Source document: https://docs-lawep.s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/1698750188506.pdf (Malaysia)
Jilid IV No.

47 Hari Khamis 29hb Februari, 1968 PERBAHATHAN PARLIMEN DEWAN RA'AYAT YANG KEDUA PENGGAL KEEMPAT PENYATA RASMI KANDONGAN-NYA JAWAPAN2 MULUT BAGI PERTANYAAN2 [Ruangan 6889] RANG UNDANG2: The Banking (Amendment) Bill, 1967 [Ruangan 6898] The Central Bank of Malaysia (Amendment) Bill, 1967 [Ruangan 6947] The Finance Act, 1968 [Ruangan 6949] The Investment Incentives Bill [Ruangan 6958] The Excise (Amendment) (No.
2) Bill [Ruangan 7015] Rang Undang2 Badan Perundangan Sarawak (Peng- gunaan Wang2 Yang Di-pinjam Daripada Persekutuan) [Ruangan 7016] Rang Undang2 Benda2 Radioaktif [Ruangan 7021] The National Land Code (Penang and Malacca Titles) (Amendment) Bill [Ruangan 7024] UCHAPAN PENANGGOHAN: Pilehanraya Umum Negeri Sarawak [Ruangan 7026] DI-CHETAK DI-JABATAN CHETAK KERAJAAN OLEH THOR BENG CHONG, A .

M .
M .

N ., PENCHETAK KERAJAAN KUALA LUMPUR 1969 MALAYSIA DEWAN RA'AYAT YANG KEDUA PENGGAL YANG KEEMPAT Penyata Rasmi Hari Khamis, 29hb Februari, 1968 Persidangan bermula pada pukul 10.00 pagi YANG HADZIR: Yang Berhormat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Y.B.

DATO' CHIK MOHAMED YUSUF BIN SHEIKH ABDUL RAHMAN, S.P.M.P., J.P., Dato' Bendahara, Perak.

Menteri Kewangan, Y.A.B.

TUAN TAN SIEW SIN, S.S.M., J.P. (Melaka Tengah).

Menteri Pengangkutan, Yang Berbahagia TAN SRI SARDON BIN HAJI JUBIR, P.M.N.

(Pontian Utara).
(Pontian Utara).

Menteri Perdagangan dan Perusahaan, DR LIM SWEE AUN, J.P. (Larut Selatan).

Menteri Kerajaan Tempatan dan Perumahan, TUAN KHAW KAI-BOH, PJ.K.

(Ulu Selangor).

Menteri Hal Ehwal Sarawak, Yang Berbahagia TAN SRI TEMENGGONG JUGAH ANAK BARIENG, P.M.N., P.D.K.

(Sarawak).

Menteri Buroh, TUAN V. M ANICKAVASAGAM, J.M.N., P.J.K.

(Kelang).

Menteri Hal Ehwal Tanah dan Galian dan Menteri Ke'adilan, DATO' HAJI ABDUL-RAHMAN BIN YA'KUB (Sarawak).
Menteri Muda Kewangan, DR NG KAM POH, J.P. (Teluk Anson).

Menteri Muda Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri, TUAN HAMZAH BIN DATO' ABU SAMAH (Raub).

Setia-usaha Parlimen kapada Menteri Kesihatan, TUAN IBRAHIM BIN ABDUL RAHMAN, J.M.N.

(Seberang Tengah).

Setia-usaha Parlimen kapada Menteri Buroh, TUAN LEE SAN CHOON, K.M.N.

(Segamat Selatan).

Setia-usaha Parlimen kapada Menteri Kewangan, TUAN A LI BIN HAJI AHMAD (Pontian Selatan).

Setia-usaha Parlimen kapada Timbalan Perdana Menteri, TUAN CHEN WING SUM (Damansara).
NIK ABDUL AZIZ BIN N IK MAT (Kelantan Hilir).

TUAN ABDUL GHANI BIN ISHAK, A.M.N.

(Melaka Utara).

TUAN ABDUL KARIM BIN ABU, A.M.N.

(Melaka Selatan).

WAN ABDUL KADIR BIN ISMAIL, P.P.T.

(Kuala Trengganu Utara).

WAN ABDUL RAHMAN BIN DATU TUANKU BUJANG, A.B.S.

(Sarawak).

6883 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6884 Yang Berhormat DATO' ABDULLAH BIN ABDUL RAHMAN, S.M.T., Dato' Bijaya di-Raja (Kuala Trengganu Selatan).

Y.A.M.

TUNKU ABDULLAH IBNI AL-MARHUM TUANKU ABDUL RAHMAN, P.P.T.

(Rawang).
(Rawang).

TUAN HAJI ABDULLAH BIN HAJI MOHD.

SALLEH, A.M.N., S.MJ., P.I.S.

(Segamat Utara).

TUAN HAJI A BU BAKAR BIN HAMZAH, J.P. (Bachok).

TUAN AHMAD BIN ARSHAD, A.M.N.

(Muar Utara).

TUAN HAJI AHMAD BIN SA'AID, J.P. (Seberang Utara).

TUAN RAFAEL ANCHETA, A.M.N.

(Sabah).

TUAN CHAN CHONG WEN, A.M.N.

(Kluang Selatan).

TUAN CHAN SEONG YOON (Setapak).

TUAN CHAN SIANG SUN, P.J.K., (Bentong).

TUAN CHEW BIOW CHUON, J.P. (Bruas).

TUAN CHIN FOON (Ulu Kinta).


TUAN D. A. DAGO ANAK RANDAN alias DAGOK ANAK RANDEN, A.M.N.

(Sarawak).

TUAN C V. DEVAN NAIR (Bungsar).

TUAN EDWIN ANAK TANGKUN (Sarawak).

TUAN SYED E SA BIN ALWEE, J.M.N., S.MJ., P.I.S.

(Batu Pahat Dalam).

DATIN HAJJAH FATIMAH BINTI HAJI ABDUL MAJID (Johor Bahru Timor).

TUAN GANING BIN JANGKAT (Sabah).

TUAN GEH CHONG KEAT, K.M.N.

(Penang Utara).

TUAN HAJI HAMZAH BIN ALANG, A.M.N., P J .

K. (Kapar).

TUAN HANAFI BIN MOHD.

YUNUS, A.M.N., J.P. (Kulim Utara).


TUAN HARUN BIN ABDULLAH, A.M.N., J.P. (Baling).

WAN HASSAN BIN WAN DAUD (Tumpat).

DATO' HAJI HUSSEIN BIN MOHD.

NOORDIN, D.P.M.P., A.M.N., P.J.K.

(Parit).

TUAN HUSSEIN BIN SULAIMAN (Ulu Kelantan).

TUAN HAJI HUSSAIN RAHIMI BIN HAJI SAMAN, S.M.K.

(Kota Bahru Hulu).

Yang Amat Berbahagia TUN DR ISMAIL BIN DATO' HAJI ABDUL RAHMAN, S.S.M., P.M.N.

(Johor Timor).

Yang Berhormat TUAN ISMAIL BIN IDRIS (Penang Selatan).

PENGHULU JINGGUT ANAK ATTAN, K.M.N., Q.M.C, A.B.S.


(Sarawak).

TUAN KADAM ANAK KIAI (Sarawak).

TUAN KAM WOON WAH, J.P. (Sitiawan).

TUAN THOMAS KANA (Sarawak).

TUAN LEE SECK FUN, K.M.N.

(Tanjong Malim).

DR LIM CHONG EU (Tanjong).

6885 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6886 Yang Berhormat TUAN LIM P'EE HUNG, P.J.K.

(Alor Starl DR MAHATHIR BIN MOHAMAD (Kota Star Selatan).

TUAN T. MAHIMA SINGH, J.M.N., J.P. (Port Dickson).

DATO' DR HAJI MEGAT KHAS, D.P.M.P., J.P., P.J.K.

(Kuala Kangsar).

TUAN MOHD.


DAUD BIN ABDUL SAMAD (Besut).

TUAN MOHAMED IDRIS BIN MATSIL, J.M.N., P.J.K., J.P. (Jelebu-Jempol).

TUAN MOHD.

TAHIR BIN ABDUL MAJID, S.M.S., P.J.K.

(Kuala Langat).

TUAN HAJI MOHAMED YUSOF BIN MAHMUD, A.M.N.

(Temerloh).

TUAN MOHD.

ZAHIR BIN HAH ISMAIL, J.M.N.

(Sungei Patani).

WAN MOKHTAR BIN AHMAD (Kemaman).

TUAN HAJI MOKHTAR BIN HAJI ISMAIL (Perlis Selatan).

TUAN MUHAMMAD FAKHRUDDIN BIN HAJI ABDULLAH (Pasir Mas Hilir).

TUAN HAJI MUHAMMAD SU'AUT BIN HAJI MUHD.


TAHIR, A.B.S.

(Sarawak).

DATO' HAJI MUSTAPHA BIN HAJI ABDUL JABAR, D.P.M.S., A.M.N., J.P. (Sabak Bernam).

TUAN MUSTAPHA BIN AHMAD (Tanah Merah).

TUAN NG FAH YAM (Batu Gajah).

TUAN OTHMAN BIN ABDULLAH, A.M.N.

(Perlis Utara).

TUAN QUEK KAI DONG, J.P. (Seremban Timor).

TUAN RAMLI BIN OMAR (Krian Darat).

TUAN HAJI REDZA BIN HAJI MOHD.

SAID, PJ.K., J.P. (Rembau-Tampin).


RAJA ROME BIN RAJA MA'AMOR, P.J.K., J.P. (Kuala Selangor) TUAN SEAH TENG NGIAB, S.M.J., P.I.S.

(Muar Pantai).

TUAN SIM BOON LIANG, A.B.S.

(Sarawak).

TUAN SIOW LOONG H I N, P.J.K.

(Seremban Barat).

TUAN SENAWI BIN ISMAIL, P.J.K.

(Seberang Selatan).

TUAN SDH AH TECK (Batu Pahat).

TUAN HAJI SULEIMAN BIN A LI (Dungun).

TUAN SULEIMAN BIN HAH TAIB (Krian Laut).

TUAN TAJUDDIN BIN A L I, P J .

K. (Larut Utara).

TUAN TAI KUAN YANG, A.M.N.

(Kulim-Bandar Bharu).


TUAN TAMA WENG TINGGANG WAN (Sarawak).

DR TAN CHEE KHOON (Batu).

TuAN TAN CHENG BEE, A.M.N., J.P. (Bagan).

TUAN TAN TOH HONG (Bukit Bintang).

TUAN TIAH ENG BEE (Kluang Utara).

TENGKU ZAID BIN TENGKU AHMAD (Pasir Mas Hulu).

6887 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6888 YANG TIADA HADHIR: Yang Berhormat Perdana Menteri dan Menterr Hal Ehwal Luar Negeri, Y.T.M.

TUNKU ABDUL RAHMAN PUTRA AL-HAJ, K.O.M.

(Kuala Kedah).
(Kuala Kedah).

Timbalan Perdana Menteri, Menteri Pertahanan, Menteri Hal Ehwal Dalam Negeri dan Menteri Pembangunan Negara dan Luar Bandar, Y.A.B.

TUAN HAJI ABDUL RAZAK BIN DATO' HUSSAIN, S.M.N.

(Pekan).

Menteri Kerja Raya, Pos dan Talikom, Y.A.B.

TUN V. T. SAMBANTHAN, S.S.M., P.M.N.

(Sungai Siput).

Menteri Pelajaran, TUAN MOHAMED KHIR JOHARI (Kedah Tengah).

Menteri Kesihatan, TUAN BAHAMAN BIN SHAMSUDIN (Kuala Pilah).
Menteri Kebajikan A m, TUAN HAJI ABDUL HAMID KHAN BIN HAJI SAKHAWAT A LI KHAN, J.M.N., J.P. (Batang Padang).

Menteri Penerangan dan Penyiaran dan Menteri Kebudayaan, Belia dan Sokan, TUAN SENU BIN ABDUL RAHMAN (Kubang Pasu Barat).

Menteri Pertanian dan Sharikat Kerjasama, TUAN HAJI MOHD.

GHAZALI BIN HAJI JAWI (Ulu Perak).

Menteri Muda Ta' Berjabatan, TUAN HAJI ABDUL KHALID BIN AWANG OSMAN (Kota Star Utara).
Menteri Muda Kebudayaan, Belia dan Sokan, ENGKU MUHSEIN BIN ABDUL KADIR, T.M.N., D.P.M.T., P.J.K.

(Trengganu Tengah).

Menteri Muda Pelajaran, TUAN LEE SIOK YEW, AM.N., P.J.K.

(Sepang).

TUAN ABDUL RAHMAN BIN HAJI TALIB, P.J.K.

(Kuantan).

TUAN HAJI ABDUL RASHID BIN HAJI JAIS (Sabah).

TUAN ABDUL RAZAK BIN HAJI HUSSIN (Lipis).

TUAN ABDUL TAIB BIN MAHMUD (Sarawak).

PUAN AJIBAH BINTI ABOL (Sarawak).

WAN ALWI BIN TUANKU IBRAHIM (Sarawak).

DR AWANG BIN HASSAN, S.M.J.

(Muar Selatan).


TUAN AZIZ BIN ISHAK (Muar Dalam).

TUAN JONATHAN BANGAU ANAK RENANG, A.B.S.

(Sarawak).

PENGARAH BANYANG ANAK JANTING, P.B.S.

(Sarawak).

TUAN CHIA CHIN SHIN, A.B.S.

(Sarawak).

TUAN FRANCIS CHIA NYUK TONG (Sabah).

Yang Berhahagia TAN SRI FATIMAH BINTI HAJI HASHIM, P.M.N.

(Jitra-Padang Terap).

Yang Berhormat TUAN S. FAZUL RAHMAN, A.D.K.

(Sabah).

DATO' GANIE GILONG, P.D.K., J.P. (Sabah).

TUAN HANAFIAH BIN HUSSAIN, A.M.N.

(Jerai).


TUAN STANLEY HO NGUN KHIU, A.D.K.

(Sabah).

Yang Berbahagia TAN SRI SYED JA'AFAR BIN HASAN ALBAR, P.M.N.

(Johor Tenggara).

6889 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6890 Yang Berhormat TUAN KHOO PENG LOONG (Sarawak).

TUAN EDMUND LANGGU ANAK SAGA (Sarawak).

TUAN AMADEUS MATHEW LEONG, A.D.K., J.P. (Sabah).

TUAN LIM KEAN SIEW (Dato Kramat).

DATO' LING BENG SIEW, P.N.B.S.

(Sarawak).

TUAN PETER LO SU Y IN (Sabah).

TUAN C. JOHN ONDU MAJAKIL (Sabah).


TUAN JOSEPH DAVID MANJAJI (Sabah).

TUAN MOHD.

ARIF SALLEH, A.D.K.

(Sabah).

DATO' MOHAMED ASRI BIN HAJI MUDA, S.P.M.K.

(Pasir Puteh).

ORANG TUA MOHAMMAD DARA BIN LANGPAD (Sabah).

Yang Amat Berbahagia TUN DATU MUSTAPHA BIN DATU HARUN, S.M.N., P.D.K.

(Sabah).

Yang Berbahagia TAN SRI N IK AHMAD KAMIL, D.K., S.P.M.K., S.J.M.K., P.M.N., P.Y.G.P., Dato' Sri Setia Raja (Kota Bharu Hilir).

Yang Berhormat TUAN ONG KEE H UI (Sarawak).


TUAN HAJI OTHMAN BIN ABDULLAH (Hilir Perak).

TUAN HAJI RAHMAT BIN HAJI DAUD, A.M.N.

(Johor Bahru Barat).

TUAN D. R. SEENIVASAGAM (Ipoh).

DATO' S. P. SEENIVASAGAM, D.P.M.P., P.M.P., J.P. (Menglembu).

TUAN SNG CHIN JOO (Sarawak).

TUAN SULAIMAN BIN BULON, P.J.K.

(Bagan Datoh), PENGIRAN TAHIR PETRA (Sabah).

TUAN TAN KEE GAK (Bandar Melaka).

TUAN TAN TSAK YU (Sarawak).

TUAN TOH THEAM HOCK (Kampar).

TUAN YEH PAO TZE, A.M.N.

(Sabah).


TUAN STEPHEN YONG KUET TZE (Sarawak).

TUAN HAJI ZAKARIA BIN HAJI MOHD.

TAIB, P.J.K.

(Langat).

DO'A kan kelayakan, umor, pengalaman, taraf kera'ayatan dan gaji mereka.

(Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusi- kan Meshuarat) JAWAPAN2 MULUT BAGI PERTANYAAN2 LEMBAGA KEMAJUAN PERUSA- HAAN PERSEKUTUAN—SENARAI KAKI-TANGAN KERJA 1.
Tengku Zaid bin Tengku Ahmad (Pasir Mas Hulu) minta kapada Men- teri Perdagangan dan Perusahaan mem- beri satu senarai penoh Kakitangan Kerja dalam Lembaga Kemajuan Per usahaan Persekutuan dengan menyata- Menteri Perdagangan dan Perusahaan (Dr Lim Swee Aun): Tuan Yang di- Pertua, jumlah kakitangan kerja, ia-itu Executive Staff di-Lembaga Kemajuan Perusahaan Persekutuan ia-lah 25 orang pegawai.
Dua daripada mereka Penga- rah dan Penolong kapada Pengarah ada-lah bangsa asing yang lain-nya warganegara Malaysia.

21 orang pega wai mempunyai kelulusan universiti, sa-orang pegawai M.C.S.

bersara, sa- orang Persekolahan Tinggi, sa-orang pegawai Sijil Sekolah Seberang Laut, sa-orang pegawai kelu lusan sekolah menengah.
pegawai Sijil 6891 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6892 Tiga orang pegawai telah bekerja dengan Kerajaan dan atau perusahaan lebeh daripada 15 tahun, 17 orang pegawai telah bekerja dengan Kerajaan, dan atau perusahaan di-antara 5 sam- pai 10 tahun, 5 orang pegawai telah bekerja dengan Kerajaan atau perusa haan kurang dari 5 tahun.
15 orang pegawai berumor di-antara 20 sampai 30 tahun, 7 orang pegawai berumor di-antara 30 sampai 40 tahun, 2 orang pegawai berumor di-antara 40 sampai 50 tahun, sa-orang pegawai berumor lebeh daripada 50 tahun.

penoh Kakitangan bukan Kakitangan Kerja dalam Lembaga Kemajuan Per usahaan Persekutuan menurut kaum.
Dr Lim Swee Aun: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, jumlah kakitangan dalam Lembaga Kemajuan Perusahaan Per sekutuan yang bukan kakitangan kerja, non-executive staff, ia-lah 32 orang, semua-nya warganegara Malaysia.

Mereka terdiri daripada pegawai kerani 11, penterjemah 1, Jurutrengkas 9, jurutaip 6, operator talipon 1, pemandu 1, pelayan pejabat 3.

Tangga-gaji ia-lah daripada $532 sampai $5,000 sa-bulan.

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah (Bachok): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, siapa- kah yang mendapat gaji $5,000 sa- bulan itu?
Dr Lim Swee Aun: Ini ia-lah di- bayar kapada Director, sa-orang pakar yang datang daripada luar negeri.

Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dapat-kah di-beri faham lagi sa-kali, ia-itu saya bertanya pegawai apa-kah yang mendapat $5,000 tangga-gaji, ada pun gaji mengikut expert yang kita minta daripada luar negeri itu barangkali kita boleh beri lebeh, tetapi pegawai-nya.

Dr Lim Swee Aun: Ini expert pegawai juga, ini sa-orang yang men dapat $5,000.
Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah: Jadi, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, ada-kah pegawai ini mendapat gaji yang paling tinggi sa-kali di-Malaysia mengikut tangga-gaji atau pun ada lagi pegawai yang gaji-nya $5,000 lebeh di-Malaysia.

Dr Lim Swee Aun: Ada yang lebeh juga.

LEMBAGA KEMAJUAN PERUSA HAAN PERSEKUTUAN-SENARAI KAKITANGAN BUKAN KAKI TANGAN KERJA 2.

Tengku Zaid bin Tengku Ahmad minta kapada Menteri Perdagangan dan Perusahaan memberi satu senarai M.LD.FX.—SENARAI KAKI TANGAN KERJA 3.
Tengku Zaid bin Tengku Ahmad minta kapada Menteri Perdagangan dan Perusahaan memberi satu senarai penoh Kakitangan Kerja dalam M.I.D.F.L.

dengan menyatakan kela- yakan, umor, pengalaman taraf kera- 'ayatan dan gaji mereka.

Dr Lim Swee Aun: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Sharikat Permodalan Kema juan Perusahaan Malaysia Berhad ada- 'awam yang lah sa-buah sharikat berhad sunggoh pun Kerajaan telah membeli sa-banyak 10,000 saham.
Tidak lazim-nya bagi sharikat 'awam yang berhad yang sa-umpama ini mengumumkan matalamat2 sulit menge- nai kelayakan, pengalaman dan gaji pegawai2 kerja yang penting di-dalam sharikat-nya.

Saya perchaya Ahli Yang Berhormat akan faham ada-lah tidak menjadi kebaikan kapada sharikat itu matalamat2 saperti ini di-umumkan.

Walau bagaimana pun suka saya me nyatakan bahawa daripada 27 orang pegawai kerja atau pegawai profes sional, 24 orang ia-lah warganegara Malaysia.
PENYIASATAN SUROHANJAYA MAJLIS BANDAR RAYA PER- BANDARAN BANDAR DAN MAJLIS TEMPATAN—HASIL 4.
Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad (Muar Utara) bertanya kapada Menteri Kera jaan Tempatan dan Perumahan: (a) apa-kah hasil penyiasatan Su- rohanjaya Majlis Bandar Raya, dan Perbandaran, Bandaran, 6893 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6894 Majlis Tempatan dan bila kertas puteh mengenal-nya akan di- keluarkan; (b) ada-kah benar bahawa pilehan2 tersebut akan di- raya majlis2 adakan pada tahun ini; jumlah majlis2 tersebut (c) berapa yang telah di-ambil aleh oleh Kerajaan2 Negeri dan nyatakan sebab2-nya.
Menteri Kerajaan Tempatan dan Perumahan (Tuan Khaw Kai-Boh): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Surohanjaya Penyiasat di-Raja bagi menyiasat per- jalanan Penguasa2 Tempatan, sa-bagai- mana yang di-fahamkan, ada-lah di- perengkat yang terakhir sekarang dalam usaha mereka bagi menyediakan lapo- ran yang di-jangkakan akan mengemu- lagi itu kakan tidak selesai kelak.
Oleh kerana apabila Surohanjaya itu sa-buah badan yang bebas, maka tidak-lah wajar-nya bagi saya, atau pun pehak2 Kerajaan mem- beri sa-barang arahan kapada-nya.

laporan lama Berkenaan dengan soalan yang ke dua, sa-bagaimana yang telah saya nyatakan tidak kurang dua kali dalam Dewan ini soal mengenai mengadakan pilehanraya bagi Penguasa2 Tempatan itu hanya dapat di-putuskan sa-lepas sahaja penyata Surohanjaya di-Raja itu di-umumkan.
Soalan yang ketiga, Penguasa2 Tem patan yang telah di-ambil aleh kuasa pentadbiran-nya oleh Kerajaan2 Negeri ada-lah saperti berikut: Yang pertama Majlis Bandaran Seremban yang mana sa-buah Su rohanjaya penyiasat yang di-bentok untok-nya telah di-dapati ada berlaku salah tadbir dan amalan churang yang di-lakukan oleh Ahli2 Majlis Meshuarat.
Yang kedua Majlis Bandar Raya George Town yang mana sa-buah Surohanjaya penyiasat yang di-bentok untok-nya telah mendapati ada ber laku perbuatan2 salah tadbir, amalan churang serta melanggar undang2 telah di-lakukan oleh Ahli2 yang dan pegawai2 Majlis Meshuarat Majlis Bandar Raya ini.

Yang ketiga Majlis Bandaran Johor Bharu kerana terdapat tudohan2 salah tadbir dan amalan churang di-dalam Majlis itu.
tugas2 dan Yang keempat Majlis Perbandaran Melaka dan Majlis Bandaran Batu Pahat di-sebabkan kedudokan ke- lemah, maka kedua2 wangan-nya Penguasa2 Tempatan ini tidak dapat tanggong- menjalankan jawab2-nya dengan sa-penoh lagi.

Dalam kedua2 perkara ini Kerajaan Negeri tidak mempunyai jalan2 yang lain lagi hanya mengambil aleh kuasa pentadbiran-nya.

Jika tidak berbuat demikian maka perkhidmatan2 yang mustahak akan terganggu dan akibat- nya pembayar2 chukai akan men derita.
Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad: Soalan tambahan, bagi jawapan (c) tadi ada- kah Kementerian ini berchadang hen- dak menyerahkan masaalah tersebut kapada Badan Penchegah Rasuah un- tok melichinkan masaalah amalan churang kewangan itu.

Tuan Khaw Kai-Boh: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, berkenaan soalan ini, Ke menterian akan menunggu laporan daripada Surohanjaya Penyi asat Penguasa2 Tempatan.
saya ini sudah tugas-nya, Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, jika saya tidak lama silap, Surohanjaya sangat menjalankan tetapi belum lagi menerbitkan laporan.

Ada- kah di-masa Kerajaan menyerahkan penyiasatan ini di-masokkan sama time factor di-dalam Terms of Reference kapada ini?

Kalau tidak, 10 tahun lagi pun dia tidak siapkan.

Tuan Khaw Kai-Boh: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Ahli Yang Berhormat ada salah faham berkenaan dengan perkara ini.

Ini satu perkara yang mustahak.


Laporan ini, sa-bagaimana yang saya telah terangkan tadi bahawa badan ini satu badan yang bebas, dan Kemen terian saya tidak boleh beri arahan2 bila laporan ini di-siapkan, tetapi saya mendapat tahu di-dalam satu dua bulan ini laporan ini boleh di-siapkan.
Yang Teramat Mulia Perdana Menteri telah berjanji di-dalam Meshuarat ini, ia-itu 6895 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6896 di-dalam satu dua hari ini hendak mengadakan satu meshuarat dengan Ahli2 dari Parti Pembangkang dan lain2 berkenaan dengan soal ini-lah.

Di- dalam meshuarat itu Ahli Yang Ber- hormat boleh buat pertanyaan2 berke naan dengan soal ini.
Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dari segi asas undang2 di-ketika Badan Penyiasat Bebas ini menjalankan tugas-nya dan belum lagi memberi laporan apa-kah kita boleh membuat satu2 meshuarat di-atas perkara itu?

Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Dia tidak kata belum lagi; barangkali sudah habis laporan itu di-beri baharu-lah meshu arat ini di-panggil.
Tempatan tidak boleh menjalankan ranchangan2-nya dalam Majlis itu dan menjalankan tugas2, mesti-lah Kerajaan Negeri mengambil tindakan dan menu- tupkan Majlis itu dan di-jalankan pentadbiran-nya sa-hingga sampai satu masa boleh di-buat satu laporan bagai- mana kita boleh selesaikan soalan ini, perkara yang susah di-dalam Majlis Tempatan itu mengikut keadaan2 tem- pat itu.
Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, bila mana Kerajaan Negeri hendak mengambil aleh Majlis2 Tempatan yang terlibat dalam masa- alah yang tersebut, dan ada-kah Kera jaan Negeri itu membuat perundingan dengan Kerajaan Pusat, khas-nya Ke menterian ini?
Wan Abdul Kadir bin Ismail (Kuala Trengganu Utara): Tuan Yang di- Pertua, ada-kah pehak Kementerian menimbangkan untok Kerajaan Negeri mengambil aleh Majlis Bandaran Taiping, kerana sa-panjang yang saya tahu pentadbiran Majlis Bandaran Taiping selalu kelam kabut di-antara pehak yang menguasai Majlis itu ia-itu Ahli2 bebas dan U.D.P.
di-dalam Tuan Khaw Kai-Boh: Tuan Yang Perlembagaan di-Pertua, negeri kita, kita ada satu Article 95 (A) dan di-bawah Article itu perkara ini ada berkenaan dengan faedah2 ra'ayat Kerajaan Pusat dan Kerajaan Negeri mesti mengambil tanggong-jawab juga; sebab itu-lah perkara ini ada juga di- rundingkan dengan Kerajaan Negeri oleh Kerajaan Pusat.

ini Tuan Khaw Kai-Boh: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, berkenaan soalan itu juga badan telah pereksa berkenaan dengan hal2 di-dalam Majlis Tempatan ini.
Soalan ini juga hendak-lah me- nunggu laporan dari badan ini.

Sa- lepas itu, Kementerian boleh mengambil tindakan berkenaan perkara ini.

ini, jika satu2 Majlis Tuan Haji Abu Bakar bin Hamzah: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, ada-kah tersebut di-dalam undang2 tuboh Majlis Per- bandaran itu lemah dalam kewangan-nya maka Kera jaan Negeri boleh mengambil aleh, atau pun sa-mata2 ini sa-bagai satu perkara yang di-lakukan oleh kebijak- sanaan negeri itu sendiri?
di-bawah Tuan Khaw Kai-Boh: Tuan Yang Perlembagaan di-Pertua, negeri kita, perkara ini ada di-bawah perentah Kerajaan Negeri sebab itu Kerajaan ini hendak ambil tanggong- jawab berkenaan hal ini dan juga men- jaga faedah2 ra'ayat di-dalam negeri itu, sebab itu-lah apabila satu Majlis BANTUAN DALAM PENTADBI RAN RANCHANGAN DI-BAWAH LEMBAGA KEMAJUAN TANAH PERSEKUTUAN 5.
Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad bertanya kapada Menteri Kerajaan Tempatan dan Perumahan: (a) ada-kah Kementerian beliau mem- bantu dalam pentadbiran ran- changan perumahan di-bawah Lembaga Kemajuan Tanah Per- sekutuan dan jika tidak, kenapa; (b) sa-takat ini, ada-kah apa2 perun telah di-jalankan dingan yang oleh Kementerian beliau dengan Kementerian Pembangunan Ne- gara dan Luar Bandar tentang perkara ini.
Tuan Khaw Kai-Boh: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Kementerian ini tidak meno- long, atau pun membantu dalam pen tadbiran ranchangan2 perumahan yang di-bena oleh Lembaga Kemajuan Tanah Persekutuan (F.L.D.A.)

sunggoh 6897 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6898 pun Kementerian ini sa-bagaimana terma'alum dari nama-nya, sentiasa bersedia untok berunding mengenai mana2 aspek course dan teknik peru mahan.

