**Partnerships Without Borders**

**A program in conjunction with HACU**

**BLM National Training Center Telecast November 19, 1997**

This transcript is from the closed-captioning file created during the
telecast

and may contain errors in transcription and omissions of text.

Announcer: Live from the Studios in Phoenix, Arizona, Partnerships
Without Borders. An Interactive Teleconference in Conjunction with the
Second International Conference on Natural Resources and Cultural
Heritage. And Now, with You, the Host of Your Program, Raul Cardenas.

Cardenas: Good Morning to Each One of You and Welcome to Our Program on
Eco‑tourism. This Program Consists of Different Segments with
Individuals From Different Countries Representing Aspects Regarding Our
Topic. During the next Two Hours, We Are Going to Be Broadcasting via
Satellite to Different Countries Which Have Been Informed on How To
Receive this Program. The International Congress That Is Currently under
Way at Arizona State University in Phoenix Is under the Direction of The
Hispanic Association of Colleges and Universities That Is Headquartered
in San Antonio, Texas. The next Segment We Will Have with Us Dr. Antonio
Flores, the President of the Hispanic Association of Colleges and
Universities from San Antonio, Texas. Welcome, Antonio.

Thank You Very Much.

Cardenas: We Also Have Dr. Ricardo Anaya from New Mexico Highlands
University in the City of Las Vegas. Thank You for Joining Us, Ricardo.
Good Morning.

Anaya: Good Morning, Raul. I Want to Thank You for Your Invitation. I
Want to Say ‑‑ to Give My Thanks to Antonio Flores and All the Members
for Inviting Me to this Conference.

Cardenas: We Also Have Two Student Ambassadors. Miss Claudia Salas.

Salas: Thank You Very Much. It Is a Pleasure to Be Here.

Cardenas: Hector from New Mexico University.

Balderas: Thank You Very Much.

Cardenas: Before Beginning Our Discussion, I Would like to Mention to
Our Viewers That During this Program, You Will Be Able to Communicate
with Us by Telephone, by Using the Telephone Number That We Have
Previously Given to the Sites That Are Participating with Us. You Will
Be Able to Call Us Whenever You Want. We Will Answer All the Calls as
Long as Time Allows. You Will Also Be Able to Ask Us Questions or Send
Us Any Comments via Fax. Our Fax Number in the United States Is
602‑906‑5701 and 5702. To Begin Today, Antonio Flores Will Give Us Some
Information on The Background of HACU and the Second Annual Conference
on Natural Resources and Cultural Heritage Which Is Currently under Way
this Week in Phoenix, Arizona. Antonio?

Flores: Thank You Very Much, Raul. It\'s a Great Pleasure for Us to Be
Sponsoring Once Again this Important International Conference. HACU, as
We All Know, Was Founded in 1986 by 18 Universities in The Southwest of
the United States. And since Then, Ten Years Afterwards, Our Association
Has Grown And Represent Today More than 200 Universities. And No Longer
Just in the United States and Puerto Rico but They Also Represent Them
in Latin America. And of Course, this Is a Great Honor and a Great
Pleasure for HACU to Sponsor this International Convention for the
Second Time. The First Time it Was Done Last Year in the City of Las
Cruces, New Mexico at the Campus of New Mexico State University with a
Tremendous Success. We Have Tremendous Participation Not Only from
Students but Hispanics and Other Groups Around the Country. And it Was a
Great Success Because the Focus of this Conference Is Regarding Aspects
That Have Anything to Do with the Conservation of Natural Resources with
the Improvement of the Environment And, of Course, with Eco‑tourism.
This Year, Once Again, for the Second Time, the Conference Will Deal
with Aspects of Utmost Importance Regarding this Topic with Associations
or Collaboration Crossing Borders. And We Have among Us Many
Representatives from Various Countries In the American Continent That
Represent Not Only Member Institutions of HACU but Also Other
Institutions That Might Join Us. We Are Also Happy to Have Students
among Us Because, of Course, Those Future Generations Are the Ones Who
Will Carry the Leadership and the Direction in the Improvement of the
Environment and the Conservation of Natural Resources and in Sustainable
Development of Eco‑tourism. We Want to Emphasize That HACU Is Committed
to Improve and to Increase the Exchange Programs Between the United
States, Between Our Institutions in the United States and Those That Are
In Latin America and in the Caribbean. We Also Want to Emphasize That
Those Programs Will Give an Important Effort to the Improvement of
Academic Frame Works at The Same Time That We Carry out Student
Exchanges Between Our Countries. With That Vision, HACU Has Been Wanting
to Link up These Institutions Across Borders and We Are Very Happy to
Sponsor This Second International Conference. We Welcome Everyone and We
Hope That this Conference Will Be a Great Success.

Cardenas: Thank You, Antonio. I Understand That the Majority of the
Colleges That Exist, That Are Members of HACU, Have Great ‑‑ Very Large
Percentage of Hispanic Students in the United States.

Exactly, Raul. Two out of Three Every Latin‑american Students
Participate in Our Universities in the United States and in Puerto Rico.
It\'s 1.3 Million Students at the National Level That We Have Seen in
Our Registration Rates in Higher Education. And We Have Close to 800,000
of Those in Our Institutions. That Is a Great Responsibility and at the
Same Time, a Great Privilege for Us to Be Able to Serve a Community That
Still ‑‑ Is Too Distant from Where it Should Be with Regards to its
Academic and Educational Achievements.

Cardenas: That\'s a Very Impressive Number and All the Work That\'s
Being Undertaken by Our Universities Is Also Tremendous. Are There Any
Other Questions about HACU? We\'ll Continue with Our Program with
Ricardo Dow Y Anaya. In Charge of the Student Ambassador Program Will
Talk about it With Us.

Anaya: Thank You Very Much. Mr. Cardenas. The Student Ambassador Program
Has a Vision in Order to Promote Students That Dr. Antonio Flores Was
Mentioning. And Our Vision Can Be Stated in Just a Few Words. We\'re
Trying to Focus on Leadership, Education, Opportunities All along the
Americas. Within this Vision, We Have a Mission ‑‑ Our Objective Is to
Promote the Good Health for Our People and Good Health for Our World. We
Have Many Students That Are Working Currently on this Congress. We Have
32 Countries Represented. 13 States. 30 Institutions. And 5 Federal
Agencies and 70 Families. And We\'re Talking about Our ‑‑ We\'re Also
Talking about Our Future There. To All My Colleagues Who Are Helping Us,
We Have Collaboration With New Mexico Highlands University, with the
Bureau of Land Management and HACU in Order to Be Successful. In
Highlands, We Started Mary Lucy School. It Is an Example of All the
Students That We Have. When We\'re Talking about How Our Kids Have
Changed. One Child\'s Mother Was from Las Vegas. Mary Lucy Encountered
the ‑‑ She Was a Representative of the United States as an Ambassador to
the Republic of Honduras. She\'s a Very Kind Lady. A Lady Who Has Always
Worked for Children, for the Poor People, With Great Efforts to the Day
‑‑ She\'s a Great Model for Us to Follow. So the Student Ambassador
Program Represents That Kind of Student. What We Also Have in Our
Program Is a Mixture of Disciplines. We Cannot Resolve Our Problems with
Regards to Our Natural Resources Without Various Disciplines. Such as
Mary Lucy, We\'re Always Pushing the Spanish Language. He Will Also ‑‑
We Also Have Various Disciplines. For Example, Let Me Introduce Claudia
Salas Who Has a Different Perspective. Claudia, Why Are You Here with Us
at this Conference?

Salas: I Am Participating in the First Congress Last Year. And I\'m
Coming in as a Spanish Student. I Took the Class in ‑‑ I Have Classes in
Becoming a Teacher. I Want to Become a High Schoolteacher in Spanish.
And Coming to Things like this for Me Is Beneficial So I Can Learn a
Lot. And to Practice the Language and Also to Learn about the
Opportunities. Many People Say Well, Why Did We Come Here If We\'re Not
Studying Eco‑tourism but for Example I, with the Spanish I Want to
Teach, Something like That, this Teaches Me Quite a Bit about the
Environment and I Can Go to the Schools and Take to the Students On
Excursions, Field Trips Where They Can Touch the Earth, Touch The
Waters, the Trees. And Learn about the Realities. These Things ‑‑ They
Give Me More Knowledge about the Environment So That I Can Be ‑‑ So That
I Will Not Become Just The Traditional Teacher Just Teaching on the
Chalkboard or with Just Books. This Way, I Can Take My Students to Touch
and to Learn More About the Commodities of the Environment and Also
about Nature.

Anaya: Thank You Very Much, Claudia. It\'s Very Important That Everyone
Know That the Opportunity at This Type of Conference Is Not Just for
Technicians or Experts In Natural Sciences. It\'s Important That We Set
Aside an Obstacle, the Academic Obstacle in Order to Be Able to Deal
with Various Areas of Expertise. For Example, Claudia Can Work for the
Bureau of Land Management In Her ‑‑ in Their Environmental Education
Program. And It\'s Very Important for Us to Destroy or Eliminate That
Barrier. And There Are Other Problems. There Are Politics and There Are
Students That Are Studying Political Science. And If You Will Allow Me,
I Will Introduce Another Student from New Mexico Highlands University.
Hector Balderas. Hector, Those Studies in this ‑‑ in this Program, What
Forever?

Balderas: Thank You, Doctor. This Program Has Helped Me a Great Deal and
the Reasons Are Because Currently it Has Helped Me When I Analyze the
Social Programs and the Effects That They Have on the Environment. And I
Think, Also, That the Factor ‑‑ the Most Important Aspect Of this
Program with Regard to the Student Ambassadors Is That It\'s Culture in
Nature. When We Approach it in That Cultural Way, Looking for Solutions,
We\'re Not Looking for Certain Citizens of a Certain Country or Certain
Heritage. We Are Men and Women, Families Who Are Looking for Solutions
for Humanity. That\'s Why I\'m Involved in this Program.

Anaya: Thank You Very Much, Hector. It\'s Clear What These Two Students,
These Two Models, That Students All over the World Can Help out in the
Conservation of Our Natural Resources as We with Our Vision, We
Understand That It Is Very Important That We Have the Capacity and the
Vision Not Only Just on a Focal Point but One That Includes the Entire
World. That\'s Something That We Are Lacking, That We Don\'t Offer More
But There Are Agencies in the United States Such as Bureau of Land
Management and Such as the Forest Parks Service. There Are People Who
Want to Give Our Students a Challenge. A Challenge. They Want to Place
Our Students in Leadership Position for the Future. Leaders That Can
Think Is More Important than Any Other Leaders Because They Cannot Only
Lead but They Can Also Listen. They Can Listen to the Feelings of Our
Race. They Can Also Conserve Our Cultures, Our Traditions. Our Heritage.
There\'s a Lot of Things I Could Talk about. But at this Point, I\'ll
Stop.

Cardenas: That\'s a Very Interesting Program. I Would like to Ask the
Students ‑‑ I Imagine this Takes a Lot Of Time Because You Have to Do
Your Studies and Then You Have to Participate in These Activities.

Balderas: Yes, It\'s True. The Thinking Is Changing. With Regards to
Just Studying Problems. In Other Words, Students Have to Go out and Ask
Questions. They Have to Look for Solutions. Not When They Begin Their
Jobs but While They\'re Still at School.

Cardenas: Very Good. I Think That\'s Very Interesting. And Something
That You Receive a Great Deal of Credit for Because I Imagine it Take a
‑‑ it Takes a Great Deal of Time to Participate in These Kinds of
Activities While Being a Student And in Community Service Which, to Me,
Is Very Important. Are There Any Other Similar Programs Here in the
United States That You Know Of?

