Consumer complaint received 2022-05-26
Company: Ocwen Financial Corporation
State: TN
Product: Mortgage
Sub-product: Reverse mortgage
Issue: Closing on a mortgage

Complaint:
I have contacted Liberty as usual the response is they are escalating this matter. In issues I had before the end ( closing ) they did the same thing- they are escalating, I was handled. 

Elder Abuse and Manipulation that occurred in the Reverse Mortgage application with Liberty Reverse Mortgage In XX/XX/XXXX I finally realized that I had been scammed by a self-professing XXXX woman. Based on this womans lies I had gotten myself in debt renovating my home. For most of my adult life I have lived within my means and gone without to survive. I understand the difference between needs and wants having gone without court ordered child support without a college education and not on welfare raising XXXX children. I was in debt from this event about {$30000.00} and had the potential of losing my home. My dishonest scammer was very very good at the manipulation that occurred. 

I might have been able to pay this debt leaving me barely able to squeeze by. I had decided to look in to Reverse Mortgage programs designed for the elderly. I was turning XXXX in a year and felt that my health was only going to deteriorate as I get older. By the time I would have any relief from this debt I would not have the health to do things that I wanted or dreamed to do. My thinking was that I could do a reverse mortgage to pay this debt off and then I would just live within my means as I have done in my life. 

The first organization I called was XXXX. I was just trying to get an estimate for how much my would be available to me if my home was worth x amount of money providing I met all the requirement of the program stating that I understood it was not a set figure. The person would not give me any dollar amount or provide me with an example of formulas used to determine an amount. I needed to find out if the dollar amount would even make it worth me pursuing this. They asked for extreme personal details of information without providing hardly any information ( so I an elderly person is giving up very detailed and personal information ). Information that could be used to manipulate a person by someone knowing what situation you are in or how urgently help is needed. 

With the amount of fraud taking place today, I felt it was not appropriate information to be disclosed at this level until I made a decision formally make an application. 

I was not getting any information from XXXX so I searched for other reverse mortgage companies. I ran across the name of Liberty Reverse Mortgage. Alongside the names of the companies were comment s and I remember it saying for people with good credit. Since I have had good credit scores ( XXXX + as high as XXXX ) I decided to call Liberty Reverse mortgage. Each time you call you are given a message that the phone call is recorded. 
Phone calls to Liberty Reverse Mortgage- I made close to 70 phone calls to Liberty Reverse Mortgage. I have a list of 48 dates although there were more between XX/XX/XXXX & XX/XX/XXXX when I formally made the application and a few more that werent logged due to the stressful situation I was dealing with. I was under so much stress the person who was dishonest was causing problems with my family members and her church people did not leave my home when I told them to leave and I ended up calling the police. See attachments A & B. 

It was in those 2 months ( XXXX XXXX XXXX ) that I had talked extensively to XXXX XXXX about the terms of the loan. We also discussed how long it would take to close once I applied. I was told 1 2 months. 

It took 8 months to get this reverse mortgage, 6 months from the time I formally applied in XX/XX/XXXX. I jumped every hoop they demanded. I had provided all the information they wanted, scheduled the counseling for XX/XX/XXXX which was the earliest date I could get. I wanted to close the loan soon after counseling. 

In XX/XX/XXXX when I applied the interest rate was just under 2 % interest, max increase 2 % per year and capped at 10 %. This was the only plan XXXX and I verbally spoke about. Quite honestly I thought once you identified what type of reverse mortgage you choose, this was the offer for that plan. It never occurred to me that there were options. 

I have close to 5 inches of paperwork of things sent to me. One example is shortly after I officially applied for the reverse mortgage with Liberty. The package I received was 92 double sided pages, single line, not double lined, printed in 10pt and smaller type ( equating to 184 pages ). It covered all the types of reverse mortgages. If a company wants to bury or minimize information, it could easily be done in that package. A person would have to know what to ask to get down to what would apply to their loan. I am not a banker and do not know all the acronyms. 

The differences if I went to a bank to get a loan : A bank would not take 6 8 months to complete the process. You would submit the information they require. In my previous mortgages the interest rate was locked in when you made the application. 
A bank would be give able to give you print outs of the financial information. More specific to your loan numbers given at the time. 
A person would not be isolated. Again 70 calls, containing 100 200 hours of conversation. 
The amount and depth of personal information would not be disclosed in a bank situation.