Lembaga Kemajuan Tanah Persekutuan atau pun F.L.D.A.
ia-lah sa-buah Badan berkanun yang di- amanahkan dengan tanggong-jawab mengadakan serta menguruskan Ran- changan2 Kemajuan Tanah untok ra'ayat dan matlamat utama-nya ia-lah Kemajuan Tanah dan bukan-lah Kema juan Perumahan.
Oleh kerana Kema juan Tanah ada-lah meliputi seluroh bidang kegiatan2, termasok juga pem- bukaan tanah baharu, penanaman getah, kelapa sawit dan lain2 dan juga penyediaan rumah2, bekalan ayer serta kemudahan2 lain untok pendudok, kon- tek dalam mana2 perkara perumahan di-jalankan oleh Lembaga Kemajuan Tanah Persekutuan, atau F.L.D.A.

ber- lainan daripada yang di-buat oleh Kementerian ini, yang menumpukan usaha-nya buat sementara waktu, pada perumahan harga murah untok gu- longan berpendapatan kechil.
Dengan pendek kata, projek2 perumahan yang di-ranchangkan oleh Lembaga Kema juan Tanah Persekutuan, atau F.L.D.A., ada-lah menjadi sa-bahagian yang sa- bati dengan ranchangan2 kemajuan tanah-nya, dan oleh ini Lembaga Kemajuan Tanah Persekutuan-lah yang paling mengetahui bagaimana hendak melaksanakan serta menguruskan ran bersama2 changan2 perumahan-nya dengan tugas2-nya yang lain.
Berkenaan soalan yang kedua semua Kementerian bekerja rapat dan saling berunding antara satu sama lain, di- bawah Kerajaan Pusat Perikatan, dan saperti saya telah nyatakan tadi, Ke menterian ini juga sa-bagaimana ter ma'alum dari nama-nya, sentiasa ber sedia menyumbangkan nasihat dan bantuan jikalau dan apabila di-minta, berthabitan dengan perumahan.
sa-perlu-nya, Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dalam soal rumah murah, saya ingin membuat soalan tambahan sa-bagaimana pengumuman yang di-buat oleh Yang Berhormat Menteri yang berkenaan ini bahawa rumah murah sekarang telah keku- rangan wang.

Jadi dengan kekurangan wang ini, apa-kah langkah mengatasi untok dapatkan wang dan daripada sumber mana-kah wang itu di-dapati.
Tuan Khaw Kai-Boh: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sampai masa sekarang esti mate2 berkenaan dengan ranchangan rumah murah kita dapati dari Kemen terian Kewangan tetapi Kementerian saya ada-lah menchari mana2 jalan di- dalam negeri2 luar, boleh dapat wang pinjaman dan lain2 untok melaksanakan bagi ranchangan2 rumah murah, oleh kerana di-dalam estimate tahunan ini sa-belum ada chukup bagi ranchangan2 rumah murah, ada di-dalam masa dua tiga minggu negeri kita ada minta orang2 yang pandai, expert berkenaan hal2 ini.
Tujuan kita tengok macham mana kita boleh dapat dasar yang baharu atau jalan yang baharu, boleh dapat wang lebeh untok ranchangan2 rumah murah.

RANG UNDANG2 THE BANKING (AMENDMENT) BILL, 1967 Bachaan Kali Yang Kedua dan Ketiga Menteri Kewangan (Tuan Tan Siew Sin) (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that a Bill intituled "An Act to amend the Banking Ordinance, 1958" be read a second time.
It has become apparent to both the Treasury and Bank Negara Malaysia that a number of amendments to the Banking Ordinance, 1958, are called for in the light of the experience gained in implementing this particular law during the last nine years.
The opera tions of a few banks recently have also pointed to the need to strengthen the legislative framework within which licensed banks operate in Malaysia and the proposed amendments are designed to enable Bank Negara to tighten its supervision and control over such banks.

I shall also be presenting sepa rately to this House a number of amendments to the Central Bank of Malaysia Ordinance, 1958, for a similar purpose.
The underlying reasons for the pro to the Banking posed amendments 6899 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6900 Ordinance are set out in the explanatory statement.

However, as Honourable Members may be aware, the Associa tion of Banks in Malaysia has since made representations on them.

I have carefully considered these representa tions and will deal in detail with the more important of them.
in respect of a Clause 2 of the Bill is designed to ensure that the original intention of the capital requirement provisions of the foreign bank law operating in Malaysia is fulfilled.
Such a bank is required to bring in funds of at least $2 million, but because of the present wording of the relevant provisions in the law, it is possible for a foreign bank to utilise its deposits or its borrowings in Malaysia for invest ment in approved assets of a value of at least $2 million in this country and remit back the original $2 milion to its head office.
The capital requirement provisions relating to such banks are now to be changed to require them to hold net assets in Malaysia, instead of approved assets, in order to ensure that these banks not only bring in a mini mum amount of foreign capital into this country but retain it here.

is the bank, Clause 4 is designed to meet the situation created by those domestic banks which appoint business advisers, who are neither directors nor emplo yees of such banks.
It cannot be denied that the business adviser has a certain amount of influence in the bank and, for all practical purposes, fully identified with it.

As such a business adviser, however, is neither a director the nor an employee of various provisions of the Banking Ordi nance restricting loans and advances to directors and employees do not apply to him.

A similar doubt exists as to whether a comprador employed by a foreign bank is an employee of that bank.
It is necessary, therefore, that the provisions restricting loans and advan ces to employees of banks should be extended to cover the business adviser and the comprador, as well as other persons appointed by a bank to per form similar functions by whatever name called.

The amendments proposed the Bill are meant, in clause 4 of therefore, to extend the restrictions on loans and advances to employees of banks to cover such persons as well.
I should add that in reply to a query the Association of Banks raised by the Attorney-General's in Malaysia, Department has confirmed the proposed amendments would not cover professional persons solicitors, auditors and doctors, whose services may be retained by banks.

that like for their interest own banks Clause 5 deals with a very important problem that has arisen in recent years as a result of directors using the names of nominees to borrow money from their themselves.
Although a provision exists in section 131 of the Companies Act, 1965, which requires directors of all companies, including banks, to make disclosures of in connection with contracts with companies in which they are directors, it is considered necessary to introduce a specific disclosure clause in connection with advances the Banking Ordinance itself and to provide for a heavier penalty in the event of non-disclosure.
Clause 5 is designed to meet this need and will make it manda tory for bank directors to disclose to their boards of directors their interest in loans and advances made by their banks.

in to in regard Clause 6 is designed to meet another situation that has arisen over the last loans and few years advances, both secured and unsecured, given by banks to their directors and to firms and companies in which such directors have an interest.
It is essential that banks should be required to report to Bank Negara not only unsecured loans and advances to companies in which bank directors have an interest, but secured advances as well.

The existing provisions in the law require the reporting of unsecured loans and advances only, and there have been occasions where loans and advances which were only partially secured were not reported.
The proposed amend ments the Ordinance will now require banks to report to Bank Negara all loans and advances to certain cate gories of persons and organisations.

As a result of the representations of the Association of Banks in Malaysia, I to 6901 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6902 intend to move a minor amendment during the Committee stage to include a provision for appeal to the Minister against any orders issued by Bank Negara Malaysia in the exercise of the powers granted to it under this clause.
investing the funds of It is also considered necessary that there should be some control over banks their shareholders in other companies.

The Association of Banks, however, in its representations has claimed that there should be no restriction on the use by banks of their shareholders' funds for investment in shares, and that clause 7 of the Bill would fetter the banks in carrying on a branch of their legitimate business.

I cannot accept this conten tion.


Carried to its logical conclusion, the Association's contention that there should be no restriction on the use by banks of their shareholders' funds for investment would mean that the banks should be permitted to conduct their business without any share capital of their own and be entirely dependent on their banking depositors' business.

I would regard such a conten tion as thoroughly irresponsible.
funds for in fact, should When a group of people get together and subscribe capital towards the estab lishment of a bank whose business is to collect deposits from the public, the shareholders, regard themselves as trustees of such public funds.

That being so, their paramount responsibility is the safety of deposits held in trust for depositors, committing their shareholders' own funds as a guarantee for the proper discharge of that responsibility.
Banks sometimes losses and shareholders' funds incur should be used to make good such losses.

This must be the fundamental approach to the business of banking which is so unlike any other type of business enterprise in which only its own shareholders' funds are involved.

In other words, the directors of an ordinary business enterprise take risks with the funds of their own share holders, whereas bank directors can take risks with the funds of the public.
I do not have to make the point that one of the most delightful things in the world is to gamble with somebody else's money.

If you win, you gain correspondingly.

If you lose, you do not suffer, because you have only lost some body else's money.

Under such circums tances, it is imperative that the laws governing the conduct of banking business must be far stricter than that governing the conduct of any other kind of business.
Moreover, the experience of Bank Negara over the years has underlined the need to control the type and extent of a bank's investment in other com panies and to ensure that a bank's capital is used primarily to strengthen its structure and organisation.

I would like to give a few examples of the practices of some banks: one bank invested a very substantial proportion of its share capital in the shares of trading and other companies.
Another bank which agreed to increase its paid- in up capital, which was insufficient relation to its network of branches and deposits, utilised practically the whole of this increase in capital in buying the shares of another company abroad.

Yet another bank had an arrangement with another company to invest in the shares of the same extent as the other company invested in the shares of the bank thus increasing the capital of each without having to put in any additional funds at all.
All these malpractices clearly demonstrate the need to control the type and extent of a bank's investment in other com panies.

the other company to I have carefully considered the repre sentations of the Association of Banks in Malaysia on this clause.
While I agree that there may be a case for introducing a more flexible clause to allow banks in Malaysia to invest in shares of companies which are trustee securities, I consider that, at the same time, there should be provision in the Banking Ordinance to prohibit invest ments of the type referred to above.
I therefore intend to move an amend ment during the Committee stage by introducing a new clause 10A and deleting the present clause 7 to provide for the control by Bank Negara of investment by banks by regulation, in order to provide for a fair degree of flexibility in the control of such invest ments.
I should explain that the purpose 6903 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6904 of this clause is not to prevent banks from investing their shareholders' funds but to ensure that such investment does not weaken their financial structure.

jurisdiction at present As a further measure of control, Clause 8 of the Bill is designed to extend Bank Negara's jurisdiction to cover the subsidiaries of banks.
Bank Negara's is limited to banks only, although under the Companies Act, 1965, an investiga tion of any company can be made on the direction of the Minister of Com merce and Industry under certain conditions and after a public proclama tion by the Yang di-Pertuan Agong.
As there is a very close relationship between finance subsidiaries of banks and the banks themselves, and as the inspection provisions Companies Act, 1965, are not adequate for this purpose, it is felt that Bank Negara should be empowered to inspect the books and accounts of the subsi diaries of licensed banks.

Clause 8 of the Bill proposes an amendment to the Ordinance whereby Bank Negara will be given such powers.
the the in Clause 9 is designed to stop officers of banks from receiving commissions and gifts from the customers of such banks as a consideration for favours granted or to be granted.

Such a practice should be curbed in the interest of the public which deposits money with banks, as a corrupt banker en dangers the safety of such deposits by being prepared to grant risky over draft which a prudent banker would not be prepared to do.
As bankers make use of depositors' funds for their lending activities, it is considered that they should be prohibited from accept ing from customers of the bank and the new this section 24A will question.
However, it may sometimes be very difficult for bank managers to refuse from to accept nominal gifts their customers during festive occasions and as a result of the representations of the Association of Banks in Malay sia, I intend to move a minor amend ment during the Committee stage to exempt gifts of nominal value received during festive occasions from the provi sions of this clause.
take care of commissions gifts and in the discharge of In the existing law, there are no provisions for the punishment of direc tors and managers of licensed banks for failure to take reasonable steps to ensure compliance with the require ments of the Banking Ordinance.

The new section 24B of the Ordinance is designed to ensure that directors and managers of banks exercise reasonable diligence their duties.
As a result of the representations of the Association of Banks in Malaysia on this clause, I intend to move further amendments to this clause during the Committee stage, so that bank directors and managers who can prove that they have taken the necessary steps to ensure compliance with the provisions of the law will be absolved from blame.
It is proposed, under Clause 10 of the Bill, to introduce provisions into the Ordi nance whereby the Governor of Bank Negara Malaysia, with the concurrence of the Minister of Finance, may com pound any offence by a bank under the Banking Ordinance.
I light of amendments which There are other consequential amend ments to the Ordinance which do not touch on matters of principle but the main have referred to are all designed to ensure that banks operate in this country with the minimum of supervision, consonant with sound and stable banking so that depositors' funds are adequately safe guarded and the national interest duly served.
I must emphasise that these amendments have become necessary in the the Central Bank's experience during the last nine years in sound banking practice promoting the of within they Banking Ordinance, 1958, and arise of the a few banks.

I know that many banks in Malaysia are very conscious of their responsibilities and have co-operated with in promoting a sound banking structure.

There are, however, others who have not yet realised that, as bankers, their primary responsibility their depositors.
to They have yet to realise that forming a bank with the main idea of getting their hands on public money with which to gamble, so that they can get rich quickly and with practically no risk to the authorities framework operations out the of is 6905 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6906 themselves, but with the maximum of risk to the members of the public who have entrusted them with their money, is tantamount, in so far as banking is concerned, to an act of criminal irres ponsibility.
The amendments proposed this Bill would not have been in necessary if this fundamental duty had been fulfilled by all banks in Malaysia.

The Government has a duty to stop all malpractices segment of our economy and it will not hesitate, if this should prove necessary, to intro duce further regulatory measures to ensure that banks in Malaysia operate on sound lines and that depositors' funds are adequately safeguarded.
this vital in Before I close, I would like to refer to some of the ill-informed criticism that has been levelled at this extremely important piece of legislation.

It is clear that much of this criticism came from those who did not even bother to read, let alone digest, this Bill.

It is ridicu lous to suggest that the passing of this Bill into law will hinder legitimate trade or make it more difficult for the business community its legitimate operations.
Neither will this legislation hinder in any way the legiti mate activities of any bank.

I do agree, however, that the aim of this legislation is to protect innocent members of the public who have entrusted their money to banks from the rapacious fingers of some unscrupulous bank directors.

In other words, this Bill is aimed at dis honest bank directors, not honest ones, and those with a clear conscience have nothing to fear from this law.
finance to Furthermore, more than adequate time has been given to all concerned to study this Bill.

This Bill and the Central Bank of Malaysia (Amendment) Bill got their first reading in this House on 13th November, 1967 and were pub lished immediately thereafter.
A period of 3J months has, therefore, been pro vided for their study, and the very fact that the Association of Banks in Malay sia has had time to submit a lengthy memorandum to the Government on these Bills and to follow up this memo randum with exhaustive discussions with both the Governor of Bank Negara and myself, is an indication that ade quate time has been given for these to be Bills thoroughly studied by interested parties.
The fact also that the memorandum submitted by the Association of Banks in Malaysia and the Government's subsequent discus sions with it have resulted in amend this Bill, ments being proposed shows that the Government has taken due and full account of the representa tions made, and the Bill as proposed to be amended in Committee should, except therefore, those with ulterior motives, and I think Honourable Members will agree with me that it is not my duty as Finance Minister to encourage these gentry.
everybody satisfy to Sir, I beg to move.

Menteri Pengangkutan (Tan Sri Haji Sardon bin Haji Jubir): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya menyokong usul ini.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon (Batu) (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, both the public and the banks in this country must, generally speaking, accept parts of the the Amendment Bills now before House, namely, the Amendment to the Banking Ordinance, 1958, and also the Amendment to the Central Bank of Malaysia Ordinance, 1958.
This country has seen how mal practices that the Honourable Minister of Finance has highlighted in his speech in a certain bank in mis country were brought to light first in the Economist and then high—lighted by me in this House.

Subsequently, oral questions were asked in this House and I made an adjournment speech on this subject as well.
I entirely agree with the Minister for Finance that confidence in banks is a very tender and fragile plant and we should nourish and nurture it carefully and should not do anything that may stunt its growth or even destroy it.
But when the Government does not or has not done anything to stop such mal practices that were apparent to all in the banking business then it was time that persons like me should focus the glare of publicity on it in the hope that the Minister of Finance will amend our Banking Ordinance to root out mal practices.

6907 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6908 Here, if I may digress a little, the Minister for Finance has accused me in this House not once, but at least three times of wanting to destroy a certain bank.
I say that it was a false accusation, for I do not, I repeat, I do not have shares in any bank nor do I move in such exalted banking circles, so that I can and have taken a detached view of such debates.

Next, I am the treasurer of a club known as the Socialist Club based in Kuala Lumpur, and we have two fixed deposits in the same bank in Kuala Lumpur.

Now, if there is any intention on my part to destroy or damage that bank I would not, in the first instance, have put the money there.
Then, when there was a small run on that bank, again, if I had any intention to harm have with I would that drawn the two fixed deposits.

I did nothing of that sort—in fact, recently I have just renewed those deposits for another six months.

This will, I hope, show that the Minister of Finance is not incapable of making wild accusa tions himself.
bank Coming back to the Amendments before the House, it must be accepted that any legislation that provides for the greater protection of customers' deposits at banks must be welcomed by all.

This is particularly so, when one sees that in this country since Merdeka, i.e., since 1957, so many banks have grown up like mushrooms, and it is no secret that most leading Alliance Party members have obtained lucrative posi tions and as directors of banks corporations.
In fact, any retiring Minister may well become a director or chairman of the board of directors of banks, thus assuming the direction and control of these banks and corporations.

As these directors are relatively inexperienced in banking practices, it is imperative that there should be strict control not only to prevent but also to root our mal practices that may exist.
On the other hand, one should not swing to the other extreme, i.e., care should be taken to see that the Legis impose rules and lature should not seriously regulations, which would the day-to-day working of hamper banks.

There should not be too many fetters or restrictions being placed on the banking business in Malaysia.

By and large, I am glad to say that the banking business in Malaysia is con and honest ducted lines—and the Honourable think Minister knows that.
along efficient I Mr Speaker, Sir, before I touch on the Bill before us to-day, I propose to comment on some aspects of banking in this country.

in some cases As I have stated before, since Mer deka both local and foreign banks have cropped up like mushrooms.

The old and experienced staff have been spread out very thinly amongst the new banks there has been and crimping of staff.

It is evident also that there is a serious shortage of expe rienced or even trained personnel.
It is true that some banks have sent their employees abroad and they have come foreign banking back after passing in examinations.

Unfortunately, the course abroad studies they had to study subjects which had little or no relevance to banking in Malaysia.
As such it is imperative that both Bank Negara Malaysia and the Association of Banks in Malaysia should get together to set up a Malay sian Institute of Bankers, so that future bankers can be locally and what is more important they can be fully conversant with local banking practices.

trained their of Here, if an approach is made to the University of Malaya, it may be able to help out, but I must stress that I have no authority to speak on behalf of the University of Malaya.
I was merely throwing out a suggestion to the Central Bank and to the Association of Banks in Malaysia.

The University has just approved Chairs in Accounting, Public Industrial Administration; and, of course, these are all within the context of the Faculty of Economics and Administration.

As such, they will be able to help out in a Malaysian the establishment of Institute of Bankers.
Relations and 6909 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6910 in the University to A better suggestion would be establish a Department of Banking in the University of Malaya.

This, of course, would obviate the necessity of establishing a Malaysian Institute of Banks run by the banks themselves and would have the added advantage of diversifying courses in the University.

The snag where is concerned is simple—the shortage of funds and, with it, of personnel.
But it should not be a problem where the banks are concerned, as I notice that there are about 40 banks this country.

If, on an average, each of them contribute $100,000 they should be able to raise $4 million without much difficulty for such a project.

That should be sufficient not only for the capital expenditure but to endow a Chair in Banking and take care of the recurrent expenditure for the first few years.
As one who has been intimately associated with the Univer sity of Malaya since its inception, I throw out to Bank this suggestion Negara Malaysia and the Association of Banks in Malaysia for their serious consideration.

And if the Minister of Finance for good measure will not only give this proposal his blessing but also kick it off with a personal contribution, I am sure the project will be assured of a resounding success.
Mr Speaker, Sir, I have here with me the Annual Report for 1967 of a certain bank in Kuala Lumpur.

With your permission, I shall quote a small excerpt the the Report of Auditors to the members.
I quote: from "In our opinion, the annexed Balance Sheet and Profit and Loss Account together with the annexed notes are full and fair and are properly drawn up in accordance with the provisions of the Companies Act 1965, with such modifications and exceptions as have been determined by Bank Negara Malaysia pursuant to sub-section (16) of section 169 and so as to give a true, correct and fair view of the state of affairs of the Bank at 30th June, 1967. and of its results for the year ended on that date."
omission or of commission of banks should be hidden under the sarong of Bank Negara.

in to the Accounts and On the previous page of this Report are Notes in paragraph 6 are listed the subsidiary companies as at 30th June, 1967.

Then, in paragraph 7 it is stated that no provision has been made these accounts in respect of losses incurred by three subsidiary companies.
Surely, all these losses in so far as they affect the parent company should be listed in the Statement of Accounts of the parent company and whatever modi fications, or exceptions as have been too, determined by Bank Negara should be set out in the Notes to the Accounts, so that the shareholders and the depositors of the Bank can have a true picture of the stability of the bank.
I gather that this is not the only bank that makes use of Section 169 sub section 16 of the Companies Act, 1965, to make modifications and exceptions to the report of their auditors.
If the Minister of Finance is sincere in his statement, and he has time and again in the course of his speech stated that the object of this Bill is to root out malpractices that may exist, then, he should plug up this legal loophole, or at least modify it so as to prevent banks in Malaysia from hiding under the sarong of Bank Negara Malaysia.

I shall now touch on the material clauses of the Amendment before us today.
These amendments to the Bank ing Ordinance, 1958, remind me of the story of the man who cut his nose to spite his face.

Furthermore, they are vague and uncertain and are likely to affect adversely the economy of the country and spark off a flight of capital to neighbouring countries, mainly to the is Singapore.

This amendments to the amendments which have been made at the last moment.

in spite of Clause 2 Thus, Bank Negara has been used to conceal some discrepancies.
Mr Speaker, Sir, when this House passed the Companies Act in 1965, it was never intended that the sins of This amendment to section 4 of the Principal Act seeks to increase the net assets of foreign banks in Malaysia to $2 million the present instead of qualification of $2 million in immov able property and/or other approved 6911 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6912 assets.
It that some is well known foreign banks bring in a small amount of capital and then remit out of this country a fair bit of their capital from their profits.

Hence, this amendment is a wise one, but I would be happier if the Minister of Finance were to raise this figure to $3 million.
For example, he has pointed out just now that some of these banks, after bringing in their capital and having got in money from their depositors, remit out their capital and this then carry on business in country purely out of the depositors' is entirely funds.

That, of course, unsatisfactory the is interests of this country.
against and Clause 4 like people the advice of This is poorly worded as the Minister himself has admitted, because he had the to go and seek Attorney-General before coming to this House to say that it does not apply to professional doctors, lawyers and the like, who have work to do with banks.

It restricts unsecured loans and facilities to persons to not more than six months remuneration.
But it applies not only to officers and employees of banks, it also includes "other persons being persons receiving remuneration from such licensed bank".
This the is obviously designed, as Minister has stated, to bring persons like the bank advisers and compradores within the ambit of the prohibition, but in doing so I am afraid the Minister for Finance has cast his net too wide and has roped in professional persons that I have mentioned, namely, doctors, lawyers, auditors, valuers, who may be retained by banks in a professional capacity.
I am glad that the Minister has clarified that these people, accord ing the Attorney-General, are not included as "other persons being persons receiving remuneration for such licensed bank".

interpretation by an to Clause 5 This clause It long overdue.

is requires all directors of banks to declare to their boards their direct or in connection with indirect to other loans or advances granted banks.

This is very important as the interest question of conflicting interests may and often have arisen.
Here the director who has connections with other com panies with whom his bank has business dealings is obliged to disclose such interest to the board.

The mal practices of the past could not have taken place, if this amendment had taken place much earlier than now.

This amendment too will go a long way towards safeguarding the interest of depositors and shareholders and will, I am sure, be welcomed by all honest bankers.
Clause 6 As I have mentioned before, Bank Negara should not be too meddlesome and swing from one extreme to the other.

This clause requires monthly returns, not later than fifteen days after the last day of each month, of a huge number of transactions most of which may not or will not be of interest to Bank Negara.

The amount of paper work involved is out of all proportion to the information that can be gained and may well defeat the object of the amendment.
It will increase manifold the capacity of Bank Negara to sift and find out what is going wrong and where.

I do admit that such returns should be made but not at monthly intervals.

Perhaps, in order to cut down paper work and for Bank Negara itself to make use of such returns, it would be sufficient that they should be made quarterly and not monthly as laid down in the amendment.

the depositors.
the depositors.

In The original sub-section (2) seeks to invest the Central Bank with the power to issue orders to banks prohibiting them from granting advances to the detriment of the Principal Act the Central Bank the Minister who may, by advises order in writing, issue such orders.

I am glad that the Minister has heeded the representations of the Association of Banks of Malaysia.

It has now given the right of appeal to the Minister and that is what it should be.
Clause 7— The crowning folly of these amend ments was in Clause 7 which sought 6913 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6914 investing to prevent banks from in shares of other companies without the in writing of Bank prior consent Negara Malaysia.

However, this has now been amended or deleted.

Though the amendment is better, it still may have the same effect unless the rules are carefully drawn up.
It is a well- known fact that the tendency today is to allow even to be invested in well established and sound companies because of better returns and higher dividends.

The amendment to the English Trustees Investments Act was made with this object, and I know it has been followed by amend ments to our own Trustee Ordinance.

But, here, we may be preventing and restricting banks from investing in all companies.
trust money Mr Speaker, Sir, in most advanced are more countries, where banks sophisticated than those in this coun try, there are Merchant Banks, Ex change Banks, etc.

The former invests in stocks and shares of companies and the latter, as its name implies, confines its business to foreign exchange.
But banking in Malaysia has not reached such a degree of specialisation, and surely it is part and parcel of the legi timate business of banks in Malaysia, particularly of local banks, to invest in stocks and shares of other companies.

One immediate effect of this original amendment would have been for the licensed bank incorporated outside this country to invest in the stocks and shares of companies incorporated out side the Federation.

Thus, there will be a shift of capital, say, to Singapore.
It will be seen that this amendment, apart from inducing a flight of business to outside the this country, acts detriment of the locally incorporated bank, and surely that is not the inten tion of the Minister of Finance or of the Alliance Government as well.
to Both the Minister of Finance and his colleague, the Minister of Com merce and Industry, have tried their best by way of incentives, tax rebates, etc., to attract foreign capital to this country, but by this amendment we are doing our best to induce a flight of capital from this country.

This is cut ting one's nose to spite one's face with a vengeance.
This amendment too will work to the detriment of Malaysian incor porated banks, as it will encourage these banks to distribute their profits to shareholders rather than to accum ulate them and thereby strengthening time themselves and at their providing greater security depositors.

Once again, the Minister of Finance if it is not part of the business of banks to in companies and what is so objectionable about it?
the same for I ask invest Clause 7 is now deleted and in its place there will be a clause, Clause 10A, which will amend Section 29 of the Principal Act.

It is now proposed to formulate regulations to provide for control by the Central Bank with respect to the acquisition or holding by a licensed bank of shares of any corporation or of immovable property or with respect to a licensed bank becoming a partner or proprietor of any firm, with unlimited liability.
The Explanatory Note states that the inser tion of Clause 10A is to provide flexibility in the control of investments by licensed banks, I fail to fathom the logic of this assertion.

Surely, where there are no rules or regulations, then the banks have plenty of elbow room, but once you and regulations, then this flexibility is lost.

However, let us hope that the Minister, in formulating these rules, will see to it that the banks are not put in a straight jacket and almost let Bank Negara this country.
the banks run all set up rules in from the money Mr Speaker, Sir, the Minister, in the course of his speech, quite rightly stated that the banks should not gamble with money of depositors.

He also stated that shareholders should be used to cushion any losses that may be incurred by the banks.
I entirely agree with him in this respect, but the Minister knows that there are many well established banks who not only have the money from the shareholders but who have, over the course of the years, by prudent bank ing, accumulated huge reserves, and surely if the banks wanted to make 6915 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6916 from depositors, use of these reserves, as apart from the money they invest such should be allowed reserves in any business that they think fit.
then to Clause 8— This Clause empowers Bank Negara Malaysia to investigate the affairs of the subsidiary companies of banks and to see that their subsidiary companies do not act against the national interest.

It is a well known fact that some banks use the facilities of their branches to act as agents, for their subsidiary finance companies rule of maximum interest.
It is also a well known fact that finance subsidiaries of banks in Malaysia accept deposits from the public, but no prospectuses have been issued by these subsidiary com panies.

In view of what I have pointed out, why has not the Minister declared these finance companies as prescribed corporations?

to subvert the Mr Speaker, Sir, I have here with me the Annual Report of a local bank for the year 1967.
Its subsidiary finance corporation has lost, or is expected to lose, $4,317,875 in diminution in value of investments.

Again, the Profit and Loss Account for 1967 showed an adverse balance of $3,390,952 as against $76,084 for 1966.

This very same subsidiary has also at the moment in invested unquoted amount was shares, whereas $7,532,946 for the previous year.
$10,268,456 this Furthermore, local bank has this nine subsidiaries, one of which is a printing company and four of which are located in Singapore.

Thus, one can see the risk that a depositor of a finance company is exposed to.

Such companies pose a similar danger that insurance was posed by mushroom companies, which swindled a great number of people before the Govern ment stepped in at the instance of the Labour Party of Malaya.
In view of the foregoing, the Government should exercise greater control over the sub sidiaries of banks, and I shall be grateful, if at a later date, the Minister will bring in further amendments to this effect.

Clause 9— it In and gifts long as commissions there are no the Explanatory Note, is explained that the new section 24A is to prohibit officers of banks from accept ing from customers of the banks.

I am all for putting an end to corruption amongst officers of the banks.
But even the Director of the Anti-Corruption Agency must realise that it is usual for clients to show their gratitude to those officers so strings attached.

To that extent, I am glad that there is an amendment to the proposed section 24A, namely, "other than a gift of nominal value received during festive occasions."

Now, what does nominal value mean?


Will half a dozen bottles of whisky constitute a breach of nominal value, or will, let us say, four bottles of whisky on a festive occasion constitute a breach of nominal value?

I shall be very grateful for an inter pretation of "nominal value" by the Minister of Finance.

I can say without fear that often at Christmas and the Chinese New Year I have often been offered such gifts from my grateful patients, but that a crime?
The unfortunate part of it, where I am concerned, is that as a strict Methodist, I do not drink those gifts and have to invite my friends to drink them off for me.

