**NASA**

**March 16, 2004**

**1:00 p.m. CST**

> Coordinator I just want to remind all participants this conference is
> being recorded. If you have any objections, you may disconnect at this
> time.
>
> Anita Hello, I'm sorry for the mix-up that the conferencing center
> had, but its straightened out now, so thanks for hanging in there. To
> continue the conversation we were having before starting the
> recording, Steve Bridges has just joined us and he is our Audio-Visual
> Manager at JPL; and he of any of us here, knows the most about NASA TV
> going digital. Steve, we're recording this because then we get a
> transcript. You're giving information to a lot of museums, like 100
> museums or more, so tell us.
>
> M All of us have gotten the information that says, "Write in and give
> us your e-mail if you want to know about going digital," but beyond
> that we've heard zero. The question I had was involving what formats
> are being considered or whatever, because there are different digital
> formats that people use via satellite.
>
> Eric I'm sorry; I'm joining late. This is Eric deJong. What is this in
> regard to, this question?
>
> Anita Steve Bridges is on the line, Eric, and he's going to talk to us
> about NASA TV going digital. Steve, jump in.
>
> Steve Okay. Basically, NASA TV is going digital. It's going to be four
> channels that are going to be broadcast down on it and the satellite
> has not been determined, which transponder, but it's probably going to
> be a C-band transponder. It will be digital data, so what you'll have
> to have, basically, for lack of anything else, is a set top converter
> that can receive one of the four signals. You can choose which one of
> the four you get, and they have not even determined how they're going
> to do the programming. And problem one, one of them is going to be
> encoded, so it's mainly from \[NASA\] Center to \[NASA\] Center.
> Another one is going to be for news media. The other one is going to
> be for educational purposes and the fourth one, I have no idea what
> they're going to use it for; but they just were doing the technology
> to get four channels of digital down, still at broadcast quality.
>
> Eric Are they continuing to support the analog, as well or is the
> shift over hard? Maybe, you might want to give the dates. I know what
> they are, but for other peoples' edification.
>
> Steve No, the analog system will continue until they're satisfied that
> it's time to change it over and they probably won't change it over
> until after the shuttle gets back operational.
>
> Eric The set top boxes, could you give an indication of what their
> cost will be for people and if they have a choice of manufacturers?
>
> Steve I don't know the choice of manufacturers, but I do know they're
> using the most common systems that are out there, and we've heard the
> range anywhere from viewing-only quality to broadcast is from about
> \$400 to \$1,000 a box.
>
> Jack Dunn This sounds different from, for instance, I have 4DTV. Are
> you familiar with that?
>
> Steve No, I am not.
>
> Jack Dunn That's digital. It was originally a General instrument, but
> they're using it. They've got several hundred channels up there and
> you can get a C-band receiver, which has the 4DTV built in, which does
> the conversion to pick up the digital channels. My question is, what
> I'm suspecting, what it sounds like is that may be different than the
> 4DTV system, because I also know of some satellite providers that are
> using some other kinds of digital scrambling systems.
>
> Steve Right. I'm not positive on it because Rodney at \[NASA\]
> Marshall is the prime guy on this thing and they're still working out
> kinks, so that's why I don't think you've gotten anything back yet
> because nothing is in concrete. The system is mainly what broadcasters
> use to transmit their stuff to each other internally from one system
> to another. It is encoded, but also, it can be set for being in the
> clear, so anybody with a receiver can receive it.
>
> Kris This is Kris in Iowa. Do I understand correctly, and perhaps this
> is a little bit too technical for this discussion, we've got a
> standard analog dish with the LNB feed down to the receiver. Is all of
> that stuff still useable and you just have another unit, another
> receiver, or do you have to change out the LNB that's sitting out on
> the dish, as well?
>
> Steve I think the LNB that you have and everything up to the point is
> probably the same. They're probably ... change out your receiver or
> not. I don't know that detail, but I know that your dish would be
> fine. It's just getting digital data. I think there are receivers that
> pass it on, anything that's digital passes on to maybe a decoder box.
