Source document: https://docs-lawep.s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/1698926169925.pdf (South Africa)
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 1 TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 ____ PROCEEDINGS OF MINI-PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY CHAMBER ____ Members of the mini-plenary session met in the National Assembly Chamber at 10:03.

House Chairperson Mr C T Frolick took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.
APPROPRIATION BILL Debate on Vote No 28 - Labour: The MINISTER OF LABOUR: Hon House Chair, hon Deputy Minister of Labour, hon acting chairperson of the portfolio committee, leaders of our social partners, esteemed guests in the gallery, ladies and gentlemen, it is truly an honour for me to stand before you this morning to present the Department of Labour’s Budget Vote for the 2018-19 financial year.
It is UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 2 significant that we present our budget in a year when we celebrate the life and times of our struggle icons, Ma Albertina Sisulu and our international icon, the former President and late Nelson Rolihlahla Mandela.

We are also gathered here during Africa month, where we recall the seminal writing of Pixley Ka Isaka Seme in 1906, with his prophetic essay, The Regeneration of Africa.
We also recall that it was this very essay which later went on to inspire leaders like President Kwame Nkrumah, President Julius Nyerere and Kenneth Kaunda to pursue the ideal of a free and united Africa.

We also stand before you in the month when we celebrate the struggles of our workers around the world who fought tirelessly for an eight-hour day, resulting in May Day being declared International Workers’ Day.
Sadly, we are also delivering our Budget Vote barely a month after we witnessed the passing of our struggle stalwarts, the mother of the nation, Winnie Madikizela-Mandela, Comrade Zola Skweyiya and the chairperson of the portfolio committee Comrade Fezeka Loliwe.

We say rest in power ... UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 3 IsiZulu: ... maqhawe omzabalazo wenkululeko.

English: We will never forget your invaluable contributions.

IsiZulu: Nilale ngoxolo!


English: Hon Chairperson, you will pardon me if I do not dwell too much on the details of how far we have gone as such details are captured in our annual reports, strategic plans and annual performance plans.

However, the Deputy Minister will cover some aspects of progress to date and our key priorities going forward.
Let me start off by giving a broad-brush synopsis on how far we have come in pursuit of the 2014 to 2019 Medium-Term Strategic Framework, MTSF, as our blueprint and the ANC’s electoral mandate.

We must underscore that in giving effect to this mandate, we continue to be guided by our constitutional commitments, the Freedom Charter and the 2014 ANC’s election manifesto.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 4 We understand that this juncture of our democratic transition calls for bold and decisive steps to place the country on a path that seeks to eliminate poverty, and creates jobs and sustainable livelihoods for our people.

This requires radical change and a sustained focus on addressing the real issues, not just empty rhetoric.
True to the African proverb that says, “If you want to go fast, go alone, but if you want to go far, go together,” we have indeed carried out our work in collaboration with our social partners and our people, in order to ensure that the outcomes are not short term, but medium to long term and most importantly, sustainable.

We have been relatively successful in dealing with key priority issues in the medium-term strategic framework of the ruling party.
These include putting in place measures to reduce workplace conflict; improving collaboration between government, organised business and organised labour; and enhancing fairness in the workplace and encouraging a robust, but mutually-beneficial labour-relations culture.

Collective bargaining structures and dispute settlement mechanisms are constantly being strengthened.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 5 Strengthening inspection and enforcement has remained one of our main focus areas in this MTSF period.

Whilst we have exceeded our set targets on inspections, we have now turned our attention to strengthening enforcement by introducing enabling legislative instruments to navigate the inherent complexities in this work.
Unprocedural and unprotected strike levels have declined significantly in the last three years and the proposed amendments to the Labour Relations Act will assist to sustain this welcome development.

Whilst there is clear evidence that we have made significant strides in pushing the key issues in the 2014 to 2019 MTSF plan, we recognise that there is still some way to go to complete this task.
We will use the remaining months to the end of this administration as a final push to complete any of our unfinished tasks.

At the risk of sounding like I am bragging, the ANC has indeed delivered on the call in the Freedom Charter that says, “There shall be a national minimum wage.” To complete this work, Parliament is seized with considering the first ever National Minimum Wage Bill to be introduced in South Africa.
You will UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 6 be pleased to know that this is the only policy demand in the Freedom Charter which remained outstanding to date.

When it is finalised, we can gladly stand back and rightfully proclaim — mission accomplished.

There are a few issues that I need to deal with.

The first relates to the fact that the number of people who now have access to the services of the department has grown significantly since 1994.
Secondly, the service offerings of the department have also increased manyfold from what it used to be in the period pre-1994.

It is true that our infrastructure has not kept up with the volumes of people that use our service offerings.

As a result, this has inevitably compromised the quality of service delivery in some instances.

For this reason, and guided by the MTSF, we have developed plans to ramp up our infrastructure and modernisation of our service-delivery platforms.
The Unemployment Insurance Fund, UIF, and the Compensation Fund, CF, are leading in this regard, given that they are the two entities that command the biggest share of the services that we provide.

Both funds, in addition to employing more service-oriented personnel, have introduced sophisticated UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 7 online systems to enhance better service delivery.
We all recognise that keeping our service-delivery platforms up to speed with the demand on our services will take time but we will not take our foot off the pedal.

The Public Employment Services has been extremely successful in registering workseekers and other related services.

The focus and orientation will now concentrate more on ramping up the number of placements as that is where the desired impact will come from.
Inspection and Enforcement Services registered high levels of success on the inspections and follow-up fronts.

However, the focus going forward will direct more energy in the efforts to improve enforcement.
With regard to enhancing employment opportunities, the UIF will continue to work with the Department of Higher Education and Training through sector education and training authorities, setas, Public Works on the Expanded Pubic Works Programme exit plans and the technical vocational education and training, TVETs, on upskilling UIF beneficiaries.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 8 Our partnership with the Industrial Development Corporation, IDC, created over 29 000 jobs and saved 16 000 in the last four years ending 31 March 2018.

We will continue to partner with the IDC as we have again ringfenced R5 billion for labour-intensive investment projects going forward.
You will recall that last year I reported on the CF and the SA Institute of Chartered Accountants, SAICA, partnership to train learners in medical and actuarial skills.

I also reported that the first intake of 100 learners commenced their studies in different skill disciplines and these were: 20 medical doctors, 20 nurses, 35 occupational therapists, five actuaries and 20 medical orthotists and prosthetists.

I am happy to report that the partnership with SAICA is beginning to bear the desired results.
All 100 learners of the 2017 intake progressed to the second level of the programme.

We are very proud to announce that 22 of the learners from this programme are our guests this morning and are sitting in the gallery.

I will ask them to stand up so that the hon members can see them.

[Applause.]
[Applause.]

We are aware of challenges in the occupational health and safety environment and it is precisely for this reason that UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 9 Cabinet has approved the passage of the Occupational Health and Safety Amendment Bill to Parliament.

Our efforts to expedite the amendments on the Compensation for Occupational Injuries and Diseases Act have turned out to be more complex than we had initially thought.
The public comments window and the engagements at the National Economic Development and Labour Council, Nedlac, generated high volumes of public comments on the Bill and this slowed down the process considerably.

The Bill is still going through government’s internal processes.

The Unemployment Insurance Amendment Bill has also been delayed in part, in order to accommodate the Private Members’ Bill and to complete the consideration of regulations.
The Bill is currently going through the parliamentary processes and we anticipate that it will be finalised shortly.

Now let me turn to the policy matter that occupies the hearts and minds of many South Africans these days; that is the proposed national minimum wage.
There are those who have come out in support of this policy intervention and equally there are those who, for various UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 10 reasons, are opposed to this intervention.
I have said this before and I want to once again underscore that whilst the introduction of the national minimum wage may not mean a lot to those who are well-looked after in the world of work, for the majority of vulnerable workers it will be a huge difference.

The national minimum wage is by no means an end in itself, but a means to an end.

Setting the inaugural level at R20 per hour was informed by research and robust analysis of various scenarios and their possible ramifications.
This level is informed by real world considerations and not some idealistic desires.

It is also disturbing that those who are against the national minimum wage have nothing to offer as alternatives but want to keep the status quo.

Those who are demanding that the level be set higher are totally oblivious of the consequences in doing so.
It is ironic that whilst the legislators are busy doing shadow-boxing on the national minimum wage, it is said that a number of progressive employers have already started adjusting their workers’ wages in anticipation of the national minimum wage becoming a reality.

It is also heartening that the UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 11 employers in question are adjusting workers’ wages upwards and not downwards as others would want us to believe.
Another matter that has been exaggerated in the public domain relates to the proposed amendments to sections 95, 99 and 100 of the Labour Relations Act.

This is with respect to requiring trade unions and employer organisations that seek registration, to make provisions in their constitutions requiring a secret ballot of members before embarking on a strike or lockout as the case may be.
The impression that is created in the public discourse seeks to suggest that this provision in the Labour Relations Act is new, which is not the case.

Trade union constitutions have always made provisions to ballot their members.

The only thing that is new is the introduction of the word secret and an obligation to keep the records for a certain period of time.
It is intriguing to note that the Collins English Dictionary defines the word ballot as a secret vote in which ... select a stance or express their opinion about something.

The Oxford English Dictionary defines the word ballot as a system of voting secretly and in writing on a particular issue.
Introducing secret before the word ballot is therefore nothing UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 12 new, but is an emphasis on the real meaning of the word and what is already implied in the existing law.

This amendment is informed by our commitment to simplify the labour laws.

The second source of protest by certain people stems from the four proposed changes to section 32 of the Labour Relations Act and the rationale behind each one.
The first is the extension of the period within which the Minister must extend a collective agreement if the parties to the agreement are only sufficiently represented.

