways to 
*	Evaluate program quality,
*	Promote program improvement, and
*	Inform and advocate for the program.
	 
Guest Participants: 
Toni Borge is the director of the Adult Education & Transitions Program
at Bunker Hill Community College in Boston, Massachusetts. She has a
master's degree in educational administration. Toni is a member of the
TESOL task force that is advising the U.S. Department of Homeland
Security, Office of Citizenship, on redesigning the citizenship test
that is being piloted in 2007.  In May, Toni will present a TESOL
Virtual Seminar entitled "Assessment and Learning: Balancing Program
Performance and Instruction" in which she will discuss effective ways to
manage and balance instruction to meet state and national performance
standards.
 
Dr. Larry Condelli is a managing director of the Adult Education and
Literacy Program in the Education and Human Development Division at the
American Institutes for Research. His work includes research on adult
ESL students, accountability, and conducting professional development
and technical assistance for adult educators. He recently directed the
What Works Study for Adult ESL Literacy Students, the first large-scale
empirical study of the effectiveness of instructional practices for
adult ESL
students, and is currently directing a study of the impact of explicit
literacy instruction on low-literate adult ESOL learners for the U.S.
Department of Education.  He is also the project director for the
National Reporting System and was instrumental in developing this
national accountability system for federally funded adult education and
literacy program. Dr. Condelli's other projects include development of a
performance-based reading assessment for low-literate adults for the
National Assessment of Adult Literacy, funded by the National Center for
Educational Statistics. He is a staff development and data consultant
for the states of Alabama, California, Georgia and Utah and provides
training and technical assistance to adult education staff in several
states. Dr. Condelli holds a Ph.D. in Psychology from the University of
California.
 
Donna Cornellier is the Project Manager for the student level data
system in Massachusetts.  In this role, her responsibilities include
managing the System for Managing Accountability and Results Through
Technology (SMARTT) development team; designing NRS training materials,
and providing training and technical assistance to the local programs on
using NRS data for program improvement. Presentations included how
assessment data is tracked in the student level database and what
reports are available to help programs implement the NRS policies.
Formerly she was the Director of a local ABE program in Massachusetts.
She holds a Masters degree in Educational Leadership and Management.
 
Ajit Gopalakrishnan is an Education Consultant with the Connecticut
State Department of Education's Bureau of Early Childhood, Career and
Adult Education. He manages adult education projects in the areas of
statewide assessment, data management, program accountability, and
technology.
 
Rosemary I. Matt has recently been appointed to the newly developed
position of NRS Liaison for New York State, under the direction of the
Literacy Assistance Center in New York City.  In this role, her
responsibilities include NRS training, data management, and desk
monitoring of all New York State programs.  Prior to this position,
Rosemary has been in education throughout her career, first as a
secondary education mathematics teacher for fifteen years and then as
the director of the New York State staff development consortium in the
mid state.  
 
Karen Mundie has been an adult education professional for over thirty
years. She is the associate director of the Greater Pittsburgh Literacy
Council, a large community-based education organization (42 professional
staff members, 550 volunteers, and 2000 students). She is also the
director of the Southwest Professional Development Center, where she was
the lead trainer in the area of using data for decision-making for three
years.  Karen is a past president of the Pennsylvania Association for
Adult and Continuing Education (PAACE) and was Pennsylvania's
Outstanding Adult Educator for 2005. She holds two masters' degrees from
the University of Virginia. 
Joanie Rethlake, native Texan, is the state director for adult education
for Texas LEARNS, the state office for adult education in Houston, Texas
and has responsibility for administering the state's adult education
program and directing the technical assistance and professional
development offered to adult education and family literacy programs
across Texas.  Formerly, she was the director of adult education at
Harris County Department of Education and past president of the Texas
Association for Literacy and Adult Education (TALAE). 
Sandy Strunk is Program Director for Community Education at Lancaster
Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13. In this role, she provides leadership for
several educational programs including Adult Basic Education, the Adult
Education Southeast Professional Development Center, Early Reading
First, English as a Second Language, Family Literacy, Head Start, Organ
and Tissue Donation Awareness Education and Workforce Education. Sandy
has been an adult education practitioner for over twenty years. She is a
past president of the PA Association for Adult Continuing Education,
provided leadership to Pennsylvania's adult education program
improvement training system for six years (1997 - 2003) and continues to
provide leadership for Pennsylvania's family literacy program
improvement initiative (SEQUAL). She serves on the advisory board of the
Goodling Institute for Research in Family Literacy and is particularly
interested in educational interventions that focus on the family unit.
Sandy has a B.S. in education from Lock Haven University and a M.Ed. in
Training and Development from Penn State University.
 
Luanne Teller is the Director of Massasoit Community College's Stoughton
ABE (ESOL) and Transitions to College Programs.  She was involved in
establishing and developing of both programs.  Prior to these positions,
she was the Coordinator of an Office Skills Job Training Program, which
provided employment skills training to empower women to transition off
of public assistance into full-time careers.  She holds a degree in
secondary education (French and Spanish).  She has served on a variety
of board and committees, as both a volunteer and elected official.  She
is currently a member of the Board of Directors for the Greater Plymouth
County United Way.  She has extensive experience using research data and
communicating with a wide range of constituencies to develop effective
program plans, and to promote the commitment to continuous improvement.
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From Ajit.Gopalakrishnan at ct.gov  Mon Apr 16 10:32:10 2007
From: Ajit.Gopalakrishnan at ct.gov (Gopalakrishnan, Ajit)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 10:32:10 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 711] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins
 today!
In-Reply-To: <025601c7801a$6dd5ed70$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <281DD0D97E3EC94FB83030B1379CE426027D1C66@DOIT-EX302.exec.ds.state.ct.us>

Good morning Marie. Thanks for giving me the opportunity to share my
ideas with the members of this list. You asked, "I'll start us off by
asking our guests to briefly describe how they use data in their work to
improve literacy services." 

 

I will begin my comments from my perspective as state agency staff
member. In my opinion, if we (at the state office) want local programs
to utilize data for program improvement, we have to continuously model
those behaviors at the state level. We have used data to:

*	inform the development of our policies and recommendations;
*	highlight program practices that need attention;
*	target providers for on-site monitoring;
*	identify high-performing providers to learn from, about
strategies that work; 
*	provide technical assistance and feedback; and
*	enhance our professional development model.

 

Ajit

Ajit Gopalakrishnan 
Connecticut Department of Education 
25 Industrial Park Road 
Middletown, CT 06457 
Phone: (860) 807-2125 
Fax: (860) 807-2062 
Email: ajit.gopalakrishnan at ct.gov 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today!

 

Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.  

 

Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I
have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this.

 

Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this
is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages.

 

I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use
data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers, please
post your questions and share your own experiences using data.  What
type of data would you like to track and why?

 

Thanks!

 

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 

**********

Discussion Announcement 

Dear Colleagues, 

I'm pleased to announce the following Panel Guest Discussion, which will
be held during the week of April 16 - 20.

Topic: Using Data for Program Improvement 

Guests will discuss the work they have done in using data to improve the
quality of adult literacy programming.  We will hear about the use of
data in small and large programs, as well as at the state and national
levels.  Panelists are interested in your questions and eager to hear
about your use of data, as well as share their own experiences, so
please ask questions and share your stories.  

Recommended preparations for this discussion 

Please use the following guiding questions to help you share how you use
data in your program (or classroom), or how you would like to:

 

*	Do you use data in your program?  What type?  How?  What have
been the results?
*	What information (data) would you like to track and why?  
*	What data would you like to learn how to use?

 

Resources of interest:

 

Using Data Effectively by Donna Cornellier:  see attached Power Point
Presentation.

This PowerPoint outlines a basic framework for identifying, using, and
monitoring data; excellent guiding questions are provided as well as a
case study for practicing the application of the framework.

 

 

Developing & Disseminating Report Cards, Report Card Rubric, Rolling Out
the Report Card.   See attached Power Point Presentations from
University of the State of New York, State Education Department and the
Literacy Assistance Center (LAC).  These presentations outline the
development of a Report Card for measuring the performance of literacy
programming within the state of NY.  A detailed look at scoring the
elements of program performance is provided; presenters also review
their process for informing/ working with stakeholders on the use of
report cards, and report on the first year results of the initiative.

 

 

NRS Publications on data

http://www.nrsweb.org/pubs/

This site has a wealth of resources including the NRS Implementation
Guidelines; NRS Tips offering information on building data systems, and
setting goals and standards; and  Training Guides that provide practical
information and tools that can be used to build and use data systems
effectively.    

 

 

Learning to be an NRS Data Detective

http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/StateDataDetectives.aspx

This training explores how an effective data detective: 

*	Understands the process and psychology of data collection;
*	Examines data including assessment, goal setting, and follow-up
data;
*	Asks further questions of the data; and

*         Makes changes in processes and policies to improve data
quality and program services.

 

NRS State and Local Report Cards

http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/insights/report_cards.aspx

Report cards can be a powerful and effective tool for accountability and
program improvement if properly used and implemented. There are many
types of report cards, but for the purposes of NRS, our focus is on
report cards that assess performance. Report cards that allow meaningful
evaluation have the following characteristics: 

*         Include outcome and other data,

*         Provide a basis for evaluation of that data, and

*         Present contextual data or interpretive information that aid
interpretation and promote understanding.

Report cards can be used in several different ways to 

*         Evaluate program quality,

*         Promote program improvement, and

*         Inform and advocate for the program.

 

Guest Participants: 

Toni Borge is the director of the Adult Education & Transitions Program
at Bunker Hill Community College in Boston, Massachusetts. She has a
master's degree in educational administration. Toni is a member of the
TESOL task force that is advising the U.S. Department of Homeland
Security, Office of Citizenship, on redesigning the citizenship test
that is being piloted in 2007.  In May, Toni will present a TESOL
Virtual Seminar entitled "Assessment and Learning: Balancing Program
Performance and Instruction" in which she will discuss effective ways to
manage and balance instruction to meet state and national performance
standards.

 

Dr. Larry Condelli is a managing director of the Adult Education and
Literacy Program in the Education and Human Development Division at the
American Institutes for Research. His work includes research on adult
ESL students, accountability, and conducting professional development
and technical assistance for adult educators. He recently directed the
What Works Study for Adult ESL Literacy Students, the first large-scale
empirical study of the effectiveness of instructional practices for
adult ESL

students, and is currently directing a study of the impact of explicit
literacy instruction on low-literate adult ESOL learners for the U.S.
Department of Education.  He is also the project director for the
National Reporting System and was instrumental in developing this
national accountability system for federally funded adult education and
literacy program. Dr. Condelli's other projects include development of a
performance-based reading assessment for low-literate adults for the
National Assessment of Adult Literacy, funded by the National Center for
Educational Statistics. He is a staff development and data consultant
for the states of Alabama, California, Georgia and Utah and provides
training and technical assistance to adult education staff in several
states. Dr. Condelli holds a Ph.D. in Psychology from the University of
California.

 

Donna Cornellier is the Project Manager for the student level data
system in Massachusetts.  In this role, her responsibilities include
managing the System for Managing Accountability and Results Through
Technology (SMARTT) development team; designing NRS training materials,
and providing training and technical assistance to the local programs on
using NRS data for program improvement. Presentations included how
assessment data is tracked in the student level database and what
reports are available to help programs implement the NRS policies.
Formerly she was the Director of a local ABE program in Massachusetts.
She holds a Masters degree in Educational Leadership and Management.

 

Ajit Gopalakrishnan is an Education Consultant with the Connecticut
State Department of Education's Bureau of Early Childhood, Career and
Adult Education. He manages adult education projects in the areas of
statewide assessment, data management, program accountability, and
technology.

 

Rosemary I. Matt has recently been appointed to the newly developed
position of NRS Liaison for New York State, under the direction of the
Literacy Assistance Center in New York City.  In this role, her
responsibilities include NRS training, data management, and desk
monitoring of all New York State programs.  Prior to this position,
Rosemary has been in education throughout her career, first as a
secondary education mathematics teacher for fifteen years and then as
the director of the New York State staff development consortium in the
mid state.  

 

Karen Mundie has been an adult education professional for over thirty
years. She is the associate director of the Greater Pittsburgh Literacy
Council, a large community-based education organization (42 professional
staff members, 550 volunteers, and 2000 students). She is also the
director of the Southwest Professional Development Center, where she was
the lead trainer in the area of using data for decision-making for three
years.  Karen is a past president of the Pennsylvania Association for
Adult and Continuing Education (PAACE) and was Pennsylvania's
Outstanding Adult Educator for 2005. She holds two masters' degrees from
the University of Virginia. 

Joanie Rethlake, native Texan, is the state director for adult education
for Texas LEARNS, the state office for adult education in Houston, Texas
and has responsibility for administering the state's adult education
program and directing the technical assistance and professional
development offered to adult education and family literacy programs
across Texas.  Formerly, she was the director of adult education at
Harris County Department of Education and past president of the Texas
Association for Literacy and Adult Education (TALAE). 

Sandy Strunk is Program Director for Community Education at Lancaster
Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13. In this role, she provides leadership for
several educational programs including Adult Basic Education, the Adult
Education Southeast Professional Development Center, Early Reading
First, English as a Second Language, Family Literacy, Head Start, Organ
and Tissue Donation Awareness Education and Workforce Education. Sandy
has been an adult education practitioner for over twenty years. She is a
past president of the PA Association for Adult Continuing Education,
provided leadership to Pennsylvania's adult education program
improvement training system for six years (1997 - 2003) and continues to
provide leadership for Pennsylvania's family literacy program
improvement initiative (SEQUAL). She serves on the advisory board of the
Goodling Institute for Research in Family Literacy and is particularly
interested in educational interventions that focus on the family unit.
Sandy has a B.S. in education from Lock Haven University and a M.Ed. in
Training and Development from Penn State University.

 

Luanne Teller is the Director of Massasoit Community College's Stoughton
ABE (ESOL) and Transitions to College Programs.  She was involved in
establishing and developing of both programs.  Prior to these positions,
she was the Coordinator of an Office Skills Job Training Program, which
provided employment skills training to empower women to transition off
of public assistance into full-time careers.  She holds a degree in
secondary education (French and Spanish).  She has served on a variety
of board and committees, as both a volunteer and elected official.  She
is currently a member of the Board of Directors for the Greater Plymouth
County United Way.  She has extensive experience using research data and
communicating with a wide range of constituencies to develop effective
program plans, and to promote the commitment to continuous improvement.

 

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Apr 16 11:12:12 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 11:12:12 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 712]  Resources for Data Discussion
Message-ID: <02a501c78039$9d2b72b0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
Ok, I have the Power Points available for you all now:
 
For the Power Point from Donna Cornellier, go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html
and scroll down to the bottom of that page.  You'll see the resources
listed there.
 
For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on these links:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingR
eportCards.ppt
 
If anyone has difficulties opening/viewing these resources, please email
to let me know.
 
Thanks,
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From LCondelli at air.org  Mon Apr 16 11:44:03 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 11:44:03 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins
	today!
In-Reply-To: <025601c7801a$6dd5ed70$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B253092B@dc1ex03.air.org>

Hi Everyone,
 
It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks to
Marie for asking me and organizing this.
 
There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for program
improvement at the state and level.  Through the National Reporting
system project which I direct, we have conducted several training and
technical assistance activities over the past 4 years on this topic,
including two general training seminars on using data and more specific
ones on promoting adult education programs, monitoring, developing state
and local report cards. All of the training materials and other
information on the topic, including sample work from states, is
available on the NRSWeb website, which Marie has referenced. 
 
All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work and
many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a trainer
for us a few years back).
 
I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your
experiences, as well as the responses from the other guests.
________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today!

Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.  
 
Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I
have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this.
 
Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this
is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages.
 
I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use
data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers, please
post your questions and share your own experiences using data.  What
type of data would you like to track and why?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Apr 16 13:29:08 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 13:29:08 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 714] Just joining us? Here's what you need to know...
Message-ID: <030201c7804c$bdc8ed00$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi folks,
 
A number of subscribers have just joined us and so I would like to give
them the necessary info for joining our discussion.  Please post your
questions and share your experiences now!
 
View the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html to get up to
date with the current conversation.
 
See suggested resources at:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html
(Scroll to the bottom!!)
See more resources at:  
For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on these links:

http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt

http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt

http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingR
eportCards.ppt

Here are your prompts:  add your voice!: 

* Do you use data in your program? What type? How? What have been the
results? 

* What information (data) would you like to track and why? 

* What data would you like to learn how to use? 

Thanks!!
 
Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 <http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Mon Apr 16 14:40:36 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 11:40:36 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 715] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
	begins	today!
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B253092B@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <OF5C6D473E.078FD715-ON072572BF.00663080-072572BF.00669863@yc.edu>

Hi there,

 I like to use state database information to show me which teachers are 
needing assistance and which teachers are modeling good practices. The 
database is certainly not a final word, as we all have had groups of 
students that performed well or poorly regardless of instruction.  The 
data is a good place to show red flags, however. Student assessments and 
staff self-assessments are also great for predicting professional 
development needs. Data can also help us see what people groups we are 
reaching with advertising, and which people groups are not. Then we can 
create new means of recruitment for our program.

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

"Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
04/16/2007 09:15 AM
Please respond to
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To
"The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
cc

Subject
[Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins  today!

Hi Everyone,
 
It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks to 
Marie for asking me and organizing this.
 
There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for program 
improvement at the state and level.  Through the National Reporting system 
project which I direct, we have conducted several training and technical 
assistance activities over the past 4 years on this topic, including two 
general training seminars on using data and more specific ones on 
promoting adult education programs, monitoring, developing state and local 
report cards. All of the training materials and other information on the 
topic, including sample work from states, is available on the NRSWeb 
website, which Marie has referenced. 
 
All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work and 
many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a trainer 
for us a few years back).
 
I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your experiences, 
as well as the responses from the other guests.

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On 
Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins today!

Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all. 
 
Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I have 
pasted the announcement below ? please note that there have been some 
edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they are 
power points) but I?m having a tough time getting them through the server. 
 For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I arrange access 
to the Power Points, I?ll let you know.  If you received the original 
announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments already (?Using 
Data Effectively DCornellier?).  Thank you for your patience with this.
 
Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot?s Day and is 
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as 
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this is 
fine ? they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to begin, 
please feel free to post your messages.
 
I?ll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use 
data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers, please post 
your questions and share your own experiences using data.  What type of 
data would you like to track and why?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From sandy_strunk at IU13.org  Mon Apr 16 15:13:51 2007
From: sandy_strunk at IU13.org (Sandy Strunk)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 15:13:51 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 716]  Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B253092B@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F14D0@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>

Good afternoon, everyone, and many thanks to Marie for putting this
panel together. Using data for decision-making has been a passion of
mine for some time. I think by nature, I'm just one of those people who
always has questions about things - and I love testing my assumptions
about how the world works. It started some years ago when Pennsylvania
first began its work with Project EQUAL (Educational Quality for Adult
Literacy). Judy Alamprese was our professional developer and she
challenged each of our sites to pose a question related to program
improvement, collect some data related to the question, analyze that
data, and then develop a program improvement plan based on our data
analysis. I took to the process like a fish to water.

 

I still remember the first teacher I walked through this process with.
She was a beginning ESL teacher - one of our best. She wanted to know if
she was teaching the sorts of things her students were most interested
in learning. This sounds fairly basic, but when none of your students
speak English, it's a challenge to know if what you're teaching is what
they most want to learn. To collect our data, we partnered with the
Advanced ESL class and had them translate some basic questions into nine
languages. At that time, our beginning curriculum was based on work
skills and basic communication for the workplace. What we learned was
that this particular cohort of students wanted to learn about shopping
and healthcare - work skills were at the bottom of their list! More
importantly, we learned that our assumptions about what students want
and need to learn are not always accurate.  We were teaching job prep
when they wanted to know how to order a quarter pounder with fries
(we've since started a health literacy unit, as well ;-).

 

That was the start of a program improvement process that we have used in
our local program ever since. We have a program improvement team - which
most years, is representative of all facets of our adult education
program. I say most years because this year, for the first time, the
program improvement team is limited to site managers and supervisors who
have been working together to develop an ongoing progress monitoring
system. Our progress monitoring system provides our learners with
individual written feedback on a quarterly basis related to their actual
attendance compared to the number of class hours available, achievement
on standardized assessments they have completed, and goal attainment
related to what they told us they wanted to achieve when they enrolled.
This is the first year that we have shared written progress data with
our learners in this manner. If using data for decision-making is a
powerful tool for changing what we do, we wondered what impact the data
might have on our learners. Our assumption is that it will have a
positive impact on student retention, but implementation isn't stable
enough yet to do a comparison study. I'd love to know if anyone else is
doing this sort of written student feedback and what they've learned as
a result.

 

Other ways we use data? Well, we always have one or two action research
or inquiry projects running. Last year, two of our staff did a great
action research project on the question, "Why do some of our students
complete our orientation process but never reach enrollment status?"
When this question came up in our program improvement meetings, we all
had opinions (our team is never at a loss for opinions). Some speculated
that "childcare and transportation" are the issues. Some of us were
quick to suggest that "childcare and transportation" are the universal
retention scapegoats for our field. Others felt that quality teaching
was the issue. Still others suggested that the problem rests with the
motivation of our learners. Without data for decision-making, we would
have no mechanism for moving this discussion beyond the opinion stage.

 

We also collect customer satisfaction data twice a year. One day in the
Fall and one day in the Spring we survey everyone who is in class with a
simple instrument that rates the student's satisfaction with the
classroom environment, the teacher, instructional materials, and goals.
In fact, we just finished our Spring cycle and last week I got the
report comparing our Spring 2007 student satisfaction numbers to our
Spring 2006 numbers. Here's an interesting snippet - 69% of our family
literacy students (N=42) strongly agree that they can use what they
learn in class at home or at work. 58% of our ESL students (N=263)
strongly agree. 27% of our ABE/GED students (N=150) strongly agree.
Another interesting tidbit - 76% of our family literacy students
strongly agree that the teacher starts class on time. 86% of our ESL
students strongly agree. 59% of our ABE/GED students strongly agree.
Well, as usual, one question always leads to another. I'm not exactly
sure how to make sense of these numbers, but my next step will be to
look at the disaggregated data by classroom. The good news is that all
of these percentages are up from last year. Either we're doing better or
we have an especially agreeable cohort of learners.

 

I think the point I want to make is - for us, data for decision-making
is tied to our constant curiosity about the work we do. Yes, we
routinely look at our performance against state standards - but that's a
routine part of our work. The more interesting investigations tend to
stem from something we notice and wonder about. Like - do ABE/GED
teachers in our program really start class later than ESL teachers or
does it just seem that way because so many of them start the day with
individual work rather than group lessons?

 

Sandy Strunk

Program Director for Community Education

Lancaster-Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13

1020 New Holland Avenue

Lancaster, PA 17601

(717) 606-1873

________________________________

 

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From LCondelli at air.org  Mon Apr 16 15:15:51 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 15:15:51 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 717] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <OF5C6D473E.078FD715-ON072572BF.00663080-072572BF.00669863@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530934@dc1ex03.air.org>

Hi Tina,
 
Using the data to identify which teachers need help and what is good
practice is very intriguing idea.  Can you tell us more about that --
what indicators you use, for example?

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 2:41 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 715] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today!

Hi there, 

 I like to use state database information to show me which teachers are
needing assistance and which teachers are modeling good practices. The
database is certainly not a final word, as we all have had groups of
students that performed well or poorly regardless of instruction.  The
data is a good place to show red flags, however. Student assessments and
staff self-assessments are also great for predicting professional
development needs. Data can also help us see what people groups we are
reaching with advertising, and which people groups are not. Then we can
create new means of recruitment for our program. 

Tina 

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu 

"Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

04/16/2007 09:15 AM 
Please respond to
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To
"The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov> 
cc
Subject
[Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today!

	

Hi Everyone, 
  
It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks to
Marie for asking me and organizing this. 
  
There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for program
improvement at the state and level.  Through the National Reporting
system project which I direct, we have conducted several training and
technical assistance activities over the past 4 years on this topic,
including two general training seminars on using data and more specific
ones on promoting adult education programs, monitoring, developing state
and local report cards. All of the training materials and other
information on the topic, including sample work from states, is
available on the NRSWeb website, which Marie has referenced. 
  
All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work and
many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a trainer
for us a few years back). 
  
I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your
experiences, as well as the responses from the other guests. 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today!

Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.   
  
Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I
have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this. 
  
Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this
is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages. 
  
I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use
data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers, please
post your questions and share your own experiences using data.  What
type of data would you like to track and why? 
  
Thanks! 
  
Marie Cora 
Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
 -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From barguedas at sfccnm.edu  Mon Apr 16 15:25:04 2007
From: barguedas at sfccnm.edu (Barbara Arguedas)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 13:25:04 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 718] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <OF5C6D473E.078FD715-ON072572BF.00663080-072572BF.00669863@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C3CF@ex01.sfcc.edu>

Hello Tina,

I wonder if you could say more about what exact data you use to see what
your teachers need.  Is it attendance or level gain, or something else?

 

We use attendance data to track total hours students are attending and
to determine if they are eligible to post-test (minimum of 40 hours in
NM).  If students attend at least 75% of the potential hours, then the
student is eligible to get a certificate at the end of the session
(usually a 12-week session that meets 5 hours each week).  We also see
what the overall retention rate is by teacher as well as the post-test
rate and the level gain rate.  I agree that these could indicate a need
for training.

 

We are interested in other ways that programs use data to help with
retention.  Thank you.

 

Barbara Arguedas

Santa Fe Community College

Santa Fe, NM

 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 12:41 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 715] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today!

 

Hi there, 

 I like to use state database information to show me which teachers are
needing assistance and which teachers are modeling good practices. The
database is certainly not a final word, as we all have had groups of
students that performed well or poorly regardless of instruction.  The
data is a good place to show red flags, however. Student assessments and
staff self-assessments are also great for predicting professional
development needs. Data can also help us see what people groups we are
reaching with advertising, and which people groups are not. Then we can
create new means of recruitment for our program. 

Tina 

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu 

"Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

04/16/2007 09:15 AM 

Please respond to
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To

"The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov> 

cc

 

Subject

[Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today!

 

 

 

Hi Everyone, 
  
It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks to
Marie for asking me and organizing this. 
  
There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for program
improvement at the state and level.  Through the National Reporting
system project which I direct, we have conducted several training and
technical assistance activities over the past 4 years on this topic,
including two general training seminars on using data and more specific
ones on promoting adult education programs, monitoring, developing state
and local report cards. All of the training materials and other
information on the topic, including sample work from states, is
available on the NRSWeb website, which Marie has referenced. 
  
All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work and
many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a trainer
for us a few years back). 
  
I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your
experiences, as well as the responses from the other guests. 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today!

Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.   
  
Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I
have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this. 
  
Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this
is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages. 
  
I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use
data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers, please
post your questions and share your own experiences using data.  What
type of data would you like to track and why? 
  
Thanks! 
  
Marie Cora 
Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
 -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

-------------- next part --------------
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From sandy_strunk at IU13.org  Mon Apr 16 15:29:42 2007
From: sandy_strunk at IU13.org (Sandy Strunk)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 15:29:42 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 719] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <OF5C6D473E.078FD715-ON072572BF.00663080-072572BF.00669863@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F14E9@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>

Tina and Larry,

I do this, too, but I'm also very interested in positive deviance. How
is it that some teachers, who work in very challenging settings, are
able to produce such significant results? For example, there's a teacher
in our program, let's call her Miranda, who consistently has high
enrollment, wonderful retention and excellent student achievement. I can
assign her to ABE/GED, ESL, family literacy, day, evening - it just
doesn't seem to matter. It's a much harder data collection question,
because she thinks she's doing what everyone else is doing and,
ostensibly, she is. What jumps out at me when I visit her class is the
sense of community she's able to build that seems to be based on her
belief that her students will accomplish great things. 

 

Sandy Strunk

Program Director for Community Education

Lancaster-Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13

1020 New Holland Avenue

Lancaster, PA 17601

(717) 606-1873

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 2:41 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 715] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today!

 

Hi there, 

 I like to use state database information to show me which teachers are
needing assistance and which teachers are modeling good practices. The
database is certainly not a final word, as we all have had groups of
students that performed well or poorly regardless of instruction.  The
data is a good place to show red flags, however. Student assessments and
staff self-assessments are also great for predicting professional
development needs. Data can also help us see what people groups we are
reaching with advertising, and which people groups are not. Then we can
create new means of recruitment for our program. 

Tina 

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu 

"Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

04/16/2007 09:15 AM 

Please respond to
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To

"The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov> 

cc

 

Subject

[Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today!

 

 

 

Hi Everyone, 
  
It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks to
Marie for asking me and organizing this. 
  
There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for program
improvement at the state and level.  Through the National Reporting
system project which I direct, we have conducted several training and
technical assistance activities over the past 4 years on this topic,
including two general training seminars on using data and more specific
ones on promoting adult education programs, monitoring, developing state
and local report cards. All of the training materials and other
information on the topic, including sample work from states, is
available on the NRSWeb website, which Marie has referenced. 
  
All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work and
many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a trainer
for us a few years back). 
  
I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your
experiences, as well as the responses from the other guests. 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today!

Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.   
  
Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I
have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this. 
  
Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this
is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages. 
  
I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use
data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers, please
post your questions and share your own experiences using data.  What
type of data would you like to track and why? 
  
Thanks! 
  
Marie Cora 
Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
 -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Mon Apr 16 15:56:58 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 12:56:58 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 720] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530934@dc1ex03.air.org>
References: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530934@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <OFB3ACDC92.D48E315E-ON072572BF.006D95F8-072572BF.006D95F9@yc.edu>

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From mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us  Mon Apr 16 17:03:22 2007
From: mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us (Mary Beheler)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 17:03:22 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 721] Re: What about us little guys using volunteers for
	one-on-one tutoring?
In-Reply-To: <030201c7804c$bdc8ed00$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMIEAOCEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>

MessageWe tutor adults. No children.
Almost all our students are at Begining Literacy to High Intermediate ABE
level. Almost no high or even low adult secondary. At the secondary level we
only get the students that can't (or won't) tolerate study in a regular ABE
classroom. ESL instruction is done by a different organization, with paid
teachers.

We net 20 to 25 students with more than 12 hours of study each year. We are
so small that sometimes an entire FFL will have only one student in it. When
that happens the only question is, "How many advanced a level: 0 or 100%?"

We deal with students on a highly individualized basis. One may need to
learn to read again after having a stroke or a fever. Another may have
taught himself to sight read at a very high level, but neglected to teach
himself any spelling or writing skills. A high school graduate may not have
learned even his ABCs, for whatever reason. One or two students a year might
have an employment or higher education goal. (Then WV can't verify it, if
the student works or studies out of state.)  I can safely say that no two
students have been alike in the nearly ten years that I have been here.

I genuinely *like* statistics and know they can be very useful, and don't
mind gathering data to be put in a bigger pool if what comes back is
helpful. However, if a level has only 3 students, is the data even
"statistically significant" if just 2 of them are available for both pre and
post assessment? 2 of 4?

Some things are better seen by microscopes and others by telescopes. Right
now neither NRS nor CASAS seems especially useful at a local level. Maybe
all I need is to find out how to focus them. Maybe they should be just
trashed. They may cost more to use than they return in terms of time and
money and *stress*, on us and especially on our students.

I'm from West Virginia, not Missouri, but, "Show me!" (Please.)

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156
  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
  Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 1:29 PM
  To: Assessment at nifl.gov
  Subject: [Assessment 714] Just joining us? Here's what you need to know...

  Hi folks,

  A number of subscribers have just joined us and so I would like to give
them the necessary info for joining our discussion.  Please post your
questions and share your experiences now!

  View the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html to get up to date
with the current conversation.

  See suggested resources at:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html
(Scroll to the bottom!!)
  See more resources at:
  For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on these links:

  http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt

  http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt

  http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingRep
ortCards.ppt

  Here are your prompts:  add your voice!:

  * Do you use data in your program? What type? How? What have been the
results?

  * What information (data) would you like to track and why?

  * What data would you like to learn how to use?

  Thanks!!

  Marie Cora

  Marie Cora
  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
  NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
  http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Mon Apr 16 17:40:20 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 14:40:20 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 722] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F14E9@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>
References: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F14E9@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>
Message-ID: <OFBFBD65D1.5791ADAB-ON072572BF.00770CAD-072572BF.00770CAE@yc.edu>

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From sandy_strunk at IU13.org  Mon Apr 16 17:58:08 2007
From: sandy_strunk at IU13.org (Sandy Strunk)
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2007 17:58:08 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 723] Re: What about us little guys using volunteers
	forone-on-one tutoring?
In-Reply-To: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMIEAOCEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>
Message-ID: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F1579@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>

Mary,

I think you raise some valid concerns. When you're working with a small
pool of students like this, aggregate statistics can be rather
meaningless. I would think the most helpful data for you would be
individual diagnostic reading assessment and progress monitoring data.
Are you familiar with the Adult Reading Component study and the work
related to using reading profiles? You might want to check out
http://www.nifl.gov/readingprofiles/. I'm wondering if the component
reading assessments wouldn't go a long way toward "focusing" the reading
instruction you offer based on each learner's profile. That doesn't get
you off the hook for NRS reporting, but it does provide a mechanism for
meeting the highly individual needs of your learners. Just a thought.

 

Sandy Strunk

Program Director for Community Education

Lancaster-Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13

1020 New Holland Avenue

Lancaster, PA 17601

(717) 606-1873

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Mary Beheler
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 5:03 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 721] Re: What about us little guys using volunteers
forone-on-one tutoring?

 

We tutor adults. No children.

Almost all our students are at Begining Literacy to High Intermediate
ABE level. Almost no high or even low adult secondary. At the secondary
level we only get the students that can't (or won't) tolerate study in a
regular ABE classroom. ESL instruction is done by a different
organization, with paid teachers.

 

We net 20 to 25 students with more than 12 hours of study each year. We
are so small that sometimes an entire FFL will have only one student in
it. When that happens the only question is, "How many advanced a level:
0 or 100%?"

 

We deal with students on a highly individualized basis. One may need to
learn to read again after having a stroke or a fever. Another may have
taught himself to sight read at a very high level, but neglected to
teach himself any spelling or writing skills. A high school graduate may
not have learned even his ABCs, for whatever reason. One or two students
a year might have an employment or higher education goal. (Then WV can't
verify it, if the student works or studies out of state.)  I can safely
say that no two students have been alike in the nearly ten years that I
have been here.

 

I genuinely *like* statistics and know they can be very useful, and
don't mind gathering data to be put in a bigger pool if what comes back
is helpful. However, if a level has only 3 students, is the data even
"statistically significant" if just 2 of them are available for both pre
and post assessment? 2 of 4? 

 

Some things are better seen by microscopes and others by telescopes.
Right now neither NRS nor CASAS seems especially useful at a local
level. Maybe all I need is to find out how to focus them. Maybe they
should be just trashed. They may cost more to use than they return in
terms of time and money and *stress*, on us and especially on our
students.

 

I'm from West Virginia, not Missouri, but, "Show me!" (Please.)

 

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156 

	-----Original Message-----
	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Marie Cora
	Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 1:29 PM
	To: Assessment at nifl.gov
	Subject: [Assessment 714] Just joining us? Here's what you need
to know...

	Hi folks,

	 

	A number of subscribers have just joined us and so I would like
to give them the necessary info for joining our discussion.  Please post
your questions and share your experiences now!

	 

	View the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html to get up to
date with the current conversation.

	 

	See suggested resources at:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html
(Scroll to the bottom!!)

	See more resources at:  

	For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on these
links:

	
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt

	
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt

	
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingR
eportCards.ppt

	Here are your prompts: add your voice!:

	* Do you use data in your program? What type? How? What have
been the results? 

	* What information (data) would you like to track and why? 

	* What data would you like to learn how to use? 

	Thanks!!

	 

	Marie Cora

	 

	 

	 

	Marie Cora

	marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
<mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

	NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

	Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

	http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

	 

	 

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From rosemarym at lacnyc.org  Tue Apr 17 07:38:45 2007
From: rosemarym at lacnyc.org (Rosemary Matt)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 07:38:45 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 724] Re: What about us little guys using
	volunteersforone-on-one tutoring?
References: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F1579@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92CE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

Good Morning Everyone!
 
I am sorry to be so late joining the group.  I am one of the panelists, Rosemary Matt.  Just recently, I accepted the position of NRS Liaison for New York State so monitoring data and providing technical assistance to programs in need is now my entire focus.  We also have a large contingent of programs that provide service through a volunteer network in a one to one tutoring arrangement.  Your concerns Mary regarding the inability for programs such as these to meet performance benchmarks is shared by New York programs as well.  Our state department has thoroughly considered the population these folks serve and consider that to be a mitigating circumstance when assessing their performance.  The value of these organizations serving some of our lowest skilled readers is well known and appreciated.  In a state the size of New York it is possible to absorb the lack of educational gain increments from these agencies as they are balanced by other programs serving students for whom gain is eminent.  
 
At the same time however we have worked closely with these programs and their statewide leadership team to provide technical assistance in the area of assessment.  As they learn more about the strategies and nuances that evolve around the NRS accountability system, they are better able to show whatever gain is possible from their students.  
 
As some of you are aware, New York also utilizes the program level Report Card.  We attended the training two years ago that was provided by Larry and his staff at AIR.  I would strongly recommend this training to any state considering this accountability tool for programs.  We have made incredible advances in terms of identifying high performing programs and targeting those in need of technical assistance through our Report Card Rubric.  Marie has posted three power points that I offer in training built around this rubric.  To further support our volunteer programs, our state department has chosen to rank these programs among themselves providing a homogeneous category specific to their needs.  They are not measured against the cohort of traditional adult education programs.
 
Another strategy we have recently embarked upon is through our statewide data system, we have introduced Collaboration Metrics.  Many students working first with these volunteer programs while they are at minimal skill levels will eventually move into traditional programming and continue to succeed through the educational levels.  To ensure the volunteer programs remain tied to the student's success, they are informed of the students progress through the data system and can subsequently report on that gain as well.  
 
These few methods of support have been well received by our volunteer affiliates.  Hope they may give you and your state some thoughts for the future.
Rosemary
 
 
 
Rosemary I. Matt
NRS Liaison for NYS
Literacy Assistance Center
12 Meadowbrook Drive
New Hartford, NY 13413
315.798.1026

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Sandy Strunk
Sent: Mon 4/16/2007 5:58 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 723] Re: What about us little guys using volunteersforone-on-one tutoring?

Mary,

I think you raise some valid concerns. When you're working with a small pool of students like this, aggregate statistics can be rather meaningless. I would think the most helpful data for you would be individual diagnostic reading assessment and progress monitoring data. Are you familiar with the Adult Reading Component study and the work related to using reading profiles? You might want to check out http://www.nifl.gov/readingprofiles/. I'm wondering if the component reading assessments wouldn't go a long way toward "focusing" the reading instruction you offer based on each learner's profile. That doesn't get you off the hook for NRS reporting, but it does provide a mechanism for meeting the highly individual needs of your learners. Just a thought.

 

Sandy Strunk

Program Director for Community Education

Lancaster-Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13

1020 New Holland Avenue

Lancaster, PA 17601

(717) 606-1873

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Mary Beheler
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 5:03 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 721] Re: What about us little guys using volunteers forone-on-one tutoring?

 

We tutor adults. No children.

Almost all our students are at Begining Literacy to High Intermediate ABE level. Almost no high or even low adult secondary. At the secondary level we only get the students that can't (or won't) tolerate study in a regular ABE classroom. ESL instruction is done by a different organization, with paid teachers.

 

We net 20 to 25 students with more than 12 hours of study each year. We are so small that sometimes an entire FFL will have only one student in it. When that happens the only question is, "How many advanced a level: 0 or 100%?"

 

We deal with students on a highly individualized basis. One may need to learn to read again after having a stroke or a fever. Another may have taught himself to sight read at a very high level, but neglected to teach himself any spelling or writing skills. A high school graduate may not have learned even his ABCs, for whatever reason. One or two students a year might have an employment or higher education goal. (Then WV can't verify it, if the student works or studies out of state.)  I can safely say that no two students have been alike in the nearly ten years that I have been here.

 

I genuinely *like* statistics and know they can be very useful, and don't mind gathering data to be put in a bigger pool if what comes back is helpful. However, if a level has only 3 students, is the data even "statistically significant" if just 2 of them are available for both pre and post assessment? 2 of 4? 

 

Some things are better seen by microscopes and others by telescopes. Right now neither NRS nor CASAS seems especially useful at a local level. Maybe all I need is to find out how to focus them. Maybe they should be just trashed. They may cost more to use than they return in terms of time and money and *stress*, on us and especially on our students.

 

I'm from West Virginia, not Missouri, but, "Show me!" (Please.)

 

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156 

	-----Original Message-----
	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Marie Cora
	Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 1:29 PM
	To: Assessment at nifl.gov
	Subject: [Assessment 714] Just joining us? Here's what you need to know...

	Hi folks,

	 

	A number of subscribers have just joined us and so I would like to give them the necessary info for joining our discussion.  Please post your questions and share your experiences now!

	 

	View the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html to get up to date with the current conversation.

	 

	See suggested resources at:  http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html  (Scroll to the bottom!!)

	See more resources at:  

	For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on these links:

	http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt

	http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt

	http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingReportCards.ppt

	Here are your prompts: add your voice!:

	* Do you use data in your program? What type? How? What have been the results? 

	* What information (data) would you like to track and why? 

	* What data would you like to learn how to use? 

	Thanks!!

	 

	Marie Cora

	 

	 

	 

	Marie Cora

	marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

	NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

	Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

	http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

	 

	 

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From tborge at bhcc.mass.edu  Tue Apr 17 08:45:29 2007
From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu (Borge, Toni)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 08:45:29 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 725] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins
	today!
In-Reply-To: <025601c7801a$6dd5ed70$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59E74B69@mercury.bhcc.dom>

Good morning from Rain soaked Boston.  One area that we use data to
improve literacy services in our program is looking at attendance data.
In Massachusetts, we have a DOE web based system that allows us to view
class attendance data, as well as other pertinent data that gives us
tools to improve literacy services.  I review the data and look at each
individual class to see how attendance is.  If attendance is low one
month I then review what happened.  For example: Was there inclement
weather? Or have any natural disasters occurred in homelands of
students? Was the teacher absent for a period of time? If yes, I know
that is an outside factor.  But if I see that attendance is low for more
than a month, I investigate.  Ask the program advisor to review calls to
students when absent to find out the reasons given for dropping out and
share the student feedback with the teacher and ask for her/his opinion.
If the overriding case involves students feeling lost over what is being
taught, the teacher opens discussion about the lessons and works with
the students on the topics.  Students feel empowered in their learning
and attendance improves.

Toni 

 

Toni F. Borge

Adult Education & Transitions Program Director

Bunker Hill Community College

Chelsea Campus

175 Hawthorne Street

Chelsea, MA  02150

Phone: 617-228-2108   *  Fax:617-228-2106

E-mail: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu

"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that
matter." Martin Luther King Jr.

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today!

 

Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.  

 

Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I
have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this.

 

Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this
is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages.

 

I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use
data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers, please
post your questions and share your own experiences using data.  What
type of data would you like to track and why?

 

Thanks!

 

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 

**********

Discussion Announcement 

Dear Colleagues, 

I'm pleased to announce the following Panel Guest Discussion, which will
be held during the week of April 16 - 20.

Topic: Using Data for Program Improvement 

Guests will discuss the work they have done in using data to improve the
quality of adult literacy programming.  We will hear about the use of
data in small and large programs, as well as at the state and national
levels.  Panelists are interested in your questions and eager to hear
about your use of data, as well as share their own experiences, so
please ask questions and share your stories.  

Recommended preparations for this discussion 

Please use the following guiding questions to help you share how you use
data in your program (or classroom), or how you would like to:

 

*	Do you use data in your program?  What type?  How?  What have
been the results?
*	What information (data) would you like to track and why?  
*	What data would you like to learn how to use?

 

Resources of interest:

 

Using Data Effectively by Donna Cornellier:  see attached Power Point
Presentation.

This PowerPoint outlines a basic framework for identifying, using, and
monitoring data; excellent guiding questions are provided as well as a
case study for practicing the application of the framework.

 

 

Developing & Disseminating Report Cards, Report Card Rubric, Rolling Out
the Report Card.   See attached Power Point Presentations from
University of the State of New York, State Education Department and the
Literacy Assistance Center (LAC).  These presentations outline the
development of a Report Card for measuring the performance of literacy
programming within the state of NY.  A detailed look at scoring the
elements of program performance is provided; presenters also review
their process for informing/ working with stakeholders on the use of
report cards, and report on the first year results of the initiative.

 

 

NRS Publications on data

http://www.nrsweb.org/pubs/

This site has a wealth of resources including the NRS Implementation
Guidelines; NRS Tips offering information on building data systems, and
setting goals and standards; and  Training Guides that provide practical
information and tools that can be used to build and use data systems
effectively.    

 

 

Learning to be an NRS Data Detective

http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/StateDataDetectives.aspx

This training explores how an effective data detective: 

*	Understands the process and psychology of data collection;
*	Examines data including assessment, goal setting, and follow-up
data;
*	Asks further questions of the data; and

*         Makes changes in processes and policies to improve data
quality and program services.

 

NRS State and Local Report Cards

http://www.nrsweb.org/reports/insights/report_cards.aspx

Report cards can be a powerful and effective tool for accountability and
program improvement if properly used and implemented. There are many
types of report cards, but for the purposes of NRS, our focus is on
report cards that assess performance. Report cards that allow meaningful
evaluation have the following characteristics: 

*         Include outcome and other data,

*         Provide a basis for evaluation of that data, and

*         Present contextual data or interpretive information that aid
interpretation and promote understanding.

Report cards can be used in several different ways to 

*         Evaluate program quality,

*         Promote program improvement, and

*	Inform and advocate for the program.

 

Guest Participants: 

Toni Borge is the director of the Adult Education & Transitions Program
at Bunker Hill Community College in Boston, Massachusetts. She has a
master's degree in educational administration. Toni is a member of the
TESOL task force that is advising the U.S. Department of Homeland
Security, Office of Citizenship, on redesigning the citizenship test
that is being piloted in 2007.  In May, Toni will present a TESOL
Virtual Seminar entitled "Assessment and Learning: Balancing Program
Performance and Instruction" in which she will discuss effective ways to
manage and balance instruction to meet state and national performance
standards.

 

Dr. Larry Condelli is a managing director of the Adult Education and
Literacy Program in the Education and Human Development Division at the
American Institutes for Research. His work includes research on adult
ESL students, accountability, and conducting professional development
and technical assistance for adult educators. He recently directed the
What Works Study for Adult ESL Literacy Students, the first large-scale
empirical study of the effectiveness of instructional practices for
adult ESL

students, and is currently directing a study of the impact of explicit
literacy instruction on low-literate adult ESOL learners for the U.S.
Department of Education.  He is also the project director for the
National Reporting System and was instrumental in developing this
national accountability system for federally funded adult education and
literacy program. Dr. Condelli's other projects include development of a
performance-based reading assessment for low-literate adults for the
National Assessment of Adult Literacy, funded by the National Center for
Educational Statistics. He is a staff development and data consultant
for the states of Alabama, California, Georgia and Utah and provides
training and technical assistance to adult education staff in several
states. Dr. Condelli holds a Ph.D. in Psychology from the University of
California.

 

Donna Cornellier is the Project Manager for the student level data
system in Massachusetts.  In this role, her responsibilities include
managing the System for Managing Accountability and Results Through
Technology (SMARTT) development team; designing NRS training materials,
and providing training and technical assistance to the local programs on
using NRS data for program improvement. Presentations included how
assessment data is tracked in the student level database and what
reports are available to help programs implement the NRS policies.
Formerly she was the Director of a local ABE program in Massachusetts.
She holds a Masters degree in Educational Leadership and Management.

 

Ajit Gopalakrishnan is an Education Consultant with the Connecticut
State Department of Education's Bureau of Early Childhood, Career and
Adult Education. He manages adult education projects in the areas of
statewide assessment, data management, program accountability, and
technology.

 

Rosemary I. Matt has recently been appointed to the newly developed
position of NRS Liaison for New York State, under the direction of the
Literacy Assistance Center in New York City.  In this role, her
responsibilities include NRS training, data management, and desk
monitoring of all New York State programs.  Prior to this position,
Rosemary has been in education throughout her career, first as a
secondary education mathematics teacher for fifteen years and then as
the director of the New York State staff development consortium in the
mid state.  

 

Karen Mundie has been an adult education professional for over thirty
years. She is the associate director of the Greater Pittsburgh Literacy
Council, a large community-based education organization (42 professional
staff members, 550 volunteers, and 2000 students). She is also the
director of the Southwest Professional Development Center, where she was
the lead trainer in the area of using data for decision-making for three
years.  Karen is a past president of the Pennsylvania Association for
Adult and Continuing Education (PAACE) and was Pennsylvania's
Outstanding Adult Educator for 2005. She holds two masters' degrees from
the University of Virginia. 

Joanie Rethlake, native Texan, is the state director for adult education
for Texas LEARNS, the state office for adult education in Houston, Texas
and has responsibility for administering the state's adult education
program and directing the technical assistance and professional
development offered to adult education and family literacy programs
across Texas.  Formerly, she was the director of adult education at
Harris County Department of Education and past president of the Texas
Association for Literacy and Adult Education (TALAE). 

Sandy Strunk is Program Director for Community Education at Lancaster
Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13. In this role, she provides leadership for
several educational programs including Adult Basic Education, the Adult
Education Southeast Professional Development Center, Early Reading
First, English as a Second Language, Family Literacy, Head Start, Organ
and Tissue Donation Awareness Education and Workforce Education. Sandy
has been an adult education practitioner for over twenty years. She is a
past president of the PA Association for Adult Continuing Education,
provided leadership to Pennsylvania's adult education program
improvement training system for six years (1997 - 2003) and continues to
provide leadership for Pennsylvania's family literacy program
improvement initiative (SEQUAL). She serves on the advisory board of the
Goodling Institute for Research in Family Literacy and is particularly
interested in educational interventions that focus on the family unit.
Sandy has a B.S. in education from Lock Haven University and a M.Ed. in
Training and Development from Penn State University.

 

Luanne Teller is the Director of Massasoit Community College's Stoughton
ABE (ESOL) and Transitions to College Programs.  She was involved in
establishing and developing of both programs.  Prior to these positions,
she was the Coordinator of an Office Skills Job Training Program, which
provided employment skills training to empower women to transition off
of public assistance into full-time careers.  She holds a degree in
secondary education (French and Spanish).  She has served on a variety
of board and committees, as both a volunteer and elected official.  She
is currently a member of the Board of Directors for the Greater Plymouth
County United Way.  She has extensive experience using research data and
communicating with a wide range of constituencies to develop effective
program plans, and to promote the commitment to continuous improvement.

 

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

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From tborge at bhcc.mass.edu  Tue Apr 17 08:57:30 2007
From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu (Borge, Toni)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 08:57:30 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 726] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <OFBFBD65D1.5791ADAB-ON072572BF.00770CAD-072572BF.00770CAE@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59E74B76@mercury.bhcc.dom>

Hi Sandy,

I agree with Tina that by creating a sense of community students feel
comfortable and open to risk taking in their learning.  I have a
transitions to college program that is based on a cohort model. The
students take the same classes and build bonds with each other that
carry over when they enroll into their college programs.  The retention
in that program is high, 86%.  Kudos to your teachers.

Toni

 

Toni F. Borge

Adult Education & Transitions Program Director

Bunker Hill Community College

Chelsea Campus

175 Hawthorne Street

Chelsea, MA  02150

Phone: 617-228-2108   *  Fax:617-228-2106

E-mail: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu

"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that
matter." Martin Luther King Jr.

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 5:40 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 722] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today!

 

Hi Sandy,

 

I think you answered your own question. Teachers who create a sense of
community are always already more successful at retention. Sometimes it
is difficult to put a finger on exactly what that factor is that creates
the environment, but a caring instructor is predisposed to generate
great results regardless of time of day, demographics of the classroom,
or whatever variables are offered. 

 

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

 

-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
From: "Sandy Strunk" <sandy_strunk at IU13.org>
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
Date: 04/16/2007 12:29PM
Subject: [Assessment 719] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today!

Tina and Larry, 

I do this, too, but I'm also very interested in positive deviance. How
is it that some teachers, who work in very challenging settings, are
able to produce such significant results? For example, there's a teacher
in our program, let's call her Miranda, who consistently has high
enrollment, wonderful retention and excellent student achievement. I can
assign her to ABE/GED, ESL, family literacy, day, evening - it just
doesn't seem to matter. It's a much harder data collection question,
because she thinks she's doing what everyone else is doing and,
ostensibly, she is. What jumps out at me when I visit her class is the
sense of community she's able to build that seems to be based on her
belief that her students will accomplish great things. 

 

Sandy Strunk 

Program Director for Community Education 

Lancaster-Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13 

1020 New Holland Avenue 

Lancaster , PA 17601 

(717) 606-1873 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 2:41 PM 
To: The Assessment Discussion List 
Subject: [Assessment 715] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today! 

 

Hi there, 

 I like to use state database information to show me which teachers are
needing assistance and which teachers are modeling good practices. The
database is certainly not a final word, as we all have had groups of
students that performed well or poorly regardless of instruction.  The
data is a good place to show red flags, however. Student assessments and
staff self-assessments are also great for predicting professional
development needs. Data can also help us see what people groups we are
reaching with advertising, and which people groups are not. Then we can
create new means of recruitment for our program. 

Tina 

Tina Luffman 
Coordinator, Developmental Education 
Verde Valley Campus 
928-634-6544 
tina_luffman at yc.edu 

"Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

04/16/2007 09:15 AM 

Please respond to 
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov> 

To 

"The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov> 

cc 

 

Subject 

[Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today! 

 

 

 

Hi Everyone, 
  
It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks to
Marie for asking me and organizing this. 
  
There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for program
improvement at the state and level.  Through the National Reporting
system project which I direct, we have conducted several training and
technical assistance activities over the past 4 years on this topic,
including two general training seminars on using data and more specific
ones on promoting adult education programs, monitoring, developing state
and local report cards. All of the training materials and other
information on the topic, including sample work from states, is
available on the NRSWeb website, which Marie has referenced. 
  
All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work and
many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a trainer
for us a few years back). 
  
I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your
experiences, as well as the responses from the other guests. 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora 
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM 
To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today! 

Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.   
  
Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I
have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this. 
  
Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States .  Some of our guests,
as well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and
this is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages. 
  
I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use
data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers, please
post your questions and share your own experiences using data.  What
type of data would you like to track and why? 
  
Thanks! 
  
Marie Cora 
Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
  ------------------------------- 
National Institute for Literacy 
Assessment mailing list 
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 

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From bhofmeyer at niesc.k12.in.us  Tue Apr 17 09:50:50 2007
From: bhofmeyer at niesc.k12.in.us (bhofmeyer)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 09:50:50 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 727] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C3CF@ex01.sfcc.edu>
References: <OF5C6D473E.078FD715-ON072572BF.00663080-072572BF.00669863@yc.edu>
	<4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C3CF@ex01.sfcc.edu>
Message-ID: <20070417133311.M22386@niesc.k12.in.us>

Barbara,

In addition to the other great ideas discussed yesterday, I'd like to offer an additional way to analyze NRS data on the local level. If you divide the contact hours by the number of enrolled students in each educational functioning level (EFL) on Table 4, you will get a rough idea of how long students in?each EFL are staying in class. If you find that students in one of the levels - say beginning literacy - are leaving before they have enough hours to post-test or make a level gain, you may wish to examine further the instructional strategies, curriculum, and professional development needs of staff?serving those learners.?If the average contact hours are high, but level gains in that EFL are low, once again, a review of assesssment, instruction and curriculum may reveal specific professional development needs for your program.

Barbara Hofmeyer

Coaching Consultant for

Indiana DOE, Division of Adult Education

On Mon, 16 Apr 2007 13:25:04 -0600, Barbara Arguedas wrote
> Hello Tina, 
> I wonder if you could say more about what exact data you use to see what your teachers need.? Is it attendance or level gain, or something else?? 
> ? 
> We use attendance data to track total hours students are attending and to determine if they are eligible to post-test (minimum of 40 hours in NM).? If students attend at least 75% of the potential hours, then the student is eligible to get a certificate at the end of the session (usually a 12-week session that meets 5 hours each week).? We also see what the overall retention rate is by teacher as well as the post-test rate and the level gain rate.? I agree that these could indicate a need for training. 
> ? 
> We are interested in other ways that programs use data to help with retention.? Thank you. 
> ? 
> Barbara Arguedas 
> Santa Fe Community College 
> Santa Fe, NM 
> ? 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu
> Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 12:41 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 715] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins today! 
> ? 
> 
> Hi there, 
> 
> ? I like to use state database information to show me which teachers are needing assistance and which teachers are modeling good practices. The database is certainly not a final word, as we all have had groups of students that performed well or poorly regardless of instruction. ?The data is a good place to show red flags, however. Student assessments and staff self-assessments are also great for predicting professional development needs. Data can also help us see what people groups we are reaching with advertising, and which people groups are not. Then we can create new means of recruitment for our program. 
> 
> Tina 
> 
> 
> Tina Luffman
> Coordinator, Developmental Education
> Verde Valley Campus
> 928-634-6544
> tina_luffman at yc.edu 
> 
>

> "Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 
> Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
> 04/16/2007 09:15 AM

> Please respond to
> The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

>

> To  
> "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>

> cc  
> ?

> Subject  
> [Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins ? ? ? ? today!

> ?

> ?  
> ?

>

> 
> 
> Hi Everyone, 
> ? 
> It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks to Marie for asking me and organizing this. 
> ? 
> There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for program improvement at the state and level. ?Through the National Reporting system project which I direct, we have conducted several training and technical assistance activities over the past 4 years on this topic, including two general training seminars on using data and more specific ones on promoting adult education programs, monitoring, developing state and local report cards. All of the training materials and other information on the topic, including sample work from states, is available on the NRSWeb website, which Marie has referenced. 
> ? 
> All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work and many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a trainer for us a few years back). 
> ? 
> I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your experiences, as well as the responses from the other guests. 
> 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

> 
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Marie Cora
> Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins today!
> 
> Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all. ? 
> ? 
> Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement. ?I have pasted the announcement below ? please note that there have been some edits to Guest bios. ?Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they are power points) but I?m having a tough time getting them through the server. ?For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I arrange access to the Power Points, I?ll let you know. ?If you received the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments already (?Using Data Effectively DCornellier?). ?Thank you for your patience with this. 
> ? 
> Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot?s Day and is celebrated in many corners of the United States. ?Some of our guests, as well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this is fine ? they will catch up with us tomorrow. ?For anyone ready to begin, please feel free to post your messages. 
> ? 
> I?ll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use data in their work to improve literacy services. ?Subscribers, please post your questions and share your own experiences using data. ?What type of data would you like to track and why? 
> ? 
> Thanks! 
> ? 
> Marie Cora 
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
> ? -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

-- 
Open WebMail Project (http://openwebmail.org)

 
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From LCondelli at air.org  Tue Apr 17 12:07:10 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 12:07:10 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 728] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <20070417133311.M22386@niesc.k12.in.us>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B253094C@dc1ex03.air.org>

Barbara,
 
That is a great idea and if you can break it down even further -- by
site or class, for example -- you can get even better insights.

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of bhofmeyer
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 9:51 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 727] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today!

Barbara,

In addition to the other great ideas discussed yesterday, I'd like to
offer an additional way to analyze NRS data on the local level. If you
divide the contact hours by the number of enrolled students in each
educational functioning level (EFL) on Table 4, you will get a rough
idea of how long students in each EFL are staying in class. If you find
that students in one of the levels - say beginning literacy - are
leaving before they have enough hours to post-test or make a level gain,
you may wish to examine further the instructional strategies,
curriculum, and professional development needs of staff serving those
learners. If the average contact hours are high, but level gains in that
EFL are low, once again, a review of assesssment, instruction and
curriculum may reveal specific professional development needs for your
program.

Barbara Hofmeyer

Coaching Consultant for

Indiana DOE, Division of Adult Education

On Mon, 16 Apr 2007 13:25:04 -0600, Barbara Arguedas wrote 
> Hello Tina, 
> I wonder if you could say more about what exact data you use to see
what your teachers need.  Is it attendance or level gain, or something
else?  
>   
> We use attendance data to track total hours students are attending and
to determine if they are eligible to post-test (minimum of 40 hours in
NM).  If students attend at least 75% of the potential hours, then the
student is eligible to get a certificate at the end of the session
(usually a 12-week session that meets 5 hours each week).  We also see
what the overall retention rate is by teacher as well as the post-test
rate and the level gain rate.  I agree that these could indicate a need
for training. 
>   
> We are interested in other ways that programs use data to help with
retention.  Thank you. 
>   
> Barbara Arguedas 
> Santa Fe Community College 
> Santa Fe, NM 
>   
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu 
> Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 12:41 PM 
> To: The Assessment Discussion List 
> Subject: [Assessment 715] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today! 
>   
> 
> Hi there, 
> 
>   I like to use state database information to show me which teachers
are needing assistance and which teachers are modeling good practices.
The database is certainly not a final word, as we all have had groups of
students that performed well or poorly regardless of instruction.  The
data is a good place to show red flags, however. Student assessments and
staff self-assessments are also great for predicting professional
development needs. Data can also help us see what people groups we are
reaching with advertising, and which people groups are not. Then we can
create new means of recruitment for our program. 
> 
> Tina 
> 
> 
> Tina Luffman 
> Coordinator, Developmental Education 
> Verde Valley Campus 
> 928-634-6544 
> tina_luffman at yc.edu 
> 
> 

> "Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 
> Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
> 04/16/2007 09:15 AM 

> Please respond to 
> The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov> 	

> 
> To 	
> "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov> 	

> cc 	
>   	

> Subject 	
> [Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today! 	

>   

>   	
>   	

> 

> 
> 
> Hi Everyone, 
>   
> It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks to
Marie for asking me and organizing this. 
>   
> There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for
program improvement at the state and level.  Through the National
Reporting system project which I direct, we have conducted several
training and technical assistance activities over the past 4 years on
this topic, including two general training seminars on using data and
more specific ones on promoting adult education programs, monitoring,
developing state and local report cards. All of the training materials
and other information on the topic, including sample work from states,
is available on the NRSWeb website, which Marie has referenced. 
>   
> All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work and
many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a trainer
for us a few years back). 
>   
> I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your
experiences, as well as the responses from the other guests. 
> 
________________________________

> 
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora 
> Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM 
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
> Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today! 
> 
> Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.   
>   
> Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.  I
have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this. 
>   
> Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this
is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages. 
>   
> I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they
use data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers,
please post your questions and share your own experiences using data.
What type of data would you like to track and why? 
>   
> Thanks! 
>   
> Marie Cora 
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
>   ------------------------------- 
> National Institute for Literacy 
> Assessment mailing list 
> Assessment at nifl.gov 
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

-- 
Open WebMail Project (http://openwebmail.org <http://openwebmail.org/> )

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From kmundie at gplc.org  Tue Apr 17 13:01:39 2007
From: kmundie at gplc.org (Karen Mundie)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 13:01:39 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 729]  data for program improvement
Message-ID: <E80904B0-8009-4AC4-9F35-B57D7AD3115B@gplc.org>

Sorry, I'm entering the discussion a bit late. My email has been  
asnarl for the last couple of days.

I am, like Sandy Struck, a product of Pennsylvania's program  
improvement process, Project Equal, and I was for a number of years a  
trainer in using data for decision making. The heart of this training  
was to help programs to describe, in detail, an area for improvement  
within their program,  to ask a question based on that particular  
area of concern, to look at program data that related to the problem  
area, to come to some conclusions based on the data, and then to take  
actions that would result in program improvement. This sounds very  
simple, but in fact, it was a hard road for all of us, and there were  
difficulties at every step.

In the beginning people (most of us) tended to ask questions that  
were too broad (or too narrow) or too vague, and we tended to look at  
aggregated data only --and even when there was data enough to draw  
conclusions from, our action plans often seemed to have little  
relation to those conclusions. In short, learning to use data for  
program improvement was a surprisingly slow process, and involved the  
creation of a habit of mind that was not at all "second nature" to  
most of our program directors and their staffs.

I think that our tendency now is to think that using data for making  
program decisions is just common sense--but I think it's a more  
complex issue. And one that has implications for professional  
development at all levels.

I would say that over time some of the programs I worked with  
developed the habit of using data for decision making, and that  
others reverted back to decision making by intuition--as Sandy said  
there's rarely a dearth of opinions in our programs.

Karen Mundie
Associate Director
Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
Pittsburgh, PA  15206
412 661-7323 (ext 101)
kmundie at gplc.org

GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007

This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees  
and is not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the  
intended recipient, please report the error to the originator and  
delete the contents.

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From bhofmeyer at niesc.k12.in.us  Tue Apr 17 13:30:06 2007
From: bhofmeyer at niesc.k12.in.us (bhofmeyer)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 13:30:06 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 730] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B253094C@dc1ex03.air.org>
References: <20070417133311.M22386@niesc.k12.in.us>
	<E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B253094C@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <20070417165020.M55115@niesc.k12.in.us>

Larry and all,

That's true. Table 4 and Table 4b contain a great deal of information, which if analyzed by program, site and class, can help begin to identify strengths and areas needing additional support. For example, these two tables can help program administrators/teachers identify some of the following reasons behind low percentages of level gains:

1. Students aren't staying long enough to post-test. If the total contact hours divided by the total number of students is less than the number of hours required for post-testing, we know we have a retention problem. Now we can look at: the intake process and transition into class; whether instruction is meeting student needs/expectations; whether curriculum and materials meet the varied levels and learning styles/modalities of students; outside barriers that keep students from attending; etc.

2. Students are staying long enough to post-test, but are not being post-tested.?(Compare the number of students on Table 4 to the number on Table 4b.) If?this is the case, we can look into whether this is a staff problem - i.e. they have no?sytem to know when a learner has enough hours to post-test; they need assessment training/support; etc. - or a student problem. In some programs we have found that when students learn they will be taking a post-test, they stop coming for a period of time. In this case, we need to help students understand that we are assessing our effectiveness, not their intelligence.

3. Students are being post-tested, but not making level gains. (Compare the number of students on Table 4b -i.e. those?who have been post-tested -?to the number who?show a gain on that table.) If this is the case, we can begin to look at instructional strategies and curriculum/materials.

There is one other possibility that I can think of. Students may be post-tested and making gains, but in some cases there is a glitch in the paper flow and for some reason information is not being submitted for data entry or data entry is flawed. If you have a system for submitting class data back to each teacher for review, they can help you identify if this is the case and where the glitch may be taking place.

In short, I love the NRS reports because they tell you so much about your program if you take time to analyze them. I hope I haven't taken up your time telling all of you things you already knew. I'm looking forward to hearing some great new ideas this week.

Barbara Hofmeyer 
Coaching Consultant for 
Indiana DOE, Division of Adult Education

On Tue, 17 Apr 2007 12:07:10 -0400, Condelli, Larry wrote
> Barbara, 
> ? 
> That is a great idea and if you can break it down even further -- by site or class, for example -- you can get even better insights.
> 
>

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of bhofmeyer
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 9:51 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 727] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins today!
> 
> 
> Barbara, 
> In addition to the other great ideas discussed yesterday, I'd like to offer an additional way to analyze NRS data on the local level. If you divide the contact hours by the number of enrolled students in each educational functioning level (EFL) on Table 4, you will get a rough idea of how long students in?each EFL are staying in class. If you find that students in one of the levels - say beginning literacy - are leaving before they have enough hours to post-test or make a level gain, you may wish to examine further the instructional strategies, curriculum, and professional development needs of staff?serving those learners.?If the average contact hours are high, but level gains in that EFL are low, once again, a review of assesssment, instruction and curriculum may reveal specific professional development needs for your program. 
> Barbara Hofmeyer 
> Coaching Consultant for 
> Indiana DOE, Division of Adult Education 
> 
> On Mon, 16 Apr 2007 13:25:04 -0600, Barbara Arguedas wrote 
> > Hello Tina, 
> > I wonder if you could say more about what exact data you use to see what your teachers need.? Is it attendance or level gain, or something else?? 
> > ? 
> > We use attendance data to track total hours students are attending and to determine if they are eligible to post-test (minimum of 40 hours in NM).? If students attend at least 75% of the potential hours, then the student is eligible to get a certificate at the end of the session (usually a 12-week session that meets 5 hours each week).? We also see what the overall retention rate is by teacher as well as the post-test rate and the level gain rate.? I agree that these could indicate a need for training. 
> > ? 
> > We are interested in other ways that programs use data to help with retention.? Thank you. 
> > ? 
> > Barbara Arguedas 
> > Santa Fe Community College 
> > Santa Fe, NM 
> > ? 
> > -----Original Message----- 
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu 
> > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 12:41 PM 
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List 
> > Subject: [Assessment 715] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins today! 
> > ? 
> > 
> > Hi there, 
> > 
> > ? I like to use state database information to show me which teachers are needing assistance and which teachers are modeling good practices. The database is certainly not a final word, as we all have had groups of students that performed well or poorly regardless of instruction. ?The data is a good place to show red flags, however. Student assessments and staff self-assessments are also great for predicting professional development needs. Data can also help us see what people groups we are reaching with advertising, and which people groups are not. Then we can create new means of recruitment for our program. 
> > 
> > Tina 
> > 
> > 
> > Tina Luffman 
> > Coordinator, Developmental Education 
> > Verde Valley Campus 
> > 928-634-6544 
> > tina_luffman at yc.edu 
> > 
> >

> > "Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 
> > Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
> > 04/16/2007 09:15 AM

> > Please respond to 
> > The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

> >

> > To  
> > "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>

> > cc  
> > ?

> > Subject  
> > [Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins ? ? ? ? today!

> > ?

> > ?  
> > ?

> >

> > 
> > 
> > Hi Everyone, 
> > ? 
> > It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks to Marie for asking me and organizing this. 
> > ? 
> > There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for program improvement at the state and level. ?Through the National Reporting system project which I direct, we have conducted several training and technical assistance activities over the past 4 years on this topic, including two general training seminars on using data and more specific ones on promoting adult education programs, monitoring, developing state and local report cards. All of the training materials and other information on the topic, including sample work from states, is available on the NRSWeb website, which Marie has referenced. 
> > ? 
> > All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work and many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a trainer for us a few years back). 
> > ? 
> > I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your experiences, as well as the responses from the other guests. 
> > 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

> > 
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Marie Cora 
> > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM 
> > To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
> > Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins today! 
> > 
> > Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all. ? 
> > ? 
> > Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement. ?I have pasted the announcement below ? please note that there have been some edits to Guest bios. ?Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they are power points) but I?m having a tough time getting them through the server. ?For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I arrange access to the Power Points, I?ll let you know. ?If you received the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments already (?Using Data Effectively DCornellier?). ?Thank you for your patience with this. 
> > ? 
> > Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot?s Day and is celebrated in many corners of the United States. ?Some of our guests, as well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this is fine ? they will catch up with us tomorrow. ?For anyone ready to begin, please feel free to post your messages. 
> > ? 
> > I?ll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they use data in their work to improve literacy services. ?Subscribers, please post your questions and share your own experiences using data. ?What type of data would you like to track and why? 
> > ? 
> > Thanks! 
> > ? 
> > Marie Cora 
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
> > ? ------------------------------- 
> > National Institute for Literacy 
> > Assessment mailing list 
> > Assessment at nifl.gov 
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
> 
> -- 
> Open WebMail Project (http://openwebmail.org)

-- 
Open WebMail Project (http://openwebmail.org)

 
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From LCondelli at air.org  Tue Apr 17 15:22:56 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 15:22:56 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 731] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins	today!
In-Reply-To: <20070417165020.M55115@niesc.k12.in.us>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530960@dc1ex03.air.org>

Barbara,
 
I like your thinking!
 
What we advise is to monitor periodically (monthly or quarterly) program
pre-posttest rates and retention factors.  In this way you can see if a
program has had a problem in time to intervene to explore the problem
and correct it.
 
In our Data Detective training we illustrated how to use data as the
starting point for exploring what might be happening in your programs.
As you note in your example below, low educational gains may be due to
low retention, program staff not administering the posttest or students
just not making gains.  Data can help you  pinpoint which of these three
problems may exist. Once you know this, you can dig deeper to look for
the underlying issues on which you can direct program improvement (such
as changes in class schedules, better support and training for
assessment or changes in instruction that may be needed).

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of bhofmeyer
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 1:30 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 730] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today!

Larry and all,

That's true. Table 4 and Table 4b contain a great deal of information,
which if analyzed by program, site and class, can help begin to identify
strengths and areas needing additional support. For example, these two
tables can help program administrators/teachers identify some of the
following reasons behind low percentages of level gains:

1. Students aren't staying long enough to post-test. If the total
contact hours divided by the total number of students is less than the
number of hours required for post-testing, we know we have a retention
problem. Now we can look at: the intake process and transition into
class; whether instruction is meeting student needs/expectations;
whether curriculum and materials meet the varied levels and learning
styles/modalities of students; outside barriers that keep students from
attending; etc.

2. Students are staying long enough to post-test, but are not being
post-tested. (Compare the number of students on Table 4 to the number on
Table 4b.) If this is the case, we can look into whether this is a staff
problem - i.e. they have no sytem to know when a learner has enough
hours to post-test; they need assessment training/support; etc. - or a
student problem. In some programs we have found that when students learn
they will be taking a post-test, they stop coming for a period of time.
In this case, we need to help students understand that we are assessing
our effectiveness, not their intelligence.

3. Students are being post-tested, but not making level gains. (Compare
the number of students on Table 4b -i.e. those who have been post-tested
- to the number who show a gain on that table.) If this is the case, we
can begin to look at instructional strategies and curriculum/materials.

There is one other possibility that I can think of. Students may be
post-tested and making gains, but in some cases there is a glitch in the
paper flow and for some reason information is not being submitted for
data entry or data entry is flawed. If you have a system for submitting
class data back to each teacher for review, they can help you identify
if this is the case and where the glitch may be taking place.

In short, I love the NRS reports because they tell you so much about
your program if you take time to analyze them. I hope I haven't taken up
your time telling all of you things you already knew. I'm looking
forward to hearing some great new ideas this week.

Barbara Hofmeyer 
Coaching Consultant for 
Indiana DOE, Division of Adult Education 

On Tue, 17 Apr 2007 12:07:10 -0400, Condelli, Larry wrote 
> Barbara, 
>   
> That is a great idea and if you can break it down even further -- by
site or class, for example -- you can get even better insights. 
> 
> 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of bhofmeyer 
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 9:51 AM 
> To: The Assessment Discussion List 
> Subject: [Assessment 727] Re: Using Data for Program Improvementbegins
today! 
> 
> 
> Barbara, 
> In addition to the other great ideas discussed yesterday, I'd like to
offer an additional way to analyze NRS data on the local level. If you
divide the contact hours by the number of enrolled students in each
educational functioning level (EFL) on Table 4, you will get a rough
idea of how long students in each EFL are staying in class. If you find
that students in one of the levels - say beginning literacy - are
leaving before they have enough hours to post-test or make a level gain,
you may wish to examine further the instructional strategies,
curriculum, and professional development needs of staff serving those
learners. If the average contact hours are high, but level gains in that
EFL are low, once again, a review of assesssment, instruction and
curriculum may reveal specific professional development needs for your
program. 
> Barbara Hofmeyer 
> Coaching Consultant for 
> Indiana DOE, Division of Adult Education 
> 
> On Mon, 16 Apr 2007 13:25:04 -0600, Barbara Arguedas wrote 
> > Hello Tina, 
> > I wonder if you could say more about what exact data you use to see
what your teachers need.  Is it attendance or level gain, or something
else?  
> >   
> > We use attendance data to track total hours students are attending
and to determine if they are eligible to post-test (minimum of 40 hours
in NM).  If students attend at least 75% of the potential hours, then
the student is eligible to get a certificate at the end of the session
(usually a 12-week session that meets 5 hours each week).  We also see
what the overall retention rate is by teacher as well as the post-test
rate and the level gain rate.  I agree that these could indicate a need
for training. 
> >   
> > We are interested in other ways that programs use data to help with
retention.  Thank you. 
> >   
> > Barbara Arguedas 
> > Santa Fe Community College 
> > Santa Fe, NM 
> >   
> > -----Original Message----- 
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu 
> > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 12:41 PM 
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List 
> > Subject: [Assessment 715] Re: Using Data for Program
Improvementbegins today! 
> >   
> > 
> > Hi there, 
> > 
> >   I like to use state database information to show me which teachers
are needing assistance and which teachers are modeling good practices.
The database is certainly not a final word, as we all have had groups of
students that performed well or poorly regardless of instruction.  The
data is a good place to show red flags, however. Student assessments and
staff self-assessments are also great for predicting professional
development needs. Data can also help us see what people groups we are
reaching with advertising, and which people groups are not. Then we can
create new means of recruitment for our program. 
> > 
> > Tina 
> > 
> > 
> > Tina Luffman 
> > Coordinator, Developmental Education 
> > Verde Valley Campus 
> > 928-634-6544 
> > tina_luffman at yc.edu 
> > 
> > 

> > "Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 
> > Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
> > 04/16/2007 09:15 AM 

> > Please respond to 
> > The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov> 	

> > 
> > To 	
> > "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov> 	

> > cc 	
> >   	

> > Subject 	
> > [Assessment 713] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today! 	

> >   

> >   	
> >   	

> > 

> > 
> > 
> > Hi Everyone, 
> >   
> > It is a pleasure to be a guest on the list this week and my thanks
to Marie for asking me and organizing this. 
> >   
> > There is a strong federal initiative to promote use of data for
program improvement at the state and level.  Through the National
Reporting system project which I direct, we have conducted several
training and technical assistance activities over the past 4 years on
this topic, including two general training seminars on using data and
more specific ones on promoting adult education programs, monitoring,
developing state and local report cards. All of the training materials
and other information on the topic, including sample work from states,
is available on the NRSWeb website, which Marie has referenced. 
> >   
> > All of the other guests have done a great deal of interesting work
and many of them attended our training (and Sandy Strunk served as a
trainer for us a few years back). 
> >   
> > I will be interested to get your questions and learn of your
experiences, as well as the responses from the other guests. 
> > 
________________________________

> > 
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Marie Cora 
> > Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 7:29 AM 
> > To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
> > Subject: [Assessment 710] Using Data for Program Improvement begins
today! 
> > 
> > Good morning, afternoon and evening to you all.   
> >   
> > Today begins our discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement.
I have pasted the announcement below - please note that there have been
some edits to Guest bios.  Also, I am trying to send 4 attachments (they
are power points) but I'm having a tough time getting them through the
server.  For now, you have the announcement below and as soon as I
arrange access to the Power Points, I'll let you know.  If you received
the original announcement that I sent, you have one of the attachments
already ("Using Data Effectively DCornellier").  Thank you for your
patience with this. 
> >   
> > Also, I would like to acknowledge that today is Patriot's Day and is
celebrated in many corners of the United States.  Some of our guests, as
well as subscribers, may not be present on-line with us today and this
is fine - they will catch up with us tomorrow.  For anyone ready to
begin, please feel free to post your messages. 
> >   
> > I'll start us off by asking our guests to briefly describe how they
use data in their work to improve literacy services.  Subscribers,
please post your questions and share your own experiences using data.
What type of data would you like to track and why? 
> >   
> > Thanks! 
> >   
> > Marie Cora 
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
> >   ------------------------------- 
> > National Institute for Literacy 
> > Assessment mailing list 
> > Assessment at nifl.gov 
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
> 
> -- 
> Open WebMail Project (http://openwebmail.org <http://openwebmail.org/>
) 

-- 
Open WebMail Project (http://openwebmail.org <http://openwebmail.org/> )

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From EllaBogard at cs.com  Tue Apr 17 16:46:31 2007
From: EllaBogard at cs.com (EllaBogard at cs.com)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 16:46:31 EDT
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
Message-ID: <c49.e1fa13d.33568c27@cs.com>

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program to 
help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program. We use 
enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours attended data to 
check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers of students throught 
he door versus number completeing enrollment to help us improve retention in 
the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very easy to 
track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics from one year to 
another so we know how we are doing in comparison to previous years. By 
tracking information collected on attendance, educational gain, hours of engagement 
and accomplishments, we have been able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible to 
improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested, progress 
made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that information by 
class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows us to compare 
effectiveness of programs and staff and assign responsibility for improvement where 
needed.
 
I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not just 
total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of the 
progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would also like to 
understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink data collected to improve 
my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

   
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From mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us  Tue Apr 17 16:58:23 2007
From: mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us (Mary Beheler)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 16:58:23 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 733] Re: What about us little guys using volunteers for
	one-on-one tutoring?
In-Reply-To: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92CE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
Message-ID: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMMEBECEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>

MessageYes, WV would "consider our mitigating circumstances" if we had
missed a few of our goals. But we would also get a warning about, "Money is
tight, and if you don't make your goals...."

We have made our goals, but sometimes completing the nagging and pleading it
takes to get the one last student in to post test (and succeed) has been
frighteningly close to the fiscal year deadline. We had a group of 5. Three
post-tested: 2 "improved a level" and 1 did not (even though he had actually
gained more CASAS points than the others). Therefore, our NRS score at that
level was only 40%. We needed something above 50%. We had to get another
student assessed!

One missing student had moved hundreds of miles away. The other had a new
job providing him many over-time hours. He finally came in on the last
possible day to post test and fell across the FFL line with a 1 or 2 point
gain. Our improvement rate for that level suddenly jumped from 40 to 60%!
That's silly (IMHO).

To complicate things a bit, other funders, such as United Way, look at these
statistics as well. Explaining levels and how some students can improve
quite a bit and not be a "success" is hard to do without sounding like we
are just whining. Fortunately, they have allowed us to use any 5 point CASAS
gain as a measure of success instead of using the NRS brackets. And if one
student comes up 20 points, we get 4 United Way credits! (On the NRS report
it counts only one gain in his entry level, though he may have crossed more
FFL lines.

Doesn't using using the different level brackets, instead of total points
gained by each individual, distort the results, even in larger groups? Why
are they used?

Since the statistics for small groups can be changed so drastically by even
one individual, why not pool the results from groups like ours? (Call the
pool "The Long Tail" if you must:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Long_Tail) The pool might give researchers
an idea of whether classrooms or one-on-one tutoring is most effective at
the lowest literacy levels.

So, if you have any influence, please try to persuade NRS to describe the
goals for small groups in terms that make more sense for our situation.
Right now we are like little kids clomping around in Mom's high heels. It is
hard to work that way, and very far from useful.

All of which is not to say that individual assessments are not quite helpful
for for spotting individual problems and successes. They do help.

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156
  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Rosemary Matt
  Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 7:39 AM
  To: The Assessment Discussion List
  Subject: [Assessment 724] Re: What about us little guys
usingvolunteersforone-on-one tutoring?

  Good Morning Everyone!

  I am sorry to be so late joining the group.  I am one of the panelists,
Rosemary Matt.  Just recently, I accepted the position of NRS Liaison for
New York State so monitoring data and providing technical assistance to
programs in need is now my entire focus.  We also have a large contingent of
programs that provide service through a volunteer network in a one to one
tutoring arrangement.  Your concerns Mary regarding the inability for
programs such as these to meet performance benchmarks is shared by New York
programs as well.  Our state department has thoroughly considered the
population these folks serve and consider that to be a mitigating
circumstance when assessing their performance.  The value of these
organizations serving some of our lowest skilled readers is well known and
appreciated.  In a state the size of New York it is possible to absorb the
lack of educational gain increments from these agencies as they are balanced
by other programs serving students for whom gain is eminent.

  At the same time however we have worked closely with these programs and
their statewide leadership team to provide technical assistance in the area
of assessment.  As they learn more about the strategies and nuances that
evolve around the NRS accountability system, they are better able to show
whatever gain is possible from their students.

  As some of you are aware, New York also utilizes the program level Report
Card.  We attended the training two years ago that was provided by Larry and
his staff at AIR.  I would strongly recommend this training to any state
considering this accountability tool for programs.  We have made incredible
advances in terms of identifying high performing programs and targeting
those in need of technical assistance through our Report Card Rubric.  Marie
has posted three power points that I offer in training built around this
rubric.  To further support our volunteer programs, our state department has
chosen to rank these programs among themselves providing a homogeneous
category specific to their needs.  They are not measured against the cohort
of traditional adult education programs.

  Another strategy we have recently embarked upon is through our statewide
data system, we have introduced Collaboration Metrics.  Many students
working first with these volunteer programs while they are at minimal skill
levels will eventually move into traditional programming and continue to
succeed through the educational levels.  To ensure the volunteer programs
remain tied to the student's success, they are informed of the students
progress through the data system and can subsequently report on that gain as
well.

  These few methods of support have been well received by our volunteer
affiliates.  Hope they may give you and your state some thoughts for the
future.
  Rosemary

  Rosemary I. Matt
  NRS Liaison for NYS
  Literacy Assistance Center
  12 Meadowbrook Drive
  New Hartford, NY 13413
  315.798.1026

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Sandy Strunk
  Sent: Mon 4/16/2007 5:58 PM
  To: The Assessment Discussion List
  Subject: [Assessment 723] Re: What about us little guys using
volunteersforone-on-one tutoring?

  Mary,

  I think you raise some valid concerns. When you?re working with a small
pool of students like this, aggregate statistics can be rather meaningless.
I would think the most helpful data for you would be individual diagnostic
reading assessment and progress monitoring data. Are you familiar with the
Adult Reading Component study and the work related to using reading
profiles? You might want to check out http://www.nifl.gov/readingprofiles/.
I?m wondering if the component reading assessments wouldn?t go a long way
toward ?focusing? the reading instruction you offer based on each learner?s
profile. That doesn?t get you off the hook for NRS reporting, but it does
provide a mechanism for meeting the highly individual needs of your
learners. Just a thought.

  Sandy Strunk

  Program Director for Community Education

  Lancaster-Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13

  1020 New Holland Avenue

  Lancaster, PA 17601

  (717) 606-1873

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Mary Beheler
  Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 5:03 PM
  To: The Assessment Discussion List
  Subject: [Assessment 721] Re: What about us little guys using volunteers
forone-on-one tutoring?

  We tutor adults. No children.

  Almost all our students are at Begining Literacy to High Intermediate ABE
level. Almost no high or even low adult secondary. At the secondary level we
only get the students that can't (or won't) tolerate study in a regular ABE
classroom. ESL instruction is done by a different organization, with paid
teachers.

  We net 20 to 25 students with more than 12 hours of study each year. We
are so small that sometimes an entire FFL will have only one student in it.
When that happens the only question is, "How many advanced a level: 0 or
100%?"

  We deal with students on a highly individualized basis. One may need to
learn to read again after having a stroke or a fever. Another may have
taught himself to sight read at a very high level, but neglected to teach
himself any spelling or writing skills. A high school graduate may not have
learned even his ABCs, for whatever reason. One or two students a year might
have an employment or higher education goal. (Then WV can't verify it, if
the student works or studies out of state.)  I can safely say that no two
students have been alike in the nearly ten years that I have been here.

  I genuinely *like* statistics and know they can be very useful, and don't
mind gathering data to be put in a bigger pool if what comes back is
helpful. However, if a level has only 3 students, is the data even
"statistically significant" if just 2 of them are available for both pre and
post assessment? 2 of 4?

  Some things are better seen by microscopes and others by telescopes. Right
now neither NRS nor CASAS seems especially useful at a local level. Maybe
all I need is to find out how to focus them. Maybe they should be just
trashed. They may cost more to use than they return in terms of time and
money and *stress*, on us and especially on our students.

  I'm from West Virginia, not Missouri, but, "Show me!" (Please.)

  Mary G. Beheler
  Tri-State Literacy
  455 Ninth Street
  Huntington, WV 25701
  304 528-5700, ext 156

    -----Original Message-----
    From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
    Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 1:29 PM
    To: Assessment at nifl.gov
    Subject: [Assessment 714] Just joining us? Here's what you need to
know...

    Hi folks,

    A number of subscribers have just joined us and so I would like to give
them the necessary info for joining our discussion.  Please post your
questions and share your experiences now!

    View the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html to get up to date
with the current conversation.

    See suggested resources at:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html
(Scroll to the bottom!!)

    See more resources at:

    For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on these links:

    http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt

    http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt

    http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingR
eportCards.ppt

    Here are your prompts: add your voice!:

    * Do you use data in your program? What type? How? What have been the
results?

    * What information (data) would you like to track and why?

    * What data would you like to learn how to use?

    Thanks!!

    Marie Cora

    Marie Cora

    marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

    NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

    Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

    http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

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From LCondelli at air.org  Tue Apr 17 17:17:13 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 17:17:13 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 734] Re: What about us little guys using volunteers
	forone-on-one tutoring?
In-Reply-To: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMMEBECEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B253096C@dc1ex03.air.org>

Hi Mary,
 
Using the CASAS 5 point gains and United Way credits are good ways to
help your program get the recognition and credit for helping learners.
We encourage states and local programs to use such strategies to
demonstrate gain for small programs such as yours and others that serve
students at the lower literacy levels.  This is not a distortion at all
but a more accurate way to look at your program gains in this case.
 
The NRS is a national system and for that reason, there has to be be
some generalizations and standardization so that cross-program and
cross-state aggregation is meaningful.  But there is flexibility at the
state and local level to use other measures to show gains and progress
and to meet the accountability requirements we all have to face.  We
hope states and local programs take advantage of this flexibility at the
local level, where there is no need for national aggregation.  Your
state or local program in your area could pool your results for your own
use. 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Mary Beheler
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:58 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 733] Re: What about us little guys using volunteers
forone-on-one tutoring?

Yes, WV would "consider our mitigating circumstances" if we had missed a
few of our goals. But we would also get a warning about, "Money is
tight, and if you don't make your goals...." 
 
We have made our goals, but sometimes completing the nagging and
pleading it takes to get the one last student in to post test (and
succeed) has been frighteningly close to the fiscal year deadline. We
had a group of 5. Three post-tested: 2 "improved a level" and 1 did not
(even though he had actually gained more CASAS points than the others).
Therefore, our NRS score at that level was only 40%. We needed something
above 50%. We had to get another student assessed!
 
One missing student had moved hundreds of miles away. The other had a
new job providing him many over-time hours. He finally came in on the
last possible day to post test and fell across the FFL line with a 1 or
2 point gain. Our improvement rate for that level suddenly jumped from
40 to 60%! That's silly (IMHO).
 
To complicate things a bit, other funders, such as United Way, look at
these statistics as well. Explaining levels and how some students can
improve quite a bit and not be a "success" is hard to do without
sounding like we are just whining. Fortunately, they have allowed us to
use any 5 point CASAS gain as a measure of success instead of using the
NRS brackets. And if one student comes up 20 points, we get 4 United Way
credits! (On the NRS report it counts only one gain in his entry level,
though he may have crossed more FFL lines.
 
Doesn't using using the different level brackets, instead of total
points gained by each individual, distort the results, even in larger
groups? Why are they used?
 
Since the statistics for small groups can be changed so drastically by
even one individual, why not pool the results from groups like ours?
(Call the pool "The Long Tail" if you must:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Long_Tail) The pool might give
researchers an idea of whether classrooms or one-on-one tutoring is most
effective at the lowest literacy levels.
 
So, if you have any influence, please try to persuade NRS to describe
the goals for small groups in terms that make more sense for our
situation. Right now we are like little kids clomping around in Mom's
high heels. It is hard to work that way, and very far from useful.
 
All of which is not to say that individual assessments are not quite
helpful for for spotting individual problems and successes. They do
help.
 
Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156 

	-----Original Message-----
	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Rosemary Matt
	Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 7:39 AM
	To: The Assessment Discussion List
	Subject: [Assessment 724] Re: What about us little guys
usingvolunteersforone-on-one tutoring?
	
	
	Good Morning Everyone!
	 
	I am sorry to be so late joining the group.  I am one of the
panelists, Rosemary Matt.  Just recently, I accepted the position of NRS
Liaison for New York State so monitoring data and providing technical
assistance to programs in need is now my entire focus.  We also have a
large contingent of programs that provide service through a volunteer
network in a one to one tutoring arrangement.  Your concerns Mary
regarding the inability for programs such as these to meet performance
benchmarks is shared by New York programs as well.  Our state department
has thoroughly considered the population these folks serve and consider
that to be a mitigating circumstance when assessing their performance.
The value of these organizations serving some of our lowest skilled
readers is well known and appreciated.  In a state the size of New York
it is possible to absorb the lack of educational gain increments from
these agencies as they are balanced by other programs serving students
for whom gain is eminent.  
	 
	At the same time however we have worked closely with these
programs and their statewide leadership team to provide technical
assistance in the area of assessment.  As they learn more about the
strategies and nuances that evolve around the NRS accountability system,
they are better able to show whatever gain is possible from their
students.  
	 
	As some of you are aware, New York also utilizes the program
level Report Card.  We attended the training two years ago that was
provided by Larry and his staff at AIR.  I would strongly recommend this
training to any state considering this accountability tool for programs.
We have made incredible advances in terms of identifying high performing
programs and targeting those in need of technical assistance through our
Report Card Rubric.  Marie has posted three power points that I offer in
training built around this rubric.  To further support our volunteer
programs, our state department has chosen to rank these programs among
themselves providing a homogeneous category specific to their needs.
They are not measured against the cohort of traditional adult education
programs.
	 
	Another strategy we have recently embarked upon is through our
statewide data system, we have introduced Collaboration Metrics.  Many
students working first with these volunteer programs while they are at
minimal skill levels will eventually move into traditional programming
and continue to succeed through the educational levels.  To ensure the
volunteer programs remain tied to the student's success, they are
informed of the students progress through the data system and can
subsequently report on that gain as well.  
	 
	These few methods of support have been well received by our
volunteer affiliates.  Hope they may give you and your state some
thoughts for the future.
	Rosemary
	 
	 
	 
	Rosemary I. Matt
	NRS Liaison for NYS
	Literacy Assistance Center
	12 Meadowbrook Drive
	New Hartford, NY 13413
	315.798.1026

________________________________

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Sandy Strunk
	Sent: Mon 4/16/2007 5:58 PM
	To: The Assessment Discussion List
	Subject: [Assessment 723] Re: What about us little guys using
volunteersforone-on-one tutoring?
	
	

	Mary,

	I think you raise some valid concerns. When you're working with
a small pool of students like this, aggregate statistics can be rather
meaningless. I would think the most helpful data for you would be
individual diagnostic reading assessment and progress monitoring data.
Are you familiar with the Adult Reading Component study and the work
related to using reading profiles? You might want to check out
http://www.nifl.gov/readingprofiles/. I'm wondering if the component
reading assessments wouldn't go a long way toward "focusing" the reading
instruction you offer based on each learner's profile. That doesn't get
you off the hook for NRS reporting, but it does provide a mechanism for
meeting the highly individual needs of your learners. Just a thought.

	 

	Sandy Strunk

	Program Director for Community Education

	Lancaster-Lebanon Intermediate Unit 13

	1020 New Holland Avenue

	Lancaster, PA 17601

	(717) 606-1873

	
________________________________

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Mary Beheler
	Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 5:03 PM
	To: The Assessment Discussion List
	Subject: [Assessment 721] Re: What about us little guys using
volunteers forone-on-one tutoring?

	 

	We tutor adults. No children.

	Almost all our students are at Begining Literacy to High
Intermediate ABE level. Almost no high or even low adult secondary. At
the secondary level we only get the students that can't (or won't)
tolerate study in a regular ABE classroom. ESL instruction is done by a
different organization, with paid teachers.

	 

	We net 20 to 25 students with more than 12 hours of study each
year. We are so small that sometimes an entire FFL will have only one
student in it. When that happens the only question is, "How many
advanced a level: 0 or 100%?"

	 

	We deal with students on a highly individualized basis. One may
need to learn to read again after having a stroke or a fever. Another
may have taught himself to sight read at a very high level, but
neglected to teach himself any spelling or writing skills. A high school
graduate may not have learned even his ABCs, for whatever reason. One or
two students a year might have an employment or higher education goal.
(Then WV can't verify it, if the student works or studies out of state.)
I can safely say that no two students have been alike in the nearly ten
years that I have been here.

	 

	I genuinely *like* statistics and know they can be very useful,
and don't mind gathering data to be put in a bigger pool if what comes
back is helpful. However, if a level has only 3 students, is the data
even "statistically significant" if just 2 of them are available for
both pre and post assessment? 2 of 4? 

	 

	Some things are better seen by microscopes and others by
telescopes. Right now neither NRS nor CASAS seems especially useful at a
local level. Maybe all I need is to find out how to focus them. Maybe
they should be just trashed. They may cost more to use than they return
in terms of time and money and *stress*, on us and especially on our
students.

	 

	I'm from West Virginia, not Missouri, but, "Show me!" (Please.)

	 

	Mary G. Beheler
	Tri-State Literacy
	455 Ninth Street
	Huntington, WV 25701
	304 528-5700, ext 156 

		-----Original Message-----
		From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Marie Cora
		Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 1:29 PM
		To: Assessment at nifl.gov
		Subject: [Assessment 714] Just joining us? Here's what
you need to know...

		Hi folks,

		 

		A number of subscribers have just joined us and so I
would like to give them the necessary info for joining our discussion.
Please post your questions and share your experiences now!

		 

		View the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html to get up to
date with the current conversation.

		 

		See suggested resources at:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html
(Scroll to the bottom!!)

		See more resources at:  

		For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on
these links:

	
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt

	
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt

	
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingR
eportCards.ppt

		Here are your prompts: add your voice!:

		* Do you use data in your program? What type? How? What
have been the results? 

		* What information (data) would you like to track and
why? 

		* What data would you like to learn how to use? 

		Thanks!!

		 

		Marie Cora

		 

		 

		 

		Marie Cora

		marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
<mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

		NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

		http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

		Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

		http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

		 

		 

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From LCondelli at air.org  Tue Apr 17 17:30:33 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 17:30:33 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <c49.e1fa13d.33568c27@cs.com>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530970@dc1ex03.air.org>

Hi Ella,
 
Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
is going on.
 
I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
attendance.
 
Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most
data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that
learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
this measure reflects student motivation to attend.
 
Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about
why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
them.

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program
to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program.
We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours
attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers
of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been
able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible
to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that
information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
responsibility for improvement where needed.

I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not
just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From sandy_strunk at IU13.org  Tue Apr 17 17:38:00 2007
From: sandy_strunk at IU13.org (Sandy Strunk)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 17:38:00 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 736] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530970@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F19A2@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>

Larry,

Could you tell us more about the ESL research on percentage of possible
time attended? This is a new idea to me. Does it reflect greater
intensity as opposed to lesser intensity for a longer duration - or do
you think something else is going on? If your research is correct, there
are certainly implications for how we structure instructional segments. 

 

Sandy Strunk

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hi Ella,

 

Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
is going on.

 

I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
attendance.

 

Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most
data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that
learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
this measure reflects student motivation to attend.

 

Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about
why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
them.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program
to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program.
We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours
attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers
of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been
able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible
to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that
information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
responsibility for improvement where needed.

I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not
just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us  Tue Apr 17 17:58:28 2007
From: mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us (Mary Beheler)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 17:58:28 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 737]  Data quality and usefulness
In-Reply-To: <030201c7804c$bdc8ed00$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMMEBFCEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>

MessageDoes GIGO apply to the data all of us, big and small, are gathering?

The information gleaned from the CASAS Life Skills (or any other) assessment
tool can be useful for spotting problems and successes, but because of the
*multiple layers of skills involved in answering any one question* the
specific question(s) missed must be looked at very carefully. But, getting
the student feedback that makes looking carefully possible gets into
problems of assessment confidentiality.

Example: A excellent student may understand *everything* else about a
certain CASAS map question, but if he or she has heard the expression "X
marks the spot," and assumes X means the goal, not the beginning, this
question will be nonsense. I don't think the check-off sheet of demonstrated
skills specifies, "Knows that on *this* map X means, "Start here."  If the
student's tutor or I can't discuss a missed question with the student, how
will I discover that?

How do we know that the question a student answers or misses actually
assesses the skill the assessment manual tells us it does?

I was scoring an answer sheet and was dismayed at how poorly a student was
doing, when I noticed I was using the math answers, not reading. I switched
to the correct set, and the student made even a worse score! Both scores
were in the "valid" range, too! How much confidence should I place in that
assessment?

Having the questions in a booklet and marking the answers to multiple choice
questions on a separate sheet may be a skill even somewhat advanced adult
students do not have. Because our student workbooks don't use multiple
choice questions, we have actually created lists of number-letter pairs to
see if a student can mark the letter in the appropriate column of each
numbered row on a separate answer sheet. That's all. (Did that after a
strong level 2 student marked the answer sheet by page number, not question
number, with answers to 2 and 3 questions marked in the same row.)

Has anyone made an effort to see if the lower level literacy students want
to learn what the CASAS or other accepted NRS assessments wants us to teach?
Lots of our students are on SSI. They don't see the point in learning about
employment applications. That often means any question about employment
forms isn't important enough to take seriously, even if the ones about other
forms are.

Colleges have sense enough to make all freshman year classes pretty generic,
and leave the "major" study to later years. Is it useful for assessment of
beginning literacy to get so specific so soon? Whatever happened to "Learn
to read; then read to learn"?

We used to use the quick and unintimidating SORT-R for student assessment.
Even on that simple test almost all men missed word "dainty," no matter what
their reading level.  Does anyone know if any specific question(s) on the
assessments used for gathering NRS data is answered incorrectly by most
students at any one level? Or if a significant number of students in the
Laubach series misses different questions than students in Challenger or
Voyager, or another series?

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156

  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
  Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 1:29 PM
  To: Assessment at nifl.gov
  Subject: [Assessment 714] Just joining us? Here's what you need to know...

  Hi folks,

  A number of subscribers have just joined us and so I would like to give
them the necessary info for joining our discussion.  Please post your
questions and share your experiences now!

  View the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html to get up to date
with the current conversation.

  See suggested resources at:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html
(Scroll to the bottom!!)
  See more resources at:
  For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on these links:

  http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt

  http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt

  http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingRep
ortCards.ppt

  Here are your prompts:  add your voice!:

  * Do you use data in your program? What type? How? What have been the
results?

  * What information (data) would you like to track and why?

  * What data would you like to learn how to use?

  Thanks!!

  Marie Cora

  Marie Cora
  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
  NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
  http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

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From SMonti at ccbcmd.edu  Tue Apr 17 18:58:52 2007
From: SMonti at ccbcmd.edu (Monti, Suzi)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 18:58:52 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 738] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530970@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <DAA0CB37DE95234ABD1407F042207CB79EC979@dwe.ccbc.ccbcmd.edu>

I would like to add a few comments on retention and ESOL students. 
 
We have recently heard a lot about "stopping out" and I think that can pertain to ESOL learners for many of the same reasons as ASE/GED learners - with the addition of issues such as stages of acculturation and/or home country responsibilities which may cause ESOL learners to withdraw for weeks or months and then possibly return.
 
I would also like to raise the issue of the mobility of the ESOL population. We see migration reports on immigrants and settlement trends and I often wonder how much of a difference in retention these trends makes when comparing ASE/GED retention rates with ESOL. 
 
I think of the "stopover" trend we see sometimes in ESOL here in Baltimore, MD where non-native speakers will enter and only temporarily reside her before moving to an intended more perm ant location. This obviously has great impact on retention. When comparing ESOL programs statewide or nationwide, the "stopover" trend may negatively impact the retention rates of certain programs.
 
Another thing we see is "shift" or movement around the beltway (as we call it). We have major ESOL class sites at locations along the Baltimore beltway that roughly encircles the city and we see contraction and expansion at these sites based the movement of the ESOL population. We will see that a site may suddenly have low retention across ALL six or seven ESOL classes offered - even the classes with veteran/experienced teachers with a great track record of retention. In some cases, the same teacher is also teaching at another site and his/her class there is doing well at that site. Both of these things show that attrition is not likely a result of instructional issues. 
 
When we see this contraction of a site with mid-semester attrition, we can sometimes predict that at another site we will experience a boom in registration the next semester. It depends on if it is more "stopover" (with learners leaving the area entirely) or just "shift" (learners relocating within the area). If it is the latter, learners who leave one site mid-semester will turn up to register the next semester at another site. 
 
Suzi Monti 

ESOL Curriculum Developer and Instructional Specialist 
The Community College of Baltimore County 
Center for Adult and Family Literacy 
7200 Sollers Point Road E102
Baltimore, MD 21222 

(410) 285-9476   

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Tuesday April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Hi Ella,
 
Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what is going on.
 
I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of attendance.
 
Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because this measure reflects student motivation to attend.
 
Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for them.

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program. We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance, educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested, progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign responsibility for improvement where needed.

I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From dlwann at comcast.net  Tue Apr 17 21:56:09 2007
From: dlwann at comcast.net (Dan Wann)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 21:56:09 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 739] Re: Data quality and usefulness
In-Reply-To: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMMEBFCEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>
References: <030201c7804c$bdc8ed00$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
	<LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMMEBFCEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>
Message-ID: <009301c7815c$bc061cc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>

Mary, 

 

Where did the valid score place the excellent student who was doing poorly?
Since we work from the scale score and not the number correct I do not know
how to interpret the doing so poorly.  When working with teachers and
students, we try to place an emphasis on the where the student falls on the
scale or NRS level.  In training with teachers, we always stress that
students are not a single level but students have range of strengths and
needs and we discuss about how to present this information to the student.  

 

I agree that a missed question does not tell us why the student was not able
to correctly answer the question; however,  by taking "multiple measures" of
student performance over time with a variety of formats tells me if the
student has the concept and if the student can transfer what is known to
different contexts. 

 

In the example cited below, in most exercises that use maps the X is also
marked with the words such as "you are here."  It would seem that the
student using "X marks the spot" and not "X you are here" would indicate a
reading/literacy problem.  As a teacher I would watch that student read
directions and try to perform tasks.  Does the student ask others to help
explain the task? Does the student ask me, the teacher, for help?  Observing
the student's behavior and patterns of work is part of the assessment
process, and from your other posts I think that is what you seem to do in
your program with such a variety of learners at vastly different levels. 

 

The last point you make about application forms when the student does not
intend to seek employment presents a challenge that we always face.  If not
application for work, all ESL students are faced without filling out forms
and as  a teacher I want to have students learn to "transfer" knowledge so I
think I might use your quote "learn to read and then read to learn."  That
is I would use the application form for work as a transition to other forms
and so filling out forms is the concept that I am teaching as well as
helping students understand that there are many forms that they will have to
fill out in English and forms have certain questions and vocabulary in
common.  That way there is a relationship between the assessment and what is
taught.  The context of the question is not as important as the ability to
read and fill forms.  I explain to students that the employment form for
them is not important but I would try and brainstorm with them when they
might need to help someone with an employment form.  

 

Since you mention using CASAS life skills test you might want to look at the
new tests CASAS has developed such as the Life and Work. If your state has
other approved assessments for ESL then you might look at those assessments
to see if you think it is a better match for your curriculum.  I have found
that CASAS Literacy tests and level A reading tests are very sensitive
instruments in tracking lower level student learning gains.

 

Dan Wann 

Professional Development Consultant  

Indiana Adult Education Professional Development Project 

 

dlwann at comcast.net  

 

 

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Mary Beheler
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:58 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 737] Data quality and usefulness

 

Does GIGO apply to the data all of us, big and small, are gathering?

 

The information gleaned from the CASAS Life Skills (or any other) assessment
tool can be useful for spotting problems and successes, but because of the
*multiple layers of skills involved in answering any one question* the
specific question(s) missed must be looked at very carefully. But, getting
the student feedback that makes looking carefully possible gets into
problems of assessment confidentiality.

 

Example: A excellent student may understand *everything* else about a
certain CASAS map question, but if he or she has heard the expression "X
marks the spot," and assumes X means the goal, not the beginning, this
question will be nonsense. I don't think the check-off sheet of demonstrated
skills specifies, "Knows that on *this* map X means, "Start here."  If the
student's tutor or I can't discuss a missed question with the student, how
will I discover that?

 

How do we know that the question a student answers or misses actually
assesses the skill the assessment manual tells us it does? 

 

I was scoring an answer sheet and was dismayed at how poorly a student was
doing, when I noticed I wasusing the math answers, not reading. I switched
to the correct set, and the student made even a worse score! Both scores
were in the "valid" range, too! How much confidence should I place in that
assessment?

 

Having the questions in a booklet and marking the answers to multiple choice
questions on a separate sheet may be a skill even somewhat advanced adult
students do not have.Because our student workbooks don't use multiple choice
questions, we have actually created lists of number-letter pairs to see if a
student can mark the letter in the appropriate column of each numbered row
on a separate answer sheet. That's all. (Did that after a strong level 2
student marked the answer sheet by page number, not question number, with
answers to 2 and 3 questions marked in the same row.)

 

Has anyone made an effort to see if the lower level literacy students want
to learn what the CASAS or other accepted NRS assessments wants us to teach?
Lots of our students are on SSI. They don't see the point in learning about
employment applications. That often means any question about employment
forms isn't important enough to take seriously, even if the ones about other
forms are.

 

Colleges have sense enough to make all freshman year classes pretty generic,
and leave the "major" study to later years. Is it useful for assessment of
beginning literacy to get so specific so soon? Whatever happened to "Learn
to read; then read to learn"?

 

We used to use the quick and unintimidating SORT-R for student assessment.
Even on that simple test almost all men missed word "dainty," no matter what
their reading level.  Does anyone know if any specific question(s) on the
assessments used for gathering NRS data is answered incorrectly by most
students at any one level? Or if a significant number of students in the
Laubach series misses different questions than students in Challenger or
Voyager, or another series?

 

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 1:29 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 714] Just joining us? Here's what you need to know...

Hi folks,

 

A number of subscribers have just joined us and so I would like to give them
the necessary info for joining our discussion.  Please post your questions
and share your experiences now!

 

View the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html to get up to date
with the current conversation.

 

See suggested resources at:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html
(Scroll to the bottom!!)

See more resources at:  

For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on these links:

http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt

http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt

http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingRepor
tCards.ppt

Here are your prompts: add your voice!:

* Do you use data in your program? What type? How? What have been the
results? 

* What information (data) would you like to track and why? 

* What data would you like to learn how to use? 

Thanks!!

 

Marie Cora

 

 

 

Marie Cora

 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

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From Ajit.Gopalakrishnan at ct.gov  Wed Apr 18 09:20:30 2007
From: Ajit.Gopalakrishnan at ct.gov (Gopalakrishnan, Ajit)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 09:20:30 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 740] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F19A2@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>
Message-ID: <281DD0D97E3EC94FB83030B1379CE426027D1C83@DOIT-EX302.exec.ds.state.ct.us>

In light of Larry's comments, I would like to share a program quality
standard that we have been using in Connecticut. We call it the
"utilization rate" or "% of available instruction used". It is the
percent of available class hours utilized by each student in the class.
We aggregate this measure at the class level and the program level.

 

We have experienced some challenges with this measure though. We are
able to account for late starters by pro-rating the remaining available
hours based on that late start date, but it gets unwieldy to also
account for students who exit early. This measure works well for classes
offered on a set schedule but can be problematic for learning labs where
the lab might be open for say 25 hours a week but a student is not
expected to be there for the entire 25 hours; this could result in a low
utilization rate though the students might be attending say 10
hours/week. At the other extreme, some classes/programs may show high
utilization rates but may be offering classes that run for only 40 hours
in a semester. I find that combining this utilization rate with an
absolute average of hours attended gives a better picture of the
participation and persistence of learners within a program.

 

I too would like to hear Larry's thoughts on Sandy's question. In my
personal experience after looking at tons of data over the past 2-3
years from a variety of programs, I would expect that "intensity" (more
instructional hours in a week) more than "duration" (more calendar days
between class start and end dates) might result in greater learner
attendance. For example, it is probably more likely that 20 ESL students
will attend 100 hours each on average during a fiscal year if they are
offered a class that runs 12 hours a week for 12 weeks than if they are
offered a class that runs 4 hours a week for 36 weeks. 

 

Another element that we are beginning to track more closely is retention
across fiscal years. We know that many students don't achieve their
goals within one fiscal year. Therefore, we are using our data system to
track and report on students who are new in the fiscal as well as those
who might be returning to that program from a prior fiscal year.

 

What about recruitment? Do any programs/states look at the students
served over the past six/seven years and compare that to say Census
2000?

 

Ajit

 

Ajit Gopalakrishnan
Education Consultant
Connecticut Department of Education
25 Industrial Park Road
Middletown, CT 06457
860-807-2125
Fax: 860-807-2062
ajit.gopalakrishnan at ct.gov

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Sandy Strunk
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:38 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 736] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Larry,

Could you tell us more about the ESL research on percentage of possible
time attended? This is a new idea to me. Does it reflect greater
intensity as opposed to lesser intensity for a longer duration - or do
you think something else is going on? If your research is correct, there
are certainly implications for how we structure instructional segments. 

 

Sandy Strunk

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hi Ella,

 

Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
is going on.

 

I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
attendance.

 

Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most
data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that
learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
this measure reflects student motivation to attend.

 

Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about
why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
them.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program
to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program.
We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours
attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers
of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been
able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible
to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that
information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
responsibility for improvement where needed.

I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not
just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From kmundie at gplc.org  Wed Apr 18 10:40:58 2007
From: kmundie at gplc.org (Karen Mundie)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 10:40:58 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 741] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <DAA0CB37DE95234ABD1407F042207CB79EC979@dwe.ccbc.ccbcmd.edu>
References: <DAA0CB37DE95234ABD1407F042207CB79EC979@dwe.ccbc.ccbcmd.edu>
Message-ID: <43DFB331-14B0-4D47-962D-E6D7A6C4BE16@gplc.org>

Suzi, given that much mobility in your students, I'm curious about  
your curriculum. Do you have a reasonably set curriculum that is  
consistent across sites? If that were the case, the movement would  
have fewer implication for student learning gains.

And do you "move" the student records and hours in class forward from  
one site to another internally?

The beauty of our on-line data bases in Pennsylvania is that students  
can't be duplicated in the system. Even if a student moves to a  
different program rather than a different site, his record is in  
edata and the new program and old one share the student equally. Both  
programs can put in hours, but only one can put in assessment  
information. The program in which the student is currently active is  
usually the "primary" program.

There are, frankly, some students who, because they are so motivated  
to learn English, are active in more than one program at the same  
time. It doesn't matter which agency does the testing--we usually use  
the best results for the official record. If our data base manager  
sees that we have better results than the primary agency, it benefits  
both of us to use that data. We might have the caught the student on  
a better day or our test might have have more appropriate for that  
particular student.

Karen Mundie
Associate Director
Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
Pittsburgh, PA  15206
412 661-7323 (ext 101)
kmundie at gplc.org

GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007

This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees  
and is not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the  
intended recipient, please report the error to the originator and  
delete the contents.

On Apr 17, 2007, at 6:58 PM, Monti, Suzi wrote:

> I would like to add a few comments on retention and ESOL students.
>
> We have recently heard a lot about "stopping out" and I think that  
> can pertain to ESOL learners for many of the same reasons as ASE/ 
> GED learners - with the addition of issues such as stages of  
> acculturation and/or home country responsibilities which may cause  
> ESOL learners to withdraw for weeks or months and then possibly  
> return.
>
> I would also like to raise the issue of the mobility of the ESOL  
> population. We see migration reports on immigrants and settlement  
> trends and I often wonder how much of a difference in retention  
> these trends makes when comparing ASE/GED retention rates with ESOL.
>
> I think of the "stopover" trend we see sometimes in ESOL here in  
> Baltimore, MD where non-native speakers will enter and only  
> temporarily reside her before moving to an intended more perm ant  
> location. This obviously has great impact on retention. When  
> comparing ESOL programs statewide or nationwide, the "stopover"  
> trend may negatively impact the retention rates of certain programs.
>
> Another thing we see is "shift" or movement around the beltway (as  
> we call it). We have major ESOL class sites at locations along the  
> Baltimore beltway that roughly encircles the city and we see  
> contraction and expansion at these sites based the movement of the  
> ESOL population. We will see that a site may suddenly have low  
> retention across ALL six or seven ESOL classes offered - even the  
> classes with veteran/experienced teachers with a great track record  
> of retention. In some cases, the same teacher is also teaching at  
> another site and his/her class there is doing well at that site.  
> Both of these things show that attrition is not likely a result of  
> instructional issues.
>
> When we see this contraction of a site with mid-semester attrition,  
> we can sometimes predict that at another site we will experience a  
> boom in registration the next semester. It depends on if it is more  
> "stopover" (with learners leaving the area entirely) or just  
> "shift" (learners relocating within the area). If it is the latter,  
> learners who leave one site mid-semester will turn up to register  
> the next semester at another site.
>
> Suzi Monti
> ESOL Curriculum Developer and Instructional Specialist
> The Community College of Baltimore County
> Center for Adult and Family Literacy
> 7200 Sollers Point Road E102
> Baltimore, MD 21222
>
> (410) 285-9476
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- 
> bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
> Sent: Tuesday April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
> Hi Ella,
>
> Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of  
> what is going on.
>
> I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency  
> of attendance.
>
> Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and  
> most data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and  
> persistence patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at  
> learners who "stop out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns,  
> attending for a while and coming back later. Another measure is the  
> percent of time possible that learners attend.  You compute this by  
> dividing the attended hours by total possible (e.g., learner  
> attends 8 hours a week for a class scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).   
> Some research I did on ESL students showed that those who attended  
> a higher proportion of possible time learned more, independent of  
> total hours.  I think this is so because this measure reflects  
> student motivation to attend.
>
> Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot  
> about why these type of students don't attend more regularly and  
> can inform you of needs, which could help in designing classes and  
> programs for them.
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- 
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
> Dear Collegues:
>
> Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our  
> program to help us track and improve the end results coming out of  
> our program. We use enrollment data to check the reach of our  
> program, average hours attended data to check the depth of  
> engagement of students, and numbers of students throught he door  
> versus number completeing enrollment to help us improve retention  
> in the crucial orientation period of classes.
>
> We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it  
> very easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare  
> statistics from one year to another so we know how we are doing in  
> comparison to previous years. By tracking information collected on  
> attendance, educational gain, hours of engagement and  
> accomplishments, we have been able to improve all of these efforts.
>
> Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it  
> possible to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who  
> has tested, progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We  
> can organize that information by class, by teacher, by program, or  
> by site, which allows us to compare effectiveness of programs and  
> staff and assign responsibility for improvement where needed.
>
> I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over  
> time not just total hours attended. I think   this might give a  
> better picture of the progress to be expected than the total time  
> attended does. I would also like to understand more about how I can  
> use all of the ABLELink data collected to improve my programs  
> overall effectiveness.
>
> Respectfully submitted by,
> Ella Bogard
>
> Ella Bogard, Executive Director
> Franklinton Learning Center
> 1003 West Town Street
> Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438
>
> Phone: (614) 221-9151
> Fax: (614) 221-9131
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us  Wed Apr 18 10:50:29 2007
From: mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us (Mary Beheler)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 10:50:29 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 742] Re: Data quality and usefulness
In-Reply-To: <009301c7815c$bc061cc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
Message-ID: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMAEBICEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>

MessageWe have no ESL students. They are all basic literacy students,
primarily at FFL levels 1-4. We use the Life Skills assessment because the
one for Employment Skills is just too irrelevant to our many disabled and
retired students. I have not seen the new series, but the term "work" makes
me suspect it might bring up some of the same issues. And right now the both
the time and money budgets are too tight to experiment.

The map question, which does *not* include a note that X means "you are
here," has baffled many students, not just the excellent ones. Hate to
"teach to the test" but now I try to remind our tutors to mark a "You are
here" X on at least one of the maps they use in practice. It is just one of
those things you either know or you don't. ("Everything is intuitive, once
you know how," is one of my favorite quotes about learning a yet another
computer application.)

I wanted to see which questions our students missed most, and over the years
the map question with the unmarked X has been prominent, though other map
questions were not. (The one with the left pointing north arrow is the
second most missed map question.)

The person who did worse after I began comparing his answers to the correct
master is an very artistic student who once just filled in the bubbles on
the answer sheet in a pretty pattern. (Had to have a serious talk with him
about that.)

Scaled scores are derived from the raw score. If one is low, so is the
other. I used the term "doing so poorly" because I knew he had previously
answered more than half the questions correctly on a parallel assessment.
This time I was seeing very few correct answers, even at the very beginning
of the assessment, where the questions tend to be easier for most students.

Sometimes he is fully engaged in what he is doing and we get a good
assessment. When he is in a "lets get this over with" mood, anything can
happen. The day he did better with the wrong answer sheet was a day he was
doing random guesses. Even so, marked enough of them correctly for his
scaled score to be in the valid range. However, the ones he hit correctly
were scattered all over the place. As a human being could see the
randomness.  I just junked what he'd done that day and gave him a different
assessment a couple of months later, when his attitude was more suitable.
Glad the random marking didn't happen when we were up against the end of the
fiscal year deadline!
Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156

  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Dan Wann
  Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 9:56 PM
  To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
  Subject: [Assessment 739] Re: Data quality and usefulness

  Mary,

  Where did the valid score place the excellent student who was doing
poorly?   Since we work from the scale score and not the number correct I do
not know how to interpret the doing so poorly.  When working with teachers
and students, we try to place an emphasis on the where the student falls on
the scale or NRS level.  In training with teachers, we always stress that
students are not a single level but students have range of strengths and
needs and we discuss about how to present this information to the student.

  I agree that a missed question does not tell us why the student was not
able to correctly answer the question; however,  by taking "multiple
measures" of student performance over time with a variety of formats tells
me if the student has the concept and if the student can transfer what is
known to different contexts.

  In the example cited below, in most exercises that use maps the X is also
marked with the words such as "you are here."  It would seem that the
student using "X marks the spot" and not "X you are here" would indicate a
reading/literacy problem.  As a teacher I would watch that student read
directions and try to perform tasks.  Does the student ask others to help
explain the task? Does the student ask me, the teacher, for help?  Observing
the student's behavior and patterns of work is part of the assessment
process, and from your other posts I think that is what you seem to do in
your program with such a variety of learners at vastly different levels.

  The last point you make about application forms when the student does not
intend to seek employment presents a challenge that we always face.  If not
application for work, all ESL students are faced without filling out forms
and as  a teacher I want to have students learn to "transfer" knowledge so I
think I might use your quote "learn to read and then read to learn."  That
is I would use the application form for work as a transition to other forms
and so filling out forms is the concept that I am teaching as well as
helping students understand that there are many forms that they will have to
fill out in English and forms have certain questions and vocabulary in
common.  That way there is a relationship between the assessment and what is
taught.  The context of the question is not as important as the ability to
read and fill forms.  I explain to students that the employment form for
them is not important but I would try and brainstorm with them when they
might need to help someone with an employment form.

  Since you mention using CASAS life skills test you might want to look at
the new tests CASAS has developed such as the Life and Work. If your state
has other approved assessments for ESL then you might look at those
assessments to see if you think it is a better match for your curriculum.  I
have found that CASAS Literacy tests and level A reading tests are very
sensitive instruments in tracking lower level student learning gains.

  Dan Wann

  Professional Development Consultant

  Indiana Adult Education Professional Development Project

  dlwann at comcast.net

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Mary Beheler
  Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:58 PM
  To: The Assessment Discussion List
  Subject: [Assessment 737] Data quality and usefulness

  Does GIGO apply to the data all of us, big and small, are gathering?

  The information gleaned from the CASAS Life Skills (or any other)
assessment tool can be useful for spotting problems and successes, but
because of the *multiple layers of skills involved in answering any one
question* the specific question(s) missed must be looked at very carefully.
But, getting the student feedback that makes looking carefully possible gets
into problems of assessment confidentiality.

  Example: A excellent student may understand *everything* else about a
certain CASAS map question, but if he or she has heard the expression "X
marks the spot," and assumes X means the goal, not the beginning, this
question will be nonsense. I don't think the check-off sheet of demonstrated
skills specifies, "Knows that on *this* map X means, "Start here."  If the
student's tutor or I can't discuss a missed question with the student, how
will I discover that?

  How do we know that the question a student answers or misses actually
assesses the skill the assessment manual tells us it does?

  I was scoring an answer sheet and was dismayed at how poorly a student was
doing, when I noticed I wasusing the math answers, not reading. I switched
to the correct set, and the student made even a worse score! Both scores
were in the "valid" range, too! How much confidence should I place in that
assessment?

  Having the questions in a booklet and marking the answers to multiple
choice questions on a separate sheet may be a skill even somewhat advanced
adult students do not have.Because our student workbooks don't use multiple
choice questions, we have actually created lists of number-letter pairs to
see if a student can mark the letter in the appropriate column of each
numbered row on a separate answer sheet. That's all. (Did that after a
strong level 2 student marked the answer sheet by page number, not question
number, with answers to 2 and 3 questions marked in the same row.)

  Has anyone made an effort to see if the lower level literacy students want
to learn what the CASAS or other accepted NRS assessments wants us to teach?
Lots of our students are on SSI. They don't see the point in learning about
employment applications. That often means any question about employment
forms isn't important enough to take seriously, even if the ones about other
forms are.

  Colleges have sense enough to make all freshman year classes pretty
generic, and leave the "major" study to later years. Is it useful for
assessment of beginning literacy to get so specific so soon? Whatever
happened to "Learn to read; then read to learn"?

  We used to use the quick and unintimidating SORT-R for student assessment.
Even on that simple test almost all men missed word "dainty," no matter what
their reading level.  Does anyone know if any specific question(s) on the
assessments used for gathering NRS data is answered incorrectly by most
students at any one level? Or if a significant number of students in the
Laubach series misses different questions than students in Challenger or
Voyager, or another series?

  Mary G. Beheler
  Tri-State Literacy
  455 Ninth Street
  Huntington, WV 25701
  304 528-5700, ext 156

    -----Original Message-----
    From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
    Sent: Monday, April 16, 2007 1:29 PM
    To: Assessment at nifl.gov
    Subject: [Assessment 714] Just joining us? Here's what you need to
know...

    Hi folks,

    A number of subscribers have just joined us and so I would like to give
them the necessary info for joining our discussion.  Please post your
questions and share your experiences now!

    View the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html to get up to date
with the current conversation.

    See suggested resources at:
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07program_impr.html
(Scroll to the bottom!!)

    See more resources at:

    For the 3 power points from New York State/LAC, click on these links:

    http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/ReportCardRubric.ppt

    http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/RollingOutReportCard.ppt

    http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_docs/DevelopingDisseminatingR
eportCards.ppt

    Here are your prompts: add your voice!:

    * Do you use data in your program? What type? How? What have been the
results?

    * What information (data) would you like to track and why?

    * What data would you like to learn how to use?

    Thanks!!

    Marie Cora

    Marie Cora

    marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

    NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

    Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

    http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

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From jtaustin1 at core.com  Wed Apr 18 11:49:03 2007
From: jtaustin1 at core.com (JTA)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 11:49:03 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 743]  Data quality and usefulness of NRS
Message-ID: <20070418155627.7C068BFC91@mail1.mx.core.com>

<p></p><p>Folks,</p><p></p><p>I hope that this is not a duplicative posting, but one implicit assumption being made here is that NRS is itself valid.? Many of the postings assume that it is, and work from there to elaborate usage for various accountability and program improvement purposes.<br /> </p><p>I work in Ohio and have noted the requirements promulgated by DAEL that other systems must align to NRS (most recently last fall with the Federal register outline of the periodic review process) and in various letters from the AIR psychometrician to states or vendors.? </p><p>When a national system is above all of the state systems, I would think that we should strive to keep it on the quality control line as well as all of the underlings. <br /> </p><p>In my reading of the history of NRS, I have not seen the sorts of construct validity studies that seem to be requested / required for state tests and vendor tests.? Consider the width of the levels and the statements that comprise them.? </p><p>There was a thread of work coming out of the CRESST organization a few years ago (Eva Baker's name comes to mind) called Standards for Educational Accountability (SEA) which might be useful if folks wanted to think about validation of? NRS.</p><p>Another useful framework is the Data Quality Campaign (DQC) that Achieve, Inc. and other organizations are using to improve the seamlessness of transitions in P-16 systems.? In Ohio, for example, we have ABLELink for adult basic education, EMIS for K-12, and other systems for One-Stops and post-secondary.? Many of these systems end up in front of the &quot;tower of babel&quot; when they try to communicate, as noted in some of our &quot;Data Match&quot; to unemployment wage records.</p><p></p>
JTA 
CoreComm Webmail. 
http://home.core.com
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From SMonti at ccbcmd.edu  Wed Apr 18 12:29:26 2007
From: SMonti at ccbcmd.edu (Monti, Suzi)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 12:29:26 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 744] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
References: <DAA0CB37DE95234ABD1407F042207CB79EC979@dwe.ccbc.ccbcmd.edu>
	<43DFB331-14B0-4D47-962D-E6D7A6C4BE16@gplc.org>
Message-ID: <DAA0CB37DE95234ABD1407F042207CB7142116@dwe.ccbc.ccbcmd.edu>

Karen,
 
      In response to your question about our curriculum, we do use the same materials (core books) across classes at the same level and while we have/encourage great flexibility to teach in response to student needs there is commonality provided by a framework of target skills or strategies to cover per level/per semester. This does facilitate the learning process if a student transfers within a semester or even if the student shows up the next semester.
 
      As far as tracking, within our program and within a fiscal year we do pick up the students where they turn up assuming the identifiers are consistent. We also plan "sister sites" to encourage multiple enrollment to increase intensity/contact hours for students who desire it. We have the same issues with multiple test results in those cases but the information system we use seems to successfully handle that.
 
      You mentioned students accessing more than one program and being able to track that. I am not sure if our statewide system in Maryland is able to do that (perhaps someone on the list can respond to that?). The issue of tracking can even become problematic within our program. Because of the lack of usual identifiers such as SS#s we have issues due to the use of multiple names or varied arrangement of names/surnames, reversals on dates of birth, etc. as can be common with ESOL students. We assign a number to each student but it is challenging to determine if we are dealing with the same or a different student sometimes. It can be detective work to try to sort it out. It would be interesting to know how often this impacts tracking. 
 
Suzi

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Karen Mundie
Sent: Wed 4/18/2007 10:40 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 741] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Suzi, given that much mobility in your students, I'm curious about your curriculum. Do you have a reasonably set curriculum that is consistent across sites? If that were the case, the movement would have fewer implication for student learning gains.  

And do you "move" the student records and hours in class forward from one site to another internally? 

The beauty of our on-line data bases in Pennsylvania is that students can't be duplicated in the system. Even if a student moves to a different program rather than a different site, his record is in edata and the new program and old one share the student equally. Both programs can put in hours, but only one can put in assessment information. The program in which the student is currently active is usually the "primary" program. 

There are, frankly, some students who, because they are so motivated to learn English, are active in more than one program at the same time. It doesn't matter which agency does the testing--we usually use the best results for the official record. If our data base manager sees that we have better results than the primary agency, it benefits both of us to use that data. We might have the caught the student on a better day or our test might have have more appropriate for that particular student. 

Karen Mundie
Associate Director
Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
Pittsburgh, PA  15206
412 661-7323 (ext 101)
kmundie at gplc.org

GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007

This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees and is not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the intended recipient, please report the error to the originator and delete the contents.

On Apr 17, 2007, at 6:58 PM, Monti, Suzi wrote:

	I would like to add a few comments on retention and ESOL students. 
	 
	We have recently heard a lot about "stopping out" and I think that can pertain to ESOL learners for many of the same reasons as ASE/GED learners - with the addition of issues such as stages of acculturation and/or home country responsibilities which may cause ESOL learners to withdraw for weeks or months and then possibly return.
	 
	I would also like to raise the issue of the mobility of the ESOL population. We see migration reports on immigrants and settlement trends and I often wonder how much of a difference in retention these trends makes when comparing ASE/GED retention rates with ESOL. 
	 
	I think of the "stopover" trend we see sometimes in ESOL here in Baltimore, MD where non-native speakers will enter and only temporarily reside her before moving to an intended more perm ant location. This obviously has great impact on retention. When comparing ESOL programs statewide or nationwide, the "stopover" trend may negatively impact the retention rates of certain programs.
	 
	Another thing we see is "shift" or movement around the beltway (as we call it). We have major ESOL class sites at locations along the Baltimore beltway that roughly encircles the city and we see contraction and expansion at these sites based the movement of the ESOL population. We will see that a site may suddenly have low retention across ALL six or seven ESOL classes offered - even the classes with veteran/experienced teachers with a great track record of retention. In some cases, the same teacher is also teaching at another site and his/her class there is doing well at that site. Both of these things show that attrition is not likely a result of instructional issues. 
	 
	When we see this contraction of a site with mid-semester attrition, we can sometimes predict that at another site we will experience a boom in registration the next semester. It depends on if it is more "stopover" (with learners leaving the area entirely) or just "shift" (learners relocating within the area). If it is the latter, learners who leave one site mid-semester will turn up to register the next semester at another site. 
	 
	Suzi Monti 

	ESOL Curriculum Developer and Instructional Specialist 
	The Community College of Baltimore County 
	Center for Adult and Family Literacy 
	7200 Sollers Point Road E102
	Baltimore, MD 21222 

	(410) 285-9476   

	
	-----Original Message-----
	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
	Sent: Tuesday April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
	To: The Assessment Discussion List
	Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
	
	
	

		Hi Ella,
		 
		Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what is going on.
		 
		I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of attendance.
		 
		Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because this measure reflects student motivation to attend.
		 
		Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for them.

________________________________

		From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
		Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
		To: assessment at nifl.gov
		Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
		
		
		Dear Collegues:
		
		Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program. We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.
		
		We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance, educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been able to improve all of these efforts. 
		
		Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested, progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign responsibility for improvement where needed.
		
		I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.
		
		Respectfully submitted by,
		Ella Bogard
		
		Ella Bogard, Executive Director
		Franklinton Learning Center
		1003 West Town Street
		Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438
		
		Phone: (614) 221-9151
		Fax: (614) 221-9131
		
		

	
	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us  Wed Apr 18 13:41:42 2007
From: mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us (Mary Beheler)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 13:41:42 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 745] Re: Data quality and usefulness of NRS
In-Reply-To: <20070418155627.7C068BFC91@mail1.mx.core.com>
Message-ID: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMOEBJCEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>

Maybe aggregate figures for large groups can give some indication are doing
better or worse than they used to. Maybe.

But NRS gives surely gives meaningless results for small groups like ours.
(Total 20-25 students with 12 or more hours per year) One individual can
vary the group results far too drastically.

My first posting on the 16th asked a question about the statistical validity
of the figures for a five member level containing only 3 or 4 post-tested
individuals. If these figures has real meaning for our group, would someone
please explain? (I'm not a statistician, but I have had some college math
classes, including calculus.)

The standard for a level with only one member could be 2% or 98%, it still
amounts to pass/fail. At level 4 (high intermediate ABE)  the student could
improve more than 10 CASAS points and the whole level, and therefore our
group, would not be an NRS success!

Yes, I know, the state will take our smallness into consideration when
looking at our figures, but the rules are not written that way.

It seems like it would be useful for small groups to have their results
bundled for comparison to the big guys. Maybe invent a standard for a whole
organization, if it is big enough. If level-by-level analysis of small
groups is as nonsensical as I think it is, why burden us with it? Let us
just report.

And you are right, JTA, the whole NRS system might be useless in the long
run. Maybe even harmful.

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156
  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of JTA
  Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 11:49 AM
  To: The Assessment Discussion List
  Subject: [Assessment 743] Data quality and usefulness of NRS

  Folks,

  I hope that this is not a duplicative posting, but one implicit assumption
being made here is that NRS is itself valid.  Many of the postings assume
that it is, and work from there to elaborate usage for various
accountability and program improvement purposes.

  I work in Ohio and have noted the requirements promulgated by DAEL that
other systems must align to NRS (most recently last fall with the Federal
register outline of the periodic review process) and in various letters from
the AIR psychometrician to states or vendors.

  When a national system is above all of the state systems, I would think
that we should strive to keep it on the quality control line as well as all
of the underlings.

  In my reading of the history of NRS, I have not seen the sorts of
construct validity studies that seem to be requested / required for state
tests and vendor tests.  Consider the width of the levels and the statements
that comprise them.

  There was a thread of work coming out of the CRESST organization a few
years ago (Eva Baker's name comes to mind) called Standards for Educational
Accountability (SEA) which might be useful if folks wanted to think about
validation of  NRS.

  Another useful framework is the Data Quality Campaign (DQC) that Achieve,
Inc. and other organizations are using to improve the seamlessness of
transitions in P-16 systems.  In Ohio, for example, we have ABLELink for
adult basic education, EMIS for K-12, and other systems for One-Stops and
post-secondary.  Many of these systems end up in front of the "tower of
babel" when they try to communicate, as noted in some of our "Data Match" to
unemployment wage records.

  JTA
  CoreComm Webmail.
  http://home.core.com
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From lteller at massasoit.mass.edu  Wed Apr 18 13:56:06 2007
From: lteller at massasoit.mass.edu (Luanne Teller)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 13:56:06 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 746]  Using Data
Message-ID: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3CFC@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>

Hi all:

 

I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is the
focus of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of writing
our proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we speak!

 

The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what most
people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard to
attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We believe;
however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture of what is
happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion, not decision
making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at additional
sources of data that we find essential in informing our
planning---meetings with staff, classes, our student advisory board, and
focus groups.

 

Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year
analysis of learner retention, and began to document why students did
not persist.  We found that the retention for students who enrolled
after January 1 (our programs runs on a school calendar year from
September to June) was significantly lower than the retention for
students who began in September.  Even more compelling, we learned that
the retention for students who began after March 1 was 0%.

 

We met with staff and students, and did some research around student
retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to pilot a
"managed enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts, our grantor (MA DOE)
allows us to "over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20% more
students in the fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the overenrolled
students into funded slots.  This allows us to keep the seats filled
even with the typical attrition that occurs.

 

In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students to
the higher level who are ready to progress....that typically leaves
several openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in
February as a cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation
programs including a requirement that new students observe a class
before enrolling.  

 

While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will have a
positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the
transition seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager
to look at the data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness
of this plan.  

 

As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to be a
unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect that
the lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for
themselves with employers is influencing their attendance and
persistence.  This is an issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms
of policy.  Do we need to have a more flexible, lenient policy for
beginner students?  Is there a way to support students in addressing
these employment issues?  How can we empower students more quickly?  Are
there other issues for these beginner level students that affect their
participation?  As we enter these discussions, the numbers will provide
a basis for developing strategies, but the students themselves with be
our greatest source of valuable data. 

 

Luanne Teller

 

Luanne Teller

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From dcornellier at doe.mass.edu  Wed Apr 18 14:45:13 2007
From: dcornellier at doe.mass.edu (Cornellier, Donna)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 14:45:13 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 747] Staff Development for Using Data for Program
	Improvement
Message-ID: <8ADDCB4F87E49F47B163BCD04B6D6EA101459689@exchange1.doe.mass.edu>

Hi,

In Massachusetts we have developed and implemented a plan for ongoing staff
development on using data to promote continuous improvement.  Our state-wide
professional development system, (SABES) has developed a program planning
process that incorporates NRS and other data to promote continuous
improvement. They utilized the following approaches to providing support for
program planning: (1) a comprehensive 12-hour course, offered in all five
regions of the state, on planning for program improvement, including a
module on types and sources of data, data quality, and data analysis. The
course culminates with presentations by participants on their program
planning activities. (2) On-site coaching to selected programs in need of a
tailored approach  (3) A separate data module from the planning course
presented twice as a separate workshop (4) Program and staff development
sharing groups to provide forums for directors and practitioners to share
experiences. Follow-up for all participants who attended this training is
provided.  Programs are now required to submit program improvement plans
that are tied to their performance in attendance, average attended hours,
pre- and post- testing, learning gains and eventually, the achievement of
student goals.  SABES provides ongoing support to programs in developing
their continuous improvement plans. We have found that offering more
intensive courses for several staff members at local programs has been very
helpful for our local programs. 

Donna Cornellier
SMARTT ABE Project Manager
Adult and Community Learning Services
Massachusetts Department of Education
350 Main Street
Malden, MA 02148
781 338-3814

From LCondelli at air.org  Wed Apr 18 15:32:55 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 15:32:55 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 748] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F19A2@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530983@dc1ex03.air.org>

Sandy,
 
A few years ago I did a study on adult ESL literacy students that
focused primarily on instruction.  But we also looked at retention.  We
found that the proportion of time an ESL literacy student attended
(measure by hours attended over total hours class was scheduled) had a
positive effect on oral English skills and reading comprehension, all
else being equal (using a complex statistical model).
 
The possible reasons for this effect are intriguing and need more
research.  Because this measure showed an effect regardless of how many
hours the student actually attended (or how many hours per week a
student attended), my interpretation is that this measure is a measure
of motivation (although I have no data or other information to check
this).  In other words, the student who continues to attend over time,
despite all of the other competing demands on time, is one that is more
motivated.  This motivation helps learning.  
 
I think if true, it does have implications for structuring instructional
segments.

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Sandy Strunk
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:38 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 736] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Larry,

Could you tell us more about the ESL research on percentage of possible
time attended? This is a new idea to me. Does it reflect greater
intensity as opposed to lesser intensity for a longer duration - or do
you think something else is going on? If your research is correct, there
are certainly implications for how we structure instructional segments. 

 

Sandy Strunk

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hi Ella,

 

Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
is going on.

 

I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
attendance.

 

Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most
data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that
learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
this measure reflects student motivation to attend.

 

Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about
why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
them.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program
to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program.
We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours
attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers
of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been
able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible
to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that
information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
responsibility for improvement where needed.

I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not
just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From flowenbach at cweal.org  Wed Apr 18 17:15:06 2007
From: flowenbach at cweal.org (Fred Lowenbach)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 17:15:06 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 749] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530983@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <11100F3DEA99F24CB3E87E45900040DF779BD8@cwf-exchange.Commonweal-Foundation.org>

Hopefully everyone participating in this discussion regarding adult
literacy is aware that almost everything you are saying applies to the
results for students in school as well.  Coming from a public school
background you could always see the effect that high mobility rates had
on overall student results.  Schools with those highest rates almost
always struggled to meet standard on state measures connected to NCLB.
This was the case with overall populations as well as various subgroups
that were tested.  The same applies to student retention, or for that
matter attendance.  As a rule, student who attended regularly achieved
much higher grades than students whose attendance was far less
consistent.  This then followed suit with results on standardized
testing and ultimately on graduation rates.

 

The entire education community, whether it is involved with adult
literacy, or the traditional K-12 curriculum is faced with the same
thing.  The key to increasing literacy and to closing achievement gaps
starts with getting and retaining students.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 3:33 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 748] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Sandy,

 

A few years ago I did a study on adult ESL literacy students that
focused primarily on instruction.  But we also looked at retention.  We
found that the proportion of time an ESL literacy student attended
(measure by hours attended over total hours class was scheduled) had a
positive effect on oral English skills and reading comprehension, all
else being equal (using a complex statistical model).

 

The possible reasons for this effect are intriguing and need more
research.  Because this measure showed an effect regardless of how many
hours the student actually attended (or how many hours per week a
student attended), my interpretation is that this measure is a measure
of motivation (although I have no data or other information to check
this).  In other words, the student who continues to attend over time,
despite all of the other competing demands on time, is one that is more
motivated.  This motivation helps learning.  

 

I think if true, it does have implications for structuring instructional
segments.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Sandy Strunk
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:38 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 736] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Larry,

Could you tell us more about the ESL research on percentage of possible
time attended? This is a new idea to me. Does it reflect greater
intensity as opposed to lesser intensity for a longer duration - or do
you think something else is going on? If your research is correct, there
are certainly implications for how we structure instructional segments. 

 

Sandy Strunk

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hi Ella,

 

Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
is going on.

 

I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
attendance.

 

Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most
data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that
learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
this measure reflects student motivation to attend.

 

Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about
why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
them.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program
to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program.
We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours
attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers
of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been
able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible
to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that
information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
responsibility for improvement where needed.

I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not
just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Wed Apr 18 18:01:14 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 15:01:14 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 750] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3CFC@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>
References: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3CFC@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>
Message-ID: <OF9585641A.B6F4718F-ON072572C1.0078F67F-072572C1.0078F681@yc.edu>

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From sandy_strunk at IU13.org  Wed Apr 18 19:01:38 2007
From: sandy_strunk at IU13.org (Sandy Strunk)
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2007 19:01:38 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 751] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <11100F3DEA99F24CB3E87E45900040DF779BD8@cwf-exchange.Commonweal-Foundation.org>
Message-ID: <66C8B9B747B73C4EA36866C84FF6FAA15F1E35@IUHQSEXC002.hq.iu13.local>

Fred,

I certainly agree that K-12 education has retention issues related to
mobility; however, the difference as I see it is twofold. First of all,
most schools run on a 180 cycle and children are expected to attend
every day that they're healthy and reside in the district. Secondly,
while an individual teacher may structure his/her instructional
segments, most students don't have the ability to choose whether or not
to attend a given session. I suspect that the attendance issue in K-12 -
at least up until 9th or 10th grade - is related to the family's
mobility rather than to student motivation.

 

Most adult education programs in Pennsylvania, have an average
attendance of 60 to 100 hours per year. Mobility is certainly a factor,
but in my experience most adults "stop out" for many reasons other than
mobility. As a program director, I have tried various combinations of
intensity and duration. One of the ways we've worked on retention is to
have each teacher create a scattergram of his/her retention patterns.
One axis of the graph is the number of hours available, the other axis
is the duration of the class. What we found is that different patterns
emerge on the scattergram with different teachers. We then work with
teachers individually to develop improvement strategies based on their
individual patterns. For example, a teacher with students who cluster in
the low intensity/low duration quadrant would use very different
retention strategies than a teacher who has students clustering in the
low intensity/high duration quadrant or a teacher whose scattergram is
evenly distributed across the four quadrants. Ultimately, the teacher's
goal is to see his/her students clustering in the high intensity, high
duration quadrant. Our experience suggests that working with teachers on
their scattergrams and retention strategies has a positive impact on
student retention.

 

If Larry's research can be replicated, it speaks to a couple of very
important issues for our field. Open entry/open exit is one of them. The
second is the length of the instructional segment, regardless of
intensity. Our program has operated under the assumption that low
intensity classes need to be longer in duration. For example, our night
classes tend to run in 14 week segments whereas our daytime, high
intensity classes tend to run about 7 weeks. This research certainly
challenges this assumption. 

 

Sandy

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Fred Lowenbach
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 5:15 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 749] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hopefully everyone participating in this discussion regarding adult
literacy is aware that almost everything you are saying applies to the
results for students in school as well.  Coming from a public school
background you could always see the effect that high mobility rates had
on overall student results.  Schools with those highest rates almost
always struggled to meet standard on state measures connected to NCLB.
This was the case with overall populations as well as various subgroups
that were tested.  The same applies to student retention, or for that
matter attendance.  As a rule, student who attended regularly achieved
much higher grades than students whose attendance was far less
consistent.  This then followed suit with results on standardized
testing and ultimately on graduation rates.

 

The entire education community, whether it is involved with adult
literacy, or the traditional K-12 curriculum is faced with the same
thing.  The key to increasing literacy and to closing achievement gaps
starts with getting and retaining students.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 3:33 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 748] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Sandy,

 

A few years ago I did a study on adult ESL literacy students that
focused primarily on instruction.  But we also looked at retention.  We
found that the proportion of time an ESL literacy student attended
(measure by hours attended over total hours class was scheduled) had a
positive effect on oral English skills and reading comprehension, all
else being equal (using a complex statistical model).

 

The possible reasons for this effect are intriguing and need more
research.  Because this measure showed an effect regardless of how many
hours the student actually attended (or how many hours per week a
student attended), my interpretation is that this measure is a measure
of motivation (although I have no data or other information to check
this).  In other words, the student who continues to attend over time,
despite all of the other competing demands on time, is one that is more
motivated.  This motivation helps learning.  

 

I think if true, it does have implications for structuring instructional
segments.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Sandy Strunk
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:38 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 736] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Larry,

Could you tell us more about the ESL research on percentage of possible
time attended? This is a new idea to me. Does it reflect greater
intensity as opposed to lesser intensity for a longer duration - or do
you think something else is going on? If your research is correct, there
are certainly implications for how we structure instructional segments. 

 

Sandy Strunk

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hi Ella,

 

Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
is going on.

 

I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
attendance.

 

Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most
data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that
learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
this measure reflects student motivation to attend.

 

Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about
why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
them.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program
to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program.
We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours
attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers
of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been
able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible
to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that
information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
responsibility for improvement where needed.

I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not
just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From djrosen at comcast.net  Thu Apr 19 02:05:23 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 02:05:23 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <OF9585641A.B6F4718F-ON072572C1.0078F67F-072572C1.0078F681@yc.edu>
References: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3CFC@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>
	<OF9585641A.B6F4718F-ON072572C1.0078F67F-072572C1.0078F681@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <462706A3.1050605@comcast.net>

Larry, and others,

Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns like 
this that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year, may not be 
the best unit of time in which to measure learner gains, except for 
those who are doing basic skills brush-up or who have very short-term 
goals like preparing for a drivers license test. I wonder if there is a 
possibility that the NRS might be adjusted, perhaps in a pilot at first, 
so that a longer period of learning, say three years, might be used to 
demonstrate learner gains.  Of course, there would need to be 
intermediate measures, but accountability -- for programs and states -- 
might be based on a longer period of time. 

It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure learning 
gains or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher education, but 
rather Congressional expectations for job skills training. Would you agree?

Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that track 
and report learner outcomes over several years, and use the data for 
program improvement.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote:

> Hi Luanne,
>  
> I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be 
> consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often 
> the last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with 
> the program until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the 
> highest posttesting and retention rate.
>  
> Tina
>
>
>
>
> Tina Luffman
> Coordinator, Developmental Education
> Verde Valley Campus
> 928-634-6544
> tina_luffman at yc.edu <mailto:tina_luffman at yc.edu>
>
> -----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----
>
>     To: <assessment at nifl.gov>
>     From: "Luanne Teller" <lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
>     Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
>     Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
>     Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data
>
>     Hi all:
>
>      
>
>     I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is
>     the focus of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process
>     of writing our proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data
>     even as we speak!
>
>      
>
>     The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what
>     most people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with
>     regard to attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment,
>     etc.  We believe; however, that the numbers alone provide an
>     incomplete picture of what is happening, so we use the numbers as
>     a basis for discussion, not decision making.  After analyzing the
>     numbers, we begin to look at additional sources of data that we
>     find essential in informing our planning---meetings with staff,
>     classes, our student advisory board, and focus groups.
>
>      
>
>     Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year
>     analysis of learner retention, and began to document why students
>     did not persist.  We found that the retention for students who
>     enrolled after January 1 (our programs runs on a school calendar
>     year from September to June) was significantly lower than the
>     retention for students who began in September.  Even more
>     compelling, we learned that the retention for students who began
>     after March 1 was 0%.
>
>      
>
>     We met with staff and students, and did some research around
>     student retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided
>     to pilot a "managed enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our
>     grantor (MA DOE) allows us to "over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so
>     we enroll 20% more students in the fall.  When students leave, we
>     "drop" the overenrolled students into funded slots.  This allows
>     us to keep the seats filled even with the typical attrition that
>     occurs.
>
>      
>
>     In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students
>     to the higher level who are ready to progress....that typically
>     leaves several openings in the beginner levels and we begin
>     students in February as a cohort.  This year, we implemented new
>     orientation programs including a requirement that new students
>     observe a class before enrolling. 
>
>      
>
>     While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will
>     have a positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally
>     that the transition seems to be easier for some of these
>     students.  We are eager to look at the data at the end of the year
>     to analyze the effectiveness of this plan. 
>
>      
>
>     As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to
>     be a unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We
>     suspect that the lack of effective English communication skills to
>     advocate for themselves with employers is influencing their
>     attendance and persistence.  This is an issue that we are
>     beginning to tackle in terms of policy.  Do we need to have a more
>     flexible, lenient policy for beginner students?  Is there a way to
>     support students in addressing these employment issues?  How can
>     we empower students more quickly?  Are there other issues for
>     these beginner level students that affect their participation?  As
>     we enter these discussions, the numbers will provide a basis for
>     developing strategies, but the students themselves with be our
>     greatest source of valuable data.
>
>      
>
>     Luanne Teller
>
>      
>
>     Luanne Teller
>
>     -------------------------------
>     National Institute for Literacy
>     Assessment mailing list
>     Assessment at nifl.gov
>     To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>     http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>-------------------------------
>National Institute for Literacy
>Assessment mailing list
>Assessment at nifl.gov
>To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  
>

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Apr 19 08:45:54 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 08:45:54 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 753]  Using Student Goals as Data
Message-ID: <01da01c78280$abfa7090$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
Wow, what a super discussion!  So rich and full of great ideas,
interesting comments, excellent questions, and thoughtful challenges.  I
usually contribute more myself but I'm just reading and soaking it in at
this point.  I am cutting and pasting the discussion into a
user-friendly document, which I will make available once our Guest Panel
concludes tomorrow.  
 
We are really covering a lot of ground here!  Just curious (because it
is a focus on mine within the realm of accountability):  a number of
folks have discussed issues of retention and the types of strategies
that they employ in their programming, but I don't think that anyone has
mentioned if they use student-stated goals to track retention, trends in
learning or program offerings, etc.  Perhaps the use of student goals is
more easily applicable at the classroom/teaching level (not sure!), but
I just wanted to know if anyone out there makes programmatic decisions
based in part on the reasons why students come to your programs.  I am
not referring to learning gains (reading, writing, math, ESOL, etc), but
rather to students' ultimate purposes for attending, like getting a
better job, helping kids with homework, buying a home, becoming a
citizen, etc. 
 
Thoughts on this?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From lteller at massasoit.mass.edu  Thu Apr 19 09:24:33 2007
From: lteller at massasoit.mass.edu (Luanne Teller)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 09:24:33 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 754] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <11100F3DEA99F24CB3E87E45900040DF779BD8@cwf-exchange.Commonweal-Foundation.org>
Message-ID: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3D00@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>

Good morning:

How interesting to hear from a range of institutions---I get so focused
on my programs that it is interesting to hear from other types of
organizations and structures.

 

For my students, motivation isn't an issue at all.  We have a lengthy
wait list - depending on the level, students could wait as little as 6
months or as long as 2 years to get into our program.  Consequently,
they are pretty thrilled to finally be there, and eager to participate.

 

For my population, (adult ESOL learners---a large majority in the 25-44
age range) the issue is juggling demands on their time.  The majority
work at least one job (many work 2 or more) and have children in school.
Our classes are in the evening, since over 90% of the population we
serve work during the day.  Many rush directly from work to class, and
might be late due to mandatory overtime, or a family need that requires
attention prior to attending class.  Given the lack of access to
adequate preventative health care that many of our students face, there
are ongoing health problems for many.  Add this to the occasional trip
back to their native country for a death in the family, or some other
type of family emergency, and frankly I'm amazed that they are able to
maintain such a strong commitment to their studies.

 

Some of our research and data analysis have uncovered these issues--
still it remains quite a challenge to respond to these problems.  We
initially adjusted our program plan and schedule to allow for longer
breaks during the holidays, when many students wish to return to their
native countries.  We also incorporate school vacations in our planning.
When an individual student starts to have a problem, we meet with him or
her to see how we can help.  It doesn't always work, but sometimes we
are able to communicate with employers, and that's been helpful for many
students.  Sometimes, we offer students a "leave of absence" to deal
with pressing personal matters, and invite them to return when things
are more settled.  All of these strategies have evolved over years of
looking at attendance/retention data, and discussions with focus groups.
These strategies have had a positive impact, and students appreciate our
responsiveness to their needs.  

 

The first year that we implemented our "managed enrollment" (vs. open
entry/open exit) model, our retention increased from 74% to 90%.  Our
attendance has increased from 68% to now over 82%.  We all know how
critical it is to keep students long enough for them to reach their
goals...

 

Which brings me to my final point.  We all serve so many masters---NRS,
our funders (in my case DOE); our parent organizations (for me a
community college) and we are constantly looking at data to justify our
existence and demonstrate our effectiveness.  Let's be realistic, if we
want to retain our funding, we have to show results-which is as it
should be.

 

For us; however, when we look at our data, it is always with an eye to
how we can better serve our students and respond to their needs.  The
difference is subtle, but powerful.  It's a lot easier to get staff and
students on board with planning and change when they can see a direct
result for our students than to respond to a bunch of charts and
mandates from "higher ups".  

 

Luanne Teller

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Fred Lowenbach
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 5:15 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 749] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hopefully everyone participating in this discussion regarding adult
literacy is aware that almost everything you are saying applies to the
results for students in school as well.  Coming from a public school
background you could always see the effect that high mobility rates had
on overall student results.  Schools with those highest rates almost
always struggled to meet standard on state measures connected to NCLB.
This was the case with overall populations as well as various subgroups
that were tested.  The same applies to student retention, or for that
matter attendance.  As a rule, student who attended regularly achieved
much higher grades than students whose attendance was far less
consistent.  This then followed suit with results on standardized
testing and ultimately on graduation rates.

 

The entire education community, whether it is involved with adult
literacy, or the traditional K-12 curriculum is faced with the same
thing.  The key to increasing literacy and to closing achievement gaps
starts with getting and retaining students.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 3:33 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 748] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Sandy,

 

A few years ago I did a study on adult ESL literacy students that
focused primarily on instruction.  But we also looked at retention.  We
found that the proportion of time an ESL literacy student attended
(measure by hours attended over total hours class was scheduled) had a
positive effect on oral English skills and reading comprehension, all
else being equal (using a complex statistical model).

 

The possible reasons for this effect are intriguing and need more
research.  Because this measure showed an effect regardless of how many
hours the student actually attended (or how many hours per week a
student attended), my interpretation is that this measure is a measure
of motivation (although I have no data or other information to check
this).  In other words, the student who continues to attend over time,
despite all of the other competing demands on time, is one that is more
motivated.  This motivation helps learning.  

 

I think if true, it does have implications for structuring instructional
segments.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Sandy Strunk
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:38 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 736] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Larry,

Could you tell us more about the ESL research on percentage of possible
time attended? This is a new idea to me. Does it reflect greater
intensity as opposed to lesser intensity for a longer duration - or do
you think something else is going on? If your research is correct, there
are certainly implications for how we structure instructional segments. 

 

Sandy Strunk

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hi Ella,

 

Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
is going on.

 

I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
attendance.

 

Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most
data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that
learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
this measure reflects student motivation to attend.

 

Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about
why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
them.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program
to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program.
We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours
attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers
of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been
able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible
to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that
information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
responsibility for improvement where needed.

I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not
just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From bryan at cal.org  Thu Apr 19 09:29:32 2007
From: bryan at cal.org (Bryan Woerner)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 09:29:32 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 755] Re: Using Student Goals as Data
In-Reply-To: <01da01c78280$abfa7090$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <7E0B624DDF68104F92C38648A4D93D8F02751E1B@MAIL.cal.local>

Hello all!
 
I've been trying to keep up with this discussion as best I can.
 
As a teacher, I use the test data given to me by my program along with
my own needs assessments (what the students know and what they want to
know) to plan my lessons. Typically my students want to get a better
job, help kids with school work, and be able to live in the US. The test
data shows their strengths and weakness. By combining the this
information, I can design lessons that target the language used in these
everyday situations: reading an apartment ad, answering and asking
questions in an interview, making a doctor's appointment over the phone,
etc.
 
Bryan Woerner

 
________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 8:46 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 753] Using Student Goals as Data

Hi everyone,
 
Wow, what a super discussion!  So rich and full of great ideas,
interesting comments, excellent questions, and thoughtful challenges.  I
usually contribute more myself but I'm just reading and soaking it in at
this point.  I am cutting and pasting the discussion into a
user-friendly document, which I will make available once our Guest Panel
concludes tomorrow.  
 
We are really covering a lot of ground here!  Just curious (because it
is a focus on mine within the realm of accountability):  a number of
folks have discussed issues of retention and the types of strategies
that they employ in their programming, but I don't think that anyone has
mentioned if they use student-stated goals to track retention, trends in
learning or program offerings, etc.  Perhaps the use of student goals is
more easily applicable at the classroom/teaching level (not sure!), but
I just wanted to know if anyone out there makes programmatic decisions
based in part on the reasons why students come to your programs.  I am
not referring to learning gains (reading, writing, math, ESOL, etc), but
rather to students' ultimate purposes for attending, like getting a
better job, helping kids with homework, buying a home, becoming a
citizen, etc. 
 
Thoughts on this?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From dlwann at comcast.net  Thu Apr 19 09:47:06 2007
From: dlwann at comcast.net (Dan Wann)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 09:47:06 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 756] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <462706A3.1050605@comcast.net>
References: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3CFC@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu><OF9585641A.B6F4718F-ON072572C1.0078F67F-072572C1.0078F681@yc.edu>
	<462706A3.1050605@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>

I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic and ESL
students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track over a longer
period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the adult basic skills
network is that basic skills programs have little impact because students do
not stay long to make a difference.  Do we have any evidence that shows we
work with the same students more than one year and that we work with a high
enough number of students more than one year to make a significant
difference? 

 

 

Dan Wann

Professional Development Consultant 

IN Adult Education Professional Development Project 

 

dlwann at comcast.net  

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data

 

Larry, and others,

Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns like this
that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year, may not be the best
unit of time in which to measure learner gains, except for those who are
doing basic skills brush-up or who have very short-term goals like preparing
for a drivers license test. I wonder if there is a possibility that the NRS
might be adjusted, perhaps in a pilot at first, so that a longer period of
learning, say three years, might be used to demonstrate learner gains.  Of
course, there would need to be intermediate measures, but accountability --
for programs and states -- might be based on a longer period of time.  

It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure learning gains
or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher education, but rather
Congressional expectations for job skills training. Would you agree?

Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that track and
report learner outcomes over several years, and use the data for program
improvement.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote: 

Hi Luanne,

 

I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be
consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often the
last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the program
until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest posttesting
and retention rate.

 

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

 

-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

To:  <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov> <assessment at nifl.gov>
From: "Luanne Teller"  <mailto:lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
<lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data

Hi all: 

  

I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is the focus
of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of writing our
proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we speak! 

  

The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what most
people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard to
attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We believe;
however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture of what is
happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion, not decision
making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at additional sources
of data that we find essential in informing our planning---meetings with
staff, classes, our student advisory board, and focus groups. 

  

Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year analysis of
learner retention, and began to document why students did not persist.  We
found that the retention for students who enrolled after January 1 (our
programs runs on a school calendar year from September to June) was
significantly lower than the retention for students who began in September.
Even more compelling, we learned that the retention for students who began
after March 1 was 0%. 

  

We met with staff and students, and did some research around student
retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to pilot a "managed
enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor (MA DOE) allows us to
"over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20% more students in the
fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the overenrolled students into funded
slots.  This allows us to keep the seats filled even with the typical
attrition that occurs. 

  

In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students to the
higher level who are ready to progress..that typically leaves several
openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in February as a
cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation programs including a
requirement that new students observe a class before enrolling.  

  

While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will have a
positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the transition
seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager to look at the
data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness of this plan.  

  

As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to be a
unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect that the
lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for themselves
with employers is influencing their attendance and persistence.  This is an
issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms of policy.  Do we need to
have a more flexible, lenient policy for beginner students?  Is there a way
to support students in addressing these employment issues?  How can we
empower students more quickly?  Are there other issues for these beginner
level students that affect their participation?  As we enter these
discussions, the numbers will provide a basis for developing strategies, but
the students themselves with be our greatest source of valuable data. 

  

Luanne Teller 

  

Luanne Teller 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 

 

  _____  

 
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  

 

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From lteller at massasoit.mass.edu  Thu Apr 19 09:50:31 2007
From: lteller at massasoit.mass.edu (Luanne Teller)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 09:50:31 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 757] Re: Using Student Goals as Data
In-Reply-To: <01da01c78280$abfa7090$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3D01@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>

Hi Marie:

 

Great point---

 

As I just stated in my last email, our primary focus is how the
information we derive from our data can benefit our students.

 

We recently completed a two year study on learner goals, and completely
revised our goal setting process.  

 

In the beginning of the year, students select at least 3 goals that they
want to work on.  (We use pictures for beginner ESOL students and more
advanced students who can help translate.)  The process is somewhat
driven by the DOE mandates, but we pride ourselves in having an entire
page of "other" goals that students can identify.  While the DOE
requirements provide the basic structure for our goal setting process,
we are not limited by it.  Each month, students answer three questions
in their blue books around the goals they have selected:

 

1.	What they did in the past month towards meeting their goals
2.	What they plan to do in the upcoming month to meet their goals
3.	What we can do to assist them.

 

Instructors collect the goals books each month and review them.  We work
as a team to assist students where we can.  When a student meets a goal,
the instructor notifies the office staff (there is a paper trail) so we
can enter it into the system (or not depending on the goal and student
authorization to release the information).  This allows us to quantify
our learner's progress towards their goals in a data base that yields
useful information.

 

In the beginning of the year, when instructors collect the goals books
for the first time, they review the information around what goals
students have set.  This allows them to integrate goals into the
curriculum and instruction, and provides administrative staff with
information to help planning for the year. For example, many students
this year have selected health-related goals, so we have the Director of
Interpreter Services from our local hospital coming to speak with
students around patient rights and access to health care resources in
the community.  

 

We also have conversation classes that allow us to focus on clusters of
goals.  For example, we might do a series on Citizenship if we have
several students with that goal.  

 

In many ways, helping our students articulate and achieve their goals
relates directly to the retention and attendance issue.  The best way to
retain students is when they see a direct result from their
participation that is relevant to their daily lives.  

 

At the end of the year, we collate all the information around student
goal achievement.  We have an annual year-end student achievement
ceremony, and on each table we place a tent card.  On the outside it
says simply "Did you know that..." and on the inside, we include
information about student goal achievements.  For example, it might say
that 6 students became American citizens, or 5 students bought new
homes, or 12 students got raises.  

 

This helps communicate the impact of our program to our community
partners and funders in a real and meaningful way.  

 

This is a great example of how we are able to serve our funders (by
quantifying data to meet the state accountability standard around
student goal setting) in a way that truly focuses on meeting our
students' needs. 

 

Luanne 

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 8:46 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 753] Using Student Goals as Data

 

Hi everyone,

 

Wow, what a super discussion!  So rich and full of great ideas,
interesting comments, excellent questions, and thoughtful challenges.  I
usually contribute more myself but I'm just reading and soaking it in at
this point.  I am cutting and pasting the discussion into a
user-friendly document, which I will make available once our Guest Panel
concludes tomorrow.  

 

We are really covering a lot of ground here!  Just curious (because it
is a focus on mine within the realm of accountability):  a number of
folks have discussed issues of retention and the types of strategies
that they employ in their programming, but I don't think that anyone has
mentioned if they use student-stated goals to track retention, trends in
learning or program offerings, etc.  Perhaps the use of student goals is
more easily applicable at the classroom/teaching level (not sure!), but
I just wanted to know if anyone out there makes programmatic decisions
based in part on the reasons why students come to your programs.  I am
not referring to learning gains (reading, writing, math, ESOL, etc), but
rather to students' ultimate purposes for attending, like getting a
better job, helping kids with homework, buying a home, becoming a
citizen, etc. 

 

Thoughts on this?

 

Thanks!

 

Marie

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

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From reders at pdx.edu  Thu Apr 19 10:17:37 2007
From: reders at pdx.edu (Steve Reder)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 07:17:37 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 758] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
References: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3CFC@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu><OF9585641A.B6F4718F-ON072572C1.0078F67F-072572C1.0078F681@yc.edu><462706A3.1050605@comcast.net>
	<002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
Message-ID: <000001c7828d$7b4e09e0$5074fc83@PSU.DS.PDX.EDU>

The Longitudinal Study of Adult Learning has been following a target
population of ABE learners over a long period of time.  It's finding exactly
the pattern that others have been describing - many adults participate in
programs over a series of "episodes" which often span multiple years (NRS
accounting periods).  When we've presented these data, we've suggested that
NRS will not capture all of the impact that programs have on learning in
part because of its short-term focus for measuring both participation and
outcomes.  I wonder if states could get waivers on a pilot basis to
experiment with longer reporting periods as David Rosen suggested.

 

-Steve Reder

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Dan Wann
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 6:47 AM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 756] Re: Using Data

 

I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic and ESL
students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track over a longer
period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the adult basic skills
network is that basic skills programs have little impact because students do
not stay long to make a difference.  Do we have any evidence that shows we
work with the same students more than one year and that we work with a high
enough number of students more than one year to make a significant
difference? 

 

 

Dan Wann

Professional Development Consultant 

IN Adult Education Professional Development Project 

 

dlwann at comcast.net  

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data

 

Larry, and others,

Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns like this
that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year, may not be the best
unit of time in which to measure learner gains, except for those who are
doing basic skills brush-up or who have very short-term goals like preparing
for a drivers license test. I wonder if there is a possibility that the NRS
might be adjusted, perhaps in a pilot at first, so that a longer period of
learning, say three years, might be used to demonstrate learner gains.  Of
course, there would need to be intermediate measures, but accountability --
for programs and states -- might be based on a longer period of time.  

It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure learning gains
or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher education, but rather
Congressional expectations for job skills training. Would you agree?

Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that track and
report learner outcomes over several years, and use the data for program
improvement.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote: 

Hi Luanne,

 

I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be
consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often the
last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the program
until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest posttesting
and retention rate.

 

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

 

-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

To:  <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov> <assessment at nifl.gov>
From: "Luanne Teller"  <mailto:lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
<lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data

Hi all: 

  

I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is the focus
of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of writing our
proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we speak! 

  

The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what most
people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard to
attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We believe;
however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture of what is
happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion, not decision
making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at additional sources
of data that we find essential in informing our planning---meetings with
staff, classes, our student advisory board, and focus groups. 

  

Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year analysis of
learner retention, and began to document why students did not persist.  We
found that the retention for students who enrolled after January 1 (our
programs runs on a school calendar year from September to June) was
significantly lower than the retention for students who began in September.
Even more compelling, we learned that the retention for students who began
after March 1 was 0%. 

  

We met with staff and students, and did some research around student
retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to pilot a "managed
enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor (MA DOE) allows us to
"over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20% more students in the
fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the overenrolled students into funded
slots.  This allows us to keep the seats filled even with the typical
attrition that occurs. 

  

In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students to the
higher level who are ready to progress..that typically leaves several
openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in February as a
cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation programs including a
requirement that new students observe a class before enrolling.  

  

While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will have a
positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the transition
seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager to look at the
data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness of this plan.  

  

As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to be a
unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect that the
lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for themselves
with employers is influencing their attendance and persistence.  This is an
issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms of policy.  Do we need to
have a more flexible, lenient policy for beginner students?  Is there a way
to support students in addressing these employment issues?  How can we
empower students more quickly?  Are there other issues for these beginner
level students that affect their participation?  As we enter these
discussions, the numbers will provide a basis for developing strategies, but
the students themselves with be our greatest source of valuable data. 

  

Luanne Teller 

  

Luanne Teller 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 

 
 
 

  _____  

 
 
 
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  

 

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From kolson2 at columbus.rr.com  Thu Apr 19 10:20:22 2007
From: kolson2 at columbus.rr.com (K Olson)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 10:20:22 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 759] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
References: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3CFC@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>
	<OF9585641A.B6F4718F-ON072572C1.0078F67F-072572C1.0078F681@yc.edu>
	<462706A3.1050605@comcast.net>
	<002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
Message-ID: <007001c7828d$de124f50$1b405f18@bessie>

Last year sometime, I remember hearing Ajit talk about how CT was tracking
students over a period of years. They had some very interesting information
about the percent of students who did and did not come back the second year.
I hope he will share it here. 

 

Kathy Olson

Training Specialist

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Dan Wann
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 9:47 AM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 756] Re: Using Data

 

I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic and ESL
students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track over a longer
period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the adult basic skills
network is that basic skills programs have little impact because students do
not stay long to make a difference.  Do we have any evidence that shows we
work with the same students more than one year and that we work with a high
enough number of students more than one year to make a significant
difference? 

 

 

Dan Wann

Professional Development Consultant 

IN Adult Education Professional Development Project 

 

dlwann at comcast.net  

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data

 

Larry, and others,

Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns like this
that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year, may not be the best
unit of time in which to measure learner gains, except for those who are
doing basic skills brush-up or who have very short-term goals like preparing
for a drivers license test. I wonder if there is a possibility that the NRS
might be adjusted, perhaps in a pilot at first, so that a longer period of
learning, say three years, might be used to demonstrate learner gains.  Of
course, there would need to be intermediate measures, but accountability --
for programs and states -- might be based on a longer period of time.  

It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure learning gains
or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher education, but rather
Congressional expectations for job skills training. Would you agree?

Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that track and
report learner outcomes over several years, and use the data for program
improvement.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote: 

Hi Luanne,

 

I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be
consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often the
last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the program
until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest posttesting
and retention rate.

 

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

 

-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

To:  <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov> <assessment at nifl.gov>
From: "Luanne Teller"  <mailto:lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
<lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data

Hi all: 

  

I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is the focus
of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of writing our
proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we speak! 

  

The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what most
people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard to
attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We believe;
however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture of what is
happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion, not decision
making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at additional sources
of data that we find essential in informing our planning---meetings with
staff, classes, our student advisory board, and focus groups. 

  

Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year analysis of
learner retention, and began to document why students did not persist.  We
found that the retention for students who enrolled after January 1 (our
programs runs on a school calendar year from September to June) was
significantly lower than the retention for students who began in September.
Even more compelling, we learned that the retention for students who began
after March 1 was 0%. 

  

We met with staff and students, and did some research around student
retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to pilot a "managed
enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor (MA DOE) allows us to
"over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20% more students in the
fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the overenrolled students into funded
slots.  This allows us to keep the seats filled even with the typical
attrition that occurs. 

  

In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students to the
higher level who are ready to progress..that typically leaves several
openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in February as a
cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation programs including a
requirement that new students observe a class before enrolling.  

  

While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will have a
positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the transition
seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager to look at the
data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness of this plan.  

  

As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to be a
unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect that the
lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for themselves
with employers is influencing their attendance and persistence.  This is an
issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms of policy.  Do we need to
have a more flexible, lenient policy for beginner students?  Is there a way
to support students in addressing these employment issues?  How can we
empower students more quickly?  Are there other issues for these beginner
level students that affect their participation?  As we enter these
discussions, the numbers will provide a basis for developing strategies, but
the students themselves with be our greatest source of valuable data. 

  

Luanne Teller 

  

Luanne Teller 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 

 
 
 

  _____  

 
 
 
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  

 

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From mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us  Thu Apr 19 11:16:36 2007
From: mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us (Mary Beheler)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 11:16:36 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 760] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
Message-ID: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMIEBNCEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>

Our oldest few:
Intake 1997 Grade level equivalent 2, now 11
Intake 1998 GLE K, now 7
Intake 1998 GLE 2, now 7
Intake 1998 GLE 3, now 11
Intake 2000 GLE K, now 4
And all of them have been "stop-out" students, with very uneven progress, at
times even going down on the CASAS scale. They tend not to improve as
quickly as NRS likes, but they do improve.
There is another set of students that need to continue coming just to keep
whatever skills they have. They can be really hard on NRS statistics!

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156
  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Dan Wann
  Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 9:47 AM
  To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
  Subject: [Assessment 756] Re: Using Data

  I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic and ESL
students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track over a longer
period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the adult basic skills
network is that basic skills programs have little impact because students do
not stay long to make a difference.  Do we have any evidence that shows we
work with the same students more than one year and that we work with a high
enough number of students more than one year to make a significant
difference?

  Dan Wann

  Professional Development Consultant

  IN Adult Education Professional Development Project

  dlwann at comcast.net

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
  Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
  To: The Assessment Discussion List
  Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data

  Larry, and others,

  Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns like
this that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year, may not be the
best unit of time in which to measure learner gains, except for those who
are doing basic skills brush-up or who have very short-term goals like
preparing for a drivers license test. I wonder if there is a possibility
that the NRS might be adjusted, perhaps in a pilot at first, so that a
longer period of learning, say three years, might be used to demonstrate
learner gains.  Of course, there would need to be intermediate measures, but
accountability -- for programs and states -- might be based on a longer
period of time.

  It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure learning
gains or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher education, but
rather Congressional expectations for job skills training. Would you agree?

  Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that track
and report learner outcomes over several years, and use the data for program
improvement.

  David J. Rosen
  djrosen at comcast.net

  Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote:

  Hi Luanne,

  I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be
consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often the
last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the program
until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest posttesting
and retention rate.

  Tina

  Tina Luffman
  Coordinator, Developmental Education
  Verde Valley Campus
  928-634-6544
  tina_luffman at yc.edu

  -----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

  To: <assessment at nifl.gov>
  From: "Luanne Teller" <lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
  Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
  Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
  Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data

  Hi all:

  I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is the
focus of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of writing our
proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we speak!

  The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what most
people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard to
attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We believe;
however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture of what is
happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion, not decision
making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at additional sources
of data that we find essential in informing our planning---meetings with
staff, classes, our student advisory board, and focus groups.

  Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year analysis
of learner retention, and began to document why students did not persist.
We found that the retention for students who enrolled after January 1 (our
programs runs on a school calendar year from September to June) was
significantly lower than the retention for students who began in September.
Even more compelling, we learned that the retention for students who began
after March 1 was 0%.

  We met with staff and students, and did some research around student
retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to pilot a "managed
enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor (MA DOE) allows us to
"over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20% more students in the
fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the overenrolled students into funded
slots.  This allows us to keep the seats filled even with the typical
attrition that occurs.

  In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students to the
higher level who are ready to progress..that typically leaves several
openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in February as a
cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation programs including a
requirement that new students observe a class before enrolling.

  While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will have a
positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the transition
seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager to look at the
data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness of this plan.

  As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to be a
unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect that the
lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for themselves
with employers is influencing their attendance and persistence.  This is an
issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms of policy.  Do we need to
have a more flexible, lenient policy for beginner students?  Is there a way
to support students in addressing these employment issues?  How can we
empower students more quickly?  Are there other issues for these beginner
level students that affect their participation?  As we enter these
discussions, the numbers will provide a basis for developing strategies, but
the students themselves with be our greatest source of valuable data.

  Luanne Teller

  Luanne Teller

  -------------------------------
  National Institute for Literacy
  Assessment mailing list
  Assessment at nifl.gov
  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

 -------------------------------National Institute for LiteracyAssessment
mailing listAssessment at nifl.govTo unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
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From kmundie at gplc.org  Thu Apr 19 11:51:01 2007
From: kmundie at gplc.org (Karen Mundie)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 11:51:01 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 761] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
References: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3CFC@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu><OF9585641A.B6F4718F-ON072572C1.0078F67F-072572C1.0078F681@yc.edu>
	<462706A3.1050605@comcast.net>
	<002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
Message-ID: <76CF5385-FB46-4FFF-8454-CE7808AC3131@gplc.org>

Dan, I know that's the perception, but I also know that we roll over  
about half of our students from one year to the next. . . and some of  
those students had rolled over the previous year as well. We've  
actually had to put a three year limit on some students (especially  
ESL).

I'm having our data person look this up as well as we can.  
Unfortunately, our data tends to be divided, as David indicated, in  
discrete yearly "lumps." We can get the information, but it's time- 
consuming because the data bases are designed for accountability over  
a contract year.

We certainly do have a lot of students who come in with short term  
goals and leave when these are accomplished. We also have a lot of  
stop out students, who have to put goals on the back burner while  
they work out other issues. I think, however, we do keep a  
significant number of students over time. I think for my own little  
research project, I'm going to investigate gains over multiple years.

Karen Mundie
Associate Director
Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
Pittsburgh, PA  15206
412 661-7323 (ext 101)
kmundie at gplc.org

GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007

This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees  
and is not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the  
intended recipient, please report the error to the originator and  
delete the contents.

On Apr 19, 2007, at 9:47 AM, Dan Wann wrote:

> I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic and  
> ESL students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track  
> over a longer period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of  
> the adult basic skills network is that basic skills programs have  
> little impact because students do not stay long to make a  
> difference.  Do we have any evidence that shows we work with the  
> same students more than one year and that we work with a high  
> enough number of students more than one year to make a significant  
> difference?
>
>
>
>
>
> Dan Wann
>
> Professional Development Consultant
>
> IN Adult Education Professional Development Project
>
>
>
> dlwann at comcast.net
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- 
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data
>
>
>
> Larry, and others,
>
> Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns  
> like this that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year,  
> may not be the best unit of time in which to measure learner gains,  
> except for those who are doing basic skills brush-up or who have  
> very short-term goals like preparing for a drivers license test. I  
> wonder if there is a possibility that the NRS might be adjusted,  
> perhaps in a pilot at first, so that a longer period of learning,  
> say three years, might be used to demonstrate learner gains.  Of  
> course, there would need to be intermediate measures, but  
> accountability -- for programs and states -- might be based on a  
> longer period of time.
>
> It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure  
> learning gains or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher  
> education, but rather Congressional expectations for job skills  
> training. Would you agree?
>
> Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that  
> track and report learner outcomes over several years, and use the  
> data for program improvement.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
> Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote:
>
> Hi Luanne,
>
>
>
> I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be  
> consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona.  
> Often the last group who enter in March are the least likely to  
> stay with the program until posttesting, and the August group seem  
> to have the highest posttesting and retention rate.
>
>
>
> Tina
>
>
>
>
>
> Tina Luffman
> Coordinator, Developmental Education
> Verde Valley Campus
> 928-634-6544
> tina_luffman at yc.edu
>
>
>
> -----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----
>
> To: <assessment at nifl.gov>
> From: "Luanne Teller" <lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
> Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
> Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data
>
>
>
> Hi all:
>
>
>
> I wanted to chime in about our program?s use of data since this is  
> the focus of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process  
> of writing our proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data  
> even as we speak!
>
>
>
> The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what  
> most people consider the ?hard data? -- the raw numbers with regard  
> to attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We  
> believe; however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete  
> picture of what is happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for  
> discussion, not decision making.  After analyzing the numbers, we  
> begin to look at additional sources of data that we find essential  
> in informing our planning---meetings with staff, classes, our  
> student advisory board, and focus groups.
>
>
>
> Here?s an example we?re currently working on---we did a two year  
> analysis of learner retention, and began to document why students  
> did not persist.  We found that the retention for students who  
> enrolled after January 1 (our programs runs on a school calendar  
> year from September to June) was significantly lower than the  
> retention for students who began in September.  Even more  
> compelling, we learned that the retention for students who began  
> after March 1 was 0%.
>
>
>
> We met with staff and students, and did some research around  
> student retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to  
> pilot a ?managed enrollment? approach.  In Massachusetts , our  
> grantor (MA DOE) allows us to ?over-enroll? our classes by 20%, so  
> we enroll 20% more students in the fall.  When students leave, we  
> ?drop? the overenrolled students into funded slots.  This allows us  
> to keep the seats filled even with the typical attrition that occurs.
>
>
>
> In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students  
> to the higher level who are ready to progress?.that typically  
> leaves several openings in the beginner levels and we begin  
> students in February as a cohort.  This year, we implemented new  
> orientation programs including a requirement that new students  
> observe a class before enrolling.
>
>
>
> While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will  
> have a positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that  
> the transition seems to be easier for some of these students.  We  
> are eager to look at the data at the end of the year to analyze the  
> effectiveness of this plan.
>
>
>
> As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to  
> be a unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We  
> suspect that the lack of effective English communication skills to  
> advocate for themselves with employers is influencing their  
> attendance and persistence.  This is an issue that we are beginning  
> to tackle in terms of policy.  Do we need to have a more flexible,  
> lenient policy for beginner students?  Is there a way to support  
> students in addressing these employment issues?  How can we empower  
> students more quickly?  Are there other issues for these beginner  
> level students that affect their participation?  As we enter these  
> discussions, the numbers will provide a basis for developing  
> strategies, but the students themselves with be our greatest source  
> of valuable data.
>
>
>
> Luanne Teller
>
>
>
> Luanne Teller
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net  Thu Apr 19 12:23:40 2007
From: bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net (Bonnie Odiorne)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 09:23:40 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 762] Re: Using Student Goals as Data
Message-ID: <852151.15917.qm@web83313.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

When a student comes to an adult ed program, it's usually "to learn English," or "to learn to read." It can take a lot of probing to elicit more specific reasons from students: Where/when do you need to speak English, or to speak it better, with whom? What do you do now? Is that working? So goal-setting can and should be an important part of an intake interview, and, as was mentioned, an ongoing component of a classroom situation to track progress and benchmarks, especially since students can plateau and take a long time to "progress." I like the question about whether specific goals are related to better retention, or the sense of community in the classsroom, extrinsic vs. intrinsic motivation, "tangible" progress etc. There would be lots of ways, perhaps, to obtain data on these elements.
Thanks for the discussion. I think it ranges far wider than just ESOL students to the differentiated classroom in general, as well as questions of attrition/retention, which, as has been pointed out, can be systemic, and not program-related at all, but to the multiple barriers adults face.
Bonnie Odiorne, Director, Writing Center, Post University

----- Original Message ----
From: Marie Cora <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 8:45:54 AM
Subject: [Assessment 753] Using Student Goals as Data

Hi everyone,
 
Wow, what a super discussion!  So rich and full of great ideas, interesting comments, excellent questions, and thoughtful challenges.  I usually contribute more myself but I?m just reading and soaking it in at this point.  I am cutting and pasting the discussion into a user-friendly document, which I will make available once our Guest Panel concludes tomorrow.  
 
We are really covering a lot of ground here!  Just curious (because it is a focus on mine within the realm of accountability):  a number of folks have discussed issues of retention and the types of strategies that they employ in their programming, but I don?t think that anyone has mentioned if they use student-stated goals to track retention, trends in learning or program offerings, etc.  Perhaps the use of student goals is more easily applicable at the classroom/teaching level (not sure!), but I just wanted to know if anyone out there makes programmatic decisions based in part on the reasons why students come to your programs.  I am not referring to learning gains (reading, writing, math, ESOL, etc), but rather to students? ultimate purposes for attending, like getting a better job, helping kids with homework, buying a home, becoming a citizen, etc. 
 
Thoughts on this?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
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From pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us  Thu Apr 19 12:24:50 2007
From: pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us (JO PAMMENT)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 12:24:50 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 763] Re: Using Student Goals as Data
In-Reply-To: <01da01c78280$abfa7090$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <01da01c78280$abfa7090$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <46275F920200009E0000E66D@10.1.0.15>

Hi, 
I've been following along.  Thank you all for the great comments.

We do ask for student goals on entry into the program but the goal is broad in order to meet the reporting needs to the State.  
However the teachers are asked to do a more specific student survey in the classroom at the beginning of the semester and  a
follow-up one at the end of the semester to learn the more specific goals of the students and whether they think their needs are met.  

Questions on the survey are simple and may be:  
Where do you want to use your English?
Name three places where you use English
Name three places where you need to use English.
Where are you afraid to speak English?

The teacher's can adjust the questions to meet their perceived classroom needs.  

There is also a Student Self-Evaluation where students rate their improvement on speaking, understanding, writing, reading, grammar, pronunciation and any other teaching focus areas .  They can say:  improved a lot, improved a little, did not improve, got worse and explain their comments.  They are also asked to rate questions  on a scale of 1 to 5, such as:  I come to class regularly.  I come to class on time.  I do my homework.  Homework helps me learn English.  I understand my teacher.  I understand my classmates when they speak to me.  I speak English in class.  I speak English outside of class.  I practice what I learn in class every day.  The final questions is:  My goal is to speak English 15, 30, 45, 60, 60+ minutes a day.

This self-evaluation helps the students to become more aware of their active role in learning English.  

Unfortunately this is all for the awareness of the teacher and the student which helps improve classroom teaching and learning, but can 't be reported as an assessment tool.

Jo Pamment

Jo Pamment
Director Adult Ed. ESL
Haslett Public Schools
1118 S. Harrison 
East Lansing, Michigan 48823

TEL:  517 337-8353
FAX:  517 337-3195
E-Mail:  pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us

>>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 4/19/2007 8:45 AM >>>
Hi everyone,
 
Wow, what a super discussion!  So rich and full of great ideas,
interesting comments, excellent questions, and thoughtful challenges.  I
usually contribute more myself but I'm just reading and soaking it in at
this point.  I am cutting and pasting the discussion into a
user-friendly document, which I will make available once our Guest Panel
concludes tomorrow.  
 
We are really covering a lot of ground here!  Just curious (because it
is a focus on mine within the realm of accountability):  a number of
folks have discussed issues of retention and the types of strategies
that they employ in their programming, but I don't think that anyone has
mentioned if they use student-stated goals to track retention, trends in
learning or program offerings, etc.  Perhaps the use of student goals is
more easily applicable at the classroom/teaching level (not sure!), but
I just wanted to know if anyone out there makes programmatic decisions
based in part on the reasons why students come to your programs.  I am
not referring to learning gains (reading, writing, math, ESOL, etc), but
rather to students' ultimate purposes for attending, like getting a
better job, helping kids with homework, buying a home, becoming a
citizen, etc. 
 