>
> Jack I can tell you there are some ETV channels, PBS channels, and
> they're on the 4DTV; but I also know, because I'm in involved with a
> service called SCOLA that goes to a bunch of universities, and they're
> using a different box, but again, the boxes all come after your
> standard LNB and standard receiver. It's just an add-on.
>
> M I know currently at home, I've got DISH network and they're carrying
> NASA TV. Any thoughts as to how that affects them?
>
> Steve The only thing is that they're going to have to install a
> decoding box, too, before they put it out in their final chain, but I
> don't think \$1,000 is going to hurt DISH network.
>
> M They cancelled a whole bunch of stations last week for a day.
>
> Steve That's a one-time cost for them and they probably have other
> stuff. Maybe the small "Ma and Pa" cable stations may be hurting.
>
> Eric Is there any provision after the tenures of discussion for one of
> the four channels to handle HDTV?
>
> Steve To go HD? Right now, they've put that as part of the package,
> but it's not going to be implemented because of cost until HD gets a
> little more firm.
>
> Eric Could you repeat that?
>
> Steve They've considered it. It's part of their engineering, but they
> are not going to implement it because it's an added cost and right
> now, they're just going to go with standard.
>
> Eric Do they have a date at which time they would reconsider the HD
> version?
>
> Steve No, not that I know of.
>
> Eric I just thought I'd check because it would be yet another way to
> get some of the full resolution HD out to people and quicker and
> cheaper and all those kinds of things.
>
> Steve I think one of the improvements that everybody in the cable
> companies is going to like is because they'll probably have a
> dedicated educational channel, which will be more suitable for the
> public.
>
> Jack Right now as I said because of my connection with SCOLA, they run
> the same thing. They run, I think it's three channels with a spare one
> that gets used for other things and gives them the ability to separate
> out. The other thing I can tell you at least from 4DTV, the
> compression, because it's on C-band, isn't as strong as it is on the
> little dishes and it looks really good.
>
> Steve The bandwidth should be quite adequate and that's what they were
> going for because they need to deliver broadcast quality to the
> television stations.
>
> Eric Do you know what the bit rate is?
>
> Steve No, I don't. I don't have the stuff in front of me.
>
> Jack If we could still talk them into 4DTV, you can get a receiver at
> the top of the line right now with the digital built into it for less
> than \$700.
>
> Steve I heard that is was about \$400, but actually, if you respond
> back to that Web page, that's probably a good forum to put in your
> input.
>
> M We were trying, but we couldn't find a place to respond, other than
> to give them our e-mail so that we'd get on future information.
> Somebody said there was a survey, but I couldn't find it.
>
> Anita Yes, there was supposed to be a survey. I'll check up on that.
> I'm kind of dismayed if all they did was take your e-mail address.
> They should be asking you guys.
>
> Steve I'm on the fringe of this whole thing, so really, Marshall is
> the prime center on this.
>
> Anita There's a guy named Wes Wall from Marshall, who called me.
>
> Steve Yes, I'll try to get a little more information and then, I'll
> get it to Anita and she can get it out to you guys.
>
> Eric You may have mentioned this before, Steve, but did you give a
> date at the earliest inception when we'll be doing our prototype
> testing for it and when the likelihood of it being ready for prime
> time, so to speak, is?
>
> Steve There's no solid date, but it's close to the end of the year.
>
> Eric But there is going to be a testing period, right?
>
> Steve Yes, it's going to be in parallel. They haven't even, as far as
> I know, figured out what's going to go on each one of the channels,
> other than the broad definition of center to center, and to news
> media, and to education.
>
> M The Mars Viz Channel.
>
> Eric And the fourth one is reserved for "other?"
>
> Steve That's "other," yes.
>
> Anita Anybody else have any questions for Steve, or should we let him
> get back to his regular work?
>
> Eric Yes, Steve, thanks a lot for giving all the museum folks the
> preliminary view of this because I think it will be interesting to be
> people to be able to get digital quality imagery, both animations,
> live shots, and others, via this channel as it becomes available.
>
> Steve Yes. I think it's just an expense at the beginning, but it
> increases the capabilities by a tremendous amount.
>
> Eric Is there any discussion of embedded caption kind of textual
> material, which often can be available through this kind of a system,
> to be incorporated, as well as the video feed, the video ...?