This is to provide the Minister with sufficient time to consider any commitments received in respect of the Minister’s notice published in terms of section 32(5)(c) of the Act.

The second is to provide for improved representativeness requirements for the extension of collective agreements under section 32(2) of the Act.
Section 32(2) of the Act required the trade union party to the agreement to represent the majority of employees, and in addition, that the members of the employer organisations party to the agreement be required to employ the majority of employees within the scope of the agreement.

The amendment now only requires one or the other.


UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 13 In order to promote collective bargaining at sectoral level and in accordance with the jurisprudence of the International Labour Organisation, ILO, the operating principle underlying the extension of agreements is either, whether an agreement applies to the majority of employees in the sector, or to the scope of application of the agreement.
In other words, the principle is now one of coverage rather than strict representativeness.

This is a major breakthrough for the labour movement and not an easy victory at all.

The third is the manner in which representativeness is determined.
The original intention of the Act was that the representativeness of bargaining councils and their constituent parties would be determined annually by the registrar and not each and every time a bargaining council referred a collective agreement to the Minister for extension.

The amendments to both sections 32(2)(c), (5)(a) and 49 of the Act seek to give effect to that intention and nothing more.
The fourth is to give the Minister the power to ... regulations on the procedures and criteria that bargaining councils must take into consideration.

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 14 The code of good practice on the other hand is intended to provide practical guidance on picketing in support of any protected strike or in opposition to any lockout.
It is intended to be a guide to those who may be contemplating, organising or taking part in a picket and for those who as employers, employees or members of the general public may be affected by it.

We are aware of the issues that the Auditor-General, AG, has raised and they are receiving focused attention.

We are confident that we are making progress in getting these matters corrected along the lines of what the AG has recommended.
Hon members will recall that South Africa assumed the chair of two international bodies, which are the Southern African Development Community, SADC, and the Brazil, Russia, India, China and South Africa, Brics.

I am pleased to report that we hosted a successful session of the SADC Ministers of employment and labour, and social partners, in March 2018 in Cape Town.
With respect to Brics, as the current chair the Minister of Labour assumed the chair of the Jobs and Employment Chapter, which takes place at both technical and ministerial levels UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 15 through the Labour Employment Ministerial meeting.

I am pleased to report that we hosted the technical team meeting recently in preparation for the ministerial session later in the year.
South Africa continues to get recognition for what it has to offer in shaping the international discourse.

Recently, the ILO invited our President, His Excellency Cyril Ramaphosa, to take a leading role in the ILO’s Global Commission on the future of work as cochair with the Prime Minister of Sweden.

This represents a profound recognition and confidence in what South Africa has to offer in shaping the global agenda on topical issues.
We are even more excited that, in addition to the ILO invitation to cochair the commission, the ILO has also extended an invitation in advance to our President to address the ILO’s centenary conference in June 2019, pleasantly coinciding as it does with the historic year of the celebration of the birth of South Africa's first democratically elected President, the late President Nelson Mandela.

This is indeed a gesture of the highest honour for South Africa and its people.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 16 Let me conclude by thanking the Deputy Minister of Labour, Inkosi Adv Phathekile Holomisa, for his unwavering support.

I also extend my sincere gratitude to the acting chairperson and hon members of the Portfolio Committee on Labour for your continued support and guidance in executing our work.
Let me also extend my gratitude to our social partners for always being there when we need them, and to the director-general and his team for their support.

I hereby table the 2018-19 Budget Vote 28 totalling R3,2 billion for the Department of Labour for your consideration.

Thank you very much.

[Applause.]

Afrikaans: Me S R VAN SCHALKWYK: Agb Voorsitter, agb Ministers en Adjunkministers, agb lede, gaste in die gallery, mede Suid- Afrikaners, goeie môre.
Ek wil vanoggend hierdie debat opdra aan ons ontslape voorsitster, Fezeka Loliwe.

By die geleentheid wil ek ook baie dankie sê aan al die lede van die portefeuljekomitee regoor alle politieke partye, asook die direkteur-generaal en sy span, en, baie spesiaal, die UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 17 Ministerie wat my so mooi ondersteun het gedurende hierdie paar maande.
As ons vandag in die middel van Werkersmaand staan, en, soos ek, bevoorreg is om as waarnemende voorsitster aan die laaste begrotingsdebat van Arbeid van die vyfde Parlement deel te kan neem, kan ons nie aanbeweeg voordat ons nie ’n terugblik op die verlede gehad het nie.

English: The evolution of our labour laws and workers’ rights has come a long way, hon members.

This journey can be traced back to the Masters and Servants Acts of 1853 which were designed to suppress workers and repress trade unions.
Those laws required servants’ obedience and loyalty to their masters, with infringements of the contract punishable by a court of law, often with a jail sentence of hard labour.

Our people were sent to potato farms for failure to produce a dompas, and for being at a place without a valid workseeker’s permit.

Prior to 1995, an employee could be dismissed in terms of the contract of employment, which could permit any reason for dismissal.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 18 Since 1995, an employee may be dismissed only for misconduct, operational reasons and incapacity.

The Labour Relations Act of 1995 is a pivotal piece of legislation, as it recognises the need for fast and easy access to justice in labour disputes.

It is fact and not fiction that, through the ANC, workers today are able to seek employment wherever they choose.
Once in employment, they can count on protection against unfair labour practices.

Workers today can sit around the table with the employers and negotiate their working conditions.

These things did not fall from the sky, but are as a result of the hard work of the ruling party and those who are the friends of progress.

You will also be aware that South Africa is guided by international best practices when it comes to crafting a labour relations regulatory framework.
We draw a lot from the International Labour Organisation, ILO, conventions and recommendations when developing our labour relations dispensation.

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 19 In addition, all our labour laws have to pass the scrutiny of the robust Economic and Social Impact Assessment and most importantly, they also have to be in line with the spirit and the letter of our Constitution.
These various tests through which our labour laws have to undergo, give most of us a degree of comfort that we are at least not trampling on the fundamental rights of our citizens.

As a matter of fact, our Labour laws are a direct expression of our Bill of Rights which, of course, has its origins in the 1955 Freedom Charter and nothing more.

None of our labour laws fall outside of the Bill of Rights.
No one disputes the fact that lasting victory over poverty and hunger requires the creation of decent work opportunities and sustainable livelihoods for all our people.

South Africa’s democratic elections from 1994 to date, were about the aspirations and collective desire for a better South Africa and a better life for all.

They were about a journey to bring an end to the legacy of apartheid and to build a united, nonracial, nonsexist, democratic and prosperous South Africa.
I submit therefore that decent work is the foundation of the fight against poverty and inequality, and its promotion should UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 20 be the cornerstone of all our efforts.

The creation of decent work and sustainable livelihoods remain at the core of the ANC-led government’s agenda.

The task of addressing joblessness, poverty and inequality is a responsibility of all of us and not just one social partner.
For this we need to stop the blame game, and demonstrate that we are indeed committed to the future of this country.

The majority of South African workers have no other place they call home other than South Africa.

They do not carry two passports.

Therefore, if South Africa is in trouble, they do not have a holiday home in some exotic island in the middle of an ocean somewhere.

They literally have nowhere else to run.

South Africa is all they have.


Therefore, building and defending hard-fought freedom is not an option but a duty.

Former President Nelson Mandela once said, and I quote, The challenges in South Africa... are not for government alone, but are equally, challenges for our social partners.

None of our goals are achievable by government ...working in its own corner... alone.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 21 This is so apt, considering the levels of socioeconomic deficit in this country.

We recognise that a society based on poverty for many, and prosperity for a few, carries the biggest risk for all of us.

During the platinum strike of the recent past, I overheard a worker representative pose a very sharp question, and it went something like this: If you won’t let us dream, we won’t let you sleep.
What happens when real opportunity for everyone earning below the poverty line evaporates entirely?

What happens when people can’t find decent paying jobs that they can afford to live on?

What happens when people have had enough?

These questions are indeed difficult but, in a small way, the ANC government, through its policy interventions, is providing answers to these questions.

The debates on the national minimum wage are a case in point.
Often, those who oppose the interventions are those who are living comfortably in the leafy suburbs.

Some of them have never worked for someone else in their entire lives.

I call it having been born with a silver spoon in their mouths.

Some of them do not understand what it means to work for nothing but UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 22 tips, as many waiters and waitresses in our restaurants have to do.
They are those, as the Minister of Labour once said, who claim, in well-spoken English, to care about workers, but when they are asked to sign in support of a national minimum wage, they show their true colours by opposing every attempt that the ANC is placing before Parliament in the interest of workers.

History will judge you harshly.

She said, at least today we know who really cares about the low-paid workers.
Let me highlight a couple of what I consider to be key achievements in this Medium-Term Strategic Framework period.

Progress in moderating workplace conflict through advocating a multiyear approach to collective bargaining agreements.

This is confirmed by the decrease in the number of unprocedural strikes recorded since then.
In the past, a trade union had to have a 50% plus one union representivity in order to qualify for majority rights such as the right to union representatives and access to information.
Today, even in cases where a union does not command a 50% plus one representivity, a commissioner may award majority rights to a union that is considered to be sufficiently UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 23 representative, as long as no other union in that workplace already has majority rights.

In terms of Section 186, a dismissal is no longer just limited to the termination of a contract of employment by an employer, but termination of any employment.
This means that, where an employee is stationed with the client of a temporary employment service, and the client decides to terminate his employment, the employee can refer the client to the Commission for Conciliation, Mediation and Arbitration, CCMA, irrespective of the contract with the temporary employment service, due to the fact that the employment relationship is between the employee and the client.
A fixed-term contract that exceeds three months without justifiable reason would result in such an employee automatically becoming a permanent employee.

