any serious reform. But today there is some substance behind what is being done at the present time, and that is what concerns hon. Members opposite. Today, we hear hon. Members opposite coming forward, as they have done in the past, and saying that they are so anxious to throw over the hereditary principle. They have been fighting to maintain the hereditary principle in this country generation after generation, yet now they say," Oh, we are not concerned about the hereditary principle." Are they not? Will they apply the removal of the hereditary principle all around, from top to bottom? Will they? No, I do not think they will. But always, when they are faced with an attack of any kind, when they feel the people are likely to rise against them, they are prepared to make all kinds of concessions. As Tolstoy said, "The wealthy will do anything for the poor but get off their backs." So it is with the crowd opposite; when there is any proposal for dealing with such an anachronism as the House of Lords they are ready to do anything but give up the Second Chamber, and what the Second Chamber means to them -- the possibility 288 of holding back the progress of the people of this country. A Member for one of the Universities said that we must all agree that a Second Chamber, however constituted, must have the power of real delay. I never heard anything like that in all my