Source document: https://docs-lawep.s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/1698054565282.pdf (Papua New Guinea)
FOURTH DAY ________________________________ Friday 13 January 2023 DRAFT HANSARD _______________________________ Subject: Page No: MISREPORTING BY THE POST COURIER – STATEMENT BY THE SPEAKER ..... 2 ANSWERS TO PREVIOUS QUESTIONS ........................................................................... 2 QUESTIONS ............................................................................................................................ 4 Inclusion of Council Presidents Within Provincial Assemblies ............................................. 5 Duplication of Roles Within the District ................................................................................ 6 Mining and Goilala Open ....................................................................................................... 6 Land Incorporation Amendment Act ................................................................................... 10 Origin Oil – PDL-10 Gas Project ......................................................................................... 11 Water Supply to Rural Areas ............................................................................................... 13 Benefits under UBSA or LBSA ........................................................................................... 16 Law and Order ...................................................................................................................... 17 MOTION BY LEAVE ........................................................................................................... 19 LEAVE OF ABSENCE ......................................................................................................... 19 ANSWERS TO PREVIOUS QUESTION ........................................................................... 20 GRIEVANCE DEBATE ........................................................................................................ 23 ADJOURNMENT .................................................................................................................. 40 FOURTH DAY Friday 13 January 2022 The Speaker (Mr Job Pomat) took the Chair at 11.00 a.m. and invited the Minister for Higher Education, Research, Science and Technology and the Member for Kandep, Honourable Don Polye to say Prayers; “God of the universe, God of the multi verse, God of love, God of peace, God of happiness, God of uprightness, God of righteousness and perfection.
God we stand before you and we’re happy because God you created us perfect as yourself.

We were fearfully and wonderfully created by the divine hand of the creator.

You created us not to have rooms for what is negative, what is bad, what is unrighteous or what is imperfect.

You all created us all good and perfect.


In us we have all the rooms to do good decisions, perfect decisions, upright decisions for our people that we can lead transparently and we can make sound decisions, that we can make visionary decisions.

That we can make decisions with love and care for our people.

Because Lord you are love and care, God you are a lovely God and we are lovely people that you have appointed to these positions, that we can serve our people.

And God I pray that is what we are.


In this year and the next five years to come and into the future, we see positivity.

We see no more killing, no more economic crisis, no more cash flow issues, no more mismanagement and abuse of offices.

We see good leadership by both the Government and Opposition and by the Public Servants, and by those in authority we pray and we see the future of Papua New Guinea good and perfect because God you are with us.
God you are here with the people created by God, pure and good.

God we’re you fearfully and wonderfully created.

I am seeing God that you are with us.

I’m seeing this country of Papua New Guinea a paradise that you have given us.

This is the country we love so dearly and the people you died.

We love them as leaders and we will lead them.


God we are sure that the wisdom is with is, understanding is with us and love, happiness, joy and understanding is with this Parliament, the Prime Minister, the leader of the Opposition, the Deputy Prime Minister, us ministers and members of Parliament.

The opposition members, the public servants, all of us, we see and the people Papua New Guinea.

We have love and are positive in our minds.


We are positive, what you create within us with a conviction is what we will see without and what we believe in ourselves.

This nation that you have given us, we cannot let it go down to the deterioration of negativity and problems.

God we believe this nation will see positive in the many years to come.

We pray say this in the name of Jesus Christ, Amen.
1 MISREPORTING BY THE POST COURIER – STATEMENT BY THE SPEAKER Mr SPEAKER – Honourable members, the Chair would like to make a statement before we go to the business of the day.

This is regarding to the event that happened yesterday and what has been reported on the front page of today’s Post Courier.

We all make mistakes, and I believe that Post Courier made a mistake yesterday and reported on today’s front page of the Post Courier stating that ‘Parlt sweats’.
02/04 Honourable Members it is alarming to note the Post Courier’s front Page headline of Parliament was hot and sweaty yesterday during the historic visit by the Australian Prime Minister.

Yesterday, I presided on this Chair and I wasn't physically sweating nor was I emotionally sweating, yes we all understand we have power issue with the PNG Power but we were assured yesterday that there will be no power disruptions for yesterday's occasion.
I must inform the public that Parliament was not operating on its genset when the Parliament was in Session but we were operating on the main power produced by PNG Power.

I believe Post Courier misreported that Parliament was hot and sweaty during yesterday's occasion.

I would like to ask which journalism school do those journalists attend because there should be investigative journalism involved.

There needs to be two sides of the story before you publish anything publicly.
We should not read about one-sided stories.

I will reserve my grievances as a leader.

Our dailies should be responsible in reporting facts.

ANSWERS TO PREVIOUS QUESTIONS Mr JIMMY UGURO – Thank you, Mr Speaker for giving me the opportunity to respond to the questions by the Honourable Member for Pomio.

Mr Peter O'Neill – Point of Order!

Mr Speaker, I am not trying to disturb the Minister from answering the questions but the Minister was abruptly stopped while answering the questions.
He is a mandated Leader of this honourable House, his people and his electorate.

2 The Chair needs to apologise to the Minister because without excusing him he was stopped from answering the questions despite the fact that an important visitor visited our Chambers he still should be accorded courtesy.

The Chair owes him an apology before he answers the questions.

Mr SPEAKER – Thank you honourable Member for Ialibu-Pangia for your point of order.
It is in the Standing Orders that the Chair can interrupt the Parliament anytime where it deems necessary.

On your concern for the Chair to apologise, I have shown him courtesy by allowing him to continue today to answer yesterday's questions.
I further apologise to the Minister, for interrupting you whilst you were responding to important questions but that was the advice I got from the Clerk telling me, according to the program when the Australian Prime Minister arrives you will have to interrupt Parliament and go ahead with the program.

Mr Minister, I apologise to you and I have given you the Floor for you to make those important responses for the benefit of our people and this House.
Mr JIMMY UGURO – Mr Speaker, 1 thank the Member for Pangia-lalibu for intervening to raise the issue to apologise and I sincerely accept the Chair’s apology.

Let me continue with my responses where the Member for Pomio was asking about the behavioural management policy for the department and secondly; 03/04 Firstly, Behavioral Management Policy, Boys Scout Policy and the Management Plan was launched by the Governor-General in one of the schools in the National Capital District.
We are now encouraging all the schools to utilize this policy to educate our children throughout the school on the behaviors, values, and the types of attitudes that we face throughout the schools and societies.

So, Education Department is working very hard to get those things done off the ground with the assistance from our Guidance Officers in the provinces, board of management, teachers and parents.
I said yesterday that it is the stakeholder’s responsibility to ensure that the behaviors of our children in the school system are educated, trained, and guided well throughout the education system.

So, we produce the kids and enroll them in the schools, we expect the teachers and school board to manage the issues that we all face.
But allow me to zoom it down; if the child is 3 causing social problems, the first question they asked is; where did he come from, which province, which district, and even which country and zoom it down to parents.

If we go down to the village and district, they said they come from which parents.

So, the small dot starts from the parents.

So, parents are responsible for bringing up a child well, we will not have any issues affecting our society.
The society creates and train our children very much in their attitude towards learning and behaving in the community.

Number two question; if the schools are registered under the Lands Department.

My answer is no, as we understand that all the schools are community-oriented programs.

All the communities own the schools and the Education Department only establishes the schools.

The lands are own by the churches and the government where they allow the schools to be established.
In our customary land, in the community they agreed on the certain location of the land; they liaise with the land-owners in the central location, they agreed and they established the school.

We have no records of registering any land of the education institutions throughout the country, but the message received was good.
In the future it’s a big job, but we don’t create room for economic activity or commercializing the land for education purposes, because it is a community-oriented project and community have agreed to and they have given the land with no cost or low cost.

So, that’s the issue that we have but we can take it on from there with the Lands officers and if we have to register that land as per the community agreement, we can do that and State can own the land.
But at the moment in the mindset of our community, they already know where the schools are; is the State land, as well as the health facilities.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr LUTHER WENGE – Mr Speaker, I rise to seek leave of the Chair and to ask you a question because the Chair has the power for the question I will be asking.

Mr SPEAKER – Leave granted, you may ask the question.

QUESTIONS Mr LUTHER WENGE – Thank you, Mr Speaker.

I will speak in Pidgin to direct my questions to the Chair.
4 Mr Speaker, Section 10 of the Constitution the law on Provincial and Local-Level Government Council stipulate who will be in the provincial government.

04/04 Section 10, clearly outlines who should be in the Provincial Government.

It clearly states who is authorized to be in the Provincial Government, from governor, the Members of Parliament to the chiefs and the councilor.

The Morobe Provincial Government has referred this matter to Court when the amendment was done by then Member for Ialibu.
This amendment removed the LLG presidents from the Provincial Government authority.

According to the Supreme Court, this amendment is not right under the section 187 of the Constitution.

Mr Speaker, from that ruling, it does not mean that the Council President is automatically going into the provincial assembly.