Fixed-term employees working for longer than three months must work under and receive the same benefits as all other permanent employees, unless a justifiable reason to differentiate in terms and conditions exists, such as length of service, seniority, etc.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 24 Review proceedings brought by employers in respect of arbitration awards handed down by, for example, the CCMA, will no longer suspend the enforcement of those arbitration awards, unless certain considerations apply.

This will bring to an end the tendency of some employers who take CCMA awards on review merely to frustrate a worker.
While these achievements are profound, we are aware of a number of challenges that the department still need to deal with, including the issues raised by the Auditor-General.

We therefore request the Minister to note all the issues raised by the Auditor-General and to ensure that special and focused attention is given.
These include, but are not limited to concerns of the Auditor- General about fruitless and wasteful expenditure, underperformance on certain programmes, and regression in the Unemployment Insurance Fund, UIF.

Notwithstanding the challenges that are there, we want to commend the CCMA for being the shining example of what running an institution should be.

The CCMA is indeed the jewel in the Department of Labour’s crown.

Keep up the good work, CCMA; you make us proud.

[Applause.]
[Applause.]

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 25 We acknowledge that we came from a very difficult past with the Compensation Fund where, in some instances, backlogs as far back as the 70s could only be dealt with in the recent past.
This indeed shows us how the service to our workers was dealt with back then, but through the action plan by the not- so-brand-new Commissioner Mafata to address the challenges in the Compensation Fund, notable improvements continue to produce.

The Department of Labour performed well in 2016-17, obtaining an overall achievement of 74% and 75% on the Employment Creation Strategic Objective.
The committee notes the slow pace at which vacant funded posts are filled and therefore recommend that, taking into consideration the high level of unemployment in our country, it is important that vacant funded posts be filled without delay by the Department and its entities.

In the current financial year, the department and its entities received a total of R3,295 billion.

The budget allocation has increased by R75,8 million from the 2017-18 allocation in real terms.
We know that in the current economic climate the norm is a reduction in the allocation of departmental budgets, but UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 26 the ANC government supports the important role of the Department of Labour and its entities and therefore increased the allocation to, among other things, ensure that there are R35,8 million more available to employ inspectors and to provide them with the relevant tools of trade.
This addresses a concern expressed by all political parties in the committee, especially with the anticipation of pressure that will be put on its resources after the implementation of the national minimum wage.

As we know, hon members, there are currently many employers who are not adhering to the low wages prescribed by the sectoral determinations and even more might take chances with the national minimum wage, hence this provision.
The allocation was also increased to ensure that the budget of the CCMA be reviewed to R963,1 million, an increment by R48,8 million to reflect the increased responsibilities that will come with the implementation of the labour law amendments currently being considered.
To advance the purpose of the Public Employment Services Programme to provide assistance to companies and workers to adjust to the changing labour market conditions and regulate private employment agencies an amount of R160,2 million goes UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 27 to nonprofit organisations, namely Deaf Federation of SA, the National Council for the Blind, Workshops for the blind, and Work-centres for the disabled.
We are indeed showing that the ANC is a caring government for the vulnerable, disabled and the poor.

We however know that unemployment is rife and therefore we need to see an increase in the placement rate of jobseekers.

We encourage other government departments to use the services offered by this programme.

The strategic objective of the Labour Activation Programme is to enhance employability of UIF beneficiaries, enable entrepreneurship and preserve jobs.
In this regard the UIF aims to target 450 000 beneficiaries with learning and workplace opportunities, and achieve a 90% training lay-off scheme applications with complete information recommended or decline by the project adjudication committee.

To deal with the unemployment challenge will require all hands on deck predicated on strong partnerships.

The National Development Plan, NDP, calls for a social compact to reduce poverty and inequality, and to raise employment and investment levels.
It is therefore clear that for us to move the country forward, all of us need to put the country and our people first.

The current phenomenon of grandstanding to score cheap UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 28 political points by misleading our vulnerable citizens in the hope of convincing them to abandon the ANC and put you, the DA, in power in 2019, must be rejected at all cost.

[Interjections.]
[Interjections.]

Bob Marley coined a line in one of his songs and it goes like this: You can fool some people some times, but you can’t fool all the people all the time Afrikaans: Die werkers van Suid-Afrika weet wie gee werklik om vir hul sosiale welvaart.

Hulle weet ook wie is die wolwe in skaapklere.

[Tussenwerpsels.]

Hul weet dat die ANC nie langer sal toelaat dat hulle tevrede moet wees met krummels wat van die base se tafels afval nie.
Die feit dat baie van die werkers in die kwesbare sektore laagsgeskoold is, beteken nie dat hul dom is nie.

English: Stop taking them for a ride because they are not fools.

The ANC supports the budget.

Thank you.

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 29 Mr M BAGRAIM: Mr Chairman, I stand here on behalf of the Democratic Alliance and I express complete disdain and horror with regard to the proposed budget indicating business as usual.

I have the ...
I have the ...

[Inaudible.]

of the Bagraim family, Dorothy here today, welcome.

My wife, Patsy and all her friends, thank you.

We have almost 9,2 million unemployed in South Africa and we are on the cusp of losing a further million jobs on the forthcoming introduction of a national minimum wage.
The hon Minister, Oliphant, presides over a failed Department of Labour and is merely twiddling her thumbs while South Africa burns because of the failure of our government to create jobs and because of the labour regulatory authority applying a hand brake to employment we have increased crime and poverty.

It is a crying shame that our current government is doing everything in its power to make it impossible for businesses to take in new staff.
In fact, I’ve just heard that the Durban offices of the Department of Labour are still closed after two years.

Everyone, forget about claiming Unemployment Insurance Fund, UIF, if you live in Durban.

The Democratic Alliance will ease up the regulations, spend more money on enforcements and deregulate employment for UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 30 startup businesses.

The DA is already showing results where it governs.
The Auditor-General in its preliminary report relays enormous problems in its high level risk assessment of the Department of Labour.

There are numerous concerns identified and every single section of the Department of Labour has not only failed South Africa, but has failed those who want to collect UIF, those who have been injured on duty and the businesses that want to try to register with the various sections of the department.
The Department of Labour itself does not seem to be able to structure its financial management and it is said that there is in fact no contract management at all.

Fraud is on the increase and past cases haven’t been properly prosecuted.

Indeed, if the Department of Labour was a company in the private sector we would have collapsed it many years ago.

The past 20 years has been dismal and it needs a new and innovative government to come in and build a better future.
The South African workforce and indeed every worker who has been paying into workman’s compensation and UIF should vote very clearly for the DA in order to show that they require better treatment and respect.

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 31 In essence, Minister, we are spending a lot of money on a department which very clearly is unable to run itself and all the while we are going further and further into more and more unemployment.
We are unable to monitor and enforce the labour legislation that we already have and the only response that we get from this moronic department is to make more stringent, onerous laws and regulations.

It is an oxymoron to call this department the Department of Labour as in fact the Department of Labour is not working.
To state that labour isn’t working is an uunderstatement because hon Minister you are creating an environment when not only your people aren’t working, but they are encouraging others not to work as well.

Hon Minister, last year we pointed out to you that there were numerous fraud cases and you hadn’t taken action against those fraudulent individuals.

The most you could do was to suspend people, on full pay, pending enquiries which are taking years.

This is not even a slap on the wrist.


However, we note that there are new batches of fraud cases within your department.

Over 70 have already been reported and the process has hardly been embarked upon to try and even dismiss the individuals.

Last year the compensation fund reported 116 frauds, most of which haven’t been properly investigated and 12 of these cases have been on your register for more than a year.
These have an UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 32 estimated value of R6,6 million has been stolen.

The Fund has a financial misconduct register that currently has 216 cases of which 168 are still under investigation.

I don’t think anyone is doing anything.

I am sure when we come here next year we will report that the investigations continue and while staff earns their salaries sitting at home.
These investigations have taken in most cases up to 4 years.

Evidence gets lost, officials resign and there is no consequence of fraudulent behaviour.

The Democratic Alliance cannot be seen to be asking the good citizens of South Africa to pay their taxes, the UIF and their workman’s compensation.

The money is stolen and then recklessly dealt with.
For instance, duplicate payments made and loans issued to medical service providers in prior years have not been recovered despite this being pointed out to the Minister last year.

There is stated to be a culture of poor performance and weak internal control environment.

Who would support this budget for this?

It is disgusting!
The Commission for Conciliation, Mediation and Arbitration, CCMA, is probably the only small section within the department which is working properly and we have been told that their budget will remain the same, if not slightly smaller, and yet, UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 33 the ANC government is wanting to boast to the workforce that they are going to implement a national minimum wage which will increase the workload of the CCMA by over 30%.
The CCMA commissioner himself has said that with this workload increase of 30%, he will not have the budget to implement the national minimum wage.

Why do we make rules and regulations which we know we won’t be able to implement or monitor?

IsiZulu: Nk M S KHAWULA: Sihlalo, nginephuzu lokukhalima okuphambukayo.

Ngifuna ukubuza ukuthi uthini ngalaba bantu base-Cape Winelands ababaholela ngewayini na?
Uthini ngalaba bantu bala abasahluphekayo abamnyama mabefuna amavoti bebathengela utshwala, amawayini nesinkwa esinsundu?

Kubizwa ngani lokho?

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr C T Frolick): Hon member, please, take your seat.

That is not a point of order.

Continue, hon Bagraim.

Mr M BAGRAIM: It is disgusting to try to hoodwink South Africa and the hardworking citizens by telling them that they are going to get fancy new legislation and then leave them high and dry.
Their expectations are enormous but delivery will be nil.

The Democratic Alliance government would implement a UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 34 national minimum wage in accordance with each sector and will ensure that the inspectorate is properly resourced and that the retrenchments will come to a halt.
The DA will ensure that the future workforce is properly educated, trained and that small businesses will be able to make room for more staff so as to enable the economy to grow once again.