>
> Steve I don't think anybody has gone that far, other than it has been
> discussed. Everybody knows that that's capable, but I don't think
> they've gone in depth yet on what they're actually going to put on
> there.
>
> Eric Okay. Thank you.
>
> Anita Thank you, Steve. We'll call you again with a little more
> notice. Keep me posted if there's anything new to report and we'll put
> you on.
>
> Steve Sure, will do. Good-bye.
>
> Anita Eric, we had some problems with the telephone line this morning
> and also late notice because I was out yesterday.
>
> Eric No problem, and glad to get Steve on line with this because it
> gets people all through summer thinking about it. I think the first
> prototype testing is for the fall and then hopefully, they will be
> running it in parallel, this digital television. Some people might
> want to actually be early participants as we get this online, before
> it becomes actually fully operational even.
>
> Anita I was hoping that they were surveying their potential users, to
> make sure that they design something the users can use, but it doesn't
> sound like it.
>
> M I just think they're at the stage where they're collecting all the
> e-mails and they haven't even formulated anything yet. That's what I
> got from them. I was just at their survey site and basically, yes,
> they just want your e-mail address, so they can start sending things
> out, once they get them together.
>
> Eric Actually, Anita, it's possible if there's not a survey that's
> officially out there -- I don't want to volunteer you for too many
> things -- but possibly, you could collect some peoples' input and feed
> it to Steve; and that way, at least it would go into the system as
> they're making the decisions.
>
> Anita Yes.
>
> Eric That might not be a bad thing.
>
> M Yes, because honestly, the museums and planetariums, money is a
> consideration to many of us. Let's face it, we're really cheapskates
> in a lot of ways. We have to be.
>
> Eric Would you be willing to do that, among the other things you're
> collecting, Anita?
>
> Anita Yes, absolutely. I might ask for somebody to help me devise the
> questions, what are the right questions to ask of the museum community
> and then, we'll put something together.
>
> Eric That sounds good. I'd be happy to help with that and twist
> Steve's arm, as well, so we can actually formulate the questions in a
> way that the responses will fit into where their decision points are.
>
> Anita Excellent. Thank you.
>
> Eric Yes, sure.
>
> Anita I love your questions about embedded text and things like that.
>
> Eric The systems are fully capable of doing that and also, again, if
> museums and our museum partners want to express that would be
> interesting to them, perhaps, someone would pay a little more
> attention to that part of it, too. That is a nice capability to have
> and it's not that hard to implement.
>
> Anita Yes, and with a survey like that, I'd go beyond Mars Viz. I'd go
> to dome-l and ASTC and the AAM list serves.
>
> Eric Sure. That sounds good.
>
> Anita Probably get a pretty good response.
>
> Eric Yes.
>
> Jack I was going to mention that SCOLA, because they carry
> international television, other countries, they can embed the
> translation just the same way that you do. It's like closed
> captioning, but you know what I mean.
>
> Anita What is the name of that again?
>
> Jack That is SCOLA. It used to stand for Satellite Communications for
> Learning, but its just SCOLA now. It's connected to Creighton
> University in Omaha. They have four channels and a bunch of stuff.
> I'll send you their URL.
>
> Anita It just looks like SCOLA.org. That would be very great if it had
> closed captioning translations.
>
> M They're going to have them up on their streaming set eventually,
> too, but it's cool to watch.
>
> Eric There's a little bit of ... being done in their preliminary
> sessions, examining not with the general NASA thing, but just with how
> we're going to handle Cassini, because of the Huygens Probe being
> European Space Agency led and the Cassini spacecraft being NASA led,
> trying to see how we share some of that information. It has some
> immediate needs to us and everyone and long term, it could have a
> great benefit, I think.
>
> Anita This SCOLA looks very interesting. It's got Russia Online as a
> partner and the Sons of Italy.
>
> Jack Yes, they have like 30 or 40 countries. I've been associated with
> them for about 15 to 20 years and I'll give you a contact you can talk
> to up there. By the way, I understand that people in Houston watch
> SCOLA, the astronauts training for Russia.
>
> Anita Really?