Anaya: There Are a Few. For Example, the Agencies Have Different
Programs for Training. Training Programs at Various Levels. Programs
Where the Student Can Begin His or Her Studies at the University. There
Are Programs to Advance Them Through the Technical Areas In the Field.
And It\'s Important That Students Go Through the Offices of BLM For the
Bureau of Land Management to Find Out, to Ask Questions. They Can\'t Do
Anything ‑‑ They Might Be Able to Feed You but You Must Be Able to Eat.
But During Our Program, We\'re Doing Things Such as Creating a Database.
All the Students That Are in Secondary School. So If They Continue
Working with Us as Volunteers and Nobody Gets Paid. As Volunteers, Each
Semester at New Mexico Highlands University, We Have More than 5500
Hours of Activities as a Volunteer. This Is Very Important. Also to
Reach Students If They Are Experts in the Area of Mathematics, They Can
Work with the Community Teaching Younger Kids about Math If Somebody Has
a Problem with Older People, With Senior Citizens, with Regard to Health
Problems. A Student Can Work with a Senior Citizen. So It\'s an Exchange
of Time. But Such as Before, We Can Work and We Can Learn from Our Own
People. Just by Conversing, Just by Learning.

Cardenas: Very Well. Is There Any Other Question with Regards to this
Program?

Flores: I Just Wanted to Add That, of Course, with Regards to The
Questions That You Made a Few Moments Ago, Raul, That HACU, The Hispanic
Association of Colleges and Universities Has a National Internship
Program Which Gives a Great Deal of Opportunity to Many of Our Students
to Experience for Themselves Firsthand a Professional Opportunity at
Least for One Summer or For a Semester or Even During the Entire School
Year. And Many of Them Have Participated in Programs of this Type with
The Bureau of Land Management. With the National Parks Service and with
a Series of Federal Agencies That Allows Them to Participate in a Very
Professional Manner and a Very Personal Manner in this Type of Program.
And They Open New Doors and New Horizons for Their Professional Future.

Cardenas: That Sounds Very Interesting with Regards to the Opportunities
Being Offered to Our Students to Be Able to Participate in That Kind of
Service.

Salas: I Would like to Mention That the Requirement That We Have to Have
in Order to Come to the Conference Is it Also Allows Us to Learn a Lot
and It\'s a Wonderful Benefit and the Friendships That We Establish in
the ‑‑ and the Contacts Will Also ‑‑ Not Just Individuals but Friends
and Friendships That One Day We Can Call upon to Help Us in Our Own
Countries and in Theirs.

Cardenas: It\'s Important, You Know, That Many Times We Have These
Conferences and Conventions. We Get Through to the Students Which Is the
Main Reason Why We\'re Meeting to Help Students. I Think It\'s Wonderful
You Guys Have Benefitted from These Programs.

Salas: Thank You.

Cardenas: Very Well. Is There Any Other Question or Comment?

Anaya: Just One or Two Please. This Year, We Have Settled the Student
Ambassadors ‑‑ That\'s 70. Last Year, the First Year of this Congress,
We Started with 20. And Also, During this Very Same Congress, We Have
125 Students Who Would like to Take Part in the Ambassador Program and
Such As the Program That Dr. Flores Explained about. We Have Some
Students That Spent Some Time ‑‑ Very Successful Time in Alaska. We Have
Students That Worked with Bureau of Land Management. What We Can Do Now
with All of the Contacts and All of the Mechanisms That We Have Is to
Take the Same Studies That These Students Did for BLM, Bureau of Land
Management in Alaska, Maybe We Could Do That in Honduras or Maybe We
Could Do That in Mexico With the Same Students or Different Students in
Order to Continue Because These Students Will Be the Leaders for the
Future. And They Will Be Working as Future Technicians but Also They
Will Be the Fathers for this Movement.

Cardenas: Yeah. It Is Extremely Interesting. We\'re Running out of Time.
So Thank You, Ricardo for Your Presentation. At this Time, in Order to
Establish Our Discussion Providing Eco‑tourism, We Would like to Present
a Video That Was Prepared For Us by Universidad Autonoma De Tamaulipas.
After this Video, We Will Talk with a Distinguished Panel about The
Topic of Eco‑tourism in Our Constantly Changing World.

the Positive or Negative Impact upon Negative ‑‑ Taking into
Consideration Mexico Is among the First Five Places Worldwide Because of
Their Ecology and Their Multidiversity. We Took into Consideration That
One of the Aspects of Major Importance Which Has Been Given Currently
and Which Has Allowed Us to Also Have a Diffusion and a Knowledge of the
Different Species, There Are 572 Species of Reptiles. And Having More
than Half of the Species Which Are Native. And Also Species Which Are
Mammals and 285 Amphibian Species of Which 63% of These Are Also Native.
2,000 Floral Species Occupying 10% of the Complete Global Space. And
Also More than 600 Species of These Which Are at Least a Native. 1,040
of These Are Wild. Among Them, 86 of Them Are Native. 400 of Them Are
Found along the Border Between the United States And Mexico Border. And
over 500 Species of Butterflies. The Impact That this Has Had upon
Mexico in the Environmental Aspect Is Well Taken into the Richness of
this in the Financial Aspect and the Tourism Aspect. It Has Been Managed
by the People Who Not Only Have Been Able to ‑‑ Within Our Country in
New Mexico, Not Only Globally but Develop the Productivity of the
Mankind and Develop, Also the Environmental Aspects. And Also Try to
Balance a ‑‑ the Environmental Balance. So, Theoretically, We Agree That
this Development must Be Carried out but Not at the Cost of the
Environment but Within a Balance and less Satisfying the Basic Needs of
Man Kind Such as Food and Shelter. Sustenance and Also the Need to Also
Preserve Our Natural Resources. Especially in Those Sectors in Which the
Communities Directly Live off the Natural Resources. And Currently, That
Being One of Our Worries Globally and Also At a National Level We Would
like to Integrate the Productivity Of the Development of Mankind and
Also the Protection of the Environment Between the Conflicts with the
Economic and the Ecology and this Would Allow Us Then to Sustain the
Development, Be in Accord with the Satisfaction of the Basic Needs of
Mankind Such as Food, Shelter and Sustenance Through Direct Contact with
The Natural Resources. However, Through the Point of Voice ‑‑ Point of
View, it Can Come upon Some Kind of Conflict as One Is Taking Advantage
of Some of the Natural Resources and Allowing Us Also to Move Forward in
the Development of Our Projects and Natural Resources. In Order to
Sustain and Create a Balance in Reference to the Basic Needs of Man Kind
and the Environment, Tourism Does Play a Major Role. In this Case, the
Eco‑tourism Which Is One of the Industries of The Greatest Importance in
Our Country. And Know That in Mexico, We Have Resources That Are Quite
Vast. Of Flora and Fauna. And Which from Years Past, the Eco‑tourism Has
Been Practiced Not as Such but Yes in Some Aspects Such as the
Characteristics, Such as Natural Resources. Not That ‑‑ Now That Mexico
Does Have Cascades, Archaeology, Flora, Fauna and Lagoons. At this ‑‑
this Does Make a Very Attractive So That Well ‑‑ So That Tourists Can
Come in Both at the International Level and Also National Level and
Enjoy These Natural Resources. For Example, in the Last 30 Years, Mexico
Occupied the Second And Third Place Worldwide. In the Tourism and
Eco‑tourism Aspect. So, it Does Have a Basic Role. And it Is the
Generator, Also, of Employment. Now, Given That 9% of the Population Is
Employed Through These Two Million Jobs, One out of Every Nine Is
Related to the Tourist Aspect. In 1993, for Example, There Was a Visit
of Some Four Million Foreigners, Tourists, Which Allowed Us to Generate
\$473 Million. And this Places Them in the Second Place after the Sale
of Petroleum and Manufacture. We Are in Eighth Place. Globally. Through
Placing Us Within the Tourism Industry. And According to the Global
Data, it Is the Seventh in Reference To the Infrastructure. We, of
Course, We Do Need Some Form of Integrated Structure in Reference to the
Preservation of the Resources of the Generation Of Employment and Also
the Development ‑‑ the Social Development Especially for Those Sectors
in Which There Is a Direct Promotion in Which it Is Trying to Generate
and to Take Advantage of the Natural Resources as Such. In Reference to
the Associations, They\'re Playing a Role, a Basic Role in Mexico. Both
at the Local ‑‑ in Our State, Local Level in Our State, Given the Fact
That There\'s a Great Amount of Organizations of ‑‑ That Are
Nongovernmental Which Are Carrying out Actions to Realize the
Conservation of Our Natural Resources. And in this Way, Be Able to Then
Have an Eco‑tourism or Sustainable Eco‑tourism Which Would Have the
Relationship in Harmony with That Which Would Be the Tourism. Which
Would Allow Us to Enjoy and Appreciate and Investigate the ‑‑ Those
Other Aspects Which Are Sem by Otic to the Environment. And Also the
Generation of an Economic Resource Both for the Country and for the
Community in Which the Resources Being Exploited and Thus Promoting the
Conservation and the Protection Of the Environment. And Thus Lessening
the Impact upon the Environment Which this Generates. Now That it Is
Necessary to Depend upon and Count upon Some Plants in Mexico, They Have
a National Plan and Strategies Which Are Perfectly Defined Which Would
Allow Us to Control the Use And the Abuse of the Natural Resources. Both
at the National Level and the Local Level and Also the State Level.
There Are Legislations Which We Depend upon Which Allow the ‑‑ The
Caring and Protection of the Natural Resources. Thus Lessening Their
Impact upon the Environment. There Are Benefits, Financial Ones,
Especially for the Local Communities Which Allow Us, Then, to Satisfy
Their Needs and Also to Give Them an Alternative to the Proper
Community. Through These Actions Which Enable Them and Guide Them
Psychologically. Or as Loaners or Service or Volunteers Which Can Be
Then Sustained via Through Eco‑tourism or the Tourism by Nature. In Our
Industry, ‑‑ in Our Civil Industry of Eco‑tourism in Mexico, There Has
Been Designed a Series of Strategies Which Allow the Achievement of ‑‑
Through Programs That Have Been Designed Expressly for These Areas. That
Need to Be Exploited for Areas That Are Open and Are Being Opened up to
the Tourism, Both Ecological Tourism in the Scientific Character like
the Beaches, Adventure Tourism, Mountain Hiking, Scenic Tourism, and
Tourism for the Observers, The Photographers, the Agro Tourism Flora.
The Educational Tourism. These Are Strategies Which Have Allowed One
Either One Way or Another to Utilize the Resources, Not Only with the
Purpose of Exploiting the Resource but Also Educational. Both Go with
the Community Locally and Also for the External Community and Also for
the Tourist Themselves to Learn to Appreciate to Respect, to Preserve
Our Natural Resources. Examples of Plans and Programs for Eco‑tourism
That Have Been Successful, We Have Them at the Level of Mexico ‑‑ Being
the Most Important Ones. We Have Plans of Development Which the ‑‑
Reserve for ‑‑ and in Chaps a and These Without of Course Discarding the
‑‑ and Also Others from the Protected Areas with Their Different
Characters Which Are Established in the National Plan. And in the
Program for Conservation of the Institute of Ecology. Those Which of
Course Are Located Within Our State in the Reserve of the Biosphere. In
the Case of the Areas, the Natural Areas, Such as the Seabirds and the
Turtles, the Flora, All of These ‑‑ These Are Allowing Us to ‑‑ in One
Way or Another, to Educate and Create a Consciousness of Ecological
Character in the Communities in Our Country Particularly. There Are
Complexes like Lagoons Such as the Wetlands in the Northern Area. And in
the Southern Areas of ‑‑ Which Is an Area Which Is Also Characterized by
the Migratory Birds and Also Flora and Wildflower. And the Flora Which
Is Located in ‑‑ Is Dedicated to the Conservation of the White Dove. One
of the Most Natural Resources Is Also Another One of the Factors of the
Elements Which Allow a Generation of Income Both From the Ecological and
the Financial Aspect for Our Community. In Sonora, There Is a Protection
of Animals and There Is a High Biological Concentration of Animals Which
Is Located in the Open Lands. And Also Which Is ‑‑ There Is a Protection
of Flora, the Diversity of It. And Also the Arid Flora. We\'re Talking
about the Reserve and the ‑‑ and the Biosphere. We\'re Also Talking
about the Birds and Also the High Concentration of the Different
Animals. And in the Case of the Sea Turtles, in Reference to the City,
This Is a Concentration Where They Come and Lay Their Eggs. Also, in the
Open Plains, Is Considered a National Monument Which Also Identifies Our
Shield. The Concern That We Have from Our Authorities in Reference to
The Conservation of Our Natural Resources Has Been Given at the National
Level and Also at the State Level. In Our Case, There Is ‑‑ Zones
Proposed for Protection with the Categories Also of the Borders or the
Ecological Borders Which Are Posed Also to Be Subject to the
Preservation, the Ecological Preservation And, for Example, in the Case
of the Picachua Which In One Way or Another, They Have Special ‑‑
Because of the Characteristics and According to What They ‑‑ the
Politics Are Being Established in Reference to the Declaration of These
Areas, These Are Considered to Be a Very Special Zone. And Within the
Protected Areas, There Are Also Different Ones That Are Proposed Such as
Ecological Reserves and a Natural Monuments, Parks, and Also Reserves.
Which Is the Importance or How Can We Take into Consideration That
Mexico Is Carrying out Through a Point of View, of Eco‑tourism, the
Ecology, the Natural Ecology. In Reality, the Great Diversity and the
Richness of Our Country Is Allowing Us to Take a Consciousness into the
Importance of Conserving Our Resources. The Resource Which Allows the
Integration of Both the Social Which Is One of the Elements to Which
More Important Should Be Granted, Given the Fact That it Does Allow Also
the Taking upon ‑‑ and the Balancing of the Tourism as a Very New
Activity. And a Very More Modern Activity. To Be Able to Have More
Natural Resource in Order to Carry this Out. Should Be Allowed ‑‑ Allow
the Human Being to Direct Their Efforts to the Sustenance of That
Balance. Towards Mankind and Nature. And Thus, Creating More Jobs. And
the Development in a Financial Sense Which Would Allow Us to Obtain a
Well Being in the Social Status Which Is So Desired at The Global Level.
In Reference to the Ecology, it Is More like a Science or an Ethics
Scientific Ethics Which Would Allow Us Then to Preserve Our Natural
Resources. Our Historical and Cultural, Social, Religious and Which
Would Also Allow Us to Give Us a Benefit and to Preserve These Elements
So That We Can Then Show Them to the Tourist That Come From Within the
Very Country of Mexico and Also from Other Countries Outside of Mexico
Thus Allowing Us the Preservation of Traditions That Are Proper to
Mexico and Also Allow Us Also for Future Generations. And Also Having
the Community as the Central Focal Point of the ‑‑ That Should Be Able
to Carry out a Responsible Tourism and a Tourism of ‑‑ in a Natural
Element or State. And Also the Interiors of Their Communities. This Also
Would Allow Us to Add ‑‑ at the Level of Actions, That We Would Be Then
Able to Have a Generation of Employment and Have a Force Within Their
Communities and Thus Have an Element Of Permanency Within Their
Community and Locality.