Hon Minister, I expect you to hang your head in shame as you have presided over a complete failure of both the Department of Labour and job creation.

With our youth at almost 50% unemployment, you have given us no hope other than to ensure that we have a change of government.
I want to thank hon Ollis for the training that I have received in the past, for everything and all the help.

I wish you good luck for your future career.

Thank you.

[Applause.]

Ms N NOLUTSHUNGU: Chair, the EFF rejects the Department of Labour budget.

As the EFF, we are shocked that the ANC government through this department is hellbent on the worse attack on worker’s rights since 1994 through the proposed labour laws and slave wage of R20,00 per hour as national minimum wage.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 35 The right to strike ballot, a living wage and decent working conditions are worker’s rights which we are prepared to fight for as the EFF, and we support all workers rights irrespective of their unions in defending these rights.

Minister, if you are willing to test the workers with the strike ballots, picketing rule, longer conciliation and compulsory arbitration, you must continue with your bills.
Workers of the world are uniting, and be warned!

It is your arrogance that will fall and be met with the force of workers.

While we welcome the national minimum wage in principle, we reject the R20,00 per hour proposed rate.

This is nothing, but an extension of the Expanded Publics Work Programme, EPWP, that will trap workers in low wages for the rest of their working life, while companies and bosses live lavishly out of profits.
We reject the labour brokers and have long called for insourcing of workers in government, universities, state-owned companies and in the private sectors.

It is for this reason why we will be introducing two very important Private Member Bills.

We are going to introduce a Private Member Bill to ban all labour brokers to restore worker’s dignity, to advance the UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 36 struggle for better working conditions and living wage.
[Applause.]

We are going to introduce a Private Member Bill to ensure that no person work for government through a third party, and all workers are employed on a fulltime basis, with pension and medical aid since the public health care has completely collapsed.

Farm workers, taxi drivers, domestic workers, cleaners, nurses, teachers and all other workers continue to work in shocking conditions.

We are going to expropriate land without compensation for equal distribution to improve their conditions.
We are going to expropriate land without compensation for equal redistribution to improve the condition of farm workers.

And all farm workers shall share in the ownership of agricultural land.

We are going to expropriate land without compensation for equal redistribution for domestic workers to build homes.

We are going to expropriate land without compensation for taxi drivers to drive short and manageable distances.

All workers need land.


It is a matter of fact that in this country and across the world, women continue to get paid far more less than what men UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 37 are paid, for the same job.

This is why we are calling for a national review of salaries in government and in private sector, to ensure that women are paid as much as men for doing the same job.
Equally, this must also be done for black people to get paid the same money as white workers.

Thank you.

[Applause.]

Mr X NGWEZI: Hon Chairperson, the IFP would like to note with serious concern the shockingly high unemployment rate in South Africa that has continually moved from bad to worse.
We are of the view that the lingering joblessness and high rate of youth unemployment has not been met with the responsiveness that is required from the government and that it is high time something effective is implemented.

It is particularly concerning that 39% of all unemployed people in this country have never worked before.

The figure amongst young people is sitting at 60,3% which is incessantly high compared to other African countries that are classified as upper middle income countries.
Chairperson, it is alarming that the annual unemployment growth rate in South Africa of 4,8% is double that of unemployment rate which stands at 2,4%.

Which means the trend UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 38 is persisting yet still no radical action on the part of the government to create employment opportunities is being effected; the National Development Plan goal of reducing unemployment by 6% by 2030 as it stands is unattainable.
The unrelenting unemployment amongst the young people who have completed their matric, those who have graduated from tertiary institutions and those who dropped out from schools for a variety of reasons are a cause for grave concern.

This state is also exacerbated by a demand for more work experience from both government and private sector.
Despite the amendment of the Labour Relations Act in 2010 and the High Court ruling on the 13th of July that gave employees hired by labour brokers benefit if they remain employed by companies for more than three months, labour brokering remains the main cause of unemployment as employees hired through this process are easily displaced from their places of employment.
The minimum wage proposed by the government of R20,00 per hour, is not a living wage and is far below the daily expenses of many workers which include transport to and from work and daily subsistence provision.

In that regard the IFP supports the sectoral determination for minimum wage.

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 39 We nonetheless support this Budget Vote in the interest of better labour relations in our country.

[Applause.]
[Applause.]

Chairperson, I would request to leave because I have another committee Budget Vote that is sitting.

It would not be disrespecting you hon Minister and members.

Thank you.

[Applause.]

Mr A M SHAIK EMAM: Hon House Chair, the NFP welcomes the report of the Department of Labour tabled here today.

Allow me at the outset to express our disappointment at the decision to postpone the implementation of the national minimum wage.
Whilst we accept that extensive deliberations took place on the introduction of the national minimum wage.

We call on the department and all stakeholders to accelerate the process Minister of concluding on this matter and ensure that the proposed minimum wage is implemented without any further delay.
Now when we talk about labourers hon Chairperson, it reminds me of my forefathers when they were brought here from India to work as indentured labourers in the farms of sugarcane plantations and they lived under the most shocking and inhumane conditions of pain, suffering abuse, long hours and UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 40 yes it reminds me mama Khawula, of brown bread and black tea.

That is what they used to be given.


So, I think as a country and as a government, we have come a long way from the abuse of our workers suffered pre1994 during the apartheid days to today where we have been able to give them protection and ensure that the condition under which they work are much more humane.

Hon Chairperson, we acknowledge the expected impact that the national minimum wage will have on approximately 6,6 million workers and their families.
While many unions in South Africa represent a large percentage of employees let us not forget about the millions of our citizens that are either unemployed or are on the low income category which seem to be marginalised or left out completely.

Hon Chairperson, this is aggravated by the large number of foreigners employed in the country.
Now we already know that we have the 26,7% unemployment rate in South Africa and this is been aggravated by the fact that foreigners are coming into South Africa and of course we do not blame them because of the challenges they face in their own countries and also we have to be mindful of the fact that these are the countries that UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 41 stood by us when we needed them most and when we needed to liberate ourselves.
However, we also need to be mindful that it is having an impact on employment in South Africa and that is becoming a serious problem.

If you actually advertise for certain fields of employment, you will find that 99 out of 100 of them that are applying are foreigners.

A lot of them are illegal and are been exploited by employers and that is why you will find some of them will not want you to have a minimum wage.
The reason for that is so that they can continue exploiting our labourers by paying them very, very little wages and that is exactly the rational be that some of them do not wanting us to pay our people a decent wage.

Now, we need to get the department together with Home Affairs and the other relevant departments to work on this to try and prevent this because of we do not, we are going to have dire consequences at some stage.
We must also be mindful Minister, through the Chair, that this about a million people entering the job market every year.

Either through those that have graduated or those that have dropped out of school and the percentage of jobs that we are UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 42 creating are far lower than them and that is why I think we need to address that and if we do not address we are going to have so much unemployment.
The rate is going to increase and we must also be mindful that when we talk about the unemployment rate increasing we must also be mindful of the increase in the population.

So, it is not just the matter of that the unemployment rate is increasing, but the population is also increasing as well.
So, we need to be mindful of that to take that into consideration so that we can create more jobs and I think what it is very important we need to create an environment where when learners, students and graduates are coming out, there are jobs that are able to be created.

The NFP supports the Budget Vote tabled because preventing or objecting to our Budget Vote will not take the country forward.

We need to find solutions.

The NFP supports this Budget Vote.

[Time expired.]

[Applause.]
The DEPUTY MINISTER OF LABOUR: Hon Chairperson, Minister of Labour Mama Oliphant, hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers, hon acting chairperson of the portfolio committee, hon member, officials of the department, distinguished guests including representatives of our social partners at the National Economic Development and Labour Council, Nedlec, the UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 43 International Labour Organisation, ILO, my family led by my wife Nosimanye, ladies and gentlemen, good morning.
It is indeed an honour for me to once again stand before you on the occasion of the debate on the Budget Vote 28 of the Department of Labour.

We dip our banner also in honour of the unknown and unheralded soldiers, who die fighting for the economic well- being of the nation, deep underground, in search of gold and other precious metals, the mineworkers, especially the seven men who recently lost their lives in Carletonville.
We convey our heartfelt condolences to their grieving families and fellow workers.

Two weeks ago, workers celebrated the 23rd anniversary of the Workers Day since its declaration as a public holiday in South Africa.

This public holiday bears testimony to the struggles that workers in this country and in other parts of the globe have waged for their rights and social justice in the workplace over many decades.
The South African labour movement understood and consistently maintained that the workplace struggles, could not be separated from broader social struggles; that economic justice and equality could not be achieved without workers playing a meaningful role in shaping the discourse.
In this 22nd anniversary of the adoption of our Constitution, the 45th anniversary of the 1973 Durban strikes UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 44 and the 63rd anniversary of the Freedom Charter, we pay tribute to the millions of workers who sacrificed so much so that all South Africans could today enjoy the fundamental rights of being true citizens in their country.
When the ANC took power in 1994, it knew that undoing over 300 hundred years of colonial and apartheid repression was not going to be easy.

The ANC also knew that it would take time to achieve all the things we had set out to do.

The seminal documents Ready to Govern and the Reconstruction and Development Programme served as the blue prints on what had to be done.
Today, as we take you through the path we have traversed, in pursuit of the labour relations transformation agenda, we must equally reaffirm our commitment to soldier on.

The Department of Labour is alive to its mandate of ensuring that there is decent work pursued under conditions of freedom, equity, security and human dignity.

Chairperson, allow me to, albeit very briefly, explain the framework within which we do our work.
We are guided by the Service delivery improvement plan established and maintained by the executive authority.