>
> M That's what I heard from a couple of guys who were training and told
> me they watched it in the crew quarters.
>
> Anita I'm looking at the Web site here. How do you receive SCOLA? Is
> there a cost for it?
>
> M Yes. They're a for-pay because basically, they have a key on the
> box. You get a box and you get your digital and then, they have a key
> for it, but then, they're also now going to go over into a streaming
> version, too. That's how they support themselves. They're cheapskate
> non-profits, like us.
>
> Anita Very interesting. Eric, do you have any Mars news for us today?
>
> Eric A lot of people are off at LPSC, but we're still going to have a
> press conference this coming Thursday, nonetheless. We've actually
> been trying to iron out some additional details, as to how we might
> standardize two different products that we put out on occasion, but I
> think we'd like to increase the number of times we put them out.
>
> One is the navigation camera on a regular basis is used, of course, to
> plan out where we're going to go and also to look back at where we've
> been. Since the navigation camera has a wide field of view, there are
> more mosaics available from it than, say, from the PanCam; so we're
> thinking about trying to put on a regular basis, some simple mosaics,
> a left and right eye and an anaglyph, and then put that together with
> a caption.
>
> I'm talking with Michelle Viotti (Mars public engagement manager) and
> her people, and also with Guy Webster \[media\] and Joy Crisp \[Deputy
> Project Scientist, MER\] this morning, about if we could standardize
> that caption and then we can get the image processing people to do it
> systematically. We do a standard projection, simple cylindrical
> projection and mosaic, and do that on a regular basis, so people would
> have that as a reference of where we're going and where we've been.
>
> We were talking about that today, about trying to get that together
> and then second, Ohio State, the people at Ohio State, ..., they're
> the group that's in charge of rover localization. They have a little
> harder problem of having to do more analysis to do this latter
> product, but they been putting out on occasion, products that show the
> basic navigation path that the rover has taken in each case, and then
> indicating some of the major regions/features on them on an overlay.
> That will probably only be available when we have a good PanCam,
> either a color or black-and-white image to use as a background and
> when they complete their analysis, but we're thinking about trying to
> put those out as well. As the mission goes on, it's nice to have these
> site maps to orient people. Those were two things that we were
> actually working on this past week to try and get together and see if
> we can't get them out systematically.
>
> We're still on the once a week press conference schedule and they're
> still normally Thursday at 10:00 a.m. PST. On a daily basis on
> weekdays, we have a virtual editorial board that meets and discusses
> images to go onto the Web site and also for other uses, and so we're
> meeting every day on those. We may have images every day or every
> other day, something like that, and some days vary with how many
> images. We also have images being produced on weekends, not just
> weekdays, but the virtual editorial board pretty much meets every week
> day to discuss those issues.
>
> If people have input about what they're seeing on the Web site
> image-wise, I can also feed those to that virtual editorial board that
> meets and we'd certainly like to consider any of the things that we
> could do to add to the images that are being produced. That's kind of
> a short summary, except that we're all excited about looking down into
> new craters. Getting over to Bonneville and looking down into it has
> been a very exciting experience for all of us, so that's a big deal.
> As we leave our Opportunity crater, we're also going to be interested
> in seeing what we get to next there, too.
>
> Anita Actually, I'm looking right now for an image I just saw this
> morning. Here's this field of pretty similar looking rocks and then
> right in the middle of it, there's this black and white speckled rock.
> Do you remember that one? Have you seen it?
>
> Eric Yes, I have, but I don't have any comments about it at this time.
>
> Anita Please. It's really cool.
>
> Eric I'm sorry. It is very cool. There are a bunch of papers and
> abstracts that are going to come out of this LPSC \[Lunar and
> Planetary Science Conference\] series of meetings this week, so there
> will be a lot on that; and in the future, I think, we're going to have
> focused things like we had a week or so ago, the space science update
> we had at Headquarters. I think, besides the weekly press conference,
> they're looking toward, every once in a while, having these new
> discovery-oriented press conferences, as well, or space science
> updates with a specific topic, like they did the evidence for water in
> Meridiani. I think we'll be seeing some more like that as people are
> accumulating the story and have a better understanding of the geology
> of the region and especially, the mineralogy of the region.
