we've seen a reduction in the people arriving from Sri Lanka for a period. There's always a range of measures. But I think when you look at the situation, the clear fact: June, the second lowest month; July, the third lowest month; and more than 1000 less arrivals in the same time period last year, then you have to say --  Van Onselen: But whether they're lower --  Bowen: Something has changed, and the thing that's changed in more recent times is the announcement that people will be returned to Malaysia. Van Onselen: But even if you accept that things have changed and the numbers are lower, there's still been nearly 600 arrivals since the announcement in May. Now, that's close to the 800 cap. So if that happens over the next three or four months, you are going to need another arrangement beyond the cap of 800. Bowen: As I said before, let's just see this operate. Van Onselen: We're only talking three months here. I'm not asking you to speculate three years ahead. Bowen: No, no, but let's see it operate. And I think, you know, obviously people smugglers will sell anything, and they will say, and they're already out there saying, I've got no doubt, 'Oh look, this doesn't apply to you, I'll get you on a boat'. Or, 'Look, you know, Australia won't be able to deliver this, this is all talk', this is, you know, what the people smugglers will be selling. Now, I think