be offended with seeing that on a forum, hence I didn't need to be banned for it. I didn't mean to misrepresent anything you said. If I misread anything, please tell me what it was and in what way I was off the mark, I really am interested to hear your opinion, it was just a little frustrating that your response was not to explain but to, to my mind, have a go at me for not being satisfied with your answer. In that way, I don't think you did explain yourself - you raised some points that I disagreed with but if I got the wrong end of the stick, please let me know instead of bemoaning how I've misunderstood. As I said, this is about debate for me, it's not about necessarily reaching one certain end point, I wanted people to have an open discussion about standards on the boards. Granted, Matt's given me his time and attention and that's really good of him, so please be clear that I appreciate his effort. To me though, this is a discussion between two people and I don't see that I should have nothing left to say when I get a response. So please don't assume that it's "not good enough" purely because I'm continuing a discussion with Matt, I think this is a good topic to have open and I appreciate people's contributions, whether or not I agree with everything they say. I really have to leave and pick