The service delivery improvement plan is in turn prepared in line with the Medium-Term Strategic Framework, the strategic plan, the annual UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 45 performance plan and other relevant prescripts.
The 2014-19 Medium-Term Strategic Framework set ambitious targets for the executive authority and we want to use this opportunity to report.

Whilst there are areas where we have recorded exceptional progress, there are areas that are still work in progress.

Whilst progress to date is relatively satisfactory, we are the first to admit that there is still a long way to go.
Last year, we made a commitment to strengthen inspection and enforcement in general and on compliance with the employment equity law in particular.

We are pleased to report that we have made notable improvements on this front.

We have registered an increase in the number of companies that were subjected to the director-reneral, DG, reviews for noncompliance during this period.

We reviewed 1 550 companies in total during this period.
Forty-five of these companies were referred to court and their cases await the court‘s decision.

Despite the Johannesburg Stock Exchange claiming in the media that their listed companies were all compliant, we reviewed and discovered 74 of their listed entities that were found to be noncompliant.

Whilst we could do better than this going forward, this is a good start.
We are taking steps to further enhance our capacity on this front by beefing up the UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 46 number of employment equity inspectors.

I am happy to report that the process towards the promulgation of section 53 of the Employment Equity Act dealing with the issuing of certificates of compliance as a prerequisite for accessing state contracts, have been finalised.
This will ensure that no organisations or service providers will be permitted to do business with the state unless they comply with the Employment Equity Act.
With regards to enhancing the employability prospects of the Unemployment Insurance Fund, UIF, beneficiaries, through skills development and capacity building, the Minister has already confirmed that we will continue to leverage our partnerships with the Department of Higher Education and Training, the technical vocational education and training, TVET, colleges and Public Works.
We are aware of the challenges in programmes such as the training lay-off schemes and the turnaround programmes, however, l am happy to indicate that these are receiving focused and special attention.

With respect to 59 scuba diving learners who had completed their training, but were still awaiting integration to workplaces, 38 were placed.

The remaining 21 learners are still awaiting integration within the SA Police Service, Transnet, National Port Authority and the SA National Defence Force, SANDF.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 47 Working with the Agri-Seta, a total of 59 cooperatives were provided with training in farming and management skills in the period under review.

Productivity South Africa has, on the other hand, provided support to 71 companies facing economic distress by restructuring and improving their productivity and operational efficiency thereby mitigating the impact of retrenchments resulting in 8 515 jobs being saved.
In addition, Productivity SA, supported 590 companies that were in distress resulting in 45 232 jobs being retained.

We are very happy that our interventions are beginning to pay social and economic dividends on job retention and enhancing the employability of our people.

Plans are in place to upscale the scope and reach of the labour activation programme.

Whilst there are some improvements in the Compensation Fund administration, there is still a lot of work to be done.
The recently revised organisational structure of the fund holds the promise to deal with the remaining challenges.

I can report, for example, that the claims environment, which was the major source of complaints for many years, is showing huge improvements since we last appeared before this House.

The fund has completely wiped out the backlog in claims.
The fund is modernising its service delivery infrastructure and as a result 88% of the claims are today finalised in 21 days, a far UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 48 cry from what it used to be in the past.

The fund has made a commitment that it will have resolved all the current bottlenecks in the claims environment by 2019.

Chairperson, it would be amiss of me not to touch on the challenges that still confront us and what we are doing about them.
On the service delivery front, we have recently developed a revised service delivery plan taking into account operational service delivery challenges and those raised by the Auditor-General.

The acting chairperson of the portfolio committee raised in her input the concern that the Unemployment Insurance Fund has fallen from being the benchmark of efficiency in the to a level where it was recently smacked with a disclaimer by the Auditor-Genera, AG.
The UIF management has put together an action plan to change the audit opinion for the better.

Already, the action plan is delivering some positive results, with the interim audit by the Auditor-General of South Africa, AGSA, so far indicating a likelihood of improving from disclaimer to qualified with findings.

The AG has raised numerous areas of concern and areas of major concern in the department and across all its entities.
It is only the Commission for Conciliation, Mediation and Arbitration, CCMA, as it has been said that has UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 49 but one insignificant concern from the AG, with the department and other entities being a mixed bag of areas of concern and those that the AG considers to be of major concern.
The issues such as underspending, leadership challenges, consequence management, vacancy rate, annual statements, information technology, IT, governance, human resources, wasteful and fruitless expenditure will be firmly on our radar as part of our oversight and monitoring role in the remaining medium-term period.
I can assure you members that we are aware of all the issues that the AG has raised and we will make sure that the director-general and his management team give these issues the attention they deserve.

There will be consequence management.

We have also noted the issues raised in the report of the portfolio committee on the strategic plans of the Department of Labour and its entities.

We take note of the key issues that are flagged as the key issues for consideration by Parliament.
We have also noted the six recommendations that the committee wants the Minister to consider.

We will keep the committee informed of progress in this regard.

As we move towards the end of the 2014-19 Medium-Term Strategic Framework, our major key priorities going forward will be focused on service delivery and those areas in Medium- UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 50 Term Strategic Framework, MTSF, that are somewhat lagging behind.
You will notice that our budget allocation weighting takes into account the areas that require capacity enhancements going forward.

Of the total Department of Labour, DoL, Budget Vote, five key programmes will take the biggest share of the budget given the challenges and work load that await them.

The CCMA has an allocation of R963 million; administration R917,3 million; inspection and enforcement R598,2 million; public employment services R582,7 million: and Nedlac has an allocation of R31,7 million.
The CCMA workload will increase significantly, likewise that of the inspection and enforcement services, as a consequence of the National Minimum Wage Bill, Basic Conditions of Employment Amendment Bill and the Labour Relations Amendment Bill.

The budget allocation attempts to address this reality.

Administration and public employment services will be expected to play a much more visible role in the remaining medium-term period.
Public employment services will need more resources as it shifts its focus from too much emphasis on registration of workseekers to placement of workseekers.

Administration will have to prioritise ramping up the service delivery infrastructure and dealing with issues raised by the AG.

Other UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 51 programmes and entities that are not mentioned, their budgets have also been enhanced though in moderation in some instances.
Our work, going forward, will be underpinned by the call of President Cyril Ramaphosa in his state of the nation address, that 2018 is the year of encouraging significant new investments in our economy.

To this end we will mobilise all levers in our portfolio to contribute to the achievement of this objective.

This leaves me with having to thank the Minister for her support from the inception of the fifth administration 2014.

Thank you to the acting chairperson, hon van Schalkwyk.
Thank you to the members of portfolio committee who I have noticed that when they are deliberating on issues of concern to the department, they are collegial in their undertaking of the work.

The mount of criticism that characterises some of the speeches is rarely ever found in the deliberations that take place in the portfolio committee where the actual work of the committee takes place.

I commend them to continue to do so.


I thank also the director-general, DG, DoL management and staff of the department for their continued support as well as the UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 52 staff in the Ministry.

Thank you very much.

[Applause.]


The ACTING CHAIRPERSON (Ms N Gina): Hon members, before I call on the next speaker, let us welcome the Grade 4, 5, and 6 learners from Ekuthuleni Primary School in Kraaifontein, who have visited Parliament to see how the proceedings go.

You are welcome, beautiful learners.

[Applause.]

Thank you.

Mr N L S KWANKWA: Hon Chairperson... IsiXhosa: ... abasebahle, molweni ke bethunana maan, matselele.
English: Workers withhold their labour as the chief weapon in their struggle for higher wages and a decent life.

In other words, workers’ ability to strike remains their most successful, and often only, means to address systemic inequality.

Any attempt to limit or undermine this weapon constitutes a conscious effort to perpetuate and, indeed, intensify inequality.

This is clearly what the Labour Relations Amendment Bill intends to do, in terms of how some of the stakeholders view it.
For instance, this issues Minister... UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 53 IsiXhosa: ... asifuni sibe siziphinda-phinda ingathi silikhasethi elixingileyo.

English: Remember in the debate on the minimum wage, we highlighted the concerns that the unions and the labour movements have about issues like a secret ballot, a longer conciliation period, advisory arbitration, and so on.
However, there is an issue I want to highlight which comes from one of the unions, in particular, the SA Federation of Trade Unions, Saftu.
They are concerned about the fact that... IsiXhosa: ... bathi... English: ... Minister, after there were deliberations in the portfolio committee – I think on 17 April – concerning the issues that they raised and which they are still continuing to try and advocate for - that most of their input and submissions were, to a large extent, completely disregarded after the process had been taken back to the Department of Labour, so that it UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 54 could then redraft the relevant Bills.
We would like you to attend to that because it remains a primary concern.

When we were debating the Arts and Culture debate, we said that it is important in an attempt and, in a way, a strategy of trying to build social cohesion ... IsiXhosa: ... ukuqinisekisa ukuba... ... we bring everyone on board... IsiXhosa: ... singashiyeli abanye ngaphandle.

English: Right?

We would like to hear you address that.


However, Minister, there is an issue... IsiXhosa: ... eli sebe... English: UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 55 ... you call it the Inspection and Enforcement Services, which regulates employment and nonemployment conditions.

You’ve reduced the budget, in real terms, by 1,7%, but in our view, it is one of the departments that is not entirely effective.
I remember reporting an incident where a restaurant owner here, in the Western Cape, declared it, publically, to people ... IsiXhosa: ... aba bamsebenzelayo ukuba... English: ... he does not employ black South Africans, and then they continued ...

[Interjections.]

...

Here?

In Cape Town, and then they continued, and still continue, to this day, in this province and in other parts of the country, where they exploit our fellow African brothers and sisters.
However, you see, what is happening is that they pit Africans against each other.

[Interjections.]

They pit Africans against each other.