Thoughts on this?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

From Ajit.Gopalakrishnan at ct.gov  Thu Apr 19 12:46:14 2007
From: Ajit.Gopalakrishnan at ct.gov (Gopalakrishnan, Ajit)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 12:46:14 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 764] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
Message-ID: <281DD0D97E3EC94FB83030B1379CE426027D1C87@DOIT-EX302.exec.ds.state.ct.us>

Hi Dann, David, Kathy, and others,

 

I think that many states do have longitudinal data systems where a
single student identifier is used across providers and across fiscal
years. In those cases, states should be able to look at persistence and
success rates across multiple years. We have been studying this issue
for some months and find that the number (percent) of learners who
return to adult education in a future fiscal year is fewer than we had
expected. We are also beginning to notice that this return rate of
non-graduates varies significantly (between 35% and 65%) among the three
secondary completion options available in CT: the GED Preparation, the
Adult High School Credit Diploma Program and the National External
Diploma Program. Typically, the GED preparation reflects the lowest
return rates. We are now beginning to look at the success rates of those
students who persist for more than one fiscal year.

 

With regard to David's initial question about tracking learning gains
across fiscal years, in the adult education system, many learners begin
in January/February or even later in a fiscal year but are held to same
expectation of having to demonstrating a learning gain by June 30. These
learners have significantly less time within which to achieve that
learning gain as compared to those who started in the fall. As an
example, 42% of students who started ESL in Connecticut by October 2005
completed an NRS level by June 30, 2006 as compared to 33% among those
who started after October.

 

By contrast, the U.S. Department of Labor's implementation of NRS as
part of its Common Measures policy for out-of-school youth allows the
persistent learner, 12 months from the start date before being
considered in calculations relative to learning gains, even if that
12-month period spans two fiscal years.

 

Ajit

Ajit Gopalakrishnan 
Connecticut Department of Education 
25 Industrial Park Road 
Middletown, CT 06457 
Phone: (860) 807-2125 
Fax: (860) 807-2062 
Email: ajit.gopalakrishnan at ct.gov 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Dan Wann
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 9:47 AM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 756] Re: Using Data

 

I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic and ESL
students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track over a
longer period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the adult
basic skills network is that basic skills programs have little impact
because students do not stay long to make a difference.  Do we have any
evidence that shows we work with the same students more than one year
and that we work with a high enough number of students more than one
year to make a significant difference? 

 

 

Dan Wann

Professional Development Consultant 

IN Adult Education Professional Development Project 

 

dlwann at comcast.net  

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data

 

Larry, and others,

Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns like
this that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year, may not be
the best unit of time in which to measure learner gains, except for
those who are doing basic skills brush-up or who have very short-term
goals like preparing for a drivers license test. I wonder if there is a
possibility that the NRS might be adjusted, perhaps in a pilot at first,
so that a longer period of learning, say three years, might be used to
demonstrate learner gains.  Of course, there would need to be
intermediate measures, but accountability -- for programs and states --
might be based on a longer period of time.  

It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure learning
gains or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher education, but
rather Congressional expectations for job skills training. Would you
agree?

Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that track
and report learner outcomes over several years, and use the data for
program improvement.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote: 

Hi Luanne,

 

I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be
consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often
the last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the
program until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest
posttesting and retention rate.

 

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

 

-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

To: <assessment at nifl.gov> <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov> 
From: "Luanne Teller" <lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
<mailto:lteller at massasoit.mass.edu> 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data

Hi all: 

  

I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is the
focus of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of writing
our proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we speak! 

  

The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what most
people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard to
attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We believe;
however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture of what is
happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion, not decision
making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at additional
sources of data that we find essential in informing our
planning---meetings with staff, classes, our student advisory board, and
focus groups. 

  

Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year
analysis of learner retention, and began to document why students did
not persist.  We found that the retention for students who enrolled
after January 1 (our programs runs on a school calendar year from
September to June) was significantly lower than the retention for
students who began in September.  Even more compelling, we learned that
the retention for students who began after March 1 was 0%. 

  

We met with staff and students, and did some research around student
retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to pilot a
"managed enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor (MA DOE)
allows us to "over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20% more
students in the fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the overenrolled
students into funded slots.  This allows us to keep the seats filled
even with the typical attrition that occurs. 

  

In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students to
the higher level who are ready to progress....that typically leaves
several openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in
February as a cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation
programs including a requirement that new students observe a class
before enrolling.  

  

While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will have a
positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the
transition seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager
to look at the data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness
of this plan.  

  

As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to be a
unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect that
the lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for
themselves with employers is influencing their attendance and
persistence.  This is an issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms
of policy.  Do we need to have a more flexible, lenient policy for
beginner students?  Is there a way to support students in addressing
these employment issues?  How can we empower students more quickly?  Are
there other issues for these beginner level students that affect their
participation?  As we enter these discussions, the numbers will provide
a basis for developing strategies, but the students themselves with be
our greatest source of valuable data. 

  

Luanne Teller 

  

Luanne Teller 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 

 
 
 
 
 
 
 

________________________________

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  

 

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From pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us  Thu Apr 19 12:57:07 2007
From: pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us (JO PAMMENT)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 12:57:07 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 765]   Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
References: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3CFC@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu><OF9585641A.B6F4718F-ON072572C1.0078F67F-072572C1.0078F681@yc.edu>
	<462706A3.1050605@comcast.net>
	<002501c78289$382f8fc0$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>
Message-ID: <462767230200009E0000E685@10.1.0.15>

We have been fortunate with continuity of our students.  Our adult ESL program covers all NRS levels, and we have had many students who began in the literacy or low beginner level and progressed through the years through the low advanced level.  We are allowed to keep them if they show one EFL gain in 450 hours.  Although we try to get followup information, we don't always learn why every student leaves, but frequently we receive the information on students who leave our program  and go on to higher education programs.  Often these students work, but are able to schedule classes around their job times or vice versa.

Jo Pamment

Jo Pamment
Director Adult Ed. ESL
Haslett Public Schools
1118 S. Harrison 
East Lansing, Michigan 48823

TEL:  517 337-8353
FAX:  517 337-3195
E-Mail:  pammenjk at haslett.k12.mi.us

>>> "Dan Wann" <dlwann at comcast.net> 4/19/2007 9:47:06 AM >>>
I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic and ESL
students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track over a longer
period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the adult basic skills
network is that basic skills programs have little impact because students do
not stay long to make a difference.  Do we have any evidence that shows we
work with the same students more than one year and that we work with a high
enough number of students more than one year to make a significant
difference? 

 

 

Dan Wann

Professional Development Consultant 

IN Adult Education Professional Development Project 

 

dlwann at comcast.net  

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data

 

Larry, and others,

Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns like this
that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year, may not be the best
unit of time in which to measure learner gains, except for those who are
doing basic skills brush-up or who have very short-term goals like preparing
for a drivers license test. I wonder if there is a possibility that the NRS
might be adjusted, perhaps in a pilot at first, so that a longer period of
learning, say three years, might be used to demonstrate learner gains.  Of
course, there would need to be intermediate measures, but accountability --
for programs and states -- might be based on a longer period of time.  

It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure learning gains
or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher education, but rather
Congressional expectations for job skills training. Would you agree?

Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that track and
report learner outcomes over several years, and use the data for program
improvement.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net 

Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote: 

Hi Luanne,

 

I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be
consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often the
last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the program
until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest posttesting
and retention rate.

 

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

 

-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

To:  <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov> <assessment at nifl.gov>
From: "Luanne Teller"  <mailto:lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
<lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data

Hi all: 

  

I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is the focus
of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of writing our
proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we speak! 

  

The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what most
people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard to
attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We believe;
however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture of what is
happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion, not decision
making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at additional sources
of data that we find essential in informing our planning---meetings with
staff, classes, our student advisory board, and focus groups. 

  

Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year analysis of
learner retention, and began to document why students did not persist.  We
found that the retention for students who enrolled after January 1 (our
programs runs on a school calendar year from September to June) was
significantly lower than the retention for students who began in September.
Even more compelling, we learned that the retention for students who began
after March 1 was 0%. 

  

We met with staff and students, and did some research around student
retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to pilot a "managed
enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor (MA DOE) allows us to
"over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20% more students in the
fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the overenrolled students into funded
slots.  This allows us to keep the seats filled even with the typical
attrition that occurs. 

  

In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students to the
higher level who are ready to progress..that typically leaves several
openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in February as a
cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation programs including a
requirement that new students observe a class before enrolling.  

  

While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will have a
positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the transition
seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager to look at the
data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness of this plan.  

  

As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to be a
unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect that the
lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for themselves
with employers is influencing their attendance and persistence.  This is an
issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms of policy.  Do we need to
have a more flexible, lenient policy for beginner students?  Is there a way
to support students in addressing these employment issues?  How can we
empower students more quickly?  Are there other issues for these beginner
level students that affect their participation?  As we enter these
discussions, the numbers will provide a basis for developing strategies, but
the students themselves with be our greatest source of valuable data. 

  

Luanne Teller 

  

Luanne Teller 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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From barguedas at sfccnm.edu  Thu Apr 19 13:02:59 2007
From: barguedas at sfccnm.edu (Barbara Arguedas)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 11:02:59 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 766] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMIEBNCEAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>
Message-ID: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C3FA@ex01.sfcc.edu>

We too see this happening.  Just now we posted the official GED test
scores (passing!) for a student who started in June 2003 (65 hours) and
stopped out in July 2003.  She came back March 2004 and was in and out
through March 2005.  This March and April (2007!) she took and passed
all of the official GED tests.   So this is a success story!  BUT, we
get no credit as far as NRS is concerned because the student is not
enrolled this program year.   YES, we support efforts to report results
over multi-year periods.

Thanks.

Barbara Arguedas

Santa Fe Community College Adult Basic Education

 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Mary Beheler
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 9:17 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 760] Re: Using Data

 

Our oldest few:

Intake 1997 Grade level equivalent 2, now 11

Intake 1998 GLE K, now 7

Intake 1998 GLE 2, now 7

Intake 1998 GLE 3, now 11

Intake 2000 GLE K, now 4

And all of them have been "stop-out" students, with very uneven
progress, at times even going down on the CASAS scale. They tend not to
improve as quickly as NRS likes, but they do improve.

There is another set of students that need to continue coming just to
keep whatever skills they have. They can be really hard on NRS
statistics!

 

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156 

	-----Original Message-----
	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Dan Wann
	Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 9:47 AM
	To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
	Subject: [Assessment 756] Re: Using Data

	I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic
and ESL students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track
over a longer period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the
adult basic skills network is that basic skills programs have little
impact because students do not stay long to make a difference.  Do we
have any evidence that shows we work with the same students more than
one year and that we work with a high enough number of students more
than one year to make a significant difference? 

	 

	 

	Dan Wann

	Professional Development Consultant 

	IN Adult Education Professional Development Project 

	 

	dlwann at comcast.net  

	 

	
________________________________

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
	Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
	To: The Assessment Discussion List
	Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data

	 

	Larry, and others,
	
	Tina, and many other program administrators have observed
patterns like this that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding
year, may not be the best unit of time in which to measure learner
gains, except for those who are doing basic skills brush-up or who have
very short-term goals like preparing for a drivers license test. I
wonder if there is a possibility that the NRS might be adjusted, perhaps
in a pilot at first, so that a longer period of learning, say three
years, might be used to demonstrate learner gains.  Of course, there
would need to be intermediate measures, but accountability -- for
programs and states -- might be based on a longer period of time.  
	
	It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure
learning gains or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher
education, but rather Congressional expectations for job skills
training. Would you agree?
	
	Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs
that track and report learner outcomes over several years, and use the
data for program improvement.
	
	David J. Rosen
	djrosen at comcast.net
	
	
	Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote: 

	Hi Luanne,

	 

	I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to
be consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often
the last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the
program until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest
posttesting and retention rate.

	 

	Tina

	
	
	
	
	Tina Luffman
	Coordinator, Developmental Education
	Verde Valley Campus
	928-634-6544
	tina_luffman at yc.edu

	 

	-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

	To: <assessment at nifl.gov> <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov> 
	From: "Luanne Teller" <lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
<mailto:lteller at massasoit.mass.edu> 
	Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
	Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
	Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data
	
	

	Hi all: 

	  

	I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this
is the focus of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of
writing our proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we
speak! 

	  

	The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at
what most people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard
to attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We
believe; however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture
of what is happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion,
not decision making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at
additional sources of data that we find essential in informing our
planning---meetings with staff, classes, our student advisory board, and
focus groups. 

	  

	Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year
analysis of learner retention, and began to document why students did
not persist.  We found that the retention for students who enrolled
after January 1 (our programs runs on a school calendar year from
September to June) was significantly lower than the retention for
students who began in September.  Even more compelling, we learned that
the retention for students who began after March 1 was 0%. 

	  

	We met with staff and students, and did some research around
student retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to
pilot a "managed enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor
(MA DOE) allows us to "over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20%
more students in the fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the
overenrolled students into funded slots.  This allows us to keep the
seats filled even with the typical attrition that occurs. 

	  

	In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move
students to the higher level who are ready to progress....that typically
leaves several openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in
February as a cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation
programs including a requirement that new students observe a class
before enrolling.  

	  

	While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will
have a positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the
transition seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager
to look at the data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness
of this plan.  

	  

	As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem
to be a unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect
that the lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for
themselves with employers is influencing their attendance and
persistence.  This is an issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms
of policy.  Do we need to have a more flexible, lenient policy for
beginner students?  Is there a way to support students in addressing
these employment issues?  How can we empower students more quickly?  Are
there other issues for these beginner level students that affect their
participation?  As we enter these discussions, the numbers will provide
a basis for developing strategies, but the students themselves with be
our greatest source of valuable data. 

	  

	Luanne Teller 

	  

	Luanne Teller 

	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

	 

	 
	 
	 
	
	
	
________________________________

	 
	 
	 
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From Kate.Diggins at slc.k12.ut.us  Thu Apr 19 13:31:31 2007
From: Kate.Diggins at slc.k12.ut.us (Kate Diggins)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 11:31:31 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 767]  Teaching gains over more than one year
Message-ID: <46275313020000520000C096@slc.k12.ut.us>

I'd like to respond to David Rosen's question regarding programs which track student gains beyond the bounds of the fiscal year.  At my program, students stay for an average of 15 months, and they are permitted to stay for five years if they wish (and many of them do), so we track them from start to finish.  We are a small program, serving about 250 students a year, so we take a fairly low-tech approach.  After pretesting with BEST "Plus" and BEST Literacy, we plot their scores on line graphs (two separate graphs - one for each of the two tests) and continue to plot their scores for each subsequent test.  As time goes by, the lines representing a student's progress slope gradually upward across the pages. This is a graphic that the students can easily understand, and it enables us to see which skill areas require emphasis for individual students.  Having a complete picture of a student's testing history also allows us to show students that an occasional disappointing test score may be an aberration from a generally upward trend.

Kate Diggins
Director of Adult Education
Guadalupe Schools
(801) 531-6100 (x-1107)

From LCondelli at air.org  Thu Apr 19 14:15:51 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 14:15:51 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 768] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <76CF5385-FB46-4FFF-8454-CE7808AC3131@gplc.org>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530996@dc1ex03.air.org>

Dan, Karen, Steve and David,
 
You all have raised the issue of changing the NRS reporting period from
one year to multiple years.  While this is off the topic of using data,
I will give a quick response.
 
First, the mandate is to have an annual reporting system so some
information is required each year top report to Congress.  Beyond this,
this topic has come up and been considered multiple times and there is
some flexibility with ED to make some changes to the reporting period,
if there is a compelling reason that can be demonstrated.  Our analyses
of several states' data (not NRS reported data but individual student
data from over several years), however, including some very large
states, is that there are proportionally very few students who continue
year to year (on the order of 5 percent or less in some states) and it
does not appear at this time that it would make a difference in
performance data at the national level, as Dan Wann suggested.
 
NRS is a national system so with some local programs (such as Karen's)
or other states, there may be large numbers of students who continue
year to year and in those instances it might be advisable to look at and
report multi-year data.  To bring us back to our topic of using data,
this would be a good analysis a state or local program to pursue-- to
look at returning and continuing students and see how they differ in
outcomes and other factors from students who stay a short time.  We also
can rely on research, such as Steve Reder's study to look at long-term
relationships, which if compelling, could result in a change to the
reporting period in the future.  
 
________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Karen Mundie
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 11:51 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 761] Re: Using Data

Dan, I know that's the perception, but I also know that we roll over
about half of our students from one year to the next. . . and some of
those students had rolled over the previous year as well. We've actually
had to put a three year limit on some students (especially ESL). 

I'm having our data person look this up as well as we can.
Unfortunately, our data tends to be divided, as David indicated, in
discrete yearly "lumps." We can get the information, but it's
time-consuming because the data bases are designed for accountability
over a contract year.  

We certainly do have a lot of students who come in with short term goals
and leave when these are accomplished. We also have a lot of stop out
students, who have to put goals on the back burner while they work out
other issues. I think, however, we do keep a significant number of
students over time. I think for my own little research project, I'm
going to investigate gains over multiple years. 

Karen Mundie
Associate Director
Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
Pittsburgh, PA  15206
412 661-7323 (ext 101)
kmundie at gplc.org

GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007

This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees and
is not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the intended
recipient, please report the error to the originator and delete the
contents.

On Apr 19, 2007, at 9:47 AM, Dan Wann wrote:

	I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic
and ESL students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track
over a longer period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the
adult basic skills network is that basic skills programs have little
impact because students do not stay long to make a difference.  Do we
have any evidence that shows we work with the same students more than
one year and that we work with a high enough number of students more
than one year to make a significant difference? 

	

	

	Dan Wann

	Professional Development Consultant 

	IN Adult Education Professional Development Project 

	

	dlwann at comcast.net  

	

	
________________________________

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
	Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
	To: The Assessment Discussion List
	Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data

	

	Larry, and others,
	
	Tina, and many other program administrators have observed
patterns like this that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding
year, may not be the best unit of time in which to measure learner
gains, except for those who are doing basic skills brush-up or who have
very short-term goals like preparing for a drivers license test. I
wonder if there is a possibility that the NRS might be adjusted, perhaps
in a pilot at first, so that a longer period of learning, say three
years, might be used to demonstrate learner gains.  Of course, there
would need to be intermediate measures, but accountability -- for
programs and states -- might be based on a longer period of time.  
	
	It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure
learning gains or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher
education, but rather Congressional expectations for job skills
training. Would you agree?
	
	Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs
that track and report learner outcomes over several years, and use the
data for program improvement.
	
	David J. Rosen
	djrosen at comcast.net
	
	
	Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote: 

	Hi Luanne,

	

	I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to
be consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often
the last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the
program until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest
posttesting and retention rate.

	

	Tina

	
	
	
	
	Tina Luffman
	Coordinator, Developmental Education
	Verde Valley Campus
	928-634-6544
	tina_luffman at yc.edu

	

	-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

	To: <assessment at nifl.gov> <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov> 
	From: "Luanne Teller" <lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
<mailto:lteller at massasoit.mass.edu> 
	Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
	Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
	Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data
	
	
	

	Hi all: 

	  

	I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this
is the focus of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of
writing our proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we
speak! 

	  

	The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at
what most people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard
to attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We
believe; however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture
of what is happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion,
not decision making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at
additional sources of data that we find essential in informing our
planning---meetings with staff, classes, our student advisory board, and
focus groups. 

	  

	Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year
analysis of learner retention, and began to document why students did
not persist.  We found that the retention for students who enrolled
after January 1 (our programs runs on a school calendar year from
September to June) was significantly lower than the retention for
students who began in September.  Even more compelling, we learned that
the retention for students who began after March 1 was 0%. 

	  

	We met with staff and students, and did some research around
student retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to
pilot a "managed enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor
(MA DOE) allows us to "over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20%
more students in the fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the
overenrolled students into funded slots.  This allows us to keep the
seats filled even with the typical attrition that occurs. 

	  

	In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move
students to the higher level who are ready to progress....that typically
leaves several openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in
February as a cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation
programs including a requirement that new students observe a class
before enrolling.  

	  

	While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will
have a positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the
transition seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager
to look at the data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness
of this plan.  

	  

	As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem
to be a unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect
that the lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for
themselves with employers is influencing their attendance and
persistence.  This is an issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms
of policy.  Do we need to have a more flexible, lenient policy for
beginner students?  Is there a way to support students in addressing
these employment issues?  How can we empower students more quickly?  Are
there other issues for these beginner level students that affect their
participation?  As we enter these discussions, the numbers will provide
a basis for developing strategies, but the students themselves with be
our greatest source of valuable data. 

	  

	Luanne Teller 

	  

	Luanne Teller 

	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

	

	 
	
________________________________

	 
	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	  

	

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From LCondelli at air.org  Thu Apr 19 14:26:00 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 14:26:00 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 769] Re: Teaching gains over more than one year
In-Reply-To: <46275313020000520000C096@slc.k12.ut.us>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530999@dc1ex03.air.org>

Kate,

This is a good example of the type of analyses I suggested in my
previous post on this topic.  Thanks, Kate! 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Kate Diggins
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 1:32 PM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 767] Teaching gains over more than one year

I'd like to respond to David Rosen's question regarding programs which
track student gains beyond the bounds of the fiscal year.  At my
program, students stay for an average of 15 months, and they are
permitted to stay for five years if they wish (and many of them do), so
we track them from start to finish.  We are a small program, serving
about 250 students a year, so we take a fairly low-tech approach.  After
pretesting with BEST "Plus" and BEST Literacy, we plot their scores on
line graphs (two separate graphs - one for each of the two tests) and
continue to plot their scores for each subsequent test.  As time goes
by, the lines representing a student's progress slope gradually upward
across the pages. This is a graphic that the students can easily
understand, and it enables us to see which skill areas require emphasis
for individual students.  Having a complete picture of a student's
testing history also allows us to show students that an occasional
disappointing test sco  re may be an aberration from a generally upward
trend.

Kate Diggins
Director of Adult Education
Guadalupe Schools
(801) 531-6100 (x-1107)
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From dcornellier at doe.mass.edu  Thu Apr 19 15:06:46 2007
From: dcornellier at doe.mass.edu (Cornellier, Donna)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 15:06:46 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 770] Re: Using Student Goals as Data
Message-ID: <8ADDCB4F87E49F47B163BCD04B6D6EA1014597A5@exchange1.doe.mass.edu>

Hi,

In Massachusetts we just developed a goals cube in Cognos, our third party
reporting tool. This cube allows teachers/directors to look at class level
data as well as site level data so teachers can review the goals set by
their students and incorporate the goals into the curriculum. Teachers have
requested this information to help them better meet the needs of their
students. 

Donna Cornellier

-----Original Message-----
From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com] 
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 8:46 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 753] Using Student Goals as Data

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
  So rich and full of great ideas,
interesting comments, excellent questions, and thoughtful challenges.  I
usually contribute more myself but I'm just reading and soaking it in at
this point.  I am cutting and pasting the discussion into a user-friendly
document, which I will make available once our Guest Panel concludes
tomorrow.  
 
We are really covering a lot of ground here!  Just curious (because it is a
focus on mine within the realm of accountability):  a number of folks have
discussed issues of retention and the types of strategies that they employ
in their programming, but I don't think that anyone has mentioned if they
use student-stated goals to track retention, trends in learning or program
offerings, etc.  Perhaps the use of student goals is more easily applicable
at the classroom/teaching level (not sure!), but I just wanted to know if
anyone out there makes programmatic decisions based in part on the reasons
why students come to your programs.  I am not referring to learning gains
(reading, writing, math, ESOL, etc), but rather to students' ultimate
purposes for attending, like getting a better job, helping kids with
homework, buying a home, becoming a citizen, etc. 
 
Thoughts on this?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com NIFL
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 

From reders at pdx.edu  Thu Apr 19 16:53:35 2007
From: reders at pdx.edu (Steve Reder)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 13:53:35 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 771] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530996@dc1ex03.air.org>
References: <76CF5385-FB46-4FFF-8454-CE7808AC3131@gplc.org>
	<E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530996@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <001201c782c4$ccb01080$5074fc83@PSU.DS.PDX.EDU>

Thanks for those points, Larry.  Besides giving us a broader view of more
complex patterns of participation, multi-year data frames will probably do a
better job at revealing program impacts on longer term outcomes such as
postsecondary education and employment  It's good to hear that there may be
flexibility within ED for experimentation such as this.  

-Steve Reder

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 11:16 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 768] Re: Using Data

 

Dan, Karen, Steve and David,

 

You all have raised the issue of changing the NRS reporting period from one
year to multiple years.  While this is off the topic of using data, I will
give a quick response.

 

First, the mandate is to have an annual reporting system so some information
is required each year top report to Congress.  Beyond this, this topic has
come up and been considered multiple times and there is some flexibility
with ED to make some changes to the reporting period, if there is a
compelling reason that can be demonstrated.  Our analyses of several states'
data (not NRS reported data but individual student data from over several
years), however, including some very large states, is that there are
proportionally very few students who continue year to year (on the order of
5 percent or less in some states) and it does not appear at this time that
it would make a difference in performance data at the national level, as Dan
Wann suggested.

 

NRS is a national system so with some local programs (such as Karen's) or
other states, there may be large numbers of students who continue year to
year and in those instances it might be advisable to look at and report
multi-year data.  To bring us back to our topic of using data, this would be
a good analysis a state or local program to pursue-- to look at returning
and continuing students and see how they differ in outcomes and other
factors from students who stay a short time.  We also can rely on research,
such as Steve Reder's study to look at long-term relationships, which if
compelling, could result in a change to the reporting period in the future.

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Karen Mundie
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 11:51 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 761] Re: Using Data

Dan, I know that's the perception, but I also know that we roll over about
half of our students from one year to the next. . . and some of those
students had rolled over the previous year as well. We've actually had to
put a three year limit on some students (especially ESL). 

 

I'm having our data person look this up as well as we can. Unfortunately,
our data tends to be divided, as David indicated, in discrete yearly
"lumps." We can get the information, but it's time-consuming because the
data bases are designed for accountability over a contract year.  

 

We certainly do have a lot of students who come in with short term goals and
leave when these are accomplished. We also have a lot of stop out students,
who have to put goals on the back burner while they work out other issues. I
think, however, we do keep a significant number of students over time. I
think for my own little research project, I'm going to investigate gains
over multiple years. 

 

 

 

Karen Mundie

Associate Director

Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council

100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor

Pittsburgh, PA  15206

412 661-7323 (ext 101)

kmundie at gplc.org

 

GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007

 

 

This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees and is
not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the intended recipient,
please report the error to the originator and delete the contents.

 

On Apr 19, 2007, at 9:47 AM, Dan Wann wrote:

I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic and ESL
students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track over a longer
period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the adult basic skills
network is that basic skills programs have little impact because students do
not stay long to make a difference.  Do we have any evidence that shows we
work with the same students more than one year and that we work with a high
enough number of students more than one year to make a significant
difference? 

Dan Wann

Professional Development Consultant 

IN Adult Education Professional Development Project 

dlwann at comcast.net  

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data

Larry, and others,

Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns like this
that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year, may not be the best
unit of time in which to measure learner gains, except for those who are
doing basic skills brush-up or who have very short-term goals like preparing
for a drivers license test. I wonder if there is a possibility that the NRS
might be adjusted, perhaps in a pilot at first, so that a longer period of
learning, say three years, might be used to demonstrate learner gains.  Of
course, there would need to be intermediate measures, but accountability --
for programs and states -- might be based on a longer period of time.  

It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure learning gains
or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher education, but rather
Congressional expectations for job skills training. Would you agree?

Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that track and
report learner outcomes over several years, and use the data for program
improvement.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote: 

Hi Luanne,

I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be
consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often the
last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the program
until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest posttesting
and retention rate.

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

To:  <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov> <assessment at nifl.gov>
From: "Luanne Teller"  <mailto:lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
<lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data

Hi all: 

  

I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is the focus
of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of writing our
proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we speak! 

  

The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what most
people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard to
attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We believe;
however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture of what is
happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion, not decision
making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at additional sources
of data that we find essential in informing our planning---meetings with
staff, classes, our student advisory board, and focus groups. 

  

Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year analysis of
learner retention, and began to document why students did not persist.  We
found that the retention for students who enrolled after January 1 (our
programs runs on a school calendar year from September to June) was
significantly lower than the retention for students who began in September.
Even more compelling, we learned that the retention for students who began
after March 1 was 0%. 

  

We met with staff and students, and did some research around student
retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to pilot a "managed
enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor (MA DOE) allows us to
"over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20% more students in the
fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the overenrolled students into funded
slots.  This allows us to keep the seats filled even with the typical
attrition that occurs. 

  

In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students to the
higher level who are ready to progress..that typically leaves several
openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in February as a
cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation programs including a
requirement that new students observe a class before enrolling.  

  

While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will have a
positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the transition
seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager to look at the
data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness of this plan.  

  

As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to be a
unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect that the
lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for themselves
with employers is influencing their attendance and persistence.  This is an
issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms of policy.  Do we need to
have a more flexible, lenient policy for beginner students?  Is there a way
to support students in addressing these employment issues?  How can we
empower students more quickly?  Are there other issues for these beginner
level students that affect their participation?  As we enter these
discussions, the numbers will provide a basis for developing strategies, but
the students themselves with be our greatest source of valuable data. 

  

Luanne Teller 

  

Luanne Teller 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
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To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 

  _____  

 
 
 
-------------------------------
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Assessment mailing list
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To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  

-------------------------------

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From barguedas at sfccnm.edu  Thu Apr 19 17:11:12 2007
From: barguedas at sfccnm.edu (Barbara Arguedas)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 15:11:12 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 772] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <000001c7828d$7b4e09e0$5074fc83@PSU.DS.PDX.EDU>
Message-ID: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C3FE@ex01.sfcc.edu>

We are getting some good ideas from this discussion. We wonder if there
is a way to learn from high performing states.  Who are they?  What do
they do in terms of using data?  Have some states discovered the data
that makes a difference in their final NRS reports?  What are the
factors that truly impact the final data?

 

Maybe we don't have to reinvent.  Thanks.

 

Barbara Arguedas

Santa Fe Community College ABE

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From rosemarym at lacnyc.org  Thu Apr 19 17:24:20 2007
From: rosemarym at lacnyc.org (Rosemary Matt)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 17:24:20 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 773] Re: Using Student Goals as Data
References: <8ADDCB4F87E49F47B163BCD04B6D6EA1014597A5@exchange1.doe.mass.edu>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92EB@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

Sorry I haven't jumped back into the discussion sooner.  My data responsibilities brought me away from my office many more hours than I had expected this week.

 

A few posts ago, Luanne spoke to her concerns with retention particularly as students entered at the later portion of the fiscal year.  Luanne, you mention a student retention rate of 0% for those entering after March 1st, I am curious, what is your benchmark beyond which you expect students to remain in programming.  Is there an hour allocation or are you basing your calculations on a completion of the session only?

 

Also, I wondered if Massachusetts employed any distance learning for students leaving a program for employment.  Larry, I am sure you have heard New York voice our concern previously regarding our data indicating what appears to be a disincentive for programs encourage students to enter employment as that often results in the student leaving the literacy program prematurely and not showing educational gain.  Have other state's data shown this trend?  

 
Rosemary I. Matt
NRS Liaison for NYS
Literacy Assistance Center
12 Meadowbrook Drive
New Hartford, NY 13413
315.798.1026

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Cornellier, Donna
Sent: Thu 4/19/2007 3:06 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 770] Re: Using Student Goals as Data

Hi,

In Massachusetts we just developed a goals cube in Cognos, our third party
reporting tool. This cube allows teachers/directors to look at class level
data as well as site level data so teachers can review the goals set by
their students and incorporate the goals into the curriculum. Teachers have
requested this information to help them better meet the needs of their
students.

Donna Cornellier

-----Original Message-----
From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 8:46 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 753] Using Student Goals as Data

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
  So rich and full of great ideas,
interesting comments, excellent questions, and thoughtful challenges.  I
usually contribute more myself but I'm just reading and soaking it in at
this point.  I am cutting and pasting the discussion into a user-friendly
document, which I will make available once our Guest Panel concludes
tomorrow. 

We are really covering a lot of ground here!  Just curious (because it is a
focus on mine within the realm of accountability):  a number of folks have
discussed issues of retention and the types of strategies that they employ
in their programming, but I don't think that anyone has mentioned if they
use student-stated goals to track retention, trends in learning or program
offerings, etc.  Perhaps the use of student goals is more easily applicable
at the classroom/teaching level (not sure!), but I just wanted to know if
anyone out there makes programmatic decisions based in part on the reasons
why students come to your programs.  I am not referring to learning gains
(reading, writing, math, ESOL, etc), but rather to students' ultimate
purposes for attending, like getting a better job, helping kids with
homework, buying a home, becoming a citizen, etc.

Thoughts on this?

Thanks!

Marie

Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com NIFL
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From KHinson at almanid.com  Thu Apr 19 19:14:07 2007
From: KHinson at almanid.com (Katrina Hinson)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 01:14:07 +0200
Subject: [Assessment 774] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
Message-ID: <4627BF87.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>

I don't know if anyone has raised this question but one of the things I
know myself and the testing coordinator at my school are concerned with
is the fact that we don't get to count gains made if a person goes from
the M level TABE to the D level TABE. We use versions 9 and 10.  I had a
student who scored around 9.0 or so on the M level Reading which we
question in and of itself in terms of validity. He's at the point where
we're supposed to retest him. He'd tested on the D level in math the
first time and he's been regularly attending and regulary working on his
goals. He went from the 9.0 on the M level test which is moderately hard
in reading to a 7.7 on the D level test which is difficult. Because he
DROPPED in terms of grade level, it's not counted as a level
completion...even though he actually went from M to D...which one would
think would also qualify as a level.

Has anyone else had this happen and if so, what are your suggestions.

Regards,
Katrina Hinson

From andreawilder at comcast.net  Thu Apr 19 19:54:17 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 19:54:17 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 775] Re: Teaching gains over more than one year
In-Reply-To: <46275313020000520000C096@slc.k12.ut.us>
References: <46275313020000520000C096@slc.k12.ut.us>
Message-ID: <6b69675cbf38348974939f05e17bf252@comcast.net>

Kate--

How do you account for the long retention rate?  Other programs report 
this as a difficulty.

Thanks.

Andrea

On Apr 19, 2007, at 1:31 PM, Kate Diggins wrote:

> I'd like to respond to David Rosen's question regarding programs which 
> track student gains beyond the bounds of the fiscal year.  At my 
> program, students stay for an average of 15 months, and they are 
> permitted to stay for five years if they wish (and many of them do), 
> so we track them from start to finish.  We are a small program, 
> serving about 250 students a year, so we take a fairly low-tech 
> approach.  After pretesting with BEST "Plus" and BEST Literacy, we 
> plot their scores on line graphs (two separate graphs - one for each 
> of the two tests) and continue to plot their scores for each 
> subsequent test.  As time goes by, the lines representing a student's 
> progress slope gradually upward across the pages. This is a graphic 
> that the students can easily understand, and it enables us to see 
> which skill areas require emphasis for individual students.  Having a 
> complete picture of a student's testing history also allows us to show 
> students that an occasional disappointing test sco
>  re may be an aberration from a generally upward trend.
>
> Kate Diggins
> Director of Adult Education
> Guadalupe Schools
> (801) 531-6100 (x-1107)
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>

From lteller at massasoit.mass.edu  Thu Apr 19 21:16:12 2007
From: lteller at massasoit.mass.edu (Luanne Teller)
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2007 21:16:12 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 775] Re: Using Student Goals as Data
References: <8ADDCB4F87E49F47B163BCD04B6D6EA1014597A5@exchange1.doe.mass.edu>
	<6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92EB@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
Message-ID: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E0682046A832C@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>

Good questions....
For us, it's sometimes a questions of poor attendance, and then we have to get to the heart of the problem.  More often however, when it came to late-year enrollment, students simply stopped attending at all.
 
It was extremely difficult to get feedback of any kind from these students, so we had to piece together bits of information we could gather from students, teachers, and other students in the program who were friendly with the departing students.
 
Our classes end in June, and begin again in September.  I reviewed all the data for the year for students who left and never returned; I didn't specifically set March 1 as a cut point---it revealed itself to be significant upon review of the dates when students enrolled and then left.  
 
When compiling the data into charts, it became apparent that any enrollment after the first half of the year was compromised; but all enrollments after March 1 were not succesfully retained.
 
We are just beginning to work with one of my programs on distance learning as a supplement to classroom instruction...so new that I have no idea where it's going!
 
Hope this clarifies...Luanne

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Rosemary Matt
Sent: Thu 4/19/2007 5:24 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 773] Re: Using Student Goals as Data

Sorry I haven't jumped back into the discussion sooner.  My data responsibilities brought me away from my office many more hours than I had expected this week.

 

A few posts ago, Luanne spoke to her concerns with retention particularly as students entered at the later portion of the fiscal year.  Luanne, you mention a student retention rate of 0% for those entering after March 1st, I am curious, what is your benchmark beyond which you expect students to remain in programming.  Is there an hour allocation or are you basing your calculations on a completion of the session only?

 

Also, I wondered if Massachusetts employed any distance learning for students leaving a program for employment.  Larry, I am sure you have heard New York voice our concern previously regarding our data indicating what appears to be a disincentive for programs encourage students to enter employment as that often results in the student leaving the literacy program prematurely and not showing educational gain.  Have other state's data shown this trend?  

 
Rosemary I. Matt
NRS Liaison for NYS
Literacy Assistance Center
12 Meadowbrook Drive
New Hartford, NY 13413
315.798.1026

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Cornellier, Donna
Sent: Thu 4/19/2007 3:06 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 770] Re: Using Student Goals as Data

Hi,

In Massachusetts we just developed a goals cube in Cognos, our third party
reporting tool. This cube allows teachers/directors to look at class level
data as well as site level data so teachers can review the goals set by
their students and incorporate the goals into the curriculum. Teachers have
requested this information to help them better meet the needs of their
students.

Donna Cornellier

-----Original Message-----
From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 8:46 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 753] Using Student Goals as Data

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
  So rich and full of great ideas,
interesting comments, excellent questions, and thoughtful challenges.  I
usually contribute more myself but I'm just reading and soaking it in at
this point.  I am cutting and pasting the discussion into a user-friendly
document, which I will make available once our Guest Panel concludes
tomorrow. 

We are really covering a lot of ground here!  Just curious (because it is a
focus on mine within the realm of accountability):  a number of folks have
discussed issues of retention and the types of strategies that they employ
in their programming, but I don't think that anyone has mentioned if they
use student-stated goals to track retention, trends in learning or program
offerings, etc.  Perhaps the use of student goals is more easily applicable
at the classroom/teaching level (not sure!), but I just wanted to know if
anyone out there makes programmatic decisions based in part on the reasons
why students come to your programs.  I am not referring to learning gains
(reading, writing, math, ESOL, etc), but rather to students' ultimate
purposes for attending, like getting a better job, helping kids with
homework, buying a home, becoming a citizen, etc.

Thoughts on this?

Thanks!

Marie

Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com NIFL
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From crandall at umbc.edu  Fri Apr 20 03:54:17 2007
From: crandall at umbc.edu (JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 03:54:17 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Assessment 776] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <001201c782c4$ccb01080$5074fc83@PSU.DS.PDX.EDU>
References: <76CF5385-FB46-4FFF-8454-CE7808AC3131@gplc.org>
	<E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2530996@dc1ex03.air.org>
	<001201c782c4$ccb01080$5074fc83@PSU.DS.PDX.EDU>
Message-ID: <32510.210.229.158.10.1177055657.squirrel@webmail.umbc.edu>

Larry and Steve,

I agree.  There are important gains that are missed when one only looks at
data within a year.  Longitudinal data would give us a much better view of
participant progress, both for those programs in which a significant
number of adults continue more than one term, as well as those in which
participants stop out and return.

Jodi Crandall

> Thanks for those points, Larry.  Besides giving us a broader view of more
> complex patterns of participation, multi-year data frames will probably do
> a
> better job at revealing program impacts on longer term outcomes such as
> postsecondary education and employment  It's good to hear that there may
> be
> flexibility within ED for experimentation such as this.
>
> -Steve Reder
>
>
>
>   _____
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
> Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 11:16 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 768] Re: Using Data
>
>
>
> Dan, Karen, Steve and David,
>
>
>
> You all have raised the issue of changing the NRS reporting period from
> one
> year to multiple years.  While this is off the topic of using data, I will
> give a quick response.
>
>
>
> First, the mandate is to have an annual reporting system so some
> information
> is required each year top report to Congress.  Beyond this, this topic has
> come up and been considered multiple times and there is some flexibility
> with ED to make some changes to the reporting period, if there is a
> compelling reason that can be demonstrated.  Our analyses of several
> states'
> data (not NRS reported data but individual student data from over several
> years), however, including some very large states, is that there are
> proportionally very few students who continue year to year (on the order
> of
> 5 percent or less in some states) and it does not appear at this time that
> it would make a difference in performance data at the national level, as
> Dan
> Wann suggested.
>
>
>
> NRS is a national system so with some local programs (such as Karen's) or
> other states, there may be large numbers of students who continue year to
> year and in those instances it might be advisable to look at and report
> multi-year data.  To bring us back to our topic of using data, this would
> be
> a good analysis a state or local program to pursue-- to look at returning
> and continuing students and see how they differ in outcomes and other
> factors from students who stay a short time.  We also can rely on
> research,
> such as Steve Reder's study to look at long-term relationships, which if
> compelling, could result in a change to the reporting period in the
> future.
>
>
>
>
>   _____
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
> Behalf Of Karen Mundie
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 11:51 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 761] Re: Using Data
>
> Dan, I know that's the perception, but I also know that we roll over about
> half of our students from one year to the next. . . and some of those
> students had rolled over the previous year as well. We've actually had to
> put a three year limit on some students (especially ESL).
>
>
>
> I'm having our data person look this up as well as we can. Unfortunately,
> our data tends to be divided, as David indicated, in discrete yearly
> "lumps." We can get the information, but it's time-consuming because the
> data bases are designed for accountability over a contract year.
>
>
>
> We certainly do have a lot of students who come in with short term goals
> and
> leave when these are accomplished. We also have a lot of stop out
> students,
> who have to put goals on the back burner while they work out other issues.
> I
> think, however, we do keep a significant number of students over time. I
> think for my own little research project, I'm going to investigate gains
> over multiple years.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Karen Mundie
>
> Associate Director
>
> Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
>
> 100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
>
> Pittsburgh, PA  15206
>
> 412 661-7323 (ext 101)
>
> kmundie at gplc.org
>
>
>
> GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007
>
>
>
>
>
> This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees and is
> not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the intended
> recipient,
> please report the error to the originator and delete the contents.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Apr 19, 2007, at 9:47 AM, Dan Wann wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> I wonder if there is enough data to even show that adult basic and ESL
> students stay with a program in large enough numbers to track over a
> longer
> period?   The conventional wisdom of those outside of the adult basic
> skills
> network is that basic skills programs have little impact because students
> do
> not stay long to make a difference.  Do we have any evidence that shows we
> work with the same students more than one year and that we work with a
> high
> enough number of students more than one year to make a significant
> difference?
>
> Dan Wann
>
> Professional Development Consultant
>
> IN Adult Education Professional Development Project
>
> dlwann at comcast.net
>
>   _____
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
> Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 2:05 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 752] Re: Using Data
>
> Larry, and others,
>
> Tina, and many other program administrators have observed patterns like
> this
> that suggest that a one-year time frame, a funding year, may not be the
> best
> unit of time in which to measure learner gains, except for those who are
> doing basic skills brush-up or who have very short-term goals like
> preparing
> for a drivers license test. I wonder if there is a possibility that the
> NRS
> might be adjusted, perhaps in a pilot at first, so that a longer period of
> learning, say three years, might be used to demonstrate learner gains.  Of
> course, there would need to be intermediate measures, but accountability
> --
> for programs and states -- might be based on a longer period of time.
>
> It seems to me that the one-year time frame within to measure learning
> gains
> or goals accomplished comes not from K-12 or higher education, but rather
> Congressional expectations for job skills training. Would you agree?
>
> Also I wonder if you or others have some examples of programs that track
> and
> report learner outcomes over several years, and use the data for program
> improvement.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
> Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote:
>
> Hi Luanne,
>
> I find it interesting that what you are finding in data seems to be
> consistent with what we see in our GED classes here in Arizona. Often the
> last group who enter in March are the least likely to stay with the
> program
> until posttesting, and the August group seem to have the highest
> posttesting
> and retention rate.
>
> Tina
>
>
>
>
>
> Tina Luffman
> Coordinator, Developmental Education
> Verde Valley Campus
> 928-634-6544
> tina_luffman at yc.edu
>
> -----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----
>
> To:  <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov> <assessment at nifl.gov>
> From: "Luanne Teller"  <mailto:lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
> <lteller at massasoit.mass.edu>
> Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> Date: 04/18/2007 10:56AM
> Subject: [Assessment 746] Using Data
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi all:
>
>
>
> I wanted to chime in about our program's use of data since this is the
> focus
> of our discussion.  Coincidentally, I am in the process of writing our
> proposal for next year, so I am knee-deep in data even as we speak!
>
>
>
> The use of data takes many forms in our program.  We look at what most
> people consider the "hard data" -- the raw numbers with regard to
> attendance, learner gains, retention, goal attainment, etc.  We believe;
> however, that the numbers alone provide an incomplete picture of what is
> happening, so we use the numbers as a basis for discussion, not decision
> making.  After analyzing the numbers, we begin to look at additional
> sources
> of data that we find essential in informing our planning---meetings with
> staff, classes, our student advisory board, and focus groups.
>
>
>
> Here's an example we're currently working on---we did a two year analysis
> of
> learner retention, and began to document why students did not persist.  We
> found that the retention for students who enrolled after January 1 (our
> programs runs on a school calendar year from September to June) was
> significantly lower than the retention for students who began in
> September.
> Even more compelling, we learned that the retention for students who began
> after March 1 was 0%.
>
>
>
> We met with staff and students, and did some research around student
> retention issues.  After a year-long process, we decided to pilot a
> "managed
> enrollment" approach.  In Massachusetts , our grantor (MA DOE) allows us
> to
> "over-enroll" our classes by 20%, so we enroll 20% more students in the
> fall.  When students leave, we "drop" the overenrolled students into
> funded
> slots.  This allows us to keep the seats filled even with the typical
> attrition that occurs.
>
>
>
> In January, when we do our mid-point assessments; we move students to the
> higher level who are ready to progress..that typically leaves several
> openings in the beginner levels and we begin students in February as a
> cohort.  This year, we implemented new orientation programs including a
> requirement that new students observe a class before enrolling.
>
>
>
> While it is still too early to tell if these new procedures will have a
> positive impact, we are hopeful and we know anecdotally that the
> transition
> seems to be easier for some of these students.  We are eager to look at
> the
> data at the end of the year to analyze the effectiveness of this plan.
>
>
>
> As we begin to look at our data, we are finding that there seem to be a
> unique set of issues for our beginner ESOL students.  We suspect that the
> lack of effective English communication skills to advocate for themselves
> with employers is influencing their attendance and persistence.  This is
> an
> issue that we are beginning to tackle in terms of policy.  Do we need to
> have a more flexible, lenient policy for beginner students?  Is there a
> way
> to support students in addressing these employment issues?  How can we
> empower students more quickly?  Are there other issues for these beginner
> level students that affect their participation?  As we enter these
> discussions, the numbers will provide a basis for developing strategies,
> but
> the students themselves with be our greatest source of valuable data.
>
>
>
> Luanne Teller
>
>
>
> Luanne Teller
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   _____
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
> -------------------------------
>
> National Institute for Literacy
>
> Assessment mailing list
>
> Assessment at nifl.gov
>
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>

-- 
JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Professor, Education Department
Director, Ph.D. Program in Language, Literacy & Culture
Coordinator, Peace Corps Master's International Program in ESOL/Bilingual
Education
University of Maryland, Baltimore County (UMBC)
1000 Hilltop Circle, Baltimore, MD 21250
ph:    410-455-2313/2376  fax:   410-455-8947/1880
email: crandall at umbc.edu
www.umbc.edu/llc/
www.umbc.edu/esol/
www.umbc.edu/esol/peacecorps.html

From crandall at umbc.edu  Fri Apr 20 04:28:51 2007
From: crandall at umbc.edu (JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 04:28:51 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Assessment 777] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3D00@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>
References: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3D00@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>
Message-ID: <51824.210.229.158.10.1177057731.squirrel@webmail.umbc.edu>

Luanne,

This is consistent with some research I've done with Forrest Chisman and
several people at adult ESOL programs in community colleges.  Managed
enrollment not only increases attendance and learning gains, it also
increases retention and enrollment in the next ESOL level.

Jodi Crandall
> Good morning:
>
> How interesting to hear from a range of institutions---I get so focused
> on my programs that it is interesting to hear from other types of
> organizations and structures.
>
>
>
> For my students, motivation isn't an issue at all.  We have a lengthy
> wait list - depending on the level, students could wait as little as 6
> months or as long as 2 years to get into our program.  Consequently,
> they are pretty thrilled to finally be there, and eager to participate.
>
>
>
> For my population, (adult ESOL learners---a large majority in the 25-44
> age range) the issue is juggling demands on their time.  The majority
> work at least one job (many work 2 or more) and have children in school.
> Our classes are in the evening, since over 90% of the population we
> serve work during the day.  Many rush directly from work to class, and
> might be late due to mandatory overtime, or a family need that requires
> attention prior to attending class.  Given the lack of access to
> adequate preventative health care that many of our students face, there
> are ongoing health problems for many.  Add this to the occasional trip
> back to their native country for a death in the family, or some other
> type of family emergency, and frankly I'm amazed that they are able to
> maintain such a strong commitment to their studies.
>
>
>
> Some of our research and data analysis have uncovered these issues--
> still it remains quite a challenge to respond to these problems.  We
> initially adjusted our program plan and schedule to allow for longer
> breaks during the holidays, when many students wish to return to their
> native countries.  We also incorporate school vacations in our planning.
> When an individual student starts to have a problem, we meet with him or
> her to see how we can help.  It doesn't always work, but sometimes we
> are able to communicate with employers, and that's been helpful for many
> students.  Sometimes, we offer students a "leave of absence" to deal
> with pressing personal matters, and invite them to return when things
> are more settled.  All of these strategies have evolved over years of
> looking at attendance/retention data, and discussions with focus groups.
> These strategies have had a positive impact, and students appreciate our
> responsiveness to their needs.
>
>
>
> The first year that we implemented our "managed enrollment" (vs. open
> entry/open exit) model, our retention increased from 74% to 90%.  Our
> attendance has increased from 68% to now over 82%.  We all know how
> critical it is to keep students long enough for them to reach their
> goals...
>
>
>
> Which brings me to my final point.  We all serve so many masters---NRS,
> our funders (in my case DOE); our parent organizations (for me a
> community college) and we are constantly looking at data to justify our
> existence and demonstrate our effectiveness.  Let's be realistic, if we
> want to retain our funding, we have to show results-which is as it
> should be.
>
>
>
> For us; however, when we look at our data, it is always with an eye to
> how we can better serve our students and respond to their needs.  The
> difference is subtle, but powerful.  It's a lot easier to get staff and
> students on board with planning and change when they can see a direct
> result for our students than to respond to a bunch of charts and
> mandates from "higher ups".
>
>
>
> Luanne Teller
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Fred Lowenbach
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 5:15 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 749] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
>
>
> Hopefully everyone participating in this discussion regarding adult
> literacy is aware that almost everything you are saying applies to the
> results for students in school as well.  Coming from a public school
> background you could always see the effect that high mobility rates had
> on overall student results.  Schools with those highest rates almost
> always struggled to meet standard on state measures connected to NCLB.
> This was the case with overall populations as well as various subgroups
> that were tested.  The same applies to student retention, or for that
> matter attendance.  As a rule, student who attended regularly achieved
> much higher grades than students whose attendance was far less
> consistent.  This then followed suit with results on standardized
> testing and ultimately on graduation rates.
>
>
>
> The entire education community, whether it is involved with adult
> literacy, or the traditional K-12 curriculum is faced with the same
> thing.  The key to increasing literacy and to closing achievement gaps
> starts with getting and retaining students.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 3:33 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 748] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
>
>
> Sandy,
>
>
>
> A few years ago I did a study on adult ESL literacy students that
> focused primarily on instruction.  But we also looked at retention.  We
> found that the proportion of time an ESL literacy student attended
> (measure by hours attended over total hours class was scheduled) had a
> positive effect on oral English skills and reading comprehension, all
> else being equal (using a complex statistical model).
>
>
>
> The possible reasons for this effect are intriguing and need more
> research.  Because this measure showed an effect regardless of how many
> hours the student actually attended (or how many hours per week a
> student attended), my interpretation is that this measure is a measure
> of motivation (although I have no data or other information to check
> this).  In other words, the student who continues to attend over time,
> despite all of the other competing demands on time, is one that is more
> motivated.  This motivation helps learning.
>
>
>
> I think if true, it does have implications for structuring instructional
> segments.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Sandy Strunk
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:38 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 736] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
> Larry,
>
> Could you tell us more about the ESL research on percentage of possible
> time attended? This is a new idea to me. Does it reflect greater
> intensity as opposed to lesser intensity for a longer duration - or do
> you think something else is going on? If your research is correct, there
> are certainly implications for how we structure instructional segments.
>
>
>
> Sandy Strunk
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
>
>
> Hi Ella,
>
>
>
> Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
> is going on.
>
>
>
> I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
> attendance.
>
>
>
> Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most
> data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
> patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
> out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
> coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that
> learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
> total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
> scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
> showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
> learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
> this measure reflects student motivation to attend.
>
>
>
> Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about
> why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
> you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
> them.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
> Dear Collegues:
>
> Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program
> to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program.
> We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours
> attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers
> of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
> help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.
>
> We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
> easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
> from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
> previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
> educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been
> able to improve all of these efforts.
>
> Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible
> to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
> progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that
> information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
> us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
> responsibility for improvement where needed.
>
> I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not
> just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
> the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
> also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
> data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.
>
> Respectfully submitted by,
> Ella Bogard
>
> Ella Bogard, Executive Director
> Franklinton Learning Center
> 1003 West Town Street
> Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438
>
> Phone: (614) 221-9151
> Fax: (614) 221-9131
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>

-- 
JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Professor, Education Department
Director, Ph.D. Program in Language, Literacy & Culture
Coordinator, Peace Corps Master's International Program in ESOL/Bilingual
Education
University of Maryland, Baltimore County (UMBC)
1000 Hilltop Circle, Baltimore, MD 21250
ph:    410-455-2313/2376  fax:   410-455-8947/1880
email: crandall at umbc.edu
www.umbc.edu/llc/
www.umbc.edu/esol/
www.umbc.edu/esol/peacecorps.html

From rosemarym at lacnyc.org  Fri Apr 20 07:04:07 2007
From: rosemarym at lacnyc.org (Rosemary Matt)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 07:04:07 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 778] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
References: <4627BF87.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92ED@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

Katrina,

I am not sure what state you are from but here in New York, we have just this past year implemented a new state policy for administration of the TABE and a series of validity tables as well.  (I have attached both for you to take a look at)  Larry may remember that it was our state data that prompted us to change the way our programs were using the TABE.  In some cases, based on the score ranges, teachers were actually prohibiting their students from showing enough gain to place them in the next EFL under NRS guidelines by choosing an invalid level of the TABE.  Scores on either the high or low end of each range of scores on the TABE are unreliable because of the large standard error of measurement associated with the extreme ends of any bell curve.  This means that as you suspected, the high and low scores on each of the tests are less likely to be a true indication of the student's ability.  Retesting with a higher or lower level of the test is recommended for these cases.  It was evident to us, based on our state data, that test administrators either did not understand that concept or had differing opinion as to when a test was outside the acceptable range and consequentially when to retest.  

 

We employed the methodology developed by the University of Massachusetts for the Massachusetts Department of Education to establish acceptable ranges for the Reading, Mathematics Computation and Applied Mathematics sections of the TABE 7 & 8 and TABE 9 & 10.  The policy, along with the scoring tables, were then integrated into our data management system such that invalid scores may not even be entered into the data system.  If students score outside the valid ranges, they must be retested on an appropriate version of the TABE.  

 

Strategy is still advised when using these scoring tables.  For example, based on our validity tables, if a student scores a 7.2 GE reading level on an M TABE, they are within the valid range however if a level M is administered for the post test to this same student, the very highest that student may achieve and still fall within the valid range is a 7.7 GE.  This score will not be enough to show education gain.  This student must be given a level D test to open up the possibility of achieving a score high enough to evidence gain.  As long as the administration of the TABE levels is contiguous, the scores are valid and may be used under NRS guidelines.  (So moving from an M to a D is acceptable) 

 

As you can imagine Katrina, a comprehensive staff development was built to accommodate all this information and we rolled it out to all programs through a train the trainer model.  I am pleased to say that our state's performance in the area of educational gain has increased significantly as a result of this work.  I hope this is useful to you and your testing coordinator.

Rosemary

 

 
Rosemary I. Matt
NRS Liaison for NYS
Literacy Assistance Center
12 Meadowbrook Drive
New Hartford, NY 13413
315.798.1026

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Katrina Hinson
Sent: Thu 4/19/2007 7:14 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 774] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

I don't know if anyone has raised this question but one of the things I
know myself and the testing coordinator at my school are concerned with
is the fact that we don't get to count gains made if a person goes from
the M level TABE to the D level TABE. We use versions 9 and 10.  I had a
student who scored around 9.0 or so on the M level Reading which we
question in and of itself in terms of validity. He's at the point where
we're supposed to retest him. He'd tested on the D level in math the
first time and he's been regularly attending and regulary working on his
goals. He went from the 9.0 on the M level test which is moderately hard
in reading to a 7.7 on the D level test which is difficult. Because he
DROPPED in terms of grade level, it's not counted as a level
completion...even though he actually went from M to D...which one would
think would also qualify as a level.

Has anyone else had this happen and if so, what are your suggestions.

Regards,
Katrina Hinson
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Apr 20 08:21:56 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 08:21:56 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 779]  Using Data Discussion - Final Day!
Message-ID: <03a801c78346$7d8e5de0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  I hope this email
finds you well.
 
Just a reminder that today is our final day of discussion on Using Data
for Program Improvement with our Guest Panel members.  The discussion
continues to be interesting and intense, so I hope our final day will
also be as stimulating.
 
As noted previously, I will prepare the discussion in user-friendly
format once it has closed, and let you know where you can access it.
 
Post your thoughts, questions, ideas, and share your experiences today!
Don't miss out!
 
Thanks!!
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From Mario.Zuniga at fldoe.org  Fri Apr 20 08:33:31 2007
From: Mario.Zuniga at fldoe.org (Zuniga, Mario)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 08:33:31 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 780] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <4627BF87.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>
References: <4627BF87.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>
Message-ID: <96E135649F1AD048AA6FF8CBC598C23E088F6C0A@MAIL1.FLDOE.INT>

Katrina,
   This is the very reason it's better to use scale scores rather than
grade levels to place and promote students. The scale score accounts for
varying difficulty levels of the TABE and is the only metric that can
accurately measure a student's growth over time. 
   Grade levels are a gross measure that lose their meaning as you move
from level of the TABE to the next. So, for example, if a student earns
a 5.5 on the M level and a different student earns a 5.5 on the D level,
they ostensibly are at the same grade level, but the reality is that the
student who took the D level got a 5.5 on a test that had more difficult
content. As a result, you cannot realistically equate the two.
    Hope this helps!

Mario Zuniga
 
Adult Education Consultant
NRS, Assessment, and Accountability
Division of Workforce Education 
Florida Department of Education
mario.zuniga at fldoe.org 
(850) 245-9059

 

Please take a few minutes to provide feedback on the quality of service you received from our staff. The Department of Education values your feedback as a customer. Commissioner of Education Jeanine Blomberg is committed to continuously assessing and improving the level and quality of services provided to you.Simply use the link below.  Thank you in advance for completing the survey.
 

http://data.fldoe.org/cs/default.cfm?staff=Mario.Zuniga at fldoe.org|08:33:31%20Fri%2020%20Apr%202007
 

 -----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Katrina Hinson
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 7:14 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 774] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

I don't know if anyone has raised this question but one of the things I
know myself and the testing coordinator at my school are concerned with
is the fact that we don't get to count gains made if a person goes from
the M level TABE to the D level TABE. We use versions 9 and 10.  I had a
student who scored around 9.0 or so on the M level Reading which we
question in and of itself in terms of validity. He's at the point where
we're supposed to retest him. He'd tested on the D level in math the
first time and he's been regularly attending and regulary working on his
goals. He went from the 9.0 on the M level test which is moderately hard
in reading to a 7.7 on the D level test which is difficult. Because he
DROPPED in terms of grade level, it's not counted as a level
completion...even though he actually went from M to D...which one would
think would also qualify as a level.

Has anyone else had this happen and if so, what are your suggestions.

Regards,
Katrina Hinson
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From lteller at massasoit.mass.edu  Fri Apr 20 08:59:18 2007
From: lteller at massasoit.mass.edu (Luanne Teller)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 08:59:18 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 781] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <51824.210.229.158.10.1177057731.squirrel@webmail.umbc.edu>
Message-ID: <E54D221FAB5A4248B99AA8DBD78E068203DF3D16@EXCHANGE.massasoit.mass.edu>

Hi Jodi:

Hmmm!  I honestly never thought to look at how students are retained and
progress during the following year/s...great thought!  I am going to
have to go back and look at this data to see if I can find any
trends...thanks for the idea!  Luanne

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2007 4:29 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Cc: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 777] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Luanne,

This is consistent with some research I've done with Forrest Chisman and
several people at adult ESOL programs in community colleges.  Managed
enrollment not only increases attendance and learning gains, it also
increases retention and enrollment in the next ESOL level.

Jodi Crandall
> Good morning:
>
> How interesting to hear from a range of institutions---I get so
focused
> on my programs that it is interesting to hear from other types of
> organizations and structures.
>
>
>
> For my students, motivation isn't an issue at all.  We have a lengthy
> wait list - depending on the level, students could wait as little as 6
> months or as long as 2 years to get into our program.  Consequently,
> they are pretty thrilled to finally be there, and eager to
participate.
>
>
>
> For my population, (adult ESOL learners---a large majority in the
25-44
> age range) the issue is juggling demands on their time.  The majority
> work at least one job (many work 2 or more) and have children in
school.
> Our classes are in the evening, since over 90% of the population we
> serve work during the day.  Many rush directly from work to class, and
> might be late due to mandatory overtime, or a family need that
requires
> attention prior to attending class.  Given the lack of access to
> adequate preventative health care that many of our students face,
there
> are ongoing health problems for many.  Add this to the occasional trip
> back to their native country for a death in the family, or some other
> type of family emergency, and frankly I'm amazed that they are able to
> maintain such a strong commitment to their studies.
>
>
>
> Some of our research and data analysis have uncovered these issues--
> still it remains quite a challenge to respond to these problems.  We
> initially adjusted our program plan and schedule to allow for longer
> breaks during the holidays, when many students wish to return to their
> native countries.  We also incorporate school vacations in our
planning.
> When an individual student starts to have a problem, we meet with him
or
> her to see how we can help.  It doesn't always work, but sometimes we
> are able to communicate with employers, and that's been helpful for
many
> students.  Sometimes, we offer students a "leave of absence" to deal
> with pressing personal matters, and invite them to return when things
> are more settled.  All of these strategies have evolved over years of
> looking at attendance/retention data, and discussions with focus
groups.
> These strategies have had a positive impact, and students appreciate
our
> responsiveness to their needs.
>
>
>
> The first year that we implemented our "managed enrollment" (vs. open
> entry/open exit) model, our retention increased from 74% to 90%.  Our
> attendance has increased from 68% to now over 82%.  We all know how
> critical it is to keep students long enough for them to reach their
> goals...
>
>
>
> Which brings me to my final point.  We all serve so many
masters---NRS,
> our funders (in my case DOE); our parent organizations (for me a
> community college) and we are constantly looking at data to justify
our
> existence and demonstrate our effectiveness.  Let's be realistic, if
we
> want to retain our funding, we have to show results-which is as it
> should be.
>
>
>
> For us; however, when we look at our data, it is always with an eye to
> how we can better serve our students and respond to their needs.  The
> difference is subtle, but powerful.  It's a lot easier to get staff
and
> students on board with planning and change when they can see a direct
> result for our students than to respond to a bunch of charts and
> mandates from "higher ups".
>
>
>
> Luanne Teller
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Fred Lowenbach
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 5:15 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 749] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
>
>
> Hopefully everyone participating in this discussion regarding adult
> literacy is aware that almost everything you are saying applies to the
> results for students in school as well.  Coming from a public school
> background you could always see the effect that high mobility rates
had
> on overall student results.  Schools with those highest rates almost
> always struggled to meet standard on state measures connected to NCLB.
> This was the case with overall populations as well as various
subgroups
> that were tested.  The same applies to student retention, or for that
> matter attendance.  As a rule, student who attended regularly achieved
> much higher grades than students whose attendance was far less
> consistent.  This then followed suit with results on standardized
> testing and ultimately on graduation rates.
>
>
>
> The entire education community, whether it is involved with adult
> literacy, or the traditional K-12 curriculum is faced with the same
> thing.  The key to increasing literacy and to closing achievement gaps
> starts with getting and retaining students.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
> Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 3:33 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 748] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
>
>
> Sandy,
>
>
>
> A few years ago I did a study on adult ESL literacy students that
> focused primarily on instruction.  But we also looked at retention.
We
> found that the proportion of time an ESL literacy student attended
> (measure by hours attended over total hours class was scheduled) had a
> positive effect on oral English skills and reading comprehension, all
> else being equal (using a complex statistical model).
>
>
>
> The possible reasons for this effect are intriguing and need more
> research.  Because this measure showed an effect regardless of how
many
> hours the student actually attended (or how many hours per week a
> student attended), my interpretation is that this measure is a measure
> of motivation (although I have no data or other information to check
> this).  In other words, the student who continues to attend over time,
> despite all of the other competing demands on time, is one that is
more
> motivated.  This motivation helps learning.
>
>
>
> I think if true, it does have implications for structuring
instructional
> segments.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Sandy Strunk
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:38 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 736] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
> Larry,
>
> Could you tell us more about the ESL research on percentage of
possible
> time attended? This is a new idea to me. Does it reflect greater
> intensity as opposed to lesser intensity for a longer duration - or do
> you think something else is going on? If your research is correct,
there
> are certainly implications for how we structure instructional
segments.
>
>
>
> Sandy Strunk
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
>
>
> Hi Ella,
>
>
>
> Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
> is going on.
>
>
>
> I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
> attendance.
>
>
>
> Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and
most
> data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
> patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
> out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
> coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible
that
> learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
> total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
> scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
> showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
> learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
> this measure reflects student motivation to attend.
>
>
>
> Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot
about
> why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
> you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
> them.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
> Dear Collegues:
>
> Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our
program
> to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our
program.
> We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average
hours
> attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and
numbers
> of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
> help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of
classes.
>
> We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
> easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
> from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
> previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
> educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have
been
> able to improve all of these efforts.
>
> Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it
possible
> to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
> progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize
that
> information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
> us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
> responsibility for improvement where needed.
>
> I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time
not
> just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
> the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
> also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
> data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.
>
> Respectfully submitted by,
> Ella Bogard
>
> Ella Bogard, Executive Director
> Franklinton Learning Center
> 1003 West Town Street
> Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438
>
> Phone: (614) 221-9151
> Fax: (614) 221-9131
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>

-- 
JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Professor, Education Department
Director, Ph.D. Program in Language, Literacy & Culture
Coordinator, Peace Corps Master's International Program in
ESOL/Bilingual
Education
University of Maryland, Baltimore County (UMBC)
1000 Hilltop Circle, Baltimore, MD 21250
ph:    410-455-2313/2376  fax:   410-455-8947/1880
email: crandall at umbc.edu
www.umbc.edu/llc/
www.umbc.edu/esol/
www.umbc.edu/esol/peacecorps.html

-------------------------------
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From JaneS at doe.mass.edu  Fri Apr 20 11:21:16 2007
From: JaneS at doe.mass.edu (Schwerdtfeger, Jane)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 11:21:16 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 782]  FW:  Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
Message-ID: <8ADDCB4F87E49F47B163BCD04B6D6EA162D7E5@exchange1.doe.mass.edu>

Hi, Katrina, we found the same problem with the TABE, and we received help
from the Center for Educational Assessment at University of Massachusetts,
Amherst (from Prof. Steve Sireci and Dr. April Zenisky Laguilles), who
formulated a chart for testers to use. It has really helped the problem! You
can find it in our FY07 assessment manual for using the TABE, on pp. 10-11
at http://www.doe.mass.edu/acls/assessment/news/TABEpolicy.doc

Jane Schwerdtfeger
Curriculum and Assessment Developer, Adult and Community Services
Massachusetts Department of Education 

PS: the discussion has been terrific this week! Thanks to all who
participated!

-----Original Message-----
From: Katrina Hinson [mailto:KHinson at almanid.com]
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2007 7:14 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 774] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

I don't know if anyone has raised this question but one of the things I
know myself and the testing coordinator at my school are concerned with
is the fact that we don't get to count gains made if a person goes from
the M level TABE to the D level TABE. We use versions 9 and 10.  I had a
student who scored around 9.0 or so on the M level Reading which we
question in and of itself in terms of validity. He's at the point where
we're supposed to retest him. He'd tested on the D level in math the
first time and he's been regularly attending and regulary working on his
goals. He went from the 9.0 on the M level test which is moderately hard
in reading to a 7.7 on the D level test which is difficult. Because he
DROPPED in terms of grade level, it's not counted as a level
completion...even though he actually went from M to D...which one would
think would also qualify as a level.

Has anyone else had this happen and if so, what are your suggestions.

Regards,
Katrina Hinson
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From dcornellier at doe.mass.edu  Fri Apr 20 11:59:11 2007
From: dcornellier at doe.mass.edu (Cornellier, Donna)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 11:59:11 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 783]  Using Performance Standards Data in Desk Reviews
Message-ID: <8ADDCB4F87E49F47B163BCD04B6D6EA101459838@exchange1.doe.mass.edu>

Hi,

In Massachusetts we migrated our desk review system over to a web based
reporting system (Cognos) in the last few years. The system allows programs
ongoing access to view their progress throughout the year. At the end of the
fiscal year programs can view their scores.  The six performance standards
have been informed by statistical analysis of multiple years of data, a
goals pilot, and input from the field of ABE practitioners in multiple task
groups and workshops at statewide conferences. Each of the standards is set
at or near the Massachusetts state average for performance in the following
areas: attendance, average attended hours, pre and post testing percentage,
learner gains, setting and meeting student goals, and NRS Table 4
educational functioning level completion. The performance standards, as one
part of a larger system of accountability, encourage continuous improvement,
effective program administration, and positive student outcomes.
Our intention was to create a simple and understandable system that local
programs would buy into and use. The state also wanted the system to be seen
as helping with program improvement not as punitive. We assign points to a
relatively small number of measures because those are the measures we want
to emphasize and because of the difficulty of quantifying some of the other
measures. The fact that local programs have regular access to the Cognos
system has helped with buy in. This access allows locals to see the same
data the state sees, increasing transparency, and allowing programs to
follow their progress throughout the year. This has helped locals to see the
benefits of the desk review system. 

Donna Cornellier
SMARTT ABE Project Manager
Adult and Community Learning Services
Massachusetts Department of Education
350 Main Street
Malden, MA 02148
781 338-3814

From kmundie at gplc.org  Fri Apr 20 12:23:24 2007
From: kmundie at gplc.org (Karen Mundie)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 12:23:24 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 784] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92ED@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
References: <4627BF87.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>
	<6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92ED@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
Message-ID: <18DB73F5-0C73-449C-BF2A-8F3B9F79CCD2@gplc.org>

I'm fascinated by this discussion because most of us who do a lot of  
standardized testing have, indeed, learned by experience  that the  
whole testing thing is not quite as straightforward as one might  
think, that there is strategy involved if a program is to put its  
"best foot forward" in a completely legitimate way--not to mention a  
good deal of staff training to achieve any kind of consistency.

Karen Mundie
Associate Director
Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
Pittsburgh, PA  15206
412 661-7323 (ext 101)
kmundie at gplc.org

GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007

This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees  
and is not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the  
intended recipient, please report the error to the originator and  
delete the contents.

On Apr 20, 2007, at 7:04 AM, Rosemary Matt wrote:

> Katrina,
> I am not sure what state you are from but here in New York, we have  
> just this past year implemented a new state policy for  
> administration of the TABE and a series of validity tables as  
> well.  (I have attached both for you to take a look at)  Larry may  
> remember that it was our state data that prompted us to change the  
> way our programs were using the TABE.  In some cases, based on the  
> score ranges, teachers were actually prohibiting their students  
> from showing enough gain to place them in the next EFL under NRS  
> guidelines by choosing an invalid level of the TABE.  Scores on  
> either the high or low end of each range of scores on the TABE are  
> unreliable because of the large standard error of measurement  
> associated with the extreme ends of any bell curve.  This means  
> that as you suspected, the high and low scores on each of the tests  
> are less likely to be a true indication of the student?s ability.   
> Retesting with a higher or lower level of the test is recommended  
> for these cases.  It was evident to us, based on our state data,  
> that test administrators either did not understand that concept or  
> had differing opinion as to when a test was outside the acceptable  
> range and consequentially when to retest.
>
> We employed the methodology developed by the University of  
> Massachusetts for the Massachusetts Department of Education to  
> establish acceptable ranges for the Reading, Mathematics  
> Computation and Applied Mathematics sections of the TABE 7 & 8 and  
> TABE 9 & 10.  The policy, along with the scoring tables, were then  
> integrated into our data management system such that invalid scores  
> may not even be entered into the data system.  If students score  
> outside the valid ranges, they must be retested on an appropriate  
> version of the TABE.
>
> Strategy is still advised when using these scoring tables.  For  
> example, based on our validity tables, if a student scores a 7.2 GE  
> reading level on an M TABE, they are within the valid range however  
> if a level M is administered for the post test to this same  
> student, the very highest that student may achieve and still fall  
> within the valid range is a 7.7 GE.  This score will not be enough  
> to show education gain.  This student must be given a level D test  
> to open up the possibility of achieving a score high enough to  
> evidence gain.  As long as the administration of the TABE levels is  
> contiguous, the scores are valid and may be used under NRS  
> guidelines.  (So moving from an M to a D is acceptable)
>
> As you can imagine Katrina, a comprehensive staff development was  
> built to accommodate all this information and we rolled it out to  
> all programs through a train the trainer model.  I am pleased to  
> say that our state?s performance in the area of educational gain  
> has increased significantly as a result of this work.  I hope this  
> is useful to you and your testing coordinator.
> Rosemary
>
>
> Rosemary I. Matt
> NRS Liaison for NYS
> Literacy Assistance Center
> 12 Meadowbrook Drive
> New Hartford, NY 13413
> 315.798.1026
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Katrina Hinson
> Sent: Thu 4/19/2007 7:14 PM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 774] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
> I don't know if anyone has raised this question but one of the  
> things I
> know myself and the testing coordinator at my school are concerned  
> with
> is the fact that we don't get to count gains made if a person goes  
> from
> the M level TABE to the D level TABE. We use versions 9 and 10.  I  
> had a
> student who scored around 9.0 or so on the M level Reading which we
> question in and of itself in terms of validity. He's at the point  
> where
> we're supposed to retest him. He'd tested on the D level in math the
> first time and he's been regularly attending and regulary working  
> on his
> goals. He went from the 9.0 on the M level test which is moderately  
> hard
> in reading to a 7.7 on the D level test which is difficult. Because he
> DROPPED in terms of grade level, it's not counted as a level
> completion...even though he actually went from M to D...which one  
> would
> think would also qualify as a level.
>
> Has anyone else had this happen and if so, what are your suggestions.
>
> Regards,
> Katrina Hinson
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
> <TABE_Policy_NYS.doc>
> <TABE_Final_Tables.doc>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From rosemarym at lacnyc.org  Fri Apr 20 12:55:03 2007
From: rosemarym at lacnyc.org (Rosemary Matt)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 12:55:03 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 785] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
References: <4627BF87.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com><6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92ED@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
	<18DB73F5-0C73-449C-BF2A-8F3B9F79CCD2@gplc.org>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92EE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

Karen,
The challenge of rolling out the staff development for these assessment pieces is truly daunting.  In New York, every staff member who is to administer the TABE must attend the state training.  Through our data management system, we track all attendance and certifications for state mandated training.  We have a similar strand running for the BEST Plus as well.  Although it is a challenge to get everyone trained, for those programs who pushed their staff through the first round, they are already seeing the difference in their performance data for educational gain.  You are absolutely correct in feeling there is not only strategy involved but a better understanding of the nuances of the NRS system can assist a program in demonstrating through their data reporting, a more accurate picture of the service they provide and the impact it has on their students.
Rosemary
 
Rosemary I. Matt
NRS Liaison for NYS
Literacy Assistance Center
12 Meadowbrook Drive
New Hartford, NY 13413
315.798.1026

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Karen Mundie
Sent: Fri 4/20/2007 12:23 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 784] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

I'm fascinated by this discussion because most of us who do a lot of standardized testing have, indeed, learned by experience  that the whole testing thing is not quite as straightforward as one might think, that there is strategy involved if a program is to put its "best foot forward" in a completely legitimate way--not to mention a good deal of staff training to achieve any kind of consistency. 

Karen Mundie
Associate Director
Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
Pittsburgh, PA  15206
412 661-7323 (ext 101)
kmundie at gplc.org

GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007

This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees and is not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the intended recipient, please report the error to the originator and delete the contents.

On Apr 20, 2007, at 7:04 AM, Rosemary Matt wrote:

	
	Katrina,
	I am not sure what state you are from but here in New York, we have just this past year implemented a new state policy for administration of the TABE and a series of validity tables as well.  (I have attached both for you to take a look at)  Larry may remember that it was our state data that prompted us to change the way our programs were using the TABE.  In some cases, based on the score ranges, teachers were actually prohibiting their students from showing enough gain to place them in the next EFL under NRS guidelines by choosing an invalid level of the TABE.  Scores on either the high or low end of each range of scores on the TABE are unreliable because of the large standard error of measurement associated with the extreme ends of any bell curve.  This means that as you suspected, the high and low scores on each of the tests are less likely to be a true indication of the student's ability.  Retesting with a higher or lower level of the test is recommended for these cases.  It was evident to us, based on our state data, that test administrators either did not understand that concept or had differing opinion as to when a test was outside the acceptable range and consequentially when to retest.  
	 
	We employed the methodology developed by the University of Massachusetts for the Massachusetts Department of Education to establish acceptable ranges for the Reading, Mathematics Computation and Applied Mathematics sections of the TABE 7 & 8 and TABE 9 & 10.  The policy, along with the scoring tables, were then integrated into our data management system such that invalid scores may not even be entered into the data system.  If students score outside the valid ranges, they must be retested on an appropriate version of the TABE.  
	 
	Strategy is still advised when using these scoring tables.  For example, based on our validity tables, if a student scores a 7.2 GE reading level on an M TABE, they are within the valid range however if a level M is administered for the post test to this same student, the very highest that student may achieve and still fall within the valid range is a 7.7 GE.  This score will not be enough to show education gain.  This student must be given a level D test to open up the possibility of achieving a score high enough to evidence gain.  As long as the administration of the TABE levels is contiguous, the scores are valid and may be used under NRS guidelines.  (So moving from an M to a D is acceptable) 
	 
	As you can imagine Katrina, a comprehensive staff development was built to accommodate all this information and we rolled it out to all programs through a train the trainer model.  I am pleased to say that our state's performance in the area of educational gain has increased significantly as a result of this work.  I hope this is useful to you and your testing coordinator.
	Rosemary

	 

	 
	Rosemary I. Matt
	NRS Liaison for NYS
	Literacy Assistance Center
	12 Meadowbrook Drive
	New Hartford, NY 13413
	315.798.1026

________________________________

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Katrina Hinson
	Sent: Thu 4/19/2007 7:14 PM
	To: assessment at nifl.gov
	Subject: [Assessment 774] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
	
	

	I don't know if anyone has raised this question but one of the things I
	know myself and the testing coordinator at my school are concerned with
	is the fact that we don't get to count gains made if a person goes from
	the M level TABE to the D level TABE. We use versions 9 and 10.  I had a
	student who scored around 9.0 or so on the M level Reading which we
	question in and of itself in terms of validity. He's at the point where
	we're supposed to retest him. He'd tested on the D level in math the
	first time and he's been regularly attending and regulary working on his
	goals. He went from the 9.0 on the M level test which is moderately hard
	in reading to a 7.7 on the D level test which is difficult. Because he
	DROPPED in terms of grade level, it's not counted as a level
	completion...even though he actually went from M to D...which one would
	think would also qualify as a level.
	
	Has anyone else had this happen and if so, what are your suggestions.
	
	Regards,
	Katrina Hinson
	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	

	
	<TABE_Policy_NYS.doc>
	
	<TABE_Final_Tables.doc>
	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From forrest at crosslink.net  Fri Apr 20 13:47:13 2007
From: forrest at crosslink.net (forrest)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 13:47:13 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 786]   Re: Using Data
Message-ID: <000701c78373$ef1bc240$92e7f804@hppav>

Dan, you have raised some critically important questions. NRS data indicates that only about 36% of ESL students "complete a level" each year. This is cause for concern, because the same data show that the vast majority of ESL students are at the lowest levels of proficiency and have low levels of education in their native countries. However, the NRS data is not definitive for a number of reasons -- such as low rates of re-test in many programs, the use of tests that do not measure the full range of English language skills, and the fact that data is reported only for a single year (students may persist in programs long enough to achieve much larger learning gains).

As a first step toward finding out more about the learning gains and persistence of ESL students, Jodi Crandall and I worked with the faculty and staff at 5 highly regarded community college programs to use student record data as a means of determining both learning gains and persistence rates. At several of the colleges we were able to track the learning gains and persistence of students for as long as seven years. At most of the colleges, the measures of learning gains used was completion of one or more additional levels AS THE COLLEGE DEFINED THE LEVELS. Both the definition of levels and the standards of completion took account of test scores (of the sort reported to the NRS), but they also took account of other measures of student achievement (including proficiency in all core ESL skills). 

Needless to say, our findings were fairly complex and cannot be adequately set forth here. In summary, however, we found that at most 30% of students persist for 2-3 college terms and complete more than 2-3 levels over a seven year period. More than 40-50% of students do not complete a level or complete only a single level at any time over a seven year period. Although we could not be sure, it appears that low level students were more likely to persist than higher level students. About 10-15% of adult education ESL students enrolled in credit ESL at these colleges, and the number who eventually enrolled in academic credit courses was in the single digits. 

We also found that all the colleges we examined employ strategies that significantly improve the rate of learning gains and retention. Among these were high intensity/managed enrollment classes (more than 3-6 hours per week), strategies to encourage learning outside the classroom, appropriate uses of echnology for instruction, co-enrollment of adult education ESL students in vocational programs taught in English, curricular designs that insure instruction is relevant to the interests of students (such as Frerian approaches), enriched guidance/counseling/support services, setting high expectations, and VESL programs. Unfortunately, only small numbers of students have access to most of these strategies at most colleges, because they are far more expensive on a per student basis than is standard ESL instruction. Conversely, it appears that large numbers of students would like to make the committment to enhanced programs, if they were available. 

The results of our research were published by the Council for the Advancement of Adult Literacy (under the auspices of which the research was conducted) in February as the report " Passing the Torch:Strategies for Innovation in Community College ESL." This is available at the CAAL website: www.caalusa.org. CAAL will be publishing more of the data we gathered later this spring. 

Among the "take away" messages we gathered from our work were: 1) The use of longitudinal (multi-year) data and holistic assessments of learning gains are essential for understanding and improving the effectiveness of ESL programs. In many programs it is feasible to gather and use longitudinal data in this way, but few programs do so due to a variety of perceived constraints and/or a lack of support for data analysis by their host institutions. 2) Research can be very helpful in program improvement, but it requires a substantial committment on the part of programs to gather relevant data and tease out its lessons on an on-going basis. Programs should receive far more support for this. 3) It is posible to greatly improve ESL program outcomes using a variety of strategies, but these require a larger investment in instruction per student -- an investment that we believe is well worth the cost. 4) Numbers do not speak for themselves. For example, low rates of learning gains must be read in the context of the goals that both students and programs set for ESL instruction. It may be that some portion of students legitimately wish to use ESL programs as an initial platform to learn SOME English, and that their learning gains after separating from programs are substantial. Too little is known about this. Conversely, we found that the more students learn, the more ambitious their learning goals become. Because numbers do not speak for themselves, it is all the more important for individual programs and state agencies to invest in the use of research for program improvement and to ACTUALLY USE IT for therse purposes. Too often over-burdened ESL faculty and staff consider research an after-thought. They need the time, encouragement, resources, and training to development "continuous program improvement" models to their work.                                    
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From kmundie at gplc.org  Fri Apr 20 14:27:51 2007
From: kmundie at gplc.org (Karen Mundie)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 14:27:51 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 787] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92EE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
References: <4627BF87.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com><6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92ED@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
	<18DB73F5-0C73-449C-BF2A-8F3B9F79CCD2@gplc.org>
	<6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB82B92EE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
Message-ID: <1D4CE3BE-EA27-4E88-AEC7-6EB963DAAF85@gplc.org>

In Pennsylvania we also have a mandated Assessment training. At least  
one person from every program must have attended the training.

However, the truth is,  many people are still giving assessments who  
have not attended training.

At my own agency, everyone who gives the TABE or BEST or BEST Plus  
has attended training. Basically,  I think we do very well with the  
TABE. We are lucky in having an education specialist who is an  
assessment trainer and who oversees our testing procedures in general.

  I think that the Best Plus is a problem for many programs because  
expertise in giving the test requires a good deal of practice. We  
have limited the number of staff who give the BEST Plus to about nine  
staff members and try to have the pre and post tests given by the  
same person, but I'm still concerned that there is still too much  
room for scoring anomalies and differences in judgment.

  I hear from a number of programs that this is problem.

Karen Mundie
Associate Director
Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
Pittsburgh, PA  15206
412 661-7323 (ext 101)
kmundie at gplc.org

GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007

This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees  
and is not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the  
intended recipient, please report the error to the originator and  
delete the contents.

On Apr 20, 2007, at 12:55 PM, Rosemary Matt wrote:

> Karen,
> The challenge of rolling out the staff development for these  
> assessment pieces is truly daunting.  In New York, every staff  
> member who is to administer the TABE must attend the state  
> training.  Through our data management system, we track all  
> attendance and certifications for state mandated training.  We have  
> a similar strand running for the BEST Plus as well.  Although it is  
> a challenge to get everyone trained, for those programs who pushed  
> their staff through the first round, they are already seeing the  
> difference in their performance data for educational gain.  You are  
> absolutely correct in feeling there is not only strategy involved  
> but a better understanding of the nuances of the NRS system can  
> assist a program in demonstrating through their data reporting, a  
> more accurate picture of the service they provide and the impact it  
> has on their students.
> Rosemary
>
> Rosemary I. Matt
> NRS Liaison for NYS
> Literacy Assistance Center
> 12 Meadowbrook Drive
> New Hartford, NY 13413
> 315.798.1026
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Karen Mundie
> Sent: Fri 4/20/2007 12:23 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 784] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>
> I'm fascinated by this discussion because most of us who do a lot  
> of standardized testing have, indeed, learned by experience  that  
> the whole testing thing is not quite as straightforward as one  
> might think, that there is strategy involved if a program is to put  
> its "best foot forward" in a completely legitimate way--not to  
> mention a good deal of staff training to achieve any kind of  
> consistency.
>
> Karen Mundie
> Associate Director
> Greater Pittsburgh Literacy Council
> 100 Sheridan Square, 4th Floor
> Pittsburgh, PA  15206
> 412 661-7323 (ext 101)
> kmundie at gplc.org
>
> GPLC - Celebrating 25 years of literacy, 1982-2007
>
>
> This e-mail is intended solely for the use of the named addressees  
> and is not meant for general distribution.  If you are not the  
> intended recipient, please report the error to the originator and  
> delete the contents.
>
>
> On Apr 20, 2007, at 7:04 AM, Rosemary Matt wrote:
>
>> Katrina,
>> I am not sure what state you are from but here in New York, we  
>> have just this past year implemented a new state policy for  
>> administration of the TABE and a series of validity tables as  
>> well.  (I have attached both for you to take a look at)  Larry may  
>> remember that it was our state data that prompted us to change the  
>> way our programs were using the TABE.  In some cases, based on the  
>> score ranges, teachers were actually prohibiting their students  
>> from showing enough gain to place them in the next EFL under NRS  
>> guidelines by choosing an invalid level of the TABE.  Scores on  
>> either the high or low end of each range of scores on the TABE are  
>> unreliable because of the large standard error of measurement  
>> associated with the extreme ends of any bell curve.  This means  
>> that as you suspected, the high and low scores on each of the  
>> tests are less likely to be a true indication of the student?s  
>> ability.  Retesting with a higher or lower level of the test is  
>> recommended for these cases.  It was evident to us, based on our  
>> state data, that test administrators either did not understand  
>> that concept or had differing opinion as to when a test was  
>> outside the acceptable range and consequentially when to retest.
>>
>> We employed the methodology developed by the University of  
>> Massachusetts for the Massachusetts Department of Education to  
>> establish acceptable ranges for the Reading, Mathematics  
>> Computation and Applied Mathematics sections of the TABE 7 & 8 and  
>> TABE 9 & 10.  The policy, along with the scoring tables, were then  
>> integrated into our data management system such that invalid  
>> scores may not even be entered into the data system.  If students  
>> score outside the valid ranges, they must be retested on an  
>> appropriate version of the TABE.
>>
>> Strategy is still advised when using these scoring tables.  For  
>> example, based on our validity tables, if a student scores a 7.2  
>> GE reading level on an M TABE, they are within the valid range  
>> however if a level M is administered for the post test to this  
>> same student, the very highest that student may achieve and still  
>> fall within the valid range is a 7.7 GE.  This score will not be  
>> enough to show education gain.  This student must be given a level  
>> D test to open up the possibility of achieving a score high enough  
>> to evidence gain.  As long as the administration of the TABE  
>> levels is contiguous, the scores are valid and may be used under  
>> NRS guidelines.  (So moving from an M to a D is acceptable)
>>
>> As you can imagine Katrina, a comprehensive staff development was  
>> built to accommodate all this information and we rolled it out to  
>> all programs through a train the trainer model.  I am pleased to  
>> say that our state?s performance in the area of educational gain  
>> has increased significantly as a result of this work.  I hope this  
>> is useful to you and your testing coordinator.
>> Rosemary
>>
>>
>> Rosemary I. Matt
>> NRS Liaison for NYS
>> Literacy Assistance Center
>> 12 Meadowbrook Drive
>> New Hartford, NY 13413
>> 315.798.1026
>>
>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Katrina Hinson
>> Sent: Thu 4/19/2007 7:14 PM
>> To: assessment at nifl.gov
>> Subject: [Assessment 774] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
>>
>> I don't know if anyone has raised this question but one of the  
>> things I
>> know myself and the testing coordinator at my school are concerned  
>> with
>> is the fact that we don't get to count gains made if a person goes  
>> from
>> the M level TABE to the D level TABE. We use versions 9 and 10.  I  
>> had a
>> student who scored around 9.0 or so on the M level Reading which we
>> question in and of itself in terms of validity. He's at the point  
>> where
>> we're supposed to retest him. He'd tested on the D level in math the
>> first time and he's been regularly attending and regulary working  
>> on his
>> goals. He went from the 9.0 on the M level test which is  
>> moderately hard
>> in reading to a 7.7 on the D level test which is difficult.  
>> Because he
>> DROPPED in terms of grade level, it's not counted as a level
>> completion...even though he actually went from M to D...which one  
>> would
>> think would also qualify as a level.
>>
>> Has anyone else had this happen and if so, what are your suggestions.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Katrina Hinson
>> -------------------------------
>> National Institute for Literacy
>> Assessment mailing list
>> Assessment at nifl.gov
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>>
>> <TABE_Policy_NYS.doc>
>> <TABE_Final_Tables.doc>
>> -------------------------------
>> National Institute for Literacy
>> Assessment mailing list
>> Assessment at nifl.gov
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From Kate.Diggins at slc.k12.ut.us  Fri Apr 20 14:31:38 2007
From: Kate.Diggins at slc.k12.ut.us (Kate Diggins)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 12:31:38 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 788] Re: Teaching gains over more than one	year
Message-ID: <4628B2AA020000520000C101@slc.k12.ut.us>

Well, I think I would attribute it to quite a bit of individual attention.  Our students are placed in samll groups and work with volunteer mentor-tutors.  The groups are maintained and supported by the professional staff; so this means that there's a web of supportive  relationships to help students with problems that may lead to"stop-out".  If a student is absent twice without calling in, we call to find out what's happening.  We try, too, to assist in overcoming the most typical barriers to education, so we have childcare  and a small shuttle bus that can do door-to-door service to 15 people, if they live within a couple miles of the school. To be honest, I've never been sure that our retention was good, because I've never had data to compare it with.  Does anyone know what a typical retention rate is for a non-intensive adult ESL program?

Kate Diggins
Director of Adult Education
Guadalupe Schools
(801) 531-6100 (x-1107)
>>> Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net> 04/19/07 5:54 PM >>>
Kate--

How do you account for the long retention rate?  Other programs report 
this as a difficulty.

Thanks.

Andrea

On Apr 19, 2007, at 1:31 PM, Kate Diggins wrote:

> I'd like to respond to David Rosen's question regarding programs which 
> track student gains beyond the bounds of the fiscal year.  At my 
> program, students stay for an average of 15 months, and they are 
> permitted to stay for five years if they wish (and many of them do), 
> so we track them from start to finish.  We are a small program, 
> serving about 250 students a year, so we take a fairly low-tech 
> approach.  After pretesting with BEST "Plus" and BEST Literacy, we 
> plot their scores on line graphs (two separate graphs - one for each 
> of the two tests) and continue to plot their scores for each 
> subsequent test.  As time goes by, the lines representing a student's 
> progress slope gradually upward across the pages. This is a graphic 
> that the students can easily understand, and it enables us to see 
> which skill areas require emphasis for individual students.  Having a 
> complete picture of a student's testing history also allows us to show 
> students that an occasional disappointing test sco
>  re may be an aberration from a generally upward trend.
>
> Kate Diggins
> Director of Adult Education
> Guadalupe Schools
> (801) 531-6100 (x-1107)
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From tborge at bhcc.mass.edu  Fri Apr 20 14:38:59 2007
From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu (Borge, Toni)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 14:38:59 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 789] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <DAA0CB37DE95234ABD1407F042207CB79EC979@dwe.ccbc.ccbcmd.edu>
Message-ID: <25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59EE2B4F@mercury.bhcc.dom>

Hi, 

Shifts in ESOL population can also be attributed to change in employment
opportunities and contraction in the availability of affordable housing.
Massachusetts is suffering like many places in the country with a dearth
of affordable housing. Rents have increased exponentially and the city
where my program is located has increased enforcement on the number of
people who can legally live in an apartment building.  People then shift
to another low rent area.  Then they try to return to school.  I only
see this issue increasing as little is being done outside of community
organizations to address this issue.

Toni

 

Toni F. Borge

Adult Education & Transitions Program Director

Bunker Hill Community College

Chelsea Campus

175 Hawthorne Street

Chelsea, MA  02150

Phone: 617-228-2108   *  Fax:617-228-2106

E-mail: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu

"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that
matter." Martin Luther King Jr.

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Monti, Suzi
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 6:59 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 738] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

I would like to add a few comments on retention and ESOL students. 

 

We have recently heard a lot about "stopping out" and I think that can
pertain to ESOL learners for many of the same reasons as ASE/GED
learners - with the addition of issues such as stages of acculturation
and/or home country responsibilities which may cause ESOL learners to
withdraw for weeks or months and then possibly return.

 

I would also like to raise the issue of the mobility of the ESOL
population. We see migration reports on immigrants and settlement trends
and I often wonder how much of a difference in retention these trends
makes when comparing ASE/GED retention rates with ESOL. 

 

I think of the "stopover" trend we see sometimes in ESOL here in
Baltimore, MD where non-native speakers will enter and only temporarily
reside her before moving to an intended more perm ant location. This
obviously has great impact on retention. When comparing ESOL programs
statewide or nationwide, the "stopover" trend may negatively impact the
retention rates of certain programs.

 

Another thing we see is "shift" or movement around the beltway (as we
call it). We have major ESOL class sites at locations along the
Baltimore beltway that roughly encircles the city and we see contraction
and expansion at these sites based the movement of the ESOL population.
We will see that a site may suddenly have low retention across ALL six
or seven ESOL classes offered - even the classes with
veteran/experienced teachers with a great track record of retention. In
some cases, the same teacher is also teaching at another site and
his/her class there is doing well at that site. Both of these things
show that attrition is not likely a result of instructional issues. 

 

When we see this contraction of a site with mid-semester attrition, we
can sometimes predict that at another site we will experience a boom in
registration the next semester. It depends on if it is more "stopover"
(with learners leaving the area entirely) or just "shift" (learners
relocating within the area). If it is the latter, learners who leave one
site mid-semester will turn up to register the next semester at another
site. 

 

Suzi Monti 

ESOL Curriculum Developer and Instructional Specialist 
The Community College of Baltimore County 
Center for Adult and Family Literacy 
7200 Sollers Point Road E102
Baltimore, MD 21222 

(410) 285-9476   

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Tuesday April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

	Hi Ella,

	 

	Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding
of what is going on.

	 

	I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking
consistency of attendance.

	 

	Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days
and most data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and
persistence patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners
who "stop out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a
while and coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time
possible that learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the
attended hours by total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week
for a class scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL
students showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible
time learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so
because this measure reflects student motivation to attend.

	 

	Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a
lot about why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can
inform you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs
for them.

	 

	
________________________________

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
	Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
	To: assessment at nifl.gov
	Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

	Dear Collegues:
	
	Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our
program to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our
program. We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program,
average hours attended data to check the depth of engagement of
students, and numbers of students throught he door versus number
completeing enrollment to help us improve retention in the crucial
orientation period of classes.
	
	We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it
very easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare
statistics from one year to another so we know how we are doing in
comparison to previous years. By tracking information collected on
attendance, educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments,
we have been able to improve all of these efforts. 
	
	Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it
possible to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has
tested, progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can
organize that information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site,
which allows us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and
assign responsibility for improvement where needed.
	
	I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over
time not just total hours attended. I think this might give a better
picture of the progress to be expected than the total time attended
does. I would also like to understand more about how I can use all of
the ABLELink data collected to improve my programs overall
effectiveness.
	
	Respectfully submitted by,
	Ella Bogard
	
	Ella Bogard, Executive Director
	Franklinton Learning Center
	1003 West Town Street
	Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438
	
	Phone: (614) 221-9151
	Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Apr 20 14:41:57 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 14:41:57 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 790]  Post from Forrest Chisman
In-Reply-To: <000701c78373$ef1bc240$92e7f804@hppav>
Message-ID: <04e401c7837b$93d319d0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi folks,
 
Just a quick note to say that the email below that was just posted is
from Forrest Chisman, of CAAL - it is not signed below.
 
Thanks,
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of forrest
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2007 1:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 786] Re: Using Data
 
Dan, you have raised some critically important questions. NRS data
indicates that only about 36% of ESL students "complete a level" each
year. This is cause for concern, because the same data show that the
vast majority of ESL students are at the lowest levels of proficiency
and have low levels of education in their native countries. However, the
NRS data is not definitive for a number of reasons -- such as low rates
of re-test in many programs, the use of tests that do not measure the
full range of English language skills, and the fact that data is
reported only for a single year (students may persist in programs long
enough to achieve much larger learning gains).
 
As a first step toward finding out more about the learning gains and
persistence of ESL students, Jodi Crandall and I worked with the faculty
and staff at 5 highly regarded community college programs to use student
record data as a means of determining both learning gains and
persistence rates. At several of the colleges we were able to track the
learning gains and persistence of students for as long as seven years.
At most of the colleges, the measures of learning gains used was
completion of one or more additional levels AS THE COLLEGE DEFINED THE
LEVELS. Both the definition of levels and the standards of completion
took account of test scores (of the sort reported to the NRS), but they
also took account of other measures of student achievement (including
proficiency in all core ESL skills). 
 
Needless to say, our findings were fairly complex and cannot be
adequately set forth here. In summary, however, we found that at most
30% of students persist for 2-3 college terms and complete more than 2-3
levels over a seven year period. More than 40-50% of students do not
complete a level or complete only a single level at any time over a
seven year period. Although we could not be sure, it appears that low
level students were more likely to persist than higher level students.
About 10-15% of adult education ESL students enrolled in credit ESL at
these colleges, and the number who eventually enrolled in academic
credit courses was in the single digits. 
 
We also found that all the colleges we examined employ strategies that
significantly improve the rate of learning gains and retention. Among
these were high intensity/managed enrollment classes (more than 3-6
hours per week), strategies to encourage learning outside the classroom,
appropriate uses of echnology for instruction, co-enrollment of adult
education ESL students in vocational programs taught in English,
curricular designs that insure instruction is relevant to the interests
of students (such as Frerian approaches), enriched
guidance/counseling/support services, setting high expectations, and
VESL programs. Unfortunately, only small numbers of students have access
to most of these strategies at most colleges, because they are far more
expensive on a per student basis than is standard ESL instruction.
Conversely, it appears that large numbers of students would like to make
the committment to enhanced programs, if they were available. 
 
The results of our research were published by the Council for the
Advancement of Adult Literacy (under the auspices of which the research
was conducted) in February as the report " Passing the Torch:Strategies
for Innovation in Community College ESL." This is available at the CAAL
website: www.caalusa.org. CAAL will be publishing more of the data we
gathered later this spring. 
 
Among the "take away" messages we gathered from our work were: 1) The
use of longitudinal (multi-year) data and holistic assessments of
learning gains are essential for understanding and improving the
effectiveness of ESL programs. In many programs it is feasible to gather
and use longitudinal data in this way, but few programs do so due to a
variety of perceived constraints and/or a lack of support for data
analysis by their host institutions. 2) Research can be very helpful in
program improvement, but it requires a substantial committment on the
part of programs to gather relevant data and tease out its lessons on an
on-going basis. Programs should receive far more support for this. 3) It
is posible to greatly improve ESL program outcomes using a variety of
strategies, but these require a larger investment in instruction per
student -- an investment that we believe is well worth the cost. 4)
Numbers do not speak for themselves. For example, low rates of learning
gains must be read in the context of the goals that both students and
programs set for ESL instruction. It may be that some portion of
students legitimately wish to use ESL programs as an initial platform to
learn SOME English, and that their learning gains after separating from
programs are substantial. Too little is known about this. Conversely, we
found that the more students learn, the more ambitious their learning
goals become. Because numbers do not speak for themselves, it is all the
more important for individual programs and state agencies to invest in
the use of research for program improvement and to ACTUALLY USE IT for
therse purposes. Too often over-burdened ESL faculty and staff consider
research an after-thought. They need the time, encouragement, resources,
and training to development "continuous program improvement" models to
their work.                                    
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From tborge at bhcc.mass.edu  Fri Apr 20 14:55:04 2007
From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu (Borge, Toni)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 14:55:04 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 791] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement
In-Reply-To: <11100F3DEA99F24CB3E87E45900040DF779BD8@cwf-exchange.Commonweal-Foundation.org>
Message-ID: <25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59EE2B60@mercury.bhcc.dom>

Yes, when parents move so do their children.  The public school system
here has a very low graduation rate and a big factor is the number of
students who haven't dropped out but have moved out. And not surprising,
their performance on meeting standards is not high no matter how hard
the teachers in the system work to address the needs of the students.

Toni

 

Toni F. Borge

Adult Education & Transitions Program Director

Bunker Hill Community College

Chelsea Campus

175 Hawthorne Street

Chelsea, MA  02150

Phone: 617-228-2108   *  Fax:617-228-2106

E-mail: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu

"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that
matter." Martin Luther King Jr.

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Fred Lowenbach
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 5:15 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 749] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hopefully everyone participating in this discussion regarding adult
literacy is aware that almost everything you are saying applies to the
results for students in school as well.  Coming from a public school
background you could always see the effect that high mobility rates had
on overall student results.  Schools with those highest rates almost
always struggled to meet standard on state measures connected to NCLB.
This was the case with overall populations as well as various subgroups
that were tested.  The same applies to student retention, or for that
matter attendance.  As a rule, student who attended regularly achieved
much higher grades than students whose attendance was far less
consistent.  This then followed suit with results on standardized
testing and ultimately on graduation rates.

 

The entire education community, whether it is involved with adult
literacy, or the traditional K-12 curriculum is faced with the same
thing.  The key to increasing literacy and to closing achievement gaps
starts with getting and retaining students.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 3:33 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 748] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Sandy,

 

A few years ago I did a study on adult ESL literacy students that
focused primarily on instruction.  But we also looked at retention.  We
found that the proportion of time an ESL literacy student attended
(measure by hours attended over total hours class was scheduled) had a
positive effect on oral English skills and reading comprehension, all
else being equal (using a complex statistical model).

 

The possible reasons for this effect are intriguing and need more
research.  Because this measure showed an effect regardless of how many
hours the student actually attended (or how many hours per week a
student attended), my interpretation is that this measure is a measure
of motivation (although I have no data or other information to check
this).  In other words, the student who continues to attend over time,
despite all of the other competing demands on time, is one that is more
motivated.  This motivation helps learning.  

 

I think if true, it does have implications for structuring instructional
segments.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Sandy Strunk
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:38 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 736] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Larry,

Could you tell us more about the ESL research on percentage of possible
time attended? This is a new idea to me. Does it reflect greater
intensity as opposed to lesser intensity for a longer duration - or do
you think something else is going on? If your research is correct, there
are certainly implications for how we structure instructional segments. 

 

Sandy Strunk

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 5:31 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 735] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

 

Hi Ella,

 

Disaggregating by class can be very effective to understanding of what
is going on.

 

I wanted to comment on your last remark about tracking consistency of
attendance.

 

Attendance and persistence are a very popular topics these days and most
data systems allow for tracking of student attendance and persistence
patterns.  One thing you might consider looking at learners who "stop
out" -- have sporadic attendance patterns, attending for a while and
coming back later. Another measure is the percent of time possible that
learners attend.  You compute this by dividing the attended hours by
total possible (e.g., learner attends 8 hours a week for a class
scheduled 10 hours a week=80%).  Some research I did on ESL students
showed that those who attended a higher proportion of possible time
learned more, independent of total hours.  I think this is so because
this measure reflects student motivation to attend.

 

Identifying and studying "stop out" learners might tell you a lot about
why these type of students don't attend more regularly and can inform
you of needs, which could help in designing classes and programs for
them.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of EllaBogard at cs.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2007 4:47 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 732] Re: Using Data for Program Improvement

Dear Collegues:

Here at Franklinton Learning Center, we use data everyday in our program
to help us track and improve the end results coming out of our program.
We use enrollment data to check the reach of our program, average hours
attended data to check the depth of engagement of students, and numbers
of students throught he door versus number completeing enrollment to
help us improve retention in the crucial orientation period of classes.

We have a program called ABLELink here in Ohio that has made it very
easy to track some areas. It has also allowedus to compare statistics
from one year to another so we know how we are doing in comparison to
previous years. By tracking information collected on attendance,
educational gain, hours of engagement and accomplishments, we have been
able to improve all of these efforts. 

Tracking and constantly checking this data is what has made it possible
to improve. We can easily pull up reports on testing, who has tested,
progress made, who hasn't tested, attendance, etc. We can organize that
information by class, by teacher, by program, or by site, which allows
us to compare effectiveness of programs and staff and assign
responsibility for improvement where needed.

I would like to be able to track consistency of attendance over time not
just total hours attended. I think this might give a better picture of
the progress to be expected than the total time attended does. I would
also like to understand more about how I can use all of the ABLELink
data collected to improve my programs overall effectiveness.

Respectfully submitted by,
Ella Bogard

Ella Bogard, Executive Director
Franklinton Learning Center
1003 West Town Street
Columbus, Ohio 43222-1438

Phone: (614) 221-9151
Fax: (614) 221-9131

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From alcdgg at langate.gsu.edu  Tue Apr 17 09:31:51 2007
From: alcdgg at langate.gsu.edu (Daphne Greenberg)
Date: Tue, 17 Apr 2007 09:31:51 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 792]  New Adult Literacy Journal: Cross Post
Message-ID: <46249407020000310001E764@mailsrv4.gsu.edu>

List colleagues,

If you are a subscriber to multiple NIFL lists, please excuse the cross
posting of this message. On behalf of Don Harting, the editor of the
Adult Basic Education and Literacy Journal, I would like to announce the
following:

New Literacy Journal Launched 

The first issue of the Adult Basic Education and Literacy Journal,
copublished by the Commission on Adult Basic Education (COABE) and
ProLiteracy America, was launched in March. 
The journal?s predecessor, Adult Basic Education, was started by COABE
in 1977. The new journal will continue to carry research articles that
are peer reviewed using a double blind protocol that conceals reviewers?
identities from authors, and vice versa.
The journal will also include the following shorter features written
especially for practitioners:
?   Practitioner Perspective offers first-person narratives by
people who?ve solved problems that instructors or program directors
often encounter. The emphasis is on learnings that can be used by other
practitioners.
?   Web Scan, edited by David Rosen, offers a roundup of the most
useful instructional and management resources found on the Internet.
?   Research Digest, edited by Cristine Smith, offers a quick recap
of published and ongoing research projects around the country, with
contact information so interested readers can find out more.
?   Resource Reviews, edited by Daphne Greenberg, help practitioners
and researchers stay abreast of the latest offerings from educational
publishers.
?   Occasional essays, called Viewpoint, that analyze trends and
forces at work in the field. The March issue carries an essay on health
literacy by Rima Rudd. The July issue will carry an essay on the
national research agenda by John Comings.

The journal is published three times per year. To subscribe, or to view
author guidelines, visit www.coabe.org. For more information, send an
e-mail to journaleditor at literacyprogram.org.

Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

From kabeall at comcast.net  Fri Apr 20 12:33:42 2007
From: kabeall at comcast.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2007 12:33:42 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 793]  Effective Transitions in Adult Education
Message-ID: <004c01c78369$ab57c810$ab8a11ac@your4105e587b6>

Join us for two days of workshops on Effective Transitions in Adult
Education, November 8-9, 2007 in Providence, RI.  Our keynote speaker, Dr.
JoAnn Crandall, will kick off the event with a discussion of transition for
English language learners.  For more details, 
SEE  http://www.collegetransition.org/novconference.html 

 

Cynthia Zafft, Director
National College Transition Network at World Education
nctn at worlded.org

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Apr 23 07:50:04 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 23 Apr 2007 07:50:04 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 794]  Discussion Thanks!!
Message-ID: <000001c7859d$890f9d10$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Dear Colleagues,
 
I would like to thank our Guest Panelists from last week's discussion:
 
Larry Condelli   
Joanie Rethlake  
Rosemary Matt  
Ajit Gopalakrishnan 
Donna Cornellier   
Toni Borge   
Luanne Teller    
Karen Mundie    
Sandy Strunk    
 
and subscribers for making the conversation rich and for sharing
insightful experiences.  Over the next few days I will be working on
preparing the discussion in user-friendly format and I will send email
out when it is ready for your use.
 
Thanks to all again for such a great discussion last week.  
 
Marie
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 <http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
 <http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/>
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From pjcross at okcps.org  Wed Apr 25 13:19:19 2007
From: pjcross at okcps.org (Cross, Patricia J.)
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 12:19:19 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 795] Re: Discussion Thanks!!
References: <000001c7859d$890f9d10$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <A86CC8A1353C3C4694A36C6FFAA999671B2591@906-be000-e01.staff.oc.ps>

Thanks, Marie.  
pjcross at okcps.org

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Mon 4/23/2007 6:50 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 794] Discussion Thanks!!

Dear Colleagues,
 
I would like to thank our Guest Panelists from last week's discussion:
 
Larry Condelli   
Joanie Rethlake  
Rosemary Matt  
Ajit Gopalakrishnan 
Donna Cornellier   
Toni Borge   
Luanne Teller    
Karen Mundie    
Sandy Strunk    
 
and subscribers for making the conversation rich and for sharing insightful experiences.  Over the next few days I will be working on preparing the discussion in user-friendly format and I will send email out when it is ready for your use.
 
Thanks to all again for such a great discussion last week.  
 
Marie
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment <http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ <http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/> 
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Apr 25 13:53:03 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 13:53:03 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 796]  FW: Free Workshop on Adult Literacy
Message-ID: <01e001c78762$933d2070$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

FREE ONE DAY WORKSHOP ON ADULT  LITERACY
EDUCATION IN INDUSTRIALIZED NATIONS

Are you overwhelmed by the vast amount of information about adult
literacy education available in thousands of reports in dozens of online
internet web sites, portals and wikis, shelves of new books from many
publishers, numerous government projects, and a plethora of fat, heavy
duty research reports? As an administrator, teacher, tutor, or
researcher in adult literacy do you find that you do not have the time
to wade through this sea of information to find what is relevant to your
teaching and other program needs?

GRAB A GLOBAL GRASP OF ADULT BASIC SKILLS EDUCATION TRENDS

If you find yourself drowning in this ocean of information, this one
day, six hour workshop is for you! In it you will learn about critically
important developments in adult literacy education going on in
Australia, Canada, Ireland, Great Britain, New Zealand, and the United
States.

Using humor, extensive illustrations, and simplified statistical
information, this workshop discusses projects and research in five areas
of activity that can be identified in these industrialized nations,
including activities to

1.Determine how many adults need and want basic skills education, i.e.,
determining the scale of need for adult literacy education.

2. Determine the extent of and activities to increase the participation
of adults in language, literacy, and numeracy (LLN) education.

3. Understand the system of provision, i.e., finding out what is going
on in a diversity of programs.

4. Improve the quality of provision, i.e., helping programs get better
at what they do.

5. Improve the accountability of provision, including how to show the
returns to investments in adult basic skills education.

This workshop presentation is FREE, sponsors pay only travel costs. The
workshop will be available from July 1, 2007. To arrange for the
workshop to be presented in your area contact Tom Sticht,
tsticht at aznet.net.

About Tom Sticht:
Tom Sticht is recognized internationally for his work on the education
and training of under-educated youth and adults. He holds a Ph.D in
psychology from the University of Arizona and has taught at numerous
universities, including the Harvard Graduate School of Education, the
University of British Columbia, and the U. S. Naval Postgraduate School.
He has published over 170 books and articles on the education of
under-educated youth and adults. Dr. Sticht has served on the Secretary
of Labor's Commission on Achieving Necessary Skills (SCANS); the
National Commission on Working Women; and he chaired the California
Workforce Literacy Task Force. Earlier he was Associate Director of the
U. S. National Institute of Education, President, Applied Behavioral &
Cognitive Sciences, Inc. and Project Coordinator for the San Diego
Consortium for Workforce Education & Lifelong Learning. Articles on Dr.
Sticht's work have appeared in newspapers and magazines in several
countries including the New York Times, the Washington Post, the Boston
Globe, the London Times, the New Zealand Herald, USA Today, and the Wall
Street Journal. In 1994, Dr. Sticht was the first adult literacy
specialist elected to the Reading Hall of Fame in the United States and
in 2003 he was awarded UNESCO's Mahatma Gandhi medal.

From barguedas at sfccnm.edu  Wed Apr 25 16:18:26 2007
From: barguedas at sfccnm.edu (Barbara Arguedas)
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 14:18:26 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 797] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <000701c78373$ef1bc240$92e7f804@hppav>
Message-ID: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C44A@ex01.sfcc.edu>

I have tried to access the publication "Passing the Torch" but keep
getting a network error.  Does anyone know how to report the error?  I
have tried going to the caalusa.org website but no contact information
is listed.  Thanks.

 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of forrest
Sent: Friday, April 20, 2007 11:47 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 786] Re: Using Data

 

Dan, you have raised some critically important questions. NRS data
indicates that only about 36% of ESL students "complete a level" each
year. This is cause for concern, because the same data show that the
vast majority of ESL students are at the lowest levels of proficiency
and have low levels of education in their native countries. However, the
NRS data is not definitive for a number of reasons -- such as low rates
of re-test in many programs, the use of tests that do not measure the
full range of English language skills, and the fact that data is
reported only for a single year (students may persist in programs long
enough to achieve much larger learning gains).

 

As a first step toward finding out more about the learning gains and
persistence of ESL students, Jodi Crandall and I worked with the faculty
and staff at 5 highly regarded community college programs to use student
record data as a means of determining both learning gains and
persistence rates. At several of the colleges we were able to track the
learning gains and persistence of students for as long as seven years.
At most of the colleges, the measures of learning gains used was
completion of one or more additional levels AS THE COLLEGE DEFINED THE
LEVELS. Both the definition of levels and the standards of completion
took account of test scores (of the sort reported to the NRS), but they
also took account of other measures of student achievement (including
proficiency in all core ESL skills). 

 

Needless to say, our findings were fairly complex and cannot be
adequately set forth here. In summary, however, we found that at most
30% of students persist for 2-3 college terms and complete more than 2-3
levels over a seven year period. More than 40-50% of students do not
complete a level or complete only a single level at any time over a
seven year period. Although we could not be sure, it appears that low
level students were more likely to persist than higher level students.
About 10-15% of adult education ESL students enrolled in credit ESL at
these colleges, and the number who eventually enrolled in academic
credit courses was in the single digits. 

 

We also found that all the colleges we examined employ strategies that
significantly improve the rate of learning gains and retention. Among
these were high intensity/managed enrollment classes (more than 3-6
hours per week), strategies to encourage learning outside the classroom,
appropriate uses of echnology for instruction, co-enrollment of adult
education ESL students in vocational programs taught in English,
curricular designs that insure instruction is relevant to the interests
of students (such as Frerian approaches), enriched
guidance/counseling/support services, setting high expectations, and
VESL programs. Unfortunately, only small numbers of students have access
to most of these strategies at most colleges, because they are far more
expensive on a per student basis than is standard ESL instruction.
Conversely, it appears that large numbers of students would like to make
the committment to enhanced programs, if they were available. 

 

The results of our research were published by the Council for the
Advancement of Adult Literacy (under the auspices of which the research
was conducted) in February as the report " Passing the Torch:Strategies
for Innovation in Community College ESL." This is available at the CAAL
website: www.caalusa.org. CAAL will be publishing more of the data we
gathered later this spring. 

 

Among the "take away" messages we gathered from our work were: 1) The
use of longitudinal (multi-year) data and holistic assessments of
learning gains are essential for understanding and improving the
effectiveness of ESL programs. In many programs it is feasible to gather
and use longitudinal data in this way, but few programs do so due to a
variety of perceived constraints and/or a lack of support for data
analysis by their host institutions. 2) Research can be very helpful in
program improvement, but it requires a substantial committment on the
part of programs to gather relevant data and tease out its lessons on an
on-going basis. Programs should receive far more support for this. 3) It
is posible to greatly improve ESL program outcomes using a variety of
strategies, but these require a larger investment in instruction per
student -- an investment that we believe is well worth the cost. 4)
Numbers do not speak for themselves. For example, low rates of learning
gains must be read in the context of the goals that both students and
programs set for ESL instruction. It may be that some portion of
students legitimately wish to use ESL programs as an initial platform to
learn SOME English, and that their learning gains after separating from
programs are substantial. Too little is known about this. Conversely, we
found that the more students learn, the more ambitious their learning
goals become. Because numbers do not speak for themselves, it is all the
more important for individual programs and state agencies to invest in
the use of research for program improvement and to ACTUALLY USE IT for
therse purposes. Too often over-burdened ESL faculty and staff consider
research an after-thought. They need the time, encouragement, resources,
and training to development "continuous program improvement" models to
their work.                                    

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From lwilkins at mills.edu  Wed Apr 25 21:48:49 2007
From: lwilkins at mills.edu (Lynne Wilkins)
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2007 17:48:49 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 798]  esl oral assessment
Message-ID: <46300501.9020407@mills.edu>

Dear Group,

Can anyone recommend a standardized ESL focused oral assessment that 
includes speaking in addition to listening?

Thanks in advance,
Lynne Wilkins

-- 
Lynne Bierer Wilkins
The English Center (ECIW)
Director, Corporate Training for Industry
Associate Director for Programs 
(510) 430-2285; lwilkins at mills.edu
www.eciw.org

From crandall at umbc.edu  Thu Apr 26 00:06:30 2007
From: crandall at umbc.edu (JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall)
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 00:06:30 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Assessment 799] Re: Using Data
In-Reply-To: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C44A@ex01.sfcc.edu>
References: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C44A@ex01.sfcc.edu>
Message-ID: <1596.218.144.201.126.1177560390.squirrel@webmail.umbc.edu>

Dear Barbara,

I just tried the site and had no difficulty.

Here is the website for the Executive Summary:
http://www.caalusa.org/eslexecsummary.pdf

The website for the full publication is:
http://www.caalusa.org/eslpassingtorch226.pdf

Try these again.  If you still have difficulty, you may want to contact
Gail Spangenberg, the Executive Director of the Council for Advancement of
Adult Literacy at
gspangenberg at caalusa.org

Hope this helps.

Jodi Crandall (one of the authors of the report)

> I have tried to access the publication "Passing the Torch" but keep
> getting a network error.  Does anyone know how to report the error?  I
> have tried going to the caalusa.org website but no contact information
> is listed.  Thanks.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of forrest
> Sent: Friday, April 20, 2007 11:47 AM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 786] Re: Using Data
>
>
>
> Dan, you have raised some critically important questions. NRS data
> indicates that only about 36% of ESL students "complete a level" each
> year. This is cause for concern, because the same data show that the
> vast majority of ESL students are at the lowest levels of proficiency
> and have low levels of education in their native countries. However, the
> NRS data is not definitive for a number of reasons -- such as low rates
> of re-test in many programs, the use of tests that do not measure the
> full range of English language skills, and the fact that data is
> reported only for a single year (students may persist in programs long
> enough to achieve much larger learning gains).
>
>
>
> As a first step toward finding out more about the learning gains and
> persistence of ESL students, Jodi Crandall and I worked with the faculty
> and staff at 5 highly regarded community college programs to use student
> record data as a means of determining both learning gains and
> persistence rates. At several of the colleges we were able to track the
> learning gains and persistence of students for as long as seven years.
> At most of the colleges, the measures of learning gains used was
> completion of one or more additional levels AS THE COLLEGE DEFINED THE
> LEVELS. Both the definition of levels and the standards of completion
> took account of test scores (of the sort reported to the NRS), but they
> also took account of other measures of student achievement (including
> proficiency in all core ESL skills).
>
>
>
> Needless to say, our findings were fairly complex and cannot be
> adequately set forth here. In summary, however, we found that at most
> 30% of students persist for 2-3 college terms and complete more than 2-3
> levels over a seven year period. More than 40-50% of students do not
> complete a level or complete only a single level at any time over a
> seven year period. Although we could not be sure, it appears that low
> level students were more likely to persist than higher level students.
> About 10-15% of adult education ESL students enrolled in credit ESL at
> these colleges, and the number who eventually enrolled in academic
> credit courses was in the single digits.
>
>
>
> We also found that all the colleges we examined employ strategies that
> significantly improve the rate of learning gains and retention. Among
> these were high intensity/managed enrollment classes (more than 3-6
> hours per week), strategies to encourage learning outside the classroom,
> appropriate uses of echnology for instruction, co-enrollment of adult
> education ESL students in vocational programs taught in English,
> curricular designs that insure instruction is relevant to the interests
> of students (such as Frerian approaches), enriched
> guidance/counseling/support services, setting high expectations, and
> VESL programs. Unfortunately, only small numbers of students have access
> to most of these strategies at most colleges, because they are far more
> expensive on a per student basis than is standard ESL instruction.
> Conversely, it appears that large numbers of students would like to make
> the committment to enhanced programs, if they were available.
>
>
>
> The results of our research were published by the Council for the
> Advancement of Adult Literacy (under the auspices of which the research
> was conducted) in February as the report " Passing the Torch:Strategies
> for Innovation in Community College ESL." This is available at the CAAL
> website: www.caalusa.org. CAAL will be publishing more of the data we
> gathered later this spring.
>
>
>
> Among the "take away" messages we gathered from our work were: 1) The
> use of longitudinal (multi-year) data and holistic assessments of
> learning gains are essential for understanding and improving the
> effectiveness of ESL programs. In many programs it is feasible to gather
> and use longitudinal data in this way, but few programs do so due to a
> variety of perceived constraints and/or a lack of support for data
> analysis by their host institutions. 2) Research can be very helpful in
> program improvement, but it requires a substantial committment on the
> part of programs to gather relevant data and tease out its lessons on an
> on-going basis. Programs should receive far more support for this. 3) It
> is posible to greatly improve ESL program outcomes using a variety of
> strategies, but these require a larger investment in instruction per
> student -- an investment that we believe is well worth the cost. 4)
> Numbers do not speak for themselves. For example, low rates of learning
> gains must be read in the context of the goals that both students and
> programs set for ESL instruction. It may be that some portion of
> students legitimately wish to use ESL programs as an initial platform to
> learn SOME English, and that their learning gains after separating from
> programs are substantial. Too little is known about this. Conversely, we
> found that the more students learn, the more ambitious their learning
> goals become. Because numbers do not speak for themselves, it is all the
> more important for individual programs and state agencies to invest in
> the use of research for program improvement and to ACTUALLY USE IT for
> therse purposes. Too often over-burdened ESL faculty and staff consider
> research an after-thought. They need the time, encouragement, resources,
> and training to development "continuous program improvement" models to
> their work.
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>

-- 
JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Professor, Education Department
Director, Ph.D. Program in Language, Literacy & Culture
Coordinator, Peace Corps Master's International Program in ESOL/Bilingual
Education
University of Maryland, Baltimore County (UMBC)
1000 Hilltop Circle, Baltimore, MD 21250
ph:    410-455-2313/2376  fax:   410-455-8947/1880
email: crandall at umbc.edu
www.umbc.edu/llc/
www.umbc.edu/esol/
www.umbc.edu/esol/peacecorps.html

From sdscanlon at adelphia.net  Thu Apr 26 06:51:59 2007
From: sdscanlon at adelphia.net (Sandy Scanlon)
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 06:51:59 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 800] Re: Using Data
References: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C44A@ex01.sfcc.edu>
Message-ID: <001401c787f0$ea147ae0$6401a8c0@userrhw2qmgdrx>

I accessed the report by keying the report title into Google.
Sandy 
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Barbara Arguedas 
  To: The Assessment Discussion List 
  Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2007 4:18 PM
  Subject: [Assessment 797] Re: Using Data

  I have tried to access the publication "Passing the Torch" but keep getting a network error.  Does anyone know how to report the error?  I have tried going to the caalusa.org website but no contact information is listed.  Thanks.

  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of forrest
  Sent: Friday, April 20, 2007 11:47 AM
  To: assessment at nifl.gov
  Subject: [Assessment 786] Re: Using Data

  Dan, you have raised some critically important questions. NRS data indicates that only about 36% of ESL students "complete a level" each year. This is cause for concern, because the same data show that the vast majority of ESL students are at the lowest levels of proficiency and have low levels of education in their native countries. However, the NRS data is not definitive for a number of reasons -- such as low rates of re-test in many programs, the use of tests that do not measure the full range of English language skills, and the fact that data is reported only for a single year (students may persist in programs long enough to achieve much larger learning gains).

  As a first step toward finding out more about the learning gains and persistence of ESL students, Jodi Crandall and I worked with the faculty and staff at 5 highly regarded community college programs to use student record data as a means of determining both learning gains and persistence rates. At several of the colleges we were able to track the learning gains and persistence of students for as long as seven years. At most of the colleges, the measures of learning gains used was completion of one or more additional levels AS THE COLLEGE DEFINED THE LEVELS. Both the definition of levels and the standards of completion took account of test scores (of the sort reported to the NRS), but they also took account of other measures of student achievement (including proficiency in all core ESL skills). 

  Needless to say, our findings were fairly complex and cannot be adequately set forth here. In summary, however, we found that at most 30% of students persist for 2-3 college terms and complete more than 2-3 levels over a seven year period. More than 40-50% of students do not complete a level or complete only a single level at any time over a seven year period. Although we could not be sure, it appears that low level students were more likely to persist than higher level students. About 10-15% of adult education ESL students enrolled in credit ESL at these colleges, and the number who eventually enrolled in academic credit courses was in the single digits. 

  We also found that all the colleges we examined employ strategies that significantly improve the rate of learning gains and retention. Among these were high intensity/managed enrollment classes (more than 3-6 hours per week), strategies to encourage learning outside the classroom, appropriate uses of echnology for instruction, co-enrollment of adult education ESL students in vocational programs taught in English, curricular designs that insure instruction is relevant to the interests of students (such as Frerian approaches), enriched guidance/counseling/support services, setting high expectations, and VESL programs. Unfortunately, only small numbers of students have access to most of these strategies at most colleges, because they are far more expensive on a per student basis than is standard ESL instruction. Conversely, it appears that large numbers of students would like to make the committment to enhanced programs, if they were available. 

  The results of our research were published by the Council for the Advancement of Adult Literacy (under the auspices of which the research was conducted) in February as the report " Passing the Torch:Strategies for Innovation in Community College ESL." This is available at the CAAL website: www.caalusa.org. CAAL will be publishing more of the data we gathered later this spring. 

  Among the "take away" messages we gathered from our work were: 1) The use of longitudinal (multi-year) data and holistic assessments of learning gains are essential for understanding and improving the effectiveness of ESL programs. In many programs it is feasible to gather and use longitudinal data in this way, but few programs do so due to a variety of perceived constraints and/or a lack of support for data analysis by their host institutions. 2) Research can be very helpful in program improvement, but it requires a substantial committment on the part of programs to gather relevant data and tease out its lessons on an on-going basis. Programs should receive far more support for this. 3) It is posible to greatly improve ESL program outcomes using a variety of strategies, but these require a larger investment in instruction per student -- an investment that we believe is well worth the cost. 4) Numbers do not speak for themselves. For example, low rates of learning gains must be read in the context of the goals that both students and programs set for ESL instruction. It may be that some portion of students legitimately wish to use ESL programs as an initial platform to learn SOME English, and that their learning gains after separating from programs are substantial. Too little is known about this. Conversely, we found that the more students learn, the more ambitious their learning goals become. Because numbers do not speak for themselves, it is all the more important for individual programs and state agencies to invest in the use of research for program improvement and to ACTUALLY USE IT for therse purposes. Too often over-burdened ESL faculty and staff consider research an after-thought. They need the time, encouragement, resources, and training to development "continuous program improvement" models to their work.                                    

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  -------------------------------
  National Institute for Literacy
  Assessment mailing list
  Assessment at nifl.gov
  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
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From caalusa at earthlink.net  Thu Apr 26 07:11:11 2007
From: caalusa at earthlink.net (gspangenberg@caalusa.org)
Date: Thu, 26 Apr 2007 07:11:11 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [Assessment 801]  Accessing Passing the Torch CAAL website
Message-ID: <19508759.1177585871772.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Barbara and others --

Every test we've done, and communications from a wide range of people, indicate that the document can be accessed without trouble from our website -- for both Mac and PC. But 2-3 people have reported that they had difficulty on the first try (it is a very large document) and that only on the second attempt did it "take" (because a portion of the document had already moved to their computers. I am in the process of having the site rechecked to see if some problem has crept in that we're not aware of or if a certain computer capacity is needed to receive the download. But in the meantime, a bound copy of the publication can be ordered at a nominal cost by e-mailing bheitner at caalusa.org for ordering and payment instructions. Sorry for any inconvenience.

Gail Spangenberg 
Manager, National Commission on Adult Literacy
President, Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Floor
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2363
http:www.caalusa.org

-----Original Message-----
>From: "JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall" <crandall at umbc.edu>
>Sent: Apr 26, 2007 12:06 AM
>To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
>Subject: [Assessment 799] Re: Using Data
>
>Dear Barbara,
>
>I just tried the site and had no difficulty.
>
>Here is the website for the Executive Summary:
>http://www.caalusa.org/eslexecsummary.pdf
>
>The website for the full publication is:
>http://www.caalusa.org/eslpassingtorch226.pdf
>
>Try these again.  If you still have difficulty, you may want to contact
>Gail Spangenberg, the Executive Director of the Council for Advancement of
>Adult Literacy at
>gspangenberg at caalusa.org
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>Jodi Crandall (one of the authors of the report)
>
>
>> I have tried to access the publication "Passing the Torch" but keep
>> getting a network error.  Does anyone know how to report the error?  I
>> have tried going to the caalusa.org website but no contact information
>> is listed.  Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
>> On Behalf Of forrest
>> Sent: Friday, April 20, 2007 11:47 AM
>> To: assessment at nifl.gov
>> Subject: [Assessment 786] Re: Using Data
>>
>>
>>
>> Dan, you have raised some critically important questions. NRS data
>> indicates that only about 36% of ESL students "complete a level" each
>> year. This is cause for concern, because the same data show that the
>> vast majority of ESL students are at the lowest levels of proficiency
>> and have low levels of education in their native countries. However, the
>> NRS data is not definitive for a number of reasons -- such as low rates
>> of re-test in many programs, the use of tests that do not measure the
>> full range of English language skills, and the fact that data is
>> reported only for a single year (students may persist in programs long
>> enough to achieve much larger learning gains).
>>
>>
>>
>> As a first step toward finding out more about the learning gains and
>> persistence of ESL students, Jodi Crandall and I worked with the faculty
>> and staff at 5 highly regarded community college programs to use student
>> record data as a means of determining both learning gains and
>> persistence rates. At several of the colleges we were able to track the
>> learning gains and persistence of students for as long as seven years.
>> At most of the colleges, the measures of learning gains used was
>> completion of one or more additional levels AS THE COLLEGE DEFINED THE
>> LEVELS. Both the definition of levels and the standards of completion
>> took account of test scores (of the sort reported to the NRS), but they
>> also took account of other measures of student achievement (including
>> proficiency in all core ESL skills).
>>
>>
>>
>> Needless to say, our findings were fairly complex and cannot be
>> adequately set forth here. In summary, however, we found that at most
>> 30% of students persist for 2-3 college terms and complete more than 2-3
>> levels over a seven year period. More than 40-50% of students do not
>> complete a level or complete only a single level at any time over a
>> seven year period. Although we could not be sure, it appears that low
>> level students were more likely to persist than higher level students.
>> About 10-15% of adult education ESL students enrolled in credit ESL at
>> these colleges, and the number who eventually enrolled in academic
>> credit courses was in the single digits.
>>
>>
>>
>> We also found that all the colleges we examined employ strategies that
>> significantly improve the rate of learning gains and retention. Among
>> these were high intensity/managed enrollment classes (more than 3-6
>> hours per week), strategies to encourage learning outside the classroom,
>> appropriate uses of echnology for instruction, co-enrollment of adult
>> education ESL students in vocational programs taught in English,
>> curricular designs that insure instruction is relevant to the interests
>> of students (such as Frerian approaches), enriched
>> guidance/counseling/support services, setting high expectations, and
>> VESL programs. Unfortunately, only small numbers of students have access
>> to most of these strategies at most colleges, because they are far more
>> expensive on a per student basis than is standard ESL instruction.
>> Conversely, it appears that large numbers of students would like to make
>> the committment to enhanced programs, if they were available.
>>
>>
>>
>> The results of our research were published by the Council for the
>> Advancement of Adult Literacy (under the auspices of which the research
>> was conducted) in February as the report " Passing the Torch:Strategies
>> for Innovation in Community College ESL." This is available at the CAAL
>> website: www.caalusa.org. CAAL will be publishing more of the data we
>> gathered later this spring.
>>
>>
>>
>> Among the "take away" messages we gathered from our work were: 1) The
>> use of longitudinal (multi-year) data and holistic assessments of
>> learning gains are essential for understanding and improving the
>> effectiveness of ESL programs. In many programs it is feasible to gather
>> and use longitudinal data in this way, but few programs do so due to a
>> variety of perceived constraints and/or a lack of support for data
>> analysis by their host institutions. 2) Research can be very helpful in
>> program improvement, but it requires a substantial committment on the
>> part of programs to gather relevant data and tease out its lessons on an
>> on-going basis. Programs should receive far more support for this. 3) It
>> is posible to greatly improve ESL program outcomes using a variety of
>> strategies, but these require a larger investment in instruction per
>> student -- an investment that we believe is well worth the cost. 4)
>> Numbers do not speak for themselves. For example, low rates of learning
>> gains must be read in the context of the goals that both students and
>> programs set for ESL instruction. It may be that some portion of
>> students legitimately wish to use ESL programs as an initial platform to
>> learn SOME English, and that their learning gains after separating from
>> programs are substantial. Too little is known about this. Conversely, we
>> found that the more students learn, the more ambitious their learning
>> goals become. Because numbers do not speak for themselves, it is all the
>> more important for individual programs and state agencies to invest in
>> the use of research for program improvement and to ACTUALLY USE IT for
>> therse purposes. Too often over-burdened ESL faculty and staff consider
>> research an after-thought. They need the time, encouragement, resources,
>> and training to development "continuous program improvement" models to
>> their work.
>>
>> -------------------------------
>> National Institute for Literacy
>> Assessment mailing list
>> Assessment at nifl.gov
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>>
>
>
>-- 
>JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
>Professor, Education Department
>Director, Ph.D. Program in Language, Literacy & Culture
>Coordinator, Peace Corps Master's International Program in ESOL/Bilingual
>Education
>University of Maryland, Baltimore County (UMBC)
>1000 Hilltop Circle, Baltimore, MD 21250
>ph:    410-455-2313/2376  fax:   410-455-8947/1880
>email: crandall at umbc.edu
>www.umbc.edu/llc/
>www.umbc.edu/esol/
>www.umbc.edu/esol/peacecorps.html
>
>
>
>-------------------------------
>National Institute for Literacy
>Assessment mailing list
>Assessment at nifl.gov
>To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Apr 27 11:49:21 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 27 Apr 2007 11:49:21 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 802]  Data Discussion Archived
Message-ID: <02f101c788e3$a01198d0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Dear Colleagues,
 
I've prepared last week's discussion in user-friendly format and it is
now available for your use at the Adult Literacy Education Wiki
(ALEWiki).  Go to the Assessment Section at:
http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Assessment_Information
 
and scroll down to Discussions - it's the first one listed there.
There were about 30 pages of text from that conversation, so in order to
make it as organized as possible, I cut the discussion up by thread and
archived each thread - I tried as best I could to leave the posts in the
order in which they came, with some exceptions.  
 
The Data Discussion will also be archived within the next couple of
weeks at:  Archived Events (NIFL home)
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_guests.html
<http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_guests.html   As>    As soon
as it is posted there I will send out that info.
 
Thanks and I hope you find the format helpful and that you use it!!
 
marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 <http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From jscogins at shout.net  Sat Apr 28 20:49:33 2007
From: jscogins at shout.net (Janet Scogins)
Date: Sat, 28 Apr 2007 19:49:33 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 803] Re: Data Discussion Archived
References: <02f101c788e3$a01198d0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <014101c789f8$46609d20$63c1d142@JANET>

MessageThanks so much for organizing this for us. It is very helpful.

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Marie Cora 
  To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
  Sent: Friday, April 27, 2007 10:49 AM
  Subject: [Assessment 802] Data Discussion Archived

  Dear Colleagues,

  I've prepared last week's discussion in user-friendly format and it is now available for your use at the Adult Literacy Education Wiki (ALEWiki).  Go to the Assessment Section at:
  http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Assessment_Information

  and scroll down to Discussions - it's the first one listed there.   There were about 30 pages of text from that conversation, so in order to make it as organized as possible, I cut the discussion up by thread and archived each thread - I tried as best I could to leave the posts in the order in which they came, with some exceptions.  

  The Data Discussion will also be archived within the next couple of weeks at:  Archived Events (NIFL home) http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_guests.html   As soon as it is posted there I will send out that info.

  Thanks and I hope you find the format helpful and that you use it!!

  marie

  Marie Cora
  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
  NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
  http://www.niflgov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
  http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  -------------------------------
  National Institute for Literacy
  Assessment mailing list
  Assessment at nifl.gov
  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  Email delivered to jscogins at shout.net
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue May  1 13:12:47 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 13:12:47 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 804]  Data Discussion at Institute's archives
Message-ID: <00ed01c78c13$f15efd30$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
The discussion on Using Data for Program Improvement is now posted at
the National Institute for Literacy's Discussion List Events Archive.
Go to:  http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/list_guests.html
and go to the Assessment section discussions.  Using Data is the first
one listed there.  
 
Now you have a couple of different locations for accessing this
transcript, and which one you use will probably depend more on what else
is posted at these locations (the transcript is also posted at the ALE
Wiki, (http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Assessment_Information,
see Discussions).  
 
Have you checked out the archives at the NIFL Discussions page
(http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/discussions.html)?  It's very
easy to find discussions under the different topics, and to search for
specific information, by date, topic, or author.  Using the archives
also alleviates the amount of email coming into your box every day:  you
can follow discussions when you choose to by reading the archives when
you want.  
 
A couple of tips:  In the right-hand toolbar:
Click on Archives for transcripts of discussions from the past 5 or more
years on 15 topics, including those of Discussions Lists that are no
longer running.  
Click on List Events and find info on any upcoming guest or organized
discussion.
Click on the link to Archived Events at the top of List Events page for
guest discussions that have been formatted for easy use.  
 
Enjoy!
 
Marie Cora
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue May  8 12:33:56 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 12:33:56 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 805]  Data use, anyone?
Message-ID: <01ab01c7918e$ada454c0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi all,
 
It's been a couple of weeks since our panel discussion on Using Data for
Program Improvement, and I was just wondering if anyone has done
anything with data (or thought about doing something!) in either your
classroom or program?  Or perhaps you now have some plan to use data in
some way in the future?  Please share with us if you do!
 
Thanks!
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From MMaralit at NIFL.gov  Thu May 10 11:55:05 2007
From: MMaralit at NIFL.gov (Maralit, Mary Jo)
Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 11:55:05 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 806]  Latest NAAL Report -- Literacy Behind Bars
Message-ID: <4062487BDB6029428A763CAEF4E1FE5B15382A2E@wdcrobe2m03.ed.gov>

Forwarded by request: Literacy Behind Bars 
The National Center for Education Statistics (NCES) has just released
Literacy Behind Bars: Results From the 2003 National Assessment of Adult
Literacy Prison Survey. This report presents findings on the literacy skills
of incarcerated adults and analyzes the changes in these skills since the
1992 National Adult Literacy Survey (NALS). 
Major findings include the following:
*	The average Prose, Document, and Quantitative literacy scores of the
prison population were higher in 2003 than in 1992. 
*	Prison inmates had lower average prose, document, and quantitative
literacy than adults living in households. On average, inmates also had
lower levels of educational attainment than adults living in households. 
*	In general, either prison inmates had lower average Prose, Document,
and Quantitative literacy than adults living in households with the same
level of educational attainment or there was no statistically significant
difference between the two groups. The exception was that among adults
without any high school education, prison inmates had higher average
literacy on all three scales than adults living in households. 
*	In 2003, 37 percent of the prison population did not have a high
school diploma or a GED, compared with 49 percent in 1992. 
*	Incarcerated White adults had lower average prose literacy than
White adults living in households. Incarcerated Black and Hispanic adults
had higher average prose literacy than Black and Hispanic adults living in
households. 
*	Between 1992 and 2003, average prose and quantitative literacy
levels increased for prison inmates who were Black, male, or in the 25- to
39-year-old age group. 
For more information, please check NAAL web site at: nces.ed.gov/NAAL.
Jaleh Behroozi Soroui
Education Statistics Services Institute (ESSI)
American Institutes for Research
1990 K Street, NW Suite 500
Washington, DC 20006
Phone: 202/403-6958
email: jsoroui at air.org

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri May 11 10:06:53 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 10:06:53 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 807]  Online and Blended Models of PD
Message-ID: <046901c793d5$a1594dd0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:

The following discussion is taking place on the Adult Literacy
Professional Development Discussion List - my apologies for not alerting
you earlier about the first part of this discussion.  Please read below
for a description of each part.

To subscribe to this discussion and to view the archives so you can
catch up on posts from this week, go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Professionaldevelopment

Also, Jackie, Taylor, the Moderator of that List, has built a section on
the Wiki where resources, additional information, and the discussion
threads are being posted.  Go to:
http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Adult_Literacy_Professional_Devel
opment  - information on this discussion can be found in the upper right
hand corner:  see "Going the Distance".  

Thanks,
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

=============================================================
Discussion Topic: Going the Distance: Online and Blended Models of
Sustained Professional Development
Where held: The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List
Part I: Discussion Primer - May 7-13, 2007
Part II: Discussion with Guests - May 14 - 21, 2007

To participate, subscribe:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Professionaldevelopment       
Guest Participants (Biographies): http://tinyurl.com/yrtktz   
Moderator: Jackie Taylor, jataylor at utk.edu   

Preparation for Discussion: http://tinyurl.com/242bpg   

 This is a two-part discussion. _Part I_ is a "discussion primer" and
begins before the guest discussion. _Part II_ is the online discussion
with Guest Participants, including _both_ asynchronous discussion and
"real-time" opportunities.

=============================================================
General Overview

Join the Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List to
explore development, design, and facilitation considerations and
implications with online and blended models of professional development.
Subscribers will have the opportunity to view a Pod cast of the
face-to-face panel discussion at the AALPD PreConference at COABE,
interact with panelists and additional guests online, and plan next
steps.

Part I: Discussion Primer - What's Available in Online Professional
Development?"
When: May 7-13, 2007

Join the list to share your state or organization's initiatives in
providing online professional development, or to learn what is available
to you in online professional development, any costs involved, whether
credits (CEUs) are available, and more.

Part II: Guest Discussion - "Going the Distance: Online and Blended
Models of Sustained Professional Development"

When: May 14 - 21, 2007

 Join the list to participate in a guest discussion of online and
blended professional development and professional
development-at-a-distance.

================================================================
 Topics include (but are not limited to):

Teachers and Administrators:

** Sharing qualities that attract practitioners to online and blended
professional development and offering recommendations for
designers/developers; 
** Browsing online courses/tools from various providers and interacting
with online course facilitators; 
** Discussing considerations in selecting online professional
development and supporting participation; 
 

Designers and Developers:

** Sharing strategies and considerations for online and blended
professional development and professional development-at-a-distance; 
** Examining ways to blend technology tools and other design
implications to enhance professional development; 
** Exploring strategies for evaluating the effectiveness of online and
blended models; 
 

Online Facilitators (DE Teachers, Professional Developers, List
Moderators):

** Considering what skills and qualities make a good online
presenter/trainer; 
** Sharing practical techniques, including facilitating interactivity
and improving teacher retention; 
 

All:

** Discussing quality considerations specific to the online environment;
and 
** Developing action agendas as individuals, teams, or as a field to
advance online and blended professional development opportunities. 
 
This discussion will build and expand upon issues explored in the recent
AALPD PreConference at COABE, "Exploring the Potential for Online
Professional Development."
http://www.aalpd.org/training/2007coabepreconference_agenda.html    
 
================================================================

GUESTS

Marie Cora ~ Adult Education Consultant

Barbara (Bee) Dieu ~ Educator and life long learner. Member Tesol EVO
and Braz-Tesol EduTech SIG Coordinator

Kristine Marane G?ngora ~ Instructional Designer, ProLiteracy Worldwide

Dr. Dafne Gonz?lez ~ Full Professor, Universidad Simon Bolivar, Caracas,
Venezuela; TESOL EVO 

Crystal Hack ~ GED-i Coordinator, Center for the Application of
Information Technologies (CAIT), Western Illinois University

Dr. Elizabeth Hanson-Smith ~ Professor Emeritus at CSU, Sacramento;
TESOL EVO 

Debra L. Hargrove, Ed.D. ~ Coordinator Florida TechNet

Noreen S. Lopez ~ Adult Education Consultant

Susan Ohlsen ~ Project Manager, ProLiteracy America, Verizon Literacy
Network 

Dr. Leslie Petty ~ Associate Director, Project IDEAL, University of
Michigan

Tim Ponder ~ Ohio Literacy Resource Center (OLRC) 

Sharon Reynolds ~ Coordinator, Central/Southeast ABLE Resource Center,
Ohio University, Athens, Ohio 

Lynda Terrill ~ Technical Assistance and Web Coordinator, Center for
Adult English Language Acquisition, Center for Applied Linguistics,
Washington, DC 

Marian Thacher ~ Director, Outreach and Technical Assistance Network
(OTAN)
================================================================

From kabeall at comcast.net  Wed May 16 15:48:02 2007
From: kabeall at comcast.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Wed, 16 May 2007 15:48:02 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 808]  New from NCSALL
Message-ID: <00d901c797f3$259e7fe0$0202a8c0@your4105e587b6>

Assessment discussion list members will be particularly interested in the
chapter on adult education program quality.

 

Review of Adult Learning and Literacy, Volume 7, edited by John Comings,
Barbara Garner, and Cristine Smith. 

This newest volume in the annual series from NCSALL presents chapters on the
persistence of adult education students, adult education program quality,
assistive technology, individualized group instruction, health literacy,
research on professional development and teacher change, adult literacy and
numeracy development in Australia, adult basic education in South Africa,
and annotated bibliography on workplace education. For chapter summaries,
visit the NCSALL Web site at http://www.ncsall.net/index.php?id=1175.

 

Includes chapters on: 

*	the persistence of adult education students 
*	adult education program quality 
*	assistive technology 
*	individualized group instruction 
*	health literacy 
*	research on professional development and teacher change 
*	adult literacy and numeracy development in Australia 
*	adult basic education in South Africa 
*	annotated bibliography on workplace education 

To order the paper edition of the Review of Adult Learning and Literacy,
Volume 7, for $25.00, a 30% discount, visit  NCSALL's Web site at
<http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1002> www.ncsall.net/?id=1002. To order the cloth
edition at $135.00 or the paper edition at $35.00 Taylor & Francis Web site
at www.taylorandfrancis.co.uk/.

 

 

****************

Kaye Beall

World Education

4401 S. Madison St.

Muncie, IN  47302

Tel: 765-717-3942

Fax: 617-482-0617

kaye_beall at worlded.org

http://www.worlded.org

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu May 17 15:03:18 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 15:03:18 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 809]  Upcoming discussions next week
Message-ID: <04b701c798b6$08426fb0$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:
Below please find descriptions of 2 discussions of interest being held
next week.  The first is focused on implementing ESL content standards
and it will be held on the Adult English Language Learners Discussion
List ( <http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Englishlanguage>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Englishlanguage).  The second
discussion will be held on the Poverty, Race, Women and Literacy
Discussion List (http://
<http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/povertyracewomen>
www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/povertyracewomen) and will focus on the
results of the NAAL and Gender, Race, and Socioeconomic Status (SES).
Please read below for further details and a listing of resources for
each discussion.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
****************************************
 
 
To subscribe to the Adult English Language Learners discussion list, go
to  <http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Englishlanguage>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Englishlanguage and click on
Subscribe
 
Please join us for an upcoming discussion on implementing adult ESL
content standards from May 21-25. The discussion will be facilitated by
Kirsten Schaetzel and Sarah Young of the Center for Adult English
Language Acquisition (CAELA). Kirsten and Sarah will be joined by adult
ESL practitioners using standards in the field, including Dr. Lesley
Tomaszewski of the Texas Center for the Advancement of Literacy and
Learning (TCALL) and Karen Gianninoto of the Maryland State Department
of Education.

Before beginning the discussion, we would like to provide some
background information about standards-based instruction based on two
recent CAELA briefs: "Understanding Adult ESL Content Standards"
(September 2006,
http://www.cal.org/CAELA/esl_resources/briefs/contentstandards.html
<https://mail.cal.org/exchweb/bin/redir.asp?URL=http://www.cal.org/CAELA
/esl_resources/briefs/contentstandards.html> ) and
"Using Adult ESL Content Standards" (March 2007,
http://www.cal.org/CAELA/esl_resources/briefs/usingcontstandards.html
<https://mail.cal.org/exchweb/bin/redir.asp?URL=http://www.cal.org/CAELA
/esl_resources/briefs/usingcontstandards.html> ).
Content standards are broadly defined as what learners should know and
be able to do in a certain subject or practical domain. They describe
the knowledge and skills that students will have upon successful
completion of an instructional program. Although standards are the
foundation for designing curricula, instruction, and assessment, they do
not stipulate the types of lesson plans, activities, or teaching
methodologies that should be used. Content standards, curriculum
frameworks, and resource guides that states have developed can provide
guidance to local programs and practitioners in developing effective
curriculum and instruction.

Standards-based education has been a part of K-12 instruction and
assessment for quite some time now, but it is a relatively new addition
to the adult basic education and adult ESL fields. There are many adult
ESL standards-based initiatives currently in development or in use, such
as the Adult Education Content Standards Warehouse
(http://www.adultedcontentstandards.ed.gov
<https://mail.cal.org/exchweb/bin/redir.asp?URL=http://www.adultedconten
tstandards.ed.gov> ) where sets of adult ESL
content standards from ten states, CASAS, and Equipped for the Future
(EFF) are available for download. The Adult Literacy Education (ALE)
Wiki Web site on Standards
(http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Standards
<https://mail.cal.org/exchweb/bin/redir.asp?URL=http://wiki.literacytent
.org/index.php/Standards> ) provides a list of
existing and in-development adult education standards, curriculum
frameworks, and resource guides from over 20 states, as well as links to
standards from four other English-speaking countries. The
Standards-In-Action project, funded by the Office of Vocational and
Adult Education, is working with six pilot states to develop
professional development and resources for implementing standards in
curriculum, instruction, and assessment.

As we prepare to begin our discussion on what adult ESL content
standards are and how they are used to improve instruction and learning,
please consider the following questions. We look forward to hearing your
responses and examining additional questions focused on implementing
standards in adult ESL.

How are English language acquisition and skills development approached
in content standards, and how does this differ from previous methods of
ESL instruction?

Many people on this list have children in standards-based K-12 programs
or who have taught in a K-12 setting. How do adult standards compare to
K-12 standards? What can we learn or apply from K-12 standards-based
education, in terms of research on instructional methods, activities,
and materials, assessment, and professional development?

What professional development and supplementary materials are needed to
facilitate adult ESL standards implementation?

How can we know if adult ESL standards-based instruction and assessment
are beneficial for students, teachers, and programs?

We will be posting some preliminary thoughts about these questions next
week, and look forward to hearing from practitioners and administrators
in the field who have experience with adult ESL content standards or who
are interested in learning more.

Sincerely,
Sarah Young & Kirsten Schaetzel
Center for Adult English Language Acquisition
www.cal.org/caela
 
 
 
 
Title of Discussion:
Gender, Race, SES and Adult Literacy: What does the National Assessment
of Adult Literacy (NAAL) tell us?
 
When:
May 21-May 29, 2007
 
Where: 
Poverty, Race, Women, and Literacy List. To subscribe (and later
unsubscribe if you wish) go to: 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/povertyracewomen 
 
Guest Discussant: 
Elizabeth Greenberg
 
Guest Bio:
Elizabeth Greenberg, is a principal research analyst at the American
Institutes for Research (AIR), and is AIR's Project Director for the
2008 National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) Special Studies
contract.  She was also AIR's Deputy Project Director for the 2003 NAAL
Design, Analysis, and Reporting contract. In her role as Deputy Project
Director for the 2003 NAAL, she led the development of the NAAL
background questionnaire and assessment items. She is a lead author or
co-author of several reports based on the 2003 NAAL, including A First
Look at the Literacy of America's Adults in the 21st Century, The Health
Literacy of America's Adults, Literacy in Everyday Life, Literacy Behind
Bars, and the 2003 NAAL Public-Use Data File User's Guide.  Elizabeth is
also an author or co-author of several reports and articles based upon
the 1992 adult literacy data, including English Literacy and Language
Minorities in the United States.   
 
 
Resources for Discussion:
Literacy in Everyday Life
http://nces.ed.gov/pubsearch/pubsinfo.asp?pubid=2007480 
 
A First Look at the Literacy of America's Adults in the 21st Century
http://nces.ed.gov/pubsearch/pubsinfo.asp?pubid=2006470 
 
The Health Literacy of America's Adults
http://nces.ed.gov/pubsearch/pubsinfo.asp?pubid=2006483 
 
Literacy Behind Bars
http://nces.ed.gov/pubsearch/pubsinfo.asp?pubid=2007473 
 
 
 
Key Points from NAAL 2003 related to Literacy, Gender, Race, and SES:
 
Gender
 
*          Between 1992 and 2003, women's average document and
quantitative
literacy scores increased.  During the same time period, men's average
document literacy score decreased and there was no statistically
significant change in average quantitative literacy for men. 
 
*          Between 1992 and 2003, women's average prose literacy score
stayed the same, while men's average prose literacy score decreased.  
 
 
*          In 2003, women had higher average prose and document literacy
than men, and men had higher average quantitative literacy than women.
 
In 1992, there was no statistically significant difference between men
and women in their average prose literacy, but men had higher average
document and quantitative literacy than women.  
 
Race
 
*          Between 1992 and 2003, average prose, document, and
quantitative
literacy increased for Black adults.  
 
*          Between 1992 and 2003, average prose and document literacy
decreased for Hispanic adults.  Average quantitative literacy did not
change for Hispanic adults.  The percentage of the adult population (age
16 and older) that identified themselves as Hispanic increased from 8
percent in 1992 to 12 percent in 2003.
 
*          Between 1992 and 2003, average prose literacy increased for
Asian/Pacific Islander adults and there was no statistically significant
change in average document and quantitative literacy for this group.
 
*          Between 1992 and 2003, there was no statistically significant
change in average prose and document literacy for white adults, but
there was an increase in quantitative literacy.  
 
SES
 
*          Among adults with Below Basic prose literacy, 26 percent
lived
in households with average incomes of less than $10,000 and only 7
percent lived i n households with average incomes of $60,000 or greater.
 
 
Among adults with Proficient prose literacy, 2 percent lived in
households with average incomes of less than $10,000 and 65 percent
lived in households with average incomes of $60,000 or greater.  
 
*          Higher percentages of adults with higher literacy levels than
adults with lower literacy levels were employed full-time, and lower
percentages were out of the labor force.  Sixty-four percent of adults
with Proficient prose literacy were employed full-time, compared with 29
percent of adults with Below Basic prose literacy.  Eighteen percent of
adults with Proficient prose literacy were not in the labor force,
compared with 57 percent of adults with Below Basic prose literacy.
 
*          The occupational groups with the highest average prose,
document, and quantitative literacy scores were Professional and related
and Management, Business, and Financial.  The occupational groups with
the lowest average prose document and quantitative literacy scores were
Service; Farming, Fishing, and Forestry; Transportation and Material
Moving; Production; and Construction and Extraction.
 
Daphne Greenberg
Assistant Professor
Educational Psych. & Special Ed.
Georgia State University
P.O. Box 3979
Atlanta, Georgia 30302-3979
phone: 404-651-0127
fax:404-651-4901
dgreenberg at gsu.edu
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Mon May 21 12:22:02 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 12:22:02 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 810] Natl Commission on Adult Literacy Resource
	Document Released
Message-ID: <649EA3CB-97FA-41FE-A3CC-B51545C5DB72@caalusa.org>

NEWS RELEASE - May 21, 2007, NYC -- On behalf of the National  
Commission on Adult Literacy,  MOUNTING PRESSURES FACING THE U.S.  
WORKFORCE AND THE INCREASING NEED FOR ADULT EDUCATION AND LITERACY  
was released today by the Commission's chairman, its study director,  
and CAAL. The 67 resource document was one of several presentations  
made at the April 17, 2007 meeting of the National Commission. It was  
developed by Dennis Jones (President) and Patrick Kelly (Senior  
Associate & Director, National Information Center) of the National  
Center for Higher Education Management Systems (NCHEMS).

This publication consists largely of 50 color graphics reflecting  
NCHEMS analysis and 2005 data from such multiple sources as OECD, the  
U.S. Census Bureau, the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, the National  
Center for Education Statistics, the U.S. Bureau of Justice, the U.S.  
Department of Education, GED Testing Service, and NCHEMS itself.  
NCHEMS concludes that this data set -- including information on  
international comparisons, U.S. demographic trends, U.S. education  
achievement levels, workforce education levels, and other variables  
-- calls for a dramatically expanded and more effective adult  
education and literacy enterprise in America. A short introduction  
and executive summary by the authors accompanies their compelling  
presentation.

Although this document should not necessarily be taken to reflect  
conclusions of the Commission at this stage (its work is still in  
progress), the Commission is pleased to release it as a public  
service. Other materials developed for the Commission's April 17th  
meeting will be provided in the near future.

MOUNTING PRESSURES... is available in color PDF format at the CAAL  
website, www.caalusa.org. Bound color copies may also be purchased  
directly from CAAL ($25 each plus postage, bheitner at caalusa.org for  
ordering instructions). [Note: This is a large document best "read"  
in color. Persons able to print only in black and white or having a  
slow speed connection may do better to order it from CAAL.]

?

Gail Spangenberg
President
Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Fl
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2362, F: 212-512-2610
www.caalusa.org

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From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Thu May 24 13:34:44 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 13:34:44 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 811] DARE TO DREAM - from National Commission on Adult
	Literacy
Message-ID: <DABD2B5E-E1FB-4234-92BD-6C1D6F7B5A29@caalusa.org>

NEWS RELEASE -- May 24, 2007, New York, NY --  On behalf of the  
National Commission on Adult Literacy, the Commission's chairman,  
study director, and CAAL are today releasing DARE TO DREAM: A  
Collection of Papers from a Resource Group of 102 Adult Education and  
Literacy Professionals. This document was one of several  
presentations prepared for the April 17, 2007 meeting of the  
Commission. While it does not necessarily reflect conclusions of the  
Commission at this stage in its ongoing work, the Commission is  
pleased to make this material available as a public service. The  
papers that make up this collection were developed in response to  
questions posed in several thematic areas (indicated in the  
publication). They reflect the ideas, insights, cautions, and  
recommendations of 102 education and literacy leaders whose  
participation was facilitated by a team of 10 group leaders. The  
group was challenged to "think outside the box," to imagine systemic  
changes that would be required to expand adult education and literacy  
service beyond the 3 million or so presently served in publicly  
funded programs to many times that number, and to do so to a  high  
standard of quality.

DARE TO DREAM is available in PDF format at the CAAL website,  
www.caalusa.org (scroll down from the top of the middle column at the  
homepage). It may also be purchased directly from CAAL ($25 each plus  
postage, bheitner at caalusa for ordering instructions).

DARE TO DREAM is the second in a series of recent Commission  
resources being made publicly available. "Mounting Pressures Facing  
the U.S. Workforce and the Increasing Need for Adult Education and  
Literacy" was prepared for the Commission by Dennis Jones and Patrick  
Kelly of the National Center for Higher Education Management Systems  
was released on May 21, 2007 and can also be downloaded from the CAAL  
website. In the near future,  two other presentations developed for  
the April 17th meeting will be made available: a DVD presentation by  
Mark Tucker, president of the National Center for Education and the  
Economy, and a presentation from labor economist Andrew Sum.

Principle funders of the National Commission on Adult Literacy are  
The Dollar General Corporation (in the lead role at $1 million), The  
McGraw-Hill Companies, Inc. (through both grant and in-kiind  
support), and Harold W. McGraw, Jr.

Gail Spangenberg
President
Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Fl
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2362, F: 212-512-2610
www.caalusa.org

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From mhefner at cccti.edu  Thu May 24 14:54:25 2007
From: mhefner at cccti.edu (Melinda Hefner)
Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 14:54:25 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 812]  ESL Assessment
References: <025601c7801a$6dd5ed70$0202a8c0@LITNOW>
	<E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B253092B@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <20070524T145425Z_1F1A00170000@cccti.edu>

I'm sure this topic has been discussed many, many times before, but I wanted to ask some questions nevertheless since there may be new members or new information. I want to get a better feel for what is being done nationally rather than in my own region.  

1.  What is the best assessment tool for ESL adult learners?  

2.  What is the most widely used assessment tool for them?  

3.  How much movement from one level to another do your programs see among these learners?

While I will appreciate detailed responses, I really just need some general responses.

Thanks in advance!!

Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266
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From dlwann at comcast.net  Thu May 24 18:04:37 2007
From: dlwann at comcast.net (Dan Wann)
Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 18:04:37 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 813] Re: ESL Assessment
In-Reply-To: <20070524T145425Z_1F1A00170000@cccti.edu>
References: <025601c7801a$6dd5ed70$0202a8c0@LITNOW><E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B253092B@dc1ex03.air.org>
	<20070524T145425Z_1F1A00170000@cccti.edu>
Message-ID: <00d501c79e4f$85438c30$0a00a8c0@D28ZY081>

My responses to your questions are below.   Dan Wann 

 

  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Melinda Hefner
Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 2:54 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 812] ESL Assessment

 

I'm sure this topic has been discussed many, many times before, but I wanted
to ask some questions nevertheless since there may be new members or new
information. I want to get a better feel for what is being done nationally
rather than in my own region.  

 

1.  What is the best assessment tool for ESL adult learners?  Many factors
to consider both Best and CASAS have been developed for use with Adult
English Language Learners many of whom have limited educational backgrounds.
Both of these tools have strengths and weaknesses based on a program's needs
and philosophy.  The most important assessment tool is a policy that
stresses multiple measures of student progress over time with one of these
two tools as the standardized arrow in your quiver.  

 

2.  What is the most widely used assessment tool for them?  I do not know
but both are used extensively in the United States and I know that CASAS is
also used outside of the US. 

 

3.  How much movement from one level to another do your programs see among
these learners?  Indiana is a TABE and CASAS state with CASAS required for
all ESL students.  Indiana level gains in ESL average 50% for the 6 NRS
levels.  

 

While I will appreciate detailed responses, I really just need some general
responses.

 

Thanks in advance!!

 

 

 

Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

 

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina  28638
Office:  (828) 726-2245
FAX:     (828) 726-2266

 

 

 

 

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From forrest at crosslink.net  Fri May 25 12:44:26 2007
From: forrest at crosslink.net (fchisman)
Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 12:44:26 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 814] Re: ESL Assessment
In-Reply-To: <20070524T145425Z_1F1A00170000@cccti.edu>
Message-ID: <GMEELPPFJEPCKIHJFANPEENEGBAA.forrest@crosslink.net>

There appears to be no single ESL assessment that is suitable for all purposes -- although many states mandate a single assessment for reporting (and sometimes promotion) purposes. Among the mandated tests are the BEST, CASAS, CELSA, and REEP. Regrettably, there is no single assessment that measures all four core ESL skills. Most programs appear to use a combination of standardized tests (sometimes different tests for different purposes) with locally constructed assessments and teacher judgments. This situation is far from ideal, but no one seems to be focused on improving it.

For a discussion of ESL assessments, see "Passing the Torch: Strategies for Innovation in Community College ESL" pages 43-47. This is available online at www.caalusa.org.

Forrest Chisman
  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Melinda Hefner
  Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 2:54 PM
  To: The Assessment Discussion List
  Subject: [Assessment 812] ESL Assessment

  I'm sure this topic has been discussed many, many times before, but I wanted to ask some questions nevertheless since there may be new members or new information. I want to get a better feel for what is being done nationally rather than in my own region.  

  1.  What is the best assessment tool for ESL adult learners?  

  2.  What is the most widely used assessment tool for them?  

  3.  How much movement from one level to another do your programs see among these learners?

  While I will appreciate detailed responses, I really just need some general responses.

  Thanks in advance!!

  Melinda M. Hefner
  Director, Literacy Support Services

  Basic Skills Department
  Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
  2855 Hickory Blvd.
  Hudson, North Carolina  28638
  Office:  (828) 726-2245
  FAX:     (828) 726-2266

   
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From bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net  Fri May 25 12:50:51 2007
From: bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net (Bonnie Odiorne)
Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 09:50:51 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 815] Re: ESL Assessment
Message-ID: <207722.75910.qm@web83308.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

When I was in not for profit adult/community education:

1.  What is the best assessment tool for ESL adult learners?  I used both CASAS language and reading for ESL Learners. I will say though that I found that while CASAS measures competencies, it is difficult to separate out language skills levels related to the task analysis.
 
2.  What is the most widely used assessment tool for them?  CT is a CASAS state.
 
3.  How much movement from one level to another do your programs see among these learners? We did see multiple level jumps, though my most recent job was a WIA-funded high-intensit/duration program. As many of you know, level jumps don't 'count" in the NRS. in the literacy volunteers program level gain was smaller and sometimes nil, but that was for a minimum 2/hrs/wk volunteer tutoring. Highly motivated and educated students in their own language did better.

Now I use Accuplacer for all university testing, and we have far fewer ESL students than we did. Even when we did, the testing was a more informal oral interview/writing sample assessment. I've found that while ESL students I work with have fewer problems communicating orally,so are not easily spotted, they have a terrifically hard time with writing, and reading academic-level texts. but then again, that's true for the general under-prepared "developmental" population.
 
Bonnie Odiorne, Ph.D.
Writing Center Director and Adjunct Professor, Post University, Waterbury, CT

 
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net
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From Ajit.Gopalakrishnan at ct.gov  Fri May 25 16:24:00 2007
From: Ajit.Gopalakrishnan at ct.gov (Gopalakrishnan, Ajit)
Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 16:24:00 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 815] Re: ESL Assessment
In-Reply-To: <GMEELPPFJEPCKIHJFANPEENEGBAA.forrest@crosslink.net>
Message-ID: <281DD0D97E3EC94FB83030B1379CE42605B4318C@DOIT-EX302.exec.ds.state.ct.us>

CT has implemented the range of reading and listening assessments in the
CASAS system with ESL learners for 15+ years. More recently, CT has been
implementing the CASAS Functional Writing Assessment and in a more
limited way, the CASAS Workplace Speaking Assessment, in ESL programs.
We are beginning to reap the benefits of having assessments in the four
core skill areas of reading, listening, writing, and speaking within the
same curriculum, assessment, and instructional system. It has helped us
to highlight that ESL learners who are at higher levels in terms of
their listening (or may be even their speaking) abilities can benefit
from instruction that is designed to improve their reading and writing
skills, especially if those learners are preparing to transition to a
secondary completion program or to college. The new reading tests in the
Life and Work series have been a welcome enhancement. States and
practitioners of the CASAS National Consortium are working toward and
eagerly awaiting the new listening assessments in the Life and Work
series.

In terms of level completion among learners who are pre-and-post tested,
there are several factors that seem to influence progress of learners
from one level to another including the skill area being assessed, the
learner's entering ability level, the continuous hours attended between
pre-and-post, the quality of instruction, and the relation of the
instruction to the assessment. Nationally, among those who are pre-post
tested, over 60% of learners complete an educational level.

Thank you.

Ajit

Ajit Gopalakrishnan 
Connecticut Department of Education 
25 Industrial Park Road 
Middletown, CT 06457 
Phone: (860) 807-2125 
Fax: (860) 807-2062 
Email: ajit.gopalakrishnan at ct.gov 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of fchisman
Sent: Friday, May 25, 2007 12:44 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 814] Re: ESL Assessment

 

There appears to be no single ESL assessment that is suitable for all
purposes -- although many states mandate a single assessment for
reporting (and sometimes promotion) purposes. Among the mandated tests
are the BEST, CASAS, CELSA, and REEP. Regrettably, there is no single
assessment that measures all four core ESL skills. Most programs appear
to use a combination of standardized tests (sometimes different tests
for different purposes) with locally constructed assessments and teacher
judgments. This situation is far from ideal, but no one seems to be
focused on improving it.

 

For a discussion of ESL assessments, see "Passing the Torch: Strategies
for Innovation in Community College ESL" pages 43-47. This is available
online at www.caalusa.org.

 

Forrest Chisman

	-----Original Message-----
	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On Behalf Of Melinda Hefner
	Sent: Thursday, May 24, 2007 2:54 PM
	To: The Assessment Discussion List
	Subject: [Assessment 812] ESL Assessment

	I'm sure this topic has been discussed many, many times before,
but I wanted to ask some questions nevertheless since there may be new
members or new information. I want to get a better feel for what is
being done nationally rather than in my own region.  

	 

	1.  What is the best assessment tool for ESL adult learners?  

	 

	2.  What is the most widely used assessment tool for them?  

	 

	3.  How much movement from one level to another do your programs
see among these learners?

	 

	While I will appreciate detailed responses, I really just need
some general responses.

	 

	Thanks in advance!!

	 

	 

	 

	Melinda M. Hefner
	Director, Literacy Support Services

	 

	Basic Skills Department
	Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
	2855 Hickory Blvd.
	Hudson, North Carolina  28638
	Office:  (828) 726-2245
	FAX:     (828) 726-2266

	 

	 

	 

	
	 

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From djrosen at comcast.net  Mon May 28 11:57:52 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 11:57:52 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 816] CLASP Recommendation on allowing "Ability to
	Benefit" tests for NRS
Message-ID: <F1086B26-D4E1-496F-BCD2-BD4A09D6E3FE@comcast.net>

NIFL Assessment Colleagues,

The Center for Law and Social Policy (CLASP) published in April a  
short set of recommendations , "Updating WIA Title II to Help More  
Adult Education Students Gain Post-secondary Credentials and Move up  
to Better Jobs".

http://clasp.org/publications/wia_titleii_rec.pdf

Among these is the recommendation that the NRS should allow "ability  
to benefit" tests to be used to demonstrate adult learner outcomes.

"5) Reduce the barriers to post-secondary transition by aligning  
assessments. Currently students
in workforce bridge or post-secondary transition activities must take  
two sets of tests both
upon entering and exiting a program: the basic skills test used by  
the college to determine
readiness for college coursework, remediation needs, and ?ability to  
benefit? for federal
student aid purposes and the basic skills test used by the adult  
education provider (tests
approved by the U.S. Department of Education for adult education  
performance
accountability purposes). In both cases, the lists of tests are  
intended for use with adults who
lack a high school diploma or GED, but most of the ability to benefit  
tests are not on the list
of approved assessments for Title II accountability use. These two  
sets of different
assessments impose a burden of multiple testing on students and  
providers and make it more
difficult for adult education providers and colleges to work together  
to prepare adult
education students for college without the need for further  
remediation. We suggest that
Congress ask the Secretary to convene a group of testing experts and  
adult education
practitioners to work to align these two lists of approved  
assessments to the greatest extent
possible, and to allow at least some of the ability to benefit  
assessments, or ?crosswalks?
between them and adult education tests, to be used for accountability  
purposes under the
adult education National Reporting System for students in workforce  
bridge programs or
post-secondary transition activities.  "

Would it be a good idea for the NRS to add to its list of approved  
assessments for Title II Accountability "ability to benefit tests"  
used by colleges to place students in regular or developmental  
courses (e.g. Compass, Accuplacer, and others)? Why or why not?

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

From gleasonm at ccliteracy.org  Tue May 29 10:34:46 2007
From: gleasonm at ccliteracy.org (Mary V Gleason)
Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 07:34:46 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 817] Re: ESL Assessment
In-Reply-To: <207722.75910.qm@web83308.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
References: <207722.75910.qm@web83308.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1348.168.53.172.145.1180449286.squirrel@webmail.ccliteracy.org>

Hi- ours is a small non-profit organization, and we do have a large ESL
population.  I like the BEST-Plus oral assessment.

A great many of our learners who are educated in other countries can read
and write English quite well, and it is the oral portion with which they
struggle.

Mary V. Gleason
Executive Director, CC Literacy Council
4044 Greenwood Dr., CC, TX 78416
(361) 857-5896   Fax: 854-5898

>
>
>
> 1.  What is the best assessment tool for ESL adult learners?  I used both
> CASAS language and reading for ESL Learners. I will say though that I
> found that while CASAS measures competencies, it is difficult to separate
> out language skills levels related to the task analysis.
>
> 2.  What is the most widely used assessment tool for them?  CT is a CASAS
> state.
>
> 3.  How much movement from one level to another do your programs see among
> these learners? We did see multiple level jumps, though my most recent job
> was a WIA-funded high-intensit/duration program. As many of you know,
> level jumps don't 'count" in the NRS. in the literacy volunteers program
> level gain was smaller and sometimes nil, but that was for a minimum
> 2/hrs/wk volunteer tutoring. Highly motivated and educated students in
> their own language did better.
>
> Now I use Accuplacer for all university testing, and we have far fewer ESL
> students than we did. Even when we did, the testing was a more informal
> oral interview/writing sample assessment. I've found that while ESL
> students I work with have fewer problems communicating orally,so are not
> easily spotted, they have a terrifically hard time with writing, and
> reading academic-level texts. but then again, that's true for the general
> under-prepared "developmental" population.
>
> Bonnie Odiorne, Ph.D.
> Writing Center Director and Adjunct Professor, Post University, Waterbury,
> CT
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to
> bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net-------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to gleasonm at ccliteracy.org
>

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Jun  1 09:18:34 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 1 Jun 2007 09:18:34 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 818]  Oakland's PD Model for Classroom Assessment
Message-ID: <02f001c7a44f$5be144d0$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Dear Colleagues:
I hope this email finds you well.
 
I'm passing along this post from the Professional Development Discussion
List.  
 
Over the past several months, Bonnita Solberg from Oakland Adult and
Career Education has described the evolvement of professional
development training in the Oakland programs.  The process engaged
teachers and staff to take the lead in identifying and improving an area
of need in their work.  The committee settled on classroom assessment as
their focus.  
 
For a full reading of Bonnita's reflections on the OACE Professional
Development program, please to go:  
 
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/professionaldevelopment/2007/000919.html 
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/professionaldevelopment/2007/001134.html
 
Below is an update from the OACE, including a comprehensive list of
assessments Bonnita gathered as part of a practitioner and
learner-centered staff development model. 
 
Thanks to Bonnita for sharing the program update and their list of
assessment resources. 
 
Do folks have questions or comments on Bonnita's set of resources?  Do
you find this resource useful?  Do you develop similar sets of resources
in your program?  If so, who's involved in that?  Do you engage teachers
and other staff in similar ways to tackle tough issues like assessment?
Do teachers become mentors and/or trainers to others in the program on
issues of assessment?  Do you have time set aside for teachers to share
their in-class assessment strategies?
 
Please share your questions and own experiences.
 
Thanks!

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
====================================================
 
Oakland Adult and Career Education (OACE)
Professional Development Training
 
A committee of several ESL OACE classroom teachers and teachers on
special assignment, together with two administrators first came together
in November 2006.  The committee has met weekly to discuss how to move
forward professional development training with a focus on daily
assessment in the classroom.  We chose to employ a PD design that
supports teachers presenting exercises used in their daily practice,
exercises that could be transformed into assessments for many purposes:
a reflection tool for teachers to adjust their daily practice, informing
students of their progress, informing teachers to whom students would be
promoted, and providing data for administration and funding sources. Our
format for PD training emerged from a solid and soaring belief that
teachers could rise to the challenge of developing assessments, that
teachers could train as well as learn from fellow teachers without
employing experts in the field to conduct workshops.  In this scenario,
each participant is a presenter/learner developing their individual PD
learning portfolio and PD plan, although neither have been formally
defined as such.  Some choose not to participate on the one end of the
spectrum; others spend hours over and above what they are compensated
for to form a product of quality and pride, and most fall somewhere in
the middle. 
 
But the committee and presenters/learners were floundering.  Without
examples of the myriad of acceptable and useful assessments, teachers
had no guidelines to take daily practice to the next level ----
generating an assessment in one of the four skill areas: listening,
speaking, reading or writing, at each of the six ESL levels.  I went to
the web and retrieved references for this purpose.  The retrieved
documents were compiled into three separate folders:  About Assessments,
Sample Assessments and Background on Assessments.
 
 
A.  About Assessments Folder provided a basis for discussions by
committee members and by teachers at large as we educated ourselves on
the many facets of assessment.
*	Creating Authentic Materials and Activities for the Adult
Literacy Classroom by Eric Jacobson, et al.  Retrieved on 3/17/07 from
the National Center for the Study of Adult Learning and Literacy
(NCSALL) at www.ncsall.net   In upper right find google box; type in
"Authentic Materials"; click on> NCSALL site search; click on> NCSALL:
"The Impact of Use of Authentic Materials and Activities" to access
Volume 6, Issue C, September 2003; at bottom of page click on> blue
green word "online" to access the full report. 
*	"Portfolio Assessments, Student Self Report, Other Forms of
Learner-Contextualized Assessment: Teacher Observations, Conferences"
pp. 92-96  
*	"Points to Remember" pp. 103 - 104     
*	Assessment documents/Coalition for Essential Schools (EFF)  1998
Fall Forum workshop given by Excelsior High School.  Presented by Cathy
Crist, Diane Guill, Patricia Harmesk, Chris Lake.  Retrieved 3/6/07 from
http://www.essentialschools.org/cs/resources/view/ces_res/124
Short, easy to read, and to the point papers titled: 
*	Defining Assessments 
*	Purposes of Assessment 
*	What are the Strengths of My Current Assessment System? 
*	Tips for Managing an Assessment System 
*	"Using Rubrics" by Bill Kast published in "Teacher to Teacher".
Retrieved 3/6/07 from Educational Resources Information Center (ERIC) at
www.eric.ed.gov <http://www.eric.ed.gov/>                       Enter
ERIC # ED458392.   Easy to read introduction to rubrics and how to
develop one. 
*	"Describing the Task" and "Selecting Tasks for Performance
Assessments" Adapted from Herman, Aschbacher and Winters (1992).
Retrieved 3/20/07 from Instructional Intranet Chicago Public School at
http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments  Click on> Ideas and Rubric;
click on> Performance Assessment Tasks; click on> Describing the Task or
Selecting Tasks for Performance Assessment 
*	California Standards for the Teaching Profession:  Assessing
Learning   <http://www.ctc.ca.gov/reports/cstpreport.pdf>
www.ctc.ca.gov/reports/cstpreport.pdf     
 
B.  Sample Assessments Folder:  Compiled to use in small break out level
groups as examples of assessment tools.
*	Learning Logs/Equipped for the Future  Retrieved on 3/6/07 from
http://eff.cls.utk.edu/toolkit/tools_learning_logs.htm 
*	Improving Performance, Reporting Results: Scoring Rubric
Template--EFF Performance Level 1  Retrieved on 03/07/07 from
http://eff.cls.ulk.edu/PDF/RWU_Assessment.pdf   Click on> Improving
Performance, Reporting Results to find these references:
Scoring Rubric Template--EFF Performance Level 1; The Accountability
Assessment Prototype for Read With Understanding; p. 35
Model Assessment Task:  Reading Utility Bills pp. 49 - 55
Model Assessment Tasks:  Delivering Interoffice Mail  pp.37 - 40 
*	Understanding Scoring Rubrics:  A Guide for Teachers by Boston,
Carol, editor.  Retrieved on 3/6/07 from Equipped for the Future
Teaching & Learning Toolkit http://eff.cls.utk.edu/toolkit    Or
retrieve from Educational Resources Information Center (ERIC). In upper
right, find ERIC google search box and enter> ED471518; click on>
search.  Go to page 78 of the original text, (labeled page 85 in "best
copy available")   
*	In House Forms of student learning logs:  Verb Chart Assessment;
ESL Diary; Do I Know These Words? 
*	Did I Use English"  from "A New Start" by Linda Mrowick and
Peter Furnborough; Heinemann Educational Books. Form to be filled out by
students chronicling their use of English outside the classroom. 
*	Generic Assessment Rubrics for Oral Communication. Listening and
Speaking, and Writing from "English, No Problem" by Minicz, Elizabeth
and Marcia L. Taylor; New Readers Press 
C. Background on Assessment:  Compilation of articles that provide in
depth discussion of assessment, assessment tools, assessment tracking on
a more academic level than the committee undertook; used by some members
to broaden their knowledge of assessments.  
            
*	Assessment and Second Language Study:  What and Why? by Charles
R. Hancock, The Ohio State University, July 1994.  Retrieved on
3/19/2007 from Outreach and Technical Assistance Network for Adult
Educators (OTAN).  www.otan.dni.us <http://www.otan.dni.us/>   Click on>
Research & Reference; click on> Library Collections; click on> Online
Documents; click on> English (Second Language); click on >Alternative
Assessment 
*	It Belongs to Me:  A Guide to Portfolio Assessment in Adult
Education Programs by Hanna Arlene Fingeret, 1993.Retrieved on
3/19/2007from Outreach and Technical Assistance Network (OTAN).
www.otan.dni.us <http://www.otan.dni.us/>    Click on> Research &
Reference; click on> Library Collections; click on> Online Documents;
click on> Assessment folder.  On second page click on> "It Belongs to Me
. . . ."  There are four parts to this report: 
*	PT01  Acknowledgements and Introduction 
*	PT02  Assessment Purposes and Models 
*	PT03  Implementing Portfolio Assessment 
*	PT04: Summary and Conclusion    
*	Knowledge in Action:  The Promise of Project-Based Learning
Retrieved on 3/20/07 from the National Center for the Study of Adult
Learning and Literacy (NCSALL) at www.ncsall.net    Click on>
Publications in the top bar; click on> Focus on Basics in left column;
read down the list to Volume 2, Dec 1998;  click on Project-Based
Learning; click on> "Knowledge in Action".  
*	"The Purpose of Assessment is to Drive Instruction" and the
"Learner Questionaire" Retrieved from National Institute for Literacy
INIFL) at nifl.gov/readingprofiles/PF_MC_Using_Assessments.htm. 
*	Assessment documents/Coalition for Essential Schools  Retrieved
on 03/07/07 from
http://www.essentialschools.org/cs/resources/view/ces_res/124
Find these titles: 
"Purposes of Assessment; Protocol for Looking at Student Work"
"Definition of Performance Assessment"
"Defining Assessment"
"Exhibitions:  Facing Outward, Pointing Inward"
"Anatomy of an Exhibition"

"Consultancy for Portfolio Presentation"

"Managing Alternative Assessment"                          
*        Introduction to Performance Assessment Scoring
Rubric/Instructional Intranet Chicago Public Schools. Retrieved on
03/07/07 from http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments  Go down list,
click on> Rubric How-To's - MidLinks Teacher Resource Room; click on> #3
Alternative Assessment Resources; click on> words in blue "Ideas and
Rubrics" and select from a menu of topics:
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/ideas_and_r
ubrics.html> 
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Intro_P1/intro_p1.html> Introduction
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Definition_of_P1/definition_of_p1.html> Definition of Performance
Assessment
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/task_scoring_rubric/task_scoring_rubric.html> Performance Assessment
= Task + Rubric
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Rubric_Importance/rubric_importance.html> Why scoring rubrics are
important
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Scoring_Rubrics/scoring_rubrics.html> Elements of a scoring rubric
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Analytical_Holistic/analytical_holistic.html> Analytical vs. holistic
rubrics
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Combining_Scores/combining_scores.html> Combining scores from
analytical rubric scales
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/General_Specific/general_specific.html> General vs. specific rubrics
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Share_Rubrics/share_rubrics.html> Share your rubric with students and
parents
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Find_Rubrics/find_rubrics.html> Where to find rubrics
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Eval_Rubrics/eval_rubrics.html> Evaluating rubrics
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Test_Drive/test_drive.html> Take a test drive!
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Reliable_Assessments/reliable_assessments.html> Why we need reliable
and valid assessments
 
<http://intranet.cps.k12.il.us/Assessments/Ideas_and_Rubrics/Intro_Scori
ng/Using_Rubric/using_rubric.html> Using your rubric
            Reference

*        "Using Portfolio Assessment in EL Civics Classes in
California"/ California Adult Education Research Digest Research Digest
No. 1/Performance Assessment  June 2003    Retrieved on 03/08/07 from
OTAN; click on>Research; click on>California Adult Research
*        "Developing Classroom Performance Assessments and Scoring
Rubrics -Part II."  Retrieved on 3/16/07 from ERIC www.eric.ed.gov
<http://www.eric.ed.gov/>   Enter ERIC  #ED481715 2003-06-00.
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Mon Jun  4 10:23:42 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 10:23:42 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 819]  TORCHLIGHTS IN ESL - New CAAL Paper
Message-ID: <A1F8BC8E-2A86-44F0-B68A-432524833267@caalusa.org>

MONDAY, JUNE  4, 2007, NEW YORK, N.Y. --  The Council for Advancement  
of Adult Literacy today releases TORCHLIGHTS IN ESL: Five Community  
College Profiles. The publication is a supplement to PASSING THE  
TORCH: Strategies for Innovation in Community College ESL -- the  
result of a two-year CAAL study by Forrest P. Chisman and JoAnn  
Crandall, published in March 2007. Both projects were made possible  
by support from the William and Flora Hewlett Foundation, Harold W.  
McGraw, Jr., The McGraw-Hill Companies, Inc.,  the Ford Foundation,  
and the Dollar General Corporation.