The amendment was made under the Organic Law on Provincial and Local Level Government.

The government will implement this amendment and it goes back to the province and the LLG.
The Supreme Court has the power to rule whether the law is unconstitutional or not.

The ruling to not include the council presidents is unconstitutional.

The onus is now on the Government to bring it to the National Parliament to propose a bill to bring the council presidents back into the province as it is a recommendation of the Supreme Court.

The Government to date has not acted upon the Supreme Court’s decision.

I believe the LLG presidents are illegally sitting in the Provincial Assemblies.
I am asking the Chair, as the Speaker, you have the authority under the Constitution to refer this matter to the Supreme Court to clarify.

Inclusion of Council Presidents Within Provincial Assemblies Mr Speaker (1) Are you going to refer this matter to the Supreme Court to have this clarification done?

Under the Organic Law, there is a mention of District Planning and Budget Priority Committee, which will automatically have the members of Parliament and the governor and the council presidents as members.
Now we have the District Planning Budget Priority Act which gives authority for the Member of Parliament and another chosen to be included in this committee.

I see that the DDA has replace the District Planning and Budget Priority and in my view, it is unconstitutional.

As the District Planning Budget Priority stems from the Organic Law which is higher than the DDA.

It is similar to the District Authority that has been created in Lae.
This is not to 5 upset my good Member, I am only making a reference to the law.

We are replacing or having two groups of people doing the same work.

Duplication of Roles Within the District This a constitutional issue, therefore, I am asking the Speaker to refer this issue to the Supreme Court to give us a clear opinion on this matter.
05/04 Mr Speaker, I humbly ask you to refer this constitutional matter to the Supreme Court for a clear interpretation and opinion so that all the Governors and Open Members will be clear on that law.

Mr Speaker, can you seek legal advice from your legal officers to file for interpretation on this issue at the Supreme Court?

Mr SPEAKER – I thank the Governor for your question to the Chair.
I believe the Minister for Provincial Affairs and Local-Level Government and relevant Ministers like the Justice and Attorney General are present and taken note.

This question requires a legal opinion, therefore, I will take this question onboard and will direct the Parliament learned officers with the Clerk to prepare a response on paper so I can respond accordingly to your questions.
Mining and Goilala Open Mr CASMIRO AIA – Mr Speaker, thank you for recognising the people of Goilala to express our concerns on this Floor.

My questions are directed to the Minister for Petroleum and Energy and I ask that the Mining Minister take note.
Mr Speaker, in recent times there have been activities along the border of Gulf and Central Provinces specifically Ward 6 of the Goari LLG in the Goilala District ExxonMobil Antelope limited EFB 21, line 1, 2 ,3, 4, 5, and 6 Mr Speaker, the laws of extracting industries are made in such a way that we as Open Members are not at the dining table to discuss the progress and initiation of extracting programs including gas, oil and mining.
It is amusing that the Goilala Member is not part of all the progress activities that are happening in the backyard of my district.

(1) Can the Minister confirm or deny that such activities are taking place?

(2) Can the Minister confirm that Antelope 4,5, and 6 are in Gulf Province or is it in Goilala?
(3) Can the Minister for Mining and Minister for Petroleum present an amendment to 6 the Extracting Industries Act so that it can allow the presence of Open Members to participate in such important programs on their own land to be included in discussions from the commencement of the projects?

This is so that our people can have a fair share of benefits in terms of equity and other arrangements through the activities that are taking place.
06/04 If there is any discussion of progression or to initiate projects of such magnitude or degree in any particular district of province, there should be a roundtable discussion involving.

Open members.

Mr Speaker, in this House, we do not represent ourselves, we represent a group of people.

In my case, I represent a group of people called the Goilala people.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr SPEAKER – Honourable Member, can you withdraw the term ‘dining table’ to mean round table?
Mr CASMIRO AIA – Thank you, Mr Speaker, I withdraw.

Mr SPEAKER – Honourable Member before the Minister answers your concerns can you explain what you mean by the term ‘dining table’?

Your question is captured in the Hansard and we have our whole nation listening to you.

Mr CASMIRO AIA – What I mean by ‘dining table’ is our job is to verify the clans and also to find out, who the members of the clans are.
After that is concluded, I will sign the verification on the advice of my team who will be conducting the verification studies.

The team will make recommendations to my department team, where they will agree upon before I shall sign it.

I will only sign on advice.

Once I sign, they will put it on National Gazette and that will authorize who is the landowner.

In Papua New Guinea because of land tenure system it is difficult to identify the landowners.
It is also difficult to identify provinces involved, so these things have to come to careful study.

In one of my experiences I would like to share is, this is a very sensitive issue and no matter what the project company says in its own studies and no matter what my department say in their subsequent verification studies, there is always contest.

Some of these contests can last 7 many years, so it is not a very easy landscape.
We do our very best to make sure that we include people as widely as possible so that we reduce the friction, so that the project can go ahead and all of us can benefit from it.

So the issue in itself, as the Governor of Oro has pointed out, is a very sensitive issue and we are very much aware of that.
We will do everything to make sure that those who qualify as landowners and qualify as the provinces hosting the project, et cetera will be carefully and scientifically identified and then determinations will be made for gazettal and we will move forward.

Once I publish the gazettal, everyone in the project footprint area, whether it is in the Gulf province, Eastern Highlands province, Chimbu, Western Highlands or Central province they will know very shortly once the study is completed.
I would be misleading the people and cause inconveniences if I say something without completing the process in the future so we need to await the completion of this process.

When the final thing is ready then we will move to the development forum.

Development forum is the time when the provinces, districts and landowners who are qualified to be in the gazettal determination will meet with the National Government on a round table to consider the benefits that the project will bring forth.
The matter is in progress and I want to assure everyone that once the process is been completed, who is supposed to be going to the court will do so and who is supposed to go to development forum will come to the development forum and we will have all the support to move the project forward.

Before I sit down, at this stage to answer the question from the Member for Goilala, I do not know, as we know in principle the project is now at Gulf province.
Neighboring provinces like Central that include Goilala, Eastern Highlands, Chimbu even Western Highlands or Southern Highlands, I am not sure, but if they are included we have to wait and see the final conclusions of the studies.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr KERENGA KUA – Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Both the Mining Act and the Oil and Gas Act have very good procedures for us to follow in conducting mining and petroleum activities in Papua New Guinea.
So, far, I thought that all these procedures are good and have space and time for all the stakeholders to involve at the right time in the right place.

So, I have a confidence in our existing procedures.

Regarding whether they will be on a ‘dining table’ and then later to a roundtable, it has its own time.

8 First of all, the operating companies must do a clan vetting.

In this case, the TOTAL Energies in PRL15 Antelope Gas project.
The TOTAL Energy has done the clan vetting and I think, in October last year, they gave it to the Department of Petroleum and Energy.

Mr Garry Juffa – Point of Order!


I just want to correct some of the Minister’s thoughts in regards to the procedures and processes that are undertaken by the mining and petroleum industry or the departments, but specifically, I would say the departments because the fact of the matter is that in many instances, they don’t consult either the provincial government or the local level governments.

They don’t even consult the genuine landowners in many instances.
They get their landowners from Port Moresby or somewhere else and suddenly they turn up and hold a so- called community hearing and often times, we found out too late and realise that the people involved are not the right landowners in many instances.

So, please, I just want to correct the good Minister that there are serious flaws in these two departments because what he thinks is happening is not actually happening in many instances.
This is how I experienced in Northern Province so I just want to highlight this here.

This is good for us because we can go and correct these anomalies that exists in these two departments; mining and petroleum.

Thank you.

Mr SPEAKER – Honourable Minister!

Please continue!

Mr KERENGA KUA – Thank you, Mr Speaker.

The key point is, like I’ve said, there’s time and space for relevant stakeholders to engage at the right time and at the right place.

So, the processes and steps are there.


In the case of mining, I will leave it to the Mining Minister but for petroleum, first clan vetting will be done by the operating company and in this case, the TOTAL Energy has done it and gave it to the department.

Under the law, the department must go and verify the preliminary studies of the operating companies.

So, to do this, we need experts with educational qualification and work experience in this job because it is one of the very important issues.
This is to make sure that the correct provinces, districts, LLGs, clans, and members of the clans are identified so that they can participate.

9 So, my department has advertised to engage an expert last year to do the verification study and we are at that point and I think, they have made the decision and early this year we will start the verification project at the Papua LNG project in Antelope area.

Now, project benefits will go to the landowners of the blocks.
The blocks have their boundaries and coordinates so the benefits will go to them.

To do this, phase one to identify the clans has been done by TOTAL and the second phase will be conducted by my department.

07/04 Mr SPEAKER – Honourable Member, we have a supplementary.

Honourable member for Kairiku you may give your supplementary.