>
> Anita Is most of the team down there?
>
> Eric Yes, most of the team is at LPSC. We have a skeleton team still
> here, though. Joy is participating in the virtual editorial boards
> still, so people are still participating, even though they're at LPSC.
>
> Anita I don't know that I saw anything more about the UFO. Did they
> determine if that was the Viking orbiter, one of the Viking orbiters?
>
> Eric I paid rapt attention to it while it was happening, but I
> honestly haven't followed up since, so I'm not sure. We have
> eliminated several of the orbiters we knew it wasn't; but I didn't
> hear whether they'd been able to determine or whether they knew the
> actual ephemeris, if you will, of the Viking orbiters well enough to
> say that it likely was something like that or whether it was a meteor.
> I haven't heard anything about that since, so I don't know. It doesn't
> mean that somebody didn't, but I haven't heard.
>
> Anita Anybody out there have anything they want to ask about?
>
> Steve L. This is Steve Lee in Denver. I've actually got three
> questions, if I can dump those all on you. One is the color panorama
> from the rim of Bonneville. They released about half of that
> yesterday. Is that going to be a complete 360, eventually, and is it
> going to be a full resolution one?
>
> The second thing is I'm gathering, reading between the lines, that
> they're not going to spend a whole lot of time at Bonneville. They're
> going to drive off fairly soon toward the hills, and I just wanted to
> hear Eric's input on that.
>
> The final thing was a couple of weeks ago, I had asked about the APXS
> instrument showing plutonium in their compositional plots. I was
> wondering if anybody had heard anything.
>
> Anita Yes, I did follow up on that and put it in the transcript, but I
> didn't send a note around about it. It turns out that the proton
> source on the APXS is curium. I think it's curium 243 and that decays
> to plutonium.
>
> Eric When they said, "background," they didn't mean background on
> Mars, but background, due to the actual APXS proton source.
>
> Steve L. Great. Thank you.
>
> Eric That was a good question. Thank you. We'll go in reverse order,
> so Anita got that one and the second one is on the driving toward the
> hills versus how much time we're going to spend at the crater,
> investigating it. Actually, I don't think the final determination has
> been made yet. Even Ray Arvidson \[Washington University, St. Louis\]
> was ducking that question when asked it directly.
>
> I think here's what the decision will be made on: if anyone finds a
> specifically interesting target. Obviously, Spirit and the Opportunity
> sites are very different in terms of the rock outcrops, and so the
> rock outcrops have drawn our attention in the case of Opportunity and
> so there, we've spent a lot of time investigating the sidewall of the
> crater because we had a rock outcrop to investigate. That's a reason
> for spending a lot of time at one place.
>
> Spirit, on the other hand, that area, we don't have exposed rock
> outcrop-like things in the craters. It doesn't appear to be that; we
> see rocks, and ejecta, and we see the crater wall, but it doesn't seem
> to have a rock outcrop of the same nature. If it had one or we
> identified one, we would certainly try our best to actually get up
> close to it, as long as it's safe to navigate and then spend time
> there. Without that to draw us, it's a question of are there any other
> interesting rocks in terms of their mineralogy and can we examine that
> from just the photographic, if you will, from the PanCam and its
> limited spectral information, can we determine from that that we have
> interesting targets to visit.
>
> If someone does identify such a rock, then we'll see if we can't visit
> it. That's what people are doing. They're looking at are there any
> specific rocks that draw our attention.
>
> If that's not the case and someone doesn't say, "Yes. This one is
> unusual. We want to visit it," then we are drawn to try, and with
> Spirit, as opposed to Opportunity, to drive farther. It's the one that
> I think it's logical to drive farther with. The East Hills do beckon.
> There is certainly from the imagery we've already seen with the PanCam
> in the distance, there are ... variations. There are clearly some
> variations that are probably mineralogical in nature and so we'd like
> to get closer, that being the only way we can investigate those things
> in the east hills. I don't think the final decision has been made yet,
> but that's the logic upon which the decision is hinging. Does that
> make sense?
>
> Steve L. Yes.
