Source document: https://docs-lawep.s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/1694823696423.pdf (Botswana)
THE SECOND MEETING OF THE THIRD SESSION OF THE TWELFTH PARLIAMENT FRIDAY 25 FEBRUARY 2022 MIXED VERSION HANSARD NO: 205 THE NATIONAL ASSEMBLY SPEAKER The Hon.

Phandu T. C. Skelemani PH, MP.

DEPUTY SPEAKER Hon.

P. P. P. Moatlhodi, MP.

(Tonota) Clerk of the National Assembly Deputy Clerk of the National Assembly Acting Learned Parliamentary Counsel Assistant Clerk (E) His Excellency Dr M. E. K. Masisi, MP.

His Honour S. Tsogwane, MP.


(Boteti West) CABINET - President - Vice President - Ms B. N. Dithapo - Mr L. T. Gaolaolwe - Advocate L. O. Tlhowe - Mr R. Josiah Hon.

K. N. S. Morwaeng, MP.

(Molepolole South) - Minister for Presidential Affairs, Governance and Public Administration Hon.

K. T. Mmusi, MP.

(Gabane-Mmankgodi) - Minister of Defence, Justice and Security Hon.

Dr L. Kwape, MP.

(Kanye South) - Minister of International Affairs and Cooperation Hon.

K. K. Autlwetse, MP.


(Specially Elected) - Minister of Local Government and Rural Development Hon.

K. S. Gare, MP.

(Moshupa-Manyana) - Minister of Agricultural Development and Food Security Hon.

P. K. Kereng, MP.

(Specially Elected) - Minister of Environment, Natural Resources Conservation and Tourism Hon.

Dr E. G. Dikoloti MP.

(Mmathethe-Molapowabojang) - Minister of Health and Wellness Hon.

T.M.

Segokgo, MP.

(Tlokweng) - Minister of Transport and Communications Hon.

K. Mzwinila, MP.
K. Mzwinila, MP.

(Specially Elected) - Minister of Land Management, Water and Sanitation Services Hon.

T. M. Rakgare, MP.

(Mogoditshane) - Minister of Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Development Hon.

A. M. Mokgethi, MP.

(Gaborone Bonnington North) - Minister of Nationality, Immigration and Gender Affairs Hon.

P. O. Serame, MP.

(Specially Elected) - Minister of Finance and Economic Development Hon.

F. M. M. Molao, MP.

(Shashe West) - Minister of Basic Education Hon.

Dr D. Letsholathebe, MP.


(Tati East) Hon.

L. M. Moagi, MP.

(Ramotswa) - Minister of Tertiary Education, Research, Science and Technology - Minister of Mineral Resources, Green Technology and Energy Security Hon.

M. Kgafela, MP.

(Mochudi West) - Minister of Investment, Trade and Industry Hon.

M. R. Shamukuni, MP.

(Chobe) - Minister of Employment, Labour Productivity and Skills Development Hon.

E. M. Molale, MP.

(Goodhope-Mabule) - Minister of Infrastructure and Housing Development Hon.
D. M. Mthimkhulu, MP.

(Gaborone South) - Assistant Minister, Presidential Affairs, Governance and Public Administration Hon.

S. N. Modukanele, MP.

(Lerala -Maunatlala) Hon.

T. Monnakgotla, MP.

(Kgalagadi North) Hon.

M. M. Pule, MP.

(Mochudi East) Hon.

M. S. Molebatsi, MP.


(Mmadinare) - Assistant Minister, Local Government and Rural Development - Assistant Minister, Local Government and Rural Development - Assistant Minister, Local Government and Rural Development - Assistant Minister, Agricultural Development and Food Security Hon.

S. Lelatisitswe, MP.

(Boteti East) - Assistant Minister, Health and Wellness Hon.

N. W. T. Makwinja, MP.

(Lentsweletau-Mmopane) - Assistant Minister, Basic Education Hon.

B. Manake, MP.
B. Manake, MP.

(Specially Elected) - Assistant Minister, Investment, Trade and Industry Hon.

H. B. Billy, MP.

(Francistown East) Hon.

A. Lesaso, MP.

(Shoshong) - Assistant Minister, Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Development - Assistant Minister,Tertiary Education, Research, Science and Technology MEMBERS OF PARLIAMENT AND THEIR CONSTITUENCIES Names Constituency Hon.

L. Kablay, MP.

(Government Whip) Letlhakeng-Lephephe RULING PARTY (Botswana Democratic Party) Hon.

Dr U. Dow, MP.

Hon.


P. Majaga, MP.

Hon.

M. Balopi, MP.

Hon.

J. S. Brooks, MP.

Hon.

C. Greeff, MP.

Hon.

T. Letsholo, MP.

Hon.

T. F. Leuwe, MP.

Hon.

T. Mangwegape-Healy, MP.

Hon.

Dr T. Matsheka, MP.

Hon.

S. N. Moabi, MP.

Hon.

P. K. Motaosane, MP.

Hon.

O. Regoeng, MP.

Hon.

J. L. Thiite, MP.


Specially Elected Nata-Gweta Gaborone North Kgalagadi South Gaborone Bonnington South Kanye North Takatokwane Gaborone Central Lobatse Tati West Thamaga-Kumakwane Molepolole North Ghanzi North OPPOSITION (Umbrella for Democratic Change) Hon.

D. Saleshando, MP.

(Leader of the Opposition) Hon.

M. G. J. Motsamai, MP.


(Opposition Whip) Maun West Ghanzi South Selebi Phikwe West Mahalapye East Sefhare-Ramokgonami Ngami Okavango Maun East Bobonong Selebi Phikwe East Palapye Nkange Mahalapye West Francistown West Hon.

D. L. Keorapetse, MP.

Hon.

Y. Boko, MP.

Hon.

Dr K. Gobotswang, MP.

Hon.

C. K. Hikuama, MP.

Hon.

K. K. Kapinga, MP Hon.

G. Kekgonegile, MP.

Hon.

T. B. Lucas, MP.

Hon.

K. Nkawana, MP.

Hon.

O. Ramogapi, MP.

Hon.

Dr N. Tshabang, MP.

Hon.

D. Tshere, MP.

Hon.


M. I. Moswaane, MP.

Hon.

T. S. Khama, MP.

Hon.

L. Lesedi, MP.

Hon.

B. Mathoothe, MP.

Hon.

M. Reatile, MP.

(Botswana Patriotic Front) Serowe West Serowe South Serowe North Jwaneng-Mabutsane Hon.

W. B. Mmolotsi, MP.
Francistown South (Alliance for Progressives) TABLE OF CONTENTS THE SECOND MEETING OF THE THIRD SESSION OF THE TWELFTH PARLIAMENT FRIDAY 25th FEBRUARY, 2022 CONTENTS PAGE (S MINISTER’S QUESTION TIME............................................................................................................................1 QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER...................................................................................................................1-3 QUESTION WITHOUT NOTICE..........................................................................................................................4 Commission of Enquiry to Investigate the Nature and Extent of Corruption, Economic Crime, Mismanagement, Maladministration and Unethical Governance in Public Institutions Motion (Resumed Debate) ...............................................................................................................................4-25 Government to Consider Supplementing North West District Cattle Farmers who Sell their Cattle to Botswana Meat Commission (BMC) Motion.............................................................................................................................................................26-35 Friday 25th February, 2022 THE ASSEMBLY met at 9:00 a.m. (THE SPEAKER in the Chair) P R A Y E R S * * * * MINISTER’S QUESTION TIME MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT, NATURAL RESOURCES CONSERVATION AND TOURISM THEME: TOURISM DEVELOPMENT AND PROMOTION Asked the Minister of Environment, Natural Resources Conservation and Tourism: HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa rra, ga ke bue ka Letlhakane.
Ke bua ka Letlhakeng Sub District, e seng Letlhakane e wena o buang ka yone.

MR BILLY: Okay, thank you, Letlhakeng Sub District.

Tota re a itemogela gore go botlhokwa gore re ka nna le stadium sa mofuta oo koo.

Keletso ke gore fa re ka nna le madi re tlaa direla Letlhakeng Sub District, districts le sub districts tse dingwe mini stadiums.

Gompieno re na le di le 10 tse re di dirang mo lefatsheng la Botswana.
Thotloetso e e teng ke gore, kwa Letlhakeng Sub District, re rotloetse metshameko e mengwe e e ka dirwang fa go senang mabala teng a a tshwanang le Annual Horse Racing in Motokwe.

E na le tatedi e e seng kana ka sepe, e rotloetsa metshameko, go ntsha banana bodutu le go ba okeletsa dikitso tsa metshameko.

Ke a leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.


(i) which tourism events are earmarked for the 2022 Tourism Calendar in Botswana; and (ii) whether there are any plans to develop and promote tourism events throughout the country as a way to improve domestic tourism and livelihoods of Batswana by taking advantage of the diverse cultures of Batswana.

MR BROOKS: Mr Speaker, Minister o phaketse a re o kwa Zimbabwe, ke kopa later date for this question.
Ga a batle go e neeletsa, o batla go ikarabela ka bo ene.

MR LEUWE: Supplementary.

Thank you Mr Speaker, tla ke go leboge Tona le fa karabo ya gago e sa sologele ba Takatokwane molemo thata.

Motho a go botse fela gore, horse racing ka e bile ke foo o supa gore gongwe e ka thusa, a le atle le e eme nokeng?

A ga le lemoge gore bontsi jwa batho ba Letlhakeng Sub District, o tlaa fitlhela ba na le talente jaanong go sena kwa ba e supang teng gore go bonwe ba na le talente.
Le dira jang gore talente e e kwa Letlhakeng Sub District, e tswele kwa ntle batho ba e bone le le ba Youth?

Ke a leboga Mr Speaker.

Later Date.

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER CONSTRUCTION OF MINI STADIUM MR F. T. LEUWE (TAKATOKWANE): asked the Minister of Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Development to state when a mini stadium will be constructed in the Letlhakeng Sub-District to encourage sport development in the area.
OF MINISTER ASSISTANT YOUTH EMPOWERMENT, SPORT AND CULTURE DEVELOPMENT (MR BILLY): Mma ke kope maitshwarelo Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, maranyane a me ga a ntetle gore ke ka bula video.

Ke kope maitshwarelo gape gore, maabane Ministry of Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Development o bo o sa iponatsa go araba dipotso tse di neng di boditswe ministry.

Ke lebaka la gore re ne ra goroga moragonyana, flight ya go ya Kasane e ne ya diega.
Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, karabo ke gore tota ka boammaaruri, ga re na plans tsa go dira a mini stadium kwa Letlhakane Sub District, lebaka ke gore go dirwa ke gore ga re na madi… MR BILLY: Ke a leboga Mr Speaker, ke a leboga Honourable Leuwe.

Re etse tlhoko metshameko ka go farologana, mme kwa Motokwe Horse Racing re tsaya karolo mo go yone dinako tse tsotlhe.

Maloba ka December officer wa MYSC o ne a tsaya karolo koo, ke selo se re se rotloetsang thata gore se diragale.
Metshameko ka go farologana ga yone, re etse tlhoko gore e tokafale mo lefatsheng la rona.

Re dumela gore ka yone re ka kgona go tlhama mebereko ra tokafatsa itsholelo ya lefatshe la Botswana.

Ke a leboga motlotlegi.


YOUTH DEVELOPMENT FUND MR K. NKAWANA (SELEBI PHIKWE EAST): asked the Minister of Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Development to state: (i) the number of youths who have received funding under the Youth Development Fund (YDF) programme in the last five years in Selebi Phikwe East Constituency; (ii) how many YDF businesses are still operational and how many have collapsed; and (iii) lessons learned from all the projects funded.
1 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER OF MINISTER ASSISTANT YOUTH EMPOWERMENT, SPORT AND CULTURE DEVELOPMENT (MR BILLY): Mma ke tseye sebaka se Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente ke go leboge.

Potso e ne e botsa gore re thusitse banana ba le kae ka lenaneo la Youth Development Fund (YDF) mo dingwageng tse tlhano tse di fetileng, mo Selebi Phikwe Constituency.

Karabo e ntse jaana, ka Ngwaga wa Madi wa 2017/18 le 2021/22, re ne ra thusa projects tsa banana di le 16.
Mo go tsone re ne ra dirisa madi a a kanang ka P1, 469, 797.00 mo lenaneong la YDF mo Selebi Phikwe East Constituency.

12 wa projects tseo e ne e le tsa services, tse pedi e le tsa agriculture, tse pedi e le tsa manufacturing.

Ke tlhalose gore Ngwaga wa Madi wa 2020/21, re ne ra se ka ra ntsha madi go ya go thusa banana mo Kgaolong ya Selebi Phikwe East ka lebaka la COVID-19.
Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, Honourable Nkawana o ne a batla go itse gore mo projects tse ke buang ka tsone, ke dife tse di santseng di dira le tse di phutlhameng.

Mo go tse 16, 12 di santse di bereka sentle, tse pedi di tswetse madirelo, tse pedi di emetse go fiwa madi ka 2021/22 Financial Year, di mo procurement stage.
Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, ke supe gore dikgwebo tsa banana tsa YDF di gateletswe ke rents tse di kwa godimo fela thata le mmaraka o o seyong wa products le ditlamelo tse ke sa tswang go bua ka tsone le go tlhoka go tsenya moko mo nameng ga banana mo dikgwebong tsa bone.

Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, mo nakong e ke supe gore ga re a phutha mabogo re lela sa ga ragele.
Re tsweletse ka go rotloetsa banana ka to monitor dikgwebo tsa bone le go ba ruta go tsamaisa dikgwebo mo gotweng capacity building.

We then monitor coaching ya dikgwebo tsa banana re dirisa Local Enterprise Authority (LEA), United Nations Development Programme (UNDP) le Botswana International University of Science and Technology (BIUST).

Re itemogetse rraetsho gore banana ga ba duele sentle.
Re ne ra dira thulaganyo ya lenaneo which was launched by Tona Rre Rakgare la “Akola ke Akole.” Ka lone re rotloetsa banana gore fa ba akotse jalo, lenaneo le tshwanetse le tswelele.

Ba tshwanetse go duela.

O ikopanye le ba Ministry of Youth Empowerment, Sport and Culture Development (MYSC) kwa diofising tse di leng teng mo dikgaolong go tla ka a payment plan ya gore o ka duela ka tsela e e ntseng jang.

Re itemogetse rraetsho ka lack of commitment mo bananeng.
Banana ba na le entitlement mentality ya gore loans tse ga ba di duele.

Re rotloetsa gore banana ba di duele ka ditsela tse di farologanyeng tse ke setseng ke buile ka tsone.

Ba goga maoto le go tlisa financial performance kwa diofising tsa MYSC go supa gore ba tsamayatsamaya fa kae, ba ka thusiwa fa kae.

Ba tlhoka entrepreneurial skills tse ke sa tswang go tlhalosa ka tsone gore di botlhokwa.
Re tsweletse re a ruta, re ba direla workshops, ba ba iseng ba tsene mo kgwebong le ba ba nang le dikeletso tsa go tsena mo go yone.

Gompieno fa ke bua le wena Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, re mo Kasane.

Re tlile go rotloetsa banana gore ba fetole ka fa ba tsamaisang dikgwebo tsa bone ka teng.

Ke supa gore le gone moo, go ka re neela maduo a a bonalang.

Go tswalwa ga moepo le gone go ne ga re babalela thata kwa Selebi Phikwe East le COVID-19 restrictions di ne tsa babalela dikgwebo tsa banana.
Ke a leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

MR NKAWANA: Ke a leboga Mr Speaker.

Ke botse Tona gore a a re mo ngwageng wa 2022/2023, le na le dikopo di le pedi fela so far.

Motho o ka botsa gore have you set aside funds for other potential youth ba ba tlaabong ba na le projects.

Potso e nngwe e bo e nna gore a le ntse le ya go di tsamaisa ka same style jaaka le ne le dira?
Le ntse le bona gore di a palelwa kgotsa go na le any radical change mo tsamaisong ya lona e e ka dirang gore projects tsa banana di itshwarelele.

Ba na le mentality wa entitlement.

Le tsile go dira eng go ntsha Batswana mo mentality o o buang ka one, e le go supa gore dilo ga di tsamae sentle ka lebaka le le ntseng jalo?

Ke a leboga.
Ke a leboga.

Gape se sengwe se re se itemogetseng gore re tshwanetse re se tsweledise go se dira botoka ke gore, fa dikgwebo tsa banana re di fa madi, re tshwanetse go nna le precondition gore re ba rotloetse go tsamaisa dikgwebo before re ba neela madi.

Fa re ba neetse madi, re latedise go bona gore dikgwebo tsa bone di tswelela sentle le go ba thusa go bona market mo go se ba se dirang.

MR BILLY: Ke a go leboga motlotlegi.


Reset Agenda e itebagantse le go fetola that mentality e ke ntseng ke bua ka yone, entitlement mentality.

Reset Agenda re kgarametsa ka yone go rotloetsa ba ba mo dikgwebong gore ba fetole jaaka ke tlhalosa.

Ba fetole ka fa ba tsamaisang dikgwebo tsa bone ka teng.

Le go dirisa maranyane rraetsho.


We set priority ya gore businesses 2 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER tse re ka di ntshetsang madi ke tsa mofuta o o ntseng jang, re lebeletse gore businesses tse dintsi tsa banana are collapsing.

Re bo re rotloetsa gape gore banana ba dire dikoporase.

Monana a se ka a ikemela a le nosi.


Ba dire dikoporase go ikopanya go tla ka dikitso tse di farologanyeng go dira dikgwebo ba le mmogo tsa agriculture tse di nang le maduo kana value chain e e ka bonalang mo go tsone.

Agriculture ke nngwe ya sectors tse re rotloetsang banana go tsena mo go yone re lebeletse chain.

Businesses tsa bone di ka tswelela because fa o ka lebelela sector e, Goromente o beile focus e ntsi mo go yone.
Tsa technology jaaka ke sa tswa go tlhalosa, le tsone re rotloetsa banana ba di dirise ka gore market wa teng o santse o bulegile go gaisa the normal market e re ntseng re itse go e bona ya go bula dikgwebo o sa latele batho.

Ke a leboga.

MR HIKUAMA: Ke a leboga Honourable Speaker.

Ke utlwa Tona a re ba dirisa lenaneo la Reset Agenda go fetola the entitlement mentality wa banana.
Ke batla gore a re fe go feta foo gore this Reset Agenda just being a phrase, what are they actually doing to ensure that they are rolling out the Reset Programme go lokolola ditlhaloganyo tsa banana ka fa ba dirang ka teng?

What is it that they are doing practically to change the mindset of the youth?

Ke a leboga.

MR BILLY: Ke a leboga Honourable Hikuama.

Mo phuthegong e re e tshwereng letsatsi leno kwa Kasane, se re yang go se dira ke sone se o se boditseng.
Re kopane le banana ba ba tsweletseng sentle mo dikgwebong.

Re ba dirisa mo gotweng ‘ngwana o ruta ngwana.’ Re ba dirisa go ruta banana ba bangwe gore dikgwetlho di ntse jang.

Fa o kopane le dikgwetlho o dira jang gore o di rarabolole mo dikgwebong tse re leng mo go tsone.

Se sengwe gape ke go tla ka thotloetso ya gore dikgwebo ka gore di thata go di dira, o tshwanetse o bo o itsetsepetse mo go ntseng jang, mo gotweng capacity building.

Re ba aga ditlhaloganyo go tsamaisa dikgwebo.


Re ba fa skills tsa go tsamaisa dikgwebo.

Ke sone se re se dirang rraetsho go leka go rotloetsa banana gore ba tswe mo tlhaloganyong ya bogologolo, ba tsene mo the current change of mindset e e ka thusang go tsamaisa dikgwebo tsa bone go le motlhofo.
MR MOTSAMAI: Mr Speaker, Tona o bua gore ba a ruta, ba a ruta, lenaneo la bone le le tsepameng la gore ga ba tlogele banana bogolo jang ba ba kwa dikgaolong, kwa tengnyanateng, settlements tsa kwa Kgalagadi, Okavango le Ghanzi ke lefe?

Ba dira jang go tsenelela koo gore le bone ba itse se se batlwang mo bananeng?

Mr Speaker, ke batla go itse gore a ba lemoga sentle gore gone kwa ke go buang, ga go na le fa e le ditlhaeletsanyo tsa radio, ditsela le eng.
How do you reach banana bao gore ba fetole mindset wa bone go bona gore seemo se ba ka itepatepanyang le sone, ba tshela ka sone ke sefe?

Ke a leboga.

MR BILLY: Ke a leboga Motlotlegi Motsamai.

Re dirile lenaneo le re yang go tsamaya dikgaolo ka bontsi.

Mo lenaneong la rona la kwa tengyanateng, ga ke itse gore a go santse go dirisiwa lefoko la tengnyanateng, kana batho ba ba kgakala le ditlamelo jaaka go a tle go buiwe mo malatsing a gompieno.
Fa re leng teng fa, re tshwere phuthego ka maranyane gore ba ba kgakala le go tla fa re leng teng, ba ka bona se re se dirang mo maranyaneng kana ba re sala morago.

Kwa tengnyanateng re ya go goroga rraetsho.

Re na le lenaneo le re yang go fetsa ngwaga re kopana le banana go bona gore dikgwebo tsa bone di tsamaya jang.

O tshwanetse o tlhaloganye Honourable Motsamai gore re na le thulaganyo ya go tsamaya le Honourable Rakgare Botswana jo jotlhe re lekola dikgwebo tsa banana.
Re lekola ka fa banana ba sokolang ka teng go tsena mo market.

So, fa re ya kwa bathong jaana, re ya re ne re sekasekile gore banana ba ka tswa ba tlhoka eng gore ...(inaudible)… tse di ntseng jang.

So, this engagement e re leng mo go yone, re mo go yone re dirile a mini study sa rona re le ministry gore how can we approach banana.

Ke a leboga.

MR LUCAS: Supplementary.

Ke a leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.


Tota kgang ya me e ne e le gore kana Youth Development Fund (YDF) e abelwa dikgaolo jalo ka go farologana madi a a farologaneng, mme kwa e neng e le gore le lemoga gore toropo ya Selebi Phikwe e ne ya babalelwa ke go tswalwa ga moepo, a le ne la oketsa dipalo tsa banana ba le ba thusang le lebile gore go tswalwa ga moepo go amile thata itsholelo ya Selebi Phikwe?

Sa bobedi ke gore kwa Selebi Phikwe go na le ba SPEDU.
Ke batla go itse gore le lomagana le bone jang le le ba MYSC?

Le lomagana le bone jang go leka go thusa dikgwebo tsa banana tse di tsweletseng le tse gongwe ba di akantseng go ya kwa pele?