Cardenas: We Want to Thank the Universidad Autonoma De Tamaulipas for
Preparing this Presentation. And Now, We Have with Us Dr. Jose Raymundo
Romero. We Are Honored with Your Presence Today, Jose. Thank You for
Being with Us. Its.

Romero: It\'s a Great Pleasure for Me.

Cardenas: and Our Third ‑‑ or Second Guest Is Alberto Chavez, The
Ex‑director of the Department of Tourism in Galapagos Islands.

Chavez: Thank You, Raul. I\'m Happy to Be Here with You.

Cardenas: Thank You. And Dr. Flores and Ricardo Anaya Continue Being
with Us. We Want to Thank Letter for the Video That Was Presented to Us.
Anyone Want to Add Anything? Is There a Question or Comment with Regard
to the Video We Just Saw?

Flores: I Would like to Ask a Question to Our Participants From Brazil
and Ecuador That I Think That it Is Important to Ask Immediately What Is
Your Definition of Eco‑tourism from the Standpoint of Sustainable
Development Within the Latin‑american Context?

Romero: May I Respond?

Cardenas: of Course.

Romero: for Us in Brazil, it Is Very Clear That the Natural Beauties Are
Monuments. They\'re Monuments Such as in Europe. We Have the Cathedrals,
the Museums, the Palaces. These Monuments must Be Seen. By Tourism. So
this Is Also So That People That Visit These Regions Can Be Well‑placed
or Well Aware of the Conservation of Nature, the Environment, the
Conservation of the World We Live In. Such as in Europe, Monuments Are
Sustained. They Are Conserved. ‑‑ They Are Concerned with the Resources.
This, to Us, Is Very Important Because We Have the Resources. If We Do
Not Have the Possibilities, We Don\'t Know How to Maintain the
Conversation. We Don\'t Know How to Maintain the Environment Without
These Resources. So, We See Eco‑tourism from Two Standpoints. First of
All, as a Distribution of the Richness That Is Very Concentrated in the
Certain Part of the World and in Some Way, To Extract the Natural
Richness in the Natural Monuments as Well As to Create a World
Ecological Conscience. That\'s the Idea. We Are a Global Village.
That\'s the Central Idea. But We must Be a Global Humanity, Also. So, We
Have Seen Eco‑tourism in this Way That We must Take Advantage of Those
Richness That Exist in One Country and Another and We must Consider Them
as Natural Monuments. And It\'s Also a Way to Make a Distribution of the
Richness. In Various Parts of the World.

Chavez: Yes, Dr. Flores, for Us in Ecuador, Eco‑tourism Is Something
Very Important. It\'s a Concept That Is Growing in Our Country. We Start
from the Premise That We Have 15% of Ecuador Is Protected Lands. These
Are Areas We Feel We must Conserve Because We Think They House All the
Eco‑systems That Are Found in Ecuador. We Also Have 18 Established
Cultures in Ecuador. We must Also Conserve. So All of this Within
Sustainable Development Framework. We Also Have Seen That Eco‑tourism Is
an Excellent Source of Income. We Can Also Give Conservation More
Feasibility. We Can Make it More Productive Thanks to Eco‑tourism. This
Is an Activity That Allows Us to Manage Our Resources and To Diminish
the Pressures That Exist at the Local Level. Towards Our Resources. So,
We Have Established a Strategy We Could Refer to it as That. Of
Development of Projects in Eco‑tourism in Our Country. We\'re Starting
with the Universities That Has Been the First Step That We Have Taken.
We Have Started Programs at Universities in Eco‑tourism and Every
University That We Have in Ecuador. We Have These Types of Programs.
These Are Environmental Programs That Are Linked to Eco‑tourism.

Romero: Dr. Ricardo, I Would like to State That Brazil Is a Very Large
Country. It Has a Very Interesting Characteristic. Biggest Dimension Is
‑‑ Dimension Is from North to South So this Makes Brazil Very Diverse in
Terms of its Weather and its Biological Elements. We Have Tropical
Areas. We Have Other Kinds of Areas. We Have Various Eco‑systems That
Are Well‑defined That Can Lead To a Very Wide Vision of the Various
Systems That We Have. So, We Have, in Fact, the Amazon Region Which Is
in the Northern Region of Brazil with its Trees, its River. Its Great
Biodiversity. The Biodiversity in Brazil Is Also Supported by the
Biodiversity In Ecuador. They Have a Similar Biodiversity but There Are
Other Regions Such as the Central Region of Brazil We Name a ‑‑ it Is a
Dry Region. Where We Can Verify the Flora and the Fauna That Is Very
Natural And Are Very Important. Another Region That We Have Is the
Coastal Region. Brazil, We Have More than 8,000 Kilometers of Coastline.
We Have a Great Deal of Variation in Terms of the Scenery. We Have Some
Sceneries or Some Places That Have Been Untouched By Man Where We Could
See Sea Turtles. We Also Have, Back in the Amazon Area, the Great
Rivers. Which Are the Highways of this River. ‑‑ Correction, of this
Region. So, We Have a Great Deal of Diversity So Eco‑tourism for Us in
Brazil Means the Possibility of Being Able to Show the World\'s
Population That We Have a Natural Life That We Have a Life That Must Be
Conserved Because We must Think about the Future Generations. But We
Also Have Problems. We Still Have Problems. We Can See That in Order to
Extract Gold, We Contaminate the Water and this Is Very Bad. We
Introduce Mercury into the Water and this Contaminates the Rivers and
Lakes and this Is a Very Bad Thing. But We must Think That the People
Who Do That Do it to Survive. They Do it to Have a Way of Life. So, this
Is What Eco‑tourism Offers Us. It\'s a Source of Revenue. Not Only to
Exploit Those Regions, but in Order to Also Make the Population Being
Able to Survive.

Cardenas: We Have a Question That Was Sent to Us by Fax for You, Doctor
and I\'ll Read it in English. Many People Rely on Cultural Art for an
Income. There\'s Been Increased Demand for Our Native Art. Do You See
this Industry from Your Country as a Source for Development? And How Can
We as Americans Continue to Assist in this Development?

Romero: Surely, Natural Culture, the Natural Endemic Culture Of the
Country, Brazil, Is Very Important for the Sustainable Development
Because If You See the Brazilian Indians That Lived In the Regions
Conserve Those Regions. There Was an Entire Tradition of Culture That
Was Lost with Time. Latin America Has Suffered a Great Deal of Problem
with Respect To Their Loss of Culture. I Think this Is a Good Time to
Rescue Very Rich Tradition and Culture That Is Not Just in Brazil but
It\'s Also in the Andes in Mexico, the Incas, the Mayas, the Aztecs.
These Are Examples of Lost Cultures. These Cultures Have a Certain
Knowledge of Natural Herbs That We Must Use for Our Development. I
Don\'t Know If it Is Used Everywhere but We Do Have Certain Vegetable
Species and Some Certain Biological Materials That Could Be Very Useful
for the World. So It\'s Not Just the Industry but the Rescue of the
Latin‑american Culture Is Very Important in Order to Achieve a More
Balanced World.

Cardenas: Well, We Were Going to Attempt Another Video Presentation from
Universidad Federal De Santa Caterina but the Tape Was Damaged When it
Was Shipped So We Have, Live, on the Telephone from Floronapolis, the
Professor Who Has a Short Presentation on Eco‑tourism in Brazil. Dr.
Murietta.

Hello.

Who\'s There?

Cardenas: Good Morning. How Are You?

I\'m Here to Attempt to Help You in Any Question That You Might Have for
Me. So, Regarding My Dissertation on Tourism on Santa Caterina Island.

Very Well. Continue Dr. Moreto.

Cardenas: You Had a Presentation, Right?

Personal?

Cardenas: Yes.

Well, I Teach at the University of Santa Catarina and I\'m Currently
Working in the Santa Catarina Government Agency and My Function Is of
President of the Office. For Almost Ten Years, I\'ve Been Working as a
Consultant for the Planning of Tourism. Sustainable Tourism. Market
Studies and Other Projects That Are Related with Eco‑tourism in Brazil
and in America.