You would know what institutions you are dealing with. For instance Liberty Reverse Mortgage is a dba, several of the other institutions who are involved ( dbas ) in this process. And how many of these other entities are owned or associated with Liberty Reverse Mortgage. In a conventional loan I would have a choice of the XXXX, the title company and I would know what company is managing the loan. 
It is XX/XX/XXXX and I still do not have a Welcome Package. I dont know where to return the excess money they sent me although I am paying interest on it, or how to request more money if I wanted it. I have requested this information multiple times but never received it. 
Liberty is very aware that I am very stressed about having this {$190.00}?? XXXX money in my bank account if someone gets access to my account it could be stolen. 
I could choose the title company you I wanted to use and be given the cost. With the reverse mortgage process you are not able to have those choices. 
I paid for the appraisal via a screen with no cover page, just a place to authorize a {$550.00} payment to XXXX. There was no ability to ask for a receipt or get a copy of the transaction. XXXX also included a statement that additional charges for the appraisal could be charged. In a bank setting you would receive dated receipts for transactions ( not be sent a form to sign to charge your credit card and not provide a way to get a receipt. See attachment D. 
The company who is overseeing the reverse mortgage has unlimited access to the checkbook. Some of the fees you are charged are outrageous and I have no say or ability to seek out more reasonable venders to provide the service. 
A senior should not receive communications in 5 point type or letters in 7 point type. I had to use 2 devices to be able to read these documents. Readers and magnifying devices. See attachment C. 
You would get answers, not be told that they will escalate the issues to never addressed ( the person then says they are not authorize to do anything ). Knowing that each time you go over the information it is creating stress, health issues and despair being so manipulated and these companies have the checkbook. The lack of humanity is astounding. At a bank you would have those answers before you left the bank. 
At the time of closing the loan there are not additional requirements that would have been resolved before you got to the closing part. The 1st time I tried to close I was given the additional requirement the Thursday before I was going to close the following week. See attachments G & H. 
The 2nd time to close the loan papers, I was presented with different financial rates of at least 2 times plus the amount of interest that had been discussed and in place at the time I applied for the loan. 
It seems in the reverse mortgage process, seniors dont seem to have a right to get receipts, a copy of the appraisal I paid for, and I had to request it from Liberty. This includes getting financial statements/receipts in a timely manner. The only thing I seem to get in a timely manner is the bill of the monies they are adding to my debt. In a traditional bank setting I would have all issues resolved and information given within hours, at most days. 

Other practices that have occurred with Liberty Reverse Mortgage In a feedback communication email sent to me from Liberty Reverse Mortgage. See attachment I. I have asked Liberty Reverse Mortgage for a copy of all the phone recordings ( every time you call them they tell you that they are recording everything. I implore you to ask for a copy of the voice recordings for the following reasons 1 ) You will see how manipulation is used to divert the focus from questions that ones asked. In my case there is well over 100 - 200 hours of discussions that took place and would demonstrate how a senior is manipulated.

2 ) There is very personal information recorded that could be sold, or used to target elderly people for other scams 3 ) The amount of personal information that can be used to confuse or suggest that one doesnt remember things. This would not happen if a person goes to a bank to get a conventional loan. This was done to me when XXXX presented 3 different loan programs to me. I told XXXX that XXXX and I only spoke about 1 loan package. 3 ) The phone recordings would demonstrate how easy it is to run elderly people in circles, avoid answering questions and use personal information and fears to close the loan which is what happened to me. 