A le na le tomagano epe e le nang le yone?

Fa le na le yone, gongwe o e ntlhalosetse ka gore ka le rona kwa Bobirwa re mo SPEDU, gongwe lenaneno leo le ka re sologela molemo.

O ntshedimosetse mo tsone tse pedi tseo.

Ke a leboga.
Ke a leboga.

3 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER MR BILLY: Ke a leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, ke a go leboga Honourable Lucas.

Kana SPEDU is a programme e e dirwang ke Goromente.

We are one Government, letsogo la moja le itse se letsogo la molema le se dirang.

So, re na le banana.

Bontsi jwa batho ba ba tsamaisang dikgwebo, o fitlhela go na le banana mo teng.
So, fa go nang le businesses tsa banana, re rotloetsa gore ba fiwe priority re dirisa affirmative action over other competitors.

Se sengwe o ne o bua ka dipalo ka gore go supagetse gore kwa Selebi Phikwe go tswalwa ga meepo go ne ga ama dikgwebo tsa banana.

Re leka go thusana le banana gore re ba bontshe kana re dire mo gotweng ke screening businesses tse ba ka kgonang go di dira jaaka o setse o buile ka SPEDU, tse di dumalanang le dikakanyetso tsa dikgwebo tsa Selebi Phikwe.
Se re se dirang re rotloetsa Banana gore ba dire certain types of businesses tse e leng gore ...(inaudible)… le Phikwe.

Ke sengwe se e leng gore re se tshwere raetsho.

Re rotloetsa gore banana ba dire businesses tsa dikoporase tse di kopanetsweng go leka go tokafatsa go tsamaisiwa ga dikgwebo.

Ke a leboga honourable.


MR LUCAS: Nnyaa mme Tona o kare ga o e arabe ka gore potso e ne e le gore a mme ka gore kwa Selebi Phikwe go ne ga tswalwa moepo, a le ne la tlhatlosa madi a le a neelang ba Selebi Phikwe le lebile gore ba amilwe thatathata ke go wa ga moepo?

Ga o a tsena mo kgannyeng eo.


Jaanong motho o ne a ka nna le kgatlhego ya gore kwa go nnileng le dibetso tse di tshwanang le tsone tseo, gongwe le ka bo le ne le tlhatlosa madi kgotsa le dira ditsela tse di farologanang le tsa mafelo a mangwe, go nale gore le dire one-size-fits-all.

MR BILLY: Honourable Member, kana bothata jo re nnileng le jone, ke jone jwa tlhaelo ya madi.

Fa o ka lebelela madi a re a ntshitseng gompieno, re a fokoditse.
Maloba a ne a le mantsi mme gompieno re a fokoditse per constituency.

Ke sone se se bakileng seo.

Ke mogopolo o montle gore gongwe re nne fa fatshe re sekaseke gore ba Selebi Phikwe ba ka thusiwa ka tsela e e ntseng jang.

MR SPEAKER (MR SKELEMANI): Thank you, let us move on to question without notice.

Honourable Moswaane.
QUESTION WITHOUT NOTICE BAN OF IMPORTATION OF FRUITS AND VEGETABLES MR M. I. MOSWAANE (FRANCISTOWN WEST): asked the Minister of Agricultural Development and Food Security if he is aware that: (i) the ban of importation of fruits and vegetables into Botswana, is being used by large chain stores to monopolise and drive the informal sector into poverty and out of business; (ii) some informal traders are unable to source enough potatoes from local farmers as far as Gantsi, Kudumatse and Tuli Block as those farmers are refusing to sell to them; (iii) large chain stores enter into contracts with farmers for their produce in advance and hence leave only left overs or nothing at all for Batswana traders and that if this is left unchecked, many Batswana owned business will not survive; and (iv) what is the impact of the ban on importation of fruits and vegetables on the informal traders in Botswana.
...Silence...

HONOURABLE MEMBER: General, o a bidiwa!

...Silence...

MR SPEAKER: Motlotlegi ga a yo.

Honourable Mooswaane, are you not there?

Honourable Members, let us proceed.

Clerk, let us move on to Motions.

COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONS Motion (Resumed Debate) MR SPEAKER: Order!

Order!

Honourable Members, the debate is resuming.


When the House adjourned on the 18th of this month, Honourable Kekgonegile was on the floor debating and he is left with 4 minutes 14 seconds.

Honourable Kekgonegile.

MR KEKGONEGILE (MAUN EAST): Tanki Mr Speaker.

Mma re dumedise batlotlegi le setšhaba ka kakaretso.

Go ntse jalo Mr Speaker, gore kana Motion o fa pele ga rona, ba ga rona ba ipelaetsa gore o tshwara kwa le kwa.
O tshwanetse gore o tshware kwa le kwa ka gore fa o bua ka go dira dilo sentle, o bua ka dilo tse di 4 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) farologaneng tse dintsinyana tse di sa diriweng sentle.

So, ga o ka ke wa lebagana fela o bo o re corruption kana maladministration kwa.
O tshwanelwa ke gore o tseye corruption kana maladministration in general jaaka gompieno re lebile Constitutional Review.

Ga re a tlhopha a specific Clause kana Section re bo re re re lebagana le yone, re ile kwa Batswaneng fela ra re a re sekasekeng Constitution.

Gone moo fela go supa gore ra re a reyeng kwa diphetogong.

Ra re Motion o o tlhamaletse o siame, mathata a matona fela ke e gore o sirelediwa ke Matona fela.
Ke tsaya gore setšhaba se eletsa go utlwa Mapalamente a Domkrag ba akgela, e seng Matona fela jaaka gompieno go bua bone fela o ipotsa gore ba sireletsa eng?

A mme ga gona mosi mongwe gone fa go a bo go bua Matona fela e le bone ba ba sireletsang ba re ga ba batle Motion?

Setšhaba se eletsa go utlwa Mapalamente fela ba Domkrag, backbench go utlwa gore ba reng.

Go botlhokwa thata gore... HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification Honourable Kekgonegile.
MR KEKGONEGILE: Ke two minutes fela comrade, nako ya teng e tšhaile.

Setšhaba se eletsa go itse gore naare mme Cabinet e ya rona e, a ka fa e dirang dilo ka teng go siame?

A kamoso fa motho a le mo dipampiring gotwe o mo tshekong, maitseboa a le mo Khuduthamageng, a le mo Palamenteng, a ke dilo tse di re siametseng re le lefatshe kana ga re dire dilo tsentle?
A declaration of assets yone e e leng gore ga e kgone go nna transparent, ga e kgone go nna public, e fitlhilwe golo gongwe, a mme ga se yone e dirang gore dilo di se ka tsa tsamaya sentle, di nne le tshokamo e ntsi?

Setšhaba se eletsa go itse dilo tseo.

Re tsaya gore Motion o o lebaganye le dilo tse di ntseng jalo.

Gompieno ministries tse di kwa Central Business District (CBD) tsotlhe di 75 per cent capacity full, 25 per cent ya ofisi ga di dirisiwe mme go a duelwa.
Gone moo fela ka bogone, ke dilo tse re tshwanelwang ke gore di buiwe di bonwe gore a mme ke tsone.

Go dira businesses ga Mapalamente, Cabinet, Makhanselara le Goromente, a dilo tse di siame fa re re badirelapuso bone ba se ka ba di dira?

Fa o ya kwa bo America, ga se mo e leng gore gatwe, why fix it when it is not broken.

MaAmerica ngwaga le ngwaga ba na le tsamaiso ya gore they review melao le judgements tsa bone, go bona gore a mme di santse di le relevant.
Le rona ke nako ya gore we should review ditsamaiso and institutions tsa rona, go bona gore a mme di santse di le relevant.

Mme setšhaba ke sone se se ka re thusang go re nnyaa, mmapodi ga a ka ke a ipona se se mo tlhogong.
Lona ba le tshwereng, ga le a tshwara sentle fa le fa le fa, ke sone se ke dumalanang le Motion o. E bile gape fa re leba dikgang tse di tshwanang le tsa Directorate of Intelligence and Security (DIS); setšhaba se lela thata ka DIS, ka fa e tseneletseng tenders ka teng, ka fa e senyang ka teng ga se gone.

Ka fa e tseneletseng appointments tsa public service ka teng, gore go abelwa mang tiro efe, ga se gone.
Dilo tse re tshwanelwa ke gore re utlwe setšhaba se re bolelela gore nnyaa, mme fa ga le a tshwara sentle.

DIS e dira intelligence e e tshwanang le dikgang tse di neng di diragala maloba mo Phase II.

Ke tsone dilo tse DIS e tshwanelang ke go lebagana le tsone, e seng go tla go tsenelela mo diofising, gotwe go a berekwa, gotwe ga o bereke sentle.

Ba itse eng ka go sa bereka sentle, ka bone ba tshwanelwa ke to gather intelligence for tshenyetso-setšhaba.

Key issues gone mo Motion o ke governance.


Governance re bua ka accountability, transparency, responsibility, freedom from office abuse.

Ke dumela gore Motion o Mr Speaker o siame, I support it.

Tanki.

MR SPEAKER: Thank you Honourable Kekgonegile.

Honourable Moatlhodi, Member for Tonota and Deputy Speaker.

MR MOATLHODI (TONOTA): Ke a go leboga Motlotlegi Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, good morning sir.
Ke tsaya sebaka se go tlhalosetsa Palamente eno ya tlotla gore mo lefatsheng le la rona re na le lekgotla le bidiwa gotwe Department of Public Prosecutions (DPP), le le lebaganeng fela le bosekisi, le sa kgatlhalesege gore ke mang.

Mongwe le mongwe yo o belaelwang gore o na le molato, lephata le le tlhomamisa gore o a sekisiwa.

Re na le lekgotla le la Directorate on Corruption and Economic Crime (DCEC) le le tletseng ka magano a batho ba le bantsi, including Batlotlegi Mapalamente.
Tla ke fe sekai ka diteemane, DCEC fa e belaela gore o bereka kwa diteemaneng kana o na le mongwe mokgwa o o bosula o o o dirang ka diteemane tsa Botswana, e a go tlhotlhomisa.

DCEC fa e belaela gore o tsamaya mo tseleng ya botshelo mme ga o e tsamae sentle, o rata go gogorupa dikhumo tsa lefatshe le kana tsa batho ba lefatshe le, ka fa e seng ka mokgweng, e a o go tlhotlhomisa.

Fa e go tshwara gore ka nnete o na le monko wa bogodu e go isa kwa lekgotleng la DPP gore e go sekise.
Re na le lekgotla le teng le bidiwa gotwe DIS, le le tletseng ka legano 5 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) la mongwe le mongwe, bangwe e bile re e tshabela kgakala re re e magwata, mme nna ga ke e tshabe ka gore ke mongwe wa batho ba ba dirileng molao o. DIS ke matlho, dinko, ditsebe le dinao tsa setšhaba, gongwe le gongwe fa seretse sa tlhoka tshiamo se nkgang teng, e ya teng, mme fa e ka tswa ka ledupa e go isa kwa DPP.
Re na le sepodise se bidiwa gotwe Criminal Investigation Department (CID), ga ba apere seaparo sa mapodise, ba tsamaya…le bone ke dinko, ditsebe, matlho a setšhaba, ba a nkga.

Fa go nkgang bodupa jo e seng jwa tshiamo teng ba go isa kwa DPP.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: A ba kile ba go nkga Rraagwe Nkamo?

MR MOATLHODI: A ko o inketlele Rraetsho.

Re na le sepodise se bidiwa gotwe Special Branch, bogologolo se ne se le teng, ga ke itse gore a se santse se le teng, le gore se bidiwa jalo.
Ke sepodise le sone, se bereka fela jaaka CID.

Makgotla a otlhe tiro ya teng ke go tlhotlhomisa, go bona gore ga gona ope yo o gogorupang tse di sa mo tshwanelang.
Ke utlule mongwe wa ditsala tsa me gompieno, ke a dumela ke Motlotlegi Mopalamente wa Maun Botlhaba, o ne a bua sengwe Sekgoa se ke se ratang gotwe, “if it isn’t broken, why fix it.” Ka gore makalana a otlhe a ke sa tswang go a bua Motlotlegi Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente a tlhomilwe ke Puso, a tsepama mo tirong ya one, le ene mong wa Tshutiso e le fa e le ka lepe la malatsi, ga a ise a ko a tle a re makalana a ga a bereke, ga a itse tiro ya one, ka jalo ke tla ka Motion o go a tlhobosa.
E bile fa ke ntse ke gogobisa ditsebe mo mmung, ke utlwa gotwe mong wa Tshutiso e o kile a bereka kwa DCEC.

O itse marumo a yone, mosola wa yone, e bile o itse gore ke lekgotla le le botlhokwa go le kana ka eng.

Lekgotla la DCEC, mafatshe otlhe jikelele, re balela le Russia e e eteletsweng ke Rraetsho Vladimir Putin, le yone e na le DCEC.

Why should we today re e tlole e ntse e bereka, motho a bo a tla a re ke belaela gore lekgotla le ga le bereke sentle, ke tla ka Motion ke o. Heelang!
ga se bogologolo ngwana yo wa ga mogolole, Rraetsho Motlotlegi Dumelang Saleshando, o ne a bua maloba a re kwa lephateng la botsogo go nna go fetotswe bo Permanent Secretary (PS), tota go tlaa tswelela sentle jang.

O ne a re, if it isn’t broken, why fix it.

Letsatsi le ga gona ope yo o ka re rayang a re… bina Phofu.

Ga gona ope letsatsi le yo o ka buang a re lekgotla le senyegile, ke tla ka Motion, why should you fix it if it isn’t broken?

E tlogeleng e ntse jalo.


HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ke kopa Mopalamente.

tlhaloso MR MOATLHODI: O itlhaganele ngwana wa ga nkgonne.

MR SALESHANDO: Ee Rra.

Rre Pono Moatlhodi, o mongwe wa Mapalamente a a kileng a tla mo Palamenteng o ngongorega ka tshenyetso-setšhaba, e bile o batla gore Palamente e dumalane gore go ye go tlhotlhomisiwa.

Nako e o neng o ntsha megopolo eo o batla gore go ye go tlhotlhomisiwa, DCEC e ntse e le teng, sepodise se le teng le DPP, a o ne o raya gore e phatlaladiwe?
MR MOATLHODI: Mogopolo o ke tlileng ka one, thank you for reminding me, ke ne ke bua ka maladministration at the University of Botswana.

I particularly and singularly called for a committee of investigation and Rraetsho Festus Mogae o ne a tlhopha komiti ya go nna jalo, ya bo e a go tlhotlhomisa.

Ya fitlhela tshenyetso-setšhaba e se kana ka sepe.

Ga bo ga ntshiwa mosadi wa Lekgoa ga tlhongwa Professor Bojosi Otlhogile.

Ke santse ke ikgopola, le motlhala wa me o ropame.


Mu ndi lakidze nako ya ngu basekulu.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: E ntse DCEC e le teng?

MR MOATLHODI: I have never said anything about DCEC, but I have particularly and singularly called for the establishment of an investigating committee and it was set up.

Jaanong gompieno makalana a a teng otlhe a a tlhotlhomisang a a itseng tiro ya one.

Ga gona ope yo o kileng a re makalana a o a a tlhobosa, if it isn’t broken, why fix it.
Makalana a a teng, rotlhe re a dumela gore a eteletswe ke Batswana.

Rotlhe re a dumalana gore a dira tiro ka botswerere.

Rotlhe re a dumalana gore everyday they are on the ground doing their job, because lefatshe le ke la molao, thokgamo le le dirang dilo transparently.

Ka bokhutshwane Motlotlegi Motsamaisa…mu ndi lakidze nako ya ngu basekulu.

Ndo i shaka i li pa chena.

Ku na mangwe mabili a salila shule a ndi no shaka ku a tshamba.

Nda boka Mbizi.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: O dumalana le ene?


MR SPEAKER: Two minutes.

MR MOATLHODI: …DCEC…ga gona ope yo o ka re rayang a re DCEC…ke Mokhurutshe, fa ke bua ga ke tsenwe ganong, go a didimalwa.

Ke Mokhurutshe, ke MR MOATLHODI: Nda boka Mbizi.


Ka bokhutshwane Motlotlegi Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, ga ke dumalane le Motion o gotlhelele ka gore re na 6 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) le makalana ke a.
Le fa re ka re re leka to penal beat Motion o, Standing Order 47.2 does not allow us, we are definitely going to be throwing it out of context.

So it is safe and professional to throw it away.

Mo lefatsheng leno, ga re batle tshenyetso-setšhaba, ga se bogologolo Motlotlegi Mopalamente wa Bobonong go utlwiwa selelo sa gagwe, se ntse se le teng, Motlotlegi Tautona a ya kwa Bobirwa a ntsha Commission gore Babirwa ba senyetswa dikgomo.
O tlhophile Commission ke ele e eme ka dinao, re emetse report ya yone, e a goroga.

O gopole gore Motlotlegi Tautona o dirile kgang e a sa tlelwa ka ope Motion.

Why today makalana a rona a le teng go bo go tliwa ka Motion?

Nnyaa bagaetsho, a re lebeng go sele.

Ba re o mo tlhoe mme e se ka ya re ka lepe letsatsi, wa mo tshasa seretse se e seng sone.
Ga ke dumalane le Tshutiso e Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, ke kopa Batlotlegi bakaulengwe ba dumalane le nna re e latlhe ka fensetere, re lebelele e nngwe.

May the good Lord save this great Republic of Botswana.

I thank you Mr Speaker.

HIS HONOUR THE VICE PRESIDENT (MR TSOGWANE): Ke a leboga Mr Speaker.

Ke na le metsotso e le kae Mr Speaker?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ga a tsholetsa.

MR SPEAKER: Ten.

MR TSOGWANE: Sir, how many minutes?

MR SPEAKER: You have ten minutes.


MR TSOGWANE: Ten minutes, thank you Mr Speaker.

Ke go dumedisa, ke bo ke dumedise le Batswana kwa gae.

Ke bo ke kope Batswana gore ba reetse sentle kgang e re e tshwereng gore re e bua jang, re dumalane, re e gana, re e gana jang.

Ke batla go leboga dibui tse di setseng di buile, thatathata tsa Puso ya Domkrag, ba ba supileng fa ba sa dumalane le mogopolo ka fa o ntseng ka teng.
Selo sa ntlha ba ne ba supa bokoa mo mogopolong, jo e leng gore ka fa tsamaisong fela ya go tlhomiwa ga makalana a a tshwanang le a, go a fapoga.

Selo sa bobedi ba ne ba supa fa ba sa dumalane le mogopolo o ka gore ga o supe sentle gore gatwe se se batliwang gore re se fitlhelele ke eng.

Ke gore go bophara fela, go tshwana le motho a latlhela letloa mo metsing a re o a tsoma, gore fa e le gore gongwe o ka sela sengwe, o ka se sela, fa e le gore letloa le tswa fela, le ka tswa fela.
Jaanong rona re dumela mo go reng re tshwanetse gore re ...(silence)... MR SPEAKER: You are lost Vice President (VP).

MR TSOGWANE: ... Kgang ga e yo, e padile le mong wa mogopolo o ...(silence)... MR SPEAKER: You are lost again VP.

MR TSOGWANE: Hello Mr Speaker, hei sale ke timile Mr Speaker, a o ka busetsa metsotsonyana ya me?

Ke sale ke timile.

MR SPEAKER: E ne e eme.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... MR TSOGWANE: Nte ke simolole.
Ke bao ba a tlhodia, Motlotlegi Rre Motsamai, a o ka ithuta go nna o reetsa batho ba bangwe fa ba bua, kana listening is a skill?

O tshwanetse go itse gore listening is a skill, especially for a leader.

So ke ne ke kopa gore re reetsaneng.

Motlotlegi, ke ne ke santse ke re, Batlotlegi ba ba buileng ba ne ba supa sentle gore ga go na kgang e re e beilweng pele, e go tweng e ka re fa e sena go nna e tlhotlhomisiwa, ra fitlhelela maduo a yone.
Go buiwa ka corruption ka bophara, mme kana corruption jaaka re itse, re a e lwantsha.

Motswana mongwe le mongwe le yo o kwa tennyanateng, o a itse gore Goromente yo o itlamile gore o lwantsha corruption, ke sone se o bonang makgotlatshekelo a tshwaragane le bothata ka dikgetsi tse di amanang le tshenyetso-setšhaba.

Dikgetsi tseo di ya koo ka gore di begwa ke Batswana ba ba itseng gore ba tshwanetse gore to report dikgang tsa tshenyetso-setšhaba kwa kae.
Jaanong bangwe bone go raya gore ga ba rotloetse Batswana gore ba tswelele ba isa dikgang tsa tshenyetso-setšhaba kwa makalaneng a re a tlhomileng.

Selo sa ntlha Mr Speaker, re tshwanetse re simolole fela ka go tshepa.
A re setse re re ga re na tshepo mo DCEC, le mo lekalaneng le le lwantshang madi a a dirisiwang a borukutlhi a maloba re fetisa dikgang gone fa tsa melao e mentsintsi, re tlaa tshepiwa ke mafatshe a mangwe gore le rona re eme ka dinao go lwantsha borukutlhi jwa madi a e leng gore ga a tle ka tsela e e siameng.

A ga re na tshepo mo Financial Intelligence Act (FIA) le mo institutions tsotlhe tse e leng gore Motlotlegi Moatlhodi le ba bangwe ba di buile?
Fa re sena tshepo, ra re re di tokafatse jang because ke gone fa kgang e tshwanetseng gore e nne teng?

Re ka tokafatsa jang makalana a gore a tle a kgone a bereke thata, a lome thata, babelaelwa ba kgone gore ditlhotlhomiso tsa teng di wele.
Labofelo le fa Commission e ka nna, ke ntse 7 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) ke one makgotla a a yang go tlhotlhomisa.
So ga ke itse gore jaanong pharologanyo e e tlaa bong e le teng, e tlaabo e le efe jaanong mo go reng go ye go tlhomiwa Commission ka gore ke bone ba ba yang go tlhodumela, le go isa dikgang kwa makgotlatshekelo, bone bo DPP.

Ke bone ba ba yang to investigate, sepodise sa rona se teng to investigate.

Jaanong kgang e e bophara, e bile e ka timetsa setšhaba, le motlhala wa ditlhotlhomiso tse e leng gore makgotla a di tshwere.
Ke ne ke re re se ka ra dumalana le kgang e, yo o tlaa tswang fa a ya go bolelela setšhaba a re ba ganne gore go tlhotlhomisiwe corruption, nnyaa, e tlaabo e le moetimokanyi, ka gore mongwe le mongwe o a utlwa, a itse.