The Minister must distinguish between gifts given in appreciation for work done and gifts that are given in consideration of favours to be granted.

However, bank officers must be relieved that they can now receive gifts of nominal value from grateful clients during festive occasions.
is The new Section 24B, in its original form, makes a mockery of justice, for it makes a serious inroad into the legal principle that no person should be punished without proof of culpability.

However, I am glad that the Minister has taken cognizance of the representa tion made to him by the Association of Banks in Malaysia and has amended this Section 24B.

Clause 10— Finally, I come to Clause 10.


Here, in the Explanatory Note, it is considered that the Governor of the Central Bank with the concurrence of the Minister, 6917 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6918 should be empowered to compound any offence against the Ordinance.

This is to me.
This is to me.

As I have incomprehensible mentioned before, the proposed original new Section 24B, as laid down in this Bill makes a serious inroad into the administration of justice in that under it a person can be punished without proof of culpability.

judge, Here, in Clause 10, the Minister has gone to the other extreme by giving the Governor sweeping himself and powers to compound any offences against the Ordinance.

Why should the Governor be both jury and prosecutor all rolled into one?
Why should he be given such sweeping powers?

If there is to be any bite in these amendments, then the Governor should not be given these powers to compound any offence against the Ordinance.

Lest there be any misappre hension, I wish to make it quite clear that what I have said, or have to say, does not apply in to cumbent of the office of Governor of Bank Negara.

the present is not to any banker The principle to compound offences is wrong.
I say this because the greatest deterrent the amount of money that he can be fined by any court cr by the Governor or by the Minister, but the greatest deter rent is a prison sentence—and only a court of law can impose a prison sen this tence on any offender against Banking Ordinance.
If you take that deterrent away, the banker may be tempted to commit an offence secure in the knowledge that the offence may be compounded by the Governor and all that he has to suffer is the payment of a fine to be imposed by the Governor.

It is true that the Governor need not exercise the power that he possesses and refer the power to the court, but why provide the offender with such a loophole?

puts the fear of God into him.

Hence, why bring in the Governor and the administration of Minister Justice?
the in I gather that the purpose of this power to the Governor, subject to the concurrence of the Minister to com the is pound offences, Governor minor compound offences—that is, typing errors, etc.

If that is the intention, and I can see merit in it, then why should it not be spelt out clearly?
to enable to In conclusion, Mr Speaker, Sir, in view of the grave deficiencies in this Bill, and this has been admitted by the Minister himself in that he has brought forth many amendments, I wish to notify the Minister that at the approp riate time of these proceedings I shall move reference back of this Bill to a Select Committee, and I do hope that the Minister will not block it.
Finally, Mr Speaker, Sir, I wish to quote a few of the Press comments on these two Bills and I do hope that the Minister will not castigate these Press opinions as, did I hear him say, "ill- informed opinions".

I quote from the Eastern Sun of the 23rd February, 1968.

Inter alia, it states: "What the Council of Banks in Malaysia fears is the interference in the management of banks by the Central Bank when the two amending Bills are passed.
There are many aspects of banking business with which the Central Bank should not interfere, and one of which is the secrecy of a client's account.

Unless the Government has reason to believe that certain banks are evading income tax or are involved in corrupt practices, it should not make it a rule to demand the scrutiny of all bank accounts.
"; this refers mainly to the amendment to the Central Bank Ordinance, 1958— "Too much restriction should not be imposed on banks that they are forced to invest their funds abroad.

Protection of the public should not be made detrimental to the banking business."

as Bankers are, by and large, honest and wealthy people.

But in every profession there is the odd black sheep as the Minister himself has mentioned.
The banker has the wealth to pay any fine whether imposed by a court of law or by the Governor but it is the fear of a" prison sentence that Then again, in the Straits Times of the 19th February, 1968, the editorial reads: "Sound banking practice is one thing.

The straight jacket of the proposed amendments to is the Malaysian Banking Ordinance something else.
The amendments offered on them by the Council of the Association of Banks no doubt will have the Government's the opinion earnest attention, particularly 6919 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6920 It that to give the Central Bank authority to control the investment of bank funds in industry would be a gross disservice to the national effort.
is a restriction which certainly would stimulate incorporation of companies outside Malaysia, including Singa pore, the memorandum tartly adds, where they would count the support of foreign banks.

It may be urged that the Central Bank would not withhold consent unreasonably— perhaps not, but it is an authority that the Central Bank should not have.
If the object is to protect depositors' funds, it could be assured by restricting the banks through the shareholders' own money, that is, their paid-up capital and reserves.

investment by The use of the depositors' money would need approval.

There are proposals which the Penal Code duplicate provisions prohibiting officers and employees from accepting money for favours done and others whose value is not commensurate with the paper work involved or which would invite abuse.

in The Bill needs re examined.


Its genuine purposes can be secured without potentially dangerous an extension of the Central Bank's powers."

to be completely Then, in another editorial dated 22nd February, 1968, the Straits Times has this to say : "But is it necessary that the Central Bank should have the right to enquire into any and every private banker's deposits?"

It goes further to say: investments trust, which "It is also seeking the right to approve or in company disapprove bank shares.
These and other proposed major amendments to the banking legislation will increase substantially the Central Bank's statutory powers to the possible detriment of the role which a sound banking system now plays, an unquestionably willing and cordial in 1968 was rightly regarded as essential."

Then, Mr Speaker, Sir, in the Straits Times of 21st February 1968, there is a report of a speech by Senator T. H. Tan, the leader of the Alliance Party in the Senate.
He suggested that the proposed be strenuously opposed in the interests of the Nation."
amendment "should that in view of Mr Speaker, Sir, the widespread Press disapproval, in view of the disapproval by the Honourable Senator T. H. Tan, and in view of the fact the Minister himself has brought, at his late stage, a number of amendments, I think this Bill, despite the time that has been given to us— and I admit that the time given has been adequate—it would be better for Bank Negara Malaysia, the Minister and the bankers if this were to be sent to a Select Committee, where all the various facets of the disagreement with the extension of powers of Bank Negara will be examined once again and the Bill will be brought back to this House after an examination by the Select Committee.
Thank you.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Persidangan ini di-tempohkan sa-lama 15 minit.

Persidangan pukul 11.20 pagi.

di-tempohkan pada Persidangan di-sambong sa-mula pada pukul 11.40 pagi.

the manner whereby Perbahathan di-sambong sa-mula.

Dr Lim Chong Eu (Tanjong) (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, I would like, first of all, to commend the Govern ment for they have brought this Banking about (Amendment) Bill.
As has already been indicated, the original Ordinance was in 1958 and this set of amendments have been presented to the House for three and a half months.

So, not only the Members of this House but the general public has had sufficient time to comment on it, and the Honourable Minister has also had sufficient time to re-evaluate the comments that had been made upon in subsequence to which we have now a sheaf of further amendments to the amendments.
the amending Bill, that talk about Sir, I make this remark commending the manner in which this Bill has been brought forth with a little bit of regret, the that one could only wish Government will give to the Constitu tion the same degree of deference as it does to the Banking Bill.
We very sel dom the bank, but we talk about the sanctity of the Constitution in that we can make amendments to the Constitution over night, whereas apparently takes much, much more tender and solicitous care to push forward this amendment to the Banking Ordinance.

Sir, with this preface I would like just briefly to touch on the Bill itself.
the sanctity of it Sir, I feel that the Honourable Minis ter is fully aware of the necessity of 6921 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6922 the development of providing checks and balances in this Bill.

He is, I think, fully aware also of the kind of fear that is naturally aroused by an extremely conservative section of our society and, therefore, in the course of his speech he had clearly indicated that the intention of the Bill is just to tighten the Bank Negara's supervision and control of the banks.
However, Sir, I think he must fully appreciate too that there is apprehen the business circles, sion throughout particularly among banking circles, that this supervision and control will not really go to the extent of domination and dictation but also the question of crimping the banking system in this country.
Sir, the Honourable Minister, I think, expressed his awareness by stating at the end of his speech that only those who have anything to fear should really worry about the Bill but those who have nothing to fear should have nothing to worry over the provisions of this Bill.
However, Sir, I do feel that there are little aspects of the Bill whereby further amendments, either now or subse quently, could be made in order to make things clearer and in order to make it sure that the intentions of Government are just those of tighter supervision and control.
We on this side certainly recall the occasion when we brought a question to the House, and in deference to the Honourable Minister we did not pursue the ques tion further, and I presume that much of the amendments provided in this Bill are the outcome of the run that took place last year.
through, amendment goes Sir, I would like to touch on the question of the power provided to the Central Bank in Clause 4 of the Bill to look into the individual accounts in the banks and these will now be liable, if to the enquiry by the Central Bank.

I make this comment fully realising that the Minister must provide this power to the Central Bank, otherwise it cannot effectively carry out the provisions in Clause 4 for checking on the secured and unsecured accounts of directors and so on.
However, Sir, I do hope that the Minister in his reply will stress that the secrecy that is required by the banks, and which has to be maintained in the relationship between the banks and the ordinary depositors, will be respected to the full.

Although it is provided for by Section 22 of the original Ordinance, I hope that the Honourable Minister will make this clear to the public as a whole.
I wonder also whether it may not be a useful idea if the Government should consider, at some subsequent date, to put forward some amendments or some kind of balancing factor, so that prior to any examination of indivi dual accounts, the Central Bank or the Governor may either have to get permission, via a court order, to do such examination or would have to get a warrant issued by the Minister him self.
This kind of balance, to some extent, will ensure the Government's abiding with the concept of the neces sary secrecy between banks and deposi tors and at the same time allow the the Government, power individual accounts which the Government feels necessary where there is any need, or where there is any suspicion.
the Central Bank, those to examine The general provision given in Clause 6 for checking of secured and unsecured accounts of directors either in the banks or in holdings of companies to which the banks have given advances are all, I think, perfectly clear.
However, I do hope that the Honourable Minister will consider that although the powers that have now been given to the Central Bank are necessary, in order to effect the the type of supervision which Government envisages, the Government will also consider the possibility of providing some way of appeal to the Minister, so that the entire function of the Central Bank will not just rest and end with the Central Bank that the Minister will still have some say in any kind of appeal.
looking into The last point that I would like to touch on is the question of nominal gifts that is contained in the amendment to the amendment.

I do feel that this is one of the occasions where second thought probably is not as purposeful as the original concept.
The second thought and the proposed amendment to the amendment now qualifies the term "gift" to "nominal gifts" received during festive occasions and, like the 6923 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6924 that I do hope Honourable Member for Batu, I hope the Honourable Minister will that clarify this point and state clearly and exactly what "nominal gifts' mean.
Furthermore, the Government will look into this ques tion of completely stopping this idea of giving gifts to responsible members in banks, so that the gifts that are not only given to directors or responsible officers of the bank but gifts that are given to close relatives and immediate relatives of the directors and of the officers of banks will also come under this same prohibition.
With these observations, I support the passage of this Bill and ask that the Government, however, should not delay all that long and as soon as possible, probably within a year or two, 18 months after the implementation of this Bill, should any difficulties arise, the Government should not be reluctant to look into bringing in further amend ments to the Bill in accordance with the need and the immediate experiences of this change.
It is agreed, Sir, that we should be conservative, but I think the Honourable Minister will agree with me this new departure creates anxieties, and I think the Government should not be too reluctant to meet the wishes of the people in order to make our financing and banking system go through.
that satu Tuan Haji Mohamed Yusof bin Mahmud (Temerloh): Tuan Yang di- Pertua, saya bangun memberi uchapan sa-tinggi2-nya kapada tahniah yang Yang Berhormat Menteri Kewangan Rang kerana mengadakan Undang2 yang mengawal perusahaan perniagaan bank di-negara kita ini.

Sa-putut-nya Rang Undang2 ini telah lama di-laksanakan.

Dalam saya mem beri sokongan ini, ada satu dua per- kara yang saya fikir bagi menguatkan mengapa Rang Undang2 ini patut di- adakan.
Terutama sa-kali, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, berkenaan dengan ra'ayat2 yang bukan daripada warganegara negeri ini itu wang2 yang datang dari luar negeri untok di-investkan di-dalam bank ini dengan tujuan siasah, maka dengan ada-nya Rang Undang2 ini, yang saya saperti ini dapat di-awasi.
Kita telah perchaya-lah perkara2 ada pengalaman pada masa pilehanraya yang telah lalu di-mana wang2 yang datang daripada luar negeri telah di- siasah bagi gunakan untok tujuan2 menjadikan negara siasah mereka yang tidak di-ingini ini.

Saya memandang oleh negara bahawa perkara ini sangat-lah berat.
ini bagi tujuan2 tahun empat tiga juga wang2 daripada Pada pengalaman saya, atau pen- dapat saya, pada satu masa lebeh kurang dahulu luar banyak negeri saperti daripada Hong Kong di-bawa masok ka-negeri kita ini.
Tujuanrnya yang sa-benar tidak-lah di-ketahui, sama ada betul-kah atau tidak yang mereka2 itu membawa modal2 tersebut untok di-tanam kapada negeri ini sama ada berkenaan dengan perusahaan atau perniagaan, tetapi sa- balek-nya pula kita khuatir, oleh sebab anasir2 yang tidak di-ingini daripada negeri ini akan mendapatkan bantuan2 kewangan daripada luar negeri, maka dengan ada-nya Rang Undang2 yang sa-macham ini, rasa saya dapat kita kawal atas perkara2 ini.
ini, baharu2 Satu perkara lagi, Tuan Yang di- P'ertua, berkenaan dengan unsecured overdraft.

Ini rasa saya ada-lah satu perkara yang baik, sebab dengan ada- nya Rang Undang2 yang sa-macham ini, maka saya khuatir kerana ada mereka2, ia-itu pedagang2 yang bukan daripada ra'ayat negeri ini yang meng gunakan kaedah2 unsecured overdraft ini yang akan merugikan negara kita.
Sa-umpama-nya saya tidak-lah hendak mencheritakan di- mana tempat itu terjadi, ia-itu sa-orang pedagang yang telah lama berniaga di- negara ini, tetapi dia telah membuat planning lebeh kurang 10 tahun bagai- mana hendak menggunakan unsecured overdraft itu boleh mengeluarkan wang2 daripada negeri ini keluar dengan tidak dapat di- ambil balek dan tidak ada satu jalan yang boleh bank2 ini mendapatkan balek wang2 yang telah keluar itu.
Maka dengan ada-nya chara kawalan yang sa-macham ini, dapat-lah Kera- sa-saorang jaan mengawal pedagang yang menggunakan tiga, tujoh dan lapan bank dengan un secured overdraft-nya dan oleh sebab dia telah berniaga dengan bagitu lama ini dan dengan sebab bagi 6925 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6926 ini, maka bank2 dalam negeri ini memberi keperchayaan penoh kapada- nya dengan satu consignment barang2 yang datang daripada luar di-mana dia mendapat overdraft tetapi dia mendapat overdraft daripada Japan bank dengan satu consignment daripada barang2 ter- sebut.
Jadi, ini satu penipuan yang patut dapat kita awasi dengan ada-nya Rang Undang2 ini.
Satu perkara lagi, Tuan Yang di- Pertua, saya harap juga dengan ada- nya Rang Undang2 ini, jangan-lah pula menyebabkan orang2 kaya kita yang takut hendak menyimpan ada duit wang dalam bank ini pula, kerana dengan chara ini boleh mengurangkan orang ramai menyimpan wang dalam bank itu, kemungkinan bank itu tidak boleh berjalan, sebab dia takut ia-lah oleh kerana banyak orang2 yang ada wang yang suka berniaga yang tidak suka perdagangan2 itu di-ketahui oleh orang ramai, kemungkinan ini akan timbul dan ini akan menjadi kelam- kabut juga berkenaan dengan hal bank di-tanah ayer kita ini.
Saya rasa, fikiran2 yang akan kita dapati pada satu masa kelak dapat-lah Yang Berhormat Menteri Kewangan ini memikirkan atas soal ini sa-telah kita menjalankan Rang Undang2 ini, kemungkinan yang akan kita hadapi beberapa kesuiitan yang tujuan asal- nya jangan-lah kita menjadikan peru- sahaan bank ini boleh menjadi kurang dan menyebabkan keadaan ekonomi negara kita merosot.

Terima kaseh.
Terima kaseh.

Tun Tan Siew Sin (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, I am very grateful for the support which has generally been extended to this very important piece of legislation, and it is clear that Hon ourable Members of this House realise the importance of passing this Bill into law as speedily as possible.

I shall now try to deal with the points which have been raised in the course of this debate.
The Honourable Member for Batu has suggested, and I must say it is a very constructive suggestion, that we should do what we can to increase the supply of trained banking personnel in this country.

He suggested that for set up a this purpose we might Malaysian Institute of Bankers.

I am to set up a Committee glad to tell him that in point of fact this matter is now under consideration by Bank Negara in conjunction with the Association of Banks in Malaysia.
In fact, as early as August, 1967, Bank Negara proposed to the Association of Banks to to establish an examine a proposal Institute of Bankers in Malaysia and a Training Centre for bank officers.

Bank Negara has already acquired a suitable site for the Training Centre and a building is being planned.

In the mean time, Bank Negara has, during the past three years, invited a number of officers from commercial banks to participate in training courses it conducts primarily for its own officers.
It will, therefore, be seen, Sir, that we have already done something about the suggestion of the Honourable Member for Batu.

in on bank.

The Honourable Member for Batu also states that when there was a run on a certain bank last year, he did not withdraw his deposits and in point of fact he renewed his deposits with his Further that speech, he quotes the case of a certain bank which he feels has done things which it should not do, or not done things which it should.
I sincerely hope that the bank in which he has renewed his fixed deposits and the later bank to which he referred are not one and the same bank.

If it is, it does show a rather strange logic on the part of the Honourable Member for Batu to say that he has got every confidence in the bank and then to bring out its alleged shortcoming in public and that sort of thing, as the Honourable Member for Batu well knows, will not do that bank any good.
So, I hope he is not referring to one and the same bank that speech.

in He states that Clause 4 of the Bill is poorly drafted because it does not make clear that professional men like lawyers, doctors and auditors are in point of fact exempted from the pro visions of this clause.

I made it clear, Sir.


in my speech these pro fessional persons are, in fact exempted and I do not see therefore how he can make his accusation stick that this is the a poorly drafted clause when that Attorney-General has confirmed that 6927 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6928 the clause, as drafted, is clear enough and does exclude the persons whom the Honourable Member for Batu feels, and rightly so, should be excluded.
I is think clause is designed transactions under I now come to Clause 6, and the Honourable Member for Batu suggested that it was unrealistic or impracticable to ask the banks to submit monthly returns, because there would be a huge number of this clause.
All I can say is that, if the number of transactions is really large, then something there seriously wrong with the bank, because that catch anomalies or irregularities, and if a bank were to submit a return in which a large number of items appear, then it does mean that this clause is over due and is certainly, I think, appro priate; and if the number of returns is huge, then something will have to be done.
I sincerely hope, for the sake of the banking system in this country, that the returns under this clause will be as few as possible.

There is no therefore, of Bank Negara question, being swamped or overwhelmed with returns under this clause.

to Then, he talks of Clause 7 which he describes as the crowning folly of this Bill.
I beg to disagree with him, because this clause is in fact one of the most liberal in the entire banking world—and when I talk of the entire the banking world, I do not mean entire banking world of Malaysia—I mean the entire banking system of the world.

He will probably be suprised to know that many developed countries in point of fact specifically prohibit their commercial banks from investing in any shares at all.
I mean, they do not allow even one dollar's worth of investment on the part of commercial shares of ordinary in banks companies, or for that matter, any company at all.

And this prohibition is in fact found in the legislation of in many developing countries.

We extremely Malaysia liberal in this respect in the sense that we do allow such investments but we say that such investments must be con trolled.
It is also not true to say or to this suggest clause will result in a shift of capital, the enactment of therefore that the are say, to Singapore, or for that matter any other foreign country.

If because of this clause businessmen or bankers get their funds for such investment in a foreign country, then all I can say is "good luck to them".

We in Malaysia certainly do not want this kind of business.
It should also be made clear, Mr Speaker, Sir, that normally, and certainly in the past and I think this will also apply in the future, com panies do not obtain their share capital the banks.

As the Honourable from Member should know, when a company is formed, the normal course, the usual course, is for it to get its capital either from the Stock Exchange or the share market or from its own sources.
But it is most unusual for a company, when starting operations, to get its equity or share capital from a commercial bank.

The services or facilities of commercial banks are only resorted to when companies wish to increase or to augment their working capital, but certainly not their share capital.

It is, therefore, not true to say that it is part of the business of banks to invest in companies.

In fact, not so long ago.


I had with me the senior executive of one of the largest banks in the whole world, and he was surprised that we in commercial Malaysia banks investments.

Needless to say, this is an American bank because American banks are the largest banks the United States of America and in many other countries such investments are totally prohibited—totally and com pletely prohibited.

the world.
the world.

In our such to make allowed in seek He asked about the case of banks with huge reserves which, he suggested, might be allowed to invest in other companies.

I have made it clear in my speech to that we do not prohibit banks under this clause from investing at all.

All we say is that we will allow such investment, but such investment will be subject to control by Bank Negara.
In this connection I would add, Sir, that Bank Negara, or rather, the Treasury and Bank Negara, have agreed to consult the Association of Banks in Malaysia before drawing up the regulations under this clause, and the purpose of these regulations is to enable the banks to know before 6929 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6930 to meet hand what sort of shares they can invest in, and what sort of shares they cannot, and to what extent.
It will therefore be seen that the amendment to be proposed at the Committee stage will to a large extent or go a very long the way Association of Banks in Malaysia.

I do not think we can go further than we have because, as I have said, our attitude in this respect in fact is one of the most liberal in the whole world, because other countries are much stricter than we are in this respect, even if this Clause is passed.
the objections of in In fact, the Honourable Member for the course of his speech, Batu, stated that the subsidiary of a certain bank invested in unquoted shares to the extent of $10 million, and this really is the crux of the whole question.
this matter When I was discussing with the representatives of the Associa tion of Banks in Malaysia, I suggested that in so far as investment in shares quoted on the Stock Exchange was take a very concerned, we would forthcoming attitude and, to my horror and surprise, one banker stated that this was not good enough.

The impli cation of this objection was obviously that banks should be allowed to invest not only in shares quoted on the Stock Exchange, they should be allowed to go well beyond that.
That means that some banks in this country feel that they should be given an unfettered right to invest in even shady and doubtful shares.

That, Sir, is an indication of the problems faced by the Treasury and Bank Negara in controlling com mercial banks in this country.

As I have said, some of them are not quite as responsible as they should be.

Coming to Clause 9, the Honourable Member has asked what "nominal value" means, and he quotes the case of half a dozen bottles of whisky.
I think if you receive from a friend or even from a customer half a dozen bottles of whisky on the occasion of Chinese New Year or Hari Raya or Christmas Day, that would be allow able.

I think we are quite reasonable people both in the Treasury and Bank Negara and will not regard that as corruption.
He also takes exception to Clause 10 where the Governor of Bank Negara, with the concurrence of the Minister of Finance, is empowered to compound any offence against the Ordinance, and he feels that the principle of allowing the compounding of such offences is wrong.
I submit, Sir, that that is a very sound principle because such offences are normally committed not so much by the directors but by the bank itself, and it is clearly not possible to send a bank to jail—you can send a bank director to jail but not a bank to jail— and the principle of compounding the offence is to enable this matter to be and settled without too much fuss; and I think that in so far as banking is concerned, there this procedure.
It will be noted that the the com Clause does provide pounding can be as much as the maximum of the fine allowed under the law.

is considerable merit expeditiously quickly, that in He suggests that this Bill should be referred to a Select Committee.

As I have stated already, this Bill has been before the public, including this House, for three and a half months.

The people most concerned, i.e.


the commercial themselves, have submitted a banks memorandum to me, they have had discussions with me and, as far as I know, the amendments which we pro pose to make in Committee have gone a long way to meet their objections; and, as far as I know, they are satisfied with what Government has done to meet them part of the way.

I, therefore, see no point in referring this Bill to a Select Committee.
In fact, he is the only speaker on the Opposition side who has made this suggestion.

He will no doubt note that one of his collea gues, for the Honourable Member Tanjong, in fact, takes the opposite point of view and feels that this Bill should be passed into law as soon as possible.

The Honourable Member for Tan jong refers to the basic need to ensure secrecy in so far as individual accounts are concerned.
This, of course, refers to the other Bill, the Central Bank of Malaysia (Amendment) Bill, and I will deal with that point when we come to 6931 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6932 it, i.e., the next Bill on the Order Paper.

to that to appeal the petitioner He also suggests that there should be a provision for appeal against the Governor's decisions.

As he will have noted, in one clause we have provided the for Minister in case he disagrees with the decision of the Governor.
I can assure the Honourable Member the Treasury works very closely with Bank Negara and there is, in fact, a general power of supervision by the Minister over Bank Negara, because there is a clause in either the Central Bank of the Banking Malaysia Ordinance or the that Ordinance Minister of Finance can give general directions to the Governor of Bank Negara and such directions must be followed.

So, I think that that point is well taken care of.


the effect to indicates The Honourable Member for Batu also makes a plea that if this law is it will be, and passed, as I hope that subsequent experience amendments are necessary, we will keep an open mind on this question.

I can give him that assurance.


I for one will be the first to agree that neither the Treasury nor Bank Negara has a monopoly of wisdom even the banking field, and if at any time we feel that amendments are necessary in the shall light of experience, we certainly not hesitate to come back to this House further amendments.

propose and in to, I My Honourable friend from Temer- think, non-citizens loh refers being able to remit funds out of this country, funds which originally came from the commercial banks.
This is a foreign exchange matter—it is not so much a banking matter, it is a foreign exchange matter.

The Honourable Member will appreciate that we pursue a very liberal foreign exchange policy and it is not really possible to impose foreign exchange control in respect of certain categories of business without imperilling the whole principle of a liberal foreign exchange policy.

This is a very big issue.


Once foreign exchange control is imposed or once we tighten our foreign exchange procedures in the this country.

This matter of remission of funds overseas, I think it will be found that capital will be very shy and may not come to is a wider problem, and I do not think we can deal with this problem in a banking ordinance.
Anyway, we are aware of this problem and where possible we will certainly do what we can to prevent ill-gotten gains—I think that is what he has in mind—from being to remitted overseas evade the law.

We are aware of this problem, but that is really a separate matter.

Thank you very much.

in an attempt Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Mr Speaker, Sir, may I under Standing Order 54 move that this Bill be referred to a Select Committee?
Tun Tan Siew Sin: Mr Speaker, Sir, I think the Bill must be read a second time before the Honourable Member can make his proposal, and I suggest that the Bill be read a second time first.

Usul di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Rang Undang2 di-bachakan kali yang kedua.

MENYERAHKAN RANG UNDANG2 KAPADA JAWATAN-KUASA PILEHAN Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Mr Speaker, Sir, before the Bill is taken to its Com mittee Stage, I beg to move under Standing Order 54 that this Bill be referred to a Select Committee.
Tuan Edwin anak Tangkun (Sara saya wak): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, menyokong.

Usul di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan tidak di-setujukan.

Jawatan-kuasa Rang Undang2 di-serahkan kapada Dewan sa-bagai Jawatan-kuasa.

Dewan bersidang sa-bagai Jawatan- kuasa.

Rang Undang2 di-timbangkan dalam Jawatan-kuasa.

6933 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6934 (Tuan (Timbalan) Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan Jawatan-kuasa) Fasal 1 hingga 5 di-perentahkan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.
Fasal 6— Tun Tan Slew Sin: Mr Chairman, Sir, I beg to move that Clause 6 be amended in the manner indicated in the amendment list which has already been circulated to all Honourable Members.
I need not go further into the reasons for this proposal, as I spoke at some length on this amend ment, which reads as follows, in the course of my speech on the Second Reading : Clause 6: Insert immediately after sub section (2) of the proposed section 11 therein the following— "Provided that any bank which has been issued with an order by the Central Bank pursuant to this section, may appeal in writing to the Minister, who may, as he thinks fit, confirm, vary or revoke the order of the Central Bank."
Pindaan di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Fasal 6 yang di-pinda di-perentahkan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

Fasal 7— Tun Tan Siew Sin: Mr Chairman, Sir, I beg to move the amendment referred to in the amendment list which has already been circulated to Honour able Members.

The amendment is to delete Clause 7.

I have nothing to add to my remarks on the reasons for this amendment as I spoke at some length on it in my speech on the Second Reading.
Pindaan di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Fasal 7 yang di-pinda di-perentahkan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

Fasal 8 di-perentahkan menjadi sa- bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

Fasal 9— Tun Tan Siew Sin: Mr Chairman, Sir, I beg to move the amendment specified in the amendment list which to all has already been circulated Honourable Members.
The amendment reads as follows: Clause 9: (a) Insert immediately after the the word "gift" appearing line 4 of proposed section 24A the following— in "(other than a gift of nominal value received during festive occasions)"; (b) Substitute for the proposed section 24B the following— "Penalties on directors and managers.

24B.
(1) Any person who, being a director or manager of a licensed bank— (a) fails to take all reasonable steps to secure compliance by the bank with the require ments of this Ordinance and the Central Bank of of Malaysia Ordinance, 1958; or (b) fails to take all reasonable steps to ensure the correct ness of any statement sub mitted under the provisions of this Ordinance or of the Central Bank of Malaysia Ordinance, 1958, shall, on conviction, be liable to a fine not exceeding $5,000 or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding three years or to both such fine and imprison ment.
(2) In any proceedings against a person under sub-section (1) it shall be a defence to prove that he has reasonable grounds to believe that another person was charged with the duty of securing compliance with the requirements of those Ordi the duty of nances or with ensuring that those statements were accurate and that person was competent and in a position to discharge that duty.
(3) A person shall not be sentenced to imprisonment for any offence under sub-section (1) unless in the opinion of the court, he committed the offence wilfully.".

that is touched on Dr Lim Chong Eu (dengan izin): Sir, I had already this question of nominal gifts.
Sir, I feel very strongly that this Clause 9 (a), the proposed amendment, which should not be passed and incorporated into this Bill by virtue of the fact that either we have this amendment and an appendix to qualify what exactly is the meaning of "nominal gift", or tells us exactly unless the Minister 6935 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6936 what he feels "nominal gift" is.

I feel, Sir, that the original draft is a stricter and better one for control.
Sir, in the reply by the Honourable Minister he accepted, for example, half a dozen bottles of whisky as a nominal gift.

But would a dozen bottles of cham pagne be accepted, or would a Rolex watch be acceptable?