Mr PETER ISOAIMO – Mr Speaker, my supplementary is for the same minister but the question is a bit different.
Mr SPEAKER – Honourable Member, I will not allow you to take advantage of supplementary, you should ask the Minister a new question.

I will not allow you now because I would like to give this time to the Member for Chuave.

Land Incorporation Amendment Act Mr JAMES NOMANE- Thank you, Mr Speaker, for recognizing the people of Chuave.

My question without notice goes to the good Deputy Prime Minister and Minister for Lands.
Just quickly, with respect to the land ownership in the country, we understand, Mr Speaker, that the state owns a mega 3 to 4 per cent and the bulk of the land is owned by the customary landowners.
08/04 The land tenure system continues to be a major impediment to investment and just quickly, for clarity, as we push for development in Chuave with our customary landowners, if the Minister for Lands and Deputy Prime Minister can confirm whether we will continue to be using the Land Incorporation Amendment Act 2009, otherwise known as the ILG Act, or whether we will be repealing this Act and replacing it with something else?

Thank you, Mr Speaker.


10 Mr JOHN ROSSO – Thank you for the important question from the good Member for Chuave.

Yes the ILG Act is what we’ve been using, which is a pretty good one, but it has come with some consequences.

It has been grossly abused by a lot of people, especially our intellectual ones in our rural communities and some of them have used people to register ILGs and have taken ownership of that land off our people from the villages who are left with no ownership rights.
So currently, Lands Department under my tenure-ship is looking at amending it to find a more suitable option so that it can be able to ensure that our land is not misused by educated people who have wrong motives and such.

So we are looking at amending it so that we can find a better way to address this landownership in our country.

Origin Oil – PDL-10 Gas Project Mr JAMES DONALD – Thank you, Mr Speaker.

I would like to direct my questions to Minister for Petroleum.
Just a bit of background – my district hosts a number of reserves such as P’nyang, Stanley, Douglas and Pukpuk among other small reserves.

My question is specifically for PDL-10 of the Stanley Gas Project.

The previous Minister, Nixon Duban, in 2015, issued a license for this particular project during which time I was a council president and participated in celebrations and hosting of this achievement.
The original licensee, Origin Oil holds a development license; which means you are now given an OK to go and develop after you have met all the requirements.

So in 2020, the licensee, Origin Oil, sold this license to Arran Energy.

Arran Energy held this license for about two years and just recently, this license was sold to Trans Wonderland.

This might’ve occurred last year.


My questions are: (1) To my understanding, if a licensee is given a license to develop, why would they hold onto the license without conducting any developments?

(2) Does this break the laws of this country?

(3) What will the Government do, through the ministry, to address this situation?

Do we have to penalise licensees; the people who constantly buy and sell licenses continuously?

What do we do?
What do we do?

(4) Can the Minister confirm or deny if the recent changes from Arran Energy to Trans Wonderland has taken place and if he is aware, can he explain to the people of the project area?

11 09/04 Why would we constantly break laws of this country, constantly buying and selling the license?

It is one of thing that shouldn’t be happening in this country.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr KERENGA KUA – I thank the Member for North Fly for raising these very important questions.
Mr Speaker, this PDL 10 is one of the problem licenses right from the beginning.

When this PDL license was issued, at the same time, the gas agreement was also signed.

What it means is that, you have to move to the final investment decision within 12 months and after that move into construction.

Since they signed this agreement approximately 10 years ago, there has been no movement.
We tried to manage this as best as we can and up to now there has been no compliance with the terms and conditions of the gas agreement that has been signed.

There’s been no compliance with the PDL that has been given.

Development license means you must develop it but that didn’t happen.

So, when I became the Minister for Petroleum in 2019, there was an intention to sell it to the incoming company.

They call it Arran Energy.


At that point in time they had given me assurance that they will move on with the terms and conditions of the gas agreement with the license conditions.

We have agreed to give them the opportunity to give it a go and the sale has been concluded from the hands of Repsol, an European company, into Arran Energy.

It has been with Arran Energy for almost four years now.

But, they have problem with the commercial model, they have put it into the gas agreement is unworkable.
Whether to install pipeline down to the coast is the different cost and supplying gas to Ok Tedi is different cost as well but their negotiation with the Ok Tedi has collapsed.

So, their business model has collapsed and they cannot able to implement the gas agreement.

So, it’s sitting there.

Recently, I heard that they are trying to sell it out to another company like what the Member has pointed out.
We are not aware of this because there is no provision within the Oil and Gas Act similar to the Land Act where Minister will approve the sale.

For the transaction the Minister for Lands has the power to approve the sale of interest in the land.

But for Oil and Gas Act, we don’t have similar provision so, transaction can take place outside whilst Minister 12 and the Department will not be aware when giving the notice after sale is completed.

That’s the first time we will be aware.


So, we became aware that there was a further same transaction from Arran Energy into another third party recently.

Two days ago, my secretary department wrote to Arran and said, ‘can you confirm or deny this particular transaction and if it takes place please provide all the documentations underpinning the transaction.

So, we as a department will understand’.


However, one thing we have pointed out as a department is that, we maintain our position that all the positions we have taken in relation to any violations of the Gas Agreement that was signed in 2015 with violation of any terms and conditions of PDL 10 license.

We reserve our rights on all those violations and we will take the appropriate statutory and administrative action that we as a department are entitled to.

So, we will not waver from that position.


That position remains; the sale of business interest they can do it outside, but management for the license condition and Gas Agreement is within the authority of the Petroleum Department and we will continue to have that properly investigated and assemble all the necessary information.

10/04 My final point, is that there’s an application for a variation of the license conditions and it is already at the Petroleum Advisory Board report.

I’m advised.
I’m advised.

I will not make a decision for the Petroleum Advisory Board, they are an independent Statutory of Authority, they will make the decisions in due cause whether or not they will approve the terms of that application for a variation to the existing license, that’s the current state of play.

But the department reserves all its rights on any previous violation of the gas agreement and PD licence that we have granted.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

When I have confirmation, I will advise the member.
Water Supply to Rural Areas Sir PUKA TEMU – Thank you, Honourable Speaker for allowing me to ask a question without notice to the Honourable Minister for State and Enterprise.

Yesterday, I asked a question regarding provision of electricity to the rural masses to the off-grid mechanism.

The question is in relation to the rural masses with regards to water security.

13 Currently, Honourable Speaker as you and I know, Water PNG is focus on profit base water services mainly providing services to cities.
So, when we ask for Water PNG to come to the district level, they say that is not profitable and so we have to look for funds through DSIP and et cetera, and so water services are delayed at the district level.

But when you go down to the village level, village people find it hard.

And given the climate changes and the recent dry spell I think before Christmas which affected New Guinea Islands, the mainland and people were really looking for sources of water particularly our rural masses.
And therefore, Mr Speaker, I for one believe that as a nation we have not yet organized ourselves well with regards to water security for our rural masses.

And like many developments that have been taking place we focus on the urban cities for water, power and communication, et cetera because its easy to do those things.
One classic example, Mr Speaker, is just not far from here is a settlement called Gereka and the end of the water pipe is just a few kilometres from there and Water PNG can connect them and make a lot of money that also includes the Taurama Valley.

But nothing has been done and imagine the suffering of the rural masses, the Enterprises given that we have not really focus on rural water services in our country.
In the old days through outside funding, the Department of Health in the little college in Madang was creating rural water systems but due to lack of funding through European Union and other bilateral and multilaterals that program collapsed.

Mr Speaker, I strongly believe that there is a greater need right now given the climate changes and the EL Niño conditions that come and go, I think our rural masses have a problem with water security.
Can I recommend to the Honourable Minister to look at a proposal for establishing whether in the existing Water PNG a rural component for water services to the rural masses or my strong recommendation would be to establish a rural water services commission so that the entity can specifically look at the non-profit making components of water services to our country.

11/04 Mr WILLIAM DUMA – Thank you, Mr Speaker.

I’d like to thank the Member for Abau for this very important question.
Mr Speaker, about 2 or 3 years ago, there was a program initiated by both the World Bank and partly by the United Nations called the WASH Program.

The idea was to extend the provision of water supplies from the main centres to the rural areas and even from sources 14 located within each affected villages to provide clean and safe drinking water to the affected communities.

So, in my electorate, we were also able to put aside some funds to qualify for this WASH Program.
So, I am aware that there was a program and it is now up to all of us Members to seek advice from the Department of National Planning to see whether that program is still continuing or not.

If not, as a government we can ask the World Bank to help fund so that we can provide the counterpart funding to try and extend this important service to our villages.
When we look at the history of the Water Board, the main function we all know is to provide water to the urban areas initially and now it is call Water PNG.

Now, with the increase of settlements in the urban areas, the need for water is becoming more and Water PNG is aware of it.
If you look at the case of the National Capital District, in my capacity as Minister responsible, directed Water PNG to look at extending water services to the so-called End of the World for instance, in Taurama valley and right past the Motukea Island then further down to where the rural and Local Level Government Chamber is and then further to the other side.