Makalana a a teng a tshwere tiro a tsweletse.

Ke ne ke re re tle re lebe dintlha tse ka kgang e e ntseng jaana.

Bagaetsho, re dumela mo go reng re na le motlhala.


Dikgang di tshwerwe, batho ba a tlhotlhomisiwa, bangwe e re fa ba tlhotlhomisiwa ba le botse phokoje, mme go bo go supafala gore dikgang di tshwerwe, di a tlhotlhomisiwa.

Jaanong ke ne ke re a re se feleng dipelo, re se ka ra felela makalana a dipelo batho betsho.
A re ba neeleng nako ka gore e tlaa nna o ka re jaanong re tlhataganya ditlhotlhomiso mo godimo ga tse dingwe mo go ka felelang go tsala confusion, go diega, go tsala lebaka le le leele, ka gore commission fa e dirwa, e ya go tsaya nako ya yone, e ya go dikologa, mme ongwe dikgang tse dingwe di ne di ka fefogelwa jaaka makalana a le teng.
Ke dumalana le ba ba reng fa e le gore re bona makalana a a tlhaela golo gongwe, se se ka diragalang ke gore re a oketse bokete jo ba ka kgonang gore ba rwale bokete jwa dikgang ka teng.

Re oketse makalana a, re bone gore a mme go na le fa a tlhaelang teng.

Mo nakong ya gompieno, ga re ise re bo re latlhegelwe ke confidence.
Ke raya gore le bone bo DIS ba ba kgalwang, go fiwa cases ka dikonteraka dingwe tse e leng gore ga di tsamae sentle, go tswa foo go bo gotwe ba se ka ba itshunya nko, nnyaa ga ba itshunye nko batho betsho, kana ba a thusa le bone mo ditlhotlhomisong.

Dikonteraka tse, ke tsone dikgang tse re lwang natso re re corruption e itaya e re.
Go raya gore ba dipolola yone corruption e, jaaka case ya kwa Selebi Phikwe e e leng gore go feletse go bonwe tota gore go na le boammaaruri mo dipelaelong tse ba DIS ba nnileng le tsone, mme e bile konteraka eo ya felela e emisitswe ka mabaka a a tletseng a a dumalanang, a makgotlatshekelo a feletseng le one a dumalana gore golo fa go na le tshenyetso- setšhaba, le tlolotsamaiso.
Jaanong ke tsone dilo tse re tshwanetseng gore re ka bo re di rotloetsa gona le gore re bo re kgala makalana a bosigo le motshegare, re bua dikgang di gana go fela, re sa batle gore makalana a a tlhotlhomise, a tswelele ka tiro ya bone.

Moo e tlaabo e le gore jaanong re leleka mogatla wa lesilo.

Ke bona e le gore Motion o batho betsho, ga o ka ke wa tlisa maduo ape a a botoka.

Ke yone kgang e ke tshwanetseng gore ke e supe.


Setšhaba se utlwe gore ga re a re re gana go lwantsha corruption, ra re re na le makalana a re tshwanetseng gore fa e le sengwe, re a tiise.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification.

MR TSOGWANE: Ga ke na clarification, o tlaa tla o clarify fa o setse o bua.

Re tshwanetse re nne le makalana, re a tiise, a tle a nonofe, a kgone gore a ye go lwantsha corruption.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ao VP!

E a go rona kgang eo morena.


MR TSOGWANE: Nnyaa, kana ga ke ka ke ka go neela clarification o batla gore jaanong ke dumalane le wena go tsietsa setšhaba.

Mosola wa teng e tlaabo e le eng?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa.

MR TSOGWANE: Ke raya gore fa o batla gore ke go tlatse mo go timetseng batho, ga ke ka ke ka go tlatsa.
Ke tlaa tla ke go neela clarification mo dikgannyeng tse o buang dilo tse di nang le boammaaruri, mme fa o tla mo dikgannyeng tse di ntseng jaana, tsa go tla go tshwara batho, go ba baya bobi matlhong, gore phathi ya ga Domkrag e lebege o kare ga e lwantshe corruption… Kana ke rona ba re tlholang re tewa gotwe ke rona ba re dirang corruption, mme e le dikgang tse e leng gore ga... HONOURABLE MEMBER: Clarification Your Honour.

MR TSOGWANE: Ke mang wa clarification?

MR HIKUAMA: Ke nna, Hikuama.


MR TSOGWANE: Nnyaa, o tshwana fela le bone bao ba ba batlang go timetsa setšhaba.

Jaanong ga ke neele ope yo o batlang go timetsa setšhaba.

Yo o batlang go timetsa setšhaba ka dikgang tse di senang boammaaruri, ga ke ka ke ka mo neela clarification.

MR HIKUAMA: Nnyaa, ga ke batle go tsietsa ope.


MR TSOGWANE: …(Inaudible)… o batla go nthaya o re DCEC le mapodise ba ba tlhotlhomisang dikgang, ga ba na bokgoni... 8 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) HONOURABLE MEMBER: Point of order Mr Speaker.
MR TSOGWANE: A o batla go nthaya o re bo FIA, ga ba ka ke ba kgona?

Nnyaa, ga re ka ke ra dumalana le dikgang tseo, le batla go timetsa motlhala wa dikgang tse di leng teng... HONOURABLE MEMBER: Point of order.

Ga a ka ke a re re tsietsa setšhaba.

It is wrong.

MR TSOGWANE: Le batla gore motlhala o re setseng jaanong re tshwanetse… ee, re itse gore fa re bua dikgang tse di bogale, go tshwanetse gore le bue jalo Rre Moswaane.
Ba backbench ba go ntseng gotwe ba bue, ba batla go tsenngwa mafoko ganong, ga ke itse gore mathata a lona ke eng.

Ga re ka ke ra bua rotlhe.

Batho ba backbench ba ga Domkrag, ba a itse gore ke maitlamo a rona, go teng mo manifesto wa rona, re ya go lwantsha tshenyetso-setšhaba.

Jaanong ga ke itse gore le batla gore bone ba le buelele.

Go tla leng gore le buelelwe ke maDomkrag mo Palamenteng?

So, rona ga re na mathata le bagarona, re dumalane.
HONOURABLE MEMBER: ...(Inaudible)… there is an elephant in the room.

You are failing to fight it.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Hikuama, nna o iketla.

MR TSOGWANE: Hikuama, ga o gaufi le go tlogela Palamente fa o bona o simolola dikgang tse di ntseng jaana.

Nako ya gago e ntse e a go tšhaela and o e dira gore e itlhaganele.

Bagaetsho, re ya go lwantsha tshenyetso- setšhaba, mang a rata le a sa rate, re ya go tlhotlhomisa mongwe le mongwe.
Le bone ba le ntseng le ba ema nokeng, ba re ba itseng, fa gongwe gatwe nnyaa, golo moo e ne e le go ba pateletsa kana go ba reng, ga o ka ke wa lwantsha tshenyetso-setšhaba o rialo.

Ke a leboga Mr Speaker, ga ke dumalane le mogopolo o. MR LUCAS (BOBONONG): Ke a leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

Ke eme jaana, ke eme nokeng mogopolo wa ga Rraetsho Keorapetse.
E bile tota o tsile ka nako e e siameng, e tshenyetso-setšhaba e re tshwentseng rotlhe, le bone ba ba busang, ba supile gore e ba tshwentse.

Mo Budget Speech ya ga Mma Serame, o ne a supa gore nngwe ya dilo tse di tshwenyang tota, tse di tlileng go kgoreletsa maikaelelo ape a lefatshe le le ka lekang go a dira, ke tshenyetso- setšhaba, a bo a supa gore yone tshenyetso-setšhaba e, is an elephant in the room.

Akanya fela tlou e le mo room gore go nna jang.


A ba a supa gape gore mme e bile jaanong tshenyetso-setšhaba yone e, ke kankere.

O e tshwantshitse le dilo tse pedi tse di tshenyo-kgolo, tse re tshwanetseng go di ela tlhoko, o rile ke elephant in the room le kankere.

Gone mo ka bobedi fela, go supa gore tshenyetso- setšhaba e aname, e re apere.
Se gongwe motho a se ngongoregelang ka ene ke gore e rile fa a tsena kwa bokhutlong jwa kgang e, a bo a nna e kete o kare o batla go supa badirelapuso ka monwana gore o kare e godile thata, e bile e godisiwa ke gore ba dira kgwebo le Puso.
A bua jalo mo molaong o a neng a o present wa Public Procurement, re lekile go supa gore ee, mme fa e le gore go ka tswa go ntse jalo ka bodirelapuso, mme le rona re le mapolotiki, go simolola ka President, VP le Ministers, a ko re se ka ra tsena mo dikgannyeng tsa tenders ka gore re kgotlela tsamaiso yone e, e bile kwa morago, e ka godisa corruption.

Mogopolo o fa o ntshiwa, o ne a o gana gotlhelele.


Mme ke itumelela gore o supile gore corruption e bokete mo lefatsheng la Botswana, e tshwana le tlou e le mo room le kankere.

Gone moo ka bo gone, go raya gore Honourable Keorapetse, o tlile ka mogopolo o o lebanyeng tota.

Jaanong go na le ba ba ipelaetsang, o utlwa motho a re kana ke gore o bua ka selo se se bophara, corruption, maladministration and unethical governance.

Tsotlhe tse kana di a nyalana, di a tsamaelana.


Ka jalo gape, bophara jwa kgang ga bo molato, ka gore, fa e le gore commission yone eo e ka dirwa ya nna teng, e tlaa betla mo gotweng ke terms of reference.

Tse di tlaabong jaanong di agelela gore tota se re tlaa itebaganyang le sone ke eng le eng, fela jalo.

Go tlaabo go supa jaanong gore tota mme e tlaa remelela mo go eng.
Re tshwanetse ra dumalana rotlhe gone fa gore corruption e senya lefatshe le, mme e bile corruption jaanong mo lebakeng le le leele, e ntse e sena commissions tse re neng re di bona fa moragonyana.

Ka dingwaga tsa bo 1992, go ne go na le bo Kgabo Commission, Christie Commission, ya re ka 2004, ga nna le Lesetedi Commission.
Tsotlhe tse, o ne o bona gore di leka go tsena, di tsenelela thatathata, di batlisisa gore corruption e ntse ka mofuta o o ntseng jang, gore re tle re kgone go baakanya institutions tse re buang ka tsone, tse di tshwanang le bone bo DCEC.

One mogopolo o, fa o ka salwa morago sentle, o tlaa ntsha le dipaakanyo tse di tshwanetseng go dirwa fa re itebaganya le makgotla one a, ka gore makgotla a teng a bo DCEC, FIA le DIS, mme corruption e ntse e tsweletse.
Fa commission e dirilwe, e ka re thusa gape go bona gore makgotla one a, re ka a tlhabolola ka tsela e e ntseng jang.

9 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) Ke sone se ke reng mogopolo o o tlile ka nako e e siameng, mme re tshwanetse go lemoga selo sengwe.
Kana fa ke bua gore go ne go na le commissions ka bo 1992, Kgabo Commission, Christie Commission le Lesetedi Commission, nako ya teng, commissions di ne di lebega go sena mathata gore di dirwe.
Mo bogompienong, nako e re buang ka dikgang tse di bokete, tse di tona, tse re buang among other things, gore go lebega e kete go na le magatwe a gore madi a a kana ka P100 billion, a lebega a nyeletse ka tsela nngwe, go na le magatwe one ao, mme o bo o re ga o ka ke wa dira commission gore e tle e sekaseke dikgang tsa mofuta o, go supa gore golo fa, go tshwanetse ga bo go fitlhiwa sengwe.
Ga re ka ke ra bua ka madi a a kalokalo a P100 billion, mme re bo re tshaba go dira commission e e tlaabong e tlhotlhomisa dikgang tsa corruption ka bophara.

Fa e le gore corruption e kgona go re senyetsa madi a a kalo, go raya gore corruption e kwa godimo, e ntsi fela thata.

HONOURABLE honourable.

MEMBER: Clarification MR LUCAS: Mma ke fete ka kgang e nngwe ke e Rre Moswaane.
Gompieno go dikgang tse di tshwanang le tsa bo National Petroleum Fund (NPF), tse di supileng gore madi a le mantsi a lefatshe la Botswana, a a senyega, mme a senyega to corruption.

Go lebega e kete go na le bothata jwa gore re itebaganye le dikgang tse, re bo re bone gore tota mme modi wa tsone ke eng.

Go na le dikgang tse di tshwanang le tsa bo Capital Management Botswana (CMB), tse madi a a boitshegang, a mangwe a one a amana le pensions tsa badirelapuso ba lefatshe la Botswana.
Madi ao a nyeletse, ga a bonwe, mme re ntse ra re nnyaa, ga go ka ke ga dirwa commission of enquiry.

Honourable Keorapetse, wena rra o tlhapile diatla, o tlile ka kgang e e batlang go tsenelela kwa botengteng jwa yone kgang ya corruption.

Maabane jaana Rre Motaosane, o ne a botsa potso mo Palamenteng, ka nngwe kompone gape, gatwe Bluthorn, e le yone go supang gore e tsamaile e gogorupa madi mo dikhanseleng ka tsela e e neng e belaetsa e bile e gakgamatsa.
Le fa go ntse jalo, go na le ba ba reng nnyaa, go se ka ga dirwa dithulaganyo dipe tsa commission gore re sekaseke dikgang tse.

Le bone bo Rre Motaosane jaanong ba didimetse, mme ke bone ba ba neng ba tla ka dikgang tseo tsa bo gore Bluthorn e tsere madi mo dikhanseleng, Tona wa madi a ba a supa gore e lebega e tsere madi ka tsela e e seng yone, mme ditlhotlhomiso di tsweletse.
Corruption e ntsi mo lefatsheng la Botswana, mo e leng gore ope yo o latolang, yo o reng e se ka ya tlhotlhomisiwa, ka motlhale o Honourable Keorapetse a buang ka yone, go raya gore motho yoo, o fitlha sengwe.

Legale ga ke na bothata jwa gore sengwe se a fitlhwa, ka gore fa o re o lebelela NPF, bagolo ba lefatshe le, ba umakiwa mo go yone.

Kana jaanong fa go ka dirwa commission of enquiry, go raya gore jaanong ba ka tloga ba tshwarwa ke selaga.
Fa o bua ka CMB, bagolo ba lefatshe le ba umakiwa mo go yone.

Go raya gore fa go ka dirwa commission of enquiry, ba ka tloga ba tshwarwa ke selaga.

Bluthorn le yone, bagolo ba lefatshe le ba a umakiwa.

Go raya gore fa go ka dirwa commission of enquiry, ba ka tloga ba tshwarwa ke selaga.

Go raya gore jaanong go gana commission of enquiry mo, fa o go lebile sentle, e ganwa ka gore fa e ka dirwa, kana e ya go upolola, e ya go tsena kwa moding wa gore tota mme bagolo ba tsena jang mo dikgannyeng tsone tse.
E bo e supa gore gore re tle re kganele seemo sa gore bagolo ba nne ba umakiwa mo dikgannyeng tse, ke re dire jang gore re tle re baakanye seemo sa go nna jalo.

Go a lemotshega batho betsho gore corruption ya Lefatshe la Botswana e a gola, le ka ratings re wela kwa tlase, jaanong ke gakgamatswa ke ba ba ganang fela ba re nnyaa ke gore corruption o e bua e le tona thata, ke gore e tona mo o ka se keng wa e bua e ntse jalo.

Corruption ya lefatshe la Botswana e bophara, e tona.
The terms of reference ke tsone tse di tlaa betlang gore tota re tshwanetse ra itebaganya le bontlha bofe jwa corruption e e teng mo Lefatsheng la Botswana.

Ga o ka ke wa tsaya corruption gore ke selo se o tshwanetseng gore o ye go tlhotlhomisa gongwe University of Botswana (UB) kgotsa Bank of Botswana, nnyaa.

Re batla a commission of enquiry e e tlaa tsenang kwa moding wa kgang ya corruption.

E ba e supa gore the ruling elites ba tsena jang e bile ba amiwa jang ke corruption.
E seng e e tlaabong e batla fela go itse gore badirelapuso ba amega jang, ka gore go a supagala gore babusi ba lefatshe le le bone ba a amega.

Re sale re bona go simolola ka 2004 go fitlhelela gompieno, 18 years, go na le hesitancy e ntsi thata ya to deal with dikgang tsa corruption, mme go ntse go buiwa gape gore e teng.

Re a bua nako le nako gore corruption e teng, mme go na le hesitancy e e gakgamatsang ya to deal le dikgang tse.
Go tlaabo go buiwa jaaka le rona re ne re bua e bile re tswelela re bua gore go ne go na le corruption ka nako ya DIS ya ga Isaac Kgosi.
Ba Puso 10 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) gompieno ba bua gore corruption e ne e le ntsi, mme jaanong ke eng fa e le gore e ne e le ntsi ka nako eo, re sa dire commission of enquiry, re tle re ye kwa boteng jwa go itse gore corruption eo e ne e le ya mofuta mang ka nako ya Isaac Kgosi.
Ka nako ya gompieno ya DIS ya gompieno go na le corruption gape e e buegang e DIS now is meddling mo dikgannyeng tsa corruption, e tsenelela dikgang tse.

Re ne re utlwa maloba gotwe ba Water Utilities Corporation (WUC) ba duetse madi a a kanang ka P112 million ka gore DIS e ne ya tsena, ya iphaga dikoro mo dikgannyeng tsa corruption.

Mo ka bo gone ke nngwe ya dikgang tse Honourable Keorapetse a reng a ko di sekasekwe ka bophara jwa tsone.
Le se ka la tshaba bophara, le tshaba eng bophara ka gore commission fa e le teng will define tota scope sa gore e dira eng.

A re se ka ra tshaba bophara joo.

Re a bona gore DIS e lebega e kete e kgoreletsa le makgotla a mangwe one a o a buang Vice President (VP), e lebega e itshunya nko, e iphara dikogo mo dikgannyeng tse fa gongwe e leng tsa DCEC.

Dilo tse Honourable Keorapetse a re, di tshwanetse tsa salwa morago, tsa batlisiswa gore re tle re kgone go fokotsa tshenyetso-setshaba e e kanakana.
indeed Tshenyetso-setshaba Motlotlegi Serame, is a cancer.

Fa e tsena mo setšhabeng jaaka e tsene jaana, e bile e tsene thatathata kwa babusing, go raya gore jaanong lefatshe la rona ga lone ke kwa nageng.

Lemmenyana lepe le re neng re na le lone, le tlile go phimolwe ke corruption.

O tlaa utlwa fela go ntse gotwe Tautona o filwe mpho ya P2 million, o sa itse gore gatwe o felwang mpho ya P2 million.

O tlaa utlwa go ntse gotwe jaanong dikgang tse tsa corruption re tlaa di latedisa ka DCEC.
Rona ra re ee DCEC e teng, mme ga e a kgona e bile ga e kgone go fitlhelela ka moding wa dikgang tsa corruption.

Ka jalo commission of enquiry mo corruption, maladministration and unethical governance is an imperative, e a tlhokafala gompieno go feta ka nako epe, ka gore e bile jaanong malatsi a fa go sa tlhola go utswiwa engines tsa Water Affairs fela.

Malatsi a go utswiwa madi e bile go buiwa ka madi a mantsi a bo P100 billion, madi a a boitshega.

Re tshwanetse gore re dire commission eo ka bofefo.
Ke a leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

MINISTER OF YOUTH EMPOWERMENT, SPORT AND CULTURE DEVELOPMENT (MR RAKGARE): Ke a leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.
Ke batla ke simolole fela Mr Speaker, ka go supa gore ke gana Motion o. Ka nako e tlhopho e tlaabong e tla, ke ya go tlhopha “no.” Fa e ne e le gore ga go tsamaye ka alphabetical order, ke ne ya go nna motho wa ntlha go tsholetsa letsogo go tlhopha “no,” ka gore mabaka a teng Mr Speaker a go tlhopha “no...” HONOURABLE MEMBER: Because you benefit from the system.

MR RAKGARE: Ke kopa o kgalemele yo mongwe yo Mr Speaker a didimale.
Re a ba reetsa fa ba bua, ba se ka ba bo ba leka go nketsha mo tseleng, ka gore ke tlaa tswa mo tseleng.

Ga ke na mathata le go tswa tseleng.

Moswaane itshware sentle o mogolo.

Mr Speaker, ke ya go tlhaopha “no” ka mabaka.

A re simolole ka yo o tlileng ka Motion fa pele ga Ntlo ya Palamente.

O filwe metsotso ele 30 Mr Speaker, Honourable Keorapetse gore a tlhatlhamolole Motion wa gagwe.
Ga a bue le rona re le Mapalamente o bua le Batswana, gore Batswana ba itse gore o tlile fa pele ga Ntlo ya Palamente a tla go kopa eng.

E tle e re fa Mapalamente ba mo gana kana ba mo dumela, Batswana ba kgone go tlhaloganya gore mme Motlotlegi Keorapetse o ne a batla eng.

Sa ntlha se ke dumelang gore Motlotlegi Keorapetse o ka bo a ne a se dirile, e ka bo le go thusa Batswana go tlhaloganya gore fa re bua ka public institutions re bua ka eng.
Re utlwe fela a di balolola gore o bua ka eng, Batswana ba tle ba mo tlhaloganye gore a re gone go ye go dirwa eng mo go eng.

Sa bobedi, Honourable Keorapetse o ka bo ane a supile gore, fa a tsentse mafoko a matona a, a bangwe ba rona re a tlhaloganyang, mme bangwe ba Batswana kwa lwapeng ga ba a tlhaloganye.

Mafoko a a raya eng e bile a nyalana jang, o ka bo a ne a supile fela ka bophara gore fa a bua ka corruption, maladministration, mismanagement, economic crime le unethical governance o raya.
Mr Speaker, Honourable Keorapetse o dirile Public Administration kwa UB.

Ke ntse ngwaga di le tlhano dealing with dikgang tse le nna kwa UB ke dira governance, re a tlhaloganya nna le ene gore re bua ka eng.

Because o itse sentle gore maikaelelo a gagwe ke eng, o tlaa mo Palamenteng a bo a tla go kgobokanya mafoko a, e bo e nna e kete go na le sengwe se se tona se a se batlang gore se upololwe ke mogopolo o a o beileng Palamente pele.
A itse Mr Speaker gore golo mo ga go motlhofo, ga go ka ke ka kgonafala.

