own grassroots and of public opinion at large. So I was talking to him on that basis on a number of occasions. LIZ JACKSON: The politics rather than the science? NICK MINCHIN: Yeah, Yeah. LIZ JACKSON: Over the next two months Tony Abbott put this to his leader Malcolm Turnbull, sometimes he say on morning bikes rides in Canberra ,but Malcolm Turnbull was unpersuadable, and still is; and the word crap still rankles. MALCOLM TURNBULL: Well, I was very disappointed ah that he said that. I don't think that any reasonable, prudent person in public life, you know, any policy maker in government or in an alternative government, can reasonably say this is all a lot of crap and we don't have to worry about it. We only have to do so much as to you know resolve whatever political issues that there might be. LIZ JACKSON (Tony Abbott): Malcolm Turnbull tells us that he was disappointed by your comment that climate change is crap. TONY ABBOTT: Well, that's not exactly what I said. A, it was, if you like, a bit of spur of the moment hyperbole, but b, I was talking about the arguments on climate change, in particular the argument that the that the science is settled. Now, I don't believe that the science is settled. Certainly, I think that climate change happens and I think that prudent governments take reasonable precautions against credible threats. LIZ JACKSON: Do you worry about global warming? TONY ABBOTT: I worry