Cardenas: Well, Can You Tell Us a Little Bit Because Your Video Arrived
Damaged and We Can\'t Use it and Is So We Were Hoping You Could Tell Us
a Little Bit about Your Eco‑tourism Program.

Well, in Our Conversation, We Spoke about the Impacts That Tourism Has
with Regard to its Development and They Want to Develop the Natural
Space. And Prepare to Build Space. In Santa Catarina, We Have an Island
‑‑ People Who Began the Colonization Here ‑‑ the Development of the
Tourism on Our Island Has Provoked a Great Deal of Transformations. But
We Don\'t Have a Great Deal of Impacts over Here on the Hotel Chains.
And There Is No Great Deal of Preoccupation. There\'s No Tangible
Preoccupation Because it Counters the Development of Tourism. But the
Way That the Space Is Occupied by the People, by the Families, Has Also
Provoked a Great Deal of Impact and a Great Deal of Negative Impact in
That Space. Counter Point, Other Points of North America Make Is, for
Example, When People Work on the Arrival of the Hotel Chains or The
Other Developments, We Don\'t Have Very Large Developments. We Don\'t
Have Large Hotel Chains. But the Intensive Occupation of the Space Has
Become a Great Threat to the Culture. To the Conservation of the
Cultural Values. With Regards to the Homes, the Different Elements, the
Plazas, The Different Elements of the Historic Heritage. But Also with
Regards to the Occupation of Natural Space, the Nature Has Succumbed in
the Face of Man on the Island. We Have a Great Deal of Concern. We Feel
That from Our Standpoint, Nature Is the Prime Resource Along with the
Cultural Characteristics.

Cardenas: Is There a Question from the Panelists?

Flores: I Have a Question. I Think It\'s Very Important Within the
Context of Latin America, Specifically, and this Has Something to Do
with Given the Disadvantageous Conditions of Latin‑american Countries
from Socioeconomic Standpoint and Also from a Political Standpoint in
Terms of the Sustainable Development of Eco‑tourism, What Are Some of
the More Important Challenges That Your Countries Are Facing with Regard
to the Sustainable Development? Sustainable Development of Eco‑tourism?

Chavez: We\'re Trying to Change the Tour Nix Our Country. We\'re Aware
There Are Some Invaluable Priceless Resources Which We Need to Conserve
but for Us, We\'re Beginning to Initiate These Practices in this Area.
We Were Established as We Mentioned Before, Some Educational Programs
Which We Need to Start from There at Every Level Is Where We Need to
Start Working At. At the University Level, at the College Level. At the
Level of the Rural Population. So That These Programs Can Then Have
Success. And So We Can Come out Forth.

Cardenas: Doctor, Do You Have Any Comments? We\'re Listening.

I Believe That There Is a Great Challenge Politically in the Sense That
We Would like to Sustain the Characteristics and the Diversity in the
Environment and Also Maintain the Cultural Traces So That We Can Then Be
Able to Go into the International Markets. For Me, It\'s a Great Need
Throughout All of Latin America What The Scientists Call ‑‑ the
Political Classes, the Commercial Classes and Our Continent, Then Can
Generate Ecology for Our Continent. For Me, this Can Patronize and Help
Us in the Generation of Products. Why must We Succumb in Comparison to
Other Countries?

Romero: I Would like to Talk with Regard to the Question That Dr. Flores
Posed, Let\'s Look at the Situation in Brazil. In 1970, We Had 90
Million Inhabitants in Brazil. 27 Years Afterwards, We\'re 160 Million!
If an Entire ‑‑ If it Had Been Incorporated into the Countries More than
70 Million People. This Is a Great Problem for the Maintenance of the
Environment, For the Sustainable Development. So What We must Do Is to
Incorporate a Great Deal of Education, To Be Able to Incorporate All
Those People to the Regular Life, To the Regular Citizenship. There Is a
Very Important Role That Universities must Play as Well as HACU and That
They Can Develop in Latin America. Because If You See in These
Globalization Times, It\'s like We Are Overrunning All the
Latin‑american Countries and Also African Countries and We\'re Exploding
Prime Materials. And this Is Not a Good Thing Because There Are Some
That Provide A Great Deal of Jobs. A Man Who Does Not Have a Job but
must Survive Will Cut the Tree, Will Cut the Tree, Will Have to Kill an
Animal To, Perhaps, Conserve His Own Life. So, this Might Lead to
Extension. So this ‑‑ to Extinction. This Is a Very Important Problem.
Poverty Is One of the Worst Aspects That Has Affected the Environment.
Teleconference That We Are Undertaking Is a Very Positive Thing That We
Can Do in Terms of Globalization and It\'s a Positive Aspect. But We
must Keep in Mind That We Have Economic Problems and it Is Imperative
That the More Developed Countries must Understand That a Problem in
Brazil Is Not Just a Problem Brazil but it Covers the Entire Globe.

Cardenas: Those Are Excellent Comments. I Would like to Thank Dr. Luis
Moreto by Telephone. We\'re Sorry We Couldn\'t Use Your Video. We Want
to Thank You for Your Participation.

Thank You.

Cardenas: These Have Been Excellent Comments. And Now, I Think We\'ll
Move On. To Alberto and Your Presentation with Regards to this Topic.

Chavez: Thank You, Dr. Cardenas. Ecuador Is a Very Small Country That
Has a Tremendous Biodiversity. We\'re Talking about Something like 23
Life Zones and There Are Around 30 That Exist All over the World. We\'re
Talking about 18 Different Cultures to Give You an Example. In Ecuador,
There Exists 10% from All the Plant Species That Are In Existence All
over the World. Only .2% of Land Surface. We Also Have 11% of the
World\'s Total Production of Orchids. From this Small Territory, Ecuador
Has 15% That Is ‑‑ Belongs to The Protected Area Systems. We Have to
Conserve All These Resources. We Have to Conserve All These Cultures. We
must Move Ahead. We Have Realized What a Tremendous Value We Have in
Ecuador and We Have Realized That this Is a Great Competitiveness That
We Have Before the Rest of the World. And It\'s Also a Great
Responsibility That We Have Such as Was Said Before. We must Achieve
That this Be Conserved. That this Be Conserved for Future Generations.
And the Responsibility Is Not Just for Ecuador but for the Rest Of the
World. We\'re Talking Also, for Example, the Galapagos Island That Is
Situated So Critical That We must Dedicate Ourselves to Conservation. So
How Will We Achieve this Conservation? Well, We Have Planned a Thesis
for Eco‑tourism and We Have Instilled into University Programs Where
Currently this Is Being Taught Where We Are Utilizing the Tools That Are
Available at This Time in Many of ‑‑ and Many of These Have Been
Research and Have Been Achieved in European and United States
Universities. So the Universities Begin These Environmental Starting
Programs. Resource Management with Regards to Eco‑tourism. And We Also
Have to Part from Another Very Important Premise Such as Was Stated in
One of the Previous Videos That We Saw. Tourism Is a Very Important
Activity at the Global Level. It\'s a Growing Activity. In 1996, We Saw
593 Million Travelers That Were Perceived All Over the World. According
to the World Tourism Organization, We Have a Growing Demand, a Growing
Preference Towards Tourism Sites Where Conservation Is Being Practiced
and Where Pristine Characteristics of the Environment Are in Existence.
We Have All of These Resources in Ecuador and We must Begin to Develop
Them. We Don\'t Have a Very Established Framework or We Don\'t Have Very
Many Programs but We Do Have a Certain Amount of Tourism in Ecuador.
We\'re Talking about 500,000 People That Visit Ecuador Currently. And
Eco‑tourism Right Now Occupies the Fourth Place in Terms of The Most
Important Activity in Our Country. It\'s a Great Source of Income That
We Have. So, I Think That We Are Headed in the Right Direction in Trying
To Achieve this Objective. That Is So Important Such as the Conservation
of Our Natural Resources and Our Cultures.

Cardenas: Very Good. We Have a Call, a Telephone Call and Then We Have a
Fax. We\'ll Go to the Caller First. Which Will Be a Question and Then
We\'ll Continue with the Fax. Late Go to Line One. ‑‑ Let\'s Go to Line
One. Hello.

Caller: Hello. My Question Is the Following. My Name\'s Jose. Look, I
Would like to Ask the Panelist the Following. Taking into Consideration
That Tourism ‑‑ Anybody However Can Cause and Is Causing an Overload and
upon the Eco‑systems, What Are the Foundations ‑‑ the Concrete Ones,
First of All, to Avoid The Collapse of Those Eco‑systems and Secondly,
in Order to Sustain a Long‑range, a Restructuring and the Conservation
of The National Resources, the Question Is it ‑‑ the Natural Resources,
the Question Is it Seems There Is No Particular Way To See this and I
Would like to Hear Greatly, the Pand the Diversity of Course of the
Different Nations and Their Systems. Thank You.

Chavez: Yes, Jose. In Ecuador, We Have an Excellent Example Which Is the
Galapagos Islands. We Have Tourism Which We Have Had for 30 Years.
Tourism Has Been Growing Considerably. Currently We\'re Talking about
7,000 ‑‑ Excuse Me, 70,000 Visitors at the Galapagos Island Gets. When
We First Started, We Were Talking about a Few Thousands. We Have
Established There Is a Development Plan for the Islands. We Have Managed
to Sustain Tourism in Such a Way That We Have Limited the Space for
Shipments for Tourism Purposes. We\'re Talking about the Galapagos
Islands. There Are Several Hotels. So We Don\'t Have New Investors
Trying to Build Hotels Because This Is Limited. On the Other Hand, on
the Island, We Have Created an Excellent Group of Nature Guides Who Are
Trained Every Year and These Have Become Some Truly Excellent Rangers of
the Galapagos Islands Park. And They Maintain Strict Conservation
Measures. When We Limit the Amount of Ships That Can Visit the Galapagos
Islands, We\'re Also Diminishing the Amount of Visitors. With
Excellently Trained Guides, We Can, at the Same Time, Maintain
Conditions for Visits and Not Alter the Environment. Any Other
Questions?

Romero: Yes. In Brazil, We Still Have More Brazilian Tourists That Go
out of The Country than What We Receive. So It\'s a Very Large Country.
We Can Receive a Great Deal of Visitors. Of Course, There must Be an
Infrastructure. An Infrastructure That Preserves the Eco‑systems. There
Is a Concern on the Part of Jose, That He Transmitted to Us with Regards
to the Effects That the Tourism Has and All the Visitors Have on the
Eco‑systems. I Think That this Can Be Resolved. We Just must Look at the
Great Massive Tourists That Visit Europe and That Go to See the
Monuments, the Cathedrals and They Want to Visit the Natural Beauties of
Europe or to Come Here to The United States. There\'s Some Way That
Where the Destruction of Cathedrals and Monuments Is Being Happening.
Like Disney World. There\'s Millions of Visitors That Go to the United
States to Go To Disney World. And They\'re Not Destroying it Because
There Are People Who Are Prepared for the Visitors Because There Exists
an Infrastructure To Receive Those Visitors. Many Times a Person in My
Country, Play a Role or Throw a Piece Of Paper on the Ground. They
Don\'t Do That at Disney World So this Involves an Environmental
Education of Certain Type That Would Help. I Think That Tourism Would Be
an Excellent Source of Revenue for Countries. It\'s a Very Good Way to
Distribute Richness and it must Not ‑‑ It Doesn\'t Necessarily Have to
Be Negative.

Flores: If You Would Allow Me to Suggest Something. With Regards to That
Question, I Think the Point That Somebody Mentioned Before with Regards
to the Education Is Very, Very Important. In Terms of the Ecological
Conservation of Regions with Sustainable Eco‑tourism. And I Think That
Dr. Romero\'s Suggestion of a Few Minutes Ago That HACU Take a Stronger
Position of Leadership in the Increase Of Research Programs and Academic
Programs Would Be Very Important Because this Is a New ‑‑ a New
Phenomena at the Global Level.