Se a se batlang ke gone fela gore a tsweledise kgang e a kileng a e bua Mr Speaker on Facebook, a supa gore the key goal ya bone as the opposition is to make Batswana hate the Botswana Democratic Party (BDP) and Government.
O 11 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) kile a bua mafoko a Mr Speaker, ga ke dumela gore o ka a ganela fa a ganela ke tlaa supa gore o a buile leng, kwa kae.
So I am not surprised gore a bo a tla ka mogopolo o o ntseng jaana, ka gore maikaelelo a gagwe ke gore Batswana kwa lwapeng e re fa re tswa mo Palamenteng mo re sena go nna re tlhopha “no,” ka gore reya go tlhopha “no” as the BDP, e bo jaanong Batswana ba re ehe re le boleletse, kana e le bone ba kganetso ba re re le boleletse gore ba ya go gana ka gore gore he knows very well gore mogopolo o o bophara ga o ka ke wa kgonagala.

Ba bangwe le Rre Lucas ba ntse ba bua.


Tla re le gakolole, Honourable Keorapetse o ne a bua fa a bua ka Commission ya ga Justice Zondo ya the Enquiry into allegations tsa State Capture.

Go and look at the terms of reference tsa commission eo, o lebelele gore e tswa kwa kae, since 2018 e simolotse go fitlhelela gompieno go ntse go tsweletswe.

Tsamaya o ye go lebelela commissions tse di fetileng, ka gore Afrika Borwa le mo rata thata.
O lebelele Honourable Keorapetse, o motho yo ke a tleng ke utlwe o ntse o bua ka bolo thata le fa o le kgakala le yone, o sa e tlhaloganye.

O ye go lebelela, 2001 go ne ga tlhomiwa commission ke Tautona wa nako eo kwa Afrika Borwa e e neng e ya go lebelela Ellis Park disaster kwa ditlhopha sa Pirates le sa Kaizer Chiefs dine di tshameka ga nna le stampede teng.
Bona gore gone gotweng, go sa twe a commission e ye go itebaganya le sengwe le sengwe, e ne e le gore jaanong go na le kgang nngwe e e beilweng commission pele e go itsiweng gore commission e e ya go neelwa terms of reference, fa ba sena go nna ba feta ba tlaa ka ka recommendations mme boeteledipele will act on those recommendations.

Gompieno re bua ka public institutions tse motlotlegi a neng a dira ka bomo, ga a ka ke a di re baya pele gore mme o bua ka ga eng.
Mr Speaker, yes go na le fa re dumalanang le batlotlegi ba ga rona ba kganetso teng, gore a re bone gore re dira jang to strengthen DCEC.

Ke a dumela Mr Speaker gore seo se botlhokwa, mo go seng botlhokwa ke jaaka gongwe Leader of the Opposition (LOO) a etle a nne a bue, go nna go fetolwa Director General wa DCEC, fa Tautona a batla go mo fetola o a mo fetola.
Ga re itse mabaka a gore o a bo a mo fetola go rileng, mme se re se itseng ke gore a bo a mo fetola a itse gore se a se dirang o batla gore a bone gore DCEC e tswelela e ntse e dira tiro ya yone, e sa kgopakgopediwe e bile tiro e e dirwe sentle ka manontlhotlho.

Se re dumelang mo go sone Honourable Keorapetse ke gore DCEC must be well resourced, DCEC e tshwanetse e letlelesege, e thusiwe to recruit highly skilled personnel.
These people must be paid, they must be paid well, because ba dira tiro e e rileng e e faphegileng.

Go na le dikgang di le dintsintsi kwa DCEC tse di tshwanetseng di fetele kwa DPP, le DPP must be resourced and reformed, so that investigations fa di sena go nna di dirwa go isiwa kwa go the prosecutor dilo tse di kgona gore di diragale.

Let us capacitate DCEC and DPP.

A re dire jalo ka gore kamoso fa go sena go dirwa investigation, dikgang di ka feta ka bonako.
Sa bofelo Mr Speaker, the Leader of the House o ntse a tlhalosa fa gore it is surprising gore batho ba bo ba tla fa go ikgalaletsa, ba batla go bona go lwantshiwa corruption go feta rona kana bangwe.

Ba dumela gore go a senngwa.

Ba dumela gore ba botoka mo go ba bangwe, e bile re mariwa ka dipuo.

Golo moo ga go simologe, go nna go le teng gore Matona a a senya, tshenyetso-setšhaba e simolola ka babusi.

Ke ne ka bua fa ka Declaration of Assets and Liabilities mo Palamenteng.
Ga ke batle go boelela mafoko a ke a buileng maloba.

A re lebelele gape le ka fa ba ntseng ba dira ka teng, e bile go lebega ba na le mathata.

Mr Speaker, ba na le mathata le gore batho bangwe ba ba ikamanyang le bone, ba tlhotlhomisediwa dikgang tsa tshenyetso-setšhaba.

Fa o utlwa gotwe jarata ya mongwe e lotletswe, go na le dingwe tse di belaetsang mo teng, motho yo o a tlhotlhomisiwa.

Batho ba ba yang go kuela kwa godimo, mokgosi wa bone o utlwala le moseja wa mawatle, ke bone ba.
Mathata a batho ba Mr Speaker, ba tla mo Palamenteng go bua dikgang tse, mme ga di tsamaelane le ka fa ba dirang dilo ka teng.

Ga se bone ba e kabong e re gompieno fa gotwe re tlhotlhomisa semangmang, e bo ba kuela kwa godimo gore tsamayang le ye go bula ntlo ya motho.

Go bulwa ntlo ya motho yoo, e le gore e ne e lotletswe fa go diragetse eng?

Re bona dilo tse di diragalang.


Maloba re ne re le fa Honourable Serame a tlile ka Bill ya Financial Intelligence, e na le tse dingwe tse di neng di tla ka Honourable Mmusi.

Ba omana e le gore ba re phones tsa batho are going to be tapped, mme re bona borukutlhi bo tsweletse mo lefatsheng la rona jo bo lwantshiwang bo ile magoletsa.

Maabanenyana jaana re ne re utlwa e le gore batho ba ne ba ganyaolwa ke mapodise, ba ba senyetsang lefatshe le.
Batho ba fa re sa kgone go itebaganya le bone, re tlile go nna le mathata a a tlaa amang Batswana ka tsela e e seng yone.
Mr 12 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) Speaker, re tlhamaletse fela gore re tlile go gana Motion o, mme we know gore ba ya go ya kwa setšhabeng ba re ke eo Domkrag e gana go lwantshiwa corruption.

Nnyaa, o Motion ga o amane gope le kgang ya go lwantsha tshenyetso-setšhaba, ke go tla fa go ikgatlha.
Ke go tsweledisa se ba neng ba se bua sa gore ba batla go bona Batswana ba ila party e e busang, Goromente wa letsatsi.

Motion o, is about kgang ya gore Batswana ba ile party ya rona le Goromente.

It has got nothing to do with fighting corruption, go sireletsa, gammogo le go nonotsha ditsamaiso tsa Puso tsa go lwantsha tshenyetso-setšhaba, ga go na sepe seo.
Ke batla go gatelela kgang e Mr Speaker ke re, mong wa Motion, o ne a na le a good 30 minutes to unpack his Motion, he failed dismally gore a re convince re le Ntlo.

He failed dismally gore molaetsa o goroge kwa Batswaneng gore ba tlhaloganye gore fa a bua ka public institutions o bua ka eng.

Fa a bua ka mafoko a matonatona a a kwadileng, o bua ka eng.

We are not at the university here, or in the boardroom fa o ka tshamekang ka mafoko, o tshameka ka ditlhaloganyo tsa Batswana.
Ka tsela e e ntseng jalo Mr Speaker, ke gana Motion o, nkwalele no ruri gone jaana, e se ka ya re fa o bitsa batho wa mpitsa le nna kgantele.

Ke a leboga.

MR SPEAKER: Thank you Minister.

Honourable Members, we have run out of time, it is now time to call upon Honourable Keorapetse to reply to the debates.

MR KEORAPETSE (SELEBI PHIKWE WEST): Ke a go leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

Se re se utlwileng gompieno ke dikgakgamatso, tota e bile ke matlhabisa ditlhong.
Ke ne ke solofetse go le gontsi mo Matoneng ba ba tshwanang le Honourable Molale.

Ga ke dumele gore go na le yo o nang le experience ya governance jaaka ene mo go rona rotlhe jaaka re kgobokane jaana.

Gongwe motho yo mongwe yo a ka bapisiwang le ene ke Honourable Speaker ka experience ya governance.

Ba bangwe Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente ba ka itshwarelwa bo Honourable Lelatisitswe.
Fa o ithutetse dipilisi jaaka Honourable Lelatisitswe, it would be understandable gore go ka nna le confusion mo Tshutisong e tshwana le e. Jaaka ke bua, ke ne ke sa solofele gore ba bangwe ba ba tshwanang le Honourable Molale go ka nna jalo.

Honourable Molale o buile nngwe ya dikgang tse di buiwang ke ba le bantsi ba ba buileng ba party e e busang.

Sa ntlha a re ga a bone gore go na le sengwe se se tona se se diragetseng se se ka tlamang gore go nne le a commission of enquiry, o buile jalo.
Kgang yone e was echoed by bontsi jwa ba ba setseng ba buile.

Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, ke tlaa batla go itebaganya le kgang eo ke e arabe.

Le lemogile Mapalamente, le lemogile Batswana ba le lebeletseng Palamente gore go buile Matona fela le Deputy Speaker.

Go buile ba ba nang le maemo fela mo party e e busang mme selo seo se tshwanetse go le tshwenya le ipotse gore go diragala eng gore e bo Matona ba ba eteletseng kwa pele, ba gana kgang e?
Ke eng go ikwadile bone fela mo the list and submitted it kwa go Speaker ya gore ga go bue ba e seng Matona?

Anyway, we are not surprised, gone re utlwile tlhatlharuane e e neng e le kwa caucus ya lona, le ba ba neng ba sa dumalanwe le gore go ganwe Tshutiso e. Ba ipotsa gore “ao!

le raya gore batho re tlaa nna re gana sengwe le sengwe fela le mo go tlhamaletseng go tshwana le mo.” Ke dingwe tsa dikgang tse di neng di buega kwa caucus ya Domkrag.
Ke sone se o bonang ba le fa jaana, ga se gore ba a dumalana gore go ganwe Tshutiso e Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

Ke jaaka o bona debate ya bone.

O kile wa bona debate e go buang Matona fela?

Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, kgang e e neng e buiwa ke Honourable Lucas gore corruption e jweleletse mo lefatsheng la Botswana, ke boammaaruri jo ke ipotsang gore Honourable Molale ga a bo bone fa kae.
Transparency International; lekgotla la mafatshefatshe le le kalang selekanyo tsa corruption, le tlhalosa gore Botswana e wetse kwa tlase mo sekaleng sa tshenyetso-setšhaba, le gaisiwa ke Seychelles le Cape Verde.

Le a itse gore nako le nako fa o lebelela speeches tsa boRre Gaolathe, Rre Mogae, Rre Matambo in the past, ba ne ba ipelafatsa ka gore lefatshe la Botswana is the least corrupt country in Africa.

Gompieno golo moo go nyeletse mo dipegong gompieno ka gore lefatshe la Botswana le wetse kwa tlase.
Ke kgang ya ntlha e e tshwanetseng go re tshwenya.

Ke le boleletse ka Afrobarometer, e ne e supa dipalo tsa gore more than 50 per cent ya Batswana ba dumela gore tshenyetso- setšhaba e jweleletse mo e leng gore ga e na bolekeletso.

E bile Batswana ba bua mo survey ya Afrobarometer ba re, “baeteledipele ba ba tlhophilweng go balelwa le ofisi ya ga Tautona, ba belaela gore corruption tota kwa e ka batlelwang teng, ke gone koo.
Batswana gape ba a tshwenyega, 70 per cent ya bone, ba supa gore ba na le tlhobaelo ya gore fa o ka bega tshenyetso-setšhaba, ditlamorago tsa teng e ka nna go ipusulosetsa mo go wena mo e leng gore fa o bereka, o ka iphitlhela o latlhegetswe ke tiro kana o tsene mo mathateng.

Scandals tse gotweng go utswilwe P100 billion, bo Rre Molale ba tsaya gore golo moo ga se sepe fela gore go bo go na le dipego tsa gore a go utswilwe.
Bontsi jwa 13 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) bone ba dumela gore gatwe P100 billion o utswilwe mme fa go tla mo go reng go tlhotlhomisiwe, le mo selekanyong sa corruption, corruption ga e kalokalo.
Scandals tsa National Petroleum Fund (NPF) tse Honourable Lucas a ntseng a bua ka tsone le tsa Capital Management Botswana (CMB), tse e leng gore fa o ne o ka bua ka Sesotho o ne o kare, “le Tautona ba ne ba supa gore o nkga lefotha mo tabeng yone e ya CMB le NPF.

Dipampiri di kwadile, affidavits di kwadilwe di kwa court tse di supang gore Tautona le ene o nkga lefotha tabeng ena ya corruption ya NPF le CMB.

High profile corruption… MR MOSWAANE: Clarification.

Thank you.
Thank you.

Ke ne ke re Honourable Keorapetse o e tshwere sentle.

Ke ne ke re gakere mme Tshutiso ya gago ya re go batliwe Judge yo o ikemetseng ka nosi ka gore babusi ba madi matsogong, ga se bone ba ka kgonang go batlisisa corruption e?

Fa o lebeletse Matona a ka fa ba ntseng ka teng ba gana Tshutiso e, a fa o lebeletse kamoso fa ba ka dumalana le Tshutiso e, a ba ka tsoga e le Matona kamoso?
Kana ke belaela gore ba tlaa ntshiwa botlhe gotwe ‘you failed my Government.’ A fa o ba lebeletse jaana, a ba gololesegile mo nakong ya gompieno go ka dumalana le Tshutiso e?

Kana re belaela gore ke bone ba ba leng madi matsogong, ke bone ba ba senyang go feta badirelapuso.

E bile ba pateletsa badirelapuso ka gore ke bone ba tshwereng taolo.

The buck stops with the Ministers or Cabinet.

Ga ba ka ke ba tswelela ba supa kwa le kwa.

MR KEORAPETSE: Ke a leboga Honourable Moswaane.


Mma ke taboge le tsone ke re go a itshupa gore… FOR PRESIDENTIAL MINISTER AFFAIRS, GOVERNANCE AND PUBLIC ADMINISTRATION (MR MORWAENG): Point of order Mr Speaker.

Tumelo ya me ke gore, gore Rre Keorapetse a bo a re Motlotlegi Rraetsho Tautona ke mmelaelwa, ga se gone.

Kana mo ditsebeng tsa setšhaba, Motlotlegi Rre Keorapetse o raya setšhaba a re Motlotlegi Rraetsho Tautona ke mmelaelwa, suspect.
HONOURABLE MEMBER: Tautona o rile o ka o tlogela tiro, o ka suta a sekisiwa gakere, a a sute.

MR MORWAENG: Mma ke bue.

Motlotlegi Rre Keorapetse o dira gore Tautona mo matlhong a sštshaba e nne o kare o a senya mme go sa nna jalo.

Ke kopa gore a baakanye golo moo, a beye mafoko a gagwe sentle.

Ke a leboga.

MR SPEAKER: I thought he was saying there are affidavits showing the things we shall find in court indicating what he is claiming.

Kgang ke eo Honourable Keorapetse.

MR KEORAPETSE: Ee rra.


Go ntse jalo Mr Speaker.

Tautona Masisi fa gongwe fa ke ka thulana le ene o na le go mpolelela kgang ya gore, “wena Keorapetse kana o mpitsa legodu.” Ke tle ke mo tlhalosetse dikgang tse gore nnyaa mme kana ga go bue nna, go bua dipampiri tse di kwa makgotlatshekelong tse di ikanetsweng le ba ba reng mo NPF go na le madi mangwe a o neng o a fiwa le ba ba amegang mo CMB gore go na le madi mangwe a o neng wa a fiwa.

Ga go bue nna, go bua bone ka dipampiri tse di kwa court.
Gape jaanong ke tlaa tlhoka jang gore ke re Tautona ke legodu fa e le gore e le Head of State o kgona gore e bo e le gore o ipha polase ya Banyana Farms?

Ka re o a ipha Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente ka gore the President is at the helm of the Executive power of Botswana.

Ke ene motho wa tshwetso ya bofelo mo the Executive decisions.

Jaanong process ya go abela Tautona polase ya Batswana motho wa bofelo yo o ka e tseelang tshwetso ke ene Tautona.
Jaanong lona le se ka la tsaya fela gore ba ba neng ba kgobokane gotwe ba mo abela polase ba ne ba mo abela polase.

O ne a ipha polase.

The Executive power of Botswana is vested in the President.

LEADER OF THE HOUSE (MR TSOGWANE): Point of order Mr Speaker.

Kana ke tlhagisitse Batswana gore ba tle ba reetse dikgang ba bo ba lemoge go tlhoka bommaaruri.

Ga ke dumalane le kgang e gotweng Tautona a ipha.


Le gone ga go na le fa e le polase epe e e kileng ya re fa e abiwa gope fela a bo e le gore Tautona ke ene yo e leng gore jaanong o sanction kana o dumalana le gore mongwe a abelwe polase kana dipolase when they are auctioned.

Ga go na fa Tautona a tleng a tsene teng.

Kgang ya gore o ipha polase ga e na boammaaruri, ke ya lesenyo, ke e Batswana ba tshwanetseng gore ba itse gore ke ya lesenyo.

Ga go simologe.
Ga go simologe.

Jaanong there is… HONOURABLE MEMBER: Vice President (VP) o a debate.

MR KEORAPETSE: Mo emise, o a debate.

MR TSOGWANE: Ee, ke a debate.

There is no truth in that.

Ke tshenyo, ke letlhoo le le itsiweng ke Motswana mongwe le mongwe.

That is my point of order Mr Speaker.


14 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) MR SPEAKER: Honourable Member, I think it pays to always listen and then react.

It pays a lot.

That is why ke ne ke re in reaction to Honourable Morwaeng, what Keorapetse has said about the basis for his allegations.
If people have been listening, they would have heard that his basis is affidavit filed at court.

So, it pays to listen to other members.

What the VP is saying as his basis of objection is that as far as the allocation of farms tsa Banyana, as far as he knows, there was never an issue of any of those allocations going to the Head of State, to the Executive for decision.

That was done by those members who have been given the job to allocate the farms.

That I understand is the basis of his objection.


In addition, when he argues to buttress it so that it becomes clear, we cannot say he is now debating.

He has to, otherwise how would he put his case?

How would we understand the basis of his objection?

So, I say Honourable Members it is good to given an ear and then you can object.

MR KEORAPETSE: Mr Speaker, I think let us agree that there is a difference of opinion here.
Fa e le gore Motlotlegi Tautona e le Commander-in-Chief of the armed forces, Botswana Defence Force (BDF) e ka tsaya tshwetso ya gore e mo fa mpho ya tlhobolo, in my view, in my humble opinion ke gore Tautona o a bo a iphile tlhobolo eo because he is Commander-in-Chief of the armed forces.

O a bo a e iphile because ke ene lesole le letona mo lefatsheng la Botswana.
So, in terms of the Constitution, the Executive power of Botswana vests in the President and shall be exercised by him either directly or indirectly through subordinates to him.

Subordinates to him decided to allocate him a state farm and he did not say anything about it.

He saw nothing wrong with it.

Effectively he has allocated himself a state farm.

O iphile polase ya Batswana.

That is my argument.

Let us agree that it is my opinion gore o iphile polase ka gore ke Tautona.
Ga ke dumele gore go na le Tautona yo e leng gore a eteletse lefatshe go ka nna le gore go abiwa dipolase a se ke a itse.
Ke buile gangwe le gape ka re the reason why President a sa tshwanela go tsena mo business ke gore intelligence reports, including economic intelligence reports tsa gore ditshono di kwa kae, di ya go tlhaga leng, di tlhaga ka tsela e e ntseng jang, di tlhoka gore batho ba bo ba ipaakantse ka tsela e e ntseng jang, information e e tla kwa go Tautona pele ga mongwe le mongwe by virtue of his office.

That is why ke sa dumalane Mr Speaker.

MR MOATLHODI: On a point of order Mr Speaker.


Ke a leboga Motlotlegi Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

Standing Order 23.2 is very very categorically clear gore the name of the President should be used away from disrespect.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: 100 per cent wrong.


MR MOATLHODI: Tota fela bagaetsho fela go buiwa ka leina la motho yo motona o tlhakatlhakanngwa le magodu, bogodu jo ke utlwang bo buiwang ke Motlotlegi Mopalamente wa Selebi Phikwe, a mme gone ke tshwanelo gore re gatake melao ya rona ka dinao?

Ke sone se ke se buang Motlotlegi Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

MR SPEAKER: The position taken by Honourable Keorapetse is a legalistic one.
For him, there is no need to show that the President personally did anything to influence those who were allocating the farms.

He is claiming that because they are under him in terms of the Constitution that is as good as him allocating to himself.

Wena you are saying, a-e!

o abetswe ke batho ba sele, in as much as I could have applied myself and got a piece, nobody would claim that ke e filwe ka maemo a me.

That is the difference he wants to make.


I thought when he said, let us agree that we disagree, that really is the position.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Further point of order Mr Speaker, on the same issue.

MINISTER OF YOUTH EMPOWERMENT, SPORT AND CULTURE DEVELOPMENT (MR RAKGARE): Further point of procedure.

Mr Speaker, ke utlwa Honourable Keorapetse gore a re dumalane gore ga re dumalane, but I think mafoko a mangwe one ga se mo gotweng ga re dumalane, ke a re reng fela, nnyaa le ga le maleba.
I think ke mo utlwile sentle gore o ne a bua gore…and like o buile Mr Speaker, you clarified the issue, re a tlhaloganya gore kana he is saying “dikgang di fa pele ga makgotlatshekelo, affidavits di tseng, leina la ga Tautona le a umakiwa mo teng.
Jaanong ke le Keorapetse, ke a dumela gore Tautona ke legodu, mme ke dumedisiwa ke gore o iphile Banyana farms.” Ke gone fa e leng gore ra re, e-e mo ga go nne sentle, go nna le difference of opinion, but we cannot allow Honourable Keorapetse go bitsa Tautona legodu, le gone a bua jaana e le ka dikgang tse e leng gore clearly Tautona ga a ipha lefatshe.