>
> Eric As far as the color panorama of Bonneville, I think we are trying
> to get a full and complete set of that and I'm not quite sure when the
> sequences are all in hand or will be in hand yet. I'll look into that
> and let you know later.
>
> Anita We had a question from Gene Zajac in Ohio. He wanted to know,
> "How do you use Photo Shop or anything else to produce color images
> from the rover images?" Is that something that Mars folks can do, I
> mean Mars Viz folks? He can make a color arrangement. He's not sure if
> he has the correct color balance.
>
> Eric The color balance question is a very difficult one, actually.
> Basically, you can adjust the colors, obviously, using Photo Shop by
> adjusting the brightness variations in three individual filters. You
> can actually adjust the histograms individually of each filter, and
> try to get it to do a brightness correction and so, you can adjust the
> colors that way. If you use an image that has been properly color
> balanced by the PanCam team, as your reference, then you probably can
> do a reasonable job at approximating the color that you see in the
> PanCam images.
>
> The problem lies in that to do it absolutely correctly, what you need
> to do is actually correct things photometrically and use curves that
> were generated during testing that was done with the cameras before
> they were flown, so that you actually can get the response function
> correct relatively for each of the separate filters. You actually need
> some calibration data and you need to refer to that calibration data,
> those calibrations curves, if you want to do a completely good and
> correct color balance. Without those calibration curves and some
> software that actually does photometric corrections, you can't get it
> absolutely correct. That's why I say if you put aside and have a
> separate window open and use a correctly color calibrated image as
> your reference, then you can adjust the filters. Does that make sense?
>
> Gene This is Gene Zajac. Yes, it does make sense. Thanks, Anita, for
> asking that question for me.
>
> Anita I'm glad you're on.
>
> Gene I understand that and I can play with it like that. What about
> when you have the magnified pictures of when we had the RAT holes? Are
> there color images of that?
>
> Eric Yes, we have color images, using the PanCam of the RAT holes.
> Many of them have been adjusted to show differences, rather than true
> color. They've literally done that, so that you could see the
> distribution of the dust, if you will, that is created by the abrasion
> of the Rock Abrasion Tool, and you can see where it's been actually
> pushed across the rest of the rock. Those are not usually done true
> color. They are done to show dust distribution.
>
> Gene I can make those blueberries really blue, but I didn't want to do
> that.
>
> Eric Yes.
>
> Gene Thank you.
>
> Anita Eric, did you get a chance to see the Geowall sample from Adler
> of the blueberries area?
>
> Eric I'm sorry, which ones?
>
> Anita I had sent an e-mail to you a week or two ago of Adler's Geowall
> pictures.
>
> Eric I confess that I didn't, but I will take a look at them. I've
> actually been out sick for a few days, as you may have heard, but I'll
> take a look at those. I'd be very interested in looking at those.
>
> Anita Yes, maybe we could get an appointment with Brian Swift to go
> down there, a bunch of us and look at them in his Geowall.
>
> Eric I'd be incredibly interested in seeing some of the images on both
> Geowalls and on planetarium domes and things like that because I
> haven't had a chance to do that, so I would greatly appreciate that
> opportunity.
>
> Jack One other thing I was going to comment is on processing our 3Ds,
> one of the things that we started doing was that we noticed things
> look better one way on a monitor versus a different way on a dome. I
> think it has to do with projection and the curve and so on. We've
> adjusted our latest images to make them two versions, to do both. It
> has a suffix with a D on it and one has a suffix with an M, just
> because we found that some things when they were, like right in your
> lap, the 3D, your eyes trying to come together on that liked it a
> little bit better one way, than it did looking off on the dome.
>
> Eric Right, I totally agree. There's really a sweet spot distance for
> optimally viewing a 3D object. A screen viewing distance, people
> easily can adjust a foot or two and get into that sweet spot. In a
> dome, you have chairs, so it's just geometry, but it's certainly ... a
> different spot. I think that's very advisable to do.
>
> Anita Yes, and along those lines, Jack, another thing we had going
> with Pat Reiff this past week was we've been calling them red/blue
> glasses, but in talking to Kris Capraro, who works for Eric, the
> red/cyan is actually a little better, brighter.