And how many nominal gifts to any one person be acceptable?

For example, if 1,000 people give 6 bottles of whisky, will that be a nominal gift?
Or, if one person gives 6 bottles of whisky not only to the director but to every single one of his relatives, will that be equivalent to a nominal gift?

By virtue of the fact of the difficulties arising out of this, I do hope that the Minister will accept in good faith that either he spells it out or he should be stricter and stick to the original purposes and the original draft.
Tun Tan Siew Sin: Mr Chairman, Sir, I am very glad to note that the for Tanjong Honourable Member thinks I am not strict enough.

As he probably is aware, this amendment is the result of a compromise really between the Government and the Association of Banks in Malaysia, and I think it is a fair compromise, because we must admit that in human society gifts are exchanged on festive occa sions, and it is only right to exempt, I think, such gifts from the provisions of this Clause.
Otherwise we do get, I think, a very difficult situation.

As for defining with exactitude the expression "nominal gift", I think that is not so easy because there are obviously different circumstances, and I am sure that we can trust the Attorney- General and the people concerned to reasonably this expression interpret and sensibly.

I think we need not go beyond that.

I myself am not worried that there will be any ambiguity or any difficulty in interpreting this expres sion.
Pindaan di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Fasal 9 yang di-pinda di-perentahkan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

Fasal 10— Tun Tan Siew Sin: Mr Chairman, Sir, I would like to move the amend ment proposed in the amendment list which has already been circulated to all Honourable Members.

The amend ment reads: Clause 10: Insert immediately after clause 10 the following— "Amend ment of section 29.

10A.
Section 29 of the principle Ordinance is hereby amended by renumbering the existing section as sub-section (1) and adding thereafter sub section (2)— following the (2) Without prejudice to the generality of sub-section (1) regulations may be made under that sub-section to provide for control by the Central Bank with respect to the acquisition or holding by a licensed bank of shares of any corporation (as defined in the Companies Act, 1965), or of immovable property or with respect to a licensed becoming a partner or proprietor of any firm with unlimited liability.".
bank Dr Tan Chee Khoon: Mr Chairman, Sir, just now the Minister, in his comments on Clause 7—and this Clause 10A is a replacement of Clause 7—has stated that he thought that this Government and this country has been very liberal in the participation of banks in the business life of this country to the extent of allowing the banks to acquire shares of companies which he stated in other countries is not allowed.

Perhaps, the Minister and his backroom boys have not looked at one angle of this.
But, before I go on to developing that theme, I wish to say that I entirely agree with him that banks should not gamble in shares that are not quoted on the stock exchange, certainly not with the money of depositors.

I entirely agree with him on that point and if it is the purpose of this amendment to curb that type of, what I would say, unethical or mal practice, then I am all with it.

But, perhaps, the Minister has not looked at it from a different angle.
He knows very well that in this country some of the big business this country belong to foreign firms.

He knows also very well that for local industries to gain control or to buy such foreign in 6937 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6938 firms, it is not that easy for the private individual to buy such shares that may be on the market.
Consequently, if the control of such big combines is to pass into local hands, one way would be for the banks with their vast resources— and I wish to stress here that I would consider money from its reserves as opposed to money from its depositors or even from that of shareholders— should legitimately be used to acquire shares in companies and therefore gain control of such companies instead of such companies being in the hands of foreigners.
Just now, he stated also that he did not see why the money of banks should be used to set up local businesses.

There, I entirely agree with him that this should not be so, that companies which are floated should not use the money of banks to establish themselves.

What happens is that, to use his own words, where companies need augment capital their working capital, then the com panies would have to use the resources of banks rather than to go back to the shareholders for another call of capital.
I do submit that on these two grounds, that the reserves of banks should be used to acquire control of foreign firms, that the reserves of banks should be used to augment the working capital of companies already formed, there are very good grounds for banks to partici pate in the business life of this country.

extra to While we are on Clause 10, Mr Chairman, Sir, the Minister stated that he felt it was a very good working device for both the Governor and the Minister to compound offences.
As I stated in my speech just now, if he were to compound minor offences, I am all with him.

The snag is if this were used to compound major offences as it can under the law, then it will be a travesty of justice on the part of the Governor of Bank Negara or of the Minister to compound major offences and let the dishonest bankers get away from a prison sentence.
Tun Tan Siew Sin: Mr Chairman, Sir, we have not—when I say "we" I mean the Treasury and Bank Negara— the matter that aspect of forgotten brought up by the Honourable Member it in that for Batu, is sometimes desirable to allow the commercial banks to finance the acquisition of shares of the large foreign companies—in fact, the Association of Banks does not allow us to forget this point—and we will provide for this very matter in our regulations.
Perhaps the Honourable Member did not understand me com pletely.
I tried to make it clear that we have already drafted regulations and these regulations will be discussed with the Association of Banks in Malaysia, whereby banks will be allowed auto matically and without seeking the prior approval of the Governor of Bank Negara to invest in what we might call, the reputable shares of the bigger companies up to a certain extent of the issued capital and their reserves, and that provision will take care of the very point mentioned by the Honourable Member for Batu.
I think he agrees with me on that.

That will take care of his point.

in future when In regard to the second point on the to compounding of offences, I tried make it clear that there may be occa sions it would be desirable, for example, to take a bank director to court.
The Honourable Member should know that banks are very sensitive institutions and a court case with regard to banks is the surest way to start a run on the bank and, therefore, it may be desirable some- times for these matters to be settled behind the scenes far from the public gaze, because there are occasions when we do not want to direct publicity to banks.

This is one of the reasons why it is desirable that there should be provision the compounding of offences.
for Dr Tan Chee Khoon: On a point of clarification, Mr Chairman Sir.

It is the intention of the Government to use this power to compound all offences, even of a criminal nature, which means that there will be this run on the bank that he talks of.

Surely, it is not the intention of the Government to be a party to such malpractices?

Tun Tan Siew Sin: Mr Chairman, Sir, it is not possible for me to give an answer to such a hypothetical question.
6939 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6940 We will have to judge each case on its merits.

When the time comes, we will decide whether it is desirable to com pound the offence or to take the matter to court.

Pindaan di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Fasal 10 yang di-pinda di-perentah- kan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

Fasal 11 di-perentahkan menjadi sa- bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.
Fasal 12— Tun Tan Siew Sin: Mr Chairman, Sir, I beg to move the amendment proposed in the amendment list which has already been circulated the Honourable Members.

The Amendment reads: to Clause 12: Delete the word "or" appearing at the end thereof.

Pindaan di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Fasal 12, yang di-pinda di-perentah kan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

Rang Undang2 di-laporkan dengan pindaan: di-bachakan kali yang ketiga dan di-luluskan.
THE CENTRAL BANK OF MALAYSIA (AMENDMENT) BILL, 1967 Bachaan Kali Yang Kedua dan Ketiga Tun Tan Siew Sin (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that a Bill intituled "An Act to amend the Central Bank of Malaysia Ordinance, 1958" be read a second time.

to I have already presented this House an Act to amend the Banking Ordinance, 1958, as part of the exercise to to enable Bank Negara Malaysia supervise and control banks in this country more adequately in the public interest.
The Bill before this House to amend the Central Bank of Malaysia Ordinance, 1958, is complementary to the amendments to the Banking Ordi been have nance which approved.

already Clause 2 of the Bill is designed to reduce the quorum required for meet ings of the Board of Directors from five to four.

This is purely a procedural matter designed to ensure that meetings of the Board may be held even though it may not be possible to collect at any one time more than four members of the Board.
The Association of Banks in Malay sia in its submissions on the proposed amendments has claimed that clause 3 of the Bill will extend the powers of Bank Negara Malaysia to matters which lie outside the objects of a central bank.

Two of the principal objects of Bank Negara are: "(a) to promote monetary stability and a sound financial structure; and (6) to influence the credit situation to the advantage of Malaysia."
In pursuing these objectives, Bank Negara has been empowered to make recommendations to banks in respect of the rates of interest payable to or by banks and the rates of discount charge able by banks.

Although control over interest rates is an important instrument of Central Bank policy, it could be evaded by the banks concerned if the powers of recommendation of Bank Negara were to be limited to interest rates only.
Commissions and other charges imposed by banks are also important forms of charges levied by banks which affect the cost of credit in the country, so that empowering Bank Negara to make recommendations to banks on commissions and charges cannot, by any means, be said to be against its objects.

Under existing conditions, commer cial banks in Malaysia follow the rules of their Association in the conduct of their banking business.
Changes in interest rates have been effected by way of changes in the rules of the Associa tion.

As rates of commission and other charges which banks impose on their customers are also included in the rules of the Association, Bank Negara should be empowered to make recommenda tions on these rates of commission and other charges through changes to the existing rules of the Association or by 6941 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6942 introducing new rules if this should be rules will be these necessary.
As observed by all banks alike, it is incor rect to suggest that Bank Negara in exercising the powers of recommenda tion conferred by this provision will need to be involved in the day to day affairs of any bank.

Moreover, it is the practice of Bank Negara to consult the Association of Banks in Malaysia regarding changes in the rules, so that the views of the Association are always taken into consideration.
I understand that not so long ago the Association its rules on interpreted commission on letters of guarantee so as to benefit only the banks themselves and against the interests of not only their customers but also the country as a whole, and Bank Negara had great difficulty in dissuading the Association from such an interpretation.
In another instance, one or two banks resorted to levying a service charge of 1% to 2% per annum as a lump sum over and above the interest rate charged to their customers and, here again, it was only after some difficulty that Bank Negara persuaded to cancel such charges, which distorted the interest rate structure.

I therefore con sider it essential in the public interest that Bank Negara should be empowered to make recommendations to banks on rates of commission and other charges payable to banks.
the banks concerned to The proposed amendment in clause 4 is designed purely remove any possibility of doubt as to the effect of the Central Bank of section 44 of Malaysia Ordinance and section 11 of the Banking Ordinance.
While section 44 (1) of the Central Bank of Malaysia Ordinance prohibits Bank Negara from asking for information on any indivi dual account in a licensed bank in Malaysia, section 11 (1) of the Banking Ordinance, on the other hand, requires all banks in Malaysia to furnish parti culars of all unsecured advances granted to certain categories of borrowers to Bank Negara.
As all banks in Malaysia will now be required to furnish parti culars of all advances, both secured and unsecured, granted to certain cate the proposed gories of borrowers, amendments to section 44 are designed to resolve the apparent conflict between these two provisions.

I should add that under section 44 (2) of the Central Bank of Malaysia Ordinance, statistical information received from a bank is regarded as secret between that bank and the Central Bank.

Sir, I beg to move.
Sir, I beg to move.

Menteri Muda Kewangan (Dr Ng Kam Poh): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya menyokong usul ini.

Dr Tan Chee Khoon (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, what I have said just now in my introductory remarks regard ing (Amendment) Bill 1967, applies with equal cogency to the Bill before us today.
the Banking is I think it would be true to say that the public and the banks would wel come and accept the need for such control and direction as really the Central Bank of necessary by Malaysia, in order its to carry out the Central Bank of objects.

But Malaysia should confine its activities as laid down in its objects and should certainly not exercise its functions in such a way as to hamper or encroach on the day to day running of banks that I have mentioned before.
The Minister should strike a fine balance between the control that is necessary and yet not meddle with the manage ment of banks.

With these preliminary remarks let us now examine the bill before us today.

On the surface of it, the amend ments sought for by the Minister are small and may even look innocuous to the uninitiated.

However, the House should know that they are not that simple and that they can have far- reaching effects.
The Central Bank of Malaysia (Amendment) Bill has only three material clauses, Clause 2— When the Ordinance was originally enacted in 1958, Section 8 (2) provided the that the Board of Directors of Central Bank should consist of the Governor, the Deputy Governor and five Directors.

A quorum for meetings of the Board was then four Directors 6943 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6944 to under Section 13 (3).
At the beginning of 1965, the Central Bank of Malaysia (Amendment and Extension) Act, 1965, amended Section 8 (2) of the Ordinance so that, in addition to the Governor and the Deputy Governor, the number of Directors would not be less than five and not more than eight.

At the same time, Section 13 (3) was amended so that the quorum for a meeting of the five.
The Board was increased to present amending Bill proposes reduce the quorum for a meeting of the Board back to four again, but no reason is given for this reduction.
It is to be noted again, however, that the proviso to Section 13 (3) of the Ordinance gives the Chairman a casting vote in the case of an equality of votes, and, as both the Governor and the Deputy Governor are Directors of the Bank, at a meeting of the Board at which only two other directors are present, it will be possible for a decision to be made on the votes of the Deputy Governor together.

With a quorum of five as at present, this is not possible.
We can see that is reduced to four then the Governor and his deputy can dominate the proceed ings of the Central Bank of Malaysia.

Surely, it is not the intention of the Minister to let them do so.

Mr Speaker, Sir, if there is no merit in this quorum of five, why should the Minister way back in 1965 amend the original four to five, and today he seeks the permission of this House to bring it back to four again?
Surely, the Minister and the Governor cannot change ideas on this vital matter of a quorum backwards and forwards in a matter of two-three years and, as such, I submit that there is no case for the quorum to be reduced to four.

the Governor and the quorum if Clause 3— Clause 3 of the Bill empowers Bank Negara to prescribe the rate or amount of commission, but it does not say whether it shall be a maximum or a minimum.
Presumably, it is to empower Bank Negara restrictions and the Minister just now in his speech has stated the case for such restrictions.

It is my opinion that such restrictions are not within the objects of the Central Bank as set out in Section 4 of the impose to Central Bank of Malaysia Ordinance, and the Minister has just now read the relevant clauses (c) and (d) of Section 4.
The amendment would extend the powers of the Central Bank to matters outside its scope prescribed in (c) and (d) of Section 4 and may well be ultra vires these two provisions.

Presumably, the Minister thinks that by virtue of Section 39 of the Principal Act, such recommendations are enforceable by a direction issued with the approval of the Minister.
But it is clear that the Dewan Ra'ayat then, i.e., in 1958, when the Principal Act was passed, intended that the power to make such recom mendations should be exercised within the limits of the prescribed objects of the Central Bank that I have indi cated—that the Minister himself has read out.
This limitation of the power of the Central Bank too is reflected in Section 37 of the Principal Act which permits the making of such recommen dations only when the Central Bank is satisfied that the recommendations are for the purpose of giving effect to the Central Bank's object.

Another important matter is that the charges imposed by banks in Malaysia should not be out of line with those in Singapore.
This is obvious, for if these charges in Malaysia are too high there would simply be a shift of business to Singapore.

In simple terms, there would be a flight of business to Singapore and, surely, that is not the intention of this amendment.

Already without this amendment there has been a shift of business to Singapore.
Furthermore, in order for the Central Bank to make recommendations on charges and com missions, to make it would have detailed and comprehensive examina tions of the operations and costs of the activities of the banks.

I submit that the Central Bank has neither the staff to do this, and what is more important, this is not one of the proper functions of the Central Bank as laid down in Section 4 of the Principal Act, in parti cular (c) and (d).
Clause 4—(Invasion of secrecy)— the right of As regards Clause 4, the explanation is that it is necessitated by the proposed 6945 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6946 information the affairs of the Central Bank, into amendment to the Banking Ordinance.

But this is a very serious invasion of the right of secrecy which an individual customer has been guaranteed by Section 22 of the Banking Ordinance, 1958.
It reads: "Nothing in this Ordi nance shall authorise the Minister to direct the Central Bank, or shall autho to enquire rise specifically the individual customer of a licensed bank."

Further, Section 44 of the Central Bank of Malaysia Ordinance, 1958, expressly regarding any excludes individual account.
"The Central Bank may at any time for the purpose of carrying out its functions under this Ordinance require a bank to furnish such statistical information (other than information regarding any individual account in such bank) as the Bank may specify."

The present amend ment by deleting the sentence within brackets that I have quoted provides for the exact opposite.

This will have serious consequences and will under mine public confidence in banks and may cause a flight of capital.
Just now we heard the Member for Temerloh stressing on the importance of secrecy; the Member for Tanjong also stressed on the importance of secrecy.

I quote: I consider that this piece of legisla tion will have the effect of encouraging our people to keep their money in foreign banks which may be able to hold our country to ransom, or at least to dictate to us.
Most of the Ministers should be aware how the "Gnomes of Zurich" were able to dictate to the Bank of England and how Swiss Banks has become so powerful.

Perhaps many Alliance have accounts in Swiss Banks, because of the absolute secrecy they enjoy.

As such, it would be absolute folly for Bank Negara to destroy this secrecy and the confidence.

Besides, the Comptroller- General of Income Tax has already ample powers to examine the bank accounts of individuals.

Must Bank Negara also have such powers?


What if Bank Negara gets bloody minded against particular individuals?

themselves leaders One must remember that the staff of the Inland Revenue Department in investigating the accounts of an indivi in the proceedings of dual has to swear to an oath of secrecy.

Nowhere do I see such a precautionary measure either in the Principal Act or in the proposed amendment, although the Minister does say that this is so, the Minister's words are only but this recorded House.
The Act is what matters, and nowhere, I submit, in the Principal Act or in the proposed amendments is such a provision for secrecy.

This amend ment, I reiterate, will not only impair but also destroy public confidence in our banking system which has strictly maintained the doctrine of secrecy of a depositor's account.

As one who has been taught to maintain my patient's secrets, I am aghast at this amendment.
the workings of Furthermore, I for one fail to see of what use it is that the Central Bank or its officers should have the power to pry into the individual accounts.

Thus, how can my account, for example, be of such importance as to affect the Central Bank?

In the explanatory note it is stated that this proposed amendment is necessitated by the amendment pro posed for Section 11 of the Banking Ordinance, 1958, to remove any pos sible conflict.
If that is the purpose of this amendment the proper thing would be to tidy up Section 11 of the Banking Ordinance of 1958 rather than have this proposed is amendment obnoxious both to the depositors and it is to the banks.

Furthermore, if thought necessary the accounts of directors and other em ployees of the banks, and I can see merit in this, why does the Minister not bring amendments to this effect instead of this obnoxious inflicting amendment on depositors as well?
investigate which to Mr Speaker, Sii, in conclusion, in view of what I have said about the three clauses, i.e., Clauses 2, 3 and 4, I hope I have convinced this House that Clause 2 will increase the power of the Governor and bis Deputy, Clause 3 is the inconsistent with the objects of Principal Act as contained in Section 4 of that Act, and Clause 4 is obnoxious as it destroys the secrecy between the depositors and the banks.
If I have succeeded in doing this, then I call on 6947 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6948 this House to throw out this Amend ment.

interference Finally, Mr Speaker, Sir, with your permission I wish to read what the Press thinks of some of these amend ments.
This is from the editorial of the Straits Times of the 22nd February, 1968, "To its authority to recommend bank the interest rates, which, with concurrence of the Finance Minister, the Central Bank may direct banks to is now the Central Bank observe, seeking authority to fix other charges and commissions, an unfair and un necessary banking business, unless it is the Central Bank's intention practically to run all banks by remote control."
Now, Mr Speaker, Sir, I have stated before that most of us, in fact all of us in this House, will agree with the Minister that he should see to it that malpractices that have occurred in the past should be rooted out and the malpractices that may occur in the future should be prevented, but that does not mean that we should give the Central Bank of Malaysia the power to run the banks in this country by remote control which these amend ments seek to provide.

Thank you.
Thank you.

in Tuan (Timbalan) Yang di-Pertua: ini di-tempohkan hingga Meshuarat pukul 4.00 petang.

Persidangan di-tanggohkan pada pukul 1.00 tengah hari.

Persidangan di-sambong sa-mula pada pukul 4.00 petang.

(Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan Meshuarat) THE CENTRAL BANK OF MALAYSIA (AMENDMENT) BILL Bachaan Kali Yang Kedua dan Ketiga Perbahathan di-sambong sa-mula.
Tun Tan Siew Sin (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, only one Honourable Member, namely the Honourable Mem ber for Batu, spoke on this Bill and I shall reply to the points which have been raised by him, although he is not in the House at present.

He is not happy with Clause 2 of the Bill because he feels that there was no good reason for reducing the quorum from 5 to 4.
It was true, Sir, that the quorum was increased from 4 to 5 in 1965 but the size of the Board of the Bank was increased from 7 to a maxi mum of 10.

This increase in the number of members of the Board was meant to bring from in new Board members Singapore and East Malaysia as a result of the establishment of Malaysia.

However, the new members have not been appointed to the Board, so that the Board remains at its original num ber of 7 including the Governor and the Deputy Governor.
Under the cir cumstances, therefore, it was felt justifi able and reasonable to go back to the original number of 4 and I do not think anybody can suggest that a quorum of 4 out of a total strength of 7 is too low.
The Honourable Member for Batu also is of the view that it would be impracticable for the Central Bank to make the recommendations which are the subject of Clause 3 of the Bill because, he says, they will involve, too many recommendations, and so many banks are involved and so many tran sactions are involved.
I do not think that he has got hold of the right end of the stick, because all that Bank Negara need to do is to make a recom mendation, and not in respect of any individual bank, because the rule is that the Association of Banks in Malaysia makes rules for all the banks which are members of the Association and in the event of such a recommendation being made, that recommendation applies to all the banks.
So, there is no question of imprac ticable or that it could only be imple mented with a great deal of or with too much administrative work.

this new proposal being In regard to Clause 4 of the Bill, the Honourable Member suggested that this is a very serious evasion of the right of secrecy and that nowhere in any law relating to the subject are there pre cautionary measures to ensure that this rule of secrecy is not broken.
He apparently is not aware that sub-section 2 of Section 44 provides that statistical information received from a bank under sub-section (1) of Section 44 shall be 6949 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6950 regarded as secret between that bank and in the Central Bank.
Again, the Central Bank of Section 16 of Malaysia Ordinance, it is provided that except for the purpose of the perfor mance of his duties or the exercise of his functions or when lawfully required to do so by any court or under the provisions of any law, no director, officer, or employee of the Bank shall disclose to anv person any information relating to the affairs of the Central Bank, or of a bank or of a customer of the Central Bank or of a bank which he has acquired the per formance of his duties or the exercise of his functions.
It will, therefore, be observed that there are adequate safe information guards gained under the provisions of this Clause is kept secret and will be kept secret as between the bank and the Central Bank.

to ensure that in Usul di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Rang Undang2 di-bachakan kali yang kedua dan di serahkan kapada Dewan sa-bagai Jawatan-kuasa.

Dewan bersidang sa-bagai Jawatan- kuasa.

Rang Undang2 di-timbangkan dalam Jawatan-kuasa.


(Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan Jawatan-kuasa) Fasal2 1 hingga 4 di-perentahkan sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

Rang Undang2 di-laporkan dengan di-bachakan kali tidak ada pindaan yang ketiga dan di-luluskan.

other is to raise the exemption limit for development tax from $500 to $2,000 per annum.
for the With regard to tin profits tax the law as it stands now provides that only the person who has sold the tin con centrates produced will be allowed the standard profit deduction of $100 per picul of tin metal derived from the tin concentrates sold in computing his profits for tin profits tax purposes.
This gives rise to an anomalous position in that where a mine is worked on a tri bute basis the person working the mine and paying the tribute, although he will be subject to tin profits tax, will not be eligible the standard deduction since he has not sold the tin con centrates produced.

On the other hand, tributes who has not worked the mine but has the right by law to sell the tin concentrates pro full duced amount of the standard profit deduction.
to The proposed amendment seeks remove the this anomaly by giving benefit of producing tin metal to in his standard profit deduction every person responsible in capacity as an entrepreneur and not as a labour contractor in proportion to his share in the profits of the particular mining operations or his share in the proceeds of sale of the tin concentrates produced by those particular mining operations.
The amendment also seeks to provide that the labour contractor will no longer be liable to tin profits tax since he is merely supplying the labour to work the mine on a contract basis.

The pro posed amendment will take effect for the year of assessment 1968 and subse quent years of assessment.
is alone entitled the the to THE FINANCE ACT, 1968 Bachaan Kali Yang Kedua dan Ketiga Menteri Muda Kewangan (Dr Ng Kam Poh) {dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that a Bill intituled "An Act to amend the laws relating to in come tax in Sabah, Sarawak and West Malaysia and the law relating to sup plementary tax" be read a second time.

income The purpose of this Bill is two-fold.


One is to remove an anomaly in the administration of tin profits tax and the Honourable Members will recall that development tax was introduced in 1967 by amending the three separate Income Tax/Inland Revenue Ordinances of West Malaysia, Sabah and Sarawak.
With the repeal of these Ordinances when the Income Tax Act, 1967, came into force the relevant provisions for the imposition of the tax have been consolidated into a single legislation and incorporated in the Supplementary Income Tax Act, 1967.
Since the pro posed amendment to raise the exemp tion limit from $500 to $2,000 per 6951 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6952 annum is to have retrospective effect to 1st January, 1967, the Bill now before the House is seeking to amend not only the Supplementary Income Tax Act but also the repealed Ordinances as well.

The Minister of Finance has already dealt at some length in his Budget the the need Speech with exemption limit and I do not therefore propose this matter.
further on to explain to raise Sir, I beg to move.

Setia-usaha Parlimen kapada Men- teri Kewangan (Tuan Ali bin Haji Ahmad): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya menyokong.

to Tuan Sim Boon Liang (Sarawak): Mr Speaker, Sir, I would touch on Clause 3 of this Bill through which the Honourable Minister of Finance seeks the approval of this House to amend the laws relating particularly the development tax in Malaysia.
Under this Clause, Sir, I understand that the exemption limit for an individual, who is not a partner in any partnership business, will be raised to $2,000 a year.

But, Sir, I would say that the exemp tion limit is too small.
Sir, in the case of Sarawak, I would like to urge the Honourable Minister of Finance that the exemption limit for development tax should be raised to $4,000 a year instead of $2,000 There are three reasons: (1) because the cost of living in Sarawak is very high; (2) the small hawkers or small traders in Sarawak, who just only earn $180 or a little more a month, which is still not enough to feed their their families or to send children to school, are asked to pay the development tax under Clause 3 of this Finance Bill and (3), Sir, the people in Sarawak still have not got the full measure of benefits in public services in West Malaysia.
as those enjoyed Therefore, Sir, I earnestly suggest to the Honourable Minister of Finance that some sort of adjustment should be made for East Malaysia, particularly Sarawak, regarding paragraph (2) of Clause 3, in order to raise the exemp tion limit about which I have spoken just now; or, if possible, Sir, I would like to urge the Honourable Minister of Finance to abolish the development tax in Sarawak for the time being until the State has caught up with the other States with the same full measure of benefit in public services.
Sir, regarding the small partnership businesses in Sarawak, I would like to take this opportunity to bring to the notice of the Honourable Minister of Finance the grievances of the small partnership businessmen.

I have close contact with them.

From my personal observation, I know that many of them have been asked to pay $100 each on development tax whether their business is having a small profit of $100 a year or not.

Sir, there are many small part nership businesses in Sarawak.
Now, I would like to lake one small partner ship business in my district as an example.

Sir, this business has four partners with a small capital of $4,000.

They rented a small theatre to run a film show business, which was very dull due to the decJine in prices of local products.

At the end of that year, this film show business was making only a profit of about $500 after deducting the theatre rent, film hire, Government entertainment duty and other expenses.
At the beginning of the next year, after submitting the business profit returns, these four partners were asked to pay $100 each for the so-called minimum development tax, i.e., the four of them had to pay $400 for the tax out of a profit of $500 from that business.

Sir, is it fair to tax these people who have made so little profit?
Therefore, Sir, I hope that the Honourable Minister of Finance will take this into his kind consideration and make some adjust ment with regard to the small partner ship businesses in Sarawak.

Thank you, Sir.

Dr Lim Chong Eu (Tanjong) {dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, I would like to participate in this debate and in so doing I just wish to continue to express our strong opposition to the develop tax.
Sir, we have consistently ment opposed right this development from the first when it was introduced in 1967 when we said that all the small traders—the barbers, the bicycle shop keepers and every one else—will rue and curse the day when they voted for the Alliance symbol.

This has produced tax 6953 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6954 to that the extent some effect the Government has attempted to alleviate the situation somewhat by raising the amount from $500 to $2,000.
Never theless, Sir, I still maintain that the development tax per se whether it is increased from $2,000 to $4,000 as has already been suggested by the Member from Sarawak, or even if it is increased from $4,000 to $5,000, by virtue of its historical connection with the turnover tax, the development tax will still be an unpopular tax, and we have to strongly oppose the imposition of the develop ment tax, and I ask the Government to consider withrawing it completely.
in Dr Ng Kam Poh (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, I can quite understand that the Honourable Member for Tan- jong is opposing this tax by saying that this tax is very unpopular.

No one this this House, or outside inside House, will regard any tax measure as a popular measure.

It is a fact of life is that when anybody's pocket being touched upon he will oppose.

But tax we must and tax we will have to to, otherwise how are we going run to have this Government and development this country?
This is a basic fact of life, and I hope the Opposition Members will come up with constructive criticisms saying that they do not like this tax, that this tax will bring in, say, $15 million, they will give some other form of tax that is popular according to them to give $15 million in this House.

But they have not done so, Mr Speaker, Sir.

They just merely criticise and say that it is unpopular.

Mr Speaker, Sir, every tax is unpopular.

Nobody to pay money.


I do not like too, but I will have to pay my income tax.

I believe that in Malaysia taxation is not as high as in many, many countries in the world, taking for example £0.19.6 is in being U.K.—of course, I concede that it is a developed country.
taxed out of the pound likes and In reply to the Honourable Member from Sarawak concerning small part small partnerships, Mr ners Speaker, Sir, "partnership" means that the partners draw a certain amount of pay or allowance out of the part nership.

By drawing an allowance out of this partnership, thereby their profit is reduced to a margin of non-existent or no profit at all, but the profit has been taken out because of the allow ance or pay the partnership from business.
That is why we cannot exempt partnerships tax, and each and everyone has to pay $100.

This is a fact, and I am sure the Honourable Member from Sarawak will not oppose me because this is what partnership is meant.

from development He raised three very interesting points that the cost of living is high in Sarawak, that the hawkers there have to pay the tax if they earn $180 and that Sarawak has not the full measure of benefits.

I will reply to them one by one.


Firstly, the cost of living in Sarawak in the towns are not very much higher than in the towns in West Malaysia.

So, let us not have this belief that Sarawak is a very, very poor, under-nourished country, so that they cannot afford to pay the tax.
Secondly, if the high cost of living is so high in Sarawak, the hawkers can easily earn more than $180 a month and they can probably earn $300 to $400 a month if the high cost of living is such as stated by the Honourable Member from Sarawak.