TORCHLIGHTS, 123 pages, gives detailed profiles of the ESL programs  
of each of  the five colleges at the heart of CAAL's study. It was  
authored by Elizabeth Zachry & Emily Dibble (Bunker  Hill Community  
College, MA), Sharon Seymour (City College of San Francisco, CA),  
Suzanne Leibman (College of Lake County, IL), Sandy Ares & Beth  
Larson (Seminole Community College, FL), and Pamela Ferguson (Yakima  
Community College, WA).  The profiles, especially if read in  
conjunction with CAAL's main research report, should be helpful to  
those who design and operate community college ESL programs as well  
as to policy makers and funding agencies. For example, they each  
contain a discussion of the financing and levels of funding needed to  
provide high quality adult ESL services.

The five programs profiled in TORCHLIGHTS offer extraordinarily high  
quality ESL instruction. They are considered exemplary according to  
standards and criteria developed in the CAAL research project and as  
judged by dozens of professionals across the country who nominated  
the programs for inclusion in the study. CAAL promised in releasing  
PASSING THE TORCH that it would publish detailed profiles of the  
programs. The release of TORCHLIGHTS makes good on that promise.

The main research report focuses on noncredit ESL services. It  
concentrates on generating learning gains, retaining students, and  
bringing about transitions to future education. Among the effective  
strategies examined are high intensity instruction, learning outside  
the classroom, and the use of "learner-centered" curricular. Special  
attention is given to curricular integration, coenrollment,  
vocational ESL (VESL), and the Spanish GED. Issues of faculty  
training, development, and quality are examined, and recommendations  
are given for "engineering innovation" in ESL colleges and programs.  
Funding and assessment issues are also treated.

To access the free PDF version of TORCHLIGHTS, click on the link  
provided above. Bound copies may be purchased directly from CAAL ($25  
plus postage and delivery, contact bheitner at caalusa.org for ordering  
instructions). Many other publications from CAAL, and from the  
National Commission on Adult Literacy, are available in PDF form at  
the CAAL web site (www.caalusa.org). All may be used freely with  
attribution.

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From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Mon Jun  4 12:38:45 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Mon, 4 Jun 2007 12:38:45 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 820]  Fwd: TORCHLIGHTS IN ESL - New CAAL Paper
References: <A1F8BC8E-2A86-44F0-B68A-432524833267@caalusa.org>
Message-ID: <A7080B20-E9CA-48CC-97E6-C854BD285FE2@caalusa.org>

NOTE:  The earlier posting of this news release carried an incorrect  
linking address for the CAAL web site. The necessary correction has  
been made in the copy forwarded here. BH

Begin forwarded message:

> From: Gail Spangenberg <gspangenberg at caalusa.org>
> Date: June 4, 2007 10:23:42 AM EDT
> To: assessment at nifl.gov, The Adult English Language Learners  
> Discussion List <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>,  
> familyliteracy at nifl.gov, professionaldevelopment at nifl.gov,  
> povertyracewomen at nifl.gov, technology at nifl.gov, workplace at nifl.gov,  
> National Literacy Advocacy List sponsored by AAACE <aaace- 
> nla at lists.literacytent.org>, library-lit at ala.org
> Subject: TORCHLIGHTS IN ESL - New CAAL Paper
>
>
> MONDAY, JUNE  4, 2007, NEW YORK, N.Y. --  The Council for  
> Advancement of Adult Literacy today releases TORCHLIGHTS IN ESL:  
> Five Community College Profiles. The publication is a supplement to  
> PASSING THE TORCH: Strategies for Innovation in Community College  
> ESL -- the result of a two-year CAAL study by Forrest P. Chisman  
> and JoAnn Crandall, published in March 2007. Both projects were  
> made possible by support from the William and Flora Hewlett  
> Foundation, Harold W. McGraw, Jr., The McGraw-Hill Companies,  
> Inc.,  the Ford Foundation, and the Dollar General Corporation.
>
> TORCHLIGHTS, 123 pages, gives detailed profiles of the ESL programs  
> of each of  the five colleges at the heart of CAAL's study. It was  
> authored by Elizabeth Zachry & Emily Dibble (Bunker  Hill Community  
> College, MA), Sharon Seymour (City College of San Francisco, CA),  
> Suzanne Leibman (College of Lake County, IL), Sandy Ares & Beth  
> Larson (Seminole Community College, FL), and Pamela Ferguson  
> (Yakima Community College, WA).  The profiles, especially if read  
> in conjunction with CAAL's main research report, should be helpful  
> to those who design and operate community college ESL programs as  
> well as to policy makers and funding agencies. For example, they  
> each contain a discussion of the financing and levels of funding  
> needed to provide high quality adult ESL services.
>
> The five programs profiled in TORCHLIGHTS offer extraordinarily  
> high quality ESL instruction. They are considered exemplary  
> according to standards and criteria developed in the CAAL research  
> project and as judged by dozens of professionals across the country  
> who nominated the programs for inclusion in the study. CAAL  
> promised in releasing PASSING THE TORCH that it would publish  
> detailed profiles of the programs. The release of TORCHLIGHTS makes  
> good on that promise.
>
> The main research report focuses on noncredit ESL services. It  
> concentrates on generating learning gains, retaining students, and  
> bringing about transitions to future education. Among the effective  
> strategies examined are high intensity instruction, learning  
> outside the classroom, and the use of "learner-centered"  
> curricular. Special attention is given to curricular integration,  
> coenrollment, vocational ESL (VESL), and the Spanish GED. Issues of  
> faculty training, development, and quality are examined, and  
> recommendations are given for "engineering innovation" in ESL  
> colleges and programs. Funding and assessment issues are also treated.
>
> To access the free PDF version of TORCHLIGHTS, click on the link  
> provided above. Bound copies may be purchased directly from CAAL  
> ($25 plus postage and delivery, contact bheitner at caalusa.org for  
> ordering instructions). Many other publications from CAAL, and from  
> the National Commission on Adult Literacy, are available in PDF  
> form at the CAAL web site (www.caalusa.org). All may be used freely  
> with attribution.
>
>
>

Gail Spangenberg
President
Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Fl
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2362, F: 212-512-2610
www.caalusa.org

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From djrosen at comcast.net  Sat Jun 16 23:02:53 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2007 23:02:53 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 821]  Special Topic: Community Literacy Discussion,
	June 25-29
Message-ID: <4674A45D.2080704@comcast.net>

Colleagues,

We will hold a discussion about community literacy on the National 
Institute for Literacy Special Topics discussion list during the week of 
June 25 -29.  Our guests for this discussion will include, among others: 
Margaret Doughty, Carl Guerriere, Petrice Sams- Abiodun, Darlene 
Kostrub, Jeff Carter, and Kathy Chernus.

We will discuss:

    * what community adult and family literacy means
    * what the community literacy purposes and goals are
    * why community literacy is important
    * who key community literacy stakeholders are
    * examples of community literacy coalitions
    * incentives and strategies for strengthening community literacy
    * how to measure the health, outcomes and impact of community literacy
    * the effect of community literacy on a community
    * what we know about community literacy from research
    * what the relationship is of community literacy to workforce
      literacy, workforce development, and transition to higher education
    * the role of technology in community literacy
    * what resources are needed for effective community literacy
      collaboration
    * how literacy organizations can work together to make literacy a
      top community priority

<>and more.

To subscribe to the Special Topics Discussion List, go to

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics

(After registering, you will be sent an email.  You must reply to the 
email immediately to be subscribed.)

<>You may unsubscribe, after this discussion, or remain subscribed to 
see if you are interested in the next discussion.  Between these 
specific, topic-oriented discussions, you will not receive messages from 
the list.

I look forward to your joining us in this discussion.

David J. Rosen

Special Topics Discussion List Moderator

djrosen at comcast.net

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From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Mon Jun 18 15:24:46 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2007 15:24:46 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 822]  NEW from National Commission on Adult Literacy
Message-ID: <E42B5CEA-B6AD-47E8-AFD9-7829A667343E@caalusa.org>

NEWS RELEASE - June 18, 2007, NYC -- The National Commission on Adult  
Literacy is today releasing FORCES CHANGING OUR NATION'S FUTURE,  
another of the presentations given at its second meeting on April 17,  
2007. This document, 44 pages long, was prepared by labor economist  
Andrew Sum of Northeastern University, a member of the National  
Commission. Dr. Sum is Professor and Director, Center for Labor  
Market Studies at Northeastern University. The resource is based on  
research findings from THE PERFECT STORM (Educational Testing  
Service, March 2007) which Dr. Sum co-authored along with Irwin  
Kirsch and other ETS researchers. It also draws on a number of other  
studies. The publication includes an Author's Introduction and  
Executive Summary and 30 graphs and tables. It examines the  
comparative performance of U.S. adults and youth on international  
literacy assessments, the importance of literacy/numeracy  
proficiencies for labor market success, and the projected outlook for  
literacy proficiencies of US. adults. The document is available in  
PDF form from the website of the Council for Advancement of Adult  
Literacy (CAAL manages the Commission project). It may also be  
purchased directly from CAAL in bound form ($25 plus postage, contact  
bheitner at caalusa.org for ordering instructions).

?

The following publications from the Commission are also available  
from the CAAL web site,  www.caalusa.org.

DARE TO DREAM: A Collection of Papers from a Resource Group of 102  
Education and Literacy Professionals;

MOUNTING PRESSURES Facing the U.S. Workforce and the Increasing Need  
for Adult Education and Literacy (prepared by executives of the  
National Center for Higher Education Management Systems);

Four Lay-of-the-Land Papers on The Federal Role in Adult Literacy  
(Lennox L. McLendon, Garrett Murphy, James Parker).

Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Fl
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2363, F: 212-512-2610
www.caalusa.org

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From djrosen at comcast.net  Tue Jun 19 19:15:15 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 19:15:15 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 823] Re: ALE WIki -- Wikiteers and Topic Leaders needed!
In-Reply-To: <8761A2A8-0338-44F0-BC1D-0261ACF4FE4B@comcast.net>
References: <8761A2A8-0338-44F0-BC1D-0261ACF4FE4B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <F5ED2063-B670-4C90-AB50-5C31CF55C826@comcast.net>

Colleagues,

Have  you used the Adult Literacy Education Wiki?

http://wiki.literacytent.org

Have you contributed to the ALE Wiki?  Would you like to be more  
involved with this (nearly 900 registered member) online adult  
literacy education community of practice?  There are several areas  
that need topic leaders.  Perhaps one of these would interest you:

? ESL/ESOL
? Workforce, Workplace and Worker Education
? Basic Literacy
? Reading
? Curriculum Development
? GED Research
? Learning Disabilities
? Program Design
? Project Based Learning
? Return on Investment
? Young Adult Literacy

This is a volunteer effort, and it's best if you choose an area that  
you are already working on/want to learn more about. If you are  
interested in being a topic leader for one of the above areas, please  
e-mail me.

David Rosen
djrosen1 at comcast.net

From Rwrightparker at ci.escondido.ca.us  Thu Jun 21 11:31:06 2007
From: Rwrightparker at ci.escondido.ca.us (Robin Wright Parker)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 08:31:06 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 824]  On-line tracking system?
Message-ID: <467A3749.D065.00A7.0@ci.escondido.ca.us>

We currently have info in different forms (hard and soft data) and in different locations (excel, written, etc).  We are seeking to move to an on-line platform so that tutors, learners, and administrators can enter certain information (demographic and/or assessment) on-line and the info will be stored in one comprehensive program so that we can then make better use of our data.  Is anyone already using an online platform; and if so, did you develop it in-house or hire someone to develop it for you?  We are looking for any model information we can find, but our searches haven't been very fruitful.  Any insights, suggestions, or words of wisdom will be greatly appreciated.
 
Warm regards,
 
 
 
Robin Parker
*******************************
Robin R. Wright Parker
Families For Literacy Coordinator 
Escondido Public Library
Phone: 760-839-4272
rwrightparker at ci.escondido.ca.us

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From barguedas at sfccnm.edu  Thu Jun 21 11:58:23 2007
From: barguedas at sfccnm.edu (Barbara Arguedas)
Date: Thu, 21 Jun 2007 09:58:23 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 825] Re: On-line tracking system?
In-Reply-To: <467A3749.D065.00A7.0@ci.escondido.ca.us>
Message-ID: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C66D@ex01.sfcc.edu>

Hello.  New Mexico has adopted the LACES program, a product of
LiteracyPro, for all ABE programs in the state.  LACES is an on-line
system.  At this time we have not done input from off-site locations but
it is possible to do.  Literacy Volunteers of Santa Fe has used the
LiteracyPro database (not web-based), put out by the same company, for
several years.  LiteracyPro (the database) has extra components for
entering tutor and donor information.  We are waiting for the
LiteracyPro database to become web-based and more compatible with LACES
so that we can combine the data.  You should be able to find
LiteracyPro.com on the web.  Hope this helps.  

Barbara Arguedas

ABE Director

Santa Fe Community College

Santa Fe, NM 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Robin Wright Parker
Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:31 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 824] On-line tracking system?

 

We currently have info in different forms (hard and soft data) and in
different locations (excel, written, etc).  We are seeking to move to an
on-line platform so that tutors, learners, and administrators can enter
certain information (demographic and/or assessment) on-line and the info
will be stored in one comprehensive program so that we can then make
better use of our data.  Is anyone already using an online platform; and
if so, did you develop it in-house or hire someone to develop it for
you?  We are looking for any model information we can find, but our
searches haven't been very fruitful.  Any insights, suggestions, or
words of wisdom will be greatly appreciated.

 

Warm regards,

 

 

 

Robin Parker

*******************************

Robin R. Wright Parker
Families For Literacy Coordinator 
Escondido Public Library

Phone: 760-839-4272
rwrightparker at ci.escondido.ca.us
<mailto:rwrightparker at ci.escondido.ca.us>  

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From djrosen at comcast.net  Sat Jun 23 07:17:52 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2007 07:17:52 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 826] Reminder: Community Literacy Discussion Begins
	Monday, June 25th
Message-ID: <658AAD10-9E01-4835-8D77-5EE41BC78B89@comcast.net>

Colleagues,

The Community Literacy discussion begins Monday on the National  
Institute for Literacy's Special Topics List. For more information  
about the discussion go to:

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/specialtopics/2007/000338.html

or (the short URL):

http://tinyurl.com/23nvye

To subscribe (free) go to:

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics

David J. Rosen
Special Topcs Discussion Moderator
djrosen at comcast.net

From gleasonm at ccliteracy.org  Mon Jun 25 09:58:51 2007
From: gleasonm at ccliteracy.org (Mary V Gleason)
Date: Mon, 25 Jun 2007 06:58:51 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 827] Re: On-line tracking system?
In-Reply-To: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C66D@ex01.sfcc.edu>
References: <4CFDD6B88B634C409A76C0F44B3509BE04B6C66D@ex01.sfcc.edu>
Message-ID: <4583.168.53.172.145.1182779931.squirrel@webmail.ccliteracy.org>

Hi - we just talked with e-tapestry. Their online donor database program
sounds good, is expensive for us ($4-5000) but has some good ideas.   I
know there are others.  I have heard from some folks that LACES is
difficult.

Mary

> Hello.  New Mexico has adopted the LACES program, a product of
> LiteracyPro, for all ABE programs in the state.  LACES is an on-line
> system.  At this time we have not done input from off-site locations but
> it is possible to do.  Literacy Volunteers of Santa Fe has used the
> LiteracyPro database (not web-based), put out by the same company, for
> several years.  LiteracyPro (the database) has extra components for
> entering tutor and donor information.  We are waiting for the
> LiteracyPro database to become web-based and more compatible with LACES
> so that we can combine the data.  You should be able to find
> LiteracyPro.com on the web.  Hope this helps.
>
> Barbara Arguedas
>
> ABE Director
>
> Santa Fe Community College
>
> Santa Fe, NM
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Robin Wright Parker
> Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2007 9:31 AM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 824] On-line tracking system?
>
>
>
> We currently have info in different forms (hard and soft data) and in
> different locations (excel, written, etc).  We are seeking to move to an
> on-line platform so that tutors, learners, and administrators can enter
> certain information (demographic and/or assessment) on-line and the info
> will be stored in one comprehensive program so that we can then make
> better use of our data.  Is anyone already using an online platform; and
> if so, did you develop it in-house or hire someone to develop it for
> you?  We are looking for any model information we can find, but our
> searches haven't been very fruitful.  Any insights, suggestions, or
> words of wisdom will be greatly appreciated.
>
>
>
> Warm regards,
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Robin Parker
>
> *******************************
>
> Robin R. Wright Parker
> Families For Literacy Coordinator
> Escondido Public Library
>
> Phone: 760-839-4272
> rwrightparker at ci.escondido.ca.us
> <mailto:rwrightparker at ci.escondido.ca.us>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to gleasonm at ccliteracy.org
>

Mary V. Gleason
Executive Director, CC Literacy Council
4044 Greenwood Dr., CC, TX 78416
(361) 857-5896   Fax: 854-5898

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Sun Jul  1 09:17:50 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Sun, 1 Jul 2007 09:17:50 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 828]  Assessment in Distance Learning:  Save the date!
Message-ID: <007601c7bbe2$3a320c70$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
I wanted to let you know that there will be a guest discussion on
assessment in distance learning on this List during the week of July 9.
 
Look for a full announcement coming soon!
 
Thanks!
 
Marie Cora
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Jul  2 11:09:10 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2007 11:09:10 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 829]  List Tips for Subscribers
Message-ID: <013401c7bcba$f2484530$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Discussion List Tips
Here are some suggestions for maximizing your experience as a List
Member, both in terms of getting the most out of the content, as well as
minimizing the time and effort involved in following the Discussion
List.  In addition to the tips below, you should always feel free to
contact me with any questions or concerns, or if you need help:
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
Posting to the List
Please include an email address in your signature line in at least your
first message so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry off-list
if they choose.
Please be sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of your
message; many subscribers follow discussion threads via the Subject
Line, and often, the message content shifts as people converse, but the
Subject Line remains the same from the first posted message.  This makes
it more difficult to follow discussion threads.  Please remember to
check the Subject Line info and change it to appropriately reflect your
message content, if needed.
Consider whether your reply is best suited to send to only one person or
the whole group.
Managing Your Subscription
Digest Format
This format allows subscribers to receive Discussion List messages
"bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line will not be
topic-specific, so any replies to digest format often mean the subject
line will need adjusting before replying. Also, subscribers using digest
format do not receive the information that was posted right away.
Because of that, this option may or may not suit everyone's needs.
>From the Assessment Discussion List page:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
Scroll down to Unsubscribe and other options at the bottom and enter
your subscription email address.  
This takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to unsubscribe or
to log in using your password. Log in. (There is a button you can click
to have your password emailed to you if you've forgotten it.)
Once you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest mode".
Click this to "on", then scroll down further and click "submit my
changes."
Use the archives
You do not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so if
you are interested in reading about certain topics, but don't want to be
a List Member, this option is open for you.  (See below for more
information on using the archives.)
Just hit delete!
This is when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic of
discussion just isn't up your alley, or you simply don't have the time
at the moment, the delete button is a good option.  No one is making you
be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all your choice!
Often subscribers say that they just can't hit delete for fear of
missing something, but remember that all posts get logged automatically
in the archives and so when you *do* have the time or when that topic
area *does* interest you, you can go back and search for those posts in
the archives.
Using the Archives
To read full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the
Assessment List Archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
The archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
In the right-hand toolbar:
Click on Search Archives; you can search just the Assessment archives or
all the List archives from here; search by thread, subject, or author.
Click on List Events to view information on upcoming, as well as past,
Discussion Topics.  
Click on List Help for the FAQ about using the Lists.
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Jul  6 12:14:54 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 12:14:54 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 830] Assessment in Distance Learning Discussion next
	week!
Message-ID: <045601c7bfe8$cb305a10$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Discussion Announcement 
Dear Colleagues, 
I'm pleased to announce the following Guest Discussion, which will be
held during the week of July 9 (next week!!):
Topic: Assessment in Distance Learning 
Guest Participants: 
Jennifer Rafferty currently works as an independent education
consultant.  Formerly, she worked at the Adult Literacy Resource
Institute at SABES Boston where she held the role of Project Manager for
the Massachusetts ABE Distance Learning Project.  She has worked in the
field of ABE since 1998.
 
Shannon Young is the Program Manager for the Support Center at Project
IDEAL / AdultEd Online and is a Senior Research Area Specialist for the
Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology at The University of
Michigan's Institute for Social Research. She oversees the Center's work
on curriculum and assessment issues and leads the design team that
creates online tools used to collect student data and support teachers
in member states.  Shannon has conducted education research in k-12 and
ABE settings and been a tutor and writing instructor since 1991.
Recommended preparations for this discussion:
Please consider any of the following questions as catalysts for
discussion.  There is some redundancy with the questions below; however,
the questions are articulated slightly differently and so might provide
people with different entry points of thought.  Also, perhaps
subscribers will find it interesting to view Massachusetts as a sort of
case study given that the issues faced there appear to mirror the issues
faced elsewhere in Distance Learning. 
 
Measures of Progress-Informal and Ongoing
 
In the discussion on pre-assessments for online learning (see Resources
of Interest, below), participants talked about the ways in which they
use various pre-assessments, orientation activities, and technology
training to gauge readiness and prepare their students to become
distance learners who persist beyond the "try-out" phase.  
 
In distance learning, the initial orientation period may be one of the
few times teachers and students are face to face.   The types of
informal, ongoing assessments teachers routinely use in classrooms
(e.g., "reading" students to determine comprehension, redirecting or
expanding discussions, group activities, quizzes, etc.) frequently
aren't available in a distance setting.  So, once we have students in
the distance-learning door, how can we use progress measures and
informal assessments to help keep them engaged? What do those measures
entail?  What does and doesn't work and why?   What role might partner
agencies and/or interested "others" play in the assessment process and
in helping students stay connected and engaged?
 
As a distance teacher, how do you use the results of progress measures
to inform your teaching? 
 
Post-Testing and the NRS
 
In June, the NRS posted its official guidelines for counting distance
learners in the NRS tables.  One of the guidelines for counting distance
learners states that students be post-tested in a proctored setting
using a standardized assessment at intervals designated by the test
developer or by state policy.   Some states follow test developer
guidelines.  Others mandate students be post-tested after a certain
number of days.  
 
*	How do you get your distance learners to take standardized
post-tests?  
*	How do you prepare them in advance to understand the necessity
of post-testing?  
*	What sorts of partnerships have you formed with other service
providers (e.g., libraries, career link centers, etc.) to handle
post-testing distance learners?  What advice would you have for others
interested in forming these partnerships?
*	What do you do when a student achieves his/her goal before the
pre-determined post-test interval?  For example, many students come into
distance programs with specific, short-term goals and study intently for
brief periods of time (e.g., 50 hours of study over a two-week period).
They meet their objectives and are ready to exit a program.  If they
have not been designated as a project-based learner, how do you handle
accounting for these students?  Do you post-test even if they haven't
met the pre-established time-based criteria?    
 
The following questions are based on discussions that have come up with
distance learning programs in Massachusetts:  
 
Questions related to standardized assessments, NRS, and state assessment
policies: 
 
1. What standardized testing instruments do you use with distance
learners in your state?  
 
2. Are your distance learning programs required to follow assessment
policies/guidelines that were created for classroom programs, or has
your state developed a separate set of distance learning assessment
policies? 
 
3. Do the standardized assessments align well with the dl curricula
being used in your state? 
 
4. How successful has your program been with pre and post assessment of
distance learners?  
 
5. What strategies have you implemented to encourage learners to return
for a post-test and which strategies have been the most successful? 
 
6. Has your state developed any remote testing guidelines that would
make it easier for learners to access required assessments without
having to return to the adult learning program? 
 
7. Does your state use a standardized assessment that is
online/web-based?  If so, has having a web-based assessment made it
easier for your program to pre and post-test learners?
 
Questions related to other forms of assessment for dl programs:
 
What other assessment instruments do you use to gauge whether your
learners are appropriate for distance learning delivery? Do you think
that these assessments give a good indication as to whether or not the
learner is prepared for self-directed learning? What skills needed for
dl are not so easily evaluated with inventories and assessments?  
 
Resources of interest:
 
Project IDEAL (Improving Distance Education for Adult Learners):
http://projectideal.org      
 
AdultEdOnline:  http://www.adultedonline.org  (Introduction to distance
teaching and free online self-assessment for classroom teachers
interested in becoming a distance teacher)
 
"Pre-Assessments for On-Line Learning"; Excerpt from Special Topics
Community Literacy discussion; go to:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance_1.htm
l
The discussion begins with questions regarding early drop-out and
retention issues and asks whether "try-out periods" are integral to
on-line learning processes.  It then focuses on the inclusion of
pre-assessments, as well as pre- and on-going orientation sessions as
strategies for improving retention and success rates.  
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From jataylor at utk.edu  Fri Jul  6 12:24:23 2007
From: jataylor at utk.edu (Taylor, Jackie)
Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 12:24:23 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 831] Discussion of Professional Development Research
	(July 9 - 13)
Message-ID: <0913EC48F2B05C4FBE4878BAFCABBFEC8E0C50@KFSVS2.utk.tennessee.edu>

Dear List Colleagues,

Next week (July 9-13), the Adult Literacy Professional Development
Discussion List is hosting a guest discussion on professional
development research, and implications for teaching and learning in our
field. To join the discussion, visit:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Professionaldevelopment 

 

For a web-based version of the announcement below, visit:
http://tinyurl.com/yvuvzr 

 

Looking forward!  Jackie Taylor, Adult Literacy Professional Development
List Moderator, jataylor at utk.edu 

 

 

Title:   Research on Professional Development and Teacher Change:
Implications for Adult Basic Education

Date:   July 9-13, 2007

Resource for Discussion:
http://www.ncsall.net/fileadmin/resources/ann_rev/smith-gillespie-07.pdf

Guests:

Marilyn Gillespie, Ed.D., Senior Educational Researcher, Center for
Education Policy, SRI International

Cristine Smith, Ed.D., Assistant Professor, Center for International
Education, University of Massachusetts, Amherst (Guest Bios:
http://tinyurl.com/2bpyap)

To participate, subscribe:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Professionaldevelopment

To submit questions for discussion, email: jataylor at utk.edu 

 

Description: Historically, very little research has been conducted in
adult literacy professional development. Recently, the National Center
for the Study of Adult Learning and Literacy (NCSALL) has published a
chapter within the Review of Adult Learning and Literacy (v. 7) on
research in professional development and teacher change
<http://www.ncsall.net/fileadmin/resources/ann_rev/smith-gillespie-07.pd
f> . This chapter (available free and online) draws from the NCSALL
Professional Development Study as well as research on professional
development from the K-12 field. Join the Adult Literacy Professional
Development Discussion List where the authors, Cristine Smith and
Marilyn Gillespie, will participate with subscribers in discussion on
teacher professional development issues like: 

*	What is known about what makes teacher professional development
effective 
*	How teachers change as a result of professional development 
*	Implications for policy, practice and research in professional
development 
*	How the Association of Adult Literacy Professional Developers
(AALPD) can take action to: 

	a.	Develop a centralized location for professional
development research, and 
	b.	Advance research in adult literacy professional
development. 

************************************************

Preparation for PD Research Discussion

Please reflect on your answers to any of the following...

 

Overall:

1)     From your experience, what has been the most effective
professional development in which you have participated? What factors
made it most valuable for your professional growth and learning?

 

2)     What aspects of the chapter on professional development research
stood out to you most? Why?

 

3)     What are the similarities and notable differences between K-12
and adult literacy education professional development?

 

Lessons Learned

4)     Given the lessons learned from the NCSALL Professional
Development Study and PD research in general, are these understandings
being translated into the professional development our field is offering
teachers? For example:

a.      Is more teacher training involving both the program
administrator and teacher?

b.      Are you seeing more follow-up on-site?

c.      Is there less of a focus in the field on single-session
workshops and more on program-based, job-embedded, or hybrid models of
professional development?

 

State of Research

5)     What are the differences in K-12 and adult literacy professional
development research needs?

 

6)     What kinds of research in adult literacy professional development
are most needed?

 

Funding:

7)     How are states currently funding professional development
research? What are potential ways in which states may fund PD research,
such as collaborating with neighboring states to address common PD
research questions of concern?

 

Professional Development Models

8)     On-site professional development vs. the regional or state
workshop model: What are the advantages and disadvantages of each?

 

Single-Session Professional Development - Exception vs. Norm

9)     The authors note that one implication for practice from
professional development research is that states should make
single-session workshops the exception rather than the norm. Do you
agree? Why or why not?

 

10)  What are other options for increasing professional development
designs that offer longer term, more job-embedded models of professional
development?

 

Teacher Working Conditions

11) Authors discuss what researchers call the "dilution effect" of
professional development: The actual impact of the professional
development is diluted by all of the other factors that support or
hinder teachers from making change.

 

a.      How do teachers' working conditions (such as paid prep time or
benefits) relate to their ability to make use of the professional
development they receive?

 

b.      Is improving teacher working conditions a concern that can only
be addressed at the local level? Why or why not?

 

c.      What work is being done to improve teacher working conditions in
programs and states? What has changed since the advent of the NCSALL
Professional Development Study, specifically pertaining to teacher
working conditions? Have we "taken the lesson home?" To heart?

 

The Role of the School Administrator in Teacher Professional Development

12)  How do program directors support and/or constrain teacher change?

 

Using Student Data to Improve Instruction

13) What work is being done in using student achievement data to improve
teaching practice?

 

Teacher Turnover

14)  Is teacher turnover higher in adult education than in K-12? What
are the factors that cause teachers to leave the field of adult
education? What are the implications of high teacher turnover for our
students, for our field?

 

Serve More Students or Serve Fewer, Better?

15) From your experience, share your perspective on the issue about the
extent to which research-based professional development should be more
heavily invested. For example, given that research indicates that
working conditions, such as access to benefits and paid preparation time
for ABE teachers, may actually influence the effectiveness of
professional development, should policy makers consider whether any
increase in funding be channeled into such expenditures, even if fewer
students are served as a result?

 

16) The annual average cost per adult education student in states is
$800.00. In many states, this cost is much lower. Should it cost more to
teach adult education students? Why or why not?

 

17) What other issues may arise in the quantity versus quality debate?

 

 

 

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Jul  9 09:22:13 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 9 Jul 2007 09:22:13 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 832] Assessment in Distance Learning discussion begins
	today!!
Message-ID: <073201c7c22c$2a50dac0$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hello everyone,
 
I would like to welcome our guests Jennifer Rafferty and Shannon Young.
They have both posed some interesting questions as catalysts for
discussion, and I encourage subscribers to take a look at these
(http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance.html
#prep), ask your own questions, or respond to any ideas that strike you.

 
Let's hear from programs and states that are now engaged in offering
distance learning opportunities:  what are your successes and
challenges?  Do Shannon's and Jennifer's questions and points feel
familiar to your experience?     Do you have strategies for tackling
assessment and accountability mandates?  What are they?
 
Did you read through the resource "Pre-Assessments for Online Learning"?
(http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance_1.ht
ml).  What did you think of that discussion?
 
For full information on this discussion including the announcement,
guest profiles, and suggested preparations, go to:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance.html#
announce.
 
Thanks and looking forward to hearing from you!
 
Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jul 10 10:08:08 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 10:08:08 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 833]  DL question on evaluation
Message-ID: <084001c7c2fb$be807d20$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

The following is posted on behalf of a subscriber:
 
 
Do states that fund and support distance learning have a coordinating
entity to provide leadership, oversight, and accountability?  How do DL
programs within a particular state get evaluated in terms of their
effectiveness? 
 
 
 
Thanks,
 
Marie Cora
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jul 10 10:33:45 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 10:33:45 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 834]  Questions for discussion
Message-ID: <084501c7c2ff$52a73f90$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List,
so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions
and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post them now!
 
Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has
already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests
Shannon and Jennifer:
 
Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important
follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within
professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know
how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.  The same
goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can
be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in hearing from folks
about the strategies and methods they use to get DL students to complete
the full cycle including the post-test.
 
Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this
regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to
help demonstrate achievement?
 
Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you
able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of
funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
 
Thanks!!

Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From VenuT at lacnyc.org  Tue Jul 10 15:13:20 2007
From: VenuT at lacnyc.org (Venu Thelakkat)
Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 15:13:20 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 835] Re: DL question on evaluation
In-Reply-To: <084001c7c2fb$be807d20$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB84C3D9F@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

I can speak only from my experiences in New York State, which has a large number of students in Distance Learning programs.  The State Education Department, which sets policies on management and assessment in these programs, have started conducting analyses on the effectiveness of distance learning programs vis-?-vis regular classroom programs (not that much difference in effectiveness) and programs themselves are encouraged to look at the NRS reports of distance learning programs separately.  Distance learning programs are evaluated in NY the same way as other services are, using NRS guidelines.  Starting in FY2008 (December 2009) the Federal Department of Education is going to ask all states provide disaggregated reports on students in distance learning programs, so the focus on these services is intensifying.  

 

Venu Thelakkat

Director of ALIES/Data Analysis

Literacy Assistance Center

32 Broadway, 10th Floor

New York, NY 10004

Phone: (212) 803-3370

Fax: (212) 785-3685

Email: venut at lacnyc.org

Web: www.alies.org

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:08 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 833] DL question on evaluation

 

The following is posted on behalf of a subscriber:

 

 

Do states that fund and support distance learning have a coordinating entity to provide leadership, oversight, and accountability?  How do DL programs within a particular state get evaluated in terms of their effectiveness? 

 

 

 

Thanks,

 

Marie Cora

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

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From msturm at alphaplus.ca  Tue Jul 10 15:41:36 2007
From: msturm at alphaplus.ca (Matthias Sturm)
Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 15:41:36 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 836] Re: DL question on evaluation
References: <084001c7c2fb$be807d20$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <B9D3C83445977944A514A77AF8052B1501DC97@aotmail.appsontap.ca>

Hi all
 
Since my experience comes from working on pilot project in Ontario, Canada, I can't comment on how individual States in the U.S. accomplish this but I can share some things from North of the border with you and I hope they are to some value to this discussion.
 
During the pilot phase of the project from 2003 to 2006, AlphaPlus Centre [http://www.alphaplus.ca] was contracted to provide the coordination of communications, research, professional development and to the extend of the research data gathered also accountability. Four literacy programs were contracted by the government directly to explore, implement and research distance, online, blended and/or flexible learning models in partnership with AlphaPlus. I was working as the project coordinator of this project at AlphaPlus Centre. In case you haven't seen the link posted on the introduction page to this discussion, the research report and an executive summary can be accessed online in pdf format. [http://distance.alphaplus.ca]
 
Since the pilot project phases finished the Ontario government has been working on a accountability framework that would make the evaluation of the effectiveness of the programs and reporting to the government as the funder of ABE in Ontario more effective.
 
Matthias 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Tue 10-Jul-07 10:08 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 833] DL question on evaluation

The following is posted on behalf of a subscriber:
 
 
Do states that fund and support distance learning have a coordinating entity to provide leadership, oversight, and accountability?  How do DL programs within a particular state get evaluated in terms of their effectiveness? 
 
 
 
Thanks,
 
Marie Cora
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Tue Jul 10 18:40:44 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 15:40:44 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 837] Re: DL question on evaluation
In-Reply-To: <084001c7c2fb$be807d20$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <084001c7c2fb$be807d20$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <OF93912AD4.13E6EAFE-ON07257314.007C9460-07257314.007C9461@yc.edu>

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From belcherkitty at shaw.ca  Tue Jul 10 19:58:53 2007
From: belcherkitty at shaw.ca (mary belcher)
Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 16:58:53 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 838] Re: DL question on evaluation
References: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB84C3D9F@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
Message-ID: <005901c7c34e$453a9100$6802a8c0@maryb>

What are 'disaggregated reports' ?
Mary B.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Venu Thelakkat 
  To: The Assessment Discussion List 
  Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 12:13 PM
  Subject: [Assessment 835] Re: DL question on evaluation

  I can speak only from my experiences in New York State, which has a large number of students in Distance Learning programs.  The State Education Department, which sets policies on management and assessment in these programs, have started conducting analyses on the effectiveness of distance learning programs vis-?-vis regular classroom programs (not that much difference in effectiveness) and programs themselves are encouraged to look at the NRS reports of distance learning programs separately.  Distance learning programs are evaluated in NY the same way as other services are, using NRS guidelines.  Starting in FY2008 (December 2009) the Federal Department of Education is going to ask all states provide disaggregated reports on students in distance learning programs, so the focus on these services is intensifying.  

   

  Venu Thelakkat

  Director of ALIES/Data Analysis

  Literacy Assistance Center

  32 Broadway, 10th Floor

  New York, NY 10004

  Phone: (212) 803-3370

  Fax: (212) 785-3685

  Email: venut at lacnyc.org

  Web: www.alies.org

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Marie Cora
  Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:08 AM
  To: Assessment at nifl.gov
  Subject: [Assessment 833] DL question on evaluation

   

  The following is posted on behalf of a subscriber:

   

   

  Do states that fund and support distance learning have a coordinating entity to provide leadership, oversight, and accountability?  How do DL programs within a particular state get evaluated in terms of their effectiveness? 

   

   

   

  Thanks,

   

  Marie Cora

   

  Marie Cora

  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

  NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

  Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

  http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

   

   

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From VenuT at lacnyc.org  Tue Jul 10 23:07:48 2007
From: VenuT at lacnyc.org (Venu Thelakkat)
Date: Tue, 10 Jul 2007 23:07:48 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 839] Re: DL question on evaluation
References: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB84C3D9F@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
	<005901c7c34e$453a9100$6802a8c0@maryb>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB8377F1A@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

Sorry, by that I meant reports prepared not for the whole program or agency but just for the distance learning program.  This allows a program to evaluate the performance of a specific distance learning product or all distance learning offerings.  
 
Venu Thelakkat
Director of ALIES/Data Analysis
Literacy Assistance Center
32 Broadway, 10th Floor
New York, NY 10004
Phone: (212) 803-3370
Fax: (212) 785-3685
Email: venut at lacnyc.org
Web: www.alies.org

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of mary belcher
Sent: Tue 7/10/2007 7:58 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 838] Re: DL question on evaluation

What are 'disaggregated reports' ?
Mary B.

	----- Original Message ----- 
	From: Venu Thelakkat <mailto:VenuT at lacnyc.org>  
	To: The Assessment Discussion List <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov>  
	Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 12:13 PM
	Subject: [Assessment 835] Re: DL question on evaluation

	I can speak only from my experiences in New York State, which has a large number of students in Distance Learning programs.  The State Education Department, which sets policies on management and assessment in these programs, have started conducting analyses on the effectiveness of distance learning programs vis-?-vis regular classroom programs (not that much difference in effectiveness) and programs themselves are encouraged to look at the NRS reports of distance learning programs separately.  Distance learning programs are evaluated in NY the same way as other services are, using NRS guidelines.  Starting in FY2008 (December 2009) the Federal Department of Education is going to ask all states provide disaggregated reports on students in distance learning programs, so the focus on these services is intensifying.  

	 

	Venu Thelakkat

	Director of ALIES/Data Analysis

	Literacy Assistance Center

	32 Broadway, 10th Floor

	New York, NY 10004

	Phone: (212) 803-3370

	Fax: (212) 785-3685

	Email: venut at lacnyc.org

	Web: www.alies.org <http://www.alies.org/> 

	
________________________________

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Marie Cora
	Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:08 AM
	To: Assessment at nifl.gov
	Subject: [Assessment 833] DL question on evaluation

	 

	The following is posted on behalf of a subscriber:

	 

	 

	Do states that fund and support distance learning have a coordinating entity to provide leadership, oversight, and accountability?  How do DL programs within a particular state get evaluated in terms of their effectiveness? 

	 

	 

	 

	Thanks,

	 

	Marie Cora

	 

	Marie Cora

	marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

	NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

	Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

	http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

	 

	 

	
________________________________

	

	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	Email delivered to belcherkitty at shaw.ca
	

	
________________________________

	

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From mjjerdems at yahoo.com  Wed Jul 11 07:46:07 2007
From: mjjerdems at yahoo.com (Mary Jane Jerde)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 04:46:07 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 840] Re: DL question on evaluation
In-Reply-To: <005901c7c34e$453a9100$6802a8c0@maryb>
Message-ID: <957046.67922.qm@web54001.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

It means separated out into various groupings.

mary belcher <belcherkitty at shaw.ca> wrote:     v\:* {  BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML) } o\:* {  BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML) } w\:* {  BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML) } .shape {  BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML) }    st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) }       What are 'disaggregated reports' ?
 Mary B.
    ----- Original Message ----- 
   From:    Venu Thelakkat    
   To: The Assessment Discussion List 
   Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 12:13    PM
   Subject: [Assessment 835] Re: DL question    on evaluation
   

      I can speak only    from my experiences in New    York State, which has a large number of    students in Distance Learning programs.  The State Education Department,    which sets policies on management and assessment in these programs, have    started conducting analyses on the effectiveness of distance learning programs    vis-?-vis regular classroom programs (not that much difference in    effectiveness) and programs themselves are encouraged to look at the NRS    reports of distance learning programs separately.  Distance learning    programs are evaluated in NY the same way as other services are, using NRS    guidelines.  Starting in FY2008 (December 2009) the Federal Department of    Education is going to ask all states provide disaggregated reports on students    in distance learning programs, so the focus on these services is intensifying.     
    
      Venu    Thelakkat
   Director of    ALIES/Data Analysis
   Literacy Assistance Center
   32 Broadway, 10th    Floor
   New    York, NY 10004
   Phone: (212)    803-3370
   Fax: (212)    785-3685
   Email: venut at lacnyc.org
   Web: www.alies.org

         
---------------------------------
   
   From:    assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:08    AM
To:    Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject:    [Assessment 833] DL question on evaluation

    
   The following is posted on behalf    of a subscriber:
    
    
   Do states that fund and support distance learning have    a coordinating entity to provide leadership, oversight, and    accountability?  How do DL programs within a particular state get    evaluated in terms of their effectiveness? 
    
    
    
   Thanks,
    
   Marie    Cora
    
   Marie    Cora
   marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
   NIFL Assessment Discussion List    Moderator
   http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
   Coordinator, LINCS Assessment    Special Collection
   http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
    
    

      

---------------------------------
    
-------------------------------
National Institute for    Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe    or change your subscription settings, please go to    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to    belcherkitty at shaw.ca
      

---------------------------------
    
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-------------------------------
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To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
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From Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu  Wed Jul 11 09:06:14 2007
From: Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu (Jennifer A. Rafferty)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 09:06:14 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 840] Re: DL question on evaluation
References: <084001c7c2fb$be807d20$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
	<OF93912AD4.13E6EAFE-ON07257314.007C9460-07257314.007C9461@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A0772156@ebe3.umassb.net>

Thank you for your post, Tina!  Great to see you here.  My question to you is not related to assessment, but it is a follow-up question on what you have described below for going to scale.  If all programs in AZ are required to offer a distance learning option, how is this funded?  Did programs have to choose to offer a dl program service option and give up a f-2-f class in order to fund the component, or is there funding available for the required distance learning component?

Jennifer

Jennifer Rafferty
jennifer.rafferty at umb.edu

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Tina_Luffman at yc.edu
Sent: Tue 7/10/2007 6:40 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 837] Re: DL question on evaluation
 
Hi NIFL List:
 
In response to this question on evaluation, here in Arizona the state hired Sheryl Hart, Matthew Piech, and one other representative to handle the distance learning needs. Then the state offered additional funding to seven programs to run pilot sites for a three year period. These seven programs were chosen from a pool of current GED providers statewide. As of now we have completed our three year pilot and are going to scale, which means that all GED programs in Arizona must have a distance learning component whether they operate their own or partner with another provider.
 
Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

	To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
	From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
	Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
	Date: 07/10/2007 07:08AM
	Subject: [Assessment 833] DL question on evaluation
	
	

	The following is posted on behalf of a subscriber: 

	  

	  

	Do states that fund and support distance learning have a coordinating entity to provide leadership, oversight, and accountability?   How do DL programs within a particular state get evaluated in terms of their effectiveness? 

	  

	  

	  

	Thanks, 

	  

	Marie Cora 

	  

	Marie Cora 

	marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

	NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator 

	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

	Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection 

	http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 

	  

	  

	-------------------------------
	National Institute for Literacy
	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	Email delivered to tina_luffman at yc.edu
	

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From Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu  Wed Jul 11 09:25:57 2007
From: Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu (Jennifer A. Rafferty)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 09:25:57 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 841] Re: DL question on evaluation
References: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB84C3D9F@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
Message-ID: <FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A0772157@ebe3.umassb.net>

Thank you for you posting, Venu.  You mention two distinct groups below that can provide us with data to analyze the effectiveness of distance learning, the classroom programs and distance learning programs. I am wondering if New York allows learners to coenroll in both a classroom and a distance learning program?  

Jennifer

Jennifer Rafferty
Distance Learning Project Manager
Adult Literacy Resource Institute
jennifer.rafferty at umb.edu
617-287-4081

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Venu Thelakkat
Sent: Tue 7/10/2007 3:13 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 835] Re: DL question on evaluation
 
I can speak only from my experiences in New York State, which has a large number of students in Distance Learning programs.  The State Education Department, which sets policies on management and assessment in these programs, have started conducting analyses on the effectiveness of distance learning programs vis-?-vis regular classroom programs (not that much difference in effectiveness) and programs themselves are encouraged to look at the NRS reports of distance learning programs separately.  Distance learning programs are evaluated in NY the same way as other services are, using NRS guidelines.  Starting in FY2008 (December 2009) the Federal Department of Education is going to ask all states provide disaggregated reports on students in distance learning programs, so the focus on these services is intensifying.  

 

Venu Thelakkat

Director of ALIES/Data Analysis

Literacy Assistance Center

32 Broadway, 10th Floor

New York, NY 10004

Phone: (212) 803-3370

Fax: (212) 785-3685

Email: venut at lacnyc.org

Web: www.alies.org

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:08 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 833] DL question on evaluation

 

The following is posted on behalf of a subscriber:

 

 

Do states that fund and support distance learning have a coordinating entity to provide leadership, oversight, and accountability?  How do DL programs within a particular state get evaluated in terms of their effectiveness? 

 

 

 

Thanks,

 

Marie Cora

 

Marie Cora

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

 

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From lchenven at 1199etjsp.org  Wed Jul 11 10:45:14 2007
From: lchenven at 1199etjsp.org (Laura Chenven)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 10:45:14 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 842] Re: Questions for discussion
In-Reply-To: <084501c7c2ff$52a73f90$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <084501c7c2ff$52a73f90$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <AD114AC462004246B6C08FF2E4E7A6C203DBDA6C@1199mail.1199etjsp.org>

Let me raise another question.  I am new to this list so it may be
something that many of you have already discussed.  
 
I work with a national labor/management partnership that supports
training and education for the incumbent healthcare workforce.  We are
supporting several distance learning and hybrid nursing programs.
Because these programs are asynchronous for the most part and can fit
into many workers busy schedules, there is a great deal of interest in
them.  However, because we realize that distance learning may not be the
best modality for everyone, we want to be able to be able to screen for
students who are most likely to be successful in this kind of program
and also pinpoint other students who may be successful with some extra
help up front.
 
I'd love to hear others experiences with this type of screening.  Do you
find it necessary?  Is it helpful?  What have you learned.
I'm looking forward to hearing from you.
 
Laura Chenven
H-CAP National Coordinator
202 257-7108
lchenven at 1199etjsp.org

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion

Hi everyone,
 
It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List,
so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions
and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post them now!
 
Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has
already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests
Shannon and Jennifer:
 
Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important
follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within
professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know
how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.  The same
goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can
be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in hearing from folks
about the strategies and methods they use to get DL students to complete
the full cycle including the post-test.
 
Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this
regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to
help demonstrate achievement?
 
Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you
able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of
funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
 
Thanks!!

Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 

.

.
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Jul 11 11:47:16 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 11:47:16 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 843] Re: Screening for success
In-Reply-To: <AD114AC462004246B6C08FF2E4E7A6C203DBDA6C@1199mail.1199etjsp.org>
Message-ID: <0a5f01c7c3d2$c3346d90$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Laura, Welcome and thanks for your question - which is an excellent
one!  I'm also looking forward to hearing from subscribers on this
question.
 
Some discussion on this can be found in one of the suggested resources,
entitled "Pre-assessments for on-line learning".  Go to:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance_1.htm
l
 
The information in the discussion opens with a focus on "wait periods"
or "tryout periods" so that prospective students can self-determine
their ability and commitment, but it winds around to discuss assessing
skills that people need to engage in technology and distance learning.  
 
I'd be very much interested in what List Subscribers think about that
discussion and Laura's questions below.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Laura Chenven
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:45 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 842] Re: Questions for discussion
 
Let me raise another question.  I am new to this list so it may be
something that many of you have already discussed.  
 
I work with a national labor/management partnership that supports
training and education for the incumbent healthcare workforce.  We are
supporting several distance learning and hybrid nursing programs.
Because these programs are asynchronous for the most part and can fit
into many workers busy schedules, there is a great deal of interest in
them.  However, because we realize that distance learning may not be the
best modality for everyone, we want to be able to be able to screen for
students who are most likely to be successful in this kind of program
and also pinpoint other students who may be successful with some extra
help up front.
 
I'd love to hear others experiences with this type of screening.  Do you
find it necessary?  Is it helpful?  What have you learned.
I'm looking forward to hearing from you.
 
Laura Chenven
H-CAP National Coordinator
202 257-7108
lchenven at 1199etjsp.org
 
  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
Hi everyone,
 
It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List,
so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions
and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post them now!
 
Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has
already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests
Shannon and Jennifer:
 
Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important
follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within
professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know
how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.  The same
goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can
be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in hearing from folks
about the strategies and methods they use to get DL students to complete
the full cycle including the post-test.
 
Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this
regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to
help demonstrate achievement?
 
Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you
able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of
funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
 
Thanks!!

Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 

.

.
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Jul 11 12:17:28 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 12:17:28 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 844]  Just joining us?
Message-ID: <0a8601c7c3d6$fab5e1f0$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
A number of folks have subscribed in the last couple of days for this
discussion on assessment in distance learning.  Here's what you need to
know:
 
For full information on this discussion including the announcement,
guest profiles, and suggested preparations, go to:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance.html#
announce.
 
To catch up on the emails posted since Monday morning, go to the
archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment and click
on Read Current Posted Messages at the top - posts from this discussion
begin at #832. 
 
FYI:  Assessment post #829 provides subscribers with suggestions for
maximizing and managing your List experience, although it has lost it's
user-friendly formatting in the archive.  (If you would like this "List
Tips" post in the nice format, send me an email and I will send it back
to you).
 
Thanks!  If anyone has questions or difficulties, please never hesitate
to contact me directly.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Wed Jul 11 13:08:14 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 10:08:14 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 845] Re: DL question on evaluation
In-Reply-To: <FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A0772156@ebe3.umassb.net>
References: <084001c7c2fb$be807d20$0302a8c0@LITNOW>	<OF93912AD4.13E6EAFE-ON07257314.007C9460-07257314.007C9461@yc.edu>,
	<FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A0772156@ebe3.umassb.net>
Message-ID: <OF34D25782.60C15D48-ON07257315.005BDC9D-07257315.005E2331@yc.edu>

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From shannony at umich.edu  Wed Jul 11 15:34:32 2007
From: shannony at umich.edu (Shannon Young)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 15:34:32 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 846] Re: DL question on evaluation
In-Reply-To: <FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A0772157@ebe3.umassb.net>
Message-ID: <C2BAA908.19ECF%shannony@umich.edu>

Hi Venu,

Piggybacking on Jennifer's question, if you have any co-enrolled students,
have you developed a policy for how to categorize these students in terms of
NRS reporting?  

Thanks, 
Shannon

-- 
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org

On 7/11/07 9:25 AM, "Jennifer A. Rafferty" <Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu>
wrote:

> Thank you for you posting, Venu.  You mention two distinct groups below that
> can provide us with data to analyze the effectiveness of distance learning,
> the classroom programs and distance learning programs. I am wondering if New
> York allows learners to coenroll in both a classroom and a distance learning
> program?  
> 
> Jennifer
> 
> Jennifer Rafferty
> Distance Learning Project Manager
> Adult Literacy Resource Institute
> jennifer.rafferty at umb.edu
> 617-287-4081
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Venu Thelakkat
> Sent: Tue 7/10/2007 3:13 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 835] Re: DL question on evaluation
>  
> I can speak only from my experiences in New York State, which has a large
> number of students in Distance Learning programs.  The State Education
> Department, which sets policies on management and assessment in these
> programs, have started conducting analyses on the effectiveness of distance
> learning programs vis-?-vis regular classroom programs (not that much
> difference in effectiveness) and programs themselves are encouraged to look at
> the NRS reports of distance learning programs separately.  Distance learning
> programs are evaluated in NY the same way as other services are, using NRS
> guidelines.  Starting in FY2008 (December 2009) the Federal Department of
> Education is going to ask all states provide disaggregated reports on students
> in distance learning programs, so the focus on these services is intensifying.
> 
>  
> 
> Venu Thelakkat
> 
> Director of ALIES/Data Analysis
> 
> Literacy Assistance Center
> 
> 32 Broadway, 10th Floor
> 
> New York, NY 10004
> 
> Phone: (212) 803-3370
> 
> Fax: (212) 785-3685
> 
> Email: venut at lacnyc.org
> 
> Web: www.alies.org
> 
> ________________________________
>

From shannony at umich.edu  Wed Jul 11 16:16:16 2007
From: shannony at umich.edu (Shannon Young)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 16:16:16 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 847] Re: Screening for success
In-Reply-To: <0a5f01c7c3d2$c3346d90$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <C2BAB2D0.19ED4%shannony@umich.edu>

Hi Laura,

I think the idea of a tryout period that Marie mentioned is a good one.  We
also recommend careful pre-screening.  During the first round of Project
IDEAL experiments, several states opened their distance programs to any and
all who expressed interest.  This approach proved problematic in many
cases?students whose skills, abilities, and/or dispositions didn?t match
well with distance study quickly became frustrated. As a result, drop-out
rates were high.   Programs discovered that they needed to carefully
pre-screen students in several arenas to ensure a good fit.  Many now begin
by surveying students on their learning styles and preferences, time
management skills, and motivation, using their responses as a jumping off
point to talk about what distance study entails.   Once some students
understand what?s involved in being a distance learner, they realize a
classroom program makes more sense for them.  Prescreening also includes
assessing students? technology skills and access as well as their basic
literacy skills.  This combination of pre-assessments helps teachers better
determine (1) which students are potentially good candidates for distance
and (2) what, if any, baseline training is needed.

These days, there are a variety of ?is distance learning for me??
self-assessments available online for students.  I?ve included a sample of
some I?ve come across to give you an idea of what types of topics/issues
distance programs are addressing.

Guilford Technical Community College
(http://www.gtcc.cc.nc.us/distance/dlForMe.html)
--An original and entertaining approach to helping students determine
whether distance learning makes sense for them.
 
Student Online Readiness Tool (SORT)  http://www.alt.usg.edu/sort/
--Six section self-assessment created by the University System of Georgia
designed to help students determine whether they should study online.  The
six areas are: Technology experience, access to tools, study habits,
lifestyle, goals and purposes, and learning preferences.
 
Online Readiness Quiz (http://www.pima.edu/cgi-bin/onlineReadiness/quiz.pl)

--This 41-item quiz from Pima Community College assesses potential distance
students in four areas:  computer and technology skills, time management,
learning environment, and study and reading skills.

Minnesota Virtual University:  Are Distance Learning Courses for You?
(http://www.mnvu.org/mnvu/5102.jsp)

--Provides a computer scored self-assessment for distance learners.

Shannon

On 7/11/07 11:47 AM, "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:

> Hi Laura, Welcome and thanks for your question ? which is an excellent one!
> I?m also looking forward to hearing from subscribers on this question.
>  
> Some discussion on this can be found in one of the suggested resources,
> entitled ?Pre-assessments for on-line learning?.  Go to:
> http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance_1.html
>  
> The information in the discussion opens with a focus on ?wait periods? or
> ?tryout periods? so that prospective students can self-determine their ability
> and commitment, but it winds around to discuss assessing skills that people
> need to engage in technology and distance learning.
>  
> I?d be very much interested in what List Subscribers think about that
> discussion and Laura?s questions below.
>  
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  
>  
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
> Behalf Of Laura Chenven
> Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:45 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 842] Re: Questions for discussion
>  
> Let me raise another question.  I am new to this list so it may be something
> that many of you have already discussed.
>  
> I work with a national labor/management partnership that supports training and
> education for the incumbent healthcare workforce.  We are supporting several
> distance learning and hybrid nursing programs.  Because these programs are
> asynchronous for the most part and can fit into many workers busy schedules,
> there is a great deal of interest in them.  However, because we realize that
> distance learning may not be the best modality for everyone, we want to be
> able to be able to screen for students who are most likely to be successful in
> this kind of program and also pinpoint other students who may be successful
> with some extra help up front.
>  
> I'd love to hear others experiences with this type of screening.  Do you find
> it necessary? Is it helpful?  What have you learned.
> I'm looking forward to hearing from you.
>  
> Laura Chenven
> H-CAP National Coordinator
> 202 257-7108
> lchenven at 1199etjsp.org
>  
> 
> 
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
> Behalf Of Marie Cora
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
> Hi everyone,
>  
> It?s very quiet out there!  I?ve had many new subscribers join our List, so I
> know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions and I know
> you have experiences to share. Please post them now!
>  
> Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has already
> been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests Shannon and
> Jennifer:
>  
> Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important follow-up
> measure from students?  I have experience in DL within professional
> development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) ? and I know how difficult
> follow-up is with the professional population.  The same goes for regular
> classroom-based programs ? getting full test scores can be really hard.  So I
> am extremely interested in hearing from folks about the strategies and methods
> they use to get DL students to complete the full cycle including the
> post-test.
>  
> Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this regard?
> Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to help
> demonstrate achievement?
>  
> Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you able
> to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of funding; timing;
> some F2F (?face-to-face?)/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
>  
> Thanks!!
> 
> 
> Marie Cora
>  
>  
>  
> Marie Cora
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>  
>  
> 
> .
> 
> .
> 
> 
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to shannony at umich.edu

-- 
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org

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From dcornellier at doe.mass.edu  Wed Jul 11 16:08:44 2007
From: dcornellier at doe.mass.edu (Cornellier, Donna)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 16:08:44 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 848] Re: Questions for discussion
Message-ID: <85268246A4FDDC419FFAEC9BE229211D01E40F22@smtp.doemass.org>

Hi Marie,
 
I've attached the new NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning that were sent
out to State Directors on June 6, 2007 with a memo from Cheryl Keenan.  The
distance education policy includes a definition of distance learners,
guidance on how to measure contact hours for the learners, and describes
assessment and reporting requirements which are summarized in the memo.  It
will be an interesting discussion around how states implement these
policies, and you have posed some great questions below.
 
Thanks,
Donna Cornellier
Massachusetts NRS Trainer  
 

  _____  

From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion

Hi everyone,
 
It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List, so
I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions and I
know you have experiences to share.  Please post them now!
 
Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has already
been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests Shannon and
Jennifer:
 
Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important follow-up
measure from students?  I have experience in DL within professional
development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know how difficult
follow-up is with the professional population.  The same goes for regular
classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can be really hard.  So
I am extremely interested in hearing from folks about the strategies and
methods they use to get DL students to complete the full cycle including the
post-test.
 
Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this regard?
Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to help
demonstrate achievement?
 
Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you able
to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of funding;
timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
 
Thanks!!

Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
<http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
<http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/> 
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Jul 11 16:28:03 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 16:28:03 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 849] Re: NRS Guidelines for DL
In-Reply-To: <85268246A4FDDC419FFAEC9BE229211D01E40F22@smtp.doemass.org>
Message-ID: <0b1301c7c3f9$fc367990$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
You will notice that the attachments Donna mentions were not attached!
(Thanks Donna!!)  We are trying to avoid sending attachments via the
emails because some people's systems are not prepared to handle this
type of thing.
 
I am working on having the documents Donna talks about posted at the
same site where the rest of the information for this discussion is.
I'll let you know as soon as they are up there.  In the meantime,
perhaps some of you are already aware of the new guidelines or have
access to them.
 
Thanks,
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Cornellier, Donna
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 4:09 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 848] Re: Questions for discussion
 
Hi Marie,
 
I've attached the new NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning that were
sent out to State Directors on June 6, 2007 with a memo from Cheryl
Keenan.  The distance education policy includes a definition of distance
learners, guidance on how to measure contact hours for the learners, and
describes assessment and reporting requirements which are summarized in
the memo.  It will be an interesting discussion around how states
implement these policies, and you have posed some great questions below.
 
Thanks,
Donna Cornellier
Massachusetts NRS Trainer  
 
 
  _____  

From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
Hi everyone,
 
It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List,
so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions
and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post them now!
 
Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has
already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests
Shannon and Jennifer:
 
Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important
follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within
professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know
how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.  The same
goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can
be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in hearing from folks
about the strategies and methods they use to get DL students to complete
the full cycle including the post-test.
 
Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this
regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to
help demonstrate achievement?
 
Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you
able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of
funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
 
Thanks!!

Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From LCondelli at air.org  Wed Jul 11 16:41:30 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 16:41:30 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 850] Re: NRS Guidelines for DL
In-Reply-To: <0b1301c7c3f9$fc367990$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2D13420@dc1ex03.air.org>

Donna, Marie and Everyone,
 
You can get these documents on the NRS web site. http://www.nrsweb.org.
Look under What's New.
 
Larry Condelli
NRS Project Director

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 4:28 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 849] Re: NRS Guidelines for DL

Hi everyone,
 
You will notice that the attachments Donna mentions were not attached!
(Thanks Donna!!)  We are trying to avoid sending attachments via the
emails because some people's systems are not prepared to handle this
type of thing.
 
I am working on having the documents Donna talks about posted at the
same site where the rest of the information for this discussion is.
I'll let you know as soon as they are up there.  In the meantime,
perhaps some of you are already aware of the new guidelines or have
access to them.
 
Thanks,
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Cornellier, Donna
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 4:09 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 848] Re: Questions for discussion
 
Hi Marie,
 
I've attached the new NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning that were
sent out to State Directors on June 6, 2007 with a memo from Cheryl
Keenan.  The distance education policy includes a definition of distance
learners, guidance on how to measure contact hours for the learners, and
describes assessment and reporting requirements which are summarized in
the memo.  It will be an interesting discussion around how states
implement these policies, and you have posed some great questions below.
 
Thanks,
Donna Cornellier
Massachusetts NRS Trainer  
 
 
________________________________

From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
Hi everyone,
 
It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List,
so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions
and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post them now!
 
Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has
already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests
Shannon and Jennifer:
 
Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important
follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within
professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know
how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.  The same
goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can
be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in hearing from folks
about the strategies and methods they use to get DL students to complete
the full cycle including the post-test.
 
Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this
regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to
help demonstrate achievement?
 
Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you
able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of
funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
 
Thanks!!

Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
-------------- next part --------------
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Jul 12 14:28:37 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 14:28:37 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 851] Re: DL curriculum and materials
In-Reply-To: <C2BAB2D0.19ED4%shannony@umich.edu>
Message-ID: <0c3301c7c4b2$77733450$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Shannon and everyone,
 
Wow, thanks for all these great resources!  I see that you advocate a
variety of pre-assessments in order to best determine a person's
readiness, which makes a lot of sense to me.
 
It made me think of something else:  what is there in the way of
curriculum and materials used in DL?  Do folks focus on 'commercial
packages' or materials generated by the feds or states, or do programs
develop their own curriculum and materials?  I ask this because if there
are particular requirements around assessing and reporting, then each of
these pieces would be affected by the other.  And I would assume that
some things work better together than others.
 
How does all that work in programs?
 
Thanks,
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Shannon Young
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 4:16 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 847] Re: Screening for success
 
Hi Laura,

I think the idea of a tryout period that Marie mentioned is a good one.
We also recommend careful pre-screening.  During the first round of
Project IDEAL experiments, several states opened their distance programs
to any and all who expressed interest.  This approach proved problematic
in many cases-students whose skills, abilities, and/or dispositions
didn't match well with distance study quickly became frustrated. As a
result, drop-out rates were high.   Programs discovered that they needed
to carefully pre-screen students in several arenas to ensure a good fit.
Many now begin by surveying students on their learning styles and
preferences, time management skills, and motivation, using their
responses as a jumping off point to talk about what distance study
entails.   Once some students understand what's involved in being a
distance learner, they realize a classroom program makes more sense for
them.  Prescreening also includes assessing students' technology skills
and access as well as their basic literacy skills.  This combination of
pre-assessments helps teachers better determine (1) which students are
potentially good candidates for distance and (2) what, if any, baseline
training is needed.    

These days, there are a variety of "is distance learning for me?"
self-assessments available online for students.  I've included a sample
of some I've come across to give you an idea of what types of
topics/issues distance programs are addressing.  

Guilford Technical Community College
(http://www.gtcc.cc.nc.us/distance/dlForMe.html)
--An original and entertaining approach to helping students determine
whether distance learning makes sense for them. 
 
Student Online Readiness Tool (SORT)  http://www.alt.usg.edu/sort/
--Six section self-assessment created by the University System of
Georgia designed to help students determine whether they should study
online.  The six areas are: Technology experience, access to tools,
study habits, lifestyle, goals and purposes, and learning preferences.
 
Online Readiness Quiz
(http://www.pima.edu/cgi-bin/onlineReadiness/quiz.pl)

--This 41-item quiz from Pima Community College assesses potential
distance students in four areas:  computer and technology skills, time
management, learning environment, and study and reading skills.

Minnesota Virtual University:  Are Distance Learning Courses for You?
(http://www.mnvu.org/mnvu/5102.jsp)

--Provides a computer scored self-assessment for distance learners.

Shannon

On 7/11/07 11:47 AM, "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
wrote:
Hi Laura, Welcome and thanks for your question - which is an excellent
one!  I'm also looking forward to hearing from subscribers on this
question.
 
Some discussion on this can be found in one of the suggested resources,
entitled "Pre-assessments for on-line learning".  Go to:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance_1.htm
l
 
The information in the discussion opens with a focus on "wait periods"
or "tryout periods" so that prospective students can self-determine
their ability and commitment, but it winds around to discuss assessing
skills that people need to engage in technology and distance learning.  
 
I'd be very much interested in what List Subscribers think about that
discussion and Laura's questions below.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
<mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov%5d>  On Behalf Of Laura Chenven
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:45 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 842] Re: Questions for discussion

Let me raise another question.  I am new to this list so it may be
something that many of you have already discussed.  

I work with a national labor/management partnership that supports
training and education for the incumbent healthcare workforce.  We are
supporting several distance learning and hybrid nursing programs.
Because these programs are asynchronous for the most part and can fit
into many workers busy schedules, there is a great deal of interest in
them.  However, because we realize that distance learning may not be the
best modality for everyone, we want to be able to be able to screen for
students who are most likely to be successful in this kind of program
and also pinpoint other students who may be successful with some extra
help up front.

I'd love to hear others experiences with this type of screening.  Do you
find it necessary? Is it helpful?  What have you learned.
I'm looking forward to hearing from you.

Laura Chenven
H-CAP National Coordinator
202 257-7108
lchenven at 1199etjsp.org
  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
<mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov%5d>  On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
Hi everyone,
 
It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List,
so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions
and I know you have experiences to share. Please post them now!
 
Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has
already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests
Shannon and Jennifer:
 
Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important
follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within
professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know
how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.  The same
goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can
be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in hearing from folks
about the strategies and methods they use to get DL students to complete
the full cycle including the post-test.
 
Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this
regard? Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to
help demonstrate achievement?
 
Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you
able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of
funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
 
Thanks!!

Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
<mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

.

.
  _____  

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to shannony at umich.edu

-- 
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, &
Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org
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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Thu Jul 12 17:00:19 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 14:00:19 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 852] Re: DL curriculum and materials
In-Reply-To: <0c3301c7c4b2$77733450$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <0c3301c7c4b2$77733450$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <OF7C7A6319.65E4FC1C-ON07257316.007362E3-07257316.007362E4@yc.edu>

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From Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu  Thu Jul 12 17:09:20 2007
From: Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu (Jennifer A. Rafferty)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 17:09:20 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 853] Re: DL curriculum and materials
References: <0c3301c7c4b2$77733450$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A077216A@ebe3.umassb.net>

Hi everyone,

In addition to the pre-assessment resources Shannon has shared, I would also like to share with you the URL for the Massachusetts ABE Distance Learning Project.  www.anywhereanytimeabe.org .  Over the past two years, we have developed the Orientation Modules section.  It is actually being revised and updated as we engage in this discussion, so I encourage you to visit the site again in the next month because you will find that the resources have additional notes to the instructor as well as more interactive features and revised handouts.  

The Orientation Modules were created thinking of both the distance learner and the classroom learner.  One of our visions for this section of our website was to see classroom programs incorporate content from the Orientation Modules into their curriculum so that classroom learners would be prepared for distance learning should they ever need to ?stop out? of the classroom.   In fact, the content developers, who are both classroom and dl instructors, use the materials with both groups of learners.

We created the modules thinking they could be used according to the needs of the learner.  Our dl pilot programs are not required to complete the modules with distance learners during the orientation process, but they are encouraged to use the resources and adapt them.  We generated all of the topics through discussions and focus groups with our dl pilot programs. The topics include:  setting goals, barriers and supports, independent learning, technical skills, time management and study skills, and communication skills.  

As for your question about distance learning curricula, Massachusetts has implemented a variety of commercially produced curricula over the past eight years.  During the pilot phase from 2004-07, programs were funded to pilot commercially produced curricula for which the state had purchased licenses.  They were not funded to create curricula, although there is one ESOL dl pilot that had developed a homegrown curriculum prior to being funded.  Of course, teachers supplement these curricular packages with their own materials to fill in gaps and to provide additional practice.  We call these other materials ?supplemental?, based on Project IDEAL?s system for collecting proxy seat time for distance learners.   There are currently three models I am aware of that have been created to approximate seat time for distance learners: the teacher judgment model, the student mastery model, and the clock time model.  So, depending on the curriculum/a and the kind of delivery(e.g. multimedia, computer-based) a state chooses, this will dictate the way the proxy seat time is collected.   Project IDEAL has a publication on this topic of seat time, it is Paper 2#, Measuring Contact Hours and Educational Progress in Distance Education, and can be accessed at their website at www.projectideal.org under the Publications section.  

One of the big questions we asked ourselves while piloting the commercially produced curricula was, do these curricula align with our state Curriculum Frameworks and our standardized assessment for ABE learners (the MAPT)?   This past fiscal year, we examined the frameworks and the ABE curricular package that is currently being used in MA with dl pilots, so we have a better sense of where there will be a need to supplement our ABE dl curriculum.   

Jennifer Rafferty
jennifer.rafferty at umb.edu

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Thu 7/12/2007 2:28 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 851] Re: DL curriculum and materials
 
Hi Shannon and everyone,
 
Wow, thanks for all these great resources!  I see that you advocate a
variety of pre-assessments in order to best determine a person's
readiness, which makes a lot of sense to me.
 
It made me think of something else:  what is there in the way of
curriculum and materials used in DL?  Do folks focus on 'commercial
packages' or materials generated by the feds or states, or do programs
develop their own curriculum and materials?  I ask this because if there
are particular requirements around assessing and reporting, then each of
these pieces would be affected by the other.  And I would assume that
some things work better together than others.
 
How does all that work in programs?
 
Thanks,
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Shannon Young
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 4:16 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 847] Re: Screening for success
 
Hi Laura,

I think the idea of a tryout period that Marie mentioned is a good one.
We also recommend careful pre-screening.  During the first round of
Project IDEAL experiments, several states opened their distance programs
to any and all who expressed interest.  This approach proved problematic
in many cases-students whose skills, abilities, and/or dispositions
didn't match well with distance study quickly became frustrated. As a
result, drop-out rates were high.   Programs discovered that they needed
to carefully pre-screen students in several arenas to ensure a good fit.
Many now begin by surveying students on their learning styles and
preferences, time management skills, and motivation, using their
responses as a jumping off point to talk about what distance study
entails.   Once some students understand what's involved in being a
distance learner, they realize a classroom program makes more sense for
them.  Prescreening also includes assessing students' technology skills
and access as well as their basic literacy skills.  This combination of
pre-assessments helps teachers better determine (1) which students are
potentially good candidates for distance and (2) what, if any, baseline
training is needed.    

These days, there are a variety of "is distance learning for me?"
self-assessments available online for students.  I've included a sample
of some I've come across to give you an idea of what types of
topics/issues distance programs are addressing.  

Guilford Technical Community College
(http://www.gtcc.cc.nc.us/distance/dlForMe.html)
--An original and entertaining approach to helping students determine
whether distance learning makes sense for them. 
 
Student Online Readiness Tool (SORT)  http://www.alt.usg.edu/sort/
--Six section self-assessment created by the University System of
Georgia designed to help students determine whether they should study
online.  The six areas are: Technology experience, access to tools,
study habits, lifestyle, goals and purposes, and learning preferences.
 
Online Readiness Quiz
(http://www.pima.edu/cgi-bin/onlineReadiness/quiz.pl)

--This 41-item quiz from Pima Community College assesses potential
distance students in four areas:  computer and technology skills, time
management, learning environment, and study and reading skills.

Minnesota Virtual University:  Are Distance Learning Courses for You?
(http://www.mnvu.org/mnvu/5102.jsp)

--Provides a computer scored self-assessment for distance learners.

Shannon

On 7/11/07 11:47 AM, "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
wrote:
Hi Laura, Welcome and thanks for your question - which is an excellent
one!  I'm also looking forward to hearing from subscribers on this
question.
 
Some discussion on this can be found in one of the suggested resources,
entitled "Pre-assessments for on-line learning".  Go to:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance_1.htm
l
 
The information in the discussion opens with a focus on "wait periods"
or "tryout periods" so that prospective students can self-determine
their ability and commitment, but it winds around to discuss assessing
skills that people need to engage in technology and distance learning.  
 
I'd be very much interested in what List Subscribers think about that
discussion and Laura's questions below.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
<mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov%5d>  On Behalf Of Laura Chenven
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:45 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 842] Re: Questions for discussion

Let me raise another question.  I am new to this list so it may be
something that many of you have already discussed.  

I work with a national labor/management partnership that supports
training and education for the incumbent healthcare workforce.  We are
supporting several distance learning and hybrid nursing programs.
Because these programs are asynchronous for the most part and can fit
into many workers busy schedules, there is a great deal of interest in
them.  However, because we realize that distance learning may not be the
best modality for everyone, we want to be able to be able to screen for
students who are most likely to be successful in this kind of program
and also pinpoint other students who may be successful with some extra
help up front.

I'd love to hear others experiences with this type of screening.  Do you
find it necessary? Is it helpful?  What have you learned.
I'm looking forward to hearing from you.

Laura Chenven
H-CAP National Coordinator
202 257-7108
lchenven at 1199etjsp.org
  _____  

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
<mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov%5d>  On Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
Hi everyone,
 
It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List,
so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions
and I know you have experiences to share. Please post them now!
 
Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has
already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests
Shannon and Jennifer:
 
Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important
follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within
professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know
how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.  The same
goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can
be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in hearing from folks
about the strategies and methods they use to get DL students to complete
the full cycle including the post-test.
 
Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this
regard? Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to
help demonstrate achievement?
 
Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you
able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of
funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
 
Thanks!!

Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
<mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

 

.

.
  _____  

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to shannony at umich.edu

-- 
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, &
Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org

From Kgotthardt at comcast.net  Thu Jul 12 17:19:00 2007
From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net (Katherine G)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 17:19:00 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 854] Re: DL curriculum and materials
In-Reply-To: <0c3301c7c4b2$77733450$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCCEOHDGAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>

Re: [Assessment 843] Re: Screening for successHi Marie and everyone.

In Prince William County, VA, we are using Project Connect for ESOL.  This
is our second session using it.  If you are not familiar with the package,
you can learn more about at http://pbslearnenglish.org/learn/page1.xml  As
an instructor, I find Project Connect easy to use, and in general, I think
the students feel it is pretty simple.  However, students still need a live
help.  Another experienced ESOL teacher (whom I think is on this list) holds
live sessions on Friday nights.  During the live sessions, I am logged into
Project Connect from home so students can get instant responses to email and
feedback on their work units.

We provide students a handbook that illustrates Project Connect's key
functions as well as helpful tips for students who might not be accustomed
to online learning.  In addition to this and the Project Connect online
orientation, we will be providing live, monthly orientations in which we go
through the handbook and program and catch up on any questions students
might have about the technology.  This helps me get some face-to-face time
with the students as well.  Last term, I worked with students online and
spoke to them on the phone.  However, since they only had live contact with
the Friday night teacher, some students had difficulty with the concept I
was a real person.  This is common in most DL classes, so hopefully, the
orientations will help eradicate the myth that I am a computer : )  And of
course, they will continue to benefit from the blended method already in
place.

Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL DL Instructor

Prince William County Public Schools

Adult Education

P.O. Box 389

Manassas, VA 20108

work 703-791-8387

fax 703-791-8889

 -----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2007 2:29 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 851] Re: DL curriculum and materials

  Hi Shannon and everyone,

  Wow, thanks for all these great resources!  I see that you advocate a
variety of pre-assessments in order to best determine a person's readiness,
which makes a lot of sense to me.

  It made me think of something else:  what is there in the way of
curriculum and materials used in DL?  Do folks focus on 'commercial packages
' or materials generated by the feds or states, or do programs develop their
own curriculum and materials?  I ask this because if there are particular
requirements around assessing and reporting, then each of these pieces would
be affected by the other.  And I would assume that some things work better
together than others.

  How does all that work in programs?

  Thanks,

  Marie Cora

  Assessment Discussion List Moderator

  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Shannon Young
  Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 4:16 PM
  To: The Assessment Discussion List
  Subject: [Assessment 847] Re: Screening for success

  Hi Laura,

  I think the idea of a tryout period that Marie mentioned is a good one.
We also recommend careful pre-screening.  During the first round of Project
IDEAL experiments, several states opened their distance programs to any and
all who expressed interest.  This approach proved problematic in many
cases-students whose skills, abilities, and/or dispositions didn't match
well with distance study quickly became frustrated. As a result, drop-out
rates were high.   Programs discovered that they needed to carefully
pre-screen students in several arenas to ensure a good fit.  Many now begin
by surveying students on their learning styles and preferences, time
management skills, and motivation, using their responses as a jumping off
point to talk about what distance study entails.   Once some students
understand what's involved in being a distance learner, they realize a
classroom program makes more sense for them.  Prescreening also includes
assessing students' technology skills and access as well as their basic
literacy skills.  This combination of pre-assessments helps teachers better
determine (1) which students are potentially good candidates for distance
and (2) what, if any, baseline training is needed.

  These days, there are a variety of "is distance learning for me?"
self-assessments available online for students.  I've included a sample of
some I've come across to give you an idea of what types of topics/issues
distance programs are addressing.

  Guilford Technical Community College
(http://www.gtcc.cc.nc.us/distance/dlForMe.html)
  --An original and entertaining approach to helping students determine
whether distance learning makes sense for them.

  Student Online Readiness Tool (SORT)  http://www.alt.usg.edu/sort/
  --Six section self-assessment created by the University System of Georgia
designed to help students determine whether they should study online.  The
six areas are: Technology experience, access to tools, study habits,
lifestyle, goals and purposes, and learning preferences.

  Online Readiness Quiz
(http://www.pima.edu/cgi-bin/onlineReadiness/quiz.pl)

  --This 41-item quiz from Pima Community College assesses potential
distance students in four areas:  computer and technology skills, time
management, learning environment, and study and reading skills.

  Minnesota Virtual University:  Are Distance Learning Courses for You?
(http://www.mnvu.org/mnvu/5102.jsp)

  --Provides a computer scored self-assessment for distance learners.

  Shannon

  On 7/11/07 11:47 AM, "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:

  Hi Laura, Welcome and thanks for your question - which is an excellent
one!  I'm also looking forward to hearing from subscribers on this question.

  Some discussion on this can be found in one of the suggested resources,
entitled "Pre-assessments for on-line learning".  Go to:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance_1.html

  The information in the discussion opens with a focus on "wait periods" or
"tryout periods" so that prospective students can self-determine their
ability and commitment, but it winds around to discuss assessing skills that
people need to engage in technology and distance learning.

  I'd be very much interested in what List Subscribers think about that
discussion and Laura's questions below.

  Marie Cora
  Assessment Discussion List Moderator

  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Laura Chenven
  Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:45 AM
  To: The Assessment Discussion List
  Subject: [Assessment 842] Re: Questions for discussion

  Let me raise another question.  I am new to this list so it may be
something that many of you have already discussed.

  I work with a national labor/management partnership that supports training
and education for the incumbent healthcare workforce.  We are supporting
several distance learning and hybrid nursing programs.  Because these
programs are asynchronous for the most part and can fit into many workers
busy schedules, there is a great deal of interest in them.  However, because
we realize that distance learning may not be the best modality for everyone,
we want to be able to be able to screen for students who are most likely to
be successful in this kind of program and also pinpoint other students who
may be successful with some extra help up front.

  I'd love to hear others experiences with this type of screening.  Do you
find it necessary? Is it helpful?  What have you learned.
  I'm looking forward to hearing from you.

  Laura Chenven
  H-CAP National Coordinator
  202 257-7108
  lchenven at 1199etjsp.org

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
  Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
  To: Assessment at nifl.gov
  Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
  Hi everyone,

  It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List,
so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions and I
know you have experiences to share. Please post them now!

  Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has
already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests Shannon
and Jennifer:

  Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important follow-up
measure from students?  I have experience in DL within professional
development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know how difficult
follow-up is with the professional population.  The same goes for regular
classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can be really hard.  So
I am extremely interested in hearing from folks about the strategies and
methods they use to get DL students to complete the full cycle including the
post-test.

  Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this
regard? Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to help
demonstrate achievement?

  Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you
able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of funding;
timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?

  Thanks!!

  Marie Cora

  Marie Cora
  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
  NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
  http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

  .

  .

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
--

  -------------------------------
  National Institute for Literacy
  Assessment mailing list
  Assessment at nifl.gov
  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  Email delivered to shannony at umich.edu

  --
  Shannon J. Young
  Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
  Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, &
Technology
  Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan

  5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
  Ph:         (734) 763-5325
  Fax:       (734) 615-6638
  Email:     shannony at umich.edu
  Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Jul 13 09:13:51 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 09:13:51 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 855]  Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
Message-ID: <0d3b01c7c54f$a8d8b090$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  
 
Today is our final day of conversation with Jennifer and Shannon on
assessment in distance learning.  I encourage you to post your questions
and experiences now.  I'm looking forward to reading the replies from
yesterday's posts.
 
Here's my next thought on this, I'm back to Post-Testing:  does DL
post-testing ever involve groups of learners together?  Or is it usually
a unilateral event for that one student?  I'm asking because I know this
is a tough area, and I was wondering if some amount of work with peers
might alter this.  What are people's thoughts and experiences on this?
 
Thanks,
Marie 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu  Fri Jul 13 10:06:05 2007
From: Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu (Jennifer A. Rafferty)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 10:06:05 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 856] Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
References: <0d3b01c7c54f$a8d8b090$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A077216D@ebe3.umassb.net>

Hi Marie,
I don?t know if I understood you correctly, but logistically it is not always possible to get the dl learners together to be post-tested.  In Massachusetts, our dl programs run with an open enrollment schedule, so students start at different times and they accumulate ?seat time? hours at different rates depending on the intensity of their studying.   As is with the orientation process, our programs have to be prepared to provide support individually if the timing for orientation and pre/post-testing doesn?t fit the learners? schedules.  I have seen some dl students go to classroom-based programs when post-testing is being conducted in a group.  This seems to be a good logistical set-up, to look at the scheduling of post-testing for classroom programs in the agency, and send the dl learner to be post-tested there if it fits their schedule and scenario.  When I was teaching in a dl ESOL program back in 2003, we were using the BEST to assess learners and it was challenging to coordinate because each learner needed to be assessed individually and the test needed to be administrated by another instructor.  We ended up doing an exchange where I would assess classroom learners and a classroom teacher came to my program to assess my distance learners.     

Jennifer Rafferty

jennifer.rafferty at umb.edu

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Fri 7/13/2007 9:13 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 855]  Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
 
Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  
 
Today is our final day of conversation with Jennifer and Shannon on
assessment in distance learning.  I encourage you to post your questions
and experiences now.  I'm looking forward to reading the replies from
yesterday's posts.
 
Here's my next thought on this, I'm back to Post-Testing:  does DL
post-testing ever involve groups of learners together?  Or is it usually
a unilateral event for that one student?  I'm asking because I know this
is a tough area, and I was wondering if some amount of work with peers
might alter this.  What are people's thoughts and experiences on this?
 
Thanks,
Marie 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 

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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Fri Jul 13 11:51:02 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 08:51:02 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 857] Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
In-Reply-To: <0d3b01c7c54f$a8d8b090$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <0d3b01c7c54f$a8d8b090$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <OF6BAD00A4.FDD88647-ON07257317.00571215-07257317.00571216@yc.edu>

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Jul 13 12:58:23 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 12:58:23 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 858] Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
In-Reply-To: <FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A077216D@ebe3.umassb.net>
Message-ID: <0da401c7c56f$068d1720$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

(My apologies if you are receiving duplicates of any posts)

Hi Jennifer - thanks so much for this.  Yes, I didn't make myself that
clear in my post, but your reply definitely speaks to some of the
questions that I do have.  

I was indeed asking about what you discuss below:  I am interested in
how post-testing might get accomplished when you can be in f2f
situations, and whether or not being able to group students together
would make any difference at all.  

But I was also wondering (and I'm showing the true colors of my lack of
knowledge around the details of DL - but that's ok because I am here to
learn) these things:

-I assume that some DL is purely DL - no f2f (is that right?) -If so,
how do you use required tests that do not lend themselves to on-line
delivery? -And if post-assessment *can* be accomplished purely on-line,
are there ways to make that post-test more of a group task, which might
lead to more people completing that piece of the puzzle? (this group
task idea is obviously an assumption on my part)

Ok, thanks and looking forward to hearing what people's experiences are
with this.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-----Original Message-----
From: Jennifer A. Rafferty [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Jennifer A. Rafferty
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 10:06 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: RE: [Assessment 855] Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!

Hi Marie,
I don't know if I understood you correctly, but logistically it is not
always possible to get the dl learners together to be post-tested.  In
Massachusetts, our dl programs run with an open enrollment schedule, so
students start at different times and they accumulate "seat time" hours
at different rates depending on the intensity of their studying.   As is
with the orientation process, our programs have to be prepared to
provide support individually if the timing for orientation and
pre/post-testing doesn't fit the learners' schedules.  I have seen some
dl students go to classroom-based programs when post-testing is being
conducted in a group.  This seems to be a good logistical set-up, to
look at the scheduling of post-testing for classroom programs in the
agency, and send the dl learner to be post-tested there if it fits their
schedule and scenario.  When I was teaching in a dl ESOL program back in
2003, we were using the BEST to assess learners and it was challenging
to coordinate because each learner needed to be assessed individually
and the test needed to be administrated by another instructor.  We ended
up doing an exchange where I would assess classroom learners and a
classroom teacher came to my program to assess my distance learners.

Jennifer Rafferty

jennifer.rafferty at umb.edu

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Fri 7/13/2007 9:13 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 855]  Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
 
Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  
 
Today is our final day of conversation with Jennifer and Shannon on
assessment in distance learning.  I encourage you to post your questions
and experiences now.  I'm looking forward to reading the replies from
yesterday's posts.
 
Here's my next thought on this, I'm back to Post-Testing:  does DL
post-testing ever involve groups of learners together?  Or is it usually
a unilateral event for that one student?  I'm asking because I know this
is a tough area, and I was wondering if some amount of work with peers
might alter this.  What are people's thoughts and experiences on this?
 
Thanks,
Marie 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 

From shannony at umich.edu  Fri Jul 13 13:40:22 2007
From: shannony at umich.edu (Shannon Young)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 13:40:22 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 859] Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
In-Reply-To: <0da401c7c56f$068d1720$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <C2BD3146.19F6B%shannony@umich.edu>

Hi Marie,

You've raised good questions many programs have to address.  Most Project
IDEAL states have policies requiring their students to be post-tested in a
proctored f2f setting, regardless of whether they're pure distance students.
I think this usually applies only to standardized testing, though I know
states like North Carolina require students to come in for progress testing
after each unit of study.  NC's ESOL distance students receive "seat time"
credit only after demonstrating mastery of the materials.  I know Missouri
at one point experimented with offering the TABE online, but I believe
students were still required to complete the test in a proctored setting.
Other curriculum-specific quizzes and tests are usually completed without a
f2f component.  

Some programs and states (particularly ones that have large, rural
populations) have set up partnerships with local libraries, schools, and
other social service agencies to handle post-testing.  That way, while
students may have to drive some distance to participate in orientation, they
can then go to a place that's closer to home to post-test.

Last year, we surveyed Project IDEAL teachers to find out how they got
students to return for post testing.  One frequent answer:  throw a party.
When students knew they'd be seeing and socializing with other students from
orientation (as Tina mentioned), they were more likely to come back in for
testing.

Does any state have a policy allowing post-testing to be conducted online
and without a proctor?  If so, how do you ensure validity?

Thanks,
Shannon

-- 
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org

From teacherwendyq at gmail.com  Fri Jul 13 15:04:04 2007
From: teacherwendyq at gmail.com (Wendy Quinones)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 15:04:04 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 860] Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
In-Reply-To: <0d3b01c7c54f$a8d8b090$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <0d3b01c7c54f$a8d8b090$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <ad2cc1ef0707131204t48d5a4d2qbc962439e4acc391@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry for coming in late on this, but a couple of the pre-screening links
Shannon gave us are dead -- the Pima Community College and Guilford
Technical College ones.  They sound terrific, so I'd really like to find
them!

Wendy Quinones

On 7/13/07, Marie Cora <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:
>
>  Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.
>
>
>
> Today is our final day of conversation with Jennifer and Shannon on
> assessment in distance learning.  I encourage you to post your questions
> and experiences now.  I'm looking forward to reading the replies from
> yesterday's posts.
>
>
>
> Here's my next thought on this, I'm back to Post-Testing:  does DL
> post-testing ever involve groups of learners together?  Or is it usually a
> unilateral event for that one student?  I'm asking because I know this is
> a tough area, and I was wondering if some amount of work with peers might
> alter this.  What are people's thoughts and experiences on this?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Marie
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to teacherwendyq at gmail.com
>
>
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From shannony at umich.edu  Fri Jul 13 15:53:38 2007
From: shannony at umich.edu (Shannon Young)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 15:53:38 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 861] Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
In-Reply-To: <ad2cc1ef0707131204t48d5a4d2qbc962439e4acc391@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <C2BD5082.19F74%shannony@umich.edu>

Hi Wendy,

I didn?t have trouble with either link.  Would you try again?  Perhaps your
browser handles things differently from mine.  If neither works for you, you
can find the ?Is Distance for Me?? quizzes on each site by going to their
Distance Learning pages.  For Guilford (www.gtcc.edu), go to Distance
Learning (right hand menu on the home page) and then to the submenu Getting
Started.  For Pima, (www.pima.edu) it?s in Courses and Degrees, submenu
Distance Learning.

Pima:  http://www.pima.edu/cgi-bin/onlineReadiness/quiz.pl

Guilford:  http://www.gtcc.edu/distance/dlForMe.html

I hope this helps!

Thanks, Shannon

On 7/13/07 3:04 PM, "Wendy Quinones" <teacherwendyq at gmail.com> wrote:

> Sorry for coming in late on this, but a couple of the pre-screening links
> Shannon gave us are dead -- the Pima Community College and Guilford Technical
> College ones.  They sound terrific, so I'd really like to find them!
>  
> Wendy Quinones
> 
>  

Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org

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From KHinson at almanid.com  Fri Jul 13 16:33:07 2007
From: KHinson at almanid.com (Katrina Hinson)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 22:33:07 +0200
Subject: [Assessment 862]   Re: DL curriculum and materials
In-Reply-To: <OF7C7A6319.65E4FC1C-ON07257316.007362E3-07257316.007362E4@yc.edu>
References: <0c3301c7c4b2$77733450$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
	<OF7C7A6319.65E4FC1C-ON07257316.007362E3-07257316.007362E4@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <4697A92F.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>

I'm just getting caught up with the conversation and haven't read all
the threads yet. I wish it wasn't the last day for the discussion. There
is so much to talk about with regards to dl. 

I work with dl at my school and we use MHC online, Skills Tutor and
another program called A+. I like all of them and all of them have their
strengths and weaknesses.   

I also make supplemental materials available to my students - anything
from workbooks to worksheets to face to face tutoring if they really get
stuck. We communicate a lot by email and by phone. Like Tina, we're
still in the early stages of our dl process.

>>> <Tina_Luffman at yc.edu> 7/12/2007 5:00 pm >>>
Hi Marie,
 
Different states have purchased different software packages for their
dl classes. Arizona purchased MHC Online. Later we added a Pre-GED LAN
only software program to help with students who were not ready for the
MHC Online materials. This summer Arizona purchased a newer version of
Pre-GED that is web-based similar to MHC Online. 
 
Each program in our state has the ability to chose supplemental
materials. Our college also has Skills Tutor, so we were blessed to have
both of these electronic materials for our students. In addition, we had
a few older McGraw-Hill GED and Pre-GED textbooks that we could loan to
students. I encouraged students to buy a Complete Pre-GED book to have
at home, but certainly did not require it. 
 
In IDEAL's course DL 102, the online instructors networked together to
locate videos, Web sites, materials to scan and send to students, and
generally worked creatively to find ways to meet curricular needs to
explain challenging concepts at a distance. Much has been done, but we
are still in the early stages of online education.
 
Thanks,
 
Tina
Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu 

-----assessment-bounces at nifl.gov wrote: -----

To: "'The Assessment Discussion List'" <assessment at nifl.gov>
From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
Date: 07/12/2007 11:28AM
Subject: [Assessment 851] Re: DL curriculum and materials

Hi Shannon and everyone, 
  
Wow, thanks for all these great resources!   I see that you advocate a
variety of pre-assessments in order to best determine a person?s
readiness, which makes a lot of sense to me. 
  
It made me think of something else:   what is there in the way of
curriculum and materials used in DL?   Do folks focus on ?commercial
packages? or materials generated by the feds or states, or do programs
develop their own curriculum and materials?   I ask this because if
there are particular requirements around assessing and reporting, then
each of these pieces would be affected by the other.   And I would
assume that some things work better together than others. 
  
How does all that work in programs? 
  
Thanks, 
  
Marie Cora 
Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
  
-----Original Message----- 
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Shannon Young 
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 4:16 PM 
To: The Assessment Discussion List 
Subject: [Assessment 847] Re: Screening for success 
  
Hi Laura, 

I think the idea of a tryout period that Marie mentioned is a good one.
 We also recommend careful pre-screening.  During the first round of
Project IDEAL experiments, several states opened their distance programs
to any and all who expressed interest.  This approach proved problematic
in many cases?students whose skills, abilities, and/or dispositions
didn?t match well with distance study quickly became frustrated. As a
result, drop-out rates were high.   Programs discovered that they needed
to carefully pre-screen students in several arenas to ensure a good fit.
 Many now begin by surveying students on their learning styles and
preferences, time management skills, and motivation, using their
responses as a jumping off point to talk about what distance study
entails.   Once some students understand what?s involved in being a
distance learner, they realize a classroom program makes more sense for
them.  Prescreening also includes assessing students? technology
skills and access as well as their basic literacy skills.  This
combination of pre-assessments helps teachers better determine (1) which
students are potentially good candidates for distance and (2) what, if
any, baseline training is needed.     

These days, there are a variety of ?is distance learning for me??
self-assessments available online for students.  I?ve included a
sample of some I?ve come across to give you an idea of what types of
topics/issues distance programs are addressing.   

Guilford Technical Community College (
http://www.gtcc.cc.nc.us/distance/dlForMe.html) 
--An original and entertaining approach to helping students determine
whether distance learning makes sense for them. 
  
Student Online Readiness Tool (SORT)   http://www.alt.usg.edu/sort/ 
--Six section self-assessment created by the University System of
Georgia designed to help students determine whether they should study
online.  The six areas are: Technology experience, access to tools,
study habits, lifestyle, goals and purposes, and learning preferences. 
  
Online Readiness Quiz (
http://www.pima.edu/cgi-bin/onlineReadiness/quiz.pl) 

--This 41-item quiz from Pima Community College assesses potential
distance students in four areas:  computer and technology skills, time
management, learning environment, and study and reading skills. 

Minnesota Virtual University:  Are Distance Learning Courses for You? (
http://www.mnvu.org/mnvu/5102.jsp) 

-- Provides a computer scored self-assessment for distance learners. 

Shannon 

On 7/11/07 11:47 AM, "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
wrote: 
Hi Laura, Welcome and thanks for your question ? which is an
excellent one!  I?m also looking forward to hearing from subscribers
on this question. 
  
Some discussion on this can be found in one of the suggested resources,
entitled ?Pre-assessments for on-line learning?.  Go to:  
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance_1.html

  
The information in the discussion opens with a focus on ?wait
periods? or ?tryout periods? so that prospective students can
self-determine their ability and commitment, but it winds around to
discuss assessing skills that people need to engage in technology and
distance learning.   
  
I?d be very much interested in what List Subscribers think about that
discussion and Laura?s questions below. 
  
Marie Cora 
Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
  
  
-----Original Message----- 
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [ mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Laura Chenven 
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 10:45 AM 
To: The Assessment Discussion List 
Subject: [Assessment 842] Re: Questions for discussion 

Let me raise another question.  I am new to this list so it may be
something that many of you have already discussed.   

I work with a national labor/management partnership that supports
training and education for the incumbent healthcare workforce.  We are
supporting several distance learning and hybrid nursing programs. 
Because these programs are asynchronous for the most part and can fit
into many workers busy schedules, there is a great deal of interest in
them.  However, because we realize that distance learning may not be the
best modality for everyone, we want to be able to be able to screen for
students who are most likely to be successful in this kind of program
and also pinpoint other students who may be successful with some extra
help up front. 

I'd love to hear others experiences with this type of screening.  Do
you find it necessary? Is it helpful?  What have you learned. 
I'm looking forward to hearing from you. 

Laura Chenven 
H-CAP National Coordinator 
202 257-7108 
lchenven at 1199etjsp.org 

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [ mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Marie Cora 
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM 
To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion 
Hi everyone, 
  
It?s very quiet out there!  I?ve had many new subscribers join our
List, so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have
questions and I know you have experiences to share. Please post them
now! 
  
Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has
already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests
Shannon and Jennifer: 
  
Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important
follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within
professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) ? and I
know how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.  The
same goes for regular classroom-based programs ? getting full test
scores can be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in hearing from
folks about the strategies and methods they use to get DL students to
complete the full cycle including the post-test. 
  
Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this
regard? Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to
help demonstrate achievement? 
  
Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you
able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of
funding; timing; some F2F (?face-to-face?)/no F2F; staffing; etc)? 
  
Thanks!! 

Marie Cora 
  
  
  
Marie Cora 
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection 
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 

  

. 

. 

------------------------------- 
National Institute for Literacy 
Assessment mailing list 
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Email delivered to shannony at umich.edu 

-- 
Shannon J. Young 
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online 
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, &
Technology 
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan 
     
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248 
Ph:         (734) 763-5325 
Fax:       (734) 615-6638 
Email:     shannony at umich.edu 
Websites:       http://projectideal.org      
http://www.adultedonline.org 
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Email delivered to tina_luffman at yc.edu 

From KHinson at almanid.com  Fri Jul 13 16:38:58 2007
From: KHinson at almanid.com (Katrina Hinson)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 22:38:58 +0200
Subject: [Assessment 863]   Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
In-Reply-To: <OF6BAD00A4.FDD88647-ON07257317.00571215-07257317.00571216@yc.edu>
References: <0d3b01c7c54f$a8d8b090$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
	<OF6BAD00A4.FDD88647-ON07257317.00571215-07257317.00571216@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <4697AA8E.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>

We do pre and post testing face to face with DL students as well. They test in a group environment at least for the Pre Test. The post test are usually scheduled with me after so many hours of instruction and progress as we work towards their GED test.  If they're not post tested before the end of a session, we'll bring them in as fits their schedule to get their post testing done. Flexibility has definitely been a key component of the DL process.  One of the things I'm learning from the DL students is not that they don't want face to face interaction but don't have the time or resources to come to class as often as they would like to and DL provides them an avenue to make progress and positive steps forward in a way that fits their life commitments.

Regards,
Katrina Hinson

>>> <Tina_Luffman at yc.edu> 7/13/2007 11:51 am >>>
Hi Marie,
 
We normally do posttesting in a group setting to save instructor time and energy. One teacher has offered posttesting done at the same time she is giving pretesting when she does orientations. She will send out an invitation to her online students to come in at a certain time, and she has had some success with that setup. She does these on Saturdays. She also has her students make arrangements with the campus instructor to do posttesting for her.
 
I ask dl students to come to campus during the face-to-face (f2f) week of posttesting and give them a list of locations and times for them to give flexibility. I do posttesting one week per month. By the end of the semester, many students have come to at least one of these sessions. I also try to get the student to stay for the entire three hours class period to encourage some personal interaction with the staff and other students as well as to ask questions in person.
 
Because these students enter our program in group orienatations with the f2f students, the followup posttesting in group settings with other students is a natural process and seems to be a welcoming system. We also do go out of our way to accommodate students with individual posttesting. Some students are actually nervous about meeting in groups, and others have scheduling or transportation issues that we are willing to work around within reason.
Thanks,
 
Tina
 
Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

From KHinson at almanid.com  Fri Jul 13 16:47:25 2007
From: KHinson at almanid.com (Katrina Hinson)
Date: Fri, 13 Jul 2007 22:47:25 +0200
Subject: [Assessment 864]   Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
In-Reply-To: <0da401c7c56f$068d1720$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A077216D@ebe3.umassb.net>
	<0da401c7c56f$068d1720$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <4697AC89.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>

DL isn't always purely Distant. Students get stuck with a problem, or have an issue and he or she may not understand an area and may need some momentary face to face interaction with a real person. My DL students know that I teach from 8-3 but that any time after 3 they can come in and meet with me. I'll even give up my lunch time if need be to meet with my students.  Additionally, I will give my DL students my IM information and they know they can find me online if they want "real" time interaction outside of my normal workday hours.  

The NRS requirments for DL were just recently posted to the list. One of the requirements mentioned in the document is that pre and post testing has to be done face to face.  We already require our students to do that and all GED practice tests have to be done online. Additionally, one thing we've found is that it's helpful to have some kind of face to face interaction with the students. It's not as impersonal as it could be if the DL student didn't see a warm face and know they could really get the help they needed if they have questions or problems.

Regards,

Katrina Hinson

>>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 7/13/2007 12:58 pm >>>
(My apologies if you are receiving duplicates of any posts)

Hi Jennifer - thanks so much for this.  Yes, I didn't make myself that
clear in my post, but your reply definitely speaks to some of the
questions that I do have.  

I was indeed asking about what you discuss below:  I am interested in
how post-testing might get accomplished when you can be in f2f
situations, and whether or not being able to group students together
would make any difference at all.  

But I was also wondering (and I'm showing the true colors of my lack of
knowledge around the details of DL - but that's ok because I am here to
learn) these things:

-I assume that some DL is purely DL - no f2f (is that right?) -If so,
how do you use required tests that do not lend themselves to on-line
delivery? -And if post-assessment *can* be accomplished purely on-line,
are there ways to make that post-test more of a group task, which might
lead to more people completing that piece of the puzzle? (this group
task idea is obviously an assumption on my part)

Ok, thanks and looking forward to hearing what people's experiences are
with this.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-----Original Message-----
From: Jennifer A. Rafferty [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Jennifer A. Rafferty
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 10:06 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: RE: [Assessment 855] Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!

Hi Marie,
I don't know if I understood you correctly, but logistically it is not
always possible to get the dl learners together to be post-tested.  In
Massachusetts, our dl programs run with an open enrollment schedule, so
students start at different times and they accumulate "seat time" hours
at different rates depending on the intensity of their studying.   As is
with the orientation process, our programs have to be prepared to
provide support individually if the timing for orientation and
pre/post-testing doesn't fit the learners' schedules.  I have seen some
dl students go to classroom-based programs when post-testing is being
conducted in a group.  This seems to be a good logistical set-up, to
look at the scheduling of post-testing for classroom programs in the
agency, and send the dl learner to be post-tested there if it fits their
schedule and scenario.  When I was teaching in a dl ESOL program back in
2003, we were using the BEST to assess learners and it was challenging
to coordinate because each learner needed to be assessed individually
and the test needed to be administrated by another instructor.  We ended
up doing an exchange where I would assess classroom learners and a
classroom teacher came to my program to assess my distance learners.

Jennifer Rafferty

jennifer.rafferty at umb.edu 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Fri 7/13/2007 9:13 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
Subject: [Assessment 855]  Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
 
Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  
 
Today is our final day of conversation with Jennifer and Shannon on
assessment in distance learning.  I encourage you to post your questions
and experiences now.  I'm looking forward to reading the replies from
yesterday's posts.
 
Here's my next thought on this, I'm back to Post-Testing:  does DL
post-testing ever involve groups of learners together?  Or is it usually
a unilateral event for that one student?  I'm asking because I know this
is a tough area, and I was wondering if some amount of work with peers
might alter this.  What are people's thoughts and experiences on this?
 
Thanks,
Marie 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Email delivered to khinson at almanid.com

From djrosen at comcast.net  Sat Jul 14 18:40:21 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2007 18:40:21 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 865] GED Outcomes and Earnings Discussion with Dr. John
	Tyler
Message-ID: <2E60E47A-8503-49EC-9C3A-D700DFE753ED@comcast.net>

Colleagues,

On July 23rd, on the National Institute for Literacy Special Topics  
list, we will begin discussing the General Educational Development  
(GED) diploma outcomes research of Dr. John Tyler. Dr. Tyler is  
Associate Professor of Education, Economics, and Public Policy at  
Brown University in Providence, Rhode Island. An applied  
microeconomist, his research focuses on what is happening to low- 
skilled individuals in today's high-skill economy. He is regarded as  
one of the nation's experts on the economic returns to the General  
Educational Development (GED) certificate. Dr. Tyler's interests also  
include school reform issues, program evaluation, and quantitative  
research methods.

Dr. Tyler will take our questions from the week's discussion, will  
respond to them the following Monday, and will continue to respond to  
follow-up questions throughout the week of July 30th.

You or your colleagues who may wish to join this discussion can  
subscribe by going to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics
After you complete the simple registration form (30 seconds) you will  
receive an email asking you to confirm that you wish to subscribe.   
Immediately reply to the email to complete your subscription. After  
the discussion ends you can unsubscribe from the same Web address, or  
stay on for the next discussion.

To prepare for this discussion please look at a 30-minute video  
discussion with John Tyler; teacher, Sara Fass; and professional  
development coordinator, Sue Snider.  The video panel discussion  
focuses on the economic benefits that accrue to holders of the GED  
credential. It was based on a review by John Tyler of eight  
(published and working) research papers on the GED. Several of these  
papers were authored by John Tyler, Richard Murnane, and John  
Willett, researchers with the National Center for the Study of Adult  
Learning and Literacy (NCSALL) whose work has influenced what we know  
about the economic benefits of the GED.
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/ged/webcast_ged.html

The following readings, mentioned in the video panel discussion,  
would also be useful preparation for this discussion:

NCSALL GED Research Briefs
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=27
Seven briefs by John Tyler are linked on this page, among which are:
"The Economic Benefits of the GED: A Research Synthesis", "So You  
Want a GED? Estimating the Impact of the GED on the Earnings of  
Dropouts Who Seek the Credential", "Who Benefits from Obtaining a  
GED? Evidence from High School and Beyond", and "Estimating the Labor  
Market Signaling Value of the GED"

Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices About the GED and Your Future
http://www.ncsall.net/fileadmins/resources/teach/beyond_ged.pdf

The following additional GED research articles by John Tyler will be  
found in .pdf  on his Web page at
http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Education/personnel.php? 
who=jhtyler#pubs
2005 - "Is the GED an Effective Route to Postsecondary Education?"
2004 - "Does the GED Improve Earnings? Estimates from a Sample of  
Both Successful and Unsuccessful GED Candidates?" Industrial and  
Labor Relations Review 57:4 (2004), 579-98.
2004 - "The Devil?s in the Details: Evidence from the GED on the  
Large Effects of Small Differences in High Stakes Exams ".  Economics  
of Education Review 23:4 (2004), 336-49. With Richard J. Murnane and  
John B. Willett.

GED teachers, especially, will find the following publication of GED  
outcomes data -- intended to be used by GED teachers and their  
students -- of special interest. It was written by Sara Fass and  
Barbara Garner in 2000, and updated by Eileen Barry in 2006.
"Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices About the GED and Your Future"
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1099

I look forward to having you join us in this discussion.

David J. Rosen
Special Topics Discussion Moderator
djrosen at comcast.net

From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Thu Jul 12 12:25:39 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Thu, 12 Jul 2007 12:25:39 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 866]  National Commission on Adult Literacy Web Site
Message-ID: <9A530714-C566-4C8B-9888-AFB2F037A832@caalusa.org>

Colleagues,

You may be interested in the new web site of the National Commission  
on Adult Literacy. It was launched just yesterday and can be found  
at: www.nationalcommissiononadultliteracy.org.

As part of the site launch, the Commission is also making publicly  
available  a DVD presentation made to the Commission on April 17th.  
It is a 17-minute talk about major findings of the New Commission on  
Skills of the American Workforce by Marc Tucker, president of the  
National Center for Education and the Economy and New Commission  
study director. The DVD may be viewed online on either Mac or PC  
platforms. It is the first entry on the PUBLICATIONS page.

Gail S

Gail Spangenberg
President
Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Fl
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2362, F: 212-512-2610
www.caalusa.org

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Jul 16 09:41:26 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 09:41:26 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 867]  Discussion thanks
Message-ID: <0fca01c7c7af$02c41e80$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Dear Colleagues,
 
I would like to thank our guests, Shannon Young and Jennifer Rafferty,
for taking the time to share their experiences with us in last week's
discussion on assessment in distance learning.  I encourage subscribers
to check out the resources that were shared, and if you do, let us know
what you think.  Thanks also to those subscribers who posted their
questions and thoughts on this topic.
 
For now, if you have just subscribed to the List, you can read the
discussion at the archives.  Go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment and click on Read
Current Posted Messages dated from last week.   I will also prepare the
discussion in user-friendly format and post it at the archives; I'll
send email when it's ready - probably in about a week.
 
If people still have thoughts on this topic, please feel free to carry
on with the discussion.
 
Thanks!
 
Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From teacherwendyq at gmail.com  Mon Jul 16 09:53:43 2007
From: teacherwendyq at gmail.com (Wendy Quinones)
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 09:53:43 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 868] Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
In-Reply-To: <C2BD5082.19F74%shannony@umich.edu>
References: <ad2cc1ef0707131204t48d5a4d2qbc962439e4acc391@mail.gmail.com>
	<C2BD5082.19F74%shannony@umich.edu>
Message-ID: <ad2cc1ef0707160653y2e402fb4hcce87d14e4221377@mail.gmail.com>

Both these links worked fine, Shannon -- thanks!  I can't imagine what the
problem was before, unless it was some Microsoft whimsy that day.  Who can
account for Bill Gates's moods?  :-)

Wendy

On 7/13/07, Shannon Young <shannony at umich.edu> wrote:
>
> Hi Wendy,
>
> I didn't have trouble with either link.  Would you try again?  Perhaps
> your browser handles things differently from mine.  If neither works for
> you, you can find the "Is Distance for Me?" quizzes on each site by going to
> their Distance Learning pages.  For Guilford (www.gtcc.edu), go to
> Distance Learning (right hand menu on the home page) and then to the submenu
> Getting Started.  For Pima, (www.pima.edu) it's in Courses and Degrees,
> submenu Distance Learning.
>
> Pima:  *http://www.pima.edu/cgi-bin/onlineReadiness/quiz.pl
> *
> Guilford:  http://www.gtcc.edu/distance/dlForMe.html
>
>
> I hope this helps!
>
> Thanks, Shannon
>
> On 7/13/07 3:04 PM, "Wendy Quinones" <teacherwendyq at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Sorry for coming in late on this, but a couple of the pre-screening links
> Shannon gave us are dead -- the Pima Community College and Guilford
> Technical College ones.  They sound terrific, so I'd really like to find
> them!
>
> Wendy Quinones
>
>
>
>
> Shannon J. Young
> Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
> Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, &
> Technology
> Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
>
> 5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
> Ph:         (734) 763-5325
> Fax:       (734) 615-6638
> Email:     shannony at umich.edu
> Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to teacherwendyq at gmail.com
>
>
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From lchenven at 1199funds.org  Mon Jul 16 09:57:30 2007
From: lchenven at 1199funds.org (Laura Chenven)
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 09:57:30 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 869] FW: Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
Message-ID: <AD114AC462004246B6C08FF2E4E7A6C203DBDAC0@1199mail.1199etjsp.org>

 

Even though this discussion is officially over, we can still talk about
the subject I hope.  
The Healthcare Career Advancement Program is, among other things,
working with several labor management partnerships on distance learning
nursing programs.  One of the things we are interested in is the
interaction between students and instructors.  In some instances we
understand that there is even more interaction in DL than would be
possible in some of the lecture hall classes that many students
experience in general education and nursing lecture courses.  We are
also looking at the issue of sheltered entry to college utilizing
distance learning.  For example, workers who have been out of school a
long time often have difficulty making the transition to college and
need a lot of support as they are beginning their gen ed courses and
pre-requisites for nursing.  We are considering a hybrid
on-ground/on-line entry to college that starts with more classroom face
time (and group computer time) and ends with more individual and
asynchronous on line time.  We think this would be particularly helpful
for students interested in on line programs who need to get up to speed
with using the computer and getting into distance learning.
Do any of  you have examples of these kinds of programs?
Thanks,
Laura ChenvenH-CAP
National Coordinator
P.O. Box 5688
Takoma Park, MD 20913
202 257-7108
lchenven at 1199funds.org
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Katrina Hinson
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 4:47 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 864] Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!

DL isn't always purely Distant. Students get stuck with a problem, or
have an issue and he or she may not understand an area and may need some
momentary face to face interaction with a real person. My DL students
know that I teach from 8-3 but that any time after 3 they can come in
and meet with me. I'll even give up my lunch time if need be to meet
with my students.  Additionally, I will give my DL students my IM
information and they know they can find me online if they want "real"
time interaction outside of my normal workday hours.  

The NRS requirments for DL were just recently posted to the list. One of
the requirements mentioned in the document is that pre and post testing
has to be done face to face.  We already require our students to do that
and all GED practice tests have to be done online. Additionally, one
thing we've found is that it's helpful to have some kind of face to face
interaction with the students. It's not as impersonal as it could be if
the DL student didn't see a warm face and know they could really get the
help they needed if they have questions or problems.

Regards,

Katrina Hinson

>>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 7/13/2007 12:58 pm >>>
(My apologies if you are receiving duplicates of any posts)

Hi Jennifer - thanks so much for this.  Yes, I didn't make myself that
clear in my post, but your reply definitely speaks to some of the
questions that I do have.  

I was indeed asking about what you discuss below:  I am interested in
how post-testing might get accomplished when you can be in f2f
situations, and whether or not being able to group students together
would make any difference at all.  

But I was also wondering (and I'm showing the true colors of my lack of
knowledge around the details of DL - but that's ok because I am here to
learn) these things:

-I assume that some DL is purely DL - no f2f (is that right?) -If so,
how do you use required tests that do not lend themselves to on-line
delivery? -And if post-assessment *can* be accomplished purely on-line,
are there ways to make that post-test more of a group task, which might
lead to more people completing that piece of the puzzle? (this group
task idea is obviously an assumption on my part)

Ok, thanks and looking forward to hearing what people's experiences are
with this.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-----Original Message-----
From: Jennifer A. Rafferty [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Jennifer A. Rafferty
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 10:06 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: RE: [Assessment 855] Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!

Hi Marie,
I don't know if I understood you correctly, but logistically it is not
always possible to get the dl learners together to be post-tested.  In
Massachusetts, our dl programs run with an open enrollment schedule, so
students start at different times and they accumulate "seat time" hours
at different rates depending on the intensity of their studying.   As is
with the orientation process, our programs have to be prepared to
provide support individually if the timing for orientation and
pre/post-testing doesn't fit the learners' schedules.  I have seen some
dl students go to classroom-based programs when post-testing is being
conducted in a group.  This seems to be a good logistical set-up, to
look at the scheduling of post-testing for classroom programs in the
agency, and send the dl learner to be post-tested there if it fits their
schedule and scenario.  When I was teaching in a dl ESOL program back in
2003, we were using the BEST to assess learners and it was challenging
to coordinate because each learner needed to be assessed individually
and the test needed to be administrated by another instructor.  We ended
up doing an exchange where I would assess classroom learners and a
classroom teacher came to my program to assess my distance learners.

Jennifer Rafferty

jennifer.rafferty at umb.edu 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Fri 7/13/2007 9:13 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 855]  Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
 
Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  
 
Today is our final day of conversation with Jennifer and Shannon on
assessment in distance learning.  I encourage you to post your questions
and experiences now.  I'm looking forward to reading the replies from
yesterday's posts.
 
Here's my next thought on this, I'm back to Post-Testing:  does DL
post-testing ever involve groups of learners together?  Or is it usually
a unilateral event for that one student?  I'm asking because I know this
is a tough area, and I was wondering if some amount of work with peers
might alter this.  What are people's thoughts and experiences on this?
 
Thanks,
Marie 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to khinson at almanid.com
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to lchenven at 1199etjsp.org

.

?Please note that the email address for the person you are corresponding with has changed.  The new address is listed above.  Please use this new address in all future correspondence.  Thank you?

Health care information is personal and sensitive information. If such information is being emailed to you, it is after appropriate authorization from the patient or under circumstances that do not require patient authorization. You, the recipient, are obligated to maintain it in a safe, secure and confidential manner. Re-disclosure without additional patient consent or as permitted by law is prohibited. Unauthorized re-disclosure or failure to maintain confidentiality could subject you to penalties described in federal and state law. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the related message.

From Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu  Mon Jul 16 10:34:06 2007
From: Jennifer.Rafferty at umb.edu (Jennifer A. Rafferty)
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 10:34:06 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 870] Re: FW: Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
References: <AD114AC462004246B6C08FF2E4E7A6C203DBDAC0@1199mail.1199etjsp.org>
Message-ID: <FABAF66545F50E40B114475DE50E36A0772179@ebe3.umassb.net>

Hi Laura,
Thanks for posting.  The hybrid/blended program that you describe with more face-to-face in the beginning phase of enrollment is an approach that we have used in MA with our distance learning pilot programs.  While we never coined it as a model per se, we discussed what we recognized as a trend with some learners who gradually made their way into the independent learning mode.  I always imagine a spectrum when I see distance learners.  At one end is the group that enters and can immediately engage in distance learning because they have the independent learning skills and other skills needed to persist.  At the other end of the spectrum are those who require a blended model with more face-to-face time.  Some of these learners who start with the blended model eventually move on the spectrum towards the independent learning mode as they gain comfort with the new delivery.  Others continue to need regular face-to-face support.  In short, we have used a flexible approach that addresses the needs of the individual. 
Jennifer

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Laura Chenven
Sent: Mon 7/16/2007 9:57 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 869] FW: Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
 
 

Even though this discussion is officially over, we can still talk about
the subject I hope.  
The Healthcare Career Advancement Program is, among other things,
working with several labor management partnerships on distance learning
nursing programs.  One of the things we are interested in is the
interaction between students and instructors.  In some instances we
understand that there is even more interaction in DL than would be
possible in some of the lecture hall classes that many students
experience in general education and nursing lecture courses.  We are
also looking at the issue of sheltered entry to college utilizing
distance learning.  For example, workers who have been out of school a
long time often have difficulty making the transition to college and
need a lot of support as they are beginning their gen ed courses and
pre-requisites for nursing.  We are considering a hybrid
on-ground/on-line entry to college that starts with more classroom face
time (and group computer time) and ends with more individual and
asynchronous on line time.  We think this would be particularly helpful
for students interested in on line programs who need to get up to speed
with using the computer and getting into distance learning.
Do any of  you have examples of these kinds of programs?
Thanks,
Laura ChenvenH-CAP
National Coordinator
P.O. Box 5688
Takoma Park, MD 20913
202 257-7108
lchenven at 1199funds.org
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Katrina Hinson
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 4:47 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 864] Re: Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!

DL isn't always purely Distant. Students get stuck with a problem, or
have an issue and he or she may not understand an area and may need some
momentary face to face interaction with a real person. My DL students
know that I teach from 8-3 but that any time after 3 they can come in
and meet with me. I'll even give up my lunch time if need be to meet
with my students.  Additionally, I will give my DL students my IM
information and they know they can find me online if they want "real"
time interaction outside of my normal workday hours.  

The NRS requirments for DL were just recently posted to the list. One of
the requirements mentioned in the document is that pre and post testing
has to be done face to face.  We already require our students to do that
and all GED practice tests have to be done online. Additionally, one
thing we've found is that it's helpful to have some kind of face to face
interaction with the students. It's not as impersonal as it could be if
the DL student didn't see a warm face and know they could really get the
help they needed if they have questions or problems.

Regards,

Katrina Hinson

>>> "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 7/13/2007 12:58 pm >>>
(My apologies if you are receiving duplicates of any posts)

Hi Jennifer - thanks so much for this.  Yes, I didn't make myself that
clear in my post, but your reply definitely speaks to some of the
questions that I do have.  

I was indeed asking about what you discuss below:  I am interested in
how post-testing might get accomplished when you can be in f2f
situations, and whether or not being able to group students together
would make any difference at all.  

But I was also wondering (and I'm showing the true colors of my lack of
knowledge around the details of DL - but that's ok because I am here to
learn) these things:

-I assume that some DL is purely DL - no f2f (is that right?) -If so,
how do you use required tests that do not lend themselves to on-line
delivery? -And if post-assessment *can* be accomplished purely on-line,
are there ways to make that post-test more of a group task, which might
lead to more people completing that piece of the puzzle? (this group
task idea is obviously an assumption on my part)

Ok, thanks and looking forward to hearing what people's experiences are
with this.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-----Original Message-----
From: Jennifer A. Rafferty [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Jennifer A. Rafferty
Sent: Friday, July 13, 2007 10:06 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: RE: [Assessment 855] Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!

Hi Marie,
I don't know if I understood you correctly, but logistically it is not
always possible to get the dl learners together to be post-tested.  In
Massachusetts, our dl programs run with an open enrollment schedule, so
students start at different times and they accumulate "seat time" hours
at different rates depending on the intensity of their studying.   As is
with the orientation process, our programs have to be prepared to
provide support individually if the timing for orientation and
pre/post-testing doesn't fit the learners' schedules.  I have seen some
dl students go to classroom-based programs when post-testing is being
conducted in a group.  This seems to be a good logistical set-up, to
look at the scheduling of post-testing for classroom programs in the
agency, and send the dl learner to be post-tested there if it fits their
schedule and scenario.  When I was teaching in a dl ESOL program back in
2003, we were using the BEST to assess learners and it was challenging
to coordinate because each learner needed to be assessed individually
and the test needed to be administrated by another instructor.  We ended
up doing an exchange where I would assess classroom learners and a
classroom teacher came to my program to assess my distance learners.

Jennifer Rafferty

jennifer.rafferty at umb.edu 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Marie Cora
Sent: Fri 7/13/2007 9:13 AM
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 855]  Final Day for DL Assessment discussion!
 
Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  
 
Today is our final day of conversation with Jennifer and Shannon on
assessment in distance learning.  I encourage you to post your questions
and experiences now.  I'm looking forward to reading the replies from
yesterday's posts.
 
Here's my next thought on this, I'm back to Post-Testing:  does DL
post-testing ever involve groups of learners together?  Or is it usually
a unilateral event for that one student?  I'm asking because I know this
is a tough area, and I was wondering if some amount of work with peers
might alter this.  What are people's thoughts and experiences on this?
 
Thanks,
Marie 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
 
 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to khinson at almanid.com
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to lchenven at 1199etjsp.org

.

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From djrosen at comcast.net  Mon Jul 16 13:12:19 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 13:12:19 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 871]  NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning Assessment
In-Reply-To: <85268246A4FDDC419FFAEC9BE229211D01E40F22@smtp.doemass.org>
References: <85268246A4FDDC419FFAEC9BE229211D01E40F22@smtp.doemass.org>
Message-ID: <102918D9-C939-4AC1-9403-EE55E3CA6F2A@comcast.net>

Assessment colleagues,

Here's a follow-up to the discussion on distance learning  
assessment.  I have a question about the changes to the NRS  
guidelines for distance education learners. ( http://www.nrsweb.org.   
Look under What's New.)

Item 3: "For NRS reporting, states can count a student only once, as  
either a distance education student or traditional classroom learner."

Presumably that means the student can be counted only once annually,  
and that the program needs to decide if the student is _primarily_ a  
distance learning student or _primarily_ a face-to-face (classroom or  
tutorial) student. Presumably this gives programs and students the  
freedom to offer distance learning options and face-to-face options  
to the same student within the year, that a face-to-face student  
could also have supplemental online learning.  Presumably, the intent  
of this is to avoid double-counting the same person, not to restrict  
how students access learning (whether distance learning or face-to- 
face or both).

Donna Cornellier, or Larry Condelli, are my presumptions correct?

Thanks,

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Jul 11, 2007, at 4:08 PM, Cornellier, Donna wrote:

> Hi Marie,
>
> I've attached the new NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning that  
> were sent out to State Directors on June 6, 2007 with a memo from  
> Cheryl Keenan.  The distance education policy includes a definition  
> of distance learners, guidance on how to measure contact hours for  
> the learners, and describes assessment and reporting requirements  
> which are summarized in the memo.  It will be an interesting  
> discussion around how states implement these policies, and you have  
> posed some great questions below.
>
> Thanks,
> Donna Cornellier
> Massachusetts NRS Trainer
>
>
> From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> It?s very quiet out there!  I?ve had many new subscribers join our  
> List, so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have  
> questions and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post  
> them now!
>
>
>
> Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has  
> already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests  
> Shannon and Jennifer:
>
>
>
> Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important  
> follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within  
> professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) ? and I  
> know how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.   
> The same goes for regular classroom-based programs ? getting full  
> test scores can be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in  
> hearing from folks about the strategies and methods they use to get  
> DL students to complete the full cycle including the post-test.
>
>
>
> Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in  
> this regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of  
> measures to help demonstrate achievement?
>
>
>
> Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are  
> you able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels  
> of funding; timing; some F2F (?face-to-face?)/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

From LCondelli at air.org  Mon Jul 16 14:47:46 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 14:47:46 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 872] Re: NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning Assessment
In-Reply-To: <102918D9-C939-4AC1-9403-EE55E3CA6F2A@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2D1348F@dc1ex03.air.org>

Hi David,

Yes, your are correct in your interpretation.  The only intent for NRS
purposes is to avoid double counting, while at the same time giving
states as much latitude as possible to provide both distance and other
instruction.  States need only explain (in their distance education
policy) how they make the determination for counting purposes.

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 1:12 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 871] NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning
Assessment

Assessment colleagues,

Here's a follow-up to the discussion on distance learning assessment.  I
have a question about the changes to the NRS  
guidelines for distance education learners. ( http://www.nrsweb.org.   
Look under What's New.)

Item 3: "For NRS reporting, states can count a student only once, as
either a distance education student or traditional classroom learner."

Presumably that means the student can be counted only once annually, and
that the program needs to decide if the student is _primarily_ a
distance learning student or _primarily_ a face-to-face (classroom or
tutorial) student. Presumably this gives programs and students the
freedom to offer distance learning options and face-to-face options to
the same student within the year, that a face-to-face student could also
have supplemental online learning.  Presumably, the intent of this is to
avoid double-counting the same person, not to restrict how students
access learning (whether distance learning or face-to- face or both).

Donna Cornellier, or Larry Condelli, are my presumptions correct?

Thanks,

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Jul 11, 2007, at 4:08 PM, Cornellier, Donna wrote:

> Hi Marie,
>
> I've attached the new NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning that were 
> sent out to State Directors on June 6, 2007 with a memo from Cheryl 
> Keenan.  The distance education policy includes a definition of 
> distance learners, guidance on how to measure contact hours for the 
> learners, and describes assessment and reporting requirements which 
> are summarized in the memo.  It will be an interesting discussion 
> around how states implement these policies, and you have posed some 
> great questions below.
>
> Thanks,
> Donna Cornellier
> Massachusetts NRS Trainer
>
>
> From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our  
> List, so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have  
> questions and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post them 
> now!
>
>
>
> Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has 
> already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests 
> Shannon and Jennifer:
>
>
>
> Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important  
> follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within  
> professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I  
> know how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.   
> The same goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full  
> test scores can be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in  
> hearing from folks about the strategies and methods they use to get  
> DL students to complete the full cycle including the post-test.
>
>
>
> Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in  
> this regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of  
> measures to help demonstrate achievement?
>
>
>
> Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are  
> you able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels  
> of funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to lcondelli at air.org

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Jul 16 15:50:41 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 15:50:41 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 873]  AE Content Standards Warehouse redesign
Message-ID: <108a01c7c7e2$97c3db00$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:
 
The following message is from Cheryl Keenan.
 
************************************************************************
************** 
I would like to take this opportunity to announce the redesign of the
Adult Education Content Standards Warehouse Website, which provides
materials to support the planning, development, alignment, and
implementation of content standards for adult education.  We have
revised the site to be more user-friendly and accessible to the viewer,
based on input from the field and a usability evaluation.  Please visit
the revised site at <http://www.adultedcontentstandards.ed.gov>, which I
encourage you to bookmark for future reference.
On this site, you can find content standards from a variety of states
and organizations in the areas of English language acquisition, reading,
and mathematics; relevant national and international standards;
professional development materials for standards-based education reform;
and A Process Guide for Developing Adult Education Content Standards. 
The American Institutes for Research (AIR) operates the Adult Education
Content Standards Warehouse Website through a contract with the Office
of Vocational and Adult Education, US Department of Education.
Cheryl Keenan 
Director, Division of Adult Education and Literacy 
Office of Vocational and Adult Education 
U.S. Department of Education 
550 12th Street, SW 
Washington, DC 20202-7240 
Cheryl.Keenan at ed.gov 
(202) 245-7721 
-------------- next part --------------
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From shannony at umich.edu  Mon Jul 16 16:41:17 2007
From: shannony at umich.edu (Shannon Young)
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:41:17 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 874] Re: NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning Assessment
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2D1348F@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <C2C1502D.1A02E%shannony@umich.edu>

The primary counting issue we've seen so far has to do with hybrid or
blended learning students.   In some instances, students study in a
classroom program for some months and then switch to distance learning
(e.g., during winter months).  Does an agency assign status based on which
program (classroom or distance) the student entered first? on which approach
accumulated more hours?, etc.  In other instances, the student may
participate in a combination of distance and classroom study concurrently.
At what point do you determine whether a student should be considered a
distance or classroom learner?  And, what are the benefits/drawbacks of
counting them one way or the other?

Traditionally, counting "seat time" hours has been used to determine when to
post-test a student.  Now that both distance and classroom hours can be
accumulated, what impact, if any, should this have on post-testing
timeframes?  

We will be working with Project IDEAL states this August on developing their
policies and plans for counting distance learners using the new NRS
guidelines.  We will also have a paper (due out this fall) that addresses
some of these questions.   What other questions are you exploring as you
review the new NRS guidelines and think about the ramifications for data
collection and reporting?

Thanks,
Shannon

-- 
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org

On 7/16/07 2:47 PM, "Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> wrote:

> Hi David,
> 
> Yes, your are correct in your interpretation.  The only intent for NRS
> purposes is to avoid double counting, while at the same time giving
> states as much latitude as possible to provide both distance and other
> instruction.  States need only explain (in their distance education
> policy) how they make the determination for counting purposes.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 1:12 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 871] NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning
> Assessment
> 
> Assessment colleagues,
> 
> Here's a follow-up to the discussion on distance learning assessment.  I
> have a question about the changes to the NRS
> guidelines for distance education learners. ( http://www.nrsweb.org.
> Look under What's New.)
> 
> Item 3: "For NRS reporting, states can count a student only once, as
> either a distance education student or traditional classroom learner."
> 
> Presumably that means the student can be counted only once annually, and
> that the program needs to decide if the student is _primarily_ a
> distance learning student or _primarily_ a face-to-face (classroom or
> tutorial) student. Presumably this gives programs and students the
> freedom to offer distance learning options and face-to-face options to
> the same student within the year, that a face-to-face student could also
> have supplemental online learning.  Presumably, the intent of this is to
> avoid double-counting the same person, not to restrict how students
> access learning (whether distance learning or face-to- face or both).
> 
> Donna Cornellier, or Larry Condelli, are my presumptions correct?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net

From VenuT at lacnyc.org  Mon Jul 16 16:46:18 2007
From: VenuT at lacnyc.org (Venu Thelakkat)
Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2007 16:46:18 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 875] Re: NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning Assessment
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2D1348F@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB84C3FF3@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

Larry, 

Where exactly would the double counting happen?  If I understand the new
reporting policy correctly, states are being required to submit two new
tables, 4c and 5a, just for distance learning students but to include
all students in the old NRS tables 1 - 6.  This tells me that 4c is a
subset of table 4 and 5a is a subset of table 5.  On which table would
we make the mistake of counting a student who is enrolled in both
distance learning and traditional classroom instruction twice?  We
already make sure we don't double count students enrolled in more than
one class.  Is this not similar?  

Venu Thelakkat
Director of ALIES/Data Analysis
Literacy Assistance Center
32 Broadway, 10th Floor
New York, NY 10004
Phone: (212) 803-3370
Fax: (212) 785-3685
Email: venut at lacnyc.org
Web: www.alies.org

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Condelli, Larry
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 2:48 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 872] Re: NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning
Assessment

Hi David,

Yes, your are correct in your interpretation.  The only intent for NRS
purposes is to avoid double counting, while at the same time giving
states as much latitude as possible to provide both distance and other
instruction.  States need only explain (in their distance education
policy) how they make the determination for counting purposes.

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 1:12 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 871] NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning
Assessment

Assessment colleagues,

Here's a follow-up to the discussion on distance learning assessment.  I
have a question about the changes to the NRS  
guidelines for distance education learners. ( http://www.nrsweb.org.   
Look under What's New.)

Item 3: "For NRS reporting, states can count a student only once, as
either a distance education student or traditional classroom learner."

Presumably that means the student can be counted only once annually, and
that the program needs to decide if the student is _primarily_ a
distance learning student or _primarily_ a face-to-face (classroom or
tutorial) student. Presumably this gives programs and students the
freedom to offer distance learning options and face-to-face options to
the same student within the year, that a face-to-face student could also
have supplemental online learning.  Presumably, the intent of this is to
avoid double-counting the same person, not to restrict how students
access learning (whether distance learning or face-to- face or both).

Donna Cornellier, or Larry Condelli, are my presumptions correct?

Thanks,

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Jul 11, 2007, at 4:08 PM, Cornellier, Donna wrote:

> Hi Marie,
>
> I've attached the new NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning that were 
> sent out to State Directors on June 6, 2007 with a memo from Cheryl 
> Keenan.  The distance education policy includes a definition of 
> distance learners, guidance on how to measure contact hours for the 
> learners, and describes assessment and reporting requirements which 
> are summarized in the memo.  It will be an interesting discussion 
> around how states implement these policies, and you have posed some 
> great questions below.
>
> Thanks,
> Donna Cornellier
> Massachusetts NRS Trainer
>
>
> From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our  
> List, so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have  
> questions and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post them 
> now!
>
>
>
> Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has 
> already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests 
> Shannon and Jennifer:
>
>
>
> Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important  
> follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within  
> professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I  
> know how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.   
> The same goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full  
> test scores can be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in  
> hearing from folks about the strategies and methods they use to get  
> DL students to complete the full cycle including the post-test.
>
>
>
> Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in  
> this regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of  
> measures to help demonstrate achievement?
>
>
>
> Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are  
> you able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels  
> of funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to lcondelli at air.org
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to venut at lacnyc.org

From KHinson at almanid.com  Mon Jul 16 21:06:00 2007
From: KHinson at almanid.com (Katrina Hinson)
Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 03:06:00 +0200
Subject: [Assessment 876] Re: NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning	Assessment
In-Reply-To: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2D1348F@dc1ex03.air.org>
References: <102918D9-C939-4AC1-9403-EE55E3CA6F2A@comcast.net>
	<E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2D1348F@dc1ex03.air.org>
Message-ID: <469BDDB2.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>

Ok, How does this work if say for instance, a student is enrolled in a physical class that runs from 8-12 and then is enrolled in a distance learning class for time outside the 8-12 boundary or for day he/she is absent.  They are only counted once even though that is two separate classes, rosters and contracts?

Regards,
Katrina

>>> "Condelli, Larry" <LCondelli at air.org> 7/16/2007 2:47 pm >>>
Hi David,

Yes, your are correct in your interpretation.  The only intent for NRS
purposes is to avoid double counting, while at the same time giving
states as much latitude as possible to provide both distance and other
instruction.  States need only explain (in their distance education
policy) how they make the determination for counting purposes.

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Monday, July 16, 2007 1:12 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 871] NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning
Assessment

Assessment colleagues,

Here's a follow-up to the discussion on distance learning assessment.  I
have a question about the changes to the NRS  
guidelines for distance education learners. ( http://www.nrsweb.org.   
Look under What's New.)

Item 3: "For NRS reporting, states can count a student only once, as
either a distance education student or traditional classroom learner."

Presumably that means the student can be counted only once annually, and
that the program needs to decide if the student is _primarily_ a
distance learning student or _primarily_ a face-to-face (classroom or
tutorial) student. Presumably this gives programs and students the
freedom to offer distance learning options and face-to-face options to
the same student within the year, that a face-to-face student could also
have supplemental online learning.  Presumably, the intent of this is to
avoid double-counting the same person, not to restrict how students
access learning (whether distance learning or face-to- face or both).

Donna Cornellier, or Larry Condelli, are my presumptions correct?

Thanks,

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net 

On Jul 11, 2007, at 4:08 PM, Cornellier, Donna wrote:

> Hi Marie,
>
> I've attached the new NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning that were 
> sent out to State Directors on June 6, 2007 with a memo from Cheryl 
> Keenan.  The distance education policy includes a definition of 
> distance learners, guidance on how to measure contact hours for the 
> learners, and describes assessment and reporting requirements which 
> are summarized in the memo.  It will be an interesting discussion 
> around how states implement these policies, and you have posed some 
> great questions below.
>
> Thanks,
> Donna Cornellier
> Massachusetts NRS Trainer
>
>
> From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com] 
> Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
> Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our  
> List, so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have  
> questions and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post them 
> now!
>
>
>
> Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has 
> already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests 
> Shannon and Jennifer:
>
>
>
> Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important  
> follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within  
> professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I  
> know how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.   
> The same goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full  
> test scores can be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in  
> hearing from folks about the strategies and methods they use to get  
> DL students to complete the full cycle including the post-test.
>
>
>
> Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in  
> this regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of  
> measures to help demonstrate achievement?
>
>
>
> Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are  
> you able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels  
> of funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
>
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/ 
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov 
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net 

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Email delivered to lcondelli at air.org 
-------------------------------
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Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Email delivered to khinson at almanid.com

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jul 17 00:17:35 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2007 00:17:35 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 877]  Financial Literacy Discussion Announcement
Message-ID: <10dd01c7c829$67d42840$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

On the family literacy list there will be a discussion on financial
literacy starting July 18th. If you are interesting in partaking in this
discussion, you can subscribe to the list by going to:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/familyliteracy 
If you would like to subscribe only for the discussion, you can
unsubscribe at the same Web page when the discussion is over..

Here is the discussion announcement from Gail Price, the family and
literacy discussion list facilitator:

We will hold a discussion about financial literacy on the National
Institute for Literacy Family Literacy  discussion list during the week
of July 18 -20. Our guest for this discussion will be Margo Waddell,
Senior Program Specialist and Project Manager, National Center for
Family Literacy.

We will discuss: 

*	What financial literacy is. 
*	What the goals and purposes of financial literacy programs are.

*	Why financial literacy is important. 
*	Where you can find resources in your community. 
*	Lessons learned regarding instruction; adult and pre-school. 
*	Ages and stages for financial education instruction. 
*	Family involvement in financial planning. 
*	...and more 

 

Background Reading

Visit the Verizon Thinkfinity Web site at 

http://literacynetwork.verizon.org/Family-Literacy.115.0.html
<http://literacynetwork.verizon.org/Family-Literacy.115.0.html> 

 to explore the following resources

Basic Intergenerational Financial Literacy Resources - Four user
friendly resources for teachers and adult learners.   

Family Money Matters: Exploring the World of Economics - More resources
for teaching Basic Intergenerational Financial Literacy.   

 

Biography of Guest

Margo Waddell, a senior program specialist and project manager with the
National Center for Family Literacy (NCFL), currently is the project
manager for NCFL??*s Financial Education partnership with Women 4 Women.
In partnership with the National Endowment for Financial Education, she
is piloting a new curriculum for adult learners, Financial Opportunity:
Family Progress, and has co-authored both an instruction guide for
implementing the curriculum and a Family Financial Play Pack for
pre-school children to explore at home with their parents.

Margo began her work in family literacy co-coordinating one of the
first National Barbara Bush Family Literacy grants at Western Suffolk
BOCES, Dix Hills, New York, in 1990. She also provided technical
assistance and professional development to Even Start family literacy
programs across New York State for the Center for Family Resources in
Mineola, New York. Margo joined the NCFL endorsed trainer network in
1995 and moved to Louisville to join the NCFL staff in 1998 as a project
manager for the NCFL/UPS Careers for Families program. In 1992 she
became project manager for the Family Independence Initiative. These
programs demonstrated that family literacy is a practical solution to
welfare reform and have been recognized by both the National Association
of Welfare Statistics and the Welfare Information Network as promising
practices. 

Questions We Will Discuss

1.	How do you address financial literacy in your work now? 
2.	What are some financial literacy resources you have found
helpful? 
3.	What source, if any, do you have for financial literacy
resources? 
4.	What are some of the questions you are asked by students about
financial matters? 
5.	What are the ages of the children in your programs and how are
you introducing them to financial concepts? 

Gail J. Price
Multimedia Specialist
National Center for Family Literacy
325 W. Main Street, Suite 300
Louisville, KY 40202
gprice at famlit.org 
502 584-1133, ext. 112

From mdaniels at proliteracy.org  Wed Jul 18 12:59:10 2007
From: mdaniels at proliteracy.org (mdaniels)
Date: Wed, 18 Jul 2007 12:59:10 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 878] Model programs sought for performance
	accountability initiative
Message-ID: <221E918332E818488687199E5CBD74CE065CAC6B@keats.proliteracy.org>

WANTED: Model Programs for Performance Accountability Initiative 
DEADLINE!  5:00 PM EDT July 20, 2007 

Join ProLiteracy America and the Dollar General Literacy Foundation in the
three-year Dollar General/ProLiteracy Performance Accountability Initiative.

Be one of eight model programs selected (in each year of the three years) to
help identify promising practices in adult education and literacy program
accountability. Your expertise and resources will be used to design training
sessions that will help other programs improve their  performance
accountability.

If your program can demonstrate success in the area of "Data Analysis for
Program Decision-Making," ProLiteracy wants to hear from you! If you are
selected, your program receives a small stipend, increased visibility, and
the chance to impact others in the literacy and adult education field.

Act NOW -- the deadline for accepting nominations is 5:00 PM EDT on Friday,
July 20, 2007. 

Apply online at http://www.proliteracy.org/external/dg_pai.asp. Share this
information with other programs you think would be a great resource. 

Thanks for your help in this important project (and your response by July
20!) 

Direct your questions to Melanie Daniels, project manager, via e-mail at
mdaniels at proliteracy.org.

From donnaedp at cox.net  Thu Jul 19 08:37:30 2007
From: donnaedp at cox.net (Donna Chambers)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 08:37:30 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 879] Re: Questions for discussion
References: <85268246A4FDDC419FFAEC9BE229211D01E40F22@smtp.doemass.org>
Message-ID: <001601c7ca01$934f8a30$e884c848@DH89L251>

Donna,

I saw this on the Listserv, but didn't see the attachment that you sent out to State Directors. I would appreciate if you would send me the attachment.  Thanks. Donna Chambers
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Cornellier, Donna 
  To: The Assessment Discussion List 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 4:08 PM
  Subject: [Assessment 848] Re: Questions for discussion

  Hi Marie,

  I've attached the new NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning that were sent out to State Directors on June 6, 2007 with a memo from Cheryl Keenan.  The distance education policy includes a definition of distance learners, guidance on how to measure contact hours for the learners, and describes assessment and reporting requirements which are summarized in the memo.  It will be an interesting discussion around how states implement these policies, and you have posed some great questions below.

  Thanks,
  Donna Cornellier
  Massachusetts NRS Trainer  

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: Marie Cora [mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com] 
  Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 10:34 AM
  To: Assessment at nifl.gov
  Subject: [Assessment 834] Questions for discussion

  Hi everyone,

   

  It's very quiet out there!  I've had many new subscribers join our List, so I know this is of interest to you all.   I know you have questions and I know you have experiences to share.  Please post them now!

   

  Here is one of my questions for this discussion, which actually has already been asked within the suggested preparations by our guests Shannon and Jennifer:

   

  Post-testing:  How is this done?  How do you get that important follow-up measure from students?  I have experience in DL within professional development only (not with ABE/ESOL students) - and I know how difficult follow-up is with the professional population.  The same goes for regular classroom-based programs - getting full test scores can be really hard.  So I am extremely interested in hearing from folks about the strategies and methods they use to get DL students to complete the full cycle including the post-test.

   

  Do federal requirements allow for any flexibility/creativity in this regard?  Can you use formative assessment and other types of measures to help demonstrate achievement?

   

  Do Project IDEAL states do their assessment in the same way, or are you able to alter your approach depending on certain things (levels of funding; timing; some F2F ("face-to-face")/no F2F; staffing; etc)?

   

  Thanks!!

  Marie Cora

   

   

   

  Marie Cora

  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

  NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

  Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

  http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

   

   

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  -------------------------------
  National Institute for Literacy
  Assessment mailing list
  Assessment at nifl.gov
  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
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From shannony at umich.edu  Thu Jul 19 09:34:34 2007
From: shannony at umich.edu (Shannon Young)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 09:34:34 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 880] Re: NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning Assessment
In-Reply-To: <469BDDB2.121C.00A0.0@almanid.com>
Message-ID: <C2C4E0AA.1A15D%shannony@umich.edu>

Hi Katrina,

I believe so.  A student may only be counted one time even though he/she is
enrolled in separate distance and classroom-based classes.  Larry, would you
confirm that this is the case?

Thanks, Shannon
-- 
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org

On 7/16/07 9:06 PM, "Katrina Hinson" <KHinson at almanid.com> wrote:

> Ok, How does this work if say for instance, a student is enrolled in a
> physical class that runs from 8-12 and then is enrolled in a distance learning
> class for time outside the 8-12 boundary or for day he/she is absent.  They
> are only counted once even though that is two separate classes, rosters and
> contracts?
> 
> Regards,
> Katrina
> 

From shannony at umich.edu  Thu Jul 19 09:50:24 2007
From: shannony at umich.edu (Shannon Young)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 09:50:24 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 881] Re: Questions for discussion
In-Reply-To: <001601c7ca01$934f8a30$e884c848@DH89L251>
Message-ID: <C2C4E460.1A160%shannony@umich.edu>

Donna,
The new guidelines document Donna Cornellier mentioned is posted on the NRS
website in the second bullet in What?s New on the home page:  www.nrsweb.org
I didn?t see the memo from Cheryl Kenan.  Shannon

On 7/19/07 8:37 AM, "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net> wrote:

> Donna,
>  
> I saw this on the Listserv, but didn't see the attachment that you sent out to
> State Directors. I would appreciate if you would send me the attachment.
> Thanks. Donna Chambers
>>  
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>  
>> From:  Cornellier, Donna <mailto:dcornellier at doe.mass.edu>
>>  
>> To: The Assessment Discussion List <mailto:assessment at nifl.gov>
>>  
>> Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2007 4:08  PM
>>  
>> Subject: [Assessment 848] Re: Questions  for discussion
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> Hi Marie,
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> I've attached the new NRS Guidelines for Distance  Learning that were sent
>> out to State Directors on June 6, 2007 with a  memo from Cheryl Keenan.  The
>> distance education policy includes a  definition of distance learners,
>> guidance on how to measure contact hours for  the learners, and describes
>> assessment and reporting requirements which  are summarized in the memo.  It
>> will be an interesting discussion around  how states implement these
>> policies, and you have posed some great questions  below.
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> Thanks,
>>  
>> Donna Cornellier
>>  
>> Massachusetts NRS Trainer

-- 
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org

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From LCondelli at air.org  Thu Jul 19 10:43:47 2007
From: LCondelli at air.org (Condelli, Larry)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 10:43:47 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 882] Re: NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning Assessment
References: <C2C4E0AA.1A15D%shannony@umich.edu>
Message-ID: <E9590ED2EF3FB24390F8D057513655B2676E65@dc1ex03.air.org>

Hi Shannon and Katrina,
 
NRS requires a non-duplicated count of students.  So the state has to have a policy on how to classify them (DL or not) for reporting.  It's just the same as if a student took two separate classes at the same time -- they are only counted once in NRS.  
 
Of course you may have other procedures for local contracts, management, scheduling, etc., according to state/local policy.  Again, it's the same as if a student took multiple classes at the same time.

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of Shannon Young
Sent: Thu 7/19/2007 9:34 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 880] Re: NRS Guidelines for Distance Learning Assessment

Hi Katrina,

I believe so.  A student may only be counted one time even though he/she is
enrolled in separate distance and classroom-based classes.  Larry, would you
confirm that this is the case?

Thanks, Shannon
--
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
   
5116 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 615-6638
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org <http://projectideal.org/>       http://www.adultedonline.org <http://www.adultedonline.org/> 

On 7/16/07 9:06 PM, "Katrina Hinson" <KHinson at almanid.com> wrote:

> Ok, How does this work if say for instance, a student is enrolled in a
> physical class that runs from 8-12 and then is enrolled in a distance learning
> class for time outside the 8-12 boundary or for day he/she is absent.  They
> are only counted once even though that is two separate classes, rosters and
> contracts?
>
> Regards,
> Katrina
>

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to lcondelli at air.org

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From lchenven at 1199funds.org  Thu Jul 19 10:41:52 2007
From: lchenven at 1199funds.org (Laura Chenven)
Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2007 10:41:52 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 883] Re: Model programs sought for
	performanceaccountability initiative
In-Reply-To: <221E918332E818488687199E5CBD74CE065CAC6B@keats.proliteracy.org>
References: <221E918332E818488687199E5CBD74CE065CAC6B@keats.proliteracy.org>
Message-ID: <AD114AC462004246B6C08FF2E4E7A6C203DBDB3B@1199mail.1199etjsp.org>

Wow - I wish I had know about this before - guess I should have joined
this listserv sooner - When will the next opportunity be available for
applications.
Laura Chenven 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of mdaniels
Sent: Wednesday, July 18, 2007 12:59 PM
To: 'assessment at nifl.gov'
Subject: [Assessment 878] Model programs sought for
performanceaccountability initiative

WANTED: Model Programs for Performance Accountability Initiative
DEADLINE!  5:00 PM EDT July 20, 2007 

Join ProLiteracy America and the Dollar General Literacy Foundation in
the three-year Dollar General/ProLiteracy Performance Accountability
Initiative.

Be one of eight model programs selected (in each year of the three
years) to help identify promising practices in adult education and
literacy program accountability. Your expertise and resources will be
used to design training sessions that will help other programs improve
their  performance accountability.

If your program can demonstrate success in the area of "Data Analysis
for Program Decision-Making," ProLiteracy wants to hear from you! If you
are selected, your program receives a small stipend, increased
visibility, and the chance to impact others in the literacy and adult
education field.

Act NOW -- the deadline for accepting nominations is 5:00 PM EDT on
Friday, July 20, 2007. 

Apply online at http://www.proliteracy.org/external/dg_pai.asp. Share
this information with other programs you think would be a great
resource. 

Thanks for your help in this important project (and your response by
July
20!) 

Direct your questions to Melanie Daniels, project manager, via e-mail at
mdaniels at proliteracy.org.
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to lchenven at 1199funds.org

?Please note that the email address for the person you are corresponding with has changed.  The new address is listed above.  Please use this new address in all future correspondence.  Thank you?

Health care information is personal and sensitive information. If such information is being emailed to you, it is after appropriate authorization from the patient or under circumstances that do not require patient authorization. You, the recipient, are obligated to maintain it in a safe, secure and confidential manner. Re-disclosure without additional patient consent or as permitted by law is prohibited. Unauthorized re-disclosure or failure to maintain confidentiality could subject you to penalties described in federal and state law. If you have received this message in error, please notify us immediately and destroy the related message.

From wfagan at mun.ca  Sun Jul 22 18:56:06 2007
From: wfagan at mun.ca (Will Fagan)
Date: Sun, 22 Jul 2007 20:26:06 -0230
Subject: [Assessment 884]  GED Discussion Group
In-Reply-To: <108a01c7c7e2$97c3db00$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <108a01c7c7e2$97c3db00$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <77D68C0C-9EE1-4BDE-B77F-7FD8A316DAE2@mun.ca>

Hi:
I recall reading about a discussion group on the GED - can't recall  
if it is past or coming up? Can you help?
Many thanks!
Bill Fagan

On 16-Jul-07, at 5:20 PM, Marie Cora wrote:

> Colleagues:
>
>
>
> The following message is from Cheryl Keenan.
>
>
>
> ********************************************************************** 
> ****************
>
> I would like to take this opportunity to announce the redesign of  
> the Adult Education Content Standards Warehouse Website, which  
> provides materials to support the planning, development, alignment,  
> and implementation of content standards for adult education.  We  
> have revised the site to be more user-friendly and accessible to  
> the viewer, based on input from the field and a usability  
> evaluation.  Please visit the revised site at <http:// 
> www.adultedcontentstandards.ed.gov>, which I encourage you to  
> bookmark for future reference.
>
> On this site, you can find content standards from a variety of  
> states and organizations in the areas of English language  
> acquisition, reading, and mathematics; relevant national and  
> international standards; professional development materials for  
> standards-based education reform; and A Process Guide for  
> Developing Adult Education Content Standards.
>
> The American Institutes for Research (AIR) operates the Adult  
> Education Content Standards Warehouse Website through a contract  
> with the Office of Vocational and Adult Education, US Department of  
> Education.
>
> Cheryl Keenan
> Director, Division of Adult Education and Literacy
> Office of Vocational and Adult Education
> U.S. Department of Education
> 550 12th Street, SW
> Washington, DC 20202-7240
> Cheryl.Keenan at ed.gov
> (202) 245-7721
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to wfagan at mun.ca

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From djgbrian at utk.edu  Mon Jul 23 10:13:09 2007
From: djgbrian at utk.edu (Brian, Dr Donna J G)
Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2007 10:13:09 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 885] Re: GED Discussion Group
In-Reply-To: <77D68C0C-9EE1-4BDE-B77F-7FD8A316DAE2@mun.ca>
Message-ID: <DF8ADDAFC4D62C46898FACD5429F5BF5A4FD47@KFSVS1.utk.tennessee.edu>

Bill,
Here's a copy of the original post announcing the discussion.  As you
can see, it starts today on the special topics list.
Donna Brian
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Colleagues,

On July 23rd, on the National Institute for Literacy Special Topics
list, we will begin discussing the General Educational Development

(GED) diploma outcomes research of Dr. John Tyler. Dr. Tyler is
Associate Professor of Education, Economics, and Public Policy at Brown
University in Providence, Rhode Island. An applied microeconomist, his
research focuses on what is happening to low- skilled individuals in
today's high-skill economy. He is regarded as one of the nation's
experts on the economic returns to the General Educational Development
(GED) certificate. Dr. Tyler's interests also include school reform
issues, program evaluation, and quantitative research methods.

Dr. Tyler will take our questions from the week's discussion, will
respond to them the following Monday, and will continue to respond to
follow-up questions throughout the week of July 30th.

You or your colleagues who may wish to join this discussion can
subscribe by going to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics
<http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics> 

After you complete the simple registration form (30 seconds) you will 

receive an email asking you to confirm that you wish to subscribe. 

Immediately reply to the email to complete your subscription. After the
discussion ends you can unsubscribe from the same Web address, or stay
on for the next discussion.

To prepare for this discussion please look at a 30-minute video
discussion with John Tyler; teacher, Sara Fass; and professional
development coordinator, Sue Snider. The video panel discussion focuses
on the economic benefits that accrue to holders of the GED credential.
It was based on a review by John Tyler of eight (published and working)
research papers on the GED. Several of these papers were authored by
John Tyler, Richard Murnane, and John Willett, researchers with the
National Center for the Study of Adult Learning and Literacy (NCSALL)
whose work has influenced what we know about the economic benefits of
the GED.

http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/ged/webcast_ged.html
<http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/ged/webcast_ged.html> 

The following readings, mentioned in the video panel discussion, would
also be useful preparation for this discussion:

NCSALL GED Research Briefs

http://www.ncsall.net/?id=27 <http://www.ncsall.net/?id=27> 

Seven briefs by John Tyler are linked on this page, among which are:

"The Economic Benefits of the GED: A Research Synthesis", "So You Want a
GED? Estimating the Impact of the GED on the Earnings of Dropouts Who
Seek the Credential", "Who Benefits from Obtaining a GED? Evidence from
High School and Beyond", and "Estimating the Labor Market Signaling
Value of the GED"

Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices About the GED and Your Future
http://www.ncsall.net/fileadmins/resources/teach/beyond_ged.pdf
<http://www.ncsall.net/fileadmins/resources/teach/beyond_ged.pdf> 

The following additional GED research articles by John Tyler will be
found in .pdf on his Web page at
http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Education/personnel.php
<http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Education/personnel.php> ? 

who=jhtyler#pubs

2005 - "Is the GED an Effective Route to Postsecondary Education?"

2004 - "Does the GED Improve Earnings? Estimates from a Sample of Both
Successful and Unsuccessful GED Candidates?" Industrial and Labor
Relations Review 57:4 (2004), 579-98.

2004 - "The Devil's in the Details: Evidence from the GED on the Large
Effects of Small Differences in High Stakes Exams ". Economics of
Education Review 23:4 (2004), 336-49. With Richard J. Murnane and John
B. Willett.

GED teachers, especially, will find the following publication of GED
outcomes data -- intended to be used by GED teachers and their students
-- of special interest. It was written by Sara Fass and Barbara Garner
in 2000, and updated by Eileen Barry in 2006.

"Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices About the GED and Your Future"

http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1099 <http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1099> 

I look forward to having you join us in this discussion.

David J. Rosen

Special Topics Discussion Moderator

djrosen at comcast.net

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Will Fagan
Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2007 6:56 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 884] GED Discussion Group

Hi: 
I recall reading about a discussion group on the GED - can't recall if
it is past or coming up? Can you help?
Many thanks!
Bill Fagan

 
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From djrosen at comcast.net  Mon Jul 23 10:21:21 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2007 10:21:21 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 886] Re: GED Discussion Group
In-Reply-To: <77D68C0C-9EE1-4BDE-B77F-7FD8A316DAE2@mun.ca>
References: <108a01c7c7e2$97c3db00$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
	<77D68C0C-9EE1-4BDE-B77F-7FD8A316DAE2@mun.ca>
Message-ID: <C0E08F54-6AF3-475E-8B7B-88418478AF2A@comcast.net>

Assessment Colleagues,

On Jul 22, 2007, at 6:56 PM, Will Fagan wrote:

> I recall reading about a discussion group on the GED - can't recall  
> if it is past or coming up? Can you help?
> Many thanks!

Today, Monday, July 23rd, on  the National Institute for Literacy  
Special Topics discussion list, we will begin discussing the General  
Educational Development (GED) diploma outcomes research of John  
Tyler. The process for the discussion is as follows:

Now: Prepare for the discussion by looking at and/or reading the  
preparation materials described below
Monday, July 23rd -Thursday, July 26th: Post your questions to the  
discussion list
Friday, July 27th: I will organize and send your questions to Joh Tyler
Monday, July 30th - Friday, August 3rd: Dr. Tyler will reply to your  
questions and reply to your follow-up questions and comments.

This process depends on your preparation and your questions, so I  
hope you will take the time now to watch the video, read the articles  
and fire off questions to specialtopics at nifl.gov

Guest Biography

Dr. Tyler is Associate Professor of Education, Economics, and Public  
Policy, and Education Department Chair at Brown University, in  
Providence, Rhode Island. Dr. Tyler will take our questions from the  
week's discussion, will respond to them the following Monday, July  
30, and will continue to respond to follow-up questions throughout  
the week of July 30th.

Discussion Preparation

To prepare for this discussion you can view a 30-minute video  
discussion with John Tyler; teacher, Sara Fass; and professional  
development coordinator, Sue Snider.  The video panel discussion  
focuses on the economic benefits that accrue to holders of the GED  
credential. It was based on a review by John Tyler of eight  
(published and working) research papers on the GED. Several of these  
papers were authored by John Tyler, Richard Murnane, and John  
Willett, researchers with the National Center for the Study of Adult  
Learning and Literacy (NCSALL) whose work has influenced what we know  
about the economic benefits of the GED.

The following readings, mentioned in the video panel discussion,  
would be useful preparation for this discussion:

NCSALL GED Research Briefs
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=27
Seven briefs by John Tyler are linked on this page, among which are:
"The Economic Benefits of the GED: A Research Synthesis", "So You  
Want a GED? Estimating the Impact of the GED on the Earnings of  
Dropouts Who Seek the Credential", "Who Benefits from Obtaining a  
GED? Evidence from High School and Beyond", and "Estimating the Labor  
Market Signaling Value of the GED"

Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices About the GED and Your Future
http://www.ncsall.net/fileadmins/resources/teach/beyond_ged.pdf

GED teachers, especially, will find the following publication of GED  
outcomes data -- for GED students -- of special interest. It was  
written by Sarah Fass and Barbara Garner, April 2000, and updated by  
Eileen Barry, 2006.
Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices About the GED and Your Future
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1099

Helping Others to Subscribe

Please send this subscription information to your colleagues who may  
wish to join this discussion:

One can subscribe by going to

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics

After completing the simple registration form (30 seconds) you will  
receive an email asking you to confirm that you wish to subscribe.   
Immediately reply to the email message to complete your subscription.  
After the discussion ends you can unsubscribe from the same Web  
address, or stay on for the next discussion.

David J. Rosen
Special Topics Discussion Moderator
djrosen at comcast.net

From alcdgg at langate.gsu.edu  Mon Jul 23 10:24:14 2007
From: alcdgg at langate.gsu.edu (Daphne Greenberg)
Date: Mon, 23 Jul 2007 10:24:14 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 887] Re: GED Discussion Group
Message-ID: <46A481CE020000310002B489@mailsrv4.gsu.edu>

Here is a copy of a message that David Rosen, the facilitator of the
Special Topics Discussion List sent:
Colleagues,

On July 23rd, on the National Institute for Literacy Special Topics
list, we will begin discussing the General Educational Development

(GED) diploma outcomes research of Dr. John Tyler. Dr. Tyler is
Associate Professor of Education, Economics, and Public Policy at Brown
University in Providence, Rhode Island. An applied microeconomist, his
research focuses on what is happening to low- skilled individuals in
today's high-skill economy. He is regarded as one of the nation's
experts on the economic returns to the General Educational Development
(GED) certificate. Dr. Tyler's interests also include school reform
issues, program evaluation, and quantitative research methods.

Dr. Tyler will take our questions from the week's discussion, will
respond to them the following Monday, and will continue to respond to
follow-up questions throughout the week of July 30th.

You or your colleagues who may wish to join this discussion can
subscribe by going to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics

After you complete the simple registration form (30 seconds) you will

receive an email asking you to confirm that you wish to subscribe.

Immediately reply to the email to complete your subscription. After the
discussion ends you can unsubscribe from the same Web address, or stay
on for the next discussion.

To prepare for this discussion please look at a 30-minute video
discussion with John Tyler; teacher, Sara Fass; and professional
development coordinator, Sue Snider. The video panel discussion focuses
on the economic benefits that accrue to holders of the GED credential.
It was based on a review by John Tyler of eight (published and working)
research papers on the GED. Several of these papers were authored by
John Tyler, Richard Murnane, and John Willett, researchers with the
National Center for the Study of Adult Learning and Literacy (NCSALL)
whose work has influenced what we know about the economic benefits of
the GED.

http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/ged/webcast_ged.html

The following readings, mentioned in the video panel discussion, would
also be useful preparation for this discussion:

NCSALL GED Research Briefs

http://www.ncsall.net/?id=27

Seven briefs by John Tyler are linked on this page, among which are:

"The Economic Benefits of the GED: A Research Synthesis", "So You Want a
GED? Estimating the Impact of the GED on the Earnings of Dropouts Who
Seek the Credential", "Who Benefits from Obtaining a GED? Evidence from
High School and Beyond", and "Estimating the Labor Market Signaling
Value of the GED"

Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices About the GED and Your Future
http://www.ncsall.net/fileadmins/resources/teach/beyond_ged.pdf

The following additional GED research articles by John Tyler will be
found in .pdf on his Web page at
http://www.brown.edu/Departments/Education/personnel.php?

who=jhtyler#pubs

2005 - "Is the GED an Effective Route to Postsecondary Education?"

2004 - "Does the GED Improve Earnings? Estimates from a Sample of Both
Successful and Unsuccessful GED Candidates?" Industrial and Labor
Relations Review 57:4 (2004), 579-98.

2004 - "The Devil?s in the Details: Evidence from the GED on the Large
Effects of Small Differences in High Stakes Exams ". Economics of
Education Review 23:4 (2004), 336-49. With Richard J. Murnane and John
B. Willett.

GED teachers, especially, will find the following publication of GED
outcomes data -- intended to be used by GED teachers and their students
-- of special interest. It was written by Sara Fass and Barbara Garner
in 2000, and updated by Eileen Barry in 2006.

"Beyond the GED: Making Conscious Choices About the GED and Your Future"

http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1099

I look forward to having you join us in this discussion.

David J. Rosen

Special Topics Discussion Moderator

dj
rosen at comcast.net

>>> Will Fagan <wfagan at mun.ca> 07/22/if it is past or coming up? Can you help?
Many thanks!
Bill Fagan

On 16-Jul-07, at 5:20 PM, Marie Cora wrote:

> Colleagues:
>
>
>
> The following message is from Cheryl Keenan.
>
>
>
> **********************************************************************

> ****************
>
> I would like to take this opportunity to announce the redesign of  
> the Adult Education Content Standards Warehouse Website, which  
> provides materials to support the planning, development, alignment,  
> and implementation of content standards for adult education.  We  
> have revised the site to be more user-friendly and accessible to  
> the viewer, based on input from the field and a usability  
> evaluation.  Please visit the revised site at <http:// 
> www.adultedcontentstandards.ed.gov>, which I encourage you to  
> bookmark for future reference.
>
> On this site, you can find content standards from a variety of  
> states and organizations in the areas of English language  
> acquisition, reading, and mathematics; relevant national and  
> international standards; professional development materials for  
> standards-based education reform; and A Process Guide for  
> Developing Adult Education Content Standards.
>
> The American Institutes for Research (AIR) operates the Adult  
> Education Content Standards Warehouse Website through a contract  
> with the Office of Vocational and Adult Education, US Department of  
> Education.
>
> Cheryl Keenan
> Director, Division of Adult Education and Literacy
> Office of Vocational and Adult Education
> U.S. Department of Education
> 550 12th Street, SW
> Washington, DC 20202-7240
> Cheryl.Keenan at ed.gov
> (202) 245-7721
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to wfagan at mun.ca

From kbeall at onlyinternet.net  Thu Jul 26 13:20:08 2007
From: kbeall at onlyinternet.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Thu, 26 Jul 2007 13:20:08 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 888] Registration is open! - Effective Transition in
	Adult Education conference on Nov 8-9, 2007
Message-ID: <007401c7cfa9$3750bfd0$0302a8c0@your4105e587b6>

Dear Colleagues, 

We wish to invite you to join us for the National Conference on Effective
Transitions in Adult Education that will take place on November 8-9, 2007 at
the Crowne Plaza Hotel in Providence, RI.  The two-day conference will focus
on strategies and promising practices that help adult learners succeed in
postsecondary education and training. 

The registration for the conference in now open!
LINK: http://collegetransition.org/conference/registration.html

Our keynote speaker, Dr. JoAnn Crandall, will kick off the event with a
discussion of transition for English language learners.  

For more conference details, 
SEE  http://www.collegetransition.org/novconference.html

Cynthia Zafft, Director

Priyanka Sharma, Coordinator
National College Transition Network

World Education, Inc.
44 Farnsworth Street
Boston, MA 02210
617.482.9485 
nctn at worlded.org

www.collegetransition.org <http://www.collegetransition.org/> 

www.collegeforadults.org

 

 

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From kbeall at onlyinternet.net  Mon Jul 30 12:55:06 2007
From: kbeall at onlyinternet.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2007 12:55:06 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 889]  New from NCSALL
Message-ID: <005701c7d2ca$65732460$0302a8c0@your4105e587b6>

We'd like to share two, new resources from the National Center for the Study
of Adult Learning and Literacy (NCSALL). The materials can be downloaded
free from the NCSALL website at www.ncsall.net <http://www.ncsall.net/> . 

Skills for Disease Prevention <http://www.ncsall.net/?id=769#prevention>
and Screening
By Rima E. Rudd, Lisa Soricone, and Jennie Maricel Santos
The goal of this 15-hour study circle+ is to prepare participants to help
their students develop basic skills needed for engaging in disease
prevention and screening activities. These skills include decision-making,
using graphs and charts, calculating percentages, and interpreting risks and
probability. 

For more information and to download, go to:
www.ncsall.net/?id=769#prevention 

 

Evidence-based Practice: A <http://www.ncsall.net/?id769#ebp_train>
Workshop for Training Adult Basic Education, TANF and One Stop Practitioners
and Program Administrators (May 2007)
By Cristine Smith, Beth Bingman, Lennox McLendon, and John Comings
The National Center for the Study of Adult Learning and Literacy (NCSALL)
and the National Adult Education Professional Development Consortium
(NAEPDC), with funding from the National Institute for Literacy (Institute),
created a one-day workshop to assist practitioners and administrators in
adult basic education, TANF (Transitional Assistance for Needy Families) and
One Stop programs to understand evidence-based practice and develop
strategies for continuously accessing, understanding, judging and using
research.

For more information and to download, go to:
www.ncsall.net/?id=769#ebp_train 

 

Kaye

****************

Kaye Beall

World Education

6760 West Street

Linn Grove, IN 46711

Tel: 765-717-3942

Fax: 617-482-0617

kaye_beall at worlded.org

http://www.worlded.org

 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Jul 31 13:23:45 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2007 13:23:45 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 890]  Assessment in DL discussion archived!
Message-ID: <063801c7d397$8dc1a8b0$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Dear Colleagues,
 
I have prepared our discussion from the other week in user-friendly
format and it is now archived at:
 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance.html
At the top in blue you will see 4 different sections to the document:
Discussion
<http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance.html
#announce>  Announcement | Guest
<http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance.html
#guests>  Participants | Recommended
<http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance.html
#prep>  preparations | 
Full
<http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07assess_distance_disc
ussion.html>  Discussion
Click on the section that you want to read.
 
Did you also know that you can see/read past discussions from any of the
11 Discussion Lists?  You can also get info on upcoming discussions as
well.  Go to the main Discussions Page at
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/discussions.html
 
In the right-hand toolbar, click on List Events.  You see a listing of
Upcoming Events on the Lists, and below that, you see Previous 2007
Events.  Click on any of the Previous 2007 Events to read that
discussion.  
 
Thanks!

Marie Cora
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Aug  1 14:52:15 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 1 Aug 2007 14:52:15 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 891]  Job Opportunity
Message-ID: <076c01c7d46d$14b860e0$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

The following post is from Emily Ellison.

-----

Job Opportunity
Literacy Action, Inc.
Atlanta, GA

JOB DESCRIPTION

Job Title:	Director of Education 
Reports To:	Executive Director
Supervises:	Instructional Staff and Program Coordinators
Employment Status:	 Regular full-time

Summary:	The Education Director is an essential member of the
agency's Leadership Team whose main focus is on curriculum and
instructional and programmatic operations, including assessment,
evaluation, and accountability.

Duties and Responsibilities:

*	Serve as Educational Leader of the organization
*	Oversee the implementation of a cohesive, coordinated and
articulated core curriculum that incorporates state and national
standards and latest research and best practices in the field of adult
education
*	Assist in operationalizing the Strategic Goals of the agency as
articulated by the Board of Trustees and Executive Director into
educational programs that reflect and communicate the Mission and Values
of Literacy Action
*	Manage the instructional staff and daily operation of
educational programs at Literacy Action 
*	Identify new education programs and services 
*	Assess operations, coordinate and evaluate in-service and
professional development activities for all instructional staff
regularly
*	Convene regular meetings of instructors and programmatic staff
to share best practices, increase communication and teamwork, and ensure
quality services; attend Leadership Team meetings; attend Board meetings
as required
*	Conduct quarterly and annual job assessments of all
instructional staff
*	Assist in the development of program funding proposals and
reports by providing accurate and timely data including:
documenting student and program outcomes monthly, quarterly, and
annually;
evaluating educational services monthly, quarterly, and annually using a
variety of methodologies including student surveys, regular pre and post
testing, and other teacher created assessment instruments
*	Work collaboratively with the Executive Director, Director of
Development, and Director of Finance and Administration to monitor
outcome and costs of programs and service delivery
*	Function as a productive and collaborative member of the
Literacy Action staff, helping to build a team spirit and contributing
to a positive work environment and a culture of lifelong learning
*	Other duties as assigned by the Executive Director

Qualifications:  The candidate must have excellent oral and written
communication skills; strong organizational and leadership skills are
required, as well as an ability to work with a wide variety of people.
Experience required in supervision, program evaluation.  Experience in
curriculum development preferred.  Experience in and respect for adult
literacy, low income, and multicultural populations.  Masters degree in
Education or related field preferred, with experience in adult education
with educational leadership.  It is essential that the person filling
this position has kept up with latest research and best practices in the
field of adult basic education, is a passionate advocate for adult
literacy, and has exceptional interpersonal skills.  

All interested and qualified applicants should send a cover letter, or
statement of philosophy, and their resume to:  Emily Ellison at
emellison at literacyaction.org

Emily 
 
Emily Ellison
Executive Director
Literacy Action, Inc.
101 Marietta Street, Suite 200
Atlanta, GA   30303
404.818.READ
 
SAVE the DATE!!
Please join us on Saturday, September 29, at 8:00 PM for a private stage
performance of TO KILL A MOCKINGBIRD staring Tom Key, at Theatrical
Outfit's Balzer Theatre.  All proceeds from this unique fundraising
event will enable Literacy Action to continue providing quality
instruction to adults who want to break the intergeneration cycle of
functional illiteracy.  Call 404-818-7326 for details.  
Please help us Rewrite Futures.  
 
 

From nmuller at nafc.org  Tue Aug  7 16:59:10 2007
From: nmuller at nafc.org (Nancy Muller)
Date: Tue, 7 Aug 2007 16:59:10 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 892]  Assessment of Literacy
Message-ID: <00d101c7d935$cdc67d20$6801a8c0@NAFC.local>

Which web site addresses do you recommend that I visit so that I can have
the literacy level of our newly designed web site assessed on line?
 
Thanks!
Nancy Muller
 

Executive Director

National Association For Continence (NAFC)

PO Box 1019 Charleston, SC 29402 USA

Email:  nmuller at nafc.org

Telephone: 843.377.0900 extension 207

Facsimile: 843.377.0905

Web Address:  www.nafc.org

 

 
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From tsticht at znet.com  Fri Aug 10 14:15:32 2007
From: tsticht at znet.com (tsticht at znet.com)
Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2007 11:15:32 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 893]  Message for International Literacy Day
Message-ID: <1186769732.46bcab4482deb@webmail.znet.net>

A Message for International Literacy Day 2007

UNESCO Recognition for Industrialized Nations:
>From Fighting Pockets of Illiteracy to Raising Levels of Literacy

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

During 2007 I am presenting a series of workshops entitled Adult Literacy
Education in Industrialized Nations. Earlier, I worked for 25 years
(1979-2003) as a volunteer member of UNESCO's International Literacy Prize
Jury. This Jury recommends to the Director General of UNESCO the winners of
UNESCO's literacy awards each year on September 8, International Literacy
Day.

For most of the time that UNESCO has awarded literacy recognition the
discourse was about "illiteracy" and most attention was, and still is,
focussed on developing nations with large percentages of illiterate adults
(age 15 and above). There were times, however, when recognition was given
to industrialized nations where it was generally said that illiteracy was
not a major problem but there were "pockets of illiteracy." This usually
referred to socially marginalized groups of indigenous persons, immigrants,
poverty stricken, incarcerated, and the like.

Over time, the discourse of literacy has varied and has included
"illiteracy," "functionally illiterate," "functionally literate," "literacy
levels," and "multiple literacies." This listing moves from thinking about
"illiteracy" as being almost totally unable to read and write, to thinking
about literacy as a continuum from illiteracy through gradients of literacy
from low to higher levels and to the idea of "multiple literacies" meaning
the ability to use a variety of symbolic communication media (e.g, the
internet) and graphic technologies such as maps, graphs, and the like.

UNESCO may provide three types of recognition on International Literacy Day:
Major Prizes with monetary awards, Honorable Mentions, and Recognition in
the Palmares, the official document that proclaims the winners of each
year's recognition. Of the six industrialized nations that are discussed in
my workshop, five have received multiple recognition primarily before the
shift in discourse in talking about "illiteracy" to "levels of literacy" or
"multiple literacies." This UNESCO recognition has helped each of these five
nations keep the need for literacy education in their nation in the
awareness of policymakers and has provided a foundation for major
activities that are underway to advance levels of literacy in these nations
today.

On September 8th of this year we should continue to press for international
attention to the plight of hundreds of millions of illiterate adults around
the world. But we should also recognize the need in all nations, both
developing and developed, to raise the levels of literacy of thousands of
millions of adults and promote the multiple literacies of adults who are at
risk of losing such advances as they have made in their lives and the lives
of their families in the face of a rapidly changing world.

As a member of UNESCO's International Literacy Jury  I was honored to
participate in recognizing the work of nations that are part of my workshop
on Adult Literacy in Industrialized Nations. Today I am pleased to once
again recognize the outstanding adult literacy work that these nations have
performed in the past, and to call attention to the continuing efforts of
these and other industrialized nations which are today locked in a struggle
to enhance the lives of millions of adults and their families through
policies and practices aimed at improving literacy.

Celebrate Adult Literacy Education on September 8th!

UNESCO recognition of my workshop industrialized nations:

1. Australia
1969 HM Summer Institute of Education
1984 R Mr. Archibald Alexander Nelson
1989 R Workplace Education Project
1991 R News on Wheels

2. Canada
1977 HM Frontier College, Basic Education of the Canadian Frontier
1985 HM Canadian Organization for Development Through Education (CODE)
1988 HM Southam Incorporated
1995 Major Prize Community Academic Services Program (CASP), New Brunswick
2002 HM National Adult Literacy Database

3. New Zealand
1988 HM Mr. Michael Marquet
1995 HM Waitakera WEA Adult Literacy
1997 R National Association of ESOL Home Tutor Scheme
2000 HM Literacy Aotearoa, Inc.
2001 Major Prize Workbase, the National Center for Workplace Literacy &
Language

4. United Kingdom
1981 HM "On the Move" Project of the British Broadcasting Corp.
1984 HM Adult Literacy and Basic Skills Unit (ALBSU)
1999 Major Prize Family Literacy Programme, Basic Skills Agency

5. United States
1968 HM International Reading Association
1971 HM National Affiliation for Literacy Advance
1972 HM Appalachian Adult Education Center
1978 HM Dr.Welthy Honziger Fisher
1980 R Mrs. Ruth Johnson Colvin
1981 R Laubach Literacy International
1992 R Beginning With Books Literacy Program
2007 Major Prize Reach out and Read

Legend: HM-Honorable Mention; R-Recognition in the Palmares

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From MMaralit at NIFL.gov  Mon Aug 13 09:44:30 2007
From: MMaralit at NIFL.gov (Maralit, Mary Jo)
Date: Mon, 13 Aug 2007 09:44:30 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 894] Aug. 29 Webcast: Health Literacy of America's
	Adults
Message-ID: <4062487BDB6029428A763CAEF4E1FE5B180C47BD@wdcrobe2m03.ed.gov>

SAVE THE DATE for a LIVE webcast!

Health Literacy of America's Adults: 
Results from the 2003 National Assessment of Adult Literacy 

WHEN:	August 29, 2007
		1:30 PM - 3:00 PM Eastern Time
		12:30 PM - 2:00 PM Central Time 
		11:30 AM - 1:00 PM Mountain Time 
		10:30 AM - 12:00 AM Pacific Time 

** Registration information will be shared in a future posting, but for now,

SAVE THE DATE for a LIVE webcast on Wednesday, August 29! **

For more information about this webcast or The National Institute for
Literacy, 
go to: http://www.nifl.gov.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

The August 29 webcast will focus on the Health Literacy of America's Adults:
Results of the National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) 2003.  

The live webcast will feature:
*	Dr. Sheida White directs the National Assessment of Adult Literacy
at the National Center for Education Statistics (or NCES).  Her doctoral
degree is in linguistics from Georgetown University.  After working as a
full-time reading researcher for 6 years, she joined NCES in 1991.  During
the first 8 years at NCES, she monitored the National Assessment of
Education Progress (NAEP).  Since 1999, she has been directing the NAAL
project. Dr. White has taught non-native English speaking adults.  She
created a guided reading program to address the reading comprehension needs
of slow readers. Her articles have appeared in journals such as "Language in
Society" and "Reading Research Quarterly".

*	Other panelists: TBA.  The webcast will be moderated by Dr. Sandra
L. 
Baxter, Director of the National Institute for Literacy.

                     --------------------------

The National Institute for Literacy has hosted a number of web casts
presenting information, findings and results from the National Assessment of
Adult Literacy (NAAL), for more information on these webcast, please go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/NAAL2003.html.

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From MMaralit at NIFL.gov  Mon Aug 20 17:36:53 2007
From: MMaralit at NIFL.gov (Maralit, Mary Jo)
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2007 17:36:53 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 895] REGISTER for the August 29 Health Literacy Webcast
Message-ID: <4062487BDB6029428A763CAEF4E1FE5B15382DCC@wdcrobe2m03.ed.gov>

REGISTER for the August 29 Webcast: Health Literacy of America's Adults: 
Results from the 2003 National Assessment of Adult Literacy 

WHEN: August 29, 2007 
1:30 PM - 3:00 PM Eastern Time 
12:30 PM - 2:00 PM Central Time 
11:30 AM - 1:00 PM Mountain Time 
10:30 AM - 12:00 AM Pacific Time 

*To Register, go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/NAALhealth/webcast0829.html * 

Be sure to mark your calendar for Wednesday, August 29.  Once you have
registered, you will receive a confirmation email that gives you more
information on how to tune in for the webcast on August 29. (Please note,
you will need either Windows Media Player or Real Player to view the
webcast.  More instructions will be provided, once you have registered.)

For more information about this webcast or The National Institute for 
Literacy, go to: http://www.nifl.gov. 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

The August 29 webcast will focus on the Health Literacy of America's Adults:

Results of the National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) 2003. 

The live webcast will feature: 
* Dr. Sheida White directs the National Assessment of Adult Literacy 
at the National Center for Education Statistics (or NCES). Her doctoral 
degree is in linguistics from Georgetown University. After working as a 
full-time reading researcher for 6 years, she joined NCES in 1991. During 
the first 8 years at NCES, she monitored the National Assessment of 
Education Progress (NAEP). Since 1999, she has been directing the NAAL 
project. Dr. White has taught non-native English speaking adults. She 
created a guided reading program to address the reading comprehension needs 
of slow readers. Her articles have appeared in journals such as "Language in

Society" and "Reading Research Quarterly". 

* Other panelists: TBA. 
* The webcast will be moderated by Dr. Sandra 
L. Baxter, Director of the National Institute for Literacy. 

-------------------------- 

The National Institute for Literacy has hosted a number of web casts 
presenting information, findings and results from the National Assessment of

Adult Literacy (NAAL), for more information on these webcast, please go to: 
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/NAAL2003.html.

From kbeall at onlyinternet.net  Thu Aug 23 09:49:37 2007
From: kbeall at onlyinternet.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Thu, 23 Aug 2007 09:49:37 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 896] Survey on Professional Development Needs/National
	Institute for Literacy
Message-ID: <007a01c7e58c$72c713e0$020ba8c0@your4105e587b6>

 

 

Adult education teachers and administrators:  

Have you ever wished you could have some input into decisions that are being
made nationally on professional development opportunities?  If so, here is
your chance to express your opinion and share your thoughts.  

 

The National Institute for Literacy is conducting a survey on the
professional development needs of adult education practitioners across the
country.  We need your help to gather information that reflects your own
needs in the area of professional development as well as how you think
professional development should be offered.  We are asking for only 10-15
minutes of your time.  

 

 

Follow this link to take the survey at
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/needssurvey/.

 

 

Information collected from the professional development needs survey will be
used by the Institute and the LINCS Regional Resource Centers to (1) give us
insights on how Institute-produced materials and training can be
disseminated and (2) identify areas where the Institute might want to
develop additional materials and trainings. The Regional Resource Centers
will use the data to develop a regional dissemination plan that will include
how to best disseminate and present Institute-sponsored resources and
training in partnership with the state organizations.

 

The National Institute for Literacy, a federal agency, provides leadership
on literacy issues, including the improvement of reading instruction for
children, youth, and adults. In consultation with the U.S. Departments of
Education, Labor, and Health and Human Services, the Institute serves as a
national resource on current, comprehensive literacy research, practice, and
policy. 

 

The National Institute for Literacy is committed to the dissemination of
high-quality resources to help practitioners use evidence-based
instructional practices that improve outcomes in adult learners' literacy
skills. LINCS is the backbone of the Institute's dissemination system,
providing information on a wide variety of literacy relevant topics, issues,
and resources through regional resource centers, collections of resources,
and discussion lists.  For more information about the National Institute for
Literacy and LINCS visit http://www.nifl.gov <http://www.nifl.gov/> .  

 

 

NOTE: The valid OMB control number for this information collection is
1800-0011 v. 86.

 

 

National Institute for Literacy

Regional Resource Centers

 

Kaye Beall, Co-Director

Region 1 Resource Center

World Education, Inc./U.S. Division

kaye_beall at worlded.org

765.717.3942

 

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From MMaralit at NIFL.gov  Mon Aug 27 16:51:04 2007
From: MMaralit at NIFL.gov (Maralit, Mary Jo)
Date: Mon, 27 Aug 2007 16:51:04 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 897]  Reminder: Aug 29 Webcast:  Health Literacy
Message-ID: <4062487BDB6029428A763CAEF4E1FE5B180C4900@wdcrobe2m03.ed.gov>

Hello, All,

Just a final reminder about the Aug 29 webcast: Health Literacy of America's
Adults.

For more information and to register, go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/NAALhealth/webcast0829.html

Panelist include:

Dr. Sheida White, Project Director, National Assessment of Adult Literacy at
the National Center for Education.  Dr. White directs the National
Assessment of Adult Literacy at the National Center for Education Statistics
(or NCES). 

Dr. Ian Bennett is an Assistant Professor at School of Medicine and a
Research Associate at Graduate School of Education at the University of
Pennsylvania. 

Toni Cordell is an adult learner and recently served as an expert panel
member on the Joint Commission and nationally known speaker on the topic of
health literacy, who draws from her personal struggle with dyslexia. 

Please feel free to pass along to others who may be interested in viewing
this webcast.

Regards, 
Jo Maralit
mmaralit at nifl.gov

From pnaidu at kennesaw.edu  Tue Aug 28 13:20:48 2007
From: pnaidu at kennesaw.edu (Pinder  Naidu)
Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2007 13:20:48 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 897]  Reading math textbooks
Message-ID: <s6d4213a.080@greatowl.kennesaw.edu>

Hello All:
 
I am a PhD student in math education taking a adult education class and
have some questions for you. 
 
Does anyone on the list know of any work being done assessing adult
learners ability to read and comprehend math text books? 
 
I'd also like to know what effect this has on exam results? 
 
Does the ability to read interfere with success with numeracy? 
 