Tautona ga a a ipha lefatshe Mr Speaker, you are right, o abetswe lefatshe ke ba ba neng ba filweng boikarabelo jwa gore ba ka kgaoganya Banyana farms.
Jaanong I think fa Honourable Keorapetse a ne a ka supa gore indeed Tautona o laetse gore a neelwe lefatshe le, gongwe ke gone fa re neng re kare go na le pharologanyo ya opinion.
So ke ne ke kopa gore tota fela o mo kope gore 15 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) when he debates a se ka a amanya Tautona le bogodu, a dirisa mafoko a a ntseng jalo, ka gore o a itse gore se a se buang ga se a nna jaaka a se bua.

Ke a kopa Mr Speaker.


MR SPEAKER: Honourable Members, I do not know how it can be put, but Honourable Keorapetse says, he is not saying, nor does he have the evidence that the President as such directed the committee or whichever group of people who were allocating, it does not say that the President directed them, but he is saying, because he applied and he holds executive power, who would go and refuse to oblige.

Is he objecting to the President participation in such matters?
My understanding is that there is nothing that he has said indeed that shows that the President did a, b, c, which is out of order to get Banyana Farms, is his objection to the Head of state getting involved as he elaborated in such businesses.

He says no, yo o na le pension ya gagwe, we take care of him a nne koo.

So is not a question of corruption as you understand it, I think he has made that clear.
That is why I am saying he was legalistic, there is nothing that has been shown that the President acted outside the law, but outside his own understanding or wishes.

LEADER OF THE HOUSE (MR TSOGWANE): Point of procedure.

Mme re a go utlwa Mr Speaker, kana re Batswana, Motswana fa a bua re a mo utlwa.

Gape ke ne ke re procedure e ke batlang gore ke fete ka yone ke gore, kana we are setting precedence ya gore kamoso ke bo ke tla ke re, in my opinion semangmang ke legodu, a, b, c, in my opinion.
Jaanong dilo tse di ntseng jaana Mr Speaker, le ba ba reeditseng Ntlo e, ga di tsamaye sentle, ka gore o feletse a re, “ene o bona gore Tautona ke legodu,” gape o baya badirelapuso ka kwa mosing, kana a re ba mo neetse, he applied.

Dipolase were advertised, he applied.

Ga a a fiwa fela gotwe, tlaa o tseye polase.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, a re o iphile.

Ga a fiwa, o iphile.


MR TSOGWANE: Gakere o a mo utlwa jaanong Mr Speaker gore go buiwa dipuo tse di ntseng jang, “gatwe o iphile.” Jaanong se ke se kopang ke gore, a re yeng re ye go bona process kgang e e eme, re tle re boele mo go yone, re bone gore a mme Tautona did not apply for polase eo, he was not interviewed jaaka mongwe le mongwe.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ke sone se re reng go tlhotlhomisiwe, le ganela eng ditlhotlhomiso?
MR TSOGWANE: Ditlhotlhomiso tsa go latlha bosupi, le tlogela batho ba ya kwa le ba kwalela dikwalo... HONOURABLE MEMBER: Le latlhile bosupi maabane, le bolaile magodu ba le 10, ga ba ka ke ba tlhola ba ganetsa sepe.

MR TSOGWANE: ...re na le dikwalo tsa lona tse le di kwalelang mafatshe le senya lefatshe le le re batho ba ba le boditseng phokoje ba dira sentle, ba se ka ba boela kwano.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Batho ba re magodu a mo Palamenteng a tseelwa dikgato leng?
HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ba botsa gore ke eng le le ditsala magodu le malatsi a?

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Interruptions!)...

MR SPEAKER:…(Inaudible)…be careful, because I do not think there is anywhere that Honourable Keorapetse in regard to Banyana farms said that His Excellency ke legodu, no!

MR TSOGWANE: A rialo.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: He did Mr Speaker, he did!

MR SPEAKER: No, no, that is why I say ...(inaudible) to listen, if you ...(inaudible)… yourself from listening you will never follow the debate.
The issue ya bogodu fa e tla mo gongwe e kopana le His Excellency is accusing directly gore ke mmitsa legodu, is in relation to ...(inaudible)…I think ke madi NPF le mo gongwe, which derived from affidavits.

As far as Banyana is concerned, there is no issue of theft, the claim is because he is the commander, he holds executive power, he should not have participated.

Which I say, it does not show His Excellency as being corrupt at all.
It is legalistic approach, gore if you are in charge of any area do not participate emela ka kwa thoko, o lese ba bangwe to participate.

That is not the same as saying you deliberately went ahead, o bo o raya batho o re mphang jaana le jaana, because he cannot show that, I am quite sure he cannot show it, gore His Excellency o ne a ya kwa go bafe a ba raya ba dire eng.

That is why I say he is legalistic.


MR TSOGWANE: Mr Speaker, re a go utlwa, mme kana Tautona o okametse land boards tse di amang le kabo ya plots, o ikopela plot jaaka mongwe le mongwe.

Ke fa kae fa e leng gore Tautona ga a okamela gope fa e leng gore then he has the right to participate?
16 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) HONOURABLE MEMBER: Vice President!

Tautona ga se mongwe le mongwe, ga o tlhaloganye eng?
MR SPEAKER: ...(Inaudible)…Vice President, that is why I say that argument is legalistic, I mean that if it were to be followed, if he apply to everything where he wants to participate because at the end of the day he is executive, he then will be guilty right through, because he cannot put away the power at any moment.
teng le gore go ka ya go tlhotlhomisiwa, jaanong ga go thuse gore e re mme go ka tswa go tsamaya dilo sentle, e bo e le gore gompieno ke gone VP a reng a go ye go tlhotlhomisiwa gore go tsamaile jang mme gape a gana ditlhotlhomiso.

Jaanong a re leseng mosutise wa Motion a tswale kgang ya gagwe, lona bo VP le Matona, re le utlwile ka fa le sa batleng kgang e ka teng, mme ke tsaya gore jaanong a a sirelediwe; points of order tse di kana kana ga di re ise gope.
HONOURABLE MEMBER: Procedure Mr Speaker, o ne o biditse leina la me.

MR SPRAKER: ...(Inaudible)…executive powers, go felela foo ...(inaudible)… it cannot be.

You cannot say His Excellency is corrupt because batho botlhe mo lefatsheng le by virtue of the Constitution are under.

It is wrong if we say so.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker procedure.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Honourable Saleshando, o sale a kopile procedure.

MR RAKGARE: Procedure.


Mr Speaker, ke ne ke re mogolo wame, go raya gore go na le golo gongwe fa o sa utlwang Honourable Keorapetse teng.

Fa o sena go gakolola Mr Speaker, ka gore o na le tshwanelo ya gore o ka bua ka fa a buang ka teng ka gore dikgang di fa pele ga makgotlatshekelo, affidavits di teng fa leina la ga Tautona le umakiwang teng, go buiwa ka dikgang tsa bo NPF.

O ne a bua mafoko a Mr Speaker, o a buile ka Setswana gore ene o dumela gore Tautona ke legodu ka gore o ikabetse Banyana Farms.
A bo a tlhalosa ka fa a neng a tlhalosa ka teng.

That is what he said Mr Speaker.

You can pull the Hansard o tle o utlwe mafoko a… HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… MR SPEAKER: Order!

Honourable Saleshando.

MR SALESHANDO: Ke a go leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo.

Mr Speaker, tota ke ne ke kopa gore kgang e re e buile; Matona le Mothusa Tautona re utlwa tshakgalo ya bone mo kgannyeng e, mme rona re e tlhaloganya fela jaaka Rre Keorapetse a e buile.
Le wena Mr Speaker, kamoso fa ke ka utlwa gotwe o fentse tender mo Palamenteng, ke tlile go gakgamalela tsamaiso ya gago.

Jaanong re e buile, ke ne ke kopa gore jaanong a mosutisi, Mopalamente Rre Keorapetse a sirelediwe kgatlhanong le tshakgalo ya Matona mo kgannyeng e ya tshenyetso-setšhaba.
Ba buile or they have debated, re ba utlwile ka fa ba sa dumalaneng ka MR SPEAKER: You know what Honourable Members, we have to try as much as possible to be procedural and deal with those amongst you who think that things were said in one way or the other, and certainly I did not understand them that way.

Honourable Rakgare says the Honourable mover of the Motion said certain words, which I said no, that is not my understanding.
He said the Hansard will bring us out, and certainly, I do not ever remember those words being said by Honourable Keorapetse, and he says it maybe that I was not listening enough.

I try to pay attention.

If he insists that I did not hear properly, then the only way to do is to go to the Hansard.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, ba bopeditswe ke bolope.

MR RAKGARE: I insist Mr Speaker.

O ntseele dikgato fa e le gore ga go a nna jalo mo Hansard.
HONOURABLE MEMBER: Fa re ya go fitlhela a buile jalo, ke ka dumalana le mafoko a teng a a builweng, ke tlaa kopa gore ke a supe gore ke eng e le bogodu.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, Speaker o buile gore… MR RAKGARE: Nnyaa, wena o ka rialo gakere, o senya batho maina; Leader of Opposition (LOO), o ka rialo, ke ka fa o dirang ka teng.

Ga go molato.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Kana Motion o is all about go senya maina a batho.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… MR SPEAKER: The time is quarter to 11.
I am not sure how quickly we can have access to the response by Honourable Keorapetse.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, Mr Speaker, is Keorapetse denying gotlhelele the statement?

MR KEORAPETSE: No, I am not.


17 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) HONOURABLE MEMBER: He is not denying, so he is correct; the objection by Honourable Rakgare is correct.

MR SALESHANDO: Re ka support statement seo.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: So, you have to rule on it.

MR KEORAPETSE: Can I clarify Mr Speaker?


MR SPEAKER: No, first of all, the question is whether you agree with – Honourable Keorapetse, whether you agree with what Honourable Rakgare, Minister, said you said, or do you want him to repeat what he claims you said?

MR KEORAPETSE: Mr Speaker, I can further clarify what I said.

MR SPEAKER: No, no clarification.

MR KEORAPETSE: The import of what I said.

Ke mangwe a mafoko a e leng gore o a buile, a ke a buang kwa morago.

That is what he said.


MR SPEAKER: Do you agree Honourable Keorapetse?

MR KEORAPETSE: Ke a dumalana Mr Speaker, ke buile jalo.

MR SPEAKER: Rra?

MR KEORAPETSE: Ke a dumalana, ke buile jalo.

MR SPEAKER: Okay.

MR KEORAPETSE: Le fa e le gore ga ke a bua exactly jaaka fa a buile, mme tota molaetsa wame ke one o Rakgare a o buang.
Molaetsa wa me Mr Speaker, ke gone gore gore Tautona e re a eteletse pele lefatshe la Botswana, a bo a ipha polase ka gore ka re gone gore Executive Powers… HONOURABLE MEMBERS: Nnyaa, go enough o setse o o tlhalositse.

MR SPEAKER: Not the import either; what he says you said.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Did you say those words?

That is the question.

MR KEORAPETSE: A reng, let him repeat ke mo utlwe.


MR KEORAPETSE: Ee, gone fela gore Executive Power e mo go ene, a bo a bona fela go sena molato gore a abelwe polase ya Batswana, e le Tautona yo mo setilong, yo Batswana ba mo tlhokomelang go ya go fitlhela a tsena ka lebitla, mme a bo a bona go tshwanela gore e re a eteletse a bo a ka fiwa polase, golo moo ke bogodu Mr Speaker.

MR SPEAKER: O biditswe ke mang wena Honourable Moswaane?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ke ao mafoko Mr Speaker.


He says specifically that you said certain words.

Now, it is those words which I want you to confirm if you said them, and then we know how to proceed.

Do you want him to repeat them?

MR SPEAKER: It is not clear what I had said before.

It is a legalistic argument; there is no factual basis of His Excellency (H.E) having done anything wrong.

It is a legally straight argument.

Jaanong ga ke itse gore re tsietsega fa kae.

MR KEORAPETSE: Yes, please.


MR SPEAKER: So that you can react?

Honourable Minister Rakgare.

MR RAKGARE: Thank you very much Mr Speaker.
Fa o sena go nna o o fa opinion ya gago Mr Speaker, gore wena o dumela gore se a se buang ga go na molato kalo kalo ka gore dikgang di fa pele ga makgotlatshekelo, fa o sena go mo fa sebaka gore a tswelele Mr Speaker, o rile ene e le Keorapetse, o dumela gore Tautona ke legodu ka gore go a belaelwa gore Banyana Farms o go abetswe ka tsela e e leng gore bone ba a ba eteletseng pele, because he has the Executive Powers, bone bao ke batho ba ba ka fa tlase ga gagwe, jaanong o a ba laola.
18 (MR FOR AND PRESIDENTIAL MINISTER PUBLIC AFFAIRS, GOVERNANCE ADMINISTRATION MORWAENG): Procedure, Mr Speaker.

Nnyaa, Mr Speaker, re tsietsega fa go reng Rre Keorapetse kana o ntse a bua a ipoeletsa (repeating) a bo a tlhalosa gore o buile jalo a re mafoko a a buileng a, o a feleletsa ka gore ke bogodu se Tautona a se dirileng go kopa lefatshe a bo a le fiwa.

A re ke bogodu.

Tautona ke legodu; o ntse a bua a re ga a ganetse Mr Speaker.
Go le legally… MR SPEAKER: Wena Mokwena, o rata go oketsa; thata e bile.

O rata go oketsa.

Do not have your own interpretation.

Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) HONOURABLE MEMBER: O loka letswai.

MR SPEAKER: Nnyaa, do not do that.


Do not have own interpretation… HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… MR SPEAKER: His Excellency (HE), the Head of State holding Executive powers when he applied for the farm and he was given that farm, he says go tshwana le fa a bo a iphile, he should never put himself in that situation ka gore ene o duelwa ke the state right through.

That is the legalistic argument.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: He cannot say Tautona ke legodu.
HONOURABLE MEMBER: The Speaker’s ruling is final batho betsho.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... HONOURABLE MEMBER: Kgang ya bogodu Mr Speaker, ga se kgang ya semantics ya gore o re motho ke legodu.

Fa o re motho ke legodu o raya gore o utswile, go utswa le gore o bo o filwe, go na le pharologanyo Mr Speaker, there is a big difference.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... HONOURABLE MEMBER: A mme motho o ka bidiwa legodu fela, le fa gotwe legalistic.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: He cannot say that.


HONOURABLE MEMBER: O ganetsana interpretation ya ga Attorney General le Speaker?

le HONOURABLE MEMBER: You cannot say that.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ga re ka ke ra tswelela motho a re Tautona ke legodu.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: A Tautona a buisiwe sentle.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ga o ka ke wa laola Speaker gore a tswelele… HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ke opinion ya gago, ga go na molato.
HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker, please help us.

A re Tautona ke legodu, mme Tautona ga a a ikabela lefatshe.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... MR SPEAKER: Honourable Keorapetse said HE was given the farm, he said so, but he then said go tshwana fela le fa a ikabetse.

...(Interruptions)... it was given.

ASSISTANT MINISTER FOR PRESIDENTIAL AFFAIRS, GOVERNANCE AND PUBLIC ADMINISTRATION (MR MTHIMKHULU): Procedure.
Mr Speaker, selo sa ntlha ke batla go simolola ka gore o rile Honourable Keorapetse’s argument is legalistic, but then he goes on to accuse the President gore ke legodu, and that one you have not ruled on gore a o dira sentle gore President ke legodu, fa a sa dire sentle, a a withdraw that statement.

We want to hear your ruling on that.

Secondly, the legalistic argument, Mr Speaker, ga e complete ya ga Honourable Keorapetse fa a re President ke ene the head ya Executive.
Molaomotheo wa Botswana 47.3 o bua gore, “nothing contained in this section shall prevent Parliament from conferring functions on persons or authorities other than the President.” There are functions in the Government that can be conferred on other authorities other than the President.

President ga a ka ke a exercise those functions, they can only be exercised by certain officials.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Interruptions!)...

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, mo tlogeleng a bue, le mo kgoreletsa eng?
HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... MR MTHIMKHULU: Moswaane, a ko o didimale ke fetse, ke tloga ke bua ka wena o bo o re ga ke dire sentle, o bo o rogana.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ga go na Puso e e ka ganang gore go lwantshiwe corruption, fa e se batho ba senya fela.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, ga o ka ke wa bua ka nna, gakere o a itse gore o emisitse merogo gore e tsene mo lefatsheng la Botswana.

Thank you.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Re tsile go bitsana magodu gone fa.
A ke bue gore Honourable Keorapetse ke legodu ka gore o tsamaya le magodu?

MR MTHIMKHULU: Maloba o ne o re ngwana wa gago o bolailwe ke mosadi wa gago, ke jone bomatla jo bo kanakana jo, didimala o re reetse re a bua.
19 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) HONOURABLE MEMBER: O sematla wena ka gore o thibetse merogo gore e tsene mo lefatsheng la Botswana ka gore o na le garden e tona o dirisana le ba Choppies, bloody stupid Minister!

MR SPEAKER: You know what I am going to do?


I am going to park... MR MTHIMKHULU: Ke gone o bo o re ngwana wa gago o bolailwe ke mosadi wa gago, ke jone bomatla jone jo.

MR SPEAKER: I am going to start parking all those who are becoming rowdy.

MR MTHIMKHULU: I want to finish.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mosadi wa me o tlhokafetse pele ga ngwana.

MR MTHIMKHULU: This argument ga e complete yone e e legalistic eo, o a e tlhopha and o e dira jalo ka bomo deliberately to distort the truth.
O a itse gore certain functions cannot be performed by the President, if the President could have given himself that farm, o ka bo a sa tsamaya a ya go e ikopela (apply), o ka bo a e iphile, but it is a function that was performed by an officer of the Government, which has been conferred on him by the statutes tsa lefatshe.
Ga a bue ka golo moo, a a bue ka tsone dilo tse, that is why re re Mr Speaker, a dire ruling yone e, re e dire e siame, e tlhamaletse e bile gape go tlhamalale gore Keorapetse ga a buise President sentle, a a withdraw mafoko a gagwe go tlhamalale, gore fa a re President ke legodu ga a bue sentle, a withdraw.

MR SPEAKER: Honourable Members, ke gakgamala why there is such poverty in understanding what to me is a simple argument.
Honourable Keorapetse said, and he is on record, that he knows that the President applied and he was given the farm, after applying, he knows that, hence his argument that of course the President holds Executive powers, to him that is the same as the President giving himself a farm, ga go na gap gope.

E tlhatlharuane ya bogodu, I think it is because you are allergic to contrary views, you are really allergic.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ke babelaelwa.

MR SPEAKER: Nnyaa, ga ke itse sepe ka babelaelwa.


HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ba itse sentle ka bogodu, jaanong sengwe le sengwe ba se associate le bogodu.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: ...(Murmurs)... HONOURABLE MEMBER: A re Speaker.

tswelele Mr MR SPEAKER: You want to be parked?


You certainly do not agree with the argument by Honourable Keorapetse that despite H.E applying like everybody else, despite H.E being given the farm by the relevant authorities, despite all that, nobody should conclude that H.E o iphile, which is what Honourable Keorapetse claims.

Ene a re fa go dirilwe jalo, wena o le H.E o iphile, go tshwana le fa o iphile.
He knows the facts of what actually happened, that H.E applied, was then given by the people who are sitting with the duty to allocate, but he is saying that does not matter, go tshwana le fa a iphile, why, because H.E holds Executive powers.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Feleletsa Mr Speaker, gore o rile ke bogodu.

MR TSOGWANE: Ke ne ke batla gore procedure Mr Speaker, o rule mo kgannyeng e. You must rule gore re tle re e ise kwa komiting ya Palamente e e lebaganeng le rulings tsa gago.
HONOURABLE MEMBER: Wa re fa a re President ke legodu, o bua sentle?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: You are threatening the Speaker, hey?

MR SPEAKER: If there is no basis for it, I should have no difficulty in ruling, which is not on.

If there is an argument and to me for instance, I know what legodu is, peculiar in terms of our law, and from the admission by Honourable Keorapetse, none of the elements which constitute that crime have been shown, they do not exist.
HONOURABLE MEMBER: Rule Mr Speaker, please, and rule.

MR SPEAKER: No, I am not ruling.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Then get the Hansard, o tlhaloganye sentle Mr Speaker gore o buile eng.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, Rakgare.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Kante o batla go laola Mr Speaker.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Interruptions!


)… MR SPEAKER: He has confirmed Honourable Rakgare what you said... 20 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) HONOURABLE MEMBER: O batla to instruct Mr Speaker gore a tsamaise jang?

MR SPEAKER: No, no, he is putting forward his own view, there is nothing wrong with that.
HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, o a re lapisa mme jaanong.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Kante ene o batla go go laolela gore o tsamaise jang.

MR SPEAKER: …on the basis of facts, we do not show any bogodu.

He wants to conclude on the basis of the Constitution that motho o iphile, it is not proper, he should never have applied to start with; what do I rule?

HIS HONOUR THE VICE PRESIDENT (MR TSOGWANE): Nnyaa, ruling ke gore we have challenged his position.
Re dirile points of order and procedure, there should be a ruling at the end of the day.

MR SPEAKER: And I said those who...(Inaudible)… HONOURABLE MEMBER: It is an irrelevant point of order.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Vice President (VP), a o itse sengwe ka ethical leadership?

MR SPEAKER: Hence the explanation that the matter is legally...(Interruptions)...HE has not been shown to have done anything wrong that legally...(Inaudible)...by Honourable Keorapetse is so irrelevant, it is just wasting time.
MR RAKGARE: Ke gone Mr Speaker, re ka tswelela.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: That is why he should withdraw Mr Speaker.

MR RAKGARE: Mapalamente otlhe a Umbrella for Democratic Change (UDC) le ba Botswana Patriotic Front (BPF) ke magodu a matona.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: O betilwe ke pelo.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Gone o itse gore ga o bue nnete gakere?

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… MR KEORAPETSE: Mma bakaulengwe... ke tsweleleng HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Interruptions!

)… MR BOKO: Order!

Thank you Mr Speaker.


Mr Speaker, kana batho ba reeditse Palamente, batsadi le masika a rona le Batswana fela ka kakaretso.

Honourable Rakgare o buile, re ka ya kwa Hansard, a re Mapalamente otlhe a opposition ba BPF le UDC, o rile ke magodu.

Gongwe o mo kope Mr Speaker, a boele...(Interruption)… MR SPEAKER: You know what Honourable Boko, you were tsosa tlhatlharuane, we expect you to do that.
that...(Interruptions)...o inviting HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa Boko, mo tlogele o a itse gore o buisiwa ke... HONOURABLE MEMBER: Gakere o a itse gore Keorapetse ke legodu o ne a palame fly machine ya ga Muti.
HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… MR KEORAPETSE: Mr Speaker, dikgang tse tsotlhe fela tsa bo National Petroleum Fund (NPF), Capital Management Botswana (CMB), dipolase tsa Banyana, dimpho tsa ga Tautona tse di neng di buiwa ke Honourable Lucas, gore lefatshe la Botswana was blacklisted ke European Union (EU), grey listed ke Financial Action Task Force (FATF), nako le nako tenders tsa ga Goromente ditiro ga di goroge kwa Batswaneng ka gore go sekiwa tenders tse di rekilweng kwa makgotleng.
Fa o lebelela tse tsotlhe Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, they point to lefatshe which is collapsing like the house of cards.