Thirdly, on the question of full measure of benefits, he knows full well that the development expenditure per capita in West Malaysia is only $64 whereas it is $67 in Sarawak and Sabah.
In fact, they are having the best of both worlds as the Minister of Finance has said.

I do not think it is very fair on the part of the people in West Malaysia to give so much con cession to the people of East Malaysia, who are having the best of both worlds, as well as wanting the abolishment of the development tax.

Usul di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Rang Undang2 di-bachakan kali yang kedua dan di-serahkan kapada Dewan sa-bagai Jawatan-kuasa.

Dewan bersidang sa-bagai Jawatan- kuasa.


Rang Undang2 di-timbangkan dalam Jawatan-kuasa.

6955 29 FEBRUARI 1968 .

6956 (Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan Meshuarat Jawatan-kuasa) Fasal2 1, 2 dan 3— Dr Lim Chong Eu (dengan izin): Mr Chairman, Sir, I take this opportu nity to rebut some of the statements that were made by the Honourable Assistant Minister, because I would still maintain that Clause 3 in regard to the tax exemption being raised from $500 to $2,000 is inadequate.
The very that we could suggest to the least Government is to raise the level from $2,000 to $4,000 as has been proposed, that is to say, on an average of about $350 a month.
Sir, they earn, let us say, $2,000 a year, or about $150 a month, and there are numbers of people who make that income and who are subject to the development tax; and this is a very poor section of the those community, because frequently who are subject to tax have to carry very many other heads within their families and support them; hence the level of $2,000 for the payee of the tax is not a good index.
Sir, the point that I would like to rebut the Honourable Assistant Minister is that we have been unconstructive.

We had tried very hard to indicate that if it were only a matter of $15 million savings in order to do away with the development tax, the Government could very well do that by really pruning its own expenditure.
For hard on example, during the course of the debate on the Budget, I have indicated that the Treasury should very well cut down $770,000 over increased for increased for handling expenditure taxes.

Sir, it is this type of expenditure which makes the people, who have to suffer most, feel that this kind of tax is unpopular, and I do hope that the Minister will consider at some subse quent date to increase this level from $2,000 to $4,000 and, if possible, even to eliminate the whole of the develop ment tax.
Dr Ng Kam Poh: Mr Chairman, Sir, though somewhat eloquent, the Hon ourable Member has got the wrong end of the stick because representation sent to us from all over the country when I say "all over", I mean all over—has been for $2,000—it has not been for $4,000.

And his suggestion, constructive as he says, that we should eliminate $770,000 because we have more taxes, we have got to have more staff, is incomprehensible because we need to have the staff to work.
But this $770,000 is to produce $15,000,000; surely there is a wide gap of difference— of about $14,250,000 or roughly of that order.

So, I do not see how his that so-called constructive suggestion a reduction of $770,000 would in a way affect tax of $15,000,000.

That is not constructive enough.

What he should say is that we should produce a tax which is popular, according to him, in this country to produce $15,000,000 in lieu of the development tax.
Then I am sure the Government will be only too willing to abolish this development tax.

That is constructive suggestion the Opposition benches—not this type.

Mr Chairman, Sir, I am afraid our opinions differ.

One man's meat is another man's poison.

the development from Dr Lim Chong Eu: Sir, with your permission, I would like to take this opportunity, in Committee Stage, to explain further.
I think the Honourable Assistant Minister has quite clearly painted a wrong picture, because it is quite clear that two representations— one from Sarawak and the other one from Penang—indicated that the level of $2,000 is not adequate and that it should be $4,000; and unless we are going to be abolished into the region of limbo, I feel that our representation in this House is a valid one and the Government certainly cannot use the word "all"; it must at least include "all except two" for the purposes of today.
(Ketawa).

Sir, the other factor is this.
I indi cated that the Treasury itself can begin to cut down and make an effort to save—on this question of the classic example of Parkinson's Law in that when you increase more taxes you have to employ more staff; and in this particular this particular Budget, the Treasury has to spend $770,000—1 admit it is a long cry from case for 6957 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6958 the Treasury's ex $15,000,000—but penditure on the annual Budget, I think, is less than 10 per cent of the total Budget expenditure of all the other Departments of the Government; and if the Treasury sets this example, you will collect not $770,000 from all the departments, you have savings coming very well close to $15,000,000.
That is all I ask of the Government, that the Government, as it expects the people to bear the burden, should also really get down to the business of keeping down expenditure, so that we will not have to be presented with unpopular taxes.

Dr Ng Kam Poh: Mr Chairman, Sir, here again the Member for Tanjong is speaking on a somewhat different matter.
The Treasury as I have always told him, and I am still telling him, has always been very stringent and in its expenditure, but, very careful somehow or other, it does not penetrate—not through my fault surely, because I have been repeating it so often.

He says, "You must listen to the two representations from this House".

What I mentioned was representation made to the Minister from the lower income groups from all over Malay this representations sia—not House.
As Opposition Members it is their duty to oppose.

How they oppose it is up to them—whether it be on estimates, or legal matter.

Right or wrong, they have to oppose—otherwise, he will not be sitting there after 1969.

He probably will lose.

So, he has to oppose.

I can understand that.

Mr Chairman, Sir, you too can understand that.

(Ketawa).

from least, for constituency—I The Honourable Member from Sarawak—I do not know he is from which suppose he represents part of Sarawak—might also lose.
At the Honourable Member for Tanjong, if he does not oppose he might not be returned.

So, I can understand what he is saying now.

He might say "$5,000" or "$6,000" or even "abolish the tax".

What I am saying is this: if you can give us a constructive, or an alternative tax— whether it is popular or unpopular it is up to him—to give $15,000,000 as income to the Government, I am sure the Minister of Finance and the Treasury would be only too happy to accept his suggestion.

Thank yau, Sir.
Thank yau, Sir.

Tuan Geh Chong Keat: Untok pen- jelasan, Tuan Pengerusi, saya minta izin beruchap dalam bahasa Inggeris.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Penjelasan apa!

Tuan Geh Chong Keat: Sebab jawapan daripada Menteri Muda.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Itu tadi patut di-jawab.

Tuan Geh Chong Keat: Sekarang dia baharu sahaja beri jawapan.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Itu sudah habis-lah.

Fasal2 1 hingga 3 di-perentahkan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.
Rang Undang2 di-laporkan dengan tidak ada pindaan: di-bachakan kali yang ketiga dan di-luluskan.

THE INVESTMENT INCENTIVES BILL Bachaan Kali Yang Kedua dan Ketiga Menteri Perdagangan dan Perusahaan (Dr Lim Swee Aun) (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Bill, "The Investment Incentives Bill" be now read a second time.
Our immediate objectives are to provide greater employment opportu nities for our increasing population to widen and strengthen the base of our economy, to diversify the sources of our foreign exchange earnings and increase our export income.

The Invest the ment Incentives Bill measures these objectives.
The Bill provides for a variety of incentives to induce a greater and more rapid flow of investments not only in manufacturing and agricul tural based industries but also other enterprises and to encourage the expan sion of exports in manufactures.

is one of achieving towards This Bill is based on the recom mendations of a Committee appointed 6959 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6960 by the Government under the Chair manship of my Permanent Secretary, Raja Tan Sri Mohar.
The Committee, in formulating their recommendations, reviewed the adequacy of existing incentives.

They examined the various incentives provided by countries within and outside our region and they took into consideration responsible opinions and suggestions submitted in dividuals and related organizations in the country.
As a result of their review and study, the Committee have recom mended existing incentives and the introduction of new ones and for convenience and ease of reference these incentives should as far as practicable, be embodied in a single legislation.

improvements from to the need particularly takes cognizance of Much care and thought have, there fore, gone into the designing of the Bill.

to It this spread development country, less developed areas.
It also lays emphasis on encouraging the maximum employ ment of labour and use of local raw materials and the maximum conserva tion foreign exchange earnings.

throughout the and net increase in to This Bill is very technical and to assist the House I shall try to explain in the simplest possible terms the main provisions of the Bill and where appropriate the comparison with exist ing provisions.
The provisions of the Investment Incentives Bill, Mr Speaker, Sir, will extend throughout Malaysia and will be retrospective as January, 1968. from 1st Part I of the Bill deals with definitions and I would like to draw the attention of this House to the new definition of "Industry" which now commercial includes undertaking to manufacturing only as in the existing Ordinance.

and not confined any kind of Part II of the Bill deals with pioneer status.
With the wider definition of "Industry", pioneer status can now be given to non-manufacturing industries.

The procedure industry and product, laid down under Chapter I relating to the declaration of the pioneer application and the granting of pioneer certificate, its amendment and can cellation are the same as in the existing legislation.
Section 3 (1) (b) is new and specifically states that a product or industry may be declared pioneer if it is to be manufactured for exports or the industry would contribute to the economic development of Malaysia.

Chapter 2 of Part II provides for tax relief for companies granted pioneer status.

A number of important modi fications have been made to improve upon the existing provisions.

Like the existing tax relief will be granted to companies that are declared pioneer.
There will be no minimum amount of investment level required to attain the initial two years of tax relief.
Extensions of tax relief will be granted as follows: legislation, a two-year (i) if by the end of the third year of the companies have production incurred fixed capital expenditure of not less than $250,000, the pioneer period will be extended by one year to three years; (ii) if by the end of the fourth year of production the companies have incurred fixed capital expenditure of not less than $500,000, the pioneer period will be extended by one year to four years; (iii) if by the end of the fifth year of production the companies have incurred fixed capital expenditure of not less than $1 million, the pioneer period will be extended by one more year to five years.
is an This provision improvement upon the existing legislation in that it gives industrialists one extra year in which to incur expenditure to qualify for extensions of pioneer status.

Under the existing legislation pioneer com panies have to incur their qualifying their expenditure before existing tax relief period.

Under the new Act extensions can be granted as long as the qualifying expenditure is incurred during in which extension of pioneer status is sought.
the end of the year 6961 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6962 levels, extensions of In addition to the five years tax relief which firms can be granted for attaining qualifying fixed capital ex penditure a three years are provided for further under Section 14, thus bringing the possible maximum up to eight years of tax relief.
In this respect one-year extension of tax relief period will be given for firms meeting each of the following provisions, designed to create a balanced development throughout the country by encouraging the expansion of industry in underdeveloped areas and the greater use of Malaysian raw materials : (i) if they establish factories in an area declared as a development area by the Government; (iii) if (ii) if they manufacture a product or establish an indusry declared as a priority product or industry; incorporate their products the percentage of Malay sian content specified by Govern ment.
they into it The other important modification is in respect of capital allowances.

For a pioneer company, the amount of capital allowances allowed for the first year of assessment after its tax relief period will be calculated on the aggregate of the capital expenditure incurred during the tax relief period.

This has given rise to an anomaly.


A pioneer company which suffer losses every year throughout its relief period will be placed in a worse-off position than a non-pioneer company in similar posi tion.

To correct this anomaly, Section 18 of the present Bill provides that where a pioneer company incurs losses throughout its tax relief period capital allowances will be notionally aggre gated, as if it is not a pioneer company.
and the total amount carried forward and allowed as a deduction for the post pioneer period.

In view of pressure on Government revenue and having regard to the total incentives granted, the Minister may, under Section 20, impose a condition in safeguard against pioneer companies enjoying exempt profits grossly out of proportion to their invested capital.

the pioneer status to The other important modification is in regard to exempt dividends.
Under Section 22 of the Bill the provision for exempt dividends of pioneer companies has been extended to include dividends in the hands of shareholders of com panies which own shares in pioneer companies.

This liberalizes the existing restriction whereby only dividends paid by holding companies are exempt in the hands of the shareholders.

Section 23 of the Bill incorporates the present exemption from payroll tax to pioneer companies.
Pre granted viously the exemption was granted under separate legislative provisions.

As in the existing legislation this new Bill provides for pioneer firms which incur tax relief period to offset the nett loss incurred during the pioneer relief period against profits of the post-pioneer period.

losses during their Chapter 3 introduces a new form of tax incentives called "Investment Tax Credit" to approved projects which are not considered suitable for grant of pioneer status.
to be given The rate of Investment Tax Credit given will not be less than 25% of the capital expenditure incurred on a fac tory plant or machinery the approved project.

for If the approved company has set up its factory in— (i) a development area; or (ii) produces priority product or products; or (iii) incorporates the required percen tage of Malaysian content, an additional Investment Tax Credit of 5% will be given for each of the three conditions fulfilled in the basis period.
is The Investment Tax Credit is given only once for the year of assessment in the basis period in which the expen diture incurred and such capital expenditure must be incurred within five years from the beginning of the basis period in which the project is approved, that is to say, if the capital expenditure in the sixth is incurred year, it will not qualify for an Invest ment Tax Credit.
6963 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6964 Where an Investment Tax Credit is given for the year of assessment an amount equal to the credit will be exempt from tax for that year.

But, where because of a loss or an insuffi ciency of income the credit cannot be fully utilised, any credit not so utilised can be carried forward to the first year of assessment for which there is profit, and so on for subsequent years until the whole amount of the credit is given.
Dividends paid out of income exempt from tax by virture of the grant on Investment Tax Credit are exempt in the hands of shareholders and tax at source will not be deducted from divi dends paid out.

The Investment Tax Credit will be of particular advantage to a company as it is already assured of a tax credit which it can use as and when a profit is made.
Under the pioneer status the concession ceases at the end of the tax relief period whether or not the com pany makes a profit or loss during that period.

A company, however, has the choice of either being granted pioneer status or investment tax credit, which ever in its assessment, is to its advan tage.

The Investment Tax Credit is, in fact, an introduction of a type of "Cre dit Card" system in tax relief, whereby it can always carry the amount of tax credit until it is fully utilised.
market research and such other related expenses.

These deductions will be allowed in addition to those already provided for, under the provisions of the Income Tax Act of 1967.

Pioneer companies will have a special privilege under the Schedule.

All deduc tions which have been allowed under this Schedule and which are incurred during a pioneer company's tax relief period can be carried forward and the aggregate of this will be allowed as deductions in the post-tax relief period.
Another new export incentive takes the form of an accelerated depreciation allowance in respect of capital expen diture incurred in acquiring plant or equipment to modernise production techniques in existing or newly set up factories.

This incentive takes cogni zance of the fact that in order to com pete successfully in export markets, firms have to use efficient and up-to- date machines.
Only approved resident companies will be entitled to obtain accelerated depreciation and in order to qualify for it these companies must export more than 20% by value of its total produc tion.

Exporters of primary commodities and companies enjoying pioneer status or investment tax credit, however, will not qualify.

Part III of the Bill provides a range of export incentives for enterprising manufacturers who wish to export their products.
to obtain The first of these relates to deduc tions for certain out-goings and expen ses for the promotion of exports.

The rules governing these deductions are set out in the Schedule to this Bill.

Every company that wishes to avail itself of these export promotion incentives will have a certificate of approval from the Minister of Finance.

Under the provisions of the Schedule any expenses incurred by the approved company for export promotion will be allowed as a deduction.
Such expenses will advertising expenses paid to persons not resident in Malaysia, expenses attributable to free samples for customers outside Malaysia, expenses incurred in conducting export overseas include The rate of accelerated depreciation given is 40% per annum.

This would mean that more than 90% of the initial outlay will be written off in (5) years which compares very favourably with the 20 or more years under the normal rates of allowances.

A further incentive introduced is the export allowance.
A non-resident com pany does not qualify for such allo wance and exports of primary com modities are excluded.

The allowance is related to the increase in exports, the extent of wages paid in respect of employees whose basic wage does not exceed $500 per month and to the amount of Malaysian materials pur chased for use in the manufacture of products for export.
The scheme is therefore intended: (i) to encourage exports of manufac tured products; 6965 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6966 (ii) to induce more liberal use of thereby Malaysian materials, maximisinig net foreign exchange savings; and (iii) to induce maximum employment of labour of the type which is in abundant supply in the country.
A "resident company" is defined under the principal Act as a company, the control and management of which is exercised in Malaysia, that is to say, the Directors' meetings, formulation of policies and management of the com pany are carried out in Malaysia.

A "non-resident company" means a company, the control and management of which are exercised abroad.
Broadly, the scheme allows an extra deduction for income tax purposes of 20 cents for every dollar of expenses incurred in wages and purchases of Malaysian materials during the basis period.
The amount of the allowance is calculated in the following manner: sales of manufactured products for the three preceding basis periods are initially calculated; (i) The average export the the excess of (ii) Determine sales of manufactured export products for the current basis period over the average export sales three preceding for years; and the (iii) Apply the following formula: Excess of Export Sales as deter mined X 20 cents.

Total Gross Sales for Basic Period.


incorporates The Bill further the existing provisions for the refund of an appropriate proportion of payroll tax paid by a manufacturer in the produc tion of an export product or products.

This relief is granted only to companies and in respect of products registered for the purpose with the Ministry of Commerce and Industry.

To qualify for the relief such companies must export more than 20% by value of the total production of the registered product.
The amount of refund in payroll tax is calculated in the proportion of the value of the export sales of the registered product to the total sales of the com pany for the year.

Part IV of the Bill deals with supple mental provisions relating to: (i) power of entry by authorised officers for checking premises and records in pursuance of the Act; (ii) power of the Minister to make rules for facilitating the operation of the Act.
With the coming into force of the Investment Incentives Act which will operate for the whole of Malaysia the following legislations will be repealed: (Relief Income Tax) Ordinance (i) The Pioneer Industries from 1956 of Sabah; and (ii) The Pioneer Industries (Relief Income Tax) Ordinance from 1958 of West Malaysia.
the Under transitional provisions, however, it is provided that the existing Pioneer Industries (Relief from Income Tax) Ordinance of Sabah and West Malaysia will continue to pioneer companies in existence on 1st these companies January, 1968, and will in addition be eligible for the benefits introduced under the new Bill.
In effect, it means that the existing pioneer companies will also qualify for: to apply (a) Extensions of tax relief periods by up to 3 more years if the conditions for such extensions as mentioned earlier are fulfilled; (b) National capital allowances to be aggregated and allowed the post-pioneer period as explained earlier.
in approved under The companies which have applied status and have been for pioneer approved in principle before the 1st January, 1968, will., when granted pioneer certificates, be regarded as the having been repealed Ordinances.
These companies will, therefore, be in the same position as pioneer companies approved before the 1st of January, 1968. colleague, the Minister of Finance, will be presenting for approval of this Session, an amendment to the Excise Act to provide a drawback of excise duty paid on components produced in Malaysia and the manufacture of export used the House at My in 6967 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6968 products.
The full drawback of excise duty and customs duties are additional aids, to manufacturers in developing their exports.

the that Mr Speaker, Sir, I hope that I have managed to explain sufficiently clearly to Honourable Members the technical provisions of the Bill.

The Government fully appreciates incentives provided in the Bill are liberal and involve Government in fairly substan tial losses in revenue.
But if we are to attract and compete for foreign invest ments and skills and to participate effectively in export markets, we have to bear some sacrifices.

We hope, in addition to the favourable climate for investments that we have created, the expanding market potentials both in terms of increase in population and purchasing power this country offers, investors, both foreign and local, will incentives the variety of provided in the Bill further incentives for investing in Malaysia.
This Bill is evident proof of the desire and deter mination of the Government to push ahead with and diversification of the country's economy.

industrialisation find that Having regard to the objectives and purposes of this Bill, I am confident that it will receive the full support of the House, including the Members of the Opposition.

two minor amendments As soon as this Bill was read the first time, it has been found necessary to make to Clauses 3 and 4 of the Schedule.
These amendments have been circulated to Honourable Members and I hope they read the opportunity have had them.

these amendments to be made in the Com mittee stage.

Thank you.

to formally move I will Dr Ng Kam Poh: Tuan Yang di- Pertua, saya menyokong usul ini.

Tuan Tan Toh Hong (Bukit Bintang): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya bangun untok memberi sokongan saya yang penoh kapada Rang Undang2 Galakan Pelaboran yang sekarang di-bentang di- Rumah yang mulia ini.
Ini ada-lah satu asas yang baik bagi negara kita dalam kerana ranchangan pada kali yang pertama-nya kita ada perusahaan-nya beberapa galakan untok perusahaan yang di-satukan dalam satu undang2.
Ini ada-lah satu tapak kemajuan ka- hadapan kalau di-bandingkan dengan taraf perintis (kelepasan daripada chu- kai pendapatan) yang telah di-kemuka- di-negeri2 Persekutuan Tanah kan Melayu pada tahun 1958 dan dari satu masa ka-samasa telah di-pinda yang mana sa-hingga hari ini hanya memberi chukai pendapatan perchuma untok membenar sharikat2 taraf perintis sa- hingga 5 tahun.

Ini patut di-bangkitkan dahulu lagi.


Sa-lain daripada kebebasan daripada chukai pendapatan, Rang Undang2 ini juga akan memberi galakan2 yang lain kapada perusahaan sa-chara (susutan di-perchepat) elaun pembangunan dan bantuan eksepot yang sangat mustahak bagi perkembangan perusahaan tempa- tan sa-chara pesat.
Mengikut pengala- man dari beberapa negeri bahawa maju dan subor sa-sabuah perusahaan tidak tertanggong kapada satu faktor sahaja chukai saperti kebebasan daripada pendapatan, juga bergantong kapada penyatuan beberapa galakan2, atau pun galakan2 lain untok menye- suaikan beberapa perusahaan.

Boleh- lah di-katakan bahawa peruntokan pada galakan2 ini akan memberi modal yang.

benar dalam perusahaan kilang dan ini akan menggalakkan perkem bangan lagi dalam beberapa tahun yang akan datang.
tetapi Tuan Yang di-Pertua, peruntokan bantuan eksepot ada-lah kena pada tempat-nya bagi perusahaan2 tempatan hendak-lah memberikan kita pertuka- ran wang asing bagi negara kita.

Penubohan perusahaan2 eksepot sangat- lah mustahak perkembangan bagi ekonomi kita sekarang ini oleh sebab kedudokan baki pembayaran kita mero- sot oleh sebab jatoh-nya harga getah.
Jikalau negara ini berjaya menuboh- kan sa-buah perusahaan2 eksepot yang lichin, maka baki pembayaran kita boleh di-perbetulkan dan ekonomi kita tegoh.

ini Ada-lah menggumbirakan Rang Undang2 di-kemukakan walau bagaimana pun saya harap ia-itu galakan2 ini di-laksanakan sa-berapa chepat yang boleh dengan lichin-nya, 6969 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6970 itu sama ada-lah tadbiran jikalau kita hendak menchapai kema- juan perusahaan yang chepat di-negeri ini.
Kita tahu bahawa bahagian kilang hanya ekonomi sa-gulongan kechil negara kita pada masa ini dan mem- punyai banyak peluang untok berkem- bang.

Oleh sunggoh mustahak bagi Kerajaan kita menguat- kuasakan peruntokan Rang Undang2 ini dengan segera yang sa-berapa boleh.

Saya telah pun berchakap ber- kenaan dengan perkara ini dahulu dan saya akan ulangi lagi dengan harapan bahawa chara2 lama akan di-kurangkan.
entrepreneurs Jikalau terbuka memenohi borang2 yang pan- jang dan menunggu beberapa lama untok mendapat keputusan yang akan di-buat ada mereka berhak menerima galakan, atau tidak, maka saya khuatir ini akan menjadi satu halangan dalam mengembangkan per usahaan kita.

Saya mengambil kesem- patan menggesa Kerajaan supaya mengurangkan tadbir sa-chara dan memberi ke- senangan pada permintaan galakan untok faedah umum perkembangan perusahaan di-Malaysia.
Sa-lain dari- pada juga menggesa Kerajaan supaya menubohkan sa-buah antara Kementerian2 Jawatan-kuasa yang berkuasa penoh membuat ke putusan untok mengurangkan pentad- lama dan kelambatan.

biran chara ini berpandu kapada Jawatan-kuasa kechergasan akan menyelamatkan masa dan tenaga yang mana pada masa ini tersekat kapada tulis-menulis di-antara penanam2 modal dengan Kementerian Perusahaan, Perbenda- haraan, Pejabat2 Chukai Pendapatan dan Kastam dan sa-balek-nya.

itu saya suka di-sini untok lama (F.I.D.A.)


Industrial Development Federal Authority telah pun di- tubohkan dan saya faham pejabat ini ada mempunyai" banyak kaki-tangan pegawai2 yang kanan; tidak-lah men jadi salah kalau di-sebutkan bahawa F.I.D.A.

dengan kerjasama dari pehak Kementerian2 Kerajaan boleh mem- perchepatkan dalam bentok pertubohan yang ada sekarang.
Jumlah perkembangan perusahaan negeri ini ada-lah baik, tetapi tidak dynamic dan perusahaan kilang tem- patan hanya memberi 10 peratus Jikalau kapada pendapatan negara.

lagi kerja-nya ekonomi kita hendak di-pertegohkan ranchangan2 Kera dengar beranika jaan hendak-lah dengan sa-chara apa jalan pun menggalak penubohan per usahaan2.

Ini ada-lah mustahak untok memberi Malaysia publisiti dalam hal pelaboran kapada bukan penanam2 modal tempatan bahkan juga kapada seluroh dunia.
sahaja baik yang untok apa-kah F.I.D.A.

Ada beberapa banyak telah di-tubohkan untok per menasihat Kerajaan usahaan2 di-Malaysia.

Saya harap ia-nya akan selalu memberi tahu kapada orang ramai menerusi penerangan-nya dalam semua bahasa, ia-itu apa-kah perusahaan2 yang ber- di-tubohkan—bahasa2 faedah saperti Bahasa Kebangsaan, China, Tamil, Jerman, Inggeris, Peranchis, Jepun dan lain2 yang mustahak dalam dunia Penanam Modal Antarabangsa.
saudagar2 yang suka menubohkan perusahaan2, tetapi mereka tidak tahu bagaimana hendak menjalankan-nya.

Dan kita patut mengaku, ia-itu ada-lah payah sadikit untok mengambil keputusan mana perusahaan yang baik untok menanam modal.

F.I.D.A.

hendak-lah menolong saudagar2 suka hendak menanam modal, tetapi tidak tahu segi2 teknik (technical expertise).

Jikalau F.I.D.A.

menemui saudagar2 ini, saya perchaya bahawa beberapa banyak lagi kilang akan di-tubohkan di-seluroh negara kita.
ini yang tentang pengeluaran Tuan Yang di-Pertua, perusahaan ada- lah satu perkara yang baik dan kita semua bersetuju ini.

Tetapi ini juga bermaana bahawa wang asing dan keuntongan akan keluar daripada negeri ini, kerana barang2 jentera ter- paksa di-impotkan.

Oleh yang demi- kian: saya menggesa Kerajaan untok barang2 menggalakkan tempatan saperti jentera2 kechil.
Sa- lain itu Kerajaan patut-lah menggalak kan penubohan beberapa perusahaan menggunakan barang2 Ini ada-lah mustahak dalam usaha pem- bangunan negara kita dan ia bukan sahaja menambahkan pendapatan dan pekerjaan kapada pendudok2 di-luar bandar bahkan ia juga menambah per- tukaran wang asing dan meninggikan lagi kekayaan negara kita.

Oleh sebab itu jikalau kita banyak menggunakan tempatan.

6971 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6972 barang2 mentah tempatan ia-nya akan membawa faedah kapada negara dan ra'ayat2 kita.
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dengan suka- saya menyokong Rang chita-nya Undang2 ini.

Terima kaseh.

Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Saaid (Sebe- rang Utara): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya memberi sokongan yang penoh atas Rang Undang2 Galakan Pela- saya mengalu2kan bohan kenyataan daripada Yang Berhormat Menteri Perdagangan dan Perusahaan pada masa beliau membentangkan Rang Undang2 ini.
ini dan galakan sa-tinggi2 Saya mengambil peluang meng- tahniah kapada uchapkan Yang Berhormat Menteri yang telah pun mengadakan satu Rang Undang2 yang agak saya akan memberi lebeh lagi kapada orang2 yang galakan ingin hendak mendirikan kilang2 per usahaan di-dalam negara kita ini.
Di- samping itu, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya ingin-lah menarek perhatian Yang Berhormat Menteri pada masa kita kapada hendak memberi pemodal2 luar negeri, jangan-lah pula tertinggal, atau pun kita rengan2kan tanggong-jawab terhadap pemodal2 di- dalam negara kita ini.

Kalau kita hendak memberi keistimewaan kapada pemodal2 daripada luar negeri, saya, fikir patut di-beri lebeh keistimewaan pula kapada pemodal2 daripada tem patan kita sendiri.
Jangan-lah sa-mata2 kita mengharapkan modal itu daripada luar negeri, bahkan sa-bagaimana yang saya sebutkan, modal dalam negeri kita ini pun, jikalau kita hendak kumpulkan, kita akan dapat beratus2 juta ringgit, tetapi dengan sharat-nya kilang perusahaan yang akan di-diri- kan itu pada pendapatan umum mem beri faedah keuntongan kapada orang2 yang dalam ingin hendak masok lapangan perusahaan dan perniagaan.
Sa-bagaimana yang di-terangkan oleh Yang Berhormat Menteri perusahaan2 yang di-dirikan di-dalam negara kita ini dengan modal daripada orang2 tidak dalam negeri ini, nampak-nya, ada satu kelonggaran.

Oleh yang demi- kian, saya mengshorkan supaya Yang Berhormat Menteri ini menimbangkan dalam kapada juga negeri kita ini kita berikan pemodal2 daripada telah tahun pertama keistimewaan, atau perkechualian dari pada di-kenakan chukai pendapatan dengan chara beransor2.
Mithal-nya, pada kita yang kechualikan daripada bayaran chukai pendapatan terus.

Tahun yang kedua kita kenakan dia bayar 8%; tahun yang ketiga 16%, tahun yang keempat 24% tahun yang kelima 32% dan tahun yang keenam 40% sa-bagaimana yang kita kenakan chukai pendapatan kapada sa-barang perusahaan2 dalam ini akan ini.