Romero: We must Have Exchanges Between Experts of Different Countries So
We Can Exchange Ideas and Information.

Cardenas: Thank You Very Much for the Call. Thank You. We Have a Fax
Very Quickly Because Time Is Running out. And it Goes like this. And
this Is for Professor Romero and Alberto Chavez. The Rain Forest ‑‑ What
Is Your Country Doing to Stop Problems Regarding the Cattle in the Rain
Forest?

Chavez: Well, in Our Country, Unfortunately, this Is One of The
Environmental Problems That We Have. And We Had in this Area. And
Certainly Because We Are Not ‑‑ Because We Are Certainly Not Reforesting
and at this Point They Are Certainly Not Strong Enough. We Have to
Emphasize Education. The Education of the Local Communities and Also as
We Were Mentioning Before, We Also Have to Work Hard to Try to Give
Economic Alternatives to Those People Who Depend upon These Natural
Areas Which Are Potentially in Danger of Being Deforested. Before We
Were Mentions That ‑‑ Mentioning That 70% of the Population Gives in
Strict Poverty So We Can\'t Talk about this Unless We Are Able to Solve
the Poverty and in Order to Do That, We must Present Alternatives Before
We Can Tell Those People Not To Come and Cut the Trees.

Romero: this Is a Very Interesting Question. There Are Burnings in the
Amazon Region. Some of Them Are Very Serious. You must Think Why Are
They Doing the Burnings. And the Question Is What Do the Countries Do
about this? There Are Control Programs but this Isn\'t a Police
Operation. There Isn\'t Enough Personnel to Avoid the Burnings. There\'s
Also Extreme Lack of Education. In Latin America, There Are a Tremendous
Amount of Children That Don\'t Go to School. In Latin America, Those
That Make it to the University Level Are Very Few N Latin America,
Unemployment Is Growing Every Moment. This Globalized Commerce That We
Have. So, We must Not Concentrate on What Countries Are Doing with
Regards to this but on What the World Is Doing with Regards to This
Problem Because It\'s Not a Brazilian Problem or an Ecuador Problem.
It\'s a Problem in Africa. It\'s a Problem That Is a Result of the Great
Imbalance That We\'re Perceiving All over the World. We Don\'t Have a
Political Wall. That Fell down. But There Is a Very Serious, Very Strong
Wall That Separates the Rich from the Poor. So, We must Start from That
Point for the Well Being of the Humanity. And in Terms of Education and
Also as a Creation of an Awareness, So That If the World Is Not
Homogeneous, Then the Impact Will Not Be in Brazil but They\'ll Be Seen
All over the World.

Cardenas: Thank You Very Much.

Anaya: Just a Brief Comment. That\'s Where We\'re Throwing the Coals
into the Fire. That\'s Where We Have to Stimulate the Student
Ambassadors. That\'s Why We Have to Set up a Plan to Place Our Students
in Those Places.

Cardenas: Very Good. Thank You Gentlemen for Your Presentations. At this
Time, We\'re Going to Take a Break. When We Come Back, We\'re Going to
Talk about the Effects of Eco‑tourism on Local Communities. And We\'ll
See a Presentation from the University of Arizona in Tucson. We\'ll Be
Back in Ten Minutes.

Cardenas: Welcome to the Second Half of Our Teleconference Sponsored by
HACU on Natural Resources and Cultural Heritage. In Our next Segment, We
Have with Us Ms. Liddie Martinez Who Is President of the Coloquio
International Del Camino Real De Tierra Adentro.

Martinez: Thank You Very Much.

Cardenas: We Appreciate Your Presence Here.

Cardenas: Also with Us Is Joaquin Murietta.

Murietta: Good Morning, Raul. Thank You Gore Inviting Me.

Cardenas: We Also Have Jorge. Welcome.

Thank You. I Wanted to Thank HACU for the Opportunities They Are
Extending To Mexican Students.

Cardenas: We Hope That ‑‑ We\'re Going to Begin this Segment With Dr.
Emily Young from the University of Arizona in Tucson. Let\'s Go to the
Tape.

There Is a Lot of Interest That\'s Been Coming to the Forefront in
Reference to Trying to Conserve the Environment but The Development of
Eco‑tourism Can Also Create More Damages than Benefits to the Ecology.
Both Economically and Environmentally. If it Is Not Designed to Reduce
the Minimum Impact to the Environment and to Also Be Able to Give the
Local Peoples Some Kind of Financial Gain. In Mexico, the Preservation
of Mammals Cannot Be Realized Without the Participation of Fishermen and
Their Families. Purpose of this Presentation Is to Evaluate the
Different Points Of View of Tourism as a Viable Means So That We Can
Integrate Different Ways and Development in the Conservation in
California. In Magdalena ‑‑ They\'re Based upon the Fields in 1993 and
\'94. And in 1996 and 1997. Eco‑tourism Is Defined Here as Trips to See
and to Observe the Physical Areas and Also Any of the Areas Which Would
Promote the Conservation of the Environment. In Mexico, There Are
Organizations and the Government Is Being Used as a Way to Promote this
and to Protect the Environment and Also for the Local Peoples. But We
Still Do Not Understand Very Well the Development of Eco‑tourism to ‑‑
in Relation to the Conservation of Nature in Any Particular Context. In
Magdalena, the Gray Whale Is Concentrated There in Order to Reproduce
and to Nurse Throughout the Months of December to April Before They
Migrate Northbound, Before They Go and Feed in The Northern Seas. In the
Present ‑‑ These Species Which Have Mexican in Their Nature Have
Contributed to Their Popularity as Tourist Sites in Order to Be Able to
Conserve the Whales. The Laguna Integrates as Part of the Area of
Preservation Established in 1988 and Aside from That ‑‑ They Declared
this Area as a Cultural Heritage and Protected Area. Apparently, Some
Family Members Belonging to Fishermen Live Along These Sites. It Is
Located along Magdalena. They Work along the Fishermen ‑‑ along the
Fishing and Also in The Production of Fishing. These Are Ranches from
the Interior. As Such, They Learn to Fish During this Century. In the
\'70s and in the \'80s, They Increase the Populations of Fishes in Both
Areas When a Lot of Immigrants That Were Very Poor from ‑‑ Came to the
Peninsula Looking for Better Economic Prospects in Fishing. This
Resulted in the Overexploitation of Fisheries. Fishing Focused Toward
the Gray Whale Is Truly Recognized and Acknowledged and it Is Seen as
the Contributing Element That it Is for the Fishing. Tourism for the
Gray Whale Began in the 1970s and as Such, it Began to Be Dominated by
Foreign Companies. With Very Little Financial Benefits for the Majority
of the Local Inhabitants. In the \'70s, One Family from the Lagoon Began
to Take Tourists Arriving by Land to Their Fishing Lands to See the
Whales. There Was More Interest Which Was Generated in the Gray Whale.
And the Last Couple of Years, at Least Some of the Families and A
Tourist Corporation from St. Ignacio Was Formed. Those Two Groups Then
Began to Work Also on Taking Tourists out To See the Great Whales. The
Three Families in the Laguna Areas Either Were Born There or Have Worked
There for Many Years and Have Worked in the Fishing Area. These Families
Offer Their Services to the Tourists Which Arrive On Their Own Account
to the Lagoon. In 1990, the Mexican Government Began to Demand That the
Foreign Corporations Which Were Operating in the Lagoon St. Ignacio to
Employ the Fishermen ‑‑ the Mexican Fishermen in the Observation Of
These Tours. This Was a Decision Which Was Then Made by the Mexican
Government Prior to the Times in Which the Fishermen Would Go Out to See
the Whales. They Protested this Decision and They Asked the Government
Then To Come in and Do ‑‑ Offer a Different Solution. Even Though it Is
No Longer Forbidden to Fish During the Times Of the Season of the Great
Whale, the Mexican Government Knows Only Those People Living on the
Lagoons Can Receive the Permits To Go Observe the Great Whales. The
Corporations Which Have Begun to Employ the Local People Have Talked
about Benefits Which Were Not Anticipated about These Exploits. In
Mexico, a Lot of Inhabitants Lost Their Jobs. Which Was in 1988. Many of
Them Begin to Fish to Earn a Living. Many Began to Work as Guides in
Their Little Boats for Foreign Tourists Which Were Coming to See the
Gray Whales. These Boatsmen Then Began to Convert Themselves into More
of an Opportunistic Financial Position and Thus Creating More of a
Conflict. So, in Order to Be Able to Resolve this Conflict, There Was a
Group That Was Formed in Order to Control the Tourist Activity Of
Boating in the Season When the Wails Were Mating. Since this Was Formed
Nine Years Ago, the Club Has Grown from 12 To 34 Members and Has
Acquired a Legal Status as a Touristic Cooperative. Even More Recently,
Two More Groups, Local Ones, Have Been Formed. There Has Also Been Just
Recently Foreign Corporations Dealing In Tourism Began to Employ Some
Local Inhabitants. In \'94, with New Requirements Which the Boatsmen
Needed to Fulfill in Order to Observe the Great Whales and the Demands
for Tourism, the ‑‑ They Were Asking the Tourist Companies Begin to
Disperse and Distribute More of Their Beneficial Financial Benefits
Derived from These Activities. But Other Corporations Did Not Pay
Attention to the New Requirements. And They Continued to Operate Without
Employing the Local Inhabitants and Without Having the Permits to Go See
the Whales. In Ecological Terms, There Have Been Several Problems Which
Have Come Forth Which Have Been Associated with the Growth of Tourism,
Associated with the Whales. In the Last Couple of Years, There Has Been
an Inadequate Infrastructure for Tourism. Which Has Not Been Able to
Lessen the Impact of the Tourism upon The Fauna. And the Wildlife in
this Area. By Not Bringing in Too Many Tourists During this Time. But
with the Growth of the Gray Whale Tourism Project, There Is More
Pressure Even More upon the Services Which Are No Longer Adequate to
Deal with Human. This Situation Will Get Worse in the Future and Will
Result in The Pollution of the Natural Resources Which the Marine Life
Depends upon. And Also for the Public Service. Aside from That, We Also
Know What the Acceptable Levels of Tourism Is in Reference to the Gray
Whales. We Don\'t Otherwise Understand the Impact Long‑term in Reference
To this Behavior and the Mortality of the Gray Whale. Both the Laguna
St. Ignacio and Also Magdalena, There Is the Phenomenon of the Friendly
Whales Which Come Close to the Boats And Allow the Tourists to Touch
Them. Many Tourists Come to These Areas, Anticipating Such Encounters
And Demanding That the Boatsmen Find a Tame Whale to Such a Point That
They Can Become Bothersome to the Whales. There Can Be Found up to 12
Boats Around One Whale During the High Season or the High Time of
Tourism. Aside from That, the Luxury Liners That Come from the United
States Travel Through the Area That Is Mainly Known for the Reproductive
Area for the Whales. And the Mexican Officials That Promote this
Situation Do Not Believe That this Is Acceptable Given the Fact That it
Could Be Very Dangerous to the Eco‑systems and to the Whales. In
Financial Terms, There Have Been Several Problems Which Have Come to the
Forefront, Also. Both in St. Ignacio Laguna and in Magdalena, the Boats
and Tourist Campgrounds Are Controlled by Corporations Which Are Located
and Headquartered Outside of the Area. In Said Communities, There Are
Few Restaurants and Hotels and Telephones. Such Then this Results from a
Small Percentage of this Tourism Benefitting the Communities. In Laguna
St. Ignacio, the Foreign Corporations Generated Approximately \$8.3
Million Arising from Tourism in 1994. Although Between 50% and 65% of
That Was Spent in Mexico. Less than 1% Was Spent Directly on the
Communities from the Laguna St. Ignacio Hotel. Since There Are Very Few
Existing Alternatives to the Fishing, Except Tourism, the Majority of
the Inhabitants ‑‑ Continue Fishing for an Entire Year and Fishing Which
Are Overexploited. Some Begin to Create a ‑‑ Some Begin to Create a
Black Market. Others Do it Outright. For Example, the Sea Turtle. And
Certain Others ‑‑ Other Particular Sea Species. Others Continue to Fish
in the Sea Throughout the Gestation and Mating Period of the Whales.
Thus Incorporating and Representing a Potential Danger for the Whales to
Get Entangled in These Mates ‑‑ in These Nets. The Growth of Tourism Has
Promoted More Conflict and Tension in The Community and Each Time, More
Tourist Boats Are out on the Bay with the Whales. And as Such, in Order
to Generate More Financial Benefits, the Local People Can Affiliate with
Some but Not All of These Pressures and the Natural Resources in Both
Areas. They Have to Find Other Financial Alternatives in Order to
Diversify the Options in Order to Be Able to Earn a Living in Both
Places. A Positive Development in St. Ignacio Lagoon and ‑‑ Were the
Official Investigators That Were in Charge of the Research and
Supervision of the Gray Whale. In Ignacio Before 1984, There Were Few
Inhabitants Seen Within Any Particular Preserve Within the Biosphere.
Several from this Agency Came to the Bay That Year Throughout The Mating
Period of the Gray Whale to Observe Activities of the Humans Around this
Gestational Period. And to Speak Also with the Local Inhabitants and the
Foreign Corporations Concerning Their Concerns and the Impact on Tourism
And the Development of the Local Community. Also Recently, Various
Organizations That Are Ecological and Nongovernmental from Mexico and
from the United States Have Become Interested in Diversifying Funds and
Other Resources Among this Area Which Would Promote the Education
Environmentally and to Assist in Other Financial Alternatives. So Both
the Economic and Socioeconomic Situation Can Be Leveled Out Long Term.
Knowledge Has Been Increasing upon the Impact of the Ecological
Importance in Both Areas. And it Has Also Allowed Them to Take into
Consideration Their Opinions and Their Necessities and Their Needs in
the Administration of the Reserves. In Conclusion, While Eco‑tourism May
Appear to Be Very Attractive as a Way in Order to Litigate this Area, in
Practice Is it ‑‑ it Is Very Problematic. In Magdalena, There Has to Be
Established a New Alliance Between The Inhabitants Locally, the Business
Men and the Mexican Government and the Ongs in Order to Be Able to
Generate Rural Benefits to Local Communities to Ensure the Protection of
Sea Mammals and Their Habitats. This Should Comprise a ‑‑ Communication
Between Everyone Involved So They Can Conduct the Preservation of the
Environment And Also Be Able to Talk about the Beneficial Financial
Benefits Of this. An Alliance Between the Community and the Fishermen
Shall Be the Base Then to Give Us the Information about the Sea Mammals
and Also the Local Peoples. In Order to Be Able to Fuse Theory with
Practice, a Better Evaluation of the Needs and the Perfective ‑‑ the
Perspective of The Peoples about All the Outside Groups Is Essential in
Order To Guarantee the Future Protection of the Natural Resources in The
Seas. We of a to Acknowledge That the Base for the Preservation for The
Environment Is Communication.