Go na le mathata a a serious, a ke sa itseng gore ba phathi e e busang, bogolo jang Matona, a ga ba a bone, ga a ba tshwenye.

Ke a tshwenyega Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente gore, nako e Tautona Masisi e nnang Tautona, re bona ba lelwapa la gagwe ba fenya tenders tsa Puso go feta ka nako e a neng a se Tautona.

Ke raya gore golo moo go tshwanetse gore go tshwenye Batswana.
Go a ntshwenya Mr Speaker, gore e ka re motho a ne a ntse a tshela mo lefatsheng e se Tautona, masika a gagwe ba ne ba sa fenye tenders tsa to supply Antiretrovirals (ARVs) mo Pusong le tenders tsa hundreds of millions, e bo e re motho a nna Tautona, e bo jaanong sa ntlha, ke gore ene ka bo ene e le Tautona, o kwadisitse dikompone tse di fetang tse a kileng a di kwadisa nako e neng e se Tautona.

Sa bobedi, masika a gagwe a simolola to win tenders mo Pusong.
Selo se se tshwanetse gore se re tshwenye Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, re bo re appoint commission e tle e rarabolole dikgang tse, e re tlhalosetse gore gatwe matsapa di a tsaya kae.
21 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) Go buiwa kgang ya gore Motion ga o a kwalega, golo moo ke seipato Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

What is not clear ka gore Palamente e tseye tshwetso ya gore go nne le commission of enquiry that is chaired by a Judge, what is not clear about that?
E e leng gore e tlaabo e direla dilo mo pontsheng, e bile report ya yone e tlaabo e phatlaladiwa or published.

What is not clear about that?

Commission e gape, e tlhotlhomise bophara le ka fa tshenyetso-setšhaba le go gopela itsholelo di ntseng ka teng.

What is not clear about gore part of terms of reference tsa commission e tlaabo e le go lebelela gore corruption and economic crime, nature and extent of corruption, corruption e jweleletse go le kae.
Transparency International is saying we have fallen five points.

Afrobarometer e supa gore Batswana ba re corruption e kwa godimo, e bile le kwa Office of the President Batswana mo Afrobarometer Survey ba supa jalo.

Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, what is not clear about gore one of the terms of reference e tlaa nna gore commission e e itebaganye le corruption and economic crime gore bophara jwa yone a ke jaaka fa Transparency International, Afrobarometer le DCEC di bua.
Mismanagement, what is not clear about mismanagement, maladministration and unethical governance?

I do not understand because, kana se Motion o o se buang ke gore, a elements tsa good governance mo Botswana di tsenya Botswana mo mathateng a gore e bo mo sekaleng sa corruption, unethical mismanagement, maladministration governance, di wela kwa tlase, go na le mathata.
le Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, Motion o maikaelelo jaaka ke ne ke bua ke gore, ga ke itse gore fa motho a botsa gore public institutions ke eng, a re ke kabo ke tlhalositse gore public institutions ke eng.

Gongwe le gongwe fa Goromente a leng teng, it is a public institution.

Fa o bua ka ofisi ya Puso, that is a public institution.
Fa o bua ka makalana a letsatsi le letsatsi re a tseelang ditshwetso ka go a direla melao le go a fa subventions, budget ya setšhaba, ke bua ka makalana a a tshwanang le ao Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

Maikaelelo a rona at the end of the day, e ne e le gore commission e e tle e gakolole ka gore ke yone e e ka gakololang gore appropriate policies, tse di ka nnang teng ke dife.

Makalana a a tshwanetseng gore a bo a le teng ke afe, a a leng teng a retelelwa jang, jaaka re bona DCEC gompieno.
Rra Nkamo o ne a bua gore DCEC le Directorate of Public Prosecution (DPP) ga ke ise ke bue gore ga di na bokgoni, mme o a itse gore ke tlisitse Bill mo Palamenteng e e setseng e badilwe la ntlha, e e lekang go nonotsha DCEC.

Fa ke bua le wena ka nako e, go na le cases tse di fetang 10 years, DCEC referred them to DPP, ga di ise di ke di tsene ka kgoro ya kgotlatshekelo.
Mabaka a otlhe Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, a a tlama gore go nne le a commission of enquiry e ye go lebelela gore tota seemo se ka fa se ntseng ka teng se ka dirwa ka tsela e e ntseng jang.

Ba ntse ba bua ba re go na le makalana, ke eng go tshwanetse gore go nne le a commission of enquiry go na le makalana.

There was never a time mo lefatsheng la Botswana e go nnileng le a commission of enquiry, mme go sena makalana a botlhotlhomisi.
Fa go nna le commission ya Kgabo Commission, go ne go na le land boards, department of lands le sepodisi tse di neng di itebagantse le to implement Penal Code ya lefatshe la Botswana.

Makalana ao a ne a le teng a a tlhotlhomisang, Serious Crime le Crime Intelligence mo sepodising ba ne ba ntse ba le teng, mme ga nna le commission.
When Judge Lesetedi was appointed gore a etelele commission of enquiry ya kabo ya lefatshe, le le abilweng ka tshokamo, DCEC, sepodisi, CID, Serious Crime le makalana otlhe a ba ntseng ba a bua di ne di ntse di le teng.

Commission of enquiry tiro ya yone, especially ka fa Motion o ke o kwadileng ka teng, ga se go ya go tlhotlhomisa semangmang.

Ke go ya go lebelela gore tshenyetso-setšhaba le go gopela itsholelo di jweleletse go le kae mo lefatsheng la Botswana.
Matsapa di a tsaya kae gore cases which are high profile corruption cases, di bo di latlhegela Puso tsotlhe kwa makgotlatshekelong, Batswana ba felela ba latlhegelwa ke confidence mo makalaneng a botlhotlhomisi.

Dikgang tse di neng di buega fa, ke sone se o bonang di buiwa ke Matona le ba ba sha mo Domkrag.

Ba bangwe e le gore motho wa teng o tlogetse Domkrag ga nne, gabedi.
Ke ne ke raya yo mongwe maabane ke re, “ke gore lona motho o tlogela Domkrag gabedi, o tswa o ya Botswana National Front (BNF), Botswana Congress Party (BCP) o a boa, a bo a tla a ya Botswana Movement for Democracy (BMD), a bo a boela gape mo Domkrag.

A bo a le feta mo line a bo a ya go neelwa Botona.” Ke bo ke re, ke sone se o bonang batho ba, e le gore modumo wa bone ga o kana ka sepe mo Palamenteng.

Batho botlhe ba e leng gore fa go buiwa ka Tautona ba omana thata, o ba ele tlhoko.
Ke gore fa e se Mothusa Tautona, e se Honourable Deputy Speaker, Honourable Rakgare, Honourable Morwaeng, ke Honourable Mthimkhulu 22 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) and there is something common about these people.

Gongwe in exception ya ga Mothusa Tautona ka gore tota ke letsogo la ga Tautona.
Ba botlhe ke batho ba ba tswang kwa kganetso, botlhe.

E rile fa ba tsena ba fiwa maemo, ba fitlhela batho ba le mo laeneng.

Jaanong go se ka ga le gakgamatsa gore e bo e kete boDomkrag jwa bone bo feta jwa go Honourable Regoeng, maDomkrag a motia a a goletseng mo phathing e, ba e sokoletse ka bokete jo bo kanakana.

Batho ba bo batla ba nna Matona, e bo e le gore ba tsosa modumo o o kanakana mo Palamenteng fa go buiwa ka dikgang tsa tshenyetso-setšhaba.
Ga go gakgamatse Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

Ba iphitlha ka monwana, Motion o tlhamaletse fela gore a gore nne le a commission of enquiry e e tlaa yang go lebelela gore dikgang tsa tshenyetso-setšhaba, di ka dirwa ka tsela e e ntseng jang.
Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, dikgang tsa gore Tautona a bo a nna le dikgwebo, ke tlhalositse gore Tautona get intelligence briefings, including economic briefings tsa gore opportunities di kae, di ya go tla leng, batho ba tshwanetse ba di ipaakanyetse ka tsela e e ntseng jang.

All these briefings di tla kwa go Tautona by virtue of his office.
Jaanong gore e bo e nna a participant Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, golo moo go a ntshwenya ka gore botshelo jwa ga Tautona fa a sena go nna Tautona, ene le masika a gagwe botshelo jwa bone bo fetogela kwa botokeng ka mokgwa o o makatsang.
Mr Speaker, fa ke buile jalo, I move that this Honourable House resolves that His Excellency the President sets up a Commission of Enquiry, chaired by a Judge, sitting in public and whose report shall be published, to investigate the nature and extent of corruption, economic crime, mismanagement, maladministration and unethical governance in public institutions with a view to recommend formulation of appropriate policies, programmes and enacting appropriate laws.
Ba ba neng ba emetse “no” ke yone nako ya gore jaanong bo “no” ba lona ba tle ba itshupe thata Honourable Rakgare.

Ke a leboga Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente.

MR SPEAKER: Order!

Order!

Honourable Members.

This is the time Honourable Members, those who agree with the Motion will say, “aye” those who do not will say “no” or “nay.” HONOURABLE MEMBER: Procedure Mr Speaker.

Ke ne ke kopa gore gongwe o lebe le kwa chat ya rona, bangwe fa re sa kgone re tle re romele “yes” or “no” wa rona at the chat.
MR SPEAKER: What I propose to do Honourable Members is for your name to be called out and you pronounce yourself whether you agree with the Motion or you do not agree with it.

The collection of voices will not take us anywhere.
CLERK: MEMBER’S NAME AYE NO ABSTAIN ABSENT His Excellency Dr Masisi Honourable Autlwetse Honourable Balopi Honourable Boko Honourable Brooks Honourable Billy Honourable Dr Dikoloti Honourable Dr Dow Honourable Gare √ √ √ √ √ Honourable Dr Gobotswang √ Honourable Greeff 23 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) √ √ √ √ √ √ Honourable Hikuama Honourable Kablay Honourable Kapinga Honourable Kekgonegile Honourable Keorapetse Honourable Kereng Honourable Kgafela Honourable Khama Honourable Dr Kwape Honourable Lesedi Honourable Lelatisitswe Honourable Lesaso Honourable Dr Letsholathebe Honourable Letsholo Honourable Leuwe Honourable Lucas Honourable Majaga Honourable Makwinja Honourable Manake Honourable Mangwegape-Healy Honourable Mathoothe Honourable Dr Matsheka Honourable Mmolotsi Honourable Mmusi Honourable Moabi Honourable Moagi Honourable Moatlhodi Honourable Modukanele Honourable Mokgethi Honourable Molale Honourable Molao Honourable Molebatsi Honourable Monnakgotla Honourable Morwaeng Honourable Moswaane √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ 24 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) Honourable Motaosane Honourable Motsamai Honourable
 Mthimkhulu Honourable Mzwinila Honourable Nkawana Honourable Pule Honourable Rakgare Honourable Ramogapi Honourable Reatile Honourable Regoeng Honourable Saleshando Honourable Segokgo Honourable Serame Honourable Shamukuni Honourable Thiite Honourable Dr Tshabang Honourable Tshere His Honour Tsogwane √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ √ LEADER OF THE HOUSE (MR TSOGWANE): Go na le three members ba ba neng ba tsholeditse diatla Mr Speaker, ga ke itse gore a o ba bone?
MR SPEAKER: We are going back to them VP.

MR TSOGWANE: Yes sir.

CLERK: Honourable Kapinga.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: O kwadile on the chat gore o tlhopha “yes.” CLERK: Honourable Kgafela.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: O kwadile on the chat gore “no.” HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ga gona comment ya ga Kgafela on the chat, Honourable Morwaeng is being untruthful.

MINISTER FOR PRESIDENTIAL AFFAIRS, GOVERNANCE AND PUBLIC ADMINISTRATION (MR MORWAENG): O nthomeletse message to say that, o a utlwa?
HONOURABLE MEMBER: O ne o re o kwadile on chat.

Chat ga go tewe phone ya gago.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: TK, o ka tlhopha.

MR SPEAKER: We see Honourable Lefoko on the chat, ‘no.’ HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker, re tlaa itse jang gore go kwadile bone jaanong?
25 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022COMMISSION OF ENQUIRY TO INVESTIGATE THE NATURE AND EXTENT OF CORRUPTION, ECONOMIC CRIME, MISMANAGEMENT, MALADMINISTRATION AND UNETHICAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC INSTITUTIONSMotion (Resumed Debate) MR SPEAKER: When their names come.

When you write on the chat automatically, it tells us who you are.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, o ntlhapaletsa eng?

Apologise.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Welang bakaulengwe, Motion o o ga o siama fela le a itse.
dibete HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker, ga o gatele Kabo Morwaeng dikgato?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ga le na dipalo.

MR SPEAKER: Tsa eng kana?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Tsa go utswa ditlhopho.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Wena Mthimkhulu, o beile mo go reng ga re na dipalo, o rileng?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Gakere ga botlhale.

le bue HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ga o bone Kapinga a sa le thusa gompieno.

O bone gore fa ke mathata, go tlhakatlhakane a bo a sia mo go lona.
MR KAPINGA: Ga ke a sia, ke tlhophile ka bo ka romela le message gore I am voting “yes’.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Nnyaa, ke raya to debate.

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… HONOURABLE MEMBER: Honourable Khama o teng.

Ke eng o kare le batla go mo tlola jaana Mr Speaker?

HONOURABLE MEMBERS: …(Murmurs)… HONOURABLE MEMBER: Khama o apere t-shirt mo Palamenteng, ga a ka ke a tlhopha.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Morwaeng le ene ga a bofa tie, ga a apara le fa e le baki.

Morwaeng o tsenela Palamente in the toilet.


HONOURABLE MEMBER: Mr Speaker, go na le “no” wa ga Mma Kereng.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: O ntlhapaletsa eng nkgonne Nkawana?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ehe!

Sorry.

MR NKAWANA: Sorry.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Kgoberego, golo moo ke go tlhokela yo mongwe maitseo.

MR NKAWANA: Ke rile sorry, kante jaanong ga o itse sorry.

MR SPEAKER: Mo tlhophong ya lona, the ayes 16; the noes 28; absent 20.

Therefore, the “Noes” have it.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: They rigged Mr Speaker.


Question put and negated.

GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC) Motion MR KEKGONEGILE (MAUN EAST): Tanki Mr Speaker, re tseela gore re dumedisitse.

Mr Speaker, kana kwa Bokone Bophirima temothuo le bojanala ke tsone konokono ya matshelo a rona.

Kwa temothuong thatathata, kwa thuong ya dikgomo.


Fa re lebelela jaaka go diragala lefatshe ka bophara, palo ya dikgomo lefatshe ka bophara e ole kana e ntse e tsweletse e ya wa, e ya kwa tlase.

Rona kwa Ngamiland ka bo 2010 dikgomo tse di neng di le teng e ne e le bo 600 000, mme ka bo 2016 e ne e le bo 317 000, ngwaga o o neng o feta o ka 2021 di ne di wetse kwa tlase, palo ya tsone e le bo 200 000.

Go wa ga dipalo tse go tsamaelana le go wa ga matshelo a batho mo kgaolong.
E bile go wa ga dipalo tse go tsamaelana le gore mananeo a ga Goromente a a tshwanang a botlhoki, a dithuso tse di farologaneng, dipalo tsa one mo kgaolong ya rona di a gola, ga di ye kwa tlase.

Gone moo fela go tsamaelana le gore the cultural livelihood means tsa batho jaanong have been eroded, di dule, ga di sa tlhole di le teng.

Di a swa, di sule.

Mo go rayang gore batho jaanong e nna batlhoki ka dipalo tse di kwa godimo.

Dipalo tse tsa dikgomo gore di bo di wa di na le mabaka a a farologaneng.
HONOURABLE MEMBER: O ntlhapaletsa eng?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ke ne ke re ke a go seba, sorry.

Motion o maikaelelo a one ke go leka go tokafatsa seemo sa beef industry mo kgaolong ya rona mo go ntsheng barriers, go ntsheng dikgang tse di dirang gore thuo ya kgomo mo kgaolong ya rona e nne bokete mo bathong.
26 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion Le fela gore go nne le participation in the beef industry e e kwa godimo fela thata.

Motho fa a lebile seemo se se diragalang gompieno, fa re lebile the beef industry mo North West, kana pele ga boipuso le gongwe in the early 70s, the beef industry contributed more than 50 per cent to the GDP.
Gompieno agriculture fela contributes 0.9 per cent to the GDP compared to more than 50 per cent in 1966.

Kana gone moo fela go raya gore fa o lebelela dikgang tse di tshwanang gore BMC ya Maun e na le capacity ya to slaughter kana bokgoni jwa go bolaya dikgomo di tshwara bo 24 000 ka ngwaga, mme mo dingwageng tse tharo tse di ntseng di feta tse BMC e ntse e bolaya an average of 10 000 ka ngwaga.

Mo go rayang gore go na le deficit ya 14 000.

Deficit ya 14 000 e raya eng?


E raya gore matshelo a batho a wela kwa tlase.

Bone ba ba ka bong ba bonye thuso, ba ba ka bong ba bonye botshelo mo go 14 000 yo.

E raya gore palo ya barui e wela kwa tlase.

E raya gore malwapa a a ka bong a tshetswa ke dikgomo a wela kwa tlase.
Gone kana mabaka a teng a mantsinyana, ka gore go na le boitlhobogo jo bo setseng bo tsene mo bathong, ka gore kgomo ga e sa tlhole e na le boleng, ga e sa tlhole e na le ditlamorago tsa itsholelo, tse di neng di ntse di le teng nako e yotlhe fa batho ba santse ba dumela mo kgomong.
Gone moo fela ka bogone go raya gore batho jaanong ka bonya ka bonya ba a tswa, e bile ba dule mo go dumeleng mo kgomong ka mmetela, ka dipalo tse di kwa godimo, ka gore kgomo ga e na dipoelo, ka ntata ya gore prices, ditlhwatlhwa kwa go rona di kwa tlase fela thata.

E bile gape ditlhwatlhwa tse di a farologana.

Kwa BMC o tlaa bona gongwe ka bo P23, P25 per kg.

Fa o ya kwa private abattoirs a bo o e fitlhela ka bo P19 per kg.
Kana re raya dikgomo tse ditona, e seng namane jaaka go diragala kwa bo Ghanzi le dikgaolo tse dingwe.

Fa o ya to the butchers kgomo ya teng e tlaabo e go fa bo P15 per kg.

Sone se fela ka bosone ke se se dirang gore a bo e kete re ikuela thata gore kana mme batho ba jewa ntsoma, go tlhokafala golo mo go bidiwang gotwe Meat Regulator, yo o ka tlang a raya setšhaba, a ra ya bagwebi a re, nnyaa fa le ja batho ntsoma.

Motho sesagagwe o tshwanelwa ke gore a bo a boelwa ke sengwe mo go sone.
Late payments tsa BMC le tsone ke bothata jo re nang najo kwa kgaolong ya rona, gore fa o tsentse kgomo kwa BMC ka January o ya go bona dituelo tsa gago ka March.

Moo fela ka bogone go raya gore by the time dituelo tseo di goroga you have already spent that money mo go se tota o neng o sa ikaelela to spend mo go sone, ka gore o ne o tseela gore o a ithusa.

Jaanong ke go adima kwa le kwa fela gore ke solofetse sengwe, ke solofetse sengwe.
Mo madi a teng a felelang kgantele o kolota jaanong go feta mo o neng o go solofetse.

Re na le kgwetlho ya feeding challenges…ke alela dilo tse Mr Speaker gore re kgone go bona gore ke eng re tlhoka thuso e e ntseng jaana kwa Bokone Bophirima.

Re na le bothata jwa feeding challenges, gore jaanong mo merakeng ga go sa tlhole go na le bojang, ke dikgwa fela.

Fa e ne e ntse e le gore ke gone fa ne e le mafudiso, jaanong ke dikgwa, bush encroachment e nnile ntsi thata mo mafudisong.
Gone moo fela ka bogone jaanong go raya gore go jeswe leruo thata, go batliwe dijo tsa dikgomo.

E bile gape gone moo go raya gore palo ya dikgomo e nna ntsi, mo go feleletsang re nna le overgrazing le leuba le le leng teng kgapetsa kgapetsa mo kgaolong ya rona.

Ke dingwe tsa dikgwetlho tse re nang natso mo baruing.

Fa re tsena mo kgannyeng ya konokono, ya gore gone mme fa o isa kgomo ya gago kwa BMC ka e le yone e e ditlhwatlhwa di botoka mo kgaolong ya rona o tsaya dikgomo kae?
Transport cost e ntse jang?

Kana BMC re bua ka Maun, but kgaolo ele e tona, o kgona go e tsaya o tswa kwa bo Seronga, Kareng, ka fa dipolasing, o kgona go e tsaya o tswa fela gone fa go bo Toteng fale, kana Shorobe ka fa.

Fa o tswa ntlheng ya bo Shorobe, go raya gore transport ke P500 kgomo nngwe le nngwe.

Fa o tla o tswa kwa bo Beetsha, Seronga, transport go raya gore ke P1, 000 kgomo nngwe le nngwe.
Motho o ipotsa gore, gone mme jaanong fa go tsetse go dule P1, 000 wa transport mme kwa kgomong e, o ya go bona P4, 000 tota o tlaabo o saletswe ke eng mo thuong ya gago ya kgomo e?

Fa o tsena kwa quarantine, kana o e isa quarantine, e ya go nna 30 days, mme go raya gore kwa o tshwanelwa ke gore o nne le motlhokomedi wa dikgomo tse o tlaabong o di beile koo for 30 days.

Kwa morakeng wa gago gape kwa, o tshwanelwa ke gore o bo o na le motlhokomedi.
Gone moo fela ka bo gone, go raya gore go tsenya barui ba kwa mohoholela, go raya gore kgomo e le nngwe fela jaanong kana dikgomo tsone tseo, o felela kgantele o tswa fela mo dipalong gore o isitse dipalo tse kae.