Dengan negara kita membolehkan perusahaan2 daripada modal tempatan lebeh di-galakkan lagi untok mendirikan perusahaan2 mereka di-dalam negara kita ini.
biasa sa-bagaimana Perkara yang kedua, Tuan Yang di- taraf Pertua, ia-lah mengenai modal ia- perintis yang kita akan kenakan itu kalau-lah modal diaripada negara kita sendiri luar yang di- 51%, modal daripada kehendaki 49%.
Saya berhadap modal 51% itu yang hendak di-kutip daripada pemodal2 dalam negara kita ini patut- lah di-buka dengan sa-luas2-nya sa- bagaimana baharu2 ini kita dapat tahu ia-itu MARA telah pun dapat buat satu peratoran supaya orang2 bumi- putra yang ingin memasoki dalam lapangan perusahaan dengan menanam modal, maka MARA memegang saham2 bagi pehak bumiputra dan sa- lama dua tahun tidak boleh di-tukar- kan nama atau di-jual.
Ini ada-lah satu chara yang baik dan saya harap modal yang di-untokkan untok dalam negara kita ini beberapa peratus dari pada 51% itu di-untokkan sa-banyak 20% mithal-nya bumiputra untok supaya dapat MARA memegang saham2 ini dan dapat berunding dengan Yang Berhormat Menteri supaya di- tanamkan modal di-mana perusahaan dengan taraf perintis akan di-laksana- kan di-negara kita ini supaya sama2 mengambil bahagian yang saya fikir boleh menyesuaikan dan untok men- dapatkan modal.
Saya telah mengshor kan pekara ini supaya pehak Kemen- terian jabatan ini mengadakan satu Jabatan Penguasa yang di-namakan atau pun Trust Bond ia-itu jabatan ini menjual kapada siapa juga yang ingin hendak menanam modal dan di-beri akuan bahawa orang yang membeli bond perusahaan perusahaan bond 6973 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6974 tiap2 ini dapat-lah ini akan di-beri jaminan membayar sagu hati atau pun faedah, atau pun bonus sa-banyak yang di-kenakan oleh bank dalam perkara kita menyimpan wang tetap.
Dengan sa-chara yang sa- macham lapisan ra'ayat membeli bond itu dan daripada wang kumpulan itu boleh-lah di-jadi- kan modal untok mendirikan beberapa banyak lagi perusahaan2 dalam negara kita ini yang di-fikirkan bersesuaian dan boleh mengeluarkan hasil2 yang dapat di-ekspotkan ka-luar negeri.

Saya berharap Menteri akan timbang di-atas supaya dapat kita shor ini mengumpulkan lagi lebeh banyak modal daripada dalam negara kita sendiri.
saya ini, Yang ketiga, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya telah melihat dan meneliti Bill ini dan saya tidak nampak ada satu sharat yang saya fikir chukup perlu dan penting di-adakan di-dalam Rang Undang2 ia-itu mengenai harga pengeluaran benda yang di-keluarkan oleh kilang perusahaan itu.

Mithal-nya satu kilang di-dirikan di-dalam negara kita ini hendak mengeluarkan kata-lah guni jute di-Butterworth pada masa sekarang ini guni itu berharga 50 sen satu guni.
Manakala hendak di-dirikan mesti-lah di-sharatkan pada masa sa- belum kilang itu mengeluarkan, maka harga guni itu 50 sen, dia mesti jual tidak boleh lebeh daripada 50 sen. Ini akan menentukan bahawa dia tidak akan boleh dapat lebeh keuntongan daripada yang berpatutan.
Sa-bagai- mana kita sedia ma'alum perkara ini beberapa kali telah di-bawa ka-dalam Dewan ini mengenai harga gula yang dahulu-nya 25 sen sa-kati sekarang sudah jadi 33 sen, naik sampai 8 sen; harga tepong bagitu juga 20 sen sudah naik sampai 25 sen; harga besi waja yang oleh Malayawata sekarang ini, dahulu-nya di-impot ka- tan, dalam negeri sekarang saya di-beritahu sudah naik sampai $300 satu tan.
Jadi ini ada- lah satu chara yang tidak menasabah, dan saya berharap di-sharatkan dalam undang2 boleh tidak supaya menaikkan barang2 kegunaan ramai sa-wenang2-nya untok men- dengan dapatkan satu keuntongan yang ter- lebeh daripada yang berpatutan.
Saya berharap juga supaya Kementerian ini ini $200 di-buat satu ini daripada berusaha menyekatkan kemasokan barang2 yang akan bertanding dengan kilang2 barang2 keluaran perusahaan yang kita akan dirikan, sebab saya sendiri tahu dalam negara kita ini ada beberapa kilang buat ubat tekanan nyamok, tetapi oleh kerana ini yang di- daripada ubat nyamok impot ka-dalam negara kita ini, pada satu masa sa-hingga kilang di-Mak Mandin lebeh itu di-tutup sa-hingga daripada enam bulan.
Ini akan menjadi satu petunjok kapada kita supaya dapat kita awasi jangan di-masokkan barang2 bertandingan dengan barang2 keluaran negera kita sa-hingga terpaksa per usahaan2 kita ini di-tutup.
ia-itu Yang ketiga saya berharap supaya di-sharatkan di-dalam undang2 atau pun sa-ehara peratoran kapada orang2 yang hendak mendirikan kilang taraf perintis ini supaya mereka Malay- sianise, atau pun tiap2 pekerja2 dari pada ka-bawah itu tidak bagitu penting labour—orang2 sangat skilled yang mahir mesti-lah di-warganegara- kan dalam satu masa yang di-tentukan, kata-lah lima tahun mithal-nya, atau- tahun dan manakala pun sa-puloh sampai masa sa-kalian itu, maka pekerja2 di-dalam kilang itu sudah di- warganegarakan, dan dengan di-sharat kan bahawa warganegara akan di- hantar keluar untok berlateh, atau pun untok bekerja di-bawah orang yang kanan sa-kali di-dalam fekteri atau kilang perusahaan itu sa-bagai under study sa-hingga dapat dia mengambil jawatan2 yang penting dalam aleh sharikat2 perkilangan yang saya sebut- kan itu.
Saya berharap-lah kapada Yang Berhormat Menteri supaya me- nimbangkan di-atas shor dan pan- dangan saya ini.

Dan mengenai satu perkechualian daripada bayar daftar gaji atau pay-roll manakala di-dapati kilang itu menggunakan bahan kelua ran negeri kita ini dan mengekspotkan lebeh daripada 20 peratus daripada barang2 keluaran-nya sa-hingga di-beri perkechualian ini sa-hingga 8 tahun.
Ini pun saya sokong supaya dengan chara ini kita memberi galakan yang lebeh lagi kapada perusahaan2 untok menggunakan bahan2 keluaran negara kita saya sebutkan berkali2 mengenai getah, kelapa sawit, kelapa, kayu yang kita sa-bagaimana yang ini 6975 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6976 ini dapat kita ada dalam negeri ini, bijeh timah, bijeh besi, banyak daripada bahan2 di-dalam jadikan negara kita barang2 kegunaan dan dapat di-ekspot- kan. Dan saya mengshorkan lagi sa- kali sa-bagaimana yang di-sebutkan oleh Yang Berhormat Menteri dalam keterangan-nya tadi, orang2 yang telah mengekspotkan barang2 20 peratus akan di-kechualikan daripada mem- bayar daftar gaji.
Apa yang saya fikir yang lebeh sesuai lagi, barang2 yang kita akan ekspotkan itu kita kurangkan harga-nya 20 peratus daripada harga pasaran yang di-kenakan di-dalam ini, dengan chara yang negara kita macham itu dapat kita bertanding dengan pasaran dunia yang menge- luarkan sa-macham dengan keluaran daripada negara kita ini; biar-lah kita saperti kata Yang Berhormat perut sadikit—we must sacrifice, baik kita boleh sacrifice dengan sharat kita dapat mengekspotkan banyak barang2 perbuatan daripada negara kita ini dan dapat pertukaran wang masok ka-dalam negara kita.
barang2 beberapa yang kita ikat tadi Yang kedua-nya, kita dapat memberi pekerjaan kapada orang2 yang meng- anggor, dan yang ketiga, kita dapat membaiki kedudokan ekonomi kita.

di-Pertua, Sekian-lah, Tuan Yang terima kaseh.


ini di-buat dalam Malaysia Tuan Geh Chong Keat (Pulau Pinang Utara): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, izin beruchap dalam saya mohon bahasa Inggeris, tetapi sa-belum-nya, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya memberi- kan sa-tinggi2 tahniah kapada Menteri kita, sebab Act ia-lah untok menggalakkan ranchangan pem- bangunan perusahaan dan lain2 usaha perniagaan bagi memajukan eksepot dan bagi maksud2 yang bersangkutan dengan-nya.
Saya ada mendengar uchapan Menteri kita atas laporan dan kemajuan di-dalam Kementerian Perdagangan dan Per usahaan dan saya juga memberi pujian, tahu tetapi saya hendak memberi ia-itu kapada Menteri kesusahan2 di-dalam kemajuan per dagangan dan perusahaan di-dalam negeri kita.
Berkenaan dengan perkara industrialists, ini orang2 pengusaha perdagangan luar saya ada dengar kita ini perkara perdagangan, negeri ada menunjokkan interest— suka hati mereka di-atas perusahaan di-dalam negeri ini, tetapi ada banyak terdapat red tape (tali merah) di-dalam pekerjaan itu.
Sebab tetamu2 dari luar negeri apabila mereka sampai di- negera kita ini, di-Kuala Lumpur, ada berhubong dengan Kementerian di- atas tetapi mereka di-tolak dari satu pejabat ka- satu pejabat, dan sa-lama 10 hari mereka sampai di-sini, orang2 ini telah saya putus harapan.

minta Menteri kita menjaga, bila kita memberi pujian bagitu, juga kita mesti jaga supaya polisi di-dalam Kemen terian kita ini jangan-lah di-laksanakan saperti pagar makan padi.
Memang- lah pegawai2 atas yang bersangkutan menolong kita di-dalam memajukan perkara ini, tetapi oleh sebab terdapat red tape dan lain2 lagi maka perkara ini ada sadikit.

Dengan sebab itu kita minta-lah Kementerian kita mesti-lah mengawasi atas perkara ini.
tersangkut Itu-lah sebab of act products with Mr Speaker, Sir, in supporting the Government's call for additional incen tives for the manufacturing enterprises and other commercial enterprises, 1 must request for safeguards with per for higher the demand sistency on standards for the finished commodities and precautionary measures against the exploitation of consumers.
The Government must be fully on the lookout for motivation by industrialists towards amalgamation of similar products which may result in a monopolistic control and manipula prices.
The Government tion against balance a must any monopolistic amalgamation on essential items such as rubber tyres, flour, cement, sugar and other products that may have adverse financial effects the public and promote healthy on commercial competitions for cheaper and better quality commodities as the industries or factories progress.
Very often we have requested the Minister's the reduction of retail attention for prices of commodities—for example, motor car tyres, sugar and cement—and reply usually was that the retail price set it was derived that was the Minister's inevitable, certain as 6977 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6978 Perhaps cost was production is aware, for example, from the world market price and that closely the scrutinized by the Ministry's repre sentatives and they felt that the price was fair.
But, then, I would like to draw the Minister's attention to busi the ness manoeuvring.

Minister in regard to flour, that in Singapore, they are selling flour at around $6.50 and the C.I.F.

price is around $6.20; and the wheat grain was purchased from the same Australian Wheat Board and other boards.

The market price of flour here is about $8 and we know that the production cost is somewhere around $5.50.
So why this extra cost that the Minister and his advisers say is the cement factories, or the flour factories, have another their organisation or another interested part of that organisation by establishing an agency in Hong Kong or Singapore outside Malaysia?

This factory will buy from the agency which will pur chase from the Board and the agency will bill the factory direct, therefore resulting in extra charges, such as com missions.

So, the profits were derived without income tax or other taxes.
This is a gross profit which the consumers in Malaysia have to pay.

establishment within justifiable?

Perhaps, I am sure, Mr Speaker, Sir, that the price of flour today is very high at $8 per bag of 50 pounds.

Now if we take into consideration the low cost of rubber, which is causing rubber tappers and countryside people hardships, we must force the price of flour to come down.

The Minister will say that it is impossible, but we know it is quite pos sible—it is quite possible by increased production.
If the two factories could not produce, we get a third factory to produce.

I am sure we will force the price down to $6 or even to $5.80 per bag.

The Minister may have other reasons to consider, but I feel that it is worthwhile to consider this matter at this juncture, when the price of rubber is at a low level—the lowest is yet to come.
Sir, we have quite often read the warnings of both the Honourable Minister of Finance and the Honour able Minister of Commerce and Indus to keep down try to manufacturers their selling price, but the public experience has been an upward surge instead.
Therefore, I request for a strict vigilance on the production costs and for a fair and just marketing price, so that the consumers and the general public need not fear being exploited with "passed-on" taxes—and thus en courage pepole to buy more Malaysian products.

I am sure the Minister is quite aware the excise duty which has been recently imposed has also added to the consumers' purchase price.
Sir, the public has often heard the manufacturers state that they have been operating under very trying conditions with heavy tax loads and have appealed for Government protection.

Yet they could afford to declare very handsome bonuses to their directors during their short establishment which are much beyond the expectation of any of our Honourable Ministers—bonuses or gratuities for their loyal and faithful service to our nation which has taken up a very great part of the prime of their lives.
Sir, we can see that such bonuses warrant the Minister's atten tion in respect of the profits and costs of production of such factories.

Sir, the public feel that they must appeal to and rely on the Government and her faithful officers for protection.
Since the industrialists appeal to the Government for protection, I feel that it is quite justifiable that the consumers and the pepole too must protest and appeal to the Government because of the increase of the high cost of living due to buying more local products and other restrictions.
Sir, in such a case we must ensure that the high prices and sacrifices made by them in accepting low quality products will not be in vain—and the people make sacrifices in supporting our conutry's policy for the sake of prosperity of the Nation.

So, their appeal to the Honourable Minister of Commerce and Industry must not be lost in the wilderness.

Terima kaseh.
Terima kaseh.

Tuan Tajudin bin Ali (Larut Utara): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya bangun menyokong satu Rang Undang2 yang telah di-majukan oleh Yang Berhormat Menteri yang bernama Galakan Pela- boran.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, patut-lah 6979 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6980 lama, kita kita bertanya diri kita sendiri fasal apa- kah Undang2 ini di-majukan.
Di-kalan- gan kita Undang2 saperti ini memang sudah ada, chuma ini tambahan sahaja; kalau buku sudah ada di-tangan, buku sudah berkulit tukar- isi-nya di-tambah kan kulit-nya dan sana sadikit dan di-tambah sini sadikit Itu sahaja pandangan saya, sahaja.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, tetapi pada fikiran saya chara2 kita mentabdirkan perindasterian dalam negara kita yang muda ini jaun daripada memuaskan hati kita.
Mahu-kah kita tengok, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di-sana kilang besar, asap-nya naik ka-langit, merosakkan tetapi kita pemandangan barang2 yang di-keluarkan oleh fekteri2 ini ada-lah mahal.
semua, Saya suka menegaskan di-sini, Tuan ia-itu semua kaum Yang di-Pertua, capitalist saya tidak perchaya, sama ada orang puteh, Amerika atau pun Jepun; saya memang tidak perchaya, kerana mereka itu datang ka -negeri kita ini dengan tujuan yang tidak lain ia-itu satu jalan untok membuat duit dengan sa-berapa daya upaya-nya, yang boleh dan duit itu akan di-bawa balek ka-negeri mereka.

sahaja- menchari Satu chontoh-nya, Tuan Yang di- Pertua, saperti Kilang Malayawata.
Saya rasa 99% daripada perkakas2 jentera dan perkakas2 lain-nya termasok technician-nya ada-lah datang daripada negeri Jepun.

Apa yang kita untong, ia-lah mendapat satu dua orang director terdiri dari orang2 Malaysia, yang tetapi harga barang terlalu mahal, berlebeh2an.

Ini-kah yang kita kehen- daki?


Tuan Yang di-Pertua, pada fikiran saya, ini ada-lah perkara benar kalau kita berkehendakkan wang, umpama- nya satu2 saham di-jual dalam market kita ini, tiap2 kali kalau di-kehendakkan $10 juta, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, empat kali ganda akan di-keluarkan daripada modal tempatan, kalau hendakkan modal.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, barangkali saya fikir apa yang di-buat oleh Singa pura, kita mesti lawan Singapura.
Kalau ini-lah hasrat kita, kita tidak dapat lawan Singapura, umpama-nya, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, chara2 yang saya telah nyatakan tadi, mentadbirkan pernia- gaan kita, perusahaan kita, jaun dari pada memuaskan.

Satu chontoh umpama-nya kayu kayan.

Kita eksepctkan kayu kayan ka- luar negeri.


Apabila barang itu datang umpama-nya satu tan kayu kita keluar- kan dengan harga $130 maka datang balek sa-mula sa-buah kerusi yang tidak sampai 18 kati berat-nye dengan harga sa-banyak $136 dan kita boleh tengok di-Talivishen Malaysia sendiri yang baharu2 ini di-bawa daripada Ottawa sana berharga sa-banyak $136 bagi sa-buah kerusi sahaja.
Jadi, saya ini, Tuan menitek-beratkan perkara tidak kita Yang di-Pertua, mengapa fikirkan bagi membuat barang itu finished product dalam negeri kita ini, mengapa kita menghantar kayu keluar, bijeh timah kita keluar, getah kita ke luar?

Saya telah menyatakan sa-malam bahawa kita kena-lah paksa orang2 estate ini keluarkan capital; mereka memang pandai menanam getah, kita mesti menggunakan getah ini sa-bagai finished product dalam negeri kita ini sa-kurang2-nya 70%.
Kita berkawan dengan kaum capitalist, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, kalau kita lembut2, kepala kita akan di-pulas, di-pusingkan-nya pada sa-tiap masa.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, kalau kita ingat employment, berapa orang dapat kerja apabila satu fekteri siap, berapa orang, capital-nya hampir2 10 tahun kita mem- beri galakan rnocham ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, chuma $200 juta sahaja yang datang Petang ini sahaja saya dengar Yang Berhormat Menteri Muda Ke- sahaja.

ini wangan Denmark menolong kita $13 juta interest.
dengan Jadi, kewangan yang kita boleh dapat, Tuan Yang di- Pertua.

Saya shorkan kapada Yang Berhormat Menreri supaya perkara ini kita mesti-lah berjaga2, fikir dan halusi, kerana chara2 kita mentadbirkan perin dasterian ini sangat2 tidak betul.
tiada satu sen pun ini-lah number2 senang kata, Saya shorkan kapada Yang Berhor mat Menteri supaya melawat mana2 negeri dalam dunia ini dan kita hendak- lah tegak, umpama-nya, kilang getah yang besar di-sini, kita boleh mengata- kan: "Aku adakan kemudahan2, kamu hendak tanah, aku bagi—di-tepi laut, 6981 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6982 perlindongan, dekat Petaling Java, di-Kamunting; kita boleh beri segala kemudahan, kita beri capital 100%, kamu perlindongan; keluarkan—50%, lama-kelamaan de- ngan chara pakatan mesti beri pada Kerajaan."
Ini kita boleh buat, fasal kemudahan kita telah beri dan dengan jalan control, kita pegang mereka itu sunggoh2, baharu-lah kita dapat ke- puasan perjalanan yang baik untok faedah negara dan ra'ayat kita.
Kita tidak payah mengeluarkan modal satu sen pun, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya ulang sa-kali lagi, kita berikan kemu dahan2, umpama-nya capital bagi satu perindasterian ber- harga $20 juta, kamu keluarkan $20 juta itu; dan kita boleh mengatakan bahawa, tidak susah pun, kalau kamu tidak masok pun, aku tidak makan.

Tengok, sa-bagai satu chontoh di-Batu Tiga, sa-buah Kilang Motor Volvo, saya telah nyatakan baharu2 ini bahawa daripada Sweden, sampai volvo tube pun di- bawa daripada Sweden.
Tuan Yang sa-belum kita rasa di-Pertua, membuat kesalahan yang lebeh besar lagi, kita mesti-lah berfikir bersunggoh2 di-atas jurusan ini.

tidak mati, kerana "Aku kuat, di-bawa senang 100% saya Berkenaan atas hal ehwal membuat kira2, mereka tentu-lah menjalankan chara2-nya kerana satu kalau di-beli-nya dengan hanya $10 di-katakan $30 siapa dapat tahu; tidak akan Yang Berhormat Menteri Kewangan dapat pereksa kita tidak akan dapat bertanding dengan capitalist ini.
Chuma kita dapat pegang ia-lah undang2 dalam negara kita ini, kita jangan relax sa-kali2 kapada pehak capitalist ini.

Kalau kita biarkan, lama- kelamaan kedudokan Kerajaan kita pun akan terancham.

Pepatah Melayu me ngatakan, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, ber kenaan dengan hal capitalist ini, "lulus jarum, lulus-lah kelindan".
Memang kita tahu mereka ini ia-lah kaum yang terbesar kekuasaan sa-kali dengan wang, mereka boleh buat bermacham2, tidak ada satu fakteri pun lepas di- dirikan di-dalam tanah ayer kita ini yang memberi faedah kapada kita.

Saya perhatikan, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, bukan-lah pula saya hendak puji Singapura, tetapi chara mereka men jalankan hal ehwal perindasterian ini, tewas.

Kita mesti-lah kita ada-lah jalan mengaku tewas, baharu-lah kita boleh dapat ka-hadapan, dan mereka itu bersunggoh2 dengan ini.
Saya telah katakan di-dalam Dewan yang mulia ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Singapura tidak mempunyai dua pokok getah sa-kali pun, tidak ada sa-kati boleh mentadbirkan bijeh, perindasterain ini, kita mesti-lah me ngaku di-mana kita tewas, di-mana kita boleh dapat mempelajari daripada mereka itu.
tetapi faedah ini memberi Jadi perkara2 ini, saya perhatikan sangat-lah tidak memuaskan hati kita, sampai spoke basikal itu pun datang daripada negera Jepun, bukan-nya datang daripada factory, tetapi datang daripada Assembly Plant; semua per kara kapada mereka, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sa-lain daripada mendapat keuntongan yang berlipat ganda, saya rasa kalau satu indastri di-letakkan di-negeri kita ini dengan harga $10 juta, dalam tempoh lapan tahun ini yang kita berikan per lindongan, mereka itu akan mendapat lima kali ganda, keuntongan empat kalau di-tanam-nya modal $10 juta, akan mendapat untong sampai $50 juta.
Ini duit siapa?

Duit ra'ayat jelata kita.

Penghabisan-nya sa-kali, saya shor dengan kuat-nya dan meminta kapada Yang Berhormat Menteri, ia sa-orang yang dalam cherdek dan pandai kalangan perniagaan, saya rasa payah kita hendak lawan dia, bertengkar pun kita tidak boleh menang dengan dia— Saya tahu.

Jadi kalau dia hendak buat, saya rasa boleh.


Saya shorkan supaya jangan kita benarkan mana2 fakteri yang baharu dalam tanah ayer kita ini, melainkan dengan champor tangan dari Kerajaan ia-itu 50 peratus dan 50 peratus lagi daripada pehak yang akan menegakkan fakteri itu dengan techni cal know how dan sa-bagai-nya dan 50 peratus itu pun datang daripada pehak dia sendiri.

Jadi pehak Kerajaan kita tidak berat, tidak ada keluar wang satu sen pun; kita chuma mengadakan perlindongan, kemudahan2.
Dengan jalan ini harga barang2 kita boleh kawal, kira2 dia boleh kita kawal, satu machine harga- nya katakan $10,000 dia tidak boleh letak $30,000; ini kita mana tahu, tam- bahan pula kira2 ma'alum-lah kira2, 6983 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6984 Tuan Yang di-Pertua.

Jadi, ini-lah, kalau tidak, kita sudah rosak, tetapi rosak-nya jauh lagi.

Saya harap sangat supaya perkara ini kita perketatkan sunggoh2; jadi, kalau ada kemudahan2 yang baik, kita katakan kita hantar Menteri Buroh untok memereksa satu fakteri.
Bila masa Yang Berhormat Menteri itu pergi, dia sambut dengan segala hormat-nya pergi memereksa ka-satu fakteri itu; apabila balek sahaja Menteri Buroh maka di-mulakan per kara yang lama balek.

Dengan buku2 rekod yang larna, dia pun balek dengan chara2 capitalist; tidak ini menguntongkan siapa2 pun terutama sa-kali ra'ayat jelata.

langsong Rakan2 ini saya sa-belah telah menyatakan sa-belum ada fakteri harga tepong pada masa dahulu ia-lah 15 sen, sekarang sudah naik 25 sen; siapa hendak bayar?
Tuan tentu dapat bayar, saya dapat bayar, tetapi ra'ayat jelata akan menderita.

Besi, Ahli Yang Ber hormat dari Tanjong menyatakan, itu perkara benar, oh!

kita terok, beri kita terok sampai bongkok kita hendak terok di-tekan oleh pehak capitalist, baharu kita hendak bangkit, tidak upaya kita, sa-kali kita bongkok, itu-lah yang akhir dan penghabisan sa-kali bagi kita.
Saya harap kapada Yang Berhormat Menteri sunggoh pun kita luluskan Rang Undang2 ini, hendak-lah kita buat pentadbiran satu chara supaya kaum capitalist mana2 sa-kali pun kita ikat tangan-nya, ikat kaki-nya, baharu- lah masok ka-dalam tanah ayer kita.

Kalau jangan kita benarkan.

tidak, Terima kaseh.

Tuan Mohd.


Zahir bin Haji Ismail: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, tiap2 negara yang baharu membangunan berkehendakkan satu Undang2 saperti yang di-hadapan kita ini supaya negara itu boleh men- gadakan indastri2 dan fakteri2 untok mema'amorkan negara itu.
Sunggoh pun negara kita, sa-bahagian yang terbesar, kena bergantong kapada pertanian sa-bagai asas dan daya kita untok menempatkan negara kita di-atas satu kedudokan yang tetap, tetapi di- samping lupa, jangan pendudok2 di-bandar2 berkehendakkan fakteri2 untok bekerja kilang2 atau itu, menchari nafkah.
Sa-lain dari kita itu tidak kanak2 daripada petani2 yang tanah lagi menjadi bendang mereka terpaksa mening- economic holding, galkan kampong halaman mereka dan datang ka-bandar2 untok bekerja di- dalam kilang2.

sahaja.
sahaja.

Kita berharap Kerajaan menggalak- ank penanam modal bukan-nya sahaja di-daerah Kuala Lumpur atau Petaling Jaya di-atas Saya sedar kerumitan2 hendak menggalakkan fakteri2 di-pekan2 kechil—soal buroh, transpot atau pun pengangkutan atau orang2 yang mahir ada-lah menjadi faktor yang penting yang menyusahkan mengadakan kilang2 di-pekan2 lain.

tetapi kita berharap Kerajaan Akan terbuka, jangan, dengan mata yang mengikuti kesilapan2 di-lain tempat2, umpama-nya, pada masa dahulu, fakteri sahaja.
yang di-bukakan di-London Yang pem- demikian menjadi-lah bahagian pendudok2 tidak sa-imbang.

Di-London sahaja sudah dekat 9 million pendudok2 berbanding dengan tempat2 lain yang jauh kekurangan pendudok2.

Baharu2 sahaja Kerajaan British menggalakkan fakteri2 di-tempat lain, saperti di-Birmingham, Glasgow dan Wales.

Kita takut barangkali, jika perkara ini tidak di-kawal dari awal, Kuala Lumpur pada masa hadapan pun akan menjadi London yang lepas.
lebeh Di-Petaling Jaya, saya dapati banyak orang2 dari tempat2 lain di-Malaysia Barat yang datang bekerja di-situ.

Pegawai2 Kerajaan sudah tentu banyak telah di-situ, kerana Kuala Lumpur pun menjadi Ibu Kota.
Orang2 lain yang bekerja di-kilang2 pun banyak, sunggoh pun kita jarang melihat orang Pulau Pinang yang suka hendak pindah keluar dari Pulau Pinang mereka yang sangat endah tetapi oleh sebab keadaan yang memaksakan, kita dapati banyak orang2 Pulau Pinang yang ber- pindah datang ka-Kuala Lumpur, atau ka-Petaling Jaya.
Orang2 datang ka-situ bekerja di-kilang2, dan orang2 lain datang pula kerana peluang telah pun terbuka untok menjual barang2, atau lain2 saperti tukang gunting, bekerja tukang jahit, penjual rempah chabai, atau sa-umpama-nya.
itu, Jika Kuala Lumpur dan Petaling Jaya telah banyak pendudok2 daripada 6985 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6986 sa-patut-nya dan tidak sa-imbang pem- bahagian pendudok2 dengan lain2 tern- pat, maka bahaya-nya ada-lah banyak, baik pun dari segi iktisad dan juga dari segi siasah, sa-lain daripada bahaya asap saperti London pada masa seka- rang ini.
Itu-lah kita berharap muga2 Kerajaan, walau pun pada mula-nya ada kerumitan2, berikhtiar dengan ber- sunggoh2-nya mengadakan fakteri2 di- pekan2 saperti Taiping, Alor Star, Kuantan, Kota Bharu dan sa-bagai- nya.

Hendak-lah di-bukakan kawasan2 indastri di-lain2 tempat saperti kawasan Mak Mandin di-Province Wellesley itu.

Untok memberi galakan di-lain2 tempat ini, hendak-lah Kerajaan memberi segala pertolongan2 tambah lagi ka kilang2.
pembuka2 pada Saperti hendak-lah di-adakan tanah2 yang siap untok mereka itu menjalankan peker- ini hendak-nya jaan mereka.

Tanah telah di-tukar sharat kapada pernia- gaan.

Paip2 ayer dan bekalan api hendak-lah boleh di-sambongkan de ngan segera.

Kita tidak boleh menapikan bahawa satu faktor yang menakutkan mana2 ahli perniagaan untok membuka kilang2 baharu, ia-lah soal tanah.
Ada kala- nya mereka terpaksa menunggu bukan sahaja berbulan2, tetapi bertahun2 un tok mendapat kebenaran mengubah sharat itu dari, umpama-nya, sharat pertanian kapada sharat per niagaan.

tanah Majlis2 Bandaran pula mengambil masa yang tidak kurang lama-nya untok meluluskan satu2 layout plan dan plan bangunan2 yang hendak di-bena itu.

Pejabat Ukor pula mengambil masa yang panjang untok mengukor dan membuat geran2 baharu.
Oleh sebab keadaan lambat ini-lah, maka timbul- lah perasaan churiga2, was2 dan takut hendak menanam modal itu.

Mereka yang mempunyai wang tentu-lah tidak mahu menunggu bagitu lama di-dalam keadaan yang tidak tentu, untok mela- borkan modal mereka ka-dalam mana2 satu kilang.

Tambahan pula jika mereka faedah2 kapada terpaksa membayar Bank2.
Sa-lain dari itu jangan pula kita lupa banyak daripada penanam2 modal itu berkehendakkan pertolongan daripada bank2 ini untok mendapat wang yang menjadi sa-bahagian dari pada modal mereka, atau pun dari lain2 financer.