>
> Jack Yes, because the cyan would be a little bit lighter, which should
> help you a little bit also when you're projecting because sometimes
> when people project things, depending upon their projector and their
> planetarium, it may not be as bright.
>
> Eric Yes, and actually, I think there are two reasons that it helps a
> lot to consider using the red/cyan, rather than the red/blue. One is,
> as you pointed out, in terms of you get a brighter image through the
> cyan filter, than you get through the blue filter. The other reason is
> if you take red and cyan and mix them, it's closer to gray, a neutral
> gray scale, than red/blue, which is missing the green component.
> You'll get less of a reddish, purple hue that you tend to get with a
> lot of the red/blue process images if you do a red/cyan.
>
> Ideally, you should add red, green, plus blue and have green plus
> blue, but the third eye is missing, so you have to make a compromise
> there and cyan is a much better compromise to get neutral gray
> densities and balance them. Give that a try, if you guys do it. It's
> \$0.25 a pair of glasses. I think those work a lot better.
>
> Jack Darn, I just bought a bunch more. Wait, I think these are the
> red/cyan. I better take a look. They look different than the other
> ones. The person ordering may have made a mistake in our favor.
>
> Anita Jack, do you want to say anything about Pat Reiff at Rice and
> what's going on there?
>
> Jack Yes, she did e-mail me and I told her go ahead and just put them
> in. They're doing something at Rice with the Space Update Cds and
> their Mars stuff and I told them, "Yes. Go ahead and just take and use
> our 3D images, and just go ahead and credit us, and away you go."
>
> Anita That's really nice of you guys. That's wonderful.
>
> Jack As long as they give us our name. and the honest thing is that
> the more valuable thing for me, and I bet it is for most planetariums
> in a lot of ways is, if you get a letter back or even the e-mails that
> say that they're using some of your stuff, you can take that up to
> your administrators. That sometimes is more valuable than money, if
> you know what I mean.
>
> Anita Absolutely. I have to admit a lot of the comments that you guys
> have e-mailed me, or said, have found their way into my PowerPoint
> presentation on this whole thing when I had to do the "song and dance"
> for my management a week or two ago. I thought to myself, "We don't
> have a reporting form up yet. I can't give them attendance numbers and
> I know they're going to want that. I'll just use these quotes," and I
> set a new standard for metrics. They loved it because I just let you
> guys speak for yourselves about how you're using it, what your
> audience reactions are, that type of thing. I appreciate that because
> that has really made an impression on folks around here and I think at
> Headquarters, too.
>
> Eric Yes, and I'd like to second the thank you for sending those
> comments to us because it does make a difference in the next budget
> cycle for how we actually make sure that this happens again and can
> happen continuously, which is important. They need to hear from you
> that it's helpful to you, and so thank you for sending those comments.
> It's really been a big boost to us.
>
> Anita Yes, because we think this is useful.
>
> Eric Yes, obviously we do, but we have a slightly biased view so it's
> good to get some unbiased input from you.
>
> Jack We just think it's great to have all this stuff recorded. Give
> these people raises, quick.
>
> M I'll second that motion. Give them big raises.
>
> Eric You guys are doing a great job and it's wonderful to know that
> this stuff is being seen right away by people and it's not years later
> or anything, but really, while it's happening, so thank you.
>
> Ken You guys need to send a special heads up and thank you to Terri
> Formico for that wonderful DVD.
>
> Terri Thank you. I'll just keep the job. I don't need a raise. Just
> keeping the job is good enough for me.
>
> Ken Terri, any word yet on the index or the Table of Contents, or are
> we still a long way away from that?
>
> Terri I haven't had a chance to read up on it yet. I got a little bit
> behind because I, too, was hit with a little bit of a bug on Friday,
> so I haven't had a chance to grab my book and just sit down and read.
> I wish I would have had it at home with me. I need to get together
> with Shigeru \[Suzuki\] to see if he knows some more information on
> it, too.
>
> Ken In the meantime, I'll keep working on the index for my end, as
> well. Thank you.
>
> Terri Great, that's very helpful.
>
> Anita You're having fun, right, Ken?