Cardenas: We Thank Dr. Young for Preparing this Presentation. And for
Her Video That Was Very Well Done and Very Interesting. It\'s an
Interesting Perspective. All the Comments That Were Made Have Been Very,
Very Good Because They Help Us to Understand the Topic a Little Better.
Our next Panelist Is Liddie Martinez. She Will Speak about How to
Diminish the Effects of Eco‑tourism.

Martinez: Thank You. An International Project Has Been Established Three
Years Ago by The Park Service of the United States. The Office of
Mexican Affairs and the National Institute of Anthropology and History
‑‑ the Bureau of Land Management and The University. This Form Allowed
Colleagues from Mexico and the United States To Share Information,
Historical Information Concerning the Hispanic Culture. The Development
of the Project Throughout the Last Three Years Included the Arts, Music,
Youth, the Ideas from the Communities, Panoramic Views and Historical
Sites. The Impact of the Project Is Effective for the Communities upon
Social, Cultural and Economic Aspects. This Is Because the Number of
Visitors Is Small and it Is Not Intrusive upon the Hosting Communities.
Also, as a Benefit Is the Educational and Cultural Experience by The
Visitor to Sites Which Are Not Commonly Visited by Tourists. These
Special and Unique Sites Include Labors, Waterways, Homes And Local
Artist Workshops. Even Though the Financial Benefit for the Community Is
Not Very High, However, When it Is Managed Through a Media Information
Which Is Public and Managed Through Eco‑touristic Methods, the Impacts
Are Minimized, Especially Those Elements Which Are Social, Cultural and
Environmental in Their Nature. This Is True Because the Tourists Form a
Constant Flow When They Travel to Small Communities. The International
Committee Is Currently Working to Expand the Program Including the
International Program of Youth Interchange. Among Both Countries. Under
Our Plans, the Annual Conference \[ Speaking Spanish \] Is Hosted by
Communities in Both Countries. So in Reality, We Are Re‑establishing the
Footprints of the Historical past. At the Same Time, this Serves as a
Method of Economic Interchange. This Project Could Not Have Been ‑‑
Without the Collaboration Among Universities, Governmental Agencies,
Nongovernmental Agencies, Churches and Other Interested Groups in Both
Countries. These Groups, Cooperative Groups, Have the Ability to Enforce
Their Limited Resources and to Share the Responsibilities in Realizing
‑‑ in Reference to the Obstacles. It Is Our Desire That New Projects and
Programs Can Be Developed Through These Interchanges and That They Be
Expanded and Reinforced. The Local Committee in Mexico for the Fourth
International Symposium of \[ Speaking Spanish \] Has the Good Fortune
to Have Been Supported by Our Municipal ‑‑ And Also Our County
Commission and Also from the State Agencies, The Federal and
International Agencies. And We Have Experimented with Each Symposium.
Each One Having More Participation and Perhaps More Support Among
Individuals and Organizations. Last Month, Our Committee, the Fourth
Symposium, Traveled to Durango, Mexico, to Participate in the Third
Symposium. We Traveled Using a Bus. Throughout ‑‑ During Those Days of
Travel, We Came Through ‑‑ Which Was the First Site of the Symposium
Where They Received Us In Their Different Homes by Different Families.
We Visited Historical Temples. We Walked along Historical Paths Built of
Rugs. There, the Waterways Run Underneath the Homes. Also, We Ate Nuts
During the Nut Festival. It Is a Festival Which Is Celebrated to
Celebrate the Harvest. We Heard Music Which Our Ancestors Would Share
with Us When We Were Children and We Danced until Morning into the
Daylight of The next Day. When We Continued with Our Trip, We Did Not
Leave Behind Any Physical Signs. However, the Impact Being Cultural and
Social upon Each and Every One of Us Will Follow Us to Our Last Days.
This Is the Content of Eco‑tourism. Our Countries Have Struggled to
Establish an Equilibrium among The Conservation of Our Natural Resources
and Our Cultural Heritage with the Economic Elements. However, it Is
Necessary to Acknowledge the Negative Effect That Tourism Can Have upon
the Peoples in the Local Communities. But We Would Focus upon Our Goals,
upon the Benefits That We Can Enjoy from These Touristic Activities. In
My Original State of New Mexico, We Have Come to Acknowledge The
Touristic Benefits Which Are Based upon Tourism to the Indigenous Towns.
In Indians and Mexicans. Although Many Benefits Can Be Realized Through
Tourism, We Still Have the Challenge of Maintaining a Balance Between
Tourism and The Rights of Our Peoples.

Cardenas: Very Good. Thank You for Your Comments Liddie. We\'re Going to
Continue with the Other Members of the Panel. We Have with a Queen
Murietta. With a Queen, Do You Have Something for Us?

Murietta: Yes, Raul. Something Very Interesting That Liddie Mentioned
with Regard to The Links That Are Being Created Through Their Program. I
Think it Is Very Important How Border Cultures Are Linking up Between
Themselves and this Is Something That We Don\'t Also See On the News.
It\'s Something We Don\'t Always See in Daily Life. I Think this Is
Something That We Should Focus upon Because It\'s Very Important.
Regarding How Several Cultures Are Sharing Natural Resources. I Think
this Is Related to Our Activity in Sonora. I Want to Clear Something
out. I Do Work with Son Our an Institute Which Is a Community‑based ‑‑
Sonoran Institute Which Is a Community‑based Organization in Arizona.
I\'m Student from Mexico. I\'m Seeing the Flag from the United States
and That\'s Fine but I Am from Mexico. I Am Working and Studying Here in
the United States Currently. Sonora ‑‑ Before Anything Else, the Sonoran
Institute, We Undertook Several ‑‑ We Undertook Several Seminars. We\'ve
Been Talking about the Border Territories. We\'re Going to Show You a
Map Here. And Show You Where We Are Working. This Is the Area to the
West of Tucson, the Border Area Between Sonoran, Arizona, Where We Find
Several Protected Areas with Different Levels of Production. ‑‑ of
Protection. Whether They Be State or Federal in Nature. In Mexico, We
Have the Pinacate Reserve. In Arizona, We Also Have the Organ Pipe
Reserves. The Goldwater Firing Range as Well as the Tohona Nations.
We\'re Talking about Three Different Cultures, Three Different Nations
That Are Sharing the Same Nature Resource, this Natural Resource Is the
Sonoran Desert. Once Again, These Are Cultures That Are ‑‑ These Are
Cross Border Cultures. Many Times We Don\'t Know How to Identify Whether
or Not We\'re in Mexico or the United States. Basically Because the
People That Live in Those Regions Are Sharing Those Natural Resources
and We Are Sharing That Same Culture. Anyway, We Have Organized Several
Research Studies with Regard To Sustainable Activities Surrounding
Eco‑tourism, Recycling ‑‑ Recyclable Materials and Why Are We Doing
this? Well, Many Times When We Develop Protected Areas, We Don\'t Take
Into Account the Communities That Live Within or Close to the Protected
Areas. When We Declare Them as Such, There Are Many Restrictions. And
among Them, the Traditional Use That the Communities Have Made a Point
of Using These Regions for. These Apply To, for Example, the Fishing
Industry and Many of These Issues Were Not Addressed When the
Limitations Were Imposed. And ‑‑ but That Isn\'t the Only Alternative.
There Are Others. That\'s Where the Integration of the Human Dimensions
in Resource Management Which Is the Specialty That We\'re Working
Currently. The Sonoran Route Is Interesting Because of the Three Nations
That Are Involved in this Association. It\'s a Regional Effort. We\'re
Not Involved in One or Two or Three Communities. We\'re Involved with
Various Communities Because Each One of Those Communities Has a Unique
Characteristic. They Have Their Own Resources. They Have Their Own
Cultures. Eco‑tourism Is Linking Us up in Order to Manage These
Activities. Once Again, this Is a Regional Effort Between Arizona and
Sonora. We Are Linking These Protected Areas. We\'re Within Their
Management Plans. There Is an Organizing Committee on the Part of the
Communities Which Is Very Porch. How the Communities Participate in the
Making of Decisions and In the Identification of Priorities for Them.
Through this Sonora Route, We\'re Creating a Binational Partnership
Where Within the Partnership, We Currently Have Other ‑‑ Hotel
Operators, Mayors, Local Guides, Tourist Guides. This Will Work as
Membership of Sorts. There Will Be Certain Levels of Membership. Those
Memberships, What Is Important Is That a Percentage of Those Financial
Resources Will Be Funding the Management of the Resources. As I
Mentioned Before, We Talked about People and Communities But Nobody
Talks about the Natural Resources. What Happens to the Limits of the
Resources. We Have to Recognize Those Limits. We must Recognize the
Cultural Limits. For Example, in the Tohono Nation, There Are Places
Where They Don\'t Want Any Tourists There and We must Respect That Also.
That\'s Part of Their Culture. It\'s Part of the Respect We must Have
Towards Them. Within That, There Is a Code of Conduct We\'re Developing
‑‑ the Training or the Understanding of These Limitations. The Benefits
That the Resources Offer. Within All of this Is Through the Memberships
and These Partnerships, Once Again, There Is a Percent a ‑‑ Percentage
That Is Directed Towards the Management in Many Areas We Don\'t Have a
Budget for the Management of Those Areas. Where Is the Money Coming
from? There Is No National or State Policies for Handling Those
Protected Areas. It Looks Good on Paper but the Reality Is Different. In
Mexico, the Thing Is Changing Currently Especially with the Biosphere
Reserve Program. Which Is Sponsored by the United Nations. It\'s Also
Through the Biosphere Program. Also a National Program That Has Been
Widely Accepted All over The Country. It Covers about 17 Biosphere
Reserves. Also, for Us, We Were Talking about Educational Process. It\'s
True. It Is an Educational Process. Not Just for the Local Communities.
Many Times this Education must Be Directed Towards the Decision Makers.
Such as the Politicians Who Are Making Those Decisions or Developing
Those Kinds of Programs. Many Times, the Community Is Well Educated but
the Programs Come From Somewhere Else. So, the Education must Be
Completely Integrated. Not Just for the Communities but for Everybody.
That Was Just What I Wanted to Say. We\'re Working with the Sonora
Route. It Is Eco‑tourism Association. That Will Link Different
Activities, Tourist Guides, Hotel Managers, Protected Area
Administrators and this Will Take Time. It Takes a Lot of Time. And Just
to Finish, I Want to Clear up That Within the World Eco‑tourism, Eco‑ ‑‑
Eco Means Ecology, Not Economy.