Dan bank2 ini tentu-lah tidak dapat meluluskan apa2 pinjaman, me- lainkan sa-telah sakalian persediaan2 saperti tapak kilang dan bangunan kilang itu telah sempurna di-atorkan.
Hasil-nya company2 yang mempunyai modal yang sahaja, saperti company2 di-luar negeri, yang berani menanamkan modal mereka itu di-sini.

Itu-lah sebab-nya patut Kera jaan menyiapkan tapak2 perniagaan itu dan memberi segala pertolongan2 yang boleh untok menanam2 modal itu men jalankan perniagaan mereka dengan segera.

siap2 bersedia Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di-dalam sa- tengah2 Negeri ada tanah2 Simpanan Melayu dan Customery Land.
Ini ada- lah menjadi satu faktor yang besar yang tertumboh- menghalangkan daripada nya kilang2 indastri2 di-pekan2 patut di-bangunkan indastri2 itu.

Tidak patut Kementerian Perdagangan memberi sebab ada-lah perkara2 yang saya sebut- kan ini ia-lah kuasa Negeri, atau pun State matter.

Saya berharap Kemen terian berurus dengan Kerajaan2 Negeri ini boleh di- itu perbaiki demi untok kema'amoran tidak perchaya mana2 negara.
Saya Kerajaan Negeri itu akan membang- kang apa2 tindakan yang memberi faedah kapada ra'ayat.

supaya perkara sahaja faedah bukan Tanah2 di-dalam Simpanan Melayu dan juga Tanah2 Customery, jika tidak di-developkan, maka tidak akan mem beri kapada negara, tetapi juga kapada bumiputra itu sendiri.
Oleh yang demikian tidak- itu di- kah boleh Kerajaan Negeri rundingkan supaya mereka itu mem- perbaiki undang2 untok membolehkan mana2 kompeni yang ahli2 saham-nya tidak kurang daripada sakalian2 peratus terdiri dari bumiputra, maka kompeni itu boleh di-anggap sa-bagai bumiputra dan tanah itu boleh di-tukar jual ka pada kompeni itu?
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, tanah2 Sim panan Melayu atau Customery Land tidak boleh di-pindahkan milek kapada kompeni2 berhad corporation walau pun 100% ahli2-nya itu terdiri daripada bumiputra.

Ini di-sebabkan kompeni2 itu bukan-nya manusia yang atau 6987 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6988 mempunyai ugama, atau adat resam ta'arif yang di-kehendaki di- saperti dalam undang2 itu.

Demi dari segi perniagaan bumiputra maka Undang2 Simpanan Melayu atau Customery Land harus-lah di-kaji.
Ini sangat-lah mus- tahak kerana lazim-nya satu2 pernia gaan itu sa-belum di-jalankan hendak- lah di-jalankan dengan chara berhad, sama ada private atau public limited company.
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, akhir-nya saya merojok kapada Sekshen 5 (1) (e), Bill ini yang membolehkan Menteri mem- beri taraf perintis sa-telah ia berpuas hati di-atas orang2 yang di-chadangkan menjadi Pengarah Sharikat yang di- chadangkan itu dan kapada perihal orang2 yang di-chadang hendak di- tawarkan supaya menjanjikan modal share, atau apa2 bahagian-nya.
Sekshen ini membolehkan Menteri menetapkan berapa banyak sher dari warganegara, atau local participation, atau berapa banyak saham2 yang patut di-untokkan kapada bumiputra.

Kita sedar bahawa sa-nya ada saham2 sharikat2 yang bumiputra di-dalam lepas sa-telah pun di-jual kapada bumi putra, maka saham itu di-jual dengan chara speculation kapada orang2 yang bukan bumiputra.
Ada kala-nya orang2 yang bukan bumiputra meminjamkan nama daripada orang2 bumiputra un- tok membuat permintaan, atau per- mohonan kapada saham2 dan lepas di-dapati-nya saham2 itu, maka di- sendiri tukarkan kapada nama-nya atau pun di-jualkan-nya kapada lain orang.

Akhir-nya bumiputra itu tidak interest ada sadikit pun hak atau di-dalam mana2 sharikat itu.
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Yang Berhor- mat Menteri barangkali dan telah pun bertalu2 mengatakan apa yang boleh ia perbuat, jikalau sa-kira-nya perkara ini berlaku.
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya suka mengshorkan untok pertimbangan Menteri itu supaya saham2 bumiputra itu di-chapkan dengan chap Saham bumiputra dan di-adakan sharat2, di- tengah saham2 itu di-jual kapada lain orang daripada bumiputra, dan di-ada kan sharat2 lagi yang menegahkan orang2 daripada membuat apa2 surat perjanjian atau Power of Attorney yang mengubahkan hak2 atau interest di- dalam share itu kapada lain2 orang dan mensharakatkan tiap2 perjanjian atau Power of Attorney itu ada-lah tidak mempunyai kuat-kuasa undang2 atau unenforceable oleh mana2 Mahkamah.
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sharat2 ini boleh di-buat di-dalam undang2 ini.

Jika tidak pun di-dalam meshuarat ini, meshuarat pada masa yang akan datang pun boleh, jika chadangan ini ada-lah di-fikirkan sesuai.
Pada fikiran saya dengan chara ini boleh kita mengekalkan saham bumi putra itu di-dalam tangan bumiputra, sunggoh pun share ini jika di-kenakan sharat2 yang saya sebutkan tadi, akan menjadi murah dan daripada share2 yang atau interest-nya atau keuntongan-nya ada- lah kekal di-dalam tangan bumiputra saperti kehendak dasar Kerajaan pada masa sekarang ini.

faedah-nya lain2, tetapi jika Itu pun Niat kita bukan-lah saham2 ini untok di-speculatekan.
ada mana2 bumiputra yang hendak ber- niaga dengan di-speculatekan harga saham2 itu, maka mereka boleh mem- beli yang baki 90 peratus sher2 yang di-pelawakan jual kapada orang2 yang bukan bumiputra itu.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sa-kian-lah, terima kaseh.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua: Persidangan di-tempohkan sa-lama 15 minit.

Persidangan di-tempohkan pada pukul 6.12 petang.

Persidangan di-sambong sa-mula pada pukul 6.35 petang.

(Tuan (Timbalan) Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan Meshuarat) di-sambong Perbahathan samula.
Tuan Kam Woon Wah (Sitiawan) {dengan izin): Sir, I agree that it is a to good principle to have incentives draw money from foreign countries, or from foreigners, to help our developing country in the search for industrialisa tion.

Sir, within the recent past, there have been quite a few companies which have been established here with pioneer 6989 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6990 and says, certificates, and we find that all of them are doing very well.
However, Sir, there is a point which worries most of us—that is some time after they have been operating in this country, they throw their shares open to our Malay sian public.

Sir, the point is that we have no control over the capital or the quoted price of capital of these foreign companies: for instance, a company comes in here and applies for a pioneer "Well, my certificate company is worth $2 million because I pay so much for my machinery and etc., etc.
", and after some time this company throws open its shares to our public.

Now, first of all, we must be sure that this machinery is really worth $2 million; otherwise, if it is $1 million or $1/2 million and then they jack up the price to $2 million and then throw 50 per cent of the $2 million open to the public, immediately make $1 million.

So, I feel that is a very clever move, amounting to a fraud on our Malaysian share public who hungry.
Any shares today, if thrown open over subscribed—and yet we are not sure whether this company is really worth that figure.

public they the are are to is Sir, another point that—the Honourable Minister of course, can the establishment of explain—with these companies why we are still paying higher prices for certain goods Although this has been explained, it has not satisfied all of us, because the people in this country can compare our prices, say, with Singapore.
For instances, a sugar company in Singa pore may be importing its raw mate rials, say, from Australia and similarly a sugar company in Malaysia may be importing the same raw materials from Australia, yet our price here is higher than in Singapore.
the into look these Therefore, I hope the Honourable two Minister will points, especially first point— that in respect of any company with pioneer status, before its shares open to the public, there must be an enquiry as to the value of its shares, its capital cost of the goods, the etc., otherwise foreigners who come here, will take these people, throws it the money and the country, leaving some shares to our people who will have to carry the baby for ever.
leave Dr Lim Chang Eu (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, when the Honourable Minister of Commerce and Industry ended his introduction by saying that this very generous Bill will receive the support of the whole House including the Opposition, I thought that he was very confident of his own base.

But from the speeches that we have heard, I think he was appealing to us rather to bolster up his own courage in presenting this Bill.
However, Sir, we the can quite honestly give him support he seeks with certain modifica tions and qualifications.
Sir, I feel that the crux of the whole matter is contained in one statement made by the Honourable Minister, namely, that although we are providing these very generous terms for incen tives the Minister and the Government anticipate that this Govern initially ment and the country will lose revenue because of the provisions for exemp tion, and he asks us to make this sacrifice in order to ensure a more rapid industrialisation.
to taxpayer Sir, whilst we are not exactly told to what extent the loss of revenues will amount to, we can be certain that this will mean added burdens the in the forthcoming general year.

Further, Sir, we are not really given any real clue as to how long we will have to sustain the sacrifice before these investment returns will begin to be productive of more per capita income the the worker earner in this country.
I mean Govern ment will very likely come back to us in a matter of years and say that the G.N.P.

has gone up.

But, Sir, we have sufficiently stated that that is not a good enough programme for the country.

and to trying Certainly, Sir, we support this Bill because it is better, a much better way of to gear up our national development rather than going around the "Aid- with a begging bowl to Malaysia-Club" and from that point of view the Minister can have our the support.
However, Sir, I hope 6991 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6992 a well-thought-out Minister will take it in good faith that our criticisms of this Bill are made not in any way to carp on what has been obviously and well-planned Bill, made after years of careful scrutiny by an Advisory Com mittee headed by so distinguished an economist as the Committee.

the Chairman of I points suggest is that "industry" tc have.
Sir, the defination of important think has been However, I think we can begin to the very look at the problems from first part of the Bill, namely, in Clause the word 2, on "industry".

Sir, includes any kind of commercial undertaking.


From this point of view, I think that the Government, whilst attempting to provide new and greater incentives for investments to come has, at the same time, not clearly tried to shoulder the exact or specific type of industrial the programme of development or industrial development that we would like that the Government could very well look into trying to define these "incentives" the along certain channels.
One of most which I touched upon by several other Members, who spoke earlier, incentives should be given—if necessary we could call them "special incentives"—by virtue of the think certain grades of fact incentives industries to which export more and which use more of our local materials and more of local products.
So, Sir, the Govern ment could grade these incentives, first and that industry using the term "industry" as defined, which involves capitalisation of a nature which not only makes the industry residentially based but also makes industry nationally and locally controlled.

It has been men the tioned capital holdings should come from Malaysia itself and from Malaysians.
Sir, there is an advantage in providing these fre incentives, because very quently, particularly in large industrial investments, foreign investors are not only interested in holding and making the profits as is generally thought of, but terms of thinking capitalisation and capital development and they are, therefore, very keen to foremost particularly than 50% of are given that more they are that I the for in of value capital not only invest and make the profit, investors are but very often foreign quite willing even to leave for some the years their profits, because of increased their holdings.
An indication was made by the last speaker to the fact that the local share values themselves go up.

Sir, under the foreign investors frequently would like to have real control over their invest ments, and I think, Sir, it is a good gesture on the part of the Government to encourage the development of truly Malaysian to give added incentives for investments or industries financially, controlled which capital-wise, by local investors.
those circumstances, industries are to squeezing try encourage Sir, there is another type of industry which I think the Government can very well look into.

I would not say that the Government is not completely unaware of it.
However, I feel that rather than using the "big stick" as suggested by my Honourable friend, the Member for and Penang Utara, and forcing prices down, the Government could use this occasion of using the "carrot" foreign investments in a type of industry which Government considers basic and essen tial for the future development of the industrial complex of the nation as a whole.
For example, Sir, there are very few investors from abroad who would be keen to help finance and invest in the manufacture of machine tools.

Sir, machine tools are one of the basic needs for further development of indus tries in the future of our country, and I think this type of fundamental essen tial industries could be given a priority status with added incentives.
again under fundamental industries which Sir, basic heavy industries which involve chemical pro ducts like chlorate, chlorine, and so on, are suffer heavily competition.

Also, foreign investors may very often be controlled by their own governments when investing locally.

It is this type of basic industries which leads on to the further development of industries in the country the Government should direct its attention list of by drawing up a priority essential industries.
to which, think, I 6993 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6994 the Another type of industries industry I produced materials think which the Government could very well look into and provide incentives, very much in the same nature as it provides, utilising vis-a-vis, locally and products, is the kind of industry which involves the utilisation of a far larger amount of labour in relation to the capital—I mean, the labour-intensive type of industry.
Sir, I think one of the difficulties the Government has is with and modern modern machinery.

The absolutely modern in are very industries which come frequently capital-intensive, but they really do not require that much labour and so they are not labour-productive from that point of view.

Although I think the Government has always borne that in mind, I think the formula for the ratio and proportion between capital and labour production should also be borne in mind as an incentive.
automation is A Sir, further the point, modernisation of established, traditio nal industries.

Sir, we have, for exam ple in Penang a very beautiful and very charming historical industry, producing whatiscalled "Dragon's Blood".

"Dra gon's Blood" is a product which comes from a local brush and it is collected for generations by one small family and it is exported exclusively to one group of manufacturers.
However, Sir, the systems and methods of production have been traditional over a hundred remained as they have years and primitive as ever.

I am quite sure that industries of this type should be given a chance to meet modern challenges and provided with these incentives, if they can prove that in the process of modernising they can bring better capital by just putting themselves in a position where they can compete with other sources of this same product.
investment which Sir, the last kind of industry which I would like to touch upon is the type of involves co operative holdings, the type of invest ment which will foster the development so of what frequently touched upon but which has not really made much impact in spite of ten years of Alliance's management and administration—namely, the deve lopment of cottage industries.
There the Government has fore, if we now have a definition of an industry on such a wide basis as commercial undertakings, I am sure it would be beneficial to the people in the rural areas without having the need for them to try and use the word "bumiputra" as an open sesame to the Ministry of Commerce and Industry.

I hope the Government could direct the this development of an industry on cottage basis.
This type of industry usually is not very highly profitable and this type of industry has got to be much more carefully nurtured, and I think incentives of this type could be especially directed this kind of co-operative.
to in in this Another type of co-operative, I think, which the Government can well take into account in "looking forward to the future" and I think the Minister himself long the course of Session of Parliament did indicate the necessity of terms of thinking establishing multi-purpose factories for small-holders.
I think in order to allow rubber small-holders to compete with the much more advanced industries, the question of co-operative factories for producing multi-purpose grades and types of rubber can be encouraged.

I think should give special consideration and special incen tives for type of co-operative industry.

the Government this somewhat to bolster up Sir, with this remark, I would like to close and I hope that the new Bill will the help economy of our country.
However, Sir, I certainly will qualify my support and wait for the actual production or resultant benefits before I will give it full commendation, and I am certain the Honourable Minister himself will be only too happy if he were certain of the future.

But I certainly wish him good luck in response, otherwise just like a begging bowl it might be broken before it gets started.
Wan Abdul Kadir bin Ismail (Kuala Trengganu Utara): Tuan Yang di- Pertua, saya bangun bagi menyokong Rang Undang2 yang di-namakan dalam bahasa Kebangsaan, Rang Undang2 Galakan Pelaboran, dan saya bercha- kap dengan menggunakan kepala dan otak saya dan tidak menggunakan hati 6995 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6996 dan nafsu saya sa-bagaimana pernah saya di-tudoh di-dalam Dewan ini pada hari sa-malam, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, jikalau saya berchakap dengan meng- gunakan hati dan nafsu saya, saya boleh bawa dalam Dewan ini berpuloh2 tulisan di-dalam surat khabar Utusan Melayu yang pernah di-puji pada hari sa-malam dalam Dewan ini yang mengutok Kementerian Perdagangan dan Perusahaan ini.
Saya berharap bahawa penghargaan Yang Berhormat Menteri Perdagangan dan Perusahaan kapada Utusan Melayu akan merupa- kan penghargaan yang bahawa beliau akan sentiasa menghargai segaia tulisan dalam Utusan Melayu dan bukan-nya hanya sa-kerat2 sahaja saperti yang di- bacha oleh Yang Berhormat Menteri itu pada hari sa-malam pada tempat2 yang menyedapkan hati-nya sahaja dan saya harap segaia tulisan dalam Utusan Melayu yang pada masa ini telah mendapat pujian dan di-sanjong oleh Yang Berhormat Menteri ini akan menjadi panduan kapada-nya terutama dalam mengendalikan Kementerian- nya—Kementerian Perdagangan dan Perusahaan.
dari hati Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya bercha kap menggunakan kepala dan otak saya, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, tetapi saya sendiri berchakap dengan menggunakan hati, erti-nya dengan penoh kejujoran dan saya tidak pernah berchakap menurut nafsu dan tidak menggunakan kejujoran, atau berselindong di-sa-balek perkara yang tidak berapa betul.

saya tentang Tuan Yang di-Pertua, perkara yang pertama yang saya hendak menarek perhatian tentang Rang Undang2 ini ia- susunan kata2 dalam lah Bahasa Kebangsaan-nya.
Sa-kali lagi saya berjumpa dengan Rang Undang2 yang masa ini di-buat dalam Bahasa dan sa-bagai original Kebangsaan dalam bahasa Inggeris sa-bagai ter- jemahan.

Saya sendiri terasa hairan atau tidak bagitu faham dengan tajok Undang2 ini dalam Bahasa Kebang saan.
Rang Undang2 Galakan Pela- boran, tahu bagaimana Pejabat Undang2 menggubal perkataan ini, kerana bila saya mendengar per kataan pelaboran, saya teringat kapada satu pepatah Melayu yang mengata- tidak saya kan, "pelabor habis, Palembang tidak kalah" dan maana pelabor ia-lah peluru.

Kalau di-sebut pelabor, erti- nya peluru, kalau pelaboran pula saya tengok Inggeris-nya investment.
dalam bahasa ia-lah standard Perkataan investment ini kita guna- kan sekarang dalam bahasa Melayu yang penanaman modal—senang dan mudah di-faham dan di-gunakan hari2.

Saya tidak tahu kenapa Undang2 ini menggunakan per kataan "pelaboran" yang mengingat- kan kita kapada peluru dan kapada pepatah, "pelabor habis, Palembang tidak kalah".
Saya berharap sa-kali lagi, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dalam pada menggubal Undang2 ini supaya bahasa Melayu yang senang di-faham yang standard tidak payah mereka perkataan2 yang tidak pernah di-gunakan oleh orang.

di-gunakan dengan Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Rang Undang2 Galakan Penanaman Modal ini ada-lah satu undang2 yang sangat perlu kapada pembangunan negara kita ini, dan Rang ini di-alu2kan oleh seluroh Undang2 lapisan ra'ayat dan saya perchaya di- alu2kan juga oleh penanaman modal dari luar negeri.
pada masa dalam perhatian Satu perkara yang saya suka hendak menarek perkara perlaksanaan undang2 ini kelak ia-lah bahawa satu kawalan yang chukup patut di-Iaksanakan dalam menarek penanaman2 modal dari luar itu bagi menanam modal di-dalam negara kita ini.
Dan saya rasa perkara yang per tama sa-kali yang harus menjadi sharat kapada penanaman modal dari luar itu ia-lah mesti ada penyertaan modal2 dalam negeri dan saya merasa sa-baik- sharat2 51 peratus modal nya-lah dalam negeri dalam tiap2 perusahaan yang hendak di-dirikan di-negara kita ini di-jalankan dari sekarang sampai pada masa yang akan datang, kerana jaminan bagi menjaga ini-lah satu keselamatan ekonomi kita di-masa hadapan.
Sharat 51 peratus modal tempatan ini tidak boleh, saya rasa kita longgar- kan. Satu perkara lagi dalam men- jalankan kawalan ini patut-lah pehak Kerajaan dan terutama pehak Ke menterian Perdagangan dan Perushaan 6997 29 FEBRUARI 1968 6998 ini dapat memberi nasihat yang patut di-terima oleh penanaman2 modal dari luar itu bagi jenis2 perusahaan yang hendak di-dirikan di-dalam negara kita ini.
dan sebab jenis2 dengan terbit daripada Satu perusahaan yang saya rasa ini meng- patut pehak Kementerian galakkan pemodal2 dari ia-lah luar dengan mengadakan perusahaan bagi memperoses dan mengeluarkan hasil2 tanaman di-Malaysia ini.
Kita banyak tanaman yang patut di-dirikan hasil indastri2 kapada bagi memproses barang2 pengeluaran yang boleh di- gunakan di-dalam negeri dan di-luar negeri; hasil banyak tanaman kita ini yang boleh di-proses, yang boleh di-jadikan product yang sangat berguna di-dalam berbagai2 lapangan.
Dan saya perchaya dengan chara bagini, maka negara kita Malay sia sa-bagai sa-buah negara tanaman tidak kita mengelakkan tidak dapat daripada berlaku-nya perkara ini; sa- bagai sa-buah negara tanaman kita perlu perbesarkan dari sa-masa ka- samasa dan kira2 dalam 60 atau 65 lebeh daripada hasil peratus atau tanaman.
kita ini Maka saya rasa patut-lah nasihat Kementerian ini di-beri, atau kalau dapat di- pujok perusahaan2 dari luar ini bagi membuka perusahaan untok mem proses hasil2 tanaman kita di-Malaysia ini yang berbagai2 chorak dan berbagai rupa itu.
Saya suka juga mengshorkan, jikalau boleh sa-tengah2 perusahaan yang di-dalam negara ini, kalau perlu, biar-lah ada penyertaan modal Kerajaan dalam sa- tengah2 perusahaan yang penting dan dan saya Kementerian Perdagangan memasok- kan modal Kerajaan dalam perusahaan besi waja Malayawata, satu langkah yang patut di-puji, kerana perusahaan besi waja perusahaan berat yang perlu di-kawal dan ada suara Kerajaan di- dalam-nya, oleh sebab itu sa-barang perusahaan yang akan di-dirikan lagi di-dalam negara kita pada masa akan itu datang, dan penting, maka patut-lah pehak Kera jaan kita dan pehak Kementerian ini menyertakan sama modal Kerajaan di- dalam perusahaan2 itu.
Kita bukan-lah hendak menjadikan negara ini negara jikalau perusahaan langkah Kerajaan di-dirikan hendak rasa itu, tetapi ini untok menjaga socialist, kepentingan negara ini bagi masa hadapan dalam perusahaan2 penting yang kelak hendak di-dirikan di-dalam negara kita ini sa-bagai hasil tarekan daripada Rang Undang2 yang akan kita luluskan pada hari ini.
bersama tempatan orang Pengarah ini yang mendapat Satu perkara lagi, Tuan Yang di- Pertua, ia-lah sudah menjadi amalan sa-tengah2 sharikat dan indastri2 yang baharu di-bena dalam negara kita sekarang taraf lain2-nya mengambil perintis, atau anak2 kerana barangkali ada modal tempatan di- dalam-nya.
Di-kalangan anak2 tempa tan itu di-pileh-lah pula satu dua orang Melayu atau pun bumiputra sa- bagai satu tayangan gambar bahawa ini perusahaan di-sertai oleh ra'ayat negeri ini dan di-sertai' oleh bumiputra sa-bagai hendak memberi galakan amalan kapada bumiputra.
Tetapi, yang telah berlaku sa-panjang ini sa- tengah2-nya di-ambil menjadi atau perusahaan2 ini mendudoki tempat itu dengan di-beri share2 kosong untok mengambil per- saorangan yang tertentu dalam perkara ini, ini dan saya pandang perkara sa-bagai satu commercial corruption yang patut di- ini supaya halusi oleh Kementerian pengaroh2 yang bagini tidak masok di-dalam usaha perindastrian yang kita hendak besarkan di-negara kita ini.
Saya rasa modal2 bumiputra boleh di-chari modal2 yang sa-benar, bukan dengan chara memberi peluang2 share2 kosong saperti ini memainkan peranan untok memudahkan segala perkara yang hendak di-jalankan oleh perusa haan itu dalam menjalankan tugas-nya dan bila mereka itu menjalankan perusahaan dan perkilangan-nya kelak.
yang Sharikat2 jenis korapsi, pengaroh orang2 satu Jadi dari segi ini, saya rasa lobang yang ada ini patut-lah di-tutup, lobang untok commercial corruption saperti ini, biar-lah bumiputra hendak di-beri peluang dengan chara yang betul, degnan chara yang sesuai, dengan chara yang wajar, Barangkali satu perkara yang payah dan agak sadikit soal menchari puncha2 modal di- kalangan bumiputra, tetapi sadikit sa- ini puncha2 modal banyak sekarang 6999 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7000 ini itu sudah ada dan jikalau barangkali sekarang ada beberapa sudah banyak puncha2 modal dari bumiputra dalam Sharikat Permodalan Kebang- saan, Tabong Haji dan berbagai2 jenis lain lagi.
Dan saya rasa sekarang ini dengan ada-nya satu Gabongan Sharikat Permodalan Kerjasama yang baharu di-bena dan ini pun merupa- kan satu modal baharu bagi men- chedok sa-banyak modal dan penyertaan modal daripada bumi putra dalam perindastrian yang hendak di-jalankan dalam negara kita ini.
sadikit suka yang berapa hadapan atau pun Satu perkara lagi, Tuan Yang di- Pertua, hendak saya ketengahkan dalam Dewan ini ia-lah ekoran2 daripada berita berita yang ada tersiar pada hari ini dalam Israel surat khabar bahawa berchadang hendak mengadakan per- janjian perdagangan dengan Singapura, dan barangkali pada satu masa yang tidak ini, lama Singapura akan menjadi suatu lapangan bagi kegiatan ekonomi daripada Israel dan orang2 Yahudi.
Dalam segi politik, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, pengaroh Israel ini sangat2 tidak di-kehendaki dalam dunia kita di-sabelah sini.

Jadi, saya berharap kelak bahawa pehak Kemen- terian akan menjaga supaya segala barang2 yang di-longgokkan menerusi Singapura dan segala perusahaan dari Israel yang akan di-dirikan di-Singapura tidak akan menembusi Tambak Johor yang ada terbentang di-Selatan tanah ayer kita ini.
Biar-lah Israel mengukoh- kan pengaroh-nya di-Singapura, sama ada Israel menggunakan Lee Kuan Yew, atau Lee Kuan Yew mengguna kan Israel, tidak menjadi soal kapada kita, tetapi keselamatan negara ini dari segi politik dan dari segi ekonomi bahawa bahaya2 ini harus di-jaga dan locheng bahaya yang telah berbunyi pada hari itu dalam surat khabar harus menjadi locheng ingatan kapada kita dan Kerajaan kita dalam menghadapi soal itu.

Terima kaseh.
Terima kaseh.

Tuan Haji Mohamed Yusof bin Mahmud: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya juga bangun untok mengambil bahagian sadikit dalam Rang Undang2 yang ada di-hadapan kita ini.
Saya sedar atas khuatir-nya Kerajaan kita terhadap negara-nya, ia-itu terutama sa-kali ia- lah berkenaan dengan banyak-nya, atau pun banyak-nya manusia kita di-dalam negara kita ini, ia-itu dalam bahasa Inggeris "Population Explosion", dan kekhuatiran Kerajaan terhadap mem- beri pekerjaan2 yang sa-wajar dengan keadaan zaman pada masa ini terhadap ra'ayat2-nya.
Jadi, dengan ada-nya undang2 yang ada di-hadapan kita hari ini ia-lah satu undang2 yang saya fikir sangat patut dan saya perchaya bahawa kemajuan2 boleh terchapai pada masa hadapan.
Sunggoh pun bagitu, saya berasa juga undang2 ini terlalu lambat, kerana pada masa ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, modal yang di-pusingkan di-dalam dunia ini sangat kekurangan, ia-itu negeri2 yang suka melaborkan modal2-nya dalam aegeri2 mahu maju, banyak mengundor- kan diri daripada pasaran2 sa-umpama- nya Britain, United States, dan pada masa sekarang mi kita dapati, ia-itu hanya di- sa-buah Tenggara Asia ini yang ada minat yang mahu melaborkan laba modal-nya di-negara kita, ia-itu negeri Jepun.
sahaja negeri Dalam kita menggalakkan penana- man modal pada pendapat saya ada tiga sharat chara, ia-itu modal2 kita sendiri, modal2 yang kita bersama dengan modal luar dan juga modal luar dengan 100 peratus-nya.
Dalam modal kita sendiri, rasa saya ini tidak ada masaalah, kerana saya perchaya anak negeri ini banyak yang berminat, yang suka hendak mendirikan perusahaan2, tetapi oleh sebab pada masa yang lampau mereka2 ini berasa ragu2 ter hadap banyak chukai2 yang di-kenakan kapada perusahaan2, atau pun pada pedagang2 yang ada dalam tanah ayer kita, saperti chukai surtax, Develop ment Tax dan juga dua, tiga tax lagi yang di-fikirkan oleh mereka2 ini yang boleh menyebabkan mereka tidak berapa minat hendak melaborkan modal-nya dalam mana2 perusahaan di- negeri kita ini.
Jadi, dengan ada-nya undang2 ini, saya perchaya modal2 dalam negeri akan monchol ka-hadapan dengan lebeh giat, kerana di-negeri kita ini, kita banyak peluang untok meng adakan perusahaan2 yang besar2 yang saya nampak terutama sa-kali per usahaan getah yang mana chara2 moden kita mengadakan heveacrumb factory 7001 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7002 atau perusahaan2 getah yang moden ini yang rasa saya akan memberi faedah yang besar kapada negara kita.
Dalam modal2 antarabangsa, modal di-dalam negeri dan di-luar negeri, saya ini ada-lah satu perkara yang rasa tiap2 satu perusahaan baik, kerana dengan modal2 dapat di-awasi oleh kita sendiri.