The idea is to connect the water all the way down there.
So, there is an ongoing processes and technical studies are currently being done by Water PNG to extend the water services along that side.

I see that there is a growth corridor for expanding the city in that side.

Mr Speaker, if you go past the LNG site and drive to that village, you will see a water instillation where water has been extracted by Water PNG and supplied to the villages there.
It is a good pilot project and it is working and the idea is that through the LNG, they pay partly for the service and the bulk of the maintenance is done by the Water PNG.

So, there is already a pilot project which is working very well in that part of the Central Province.

So, it is something that we all need to look at.

I will urge all of us Members to seriously look at making a joint approach through the department of National Planning for the World Bank to help fund this WASH Program.
We can set up in another entity to exclusively look at providing water services to our rural areas and let Water PNG continue to provide services as a commercial entity or a combination of both.

So, all these options are available and we can look at them, but I am ready to work with the Members to make sure that our people in the rural areas have access to safe clean drinking water.
Mr Speaker, to answer the question, yes, Water PNG will do its part by trying to provide water to the areas which are near the urban centres of Port Moresby and other urban centres right throughout the country.

15 If we take the example of the existing facility on the other side of the LNG plant site is, it has demonstrated that it can work.
So, provide our village and community leaders to work together with Water PNG so that we can expand the system that is already operating very well to the other parts of the country.

Thank you.

Benefits under UBSA or LBSA Mr PETER ISOAIMO – Thank you, Mr Speaker.

My question is directed to the good Minister for Petroleum and Energy.

I have three LLGs in my district namely; Mekio, Kuni and Kairuku.
My presidents of the three LLGs and the people of the coast of Kairuku and Kikori- Mauri in the boarder of Gulf to Isuototo, which boarders Manomano which is Hiri-Koiari, wants to know whether they are in the pipeline benefits under the UBSA and LBSA agreements or not?

12/04 And the people of Kairuku LLG from Kivori and Meauri in the border of Gulf and Hisiu and Toutu which borders Manumanu in Hiri-Koiari.
They want to know whether they are in the pipeline benefits underneath the UBSA and LBSA agreement or not, because for so many years they have been fighting and people have been lying and collecting money from people.

Now they have put a lot of pressure on me through their president.

We all know that members are not recognized under Section 98 of the Organic Law of the Provincial and Local Level Government.

But the problem already exists within the people.


and I would like the Minister to make it clear to the people of Kairuku coastline and LLG if they are entitled to the Pipeline benefits or not.

Thank you Mr KERENGA KUA – Thank you Speaker.

That’s a project from sometime back and has been in operation for a while now.

The Landowner Determination was signed by the then Minister and gazzetted.

Therefore, my work now is to locate the gazettal and give it to the Member and he can work from there.
so I will requisition a copy of that gazettal and give it to him and he can identify those people or clans of the pipeline corridor of his district.

From this he can check whether these people are on the listing or not.

But my understanding is that this determination was done a long time ago and those who are entitled to collect have already collected.

There are no delayed payments.

16 So as far as royalty payments are concerned, it is up-to-date, there are no outstanding.
So if the people from the Member’s district have some concerns, as soon as the gazettal was published they should have checked whether they were on the list or not and if they were not, they should have brought it to Court at that time.

It is too late now for them to bring it to Court.

If there are any residual of people who think they have entitlements, under the law it is too late to raise this issue.
It’s not good news but I am just stating the fact that it will be too late to bring it to court because it was gazzetted some time back.

One area where they can potentially share is royalty sharing, which is locked in, where names are given and it’s given to that person.

But development levy shares for the Central Provincial Government that’s an undivided money.
So if they can sit down with the good Governor of Central Province and the open members and come to an agreement with regards to the Development levy and can share it amongst those who didn’t receive any royalties.

I will pass on the copy of the gazettal to the Member and he can work his way from there, and I can sit with him at another time and help where it is necessary.

Law and Order Sir PETER IPATAS - Thank you Mr Speaker, my question without notice goes to the Minister for Internal Securities.
Mr Speaker, most of my questions is about law and order and people may be calling me Mr law and order.

But let me say this, we have a serious issue in terms of law and order; Now we have to be serious.

Where is the seriousness in combatting law and order, law and order is about life and death, security over assets?

13/04 We want to build business and sustain it into the future and without law and order everything will collapse.
Mr Speaker, I am speaking about law and order and happy to see that National Government has allocated more funding into the police force.

I’m happy with that Mr Speaker, but at the same time I am not happy with this funding allocation.

If we want to do recruitment as per the advertisement for young people to apply and be recruited in the police force.

The problem is the culture that is existing in the police force.

How can we solve it?


17 If police have some strategy, Mr Minister I want to ask today that we cannot continue to increase numbers when the existing culture out there is bad in the Police force.

Increase of numbers will only create more problems.

We must have a strategy in order to fixed the existing issues in the police force.

So, my question is short.

I am happy with the Minister for taking up the leadership and putting more resource into it.
But, I still believe that we have a long way to go and when we advertised to recruit more manpower.

I want you to address the nation that when all those young people come into the police college, who will train them, recruit, and will there be nepotism or not, how will you fix it?

We cannot recruit druggies into the police force.

When they pass out from Bomana police college and posted out to provinces and districts, who is there to mentor them.
So, that’s why some of us has been calling for outside help and looks like we’ve come to a stage where our ears are deaf on this proposal.

So, if we have a strategy the nation needs to know.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr PETER TSIAMALILI – Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Firstly, I take this opportunity to wish you, Mr Speaker, and your people belated season greeting and also to all ministers, members, governors as well.

And to my people of Bougainville, I wish you all belated seasonal greetings.
My good Governor of Enga, you have raised a very important question and I just want to assure you that throughout this festive period, I didn’t celebrate it with my people.

I am working around the clock to putting together this final piece of the White Paper for the security.

I want to assure you, the people, and leaders that because of the challenges that we faced with this culture that we are confronted with today.

The first step that we’ve taken as a force is to distant the process of recruitment.
We have independently out-sourced it so that we are arm’s length to influencing those that we want to get into the force.

We have compromised far too long and so, it is you leaders and our people’s cry that we must take that stand and show, as a force we have out-sourced that process.

Many of you leaders today have asked me, how I will recruit the young youths into the police force and my answer to you all is just follow the process.
That is the only way we can start changing the culture and it starts with us leaders.

I want to encourage all of us that the only way we can start changing the culture; is with us leaders.

18 14/04 I want to encourage all of us, as I said on the onset, this is a collective effort from all of us and this process will need all of us to collaborate and coordinate so that we ensure that the process selects the appropriate man and women into the force with good mind-set and good values.

That is what we want.


Once we start getting the appropriate people into the force obviously the culture will change.

I want to give comfort to you that your call for us to engage outside help.

My good Governor, we will have a meeting with our bilateral partners particular with Australia in April regarding the Treaty which we are currently defining and refining.

The treaty will encompass such arrangements for enhanced support from our bilateral partners towards PNG.
So, Governor and my leaders, we have started a process and it has begun so we must believe in the process.

In the first quarter, soon, I will deliver the White paper and we can talk about some of the reforms and the actions that we are going to take as a government.

Again, I just want to encourage all of us, the culture starts with us.

I need all your support to change the culture.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.


MOTION BY LEAVE Mr RAINBO PAITA (Finschhafen-Minister for Finance and Planning) – I ask leave of Parliament to move a motion without notice.

Leave granted.

LEAVE OF ABSENCE Motion (by Mr Rainbo Paita) agreed to – That the leave of absence be granted to Mr Joseph Lelang, MP (Member for Kandrian Gloucester and Opposition Leader) and Mr Maso Karipe, MP (Member for Porgera-Paiela) for the duration of this meeting on medical grounds.
19 ANSWERS TO PREVIOUS QUESTION Mr DON POLYE (Kandep - Minister for Higher Education, Research, Science and Technology) – I seek leave of Parliament to respond to previous questions.

Leave granted.

Thank you, Mr Speaker and thank you Parliament for granting me the leave to answer the previously asked questions.

There are five questions, I will read them and answer them briefly.

(1) Why most students who scored high GPAs were not given a place in the universities?
(2) Why students are given placings at the Universities that are not of their preferences and choices?

(3) Why students who met the required GPA are placed in the selection pool?

15/04 (4) Can the Minister admit or deny there is an academic fraud in the online selection system?

(5) Can the online selection system be reviewed and a fair section process be established?
I do acknowledge those questions as very important as we are almost to begin a new academic year but before I answer the questions I would like to say here that I have asked the Department Secretary to have some clarification on this matter published in the media so that our people are well informed.

Students in secondary schools doing grade 12 are using the online application system called National On-line Application System (NOAS).

And they have options of five choices.


So, its not like they are doing this without the involvement of the students.

They can choose five different programs as preferred by a grade 12 school leaver.

The selection system provides information for its program with clear and distinctive requirement preferences and residential options.