Cardenas: Thank You Very Much. The next Project We\'re Going to Listen
to the next Project. Perhaps We\'ll Listen to Some of the Projects
Previously. We\'re Going to See a Video Now Which Dr. Jaime Barquero
from Universidad Knick Waugh ‑‑ Nicaragua Will ‑‑ I Think We\'re Going
To Begin First with Jorge Then See the Video. I\'m Sorry.

Yes, Thank You. In Reference to My Presentation, I\'m a Student in the
University Of Autonoma De Chihuahua. I Work on this Program Which Is
Developed in Reference to the Human Race and Also Work with the
Governments in Canada and Mexico. Which Becomes a Civil Coalition and
Several Institutions Are Working on Development Projects, Financial and
Alternative, Also, Which Would Allow Then to ‑‑ Allow Them to Reforest
the Lands. And Also ‑‑ and Areas Are Approximately 110 Hectares in the
Area. And Also Working in Conjunction with Other Agencies. And it Is
Very Important Because in Our State of Chihuahua, Our Cultural Heritage
Is Extremely Important. Within the Institutions That Are Participating
in the Universities, So, for Example, They Have Been Able to Increase
The Student Participation in the Programs Which Are International in
Nature. For Them Also in Reference to Eco‑tourism, They\'re Working on
The Community Eco‑tourism Project. At the Same Time, Counseling Them in
the Management of Their Resources. Allowing Them to Acknowledge Those
Resources Which They Could Promote and See What Other Alternatives They
May Have Even at The International Level Whereby They Can Also See the
Importance Of Let\'s Say the Forest and the Reforestation of the Woods
in Order to Be Able to Promote a Better Quality of Life Which, Before,
Perhaps Was Not Reflected in the Way That They Were Taking Advantage of
the Resources Before. They Can Now Count up How These Projects ‑‑ So, in
this Way, Working it this Way, They\'re Coordinating Other ‑‑ with Other
Institutions and Organizations That Are Nongovernmental. Like
Nongovernmental Agencies and in Reference to the Eco‑tourism, I\'ve Had
the Opportunity to Work with People from The Communities and One of the
Areas Which Has Been Impacted, The Area Which Where We\'re Comparing
Other Communities Which Have Been Working with the ‑‑ Attempting to
Improve Their Touristic Resources. From the Point of View of the Tourism
and to Also Have the Opportunity and Have it Been Promoted by Other
Corporations, to Provide Tourism. And Comparing Them on the Other
Communities, Also. To Be Able to Observe the Changes and after Four
Years on the Project, We\'ve Been Able to Observe Something Extremely
Interesting Which Is Working with These Projects from the Point Of View
of the Sustainable Point of View. Is That it Is Basic. That We Work
Directly with the Communities. That the Very Communities Be the Ones
Decide Whether They\'re Interested in the Project or Not. And That They
Themselves Work on the Project That the Project Becomes Theirs and this
Is Extremely Important for Them to Be Able to Reach a Level of
Sustainability in Order to Manage and To Conserve Their Natural
Resources. And Also There\'s Another Topic That We Can Touch upon. Which
Is the Change in Attitude. Among the Communities. The Indigenous
Communities ‑‑ We Have Been Able to Notice Throughout That Time Period
and Through the Counseling, Through The Communities That it Is Important
That We Do Not Become Distant or We Do Not Become Removed from the
Investigators, the Researchers and All Those Whose Work Which Is ‑‑ and
When the Alternatives Are Promoted Forward, That this Be Accepted and
Allow Them to Incorporate it and to Continue Giving Them the Consulting
‑‑ it Is a Very Important Point That Needs to Be Managed and Has Been
Promoted Throughout this Entire Side. As a Student in Reference to the
Career of Eco‑tourism, the Impact That We\'re Having Is That We Find it
Is Extremely Important Is the Institutions That Are Creating Careers in
the Environmental Field in the Ecology Shall Channel the Students in
Particular in Both Projects. This Is Something the Same Institutions
must Recognize That Not Just Because of Going to Classes and Being in
School and Receiving Information. But Also That It\'s Also Part of the
Bridging Between the Information Received and What the Professional
Preparation Is. And I Believe That this Program Between Mexico and
Canada in Association Is One of the Associations in Mexico That Has
Promoted the Student Participation to a Great Extent and They Continue
to Offer Those Alternatives to Participation So It\'s Something That Is
Very Interesting. And the Results of the Works Particular to What Refers
to \[ Speaking Spanish \] In Eco‑tourism Has Yielded a Positive Result
‑‑ in the Community, They Have Accepted the Project and They Themselves
Are Working on It. They Are Perceiving Economic Benefits and They Are
Seeing Results. This Is Very Interesting. They Themselves Have Seen the
Passage of Time, They\'re Realizing That Also Something That must Be
Considered in These Work Projects with These Indigenous Communities. And
as Long as a Community Is Not Organized or an Institution Is Not
Organized, We Will Never Achieve Anything with Regards to The
Sustainable.

Cardenas: Excellent Comments, Jorge. Thank You. We Have Some Time to
Answer a Call That Comes from Cynthia in Baja, California. Good Morning.

Caller: this Is for Mr. Ricardo. I Would like to Know as a Student from
Mexico ‑‑ How We Can Work In to Getting into the Program for Student
Ambassador and Who Do We Have to Contact in Order to Get Information
about That?

Anaya: Well, Maybe One of Our Panelists Can Answer That. This Program Is
Closely Linked to the Congress ‑‑ the Conference That\'s Currently under
Way. So Then the Most Feasible Thing Is for You to Contact the Address
That Is on the Screen for HACU. Do You Have it There? I\'m Also Inviting
You to Involve Your University in Perhaps Joining HACU. Because One of
the Ways ‑‑ Participating in Our Congresss Is at The Institutional
Level. That There Be a Certain Continuity.

Caller: Can We Participate?

Flores: of Course. Please Contact Us at Our Office. We\'ll Provide You
with the Information.

Caller: Thank You Very Much.

Flores: Thank You for Your Call.

Cardenas: We Have a Presentation on Eco‑tourism. Let\'s Go to the Video.

Nicaragua, in this New Phase of Peace and Democracy, Is Willing to
Develop Eco‑tourism. During These Last Few Years, the Country Has Been
Creating the Conditions to Make of the Nation Not Just Destination for
Tourists but an Enjoyable Pleasure by Offering the Marvels by Nature.
That Are Handled or That Are Manifested Through Their Mountain Ranges,
Their Lakes. Their Volcanos, Their Coastlines and Their Forests. At this
Time, the Third Largest Source of Revenue in this Country Is
Concentrated in These Tourism ‑‑ in this Tourism Industry and in a
Certain Part, in the Eco‑tourism Sector, the Country Offers Through the
Various Panoramic Sceneries and the Diverse Nature That it Has. Few
Countries Present in Such a Short Time, So Many Attractive Natural
Sights That Nature Manifests in Which Nature Manifests Its Beauties. We
Have Two Very Wide Coastlines. One on the Pacific Ocean and One in the
Caribbean Sea. It Is Laced with Extensive Beaches. Very Impressive
Estuaries. We Have Coastal Lagoons. We Have a Certain Number of Nature
Alternatives That Surround Those Areas. We Have Two Very Large Lakes and
Smaller Volcanic Lagoons. They Also Lent Themselves Not Just to the
Scenic Observation of Its Panoramas but Also to Other Activities Such as
Fishing, Sailing, and Other Forms of Recreation. There Is a Line of
Volcanos. Some of Them with Spectacular Activities. Affiliated with
Them. That Really Produce Pyrotechnic Displays. When These Phenomena
Display Themselves During the Evenings. In Fact, We Even Have a Volcano
That Is Continuously Active. It\'s a ‑‑ It\'s Passive Activity That
Offers Observational Pleasures to Anyone Who Was Interested in Watching
the Smoldering Lava and the Entire Fascinating Nature That Surrounds
This Volcano. We Have in the Islands, a Situation That Model Paradise
Through These Tropical Regions That Are Filled with Greenery. One of the
Islands ‑‑ the Island, Which Is the Largest One, We Have Two of These
Volcanos. We Have Small Villages There Are Very Attractive and
Hospitable That Have Been Preparing Themselves Through These Recent
Years To Receive Growing Flow of Tourists. The Extreme Region of the
Nicaragua Lake, We Have the San Juan Region That Encounters the
Caribbean Sea. Part of That River, the Jungle Inundates the Coastlines.
It Is a Tropical Jungle. Practically Pristine in Nature. Practically
Virgin. Unvisited. Where There Is a Tremendous Amount of Biodiversity in
Terms of Its Botanical and Zoo Logic Composition That in Fact, Offers
Rivers That Penetrate the Heart of the Jungle Where Several of The
Natural Beauties Can Be Explored, Many of Them Untouched in This Jungle
Region. I Would like to State That Within That Potential, Nicaragua Has
Created an Entire System of National Parks of Biological Reserves and
Wildlife Sanctuaries in Order to Manifest the Rich Biodiversity That the
Country Enjoys. We Have, for Example, on the Pacific, Two Sanctuaries
That Protect the Massive Nesting of Sea Turtles. This Is a Truly
Spectacular Events. On Certain Nights in the Months of August an
December, You Can See Thousands of Sea Turtles Simultaneously Emerge
from the Ocean Waves in Order to Deposit Their Eggs on the Beach Not
Wider than One Kilometer. This Is Really an Impressive ‑‑ this Is
Impressive to Observe This Phenomena We Can See on Those Beaches.
Phenomena That Is Very Rare. We Have Two Extensive Reserves That Cover
Wetlands and Tropical Jungles. One Reserve in the Northern Portion of
the Country That Limits Itself with Honduras. Which Is a Conglomerate of
Extremely Exuberant Vegetation with Mountainous Panoramas and Caverns
and Perhaps as an Important Value, They Have Protected These Jungles.
They Have Lived off the Products of this Jungle. They Have Developed an
Entire Culture. On the Southern Portion, We Have the Other Reserve Which
Is One Of the Most Important Zones in Terms of the Amount of Rain. Few
Places on this Continent Are as Rainy as That Region. And That, Instead
of Being a Disadvantage, it Is a Great Advantage Because the Rivers Are
Very Sailable and it Also Favors the Presence of an Enormous Amount of
Species. I Don\'t Think it Would Be Too Daring to Say That Only a Few
Acres of this Reserve ‑‑ There Are More Butterflies or Foul than Any
That Can Be Found in the Entire European Continent in its Totality. We
Also Have Some Natural Reserves in the Summit of Some Natural Volcanos
That Are Extinct. And That Represent a Special Oasis Protection Sites
for Species That Are Completely Endemic to the Area That Seek Refuge in
Those Mountainous Ranges. So, in a Similar Fashion, We Can List a Number
of Things That Nicaragua Can Offer to the Tourist in this Industry. I
Would like to Say That Nicaragua Through the Tourism Ministry And
Through the Resource ‑‑ Through the Natural Resource Ministry, We\'re
Working Very Hard to Add Value to These Sites And to Create Stimulus for
the Private Sector to Be Able to Develop the Proper Infrastructure That
Is Needed So That Eco‑tourism in Nicaragua Be an Activity That Not Only
Yields Revenue from the Standpoint of the Citizens of this Country with
You Enjoyable on the Part of the Visitors.

