Your speculation that a slightly warmer world (or average) with a slightly lower relative humidity (or average) would have significantly different rainfall patterns locally than those local rainfall patterns in today's world, and that this would be moving from a current desirable state to a less desirable state in the future, is pure conjecture, for which you have not provided any empirical supporting data. Max tempterrain John Westman, So if anyone fills a book with crap, no-one who hasn't purchased a copy is allowed to comment on what it is filled with? Ian Plimer just makes it up as he goes along. It may seem a small point but he's stated that the Romans grew grapes and oranges in Northern England. Like most of his statements it is just given without any reference. Grapes possibly. There is now a vinyard near York I believe. Although I dare say that Roman aristocracy would have paid a little extra for the imported ones from warmer climates, but oranges? I don't think so. Its just not warm enough. manacker Tempterrain Peter, don't shoot yourself in the foot. You wrote (of Plimer's book): "Ian Plimer just makes it up as he goes along. It may seem a small point but he's stated that the Romans grew grapes and oranges in Northern England. Like most of his statements it is just given without any reference." I have read the sections on both the Roman Warming and the Medieval Warm Period. Nowhere does Plimer say that