in the transfer to Malaysia and the appropriate support that goes into place in Malaysia. Van Onselen: I'm not worried about the cost of the ones coming here. I'd be happy to bear whatever cost on that one as a taxpayer. Bowen: Well, the cost there is around $70 million over four years. And that goes to all the costs: that goes to the transfer costs, the transport costs, it goes to the transit centre which is being established for the first 45 days. So people will go to Malaysia for 45 days; they'll be in a transit centre. That's not one of the existing detention centres, unlike Mr Morrison's false claims. It is a centre which is appropriate: low to medium security, where those people can have their initial checks before they move into the community. It also includes supplementation from us. The UNHCR and the IOM --  Van Onselen: What sort of amounts are we talking about? Bowen: Well, for the UNHCR you're looking at about, say, $10 million over the four years. And for the IOM we're looking at about $25 million over four years. That's included in that total cost. Van Onselen: And was that important to bring them on board, I mean, to be able to sort of get this deal struck as it was this week, those kind of payment to the UNHCR to be able to create goodwill? Bowen: Well, no, we asked them to be involved. We said we wanted their help