2 examples : 1 ) When XXXX ( processor from Liberty Reverse Mortgage ) told me that Liberty would not consider the information I sent ( XXXX XXXX, XXXX ) via email to Liberty information about the flood insurance, I requested to speak with the Compliance officer from Liberty. I was diverted to several other personal but never got to speak to a compliance officer, although it was being escalated. 
a. I immediately called about getting this insurance. XXXX national flood insurance would cost me an additional {$2700.00} a year. Why wasnt I told that in XXXX when I submitted the application with information regarding my home insurance policy? I would have not gone any further with the reverse mortgage. I submitted to Liberty via email information from the XXXX flood site to Liberty so you could see that my home sits uphill and was not in the flood plan. In the XXXX flooding that occurred in XXXX, this property did not flood. Also information stating that flood insurance is for the structure, not dirt which is where the tips of my property lie in a 100 yr. flood plan. I also informed Liberty that I was filing an amendment with XXXX that can determine the home does not sit in the flood area and can be exempt from the requirement. 
XXXX I spent hours and hours the next weeks contacting ( often multiple calls to these departments ) XXXX XXXX, XXXX XXXX Department, XXXX XXXX Department XXXX XXXX XXXX Department, XXXX XXXX Map XXXX, XXXX XXXX, XXXX of Flood Plan, XXXX XXXX and XXXX XXXX, Getting quotes for cost of Elevation Certificate from surveyors in XXXX XXXX ( {$1600.00} and up ). Filed for amendment with XXXX when they told me I didnt have to have the elevation certificate to file ( application # XXXX ) although it might be required later. XXXX XXXX XXXX XXXX, XXXX XXXX XXXX, FHA  XXXX XXXX, FHA XXXXXXXX, XXXX XXXX for FHA, XXXX XXXX XXXX. At one point I waited 2 hours and 45 minutes on hold just to talk to someone. 
i. NOTE : I had applied for an amendment with XXXX because my home is on a hill on my property, did not flood in the XXXX XXXX floods. On XX/XX/XXXX I received notification from XXXX stating that the XXXX insurance was not required on my home this was almost 2 weeks after I closed. 

XXXX ) In XXXX XXXX I received a call from XXXX ( processor ) informing me that the Flood insurance would not be required, no explanation was given. I asked to close ASAP. At the 2nd attempt to close XXXX sent me 3 financial packages. I had told her I wanted to use XXXX to put some formulas in to extend out the figures 10 yrs. or more. Note : She offered to send me some examples. This is the 1st time I was offered examples of financial information specifically related to my loan. She did tell me that they were not exactly the final numbers. I remember in a conversation after I received this information XXXX talking more about the value of my home going up, the ability to pay more fees in the future should interest rates go below what I was now being offered. I just want to XXXX  in my home, at this point sometimes I feel the sooner the better. I dont care about the value of my home going up. I cared about after paying off the debt I incurred and not drawing additional funds, would I have enough money left in the account after 10 years to pay for services if I became fragile and could not do domestic activities. At this point I dont think I will live that long ( due to stress and manipulation ) and I wonder will there be any money to draw from after the bank draws their share. Diverting my attention to other information. 
a. All the home mortgages I have gotten in the past, once the application was formally submitted the interest rate was locked in. I met the demands in a timely manner and LIberty changed the terms. Loans may not always exist with the locked in rate, but in my time my loans did. Reverse mortgages are for senior people who probably have had the same experience ( XXXX years ). NOTE : I recently checked with a local bank in XX/XX/XXXX and was told that loans can still be locked into a rate when a person applies. 

