is incapable of it and wouldn't do so without belief. John Small Berries How, then, would you respond to someone who directly accuses atheists of having no motivation to be good people, since we don't believe we'll have a reward or punishment in "the afterlife"? Rainydayjess How about: If your only motivation to be good to others is that your god will torture you later if you don't, by all means, please, for the love of humanity, keep going to church! Coyotenose Hmmm.  "Healthy people don't require approval to be happy when they see other people warm and fed. I don't, and I bet you don't either." Greg Gay Right. Giving that response is a refutation that the theist is necessarily doing it for God. But rather than using "selflessness", I would admit "I do it for that internal rewarding satisfaction I get that seems to come from the evolution of social groups", or something less cumbersome that makes the point. ttp://www.facebook.com/don.gwinn Don Gwinn The point about picking and choosing what to believe is correct.  BUT (you knew there'd be a "but," right?) It's still important to point out that you can't have it both ways -- you must EITHER take the bible as inerrant, OR take it as an allegorical book from which you can choose to take some lessons and leave others. It's OK with me if a Christian believer wants to take the position that he will think for himself and reject parts of the bible that