around, in particular this arena and found nothing. Nor did my memory help. So if anyone can point to previous threads please help! I'd submit that a dead charismatic leader is probably the most effective kind: he can be infinitely romanticized without the risk that he'll say or do something inconsistent with the image. __________________ ?The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary? AQ was never so much about the man or the ideology, but rather about "the cause." Little, other than the Arab Spring, has been designed to address the cause of AQ; or to help address the many diverse causes of the many diverse populaces that AQ is reliant upon to operationalize their vision or tactics. Instead we have worked in many ways to reinforce the causes and to validate the unifying message of AQ, while at the same time being overly focused on the group itself, and those groups that turn to them for support. While people are being biblical, 50 is plenty for a dead martyr; look what Jesus did with 12... __________________ Robert C. Jones Intellectus Supra Scientia Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex and more violent; but it takes a touch of genius and lots of courage to move something in the opposite direction." Albert Einstein "We are now forming a republican government. Real liberty is