The NOAS is open for three months, thus 20 giving students more time for decision making.
The student’s application must match chosen programs, exam combination and requirements of a university or a higher education institution.

The NOAS increases the chances of admission through subject combination matching and do note that GPA is not the single requirement considered as a factor in program selection ranking.
Selectors at institutes of higher learning universities insert into the system complex ranking order during selections and they set up their own criteria to ensure that their students reach the highest academic competencies during their studies.

This resulted in a few students with good GPA not being selected because of the standard set.

Mr Speaker, it is impossible for a student to be selected to a different university or a higher education system if she/he did not have them included in the five choices.
The NOAS works as follows; a) Student applies through the NOAS which is digital application and in this system the student has five different options for institute of higher learning as alluded to earlier.

b) The NOAS is selecting a student in accordance with the choices he/she has made and having met the requirements of the institutions and the quota which the institution has of how many students can be enrolled in this program.

As each program has limited number of spaces for enrollment.
c) The system selects students who are meeting all the requirements of the institutions and with the highest GPA score for example the NOAS starts to select students with GPA 4 and if the quota is filled with students having GPA 4 and meeting all the requirements, then all other students with GPA of 3.9 will not be selected because there is competition right there.

d) The system looks at the other choices made and thus follows the same process.
e) The system cannot select students to an institution if the student did not include the particular institution or the university on the list of choices.

It is easy to find out the evidence, just get the name of the student and asked the student to open her/his account on the NOAS and you can see if the student applied to those institutions or not and if the student applied to the institution or not.
16/04 The system cannot and will never select students to the university or institution if the student didn’t apply.

So, the evidence is there in the applications that the students made in the computer system.

So it is evident that there’s no fault involve.

21 When students’ results were made available in the system, students who are able to view the choices and make the required changes during the grace period.
Mr Speaker, to answer the third question; students who met required GPA are placed in the selection pool for the following reasons: (1) They did not meet all the requirements and criteria for the universities or higher education institutions they have applied to; (2) There are students with high GPA, but because of limited space available they are not selected, and (3) The students’ subject combinations did not match the subject combinations required by the university or higher education institutions.
Mr Speaker, to answer the fourth question, there is no academic fraud in the national online system or the national application system because of the following: (1) There is a digitalised program which is specifically designed and developed for our universities and all higher education institution in Papua New Guinea which considers subject combination, spaces available, criteria established by the institution and GPA required, and (2) With full confidence, I can state that there is no academic fraud in the manner in which students are selected.
I would like to ask the Deputy Opposition Leader to provide me any list of students who complained that they were selected to different institutions that they did not apply for or if they met all the requirements specifically and were not selected.

I need to have a list because this is very important question the Deputy Opposition Leader would have raised.

Mr Speaker, I’d like to address them so I ask him to give me the list of those who felt or complained to him that they were affected.
Finally, I will provide you with evidence from the students’ online application system to prove that they were academically better students with higher GPA and also I will provide evidence from the student’s own application that the student included institution to which he or she was selected.

So there was no any fraud played there.

Mr Speaker, finally, no system is perfect and there is always room for improvement.
As the Minister responsible in this sector, I will ask for a report and we will work with higher education institutions and put together our ideas to review and improve because I believe that the systems can be improved from the current statoscope.

Thank you.

22 GRIEVANCE DEBATE Question proposed – That grievances be noted.

Mr GARRY JUFFA (Northern) – Thank you, Mr Speaker.
My grievance debate that I wish to raise here consist of number of concerns and they are: (1) In relation to the recent newspaper report, whereby a foreigner and expatriate citizen living in Papua New Guinea was brought before the district courts and fined after having been found guilty of having in his possession a particular type of narcotic; a hard drug known as enterotoxaemia over a significant quantity apparently, for which in many other countries, the sentence is quite severe especially in the Asian countries where these type of offence would attract the death penalty or serious precautionary actions consisting of time in jail and then deportation, blacklisting of that particular individual so that he never comes back to the country.
That is how those countries deal with such serious matters.

Transnational crimes of that type or in fact, of all types but in Papua New Guinea, we have fine this individual and according to the newspapers, we have suspended his sentence and allowed him to virtually walk out free.

17/04 In fact, of all types, but in Papua New Guinea we have fined this individual, and according to the newspapers we have suspended his sentence and we have allowed him to virtually walk out free.
No wonder we are attracting the worst type of people into this country who are rushing to do as they please, exploit this nation, take advantage of this weak situation or these laws that exist or don’t exist but are not enforced.

This is an insult to our people.

Meanwhile, a Papua New Guinean if he had been caught with a gram of say cannabis, he would have been severely punished, beaten, maybe even shot, sent to jail and spent hard time or years in prison.

There is something wrong here.


Minister for Internal Security and Minister for Justice, this has to be looked into.

What’s going to happen to this individual?

Will the Department of Labor conduct an investigation into his work permit and cancel it?

Will the Department of Immigration also follow through, determine what type of visa he was granted and cancel that visa and arrange for his deportation?

What’s going to happen to this individual?


Or will he be allowed to stay here and continue operating at large at will and win.

And 23 essentially telling everybody else from other countries who are here doing similar things, this is what you can do in Papua New Guinea you can get away with this, why not.

I wanted to raise this here because I think something serious needs to be done.

As a deterrent to these type of individuals, to these type of criminals.
We can’t be a wide open country where criminal cartels and their agents can just come here at will and win and do whatever they want and we just find them and let them go out do as they please and continue.

This is happening throughout the country in so many instances, this is just one example where criminals like this are engaging in these type of crimes and getting away with it.
Before that we read about a sex syndicate operated by a Sri Lankan national, what’s happened to that Sri Lankan national and those persons involved who were perpetrating those crimes against children.

In other countries these are very serious offences.

But here we are letting them walk around free, do as they please, it’s unbelievable!
On that note I want to state, Minster for Internal Security that there use to be an organization within the Police Department called the Transnational Crimes Investigation Unit.

This organization was established for the purposes of investigating these type of transnational crimes, I’m very familiar with that organization because I use to be the coordinator at one stage, for Customs.

And it consisted of the Police, Customs, Immigration and from time to time the NIO.
But this organization, it exists but it’s a shadow of its former self, it gets no funding.

All officers that were trained abroad are now displaced or have been dispatched to other areas where they are no longer able to perform their duties as investigators or intelligence operatives investigating or carrying out activities to interdict transnational crimes.

What’s happening with that organization?


Right now that organization should be expanding growing with the growing threats that are posed upon this country by transnational criminals.

And let me not start about NIO, which at the turn of independence in 1975 we had 150 NIO operatives, intelligence officers in this country operating under that organization.

Today we have less than 30.


Every other country, with the expansion of the economy and growth there is an increase in threats and opportunities, they also expand their intelligence to cater for this growth and expansion but in Papua New Guinea we have actually allowed it to shrink, it’s like gouging your eyeballs out and blocking your ears so you don’t hear or see threats.

That’s what we have done consistently.


24 18/04 Mr Speaker, I just wanted to raised those points and urged those ministers responsible for these areas to do something about it, and protect this country and its citizens.

We can’t have foreigners coming here and exploiting our children and then selling hard drugs and getting away with it.

Carrying out various types of activities and getting away with it, being fined with K10,000 is less than $2000.
Whereas next door Indonesia, he would have gone straight to jail and executed by the end of this year.

We are sending the wrong signals to the world out there.

We are telling them that Papua New Guinea is wide open for exploitation by these types of entities, criminals and cartels.

That’s not the message we want to send out.


Mr Speaker, I’ll also want to make some comments in relation to the recent laws passed or bill that were brought here by the Minister for Commerce and Trade in regards to restricted activities.

This is great news.

My question is; how we going to enforced this, because the IPA doesn’t do that.
If we look at the IPA structure, they are the structure designed merely to rubber stamp organizations that are coming here to be created as business entities or association.

They are not out there enforcing the laws.

They can take a drive from wherever they are operating in Port Moresby and they can see many of these laws has been breached.

What are they doing about it?

So, if they can’t enforce the existing laws, how they going to enforced these laws?

That’s my question in relation to that bill.


We are great at passing laws and enforcing them its another thing, we don’t do very well in that area.

So, whoever it is, from whatever country is here, let’s say he gets a company registered for operating in Port Moresby carrying out the business of say, a hardware but than he is ended up in another province buying gold and exporting it.

How are we dealing with that?

This is a real situation and happens throughout the country?

What’s IPA doing about that?


So, if they don’t have the enforcement unit mechanism and if they don’t have within their structure an investigation unit, prosecution unit, then how are they going to enforce the law?

The laws that we are passing here and congratulating ourselves and feeling great about.

How are they going to implement it?

Are they going to refer it to the police?


But police can’t do it because police are already overwhelmed, and the unit that probably could it is not even funded and just hardly existed anymore.