Cardenas: Thank You Very Much to Dr. Barquero for His Presentation. We
Have a Question Here That We Got via Fax from Pueblo, Colorado from the
University of Southern Colorado from Steven. For All the Panelists it
Says There. I Do Understand We Need to Address Natural Resource
Management At All Levels. However, I\'m Concerned We\'re Not Focusing on
Root Problems Including a Lack of Economic Systems. The Complicated Test
of Developing Sustainable Tourism, How Are You or Are You Integrating
Solutions? Who Wants to Answer First? Jorge In?

My Opinion Concerning this Question Is in Reference to That Every Time
That We\'re Having a Population ‑‑ an Accelerated Population Growth, the
Environment Is Also Growing. We Control ‑‑ to Control this Growth, but
When the Population in General Is Growing, There Is a Demand for
Recreational Areas. And to Take into Consideration the Point of View
from Tourism, The Very Same Demand Has Generated That There Be Problems
in These Resources That If They\'re Giving Programs or Projects for
These Tourists, in Such a Way That this ‑‑ I Would Recommend Programs
for Touristic Development Programs. First of All, No Which Is the
Resource Which We Are Going to ‑‑ Know Who Are Going to Be Involved in
That Project. Whether They Are Communities That Are Indigenous to the
Area. Communities Whether They\'re Mixed Community like There Are
Existing in Mexico Quite a Bit of Them. Because from this Point of View
and from a Tourist Point of View, There Are Communities Which ‑‑ There
Are Communities Which Promote Their Own Natural Resources but They
Respect ‑‑ You Need To Respect Those Areas That Culture Only If These
Indigenous Groups and Communities Really Want to Have These Promoted.
Because There Are Cases Where There Are Some Communities Do Not, For
Example, the Indigenous Communities, Don\'t Want Pictures ‑‑ Don\'t like
to Have Their Pictures to Be Taken or to Take Them on Videos or Tapes.
And That Is a Respect Towards the Culture Which must Be Taken Into
Account When They Develop Their Projects. The Other Problems That Arise
in These Projects Is That Knowing The Resources of the Species Which
Exist There in the Flora and Fauna There and Those Which Also Offer or
Represent an Enrichment in That Area. Because There Could Be Native
Species That Could Be Endangered In That Area. And in Reference to the
Fauna and the Flora, There Are Some Species That Have the Ability to
Migrate or That May Be Necessary to Move Them out of There. And Generate
Them in Another Area. So That Should Basically Answer That. Now, in
Reference to the Fauna ‑‑ I\'m Sorry, It\'s Flora. Sometimes a Tourist
Deprives Them of the Same. It Is Important That They Respect the
Cultures and That They Carry on Investigations Short‑term and Long‑term
That Is They Must Need to Monitor the Environmental and the Ecological
Impact.

Martinez: When the Small Communities Want to Create a Plan For Tourism,
There Are Ways That You Can Come in and Control the Effects. What They
Have to Do Is Ask for Help. There Are Many, Many Agencies Outside of the
United States and Internationally Which Help to Put Together a Plan So
That They Can Continue to Move Forward Towards the Preservation and the
Conservation of the Flora and Fauna There.

Murietta: Responding to the Concerns Steve Had in Colorado. I Think You
Were Talking about the Social Accosts of Certain Activity, in this Case,
Eco‑tourism. We\'re Not Talking about Natural Resource but about the
Economic Impact or How to Pressure That ‑‑ How to Measure That Either
Negative or Positive Impact on the Environment. First, We Have to Define
the Resource. We must Define the Limitation of That Resource. But
Something That Is Already Been Well Researched but Low to Integrate That
Limitation with the Financial Limitations That Communities Can on Sorb.
That Is a Bridge That Many Times ‑‑ That Can Absorb. That Is a Bridge
That Is Ignored by Us or Many Times We Don\'t Have the Tools. This Is a
Challenge for Us in the Academic Institutions to Form Those Links of the
Natural Resource with the True Cost of All The Economic Activities and
by True Cost, I\'m Referring to Social Cost. What Is the True Cost of
That Activity. And We Can Apply Numbers to That Type of Activities. We
Are Working at the Grass Root Level on That. With Regards to the
Limitations of Resources. Another Important Point Is Who Are the
Eco‑tourists? These Are the Visitors That Come from the Sectors. These
Are the Visitors Where We\'re Perceiving the Growth. Perhaps We Should
Focus on the Management of the People. It\'s a Social Problem That Is
Linked to Natural Resources. The Importance of the Human Dimensions with
Regard to the Dependence on Human Resources.

Cardenas: Very Good. I\'m Told We Have a Little Time to Talk about the
Projects That We Have Mentioned. And I Hope That the Question Will Be
Answered or Was Answered. Let\'s Talk a Little Bit about the Programs
That You Are Working On. Are There Any Questions?

Murietta: I Have a Specific Question for Liddie. These Seminars Are Very
Interesting to Me. When Is the next Date for the next Event? You
Mentioned a Third Seminar Coming Up. How Can We Participate?

Martinez: this Symposium Is Going to Be in Spanish in New Mexico in the
‑‑ \[ Speaking Spanish \] They Already Have Some Ideas about What
They\'re Going to Present. If They Wanted More Information, You Could
Call the Center ‑‑ Center. 505‑852‑4669. And It\'s from the 9th to the
12th of July. But Because We\'re Going to Celebrate the 4th Anniversary
and All Of this Begins in January. You Can Grab the Calendar. All You
Have to Do Is Call the Center. They Can Provide You with It. They Can
Tell You When the Events Will Take Place and What You Have to Do to
Present or to Participate.

Murietta: the Event Is Binational?

Martinez: Yes.

Cardenas: Any Other Comment Regarding What We\'re Talking About?

Flores: I Wanted to Reflect on What the Panelist Has Talked About So Far
and the Questions That Have Arisen. I Believe That the Questions Have a
Subtopic That Supersede the General Topic. And I Wanted to Talk about a
Point That Mr. Murietta Talked About. It Is Important in Many Countries,
Especially Latin‑american Countries, There Is an Overconcentration of
the Demographic Character in the Large Urban Centers. This Is Causing a
Series of Ecological Unbalances. So at the ‑‑ Governments must Pay Great
Attention to the Decentralization Question. Not Only in Terms of
Population but Also in Economic Terms. Work Centers, Industries, of
Course Government Establishments That must Be Decentralized Because
Otherwise, the World Would Be At Least in the Latin‑american Context,
Would Be Directed Towards an Overconcentration That Would Be
Unmanageable Such as Mexico City and Other Large Population Centers in
Latin America.

Cardenas: the Question That I Have Perhaps Is What Is the Government\'s
Role in All of These Projects? Because it Seems to Me like There\'s a
Lot of People Volunteering Their Services. What Should the Government\'s
Role Be?

Murietta: That\'s a Good Question. For Example, in Mexico, the
Government\'s Role Has Been to Establish Protected Areas as a Beginning.
Afterwards, We must Have the Management Programs of Those Areas Within
Those Management Programs. We Need to Implement Human and Economic
Activities That Will Stimulate the Political Attitude to Develop
Sustainable Programs That Will Benefit the Ecology. Many Times it Is
True We\'re Working by Ourselves as Nongovernment Organizations but the
Government Is Opening Itself Up for Activities at That Time. And We Also
Have ‑‑ Have a Responsibility as an Ngo to Support Our Governments.

Cardenas: Well, Thank You. I Guess We\'re Running out of Time. I Wan to
Thank All of You. I Want to Tell You That the Projects Are Very
Interesting. And I Hope That You Achieve All the Success You\'re Looking
for In the Future. I Would like to Ask Dr. Flores Just to Finish, If He
Could Give Us Just a Few Parting Words. Dr. Flores?

Flores: with Great Pleasure, Dr. Cardenas. First I Would like to Thank
Dr. Cardenas for Moderating this Panel So Ably. And Also, All the
Participants That ‑‑ for All Their Excellent Contributions. Of Course
the Technical Staff Who Are Responsible for the Production of this
Program. Once Again, I Want to Reiterate the Commitment That HACU Has as
An Association, Now an International Association Towards the Topic of
the Conference That this Year, of Course, Is Partnerships Without
Borders. We Want to Emphasize, Once Again, That the Americas Are United.
Share Ecological Systems as Much Cultures. From the Ecological Side, We
Have Talked a Lot about Those Systems. From the Cultural Aspect, We Know
Perfectly That the Pre‑hispanic Dimension, We All Share on this
Continent, the Beautiful Tradition Inherited to Us by Our Predecessors.
Of Course, We Also Have the Hispanic Culture So We\'re Linked to Various
Aspects. And in That Spirit, HACU Will Reiterate its Commitment to
Continue its Programs Without Borders with Institution and Students
Within the United States and of Course Between the Institutions That Are
Members of HACU and Loced in the Caribbean. Thank You Very Much.

Cardenas: Well, this Concludes Our Interactive Conference. Via
Satellite. In Conjunction with the Second International Conference on
Natural Resources and Cultural Heritage. For More Information Regarding
the Hispanic Association of Colleges and Universities, Contact HACU\'s
Main Office in San Antonio, Texas at 210‑692‑3805. I Would like to
Mention to Our Viewers That the Bureau of Land Management in the U.S.
Has Prepared Two Technical Publications In Spanish That Are an Excellent
Source of Information for the Evaluation and Management of Riparian
Areas. In Order to Obtain a Copy, Please Contact the Department of the
Interior of the United States. Via Land Service Center. P.O. Box 25047.
Denver, Colorado. 80225‑0047. On Behalf of HACU, I Would like to Thank
All Our Panelists on Today\'s Program for Their Participation. Through
Our International Partners in Brazil, Nicaragua, Mexico, Chile and the
United States Who Prepared Video Segments for Our Telecast. Most
Importantly, HACU Wants to Thank All of Our Viewers Who Participated in
this Program. Thank You for Being with Us. \[ Speaking Spanish \]