Thanks. Pinder Naidu (GSU student)
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From jataylor at utk.edu  Tue Aug 28 15:41:42 2007
From: jataylor at utk.edu (Taylor, Jackie)
Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2007 15:41:42 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 898] Upcoming Discussion: Project-Based Learning as
	Professional Development
Message-ID: <0913EC48F2B05C4FBE4878BAFCABBFECCF2048@KFSVS2.utk.tennessee.edu>

Dear Colleagues:

The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List is pleased
to host a guest discussion next week on Project-Based Learning as
Professional Development (http://tinyurl.com/2eum64). Please see below
for details.

 

 - Sound interesting? We're happy to have you join us! Visit:

 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Professionaldevelopment

 

Best wishes, Jackie Taylor

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

Title:   Project-Based Learning as Professional Development

Date:   September 4 - 11, 2007

Guest: Heide Spruck Wrigley, Senior Researcher, LiteracyWork
International

Resources for Discussion: http://tinyurl.com/2eum64 

To participate, subscribe:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Professionaldevelopment

To submit questions for discussion, email: jataylor at utk.edu 

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

 

I. Description:

Join the Adult Literacy Professional Development List to explore and
share innovative practices in Project-Based Learning (PBL) as
Professional Development. Guest participant Heide Spruck Wrigley will
share her experiences with successful professional development models
focused on PBL. A team of teachers who have facilitated student-projects
in their classes will actively participate, share their professional
development experiences, and offer practical advice on implementing
projects. We hope you will join us and share your work.

 

Discussion topics include:

*	Essential elements of project-based learning 
*	Exploring the value added of project-based learning in ESOL and
ABE 
*	Examples of successful professional development models focused
on project-based learning 
*	Myths and realities: Is project-based learning time well-spent? 
*	Evidence from research and practice 
*	Assessments in project-based learning and student performance 
*	How to get started in project-based learning 

 

This discussion introduces the PD List's Topic-of-the-Month: Keys to
Communities of Practice.

 

 

II. Guest Discussion Biography

 

Heide Spruck Wrigley has been involved in all aspects of adult literacy,
including family literacy, workplace literacy, adult ESL, EL civic and
transition to higher education. Her work focuses on the intersection of
policy, research, professional development, and classroom practice. She
is currently a (non-resident) fellow with the Migration Policy
Institute, a non-partisan Think Tank in Washington, D.C.  and is
finishing up a research and materials development project for
Youth-at-Risk outside of Vancouver, British Columbia. 

 

Her staff development work around project-based learning includes a 3
year consultancy with Project IDEA, a Texas state wide Master Teacher
project focused on PBL and a five year ongoing professional development
project with teachers in Socorro, Texas. Her PBL work includes an
emphasis on putting low and high end technology in the hands of learners
(tape recorders, PowerPoint, digital cameras, video cameras) and
creating learner showcases for the demonstration of these projects to a
wider community of parents, teachers, and learners. 

 

Heide has been key in a number of U.S. national research studies focused
on ESL literacy, but she has also been involved with ABE programs, youth
literacy programs and with the Adult Literacy Media Alliance (TV 411).
Her international work includes evaluations of teacher training programs
in Poland and in Egypt, staff development in China, and presentations in
Canada, Ireland, New Zealand and in the UK.  When she's home, Heide
lives in Mesilla, a small town in Southern New Mexico, an hour from the
US Mexico border.

 

 

III. Preparation for Discussion

 

Project-Based Learning and Professional Development

Practical Ideas

Research to Practice

(a) ; (d)

(c); (f); (e)

(a); (b); (g); (h)

 

 

 

 

 

 

(a)     Research in Action: Teachers, Projects, and Technology

http://www-tcall.tamu.edu/newsletr/june04/june04a.htm

-- Project-Based Learning and Professional Development

 

(b)     Knowledge in Action: The Promise of Project-Based Learning

http://www.ncsall.net/?id=384

Focus on Basics, v.2 Issue D

-- From Research to Practice

 

(c)     Border Program Develops Model for State 

Socorro Independent School District implements three-year demonstration
project 

www.bordercivics.org <http://www.bordercivics.org/> 

-- Examples of lesson plans and projects from Socorro, TX

 

(d)     From Low-Tech to High-Tech: Promising Practices in Integrating
New Media into Adult Literacy and ESL

http://www.literacynewyork.org/publications/LNYPract_June04.pdf

-- Examples of Projects that Integrate Technology  

 

(e)     Teachers Writing about Their Experience with PBL

 

Project-Based Learning: Don't Dictate, Collaborate!

http://www-tcall.tamu.edu/newsletr/sum00/sum00a.htm

 

Lights, Camera, Active Learning! Enhancing ESL Instruction Through Video
Projects

http://www-tcall.tamu.edu/newsletr/june04/june04b.htm 

 

(f)      Less Teaching and More Learning: Turning from traditional
methods to project-based instruction, the author found that her students
learned more

-- Susan Gaer's article and the terrific website for both interactive
computer-based learning and student web projects

 

*         Article

http://www.ncsall.net/?id=385

 

*         Website for E-Mail Projects

http://www.otan.dni.us/webfarm/emailproject/email.htm

 

 

(g)     Problem-Based or Project-Based: Is there a big difference and
what's appropriate for my class? 

 

Project-Based and Problem-Based: The same or different?

http://pblmm.k12.ca.us/PBLGuide/PBL&PBL.htm

 

Problem-based Learning and Adult English Language Learners

http://www.cal.org/caela/esl_resources/briefs/Problem-based.pdf

 

(h)     Project-Based Learning

http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Project_Based_Learning

-- A Compendium of Ideas and Reports on the Adult Literacy Education
Wiki

 

 

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From ekocher at state.pa.us  Tue Aug 28 15:44:44 2007
From: ekocher at state.pa.us (Kocher, Eileen)
Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2007 15:44:44 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 899]  PAACE Request for Proposals
Message-ID: <4D4E531F4AA25841BE7BC07B478F574008FA1F9A@enhbgpri06.backup>

The 43rd Annual PAACE Midwinter Conference on Adult Education, the largest gathering of adult educators in Pennsylvania, will be held at the Hershey Lodge, February 6-8, 2008. Adult educators and those from related areas will convene for the premier professional development and networking opportunity for all aspects of adult education in the Pennsylvania.

The theme, ?Opening Windows,? will provide a focal point for exploring educational opportunities for all types of adult students, more efficient delivery systems, transition to postsecondary education and training, new research, professional development, workforce development, public policy supporting adult education, and an optimistic eye to the future.

Keynote speaker will be Dr. Cheryl D. King, study director for the new National Commission on Adult Literacy. Honorary conference chair is the Pennsylvania Workforce Investment Board (PA WIB).

PAACE (Pennsylvania Association for Adult Continuing Education) invites you and your colleagues to submit a proposal for a concurrent session, or a more informal roundtable. Proposals are being accepted NOW and fall into the following 11 categories:

Aligned with PAACE Divisions:

Adult Basic and Secondary Education (ABSE)

Adult Literacy

Continuing Higher Education (CHE)

Corrections Education

English as a Second Language (ESL)

Family Literacy

Workforce Development

Special Categories:

Administration

Public Policy

Research

Or:

General - of interest to a broad adult education audience and/or does not fit neatly into one of the above categories.

We are requesting that all workshop proposals be submitted online.

Please note under Format and Technique the option for Roundtable Discussion. We are providing space for facilitated discussions and networking on topics of interest. The Roundtables will convene at round tables accommodating 10 people and as many others who can pull up a chair.

If your proposal has been solicited, please be sure to fill in the "Requested by" field. This is not a guarantee of acceptance but will give your proposal special attention.

We hope you will consider taking the time to share your work in adult education. Proposal deadline is October 1, 2007.

Here is the link to the online proposal form: http://www.smartwebsitesolutions.net/paace_rfp_2008.htm <http://www.smartwebsitesolutions.net/paace_rfp_2008.htm> 

We hope to hear from you!

Tana Reiff

TIU Community Education Services

First Vice-President

Pennsylvania Association for Adult Continuing Education (PAACE) www.paacesite.org <outbind://60/www.paacesite.org> 

 

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From bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net  Wed Aug 29 10:57:35 2007
From: bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net (Bonnie Odiorne)
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2007 07:57:35 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 900] Re: Reading math textbooks
In-Reply-To: <s6d4213a.080@greatowl.kennesaw.edu>
Message-ID: <211901.53230.qm@web83314.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>

I'd like to know about this, too, since I was asked by a math teacher to insert word problems in my reading comprehension summer course for at-risk students, and it would be interesting to correlate Accuplacer reading and math results. It would reinforce a writing across the curriculum initiative, which of course involves reading, at my university, whose median level is not much above a higher-level ABE student.
  Bonnie Odiorne, Ph.D. writing center director, adjunct professor, Post University, Waterbury, CT

Pinder Naidu <pnaidu at kennesaw.edu> wrote:
      Hello All:
   
  I am a PhD student in math education taking a adult education class and have some questions for you. 
   
  Does anyone on the list know of any work being done assessing adult learners ability to read and comprehend math text books? 
   
  I'd also like to know what effect this has on exam results? 
   
  Does the ability to read interfere with success with numeracy? 
   
  Thanks. Pinder Naidu (GSU student)
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to bonniesophia at sbcglobal.net

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From tsticht at znet.com  Wed Aug 29 13:27:20 2007
From: tsticht at znet.com (tsticht at znet.com)
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2007 10:27:20 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 901]  A Global Network for Adult Literacy
Message-ID: <1188408440.46d5ac78742ba@webmail.znet.net>

August 28, 2007

Toward a Global Network of Adult Literacy Education in Six Industrialized
Nations

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

One of several recent international surveys that have examined adult
language, literacy, and numeracy (LLN) education in Australia, Canada,
Ireland, New Zealand, United Kingdom, and the United States is a report by
McKenna & Fitzpatrick (2004). In this work it was noted that three of the
nations have unitary governments (Ireland, New Zealand, United Kingdom) in
which policies, funding, and educational practice are directed from a
central, national government. The other three nations studied (Australia,
Canada, United States) have federated governments in which a central
government and a number of separate states or provinces share
responsibility for policies, funding, and practices regarding adult LLN
provision.

As one of these three federated nations, the United States has long had an
Adult Education and Literacy System (AELS) that is jointly funded by
federal and state governments and operates according to the provisions of a
national law. This law, the Adult Education Act of 1966, continues today as
the Workforce Investment Act of 1998, Title 2, Adult Education and Family
Literacy Act. For over 40 years now, this adult education system has
provided language, literacy, and numeracy instruction for adults 16 years
of age or older, who are not in school and have not received a secondary
(high) school diploma or its substitute in the form of a General
Educational Development (GED) certificate. This is the longest operating,
federally legislated, nationally organized, and coherently operating adult
LLN system among any of the six nations studied by McKenna & Fitzpatrick
(2004).

Today the AELS has some two to three million adult enrollees annually, and
over its 40 year history over 100 million enrollments have been recorded.
This remarkable achievement has been documented by an accountability system
in which the states report data to the federal government which then
aggregates the data on federal and state funding, enrollments, types of
education (adult basic education (ABE), adult secondary education (ASE), or
English as a second language (ESL) education),  types of personnel
(part-time employed, full-time employed, voluntary), and, at times, types
of organizations providing the AELS services (e.g., adult high schools,
community colleges, community based organizations, etc.).

Since 2000, the AELS has operated with a National Reporting System that
includes data on funding, enrollments, retention, and completion of
programs. Additionally it includes information on progression in learning
upward through six levels of achievement in ABE, ASE, and ESL as indicated
by performance on standardized tests or other assessments, such as
portfolios scored with rubrics. It also includes data on how many adults
who are seeking a secondary education diploma or GED achieve this goal, how
many of those seeking employment go on to become employed, how many seeking
transition to secondary training or education actually complete such a
transition, and other data reported by the states.

This long-lasting AELS is supplemented in the United States by a number of
other organizations such as libraries, community based, charitable
organizations, and education providers working under other special
government programs of health, human resources development,
welfare-to-work, national defense, and early childhood education which
includes some adult literacy education. National data on how many of such
organizations exist, how many adults they serve, and outcomes achieved are
not available to me, if they exist at all. Still, I venture an educated
estimate that there may be another one million or so adults served in these
various programs.

Similarly, in the other six nations studied by McKenna & Fitzpatrick (2004)
there are difficulties in acquiring complete data on adult LLN provision
across a wide variety of organizations with either governmental or
non-governmental  sponsorship.  But there has been for the last decade or
so a growing interest in these industrialized nations in developing more
stable, coherent systems of adult literacy provision.

>From various ongoing activities in these six nations, new policies and new
approaches to adult LLN education have been forthcoming, with improved
accountability systems that hold the promise of offering substantial
evidence that the provision of LLN for adults is a valuable addition to
existing primary, secondary, and tertiary education systems.

Over100 million adults in these six nations have been declared to be at risk
for low literacy. In all six nations, each year hundreds of thousands of
young adults continue to leave the childhood school systems with poor
literacy. For these millions of adults, a solid educational LLN system will
offer the opportunities for continued growth and development, not only for
themselves, but also for their children and their communities.

The time for well-funded, world-class education systems for adult LLN
provision is upon us. Working together, as various reports indicates is
happening, these six industrialized nations form a global network connected
by the virtual reality of the world wide web. Through the continuation and
expansion of this work, it may be possible to transform the visions of such
national education systems from virtual into substantial realities.

Reference

McKenna, R. & Fitzpatrick, L. (2004).  Building sustainable adult literacy
policy and provision In Australia: A review of international policy and
programs.
http://www.ncver.edu.au

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From jackie.coelho at gmail.com  Wed Aug 29 13:39:19 2007
From: jackie.coelho at gmail.com (Jackie Coelho)
Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2007 13:39:19 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 902] Re: Reading math textbooks
In-Reply-To: <s6d4213a.080@greatowl.kennesaw.edu>
References: <s6d4213a.080@greatowl.kennesaw.edu>
Message-ID: <1dd5701e0708291039q578c1868ud0ab99cc2054ff81@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Pinder,
  I am by no means an expert. However, I would say that the ability to
read would indeed effect a reader's ability to comprehend math text
books. Reading is reading. Which is probably not very helpful. I know
a lot of work has been done on the link between numeracy and literacy.
I apologize for not being able to point you in many directions. Try
looking up the work that TIAN has done. That might help.

Jackie Coelho

On 8/28/07, Pinder  Naidu <pnaidu at kennesaw.edu> wrote:
>
> Hello All:
>
> I am a PhD student in math education taking a adult education class and have
> some questions for you.
>
> Does anyone on the list know of any work being done assessing adult learners
> ability to read and comprehend math text books?
>
> I'd also like to know what effect this has on exam results?
>
> Does the ability to read interfere with success with numeracy?
>
> Thanks. Pinder Naidu (GSU student)
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to jackie.coelho at gmail.com
>
>

From djrosen at comcast.net  Thu Aug 30 07:02:45 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Thu, 30 Aug 2007 07:02:45 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 903] What International Literacy Programs Offer
	Programs in the U.S.
Message-ID: <3CB4A95D-2A04-4E06-8F68-D6E541DFBFF5@comcast.net>

Colleagues,

I hope you will join us on September 7th -14th, 2007 for the Special  
Topics discussion What International Literacy Programs Offer Programs  
in the U.S.   You or your colleagues who may wish to join this  
discussion can subscribe by going to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics
After you complete the simple registration form (30 seconds) you will  
receive an email asking you to confirm that you wish to subscribe.   
Immediately reply to the email to complete your subscription. After  
the discussion ends you can unsubscribe from the same Web address, or  
stay on for the next discussion.

We will talk with adult literacy educator experts who have experience  
with programs in the U.S. and in other countries.  We will discuss  
with them what they have learned in other countries that may be  
useful to programs in the U.S.  As the theme of this year?s  
International Literacy Day, on September 8th, is health literacy, we  
will also explore the intersection in their work of health and literacy.

Guest Biographies and Guests' Suggested Readings for this Discussion

Dr. Erik Jacobson

Erik Jacobson is an Assistant Professor at Montclair State University  
in New Jersey, where he works in the Early Childhood, Elementary and  
Literacy Education Department. One of his research interests is the  
goals that teachers and students set for themselves in Japanese adult  
basic education classes (literacy and Japanese as a Second Language).  
He has been looking at this topic for almost 10 years, and he  
recently returned from visiting programs in Osaka and Nara. Erik is  
also the co-area leader of the Adult Literacy Education Wiki section  
on World Literacy and Nonformal Education, and he maintains a page on  
world literacy news.

Suggested Web sites:

Sample Story

http://home.kyodo.co.jp/modules/fstStory/index.php?storyid=305624

Context for Japanese ABE

?Multicultural?
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/fl20070327zg.html

Buraku Discrimination
http://blhrri.org/blhrri_e/blhrri/buraku.htm

Organization

Japan Society for the Study of Adult and Community Education
http://wwwsoc.nii.ac.jp/jssace/index-e.html

Dr. John Comings

John is a senior research associate and lecturer on education at  
Harvard's Graduate School of Education and was director of the  
National Center for the Study of Adult Learning and Literacy (NCSALL)  
from 1996 to 2007. Before HGSE and NCSALL, He spent 12 years as vice  
president of World Education in Boston. He has worked in Asia,  
Africa, and the Caribbean, and he lived for 6 years in Nepal and 2  
years in Indonesia. In his international work, he has helped design,  
implement and evaluate adult literacy programs and skill training  
programs.

Suggested Reading: http://www.worlded.org/docs/Publications/ 
teaching_adults_to_read.pdf

Dr. Ujwala Samant

Ujwala Samant is director of Learning for Life UK, a small NGo  
working in India, Pakistan, Afghanistan and the UK. Under her  
leadership, LfL has stabilized financially and added new, larger  
projects and more than tripled their annual income. She was a senior  
researcher at the National Center for the Study of Adult Learning and  
Literacy at Rutgers University, USA. Her research foci include  
gender, immigrant education, ESOL, learner engagement and voice. She  
has taught at the International Literacy Institute at the
University of Pennsylvania, and been a consultant in the field of  
development, education and gender. Her doctoral research examined the  
links between literacy and social change amongst women in Mumbai  
slums. She received The UK Asian Woman of Achievement 2007 award for  
Social and Humanitarian work

Barbara Garner

Known on NIFL?s discussion lists as the editor of ?Focus on Basics?,  
Barbara Garner led the development of non-profit World Education?s  
adult literacy efforts in Africa from 1998 through 2004, providing  
technical assistance around teacher training and curriculum  
development as well as leadership and program design. Her work took  
her to Guinea, Mali, Benin, and more recently Egypt, where she  
consulted on their national adult literacy assessment system.   
Earlier in her career she worked on non-formal education programs and  
refugee education programs in Indonesia, Thailand, and Nepal.

Suggested Reading: to get a feel for adult literacy in West Africa  
read "Creating Curricula for Challenging Circumstances" from Focus on  
Basics http://www.ncsall.net/index.php?id=199

Pamela Civins

Pamela Civins has worked in the field of nonprofit management, formal  
and nonformal education for over 15 years internationally and in  
Boston, Massachusetts.  Currently, she is the Executive Director of  
Boston Partners in Education, an organization that enhances the  
academic achievement and nurtures the personal growth of Boston's  
public school students by providing them with focused, individualized  
in-school volunteer support.  Pamela has been working exclusively in  
the US for the past three years.  Prior to her work being focused on  
K-12 urban education, she provided coordination and managerial  
oversight of nonformal education and literacy programs for girls and  
women in Nepal, India and Pakistan.  For eight years, she worked with  
the nonprofit, World Education, Inc., both in the US and abroad.  She  
coordinated a women's literacy program and was based in Kathmandu,  
Nepal for two yeas.  Pamela worked extensively in India supporting a  
collaboration with World Education and the Indian-based  
nongovernmental organization, PRIA, on a the Women's Empowerment  
Through Literacy and Livelihoods Development Project, an integrated  
literacy and livelihoods development program that took place in the  
Indian states of Madhya Pradesh and Andhra Pradesh.  She also  
provided support to a women's literacy program in Pakistan.  Pamela  
received her BA from the University of Colorado, a MIIM (Masters in  
Intercultural & International Management) from the School for  
International Training, and an M.Ed. with a focus on International  
Education Policy from Harvard University.

Recommended readings.

http://www.worlded.org/docs/Publications/teaching_adults_to_read.pdf

http://www.iiz-dvv.de/englisch/Publikationen/Weltbank/inhalt.htm

http://unesdoc.unesco.org/images/0012/001200/120067Eo.pdf

http://www.globalhealth.org/publications/contents.php3?id=2&issue=116

Brenda Bell

Brenda Bell, for many years Associate Director of the Center for  
Literacy Studies, University of Tennessee and Coordinator of the EFF  
National Center, is currently an education advisor with the Global  
Learning Group of the Education Development Center (EDC).  In 2004  
and 2005, she provided support to EDC?s Afghanistan Literacy and  
Community Empowerment Project which links literacy with governance  
and economic development activities in 200 rural villages. For the  
past year, she has been technical advisor to EQuALLS, an education  
quality and livelihood skills program in over 900 barangays in the  
western Mindanao area of the Philippines. Additionally, Brenda  
assists with program assessment, design and development activities in  
other countries. With many years of experience in nonformal and adult  
education in the U.S., Brenda (a former Peace Corps volunteer) is  
enjoying the opportunities and challenges of working outside of the  
U.S. She lives in Maryville, TN.

Suggested Reading: Developing Adult Literacy: Approaches to planning,  
implementing and delivering literacy initiatives by Juliet Merrifield  
Juliet McCaffrey Juliet Millican  Oxfam, September 30, 2007 [For this  
discussion this book will be available free online]

Juliet Merrifield

Juliet Merrifield is Principal of the Friends Centre, an independent  
adult education centre in Brighton, England.  She has worked as an  
adult educator and researcher for the last 25 years, in the USA,  
England and Ireland.  She was Director of the Learning from  
Experience Trust in London, and of the Center for Literacy Studies at  
the University of Tennessee, USA.

David J. Rosen
Special Topics Discussion Moderator
djrosen at comcast.net

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From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Tue Sep  4 08:58:52 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 08:58:52 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 904]  Reder Policy Brief for Commission released
Message-ID: <6D966932-3686-40D1-AB73-7F9285037A0B@caalusa.org>

New York, NY, 9/4/07 -- The National Commission on Adult Literacy  
today released ADULT EDUCATION AND POSTSECONDARY SUCCESS by Steve  
Reder of Portland State University and the National Center for the  
Study of Adult Learning and Literacy. The policy brief was presented  
at the Commission's third meeting on August 20, 2007. It examines GED  
holders in comparison to their counterparts who have received a high  
school diploma as well as those with no high school credential. The  
comparisons are made in terms of long-term postsecondary education  
outcomes. The author makes numerous recommendations for expanding and  
restructuring the adult education system, with the goal of college  
readiness and success in mind. [September 4, 2007, 29 pages, publ.  
Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy]  This document and others  
that have been released are available from the Publications page of   
the National Commission website: http:// 
www.nationalcommissiononadultliteracy.org/pandp.html.

Over the next 2-3 weeks, three additional documents will be released:  
a policy brief by Julie Strawn of the Center for Law and Social  
Policy  (Policies to Promote Adult Education and Postsecondary  
Alignment); a policy brief by education consultant James Parker  
(Workplace Education: Twenty State Perspectives); and a special  
perspectives paper developed by Tony Peyton of the National Center  
for Family Literacy (Family Literacy in Adult Education: The Federal  
and State Support Role).

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From mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us  Tue Sep  4 11:28:54 2007
From: mbeheler at cabell.lib.wv.us (Mary Beheler)
Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 11:28:54 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 905] Re: Reading math textbooks: suggested experiment
In-Reply-To: <EMEW-j7RI7Z15e3f2ebeab5c6585d0e5e9b2ba984da-s6d4213a.080@greatowl.kennesaw.edu>
Message-ID: <LKEOLBGLELNBINCLCOCMIEGCCFAA.mbeheler@cabell.lib.wv.us>

Try this: Create or select a math worksheet that can be displayed and edited
on your computer. Highlight everything. Change the font to "Symbol." Is it
any harder to use now? (Make a decoder by writing the alphabet, numbers, and
math symbols in the original font then changing that to "Symbol." You will
see that the numbers and most of the math operators are still the same. Only
the letters used to write the WORDS will change.)

Or, an even simpler experiment: Turn a math book upside down, read a
chapter, then do all the exercises, writing your answers upside down.

Mary G. Beheler
Tri-State Literacy
455 Ninth Street
Huntington, WV 25701
304 528-5700, ext 156
  -----Original Message-----
  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Pinder Naidu
  Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 1:21 PM
  To: Assessment at nifl.gov
  Subject: [Assessment 897] Reading math textbooks

  Hello All:

  I am a PhD student in math education taking a adult education class and
have some questions for you.

  Does anyone on the list know of any work being done assessing adult
learners ability to read and comprehend math text books?

  I'd also like to know what effect this has on exam results?

  Does the ability to read interfere with success with numeracy?

  Thanks. Pinder Naidu (GSU student)
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Sep  4 14:12:36 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 14:12:36 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 906]  September welcome!
Message-ID: <020b01c7ef1f$2c8a1520$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Dear Colleagues,
 
Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have
been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If you
are new to the List, please introduce yourself and let us know why you
have subscribed to the Assessment Discussion List - what topics would
you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers - what is
on your minds these days?  What topics of interest would you like to see
discussed?  
 
I have in the works a couple of guest discussions that will take place
this fall - one focused on GED and another focused on using data in the
classroom as a follow up to our discussion last April on using data for
program improvement (see below for info on accessing this discussion in
the archives).  I would really like to have something focused on ESOL -
any suggestions?  I have a few ideas but want to hear from you.
 
For those of you who are new, let me share these List Tips, they can be
very helpful.  Also - new folks may want to scroll down to read the
information on using the Archives so that you can see what types of
discussions we have had in the past. 
 
Thanks so much - looking forward to hearing from you and having some
great discussions here!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
Discussion List Tips
Here are some suggestions for maximizing your experience as a List
Member, both in terms of getting the most out of the content, as well as
minimizing the time and effort involved in following the Discussion
List.  In addition to the tips below, you should always feel free to
contact me with any questions or concerns, or if you need help:
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
Posting to the List
Please include an email address in your signature line in at least your
first message so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry off-list
if they choose.
Please be sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of your
message; many subscribers follow discussion threads via the Subject
Line, and often, the message content shifts as people converse, but the
Subject Line remains the same from the first posted message.  This makes
it more difficult to follow discussion threads.  Please remember to
check the Subject Line info and change it to appropriately reflect your
message content, if needed.
Consider whether your reply is best suited to send to only one person or
the whole group.
Managing Your Subscription
Digest Format
This format allows subscribers to receive Discussion List messages
"bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line will not be
topic-specific, so any replies to digest format often mean the subject
line will need adjusting before replying. Also, subscribers using digest
format do not receive the information that was posted right away.
Because of that, this option may or may not suit everyone's needs.
>From the Assessment Discussion List page:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
Scroll down to Unsubscribe and other options at the bottom and enter
your subscription email address.  
This takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to unsubscribe or
to log in using your password. Log in. (There is a button you can click
to have your password emailed to you if you've forgotten it.)
Once you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest mode".
Click this to "on", then scroll down further and click "submit my
changes."
Use the archives
You do not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so if
you are interested in reading about certain topics, but don't want to be
a List Member, this option is open for you.  (See below for more
information on using the archives.)
Just hit delete!
This is when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic of
discussion just isn't up your alley, or you simply don't have the time
at the moment, the delete button is a good option.  No one is making you
be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all your choice!
Often subscribers say that they just can't hit delete for fear of
missing something, but remember that all posts get logged automatically
in the archives and so when you *do* have the time or when that topic
area *does* interest you, you can go back and search for those posts in
the archives.
Using the Archives
To read full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the
Assessment List Archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
The archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
In the right-hand toolbar:
Click on Search Archives; you can search just the Assessment archives or
all the List archives from here; search by thread, subject, or author.
Click on List Events to view information on upcoming, as well as past,
Discussion Topics.  
Click on List Help for the FAQ about using the Lists.
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Tue Sep  4 16:57:22 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2007 16:57:22 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 907]  Release of Commission Paper by James Parker
Message-ID: <A6BBE9DB-F2FC-4090-AB53-93C5C952F86F@caalusa.org>

New York, NY, 5:00 PM -- WORKPLACE EDUCATION: TWENTY STATE  
PERSPECTIVES, a paper prepared by education consultant James T.  
Parker for the National Commission on Adult Literacy, was released  
today. This Policy Brief was prepared for the Commission's third  
meeting on August 20, 2007 by education consultant James Parker  
(formerly of the U.S. Department of Education). It describes various  
aspects of current workplace education programs in 20 states: AR, CA,  
CT, FL, GA, IN, KY, LA, MA, MN, MS, NY, NC, OH, PA, SC, TX, VA, WV,  
and WI. It examines how the programs are funded; the level of effort  
in each case for the past two years; connections, partnerships, and/ 
or strategic plans implemented by workplace education programs; how  
states measure outcomes or determine success; the nature of workplace  
education outcomes achieved; challenges or barriers faced by the  
states; what the states consider to be the key elements of success in  
their workplace education efforts, and (8) what future policy options  
the states would like to consider. One section of the paper presents  
seven policy options from the author's perspective. In an appendix to  
the study, state profiles are given for the 20 states included.  The  
document is available from the Commission website: http:// 
www.nationalcommissiononadultliteracy.org/pandp.html.

From donnaedp at cox.net  Wed Sep  5 08:26:41 2007
From: donnaedp at cox.net (Donna Chambers)
Date: Wed, 5 Sep 2007 08:26:41 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 908] Re: September welcome!
References: <020b01c7ef1f$2c8a1520$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <004601c7efb8$037c30c0$975fdd48@DH89L251>

Marie and All,

Happy September!  I must admit that I have not read all the postings on the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting has already happened, please forgive me.  

I would like to suggest  a  discussion  designing a system that efficiently moves  ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that would allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth transition from ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the learner through a pipeline? 

This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.  These sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I found everything relevant to adult learners as well.  Competency-based assessment is my specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of formative vs. summative assessment and how both guide instruction in the classroom.  Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work along side  native English speakers with teaching and learning being focused on the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would make a great discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.

Donna Chambers

From: Marie Cora 
  To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
  Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12 PM
  Subject: [Assessment 906] September welcome!

  Dear Colleagues,

   

  Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If you are new to the List, please introduce yourself and let us know why you have subscribed to the Assessment Discussion List - what topics would you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers - what is on your minds these days?  What topics of interest would you like to see discussed?  

   

  I have in the works a couple of guest discussions that will take place this fall - one focused on GED and another focused on using data in the classroom as a follow up to our discussion last April on using data for program improvement (see below for info on accessing this discussion in the archives).  I would really like to have something focused on ESOL - any suggestions?  I have a few ideas but want to hear from you.

   

  For those of you who are new, let me share these List Tips, they can be very helpful.  Also - new folks may want to scroll down to read the information on using the Archives so that you can see what types of discussions we have had in the past. 

   

  Thanks so much - looking forward to hearing from you and having some great discussions here!

   

  Marie Cora

  Assessment Discussion List Moderator

   

  Discussion List Tips

  Here are some suggestions for maximizing your experience as a List Member, both in terms of getting the most out of the content, as well as minimizing the time and effort involved in following the Discussion List.  In addition to the tips below, you should always feel free to contact me with any questions or concerns, or if you need help:  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

  Posting to the List

  Please include an email address in your signature line in at least your first message so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry off-list if they choose.

  Please be sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of your message; many subscribers follow discussion threads via the Subject Line, and often, the message content shifts as people converse, but the Subject Line remains the same from the first posted message.  This makes it more difficult to follow discussion threads.  Please remember to check the Subject Line info and change it to appropriately reflect your message content, if needed.

  Consider whether your reply is best suited to send to only one person or the whole group.

  Managing Your Subscription

  Digest Format

  This format allows subscribers to receive Discussion List messages "bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line will not be topic-specific, so any replies to digest format often mean the subject line will need adjusting before replying. Also, subscribers using digest format do not receive the information that was posted right away. Because of that, this option may or may not suit everyone's needs.

  From the Assessment Discussion List page:  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment

  Scroll down to Unsubscribe and other options at the bottom and enter your subscription email address.  

  This takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to unsubscribe or to log in using your password. Log in. (There is a button you can click to have your password emailed to you if you've forgotten it.)

  Once you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest mode". Click this to "on", then scroll down further and click "submit my changes."

  Use the archives

  You do not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so if you are interested in reading about certain topics, but don't want to be a List Member, this option is open for you.  (See below for more information on using the archives.)

  Just hit delete!

  This is when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic of discussion just isn't up your alley, or you simply don't have the time at the moment, the delete button is a good option.  No one is making you be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all your choice!  Often subscribers say that they just can't hit delete for fear of missing something, but remember that all posts get logged automatically in the archives and so when you *do* have the time or when that topic area *does* interest you, you can go back and search for those posts in the archives.

  Using the Archives

  To read full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the Assessment List Archives at:

  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.

  The archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.

  In the right-hand toolbar:

  Click on Search Archives; you can search just the Assessment archives or all the List archives from here; search by thread, subject, or author.

  Click on List Events to view information on upcoming, as well as past, Discussion Topics.  

  Click on List Help for the FAQ about using the Lists.

   

   

  Marie Cora

  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

  NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

  Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection

  http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/

   

   

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  -------------------------------
  National Institute for Literacy
  Assessment mailing list
  Assessment at nifl.gov
  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
  Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
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From mmaralit at nifl.gov  Thu Sep  6 08:33:54 2007
From: mmaralit at nifl.gov (Mary Jo Maralit)
Date: Thu,  6 Sep 2007 08:33:54 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Assessment 909] September 28 Webcast: From Assessment to Practice:
	Research-Based Approaches to Teaching Reading to Adults
Message-ID: <20070906123354.7FB8D11B47@mail.nifl.gov>

TOPIC: From Assessment to Practice: Research-Based Approaches to Teaching Reading to Adults

WHEN:  Friday, September 28, 2007

TIME:  1:30 PM - 2:45 PM Eastern Time
       12:30 PM - 1:45 PM Central Time
       11:30 AM - 12:45 PM Mountain Time
       10:30 AM - 11:45 AM Pacific Time

The National Institute for Literacy will host a webcast titled From Assessment to Practice: Research-Based Approaches to Teaching Reading to Adults on Friday, September 28, 2007. This webcast will present a practical and compelling rationale for the use of research-based principles for adult reading instruction. Dr. John Kruideiner, Dr. Rosalind Davidson, and Ms. Susan McShane will use two components of reading, word analysis and comprehension, as examples to illustrate research-based practices, focusing on specific assessment and instructional strategies derived from the research. Participants will learn about the direct link between research and evidence-based practice. The presenters also will explain how all four major components of reading provide a framework for assessing students' reading ability and how assessment results can lead to a program of instruction that improve students' reading.

For more information, please contact info at nifl.gov or call 202-233-2025 or visit us online at http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/assesspractice/webcast0928.html.

Please note: This webcast will be archived on the Institute's website about two weeks after the event.

From mjjerdems at yahoo.com  Thu Sep  6 09:38:42 2007
From: mjjerdems at yahoo.com (Mary Jane Jerde)
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 06:38:42 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 910] Re: September welcome!
In-Reply-To: <004601c7efb8$037c30c0$975fdd48@DH89L251>
Message-ID: <825176.35684.qm@web54008.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

This is a good on-going topic.

In my experience, ESL students either have the means to take the advanced grammar and pronunciation courses, etc., or they are pressed to get the diploma. If they can stay in school at all. 

In my experience, a transition class is an ideal. The reality has been that I attempt to ground them in the basics of English especially verbs,simple past and present, continuous, both kinds of future, a few modals, negatives. Then I encourage them that when they enter an ABE or similar class, they will still be responsible to maintain and develop their grammar and other English skills. It will not be the teacher's job to pour it into them or spend class time coaching them or having peer coaching the way that we can in ESL class. They have to be their own advocates on this. 

Mary Jane Jerde

Donna Chambers <donnaedp at cox.net> wrote:      
             Clean   Clean   DocumentEmail                            MicrosoftInternetExplorer4    st1\:* {  BEHAVIOR: url(#default#ieooui) }         /* Style Definitions */   table.MsoNormalTable  {mso-style-name:"Table Normal";  mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0;  mso-tstyle-colband-size:0;  mso-style-noshow:yes;  mso-style-parent:"";  mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt;  mso-para-margin:0in;  mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt;  mso-pagination:widow-orphan;  font-size:10.0pt;  font-family:"Times New Roman";}   Marie and All,
  
 Happy September!  I must admit that I have not  read all the postings on the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting  has already happened, please forgive me.  
  
 I would like to suggest  a   discussion  designing a system that efficiently moves   ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several  years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who  want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in  ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that  would allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth  transition from ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the  learner through a pipeline? 
  
 This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of  professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.  These  sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I found everything  relevant to adult learners as well.  Competency-based assessment is my  specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of formative vs. summative  assessment and how both guide instruction in the classroom.   Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work along side   native English speakers with teaching and learning being focused on  the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would make a great  discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.
  
 Donna Chambers
  
 From: Marie Cora 
    To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
   Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12    PM
   Subject: [Assessment 906] September    welcome!
   

      Dear    Colleagues,
    
   Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have    been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If you are new to the List, please    introduce yourself and let us know why you have subscribed to the Assessment    Discussion List ? what topics would you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers ? what is    on your minds these days?  What    topics of interest would you like to see discussed?  
    
   I have in the works a couple of    guest discussions that will take place this fall ? one focused on GED and    another focused on using data in the classroom as a follow up to our    discussion last April on using data for program improvement (see below for    info on accessing this discussion in the archives).  I would really like to have something    focused on ESOL ? any suggestions?     I have a few ideas but want to hear from    you.
    
   For those of you who are new, let    me share these List Tips, they can be very helpful.  Also ? new folks may want to scroll    down to read the information on using the Archives so that you can see what    types of discussions we have had in the past. 
    
   Thanks so much ? looking forward    to hearing from you and having some great discussions    here!
    
   Marie    Cora
   Assessment Discussion List    Moderator
    
   Discussion    List Tips
   Here are some suggestions    for maximizing your experience as a List Member, both in terms of getting the    most out of the content, as well as minimizing the time and effort involved in    following the Discussion List.  In    addition to the tips below, you should always feel free to contact me with any    questions or concerns, or if you need help:  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
   Posting to the    List
   Please    include an email address in your signature line in at least your first message    so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry off-list if they    choose.
   Please be    sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of your message; many    subscribers follow discussion threads via the Subject Line, and often, the    message content shifts as people converse, but the Subject Line remains the    same from the first posted message.     This makes it more difficult to follow discussion threads.  Please remember to check the Subject    Line info and change it to appropriately reflect your message content, if    needed.
   Consider    whether your reply is best suited to send to only one person or the whole    group.
   Managing Your    Subscription
   Digest Format
   This    format allows subscribers to receive    Discussion List messages    "bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line will not be topic-specific, so any replies to    digest format often mean the subject line will need adjusting before replying.    Also, subscribers using digest format do    not receive the information that was posted right away. Because of    that, this option may or may not suit everyone?s needs.
   From the    Assessment Discussion List    page:  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
   Scroll    down to Unsubscribe and other    options at the bottom and enter your subscription email    address.     
   This    takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to unsubscribe or to log in    using your password. Log in. (There is a button you can click to have your    password emailed to you if you've forgotten it.)
   Once    you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest mode". Click this    to "on", then scroll down further and click "submit my    changes."
   Use    the archives
   You do    not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so if you are    interested in reading about certain topics, but don?t want to be a List    Member, this option is open for you.     (See below for more information on using the    archives.)
   Just    hit delete!
   This is    when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic of discussion just isn?t    up your alley, or you simply don?t have the time at the moment, the delete    button is a good option.  No one    is making you be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It?s all your choice!  Often subscribers say that they just    can?t hit delete for fear of missing something, but remember that all posts    get logged automatically in the archives and so when you *do* have the time or    when that topic area *does* interest you, you can go back and search for those    posts in the archives.
   Using    the Archives
   To read    full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the Assessment List    Archives at:
   http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
   The    archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
   In the    right-hand toolbar:
   Click on    Search    Archives; you can search just the Assessment archives or all the    List archives from here; search by thread, subject, or    author.
   Click on    List Events    to view information on upcoming, as well as past, Discussion Topics.  
   Click on    List Help    for the FAQ about using the Lists.
    
    
   Marie    Cora
   marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
   NIFL Assessment    Discussion List Moderator
   http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
   Coordinator,    LINCS Assessment Special Collection
   http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
    
    

      

---------------------------------
    
-------------------------------
National Institute for    Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe    or change your subscription settings, please go to    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to    donnaedp at cox.net
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to mjjerdems at yahoo.com

       
---------------------------------
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From crandall at umbc.edu  Thu Sep  6 12:40:27 2007
From: crandall at umbc.edu (JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall)
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 12:40:27 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Assessment 911] Re: September welcome!
In-Reply-To: <825176.35684.qm@web54008.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <825176.35684.qm@web54008.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <49437.130.85.83.247.1189096827.squirrel@webmail.umbc.edu>

I agree that transition classes are a good idea, but a program which
offers gradual transition to ABE may also be a good solution.  Yakima
Valley Community College has an integrated ESL/ABE program, with students
in the upper levels of adult ESL taking first ABE math classes and then
ABE reading.  You can learn more about the program in a report that
Forrest Chisman and I did on promising practices in adult ESL in the
community college:
Passing the Torch
You can access the report online under Occasional Papers at
www.caalusa.org

I should note that we also identify one of the major barriers to
transition for adult English Language Learners is the lack of an
assessment system, with different tests used for exit from one program and
entry to another.

Jodi Crandall

> This is a good on-going topic.
>
> In my experience, ESL students either have the means to take the advanced
> grammar and pronunciation courses, etc., or they are pressed to get the
> diploma. If they can stay in school at all.
>
> In my experience, a transition class is an ideal. The reality has been
> that I attempt to ground them in the basics of English especially
> verbs,simple past and present, continuous, both kinds of future, a few
> modals, negatives. Then I encourage them that when they enter an ABE or
> similar class, they will still be responsible to maintain and develop
> their grammar and other English skills. It will not be the teacher's job
> to pour it into them or spend class time coaching them or having peer
> coaching the way that we can in ESL class. They have to be their own
> advocates on this.
>
> Mary Jane Jerde
>
>
>
> Donna Chambers <donnaedp at cox.net> wrote:
>              Clean   Clean   DocumentEmail
> MicrosoftInternetExplorer4    st1\:* {  BEHAVIOR:
> url(#default#ieooui) }         /* Style Definitions */
> table.MsoNormalTable  {mso-style-name:"Table Normal";
> mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0;  mso-tstyle-colband-size:0;
> mso-style-noshow:yes;  mso-style-parent:"";
> mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt;  mso-para-margin:0in;
> mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt;  mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
>  font-size:10.0pt;  font-family:"Times New Roman";}   Marie
> and All,
>
>  Happy September!  I must admit that I have not  read all the postings on
> the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting  has already
> happened, please forgive me.
>
>  I would like to suggest  a   discussion  designing a system that
> efficiently moves   ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several
> years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who
> want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in
> ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that  would
> allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth  transition from
> ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the  learner
> through a pipeline?
>
>  This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of
> professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.
> These  sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I
> found everything  relevant to adult learners as well.  Competency-based
> assessment is my  specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of
> formative vs. summative  assessment and how both guide instruction in the
> classroom.   Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work
> along side   native English speakers with teaching and learning being
> focused on  the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would
> make a great  discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.
>
>  Donna Chambers
>
>  From: Marie Cora
>     To: Assessment at nifl.gov
>    Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12    PM
>    Subject: [Assessment 906] September    welcome!
>
>
>       Dear    Colleagues,
>
>    Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have
>  been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If you
> are new to the List, please    introduce yourself and let us know why
> you have subscribed to the Assessment    Discussion List ? what topics
> would you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers ?
> what is    on your minds these days?  What    topics of interest would
> you like to see discussed?
>
>    I have in the works a couple of    guest discussions that will take
> place this fall ? one focused on GED and    another focused on using
> data in the classroom as a follow up to our    discussion last April on
> using data for program improvement (see below for    info on accessing
> this discussion in the archives).  I would really like to have
> something    focused on ESOL ? any suggestions?     I have a few ideas
> but want to hear from    you.
>
>    For those of you who are new, let    me share these List Tips, they can
> be very helpful.  Also ? new folks may want to scroll    down to read
> the information on using the Archives so that you can see what    types
> of discussions we have had in the past.
>
>    Thanks so much ? looking forward    to hearing from you and having some
> great discussions    here!
>
>    Marie    Cora
>    Assessment Discussion List    Moderator
>
>    Discussion    List Tips
>    Here are some suggestions    for maximizing your experience as a List
> Member, both in terms of getting the    most out of the content, as
> well as minimizing the time and effort involved in    following the
> Discussion List.  In    addition to the tips below, you should always
> feel free to contact me with any    questions or concerns, or if you
> need help:  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>    Posting to the    List
>    Please    include an email address in your signature line in at least
> your first message    so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry
> off-list if they    choose.
>    Please be    sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of
> your message; many    subscribers follow discussion threads via the
> Subject Line, and often, the    message content shifts as people
> converse, but the Subject Line remains the    same from the first
> posted message.     This makes it more difficult to follow discussion
> threads.  Please remember to check the Subject    Line info and change
> it to appropriately reflect your message content, if    needed.
>    Consider    whether your reply is best suited to send to only one
> person or the whole    group.
>    Managing Your    Subscription
>    Digest Format
>    This    format allows subscribers to receive    Discussion List
> messages    "bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line
> will not be topic-specific, so any replies to    digest format often
> mean the subject line will need adjusting before replying.    Also,
> subscribers using digest format do    not receive the information that
> was posted right away. Because of    that, this option may or may not
> suit everyone?s needs.
>    From the    Assessment Discussion List    page:
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
>    Scroll    down to Unsubscribe and other    options at the bottom and
> enter your subscription email    address.
>    This    takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to
> unsubscribe or to log in    using your password. Log in. (There is a
> button you can click to have your    password emailed to you if you've
> forgotten it.)
>    Once    you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest
> mode". Click this    to "on", then scroll down further and click
> "submit my    changes."
>    Use    the archives
>    You do    not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so
> if you are    interested in reading about certain topics, but don?t
> want to be a List    Member, this option is open for you.     (See
> below for more information on using the    archives.)
>    Just    hit delete!
>    This is    when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic
> of discussion just isn?t    up your alley, or you simply don?t have the
> time at the moment, the delete    button is a good option.  No one
> is making you be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It?s all
> your choice!  Often subscribers say that they just    can?t hit delete
> for fear of missing something, but remember that all posts    get
> logged automatically in the archives and so when you *do* have the time
> or    when that topic area *does* interest you, you can go back and
> search for those    posts in the archives.
>    Using    the Archives
>    To read    full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the
> Assessment List    Archives at:
>    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
>    The    archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
>    In the    right-hand toolbar:
>    Click on    Search    Archives; you can search just the Assessment
> archives or all the    List archives from here; search by thread,
> subject, or    author.
>    Click on    List Events    to view information on upcoming, as well as
> past, Discussion Topics.
>    Click on    List Help    for the FAQ about using the Lists.
>
>
>    Marie    Cora
>    marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>    NIFL Assessment    Discussion List Moderator
>    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>    Coordinator,    LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>    http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for    Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe    or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to    donnaedp at cox.net
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to mjjerdems at yahoo.com
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to crandall at umbc.edu
>

-- 
JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Professor, Education Department
Director, Ph.D. Program in Language, Literacy & Culture
Coordinator, Peace Corps Master's International Program in ESOL/Bilingual
Education
University of Maryland, Baltimore County (UMBC)
1000 Hilltop Circle, Baltimore, MD 21250
ph:    410-455-2313/2376  fax:   410-455-8947/1880
email: crandall at umbc.edu
www.umbc.edu/llc/
www.umbc.edu/esol/
www.umbc.edu/esol/peacecorps.html

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Sep  6 12:56:00 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 12:56:00 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 912] FW: [Technology 1259] Tech Integration
	Self-Assessment available now
Message-ID: <055e01c7f0a6$ceae5f40$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:
 
I thought some of you might be interested in this self-assessment for
teachers.  Note at the bottom of Marian's post that there will be a
discussion focused on this tool on the Technology Discussion List
(http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Technology).  I'll keep you posted
on when that discussion gets announced. 
 
Thanks, 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
 
The AdultEd Online project at www.adultedonline.org has launched a
technology integration self-assessment for teachers. See how you are
doing with using technology in your classroom, and what the possibilties
are. There may be some here that you haven't considered before. The
self-assessment takes about 15-20 minutes to complete, and if you wish
you can continue, based on your results, to create a professional
development plan for yourself and save it online.

>From the link above you can register as a teacher or as an
administrator. Administrators can invite teachers, track their results,
and see aggregated results in order to plan professional development for
a site or agency. 

There are two self-assessments on this Web site, the one for tech
integration and also one for distance teaching, so be sure you are
looking at technology integration.

We will be discussing this new tool on this list in a few weeks, but I
wanted you to know that it's available now, so please check it out when
you have a chance. Our list moderator, Mariann Fedele, along with David
Rosen, Jackie Taylor, and many others contributed much to the
development of this tool, and we are eager to have people try it out.

Marian
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Marian Thacher, OTAN
P.O. Box 269003
Sacramento, CA 95826-9003
(916) 228-2597
www.otan.us 
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From kbeall at onlyinternet.net  Thu Sep  6 15:32:22 2007
From: kbeall at onlyinternet.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 15:32:22 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 913]  New from NCSALL
Message-ID: <00b401c7f0bc$a60ac4f0$020ba8c0@your4105e587b6>

Research Utilization in the Field of Adult Learning and Literacy: Lessons
Learned by NCSALL About Connecting Practice, Policy, and Research

 

By Cristine Smith, Beth Bingman, and Kaye Beall

This occasional paper is a summary of what the staff of the NCSALL
Dissemination Initiative learned about how to connect research, policy and
practice in ways that promote evidence-based practice in the field of adult
learning and literacy.

 

Go to http://www.ncsall.net/?id=26#utilization to download the paper.

 

****************

Kaye Beall

World Education

6760 West Street

Linn Grove, IN 46711

Tel: 765-717-3942

Fax: 617-482-0617

kaye_beall at worlded.org

http://www.worlded.org

 

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From forrest at crosslink.net  Thu Sep  6 17:58:26 2007
From: forrest at crosslink.net (fchisman)
Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2007 17:58:26 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 914] Re: September welcome!
In-Reply-To: <49437.130.85.83.247.1189096827.squirrel@webmail.umbc.edu>
Message-ID: <PEEILBMHBCKJIFLALLFDGEJDCGAA.forrest@crosslink.net>

The Yakima program and its outcomes are descriped in more detail in a
separate report on it by Pamela Ferguson et.al, also published on
www.caalusa.org.

Forrest Chisman

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2007 12:40 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 911] Re: September welcome!

I agree that transition classes are a good idea, but a program which
offers gradual transition to ABE may also be a good solution.  Yakima
Valley Community College has an integrated ESL/ABE program, with students
in the upper levels of adult ESL taking first ABE math classes and then
ABE reading.  You can learn more about the program in a report that
Forrest Chisman and I did on promising practices in adult ESL in the
community college:
Passing the Torch
You can access the report online under Occasional Papers at
www.caalusa.org

I should note that we also identify one of the major barriers to
transition for adult English Language Learners is the lack of an
assessment system, with different tests used for exit from one program and
entry to another.

Jodi Crandall

> This is a good on-going topic.
>
> In my experience, ESL students either have the means to take the advanced
> grammar and pronunciation courses, etc., or they are pressed to get the
> diploma. If they can stay in school at all.
>
> In my experience, a transition class is an ideal. The reality has been
> that I attempt to ground them in the basics of English especially
> verbs,simple past and present, continuous, both kinds of future, a few
> modals, negatives. Then I encourage them that when they enter an ABE or
> similar class, they will still be responsible to maintain and develop
> their grammar and other English skills. It will not be the teacher's job
> to pour it into them or spend class time coaching them or having peer
> coaching the way that we can in ESL class. They have to be their own
> advocates on this.
>
> Mary Jane Jerde
>
>
>
> Donna Chambers <donnaedp at cox.net> wrote:
>              Clean   Clean   DocumentEmail
> MicrosoftInternetExplorer4    st1\:* {  BEHAVIOR:
> url(#default#ieooui) }         /* Style Definitions */
> table.MsoNormalTable  {mso-style-name:"Table Normal";
> mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0;  mso-tstyle-colband-size:0;
> mso-style-noshow:yes;  mso-style-parent:"";
> mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt;  mso-para-margin:0in;
> mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt;  mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
>  font-size:10.0pt;  font-family:"Times New Roman";}   Marie
> and All,
>
>  Happy September!  I must admit that I have not  read all the postings on
> the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting  has already
> happened, please forgive me.
>
>  I would like to suggest  a   discussion  designing a system that
> efficiently moves   ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several
> years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who
> want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in
> ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that  would
> allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth  transition from
> ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the  learner
> through a pipeline?
>
>  This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of
> professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.
> These  sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I
> found everything  relevant to adult learners as well.  Competency-based
> assessment is my  specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of
> formative vs. summative  assessment and how both guide instruction in the
> classroom.   Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work
> along side   native English speakers with teaching and learning being
> focused on  the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would
> make a great  discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.
>
>  Donna Chambers
>
>  From: Marie Cora
>     To: Assessment at nifl.gov
>    Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12    PM
>    Subject: [Assessment 906] September    welcome!
>
>
>       Dear    Colleagues,
>
>    Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have
>  been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If you
> are new to the List, please    introduce yourself and let us know why
> you have subscribed to the Assessment    Discussion List ? what topics
> would you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers ?
> what is    on your minds these days?  What    topics of interest would
> you like to see discussed?
>
>    I have in the works a couple of    guest discussions that will take
> place this fall ? one focused on GED and    another focused on using
> data in the classroom as a follow up to our    discussion last April on
> using data for program improvement (see below for    info on accessing
> this discussion in the archives).  I would really like to have
> something    focused on ESOL ? any suggestions?     I have a few ideas
> but want to hear from    you.
>
>    For those of you who are new, let    me share these List Tips, they can
> be very helpful.  Also ? new folks may want to scroll    down to read
> the information on using the Archives so that you can see what    types
> of discussions we have had in the past.
>
>    Thanks so much ? looking forward    to hearing from you and having some
> great discussions    here!
>
>    Marie    Cora
>    Assessment Discussion List    Moderator
>
>    Discussion    List Tips
>    Here are some suggestions    for maximizing your experience as a List
> Member, both in terms of getting the    most out of the content, as
> well as minimizing the time and effort involved in    following the
> Discussion List.  In    addition to the tips below, you should always
> feel free to contact me with any    questions or concerns, or if you
> need help:  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>    Posting to the    List
>    Please    include an email address in your signature line in at least
> your first message    so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry
> off-list if they    choose.
>    Please be    sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of
> your message; many    subscribers follow discussion threads via the
> Subject Line, and often, the    message content shifts as people
> converse, but the Subject Line remains the    same from the first
> posted message.     This makes it more difficult to follow discussion
> threads.  Please remember to check the Subject    Line info and change
> it to appropriately reflect your message content, if    needed.
>    Consider    whether your reply is best suited to send to only one
> person or the whole    group.
>    Managing Your    Subscription
>    Digest Format
>    This    format allows subscribers to receive    Discussion List
> messages    "bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line
> will not be topic-specific, so any replies to    digest format often
> mean the subject line will need adjusting before replying.    Also,
> subscribers using digest format do    not receive the information that
> was posted right away. Because of    that, this option may or may not
> suit everyone?s needs.
>    From the    Assessment Discussion List    page:
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
>    Scroll    down to Unsubscribe and other    options at the bottom and
> enter your subscription email    address.
>    This    takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to
> unsubscribe or to log in    using your password. Log in. (There is a
> button you can click to have your    password emailed to you if you've
> forgotten it.)
>    Once    you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest
> mode". Click this    to "on", then scroll down further and click
> "submit my    changes."
>    Use    the archives
>    You do    not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so
> if you are    interested in reading about certain topics, but don?t
> want to be a List    Member, this option is open for you.     (See
> below for more information on using the    archives.)
>    Just    hit delete!
>    This is    when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic
> of discussion just isn?t    up your alley, or you simply don?t have the
> time at the moment, the delete    button is a good option.  No one
> is making you be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It?s all
> your choice!  Often subscribers say that they just    can?t hit delete
> for fear of missing something, but remember that all posts    get
> logged automatically in the archives and so when you *do* have the time
> or    when that topic area *does* interest you, you can go back and
> search for those    posts in the archives.
>    Using    the Archives
>    To read    full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the
> Assessment List    Archives at:
>    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
>    The    archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
>    In the    right-hand toolbar:
>    Click on    Search    Archives; you can search just the Assessment
> archives or all the    List archives from here; search by thread,
> subject, or    author.
>    Click on    List Events    to view information on upcoming, as well as
> past, Discussion Topics.
>    Click on    List Help    for the FAQ about using the Lists.
>
>
>    Marie    Cora
>    marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>    NIFL Assessment    Discussion List Moderator
>    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>    Coordinator,    LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>    http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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> To unsubscribe    or change your subscription settings, please go to
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--
JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Professor, Education Department
Director, Ph.D. Program in Language, Literacy & Culture
Coordinator, Peace Corps Master's International Program in ESOL/Bilingual
Education
University of Maryland, Baltimore County (UMBC)
1000 Hilltop Circle, Baltimore, MD 21250
ph:    410-455-2313/2376  fax:   410-455-8947/1880
email: crandall at umbc.edu
www.umbc.edu/llc/
www.umbc.edu/esol/
www.umbc.edu/esol/peacecorps.html

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Sep  7 12:42:57 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 12:42:57 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 915]  New resource
Message-ID: <06db01c7f16e$266617b0$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues, the following announcement is from Pat Campbell at Grass
Roots Press.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
 
Grass Roots Press has just released a new book titled Measures of
Success: Assessment and Accountability in Adult Basic Education. In this
book, 13 known and respected practitioners and researchers explore the
theory and practice of assessment and accountability. The contributing
authors include Jay Derrick, Kathryn Ecclestone, Juliet Merrifield, Jan
Hagston, Dave Tout, Ralf St. Clair, Alisa Belzer, Katrina Grieve,
William Fagan, Robin Millar, Karen Geraci, Christine Pinsent-Johnson,
and Pat Campbell. 
 
Building on the premise that literacy is complex and multi-faceted, the
authors define the dominant types of assessment tools and then shift to
the broader questions of assessment for whom and for what. In Part 1,
the authors describe standardized, diagnostic, competency-based, and
performance-based assessment tools. In Part 2, the authors provide
insight into the assessment and accountability systems in Canada, the
United States, Scotland, England, Wales, and Australia. Part 3 provides
a set of seven key principles to guide effective accountability systems.
(375 pp.) 
 
The accompanying DVDS are an ideal training tool for workshops and
in-services. The diagnostic assessment DVD demonstrates how to
administer and interpret a diagnostic assessment. (Running time: 25
minutes.) The performance assessment DVD demonstrates an interview,
portfolios, building a rubric, and demonstrations. (Running time: 27:30
minutes) 
 
To order this book, go to the Grass Roots Press website at
www.literacyservices.com <http://www.literacyservices.com/> 
 
The pre-publication reviews are below. 
 
If I had to choose a single must-read for all literacy providers and
policy-makers, Measures of Success would be it. This volume describes
and critiques current assessment and accountability tools and practices
in several English-speaking countries from the perspectives of 13 known
and respected practitioner/researchers.   Building on the premise that
literacy is complex and multi-faceted, the authors define the dominant
types of assessment tools, but shift the focus to the broader question
of assessment for whom and for what. They conclude by proposing a set of
seven key principles to guide effective accountability systems. Measures
of Success is made to order for the moment. 
 
Linda Shohet
Executive-Director, The Centre for Literacy
 
This book is packed with useful information!  It doesn't shy away from
the complexities and debates at the heart of this field.  Instead, it
brings them out of the shadows and makes them accessible to
practitioners and policy-makers alike.    
 
Nancy Jackson - University of Toronto
 
It is rare that we find a text that practices so well what it preaches.
In Measures of Success, Pat Campbell has brought together an
international group of educators and researchers who share a strong
commitment to the "multi-dimensional and changing nature of literacies."
This shared commitment is the starting point for nine wide-ranging
explorations of the theory and practice of assessment and
accountability. As these articles make clear, national accountability
systems have the power to drive enormous changes - for good and ill - in
the adult basic education delivery system, with serious consequences for
the adults who depend upon these programs to develop the skills they
need to accomplish their diverse goals and purposes. This is indeed a
critical contribution to the field at a time when accountability rules.
 
Dr. Sondra Stein 
National Director (retired) Equipped for the Future Initiative 
 
Measures of Success offers a clear-eyed and nuanced account of the
consequence-both positive and negative-of current assessment and
accountability practices in adult basic education. Authors and
perspectives from Canada, the U.S., the U.K., and Australia give this
book exceptional breadth of coverage. The need to expand available
assessment tools to better capture the complexity of literacy and
numeracy practices and to better reflect the diversity of adult
learners' goals is a consistent theme across all chapters. As the
chapters in this excellent book make clear, the tests we choose and the
ways we use them convey powerful messages about learning goals and
instructional priorities. As a whole, this book presents a compelling
case for fundamental changes in our thinking about what we test, how we
test it, and how we apply test results.
 
Regie Stites

Program Manager, Center for Educational Policy, SRI International

 
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Sep  7 16:38:21 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 16:38:21 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 916] Re: formative and summative assessment in ESOL
In-Reply-To: <004601c7efb8$037c30c0$975fdd48@DH89L251>
Message-ID: <074201c7f18f$08392a90$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Donna and everyone,
 
Thanks for your post - you've raised a whole bunch of interesting
questions and issues.  I see that a couple of other emails address parts
of your post, so I will focus instead on your comments involving
formative and summative assessment.  I would argue that we need both of
these types of assessment for different purposes, but I do believe that
formative assessment can really provide the practitioner (and student!!)
with some substantial immediate feedback in which they can both see
where the strengths and challenges lie (lay?).  
 
I wonder if you could use various classroom (formative) assessments that
are focused on ABE or ASE levels with ESOL students in order to
determine their readiness in certain areas.  Does anyone do this?
 
Also, Donna you said:  "Understanding assessment would allow ESOL
learners to work along side native English speakers with teaching and
learning being focused on the skills that need to be learned."  Were you
talking about the practitioner understanding assessment better, or the
ESOL student understanding it?  Both would be great!!  Does anyone
involve the ESOL student in assessment - do you do any self assessment
with students?  If so, what's it like?
 
Thanks!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
PS:  here are a few resources/articles on formative assessment:
 
Assessment Crisis: The Absence Of Assessment FOR Learning
https://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/k0206sti.htm
 
Assessment Resource Banks - New Zealand
http://arb.nzcer.org.nz/nzcer3/using.htm
 
Assessment Training Institute - ETS
ASSESSMENT FOR LEARNING: 
Formative Assessment That Can Improve Student Learning
http://www.assessmentinst.com/
 
Classroom Assessment Techniques: A Handbook for College Teachers, Second
Edition
http://www.josseybass.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-1555425003.html
 
The Concept of Formative Assessment
http://pareonline.net/getvn.asp?v=8
<http://pareonline.net/getvn.asp?v=8&n=9> &n=9
 
Formative assessment and the Assessment Resource Banks
http://arb.nzcer.org.nz/nzcer3/formative.htm
 
Improving Teaching and Learning for Adults with Basic Skill Needs
through Formative Assessment
CERI (Centre for Educational Research and Innovation)
http://www.oecd.org/edu/whatworks 

Inside the Black Box: Raising Standards Through Classroom Assessment
http://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/kbla9810.htm
 
NW Regional Educational Laboratory
Assessment Toolkit98
http://www.nwrel.org/assessment/toolkit98.php
 
A Primer: Diagnostic, Formative, & Summative Assessment
http://www.mmrwsjr.com/assessment.htm
 
The Value of Formative Assessment
http://www.fairtest.org/examarts/winter99/k-forma3.html
 
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Donna Chambers
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 8:27 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 908] Re: September welcome!
 
Marie and All,
 
Happy September!  I must admit that I have not read all the postings on
the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting has already
happened, please forgive me.  
 
I would like to suggest  a  discussion  designing a system that
efficiently moves  ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several
years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who
want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in
ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that would
allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth transition from
ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the learner
through a pipeline? 
 
This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of
professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.
These sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I
found everything relevant to adult learners as well.  Competency-based
assessment is my specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of
formative vs. summative assessment and how both guide instruction in the
classroom.  Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work
along side  native English speakers with teaching and learning being
focused on the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would
make a great discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.
 
Donna Chambers
 
From: Marie Cora <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>  
To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12 PM
Subject: [Assessment 906] September welcome!
 
Dear Colleagues,
 
Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have
been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If you
are new to the List, please introduce yourself and let us know why you
have subscribed to the Assessment Discussion List - what topics would
you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers - what is
on your minds these days?  What topics of interest would you like to see
discussed?  
 
I have in the works a couple of guest discussions that will take place
this fall - one focused on GED and another focused on using data in the
classroom as a follow up to our discussion last April on using data for
program improvement (see below for info on accessing this discussion in
the archives).  I would really like to have something focused on ESOL -
any suggestions?  I have a few ideas but want to hear from you.
 
For those of you who are new, let me share these List Tips, they can be
very helpful.  Also - new folks may want to scroll down to read the
information on using the Archives so that you can see what types of
discussions we have had in the past. 
 
Thanks so much - looking forward to hearing from you and having some
great discussions here!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
Discussion List Tips
Here are some suggestions for maximizing your experience as a List
Member, both in terms of getting the most out of the content, as well as
minimizing the time and effort involved in following the Discussion
List.  In addition to the tips below, you should always feel free to
contact me with any questions or concerns, or if you need help:
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
Posting to the List
Please include an email address in your signature line in at least your
first message so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry off-list
if they choose.
Please be sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of your
message; many subscribers follow discussion threads via the Subject
Line, and often, the message content shifts as people converse, but the
Subject Line remains the same from the first posted message.  This makes
it more difficult to follow discussion threads.  Please remember to
check the Subject Line info and change it to appropriately reflect your
message content, if needed.
Consider whether your reply is best suited to send to only one person or
the whole group.
Managing Your Subscription
Digest Format
This format allows subscribers to receive Discussion List messages
"bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line will not be
topic-specific, so any replies to digest format often mean the subject
line will need adjusting before replying. Also, subscribers using digest
format do not receive the information that was posted right away.
Because of that, this option may or may not suit everyone's needs.
>From the Assessment Discussion List page:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
Scroll down to Unsubscribe and other options at the bottom and enter
your subscription email address.  
This takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to unsubscribe or
to log in using your password. Log in. (There is a button you can click
to have your password emailed to you if you've forgotten it.)
Once you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest mode".
Click this to "on", then scroll down further and click "submit my
changes."
Use the archives
You do not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so if
you are interested in reading about certain topics, but don't want to be
a List Member, this option is open for you.  (See below for more
information on using the archives.)
Just hit delete!
This is when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic of
discussion just isn't up your alley, or you simply don't have the time
at the moment, the delete button is a good option.  No one is making you
be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all your choice!
Often subscribers say that they just can't hit delete for fear of
missing something, but remember that all posts get logged automatically
in the archives and so when you *do* have the time or when that topic
area *does* interest you, you can go back and search for those posts in
the archives.
Using the Archives
To read full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the
Assessment List Archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
The archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
In the right-hand toolbar:
Click on Search Archives; you can search just the Assessment archives or
all the List archives from here; search by thread, subject, or author.
Click on List Events to view information on upcoming, as well as past,
Discussion Topics.  
Click on List Help for the FAQ about using the Lists.
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 

  _____  

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Sep  7 16:45:35 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 16:45:35 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 917] Re: Being your own advocate
In-Reply-To: <825176.35684.qm@web54008.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <074701c7f190$0b47ada0$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Mary Jane,
 
Thanks so much for this.  It sounds like you have worked on this area
quite a bit.  I definitely see that once the ESOL student has entered an
ABE class, they certainly would need to keep up somewhat on their own
(or already be confident at that level) because some of their skills
would already be assumed in the regular ABE student.  
 
Mary Jane:  do you have ways that you gauge if the student is ready to
go to the ABE classroom?  Do you work with ESOL students on gauging
their own capabilities and then how to address any gaps?  In other
words, do you have strategies that you employ with your students that
ready them to be their own advocate in the higher level classroom?
 
Thanks,
Marie Cora
 
 
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Mary Jane Jerde
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2007 9:39 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 910] Re: September welcome!
 
This is a good on-going topic.

In my experience, ESL students either have the means to take the
advanced grammar and pronunciation courses, etc., or they are pressed to
get the diploma. If they can stay in school at all. 

In my experience, a transition class is an ideal. The reality has been
that I attempt to ground them in the basics of English especially
verbs,simple past and present, continuous, both kinds of future, a few
modals, negatives. Then I encourage them that when they enter an ABE or
similar class, they will still be responsible to maintain and develop
their grammar and other English skills. It will not be the teacher's job
to pour it into them or spend class time coaching them or having peer
coaching the way that we can in ESL class. They have to be their own
advocates on this. 

Mary Jane Jerde

Donna Chambers <donnaedp at cox.net> wrote:
Marie and All,
 
Happy September!  I must admit that I have not read all the postings on
the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting has already
happened, please forgive me.  
 
I would like to suggest  a  discussion  designing a system that
efficiently moves  ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several
years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who
want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in
ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that would
allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth transition from
ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the learner
through a pipeline? 
 
This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of
professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.
These sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I
found everything relevant to adult learners as well.  Competency-based
assessment is my specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of
formative vs. summative assessment and how both guide instruction in the
classroom.  Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work
along side  native English speakers with teaching and learning being
focused on the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would
make a great discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.
 
Donna Chambers
 
From: Marie Cora <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>  
To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12 PM
Subject: [Assessment 906] September welcome!
 
Dear Colleagues,
 
Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have
been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If you
are new to the List, please introduce yourself and let us know why you
have subscribed to the Assessment Discussion List - what topics would
you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers - what is
on your minds these days?  What topics of interest would you like to see
discussed?  
 
I have in the works a couple of guest discussions that will take place
this fall - one focused on GED and another focused on using data in the
classroom as a follow up to our discussion last April on using data for
program improvement (see below for info on accessing this discussion in
the archives).  I would really like to have something focused on ESOL -
any suggestions?  I have a few ideas but want to hear from you.
 
For those of you who are new, let me share these List Tips, they can be
very helpful.  Also - new folks may want to scroll down to read the
information on using the Archives so that you can see what types of
discussions we have had in the past. 
 
Thanks so much - looking forward to hearing from you and having some
great discussions here!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
Discussion List Tips
Here are some suggestions for maximizing your experience as a List
Member, both in terms of getting the most out of the content, as well as
minimizing the time and effort involved in following the Discussion
List.  In addition to the tips below, you should always feel free to
contact me with any questions or concerns, or if you need help:
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
Posting to the List
Please include an email address in your signature line in at least your
first message so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry off-list
if they choose.
Please be sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of your
message; many subscribers follow discussion threads via the Subject
Line, and often, the message content shifts as people converse, but the
Subject Line remains the same from the first posted message.  This makes
it more difficult to follow discussion threads.  Please remember to
check the Subject Line info and change it to appropriately reflect your
message content, if needed.
Consider whether your reply is best suited to send to only one person or
the whole group.
Managing Your Subscription
Digest Format
This format allows subscribers to receive Discussion List messages
"bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line will not be
topic-specific, so any replies to digest format often mean the subject
line will need adjusting before replying. Also, subscribers using digest
format do not receive the information that was posted right away.
Because of that, this option may or may not suit everyone's needs.
>From the Assessment Discussion List page:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
Scroll down to Unsubscribe and other options at the bottom and enter
your subscription email address.  
This takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to unsubscribe or
to log in using your password. Log in. (There is a button you can click
to have your password emailed to you if you've forgotten it.)
Once you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest mode".
Click this to "on", then scroll down further and click "submit my
changes."
Use the archives
You do not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so if
you are interested in reading about certain topics, but don't want to be
a List Member, this option is open for you.  (See below for more
information on using the archives.)
Just hit delete!
This is when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic of
discussion just isn't up your alley, or you simply don't have the time
at the moment, the delete button is a good option.  No one is making you
be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all your choice!
Often subscribers say that they just can't hit delete for fear of
missing something, but remember that all posts get logged automatically
in the archives and so when you *do* have the time or when that topic
area *does* interest you, you can go back and search for those posts in
the archives.
Using the Archives
To read full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the
Assessment List Archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
The archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
In the right-hand toolbar:
Click on Search Archives; you can search just the Assessment archives or
all the List archives from here; search by thread, subject, or author.
Click on List Events to view information on upcoming, as well as past,
Discussion Topics.  
Click on List Help for the FAQ about using the Lists.
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
 
 

  _____  

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to mjjerdems at yahoo.com
 
  
  _____  

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Sep  7 17:15:35 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 17:15:35 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 918] Re: Passing the Torch
In-Reply-To: <PEEILBMHBCKJIFLALLFDGEJDCGAA.forrest@crosslink.net>
Message-ID: <074c01c7f194$3c0876f0$0302a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi Forrest and Jodi - thank you so much for these resources.  I am aware
of Passing the Torch, but I have not had the pleasure of reading it
through.  I've read the executive summary, which is quite a thorough
overview.  Guess I'll read the whole report now!

I know that the paper is focused on Community College - would you say
that the information would be applicable in other venues, for example,
CBOs, volunteer organizations, and the like?

Also, the overview provides an incredibly rich array of approaches,
supports, techniques - indeed: innovative strategies for addressing this
complex issue (see:  #6. Improving Learning Gains in the executive
summary).  Do any of the strategies involve the student in assessment,
or do any strategies include student self-assessment?  (The section on
Learning Outside the Classroom prompts me to ask these questions.)

Finally, you note that computer-adaptive tests with voice recognition
software would enhance the paucity of assessments that appropriately
gauge the range of ESOL students' skills.  I'm intrigued:  would this
mostly be focused on the oral skills of the student then?  Do you feel
there are adequate assessments for writing and reading skills?  Can you
talk a bit more about this?

Thank you so much!

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of fchisman
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2007 5:58 PM
To: Jodi Crandall; The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 914] Re: September welcome!

The Yakima program and its outcomes are descriped in more detail in a
separate report on it by Pamela Ferguson et.al, also published on
www.caalusa.org.

Forrest Chisman

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2007 12:40 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 911] Re: September welcome!

I agree that transition classes are a good idea, but a program which
offers gradual transition to ABE may also be a good solution.  Yakima
Valley Community College has an integrated ESL/ABE program, with
students
in the upper levels of adult ESL taking first ABE math classes and then
ABE reading.  You can learn more about the program in a report that
Forrest Chisman and I did on promising practices in adult ESL in the
community college:
Passing the Torch
You can access the report online under Occasional Papers at
www.caalusa.org

I should note that we also identify one of the major barriers to
transition for adult English Language Learners is the lack of an
assessment system, with different tests used for exit from one program
and
entry to another.

Jodi Crandall

> This is a good on-going topic.
>
> In my experience, ESL students either have the means to take the
advanced
> grammar and pronunciation courses, etc., or they are pressed to get
the
> diploma. If they can stay in school at all.
>
> In my experience, a transition class is an ideal. The reality has been
> that I attempt to ground them in the basics of English especially
> verbs,simple past and present, continuous, both kinds of future, a few
> modals, negatives. Then I encourage them that when they enter an ABE
or
> similar class, they will still be responsible to maintain and develop
> their grammar and other English skills. It will not be the teacher's
job
> to pour it into them or spend class time coaching them or having peer
> coaching the way that we can in ESL class. They have to be their own
> advocates on this.
>
> Mary Jane Jerde
>
>
>
> Donna Chambers <donnaedp at cox.net> wrote:
>              Clean   Clean   DocumentEmail
> MicrosoftInternetExplorer4    st1\:* {  BEHAVIOR:
> url(#default#ieooui) }         /* Style Definitions */
> table.MsoNormalTable  {mso-style-name:"Table Normal";
> mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0;  mso-tstyle-colband-size:0;
> mso-style-noshow:yes;  mso-style-parent:"";
> mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt;  mso-para-margin:0in;
> mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt;  mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
>  font-size:10.0pt;  font-family:"Times New Roman";}   Marie
> and All,
>
>  Happy September!  I must admit that I have not  read all the postings
on
> the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting  has already
> happened, please forgive me.
>
>  I would like to suggest  a   discussion  designing a system that
> efficiently moves   ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several
> years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who
> want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in
> ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that  would
> allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth  transition
from
> ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the  learner
> through a pipeline?
>
>  This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of
> professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.
> These  sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I
> found everything  relevant to adult learners as well.
Competency-based
> assessment is my  specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of
> formative vs. summative  assessment and how both guide instruction in
the
> classroom.   Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to
work
> along side   native English speakers with teaching and learning being
> focused on  the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would
> make a great  discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.
>
>  Donna Chambers
>
>  From: Marie Cora
>     To: Assessment at nifl.gov
>    Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12    PM
>    Subject: [Assessment 906] September    welcome!
>
>
>       Dear    Colleagues,
>
>    Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who
have
>  been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If
you
> are new to the List, please    introduce yourself and let us know why
> you have subscribed to the Assessment    Discussion List - what topics
> would you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers -
> what is    on your minds these days?  What    topics of interest would
> you like to see discussed?
>
>    I have in the works a couple of    guest discussions that will take
> place this fall - one focused on GED and    another focused on using
> data in the classroom as a follow up to our    discussion last April
on
> using data for program improvement (see below for    info on accessing
> this discussion in the archives).  I would really like to have
> something    focused on ESOL - any suggestions?     I have a few ideas
> but want to hear from    you.
>
>    For those of you who are new, let    me share these List Tips, they
can
> be very helpful.  Also - new folks may want to scroll    down to read
> the information on using the Archives so that you can see what
types
> of discussions we have had in the past.
>
>    Thanks so much - looking forward    to hearing from you and having
some
> great discussions    here!
>
>    Marie    Cora
>    Assessment Discussion List    Moderator
>
>    Discussion    List Tips
>    Here are some suggestions    for maximizing your experience as a
List
> Member, both in terms of getting the    most out of the content, as
> well as minimizing the time and effort involved in    following the
> Discussion List.  In    addition to the tips below, you should always
> feel free to contact me with any    questions or concerns, or if you
> need help:  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>    Posting to the    List
>    Please    include an email address in your signature line in at
least
> your first message    so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry
> off-list if they    choose.
>    Please be    sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content
of
> your message; many    subscribers follow discussion threads via the
> Subject Line, and often, the    message content shifts as people
> converse, but the Subject Line remains the    same from the first
> posted message.     This makes it more difficult to follow discussion
> threads.  Please remember to check the Subject    Line info and change
> it to appropriately reflect your message content, if    needed.
>    Consider    whether your reply is best suited to send to only one
> person or the whole    group.
>    Managing Your    Subscription
>    Digest Format
>    This    format allows subscribers to receive    Discussion List
> messages    "bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line
> will not be topic-specific, so any replies to    digest format often
> mean the subject line will need adjusting before replying.    Also,
> subscribers using digest format do    not receive the information that
> was posted right away. Because of    that, this option may or may not
> suit everyone's needs.
>    From the    Assessment Discussion List    page:
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
>    Scroll    down to Unsubscribe and other    options at the bottom
and
> enter your subscription email    address.
>    This    takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to
> unsubscribe or to log in    using your password. Log in. (There is a
> button you can click to have your    password emailed to you if you've
> forgotten it.)
>    Once    you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest
> mode". Click this    to "on", then scroll down further and click
> "submit my    changes."
>    Use    the archives
>    You do    not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives,
so
> if you are    interested in reading about certain topics, but don't
> want to be a List    Member, this option is open for you.     (See
> below for more information on using the    archives.)
>    Just    hit delete!
>    This is    when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the
topic
> of discussion just isn't    up your alley, or you simply don't have
the
> time at the moment, the delete    button is a good option.  No one
> is making you be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all
> your choice!  Often subscribers say that they just    can't hit delete
> for fear of missing something, but remember that all posts    get
> logged automatically in the archives and so when you *do* have the
time
> or    when that topic area *does* interest you, you can go back and
> search for those    posts in the archives.
>    Using    the Archives
>    To read    full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit
the
> Assessment List    Archives at:
>    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
>    The    archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
>    In the    right-hand toolbar:
>    Click on    Search    Archives; you can search just the Assessment
> archives or all the    List archives from here; search by thread,
> subject, or    author.
>    Click on    List Events    to view information on upcoming, as well
as
> past, Discussion Topics.
>    Click on    List Help    for the FAQ about using the Lists.
>
>
>    Marie    Cora
>    marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>    NIFL Assessment    Discussion List Moderator
>    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>    Coordinator,    LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>    http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for    Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe    or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to    donnaedp at cox.net
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to mjjerdems at yahoo.com
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to crandall at umbc.edu
>

--
JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Professor, Education Department
Director, Ph.D. Program in Language, Literacy & Culture
Coordinator, Peace Corps Master's International Program in
ESOL/Bilingual
Education
University of Maryland, Baltimore County (UMBC)
1000 Hilltop Circle, Baltimore, MD 21250
ph:    410-455-2313/2376  fax:   410-455-8947/1880
email: crandall at umbc.edu
www.umbc.edu/llc/
www.umbc.edu/esol/
www.umbc.edu/esol/peacecorps.html

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to forrest at crosslink.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

From forrest at crosslink.net  Fri Sep  7 22:40:14 2007
From: forrest at crosslink.net (fchisman)
Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 22:40:14 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 919] Re: Passing the Torch
In-Reply-To: <074c01c7f194$3c0876f0$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <PEEILBMHBCKJIFLALLFDGEJNCGAA.forrest@crosslink.net>

Marie,

We don't have any empirical evidence about the applicability of these
findings outside community colleges, but I see no reason why most of they
should NOT be suitable for Board of Education programs and the more
professionalized CBO's. I dobt, however, that thnly they are suitable to
CBO's that rely primarily on volunteer tutoring.

I think there is an element of student-self assessment in some of the
"outside the classroom" strategies -- but not in the sense that the term
"self-asessment" usually employed. I have nothing against it. We just didn't
find it.

No, we're interested in cost/effective (and time/effective) ways to measure
all four skills. The idea about computer-adaptive tests was just a stab in
the dark. As of now, there is no good, quick, inexpensive way to measure all
four skills.

Forrest

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Marie Cora
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2007 5:16 PM
To: 'The Assessment Discussion List'
Subject: [Assessment 918] Re: Passing the Torch

Hi Forrest and Jodi - thank you so much for these resources.  I am aware
of Passing the Torch, but I have not had the pleasure of reading it
through.  I've read the executive summary, which is quite a thorough
overview.  Guess I'll read the whole report now!

I know that the paper is focused on Community College - would you say
that the information would be applicable in other venues, for example,
CBOs, volunteer organizations, and the like?

Also, the overview provides an incredibly rich array of approaches,
supports, techniques - indeed: innovative strategies for addressing this
complex issue (see:  #6. Improving Learning Gains in the executive
summary).  Do any of the strategies involve the student in assessment,
or do any strategies include student self-assessment?  (The section on
Learning Outside the Classroom prompts me to ask these questions.)

Finally, you note that computer-adaptive tests with voice recognition
software would enhance the paucity of assessments that appropriately
gauge the range of ESOL students' skills.  I'm intrigued:  would this
mostly be focused on the oral skills of the student then?  Do you feel
there are adequate assessments for writing and reading skills?  Can you
talk a bit more about this?

Thank you so much!

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of fchisman
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2007 5:58 PM
To: Jodi Crandall; The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 914] Re: September welcome!

The Yakima program and its outcomes are descriped in more detail in a
separate report on it by Pamela Ferguson et.al, also published on
www.caalusa.org.

Forrest Chisman

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2007 12:40 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 911] Re: September welcome!

I agree that transition classes are a good idea, but a program which
offers gradual transition to ABE may also be a good solution.  Yakima
Valley Community College has an integrated ESL/ABE program, with
students
in the upper levels of adult ESL taking first ABE math classes and then
ABE reading.  You can learn more about the program in a report that
Forrest Chisman and I did on promising practices in adult ESL in the
community college:
Passing the Torch
You can access the report online under Occasional Papers at
www.caalusa.org

I should note that we also identify one of the major barriers to
transition for adult English Language Learners is the lack of an
assessment system, with different tests used for exit from one program
and
entry to another.

Jodi Crandall

> This is a good on-going topic.
>
> In my experience, ESL students either have the means to take the
advanced
> grammar and pronunciation courses, etc., or they are pressed to get
the
> diploma. If they can stay in school at all.
>
> In my experience, a transition class is an ideal. The reality has been
> that I attempt to ground them in the basics of English especially
> verbs,simple past and present, continuous, both kinds of future, a few
> modals, negatives. Then I encourage them that when they enter an ABE
or
> similar class, they will still be responsible to maintain and develop
> their grammar and other English skills. It will not be the teacher's
job
> to pour it into them or spend class time coaching them or having peer
> coaching the way that we can in ESL class. They have to be their own
> advocates on this.
>
> Mary Jane Jerde
>
>
>
> Donna Chambers <donnaedp at cox.net> wrote:
>              Clean   Clean   DocumentEmail
> MicrosoftInternetExplorer4    st1\:* {  BEHAVIOR:
> url(#default#ieooui) }         /* Style Definitions */
> table.MsoNormalTable  {mso-style-name:"Table Normal";
> mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0;  mso-tstyle-colband-size:0;
> mso-style-noshow:yes;  mso-style-parent:"";
> mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt;  mso-para-margin:0in;
> mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt;  mso-pagination:widow-orphan;
>  font-size:10.0pt;  font-family:"Times New Roman";}   Marie
> and All,
>
>  Happy September!  I must admit that I have not  read all the postings
on
> the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting  has already
> happened, please forgive me.
>
>  I would like to suggest  a   discussion  designing a system that
> efficiently moves   ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several
> years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who
> want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in
> ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that  would
> allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth  transition
from
> ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the  learner
> through a pipeline?
>
>  This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of
> professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.
> These  sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I
> found everything  relevant to adult learners as well.
Competency-based
> assessment is my  specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of
> formative vs. summative  assessment and how both guide instruction in
the
> classroom.   Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to
work
> along side   native English speakers with teaching and learning being
> focused on  the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would
> make a great  discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.
>
>  Donna Chambers
>
>  From: Marie Cora
>     To: Assessment at nifl.gov
>    Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12    PM
>    Subject: [Assessment 906] September    welcome!
>
>
>       Dear    Colleagues,
>
>    Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who
have
>  been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If
you
> are new to the List, please    introduce yourself and let us know why
> you have subscribed to the Assessment    Discussion List - what topics
> would you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers -
> what is    on your minds these days?  What    topics of interest would
> you like to see discussed?
>
>    I have in the works a couple of    guest discussions that will take
> place this fall - one focused on GED and    another focused on using
> data in the classroom as a follow up to our    discussion last April
on
> using data for program improvement (see below for    info on accessing
> this discussion in the archives).  I would really like to have
> something    focused on ESOL - any suggestions?     I have a few ideas
> but want to hear from    you.
>
>    For those of you who are new, let    me share these List Tips, they
can
> be very helpful.  Also - new folks may want to scroll    down to read
> the information on using the Archives so that you can see what
types
> of discussions we have had in the past.
>
>    Thanks so much - looking forward    to hearing from you and having
some
> great discussions    here!
>
>    Marie    Cora
>    Assessment Discussion List    Moderator
>
>    Discussion    List Tips
>    Here are some suggestions    for maximizing your experience as a
List
> Member, both in terms of getting the    most out of the content, as
> well as minimizing the time and effort involved in    following the
> Discussion List.  In    addition to the tips below, you should always
> feel free to contact me with any    questions or concerns, or if you
> need help:  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>    Posting to the    List
>    Please    include an email address in your signature line in at
least
> your first message    so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry
> off-list if they    choose.
>    Please be    sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content
of
> your message; many    subscribers follow discussion threads via the
> Subject Line, and often, the    message content shifts as people
> converse, but the Subject Line remains the    same from the first
> posted message.     This makes it more difficult to follow discussion
> threads.  Please remember to check the Subject    Line info and change
> it to appropriately reflect your message content, if    needed.
>    Consider    whether your reply is best suited to send to only one
> person or the whole    group.
>    Managing Your    Subscription
>    Digest Format
>    This    format allows subscribers to receive    Discussion List
> messages    "bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line
> will not be topic-specific, so any replies to    digest format often
> mean the subject line will need adjusting before replying.    Also,
> subscribers using digest format do    not receive the information that
> was posted right away. Because of    that, this option may or may not
> suit everyone's needs.
>    From the    Assessment Discussion List    page:
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
>    Scroll    down to Unsubscribe and other    options at the bottom
and
> enter your subscription email    address.
>    This    takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to
> unsubscribe or to log in    using your password. Log in. (There is a
> button you can click to have your    password emailed to you if you've
> forgotten it.)
>    Once    you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest
> mode". Click this    to "on", then scroll down further and click
> "submit my    changes."
>    Use    the archives
>    You do    not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives,
so
> if you are    interested in reading about certain topics, but don't
> want to be a List    Member, this option is open for you.     (See
> below for more information on using the    archives.)
>    Just    hit delete!
>    This is    when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the
topic
> of discussion just isn't    up your alley, or you simply don't have
the
> time at the moment, the delete    button is a good option.  No one
> is making you be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all
> your choice!  Often subscribers say that they just    can't hit delete
> for fear of missing something, but remember that all posts    get
> logged automatically in the archives and so when you *do* have the
time
> or    when that topic area *does* interest you, you can go back and
> search for those    posts in the archives.
>    Using    the Archives
>    To read    full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit
the
> Assessment List    Archives at:
>    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
>    The    archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
>    In the    right-hand toolbar:
>    Click on    Search    Archives; you can search just the Assessment
> archives or all the    List archives from here; search by thread,
> subject, or    author.
>    Click on    List Events    to view information on upcoming, as well
as
> past, Discussion Topics.
>    Click on    List Help    for the FAQ about using the Lists.
>
>
>    Marie    Cora
>    marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>    NIFL Assessment    Discussion List Moderator
>    http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>    Coordinator,    LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>    http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for    Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe    or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to    donnaedp at cox.net
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to mjjerdems at yahoo.com
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to crandall at umbc.edu
>

--
JoAnn (Jodi) Crandall
Professor, Education Department
Director, Ph.D. Program in Language, Literacy & Culture
Coordinator, Peace Corps Master's International Program in
ESOL/Bilingual
Education
University of Maryland, Baltimore County (UMBC)
1000 Hilltop Circle, Baltimore, MD 21250
ph:    410-455-2313/2376  fax:   410-455-8947/1880
email: crandall at umbc.edu
www.umbc.edu/llc/
www.umbc.edu/esol/
www.umbc.edu/esol/peacecorps.html

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to forrest at crosslink.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

-------------------------------
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Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to forrest at crosslink.net

From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Sat Sep  8 10:43:21 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 10:43:21 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 920]  Commission Releases Family Literacy Paper
Message-ID: <956F50A8-B74B-4C11-9BF9-74A956337A13@caalusa.org>

September 8, 2007, New York, NY -- The National Commission on Adult  
Literacy has released a new paper, this one by Tony Peyton of the  
National Center for Family Literacy. Titled FAMILY LITERACY IN ADULT  
EDUCATION: The Federal and State Support Role, this special  
perspectives paper (15 pages) was prepared for the August 20 meeting  
of the Commission. The paper contains an Executive Summary and four  
major sections: (1) Making the Case: Why Provide Family Literacy  
Services; (2) Federal Support for Family Literacy; (3) Examples of  
State Family Literacy Initiatives; and (4) Issues & Recommendations.  
Among the five recommendations made by the author is that serious  
national and state attention should be given to the collection of  
comparable data about family literacy services, program types,  
funding, legislative provisions, and enrollments across the states,  
as well as research to fully demonstrate program outcomes. The paper  
is available at http://www.nationalcommissiononadultliteracy.org/ 
pandp.html.

Gail Spangenberg
President
Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Fl
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2362, F: 212-512-2610
www.caalusa.org

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From donnaedp at cox.net  Sat Sep  8 14:59:44 2007
From: donnaedp at cox.net (donnaedp at cox.net)
Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2007 14:59:44 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 921] Re: formative and summative assessment in ESOL
Message-ID: <24233900.1189277984533.JavaMail.root@eastrmwml25.mgt.cox.net>

JMarie and All,

There is no argument. We need both formative and summative assessment, but for different purposes. It is important for both practitioners and students to understand the purpose for and the distinction between both.  Formative assessment is one of the most effective tools we have to inform instruction in the classroom. It allows us to pace and modifiy currriculum as we move students along on their learning journey.  On the other hand, summative assessment is necessary to determine readiness to move along to the next level of instruction or credentialing. Donna.  

 
---- Marie Cora <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote: 
> Hi Donna and everyone,
>  
> Thanks for your post - you've raised a whole bunch of interesting
> questions and issues.  I see that a couple of other emails address parts
> of your post, so I will focus instead on your comments involving
> formative and summative assessment.  I would argue that we need both of
> these types of assessment for different purposes, but I do believe that
> formative assessment can really provide the practitioner (and student!!)
> with some substantial immediate feedback in which they can both see
> where the strengths and challenges lie (lay?).  
>  
> I wonder if you could use various classroom (formative) assessments that
> are focused on ABE or ASE levels with ESOL students in order to
> determine their readiness in certain areas.  Does anyone do this?
>  
> Also, Donna you said:  "Understanding assessment would allow ESOL
> learners to work along side native English speakers with teaching and
> learning being focused on the skills that need to be learned."  Were you
> talking about the practitioner understanding assessment better, or the
> ESOL student understanding it?  Both would be great!!  Does anyone
> involve the ESOL student in assessment - do you do any self assessment
> with students?  If so, what's it like?
>  
> Thanks!
>  
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  
> PS:  here are a few resources/articles on formative assessment:
>  
> Assessment Crisis: The Absence Of Assessment FOR Learning
> https://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/k0206sti.htm
>  
> Assessment Resource Banks - New Zealand
> http://arb.nzcer.org.nz/nzcer3/using.htm
>  
> Assessment Training Institute - ETS
> ASSESSMENT FOR LEARNING: 
> Formative Assessment That Can Improve Student Learning
> http://www.assessmentinst.com/
>  
> Classroom Assessment Techniques: A Handbook for College Teachers, Second
> Edition
> http://www.josseybass.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-1555425003.html
>  
> The Concept of Formative Assessment
> http://pareonline.net/getvn.asp?v=8
> <http://pareonline.net/getvn.asp?v=8&n=9> &n=9
>  
> Formative assessment and the Assessment Resource Banks
> http://arb.nzcer.org.nz/nzcer3/formative.htm
>  
> Improving Teaching and Learning for Adults with Basic Skill Needs
> through Formative Assessment
> CERI (Centre for Educational Research and Innovation)
> http://www.oecd.org/edu/whatworks 
> 
> 
> Inside the Black Box: Raising Standards Through Classroom Assessment
> http://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/kbla9810.htm
>  
> NW Regional Educational Laboratory
> Assessment Toolkit98
> http://www.nwrel.org/assessment/toolkit98.php
>  
> A Primer: Diagnostic, Formative, & Summative Assessment
> http://www.mmrwsjr.com/assessment.htm
>  
> The Value of Formative Assessment
> http://www.fairtest.org/examarts/winter99/k-forma3.html
>  
>  
>  
>  
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> On Behalf Of Donna Chambers
> Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 8:27 AM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 908] Re: September welcome!
>  
> Marie and All,
>  
> Happy September!  I must admit that I have not read all the postings on
> the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting has already
> happened, please forgive me.  
>  
> I would like to suggest  a  discussion  designing a system that
> efficiently moves  ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several
> years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who
> want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in
> ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that would
> allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth transition from
> ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the learner
> through a pipeline? 
>  
> This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of
> professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.
> These sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I
> found everything relevant to adult learners as well.  Competency-based
> assessment is my specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of
> formative vs. summative assessment and how both guide instruction in the
> classroom.  Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work
> along side  native English speakers with teaching and learning being
> focused on the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would
> make a great discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.
>  
> Donna Chambers
>  
> From: Marie Cora <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>  
> To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
> Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12 PM
> Subject: [Assessment 906] September welcome!
>  
> Dear Colleagues,
>  
> Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have
> been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If you
> are new to the List, please introduce yourself and let us know why you
> have subscribed to the Assessment Discussion List - what topics would
> you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers - what is
> on your minds these days?  What topics of interest would you like to see
> discussed?  
>  
> I have in the works a couple of guest discussions that will take place
> this fall - one focused on GED and another focused on using data in the
> classroom as a follow up to our discussion last April on using data for
> program improvement (see below for info on accessing this discussion in
> the archives).  I would really like to have something focused on ESOL -
> any suggestions?  I have a few ideas but want to hear from you.
>  
> For those of you who are new, let me share these List Tips, they can be
> very helpful.  Also - new folks may want to scroll down to read the
> information on using the Archives so that you can see what types of
> discussions we have had in the past. 
>  
> Thanks so much - looking forward to hearing from you and having some
> great discussions here!
>  
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  
> Discussion List Tips
> Here are some suggestions for maximizing your experience as a List
> Member, both in terms of getting the most out of the content, as well as
> minimizing the time and effort involved in following the Discussion
> List.  In addition to the tips below, you should always feel free to
> contact me with any questions or concerns, or if you need help:
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> Posting to the List
> Please include an email address in your signature line in at least your
> first message so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry off-list
> if they choose.
> Please be sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of your
> message; many subscribers follow discussion threads via the Subject
> Line, and often, the message content shifts as people converse, but the
> Subject Line remains the same from the first posted message.  This makes
> it more difficult to follow discussion threads.  Please remember to
> check the Subject Line info and change it to appropriately reflect your
> message content, if needed.
> Consider whether your reply is best suited to send to only one person or
> the whole group.
> Managing Your Subscription
> Digest Format
> This format allows subscribers to receive Discussion List messages
> "bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line will not be
> topic-specific, so any replies to digest format often mean the subject
> line will need adjusting before replying. Also, subscribers using digest
> format do not receive the information that was posted right away.
> Because of that, this option may or may not suit everyone's needs.
> >From the Assessment Discussion List page:
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
> Scroll down to Unsubscribe and other options at the bottom and enter
> your subscription email address.  
> This takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to unsubscribe or
> to log in using your password. Log in. (There is a button you can click
> to have your password emailed to you if you've forgotten it.)
> Once you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest mode".
> Click this to "on", then scroll down further and click "submit my
> changes."
> Use the archives
> You do not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so if
> you are interested in reading about certain topics, but don't want to be
> a List Member, this option is open for you.  (See below for more
> information on using the archives.)
> Just hit delete!
> This is when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic of
> discussion just isn't up your alley, or you simply don't have the time
> at the moment, the delete button is a good option.  No one is making you
> be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all your choice!
> Often subscribers say that they just can't hit delete for fear of
> missing something, but remember that all posts get logged automatically
> in the archives and so when you *do* have the time or when that topic
> area *does* interest you, you can go back and search for those posts in
> the archives.
> Using the Archives
> To read full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the
> Assessment List Archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
> The archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
> In the right-hand toolbar:
> Click on Search Archives; you can search just the Assessment archives or
> all the List archives from here; search by thread, subject, or author.
> Click on List Events to view information on upcoming, as well as past,
> Discussion Topics.  
> Click on List Help for the FAQ about using the Lists.
>  
>  
> Marie Cora
>  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>  
>  
> 
>   _____  
> 
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net

From teacherwendyq at gmail.com  Mon Sep 10 09:03:19 2007
From: teacherwendyq at gmail.com (Wendy Quinones)
Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2007 09:03:19 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 922] Re: formative and summative assessment in ESOL
In-Reply-To: <074201c7f18f$08392a90$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <004601c7efb8$037c30c0$975fdd48@DH89L251>
	<074201c7f18f$08392a90$0302a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <ad2cc1ef0709100603y7f0457c8v431d3b8c1f737044@mail.gmail.com>

Hello all,
At the Community Learning Center in Cabmridge MA, I teach ABE at the level
where most of our ESOL learners enter the ABE side.  Transition has been a
thorny issue for us, as you can imagine.  We decided to try a formal
transition class; it worked well for the first year, but since then there
hasn't been a large enough group of students whom we felt would benefit
from this kind of class.  We've tried informally giving the TABE to ESOL
students who wanted to move into ABE, and that was certainly a wake-up for
the ESOL teachers because few earned the scores that we expect of ABE
learners at this level.  We're still working on it!

Wendy Quinones

On 9/7/07, Marie Cora <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:
>
>  Hi Donna and everyone,
>
>
>
> Thanks for your post ? you've raised a whole bunch of interesting
> questions and issues.  I see that a couple of other emails address parts
> of your post, so I will focus instead on your comments involving formative
> and summative assessment.  I would argue that we need both of these types
> of assessment for different purposes, but I do believe that formative
> assessment can really provide the practitioner (and student!!) with some
> substantial immediate feedback in which they can both see where the
> strengths and challenges lie (lay?).
>
>
>
> I wonder if you could use various classroom (formative) assessments that
> are focused on ABE or ASE levels with ESOL students in order to determine
> their readiness in certain areas.  Does anyone do this?
>
>
>
> Also, Donna you said:  "Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners
> to work along side native English speakers with teaching and learning being
> focused on the skills that need to be learned."  Were you talking about
> the practitioner understanding assessment better, or the ESOL student
> understanding it?  Both would be great!!  Does anyone involve the ESOL
> student in assessment ? do you do any self assessment with students?  If
> so, what's it like?
>
>
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
> PS:  here are a few resources/articles on formative assessment:
>
>
>
> Assessment Crisis: The Absence Of Assessment FOR Learning
>
> https://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/k0206sti.htm
>
>
>
> Assessment Resource Banks ? New Zealand
>
> http://arb.nzcer.org.nz/nzcer3/using.htm
>
>
>
> Assessment Training Institute ? ETS
>
> ASSESSMENT FOR LEARNING:
> Formative Assessment That Can Improve Student Learning
>
> http://www.assessmentinst.com/
>
>
>
> Classroom Assessment Techniques: A Handbook for College Teachers, Second
> Edition
>
> http://www.josseybass.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-1555425003.html
>
>
>
> The Concept of Formative Assessment
>
> http://pareonline.net/getvn.asp?v=8&n=9
>
>
>
> Formative assessment and the Assessment Resource Banks
>
> http://arb.nzcer.org.nz/nzcer3/formative.htm
>
>
>
> Improving Teaching and Learning for Adults with Basic Skill Needs through
> Formative Assessment
>
> CERI (Centre for Educational Research and Innovation)
>
> http://www.oecd.org/edu/whatworks
>
> Inside the Black Box: Raising Standards Through Classroom Assessment
>
> http://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/kbla9810.htm
>
>
>
> NW Regional Educational Laboratory
>
> Assessment Toolkit98
>
> http://www.nwrel.org/assessment/toolkit98.php
>
>
>
> A Primer: Diagnostic, Formative, & Summative Assessment
>
> http://www.mmrwsjr.com/assessment.htm
>
>
>
> The Value of Formative Assessment
>
> http://www.fairtest.org/examarts/winter99/k-forma3.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] *On
> Behalf Of *Donna Chambers
> *Sent:* Wednesday, September 05, 2007 8:27 AM
> *To:* The Assessment Discussion List
> *Subject:* [Assessment 908] Re: September welcome!
>
>
>
> Marie and All,
>
>
>
> Happy September!  I must admit that I have not read all the postings on
> the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting has already happened,
> please forgive me.
>
>
>
> I would like to suggest  a  discussion  designing a system that
> efficiently moves  ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several years
> now my experience has been with non-native English learners who want to
> receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in ESOL classes
> that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that would allow them to move
> ahead.   How can we make the smooth transition from ESOL to ABE and how can
> we in Adult Education facilitate the learner through a pipeline?
>
>
>
> This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of
> professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.  These
> sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I found
> everything relevant to adult learners as well.  Competency-based assessment
> is my specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of formative vs. summative
> assessment and how both guide instruction in the classroom.
> Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work along side
> native English speakers with teaching and learning being focused on
> the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would make a great
> discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help.
>
>
>
> Donna Chambers
>
>
>
> *From:* Marie Cora <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
>
>  *To:* Assessment at nifl.gov
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, September 04, 2007 2:12 PM
>
> *Subject:* [Assessment 906] September welcome!
>
>
>
> Dear Colleagues,
>
>
>
> Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have been
> here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.  If you are new
> to the List, please introduce yourself and let us know why you have
> subscribed to the Assessment Discussion List ? what topics would you like to
> see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers ? what is on your minds
> these days?  What topics of interest would you like to see discussed?
>
>
>
> I have in the works a couple of guest discussions that will take place
> this fall ? one focused on GED and another focused on using data in the
> classroom as a follow up to our discussion last April on using data for
> program improvement (see below for info on accessing this discussion in the
> archives).  I would really like to have something focused on ESOL ? any
> suggestions?  I have a few ideas but want to hear from you.
>
>
>
> For those of you who are new, let me share these List Tips, they can be
> very helpful.  Also ? new folks may want to scroll down to read the
> information on using the Archives so that you can see what types of
> discussions we have had in the past.
>
>
>
> Thanks so much ? looking forward to hearing from you and having some great
> discussions here!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
> *Discussion List Tips*
>
> Here are some suggestions for maximizing your experience as a List Member,
> both in terms of getting the most out of the content, as well as minimizing
> the time and effort involved in following the Discussion List.  In
> addition to the tips below, you should always feel free to contact me with
> any questions or concerns, or if you need help:
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> *Posting to the List***
>
> Please include an email address in your signature line in at least your
> first message so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry off-list if
> they choose.
>
> Please be sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of your
> message; many subscribers follow discussion threads via the Subject Line,
> and often, the message content shifts as people converse, but the Subject
> Line remains the same from the first posted message.  This makes it more
> difficult to follow discussion threads.  Please remember to check the
> Subject Line info and change it to appropriately reflect your message
> content, if needed.
>
> Consider whether your reply is best suited to send to only one person or
> the whole group.
>
> *Managing Your Subscription***
>
> *Di**gest Format*
>
> This format allows subscribers to receive Discussion List messages
> "bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line will* not* be
> topic-specific, so any replies to digest format often mean the subject line
> will need adjusting before replying. Also, subscribers using digest format
> * do not* receive the information that was posted right away. Because of
> that, this option may or may not suit everyone's needs.
>
> From the Assessment Discussion List page:
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
>
> Scroll down to *Unsubscribe and other options* at the bottom and enter
> your subscription email address.
>
> This takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to unsubscribe or
> to log in using your password. Log in. (There is a button you can click to
> have your password emailed to you if you've forgotten it.)
>
> Once you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest mode".
> Click this to "on", then scroll down further and click "submit my changes."
>
> *Use the archives*
>
> You do not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so if you
> are interested in reading about certain topics, but don't want to be a List
> Member, this option is open for you.  (See below for more information on
> using the archives.)
>
> *Just hit delete!*
>
> This is when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic of
> discussion just isn't up your alley, or you simply don't have the time at
> the moment, the delete button is a good option.  No one is making you be a
> subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all your choice!  Often
> subscribers say that they just can't hit delete for fear of missing
> something, but remember that all posts get logged automatically in the
> archives and so when you *do* have the time or when that topic area *does*
> interest you, you can go back and search for those posts in the archives.
>
> *Using the Archives*
>
> To read full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the
> Assessment List Archives at:
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
>
> The archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
>
> In the right-hand toolbar:
>
> Click on *Search Archives*; you can search just the Assessment archives or
> all the List archives from here; search by thread, subject, or author.
>
> Click on *List Events* to view information on upcoming, as well as past,
> Discussion Topics.
>
> Click on *List Help* for the FAQ about using the Lists.
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
> Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
>
> http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
>
>
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to teacherwendyq at gmail.com
>
>
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From mjjerdems at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 11 07:01:59 2007
From: mjjerdems at yahoo.com (Mary Jane Jerde)
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2007 04:01:59 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 923] Re: formative and summative assessment in ESOL
In-Reply-To: <ad2cc1ef0709100603y7f0457c8v431d3b8c1f737044@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <708467.2171.qm@web54010.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Hello, 

The comment about self-assessment below is interesting. I've done simple self-assessments of ESL students, how well you can you speak in English at the store kind of thing. Some students are pretty well tuned in to where their English fluency is. Others have too rosy a view of themselves, in my view. 

I've taught in Even Start for several years. One good part of that program was watching the students leave my ESL class and join the ABE/GED class. The reports back from these students did a great job of opening up the ESL students' eyes. They were not formal reports. It just happened naturally during breaks we shared. 

For other programs some discussions like this may need to be set up as a class exchange or visit. Or advancing ESL students might visit the ABE class during their expected last class in ESL.

The same could be said for ESL and ABE teachers to visit or exchange classes even for a half hour project. One day the Adult Ed director in my program filled in for me. She taught the pre-literacy ESL class. This was truly an extreme example and not what I intend for a bridging exercise, but she did learn a lot about the students. 

Mary Jane

Wendy Quinones <teacherwendyq at gmail.com> wrote: Hello all,
 At the Community Learning Center in Cabmridge MA, I teach ABE at the level where most of our ESOL learners enter the ABE side.  Transition has been a thorny issue for us, as you can imagine.  We decided to try a formal transition class; it worked well for the first year, but since then there hasn't been a large enough group of students whom we felt would benefit from this kind of class.  We've tried informally giving the TABE to ESOL students who wanted to move into ABE, and that was certainly a wake-up for the ESOL teachers because few earned the scores that we expect of ABE learners at this level.  We're still working on it! 
  
 Wendy Quinones
 
 On 9/7/07, Marie Cora <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:    Hi Donna and everyone,
  
 Thanks for your post ? you've raised a whole bunch of interesting questions and issues.  I see that a couple of other emails address parts of your post, so I will focus instead on your comments involving formative and summative assessment.   I would argue that we need both of these types of assessment for different purposes, but I do believe that formative assessment can really provide the practitioner (and student!!) with some substantial immediate feedback in which they can both see where the strengths and challenges lie (lay?).   
  
 I wonder if you could use various classroom (formative) assessments that are focused on ABE or ASE levels with ESOL students in order to determine their readiness in certain areas.   Does anyone do this?
  
 Also, Donna you said:  "Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work along side native English speakers with teaching and learning being focused on the skills that need to be learned."   Were you talking about the practitioner understanding assessment better, or the ESOL student understanding it?  Both would be great!!   Does anyone involve the ESOL student in assessment ? do you do any self assessment with students?  If so, what's it like?
  
 Thanks!
  
 Marie Cora
 Assessment Discussion List Moderator
  
 PS:  here are a few resources/articles on formative assessment:
  
 Assessment Crisis: The Absence Of Assessment FOR Learning
 https://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/k0206sti.htm 
  
 Assessment Resource Banks ? New Zealand
 http://arb.nzcer.org.nz/nzcer3/using.htm 
  
 Assessment Training Institute ? ETS
 ASSESSMENT FOR LEARNING: 
Formative Assessment That Can Improve Student Learning
 http://www.assessmentinst.com/ 
  
 Classroom Assessment Techniques: A Handbook for College Teachers, Second Edition
  http://www.josseybass.com/WileyCDA/WileyTitle/productCd-1555425003.html
  
 The Concept of Formative Assessment
 http://pareonline.net/getvn.asp?v=8&n=9 
  
 Formative assessment and the Assessment Resource Banks
 http://arb.nzcer.org.nz/nzcer3/formative.htm 
  
 Improving Teaching and Learning for Adults with Basic Skill Needs through Formative Assessment
 CERI (Centre for Educational Research and Innovation)
 http://www.oecd.org/edu/whatworks  

 Inside the Black Box: Raising Standards Through Classroom Assessment
 http://www.pdkintl.org/kappan/kbla9810.htm 
  
 NW Regional Educational Laboratory
 Assessment Toolkit98
 http://www.nwrel.org/assessment/toolkit98.php 
  
 A Primer: Diagnostic, Formative, & Summative Assessment
 http://www.mmrwsjr.com/assessment.htm 
  
 The Value of Formative Assessment
 http://www.fairtest.org/examarts/winter99/k-forma3.html 
  
  
  
  
 -----Original Message-----
From:  assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]  On Behalf Of Donna Chambers
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2007  8:27 AM 
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 908] Re: September welcome! 
  
  Marie and All,

   

  Happy September!  I must admit that I have not read all the postings on the listserv and so if the discussion I am suggesting has already happened, please forgive me.   

   

  I would like to suggest  a  discussion  designing a system that efficiently moves  ESOL learners through to  ABE and ASE. For several years now my experience has been with non-native English learners who want to receive their high school diploma or GED. They get "stuck"  in ESOL classes that do not provide an integrated  curriculum that would allow them to move ahead.   How can we make the smooth transition from ESOL to ABE and how can we in Adult Education facilitate the learner through a pipeline?  

   

  This summer I had the wonderful opportunity to attend  a number of professional development summer sessions that focused on assessment.  These sessions were offered to K12 teachers and administrators, but I found everything relevant to adult learners as well.  Competency-based assessment is my specialty, but I was introduced to the idea of formative vs. summative assessment and how both guide instruction in the classroom.  Understanding assessment would allow ESOL learners to work along side  native English speakers with teaching and learning being focused on the skills that need to be learned.  I believe this would make a great discussion topic.  Let me know if I can help. 

   

  Donna Chambers

   

  From:  Marie Cora 

    To:  Assessment at nifl.gov 

  Sent:  Tuesday, September 04, 2007  2:12 PM

  Subject:  [Assessment 906] September welcome!

   

 Dear Colleagues,
  
 Hello!  Welcome to September!  Welcome to those List Members who have been here for a while, and welcome to new subscribers as well.   If you are new to the List, please introduce yourself and let us know why you have subscribed to the Assessment Discussion List ? what topics would you like to see focused on here?  And to veteran subscribers ? what is on your minds these days?   What topics of interest would you like to see discussed?  
  
 I have in the works a couple of guest discussions that will take place this fall ? one focused on GED and another focused on using data in the classroom as a follow up to our discussion last April on using data for program improvement (see below for info on accessing this discussion in the archives).   I would really like to have something focused on ESOL ? any suggestions?  I have a few ideas but want to hear from you.
  
 For those of you who are new, let me share these List Tips, they can be very helpful.  Also ? new folks may want to scroll down to read the information on using the Archives so that you can see what types of discussions we have had in the past.  
  
 Thanks so much ? looking forward to hearing from you and having some great discussions here!
  
 Marie Cora
 Assessment Discussion List Moderator
  
 Discussion List Tips
 Here are some suggestions for maximizing your experience as a List Member, both in terms of getting the most out of the content, as well as minimizing the time and effort involved in following the Discussion List.   In addition to the tips below, you should always feel free to contact me with any questions or concerns, or if you need help:   marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
 Posting to the List
  Please include an email address in your signature line in at least your first message so that subscribers can respond to your inquiry off-list if they choose. 
 Please be sure that the Subject Line heading matches the content of your message; many subscribers follow discussion threads via the Subject Line, and often, the message content shifts as people converse, but the Subject Line remains the same from the first posted message.   This makes it more difficult to follow discussion threads.  Please remember to check the Subject Line info and change it to appropriately reflect your message content, if needed.
  Consider whether your reply is best suited to send to only one person or the whole group.
 Managing Your Subscription
 Digest Format
 This format allows subscribers to receive Discussion List messages "bundled" into one or two emails per day. The subject line will  not be topic-specific, so any replies to digest format often mean the subject line will need adjusting before replying. Also, subscribers using digest format  do not receive the information that was posted right away. Because of that, this option may or may not suit everyone's needs.
 From the Assessment Discussion List page:   http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment
 Scroll down to Unsubscribe and other options at the bottom and enter your subscription email address.   
 This takes you to a page where it asks you if you want to unsubscribe or to log in using your password. Log in. (There is a button you can click to have your password emailed to you if you've forgotten it.) 
 Once you've logged in, scroll down to where it reads "set digest mode". Click this to "on", then scroll down further and click "submit my changes." 
 Use the archives
 You do not have to be subscribed to a List to use the archives, so if you are interested in reading about certain topics, but don't want to be a List Member, this option is open for you.   (See below for more information on using the archives.)
 Just hit delete!
 This is when the Subject Line can be your best friend!  If the topic of discussion just isn't up your alley, or you simply don't have the time at the moment, the delete button is a good option.   No one is making you be a subscriber so you should feel no guilt!  It's all your choice!  Often subscribers say that they just can't hit delete for fear of missing something, but remember that all posts get logged automatically in the archives and so when you *do* have the time or when that topic area *does* interest you, you can go back and search for those posts in the archives. 
 Using the Archives
 To read full discussions, or search and read the archives, visit the Assessment List Archives at:
  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Assessment.
 The archives can be sorted by thread/subject/author.
 In the right-hand toolbar:
 Click on Search Archives; you can search just the Assessment archives or all the List archives from here; search by thread, subject, or author. 
 Click on List Events to view information on upcoming, as well as past, Discussion Topics.   
 Click on List Help for the FAQ about using the Lists.
  
  
 Marie Cora
  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
 NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 Coordinator, LINCS Assessment Special Collection
  http://literacy.kent.edu/Midwest/assessment/
  
  
  
---------------------------------
 
 -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
 Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Email delivered to teacherwendyq at gmail.com

 -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to mjjerdems at yahoo.com

       
---------------------------------
Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! 
Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games.
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From djrosen at comcast.net  Tue Sep 11 13:17:58 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Tue, 11 Sep 2007 13:17:58 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 924] Special Topics Discussion: Components of Numeracy
Message-ID: <23CA4760-2383-4CF0-8384-ADFA5FFFEA87@comcast.net>

Colleagues,

 From September 17th - 21st, the Special Topics list will hold a  
discussion with Mary Jane Schmitt, Myrna Manly and Dr. Lynda  
Ginsburg, authors of The Components of Numeracy, an occasional paper  
published by the National Center for the Study of Adult Learning and  
Literacy in December 2006.

You or your colleagues who may wish to join this discussion can  
subscribe by going to

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics

After you complete the simple registration form (30 seconds) you will  
receive an email asking you to confirm that you wish to subscribe.   
Immediately reply to the email to complete your subscription. After  
the discussion ends you can unsubscribe from the same Web address, or  
stay on for the next discussion.

There is a discussion taking place on the Special Topics list now  
about International Education. It will end Friday, September 14th. If  
you do not want to get the posts from that discussion, wait until the  
15th to subscribe -- but don't wait too long.  The Components of  
Numeracy discussion begins on September 17th.

Authors' Biographies

Lynda Ginsburg is a senior researcher for mathematics education at  
Rutgers University and is currently conducting NSF-sponsored research  
on adult learners' work with their children on mathematics homework  
and on mathematics learning in out-of-school settings. Prior to this  
position, she worked at the National Center on Adult Literacy (NCAL)  
for 12 years where she participated in the development of a number of  
adult education projects including Captured Wisdom, the Professional  
Development Kit (PDK) and LiteracyLink. She has taught mathematics in  
high schools, in ABE/GED and workplace programs, and in community  
college developmental classes. She holds a Ph.D. in mathematics  
education from the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee.

Myrna Manly (B.A. Mathematics, M.A. Education, M.S. Applied  
Mathematics) has experience teaching mathematics at many academic  
levels, most recently as a Professor of Mathematics at El Camino  
College. In that capacity, she developed curricula designed to adapt  
the foundation courses for the needs of at-risk students. She also is  
the author of The GED Math Problem Solver, a textbook that integrates  
all the strands of math into a coherent approach to test preparation.  
In addition to instruction, she has been involved with the assessment  
of the mathematics proficiency of adults as the Mathematics  
Specialist for the 1988 version of the GED test and as a member of  
the numeracy team for the Adult Literacy and Lifeskills Survey (ALL).  
She also brings experience in Professional Development to the  
project, having worked with states and programs, facilitating staff- 
development and train-the-trainer workshops (e.g. Making Math  
Meaningful in CA and VA, GED as Project in VA, GED Math Institute in  
Washington, DC) that were aimed at improving mathematics instruction  
to adults.

Mary Jane Schmitt has been an adult educator for over 35 years. She  
has taught mathematics in ABE, GED, and ESL programs, has worked at  
the Massachusetts Department of Education, and is currently a project  
director at TERC in Cambridge, MA, where she directs the Adult  
Numeracy at TERC projects. Mary Jane is the co-author and co-principal  
investigator for the Extending Mathematical Power (EMPower) Project  
Mathematics Curriculum for Adult Learners recently published by Key  
Curriculum Press. She is a co-founder of the Adult Numeracy Network  
(ANN). Mary Jane's undergraduate degree is in mathematics and she  
holds an M.Ed. from Harvard University. She is the 2004 recipient of  
the Kenneth J. Mattran Award for exemplary work at the national and  
international levels given by the Commission on Adult Basic Education  
(COABE).

Discussion Preparation Recommended Readings

The Components of Numeracy (especially the summary on page 34)

The Adult Numeracy Network's "Teaching and Learning Principles" and  
"Professional Development Principles."

The Inclusion of Numeracy in Adult Basic Education, Volume 3, Chapter  
5, Review of Adult Learning and Literacy

To gain insight into the importance of numeracy or quantitative  
literacy in today's society, select a few chapters that interest you  
from "Mathematics and Democracy: The case for Quantitative Literacy."

David J. Rosen
Special Topics Discussion Moderator
djrosen at comcast.net

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From djrosen at comcast.net  Wed Sep 12 09:56:27 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2007 09:56:27 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 925] Special Topics Discussion: Components of Numeracy
	(with links to readings)
Message-ID: <AF1228D7-3212-48CA-A6C9-7C3F1F5C6E70@comcast.net>

Colleagues,

I sent this message a few days ago but the links to the readings did  
not appear, so here they are -- at the bottom of the message.

David J. Rosen
Special Topics Discussion Leader
djrosen at comcast.net

 From September 17th - 21st, the Special Topics list will hold a  
discussion with Mary Jane Schmitt, Myrna Manly and Dr. Lynda  
Ginsburg, authors of The Components of Numeracy, an occasional paper  
published by the National Center for the Study of Adult Learning and  
Literacy in December 2006.

You or your colleagues who may wish to join this discussion can  
subscribe by going to

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/specialtopics

After you complete the simple registration form (30 seconds) you will  
receive an email asking you to confirm that you wish to subscribe.   
Immediately reply to the email to complete your subscription. After  
the discussion ends you can unsubscribe from the same Web address, or  
stay on for the next discussion.

There is a discussion taking place on the Special Topics list now  
about International Education. It will end Friday, September 14th. If  
you do not want to get the posts from that discussion, wait until the  
15th to subscribe -- but don't wait too long.  The Components of  
Numeracy discussion begins on September 17th.

Authors' Biographies

Lynda Ginsburg is a senior researcher for mathematics education at  
Rutgers University and is currently conducting NSF-sponsored research  
on adult learners' work with their children on mathematics homework  
and on mathematics learning in out-of-school settings. Prior to this  
position, she worked at the National Center on Adult Literacy (NCAL)  
for 12 years where she participated in the development of a number of  
adult education projects including Captured Wisdom, the Professional  
Development Kit (PDK) and LiteracyLink. She has taught mathematics in  
high schools, in ABE/GED and workplace programs, and in community  
college developmental classes. She holds a Ph.D. in mathematics  
education from the University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee.

Myrna Manly (B.A. Mathematics, M.A. Education, M.S. Applied  
Mathematics) has experience teaching mathematics at many academic  
levels, most recently as a Professor of Mathematics at El Camino  
College. In that capacity, she developed curricula designed to adapt  
the foundation courses for the needs of at-risk students. She also is  
the author of The GED Math Problem Solver, a textbook that integrates  
all the strands of math into a coherent approach to test preparation.  
In addition to instruction, she has been involved with the assessment  
of the mathematics proficiency of adults as the Mathematics  
Specialist for the 1988 version of the GED test and as a member of  
the numeracy team for the Adult Literacy and Lifeskills Survey (ALL).  
She also brings experience in Professional Development to the  
project, having worked with states and programs, facilitating staff- 
development and train-the-trainer workshops (e.g. Making Math  
Meaningful in CA and VA, GED as Project in VA, GED Math Institute in  
Washington, DC) that were aimed at improving mathematics instruction  
to adults.

Mary Jane Schmitt has been an adult educator for over 35 years. She  
has taught mathematics in ABE, GED, and ESL programs, has worked at  
the Massachusetts Department of Education, and is currently a project  
director at TERC in Cambridge, MA, where she directs the Adult  
Numeracy at TERC projects. Mary Jane is the co-author and co-principal  
investigator for the Extending Mathematical Power (EMPower) Project  
Mathematics Curriculum for Adult Learners recently published by Key  
Curriculum Press. She is a co-founder of the Adult Numeracy Network  
(ANN). Mary Jane's undergraduate degree is in mathematics and she  
holds an M.Ed. from Harvard University. She is the 2004 recipient of  
the Kenneth J. Mattran Award for exemplary work at the national and  
international levels given by the Commission on Adult Basic Education  
(COABE).

Discussion Preparation Recommended Readings
?The Components of Numeracy? (especially the summary on p. 34) http:// 
www.ncsall.net/fileadmin/resources/research/op_numeracy.pdf

The Adult Numeracy Network?s ?Teaching and Learning Principles? and  
?Professional Development Principles.? http://www.literacynet.org/ann/ 
teachingandlearningprinciplesv610.30.05 (newest).pdf

The Inclusion of Numeracy in Adult Basic Education, Volume 3, Chapter  
5, Review of Adult Learning and Literacy
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=566
To gain insight into the importance of numeracy or quantitative  
literacy in today?s society, select a few chapters that interest you  
from ?Mathematics and Democracy: The case for Quantitative  
Literacy.?  http://www.maa.org/ql/mathanddemocracy.html

-----

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Sat Sep 15 14:29:56 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2007 14:29:56 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 926]  Financial Literacy
Message-ID: <039801c7f7c6$6acfb150$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,
 
The following post might be of interest.  
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
***************************
 
Good morning, everyone.  Networks Financial Institute is pleased to
announce the release of a national study analyzing adult trends in
financial literacy.  What does the term 'financial literacy' mean to
Americans?  Do we support financial literacy education?  Where do we get
our financial information?  These are some of the questions we sough to
answer in this study.  
 
To complement this study, in a few weeks we will be releasing a second
study seeking, for the first time, to detail what financial literacy
programs are available to U.S. adults in all sectors:  for profit, non
profit, governmental, and higher education.  We will notify you as soon
as this study is released.
 
Please feel free to contact me with comments or questions, and please
forward this press release to any of your constituents who might be
interested.  Thanks so much.
 
 
----------------
David Godsted, Director of Financial Literacy
Networks Financial Institute at Indiana State University
2902 North Meridian Street, Indianapolis, IN 46208
(W) 317-536-0291 (F) 317-536-2269
 <mailto:david.godsted at isunetworks.org> david.godsted at isunetworks.org -
<http://www.isunetworks.org> http://www.isunetworks.org
 
 
National Study Assesses U.S. Adults' Financial Literacy
 
 
(September 4, 2007, Indianapolis, IN) -, Networks Financial Institute at
Indiana State University has released results of a national survey that
assesses U.S. adults' self-reported levels of financial literacy.  The
findings indicate that les than 30% of U.S. adults view their personal
financial knowledge as very good or better.
 
The quantitative online survey of 805 adults randomly selected from
throughout the U.S. with respondents statistically profiling the U.S.
adult population.  The survey aimed to establish a baseline assessment
of U.S. adults' financial literacy levels, identify the types of
information these adults seek to improve their financial knowledge,
uncover areas in which adults believe they need the most help with
personal financial education and understand perceived barriers adults
face in seeking financial literacy education.
 
Fewer than 30% of U.S. adults view their overall financial knowledge as
very good or better; however, the research also found that more than
half of U.S. adults believe they understand the concept of managing,
saving, spending and investing money wisely, reporting a need for the
most guidance with investing, retirement planning and taxes.   A
separate question revealed that despite economic trends in personal
bankruptcy, mortgage foreclosure, a climbing credit card debt, U.S.
adults are somewhat more confident in their knowledge of spending,
insurance, lending/borrowing and banking. 
 
Adults perceive a need for financial literacy.  Eight in 10 U.S. adults
think it is important that financial literacy be taught.  They also
express a desire to enhance their own personal financial knowledge to
assist them with saving and preparing for the future.  However, they are
not actively seeking assistance with these life skills.  Sixty-five
percent of U.S. adults have not received any financial literacy
instruction in the past 12 months.   
 
In identifying sources of financial education, the research asked
respondents to indicate the most frequently sought sources for financial
information.  Family members were highest ranked followed by
friends/colleagues and financial planners.  While family and friends
were most frequently consulted, financial planners were viewed as the
most valuable source of personal financial education.  Bank personnel
were viewed as moderately valuable.  Human resources personnel and
credit counselors were reported as the least valued sources.
"Respondents' lack of value in the services available through human
resources departments is particularly disturbing as these departments
typically manage the bulk of individuals benefits, including insurance
and retirement planning options," noted David Godsted, director of
financial literacy at Networks Financial Institute.
 
Adult consumers desire facts and personalized assistance in investing,
retirement planning and the wise use of money.  Despite the value placed
on financial planners, the vast majority of U.S. adults do not rely on
someone else to handle their finances.  While U.S. adults express a
desire to learn more about financial education, they cite a lack of
funds and time as primary barriers to being more financially literate.
While less than a third of U.S. adults have sought financial
information, assistance or instruction within the past 12 months, only
about one third report that they are likely to seek such resources in
the next 12 months.
 
Networks Financial Institute released the report during the August 28th,
Nation's Foreclosure Epidemic:  Causes, Consequences and Remedies
conference presented in Indianapolis.  Similar to the research findings,
speakers at the foreclosure forum indicated that a lack of financial
literacy is one of the key culprits in the current foreclosure crisis.
A copy of the Adult Financial Literacy Study is available online at
www.isunetworks.org.
 
Networks Financial Institute at Indiana State University was founded in
2003 with a grant from Lilly Endowment, Inc. The non-profit organization
strives to facilitate a more effective national and international
financial services marketplace through education, outreach and research.
Networks Financial Institute is headquartered in Indianapolis with
offices on the campus of Indiana State University in Terre Haute and
outreach in Washington, D.C., and internationally.  For more information
about Networks Financial Institute, visit
www.networksfinancialinstitute.org
<http://www.networksfinancialinstitute.org/> .
 
 
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From MMaralit at NIFL.gov  Tue Sep 18 11:09:00 2007
From: MMaralit at NIFL.gov (Maralit, Mary Jo)
Date: Tue, 18 Sep 2007 11:09:00 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 927]  Sept. 28 Webcast: Registration OPEN
References: <0122B345-3693-4B80-99C2-AE93BDC64E31@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4062487BDB6029428A763CAEF4E1FE5B15382EB7@wdcrobe2m03.ed.gov>

>From Assessment to Practice: Research-Based Approaches to Teaching Reading
to Adults

Webcast to be held Friday September 28, 2007
	1:30 PM - 2:45 PM Eastern Time
	12:30 PM - 1:45 PM Central Time
	11:30 AM - 12:45 PM Mountain Time
	10:30 AM - 11:45 AM Pacific Time 

To register, go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/assesspractice/webcast0928.html

The National Institute for Literacy is pleased to host a webcast titled From
Assessment to Practice: Research-Based Approaches to Teaching Reading to
Adults on Friday, September 28, 2007.  Join Dr. John Kruidenier, Dr.
Rosalind Davidson, and Ms. Susan McShane as they present a practical and
compelling rationale for the use of research-based principles for adult
reading instruction.  Viewers can participate by submitting questions to
panelist after the presentations.

Please feel free to pass along to others who may be interested in viewing
this webcast.

For more information on the National Institute for Literacy, go to :
http://www.nifl.gov or call 202-233-2025.

Regards,
Jo Maralit 
mmaralit at nifl.gov 

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Sep 20 09:51:42 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 09:51:42 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 928]  Save the date!
Message-ID: <01f201c7fb8d$609b9d00$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Dear Colleagues,
 
I'm pleased to announce the upcoming Guest Discussion:
 
Creativity and the GED:  Learning Outside the Practice Books
 
When:  October 8 through 12
 
We will hear from guests as well as subscribers on interesting topics
including using:  a theme-based approach, project-based learning,
on-line learning, and more!
 
The full announcement for this discussion will go out early next week.
 
Looking forward to 'seeing' you all then!
 
Marie Cora
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From tsticht at znet.com  Sun Sep 23 19:53:36 2007
From: tsticht at znet.com (tsticht at znet.com)
Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2007 16:53:36 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 929]  Is Adult Literacy Assessment Healthy?
Message-ID: <1190591616.46f6fc808fcc2@webmail.znet.net>

September 23, 2007

The Assessment of Health Literacy: Is it in Good Health?

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Literacy

I recently arrived back in the office from travel and took a quick look at
what was going on on various discussion lists on the internet. Of
particular interest was a conversation that had just ended on the Health
Literacy discussion list of the National Institute for Literacy (NIFL)
which was concerned with the results of the Health Literacy test results of
the 2003 National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL). The NAAL general
findings were released late in 2003 while the Health Literacy results were
released in 2007.  For me, the discussion once again illustrated the severe
problem of knowing what is actually being measured with the NAAL and similar
assessments, such as the International Adult Literacy and Life Skills (ALL)
survey, which like the NAAL was also released in 2006 but in January, well
before the release of the first of the NAAL reports.

In the Health Literacy assessment, items that were part of the overall NAAL
survey were pulled out for separate analysis. In the NAAL there were three
scales of literacy: Prose, Document, and Quantitative. But in forming the
Health Literacy scale, these three distinctions were ignored and instead
items from these different scales were used to create one scale of Health
Literacy.

The discussion on the NIFL Health Literacy list raised some important
questions regarding the construct validity, that is, the question of what
is being measured,  of both the general NAAL, which included the Health
Literacy items, and the Health Literacy assessment pulled from the general
NAAL. One of the strands of discussion dealt with just what was the
difference between general literacy and health literacy. This question was
never answered in any definitive manner, thus raising the issue of the
construct validity of both the general NAAL and the specific Health part of
the NAAL. The issue is: what are these two assessments assessing?
Apparently, all general literacy includes health literacy, because the
items comprising the latter Health Literacy scale were included in the
general literacy scales, but Health Literacy does not necessarily include
all aspects of general literacy. Just what these "general" aspects are was
not stated. Discussions of the meaning of "health literacy" lead to such a
wide ranging set of proposals as to render questionable the very construct
of "health literacy," rendering it as near meaningless as the construct of
"general literacy" purportedly measured in the total NAAL.

A second question of the validity of the NAAL was raised when it was asked
why the NAAL used a probability of .67% for saying someone was proficient
at a given level of either general or health literacy. The answer given by
a principal in the development of the NAAL was, "The 67% is a parameter in
a statistical theory of item performance that must be understood in
connection with all the other parameters." However this does not explain
how the .67% probability of performance came to be the standard for
assigning skill levels to people and people to task difficulty levels. In
the International ALL survey released in early 2006, which included data
for adult literacy in the United States, the parameter for proficiency was 
a .80% probability of getting items correct. But a National Academy of
Sciences panel determined that this was too high and it was an unreasonable
standard, so they recommended dropping the standard to .67%. All this
standard setting was the discussion of an earlier meeting of experts in
psychometrics in which it was acknowledged that a 50 percent standard was
the most defensible technical standard because it kept the probability of
making mistakes about peoples skills equal in terms of overstating or
understating such skills.

The fact is that setting the standards of proficiency, even though given
much forethought, remains an arbitrary action and illustrates the point
that far from measuring some "levels' of skills that adults possess, it is
instead a creation of a distribution or distributions of skills that can be
made to make a population look good or bad depending on the decisions taken.

As things stand today, when asked, most adults in the national literacy
surveys do not think they have much of a problem with literacy. This raises
validity issues again. The question is, which scale of measurement provides
the most valid indicator of people's actual ability to perform literacy
tasks in the "real world" in which they live: people's self reports or the
creations of distributions on literacy tests by psychometricians?

Unlike geological strata, there are no literacy levels out there to be
discovered, they must be created. How many adults are "at risk" because of
low literacy skills? No one knows.

NOTE: I have refrained from identifying particular discussants on the Health
Literacy list without their permission. The discussion itself may be found
online by going to www.nifl.gov  and clicking on the Discussion Lists pages
for Health Literacy. It is an interesting discussion raising questions about
the "health" of the assessment of adult literacy in general. For additional
comments on the assessment of adult literacy google Sticht assessment adult
literacy.

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Sep 24 11:11:06 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2007 11:11:06 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 930]  Technology Self-Assessment for Teachers
Message-ID: <00f401c7febd$222b8520$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues, 
 
Some of you may be interested in the following.  To subscribe to this
discussion, go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Technology
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
 
Discussion Announcement:
 
On October 1 - 5, Marian Thacher will be joining the NIFL Technology and
Literacy Discussion List to lead a discussion on the new online
technology self-assessment for teachers at AdultEd Online,
www.adultedonline.org.

Marian is the director of OTAN (www.otan.us) a California adult
education project that provides information and technology integration
support for adult educators in California. Prior to her five years with
OTAN, she taught ESL and was involved in workplace education and media
projects in San Diego and Chicago.

In addition to sharing information about the self-assessment and the
professional development plan that accompanies it, Marian will share the
development process and resources that were used to create the tool.
Questions related to technology integration are:

1. What are the skills an adult education teacher should have in order
to use technology effectively with learners?

2. What is the role of a professional development plan, and how should
it be used?

3. How do we keep up with the fast pace of technology change? What are
our learning strategies?

What other questions would you like to discuss about technology
integration competencies, professional development plans, and the
challenge of keeping up?
 
 
Mariann Fedele
Director,
NYC Regional Adult Education Network
Literacy Assistance Center
Moderator,
NIFL Technology and Literacy Discussion List
32 Broadway 10th Floor
New York, New York 10004
212-803-3325
mariannf at lacnyc.org
www.lacnyc.org
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Sep 28 11:05:30 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 28 Sep 2007 11:05:30 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 931]  PD Needs Assessment
Message-ID: <017801c801e1$032b5520$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Dear Colleagues:
 
The following survey on professional development from the National
Institute for Literacy is still on-line for you to fill out!  If you
haven't taken the opportunity to let NIFL know your thoughts, please
consider doing so.  This information will be used to shape the PD
opportunities developed and offered by the LINCS Regional Resource
Centers.  Please read on!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
Re: Professional Development Needs Assessment
 
 
Adult education teachers and administrators:  Have you taken the time to
complete the National Institute for Literacy's online professional
development survey? If not, there is still time to express your opinion
and share your thoughts to help influence decisions that are being made
nationally on professional development.  
 
The National Institute for Literacy is conducting a survey on the
professional development needs of adult education practitioners across
the country.  We need your help to gather information that reflects your
own needs in the area of professional development as well as how you
think professional development should be offered.  We are asking for
only 10-15 minutes of your time.  Follow this link to take the survey at
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/needssurvey/. The online survey is available
until November 9, 2007.  
 
Information collected from the professional development needs survey
will be used by the Institute and the LINCS Regional Resource Centers to
1) give us insights on how Institute-produced materials and training can
be disseminated and 2) identify areas where the Institute might want to
develop additional materials and trainings. The Regional Resource
Centers will use the data to develop a regional dissemination plan that
will include how to best disseminate and present Institute-sponsored
resources and training in partnership with the state organizations.
 
The National Institute for Literacy, a federal agency, provides
leadership on literacy issues, including the improvement of reading
instruction for children, youth, and adults. In consultation with the
U.S. Departments of Education, Labor, and Health and Human Services, the
Institute serves as a national resource on current, comprehensive
literacy research, practice, and policy. 
 
The National Institute for Literacy is committed to the dissemination of
high-quality resources to help practitioners use evidence-based
instructional practices that improve outcomes in adult learners'
literacy skills. LINCS is the backbone of the Institute's dissemination
system, providing information on a wide variety of literacy relevant
topics, issues, and resources through regional resource centers,
collections of resources, and discussion lists.  For more information
about the National Institute for Literacy and LINCS visit
http://www.nifl.gov <http://www.nifl.gov/>  <http://www.nifl.gov/>   
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Mon Oct  1 09:21:51 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Mon, 1 Oct 2007 09:21:51 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 932]  (no subject)
Message-ID: <29665244-BB3C-424E-9C9B-09C238726837@caalusa.org>

New York, NY 10-1-07 -- The Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy  
(CAAL) has released a new Policy Brief by senior analyst Julie Strawn  
of the Center for Law and Social Policy. This publication, POLICIES  
TO PROMOTE ADULT EDUCATION AND POSTSECONDARY ALIGNMENT, was prepared  
for the 3rd meeting of the National Commission on Adult Literacy on  
August 20, 2007. As introduced by its author, the publication focuses  
on "helping adults with lower skills and/or limited English  
proficiency earn postsecondary credentials that open doors to family- 
supporting jobs." It examines obstacles to moving toward this goal --  
with major attention to lack of alignment between federal and state  
adult education efforts, job training services, and postsecondary  
education policies. It also draws attention to the financial,  
personal, and family challenges that prevent adults from seeking and  
completing programs. Numerous policy and action recommendations are  
given for Commission consideration. The publication is available for  
download from the website of the National Commission, at  
www.nationalcommissiononadultliteracy.org/pandp.html It is also  
available in bound version from CAAL (for pricing and ordering  
instructions, bheitner at caalusa.org).

Other materials developed for various meetings of the National  
Commission are also available at the Commission's website. The  
website, and publications and the activities of the National  
Commission, are supported by grants and in-kind support from the  
Dollar General Corporation, The McGraw-Hill Companies,  the Ford  
Foundation, and several individual donors including Harold W. McGraw,  
Jr.

Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy
1221 Avenue of the Americas - 46th Fl
New York, NY 10020
212-512-2362, F: 212-512-2610
www.caalusa.org

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Oct  2 15:00:04 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2007 15:00:04 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 933]  Discussion Announcement:  Creativity and the GED
Message-ID: <068801c80526$71f5f620$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Discussion Announcement 
Dear Colleagues, 
This announcement can also be accessed at:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
I'm pleased to announce the following Guest Panel Discussion, which will
be held during the week of October 8:
Topic: Creativity and the GED:  Learning Outside the Practice Books 
Guest Participants: 
Kate Brandt
Staff Development Coordinator
Language and Literacy Programs
City University of New York 
Kate is part-time ABE/GED staff developer at the City University of New
York Adult Literacy/GED program.  She has worked as a teacher in the
adult literacy field since 1990.
 
*****
Anson Green
San Antonio, Texas
Anson has extensive experience providing training and consulting
services in the areas of workplace literacy, e-learning initiatives,
curriculum development, and learning disabilities. Anson developed the
<http://members.aol.com/getworkready/home.html> Ready for Work! work
readiness curriculum with students in his welfare-to-work GED and
computer literacy classes.  He has published a variety of articles on
the topics of workforce literacy and women and education.  After
completing Ready for Work!, Anson taught developmental reading for
Northwest Vista College in San Antonio where he also developed the
college's first computer literacy and English as a Second Language
programs. 
 
 
*****
Crystal Hack
GED-i Coordinator 
Center for the Application of Information Technologies (CAIT)
Western Illinois University
Crystal has worked in the field of adult education as an instructor,
professional development trainer, and technology leader for over 15
years. In 2001, Crystal took the lead in the curriculum and site
development of Illinois's first GED online learning tool. With her
guidance and leadership, the GED-i system has grown from a state-wide,
grassroots initiative to a national presence that is being used
literally from coast to coast. Throughout the curriculum development,
Crystal has guided the development team in their assessment practices,
ensuring that the content incorporates a variety of assessment features
which range from 'self-checks' to submitted teacher reviewed activities.
In addition to ensuring that the learner's progress can be evaluated,
Crystal leads a professional development team that provides
comprehensive training throughout Illinois and all partnering states.
Crystal has often stated that working on the GED-i project and its
related professional development opportunities is the highlight of her
career.
 
Recommended preparations for this discussion:
Theme-Based Curricula Advantages
http://adulted.about.com/cs/ged/a/GEDcurricula.htm
 
Resources from City University of New York can be accessed at:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
 
*	A short text entitled "CUNY's Approach to the GED" which gives a
sense of the principles underlying GED instruction 
*	A longer text entitled "Designing Courses Using Books" which is
manual for teachers planning theme- and content-based courses.
*	A sample lesson from a curriculum on Colonialism in North
America 
*	Two sample lessons from a curriculum called The World's Water 
*	A sample lesson from a curriculum created for a GED-to-work
program
 
 
GED-i
www.gedillinois.org
 
A Program Overview of GED-i can be accessed at:
http://dev.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
 
 
Project-Based Learning and the GED 
by Anson M. Green  
http://www.ncsall.net/?id=408 
 
This is an account of one teacher's journey using ambitious and
effective student-based projects within his GED class. He was able to
blend the GED skills work with these exciting projects, which inspired
the students to gain confidence, motivation and workforce skills along
with the test skills, and at the same time connect with their community
in a meaningful way. There are resources listed at the end. 
 
 
Optional Background Materials:
 
The Chesterfield County (VA) Public Schools adult G.E.D. program
recently experienced an over 200% increase, more than 400 applicants and
test-takers in three weeks, thanks to a cell phone text message-based
radio promotion.  Read about this at:
 
http://www.prweb.com/releases/education/mobile_marketing/prweb536274.htm
 
 
Focus <http://www.ncsall.net/index.php?id=154>  on Basics, Transitions
Issue (6D)
This contains several articles about different aspects of transitions.
 
 
Creativity and Innovation at the ALE Wiki
http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Creativity_and_Innovation 
See the section entitled Creative GED Prep
 
 
GED teachers, especially, will find the following publication of GED
outcomes data -- intended to be used by GED teachers and their students
-- of special interest. It was written by Sara Fass and Barbara Garner
in 2000, and updated by Eileen Barry in 2006.
<http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1099> "Beyond the GED: Making Conscious
Choices About the GED and Your Future"
 
 
Is the GED an <http://www.ncsall.net/?id=1155>  Effective Route to
Postsecondary Education?
A Conversation with John Tyler
by Barbara Garner
Recognizing that high school is not enough, growing numbers of adult
basic education programs (ABE) are emphasizing the transition to
postsecondary education. What impact does earning a certificate of
General Educational Development (GED) have on the post secondary
enrollment of high school dropouts? Brown University professor and
NCSALL researcher John Tyler and a colleague, Magnus Lofstrom of the
University of Texas at Dallas, examined this question using data from
Texas. Focus on Basics asked John Tyler to summarize the results and
discuss the questions they raise.
 
 
 <http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/ged/webcast_ged.html> Webcast from
the National Institute for Literacy: Research on the Economic Impact of
the GED Diploma Panel Discussion
Moderated by Dr. David J. Rosen, and featuring Dr. John Tyler, Sara Fass
and Sue Snider. 
 
NCSALL GED Research Briefs <http://www.ncsall.net/?id=27> 
Seven briefs by John Tyler are linked on this page, among which are:
"The Economic Benefits of the GED: A Research Synthesis", "So You Want a
GED? Estimating the Impact of the GED on the Earnings of Dropouts Who
Seek the Credential", "Who Benefits from Obtaining a GED? Evidence from
High School and Beyond", and "Estimating the Labor Market Signaling
Value of the GED"
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Oct  2 15:28:45 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2007 15:28:45 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 934]  Announcement correction
Message-ID: <06af01c8052a$73cd9f80$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

My apologies for this:  please use this URL for accessing the GED
Discussion Announcement and resources
 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From tsticht at znet.com  Tue Oct  2 16:34:54 2007
From: tsticht at znet.com (tsticht at znet.com)
Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2007 13:34:54 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 935]  Milestones in Adult Literacy
Message-ID: <1191357294.4702ab6e02522@webmail.znet.net>

October 2, 2007

Milestones in the History of Adult Literacy Education

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

In a number of venues in the last few years I have presented a speech
entitled "The Shoulders on Which We Stand." This presentation has reviewed
a number of great adult literacy educators who have worked to teach reading
to adults from the time of the Civil War to World War II. After the
presentation I have often been asked for references to any papers I have
written about this history of adult literacy education, and I have provided
a reference to papers on the www.nald.ca library web pages. But those papers
do not include any photographs or other graphics that I use in my
presentation.

Now the National Institute for Literacy (NIFL) has produced a new electronic
newspaper series called QEd. This e-newspaper is available on the
www.nifl.gov web site. The QEd will present a series of five e-papers on
the scientific evidence for adult literacy educators. Additionally, the
series will provide a series of brief notes from my presentation on The
Shoulders on Which We Stand called Milestones. According to the first
issue, "Milestones features some of the exceptional people who have been
part of the long history of adult literacy education in the United States.
It also illustrates the movement toward integrating professional wisdom and
scientific approaches in teaching reading to adults."

In the NIFL newsletter in addition to text there are photos or other
graphics that those who have attended my presentation have asked about. Now
you can acquire a series of historical Milestones with text and photos that
can be used to inspire adult educators in their work by letting them see
that they are part of a long term effort by some people just like
themselves. These are people dedicated to helping adults learn to read and
write and they provide The Shoulders on Which We Stand today.  The text of
the first Milestone follows.

"HARRIET A. JACOBS:
 LITERACY AND LIBERATION
 by Tom Sticht

One of the earliest accounts of teaching an adult to read
comes from the slave Harriet A.Jacobs (1813-1897).Even
though it was unlawful to teach slaves to read,Jacobs ?owner ?s
daughter taught her to read and write.In 1861,after she
became a free woman,Jacobs wrote "Incidents in the Life of a
Slave Girl Written by Herself "(Jacobs,1987/1861).In the
book she tells how she helped an older black man,a slave like
her,learn to read:"I taught him his A,B,C ?his progress was
astonishing ?At the end of six months he had read through
the New Testament and could find any text in it."
Later,Jacobs taught literacy to former slaves in the
Freedmen ?s schools during Reconstruction following the
Civil War."

You will find a photo of Harriet Jacobs in the first issue of the QEd.
Collect all five issues of the QEd for a nice illustrated set of Milestones
of adult literacy education in the United States.

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From chack at cait.org  Thu Oct  4 14:33:54 2007
From: chack at cait.org (Crystal Hack)
Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2007 13:33:54 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Assessment 936]  Creativity and the GED
In-Reply-To: <06af01c8052a$73cd9f80$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <3655432.25891191522834167.JavaMail.root@vanadium.sys.ma.cait.org>

Hello Everyone, 

If you would like to check out some samples of the online instruction offered via the GED-i (formerly the GED Illinois), you can venture to the following URL. The lessons were designed by instructors practicing in the adult education classrooms around Illinois. I am happy to discuss how we brought those teachers to think outside the typical practice book and venture into how to effectively present content online. And let me add we are constantly growing and changing and adapting our approach as we learn from our online experience. 

http://ged-i.org/instruction/samples/samples.html 

Let me know your thoughts and questions. I will tell you that I must travel to a leadership training in Chicago on Oct 10 and 11. I will respond as promptly as I can to our discussion on those days. 

Take care and chat with you soon. 

Sincerely, 

Crystal Hack 
GED-i Coordinator 

-- 
Center for the Application of Information Technologies 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
Sent: Tuesday, October 2, 2007 2:28:45 PM (GMT-0600) America/Chicago 
Subject: [Assessment 934] Announcement correction 

My apologies for this: please use this URL for accessing the GED Discussion Announcement and resources 

http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html 

Marie Cora 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Oct  4 14:47:24 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2007 14:47:24 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 937]  Creativity and the GED
Message-ID: <025701c806b7$01ae2170$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
There have been a couple of updates added to the announcement that I
sent out earlier this week.  Please see the entire announcement with
info on guests and suggested resources at:
 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
 
Thanks and looking forward to seeing you all next week!
 
Marie Cora
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Oct  8 09:16:21 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2007 09:16:21 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 938]  GED Discussion Begins Today!
Message-ID: <000001c809ad$6bb538d0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  I hope this email
finds you well.
 
Today we begin our discussion on the GED and Creativity.  You can access
the full announcement and accompanying guest bios and suggested
resources at:
 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
 
I would like to acknowledge that today is Columbus Day and there are
many folks who observe this holiday.  Please join us as you are able.
As a reminder, all emails are automatically archived at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment - click on Read Current
Posted Messages at the top.
 
To get us started, I would like to ask our guests to tell us how/why
they ended up involved in these projects connected with the GED.
 
Also, I would like to ask subscribers to share any work that they do
with GED preparation and study that is also more creative than drilling
in the practice books.
 
And!  Please post any questions you have for our guests now!
 
Thanks!  Looking forward to our discussion!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From gbundy at rmi.net  Mon Oct  8 14:03:01 2007
From: gbundy at rmi.net (Gail B)
Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2007 14:03:01 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Assessment 939] Re: GED Discussion Begins Today!
Message-ID: <27940231.1191866581582.JavaMail.root@mswamui-blood.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

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From chack at cait.org  Mon Oct  8 17:03:59 2007
From: chack at cait.org (Crystal Hack)
Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2007 16:03:59 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Assessment 940] Re: GED Discussion Begins Today!
In-Reply-To: <000001c809ad$6bb538d0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <591242.40471191877439227.JavaMail.root@vanadium.sys.ma.cait.org>

Hello All, 

I believe that teaching is the most effective change agent in a person?s life and my teaching career is diverse, ranging from the traditional K-12 classroom to summer programs for at-risk youth and job readiness skills. Additionally, I have been able to work with Adult Basic Education learners in the Illinois Department of Corrections. I found a passion for the adult education and was able to transition into the role as a professional development trainer. This opportunity helped me connect with adult education teachers throughout Illinois, building relationships with administrators, instructors, and adult learners. 

In response to Marie's question, the Illinois Community College Board was taking a very proactive step in the support and development of an online learning curriculum for GED preparation. My role as an experienced classroom teacher and professional development trainer for the Center for the Application of Information Technologies (http://www.cait.org) at Western Illinois University made participating in the GED-i project a natural fit. Leading a team of GED instructors, web developers, and content experts through the curricular development to create an engaging opportunity was a phenomenal opportunity. The goal was to have dynamic lessons that met the instructional needs of the students and went beyond just drill and practice. The resulting project is GED-i (http://ged-i.org) and the environment allows for learners to prepare for their GED with interactive lessons, facilitated instruction, and peer communication. This goes beyond the scope of the traditional pen and paper practice. 

Remember you can check the GED-i's online orientation at the following URL: 

http://ged-i.org/orientation/introduction/introduction-p1.jsp 

Let me know what questions you have any questions about this information or beyond this. 

Crystal Hack 
GED-i Coordinator 

Center for the Application of Information Technologies 

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
Sent: Monday, October 8, 2007 8:16:21 AM (GMT-0600) America/Chicago 
Subject: [Assessment 938] GED Discussion Begins Today! 

Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all. I hope this email finds you well. 

Today we begin our discussion on the GED and Creativity. You can access the full announcement and accompanying guest bios and suggested resources at: 

http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html 

I would like to acknowledge that today is Columbus Day and there are many folks who observe this holiday. Please join us as you are able. As a reminder, all emails are automatically archived at: 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment - click on Read Current Posted Messages at the top. 

To get us started, I would like to ask our guests to tell us how/why they ended up involved in these projects connected with the GED. 

Also, I would like to ask subscribers to share any work that they do with GED preparation and study that is also more creative than drilling in the practice books. 

And! Please post any questions you have for our guests now! 

Thanks! Looking forward to our discussion! 

Marie Cora 

Assessment Discussion List Moderator 

Marie Cora 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

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From shannony at umich.edu  Mon Oct  8 10:13:36 2007
From: shannony at umich.edu (Shannon Young)
Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2007 10:13:36 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 941]  Call for Distance Education Presenters
In-Reply-To: <000001c809ad$6bb538d0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <C32FB350.1B419%shannony@umich.edu>

Project IDEAL (Improving Distance Education for Adult Learners) is pleased
to host the second annual Distance Education strand at COABE in St. Louis
(April 28th-May 1st, 2008).

Last year?s strand was well-received with 12 sessions and 27 presenters
covering a variety of distance ed topics.  Teachers, program administrators,
state staff, and researchers from across the country discussed teaching
strategies, online professional development, using technologies, new tools
for distance, national and local research findings, and policy development.

We encourage you to submit a proposal about your experiences working in
distance education.  Go to the COABE website
(http://www.coabeconference.org/) and complete the online proposal form.
Under Educational Focus, check the box next to Technology/Distance Learning.
Proposals will be forwarded by COABE to Project IDEAL for review and
selection.  Proposals are due by October 31st.
 
Please feel free to contact me if you have any questions.

Thanks, 

Shannon Young
 
-- 
Shannon J. Young
Program Manager, Project IDEAL / AdultEd Online
Senior Research Area Specialist, Program on Teaching, Learning, & Technology
Institute for Social Research, The University of Michigan
    
5267 ISR, 426 Thompson Street, Ann Arbor, MI  48106-1248
Ph:         (734) 763-5325
Fax:       (734) 647-3652
Email:     shannony at umich.edu
Websites:      http://projectideal.org      http://www.adultedonline.org

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Oct  9 10:19:33 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 10:19:33 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 942]  GED Discussion - what you need to know!
Message-ID: <01c201c80a7f$6ae33a60$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Hi everyone,
 
We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to
give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
discussion.  For the full announcement, information on guests, and
suggested resources go to:
 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
 
If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can
catch up in the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
 
Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now! 
 
Thanks!!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From djrosen at comcast.net  Tue Oct  9 11:29:35 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (djrosen at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2007 15:29:35 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 943] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
Message-ID: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>

Colleagues,

I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all education.  As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for Education and the Economy,  has said in a presention recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high academic standards AND creativity. 

But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it. 

Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why? 

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> Hi everyone,
>  
> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to
> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> discussion.  For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> suggested resources go to:
>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>  
> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can
> catch up in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
>  
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now! 
>  
> Thanks!!
>  
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  
>  
>  
>  
> Marie Cora
>  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  
>  

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From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
Subject: [Assessment 942]  GED Discussion - what you need to know!
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
Size: 9260
Url: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/attachments/20071009/264c0553/attachment.mht 

From Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu  Tue Oct  9 15:24:17 2007
From: Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu (Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu)
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 15:24:17 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 944] Re: GED Discussion Begins Today!
In-Reply-To: <27940231.1191866581582.JavaMail.root@mswamui-blood.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <OF4848690C.EA889FA6-ON8525736F.00659980-8525736F.006A9773@domino1.cuny.edu>

Hi, Gail,

I was really interested to hear about the work you are doing with Native 
Americans.  As diverse as our student body is here in New York City, 
Native Americans are one group of students that we rarely see.  I love the 
way you start off with students--asking them to write about a value.  I 
think this can be such a great way to get to know students, and to show 
them that their education can be a way for them to reflect on their own 
ideas and experiences in the light of new information that they are 
learning in school.

GED classes at CUNY are thematically based.  Values are not the center of 
any of the theme-based curricula we've produced, but I do think that the 
kinds of questions that would be raised in a curriculum centered around 
values would be similar to the kinds of questions that are at the heart of 
any good theme-based course.  What's vital to a good theme-based course is 
that there is a broad, open-ended question at the center of it; a question 
such as (very broadly) "what makes a good relationship?" or (a bit more 
narrowly) "How is child development influenced by culture?"  The texts 
that students read, the questions they discuss, the graphs they create or 
examine, can all provide information that students use to make up their 
own minds about the central question that guides the theme.   If I were to 
develop a theme-based curriculum around values, I think I would probably 
focus on a series of short stories and/or essays that offered different 
perspectives on a central guiding question related to values.   To bring 
in history, I might have students read some biographies of people who 
embodied some of the values under examination through the theme.  This 
could be the opening to a short unit on the history of the time/place of 
the person whose biography we were reading in class. 

But to comment on your second question.  With this question, I think you 
raise important issues about creativity and theme-based approaches in the 
GED classroom.  While I think creativity is important, I think it's also 
important that the course a teacher creates is developed with the GED test 
in mind.  Experienced teachers generally have a pretty good sense of the 
subject matter most likely to come up on the test.   The idea behind 
theme-based teaching is that you will not be able to cover all of the 
topics that could come up on the test.  Rather, you will be able to target 
one or two areas within, say, the discipline of social studies, and 
address these in depth. Let's say you choose Colonialism, knowing that 
this is an important concept to understanding world history in general, 
and also knowing that there are bound to be questions on the GED test that 
will relate to it.    My colleague Gayle Cooper and I created such a 
curriculum for GED students.   We had a number of learning goals in mind 
when we did so.  One goal was simply to engage students in a lot of 
reading and writing for a purpose.  We've found it's easier for students 
to remember material if it related to a central concept.  Another goal we 
had in mind was to introduce students to some broad concepts that come up 
again and again in the area of social studies.  So, in the Colonialism 
curriculum, students were asked to examine three cultures--European, 
Native American and African--in some depth, and to compare these cultures 
to their own culture using a set of guiding questions that remained the 
same from culture to culture.  Organizing students' learning in this way 
allowed us to bring in material on different ways of organizing societies, 
on social class, and on different types of economies, to name a few areas. 
 The actual reading that students did came from a variety of texts that 
included excerpts from young adult historical fiction, textbooks, trade 
books and poetry.  Each lesson had a number of GED practice questions 
attached that were clearly related to what students had been studying in 
class that day.   So what the thematic approach allowed us to do was to 
teach with the test in mind, but to try to give students a deeper 
understanding by using richer texts (and more text--we think students need 
this) and teaching in a way that would highlight certain broad concepts 
that we thought were central to the discipline of history/social studies. 

In your second question you also raised the issue of how much time 
teachers give to making their classes creative and how they balance this 
with the constraints of their own time.  Of course, this is an important 
issue.  At CUNY, we've been lucky to have a team of staff developers and a 
modest amount of funding to run curriculum development seminars that give 
teachers the chance to create their own courses.  Also, there are a large 
number of teacher-created curricula that all CUNY teachers can now choose 
from when they plan courses.  Interestingly, a lot of teachers opt to plan 
their own courses even though the curricula are available.  I think that, 
for many of our teachers, this is one of the payoffs of the job--that they 
can be creative in their teaching. 

That said, I do think that it is a very tall order--to create a curriculum 
that is both creative and will meet the needs of students.  What I've 
found as a teacher is that I make a lot of mistakes the first time I teach 
a certain theme, but by the second time I've corrected a lot of those 
mistakes and by the third time it runs pretty smoothly.   So while it's a 
lot of effort to create a theme-based course the first time around, it 
gets easier and the investment of time pays off as I go along. 

I'll look forward to hearing others' responses on this 

Gail B <gbundy at rmi.net> 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
10/08/2007 02:23 PM
Please respond to
Gail B <gbundy at rmi.net>; Please respond to
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To
assessment at nifl.gov
cc

Subject
[Assessment 939] Re: GED Discussion Begins Today!

My name is Gail Bundy,  I ran the night school at the Native American 
Multi-Cultural Education School (NAMES), a community-based GED school in 
Denver, CO.  While our school is the only adult education school in metro 
Denver that targets Native Americans, we are open to all who wish to 
learn.  We serve about 150 students a year with our student base being 
about 25% Native American, 75% Latino, and about 10% divided among people 
with Asian and African tribal heritage and people of European heritage. 
About 90% of our students are youth, ages 17 to 23, and the remainder are 
older adults. Our average student dropped out of public school in the 
ninth grade and pretests on the TABE at about 5th Grade. About thirty 
students a year earn their GED ? and around 60% progress at least two 
grade levels in core subjects. 
I am a semi-retired corporate strategic planner and writer.  I was 
volunteering as a tutor, grant and report writer when the night teacher 
had to leave on family emergency.  The director asked me pinch hit for a 
few weeks. I have now been teaching the night classes for almost 4 years. 
My corporate planning background helps me provide night students (who work 
during the day) with real life context for the GED.  For example, when we 
work with graphs and charts, I ask them to ask to develop statistics from 
their work lives, so they learn the language for decision-making within 
their own industry.  A cashier from an auto reports store brought in a 
daily chart of sales figures vs. inventory, and we developed a trend 
analysis.  We used the knowledge of a clerk in a supermarket floral shop 
along with the other student?s experience with flowers to examine the 
seasonal peaks and valleys of the flower business as the basis for 
understanding economic supply and demand theory. Another student who is a 
housekeeper in a large hospital, begin charting her supervisor?s daily 
production orders, and developed her own solution for improving the work 
flow and presented it to her supervisor, who with some surprise, 
implemented the change. 
My director specifically asked me to join this listserv to learn from 
other teachers about how they add special thematic instruction to their 
programs. Like most GED programs, we use the standard texts from 
Contemporary, Steck-Vaughn and others to help our students move towards 
attaining their goals of getting to the GED as soon as possible, and then 
moving on to college or some other higher education. However, we all know 
that the GED education texts are limited in what they actually teach. 
For several years, NAMES has been working on what we call the Morning Star 
Medicine Wheel of Learning?, a values-based approach to the GED 
curriculum, which blends traditional Native American philosophy and 
story-telling techniques with the GED subjects: reading, writing, math, 
social studies, and science. The eight-pointed Morning Star is often seen 
on the beautiful star quilts made by Native American women. It is the 
first star seen in the morning, and represents that first light of hope 
and possibility that students have in reaching out to achieve thier 
education dreams. The eight pointed star also represents a compass with 
each point related to values that provide students with a moral compass. 
We look for and share with students? traditional stories from many 
cultures related to the values of respect, truth, honesty, humility, 
humor, compassion, wisdom, and love. We also challenge students to write 
their own stories exploring these values. In this way we provide students 
with creative, practical, and humorous applications of knowledge gained by 
many cultures from around the world.  We believe that this is particularly 
important for our younger students who struggle with growing up in these 
urban environments. Values discussions also provide our older students 
with a way to help teach the younger students. 
Let me give you one example of how we include these values. 
We ask each student upon entry (after taking the TABE) to write an essay 
on the topic of Respect.  We give them some guides for potential topics, 
and an outline that guides them in developing three points, introduction, 
and conclusion. We let them take their own time with it.  After they 
handwrite a rough draft, we sit them at the computer, and have them type 
it and work with them on one or two simple versions.  If the student is a 
low level writer, we will let them dictate their ideas to us, which we 
will transcribe.  But they will still have to type it and revise on their 
own. By the end of their second or third day with us, they have a 
typewritten five paragraph essay, signed and dated that describes their 
own beliefs and experience about Respect.  We have a good idea of the 
student's level in writing -- but even more importantly, one of the 
teachers has had a discussion with the student about their perception of 
the value of respect.  We learn a little about their families, their 
elders, and their lives. They learn a little about us as teachers. 
The questions that I have for the listserve are:
I.  We wonder if anyone else is developing thematic work based on values 
-- and would like to understand the frameworks that are being used.
2.  I am also curious how teachers incorporate the standard GED texts into 
their thematic work. In actuality we have so little time with our students 
- that it is necessary to rely on the books for consistency and coverage.  
I am curious about how other teachers balance the creativity of developing 
new curriculum with student's time constraints.
 I look forward to the discussion. 

-----Original Message----- 
From: Marie Cora 
Sent: Oct 8, 2007 9:16 AM 
To: Assessment at nifl.gov 
Subject: [Assessment 938] GED Discussion Begins Today! 

Clean Clean DocumentEmail MicrosoftInternetExplorer4 
Good morning, afternoon, and evening to you all.  I hope this email finds 
you well.
 
Today we begin our discussion on the GED and Creativity.  You can access 
the full announcement and accompanying guest bios and suggested resources 
at:
 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
 
I would like to acknowledge that today is Columbus Day and there are many 
folks who observe this holiday.  Please join us as you are able.  As a 
reminder, all emails are automatically archived at:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment - click on Read Current 
Posted Messages at the top.
 
To get us started, I would like to ask our guests to tell us how/why they 
ended up involved in these projects connected with the GED.
 
Also, I would like to ask subscribers to share any work that they do with 
GED preparation and study that is also more creative than drilling in the 
practice books.
 
And!  Please post any questions you have for our guests now!
 
Thanks!  Looking forward to our discussion!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to kate.brandt at mail.cuny.edu

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From jackie.coelho at gmail.com  Tue Oct  9 13:13:48 2007
From: jackie.coelho at gmail.com (Jackie Coelho)
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 13:13:48 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 945] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
References: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1dd5701e0710091013ie49e1f8yafeed5c0603c9ef9@mail.gmail.com>

I must respond to this question. I do not believe that creativity is a
distraction. Creativity is the flesh on the bones of skills and
knowledge. Although our students want to pass the GED, we have to ask
ourselves what our job as educators is. If we simply believe that
pushing our students to the level of the GED is all we have to do,
then perhaps we can pass on the creative side of things. However, if
our goal is create life long learners, who will pass the GED on then
continue learning and contributing in more and more positive ways,
then I think the answer is clear. Creativity is a must. It is what
will hook a person into learning.

However, there is another issue. Not only do the students pressure GED
teachers into teaching to the test. The pressure is on from above
also. Students who pass the GED are counted and those numbers help the
DOE decide if a program is doing its job.

I am not against accountability. But I do think that without
considering all the long-term effects of the current method of
"counting" students is revised, then some creativity will be squashed
as teachers work to satisfy a numbers requirement.

On 10/9/07, djrosen at comcast.net <djrosen at comcast.net> wrote:
> Colleagues,
>
> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all
> education.  As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for Education
> and the Economy,  has said in a presention recently to the National
> Commission on Adult Literacy,
> http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.
> education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive
> without high academic standards AND creativity.
>
> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will
> not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass
> the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12
> teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue,
> but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers and
> administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>
> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>  -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to
> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > discussion.  For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > suggested resources go to:
> >
> >
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can
> > catch up in the archives at:
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give
> a quick reminder where you can get the information on this discussion.  For
> the full announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go to:
>
>
>
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>
>
>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you can catch
> up in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
>
>
>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to jackie.coelho at gmail.com
>
>

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Oct  9 16:58:36 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 16:58:36 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 946]  GED: Creativity is essential
Message-ID: <002e01c80ab7$29bd3da0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

The following post is from Kate Brandt. 
 
 
 
On this question, I'd have to weigh in on the "creativity is essential"
side.  I'd argue that the "creative" lessons I've seen aim for a much
higher standard than many of the more "traditional" lessons I've seen,
because they ask more of students in terms of critical thinking,
reading, and writing.  Many of the theme and content-based curricula
we've developed at CUNY (City University of New York) pose open-ended
questions that require students to think, learn new information and then
apply that information to the questions that have been posed.  This
approach to instruction also asks more from students in terms of reading
and writing.  A typical "course" would expose students to a range of
texts--poetry, excerpts from textbooks and tradebooks, novels, short
stories, graphs, newspaper articles, etc.--and a variety of different
writing assignments, so that students learn to read widely and write for
different purposes.  Theme and content-based courses at CUNY also aim to
expose students to the typical ways of thinking of each discipline.  In
developing our courses, we're thinking not only of students' need to
pass the GED, but also of the academic skills students will need when
they go on to college.   

In New York City, the diversity and educational needs of the students we
encounter varies enormously.  Some of the adult students in our programs
may need just a "brush up," but many others have large gaps in their
academic knowledge.   Recent research in reading instruction, such as
that presented in an article entitled "Learning From Text" by Patricia
Alexander and Tamara Jetton, point to the enormous importance of
background knowledge in reading comprehension.   Without a frame of
reference, students are likely to forget what they have read and
studied.  Theme- and content-based instruction, when designed well,
helps students build a frame of reference for the academic content that
they are learning so that they are more likely to remember it and "make
it their own."   

In this discussion, I've had the feeling that "creativity" is being used
to describe any approach to GED instruction that is not based almost
entirely on the test-prep book.  It's odd to hear "creativity" described
as a "distraction" because the word I would use for the theme and
content based approach I've been describing is "rigorous."  While this
approach is creative in the sense that we strive to engage students'
interest by designing activities that require students to be active
participants in their own learning, I have a hard time thinking of it as
a "distraction."    In addition to doing a better job of preparing
students academically, it's based on respect for students'
intelligence--the belief that they are capable of actively acquiring
knowledge. 

Kate Brandt
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From andresmuro at aol.com  Tue Oct  9 18:05:47 2007
From: andresmuro at aol.com (andresmuro at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2007 18:05:47 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 946] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <1dd5701e0710091013ie49e1f8yafeed5c0603c9ef9@mail.gmail.com>
References: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
	<1dd5701e0710091013ie49e1f8yafeed5c0603c9ef9@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8C9D8D7AE386CDA-1384-75A5@webmail-da03.sysops.aol.com>

In our GED classes for Migrants, we teach creative writing. Our students publish books. See:

http://bordersenses.com/memorias

The books are in spanish, but some of the stories and poems are translated into English.

Andres

-----Original Message-----
From: Jackie Coelho <jackie.coelho at gmail.com>
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 12:13 pm
Subject: [Assessment 945] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

I must respond to this question. I do not believe that creativity is a
istraction. Creativity is the flesh on the bones of skills and
nowledge. Although our students want to pass the GED, we have to ask
urselves what our job as educators is. If we simply believe that
ushing our students to the level of the GED is all we have to do,
hen perhaps we can pass on the creative side of things. However, if
ur goal is create life long learners, who will pass the GED on then
ontinue learning and contributing in more and more positive ways,
hen I think the answer is clear. Creativity is a must. It is what
ill hook a person into learning.
However, there is another issue. Not only do the students pressure GED
eachers into teaching to the test. The pressure is on from above
lso. Students who pass the GED are counted and those numbers help the
OE decide if a program is doing its job.
I am not against accountability. But I do think that without
onsidering all the long-term effects of the current method of
counting" students is revised, then some creativity will be squashed
s teachers work to satisfy a numbers requirement.
On 10/9/07, djrosen at comcast.net <djrosen at comcast.net> wrote:
 Colleagues,

 I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all
 education.  As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for Education
 and the Economy,  has said in a presention recently to the National
 Commission on Adult Literacy,
 http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.
 education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive
 without high academic standards AND creativity.

 But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will
 not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass
 the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12
 teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
 from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue,
 but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers and
 administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.

 Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?

 David J. Rosen
 djrosen at comcast.net

  -------------- Original message ----------------------
 From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
 > Hi everyone,
 >
 > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to
 > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
 > discussion.  For the full announcement, information on guests, and
 > suggested resources go to:
 >
 >
 http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
 >
 > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can
 > catch up in the archives at:
 > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
 >
 > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
 >
 > Thanks!!
 >
 > Marie Cora
 > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 >
 >
 >
 >
 > Marie Cora
 >  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
 > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 >
 >

 ---------- Forwarded message ----------
 From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
 To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
 Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
 Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!

 Hi everyone,

 We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give
 a quick reminder where you can get the information on this discussion.  For
 the full announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go to:

 http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html

 If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you can catch
 up in the archives at:
 http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html

 Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!

 Thanks!!

 Marie Cora

 Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 Marie Cora

 marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com

 NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

 -------------------------------
 National Institute for Literacy
 Assessment mailing list
 Assessment at nifl.gov
 To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
 http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

 -------------------------------
 National Institute for Literacy
 Assessment mailing list
 Assessment at nifl.gov
 To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
 http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 Email delivered to jackie.coelho at gmail.com

------------------------------
ational Institute for Literacy
ssessment mailing list
ssessment at nifl.gov
o unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
ttp://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Tue Oct  9 20:27:45 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 17:27:45 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 947]    GED: Creativity is essential
In-Reply-To: <002e01c80ab7$29bd3da0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <002e01c80ab7$29bd3da0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <OFFFBBCA5C.CBE8B044-ON07257370.00028A9B-07257370.00028A9D@yc.edu>

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From donnaedp at cox.net  Tue Oct  9 20:49:25 2007
From: donnaedp at cox.net (Donna Chambers)
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 20:49:25 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 948] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
References: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <003001c80ad7$67a43400$8e5fdd48@DH89L251>

David and All,

I believe that most of the problem  we face in our AE programs is that we 
are entrenched in "GED classes" that making the minimum (just passing the 
test) is the predominant objective.  Why are we not teaching to standards of 
learning that are required for a more generic purpose that can build a 
strong foundation for learning?  It is very hard to break away from the GED 
focus when classes are called GED classes and teachers are called GED 
teachers.  MA practitioners are encouraged to use the terms ABE and ASE to 
get away from the GED mindset.  Most GED teachers, as you pointed out, feel 
the pressure to teach to the GED test rather than to facilitate learning 
that would encourage critical thinking skills that go beyond simply passing 
the GED.

If we are truly to be standards based, we must focus on what skills need to 
be taught and consider how we will assess the skills so we know when they 
are learned, before moving on.  This should be part of our everyday practice 
and is not forced by following page by page in a GED workbook.  Creativity 
and innovation should always drive instruction in order to motivate the 
learner to learn reading, writing, and math skills that can be applied in 
any situation, not just to pass the GED. Research gives us a lot of 
information today on how people learn, but do we consider these components 
of learning in our instruction?  Yes, we should  be creative in how we apply 
various methods of teaching and learning to our AE classrooms, especially 
knowing that for many the more traditional approach is not effective.

In RI the K12 has moved to a proficiency based system. This allows the focus 
on teaching and learning to be driven by standards that must be learned 
before moving on.  My work allows me to look closely at what the K12 
teachers are doing to allow various opportunities for the students to learn. 
Teachers have brought creative strategies into the classroom so that all 
children learn.  I see no reason why these strategies would not work with 
adults as well, but it will require change, not just in the classroom and 
with the teachers, but with the administration and policy makers as well. 
Building academic and learning skills takes time and patience. Teachers must 
feel comfortable trying alternative ways to instruct and not feel the 
pressure of outcomes.  Is it important that our students pass the GED or is 
it more important that exceed expectations when taking the GED because they 
have a strong learning base?   If we all stop and think about what we really 
want for our students, it is not to achieve the goal to pass the GED. It is 
to build a strong foundation of academic skills and learning techniques that 
will benefit the student throughout life.  And guess what?  They will pass 
the GED along the way.

Donna Chambers

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <djrosen at comcast.net>
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 11:29 AM
Subject: [Assessment 943] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Colleagues,

I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all 
education.  As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for Education 
and the Economy,  has said in a presention recently to the National 
Commission on Adult Literacy, http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , 
the U.S. education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be 
competitive without high academic standards AND creativity.

But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will 
not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass 
the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 
teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts 
from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, 
but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers and 
administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.

Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> Hi everyone,
>
> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to
> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> discussion.  For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> suggested resources go to:
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can
> catch up in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
>
> Thanks!!
>
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
> 

From chack at cait.org  Tue Oct  9 22:43:10 2007
From: chack at cait.org (Crystal Hack)
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 21:43:10 -0500 (CDT)
Subject: [Assessment 949] Creative and meaningful lessons...the development
 process is so imporant
In-Reply-To: <8C9D8D7AE386CDA-1384-75A5@webmail-da03.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <168834.48911191984190779.JavaMail.root@vanadium.sys.ma.cait.org>

Hello again assessment group, 

Over the course of the last seven years, our instructional design process has grown as we have learned how to integrate multiple methods of assessment in the online design process. When working with the content experts, I instructed them to imagine the possibilities of assessment practices that go beyond the tools in the traditional classroom. Also, they are provided with ideas, examples, and templates to use as a building block. As with any quality instruction, it is critical that the assessment is aligned with the objectives of the lesson. Some methods of assessment appeared ?content light? and we worked together to create relevant and meaningful assessment activities. I have found that by reminding instructors of the key elements in the development process (to have procedures in place such as creating objectives, establishing assessment, designing the instruction, and reflecting on the completed process) they tend to have a much more effective instructional approach in the content they develop. Even more importantly as it relates to this discussion, they can do this and be creative. 

We also take a group approach to developing lessons. This gets the minds of 3-4 instructors focused on the lesson topic, the objectives, the learning activities and content. The more feedback we get on the quality and creativity the better the end result for our student users. The process sounds like it would take a long time, but really we have streamlined the development process getting that amount of feedback probably takes only a little more time than developing a lesson without the input from others. 

I guess my points are 1) the development process is the foundation of a creative meaningful lesson 2) lesson can be meaningful and creative and 3) don't create in a vacuum, involve others and tap into their creativity. 

Crystal 

-- 
Center for the Application of Information Technologies 

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From khinson at almanid.com  Wed Oct 10 07:15:33 2007
From: khinson at almanid.com (Katrina Hinson)
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 12:15:33 +0100
Subject: [Assessment 950] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to	know!
Message-ID: <470CD075020000A000005231@aiqwul01a.qwu.de.almanid.com>

I'm going to have to weigh in on the side of creativity is essential as well. I definitely don't see it as a distraction - that being said, what I don't really see is creativity being supported. I liked how Jackie Coelho stated that creativity if sometimes stifled from above because the focus is on completion rates. I heartily echo that. When I am sent new students the first word out of everyone's mouth is "when can I test?" No matter how much I try to explain that attending class isn't solely about the "test" that is definitely where everyone's attention rest.  When I first started teaching in adult ed 10 years ago, I remember being told that the idea was to teach differently than what the traditional school system had done - to provide an alternative learning environment in hopes that those students who had now returned to school would find a safe, student centered learning environment - yet over those 10 years, I've seen the creativity squelched as focus shifted more and more away from life-long learning to learning for the 'now', the 'test', program 'performance measures...' For some, not all, programs, the focus is on how quickly can you get them ready to test...not on how well the student might actually be retaining what they're being exposed to. Coming in to a class for 12 hours and just to test, doesn't allow much room for anyone to be creative.  

I loved the ideas of a thematic approach - but I want to know how you do that in a program where every class is multi-level, open entry (daily - new students can arrive) and where administration is focused on bodies in a seat, quick turn around time and bottom line results?

How do you find a workable venue for creativity? I do some different things in my class that others in my area don't do and I hate relying on the "workbooks" and often come up with my own tools to use - but beyond that, I feel very limited in my ability to be creative.

Regards
Katrina Hinson

>>> <djrosen at comcast.net> 10/09/07 4:29 PM >>>
Colleagues,

I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all education.  As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for Education and the Economy,  has said in a presention recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high academic standards AND creativity. 

But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it. 

Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why? 

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> Hi everyone,
>  
> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to
> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> discussion.  For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> suggested resources go to:
>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>  
> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can
> catch up in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
>  
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now! 
>  
> Thanks!!
>  
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  
>  
>  
>  
> Marie Cora
>  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  
>  

From donnac at gwi.net  Wed Oct 10 10:07:47 2007
From: donnac at gwi.net (Donna Curry)
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 10:07:47 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 951]  GED: What you need to know
References: <002e01c80ab7$29bd3da0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
	<OFFFBBCA5C.CBE8B044-ON07257370.00028A9B-07257370.00028A9D@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <00ac01c80b47$22de0ba0$f290c3d8@DonnaCurry>

Hi. I'd like to add my two-cents to the discussion about the need to help students get their GED quickly.

I'm on a local shellfish committee looking for wardens to check out the clam flats.  When I asked what the requirements were for being a warden, I was told they needed to have a GED or high school diploma.  This struck me so I asked why. I was told that the warden would have to send in periodic reports based on his/her findings so s/he needed "at least a GED."

I worry about the disconnect between our teaching just to the test (in writing, for example, the test requires students to write an "essay") and what the broader community and business people are expecting our adult learners to be able to do once they have a GED (such as write short reports, but rarely an "essay"). 

Are we explicit in the skills that we're teaching so that students can actually use what they've learned after they pass their GED?? Do we give them opportunities to transfer their learning from the workbook (or computer) to real-life situations so they know how to use different skills in different situations?  

Donna

Donna Curry
Center for Literacy Studies
University of Tennessee
("branch office" - Westport Island, Maine)
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From djrosen at comcast.net  Wed Oct 10 10:56:11 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (djrosen at comcast.net)
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 14:56:11 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 952] Obstacles to GED Creativity and How to Overcome
	them
Message-ID: <101020071456.23688.470CE80B000E4D5700005C882212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>

Assessment Colleagues,

Several obstacles to GED program creativity have been mentioned, and there are are others. I would be interested in hearing how creative GED practitioners have overcome each of these challenges. I hope those who have solutions will pick one or more of these challenges and address them in this discussion.  How have you pushed back the pressure for GED programs to be primarily test preparation, not substantive learning?  How have you successfully addressed these constraints?

1) Students'  determination to pass the test in the shortest time possible
2) Students' holding the goal "getting the GED" as an unexamined act of faith that this is what they need that "having the certificate or diploma" will meet their needs
3) Students' belief that "real school" looks just like the often failed) schools they have attended, traditional models of  schooling
4) Teachers' lack of experience (and therefore discomfort) with creative teaching such as theme-based or project-based learning
5) Accountability  for "GED outcomes" within a short time period from funders at the national, state and/or local level.
6) Other obstacles or constraints, especially those that are unique to GED Preparation programs or, Adult Secondary Education.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

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From: "Donna Curry" <donnac at gwi.net>
Subject: [Assessment 951]  GED: What you need to know
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 14:31:53 +0000
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From Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu  Wed Oct 10 12:12:26 2007
From: Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu (Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu)
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 12:12:26 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 953] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to	know!
In-Reply-To: <470CD075020000A000005231@aiqwul01a.qwu.de.almanid.com>
Message-ID: <OFC401A4F0.3A3A761D-ON85257370.00549158-85257370.00590706@domino1.cuny.edu>

Katrina, I wanted to reply briefly to your message because I think you 
bring up some important points.  It's certainly true that not only 
administrators but students as well tend to be very focussed on the test.  
I've been teaching for ten years and invariably the students who enter my 
pre-GED class ask when they can take the test on the very first day of 
class.  When I look at their reading and writing, I know that they have a 
road to travel, yet they just want to "get it over with." 

My feeling about this is that when students have such a long road to 
travel to reach their goal, they are going to have to learn to like 
learning, to embrace it somehow, or they're just not going to get there. 
This is where I feel what we're calling "creativity" is important. 
Students deserve the chance to have good educational experiences--to enjoy 
talking about a book that they've read with a fellow student; to look at 
pictures from a particular historical era and imagine life in that time.  
This is a second chance for them to become, as you put it, lifelong 
learners.

I also think you made a good point about thematic education.  I think it 
is very difficult to use a thematic approach if you have constant turnover 
in your classes and a wide range of levels.  One of the decisions made at 
CUNY (City University of New York), where I teach, was not to let students 
into a class past a certain point in the semester.  I really think that's 
an essential decision to make if you want to teach content, because when 
you are learning content, it's necessary for new information to build upon 
previously learned.   I do think that "creativity" has to be supported by 
a program or it will have to be limited.  Even within limits, it's 
possible to do some "creative" things.  For instance, I think, when 
teaching a particular content area--let's say photosynthesis-- it's 
possible to go out and look for other texts besides those in the GED book. 
 Students need to review information more than once to really "get" 
it--also reading multiple texts helps students get a sense of what's most 
important about a topic and gives them additional reading practice.  It's 
a lot of work to do this in the beginning, but you can re-use texts once 
you've found good ones.  There are many other ways to draw students in by 
doing something that is more active than traditiona learning.  I like to 
use these methods to "trick" students in to liking school.

Kate Brandt
City University of New York

"Katrina Hinson" <khinson at almanid.com> 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
10/10/2007 09:32 AM
Please respond to
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To
<assessment at nifl.gov>
cc

Subject
[Assessment 950] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to  know!

I'm going to have to weigh in on the side of creativity is essential as 
well. I definitely don't see it as a distraction - that being said, what I 
don't really see is creativity being supported. I liked how Jackie Coelho 
stated that creativity if sometimes stifled from above because the focus 
is on completion rates. I heartily echo that. When I am sent new students 
the first word out of everyone's mouth is "when can I test?" No matter how 
much I try to explain that attending class isn't solely about the "test" 
that is definitely where everyone's attention rest.  When I first started 
teaching in adult ed 10 years ago, I remember being told that the idea was 
to teach differently than what the traditional school system had done - to 
provide an alternative learning environment in hopes that those students 
who had now returned to school would find a safe, student centered 
learning environment - yet over those 10 years, I've seen the creativity 
squelched as focus shifted more and m
 ore away from life-long learning to learning for the 'now', the 'test', 
program 'performance measures...' For some, not all, programs, the focus 
is on how quickly can you get them ready to test...not on how well the 
student might actually be retaining what they're being exposed to. Coming 
in to a class for 12 hours and just to test, doesn't allow much room for 
anyone to be creative. 

I loved the ideas of a thematic approach - but I want to know how you do 
that in a program where every class is multi-level, open entry (daily - 
new students can arrive) and where administration is focused on bodies in 
a seat, quick turn around time and bottom line results?

How do you find a workable venue for creativity? I do some different 
things in my class that others in my area don't do and I hate relying on 
the "workbooks" and often come up with my own tools to use - but beyond 
that, I feel very limited in my ability to be creative.