What we have to do is just take a very firm posture against this type of individuals and companies that are coming into this country.
Enforced the law and ensure that we send the right 25 signals out and not entertain them, give them fines and suspend their sentence and allow them to wonder around do whatever they want again.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr LUTHER WENGE (Morobe) – Thank you, Mr Speaker, for giving me the opportunity to participate on the grievance debate.

At the first instance, I want to fully concur with the point raised by the honourable Governor of Northern Province.
That the punishment that was given to this foreigner who have committed the serious offence in this country.

Very serious in the sense that the drug that was possessed, consumed, distributed by him and the ramification to the extended when people consumed it or have distribution is likely to endanger the lives of Papua New Guineans citizens.

Mr Speaker, it is a serious matter and I fully concur with the speech by the Governor of Northern.
I want to recommend it to the Attorney General of this country to speak to the Public Prosecutor that he exercises his powers under the Public Prosecutor Acts or the Constitution to appeal against the sentence.

19/04 This country is not a country where you can come and play around.

I want to strongly recommend that the person’s sentence should be appealed because it is just too lenient.

This is an independent country.

It is not a colony of Australia or some European country.
We got independence in 1975.

We cannot allow foreigners to come here and play games with our lives and our laws.

We cannot go and do the same in their country.

And I want to recommend to the Attorney General take a tougher measure.

If the law or the penalty is very lenient consequences of which he was discharged, then recommended the higher penalty should be enacted by this Parliament.

Mr Speaker, in relation to the questions that I raised before.
I raised the question merely so that you can help in the formulation of the question to the Constitutional Supreme Court.

Mr Speaker, I’m not sure about other provincial governments but I see my friend in the Enga province is fully concerned about what we are trying to do here.

Section 1- of the Organic law and Provincial law of the Local Level Government provides the Constitution of Assembly, that is that who is supposed to be in the assembly must be specified under Section 10.
Unfortunately, that section 10 was amended to take away the Council presidents and the representative of the Lord Mayor.

In a province where there are more urban councils; section 10 requires that one of them will represent them in the Provincial Assembly.

26 Mr Speaker, the Morobe Provincial Government challenged the amendments to that section which took away the Council presidents who are supposed to be there by virtue including other matters.
And the Supreme Court fully agreed that under Section 187 of the Constitution the Provincial Assembly must consist of mainly the elected leaders and therefore to have more appointed members in the provincial assembly was controlee when the organic law remove the council president from the assembly that left behind more appointed members plus the elected members of the open election in their respective provinces.
So the Supreme Court struck down that amendment and it ruled that the amendment was unconstitutional.

Mr Speaker, that does not mean that the Council president and the representative of the LLG should come automatically to the Provincial Assembly.

The Supreme Court made its decision by ruling and makes its constitutional duty to rule illegal or legal and they did rule that its illegal.
And when it ruled that doesn’t mean that doesn’t mean that all the LLG presidents will come into the Provincial Assembly this required the Parliament to amend the Organic Law to have them brought to the Provincial Assembly and it was the Parliament, the time the Supreme Court handed down its decision has not made any amendment until now.
So now my argument is that the present Government should be urged to make amendments, so that we bring the Council President to the Provincial Assembly under section 10, which was amended but surely, we can make another amendment to that section again.

20/04 Make sure that we make amendment so that we bring the Council President to the provincial assembly under section 10 which was amended but surely, we can make another amendment to that section again.
Mr Speaker, another matter I wish to raise is in relation to a section which I am not able to quote to you now but it is there and is the section which talks about the district planning and budget priority committee, which should constitute of the Governor being the Deputy Chairman and the Chairman should be the district member, and LLG president and other appointed members.
That section in my view has not been amended and in the face of it you have a District Development Authority Act which brings in the Open Member and the Council President and other appointed members.

And when you look at the functions of the DDA, it is almost a copy of that section that establishes the district planning and budget priority committee, so this is a clear duplication.
27 Mr Speaker, I am urging this parliament to review this as the DDA is sub ordinate to the organic law and therefore it is unconstitutional, therefore it should be referred to the Supreme Court for its opinion.

Secondly; the City Authority is also unconstitutional in my view because it violates the Local-Level Government Act.

This is the act that has the power to establish authority.
And to establish authority by other means is unconstitutional, because the LLG is one of the three-tier levels of government of this country.

Mr Speaker, I will draft the questions and bring them back to you to assist you to decide whether you should refer the matter to the Courts to determine or not.

Finally, I want to support the point raised by Governor Ipatas that law and order is breaking down in this country.
S urely, he is right and in the province that we are managing but in the first instance we are a government where the people are.

We can vividly see that there is a clear in- effectiveness of the police presence there.

I say in-effectiveness because the government does not exercise its constitutional obligation under section 325 of the Papua New Guinea Constitution.
This section says that the Government has an obligation to provide facilities to all of its constitutional offices, one of which is the police, and they have not.

The budget is all talking about DDA and other so-called grants and we are not talking about providing sufficient money to such offices like the police to carry out its duties.

They have to make sure there is law and order in the country and we are not doing that.
While on the issue of resourcing the police force, I would like to move onto the retirement of our police personnel who have reached their retirement age.

Why are we still keeping these men who have already passed their retirement age?

We need physically fit men and women to help in the fight against law and order in our communities.
Let us recruit young officers to go up against young law breakers and let us train these recruits who should be skilled and physically fit to control and keep peace and order in our communities.

Let us recruit, train and fund officers to help us control law and order in the country.

21/04 It is my right but I have been merciful because I am a member of Parliament, if I was an ordinary citizen, I would sue you.

Mr SPEAKER – Honourable Governor of Morobe, your 10 minutes is up.
I call on the Member for Ialibu–Pangia.

28 Mr PETER O’NEILL (Ialibu-Pangia) – Thank you, Mr Speaker, I would like to add on some of the points raised by the Governor of Morobe especially regarding the issue of provincial governments, the DDA and the Joint District Planning and Budget Priorities Committee.
Yes, it is true that the Supreme Court has made its ruling and it is incumbent on this Parliament and Government to review this decision and make the appropriate changes to the legislation so that we can correct some of the issues that have been going wrong since the reforms that took place and subsequent governments have been trying to correct it.
Mr Speaker, there is a concern, the Organic Law and the Constitution states that elected members in any assembly must be elected to one house only, whether it is the national assembly of Parliament or provincial assembly or local level government council.

That law is very clear but we continue to breach that.

Now we have governors and members of Parliament and of course presidents of LLGs who are members of the provincial government.
We are only supposed to be members of one legislature and that is that if we are elected to this Parliament we are supposed to be members of Parliament only not holding two positions.
So, the issue is about total reform, whether this House has the ability to make those tough decisions where the governors are prepared to go back to the provinces and run the provinces, where the members of Parliament are prepared to be just members of this House only, where the presidents of LLGs are prepared to be the presidents at the LLG level only.
That is why some of the changes we tried to, make was that at the provincial level the initial stage was for the LLG presidents to go back to the LLGs and get the provincial government and provincial government to fully fund them properly so that they can be operational at that level.

Mr Speaker, where provincial members can be elected directly like we used to before so they become members of the provincial assembly and are appointed chairman and so forth.
So this is the challenge that we have in this House, we don’t necessarily have to go back to court to do our job.

We must be prepared to make those tough decisions like letting go of control.

The issue about DDA is because in many provinces throughout the country even the provincial government is not looking after the districts.
They are starving them of funding especially when there are political differences, most of those elected members who are on the opposite side do not receive any funding for their districts.

The people in those districts Mr Speaker, are citizens of this country and members of your province.

They deserve education, they deserve health services and better roads.

The 29 deserve power and water and everything else that we take for granted.
So, Mr Speaker, it is about leadership and political will for us to make these tough decisions.

I understand where the governor is coming from thinking that we are now going to continuously fund the districts and forget about the provinces but in the wisdom of our fore fathers, they have created this three-tier government for us.

They knew that leadership must be at every level.

At community level, at district level, provincial level and the national level.
And their wisdom is right, Mr Speaker, we need to capture that and honour that and of course drive it to make sure it works.

And of course the funding must go directly and there must be no blockages along the way.

That is why we created DDA to avoid the blockages at the different levels of government where none of the funds that even our budget provides for ends up in the districts.

Some districts are so neglected that they seem like they are not part of this country.
Today, least we get some funding in the districts to maintain roads and maintain services that our people deserve.

That is why we have the DDA.

22/04 Maintain services that our people deserve that is why we have the DDA.

The DDA is not a legislative structure of Government.

It does not take on the role of the local level government, not the provincial government but it is a service delivery mechanism where they control some funding to make sure that the minimum services go down.
I understand that the Prime minister made an announcement in Madang that he will increase the funding to K20 million to each district, now that is a welcoming news.

But even today we are struggling to fund the K10 million so let’s get that out of the way first before raising all our expectations and every citizen in this country thinks that every member of Parliament is receiving that kind of money when in fact we are not.
Some of us are getting K5 to K6 million a year but we, maintain service delivery for our people.