They employ... IsiXhosa: ... abantu abantsundu babaxhaphaze... English: UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 56 ... and push others out of the system and say, We don’t need you in your own country, and then... IsiXhosa: ... xa kubulawa ama-Afrika asuka kwamanye amazwe ngama-Afrika aseMzantsi Afrika ngubani olilayo okanye obethakalayo.
Kufuneka ibesithi abona bantu baye baphakame xa... English: ... when there is a xenophobic violence, it is us who have to address those issues because... IsiXhosa: ... abakhathali.

English: We have to say those things.

IsiXhosa: Ndichekrwa kakhulu ke mna kukuthetha into engokhoyo, sibe sishiya inyaniso ecaleni kwendlela.

English: UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 57 The other issue we must talk about, Minister, and be very concerned about is this.
Remember, this minimum wage was set long before a decision was taken to increase the VAT and the fuel levy.

This means... IsiXhosa: ... xa sithetha ngama-R3 500 kufuneka sikhumbule ukuba yimali yakulo nyaka ophelileyo kwaye ngoku kukho nochatha werhafu ngomvo ekhulwini kulo nyaka.

Asikayenzi nale yokwandisa izinto emazingachatshazelwa ngulo chatha ngelixa abantu betyiwa yindlala ukusukela ngomhla wokuqala kuTshazimpunzi.
English: Now, it means that by the time we implement this... IsiXhosa: ... ufumanise ukuba le mali seyincinci kakhulu.

English: The other issue, Minister... IsiXhosa: ... ndiyakubona Sihlalo uza kundichukela uthi ixesha liphelile.

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 58 USIHLALO WETHUTYANA (Nksz N Gina): Siyabulela kakhulu ngokuzithoba, ixesha lakho liphelile.

MNU N L S KWANKWA: Hayi aniyithandi i-UDM.

Siza kunixhasa nje okwa ngoku.


Sekela Mphathiswa, ulibele ukuba enye inkosi yesibini apha leli Tshawe lime kule ndawo.

Khange ulibulele.

Enkosi.

IsiZulu: Nk M S KHAWULA: Sihlalo, nginephuzu lokukhalima okuphambukayo.

Anifundeni la ukuthi amakhosi wonke ahlonishwe.

Okwesibili, bengifuna ukwazi ukuthi ubani lo olaphaya emuva ogqoke isigqoko ngaphakathi ngoba akuvumelekile ukufakwa kwezisigqoko la ngaphakathi.

English: The ACTING CHAIRPERSON (Ms N Gina): That’s not a point of order, hon member.
Will you sit down?

IsiZulu: Nk M S KHAWULA: Cha!

Bengifuna ukwazi lo ogqoke isigqoko esibomvu.

Siyesaba bakithi.

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 59 USIHLALO WESIKHASHANA (Nk N Gina): Mama MaKhawula ushuqulile nawe.

Nk M S KHAWULA: Cha!

Ngisho isigqoko.

Ubani osigqokile?

USIHLALO WESIKHASHANA (Nk N Gina): Nawe!

Sengisho ukuthi ushuqulile naye ugqoke isigqoko.

Nk M S KHAWULA: Mina ngiyabonakala ubuso yena akabonakali.
USIHLALO WESIKHASHANA (Nk N Gina): Uzosondela kuwena Mama uKhawula uma sesiqeda uzobona ukuthi wubani.

Nk M S KHAWULA: Sicela ukwazi ukuthi ubani.

USIHLALO WESIKHASHANA (Nk N Gina): Uzosondela Mama uKhawula.

English: Can you continue hon Alberts?

IsiZulu: Nk M S KHAWULA: Ngiyesaba uyazi kuyimanje.

English: UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 60 The ACTING CHAIRPERSON (Ms N Gina): No, no, no, hon Mam’ Khawula.

Can you sit down?

Hon Alberts, please.


Adv A De W ALBERTS: House Chair, hon Minister, an opinion piece by the political analyst, R W Johnson, reminded me of an important part of our history.

In 1994, the ANC posters shouted out, Jobs, jobs, jobs!

Unemployment then stood at 3,7 million, while today, it stands at an eye-popping 9,4 million.

One can only deduce that there is something seriously wrong with the government’s economic policies.
South Africa’s labour force is still very young, and in most cases, this demographic dividend leads to economic growth.

However, in our case, the situation opens us up to the possibility of revolution.

With so many young people unemployed and no real hope of becoming employed, we have reason to be extremely concerned.
Afrikaans: Die probleem is natuurlik dat die regering se ekonomiese beleid, eendersyds, en beleid wat die voorvereiste is vir ekonomiese groei, soos onderwys, andersyds, op die verkeerde spoor is en binnekort met die aankomende trein met die naam, UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 61 realiteit, gaan bots.

Kom ons kyk na ’n paar aspekte in die verband.


Eerstens, die bestaande arbeidsbeleid is daarop gerig om bestaande poste bloot te herverdeel en die unies toe te laat om onrealistiese verhogings te eis, veral in die staatsdiens.

Herverdeling vind plaas deur middel van regstellende aksie en swart ekonomiese bemagtiging, terwyl werk al skaarser raak.

Dit is, uiteindelik, nie volhoubaar nie.


Tweedens, die instelling van ’n minimumloon is, in ’n ideale wêreld waar sterk ekonomiese groei bestaan en baie werk beskikbaar is, wel ’n sinvolle gedagte.

In ons wêreld is dit egter ekonomiese selfmoord met die werkers wat die grootste prys gaan betaal.

Besighede gaan eenvoudig nie nog poste skep nie en gaan bestaande poste minder maak.

English: Thirdly, so, what is to be done in its place to rectify the situation?
The most important prerequisite to ensure a growing economy, job creation, and a future for our young people, apart from private property, is a quality secondary education.

Unfortunately, the country’s state of basic education is horrific, as evidenced by the low international rankings in UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 62 mathematics and science.

Most of these school leavers become low-level workers employed in the agricultural sector.
Unfortunately, the agricultural and mining sectors are the easiest to mechanise.

It’s happening right now and jobs are being lost at an increasing pace, which is an unfortunate reality.

Fourthly, this brings me to the buzzword currently being used by many Ministers, namely the Fourth Industrial Revolution.

This event is seen as leverage that can enable economic growth in South Africa.
The reality is, however, that this revolution presents one of the most dangerous attacks on human employment in known history.

This event will not only replace basic employment, but will even present a danger to higher-level jobs in the medical, financial and legal industries, amongst others.

This means that we will need to reframe the economic and labour debate completely, going forward, if we want to survive this coming revolution.

Lastly, jobs require investment from local and international sources.
Both are wary of uncertainty, and given the importance of the certainty of property rights for economic growth, expropriation without compensation is the ultimate red UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 63 flag for investment to take flight.

The decimation of jobs starts right at this point, unfortunately.

Afrikaans: Minister, indien hierdie kwessies nie aangespreek word nie, sal die ekonomie nog steeds sy kreeftegang gaan en dinge sal verder agteruitgaan.
Ongelukkig sal werksgeleenthede soos mis voor die son bly verdwyn.

Ek dank u. Mr W M MADISHA: Thank you very much.

Chairperson, throughout Southern Africa organized labour was at the forefront of the struggle for liberation and the fight for socio-economic rights.

And history records that labour has post liberation, held its former liberators to account for their failures.

South African workers are therefore correct when they make demands for the corrections and accountability.
As far back as the RDP White Paper, our government acknowledged that growth and development were interdependent; and that if we were to address the problems of poverty, gross inequality and unemployment our economy would need to be firmly placed on a path of high and sustainable growth.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 64 And to succeed in achieving growth and development and if millions of South Africans were to be afforded an opportunity to find a place in our formal economy government needed an active and co-operative partnership with business and labour.

It was for this reason that Nedlac was established a forum where a commitment to common goals would be turned into collective action and concrete programme.
The mandate of the Department of Labour is to regulate the labour market through policies and programmes developed in consultation with business and labour, like I said.

However, there are a very serious problem that is why the whole has looked at South Africa and has said, - I will give you an example: According to the World Economic Forum’s Global Competitiveness Ranking we have dropped from the 28th highest ranked country to 61st in 2017; which indicates that we are faced with problems.
But even apart from that, we have even gone down from 28th to 82nd according to the World Bank.

That shows very serious problems.

There are a lot of things that one would want to go UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 65 into, but one would want to look into this thing of the living wage.

Chairperson, I want to say that the millions of workers in South Africa don’t enjoy that.
The ANC says that workers must get at least R20, per hour, - well I said the other day that the President of South Africa gets more than R1800, per hour.

That’s the first one.

But secondly you look around the world and you will find very big countries such as China, which has 1, 3 billion people with only 18 Ministers.

You go to America, which is extremely rich with more than 350 million people; but then you compare that to South Africa with only around 53 million, but then you have a rally of Ministers.
We talk about – if you take Ministers and Deputy Ministers you then talk about people who are beyond 71.

Now this is a very serious problem and that money is supposed to go to the workers in particular the workers in the public service.

But even more the workers of the hand all over, that is why – through you Chairperson, Minister I brought here an example.

You see our people eat bread.

How much is this bread?

You say let them get R20, now here this R15.

What are our people going to eat?


UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 66 You go to the rural areas, our people eat pap but then look at what they are eating.

This is R22, and these are major problems that we are faced with.

Therefore, Chairperson as I sit down I want to say the ANC government has failed but we congratulate the workers...

[Interjections.]

… And more must go on and fight.

You have failed.


The Minister of Social Development: Thank you Chairperson.

[Interjections.]

The ACTING CHAIRPERSON: Ms N GINA: Hon members, can we give the Minister a chance she is raising a point of order.

The Minister of Social Development: Chairperson, I would like to rise on a point of order.

The hon Madisha is misleading the House, the bread is not R15.

It is a reflection that he is not buying the bread, he has no family.