Fa o isitse bo five, go raya gore felela gone mo go tlhokomeleng mo go eng, go ya go nna le tšhentšhinyana fela ya 25 per cent of the actual cost e o neng o tshwanelwa ke gore o ka bo o e bona.
Gape kana go tswa kwa quarantine go isa BMC gape, o duela transport gape e le P250, go raya gore fa o le mo surrounding ya Maun, o tlaa duela transport ya 27 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion P750, fa o le kgakala kwa bo Beetsha-Seronga, o ya go duela transport ya bo P1, 300 per kgomo.

Gone mo fela go dingalo fela thata.


Of course yes go na le kgang ya private quarantine initiative, gore go rotloetsa gore batho ba dire masimo a bone gore go ka nna le private quarantine teng ba nna ba kwarantina gore ba se ka ba ya kgakala.

Re a itse gore costs tsa ditlhwatlhwa tsa go itirela kwarantine di ntse jang.

Kana go tlaabo go raya gore le bo feeding jalo le bo eng, le bo eng, batho ba meraka e mennyennyane ga ba ka ke ba kgona dilo tseo.
Ke tse di ka kgonwang fela ke batho ba ba nang le itsholelo.

Ke sone se re tlang re re leo lenaneo ee le teng, but ga se la majority ya batho ba ba ka thusegang.

Go na le kgang ya markets gape gore kana rona kwa Bokone Bophirima, jaaka maloba Tona fa a tsisitse statement mo Palamenteng, a bua ka fa e leng gore the beef industry e ya go tokafadiwa ka teng mo lefatsheng, o buile ka lefatshe lotlhe, mme North West e ne e seyo mo teng totally mo mananeong a a neng a fiwa.
A bua gore North West is a unique district, e na le dikgwetlho le ditsamaiso tsa yone, ga se e e ka tsenang fa.

Gone moo fela go raya gore re beilwe ka fa mosing, fa e le gore Goromente ga go na mananeo ape a re akantseng ka one.

Gone mo kana go dira seemo se e leng gore mebaraka le yone ga re yo mo go yone.
Ngwaga le ngwaga go buiwa ka Commodity Based Trade; ‘jaanong le ka rekisa sentle ka gore jaanong le wetse mo lenaneong Commodity Based Trade.’ Fa re re ee go siame re rekisa kae, nnyaa emang pele re santse re bua le Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), Zimbabwe, le China.

Ngwaga le ngwaga ke sone se se diragalang.
Mo go rayang gore ga re na market; market wa rona fa bangwe ba re ba rekisa dikgongwana fa ka bo P4, 000 rona kwa re rekisa dikgomo tse ditona ka P4, 000 ka gore kgongwana o ya go e rekisa ka P1, 000 mme o nnile le expenses tsone tse, ka gore market wa rona o local, but still fa e ne le e gore market wa rona o local, o ne o ka nna lucrative, like one wa the tenders tsa ga Goromente kwa bo police, kwa dikolong, kwa kae, e bo e le gore Goromente o reka directly from BMC ya Maun, go ne go ka nna botoka.
Prices that are won with tenders, e ka bo e le prices tse di yang to the beef farmers tsa North West, but ga re na market totally.

Gone moo fela go dira gore jaanong kgomo e se ka ya nna le mosola, mo go rona.

Fa e sa nne le mosola mo go rona, go raya gore jaanong re digela kwa tlase boleng le botlhokwa jwa gore re ka itshetsa ka kgomo, dipalo tsa batlhoki di a oketsega.

Re na le dikgwetlho tse di ntsinyana gape fa go tla mo beef industry, tse di tshwanang le tsa bo human-wildlife conflict.
Re na le Foot and Mouth Disease (FMD) kwa, dinare di A goroga, we are a red zone, mme re na le kgang e tona ya ditlou, moswi wa terata yo o kileng a nna teng wa FMD fence, ga e sa tlhole e le teng ka ditlou di e digile, di ntsifetse mo go feteletseng, go raya gore dinare di a itaola, di tsamaya fela, di salwa morago ke bo ditau jalo le dibatana tse dingwe.

Mo go rayang gore dibatana di nyeuma fela mo kgaolong ya rona.
Re bo re nna le bothata jwa tsone ditlou tse e leng gore di jojo tse, masaka, eng, ke dilo tse di nnang di thubilwe, di kgaotswe letsatsi le letsatsi.

Mo go rayang gore issue ya wildlife-human conflict e ntsi thata.

Fa o tswa o re o ya go batla dikgomo, o kopana le yone tlou, mo go rayang gore jaanong o ya go fitlhela matimela kana dikgomo tsa rona ele majankiri fela, go sena gore o ka ya go tsamaya o ya go batla, o ya go tlhatlhela ka gore o kopana le tlou, mme tlou ga e na mercy fa e kopana le wena.
Mo go rayang gore jaanong ditau le diphiri di ijela fela.

Dilo tse Mr Speaker, ke bothata jo re nang le jone, jo bo dirang gore e nne o kare jaanong dipalo tsa rona tsa dikgomo di wela kwa tlase, le rona re a itsapa gore jaanong re tsene mo mohameng o. Golo mo go bidiwang letlhoo, mo dikgaolong tsele tsa bo Toteng, Kareng, Sehithwa, fa pula e ne le sentle, ntsi ya teng e itaya kgomo fela mo e leng gore ke bothata, but ga re bone supplementary epe e re thusiwang mo go yone.
Re na le yone issue ya buffalo fence, kana dikgomo tsa rona fa di tloletse buffalo fence ka kwa, di a bolawa, mme fa dinare di tloletse ka kwa go rona, di busediwa fela ka kwa, mme re bua ka bo Commodity Based Trade initiative, o ipotsa gore jaanong dikgomo tse di bolaelwa eng, ka gore re na le laboratory ke e, we export melemo, a mme jaanong ga se nako ya gore laboratory le melemo tse re di dirise, re di bolaelang dikgomo tse, but di a bolawa.
Kana kgomo ke phologolo, fa terata ya FMD e ole, dikgomo fa di tswa di bona bojang jo bo botoka bo le ka kwa, di a tsamaya ka gore ga go na le fa e le fence, di ya go ja.

Ba veterinary ba a di tshwara koo moraka otlhe o bo o bolawa, o sala ka eng?

Batho ba bangwe fa ba bona o bolaelwa moraka otlhe, ba ipotsa gore is it worth it, a bone ba ka tswelela ka thuo ka gore go ya go tswelela go ntse jaana.
Re na le kgofa e nngwe kwa side ya bo Tubu, bo Daneha ka kwa e e bidiwang beMobile, e e feditseng dikgomo gone ka kwa, e e leng gore ga re a bona thuso epe.

E talanyana jaana kgofa ya teng, ga re a bona thuso epe kay one.

Ke dikgwetlho tse re nang le tsone tsa kgomo.


28 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion Proposal ya Motion o ke gore re kopa Palamente e gore e dumalane gore a Goromente a leke maano kana a nne le maano a gore a re thuse rona re le North West beef farmers mo kgannyeng ya BMC, tse dingwe tse gongwe re ka tswelela re ntse re sheleketla ka tsone.
Kgang ya BMC fela ya transport costs gore a mme re lebile gore; ke a itse gore Tona o ya go tla a re kwa Kgomokgwana kwa, re baakanya kwarantini, go raya gore transport costs tsa batho bale di ya go fokotsega, but still transport costs tsa kwarantini, lefatshe lotlhe ga ba kwarantini, ke rona fela ba re kwarantinang.

Mo go rayang gore batho ba bangwe ba o tsaya from moraka a bo a tsaya quota ya gagwe ya BMC, within a week a bo a phutha a dijesajesa foo gore di se ka tsa tsamaela kgakala, a bo a isa.
Wena o ya go tshwanelwa ke gore o di beye 30 days o di tlhokomela, o di jesa o reng, mo go rayang gore go diga boleng jwa price e ntseng e le kwa tlase gale gape le yone kwa North West.

Jaanong fa transport re ne re ka e thusiwa, gongwe go ne go ka nna botoka fela thata.
Gape mo gongwe mo re neng re tseela gore go ka diragala ke gore a re leke to reintroduce kana re buseletse mogopolo ole wa gore BMC e reke, then it quarantines; e nne le direct purchasing fa e le gore go tlhokafala quarantine ka gore fa gongwe o ipotsa gore what are the reasons for quarantining ka gore nama e ga e ye European Union (EU), ke e re e jang fela gone mo, mme re tsweletse re a tshela.
Botoka, kgang ya direct purchasing e ka re thusa mo management wa quarantine le mo costs tsa quarantine kwa North West.

Mo gongwe gape ke gore kgang ya gore fa re le kwa quarantine, re bo re tlhokometse, gongwe Goromente o ka re thusa gore a nne le ba ba ka re tlhokomelelang kwa quarantine fa rona re santse re le kwa merakeng, fa e le gore tse dingwe tse ga a di kgone, so that o ka fokotsa extreme costs and expenses mo go bolayang boleng jwa kgomo.
Dilo tse fela ka bo tsone fa Goromente a ka di re thusa, re tseela gore kana cattle farmers mo mafatsheng a a tshwanang le bo Brazil, South Africa and even in Europe, are hugely supplemented, mme go sena dikgang tse di kanakana tse.

That is why beef industries tsa bone di le so powerful thatathata gone kwa bo Brazil, mme e bile ba kgona to export large numbers tse di ka busetsang itsholelo mo lefatsheng.
Motion o maikaelelo a one ke go busetsa serodumo sa kgomo fela gone kwa go bo 70s, kwa re neng re kgona gore kgomo e bo e ka re tshetsa gore a re e busetseng gone kwa, re kgone go tshela.
Go ikanya to import kana go tsaya dijo kwa ntle ga go ka ke ga re thusa ka sepe because if we do not supplement our beef industry gompieno, re a e bolaya slowly but surely and re ya go felela re reka nama go tswa kwa mafatsheng a sele, mme e ne e le rona the major exporters ba nama mo kgaolong yone e. Gone mo fela can motivate banana gore ba tsene mo beef sector e ba busetsa.

It can motivate generational takeover of farms.


Gompieno fa o ya kwa merakeng ke batho ba ba tona fela, banana ga ba ye teng ka gore ga bone the benefits tsa gore ba ka tshela ka moraka ka ga o na tlhwatlhwa, boleng le dipoelo.

Ka go rialo Mr Speaker, I so submit.

Tanki.

ACTING MINISTER OF AGRICULTURAL DEVELOPMENT AND FOOD SECURITY (DR DIKOLOTI): Procedure, Mr Speaker.
Mr Speaker, I am the Acting Minister of Agriculture, mme ke ne ke re ka gore ke nna Tona yo o maleba, gongwe ke tsene pele fa Honourable Billy a ka bua.

Thank you sir.

MR SPEAKER: Indeed, Honourable Dikoloti.

HONOURABLE MEMBER: O boetse kwa o neng o palelwa teng?

HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ee, ba a mmusa fa ba riana.

DR DIKOLOTI: Tla ke go leboge Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo.

Honourable Motsamai le ba bangwe, nna le itshwara le bagolo.
Ga go monate le ntse le bua le fetisa (pass) remarks le bo le tshega jalo ka gore nako nngwe re tlaa le araba, mme le tlaa se ke le itumele.
Mr Speaker, ke simolole ka gore ga re dumalane le Motion o wa ga Honourable Kekgonegile, mme ke tlaa kopa gore o ntetle gore ke beye mabaka a gore ke eng re sa dumalane le Motion o. Kgaolo e ya Bokone Bophirima, e wela mo kgaolong ya taolo matlhoko a leruo ya bobedi kana Veterinary Disease Control Zone 2 e ba Lekgotla la Mafatshefatshe la Matlhoko a Leruo classify it jaaka kgaolo e e nang le Tlhako le Molomo kana Foot and Mouth Disease infected area or red zone.
Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo, taolo ya Tlhako le Molomo mo kgaolong e ya Bokone Bophirima, e ikaegile segolobogolo mo thulaganyong e re reng ke surveillance le thulaganyo e nngwe e re reng ke go kentela yone Tlhako le Molomo, mo go diragalang gararo mo ngwageng le gore re bo re itsa metsamao mo yone kgaolo e. Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo, re na le budget e e ka tshwarang P31 million e re e dirisang ngwaga le ngwaga mo go kenteleng Tlhako le Molomo, mme o kgona go lemoga le wena Mr Speaker gore this huge investment 29 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion ke yone e e thusang thata gone kwa kgaolong ya Bokone Bophirima gore ba kgone gore ba ka rekisa fresh bovine meat to both the regional market le tsone the international markets.
E bile mo go yone kgaolo e ya North West Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo, re na le matlhabelo a le mararo a a letleletsweng gore a ka rekisa nama kwa ntle ga lefatshe le.
Motsamaisa Dipuisano, nama ya kgomo go tswa kwa Bokone Bophirima, e babalesegile ka gore re na le thulaganyo e motlotlegi a ntseng a leka go bua ka yone e gotweng commodity-based trade, ke yone e e re letlelelang gore re bo re ka quarantine dikgomo malatsi a le masome a mararo mo stations tse di farologaneng tse a neng a bua nngwe ya tsone, e re santseng re le mo dipaakanyong tsa yone.
E nngwe e teng le yone e kwa Makalamabedi, mme o ya go fitlhela e le gore mo quarantine e, re letlelela gore re dire mo gotweng the ante-mortem, post-mortem inspection le maturation, le bone bo deboning, ke tsone dikarolo tsotlhe tse di tshwanetseng gore di tsene under this community-based trading.
quarantining Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo, dikgomo mo the Government facilities go tlhokana le gore go baakanngwe the physical infrastructure, le gore dikgomo tse di nosiwe, go nne le holding facilities le ditshenyegelo tsotlhe fela tse di ka nnang teng tse Puso e nnang e di duelela kana e netefatsa gore di nna di le teng.
Se se tlhokafalang fela mo baruing ke gore barui ba kgaolo e, ba itetle or provide yone labour ya gore ba bone gore dikgomo tse di goroga jang kwa quarantine facilities e bile dikgomo tse fa di le kwa quarantine facilities, di tlhokomelesega jang; tlhokomelo ya teng e le go disa fela ka gore tse tsotlhe tse dingwe Puso e a bo e di diragaditse.

Ke dumela gore barui kwa North West, ba ithulaganya tota Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo.
Ke mongwe wa ba ba kileng ka ya kwa, ba ya go bua le barui ka ngwaga wa 2020, ke bua le bone gore re ka ithulaganya jang botoka gore fa gongwe fa go na le ditshenyegelo tse di tshwanang le tsa bo gore go ka nna le ditshenyego tsa transport, ba dire jang botoka.

Ba setse ba ikgobokantse ba dirile tsone dikoporase tse di dirang gore go nne le gore ditshenyego tse di ka nnang teng mo labour, di nne botoka.
E bile Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo go feta gone foo, re le Puso re mekamekane le gore kampa ya Kgomo Kgwana re e baakanye gore le yone e tle e kgone go thusa barui ba letlhakore le lengwe le ditshenyegelo tseo tsa go tlisa dikgomo kwa quarantine, di se ka tsa nna kwa godimodimo.
Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo, Mopalamente o ne a bua gore o a leboga gore re tsweletse ka go nna re ntse re bona gore re thusa barui ba jang, a leboga a lebile gore re na le mo gotweng on-farm quarantine e gompieno mo kgaolong ele, re na le ba feta lesome le botlhano ba re setseng re ba sekasekile (assessed), re ba letleletse gore ba ka dira quarantine e mo farms tsa bone.
E bile go feta moo, re na le ba bangwe ba ba ikemetseng ka nosi ba ba dirang mo gotweng private quarantine e mo go yone, ke dumelang gore ke tlaa nna ke tshwaragana le Mapalamente ba Bokone Bophirima ka gore fa ke le kwa, ke ne ke na le Honourable Hikuama.
Re bua thata gore there is a dire need kana go na le letlhoko le le seng kana ka sepe la gore re fetole our husbandry procedures gore kwa bofelelong, re kgone gore re tswe mo segologolong sele sa gore o tlogele kgomo e gola go fitlhela e re fa e tsamaya e bo e thunya ditlhako.
Golo mo ga go sa tlhole go re berekela ka gore bontsi jwa batho malatsing a ba batla go ja nama e e santseng e le nana, mme o tlaa ela tlhoko gore dimmaraka tse di dintsi tse gompieno gone kwa Bokone Bophirima, ga ba a bolo go nna ba letlelelwa gore ba ka rekisa dikgomo live, a ke kwa Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) kana Mozambique.
There is a very lucrative market o o kwa Mozambique o o batlang thata go rotloetsa (promote) this weaner production mo kgaolong e. Ke dumela gore banana ba kwa Bokone Bophirima, ba ntheeditse thata ka gore ke dithulaganyo tse Puso e di etse tlhokong thata mme e bile di tsamaisana thata segolobogolo le Tlhomontšha e Tautona a re e beileng pele, tlhabatshe ya bone e e buang ka value chain development.
E re dumelang gore dithulaganyo tsotlhe fa ba ka di tseeletsa, di tlaa kgona gore di thuse barui ba ba kwa Bokone Bophirima gore ba kgone go akola segolobogolo mo thuong ya bone ya kgomo.

Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, BMC, jaaka re e tlotlile ka kwano re e bitsa cold storage, ke nngwe ya matlhabelo a a letlelesegileng gore a ka rekisa nama ya kgomo, mo region, Botswana kana ke kwa ntle ga lefatshe le.
O tlaa fitlhela Puso e itlamile totatota gore e tlaa tswelela e dira gore matlhabelo a a nne a ntse a thusa barui ba, le fa re itse gore go na le dikgang tsa gore dipoelo tsa one ga se tsone, Puso e tsere maikarabelo a gore e tlaa netefatsa gore matlhabelo a Maun a tlaa tswelela a ntse a bereka.
Ke go gakolole foo Honourable Kekgonegile gore, ngogola ba cold storage kwa Maun ba ne ba oketsa ditlhwatlhwa tsa dikgomo, kgomo e ne e ntse e tsewa ka P23 per kilogram (kg), o tlaa gakologelwa gore ba ne 30 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion ba oketsa to P28 per kg.
Golo mo go tsile go rotloetsa barui ba kwa Bokone Bophirima gore ba tswelele ka go bona gore ba tlaa dira jang gore kwa bofelelong dikgomo tsa bone di kgone go goroga kwa mmarakeng.
Gape re tlhaloganya gore go na le private abattoirs tse di kwa Maun, tse ke dumalanang le wena e le kgang e re sa bolong go e bua gore, sengwe se se botlhokwa se se ka re baakanyetsang theko le thekiso ya nama mo lefatsheng le ke meat regulator, o Botona ba setseng ba buile thata ka one gore… HONOURABLE MEMBER: Ke kopa tlhaloso.

DR DIKOLOTI: Iketle pele ke ale Dumelang, o tla tlaa o tsena.
E re dumelang gore ke yone tshoso-e-rweleng ya dikgang tse di tlaa rarabololang mathata otlhe a re sa bolong go nna le one mo dikgannyeng tsa nama.

Ke dumalana le wena ka gore ke ne ke le koo, ke ile ka etela le private abattoirs tse go bona gore go ne go berekiwa jang mo go tsone.
O fitlhela mo gongwe ke mo go ka tweng, “mashi ke tswa thobeng ke le phepa, selabe se tla le motsaya kgamelo.” Nngwe ya dikgang tse re neng re di bona kwa one of the private abattoirs, e ne e le condemnation ya dikgomo to measles, mme go lebega go na le gore go ya ka gore a o tla o apere suit kana o tla o sa apara suit fa o tla go rekisa, e ne o kare fa o apere suit o kgona go letlelelwa gore kgomo ya gago e tsene ba bo ba sa condemn golo moo.
O bona gore go dira motho foo ga se process, process e e teng e tlhamaletse, yo o leng teng yo o tshwanetseng to implement gore e diragale ka fa e tshwanetseng go diragala ka teng, ke ene yo o neng a dira gore go bo go na le mathata.
Ke dumela gore Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo, fa o lebeletse gotlhe mo Puso e go dirang go netefatsa gore mohama o wa thuo ya dikgomo kwa kgaolong ya Bokone Bophirima o tswelele o le teng e bile o itshetlela, o tlaa bona gore barui ba kwa kgaolong e ba akola go se kana ka sepe tota mo go se Puso e se ba neelang gore kwa bofelelong le bone ba nne le kgomo, e tle e kgone go ba tshetsa.

O ka tsena foo Honourable Dumelang.

MR SALESHANDO: Clarification.


Minister just two points, ya ntlha ke gore mo go e ya value chain development, a go na le anything specific se le neng le itebagantse le sone gore se re batla go se isa kwa Ngamiland kana Maun re lebile bothata jo bo leng teng?

disadvantage because I think that is the critical point?
The return on investment ya morui yo o mo North West fa o e tshwantshanya le regions tse dingwe mo lefatsheng la Botswana, a ga gona bosupi jwa gore go lebega koo go le bokete go feta kwa dikgaolong tse dingwe, you get less out of every pula that you invest mo kgomong kwa North West?
DR DIKOLOTI: Mo go ya gago ya bofelo o e botsa, ga ke itse gore a o ne o ntheeditse ke re kana nngwe ya dikgwetlho tse di teng mo kgaolong ya Bokone Bophirima ke nngwe e e buegang ka puo ya seeng gotwe husbandry procedures, tse ba di salang morago.

Go rua kgomo go fitlhelela e thunya ditlhako Dumelang ga go go busetse, o tshwanetse gore o rue kgomo o e rekise e santse e le naana gore e kgone go go neela dipoelo tse di duleng diatla.
Ke ne ke bua gore go na le dimmaraka tse di bulegileng, which are very lucrative.

Mmaraka o akaretsa wa kwa Mozambique, o ba letlelelang gore ba ka reka dikgomo go tswa kwa North West.
Ka o ne o botsa gape gore re dira eng, re le ba Lephata la Matlhoko a Leruo re nna re dira mo gotweng risk analysis go lebelela gore mme Kgaolo ya Bokone Bophirima re ka dira jang, tlhako le molomo e tlhagoga kwa kae, ke kwa kae kwa e sa tlhagogeng sentle, re ka dira jang gore ba ba koo bao re kgone gore re ba sireletse ka tsela nngwe gore kwa bofelelong ba kgone go felela ba rekisa nama ya bone kwa mmarakeng o o phuthulogileng gona le o o restricted ka fa go ntseng ka teng.
Go na le thulaganyo e nngwe e re e bitsang re re compartmentalisation of farms e go nang le bangwe ba matlhoko a leruo who have assessed farms tsa bone.

Such people o a go fitlhela gore fa a tlisa dikgomo tsa gagwe within the red zone with this compartmentalisation, dikgomo tsa gagwe di tlaabo di kgona gore di nne accessible to the lucrative market wa European Union (EU).