Mr Speaker, I support the call by the Governor for Enga and Governor for Morobe, let us review this.

Governors don’t have to come into this Honourable House, they have a province to run but give them the money to go and run their province.
They are here because they are not getting the funding so they have to follow the Prime Minister and Minister around to make sure that funding continues to come through their province.

Mr Speaker, let us remind ourselves that we are legislators, we are not elected to follow cheques around the Waigani swamp.

We are supposed to be providing the plans and the vision for our country to be developed through legislature.

30 Mr Garry Juffa – Point of Order!


Mr Speaker, I am curious because the last time I mentioned the word Waigani swamp here, I was asked to withdraw that but it has been mentioned again so I am curious, are we having double standards here?

What is going on?

But I do agree with much of the debate by the Honourable Member for Ialibu-Pangia.

Mr SPEAKER – Thank you, Honourable Governor, Member for Ialibu-Pagia can you withdraw the term Waigani swamp.
Mr PETER O’NEILL – Waigani swamp exists Mr Speaker, if you do not know, I will take you there myself.

(Laughter in the Chamber) Mr SPEAKER – Literally yes, Waigani swamp exists but in the context of your statement, I’m sure you did not literally mean the Waigani swamp.

Mr PETER O’NEILL – Okay, I replace the words with Waigani centre.

Mr SPEAKER – That’s acceptable.


Mr PETER O’NEILL – So we come to Waigani chasing after cheques and projects and members of Parliament and governors should not be doing that.

They should be given the allocations that they deserve and allocated in the budget directly so they can stay home and do that work.

Our people are in need of that attention and it is important that this honourable House works together and we will support this.
If there are serious reforms coming through to make the adjustments in the provincial government structure and of course the LLGs, we are prepared.

Mr Speaker, the DDA is not a bad concept.

Some of the leaders, because we are not working together we think it is not working.

But where there is cooperation among leaders, the DDA is delivering services to some of the remotest places that never received services before which is now made possible through that mechanism.
Mr Speaker, let us have accountability in the discharge of those funds and then it will work.

The delivery of services will go down to the people who truly deserve it.

31 Finally, Mr Speaker, the second issue I want to raise is regarding the economy.

I know that the budget allocated some support for the men and women of this country because of the cost of living that has continuously gone up.

Today the prices are continuously driven upwards almost on a weekly basis.
If you go shopping, you will see that the basic goods that our people depend on are too high.

When is the Government going to establish the price controller’s office?

The responsibility has been passed onto ICCC but now we realise that ICCC is overwhelmed and they are understaffed and cannot have officers moving around to inspect price at every level.

I think it is important to know that some of these traders out there are overcharging our people.

Our people are really suffering.


They can’t even afford three meals a day.

They either have one meal a day or no meal at all.

This is a serious concern that our Government and this House need to address.

23/04 Mr Speaker, my second point in relation to that is whilst the prices of goods and services are going up, wages have not increased.

We need to establish the Minimum Wages Board immediately and direct them to review the wages for ordinary man and women in this country.
Why is it so difficult to establish that board?

Why is it difficult to direct them to go out there and start having meetings and consultations to review the wages so that it can be in line with inflation and the increase in price of goods and services.

Mr Speaker, I think it is important that we look at these things immediately.

We are looking at big things but we are not looking at small things that matter to our people.

So that is my grievances for today.


Thank you, Mr Speaker for giving me the time to make my contribution.

Mr ELIAS KAPAVORE (Pomio) – Thank you, Mr Speaker.

I also want to join the debate today on one particular topic.

But firstly my point on DDA.

Some of us have seen a lot of good things done in our respective districts especially my district which was neglected for so many years.
I believe DDA is part of the decentralisation program where we empower the local people to make things happen at the district level and therefore I support the DDA arrangement.

My Grievance Debate is based on the questions asked this week to the Minister for Petroleum and Energy.

We talk about economic empowerment at the local level but there is a need for us today to have a reliable energy program.
32 Mr Speaker, I want to take us back to the agreement signed by four countries during the APEC arrangement in 2019.

There was an arrangement signed by the governments of Australia, New Zealand, Japan and United States.

They committed about US$1.7 billion or K6 billion.

This was four years ago.


I have raised this question several times to previous ministers on what the Government has done, whether to actually give us an update on what the government is planning to actually implement this particular arrangement.

And the same kind of response that we have been receiving for the last couple of years was given to us this week.
I know that the Government had passed the National Energy Authority Act in 2021 but the point is, we still talk about coming up with a regulation and that has not happened for the last couple of years despite the repetitive questions on the matter.

Who is going to do the regulation?

Can we have some people assigned to do these regulations?

Some of our districts need power or electricity to support our programs at the district level.
Mr Speaker, we need to give some priority, some commitment to making sure that the regulation afore the National Energy Authority Act is in place.

And the funding that is committed by the partners during the APEC arrangement, we have no idea on the status and progress of this arrangement.

According to reports about 13 per cent of our people have access to electricity, this leaves 87 per cent without electricity including my district.

We have a lot of economic activities happening in all districts.
I am calling for a feasibility study to be funded by the government right across the country to establish a system where there is feasibility for energy source to happen in our country.

So my point is, I think the Minister responded this week saying they are still working on the regulation for the Energy Authority.

So, we want to get some commitment again from the Minister responsible so that the next time we ask this question again we expect a positive response rather than vague one.
24/04 We expect a different, positive undertaking then coming up with ‘we are still working on this’ and we can come up with this in the next few months.

Mr. Speaker it is so important that we have energy in our country and especially the power grid.

I’m waiting for the government which has come up with an arrangement called the Australian ‘Powerim Community’ Project because our government is not doing all this, other countries are doing this.
If we did this together, I believe our government should take charge of this and the NEC team or department that is in place put up a program and get the government to support this arrangement.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, 33 Mr WAI RAPA (Western Highlands) – Speaker, may I make a correction, I’m the Governor for Western Highlands not Eastern Highlands.

Happy new year to you Mr. Speaker and I would also like to wish the same to members of Parliament, Ministers, Prime Minister and Deputy Prime Minister.
I would like to make a statement that so much has been said for the councillors and presidents.

Like me, I’m a president of the council now in parliament and the Local Level Government, if you see that the Organic Law was purposely based on Council, Local Level Government was supposed to do bottom-up planning and the Local Level Government Council is the foundation of the government and then we have the Provincial Government and the National Government.
But today in the caucus and also through parliament, I hear that a number of leaders have a lot of grievances with the councillors and presidents.

I would like to advise the parliament that councillors today pay K200 to become a councillor while members pay a thousand; you members get paid every fortnight but councillors are who paid K200, do not get paid fortnightly but get a form of allowance every month.

This allowance has not been given consistently.


Yesterday, I heard a leader raise this issue on allowance.

I for example have also not received my allowance for a year until I entered Parliament.

So, the government does not recognize the Local Level Government.

The Local Level Government does not have funds to provide services to the districts.

There is a lot of politics in the Highlands region amongst councillors.
However, I would like to announce here that Local Level Governments represent the national and provincial government and is the face of the government in the community.

I feel that the Government has overlooked the Local Level Government for a very long time now.

Hence, the councillors and presidents have turned to the governors, provincial governments and open members for assistance.

They have become victims of this situation.


As we have heard, some members are uncomfortable around councillors as they were with previous open members, hence this is now creating tension in the community.

However, under the organic law, it is stated that councillors and presidents must work together with their Members of Parliament.

25/04 I would like to make an appeal to the Parliament; I believe in the previous government there was some laws passed that allowed members in the local wards to be paid.
From my own research I have found that there should be K10, 000 paid to wards as funding for development in the wards.

Up to this day I believe they have not been given these funds and for too long they have not been paid their allowances as well.

And then, now we are 34 talking about bringing in an amendment to remove councils of the ward committee being represented at the provincial level.
As a former councilor, I believe equal representation from the ward and local level is important if we want good governance to prevail.

If this matter is taken to court to seek clarification, I believe the court will rule in favor of equal representation.

I am making this statement here so that we can acknowledge the presence of the local level government by giving them some financial assistance to carry out their work.
We at the provincial government have a budget allocation that we work with, what about the local level government?

Mr KEITH IDUHU (Hiri-Koiari) - Thank you, Mr Speaker.

I would also like to participate in this grievance debate.

I am not very content with much of the discussions and particularly this morning we have had some questions raised by Member for Goilala.
He asked a question pertaining to representation or legal standing to participate in the development forum; that is what he wanted to articulate about this morning.

His question was not adequately responded to and it will go off our heads if we do not address it or attend to it.
His question was; when a new development takes place in an area there is so much fanfare about it but in the discussion and other related matters, the Open Members, district leaders; those who are mandated by the people to look after their interest are left on the sidelines and treated like spectators.