>
> Ken I'm having a blast. "Look, there's another animation, woo!"
>
> Anita This is important for us to know because we are trying to put
> together a compilation DVD from other missions, other planets, and now
> that we know that an index like this is useful to you.
>
> Ken I've got a special request, though, on the subsequent DVDs. Is
> there space enough to throw the Maas video back in?
>
> Terri If you want, what I've done is I've separated it out with all
> the videos of science, mission overviews and stuff onto a separate DVD
> since you guys probably have about 60 copies of it right now. It's
> about to break again because I think, after Thursday's press
> conference, if the DVD isn't full, I'll be going onto a third DVD. I
> don't know, Eric. Maybe we need to get together and decide how we want
> to break it up.
>
> Eric I think we'll include it back again, as we start going toward the
> third, and assess if we can do another DVD, so the sets will then be
> complete again. It's just temporarily it was convenient to state
> everything on this update DVD.
>
> Terri Anybody who's new, who has joined on the distribution I have
> sent the Maas DVD with all the information on that as well with the
> latest and greatest, so anybody who is new, you've gotten an
> individual one that's separate that has all those on there.
>
> Eric You'll get it complete again, as soon as we ... to the next one.
>
> Terry Yes, and I'm not sure what's going to be best to break it to,
> just Opportunity and Spirit, or just to continue with both of them on
> the same DVD.
>
> Eric I'm interested in your input on this, but my tendency would be to
> break it based on sols.
>
> Terri I think that's a good idea.
>
> Eric A lot of the things get discussed at the same time in press
> conferences and chronological is straightforward.
>
> Terri I agree. I was hoping that would be the answer. That would be
> easier for me because that's one DVD, as opposed to two constantly.
>
> M I just want to say whatever you guys decide is wonderful. Thank you.
> Keep it up.
>
> Eric Thank you.
>
> Anita Did you guys get the *Challenges of Getting to Mars* DVD?
>
> M Yes, we did.
>
> Anita Is that useful?
>
> M Yes, it is.
>
> M I've not had time to look, but I bet it is.
>
> Anita We want to make sure what we do is useful, and not just from our
> standpoint, but from yours. Anybody have anything else this morning? I
> think we've had a pretty productive telecon for the late start that we
> got into. Anybody else?
>
> Ken Yes, this is Ken in North Carolina again. Was there a press
> conference last week and I just flat missed it?
>
> Eric There was one last Thursday. It was on Thursday at the standard
> 10:00 a.m. PST.
>
> Ken Right. Okay.
>
> Anita And this week, it's also Thursday?
>
> Eric Yes.
>
> Anita That helps, so that you guys have new ammunition for the weekend
> programs.
>
> Eric Like I said, I'm not sure how long they'll do the once a week,
> but at least, right now, that's the plan for the foreseeable future.
>
> Anita I think I sent out the URL for -- if I didn't, it will come --
> for where the Arizona State Educators Workshop is going to be streamed
> by Apple. I think that ought to be there by now. I haven't actually
> checked, but I'll let you know if that's there. You can use that if
> it's useful ... http://ali.apple.com/ali_sites/ali/exhibits/1001260/
>
> The Cal State Sacramento program on Friday night is advertised now on
> the NASA TV schedule, 11:30 p.m. EST. Sorry about that folks. They
> wanted an evening program. As I said, I still have to find them a
> speaker \[it will be Dr. Dan McCleese, Mars Program Chief Scientist\],
> but I see this, especially when we get into more channels on NASA TV,
> as a real opportunity for community colleges, colleges, planetariums,
> museums, to have some live talks where people can call in and ask
> questions. On this one, I think the live questions are only going to
> be available through Cal State Sacramento. We'll see how it goes and
> hopefully, we've broken some new ground here.
>
> Next week we will telecon again at 11 a.m. Pacific on Tuesday if the
> conference center works well again, and if there are any things you
> want to talk about as a thematic topic for that hour, let me know and
> we'll get a speaker or whatever. I think the team is a little bit more
> available now. We might be able to get some of them onto this telecon
> when they get back from Houston.
>
> M Thanks for everything.
>
> Anita Thanks, everybody. Good-bye.