Regards
Katrina Hinson

>>> <djrosen at comcast.net> 10/09/07 4:29 PM >>>
Colleagues,

I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in 
all education.  As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for 
Education and the Economy,  has said in a presention recently to the 
National Commission on Adult Literacy, 
http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -- 
and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high 
academic standards AND creativity. 

But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will 
not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass 
the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 
teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity 
distracts from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise 
this issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers 
and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it. 

Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why? 

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

 -------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> Hi everyone,
> 
> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to
> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> discussion.  For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> suggested resources go to:
> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> 
> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can
> catch up in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> 
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now! 
> 
> Thanks!!
> 
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Marie Cora
>  <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> 
> 

-------------------------------
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From Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu  Wed Oct 10 15:19:51 2007
From: Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu (Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu)
Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 15:19:51 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 954] Re: Obstacles to GED Creativity and How to
	Overcome	them
In-Reply-To: <101020071456.23688.470CE80B000E4D5700005C882212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <OF4332C5B3.CAEA1C29-ON85257370.006839F8-85257370.006A2FBB@domino1.cuny.edu>

Hi, colleagues,

In response to David Rosen's questions, I think I'll respond to number 
four.  Because I work at an institution where theme-based teaching in GED 
classrooms is policy, I think I'm in a good position to speak to this one.

The City University of New York has taken a theme-based approach to 
instruction, particularly GED instruction, for at least a decade now. 
There are eleven campuses throughout New York City where GED classes are 
offered.  The administrators and teachers who work at these sites are 
overseen by CUNY's Central Office and so there is a community of sorts 
between CUNY adult literacy teachers and administrators across the 
campuses.   While theme-based teaching, when it was introduced, 
encountered some resistance from teachers, there was also a lot of 
enthusiasm for it.  Having a community allowed teachers who were trying 
out this new approach to share materials and experiences, both at their 
campus programs and across programs. 

In addition to supporting each other, teachers were--and are--supported by 
a team of staff developers who work with them in a number of ways: 
team-teaching, periodic campus meetings, seminars, conferences, online 
fora, and more. One of the seminars that is run regularly is a curriculum 
development seminar in which teachers are paid to work with staff 
developers, first in a group setting, and then one-on-one, to produce 
curricula that they can use in their own teaching and which are also 
available to other CUNY teachers in "ready to use" form. 

I do think this approach to teaching is challenging and that institutional 
support makes a world of difference.    In our curriculum development 
seminars teachers have the chance to plan instruction carefully, thinking 
about the broad concepts they want to get across, the texts and other 
materials they will use, the learning goals they have for students, and 
the way that the many threads that must be included in GED instruction can 
be "braided" together.   While it's challenging, I also think planning in 
this way forces teachers to think about teaching in a deep and detailed 
way.  They must really think through each class--what students will learn; 
which activities they will engage in; which texts will be used and why. 

As a staff developer, I work with teachers who vary widely in terms of 
their approaches to teaching.  Some of the teachers I work with would be 
considered "traditional," while others favor "student-centered" learning 
and still others mix a variety of styles.  It can be hard to get teachers 
who have never tried an activity like student role play to take the risk. 
As part of a group of teachers taking part in a seminar, though, that 
teacher is more likely to try it out. 

So I do think theme-based teaching is a challenge, but well worth it.  And 
my experience has shown me that institutional support makes all the 
difference.

Kate Brandt

djrosen at comcast.net 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
10/10/2007 12:02 PM
Please respond to
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
cc

Subject
[Assessment 952] Obstacles to GED Creativity and How to Overcome them

Assessment Colleagues,

Several obstacles to GED program creativity have been mentioned, and there 
are are others. I would be interested in hearing how creative GED 
practitioners have overcome each of these challenges. I hope those who 
have solutions will pick one or more of these challenges and address them 
in this discussion.  How have you pushed back the pressure for GED 
programs to be primarily test preparation, not substantive learning?  How 
have you successfully addressed these constraints?

1) Students'  determination to pass the test in the shortest time possible
2) Students' holding the goal "getting the GED" as an unexamined act of 
faith that this is what they need that "having the certificate or diploma" 
will meet their needs
3) Students' belief that "real school" looks just like the often failed) 
schools they have attended, traditional models of  schooling
4) Teachers' lack of experience (and therefore discomfort) with creative 
teaching such as theme-based or project-based learning
5) Accountability  for "GED outcomes" within a short time period from 
funders at the national, state and/or local level.
6) Other obstacles or constraints, especially those that are unique to GED 
Preparation programs or, Adult Secondary Education.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

----- Message from "Donna Curry" <donnac at gwi.net> on Wed, 10 Oct 2007 
14:31:53 +0000 -----
To:
"The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Subject:
[Assessment 951] GED: What you need to know
Hi. I'd like to add my two-cents to the discussion about the need to help 
students get their GED quickly.
 
I'm on a local shellfish committee looking for wardens to check out the 
clam flats.  When I asked what the requirements were for being a warden, I 
was told they needed to have a GED or high school diploma.  This struck me 
so I asked why. I was told that the warden would have to send in periodic 
reports based on his/her findings so s/he needed "at least a GED."
 
I worry about the disconnect between our teaching just to the test (in 
writing, for example, the test requires students to write an "essay") and 
what the broader community and business people are expecting our adult 
learners to be able to do once they have a GED (such as write short 
reports, but rarely an "essay"). 
 
Are we explicit in the skills that we're teaching so that students can 
actually use what they've learned after they pass their GED?? Do we give 
them opportunities to transfer their learning from the workbook (or 
computer) to real-life situations so they know how to use different skills 
in different situations? 
 
 
Donna
 
Donna Curry
Center for Literacy Studies
University of Tennessee
("branch office" - Westport Island, Maine)
 -------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
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Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
-------------------------------
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From djrosen at comcast.net  Thu Oct 11 09:44:22 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (djrosen at comcast.net)
Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 13:44:22 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 955]  Assessing Creative GED Programs
Message-ID: <101120071344.8970.470E28B6000CB2CD0000230A2212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>

Assessment Colleagues,

I have some assessment questions below, but first please look at the following two examples of creative, theme-based and project-based GED teaching:

1. The Fabric of History curriculum -- designed for young adults who are not usually excited about learning American History, but who are interested in clothes and fashion, a whole American history curriculum built on this theme: 

http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Fabric_of_History

2. A Virtual Visit to a Lowell, Massachusetts Mill museum -- a Web site designed by and for young adults in a GED preparation program  that features a visit to a 19th century mill and readings, writings and discussion about the period. 

http://tech.worlded.org/docs/lowell/home.htm

My Overall Question: How should we assess learning in creative GED programs? Consider the examples above, the theme-based CUNY GED program that Kate Brandt has written about here, and other examples from this disscussion and elsewhere:

How should we do summative assessment for a creative GED program?  How should we do formative assessment?

1) Summative Assessment

Are scores on the GED test all we need?  Or do we also need to know, for example:

a. College as a Goal. How many/what percent of GED program participants hold the goal of going to college, and how has that changed from the beginning to the end of the program?
b. College Preparation. For those who hold this goal, how many/what percent are prepared for college? For example, how many have been admitted to college, and how many/what percent have been admitted as regular, not developmental studies, students? How many have high GED scores as one indication of preparation for college level work? How many, particularly "first generation" college students, have learned about the culture of higher education and how to navigate it successfully ?
c. Success in college. How many of the GED program graduates complete the first year of college? How many complete a two-year degree? A four-year degree?
d. What else should be assessed at the end of the program or later to determine impact or effect of the GED program?

2) Formative Assessment

Formative assessment is systematic measuring of learning progress or learning about how-to-learn strategies for the students themselves and for their teacher or tutor.

What formative assessment tools are/could be effective  in creative GED programs, for example in programs that use themes or learning projects: Dialogue journals? (Online or hold-in-the-hand) portfolios? Videotaped demonstrations of application of skills, knowledge or understanding?  Assessments of attitude changes? Something else?

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

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From anson.green at twc.state.tx.us  Fri Oct 12 07:29:14 2007
From: anson.green at twc.state.tx.us (Green, Anson)
Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 06:29:14 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 956] Re: Assessing Creative GED Programs
In-Reply-To: <101120071344.8970.470E28B6000CB2CD0000230A2212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
References: <101120071344.8970.470E28B6000CB2CD0000230A2212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1AD062FD584EB44F9628DEAF8B21D6A10AF72D22@exchg103p.actdc101p.rtdcx101p.twc.state.tx.us>

 
Hi folks:
I was catching up on the posts last night and wanted to make some
observations related to providing more than just test prep in GED
programs.  Many of you have identified very salient points and are doing
great things it sounds like.  

I'll just toss out some ideas in an email or two to keep the
conversation churning. 

The first one is on program retention. Adult education struggles with
persistence and retention issues, sometimes mightily.  I have seen the
research that speaks to the outside reasons (family, work, illness) that
students leave, but one that is not written about as much is that
students sometimes just get bored.   

If we consider just one large and growing population in adult education,
recent public school leavers (AKA drop outs), consider that one of the
main reasons they identify as for dropping out is that they were bored.
A Gates Foundation report last year (The Silent Epidemic)  found that: 

"nearly half (47 percent) said a major reason for dropping out was that
classes were not interesting. These young people reported being bored
and disengaged from high school. Almost as many (42 percent) spent time
with people who were not interested in school. These were among the top
reasons selected by those with high GPAs and by those who said they were
motivated to work hard."

The report found that 88% of high school leavers had passing grades; 70%
were confident they could have graduated; and 81% understood that
graduating was vital to their success. 

This being said, how can programs aim to provide anything BUT programs
that are engaging, relevant and have a future focus --on higher
education and work? 

As the respondents on this list have identified (I'm preaching to the
choir) there are multiple instructional reasons for providing a
"creative" GED class. As to the notion of performance, consider that if
students stay in class (because they are challenged and not bored),
performance should benefit.  I'm some ways, providing  GED "test prep"
tracks in programs only really seems to reinforce a message that the
program is delivering at 'just the minimum" ----prep for a test. It
seems that, at least for out of school youth, they are looking for much
more.

Saying that, I always thought there was great benefit in viewing
students as our customers ( we are providing a service after all).  Some
will come and are on a fast track to get somewhere, they really just
want to "take the test." They have their mind set on another goal and
that is what we want.  Fine.  Make sure we provide them with that
option. Others are looking for more and are undecided as to what
direction they want to go, to training or to a better job for example.
Programs need to provide both customers with these options. Doing so
will position us toward better outcomes and better retention. 

So that is my first observation.

Anson

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Oct 12 09:50:37 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:50:37 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 957]  Last day for GED discussion!
Message-ID: <008601c80cd6$df155130$30ca0acf@LITNOW>

Good morning colleagues,
 
This has been a great discussion this week!  Great questions have been
raised here and great ideas have been shared.  I will prepare this
discussion in UFF (User Friendly Format!) once is has completed and post
it for your convenience and use.
 
Today is our last day of the discussion with guests!  Please share your
thoughts, experiences, and ideas now.  
 
I would particularly like to hear people respond to David's set of
questions focused on formative and summative assessment.  While I'm
anxious to hear about both, I'm really interested in what subscribers
have to say about David's questions regarding the summative piece: how
can we determine the effect/impact of earning a GED in more creative
ways than what we do now, which is mostly done through examining the
scores.  We could track some of the data that David suggests - does
anyone do it?  Would you now consider it?  Do you feel that tracking
other pieces of the puzzle would be beneficial to you, your program and
students?  In what ways?
 
Thanks and looking forward to reading more from you today!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From Kgotthardt at comcast.net  Fri Oct 12 10:56:21 2007
From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net (Katherine G)
Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 10:56:21 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 958] Re: Assessing Creative GED Programs
In-Reply-To: <101120071344.8970.470E28B6000CB2CD0000230A2212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCIEJCDLAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>

David, these are fabulous projects.  I have to admit, as a fan of 19th
century culture, I was completely sucked into the "fashion" unit.  Great
pictures!  Minus the corset, I would love to have worn those clothes (but
not in the heat, in which case I would do the Jo March thing and wear only
pantaloons, much to the chagrin of my neighbors).

I have put off responding to the assessment question because I have not used
this kind of tool in my teaching other than when I have assigned projects to
undergrads.  When I did so, I used a check sheet that covered first, the
parts of the project requirements (i.e. did they complete all the parts and
what was the grade for each part); second, separate grading for each part of
the project.  Students would receive a copy of this so they knew exactly how
they did on each part.

So the grading "matrix" (I guess that's what you would call it) looked
something like this:

WRITTEN RESEARCH PAPER  Completed?  yes/no   Grade____

__Content

__Clarity

__Mechanics

__Organization

__Documentation

VISUAL AIDS  Completed?  yes/no   Grade____

__Creativity

__Relationship to Project

__Representation of topic (i.e. did it add anything to our understanding of
the topic?)

ORAL PRESENTATION  Completed?  yes/no   Grade____

__Organization

__Presentation of Content

__Clarity

__Preparedness

__Delivery

Final Grade for Project (all pieces averages together)  _________

Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of djrosen at comcast.net
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 9:44 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 955] Assessing Creative GED Programs

Assessment Colleagues,

I have some assessment questions below, but first please look at the
following two examples of creative, theme-based and project-based GED
teaching:

1. The Fabric of History curriculum -- designed for young adults who are not
usually excited about learning American History, but who are interested in
clothes and fashion, a whole American history curriculum built on this
theme:

http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Fabric_of_History

2. A Virtual Visit to a Lowell, Massachusetts Mill museum -- a Web site
designed by and for young adults in a GED preparation program  that features
a visit to a 19th century mill and readings, writings and discussion about
the period.

http://tech.worlded.org/docs/lowell/home.htm

My Overall Question: How should we assess learning in creative GED programs?
Consider the examples above, the theme-based CUNY GED program that Kate
Brandt has written about here, and other examples from this disscussion and
elsewhere:

How should we do summative assessment for a creative GED program?  How
should we do formative assessment?

1) Summative Assessment

Are scores on the GED test all we need?  Or do we also need to know, for
example:

a. College as a Goal. How many/what percent of GED program participants hold
the goal of going to college, and how has that changed from the beginning to
the end of the program?
b. College Preparation. For those who hold this goal, how many/what percent
are prepared for college? For example, how many have been admitted to
college, and how many/what percent have been admitted as regular, not
developmental studies, students? How many have high GED scores as one
indication of preparation for college level work? How many, particularly
"first generation" college students, have learned about the culture of
higher education and how to navigate it successfully ?
c. Success in college. How many of the GED program graduates complete the
first year of college? How many complete a two-year degree? A four-year
degree?
d. What else should be assessed at the end of the program or later to
determine impact or effect of the GED program?

2) Formative Assessment

Formative assessment is systematic measuring of learning progress or
learning about how-to-learn strategies for the students themselves and for
their teacher or tutor.

What formative assessment tools are/could be effective  in creative GED
programs, for example in programs that use themes or learning projects:
Dialogue journals? (Online or hold-in-the-hand) portfolios? Videotaped
demonstrations of application of skills, knowledge or understanding?
Assessments of attitude changes? Something else?

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Fri Oct 12 11:50:25 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 08:50:25 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 959] Re: Assessing Creative GED Programs
In-Reply-To: <1AD062FD584EB44F9628DEAF8B21D6A10AF72D22@exchg103p.actdc101p.rtdcx101p.twc.state.tx.us>
References: <101120071344.8970.470E28B6000CB2CD0000230A2212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>,
	<1AD062FD584EB44F9628DEAF8B21D6A10AF72D22@exchg103p.actdc101p.rtdcx101p.twc.state.tx.us>
Message-ID: <OFB1A18DEE.3032FDF9-ON07257372.00570386-07257372.00570388@yc.edu>

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From teacherwendyq at gmail.com  Fri Oct 12 13:04:32 2007
From: teacherwendyq at gmail.com (Wendy Quinones)
Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 13:04:32 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 960] Re: Assessing Creative GED Programs
In-Reply-To: <101120071344.8970.470E28B6000CB2CD0000230A2212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
References: <101120071344.8970.470E28B6000CB2CD0000230A2212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <ad2cc1ef0710121004l1b07eb94p7544d360ca870f63@mail.gmail.com>

Hello all,
I weigh in on the side of creativity!  My class created the virtual visit
that David Rosen mentions, and I can tell you that the experience allowed
students to enter history in a way I can't imagine anything else would have.
It allowed them to see what could have been a dry subject (GED Social
Studies materials, for example) as something that affected real humans, that
real people participated in.  It gave them a new framework for all of the
history and social studies we were studying, as well as a real and shared
experience to write about.

Had it occurred early in the year, I'm sure my students would have
objected.  But by then I had perfected my answer to the perennial question,
"Will it be on the test?"  Now I simply say, "Yes."  You'd be amazed at how
seldom I have been called upon to justify the answer!  But it's not hard --
history is a subject, critical thinking is required, and so on.

Finally another possible way to reduce at least student pressure for a
test-driven curriculum is to give homework out of the Steck-Vaughn skills
books.  They are cheap (maybe $2 apiece or so) and they keep students happy,
along with giving you material for discussing test-taking skills -- which,
after all, is a form of critical thinking.

Having said all of that, I have also struggled with theme-based learning.
The same issues of open enrollment and spotty attendance plague me.  I'm
trying it again this year, though, with lower-level students (GLE about 3-6)
who generally tend to have better attendance than higher levels.  I'm
keeping my fingers crossed!

Wendy Quinones

On 10/11/07, djrosen at comcast.net <djrosen at comcast.net> wrote:
>
> Assessment Colleagues,
>
> I have some assessment questions below, but first please look at the
> following two examples of creative, theme-based and project-based GED
> teaching:
>
> 1. The Fabric of History curriculum -- designed for young adults who are
> not usually excited about learning American History, but who are interested
> in clothes and fashion, a whole American history curriculum built on this
> theme:
>
> http://wiki.literacytent.org/index.php/Fabric_of_History
>
> 2. A Virtual Visit to a Lowell, Massachusetts Mill museum -- a Web site
> designed by and for young adults in a GED preparation program  that features
> a visit to a 19th century mill and readings, writings and discussion about
> the period.
>
> http://tech.worlded.org/docs/lowell/home.htm
>
> My Overall Question: How should we assess learning in creative GED
> programs? Consider the examples above, the theme-based CUNY GED program that
> Kate Brandt has written about here, and other examples from this disscussion
> and elsewhere:
>
> How should we do summative assessment for a creative GED program?  How
> should we do formative assessment?
>
> 1) Summative Assessment
>
> Are scores on the GED test all we need?  Or do we also need to know, for
> example:
>
> a. College as a Goal. How many/what percent of GED program participants
> hold the goal of going to college, and how has that changed from the
> beginning to the end of the program?
> b. College Preparation. For those who hold this goal, how many/what
> percent are prepared for college? For example, how many have been admitted
> to college, and how many/what percent have been admitted as regular, not
> developmental studies, students? How many have high GED scores as one
> indication of preparation for college level work? How many, particularly
> "first generation" college students, have learned about the culture of
> higher education and how to navigate it successfully ?
> c. Success in college. How many of the GED program graduates complete the
> first year of college? How many complete a two-year degree? A four-year
> degree?
> d. What else should be assessed at the end of the program or later to
> determine impact or effect of the GED program?
>
> 2) Formative Assessment
>
> Formative assessment is systematic measuring of learning progress or
> learning about how-to-learn strategies for the students themselves and for
> their teacher or tutor.
>
> What formative assessment tools are/could be effective  in creative GED
> programs, for example in programs that use themes or learning projects:
> Dialogue journals? (Online or hold-in-the-hand) portfolios? Videotaped
> demonstrations of application of skills, knowledge or understanding?
>  Assessments of attitude changes? Something else?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: djrosen at comcast.net
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 13:27:13 +0000
> Subject: Assessing Creative GED Programs
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: djrosen at comcast.net
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 13:16:44 +0000
> Subject: Assessing Creative GED Programs
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: djrosen at comcast.net
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 13:07:20 +0000
> Subject: Assessing Creative GED Programs
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: djrosen at comcast.net
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 13:04:50 +0000
> Subject: Assessing Creative GED Programs
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: djrosen at comcast.net
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 13:02:49 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Assessment 954] Re: Obstacles to GED Creativity and How to
> Overcome them
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Kate.Brandt at mail.cuny.edu
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 19:28:58 +0000
> Subject: [Assessment 954] Re: Obstacles to GED Creativity and How to
> Overcome them
>
> Hi, colleagues,
>
> In response to David Rosen's questions, I think I'll respond to number
> four.  Because I work at an institution where theme-based teaching in GED
> classrooms is policy, I think I'm in a good position to speak to this one.
>
> The City University of New York has taken a theme-based approach to
> instruction, particularly GED instruction, for at least a decade now.
> There are eleven campuses throughout New York City where GED classes are
> offered.  The administrators and teachers who work at these sites are
> overseen by CUNY's Central Office and so there is a community of sorts
> between CUNY adult literacy teachers and administrators across the campuses.
>   While theme-based teaching, when it was introduced, encountered some
> resistance from teachers, there was also a lot of enthusiasm for it.  Having
> a community allowed teachers who were trying out this new approach to share
> materials and experiences, both at their campus programs and across
> programs.
>
> In addition to supporting each other, teachers were--and are--supported by
> a team of staff developers who work with them in a number of ways:
>  team-teaching, periodic campus meetings, seminars, conferences, online
> fora, and more. One of the seminars that is run regularly is a curriculum
> development seminar in which teachers are paid to work with staff
> developers, first in a group setting, and then one-on-one, to produce
> curricula that they can use in their own teaching and which are also
> available to other CUNY teachers in "ready to use" form.
>
> I do think this approach to teaching is challenging and that institutional
> support makes a world of difference.    In our curriculum development
> seminars teachers have the chance to plan instruction carefully, thinking
> about the broad concepts they want to get across, the texts and other
> materials they will use, the learning goals they have for students, and the
> way that the many threads that must be included in GED instruction can be
> "braided" together.   While it's challenging, I also think planning in this
> way forces teachers to think about teaching in a deep and detailed way.
>  They must really think through each class--what students will learn; which
> activities they will engage in; which texts will be used and why.
>
> As a staff developer, I work with teachers who vary widely in terms of
> their approaches to teaching.  Some of the teachers I work with would be
> considered "traditional," while others favor "student-centered" learning and
> still others mix a variety of styles.  It can be hard to get teachers who
> have never tried an activity like student role play to take the risk.  As
> part of a group of teachers taking part in a seminar, though, that teacher
> is more likely to try it out.
>
> So I do think theme-based teaching is a challenge, but well worth it.  And
> my experience has shown me that institutional support makes all the
> difference.
>
> Kate Brandt
>
>
>   *djrosen at comcast.net*
> Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
>
> 10/10/2007 12:02 PM   Please respond to
> The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
>
>    To
> The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>  cc
>   Subject
> [Assessment 952] Obstacles to GED Creativity and How to Overcome
>  them
>
>
>
>
> Assessment Colleagues,
>
> Several obstacles to GED program creativity have been mentioned, and there
> are are others. I would be interested in hearing how creative GED
> practitioners have overcome each of these challenges. I hope those who have
> solutions will pick one or more of these challenges and address them in this
> discussion.  How have you pushed back the pressure for GED programs to be
> primarily test preparation, not substantive learning?  How have you
> successfully addressed these constraints?
>
> 1) Students'  determination to pass the test in the shortest time possible
> 2) Students' holding the goal "getting the GED" as an unexamined act of
> faith that this is what they need that "having the certificate or diploma"
> will meet their needs
> 3) Students' belief that "real school" looks just like the often failed)
> schools they have attended, traditional models of  schooling
> 4) Teachers' lack of experience (and therefore discomfort) with creative
> teaching such as theme-based or project-based learning
> 5) Accountability  for "GED outcomes" within a short time period from
> funders at the national, state and/or local level.
> 6) Other obstacles or constraints, especially those that are unique to GED
> Preparation programs or, Adult Secondary Education.
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Message from "Donna Curry" <donnac at gwi.net> on Wed, 10 Oct 2007
> 14:31:53 +0000 -----   *To:*
> "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>  *Subject:*
> [Assessment 951] GED: What you need to know
> Hi. I'd like to add my two-cents to the discussion about the need to help
> students get their GED quickly.
>
> I'm on a local shellfish committee looking for wardens to check out the
> clam flats.  When I asked what the requirements were for being a warden, I
> was told they needed to have a GED or high school diploma.  This struck me
> so I asked why. I was told that the warden would have to send in periodic
> reports based on his/her findings so s/he needed "at least a GED."
>
> I worry about the disconnect between our teaching just to the test (in
> writing, for example, the test requires students to write an "essay") and
> what the broader community and business people are expecting our adult
> learners to be able to do once they have a GED (such as write short reports,
> but rarely an "essay").
>
> Are we explicit in the skills that we're teaching so that students can
> actually use what they've learned after they pass their GED?? Do we give
> them opportunities to transfer their learning from the workbook (or
> computer) to real-life situations so they know how to use different skills
> in different situations?
>
>
> Donna
>
> Donna Curry
> Center for Literacy Studies
> University of Tennessee
> ("branch office" - Westport Island, Maine)
>  -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to kate.brandt at mail.cuny.edu
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to teacherwendyq at gmail.com
>
>
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From macsimoin at hotmail.com  Fri Oct 12 13:38:20 2007
From: macsimoin at hotmail.com (Mary Lynn Simons)
Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 17:38:20 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 961] Re: Assessing Creative GED Programs
In-Reply-To: <1AD062FD584EB44F9628DEAF8B21D6A10AF72D22@exchg103p.actdc101p.rtdcx101p.twc.state.tx.us>
References: <101120071344.8970.470E28B6000CB2CD0000230A2212020784020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
	<1AD062FD584EB44F9628DEAF8B21D6A10AF72D22@exchg103p.actdc101p.rtdcx101p.twc.state.tx.us>
Message-ID: <BAY115-W4282929E516D72388D4C9DBFA00@phx.gbl>

I am familiar with these statistics on bored students. Left out of the research is "What does 'bored' mean?". People are most often bored when they put little effort into what they are supposed to learn. If someone is making zero effort he/she gets more and more bored.  Many "Let's make the GED exciting" classes just keep the students from doing the work. In order to pass the test, students must make a big personal effort. They have to bring their reading comprehension way up, get used to the type of test, bring up their math and their grammar and writing. A class where the teacher is spending most of the time talking will not work, though, because students must grapple with the GED material, and sometimes the most interesting teachers make the worst GED teachers because they keep the students from doing what needs to be done to pass the test. Encouraging students, calling them when they don't come, keeping track of their progress, and making that personal connection -- being persistent is what makes a good GED teacher. Students are not bored when they are succeeding and they succeed when the teacher takes an interest in their progress. Also, individualizing instruction is important in getting students through the GED. Computer labs with programs such as Plato and Contemporary's PreGED are great. A GED teacher must be fixated on the progress of each student and the best way to do that is to keep a notebook where student progress is recorded. Then phone calls to absent students are easier to make because the teacher can discuss the next step more easily with the student: "Oh, you need to come in for your Social Studies Pretest", etc.

----------------------------------------> Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 06:29:14 -0500> From: anson.green at twc.state.tx.us> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment 956] Re: Assessing Creative GED Programs>>> Hi folks:> I was catching up on the posts last night and wanted to make some> observations related to providing more than just test prep in GED> programs. Many of you have identified very salient points and are doing> great things it sounds like.>> I'll just toss out some ideas in an email or two to keep the> conversation churning.>> The first one is on program retention. Adult education struggles with> persistence and retention issues, sometimes mightily. I have seen the> research that speaks to the outside reasons (family, work, illness) that> students leave, but one that is not written about as much is that> students sometimes just get bored.>> If we consider just one large and growing population in adult education,> recent public school leavers (AKA drop outs), consider that one of the> main reasons they identify as for dropping out is that they were bored.> A Gates Foundation report last year (The Silent Epidemic) found that:>> "nearly half (47 percent) said a major reason for dropping out was that> classes were not interesting. These young people reported being bored> and disengaged from high school. Almost as many (42 percent) spent time> with people who were not interested in school. These were among the top> reasons selected by those with high GPAs and by those who said they were> motivated to work hard.">> The report found that 88% of high school leavers had passing grades; 70%> were confident they could have graduated; and 81% understood that> graduating was vital to their success.>> This being said, how can programs aim to provide anything BUT programs> that are engaging, relevant and have a future focus --on higher> education and work?>> As the respondents on this list have identified (I'm preaching to the> choir) there are multiple instructional reasons for providing a> "creative" GED class. As to the notion of performance, consider that if> students stay in class (because they are challenged and not bored),> performance should benefit. I'm some ways, providing GED "test prep"> tracks in programs only really seems to reinforce a message that the> program is delivering at 'just the minimum" ----prep for a test. It> seems that, at least for out of school youth, they are looking for much> more.>> Saying that, I always thought there was great benefit in viewing> students as our customers ( we are providing a service after all). Some> will come and are on a fast track to get somewhere, they really just> want to "take the test." They have their mind set on another goal and> that is what we want. Fine. Make sure we provide them with that> option. Others are looking for more and are undecided as to what> direction they want to go, to training or to a better job for example.> Programs need to provide both customers with these options. Doing so> will position us toward better outcomes and better retention.>> So that is my first observation.>> Anson> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. Stop by today.
http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline

From tsticht at znet.com  Fri Oct 12 21:38:38 2007
From: tsticht at znet.com (tsticht at znet.com)
Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 18:38:38 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 962]  The Literacy Testing Debacle
Message-ID: <1192239518.4710219ebfc14@webmail.znet.net>

12 October 2007

The Great Literacy Testing Debacle in the United States

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Definition: Debacle: n. A total, often ludicrous failure. Online dictionary
at www.answers.com/topic/debacle

The United States seems to be caught up in measurement mania when it comes
to literacy. The No Child Left Behind law calls for extensive testing of
children's reading abilities in different grade levels. For adults, the
U.S. Education Department has developed adult literacy tests, and Title 2:
The Adult Education and Family Literacy Act of the Workforce Investment Act
of 1998 calls for accountability measures which the U. S. Education
Department has implemented in a National Reporting System that makes
extensive use of adult literacy tests. But in all these cases, the actual
measurement instruments and procedures for measuring reading/literacy and
comparing states suffer from major flaws. They all follow different
procedures in their development, which renders them incomparable, and hence
interpretations of the data produced by comparing the findings of the
various tests are essentially meaningless.

Testing Children's Learning of Reading

On page 39 of the June 4, 2007 issue of Time magazine a graph is presented
showing differences between the percentage of fourth graders in each state
who are deemed "proficient" in reading based on each state's different
standardized test. The graph also shows the percentage deemed "proficient"
on the National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP) which are
standardized tests given in all states in the nation. There are some very
large differences between the state and national test results. For
instance, Mississippi reports that close to 90 percent of fourth-graders
are proficient in reading on the state developed test, while on the NAEP
only about 19 percent score as proficient. This is a whopping 71 percentage
points difference in the numbers of fourth graders in Mississippi who are
considered proficient in reading.

The Time article provides data indicating that using state test data the
average percentage of fourth graders considered proficient is 70 percent.
Using the national NAEP tests only 30 percent of U.S. fourth graders score
as proficient. This is a 40 point average gap between state and national
estimates of fourth grade reading proficiency. The state and national tests
use different procedures to determine if children are proficient readers,
and are hence incommensurate. This raises the question of which tests
should be considered as the valid indicators of the reading abilities of
the nation's fourth grade children, the state or the federal tests. 
or
perhaps neither.

Testing Adult's Literacy Ability

Jumping ahead to when fourth graders have grown up, the 2003 National
Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) presents data for Prose and Document
literacy which indicate that in 1992 15 percent of adults over the age of
16 scored as proficient on these tests while in 2003 13 percent of adults
scored as proficient, a drop of 2 percent during the decade. Surprisingly,
only 30 percent of adult college graduates scored as proficient in
literacy.

Although there are clearly differences between the NAEP reading tests for
fourth graders and the adult literacy tests, again rendering them
incommensurate, nonetheless they both attempt to portray how many of their
target groups are "proficient" in literacy. The data indicate that there
are fewer than half as many adults (13 percent) who are proficient in
literacy as there are fourth-graders (30 percent) who are proficient using
the federal-made NAEP, and there are only a fifth as many proficient adults
as there are proficient fourth graders (70 percent), if the average of the
state-made tests are used. This suggests a tremendous loss of proficiency
as children grow into adulthood!

Measuring Literacy For Accountability in Adult Literacy Education

The problems of assessing literacy also show up in the accountability system
of the nation's Adult Education and Literacy System (AELS), which is made up
of the some 3,000 programs that are funded jointly by federal money from
Title 2 of the Workforce Investment Act of 1998 and state and local funds.
The National Reporting System (NRS) which prepares reports on how well
adults are learning literacy in the AELS has acknowledged that different
states use different standardized tests, with differing amounts of time
between pre- and post-tests to assess growth in literacy learning. The NRS
has also indicated that the comparison of educational functioning levels
and level gains across states is complicated by this lack of comparability.

But despite the acknowledged lack of comparability in the tests and
procedures used in various states the NRS goes ahead and computes averages
of the percentage of adults making learning gains across the fifty states.
Of course, the lack of comparability in measurement tools and their
administration renders these data totally meaningless and useless to
Congress (or anyone else for that matter) in deciding whether or not states
are using their federal funds responsibly and productively.

The Debacle of Testing Literacy Ability

Despite all these faults of testing for literacy skills, there is apparently
no hesitancy in using the test results to reward some educators and punish
others for what they are doing to teach literacy, whether to children or
adults. Despite extensive use of standardized tests of various sorts by the
fifty states, thirty- year trend data with the NAEP show that reading has
not improved for 9, 13, or 17 year old children since the early 1970s.
Further, the testing of adult literacy in 1992 and again in 2003 shows
little or no improvement in literacy at the lowest levels and a decline at
the highest levels.

To date, then, the great literacy testing debacle has cost hundreds of
millions of dollars, threatened teachers and administrators, subjected
children to hours of drill and practice in test taking rather than engaging
in learning important content and skills, and cast aspersions on the
literacy skills of America's workforce, thus advertising to the world that
the U. S. workforce is incompetent. This cannot be good for the health and
welfare of the nation nor its international competitiveness in the global
economy.

Even if we could get the testing of literacy right, which we have not done
up to now, there is no way we can test ourselves out of the serious
educational problems that afflict our K-12 and adult literacy education
systems. There is a word for the obsessive repetition of utterly foolish,
unreasonable, and failed practices: insanity.

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From Kgotthardt at comcast.net  Mon Oct 15 09:20:38 2007
From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net (Katherine G)
Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 09:20:38 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 963] Re: The Literacy Testing Debacle
In-Reply-To: <1192239518.4710219ebfc14@webmail.znet.net>
Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCIELCDLAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>

This is awesome information.  Thank you for posting it.

If I use parts of this in a paper, how should I cite it (APA)?

Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of tsticht at znet.com
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2007 9:39 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 962] The Literacy Testing Debacle

12 October 2007

The Great Literacy Testing Debacle in the United States

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Definition: Debacle: n. A total, often ludicrous failure. Online dictionary
at www.answers.com/topic/debacle

The United States seems to be caught up in measurement mania when it comes
to literacy. The No Child Left Behind law calls for extensive testing of
children's reading abilities in different grade levels. For adults, the
U.S. Education Department has developed adult literacy tests, and Title 2:
The Adult Education and Family Literacy Act of the Workforce Investment Act
of 1998 calls for accountability measures which the U. S. Education
Department has implemented in a National Reporting System that makes
extensive use of adult literacy tests. But in all these cases, the actual
measurement instruments and procedures for measuring reading/literacy and
comparing states suffer from major flaws. They all follow different
procedures in their development, which renders them incomparable, and hence
interpretations of the data produced by comparing the findings of the
various tests are essentially meaningless.

Testing Children's Learning of Reading

On page 39 of the June 4, 2007 issue of Time magazine a graph is presented
showing differences between the percentage of fourth graders in each state
who are deemed "proficient" in reading based on each state's different
standardized test. The graph also shows the percentage deemed "proficient"
on the National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP) which are
standardized tests given in all states in the nation. There are some very
large differences between the state and national test results. For
instance, Mississippi reports that close to 90 percent of fourth-graders
are proficient in reading on the state developed test, while on the NAEP
only about 19 percent score as proficient. This is a whopping 71 percentage
points difference in the numbers of fourth graders in Mississippi who are
considered proficient in reading.

The Time article provides data indicating that using state test data the
average percentage of fourth graders considered proficient is 70 percent.
Using the national NAEP tests only 30 percent of U.S. fourth graders score
as proficient. This is a 40 point average gap between state and national
estimates of fourth grade reading proficiency. The state and national tests
use different procedures to determine if children are proficient readers,
and are hence incommensurate. This raises the question of which tests
should be considered as the valid indicators of the reading abilities of
the nation's fourth grade children, the state or the federal tests. 
or
perhaps neither.

Testing Adult's Literacy Ability

Jumping ahead to when fourth graders have grown up, the 2003 National
Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) presents data for Prose and Document
literacy which indicate that in 1992 15 percent of adults over the age of
16 scored as proficient on these tests while in 2003 13 percent of adults
scored as proficient, a drop of 2 percent during the decade. Surprisingly,
only 30 percent of adult college graduates scored as proficient in
literacy.

Although there are clearly differences between the NAEP reading tests for
fourth graders and the adult literacy tests, again rendering them
incommensurate, nonetheless they both attempt to portray how many of their
target groups are "proficient" in literacy. The data indicate that there
are fewer than half as many adults (13 percent) who are proficient in
literacy as there are fourth-graders (30 percent) who are proficient using
the federal-made NAEP, and there are only a fifth as many proficient adults
as there are proficient fourth graders (70 percent), if the average of the
state-made tests are used. This suggests a tremendous loss of proficiency
as children grow into adulthood!

Measuring Literacy For Accountability in Adult Literacy Education

The problems of assessing literacy also show up in the accountability system
of the nation's Adult Education and Literacy System (AELS), which is made up
of the some 3,000 programs that are funded jointly by federal money from
Title 2 of the Workforce Investment Act of 1998 and state and local funds.
The National Reporting System (NRS) which prepares reports on how well
adults are learning literacy in the AELS has acknowledged that different
states use different standardized tests, with differing amounts of time
between pre- and post-tests to assess growth in literacy learning. The NRS
has also indicated that the comparison of educational functioning levels
and level gains across states is complicated by this lack of comparability.

But despite the acknowledged lack of comparability in the tests and
procedures used in various states the NRS goes ahead and computes averages
of the percentage of adults making learning gains across the fifty states.
Of course, the lack of comparability in measurement tools and their
administration renders these data totally meaningless and useless to
Congress (or anyone else for that matter) in deciding whether or not states
are using their federal funds responsibly and productively.

The Debacle of Testing Literacy Ability

Despite all these faults of testing for literacy skills, there is apparently
no hesitancy in using the test results to reward some educators and punish
others for what they are doing to teach literacy, whether to children or
adults. Despite extensive use of standardized tests of various sorts by the
fifty states, thirty- year trend data with the NAEP show that reading has
not improved for 9, 13, or 17 year old children since the early 1970s.
Further, the testing of adult literacy in 1992 and again in 2003 shows
little or no improvement in literacy at the lowest levels and a decline at
the highest levels.

To date, then, the great literacy testing debacle has cost hundreds of
millions of dollars, threatened teachers and administrators, subjected
children to hours of drill and practice in test taking rather than engaging
in learning important content and skills, and cast aspersions on the
literacy skills of America's workforce, thus advertising to the world that
the U. S. workforce is incompetent. This cannot be good for the health and
welfare of the nation nor its international competitiveness in the global
economy.

Even if we could get the testing of literacy right, which we have not done
up to now, there is no way we can test ourselves out of the serious
educational problems that afflict our K-12 and adult literacy education
systems. There is a word for the obsessive repetition of utterly foolish,
unreasonable, and failed practices: insanity.

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Oct 15 11:06:04 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 11:06:04 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 964]    The Literacy Testing Debacle citation format
Message-ID: <01ea01c80f3c$e8db7510$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:  The following is from Tom Sticht.

**********

The APA citation format for the piece I sent is:

Sticht, T. (2007, October). The great literacy testing debacle in the
United
States. Online at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/000961.html. Access date:
October 15, 2007.

Note: Of course the access date should change if people access the
article
on other dates.

I hope this is helpful.

Tom Sticht

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Oct 15 14:01:16 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 14:01:16 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 965]  Discussion Thanks!
Message-ID: <02d101c80f55$623caec0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Dear Colleagues,
 
I would like to thank our guests from last week's discussion - Crystal
Hack, Kate Brandt, and Anson Green - as well as subscribers for posting
their thoughts, experiences, and questions.  It was a very interesting
and rich discussion.  
 
My apologies that a couple of posts were not sent through until the
weekend - I had some email glitches on Friday afternoon.  If people have
more to say on the topic, please feel free to carry on.
 
I will prepare the discussion in a format that's friendly, and I'll send
out email to let you know when and where that can be accessed.  In the
meantime, if you missed the discussion but would like to browse the
content, you can read the archives by going to:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html  
 
Thank you all once again for a great discussion last week.  Looking
forward to more!
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu  Wed Oct 17 10:48:19 2007
From: ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu (Daphne Greenberg)
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 10:48:19 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 966]  level movement
Message-ID: <4715E882.919D.0031.0@langate.gsu.edu>

Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

From mhefner at cccti.edu  Wed Oct 17 11:30:02 2007
From: mhefner at cccti.edu (Melinda Hefner)
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 11:30:02 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 967] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <4715E882.919D.0031.0@langate.gsu.edu>
References: <4715E882.919D.0031.0@langate.gsu.edu>
Message-ID: <4715F23A.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>

If I were merely looking at performance from an administrative point of view, I would consider anything that meets or exceeds NRS standards a good rate. 
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina 28638
Office: (828) 726-2245
FAX: (828) 726-2266

>>> On 10/17/2007 at 10:48 am, in message <4715E882.919D.0031.0 at langate.gsu.edu>, "Daphne Greenberg" <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu> wrote:
Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

-------------------------------
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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Wed Oct 17 11:30:46 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 08:30:46 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 968] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <4715E882.919D.0031.0@langate.gsu.edu>
References: <4715E882.919D.0031.0@langate.gsu.edu>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398A0E@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

What about something like this?
OK 10-20 % of those who had this as a goal
Fair 20-30% of those who had this as a goal
Good 30-40% of those who had this as a goal
Excellent anything above 50%
??????
va
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Daphne Greenberg
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 7:48 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 966] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the
following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or
ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

-------------------------------
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Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to tarv at chemeketa.edu

From CColletti at ILSOS.NET  Wed Oct 17 11:43:02 2007
From: CColletti at ILSOS.NET (Colletti, Cyndy)
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 10:43:02 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 969] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398A0E@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Message-ID: <589FDF4DF91307439D211F7404B00E8760E911@exc01.ILSOS.ORG>

I think its important that Virginia brought in the qualifier "who had this as a goal"

You also need to qualify the "advancement" or "completion" by considering the level of the learners at the beginning of the period being measured and the amount of instructional hours leading to that advancement.  There is a great variation among our learners that we need to honor as authentic and clearly measure for the information of funders.

Cyndy Colletti

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Virginia Tardaewether
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 10:31 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 968] Re: level movement

What about something like this?
OK 10-20 % of those who had this as a goal
Fair 20-30% of those who had this as a goal
Good 30-40% of those who had this as a goal
Excellent anything above 50%
??????
va
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Daphne Greenberg
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 7:48 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 966] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the
following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or
ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to tarv at chemeketa.edu
-------------------------------
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Email delivered to ccolletti at ilsos.net

From mcarson at ksbor.org  Wed Oct 17 12:04:37 2007
From: mcarson at ksbor.org (Michelle Carson)
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 11:04:37 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 970]   Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398A0E@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
References: <4715E882.919D.0031.0@langate.gsu.edu>
	<D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398A0E@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Message-ID: <4715EC43.4E08.009A.0@ksbor.org>

To determine a good rate I would consider the following:

the state average for completion for those levels (did the program meet or exceed it?)
the national average for completion for those levels (how does the program compare?  If the state average is higher than the national average then this would not influence my assessment of the program's performance.)
the program's performance history ( I would consider trend data...is the program showing continuous improvement?  How do they compare over time? How do they compare to other program's of similar size and demographics?)
the program's performance targets (are they meeting or exceeding those?)

Overall, I think you have to consider how a program is doing in relationship to itself as well as to other programs in the state in making a determination as to what a 'good' rating would be.
>>> "Virginia Tardaewether" <tarv at chemeketa.edu> 10/17/2007 10:30 AM >>>
What about something like this?
OK 10-20 % of those who had this as a goal
Fair 20-30% of those who had this as a goal
Good 30-40% of those who had this as a goal
Excellent anything above 50%
??????
va
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
On Behalf Of Daphne Greenberg
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 7:48 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov 
Subject: [Assessment 966] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the
following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or
ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Email delivered to tarv at chemeketa.edu 
-------------------------------
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Email delivered to mcarson at ksbor.org

Michelle Carson, M.S.
Associate Director of Adult Education
Kansas Board of Regents
1000 SW Jackson, Suite 520
Topeka, KS 66612
phone:  785-368-7359
fax:        785-296-4526
e-mail:   mcarson at ksbor.org

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From jschneider at eicc.edu  Wed Oct 17 12:11:54 2007
From: jschneider at eicc.edu (Schneider, Jim)
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 11:11:54 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 971] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <4715E882.919D.0031.0@langate.gsu.edu>
Message-ID: <208D21E3AC92D449A31336961A46FB8709EF9816@eiccd-exch1.eiccd.net>

The NRS level is probably the best place to start... And is likely to be
the closest thing to an apples to apples comparison between
programs/states/etc.   

However, so much depends on the parameters of the question - the
operational definition of graduation or completion and who is included
in the student mix. 

If considering all students who ever walk through the door to a program
30% would be pretty good... 
Using a minimum of 12 hours of instruction vs 100+ hours of instruction
will provide vastly different answers.

Jim Schneider
Scott Community College

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Daphne Greenberg
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 9:48 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 966] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the
following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or
ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to jschneider at eicc.edu

From Philip.Anderson at fldoe.org  Wed Oct 17 12:44:54 2007
From: Philip.Anderson at fldoe.org (Anderson, Philip)
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 12:44:54 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 972] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 15
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1.1192636800.3748.assessment@nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <96E135649F1AD048AA6FF8CBC598C23E127C3868@MAIL1.FLDOE.INT>

Daphne,

These are just some thoughts... First it would seem to me that
completion of one program and transition to another program would depend
heavily on the goals the student had for enrolling in the first program.
It would be important to develop a measure of success that relates back
to why the student enrolled in ESOL in the first place. 

In my case of teaching ESOL in a night class held at a local church,
about 75% of the students told me they really needed to learn how to
speak and write their personal information, so they could give it to
intake clerks at offices and hospitals, and also to be able to sign
their name.  If my class were evaluated by its rate of students
completing all levels of ESOL and going to ABE, it would have been
considered a failure.  But if it were evaluated on these measures
related to the skill of communicating basic personal information in
public settings, it could have been considered a success by using a
relevant measure. 

On the other hand, I also had day time classes of about 25 students held
at a community college where about 25% of the students expressed intent
to obtain a GED, 50% wanted to enter a career program and the other 25%
wanted to start college to get a bachelor's degree.  In the first month,
the students and I talked one on one and together we set up measures of
success.  Some students set a goal of finishing ESOL in one year, others
two years.  It ended up that about half of the students actually did
reach their goals they set at the beginning.  I did not consider that to
be as successful as I hoped, but it seemed to be comparable to other
similar programs.

In the current process of the US DOE negotiating with states what the
rate of level completion (passing from one level to the next) will be
for the next year, and states negotiating with local programs what the
rate of level completion will be, that could be used as a measure of
success.  If a local program set their completion rate at 35% and they
met or exceeded that, this could be declared a "good" rate.  So, if your
measurement tool includes the program's negotiated rate with the state,
that could be used to help gauge success too.

Phil Anderson
Adult ESOL Program Specialist
Florida Department of Education

 

Please take a few minutes to provide feedback on the quality of service you received from our staff. The Department of Education values your feedback as a customer. Commissioner of Education Jeanine Blomberg is committed to continuously assessing and improving the level and quality of services provided to you.Simply use the link below.  Thank you in advance for completing the survey.
 

http://data.fldoe.org/cs/default.cfm?staff=Philip.Anderson at fldoe.org|12:44:55%20Wed%2017%20Oct%202007
 

 -----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of assessment-request at nifl.gov
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 12:00 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 15

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Today's Topics:

   1. [Assessment 966]  level movement (Daphne Greenberg)
   2. [Assessment 967] Re: level movement (Melinda Hefner)
   3. [Assessment 968] Re: level movement (Virginia Tardaewether)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 10:48:19 -0400
From: "Daphne Greenberg" <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
Subject: [Assessment 966]  level movement
To: <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <4715E882.919D.0031.0 at langate.gsu.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the
following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or
ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 11:30:02 -0400
From: "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu>
Subject: [Assessment 967] Re: level movement
To: <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <4715F23A.1F1A.005D.0 at cccti.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

If I were merely looking at performance from an administrative point of
view, I would consider anything that meets or exceeds NRS standards a
good rate. 
 
Melinda M. Hefner
Director, Literacy Support Services

Basic Skills Department
Caldwell Community College and Technical Institute
2855 Hickory Blvd.
Hudson, North Carolina 28638
Office: (828) 726-2245
FAX: (828) 726-2266

>>> On 10/17/2007 at 10:48 am, in message
<4715E882.919D.0031.0 at langate.gsu.edu>, "Daphne Greenberg"
<ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu> wrote:
Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the
following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or
ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to mhefner at cccti.edu

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Message: 3
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 08:30:46 -0700
From: "Virginia Tardaewether" <tarv at chemeketa.edu>
Subject: [Assessment 968] Re: level movement
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID:
	
<D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398A0E at cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="us-ascii"

What about something like this?
OK 10-20 % of those who had this as a goal Fair 20-30% of those who had
this as a goal Good 30-40% of those who had this as a goal Excellent
anything above 50% ??????
va
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Daphne Greenberg
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 7:48 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 966] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the
following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or
ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to tarv at chemeketa.edu

------------------------------

-------------------------------
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End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 15
******************************************

From VenuT at lacnyc.org  Wed Oct 17 12:58:58 2007
From: VenuT at lacnyc.org (Venu Thelakkat)
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 12:58:58 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 973] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <4715EC43.4E08.009A.0@ksbor.org>
References: <4715E882.919D.0031.0@langate.gsu.edu><D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398A0E@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
	<4715EC43.4E08.009A.0@ksbor.org>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB8591677@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

NRS is a good place to start because a) the definitions of terms like
completion and educational functioning levels are the best known in the
field and b) data based on NRS reporting is easier find.  However, it is
never a bad idea to think beyond NRS after the first analysis is done.

Like Michelle, I would definitely recommend using actual data from the
state to set benchmarks for assessing a program's performance.   My
preference, however, would be using the state median for performance at
each level rather than the average.  This is because the average is more
likely to be biased by outlier values (a program or two doing extremely
well or very badly in the state).  

I find federal NRS data to be much less useful because you really have
no idea what you are getting.  Different states have different
assessment instruments and testing policies and statistics are not
comparable at all from one state to the other.  

State targets are also less valuable than looking at actual state data
because I have come across instances where the targets are set because
of a policy push to improve performance in a state rather than based on
actual data.  

If you can compare the performance of your program to that of a similar
program or programs, that is of course the best way to go, in my
opinion.  The only problem is that this data may be hard to get.

Venu Thelakkat
Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis
Literacy Assistance Center
32 Broadway, 10th floor
New York, NY 10004
(212) 803-3370
venut at lacnyc.org
www.lacnyc.org
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Michelle Carson
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 12:05 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 970] Re: level movement

To determine a good rate I would consider the following:

the state average for completion for those levels (did the program meet
or exceed it?)
the national average for completion for those levels (how does the
program compare?  If the state average is higher than the national
average then this would not influence my assessment of the program's
performance.)
the program's performance history ( I would consider trend data...is the
program showing continuous improvement?  How do they compare over time?
How do they compare to other program's of similar size and
demographics?)
the program's performance targets (are they meeting or exceeding those?)

Overall, I think you have to consider how a program is doing in
relationship to itself as well as to other programs in the state in
making a determination as to what a 'good' rating would be.
>>> "Virginia Tardaewether" <tarv at chemeketa.edu> 10/17/2007 10:30 AM >>>
What about something like this?
OK 10-20 % of those who had this as a goal
Fair 20-30% of those who had this as a goal
Good 30-40% of those who had this as a goal
Excellent anything above 50%
??????
va
-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
On Behalf Of Daphne Greenberg
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 7:48 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov 
Subject: [Assessment 966] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few NIFL lists, but I received the
following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or
ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,
Daphne Greenberg
Georgia State University

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Email delivered to tarv at chemeketa.edu 
-------------------------------
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To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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Email delivered to mcarson at ksbor.org

Michelle Carson, M.S.
Associate Director of Adult Education
Kansas Board of Regents
1000 SW Jackson, Suite 520
Topeka, KS 66612
phone:  785-368-7359
fax:        785-296-4526
e-mail:   mcarson at ksbor.org

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Wed Oct 17 20:26:26 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 20:26:26 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 974]  FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
Message-ID: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

This email is cross-posted for your interest.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
-----Original Message-----
From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
[mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org] On Behalf Of
andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:23 PM
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
 
Daphnee:

I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that will
complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of students
who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of those
that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other
words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one.
WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy
ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have
beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I
have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if
a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to
move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the
GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than
before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of
students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the %
of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students
use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids
with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is
irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students  show progress in
the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL
class and the student decides to go  take the GED on her own, that would
not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares
beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have
the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters.

I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a WIA-NRS ABE
program. So, we don't have to pretest,  and assess the students every
five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate outcomes
outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we discuss
health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high GED
completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an ABE-
grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the next.
It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program anymore. 

Andres
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am
Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
Forgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I received the
following 

question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share
with the 

person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one 

level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to
ASE/GED) 

what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,

Daphne Greenberg

Georgia State University

_______________________________________________

AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.org

http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla

LiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for literacy

http://literacytent.org
  _____  

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail
<http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/index.htm?nc
id=AOLAOF00020000000970> !
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From mhefner at cccti.edu  Thu Oct 18 11:22:42 2007
From: mhefner at cccti.edu (Melinda Hefner)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 11:22:42 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 975] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>

I hope that this post will not be perceived as being disrespectful because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there are some slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.  While there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there are also optional requirements or outcome measures that states may choose to include for determination of performance among its local programs.  NRS guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of student and instructor led educational plans where instructional goals are dynamic, meet student needs, and drive instruction.  To say that nothing else matters other than level completion is not entirely accurate although I'm certain that there may be some administrators around the country who make it appear that way.  Fortunately, in North Carolina our state leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very seriously, use them to support instruction not impede it.
 
Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a goal, unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly for students transitioning into post-secondary training.  Although there are similar transitioning issues among underprepared students who graduate from high school in the traditional fashion, adult literacy providers should make successful transition into post-secondary training a high priority for students as applicable.  One of the many ways to do this is to assure and validate via pre-testing and post-testing that students do, indeed, function at the adult secondary high level and have not merely gained sufficient information and skills to have passed a GED test(s).
 
Melinda

>>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:

This email is cross-posted for your interest.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
-----Original Message-----
From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org [mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org] On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 20073:23 PM
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
 

Daphnee:

I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that will complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of students who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of those that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one. WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the % of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students  show progress in the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL class and the student decides to go  take the GED on her own, that would not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters.

I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a WIA-NRS ABE program. So, we don't have to pretest,  and assess the students every five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate outcomes outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we discuss health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high GED completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an ABE- grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the next. It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program anymore. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am
Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movementForgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I received the following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share with the person who asked me.If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?Thanks,Daphne GreenbergGeorgiaStateUniversity_______________________________________________AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.orghttp://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nlaLiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for literacyhttp://literacytent.org

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail!

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From andresmuro at aol.com  Thu Oct 18 12:45:43 2007
From: andresmuro at aol.com (andresmuro at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 12:45:43 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 976] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
	<47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>
Message-ID: <8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com>

 Melinda:

I don't disagree with anything that you are saying. However, in my opinion, the problem with NRS-WIA is the same problem as with NCLB.? Skillful teachers? in the right settings with the proper tools can facilitate knowledge in broad areas, and yet help many students show progress in standardized tests. However, most teachers feel like they are under pressure to demonstrate level gains in the given measuring tool. Comments from Tom Stitch in the NLA forum articulated exactly this. Essentially teachers felt pressure to show gains in standardized instruments and spent most of their time preparing students to demonstrate gains in these instruments. Most felt that they had little time for other activities and that they were unable to teach things that they felt were important. Comments, to me personally, from teachers throughout the US over the years suggests the same. In fact, when teachers are asked to document evidence of additional activities and progress in other areas aside from the mandated assessment, they become highly resentful. They feel that they are under pressure to prepare the students to show gains in the TABE, BEST plus, CASAS, and whatever else, and in addition, their administrators want them to demonstrate that their students are becoming more knowledgeable of civics, health, politics, history, the environment and whatever else. Teachers feel that the paperwork becomes insurmountable and that their role is to keep with an endless bureaucracy rather than concentrate on just teaching. 

In addition, as I argued in the NLA forum, there is no evidence that standardized tests demonstrate anything other than knowledge on how to take them. I don't think that there is a single scientific article that states that not getting a certain score in the BEST plus, TABE, CASAS or whatever, means that you do not posses the skills that the instrument attempts to measure. You make that argument yourself. You claim that having an GED is no indication of academic skills in math, reading, etc. The only difference is that the GED does represent access to employment, college and a significant entitlement for many. However, moving from beginning literacy ESL to beginning ESL is absolutely, unquestionably, indisputably, unarguably, overwhelmingly, incredibly meaningless. In fact, what happens in many programs is that a student will start in beginning literacy ESL, spend a whole semester or year in the same level and at the end of the year the student will demonstrate that he/she moved to beginning ESL. The student will stop attending for whatever reason and return to the same or a different program some time later. The student will be assessed again and will likely place in beginning literacy ESL again, and do the whole thing again. Now, this is not an exception. This is the rule w/ many programs. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Melinda Hefner <mhefner at cccti.edu>
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Sent: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 9:22 am
Subject: [Assessment 975] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

I hope that this post will not be perceived as being disrespectful because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there are some slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.? While there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there are also optional?requirements or outcome measures that states may choose to include for determination of performance among its local programs.? NRS guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of student and instructor led educational plans where instructional goals are dynamic, meet student needs, and drive instruction.? To say that nothing else matters other than level completion is not entirely accurate although I'm certain that there may be some administrators around the country who make it appear that way.? Fortunately, in North Carolina our state leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very seriously, use them to support instruction not impede it.

?

Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a goal, unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly for students transitioning into post-secondary training.? Although there are similar transitioning issues among underprepared students who graduate from high school in the traditional fashion, adult literacy providers should make successful transition into post-secondary training a high priority for students as applicable.? One of the many ways to do this is to assure and validate via pre-testing and post-testing that students do, indeed, function at the adult secondary high level and have not merely gained sufficient information and skills to have passed a GED test(s).

?

Melinda

>>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:

This email is cross-posted for your interest.

?

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

?

**********

?

-----Original Message-----
From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org [mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org] On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:23 PM
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

?

Daphnee:

I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that will complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of students who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of those that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one. WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the % of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students? show progress in the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL class and the student decides to go? take the GED on her own, that would not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters.

I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a WIA-NRS ABE program. So, we don't have to pretest,? and assess the students every five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate outcomes outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we discuss health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high GED completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an ABE- grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the next. It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program anymore. 

Andres

?

?

-----Original Message-----
From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am
Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I received the following 

question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share with the 

person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates from one 

level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to ASE/GED) 

what would you consider a? "good" rate?

Thanks,

Daphne Greenberg

Georgia State University

_______________________________________________

AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.org

http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla

LiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for literacy

http://literacytent.org

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail!

 

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to andresmuro at aol.com

 

________________________________________________________________________
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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Thu Oct 18 13:12:11 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 10:12:11 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 977] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>
	<8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398E52@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

Andres, etal.

What I've noticed in 37 years of teaching adults is if students are
improving their think-attack skills, their scores improve, no matter
what the assessment tool. It is not necessary to teach to the test.
Plus, any good assessment is going to be about life and work and will
fit what people/students have as goals. 

 

The largest challenge really is getting at that fine-tuned goal, getting
students to see their potential and apply their abilities in new ways
toward reaching it.

Va

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:46 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 976] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Melinda:

I don't disagree with anything that you are saying. However, in my
opinion, the problem with NRS-WIA is the same problem as with NCLB.
Skillful teachers  in the right settings with the proper tools can
facilitate knowledge in broad areas, and yet help many students show
progress in standardized tests. However, most teachers feel like they
are under pressure to demonstrate level gains in the given measuring
tool. Comments from Tom Stitch in the NLA forum articulated exactly
this. Essentially teachers felt pressure to show gains in standardized
instruments and spent most of their time preparing students to
demonstrate gains in these instruments. Most felt that they had little
time for other activities and that they were unable to teach things that
they felt were important. Comments, to me personally, from teachers
throughout the US over the years suggests the same. In fact, when
teachers are asked to document evidence of additional activities and
progress in other ar eas aside from the mandated assessment, they become
highly resentful. They feel that they are under pressure to prepare the
students to show gains in the TABE, BEST plus, CASAS, and whatever else,
and in addition, their administrators want them to demonstrate that
their students are becoming more knowledgeable of civics, health,
politics, history, the environment and whatever else. Teachers feel that
the paperwork becomes insurmountable and that their role is to keep with
an endless bureaucracy rather than concentrate on just teaching. 

In addition, as I argued in the NLA forum, there is no evidence that
standardized tests demonstrate anything other than knowledge on how to
take them. I don't think that there is a single scientific article that
states that not getting a certain score in the BEST plus, TABE, CASAS or
whatever, means that you do not posses the skills that the instrument
attempts to measure. You make that argument yourself. You claim that
having an GED is no indication of academic skills in math, reading, etc.
The only difference is that the GED does represent access to employment,
college and a significant entitlement for many. However, moving from
beginning literacy ESL to beginning ESL is absolutely, unquestionably,
indisputably, unarguably, overwhelmingly, incredibly meaningless. In
fact, what happens in many programs is that a student will start in
beginning literacy ESL, spend a whole semester or year in the same level
and at the end of the year the student will demonstrate that he/she mo
ved to beginning ESL. The student will stop attending for whatever
reason and return to the same or a different program some time later.
The student will be assessed again and will likely place in beginning
literacy ESL again, and do the whole thing again. Now, this is not an
exception. This is the rule w/ many programs. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Melinda Hefner <mhefner at cccti.edu>
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Sent: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 9:22 am
Subject: [Assessment 975] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

I hope that this post will not be perceived as being disrespectful
because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there are some
slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure
descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.  While
there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there are
also optional requirements or outcome measures that states may choose to
include for determination of performance among its local programs.  NRS
guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of student and
instructor led educational plans where instructional goals are dynamic,
meet student needs, and drive instruction.  To say that nothing else
matters other than level completion is not entirely accurate although
I'm certain that there may be some administrators around the country who
make it appear that way.  Fortunately, in North Carolina our state
leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very seriously, use them to
support instruction not impede it.

 

Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a goal,
unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student
functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or
language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly for
students transitioning into post-secondary training.  Although there are
similar transitioning issues among underprepared students who graduate
from high school in the traditional fashion, adult literacy providers
should make successful transition into post-secondary training a high
priority for students as applicable.  One of the many ways to do this is
to assure and validate via pre-testing and post-testing that students
do, indeed, function at the adult secondary high level and have not
merely gained sufficient information and skills to have passed a GED
test(s).

 

Melinda

>>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message
<059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora"
<marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:

This email is cross-posted for your interest.

 

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 

**********

 

-----Original Message-----
From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
[mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
<mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org?> ] On Behalf Of
andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:23 PM
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Daphnee:

I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that will
complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of students
who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of those
that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other
words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one.
WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy
ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have
beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I
have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if
a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to
move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the
GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than
before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of
students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the %
of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students
use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids
with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is
irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students  show progress in
the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL
class and the student decides to go  take the GED on her own, that would
not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares
beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have
the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters.

I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a WIA-NRS ABE
program. So, we don't have to pretest,  and assess the students every
five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate outcomes
outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we discuss
health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high GED
completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an ABE-
grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the next.
It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program anymore. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am
Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I received the
following 

question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share
with the 

person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one 

level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to
ASE/GED) 

what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,

Daphne Greenberg

Georgia State University

_______________________________________________

AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.org

http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla

LiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for literacy

http://literacytent.org <http://literacytent.org/> 
________________________________

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail
<http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/index.htm?nc
id=AOLAOF00020000000970> !

-------------------------------

National Institute for Literacy

Assessment mailing list

Assessment at nifl.gov

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Email delivered to andresmuro at aol.com
________________________________

size=2 width="100%" align=center> 

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail
<http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/index.htm?nc
id=AOLAOF00020000000970> !

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From dglass at ksbor.org  Thu Oct 18 13:12:59 2007
From: dglass at ksbor.org (Dianne Glass)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 12:12:59 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 978]   Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
	<47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>
Message-ID: <47174DC9.176C.0067.0@ksbor.org>

I agree with Melinda.  While the NRS does require that AEFLA-funded programs report on educational functioning level completions, the NRS also requires states to report on the number of participants who have other significant reasons for entering adult education programs as well as the number and percentage of participants who achieve the following outcomes:  entering employment, retaining/improving employment, passing the GED, and entering post-secondary education and training.  While this list does not include all the goals that adult learners have, it certainly reflects the primary goals that adult learners in Kansas identify as their reasons for participating in adult education.

In addition, DAEL encourages states to identify and collect data on other goals that adult learners may have.  In Kansas, AEFLA programs report on the following additional goals and outcomes:  acquiring the skills necessary to become a United States citizen, participating in children's (pre-school age children) literacy activities, and participating in children's (pre-K - Grade 6 age children) educational activities.  Not only do Kansas programs encourage participants to identify and work toward these goals if they are appropriate, adult education programs are rewarded when learners achieve these outcomes just as they are when learners achieve the other outcomes listed above.

Kansas has a performance-based funding formula, and the secondary outcomes that are specific to Kansas are "worth" just as much as educational level completion.  Contrary to some of the opinions expressed during this discussion, the NRS system is simply a mechanism for collecting, reporting, and analyzing data.  As a tax payer, I personally hope that every federal (and state) funded program holds grant recipients to some level of accountability.  

Dianne S. Glass
Director of Adult Education
Kansas Board of Regents
1000 SW Jackson, Suite 520
Topeka, KS 66612-1368
785.296.7159
dglass at ksbor.org
 

>>> "Melinda Hefner" <mhefner at cccti.edu> 10/18/2007 10:22 AM >>>
I hope that this post will not be perceived as being disrespectful because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there are some slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.  While there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there are also optional requirements or outcome measures that states may choose to include for determination of performance among its local programs.  NRS guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of student and instructor led educational plans where instructional goals are dynamic, meet student needs, and drive instruction.  To say that nothing else matters other than level completion is not entirely accurate although I'm certain that there may be some administrators around the country who make it appear that way.  Fortunately, in North Carolina our state leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very seriously, use them to support instruction not impede it.
 
Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a goal, unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly for students transitioning into post-secondary training.  Although there are similar transitioning issues among underprepared students who graduate from high school in the traditional fashion, adult literacy providers should make successful transition into post-secondary training a high priority for students as applicable.  One of the many ways to do this is to assure and validate via pre-testing and post-testing that students do, indeed, function at the adult secondary high level and have not merely gained sufficient information and skills to have passed a GED test(s).
 
Melinda

>>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:

This email is cross-posted for your interest.
 
Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator
 
**********
 
-----Original Message-----
From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org [mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org] On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com 
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 20073:23 PM
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org 
Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
 

Daphnee:

I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that will complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of students who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of those that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one. WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the % of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students  show progress in the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL class and the student decides to go  take the GED on her own, that would not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters.

I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a WIA-NRS ABE program. So, we don't have to pretest,  and assess the students every five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate outcomes outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we discuss health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high GED completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an ABE- grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the next. It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program anymore. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org 
Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am
Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movementForgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I received the following question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share with the person who asked me.If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates from one level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to ASE/GED) what would you consider a  "good" rate?Thanks,Daphne GreenbergGeorgiaStateUniversity_______________________________________________AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.orghttp://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nlaLiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for literacyhttp://literacytent.org

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail!

From hdooley at riral.org  Thu Oct 18 13:29:17 2007
From: hdooley at riral.org (Howard Dooley)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 13:29:17 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 979] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <0BF2D0726318524ABEF6D58E7BB3CCEB0B9534@pdc.Riral.local>

I do not know where the "66%" number quoted comes from. I have never
heard of this; has anyone else?

 

My understanding is that each state negotiates appropriate rates for
each level, based on past performance and continuous improvement
expectations.

 

While I agree that WIA creates a program model that emphasizes
accountability, perhaps too much so, at the state levels, I disagree
that it is an "insane bureaucracy". I do agree that programs which find
its model does not meet the primary needs of its learners, should not go
after its money.

 

Howard Dooley

RIRAL

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From andreawilder at comcast.net  Thu Oct 18 14:35:44 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 14:35:44 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 980] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398E52@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>
	<8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com>
	<D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398E52@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Message-ID: <a49b2878da76d6102c5365e34e764b26@comcast.net>

Hi Virginia,

Would you please define "think-attack skills?"

Thanks.

Andrea

On Oct 18, 2007, at 1:12 PM, Virginia Tardaewether wrote:

> Andres, etal.
> What I?ve noticed in 37 years of teaching adults is if students are 
> improving their think-attack skills, their scores improve, no matter 
> what the assessment tool. It is not necessary to teach to the test.? 
> Plus, any good assessment is going to be about life and work and will 
> fit what people/students have as goals.
> ?
> The largest challenge really is getting at that fine-tuned goal, 
> getting students to see their potential and apply their abilities in 
> new ways toward reaching it.
> Va
> ?
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com
> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:46 AM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 976] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
> ?
> Melinda:
>
>  I don't disagree with anything that you are saying. However, in my 
> opinion, the problem with NRS-WIA is the same problem as with NCLB.? 
> Skillful teachers? in the right settings with the proper tools can 
> facilitate knowledge in broad areas, and yet help many students show 
> progress in standardized tests. However, most teachers feel like they 
> are under pressure to demonstrate level gains in the given measuring 
> tool. Comments from Tom Stitch in the NLA forum articulated exactly 
> this. Essentially teachers felt pressure to show gains in standardized 
> instruments and spent most of their time preparing students to 
> demonstrate gains in these instruments. Most felt that they had little 
> time for other activities and that they were unable to teach things 
> that they felt were important. Comments, to me personally, from 
> teachers throughout the US over the years suggests the same. In fact, 
> when teachers are asked to document evidence of additional activities 
> and progress in other ar eas aside from the mandated assessment, they 
> become highly resentful. They feel that they are under pressure to 
> prepare the students to show gains in the TABE, BEST plus, CASAS, and 
> whatever else, and in addition, their administrators want them to 
> demonstrate that their students are becoming more knowledgeable of 
> civics, health, politics, history, the environment and whatever else. 
> Teachers feel that the paperwork becomes insurmountable and that their 
> role is to keep with an endless bureaucracy rather than concentrate on 
> just teaching.
>
>  In addition, as I argued in the NLA forum, there is no evidence that 
> standardized tests demonstrate anything other than knowledge on how to 
> take them. I don't think that there is a single scientific article 
> that states that not getting a certain score in the BEST plus, TABE, 
> CASAS or whatever, means that you do not posses the skills that the 
> instrument attempts to measure. You make that argument yourself. You 
> claim that having an GED is no indication of academic skills in math, 
> reading, etc. The only difference is that the GED does represent 
> access to employment, college and a significant entitlement for many. 
> However, moving from beginning literacy ESL to beginning ESL is 
> absolutely, unquestionably, indisputably, unarguably, overwhelmingly, 
> incredibly meaningless. In fact, what happens in many programs is that 
> a student will start in beginning literacy ESL, spend a whole semester 
> or year in the same level and at the end of the year the student will 
> demonstrate that he/she mo ved to beginning ESL. The student will stop 
> attending for whatever reason and return to the same or a different 
> program some time later. The student will be assessed again and will 
> likely place in beginning literacy ESL again, and do the whole thing 
> again. Now, this is not an exception. This is the rule w/ many 
> programs.
>
>  Andres
> ?
> ?
>
> -----Original Message-----
>  From: Melinda Hefner <mhefner at cccti.edu>
>  To: Assessment at nifl.gov
>  Sent: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 9:22 am
>  Subject: [Assessment 975] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
> I hope that this post will not be perceived as being disrespectful 
> because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there are some 
> slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure 
> descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.? While 
> there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there 
> are also optional?requirements or outcome measures that states may 
> choose to include for determination of performance among its local 
> programs.? NRS guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of 
> student and instructor led educational plans where instructional goals 
> are dynamic, meet student needs, and drive instruction.? To say that 
> nothing else matters other than level completion is not entirely 
> accurate although I'm certain that there may be some administrators 
> around the country who make it appear that way.? Fortunately, in North 
> Carolina our state leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very 
> seriously, use them to support instruction not impede it.
> ?
> Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a goal, 
> unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student 
> functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or 
> language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly 
> for students transitioning into post-secondary training.? Although 
> there are similar transitioning issues among underprepared students 
> who graduate from high school in the traditional fashion, adult 
> literacy providers should make successful transition into 
> post-secondary training a high priority for students as applicable.? 
> One of the many ways to do this is to assure and validate via 
> pre-testing and post-testing that students do, indeed, function at the 
> adult secondary high level and have not merely gained sufficient 
> information and skills to have passed a GED test(s).
> ?
> Melinda
>
>  >>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message 
> <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora" 
> <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:
> This email is cross-posted for your interest.
> ?
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> ?
> **********
> ?
> -----Original Message-----
> From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org 
> [mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org] On Behalf Of 
> andresmuro at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:23 PM
> To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
> Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
> ?
> Daphnee:
>
>  I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that will 
> complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of 
> students who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. 
> Of those that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In 
> other words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the 
> next one. WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have 
> beginning literacy ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. 
> They also have beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, 
> and GED. May be I have the names of the level wrong, but it is 
> something like that. So, if a student starts at beginning literacy 
> ESL, s/he has several levels to move through to get to GED. While 
> there are few students getting to the GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE 
> programs to show higher success rates than before. However, the number 
> of GED completers over the total number of students in ABE has gone 
> down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the % of students that show 
> progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students use language to 
> access health care, enroll in college, help their kids with homework, 
> build computers, publish stories, etc all that is irrelevant. The only 
> thing that matters is if students? show progress in the BEST or TABE. 
> In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL class and the 
> student decides to go? take the GED on her own, that would not be 
> considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares 
> beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have 
> the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters.
>
>  I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a WIA-NRS 
> ABE program. So, we don't have to pretest,? and assess the students 
> every five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate 
> outcomes outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction 
> we discuss health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very 
> high GED completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had 
> an ABE- grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to 
> the next. It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program 
> anymore.
>
>  Andres
> ?
> ?
> -----Original Message-----
>  From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
>  To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
>  Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am
>  Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
> Forgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I received the 
> following
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can 
> share with the
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> person who asked me.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates 
> from one
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to 
> ASE/GED)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> what would you consider a? "good" rate?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Daphne Greenberg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Georgia State University
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.org
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> LiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for literacy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> http://literacytent.org
>
> Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail!
> -------------------------------
>
>
>
>
> National Institute for Literacy
>
>
>
>
> Assessment mailing list
>
>
>
>
> Assessment at nifl.gov
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>
>
>
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
> Email delivered to andresmuro at aol.com
>  size=2 width="100%" align=center>
> Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail!
> -------------------------------
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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Thu Oct 18 15:24:38 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 12:24:38 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 981] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <a49b2878da76d6102c5365e34e764b26@comcast.net>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu><8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com><D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398E52@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
	<a49b2878da76d6102c5365e34e764b26@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398EFA@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

Andrea

Think-attack skills include:  please add folks

1)      plan do review

2)      Does this make sense?

3)      What am I looking for here?

4)      Will what I already know work in this new situation, or 

5)      How do I need to change what I know so it works in this new
situation?

6)      What is the situation?

7)      Gosh this looks like that, humm therefore I might know something
about it

8)      Derivation:  oh that word came to us from there, ahhhhhh

9)      Meanings: oh here's a missed meaning for that word that I didn't
know

10)  Meanings: this meaning is not what I thought, I need to update my
meaning file

11)   

Va

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Andrea Wilder
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 11:36 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 980] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Hi Virginia, 

 

Would you please define "think-attack skills?" 

 

Thanks. 

 

Andrea 

 

On Oct 18, 2007, at 1:12 PM, Virginia Tardaewether wrote: 

	 

	Andres, etal. 

	What I've noticed in 37 years of teaching adults is if students
are improving their think-attack skills, their scores improve, no matter
what the assessment tool. It is not necessary to teach to the test.
Plus, any good assessment is going to be about life and work and will
fit what people/students have as goals. 

	  

	The largest challenge really is getting at that fine-tuned goal,
getting students to see their potential and apply their abilities in new
ways toward reaching it. 

	Va 

	  

	 

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com 

	Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:46 AM 

	To: assessment at nifl.gov 

	Subject: [Assessment 976] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement 

	  

	Melinda: 

	 

	I don't disagree with anything that you are saying. However, in
my opinion, the problem with NRS-WIA is the same problem as with NCLB.
Skillful teachers  in the right settings with the proper tools can
facilitate knowledge in broad areas, and yet help many students show
progress in standardized tests. However, most teachers feel like they
are under pressure to demonstrate level gains in the given measuring
tool. Comments from Tom Stitch in the NLA forum articulated exactly
this. Essentially teachers felt pressure to show gains in standardized
instruments and spent most of their time preparing students to
demonstrate gains in these instruments. Most felt that they had little
time for other activities and that they were unable to teach things that
they felt were important. Comments, to me personally, from teachers
throughout the US over the years suggests the same. In fact, when
teachers are asked to document evidence of additional activities and
progress in other ar eas aside from the mandated assessment, they become
highly resentful. They feel that they are under pressure to prepare the
students to show gains in the TABE, BEST plus, CASAS, and whatever else,
and in addition, their administrators want them to demonstrate that
their students are becoming more knowledgeable of civics, health,
politics, history, the environment and whatever else. Teachers feel that
the paperwork becomes insurmountable and that their role is to keep with
an endless bureaucracy rather than concentrate on just teaching. 

	 

	In addition, as I argued in the NLA forum, there is no evidence
that standardized tests demonstrate anything other than knowledge on how
to take them. I don't think that there is a single scientific article
that states that not getting a certain score in the BEST plus, TABE,
CASAS or whatever, means that you do not posses the skills that the
instrument attempts to measure. You make that argument yourself. You
claim that having an GED is no indication of academic skills in math,
reading, etc. The only difference is that the GED does represent access
to employment, college and a significant entitlement for many. However,
moving from beginning literacy ESL to beginning ESL is absolutely,
unquestionably, indisputably, unarguably, overwhelmingly, incredibly
meaningless. In fact, what happens in many programs is that a student
will start in beginning literacy ESL, spend a whole semester or year in
the same level and at the end of the year the student will demonstrate
that he/she mo ved to beginning ESL. The student will stop attending for
whatever reason and return to the same or a different program some time
later. The student will be assessed again and will likely place in
beginning literacy ESL again, and do the whole thing again. Now, this is
not an exception. This is the rule w/ many programs. 

	 

	Andres 

	  

	  

	 

	-----Original Message----- 

	From: Melinda Hefner <mhefner at cccti.edu> 

	To: Assessment at nifl.gov 

	Sent: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 9:22 am 

	Subject: [Assessment 975] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement 

	I hope that this post will not be perceived as being
disrespectful because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there
are some slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure
descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.  While
there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there are
also optional requirements or outcome measures that states may choose to
include for determination of performance among its local programs.  NRS
guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of student and
instructor led educational plans where instructional goals are dynamic,
meet student needs, and drive instruction.  To say that nothing else
matters other than level completion is not entirely accurate although
I'm certain that there may be some administrators around the country who
make it appear that way.  Fortunately, in North Carolina our state
leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very seriously, use them to
support instruction not impede it. 

	  

	Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a
goal, unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student
functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or
language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly for
students transitioning into post-secondary training.  Although there are
similar transitioning issues among underprepared students who graduate
from high school in the traditional fashion, adult literacy providers
should make successful transition into post-secondary training a high
priority for students as applicable.  One of the many ways to do this is
to assure and validate via pre-testing and post-testing that students
do, indeed, function at the adult secondary high level and have not
merely gained sufficient information and skills to have passed a GED
test(s). 

	  

	Melinda 

	 

	>>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message
<059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora"
<marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote: 

	This email is cross-posted for your interest. 

	  

	Marie Cora 

	Assessment Discussion List Moderator 

	  

	********** 

	  

	-----Original Message----- 

	From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
[mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org] On Behalf Of
andresmuro at aol.com 

	Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:23 PM 

	To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org 

	Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement 

	  

	Daphnee: 

	 

	I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that
will complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of
students who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of
those that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other
words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one.
WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy
ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have
beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I
have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if
a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to
move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the
GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than
before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of
students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the %
of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students
use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids
with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is
irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students  show progress in
the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL
class and the student decides to go  take the GED on her own, that would
not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares
beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have
the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters. 

	 

	I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a
WIA-NRS ABE program. So, we don't have to pretest,  and assess the
students every five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate
outcomes outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we
discuss health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high
GED completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an
ABE- grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the
next. It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program
anymore. 

	 

	Andres 

	  

	  

	-----Original Message----- 

	From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu> 

	To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org 

	Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am 

	Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movement 

	Forgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I
received the following 

	 

	question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the 

	 

	person who asked me. 

	 

	 

	 

	If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion"
rates from one 

	 

	level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE
to ASE/GED) 

	 

	what would you consider a  "good" rate? 

	 

	 

	 

	Thanks, 

	 

	Daphne Greenberg 

	 

	Georgia State University 

	 

	 

	 

	_______________________________________________ 

	 

	AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.org 

	 

	http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla 

	 

	LiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for
literacy 

	 

	http://literacytent.org 

	 

	Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL
Mail! 

	------------------------------- 

	National Institute for Literacy 

	Assessment mailing list 

	Assessment at nifl.gov 

	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to 

	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

	Email delivered to andresmuro at aol.com 

	size=2 width="100%" align=center> 

	Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL
Mail! 

	------------------------------- 

	National Institute for Literacy 

	Assessment mailing list 

	Assessment at nifl.gov 

	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

	Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net 

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From EBrown at parkland.edu  Thu Oct 18 16:14:26 2007
From: EBrown at parkland.edu (Evelyn Brown)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 15:14:26 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 982]   Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398EFA@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu><8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com><D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398E52@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
	<a49b2878da76d6102c5365e34e764b26@comcast.net>
	<D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C07398EFA@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>
Message-ID: <47177852.A3CD.0046.0@parkland.edu>

Tha'ts the most useful list of critical thinking skills questions/statements I've seen.
thanks, 
Evelyn
>>> "Virginia Tardaewether" <tarv at chemeketa.edu> 10/18/2007 2:24 PM >>>
Andrea

Think-attack skills include:  please add folks

1)      plan do review

2)      Does this make sense?

3)      What am I looking for here?

4)      Will what I already know work in this new situation, or 

5)      How do I need to change what I know so it works in this new
situation?

6)      What is the situation?

7)      Gosh this looks like that, humm therefore I might know something
about it

8)      Derivation:  oh that word came to us from there, ahhhhhh

9)      Meanings: oh here's a missed meaning for that word that I didn't
know

10)  Meanings: this meaning is not what I thought, I need to update my
meaning file

11)   

Va

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
On Behalf Of Andrea Wilder
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 11:36 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 980] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Hi Virginia, 

 

Would you please define "think-attack skills?" 

 

Thanks. 

 

Andrea 

 

On Oct 18, 2007, at 1:12 PM, Virginia Tardaewether wrote: 

	 

	Andres, etal. 

	What I've noticed in 37 years of teaching adults is if students
are improving their think-attack skills, their scores improve, no matter
what the assessment tool. It is not necessary to teach to the test.
Plus, any good assessment is going to be about life and work and will
fit what people/students have as goals. 

	  

	The largest challenge really is getting at that fine-tuned goal,
getting students to see their potential and apply their abilities in new
ways toward reaching it. 

	Va 

	  

	 

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com 

	Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 9:46 AM 

	To: assessment at nifl.gov 

	Subject: [Assessment 976] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement 

	  

	Melinda: 

	 

	I don't disagree with anything that you are saying. However, in
my opinion, the problem with NRS-WIA is the same problem as with NCLB.
Skillful teachers  in the right settings with the proper tools can
facilitate knowledge in broad areas, and yet help many students show
progress in standardized tests. However, most teachers feel like they
are under pressure to demonstrate level gains in the given measuring
tool. Comments from Tom Stitch in the NLA forum articulated exactly
this. Essentially teachers felt pressure to show gains in standardized
instruments and spent most of their time preparing students to
demonstrate gains in these instruments. Most felt that they had little
time for other activities and that they were unable to teach things that
they felt were important. Comments, to me personally, from teachers
throughout the US over the years suggests the same. In fact, when
teachers are asked to document evidence of additional activities and
progress in other ar eas aside from the mandated assessment, they become
highly resentful. They feel that they are under pressure to prepare the
students to show gains in the TABE, BEST plus, CASAS, and whatever else,
and in addition, their administrators want them to demonstrate that
their students are becoming more knowledgeable of civics, health,
politics, history, the environment and whatever else. Teachers feel that
the paperwork becomes insurmountable and that their role is to keep with
an endless bureaucracy rather than concentrate on just teaching. 

	 

	In addition, as I argued in the NLA forum, there is no evidence
that standardized tests demonstrate anything other than knowledge on how
to take them. I don't think that there is a single scientific article
that states that not getting a certain score in the BEST plus, TABE,
CASAS or whatever, means that you do not posses the skills that the
instrument attempts to measure. You make that argument yourself. You
claim that having an GED is no indication of academic skills in math,
reading, etc. The only difference is that the GED does represent access
to employment, college and a significant entitlement for many. However,
moving from beginning literacy ESL to beginning ESL is absolutely,
unquestionably, indisputably, unarguably, overwhelmingly, incredibly
meaningless. In fact, what happens in many programs is that a student
will start in beginning literacy ESL, spend a whole semester or year in
the same level and at the end of the year the student will demonstrate
that he/she mo ved to beginning ESL. The student will stop attending for
whatever reason and return to the same or a different program some time
later. The student will be assessed again and will likely place in
beginning literacy ESL again, and do the whole thing again. Now, this is
not an exception. This is the rule w/ many programs. 

	 

	Andres 

	  

	  

	 

	-----Original Message----- 

	From: Melinda Hefner <mhefner at cccti.edu> 

	To: Assessment at nifl.gov 

	Sent: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 9:22 am 

	Subject: [Assessment 975] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement 

	I hope that this post will not be perceived as being
disrespectful because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there
are some slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure
descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.  While
there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there are
also optional requirements or outcome measures that states may choose to
include for determination of performance among its local programs.  NRS
guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of student and
instructor led educational plans where instructional goals are dynamic,
meet student needs, and drive instruction.  To say that nothing else
matters other than level completion is not entirely accurate although
I'm certain that there may be some administrators around the country who
make it appear that way.  Fortunately, in North Carolina our state
leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very seriously, use them to
support instruction not impede it. 

	  

	Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a
goal, unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student
functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or
language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly for
students transitioning into post-secondary training.  Although there are
similar transitioning issues among underprepared students who graduate
from high school in the traditional fashion, adult literacy providers
should make successful transition into post-secondary training a high
priority for students as applicable.  One of the many ways to do this is
to assure and validate via pre-testing and post-testing that students
do, indeed, function at the adult secondary high level and have not
merely gained sufficient information and skills to have passed a GED
test(s). 

	  

	Melinda 

	 

	>>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message
<059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora"
<marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote: 

	This email is cross-posted for your interest. 

	  

	Marie Cora 

	Assessment Discussion List Moderator 

	  

	********** 

	  

	-----Original Message----- 

	From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org 
[mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org] On Behalf Of
andresmuro at aol.com 

	Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:23 PM 

	To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org 

	Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement 

	  

	Daphnee: 

	 

	I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that
will complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of
students who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of
those that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other
words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one.
WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy
ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have
beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I
have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if
a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to
move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the
GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than
before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of
students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the %
of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students
use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids
with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is
irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students  show progress in
the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL
class and the student decides to go  take the GED on her own, that would
not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares
beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have
the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters. 

	 

	I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a
WIA-NRS ABE program. So, we don't have to pretest,  and assess the
students every five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate
outcomes outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we
discuss health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high
GED completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an
ABE- grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the
next. It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program
anymore. 

	 

	Andres 

	  

	  

	-----Original Message----- 

	From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu> 

	To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org 

	Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am 

	Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movement 

	Forgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I
received the following 

	 

	question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I
can share with the 

	 

	person who asked me. 

	 

	 

	 

	If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion"
rates from one 

	 

	level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE
to ASE/GED) 

	 

	what would you consider a  "good" rate? 

	 

	 

	 

	Thanks, 

	 

	Daphne Greenberg 

	 

	Georgia State University 

	 

	 

	 

	_______________________________________________ 

	 

	AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.org 

	 

	http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla 

	 

	LiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for
literacy 

	 

	http://literacytent.org 

	 

	Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL
Mail! 

	------------------------------- 

	National Institute for Literacy 

	Assessment mailing list 

	Assessment at nifl.gov 

	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to 

	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

	Email delivered to andresmuro at aol.com 

	size=2 width="100%" align=center> 

	Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL
Mail! 

	------------------------------- 

	National Institute for Literacy 

	Assessment mailing list 

	Assessment at nifl.gov 

	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

	Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net 

Evelyn Brown
Academic Development Specialist
Parkland College
2400 West Bradley
Champaign, IL 61821
217.351.2587 
ebrown at parkland.edu

From VenuT at lacnyc.org  Thu Oct 18 19:00:03 2007
From: VenuT at lacnyc.org (Venu Thelakkat)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 19:00:03 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 983] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>
	<8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB85916FE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

I am told that standardized assessments, especially those used in adult
literacy, have many problems.  But what is the alternative?  Policy
makers and funders (private or public) want accountability for the money
they disperse and there is very little else that has been proposed.
Even in NRS, educational gain is the only measure that has some validity
as a program outcome.  The other measures such as getting a job or
entering post secondary education are very unreliable given the wide
variety of methods used to collect and report the data.  

 

Venu Thelakkat

Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis

Literacy Assistance Center

32 Broadway, 10th floor

New York, NY 10004

(212) 803-3370

venut at lacnyc.org

www.lacnyc.org

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 12:46 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 976] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Melinda:

I don't disagree with anything that you are saying. However, in my
opinion, the problem with NRS-WIA is the same problem as with NCLB.
Skillful teachers  in the right settings with the proper tools can
facilitate knowledge in broad areas, and yet help many students show
progress in standardized tests. However, most teachers feel like they
are under pressure to demonstrate level gains in the given measuring
tool. Comments from Tom Stitch in the NLA forum articulated exactly
this. Essentially teachers felt pressure to show gains in standardized
instruments and spent most of their time preparing students to
demonstrate gains in these instruments. Most felt that they had little
time for other activities and that they were unable to teach things that
they felt were important. Comments, to me personally, from teachers
throughout the US over the years suggests the same. In fact, when
teachers are asked to document evidence of additional activities and
progress in other ar eas aside from the mandated assessment, they become
highly resentful. They feel that they are under pressure to prepare the
students to show gains in the TABE, BEST plus, CASAS, and whatever else,
and in addition, their administrators want them to demonstrate that
their students are becoming more knowledgeable of civics, health,
politics, history, the environment and whatever else. Teachers feel that
the paperwork becomes insurmountable and that their role is to keep with
an endless bureaucracy rather than concentrate on just teaching. 

In addition, as I argued in the NLA forum, there is no evidence that
standardized tests demonstrate anything other than knowledge on how to
take them. I don't think that there is a single scientific article that
states that not getting a certain score in the BEST plus, TABE, CASAS or
whatever, means that you do not posses the skills that the instrument
attempts to measure. You make that argument yourself. You claim that
having an GED is no indication of academic skills in math, reading, etc.
The only difference is that the GED does represent access to employment,
college and a significant entitlement for many. However, moving from
beginning literacy ESL to beginning ESL is absolutely, unquestionably,
indisputably, unarguably, overwhelmingly, incredibly meaningless. In
fact, what happens in many programs is that a student will start in
beginning literacy ESL, spend a whole semester or year in the same level
and at the end of the year the student will demonstrate that he/she mo
ved to beginning ESL. The student will stop attending for whatever
reason and return to the same or a different program some time later.
The student will be assessed again and will likely place in beginning
literacy ESL again, and do the whole thing again. Now, this is not an
exception. This is the rule w/ many programs. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Melinda Hefner <mhefner at cccti.edu>
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Sent: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 9:22 am
Subject: [Assessment 975] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

I hope that this post will not be perceived as being disrespectful
because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there are some
slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure
descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.  While
there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there are
also optional requirements or outcome measures that states may choose to
include for determination of performance among its local programs.  NRS
guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of student and
instructor led educational plans where instructional goals are dynamic,
meet student needs, and drive instruction.  To say that nothing else
matters other than level completion is not entirely accurate although
I'm certain that there may be some administrators around the country who
make it appear that way.  Fortunately, in North Carolina our state
leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very seriously, use them to
support instruction not impede it.

 

Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a goal,
unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student
functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or
language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly for
students transitioning into post-secondary training.  Although there are
similar transitioning issues among underprepared students who graduate
from high school in the traditional fashion, adult literacy providers
should make successful transition into post-secondary training a high
priority for students as applicable.  One of the many ways to do this is
to assure and validate via pre-testing and post-testing that students
do, indeed, function at the adult secondary high level and have not
merely gained sufficient information and skills to have passed a GED
test(s).

 

Melinda

>>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message
<059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora"
<marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:

This email is cross-posted for your interest.

 

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 

**********

 

-----Original Message-----
From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
[mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
<mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org?> ] On Behalf Of
andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:23 PM
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Daphnee:

I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that will
complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of students
who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of those
that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other
words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one.
WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy
ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have
beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I
have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if
a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to
move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the
GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than
before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of
students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the %
of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students
use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids
with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is
irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students  show progress in
the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL
class and the student decides to go  take the GED on her own, that would
not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares
beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have
the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters.

I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a WIA-NRS ABE
program. So, we don't have to pretest,  and assess the students every
five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate outcomes
outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we discuss
health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high GED
completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an ABE-
grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the next.
It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program anymore. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am
Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I received the
following 

question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share
with the 

person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one 

level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to
ASE/GED) 

what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,

Daphne Greenberg

Georgia State University

_______________________________________________

AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.org

http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla

LiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for literacy

http://literacytent.org <http://literacytent.org/> 
________________________________

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail
<http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/index.htm?nc
id=AOLAOF00020000000970> !

-------------------------------

National Institute for Literacy

Assessment mailing list

Assessment at nifl.gov

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Email delivered to andresmuro at aol.com
________________________________

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From djrosen at comcast.net  Thu Oct 18 20:38:11 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 20:38:11 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 984] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB85916FE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>
	<8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com>
	<6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB85916FE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
Message-ID: <F574BD12-37D2-4853-BDCE-122220ED193B@comcast.net>

Assessment Colleagues,

On Oct 18, 2007, at 7:00 PM, Venu Thelakkat asked:
> I am told that standardized assessments, especially those used in  
> adult literacy, have many problems.  But what is the alternative?   
> Policy makers and funders (private or public) want accountability  
> for the money they disperse and there is very little else that has  
> been proposed.  Even in NRS, educational gain is the only measure  
> that has some validity as a program outcome.  The other measures  
> such as getting a job or entering post secondary education are very  
> unreliable given the wide variety of methods used to collect and  
> report the data.

Great question, Venu.

One alternative that makes sense has been proposed, but I am told  
that Congress so far has been unwilling to accept it. Instead of  
reporting outcomes for every student in every federally-funded  
program, OVAE should each year pick a random sample of federally- 
funded programs and measure attainment of student goals over a multi- 
year period, that is, measure impact.  Some would argue that  
measuring impact is not possible, that adult education students are  
too hard to track over time, but the Longitudinal Study of Adult  
Literacy, now in its eighth year in Portland, Oregon, has shown that  
it is not impossible.

Isn't impact more useful to policy makers than outcomes? Does anyone  
in Congress really care how many level gains students make? Some  
policy makers may care about how many program participants --  
especially over time -- have improved their employment status, can  
read to their children, can use  a computer, now have a diploma or  
GED, and have succeeded in their education beyond secondary level.   
Of these goals, only the GED and high school diploma (for now at  
least) require a standardized test.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net
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From dglass at ksbor.org  Fri Oct 19 01:13:30 2007
From: dglass at ksbor.org (Dianne Glass)
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 00:13:30 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 985] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
Message-ID: <4717F6AA020000670000989B@KSBORWEB.KSBOR.ORG>

Several states, Kansas being one of them, have the option of using
data matching with the Department of Labor UI to determine employment
and retain/improve employment outcomes for adult education participants.
We also do data matching to determine GED outcomes.  For the first time 
ever, this year we will be able to do data matching with our postsecondary 
education database to determine enter postsecondary education or training 
outcomes for adult education participants.  

While every state does not have these data matching options, those of 
us who do have these opportunities have a much more convincing
argument to present to state legislators for supporting adult education.
Kansas has received an increase of 35% in state funding since FY04.  
For years we made our presentations to legislative committees with adult
learners telling their stories.  Adult education was only one of many 
state-funded programs that postively impacted the lives of Kansans--according 
to the virtually endless number of presentations made to legislative committees.

However, when Kansas Adult Education could give legislators actual numbers 
of adult education participants who entered employment, retained employment,
entered postsecondary education, and passed the GED Test--determined through 
data matching--legislators definitely took notice.  I had a legislative committee 
chair tell me that his committee decided to recommend support an increase in 
funding for adult education because, "You had the numbers.  It's always hard to 
determine where to allocate limited dollars.  Everybody has a convincing argument 
for why we should give them additional funding.  But you had 'hard' evidence 
that adult education is making a difference in Kansas."  

Are there problems with data matching?  Of course.  Many adult education
participants choose not to or cannot provide social security numbers or 
work permit numbers, so we "lose" any employment-related outcomes 
these learners achieve.  For eight years, we have done EXTENSIVE surveying
to determine if learners with the goal of entering postsecondary education 
or training have actually achieved these goals, but our contact rate has 
always been less than 70%.  Even when we have the option of data
matching with the Kansas postsecondary database, we will only be
able to capture those exited adult education participants who enter
postsecondary education and training in Kansas.  (A special problem
since 30% of our learners live within 10 miles of Kansas City, MO.)

So while our numbers under represent the numbers and percentages
of adult learners who actually achieve these outcomes--WE HAVE NUMBERS!
Conservative numbers are better than no numbers.  And using the numbers
we do have, we strive each year to do better.  It's very difficult to improve
without a baseline...

Dianne Glass
Director of Adult Education
Kansas Board of Regents
1000 SW Jackson, Suite 520
Topeka, KS  66612-1368
785.296.7159
dglass at ksbor.org

>>> "Venu Thelakkat" <VenuT at lacnyc.org> 10/18/07 6:00 PM >>>
I am told that standardized assessments, especially those used in adult
literacy, have many problems.  But what is the alternative?  Policy
makers and funders (private or public) want accountability for the money
they disperse and there is very little else that has been proposed.
Even in NRS, educational gain is the only measure that has some validity
as a program outcome.  The other measures such as getting a job or
entering post secondary education are very unreliable given the wide
variety of methods used to collect and report the data.  

 

Venu Thelakkat

Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis

Literacy Assistance Center

32 Broadway, 10th floor

New York, NY 10004

(212) 803-3370

venut at lacnyc.org

www.lacnyc.org

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 12:46 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 976] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Melinda:

I don't disagree with anything that you are saying. However, in my
opinion, the problem with NRS-WIA is the same problem as with NCLB.
Skillful teachers  in the right settings with the proper tools can
facilitate knowledge in broad areas, and yet help many students show
progress in standardized tests. However, most teachers feel like they
are under pressure to demonstrate level gains in the given measuring
tool. Comments from Tom Stitch in the NLA forum articulated exactly
this. Essentially teachers felt pressure to show gains in standardized
instruments and spent most of their time preparing students to
demonstrate gains in these instruments. Most felt that they had little
time for other activities and that they were unable to teach things that
they felt were important. Comments, to me personally, from teachers
throughout the US over the years suggests the same. In fact, when
teachers are asked to document evidence of additional activities and
progress in other ar eas aside from the mandated assessment, they become
highly resentful. They feel that they are under pressure to prepare the
students to show gains in the TABE, BEST plus, CASAS, and whatever else,
and in addition, their administrators want them to demonstrate that
their students are becoming more knowledgeable of civics, health,
politics, history, the environment and whatever else. Teachers feel that
the paperwork becomes insurmountable and that their role is to keep with
an endless bureaucracy rather than concentrate on just teaching. 

In addition, as I argued in the NLA forum, there is no evidence that
standardized tests demonstrate anything other than knowledge on how to
take them. I don't think that there is a single scientific article that
states that not getting a certain score in the BEST plus, TABE, CASAS or
whatever, means that you do not posses the skills that the instrument
attempts to measure. You make that argument yourself. You claim that
having an GED is no indication of academic skills in math, reading, etc.
The only difference is that the GED does represent access to employment,
college and a significant entitlement for many. However, moving from
beginning literacy ESL to beginning ESL is absolutely, unquestionably,
indisputably, unarguably, overwhelmingly, incredibly meaningless. In
fact, what happens in many programs is that a student will start in
beginning literacy ESL, spend a whole semester or year in the same level
and at the end of the year the student will demonstrate that he/she mo
ved to beginning ESL. The student will stop attending for whatever
reason and return to the same or a different program some time later.
The student will be assessed again and will likely place in beginning
literacy ESL again, and do the whole thing again. Now, this is not an
exception. This is the rule w/ many programs. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Melinda Hefner <mhefner at cccti.edu>
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Sent: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 9:22 am
Subject: [Assessment 975] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

I hope that this post will not be perceived as being disrespectful
because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there are some
slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure
descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.  While
there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there are
also optional requirements or outcome measures that states may choose to
include for determination of performance among its local programs.  NRS
guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of student and
instructor led educational plans where instructional goals are dynamic,
meet student needs, and drive instruction.  To say that nothing else
matters other than level completion is not entirely accurate although
I'm certain that there may be some administrators around the country who
make it appear that way.  Fortunately, in North Carolina our state
leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very seriously, use them to
support instruction not impede it.

 

Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a goal,
unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student
functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or
language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly for
students transitioning into post-secondary training.  Although there are
similar transitioning issues among underprepared students who graduate
from high school in the traditional fashion, adult literacy providers
should make successful transition into post-secondary training a high
priority for students as applicable.  One of the many ways to do this is
to assure and validate via pre-testing and post-testing that students
do, indeed, function at the adult secondary high level and have not
merely gained sufficient information and skills to have passed a GED
test(s).

 

Melinda

>>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message
<059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora"
<marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:

This email is cross-posted for your interest.

 

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 

**********

 

-----Original Message-----
From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
[mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
<mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org?> ] On Behalf Of
andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:23 PM
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Daphnee:

I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that will
complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of students
who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of those
that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other
words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one.
WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy
ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have
beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I
have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if
a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to
move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the
GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than
before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of
students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the %
of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students
use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids
with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is
irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students  show progress in
the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL
class and the student decides to go  take the GED on her own, that would
not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares
beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have
the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters.

I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a WIA-NRS ABE
program. So, we don't have to pretest,  and assess the students every
five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate outcomes
outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we discuss
health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high GED
completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an ABE-
grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the next.
It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program anymore. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am
Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I received the
following 

question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share
with the 

person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one 

level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to
ASE/GED) 

what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,

Daphne Greenberg

Georgia State University

_______________________________________________

AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.org

http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla

LiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for literacy

http://literacytent.org <http://literacytent.org/> 
________________________________

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail
<http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/index.htm?nc
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-------------------------------

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Assessment at nifl.gov

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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From hdooley at riral.org  Fri Oct 19 09:45:34 2007
From: hdooley at riral.org (Howard Dooley)
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 09:45:34 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 986] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
In-Reply-To: <8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu>
	<8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <0BF2D0726318524ABEF6D58E7BB3CCEB0B9538@pdc.Riral.local>

I only want to say that I think the message below crossed the line from
discussion to rant. Several facts stated are not facts at all, but
anecdotes and opinions. I was particularly struck that Melinda's
statements about the GED were misconstrued: she never states that "the
GED is no indication of academic skills". It, in fact, is. And while it
is true that an individual adult may not be able to demonstrate existing
skill or knowledge with a particular instrument, the reverse is not
true; namely, that success on the instrument is unrelated to actual
knowledge.

 

I don't have the inclination to go tit for tat with what was said.
However, I do want to say that: instructors at programs I know are not
resentful when asked to report on all the successes their learners are
achieving in their classes; and, if instructors and program managers are
unable to do more than teach to tests, warehouse adults, and recycle
them meaninglessly through class after class, then perhaps, they should
rethink their teaching methods and their program structures.

 

Howard

RIRAL

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 12:46 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 976] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Melinda:

I don't disagree with anything that you are saying. However, in my
opinion, the problem with NRS-WIA is the same problem as with NCLB.
Skillful teachers  in the right settings with the proper tools can
facilitate knowledge in broad areas, and yet help many students show
progress in standardized tests. However, most teachers feel like they
are under pressure to demonstrate level gains in the given measuring
tool. Comments from Tom Stitch in the NLA forum articulated exactly
this. Essentially teachers felt pressure to show gains in standardized
instruments and spent most of their time preparing students to
demonstrate gains in these instruments. Most felt that they had little
time for other activities and that they were unable to teach things that
they felt were important. Comments, to me personally, from teachers
throughout the US over the years suggests the same. In fact, when
teachers are asked to document evidence of additional activities and
progress in other ar eas aside from the mandated assessment, they become
highly resentful. They feel that they are under pressure to prepare the
students to show gains in the TABE, BEST plus, CASAS, and whatever else,
and in addition, their administrators want them to demonstrate that
their students are becoming more knowledgeable of civics, health,
politics, history, the environment and whatever else. Teachers feel that
the paperwork becomes insurmountable and that their role is to keep with
an endless bureaucracy rather than concentrate on just teaching. 

In addition, as I argued in the NLA forum, there is no evidence that
standardized tests demonstrate anything other than knowledge on how to
take them. I don't think that there is a single scientific article that
states that not getting a certain score in the BEST plus, TABE, CASAS or
whatever, means that you do not posses the skills that the instrument
attempts to measure. You make that argument yourself. You claim that
having an GED is no indication of academic skills in math, reading, etc.
The only difference is that the GED does represent access to employment,
college and a significant entitlement for many. However, moving from
beginning literacy ESL to beginning ESL is absolutely, unquestionably,
indisputably, unarguably, overwhelmingly, incredibly meaningless. In
fact, what happens in many programs is that a student will start in
beginning literacy ESL, spend a whole semester or year in the same level
and at the end of the year the student will demonstrate that he/she mo
ved to beginning ESL. The student will stop attending for whatever
reason and return to the same or a different program some time later.
The student will be assessed again and will likely place in beginning
literacy ESL again, and do the whole thing again. Now, this is not an
exception. This is the rule w/ many programs. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Melinda Hefner <mhefner at cccti.edu>
To: Assessment at nifl.gov
Sent: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 9:22 am
Subject: [Assessment 975] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

I hope that this post will not be perceived as being disrespectful
because it's certainly not intended to be; however, there are some
slight but noteworthy inaccuracies in the NRS outcome measure
descriptions and requirement that were in the original post.  While
there are certain NRS requirements that all states must meet, there are
also optional requirements or outcome measures that states may choose to
include for determination of performance among its local programs.  NRS
guidelines, when adhered to, are quite supportive of student and
instructor led educational plans where instructional goals are dynamic,
meet student needs, and drive instruction.  To say that nothing else
matters other than level completion is not entirely accurate although
I'm certain that there may be some administrators around the country who
make it appear that way.  Fortunately, in North Carolina our state
leadership, while taking NRS guidelines very seriously, use them to
support instruction not impede it.

 

Additionally, while I obviously support GED completion as a goal,
unfortunately GED completion alone does not assure that a student
functions at an adult secondary high level in math, reading, and/or
language which has been problematic in a number of ways particularly for
students transitioning into post-secondary training.  Although there are
similar transitioning issues among underprepared students who graduate
from high school in the traditional fashion, adult literacy providers
should make successful transition into post-secondary training a high
priority for students as applicable.  One of the many ways to do this is
to assure and validate via pre-testing and post-testing that students
do, indeed, function at the adult secondary high level and have not
merely gained sufficient information and skills to have passed a GED
test(s).

 

Melinda

>>> On 10/17/2007 at 8:26 pm, in message
<059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0 at LITNOW>, "Marie Cora"
<marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> wrote:

This email is cross-posted for your interest.

 

Marie Cora

Assessment Discussion List Moderator

 

**********

 

-----Original Message-----
From: aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
[mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org
<mailto:aaace-nla-bounces at lists.literacytent.org?> ] On Behalf Of
andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:23 PM
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Subject: Re: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

 

Daphnee:

I think that the USDE and WIA-NRS look at a minimum of 66% that will
complete a level. Supposedly a program has to base test 90% of students
who enroll in program within the first week of instruction. Of those
that have a base test they expect that 66% show progress. In other
words, 66% should be able to go from one of the levels to the next one.
WIA-NRS has a bunch of levels. for example, the have beginning literacy
ESL, beginning ESL, Intermediate ESL, Advanced ESL. They also have
beginning literacy, intermediate literacy, advanced, and GED. May be I
have the names of the level wrong, but it is something like that. So, if
a student starts at beginning literacy ESL, s/he has several levels to
move through to get to GED. While there are few students getting to the
GED level, WIA-NRS allows ABE programs to show higher success rates than
before. However, the number of GED completers over the total number of
students in ABE has gone down. ABE programs are only evaluated on the %
of students that show progress in the TABE, BEST, etc. So, if students
use language to access health care, enroll in college, help their kids
with homework, build computers, publish stories, etc all that is
irrelevant. The only thing that matters is if students  show progress in
the BEST or TABE. In fact, if a students is enrolled in a beginning ESL
class and the student decides to go  take the GED on her own, that would
not be considered progress based on WIA-NRS unless the student declares
beforehand that GED is a goal. So, teachers are under pressure to have
the students show progress in these tests and nothing else matters.

I run a GED program with high completion rates. it is not a WIA-NRS ABE
program. So, we don't have to pretest,  and assess the students every
five weeks. We are under no pressure to show intermediate outcomes
outside from GED completion. In addition to GED instruction we discuss
health literacy, nutrition, legal issues, etc. We have very high GED
completion numbers. Our students also publish stories. We had an ABE-
grant. We could only measure success rates from one level to the next.
It was an insane bureaucracy. We don't have the ABE program anymore. 

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Daphne Greenberg <ALCDGG at langate.gsu.edu>
To: aaace-nla at lists.literacytent.org
Sent: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 8:49 am
Subject: [AAACE-NLA] level movement

Forgive my cross posting to a few electronic lists, but I received the
following 

question, and I am hoping that someone has good advice that I can share
with the 

person who asked me.

If you were to review a program's "graduation" or "completion" rates
from one 

level to the next (for example from ESL to ABE or ASE/GED or ABE to
ASE/GED) 

what would you consider a  "good" rate?

Thanks,

Daphne Greenberg

Georgia State University

_______________________________________________

AAACE-NLA mailing list: AAACE-NLA at lists.literacytent.org

http://lists.literacytent.org/mailman/listinfo/aaace-nla

LiteracyTent: web hosting, news, community and goodies for literacy

http://literacytent.org <http://literacytent.org/> 
________________________________

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail
<http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/index.htm?nc
id=AOLAOF00020000000970> !

-------------------------------

National Institute for Literacy

Assessment mailing list

Assessment at nifl.gov

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

Email delivered to andresmuro at aol.com
________________________________

size=2 width="100%" align=center> 

Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail
<http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/index.htm?nc
id=AOLAOF00020000000970> !

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From gbundy at rmi.net  Fri Oct 19 12:23:52 2007
From: gbundy at rmi.net (Gail B)
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 10:23:52 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
Subject: [Assessment 987] Re: FW: [AAACE-NLA] level movement
Message-ID: <19629977.1192811032702.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

I am with a small program that has an AEFLA Grant. I have personally struggled intellectually with the level gain measure -- afterall -- how many students enter a program with a goal of increasing their test scores by at least 1 EFL. 

However, after several years, I realize that the level gain targets actually helps maintain pressure on us teachers to make sure that students are gaining academic skills and competencies. Also, I have come to realize that students like the honesty of the TABE test results.  Instead of having  a vague sense that they are bad at math, we are able to show them exactly what they need to learn. 

Just last week one student who had been struggling with math for over a year - continually testing in the third EFL -- finally had the major breakthrough - and jumped six grade levels - and 2 EFLs -- She was ecstatic -- and the whole class celebrated with her -- with as much enthusiasm as they will celebrate when she actually passes the math test -- becasue we all know that she is conquering her math fear and will be passing the test from a solid baseline of math competence. And as a teacher, I know that we finally developed a learning and problem-solving strategy that really works for her. 

Post-program survey work would not be effective with the population we serve -- We do call students after they have left and try to maintain records on how they are doing -- and we often hear from relatives and referrals how students are doing.  However, between high mobility and cell phone numbers that change a couple times a year -- I would hypothesize that the percent that could be found would be relatively low.

Gail Bundy
Native American Multi-Cultural Education School
3600 Morrison Road
Denver, CO 80219    

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Fri Oct 19 12:44:40 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 12:44:40 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 988]  FW: Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, Racism
Message-ID: <074b01c8126f$58bc89c0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:  the following post is from Tom Sticht.  When Tom first sent
this email to be posted, I initially questioned the relevance of it for
the assessment discussion list.  There are certainly connections here,
but part of what this List is intended for is to be true to the issue of
learner assessment.  So Tom and I had an email exchange and he said to
me:

"I think the whole IQ and intelligence debate centers on test
(assessment) results, as Watson said. So I thought it was a natural for
the Assessment folks..."

which convinced me that it is indeed relevant.

What are your thoughts - either on the content of Tom's article, or on
my and his exchange, for that matter?  

This also makes me think of the hotly debated issue of using
comprehensive tests to determine whether a child graduates from high
school - or whether a fast-track GED is a good thing or not.

What are your thoughts?

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

********** 

October 17, 2007

Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, and Racism

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

The 2003 National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) found that, as
with
most general literacy and other broadband cognitive assessments of the
last
century, African-Americans scored well below White adults. Perhaps for
most
people, this signifies that greater efforts are needed in the education
of
African-Americans. But for some others, this may simply reinforce the
belief that African-Americans are genetically lower in intelligence
compared to Whites and this shows itself in the differences in literacy
scores.

According to an article on the web site for The Independent news service
in
London, England for 17 October 2007, online at
http://news.independent.co.uk/sci_tech/article3067222.ece, James Watson,
a
Nobel Prize winner for work on DNA and genetics, thinks that Africans
are
less intelligent than Westerners. The article states that in a recent
interview Watson "claimed that black people were less intelligent than
white people and the idea that "equal powers of reason" were shared
across
racial groups was a delusion." According to The Independent, Watson said
that "Western policies towards African countries were wrongly based on
an
assumption that black people were as clever as their white counterparts
when "testing" suggested the contrary. He claimed genes responsible for
creating differences in human intelligence could be found within a
decade."

In an earlier interview in 2005, another Nobel Prize laureate, this time
for
economics, James Heckman discussed his ideas about cognitive skills and
their malleability in later life with  members of a presidential
commission
consisting of  former U.S. senators, heads of federal agencies, tax
attorneys and academic economists.  In his comments Heckman expressed
his
belief that "IQ is basically formed by age 8, and there are huge
differences in IQ among people. . I think these observations on human
skill
formation are exactly why the job training programs aren't working in
the
United States and why many remediation programs directed toward
disadvantaged young adults are so ineffective."

That these kinds of beliefs by Nobel Prize winners are more widespread
and
influential in affecting policies and funding for adult literacy
education
is illustrated in a Forbes Magazine article for October 2, 2000. Written
by
Dan Seligman, a widely read commentator, the article discussed the
National
Adult Literacy Survey (NAL) of 1993  and argued that the test was not
about
literacy and said, "The cluster of abilities being examined is obviously
a
proxy for plain old "intelligence." Remarking then about the "familiar
old
bell curve" Seligman says, ".do not tell us that government or any other
institution is going to transform this situation." This clearly reflects
the belief that the literacy test was actually a test of intelligence,
that
the latter is genetically based, and was not going to be changed by
adult
literacy programs.

These sorts of comments by Nobel prize laureates and well-placed popular
writers are not good for adult literacy education.  They can convince
policymakers and funding organizations that investments in adult
literacy
education are not worthwhile. For instance, the New York Times for
January
20, 2000 published an article by Kevin Sack about a gift of $100 million
being given to schools in Mississippi to promote the teaching of reading
to
children. The article says that the philanthropist giving the money and
"many experts are less than bullish on the prospects for attacking adult
illiteracy." The philanthropist is then quoted as saying, "What this
program says is that we can't solve the adult literacy problem but we
can
work with the children."

In addition to the deleterious effects of these types of comments on
adult
literacy education funding, they foment racist thinking and the
denigration
of African-Americans and others whose performance on various
standardized
tests are below those of Whites. For these reasons it is important for
the
adult education field to challenge these beliefs with renewed
commitments
to educational practice. The National Assessment of Adult Literacy
(NAAL)
of 2003 showed that 67 percent of African-American adults scored at the
Basic or Below Basic literacy levels for prose tasks. Unfortunately
enrollments of African-Americans in the Adult Education and Literacy
system
of the United States fell by 13,073 from 548,562 in fiscal year 2000-01
to
535,489 in fiscal year 2003-04, the last year for which I have found
data
for the nation. Concerted efforts are needed to attract adult
African-Americans with underdeveloped literacy skills into adult
literacy
education programs and to provide the best education possible.

>From researchers in the field of adult literacy education, help is
needed in
dispelling these ideas about intelligence. Even discussing conceptual
frameworks such as "multiple intelligences" may give some the impression
that there is something "real" about various intelligences with which
one
could be genetically endowed. This includes verbal and quantitative
intelligences of the sort generally used in developing IQ tests and
pointed
to as factors distinguishing African-Americans as inferior to Whites in
intelligence. Despite 15 years of federally funded adult literacy
research
centers, I have yet to find any research by adult literacy researchers
with
which to counter the arguments by the Nobel Prize winners, mal-informed
popular journalists, and philanthropists cited above, and others not
cited.
This suggests that there is an urgent need for adult literacy
researchers to
fight against the ideological foundations of racism that stigmatize
adult
literacy education in general and the literacy education of
African-American adults in particular.

NOTE: For an extended discussion of issues related to ideas that
marginalize
adult literacy education see the last of my papers at
http://adulted.about.com/od/adultbasiceducation/a/sticht.htm
This paper deals with issues of IQ, brain science, adult literacy and
debunks myths that hold adult literacy education back.

Thomas G. Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From andreawilder at comcast.net  Fri Oct 19 13:20:45 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 13:20:45 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 989] Re: FW: Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, Racism
In-Reply-To: <074b01c8126f$58bc89c0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
References: <074b01c8126f$58bc89c0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
Message-ID: <7dd0cd93e05ec2e9a71c6592dfaf0224@comcast.net>

Marie--

I'm from MA.  I see nothing wrong with comprehensive tests based on 
taught class material as a graduation requirement.  The problem lies in 
kids' backgrounds and teaching skills. This  is the context. In MA, 
there are students who do not pass the tests.  They are subsequently 
given many opportunities to retake the tests.  Kids with weak 
educational backgrounds will have a harder time.  This is where quality 
of teaching, number of students in the class, a safe school, are 
important.

As to intelligence tests.  They describe something, but what?

Way back in the sixties, Gerald Lesser issued a report that compared 
children from different and class and ethnic groups.  His findings:  
the skills/aptitude of middle class kids all fell in the same range, 
while the same was true for poor kids.  The PROFILES of scores were 
different for each ethnic group.  A problem:  girls scores were not 
disaggregated--this was before feminism.  The study was not 
published--it was done around 1964, I  think, and the political fallout 
would have been  catnip for some, I guess.   There are maybe 2 copies 
at the Ed School, Harvard.

Andrea

On Oct 19, 2007, at 12:44 PM, Marie Cora wrote:

> Colleagues:  the following post is from Tom Sticht.  When Tom first 
> sent
> this email to be posted, I initially questioned the relevance of it for
> the assessment discussion list.  There are certainly connections here,
> but part of what this List is intended for is to be true to the issue 
> of
> learner assessment.  So Tom and I had an email exchange and he said to
> me:
>
> "I think the whole IQ and intelligence debate centers on test
> (assessment) results, as Watson said. So I thought it was a natural for
> the Assessment folks..."
>
> which convinced me that it is indeed relevant.
>
> What are your thoughts - either on the content of Tom's article, or on
> my and his exchange, for that matter?
>
> This also makes me think of the hotly debated issue of using
> comprehensive tests to determine whether a child graduates from high
> school - or whether a fast-track GED is a good thing or not.
>
> What are your thoughts?
>
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> **********
>
> October 17, 2007
>
> Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, and Racism
>
> Tom Sticht
> International Consultant in Adult Education
>
> The 2003 National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) found that, as
> with
> most general literacy and other broadband cognitive assessments of the
> last
> century, African-Americans scored well below White adults. Perhaps for
> most
> people, this signifies that greater efforts are needed in the education
> of
> African-Americans. But for some others, this may simply reinforce the
> belief that African-Americans are genetically lower in intelligence
> compared to Whites and this shows itself in the differences in literacy
> scores.
>
> According to an article on the web site for The Independent news 
> service
> in
> London, England for 17 October 2007, online at
> http://news.independent.co.uk/sci_tech/article3067222.ece, James 
> Watson,
> a
> Nobel Prize winner for work on DNA and genetics, thinks that Africans
> are
> less intelligent than Westerners. The article states that in a recent
> interview Watson "claimed that black people were less intelligent than
> white people and the idea that "equal powers of reason" were shared
> across
> racial groups was a delusion." According to The Independent, Watson 
> said
> that "Western policies towards African countries were wrongly based on
> an
> assumption that black people were as clever as their white counterparts
> when "testing" suggested the contrary. He claimed genes responsible for
> creating differences in human intelligence could be found within a
> decade."
>
> In an earlier interview in 2005, another Nobel Prize laureate, this 
> time
> for
> economics, James Heckman discussed his ideas about cognitive skills and
> their malleability in later life with  members of a presidential
> commission
> consisting of  former U.S. senators, heads of federal agencies, tax
> attorneys and academic economists.  In his comments Heckman expressed
> his
> belief that "IQ is basically formed by age 8, and there are huge
> differences in IQ among people. . I think these observations on human
> skill
> formation are exactly why the job training programs aren't working in
> the
> United States and why many remediation programs directed toward
> disadvantaged young adults are so ineffective."
>
> That these kinds of beliefs by Nobel Prize winners are more widespread
> and
> influential in affecting policies and funding for adult literacy
> education
> is illustrated in a Forbes Magazine article for October 2, 2000. 
> Written
> by
> Dan Seligman, a widely read commentator, the article discussed the
> National
> Adult Literacy Survey (NAL) of 1993  and argued that the test was not
> about
> literacy and said, "The cluster of abilities being examined is 
> obviously
> a
> proxy for plain old "intelligence." Remarking then about the "familiar
> old
> bell curve" Seligman says, ".do not tell us that government or any 
> other
> institution is going to transform this situation." This clearly 
> reflects
> the belief that the literacy test was actually a test of intelligence,
> that
> the latter is genetically based, and was not going to be changed by
> adult
> literacy programs.
>
> These sorts of comments by Nobel prize laureates and well-placed 
> popular
> writers are not good for adult literacy education.  They can convince
> policymakers and funding organizations that investments in adult
> literacy
> education are not worthwhile. For instance, the New York Times for
> January
> 20, 2000 published an article by Kevin Sack about a gift of $100 
> million
> being given to schools in Mississippi to promote the teaching of 
> reading
> to
> children. The article says that the philanthropist giving the money and
> "many experts are less than bullish on the prospects for attacking 
> adult
> illiteracy." The philanthropist is then quoted as saying, "What this
> program says is that we can't solve the adult literacy problem but we
> can
> work with the children."
>
> In addition to the deleterious effects of these types of comments on
> adult
> literacy education funding, they foment racist thinking and the
> denigration
> of African-Americans and others whose performance on various
> standardized
> tests are below those of Whites. For these reasons it is important for
> the
> adult education field to challenge these beliefs with renewed
> commitments
> to educational practice. The National Assessment of Adult Literacy
> (NAAL)
> of 2003 showed that 67 percent of African-American adults scored at the
> Basic or Below Basic literacy levels for prose tasks. Unfortunately
> enrollments of African-Americans in the Adult Education and Literacy
> system
> of the United States fell by 13,073 from 548,562 in fiscal year 2000-01
> to
> 535,489 in fiscal year 2003-04, the last year for which I have found
> data
> for the nation. Concerted efforts are needed to attract adult
> African-Americans with underdeveloped literacy skills into adult
> literacy
> education programs and to provide the best education possible.
>
>> From researchers in the field of adult literacy education, help is
> needed in
> dispelling these ideas about intelligence. Even discussing conceptual
> frameworks such as "multiple intelligences" may give some the 
> impression
> that there is something "real" about various intelligences with which
> one
> could be genetically endowed. This includes verbal and quantitative
> intelligences of the sort generally used in developing IQ tests and
> pointed
> to as factors distinguishing African-Americans as inferior to Whites in
> intelligence. Despite 15 years of federally funded adult literacy
> research
> centers, I have yet to find any research by adult literacy researchers
> with
> which to counter the arguments by the Nobel Prize winners, mal-informed
> popular journalists, and philanthropists cited above, and others not
> cited.
> This suggests that there is an urgent need for adult literacy
> researchers to
> fight against the ideological foundations of racism that stigmatize
> adult
> literacy education in general and the literacy education of
> African-American adults in particular.
>
> NOTE: For an extended discussion of issues related to ideas that
> marginalize
> adult literacy education see the last of my papers at
> http://adulted.about.com/od/adultbasiceducation/a/sticht.htm
> This paper deals with issues of IQ, brain science, adult literacy and
> debunks myths that hold adult literacy education back.
>
> Thomas G. Sticht
> International Consultant in Adult Education
> 2062 Valley View Blvd.
> El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
> Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
> Email: tsticht at aznet.net
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net
>

From jackie.coelho at gmail.com  Fri Oct 19 13:41:19 2007
From: jackie.coelho at gmail.com (Jackie Coelho)
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 13:41:19 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 990] Re: FW: Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, Racism
In-Reply-To: <7dd0cd93e05ec2e9a71c6592dfaf0224@comcast.net>
References: <074b01c8126f$58bc89c0$0402a8c0@LITNOW>
	<7dd0cd93e05ec2e9a71c6592dfaf0224@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1dd5701e0710191041j20be62c5o55189062c06d2f75@mail.gmail.com>

Andrea,
  Thanks for mentioning the socio-economic influences on assessments.
Although you mention one study, I am sure there are many.
  Regarding what the noble prize winners had to say, one is an
economist. The fame of neither allows us to believe that every thought
they have is golden.
  Stephen Jay Gould wrote an enlightening book entitled, "The
Mismeasure of Man". In it he takes a very critical and analytical look
at the idea of the bell curve and testing.
   I am an ABE instructor, not a professional researcher. However,
this topic does indeed need more rearch, and if I knew how to pick up
the baton, I would run with it.
Jackie

On 10/19/07, Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net> wrote:
> Marie--
>
> I'm from MA.  I see nothing wrong with comprehensive tests based on
> taught class material as a graduation requirement.  The problem lies in
> kids' backgrounds and teaching skills. This  is the context. In MA,
> there are students who do not pass the tests.  They are subsequently
> given many opportunities to retake the tests.  Kids with weak
> educational backgrounds will have a harder time.  This is where quality
> of teaching, number of students in the class, a safe school, are
> important.
>
> As to intelligence tests.  They describe something, but what?
>
> Way back in the sixties, Gerald Lesser issued a report that compared
> children from different and class and ethnic groups.  His findings:
> the skills/aptitude of middle class kids all fell in the same range,
> while the same was true for poor kids.  The PROFILES of scores were
> different for each ethnic group.  A problem:  girls scores were not
> disaggregated--this was before feminism.  The study was not
> published--it was done around 1964, I  think, and the political fallout
> would have been  catnip for some, I guess.   There are maybe 2 copies
> at the Ed School, Harvard.
>
> Andrea
>
> On Oct 19, 2007, at 12:44 PM, Marie Cora wrote:
>
> > Colleagues:  the following post is from Tom Sticht.  When Tom first
> > sent
> > this email to be posted, I initially questioned the relevance of it for
> > the assessment discussion list.  There are certainly connections here,
> > but part of what this List is intended for is to be true to the issue
> > of
> > learner assessment.  So Tom and I had an email exchange and he said to
> > me:
> >
> > "I think the whole IQ and intelligence debate centers on test
> > (assessment) results, as Watson said. So I thought it was a natural for
> > the Assessment folks..."
> >
> > which convinced me that it is indeed relevant.
> >
> > What are your thoughts - either on the content of Tom's article, or on
> > my and his exchange, for that matter?
> >
> > This also makes me think of the hotly debated issue of using
> > comprehensive tests to determine whether a child graduates from high
> > school - or whether a fast-track GED is a good thing or not.
> >
> > What are your thoughts?
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> > **********
> >
> > October 17, 2007
> >
> > Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, and Racism
> >
> > Tom Sticht
> > International Consultant in Adult Education
> >
> > The 2003 National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) found that, as
> > with
> > most general literacy and other broadband cognitive assessments of the
> > last
> > century, African-Americans scored well below White adults. Perhaps for
> > most
> > people, this signifies that greater efforts are needed in the education
> > of
> > African-Americans. But for some others, this may simply reinforce the
> > belief that African-Americans are genetically lower in intelligence
> > compared to Whites and this shows itself in the differences in literacy
> > scores.
> >
> > According to an article on the web site for The Independent news
> > service
> > in
> > London, England for 17 October 2007, online at
> > http://news.independent.co.uk/sci_tech/article3067222.ece, James
> > Watson,
> > a
> > Nobel Prize winner for work on DNA and genetics, thinks that Africans
> > are
> > less intelligent than Westerners. The article states that in a recent
> > interview Watson "claimed that black people were less intelligent than
> > white people and the idea that "equal powers of reason" were shared
> > across
> > racial groups was a delusion." According to The Independent, Watson
> > said
> > that "Western policies towards African countries were wrongly based on
> > an
> > assumption that black people were as clever as their white counterparts
> > when "testing" suggested the contrary. He claimed genes responsible for
> > creating differences in human intelligence could be found within a
> > decade."
> >
> > In an earlier interview in 2005, another Nobel Prize laureate, this
> > time
> > for
> > economics, James Heckman discussed his ideas about cognitive skills and
> > their malleability in later life with  members of a presidential
> > commission
> > consisting of  former U.S. senators, heads of federal agencies, tax
> > attorneys and academic economists.  In his comments Heckman expressed
> > his
> > belief that "IQ is basically formed by age 8, and there are huge
> > differences in IQ among people. . I think these observations on human
> > skill
> > formation are exactly why the job training programs aren't working in
> > the
> > United States and why many remediation programs directed toward
> > disadvantaged young adults are so ineffective."
> >
> > That these kinds of beliefs by Nobel Prize winners are more widespread
> > and
> > influential in affecting policies and funding for adult literacy
> > education
> > is illustrated in a Forbes Magazine article for October 2, 2000.
> > Written
> > by
> > Dan Seligman, a widely read commentator, the article discussed the
> > National
> > Adult Literacy Survey (NAL) of 1993  and argued that the test was not
> > about
> > literacy and said, "The cluster of abilities being examined is
> > obviously
> > a
> > proxy for plain old "intelligence." Remarking then about the "familiar
> > old
> > bell curve" Seligman says, ".do not tell us that government or any
> > other
> > institution is going to transform this situation." This clearly
> > reflects
> > the belief that the literacy test was actually a test of intelligence,
> > that
> > the latter is genetically based, and was not going to be changed by
> > adult
> > literacy programs.
> >
> > These sorts of comments by Nobel prize laureates and well-placed
> > popular
> > writers are not good for adult literacy education.  They can convince
> > policymakers and funding organizations that investments in adult
> > literacy
> > education are not worthwhile. For instance, the New York Times for
> > January
> > 20, 2000 published an article by Kevin Sack about a gift of $100
> > million
> > being given to schools in Mississippi to promote the teaching of
> > reading
> > to
> > children. The article says that the philanthropist giving the money and
> > "many experts are less than bullish on the prospects for attacking
> > adult
> > illiteracy." The philanthropist is then quoted as saying, "What this
> > program says is that we can't solve the adult literacy problem but we
> > can
> > work with the children."
> >
> > In addition to the deleterious effects of these types of comments on
> > adult
> > literacy education funding, they foment racist thinking and the
> > denigration
> > of African-Americans and others whose performance on various
> > standardized
> > tests are below those of Whites. For these reasons it is important for
> > the
> > adult education field to challenge these beliefs with renewed
> > commitments
> > to educational practice. The National Assessment of Adult Literacy
> > (NAAL)
> > of 2003 showed that 67 percent of African-American adults scored at the
> > Basic or Below Basic literacy levels for prose tasks. Unfortunately
> > enrollments of African-Americans in the Adult Education and Literacy
> > system
> > of the United States fell by 13,073 from 548,562 in fiscal year 2000-01
> > to
> > 535,489 in fiscal year 2003-04, the last year for which I have found
> > data
> > for the nation. Concerted efforts are needed to attract adult
> > African-Americans with underdeveloped literacy skills into adult
> > literacy
> > education programs and to provide the best education possible.
> >
> >> From researchers in the field of adult literacy education, help is
> > needed in
> > dispelling these ideas about intelligence. Even discussing conceptual
> > frameworks such as "multiple intelligences" may give some the
> > impression
> > that there is something "real" about various intelligences with which
> > one
> > could be genetically endowed. This includes verbal and quantitative
> > intelligences of the sort generally used in developing IQ tests and
> > pointed
> > to as factors distinguishing African-Americans as inferior to Whites in
> > intelligence. Despite 15 years of federally funded adult literacy
> > research
> > centers, I have yet to find any research by adult literacy researchers
> > with
> > which to counter the arguments by the Nobel Prize winners, mal-informed
> > popular journalists, and philanthropists cited above, and others not
> > cited.
> > This suggests that there is an urgent need for adult literacy
> > researchers to
> > fight against the ideological foundations of racism that stigmatize
> > adult
> > literacy education in general and the literacy education of
> > African-American adults in particular.
> >
> > NOTE: For an extended discussion of issues related to ideas that
> > marginalize
> > adult literacy education see the last of my papers at
> > http://adulted.about.com/od/adultbasiceducation/a/sticht.htm
> > This paper deals with issues of IQ, brain science, adult literacy and
> > debunks myths that hold adult literacy education back.
> >
> > Thomas G. Sticht
> > International Consultant in Adult Education
> > 2062 Valley View Blvd.
> > El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
> > Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
> > Email: tsticht at aznet.net
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net
> >
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to jackie.coelho at gmail.com
>

From jay.derrick at blueyonder.co.uk  Fri Oct 19 15:54:35 2007
From: jay.derrick at blueyonder.co.uk (jay.derrick)
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 20:54:35 +0100
Subject: [Assessment 991] Re: FW: Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, Racism
References: <074b01c8126f$58bc89c0$0402a8c0@LITNOW><7dd0cd93e05ec2e9a71c6592dfaf0224@comcast.net>
	<1dd5701e0710191041j20be62c5o55189062c06d2f75@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <008501c81289$e10882b0$6401a8c0@DF01>

I've been following this debate with great interest, and would like strongly
to support Jackie's recommendation of Stephen Jay Gould's book 'The
Mismeasure of Man', in the context of this discussion.  It is a
comprehensive history and critique of intelligence testing, and in my view
it is highly relevant to a discussion of assessment in education, and
especially adult basic education, for the same reason that Tom Sticht's
original posting is relevant.  I would go further and suggest that Gould's
book is essential reading for anybody working in education, and indeed for
all citizens in democratic societies.  What Gould argues is that the results
of all standardised tests of learning or ability, should be recognised as
imperfect at best.   This imperfection isn't the problem though - the
problem is how the results of these imperfect tests are interpreted and then
used.  Too often, either from ignorance or prejudice, the results of tests
are taken to be completely true reflections of reality, and important
decisions are taken about people's lives or about future policy or funding
on the basis of them, to the exclusion of all other relevant and possibly
contradictory information.   As an extreme example, Gould cites the way low
scores in intelligence tests in the first half of the last century were used
to justify people being compulsorily sterilised, because of the belief that
low intelligence was inherited.  He shows that reliance on standardised
testing makes sense from a positivist and behaviourist theoretical viewpoint
which sees 'intelligence' as something inherent and immutable to all
individuals, similar to height or shoe-size.  More recent theories of
learning take a more complex and developmental view which demands a more
sophisticated approach to assessment.

However, I don't think this means that we shouldn't ever use tests as part
of teaching and learning!  They can be very useful to teachers who want
information for course and programme planning, or for stimulating
discussions with learners about learning, in what will be recognised as
formative assessment, or assessment for learning.  I am one of the team
working on a research project in the UK called Improving Formative
Assessment (see
www.brookes.ac.uk/schools/education/staffinfo/eccleston-FAproject.html)
which is looking at these issues in adult literacy, numeracy and ESOL
classes and other post-compulsory programmes in colleges and adult education
centres.  We are finding that whatever the regulations governing summative
assessment and quality assurance, these have effects for better or worse on
the ways teachers teach, not always to the benefit of learning, and that
these effects are more pronounced for learners with less confidence in
themselves as learners, perhaps because of bad experiences at school.

My belief is that the main reason why standardised tests are so popular with
policymakers, in spite of the arguments for them being blunt instruments, is
that they are a simple and cheap solution to the need for accountability for
certification.  There is also of course a major industry of (mostly
commercial) test providers which counts on the continuing widespread use of
them, and on the argument that the results are completely valid and
reliable.

We certainly need data about how well teachers are teaching and how well
learners are learning, but it needs to be much better quality data than can
be provided solely through standardised tests.  I agree entirely with Tom
that adult basic education practitioners should get involved in this
discussion as part of supporting learners to get the best assessment
possible.  If not I think we are selling them short.

Thanks for starting this discussion, Tom!

Jay Derrick
UK-based educational consultant

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jackie Coelho" <jackie.coelho at gmail.com>
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Friday, October 19, 2007 6:41 PM
Subject: [Assessment 990] Re: FW: Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, Racism

> Andrea,
>   Thanks for mentioning the socio-economic influences on assessments.
> Although you mention one study, I am sure there are many.
>   Regarding what the noble prize winners had to say, one is an
> economist. The fame of neither allows us to believe that every thought
> they have is golden.
>   Stephen Jay Gould wrote an enlightening book entitled, "The
> Mismeasure of Man". In it he takes a very critical and analytical look
> at the idea of the bell curve and testing.
>    I am an ABE instructor, not a professional researcher. However,
> this topic does indeed need more rearch, and if I knew how to pick up
> the baton, I would run with it.
> Jackie
>
> On 10/19/07, Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net> wrote:
> > Marie--
> >
> > I'm from MA.  I see nothing wrong with comprehensive tests based on
> > taught class material as a graduation requirement.  The problem lies in
> > kids' backgrounds and teaching skills. This  is the context. In MA,
> > there are students who do not pass the tests.  They are subsequently
> > given many opportunities to retake the tests.  Kids with weak
> > educational backgrounds will have a harder time.  This is where quality
> > of teaching, number of students in the class, a safe school, are
> > important.
> >
> > As to intelligence tests.  They describe something, but what?
> >
> > Way back in the sixties, Gerald Lesser issued a report that compared
> > children from different and class and ethnic groups.  His findings:
> > the skills/aptitude of middle class kids all fell in the same range,
> > while the same was true for poor kids.  The PROFILES of scores were
> > different for each ethnic group.  A problem:  girls scores were not
> > disaggregated--this was before feminism.  The study was not
> > published--it was done around 1964, I  think, and the political fallout
> > would have been  catnip for some, I guess.   There are maybe 2 copies
> > at the Ed School, Harvard.
> >
> > Andrea
> >
> > On Oct 19, 2007, at 12:44 PM, Marie Cora wrote:
> >
> > > Colleagues:  the following post is from Tom Sticht.  When Tom first
> > > sent
> > > this email to be posted, I initially questioned the relevance of it
for
> > > the assessment discussion list.  There are certainly connections here,
> > > but part of what this List is intended for is to be true to the issue
> > > of
> > > learner assessment.  So Tom and I had an email exchange and he said to
> > > me:
> > >
> > > "I think the whole IQ and intelligence debate centers on test
> > > (assessment) results, as Watson said. So I thought it was a natural
for
> > > the Assessment folks..."
> > >
> > > which convinced me that it is indeed relevant.
> > >
> > > What are your thoughts - either on the content of Tom's article, or on
> > > my and his exchange, for that matter?
> > >
> > > This also makes me think of the hotly debated issue of using
> > > comprehensive tests to determine whether a child graduates from high
> > > school - or whether a fast-track GED is a good thing or not.
> > >
> > > What are your thoughts?
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > >
> > > **********
> > >
> > > October 17, 2007
> > >
> > > Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, and Racism
> > >
> > > Tom Sticht
> > > International Consultant in Adult Education
> > >
> > > The 2003 National Assessment of Adult Literacy (NAAL) found that, as
> > > with
> > > most general literacy and other broadband cognitive assessments of the
> > > last
> > > century, African-Americans scored well below White adults. Perhaps for
> > > most
> > > people, this signifies that greater efforts are needed in the
education
> > > of
> > > African-Americans. But for some others, this may simply reinforce the
> > > belief that African-Americans are genetically lower in intelligence
> > > compared to Whites and this shows itself in the differences in
literacy
> > > scores.
> > >
> > > According to an article on the web site for The Independent news
> > > service
> > > in
> > > London, England for 17 October 2007, online at
> > > http://news.independent.co.uk/sci_tech/article3067222.ece, James
> > > Watson,
> > > a
> > > Nobel Prize winner for work on DNA and genetics, thinks that Africans
> > > are
> > > less intelligent than Westerners. The article states that in a recent
> > > interview Watson "claimed that black people were less intelligent than
> > > white people and the idea that "equal powers of reason" were shared
> > > across
> > > racial groups was a delusion." According to The Independent, Watson
> > > said
> > > that "Western policies towards African countries were wrongly based on
> > > an
> > > assumption that black people were as clever as their white
counterparts
> > > when "testing" suggested the contrary. He claimed genes responsible
for
> > > creating differences in human intelligence could be found within a
> > > decade."
> > >
> > > In an earlier interview in 2005, another Nobel Prize laureate, this
> > > time
> > > for
> > > economics, James Heckman discussed his ideas about cognitive skills
and
> > > their malleability in later life with  members of a presidential
> > > commission
> > > consisting of  former U.S. senators, heads of federal agencies, tax
> > > attorneys and academic economists.  In his comments Heckman expressed
> > > his
> > > belief that "IQ is basically formed by age 8, and there are huge
> > > differences in IQ among people. . I think these observations on human
> > > skill
> > > formation are exactly why the job training programs aren't working in
> > > the
> > > United States and why many remediation programs directed toward
> > > disadvantaged young adults are so ineffective."
> > >
> > > That these kinds of beliefs by Nobel Prize winners are more widespread
> > > and
> > > influential in affecting policies and funding for adult literacy
> > > education
> > > is illustrated in a Forbes Magazine article for October 2, 2000.
> > > Written
> > > by
> > > Dan Seligman, a widely read commentator, the article discussed the
> > > National
> > > Adult Literacy Survey (NAL) of 1993  and argued that the test was not
> > > about
> > > literacy and said, "The cluster of abilities being examined is
> > > obviously
> > > a
> > > proxy for plain old "intelligence." Remarking then about the "familiar
> > > old
> > > bell curve" Seligman says, ".do not tell us that government or any
> > > other
> > > institution is going to transform this situation." This clearly
> > > reflects
> > > the belief that the literacy test was actually a test of intelligence,
> > > that
> > > the latter is genetically based, and was not going to be changed by
> > > adult
> > > literacy programs.
> > >
> > > These sorts of comments by Nobel prize laureates and well-placed
> > > popular
> > > writers are not good for adult literacy education.  They can convince
> > > policymakers and funding organizations that investments in adult
> > > literacy
> > > education are not worthwhile. For instance, the New York Times for
> > > January
> > > 20, 2000 published an article by Kevin Sack about a gift of $100
> > > million
> > > being given to schools in Mississippi to promote the teaching of
> > > reading
> > > to
> > > children. The article says that the philanthropist giving the money
and
> > > "many experts are less than bullish on the prospects for attacking
> > > adult
> > > illiteracy." The philanthropist is then quoted as saying, "What this
> > > program says is that we can't solve the adult literacy problem but we
> > > can
> > > work with the children."
> > >
> > > In addition to the deleterious effects of these types of comments on
> > > adult
> > > literacy education funding, they foment racist thinking and the
> > > denigration
> > > of African-Americans and others whose performance on various
> > > standardized
> > > tests are below those of Whites. For these reasons it is important for
> > > the
> > > adult education field to challenge these beliefs with renewed
> > > commitments
> > > to educational practice. The National Assessment of Adult Literacy
> > > (NAAL)
> > > of 2003 showed that 67 percent of African-American adults scored at
the
> > > Basic or Below Basic literacy levels for prose tasks. Unfortunately
> > > enrollments of African-Americans in the Adult Education and Literacy
> > > system
> > > of the United States fell by 13,073 from 548,562 in fiscal year
2000-01
> > > to
> > > 535,489 in fiscal year 2003-04, the last year for which I have found
> > > data
> > > for the nation. Concerted efforts are needed to attract adult
> > > African-Americans with underdeveloped literacy skills into adult
> > > literacy
> > > education programs and to provide the best education possible.
> > >
> > >> From researchers in the field of adult literacy education, help is
> > > needed in
> > > dispelling these ideas about intelligence. Even discussing conceptual
> > > frameworks such as "multiple intelligences" may give some the
> > > impression
> > > that there is something "real" about various intelligences with which
> > > one
> > > could be genetically endowed. This includes verbal and quantitative
> > > intelligences of the sort generally used in developing IQ tests and
> > > pointed
> > > to as factors distinguishing African-Americans as inferior to Whites
in
> > > intelligence. Despite 15 years of federally funded adult literacy
> > > research
> > > centers, I have yet to find any research by adult literacy researchers
> > > with
> > > which to counter the arguments by the Nobel Prize winners,
mal-informed
> > > popular journalists, and philanthropists cited above, and others not
> > > cited.
> > > This suggests that there is an urgent need for adult literacy
> > > researchers to
> > > fight against the ideological foundations of racism that stigmatize
> > > adult
> > > literacy education in general and the literacy education of
> > > African-American adults in particular.
> > >
> > > NOTE: For an extended discussion of issues related to ideas that
> > > marginalize
> > > adult literacy education see the last of my papers at
> > > http://adulted.about.com/od/adultbasiceducation/a/sticht.htm
> > > This paper deals with issues of IQ, brain science, adult literacy and
> > > debunks myths that hold adult literacy education back.
> > >
> > > Thomas G. Sticht
> > > International Consultant in Adult Education
> > > 2062 Valley View Blvd.
> > > El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
> > > Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
> > > Email: tsticht at aznet.net
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -------------------------------
> > > National Institute for Literacy
> > > Assessment mailing list
> > > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > > Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net
> > >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to jackie.coelho at gmail.com
> >
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to jay.derrick at blueyonder.co.uk
>
>

From VenuT at lacnyc.org  Fri Oct 19 18:55:00 2007
From: VenuT at lacnyc.org (Venu Thelakkat)
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 18:55:00 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 992] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <F574BD12-37D2-4853-BDCE-122220ED193B@comcast.net>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu><8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com><6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB85916FE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
	<F574BD12-37D2-4853-BDCE-122220ED193B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB8591771@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

David, 

 

An independent study of adult education students over a longer period of
time sounds like a great way to evaluate the adult education system from
a national or state perspective, even though, like you said, there are
some methodological challenges.  It will certainly provide more valid
and reliable data than we get from NRS.  However, it still leaves
unresolved the issue of evaluating individual programs.  Like Diane
said, states have been using NRS data to allocate funding and target
technical assistance.  How would a longitudinal study meet this need?  

 

Venu Thelakkat

Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis

Literacy Assistance Center

32 Broadway, 10th floor

New York, NY 10004

(212) 803-3370

venut at lacnyc.org

www.lacnyc.org

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 8:38 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 984] Re: level movement

 

Assessment Colleagues,

 

On Oct 18, 2007, at 7:00 PM, Venu Thelakkat asked:

	I am told that standardized assessments, especially those used
in adult literacy, have many problems.  But what is the alternative?
Policy makers and funders (private or public) want accountability for
the money they disperse and there is very little else that has been
proposed.  Even in NRS, educational gain is the only measure that has
some validity as a program outcome.  The other measures such as getting
a job or entering post secondary education are very unreliable given the
wide variety of methods used to collect and report the data. 

 

Great question, Venu. 

One alternative that makes sense has been proposed, but I am told that
Congress so far has been unwilling to accept it. Instead of reporting
outcomes for every student in every federally-funded program, OVAE
should each year pick a random sample of federally-funded programs and
measure attainment of student goals over a multi-year period, that is,
measure impact.  Some would argue that measuring impact is not possible,
that adult education students are too hard to track over time, but the
Longitudinal Study of Adult Literacy, now in its eighth year in
Portland, Oregon, has shown that it is not impossible. 

 

Isn't impact more useful to policy makers than outcomes? Does anyone in
Congress really care how many level gains students make? Some policy
makers may care about how many program participants -- especially over
time -- have improved their employment status, can read to their
children, can use  a computer, now have a diploma or GED, and have
succeeded in their education beyond secondary level.  Of these goals,
only the GED and high school diploma (for now at least) require a
standardized test.

 

David J. Rosen

djrosen at comcast.net

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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Fri Oct 19 12:42:19 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Fri, 19 Oct 2007 09:42:19 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 993] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <F574BD12-37D2-4853-BDCE-122220ED193B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <OFE891C710.1D275081-ON07257379.005B164F-07257379.005BBE1C@yc.edu>

Hi everyone,

I feel strongly that even though standardized testing does not necessarily 
reflect the learning taking place in the classroom, especially with the 
changes in our reporting this year, it is still better than going with a 
more holistic but subjective method for deciding how our students are 
learning. Unless a test can be created that is holistic as well as not 
terribly time consuming for instructors to grade, I am glad we are 
currently staying with our current form of testing.

 It may be wise for the federal government to require one test being done 
nationwide, and perhaps they have the resources and research available to 
create one test, just as the GED exam is one test. Challenges to this test 
will be able to be made in the future concerning whether this test does or 
does not represent people from various sociopolitical and cultural 
backgrounds, and more discussion will continue, but at least we could then 
say that ABEII  means the same thing in Boston as it means in St. Louis, 
as it means in small town USA. I qualify my statement by saying I have 
only been teaching GED for 3.5 years, so many of you may have better 
input, but this is how I perceive the situation.

Thanks for listening.

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

"David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net> 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
10/19/2007 06:16 AM
Please respond to
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
cc

Subject
[Assessment 984] Re: level movement

Assessment Colleagues,

On Oct 18, 2007, at 7:00 PM, Venu Thelakkat asked:
I am told that standardized assessments, especially those used in adult 
literacy, have many problems.  But what is the alternative?  Policy makers 
and funders (private or public) want accountability for the money they 
disperse and there is very little else that has been proposed.  Even in 
NRS, educational gain is the only measure that has some validity as a 
program outcome.  The other measures such as getting a job or entering 
post secondary education are very unreliable given the wide variety of 
methods used to collect and report the data. 

Great question, Venu. 

One alternative that makes sense has been proposed, but I am told that 
Congress so far has been unwilling to accept it. Instead of reporting 
outcomes for every student in every federally-funded program, OVAE should 
each year pick a random sample of federally-funded programs and measure 
attainment of student goals over a multi-year period, that is, measure 
impact.  Some would argue that measuring impact is not possible, that 
adult education students are too hard to track over time, but the 
Longitudinal Study of Adult Literacy, now in its eighth year in Portland, 
Oregon, has shown that it is not impossible. 

Isn't impact more useful to policy makers than outcomes? Does anyone in 
Congress really care how many level gains students make? Some policy 
makers may care about how many program participants -- especially over 
time -- have improved their employment status, can read to their children, 
can use  a computer, now have a diploma or GED, and have succeeded in 
their education beyond secondary level.  Of these goals, only the GED and 
high school diploma (for now at least) require a standardized test.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to tina_luffman at yc.edu

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From djrosen at comcast.net  Sat Oct 20 10:04:08 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Sat, 20 Oct 2007 10:04:08 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 994] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB8591771@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu><8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com><6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB85916FE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
	<F574BD12-37D2-4853-BDCE-122220ED193B@comcast.net>
	<6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB8591771@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
Message-ID: <9E27E4E9-7729-4CBB-8BFF-5EB16782DFE1@comcast.net>

Hello Venu,

I don't think a longitudinal study, or a random sample of programs,  
would meet the need that individual programs or students have for  
measuring learner progress, or programs' interest in knowing learner  
outcomes or impact on learners.  These need to be addressed in other  
ways.  But since you have asked, here -- in broad brush strokes -- is  
what we need to do:

? Programs need formative and summative evaluation measures. A good  
formative system should have as one of its goals no surprises for the  
student and teacher when they see the results of a summative assessment.
? Standardized tests could be part of program evaluation if there is  
a high degree of validity between what is taught and tested.
? Multiple measures are important.  In addition to standardized  
tests, teacher evaluation, student self-evaluation, performance-based  
measures, and other measures could be part of the mix.
? In adult education it is especially important to measure progress  
toward and attainment of student goals and objectives. A superficial  
process of asking students to check off their goals when they enroll  
is not sufficient.  Student goals need to regularly be re-visited,  
and broken down into short-term objectives.  Students need an  
opportunity to regularly reflect on their progress, perhaps with a  
teacher or tutor, or with other students. Their goals may change.   
indeed changing goals may be one measure of progress!

Does all of this sound like it would take more resources than most  
adult education programs have? Yes.  High quality in education often  
requires more resources.  If we believe in high quality, then we  
should advocate for it, and for the resources needed to achieve it.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 19, 2007, at 6:55 PM, Venu Thelakkat wrote:

> David,
>
>
>
> An independent study of adult education students over a longer  
> period of time sounds like a great way to evaluate the adult  
> education system from a national or state perspective, even though,  
> like you said, there are some methodological challenges.  It will  
> certainly provide more valid and reliable data than we get from  
> NRS.  However, it still leaves unresolved the issue of evaluating  
> individual programs.  Like Diane said, states have been using NRS  
> data to allocate funding and target technical assistance.  How  
> would a longitudinal study meet this need?
>
>
>
> Venu Thelakkat
>
> Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis
>
> Literacy Assistance Center
>
> 32 Broadway, 10th floor
>
> New York, NY 10004
>
> (212) 803-3370
>
> venut at lacnyc.org
>
> www.lacnyc.org
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- 
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 8:38 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 984] Re: level movement
>
>
>
> Assessment Colleagues,
>
>
>
> On Oct 18, 2007, at 7:00 PM, Venu Thelakkat asked:
>
>> I am told that standardized assessments, especially those used in  
>> adult literacy, have many problems.  But what is the alternative?   
>> Policy makers and funders (private or public) want accountability  
>> for the money they disperse and there is very little else that has  
>> been proposed.  Even in NRS, educational gain is the only measure  
>> that has some validity as a program outcome.  The other measures  
>> such as getting a job or entering post secondary education are  
>> very unreliable given the wide variety of methods used to collect  
>> and report the data.
>>
>
>
> Great question, Venu.
>
> One alternative that makes sense has been proposed, but I am told  
> that Congress so far has been unwilling to accept it. Instead of  
> reporting outcomes for every student in every federally-funded  
> program, OVAE should each year pick a random sample of federally- 
> funded programs and measure attainment of student goals over a  
> multi-year period, that is, measure impact.  Some would argue that  
> measuring impact is not possible, that adult education students are  
> too hard to track over time, but the Longitudinal Study of Adult  
> Literacy, now in its eighth year in Portland, Oregon, has shown  
> that it is not impossible.
>
>
>
> Isn't impact more useful to policy makers than outcomes? Does  
> anyone in Congress really care how many level gains students make?  
> Some policy makers may care about how many program participants --  
> especially over time -- have improved their employment status, can  
> read to their children, can use  a computer, now have a diploma or  
> GED, and have succeeded in their education beyond secondary level.   
> Of these goals, only the GED and high school diploma (for now at  
> least) require a standardized test.
>
>
>
> David J. Rosen
>
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

From RKenyon721 at aol.com  Sun Oct 21 12:04:20 2007
From: RKenyon721 at aol.com (RKenyon721 at aol.com)
Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2007 12:04:20 EDT
Subject: [Assessment 995] Online Discussion on LD Discussion List - Guest
	Speaker Dr. Arlyn Roffman
Message-ID: <bea.1e280c38.344cd284@aol.com>

 
Hello,  
 
I am  the Moderator for the Learning Disabilities Discussion List. I am  very 
pleased to announce that Dr. Arlyn Roffman will  be leading an online 
discussion on the topic of Transition and Learning  Disabilities.  The relevant 
information follows: 
Theme:    
?Guiding Teens with LD: Navigating the Transition from  High School to 
Adulthood.?    
Date:    
November 8-9, 2007 
Learning  Disabilities Discussion List 
Guest: 
Dr.  Arlyn Roffman 
Guest's  Bio: 
Dr. Arlyn  Roffman, author of the recently published Guiding Teens with 
Learning Disabilities:  Navigating the Transition from High School to Adulthood, 
(Princeton  Review/Random House) is a  Professor of Special Education at Lesley 
University in Cambridge, Massachusetts,  where she served as the founding 
director of the Threshold Program, a non-degree  transition program for young 
adults with LD, from 1981-1996.  A licensed psychologist, she also  maintains a 
private practice focusing on the adjustment of youth and adults with  learning 
disabilities. 
Dr. Hoffman  earned her Ph.D. in developmental psychology at Boston College, 
an M.Ed. in  special education from Lesley University, and a B.A. at 
Connecticut  College.  She is the author of  numerous articles and chapters on learning 
disabilities and two other books, A Classroom Teacher?s Guide to  
Mainstreaming and Meeting the  Challenge of LD in Adulthood. 
Dr. Roffman  has served on the professional advisory boards of the Learning 
Disabilities  Association of America (LDA), National Center for Learning 
Disabilities (NCLD),  the National Adult Literacy and Learning Disability Center, 
and several other  organizations.  She has consulted  and made conference 
presentations on issues related to special education and  psychology throughout the 
U.S. and abroad and has served as an expert witness on  several cases related 
to transition for students with  disabilities. 
Tentative Outline for the  Discussion 
Laying the  Foundation for a Successful Transition 
What do K-12 teachers need to  know about how to prepare students for the 
real-life, practical challenges of  the adult world in terms of 
?    Continuing  education 
?    Entering the  workforce 
?    Participating in community  life?        
What do adult educators need  to know about their students? needs beyond 
basic skills in order to help them  successfully transition into adult life? 
Meeting  Students? Legal rights 
What does the law say about  transition during the middle and high school 
years? 
?      How can teachers help students  participate in the transition planning 
process? 
What laws protect students  after a student exits high school? 
What can adult educators  expect students to know if they have been on an IEP 
in high school? What can  adult educators do for those who have not been 
diagnosed and served under  IDEA? 
Suggested Background  Reading 
Guiding Teens with Learning Disabilities: Navigating the  Transition from 
High School to Adulthood (Arlyn  Roffman) 
A Classroom Teacher?s Guide to Mainstreaming (Arlyn  Roffman) 
Meeting the Challenge of LD in Adulthood (Arlyn  Roffman) 
Researchers' Roundtable on Transition for Young Adults with  Learning 
Disabilities 
_http://www.schwablearning.org/articles.aspx?r=7_ 
(http://www.schwablearning.org/articles.aspx?r=787) 87

Transition to Adulthood: Focusing on Life after High  School 
_http://www.schwablearning.org/articles.aspx?r=9_ 
(http://www.schwablearning.org/articles.aspx?r=970) 70  
Research Roundup (_LDNews March 2006_ 
(http://www.ncld.org/content/view/879/480/) ) 
_http://www.ncld.org/content/view/881/480_ 
(http://www.ncld.org/content/view/881/480)   
Please begin posting  specific questions to the List for Dr. Roffman based on 
her  tentative outline above.  We will continue collecting the questions  
until Nov. 6, 2007,  two days before the discussion  begins. 
If you have colleagues  interested in the topic of Transition & LD, kindly 
share or forward this  announcement to them. 
Information on how to subscribe  to the Learning Disabilities Discussion List 
- and how to post messages is  below. 
I encourage your participation  in this event and look forward to receiving 
your  questions. 
Thanks so  much, 
Rochelle  Kenyon 

Rochelle Kenyon
Moderator, NIFL/LINCS Learning Disabilities  Discussion List
Center for Literacy Studies at the University of  Tennessee
_RKenyon721 at aol.com_ (mailto:RKenyon721 at aol.com)  

To  post a message: 
_Learningdisabilities at nifl.gov_ (mailto:Learningdisabilities at nifl.gov)   

To subscribe: 
_http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/LearningDisabilities_ 
(http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/LearningDisabilities)   

To read archived messages:
_http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/learningdisabilities/2007/date.html_ 
(http://www.nifl.gov/linc/discussions/list_archives.html) 

************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com
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From gbundy at rmi.net  Mon Oct 22 01:51:11 2007
From: gbundy at rmi.net (Gail B)
Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2007 23:51:11 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
Subject: [Assessment 996] Re: FW: Genes, Intelligence, Literacy, Racism
Message-ID: <11593532.1193032272212.JavaMail.root@mswamui-billy.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Another aspect of Stephen Jay Gould's book 'The Mismeasure of Man' is his discussion of the political maneuverings involved with getting certain tests selected as the national standards. 

From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Mon Oct 22 15:08:11 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 15:08:11 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 997]  GED Discussion archived
Message-ID: <022301c814de$e5cd2060$0802a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues:
 
You can now access our discussion on Creativity and the GED at:
 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
 
Discussion Summary and Full Discussion are added to the menu of choices
at the top.
 
Thanks!
 
Marie Cora
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From lloyd_david at creativeworkplacelearning.org  Tue Oct 23 14:47:24 2007
From: lloyd_david at creativeworkplacelearning.org (Lloyd David)
Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 14:47:24 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 998] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <9E27E4E9-7729-4CBB-8BFF-5EB16782DFE1@comcast.net>
References: <059c01c8111d$85f2ba20$0402a8c0@LITNOW><47174202.1F1A.005D.0@cccti.edu><8C9DFBD75A4B076-BD4-870B@WEBMAIL-MC05.sysops.aol.com><6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB85916FE@lac-exch.lacnyc.local><F574BD12-37D2-4853-BDCE-122220ED193B@comcast.net><6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB8591771@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
	<9E27E4E9-7729-4CBB-8BFF-5EB16782DFE1@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <009401c815a5$275072f0$3564a8c0@DirectorEVO>

David,
I believe that one of the beautiful features of workplace education is the
need to include and somehow combine both academic evaluations and workplace
measures of change or progress. In the workplace education programs that CWL
offers there is always a TEAM comprised of representatives of the company
and the CWL program manager and if possible the instructor. One of the TEAMs
that we presently work with is composed of the HR manager, 2 supervisors
from different shifts, the plant manager, 2 production workers from
different shifts, the CWL program manager, and the CWL instructor. The TEAM
designed a notice about the program and informed the workforce about the
time and days for orientation and assessments. Initially we assessed 37
workers using CWL developed instruments in reading, writing, and speech. The
company had previously developed a math test. The TEAM selected 14 students
for 2 classes based on the results of the assessments. The TEAM had already
decided the skill levels desired for each class.  Later CWL will assess the
14 students using standardized test - BEST Plus and TABE. We will later
re-test the students using both CWL tests ,BEST Plus and the TABE to measure
academic changes. The members of the Team have discussed the goals of the
program and what they hope people will learn so as to improve productivity
on the job. The instructor is designing the curriculum to achieve these
goals as well as meeting the individual goals and needs of the students. 
I did an evaluation study on a program CWL ran in a distribution center. The
study measured changes in attendance at work, error rates, and individual
benefits derived from participating in the classes. We interviewed each
student, the instructor, the supervisors, plant managers, and CFO (chief
financial officer). The study entitled "Value of Workplace Education" is on
a website www.creativeworkplacelearning.org The most significant changes
resulted from the increase in confidence as described by the students and
the supervisors. Errors decreased and attendance improved as measured
against a control group of similar workers who did  not attend the classes. 
Lloyd  

Lloyd David, EdD.
Creative Workplace Learning
311 Washington Street
Brighton, MA 02135
Tel :  617-783-6360 
FAX: 617-782-0136

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2007 10:04 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 994] Re: level movement

Hello Venu,

I don't think a longitudinal study, or a random sample of programs, would
meet the need that individual programs or students have for measuring
learner progress, or programs' interest in knowing learner outcomes or
impact on learners.  These need to be addressed in other ways.  But since
you have asked, here -- in broad brush strokes -- is what we need to do:

. Programs need formative and summative evaluation measures. A good
formative system should have as one of its goals no surprises for the
student and teacher when they see the results of a summative assessment.
. Standardized tests could be part of program evaluation if there is a high
degree of validity between what is taught and tested.
. Multiple measures are important.  In addition to standardized tests,
teacher evaluation, student self-evaluation, performance-based measures, and
other measures could be part of the mix.
. In adult education it is especially important to measure progress toward
and attainment of student goals and objectives. A superficial process of
asking students to check off their goals when they enroll is not sufficient.
Student goals need to regularly be re-visited, and broken down into
short-term objectives.  Students need an opportunity to regularly reflect on
their progress, perhaps with a  
teacher or tutor, or with other students. Their goals may change.   
indeed changing goals may be one measure of progress!

Does all of this sound like it would take more resources than most adult
education programs have? Yes.  High quality in education often requires more
resources.  If we believe in high quality, then we should advocate for it,
and for the resources needed to achieve it.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 19, 2007, at 6:55 PM, Venu Thelakkat wrote:

> David,
>
>
>
> An independent study of adult education students over a longer period 
> of time sounds like a great way to evaluate the adult education system 
> from a national or state perspective, even though, like you said, 
> there are some methodological challenges.  It will certainly provide 
> more valid and reliable data than we get from NRS.  However, it still 
> leaves unresolved the issue of evaluating individual programs.  Like 
> Diane said, states have been using NRS data to allocate funding and 
> target technical assistance.  How would a longitudinal study meet this 
> need?
>
>
>
> Venu Thelakkat
>
> Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis
>
> Literacy Assistance Center
>
> 32 Broadway, 10th floor
>
> New York, NY 10004
>
> (212) 803-3370
>
> venut at lacnyc.org
>
> www.lacnyc.org
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- 
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 8:38 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 984] Re: level movement
>
>
>
> Assessment Colleagues,
>
>
>
> On Oct 18, 2007, at 7:00 PM, Venu Thelakkat asked:
>
>> I am told that standardized assessments, especially those used in  
>> adult literacy, have many problems.  But what is the alternative?   
>> Policy makers and funders (private or public) want accountability for 
>> the money they disperse and there is very little else that has been 
>> proposed.  Even in NRS, educational gain is the only measure that has 
>> some validity as a program outcome.  The other measures such as 
>> getting a job or entering post secondary education are very 
>> unreliable given the wide variety of methods used to collect and 
>> report the data.
>>
>
>
> Great question, Venu.
>
> One alternative that makes sense has been proposed, but I am told that 
> Congress so far has been unwilling to accept it. Instead of reporting 
> outcomes for every student in every federally-funded program, OVAE 
> should each year pick a random sample of federally- funded programs 
> and measure attainment of student goals over a multi-year period, that 
> is, measure impact.  Some would argue that measuring impact is not 
> possible, that adult education students are too hard to track over 
> time, but the Longitudinal Study of Adult Literacy, now in its eighth 
> year in Portland, Oregon, has shown that it is not impossible.
>
>
>
> Isn't impact more useful to policy makers than outcomes? Does anyone 
> in Congress really care how many level gains students make?
> Some policy makers may care about how many program participants -- 
> especially over time -- have improved their employment status, can 
> read to their children, can use  a computer, now have a diploma or
> GED, and have succeeded in their education beyond secondary level.   
> Of these goals, only the GED and high school diploma (for now at
> least) require a standardized test.
>
>
>
> David J. Rosen
>
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to lloyd_david at ceilearn.com

From MMaralit at NIFL.gov  Wed Oct 24 16:54:09 2007
From: MMaralit at NIFL.gov (Maralit, Mary Jo)
Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 16:54:09 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 999] NEW: News and Notes from the National Institute
	for Literacy
Message-ID: <4062487BDB6029428A763CAEF4E1FE5B180C4DF8@wdcrobe2m03.ed.gov>

October 24, 2007

 

Welcome News and Notes from the National Institute for Literacy:

 

The National Institute for Literacy this week welcomed its Advisory Board.
Our 10-member, presidentially appointed Board met in Washington, DC on
Tuesday, October 23 and on Wednesday, October 24. The U.S. Department of
Education's Office of Vocational and Adult Education (OVAE) hosted day one
of the two-day meeting. And on Wednesday, the meeting was convened at the
Institute's headquarters. 

 

On Tuesday, October 23, I shared with the Board highlights and
accomplishments of the Institute's 2006-2007 fiscal year in my Director's
Report. I am pleased to share a copy with you as an attachment to this
email. The report is also available at: 
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/publications/directors_report07.pdf.

 

WHAT'S NEW AT THE INSTITUTE

 

*	Now Available-Adolescent Literacy Report: On October 23, the
Institute issued "What Content-Area Teachers Should Know About Adolescent
Literacy," a 61-page report developed by an Interagency working group
comprised of the U.S. Department of Education's Office of Vocational and
Adult Education, the National Institute of Child Health and Human
Development, and the National Institute for Literacy. The report is designed
to support the needs of middle and high school classroom teachers,
administrators and parents in search of basic information about how to build
the reading and writing skills of adolescents. To download the report: 
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/publications/adolescent_literacy07.pdf.

 

*	Take part in a Survey on PD: The Institute's Regional Resource
Center grantees are conducting an online survey on the professional
development needs of adult education practitioners across the country. The
Professional Development Needs Assessment survey was released in August 2007
and will conclude on November 9. Survey results will help inform the
Institute and its Literacy Information and Communications System (LINCS)
Regional Resource Centers about the dissemination of materials and training
products it produces; and help identify new professional development
resources needed in the field.  To access the survey: 
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/news_events/PDsurvey07.html 

 

*	National Ad Placement: Look for the Institute's "Literacy Begins at
Home" full-page color advertisement in the November issue of Essence, the
premier lifestyle magazine for African-American women. Through its new
partnership with Essence and the ESSENCE CARES national mentoring
initiative, the Institute is creating literacy awareness and providing
expert resources to parents and the magazine's 1.5 million subscribers. This
national ad placement, a first for the Institute, carries the
slogan-"Literacy Begins at Home: Give Your Children the Gift of a
Lifetime.... Teach them to Read." The Institute's insert for parents,
released in time for the start of the school year, was also distributed in
Essence. The insert, a handy checklist for parents of toddlers through third
graders, provided information about literacy, reading, and the Institute to
1.5 million subscribers, households, and readers! To download a copy of the
insert: http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/news_events/essence_insert.html. 

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------

NOTE: For the latest news, updates and publications, subscribe to the
National Institute for Literacy's Announcement List: 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/announce
<http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/announce> 
As of October 24, 2007, the Institute has started a new list to share
information about new and on-going programs and projects, we invite you to
subscribe to this list.  If you have any questions or comments, please email
info at nifl.gov. Thank you.

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From msledet at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 25 15:12:14 2007
From: msledet at yahoo.com (shirley ledet)
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 12:12:14 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 1000] Re: level movement
In-Reply-To: <009401c815a5$275072f0$3564a8c0@DirectorEVO>
Message-ID: <70131.15318.qm@web90410.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I belelive that a good program and good instruction can have a positive long term afffect on students lives.  The assessment is a way to measure academic achievement, however many students return to say how their lives have changed since they attended my class. Their relationships improve at home; on the job; at their kids school.  They explain that they do want to get the GED and that is a goal, howvever they do not feel ready. I dn not beleive that many agencies measure the far reaching effects some programs may have on lives. I am currently attempting to contact students from 2003-2007 to find out what they are doing, what they currently need and how my program might best serve them. Numbers are important but we must start looking at people. 
  Shirley Ledet, GEd Instructor
  North Harris College-Carver Center 

Lloyd David <lloyd_david at creativeworkplacelearning.org> wrote:
  David,
I believe that one of the beautiful features of workplace education is the
need to include and somehow combine both academic evaluations and workplace
measures of change or progress. In the workplace education programs that CWL
offers there is always a TEAM comprised of representatives of the company
and the CWL program manager and if possible the instructor. One of the TEAMs
that we presently work with is composed of the HR manager, 2 supervisors
from different shifts, the plant manager, 2 production workers from
different shifts, the CWL program manager, and the CWL instructor. The TEAM
designed a notice about the program and informed the workforce about the
time and days for orientation and assessments. Initially we assessed 37
workers using CWL developed instruments in reading, writing, and speech. The
company had previously developed a math test. The TEAM selected 14 students
for 2 classes based on the results of the assessments. The TEAM had already
decided the skill levels desired for each class. Later CWL will assess the
14 students using standardized test - BEST Plus and TABE. We will later
re-test the students using both CWL tests ,BEST Plus and the TABE to measure
academic changes. The members of the Team have discussed the goals of the
program and what they hope people will learn so as to improve productivity
on the job. The instructor is designing the curriculum to achieve these
goals as well as meeting the individual goals and needs of the students. 
I did an evaluation study on a program CWL ran in a distribution center. The
study measured changes in attendance at work, error rates, and individual
benefits derived from participating in the classes. We interviewed each
student, the instructor, the supervisors, plant managers, and CFO (chief
financial officer). The study entitled "Value of Workplace Education" is on
a website www.creativeworkplacelearning.org The most significant changes
resulted from the increase in confidence as described by the students and
the supervisors. Errors decreased and attendance improved as measured
against a control group of similar workers who did not attend the classes. 
Lloyd 

Lloyd David, EdD.
Creative Workplace Learning
311 Washington Street
Brighton, MA 02135
Tel : 617-783-6360 
FAX: 617-782-0136

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2007 10:04 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 994] Re: level movement

Hello Venu,

I don't think a longitudinal study, or a random sample of programs, would
meet the need that individual programs or students have for measuring
learner progress, or programs' interest in knowing learner outcomes or
impact on learners. These need to be addressed in other ways. But since
you have asked, here -- in broad brush strokes -- is what we need to do:

. Programs need formative and summative evaluation measures. A good
formative system should have as one of its goals no surprises for the
student and teacher when they see the results of a summative assessment.
. Standardized tests could be part of program evaluation if there is a high
degree of validity between what is taught and tested.
. Multiple measures are important. In addition to standardized tests,
teacher evaluation, student self-evaluation, performance-based measures, and
other measures could be part of the mix.
. In adult education it is especially important to measure progress toward
and attainment of student goals and objectives. A superficial process of
asking students to check off their goals when they enroll is not sufficient.
Student goals need to regularly be re-visited, and broken down into
short-term objectives. Students need an opportunity to regularly reflect on
their progress, perhaps with a 
teacher or tutor, or with other students. Their goals may change. 
indeed changing goals may be one measure of progress!

Does all of this sound like it would take more resources than most adult
education programs have? Yes. High quality in education often requires more
resources. If we believe in high quality, then we should advocate for it,
and for the resources needed to achieve it.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 19, 2007, at 6:55 PM, Venu Thelakkat wrote:

> David,
>
>
>
> An independent study of adult education students over a longer period 
> of time sounds like a great way to evaluate the adult education system 
> from a national or state perspective, even though, like you said, 
> there are some methodological challenges. It will certainly provide 
> more valid and reliable data than we get from NRS. However, it still 
> leaves unresolved the issue of evaluating individual programs. Like 
> Diane said, states have been using NRS data to allocate funding and 
> target technical assistance. How would a longitudinal study meet this 
> need?
>
>
>
> Venu Thelakkat
>
> Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis
>
> Literacy Assistance Center
>
> 32 Broadway, 10th floor
>
> New York, NY 10004
>
> (212) 803-3370
>
> venut at lacnyc.org
>
> www.lacnyc.org
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- 
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 8:38 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 984] Re: level movement
>
>
>
> Assessment Colleagues,
>
>
>
> On Oct 18, 2007, at 7:00 PM, Venu Thelakkat asked:
>
>> I am told that standardized assessments, especially those used in 
>> adult literacy, have many problems. But what is the alternative? 
>> Policy makers and funders (private or public) want accountability for 
>> the money they disperse and there is very little else that has been 
>> proposed. Even in NRS, educational gain is the only measure that has 
>> some validity as a program outcome. The other measures such as 
>> getting a job or entering post secondary education are very 
>> unreliable given the wide variety of methods used to collect and 
>> report the data.
>>
>
>
> Great question, Venu.
>
> One alternative that makes sense has been proposed, but I am told that 
> Congress so far has been unwilling to accept it. Instead of reporting 
> outcomes for every student in every federally-funded program, OVAE 
> should each year pick a random sample of federally- funded programs 
> and measure attainment of student goals over a multi-year period, that 
> is, measure impact. Some would argue that measuring impact is not 
> possible, that adult education students are too hard to track over 
> time, but the Longitudinal Study of Adult Literacy, now in its eighth 
> year in Portland, Oregon, has shown that it is not impossible.
>
>
>
> Isn't impact more useful to policy makers than outcomes? Does anyone 
> in Congress really care how many level gains students make?
> Some policy makers may care about how many program participants -- 
> especially over time -- have improved their employment status, can 
> read to their children, can use a computer, now have a diploma or
> GED, and have succeeded in their education beyond secondary level. 
> Of these goals, only the GED and high school diploma (for now at
> least) require a standardized test.
>
>
>
> David J. Rosen
>
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
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> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

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From msledet at yahoo.com  Thu Oct 25 16:30:08 2007
From: msledet at yahoo.com (shirley ledet)
Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 13:30:08 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <900557.83206.qm@web90413.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted, just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity between socio economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated when
 "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on more creativity!
  Shirley Ledet
  GED Instructor
  NHC-Carver 

djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
  Colleagues,

I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high academic standards AND creativity. 

But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it. 

Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why? 

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Marie Cora" 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to
> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> suggested resources go to:
> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> 
> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can
> catch up in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> 
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now! 
> 
> Thanks!!
> 
> Marie Cora
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Marie Cora
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> 
> 

From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000

      
            Hi everyone,
   
  We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go to:
   
    http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
   
  If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
   
  Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now! 
   
  Thanks!!
   
  Marie Cora
  Assessment Discussion List Moderator
   
   
   
   
  Marie Cora
  marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
  NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
  http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
   

   

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From tborge at bhcc.mass.edu  Fri Oct 26 15:39:46 2007
From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu (Borge, Toni F)
Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 15:39:46 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1002] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <900557.83206.qm@web90413.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
	<900557.83206.qm@web90413.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59016389AC@mercury.bhcc.dom>

When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a critical
thinking way they will be successful in achieving their education and
other life goals. However, just like K-12 education, adult education is
captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of accountability which
stifles creativity and teachers teach to the test.

Toni Borge

BHCC 
Adult Education & Transitions Program

Boston, MA

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of shirley ledet
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

 

I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful on
any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted, just
smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well rounded, enjoy
reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like "I don't know, I
just know stuff."  Researchers have found that this may be the reason
for disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity
between socio economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts,
banking industry, faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your
everyday life tends to offer more of an advantage when testing then
someone whose only exposure is to go to school and study hard. My
students participate in a quite a few creative projects and those that
"get into it" tend to do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a
waste of time and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally
frustrated when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those activities
that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on more
creativity!

Shirley Ledet

GED Instructor

NHC-Carver 

djrosen at comcast.net wrote:

	Colleagues,
	
	I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention recently
to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
academic standards AND creativity. 
	
	But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge
needed to pass the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a
time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators or policy makers also
believe creativity distracts from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to
be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key question on the minds
of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the panelists to
address it. 
	
	Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?

	
	
	David J. Rosen
	djrosen at comcast.net
	
	-------------- Original message ----------------------
	From: "Marie Cora" 
	> Hi everyone,
	> 
	> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
wanted to
	> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on
this
	> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests,
and
	> suggested resources go to:
	> 
	>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
	> 
	> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
you can
	> catch up in the archives at:
	> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
	> 
	> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to
share now! 
	> 
	> Thanks!!
	> 
	> Marie Cora
	> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> Marie Cora
	> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
	> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
	> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	> 
	> 
	
	
	
	From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
	To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
	Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to
know!
	Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000

	Hi everyone,

	 

	We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information on
this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on guests, and
suggested resources go to:

	 

	
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html

	 

	If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
you can catch up in the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html

	 

	Please post your questions and also your own experiences to
share now! 

	 

	Thanks!!

	 

	Marie Cora

	Assessment Discussion List Moderator

	 

	 

	 

	 

	Marie Cora

	marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
<mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 

	NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator

	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

	 

	 

	-------------------------------
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	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
	Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
	-------------------------------
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	Assessment mailing list
	Assessment at nifl.gov
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From macsimoin at hotmail.com  Fri Oct 26 16:01:31 2007
From: macsimoin at hotmail.com (Mary Lynn Simons)
Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 20:01:31 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 1003] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59016389AC@mercury.bhcc.dom>
References: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
	<900557.83206.qm@web90413.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 
	<25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59016389AC@mercury.bhcc.dom>
Message-ID: <BAY115-W9F0A498656C7BDB587D5EBF960@phx.gbl>

Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot and if students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a skill.  The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The reason people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do not play the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I say, "Shut up and read."

________________________________> Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 15:39:46 -0400> From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment 1002] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education, adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the test.> Toni Borge> BHCC> Adult Education & Transitions Program> Boston, MA> ________________________________> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized test. We need look no further then those who have been successful on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted, just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like "I don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity between socio economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on more creativity!> Shirley Ledet> GED Instructor> NHC-Carver> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:> Colleagues,> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high academic standards AND creativity.> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> -------------- Original message ----------------------> From: "Marie Cora">> Hi everyone,>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to>> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>> suggested resources go to:>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can>> catch up in the archives at:>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!>>>> Thanks!!>>>> Marie Cora>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>> From: "Marie Cora"> To:> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000> Hi everyone,> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go to:> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you can catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!> Thanks!!> Marie Cora> Assessment Discussion List Moderator> Marie Cora> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com

_________________________________________________________________
Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. Stop by today.
http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline

From teacherwendyq at gmail.com  Fri Oct 26 17:23:19 2007
From: teacherwendyq at gmail.com (Wendy Quinones)
Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 17:23:19 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1004] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <BAY115-W9F0A498656C7BDB587D5EBF960@phx.gbl>
References: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
	<900557.83206.qm@web90413.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59016389AC@mercury.bhcc.dom>
	<BAY115-W9F0A498656C7BDB587D5EBF960@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <ad2cc1ef0710261423n49c5f99o20946f7fadfc1a70@mail.gmail.com>

Actually, all of the GED tests are reading -- even math for the most part.
I think Mary Lynn is right on!

On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot and if
> students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a
> skill.  The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The
> reason people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do not
> play the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I say,
> "Shut up and read."
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________> Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 15:39:46 -0400>
> From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment
> 1002] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> When we are referring to
> creativity do we mean teaching critical thinking skills which once our
> students know how to think in a critical thinking way they will be
> successful in achieving their education and other life goals. However, just
> like K-12 education, adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning
> wheel of accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> test.> Toni Borge> BHCC> Adult Education & Transitions Program> Boston, MA>
> ________________________________> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov[mailto:
> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet> Sent: Thursday,
> October 25, 2007 4:30 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion List> Subject:
> [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> I agree that
> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized test. We need look no
> further then those who have been successful on any type of test. We tend to
> use terms like natuarally gifted, just smart, etc. If you speak to these
> folks they are well rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use
> terms like "I don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that
> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is
> more disparity between socio economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to
> the arts, banking industry, faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your
> everyday life tends to offer more of an advantage when testing then someone
> whose only exposure is to go to school and study hard. My students
> participate in a quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it"
> tend to do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time and
> they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated when "all of
> their hard work does not pay off like they would like." Creativity also
> leads to retention; especially those activities that have to be completed in
> increments. Let's bring on more creativity!> Shirley Ledet> GED Instructor>
> NHC-Carver> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:> Colleagues,> I am a proponent of
> creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all education. As Marc
> Tucker, President of the National Center for Education and the Economy, has
> said in a presention recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
> http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high academic
> standards AND creativity.> But many GED teachers and administrators believe
> that their students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a
> time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators or policy makers also
> believe creativity distracts from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be
> the one to raise this issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many
> GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.>
> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?> David J.
> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> -------------- Original message
> ----------------------> From: "Marie Cora">> Hi everyone,>>>> We've had
> several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to>> give a quick
> reminder where you can get the information on this>> discussion. For the
> full announcement, information on guests, and>> suggested resources go
> to:>>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can>>
> catch up in the archives at:>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>> Please post
> your questions and also your own experiences to share now!>>>> Thanks!!>>>>
> Marie Cora>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> Moderator>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>> From:
> "Marie Cora"> To:> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need
> to know!> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000> Hi everyone,> We've had
> several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give a quick
> reminder where you can get the information on this discussion. For the full
> announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go to:>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html> If
> you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you can catch up
> in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html> Please post your
> questions and also your own experiences to share now!> Thanks!!> Marie Cora>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator> Marie Cora>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>
> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment
> mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your
> subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to
> djrosen at comcast.net> -------------------------------> National Institute
> for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe
> or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to
> msledet at yahoo.com
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. Stop
> by today.
>
> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
> -------------------------------
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From djrosen at comcast.net  Fri Oct 26 22:53:35 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 22:53:35 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59016389AC@mercury.bhcc.dom>
References: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net>
	<900557.83206.qm@web90413.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59016389AC@mercury.bhcc.dom>
Message-ID: <42345370-5924-41C1-9085-CFA9D5C204B0@comcast.net>

Assessment colleagues,

Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a  
shot.

Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching  
approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,  
better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we  
want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or  
both?  And where do critical skills fit in?

I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic  
skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both  
these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary  
education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the  
opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed  
in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable  
from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem  
solving.

Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring  
now adult secondary education programs?

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring  
creative skills.

If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the  
greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I  
agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high  
stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional  
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills  
like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different  
perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of  
solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving  
image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or  
rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to  
disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now  
often describe as "thinking outside the box").

Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should  
they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high  
school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable  
employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to  
successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be  
teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking  
and creativity.

I invite your comments on this.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:

> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical  
> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a  
> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their  
> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,  
> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of  
> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the  
> test.
>
> Toni Borge
>
> BHCC
> Adult Education & Transitions Program
>
> Boston, MA
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- 
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized  
> test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful  
> on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,  
> just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well  
> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like  
> "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that  
> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe  
> there is more disparity between socio economic background then  
> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,  
> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer  
> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure  
> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a  
> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to  
> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time  
> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated  
> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would  
> like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those  
> activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on  
> more creativity!
>
> Shirley Ledet
>
> GED Instructor
>
> NHC-Carver
>
> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
>
> Colleagues,
>
> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --  
> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National  
> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention  
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// 
> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --  
> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high  
> academic standards AND creativity.
>
> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their  
> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and  
> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a  
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,  
> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts  
> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this  
> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers  
> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>
> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "Marie Cora"
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I  
> wanted to
> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > suggested resources go to:
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
> 07creativityGED.html
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -  
> you can
> > catch up in the archives at:
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share  
> now!
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
>
>
>
> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I  
> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information  
> on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on  
> guests, and suggested resources go to:
>
>
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>
>
>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you  
> can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/ 
> assessment/2007/date.html
>
>
>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

From donnaedp at cox.net  Sat Oct 27 09:10:29 2007
From: donnaedp at cox.net (Donna Chambers)
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
References: <100920071529.20063.470B9E5F000BAE9900004E5F2216566276020A9C019D060B@comcast.net><900557.83206.qm@web90413.mail.mud.yahoo.com><25C5446CAEEA054E8087E673DF6C1F59016389AC@mercury.bhcc.dom>
	<42345370-5924-41C1-9085-CFA9D5C204B0@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48@DH89L251>

David and All,

Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.  Critical thinking is a 
learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can be nurtured, 
but not necessarily learned..  In Adult Education creativity is not a 
necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount.