It is R10, to R11.
It is R10, to R11.

The ACTING CHAIRPERSON: Ms N GINA: Thank you so much hon Minister.

Let us take it as it was just a point of debate sparking the debate.

Mrs E N NTLANGWINI: Chairperson, the loaf of bread that hon Madisha have shown is in fact R15.

The Minister is constantly UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 67 sending out her PA to buy the bread that’s why she doesn’t how much it cost.

The ACTING CHAIRPERSON: Ms N GINA: Thank you so much hon member.
Ms L N MJOBO: Hon Chairperson, hon Ministers and Deputy Ministers, hon Members of Parliament, distinguished guests, officials of the Department of Labour, ladies and gentlemen, good morning.

Few months ago, our country lost hon Loliwe who was the Chairperson of the Committee on Labour.

Allow me to pass the message of condolences to her family, the ANC and its alliance partners.

We have lost a dedicated female comrade who holds the committee together all the time.

May her soul, rest in peace, Magaba.


An integral part of the negotiations to end apartheid in South Africa was the creation of a new Constitution, which prevent unfair discrimination.

National Legislations were enacted to prevent discrimination.
One of such legislations is Employment UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 68 Equity Act, Number 55 of 1998, which is a tool to achieve equity in the workplace by promoting equal opportunity and fair treatment in employment through elimination of unfair discrimination and implement affirmative action measures to redress the disadvantages in employment experienced by designated groups.
Hon House Chairperson, it is common cause that women are oppressed based on race, gender and class, hence I made reference to the Constitution and the Employment Equity Act in the above passage, it is also to clarify those who claim that they stand for equal opportunities, however, they do not support and implement affirmative action.
The high percentage of low paid and vulnerable workers are women, the ANC call on you Minister of Labour to pay attention to this type of workers by capacitating and recruiting more inspectors.

The truth of the matter is that some employers do not comply with the legislations passed by this House, and they are encouraged not to comply with such legislations by some parties in this House.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 69 It is my submission that resources and energy should be in inspection and enforcement in order to protect vulnerable workers who are women.

Hon House Chairperson, we are aware that Unemployment Insurance Fund is by law charged to provide benefits such as illness, maternity, unemployment and other benefits to millions of contributors when they are out of employment.
It is my request Minister that the Fund in its investment to have programmes that benefit women, I am referring to Labour Activation Programme in this regard.
In conclusion Chairperson, allow me to quote from a leaflet about pass laws distributed by the ANC in Port Elizabeth during the protest marches in the 1950s: It means that no husband can ever be sure any day that his wife is his wife; nor can he be sure that his child may not be taken away from him and sold to farmers under the pretext of failing to comply with the pass regulation.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 70 How can any decent home be built for the proper upbringing of the children?

A man has only to come into any home or to stop a woman on the street and say he is a policeman or detective and the law of the country empowers him to take away that woman and to touch any part of her body as they can do with men under the pretext they are searching for a pass.
Hon Chairperson, the ANC speaks with confidence because it has been at the head of this national effort to change our country for the better.

We know that together with you we can do more.

On behalf of the ANC, we support Budget Vote 28 of the Department of Labour.

This budget will improve the lives of women of South Africa.

Ngiyabonga.

[Applause.]


Ms C DUDLEY: Chairperson, hon Ministers, in considering the Labour Budget the ACDP would just like to highlight three areas of concern: Firstly, it is not clear how far the department is in terms of being ready with regulations and other necessary measures for the implementation of both the new Minimum Wage Bill and the Labour Laws Amendment Bill, which provides for parental and adoption leave.
The excitement generated around these laws has left many people hopeful and UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 71 anxious to be able to benefit.

Secondly, linked to the first concern and that is the realisation that many more people will have no idea about their right in terms of these pieces of legislation and employers will also need to benefit from awareness campaigns.
The ACDP calls upon the department to ensure that awareness campaigns, regulations and other measures necessary to deliver on the provisions of the Bills are planned so that there are no unnecessary delays in implementation once the Minimum Wage Bill and the Labour Laws Amendment Bill are signed into Law.

The ACDP welcomes the progress made with regard to a minimum wage in South Africa although we are troubled by the reality that the minimum wage is not a liveable wage.
We appeal to employers not to regard the minimum wage as a norm - it is only a worst scenario, which none of us should be guilty of.

The ACDP is also encouraged by the support shown for the ACDP’s labour laws amendment which has taken cautious but definite steps in recognising the importance of family and the need for parents to bond with their children and share child UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 72 care responsibilities.
Lastly, the ACDP would like to raise concern about the lack of funds budgeted for labour inspectors, without which workers will be extremely vulnerable to the whims of unethical employers.

Health and safety issues in the mining sector, for example, how many lives could be spared if inspections were being more regularly and thoroughly carried out?
Farmworkers are spread so far and wide, they are unlikely to see labour inspectors very often and this makes an even stronger argument for the need for awareness campaigns to target relevant sectors so that people know their rights and have at least some hope of standing up for themselves where budgets fail to do so.

The ACDP will support the department in all efforts to provide and support workers and families needs in order to be productive and to build a stronger and more prosperous nation.
I thank you.

Mr D AMERICA: Chair, a key driver of poverty, inequality and crime in South Africa is the very large proportion of our people that are unemployed.

Hon Van Schalkwyk, it is a fact that it is because of the ANC that 9,2 million people in South UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 73 Africa today are unable to find work and provide for themselves and their families.

What’s more alarming is that over 50% of those in unemployment are young people.
It is very concerning that once these young people have been in unemployment for a long period of time; it becomes nearly impossible for them to enter the job market.

Research has consistently shown that registered small and medium-term enterprises face high costs of doing business.

These are often, though not exclusively, related to those regulations which constrain growth in output and employment.

It is clear that we need to reduce red tape and provide more exemptions to small businesses.
The Presidential High-Level Report confirms that young unemployed individuals, the disabled, as well as those in rural areas constitute a large share of the unemployed, who have never worked before; yet, a first-time inexperienced employee bears the same cost to the employer as an experienced worker.
The panel recommends that people below a certain age, those that have been unemployed for a long time, people in rural areas and the disabled be employed without the firm being required to pay the minimum wage.

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 74 The panel further recommends in these circumstances the setting of a separate wage in the form of sectorial determination for vulnerable workers in the labour market.
In terms of the Labour Relations Act, small companies in the same bargaining council as large companies are compelled to abide by the terms of collective bargaining agreements.

In practice, what this clause in the Labour Relations Act has done, unintentionally, is to force the terms of an agreement reached by big employers and big unions onto SMMEs.

The result is higher than manageable wages for SMMEs, with negative consequences for economic growth and job creation.
These are recommendations that are supported by the DA.

We further propose that a separate code of good practice for small and medium-term businesses should be adopted.

This will free those businesses from the constraints imposed by the Labour Relations Act and Basic Conditions of Employment Act, BCEA, thus creating opportunities to reduce cost and create more jobs.
The DA is committed to assist young South Africans in finding work by: Firstly, introducing a job seekers’ certificate allowance of R150 per month; secondly, rolling out a national UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 75 Job Centres Project, where unemployed people can access job vacancies, undertake online courses and get assistance in preparing job applications and interviews and receive employment counselling; thirdly, introducing a National Civilian Service to provide work experience for unemployed matriculants; and lastly, to provide incentives to businesses that employ more young people.
Chair, unemployed Capetonians have a reason to smile.

The City of Cape Town allocated R6,6 million in its budget to subsidise free bus rides for unemployed people in the city.

All their trips will be free of charge.

This is specifically aimed at job seekers.

This is another contribution from the DA-run city to create opportunities for the unemployed.

The unemployed deserve a break.

They deserve the dignity that a job will give them.

They need to be heard.


The President needs to walk with the unemployed.

Most of all, they need a new beginning.

The DA is a party for jobs.

We fight for the unemployed.

We fight for those who are marginalised and excluded.

Where we govern, we commit ourselves to bring opportunities to all South Africans.

We shall never desert the unemployed.


All UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 76 South Africans need a new beginning and the DA will provide that new beginning.

I thank you.

[Applause.]

Setswana: Moh M A TONGWANE: Motl Modulasetilo, diTona le Batlatsatona, maloko a a tlotlegang a Ntlotheomolao, baeng ba ba tlotlegang, babogedi le bareetsi kwa gae, madume!
English: Hon Chairperson, I want to talk about the labour market regulatory polemics and the case for a social compact, as the means to deal with the triple challenge of unemployment, poverty and inequality in South Africa.

I want to do this against the backdrop of existing active labour market interventions of the Department of Labour.

Chairperson, similar to many developing countries, South Africa has a large population of youth between the ages 14-35, representing more than 40% of the total population.
Given the youthful nature of the South African population, many of the socioeconomic challenges faced by the nation, such as for example, poverty, inequality, unemployment and poor health, are borne by the youth.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 77 Sociopolitical rights may have been archived, but for the youth, the struggle continues, not against the apartheid state: but against HIV and Aids, alcohol, drug addiction and crime; it continues for jobs, for free education and for economic freedom.

The announcement by the president of convening a job summit provides an opportunity for all of us to rally behind a set of agreed interventions.
The South African labour market is characterised by high levels of unemployment, poverty and inequality in the context of slow economic growth.

The instability of South Africa’s economy lies in the distorted pattern of ownership and economic exclusion created by apartheid policies.

The effects of decades of racial exclusion are still evident in both employment levels and income differentials.
The fault lines of these differentials are principally racially defined but also include skill levels, gender and location.

In South Africa, most low-income households live far from the centres of economic activity.

The costs of searching for and getting to work are high, and information about work is often unavailable or if it is there, it reaches them late.
In this context, labour-market services are extremely UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 78 important, including those that prepare work seekers and match them with opportunities.