How I have been treated after the ReversXXXX Mortgage was signed. 
At closing the notary called a number provided by Liberty if there were any questions. He ( the notary ) called the number 2 times. I spoke on speaker phone with a person from the Title company ( recorded, try getting that recording ). She told me they would look into the figures that were incorrect and that I would get a copy of the changes to sign and send back. Never received any copy of the correction to sign, nor did I receive an email stating the changes and figures. 
When the check was deposited into my account the entire {$29000.00} was received again no statement or email accompanying this deposit. I knew that XXXX requirement of this loan was that the XXXX XXXX XXXX I had with XXXX Bank ( my banking institute ) had to be paid off. I received the money on Friday XX/XX/XXXX. I had been told they would pay it off, but then again I have been told a lot of things. I paid the XXXX XXXX XXXX off that day. This also means additional {$190.00}?? money is on my loan. I have only asked for {$29000.00}. Now I am paying interest on this money that I did not request. 
On XX/XX/XXXX I talked to XXXX ( XXXX ) from the Title Company ( closing ) and she said I had to call Liberty Reverse Mortgage about the discrepancies. 
On XX/XX/XXXX I called XXXX and left a message asking her to call me immediately and left a brief message of what it was about. To this day I have not received any return call from XXXX. 
Before closing I had asked XXXX how I would get information about the account, how to withdraw additional funds, statements etc. she had said I would receive a Welcome package after closing. I have not received this package so I dont know where to send the additional funds they put on my account. Yet I am paying interest on it. 
I did not receive a statement regarding my loan from Liberty Reverse Mortgage until the week of XX/XX/XXXX more than 1 month after closing. This statement was printed in 5 point type I am a senior and had to use 2 devices so I could read it. 
The same week I had received what looked like a check from my bank, XXXX. It was for the amount of the payoff of my XXXX XXXX Account. It looked so much like a check so I went to the bank to ask them what it was. It took them that day to figure it out and called later that day to tell me it was a refund, the account had been paid. Again no paperwork or email had been received until XX/XX/XXXX. 
On XX/XX/XXXX I sent a feedback in response from Liberty Mutual to provide them feedback on my experience with Liberty Reverse Mortgage. Again no ability to have a copy of the feedback. 
On XX/XX/XXXX or XXXX I received a call from XXXX XXXX (? ) asking me if I wanted to add any more to the complaint. I told her what I wrote in that complaint was about what I felt was Libertys failure to do business in a timely manner and feel that I am paying over twice because of their delays. There are quite a few issues I have with how seniors are treated and the manipulation used in this process is not only ethically wrong but it is morally wrong. XXXX said that she could not do anything but she would escalate it. I had been told that before and nothing happened. I told her that having almost {$20000.00} in my bank account is making me nervous, that I wanted to send the money back and felt I should not be charged interest on it. I also told her that repeating again and again these issues is causing me physical problems and affecting me mentally. I am exhausted. See attached voice recording of the conversation XXXX. 
On XX/XX/XXXX or XXXX I receive a call XXXX the ( operation XXXX and XXXX the sales department from Liberty- they are going to escalate it. XXXX said she would email me the welcome package and the information I requested. I received a package of some of the information. The Welcome package still hasnt been received. Enough people at Liberty know this it is stressing me out to have these funds ( where I feel it is vulnerable ) and are affecting my health, they know that I am not sleeping, my health has been severely affected and I am mentally exhausted. I have stated that many times in XXXX in conversations that I feel like I am XXXX XXXX XXXX. The emotional trauma is literally killing me. See attached voice recording XXXX. 
Then the week of XX/XX/XXXX I received a letter in the mail. Get this 7 point type. See attachment F. 
I guess things are being elevated. I believe they are just trying to delay and do not intend to respond. Knowing this is affecting my health. Maybe XXXX XXXX how many seniors have they put in their graves? By this neglect and strategy ignore the person. 
This company needs to be held responsible. Although I do not think this conduct is isolated just to Liberty but to XXXX Mortgage companies. 

Suggestions Get copies of the recorded phone calls, these recordings will clarify everything. 
Have the recordings evaluated by a XXXX  for elder abuse and the isolation. I was exhausted by the time I closed I couldnt take any more. They isolated me, figured out my weakness at that point- my fear that interest rates were going to go up. As I was reminded in several conversations that rates changes occur on Tuesday of each week. 
I would like to know all the dbas that have been involved and how many of them are subsidiaries or the relationship with Liberty Mutual. 
I would like to have the Welcome package that was promised, the funds returned and the associated interest be returned to m. 

My health has been severely affected by this experience. I am a person who rarely has XXXX I have them daily. Experience very disturbed XXXX XXXX I feel suffocated and often find myself XXXX XXXX  in which I need to sit up to calm my body. I have lost 2 crowns on my teeth because of the grinding. My XXXX and XXXX  track is in pain daily ( XXXX, XXXX, XXXX XXXX and more. I have also developed the XXXX XXXX instead of XXXX  normally. 

The mental stress and XXXX ( which is why it has taken me so long to put this complaint together ) is fought daily the conduct and lack of humanity these companies use is something that will never leave me. I wonder how many other seniors have experienced the conduct of this company, and have just given up. It is too overwhelming. 

I think the reverse mortgage program had good intentions, but never considered the greed of these corporations that have turned it into something so completely vulgar. If this had gone as presented, I would now be able to be kind to people and live my life I am filing this complaint because no senior should go through this. 

NOTE : There are 2 - MP3 files that I would like to send- either I already hit the limit on the size or I don't know how to send them. The are important.

Company response to consumer: Closed with explanation