Mr Speaker, even to the development forums only the Governor and other senior stakeholders are included while the local level and those at the district are still left on the side.
But when things do not work out at the top because people at the bottom are not happy and projects or programs are stalled, they run straight back to us; the very people that were left to spectate at the beginning.

Today I also had some of you talked about customary land and the interest of our people.

Port Moresby is a classic example.

The Member for Ialibu/Pangia also spoke about the welfare of our people.

He was refereeing to price control as our economy is unbalanced.
People are attracted by the city lights and want to have access to proper education and basic services so they flock to the city but when they get here they are just struggling, there are no opportunities and some have spent over thirty years but are left outside of the system.

So much of presenting and passing the budgets that we say are for the people but in fact they do not see or have a feel of the budget because it is locked away in the formal legal system.
35 26/04 Yesterday, we saw the Prime Minister of Australia come and address the Parliament.

He comes from a nation that was developed 200 years ago.

In fact, Australia took more than 250 years to become a developed nation.

There are many other developed countries like Australia; United States is a 300 years old jurisdiction; United Kingdom, for nearly 800 years, they stayed as democracy.

The point is, we are fixing, unfixing, fixing and unfixing things.
The Oil and Gas Act Section 31 talks about conditions of grant and petroleum prospect licenses and it further talks about clan vetting.

I even hear that Section 47 of the Oil and Gas Act talks about developing companies to take the responsibility of vetting clans.

Where do these operating companies come from and what are their knowledge in anthropology so that they will understand our culture and tradition to figure out the real clan?

What is their speciality in doing clan vetting?


The ILG Act that we are talking about is a failed theory of somebody that’s why it’s been abused day in and day out.

That needs to go, it is not rocket science.

My people have always been traveling outside of Port Moresby.

The Member for Kairuku lives in Brown River because his house is there and he has to travel to and from.
The fringes of Port Moresby are undated by our people from Central province and other parts of Papua New Guinea have come and found extra-legal ways to live.

Not illegal, but extra-legal ways to live life.

We can’t chase these people away; we need to formalise their situation.

We need to formalise them into the formal global economy so that the law can also recognise them.

They can get loans and by that, you have a special interest that we create.

This is where it’s all done.


Taking the point that we should go to the Supreme Court, I took back to differ respectfully not to go to the Court, but we should come to this place; the Parliament.

That’s where we have campaigned to come and change the laws when we are elected to the Parliament.

This is the place where we change the laws so that our people can be happy.

When I talk about this, I’m not talking about Motu-Koita, I’m talking about all of you and our people in the rural sector.
This gas guzzling of money in the last few years being put into the agriculture sector, what is its fruition?

Agriculture is not a coffee and oil palm only, it is also a contagious industry, and vegetables.

We eat kaukau every day, but how do you formalise this economy?

Let’s ask that question.

It’s been done in many other countries.

If we just formalise: the land bank, the 36 tenure and its collateral activity economically, capital markets will open up to us.
This is economically proven world renown agenda in discussing.

The World Bank recognise this philosophy I speak off.

It is not a foreign concept.

If we just holding crest of economic activity even from the micro level, then you will see.

I can assure this country that you will see a growth rate at 4 to 15 per cent GDP.

Our people need real answers and not accusations and vetting by foreign companies.

Clan vetting is a special agenda and it requires special technical support.
It needs special attention and it requires some really good thinking.

Corruption and everything will go if we just get to the root cause.

We keep corrupting the system by creating extra negotiations through very fancy administrative means and that is not the answer.

That is corruption, we talk about corruption, but if we legislate it properly, then we will see some real results and I am certain and 100 per cent sure.

I am expressing my grievance because this is the place for grievances.
Thank you and may God bless us all.

27/04 Sir PUKA TEMU (Abau) – Thank you, Honourable Speaker, I wish to participate in a very short version of the Grievance Debate.

For the first time sitting down in a Grievance Debate session of this Honourable House over the last 20 years, this is the first time I have felt that this honourable House is now beginning to fully realise its true purpose.
In my last Grievance Debate, I did say that Mr Speaker, you, as the Head of the Legislature must control the committees of this honourable House.

You must be well funded so after a session of Parliament like this time, after we vote on the Governor General, all the committees should begin to work not going home to become project managers.

Our problem is that we come here and we forget our role as legislators.
We pick up the role as project managers and so we communicate with the Finance Minister, the Planning Minister, the Treasurer, we argue that this district has not received its funds, asking when the funds will be released.

Most of the time we become project managers.

Mr Speaker, three years from now we will turn 50 years old.
In the life of a human being, a 50-year-old person is a matured adult person with wisdom, knowledge and strength and so I strongly recommend that the Executive Government support the Constitutional Law Reform Commission in a big way and the Parliamentary Committee on laws in a big way.

So that we then say which laws are outdated in this country.

Let’s list them down, which laws are outdated 37 and must be repealed or reviewed and updated.
Let’s find out what laws we need and provisions of the Constitution.

It’s time for us to review and use the hindsight and 50 years of development experience and review it for the next 50 years.

Who is going to do that?

This House and so the discussion or debate today is more than what the role of this Honourable House should be.

In the previous debates it was about that project, this projected, etc, honourable Speaker.

I think we have to change now.


We as legislators and policy makers will have to change.

Mr Speaker, many of the young leaders know that I am the only one that turns up on time in an NEC meeting when I was the Minister of State, I was the only one turning up on time for this parliamentary meeting.

I turn up on time for the Government caucus.

While I was in the Opposition I always turn up on time in the Opposition caucus.
This is because I felt that my role is of a legislator and so the first priority must be this place.

What is then our challenge?

Let me point out one factor which is a weakness, for example, those of us who are open members, we don’t have access to high-powered technical advice.

We don’t even have internet in our offices.

We can’t even engage somebody to advise us.


If we want the laws to be changed, we just have to go through the Attorney General or the Committees or we just sit down We just sit down and say our role is to bring development to Abau but when we come as leaders, legislators and policy makers we are devoid of the technical support.

28/04 Mr Speaker, I think this is one area that we really have to look at to beef up the capacity of the leaders of this nation.
Prime Minister, I understand has 32 positions to support the office of the Prime Minister, Deputy Prime Minister have 15 positions, ministers of State have eight positions to support them with their departments, open members we have nothing so how will we come and debate here.
So, the House is devoid of this level of debate and this is one area I sincerely hope as we looked at our role properly I, think my recommendation, honourable Speaker, you as Head of the Legislator is to provide sufficient support to the leaders that have been elected to this honourable House.

The Executive they have it, but open members and the Opposition don’t have it.

This is an area that I thought I want to debate and two more areas I want to speak about.
Mr Speaker, for 21 years our country has experienced an Autonomous Government in the region of Bougainville.

In the previous governments and taken up by this Government are nominated number of provinces were given some form of status, we are not calling it 38 autonomous arrangement but devolvement of power in the name of a service delivery agreement.
My debate is, because we are a highly diverse country and we know the diversity that we have, we cannot cut and past what’s happening in Enga and allow the Morobe Province to do the same; its different and we are different.

Mr Speaker, therefore my argument is, having experience in one region of our country 21 years of an autonomous arrangement.
I will strongly recommend to our government that we seriously looked at an autonomous structure so that we can then devolve the powers away from Waigani swamp, which exist on the other side.

The Waigani swamp means there’s too much central control here in Waigani, Port Moresby.

We, governors who are duly elected really want to exercise our leadership and when we do we see the provinces that are moving very well.

For 21 years of experience we’ve been given funding to Bougainville.
Mr Speaker, I think that’s a very good experience for the Minister for Inter-Government Relations to take onboard and structure the right arrangement so that we can manage a state approached to give powers to provinces.

The issues that we’ve been complaining about for example; one complains that I hear regularly is why is the provincial financial manager and district financial manager is being appointed from Waigani.

Why don’t we appoint these people so they are accountable to us?
Those are some of the areas in the autonomous structure and without 21 years in this country through the region of Bougainville, I think we have an opportunity to do a good structure so that devolvement of power and resources can be managed successfully.

29/04 I want to sit down with this comment but in my observation, I believe that the 1994 reforms on the Organic Law on Provincial Government and Local Level Governments was one of the worst reforms that this country ever had.
Therefore, it is incompetent of this 11th Parliament to completely review and overhaul the 1995 Organic Law on Provincial Governments and Local Level Government.

Thank you.

Motion – That the grievances be noted – agreed to.

Mr RAINBO PAITA – Thank you, Mr Speaker, I’d like to thank the Members on both sides of the House for sitting through to the end of this year’s first session.
I also thank the 39 leaders for participating in the program for Prime Minister as well as raising many constructive questions over the week.

At the same time, many leaders have participated in the debate on many of our outstanding issues and put their thoughts together on how best this government could run our country.

ADJOURNMENT Motion (by Mr Rainbo Paita) agreed to – That the Parliament do now adjourned.

The Parliament adjourned at 1.00 p.m.. 40