I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment programs such 
as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma Program. 
This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know and be able to 
do and this information has changed over the years.  Most states' education 
systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education seems to be 
GED driven.  As such, is limited to just what is necessary to pass the GED. 
The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and assessment is 
apparent, at least to me.

In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list of 
competencies that need to be learned.  Merely passing a standardized test 
does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically. Yet, from the 
perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and policy makers, 
passing the test has become paramount  in Adult Education. Outcomes has been 
translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the GED is 
"good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass the GED, all 
will be well.   Not necessarily so!

Adult Education needs complete reform.  Let's look at what the metacognative 
research tells us and design a system around what essential knowledge and 
skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading skills into all 
activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a performance 
based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to know and be 
able to do today.  Passing the GED will still be an attainable measure, but 
only one of many that need to be achieved.  Instructors and students must 
know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and thinking 
skills will lead to passing the test.  A strong foundation will, more 
importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high school 
certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed in our 
complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from the beginning 
upon entering AE programs.  Learners must be given the opportunity to 
understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the path to skill 
building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their goals. 
Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the outcomes will 
be more meaningful.

Donna  Chambers

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Assessment colleagues,

Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
shot.

Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
both?  And where do critical skills fit in?

I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
solving.

Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
now adult secondary education programs?

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
creative skills.

If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
often describe as "thinking outside the box").

Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
and creativity.

I invite your comments on this.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:

> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> test.
>
> Toni Borge
>
> BHCC
> Adult Education & Transitions Program
>
> Boston, MA
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> more creativity!
>
> Shirley Ledet
>
> GED Instructor
>
> NHC-Carver
>
> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
>
> Colleagues,
>
> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> academic standards AND creativity.
>
> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>
> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "Marie Cora"
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to
> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > suggested resources go to:
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> 07creativityGED.html
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> you can
> > catch up in the archives at:
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> now!
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
>
>
>
> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> guests, and suggested resources go to:
>
>
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>
>
>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> assessment/2007/date.html
>
>
>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net

From Kgotthardt at comcast.net  Sat Oct 27 09:35:10 2007
From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net (Katherine G)
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <42345370-5924-41C1-9085-CFA9D5C204B0@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>

David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if
students are planning to go on to college!  Students who pass the GED with
minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and
weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.  Most colleges
require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum."  As we
know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.

Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using
rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.  Humanities
courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,
figures of speech, figurative language, and more.  For students to truly
understand history, they must be able to visualize different time periods.
Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which
graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.  The list goes
on.

Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a GED
class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all.  If
the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the
students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.  In terms of more
formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that
home.  Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not
get with GED students.  But especially with students who want to pursue
higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach
them to think critically.

Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't
studied in a long time but did in my past lives.  The essay demonstrates how
creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED students can
expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the
teacher and the class).  http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm

I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED students
planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have
communications between public schools and college to make this happen if we
want GED students to succeed.  Part of these discussions should include
creativity used and expected in every academic setting.

Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor
Prince William County Public Schools
Adult Education
P.O. Box 389
Manassas, VA 20108
work 703-791-8387
fax 703-791-8889

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Assessment colleagues,

Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
shot.

Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
both?  And where do critical skills fit in?

I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
solving.

Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
now adult secondary education programs?

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
creative skills.

If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
often describe as "thinking outside the box").

Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
and creativity.

I invite your comments on this.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:

> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> test.
>
> Toni Borge
>
> BHCC
> Adult Education & Transitions Program
>
> Boston, MA
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> more creativity!
>
> Shirley Ledet
>
> GED Instructor
>
> NHC-Carver
>
> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
>
> Colleagues,
>
> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> academic standards AND creativity.
>
> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>
> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "Marie Cora"
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to
> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > suggested resources go to:
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> 07creativityGED.html
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> you can
> > catch up in the archives at:
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> now!
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
>
>
>
> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> guests, and suggested resources go to:
>
>
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>
>
>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> assessment/2007/date.html
>
>
>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
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> -------------------------------
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>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
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> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Sat Oct 27 11:46:59 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 08:46:59 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 1008] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
Message-ID: <OFC68E1FF5.FFC615F1-ON07257381.00553688-07257381.0056B334@yc.edu>

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From andreawilder at comcast.net  Sat Oct 27 14:57:29 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 14:57:29 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1009] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <OFC68E1FF5.FFC615F1-ON07257381.00553688-07257381.0056B334@yc.edu>
References: <OFC68E1FF5.FFC615F1-ON07257381.00553688-07257381.0056B334@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <69c09a7aab39d4d0fcd91c58d6b0e1d4@comcast.net>

Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading and 2. 
creativity?

Howard Gardner is said to regret that he every wrote about multiple 
intelligences.  Anyone here want to try to define that?

Thanks.

Andrea

On Oct 27, 2007, at 11:46 AM, Tina_Luffman at yc.edu wrote:

> Hi everyone,
> ?
> I really support Donna's ideas in this posting, and I will go so 
> far?as to say that?I believe teaching critical thinking skills 
> is?vital to passing the Reading, Science, and Social Studies tests 
> anyway. And critical thinking skills are the foundation for writing 
> the GED Essay.??It seems to me that the reasoning behind the 
> teach-to-the-test pattern we fall into is that our primary outcomes 
> are educational gains and passing a GED exam.
> ?
> Another?challenge GED teachers must grapple with is that?we still need 
> to measure learning, and the standardized tests are the most objective 
> form available. Once I test a student and let them know they have come 
> up in a particular subject, this feedback gives the student efficacy 
> and encouragement, and helps so much with retention. I have seen this 
> over and over again in the classroom. Students who feel they aren't 
> getting anywhere and are ready to?quit?sit up three inches taller 
> when?they find out that they have come up three grade levels in the 
> past two months in Math, for example.
> ?
> Concerning creativity, here is a great resource: Harry Noden's book 
> Image Grammar. This English book was written for ~ 6th grade classroom 
> and encompases things like metrics for parallelism, graphcal arts?as 
> impetus for writing an essay, and so on. Please check out this link 
> for some pictures you can use to stimulate students writing an essay. 
> I found this book when writing my thesis for college where I looked 
> for ways to use Howard Gardner's Multiple Intelligence theory in the 
> Basic Writing classrom. 
> http://www3.uakron.edu/noden/web/students/index.html
> ?
> If anyone is interested in reading other ideas I found, you can go to 
> this link and click on MIT Activities for the BW Classroom link on the 
> left panel: http://www.luffman.us/tina/eng621/
> ?
> Thanks,
> ?
> Tina
>
> ?
> Tina?Luffman
> Coordinator,?Developmental?Education
> Verde?Valley?Campus
> 928-634-6544
> tina_luffman at yc.edu
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
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From MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDU  Sat Oct 27 16:22:34 2007
From: MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDU (Carver, Mary-Lynn)
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 15:22:34 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1010] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
References: <mailman.1.1193500801.21772.assessment@nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B103F@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>

Donna Chambers -
Well said. I am in total agreement.
 
Where do we start?
 
Thanks,
Mary Lynn Carver
ABE/GED Instructor
College of Lake County
Building 4, Office 405
19351 W. Washington Street
Grayslake, IL  60031
Phone:847/543-2677
mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
Fax: 847/543-7580
 
"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be constantly amused" -- Unknown
 
We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how to learn. --Peter F. Drucker 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of assessment-request at nifl.gov
Sent: Sat 10/27/2007 11:00 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31

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Today's Topics:

   1. [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Donna Chambers)
   2. [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Katherine G)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400
From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
        reply-type=original

David and All,

Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.  Critical thinking is a
learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can be nurtured,
but not necessarily learned..  In Adult Education creativity is not a
necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount.

I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment programs such
as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma Program.
This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know and be able to
do and this information has changed over the years.  Most states' education
systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education seems to be
GED driven.  As such, is limited to just what is necessary to pass the GED.
The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and assessment is
apparent, at least to me.

In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list of
competencies that need to be learned.  Merely passing a standardized test
does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically. Yet, from the
perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and policy makers,
passing the test has become paramount  in Adult Education. Outcomes has been
translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the GED is
"good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass the GED, all
will be well.   Not necessarily so!

Adult Education needs complete reform.  Let's look at what the metacognative
research tells us and design a system around what essential knowledge and
skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading skills into all
activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a performance
based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to know and be
able to do today.  Passing the GED will still be an attainable measure, but
only one of many that need to be achieved.  Instructors and students must
know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and thinking
skills will lead to passing the test.  A strong foundation will, more
importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high school
certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed in our
complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from the beginning
upon entering AE programs.  Learners must be given the opportunity to
understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the path to skill
building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their goals.
Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the outcomes will
be more meaningful.

Donna  Chambers

----- Original Message -----
From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Assessment colleagues,

Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
shot.

Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
both?  And where do critical skills fit in?

I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
solving.

Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
now adult secondary education programs?

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
creative skills.

If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
often describe as "thinking outside the box").

Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
and creativity.

I invite your comments on this.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:

> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> test.
>
> Toni Borge
>
> BHCC
> Adult Education & Transitions Program
>
> Boston, MA
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> more creativity!
>
> Shirley Ledet
>
> GED Instructor
>
> NHC-Carver
>
> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
>
> Colleagues,
>
> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///> 
> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> academic standards AND creativity.
>
> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>
> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "Marie Cora"
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to
> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > suggested resources go to:
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> 07creativityGED.html
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> you can
> > catch up in the archives at:
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> now!
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
>
>
>
> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> guests, and suggested resources go to:
>
>
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>
>
>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> assessment/2007/date.html
>
>
>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> -------------------------------
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> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
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Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400
From: "Katherine G" <Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="Windows-1252"

David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if
students are planning to go on to college!  Students who pass the GED with
minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and
weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.  Most colleges
require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum."  As we
know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.

Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using
rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.  Humanities
courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,
figures of speech, figurative language, and more.  For students to truly
understand history, they must be able to visualize different time periods.
Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which
graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.  The list goes
on.

Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a GED
class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all.  If
the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the
students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.  In terms of more
formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that
home.  Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not
get with GED students.  But especially with students who want to pursue
higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach
them to think critically.

Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't
studied in a long time but did in my past lives.  The essay demonstrates how
creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED students can
expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the
teacher and the class).  http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm

I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED students
planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have
communications between public schools and college to make this happen if we
want GED students to succeed.  Part of these discussions should include
creativity used and expected in every academic setting.

Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor
Prince William County Public Schools
Adult Education
P.O. Box 389
Manassas, VA 20108
work 703-791-8387
fax 703-791-8889

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Assessment colleagues,

Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
shot.

Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
both?  And where do critical skills fit in?

I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
solving.

Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
now adult secondary education programs?

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
creative skills.

If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
often describe as "thinking outside the box").

Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
and creativity.

I invite your comments on this.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:

> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> test.
>
> Toni Borge
>
> BHCC
> Adult Education & Transitions Program
>
> Boston, MA
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> more creativity!
>
> Shirley Ledet
>
> GED Instructor
>
> NHC-Carver
>
> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
>
> Colleagues,
>
> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///> 
> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> academic standards AND creativity.
>
> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>
> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "Marie Cora"
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to
> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > suggested resources go to:
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> 07creativityGED.html
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> you can
> > catch up in the archives at:
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> now!
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
>
>
>
> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> guests, and suggested resources go to:
>
>
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>
>
>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> assessment/2007/date.html
>
>
>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net

------------------------------

-------------------------------
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End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
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From djrosen at comcast.net  Sat Oct 27 19:17:10 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1011]  Media Library of Teaching Skills
Message-ID: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9@comcast.net>

Colleagues,

The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web- 
based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms  
and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy  
videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:

? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy  
tutoring)
? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
? OTAN  (integrating technology)
   and
? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL  
learners can and cannot do with literacy)

I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or  
tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am  
hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for  
adult literacy education classroom videos.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

From macsimoin at hotmail.com  Sat Oct 27 21:01:15 2007
From: macsimoin at hotmail.com (Mary Lynn Simons)
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>
References: <42345370-5924-41C1-9085-CFA9D5C204B0@comcast.net>
	<MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900@phx.gbl>

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or training as fast as possible.

----------------------------------------> From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher and the class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. Stop by today.
http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline

From andreawilder at comcast.net  Sat Oct 27 22:24:28 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900@phx.gbl>
References: <42345370-5924-41C1-9085-CFA9D5C204B0@comcast.net>
	<MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>
	<BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <9e32f2dbe2ba96b51be97f5819a91d2c@comcast.net>

Hi Mary Lynn--

One of my mantras for students, no matter  the age, has been:  "Don't  
waste their time."  Is this what you are getting at?

Andrea

On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:

>
> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them  
> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically  
> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to  
> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to  
> college or training as fast as possible.
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------> From:  
> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct  
> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion -  
> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential  
> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to  
> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely  
> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are  
> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require  
> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,  
> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>  
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>  
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.  
> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement  
> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For  
> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize  
> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics  
> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to  
> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another  
> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not  
> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor  
> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students  
> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>  
> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take  
> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we  
> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who  
> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to  
> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just  
> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a  
> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>  
> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED  
> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent,  
> depending on the> teacher and the class).  
> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in  
> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend  
> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between  
> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED  
> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>  
> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine  
> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County  
> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>  
> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->  
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov  
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>  
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion  
> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to  
> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by  
> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a  
> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will  
> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test  
> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want  
> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And  
> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,  
> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would  
> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and  
> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should  
> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that  
> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking  
> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and  
> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the  
> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary  
> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through  
> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and  
> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education  
> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not  
> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the  
> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that  
> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for  
> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED  
> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look  
> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to  
> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent  
> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other  
> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and  
> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of  
> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the  
> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have.  
> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED  
> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone  
> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door  
> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should  
> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical  
> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J.  
> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,  
> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean  
> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how  
> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in  
> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like  
> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes  
> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and  
> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult  
> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:  
> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On  
> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>  
> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:  
> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that  
> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need  
> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of  
> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc.  
> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading,  
> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just  
> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for  
> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity  
> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the  
> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of  
> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing  
> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.  
> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those  
> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that  
> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED"  
> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay  
> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention;  
> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments.  
> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED  
> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>  
> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy  
> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of  
> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a  
> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,  
> http://>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education  
> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive  
> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED  
> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not  
> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to  
> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.  
> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe  
> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be  
> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds  
> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists  
> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for  
> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>  
> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie  
> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the  
> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can  
> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement,  
> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>  
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday -  
> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please  
> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>  
> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List  
> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>  
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List  
> Moderator>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:  
> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what  
> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi  
> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,  
> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the  
> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement,  
> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?  
> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:  
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>  
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share  
> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion  
> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>  
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List  
> Moderator>>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>  
> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>  
> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or  
> change your subscription settings, please go to>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to  
> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National  
> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>  
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription  
> settings, please go to>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to  
> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National  
> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>  
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription  
> settings, please go to>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to  
> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National  
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>  
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to  
> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National  
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>  
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to  
> macsimoin at hotmail.com
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.  
> Stop by today.
> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html? 
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>

From djrosen at comcast.net  Sat Oct 27 22:39:24 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
In-Reply-To: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9@comcast.net>
References: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <0570AB67-85EE-4F24-AF0B-2E657CB60778@comcast.net>

....and the Web address for MLoTS is:

http://www.mlots.org

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:

> Colleagues,
>
> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms
> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
>
> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy
> tutoring)
> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
> ? OTAN  (integrating technology)
>    and
> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
> learners can and cannot do with literacy)
>
> I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or
> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am
> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
> adult literacy education classroom videos.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

From djrosen at comcast.net  Sat Oct 27 23:17:38 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1015]  GED preparation and creativity
In-Reply-To: <69c09a7aab39d4d0fcd91c58d6b0e1d4@comcast.net>
References: <OFC68E1FF5.FFC615F1-ON07257381.00553688-07257381.0056B334@yc.edu>
	<69c09a7aab39d4d0fcd91c58d6b0e1d4@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C@comcast.net>

Hello Andrea,

On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:

> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading  
> and 2. creativity?

Here's more on defining creativity.  To begin  with, it's quite  
unlikely that we will agree on a definition.  There are more than 60  
of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988),  and as far  
as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for  
creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be  
taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that  
some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that  
it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the  
kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would  
agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might  
differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in  
different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and  
in the creative problem solving of daily living.

In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was  
thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as  
innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe  
Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically  
valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic  
success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education  
systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.

Are adult literacy education students  (including basic education,  
secondary education and ESOL) capable of  this kind of creativity? If  
so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should.  In  
many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even  
acknowledged in program goals or objectives.  And I have never seen  
it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value  
and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we  
are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should  
value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to  
nourish creativity.

What do you think about this?

* Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of  
creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.:  The nature of creativity:  
Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

From donnaedp at cox.net  Sun Oct 28 07:51:18 2007
From: donnaedp at cox.net (Donna Chambers)
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
References: <42345370-5924-41C1-9085-CFA9D5C204B0@comcast.net><MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>
	<BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <001f01c81958$da000530$8e5fdd48@DH89L251>

Mary Lynn,

Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief.  I am not 
suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for just 
"passing the test"  we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our job. 
Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of  a high 
school  student and be ready to transition to college level academics is in 
the learners' best interest in respect to time and money.   Community 
College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they do. If 
the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter community 
college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, but it is 
not.   Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic and 
secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of  Adult Literacy.

Donna Chambers

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mary Lynn Simons" <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM
Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them 
accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically decide 
what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able to 
pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or 
training as fast as possible.

----------------------------------------> From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: 
assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: 
[Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, I 
agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if> students 
are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal 
ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh 
options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> 
require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> 
know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>> 
Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using> 
rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. Humanities> 
courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,> 
figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to truly> 
understand history, they must be able to visualize different time periods.> 
Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which> 
graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> 
on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a 
GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. 
If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if 
the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more> 
formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that> 
home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not> 
get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue> 
higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach> 
them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from 
Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past lives. 
The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college classroom as 
well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this 
extent, depending on the> teacher and the class). 
http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in 
extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend 
college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between public 
schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to succeed. 
Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected in 
every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online 
Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 
389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax 
703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From: 
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf 
Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The 
Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - 
what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean 
by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a means 
to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more students 
have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is creativity 
itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically 
prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit in?>> I 
would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic> skills 
and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these 
catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary> education 
(e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to have 
academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong 
critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic 
skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the 
assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary 
education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through 
standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so 
how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring> 
creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to 
one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the 
U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on 
high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional> 
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills> like 
the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, 
the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to 
represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or 
other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and 
follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of 
thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>> Are 
these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> they be? 
Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school diploma as 
a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and 
self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful post-secondary 
learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring: 
academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I invite 
your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 
2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to 
creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our 
students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be 
successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, 
just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes 
spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers 
teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions 
Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
[mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: 
Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> 
Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 
know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on 
standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been 
successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally 
gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> 
rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I 
don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be 
the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more 
disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to 
the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of 
your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing then 
someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students 
participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into 
it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of 
time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated>> 
when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like." 
Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that have 
to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley 
Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> 
Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy 
education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the 
National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> 
recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>> 
www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> and he 
includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic 
standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators 
believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on 
skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>> 
"distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or 
policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes 
tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key 
question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite 
the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it 
essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> 
djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original 
message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> 
We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> 
give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> 
discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> 
suggested resources go to:>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>> 
07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there 
were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please post 
your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>> 
Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List 
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Marie 
Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to 
know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve 
had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to give a 
quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion. For 
the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go 
to:>>>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> 
If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>> can 
catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> 
assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your 
own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 
Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
Moderator>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> 
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 
please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 
delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> 
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 
please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 
delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> 
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 
please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 
delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> 
National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 
Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 
please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 
delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> 
National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 
Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 
please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 
delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. Stop by 
today.
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-------------------------------
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From Kgotthardt at comcast.net  Sun Oct 28 07:52:28 2007
From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net (Katherine G)
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:52:28 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1017] Re: GED preparation and creativity
In-Reply-To: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFLDMAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>

I don't think we can distinguish creativity from critical thinking.  They
overlap and feed one another.  The more you ask students to be creative, the
more critical thinking they practice.  After all, how can one begin to do
something like write a poem or story, create a picture, sing a song, make
meaning of what they see and hear without critical thinking?  Likewise,
unless we express our critical thinking, what good is it?  Rote memorization
yields neither critical thinking nor creativity.

Creativity, to me, means expressing our thoughts in meaningful ways,
expressing our ideas in ways that others might not expect but that a variety
of people with different learning styles and perspectives can appreciate,
melding those ideas so they come out in a form we design.  But this kind of
thinking takes time and a willingness to consider ideas.  Rigid, controlling
individuals rarely appreciate creativity.  Anyone care to help me qualify
that statement?  : )

Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 11:18 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity

Hello Andrea,

On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:

> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading
> and 2. creativity?

Here's more on defining creativity.  To begin  with, it's quite
unlikely that we will agree on a definition.  There are more than 60
of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988),  and as far
as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for
creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be
taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that
some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that
it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the
kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would
agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might
differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in
different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and
in the creative problem solving of daily living.

In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was
thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as
innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe
Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically
valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic
success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education
systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.

Are adult literacy education students  (including basic education,
secondary education and ESOL) capable of  this kind of creativity? If
so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should.  In
many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even
acknowledged in program goals or objectives.  And I have never seen
it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value
and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we
are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should
value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to
nourish creativity.

What do you think about this?

* Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of
creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.:  The nature of creativity:
Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

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From Kgotthardt at comcast.net  Sun Oct 28 08:15:19 2007
From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net (Katherine G)
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 08:15:19 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1018] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <9e32f2dbe2ba96b51be97f5819a91d2c@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFMDMAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>

I don't think encouraging students to express themselves and to think
critically is being maternal or paternal.  I think it's good teaching with
an emphasis on caring.  Students need to feel like we care about them and
their success.  This doesn't mean we have to change their diapers to do it!

We are not responsible for the lives our students live outside the
classroom.  But we ARE responsible for what happens IN the classroom and in
our schools.  Struggling students in particular need our support.  If they
need support we cannot provide, we need to make sure we at least refer them
to the people who can help.  There IS only so much we can do, and I know
that frustrates many teachers.  Solid program structure, training, policy
and procedure help teachers manage the fine balances required in the
classroom.  That includes teaching teachers how to encourage critical
thinking and creativity.

Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of Andrea Wilder
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 10:24 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Hi Mary Lynn--

One of my mantras for students, no matter  the age, has been:  "Don't
waste their time."  Is this what you are getting at?

Andrea

On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:

>
> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them
> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically
> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to
> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to
> college or training as fast as possible.
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------> From:
> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct
> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion -
> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential
> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to
> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely
> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are
> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require
> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,
> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.
> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement
> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For
> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize
> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics
> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to
> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another
> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not
> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor
> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students
> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>
> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take
> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we
> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who
> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to
> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just
> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a
> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>
> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED
> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent,
> depending on the> teacher and the class).
> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in
> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend
> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between
> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED
> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>
> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine
> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County
> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>
> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion
> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by
> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a
> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will
> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test
> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want
> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And
> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,
> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would
> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and
> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should
> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that
> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking
> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and
> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the
> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary
> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and
> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education
> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not
> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the
> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that
> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for
> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED
> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look
> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to
> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent
> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other
> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and
> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of
> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the
> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have.
> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED
> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone
> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door
> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should
> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical
> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J.
> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,
> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean
> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how
> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in
> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like
> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes
> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and
> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult
> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:
> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On
> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>
> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:
> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that
> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need
> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of
> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc.
> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading,
> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just
> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for
> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity
> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the
> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of
> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing
> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.
> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those
> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that
> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED"
> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay
> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention;
> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments.
> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED
> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>
> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of
> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a
> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
> http://>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education
> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive
> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED
> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not
> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to
> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.
> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe
> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be
> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds
> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists
> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for
> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>
> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie
> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the
> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can
> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement,
> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday -
> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please
> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>
> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> Moderator>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:
> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what
> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi
> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,
> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the
> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement,
> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?
> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion
> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> Moderator>>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>
> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>
> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or
> change your subscription settings, please go to>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National
> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> settings, please go to>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National
> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> settings, please go to>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to
> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to
> macsimoin at hotmail.com
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.
> Stop by today.
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Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net

From MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDU  Mon Oct 29 09:13:26 2007
From: MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDU (Carver, Mary-Lynn)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 08:13:26 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1019] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
References: <mailman.58243.1193577788.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B1042@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>

Wow, I must say I disagree with Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents come in just wanting to pass the test, but have no critical thinking or transitional college skills. If we don't help them understand and acquire some of those skills, they will not be able to succeed with the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think it is one of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they need to succeed in their class and beyond.  I don't feel it is paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.
 
Thanks,
Mary Lynn Carver
ABE/GED Instructor
College of Lake County
Building 4, Office 405
19351 W. Washington Street
Grayslake, IL  60031
Phone:847/543-2677
mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
Fax: 847/543-7580
 
"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be constantly amused" -- Unknown
 
We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how to learn. --Peter F. Drucker 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of assessment-request at nifl.gov
Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33

Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
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Today's Topics:

   1. [Assessment 1011]  Media Library of Teaching Skills
      (David J. Rosen)
   2. [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Mary Lynn Simons)
   3. [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Andrea Wilder)
   4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
      (David J. Rosen)
   5. [Assessment 1015]  GED preparation and creativity (David J. Rosen)
   6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Donna Chambers)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400
From: David J. Rosen <djrosen at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1011]  Media Library of Teaching Skills
To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List <technology at nifl.gov>,
        The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List
        <professionaldevelopment at nifl.gov>,     The Assessment Discussion List
        <assessment at nifl.gov>,  The Adult English Language Learners Discussion
        List    <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9 at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
        format=flowed

Colleagues,

The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms 
and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy 
videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:

? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy 
tutoring)
? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
? OTAN  (integrating technology)
   and
? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL 
learners can and cannot do with literacy)

I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or 
tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am 
hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for 
adult literacy education classroom videos.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000
From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900 at phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or training as fast as possible.

----------------------------------------> From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to truly> understand history, they must be able to vi
 sualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the co
 llege classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher and the class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need
  to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
 > now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin
 king (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifle
 s creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty
 ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///> 
 >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a qu
 ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you
 can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------
 ------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings
 , please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400
From: Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <9e32f2dbe2ba96b51be97f5819a91d2c at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
        format=flowed

Hi Mary Lynn--

One of my mantras for students, no matter  the age, has been:  "Don't 
waste their time."  Is this what you are getting at?

Andrea

On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:

>
> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them 
> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically 
> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to 
> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to 
> college or training as fast as possible.
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------> From: 
> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 
> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - 
> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential 
> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to 
> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely 
> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are 
> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require 
> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know, 
> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>> 
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using> 
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. 
> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement 
> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For 
> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize 
> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics 
> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to 
> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another 
> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not 
> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor 
> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students 
> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more> 
> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take 
> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we 
> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who 
> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to 
> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just 
> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a 
> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how> 
> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED 
> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, 
> depending on the> teacher and the class). 
> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in 
> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend 
> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between 
> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED 
> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include> 
> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine 
> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County 
> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108> 
> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> 
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen> 
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion 
> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 
> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by 
> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a 
> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will 
> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test 
> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want 
> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And 
> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, 
> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would 
> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and 
> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should 
> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that 
> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking 
> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and 
> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the 
> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary 
> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through 
> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and 
> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education 
> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not 
> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the 
> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that 
> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for 
> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED 
> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look 
> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to 
> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent 
> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other 
> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and 
> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of 
> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the 
> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. 
> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED 
> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone 
> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door 
> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should 
> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical 
> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. 
> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, 
> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean 
> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how 
> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in 
> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like 
> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes 
> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and 
> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult 
> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: 
> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On 
> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> 
> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: 
> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that 
> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need 
> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of 
> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc. 
> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading, 
> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just 
> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for 
> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity 
> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the 
> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of 
> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing 
> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. 
> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those 
> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that 
> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" 
> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay 
> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; 
> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments. 
> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED 
> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> 
> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy 
> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of 
> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a 
> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, 
> http:// <http:///> >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education 
> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive 
> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED 
> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not 
> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to 
> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. 
> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe 
> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be 
> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds 
> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists 
> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for 
> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> 
> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie 
> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the 
> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can 
> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement, 
> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>> 
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - 
> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please 
> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>> 
> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List 
> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> 
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
> Moderator>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: 
> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what 
> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi 
> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, 
> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the 
> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement, 
> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? 
> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at: 
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> 
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion 
> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
> Moderator>>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> 
> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> 
> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or 
> change your subscription settings, please go to>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National 
> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> settings, please go to>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National 
> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> settings, please go to>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National 
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> 
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to 
> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National 
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> 
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to 
> macsimoin at hotmail.com
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. 
> Stop by today.
> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?
> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
> -------------------------------
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> Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net
>

------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400
From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <0570AB67-85EE-4F24-AF0B-2E657CB60778 at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
        format=flowed

....and the Web address for MLoTS is:

http://www.mlots.org <http://www.mlots.org/> 

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:

> Colleagues,
>
> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms
> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
>
> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy
> tutoring)
> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
> ? OTAN  (integrating technology)
>    and
> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
> learners can and cannot do with literacy)
>
> I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or
> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am
> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
> adult literacy education classroom videos.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400
From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1015]  GED preparation and creativity
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed

Hello Andrea,

On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:

> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading 
> and 2. creativity?

Here's more on defining creativity.  To begin  with, it's quite 
unlikely that we will agree on a definition.  There are more than 60 
of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988),  and as far 
as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for 
creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be 
taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that 
some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that 
it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the 
kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would 
agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might 
differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in 
different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and 
in the creative problem solving of daily living.

In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was 
thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as 
innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe 
Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically 
valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic 
success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education 
systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.

Are adult literacy education students  (including basic education, 
secondary education and ESOL) capable of  this kind of creativity? If 
so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should.  In 
many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even 
acknowledged in program goals or objectives.  And I have never seen 
it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value 
and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we 
are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should 
value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to 
nourish creativity.

What do you think about this?

* Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of 
creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.:  The nature of creativity: 
Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400
From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <001f01c81958$da000530$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
        reply-type=original

Mary Lynn,

Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief.  I am not
suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for just
"passing the test"  we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our job.
Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of  a high
school  student and be ready to transition to college level academics is in
the learners' best interest in respect to time and money.   Community
College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they do. If
the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter community
college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, but it is
not.   Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic and
secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of  Adult Literacy.

Donna Chambers

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mary Lynn Simons" <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM
Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them
accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically decide
what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able to
pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or
training as fast as possible.

----------------------------------------> From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:
assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:
[Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, I
agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if> students
are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal
ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh
options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges>
require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we>
know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>
Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>
rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. Humanities>
courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,>
figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to truly>
understand history, they must be able to visualize different time periods.>
Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which>
graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list goes>
on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a
GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all.
If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if
the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>
formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that>
home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not>
get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue>
higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach>
them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from
Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past lives.
The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college classroom as
well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this
extent, depending on the> teacher and the class).
http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in
extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend
college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between public
schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to succeed.
Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected in
every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online
Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box
389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax
703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf
Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The
Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion -
what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean
by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a means
to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more students
have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is creativity
itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically
prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit in?>> I
would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic> skills
and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these
catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary> education
(e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to have
academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong
critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic
skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the
assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary
education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so
how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring>
creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to
one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the
U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on
high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional>
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills> like
the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives,
the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to
represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or
other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and
follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of
thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>> Are
these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> they be?
Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school diploma as
a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and
self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful post-secondary
learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring:
academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I invite
your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26,
2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to
creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our
students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be
successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals. However,
just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes
spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers
teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions
Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent:
Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>
Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on
standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been
successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally
gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>>
rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I
don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be
the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more
disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to
the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of
your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing then
someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students
participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into
it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of
time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated>>
when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like."
Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that have
to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley
Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>
Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>>
recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///> >>
www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> and he
includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic
standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators
believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on
skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>>
"distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or
policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes
tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key
question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite
the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it
essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>
djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original
message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>
We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to>>>
give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>
discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>
suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there
were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please post
your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>
Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Marie
Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to
know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve
had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to give a
quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion. For
the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go
to:>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>
If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>> can
catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>
assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your
own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
Moderator>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings,
please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings,
please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings,
please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->
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please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->
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From jschneider at eicc.edu  Mon Oct 29 12:20:43 2007
From: jschneider at eicc.edu (Schneider, Jim)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:20:43 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1020] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
In-Reply-To: <D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B1042@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
Message-ID: <208D21E3AC92D449A31336961A46FB870A108F15@eiccd-exch1.eiccd.net>

I have to believe that there is a happy middle ground between simply
preparing them for the test and expecting that all learners are going to
spend the time and effort required to building the skills necessary for
success in a college level curriculum. 

There is little doubt that many GED students are capable of far more
than what they actually achieve - however, they are self-determining
adults... 

It is our professional responsibility to ensure that they are aware of
the benefits/rewards/consequences of their choices. If we are creative
and engaging, we are much more likely will encourage/convince more to
elect to become petter prepared... 

However, there are others who have chosen to not engage in the past, and
are not ready to fully engage now... we have a duty to assist them in
fulfilling their goals as well - to simply pass the test, get the job,
join the military, etc., regardless of whether we agree with them or
not. 

Incidentally, Ralph Tyler (one of the GED creators) conducted a
fascinating comprehensive study of the GED that was published in 1956.
They knew then that the passing score of the GED was not adequate for
college success. They discovered that by raising a passing score to a 50
average (500 in the 2002 Test) greatly increased the likelihood of
college success, but eliminated too many students will scores between 45
and 50 who were successful in college. So rather than closing the door
on the lesser prepared, the average passing score was left at 45.  

In my opinion they recognized the realities of adult lives in the
1950's... and while our learners would be better off if they had to be
better prepared...  we also need to be cognizant of the realities of our
learners lives. 

Jim Schneider

Assistant Dean
Scott Community College 
Career Assistance Center
627 W. Second Street
Davenport, IA 52801
(563) 326-5319  phone
(563) 326-6039  fax
 
Do not despise the small act. 

Every small act, if you do it deeply, profoundly, can touch the whole
universe. 

Millions of small acts will build a wonderful world. 

Chan Khong

 

 

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Carver, Mary-Lynn
Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 8:13 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: RE: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33

Wow, I must say I disagree with Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents
come in just wanting to pass the test, but have no critical thinking or
transitional college skills. If we don't help them understand and
acquire some of those skills, they will not be able to succeed with the
transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think it is one of the
first duties of any teacher to give students what they need to succeed
in their class and beyond.  I don't feel it is paternal/maternalistic to
help them set a course to success.
 
Thanks,
Mary Lynn Carver
ABE/GED Instructor
College of Lake County
Building 4, Office 405
19351 W. Washington Street
Grayslake, IL  60031
Phone:847/543-2677
mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
Fax: 847/543-7580
 
"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be constantly
amused" -- Unknown
 
We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping
abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how to
learn. --Peter F. Drucker 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of
assessment-request at nifl.gov
Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33

Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
        assessment at nifl.gov

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."

Today's Topics:

   1. [Assessment 1011]  Media Library of Teaching Skills
      (David J. Rosen)
   2. [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Mary Lynn Simons)
   3. [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Andrea Wilder)
   4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
      (David J. Rosen)
   5. [Assessment 1015]  GED preparation and creativity (David J. Rosen)
   6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Donna Chambers)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400
From: David J. Rosen <djrosen at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1011]  Media Library of Teaching Skills
To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List <technology at nifl.gov>,
        The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List
        <professionaldevelopment at nifl.gov>,     The Assessment
Discussion List
        <assessment at nifl.gov>,  The Adult English Language Learners
Discussion
        List    <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9 at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
        format=flowed

Colleagues,

The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms 
and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy 
videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:

? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy 
tutoring)
? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
? OTAN  (integrating technology)
   and
? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL 
learners can and cannot do with literacy)

I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or 
tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am 
hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for 
adult literacy education classroom videos.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000
From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900 at phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them
accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically
decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be
able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to
college or training as fast as possible.

----------------------------------------> From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:
[Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, I
agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if>
students are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED
with> minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract
ideas, and> weigh options are usually at a loss in the college
classroom. Most colleges> require program elements such as "writing
across the curriculum." As we> know, writing requires abstract thought,
the kind adults need to develop.>> Even basic college writing classes
require understanding and using> rhetorical patterns found in the
descriptive essay and more. Humanities> courses demand students to
understand and even implement creative forms,> figures of speech,
figurative language, and more. For students to truly> understand
history, they must be able to vi
 sualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into
statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are
used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in
another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are
not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the
instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the>
students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>
formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take
that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we
might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who want
to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the
time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran
across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time
but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used
in the co
 llege classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in college
(though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher and the
class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm
believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> planning
to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> communications
between public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED
students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>
creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine
Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County Public
Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work
703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>
Behalf Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To:
The Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED
Discussion - what you need
  to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by
creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a means
to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more
students have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or
is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both
academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical
skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both
high academic> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking
in both> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult
secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with
the> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to
succeed> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be
inseparable> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative
problem> solving.>> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what
are we measuring
 > now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills,
at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical
thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult
literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is
right, we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest economic
assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker
and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills
tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the
GED tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to
look at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability
to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent
an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other
figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and
follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of
thin
 king (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>> Are
these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> they
be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school
diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable>
employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to>
successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be>
teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking>
and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen>
djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F
wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching
critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in
a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their>>
education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,>>
adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of>>
accountability which stifle
 s creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>
BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->>
bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October
25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:
[Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I
agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>>
test. We need look no further then those who have been successful>> on
any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just
smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy
reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I
just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason
for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity
between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the
arts, banking industry, faculty
 ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to
offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only
exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in
a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to>>
do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time>> and
they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated>> when
"all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like."
Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that
have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more
creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>>
djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of
creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed in all education. As
Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for Education and the
Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to the National Commission
on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///> 
 >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->>
and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>>
academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and
administrators believe that their>> students will not pass the GED
unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test,
that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12
teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity
distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to
raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED
teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address
it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success?
Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> --------------
Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi
everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and
so I>> wanted to>>> give a qu
 ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion.
For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested
resources go to:>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday -
there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please
post your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>
Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:
"Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what
you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi
everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,
and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you
 can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full
announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go
to:>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>
>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ?
you>> can catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>
assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also
your own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie
Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie
Cora>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion
List Moderator>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>
Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change
your subscription settings, please go to>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
djrosen at comcast.net>> ------
 ------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>
Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change
your subscription settings, please go to>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National
Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National
Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To
unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to
kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National
Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To
unsubscribe or change your subscription settings
 , please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
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ctWLtagline

------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400
From: Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <9e32f2dbe2ba96b51be97f5819a91d2c at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
        format=flowed

Hi Mary Lynn--

One of my mantras for students, no matter  the age, has been:  "Don't 
waste their time."  Is this what you are getting at?

Andrea

On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:

>
> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them 
> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically 
> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to 
> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to 
> college or training as fast as possible.
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------> From: 
> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 
> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - 
> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential 
> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to 
> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely 
> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are 
> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require 
> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,

> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>> 
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using> 
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. 
> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement 
> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For

> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize 
> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics 
> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to 
> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another 
> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not 
> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor

> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students

> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more> 
> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take

> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we 
> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who 
> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to 
> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just 
> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a 
> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how> 
> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED 
> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, 
> depending on the> teacher and the class). 
> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in 
> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend 
> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between 
> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED 
> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include> 
> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine 
> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County 
> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108> 
> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> 
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen> 
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion

> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to

> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by 
> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a 
> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will 
> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test 
> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want 
> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And 
> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,

> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would 
> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and 
> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should 
> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that 
> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking 
> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and 
> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the 
> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary

> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through 
> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and 
> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education 
> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not 
> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the 
> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that 
> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for 
> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED 
> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look 
> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to 
> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent 
> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other

> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and 
> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of

> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the 
> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. 
> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED

> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone 
> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door 
> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should

> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical 
> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J.

> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, 
> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean 
> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how 
> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in 
> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like 
> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes 
> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and 
> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult 
> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: 
> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On

> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> 
> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: 
> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that 
> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need

> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of 
> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc. 
> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading, 
> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just 
> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for 
> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity 
> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the 
> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of 
> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing 
> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. 
> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those

> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that 
> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED"

> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay 
> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; 
> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments.

> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED 
> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> 
> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy 
> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of 
> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a 
> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, 
> http:// <http:///> >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.
education 
> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive 
> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED 
> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not 
> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to 
> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.

> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe 
> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be 
> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds 
> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists 
> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for 
> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> 
> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie 
> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the

> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can 
> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement, 
> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>> 
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - 
> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please 
> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>> 
> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List 
> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> 
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
> Moderator>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: 
> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what

> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi 
> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,

> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the 
> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement, 
> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? 
> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at: 
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> 
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion 
> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
> Moderator>>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> 
> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> 
> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or 
> change your subscription settings, please go to>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National 
> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> settings, please go to>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National

> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> settings, please go to>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National 
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> 
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to 
> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National 
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> 
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to 
> macsimoin at hotmail.com
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. 
> Stop by today.
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> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
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>

------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400
From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <0570AB67-85EE-4F24-AF0B-2E657CB60778 at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
        format=flowed

....and the Web address for MLoTS is:

http://www.mlots.org <http://www.mlots.org/> 

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:

> Colleagues,
>
> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms
> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
>
> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy
> tutoring)
> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
> ? OTAN  (integrating technology)
>    and
> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
> learners can and cannot do with literacy)
>
> I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or
> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am
> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
> adult literacy education classroom videos.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400
From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1015]  GED preparation and creativity
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed

Hello Andrea,

On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:

> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading 
> and 2. creativity?

Here's more on defining creativity.  To begin  with, it's quite 
unlikely that we will agree on a definition.  There are more than 60 
of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988),  and as far 
as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for 
creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be 
taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that 
some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that 
it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the 
kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would 
agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might 
differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in 
different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and 
in the creative problem solving of daily living.

In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was 
thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as 
innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe 
Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically 
valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic 
success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education 
systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.

Are adult literacy education students  (including basic education, 
secondary education and ESOL) capable of  this kind of creativity? If 
so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should.  In 
many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even 
acknowledged in program goals or objectives.  And I have never seen 
it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value 
and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we 
are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should 
value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to 
nourish creativity.

What do you think about this?

* Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of 
creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.:  The nature of creativity: 
Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400
From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <001f01c81958$da000530$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
        reply-type=original

Mary Lynn,

Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief.  I am not
suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for just
"passing the test"  we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our
job.
Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of  a high
school  student and be ready to transition to college level academics is
in
the learners' best interest in respect to time and money.   Community
College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they
do. If
the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter
community
college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, but
it is
not.   Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic and
secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of  Adult Literacy.

Donna Chambers

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mary Lynn Simons" <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM
Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them
accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically
decide
what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able
to
pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or
training as fast as possible.

----------------------------------------> From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
To:
assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:
[Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, I
agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if>
students
are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with>
minimal
ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh
options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges>
require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we>
know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to
develop.>>
Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>
rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. Humanities>
courses demand students to understand and even implement creative
forms,>
figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to truly>
understand history, they must be able to visualize different time
periods.>
Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which>
graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list
goes>
on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students
in a
GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at
all.
If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing,
if
the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of
more>
formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take
that>
home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might
not>
get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue>
higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to
teach>
them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from
Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past
lives.
The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college classroom
as
well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to
this
extent, depending on the> teacher and the class).
http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in
extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend
college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between
public
schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to
succeed.
Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected
in
every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online
Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O.
Box
389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax
703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>
Behalf
Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The
Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED
Discussion -
what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we
mean
by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a
means
to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more
students
have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is
creativity
itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically
prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit in?>>
I
would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>
skills
and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these
catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>
education
(e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to
have
academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong
critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic
skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is
the
assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary
education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if
so
how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is
measuring>
creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention
to
one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of
the
U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on
high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only
traditional>
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills>
like
the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different>
perspectives,
the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability
to
represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor
or
other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand
and
follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of
thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>>
Are
these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> they
be?
Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school
diploma as
a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and
self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful
post-secondary
learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring:
academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I invite
your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct
26,
2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to
creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our
students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be
successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals. However,
just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high
stakes
spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers
teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education &
Transitions
Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>>
Sent:
Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion
List>>
Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on
standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been
successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally
gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>>
rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I
don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may
be
the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more
disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure
to
the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of
your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing
then
someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My
students
participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get
into
it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste
of
time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally
frustrated>>
when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like."
Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that
have
to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>>
Shirley
Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net
wrote:>>>>
Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a
presention>>
recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
<http:///> >>
www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> and
he
includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic
standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators
believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on
skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>>
"distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators
or
policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high
stakes
tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key
question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I
invite
the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it
essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>
djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original
message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi
everyone,>>>>>>
We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted
to>>>
give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>
discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>
suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday -
there
were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please
post
your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>
Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:
"Marie
Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need
to
know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>
We?ve
had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to give
a
quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion.
For
the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources
go
to:>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>
>>>>>
If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>> can
catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>
assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also
your
own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
Moderator>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------->>
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings,
please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings,
please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------->>
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings,
please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->
National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>
Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings,
please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->
National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>
Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings,
please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com

_________________________________________________________________
Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. Stop
by
today.
http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_O
ctWLtagline
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From mtate at sbctc.edu  Mon Oct 29 12:26:38 2007
From: mtate at sbctc.edu (Michael Tate)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 09:26:38 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 1021] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
In-Reply-To: <D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B103F@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
References: <mailman.1.1193500801.21772.assessment@nifl.gov>
	<D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B103F@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
Message-ID: <0CA6C79FCB4AC642A77B76C17A4316EE0210A7E4@exch-1.sbctc2.local>

In all the studies I've read, when business leaders are asked what kind
of intelligence they want in a worker, they say they want intuitive
thinking .  They are looking for people who can quickly size up a
situation from incomplete data, make a decision, and implement a
strategy that works.  They're not looking for the painfully slow (and
hugely expensive) deliberative process that government  uses.  Adult
education is generally unable to offer training in creative thinking
because it doesn't have teachers who can teach creativity.  That's not
likely to change until adult education is provided by a sector that
values creativity higher than consensus.

 

Michael Tate

 

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Carver, Mary-Lynn
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 1:23 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: RE: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31

 

Donna Chambers -

Well said. I am in total agreement.

 

Where do we start?

 

Thanks,

Mary Lynn Carver

ABE/GED Instructor

College of Lake County

Building 4, Office 405

19351 W. Washington Street

Grayslake, IL  60031

Phone:847/543-2677

mlcarver at clcillinois.edu

Fax: 847/543-7580

 

"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be constantly
amused" -- Unknown

 

We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping
abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how to
learn. --Peter F. Drucker 

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of
assessment-request at nifl.gov
Sent: Sat 10/27/2007 11:00 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31

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Today's Topics:

   1. [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Donna Chambers)
   2. [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
      (Katherine G)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400
From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
        reply-type=original

David and All,

Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.  Critical thinking
is a
learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can be
nurtured,
but not necessarily learned..  In Adult Education creativity is not a
necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount.

I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment programs
such
as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma Program.
This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know and be
able to
do and this information has changed over the years.  Most states'
education
systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education seems
to be
GED driven.  As such, is limited to just what is necessary to pass the
GED.
The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and assessment is
apparent, at least to me.

In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list of
competencies that need to be learned.  Merely passing a standardized
test
does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically. Yet, from
the
perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and policy
makers,
passing the test has become paramount  in Adult Education. Outcomes has
been
translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the GED is
"good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass the GED,
all
will be well.   Not necessarily so!

Adult Education needs complete reform.  Let's look at what the
metacognative
research tells us and design a system around what essential knowledge
and
skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading skills into
all
activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a
performance
based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to know
and be
able to do today.  Passing the GED will still be an attainable measure,
but
only one of many that need to be achieved.  Instructors and students
must
know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and thinking
skills will lead to passing the test.  A strong foundation will, more
importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high school
certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed in our
complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from the
beginning
upon entering AE programs.  Learners must be given the opportunity to
understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the path to
skill
building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their goals.
Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the outcomes
will
be more meaningful.

Donna  Chambers

----- Original Message -----
From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Assessment colleagues,

Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
shot.

Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
both?  And where do critical skills fit in?

I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
solving.

Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
now adult secondary education programs?

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
creative skills.

If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
often describe as "thinking outside the box").

Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
and creativity.

I invite your comments on this.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:

> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> test.
>
> Toni Borge
>
> BHCC
> Adult Education & Transitions Program
>
> Boston, MA
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> more creativity!
>
> Shirley Ledet
>
> GED Instructor
>
> NHC-Carver
>
> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
>
> Colleagues,
>
> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> academic standards AND creativity.
>
> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>
> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "Marie Cora"
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to
> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > suggested resources go to:
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> 07creativityGED.html
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> you can
> > catch up in the archives at:
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> now!
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
>
>
>
> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> guests, and suggested resources go to:
>
>
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>
>
>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> assessment/2007/date.html
>
>
>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

-------------------------------
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Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400
From: "Katherine G" <Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="Windows-1252"

David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially
if
students are planning to go on to college!  Students who pass the GED
with
minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and
weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.  Most
colleges
require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum."  As we
know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to
develop.

Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using
rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.  Humanities
courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,
figures of speech, figurative language, and more.  For students to truly
understand history, they must be able to visualize different time
periods.
Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which
graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.  The list
goes
on.

Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a
GED
class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all.
If
the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if
the
students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.  In terms of more
formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take
that
home.  Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might
not
get with GED students.  But especially with students who want to pursue
higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to
teach
them to think critically.

Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't
studied in a long time but did in my past lives.  The essay demonstrates
how
creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED students
can
expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the
teacher and the class).  http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm

I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED students
planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have
communications between public schools and college to make this happen if
we
want GED students to succeed.  Part of these discussions should include
creativity used and expected in every academic setting.

Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor
Prince William County Public Schools
Adult Education
P.O. Box 389
Manassas, VA 20108
work 703-791-8387
fax 703-791-8889

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Assessment colleagues,

Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
shot.

Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
both?  And where do critical skills fit in?

I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
solving.

Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
now adult secondary education programs?

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
creative skills.

If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
often describe as "thinking outside the box").

Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
and creativity.

I invite your comments on this.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:

> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> test.
>
> Toni Borge
>
> BHCC
> Adult Education & Transitions Program
>
> Boston, MA
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> more creativity!
>
> Shirley Ledet
>
> GED Instructor
>
> NHC-Carver
>
> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
>
> Colleagues,
>
> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> academic standards AND creativity.
>
> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>
> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
> -------------- Original message ----------------------
> From: "Marie Cora"
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to
> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > suggested resources go to:
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> 07creativityGED.html
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> you can
> > catch up in the archives at:
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> now!
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
>
>
>
> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
>
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> guests, and suggested resources go to:
>
>
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>
>
>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> assessment/2007/date.html
>
>
>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
>
>
>
> Thanks!!
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Marie Cora
>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

-------------------------------
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Assessment mailing list
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To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net

------------------------------

-------------------------------
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End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
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From andreawilder at comcast.net  Mon Oct 29 11:19:48 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
In-Reply-To: <D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B1042@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
References: <mailman.58243.1193577788.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
	<D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B1042@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
Message-ID: <69cbc825214882ee73340c228f35e01a@comcast.net>

Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you two (Mary  
Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what would  
I see???
would there be a real difference?
Thanks.

Andrea
On Oct 29, 2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:

> Wow, I must say I disagree with Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents  
> come in just wanting to pass the test, but have no critical thinking  
> or transitional college skills. If we don't help them understand and  
> acquire some of those skills, they will not be able to succeed with  
> the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think it is one  
> of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they need to  
> succeed in their class and beyond.  I don't feel it is  
> paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.
>
> Thanks,
> Mary Lynn Carver
> ABE/GED Instructor
> College of Lake County
> Building 4, Office 405
> 19351 W. Washington Street
> Grayslake, IL  60031
> Phone:847/543-2677
> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
> Fax: 847/543-7580
>
> "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be  
> constantly amused" -- Unknown
>
> We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping  
> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how  
> to learn. --Peter F. Drucker
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of  
> assessment-request at nifl.gov
> Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
>
>
>
> Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
>         assessment at nifl.gov
>
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>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. [Assessment 1011]  Media Library of Teaching Skills
>       (David J. Rosen)
>    2. [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Mary Lynn Simons)
>    3. [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Andrea Wilder)
>    4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
>       (David J. Rosen)
>    5. [Assessment 1015]  GED preparation and creativity (David J.  
> Rosen)
>    6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Donna Chambers)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400
> From: David J. Rosen <djrosen at comcast.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1011]  Media Library of Teaching Skills
> To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List <technology at nifl.gov>,
>         The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List
>         <professionaldevelopment at nifl.gov>,     The Assessment  
> Discussion List
>         <assessment at nifl.gov>,  The Adult English Language Learners  
> Discussion
>         List    <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9 at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
>         format=flowed
>
> Colleagues,
>
> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms
> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
>
> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy
> tutoring)
> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
> ? OTAN  (integrating technology)
>    and
> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
> learners can and cannot do with literacy)
>
> I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or
> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am
> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
> adult literacy education classroom videos.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000
> From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
>
>
> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them  
> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically  
> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to  
> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to  
> college or training as fast as possible.
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------> From:  
> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct  
> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion -  
> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential  
> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to  
> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely  
> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are  
> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require  
> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,  
> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>  
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>  
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.  
> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement  
> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For  
> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to vi
>  sualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into  
> statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations  
> are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in  
> another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are  
> not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the  
> instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if  
> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of  
> more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need  
> to take that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline  
> that we might not> get with GED students. But especially with students  
> who want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to  
> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just  
> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a  
> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>  
> creativity is used in the co
>  llege classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in college  
> (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher and the  
> class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm  
> believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> planning  
> to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> communications  
> between public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED  
> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>  
> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine  
> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County  
> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>  
> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->  
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov  
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>  
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion  
> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need
>   to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by  
> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a  
> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will  
> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test  
> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want  
> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And  
> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,  
> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would  
> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and  
> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should  
> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that  
> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking  
> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and  
> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the  
> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
>> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills,  
>> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical  
>> thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in  
>> adult literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc  
>> Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest  
>> economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree  
>> with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high>  
>> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only  
>> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important  
>> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and  
>> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a  
>> range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image,  
>> a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language,  
>> or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead  
>> to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin
>  king (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>>  
> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should>  
> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high>  
> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable>  
> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to>  
> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be>  
> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking>  
> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen>  
> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F  
> wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching  
> critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how to think  
> in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving  
> their>> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12  
> education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning  
> wheel of>> accountability which stifle
>  s creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>  
> BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>  
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->>  
> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October  
> 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:  
> [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>>  
> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>>  
> test. We need look no further then those who have been successful>> on  
> any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just  
> smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy  
> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know,  
> I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the  
> reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more  
> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure  
> to the arts, banking industry, faculty
>  ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to  
> offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only  
> exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate  
> in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend  
> to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of  
> time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally  
> frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they  
> would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>  
> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>>  
> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>>  
> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a  
> proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed in all  
> education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for  
> Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to the  
> National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///>
>>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->>  
>>> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without  
>>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers  
>>> and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass the  
>>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the  
>>> test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many  
>>> K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe  
>>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be  
>>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the  
>>> minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the  
>>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it  
>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>  
>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message  
>>> ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>  
>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>  
>>> wanted to>>> give a qu
>  ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion.  
> For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested  
> resources go to:>>>>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>  
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday -  
> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please  
> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>  
> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List  
> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>  
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List  
> Moderator>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:  
> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what  
> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi  
> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,  
> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you
>  can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full  
> announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go  
> to:>>>>>>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?  
> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:  
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>  
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share  
> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion  
> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>  
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List  
> Moderator>>>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>  
> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>  
> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or  
> change your subscription settings, please go to>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to  
> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------
>  ------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>  
> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or  
> change your subscription settings, please go to>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to  
> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National  
> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>  
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription  
> settings, please go to>>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to  
> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National  
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>  
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to  
> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National  
> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>  
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings
>  , please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email  
> delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.  
> Stop by today.
> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html? 
> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400
> From: Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <9e32f2dbe2ba96b51be97f5819a91d2c at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
>         format=flowed
>
> Hi Mary Lynn--
>
> One of my mantras for students, no matter  the age, has been:  "Don't
> waste their time."  Is this what you are getting at?
>
> Andrea
>
> On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:
>
>>
>> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them
>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically
>> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to
>> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to
>> college or training as fast as possible.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------> From:
>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct
>> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion -
>> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential
>> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to
>> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely
>> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are
>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require
>> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,
>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>
>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>
>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.
>> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement
>> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For
>> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize
>> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics
>> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to
>> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another
>> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not
>> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor
>> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students
>> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>
>> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take
>> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we
>> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who
>> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to
>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just
>> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a
>> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>
>> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED
>> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent,
>> depending on the> teacher and the class).
>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in
>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend
>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between
>> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED
>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>
>> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine
>> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County
>> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>
>> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->
>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
>> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>
>> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion
>> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
>> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by
>> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a
>> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will
>> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test
>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want
>> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And
>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,
>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would
>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and
>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should
>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that
>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking
>> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and
>> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the
>> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary
>> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
>> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and
>> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education
>> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not
>> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the
>> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that
>> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for
>> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED
>> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look
>> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to
>> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent
>> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other
>> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and
>> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of
>> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the
>> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have.
>> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED
>> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone
>> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door
>> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should
>> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical
>> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J.
>> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,
>> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean
>> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how
>> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in
>> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like
>> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes
>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and
>> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult
>> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:
>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On
>> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>
>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:
>> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that
>> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need
>> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of
>> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc.
>> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading,
>> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just
>> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for
>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity
>> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the
>> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of
>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing
>> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.
>> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those
>> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that
>> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED"
>> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay
>> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention;
>> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments.
>> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED
>> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>
>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of
>> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a
>> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
>> http:// <http:///> >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.  
>> education
>> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive
>> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED
>> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not
>> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to
>> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.
>> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe
>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be
>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds
>> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists
>> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for
>> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>
>> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie
>> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the
>> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can
>> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement,
>> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday -
>> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please
>> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>
>> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>
>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
>> Moderator>>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:
>> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what
>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi
>> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,
>> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the
>> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement,
>> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?
>> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:
>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>
>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion
>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
>> Moderator>>>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>
>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or
>> change your subscription settings, please go to>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National
>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
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>> settings, please go to>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National
>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
>> settings, please go to>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
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>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>
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>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National
>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to
>> macsimoin at hotmail.com
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.
>> Stop by today.
>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?
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>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400
> From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <0570AB67-85EE-4F24-AF0B-2E657CB60778 at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
>         format=flowed
>
> ....and the Web address for MLoTS is:
>
> http://www.mlots.org <http://www.mlots.org/>
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
> On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:
>
>> Colleagues,
>>
>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
>> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms
>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
>>
>> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy
>> tutoring)
>> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
>> ? OTAN  (integrating technology)
>>    and
>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)
>>
>> I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or
>> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am
>> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
>> adult literacy education classroom videos.
>>
>> David J. Rosen
>> djrosen at comcast.net
>>
>>
>>
>> -------------------------------
>> National Institute for Literacy
>> Assessment mailing list
>> Assessment at nifl.gov
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400
> From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1015]  GED preparation and creativity
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
>
> Hello Andrea,
>
> On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:
>
>> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading
>> and 2. creativity?
>
> Here's more on defining creativity.  To begin  with, it's quite
> unlikely that we will agree on a definition.  There are more than 60
> of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988),  and as far
> as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for
> creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be
> taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that
> some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that
> it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the
> kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would
> agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might
> differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in
> different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and
> in the creative problem solving of daily living.
>
> In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was
> thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as
> innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe
> Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically
> valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic
> success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education
> systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.
>
> Are adult literacy education students  (including basic education,
> secondary education and ESOL) capable of  this kind of creativity? If
> so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should.  In
> many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even
> acknowledged in program goals or objectives.  And I have never seen
> it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value
> and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we
> are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should
> value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to
> nourish creativity.
>
> What do you think about this?
>
>
> * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of
> creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.:  The nature of creativity:
> Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400
> From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <001f01c81958$da000530$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
>         reply-type=original
>
> Mary Lynn,
>
> Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief.  I am not
> suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for  
> just
> "passing the test"  we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our  
> job.
> Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of  a  
> high
> school  student and be ready to transition to college level academics  
> is in
> the learners' best interest in respect to time and money.   Community
> College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they  
> do. If
> the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter  
> community
> college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, but  
> it is
> not.   Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic  
> and
> secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of  Adult Literacy.
>
> Donna Chambers
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mary Lynn Simons" <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM
> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them
> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically  
> decide
> what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able  
> to
> pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or
> training as fast as possible.
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------> From:  
> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:
> assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:
> [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David,  
> I
> agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if>  
> students
> are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with>  
> minimal
> ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh
> options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges>
> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As  
> we>
> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to  
> develop.>>
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.  
> Humanities>
> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative  
> forms,>
> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to  
> truly>
> understand history, they must be able to visualize different time  
> periods.>
> Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which>
> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list  
> goes>
> on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students  
> in a
> GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at  
> all.
> If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are  
> writing, if
> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of  
> more>
> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take  
> that>
> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might  
> not>
> get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue>
> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to  
> teach>
> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay  
> from
> Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past  
> lives.
> The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college  
> classroom as
> well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not  
> to this
> extent, depending on the> teacher and the class).
> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in
> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend
> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between  
> public
> schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to  
> succeed.
> Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected  
> in
> every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online
> Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education>  
> P.O. Box
> 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax
> 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:
> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>  
> Behalf
> Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The
> Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED  
> Discussion -
> what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we  
> mean
> by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a  
> means
> to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more  
> students
> have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is  
> creativity
> itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically
> prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit  
> in?>> I
> would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>  
> skills
> and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these
> catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>  
> education
> (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to  
> have
> academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong
> critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong  
> academic
> skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is  
> the
> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary
> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and  
> if so
> how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is  
> measuring>
> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying  
> attention to
> one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of  
> the
> U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus  
> on
> high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only  
> traditional>
> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills>  
> like
> the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different>  
> perspectives,
> the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability  
> to
> represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a  
> metaphor or
> other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand  
> and
> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of
> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the  
> box").>> Are
> these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should>  
> they be?
> Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school  
> diploma as
> a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and
> self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful  
> post-secondary
> learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring:
> academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I  
> invite
> your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On  
> Oct 26,
> 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to
> creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once  
> our
> students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be
> successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals.  
> However,
> just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high  
> stakes
> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and  
> teachers
> teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education &  
> Transitions
> Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>>  
> Sent:
> Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion  
> List>>
> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
> know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on
> standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been
> successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally
> gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>>
> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>>  
> "I
> don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may  
> be
> the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more
> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure  
> to
> the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part  
> of
> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing  
> then
> someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My  
> students
> participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get  
> into
> it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste  
> of
> time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally  
> frustrated>>
> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like."
> Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that  
> have
> to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>>  
> Shirley
> Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net  
> wrote:>>>>
> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of  
> the
> National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a  
> presention>>
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://  
> <http:///> >>
> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->>  
> and he
> includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic
> standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators
> believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus  
> on
> skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>>
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators  
> or
> policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high  
> stakes
> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key
> question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I  
> invite
> the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it
> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>
> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original
> message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi  
> everyone,>>>>>>
> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted  
> to>>>
> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>
> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>
> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday -  
> there
> were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please  
> post
> your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>
> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>  
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>
> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:  
> "Marie
> Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you  
> need to
> know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>  
> We?ve
> had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to  
> give a
> quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion.  
> For
> the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested  
> resources go
> to:>>>>>>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>>  
> can
> catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>
> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also  
> your
> own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> Moderator>>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>  
> ------------------------------->>
> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription  
> settings,
> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>
> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription  
> settings,
> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
> delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>  
> ------------------------------->>
> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription  
> settings,
> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
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> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>
> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription  
> settings,
> please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
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> settings,
> please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
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>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.  
> Stop by
> today.
> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html? 
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> End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
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From msledet at yahoo.com  Mon Oct 29 13:51:32 2007
From: msledet at yahoo.com (shirley ledet)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 10:51:32 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 1023] Re: GED preparation and creativity
In-Reply-To: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFLDMAA.Kgotthardt@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <822641.35829.qm@web90412.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Critical thinking is apply knowledge with speculation.  "I think that because the author refers to the drenched grass and the beautiful rainbow" it must have rained." For GED success is can be thought of as a logical conclusion to a given set of information. These skills can be transferred to all 5 subjects. In science if a bird uses it beak to peck at it food, the picture of the one with the pointiest beak should selected. Using the concept of money and food to do and understand word problems.  Teaching critical thinking helps our students understand that they know more then they think they know.  This in turn inspires them to stay, dream and want to succeed. Finally a place that believes in the their ability to learn and not expect that they already know and should just study harder. 
  Shirley-NHC-Carver
  Houston, Texas 

Katherine G <Kgotthardt at comcast.net> wrote:
  
I don't think we can distinguish creativity from critical thinking. They
overlap and feed one another. The more you ask students to be creative, the
more critical thinking they practice. After all, how can one begin to do
something like write a poem or story, create a picture, sing a song, make
meaning of what they see and hear without critical thinking? Likewise,
unless we express our critical thinking, what good is it? Rote memorization
yields neither critical thinking nor creativity.

Creativity, to me, means expressing our thoughts in meaningful ways,
expressing our ideas in ways that others might not expect but that a variety
of people with different learning styles and perspectives can appreciate,
melding those ideas so they come out in a form we design. But this kind of
thinking takes time and a willingness to consider ideas. Rigid, controlling
individuals rarely appreciate creativity. Anyone care to help me qualify
that statement? : )

Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
Behalf Of David J. Rosen
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 11:18 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity

Hello Andrea,

On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:

> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading
> and 2. creativity?

Here's more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite
unlikely that we will agree on a definition. There are more than 60
of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far
as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for
creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be
taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that
some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that
it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the
kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would
agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might
differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in
different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and
in the creative problem solving of daily living.

In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was
thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as
innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe
Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically
valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic
success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education
systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.

Are adult literacy education students (including basic education,
secondary education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If
so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In
many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even
acknowledged in program goals or objectives. And I have never seen
it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value
and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we
are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should
value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to
nourish creativity.

What do you think about this?

* Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of
creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:
Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

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From msledet at yahoo.com  Mon Oct 29 14:15:38 2007
From: msledet at yahoo.com (shirley ledet)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:15:38 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 1024] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <ad2cc1ef0710261423n49c5f99o20946f7fadfc1a70@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <146640.56583.qm@web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I agree, however by the time I students get to us they need a reason to read. Discussion brings an interest and desire to read. When very young children are given that desire because of the way it is introduced.  the desire build, the cognitive recognition of reading, thoughts, imagination and pleasure are place in the lexicon and "walaa" you have a reader. When this is not done, the students sees reading as a means to end and therefore drudgery. Telling a students to read whose mantra has become "I hate reading" " I was never good at reading" "I always fail reading" is pointless.  We must awaken the desire and the learning will come. With joy.....most of the time. 
  Shirley 

Wendy Quinones <teacherwendyq at gmail.com> wrote:
  Actually, all of the GED tests are reading -- even math for the most part.  I think Mary Lynn is right on!

  On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com> wrote:   
Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot and if students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a skill.  The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The reason people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do not play the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I say, "Shut up and read." 

________________________________> Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 15:39:46 -0400> From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu> To: assessment at nifl.gov > Subject: [Assessment 1002] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education, adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the test.> Toni Borge> BHCC> Adult Education & Transitions Program> Boston, MA> ________________________________> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> I agree that creativity is not the
 enemy of success on standardized test. We need look no further then those who have been successful on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted, just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like "I don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity between socio economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated when "all of their hard work does not pay off
 like they would like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on more creativity!> Shirley Ledet> GED Instructor> NHC-Carver> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:> Colleagues,> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high academic standards AND creativity.> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high
 stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> -------------- Original message ----------------------> From: "Marie Cora">> Hi everyone,>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to>> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>> suggested resources go to:>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can>> catch up in the archives at:>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!>>>> Thanks!!>>>> Marie Cora>> Assessment Discussion List
 Moderator>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >>>>> From: "Marie Cora"> To:> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000> Hi everyone,> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go to:> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you can catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!> Thanks!!> Marie Cora> Assessment Discussion List Moderator> Marie Cora> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>
 http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment > -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com

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From macsimoin at hotmail.com  Mon Oct 29 15:27:40 2007
From: macsimoin at hotmail.com (Mary Lynn Simons)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 19:27:40 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 1025] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
In-Reply-To: <69cbc825214882ee73340c228f35e01a@comcast.net>
References: <mailman.58243.1193577788.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
	<D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B1042@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU> 
	<69cbc825214882ee73340c228f35e01a@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BAY115-W127277FC88A9B618688CEDBF910@phx.gbl>

I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills; critical thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against teachers wasting student time with too much talking, both by students and by themselves, and calling it "creativity". In order to be able to pass the tests, students must grapple with the five subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively discussions, though interesting, can keep students from doing what they need to do to be able to pass. Adult education students have busy lives and have little time to get their GED. I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.> From: andreawilder at comcast.net> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33> > Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you two (Mary > Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what would > I see???> would there be a real difference?> Thanks.> > Andrea> On Oct 29, 2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:> > > Wow, I must say I disagree with Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents > > come in just wanting to pass the test, but have no critical thinking > > or transitional college skills. If we don't help them understand and > > acquire some of those skills, they will not be able to succeed with > > the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think it is one > > of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they need to > > succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is > > paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.> >> > Thanks,> > Mary Lynn Carver> > ABE/GED Instructor> > College of Lake County> > Building 4, Office 405> > 19351 W. Washington Street> > Grayslake, IL 60031> > Phone:847/543-2677> > mlcarver at clcillinois.edu> > Fax: 847/543-7580> >> > "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be > > constantly amused" -- Unknown> >> > We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping > > abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how > > to learn. --Peter F. Drucker> >> > ________________________________> >> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of > > assessment-request at nifl.gov> > Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM> > To: assessment at nifl.gov> > Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33> >> >> >> > Send Assessment mailing list submissions to> > assessment at nifl.gov> >> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to> > assessment-request at nifl.gov> >> > You can reach the person managing the list at> > assessment-owner at nifl.gov> >> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific> > than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."> >> >> > Today's Topics:> >> > 1. [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills> > (David J. Rosen)> > 2. [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> > (Mary Lynn Simons)> > 3. [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> > (Andrea Wilder)> > 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills> > (David J. Rosen)> > 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity (David J. > > Rosen)> > 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> > (Donna Chambers)> >> >> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------> >> > Message: 1> > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400> > From: David J. Rosen <djrosen at comcast.net>> > Subject: [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills> > To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List <technology at nifl.gov>,> > The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List> > <professionaldevelopment at nifl.gov>, The Assessment > > Discussion List> > <assessment at nifl.gov>, The Adult English Language Learners > > Discussion> > List <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>> > Message-ID: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9 at comcast.net>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;> > format=flowed> >> > Colleagues,> >> > The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-> > based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms> > and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy> > videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:> >> > ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy> > tutoring)> > ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),> > ? OTAN (integrating technology)> > and> > ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL> > learners can and cannot do with literacy)> >> > I hope you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or> > tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am> > hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for> > adult literacy education classroom videos.> >> > David J. Rosen> > djrosen at comcast.net> >> >> >> >> >> > ------------------------------> >> > Message: 2> > Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000> > From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>> > Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>> > Message-ID: <BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900 at phx.gbl>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"> >> >> > Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them > > accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically > > decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to > > be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to > > college or training as fast as possible.> >> >> >> > ----------------------------------------> From: > > Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct > > 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - > > what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential > > in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to > > college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely > > think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are > > usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require > > program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know, > > writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>> > > Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using> > > rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. > > Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement > > creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For > > students to truly> understand history, they must be able to vi> > sualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into > > statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations > > are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in > > another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are > > not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the > > instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if > > the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of > > more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need > > to take that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline > > that we might not> get with GED students. But especially with students > > who want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to > > have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just > > now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a > > long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how> > > creativity is used in the co> > llege classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in college > > (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher and the > > class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm > > believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> planning > > to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> communications > > between public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED > > students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include> > > creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine > > Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County > > Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108> > > work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> > > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov > > [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen> > > Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion > > List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need> > to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by > > creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a > > means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will > > more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test > > scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want > > students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And > > where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, > > that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would > > put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and > > as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should > > provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that > > are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking > > skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and > > the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the > > assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> >> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, > >> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical > >> thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in > >> adult literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc > >> Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest > >> economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree > >> with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high> > >> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only > >> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important > >> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and > >> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a > >> range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, > >> a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, > >> or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead > >> to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin> > king (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>> > > Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> > > they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> > > school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> > > employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> > > successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be> > > teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking> > > and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> > > djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F > > wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching > > critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how to think > > in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving > > their>> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 > > education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning > > wheel of>> accountability which stifle> > s creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> > > BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> > > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> > > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October > > 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: > > [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> > > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> > > test. We need look no further then those who have been successful>> on > > any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just > > smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy > > reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, > > I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the > > reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more > > disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure > > to the arts, banking industry, faculty> > ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to > > offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only > > exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate > > in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend > > to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of > > time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally > > frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they > > would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> > > activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> > > more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> > > NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a > > proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed in all > > education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for > > Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to the > > National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///>> >>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> > >>> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without > >>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers > >>> and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass the > >>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the > >>> test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many > >>> K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe > >>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be > >>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the > >>> minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the > >>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it > >>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> > >>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message > >>> ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> > >>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> > >>> wanted to>>> give a qu> > ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion. > > For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested > > resources go to:>>>>>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>> > > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - > > there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please > > post your questions and also your own experiences to share>> > > now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List > > Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List > > Moderator>>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: > > "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what > > you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi > > everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, > > and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you> > can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full > > announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go > > to:>>>>>>>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ > > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? > > there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at: > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share > > now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion > > List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List > > Moderator>>>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> > > ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> > > Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or > > change your subscription settings, please go to>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to > > djrosen at comcast.net>> ------> > ------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> > > Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or > > change your subscription settings, please go to>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to > > msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National > > Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> > > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription > > settings, please go to>> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to > > djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National > > Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> > > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to > > kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National > > Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> > > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings> > , please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email > > delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com> >> > _________________________________________________________________> > Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. > > Stop by today.> > http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html? > > ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline> >> > ------------------------------> >> > Message: 3> > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400> > From: Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net>> > Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>> > Message-ID: <9e32f2dbe2ba96b51be97f5819a91d2c at comcast.net>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;> > format=flowed> >> > Hi Mary Lynn--> >> > One of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been: "Don't> > waste their time." Is this what you are getting at?> >> > Andrea> >> > On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:> >> >>> >> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them> >> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically> >> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to> >> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to> >> college or training as fast as possible.> >>> >>> >>> >> ----------------------------------------> From:> >> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct> >> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion -> >> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential> >> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to> >> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely> >> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are> >> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require> >> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,> >> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>> >> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>> >> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.> >> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement> >> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For> >> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize> >> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics> >> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to> >> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another> >> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not> >> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor> >> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students> >> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>> >> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take> >> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we> >> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who> >> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to> >> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just> >> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a> >> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>> >> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED> >> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent,> >> depending on the> teacher and the class).> >> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in> >> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend> >> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between> >> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED> >> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>> >> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine> >> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County> >> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>> >> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->> >> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov> >> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>> >> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion> >> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to> >> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by> >> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a> >> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will> >> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test> >> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want> >> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And> >> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,> >> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would> >> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and> >> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should> >> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that> >> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking> >> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and> >> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the> >> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary> >> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through> >> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and> >> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education> >> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not> >> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the> >> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that> >> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for> >> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED> >> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look> >> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to> >> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent> >> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other> >> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and> >> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of> >> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the> >> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have.> >> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED> >> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone> >> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door> >> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should> >> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical> >> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J.> >> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,> >> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean> >> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how> >> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in> >> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like> >> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes> >> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and> >> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult> >> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:> >> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On> >> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>> >> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:> >> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that> >> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need> >> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of> >> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc.> >> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading,> >> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just> >> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for> >> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity> >> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the> >> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of> >> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing> >> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.> >> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those> >> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that> >> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED"> >> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay> >> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention;> >> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments.> >> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED> >> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>> >> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy> >> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of> >> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a> >> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,> >> http:// <http:///> >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. > >> education> >> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive> >> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED> >> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not> >> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to> >> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.> >> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe> >> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be> >> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds> >> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists> >> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for> >> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>> >> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie> >> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the> >> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can> >> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement,> >> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> >> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday -> >> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please> >> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>> >> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List> >> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> >> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List> >> Moderator>>>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:> >> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what> >> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi> >> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,> >> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the> >> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement,> >> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/> >> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?> >> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:> >> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>> >> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share> >> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion> >> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>> >> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List> >> Moderator>>>>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>> >> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>> >> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or> >> change your subscription settings, please go to>>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to> >> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National> >> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>> >> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription> >> settings, please go to>>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to> >> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National> >> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>> >> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription> >> settings, please go to>>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to> >> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National> >> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to> >> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National> >> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to> >> macsimoin at hotmail.com> >>> >> _________________________________________________________________> >> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.> >> Stop by today.> >> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?> >> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline> >> -------------------------------> >> National Institute for Literacy> >> Assessment mailing list> >> Assessment at nifl.gov> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> >> Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net> >>> >> >> >> > ------------------------------> >> > Message: 4> > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400> > From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>> > Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills> > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>> > Message-ID: <0570AB67-85EE-4F24-AF0B-2E657CB60778 at comcast.net>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;> > format=flowed> >> > ....and the Web address for MLoTS is:> >> > http://www.mlots.org <http://www.mlots.org/>> >> > David J. Rosen> > djrosen at comcast.net> >> >> > On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:> >> >> Colleagues,> >>> >> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-> >> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms> >> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy> >> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:> >>> >> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy> >> tutoring)> >> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),> >> ? OTAN (integrating technology)> >> and> >> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL> >> learners can and cannot do with literacy)> >>> >> I hope you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or> >> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am> >> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for> >> adult literacy education classroom videos.> >>> >> David J. Rosen> >> djrosen at comcast.net> >>> >>> >>> >> -------------------------------> >> National Institute for Literacy> >> Assessment mailing list> >> Assessment at nifl.gov> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> >> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > ------------------------------> >> > Message: 5> > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400> > From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>> > Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity> > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>> > Message-ID: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C at comcast.net>> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed> >> > Hello Andrea,> >> > On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:> >> >> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading> >> and 2. creativity?> >> > Here's more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite> > unlikely that we will agree on a definition. There are more than 60> > of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far> > as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for> > creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be> > taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that> > some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that> > it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the> > kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would> > agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might> > differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in> > different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and> > in the creative problem solving of daily living.> >> > In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was> > thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as> > innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe> > Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically> > valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic> > success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education> > systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.> >> > Are adult literacy education students (including basic education,> > secondary education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If> > so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In> > many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even> > acknowledged in program goals or objectives. And I have never seen> > it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value> > and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we> > are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should> > value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to> > nourish creativity.> >> > What do you think about this?> >> >> > * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of> > creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:> > Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.> >> > David J. Rosen> > djrosen at comcast.net> >> >> >> >> > ------------------------------> >> > Message: 6> > Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400> > From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>> > Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> > To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>> > Message-ID: <001f01c81958$da000530$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";> > reply-type=original> >> > Mary Lynn,> >> > Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief. I am not> > suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for > > just> > "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our > > job.> > Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of a > > high> > school student and be ready to transition to college level academics > > is in> > the learners' best interest in respect to time and money. Community> > College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they > > do. If> > the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter > > community> > college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, but > > it is> > not. Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic > > and> > secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of Adult Literacy.> >> > Donna Chambers> >> >> > ----- Original Message -----> > From: "Mary Lynn Simons" <macsimoin at hotmail.com>> > To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>> > Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM> > Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!> >> >> >> > Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them> > accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically > > decide> > what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able > > to> > pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or> > training as fast as possible.> >> >> >> > ----------------------------------------> From: > > Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:> > assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:> > [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, > > I> > agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if> > > students> > are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with> > > minimal> > ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh> > options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges>> > require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As > > we>> > know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to > > develop.>>> > Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>> > rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. > > Humanities>> > courses demand students to understand and even implement creative > > forms,>> > figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to > > truly>> > understand history, they must be able to visualize different time > > periods.>> > Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which>> > graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list > > goes>> > on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students > > in a> > GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at > > all.> > If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are > > writing, if> > the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of > > more>> > formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take > > that>> > home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might > > not>> > get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue>> > higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to > > teach>> > them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay > > from> > Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past > > lives.> > The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college > > classroom as> > well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not > > to this> > extent, depending on the> teacher and the class).> > http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in> > extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend> > college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between > > public> > schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to > > succeed.> > Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected > > in> > every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online> > Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education> > > P.O. Box> > 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax> > 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:> > assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> > > Behalf> > Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The> > Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED > > Discussion -> > what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we > > mean> > by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a > > means> > to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more > > students> > have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is > > creativity> > itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically> > prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit > > in?>> I> > would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic> > > skills> > and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these> > catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary> > > education> > (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to > > have> > academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong> > critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong > > academic> > skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is > > the> > assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary> > education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through> > standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and > > if so> > how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is > > measuring>> > creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying > > attention to> > one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of > > the> > U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus > > on> > high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only > > traditional>> > basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills> > > like> > the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different> > > perspectives,> > the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability > > to> > represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a > > metaphor or> > other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand > > and> > follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of> > thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the > > box").>> Are> > these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> > > they be?> > Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school > > diploma as> > a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and> > self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful > > post-secondary> > learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring:> > academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I > > invite> > your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On > > Oct 26,> > 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to> > creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once > > our> > students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be> > successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals. > > However,> > just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high > > stakes> > spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and > > teachers> > teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & > > Transitions> > Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov> > [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> > > Sent:> > Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion > > List>>> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to> > know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on> > standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been> > successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally> > gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>>> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> > > "I> > don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may > > be> > the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more> > disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure > > to> > the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part > > of> > your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing > > then> > someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My > > students> > participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get > > into> > it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste > > of> > time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally > > frustrated>>> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like."> > Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that > > have> > to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> > > Shirley> > Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net > > wrote:>>>>> > Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy> > education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of > > the> > National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a > > presention>>> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// > > <http:///> >>> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> > > and he> > includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic> > standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators> > believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus > > on> > skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>>> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators > > or> > policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high > > stakes> > tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key> > question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I > > invite> > the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it> > essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> > djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original> > message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi > > everyone,>>>>>>> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted > > to>>>> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>> > suggested resources go to:>>>>>>> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - > > there> > were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please > > post> > your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>> > Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List> > Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: > > "Marie> > Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you > > need to> > know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>> > > We?ve> > had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to > > give a> > quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion. > > For> > the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested > > resources go> > to:>>>>>>>>> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ > > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>> > > can> > catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>> > assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also > > your> > own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List> > Moderator>>>>> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> > > ------------------------------->>> > National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>> > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription > > settings,> > please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email> > delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>> > National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>> > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription > > settings,> > please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email> > delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> > > ------------------------------->>> > National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>> > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription > > settings,> > please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email> > delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->> > National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>> > Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription > > settings,> > please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email> > delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> > National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>> > Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription > > settings,> > please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email> > delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com> >> > _________________________________________________________________> > Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. > > Stop by> > today.> > http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html? > > ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline> > -------------------------------> > National Institute for Literacy> > Assessment mailing list> > Assessment at nifl.gov> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> > Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net> >> >> >> > ------------------------------> >> > -------------------------------> > National Institute for Literacy> > Assessment mailing list> > Assessment at nifl.gov> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> >> >> > End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33> > ******************************************> >> >> > <winmail.dat>-------------------------------> > National Institute for Literacy> > Assessment mailing list> > Assessment at nifl.gov> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> > Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net> > -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com
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From andreawilder at comcast.net  Mon Oct 29 14:01:24 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 14:01:24 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1026] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
In-Reply-To: <0CA6C79FCB4AC642A77B76C17A4316EE0210A7E4@exch-1.sbctc2.local>
References: <mailman.1.1193500801.21772.assessment@nifl.gov>
	<D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B103F@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
	<0CA6C79FCB4AC642A77B76C17A4316EE0210A7E4@exch-1.sbctc2.local>
Message-ID: <b3c57374c20814826d7597b5bd6f4ba9@comcast.net>

What to say.  This confirms  my feeling that "education" in the sense 
of "creativity" and "critical skills" is left off the plate when it 
comes to the GED.  In my view, most of the time, it is the teachers who 
guard these particular portals.  Ideally, "problem solving" should be 
built in--this can require new ways of thinking and collaboration 
between students.

Andrea
On Oct 29, 2007, at 12:26 PM, Michael Tate wrote:

> In all the studies I?ve read, when business leaders are asked what 
> kind of intelligence they want in a worker, they say they want 
> intuitive thinking .? They are looking for people who can quickly size 
> up a situation from incomplete data, make a decision, and implement a 
> strategy that works.? They?re not looking for the painfully slow (and 
> hugely expensive) deliberative process that government ?uses.? Adult 
> education is generally unable to offer training in creative thinking 
> because it doesn?t have teachers who can teach creativity.? That?s not 
> likely to change until adult education is provided by a sector that 
> values creativity higher than consensus.
> ?
> Michael Tate
> ?
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> On Behalf Of Carver, Mary-Lynn
> Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 1:23 PM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: RE: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
> ?
> Donna Chambers -
> Well said. I am in total agreement.
> ?
> Where do we start?
> ?
> Thanks,
> Mary Lynn Carver
> ABE/GED Instructor
> College of Lake County
> Building 4, Office 405
> 19351 W. Washington Street
> Grayslake, IL? 60031
> Phone:847/543-2677
> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
> Fax: 847/543-7580
> ?
> "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be 
> constantly amused" -- Unknown
> ?
> We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping 
> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how 
> to learn. --Peter F. Drucker
> ?
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of 
> assessment-request at nifl.gov
> Sent: Sat 10/27/2007 11:00 AM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
>
> Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
>  ??????? assessment at nifl.gov
>
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>  When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
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>  Today's Topics:
>
>  ?? 1. [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>  ????? (Donna Chambers)
>  ?? 2. [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>  ????? (Katherine G)
>
>
>  ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>  Message: 1
>  Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400
>  From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
>  Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>  To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
>  Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
>  Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
>  ??????? reply-type=original
>
>  David and All,
>
>  Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.? Critical 
> thinking is a
>  learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can be 
> nurtured,
>  but not necessarily learned..? In Adult Education creativity is not a
>  necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount.
>
>  I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment 
> programs such
>  as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma 
> Program.
>  This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know and be 
> able to
>  do and this information has changed over the years.? Most states' 
> education
>  systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education 
> seems to be
>  GED driven.? As such, is limited to just what is necessary to pass 
> the GED.
>  The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and assessment 
> is
>  apparent, at least to me.
>
>  In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list of
>  competencies that need to be learned.? Merely passing a standardized 
> test
>  does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically. Yet, 
> from the
>  perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and policy 
> makers,
>  passing the test has become paramount? in Adult Education. Outcomes 
> has been
>  translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the GED 
> is
>  "good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass the 
> GED, all
>  will be well.?? Not necessarily so!
>
>  Adult Education needs complete reform.? Let's look at what the 
> metacognative
>  research tells us and design a system around what essential knowledge 
> and
>  skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading skills 
> into all
>  activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a 
> performance
>  based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to know 
> and be
>  able to do today.? Passing the GED will still be an attainable 
> measure, but
>  only one of many that need to be achieved.? Instructors and students 
> must
>  know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and thinking
>  skills will lead to passing the test.? A strong foundation will, more
>  importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high school
>  certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed in 
> our
>  complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from the 
> beginning
>  upon entering AE programs.? Learners must be given the opportunity to
>  understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the path 
> to skill
>  building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their goals.
>  Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the outcomes 
> will
>  be more meaningful.
>
>  Donna? Chambers
>
>
>
>
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
>  To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
>  Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM
>  Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>  Assessment colleagues,
>
>  Toni asked what we mean by creativity.? Good question. I'll give it a
>  shot.
>
>  Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
>  approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
>  better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
>  want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
>  both?? And where do critical skills fit in?
>
>  I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
>  skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
>  these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
>  education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
>  opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
>  in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
>  from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
>  solving.
>
>  Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
>  now adult secondary education programs?
>
>  ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
>  ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
>  ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
>  creative skills.
>
>  If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
>  greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
>  agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
>  stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
>  basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
>  like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
>  perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
>  solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
>  image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
>  rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
>  disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
>  often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
>  Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
>  they be? Not necessarily.? But for students who see the GED or high
>  school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
>  employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
>  successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
>  teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
>  and creativity.
>
>  I invite your comments on this.
>
>  David J. Rosen
>  djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>  On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
>  > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
>  > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
>  > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
>  > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
>  > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
>  > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
>  > test.
>  >
>  > Toni Borge
>  >
>  > BHCC
>  > Adult Education & Transitions Program
>  >
>  > Boston, MA
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
>  > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
>  > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
>  > To: The Assessment Discussion List
>  > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 
> know!
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
>  > test.? We need look no further then those who have been successful
>  > on any type of test.? We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
>  > just smart, etc.? If you speak to these folks they are well
>  > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
>  > "I don't know, I just know stuff."? Researchers have found that
>  > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
>  > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
>  > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
>  > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
>  > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
>  > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
>  > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
>  > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
>  > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
>  > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
>  > like."? Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
>  > activities that have to be completed in increments.? Let's bring on
>  > more creativity!
>  >
>  > Shirley Ledet
>  >
>  > GED Instructor
>  >
>  > NHC-Carver
>  >
>  > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
>  >
>  > Colleagues,
>  >
>  > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
>  > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
>  > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
>  > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
>  > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
>  > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
>  > academic standards AND creativity.
>  >
>  > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
>  > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
>  > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
>  > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
>  > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
>  > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
>  > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
>  > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>  >
>  > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>  >
>  >
>  > David J. Rosen
>  > djrosen at comcast.net
>  >
>  > -------------- Original message ----------------------
>  > From: "Marie Cora"
>  > > Hi everyone,
>  > >
>  > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
>  > wanted to
>  > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
>  > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
>  > > suggested resources go to:
>  > >
>  > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
>  > 07creativityGED.html
>  > >
>  > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
>  > you can
>  > > catch up in the archives at:
>  > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
>  > >
>  > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
>  > now!
>  > >
>  > > Thanks!!
>  > >
>  > > Marie Cora
>  > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  > >
>  > >
>  > >
>  > >
>  > > Marie Cora
>  > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>  > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  > >
>  > >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
>  > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
>  > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>  > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
>  >
>  > Hi everyone,
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
>  > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
>  > on this discussion.? For the full announcement, information on
>  > guests, and suggested resources go to:
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
>  > can catch up in the archives at:? http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
>  > assessment/2007/date.html
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
> now!
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Thanks!!
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Marie Cora
>  >
>  > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Marie Cora
>  >
>  > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>  >
>  > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  >
>  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > -------------------------------
>  > National Institute for Literacy
>  > Assessment mailing list
>  > Assessment at nifl.gov
>  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
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>  > Assessment mailing list
>  > Assessment at nifl.gov
>  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
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>  > Assessment mailing list
>  > Assessment at nifl.gov
>  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
>  -------------------------------
>  National Institute for Literacy
>  Assessment mailing list
>  Assessment at nifl.gov
>  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
>
>
>
>  ------------------------------
>
>  Message: 2
>  Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400
>  From: "Katherine G" <Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
>  Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>  To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
>  Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
>  Content-Type: text/plain;?????? charset="Windows-1252"
>
>  David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, 
> especially if
>  students are planning to go on to college!? Students who pass the GED 
> with
>  minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, 
> and
>  weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.? Most 
> colleges
>  require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum."? As 
> we
>  know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to 
> develop.
>
>  Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using
>  rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.? 
> Humanities
>  courses demand students to understand and even implement creative 
> forms,
>  figures of speech, figurative language, and more.? For students to 
> truly
>  understand history, they must be able to visualize different time 
> periods.
>  Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which
>  graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.? The 
> list goes
>  on.
>
>  Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a 
> GED
>  class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at 
> all.? If
>  the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, 
> if the
>  students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.? In terms of 
> more
>  formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to 
> take that
>  home.? Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we 
> might not
>  get with GED students.? But especially with students who want to 
> pursue
>  higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to 
> teach
>  them to think critically.
>
>  Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I 
> haven't
>  studied in a long time but did in my past lives.? The essay 
> demonstrates how
>  creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED 
> students can
>  expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the
>  teacher and the class).? http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm
>
>  I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED 
> students
>  planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have
>  communications between public schools and college to make this happen 
> if we
>  want GED students to succeed.? Part of these discussions should 
> include
>  creativity used and expected in every academic setting.
>
>
>  Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor
>  Prince William County Public Schools
>  Adult Education
>  P.O. Box 389
>  Manassas, VA 20108
>  work 703-791-8387
>  fax 703-791-8889
>
>
>
>
>
>  -----Original Message-----
>  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
>  Behalf Of David J. Rosen
>  Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM
>  To: The Assessment Discussion List
>  Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>  Assessment colleagues,
>
>  Toni asked what we mean by creativity.? Good question. I'll give it a
>  shot.
>
>  Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
>  approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
>  better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
>  want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
>  both?? And where do critical skills fit in?
>
>  I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
>  skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
>  these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
>  education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
>  opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
>  in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
>  from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
>  solving.
>
>  Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
>  now adult secondary education programs?
>
>  ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
>  ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
>  ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
>  creative skills.
>
>  If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
>  greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
>  agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
>  stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
>  basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
>  like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
>  perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
>  solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
>  image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
>  rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
>  disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
>  often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
>  Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
>  they be? Not necessarily.? But for students who see the GED or high
>  school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
>  employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
>  successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
>  teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
>  and creativity.
>
>  I invite your comments on this.
>
>  David J. Rosen
>  djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>  On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
>  > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
>  > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
>  > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
>  > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
>  > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
>  > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
>  > test.
>  >
>  > Toni Borge
>  >
>  > BHCC
>  > Adult Education & Transitions Program
>  >
>  > Boston, MA
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
>  > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
>  > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
>  > To: The Assessment Discussion List
>  > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 
> know!
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
>  > test.? We need look no further then those who have been successful
>  > on any type of test.? We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
>  > just smart, etc.? If you speak to these folks they are well
>  > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
>  > "I don't know, I just know stuff."? Researchers have found that
>  > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
>  > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
>  > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
>  > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
>  > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
>  > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
>  > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
>  > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
>  > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
>  > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
>  > like."? Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
>  > activities that have to be completed in increments.? Let's bring on
>  > more creativity!
>  >
>  > Shirley Ledet
>  >
>  > GED Instructor
>  >
>  > NHC-Carver
>  >
>  > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
>  >
>  > Colleagues,
>  >
>  > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
>  > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
>  > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
>  > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
>  > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
>  > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
>  > academic standards AND creativity.
>  >
>  > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
>  > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
>  > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
>  > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
>  > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
>  > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
>  > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
>  > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
>  >
>  > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
>  >
>  >
>  > David J. Rosen
>  > djrosen at comcast.net
>  >
>  > -------------- Original message ----------------------
>  > From: "Marie Cora"
>  > > Hi everyone,
>  > >
>  > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
>  > wanted to
>  > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
>  > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
>  > > suggested resources go to:
>  > >
>  > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
>  > 07creativityGED.html
>  > >
>  > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
>  > you can
>  > > catch up in the archives at:
>  > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
>  > >
>  > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
>  > now!
>  > >
>  > > Thanks!!
>  > >
>  > > Marie Cora
>  > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  > >
>  > >
>  > >
>  > >
>  > > Marie Cora
>  > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>  > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  > >
>  > >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
>  > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
>  > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>  > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
>  >
>  > Hi everyone,
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
>  > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
>  > on this discussion.? For the full announcement, information on
>  > guests, and suggested resources go to:
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
>  > can catch up in the archives at:? http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
>  > assessment/2007/date.html
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
> now!
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Thanks!!
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Marie Cora
>  >
>  > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Marie Cora
>  >
>  > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
>  >
>  > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
>  >
>  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > -------------------------------
>  > National Institute for Literacy
>  > Assessment mailing list
>  > Assessment at nifl.gov
>  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>  > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>  > -------------------------------
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>  > Assessment mailing list
>  > Assessment at nifl.gov
>  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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>  > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
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>  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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>
>
>
>
>
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>
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>
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>
>  End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
>  ******************************************
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From drizikbaer at gmail.com  Mon Oct 29 16:44:13 2007
From: drizikbaer at gmail.com (Daniel Rizik-Baer)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 13:44:13 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 1027] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 40
In-Reply-To: <mailman.58957.1193687727.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
References: <mailman.58957.1193687727.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <1c1b65fe0710291344y539824a5w8ee3ba1c8361880b@mail.gmail.com>

Being new to the forum I have been a little hesitant to reply. Here goes:

As educators, what is the definition of education? What is the purpose of
education? I think this gets to the core of the argument when discussing
creativity vs. critical thinking vs. rote memorization. None of these
methods of thinking and learning take place within a vacuum and all overlap.
However, depending on the purpose of any particular educational exercise,
these methods can be ignored or highlighted.

With GED classes, there is an end goal, and that is to, obviously, pass the
GED. But what is the purpose of passing the GED? To escape poverty? Maybe
with a GED they may be able to find a better job. But how much better? I it
almost laughable in today's society, especially with no clear definition of
poverty and the Government's failure to properly calculate the poverty line,
that a person with a GED still will only make a small amount over the
poverty line.

As educators I feel that we have a responsibility to go beyond standards
based assessment and to create real learning and thinking individuals. In my
view, to help someone to learn is not strictly to help them learn what they
need to pass, but in the end to help them learn to learn. This is why
creativity, critical thinking and rote memorization are all necessary
qualities of a well-rounded education. As teachers and educators our job is
not simply to teach a curriculum, but to learn, to help people become more
intelligent in multiple ways, gaining the skills they need to contribute to
society in more ways than economics. This is not
maternalistic/paternalistic, this is HUMAN and the definition of
culture/society. We are responsible, in some ways, for their lives outside
of the classroom, for that is why we teach. We do not teach for the pleasure
of them doing well strictly in the few hours we see them, but to help them
apply what they learn to life. Only through this can we hope to build a
world of educated people who have the ability and power to think, and be
respected for their ideas. It is the lack of education that is one of the
most effective methods to keeping a population subservient. A limited
education taught to a specific test is not that much better.

Am I saying I do not believe in testing? No! I am saying that education is
holistic. One cannot think critically without having memorized certain
concepts. One cannot express themselves creatively without learning about
life in a multitude of different areas. As soon as we implement programs
that are actually intended to give people the power of learning, instead of
the most basic skills necessary for an employer to underpay them we will
continually be struggling with the consequences of the absence of such
programs.

Daniel Rizik-Baer

On 10/29/07, assessment-request at nifl.gov <assessment-request at nifl.gov>
wrote:
>
> Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
>         assessment at nifl.gov
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>         http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>         assessment-request at nifl.gov
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>         assessment-owner at nifl.gov
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. [Assessment 1026] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
>       (Andrea Wilder)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 14:01:24 -0400
> From: Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1026] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
> To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <b3c57374c20814826d7597b5bd6f4ba9 at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>
> What to say.  This confirms  my feeling that "education" in the sense
> of "creativity" and "critical skills" is left off the plate when it
> comes to the GED.  In my view, most of the time, it is the teachers who
> guard these particular portals.  Ideally, "problem solving" should be
> built in--this can require new ways of thinking and collaboration
> between students.
>
> Andrea
> On Oct 29, 2007, at 12:26 PM, Michael Tate wrote:
>
> > In all the studies I?ve read, when business leaders are asked what
> > kind of intelligence they want in a worker, they say they want
> > intuitive thinking .? They are looking for people who can quickly size
> > up a situation from incomplete data, make a decision, and implement a
> > strategy that works.? They?re not looking for the painfully slow (and
> > hugely expensive) deliberative process that government ?uses.? Adult
> > education is generally unable to offer training in creative thinking
> > because it doesn?t have teachers who can teach creativity.? That?s not
> > likely to change until adult education is provided by a sector that
> > values creativity higher than consensus.
> > ?
> > Michael Tate
> > ?
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
> > On Behalf Of Carver, Mary-Lynn
> > Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 1:23 PM
> > To: assessment at nifl.gov
> > Subject: RE: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
> > ?
> > Donna Chambers -
> > Well said. I am in total agreement.
> > ?
> > Where do we start?
> > ?
> > Thanks,
> > Mary Lynn Carver
> > ABE/GED Instructor
> > College of Lake County
> > Building 4, Office 405
> > 19351 W. Washington Street
> > Grayslake, IL? 60031
> > Phone:847/543-2677
> > mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
> > Fax: 847/543-7580
> > ?
> > "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be
> > constantly amused" -- Unknown
> > ?
> > We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping
> > abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how
> > to learn. --Peter F. Drucker
> > ?
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of
> > assessment-request at nifl.gov
> > Sent: Sat 10/27/2007 11:00 AM
> > To: assessment at nifl.gov
> > Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
> >
> > Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
> >  ??????? assessment at nifl.gov
> >
> >  To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >  ??????? http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >  ??????? assessment-request at nifl.gov
> >
> >  You can reach the person managing the list at
> >  ??????? assessment-owner at nifl.gov
> >
> >  When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> >  than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."
> >
> >
> >  Today's Topics:
> >
> >  ?? 1. [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >  ????? (Donna Chambers)
> >  ?? 2. [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >  ????? (Katherine G)
> >
> >
> >  ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >  Message: 1
> >  Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400
> >  From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
> >  Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >  To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> >  Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
> >  Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
> >  ??????? reply-type=original
> >
> >  David and All,
> >
> >  Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.? Critical
> > thinking is a
> >  learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can be
> > nurtured,
> >  but not necessarily learned..? In Adult Education creativity is not a
> >  necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount.
> >
> >  I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment
> > programs such
> >  as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma
> > Program.
> >  This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know and be
> > able to
> >  do and this information has changed over the years.? Most states'
> > education
> >  systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education
> > seems to be
> >  GED driven.? As such, is limited to just what is necessary to pass
> > the GED.
> >  The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and assessment
> > is
> >  apparent, at least to me.
> >
> >  In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list of
> >  competencies that need to be learned.? Merely passing a standardized
> > test
> >  does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically. Yet,
> > from the
> >  perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and policy
> > makers,
> >  passing the test has become paramount? in Adult Education. Outcomes
> > has been
> >  translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the GED
> > is
> >  "good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass the
> > GED, all
> >  will be well.?? Not necessarily so!
> >
> >  Adult Education needs complete reform.? Let's look at what the
> > metacognative
> >  research tells us and design a system around what essential knowledge
> > and
> >  skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading skills
> > into all
> >  activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a
> > performance
> >  based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to know
> > and be
> >  able to do today.? Passing the GED will still be an attainable
> > measure, but
> >  only one of many that need to be achieved.? Instructors and students
> > must
> >  know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and thinking
> >  skills will lead to passing the test.? A strong foundation will, more
> >  importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high school
> >  certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed in
> > our
> >  complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from the
> > beginning
> >  upon entering AE programs.? Learners must be given the opportunity to
> >  understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the path
> > to skill
> >  building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their goals.
> >  Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the outcomes
> > will
> >  be more meaningful.
> >
> >  Donna? Chambers
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  ----- Original Message -----
> >  From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> >  To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> >  Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM
> >  Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >
> >
> >  Assessment colleagues,
> >
> >  Toni asked what we mean by creativity.? Good question. I'll give it a
> >  shot.
> >
> >  Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> >  approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> >  better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> >  want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> >  both?? And where do critical skills fit in?
> >
> >  I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> >  skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> >  these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> >  education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> >  opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> >  in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> >  from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> >  solving.
> >
> >  Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> >  now adult secondary education programs?
> >
> >  ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> >  ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> >  ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> >  creative skills.
> >
> >  If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> >  greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> >  agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> >  stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> >  basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> >  like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> >  perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> >  solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> >  image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> >  rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> >  disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> >  often describe as "thinking outside the box").
> >
> >  Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> >  they be? Not necessarily.? But for students who see the GED or high
> >  school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> >  employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> >  successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> >  teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> >  and creativity.
> >
> >  I invite your comments on this.
> >
> >  David J. Rosen
> >  djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> >
> >
> >  On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
> >
> >  > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> >  > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> >  > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> >  > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> >  > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> >  > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> >  > test.
> >  >
> >  > Toni Borge
> >  >
> >  > BHCC
> >  > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >  >
> >  > Boston, MA
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> >  > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> >  > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> >  > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> >  > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
> > know!
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> >  > test.? We need look no further then those who have been successful
> >  > on any type of test.? We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> >  > just smart, etc.? If you speak to these folks they are well
> >  > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> >  > "I don't know, I just know stuff."? Researchers have found that
> >  > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> >  > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> >  > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> >  > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> >  > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> >  > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> >  > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> >  > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> >  > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> >  > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> >  > like."? Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> >  > activities that have to be completed in increments.? Let's bring on
> >  > more creativity!
> >  >
> >  > Shirley Ledet
> >  >
> >  > GED Instructor
> >  >
> >  > NHC-Carver
> >  >
> >  > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >  >
> >  > Colleagues,
> >  >
> >  > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> >  > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> >  > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> >  > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> >  > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
> >  > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> >  > academic standards AND creativity.
> >  >
> >  > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> >  > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> >  > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> >  > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> >  > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> >  > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> >  > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> >  > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >  >
> >  > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > David J. Rosen
> >  > djrosen at comcast.net
> >  >
> >  > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> >  > From: "Marie Cora"
> >  > > Hi everyone,
> >  > >
> >  > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> >  > wanted to
> >  > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> >  > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> >  > > suggested resources go to:
> >  > >
> >  > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> >  > 07creativityGED.html
> >  > >
> >  > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> >  > you can
> >  > > catch up in the archives at:
> >  > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >  > >
> >  > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> >  > now!
> >  > >
> >  > > Thanks!!
> >  > >
> >  > > Marie Cora
> >  > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >  > >
> >  > >
> >  > >
> >  > >
> >  > > Marie Cora
> >  > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >  > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >  > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  > >
> >  > >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> >  > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> >  > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >  > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >  >
> >  > Hi everyone,
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> >  > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> >  > on this discussion.? For the full announcement, information on
> >  > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> >  > can catch up in the archives at:? http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> >  > assessment/2007/date.html
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > Thanks!!
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > Marie Cora
> >  >
> >  > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > Marie Cora
> >  >
> >  > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >  >
> >  > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >  >
> >  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > -------------------------------
> >  > National Institute for Literacy
> >  > Assessment mailing list
> >  > Assessment at nifl.gov
> >  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> >  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> >  > -------------------------------
> >  > National Institute for Literacy
> >  > Assessment mailing list
> >  > Assessment at nifl.gov
> >  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> >  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > -------------------------------
> >  > National Institute for Literacy
> >  > Assessment mailing list
> >  > Assessment at nifl.gov
> >  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> >  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  -------------------------------
> >  National Institute for Literacy
> >  Assessment mailing list
> >  Assessment at nifl.gov
> >  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
> >
> >
> >
> >  ------------------------------
> >
> >  Message: 2
> >  Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400
> >  From: "Katherine G" <Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> >  Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >  To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> >  Message-ID: <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> >  Content-Type: text/plain;?????? charset="Windows-1252"
> >
> >  David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs,
> > especially if
> >  students are planning to go on to college!? Students who pass the GED
> > with
> >  minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas,
> > and
> >  weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.? Most
> > colleges
> >  require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum."? As
> > we
> >  know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to
> > develop.
> >
> >  Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using
> >  rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.?
> > Humanities
> >  courses demand students to understand and even implement creative
> > forms,
> >  figures of speech, figurative language, and more.? For students to
> > truly
> >  understand history, they must be able to visualize different time
> > periods.
> >  Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which
> >  graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.? The
> > list goes
> >  on.
> >
> >  Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a
> > GED
> >  class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at
> > all.? If
> >  the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing,
> > if the
> >  students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.? In terms of
> > more
> >  formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to
> > take that
> >  home.? Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we
> > might not
> >  get with GED students.? But especially with students who want to
> > pursue
> >  higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to
> > teach
> >  them to think critically.
> >
> >  Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I
> > haven't
> >  studied in a long time but did in my past lives.? The essay
> > demonstrates how
> >  creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED
> > students can
> >  expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the
> >  teacher and the class).? http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm
> >
> >  I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED
> > students
> >  planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have
> >  communications between public schools and college to make this happen
> > if we
> >  want GED students to succeed.? Part of these discussions should
> > include
> >  creativity used and expected in every academic setting.
> >
> >
> >  Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor
> >  Prince William County Public Schools
> >  Adult Education
> >  P.O. Box 389
> >  Manassas, VA 20108
> >  work 703-791-8387
> >  fax 703-791-8889
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  -----Original Message-----
> >  From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> > [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
> >  Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> >  Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM
> >  To: The Assessment Discussion List
> >  Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >
> >
> >  Assessment colleagues,
> >
> >  Toni asked what we mean by creativity.? Good question. I'll give it a
> >  shot.
> >
> >  Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> >  approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> >  better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> >  want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> >  both?? And where do critical skills fit in?
> >
> >  I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> >  skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> >  these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> >  education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> >  opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> >  in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> >  from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> >  solving.
> >
> >  Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> >  now adult secondary education programs?
> >
> >  ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> >  ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> >  ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> >  creative skills.
> >
> >  If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> >  greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> >  agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> >  stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> >  basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> >  like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> >  perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> >  solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> >  image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> >  rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> >  disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> >  often describe as "thinking outside the box").
> >
> >  Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> >  they be? Not necessarily.? But for students who see the GED or high
> >  school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> >  employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> >  successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> >  teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> >  and creativity.
> >
> >  I invite your comments on this.
> >
> >  David J. Rosen
> >  djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> >
> >
> >  On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
> >
> >  > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> >  > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> >  > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> >  > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> >  > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> >  > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> >  > test.
> >  >
> >  > Toni Borge
> >  >
> >  > BHCC
> >  > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >  >
> >  > Boston, MA
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> >  > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> >  > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> >  > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> >  > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
> > know!
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> >  > test.? We need look no further then those who have been successful
> >  > on any type of test.? We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> >  > just smart, etc.? If you speak to these folks they are well
> >  > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> >  > "I don't know, I just know stuff."? Researchers have found that
> >  > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> >  > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> >  > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> >  > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> >  > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> >  > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> >  > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> >  > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> >  > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> >  > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> >  > like."? Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> >  > activities that have to be completed in increments.? Let's bring on
> >  > more creativity!
> >  >
> >  > Shirley Ledet
> >  >
> >  > GED Instructor
> >  >
> >  > NHC-Carver
> >  >
> >  > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >  >
> >  > Colleagues,
> >  >
> >  > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> >  > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> >  > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> >  > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> >  > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system --
> >  > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> >  > academic standards AND creativity.
> >  >
> >  > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> >  > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> >  > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> >  > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> >  > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> >  > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> >  > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> >  > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >  >
> >  > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > David J. Rosen
> >  > djrosen at comcast.net
> >  >
> >  > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> >  > From: "Marie Cora"
> >  > > Hi everyone,
> >  > >
> >  > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> >  > wanted to
> >  > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> >  > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> >  > > suggested resources go to:
> >  > >
> >  > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> >  > 07creativityGED.html
> >  > >
> >  > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> >  > you can
> >  > > catch up in the archives at:
> >  > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> >  > >
> >  > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> >  > now!
> >  > >
> >  > > Thanks!!
> >  > >
> >  > > Marie Cora
> >  > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >  > >
> >  > >
> >  > >
> >  > >
> >  > > Marie Cora
> >  > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >  > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >  > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  > >
> >  > >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> >  > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> >  > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >  > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >  >
> >  > Hi everyone,
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> >  > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> >  > on this discussion.? For the full announcement, information on
> >  > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> >  > can catch up in the archives at:? http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> >  > assessment/2007/date.html
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > Thanks!!
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > Marie Cora
> >  >
> >  > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > Marie Cora
> >  >
> >  > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >  >
> >  > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >  >
> >  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > -------------------------------
> >  > National Institute for Literacy
> >  > Assessment mailing list
> >  > Assessment at nifl.gov
> >  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> >  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> >  > -------------------------------
> >  > National Institute for Literacy
> >  > Assessment mailing list
> >  > Assessment at nifl.gov
> >  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> >  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  >
> >  > -------------------------------
> >  > National Institute for Literacy
> >  > Assessment mailing list
> >  > Assessment at nifl.gov
> >  > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> >  > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  -------------------------------
> >  National Institute for Literacy
> >  Assessment mailing list
> >  Assessment at nifl.gov
> >  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >  Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net
> >
> >
> >
> >  ------------------------------
> >
> >  -------------------------------
> >  National Institute for Literacy
> >  Assessment mailing list
> >  Assessment at nifl.gov
> >  To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
> >  End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
> >  ******************************************
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net
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> ------------------------------
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
> End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 40
> ******************************************
>

-- 
Daniel Rizik-Baer
Family Literacy Coordinator
Children Youth and Family Collaborative
(818) 442-4407 cell
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From jschneider at eicc.edu  Mon Oct 29 16:10:50 2007
From: jschneider at eicc.edu (Schneider, Jim)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 15:10:50 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1033] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
In-Reply-To: <b3c57374c20814826d7597b5bd6f4ba9@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <208D21E3AC92D449A31336961A46FB870A169C2E@eiccd-exch1.eiccd.net>

Adult Education is capable of providing ANYTHING that it is funded to do
and or asked to do within reason... unfortunately the system has never
been funded nor supported in a manner that would suggest that it was to
do anything more than it is currently doing. 
 
Jim Schneider

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Andrea Wilder
Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 1:01 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1026] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31

What to say. This confirms my feeling that "education" in the sense of
"creativity" and "critical skills" is left off the plate when it comes
to the GED. In my view, most of the time, it is the teachers who guard
these particular portals. Ideally, "problem solving" should be built
in--this can require new ways of thinking and collaboration between
students. 

Andrea 
On Oct 29, 2007, at 12:26 PM, Michael Tate wrote: 

	In all the studies I've read, when business leaders are asked
what kind of intelligence they want in a worker, they say they want
intuitive thinking .  They are looking for people who can quickly size
up a situation from incomplete data, make a decision, and implement a
strategy that works.  They're not looking for the painfully slow (and
hugely expensive) deliberative process that government  uses.  Adult
education is generally unable to offer training in creative thinking
because it doesn't have teachers who can teach creativity.  That's not
likely to change until adult education is provided by a sector that
values creativity higher than consensus.

	 

	Michael Tate

	 

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of Carver, Mary-Lynn 
	Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 1:23 PM 
	To: assessment at nifl.gov 
	Subject: RE: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31 
	
	Donna Chambers - 
	Well said. I am in total agreement. 
	
	Where do we start? 
	
	Thanks, 
	Mary Lynn Carver 
	ABE/GED Instructor 
	College of Lake County 
	Building 4, Office 405 
	19351 W. Washington Street 
	Grayslake, IL  60031 
	Phone:847/543-2677 
	mlcarver at clcillinois.edu 
	Fax: 847/543-7580 
	
	"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be
constantly amused" -- Unknown 
	
	We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of
keeping abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people
how to learn. --Peter F. Drucker 
	

	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of
assessment-request at nifl.gov 
	Sent: Sat 10/27/2007 11:00 AM 
	To: assessment at nifl.gov 
	Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31 

	Send Assessment mailing list submissions to 
	        assessment at nifl.gov 

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	Today's Topics: 

	   1. [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know! 
	      (Donna Chambers) 
	   2. [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know! 
	      (Katherine G) 

	
---------------------------------------------------------------------- 

	Message: 1 
	Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400 
	From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net> 
	Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know! 
	To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov> 
	Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251> 
	Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";

	        reply-type=original 

	David and All, 

	Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.  Critical
thinking is a 
	learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can
be nurtured, 
	but not necessarily learned..  In Adult Education creativity is
not a 
	necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount. 

	I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment
programs such 
	as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma
Program. 
	This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know
and be able to 
	do and this information has changed over the years.  Most
states' education 
	systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education
seems to be 
	GED driven.  As such, is limited to just what is necessary to
pass the GED. 
	The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and
assessment is 
	apparent, at least to me. 

	In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list
of 
	competencies that need to be learned.  Merely passing a
standardized test 
	does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically.
Yet, from the 
	perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and
policy makers, 
	passing the test has become paramount  in Adult Education.
Outcomes has been 
	translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the
GED is 
	"good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass
the GED, all 
	will be well.   Not necessarily so! 

	Adult Education needs complete reform.  Let's look at what the
metacognative 
	research tells us and design a system around what essential
knowledge and 
	skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading
skills into all 
	activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a
performance 
	based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to
know and be 
	able to do today.  Passing the GED will still be an attainable
measure, but 
	only one of many that need to be achieved.  Instructors and
students must 
	know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and
thinking 
	skills will lead to passing the test.  A strong foundation will,
more 
	importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high
school 
	certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed
in our 
	complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from
the beginning 
	upon entering AE programs.  Learners must be given the
opportunity to 
	understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the
path to skill 
	building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their
goals. 
	Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the
outcomes will 
	be more meaningful. 

	Donna  Chambers 

	----- Original Message ----- 
	From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net> 
	To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov> 
	Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM 
	Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know! 

	Assessment colleagues, 

	Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give
it a 
	shot. 

	Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative
teaching 
	approaches will more students have more and higher academic
skills, 
	better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is,
do we 
	want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or 
	both?  And where do critical skills fit in? 

	I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high
academic 
	skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both

	these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult
secondary 
	education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the 
	opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to
succeed 
	in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be
inseparable 
	from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem

	solving. 

	Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we
measuring 
	now adult secondary education programs? 

	? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests 
	? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how? 
	? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is
measuring 
	creative skills. 

	If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of
the 
	greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the
U.S. I 
	agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on
high 
	stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only
traditional 
	basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative
skills 
	like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different

	perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of 
	solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a
moving 
	image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or 
	rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead
to 
	disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we
now 
	often describe as "thinking outside the box"). 

	Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No.
Should 
	they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or
high 
	school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to
stable 
	employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to 
	successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we
should be 
	teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical
thinking 
	and creativity. 

	I invite your comments on this. 

	David J. Rosen 
	djrosen at comcast.net 

	On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote: 

	> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching
critical 
	> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a

	> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving
their 
	> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12
education, 
	> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel
of 
	> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to
the 
	> test. 
	> 
	> Toni Borge 
	> 
	> BHCC 
	> Adult Education & Transitions Program 
	> 
	> Boston, MA 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- 
	> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet 
	> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM 
	> To: The Assessment Discussion List 
	> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need
to know! 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on
standardized 
	> test.  We need look no further then those who have been
successful 
	> on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally
gifted, 
	> just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well 
	> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms
like 
	> "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found
that 
	> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I
believe 
	> there is more disparity between socio economic background then

	> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty, 
	> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to
offer 
	> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only
exposure 
	> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in
a 
	> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it"
tend to 
	> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of
time 
	> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally
frustrated 
	> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would 
	> like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those 
	> activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's
bring on 
	> more creativity! 
	> 
	> Shirley Ledet 
	> 
	> GED Instructor 
	> 
	> NHC-Carver 
	> 
	> djrosen at comcast.net wrote: 
	> 
	> Colleagues, 
	> 
	> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- 
	> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
National 
	> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention

	> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://

	> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system
-- 
	> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without
high 
	> academic standards AND creativity. 
	> 
	> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their 
	> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and

	> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a 
	> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, 
	> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity
distracts 
	> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise
this 
	> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED
teachers 
	> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it. 
	> 
	> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success?
Why? 
	> 
	> 
	> David J. Rosen 
	> djrosen at comcast.net 
	> 
	> -------------- Original message ---------------------- 
	> From: "Marie Cora" 
	> > Hi everyone, 
	> > 
	> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so
I 
	> wanted to 
	> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on
this 
	> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on
guests, and 
	> > suggested resources go to: 
	> > 
	> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
	> 07creativityGED.html 
	> > 
	> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple
- 
	> you can 
	> > catch up in the archives at: 
	> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html 
	> > 
	> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to
share 
	> now! 
	> > 
	> > Thanks!! 
	> > 
	> > Marie Cora 
	> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
	> > 
	> > 
	> > 
	> > 
	> > Marie Cora 
	> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 
	> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
	> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
	> > 
	> > 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
	> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov> 
	> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to
know! 
	> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000 
	> 
	> Hi everyone, 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I 
	> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the
information 
	> on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on

	> guests, and suggested resources go to: 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ?
you 
	> can catch up in the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/ 
	> assessment/2007/date.html 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to
share now! 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> Thanks!! 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> Marie Cora 
	> 
	> Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> Marie Cora 
	> 
	> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 
	> 
	> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
	> 
	> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> ------------------------------- 
	> National Institute for Literacy 
	> Assessment mailing list 
	> Assessment at nifl.gov 
	> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to 
	> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
	> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net 
	> ------------------------------- 
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	> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> ------------------------------- 
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	> Assessment mailing list 
	> Assessment at nifl.gov 
	> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to 
	> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
	> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net 

	------------------------------- 
	National Institute for Literacy 
	Assessment mailing list 
	Assessment at nifl.gov 
	To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go
to 
	http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
	Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net 

	------------------------------ 

	Message: 2 
	Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400 
	From: "Katherine G" <Kgotthardt at comcast.net> 
	Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know! 
	To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov> 
	Message-ID:
<MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt at comcast.net> 
	Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="Windows-1252" 

	David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs,
especially if 
	students are planning to go on to college!  Students who pass
the GED with 
	minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract
ideas, and 
	weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.
Most colleges 
	require program elements such as "writing across the
curriculum."  As we 
	know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to
develop. 

	Even basic college writing classes require understanding and
using 
	rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.
Humanities 
	courses demand students to understand and even implement
creative forms, 
	figures of speech, figurative language, and more.  For students
to truly 
	understand history, they must be able to visualize different
time periods. 
	Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in
which 
	graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.
The list goes 
	on. 

	Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students
in a GED 
	class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at
all.  If 
	the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are
writing, if the 
	students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.  In terms
of more 
	formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need
to take that 
	home.  Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we
might not 
	get with GED students.  But especially with students who want to
pursue 
	higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time
to teach 
	them to think critically. 

	Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I
haven't 
	studied in a long time but did in my past lives.  The essay
demonstrates how 
	creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED
students can 
	expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending
on the 
	teacher and the class).
http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm 

	I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED
students 
	planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have 
	communications between public schools and college to make this
happen if we 
	want GED students to succeed.  Part of these discussions should
include 
	creativity used and expected in every academic setting. 

	Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor 
	Prince William County Public Schools 
	Adult Education 
	P.O. Box 389 
	Manassas, VA 20108 
	work 703-791-8387 
	fax 703-791-8889 

	-----Original Message----- 
	From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On 
	Behalf Of David J. Rosen 
	Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM 
	To: The Assessment Discussion List 
	Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know! 

	Assessment colleagues, 

	Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give
it a 
	shot. 

	Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative
teaching 
	approaches will more students have more and higher academic
skills, 
	better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is,
do we 
	want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or 
	both?  And where do critical skills fit in? 

	I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high
academic 
	skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both

	these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult
secondary 
	education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the 
	opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to
succeed 
	in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be
inseparable 
	from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem

	solving. 

	Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we
measuring 
	now adult secondary education programs? 

	? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests 
	? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how? 
	? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is
measuring 
	creative skills. 

	If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of
the 
	greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the
U.S. I 
	agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on
high 
	stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only
traditional 
	basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative
skills 
	like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different

	perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of 
	solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a
moving 
	image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or 
	rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead
to 
	disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we
now 
	often describe as "thinking outside the box"). 

	Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No.
Should 
	they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or
high 
	school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to
stable 
	employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to 
	successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we
should be 
	teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical
thinking 
	and creativity. 

	I invite your comments on this. 

	David J. Rosen 
	djrosen at comcast.net 

	On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote: 

	> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching
critical 
	> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a

	> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving
their 
	> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12
education, 
	> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel
of 
	> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to
the 
	> test. 
	> 
	> Toni Borge 
	> 
	> BHCC 
	> Adult Education & Transitions Program 
	> 
	> Boston, MA 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- 
	> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet 
	> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM 
	> To: The Assessment Discussion List 
	> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need
to know! 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on
standardized 
	> test.  We need look no further then those who have been
successful 
	> on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally
gifted, 
	> just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well 
	> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms
like 
	> "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found
that 
	> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I
believe 
	> there is more disparity between socio economic background then

	> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty, 
	> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to
offer 
	> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only
exposure 
	> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in
a 
	> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it"
tend to 
	> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of
time 
	> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally
frustrated 
	> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would 
	> like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those 
	> activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's
bring on 
	> more creativity! 
	> 
	> Shirley Ledet 
	> 
	> GED Instructor 
	> 
	> NHC-Carver 
	> 
	> djrosen at comcast.net wrote: 
	> 
	> Colleagues, 
	> 
	> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -- 
	> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
National 
	> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention

	> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://

	> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system
-- 
	> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without
high 
	> academic standards AND creativity. 
	> 
	> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their 
	> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and

	> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a 
	> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, 
	> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity
distracts 
	> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise
this 
	> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED
teachers 
	> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it. 
	> 
	> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success?
Why? 
	> 
	> 
	> David J. Rosen 
	> djrosen at comcast.net 
	> 
	> -------------- Original message ---------------------- 
	> From: "Marie Cora" 
	> > Hi everyone, 
	> > 
	> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so
I 
	> wanted to 
	> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on
this 
	> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on
guests, and 
	> > suggested resources go to: 
	> > 
	> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
	> 07creativityGED.html 
	> > 
	> > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple
- 
	> you can 
	> > catch up in the archives at: 
	> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html 
	> > 
	> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to
share 
	> now! 
	> > 
	> > Thanks!! 
	> > 
	> > Marie Cora 
	> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
	> > 
	> > 
	> > 
	> > 
	> > Marie Cora 
	> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 
	> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
	> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
	> > 
	> > 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> 
	> To: <Assessment at nifl.gov> 
	> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to
know! 
	> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000 
	> 
	> Hi everyone, 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I 
	> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the
information 
	> on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on

	> guests, and suggested resources go to: 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ?
you 
	> can catch up in the archives at:
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/ 
	> assessment/2007/date.html 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to
share now! 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> Thanks!! 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> Marie Cora 
	> 
	> Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> Marie Cora 
	> 
	> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com 
	> 
	> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator 
	> 
	> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> ------------------------------- 
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From gbundy at rmi.net  Mon Oct 29 17:18:00 2007
From: gbundy at rmi.net (Gail B)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 15:18:00 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
Subject: [Assessment 1028] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
Message-ID: <28194025.1193692680843.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

 
There is always a tension in the workplace between executives who want workers who have that intuitive thinking and inexperienced supervisors who want workers who only do as they are told.

I beleive that it is part of my role as a teacher of adults to help students gain the critical thinking skills to prepare students for both scenarios.  In adult education, we have always had an emphasis on using reallife examples and making education relevant.  Our adult students are a rich repository of data / stories that can be used to develop some creative problem-solving skills.

What I do as part of the ABE/ GED instruction is to work with students to develop real-life applications for their math, social studies, science, or reading, based on their actual workplace  experience - or on their desired or fantasy profession (e.g. hip hop song album producer).  And then develop ideas for improving some aspect of that profession. 

For instance, a woman who is a housekeeper at a hospital, examined the physics of how her tools, such as mops and brooms, work. She began recording the productivity directions from her boss, which she than graphed, identified a problem, developed a solution, and wrote a memo to her supervisor, suggesting a solution. A young man who works as a concrete pourer developed a set of word problems for his classmates to solve, based on his work.    

The big hangup for most students is not the lack of creativity -- many  of our students have at least one area where they are very creative -  it is the negative self-talk, sensitivity around criticism and debate, lack of experience in solving problems related to productivity in a group setting  that then combine with the low literacy skills that hinders creativity in the workplace. 

Gail Bundy
Night Instructor
Native American Multi-Cultural Education School
Denver, CO   

From gbundy at rmi.net  Mon Oct 29 17:33:55 2007
From: gbundy at rmi.net (Gail B)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 15:33:55 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
Subject: [Assessment 1029] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
Message-ID: <20243988.1193693636069.JavaMail.root@mswamui-chipeau.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

In our experience, the reading diagnostics from the TABE test are very good indicators of the critical thinking skills that are required for college and career. Those skills  -- e.g finding the main idea, fact vs opinion, sequencing, finding meaning from context, making inferences, making conclusions, cause and effect -- these are all essential skills for critical thinking as well as for reading. Luckily our GED texts in Reading, Science, and Social Studies contain good lessons on these skills.  It doesn't take a lot of time for students to come up with examples in their personal and work life - where these skills would help them be more effective. 

Gail Bundy
Native American Multi-Cultural Education School
Denver, CO

-----Original Message-----
>From: "Carver, Mary-Lynn" <MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
>Sent: Oct 29, 2007 7:13 AM
>To: assessment at nifl.gov
>Subject: [Assessment 1019] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
>
>Wow, I must say I disagree with Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents come in just wanting to pass the test, but have no critical thinking or transitional college skills. If we don't help them understand and acquire some of those skills, they will not be able to succeed with the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think it is one of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they need to succeed in their class and beyond.  I don't feel it is paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.
> 
>Thanks,
>Mary Lynn Carver
>ABE/GED Instructor
>College of Lake County
>Building 4, Office 405
>19351 W. Washington Street
>Grayslake, IL  60031
>Phone:847/543-2677
>mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
>Fax: 847/543-7580
> 
>"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be constantly amused" -- Unknown
> 
>We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how to learn. --Peter F. Drucker 
>
>________________________________
>
>From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of assessment-request at nifl.gov
>Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM
>To: assessment at nifl.gov
>Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
>
>
>
>Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
>        assessment at nifl.gov
>
>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>        http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>        assessment-request at nifl.gov
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>You can reach the person managing the list at
>        assessment-owner at nifl.gov
>
>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."
>
>
>Today's Topics:
>
>   1. [Assessment 1011]  Media Library of Teaching Skills
>      (David J. Rosen)
>   2. [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>      (Mary Lynn Simons)
>   3. [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>      (Andrea Wilder)
>   4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
>      (David J. Rosen)
>   5. [Assessment 1015]  GED preparation and creativity (David J. Rosen)
>   6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>      (Donna Chambers)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400
>From: David J. Rosen <djrosen at comcast.net>
>Subject: [Assessment 1011]  Media Library of Teaching Skills
>To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List <technology at nifl.gov>,
>        The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List
>        <professionaldevelopment at nifl.gov>,     The Assessment Discussion List
>        <assessment at nifl.gov>,  The Adult English Language Learners Discussion
>        List    <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>
>Message-ID: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9 at comcast.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
>        format=flowed
>
>Colleagues,
>
>The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
>based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms 
>and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy 
>videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
>
>? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy 
>tutoring)
>? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
>? OTAN  (integrating technology)
>   and
>? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL 
>learners can and cannot do with literacy)
>
>I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or 
>tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am 
>hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for 
>adult literacy education classroom videos.
>
>David J. Rosen
>djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000
>From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
>Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
>Message-ID: <BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900 at phx.gbl>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
>
>
>Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or training as fast as possible.
>
>
>
>----------------------------------------> From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to truly> understand history, they must be able to vi
> sualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the co
> llege classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher and the class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need
>  to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> > now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin
> king (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifle
> s creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty
> ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///> 
> >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a qu
> ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you
> can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------
> ------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings
> , please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. Stop by today.
>http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 3
>Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400
>From: Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net>
>Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
>Message-ID: <9e32f2dbe2ba96b51be97f5819a91d2c at comcast.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
>        format=flowed
>
>Hi Mary Lynn--
>
>One of my mantras for students, no matter  the age, has been:  "Don't 
>waste their time."  Is this what you are getting at?
>
>Andrea
>
>On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:
>
>>
>> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them 
>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically 
>> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to 
>> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to 
>> college or training as fast as possible.
>>
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------> From: 
>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 
>> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - 
>> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential 
>> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to 
>> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely 
>> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are 
>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require 
>> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know, 
>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>> 
>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using> 
>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. 
>> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement 
>> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For 
>> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize 
>> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics 
>> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to 
>> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another 
>> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not 
>> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor 
>> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students 
>> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more> 
>> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take 
>> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we 
>> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who 
>> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to 
>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just 
>> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a 
>> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how> 
>> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED 
>> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, 
>> depending on the> teacher and the class). 
>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in 
>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend 
>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between 
>> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED 
>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include> 
>> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine 
>> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County 
>> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108> 
>> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> 
>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
>> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen> 
>> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion 
>> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 
>> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by 
>> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a 
>> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will 
>> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test 
>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want 
>> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And 
>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, 
>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would 
>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and 
>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should 
>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that 
>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking 
>> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and 
>> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the 
>> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary 
>> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through 
>> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and 
>> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education 
>> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not 
>> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the 
>> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that 
>> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for 
>> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED 
>> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look 
>> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to 
>> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent 
>> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other 
>> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and 
>> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of 
>> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the 
>> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. 
>> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED 
>> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone 
>> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door 
>> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should 
>> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical 
>> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. 
>> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, 
>> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean 
>> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how 
>> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in 
>> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like 
>> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes 
>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and 
>> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult 
>> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: 
>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On 
>> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> 
>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: 
>> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that 
>> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need 
>> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of 
>> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc. 
>> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading, 
>> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just 
>> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for 
>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity 
>> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the 
>> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of 
>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing 
>> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. 
>> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those 
>> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that 
>> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" 
>> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay 
>> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; 
>> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments. 
>> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED 
>> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> 
>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy 
>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of 
>> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a 
>> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, 
>> http:// <http:///> >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education 
>> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive 
>> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED 
>> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not 
>> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to 
>> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. 
>> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe 
>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be 
>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds 
>> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists 
>> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for 
>> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> 
>> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie 
>> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the 
>> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can 
>> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement, 
>> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>> 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>> 
>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - 
>> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>> 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please 
>> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>> 
>> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List 
>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> 
>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
>> Moderator>>> 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: 
>> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what 
>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi 
>> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, 
>> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the 
>> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement, 
>> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>> 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? 
>> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at: 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> 
>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion 
>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 
>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
>> Moderator>>>> 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> 
>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or 
>> change your subscription settings, please go to>> 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National 
>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
>> settings, please go to>> 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National 
>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
>> settings, please go to>> 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National 
>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> 
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to 
>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National 
>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> 
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to 
>> macsimoin at hotmail.com
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. 
>> Stop by today.
>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?
>> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
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>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 4
>Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400
>From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
>Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
>To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
>Message-ID: <0570AB67-85EE-4F24-AF0B-2E657CB60778 at comcast.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
>        format=flowed
>
>....and the Web address for MLoTS is:
>
>http://www.mlots.org <http://www.mlots.org/> 
>
>David J. Rosen
>djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:
>
>> Colleagues,
>>
>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
>> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms
>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
>>
>> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit  (ESOL and basic literacy
>> tutoring)
>> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
>> ? OTAN  (integrating technology)
>>    and
>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)
>>
>> I hope you will take a look.  If you know of other good classroom or
>> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know.  I am
>> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
>> adult literacy education classroom videos.
>>
>> David J. Rosen
>> djrosen at comcast.net
>>
>>
>>
>> -------------------------------
>> National Institute for Literacy
>> Assessment mailing list
>> Assessment at nifl.gov
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 5
>Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400
>From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
>Subject: [Assessment 1015]  GED preparation and creativity
>To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
>Message-ID: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C at comcast.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
>
>Hello Andrea,
>
>On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:
>
>> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading 
>> and 2. creativity?
>
>Here's more on defining creativity.  To begin  with, it's quite 
>unlikely that we will agree on a definition.  There are more than 60 
>of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988),  and as far 
>as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for 
>creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be 
>taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that 
>some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that 
>it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the 
>kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would 
>agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might 
>differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in 
>different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and 
>in the creative problem solving of daily living.
>
>In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was 
>thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as 
>innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe 
>Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically 
>valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic 
>success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education 
>systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.
>
>Are adult literacy education students  (including basic education, 
>secondary education and ESOL) capable of  this kind of creativity? If 
>so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should.  In 
>many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even 
>acknowledged in program goals or objectives.  And I have never seen 
>it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value 
>and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we 
>are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should 
>value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to 
>nourish creativity.
>
>What do you think about this?
>
>
>* Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of 
>creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.:  The nature of creativity: 
>Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.
>
>David J. Rosen
>djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 6
>Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400
>From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
>Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
>Message-ID: <001f01c81958$da000530$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
>        reply-type=original
>
>Mary Lynn,
>
>Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief.  I am not
>suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for just
>"passing the test"  we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our job.
>Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of  a high
>school  student and be ready to transition to college level academics is in
>the learners' best interest in respect to time and money.   Community
>College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they do. If
>the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter community
>college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, but it is
>not.   Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic and
>secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of  Adult Literacy.
>
>Donna Chambers
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Mary Lynn Simons" <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
>To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
>Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM
>Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
>
>Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them
>accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically decide
>what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able to
>pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or
>training as fast as possible.
>
>
>
>----------------------------------------> From: Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:
>assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:
>[Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, I
>agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if> students
>are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal
>ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh
>options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges>
>require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we>
>know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>
>Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>
>rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. Humanities>
>courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,>
>figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to truly>
>understand history, they must be able to visualize different time periods.>
>Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which>
>graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list goes>
>on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a
>GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all.
>If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if
>the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>
>formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that>
>home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not>
>get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue>
>higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach>
>them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from
>Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past lives.
>The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college classroom as
>well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this
>extent, depending on the> teacher and the class).
>http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in
>extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend
>college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between public
>schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to succeed.
>Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected in
>every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online
>Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box
>389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax
>703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:
>assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf
>Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The
>Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion -
>what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean
>by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a means
>to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more students
>have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is creativity
>itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically
>prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit in?>> I
>would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic> skills
>and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these
>catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary> education
>(e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to have
>academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong
>critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic
>skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the
>assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary
>education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
>standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so
>how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring>
>creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to
>one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the
>U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on
>high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional>
>basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills> like
>the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives,
>the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to
>represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or
>other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and
>follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of
>thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>> Are
>these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> they be?
>Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school diploma as
>a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and
>self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful post-secondary
>learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring:
>academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I invite
>your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26,
>2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to
>creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our
>students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be
>successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals. However,
>just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes
>spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and teachers
>teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions
>Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
>[mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent:
>Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>
>Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
>know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on
>standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been
>successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally
>gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>>
>rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I
>don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be
>the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more
>disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to
>the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of
>your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing then
>someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students
>participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into
>it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of
>time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated>>
>when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like."
>Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that have
>to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley
>Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>
>Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
>education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
>National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>>
>recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///> >>
>www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> and he
>includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic
>standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators
>believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus on
>skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>>
>"distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or
>policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes
>tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key
>question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite
>the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it
>essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>
>djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original
>message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>
>We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to>>>
>give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>
>discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>
>suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
>http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
>07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there
>were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
>http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please post
>your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>
>Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
>Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>
>NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>
>http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Marie
>Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to
>know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve
>had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to give a
>quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion. For
>the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go
>to:>>>>>>>>
>http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>
>If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>> can
>catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>
>assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your
>own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
>Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
>marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
>Moderator>>>>
>http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>
>National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
>Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings,
>please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
>delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>
>National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
>Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings,
>please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
>delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>
>National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
>Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings,
>please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
>delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->
>National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>
>Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings,
>please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
>delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->
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>Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings,
>please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
>delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. Stop by
>today.
>http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
>-------------------------------
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>End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
>******************************************
>
>

From MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDU  Mon Oct 29 21:20:52 2007
From: MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDU (Carver, Mary-Lynn)
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 20:20:52 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1030] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 39
References: <mailman.58955.1193687705.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B104C@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>

  <<On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com> wrote:  
Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot and if students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a skill.  The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The reason people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do not play the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I say, "Shut up and read.">>
 
And here lies my problem with many GED programs. There are a lot of students in GED programs who don't know HOW to read well - as a result of poor schooling or possibly a physiological learning/processing disability. They will not successfully pass the GED if we don't teach them reading strategies, information processing and (the aforementioned) critical thinking skills.  I would never insult an adult student by saying "shut up and read" - it makes the assumption that anyone can do it and if they're in GED in the first place, maybe the reason is because they have a deficit in their reading skills.  When we speak of metacognition, learning styles and strategies for processing materials in class, there is better comprehension, retention and higher scoring on the GED when they take it.  Learning the vocabulary required for each content area is another area that boosts comprehension, so we mix decoding strategies with content area vocabulary.    It takes the same amount of time to frustrate students and reinforce their lifelong humiliation in school as it does to help teach and reinforce the reading and critical thinking skills for success. I choose the latter.
Thanks,
Mary Lynn Carver
ABE/GED Instructor
College of Lake County
Building 4, Office 405
19351 W. Washington Street
Grayslake, IL  60031
Phone:847/543-2677
mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
Fax: 847/543-7580
 
"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be constantly amused" -- Unknown
 
We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how to learn. --Peter F. Drucker 

 
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From jackie.coelho at gmail.com  Tue Oct 30 07:19:12 2007
From: jackie.coelho at gmail.com (Jackie Coelho)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 07:19:12 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1031] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <146640.56583.qm@web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <ad2cc1ef0710261423n49c5f99o20946f7fadfc1a70@mail.gmail.com>
	<146640.56583.qm@web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1dd5701e0710300419h22768734p27ce482309125ca6@mail.gmail.com>

Shirley, I agree that an enjoyment of reading is the first step. I
have been reading small novels with my Pre-GED level students for
three years now. And when we finish one book, they are always quick to
ask what the next will be. They really enjoy spending time discussing
the characters, the issues and relating all to themselves. Last week
we read a text that explains in detail why leaves change color and
then fall off. The next day a student told me she had never looked at
fall foliage the way she does now.
If a student enjoys reading or sees a real purpose to it, he or she
does it more than willingly.
Jackie

On 10/29/07, shirley ledet <msledet at yahoo.com> wrote:
> I agree, however by the time I students get to us they need a reason to
> read. Discussion brings an interest and desire to read. When very young
> children are given that desire because of the way it is introduced.  the
> desire build, the cognitive recognition of reading, thoughts, imagination
> and pleasure are place in the lexicon and "walaa" you have a reader. When
> this is not done, the students sees reading as a means to end and therefore
> drudgery. Telling a students to read whose mantra has become "I hate
> reading" " I was never good at reading" "I always fail reading" is
> pointless.  We must awaken the desire and the learning will come. With
> joy.....most of the time.
> Shirley
>
>
> Wendy Quinones <teacherwendyq at gmail.com> wrote:
> Actually, all of the GED tests are reading -- even math for the most part.
> I think Mary Lynn is right on!
>
> On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot and if
> students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a skill.
> The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The reason
> people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do not play
> the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I say, "Shut
> up and read."
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________> Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007
> 15:39:46 -0400> From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu> To: assessment at nifl.gov >
> Subject: [Assessment 1002] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>
> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical thinking
> skills which once our students know how to think in a critical thinking way
> they will be successful in achieving their education and other life goals.
> However, just like K-12 education, adult education is captured on the high
> stakes spinning wheel of accountability which stifles creativity and
> teachers teach to the test.> Toni Borge> BHCC> Adult Education & Transitions
> Program> Boston, MA> ________________________________>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
> Behalf Of shirley ledet> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM> To: The
> Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion -
> what you need to know!> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success
> on standardized test. We need look no further then those who have been
> successful on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well rounded, enjoy
> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like "I don't know, I just
> know stuff." Researchers have found that this may be the reason for
> disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity between socio
> economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry,
> faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure is to go
> to school and study hard. My students participate in a quite a few creative
> projects and those that "get into it" tend to do better in all subjects.
> Those that feel it is a waste of time and they just want to "study for the
> GED" are generally frustrated when "all of their hard work does not pay off
> like they would like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on more
> creativity!> Shirley Ledet> GED Instructor> NHC-Carver> djrosen at comcast.net
> wrote:> Colleagues,> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
> education -- indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
> National Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
> http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.
> education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive
> without high academic standards AND creativity.> But many GED teachers and
> administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED unless they
> focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators or
> policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high stakes
> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key question
> on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the
> panelists to address it.> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for
> success? Why?> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> -------------- Original
> message ----------------------> From: "Marie Cora">> Hi everyone,>>>> We've
> had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to>> give a
> quick reminder where you can get the information on this>> discussion. For
> the full announcement, information on guests, and>> suggested resources go
> to:>>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can>>
> catch up in the archives at:>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!>>>>
> Thanks!!>>>> Marie Cora>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>
> Marie Cora>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>> NIFL Assessment Discussion
> List Moderator>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >>>>> From:
> "Marie Cora"> To:> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need
> to know!> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000> Hi everyone,> We've had
> several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give a quick
> reminder where you can get the information on this discussion. For the full
> announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go to:>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you can catch
> up in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!>
> Thanks!!> Marie Cora> Assessment Discussion List Moderator> Marie Cora>
> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >
> -------------------------------> National Institute for
> Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or
> change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>
> -------------------------------> National Institute for
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> change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment > Email
> delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> _________________________________________________________________
> > Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. Stop
> by today.
> >
> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
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> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
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>
> -------------------------------
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> Assessment mailing list
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> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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>
>

From jackie.coelho at gmail.com  Tue Oct 30 07:23:20 2007
From: jackie.coelho at gmail.com (Jackie Coelho)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 07:23:20 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1032] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
In-Reply-To: <0CA6C79FCB4AC642A77B76C17A4316EE0210A7E4@exch-1.sbctc2.local>
References: <mailman.1.1193500801.21772.assessment@nifl.gov>
	<D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B103F@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
	<0CA6C79FCB4AC642A77B76C17A4316EE0210A7E4@exch-1.sbctc2.local>
Message-ID: <1dd5701e0710300423o3addd329m81d600f61d112441@mail.gmail.com>

I think this goes back to the "what is creativity" question. Can a
teacher teach creativity? Or can a teacher simply provide a large
enough variety of information and the enthusiasm to seek out more,
thus providing students with the means and motivation to apply the
knowledge in creative ways?

On 10/29/07, Michael Tate <mtate at sbctc.edu> wrote:
>
>
>
> In all the studies I've read, when business leaders are asked what kind of
> intelligence they want in a worker, they say they want intuitive thinking .
> They are looking for people who can quickly size up a situation from
> incomplete data, make a decision, and implement a strategy that works.
> They're not looking for the painfully slow (and hugely expensive)
> deliberative process that government  uses.  Adult education is generally
> unable to offer training in creative thinking because it doesn't have
> teachers who can teach creativity.  That's not likely to change until adult
> education is provided by a sector that values creativity higher than
> consensus.
>
>
>
> Michael Tate
>
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
> Behalf Of Carver, Mary-Lynn
> Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 1:23 PM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: RE: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
>
>
>
>
>
> Donna Chambers -
>
>
> Well said. I am in total agreement.
>
>
>
>
>
> Where do we start?
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Mary Lynn Carver
>
>
> ABE/GED Instructor
>
>
> College of Lake County
>
>
> Building 4, Office 405
>
>
> 19351 W. Washington Street
>
>
> Grayslake, IL  60031
>
>
> Phone:847/543-2677
>
>
> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
>
>
> Fax: 847/543-7580
>
>
>
>
>
> "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be constantly
> amused" -- Unknown
>
>
>
>
>
> We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping
> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how to
> learn. --Peter F. Drucker
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of assessment-request at nifl.gov
> Sent: Sat 10/27/2007 11:00 AM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
>
>
> Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
>         assessment at nifl.gov
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Donna Chambers)
>    2. [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Katherine G)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400
> From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
>         reply-type=original
>
> David and All,
>
> Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.  Critical thinking is a
> learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can be nurtured,
> but not necessarily learned..  In Adult Education creativity is not a
> necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount.
>
> I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment programs such
> as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma Program.
> This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know and be able to
> do and this information has changed over the years.  Most states' education
> systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education seems to be
> GED driven.  As such, is limited to just what is necessary to pass the GED.
> The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and assessment is
> apparent, at least to me.
>
> In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list of
> competencies that need to be learned.  Merely passing a standardized test
> does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically. Yet, from the
> perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and policy makers,
> passing the test has become paramount  in Adult Education. Outcomes has been
> translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the GED is
> "good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass the GED, all
> will be well.   Not necessarily so!
>
> Adult Education needs complete reform.  Let's look at what the metacognative
> research tells us and design a system around what essential knowledge and
> skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading skills into all
> activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a performance
> based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to know and be
> able to do today.  Passing the GED will still be an attainable measure, but
> only one of many that need to be achieved.  Instructors and students must
> know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and thinking
> skills will lead to passing the test.  A strong foundation will, more
> importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high school
> certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed in our
> complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from the beginning
> upon entering AE programs.  Learners must be given the opportunity to
> understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the path to skill
> building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their goals.
> Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the outcomes will
> be more meaningful.
>
> Donna  Chambers
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM
> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
> Assessment colleagues,
>
> Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
> shot.
>
> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> both?  And where do critical skills fit in?
>
> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> solving.
>
> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> now adult secondary education programs?
>
> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> creative skills.
>
> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> and creativity.
>
> I invite your comments on this.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
> > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> > test.
> >
> > Toni Borge
> >
> > BHCC
> > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >
> > Boston, MA
> >
> >
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> > test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> > on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> > just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> > "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> > like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> > activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> > more creativity!
> >
> > Shirley Ledet
> >
> > GED Instructor
> >
> > NHC-Carver
> >
> > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education
> system --
> > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> > academic standards AND creativity.
> >
> > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >
> > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: "Marie Cora"
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to
> > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > > suggested resources go to:
> > >
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > 07creativityGED.html
> > >
> > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> > you can
> > > catch up in the archives at:
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> > >
> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> > >
> > > Thanks!!
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> >
> >
> > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> > on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >
> >
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> > can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> > assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> >
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
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> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
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> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
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> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
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> Assessment mailing list
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> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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> Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400
> From: "Katherine G" <Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID:
> <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="Windows-1252"
>
> David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if
> students are planning to go on to college!  Students who pass the GED with
> minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and
> weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.  Most colleges
> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum."  As we
> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.
>
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.  Humanities
> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,
> figures of speech, figurative language, and more.  For students to truly
> understand history, they must be able to visualize different time periods.
> Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which
> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.  The list goes
> on.
>
> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a GED
> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all.  If
> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the
> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.  In terms of more
> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that
> home.  Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not
> get with GED students.  But especially with students who want to pursue
> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach
> them to think critically.
>
> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't
> studied in a long time but did in my past lives.  The essay demonstrates how
> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED students can
> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the
> teacher and the class).
> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm
>
> I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED students
> planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have
> communications between public schools and college to make this happen if we
> want GED students to succeed.  Part of these discussions should include
> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.
>
>
> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor
> Prince William County Public Schools
> Adult Education
> P.O. Box 389
> Manassas, VA 20108
> work 703-791-8387
> fax 703-791-8889
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
> Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
> Assessment colleagues,
>
> Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
> shot.
>
> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> both?  And where do critical skills fit in?
>
> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> solving.
>
> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> now adult secondary education programs?
>
> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> creative skills.
>
> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> and creativity.
>
> I invite your comments on this.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
> > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> > test.
> >
> > Toni Borge
> >
> > BHCC
> > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >
> > Boston, MA
> >
> >
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> > test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> > on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> > just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> > "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> > like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> > activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> > more creativity!
> >
> > Shirley Ledet
> >
> > GED Instructor
> >
> > NHC-Carver
> >
> > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education
> system --
> > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> > academic standards AND creativity.
> >
> > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >
> > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: "Marie Cora"
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to
> > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > > suggested resources go to:
> > >
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > 07creativityGED.html
> > >
> > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> > you can
> > > catch up in the archives at:
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> > >
> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> > >
> > > Thanks!!
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> >
> >
> > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> > on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >
> >
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> > can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> > assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> >
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
> End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
> ******************************************
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>
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> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Donna Chambers)
>    2. [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Katherine G)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400
> From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
>         reply-type=original
>
> David and All,
>
> Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.  Critical thinking is a
> learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can be nurtured,
> but not necessarily learned..  In Adult Education creativity is not a
> necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount.
>
> I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment programs such
> as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma Program.
> This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know and be able to
> do and this information has changed over the years.  Most states' education
> systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education seems to be
> GED driven.  As such, is limited to just what is necessary to pass the GED.
> The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and assessment is
> apparent, at least to me.
>
> In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list of
> competencies that need to be learned.  Merely passing a standardized test
> does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically. Yet, from the
> perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and policy makers,
> passing the test has become paramount  in Adult Education. Outcomes has been
> translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the GED is
> "good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass the GED, all
> will be well.   Not necessarily so!
>
> Adult Education needs complete reform.  Let's look at what the metacognative
> research tells us and design a system around what essential knowledge and
> skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading skills into all
> activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a performance
> based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to know and be
> able to do today.  Passing the GED will still be an attainable measure, but
> only one of many that need to be achieved.  Instructors and students must
> know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and thinking
> skills will lead to passing the test.  A strong foundation will, more
> importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high school
> certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed in our
> complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from the beginning
> upon entering AE programs.  Learners must be given the opportunity to
> understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the path to skill
> building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their goals.
> Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the outcomes will
> be more meaningful.
>
> Donna  Chambers
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM
> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
> Assessment colleagues,
>
> Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
> shot.
>
> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> both?  And where do critical skills fit in?
>
> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> solving.
>
> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> now adult secondary education programs?
>
> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> creative skills.
>
> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> and creativity.
>
> I invite your comments on this.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
> > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> > test.
> >
> > Toni Borge
> >
> > BHCC
> > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >
> > Boston, MA
> >
> >
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> > test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> > on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> > just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> > "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> > like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> > activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> > more creativity!
> >
> > Shirley Ledet
> >
> > GED Instructor
> >
> > NHC-Carver
> >
> > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education
> system --
> > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> > academic standards AND creativity.
> >
> > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >
> > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: "Marie Cora"
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to
> > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > > suggested resources go to:
> > >
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > 07creativityGED.html
> > >
> > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> > you can
> > > catch up in the archives at:
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> > >
> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> > >
> > > Thanks!!
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> >
> >
> > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> > on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >
> >
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> > can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> > assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> >
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400
> From: "Katherine G" <Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID:
> <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="Windows-1252"
>
> David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if
> students are planning to go on to college!  Students who pass the GED with
> minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and
> weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.  Most colleges
> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum."  As we
> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.
>
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.  Humanities
> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative forms,
> figures of speech, figurative language, and more.  For students to truly
> understand history, they must be able to visualize different time periods.
> Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which
> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.  The list goes
> on.
>
> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a GED
> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all.  If
> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the
> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.  In terms of more
> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take that
> home.  Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might not
> get with GED students.  But especially with students who want to pursue
> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to teach
> them to think critically.
>
> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't
> studied in a long time but did in my past lives.  The essay demonstrates how
> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED students can
> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the
> teacher and the class).
> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm
>
> I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED students
> planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have
> communications between public schools and college to make this happen if we
> want GED students to succeed.  Part of these discussions should include
> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.
>
>
> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor
> Prince William County Public Schools
> Adult Education
> P.O. Box 389
> Manassas, VA 20108
> work 703-791-8387
> fax 703-791-8889
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
> Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
> Assessment colleagues,
>
> Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
> shot.
>
> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> both?  And where do critical skills fit in?
>
> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> solving.
>
> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> now adult secondary education programs?
>
> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> creative skills.
>
> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> and creativity.
>
> I invite your comments on this.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
> > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> > test.
> >
> > Toni Borge
> >
> > BHCC
> > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >
> > Boston, MA
> >
> >
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> > test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> > on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> > just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> > "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> > like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> > activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> > more creativity!
> >
> > Shirley Ledet
> >
> > GED Instructor
> >
> > NHC-Carver
> >
> > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education
> system --
> > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> > academic standards AND creativity.
> >
> > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >
> > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: "Marie Cora"
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to
> > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > > suggested resources go to:
> > >
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > 07creativityGED.html
> > >
> > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> > you can
> > > catch up in the archives at:
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> > >
> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> > >
> > > Thanks!!
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> >
> >
> > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> > on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >
> >
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> > can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> > assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> >
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
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> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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> Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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>
>
> End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
> ******************************************
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
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>

From andreawilder at comcast.net  Tue Oct 30 09:03:39 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 09:03:39 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1034] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <1dd5701e0710300419h22768734p27ce482309125ca6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ad2cc1ef0710261423n49c5f99o20946f7fadfc1a70@mail.gmail.com>
	<146640.56583.qm@web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<1dd5701e0710300419h22768734p27ce482309125ca6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <d6f6c61539965de44dc76238518fe13a@comcast.net>

There is  brain research which shows that when the TEACHER focuses on a  
certain aspect of reading or learning, he STUDENT will follow this  
lead.

Andrea

On Oct 30, 2007, at 7:19 AM, Jackie Coelho wrote:

> Shirley, I agree that an enjoyment of reading is the first step. I
> have been reading small novels with my Pre-GED level students for
> three years now. And when we finish one book, they are always quick to
> ask what the next will be. They really enjoy spending time discussing
> the characters, the issues and relating all to themselves. Last week
> we read a text that explains in detail why leaves change color and
> then fall off. The next day a student told me she had never looked at
> fall foliage the way she does now.
> If a student enjoys reading or sees a real purpose to it, he or she
> does it more than willingly.
> Jackie
>
> On 10/29/07, shirley ledet <msledet at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> I agree, however by the time I students get to us they need a reason  
>> to
>> read. Discussion brings an interest and desire to read. When very  
>> young
>> children are given that desire because of the way it is introduced.   
>> the
>> desire build, the cognitive recognition of reading, thoughts,  
>> imagination
>> and pleasure are place in the lexicon and "walaa" you have a reader.  
>> When
>> this is not done, the students sees reading as a means to end and  
>> therefore
>> drudgery. Telling a students to read whose mantra has become "I hate
>> reading" " I was never good at reading" "I always fail reading" is
>> pointless.  We must awaken the desire and the learning will come. With
>> joy.....most of the time.
>> Shirley
>>
>>
>> Wendy Quinones <teacherwendyq at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Actually, all of the GED tests are reading -- even math for the most  
>> part.
>> I think Mary Lynn is right on!
>>
>> On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot  
>>> and if
>> students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a  
>> skill.
>> The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The  
>> reason
>> people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do not  
>> play
>> the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I say,  
>> "Shut
>> up and read."
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________> Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007
>> 15:39:46 -0400> From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu> To: assessment at nifl.gov >
>> Subject: [Assessment 1002] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to  
>> know!>>
>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical  
>> thinking
>> skills which once our students know how to think in a critical  
>> thinking way
>> they will be successful in achieving their education and other life  
>> goals.
>> However, just like K-12 education, adult education is captured on the  
>> high
>> stakes spinning wheel of accountability which stifles creativity and
>> teachers teach to the test.> Toni Borge> BHCC> Adult Education &  
>> Transitions
>> Program> Boston, MA> ________________________________>
>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov  
>> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
>> Behalf Of shirley ledet> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>  
>> To: The
>> Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED  
>> Discussion -
>> what you need to know!> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of  
>> success
>> on standardized test. We need look no further then those who have been
>> successful on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally  
>> gifted,
>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well rounded,  
>> enjoy
>> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like "I don't know, I  
>> just
>> know stuff." Researchers have found that this may be the reason for
>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity  
>> between socio
>> economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking  
>> industry,
>> faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends  
>> to offer
>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure is  
>> to go
>> to school and study hard. My students participate in a quite a few  
>> creative
>> projects and those that "get into it" tend to do better in all  
>> subjects.
>> Those that feel it is a waste of time and they just want to "study  
>> for the
>> GED" are generally frustrated when "all of their hard work does not  
>> pay off
>> like they would like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially  
>> those
>> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on  
>> more
>> creativity!> Shirley Ledet> GED Instructor> NHC-Carver>  
>> djrosen at comcast.net
>> wrote:> Colleagues,> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
>> education -- indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
>> National Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a  
>> presention
>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
>> http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.
>> education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be  
>> competitive
>> without high academic standards AND creativity.> But many GED  
>> teachers and
>> administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED  
>> unless they
>> focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that  
>> creativity is a
>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators  
>> or
>> policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high  
>> stakes
>> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key  
>> question
>> on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the
>> panelists to address it.> Is creativity a distraction or is it  
>> essential for
>> success? Why?> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> --------------  
>> Original
>> message ----------------------> From: "Marie Cora">> Hi everyone,>>>>  
>> We've
>> had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to>>  
>> give a
>> quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>  
>> discussion. For
>> the full announcement, information on guests, and>> suggested  
>> resources go
>> to:>>>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>
>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you  
>> can>>
>> catch up in the archives at:>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>
>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share  
>> now!>>>>
>> Thanks!!>>>> Marie Cora>> Assessment Discussion List  
>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>
>> Marie Cora>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>> NIFL Assessment  
>> Discussion
>> List Moderator>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >>>>> From:
>> "Marie Cora"> To:> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what  
>> you need
>> to know!> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000> Hi everyone,> We've  
>> had
>> several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give a  
>> quick
>> reminder where you can get the information on this discussion. For  
>> the full
>> announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go to:>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>
>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you  
>> can catch
>> up in the archives at:
>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>
>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share  
>> now!>
>> Thanks!!> Marie Cora> Assessment Discussion List Moderator> Marie  
>> Cora>
>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> NIFL Assessment Discussion List  
>> Moderator>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >
>> -------------------------------> National Institute for
>> Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To  
>> unsubscribe or
>> change your subscription settings, please go to
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
>> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>
>> -------------------------------> National Institute for
>> Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To  
>> unsubscribe or
>> change your subscription settings, please go to
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment > Email
>> delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>>>
>>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.  
>>> Stop
>> by today.
>>>
>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html? 
>> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
>>> -------------------------------
>>> National Institute for Literacy
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>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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>>> Email delivered to teacherwendyq at gmail.com
>>>
>>
>> -------------------------------
>> National Institute for Literacy
>> Assessment mailing list
>> Assessment at nifl.gov
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>>
>>
>> -------------------------------
>> National Institute for Literacy
>> Assessment mailing list
>> Assessment at nifl.gov
>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>> Email delivered to jackie.coelho at gmail.com
>>
>>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
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> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
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From djrosen at comcast.net  Tue Oct 30 09:30:31 2007
From: djrosen at comcast.net (David J. Rosen)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 09:30:31 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1035]  GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking
In-Reply-To: <BAY115-W127277FC88A9B618688CEDBF910@phx.gbl>
References: <mailman.58243.1193577788.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
	<D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B1042@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
	<69cbc825214882ee73340c228f35e01a@comcast.net>
	<BAY115-W127277FC88A9B618688CEDBF910@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <2D916EB3-B229-48D1-8C81-BCEB7D8FD785@comcast.net>

Mary Lynn wrote:

> I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college  
> or training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is  
> unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous  
> term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is  
> paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.

Creativity need not be nebulous. For example, here's a good  
definition from the Wikipedia:

"Creativity (or creativeness) is a mental process involving the  
generation of new ideas or concepts, or new associations between  
existing ideas or concepts."  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity

I am sure you can see the direct application of this kind of  
creativity to scoring high on the GED tests, for example in writing a  
good essay, and perhaps in other areas. Equally important -- for  
students who believe that GED preparation is the key to success in  
post-secondary education and some kinds of job skills training --  
generating new ideas or concepts and making associations between  
existing ideas or concepts is essential for success.

Let me return to the context in which I raised the issue of  
creativity, Marc Tucker's claim that if the U.S. is to be  
competitive, if Americans are to have good jobs, they not only need  
strong basic skills and some college education, but they also need to  
be creative, that this is the cultural edge that leads to innovation  
and invention, that makes the American economy strong, and will  
enable American workers to thrive. Some adult education students, of  
course, don't care about that.  They want the GED for other reasons,  
and that's fine. Let them fast track to the test.  Those who want GED  
prepararation for college and good jobs, however, will need more:  
stronger academic skills to succeed in college, and -- if Tucker is  
right -- skills in the mental processes to generate new ideas or  
concepts, and new associations between existing concepts, and perhaps  
other kinds of creativity.

Mary Lynn, I would like to challenge the belief that we "owe [it] to  
our students to get them to community college or training as fast as  
possible." This has not produced good results for adult students  
whose goal is to succeed in college.  Only a very small percentage of  
adult GED holders actually succeed in college, often because they  
lack the academic reading and writing skills, and numeracy  
(especially algebra) that they need to enroll in regular (not  
developmental) courses. Unfortunately way too many use up their  
college financial aide in college developmental courses and then have  
to drop out before achieving a certificate or degree.  Many of these  
students will need to take the time to prepare for college in their  
GED preparation program, not fast track to the GED test.

David J. Rosen
djrosen at comcast.net

On Oct 29, 2007, at 3:27 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:

>
> I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills;  
> critical thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against  
> teachers wasting student time with too much talking, both by  
> students and by themselves, and calling it "creativity". In order  
> to be able to pass the tests, students must grapple with the five  
> subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and  
> mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively  
> discussions, though interesting, can keep students from doing what  
> they need to do to be able to pass. Adult education students have  
> busy lives and have little time to get their GED. I think we owe to  
> to our students to get them to community college or training as  
> fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to  
> decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We  
> must respect the goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or  
> maternalistic to do otherwise.
> > From: andreawilder at comcast.net
> > Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400
> > To: assessment at nifl.gov
> > Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
> >
> > Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you two  
> (Mary
> > Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what  
> would
> > I see???
> > would there be a real difference?
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Andrea
> > On Oct 29, 2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:
> >
> > > Wow, I must say I disagree with Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/ 
> GEDstudents
> > > come in just wanting to pass the test, but have no critical  
> thinking
> > > or transitional college skills. If we don't help them  
> understand and
> > > acquire some of those skills, they will not be able to succeed  
> with
> > > the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think it  
> is one
> > > of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they  
> need to
> > > succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is
> > > paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > > Mary Lynn Carver
> > > ABE/GED Instructor
> > > College of Lake County
> > > Building 4, Office 405
> > > 19351 W. Washington Street
> > > Grayslake, IL 60031
> > > Phone:847/543-2677
> > > mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
> > > Fax: 847/543-7580
> > >
> > > "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be
> > > constantly amused" -- Unknown
> > >
> > > We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of  
> keeping
> > > abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach  
> people how
> > > to learn. --Peter F. Drucker
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > >
> > > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of
> > > assessment-request at nifl.gov
> > > Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM
> > > To: assessment at nifl.gov
> > > Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
> > > assessment at nifl.gov
> > >
> > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > > assessment-request at nifl.gov
> > >
> > > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > > assessment-owner at nifl.gov
> > >
> > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more  
> specific
> > > than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."
> > >
> > >
> > > Today's Topics:
> > >
> > > 1. [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills
> > > (David J. Rosen)
> > > 2. [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > > (Mary Lynn Simons)
> > > 3. [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > > (Andrea Wilder)
> > > 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
> > > (David J. Rosen)
> > > 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity (David J.
> > > Rosen)
> > > 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > > (Donna Chambers)
> > >
> > >
> > >  
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 1
> > > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400
> > > From: David J. Rosen <djrosen at comcast.net>
> > > Subject: [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills
> > > To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List  
> <technology at nifl.gov>,
> > > The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List
> > > <professionaldevelopment at nifl.gov>, The Assessment
> > > Discussion List
> > > <assessment at nifl.gov>, The Adult English Language Learners
> > > Discussion
> > > List <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>
> > > Message-ID: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9 at comcast.net>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
> > > format=flowed
> > >
> > > Colleagues,
> > >
> > > The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
> > > based library of short digital videos of adult education  
> classrooms
> > > and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
> > > videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
> > >
> > > ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy
> > > tutoring)
> > > ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
> > > ? OTAN (integrating technology)
> > > and
> > > ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
> > > learners can and cannot do with literacy)
> > >
> > > I hope you will take a look. If you know of other good  
> classroom or
> > > tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am
> > > hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
> > > adult literacy education classroom videos.
> > >
> > > David J. Rosen
> > > djrosen at comcast.net
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 2
> > > Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000
> > > From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
> > > Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need  
> to know!
> > > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > > Message-ID: <BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900 at phx.gbl>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
> > >
> > >
> > > Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach  
> them
> > > accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/ 
> maternalistically
> > > decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to  
> know to
> > > be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them  
> get to
> > > college or training as fast as possible.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----------------------------------------> From:
> > > Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct
> > > 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED  
> Discussion -
> > > what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is  
> essential
> > > in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to
> > > college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely
> > > think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are
> > > usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require
> > > program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As  
> we> know,
> > > writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to  
> develop.>>
> > > Even basic college writing classes require understanding and  
> using>
> > > rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.
> > > Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even  
> implement
> > > creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and  
> more. For
> > > students to truly> understand history, they must be able to vi
> > > sualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into
> > > statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and  
> equations
> > > are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone  
> here or in
> > > another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class  
> who are
> > > not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the
> > > instructor is writing on the board, if the students are  
> writing, if
> > > the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In  
> terms of
> > > more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely  
> need
> > > to take that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of  
> discipline
> > > that we might not> get with GED students. But especially with  
> students
> > > who want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we  
> need to
> > > have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I  
> just
> > > now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't>  
> studied in a
> > > long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>
> > > creativity is used in the co
> > > llege classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in  
> college
> > > (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher  
> and the
> > > class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm
> > > believer in extensive transitional services for GED students>  
> planning
> > > to attend college, and I think it's essential to have>  
> communications
> > > between public schools and college to make this happen if we>  
> want GED
> > > students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>
> > > creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>>  
> Katherine
> > > Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County
> > > Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>
> > > work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original  
> Message----->
> > > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> > > [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>
> > > Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment  
> Discussion
> > > List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you  
> need
> > > to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by
> > > creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a
> > > means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches  
> will
> > > more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test
> > > scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want
> > > students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or>  
> both? And
> > > where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc  
> Tucker does,
> > > that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I  
> would
> > > put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a  
> means and
> > > as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs  
> should
> > > provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills  
> that
> > > are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking
> > > skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills),  
> and
> > > the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the
> > > assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> > >> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic  
> skills,
> > >> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical
> > >> thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in
> > >> adult literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc
> > >> Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the>  
> greatest
> > >> economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I>  
> agree
> > >> with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high>
> > >> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only
> > >> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important
> > >> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly  
> and
> > >> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and  
> evaluate a
> > >> range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an  
> image,
> > >> a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative  
> language,
> > >> or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but  
> instead
> > >> to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin
> > > king (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the  
> box").>>
> > > Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No.  
> Should>
> > > they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or  
> high>
> > > school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to  
> stable>
> > > employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to>
> > > successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we  
> should be>
> > > teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical  
> thinking>
> > > and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J.  
> Rosen>
> > > djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F
> > > wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching
> > > critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how to  
> think
> > > in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving
> > > their>> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12
> > > education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes  
> spinning
> > > wheel of>> accountability which stifle
> > > s creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>
> > > BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston,  
> MA>>>>>>>>
> > > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->>
> > > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday,  
> October
> > > 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:
> > > [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know! 
> >>>>>>>>
> > > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on  
> standardized>>
> > > test. We need look no further then those who have been  
> successful>> on
> > > any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally  
> gifted,>> just
> > > smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>>  
> rounded, enjoy
> > > reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't  
> know,
> > > I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the
> > > reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more
> > > disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity.  
> Exposure
> > > to the arts, banking industry, faculty
> > > ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to
> > > offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only
> > > exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students  
> participate
> > > in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into  
> it" tend
> > > to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of
> > > time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally
> > > frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like  
> they
> > > would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially  
> those>>
> > > activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring  
> on>>
> > > more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>>
> > > NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I  
> am a
> > > proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed  
> in all
> > > education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for
> > > Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently  
> to the
> > > National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///>
> > >>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education  
> system -->>
> > >>> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without
> > >>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED  
> teachers
> > >>> and administrators believe that their>> students will not  
> pass the
> > >>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to  
> pass the
> > >>> test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.  
> (Many
> > >>> K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe
> > >>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I  
> hate to be
> > >>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the
> > >>> minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the
> > >>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or  
> is it
> > >>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>
> > >>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message
> > >>> ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi  
> everyone,>>>>>>
> > >>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>
> > >>> wanted to>>> give a qu
> > > ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>  
> discussion.
> > > For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested
> > > resources go to:>>>>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
> > > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from  
> yesterday -
> > > there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>  
> Please
> > > post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>
> > > now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
> > > Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> > > Moderator>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  
> From:
> > > "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion  
> - what
> > > you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi
> > > everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the  
> past day,
> > > and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you
> > > can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full
> > > announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go
> > > to:>>>>>>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from  
> yesterday ?
> > > there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>
> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > > now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion
> > > List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> > > Moderator>>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > ------------------------------->> National Institute for  
> Literacy>>
> > > Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or
> > > change your subscription settings, please go to>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email  
> delivered to
> > > djrosen at comcast.net>> ------
> > > ------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>
> > > Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or
> > > change your subscription settings, please go to>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email  
> delivered to
> > > msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>  
> National
> > > Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> > > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> > > settings, please go to>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email  
> delivered to
> > > djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->  
> National
> > > Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>  
> Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email  
> delivered to
> > > kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National
> > > Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>  
> Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings
> > > , please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>  
> Email
> > > delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com
> > >
> > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger  
> Caf?.
> > > Stop by today.
> > > http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?
> > > ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 3
> > > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400
> > > From: Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net>
> > > Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need  
> to know!
> > > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > > Message-ID: <9e32f2dbe2ba96b51be97f5819a91d2c at comcast.net>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
> > > format=flowed
> > >
> > > Hi Mary Lynn--
> > >
> > > One of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been:  
> "Don't
> > > waste their time." Is this what you are getting at?
> > >
> > > Andrea
> > >
> > > On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:
> > >
> > >>
> > >> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then  
> teach them
> > >> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/ 
> maternalistically
> > >> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to  
> know to
> > >> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them  
> get to
> > >> college or training as fast as possible.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> ----------------------------------------> From:
> > >> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27  
> Oct
> > >> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED  
> Discussion -
> > >> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is  
> essential
> > >> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to
> > >> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to  
> freely
> > >> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are
> > >> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges>  
> require
> > >> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As  
> we> know,
> > >> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to  
> develop.>>
> > >> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and  
> using>
> > >> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.
> > >> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even  
> implement
> > >> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and  
> more. For
> > >> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to  
> visualize
> > >> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into  
> statistics
> > >> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are  
> used to
> > >> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in  
> another
> > >> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not
> > >> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the  
> instructor
> > >> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the>  
> students
> > >> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>
> > >> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need  
> to take
> > >> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline  
> that we
> > >> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students  
> who
> > >> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we  
> need to
> > >> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I  
> just
> > >> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't>  
> studied in a
> > >> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>
> > >> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED
> > >> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this  
> extent,
> > >> depending on the> teacher and the class).
> > >> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm  
> believer in
> > >> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to  
> attend
> > >> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications  
> between
> > >> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED
> > >> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>
> > >> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>>  
> Katherine
> > >> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County
> > >> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA  
> 20108>
> > >> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original  
> Message----->
> > >> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> > >> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>
> > >> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment  
> Discussion
> > >> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you  
> need to
> > >> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by
> > >> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is  
> creativity a
> > >> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches  
> will
> > >> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test
> > >> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want
> > >> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or>  
> both? And
> > >> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc  
> Tucker does,
> > >> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I  
> would
> > >> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a  
> means and
> > >> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs  
> should
> > >> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills  
> that
> > >> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical  
> thinking
> > >> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic  
> skills), and
> > >> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the
> > >> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult  
> secondary
> > >> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
> > >> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking  
> skills, and
> > >> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy  
> education
> > >> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we  
> are not
> > >> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one  
> of the
> > >> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and  
> believe that
> > >> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for
> > >> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED
> > >> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability  
> to look
> > >> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the  
> ability to
> > >> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to  
> represent
> > >> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor  
> or other
> > >> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to  
> understand and
> > >> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional  
> paths of
> > >> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the
> > >> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should  
> have.
> > >> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see  
> the GED
> > >> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping  
> stone
> > >> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open  
> the door
> > >> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills  
> we should
> > >> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical
> > >> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>>  
> David J.
> > >> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM,  
> Borge,
> > >> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean
> > >> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students  
> know how
> > >> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in
> > >> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However,  
> just like
> > >> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes
> > >> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and
> > >> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult
> > >> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:
> > >> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->>  
> bounces at nifl.gov] On
> > >> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007  
> 4:30 PM>>
> > >> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment  
> 1001] Re:
> > >> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that
> > >> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test.  
> We need
> > >> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any  
> type of
> > >> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just  
> smart, etc.
> > >> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy  
> reading,
> > >> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I  
> just
> > >> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the  
> reason for
> > >> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity
> > >> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure  
> to the
> > >> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as  
> part of
> > >> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when  
> testing
> > >> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and  
> study hard.
> > >> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects  
> and those
> > >> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those  
> that
> > >> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for  
> the GED"
> > >> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does  
> not pay
> > >> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention;
> > >> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in  
> increments.
> > >> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED
> > >> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>
> > >> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
> > >> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker,  
> President of
> > >> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said  
> in a
> > >> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult  
> Literacy,
> > >> http:// <http:///> >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the  
> U.S.
> > >> education
> > >> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be  
> competitive
> > >> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many  
> GED
> > >> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will  
> not
> > >> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge  
> needed to
> > >> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time- 
> waster.
> > >> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also  
> believe
> > >> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate  
> to be
> > >> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on  
> the minds
> > >> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the  
> panelists
> > >> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it  
> essential for
> > >> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>
> > >> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From:  
> "Marie
> > >> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers  
> over the
> > >> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where  
> you can
> > >> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full  
> announcement,
> > >> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
> > >> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from  
> yesterday -
> > >> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives  
> at:>>>
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>  
> Please
> > >> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>
> > >> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion  
> List
> > >> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>
> > >> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> > >> Moderator>>>
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  
> From:
> > >> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED  
> Discussion - what
> > >> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi
> > >> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the  
> past day,
> > >> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the
> > >> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement,
> > >> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > >> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from  
> yesterday ?
> > >> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/ 
> date.html>>>>>>>>
> > >> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > >> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment  
> Discussion
> > >> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
> > >> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion  
> List
> > >> Moderator>>>>
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > >> ------------------------------->> National Institute for  
> Literacy>>
> > >> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or
> > >> change your subscription settings, please go to>>
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email  
> delivered to
> > >> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National
> > >> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> > >> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> > >> settings, please go to>>
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email  
> delivered to
> > >> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>  
> National
> > >> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> > >> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> > >> settings, please go to>>
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email  
> delivered to
> > >> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->  
> National
> > >> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>  
> Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go  
> to>
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email  
> delivered to
> > >> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->  
> National
> > >> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>  
> Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email  
> delivered to
> > >> macsimoin at hotmail.com
> > >>
> > >> _________________________________________________________________
> > >> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger  
> Caf?.
> > >> Stop by today.
> > >> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?
> > >> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
> > >> -------------------------------
> > >> National Institute for Literacy
> > >> Assessment mailing list
> > >> Assessment at nifl.gov
> > >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >> Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 4
> > > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400
> > > From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> > > Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
> > > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > > Message-ID: <0570AB67-85EE-4F24-AF0B-2E657CB60778 at comcast.net>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
> > > format=flowed
> > >
> > > ....and the Web address for MLoTS is:
> > >
> > > http://www.mlots.org <http://www.mlots.org/>
> > >
> > > David J. Rosen
> > > djrosen at comcast.net
> > >
> > >
> > > On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:
> > >
> > >> Colleagues,
> > >>
> > >> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
> > >> based library of short digital videos of adult education  
> classrooms
> > >> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
> > >> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
> > >>
> > >> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy
> > >> tutoring)
> > >> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
> > >> ? OTAN (integrating technology)
> > >> and
> > >> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
> > >> learners can and cannot do with literacy)
> > >>
> > >> I hope you will take a look. If you know of other good  
> classroom or
> > >> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am
> > >> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
> > >> adult literacy education classroom videos.
> > >>
> > >> David J. Rosen
> > >> djrosen at comcast.net
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> -------------------------------
> > >> National Institute for Literacy
> > >> Assessment mailing list
> > >> Assessment at nifl.gov
> > >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 5
> > > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400
> > > From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> > > Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity
> > > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > > Message-ID: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C at comcast.net>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes;  
> format=flowed
> > >
> > > Hello Andrea,
> > >
> > > On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:
> > >
> > >> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading
> > >> and 2. creativity?
> > >
> > > Here's more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite
> > > unlikely that we will agree on a definition. There are more  
> than 60
> > > of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far
> > > as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for
> > > creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be
> > > taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I  
> believe that
> > > some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and  
> that
> > > it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned  
> with the
> > > kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us  
> would
> > > agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might
> > > differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in
> > > different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in  
> technology, and
> > > in the creative problem solving of daily living.
> > >
> > > In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was
> > > thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer  
> to as
> > > innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I  
> believe
> > > Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have  
> historically
> > > valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American  
> economic
> > > success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education
> > > systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized  
> tests.
> > >
> > > Are adult literacy education students (including basic education,
> > > secondary education and ESOL) capable of this kind of  
> creativity? If
> > > so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we  
> should. In
> > > many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not  
> even
> > > acknowledged in program goals or objectives. And I have never seen
> > > it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not  
> value
> > > and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that,  
> if we
> > > are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should
> > > value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to
> > > nourish creativity.
> > >
> > > What do you think about this?
> > >
> > >
> > > * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of
> > > creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:
> > > Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University  
> Press.
> > >
> > > David J. Rosen
> > > djrosen at comcast.net
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Message: 6
> > > Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400
> > > From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
> > > Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need  
> to know!
> > > To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > > Message-ID: <001f01c81958$da000530$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
> > > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
> > > reply-type=original
> > >
> > > Mary Lynn,
> > >
> > > Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief. I am  
> not
> > > suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them  
> for
> > > just
> > > "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility  
> of our
> > > job.
> > > Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of a
> > > high
> > > school student and be ready to transition to college level  
> academics
> > > is in
> > > the learners' best interest in respect to time and money.  
> Community
> > > College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and  
> yet they
> > > do. If
> > > the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter
> > > community
> > > college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be  
> smoother, but
> > > it is
> > > not. Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic
> > > and
> > > secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of Adult  
> Literacy.
> > >
> > > Donna Chambers
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Mary Lynn Simons" <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
> > > To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > > Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM
> > > Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need  
> to know!
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach  
> them
> > > accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/ 
> maternalistically
> > > decide
> > > what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to  
> be able
> > > to
> > > pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to  
> college or
> > > training as fast as possible.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----------------------------------------> From:
> > > Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:
> > > assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400>  
> Subject:
> > > [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>  
> David,
> > > I
> > > agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if>
> > > students
> > > are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with>
> > > minimal
> > > ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas,  
> and> weigh
> > > options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most  
> colleges>
> > > require program elements such as "writing across the  
> curriculum." As
> > > we>
> > > know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to
> > > develop.>>
> > > Even basic college writing classes require understanding and  
> using>
> > > rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.
> > > Humanities>
> > > courses demand students to understand and even implement creative
> > > forms,>
> > > figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to
> > > truly>
> > > understand history, they must be able to visualize different time
> > > periods.>
> > > Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in  
> which>
> > > graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.  
> The list
> > > goes>
> > > on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that  
> students
> > > in a
> > > GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing  
> reading at
> > > all.
> > > If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are
> > > writing, if
> > > the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In  
> terms of
> > > more>
> > > formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need  
> to take
> > > that>
> > > home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we  
> might
> > > not>
> > > get with GED students. But especially with students who want to  
> pursue>
> > > higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the  
> time to
> > > teach>
> > > them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an  
> essay
> > > from
> > > Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in  
> my past
> > > lives.
> > > The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college
> > > classroom as
> > > well as what GED students can> expect in college (though  
> perhaps not
> > > to this
> > > extent, depending on the> teacher and the class).
> > > http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm  
> believer in
> > > extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to  
> attend
> > > college, and I think it's essential to have> communications  
> between
> > > public
> > > schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED  
> students to
> > > succeed.
> > > Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and  
> expected
> > > in
> > > every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL  
> Online
> > > Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education>
> > > P.O. Box
> > > 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax
> > > 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:
> > > assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> On>
> > > Behalf
> > > Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To:  
> The
> > > Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED
> > > Discussion -
> > > what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked  
> what we
> > > mean
> > > by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is  
> creativity a
> > > means
> > > to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more
> > > students
> > > have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is
> > > creativity
> > > itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both  
> academically
> > > prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit
> > > in?>> I
> > > would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>
> > > skills
> > > and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these
> > > catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>
> > > education
> > > (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the>  
> opportunity to
> > > have
> > > academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college,  
> strong
> > > critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong
> > > academic
> > > skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since  
> this is
> > > the
> > > assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult  
> secondary
> > > education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
> > > standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking  
> skills, and
> > > if so
> > > how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is
> > > measuring>
> > > creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying
> > > attention to
> > > one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic  
> strengths of
> > > the
> > > U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive  
> focus
> > > on
> > > high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only
> > > traditional>
> > > basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative  
> skills>
> > > like
> > > the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different>
> > > perspectives,
> > > the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the  
> ability
> > > to
> > > represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a
> > > metaphor or
> > > other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to  
> understand
> > > and
> > > follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional  
> paths of
> > > thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the
> > > box").>> Are
> > > these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should>
> > > they be?
> > > Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school
> > > diploma as
> > > a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment  
> and
> > > self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful
> > > post-secondary
> > > learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and  
> measuring:
> > > academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I
> > > invite
> > > your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen>  
> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On
> > > Oct 26,
> > > 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to
> > > creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which  
> once
> > > our
> > > students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they  
> will be
> > > successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals.
> > > However,
> > > just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the  
> high
> > > stakes
> > > spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and
> > > teachers
> > > teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education &
> > > Transitions
> > > Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> > > [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley  
> ledet>>
> > > Sent:
> > > Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion
> > > List>>
> > > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
> > > know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of  
> success on
> > > standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who  
> have been
> > > successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like  
> natuarally
> > > gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are  
> well>>
> > > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms  
> like>>
> > > "I
> > > don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>>  
> this may
> > > be
> > > the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there  
> is more
> > > disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity.  
> Exposure
> > > to
> > > the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues  
> as part
> > > of
> > > your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when  
> testing
> > > then
> > > someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study  
> hard. My
> > > students
> > > participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that  
> "get
> > > into
> > > it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is  
> a waste
> > > of
> > > time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally
> > > frustrated>>
> > > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>>  
> like."
> > > Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>  
> activities that
> > > have
> > > to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity! 
> >>>>
> > > Shirley
> > > Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net
> > > wrote:>>>>
> > > Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
> > > education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker,  
> President of
> > > the
> > > National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a
> > > presention>>
> > > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> > > <http:///> >>
> > > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system  
> -->>
> > > and he
> > > includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>>  
> academic
> > > standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and  
> administrators
> > > believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they  
> focus
> > > on
> > > skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity  
> is a>>
> > > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>>  
> administrators
> > > or
> > > policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing  
> high
> > > stakes
> > > tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's  
> the key
> > > question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and  
> administrators, so I
> > > invite
> > > the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or  
> is it
> > > essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>
> > > djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original
> > > message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi
> > > everyone,>>>>>>
> > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>  
> wanted
> > > to>>>
> > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>
> > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests,  
> and>>>
> > > suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
> > > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from  
> yesterday -
> > > there
> > > were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>  
> Please
> > > post
> > > your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>
> > > Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
> > > Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>
> > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  
> From:
> > > "Marie
> > > Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what  
> you
> > > need to
> > > know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi  
> everyone,>>>>>>>>
> > > We?ve
> > > had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>  
> wanted to
> > > give a
> > > quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this  
> discussion.
> > > For
> > > the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested
> > > resources go
> > > to:>>>>>>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>
> > > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ?  
> you>>
> > > can
> > > catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>
> > > assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions  
> and also
> > > your
> > > own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie  
> Cora>>>>
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie  
> Cora>>>>
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> > > Moderator>>>>
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>
> > > ------------------------------->>
> > > National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> > > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> > > settings,
> > > please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ 
> assessment>> Email
> > > delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>  
> ------------------------------->>
> > > National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> > > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> > > settings,
> > > please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ 
> assessment>> Email
> > > delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>
> > > ------------------------------->>
> > > National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> > > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> > > settings,
> > > please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/ 
> assessment>> Email
> > > delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>  
> ------------------------------->
> > > National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>
> > > Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> > > settings,
> > > please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>  
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> > > please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>  
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> > > Stop by
> > > today.
> > > http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?
> > > ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
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> > > End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
> > > ******************************************
> > >
> > >
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> > > National Institute for Literacy
> > > Assessment mailing list
> > > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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> > Assessment mailing list
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> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
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> Peek-a-boo FREE Tricks & Treats for You! Get 'em!
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From andreawilder at comcast.net  Sun Oct 28 18:51:01 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 18:51:01 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1036] Re: GED preparation and creativity
In-Reply-To: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C@comcast.net>
References: <OFC68E1FF5.FFC615F1-ON07257381.00553688-07257381.0056B334@yc.edu>
	<69c09a7aab39d4d0fcd91c58d6b0e1d4@comcast.net>
	<65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <20f8d2e00f698f77db680b64d461ea62@comcast.net>

David,

This is an interesting topic.  There is the idea that the creative 
person goes off into the wild and somehow invents something.  To quote 
Click and Clack, this idea is wacko.

