the retention of that House and its power because it is a fortress of Toryism and reaction and has always been. I want to answer the case of the other House with an opinion other than my own. Disraeli, the great leader of the Tory Party said: We owe the English peerage to three sources -- the spoliation of the church, the open and flagrant abuse of honours and the borough mongering of our own kind. These are the three main sources of the existing peerage of England, and, in my opinion, disgraceful ones. Probably like some people who were Liberals and then became Tories. Mr. Joseph Chamberlain said this before he became a Tory: During the last 100 years the House of Lords has never contributed one iota to popular liberties or popular freedom or done anything to advance the common weal; and during that time it has protected every abuse and sheltered every privilege. 296 He continues: Are the Lords to dictate to us, the people of England ... the laws which we shall make and the way in which we shall bring them in? Are you going to be governed by yourselves? This is available for the hon. and gallant Member in the Library. It was made in 1909. And another statement was made: When you hear it said that all the House of Lords wish to do is to ascertain the true will of the people, do not be deceived by that. You will find, I