The ANC called for government to act to improve the quality of active labour market policies, and create incentives for absorbing the young employed, so that young, unskilled job seekers can gain entry into employment.
The expansion of vocational training, linking the skills development with industrial growth and job creation and expanding support for youth, especially black youth, in accessing and developing skills are also critical to the ANC’s objectives of youth development and fighting unemployment.
The ANC’s 53rd National Conference of 2012 resolved to ensure that our programmes and policies should focus on developing skills that are required by the economy so that the youth can become part of the mainstream economy.

The National Development Plan, NDP, has recommended that one of the ways to pave the way for accelerated economic progress in the context of low growth is breaking the disincentive to hire young, unskilled work seekers by incentivising the employment of young, unskilled work seekers.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 79 All these have been a demonstration of the ANC’s quest to find a results-oriented youth development framework.

Let me remind you that prior to 1994, there was no government institutions focused on youth development in this country, if it was there, then it only catered for some and not the oppressed.

It was only after the ANC was voted into government that youth development became an apex priority of the state.
This has been complemented by strengthening the ability of the Department of Labour’s role to match supply and demand in the labour market.

The department through the Public Employment Services continues to serve as intermediary in the labour market between demand and supply of labour.

The department uses electronic employment registration system, which enables work seekers to register their qualifications, skills and work experience, and also enables employers to register work and learning opportunities.
As we speak, this programme is beginning to give hope to the unemployed through the vocational counselling services provided by the department.
During the past year, 666 719 work seekers were registered on the department’s database, and more than 197 000 were provided with employment counselling and advice by employment counsellors, about 12 517 work seekers UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 80 were placed in employment and more than 74 000 work opportunities were registered.
Persons with disabilities continue to experience discrimination and are least likely to get employment opportunities in the labour market.

The Supported Employment Enterprises, SEEs, receives a transfer from the Public Employment Services Programme, which is aimed at accelerate employment opportunities for persons with disabilities.
However, we are concerned that the transfer to Supported Employment Enterprises, SEEs, was reduced by R8,1 million over the medium-term, as this will have an impact on employment creation for persons with disabilities.

The department has signed Memorandum of Understandings, MOUs, with Technical and Vocational Education and Training, TVET Colleges.
This is done to train Unemployment Insurance Fund, UIF, beneficiaries in order to fast-track their re-entry back into the labour market, enable entrepreneurship and preserve jobs.

In this regard, the UIF aims to target 450 O00 beneficiaries with learning and work place opportunities over the medium- term.
The ANC has shown its commitment to ensure that learners are trained in various skills disciplines, with a special UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 81 focus on those that carry the promise of absorbing the learners on completion of their courses.

Therefore, we do not train for the sake of training, but we target those skills where there is a demand in the economy and where learners have an option of starting their own businesses if they so choose.
As we speak, there are workers who are being trained so that they can be marine pilots and there are those who are being trained to be divers so that they can get job opportunities in places like the harbours and the quay in our country.

Others are being trained in construction industry, doing this in conjunction with the National Skills Development Agency.
As the ANC, we welcome the department’s effort to improve public employment programmes and making sure that they work better even in times of slow economic growth.

This will not only equip the unemployed, especially the youth with skills to survive, but also affording them the opportunity to better their prospects of finding employment.
President Cyril Ramaphosa has, during the state of the Nation Address of 2018, reiterated that: “Young South Africans will be moved to the centre of our economic agenda.” The President UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 82 emphasised the importance of partnership with organised labour, business and community representatives in creating opportunities for young people through internship, apprenticeships, mentorship and entrepreneurship.
We remain committed to doing much more to improve the lives of all South Africans, and to contribute to the advancement of the lives of all South Africans.

Now, hon Bagraim, as expected, pointed a picture of doom and gloom, and gave no solutions to the challenges that the Department of Labour is currently addressing.

All Mr Bagraim has done is to remind us that talk is cheap and that it is not subject to ...

[Interjections.]

Mr D W MACPHERSON: Chairperson, I’m standing on a point of order!
The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr C T Frolick): Hon member, would you just take your seat please?

Mr D W MACPHERSON: Chairperson, is the member prepared to take a question?

UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 83 The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr C T Frolick): Hon member, are you prepared to take a question?

Ms M A TONGWANE: Not at the moment, Chairperson.

The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr C T Frolick): Thank you!


Ms M A TONGWANE: All Mr Bagraim has done is to remind us that talk is cheap and that it is not subject to value added tax, VAT.

It is not suprising that the DA still wants to perpetuate the apartheid low-wage regime that has reproduced the working poor for decades.

Perhaps you need to be reminded that many black workers spent years in prison, suffered state sponsored brutality and others.
Also, they paid the ultimate price for challenging the repressive apartheid labour market policies.

Most workers today, consider the post apartheid labour market dispensation as their revolutionary victory.

Of course, the DA wants more exemptions because they want as most as possible that workers should earn less than R20 per hour.

Shame on you, DA!

They also want new job entrants to earn less than R20 per hour.

I’m still saying, shame on you!

Thank you.


UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 84 The MINISTER OF LABOUR: Hon House Chair, firstly let me thank all the members who supported our budget who made the contribution that will assists us as the Department of Labour.
I just want to say to hon Dudley, of course we are going to have road shows, we have already started through the LP and IR branch and also IS and CCMA has started the road shows in training the members in terms of the legislation that we have.
I know that the IES budget inspection and enforcement has been reduced there were reason that were given by the Treasury to do so and precisely because they did not give us the funding for the tools of trade of the inspectors that that is why we have said to them we need to get more funding in that particular area.

I am happy that the members will assists us in order for the Treasury to increase our budget.
Hon members, particularly the former Comrade Madisha, the World Economic Forum, yes have said we have dropped from 28 to 61 and the World Bank to 82.

May be what we have to look at is what are the reasons for that.
I must say hon members, as the ANC we will never allow a clause in our own laws that will say the employers must hire and fire the workers without giving the reasons and they rather reduced us to those number rather UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 85 than to exploit our workers in this country.

We have suffered before 1994 and we are not going to allow the workers to go back to those dates where we really suffered.
Hon member from FF Plus, I don’t think we have to compare what was happening before 1994 and currently because if you are very aware you must be familiar with what was done previously.

I do believe that you know history probably you forefathers told you how they were doing it.
IsiXhosa: Imisebenzi yayibekelwe abantu abamhlophe, hayi abantu abamnyama English: ... were not even recognised as workers particularly the farm workers and domestic workers even those who were in the mines they were recognised as workers.

Therefore, after 1994 those people were recognised and probably that is why now you are complaining - Let me not say that because one – really like a child ... IsiZulu: ... uma ikhalela ubisi kufanele incele kunina.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 86 English: You forgot that some of you – you look so handsome precisely because of the domestic workers - and the question how are you paying those domestic workers, do you really recognise them as workers or you don’t.
Therefore those are the issues that you have to ... Hon members I am not going to listen to those who always make noise because ... IsiZulu: Isisho sithi ... English: ... an empty can always make noise and therefore I think we have to take care of the members of this House, particularly hon House Chair I think we need to give sometime for the members ... IsiZulu: ... ukuthi sibenzele ingqungquthela ... English: UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 87 ... about the labour laws of this country because it is clear that some of the members do not understand what the laws are saying.
The hon member from EFF, when you are talking about the labour-broking you must also look at Labour Relations Act, section 189 of what is says.

If you don’t understand it we are ready as the department to take you through the Labour Relations Act and the Basic Conditions of Employment Act, including the Employment Equity Act where it talks about the equal pay for the work of the equal value.

There is no need in this country to pay somebody less because it is either that person is a male or female.
It is there in the Employment Equity Act and that is why we have even said we are going to review section 53 of the Employment Equity Act in order to enforce those companies that are not complying with those particular laws so that they will never get the work from the government.
Hon Shaik Emam, the reason why we are able to implement the national minimum wage on 1 May is because the legislation has not been finalised and now it is up to the members of this House and also the members of the NCOP to finalise that legislation and therefore after that the President will promulgate for the implementation of the law.
UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 88 Let me turn to hon Bagraim, hon Bagraim and hon D America, I thought you always were at the portfolio committee but it is clear that even when you attend, you don’t understand what is being presented to the committee.
The reason why I am saying this is you pretend as if you are governing very well here in the Western Cape but you are implementing the EPWP and you take the forms from the Department of Labour to say those who are workseekers, you are going to employ them and you register those people as if you are employing them while you are not doing that.

Therefore, you must be honest with yourself before you are honest with the public.

Secondly you don’t even understand who contributes to the UIF and compensation.
The UIF and Compensation is contributed by the employees and the employers, the money is not taken from the fiscus or from the tax payers, but workers are contributing themselves and also we don’t have the powers to prosecute as the Department of Labour when it comes to the corruption cases that is why we refer those case to the relevant institutions.

Therefore, I just want to tell you hon member that it is very amazing when you in the portfolio committee you don’t say things that you are saying here.
It is worse [Interjections.]

No, no I was there - you even said you love me.

[Laughter.]

[Interjections.]

You don’t have such UNREVISED HANSARD MINI PLENARY SESSION – NATIONAL ASSEMBLY TUESDAY, 15 MAY 2018 PAGE: 89 love.

Therefore Hon members thank you very much for supporting this Budget Vote.

I thank you House Chair.


The HOUSE CHAIRPERSON (Mr C T FROLICK): Hon members, members are reminded that the debate of Trade and Industry will take place at 14:00 in the National Assembly and the Debate on Public Works Budget Vote will take place at 14:00 in the Old Assembly.

Order hon members and the Debate on International Relation and co-operation Budget Vote will also take place at 14:00 in Committee Room E249.

Debate concluded.

The mini-plenary session rose at 12:03.