I think there has to be tremendous support for new ideas--books, for 
instance, need a reading public, agents, people interesting in 
publishing, and a guaranteed audience. .

How much $$$$ was poured into science before computers were created and 
developed?

How about solar panels?  They have been around since when...1940's?  
Earlier?

That's it for tonight on competitiveness.  Except--how about Japan?  An 
educational system that has as its main technique rote learning?  Yet, 
I drive a Japanese car.

Andrea

I
On Oct 27, 2007, at 11:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:

> Hello Andrea,
>
> On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:
>
>> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading
>> and 2. creativity?
>
> Here's more on defining creativity.  To begin  with, it's quite
> unlikely that we will agree on a definition.  There are more than 60
> of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988),  and as far
> as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for
> creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be
> taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that
> some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that
> it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the
> kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would
> agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might
> differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in
> different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and
> in the creative problem solving of daily living.
>
> In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was
> thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as
> innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe
> Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically
> valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic
> success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education
> systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.
>
> Are adult literacy education students  (including basic education,
> secondary education and ESOL) capable of  this kind of creativity? If
> so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should.  In
> many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even
> acknowledged in program goals or objectives.  And I have never seen
> it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value
> and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we
> are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should
> value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to
> nourish creativity.
>
> What do you think about this?
>
>
> * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of
> creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.:  The nature of creativity:
> Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net
>

From bcarmel at rocketmail.com  Tue Oct 30 10:21:17 2007
From: bcarmel at rocketmail.com (Bruce C)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 07:21:17 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 1037] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <1dd5701e0710300419h22768734p27ce482309125ca6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <37771.91927.qm@web37901.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Thanks everyone for the great discussion. It's heartening to know that there are so many people out there who are NOT just teaching to the test, but are working to develop reading, writing, math, and thinking skills. I'm going to show this discussion to my whole Adult Basic Education and GED prep staff.
  from Bruce Carmel
  at Turning Point in Brooklyn, NY

Jackie Coelho <jackie.coelho at gmail.com> wrote:
    Shirley, I agree that an enjoyment of reading is the first step. I
have been reading small novels with my Pre-GED level students for
three years now. And when we finish one book, they are always quick to
ask what the next will be. They really enjoy spending time discussing
the characters, the issues and relating all to themselves. Last week
we read a text that explains in detail why leaves change color and
then fall off. The next day a student told me she had never looked at
fall foliage the way she does now.
If a student enjoys reading or sees a real purpose to it, he or she
does it more than willingly.
Jackie

On 10/29/07, shirley ledet wrote:
> I agree, however by the time I students get to us they need a reason to
> read. Discussion brings an interest and desire to read. When very young
> children are given that desire because of the way it is introduced. the
> desire build, the cognitive recognition of reading, thoughts, imagination
> and pleasure are place in the lexicon and "walaa" you have a reader. When
> this is not done, the students sees reading as a means to end and therefore
> drudgery. Telling a students to read whose mantra has become "I hate
> reading" " I was never good at reading" "I always fail reading" is
> pointless. We must awaken the desire and the learning will come. With
> joy.....most of the time.
> Shirley
>
>
> Wendy Quinones wrote:
> Actually, all of the GED tests are reading -- even math for the most part.
> I think Mary Lynn is right on!
>
> On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:
> >
> > Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot and if
> students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a skill.
> The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The reason
> people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do not play
> the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I say, "Shut
> up and read."

>
   Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical thinking
> skills which once our students know how to think in a critical thinking way
> they will be successful in achieving their education and other life goals.
> However, just like K-12 education, adult education is captured on the high
> stakes spinning wheel of accountability which stifles creativity and
> teachers teach to the test.> 
  Toni Borge> BHCC> Adult Education & Transitions
> Program> Boston, MA>
   
  Re: GED Discussion -
I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success
> on standardized test. We need look no further then those who have been
> successful on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well rounded, enjoy
> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like "I don't know, I just
> know stuff." Researchers have found that this may be the reason for
> disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity between socio
> economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry,
> faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure is to go
> to school and study hard. My students participate in a quite a few creative
> projects and those that "get into it" tend to do better in all subjects.
> Those that feel it is a waste of time and they just want to "study for the
> GED" are generally frustrated when "all of their hard work does not pay off
> like they would like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on more
> creativity!> 
  Shirley Ledet> GED Instructor> NHC-Carver> 
   
  djrosen at comcast.net wrote:> 
  Colleagues,> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
> education -- indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
> National Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
> http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.
> education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive
> without high academic standards AND creativity.> But many GED teachers and
> administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED unless they
> focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators or
> policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high stakes
> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key question
> on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the
> panelists to address it.> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for
> success? Why?> 
  David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>
   
   From: "Marie Cora">> Hi everyone,>>>> We've
> had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to>> give a
> quick reminder where you can get the information on this>> discussion. For
> the full announcement, information on guests, and>> suggested resources go
> to:>>>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>>>>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you can>>
> catch up in the archives at:>>
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share now!>>>>
> Thanks!!>>>> Marie Cora>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>

 __________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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From bcarmel at rocketmail.com  Tue Oct 30 10:24:02 2007
From: bcarmel at rocketmail.com (Bruce C)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 07:24:02 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 1038] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <d6f6c61539965de44dc76238518fe13a@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <204599.61506.qm@web37905.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hi Andrea
  Sounds interesting. I'd like to learn more. Where can I find this research? 
  Thanks from Bruce Carmel
  

Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net> wrote:
  There is brain research which shows that when the TEACHER focuses on a 
certain aspect of reading or learning, he STUDENT will follow this 
lead.

Andrea

On Oct 30, 2007, at 7:19 AM, Jackie Coelho wrote:

> Shirley, I agree that an enjoyment of reading is the first step. I
> have been reading small novels with my Pre-GED level students for
> three years now. And when we finish one book, they are always quick to
> ask what the next will be. They really enjoy spending time discussing
> the characters, the issues and relating all to themselves. Last week
> we read a text that explains in detail why leaves change color and
> then fall off. The next day a student told me she had never looked at
> fall foliage the way she does now.
> If a student enjoys reading or sees a real purpose to it, he or she
> does it more than willingly.
> Jackie
>
> On 10/29/07, shirley ledet wrote:
>> I agree, however by the time I students get to us they need a reason 
>> to
>> read. Discussion brings an interest and desire to read. When very 
>> young
>> children are given that desire because of the way it is introduced. 
>> the
>> desire build, the cognitive recognition of reading, thoughts, 
>> imagination
>> and pleasure are place in the lexicon and "walaa" you have a reader. 
>> When
>> this is not done, the students sees reading as a means to end and 
>> therefore
>> drudgery. Telling a students to read whose mantra has become "I hate
>> reading" " I was never good at reading" "I always fail reading" is
>> pointless. We must awaken the desire and the learning will come. With
>> joy.....most of the time.
>> Shirley
>>
>>
>> Wendy Quinones wrote:
>> Actually, all of the GED tests are reading -- even math for the most 
>> part.
>> I think Mary Lynn is right on!
>>
>> On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:
>>>
>>> Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot 
>>> and if
>> students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a 
>> skill.
>> The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The 
>> reason
>> people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do not 
>> play
>> the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I say, 
>> "Shut
>> up and read."
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________> Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007
>> 15:39:46 -0400> From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu> To: assessment at nifl.gov >
>> Subject: [Assessment 1002] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 
>> know!>>
>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical 
>> thinking
>> skills which once our students know how to think in a critical 
>> thinking way
>> they will be successful in achieving their education and other life 
>> goals.
>> However, just like K-12 education, adult education is captured on the 
>> high
>> stakes spinning wheel of accountability which stifles creativity and
>> teachers teach to the test.> Toni Borge> BHCC> Adult Education & 
>> Transitions
>> Program> Boston, MA> ________________________________>
>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
>> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
>> Behalf Of shirley ledet> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM> 
>> To: The
>> Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED 
>> Discussion -
>> what you need to know!> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of 
>> success
>> on standardized test. We need look no further then those who have been
>> successful on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally 
>> gifted,
>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well rounded, 
>> enjoy
>> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like "I don't know, I 
>> just
>> know stuff." Researchers have found that this may be the reason for
>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity 
>> between socio
>> economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking 
>> industry,
>> faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends 
>> to offer
>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure is 
>> to go
>> to school and study hard. My students participate in a quite a few 
>> creative
>> projects and those that "get into it" tend to do better in all 
>> subjects.
>> Those that feel it is a waste of time and they just want to "study 
>> for the
>> GED" are generally frustrated when "all of their hard work does not 
>> pay off
>> like they would like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially 
>> those
>> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on 
>> more
>> creativity!> Shirley Ledet> GED Instructor> NHC-Carver> 
>> djrosen at comcast.net
>> wrote:> Colleagues,> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
>> education -- indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
>> National Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a 
>> presention
>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
>> http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.
>> education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be 
>> competitive
>> without high academic standards AND creativity.> But many GED 
>> teachers and
>> administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED 
>> unless they
>> focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that 
>> creativity is a
>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers, administrators 
>> or
>> policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high 
>> stakes
>> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key 
>> question
>> on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite the
>> panelists to address it.> Is creativity a distraction or is it 
>> essential for
>> success? Why?> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> -------------- 
>> Original
>> message ----------------------> From: "Marie Cora">> Hi everyone,>>>> 
>> We've
>> had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to>> 
>> give a
>> quick reminder where you can get the information on this>> 
>> discussion. For
>> the full announcement, information on guests, and>> suggested 
>> resources go
>> to:>>>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>
>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you 
>> can>>
>> catch up in the archives at:>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>
>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
>> now!>>>>
>> Thanks!!>>>> Marie Cora>> Assessment Discussion List 
>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>
>> Marie Cora>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>> NIFL Assessment 
>> Discussion
>> List Moderator>>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >>>>> From:
>> "Marie Cora"> To:> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what 
>> you need
>> to know!> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000> Hi everyone,> We've 
>> had
>> several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give a 
>> quick
>> reminder where you can get the information on this discussion. For 
>> the full
>> announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go to:>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>
>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you 
>> can catch
>> up in the archives at:
>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>
>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
>> now!>
>> Thanks!!> Marie Cora> Assessment Discussion List Moderator> Marie 
>> Cora>
>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
>> Moderator>
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >
>> -------------------------------> National Institute for
>> Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To 
>> unsubscribe or
>> change your subscription settings, please go to
>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
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>> unsubscribe or
>> change your subscription settings, please go to
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>>>
>>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
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From andreawilder at comcast.net  Tue Oct 30 11:03:05 2007
From: andreawilder at comcast.net (Andrea Wilder)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 11:03:05 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1039] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <204599.61506.qm@web37905.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <204599.61506.qm@web37905.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <7dd0c2b8de8bd9ac35b745d4d97b3bbd@comcast.net>

McCandliss is the researcher. He talked in one part of a speech at the  
Learning and the Brain Conference.  All sessions are recorded, so I  
bought some copies on CD's.

McCandliss used as his example whole word learning and phonetic  
learning--what the teacher focuses on the student will follow.

It's also the white matter, myelinated parts of axons (10,000/neuron)  
that send the electric/chemical signals to the next neuron.  "Speed of  
processing" accounts for a lot of  "intelligence."  "The race to he  
swift," etc.

Andrea

On Oct 30, 2007, at 10:24 AM, Bruce C wrote:

> Hi Andrea
> Sounds interesting. I'd like to learn more. Where can I find this  
> research?
> Thanks from Bruce Carmel
>
>
> Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net> wrote:
>> There is brain research which shows that when the TEACHER focuses on a
>> certain aspect of reading or learning, he STUDENT will follow this
>> lead.
>>
>> Andrea
>>
>> On Oct 30, 2007, at 7:19 AM, Jackie Coelho wrote:
>>
>> > Shirley, I agree that an enjoyment of reading is the first step. I
>> > have been reading small novels with my Pre-GED level students for
>> > three years now. And when we finish one book, they are always quick  
>> to
>> > ask what the next will be. They really enjoy spending time  
>> discussing
>> > the characters, the issues and relating all to themselves. Last week
>> > we read a text that explains in detail why leaves change color and
>> > then fall off. The next day a student told me she had never looked  
>> at
>> > fall foliage the way she does now.
>> > If a student enjoys reading or sees a real purpose to it, he or she
>> > does it more than willingly.
>> > Jackie
>> >
>> > On 10/29/07, shirley ledet wrote:
>> >> I agree, however by the time I students get to us they need a  
>> reason
>> >> to
>> >> read. Discussion brings an interest and desire to read. When very
>> >> young
>> >> children are given that desire because of the way it is introduced.
>> >> the
>> >> desire build, the cognitive recognition of reading, thoughts,
>> >> imagination
>> >> and pleasure are place in the lexicon and "walaa" you have a  
>> reader.
>> >> When
>> >> this is not done, the students sees reading as a means to end and
>> >> therefore
>> >> drudgery. Telling a students to read whose mantra has become "I  
>> hate
>> >> reading" " I was never good at reading" "I always fail reading" is
>> >> pointless. We must awaken the desire and the learning will come.  
>> With
>> >> joy.....most of the time.
>> >> Shirley
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Wendy Quinones wrote:
>> >> Actually, all of the GED tests are reading -- even math for the  
>> most
>> >> part.
>> >> I think Mary Lynn is right on!
>> >>
>> >> On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a  
>> lot
>> >>> and if
>> >> students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a
>> >> skill.
>> >> The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much.  
>> The
>> >> reason
>> >> people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do  
>> not
>> >> play
>> >> the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I  
>> say,
>> >> "Shut
>> >> up and read."
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> ________________________________> Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007
>> >> 15:39:46 -0400> From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu> To:  
>> assessment at nifl.gov >
>> >> Subject: [Assessment 1002] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
>> >> know!>>
>> >> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
>> >> thinking
>> >> skills which once our students know how to think in a critical
>> >> thinking way
>> >> they will be successful in achieving their education and other life
>> >> goals.
>> >> However, just like K-12 education, adult education is captured on  
>> the
>> >> high
>> >> stakes spinning wheel of accountability which stifles creativity  
>> and
>> >> teachers teach to the test.> Toni Borge> BHCC> Adult Education &
>> >> Transitions
>> >> Program> Boston, MA> ________________________________>
>> >> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
>> >> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
>> >> Behalf Of shirley ledet> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>
>> >> To: The
>> >> Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED
>> >> Discussion -
>> >> what you need to know!> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of
>> >> success
>> >> on standardized test. We need look no further then those who have  
>> been
>> >> successful on any type of test. We tend to use terms like  
>> natuarally
>> >> gifted,
>> >> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well rounded,
>> >> enjoy
>> >> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like "I don't  
>> know, I
>> >> just
>> >> know stuff." Researchers have found that this may be the reason for
>> >> disparity between ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity
>> >> between socio
>> >> economic background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking
>> >> industry,
>> >> faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends
>> >> to offer
>> >> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure  
>> is
>> >> to go
>> >> to school and study hard. My students participate in a quite a few
>> >> creative
>> >> projects and those that "get into it" tend to do better in all
>> >> subjects.
>> >> Those that feel it is a waste of time and they just want to "study
>> >> for the
>> >> GED" are generally frustrated when "all of their hard work does not
>> >> pay off
>> >> like they would like." Creativity also leads to retention;  
>> especially
>> >> those
>> >> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on
>> >> more
>> >> creativity!> Shirley Ledet> GED Instructor> NHC-Carver>
>> >> djrosen at comcast.net
>> >> wrote:> Colleagues,> I am a proponent of creativity in adult  
>> literacy
>> >> education -- indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of  
>> the
>> >> National Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a
>> >> presention
>> >> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
>> >> http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.
>> >> education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be
>> >> competitive
>> >> without high academic standards AND creativity.> But many GED
>> >> teachers and
>> >> administrators believe that their students will not pass the GED
>> >> unless they
>> >> focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass the test, that
>> >> creativity is a
>> >> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,  
>> administrators
>> >> or
>> >> policy makers also believe creativity distracts from passing high
>> >> stakes
>> >> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key
>> >> question
>> >> on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I invite  
>> the
>> >> panelists to address it.> Is creativity a distraction or is it
>> >> essential for
>> >> success? Why?> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> --------------
>> >> Original
>> >> message ----------------------> From: "Marie Cora">> Hi  
>> everyone,>>>>
>> >> We've
>> >> had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to>>
>> >> give a
>> >> quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>
>> >> discussion. For
>> >> the full announcement, information on guests, and>> suggested
>> >> resources go
>> >> to:>>>>
>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
>> >> 07creativityGED.html>>>>
>> >> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you
>> >> can>>
>> >> catch up in the archives at:>>
>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>
>> >> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
>> >> now!>>>>
>> >> Thanks!!>>>> Marie Cora>> Assessment Discussion List
>> >> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>
>> >> Marie Cora>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>> NIFL Assessment
>> >> Discussion
>> >> List Moderator>>
>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >>>>> From:
>> >> "Marie Cora"> To:> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what
>> >> you need
>> >> to know!> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000> Hi everyone,> We've
>> >> had
>> >> several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted to give  
>> a
>> >> quick
>> >> reminder where you can get the information on this discussion. For
>> >> the full
>> >> announcement, information on guests, and suggested resources go  
>> to:>
>> >>  
>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
>> 07creativityGED.html>
>> >> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
>> >> can catch
>> >> up in the archives at:
>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>
>> >> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
>> >> now!>
>> >> Thanks!!> Marie Cora> Assessment Discussion List Moderator> Marie
>> >> Cora>
>> >> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
>> >> Moderator>
>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >
>> >> -------------------------------> National Institute for
>> >> Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To
>> >> unsubscribe or
>> >> change your subscription settings, please go to
>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
>> >> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>
>> >> -------------------------------> National Institute for
>> >> Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To
>> >> unsubscribe or
>> >> change your subscription settings, please go to
>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment > Email
>> >> delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >> _________________________________________________________________
>> >>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger  
>> Caf?.
>> >>> Stop
>> >> by today.
>> >>>
>> >> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?
>> >> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
>> >>> -------------------------------
>> >>> National Institute for Literacy
>> >>> Assessment mailing list
>> >>> Assessment at nifl.gov
>> >>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>> >>> Email delivered to teacherwendyq at gmail.com
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> -------------------------------
>> >> National Institute for Literacy
>> >> Assessment mailing list
>> >> Assessment at nifl.gov
>> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
>> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>> >> Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> -------------------------------
>> >> National Institute for Literacy
>> >> Assessment mailing list
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>> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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>> >>
>> >>
>> > -------------------------------
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>> > Assessment mailing list
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>> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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>> > Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net
>> >
>>
>> -------------------------------
>> National Institute for Literacy
>> Assessment mailing list
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>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
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>> Email delivered to bcarmel at rocketmail.com
>
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From mtate at sbctc.edu  Tue Oct 30 11:50:07 2007
From: mtate at sbctc.edu (Michael Tate)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 08:50:07 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 1040] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
In-Reply-To: <1dd5701e0710300423o3addd329m81d600f61d112441@mail.gmail.com>
References: <mailman.1.1193500801.21772.assessment@nifl.gov><D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B103F@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU><0CA6C79FCB4AC642A77B76C17A4316EE0210A7E4@exch-1.sbctc2.local>
	<1dd5701e0710300423o3addd329m81d600f61d112441@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0CA6C79FCB4AC642A77B76C17A4316EE0210AAEA@exch-1.sbctc2.local>

I think the term creativity confuses the issue.  How many of Gardner's
seven intelligences do we teach (or that get taught after the sixth
grade)? Not many, if any at all.  

We teach a little in the logical/math and linguistic intelligences, but
really very little at the metacognitive level that Gardner is talking
about.  Some ABE teachers get in to the inter/intrapersonal, but rarely
at the meta-level.  So that leaves the spatial, musical, body
kinesthetic which are even more rarely used.  Gardner's 8th
intelligence, the naturalistic may show up in some vocational programs,
but hardly ever in an ABE classroom.

In this "get them to work" environment, I can't imagine a funder
tolerating much of what would be labeled "touchy-feely".  It's too bad,
too.  It takes more than having a resume and knowing how to read a tape
measure to succeed in life.

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Jackie Coelho
Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 4:23 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1032] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31

I think this goes back to the "what is creativity" question. Can a
teacher teach creativity? Or can a teacher simply provide a large
enough variety of information and the enthusiasm to seek out more,
thus providing students with the means and motivation to apply the
knowledge in creative ways?

On 10/29/07, Michael Tate <mtate at sbctc.edu> wrote:
>
>
>
> In all the studies I've read, when business leaders are asked what
kind of
> intelligence they want in a worker, they say they want intuitive
thinking .
> They are looking for people who can quickly size up a situation from
> incomplete data, make a decision, and implement a strategy that works.
> They're not looking for the painfully slow (and hugely expensive)
> deliberative process that government  uses.  Adult education is
generally
> unable to offer training in creative thinking because it doesn't have
> teachers who can teach creativity.  That's not likely to change until
adult
> education is provided by a sector that values creativity higher than
> consensus.
>
>
>
> Michael Tate
>
>
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On
> Behalf Of Carver, Mary-Lynn
> Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 1:23 PM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: RE: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
>
>
>
>
>
> Donna Chambers -
>
>
> Well said. I am in total agreement.
>
>
>
>
>
> Where do we start?
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
> Mary Lynn Carver
>
>
> ABE/GED Instructor
>
>
> College of Lake County
>
>
> Building 4, Office 405
>
>
> 19351 W. Washington Street
>
>
> Grayslake, IL  60031
>
>
> Phone:847/543-2677
>
>
> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
>
>
> Fax: 847/543-7580
>
>
>
>
>
> "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be
constantly
> amused" -- Unknown
>
>
>
>
>
> We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping
> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how
to
> learn. --Peter F. Drucker
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of
assessment-request at nifl.gov
> Sent: Sat 10/27/2007 11:00 AM
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
>
>
> Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
>         assessment at nifl.gov
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>         http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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> than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Donna Chambers)
>    2. [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Katherine G)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400
> From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
>         reply-type=original
>
> David and All,
>
> Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.  Critical
thinking is a
> learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can be
nurtured,
> but not necessarily learned..  In Adult Education creativity is not a
> necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount.
>
> I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment programs
such
> as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma
Program.
> This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know and be
able to
> do and this information has changed over the years.  Most states'
education
> systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education seems
to be
> GED driven.  As such, is limited to just what is necessary to pass the
GED.
> The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and assessment
is
> apparent, at least to me.
>
> In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list of
> competencies that need to be learned.  Merely passing a standardized
test
> does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically. Yet,
from the
> perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and policy
makers,
> passing the test has become paramount  in Adult Education. Outcomes
has been
> translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the GED
is
> "good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass the GED,
all
> will be well.   Not necessarily so!
>
> Adult Education needs complete reform.  Let's look at what the
metacognative
> research tells us and design a system around what essential knowledge
and
> skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading skills
into all
> activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a
performance
> based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to know
and be
> able to do today.  Passing the GED will still be an attainable
measure, but
> only one of many that need to be achieved.  Instructors and students
must
> know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and thinking
> skills will lead to passing the test.  A strong foundation will, more
> importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high school
> certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed in
our
> complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from the
beginning
> upon entering AE programs.  Learners must be given the opportunity to
> understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the path to
skill
> building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their goals.
> Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the outcomes
will
> be more meaningful.
>
> Donna  Chambers
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM
> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
> Assessment colleagues,
>
> Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
> shot.
>
> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> both?  And where do critical skills fit in?
>
> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> solving.
>
> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> now adult secondary education programs?
>
> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> creative skills.
>
> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> and creativity.
>
> I invite your comments on this.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
> > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> > test.
> >
> > Toni Borge
> >
> > BHCC
> > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >
> > Boston, MA
> >
> >
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know!
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> > test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> > on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> > just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> > "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> > like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> > activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> > more creativity!
> >
> > Shirley Ledet
> >
> > GED Instructor
> >
> > NHC-Carver
> >
> > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education
> system --
> > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> > academic standards AND creativity.
> >
> > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >
> > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: "Marie Cora"
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to
> > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > > suggested resources go to:
> > >
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > 07creativityGED.html
> > >
> > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> > you can
> > > catch up in the archives at:
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> > >
> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> > >
> > > Thanks!!
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> >
> >
> > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> > on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >
> >
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> > can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> > assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> >
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
now!
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400
> From: "Katherine G" <Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID:
> <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="Windows-1252"
>
> David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs,
especially if
> students are planning to go on to college!  Students who pass the GED
with
> minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas,
and
> weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.  Most
colleges
> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum."  As
we
> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to
develop.
>
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.
Humanities
> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative
forms,
> figures of speech, figurative language, and more.  For students to
truly
> understand history, they must be able to visualize different time
periods.
> Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which
> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.  The list
goes
> on.
>
> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a
GED
> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all.
If
> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing,
if the
> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.  In terms of
more
> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take
that
> home.  Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might
not
> get with GED students.  But especially with students who want to
pursue
> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to
teach
> them to think critically.
>
> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I
haven't
> studied in a long time but did in my past lives.  The essay
demonstrates how
> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED
students can
> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the
> teacher and the class).
> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm
>
> I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED
students
> planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have
> communications between public schools and college to make this happen
if we
> want GED students to succeed.  Part of these discussions should
include
> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.
>
>
> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor
> Prince William County Public Schools
> Adult Education
> P.O. Box 389
> Manassas, VA 20108
> work 703-791-8387
> fax 703-791-8889
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
> Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
> Assessment colleagues,
>
> Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
> shot.
>
> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> both?  And where do critical skills fit in?
>
> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> solving.
>
> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> now adult secondary education programs?
>
> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> creative skills.
>
> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> and creativity.
>
> I invite your comments on this.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
> > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> > test.
> >
> > Toni Borge
> >
> > BHCC
> > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >
> > Boston, MA
> >
> >
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know!
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> > test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> > on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> > just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> > "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> > like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> > activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> > more creativity!
> >
> > Shirley Ledet
> >
> > GED Instructor
> >
> > NHC-Carver
> >
> > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education
> system --
> > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> > academic standards AND creativity.
> >
> > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >
> > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: "Marie Cora"
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to
> > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > > suggested resources go to:
> > >
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > 07creativityGED.html
> > >
> > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> > you can
> > > catch up in the archives at:
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> > >
> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> > >
> > > Thanks!!
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> >
> >
> > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> > on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >
> >
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> > can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> > assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> >
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
now!
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>
>
> End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
> ******************************************
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> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Donna Chambers)
>    2. [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>       (Katherine G)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:10:29 -0400
> From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1006] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID: <005e01c8189a$bfe81f70$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
>         reply-type=original
>
> David and All,
>
> Let's not confuse critical thinking with creativity.  Critical
thinking is a
> learned process, whereas, creativity is a mental vision and can be
nurtured,
> but not necessarily learned..  In Adult Education creativity is not a
> necessary skill, while critical thinking should be paramount.
>
> I work in ASE through competency-based performance assessment programs
such
> as the Adult Diploma Program and the National External Diploma
Program.
> This work has allowed me to focus on what adults need to know and be
able to
> do and this information has changed over the years.  Most states'
education
> systems are moving toward being standards driven.Adult Education seems
to be
> GED driven.  As such, is limited to just what is necessary to pass the
GED.
> The need for competency/proficiency based instruction and assessment
is
> apparent, at least to me.
>
> In today's world, critical thinking should be high on the list of
> competencies that need to be learned.  Merely passing a standardized
test
> does not guarantee that the adult is able to think critically. Yet,
from the
> perspective of the instructors, administrators, students, and policy
makers,
> passing the test has become paramount  in Adult Education. Outcomes
has been
> translated to mean numbers of GED passers. Minimally passing the GED
is
> "good enough" as a good outcome. If the student can just pass the GED,
all
> will be well.   Not necessarily so!
>
> Adult Education needs complete reform.  Let's look at what the
metacognative
> research tells us and design a system around what essential knowledge
and
> skills are needed today, embedding critical thinking/reading skills
into all
> activities. Refocus the outcome from just passing the GED to a
performance
> based demonstration of competencies based on what adults need to know
and be
> able to do today.  Passing the GED will still be an attainable
measure, but
> only one of many that need to be achieved.  Instructors and students
must
> know that building a strong foundation of basic knowledge and thinking
> skills will lead to passing the test.  A strong foundation will, more
> importantly, guarantee success for the next steps beyond high school
> certification and provide the cognitive functional skills needed in
our
> complex world. This must be communicated to the learners from the
beginning
> upon entering AE programs.  Learners must be given the opportunity to
> understand what commitment in time and effort is needed on the path to
skill
> building and filling in gaps process in order to achieve their goals.
> Changing the paradigm will be a win-win for everyone and the outcomes
will
> be more meaningful.
>
> Donna  Chambers
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:53 PM
> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
> Assessment colleagues,
>
> Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
> shot.
>
> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> both?  And where do critical skills fit in?
>
> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> solving.
>
> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> now adult secondary education programs?
>
> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> creative skills.
>
> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> and creativity.
>
> I invite your comments on this.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
> > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> > test.
> >
> > Toni Borge
> >
> > BHCC
> > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >
> > Boston, MA
> >
> >
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know!
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> > test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> > on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> > just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> > "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> > like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> > activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> > more creativity!
> >
> > Shirley Ledet
> >
> > GED Instructor
> >
> > NHC-Carver
> >
> > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education
> system --
> > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> > academic standards AND creativity.
> >
> > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >
> > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: "Marie Cora"
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to
> > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > > suggested resources go to:
> > >
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > 07creativityGED.html
> > >
> > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> > you can
> > > catch up in the archives at:
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> > >
> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> > >
> > > Thanks!!
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> >
> >
> > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> > on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >
> >
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> > can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> > assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> >
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
now!
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400
> From: "Katherine G" <Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> Message-ID:
> <MHEMKJNHLDIEMGGCCKCCMEFEDMAA.Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="Windows-1252"
>
> David, I agree that creativity is essential in GED programs,
especially if
> students are planning to go on to college!  Students who pass the GED
with
> minimal ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas,
and
> weigh options are usually at a loss in the college classroom.  Most
colleges
> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum."  As
we
> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to
develop.
>
> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using
> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.
Humanities
> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative
forms,
> figures of speech, figurative language, and more.  For students to
truly
> understand history, they must be able to visualize different time
periods.
> Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which
> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas.  The list
goes
> on.
>
> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students in a
GED
> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at all.
If
> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing,
if the
> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.  In terms of
more
> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take
that
> home.  Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might
not
> get with GED students.  But especially with students who want to
pursue
> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to
teach
> them to think critically.
>
> Finally, I just now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I
haven't
> studied in a long time but did in my past lives.  The essay
demonstrates how
> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED
students can
> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the
> teacher and the class).
> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm
>
> I'm a firm believer in extensive transitional services for GED
students
> planning to attend college, and I think it's essential to have
> communications between public schools and college to make this happen
if we
> want GED students to succeed.  Part of these discussions should
include
> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.
>
>
> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor
> Prince William County Public Schools
> Adult Education
> P.O. Box 389
> Manassas, VA 20108
> work 703-791-8387
> fax 703-791-8889
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
> Behalf Of David J. Rosen
> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
>
>
> Assessment colleagues,
>
> Toni asked what we mean by creativity.  Good question. I'll give it a
> shot.
>
> Is creativity a means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching
> approaches will more students have more and higher academic skills,
> better test scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we
> want students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or
> both?  And where do critical skills fit in?
>
> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic
> skills and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both
> these catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary
> education (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the
> opportunity to have academic skills that are strong enough to succeed
> in college, strong critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable
> from strong academic skills), and the skills of creative problem
> solving.
>
> Since this is the assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> now adult secondary education programs?
>
> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through standardized tests
> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and if so how?
> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is measuring
> creative skills.
>
> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the
> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I
> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high
> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only traditional
> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills
> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different
> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a range of
> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, a moving
> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, or
> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead to
> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thinking (what we now
> often describe as "thinking outside the box").
>
> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should
> they be? Not necessarily.  But for students who see the GED or high
> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable
> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to
> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be
> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking
> and creativity.
>
> I invite your comments on this.
>
> David J. Rosen
> djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:
>
> > When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching critical
> > thinking skills which once our students know how to think in a
> > critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
> > education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 education,
> > adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning wheel of
> > accountability which stifles creativity and teachers teach to the
> > test.
> >
> > Toni Borge
> >
> > BHCC
> > Adult Education & Transitions Program
> >
> > Boston, MA
> >
> >
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-
> > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet
> > Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List
> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know!
> >
> >
> >
> > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized
> > test.  We need look no further then those who have been successful
> > on any type of test.  We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,
> > just smart, etc.  If you speak to these folks they are well
> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like
> > "I don't know, I just know stuff."  Researchers have found that
> > this may be the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe
> > there is more disparity between socio economic background then
> > ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, faculty,
> > medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to offer
> > more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only exposure
> > is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
> > quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to
> > do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of time
> > and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally frustrated
> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would
> > like."  Creativity also leads to retention; especially those
> > activities that have to be completed in increments.  Let's bring on
> > more creativity!
> >
> > Shirley Ledet
> >
> > GED Instructor
> >
> > NHC-Carver
> >
> > djrosen at comcast.net wrote:
> >
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy education --
> > indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National
> > Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a presention
> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://
> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education
> system --
> > and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high
> > academic standards AND creativity.
> >
> > But many GED teachers and administrators believe that their
> > students will not pass the GED unless they focus on skills and
> > knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a
> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,
> > administrators or policy makers also believe creativity distracts
> > from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this
> > issue, but it's the key question on the minds of many GED teachers
> > and administrators, so I invite the panelists to address it.
> >
> > Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for success? Why?
> >
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> > -------------- Original message ----------------------
> > From: "Marie Cora"
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to
> > > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this
> > > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and
> > > suggested resources go to:
> > >
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> > 07creativityGED.html
> > >
> > > If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple -
> > you can
> > > catch up in the archives at:
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html
> > >
> > > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> > now!
> > >
> > > Thanks!!
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Marie Cora
> > > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> > > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> > > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: "Marie Cora" <marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>
> > To: <Assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> >
> >
> > We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I
> > wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the information
> > on this discussion.  For the full announcement, information on
> > guests, and suggested resources go to:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html
> >
> >
> >
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you
> > can catch up in the archives at:  http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/
> > assessment/2007/date.html
> >
> >
> >
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
now!
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks!!
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie Cora
> >
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
> >
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
> >
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to msledet at yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -------------------------------
> > National Institute for Literacy
> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
>
>
>
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
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> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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>
>
>
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>
> -------------------------------
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> Assessment mailing list
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> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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>
> End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 31
> ******************************************
>
>
> -------------------------------
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From bcarmel at rocketmail.com  Tue Oct 30 11:50:48 2007
From: bcarmel at rocketmail.com (Bruce C)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 08:50:48 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Assessment 1041] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking
In-Reply-To: <2D916EB3-B229-48D1-8C81-BCEB7D8FD785@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <774810.99004.qm@web37905.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Thank you David for your comments. 
  In New York City, there are many problems with GED students who are not adequately prepared for college. While the GED exam is full of contextualized questions, entrance exams to the City University of New York (CUNY) are more abstract. Students whose instruction has been narrowly focused on passing the GED test are likely to have a tough time in college. CUNY's completion rates, especially at the community college level, support the assertion that many, many people entering college are not academically prepared. 
   
  I agree with Mary Lynn that we must respect the goals of the students. All of our students say the goal is to get the GED and then go to college or get a job. If I am to respect this goal, it's my job to prepare them for that as best I can. Respecting students' goals means I share my knowledge and experience with them. They don't know that college skills are somewhat different from GED skills. It's quite a challenge to attend to their goals, but also help them broaden and clarify their goals. I don't think it's paternalistic/maternalistic to bring what I know to the classroom. 
   
  We are not going to "teach to the test" and send academically unprepared people into a college setting they can't handle. 
   
  From Bruce Carmel
  
"David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net> wrote:
    Mary Lynn wrote:
  

  I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.  

Creativity need not be nebulous. For example, here's a good definition from the Wikipedia:  

  "Creativity (or creativeness) is a mental process involving the generation of new ideas or concepts, or new associations between existing ideas or concepts."  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity
  

  I am sure you can see the direct application of this kind of creativity to scoring high on the GED tests, for example in writing a good essay, and perhaps in other areas. Equally important -- for students who believe that GED preparation is the key to success in post-secondary education and some kinds of job skills training -- generating new ideas or concepts and making associations between existing ideas or concepts is essential for success.
  

  Let me return to the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, Marc Tucker's claim that if the U.S. is to be competitive, if Americans are to have good jobs, they not only need strong basic skills and some college education, but they also need to be creative, that this is the cultural edge that leads to innovation and invention, that makes the American economy strong, and will enable American workers to thrive. Some adult education students, of course, don't care about that.  They want the GED for other reasons, and that's fine. Let them fast track to the test.  Those who want GED prepararation for college and good jobs, however, will need more: stronger academic skills to succeed in college, and -- if Tucker is right -- skills in the mental processes to generate new ideas or concepts, and new associations between existing concepts, and perhaps other kinds of creativity.
  

  Mary Lynn, I would like to challenge the belief that we "owe [it] to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible." This has not produced good results for adult students whose goal is to succeed in college.  Only a very small percentage of adult GED holders actually succeed in college, often because they lack the academic reading and writing skills, and numeracy (especially algebra) that they need to enroll in regular (not developmental) courses. Unfortunately way too many use up their college financial aide in college developmental courses and then have to drop out before achieving a certificate or degree.  Many of these students will need to take the time to prepare for college in their GED preparation program, not fast track to the GED test.
  

  David J. Rosen
  djrosen at comcast.net
  

  

      On Oct 29, 2007, at 3:27 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:

  
I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills; critical thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against teachers wasting student time with too much talking, both by students and by themselves, and calling it "creativity". In order to be able to pass the tests, students must grapple with the five subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively discussions, though interesting, can keep students from doing what they need to do to be able to pass. Adult education students have busy lives and have little time to get their GED. I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.
> From: andreawilder at comcast.net
> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400
> To: assessment at nifl.gov
> Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
> 
> Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you two (Mary 
> Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what would 
> I see???
> would there be a real difference?
> Thanks.
> 
> Andrea
> On Oct 29, 2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:
> 
> > Wow, I must say I disagree with Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents 
> > come in just wanting to pass the test, but have no critical thinking 
> > or transitional college skills. If we don't help them understand and 
> > acquire some of those skills, they will not be able to succeed with 
> > the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think it is one 
> > of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they need to 
> > succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is 
> > paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Mary Lynn Carver
> > ABE/GED Instructor
> > College of Lake County
> > Building 4, Office 405
> > 19351 W. Washington Street
> > Grayslake, IL 60031
> > Phone:847/543-2677
> > mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
> > Fax: 847/543-7580
> >
> > "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be 
> > constantly amused" -- Unknown
> >
> > We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping 
> > abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how 
> > to learn. --Peter F. Drucker
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of 
> > assessment-request at nifl.gov
> > Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM
> > To: assessment at nifl.gov
> > Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
> >
> >
> >
> > Send Assessment mailing list submissions to
> > assessment at nifl.gov
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > assessment-request at nifl.gov
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > assessment-owner at nifl.gov
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills
> > (David J. Rosen)
> > 2. [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > (Mary Lynn Simons)
> > 3. [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > (Andrea Wilder)
> > 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
> > (David J. Rosen)
> > 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity (David J. 
> > Rosen)
> > 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > (Donna Chambers)
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400
> > From: David J. Rosen <djrosen at comcast.net>
> > Subject: [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills
> > To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List <technology at nifl.gov>,
> > The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List
> > <professionaldevelopment at nifl.gov>, The Assessment 
> > Discussion List
> > <assessment at nifl.gov>, The Adult English Language Learners 
> > Discussion
> > List <englishlanguage at nifl.gov>
> > Message-ID: <1BB3689A-BB68-4D01-9B2E-5FCFC26EC3B9 at comcast.net>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
> > format=flowed
> >
> > Colleagues,
> >
> > The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
> > based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms
> > and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
> > videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
> >
> > ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy
> > tutoring)
> > ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
> > ? OTAN (integrating technology)
> > and
> > ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
> > learners can and cannot do with literacy)
> >
> > I hope you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or
> > tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am
> > hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
> > adult literacy education classroom videos.
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000
> > From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
> > Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Message-ID: <BAY115-W323773268663F2FF780147BF900 at phx.gbl>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
> >
> >
> > Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them 
> > accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically 
> > decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to 
> > be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to 
> > college or training as fast as possible.
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------> From: 
> > Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 
> > 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - 
> > what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential 
> > in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to 
> > college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely 
> > think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are 
> > usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require 
> > program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know, 
> > writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>> 
> > Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using> 
> > rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. 
> > Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement 
> > creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For 
> > students to truly> understand history, they must be able to vi
> > sualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into 
> > statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations 
> > are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in 
> > another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are 
> > not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the 
> > instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if 
> > the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of 
> > more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need 
> > to take that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline 
> > that we might not> get with GED students. But especially with students 
> > who want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to 
> > have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just 
> > now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a 
> > long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how> 
> > creativity is used in the co
> > llege classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in college 
> > (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher and the 
> > class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm 
> > believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> planning 
> > to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> communications 
> > between public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED 
> > students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include> 
> > creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine 
> > Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County 
> > Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108> 
> > work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> 
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
> > [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen> 
> > Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion 
> > List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need
> > to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by 
> > creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a 
> > means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will 
> > more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test 
> > scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want 
> > students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And 
> > where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does, 
> > that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would 
> > put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and 
> > as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should 
> > provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that 
> > are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking 
> > skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and 
> > the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the 
> > assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring
> >> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, 
> >> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical 
> >> thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in 
> >> adult literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc 
> >> Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest 
> >> economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree 
> >> with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high> 
> >> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only 
> >> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important 
> >> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and 
> >> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a 
> >> range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image, 
> >> a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language, 
> >> or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead 
> >> to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin
> > king (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>> 
> > Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> 
> > they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> 
> > school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> 
> > employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> 
> > successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be> 
> > teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking> 
> > and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> 
> > djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F 
> > wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching 
> > critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how to think 
> > in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving 
> > their>> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12 
> > education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning 
> > wheel of>> accountability which stifle
> > s creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> 
> > BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> 
> > From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> 
> > bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 
> > 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: 
> > [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> 
> > I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> 
> > test. We need look no further then those who have been successful>> on 
> > any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just 
> > smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy 
> > reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, 
> > I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the 
> > reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more 
> > disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure 
> > to the arts, banking industry, faculty
> > ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to 
> > offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only 
> > exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate 
> > in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend 
> > to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of 
> > time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally 
> > frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they 
> > would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> 
> > activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> 
> > more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> 
> > NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a 
> > proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed in all 
> > education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for 
> > Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to the 
> > National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// <http:///>
> >>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> 
> >>> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without 
> >>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers 
> >>> and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass the 
> >>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the 
> >>> test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many 
> >>> K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe 
> >>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be 
> >>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the 
> >>> minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the 
> >>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it 
> >>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> 
> >>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message 
> >>> ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> 
> >>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> 
> >>> wanted to>>> give a qu
> > ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion. 
> > For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested 
> > resources go to:>>>>>> 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>> 
> > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - 
> > there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>> 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please 
> > post your questions and also your own experiences to share>> 
> > now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List 
> > Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> 
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
> > Moderator>>> 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: 
> > "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what 
> > you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi 
> > everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day, 
> > and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you
> > can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full 
> > announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go 
> > to:>>>>>>>> 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
> > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? 
> > there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at: 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> 
> > Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
> > now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion 
> > List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List 
> > Moderator>>>> 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> 
> > ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> 
> > Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or 
> > change your subscription settings, please go to>> 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
> > djrosen at comcast.net>> ------
> > ------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> 
> > Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or 
> > change your subscription settings, please go to>> 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
> > msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National 
> > Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> 
> > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> > settings, please go to>> 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to 
> > djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National 
> > Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> 
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to> 
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to 
> > kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National 
> > Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> 
> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings
> > , please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 
> > delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. 
> > Stop by today.
> > http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html? 
> > ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 3
> > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400
> > From: Andrea Wilder <andreawilder at comcast.net>
> > Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Message-ID: <9e32f2dbe2ba96b51be97f5819a91d2c at comcast.net>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
> > format=flowed
> >
> > Hi Mary Lynn--
> >
> > One of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been: "Don't
> > waste their time." Is this what you are getting at?
> >
> > Andrea
> >
> > On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them
> >> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically
> >> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to
> >> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to
> >> college or training as fast as possible.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ----------------------------------------> From:
> >> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct
> >> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion -
> >> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential
> >> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to
> >> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely
> >> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are
> >> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require
> >> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,
> >> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>
> >> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>
> >> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.
> >> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement
> >> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For
> >> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize
> >> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics
> >> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to
> >> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another
> >> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not
> >> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor
> >> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students
> >> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>
> >> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take
> >> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we
> >> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who
> >> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to
> >> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just
> >> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a
> >> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>
> >> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED
> >> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent,
> >> depending on the> teacher and the class).
> >> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in
> >> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend
> >> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between
> >> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED
> >> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>
> >> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine
> >> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County
> >> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>
> >> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->
> >> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> >> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>
> >> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion
> >> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
> >> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by
> >> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a
> >> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will
> >> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test
> >> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want
> >> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And
> >> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,
> >> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would
> >> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and
> >> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should
> >> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that
> >> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking
> >> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and
> >> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the
> >> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary
> >> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
> >> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and
> >> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education
> >> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not
> >> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the
> >> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that
> >> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for
> >> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED
> >> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look
> >> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to
> >> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent
> >> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other
> >> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and
> >> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of
> >> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the
> >> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have.
> >> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED
> >> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone
> >> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door
> >> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should
> >> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical
> >> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J.
> >> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,
> >> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean
> >> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how
> >> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in
> >> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like
> >> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes
> >> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and
> >> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult
> >> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:
> >> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On
> >> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>
> >> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:
> >> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that
> >> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need
> >> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of
> >> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc.
> >> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading,
> >> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just
> >> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for
> >> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity
> >> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the
> >> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of
> >> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing
> >> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.
> >> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those
> >> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that
> >> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED"
> >> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay
> >> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention;
> >> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments.
> >> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED
> >> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>
> >> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
> >> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of
> >> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a
> >> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,
> >> http:// <http:///> >> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. 
> >> education
> >> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive
> >> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED
> >> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not
> >> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to
> >> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.
> >> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe
> >> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be
> >> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds
> >> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists
> >> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for
> >> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>
> >> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie
> >> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the
> >> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can
> >> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement,
> >> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
> >> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday -
> >> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please
> >> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>
> >> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
> >> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>
> >> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> >> Moderator>>>
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:
> >> "Marie Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what
> >> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi
> >> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,
> >> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the
> >> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement,
> >> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/
> >> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?
> >> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>
> >> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share
> >> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion
> >> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
> >> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> >> Moderator>>>>
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>
> >> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or
> >> change your subscription settings, please go to>>
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
> >> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National
> >> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> >> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> >> settings, please go to>>
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
> >> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National
> >> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> >> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
> >> settings, please go to>>
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to
> >> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National
> >> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>
> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to
> >> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National
> >> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>
> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to
> >> macsimoin at hotmail.com
> >>
> >> _________________________________________________________________
> >> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.
> >> Stop by today.
> >> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?
> >> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
> >> -------------------------------
> >> National Institute for Literacy
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> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
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> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 4
> > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400
> > From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> > Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Message-ID: <0570AB67-85EE-4F24-AF0B-2E657CB60778 at comcast.net>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
> > format=flowed
> >
> > ....and the Web address for MLoTS is:
> >
> > http://www.mlots.org <http://www.mlots.org/>
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> >
> > On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:
> >
> >> Colleagues,
> >>
> >> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web-
> >> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms
> >> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy
> >> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:
> >>
> >> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy
> >> tutoring)
> >> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),
> >> ? OTAN (integrating technology)
> >> and
> >> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL
> >> learners can and cannot do with literacy)
> >>
> >> I hope you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or
> >> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am
> >> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for
> >> adult literacy education classroom videos.
> >>
> >> David J. Rosen
> >> djrosen at comcast.net
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -------------------------------
> >> National Institute for Literacy
> >> Assessment mailing list
> >> Assessment at nifl.gov
> >> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
> >> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> >> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 5
> > Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400
> > From: "David J. Rosen" <djrosen at comcast.net>
> > Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity
> > To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Message-ID: <65D538BA-4A9D-42EE-A726-89161F3F5D5C at comcast.net>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed
> >
> > Hello Andrea,
> >
> > On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:
> >
> >> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading
> >> and 2. creativity?
> >
> > Here's more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite
> > unlikely that we will agree on a definition. There are more than 60
> > of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far
> > as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for
> > creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be
> > taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that
> > some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that
> > it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the
> > kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would
> > agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might
> > differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in
> > different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and
> > in the creative problem solving of daily living.
> >
> > In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was
> > thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as
> > innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe
> > Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically
> > valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic
> > success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education
> > systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.
> >
> > Are adult literacy education students (including basic education,
> > secondary education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If
> > so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In
> > many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even
> > acknowledged in program goals or objectives. And I have never seen
> > it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value
> > and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we
> > are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should
> > value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to
> > nourish creativity.
> >
> > What do you think about this?
> >
> >
> > * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of
> > creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:
> > Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.
> >
> > David J. Rosen
> > djrosen at comcast.net
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 6
> > Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400
> > From: "Donna Chambers" <donnaedp at cox.net>
> > Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> > To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Message-ID: <001f01c81958$da000530$8e5fdd48 at DH89L251>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
> > reply-type=original
> >
> > Mary Lynn,
> >
> > Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief. I am not
> > suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for 
> > just
> > "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our 
> > job.
> > Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of a 
> > high
> > school student and be ready to transition to college level academics 
> > is in
> > the learners' best interest in respect to time and money. Community
> > College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they 
> > do. If
> > the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter 
> > community
> > college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, but 
> > it is
> > not. Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic 
> > and
> > secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of Adult Literacy.
> >
> > Donna Chambers
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Mary Lynn Simons" <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
> > To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
> > Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM
> > Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
> >
> >
> >
> > Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them
> > accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically 
> > decide
> > what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able 
> > to
> > pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or
> > training as fast as possible.
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------> From: 
> > Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:
> > assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:
> > [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David, 
> > I
> > agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if> 
> > students
> > are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with> 
> > minimal
> > ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh
> > options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges>
> > require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As 
> > we>
> > know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to 
> > develop.>>
> > Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>
> > rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more. 
> > Humanities>
> > courses demand students to understand and even implement creative 
> > forms,>
> > figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to 
> > truly>
> > understand history, they must be able to visualize different time 
> > periods.>
> > Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which>
> > graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list 
> > goes>
> > on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students 
> > in a
> > GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at 
> > all.
> > If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are 
> > writing, if
> > the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of 
> > more>
> > formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take 
> > that>
> > home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might 
> > not>
> > get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue>
> > higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to 
> > teach>
> > them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay 
> > from
> > Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past 
> > lives.
> > The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college 
> > classroom as
> > well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not 
> > to this
> > extent, depending on the> teacher and the class).
> > http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in
> > extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend
> > college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between 
> > public
> > schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to 
> > succeed.
> > Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected 
> > in
> > every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online
> > Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education> 
> > P.O. Box
> > 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax
> > 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:
> > assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> 
> > Behalf
> > Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The
> > Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED 
> > Discussion -
> > what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we 
> > mean
> > by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a 
> > means
> > to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more 
> > students
> > have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is 
> > creativity
> > itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically
> > prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit 
> > in?>> I
> > would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic> 
> > skills
> > and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these
> > catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary> 
> > education
> > (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to 
> > have
> > academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong
> > critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong 
> > academic
> > skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is 
> > the
> > assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary
> > education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through
> > standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and 
> > if so
> > how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is 
> > measuring>
> > creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying 
> > attention to
> > one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of 
> > the
> > U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus 
> > on
> > high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only 
> > traditional>
> > basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills> 
> > like
> > the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different> 
> > perspectives,
> > the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability 
> > to
> > represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a 
> > metaphor or
> > other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand 
> > and
> > follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of
> > thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the 
> > box").>> Are
> > these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should> 
> > they be?
> > Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school 
> > diploma as
> > a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and
> > self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful 
> > post-secondary
> > learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring:
> > academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I 
> > invite
> > your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On 
> > Oct 26,
> > 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to
> > creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once 
> > our
> > students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be
> > successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals. 
> > However,
> > just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high 
> > stakes
> > spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and 
> > teachers
> > teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & 
> > Transitions
> > Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> > [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> 
> > Sent:
> > Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion 
> > List>>
> > Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
> > know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on
> > standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been
> > successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally
> > gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>>
> > rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> 
> > "I
> > don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may 
> > be
> > the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more
> > disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure 
> > to
> > the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part 
> > of
> > your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing 
> > then
> > someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My 
> > students
> > participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get 
> > into
> > it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste 
> > of
> > time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally 
> > frustrated>>
> > when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like."
> > Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that 
> > have
> > to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> 
> > Shirley
> > Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net 
> > wrote:>>>>
> > Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy
> > education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of 
> > the
> > National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a 
> > presention>>
> > recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http:// 
> > <http:///> >>
> > www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->> 
> > and he
> > includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic
> > standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators
> > believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus 
> > on
> > skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>>
> > "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators 
> > or
> > policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high 
> > stakes
> > tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key
> > question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I 
> > invite
> > the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it
> > essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>
> > djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original
> > message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi 
> > everyone,>>>>>>
> > We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted 
> > to>>>
> > give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>
> > discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>
> > suggested resources go to:>>>>>>
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>
> > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - 
> > there
> > were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>
> > http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please 
> > post
> > your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>
> > Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List
> > Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> 
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>
> > NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: 
> > "Marie
> > Cora" >> To: >> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you 
> > need to
> > know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>> 
> > We?ve
> > had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to 
> > give a
> > quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion. 
> > For
> > the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested 
> > resources go
> > to:>>>>>>>>
> > http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/ 
> > 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>
> > If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>> 
> > can
> > catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>
> > assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also 
> > your
> > own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
> > Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>
> > marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List
> > Moderator>>>>
> > http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>> 
> > ------------------------------->>
> > National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> > settings,
> > please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
> > delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>
> > National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> > settings,
> > please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
> > delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> 
> > ------------------------------->>
> > National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>
> > Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> > settings,
> > please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email
> > delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->
> > National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>
> > Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> > settings,
> > please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
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> > National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>
> > Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
> > settings,
> > please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email
> > delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?. 
> > Stop by
> > today.
> > http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html? 
> > ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline
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> > Assessment mailing list
> > Assessment at nifl.gov
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> >
> >
> >
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> > To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to 
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> >
> >
> > End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33
> > ******************************************
> >
> >
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From MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDU  Tue Oct 30 13:32:27 2007
From: MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDU (Carver, Mary-Lynn)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 12:32:27 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1042] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 48
References: <mailman.59377.1193760508.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
Message-ID: <D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B104E@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>

This may be a really petty point, but I want to go on record as the Mary Lynn who COMPLETELY agrees with David Rosen and others who believe that our students need as many critical thinking and college success strategies as we can give them - at the same time they are achieving their goal of attaining a GED and becoming better readers.  
 
I find it interesting that the two Mary Lynn's have such diametric viewpoints.  Any chance I could ask you to add a last initial when referring to one of us?
 
Thanks,
Mary Lynn Carver
ABE/GED Instructor
 
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From lloyd_david at creativeworkplacelearning.org  Tue Oct 30 14:34:04 2007
From: lloyd_david at creativeworkplacelearning.org (Lloyd David)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 14:34:04 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1043] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!
In-Reply-To: <1dd5701e0710300419h22768734p27ce482309125ca6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <ad2cc1ef0710261423n49c5f99o20946f7fadfc1a70@mail.gmail.com><146640.56583.qm@web90407.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<1dd5701e0710300419h22768734p27ce482309125ca6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <001901c81b23$74ea3310$3a64a8c0@DirectorEVO>

Jackie,
I was very pleased to learn about your success in getting students to find
enjoyment in reading. In the CWL Adult Diploma Program the first class is
English, and students are required to read a short novel. In the past we
have chosen "Lilies of the Field". They discussed it in class, were given
quizzes, and asked to write essays on particular subjects. Afterwards they
were asked to write a book report on a novel of their choice. Many picked "
A Perfect Storm" and "The Joy Luck Club". Prior to reading "Lilies of the
Field", most students had never read a novel in English. I believe these
assignments prepared them for work in the later courses.
Lloyd

Lloyd David, EdD.
Creative Workplace Learning
311 Washington Street
Brighton, MA 02135
Tel :  617-783-6360 
FAX: 617-782-0136

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Jackie Coelho
Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 7:19 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1031] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!

Shirley, I agree that an enjoyment of reading is the first step. I have been
reading small novels with my Pre-GED level students for three years now. And
when we finish one book, they are always quick to ask what the next will be.
They really enjoy spending time discussing the characters, the issues and
relating all to themselves. Last week we read a text that explains in detail
why leaves change color and then fall off. The next day a student told me
she had never looked at fall foliage the way she does now.
If a student enjoys reading or sees a real purpose to it, he or she does it
more than willingly.
Jackie

On 10/29/07, shirley ledet <msledet at yahoo.com> wrote:
> I agree, however by the time I students get to us they need a reason 
> to read. Discussion brings an interest and desire to read. When very 
> young children are given that desire because of the way it is 
> introduced.  the desire build, the cognitive recognition of reading, 
> thoughts, imagination and pleasure are place in the lexicon and 
> "walaa" you have a reader. When this is not done, the students sees 
> reading as a means to end and therefore drudgery. Telling a students 
> to read whose mantra has become "I hate reading" " I was never good at 
> reading" "I always fail reading" is pointless.  We must awaken the 
> desire and the learning will come. With joy.....most of the time.
> Shirley
>
>
> Wendy Quinones <teacherwendyq at gmail.com> wrote:
> Actually, all of the GED tests are reading -- even math for the most part.
> I think Mary Lynn is right on!
>
> On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot 
> > and if
> students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a skill.
> The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The 
> reason people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people 
> do not play the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and 
> on. I say, "Shut up and read."
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________> Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007
> 15:39:46 -0400> From: tborge at bhcc.mass.edu> To: assessment at nifl.gov >
> Subject: [Assessment 1002] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 
> know!>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching 
> critical thinking skills which once our students know how to think in 
> a critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving their
education and other life goals.
> However, just like K-12 education, adult education is captured on the 
> high stakes spinning wheel of accountability which stifles creativity 
> and teachers teach to the test.> Toni Borge> BHCC> Adult Education & 
> Transitions
> Program> Boston, MA> ________________________________>
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> On Behalf Of shirley ledet> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM> 
> To: The Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED 
> Discussion - what you need to know!> I agree that creativity is not 
> the enemy of success on standardized test. We need look no further 
> then those who have been successful on any type of test. We tend to 
> use terms like natuarally gifted, just smart, etc. If you speak to 
> these folks they are well rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they 
> tend to use terms like "I don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers 
> have found that this may be the reason for disparity between 
> ethnicity. I believe there is more disparity between socio economic 
> background then ethnicity. Exposure to the arts, banking industry, 
> faculty, medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to 
> offer more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only 
> exposure is to go to school and study hard. My students participate in a
quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend to do better
in all subjects.
> Those that feel it is a waste of time and they just want to "study for 
> the GED" are generally frustrated when "all of their hard work does 
> not pay off like they would like." Creativity also leads to retention; 
> especially those activities that have to be completed in increments. 
> Let's bring on more creativity!> Shirley Ledet> GED Instructor> 
> NHC-Carver> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:> Colleagues,> I am a proponent 
> of creativity in adult literacy education -- indeed in all education. 
> As Marc Tucker, President of the National Center for Education and the 
> Economy, has said in a presention recently to the National Commission 
> on Adult Literacy, http://www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.
> education system -- and he includes adult education, cannot be 
> competitive without high academic standards AND creativity.> But many 
> GED teachers and administrators believe that their students will not 
> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and knowledge needed to pass 
> the test, that creativity is a "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many 
> K-12 teachers, administrators or policy makers also believe creativity 
> distracts from passing high stakes
> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this issue, but it's the key 
> question on the minds of many GED teachers and administrators, so I 
> invite the panelists to address it.> Is creativity a distraction or is 
> it essential for success? Why?> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> 
> -------------- Original message ----------------------> From: "Marie 
> Cora">> Hi everyone,>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the 
> past day, and so I wanted to>> give a quick reminder where you can get 
> the information on this>> discussion. For the full announcement, 
> information on guests, and>> suggested resources go to:>>>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>
> >>> If you missed the posts from yesterday - there were a couple - you 
> can>> catch up in the archives at:>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
> now!>>>> Thanks!!>>>> Marie Cora>> Assessment Discussion List 
> Moderator>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>> NIFL 
> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >>>>> From:
> "Marie Cora"> To:> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you 
> need to know!> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000> Hi everyone,> 
> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I wanted 
> to give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this 
> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and 
> suggested resources go to:> 
> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/07creativityGED.html>
> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you can 
> catch up in the archives at:
> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>
> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share 
> now!> Thanks!!> Marie Cora> Assessment Discussion List Moderator> 
> Marie Cora> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> NIFL Assessment Discussion 
> List Moderator> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment >
> -------------------------------> National Institute for
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From macsimoin at hotmail.com  Tue Oct 30 15:28:40 2007
From: macsimoin at hotmail.com (Mary Lynn Simons)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 19:28:40 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 1044] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 39
In-Reply-To: <D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B104C@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
References: <mailman.58955.1193687705.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
	<D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B104C@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
Message-ID: <BAY115-W38F9DE56200A5419E1BC90BF920@phx.gbl>

Sorry for the misunderstanding...I would not tell a student to "Shut up and read." I meant that teachers should shut up and allow their students to do what is necessary to improve reading skills, that is read. Pre-reading discussions with students are good if they activate what the student already knows about the subject. I am against too much teacher/student talk. Does talking about how to ride a horse make someone a good horse rider? It will help, but getting on the horse and riding teaches the person to ride. 

Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 20:20:52 -0500From: MLCarver at CLCILLINOIS.EDUTo: assessment at nifl.govSubject: [Assessment 1030] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 39

  <<On 10/26/07, Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com> wrote:  Three of the GED tests are reading. If the teacher is talking a lot and if students are talking a lot, students are not reading. Reading is a skill.  The reason most people read poorly is that they don't read much. The reason people type poorly is that they don't type; the reason people do not play the guitar well is that they don't play, and on and on and on. I say, "Shut up and read.">>
 
And here lies my problem with many GED programs. There are a lot of students in GED programs who don't know HOW to read well - as a result of poor schooling or possibly a physiological learning/processing disability. They will not successfully pass the GED if we don't teach them reading strategies, information processing and (the aforementioned) critical thinking skills.  I would never insult an adult student by saying "shut up and read" - it makes the assumption that anyone can do it and if they're in GED in the first place, maybe the reason is because they have a deficit in their reading skills.  When we speak of metacognition, learning styles and strategies for processing materials in class, there is better comprehension, retention and higher scoring on the GED when they take it.  Learning the vocabulary required for each content area is another area that boosts comprehension, so we mix decoding strategies with content area vocabulary.    It takes the same amount of time to frustrate students and reinforce their lifelong humiliation in school as it does to help teach and reinforce the reading and critical thinking skills for success. I choose the latter.

Thanks,
Mary Lynn Carver
ABE/GED Instructor
College of Lake County
Building 4, Office 405
19351 W. Washington Street
Grayslake, IL  60031
Phone:847/543-2677
mlcarver at clcillinois.edu
Fax: 847/543-7580
 
"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be constantly amused" -- Unknown
 
We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how to learn. --Peter F. Drucker 
 
_________________________________________________________________
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From drizikbaer at gmail.com  Tue Oct 30 19:06:22 2007
From: drizikbaer at gmail.com (Daniel Rizik-Baer)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 16:06:22 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 1045]  Family Literacy Intake Questionnaire
Message-ID: <1c1b65fe0710301606o5447b915r6d152fd1c8aa66c8@mail.gmail.com>

Does anyone know of a standard intake questionnaire, or a questionnaire that
they have used that they feel represents the family literacy practices in
the home well? I need to find something to use as an intake method for a new
Parent Education Involvement Program which requires this.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

-- 
Daniel Rizik-Baer
Family Literacy Coordinator
Children Youth and Family Collaborative
(818) 442-4407 cell
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From tarv at chemeketa.edu  Tue Oct 30 19:28:09 2007
From: tarv at chemeketa.edu (Virginia Tardaewether)
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 16:28:09 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 1046] Re: Family Literacy Intake Questionnaire
In-Reply-To: <1c1b65fe0710301606o5447b915r6d152fd1c8aa66c8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1c1b65fe0710301606o5447b915r6d152fd1c8aa66c8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <D63A25821E9AE349ADBAB6BB1F0A766C076377EE@cccmail2.chemeketa.network>

Daniel

Some things I'd check: 1) the readability.  I've seen a number of forms
that weren't at the parents' level. 2) The function-will this form give
you the information you need? 3) How inclusive is the form for all the
families?  This is the start of a relationship and being as inclusive as
possible from the get-go can increase your retention and enrollment. So
who will complete the form in the family, are all adults included, are
children included, etc.?

va

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Daniel Rizik-Baer
Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 4:06 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 1045] Family Literacy Intake Questionnaire

 

Does anyone know of a standard intake questionnaire, or a questionnaire
that they have used that they feel represents the family literacy
practices in the home well? I need to find something to use as an intake
method for a new Parent Education Involvement Program which requires
this. 

Any help would be greatly appreciated. 

-- 
Daniel Rizik-Baer
Family Literacy Coordinator
Children Youth and Family Collaborative
(818) 442-4407 cell 

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From macsimoin at hotmail.com  Tue Oct 30 21:25:43 2007
From: macsimoin at hotmail.com (Mary Lynn Simons)
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 01:25:43 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 1047] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking
In-Reply-To: <2D916EB3-B229-48D1-8C81-BCEB7D8FD785@comcast.net>
References: <mailman.58243.1193577788.788.assessment@nifl.gov>
	<D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B1042@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>
	<69cbc825214882ee73340c228f35e01a@comcast.net>
	<BAY115-W127277FC88A9B618688CEDBF910@phx.gbl> 
	<2D916EB3-B229-48D1-8C81-BCEB7D8FD785@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <BAY115-W15A3A6D39C54A0EE209566BF930@phx.gbl>

 I still say students should get their GED as soon as possible and that it is not our job to hold students back by teaching them not only to pass the test but things we personally think they should know. We are hired to help people pass the test; that is what the taxpayers want us to do and that is why students come to the adult school in the first place.  Also, I think the GED is a pretty good test. One-third of  high school graduates cannot pass it. I don't know what states you all come from, but where I am in California, if someone passes the GED, that is a sign their skills are fairly high, high enough not to spend time on much remediation in the community college. The army used to prefer diploma grads to GED grads, not because the latter were less educated but because diploma grads have more stick-to-itiveness. Perhaps this is true in college also and accounts for the high college dropout rate of GED grads. 

________________________________> From: djrosen at comcast.net> Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 09:30:31 -0400> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment 1035] GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking>> Mary Lynn wrote:> I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.> Creativity need not be nebulous. For example, here's a good definition from the Wikipedia:> "Creativity (or creativeness) is a mental process involving the generation of new ideas or concepts, or new associations between existing ideas or concepts." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity> I am sure you can see the direct application of this kind of creativity to scoring high on the GED tests, for example in writing a good essay, and perhaps in other areas. Equally important -- for students who believe that GED preparation is the key to success in post-secondary education and some kinds of job skills training -- generating new ideas or concepts and making associations between existing ideas or concepts is essential for success.> Let me return to the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, Marc Tucker's claim that if the U.S. is to be competitive, if Americans are to have good jobs, they not only need strong basic skills and some college education, but they also need to be creative, that this is the cultural edge that leads to innovation and invention, that makes the American economy strong, and will enable American workers to thrive. Some adult education students, of course, don't care about that. They want the GED for other reasons, and that's fine. Let them fast track to the test. Those who want GED prepararation for college and good jobs, however, will need more: stronger academic skills to succeed in college, and -- if Tucker is right -- skills in the mental processes to generate new ideas or concepts, and new associations between existing concepts, and perhaps other kinds of creativity.> Mary Lynn, I would like to challenge the belief that we "owe [it] to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible." This has not produced good results for adult students whose goal is to succeed in college. Only a very small percentage of adult GED holders actually succeed in college, often because they lack the academic reading and writing skills, and numeracy (especially algebra) that they need to enroll in regular (not developmental) courses. Unfortunately way too many use up their college financial aide in college developmental courses and then have to drop out before achieving a certificate or degree. Many of these students will need to take the time to prepare for college in their GED preparation program, not fast track to the GED test.> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> On Oct 29, 2007, at 3:27 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:> I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills; critical thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against teachers wasting student time with too much talking, both by students and by themselves, and calling it "creativity". In order to be able to pass the tests, students must grapple with the five subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively discussions, though interesting, can keep students from doing what they need to do to be able to pass. Adult education students have busy lives and have little time to get their GED. I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.>> From: andreawilder at comcast.net>> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400>> To: assessment at nifl.gov>> Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>>> Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you two (Mary>> Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what would>> I see???>> would there be a real difference?>> Thanks.>>>> Andrea>> On Oct 29, 2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:>>>>> Wow, I must say I disagree with Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents>>> come in just wanting to pass the test, but have no critical thinking>>> or transitional college skills. If we don't help them understand and>>> acquire some of those skills, they will not be able to succeed with>>> the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think it is one>>> of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they need to>>> succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is>>> paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.>>>>>> Thanks,>>> Mary Lynn Carver>>> ABE/GED Instructor>>> College of Lake County>>> Building 4, Office 405>>> 19351 W. Washington Street>>> Grayslake, IL 60031>>> Phone:847/543-2677>>> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu>>> Fax: 847/543-7580>>>>>> "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be>>> constantly amused" -- Unknown>>>>>> We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping>>> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how>>> to learn. --Peter F. Drucker>>>>>> ________________________________>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>> Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM>>> To: assessment at nifl.gov>>> Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>>>>>>>>>>> Send Assessment mailing list submissions to>>> assessment at nifl.gov>>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>>>>> You can reach the person managing the list at>>> assessment-owner at nifl.gov>>>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific>>> than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest...">>>>>>>>> Today's Topics:>>>>>> 1. [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David J. Rosen)>>> 2. [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Mary Lynn Simons)>>> 3. [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Andrea Wilder)>>> 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David J. Rosen)>>> 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity (David J.>>> Rosen)>>> 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Donna Chambers)>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> Message: 1>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400>>> From: David J. Rosen>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List>,>>> The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List>>>>, The Assessment>>> Discussion List>>>>, The Adult English Language Learners>>> Discussion>>> List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web->>> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>> tutoring)>>> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>> ? OTAN (integrating technology)>>> and>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>> I hope you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>> adult literacy education classroom videos.>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 2>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000>>> From: Mary Lynn Simons>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID:>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252">>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to>>> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to>>> college or training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to>>> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are>>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require>>> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to vi>>> sualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into>>> statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations>>> are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in>>> another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are>>> not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the>>> instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if>>> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>> more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need>>> to take that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline>>> that we might not> get with GED students. But especially with students>>> who want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to>>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>>>> creativity is used in the co>>> llege classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in college>>> (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher and the>>> class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm>>> believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> planning>>> to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> communications>>> between public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED>>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need>>> to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will>>> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want>>> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would>>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and>>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should>>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that>>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring>>>> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills,>>>> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical>>>> thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in>>>> adult literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc>>>> Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest>>>> economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree>>>> with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high>>>>> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only>>>> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important>>>> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and>>>> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a>>>> range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image,>>>> a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language,>>>> or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead>>>> to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin>>> king (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>>>>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should>>>> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high>>>> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable>>>> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to>>>> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be>>>> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking>>>> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F>>> wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching>>> critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how to think>>> in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving>>> their>> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12>>> education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning>>> wheel of>> accountability which stifle>>> s creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->>>>> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October>>> 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>>>>> test. We need look no further then those who have been successful>> on>>> any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just>>> smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy>>> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know,>>> I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the>>> reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more>>> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure>>> to the arts, banking industry, faculty>>> ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to>>> offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only>>> exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate>>> in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend>>> to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of>>> time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally>>> frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they>>> would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>>>> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>>>>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a>>> proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed in all>>> education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for>>> Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to the>>> National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>>>>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->>>>>>> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without>>>>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers>>>>> and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass the>>>>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the>>>>> test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many>>>>> K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe>>>>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the>>>>> minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the>>>>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it>>>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message>>>>> ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>>>>>> wanted to>>> give a qu>>> ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion.>>> For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested>>> resources go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what>>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you>>> can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full>>> announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your subscription settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------>>> ------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your subscription settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings>>> , please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> Stop by today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 3>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400>>> From: Andrea Wilder>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> Hi Mary Lynn-->>>>>> One of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been: "Don't>>> waste their time." Is this what you are getting at?>>>>>> Andrea>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>>> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to>>>> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to>>>> college or training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> From:>>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>>> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>>> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>>> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to>>>> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>>> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are>>>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require>>>> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,>>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>>> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>>> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>>> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize>>>> different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics>>>> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to>>>> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another>>>> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not>>>> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor>>>> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students>>>> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>>>>> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take>>>> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we>>>> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who>>>> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to>>>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>>> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>>> long time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>>>>> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED>>>> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent,>>>> depending on the> teacher and the class).>>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in>>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend>>>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between>>>> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED>>>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>>> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>>> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>>> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>>> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>>> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>>> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>>> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to>>>> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>>> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>>> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will>>>> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test>>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want>>>> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And>>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,>>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would>>>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and>>>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should>>>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that>>>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>>> skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>>> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>>> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>>> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>>> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and>>>> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education>>>> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not>>>> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the>>>> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that>>>> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for>>>> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED>>>> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look>>>> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to>>>> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent>>>> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other>>>> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and>>>> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of>>>> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the>>>> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have.>>>> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED>>>> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone>>>> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door>>>> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should>>>> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical>>>> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J.>>>> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,>>>> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean>>>> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how>>>> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in>>>> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like>>>> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes>>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and>>>> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult>>>> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:>>>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On>>>> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>>>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:>>>> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that>>>> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need>>>> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of>>>> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc.>>>> If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading,>>>> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just>>>> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for>>>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity>>>> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the>>>> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of>>>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing>>>> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.>>>> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those>>>> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that>>>> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED">>>> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay>>>> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention;>>>> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in increments.>>>> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED>>>> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy>>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of>>>> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a>>>> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,>>>> http://>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.>>>> education>>>> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive>>>> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED>>>> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not>>>> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to>>>> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.>>>> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe>>>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds>>>> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists>>>> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for>>>> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie>>>> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the>>>> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can>>>> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement,>>>> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>>> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>>> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>>> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:>>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what>>>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>>> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>>> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the>>>> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement,>>>> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>>> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion>>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>>> change your subscription settings, please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> settings, please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> settings, please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to>>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to>>>> macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>>> Stop by today.>>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>>> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>> ------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy>>>> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 4>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400>>> From: "David J. Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> ....and the Web address for MLoTS is:>>>>>> http://www.mlots.org>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web->>>> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms>>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy>>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>>>> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>>> tutoring)>>>> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>>> ? OTAN (integrating technology)>>>> and>>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL>>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>>>> I hope you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>>> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>>> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>>> adult literacy education classroom videos.>>>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy>>>> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 5>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400>>> From: "David J. Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed>>>>>> Hello Andrea,>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:>>>>>>> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading>>>> and 2. creativity?>>>>>> Here's more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite>>> unlikely that we will agree on a definition. There are more than 60>>> of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far>>> as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for>>> creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be>>> taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that>>> some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that>>> it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the>>> kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would>>> agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might>>> differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in>>> different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and>>> in the creative problem solving of daily living.>>>>>> In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was>>> thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as>>> innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe>>> Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically>>> valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic>>> success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education>>> systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.>>>>>> Are adult literacy education students (including basic education,>>> secondary education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If>>> so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In>>> many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even>>> acknowledged in program goals or objectives. And I have never seen>>> it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value>>> and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we>>> are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should>>> value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to>>> nourish creativity.>>>>>> What do you think about this?>>>>>>>>> * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of>>> creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:>>> Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 6>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400>>> From: "Donna Chambers">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";>>> reply-type=original>>>>>> Mary Lynn,>>>>>> Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief. I am not>>> suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for>>> just>>> "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our>>> job.>>> Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of a>>> high>>> school student and be ready to transition to college level academics>>> is in>>> the learners' best interest in respect to time and money. Community>>> College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they>>> do. If>>> the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter>>> community>>> college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, but>>> it is>>> not. Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic>>> and>>> secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of Adult Literacy.>>>>>> Donna Chambers>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----->>> From: "Mary Lynn Simons">>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>> decide>>> what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able>>> to>>> pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or>>> training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:>>> assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David,>>> I>>> agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if>>>> students>>> are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with>>>> minimal>>> ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh>>> options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges>>>> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As>>> we>>>> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to>>> develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>> Humanities>>>> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative>>> forms,>>>> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to>>> truly>>>> understand history, they must be able to visualize different time>>> periods.>>>> Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which>>>> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list>>> goes>>>> on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students>>> in a>>> GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at>>> all.>>> If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are>>> writing, if>>> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>> more>>>> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take>>> that>>>> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might>>> not>>>> get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue>>>> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to>>> teach>>>> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay>>> from>>> Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past>>> lives.>>> The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college>>> classroom as>>> well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not>>> to this>>> extent, depending on the> teacher and the class).>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend>>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between>>> public>>> schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to>>> succeed.>>> Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected>>> in>>> every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online>>> Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education>>>> P.O. Box>>> 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax>>> 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:>>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>>>> Behalf>>> Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The>>> Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED>>> Discussion ->>> what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we>>> mean>>> by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means>>> to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more>>> students>>> have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is>>> creativity>>> itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically>>> prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit>>> in?>> I>>> would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>>>> skills>>> and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these>>> catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>>>> education>>> (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to>>> have>>> academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong>>> critical thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong>>> academic>>> skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is>>> the>>> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and>>> if so>>> how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is>>> measuring>>>> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying>>> attention to>>> one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of>>> the>>> U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus>>> on>>> high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only>>> traditional>>>> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills>>>> like>>> the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different>>>> perspectives,>>> the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability>>> to>>> represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a>>> metaphor or>>> other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand>>> and>>> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of>>> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the>>> box").>> Are>>> these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should>>>> they be?>>> Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school>>> diploma as>>> a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and>>> self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful>>> post-secondary>>> learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring:>>> academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I>>> invite>>> your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On>>> Oct 26,>>> 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to>>> creativity do we mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once>>> our>>> students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be>>> successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals.>>> However,>>> just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high>>> stakes>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and>>> teachers>>> teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education &>>> Transitions>>> Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>>>>> Sent:>>> Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion>>> List>>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to>>> know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on>>> standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been>>> successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally>>> gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>>>>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>>>>> "I>>> don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may>>> be>>> the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more>>> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure>>> to>>> the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part>>> of>>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing>>> then>>> someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My>>> students>>> participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get>>> into>>> it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste>>> of>>> time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally>>> frustrated>>>>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like.">>> Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> activities that>>> have>>> to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>>>>> Shirley>>> Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>> wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of>>> the>>> National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a>>> presention>>>>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>>>>>>>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->>>>> and he>>> includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic>>> standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators>>> believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus>>> on>>> skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>>>>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators>>> or>>> policy makers also believe creativity distracts>> from passing high>>> stakes>>> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key>>> question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I>>> invite>>> the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original>>> message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi>>> everyone,>>>>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted>>> to>>>>>> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>>>> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> there>>> were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> post>>> your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:>>> "Marie>>> Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you>>> need to>>> know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We?ve>>> had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a>>> quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion.>>> For>>> the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested>>> resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ? you>>>>> can>>> catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>>>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also>>> your>>> own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> Stop by>>> today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>> ------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>> Assessment mailing list>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> ------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>> Assessment mailing list>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>> End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>> ******************************************>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>> Assessment mailing list>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com> Peek-a-boo FREE Tricks & Treats for You! Get 'em!> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

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From andresmuro at aol.com  Wed Oct 31 12:09:38 2007
From: andresmuro at aol.com (andresmuro at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 12:09:38 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1048] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking
In-Reply-To: <BAY115-W15A3A6D39C54A0EE209566BF930@phx.gbl>
References: <mailman.58243.1193577788.788.assessment@nifl.gov>	<D5165B8FF5A05E41907F21FCD33496D9022B1042@HERMES2K3.CLCILLINOIS.EDU>	<69cbc825214882ee73340c228f35e01a@comcast.net>	<BAY115-W127277FC88A9B618688CEDBF910@phx.gbl>
	<2D916EB3-B229-48D1-8C81-BCEB7D8FD785@comcast.net>
	<BAY115-W15A3A6D39C54A0EE209566BF930@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8C9E9EF92397B0F-A30-5EAF@WEBMAIL-DF12.sysops.aol.com>

 The thing is that students learn better if information relates to their knowledge and experiences. For example, in my program, students have difficulty writing. Once we get them to write about their own experiences, and teach them to do so, they become better writers. They also publish their stories. Also, our students face health barriers and want to learn about health prevention, improvement, access. They also take nutrition classes. Because they are interested in these topics, they learn fast and they remain focused and motivated. Also we have good retention. 

Ultimately, these topics do not deter them to learn information to pass the GED. The GED is basically having good reading, writing and math skills and test taking skills. It doesn't really matter if you teaching them to read by using the Glencoe GED book, or a health brochure, a bag of potato chips, legal information, etc. I do this workshop in which I show teachers that I can teach pretty much all the math skills for the GED using a bag of potato chips. I can also teach reading, writing and graph skills with the same bag. Thing is, bags of potato chips are fascinating to students.? They capture? their imagination and keep them focused and working on task.? They are also learning how to read nutrition labels and how to watch what they eat. 

So, in a sense, teaching the GED and teaching things that are not in the book are not necessarily contradictory things. Also, in my program, in every class,? we have a small percentage of students who have diabetes and don't even know about it. We do a glucose test every semester. Those who have diabetes are referred to the doctor. To us, even if these students don't pass the GED, it is a triumph. We essentially saved limbs, if not lives. In fact, most of these students do get the GED. We also have victims of domestic violence that start to get counseling, support and protection. Many of these people would never get the GED. 

Finally, as I said before, our students get published, which is a huge self esteem builder. You can see the student's writings at http://bordersenses.com/memorias.?  Click on the books below. You can click on traducciones on the right to read the translations. Imagine a GED student who gets published and shows that to her peers, teachers, relatives. How many students ever dream of getting published or think that they have any knowledge worth sharing?

Andres
  

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 7:25 pm
Subject: [Assessment 1047] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking

 I still say students should get their GED as soon as possible and that it is 
not our job to hold students back by teaching them not only to pass the test but 
things we personally think they should know. We are hired to help people pass 
the test; that is what the taxpayers want us to do and that is why students come 
to the adult school in the first place.  Also, I think the GED is a pretty good 
test. One-third of  high school graduates cannot pass it. I don't know what 
states you all come from, but where I am in California, if someone passes the 
GED, that is a sign their skills are fairly high, high enough not to spend time 
on much remediation in the community college. The army used to prefer diploma 
grads to GED grads, not because the latter were less educated but because 
diploma grads have more stick-to-itiveness. Perhaps this is true in college also 
and accounts for the high college dropout rate of GED grads. 

________________________________> From: djrosen at comcast.net> Date: Tue, 30 Oct 
2007 09:30:31 -0400> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment 1035] GED, 
Creativity and Fast-tracking>> Mary Lynn wrote:> I think we owe to to our 
students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. That 
is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a 
nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is 
paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.> Creativity need not be 
nebulous. For example, here's a good definition from the Wikipedia:> "Creativity 
(or creativeness) is a mental process involving the generation of new ideas or 
concepts, or new associations between existing ideas or concepts." 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity> I am sure you can see the direct 
application of this kind of creativity to scoring high on the GED tests, for 
example in writing a good essay, and perhaps in other areas. Equally important 
-- for students who believe that GED preparation is the key to success in 
post-secondary education and some kinds of job skills training -- generating new 
ideas or concepts and making associations between existing ideas or concepts is 
essential for success.> Let me return to the context in which I raised the issue 
of creativity, Marc Tucker's claim that if the U.S. is to be competitive, if 
Americans are to have good jobs, they not only need strong basic skills and some 
college education, but they also need to be creative, that this is the cultural 
edge that leads to innovation and invention, that makes the American economy 
strong, and will enable American workers to thrive. Some adult education 
students, of course, don't care about that. They want the GED for other reasons, 
and that's fine. Let them fast track to the test. Those who want GED 
prepararation for college and good jobs, however, will need more: stronger 
academic skills to succeed in college, and -- if Tucker is right -- skills in 
the mental processes to generate new ideas or concepts, and new associations 
between existing concepts, and perhaps other kinds of creativity.> Mary Lynn, I 
would like to challenge the belief that we "owe [it] to our students to get them 
to community college or training as fast as possible." This has not produced 
good results for adult students whose goal is to succeed in college. Only a very 
small percentage of adult GED holders actually succeed in college, often because 
they lack the academic reading and writing skills, and numeracy (especially 
algebra) that they need to enroll in regular (not developmental) courses. 
Unfortunately way too many use up their college financial aide in college 
developmental courses and then have to drop out before achieving a certificate 
or degree. Many of these students will need to take the time to prepare for 
college in their GED preparation program, not fast track to the GED test.> David 
J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> On Oct 29, 2007, at 3:27 PM, Mary Lynn Simons 
wrote:> I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills; critical 
thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against teachers wasting student time 
with too much talking, both by students and by themselves, and calling it 
"creativity". In order to be able to pass the tests, students must grapple with 
the five subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and 
mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively discussions, though 
interesting, can keep students from doing what they need to do to be able to 
pass. Adult education students have busy lives and have little time to get their 
GED. I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or 
training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to 
decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must respect the 
goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.>> 
From: andreawilder at comcast.net>> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400>> To: 
assessment at nifl.gov>> Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, 
Issue 33>>>> Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you two 
(Mary>> Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what would>> 
I see???>> would there be a real difference?>> Thanks.>>>> Andrea>> On Oct 29, 
2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:>>>>> Wow, I must say I disagree with 
Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents>>> come in just wanting to pass the test, 
but have no critical thinking>>> or transitional college skills. If we don't 
help them understand and>>> acquire some of those skills, they will not be able 
to succeed with>>> the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think 
it is one>>> of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they need 
to>>> succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is>>> 
paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.>>>>>> Thanks,>>> 
Mary Lynn Carver>>> ABE/GED Instructor>>> College of Lake County>>> Building 4, 
Office 405>>> 19351 W. Washington Street>>> Grayslake, IL 60031>>> 
Phone:847/543-2677>>> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu>>> Fax: 847/543-7580>>>>>> 
"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be>>> constantly 
amused" -- Unknown>>>>>> We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong 
process of keeping>>> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach 
people how>>> to learn. --Peter F. Drucker>>>>>> ________________________________>>>>>> 
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>> 
Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM>>> To: assessment at nifl.gov>>> Subject: Assessment 
Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>>>>>>>>>>> Send Assessment mailing list submissions 
to>>> assessment at nifl.gov>>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide 
Web, visit>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> or, via email, 
send a message with subject or body 'help' to>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>>>>> 
You can reach the person managing the list at>>> assessment-owner at nifl.gov>>>>>> 
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific>>> than "Re: 
Contents of Assessment digest...">>>>>>>>> Today's Topics:>>>>>> 1. [Assessment 
1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David J. Rosen)>>> 2. [Assessment 
1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Mary Lynn Simons)>>> 3. 
[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Andrea 
Wilder)>>> 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David 
J. Rosen)>>> 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity (David J.>>> 
Rosen)>>> 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> 
(Donna Chambers)>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> 
Message: 1>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400>>> From: David J. Rosen>>>> 
Subject: [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> To: The 
Technology and Literacy Discussion List>,>>> The Adult Literacy Professional 
Development Discussion List>>>>, The Assessment>>> Discussion List>>>>, The 
Adult English Language Learners>>> Discussion>>> List>>>> Message-ID: >>> 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> 
format=flowed>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills 
(MLoTS) project, a free Web->>> based library of short digital videos of adult 
education classrooms>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and 
numeracy>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>> ? 
NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>> tutoring)>>> ? 
NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>> ? OTAN (integrating 
technology)>>> and>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what 
low-literate ESOL>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>> I hope you 
will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>> tutoring short 
videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>> hoping that MLoTS will 
become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>> adult literacy education classroom 
videos.>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 2>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 
01:01:15 +0000>>> From: Mary Lynn Simons>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED 
Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> 
Message-ID:>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252">>>>>>>>> 
Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>> 
accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>> decide 
what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to>>> be able to 
pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to>>> college or 
training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> 
From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>> 
2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>> what you 
need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>> in GED programs, 
especially if> students are planning to go on to>>> college! Students who pass 
the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>> think creatively, explore abstract 
ideas, and> weigh options are>>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. 
Most colleges> require>>> program elements such as "writing across the 
curriculum." As we> know,>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults 
need to develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding 
and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>> 
Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>> creative 
forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>> students to 
truly> understand history, they must be able to vi>>> sualize different time 
periods.> Symbolic thought translates into>>> statistics and math classes in 
which> graphs, numbers and equations>>> are used to communicate ideas. The list 
goes> on.>> Someone here or in>>> another posting made the remark that students 
in a GED> class who are>>> not reading in class are not practicing reading at 
all. If> the>>> instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, 
if>>> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>> 
more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need>>> to take 
that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline>>> that we might 
not> get with GED students. But especially with students>>> who want to pursue> 
higher education after earning the GED, we need to>>> have the time to teach> 
them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>> now ran across an essay from 
Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>> long time but did in my past lives. 
The essay demonstrates how>>>> creativity is used in the co>>> llege classroom 
as well as what GED students can> expect in college>>> (though perhaps not to 
this extent, depending on the> teacher and the>>> class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> 
I'm a firm>>> believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> 
planning>>> to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> 
communications>>> between public schools and college to make this happen if we> 
want GED>>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>> 
creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>> Mercurio 
Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>> Public Schools> 
Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>> work 703-791-8387> fax 
703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> 
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>> Sent: 
Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>> List> 
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need>>> to know!>>> 
Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>> creativity. Good 
question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means to an end -- that is, 
with creative teaching> approaches will>>> more students have more and higher 
academic skills,> better test>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that 
is, do we> want>>> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> 
both? And>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker 
does,>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would>>> 
put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and>>> as an 
end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should>>> provide 
students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that>>> are strong enough 
to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>> skills (these may be 
inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>> the skills of creative 
problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>> assessment list, let me ask what are we 
measuring>>>> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic 
skills,>>>> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical>>>> 
thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in>>>> adult 
literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc>>>> Tucker is right, 
we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest>>>> economic assets, one of 
the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree>>>> with Tucker and believe that the 
nearly exclusive focus on high>>>>> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the 
focus on only>>>> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects 
important>>>> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly 
and>>>> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a>>>> 
range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image,>>>> a 
moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language,>>>> or> 
rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead>>>> to> 
disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin>>> king (what we now> often 
describe as "thinking outside the box").>>>>> Are these goals that every GED 
student has or should have. No. Should>>>> they be? Not necessarily. But for 
students who see the GED or high>>>> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as 
a stepping stone to stable>>>> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open 
the door to>>>> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we 
should be>>>> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical 
thinking>>>> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. 
Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F>>> 
wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching>>> critical>> 
thinking skills which once our students know how to think>>> in a>> critical 
thinking way they will be successful in achieving>>> their>> education and other 
life goals. However, just like K-12>>> education,>> adult education is captured 
on the high stakes spinning>>> wheel of>> accountability which stifle>>> s 
creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>>>> BHCC>> Adult 
Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>>>> From: 
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->>>>> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf 
Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October>>> 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The 
Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - 
what you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of 
success on standardized>>>>> test. We need look no further then those who have 
been successful>> on>>> any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally 
gifted,>> just>>> smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> 
rounded, enjoy>>> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I 
don't know,>>> I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be 
the>>> reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more>>> 
disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure>>> to the 
arts, banking industry, faculty>>> ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your 
everyday life tends to>>> offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone 
whose only>>> exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students 
participate>>> in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" 
tend>>> to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of>>> 
time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally>>> frustrated>> 
when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they>>> would>> like." 
Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>>>> activities that have 
to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>>>>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley 
Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> 
Colleagues,>>>> I am a>>> proponent of creativity in adult literacy education 
-->> indeed in all>>> education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> 
Center for>>> Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to 
the>>> National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>>>>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html 
, the U.S. education system -->>>>>>> and he includes adult education, cannot be 
competitive without>>>>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many 
GED teachers>>>>> and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass 
the>>>>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the>>>>> 
test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many>>>>> K-12 
teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe>>>>> creativity 
distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>>> the one to raise 
this>> issue, but it's the key question on the>>>>> minds of many GED teachers>> 
and administrators, so I invite the>>>>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is 
creativity a distraction or is it>>>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David 
J. Rosen>>>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message>>>>> 
---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We've had 
several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>>>>>> wanted to>>> give a 
qu>>> ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion.>>> 
For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested>>> resources 
go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 
07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> there 
were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> post 
your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>> now!>>>>>> 
Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion 
List>>> Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
From:>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what>>> 
you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>> 
everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>> and so 
I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you>>> can get the information>> on 
this discussion. For the full>>> announcement, information on>> guests, and 
suggested resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 
07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>> there 
were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> 
assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your 
own experiences to share>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 
Assessment Discussion>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> 
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> 
Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>> 
Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your 
subscription settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 
Email delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------>>> ------------------------->> 
National Institute for Literacy>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your subscription settings, 
please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 
delivered to>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> 
National>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings, 
please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 
delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> 
National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 
please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 
delivered to>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> 
National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings>>> , 
please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered 
to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>> 
Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> Stop by 
today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> 
ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 
3>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400>>> From: Andrea Wilder>>>> Subject: 
[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The 
Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; 
charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> Hi Mary Lynn-->>>>>> One 
of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been: "Don't>>> waste their 
time." Is this what you are getting at?>>>>>> Andrea>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 
9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students 
when they enter and then teach them>>>> accordingly. It is not our job to 
paternalistically/maternalistically>>>> decide what is best for our students 
beyond what they need to know to>>>> be able to pass the test. We must not hold 
them back. Let them get to>>>> college or training as fast as 
possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> From:>>>> 
Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>>> 2007 
09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>>> what you 
need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>>> in GED programs, 
especially if> students are planning to go on to>>>> college! Students who pass 
the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>>> think creatively, explore abstract 
ideas, and> weigh options are>>>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. 
Most colleges> require>>>> program elements such as "writing across the 
curriculum." As we> know,>>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults 
need to develop.>>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding 
and using>>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>>> 
Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>>> 
creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>>> 
students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize>>>> 
different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics>>>> and 
math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to>>>> communicate 
ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another>>>> posting made the 
remark that students in a GED> class who are not>>>> reading in class are not 
practicing reading at all. If> the instructor>>>> is writing on the board, if 
the students are writing, if the> students>>>> are taking practice tests, they 
ARE reading. In terms of more>>>>> formalized, lengthier readings, students will 
most likely need to take>>>> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of 
discipline that we>>>> might not> get with GED students. But especially with 
students who>>>> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need 
to>>>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>>> 
now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>>> long 
time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>>>>> creativity is 
used in the college classroom as well as what GED>>>> students can> expect in 
college (though perhaps not to this extent,>>>> depending on the> teacher and 
the class).>>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm 
believer in>>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to 
attend>>>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications 
between>>>> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED>>>> 
students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>>> creativity 
used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>>> Mercurio 
Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>>> Public Schools> 
Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>>> work 703-791-8387> fax 
703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>>> 
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>>> Sent: 
Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>>> List> 
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to>>>> know!>>> 
Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>>> creativity. Good 
question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>>> means to an end -- that 
is, with creative teaching> approaches will>>>> more students have more and 
higher academic skills,> better test>>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end 
-- that is, do we> want>>>> students to be both academically prepared and 
creative? Or> both? And>>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as 
Marc Tucker does,>>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, 
and I would>>>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a 
means and>>>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs 
should>>>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills 
that>>>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>>> 
skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>>> the 
skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>>> assessment list, 
let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>>> education programs?>> 
? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>>> standardized tests> ? Are we 
measuring critical thinking skills, and>>>> if so how?> ? I am not aware that 
anyone in adult literacy education>>>> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc 
Tucker is right, we are not>>>> paying attention to one of the> greatest 
economic assets, one of the>>>> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with 
Tucker and believe that>>>> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic 
skills tests for>>>> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for 
the GED>>>> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to 
look>>>> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability 
to>>>> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent>>>> 
an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other>>>> 
figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and>>>> follow, 
but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of>>>> thinking 
(what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the>>>> box").>> Are these 
goals that every GED student has or should have.>>>> No. Should> they be? Not 
necessarily. But for students who see the GED>>>> or high> school diploma as a 
way out of poverty, as a stepping stone>>>> to stable> employment and 
self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door>>>> to> successful post-secondary 
learning, these are the skills we should>>>> be> teaching and measuring: 
academic skills, including critical>>>> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite 
your comments on this.>> David J.>>>> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 
2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,>>>> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to 
creativity do we mean>>>> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our 
students know how>>>> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be 
successful in>>>> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, 
just like>>>> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high 
stakes>>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and>>>> 
teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult>>>> Education & 
Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:>>>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
[mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On>>>> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: 
Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>>>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> 
Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:>>>> GED Discussion - what you need to 
know!>>>>>>>> I agree that>>>> creativity is not the enemy of success on 
standardized>> test. We need>>>> look no further then those who have been 
successful>> on any type of>>>> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally 
gifted,>> just smart, etc.>>>> If you speak to these folks they are well>> 
rounded, enjoy reading,>>>> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I 
don't know, I just>>>> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be 
the reason for>>>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more 
disparity>>>> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to 
the>>>> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of>>>> 
your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing>>>> then 
someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.>>>> My students 
participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those>>>> that "get into 
it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that>>>> feel it is a waste of 
time>> and they just want to "study for the GED">>>> are generally frustrated>> 
when "all of their hard work does not pay>>>> off like they would>> like." 
Creativity also leads to retention;>>>> especially those>> activities that have 
to be completed in increments.>>>> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley 
Ledet>>>> GED>>>> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net 
wrote:>>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult 
literacy>>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President 
of>>>> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a>>>> 
presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,>>>> 
http://>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.>>>> education>>>> system 
-->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive>>>> without high>> 
academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED>>>> teachers and 
administrators believe that their>> students will not>>>> pass the GED unless 
they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to>>>> pass the test, that 
creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.>>>> (Many K-12 teachers,>> 
administrators or policy makers also believe>>>> creativity distracts>> from 
passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>> the one to raise this>> issue, but 
it's the key question on the minds>>>> of many GED teachers>> and 
administrators, so I invite the panelists>>>> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a 
distraction or is it essential for>>>> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> 
djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> 
From: "Marie>>>> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers 
over the>>>> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you 
can>>>> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full 
announcement,>>>> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go 
to:>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>>> 
07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>>> there 
were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>>> post 
your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>>> now!>>>>>> 
Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion 
List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
From:>>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - 
what>>>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>>> 
everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>>> and 
so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the>>>> information>> 
on this discussion. For the full announcement,>>>> information on>> guests, and 
suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>> 
07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>>> there 
were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> 
assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your 
own experiences to share>>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 
Assessment Discussion>>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>>> 
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>>> 
Moderator>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>>> 
Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>>> change 
your subscription settings, please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 
Email delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> 
National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> settings, 
please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 
delivered to>>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> 
National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> settings, 
please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 
delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> 
National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 
please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 
delivered to>>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> 
National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 
Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 
please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 
delivered to>>>> macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>>> 
Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>>> Stop by 
today.>>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>>> 
ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>> ------------------------------->>>> National 
Institute for Literacy>>>> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> 
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> Email delivered to 
andreawilder at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> 
Message: 4>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400>>> From: "David J. 
Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> 
To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; 
charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> ....and the Web address 
for MLoTS is:>>>>>> http://www.mlots.org>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> 
djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen 
wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) 
project, a free Web->>>> based library of short digital videos of adult 
education classrooms>>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and 
numeracy>>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>>>> ? 
NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>>> tutoring)>>>> 
? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>>> ? OTAN (integrating 
technology)>>>> and>>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what 
low-literate ESOL>>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>>>> I hope 
you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>>> tutoring short 
videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>>> hoping that MLoTS will 
become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>>> adult literacy education classroom 
videos.>>>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy>>>> 
Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change 
your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> 
Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 5>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 
23:17:38 -0400>>> From: "David J. Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED 
preparation and creativity>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: 
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed>>>>>> 
Hello Andrea,>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:>>>>>>> Has anybody yet in this 
conversation defined 1. critical reading>>>> and 2. creativity?>>>>>> Here's 
more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite>>> unlikely that we will 
agree on a definition. There are more than 60>>> of them in the psychological 
literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far>>> as I am aware there is no standardized 
measurement instrument for>>> creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some 
believe it can be>>> taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I 
believe that>>> some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and 
that>>> it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the>>> 
kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would>>> agree, 
I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might>>> differ in 
describing the paths to it. And it may look different in>>> different contexts, 
in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and>>> in the creative problem 
solving of daily living.>>>>>> In the context in which I raised the issue of 
creativity, I was>>> thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would 
refer to as>>> innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I 
believe>>> Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have 
historically>>> valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American 
economic>>> success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education>>> 
systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.>>>>>> Are 
adult literacy education students (including basic education,>>> secondary 
education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If>>> so, should we 
nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In>>> many GED programs I 
have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even>>> acknowledged in program 
goals or objectives. And I have never seen>>> it measured. This indicates to me 
that, as a field, we do not value>>> and support student creativity. I agree 
with Marc Tucker that, if we>>> are interested in Americans' global 
competitiveness that we should>>> value creativity, and of course, there are 
other good reasons to>>> nourish creativity.>>>>>> What do you think about 
this?>>>>>>>>> * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions 
of>>> creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:>>> 
Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.>>>>>> David 
J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> 
Message: 6>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400>>> From: "Donna 
Chambers">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 
know!>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: 
text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";>>> reply-type=original>>>>>> 
Mary Lynn,>>>>>> Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief. I am 
not>>> suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for>>> 
just>>> "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our>>> 
job.>>> Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of a>>> 
high>>> school student and be ready to transition to college level academics>>> 
is in>>> the learners' best interest in respect to time and money. Community>>> 
College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they>>> do. 
If>>> the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter>>> 
community>>> college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, 
but>>> it is>>> not. Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes 
basic>>> and>>> secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of Adult 
Literacy.>>>>>> Donna Chambers>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----->>> From: 
"Mary Lynn Simons">>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Sent: Saturday, 
October 27, 2007 9:01 PM>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what 
you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they enter 
and then teach them>>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>> 
decide>>> what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be 
able>>> to>>> pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college 
or>>> training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> 
From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:>>> assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 
2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you 
need to know!>> David,>>> I>>> agree that creativity is essential in GED 
programs, especially if>>>> students>>> are planning to go on to college! 
Students who pass the GED with>>>> minimal>>> ability to freely think 
creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh>>> options are usually at a loss 
in the college classroom. Most colleges>>>> require program elements such as 
"writing across the curriculum." As>>> we>>>> know, writing requires abstract 
thought, the kind adults need to>>> develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing 
classes require understanding and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the 
descriptive essay and more.>>> Humanities>>>> courses demand students to 
understand and even implement creative>>> forms,>>>> figures of speech, 
figurative language, and more. For students to>>> truly>>>> understand history, 
they must be able to visualize different time>>> periods.>>>> Symbolic thought 
translates into statistics and math classes in which>>>> graphs, numbers and 
equations are used to communicate ideas. The list>>> goes>>>> on.>> Someone here 
or in another posting made the remark that students>>> in a>>> GED> class who 
are not reading in class are not practicing reading at>>> all.>>> If> the 
instructor is writing on the board, if the students are>>> writing, if>>> the> 
students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>> more>>>> 
formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take>>> 
that>>>> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we 
might>>> not>>>> get with GED students. But especially with students who want to 
pursue>>>> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time 
to>>> teach>>>> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an 
essay>>> from>>> Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in 
my past>>> lives.>>> The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the 
college>>> classroom as>>> well as what GED students can> expect in college 
(though perhaps not>>> to this>>> extent, depending on the> teacher and the 
class).>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer 
in>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend>>> 
college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between>>> public>>> 
schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to>>> 
succeed.>>> Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and 
expected>>> in>>> every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL 
Online>>> Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education>>>> 
P.O. Box>>> 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax>>> 
703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:>>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 
[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>>>> Behalf>>> Of David J. Rosen> Sent: 
Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The>>> Assessment Discussion List> 
Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED>>> Discussion ->>> what you need to know!>>> 
Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we>>> mean>>> by creativity. Good 
question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means>>> to an end -- that 
is, with creative teaching> approaches will more>>> students>>> have more and 
higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is>>> creativity>>> itself an 
end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically>>> prepared and 
creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit>>> in?>> I>>> would argue, 
as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>>>> skills>>> and 
creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these>>> catregories, 
both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>>>> education>>> (e.g. GED) 
programs should provide students with the> opportunity to>>> have>>> academic 
skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong>>> critical 
thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong>>> academic>>> skills), 
and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is>>> the>>> 
assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>> 
education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>> 
standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and>>> if so>>> 
how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is>>> 
measuring>>>> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying>>> 
attention to>>> one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic 
strengths of>>> the>>> U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly 
exclusive focus>>> on>>> high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus 
on only>>> traditional>>>> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important 
creative skills>>>> like>>> the ability to look at a problem freshly and from 
different>>>> perspectives,>>> the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> 
solutions, the ability>>> to>>> represent an idea with an image, a moving> 
image, a drawing; a>>> metaphor or>>> other figurative language, or> rhetoric; 
and the ability to understand>>> and>>> follow, but instead to> disregard 
instructions or traditional paths of>>> thinking (what we now> often describe as 
"thinking outside the>>> box").>> Are>>> these goals that every GED student has 
or should have. No. Should>>>> they be?>>> Not necessarily. But for students who 
see the GED or high> school>>> diploma as>>> a way out of poverty, as a stepping 
stone to stable> employment and>>> self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door 
to> successful>>> post-secondary>>> learning, these are the skills we should be> 
teaching and measuring:>>> academic skills, including critical thinking> and 
creativity.>> I>>> invite>>> your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> 
djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On>>> Oct 26,>>> 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F 
wrote:>>> When we are referring to>>> creativity do we mean teaching critical>> 
thinking skills which once>>> our>>> students know how to think in a>> critical 
thinking way they will be>>> successful in achieving their>> education and other 
life goals.>>> However,>>> just like K-12 education,>> adult education is 
captured on the high>>> stakes>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which 
stifles creativity and>>> teachers>>> teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> 
BHCC>> Adult Education &>>> Transitions>>> Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: 
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf 
Of shirley ledet>>>>> Sent:>>> Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The 
Assessment Discussion>>> List>>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion 
- what you need to>>> know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of 
success on>>> standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have 
been>>> successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like 
natuarally>>> gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are 
well>>>>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms 
like>>>>> "I>>> don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> 
this may>>> be>>> the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there 
is more>>> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. 
Exposure>>> to>>> the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues 
as part>>> of>>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when 
testing>>> then>>> someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study 
hard. My>>> students>>> participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and 
those that "get>>> into>>> it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that 
feel it is a waste>>> of>>> time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are 
generally>>> frustrated>>>>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like 
they would>> like.">>> Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> 
activities that>>> have>>> to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more 
creativity!>>>>>>> Shirley>>> Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> 
djrosen at comcast.net>>> wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of 
creativity in adult literacy>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc 
Tucker, President of>>> the>>> National>> Center for Education and the Economy, 
has said in a>>> presention>>>>> recently to the National Commission on Adult 
Literacy, http://>>>>>>>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. 
education system -->>>>> and he>>> includes adult education, cannot be 
competitive without high>> academic>>> standards AND creativity.>>>> But many 
GED teachers and administrators>>> believe that their>> students will not pass 
the GED unless they focus>>> on>>> skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the 
test, that creativity is a>>>>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 
teachers,>> administrators>>> or>>> policy makers also believe creativity 
distracts>> from passing high>>> stakes>>> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise 
this>> issue, but it's the key>>> question on the minds of many GED teachers>> 
and administrators, so I>>> invite>>> the panelists to address it.>>>> Is 
creativity a distraction or is it>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. 
Rosen>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original>>> message 
---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi>>> everyone,>>>>>>>>> We've 
had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted>>> to>>>>>> 
give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>>>> 
discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>>>> 
suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 
07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> there>>> 
were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> post>>> 
your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>>>> 
Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion 
List Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
From:>>> "Marie>>> Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what 
you>>> need to>>> know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi 
everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We?ve>>> had several new subscribers over the past day, and 
so I>> wanted to>>> give a>>> quick reminder where you can get the information>> 
on this discussion.>>> For>>> the full announcement, information on>> guests, 
and suggested>>> resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 
07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there 
were a couple ? you>>>>> can>>> catch up in the archives at: 
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>>>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please 
post your questions and also>>> your>>> own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> 
Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> Assessment Discussion List 
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> 
NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> 
Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your 
subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 
Email>>> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>>>> 
National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> 
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please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> 
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please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> 
delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>> 
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Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> 
please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> 
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National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>>>> 
Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> 
please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered 
to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>> 
Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> Stop 
by>>> today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> 
ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>> ------------------------------->>> National 
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------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>> Assessment 
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End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>> ******************************************>>>>>>>>> 
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From Tina_Luffman at yc.edu  Wed Oct 31 13:04:21 2007
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu (Tina_Luffman at yc.edu)
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 10:04:21 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 1049] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking
In-Reply-To: <8C9E9EF92397B0F-A30-5EAF@WEBMAIL-DF12.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <OF62BCBCDA.F62AA9EF-ON07257385.005DA146-07257385.005DC546@yc.edu>

Andres, 

Thanks so much for your posting. Our program is similarly trying to build 
health literacy gradually this semester, and I am going to borrow your 
idea on the potato chip bag as an idea generator for our classes. Who do 
you get to come in to do the diabetes checks? The local health department? 
I think this is a great idea.

Tina

Tina Luffman
Coordinator, Developmental Education
Verde Valley Campus
928-634-6544
tina_luffman at yc.edu

andresmuro at aol.com 
Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
10/31/2007 09:38 AM
Please respond to
The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To
assessment at nifl.gov
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Subject
[Assessment 1048] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking

The thing is that students learn better if information relates to their 
knowledge and experiences. For example, in my program, students have 
difficulty writing. Once we get them to write about their own experiences, 
and teach them to do so, they become better writers. They also publish 
their stories. Also, our students face health barriers and want to learn 
about health prevention, improvement, access. They also take nutrition 
classes. Because they are interested in these topics, they learn fast and 
they remain focused and motivated. Also we have good retention. 

Ultimately, these topics do not deter them to learn information to pass 
the GED. The GED is basically having good reading, writing and math skills 
and test taking skills. It doesn't really matter if you teaching them to 
read by using the Glencoe GED book, or a health brochure, a bag of potato 
chips, legal information, etc. I do this workshop in which I show teachers 
that I can teach pretty much all the math skills for the GED using a bag 
of potato chips. I can also teach reading, writing and graph skills with 
the same bag. Thing is, bags of potato chips are fascinating to students. 
They capture  their imagination and keep them focused and working on task. 
 They are also learning how to read nutrition labels and how to watch what 
they eat. 

So, in a sense, teaching the GED and teaching things that are not in the 
book are not necessarily contradictory things. Also, in my program, in 
every class,  we have a small percentage of students who have diabetes and 
don't even know about it. We do a glucose test every semester. Those who 
have diabetes are referred to the doctor. To us, even if these students 
don't pass the GED, it is a triumph. We essentially saved limbs, if not 
lives. In fact, most of these students do get the GED. We also have 
victims of domestic violence that start to get counseling, support and 
protection. Many of these people would never get the GED. 

Finally, as I said before, our students get published, which is a huge 
self esteem builder. You can see the student's writings at 
http://bordersenses.com/memorias.  Click on the books below. You can click 
on traducciones on the right to read the translations. Imagine a GED 
student who gets published and shows that to her peers, teachers, 
relatives. How many students ever dream of getting published or think that 
they have any knowledge worth sharing?

Andres

-----Original Message-----
From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 7:25 pm
Subject: [Assessment 1047] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking

 I still say students should get their GED as soon as possible and that it 
is 

not our job to hold students back by teaching them not only to pass the 
test but 

things we personally think they should know. We are hired to help people 
pass 

the test; that is what the taxpayers want us to do and that is why 
students come 

to the adult school in the first place.  Also, I think the GED is a pretty 
good 

test. One-third of  high school graduates cannot pass it. I don't know 
what 

states you all come from, but where I am in California, if someone passes 
the 

GED, that is a sign their skills are fairly high, high enough not to spend 
time 

on much remediation in the community college. The army used to prefer 
diploma 

grads to GED grads, not because the latter were less educated but because 

diploma grads have more stick-to-itiveness. Perhaps this is true in 
college also 

and accounts for the high college dropout rate of GED grads. 

________________________________> From: djrosen at comcast.net> Date: Tue, 30 
Oct 

2007 09:30:31 -0400> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment 1035] 
GED, 

Creativity and Fast-tracking>> Mary Lynn wrote:> I think we owe to to our 

students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. 
That 

is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need 
"creativity", a 

nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is 

paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.> Creativity need not be 

nebulous. For example, here's a good definition from the Wikipedia:> 
"Creativity 

(or creativeness) is a mental process involving the generation of new 
ideas or 

concepts, or new associations between existing ideas or concepts." 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity> I am sure you can see the direct 

application of this kind of creativity to scoring high on the GED tests, 
for 

example in writing a good essay, and perhaps in other areas. Equally 
important 

-- for students who believe that GED preparation is the key to success in 

post-secondary education and some kinds of job skills training -- 
generating new 

ideas or concepts and making associations between existing ideas or 
concepts is 

essential for success.> Let me return to the context in which I raised the 
issue 

of creativity, Marc Tucker's claim that if the U.S. is to be competitive, 
if 

Americans are to have good jobs, they not only need strong basic skills 
and some 

college education, but they also need to be creative, that this is the 
cultural 

edge that leads to innovation and invention, that makes the American 
economy 

strong, and will enable American workers to thrive. Some adult education 

students, of course, don't care about that. They want the GED for other 
reasons, 

and that's fine. Let them fast track to the test. Those who want GED 

prepararation for college and good jobs, however, will need more: stronger 

academic skills to succeed in college, and -- if Tucker is right -- skills 
in 

the mental processes to generate new ideas or concepts, and new 
associations 

between existing concepts, and perhaps other kinds of creativity.> Mary 
Lynn, I 

would like to challenge the belief that we "owe [it] to our students to 
get them 

to community college or training as fast as possible." This has not 
produced 

good results for adult students whose goal is to succeed in college. Only 
a very 

small percentage of adult GED holders actually succeed in college, often 
because 

they lack the academic reading and writing skills, and numeracy 
(especially 

algebra) that they need to enroll in regular (not developmental) courses. 

Unfortunately way too many use up their college financial aide in college 

developmental courses and then have to drop out before achieving a 
certificate 

or degree. Many of these students will need to take the time to prepare 
for 

college in their GED preparation program, not fast track to the GED test.> 
David 

J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> On Oct 29, 2007, at 3:27 PM, Mary Lynn 
Simons 

wrote:> I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills; 
critical 

thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against teachers wasting 
student time 

with too much talking, both by students and by themselves, and calling it 

"creativity". In order to be able to pass the tests, students must grapple 
with 

the five subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and 

mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively discussions, 
though 

interesting, can keep students from doing what they need to do to be able 
to 

pass. Adult education students have busy lives and have little time to get 
their 

GED. I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or 

training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us 
to 

decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must 
respect the 

goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do 
otherwise.>> 

From: andreawilder at comcast.net>> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400>> 
To: 

assessment at nifl.gov>> Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, 
Vol 25, 

Issue 33>>>> Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you 
two 

(Mary>> Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what 
would>> 

I see???>> would there be a real difference?>> Thanks.>>>> Andrea>> On Oct 
29, 

2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:>>>>> Wow, I must say I disagree 
with 

Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents>>> come in just wanting to pass the 
test, 

but have no critical thinking>>> or transitional college skills. If we 
don't 

help them understand and>>> acquire some of those skills, they will not be 
able 

to succeed with>>> the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I 
think 

it is one>>> of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they 
need 

to>>> succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is>>> 

paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.>>>>>> 
Thanks,>>> 

Mary Lynn Carver>>> ABE/GED Instructor>>> College of Lake County>>> 
Building 4, 

Office 405>>> 19351 W. Washington Street>>> Grayslake, IL 60031>>> 

Phone:847/543-2677>>> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu>>> Fax: 847/543-7580>>>>>> 

"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be>>> constantly 

amused" -- Unknown>>>>>> We now accept the fact that learning is a 
lifelong 

process of keeping>>> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to 
teach 

people how>>> to learn. --Peter F. Drucker>>>>>> 
________________________________>>>>>> 

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of>>> 
assessment-request at nifl.gov>>> 

Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM>>> To: assessment at nifl.gov>>> Subject: 
Assessment 

Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>>>>>>>>>>> Send Assessment mailing list 
submissions 

to>>> assessment at nifl.gov>>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World 
Wide 

Web, visit>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> or, via 
email, 

send a message with subject or body 'help' to>>> 
assessment-request at nifl.gov>>>>>> 

You can reach the person managing the list at>>> assessment-owner at nifl.gov
>>>>>> 

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific>>> 
than "Re: 

Contents of Assessment digest...">>>>>>>>> Today's Topics:>>>>>> 1. 
[Assessment 

1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David J. Rosen)>>> 2. 
[Assessment 

1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Mary Lynn Simons)>>> 
3. 

[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Andrea 

Wilder)>>> 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> 
(David 

J. Rosen)>>> 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity (David 
J.>>> 

Rosen)>>> 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 
know!>>> 

(Donna Chambers)>>>>>>>>> 
---------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> 

Message: 1>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400>>> From: David J. 
Rosen>>>> 

Subject: [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> To: The 

Technology and Literacy Discussion List>,>>> The Adult Literacy 
Professional 

Development Discussion List>>>>, The Assessment>>> Discussion List>>>>, 
The 

Adult English Language Learners>>> Discussion>>> List>>>> Message-ID: >>> 

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> 

format=flowed>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills 

(MLoTS) project, a free Web->>> based library of short digital videos of 
adult 

education classrooms>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading 
and 

numeracy>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>> 
tutoring)>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>> ? OTAN (integrating 

technology)>>> and>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what 

low-literate ESOL>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>> I 
hope you 

will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>> tutoring short 

videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>> hoping that MLoTS will 

become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>> adult literacy education 
classroom 

videos.>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 2>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 

01:01:15 +0000>>> From: Mary Lynn Simons>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] 
Re: GED 

Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The Assessment Discussion 
List>>>> 

Message-ID:>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252">>>>>>>>> 

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>> 

accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>> 
decide 

what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to>>> be able 
to 

pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to>>> college or 

training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> 
----------------------------------------> 

From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 
Oct>>> 

2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>> 
what you 

need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>> in GED 
programs, 

especially if> students are planning to go on to>>> college! Students who 
pass 

the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>> think creatively, explore 
abstract 

ideas, and> weigh options are>>> usually at a loss in the college 
classroom. 

Most colleges> require>>> program elements such as "writing across the 

curriculum." As we> know,>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind 
adults 

need to develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require 
understanding 

and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and 
more.>>> 

Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>> 
creative 

forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>> students 
to 

truly> understand history, they must be able to vi>>> sualize different 
time 

periods.> Symbolic thought translates into>>> statistics and math classes 
in 

which> graphs, numbers and equations>>> are used to communicate ideas. The 
list 

goes> on.>> Someone here or in>>> another posting made the remark that 
students 

in a GED> class who are>>> not reading in class are not practicing reading 
at 

all. If> the>>> instructor is writing on the board, if the students are 
writing, 

if>>> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms 
of>>> 

more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need>>> to 
take 

that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline>>> that we 
might 

not> get with GED students. But especially with students>>> who want to 
pursue> 

higher education after earning the GED, we need to>>> have the time to 
teach> 

them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>> now ran across an essay 
from 

Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>> long time but did in my past 
lives. 

The essay demonstrates how>>>> creativity is used in the co>>> llege 
classroom 

as well as what GED students can> expect in college>>> (though perhaps not 
to 

this extent, depending on the> teacher and the>>> class). 
http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> 

I'm a firm>>> believer in extensive transitional services for GED 
students> 

planning>>> to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> 

communications>>> between public schools and college to make this happen 
if we> 

want GED>>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should 
include>>>> 

creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>> 
Mercurio 

Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>> Public 
Schools> 

Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>> work 703-791-8387> 
fax 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>> From: 
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> 

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>> List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need>>> to 
know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>> creativity. Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means to an end -- 
that is, 

with creative teaching> approaches will>>> more students have more and 
higher 

academic skills,> better test>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- 
that 

is, do we> want>>> students to be both academically prepared and creative? 
Or> 

both? And>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc 
Tucker 

does,>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I 
would>>> 

put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and>>> 
as an 

end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should>>> provide 

students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that>>> are strong 
enough 

to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>> skills (these may be 

inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>> the skills of creative 

problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>> assessment list, let me ask what 
are we 

measuring>>>> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic 

skills,>>>> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring 
critical>>>> 

thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in>>>> adult 

literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc>>>> Tucker is 
right, 

we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest>>>> economic assets, 
one of 

the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree>>>> with Tucker and believe 
that the 

nearly exclusive focus on high>>>>> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, 
and the 

focus on only>>>> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects 

important>>>> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem 
freshly 

and>>>> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate 
a>>>> 

range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image,>>>> a 

moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language,>>>> or> 

rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead>>>> to> 

disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin>>> king (what we now> 
often 

describe as "thinking outside the box").>>>>> Are these goals that every 
GED 

student has or should have. No. Should>>>> they be? Not necessarily. But 
for 

students who see the GED or high>>>> school diploma as a way out of 
poverty, as 

a stepping stone to stable>>>> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key 
to open 

the door to>>>> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills 
we 

should be>>>> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical 

thinking>>>> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. 

Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni 
F>>> 

wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching>>> 
critical>> 

thinking skills which once our students know how to think>>> in a>> 
critical 

thinking way they will be successful in achieving>>> their>> education and 
other 

life goals. However, just like K-12>>> education,>> adult education is 
captured 

on the high stakes spinning>>> wheel of>> accountability which stifle>>> s 

creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>>>> BHCC>> 
Adult 

Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>>>> From: 

assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->>>>> bounces at nifl.gov] On 
Behalf 

Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October>>> 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The 

Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1001] Re: GED 
Discussion - 

what you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy 
of 

success on standardized>>>>> test. We need look no further then those who 
have 

been successful>> on>>> any type of test. We tend to use terms like 
natuarally 

gifted,>> just>>> smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> 

rounded, enjoy>>> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> 
"I 

don't know,>>> I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may 
be 

the>>> reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is 
more>>> 

disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure>>> 
to the 

arts, banking industry, faculty>>> ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of 
your 

everyday life tends to>>> offer>> more of an advantage when testing then 
someone 

whose only>>> exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students 

participate>>> in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get 
into it" 

tend>>> to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste 
of>>> 

time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally>>> 
frustrated>> 

when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they>>> would>> like." 

Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>>>> activities that 
have 

to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>>>>> more creativity!>>>> 
Shirley 

Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net 
wrote:>>>> 

Colleagues,>>>> I am a>>> proponent of creativity in adult literacy 
education 

-->> indeed in all>>> education. As Marc Tucker, President of the 
National>> 

Center for>>> Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> 
recently to 

the>>> National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>>>>> 
www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html 

, the U.S. education system -->>>>>>> and he includes adult education, 
cannot be 

competitive without>>>>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But 
many 

GED teachers>>>>> and administrators believe that their>> students will 
not pass 

the>>>>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass 
the>>>>> 

test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many>>>>> 
K-12 

teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe>>>>> creativity 

distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>>> the one to 
raise 

this>> issue, but it's the key question on the>>>>> minds of many GED 
teachers>> 

and administrators, so I invite the>>>>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is 

creativity a distraction or is it>>>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> 
David 

J. Rosen>>>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original 
message>>>>> 

---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> 
We've had 

several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>>>>>> wanted to>>> 
give a 

qu>>> ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> 
discussion.>>> 

For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested>>> 
resources 

go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> 
there 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> 
post 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>> now!>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>> 
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment 
Discussion 

List>>> Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

From:>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - 
what>>> 

you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>> 

everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>> 
and so 

I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you>>> can get the information>> 
on 

this discussion. For the full>>> announcement, information on>> guests, 
and 

suggested resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>> 
there 

were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> 

assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also 
your 

own experiences to share>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 

Assessment Discussion>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie 
Cora>>>>>>> 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> 

Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> 
change your 

subscription settings, please go to>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 

Email delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------>>> 
------------------------->> 

National Institute for Literacy>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your subscription 
settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 

delivered to>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------->> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> 
settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 

delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
settings, 

please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 

delivered to>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
settings>>> , 

please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> 
delivered 

to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>> 
_________________________________________________________________>>> 

Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> 
Stop by 

today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> 

ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> 
Message: 

3>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400>>> From: Andrea Wilder>>>> 
Subject: 

[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The 

Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; 

charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> Hi Mary 
Lynn-->>>>>> One 

of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been: "Don't>>> waste 
their 

time." Is this what you are getting at?>>>>>> Andrea>>>>>> On Oct 27, 
2007, at 

9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test 
students 

when they enter and then teach them>>>> accordingly. It is not our job to 

paternalistically/maternalistically>>>> decide what is best for our 
students 

beyond what they need to know to>>>> be able to pass the test. We must not 
hold 

them back. Let them get to>>>> college or training as fast as 

possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> 
From:>>>> 

Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>>> 
2007 

09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>>> what 
you 

need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>>> in GED 
programs, 

especially if> students are planning to go on to>>>> college! Students who 
pass 

the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>>> think creatively, explore 
abstract 

ideas, and> weigh options are>>>> usually at a loss in the college 
classroom. 

Most colleges> require>>>> program elements such as "writing across the 

curriculum." As we> know,>>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind 
adults 

need to develop.>>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require 
understanding 

and using>>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and 
more.>>>> 

Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>>> 

creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>>> 

students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize>>>> 

different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics>>>> 
and 

math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to>>>> 
communicate 

ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another>>>> posting made 
the 

remark that students in a GED> class who are not>>>> reading in class are 
not 

practicing reading at all. If> the instructor>>>> is writing on the board, 
if 

the students are writing, if the> students>>>> are taking practice tests, 
they 

ARE reading. In terms of more>>>>> formalized, lengthier readings, 
students will 

most likely need to take>>>> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain 
amount of 

discipline that we>>>> might not> get with GED students. But especially 
with 

students who>>>> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, 
we need 

to>>>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I 
just>>>> 

now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>>> 
long 

time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>>>>> creativity 
is 

used in the college classroom as well as what GED>>>> students can> expect 
in 

college (though perhaps not to this extent,>>>> depending on the> teacher 
and 

the class).>>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm 

believer in>>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning 
to 

attend>>>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications 

between>>>> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want 
GED>>>> 

students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>>> 
creativity 

used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>>> Mercurio 

Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>>> Public 
Schools> 

Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>>> work 703-791-8387> 
fax 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>>> From: 
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>>> 

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>>> 
Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>>> List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to>>>> 
know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>>> creativity. Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>>> means to an end -- 
that 

is, with creative teaching> approaches will>>>> more students have more 
and 

higher academic skills,> better test>>>> scores? Or is creativity itself 
an end 

-- that is, do we> want>>>> students to be both academically prepared and 

creative? Or> both? And>>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would 
argue, as 

Marc Tucker does,>>>> that we need both high academic> skills and 
creativity, 

and I would>>>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as 
a 

means and>>>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) 
programs 

should>>>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills 

that>>>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical 
thinking>>>> 

skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>>> 
the 

skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>>> assessment 
list, 

let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>>> education 
programs?>> 

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>>> standardized tests> ? Are 
we 

measuring critical thinking skills, and>>>> if so how?> ? I am not aware 
that 

anyone in adult literacy education>>>> is measuring> creative skills.>> If 
Marc 

Tucker is right, we are not>>>> paying attention to one of the> greatest 

economic assets, one of the>>>> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree 
with 

Tucker and believe that>>>> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes 
basic 

skills tests for>>>> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills 
for 

the GED>>>> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability 
to 

look>>>> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the 
ability 

to>>>> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to 
represent>>>> 

an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other>>>> 

figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and>>>> 
follow, 

but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of>>>> 
thinking 

(what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the>>>> box").>> Are 
these 

goals that every GED student has or should have.>>>> No. Should> they be? 
Not 

necessarily. But for students who see the GED>>>> or high> school diploma 
as a 

way out of poverty, as a stepping stone>>>> to stable> employment and 

self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door>>>> to> successful 
post-secondary 

learning, these are the skills we should>>>> be> teaching and measuring: 

academic skills, including critical>>>> thinking> and creativity.>> I 
invite 

your comments on this.>> David J.>>>> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On 
Oct 26, 

2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,>>>> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to 

creativity do we mean>>>> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once 
our 

students know how>>>> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be 

successful in>>>> achieving their>> education and other life goals. 
However, 

just like>>>> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high 

stakes>>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity 
and>>>> 

teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult>>>> 
Education & 

Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:>>>> 
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

[mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On>>>> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> 
Sent: 

Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>>>>> To: The Assessment Discussion 
List>> 

Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:>>>> GED Discussion - what you need to 

know!>>>>>>>> I agree that>>>> creativity is not the enemy of success on 

standardized>> test. We need>>>> look no further then those who have been 

successful>> on any type of>>>> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally 

gifted,>> just smart, etc.>>>> If you speak to these folks they are well>> 

rounded, enjoy reading,>>>> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> 
"I 

don't know, I just>>>> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may 
be 

the reason for>>>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more 

disparity>>>> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure 
to 

the>>>> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part 
of>>>> 

your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing>>>> 
then 

someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.>>>> My 
students 

participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those>>>> that "get 
into 

it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that>>>> feel it is a waste 
of 

time>> and they just want to "study for the GED">>>> are generally 
frustrated>> 

when "all of their hard work does not pay>>>> off like they would>> like." 

Creativity also leads to retention;>>>> especially those>> activities that 
have 

to be completed in increments.>>>> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> 
Shirley 

Ledet>>>> GED>>>> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net 

wrote:>>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult 

literacy>>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, 
President 

of>>>> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in 
a>>>> 

presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,>>>> 

http://>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.>>>> education>>>> 
system 

-->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive>>>> without 
high>> 

academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED>>>> teachers and 

administrators believe that their>> students will not>>>> pass the GED 
unless 

they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to>>>> pass the test, that 

creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.>>>> (Many K-12 
teachers,>> 

administrators or policy makers also believe>>>> creativity distracts>> 
from 

passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>> the one to raise this>> 
issue, but 

it's the key question on the minds>>>> of many GED teachers>> and 

administrators, so I invite the panelists>>>> to address it.>>>> Is 
creativity a 

distraction or is it essential for>>>> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. 
Rosen>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>> -------------- Original message 
---------------------->> 

From: "Marie>>>> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new 
subscribers 

over the>>>> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where 
you 

can>>>> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full 

announcement,>>>> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go 

to:>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>>> 
there 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>>> 
post 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>>> now!>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>>> 
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment 
Discussion 

List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

From:>>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - 

what>>>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> 
Hi>>>> 

everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>>> 
and 

so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the>>>> 
information>> 

on this discussion. For the full announcement,>>>> information on>> 
guests, and 

suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>>> 
there 

were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> 

assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also 
your 

own experiences to share>>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 

Assessment Discussion>>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie 
Cora>>>>>>>> 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>>> 

Moderator>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>>> 
change 

your subscription settings, please go to>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 

Email delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> 
------------------------------->> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> 
settings, 

please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 

delivered to>>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------->> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> 
settings, 

please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 

delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> 
-------------------------------> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 

delivered to>>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription 
settings, 

please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 

delivered to>>>> macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>>> 
_________________________________________________________________>>>> 

Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>>> 
Stop by 

today.>>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>>> 

ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>> ------------------------------->>>> 
National 

Institute for Literacy>>>> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov
>>>> 

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> Email delivered to 

andreawilder at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------>>>>>> 

Message: 4>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400>>> From: "David J. 

Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching 
Skills>>> 

To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: 
text/plain; 

charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> ....and the Web 
address 

for MLoTS is:>>>>>> http://www.mlots.org>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen 

wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills 
(MLoTS) 

project, a free Web->>>> based library of short digital videos of adult 

education classrooms>>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created 
reading and 

numeracy>>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those 
from:>>>>>>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>>> 
tutoring)>>>> 

? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>>> ? OTAN 
(integrating 

technology)>>>> and>>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what 

low-literate ESOL>>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>>>> I 
hope 

you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>>> tutoring 
short 

videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>>> hoping that MLoTS 
will 

become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>>> adult literacy education 
classroom 

videos.>>>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or 
change 

your subscription settings, please go to>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> 

Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 5>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 

23:17:38 -0400>>> From: "David J. Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1015] 
GED 

preparation and creativity>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> 
Message-ID: 

>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; 
format=flowed>>>>>> 

Hello Andrea,>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:>>>>>>> Has anybody yet in 
this 

conversation defined 1. critical reading>>>> and 2. creativity?>>>>>> 
Here's 

more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite>>> unlikely that we 
will 

agree on a definition. There are more than 60>>> of them in the 
psychological 

literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far>>> as I am aware there is no 
standardized 

measurement instrument for>>> creativity. Some believe it is inherited; 
some 

believe it can be>>> taught; some believe it can be nurtured or 
encouraged. I 

believe that>>> some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least 
nurtured and 

that>>> it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with 
the>>> 

kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would>>> 
agree, 

I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might>>> differ in 

describing the paths to it. And it may look different in>>> different 
contexts, 

in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and>>> in the creative 
problem 

solving of daily living.>>>>>> In the context in which I raised the issue 
of 

creativity, I was>>> thinking of the application of new ideas, what some 
would 

refer to as>>> innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that 
I 

believe>>> Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have 

historically>>> valued and excelled at, that has been an element of 
American 

economic>>> success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the 
education>>> 

systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.>>>>>> 
Are 

adult literacy education students (including basic education,>>> secondary 

education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If>>> so, should 
we 

nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In>>> many GED programs 
I 

have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even>>> acknowledged in 
program 

goals or objectives. And I have never seen>>> it measured. This indicates 
to me 

that, as a field, we do not value>>> and support student creativity. I 
agree 

with Marc Tucker that, if we>>> are interested in Americans' global 

competitiveness that we should>>> value creativity, and of course, there 
are 

other good reasons to>>> nourish creativity.>>>>>> What do you think about 

this?>>>>>>>>> * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and 
definitions 

of>>> creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:>>> 

Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.>>>>>> 
David 

J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
------------------------------>>>>>> 

Message: 6>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400>>> From: "Donna 

Chambers">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you 
need to 

know!>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Message-ID: >>> 
Content-Type: 

text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";>>> 
reply-type=original>>>>>> 

Mary Lynn,>>>>>> Your argument to push learners forward is a common 
belief. I am 

not>>> suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them 
for>>> 

just>>> "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of 
our>>> 

job.>>> Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of 
a>>> 

high>>> school student and be ready to transition to college level 
academics>>> 

is in>>> the learners' best interest in respect to time and money. 
Community>>> 

College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they>>> 
do. 

If>>> the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter>>> 

community>>> college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be 
smoother, 

but>>> it is>>> not. Preparation for the learners next steps, which 
includes 

basic>>> and>>> secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of 
Adult 

Literacy.>>>>>> Donna Chambers>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----->>> 
From: 

"Mary Lynn Simons">>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Sent: 
Saturday, 

October 27, 2007 9:01 PM>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion 
- what 

you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they 
enter 

and then teach them>>> accordingly. It is not our job to 
paternalistically/maternalistically>>> 

decide>>> what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to 
be 

able>>> to>>> pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to 
college 

or>>> training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> 
----------------------------------------> 

From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:>>> assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 
Oct 

2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - 
what you 

need to know!>> David,>>> I>>> agree that creativity is essential in GED 

programs, especially if>>>> students>>> are planning to go on to college! 

Students who pass the GED with>>>> minimal>>> ability to freely think 

creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh>>> options are usually at a 
loss 

in the college classroom. Most colleges>>>> require program elements such 
as 

"writing across the curriculum." As>>> we>>>> know, writing requires 
abstract 

thought, the kind adults need to>>> develop.>>>>> Even basic college 
writing 

classes require understanding and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in 
the 

descriptive essay and more.>>> Humanities>>>> courses demand students to 

understand and even implement creative>>> forms,>>>> figures of speech, 

figurative language, and more. For students to>>> truly>>>> understand 
history, 

they must be able to visualize different time>>> periods.>>>> Symbolic 
thought 

translates into statistics and math classes in which>>>> graphs, numbers 
and 

equations are used to communicate ideas. The list>>> goes>>>> on.>> 
Someone here 

or in another posting made the remark that students>>> in a>>> GED> class 
who 

are not reading in class are not practicing reading at>>> all.>>> If> the 

instructor is writing on the board, if the students are>>> writing, if>>> 
the> 

students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>> 
more>>>> 

formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take>>> 

that>>>> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we 

might>>> not>>>> get with GED students. But especially with students who 
want to 

pursue>>>> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the 
time 

to>>> teach>>>> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across 
an 

essay>>> from>>> Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but 
did in 

my past>>> lives.>>> The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the 

college>>> classroom as>>> well as what GED students can> expect in 
college 

(though perhaps not>>> to this>>> extent, depending on the> teacher and 
the 

class).>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm 
believer 

in>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to 
attend>>> 

college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between>>> 
public>>> 

schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to>>> 

succeed.>>> Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and 

expected>>> in>>> every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, 
ESOL 

Online>>> Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult 
Education>>>> 

P.O. Box>>> 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax>>> 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:>>> 
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>>>> Behalf>>> Of David J. Rosen> 
Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The>>> Assessment Discussion List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED>>> Discussion ->>> what you need to 
know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we>>> mean>>> by creativity. Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means>>> to an end -- 
that 

is, with creative teaching> approaches will more>>> students>>> have more 
and 

higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is>>> creativity>>> itself 
an 

end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically>>> prepared 
and 

creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit>>> in?>> I>>> would 
argue, 

as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>>>> skills>>> and 

creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these>>> 
catregories, 

both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>>>> education>>> (e.g. 
GED) 

programs should provide students with the> opportunity to>>> have>>> 
academic 

skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong>>> critical 

thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong>>> academic>>> 
skills), 

and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is>>> the>>> 

assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>> 

education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>> 

standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and>>> if 
so>>> 

how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is>>> 

measuring>>>> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not 
paying>>> 

attention to>>> one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic 

strengths of>>> the>>> U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the 
nearly 

exclusive focus>>> on>>> high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the 
focus 

on only>>> traditional>>>> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects 
important 

creative skills>>>> like>>> the ability to look at a problem freshly and 
from 

different>>>> perspectives,>>> the ability to try out and evaluate a range 
of> 

solutions, the ability>>> to>>> represent an idea with an image, a moving> 

image, a drawing; a>>> metaphor or>>> other figurative language, or> 
rhetoric; 

and the ability to understand>>> and>>> follow, but instead to> disregard 

instructions or traditional paths of>>> thinking (what we now> often 
describe as 

"thinking outside the>>> box").>> Are>>> these goals that every GED 
student has 

or should have. No. Should>>>> they be?>>> Not necessarily. But for 
students who 

see the GED or high> school>>> diploma as>>> a way out of poverty, as a 
stepping 

stone to stable> employment and>>> self-sufficiency, as a key to open the 
door 

to> successful>>> post-secondary>>> learning, these are the skills we 
should be> 

teaching and measuring:>>> academic skills, including critical thinking> 
and 

creativity.>> I>>> invite>>> your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On>>> Oct 26,>>> 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F 

wrote:>>> When we are referring to>>> creativity do we mean teaching 
critical>> 

thinking skills which once>>> our>>> students know how to think in a>> 
critical 

thinking way they will be>>> successful in achieving their>> education and 
other 

life goals.>>> However,>>> just like K-12 education,>> adult education is 

captured on the high>>> stakes>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which 

stifles creativity and>>> teachers>>> teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni 
Borge>>>> 

BHCC>> Adult Education &>>> Transitions>>> Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> 
From: 

assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On 
Behalf 

Of shirley ledet>>>>> Sent:>>> Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: 
The 

Assessment Discussion>>> List>>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED 
Discussion 

- what you need to>>> know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the 
enemy of 

success on>>> standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who 
have 

been>>> successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like 

natuarally>>> gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they 
are 

well>>>>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms 

like>>>>> "I>>> don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found 
that>> 

this may>>> be>>> the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> 
there 

is more>>> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. 

Exposure>>> to>>> the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal 
issues 

as part>>> of>>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage 
when 

testing>>> then>>> someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and 
study 

hard. My>>> students>>> participate in a>> quite a few creative projects 
and 

those that "get>>> into>>> it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those 
that 

feel it is a waste>>> of>>> time>> and they just want to "study for the 
GED" are 

generally>>> frustrated>>>>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off 
like 

they would>> like.">>> Creativity also leads to retention; especially 
those>> 

activities that>>> have>>> to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> 
more 

creativity!>>>>>>> Shirley>>> Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>> wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of 

creativity in adult literacy>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As 
Marc 

Tucker, President of>>> the>>> National>> Center for Education and the 
Economy, 

has said in a>>> presention>>>>> recently to the National Commission on 
Adult 

Literacy, http://>>>>>>>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. 

education system -->>>>> and he>>> includes adult education, cannot be 

competitive without high>> academic>>> standards AND creativity.>>>> But 
many 

GED teachers and administrators>>> believe that their>> students will not 
pass 

the GED unless they focus>>> on>>> skills and>> knowledge needed to pass 
the 

test, that creativity is a>>>>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many 
K-12 

teachers,>> administrators>>> or>>> policy makers also believe creativity 

distracts>> from passing high>>> stakes>>> tests.) I hate to be the one to 
raise 

this>> issue, but it's the key>>> question on the minds of many GED 
teachers>> 

and administrators, so I>>> invite>>> the panelists to address it.>>>> Is 

creativity a distraction or is it>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> 
David J. 

Rosen>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original>>> message 

---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi>>> everyone,>>>>>>>>> 
We've 

had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted>>> 
to>>>>>> 

give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>>>> 

discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>>>> 

suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> 
there>>> 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> 
post>>> 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>> 
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>>> NIFL Assessment 
Discussion 

List Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

From:>>> "Marie>>> Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion 
- what 

you>>> need to>>> know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi 

everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We?ve>>> had several new subscribers over the past 
day, and 

so I>> wanted to>>> give a>>> quick reminder where you can get the 
information>> 

on this discussion.>>> For>>> the full announcement, information on>> 
guests, 

and suggested>>> resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? 
there 

were a couple ? you>>>>> can>>> catch up in the archives at: 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>>>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> 
Please 

post your questions and also>>> your>>> own experiences to share 
now!>>>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> Assessment Discussion List 

Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> 
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> 

Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or 
change your 

subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>> 
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 

Email>>> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> 
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National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> 
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please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> 

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National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> 
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please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> 

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National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>>>> 

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please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> 

delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>>> 

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please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> 
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Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> 
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ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>> ------------------------------->>> National 

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------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>> 
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mailing list>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>> To unsubscribe or change your 

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End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>> 
******************************************>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>> 
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From andresmuro at aol.com  Wed Oct 31 15:54:15 2007
From: andresmuro at aol.com (andresmuro at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 15:54:15 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1050] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking
In-Reply-To: <OF62BCBCDA.F62AA9EF-ON07257385.005DA146-07257385.005DC546@yc.edu>
Message-ID: <8C9EA0EF36D0A3D-4A0-DDB@FWM-M11.sysops.aol.com>

Tina: 

We get different entities to do health screenings. We also have a health literacy instructor who goes to all the classes for about a week and teaches health education in a GED format. We refer students to health clinics for further check-ups. We have been incorporating health literacy into GED instruction for quite a while. Please send me an email, or call me if you need additional ideas. My number is (915) 831-4161.

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Tina_Luffman at yc.edu
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 11:04 am
Subject: [Assessment 1049] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking

Andres, 

Thanks so much for your posting. Our
program is similarly trying to build health literacy gradually this semester,
and I am going to borrow your idea on the potato chip bag as an idea generator
for our classes. Who do you get to come in to do the diabetes checks? The
local health department? I think this is a great idea.

Tina

Tina Luffman

Coordinator, Developmental Education

Verde Valley Campus

928-634-6544

tina_luffman at yc.edu

andresmuro at aol.com

Sent by: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov

10/31/2007 09:38 AM

Please respond to

The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

To

assessment at nifl.gov

cc

Subject

[Assessment 1048] Re: GED, Creativity
and Fast-tracking

The thing is that students learn better if
information relates to their knowledge and experiences. For example, in
my program, students have difficulty writing. Once we get them to write
about their own experiences, and teach them to do so, they become better
writers. They also publish their stories. Also, our students face health
barriers and want to learn about health prevention, improvement, access.
They also take nutrition classes. Because they are interested in these
topics, they learn fast and they remain focused and motivated. Also we
have good retention. 

Ultimately, these topics do not deter them to learn information to pass
the GED. The GED is basically having good reading, writing and math skills
and test taking skills. It doesn't really matter if you teaching them to
read by using the Glencoe GED book, or a health brochure, a bag of potato
chips, legal information, etc. I do this workshop in which I show teachers
that I can teach pretty much all the math skills for the GED using a bag
of potato chips. I can also teach reading, writing and graph skills with
the same bag. Thing is, bags of potato chips are fascinating to students.
?They capture ?their imagination and keep them focused and working
on task. ?They are also learning how to read nutrition labels and
how to watch what they eat. 

So, in a sense, teaching the GED and teaching things that are not in the
book are not necessarily contradictory things. Also, in my program, in
every class, ?we have a small percentage of students who have diabetes
and don't even know about it. We do a glucose test every semester. Those
who have diabetes are referred to the doctor. To us, even if these students
don't pass the GED, it is a triumph. We essentially saved limbs, if not
lives. In fact, most of these students do get the GED. We also have victims
of domestic violence that start to get counseling, support and protection.
Many of these people would never get the GED. 

Finally, as I said before, our students get published, which is a huge
self esteem builder. You can see the student's writings at http://bordersenses.com/memorias.
?Click on the books below. You can click on traducciones on the right
to read the translations. Imagine a GED student who gets published and
shows that to her peers, teachers, relatives. How many students ever dream
of getting published or think that they have any knowledge worth sharing?

Andres

-----Original Message-----

From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>

To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

Sent: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 7:25 pm

Subject: [Assessment 1047] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking

 I still say students should get their GED as soon as possible and that
it is 

not our job to hold students back by teaching them not only to pass the
test but 

things we personally think they should know. We are hired to help people
pass 

the test; that is what the taxpayers want us to do and that is why students
come 

to the adult school in the first place. ?Also, I think the GED is
a pretty good 

test. One-third of ?high school graduates cannot pass it. I don't
know what 

states you all come from, but where I am in California, if someone passes
the 

GED, that is a sign their skills are fairly high, high enough not to spend
time 

on much remediation in the community college. The army used to prefer diploma

grads to GED grads, not because the latter were less educated but because

diploma grads have more stick-to-itiveness. Perhaps this is true in college
also 

and accounts for the high college dropout rate of GED grads. 

________________________________> From: djrosen at comcast.net>
Date: Tue, 30 Oct 

2007 09:30:31 -0400> To: assessment at nifl.gov>
Subject: [Assessment 1035] GED, 

Creativity and Fast-tracking>> Mary Lynn wrote:> I think we owe
to to our 

students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible.
That 

is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity",
a 

nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it
is 

paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.> Creativity need not
be 

nebulous. For example, here's a good definition from the Wikipedia:>
"Creativity 

(or creativeness) is a mental process involving the generation of new ideas
or 

concepts, or new associations between existing ideas or concepts."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity>
I am sure you can see the direct 

application of this kind of creativity to scoring high on the GED tests,
for 

example in writing a good essay, and perhaps in other areas. Equally important

-- for students who believe that GED preparation is the key to success
in 

post-secondary education and some kinds of job skills training -- generating
new 

ideas or concepts and making associations between existing ideas or concepts
is 

essential for success.> Let me return to the context in which I raised
the issue 

of creativity, Marc Tucker's claim that if the U.S. is to be competitive,
if 

Americans are to have good jobs, they not only need strong basic skills
and some 

college education, but they also need to be creative, that this is the
cultural 

edge that leads to innovation and invention, that makes the American economy

strong, and will enable American workers to thrive. Some adult education

students, of course, don't care about that. They want the GED for other
reasons, 

and that's fine. Let them fast track to the test. Those who want GED 

prepararation for college and good jobs, however, will need more: stronger

academic skills to succeed in college, and -- if Tucker is right -- skills
in 

the mental processes to generate new ideas or concepts, and new associations

between existing concepts, and perhaps other kinds of creativity.> Mary
Lynn, I 

would like to challenge the belief that we "owe [it] to our students
to get them 

to community college or training as fast as possible." This has not
produced 

good results for adult students whose goal is to succeed in college. Only
a very 

small percentage of adult GED holders actually succeed in college, often
because 

they lack the academic reading and writing skills, and numeracy (especially

algebra) that they need to enroll in regular (not developmental) courses.

Unfortunately way too many use up their college financial aide in college

developmental courses and then have to drop out before achieving a certificate

or degree. Many of these students will need to take the time to prepare
for 

college in their GED preparation program, not fast track to the GED test.>
David 

J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>
On Oct 29, 2007, at 3:27 PM, Mary Lynn Simons 

wrote:> I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills;
critical 

thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against teachers wasting student
time 

with too much talking, both by students and by themselves, and calling
it 

"creativity". In order to be able to pass the tests, students
must grapple with 

the five subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and

mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively discussions, though

interesting, can keep students from doing what they need to do to be able
to 

pass. Adult education students have busy lives and have little time to
get their 

GED. I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college
or 

training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us
to 

decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best.
We must respect the 

goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.>>

From: andreawilder at comcast.net>>
Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400>> To: 

assessment at nifl.gov>>
Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, 

Issue 33>>>> Words are so tricky, I don't really know what
either of you two 

(Mary>> Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes,
what would>> 

I see???>> would there be a real difference?>> Thanks.>>>>
Andrea>> On Oct 29, 

2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:>>>>> Wow, I must
say I disagree with 

Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents>>> come in just wanting
to pass the test, 

but have no critical thinking>>> or transitional college skills.
If we don't 

help them understand and>>> acquire some of those skills, they
will not be able 

to succeed with>>> the transition to higher education. If not
us, who? I think 

it is one>>> of the first duties of any teacher to give students
what they need 

to>>> succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is>>>

paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.>>>>>>
Thanks,>>> 

Mary Lynn Carver>>> ABE/GED Instructor>>> College of
Lake County>>> Building 4, 

Office 405>>> 19351 W. Washington Street>>> Grayslake,
IL 60031>>> 

Phone:847/543-2677>>> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu>>>
Fax: 847/543-7580>>>>>> 

"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be>>>
constantly 

amused" -- Unknown>>>>>> We now accept the fact
that learning is a lifelong 

process of keeping>>> abreast of change. And the most pressing
task is to teach 

people how>>> to learn. --Peter F. Drucker>>>>>>
________________________________>>>>>> 

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
on behalf of>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>>

Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM>>> To: assessment at nifl.gov>>>
Subject: Assessment 

Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>>>>>>>>>>>
Send Assessment mailing list submissions 

to>>> assessment at nifl.gov>>>>>>
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide 

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send a message with subject or body 'help' to>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>>>>>

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Contents of Assessment digest...">>>>>>>>>
Today's Topics:>>>>>> 1. [Assessment 

1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David J. Rosen)>>>
2. [Assessment 

1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Mary Lynn
Simons)>>> 3. 

[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>
(Andrea 

Wilder)>>> 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching
Skills>>> (David 

J. Rosen)>>> 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity
(David J.>>> 

Rosen)>>> 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need
to know!>>> 

(Donna Chambers)>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>>

Message: 1>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400>>>
From: David J. Rosen>>>> 

Subject: [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>>
To: The 

Technology and Literacy Discussion List>,>>> The Adult Literacy
Professional 

Development Discussion List>>>>, The Assessment>>>
Discussion List>>>>, The 

Adult English Language Learners>>> Discussion>>> List>>>>
Message-ID: >>> 

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>>

format=flowed>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>>
The Media Library of Teaching Skills 

(MLoTS) project, a free Web->>> based library of short digital
videos of adult 

education classrooms>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created
reading and 

numeracy>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>>
? 

NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>>
tutoring)>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>> ? OTAN (integrating

technology)>>> and>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment
to capture what 

low-literate ESOL>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>>
I hope you 

will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>> tutoring
short 

videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>> hoping that
MLoTS will 

become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>> adult literacy
education classroom 

videos.>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 2>>>
Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 

01:01:15 +0000>>> From: Mary Lynn Simons>>>> Subject:
[Assessment 1012] Re: GED 

Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The Assessment Discussion
List>>>> 

Message-ID:>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252">>>>>>>>>

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>>

accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>>
decide 

what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to>>>
be able to 

pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to>>>
college or 

training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>
----------------------------------------> 

From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
To: assessment at nifl.gov>
Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>> 

2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>>
what you 

need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>>
in GED programs, 

especially if> students are planning to go on to>>> college!
Students who pass 

the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>> think creatively,
explore abstract 

ideas, and> weigh options are>>> usually at a loss in the college
classroom. 

Most colleges> require>>> program elements such as "writing
across the 

curriculum." As we> know,>>> writing requires abstract
thought, the kind adults 

need to develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing classes
require understanding 

and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive
essay and more.>>> 

Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>>
creative 

forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>>
students to 

truly> understand history, they must be able to vi>>> sualize
different time 

periods.> Symbolic thought translates into>>> statistics and
math classes in 

which> graphs, numbers and equations>>> are used to communicate
ideas. The list 

goes> on.>> Someone here or in>>> another posting made
the remark that students 

in a GED> class who are>>> not reading in class are not practicing
reading at 

all. If> the>>> instructor is writing on the board, if the
students are writing, 

if>>> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading.
In terms of>>> 

more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need>>>
to take 

that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline>>>
that we might 

not> get with GED students. But especially with students>>>
who want to pursue> 

higher education after earning the GED, we need to>>> have the
time to teach> 

them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>> now ran across
an essay from 

Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>> long time but did
in my past lives. 

The essay demonstrates how>>>> creativity is used in the co>>>
llege classroom 

as well as what GED students can> expect in college>>> (though
perhaps not to 

this extent, depending on the> teacher and the>>> class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>>

I'm a firm>>> believer in extensive transitional services for
GED students> 

planning>>> to attend college, and I think it's essential to have>

communications>>> between public schools and college to make this
happen if we> 

want GED>>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should
include>>>> 

creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>>
Mercurio 

Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>>
Public Schools> 

Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>>
work 703-791-8387> fax 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>>
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>>

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>
Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>>
List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need>>>
to know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>> creativity.
Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>>
means to an end -- that is, 

with creative teaching> approaches will>>> more students have
more and higher 

academic skills,> better test>>> scores? Or is creativity itself
an end -- that 

is, do we> want>>> students to be both academically prepared
and creative? Or> 

both? And>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would
argue, as Marc Tucker 

does,>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity,
and I would>>> 

put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and>>>
as an 

end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should>>>
provide 

students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that>>>
are strong enough 

to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>> skills
(these may be 

inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>> the skills
of creative 

problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>> assessment list,
let me ask what are we 

measuring>>>> now adult secondary education programs?>>
? Perhaps academic 

skills,>>>> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we
measuring critical>>>> 

thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in>>>>
adult 

literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc>>>>
Tucker is right, 

we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest>>>>
economic assets, one of 

the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree>>>> with Tucker
and believe that the 

nearly exclusive focus on high>>>>> stakes basic skills
tests for K-12, and the 

focus on only>>>> traditional> basic skills for the GED
tests disrespects 

important>>>> creative skills> like the ability to look
at a problem freshly 

and>>>> from different> perspectives, the ability to try
out and evaluate a>>>> 

range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image,>>>>
a 

moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language,>>>>
or> 

rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead>>>>
to> 

disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin>>> king (what
we now> often 

describe as "thinking outside the box").>>>>>
Are these goals that every GED 

student has or should have. No. Should>>>> they be? Not necessarily.
But for 

students who see the GED or high>>>> school diploma as a way
out of poverty, as 

a stepping stone to stable>>>> employment and self-sufficiency,
as a key to open 

the door to>>>> successful post-secondary learning, these are
the skills we 

should be>>>> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including
critical 

thinking>>>> and creativity.>> I invite your comments
on this.>> David J. 

Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>
On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F>>> 

wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching>>>
critical>> 

thinking skills which once our students know how to think>>> in
a>> critical 

thinking way they will be successful in achieving>>> their>>
education and other 

life goals. However, just like K-12>>> education,>> adult
education is captured 

on the high stakes spinning>>> wheel of>> accountability
which stifle>>> s 

creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni
Borge>>>>>>> BHCC>> Adult 

Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>>>>
From: 

assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
[mailto:assessment->>>>>
bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf 

Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October>>> 25, 2007 4:30
PM>> To: The 

Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1001]
Re: GED Discussion - 

what you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>> I agree
that creativity is not the enemy of 

success on standardized>>>>> test. We need look no further
then those who have 

been successful>> on>>> any type of test. We tend to use
terms like natuarally 

gifted,>> just>>> smart, etc. If you speak to these folks
they are well>> 

rounded, enjoy>>> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms
like>> "I 

don't know,>>> I just know stuff." Researchers have found
that>> this may be 

the>>> reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>>
there is more>>> 

disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure>>>
to the 

arts, banking industry, faculty>>> ,>> medicine, legal issues
as part of your 

everyday life tends to>>> offer>> more of an advantage when
testing then someone 

whose only>>> exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.
My students 

participate>>> in a>> quite a few creative projects and
those that "get into it" 

tend>>> to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel
it is a waste of>>> 

time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally>>>
frustrated>> 

when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they>>>
would>> like." 

Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>>>>
activities that have 

to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>>>>> more
creativity!>>>> Shirley 

Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>>>>> NHC-Carver>>>>
djrosen at comcast.net
wrote:>>>> 

Colleagues,>>>> I am a>>> proponent of creativity
in adult literacy education 

-->> indeed in all>>> education. As Marc Tucker, President
of the National>> 

Center for>>> Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>>
recently to 

the>>> National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>>>>>;
www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html

, the U.S. education system -->>>>>>> and he includes
adult education, cannot be 

competitive without>>>>> high>> academic standards
AND creativity.>>>> But many 

GED teachers>>>>> and administrators believe that their>>
students will not pass 

the>>>>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge
needed to pass the>>>>> 

test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.
(Many>>>>> K-12 

teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe>>>>>
creativity 

distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>>>
the one to raise 

this>> issue, but it's the key question on the>>>>>
minds of many GED teachers>> 

and administrators, so I invite the>>>>> panelists to address
it.>>>> Is 

creativity a distraction or is it>>>>> essential for success?
Why?>>>>>> David 

J. Rosen>>>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>
-------------- Original message>>>>> 

---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>>
Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We've had 

several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>>>>>>
wanted to>>> give a 

qu>>> ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>
discussion.>>> 

For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested>>>
resources 

go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>>

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from
yesterday ->>> there 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>
Please>>> post 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>>
now!>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion
List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>
NIFL Assessment Discussion 

List>>> Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

From:>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment
942] GED Discussion - what>>> 

you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>>
Hi>>> 

everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers
over the past day,>>> and so 

I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you>>> can get
the information>> on 

this discussion. For the full>>> announcement, information on>>
guests, and 

suggested resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the
posts from yesterday ?>>> there 

were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>

assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>> Please
post your questions and also your 

own experiences to share>>> now!>>>>>>>>
Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 

Assessment Discussion>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Marie Cora>>>>>>> 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>
NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> 

Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>>

Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>
To unsubscribe or>>> change your 

subscription settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>

Email delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>
------>>> ------------------------->> 

National Institute for Literacy>>>>> Assessment mailing
list>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>
To unsubscribe or>>> change your subscription settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>
Email 

delivered to>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------->> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing
list>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>
To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>
Email 

delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>
-------------------------------> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 

please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>
Email 

delivered to>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>>
-------------------------------> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings>>> , 

please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>
Email>>> delivered 

to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>
_________________________________________________________________>>>

Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>>
Stop by 

today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>>

ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>>
Message: 

3>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400>>> From: Andrea
Wilder>>>> Subject: 

[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>
To: The 

Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type:
text/plain; 

charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>>
Hi Mary Lynn-->>>>>> One 

of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been: "Don't>>>
waste their 

time." Is this what you are getting
at?>>>>>> Andrea>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007,
at 

9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:>>>>>>>>>>>
Community Colleges test students 

when they enter and then teach them>>>> accordingly. It is
not our job to 

paternalistically/maternalistically>>>> decide what is best
for our students 

beyond what they need to know to>>>> be able to pass the test.
We must not hold 

them back. Let them get to>>>> college or training as fast
as 

possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
----------------------------------------> From:>>>> 

Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
To: assessment at nifl.gov>
Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>>> 2007 

09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>>>
what you 

need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>>>
in GED programs, 

especially if> students are planning to go on to>>>> college!
Students who pass 

the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>>> think creatively,
explore abstract 

ideas, and> weigh options are>>>> usually at a loss in the
college classroom. 

Most colleges> require>>>> program elements such as "writing
across the 

curriculum." As we> know,>>>> writing requires abstract
thought, the kind adults 

need to develop.>>>>>> Even basic college writing classes
require understanding 

and using>>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive
essay and more.>>>> 

Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>>>

creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>>>

students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize>>>>

different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics>>>>
and 

math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to>>>>
communicate 

ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another>>>>
posting made the 

remark that students in a GED> class who are not>>>> reading
in class are not 

practicing reading at all. If> the instructor>>>> is writing
on the board, if 

the students are writing, if the> students>>>> are taking
practice tests, they 

ARE reading. In terms of more>>>>> formalized, lengthier
readings, students will 

most likely need to take>>>> that> home. Yes, this requires
a certain amount of 

discipline that we>>>> might not> get with GED students.
But especially with 

students who>>>> want to pursue> higher education after
earning the GED, we need 

to>>>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>>
Finally, I just>>>> 

now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in
a>>>> long 

time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>>>>>
creativity is 

used in the college classroom as well as what GED>>>> students
can> expect in 

college (though perhaps not to this extent,>>>> depending on
the> teacher and 

the class).>>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>>
I'm a firm 

believer in>>>> extensive transitional services for GED students>
planning to 

attend>>>> college, and I think it's essential to have>
communications 

between>>>> public schools and college to make this happen
if we> want GED>>>> 

students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>>>
creativity 

used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>>>
Mercurio 

Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>>>
Public Schools> 

Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>>>
work 703-791-8387> fax 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>>>
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>>>

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>
Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>>> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>>>
List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to>>>>
know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>>>
creativity. Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>>>
means to an end -- that 

is, with creative teaching> approaches will>>>> more students
have more and 

higher academic skills,> better test>>>> scores? Or is creativity
itself an end 

-- that is, do we> want>>>> students to be both academically
prepared and 

creative? Or> both? And>>>> where do critical skills fit
in?>> I would argue, as 

Marc Tucker does,>>>> that we need both high academic> skills
and creativity, 

and I would>>>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories,
both as a 

means and>>>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education
(e.g. GED) programs 

should>>>> provide students with the> opportunity to have
academic skills 

that>>>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong
critical thinking>>>> 

skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>>>
the 

skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>>>
assessment list, 

let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>>>
education programs?>> 

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>>> standardized
tests> ? Are we 

measuring critical thinking skills, and>>>> if so how?>
? I am not aware that 

anyone in adult literacy education>>>> is measuring> creative
skills.>> If Marc 

Tucker is right, we are not>>>> paying attention to one of
the> greatest 

economic assets, one of the>>>> historic strengths of the U.S.
I> agree with 

Tucker and believe that>>>> the nearly exclusive focus on high>
stakes basic 

skills tests for>>>> K-12, and the focus on only traditional>
basic skills for 

the GED>>>> tests disrespects important creative skills>
like the ability to 

look>>>> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives,
the ability 

to>>>> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability
to represent>>>> 

an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other>>>>

figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and>>>>
follow, 

but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of>>>>
thinking 

(what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the>>>>
box").>> Are these 

goals that every GED student has or should have.>>>> No. Should>
they be? Not 

necessarily. But for students who see the GED>>>> or high>
school diploma as a 

way out of poverty, as a stepping stone>>>> to stable> employment
and 

self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door>>>> to> successful
post-secondary 

learning, these are the skills we should>>>> be> teaching
and measuring: 

academic skills, including critical>>>> thinking> and creativity.>>
I invite 

your comments on this.>> David J.>>>> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>
On Oct 26, 

2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,>>>> Toni F wrote:>>> When
we are referring to 

creativity do we mean>>>> teaching critical>> thinking
skills which once our 

students know how>>>> to think in a>> critical thinking
way they will be 

successful in>>>> achieving their>> education and other
life goals. However, 

just like>>>> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured
on the high 

stakes>>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles
creativity and>>>> 

teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>
BHCC>> Adult>>>> Education & 

Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>
From:>>>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov

[mailto:assessment->>
bounces at nifl.gov]
On>>>> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: 

Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>>>>> To: The Assessment
Discussion List>> 

Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:>>>> GED Discussion - what you
need to 

know!>>>>>>>> I agree that>>>> creativity
is not the enemy of success on 

standardized>> test. We need>>>> look no further then
those who have been 

successful>> on any type of>>>> test. We tend to use
terms like natuarally 

gifted,>> just smart, etc.>>>> If you speak to these
folks they are well>> 

rounded, enjoy reading,>>>> mvies, theater, they tend to use
terms like>> "I 

don't know, I just>>>> know stuff." Researchers have found
that>> this may be 

the reason for>>>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>>
there is more 

disparity>>>> between socio economic background then>>
ethnicity. Exposure to 

the>>>> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine,
legal issues as part of>>>> 

your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing>>>>
then 

someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.>>>>
My students 

participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those>>>>
that "get into 

it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that>>>>
feel it is a waste of 

time>> and they just want to "study for the GED">>>>
are generally frustrated>> 

when "all of their hard work does not pay>>>> off like
they would>> like." 

Creativity also leads to retention;>>>> especially those>>
activities that have 

to be completed in increments.>>>> Let's bring on>> more
creativity!>>>> Shirley 

Ledet>>>> GED>>>> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>>
djrosen at comcast.net

wrote:>>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am
a proponent of creativity in adult 

literacy>>>> education -->> indeed in all education.
As Marc Tucker, President 

of>>>> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy,
has said in a>>>> 

presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,>>>>

http://>>; www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html
, the U.S.>>>> education>>>> system 

-->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive>>>>
without high>> 

academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED>>>>
teachers and 

administrators believe that their>> students will not>>>>
pass the GED unless 

they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to>>>> pass
the test, that 

creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.>>>>
(Many K-12 teachers,>> 

administrators or policy makers also believe>>>> creativity
distracts>> from 

passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>> the one to raise
this>> issue, but 

it's the key question on the minds>>>> of many GED teachers>>
and 

administrators, so I invite the panelists>>>> to address it.>>>>
Is creativity a 

distraction or is it essential for>>>> success? Why?>>>>>>
David J. Rosen>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>
-------------- Original message ---------------------->> 

From: "Marie>>>> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>
We've had several new subscribers 

over the>>>> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>>
give a quick reminder where you 

can>>>> get the information on this>>> discussion.
For the full 

announcement,>>>> information on guests, and>>> suggested
resources go 

to:>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>>>

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from
yesterday ->>>> there 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>>

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>
Please>>>> post 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>>>
now!>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion
List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>
NIFL Assessment Discussion 

List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

From:>>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject:
[Assessment 942] GED Discussion - 

what>>>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14
+0000>>>> Hi>>>> 

everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers
over the past day,>>>> and 

so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the>>>>
information>> 

on this discussion. For the full announcement,>>>> information
on>> guests, and 

suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the
posts from yesterday ?>>>> there 

were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>

assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>>>
Please post your questions and also your 

own experiences to share>>>> now!>>>>>>>>
Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 

Assessment Discussion>>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Marie Cora>>>>>>>> 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>
NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>>> 

Moderator>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>>>

Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>
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your subscription settings, please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>

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------------------------------>>>>>> 

Message: 4>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400>>>
From: "David J. 

Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library
of Teaching Skills>>> 

To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>>
Content-Type: text/plain; 

charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>>
....and the Web address 

for MLoTS is:>>>>>> http://www.mlots.org>>>>>>
David J. Rosen>>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>
On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen 

wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>>>>
The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) 

project, a free Web->>>> based library of short digital videos
of adult 

education classrooms>>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created
reading and 

numeracy>>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those
from:>>>>>>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>>>
tutoring)>>>> 

? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>>> ?
OTAN (integrating 

technology)>>>> and>>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment
to capture what 

low-literate ESOL>>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>>>>
I hope 

you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>>>
tutoring short 

videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>>> hoping
that MLoTS will 

become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>>> adult
literacy education classroom 

videos.>>>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>>
djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------->>>> National Institute for
Literacy>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>
To unsubscribe or change 

your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>

Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 5>>>
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 

23:17:38 -0400>>> From: "David J. Rosen">>>>
Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED 

preparation and creativity>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>>
Message-ID: 

>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed>>>>>>

Hello Andrea,>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:>>>>>>>
Has anybody yet in this 

conversation defined 1. critical reading>>>> and 2. creativity?>>>>>>
Here's 

more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite>>> unlikely
that we will 

agree on a definition. There are more than 60>>> of them in the
psychological 

literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far>>> as I am aware there is
no standardized 

measurement instrument for>>> creativity. Some believe it is inherited;
some 

believe it can be>>> taught; some believe it can be nurtured or
encouraged. I 

believe that>>> some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least
nurtured and 

that>>> it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned
with the>>> 

kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would>>>
agree, 

I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might>>>
differ in 

describing the paths to it. And it may look different in>>> different
contexts, 

in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and>>> in the creative
problem 

solving of daily living.>>>>>> In the context in which
I raised the issue of 

creativity, I was>>> thinking of the application of new ideas,
what some would 

refer to as>>> innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity
that I 

believe>>> Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans
have 

historically>>> valued and excelled at, that has been an element
of American 

economic>>> success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in
the education>>> 

systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.>>>>>>
Are 

adult literacy education students (including basic education,>>>
secondary 

education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If>>>
so, should we 

nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In>>> many
GED programs I 

have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even>>> acknowledged
in program 

goals or objectives. And I have never seen>>> it measured. This
indicates to me 

that, as a field, we do not value>>> and support student creativity.
I agree 

with Marc Tucker that, if we>>> are interested in Americans' global

competitiveness that we should>>> value creativity, and of course,
there are 

other good reasons to>>> nourish creativity.>>>>>>
What do you think about 

this?>>>>>>>>> * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various
approaches to and definitions 

of>>> creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of
creativity:>>> 

Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.>>>>>>
David 

J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------>>>>>> 

Message: 6>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400>>>
From: "Donna 

Chambers">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion
- what you need to 

know!>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>>
Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: 

text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";>>>
reply-type=original>>>>>> 

Mary Lynn,>>>>>> Your argument to push learners forward
is a common belief. I am 

not>>> suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare
them for>>> 

just>>> "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE"
responsibility of our>>> 

job.>>> Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic
skills of a>>> 

high>>> school student and be ready to transition to college level
academics>>> 

is in>>> the learners' best interest in respect to time and money.
Community>>> 

College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they>>>
do. 

If>>> the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required
to enter>>> 

community>>> college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would
be smoother, 

but>>> it is>>> not. Preparation for the learners next
steps, which includes 

basic>>> and>>> secondary fundamental skills, is the
responsibility of Adult 

Literacy.>>>>>> Donna Chambers>>>>>>>>>
----- Original Message ----->>> From: 

"Mary Lynn Simons">>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion
List">>>> Sent: Saturday, 

October 27, 2007 9:01 PM>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED
Discussion - what 

you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>>> Community
Colleges test students when they enter 

and then teach them>>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>>

decide>>> what is best for our students beyond what they need
to know to be 

able>>> to>>> pass the test. We must not hold them back.
Let them get to college 

or>>> training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>
----------------------------------------> 

From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net>
To:>>> assessment at nifl.gov>
Date: Sat, 27 Oct 

2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1007] Re: GED
Discussion - what you 

need to know!>> David,>>> I>>> agree that creativity
is essential in GED 

programs, especially if>>>> students>>> are planning
to go on to college! 

Students who pass the GED with>>>> minimal>>> ability
to freely think 

creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh>>> options are
usually at a loss 

in the college classroom. Most colleges>>>> require program
elements such as 

"writing across the curriculum." As>>> we>>>>
know, writing requires abstract 

thought, the kind adults need to>>> develop.>>>>>
Even basic college writing 

classes require understanding and using>>>> rhetorical patterns
found in the 

descriptive essay and more.>>> Humanities>>>> courses
demand students to 

understand and even implement creative>>> forms,>>>>
figures of speech, 

figurative language, and more. For students to>>> truly>>>>
understand history, 

they must be able to visualize different time>>> periods.>>>>
Symbolic thought 

translates into statistics and math classes in which>>>> graphs,
numbers and 

equations are used to communicate ideas. The list>>> goes>>>>
on.>> Someone here 

or in another posting made the remark that students>>> in a>>>
GED> class who 

are not reading in class are not practicing reading at>>> all.>>>
If> the 

instructor is writing on the board, if the students are>>> writing,
if>>> the> 

students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>>
more>>>> 

formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take>>>

that>>>> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline
that we 

might>>> not>>>> get with GED students. But especially
with students who want to 

pursue>>>> higher education after earning the GED, we need
to have the time 

to>>> teach>>>> them to think critically.>>
Finally, I just now ran across an 

essay>>> from>>> Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied
in a long time but did in 

my past>>> lives.>>> The essay demonstrates how> creativity
is used in the 

college>>> classroom as>>> well as what GED students
can> expect in college 

(though perhaps not>>> to this>>> extent, depending on
the> teacher and the 

class).>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>>
I'm a firm believer 

in>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning
to attend>>> 

college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between>>>
public>>> 

schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to>>>

succeed.>>> Part of these discussions should include> creativity
used and 

expected>>> in>>> every academic setting.>>>
Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL 

Online>>> Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools>
Adult Education>>>> 

P.O. Box>>> 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387>
fax>>> 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:>>>
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>>>>
Behalf>>> Of David J. Rosen> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To:
The>>> Assessment Discussion List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED>>> Discussion ->>>
what you need to know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we>>> mean>>>
by creativity. Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>>
means>>> to an end -- that 

is, with creative teaching> approaches will more>>> students>>>
have more and 

higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is>>> creativity>>>
itself an 

end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically>>>
prepared and 

creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit>>> in?>>
I>>> would argue, 

as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>>>> skills>>>
and 

creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these>>>
catregories, 

both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>>>> education>>>
(e.g. GED) 

programs should provide students with the> opportunity to>>>
have>>> academic 

skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong>>>
critical 

thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong>>> academic>>>
skills), 

and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is>>>
the>>> 

assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>>

education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>>

standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and>>>
if so>>> 

how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is>>>

measuring>>>> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right,
we are not paying>>> 

attention to>>> one of the> greatest economic assets, one of
the historic 

strengths of>>> the>>> U.S. I> agree with Tucker and
believe that the nearly 

exclusive focus>>> on>>> high> stakes basic skills
tests for K-12, and the focus 

on only>>> traditional>>>> basic skills for the GED
tests disrespects important 

creative skills>>>> like>>> the ability to look at
a problem freshly and from 

different>>>> perspectives,>>> the ability to try
out and evaluate a range of> 

solutions, the ability>>> to>>> represent an idea with
an image, a moving> 

image, a drawing; a>>> metaphor or>>> other figurative
language, or> rhetoric; 

and the ability to understand>>> and>>> follow, but instead
to> disregard 

instructions or traditional paths of>>> thinking (what we now>
often describe as 

"thinking outside the>>> box").>> Are>>>
these goals that every GED student has 

or should have. No. Should>>>> they be?>>> Not necessarily.
But for students who 

see the GED or high> school>>> diploma as>>> a way
out of poverty, as a stepping 

stone to stable> employment and>>> self-sufficiency, as a key
to open the door 

to> successful>>> post-secondary>>> learning, these
are the skills we should be> 

teaching and measuring:>>> academic skills, including critical
thinking> and 

creativity.>> I>>> invite>>> your comments on this.>>
David J. Rosen> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>>
On>>> Oct 26,>>> 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F 

wrote:>>> When we are referring to>>> creativity do we
mean teaching critical>> 

thinking skills which once>>> our>>> students know how
to think in a>> critical 

thinking way they will be>>> successful in achieving their>>
education and other 

life goals.>>> However,>>> just like K-12 education,>>
adult education is 

captured on the high>>> stakes>>> spinning wheel of>>
accountability which 

stifles creativity and>>> teachers>>> teach to the>>
test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> 

BHCC>> Adult Education &>>> Transitions>>>
Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:

assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>>
[mailto:assessment->>
bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf 

Of shirley ledet>>>>> Sent:>>> Thursday, October
25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The 

Assessment Discussion>>> List>>>>> Subject: [Assessment
1001] Re: GED Discussion 

- what you need to>>> know!>>>>>>>> I
agree that creativity is not the enemy of 

success on>>> standardized>> test. We need look no further
then those who have 

been>>> successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use
terms like 

natuarally>>> gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to
these folks they are 

well>>>>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend
to use terms 

like>>>>> "I>>> don't know, I just know stuff."
Researchers have found that>> 

this may>>> be>>> the reason for disparity between ethnicity.
I believe>> there 

is more>>> disparity between socio economic background then>>
ethnicity. 

Exposure>>> to>>> the arts, banking industry, faculty,>>
medicine, legal issues 

as part>>> of>>> your everyday life tends to offer>>
more of an advantage when 

testing>>> then>>> someone whose only exposure>>
is to go to school and study 

hard. My>>> students>>> participate in a>> quite
a few creative projects and 

those that "get>>> into>>> it" tend to>>
do better in all subjects. Those that 

feel it is a waste>>> of>>> time>> and they just
want to "study for the GED" are 

generally>>> frustrated>>>>> when "all of
their hard work does not pay off like 

they would>> like.">>> Creativity also leads to retention;
especially those>> 

activities that>>> have>>> to be completed in increments.
Let's bring on>> more 

creativity!>>>>>>> Shirley>>> Ledet>>>>
GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>
wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent
of 

creativity in adult literacy>>> education -->> indeed in
all education. As Marc 

Tucker, President of>>> the>>> National>> Center
for Education and the Economy, 

has said in a>>> presention>>>>> recently to the
National Commission on Adult 

Literacy, http://>>>>>>>>; www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html
, the U.S. 

education system -->>>>> and he>>> includes adult
education, cannot be 

competitive without high>> academic>>> standards AND creativity.>>>>
But many 

GED teachers and administrators>>> believe that their>>
students will not pass 

the GED unless they focus>>> on>>> skills and>>
knowledge needed to pass the 

test, that creativity is a>>>>> "distraction"
and a time-waster. (Many K-12 

teachers,>> administrators>>> or>>> policy makers
also believe creativity 

distracts>> from passing high>>> stakes>>> tests.)
I hate to be the one to raise 

this>> issue, but it's the key>>> question on the minds
of many GED teachers>> 

and administrators, so I>>> invite>>> the panelists to
address it.>>>> Is 

creativity a distraction or is it>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>>
David J. 

Rosen>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>
-------------- Original>>> message 

---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>>
Hi>>> everyone,>>>>>>>>> We've 

had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted>>>
to>>>>>> 

give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>>>>

discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>>>>

suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>>

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from
yesterday ->>> there>>> 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>
Please>>> post>>> 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>>>>

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion
List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>>>
NIFL Assessment Discussion 

List Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

From:>>> "Marie>>> Cora">> To:>>
Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what 

you>>> need to>>> know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007
14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi 

everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We?ve>>>
had several new subscribers over the past day, and 

so I>> wanted to>>> give a>>> quick reminder where
you can get the information>> 

on this discussion.>>> For>>> the full announcement,
information on>> guests, 

and suggested>>> resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>>>> If you
missed the posts from yesterday ? there 

were a couple ? you>>>>> can>>> catch up in the
archives at: 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>>>>
assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please 

post your questions and also>>> your>>> own experiences
to share now!>>>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>>
Assessment Discussion List 

Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>

NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------->>>>> National Institute
for Literacy>> 

Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>
To unsubscribe or change your 

subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>

Email>>> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>
------------------------------->>>>> 

National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>

Assessment at nifl.gov>>
To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>>

please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>
Email>>> 

delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------->>>>> 

National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>

Assessment at nifl.gov>>
To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>>

please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>
Email>>> 

delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>
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National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>>>>

Assessment at nifl.gov>
To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>>

please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>
Email>>> 

delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>>
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National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>>>>

Assessment at nifl.gov>
To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>>

please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>
Email>>> delivered 

to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>
_________________________________________________________________>>>

Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>>
Stop 

by>>> today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>>

ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>> ------------------------------->>>
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Institute for Literacy>>> Assessment mailing list>>>
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unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>

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Email delivered to 

donnaedp at cox.net>>>>>>>>>>>>
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------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>>
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mailing list>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>
To unsubscribe or change your 

subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>

End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>> ******************************************>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>>
Assessment 

mailing list>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>
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subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>

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From PTyler at msde.state.md.us  Wed Oct 31 16:45:03 2007
From: PTyler at msde.state.md.us (Patricia Tyler)
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 16:45:03 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1051] Re: Family Literacy Intake Questionnaire
In-Reply-To: <1c1b65fe0710301606o5447b915r6d152fd1c8aa66c8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2433CF3169B9054193EB844AC38230CC0AFCB44A@msebex1.msde.net>

Daniel:

 

In Maryland, we developed a simple Family Literacy Intake Survey that
establishes a baseline of family literacy practices. The questions
regard how much time is spent reading with children, and how often
parents visit the library with children, and what children's books or
magazines they have acquired for their homes.  Additionally the survey
queries how often they have met with their children's teachers (or child
care professional), how often they have helped with school work (in
class or homework), and how often they have participated in school
activities.  As with any Intake process, the expectation is that it
would be completed (either in group or individually) with guidance from
staff.

 

As stated, this survey establishes a baseline at intake.  Measurement of
increases in these activities is another issue.  Logging of the various
activities your program strives to promote is a first step, but a log of
activity may not provide the level of documentation you need.  In order
to more substantially document a parent's reading with children for
example, some of our programs use a form that the parent completes with
the date and time the parent read to the child, name of the book, some
information about the plot or theme of the book, whether the child liked
the book, and a statement of the parent's opinion of the book (why they
did or did not like the book for their child).

 

Another activity that is well documented by some of our Maryland Family
Literacy grantees is meeting with the child(ren)'s teacher(s).  Prior to
the conferences, parents are assisted with planning for the conference
and articulating the questions they would like to ask.  The parents fill
out a form with some of the basics of the conference (date, time,
location, teacher's name, subjects to be discussed), take it to the
conference and obtain the teacher's signature. This works well in a
program where the school staff is very familiar with the Family Literacy
program.

 

Both of these methods of documenting the activities serve as contextual
learning opportunities for the parents.

 

Patricia Tyler

Adult Education and Family Literacy Specialist

Maryland State Department of Education

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Daniel Rizik-Baer
Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 6:06 PM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 1045] Family Literacy Intake Questionnaire

 

Does anyone know of a standard intake questionnaire, or a questionnaire
that they have used that they feel represents the family literacy
practices in the home well? I need to find something to use as an intake
method for a new Parent Education Involvement Program which requires
this. 

Any help would be greatly appreciated. 

-- 
Daniel Rizik-Baer
Family Literacy Coordinator
Children Youth and Family Collaborative
(818) 442-4407 cell 

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From jrethlake at hcde-texas.org  Thu Nov  1 00:24:59 2007
From: jrethlake at hcde-texas.org (Joanie Rethlake)
Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 23:24:59 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1052] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking
In-Reply-To: <8C9E9EF92397B0F-A30-5EAF@WEBMAIL-DF12.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <E43278D67408F248838A1BDB75430605099FA45D@EV-SERVER.hcdemain.hcde.loc>

Bravo for being a creative educator and retaining your students!!
 
Joanie Rethlake, Texas LEARNS
 
________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 10:10 AM
To: assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 1048] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking
 
The thing is that students learn better if information relates to their
knowledge and experiences. For example, in my program, students have
difficulty writing. Once we get them to write about their own
experiences, and teach them to do so, they become better writers. They
also publish their stories. Also, our students face health barriers and
want to learn about health prevention, improvement, access. They also
take nutrition classes. Because they are interested in these topics,
they learn fast and they remain focused and motivated. Also we have good
retention. 