Mo ke dingwe tsa dipatlisiso tse re le ba matlhoko a leruo re tsweletseng re di dira.
O tlaa gakologelwa gore re na le kompone e le neng le bua ka yone Honourable Kekgonegile ya Vaccine Institute, ga e a nna fela, e tsweletse ka dipatlisiso tsa go fetola melemo e re e dirisang go bona gore kwa bofelelong re nna le melemo e e ka re thusang go laola bolwetse jwa tlhako le molomo botoka, gore kgaolo e e kgone gore e nne le dipoelo fela tse di duleng diatla.

Ke dumela gore ke di adile.
Ya bobedi ka bokhutshwane ke gore, a mme le a tle le dire an assessment ya gore mme morui yo o ruetseng mo North West, ditshenyegelo tse a lebaganeng le tsone versus barui ba bangwe mo lefatsheng a ga ba at any Honourable Saleshando, kgang ya value chain development ga se ya ga Dikoloti kana ga se ya Puso ya ga Tautona Mokgweetsi Masisi, ke kgang e le wena o le Mopalamente kwa Bokone Bophirima kana mo 31 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion lefatsheng le, o tshwanetseng gore o e tseeletse ka gore lefatshe lotlhe ka bophara ke kwa rotlhe re lebileng teng go bona gore how do we strengthen the linkages within value chain to make sure that we benefit fully.
Honourable Kekgonegile o ne a a fa sekai a bua ka bush encroachment, which is not just a problem in the North West, ke mathata lefatshe le lotlhe le.

Fa o ka ela tlhoko gore fa re ka simolola go fetola the way we manage phulo ya rona ka teng o tlaa bona le dikgang tsa leuba e ya go nna dikgang tsa maloba.

O ne a bua thata ka kgang ya mosu gore mosu has invaded most of their pastures, mme o a itse gore mosu ke nngwe ya ditlhare tse di dirisiwang jaaka feed.
Re ne re na le kompone e e neng e bidiwa AOB e e neng e dirisa mosu thata go dira dijo tsa bone, golo mo go neeletse gape value chain development, e ke solofelang gore le le Mapalamente ba kwa Bokone Bophirima le tlaa nna le ntse le tla kwa go rona re tla go le gakolola le go feta ka fa re ka buang ka teng mo Palamenteng, gore kwa bofelelong banni ba Bokone Bophirima ba kgone to benefit mo dithulaganyong tse Puso e di ipeileng pele, ka gore fa o ka ela tlhoko thulaganyo e ya Tlhomontšha e re e beilweng pele, o tlaa bona gore ke thulaganyo e e humileng thata e e leng gore fa re ka inaakanya le yone, Batswana ba tlaa kgona go tswa mo lehumeng le ba ntseng ba le mo go lone.
Ke tsaya gore ka tseo Motsamaisa Dipuisanyo tsa Palamente, ga re dumalane le Motion o Rre Kekgonegile a re o beileng pele.

Re dumela gore tse re tsweletseng re di dira kwa Bokone Bophirima di lekane, e bile re tlaa tswelela re ntse re bua le bone ka gore kgangkgolo ya rona ke go bona gore re tsalanya jang go tshela ga nare le dikgomo kwa kgaolong ya Bokone Bophirima gore kwa bofelelong barui le bone ba kgone to access all the market.
Ba Lephata la Veterinary ba tsweletse tota ba a bereka thata Honourable Kekgonegile, o nne o ikgolaganya thata le Dr Thololwane kwa Ngamiland a nne a go tlhatlhelela thata ka dikgang tse tsa compartmentalisation.

O kgone go gakolola le barui gore go tlhokana le eng gore kwa bofelelong tshimo ya gago e bo e ka felela o ka e dirisa gore o kgone to quarantine mo go yone.

Ke a leboga Mr Speaker.

MR BROOKS (KGALAGADI SOUTH): Thank you Honourable Speaker.
Re ntse re utlwa ka fa mmei wa Motion a o kopelang ka teng, o ntshitse dintlha tse di botlhokwa a lebile letlhoko le go akanya ka fa go ka tokafadiwang ka teng re lebile matshelo a batho ba Bokone Bophirima, (North West) ka Sekgoa.

Le fa go ntse jalo, re tla re utlwa ka fa Tona a lekang go tlhalosa kgang ka teng gore bone e le Ministry wa Temothuo kana Puso e dira go le kae go leka go thusa mo diemong tse di ntseng jalo.
Dilo tse re tshwanetse jaanong re tsene mo dipuisanong, re di lebelele ka go tshwana le gore batho ba re ba duletseng fa re ba kopela dithuso tse, bone seabe sa bone re ba rotloetsa go le kae mo dithulaganyong tse di ntseng jaana.

Go botlhokwa Mr Speaker, gore re thuse batho, segolo jang re itse kgaolo e tshwana le Bokone Bophirima gore e tswa kae ka dikgwetlho tse di kanakana, mo lebakeng le le kae ba ntse ba lebega e kete ba apesitswe ke boitlhobogo fa go tla go tsena mo thuong.
Dilo tse re tshwanetse gore e re jaanong re tsena mo kgannyeng e e tshwanang le e, re bo re tsentse leitlho thata mo go tsone.

Potso fela ke gore fa re tshwanetse gore re thuse batho Mr Speaker, re tlaa tswelela re ba direla go fitlhelela go le kae.

MoAferika a re,“tlogelang go direlwa jaaka nama le le batho.” Re tshwanetse re rotloetse batsadi ba rona gore kwa bofelong jwa letsatsi, se ba se tshwereng ba nne le seabe se se tseneletseng thata mo go sone.
Go tle go nne le dipoelo tse ba itseng gore ba ne ba na le seabe sa go huhula mo go tsone.

Ke dumalana le mafoko a a neng a buiwa ke Tona gore ga re sa tlhole re ka rua jaaka bogologolo mo re tlaa fitlhelang re sa itse gore a re ruile lenaka la dikgomo kana letlalo la dikgomo.

Thulaganyo e ba e dirileng ya gore re rekise dikgomo e le weaners, le gone go ka re berekela.

Maloba batho ba ba neng ba tlisa mo BMC e e ka fa Lobatse, ba kile ba rata go palangwa ke leshekere.
I know problem ya North West is so unique because of Foot and Mouth.

Ga se e re ka e itebatsang.

Equally, fa re bua ka tlhabololo le go fetola se re nang le sone gone foo, go tsena mo tirisong e e tlaa dirang gore e berekele batho ba rona, re tshwanetse gore dilo tsotlhe re di tseye re di beye mo tafoleng, re di lebelele.

Se ke lekang go se supa fela fa ke gore, BMC ya Lobatse e kile ya thusa barui ba yone gore ba tseye loans mo BMC.

Ba ye go dira feeds, ba jese dikgomo.


Fa dikgomo di sena go nna dintle, di nna botokanyana, e bo ba simolola gore fa ba isa dikgomo tseo kwa BMC, BMC e tlaabo e tlhaba dikgomo e bo e ntsha madi a yone.

I know here we are talking about fa di setse di le quarantined, ke tsaya gore go ka tswa go sa tsamaelane fa re go bua ka molomo.

However, fa re bua ka tlhokomelo le gore the end product ya gore le batla e nna eng, re dumalana gore di a welana.
Ke sone se ke reng re tshwanetse re kope, re bo re rotloetse batsadi ba rona ba Bokone Bophirima gore, go na le dithulaganyo tse re ka di salang morago, tse di ka 32 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion re thusang gore e re kwa bofelong jwa letsatsi, go nne profitable.

Kgomo ka boyone re e fetole, re tsene mo kgwebong.


Fa e tsena mo kgwebong, o dira mo gotlhe mo o ka go dirang gore e tle e busetse ditshenyegelo tsa yone, e sa go babalele o le morui, e sa babalele Puso ka tsela e e ntseng jalo.

Dilo tsotlhe tse, ke tsone tse… re leka go sireletsa go le kae.

E tle e re kamoso re di batlela mebaraka kwa Dubai le Saudi Arabia, re bo re itse gore mo nakong e e kana Tlhako le Molomo ga e ise e kwadisiwe mo kgaolong ya Bokone Bophirima.
Fa re sa sale morago protocols tse, ga re ka ke ra itse gore a Tlhako le Molomo a e a anama kana ga e aname.

MR MOTAOSANE: Clarification Mr Speaker.

Thank you Honourable Brooks.

Ga ke a go utlwa sentle ka kgang ya ka fa BMC e dirang ka teng e thusa balemi gore ba tseye sekolotonyana mo go bone ba tokafatse dikgomo tsa bone pele ga ba di isa.

Ga ke itse gore wa re kwa North West ba dire jang?

Ke batla o wela gone foo.

Ga ke a go utlwa o wela gore wa re kwa North West ba dire jang?
Re lebile mabaka a gore e na le diemo tsa yone fela di le nosi.

Le fa ba ka tsaya madi ao, a go ya go nna le poelo fa ba rekisa kwa go bone?

Thank you sir.

MR BROOKS: Thank you.

O nkutlwile.


Ke tsaya gore fa o utlwa Tona a tlhalosa, o ne a supa gore ba ne ba oketsa madi a North West kana a matlhabelo a Maun go ya kwa go P28.00, fa ke ne ke mo tshwara sentle, o tlaa nkgakolola, kana o tlaa gakolola Ntlo e. Jaanong se ke neng ke leka go se supa ke gore, malobeng BMC ya Lobatse e ne e go ntshetsa gore o ka tsaya a maximum ya P1,500.00 go jesa kgomo ya gago mo selekanyong se se kana gore e tle e kgone to gain weight e e kana.
E re o e isa matlhabelong at your own expense ya go tlhokomela jalojalo, but feeding dilo tse tsotlhe, BMC e ne e go ntshetsa P1500.00 o bo o itlhokomelela kgomo eo.

O e jesa from that P1500.00, e bo e re e sena go nna e tlhabiwa, ba bo ba goga their P1500.00 yo o neng o mo tsere.

Re balela le costs tsotlhe tsa gago mo teng jaaka o tlaabo o ntse o tsamaya up and down.
Se ke lekang go se supa ke gore, fa re ka tsaya thulaganyo e e neng e dirwa ke BMC ka nako eo, e direlwa farmers, re bo re ruta farmers tsa rona tse di kwa Bokone Bophirima, go ka fokotsa burden e re batlang go e pega Puso gore re tlhokomele batsadi ba rona ba Bokone Bophirima.

Se ke lekang go se gatelela ke gore, I am saying this for real, thuo ya kgaolo ya Bokone Bophirima is so unique ka bothata jwa Tlhako le Molomo and dilo tsotlhe tse.
Protocols tse di amanang le mafatshe a a bapileng le rona kana kwa re rekisang dinama teng Honourable Motaosane, re tshwanetse ra di sala morago.

Ga re ka ke ra ipolelela gore dikgomo tsa Bokone Bophirima re tlaa tswelela re di tlhabela mo ganong fela.

Re tshwanetse re di batlele mebaraka.


Re kgona go di batlela mebaraka re latedisa, re tlhokomela and monitor gore go anama le go tsena ga Tlhako le Molomo re go thibela go le kae, Re se ka ra ipaya mo go tlhobogeng gore this area is a red zone, e ya go tswelela e le red zone go ya lesong.

Ke red zone gompieno fa pele ga rona le lona.


In the future mo baneng ba rona, it is likely going to turn to be a green zone go tswa fela gore re tlaabo re lole go le kae go kgoreletsa Tlhako le Molomo gore e se ka ya anama mo kgaolong e e ntseng jalo.

Se ke lekang go se supa ke gore, re tshwanetse re rute farmers jaaka re ruta in the other sectors batho gore ba tle ba itshetse.
Re tshwanetse re tswelele ka go ruta farmers gore re fetole ka fa re akanyang ka teng, ka fa re batlang go atolosa gore leruo le, le re direle.

Mr Speaker, ka tsela e e ntseng jaana, ke kope rraetsho fale gore nnyaa, a re boele to the farmers, re ba bontshe gore dikgomo tse ke tsa rona.

Re letlelelwa go tsenya letsogo thata go bona gore re ikgakolola jang, re tsena go le kae go fetola bothata jo bo lebegang bo ka re apesa kopo ka letshoba.
Re ntse re bua ka letlhoko la madi, ditlhabololo tsa ditsela gore ga go na ditsela, re bua ka mo gotlhe mo, fa re setse re re Puso e tseye boikarabelo jwa go tlhokomela leruo le le mo dikwarantining… MR SALESHANDO: Ke kopa tlhaloso Honourable Brooks.

Kgantele o ne o re go ka diriwa thulaganyo e e tshwanang le e e kileng ya diriwa kwa Lobatse BMC ba fiwa loans, ba thusiwa.

Madi ao o akanya gore a tlaabo a tsewa kae?


A a tlaabo a sa tswe mo Pusong e o reng gompieno go ganwe mogopolo o ka gore ga go na madi?

MR BROOKS: Tanki my brother.

Thulaganyo e, a farmer o ne a e dira le BMC.

Thulaganyo e ke buang ka yone ke re re tlaabo re dira ya Maun BMC, re ka dira gore re thusa jang farmers ka tsela e e ntseng jalo.

Thank you sir.

Thank you Mr Speaker.

MR MOTSAMAI (GHANZI SOUTH): Tanki Mr Speaker.


Ke simolole fela ka go supa gore mogopolo o, o montle, o tlhapile bogolo jang re lebile seemo sa baitsaanape le batlhotlhomisi ba lefatshe fa ba supa lehuma ka fa le apereng ka teng dikgaolo ka go farologana.

Dikgaolo tsa Ngamiland, Kweneng, Ghanzi di umakega mo lehumeng la nta ya tlhogo.

Lehuma la nta ya tlhogo le lwantshiwa ka ditsela tse di farologanyeng.

E bile le tsena batho ka ditsela tse di farologanyeng.
33 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion Tsamaiso mo lelwapeng le mo go Goromente e ka go tshela lehuma.

Dikakanyo di ka go tsenya lehuma ka fa o akanyang dilo ka teng.

gore ba reketswe dikgomo.

Dilo tse kana go ntshiwa mo mading a batho ba ba reng ba iketsha kwa morago Mr Speaker.
Mr Speaker, ka fa go tsamayang ka teng kwa Ngamiland, kana kwa North West, ga se gore barui ga ba iteke, barui ba a iteka.

Mpolelele gore badisa ba ba disang dikgomo tsa batho ba North West ba duelwa ke mang?

Dijo tsa dikgomo tsa barui ba North West di rekwa ke mang mo madirelong?

Mekento e rekwa ke mang?

So, in other words, ke leka go supa gore the farmers gantsi ba a bo ba ikitshitse kwa morago, ba ikagela masaka, ba ituelela badisa, ba duela batho ba ba agang masaka a mofuta oo le matlo jalojalo.
Sa rona re le Goromente ke go oketsa dituelo tsa badisa fela re sa itse gore the farmers ba tsaya kae madi.

So, mogopolo o, o mo go reng a e re le fa go okediwa dituelo tsa badisa e bo e le gore le tsone the farmers fela by nature di eme sentle, di ka itepatepanya le seemo sa go duela badisa Mr Speaker.
Fa re tlhoafetse Mr Speaker, ka mogopolo o, re le lefatshe re sala mafoko a ga Tautona morago le Cabinet ya gagwe gore lefatshe le tshwanetse gore le ijese, batho ba lefatshe le ba tshwanetse to be empowered.

Ke nngwe ya ditsela tsa gore re ka thusa batho gore ba ntshe dijo tse di lekanyeng go jesa lefatshe.

E seng go ba kgobotla le go ba tshega gore ba tshwanetse gore ba bone maano a gore ba ya go bona kae kana jang ka fa ba ka itshetsang ka teng Mr Speaker.
Mr Speaker, kana ba bangwe fa gongwe fare bua ka to quarantine, ga ba itse gore to quarantine kgomo go tewa eng.

To quarantine kgomo go tewa e le gore kgomo e foo 100 per cent, botshelo jwa yone bo mo lesakeng, mme fa bo le mo lesakeng, ke mathata a mong wa kgomo.

Mr Speaker, bothata jo bo diragalelang kgomo ka nako e o ke bothata jo bo mo lebanyeng motho yoo.

So, se mogopolo o lekang go se bua ke gore imololang batho.
Maikaelelo le maikemisetso a mebuso e e tlhoafetseng ke gore fa o re ntlhopheng kana nneela setilo, ke go ya go dira gore go kokonelwa ga batho ke botshelo, go nne motlhofo go ikapola kobo ya kokonelo ya botshelo, e seng gore o ye go dira gore go nne thata go ya kwa pele.

Mr Speaker, re letse re bua ka koketsego ya leokwane, oil, dijo le taxes tse di farologanyeng maabane.

Dilo tse di kokonela batho ba Ngamiland le go feta ka gore di fitlhela e le bahumanegi ba ba leng mo mpaananeng.
Mr Speaker, re letse re bua ka dikgang tsa gore… go na le lekgetho le lengwe le le kgethisiwang the farmers Mr Speaker, mathata a mangwe ke one a a builweng ke Mapalamente Kekgonegile.

Kgaolo ya Ngamiland e na le seemo se se utlwisang botlhoko sa yone fela.

E na le ntsi ya lethobo, kgang ya Foot and Mouth le kgofa e e bolayang ya beMobile Mr Speaker.

Dilo tse ga se tse di fitlhelwang mo mafelong a mangwe.
Ke tsone tse di irang gore re lele le batho ba Ngamiland, re ipotse gore gatwe batho ba kgaolo e ya Bokone Bophirima tota ba sentse eng?

Fa re le Goromente o o tlhoafetseng, re batla go ema le bone gore le bone ba bone gore re batla go ba ntsha kwa morago, re tshwanetse ra dira sone se Mr Speaker, ba thusiwa mo masakeng ka dijo le gore dikgomo di tlamelwe.
Le fa ba sa direlwe jalo mme gongwe go nne le tsamaiso nngwe ya gore ba ka ya go bona madi kae ka e bile ke le Motsamai ke le fa, ke tlhola ke bua gore kana go tshwanetse ga nna le banka fela e e itebagantseng le temo-thuo.

Bo CEDA fa o ya kwa go bone o ya go ikuela o re ke tsenya dikgomo mo quarantine gore di ye go rekwa, o ya go batliwa dilo tse dintsintsi tse di felelang madi a project eo a feta dikgomo tse di mo lesakeng.
So, ke dikgang tse re tshwanetseng ra di tsaya ra ba ra di isa kwa tlhogong, re batla gore re ntshe morui kwa morago mme re sa tseye morui wa North West fela.

Kana go isa kgomo kwa thekisong o a bo o raya gore o itepatepanye le mathata a a leng teng mo lefatsheng la Botswana go balelwa mathata a dintsho le a manyalo lefatshe ka bophara Mr Speaker.

Re e leba jaaka, re se ka ra leba fela gore ba batla gore ba direlwe.
Mr Speaker, go builwe ka dikgang tsa gore batho ba North West ba diretswe di mmaraka kae le kae mme nama ya bone e ntse e le ya Foot and Mouth.

Dilo tseo ga di bereka mo bathong ba North West.

Ipotse gore fa lehuma la batho ba le sa fetoge le la baruakgomo mme dilo tseo go ntse gotwe di teng, ba tshela jang, di na le effect e e kana ka eng mo go bone?

Mebaraka eo ga e bereke, go tsaya lebaka le le leele.

A ga o itse gore gore o ise kwa mebarakeng eo ke gore o quarantine?
A ga o itse gore o ise teng ke gore o bo o duetse transport?

Ke dikgang tse e leng gore di kganetswe ke tse dingwe.

MR RAMOGAPI: On a point of elucidation.

Ke a leboga Mr Speaker.

O e tshwere sentle Motlotlegi Motsamai.

Kana kgaolo e ya Ngami rra Batswana … 34 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion MR SPEAKER: Honourable Ramogapi hang on, there is an issue of procedure.
OF MINISTER ASSISTANT YOUTH EMPOWERMENT, SPORT AND CULTURE DEVELOPMENT (MR BILLY): Ke a leboga Mr Speaker.

Ke ne ke re fa re ntse re tsweletse jalo, o se ka wa lebala gore o ne o mpiditse Mr Speaker.

Ke tshwanetse gore gongwe ke nne yo o latelang.

Ke a leboga.

MR SPEAKER: You disappeared.

MR BILLY: I did not sir.

MR SPEAKER: You disappeared from the screens.

MR BILLY: Ke ne ke sa appear on the screen?

I do not know what happened but ke ne ke ntse ke le teng nako e yotlhe sir.
MR SPEAKER: Ka ba ka botsa gore what has happened to Honourable Billy?

MR MOTSAMAI: Ke tsaya gore 10 minutes wa me o eme fela.

SPEAKER: …(Laughter!

)… Honourable MR Motsamai, o ithaya o re o ne o o ja mo nakong ya ga mang all this time?

Order!

Order!

Honourable Members.

It is now 12:30 p.m. May I call upon the Leader of the House, His Honour the Vice President, to move a Motion of Adjournment.

MOTION ADJOURNMENT LEADER OF THE HOUSE (MR TSOGWANE): Tanki Mr Speaker.
Ba mo utlwile Motlotlegi Motsamai gore o ne a tshameka fela ka nako, 10 minutes o eme fela, mole o ne a tshameka fela ka nako.

Mme ka go rialo Mr Speaker, ke tlaa kopa batlotlegi gore Ntlo e ye bokhutlong.

Question put and agreed to.
The Assembly accordingly adjourned at 12:30 p.m. until Monday 28th February, 2022 at 2:00 p.m. 35 Hansard No 205Friday 25th February, 2022GOVERNMENT TO CONSIDER SUPPLEMENTING NORTH WEST DISTRICT CATTLE FARMERS WHO SELL THEIR CATTLE TO BOTSWANA MEAT COMMISSION (BMC)Motion HANSARD RECORDERS Mr T. Gaodumelwe, Mr T. Monakwe, Ms T. Kebonang HANSARD REPORTERS Mr M. Buti, Ms Z. Molemi, Mr J. Samunzala, Ms N. Selebogo, Ms A. Ramadi, Ms D. Thibedi, Ms G. Baotsi HANSARD EDITORS Ms K. Nyanga, Ms C. Chonga, Mr K. Goeme, Ms G. Phatedi, Ms B. Malokwane, Mr A. Mokopakgosi, Ms O. Nkatswe, Ms G. Lekopanye, Ms T. Mokhure, Ms B. Ratshipa LAYOUT DESIGNERS Mr B.
B. Khumanego, Mr D. T. Batshegi, Mr K. Rebaisakae 36 Hansard No 205