Ultimately, these topics do not deter them to learn information to pass
the GED. The GED is basically having good reading, writing and math
skills and test taking skills. It doesn't really matter if you teaching
them to read by using the Glencoe GED book, or a health brochure, a bag
of potato chips, legal information, etc. I do this workshop in which I
show teachers that I can teach pretty much all the math skills for the
GED using a bag of potato chips. I can also teach reading, writing and
graph skills with the same bag. Thing is, bags of potato chips are
fascinating to students.  They capture  their imagination and keep them
focused and working on task.  They are also learning how to read
nutrition labels and how to watch what they eat. 

So, in a sense, teaching the GED and teaching things that are not in the
book are not necessarily contradictory things. Also, in my program, in
every class,  we have a small percentage of students who have diabetes
and don't even know about it. We do a glucose test every semester. Those
who have diabetes are referred to the doctor. To us, even if these
students don't pass the GED, it is a triumph. We essentially saved
limbs, if not lives. In fact, most of these students do get the GED. We
also have victims of domestic violence that start to get counseling,
support and protection. Many of these people would never get the GED. 

Finally, as I said before, our students get published, which is a huge
self esteem builder. You can see the student's writings at
http://bordersenses.com/memorias.  Click on the books below. You can
click on traducciones on the right to read the translations. Imagine a
GED student who gets published and shows that to her peers, teachers,
relatives. How many students ever dream of getting published or think
that they have any knowledge worth sharing?

Andres
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 7:25 pm
Subject: [Assessment 1047] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking

 I still say students should get their GED as soon as possible and that
it is 

not our job to hold students back by teaching them not only to pass the
test but 

things we personally think they should know. We are hired to help people
pass 

the test; that is what the taxpayers want us to do and that is why
students come 

to the adult school in the first place.  Also, I think the GED is a
pretty good 

test. One-third of  high school graduates cannot pass it. I don't know
what 

states you all come from, but where I am in California, if someone
passes the 

GED, that is a sign their skills are fairly high, high enough not to
spend time 

on much remediation in the community college. The army used to prefer
diploma 

grads to GED grads, not because the latter were less educated but
because 

diploma grads have more stick-to-itiveness. Perhaps this is true in
college also 

and accounts for the high college dropout rate of GED grads. 

________________________________> From: djrosen at comcast.net> Date: Tue,
30 Oct 

2007 09:30:31 -0400> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment 1035]
GED, 

Creativity and Fast-tracking>> Mary Lynn wrote:> I think we owe to to
our 

students to get them to community college or training as fast as
possible. That 

is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need
"creativity", a 

nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it
is 

paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.> Creativity need not be 

nebulous. For example, here's a good definition from the Wikipedia:>
"Creativity 

(or creativeness) is a mental process involving the generation of new
ideas or 

concepts, or new associations between existing ideas or concepts." 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity> I am sure you can see the
direct 

application of this kind of creativity to scoring high on the GED tests,
for 

example in writing a good essay, and perhaps in other areas. Equally
important 

-- for students who believe that GED preparation is the key to success
in 

post-secondary education and some kinds of job skills training --
generating new 

ideas or concepts and making associations between existing ideas or
concepts is 

essential for success.> Let me return to the context in which I raised
the issue 

of creativity, Marc Tucker's claim that if the U.S. is to be
competitive, if 

Americans are to have good jobs, they not only need strong basic skills
and some 

college education, but they also need to be creative, that this is the
cultural 

edge that leads to innovation and invention, that makes the American
economy 

strong, and will enable American workers to thrive. Some adult education

students, of course, don't care about that. They want the GED for other
reasons, 

and that's fine. Let them fast track to the test. Those who want GED 

prepararation for college and good jobs, however, will need more:
stronger 

academic skills to succeed in college, and -- if Tucker is right --
skills in 

the mental processes to generate new ideas or concepts, and new
associations 

between existing concepts, and perhaps other kinds of creativity.> Mary
Lynn, I 

would like to challenge the belief that we "owe [it] to our students to
get them 

to community college or training as fast as possible." This has not
produced 

good results for adult students whose goal is to succeed in college.
Only a very 

small percentage of adult GED holders actually succeed in college, often
because 

they lack the academic reading and writing skills, and numeracy
(especially 

algebra) that they need to enroll in regular (not developmental)
courses. 

Unfortunately way too many use up their college financial aide in
college 

developmental courses and then have to drop out before achieving a
certificate 

or degree. Many of these students will need to take the time to prepare
for 

college in their GED preparation program, not fast track to the GED
test.> David 

J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> On Oct 29, 2007, at 3:27 PM, Mary Lynn
Simons 

wrote:> I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills;
critical 

thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against teachers wasting
student time 

with too much talking, both by students and by themselves, and calling
it 

"creativity". In order to be able to pass the tests, students must
grapple with 

the five subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and 

mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively discussions,
though 

interesting, can keep students from doing what they need to do to be
able to 

pass. Adult education students have busy lives and have little time to
get their 

GED. I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college
or 

training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us
to 

decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must
respect the 

goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do
otherwise.>> 

From: andreawilder at comcast.net>> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400>>
To: 

assessment at nifl.gov>> Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest,
Vol 25, 

Issue 33>>>> Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you
two 

(Mary>> Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what
would>> 

I see???>> would there be a real difference?>> Thanks.>>>> Andrea>> On
Oct 29, 

2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:>>>>> Wow, I must say I
disagree with 

Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents>>> come in just wanting to pass
the test, 

but have no critical thinking>>> or transitional college skills. If we
don't 

help them understand and>>> acquire some of those skills, they will not
be able 

to succeed with>>> the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I
think 

it is one>>> of the first duties of any teacher to give students what
they need 

to>>> succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is>>> 

paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.>>>>>>
Thanks,>>> 

Mary Lynn Carver>>> ABE/GED Instructor>>> College of Lake County>>>
Building 4, 

Office 405>>> 19351 W. Washington Street>>> Grayslake, IL 60031>>> 

Phone:847/543-2677>>> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu>>> Fax:
847/543-7580>>>>>> 

"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be>>>
constantly 

amused" -- Unknown>>>>>> We now accept the fact that learning is a
lifelong 

process of keeping>>> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is
to teach 

people how>>> to learn. --Peter F. Drucker>>>>>>
________________________________>>>>>> 

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of>>>
assessment-request at nifl.gov>>> 

Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM>>> To: assessment at nifl.gov>>> Subject:
Assessment 

Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>>>>>>>>>>> Send Assessment mailing list
submissions 

to>>> assessment at nifl.gov>>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the
World Wide 

Web, visit>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> or, via
email, 

send a message with subject or body 'help' to>>>
assessment-request at nifl.gov>>>>>> 

You can reach the person managing the list at>>>
assessment-owner at nifl.gov>>>>>> 

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific>>>
than "Re: 

Contents of Assessment digest...">>>>>>>>> Today's Topics:>>>>>> 1.
[Assessment 

1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David J. Rosen)>>> 2.
[Assessment 

1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Mary Lynn
Simons)>>> 3. 

[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Andrea

Wilder)>>> 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>>
(David 

J. Rosen)>>> 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity (David
J.>>> 

Rosen)>>> 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to
know!>>> 

(Donna Chambers)>>>>>>>>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------->>
>>>> 

Message: 1>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400>>> From: David J.
Rosen>>>> 

Subject: [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> To: The 

Technology and Literacy Discussion List>,>>> The Adult Literacy
Professional 

Development Discussion List>>>>, The Assessment>>> Discussion List>>>>,
The 

Adult English Language Learners>>> Discussion>>> List>>>> Message-ID:
>>> 

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> 

format=flowed>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching
Skills 

(MLoTS) project, a free Web->>> based library of short digital videos of
adult 

education classrooms>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created
reading and 

numeracy>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>>
? 

NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>>
tutoring)>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>> ? OTAN
(integrating 

technology)>>> and>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what 

low-literate ESOL>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>> I
hope you 

will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>> tutoring
short 

videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>> hoping that MLoTS
will 

become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>> adult literacy education
classroom 

videos.>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 2>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct
2007 

01:01:15 +0000>>> From: Mary Lynn Simons>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012]
Re: GED 

Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The Assessment Discussion
List>>>> 

Message-ID:>>>> Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="Windows-1252">>>>>>>>> 

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>> 

accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>>
decide 

what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to>>> be
able to 

pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to>>> college or

training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>
----------------------------------------> 

From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27
Oct>>> 

2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>>
what you 

need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>> in GED
programs, 

especially if> students are planning to go on to>>> college! Students
who pass 

the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>> think creatively, explore
abstract 

ideas, and> weigh options are>>> usually at a loss in the college
classroom. 

Most colleges> require>>> program elements such as "writing across the 

curriculum." As we> know,>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind
adults 

need to develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require
understanding 

and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and
more.>>> 

Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>>
creative 

forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>>
students to 

truly> understand history, they must be able to vi>>> sualize different
time 

periods.> Symbolic thought translates into>>> statistics and math
classes in 

which> graphs, numbers and equations>>> are used to communicate ideas.
The list 

goes> on.>> Someone here or in>>> another posting made the remark that
students 

in a GED> class who are>>> not reading in class are not practicing
reading at 

all. If> the>>> instructor is writing on the board, if the students are
writing, 

if>>> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In
terms of>>> 

more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need>>>
to take 

that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline>>> that we
might 

not> get with GED students. But especially with students>>> who want to
pursue> 

higher education after earning the GED, we need to>>> have the time to
teach> 

them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>> now ran across an essay
from 

Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>> long time but did in my past
lives. 

The essay demonstrates how>>>> creativity is used in the co>>> llege
classroom 

as well as what GED students can> expect in college>>> (though perhaps
not to 

this extent, depending on the> teacher and the>>> class).
http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> 

I'm a firm>>> believer in extensive transitional services for GED
students> 

planning>>> to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> 

communications>>> between public schools and college to make this happen
if we> 

want GED>>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should
include>>>> 

creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>>
Mercurio 

Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>> Public
Schools> 

Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>> work 703-791-8387>
fax 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>> From:
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> 

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
<mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov%5DOn?> > Behalf Of David J.
Rosen>>>> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>>
List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need>>> to
know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>> creativity. Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means to an end --
that is, 

with creative teaching> approaches will>>> more students have more and
higher 

academic skills,> better test>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end
-- that 

is, do we> want>>> students to be both academically prepared and
creative? Or> 

both? And>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc
Tucker 

does,>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I
would>>> 

put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and>>>
as an 

end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should>>>
provide 

students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that>>> are
strong enough 

to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>> skills (these may be

inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>> the skills of creative

problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>> assessment list, let me ask
what are we 

measuring>>>> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps
academic 

skills,>>>> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring
critical>>>> 

thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in>>>>
adult 

literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc>>>> Tucker
is right, 

we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest>>>> economic assets,
one of 

the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree>>>> with Tucker and believe
that the 

nearly exclusive focus on high>>>>> stakes basic skills tests for K-12,
and the 

focus on only>>>> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests
disrespects 

important>>>> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem
freshly 

and>>>> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and
evaluate a>>>> 

range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image,>>>>
a 

moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language,>>>>
or> 

rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead>>>> to> 

disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin>>> king (what we
now> often 

describe as "thinking outside the box").>>>>> Are these goals that every
GED 

student has or should have. No. Should>>>> they be? Not necessarily. But
for 

students who see the GED or high>>>> school diploma as a way out of
poverty, as 

a stepping stone to stable>>>> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key
to open 

the door to>>>> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills
we 

should be>>>> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including
critical 

thinking>>>> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David
J. 

Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,
Toni F>>> 

wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching>>>
critical>> 

thinking skills which once our students know how to think>>> in a>>
critical 

thinking way they will be successful in achieving>>> their>> education
and other 

life goals. However, just like K-12>>> education,>> adult education is
captured 

on the high stakes spinning>>> wheel of>> accountability which stifle>>>
s 

creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>>>>
BHCC>> Adult 

Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>>>> From: 

assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment- <mailto:assessment-?>
>>>>> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf 

Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October>>> 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The

Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1001] Re: GED
Discussion - 

what you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the
enemy of 

success on standardized>>>>> test. We need look no further then those
who have 

been successful>> on>>> any type of test. We tend to use terms like
natuarally 

gifted,>> just>>> smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are
well>> 

rounded, enjoy>>> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>>
"I 

don't know,>>> I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this
may be 

the>>> reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is
more>>> 

disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity.
Exposure>>> to the 

arts, banking industry, faculty>>> ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of
your 

everyday life tends to>>> offer>> more of an advantage when testing then
someone 

whose only>>> exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students 

participate>>> in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get
into it" 

tend>>> to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste
of>>> 

time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally>>>
frustrated>> 

when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they>>> would>>
like." 

Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>>>> activities
that have 

to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>>>>> more creativity!>>>>
Shirley 

Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net
wrote:>>>> 

Colleagues,>>>> I am a>>> proponent of creativity in adult literacy
education 

-->> indeed in all>>> education. As Marc Tucker, President of the
National>> 

Center for>>> Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>>
recently to 

the>>> National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>>>>>
www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html 

, the U.S. education system -->>>>>>> and he includes adult education,
cannot be 

competitive without>>>>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>>
But many 

GED teachers>>>>> and administrators believe that their>> students will
not pass 

the>>>>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass
the>>>>> 

test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many>>>>>
K-12 

teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe>>>>> creativity

distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>>> the one
to raise 

this>> issue, but it's the key question on the>>>>> minds of many GED
teachers>> 

and administrators, so I invite the>>>>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is

creativity a distraction or is it>>>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>>
David 

J. Rosen>>>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original
message>>>>> 

---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>>>>
We've had 

several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>>>>>> wanted to>>>
give a 

qu>>> ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>
discussion.>>> 

For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested>>>
resources 

go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>>
there 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>>
post 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>> now!>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>>
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment
Discussion 

List>>> Moderator>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

From:>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion -
what>>> 

you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>> 

everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past
day,>>> and so 

I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you>>> can get the
information>> on 

this discussion. For the full>>> announcement, information on>> guests,
and 

suggested resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>>
there 

were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> 

assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also
your 

own experiences to share>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>

Assessment Discussion>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie
Cora>>>>>>> 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> 

Moderator>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>>
change your 

subscription settings, please go to>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 

Email delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------>>>
------------------------->> 

National Institute for Literacy>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your subscription
settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>
Email 

delivered to>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------->> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>
settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>
Email 

delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>
-------------------------------> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings, 

please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 

delivered to>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>>
-------------------------------> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings>>> , 

please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>>
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to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>
_________________________________________________________________>>> 

Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>>
Stop by 

today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> 

ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>>
Message: 

3>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400>>> From: Andrea Wilder>>>>
Subject: 

[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The

Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain;

charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> Hi Mary
Lynn-->>>>>> One 

of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been: "Don't>>> waste
their 

time." Is this what you are getting at?>>>>>> Andrea>>>>>> On Oct 27,
2007, at 

9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test
students 

when they enter and then teach them>>>> accordingly. It is not our job
to 

paternalistically/maternalistically>>>> decide what is best for our
students 

beyond what they need to know to>>>> be able to pass the test. We must
not hold 

them back. Let them get to>>>> college or training as fast as 

possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------->
From:>>>> 

Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>>>
2007 

09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>>> what
you 

need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>>> in GED
programs, 

especially if> students are planning to go on to>>>> college! Students
who pass 

the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>>> think creatively, explore
abstract 

ideas, and> weigh options are>>>> usually at a loss in the college
classroom. 

Most colleges> require>>>> program elements such as "writing across the 

curriculum." As we> know,>>>> writing requires abstract thought, the
kind adults 

need to develop.>>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require
understanding 

and using>>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and
more.>>>> 

Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>>>

creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more.
For>>>> 

students to truly> understand history, they must be able to
visualize>>>> 

different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics>>>>
and 

math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to>>>>
communicate 

ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another>>>> posting made
the 

remark that students in a GED> class who are not>>>> reading in class
are not 

practicing reading at all. If> the instructor>>>> is writing on the
board, if 

the students are writing, if the> students>>>> are taking practice
tests, they 

ARE reading. In terms of more>>>>> formalized, lengthier readings,
students will 

most likely need to take>>>> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain
amount of 

discipline that we>>>> might not> get with GED students. But especially
with 

students who>>>> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED,
we need 

to>>>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I
just>>>> 

now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in
a>>>> long 

time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>>>>>
creativity is 

used in the college classroom as well as what GED>>>> students can>
expect in 

college (though perhaps not to this extent,>>>> depending on the>
teacher and 

the class).>>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a
firm 

believer in>>>> extensive transitional services for GED students>
planning to 

attend>>>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications 

between>>>> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want
GED>>>> 

students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>>>
creativity 

used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>>> Mercurio 

Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>>> Public
Schools> 

Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>>> work
703-791-8387> fax 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>>> From:
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>>> 

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
<mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov%5DOn?> > Behalf Of David J.
Rosen>>>>> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>>>
List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to>>>>
know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>>> creativity. Good

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>>> means to an end --
that 

is, with creative teaching> approaches will>>>> more students have more
and 

higher academic skills,> better test>>>> scores? Or is creativity itself
an end 

-- that is, do we> want>>>> students to be both academically prepared
and 

creative? Or> both? And>>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would
argue, as 

Marc Tucker does,>>>> that we need both high academic> skills and
creativity, 

and I would>>>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both
as a 

means and>>>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED)
programs 

should>>>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic
skills 

that>>>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical
thinking>>>> 

skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>>>
the 

skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>>> assessment
list, 

let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>>> education
programs?>> 

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>>> standardized tests> ?
Are we 

measuring critical thinking skills, and>>>> if so how?> ? I am not aware
that 

anyone in adult literacy education>>>> is measuring> creative skills.>>
If Marc 

Tucker is right, we are not>>>> paying attention to one of the> greatest

economic assets, one of the>>>> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree
with 

Tucker and believe that>>>> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes
basic 

skills tests for>>>> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic
skills for 

the GED>>>> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the
ability to 

look>>>> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the
ability 

to>>>> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to
represent>>>> 

an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or
other>>>> 

figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and>>>>
follow, 

but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of>>>>
thinking 

(what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the>>>> box").>> Are
these 

goals that every GED student has or should have.>>>> No. Should> they
be? Not 

necessarily. But for students who see the GED>>>> or high> school
diploma as a 

way out of poverty, as a stepping stone>>>> to stable> employment and 

self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door>>>> to> successful
post-secondary 

learning, these are the skills we should>>>> be> teaching and measuring:

academic skills, including critical>>>> thinking> and creativity.>> I
invite 

your comments on this.>> David J.>>>> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On
Oct 26, 

2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,>>>> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to 

creativity do we mean>>>> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once
our 

students know how>>>> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be

successful in>>>> achieving their>> education and other life goals.
However, 

just like>>>> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high 

stakes>>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity
and>>>> 

teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult>>>>
Education & 

Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:>>>>
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

[mailto:assessment- <mailto:assessment-?> >> bounces at nifl.gov] On>>>>
Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: 

Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>>>>> To: The Assessment Discussion
List>> 

Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:>>>> GED Discussion - what you need to 

know!>>>>>>>> I agree that>>>> creativity is not the enemy of success on

standardized>> test. We need>>>> look no further then those who have
been 

successful>> on any type of>>>> test. We tend to use terms like
natuarally 

gifted,>> just smart, etc.>>>> If you speak to these folks they are
well>> 

rounded, enjoy reading,>>>> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms
like>> "I 

don't know, I just>>>> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this
may be 

the reason for>>>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is
more 

disparity>>>> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity.
Exposure to 

the>>>> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as
part of>>>> 

your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when
testing>>>> then 

someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.>>>> My
students 

participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those>>>> that "get
into 

it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that>>>> feel it is a
waste of 

time>> and they just want to "study for the GED">>>> are generally
frustrated>> 

when "all of their hard work does not pay>>>> off like they would>>
like." 

Creativity also leads to retention;>>>> especially those>> activities
that have 

to be completed in increments.>>>> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>>
Shirley 

Ledet>>>> GED>>>> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net 

wrote:>>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult 

literacy>>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker,
President 

of>>>> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in
a>>>> 

presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,>>>> 

http://>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.>>>>
education>>>> system 

-->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive>>>> without
high>> 

academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED>>>> teachers and 

administrators believe that their>> students will not>>>> pass the GED
unless 

they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to>>>> pass the test, that 

creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.>>>> (Many K-12
teachers,>> 

administrators or policy makers also believe>>>> creativity distracts>>
from 

passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>> the one to raise this>>
issue, but 

it's the key question on the minds>>>> of many GED teachers>> and 

administrators, so I invite the panelists>>>> to address it.>>>> Is
creativity a 

distraction or is it essential for>>>> success? Why?>>>>>> David J.
Rosen>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>> -------------- Original message
---------------------->> 

From: "Marie>>>> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new
subscribers 

over the>>>> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder
where you 

can>>>> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full 

announcement,>>>> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go 

to:>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>>>
there 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>>>
post 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>>> now!>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>>>
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment
Discussion 

List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

From:>>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion
- 

what>>>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>>
Hi>>>> 

everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past
day,>>>> and 

so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the>>>>
information>> 

on this discussion. For the full announcement,>>>> information on>>
guests, and 

suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday
?>>>> there 

were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> 

assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and
also your 

own experiences to share>>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie
Cora>>>> 

Assessment Discussion>>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie
Cora>>>>>>>> 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>>> 

Moderator>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>>>
change 

your subscription settings, please go to>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 

Email delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>
------------------------------->> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>>
settings, 

please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>
Email 

delivered to>>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------->> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>>
settings, 

please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>
Email 

delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>
-------------------------------> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email

delivered to>>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>>
-------------------------------> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription
settings, 

please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 

delivered to>>>> macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>>>
_________________________________________________________________>>>> 

Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>>>
Stop by 

today.>>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>>> 

ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>> ------------------------------->>>>
National 

Institute for Literacy>>>> Assessment mailing list>>>>
Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> 

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> Email delivered to 

andreawilder at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------>>>>>> 

Message: 4>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400>>> From: "David J. 

Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching
Skills>>> 

To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type:
text/plain; 

charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> ....and the Web
address 

for MLoTS is:>>>>>> http://www.mlots.org>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen

wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills
(MLoTS) 

project, a free Web->>>> based library of short digital videos of adult 

education classrooms>>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created
reading and 

numeracy>>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those
from:>>>>>>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>>>
tutoring)>>>> 

? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>>> ? OTAN
(integrating 

technology)>>>> and>>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what 

low-literate ESOL>>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>>>>
I hope 

you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>>>
tutoring short 

videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>>> hoping that MLoTS
will 

become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>>> adult literacy education
classroom 

videos.>>>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or
change 

your subscription settings, please go to>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> 

Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 5>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct
2007 

23:17:38 -0400>>> From: "David J. Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1015]
GED 

preparation and creativity>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>>
Message-ID: 

>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes;
format=flowed>>>>>> 

Hello Andrea,>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:>>>>>>> Has anybody yet
in this 

conversation defined 1. critical reading>>>> and 2. creativity?>>>>>>
Here's 

more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite>>> unlikely that
we will 

agree on a definition. There are more than 60>>> of them in the
psychological 

literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far>>> as I am aware there is no
standardized 

measurement instrument for>>> creativity. Some believe it is inherited;
some 

believe it can be>>> taught; some believe it can be nurtured or
encouraged. I 

believe that>>> some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least
nurtured and 

that>>> it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned
with the>>> 

kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would>>>
agree, 

I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might>>> differ in 

describing the paths to it. And it may look different in>>> different
contexts, 

in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and>>> in the creative
problem 

solving of daily living.>>>>>> In the context in which I raised the
issue of 

creativity, I was>>> thinking of the application of new ideas, what some
would 

refer to as>>> innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity
that I 

believe>>> Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have 

historically>>> valued and excelled at, that has been an element of
American 

economic>>> success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the
education>>> 

systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized
tests.>>>>>> Are 

adult literacy education students (including basic education,>>>
secondary 

education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If>>> so, should
we 

nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In>>> many GED
programs I 

have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even>>> acknowledged in
program 

goals or objectives. And I have never seen>>> it measured. This
indicates to me 

that, as a field, we do not value>>> and support student creativity. I
agree 

with Marc Tucker that, if we>>> are interested in Americans' global 

competitiveness that we should>>> value creativity, and of course, there
are 

other good reasons to>>> nourish creativity.>>>>>> What do you think
about 

this?>>>>>>>>> * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and
definitions 

of>>> creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:>>> 

Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University
Press.>>>>>> David 

J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
------------------------------>>>>>> 

Message: 6>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400>>> From: "Donna 

Chambers">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you
need to 

know!>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Message-ID: >>>
Content-Type: 

text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";>>>
reply-type=original>>>>>> 

Mary Lynn,>>>>>> Your argument to push learners forward is a common
belief. I am 

not>>> suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them
for>>> 

just>>> "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility
of our>>> 

job.>>> Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of
a>>> 

high>>> school student and be ready to transition to college level
academics>>> 

is in>>> the learners' best interest in respect to time and money.
Community>>> 

College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they>>>
do. 

If>>> the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to
enter>>> 

community>>> college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be
smoother, 

but>>> it is>>> not. Preparation for the learners next steps, which
includes 

basic>>> and>>> secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of
Adult 

Literacy.>>>>>> Donna Chambers>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----->>>
From: 

"Mary Lynn Simons">>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Sent:
Saturday, 

October 27, 2007 9:01 PM>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED
Discussion - what 

you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they
enter 

and then teach them>>> accordingly. It is not our job to
paternalistically/maternalistically>>> 

decide>>> what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to
be 

able>>> to>>> pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to
college 

or>>> training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>
----------------------------------------> 

From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:>>> assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat,
27 Oct 

2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion -
what you 

need to know!>> David,>>> I>>> agree that creativity is essential in GED

programs, especially if>>>> students>>> are planning to go on to
college! 

Students who pass the GED with>>>> minimal>>> ability to freely think 

creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh>>> options are usually at
a loss 

in the college classroom. Most colleges>>>> require program elements
such as 

"writing across the curriculum." As>>> we>>>> know, writing requires
abstract 

thought, the kind adults need to>>> develop.>>>>> Even basic college
writing 

classes require understanding and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in
the 

descriptive essay and more.>>> Humanities>>>> courses demand students to

understand and even implement creative>>> forms,>>>> figures of speech, 

figurative language, and more. For students to>>> truly>>>> understand
history, 

they must be able to visualize different time>>> periods.>>>> Symbolic
thought 

translates into statistics and math classes in which>>>> graphs, numbers
and 

equations are used to communicate ideas. The list>>> goes>>>> on.>>
Someone here 

or in another posting made the remark that students>>> in a>>> GED>
class who 

are not reading in class are not practicing reading at>>> all.>>> If>
the 

instructor is writing on the board, if the students are>>> writing,
if>>> the> 

students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>>
more>>>> 

formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to
take>>> 

that>>>> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we

might>>> not>>>> get with GED students. But especially with students who
want to 

pursue>>>> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the
time 

to>>> teach>>>> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran
across an 

essay>>> from>>> Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but
did in 

my past>>> lives.>>> The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in
the 

college>>> classroom as>>> well as what GED students can> expect in
college 

(though perhaps not>>> to this>>> extent, depending on the> teacher and
the 

class).>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm
believer 

in>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to
attend>>> 

college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between>>>
public>>> 

schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to>>> 

succeed.>>> Part of these discussions should include> creativity used
and 

expected>>> in>>> every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio
Gotthardt, ESOL 

Online>>> Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult
Education>>>> 

P.O. Box>>> 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax>>> 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:>>>
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On
<mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov%5DOn?> >>>> Behalf>>> Of David J.
Rosen> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The>>> Assessment Discussion
List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED>>> Discussion ->>> what you need to
know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we>>> mean>>> by creativity.
Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means>>> to an end
-- that 

is, with creative teaching> approaches will more>>> students>>> have
more and 

higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is>>> creativity>>>
itself an 

end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically>>> prepared
and 

creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit>>> in?>> I>>> would
argue, 

as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>>>> skills>>> and 

creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these>>>
catregories, 

both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>>>> education>>>
(e.g. GED) 

programs should provide students with the> opportunity to>>> have>>>
academic 

skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong>>> critical

thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong>>> academic>>>
skills), 

and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is>>> the>>> 

assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult
secondary>>> 

education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>> 

standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and>>>
if so>>> 

how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is>>> 

measuring>>>> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not
paying>>> 

attention to>>> one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the
historic 

strengths of>>> the>>> U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the
nearly 

exclusive focus>>> on>>> high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and
the focus 

on only>>> traditional>>>> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects
important 

creative skills>>>> like>>> the ability to look at a problem freshly and
from 

different>>>> perspectives,>>> the ability to try out and evaluate a
range of> 

solutions, the ability>>> to>>> represent an idea with an image, a
moving> 

image, a drawing; a>>> metaphor or>>> other figurative language, or>
rhetoric; 

and the ability to understand>>> and>>> follow, but instead to>
disregard 

instructions or traditional paths of>>> thinking (what we now> often
describe as 

"thinking outside the>>> box").>> Are>>> these goals that every GED
student has 

or should have. No. Should>>>> they be?>>> Not necessarily. But for
students who 

see the GED or high> school>>> diploma as>>> a way out of poverty, as a
stepping 

stone to stable> employment and>>> self-sufficiency, as a key to open
the door 

to> successful>>> post-secondary>>> learning, these are the skills we
should be> 

teaching and measuring:>>> academic skills, including critical thinking>
and 

creativity.>> I>>> invite>>> your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On>>> Oct 26,>>> 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F

wrote:>>> When we are referring to>>> creativity do we mean teaching
critical>> 

thinking skills which once>>> our>>> students know how to think in a>>
critical 

thinking way they will be>>> successful in achieving their>> education
and other 

life goals.>>> However,>>> just like K-12 education,>> adult education
is 

captured on the high>>> stakes>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability
which 

stifles creativity and>>> teachers>>> teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni
Borge>>>> 

BHCC>> Adult Education &>>> Transitions>>> Program>>>> Boston,
MA>>>>>>>> From: 

assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> [mailto:assessment- <mailto:assessment-?>
>> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf 

Of shirley ledet>>>>> Sent:>>> Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To:
The 

Assessment Discussion>>> List>>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED
Discussion 

- what you need to>>> know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the
enemy of 

success on>>> standardized>> test. We need look no further then those
who have 

been>>> successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like 

natuarally>>> gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks
they are 

well>>>>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms

like>>>>> "I>>> don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found
that>> 

this may>>> be>>> the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I
believe>> there 

is more>>> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity.

Exposure>>> to>>> the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal
issues 

as part>>> of>>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an
advantage when 

testing>>> then>>> someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and
study 

hard. My>>> students>>> participate in a>> quite a few creative projects
and 

those that "get>>> into>>> it" tend to>> do better in all subjects.
Those that 

feel it is a waste>>> of>>> time>> and they just want to "study for the
GED" are 

generally>>> frustrated>>>>> when "all of their hard work does not pay
off like 

they would>> like.">>> Creativity also leads to retention; especially
those>> 

activities that>>> have>>> to be completed in increments. Let's bring
on>> more 

creativity!>>>>>>> Shirley>>> Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>>
NHC-Carver>>>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>> wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of

creativity in adult literacy>>> education -->> indeed in all education.
As Marc 

Tucker, President of>>> the>>> National>> Center for Education and the
Economy, 

has said in a>>> presention>>>>> recently to the National Commission on
Adult 

Literacy, http://>>>>>>>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. 

education system -->>>>> and he>>> includes adult education, cannot be 

competitive without high>> academic>>> standards AND creativity.>>>> But
many 

GED teachers and administrators>>> believe that their>> students will
not pass 

the GED unless they focus>>> on>>> skills and>> knowledge needed to pass
the 

test, that creativity is a>>>>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many
K-12 

teachers,>> administrators>>> or>>> policy makers also believe
creativity 

distracts>> from passing high>>> stakes>>> tests.) I hate to be the one
to raise 

this>> issue, but it's the key>>> question on the minds of many GED
teachers>> 

and administrators, so I>>> invite>>> the panelists to address it.>>>>
Is 

creativity a distraction or is it>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>>
David J. 

Rosen>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original>>> message 

---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi>>> everyone,>>>>>>>>>
We've 

had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted>>>
to>>>>>> 

give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>>>> 

discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>>>> 

suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>>
there>>> 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>>
post>>> 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>>
Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>>> NIFL Assessment
Discussion 

List Moderator>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

From:>>> "Marie>>> Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED
Discussion - what 

you>>> need to>>> know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi 

everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We?ve>>> had several new subscribers over the past
day, and 

so I>> wanted to>>> give a>>> quick reminder where you can get the
information>> 

on this discussion.>>> For>>> the full announcement, information on>>
guests, 

and suggested>>> resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?
there 

were a couple ? you>>>>> can>>> catch up in the archives at: 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>>>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>
Please 

post your questions and also>>> your>>> own experiences to share
now!>>>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> Assessment Discussion List 

Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>>
marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> 

Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or
change your 

subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>>
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Nov  1 08:57:27 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 08:57:27 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1053]  Assessing LD - FYI
Message-ID: <021401c81c86$c1e90b50$0802a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,
 
There is presently a discussion happening on the Learning Disabilities
List that some of you might be interested in.  Here is a post by a
subscriber that kicked off the conversation:
 

I am interested in the assessment procedures being used in adult
literacy/adult education programs in regard to the identification of
learning and cognitive disabilities in populations who did not receive
such assessments as children in public school systems.  Given the
paucity of funds in adult education programs and adult rehabilitation
services, it would seem that the best way to get adults involved in such
assessment would be through pro bono work done by psychological
diagnosticians on a community level.  Do you agree with that?  Or are
you aware of other strategies that programs used to obtain diagnoses and
accommodations for adult students with specific learning disabilities? 
 
 
If this is of interest to you, you can subscribe yourself to that
discussion by going to:
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Learningdisabilities
 
or you can read the archives at that same page - click on Read Current
Posted Messages at the top.
 
Marie
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From andresmuro at aol.com  Thu Nov  1 12:15:13 2007
From: andresmuro at aol.com (andresmuro at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2007 12:15:13 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1054]  jrethlake@hcde-texas.org
In-Reply-To: <E43278D67408F248838A1BDB75430605099FA45D@EV-SERVER.hcdemain.hcde.loc>
Message-ID: <8C9EAB984C7AFFF-4B0-72C4@FWM-M37.sysops.aol.com>

 Thx, Joanie:

I hope that you weren't reading my rants against WIA-NRS.

Andres

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Joanie Rethlake <jrethlake at hcde-texas.org>
To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>
Sent: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 10:24 pm
Subject: [Assessment 1052] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking

Bravo for being a creative educator and
retaining your students!!

?

Joanie Rethlake, Texas LEARNS

?

From:
assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of andresmuro at aol.com

Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007
10:10 AM

To: assessment at nifl.gov

Subject: [Assessment 1048] Re:
GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking

?

The thing is that students learn better if information
relates to their knowledge and experiences. For example, in my program,
students have difficulty writing. Once we get them to write about their own
experiences, and teach them to do so, they become better writers. They also
publish their stories. Also, our students face health barriers and want to
learn about health prevention, improvement, access. They also take nutrition
classes. Because they are interested in these topics, they learn fast and they
remain focused and motivated. Also we have good retention. 

Ultimately, these topics do not deter them to learn information to pass the
GED. The GED is basically having good reading, writing and math skills and test
taking skills. It doesn't really matter if you teaching them to read by using
the Glencoe GED book, or a health brochure, a bag of potato chips, legal
information, etc. I do this workshop in which I show teachers that I can teach
pretty much all the math skills for the GED using a bag of potato chips. I can
also teach reading, writing and graph skills with the same bag. Thing is, bags
of potato chips are fascinating to students.? They capture? their
imagination and keep them focused and working on task.? They are also
learning how to read nutrition labels and how to watch what they eat. 

So, in a sense, teaching the GED and teaching things that are not in the book
are not necessarily contradictory things. Also, in my program, in every
class,? we have a small percentage of students who have diabetes and don't
even know about it. We do a glucose test every semester. Those who have
diabetes are referred to the doctor. To us, even if these students don't pass
the GED, it is a triumph. We essentially saved limbs, if not lives. In fact,
most of these students do get the GED. We also have victims of domestic
violence that start to get counseling, support and protection. Many of these
people would never get the GED. 

Finally, as I said before, our students get published, which is a huge self
esteem builder. You can see the student's writings at
http://bordersenses.com/memorias.?; Click on the books below. You can click
on traducciones on the right to read the translations. Imagine a GED student
who gets published and shows that to her peers, teachers, relatives. How many
students ever dream of getting published or think that they have any knowledge
worth sharing?

Andres

?

?

-----Original
Message-----

From: Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com>

To: The Assessment Discussion List <assessment at nifl.gov>

Sent: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 7:25 pm

Subject: [Assessment 1047] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking

?I still say students should get their GED as soon as possible and that it is 

not our job to hold students back by teaching them not only to pass the test but 

things we personally think they should know. We are hired to help people pass 

the test; that is what the taxpayers want us to do and that is why students come 

to the adult school in the first place.? Also, I think the GED is a pretty good 

test. One-third of? high school graduates cannot pass it. I don't know what 

states you all come from, but where I am in California, if someone passes the 

GED, that is a sign their skills are fairly high, high enough not to spend time 

on much remediation in the community college. The army used to prefer diploma 

grads to GED grads, not because the latter were less educated but because 

diploma grads have more stick-to-itiveness. Perhaps this is true in college also 

and accounts for the high college dropout rate of GED grads. 

________________________________> From: djrosen at comcast.net> Date: Tue, 30 Oct 

2007 09:30:31 -0400> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment 1035] GED, 

Creativity and Fast-tracking>> Mary Lynn wrote:> I think we owe to to our 

students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. That 

is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a 

nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is 

paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.> Creativity need not be 

nebulous. For example, here's a good definition from the Wikipedia:> "Creativity 

(or creativeness) is a mental process involving the generation of new ideas or 

concepts, or new associations between existing ideas or concepts." 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity> I am sure you can see the direct 

application of this kind of creativity to scoring high on the GED tests, for 

example in writing a good essay, and perhaps in other areas. Equally important 

-- for students who believe that GED preparation is the key to success in 

post-secondary education and some kinds of job skills training -- generating new 

ideas or concepts and making associations between existing ideas or concepts is 

essential for success.> Let me return to the context in which I raised the issue 

of creativity, Marc Tucker's claim that if the U.S. is to be competitive, if 

Americans are to have good jobs, they not only need strong basic skills and some 

college education, but they also need to be creative, that this is the cultural 

edge that leads to innovation and invention, that makes the American economy 

strong, and will enable American workers to thrive. Some adult education 

students, of course, don't care about that. They want the GED for other reasons, 

and that's fine. Let them fast track to the test. Those who want GED 

prepararation for college and good jobs, however, will need more: stronger 

academic skills to succeed in college, and -- if Tucker is right -- skills in 

the mental processes to generate new ideas or concepts, and new associations 

between existing concepts, and perhaps other kinds of creativity.> Mary Lynn, I 

would like to challenge the belief that we "owe [it] to our students to get them 

to community college or training as fast as possible." This has not produced 

good results for adult students whose goal is to succeed in college. Only a very 

small percentage of adult GED holders actually succeed in college, often because 

they lack the academic reading and writing skills, and numeracy (especially 

algebra) that they need to enroll in regular (not developmental) courses. 

Unfortunately way too many use up their college financial aide in college 

developmental courses and then have to drop out before achieving a certificate 

or degree. Many of these students will need to take the time to prepare for 

college in their GED preparation program, not fast track to the GED test.> David 

J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net> On Oct 29, 2007, at 3:27 PM, Mary Lynn Simons 

wrote:> I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills; critical 

thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against teachers wasting student time 

with too much talking, both by students and by themselves, and calling it 

"creativity". In order to be able to pass the tests, students must grapple with 

the five subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and 

mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively discussions, though 

interesting, can keep students from doing what they need to do to be able to 

pass. Adult education students have busy lives and have little time to get their 

GED. I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or 

training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to 

decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must respect the 

goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.>> 

From: andreawilder at comcast.net>> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400>> To: 

assessment at nifl.gov>> Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, 

Issue 33>>>> Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you two 

(Mary>> Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what would>> 

I see???>> would there be a real difference?>> Thanks.>>>> Andrea>> On Oct 29, 

2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:>>>>> Wow, I must say I disagree with 

Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents>>> come in just wanting to pass the test, 

but have no critical thinking>>> or transitional college skills. If we don't 

help them understand and>>> acquire some of those skills, they will not be able 

to succeed with>>> the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think 

it is one>>> of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they need 

to>>> succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is>>> 

paternal/maternalistic to help them set a course to success.>>>>>> Thanks,>>> 

Mary Lynn Carver>>> ABE/GED Instructor>>> College of Lake County>>> Building 4, 

Office 405>>> 19351 W. Washington Street>>> Grayslake, IL 60031>>> 

Phone:847/543-2677>>> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu>>> Fax: 847/543-7580>>>>>> 

"Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be>>> constantly 

amused" -- Unknown>>>>>> We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong 

process of keeping>>> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach 

people how>>> to learn. --Peter F. Drucker>>>>>> ________________________________>>>>>> 

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>> 

Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM>>> To: assessment at nifl.gov>>> Subject: Assessment 

Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>>>>>>>>>>> Send Assessment mailing list submissions 

to>>> assessment at nifl.gov>>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide 

Web, visit>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> or, via email, 

send a message with subject or body 'help' to>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>>>>> 

You can reach the person managing the list at>>> assessment-owner at nifl.gov>>>>>> 

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific>>> than "Re: 

Contents of Assessment digest...">>>>>>>>> Today's Topics:>>>>>> 1. [Assessment 

1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David J. Rosen)>>> 2. [Assessment 

1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Mary Lynn Simons)>>> 3. 

[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Andrea 

Wilder)>>> 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David 

J. Rosen)>>> 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity (David J.>>> 

Rosen)>>> 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> 

(Donna Chambers)>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> 

Message: 1>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400>>> From: David J. Rosen>>>> 

Subject: [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> To: The 

Technology and Literacy Discussion List>,>>> The Adult Literacy Professional 

Development Discussion List>>>>, The Assessment>>> Discussion List>>>>, The 

Adult English Language Learners>>> Discussion>>> List>>>> Message-ID: >>> 

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> 

format=flowed>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills 

(MLoTS) project, a free Web->>> based library of short digital videos of adult 

education classrooms>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and 

numeracy>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>> tutoring)>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>> ? OTAN (integrating 

technology)>>> and>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what 

low-literate ESOL>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>> I hope you 

will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>> tutoring short 

videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>> hoping that MLoTS will 

become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>> adult literacy education classroom 

videos.>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 2>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 

01:01:15 +0000>>> From: Mary Lynn Simons>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED 

Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> 

Message-ID:>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252">>>>>>>>> 

Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>> 

accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>> decide 

what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to>>> be able to 

pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to>>> college or 

training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> 

From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>> 

2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>> what you 

need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>> in GED programs, 

especially if> students are planning to go on to>>> college! Students who pass 

the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>> think creatively, explore abstract 

ideas, and> weigh options are>>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. 

Most colleges> require>>> program elements such as "writing across the 

curriculum." As we> know,>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults 

need to develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding 

and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>> 

Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>> creative 

forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>> students to 

truly> understand history, they must be able to vi>>> sualize different time 

periods.> Symbolic thought translates into>>> statistics and math classes in 

which> graphs, numbers and equations>>> are used to communicate ideas. The list 

goes> on.>> Someone here or in>>> another posting made the remark that students 

in a GED> class who are>>> not reading in class are not practicing reading at 

all. If> the>>> instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, 

if>>> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>> 

more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need>>> to take 

that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline>>> that we might 

not> get with GED students. But especially with students>>> who want to pursue> 

higher education after earning the GED, we need to>>> have the time to teach> 

them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>> now ran across an essay from 

Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>> long time but did in my past lives. 

The essay demonstrates how>>>> creativity is used in the co>>> llege classroom 

as well as what GED students can> expect in college>>> (though perhaps not to 

this extent, depending on the> teacher and the>>> class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> 

I'm a firm>>> believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> 

planning>>> to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> 

communications>>> between public schools and college to make this happen if we> 

want GED>>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>> 

creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>> Mercurio 

Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>> Public Schools> 

Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>> work 703-791-8387> fax 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> 

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>> List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need>>> to know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>> creativity. Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means to an end -- that is, 

with creative teaching> approaches will>>> more students have more and higher 

academic skills,> better test>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that 

is, do we> want>>> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> 

both? And>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker 

does,>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would>>> 

put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and>>> as an 

end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should>>> provide 

students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that>>> are strong enough 

to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>> skills (these may be 

inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>> the skills of creative 

problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>> assessment list, let me ask what are we 

measuring>>>> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic 

skills,>>>> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical>>>> 

thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in>>>> adult 

literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc>>>> Tucker is right, 

we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest>>>> economic assets, one of 

the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree>>>> with Tucker and believe that the 

nearly exclusive focus on high>>>>> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the 

focus on only>>>> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects 

important>>>> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly 

and>>>> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a>>>> 

range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an image,>>>> a 

moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language,>>>> or> 

rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead>>>> to> 

disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin>>> king (what we now> often 

describe as "thinking outside the box").>>>>> Are these goals that every GED 

student has or should have. No. Should>>>> they be? Not necessarily. But for 

students who see the GED or high>>>> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as 

a stepping stone to stable>>>> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open 

the door to>>>> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we 

should be>>>> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical 

thinking>>>> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. 

Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F>>> 

wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching>>> critical>> 

thinking skills which once our students know how to think>>> in a>> critical 

thinking way they will be successful in achieving>>> their>> education and other 

life goals. However, just like K-12>>> education,>> adult education is captured 

on the high stakes spinning>>> wheel of>> accountability which stifle>>> s 

creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>>>> BHCC>> Adult 

Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>>>> From: 

assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->>>>> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf 

Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October>>> 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The 

Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - 

what you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of 

success on standardized>>>>> test. We need look no further then those who have 

been successful>> on>>> any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally 

gifted,>> just>>> smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> 

rounded, enjoy>>> reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I 

don't know,>>> I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be 

the>>> reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more>>> 

disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure>>> to the 

arts, banking industry, faculty>>> ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your 

everyday life tends to>>> offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone 

whose only>>> exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students 

participate>>> in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" 

tend>>> to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of>>> 

time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally>>> frustrated>> 

when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they>>> would>> like." 

Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>>>> activities that have 

to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>>>>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley 

Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> 

Colleagues,>>>> I am a>>> proponent of creativity in adult literacy education 

-->> indeed in all>>> education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> 

Center for>>> Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to 

the>>> National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>>>>>; www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html 

, the U.S. education system -->>>>>>> and he includes adult education, cannot be 

competitive without>>>>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many 

GED teachers>>>>> and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass 

the>>>>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the>>>>> 

test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many>>>>> K-12 

teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe>>>>> creativity 

distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>>> the one to raise 

this>> issue, but it's the key question on the>>>>> minds of many GED teachers>> 

and administrators, so I invite the>>>>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is 

creativity a distraction or is it>>>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David 

J. Rosen>>>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message>>>>> 

---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We've had 

several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>>>>>> wanted to>>> give a 

qu>>> ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion.>>> 

For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested>>> resources 

go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> there 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> post 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>> now!>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion 

List>>> Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

From:>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what>>> 

you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>> 

everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>> and so 

I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you>>> can get the information>> on 

this discussion. For the full>>> announcement, information on>> guests, and 

suggested resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>> there 

were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> 

assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your 

own experiences to share>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 

Assessment Discussion>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> 

Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your 

subscription settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 

Email delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------>>> ------------------------->> 

National Institute for Literacy>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your subscription settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 

delivered to>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 

delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 

please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 

delivered to>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> 

National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings>>> , 

please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered 

to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>> 

Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> Stop by 

today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> 

ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 

3>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400>>> From: Andrea Wilder>>>> Subject: 

[Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The 

Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; 

charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> Hi Mary Lynn-->>>>>> One 

of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been: "Don't>>> waste their 

time." Is this what you are getting at?>>>>>> Andrea>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 

9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students 

when they enter and then teach them>>>> accordingly. It is not our job to 

paternalistically/maternalistically>>>> decide what is best for our students 

beyond what they need to know to>>>> be able to pass the test. We must not hold 

them back. Let them get to>>>> college or training as fast as 

possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> From:>>>> 

Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>>> 2007 

09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>>> what you 

need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>>> in GED programs, 

especially if> students are planning to go on to>>>> college! Students who pass 

the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>>> think creatively, explore abstract 

ideas, and> weigh options are>>>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. 

Most colleges> require>>>> program elements such as "writing across the 

curriculum." As we> know,>>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults 

need to develop.>>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding 

and using>>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>>> 

Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>>> 

creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>>> 

students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize>>>> 

different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics>>>> and 

math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to>>>> communicate 

ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another>>>> posting made the 

remark that students in a GED> class who are not>>>> reading in class are not 

practicing reading at all. If> the instructor>>>> is writing on the board, if 

the students are writing, if the> students>>>> are taking practice tests, they 

ARE reading. In terms of more>>>>> formalized, lengthier readings, students will 

most likely need to take>>>> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of 

discipline that we>>>> might not> get with GED students. But especially with 

students who>>>> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need 

to>>>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>>> 

now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>>> long 

time but did in my past lives. The essay demonstrates how>>>>> creativity is 

used in the college classroom as well as what GED>>>> students can> expect in 

college (though perhaps not to this extent,>>>> depending on the> teacher and 

the class).>>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm 

believer in>>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to 

attend>>>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications 

between>>>> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED>>>> 

students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>>> creativity 

used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>>> Mercurio 

Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>>> Public Schools> 

Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>>> work 703-791-8387> fax 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>>> 

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>>> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>>> List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to>>>> know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>>> creativity. Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>>> means to an end -- that 

is, with creative teaching> approaches will>>>> more students have more and 

higher academic skills,> better test>>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end 

-- that is, do we> want>>>> students to be both academically prepared and 

creative? Or> both? And>>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as 

Marc Tucker does,>>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, 

and I would>>>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a 

means and>>>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs 

should>>>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills 

that>>>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>>> 

skills (these may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>>> the 

skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>>> assessment list, 

let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>>> education programs?>> 

? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>>> standardized tests> ? Are we 

measuring critical thinking skills, and>>>> if so how?> ? I am not aware that 

anyone in adult literacy education>>>> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc 

Tucker is right, we are not>>>> paying attention to one of the> greatest 

economic assets, one of the>>>> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with 

Tucker and believe that>>>> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic 

skills tests for>>>> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for 

the GED>>>> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to 

look>>>> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability 

to>>>> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to represent>>>> 

an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other>>>> 

figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and>>>> follow, 

but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of>>>> thinking 

(what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the>>>> box").>> Are these 

goals that every GED student has or should have.>>>> No. Should> they be? Not 

necessarily. But for students who see the GED>>>> or high> school diploma as a 

way out of poverty, as a stepping stone>>>> to stable> employment and 

self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door>>>> to> successful post-secondary 

learning, these are the skills we should>>>> be> teaching and measuring: 

academic skills, including critical>>>> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite 

your comments on this.>> David J.>>>> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 

2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,>>>> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to 

creativity do we mean>>>> teaching critical>> thinking skills which once our 

students know how>>>> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be 

successful in>>>> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, 

just like>>>> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high 

stakes>>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and>>>> 

teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult>>>> Education & 

Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:>>>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

[mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On>>>> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: 

Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>>>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> 

Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:>>>> GED Discussion - what you need to 

know!>>>>>>>> I agree that>>>> creativity is not the enemy of success on 

standardized>> test. We need>>>> look no further then those who have been 

successful>> on any type of>>>> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally 

gifted,>> just smart, etc.>>>> If you speak to these folks they are well>> 

rounded, enjoy reading,>>>> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I 

don't know, I just>>>> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be 

the reason for>>>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more 

disparity>>>> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to 

the>>>> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of>>>> 

your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing>>>> then 

someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.>>>> My students 

participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those>>>> that "get into 

it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that>>>> feel it is a waste of 

time>> and they just want to "study for the GED">>>> are generally frustrated>> 

when "all of their hard work does not pay>>>> off like they would>> like." 

Creativity also leads to retention;>>>> especially those>> activities that have 

to be completed in increments.>>>> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley 

Ledet>>>> GED>>>> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net 

wrote:>>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult 

literacy>>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President 

of>>>> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a>>>> 

presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,>>>> 

http://>>; www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.>>>> education>>>> system 

-->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive>>>> without high>> 

academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED>>>> teachers and 

administrators believe that their>> students will not>>>> pass the GED unless 

they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to>>>> pass the test, that 

creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.>>>> (Many K-12 teachers,>> 

administrators or policy makers also believe>>>> creativity distracts>> from 

passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>> the one to raise this>> issue, but 

it's the key question on the minds>>>> of many GED teachers>> and 

administrators, so I invite the panelists>>>> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a 

distraction or is it essential for>>>> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> 

From: "Marie>>>> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers 

over the>>>> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you 

can>>>> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full 

announcement,>>>> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go 

to:>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>>> there 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>>> post 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>>> now!>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion 

List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

From:>>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - 

what>>>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>>> 

everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>>> and 

so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the>>>> information>> 

on this discussion. For the full announcement,>>>> information on>> guests, and 

suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>>> there 

were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> 

assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your 

own experiences to share>>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> 

Assessment Discussion>>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>>> 

marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>>> 

Moderator>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>>> change 

your subscription settings, please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 

Email delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> settings, 

please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 

delivered to>>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> settings, 

please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email 

delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 

please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 

delivered to>>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> 

National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, 

please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email 

delivered to>>>> macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>>> 

Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>>> Stop by 

today.>>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>>> 

ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>> ------------------------------->>>> National 

Institute for Literacy>>>> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> 

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> Email delivered to 

andreawilder at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> 

Message: 4>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400>>> From: "David J. 

Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> 

To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; 

charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> ....and the Web address 

for MLoTS is:>>>>>> http://www.mlots.org>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen 

wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) 

project, a free Web->>>> based library of short digital videos of adult 

education classrooms>>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and 

numeracy>>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>>>> ? 

NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>>> tutoring)>>>> 

? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>>> ? OTAN (integrating 

technology)>>>> and>>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what 

low-literate ESOL>>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>>>> I hope 

you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>>> tutoring short 

videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>>> hoping that MLoTS will 

become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>>> adult literacy education classroom 

videos.>>>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy>>>> 

Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change 

your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> 

Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 5>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 

23:17:38 -0400>>> From: "David J. Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED 

preparation and creativity>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: 

>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed>>>>>> 

Hello Andrea,>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:>>>>>>> Has anybody yet in this 

conversation defined 1. critical reading>>>> and 2. creativity?>>>>>> Here's 

more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite>>> unlikely that we will 

agree on a definition. There are more than 60>>> of them in the psychological 

literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far>>> as I am aware there is no standardized 

measurement instrument for>>> creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some 

believe it can be>>> taught; some believe it can be nurtured or encouraged. I 

believe that>>> some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and 

that>>> it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the>>> 

kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would>>> agree, 

I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might>>> differ in 

describing the paths to it. And it may look different in>>> different contexts, 

in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and>>> in the creative problem 

solving of daily living.>>>>>> In the context in which I raised the issue of 

creativity, I was>>> thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would 

refer to as>>> innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I 

believe>>> Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have 

historically>>> valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American 

economic>>> success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education>>> 

systems' rush toward performance on high stakes standardized tests.>>>>>> Are 

adult literacy education students (including basic education,>>> secondary 

education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If>>> so, should we 

nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In>>> many GED programs I 

have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even>>> acknowledged in program 

goals or objectives. And I have never seen>>> it measured. This indicates to me 

that, as a field, we do not value>>> and support student creativity. I agree 

with Marc Tucker that, if we>>> are interested in Americans' global 

competitiveness that we should>>> value creativity, and of course, there are 

other good reasons to>>> nourish creativity.>>>>>> What do you think about 

this?>>>>>>>>> * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions 

of>>> creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:>>> 

Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.>>>>>> David 

J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> 

Message: 6>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400>>> From: "Donna 

Chambers">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to 

know!>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: 

text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";>>> reply-type=original>>>>>> 

Mary Lynn,>>>>>> Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief. I am 

not>>> suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for>>> 

just>>> "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our>>> 

job.>>> Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of a>>> 

high>>> school student and be ready to transition to college level academics>>> 

is in>>> the learners' best interest in respect to time and money. Community>>> 

College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they>>> do. 

If>>> the GED were to be more aligned with the tests required to enter>>> 

community>>> college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, 

but>>> it is>>> not. Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes 

basic>>> and>>> secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of Adult 

Literacy.>>>>>> Donna Chambers>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----->>> From: 

"Mary Lynn Simons">>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Sent: Saturday, 

October 27, 2007 9:01 PM>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what 

you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they enter 

and then teach them>>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>> 

decide>>> what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be 

able>>> to>>> pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college 

or>>> training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> 

From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:>>> assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 

2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you 

need to know!>> David,>>> I>>> agree that creativity is essential in GED 

programs, especially if>>>> students>>> are planning to go on to college! 

Students who pass the GED with>>>> minimal>>> ability to freely think 

creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh>>> options are usually at a loss 

in the college classroom. Most colleges>>>> require program elements such as 

"writing across the curriculum." As>>> we>>>> know, writing requires abstract 

thought, the kind adults need to>>> develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing 

classes require understanding and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the 

descriptive essay and more.>>> Humanities>>>> courses demand students to 

understand and even implement creative>>> forms,>>>> figures of speech, 

figurative language, and more. For students to>>> truly>>>> understand history, 

they must be able to visualize different time>>> periods.>>>> Symbolic thought 

translates into statistics and math classes in which>>>> graphs, numbers and 

equations are used to communicate ideas. The list>>> goes>>>> on.>> Someone here 

or in another posting made the remark that students>>> in a>>> GED> class who 

are not reading in class are not practicing reading at>>> all.>>> If> the 

instructor is writing on the board, if the students are>>> writing, if>>> the> 

students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>> more>>>> 

formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take>>> 

that>>>> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we 

might>>> not>>>> get with GED students. But especially with students who want to 

pursue>>>> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time 

to>>> teach>>>> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an 

essay>>> from>>> Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in 

my past>>> lives.>>> The essay demonstrates how> creativity is used in the 

college>>> classroom as>>> well as what GED students can> expect in college 

(though perhaps not>>> to this>>> extent, depending on the> teacher and the 

class).>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer 

in>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend>>> 

college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between>>> public>>> 

schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to>>> 

succeed.>>> Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and 

expected>>> in>>> every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL 

Online>>> Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education>>>> 

P.O. Box>>> 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax>>> 

703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:>>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov 

[mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>>>> Behalf>>> Of David J. Rosen> Sent: 

Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To: The>>> Assessment Discussion List> 

Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED>>> Discussion ->>> what you need to know!>>> 

Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we>>> mean>>> by creativity. Good 

question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means>>> to an end -- that 

is, with creative teaching> approaches will more>>> students>>> have more and 

higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is>>> creativity>>> itself an 

end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically>>> prepared and 

creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit>>> in?>> I>>> would argue, 

as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>>>> skills>>> and 

creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these>>> catregories, 

both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>>>> education>>> (e.g. GED) 

programs should provide students with the> opportunity to>>> have>>> academic 

skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong>>> critical 

thinking skills (these may be inseparable> from strong>>> academic>>> skills), 

and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is>>> the>>> 

assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>> 

education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>> 

standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and>>> if so>>> 

how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is>>> 

measuring>>>> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying>>> 

attention to>>> one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic 

strengths of>>> the>>> U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly 

exclusive focus>>> on>>> high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus 

on only>>> traditional>>>> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important 

creative skills>>>> like>>> the ability to look at a problem freshly and from 

different>>>> perspectives,>>> the ability to try out and evaluate a range of> 

solutions, the ability>>> to>>> represent an idea with an image, a moving> 

image, a drawing; a>>> metaphor or>>> other figurative language, or> rhetoric; 

and the ability to understand>>> and>>> follow, but instead to> disregard 

instructions or traditional paths of>>> thinking (what we now> often describe as 

"thinking outside the>>> box").>> Are>>> these goals that every GED student has 

or should have. No. Should>>>> they be?>>> Not necessarily. But for students who 

see the GED or high> school>>> diploma as>>> a way out of poverty, as a stepping 

stone to stable> employment and>>> self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door 

to> successful>>> post-secondary>>> learning, these are the skills we should be> 

teaching and measuring:>>> academic skills, including critical thinking> and 

creativity.>> I>>> invite>>> your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On>>> Oct 26,>>> 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F 

wrote:>>> When we are referring to>>> creativity do we mean teaching critical>> 

thinking skills which once>>> our>>> students know how to think in a>> critical 

thinking way they will be>>> successful in achieving their>> education and other 

life goals.>>> However,>>> just like K-12 education,>> adult education is 

captured on the high>>> stakes>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which 

stifles creativity and>>> teachers>>> teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> 

BHCC>> Adult Education &>>> Transitions>>> Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: 

assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf 

Of shirley ledet>>>>> Sent:>>> Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The 

Assessment Discussion>>> List>>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion 

- what you need to>>> know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of 

success on>>> standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have 

been>>> successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like 

natuarally>>> gifted,>> just smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are 

well>>>>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms 

like>>>>> "I>>> don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> 

this may>>> be>>> the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there 

is more>>> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. 

Exposure>>> to>>> the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues 

as part>>> of>>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when 

testing>>> then>>> someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study 

hard. My>>> students>>> participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and 

those that "get>>> into>>> it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that 

feel it is a waste>>> of>>> time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are 

generally>>> frustrated>>>>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like 

they would>> like.">>> Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>> 

activities that>>> have>>> to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more 

creativity!>>>>>>> Shirley>>> Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> 

djrosen at comcast.net>>> wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of 

creativity in adult literacy>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc 

Tucker, President of>>> the>>> National>> Center for Education and the Economy, 

has said in a>>> presention>>>>> recently to the National Commission on Adult 

Literacy, http://>>>>>>>>; www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. 

education system -->>>>> and he>>> includes adult education, cannot be 

competitive without high>> academic>>> standards AND creativity.>>>> But many 

GED teachers and administrators>>> believe that their>> students will not pass 

the GED unless they focus>>> on>>> skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the 

test, that creativity is a>>>>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 

teachers,>> administrators>>> or>>> policy makers also believe creativity 

distracts>> from passing high>>> stakes>>> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise 

this>> issue, but it's the key>>> question on the minds of many GED teachers>> 

and administrators, so I>>> invite>>> the panelists to address it.>>>> Is 

creativity a distraction or is it>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. 

Rosen>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original>>> message 

---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi>>> everyone,>>>>>>>>> We've 

had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted>>> to>>>>>> 

give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>>>> 

discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>>>> 

suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> there>>> 

were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> post>>> 

your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion 

List Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

From:>>> "Marie>>> Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what 

you>>> need to>>> know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi 

everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We?ve>>> had several new subscribers over the past day, and 

so I>> wanted to>>> give a>>> quick reminder where you can get the information>> 

on this discussion.>>> For>>> the full announcement, information on>> guests, 

and suggested>>> resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 

07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there 

were a couple ? you>>>>> can>>> catch up in the archives at: 

http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>>>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please 

post your questions and also>>> your>>> own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> 

Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> Assessment Discussion List 

Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> 

NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> 

Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your 

subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> 

Email>>> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>>>> 

National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> 

please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> 

delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>>> 

National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> 

please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> 

delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>> 

National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>>>> 

Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> 

please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> 

delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>>> 

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Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> 

please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered 

to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>> 

Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> Stop 

by>>> today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> 

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subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>> 

End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>> ******************************************>>>>>>>>> 

------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>> Assessment 

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subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> 

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From jataylor at utk.edu  Fri Nov  2 10:01:39 2007
From: jataylor at utk.edu (Taylor, Jackie)
Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:01:39 -0400
Subject: [Assessment 1055] Professional Development Quality Standards
	Discussion
Message-ID: <0913EC48F2B05C4FBE4878BAFCABBFEC0127B33E@KFSVS2.utk.tennessee.edu>

Dear Colleagues,

Have you ever attended a professional development (PD) activity and
wondered why you spent your time participating? Have you ever attended
professional development and felt that your practice significantly
improved because of it?

 

Join the Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List for a
three-part discussion of quality professional development that will
culminate in finalizing a set of PD quality standards that AALPD will
use to advance quality professional development in the field.

 

Subscribe: http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/Professionaldevelopment 

When: November 12 - 30th (Quiet week November 19-23)

History: http://tinyurl.com/36raut 

Additional Resources: http://tinyurl.com/3xd5c8 

 

Please see below for details. For a web-based version of the
announcement, visit: http://tinyurl.com/32k3zr 

 

I hope you will join us! Best, Jackie

 

Jackie Taylor, Adult Literacy Professional Development List Moderator,
jataylor at utk.edu 

 

 

Part I: Quality Professional Development

When: November 12 - 16

 

What makes quality professional development? Join us to discuss what
subscribers identify as quality PD, and to explore the benefits and
issues with building a professional development system based on quality
standards.

 

*	What are characteristics of quality professional development?
*	How do you know it when you see it?
*	What is the value added in having PD standards?
*	What are the drawbacks?
*	PD Providers: Are standards really going to help you provide
better PD?
*	Practitioners: Are standards really going to help you identify
quality PD?

 

 

Part II: Reflection Week

When: November 19 - 23

 

AALPD will disseminate a set of quality professional development
standards and indicators that the AALPD PD Standards Committee has
drafted. This is a quiet week to:

 

1.	Reflect on the quality characteristics generated by list
subscribers during Part I. 
2.	Review the AALPD draft PD Standards. Ask yourself the questions
listed in Part III below, to prepare.

 

 

Part III: AALPD Professional Development Quality Standards

When: November 26 - 30

 

Join us to discuss the draft AALPD PD Quality Standards.  Based on this
important discussion, a final draft of the AALPD PD Quality Standards
will be sent to the AALPD Membership for an up or down vote. A final
version will be placed on the AALPD Website, and will become the
foundation for a program and state self-assessment tool to advance
quality professional development in our field.

 

Discussion Questions Include (but are not limited to):

*	How well does this draft measure up with what subscribers have
indicated is quality professional development?
*	From this draft:

	*	What are the most important PD standards or indicators
from your perspective?
	*	What are the most important standards to advance PD in
your area/state?
	*	What PD Standards would be easy to implement?
	*	What would be hard to implement?
	*	Is there anything missing?
	*	Is there anything that isn't clear?
	*	What would need to be in place in order to make these
standards possible?

 

------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------

>From the Association of Adult Literacy Professional Developers (AALPD)

Standards Committee and Executive Board

http://www.aalpd.org/ 

------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------

 

 

 

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From msledet at yahoo.com  Sun Nov  4 18:17:01 2007
From: msledet at yahoo.com (shirley ledet)
Date: Sun, 4 Nov 2007 15:17:01 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Assessment 1056] Re: GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking
In-Reply-To: <BAY115-W15A3A6D39C54A0EE209566BF930@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <51430.25242.qm@web90404.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

I cannot count how many students have returned over the years who have not yet attained the GED.  The return to tell me they want to return or that they should have stayed.  One running theme, however is how much they did learn about life, community, work ettiquette, family, their children and their children's education and school relationships. I agree our goal and job is to ultimately help them get the GED.  However let us not loose the human element in the equation.  Self-worth equals a drive to succeed and that drives leads to the GEd and so much more. 

Mary Lynn Simons <macsimoin at hotmail.com> wrote:  
I still say students should get their GED as soon as possible and that it is not our job to hold students back by teaching them not only to pass the test but things we personally think they should know. We are hired to help people pass the test; that is what the taxpayers want us to do and that is why students come to the adult school in the first place. Also, I think the GED is a pretty good test. One-third of high school graduates cannot pass it. I don't know what states you all come from, but where I am in California, if someone passes the GED, that is a sign their skills are fairly high, high enough not to spend time on much remediation in the community college. The army used to prefer diploma grads to GED grads, not because the latter were less educated but because diploma grads have more stick-to-itiveness. Perhaps this is true in college also and accounts for the high college dropout rate of GED grads. 

________________________________> From: djrosen at comcast.net> Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 09:30:31 -0400> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Subject: [Assessment 1035] GED, Creativity and Fast-tracking>> Mary Lynn wrote:> I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do otherwise.> Creativity need not be nebulous. For example, here's a good definition from the Wikipedia:> "Creativity (or creativeness) is a mental process involving the generation of new ideas or concepts, or new associations between existing ideas or concepts." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creativity> I am sure you can see the direct application of this kind of creativity to scoring high on the GED tests, for example in writing a good essay, and perhaps in other areas. Equally
 important -- for students who believe that GED preparation is the key to success in post-secondary education and some kinds of job skills training -- generating new ideas or concepts and making associations between existing ideas or concepts is essential for success.> Let me return to the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, Marc Tucker's claim that if the U.S. is to be competitive, if Americans are to have good jobs, they not only need strong basic skills and some college education, but they also need to be creative, that this is the cultural edge that leads to innovation and invention, that makes the American economy strong, and will enable American workers to thrive. Some adult education students, of course, don't care about that. They want the GED for other reasons, and that's fine. Let them fast track to the test. Those who want GED prepararation for college and good jobs, however, will need more: stronger academic skills to succeed in college, and -- if
 Tucker is right -- skills in the mental processes to generate new ideas or concepts, and new associations between existing concepts, and perhaps other kinds of creativity.> Mary Lynn, I would like to challenge the belief that we "owe [it] to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible." This has not produced good results for adult students whose goal is to succeed in college. Only a very small percentage of adult GED holders actually succeed in college, often because they lack the academic reading and writing skills, and numeracy (especially algebra) that they need to enroll in regular (not developmental) courses. Unfortunately way too many use up their college financial aide in college developmental courses and then have to drop out before achieving a certificate or degree. Many of these students will need to take the time to prepare for college in their GED preparation program, not fast track to the GED test.> David J. Rosen>
 djrosen at comcast.net> On Oct 29, 2007, at 3:27 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:> I am definitely not against teaching critical thinking skills; critical thinking and the GED go hand in hand. I am against teachers wasting student time with too much talking, both by students and by themselves, and calling it "creativity". In order to be able to pass the tests, students must grapple with the five subject areas. People will never improve reading, writing and mathematics unless they read, write, and do math! Lively discussions, though interesting, can keep students from doing what they need to do to be able to pass. Adult education students have busy lives and have little time to get their GED. I think we owe to to our students to get them to community college or training as fast as possible. That is their goal and it is unfair for us to decide that they need "creativity", a nebulous term at best. We must respect the goal of the student, and it is paternalistic or maternalistic to do
 otherwise.>> From: andreawilder at comcast.net>> Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2007 11:19:48 -0400>> To: assessment at nifl.gov>> Subject: [Assessment 1022] Re: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>>> Words are so tricky, I don't really know what either of you two (Mary>> Lynn) are talking about--if I were to observe your classes, what would>> I see???>> would there be a real difference?>> Thanks.>>>> Andrea>> On Oct 29, 2007, at 9:13 AM, Carver, Mary-Lynn wrote:>>>>> Wow, I must say I disagree with Mary Lynn Simons. Many ABE/GEDstudents>>> come in just wanting to pass the test, but have no critical thinking>>> or transitional college skills. If we don't help them understand and>>> acquire some of those skills, they will not be able to succeed with>>> the transition to higher education. If not us, who? I think it is one>>> of the first duties of any teacher to give students what they need to>>> succeed in their class and beyond. I don't feel it is>>> paternal/maternalistic to help them set
 a course to success.>>>>>> Thanks,>>> Mary Lynn Carver>>> ABE/GED Instructor>>> College of Lake County>>> Building 4, Office 405>>> 19351 W. Washington Street>>> Grayslake, IL 60031>>> Phone:847/543-2677>>> mlcarver at clcillinois.edu>>> Fax: 847/543-7580>>>>>> "Blessed are they who laugh at themselves, for they shall be>>> constantly amused" -- Unknown>>>>>> We now accept the fact that learning is a lifelong process of keeping>>> abreast of change. And the most pressing task is to teach people how>>> to learn. --Peter F. Drucker>>>>>> ________________________________>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov on behalf of>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>> Sent: Sun 10/28/2007 8:23 AM>>> To: assessment at nifl.gov>>> Subject: Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>>>>>>>>>>> Send Assessment mailing list submissions to>>> assessment at nifl.gov>>>>>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> or, via email, send a
 message with subject or body 'help' to>>> assessment-request at nifl.gov>>>>>> You can reach the person managing the list at>>> assessment-owner at nifl.gov>>>>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific>>> than "Re: Contents of Assessment digest...">>>>>>>>> Today's Topics:>>>>>> 1. [Assessment 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David J. Rosen)>>> 2. [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Mary Lynn Simons)>>> 3. [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Andrea Wilder)>>> 4. [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> (David J. Rosen)>>> 5. [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity (David J.>>> Rosen)>>> 6. [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> (Donna Chambers)>>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------->>>>>> Message: 1>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 19:17:10 -0400>>> From: David J. Rosen>>>> Subject: [Assessment
 1011] Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> To: The Technology and Literacy Discussion List>,>>> The Adult Literacy Professional Development Discussion List>>>>, The Assessment>>> Discussion List>>>>, The Adult English Language Learners>>> Discussion>>> List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a free Web->>> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>> tutoring)>>> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>> ? OTAN (integrating technology)>>> and>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>> I hope you will take a look. If you know of
 other good classroom or>>> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>> adult literacy education classroom videos.>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 2>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 01:01:15 +0000>>> From: Mary Lynn Simons>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID:>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252">>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to>>> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to>>> college or training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> From:>>>
 Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To: assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to>>> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are>>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require>>> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to vi>>>
 sualize different time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into>>> statistics and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations>>> are used to communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in>>> another posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are>>> not reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the>>> instructor is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if>>> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>> more> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need>>> to take that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline>>> that we might not> get with GED students. But especially with students>>> who want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to>>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>> long time but did in my past lives. The essay
 demonstrates how>>>> creativity is used in the co>>> llege classroom as well as what GED students can> expect in college>>> (though perhaps not to this extent, depending on the> teacher and the>>> class). http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm>>> believer in extensive transitional services for GED students> planning>>> to attend college, and I think it's essential to have> communications>>> between public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED>>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 10:54 PM> To:
 The Assessment Discussion>>> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need>>> to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will>>> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want>>> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would>>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and>>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should>>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that>>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>> skills (these may be inseparable> from
 strong academic skills), and>>> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring>>>> now adult secondary education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills,>>>> at least through standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical>>>> thinking skills, and if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in>>>> adult literacy education is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc>>>> Tucker is right, we are not paying attention to one of the> greatest>>>> economic assets, one of the historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree>>>> with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus on high>>>>> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only>>>> traditional> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important>>>> creative skills> like the ability to look at a problem freshly and>>>> from different> perspectives, the ability to try out and evaluate a>>>> range of> solutions, the ability to represent an idea with an
 image,>>>> a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other figurative language,>>>> or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and follow, but instead>>>> to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of thin>>> king (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the box").>>>>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should>>>> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high>>>> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable>>>> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to>>>> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should be>>>> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical thinking>>>> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F>>> wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean teaching>>> critical>> thinking skills which once our students know how
 to think>>> in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in achieving>>> their>> education and other life goals. However, just like K-12>>> education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes spinning>>> wheel of>> accountability which stifle>>> s creativity and teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->>>>> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October>>> 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>>>>> test. We need look no further then those who have been successful>> on>>> any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just>>> smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy>>> reading, mvies,
 theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know,>>> I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the>>> reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more>>> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure>>> to the arts, banking industry, faculty>>> ,>> medicine, legal issues as part of your everyday life tends to>>> offer>> more of an advantage when testing then someone whose only>>> exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My students participate>>> in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get into it" tend>>> to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste of>>> time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally>>> frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they>>> would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>>>> activities that have to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>>>>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>>
 GED Instructor>>>>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a>>> proponent of creativity in adult literacy education -->> indeed in all>>> education. As Marc Tucker, President of the National>> Center for>>> Education and the Economy, has said in a presention>> recently to the>>> National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>>>>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->>>>>>> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive without>>>>> high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers>>>>> and administrators believe that their>> students will not pass the>>>>> GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the>>>>> test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many>>>>> K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe>>>>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes tests.) I hate to be>>>>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key
 question on the>>>>> minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the>>>>> panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it>>>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original message>>>>> ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>>>>>>> wanted to>>> give a qu>>> ick reminder where you can get the information on this>>> discussion.>>> For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>> suggested>>> resources go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>>> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>
 Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what>>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you>>> can get the information>> on this discussion. For the full>>> announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>> now!>>>>>>>>
 Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your subscription settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------>>> ------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>> change your subscription settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or
 change your subscription>>> settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings>>> , please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> Stop by today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>>>>
 ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 3>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:24:28 -0400>>> From: Andrea Wilder>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1013] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> Hi Mary Lynn-->>>>>> One of my mantras for students, no matter the age, has been: "Don't>>> waste their time." Is this what you are getting at?>>>>>> Andrea>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 9:01 PM, Mary Lynn Simons wrote:>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>>> decide what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to>>>> be able to pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to>>>> college or training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> From:>>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:
 assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat, 27 Oct>>>> 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject: [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion ->>>> what you need to know!>> David, I agree that creativity is essential>>>> in GED programs, especially if> students are planning to go on to>>>> college! Students who pass the GED with> minimal ability to freely>>>> think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh options are>>>> usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges> require>>>> program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As we> know,>>>> writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to develop.>>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>>> Humanities> courses demand students to understand and even implement>>>> creative forms,> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For>>>> students to truly> understand history, they must be able to visualize>>>> different
 time periods.> Symbolic thought translates into statistics>>>> and math classes in which> graphs, numbers and equations are used to>>>> communicate ideas. The list goes> on.>> Someone here or in another>>>> posting made the remark that students in a GED> class who are not>>>> reading in class are not practicing reading at all. If> the instructor>>>> is writing on the board, if the students are writing, if the> students>>>> are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of more>>>>> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take>>>> that> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we>>>> might not> get with GED students. But especially with students who>>>> want to pursue> higher education after earning the GED, we need to>>>> have the time to teach> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just>>>> now ran across an essay from Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a>>>> long time but did in my past lives. The essay
 demonstrates how>>>>> creativity is used in the college classroom as well as what GED>>>> students can> expect in college (though perhaps not to this extent,>>>> depending on the> teacher and the class).>>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in>>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend>>>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between>>>> public schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED>>>> students to succeed. Part of these discussions should include>>>>> creativity used and expected in every academic setting.>>> Katherine>>>> Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online Instructor> Prince William County>>>> Public Schools> Adult Education> P.O. Box 389> Manassas, VA 20108>>>>> work 703-791-8387> fax 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message----->>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>>> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On> Behalf Of David J. Rosen>>>>> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007
 10:54 PM> To: The Assessment Discussion>>>> List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to>>>> know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we mean by>>>> creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>>> means to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will>>>> more students have more and higher academic skills,> better test>>>> scores? Or is creativity itself an end -- that is, do we> want>>>> students to be both academically prepared and creative? Or> both? And>>>> where do critical skills fit in?>> I would argue, as Marc Tucker does,>>>> that we need both high academic> skills and creativity, and I would>>>> put critical thinking in both> these catregories, both as a means and>>>> as an end. Our adult secondary> education (e.g. GED) programs should>>>> provide students with the> opportunity to have academic skills that>>>> are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong critical thinking>>>> skills (these
 may be inseparable> from strong academic skills), and>>>> the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is the>>>> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>>> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>>> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and>>>> if so how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education>>>> is measuring> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not>>>> paying attention to one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the>>>> historic strengths of the U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that>>>> the nearly exclusive focus on high> stakes basic skills tests for>>>> K-12, and the focus on only traditional> basic skills for the GED>>>> tests disrespects important creative skills> like the ability to look>>>> at a problem freshly and from different> perspectives, the ability to>>>> try out and evaluate a range of> solutions, the ability to
 represent>>>> an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a metaphor or other>>>> figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand and>>>> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of>>>> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the>>>> box").>> Are these goals that every GED student has or should have.>>>> No. Should> they be? Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED>>>> or high> school diploma as a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone>>>> to stable> employment and self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door>>>> to> successful post-secondary learning, these are the skills we should>>>> be> teaching and measuring: academic skills, including critical>>>> thinking> and creativity.>> I invite your comments on this.>> David J.>>>> Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On Oct 26, 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge,>>>> Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to creativity do we mean>>>> teaching critical>> thinking
 skills which once our students know how>>>> to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be successful in>>>> achieving their>> education and other life goals. However, just like>>>> K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high stakes>>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and>>>> teachers teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult>>>> Education & Transitions Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From:>>>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On>>>> Behalf Of shirley ledet>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>>>>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re:>>>> GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>> I agree that>>>> creativity is not the enemy of success on standardized>> test. We need>>>> look no further then those who have been successful>> on any type of>>>> test. We tend to use terms like natuarally gifted,>> just smart, etc.>>>> If you speak to these
 folks they are well>> rounded, enjoy reading,>>>> mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>> "I don't know, I just>>>> know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may be the reason for>>>> disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more disparity>>>> between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure to the>>>> arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part of>>>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing>>>> then someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard.>>>> My students participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those>>>> that "get into it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that>>>> feel it is a waste of time>> and they just want to "study for the GED">>>> are generally frustrated>> when "all of their hard work does not pay>>>> off like they would>> like." Creativity also leads to retention;>>>> especially those>> activities that have to be completed in
 increments.>>>> Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>> Shirley Ledet>>>> GED>>>> Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net wrote:>>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy>>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of>>>> the National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a>>>> presention>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy,>>>> http://>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S.>>>> education>>>> system -->> and he includes adult education, cannot be competitive>>>> without high>> academic standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED>>>> teachers and administrators believe that their>> students will not>>>> pass the GED unless they focus on skills and>> knowledge needed to>>>> pass the test, that creativity is a>> "distraction" and a time-waster.>>>> (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators or policy makers also believe>>>> creativity distracts>> from passing high stakes
 tests.) I hate to be>>>> the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key question on the minds>>>> of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I invite the panelists>>>> to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it essential for>>>> success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>> -------------- Original message ---------------------->> From: "Marie>>>> Cora">>> Hi everyone,>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the>>>> past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a quick reminder where you can>>>> get the information on this>>> discussion. For the full announcement,>>>> information on guests, and>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>>> there were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>>> post your questions and also your own
 experiences to share>>>>>> now!>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:>>>> "Marie Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what>>>> you need to know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi>>>> everyone,>>>>>>>> We?ve had several new subscribers over the past day,>>>> and so I>> wanted to give a quick reminder where you can get the>>>> information>> on this discussion. For the full announcement,>>>> information on>> guests, and suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ?>>>> there were a couple ? you>> can catch up in the archives at:>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>>>>>>
 Please post your questions and also your own experiences to share>>>> now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>> Assessment Discussion>>>> List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>>> Moderator>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>>>>>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or>>>> change your subscription settings, please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->> National>>>> Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> settings, please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>>> msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->> National>>>>
 Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>>> settings, please go to>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> -------------------------------> National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to>>>> kgotthardt at comcast.net>> -------------------------------> National>>>> Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to>>>> macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>>> _________________________________________________________________>>>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>>> Stop by
 today.>>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>>> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>>> ------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy>>>> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 4>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 22:39:24 -0400>>> From: "David J. Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1014] Re: Media Library of Teaching Skills>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;>>> format=flowed>>>>>> ....and the Web address for MLoTS is:>>>>>> http://www.mlots.org>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, at 7:17 PM, David J. Rosen wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>>>>>> The Media Library of Teaching Skills (MLoTS) project, a
 free Web->>>> based library of short digital videos of adult education classrooms>>>> and tutorials, now has three MLoTS-created reading and numeracy>>>> videos and over 30 other videos, including those from:>>>>>>>> ? NCAL/ILI Professional Development Kit (ESOL and basic literacy>>>> tutoring)>>>> ? NCAL/ILI Captured Wisdom (integrating technology),>>>> ? OTAN (integrating technology)>>>> and>>>> ? CLESE (an informal assessment to capture what low-literate ESOL>>>> learners can and cannot do with literacy)>>>>>>>> I hope you will take a look. If you know of other good classroom or>>>> tutoring short videos in digital form, please let me know. I am>>>> hoping that MLoTS will become a large, "one-stop" collection for>>>> adult literacy education classroom videos.>>>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy>>>> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>>> To unsubscribe or change
 your subscription settings, please go to>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 5>>> Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:17:38 -0400>>> From: "David J. Rosen">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1015] GED preparation and creativity>>> To: The Assessment Discussion List>>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed>>>>>> Hello Andrea,>>>>>> On Oct 27, 2007, you wrote:>>>>>>> Has anybody yet in this conversation defined 1. critical reading>>>> and 2. creativity?>>>>>> Here's more on defining creativity. To begin with, it's quite>>> unlikely that we will agree on a definition. There are more than 60>>> of them in the psychological literature (Taylor, 1988), and as far>>> as I am aware there is no standardized measurement instrument for>>> creativity. Some believe it is inherited; some believe it can be>>> taught; some believe it
 can be nurtured or encouraged. I believe that>>> some kinds of creativity can be taught or at least nurtured and that>>> it involves a set of mental activities often closely aligned with the>>> kind of mental activities we call critical thinking. Most of us would>>> agree, I believe, that a key element is originality, but we might>>> differ in describing the paths to it. And it may look different in>>> different contexts, in the sciences, in the arts, in technology, and>>> in the creative problem solving of daily living.>>>>>> In the context in which I raised the issue of creativity, I was>>> thinking of the application of new ideas, what some would refer to as>>> innovation or ingenuity. It is this applied creativity that I believe>>> Marc Tucker had in mind as something that Americans have historically>>> valued and excelled at, that has been an element of American economic>>> success, and that may be undervalued or lost now in the education>>> systems' rush toward
 performance on high stakes standardized tests.>>>>>> Are adult literacy education students (including basic education,>>> secondary education and ESOL) capable of this kind of creativity? If>>> so, should we nurture it? I believe they are and that we should. In>>> many GED programs I have seen, it is not nourished, usually not even>>> acknowledged in program goals or objectives. And I have never seen>>> it measured. This indicates to me that, as a field, we do not value>>> and support student creativity. I agree with Marc Tucker that, if we>>> are interested in Americans' global competitiveness that we should>>> value creativity, and of course, there are other good reasons to>>> nourish creativity.>>>>>> What do you think about this?>>>>>>>>> * Taylor, C.W. (1988). "Various approaches to and definitions of>>> creativity", in ed. Sternberg, R.J.: The nature of creativity:>>> Contemporary psychological perspectives. Cambridge University Press.>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>
 djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> Message: 6>>> Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 07:51:18 -0400>>> From: "Donna Chambers">>>> Subject: [Assessment 1016] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";>>> reply-type=original>>>>>> Mary Lynn,>>>>>> Your argument to push learners forward is a common belief. I am not>>> suggesting to hold learners back, but if we are to prepare them for>>> just>>> "passing the test" we are overlooking the "ASE" responsibility of our>>> job.>>> Preparing the learner to possess the expected academic skills of a>>> high>>> school student and be ready to transition to college level academics>>> is in>>> the learners' best interest in respect to time and money. Community>>> College should not have to remediate adult basic skills, and yet they>>> do. If>>> the GED were to be more aligned with the tests
 required to enter>>> community>>> college, such as the Accuplacer, the transition would be smoother, but>>> it is>>> not. Preparation for the learners next steps, which includes basic>>> and>>> secondary fundamental skills, is the responsibility of Adult Literacy.>>>>>> Donna Chambers>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----->>> From: "Mary Lynn Simons">>>> To: "The Assessment Discussion List">>>> Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 9:01 PM>>> Subject: [Assessment 1012] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>>>>>>>>>>>> Community Colleges test students when they enter and then teach them>>> accordingly. It is not our job to paternalistically/maternalistically>>> decide>>> what is best for our students beyond what they need to know to be able>>> to>>> pass the test. We must not hold them back. Let them get to college or>>> training as fast as possible.>>>>>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------> From:>>> Kgotthardt at comcast.net> To:>>> assessment at nifl.gov> Date: Sat,
 27 Oct 2007 09:35:10 -0400> Subject:>>> [Assessment 1007] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to know!>> David,>>> I>>> agree that creativity is essential in GED programs, especially if>>>> students>>> are planning to go on to college! Students who pass the GED with>>>> minimal>>> ability to freely think creatively, explore abstract ideas, and> weigh>>> options are usually at a loss in the college classroom. Most colleges>>>> require program elements such as "writing across the curriculum." As>>> we>>>> know, writing requires abstract thought, the kind adults need to>>> develop.>>>>> Even basic college writing classes require understanding and using>>>> rhetorical patterns found in the descriptive essay and more.>>> Humanities>>>> courses demand students to understand and even implement creative>>> forms,>>>> figures of speech, figurative language, and more. For students to>>> truly>>>> understand history, they must be able to visualize different time>>> periods.>>>>
 Symbolic thought translates into statistics and math classes in which>>>> graphs, numbers and equations are used to communicate ideas. The list>>> goes>>>> on.>> Someone here or in another posting made the remark that students>>> in a>>> GED> class who are not reading in class are not practicing reading at>>> all.>>> If> the instructor is writing on the board, if the students are>>> writing, if>>> the> students are taking practice tests, they ARE reading. In terms of>>> more>>>> formalized, lengthier readings, students will most likely need to take>>> that>>>> home. Yes, this requires a certain amount of discipline that we might>>> not>>>> get with GED students. But especially with students who want to pursue>>>> higher education after earning the GED, we need to have the time to>>> teach>>>> them to think critically.>> Finally, I just now ran across an essay>>> from>>> Peter Elbow whom I haven't> studied in a long time but did in my past>>> lives.>>> The essay
 demonstrates how> creativity is used in the college>>> classroom as>>> well as what GED students can> expect in college (though perhaps not>>> to this>>> extent, depending on the> teacher and the class).>>> http://www.ntlf.com/html/lib/bib/writing.htm>> I'm a firm believer in>>> extensive transitional services for GED students> planning to attend>>> college, and I think it's essential to have> communications between>>> public>>> schools and college to make this happen if we> want GED students to>>> succeed.>>> Part of these discussions should include> creativity used and expected>>> in>>> every academic setting.>>> Katherine Mercurio Gotthardt, ESOL Online>>> Instructor> Prince William County Public Schools> Adult Education>>>> P.O. Box>>> 389> Manassas, VA 20108> work 703-791-8387> fax>>> 703-791-8889>>>>>> -----Original Message-----> From:>>> assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]On>>>> Behalf>>> Of David J. Rosen> Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007
 10:54 PM> To: The>>> Assessment Discussion List> Subject: [Assessment 1005] Re: GED>>> Discussion ->>> what you need to know!>>> Assessment colleagues,>> Toni asked what we>>> mean>>> by creativity. Good question. I'll give it a> shot.>> Is creativity a>>> means>>> to an end -- that is, with creative teaching> approaches will more>>> students>>> have more and higher academic skills,> better test scores? Or is>>> creativity>>> itself an end -- that is, do we> want students to be both academically>>> prepared and creative? Or> both? And where do critical skills fit>>> in?>> I>>> would argue, as Marc Tucker does, that we need both high academic>>>> skills>>> and creativity, and I would put critical thinking in both> these>>> catregories, both as a means and as an end. Our adult secondary>>>> education>>> (e.g. GED) programs should provide students with the> opportunity to>>> have>>> academic skills that are strong enough to succeed> in college, strong>>> critical thinking
 skills (these may be inseparable> from strong>>> academic>>> skills), and the skills of creative problem> solving.>> Since this is>>> the>>> assessment list, let me ask what are we measuring> now adult secondary>>> education programs?>> ? Perhaps academic skills, at least through>>> standardized tests> ? Are we measuring critical thinking skills, and>>> if so>>> how?> ? I am not aware that anyone in adult literacy education is>>> measuring>>>> creative skills.>> If Marc Tucker is right, we are not paying>>> attention to>>> one of the> greatest economic assets, one of the historic strengths of>>> the>>> U.S. I> agree with Tucker and believe that the nearly exclusive focus>>> on>>> high> stakes basic skills tests for K-12, and the focus on only>>> traditional>>>> basic skills for the GED tests disrespects important creative skills>>>> like>>> the ability to look at a problem freshly and from different>>>> perspectives,>>> the ability to try out and evaluate a range of>
 solutions, the ability>>> to>>> represent an idea with an image, a moving> image, a drawing; a>>> metaphor or>>> other figurative language, or> rhetoric; and the ability to understand>>> and>>> follow, but instead to> disregard instructions or traditional paths of>>> thinking (what we now> often describe as "thinking outside the>>> box").>> Are>>> these goals that every GED student has or should have. No. Should>>>> they be?>>> Not necessarily. But for students who see the GED or high> school>>> diploma as>>> a way out of poverty, as a stepping stone to stable> employment and>>> self-sufficiency, as a key to open the door to> successful>>> post-secondary>>> learning, these are the skills we should be> teaching and measuring:>>> academic skills, including critical thinking> and creativity.>> I>>> invite>>> your comments on this.>> David J. Rosen> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> On>>> Oct 26,>>> 2007, at 3:39 PM, Borge, Toni F wrote:>>> When we are referring to>>> creativity do we
 mean teaching critical>> thinking skills which once>>> our>>> students know how to think in a>> critical thinking way they will be>>> successful in achieving their>> education and other life goals.>>> However,>>> just like K-12 education,>> adult education is captured on the high>>> stakes>>> spinning wheel of>> accountability which stifles creativity and>>> teachers>>> teach to the>> test.>>>> Toni Borge>>>> BHCC>> Adult Education &>>> Transitions>>> Program>>>> Boston, MA>>>>>>>> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov>>> [mailto:assessment->> bounces at nifl.gov] On Behalf Of shirley ledet>>>>> Sent:>>> Thursday, October 25, 2007 4:30 PM>> To: The Assessment Discussion>>> List>>>>> Subject: [Assessment 1001] Re: GED Discussion - what you need to>>> know!>>>>>>>> I agree that creativity is not the enemy of success on>>> standardized>> test. We need look no further then those who have been>>> successful>> on any type of test. We tend to use terms like natuarally>>> gifted,>> just
 smart, etc. If you speak to these folks they are well>>>>> rounded, enjoy reading, mvies, theater, they tend to use terms like>>>>> "I>>> don't know, I just know stuff." Researchers have found that>> this may>>> be>>> the reason for disparity between ethnicity. I believe>> there is more>>> disparity between socio economic background then>> ethnicity. Exposure>>> to>>> the arts, banking industry, faculty,>> medicine, legal issues as part>>> of>>> your everyday life tends to offer>> more of an advantage when testing>>> then>>> someone whose only exposure>> is to go to school and study hard. My>>> students>>> participate in a>> quite a few creative projects and those that "get>>> into>>> it" tend to>> do better in all subjects. Those that feel it is a waste>>> of>>> time>> and they just want to "study for the GED" are generally>>> frustrated>>>>> when "all of their hard work does not pay off like they would>> like.">>> Creativity also leads to retention; especially those>>
 activities that>>> have>>> to be completed in increments. Let's bring on>> more creativity!>>>>>>> Shirley>>> Ledet>>>> GED Instructor>>>> NHC-Carver>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>> wrote:>>>>>>> Colleagues,>>>> I am a proponent of creativity in adult literacy>>> education -->> indeed in all education. As Marc Tucker, President of>>> the>>> National>> Center for Education and the Economy, has said in a>>> presention>>>>> recently to the National Commission on Adult Literacy, http://>>>>>>>> www.caalusa.org/video/choices.html , the U.S. education system -->>>>> and he>>> includes adult education, cannot be competitive without high>> academic>>> standards AND creativity.>>>> But many GED teachers and administrators>>> believe that their>> students will not pass the GED unless they focus>>> on>>> skills and>> knowledge needed to pass the test, that creativity is a>>>>> "distraction" and a time-waster. (Many K-12 teachers,>> administrators>>> or>>> policy makers also believe
 creativity distracts>> from passing high>>> stakes>>> tests.) I hate to be the one to raise this>> issue, but it's the key>>> question on the minds of many GED teachers>> and administrators, so I>>> invite>>> the panelists to address it.>>>> Is creativity a distraction or is it>>> essential for success? Why?>>>>>> David J. Rosen>>>>> djrosen at comcast.net>>>> -------------- Original>>> message ---------------------->> From: "Marie Cora">>> Hi>>> everyone,>>>>>>>>> We've had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted>>> to>>>>>> give a quick reminder where you can get the information on this>>>>>> discussion. For the full announcement, information on guests, and>>>>>> suggested resources go to:>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ->>> there>>> were a couple ->> you can>>> catch up in the archives at:>>>>>>
 http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>> Please>>> post>>> your questions and also your own experiences to share>> now!>>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>> Marie Cora>>> Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From:>>> "Marie>>> Cora">> To:>> Subject: [Assessment 942] GED Discussion - what you>>> need to>>> know!>> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:14 +0000>>>> Hi everyone,>>>>>>>>>>> We?ve>>> had several new subscribers over the past day, and so I>> wanted to>>> give a>>> quick reminder where you can get the information>> on this discussion.>>> For>>> the full announcement, information on>> guests, and suggested>>> resources go>>> to:>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/lincs/discussions/assessment/>>> 07creativityGED.html>>>>>>>>>>> If you missed the posts from yesterday ? there were a couple ?
 you>>>>> can>>> catch up in the archives at: http://www.nifl.gov/pipermail/>>>>> assessment/2007/date.html>>>>>>>> Please post your questions and also>>> your>>> own experiences to share now!>>>>>>>> Thanks!!>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> Assessment Discussion List Moderator>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Marie Cora>>>>>>> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com>>>> NIFL Assessment Discussion List>>> Moderator>>>>>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>>
 http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> delivered to msledet at yahoo.com>>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>>> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email>>> delivered to djrosen at comcast.net>>>>>> ------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered to kgotthardt at comcast.net>> ------------------------------->>>> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list>>>> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription>>> settings,>>> please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email>>> delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com>>>>>>
 _________________________________________________________________>>> Help yourself to FREE treats served up daily at the Messenger Caf?.>>> Stop by>>> today.>>> http://www.cafemessenger.com/info/info_sweetstuff2.html?>>> ocid=TXT_TAGLM_OctWLtagline>>> ------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>> Assessment mailing list>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> Email delivered to donnaedp at cox.net>>>>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------>>>>>> ------------------------------->>> National Institute for Literacy>>> Assessment mailing list>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>>>>>>>> End of Assessment Digest, Vol 25, Issue 33>>> ******************************************>>>>>>>>> ------------------------------->>> National Institute for
 Literacy>>> Assessment mailing list>>> Assessment at nifl.gov>>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to>>> http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>>> Email delivered to andreawilder at comcast.net>>>> ------------------------------->> National Institute for Literacy>> Assessment mailing list>> Assessment at nifl.gov>> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment>> Email delivered to macsimoin at hotmail.com> Peek-a-boo FREE Tricks & Treats for You! Get 'em!> -------------------------------> National Institute for Literacy> Assessment mailing list> Assessment at nifl.gov> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment> Email delivered to djrosen at comcast.net

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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Nov  8 08:10:27 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 08:10:27 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1057]  Seeking assessments
Message-ID: <013b01c82208$bbf5ccb0$620110ac@LITNOW>

Colleagues,
 
The following post is from Kevin O'Connor, from Framingham, Mass:
 
 
I'm trying to find what other adult ed programs have used for assessment
with female second-language learners who may be low-income or homeless.
*     
      How many used commercially-based assessments (BEST+, REEP, TABE,
CASAS, etc)?
*     
      How many use alternative assessments (portfolio-based, interviews,
observations, self-assessments, etc)?
*     
      Do any of the list subscribers use the EFF framework as part of
their curriculum/assessment structure?
*     
      Which approaches have been/would be the most authentic and
informative for your program? 
 
 
 
 
Marie Cora
 <mailto:marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com> marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com
NIFL Assessment Discussion List Moderator
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
 
 
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From cdubois1 at student.gsu.edu  Mon Nov 12 15:35:09 2007
From: cdubois1 at student.gsu.edu (Courtney Leigh DuBois)
Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 15:35:09 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1058]  Program Assessment
Message-ID: <1194899709.dab5caccdubois1@student.gsu.edu>

Hi Folks,

I'm a graduate student in Instructional Technology at Georgia State University.
I've been reading this newsgroup since the beginning of the semester with great
interest since assessment is one of the five competences in our program.

I have a question for you all. Do you conduct any formative and/or summative evaluations on your program? If so, what type  of program evaluation do you conduct, and how often do you evaluate your program? 

Courtney DuBois
M.S. Instructional Technology
Georgia State University
Expected graduation May 2008 (yeah!)

From ryanryanc at yahoo.com  Sat Nov 17 17:51:30 2007
From: ryanryanc at yahoo.com (Ryan Hall)
Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:51:30 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1059]  TABE Training
Message-ID: <C364DAA2.40F3%ryanryanc@yahoo.com>

Hi everyone, 
I am doing some work for a nonprofit literacy agency in Georgia, and I need
some information about using the TABE. I was hoping that people on this list
could tell me the best way for me to get training for administering,
scoring, and analyzing scores on the TABE. Any suggestions?
Thanks, 
Ryan

 

From bsanders37 at yahoo.com  Sat Nov 17 21:53:05 2007
From: bsanders37 at yahoo.com (Benny L Sanders)
Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 18:53:05 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Assessment 1060] Re: TABE Training
In-Reply-To: <C364DAA2.40F3%ryanryanc@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <903920.14027.qm@web35901.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hi, I would suggest TABE PC.  It does all of that for you and saves hours of study, testing and scoring and analyzing.  It cost about $350 for 50 applications.  To me, that is the only way to go.  It is a Contemporary Publisher product.
   
  Benny Sanders
Ryan Hall <ryanryanc at yahoo.com> wrote:
  Hi everyone, 
I am doing some work for a nonprofit literacy agency in Georgia, and I need
some information about using the TABE. I was hoping that people on this list
could tell me the best way for me to get training for administering,
scoring, and analyzing scores on the TABE. Any suggestions?
Thanks, 
Ryan

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to bsanders37 at yahoo.com

 
   
   
  Benny L. Sanders
  Executive Director
  Reach Across Houston
  9808 Bauman Road
  Houston, TX 77076
  (v) 713-697-2244
  (f) 713-697-2323
  (c)832-797-3373
   
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From alflinn at templejc.edu  Sun Nov 18 09:53:34 2007
From: alflinn at templejc.edu (alflinn at templejc.edu)
Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 08:53:34 -0600
Subject: [Assessment 1061] Re: TABE Training
Message-ID: <eaa9a16823a54cb4b83559da059b1516.alflinn@templejc.edu>

We use TABE PC, but find the system is not always user friendly. We often are forced to use 
the "paper pencil" tests especially when it repeatedly "bumps" a learner out of the system. 

No matter what you use, it is essential that staff READ the manuals and take the test themselves to 
understand the personality of the test and what it will and will not tell you. The publisher will 
be glad to provide you with training, but an experienced user would be a better choice (often the 
publisher is only interested in selling the product, not explaining it).

Are you near any adult education/literacy programs using TABE? You might be able to attend their 
training or find a trainer through them.

Please note: There is an IT issue with TABE PC as well. I belive the requirement is Flash 8 NOT 9. 
We have had nightmares trying to utilize our campus testing center because most of the tests the 
center provides require the OTHER Flash player. Make sure you check with TABE PC folks AND your 
internal IT people to make sure you are set up properly.

Good luck!

Amy Flinn
Temple College

------- Original Message -------
>From    : Benny L Sanders[mailto:bsanders37 at yahoo.com]
Sent    : 11/17/2007 8:53:05 PM
To      : assessment at nifl.gov
Cc      : 
Subject : RE: [Assessment 1060] Re: TABE Training

 Hi, I would suggest TABE PC.  It does all of that for you and saves hours of study, testing and 
scoring and analyzing.  It cost about $350 for 50 applications.  To me, that is the only way to 
go.  It is a Contemporary Publisher product.
   
  Benny Sanders
Ryan Hall <ryanryanc at yahoo.com> wrote:
  Hi everyone, 
I am doing some work for a nonprofit literacy agency in Georgia, and I need
some information about using the TABE. I was hoping that people on this list
could tell me the best way for me to get training for administering,
scoring, and analyzing scores on the TABE. Any suggestions?
Thanks, 
Ryan

-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to  
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 
Email delivered to bsanders37 at yahoo.com

 
   
   
  Benny L. Sanders
  Executive Director
  Reach Across Houston
  9808 Bauman Road
  Houston, TX 77076
  (v) 713-697-2244
  (f) 713-697-2323
  (c)832-797-3373
   

From bcarmel at rocketmail.com  Sun Nov 18 12:01:24 2007
From: bcarmel at rocketmail.com (Bruce C)
Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 09:01:24 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Assessment 1062] Re: TABE Training
In-Reply-To: <903920.14027.qm@web35901.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <475710.80712.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hello Assessment List:

Here's the bind we have been in forever:

The standardized tests like the TABE tell us little
about what is really go on, but they are required,
easy to administer, and give us a "score."  Other
assessments--formal and informal--give lots of
information about what is really going on but they
take too much time and are not considered "valid and
reliable" scores. 

I would discourage people from using the TABE to
analyze students' reading abilities. The TABE is not
even a great indicator of reading level or progress,
and I think any analysis of students' skill sets based
on the TABE is really shaky--no matter what the
publishers who make tons of money on the TABE say.

It takes a lot more time to do one-on-one assessments
where you ask students to read something--silently
and/or aloud--note their errors and ask them questions
about it. But that is definitely worth analyzing. 

Also,  I think the TABE is a particularly bad
standardized test.  

A few comments:
--If students scores high on the TABE, they are pretty
much guaranteed to be good readers (and a good test
takers)
--If students scores low on the TABE:
they might be poor readers, 
they might have been tripped up by this bad test:
maybe they needed more time to read well
maybe they got nervous, 
maybe they read and understood every bit of the TABE
but picked the wrong answers
or maybe something else was wrong--they were tired,
distracted by something in their personal lives,
hungry, or sick. 

from Bruce Carmel
Turning Point
Brooklyn NY

      ____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better sports nut!  Let your teams follow you 
with Yahoo Mobile. Try it now.  http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9_qDKvtAbMuh1G1SQtBI7ntAcJ

From bhofmeyer at niesc.k12.in.us  Sun Nov 18 18:35:05 2007
From: bhofmeyer at niesc.k12.in.us (Barbara Hofmeyer)
Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:35:05 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1063] Re: TABE Training
In-Reply-To: <C364DAA2.40F3%ryanryanc@yahoo.com>
References: <C364DAA2.40F3%ryanryanc@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4740CC29.3020605@niesc.k12.in.us>

Ryan,
If you contact CTB McGraw Hill, they advertise staff development tools 
including videos and PowerPoint on how to administer, score, and 
interpret TABE tests. Their website is www.ctb.com/tabe. You will also 
find a link to FAQ's on the website. That may answer many of your 
questions. Your regional CTB consultant may also be able to point you to 
some local live training.
Barb Hofmeyer

Ryan Hall wrote:
> Hi everyone, 
> I am doing some work for a nonprofit literacy agency in Georgia, and I need
> some information about using the TABE. I was hoping that people on this list
> could tell me the best way for me to get training for administering,
> scoring, and analyzing scores on the TABE. Any suggestions?
> Thanks, 
> Ryan
>
>  
>
>
> -------------------------------
> National Institute for Literacy
> Assessment mailing list
> Assessment at nifl.gov
> To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
> Email delivered to bhofmeyer at niesc.k12.in.us
>
>
>   

From gbundy at rmi.net  Sun Nov 18 18:44:20 2007
From: gbundy at rmi.net (Gail B)
Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 16:44:20 -0700 (GMT-07:00)
Subject: [Assessment 1064] Re: TABE Training
Message-ID: <20212402.1195429461095.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

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From caltamari at gmail.com  Mon Nov 19 12:47:01 2007
From: caltamari at gmail.com (Cindi Al-Tamari)
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 09:47:01 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 1065] Re: TABE Training
In-Reply-To: <C364DAA2.40F3%ryanryanc@yahoo.com>
References: <C364DAA2.40F3%ryanryanc@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1143e2770711190947l521df4cai12b5a7b050fe9328@mail.gmail.com>

Hi everyone,

I am at graduate student at Fort Hays State University.  Currently I
am taking a course in assessment and I had a few questions pertaining
to assessment of ESL adult learners.  I have been reading this
listserv since the beginning of the semester, and have found a lot of
good information but not as much as I was hoping pertaining to
assessment of adult ESL learners.  I would greatly appreciate your
input on the following questions:

1) How does assessment of adult ESL students vary from assessment of
K-12 ESL students?

2) Should there be, or is there, one standard of assessment of adult
ESL students or should the assessment vary according to the students
motive for studying English?  (Communicative purposes vs. academic
purposes)?

3) Are there any web sites or previous posts from this listserv that
you suggest for more information on adult ESL assessment.

4) What is your view of standardized tests such as the TOEFL etc...Do
you feel these tests adequately assess ESL students true level of
competency in English?  Where do these tests fall short and how can
they be improved?

Thank you,

Cindi

From PowerPath at aol.com  Tue Nov 20 09:37:21 2007
From: PowerPath at aol.com (PowerPath at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 09:37:21 EST
Subject: [Assessment 1066] Using TABE with Literacy and ABE students -
	Guidelines for Inclusive Test Admin!!!
Message-ID: <c5e.23d9a9fa.34744b21@aol.com>

Ryan - in response to your inquiry about using the TABE test in a literacy 
program, based upon our recent research (4,567 adult education and literacy 
students from 13 states in 108 programs, 2003 - 2006) on the incidence of special 
learning needs in adult education here are some things I think you should be 
thinking about:

1.? About 4-5 out of every 10 adults in literacy and basic education programs 
have a vision function problem - mostly near vision and binocularity (using 
the two eyes together for sustained reading).

2.? Between 7 to 8 out of every 10 adults in literacy and basic education 
programs have attention challenges and will begin to loose comprehension and 
struggle with time-on-task.

3.? About 8 to 9 out of every 10 adults in literacy and basic education 
programs have issues with bright overhead lights, white paper and black letters 
(too much glare, letters move or go in and out of focus, difficulties with 
following lines within paragraphs AND great difficulty with filling in bubble sheets 
accurately) - the TABE is on white paper - has black letters and uses a 
bubble sheet answer form.? This key (and little known) learning challenge is call 
visual stress syndrome (VSS) or scotopic sensitivity.

4.? About 4 out of every 10 adults in literacy and basic education programs 
already have a diagnosis of 'Learning Disability' with about 6 to 7 out of 10 
that could, if not already, be diagnosed as having a some type of learning 
disability.? We all know the legal issues re: ADA, IDEA, Section 504, etc., and 
the need to provide accommodations and adaptations...right?

Consequently, in administration of the TABE there are some key issues that 
must be addressed OR the adult learner will not be able to demonstrate 'what 
they know' on the TABE due to the way the test materials are presented.

CTB McGraw-Hill (publisher of the TABE) has known that there needs to be 
special accommodations and adaptations made for adults with special learning needs 
- most of which could be ID'd as 'disabilities' if the resources were 
available for neuro-psychological testing.? EVEN without such diagnostic testing 
being available for a formal diagnosis, CTB McGraw-Hill has a created a set of 
accommodations and adaptations for inclusion of all adults to better show what 
they know on the TABE test.

The Guidelines for Inclusive Test Administration IS NOT often referred to by 
either TABE trainers, in TABE materials or by the CTB McGraw-Hill sales 
force....so, this document isn't widely circulated - BUT IT DOES EXIST!?

The Guidelines have been included as part of the conversation in conference 
sessions in adult education via The National Association for Adults with 
Special Learning Needs (NAASLN) at both NAASLN conferences, as part of preconference 
information in NAASLN sponsored pre-conferences, and in NAASLN conference 
sessions tracks at COABE and CEA.?

Below is the link to this Guide.? I believe it is a huge disservice to all of 
our literacy and adult basic education students/customers IF ACCOMMODATIONS 
and ADAPTATIONS ARE NOT MADE POSSIBLE in ALL learning situations and especially 
in testing.

Guidelines for Inclusive Test Administration 2005
http://www.ctb.com/articles/article_information.jsp?CO
NTENT%3C%3Ecnt_id=10134198673254933&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=1408474395222381&
ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=1408474395213825&bmUID=1195562339042

Laura Weisel, Ph.D.,
Clinical Services
The TLP Group*
PO Box 21510
Columbus, OH? 43221
614.850.8677
dr.weisel at powerpath.com

*The TLP Group is a social entrepreneurial company that uses traditional 
entrepreneurial principles to organize, create, and manage ventures for creating 
needed social change to address recognized social problems.? The social 
entrepreneurial company often tackles social problems that have not been successfully 
solved by traditional government or nonprofit initiatives.????

The TLP Group works in partnership with state departments, universities, c
olleges, communities, community providers and institutional providers.? By 
combining the best of talents, the most effective use of resources, and the latest 
evidence based research, The TLP Group is dedicated to making a dramatic impact 
on service delivery and client outcomes.

**************************************
 See what's new at http://www.aol.com
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Tue Nov 20 11:27:11 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 11:27:11 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1067] DEADLINE Reminder - WE LEARN Conference Proposals
Message-ID: <075901c82b92$3530a860$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

 
2008 Conference Call for Proposals
 
WE LEARN 5th Annual (Net)Working Gathering & Conference on Women &
Literacy
Building Alliances / Construyendo Alianzas
 
http://www.litwomen.org/conference.html
 
March 7- 8, 2008 
Fordham Univ. at Lincoln Center in New York City, NY
Co-Sponsored with WE LEARN by Fordham University Graduate School of
Education
 
** The Call for Proposals is now available -- both poster & form are
available in English and Spanish. **
 
We are seeking a variety of creative formats, both formal and informal:
 
Formal 90 minute sessions:
Hands-OnWorkshop or Demonstration 
Panel Presentation 
Facilitated Discussion
Performance/Reading followed by Discussion/Activity 
Research Paper/Presentation 
 
Informal Options:
Community Share Table Space: Display a Poster, Collage, or Art Work /
Share Classroom or Program Materials, etc.     (This option is available
to literacy programs, student groups, or community centers that want to
share their work addressing women's literacy issues and/or the theme of
the conference.) ** Space Limited
 
Open Air **Time: 15 minutes or less: Tell a story, Sing a song, Recite a
poem, Perform a skit, etc.
    (Open to individuals or groups who want to share their work
addressing women's literacy issues and/or the theme of the conference.)
 
Caucus Time: Facilitate a discussion to exchange ideas, Build alliances,
Organize a regional group, etc.
   
Wellness Activity: Lead Tai Chi, Yoga, stretching or meditation, Guide a
group walk, Lead dance or movement, Prepare a craft or art activity,
Organize a music activity, etc. 
 
 
DEADLINE for Application: Nov. 30, 2007
Please apply using the Internet form.
 
http://www.litwomen.org/conferences/2008/props08.html
 
Sponsorship, advertiser, and exhibitor information also available:
http://www.litwomen.org/conferences/2008/sponsors.pdf
 
Registration and hotel information will be available by December 3.
 
 
For questions or concerns, please contact:
Mev Miller, Ed.D., Director
 
WE LEARN
Women Expanding: Literacy Education Action Resource Network
www.litwomen.org/welearn.html
 
182 Riverside Ave.
Cranston, RI 02910
401-383-4374
welearn at litwomen.org
 
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From fgibson4 at student.gsu.edu  Tue Nov 20 11:41:48 2007
From: fgibson4 at student.gsu.edu (Frederick W. Gibson)
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:41:48 +0000
Subject: [Assessment 1068] Re: TABE Training
Message-ID: <1195576908.b9db104fgibson4@student.gsu.edu>

Hello everyone:

A dededicated Website to ESL assessment would be:

http://www-esl.info/

Assessment by testing is just away to give all of the testing centers in the United State an opportunity to rob (steal money) all of the public and private school system of  money spent on testing. Most of the test given have some type of bias or does not adequately represent what is being assessed. 

Thanks
Fred Gibson
GSU

-----Original Message-----
From: "Cindi Al-Tamari" <caltamari at gmail.com>
To: "The Assessment Discussion List" <assessment at nifl.gov>
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 09:47:01 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 1065] Re: TABE Training

Hi everyone,

I am at graduate student at Fort Hays State University.  Currently I
am taking a course in assessment and I had a few questions pertaining
to assessment of ESL adult learners.  I have been reading this
listserv since the beginning of the semester, and have found a lot of
good information but not as much as I was hoping pertaining to
assessment of adult ESL learners.  I would greatly appreciate your
input on the following questions:

1) How does assessment of adult ESL students vary from assessment of
K-12 ESL students?

2) Should there be, or is there, one standard of assessment of adult
ESL students or should the assessment vary according to the students
motive for studying English?  (Communicative purposes vs. academic
purposes)?

3) Are there any web sites or previous posts from this listserv that
you suggest for more information on adult ESL assessment.

4) What is your view of standardized tests such as the TOEFL etc...Do
you feel these tests adequately assess ESL students true level of
competency in English?  Where do these tests fall short and how can
they be improved?

Thank you,

Cindi
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to fgibson4 at student.gsu.edu

From hdooley at riral.org  Tue Nov 20 12:00:24 2007
From: hdooley at riral.org (Howard Dooley)
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 12:00:24 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1069] Re: Using TABE with Literacy and ABE students
	-Guidelines for Inclusive Test Admin!!!
In-Reply-To: <c5e.23d9a9fa.34744b21@aol.com>
References: <c5e.23d9a9fa.34744b21@aol.com>
Message-ID: <0BF2D0726318524ABEF6D58E7BB3CCEB0B960E@pdc.Riral.local>

These are interesting stats. Where are they from? They seem inflated,
given other references and research I have seen.

 

Howard D.

 

________________________________

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of PowerPath at aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 9:37 AM
To: ryanryanc at yahoo.com; assessment at nifl.gov
Subject: [Assessment 1066] Using TABE with Literacy and ABE students
-Guidelines for Inclusive Test Admin!!!

 

Ryan - in response to your inquiry about using the TABE test in a
literacy program, based upon our recent research (4,567 adult education
and literacy students from 13 states in 108 programs, 2003 - 2006) on
the incidence of special learning needs in adult education here are some
things I think you should be thinking about:

1.  About 4-5 out of every 10 adults in literacy and basic education
programs have a vision function problem - mostly near vision and
binocularity (using the two eyes together for sustained reading).

2.  Between 7 to 8 out of every 10 adults in literacy and basic
education programs have attention challenges and will begin to loose
comprehension and struggle with time-on-task.

3.  About 8 to 9 out of every 10 adults in literacy and basic education
programs have issues with bright overhead lights, white paper and black
letters (too much glare, letters move or go in and out of focus,
difficulties with following lines within paragraphs AND great difficulty
with filling in bubble sheets accurately) - the TABE is on white paper -
has black letters and uses a bubble sheet answer form.  This key (and
little known) learning challenge is call visual stress syndrome (VSS) or
scotopic sensitivity.

4.  About 4 out of every 10 adults in literacy and basic education
programs already have a diagnosis of 'Learning Disability' with about 6
to 7 out of 10 that could, if not already, be diagnosed as having a some
type of learning disability.  We all know the legal issues re: ADA,
IDEA, Section 504, etc., and the need to provide accommodations and
adaptations...right?

Consequently, in administration of the TABE there are some key issues
that must be addressed OR the adult learner will not be able to
demonstrate 'what they know' on the TABE due to the way the test
materials are presented.

CTB McGraw-Hill (publisher of the TABE) has known that there needs to be
special accommodations and adaptations made for adults with special
learning needs - most of which could be ID'd as 'disabilities' if the
resources were available for neuro-psychological testing.  EVEN without
such diagnostic testing being available for a formal diagnosis, CTB
McGraw-Hill has a created a set of accommodations and adaptations for
inclusion of all adults to better show what they know on the TABE test.

The Guidelines for Inclusive Test Administration IS NOT often referred
to by either TABE trainers, in TABE materials or by the CTB McGraw-Hill
sales force....so, this document isn't widely circulated - BUT IT DOES
EXIST! 

The Guidelines have been included as part of the conversation in
conference sessions in adult education via The National Association for
Adults with Special Learning Needs (NAASLN) at both NAASLN conferences,
as part of preconference information in NAASLN sponsored
pre-conferences, and in NAASLN conference sessions tracks at COABE and
CEA. 

Below is the link to this Guide.  I believe it is a huge disservice to
all of our literacy and adult basic education students/customers IF
ACCOMMODATIONS and ADAPTATIONS ARE NOT MADE POSSIBLE in ALL learning
situations and especially in testing.

Guidelines for Inclusive Test Administration 2005
http://www.ctb.com/articles/article_information.jsp?CONTENT%3C%3Ecnt_id=
10134198673254933&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=1408474395222381&ASSORTMENT%3C%3
East_id=1408474395213825&bmUID=1195562339042

Laura Weisel, Ph.D.,
Clinical Services
The TLP Group*
PO Box 21510
Columbus, OH  43221
614.850.8677
dr.weisel at powerpath.com

*The TLP Group is a social entrepreneurial company that uses traditional
entrepreneurial principles to organize, create, and manage ventures for
creating needed social change to address recognized social problems.
The social entrepreneurial company often tackles social problems that
have not been successfully solved by traditional government or nonprofit
initiatives.    

The TLP Group works in partnership with state departments, universities,
colleges, communities, community providers and institutional providers.
By combining the best of talents, the most effective use of resources,
and the latest evidence based research, The TLP Group is dedicated to
making a dramatic impact on service delivery and client outcomes.

**************************************
See what's new at http://www.aol.com 
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From PowerPath at aol.com  Tue Nov 20 14:03:23 2007
From: PowerPath at aol.com (PowerPath at aol.com)
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 14:03:23 EST
Subject: [Assessment 1070] Re: Using TABE with Literacy and ABE students
	-Guidelines for Inclusive Test Admin!!!
Message-ID: <c2d.2202165e.3474897b@aol.com>

Howard - 

The statistics are from 108 adult basic and literacy programs, in 13 states, 
who have staff trained in administering the engagement interview and 
screenings in the PowerPath system.   The screenings included an information processing 
screening battery, vision and hearing function screenings, and screenings for 
attention difficulties and visual stress syndrome.   The core screenings have 
been normed, standardized, and prove to be reliable measures for screening 
individuals 16 years of age and older who are native English speakers.   The 
core screenings have been correlated and weighted to predict a Woodcock Johnson 
full scale score.     

The data mentioned in the previous e-mail has been presented at the '07 & '06 
COABE conference, '07 & '06 CEA conference, at the recent '07 ProLiteracy 
conference, and at the '06 Meeting of the Minds Research Symposium. 
 
Earlier data ('03 - '05) was presented to NAEPDC in '05.   A session will 
also be held at the '08 COABE conference titled 'Incidence of Special Learning 
Needs'.   

Additional data (collected from correction adult basic and literacy programs) 
was presented in a Focus on Basics article (Understanding the Complexities of 
Offenders' Special Learning Needs, Volume 7, Issue D, August '05).   

Papers are currently being prepared for publication on the research, data 
collection, and findings.
 
I too was blown away by the data.   It is powerful and has a myriad of 
implications.   New data ('07)   that is being collected appears to mirror previous 
data.   

If you would like more information on the data collection, please contact me 
directly.    

Laura Weisel, Ph.D.,
Clinical Services
The TLP Group*
PO Box 21510
Columbus, OH   43221
614.850.8677
dr.weisel at powerpath.com

*The TLP Group is a social entrepreneurial company that uses traditional 
entrepreneurial principles to organize, create, and manage ventures for creating 
needed social change to address recognized social problems.   The social 
entrepreneurial company often tackles social problems that have not been 
successfully solved by traditional government or nonprofit initiatives.     

The TLP Group works in partnership with state departments, universities, 
colleges, communities, community providers and institutional providers.   By 
combining the best of talents, the most effective use of resources, and the latest 
evidence based research, The TLP Group is dedicated to making a dramatic 
impact on service delivery and client outcomes.

**************************************
 See what's new at http://www.aol.com
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From dbaycich at literacy.kent.edu  Tue Nov 20 17:38:57 2007
From: dbaycich at literacy.kent.edu (Dianna Baycich)
Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 17:38:57 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1071] Re: TABE reading test
In-Reply-To: <475710.80712.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <903920.14027.qm@web35901.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<475710.80712.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <014e01c82bc6$267f8730$f5607b83@Hebe>

Hi,
Good points about using the TABE to assess reading. I'd like to suggest a
couple of resources to supplement the scant information we get from the
TABE. The first is the Assessment Strategies and Reading Profiles site at
http://www.nifl.gov/readingprofiles/

The second are the Quick Reading Assessments (and they really are quick) at
the Ohio Literacy Alliance site. http://www.ohioliteracyalliance.org/

The adult passages range from grade one to grade 8 reading level. The high
school passages go from grade 9 to 12 reading level.  

Hope these are helpful.

Dianna

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Bruce C
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 12:01 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1062] Re: TABE Training

Hello Assessment List:

Here's the bind we have been in forever:

The standardized tests like the TABE tell us little about what is really go
on, but they are required, easy to administer, and give us a "score."  Other
assessments--formal and informal--give lots of information about what is
really going on but they take too much time and are not considered "valid
and reliable" scores. 

I would discourage people from using the TABE to analyze students' reading
abilities. The TABE is not even a great indicator of reading level or
progress, and I think any analysis of students' skill sets based on the TABE
is really shaky--no matter what the publishers who make tons of money on the
TABE say.

It takes a lot more time to do one-on-one assessments where you ask students
to read something--silently and/or aloud--note their errors and ask them
questions about it. But that is definitely worth analyzing. 

Also,  I think the TABE is a particularly bad standardized test.  

A few comments:
--If students scores high on the TABE, they are pretty much guaranteed to be
good readers (and a good test
takers)
--If students scores low on the TABE:
they might be poor readers,
they might have been tripped up by this bad test:
maybe they needed more time to read well maybe they got nervous, maybe they
read and understood every bit of the TABE but picked the wrong answers or
maybe something else was wrong--they were tired, distracted by something in
their personal lives, hungry, or sick. 

from Bruce Carmel
Turning Point
Brooklyn NY

 
____________________________________________________________________________
________
Be a better sports nut!  Let your teams follow you with Yahoo Mobile. Try it
now.  http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9_qDKvtAbMuh1G1SQtBI7ntAcJ
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to dbaycich at literacy.kent.edu

From Miriam.Kroeger at azed.gov  Wed Nov 21 10:59:58 2007
From: Miriam.Kroeger at azed.gov (Kroeger, Miriam)
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 08:59:58 -0700
Subject: [Assessment 1072] Re: TABE Training
In-Reply-To: <475710.80712.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <903920.14027.qm@web35901.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<475710.80712.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1C563202F40F27458F337F6B4A3C291D03E24F62@prodmail1.prod.root>

OVAE requires that Adult Education programs funded through WIA Title II
use "standardized assessment procedures....The procedures must be a
standardized test or a standarized poerformance-based assessment with a
standardized scoring rubric."  (NRS guidelines, pg.22) OVAE is also in
the process of "vetting" assessments for approved use in AE programs.
With the standarized, reliability and validity requirements, programs
have "defaulted" to publishers' tests - thus the overwhelming use of
TABE or CASAS.  (Other tests that may have previously been used such as
ABLE or AMES are no longer published or have not been updated.)  

We all know that no test is perfect; what we need to know is how to make
the best use of the tests that are approved and to not let a test drive
the instruction; rather it should help to inform instruction.  Given
that, do the majority of individuals using the TABE use the resources
that are available with it?  Someone has suggested that the instructors
take the tests. They should at least review them at all the levels.
They also need to be aware of the level at which the test items are
written.  A scale score of 600 on an E level test does not indicate that
the student is at an ASE II level.  

Additionally, the Users Manual for both 7/8 and 9/10 contain item
analysis for each question for both the complete and survey.  Using
these tool appropriately the instructor can get an idea of some of the
skills that a student may be weak in.  There are even sample lesson
plans that demonstrate how a skill could be addressed in instruction.
Publishers are not the big bad bogeymen - many of the people who work
for them and who develop these materials and resources once worked in
the field.  They probably get paid more, or heaven forbid - have a
full-time job and benefits with a publisher!

Perhaps the frustration that many feel is caused by a (seeming?)
emphasis on numbers (ed gains) and not enough recognition of the
professional judgement of the teacher and student-centered learning.  

Peace and Blessings to all at this Thanksgiving time

-Miriam Kroeger
Arizona

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Bruce C
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 10:01 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1062] Re: TABE Training

Hello Assessment List:

Here's the bind we have been in forever:

The standardized tests like the TABE tell us little about what is really
go on, but they are required, easy to administer, and give us a "score."
Other assessments--formal and informal--give lots of information about
what is really going on but they take too much time and are not
considered "valid and reliable" scores. 

I would discourage people from using the TABE to analyze students'
reading abilities. The TABE is not even a great indicator of reading
level or progress, and I think any analysis of students' skill sets
based on the TABE is really shaky--no matter what the publishers who
make tons of money on the TABE say.

It takes a lot more time to do one-on-one assessments where you ask
students to read something--silently and/or aloud--note their errors and
ask them questions about it. But that is definitely worth analyzing. 

Also,  I think the TABE is a particularly bad standardized test.  

A few comments:
--If students scores high on the TABE, they are pretty much guaranteed
to be good readers (and a good test
takers)
--If students scores low on the TABE:
they might be poor readers,
they might have been tripped up by this bad test:
maybe they needed more time to read well maybe they got nervous, maybe
they read and understood every bit of the TABE but picked the wrong
answers or maybe something else was wrong--they were tired, distracted
by something in their personal lives, hungry, or sick. 

from Bruce Carmel
Turning Point
Brooklyn NY

 
________________________________________________________________________
____________
Be a better sports nut!  Let your teams follow you with Yahoo Mobile.
Try it now.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9_qDKvtAbMuh1G1SQtBI7ntAcJ
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to miriam.kroeger at azed.gov

From jgordon at fortunesociety.org  Wed Nov 21 14:41:59 2007
From: jgordon at fortunesociety.org (John Gordon)
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 14:41:59 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1073] Re: TABE Training
In-Reply-To: <1C563202F40F27458F337F6B4A3C291D03E24F62@prodmail1.prod.root>
References: <903920.14027.qm@web35901.mail.mud.yahoo.com><475710.80712.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<1C563202F40F27458F337F6B4A3C291D03E24F62@prodmail1.prod.root>
Message-ID: <25AB4DBCECBD574F8A8EE92F47848BBDD049D5@mail2.fortunesociety.internal>

I think Bruce was right on the money about the TABE. It's hard not to be
cynical about the role of the test publishers. I wonder about the role
McGraw Hill has played in getting the TABE adopted, why they keep coming
out with new versions every couple of years, etc. 

Much as I like to think that programs are not letting the tests drive
instruction, I'm doubtful. The  pressures to show testing outcomes are
so intense (high stakes testing for the programs!), I assume many
programs devote considerable time to preparing students for the TABE and
other tests. I would point out that McGraw-Hill now publishes a series
of TABE workbooks. So much for not letting the test drive instruction. I
have no idea how many programs around the country use them; I'd be
interested to know....

john gordon
new york

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Kroeger, Miriam
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 11:00 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1072] Re: TABE Training

OVAE requires that Adult Education programs funded through WIA Title II
use "standardized assessment procedures....The procedures must be a
standardized test or a standarized poerformance-based assessment with a
standardized scoring rubric."  (NRS guidelines, pg.22) OVAE is also in
the process of "vetting" assessments for approved use in AE programs.
With the standarized, reliability and validity requirements, programs
have "defaulted" to publishers' tests - thus the overwhelming use of
TABE or CASAS.  (Other tests that may have previously been used such as
ABLE or AMES are no longer published or have not been updated.)  

We all know that no test is perfect; what we need to know is how to make
the best use of the tests that are approved and to not let a test drive
the instruction; rather it should help to inform instruction.  Given
that, do the majority of individuals using the TABE use the resources
that are available with it?  Someone has suggested that the instructors
take the tests. They should at least review them at all the levels.
They also need to be aware of the level at which the test items are
written.  A scale score of 600 on an E level test does not indicate that
the student is at an ASE II level.  

Additionally, the Users Manual for both 7/8 and 9/10 contain item
analysis for each question for both the complete and survey.  Using
these tool appropriately the instructor can get an idea of some of the
skills that a student may be weak in.  There are even sample lesson
plans that demonstrate how a skill could be addressed in instruction.
Publishers are not the big bad bogeymen - many of the people who work
for them and who develop these materials and resources once worked in
the field.  They probably get paid more, or heaven forbid - have a
full-time job and benefits with a publisher!

Perhaps the frustration that many feel is caused by a (seeming?)
emphasis on numbers (ed gains) and not enough recognition of the
professional judgement of the teacher and student-centered learning.  

Peace and Blessings to all at this Thanksgiving time

-Miriam Kroeger
Arizona

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of Bruce C
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 10:01 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1062] Re: TABE Training

Hello Assessment List:

Here's the bind we have been in forever:

The standardized tests like the TABE tell us little about what is really
go on, but they are required, easy to administer, and give us a "score."
Other assessments--formal and informal--give lots of information about
what is really going on but they take too much time and are not
considered "valid and reliable" scores. 

I would discourage people from using the TABE to analyze students'
reading abilities. The TABE is not even a great indicator of reading
level or progress, and I think any analysis of students' skill sets
based on the TABE is really shaky--no matter what the publishers who
make tons of money on the TABE say.

It takes a lot more time to do one-on-one assessments where you ask
students to read something--silently and/or aloud--note their errors and
ask them questions about it. But that is definitely worth analyzing. 

Also,  I think the TABE is a particularly bad standardized test.  

A few comments:
--If students scores high on the TABE, they are pretty much guaranteed
to be good readers (and a good test
takers)
--If students scores low on the TABE:
they might be poor readers,
they might have been tripped up by this bad test:
maybe they needed more time to read well maybe they got nervous, maybe
they read and understood every bit of the TABE but picked the wrong
answers or maybe something else was wrong--they were tired, distracted
by something in their personal lives, hungry, or sick. 

from Bruce Carmel
Turning Point
Brooklyn NY

 
________________________________________________________________________
____________
Be a better sports nut!  Let your teams follow you with Yahoo Mobile.
Try it now.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9_qDKvtAbMuh1G1SQtBI7ntAcJ
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to miriam.kroeger at azed.gov
-------------------------------
National Institute for Literacy
Assessment mailing list
Assessment at nifl.gov
To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment
Email delivered to jgordon at fortunesociety.org

From VenuT at lacnyc.org  Fri Nov 23 15:22:07 2007
From: VenuT at lacnyc.org (Venu Thelakkat)
Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 15:22:07 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1074] Re: TABE Training
In-Reply-To: <25AB4DBCECBD574F8A8EE92F47848BBDD049D5@mail2.fortunesociety.internal>
References: <903920.14027.qm@web35901.mail.mud.yahoo.com><475710.80712.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com><1C563202F40F27458F337F6B4A3C291D03E24F62@prodmail1.prod.root>
	<25AB4DBCECBD574F8A8EE92F47848BBDD049D5@mail2.fortunesociety.internal>
Message-ID: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB85E6FA8@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>

I agree with Miriam that test publishers present easy targets for blame.
While I am not overly compelled to defend CTB McGraw Hill, I am not sure
about the point being made by John and Bruce.  Is it that;

- The TABE is a bad standardized test and there are others that are
better suited to our purposes?  Or is it that

- All standardized assessments are bad and should not be part of any
system for evaluating program or student performance?  Or is the
argument that

- Standardized assessments should only be part of a more comprehensive
evaluation system that includes portfolios, performance-based
assessments and teacher observations (this, I believe, is part of the
argument David made in a similar thread a few weeks ago)

 

 

Venu Thelakkat

Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis

Literacy Assistance Center

32 Broadway, 10th floor

New York, NY 10004

(212) 803-3370

venut at lacnyc.org

www.lacnyc.org

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]
On Behalf Of John Gordon
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 2:42 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1073] Re: TABE Training

 

I think Bruce was right on the money about the TABE. It's hard not to be

cynical about the role of the test publishers. I wonder about the role

McGraw Hill has played in getting the TABE adopted, why they keep coming

out with new versions every couple of years, etc. 

 

Much as I like to think that programs are not letting the tests drive

instruction, I'm doubtful. The  pressures to show testing outcomes are

so intense (high stakes testing for the programs!), I assume many

programs devote considerable time to preparing students for the TABE and

other tests. I would point out that McGraw-Hill now publishes a series

of TABE workbooks. So much for not letting the test drive instruction. I

have no idea how many programs around the country use them; I'd be

interested to know....

 

john gordon

new york

 

-----Original Message-----

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]

On Behalf Of Kroeger, Miriam

Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 11:00 AM

To: The Assessment Discussion List

Subject: [Assessment 1072] Re: TABE Training

 

OVAE requires that Adult Education programs funded through WIA Title II

use "standardized assessment procedures....The procedures must be a

standardized test or a standarized poerformance-based assessment with a

standardized scoring rubric."  (NRS guidelines, pg.22) OVAE is also in

the process of "vetting" assessments for approved use in AE programs.

With the standarized, reliability and validity requirements, programs

have "defaulted" to publishers' tests - thus the overwhelming use of

TABE or CASAS.  (Other tests that may have previously been used such as

ABLE or AMES are no longer published or have not been updated.)  

 

We all know that no test is perfect; what we need to know is how to make

the best use of the tests that are approved and to not let a test drive

the instruction; rather it should help to inform instruction.  Given

that, do the majority of individuals using the TABE use the resources

that are available with it?  Someone has suggested that the instructors

take the tests. They should at least review them at all the levels.

They also need to be aware of the level at which the test items are

written.  A scale score of 600 on an E level test does not indicate that

the student is at an ASE II level.  

 

Additionally, the Users Manual for both 7/8 and 9/10 contain item

analysis for each question for both the complete and survey.  Using

these tool appropriately the instructor can get an idea of some of the

skills that a student may be weak in.  There are even sample lesson

plans that demonstrate how a skill could be addressed in instruction.

Publishers are not the big bad bogeymen - many of the people who work

for them and who develop these materials and resources once worked in

the field.  They probably get paid more, or heaven forbid - have a

full-time job and benefits with a publisher!

 

Perhaps the frustration that many feel is caused by a (seeming?)

emphasis on numbers (ed gains) and not enough recognition of the

professional judgement of the teacher and student-centered learning.  

 

Peace and Blessings to all at this Thanksgiving time

 

-Miriam Kroeger

Arizona

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov]

On Behalf Of Bruce C

Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 10:01 AM

To: The Assessment Discussion List

Subject: [Assessment 1062] Re: TABE Training

 

Hello Assessment List:

 

Here's the bind we have been in forever:

 

The standardized tests like the TABE tell us little about what is really

go on, but they are required, easy to administer, and give us a "score."

Other assessments--formal and informal--give lots of information about

what is really going on but they take too much time and are not

considered "valid and reliable" scores. 

 

I would discourage people from using the TABE to analyze students'

reading abilities. The TABE is not even a great indicator of reading

level or progress, and I think any analysis of students' skill sets

based on the TABE is really shaky--no matter what the publishers who

make tons of money on the TABE say.

 

It takes a lot more time to do one-on-one assessments where you ask

students to read something--silently and/or aloud--note their errors and

ask them questions about it. But that is definitely worth analyzing. 

 

Also,  I think the TABE is a particularly bad standardized test.  

 

A few comments:

--If students scores high on the TABE, they are pretty much guaranteed

to be good readers (and a good test

takers)

--If students scores low on the TABE:

they might be poor readers,

they might have been tripped up by this bad test:

maybe they needed more time to read well maybe they got nervous, maybe

they read and understood every bit of the TABE but picked the wrong

answers or maybe something else was wrong--they were tired, distracted

by something in their personal lives, hungry, or sick. 

 

from Bruce Carmel

Turning Point

Brooklyn NY

 

 

 

 

________________________________________________________________________

____________

Be a better sports nut!  Let your teams follow you with Yahoo Mobile.

Try it now.

http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9_qDKvtAbMuh1G1SQtBI7ntAcJ

-------------------------------

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Assessment mailing list

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To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment

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-------------------------------

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From Mdick at lagcc.cuny.edu  Wed Nov 28 10:55:16 2007
From: Mdick at lagcc.cuny.edu (Mae Dick)
Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:55:16 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1075]   Re: TABE Training
In-Reply-To: <6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB85E6FA8@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
References: <903920.14027.qm@web35901.mail.mud.yahoo.com><475710.80712.qm@web37906.mail.mud.yahoo.com><1C563202F40F27458F337F6B4A3C291D03E24F62@prodmail1.prod.root>
	<25AB4DBCECBD574F8A8EE92F47848BBDD049D5@mail2.fortunesociety.internal>
	<6E8BC13A30982C44BCD32B38FB8F5AB85E6FA8@lac-exch.lacnyc.local>
Message-ID: <474D49140200000A001CFA18@mailgate.lagcc.cuny.edu>

I think the last point Venu made is correct; standardized tests are essential, but only as one part of an overall assessment.  
They are easy to adminiister, and afterall, we, as readers, are able to read the TABE test. Eventually, our students should be able to handle them as well. However, I don't believe that it is necessary to generate yet a new test every few years. I have been using the various versions of the McGraw Hill tests for many years now, and each version has its peculiararities. As soon as you figure one version out, there's another one on the scene. They serve a purpose, but we don't need to pay for new sets quite so often.

>>> "Venu Thelakkat" <VenuT at lacnyc.org> 11/23/2007 3:22 PM >>>
I agree with Miriam that test publishers present easy targets for blame.
While I am not overly compelled to defend CTB McGraw Hill, I am not sure
about the point being made by John and Bruce.  Is it that;

- The TABE is a bad standardized test and there are others that are
better suited to our purposes?  Or is it that

- All standardized assessments are bad and should not be part of any
system for evaluating program or student performance?  Or is the
argument that

- Standardized assessments should only be part of a more comprehensive
evaluation system that includes portfolios, performance-based
assessments and teacher observations (this, I believe, is part of the
argument David made in a similar thread a few weeks ago)

 

 

Venu Thelakkat

Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis

Literacy Assistance Center

32 Broadway, 10th floor

New York, NY 10004

(212) 803-3370

venut at lacnyc.org 

www.lacnyc.org 

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
On Behalf Of John Gordon
Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 2:42 PM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1073] Re: TABE Training

 

I think Bruce was right on the money about the TABE. It's hard not to be

cynical about the role of the test publishers. I wonder about the role

McGraw Hill has played in getting the TABE adopted, why they keep coming

out with new versions every couple of years, etc. 

 

Much as I like to think that programs are not letting the tests drive

instruction, I'm doubtful. The  pressures to show testing outcomes are

so intense (high stakes testing for the programs!), I assume many

programs devote considerable time to preparing students for the TABE and

other tests. I would point out that McGraw-Hill now publishes a series

of TABE workbooks. So much for not letting the test drive instruction. I

have no idea how many programs around the country use them; I'd be

interested to know....

 

john gordon

new york

 

-----Original Message-----

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 

On Behalf Of Kroeger, Miriam

Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 11:00 AM

To: The Assessment Discussion List

Subject: [Assessment 1072] Re: TABE Training

 

OVAE requires that Adult Education programs funded through WIA Title II

use "standardized assessment procedures....The procedures must be a

standardized test or a standarized poerformance-based assessment with a

standardized scoring rubric."  (NRS guidelines, pg.22) OVAE is also in

the process of "vetting" assessments for approved use in AE programs.

With the standarized, reliability and validity requirements, programs

have "defaulted" to publishers' tests - thus the overwhelming use of

TABE or CASAS.  (Other tests that may have previously been used such as

ABLE or AMES are no longer published or have not been updated.)  

 

We all know that no test is perfect; what we need to know is how to make

the best use of the tests that are approved and to not let a test drive

the instruction; rather it should help to inform instruction.  Given

that, do the majority of individuals using the TABE use the resources

that are available with it?  Someone has suggested that the instructors

take the tests. They should at least review them at all the levels.

They also need to be aware of the level at which the test items are

written.  A scale score of 600 on an E level test does not indicate that

the student is at an ASE II level.  

 

Additionally, the Users Manual for both 7/8 and 9/10 contain item

analysis for each question for both the complete and survey.  Using

these tool appropriately the instructor can get an idea of some of the

skills that a student may be weak in.  There are even sample lesson

plans that demonstrate how a skill could be addressed in instruction.

Publishers are not the big bad bogeymen - many of the people who work

for them and who develop these materials and resources once worked in

the field.  They probably get paid more, or heaven forbid - have a

full-time job and benefits with a publisher!

 

Perhaps the frustration that many feel is caused by a (seeming?)

emphasis on numbers (ed gains) and not enough recognition of the

professional judgement of the teacher and student-centered learning.  

 

Peace and Blessings to all at this Thanksgiving time

 

-Miriam Kroeger

Arizona

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 

On Behalf Of Bruce C

Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 10:01 AM

To: The Assessment Discussion List

Subject: [Assessment 1062] Re: TABE Training

 

Hello Assessment List:

 

Here's the bind we have been in forever:

 

The standardized tests like the TABE tell us little about what is really

go on, but they are required, easy to administer, and give us a "score."

Other assessments--formal and informal--give lots of information about

what is really going on but they take too much time and are not

considered "valid and reliable" scores. 

 

I would discourage people from using the TABE to analyze students'

reading abilities. The TABE is not even a great indicator of reading

level or progress, and I think any analysis of students' skill sets

based on the TABE is really shaky--no matter what the publishers who

make tons of money on the TABE say.

 

It takes a lot more time to do one-on-one assessments where you ask

students to read something--silently and/or aloud--note their errors and

ask them questions about it. But that is definitely worth analyzing. 

 

Also,  I think the TABE is a particularly bad standardized test.  

 

A few comments:

--If students scores high on the TABE, they are pretty much guaranteed

to be good readers (and a good test

takers)

--If students scores low on the TABE:

they might be poor readers,

they might have been tripped up by this bad test:

maybe they needed more time to read well maybe they got nervous, maybe

they read and understood every bit of the TABE but picked the wrong

answers or maybe something else was wrong--they were tired, distracted

by something in their personal lives, hungry, or sick. 

 

from Bruce Carmel

Turning Point

Brooklyn NY

 

 

 

 

________________________________________________________________________

____________

Be a better sports nut!  Let your teams follow you with Yahoo Mobile.

Try it now.

http://mobile.yahoo.com/sports;_ylt=At9_qDKvtAbMuh1G1SQtBI7ntAcJ 

-------------------------------

National Institute for Literacy

Assessment mailing list

Assessment at nifl.gov 

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

Email delivered to miriam.kroeger at azed.gov 

-------------------------------

National Institute for Literacy

Assessment mailing list

Assessment at nifl.gov 

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to

http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

Email delivered to jgordon at fortunesociety.org 

-------------------------------

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Assessment mailing list

Assessment at nifl.gov 

To unsubscribe or change your subscription settings, please go to
http://www.nifl.gov/mailman/listinfo/assessment 

Email delivered to venut at lacnyc.org 

From bcarmel at rocketmail.com  Thu Nov 29 08:19:15 2007
From: bcarmel at rocketmail.com (Bruce C)
Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 05:19:15 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Assessment 1076]  Standardized Tests
In-Reply-To: <474D49140200000A001CFA18@mailgate.lagcc.cuny.edu>
Message-ID: <531830.88478.qm@web37911.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

The problem with standardized tests is the claim they
make about reading level.  

All reading happens in a context. My reading level is
dependent on my background knowledge (including
vocabulary, print conventions, conent knowledge),
interest in the subject, purpose for reading, urgency
of the task at hand, etc. For example,  I could read a
complicated "Request for Proposal" for Adult Literacy
funding much more successfully than I could read an
RFP for community health centers. In the case of the
former, I have read similar texts before, I know the
jargon and acronyms, and I will push through it
because I need the money. Not so for the latter. This
is true even if these documents have the same
Readability level.

Standardized tests ignore the realities of real
reading.  In real life, I read maps, newspapers, my
paycheck, phone books, novels, utility bills, emails,
and text messages. My reading level changes depending
on the context of each tasks. This is why the National
Assesment of Adult Literacy asked people to perform a
range of reading tasks and did not give them a
standardized test.  They wanted to be accurate.

Standardized reading tests give me a fair indication
of how well a student will do on a standardized test.
They may tell me something about the students general
reading level, but not nearly as much, and not as
accurately, as these tests claim. 

Standardized tests act as if I can put a "sixth grade"
stamp on a student's forward and assume she/he reads
everything at the sixth grade level. That just isn't
how reading works. 

Bruce Carmel
Turning Point
Brooklyn NY

> >>> "Venu Thelakkat" <VenuT at lacnyc.org> 11/23/2007
> 3:22 PM >>>
> I agree with Miriam that test publishers present
> easy targets for blame.
> While I am not overly compelled to defend CTB McGraw
> Hill, I am not sure
> about the point being made by John and Bruce.  Is it
> that;
> 
> - The TABE is a bad standardized test and there are
> others that are
> better suited to our purposes?  Or is it that
> 
> - All standardized assessments are bad and should
> not be part of any
> system for evaluating program or student
> performance?  Or is the
> argument that
> 
> - Standardized assessments should only be part of a
> more comprehensive
> evaluation system that includes portfolios,
> performance-based
> assessments and teacher observations (this, I
> believe, is part of the
> argument David made in a similar thread a few weeks
> ago)
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Venu Thelakkat
> 
> Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis
> 
> Literacy Assistance Center
> 
> 32 Broadway, 10th floor
> 
> New York, NY 10004
> 
> (212) 803-3370
> 
> venut at lacnyc.org 
> 
> www.lacnyc.org 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> On Behalf Of John Gordon
> Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 2:42 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1073] Re: TABE Training
> 
>  
> 
> I think Bruce was right on the money about the TABE.
> It's hard not to be
> 
> cynical about the role of the test publishers. I
> wonder about the role
> 
> McGraw Hill has played in getting the TABE adopted,
> why they keep coming
> 
> out with new versions every couple of years, etc. 
> 
>  
> 
> Much as I like to think that programs are not
> letting the tests drive
> 
> instruction, I'm doubtful. The  pressures to show
> testing outcomes are
> 
> so intense (high stakes testing for the programs!),
> I assume many
> 
> programs devote considerable time to preparing
> students for the TABE and
> 
> other tests. I would point out that McGraw-Hill now
> publishes a series
> 
> of TABE workbooks. So much for not letting the test
> drive instruction. I
> 
> have no idea how many programs around the country
> use them; I'd be
> 
> interested to know....
> 
>  
> 
> john gordon
> 
> new york
> 
>  
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> 
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> 
> On Behalf Of Kroeger, Miriam
> 
> Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 11:00 AM
> 
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> 
> Subject: [Assessment 1072] Re: TABE Training
> 
>  
> 
> OVAE requires that Adult Education programs funded
> through WIA Title II
> 
> use "standardized assessment procedures....The
> procedures must be a
> 
> standardized test or a standarized
> poerformance-based assessment with a
> 
> standardized scoring rubric."  (NRS guidelines,
> pg.22) OVAE is also in
> 
> the process of "vetting" assessments for approved
> use in AE programs.
> 
> With the standarized, reliability and validity
> requirements, programs
> 
> have "defaulted" to publishers' tests - thus the
> overwhelming use of
> 
> TABE or CASAS.  (Other tests that may have
> previously been used such as
> 
> ABLE or AMES are no longer published or have not
> been updated.)  
> 
>  
> 
> We all know that no test is perfect; what we need to
> know is how to make
> 
> the best use of the tests that are approved and to
> not let a test drive
> 
> the instruction; rather it should help to inform
> instruction.  Given
> 
> that, do the majority of individuals using the TABE
> use the resources
> 
> that are available with it?  Someone has suggested
> that the instructors
> 
> take the tests. They should at least review them at
> all the levels.
> 
> They also need to be aware of the level at which the
> test items are
> 
> written.  A scale score of 600 on an E level test
> does not indicate that
> 
> the student is at an ASE II level.  
> 
>  
> 
> Additionally, the Users Manual for both 7/8 and 9/10
> contain item
> 
> analysis for each question for both the complete and
> survey.  Using
> 
> these tool appropriately the instructor can get an
> idea of some of the
> 
> skills that a student may be weak in.  There are
> even sample lesson
> 
> 
=== message truncated ===

      ____________________________________________________________________________________
Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page. 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

From dlwann at comcast.net  Thu Nov 29 14:22:15 2007
From: dlwann at comcast.net (Dan Wann)
Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 14:22:15 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1077] Re: Standardized Tests
In-Reply-To: <531830.88478.qm@web37911.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <474D49140200000A001CFA18@mailgate.lagcc.cuny.edu>
	<531830.88478.qm@web37911.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <01ef01c832bd$272086f0$0300a8c0@D28ZY081>

>From what I understand the use of grade level equivalency scores are given
because of the need to report by that standard.  I have read TABE materials
that states that GE is too broad of a term to mean much and that the scale
score is much more meaningful in understanding student performance.  I know
that CASAS scale scores are much more meaningful than the GE but the GE is
made available when funding sources require grade level equivalency
reporting.  

Both CASAS and BEST do test students' reading ability in life and work
contexts and I would disagree with some of what Bruce has written below.
Further, as a test of basic reading skills these tests are constructed so
that extensive and selective background knowledge is not necessary.  The
test items on both of these tests seem to test reading within a context that
is known by a majority of people who function in society at various levels
and are not designed to test at a post-secondary level.  If you examine the
CASAS and BEST tests you see questions based on paycheck stubs, bus
schedules, work memos, employee handbooks, medicine labels and narratives.  

In my opinion standard testing is a necessary but not sufficient tool to use
for assessing student skill level or proficiency.  While I do not use TABE
because of the orientation of the test to an academic setting, I would not
say it is a bad test.  The question is does the test do what it says it will
do.  I think that CASAS and BEST do what is mentioned below by testing adult
students' ability to read a variety of documents in a variety of settings.
The scaled scores given and the indicators of levels are not grade level
dependent and can be explained just as an SAT or CAT score can be explained
independent of Grade Level.  Educators must choose a test that correlates to
the curriculum and instruction if the test is to be of value, but I would
not say that a test is bad because it tests one thing and I teach another.  

Dan Wann 
Professional Development Consultant 
Adult ESL and Development Education Teacher

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Bruce C
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 8:19 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1076] Standardized Tests

The problem with standardized tests is the claim they
make about reading level.  

All reading happens in a context. My reading level is
dependent on my background knowledge (including
vocabulary, print conventions, conent knowledge),
interest in the subject, purpose for reading, urgency
of the task at hand, etc. For example,  I could read a
complicated "Request for Proposal" for Adult Literacy
funding much more successfully than I could read an
RFP for community health centers. In the case of the
former, I have read similar texts before, I know the
jargon and acronyms, and I will push through it
because I need the money. Not so for the latter. This
is true even if these documents have the same
Readability level.

Standardized tests ignore the realities of real
reading.  In real life, I read maps, newspapers, my
paycheck, phone books, novels, utility bills, emails,
and text messages. My reading level changes depending
on the context of each tasks. This is why the National
Assesment of Adult Literacy asked people to perform a
range of reading tasks and did not give them a
standardized test.  They wanted to be accurate.

Standardized reading tests give me a fair indication
of how well a student will do on a standardized test.
They may tell me something about the students general
reading level, but not nearly as much, and not as
accurately, as these tests claim. 

Standardized tests act as if I can put a "sixth grade"
stamp on a student's forward and assume she/he reads
everything at the sixth grade level. That just isn't
how reading works. 

Bruce Carmel
Turning Point
Brooklyn NY

> >>> "Venu Thelakkat" <VenuT at lacnyc.org> 11/23/2007
> 3:22 PM >>>
> I agree with Miriam that test publishers present
> easy targets for blame.
> While I am not overly compelled to defend CTB McGraw
> Hill, I am not sure
> about the point being made by John and Bruce.  Is it
> that;
> 
> - The TABE is a bad standardized test and there are
> others that are
> better suited to our purposes?  Or is it that
> 
> - All standardized assessments are bad and should
> not be part of any
> system for evaluating program or student
> performance?  Or is the
> argument that
> 
> - Standardized assessments should only be part of a
> more comprehensive
> evaluation system that includes portfolios,
> performance-based
> assessments and teacher observations (this, I
> believe, is part of the
> argument David made in a similar thread a few weeks
> ago)
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Venu Thelakkat
> 
> Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis
> 
> Literacy Assistance Center
> 
> 32 Broadway, 10th floor
> 
> New York, NY 10004
> 
> (212) 803-3370
> 
> venut at lacnyc.org 
> 
> www.lacnyc.org 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> On Behalf Of John Gordon
> Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 2:42 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1073] Re: TABE Training
> 
>  
> 
> I think Bruce was right on the money about the TABE.
> It's hard not to be
> 
> cynical about the role of the test publishers. I
> wonder about the role
> 
> McGraw Hill has played in getting the TABE adopted,
> why they keep coming
> 
> out with new versions every couple of years, etc. 
> 
>  
> 
> Much as I like to think that programs are not
> letting the tests drive
> 
> instruction, I'm doubtful. The  pressures to show
> testing outcomes are
> 
> so intense (high stakes testing for the programs!),
> I assume many
> 
> programs devote considerable time to preparing
> students for the TABE and
> 
> other tests. I would point out that McGraw-Hill now
> publishes a series
> 
> of TABE workbooks. So much for not letting the test
> drive instruction. I
> 
> have no idea how many programs around the country
> use them; I'd be
> 
> interested to know....
> 
>  
> 
> john gordon
> 
> new york
> 
>  
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> 
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> 
> On Behalf Of Kroeger, Miriam
> 
> Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 11:00 AM
> 
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> 
> Subject: [Assessment 1072] Re: TABE Training
> 
>  
> 
> OVAE requires that Adult Education programs funded
> through WIA Title II
> 
> use "standardized assessment procedures....The
> procedures must be a
> 
> standardized test or a standarized
> poerformance-based assessment with a
> 
> standardized scoring rubric."  (NRS guidelines,
> pg.22) OVAE is also in
> 
> the process of "vetting" assessments for approved
> use in AE programs.
> 
> With the standarized, reliability and validity
> requirements, programs
> 
> have "defaulted" to publishers' tests - thus the
> overwhelming use of
> 
> TABE or CASAS.  (Other tests that may have
> previously been used such as
> 
> ABLE or AMES are no longer published or have not
> been updated.)  
> 
>  
> 
> We all know that no test is perfect; what we need to
> know is how to make
> 
> the best use of the tests that are approved and to
> not let a test drive
> 
> the instruction; rather it should help to inform
> instruction.  Given
> 
> that, do the majority of individuals using the TABE
> use the resources
> 
> that are available with it?  Someone has suggested
> that the instructors
> 
> take the tests. They should at least review them at
> all the levels.
> 
> They also need to be aware of the level at which the
> test items are
> 
> written.  A scale score of 600 on an E level test
> does not indicate that
> 
> the student is at an ASE II level.  
> 
>  
> 
> Additionally, the Users Manual for both 7/8 and 9/10
> contain item
> 
> analysis for each question for both the complete and
> survey.  Using
> 
> these tool appropriately the instructor can get an
> idea of some of the
> 
> skills that a student may be weak in.  There are
> even sample lesson
> 
> 
=== message truncated ===

 
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From bcarmel at rocketmail.com  Mon Dec  3 12:40:36 2007
From: bcarmel at rocketmail.com (Bruce C)
Date: Mon, 3 Dec 2007 09:40:36 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Assessment 1078] Re: Standardized Tests
In-Reply-To: <01ef01c832bd$272086f0$0300a8c0@D28ZY081>
Message-ID: <266245.4674.qm@web37901.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Re TABE and CASAS:
   
  Yes it is true that some standardized tests pay lip service to "real life contexts." In NY we use the TABE, so that is the test with which I am most familiar. There is a big, big difference between looking at the basic line drawings that represent real-life materials and looking at real paychecks, newspapers, bus schedules, etc. 
   
  When highly literate people look at the line drawing that is supposed to be an excerpt from a book's index, we know that this is a representation of a column on a page at the back of a book. People with limited literacy may not be able to do this.  They may see a box with some words in it. They may not know what it is. Therefore, cannot answer the questions--not because they cannot read but because they got tripped up by the complicated task that the test-writers forgot about. If the students would have been asked the same questions about a real index in a real book, some would do better. 
   
  Yes, it tests literacy skills to ask someone to take a standardized test. It tests their ability to take a specific standardized test. This says something about their abililty to read. It does not tell us how well they can perform the real-life literacy tasks that matter most to students. 
   
  Bruce Carmel

Dan Wann <dlwann at comcast.net> wrote:
  >From what I understand the use of grade level equivalency scores are given
because of the need to report by that standard. I have read TABE materials
that states that GE is too broad of a term to mean much and that the scale
score is much more meaningful in understanding student performance. I know
that CASAS scale scores are much more meaningful than the GE but the GE is
made available when funding sources require grade level equivalency
reporting. 

Both CASAS and BEST do test students' reading ability in life and work
contexts and I would disagree with some of what Bruce has written below.
Further, as a test of basic reading skills these tests are constructed so
that extensive and selective background knowledge is not necessary. The
test items on both of these tests seem to test reading within a context that
is known by a majority of people who function in society at various levels
and are not designed to test at a post-secondary level. If you examine the
CASAS and BEST tests you see questions based on paycheck stubs, bus
schedules, work memos, employee handbooks, medicine labels and narratives. 

In my opinion standard testing is a necessary but not sufficient tool to use
for assessing student skill level or proficiency. While I do not use TABE
because of the orientation of the test to an academic setting, I would not
say it is a bad test. The question is does the test do what it says it will
do. I think that CASAS and BEST do what is mentioned below by testing adult
students' ability to read a variety of documents in a variety of settings.
The scaled scores given and the indicators of levels are not grade level
dependent and can be explained just as an SAT or CAT score can be explained
independent of Grade Level. Educators must choose a test that correlates to
the curriculum and instruction if the test is to be of value, but I would
not say that a test is bad because it tests one thing and I teach another. 

Dan Wann 
Professional Development Consultant 
Adult ESL and Development Education Teacher

-----Original Message-----
From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] On
Behalf Of Bruce C
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 8:19 AM
To: The Assessment Discussion List
Subject: [Assessment 1076] Standardized Tests

The problem with standardized tests is the claim they
make about reading level. 

All reading happens in a context. My reading level is
dependent on my background knowledge (including
vocabulary, print conventions, conent knowledge),
interest in the subject, purpose for reading, urgency
of the task at hand, etc. For example, I could read a
complicated "Request for Proposal" for Adult Literacy
funding much more successfully than I could read an
RFP for community health centers. In the case of the
former, I have read similar texts before, I know the
jargon and acronyms, and I will push through it
because I need the money. Not so for the latter. This
is true even if these documents have the same
Readability level.

Standardized tests ignore the realities of real
reading. In real life, I read maps, newspapers, my
paycheck, phone books, novels, utility bills, emails,
and text messages. My reading level changes depending
on the context of each tasks. This is why the National
Assesment of Adult Literacy asked people to perform a
range of reading tasks and did not give them a
standardized test. They wanted to be accurate.

Standardized reading tests give me a fair indication
of how well a student will do on a standardized test.
They may tell me something about the students general
reading level, but not nearly as much, and not as
accurately, as these tests claim. 

Standardized tests act as if I can put a "sixth grade"
stamp on a student's forward and assume she/he reads
everything at the sixth grade level. That just isn't
how reading works. 

Bruce Carmel
Turning Point
Brooklyn NY

> >>> "Venu Thelakkat" 11/23/2007
> 3:22 PM >>>
> I agree with Miriam that test publishers present
> easy targets for blame.
> While I am not overly compelled to defend CTB McGraw
> Hill, I am not sure
> about the point being made by John and Bruce. Is it
> that;
> 
> - The TABE is a bad standardized test and there are
> others that are
> better suited to our purposes? Or is it that
> 
> - All standardized assessments are bad and should
> not be part of any
> system for evaluating program or student
> performance? Or is the
> argument that
> 
> - Standardized assessments should only be part of a
> more comprehensive
> evaluation system that includes portfolios,
> performance-based
> assessments and teacher observations (this, I
> believe, is part of the
> argument David made in a similar thread a few weeks
> ago)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Venu Thelakkat
> 
> Director of ASISTS/Data Analysis
> 
> Literacy Assistance Center
> 
> 32 Broadway, 10th floor
> 
> New York, NY 10004
> 
> (212) 803-3370
> 
> venut at lacnyc.org 
> 
> www.lacnyc.org 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> On Behalf Of John Gordon
> Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 2:42 PM
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> Subject: [Assessment 1073] Re: TABE Training
> 
> 
> 
> I think Bruce was right on the money about the TABE.
> It's hard not to be
> 
> cynical about the role of the test publishers. I
> wonder about the role
> 
> McGraw Hill has played in getting the TABE adopted,
> why they keep coming
> 
> out with new versions every couple of years, etc. 
> 
> 
> 
> Much as I like to think that programs are not
> letting the tests drive
> 
> instruction, I'm doubtful. The pressures to show
> testing outcomes are
> 
> so intense (high stakes testing for the programs!),
> I assume many
> 
> programs devote considerable time to preparing
> students for the TABE and
> 
> other tests. I would point out that McGraw-Hill now
> publishes a series
> 
> of TABE workbooks. So much for not letting the test
> drive instruction. I
> 
> have no idea how many programs around the country
> use them; I'd be
> 
> interested to know....
> 
> 
> 
> john gordon
> 
> new york
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> 
> From: assessment-bounces at nifl.gov
> [mailto:assessment-bounces at nifl.gov] 
> 
> On Behalf Of Kroeger, Miriam
> 
> Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 11:00 AM
> 
> To: The Assessment Discussion List
> 
> Subject: [Assessment 1072] Re: TABE Training
> 
> 
> 
> OVAE requires that Adult Education programs funded
> through WIA Title II
> 
> use "standardized assessment procedures....The
> procedures must be a
> 
> standardized test or a standarized
> poerformance-based assessment with a
> 
> standardized scoring rubric." (NRS guidelines,
> pg.22) OVAE is also in
> 
> the process of "vetting" assessments for approved
> use in AE programs.
> 
> With the standarized, reliability and validity
> requirements, programs
> 
> have "defaulted" to publishers' tests - thus the
> overwhelming use of
> 
> TABE or CASAS. (Other tests that may have
> previously been used such as
> 
> ABLE or AMES are no longer published or have not
> been updated.) 
> 
> 
> 
> We all know that no test is perfect; what we need to
> know is how to make
> 
> the best use of the tests that are approved and to
> not let a test drive
> 
> the instruction; rather it should help to inform
> instruction. Given
> 
> that, do the majority of individuals using the TABE
> use the resources
> 
> that are available with it? Someone has suggested
> that the instructors
> 
> take the tests. They should at least review them at
> all the levels.
> 
> They also need to be aware of the level at which the
> test items are
> 
> written. A scale score of 600 on an E level test
> does not indicate that
> 
> the student is at an ASE II level. 
> 
> 
> 
> Additionally, the Users Manual for both 7/8 and 9/10
> contain item
> 
> analysis for each question for both the complete and
> survey. Using
> 
> these tool appropriately the instructor can get an
> idea of some of the
> 
> skills that a student may be weak in. There are
> even sample lesson
> 
> 
=== message truncated ===

____________________________________________________________________________
________
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http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
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-------------------------------
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From marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com  Thu Dec  6 09:19:38 2007
From: marie.cora at hotspurpartners.com (Marie Cora)
Date: Thu, 6 Dec 2007 09:19:38 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1079]  New FOB on LD
Message-ID: <019801c83813$09be4e20$0202a8c0@LITNOW>

Colleagues,

Some of you may be interested in the following, from Focus on Basics
Editor, Barb Garner.

Marie Cora
Assessment Discussion List Moderator

**********************

Learning disabilities is the topic of a new issue of "Focus on Basics",
now available at www.ncsall.net (click on "Focus on Basics" near the top
of the right column on the homepage).

Articles range from neurology and dyslexia to legal issues related to
serving students with learning disabilities, to best practices shared by
skilled teachers, to three states' approaches to serving students with
learning disabilities, to addressing the needs of ESOL learners, to
technology, to transitions to college, to changing practice at the
program and classroom level: there's something for everyone.  

Read on!
Barb Garner, Editor

From tsticht at znet.com  Mon Dec 10 12:18:53 2007
From: tsticht at znet.com (tsticht at znet.com)
Date: Mon, 10 Dec 2007 09:18:53 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 1080]  New Year's Conga Line for Literacy
Message-ID: <1197307133.475d74fdb4a51@webmail.znet.net>

December 10, 2007

A New Year's Conga Line for Adult Literacy Education

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Many readers may recall the "conga line" dance that has been in and out of
widespread popularity several times since the 1930s, and often shows up on
New Year's Eve.  It is probably less well known that there is a
relationship of the conga to adult literacy education.

One, Two, Three, la Conga! 
.One, Two, Three, la Conga!

During World War II many entertainers used their special talents and fame to
support the war effort through the selling of war bonds or in encouraging
men to enlist in the military services. One such entertainer was the great
Cuban musician and band leader, Xavier Cugat. According to one report,
Cugat recorded a song in 1941 about the need for Americans to support
President Franklin D. Roosevelt in the war effort. Entitled, "Viva
Roosevelt!" Cugat, the primary popularizer of the conga line dance, wrote:

"Viva Roosevelt! Viva Roosevelt!
Oh what a se?or!
Ladies and Gents, get in the conga line of defense
Come on and follow this leader, give him a vote of confidence."

One, Two, Three, la Conga!  One, Two, Three, la Conga!

One of those who got "in the conga line of defense" was another Cuban
musician, Desi Arnaz, who was to go on and become internationally famous in
movies and as the real life and TV husband, Ricky Ricardo,  of Lucile Ball
in the wildly successful TV series, I Love Lucy. While living in New York,
Arnaz was drafted in May of 1943. But he suffered a torn knee cartilage, so
he was assigned as a "limited service" soldier to a special camp where
illiterate enlisted men were sent upon entry into the Army. In this camp, 
Desi Arnaz joined with thousands of other teachers in the camps for
illiterates and worked as an adult educator teaching illiterate soldiers
how to read and write. As a literacy teacher, he was part of a long "conga
line of literacy educators" who worked to make soldiers literate in World
War II.

One, Two, Three, la Conga!  One, Two, Three, la Conga!

Right across from New York, in New Jersey, another soldier, Private Arthur
Neuman joined in the conga line of adult literacy teachers when he was also
assigned to teach illiterate soldiers and non-English speaking soldiers to
read and write in the Army's Special Training Unit in Atlantic City. In a
1998 MA thesis by Marston Mischlich, he tells about the work of Private
Neumann and said, "Not only did this educational training add value to the
soldiers for their units, it also built their self-esteem." He gives an
example of how important the Special Training Unit?s efforts were in a
short letter one of the soldier student's mother which showed how important
the schooling was to families of the soldiers:

"Dear Son George:
Mother was so proud to get your letter, to think you could write a letter
yourself. I will always keep it as a remembrance. God bless the man that
taught you. It means so much to me to hear directly from you.""

One, Two, Three, la Conga!  One, Two, Three, la Conga!

In Nebraska, the middle of the nation at the time, Otis Mattox, who had been
a high school teacher, got into the conga line of Army literacy teachers
during World War II. In a note on the internet he wrote about his work as
an adult literacy teacher and said, "What had happened in early 1942, with
all this rush to get men in a hurry and into training, along about June or
July 1942, they realized all of a sudden, that they [the army] had about a
quarter of a million people that they considered functionally illiterate.
They couldn't read a Military order or they couldn't read at all, or they
couldn't write. It looked like it would be a tremendous loss to throw a
quarter of a million people out. . . They needed some instructors or
teachers. So I was sent down along with some other people. We were trying
to lift them up to about the third, fourth, or fifth grade level
educationally, so that they could function with some simple math, [so that]
they could understand orders if they were written fairly simply." Later,
when it was discovered that Maddox and some others were not limited service
soldiers, they were reassigned to the infantry and sent off to the European
theatre.

One, Two, Three, la Conga!  One, Two, Three, la Conga!

Though statistics are difficult to come by, I estimate from reports that by
April 1944 the "conga line of defense" made-up of adult literacy
instructors included some 5, 291 personnel. Of these, around 641 were
officers, 4,557 were enlisted men, and there were some 87 civilians. More
than 1200 of these teachers in the conga line of adult literacy teachers
were African-Americans. The efforts of all these teachers helped raise the
literacy skills of over a quarter million soldiers and contributed to
victory for freedom and democracy during World War II.

Today, the conga line of literacy teachers includes hundreds of thousands of
men and women working around the world to light the lamp of literacy for
tens of millions of adult learners. The work goes on, and slowly but surely
the lamp of literacy is being illuminated in all the nations of the world.
And the beat of the conga drum goes on

This New Year's Eve, put on your hat, toot your horn, form a line, put your
hands on the hips of the person in front of you and do la conga for
literacy!

One, Two, Three for Literacy! One, Two, Three, for Literacy!

Happy New Year 2008 to All!!

[G'night, Ricky. 
G'night, Lucy. ]

Thomas G. Sticht.
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net

From MMaralit at NIFL.gov  Tue Dec 11 10:14:38 2007
From: MMaralit at NIFL.gov (Maralit, Mary Jo)
Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 10:14:38 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1081]  January 11 Webcast: Reading Assessment Part 2
Message-ID: <4062487BDB6029428A763CAEF4E1FE5B180C5088@wdcrobe2m03.ed.gov>

** SAVE THE DATE: Reading Assessment Webcast, Part 2 **

>From Assessment to Practice: Research-Based Approaches to Teaching Reading
to Adults
Part 2: Specific Instructional Strategies for Fluency and Vocabulary

WHEN: Friday, January 11, 2008 

TIME: 1:30 PM - 2:45 PM Eastern Time 
	12:30 PM - 1:45 PM Central Time 
	11:30 AM - 12:45 PM Mountain Time 
	10:30 AM - 11:45 AM Pacific Time 

Please join us on Friday, January 11, 2008 for Part 2 of "From Assessment to
Practice: Research-Based Approaches to Teaching Reading to Adults" webcast.
This follow-up webcast will focus on specific instructional strategies for
two other components of reading, fluency and vocabulary. The presenters will
show how all four components provide a natural framework for assessing adult
students' reading ability, and how assessment results can lead seamlessly to
a program of instruction to improve students' reading.

For more information, please go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/assesspractice2/webcast0111.html
(Registration will be available by January 3, 2008.)

This seventy-minute webcast is a part two for the webcast presented on
September 28, 2007: From Assessment to Practice-Research-Based Approaches to
Teaching Reading  to Adults
<http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/assesspractice/webcast0928.html>. The
main purpose of the first webcast was to present a compelling rationale for
the use of research-based principles for adult reading instruction. The
presenters used two components of reading, word analysis and comprehension,
as examples to illustrate research-based practices, focusing on specific
instructional strategies derived from the research. 

For more information, please contact info at nifl.gov or call 202-233-2025 or
visit us online at: http://www.nifl.gov/.

Thanks,
Jo Maralit
mmaralit at nifl.gov
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From gspangenberg at caalusa.org  Fri Dec 14 07:16:57 2007
From: gspangenberg at caalusa.org (Gail Spangenberg)
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 07:16:57 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1082]  CAAL Releases New Commission Papers
Message-ID: <F6B549E0-AB29-4DC0-AB6D-DC8CF12DB556@caalusa.org>

NEWS RELEASE (December 14, NYC) -- Two new papers prepared for the  
National Commission on Adult Literacy were released today by the  
Council for Advancement of Adult Literacy:

THE FISCAL CONSEQUENCES OF ADULT EDUCATIONAL ATTAINMENT (66 pages)  
was prepared for the Commission?s December 4th meeting by a team of  
researchers from the Center for Labor Management Studies of  
Northeastern University, under the leadership of Commissioner Andrew  
Sum. The report studies the earnings of adults according to their  
level of education achievement in terms of the impact those earnings  
have on the fiscal affairs of the states and the lives of  
individuals. Appendix E of the report gives estimates of annual net  
fiscal contributions of adults by education attainment level for the  
13 largest states. The report findings have major implications for  
the purposes and conduct of the nation?s adult education and literacy  
enterprise at all levels of service. The report should also be of  
high interest to state and federal polilcymakers and planners, as  
well as the business community.

CHALLENGES IN ASSESSING FOR POSTSECONDARY READINESS (26 pages) was  
also prepared for the Commission's December 4th meeting. This Policy  
Brief was written by Daryl F. Mellard and Gretchen Anderson of the  
Division of Adult Studies, Center for Research on Learning,  
University of Kansas. It examines the major assessments in use today  
to measure adult learning gains and determine student placements ?  
e.g., BEST, CASAS, TABE, COMPASS, ASSET, and ACCUPLACER in terms of  
their uses and how they well they align with postsecondary education  
entry requirements. Special attention is given to the GED. The  
authors identify several problems and challenges as well as  
recommendations to resolve them.

  The two papers are available in PDF from the Publication page of  
the websites of the Commission and of CAAL:  
www.nationalcommissiononadultliteracy.org or www.caalusa.org. Both  
publications are also available in bound form from CAAL (contact  
bheitner at caalusa.org for ordering instructions

The work of the National Commission on Adult Literacy is funded by  
the Dollar General Corporation, The Mc-Graw-HIll Companies, Harold W.  
McGraw, Jr., the Charles Stewart Mott Foundation, the Ford  
Foundation, and individual donors.

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From mcnutt at utk.edu  Fri Dec 14 13:23:41 2007
From: mcnutt at utk.edu (McNutt Jr, William R)
Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2007 13:23:41 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1083]  Position Announcement
Message-ID: <0913EC48F2B05C4FBE4878BAFCABBFEC015BCCA1@KFSVS2.utk.tennessee.edu>

The Center for Literacy Studies, located within the College of
Education, Health and Human Sciences at the University of Tennessee -
Knoxville, is seeking an onsite Director to begin Spring, 2008.  The
mission of the Center for Literacy Studies is to support and advance
literacy education across the lifespan. The Center conducts research,
professional development, program evaluation and other work within
family, community, and workplace literacy contexts. The Director
oversees the work of the Center, raises funds through grants and
contracts, writes grant proposals and develops budgets, approves
expenditures of funds, and negotiates subcontracts. The Director also
hires and discharges personnel, acts as principal investigator for
grants, provides direct project oversight for some grants, and oversees
a staff of thirty to assure project work is conducted in accordance with
contractual agreements with outside funders

A full copy of the position announcement and initial contact
instructions can be found at http://www.cls.utk.edu/director.htm .

Thank you,
Bill McNutt
Technology Coordinator, 
UT Center for Literacy Studies

From MMaralit at NIFL.gov  Mon Dec 17 09:59:06 2007
From: MMaralit at NIFL.gov (Maralit, Mary Jo)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 09:59:06 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1084]  January 11 Webcast: Register Now
References: <0122B345-3693-4B80-99C2-AE93BDC64E31@comcast.net>
	<4062487BDB6029428A763CAEF4E1FE5B15382EB7@wdcrobe2m03.ed.gov>
Message-ID: <4062487BDB6029428A763CAEF4E1FE5B180C50F1@wdcrobe2m03.ed.gov>

** REGISTRATION OPEN FOR Reading Assessment Webcast, Part 2 **

>From Assessment to Practice: Research-Based Approaches to Teaching Reading
to Adults
     Part 2: Specific Instructional Strategies for Fluency and Vocabulary

WHEN: Friday, January 11, 2008 

TIME:	       1:30 PM -  2:45 PM Eastern Time 
	 	12:30 PM -  1:45 PM Central Time 
	 	11:30 AM - 12:45 PM Mountain Time 
	 	10:30 AM - 11:45 AM Pacific Time 

Please join us for Part 2 of "From Assessment to Practice: Research-Based
Approaches to Teaching Reading to Adults" webcast. This follow-up webcast
will focus on specific instructional strategies for two other components of
reading, fluency and vocabulary. The presenters will show how all four
components provide a natural framework for assessing adult students' reading
ability, and how assessment results can lead seamlessly to a program of
instruction to improve students' reading.

REGISTRATION NOW OPEN
To register and for more information, please go to:
http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/assesspractice2/webcast0111.html
Once you have registered, you will receive a confirmation email and a
reminder email before the event.

This seventy-minute webcast is a part two for the webcast presented on
September 28, 2007: From Assessment to Practice-Research-Based Approaches to
Teaching Reading  to Adults
<http://www.nifl.gov/nifl/webcasts/assesspractice/webcast0928.html>. The
main purpose of the first webcast was to present a compelling rationale for
the use of research-based principles for adult reading instruction. The
presenters used two components of reading, word analysis and comprehension,
as examples to illustrate research-based practices, focusing on specific
instructional strategies derived from the research. 

For more information, please contact info at nifl.gov or call 202-233-2025 or
visit us online at: http://www.nifl.gov/.

Thanks,
Jo Maralit
mmaralit at nifl.gov

From aprilrvalois at yahoo.com  Mon Dec 17 12:40:35 2007
From: aprilrvalois at yahoo.com (April Valois)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 09:40:35 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Assessment 1085]  Assessment of ESL individuals
Message-ID: <207267.94006.qm@web34808.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hello All-- I am a second year graduate student in a
school psychology (CAGS) program in Rhode Island. I am
currently taking a cognitive assessment course, and
was wondering if I could get some feedback regarding
precautions in assessing cognitive ability of ESL
individuals. Also, if anyone could suggest specific
assessment tools that address this issue it would be
greatly appreciated. 

Thank You,

April Valois
Rhode Island College
Second Year Graduate Student in Counseling/School
Psychology
aprilrvalois at yahoo.com

      ____________________________________________________________________________________
Looking for last minute shopping deals?  
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From kbeall at onlyinternet.net  Mon Dec 17 15:09:16 2007
From: kbeall at onlyinternet.net (Kaye Beall)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 15:09:16 -0500
Subject: [Assessment 1086] New issue of Focus on Basics published by World
	Education
Message-ID: <002301c840e8$b3737de0$030ba8c0@D14J7YD1>

The new issue of "Focus on Basics" is now available at
<http://www.worlded.org> www.worlded.org.  Published by World Education, the
theme is Learning Disabilities.

Articles include:
- An update on the neurobiology of dyslexia
- A look at legal issues related to LD and what they mean for programs
- The evolution of an ABE teacher and her practice, a program and its
practices, and states and their policies, all as they relate to learning
disabilities
- ESOL and LD, theory and practice
- Assistive technology
- Transitioning students with learning disabilities to college

Soon you'll be able to discuss the articles with the authors and your
colleagues on this list. Watch for notices soon. 

Regards,
Barb Garner
Editor

 

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From tsticht at znet.com  Mon Dec 17 16:24:29 2007
From: tsticht at znet.com (tsticht at znet.com)
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2007 13:24:29 -0800
Subject: [Assessment 1087]  Puzzles From Adult Literacy Research
Message-ID: <1197926669.4766e90dc4e25@webmail.znet.net>

December 17, 2007

Some Puzzling Findings From and For Adult Literacy Research

Tom Sticht
International Consultant in Adult Education

Over the years I have found research studies of adult literacy that seem to
raise more questions about adult literacy than they answer. Here are some
findings from studies of adult literacy from national surveys using
literacy tests that I have found puzzling.

Workforce Literacy

A number of analyses of standardized and normed literacy test scores has
taken place since World War I when the first mass mental testing of adults
took place up to the present with both national and international
assessments of adult literacy. Across all this time and testing it has
repeatedly been found that literacy level is positively related to
occupational status and higher income. There are, however, some interesting
deviations from these generalities and some data that suggest complications
in interpreting these types of studies.  Just how does measured literacy
ability affect adult workers in their daily lives at work?

Literacy and Occupation. In what occupations do the least literate adults
work? It turns out that 53 percent of adults who score at the lowest level
of literacy, Below Basic, on the Prose test of the 2003 National Assessment
of Adult Literacy (NAAL) occupy "white collar" occupations. This is perhaps
contrary to what might be the stereotype of low literate adults working in
farming, construction, manufacturing, maintenance and other jobs frequently
thought of as "blue collar" jobs. Indeed, on the NAAL survey, the percentage
of Below Basic adults working in Management, Business, and Financial
occupations was the same (3 percent) as those working in Farming, Fishing,
and Forestry. There were four times the percentage of Below Basic adults
working in Office and Administrative Support occupations (8 percent), which
might be considered as "literacy oriented" jobs,  as in Installation,
Maintenance, and Repair occupations (2 percent) in 2003.

The greatest percentage of Below Basic adults worked in Service occupations
(30 percent), as did 16 percent of adults with Intermediate and 10 percent
with Proficient levels of Prose literacy. Of course, the category of
"Service" occupations is quite broad and could include some very low
literacy demanding jobs  as well as some very high literacy demanding jobs.
Whatever the case, almost a third of the Below Basic adults have found jobs
within this occupational category which is generally thought of as one of
the fastest growing categories of work.

Literacy and Income. As a general trend, weekly earnings rise as one's
literacy skills increase. However, a high literacy level does not guarantee
higher income. In 2003 some14 percent of adults with Proficient literacy on
the Prose scale earned less than $500 a week, or about $26,000 per year. On
the other hand, low literacy does not necessarily lead to a low income. Over
35 percent of adults scoring Below Basic on the Prose scale of the NAAL
earned over $500 a week, and almost one in five earned $650 or more per
week ($33,800 per year).

Literacy and Job Opportunities. Apparently, even though adults may score
poorly on literacy tests like the NAAL, most do not think of their reading
skills as limiting their job opportunities very much. For adults scoring at
the lowest level of literacy, Below Basic, on the NAAL Prose scale, 40
percent said they thought their reading skills limited their job
opportunities "not at all,"  36 percent thought their reading skills might
limit their job opportunities "some or a little," and only 25 percent
thought their reading skills limited them "a lot."

Aside from research in the military, I have found no research that looks at
how well  workers having different literacy abilities actually perform
critical job tasks in various jobs within different occupational groups.

Family Literacy: Race, Ethnicity, Mothers,
and the Intergenerational Transfer of Literacy

Here are some disturbing data that I have observed over a 25 year period.
First, in 1980 the Department of Defense re-normed the ten tests comprising
the Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery (ASVAB) which all applicants
for military service have to take. The data for young adults 18 to 27 years
old showed the performance on the Armed forces Qualification Test (AFQT), a
subset of the ASVAB tests, as a function of the person's mother's education
level.

The data broken out by race or ethnic group showed that as the mother's
education level increased from 0-8 years to 9-11 years, high school
graduate, some college, and college graduate and beyond, the young adults'
AFQT scores increased for Whites, Blacks, and Hispanics. However, at all
levels of the mother's education, Whites scored better than Hispanics who
scored better than Blacks.

Further, the adult children of Black mothers with college graduation or
beyond education scored on the AFQT like the Hispanic young adults whose
mother's had between high school and some college education, and White
young adults whose mother's had between 9-11 and high school graduation
education. The young Hispanic adults whose mother's had college graduation
or plus education scored like the young White adults whose mother's had a
high school education.

Five years later, in 1985, the Young Adult Literacy Survey of 21 to 25 year
olds showed similar trends. As the young adults' mother's education
increased from less than high school, to high school graduate, to beyond
high school education, test scores on the literacy survey increased for
Whites, Hispanics and Blacks. However, at all levels of education Whites
scored higher than Hispanics, who scored higher than Blacks. Blacks whose
mothers had more than high school education scored just a little above
Hispanics whose mothers had less than high school education and well below
Whites whose mothers had less than high school education. Hispanics whose
mothers had more than high school education scored like Whites whose
mothers had a high school education.

I have not found more recent data showing the intergenerational transfer of
literacy from mothers to their adult children as a function of race or
ethnicity. But it is interesting to me that on both the ASVAB and YALS
(which was the predecessor to the National Assessment of Adult
Literacy-NAAL) as mother's education increased, there was an increase
across generations that raised the literacy scores of the mother's adult
children. Why these intergenerational transfer effects of increased
mother's education occur is not clear to me. Why should the
intergenerational transfer of literacy from mothers who have completed a
four year college degree exceed that of mothers who have only a high school
education, while the latter transfer more than mothers with less than a high
school education? Why should the differences between races and ethnic groups
be maintained in the intergenerational transfer effect? I have found little
research that directly examines these relationships among race, ethnicity,
mother's education and the intergenerational transfer of literacy.

Investments in adult literacy education frequently point to the effects of
such investments on children's and workforce development. There is,
however, a dearth of research that provides detailed understandings of what
effects these investments in adult literacy education actually have on both
children's literacy development and on the job opportunities and job
productivity of adults in the workforce.

Presently, there is no national center for research on adult literacy
education that could pursue a concerted body of research to provide an
understanding of these critical relationships of adult literacy and the
literacy development of our nation's children and workforce. This seems a
serious omission in the research program of the federal government's
Institute for Education Sciences in the Department of Education.

Thomas G. Sticht.
International Consultant in Adult Education
2062 Valley View Blvd.
El Cajon, CA 92019-2059
Tel/fax: (619) 444-9133
Email: tsticht at aznet.net