Dan dengan ada-nya undang2 ini saya perchaya-lah kemungkinan tampil-nya ka-hadapan modal2 dari- pada luar negeri ini untok bersama2 dengan warganegara kita negeri ini untok mengadakan perusahaan2 yang besar di-negeri ini.
Bagi modal2 yang 100 peratus datang dari luar negeri, rasa saya ini kemungkinan-nya sangat sadikit, tetapi saya perchaya ada juga ada2 per kemungkinan barangkali usahaan yang tidak dapat kita sendiri, negara kita sendiri mengadakan modal- nya terutama sa-kali kita berkehendak kan foreign exchange yang mana kita berkehendakkan barang2 yang datang dari luar negeri.
Jadi, dalam perkara ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, modal2 yang datang dari luar negeri itu, saya ber- harap perhatian yang berat di-beri teru tama sa-kali intention atau pun tujuan2 pemodal2 itu melaborkan modal dalam itu betul2 negeri ini supaya bagaimana tujuan2 kita, ia-itu hendak mengadakan beberapa banyak peru sahaan dan mengadakan pendapatan lebeh pada anak2 negara ini yang dengan tidak ada tujuan2 lain.
Saya tahu sekarang pengaroh2 antara Timor dengan Barat dengan minat menchuba ini bagi mendapatkan negara kita mengambil bahagian daripada satu pehak ka-satu pehak, tetapi saya puji atas kebijaksanaan Kerajaan kita yang telah mengadakan dasar yang bebas tidak berbelah dengan mana2 yang pehak.
Tetapi sa-bagaimana yang saya tadi, kemungkinan-nya ada, katakan tahu sekarang dan yang sebab kita ini ada-lah merosot keadaan kita dalam harga getah: tengok kita sekarang Kerajaan China Kominis chuba membeli getah2 lebeh giat kita dan dengan tidak berapa yakin yang mereka2 itu betul2 hendak membeli getah kita.
Padahal ini sendiri, dia kita hendak mendirikan sendiri fakteri2 saperti itu, tetapi dengan tujuan tahu Kerajaan2 boleh tujuan2 saya ini siasah di-belakang-nya itu, maka ini-lah yang di-khuatirkan rasa saya di-negara kita ini, tetapi saya perchaya perkara ini dapat di-awasi oleh Kerajaan kita.
Sa-lain daripada itu, Tuan Yang di- Pertua, dalam usaha kita mengadakan perusahaan2 dalam negeri ini banyak- lah rakan2 saya telah menyebut betapa mustahak-nya ia-itu segala bahan2 yang ada dalam negeri ini hendak-lah di- saya dalam policy gunakan.

Rasa speech dahulu ia-itu dalam masa kita membinchangkan perbelanjaan dahulu, saya ada menyentoh berkenaan dengan betapa kekhuatiran saya terhadap peru sahaan2 yang menggunakan negeri ini sa-bagai launching ground sahaja, atau sa-bagai sahaja.
Barang2 yang akan di-usahakan di- negeri ini bukan daripada negeri ini, tempat chuma negeri perusahaan menchantum mereka; tidak akan menjadi kebaikan kapada negara kita.

ini di-jadikan perkakas2 ini pada fikiran saya lonchatan tapak Sa-perkara lagi, Tuan Yang di- Pertua, saya berharap kalau kita dapat menarek modal2 ini, kita jangan terikat pada satu peratoran2 ia-itu bagaimana barang2 pengeluaran2 kita ini di-sekat pasar2an-nya.
Saya tahu Kerajaan India mengadakan Joint Venture-nya dengan industrialists daripada Amerika, Britain, France, tetapi barang2 pengeluaran dari itu di-sekat pasaran2-nya.

Di- India mana pasaran2 daripada industri yang ini, maka telah ada di-luar negeri barang2 daripada negeri kita tidak membenarkan masok ka-pasaran2 telah ada mereka2 menjalankan perdagangan.
Ini saya sangat khuatir, Tuan Yang di- Pertua; kita mengadakan perusahaan dalam negeri, bukan untok dalam negeri ini; kita berkehendakkan supaya per usahaan foreign ini mendapat exchange, mendapatkan pasaran dari luar negeri.

Kalau kita terikat sa-chara macham faedah-nya tidak ada mereka2 mengadakan perusahaan ini.

ini di-Pertua, Berkenaan dengan pasaran ini, Tuan Yang saya mengambil peluang di-Dewan ini memberi pujian yang besar terhadap wakil kita yang ada sekarang bermeshuarat di-India.
Bagaimana peranan-nya menghadapi negara2 yang sangat maju, yang sangat 7003 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7004 churiga terhadap pengeluaran barang2 daripada negeri2 yang sedang hendak maju dan wakil kita sedang bergiat bagaimana boleh negeri2 yang sudah maju itu menerima satu dasar bagai mana kita boleh mendapat pasaran2 terhadap barang2 perbuatan negeri kita.

Ini-lah yang saya rasa yang sangat2 di- khuatirkan.
Kita ada banyak industries, kalau kita tidak ada foreign market, tidak ada pasaran luar negeri, ini juga rasa saya tidak memberi besar faedah kapada negeri kita.

Jadi, usaha2 ini, rasa saya, patut di-lanjutkan, kita dapat patut menyedarkan negera2 yang telah maju betapa penting-nya mereka2 itu memi- kirkan keadaan2 negara yang sedang hendak maju macham kita ini untok dalam perusahaan dan untok dalam industri2-nya.
Jadi, ini akan menetap- kan keadaan dunia kita, jikalau negeri2 yang kaya ini tidak menimbangkan, tidak memikirkan bagaimana negeri2 yang sa-macham kita hendak maju di-sekat, bagaimana-kah perasaan2 kita, yang ini akan menyebabkan dunia ini tidak akan menjadi aman.
Jadi, saya harap Kerajaan kita dalam memberi incentive dan sa-bagai-nya, sa-balek- nya, sa-balek-nya kita hendak-lah men- jaga perkara2 yang saya cheritakan tadi, tetapi saya lagi mengambil peluang memberi tahniah kapada wakil2 kita yang sedang giat hendak menjalan- kan usaha-nya di-India itu.
Sunggoh pun dalam surat2 khabar, saya perhati- kan kemajuan perbinchangan atau meshuarat itu nampak-nya kita akan menuju kapada ia-itu negeri2 yang telah maju yang kaya tidak mahu berganjak supaya melonggarkan sharat2 yang di-kenakan itu kapada pengeluaran2 barang2 daripada negeri2 yang sedang maju ini.
jalan buntu, sa-kali Kita tengok sekarang, Tuan Yang di- Pertua, negeri2 dalam dunia ini chuma menchari perlindongan untok menjaga perusahaan2 negeri2 mereka sa-umpama saya katakan tadi bagi negeri2 orang sendiri, mereka mengadakan puteh Common Market-nya di-mana mereka churiga terhadap kemasokan barang2 daripada negeri2 yang baharu maju masok ka-dalam kawasan2 mereka itu.

Ini saya rasa satu benda yang patut sangat di-binchangkan, atau pun di- mengertikan kapada mereka itu.
Kalau tidak dapat terus pun, saya perchaya melalui Badan2 Bangsa2 Bersatu, boleh mententeramkan mereka2 yang sedang maju sa-bagai mana kita ini.

ini ia-lah pengeluaran2 ini.

Kita Sa-lain daripada itu, Tuan Yang di- sa-buah negeri Pertua, kita yang chukup bahan2 kita.

Dalam kita mengadakan perusahaan2 jangan- lah kita memandang sangat apa-kah perkara2 yang kita utamakan untok ini.

Rasa saya, pasaran kita negara sangat luas terutama sa-kali Tenggara Asia ini.
Di-Indonesia yang mana pasaran2 kita, rasa saya, sangat2 laris, kalau dapat kita mengertikan keadaan2 negara itu bagaimana kita boleh mem beri keperluan2 untok negara itu daripada melariskan negara jangan-lah memikirkan kita hendak mengeluarkan barang2 yang ada di-keluarkan oleh negeri2 kita saya terpaksa tariff cheritakan barrier dan sa-bagai-nya.
Kita tahu berkehendakan sekarang Indonesia tempat kita, rasa saya, saya harap Kerajaan kita akan mengambil bagaimana dapat pengertian kita dengan Kerajaan Indonesia dan juga pasaran2 di-negeri itu supaya dapat bersusuaian antara kedua negeri ini dalam kita menjalan- kan perusahaan2 saperti ini.
yang yang tadi menghadapi yang maju sa-bagaimana perdagangan berat bagi kita saya sa-kali bahkan ini jikalau ada Penyudah-nya, Tuan Yang di-Per- lagi memberi tua, sa-tinggi2 tahniah kapada Kerajaan untok mengadakan Undang2 sa- pada masa macham lagi perkara2 hadapan yang fikir yang boleh lagi melariskan barang2 kita keluar negeri supaya lagi chara2-nya, dapat di-longgarkan rasa saya dengan berbuat demikian dapat-lah kita datang lagi ka-Dewan ini untok membinchang dan melulus- kan-nya.

Terima kaseh.
Terima kaseh.

Tuan T. Mahima Singh (Port Dick son) (dengan izin): This Ministry, Sir, deserves the thanks of the country for the excellent progress that has been made during short period of Merdeka.

It is due, Sir, to the efficient running of this Ministry that Petaling Jaya and Batu Tiga are throbbing with new factories, which are coming up the 7005 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7006 a almost every week.
But I would like to in suggestions, Sir, few make welcoming this excellent Bill which would perhaps accelerate the develop ment or opening up of new factories in our country.

I would suggest that more people from our country be sent abroad to the ways of manufacture or study production, particularly in the coun that are not too developed.

I tries would In this case give the example of Taiwan.
There are many small indus tries in countries like Taiwan which could be more easily brought over here and made applicable to Malaysia.

anybody with Next, I would like to suggest, Sir, that we should relax in certain cases our immigration control on experts who could be useful to Malaysia.

We have the examples of even very large that are very much more countries developed than Malaysia, who wel come experts in any line.
We often read in the papers that there is a brain into from Europe and Asia drain America.

Though they have thousands of experts, America is willing to give citizenship any to knowledge of industry or science in very short periods.

Only a few days ago, Sir, we read in the papers that Australia is prepared to give citizen ship to doctors and even nurses.

I am not suggesting, Sir, that we should invite all and everybody into Malaysia.
It is the duty and responsibility of the Government to see that the people of Malaysia sufficient employment, but I am of the opinion in these experts who bring that knowledge would be able to speed up our industries, thereby giving jobs to a larger number of people for the very few that they might take away from the local people.
In this case, Sir, I would suggest even persons who have invest—a very reasonable capital to if fixed—so amount may be that anybody coming is into Malaysia that amount he prepared could be given permission for perma nent stay.

first given invest are to Finally, Sir, I would suggest that we could make greater use of the Press, not only the Malayan Press, because it is read mainly by us though a certain portion of it goes abroad.
I would ask for the co-operation of the representa tives of international newspapers and other organisations who are in Malaya, so that everything that we have in the way of development, incentives and other facilities that are made available are given to these representatives in such a way that they could be easily sent abroad to the large network of newspapers that they represent abroad.

Thank you, Sir.
Thank you, Sir.

bagi Tuan Ahmad bin Arshad: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya bangun menyo- kong penoh Rang Undang2 yang di- kemukakan oleh Yang Berhormat Menteri Perdagangan dan Perusahaan.

Beliau banyak telah memberikan pandangan kelulusan Rang Undang2 ini.

Saya chuma hendak memberikan pandangan2 yang mung- kin ada hubongan bagi perlaksanaan dengan Rang Undang2 ini.
Rang Undang2 ini atas tujuan-nya mengada- kan peluang yang lebeh banyak bagi modal dari negara2 asing dan satu masa kelak negara kita ini akan di- jadikan negara perindastrian di-Tenggara Asia ini.

sa-bagai sa-buah juga Sa-lain daripada itu, Yang Berhor mat Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sa-chara langsong perlaksanaan Rang Undang2 ini kelak akan mengurangkan penganggoran yang ada dalam negeri ini serta dapat pula menebus jurang masharakat yang berada dalam Malay sia ini dengan masharakat yang tidak berada.
satu dasar Kerajaan kita dan sa-lain daripada itu ia juga memberi satu napas baharu yang mengembirakan kapada petani2 dan peladang2 kita, kerana sa-lama ini segala hasil usaha-nya ada-lah lumpoh di-sebabkan tidak ada pasaran yang kekal.

Ini-lah menjadi Satu perkara yang saya fikir patut di-perhatikan oleh Kementerian ini bukan sahaja menumpukan kapada bahan mentah, bahan2 pertanian, tetapi banyak bahan2 yang ada dalam tanah ayer kita ini terbuang, terbiar supaya di-kaji dan di-siasat.
Kalau boleh dengan perindastrian ini dapat mem- buat bahan2 yang boleh menjadi hasil saperti barang2 kechil yang terbuang, buloh, tempurong, tandok, lidi kelapa dan lain2 lagi ini semua mendatangkan 7007 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7008 negeri faedah kapada petani2 dan peladang2 usaha menggalakkan kita.
Dalam ra'ayat ini mengutamakan barang2 buatan Malaysia dan barang2 tempatan, menurut hemat saya Tuan Yang di-Pertua, tidak memadai dengan kita beri seruan dengan kita beri nasihat, tetapi apa yang patut di-buat menurut hemat saya patut di-adakan sa-buah Lembaga bagi mengkaji dari sa-masa ka-samasa dan kita adakan ini peratoran supaya menggunakan barang2 tempa lapisan, sama ada tan dari semua lapisan bawah hingga lapisan atas, dan kalau boleh chuba kita mulakan dengan Kementerian Perdagangan dan Perusahaan yang lebeh banyak meng gunakan barang2 keluaran tempatan.
ra'ayat dalam negeri Yang kedua, Lembaga ini boleh memikir dan mengkajikan bagaimana ikhtiar kita hendak menurunkan dan hendak mengurangkan harga barang2 buatan daripada kilang yang dalam telah menjadi negeri kita ini yang sungutan ra'ayat dan juga sungutan ini bahawa barang2 dalam Dewan pengeluaran daripada kilang kita ber- harga mahal.

Jadi dengan ada-nya Lembaga ini dapat mengkaji dari sa-masa ka-samasa bersesuaian dengan barang2 ini supaya dapat di-turunkan.
Akhir-nya, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya chuma hendak memberi pan- kapada Yang Berhormat dangan ini, ia-itu kita mengalu2kan Menteri perishtiharan Kerajaan Russia baharu2 ini yang hendak menanamkan modal kapada negeri kita dan juga sedia hendak memberi latehan kapada belia2 kita dalam lapangan perusahaan dan saya perniagaan.
Di-samping mengharapkan dengan galakan pela- boran yang di-beri kapada Russia itu kelak, jangan ada tekanan, jangan ada sekatan kapada mereka, kerana bila di-sebut Russia ini, banyak gulongan2 yang tidak inginkan supaya Kerajaan Russia mengadakan perkilangan-nya dalam negeri ini, kerana dalam alam perniagaan ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, memang ada perlawanan dan tekanan antara satu satu gulongan dengan gulongan yang lain.
Kita tidak mahu negeri kita Malaysia ini di-jadikan satu dua padang dan gulongan perusahaan.

antara perdagangan pertarongan dalam itu, Jadi, sa-takat ini-lah sahaja yang dapat saya berikan pandangan kapada Yang Berhormat Menteri ini dan saya menguchapkan terima kaseh.

Dr Lim Swee Aun (dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, may I thank all Honourable Members, including Mem bers from the Opposition, who have supported this Bill.
introduced I would like to say that the Honour able Member for Larut Selatan has not made a more sensible statement than to ask the question: "Why should we export our raw materials at such low prices and import manufactured and finished goods at such high prices".
It is because of this that the Government has industrialisation not only to process more and more of our local products, to make use of more and more of our local products, but also to meet the needs of the home market and also for export purposes.
But, there are certain problems before we can set up a factory whatever its nature may be, and to set up a factory there must be four important provi sions, i.e., the technical know-how to start it and how to run it, the capital to finance it and the management, the labour to run it, and, most and equally important, the market, whether at home or abroad.

As a developing country which has been under colonial rule, we must recognise the fact that we have very little technical know-how.
It is true that we have been producing many cottage industries, we have been having many repair shops, many small, small factories, but the technical know-how from these organisations is not suffi cient to set up large modern factories to produce commercial and economi cally feasible products that are of international standards, that are com In petitive recognition of the fact that we do not have technical know-how of sufficient quantity, then we must get this know-how from somewhere.
In the world today the technical know-how, in the unfortunately, developed countries and these deve loped countries who have this technical know-how also have the capital and they are not going to part with their know-how without making a profit out in price and quality.

is concentrated this 7009 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7010 that to acknowledge, it.
This possession of of technical know-how is the biggest asset which the developed countries have and they are able to demand a price for the sharing of that know-how and we must realise, we the developing countries have foreign capital and foreign know-how, if they invest in our country, they do not do it out of charity—they are doing it for their own profit, for their own advan tage.

We must recognise that.


We too must recognise that in this world there are more than 77 developing countries, about 100 over developing countries, who are also competing to get a share of this technical know-how, a share of this investment capital.
It is because of this that the limited amount, the limited number of people who have the capital and the know-how have a wide variety of choices where they can put their capital and where they can share their know-how, and it is because of this that developing countries—not only developing countries, but even some developed countries—have given incentives to attract these know-how and capital to their countries.
So before foreign capital and know-how invest in any country, the first question it wants to know is whether it is safe to invest that money capital is not lost by expropriation through political or economical reasons or political instability in the country.

Secondly, it wants to know whether it is going to be profitable and, naturally, as capital is mobile, it is going to invest in the area where it can make the most profit.
Thirdly, making profits is not enough; it wants to ensure that both its capital and its profits can be repatriated to its home country— otherwise, there is no point in invest ing money there.

In the light of these, we must recognise that because we have this shortage of capital and know-how, we are dependent to a great extent on foreign know-how.
The foreign know- how can be brought to Malaysia either with their capital which is the usual method or we can buy their know-how through licensing of their process or the employment of experts.

through This is open to local capital.

But, unfortunately, although we may have to ensure that area in local capital, we may have an abun labour, we may have an dance of industrial estates, we abundance of may have a market, we do not have the management.
Capital alone or capital together with labour, without management is useless.

This is where, again, we have to be dependent on foreign management and foreign know- how.
That is why, Sir—I hope Honour able Members here will realise the difficulties that the Government has to in attracting foreign capital—if face we were the screws, as suggested by some of the Honourable Members, that they should not make any profit, that they should not employ this, that they should not employ that, nobody is going to come, in which case we will still be exporting raw materials and importing expensive manufactured goods.
So there must be a balance and this Investment Incentives Act is an attempt not only foreign capial but also to attract local capial to invest in industrialisation.
to attract tighten to As I have said, and I have said it many times in this House, that of the number of pioneer companies that have been set up, quite about half of them are set up with local capital and half of them on foreign joint ventures, and it is the policy of this Government now, if any foreign capital should come in, it should be a joint venture and not a hundred per cent foreign capital.
But whether we are able to persuade—I used the word "persuade" because we cannot direct them, otherwise we will lose them—whether we can persuade them to give a bigger share to local capital depends upon how important that factory would be to us.

That is where my Ministry has to evaluate before a foreign company sets up a joint venture here, how important that the national factory would be interests.
If it is an important one and we would like to have it, and there are no other offers, naturally we have to be more lenient; we have to use more carrot to attract them to invest in this country.

But, on the other hand, if it is not that important, if it is very profitable, then we want a bigger share of it.
So, there must be flexibility in to bargaining with foreign capital in 7011 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7012 invest in this country rather than have hard and fast rules where you say, "Do this and do that", in which case we may probably get nothing at all.

red that and obstructions Coming to some of the points raised by Honourable Members, one very common point raised by most Honour- there able Members had been should be a reduction in the amount of to tape investors, who wish to come and invest their money here.
I fully agree with them on this score, and we in the Ministry are trying our best to reduce to process any the application this country, but there is also the other side of the picture where occasionally the the investor is not available and that has been a major cause for the delay in the approval of certain applications.
required for information investment required from time in The Honourable Member for Bukit Bintang has suggested that there should be an Inter-Ministerial Committee in order to cut down red tape.

In fact, there is already one in the form of the Action Committee on Tariff and In dustrial Development.

Now, this Inter- Ministerial Committee meets regularly to clear not only applications for investment but also for tariff protection.

The Honourable Member for Bukit Bintang has suggested that F.I.D.A.
should be able to publicise more of the feasible projects that can be set up here; I can assure him that that is one of the purposes for which F.I.D.A.

has been set up.

In fact, an Operations Room is in the process of being set up in F.I.D.A.
and it is almost near completion, and any member of the public, not only foreigners but even local investors or even local individuals, can have access to that Operations Room, where they can be given a full briefing on our industrial development plan, where all information necessary for any potential investor can be obtained on the spot.

On the question of language problem, F.I.D.A.

will try and accommodate as far as possible all the different language speaking groups that apply for such information.
The Honourable Member for Bukit Bintang also suggested that we should to encourage more factories manufacturing tools.

Sir, we have simple machine this one—the top priority given manufacture of machine tools—but, unfortunately, up to today, we have not yet been able to interest or persuade people who have the know-how to set up a factory here, but we hope that with this new Incentives Bill they might is my be Ministry for investors to come in, F.I.D.A.
has now taken on the added responsibility of to the large foreign writing directly firms with technical know-how, the inviting them to come and invest here wherever possible.

forthcoming.

No just sitting, waiting longer this The Honourable Member for Sebe- rang Selatan has suggested that we should not discriminate against local capital; in fact, he has suggested that local capital should be given further Investment tax exemption.
Sir, Incentives Bill already is generous and, as it is applicable both to local and foreign capital, the need for further or special exemptions or tax incentives for local capital at the present moment in does not arise.

The problems industrialisation the is not so much question of capital as the technical know-how that we require.
The Honourable Member for Sebe- rang Selatan has suggested that this Incentives Bill has missed out a very important condition and that anybody wishing to enjoy these incentives should have a condition laid on where there would be a ceiling on the prices of the manufactured goods.
Sir, in my speech I did refer specifically to section 20 where, in this new Bill, power is given to the Government to limit the amount of profits that a company enjoying pioneer status can have, which would indirectly then affect the prices at which they sell their goods.

The Honourable Member for Penang Utara the spoke very strongly on prevention of monopolies in industriali sation and we, of course, adopt that policy.
However, there are certain conditions under which it would not be economic to set up a factory, if there were more than one such factory simply because of the smallness of the 7013 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7014 home market.

But the moment we are able to export that product, then this monopoly status might be reviewed or allowed to persist because, sometimes, the fact that there is adequate volume means is savings in costs of production and then it will become more competitive to export.
However, it is the general policy not to have monopoly status for any particular industry.

there Sir, the Honourable Member for Penang Utara has suggested that one of the ways for reducing the prices of manufactured goods in this country is to have more factories producing the same thing.
Sir, unfortunately, within a limited market that might be true for a short-term period, but in the long run, because of the limitations in the market and the excess capacity available when you have more than sufficient factories producing the same goods, it could result in a wastage of capital and the closing of some of the factories.

In a like ours we capital short country cannot afford to waste valuable capital.
to in industries The Honourable Member for Sungei Patani raised a rather interesting point and that is, he suggested that whilst it is good that Government has reserved shares the Malays, these shares should bear a mark that they should not be sold to anybody else but Malays.
Sir, this matter has been considered by my Ministry; in fact, we have consulted the share market and found that such restrictive type of shares cannot be quoted in the market, and once it cannot be quoted in the market, the price of these shares would be much less than the other shares which are freely negotiable; and this is the same position as the Malay Reserve land, vis-a-vis the other types of land that are in the freehold.
The Honourable Member for Sitia- wan was concerned that, when a foreign company opened its shares to the market, there was no control on the prices at which the shares could be sold.

I can assure him that not only my Ministry but also the Treasury and the Bank Negara always look into the valuation before we approve any company market.

to open its shares to the their The Honourable Member for Tan- jong wants to know what will be the size of the loss in revenue as a result of this Tax Incentives Bill.
Sir, the loss at the present moment is a theoretical one, simply because unless there are new factories who set up and who fulfill these conditions, either for export factories, or modernisation of there would not be any profits.

So, we would not have lost anything.

However, we must realise that if we do not have these incentives we would not have attracted them, they would not have been set up, which directly would help in the economic growth of the country.
So, once they have been set up, then there would be a degree of loss in income, but that is the sacrifice we have the attraction of factories to this country.

I hope, Sir, I have covered most of the points and I now beg to move that this Bill now be read a second time.

to pay for Usul di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Rang Undang2 di-bachakan kali yang kedua dan di-serahkan kapada Dewan sa-bagai Jawatan-kuasa.

Dewan bersidang sa-bagai Jawatan- kuasa.


Rang Undang2 di-timbangkan dalam Jawatan-kuasa.

(Tuan (Timbalan) Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan Meshuarat Jawatan-kuasa) Fasal2 1 hingga 34 di-perentahkan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

JADUAL— Dr Lim Swee Aun: Tuan Pengerusi, saya menchadangkan Jadual ini di- pinda mengikut Kertas DR. 17/68 yang telah di-bentangkan di-Majlis.
Pindaan berbunyi saperti yang berikut: Jadual—Kaedah 3: Gantikan dengan per- terdapat kataan "Mentri" di-mana sahaja perkataan2 "Mentri Kewangan."

Jadual—Kaedah 4 (2) (a): Potong per kataan2 "dalam suatu tahun taksiran."

7015 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7016 Pindaan di-kemuka bagi di-putus- kan, dan di-setujukan.

Jadual yang di-pinda di-perentahkan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Jadual kapada Rang Undang2.

Rang Undang2 di-laporkan dengan pindaan: di-bachakan kali yang ketiga dan di-luluskan.
THE EXCISE (AMENDMENT) (No.

2) BILL Bachaan Kali Yang Kedua dan Ketiga Dr Ng Kam Poh {dengan izin): Mr Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that a Bill intituled "an Act to amend the law relating to excise" be read a second time.

The Honourable the Minister of Commerce and Industry has just pre sented the Investment Incentives Bill, 1968, the House.

The Excise (Amendment) (No.


2) Bill, 1968, before Members of the House is for the pur pose of augmenting Investment Incentives Bill, 1968. the to This Excise (Amendment) (No.

2) Bill, 1968 will amend section 15 of the Excise Act of 1961 of West Malaysia and sections 8 of the Excise Ordinaces of Sabah and Sarawak, so that incen tives will be provided to promote the exports of locally manufactured goods.
This refund of excise duty will be those components or permitted items of commodities which have been used in the manufacture of products for export.

for It is anticipated this Excise (Amendment) (No.

2) Bill, 1968, will encourage our production of manufac tured goods to be export-orientated.

that Sir, I beg to move.

Setia-usaha Parlimen kapada Menteri Kesihatan (Tuan Ibrahim bin Abdul Rahman): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya menyokong.

Usul di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.


Rang Undang2 di-bachakan kali yang kedua dan di-serahkan kapada Dewan sa-bagai Jawatan-kuasa.

Dewan bersidang sa-bagai Jawatan- kuasa.

(Tuan (Timbalan) Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan Meshuarat Jawatan-kuasa) Fasal2 1 hingga 4 di-perentahkan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

Rang Undang2 di-laporkan dengan tidak ada pindaan: di-bachakan kali yang ketiga dan di-luluskan.
RANG UNDANG2 BADAN PERUNDANGAN SARAWAK (PENGGUNAAN WANG2 YANG DI-PINJAM DARIPADA PERSEKUTUAN) Bachaan Kali Yang Kedua dan Ketiga Menteri Muda Pelajaran (Tuan Lee Siok Yew): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya mohon menchadangkan supaya Rang Undang2 Badan Perundangan Sarawak (penggunaan wang2 yang di-pinjam daripada Persekutuan), 1968, di-bacha kali yang kedua.
tidak Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saperti yang di-terangkan di-dalam huraian yang terta'alok di-bawah Rang Undang2 ini, Council Negeri Sarawak telah melulus- kan Ordinance Pinjaman (Pengurusan Sekolah), 1964, pada 25 haribulan ia-itu sa-lepas Hari Februari, 1964, itu memberi Malaysia.

Ordinance kuasa kapada Kerajaan Negeri itu meminjam daripada Kerajaan Perseku tuan wang2 berjumlah lebeh daripada $3 juta atas sharat2 yang di- persetujui buah Kerajaan.
Urusan berkenaan pinjaman itu telah di-buat oleh Perbendaharaan Malaysia dan Kerajaan Negeri Sara wak.

Mengikut Sekshen 5 Ordinance itu wang2 yang di-pinjam di-bawah Ordinance tersebut akan di-masokkan ka-dalam Tabong Pinjaman kapada Pengurus2 Sekolah to School Managements Fund) yang di-gunakan mengikut peratoran yang di-tetapkan di-bawah Loans to Aided Schools Regulations, 1958. di-antara kedua2 (Loan Saperti yang satu perkara Persekutuan.
Oleh terma'alum pelajaran tanggong-jawab ia-lah Kerajaan yang demikian, Ordinance itu sa-takat sec tion yang di-nyatakan di-atas ada-lah mengatasi hal kuasa Perlembagaan ia- 1, Jadual Kesembilan—Senarai itu 7017 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7018 butiran 13 dan Senarai 2, butiran 7 (d).

Rang Undang2 ini bermaksud hendak memberi kuasa kapada Badan Perundangan Sarawak di-bawah Per- kara 76A, Perlembagaan Persekutuan, bagi membuat Undang2 berkenaan dengan penggunaan wang itu untok maksud2 yang tadi.
Pada hakikat-nya Rang Undang2 ini ber maksud hendak mengesahkan sekshen 5 Ordinance itu supaya berkuatkuasa kebelakangan.

tersebut Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya mohon menchadangkan.

Tuan Lee San Choon: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya menyokong usul ini.

Wan Abdul Kadir bin Ismail: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Rang Undang2 ini ada-lah satu Rang Undang2 yang tidak dapat tidak kena di-persetujukan oleh Dewan ini bagi mengsahkan Undang2 yang telah di-perkuat-kuasakan mulai 25hb September, 1964 dahulu.
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, soal pelajaran di-Sarawak dan juga di-Sabah, walau pun menurut Perlembagaan merupa- kan suatu perkara Persekutuan, tetapi Perjanjian Antara Kerajaan yang telah melahirkan Malaysia menyerahkan kuasa autonomy hak pelajaran kapada negeri2 Sarawak dan juga Sabah.

Saya suka-lah, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dalam menyokong Rang Undang2 ini hendak menyebut sa-kali lagi perkara soal pelajaran yang di-beri kuasa autonomy kapada Sarawak dan juga dalam hal ini kapada Sabah.
Saya merasa patut-lah di-mulakan perundingan di-antara Kerajaan Pusat juga dengan Kerajaan Sarawak dan dalam hal ini dengan Kerajaan Sabah dalam menyatukan perlaksanaan dasar pelajaran kebangsaan bagi negeri2 di- Malaysia Timor ini.

Saya rasa sa-lagi kuasa autonomy di-serahkan kapada Kerajaan2 Sarawak dan Sabah, maka dasar tidak pelajaran kapada negeri2 di-Malaysia Timor.
kebangsaan di-jalankan dapat-lah itu Sa-bagai daripada sa-bahagian negara Malaysia pada satu masa, sama ada dekat atau jauh, Sarawak dan Sabah mesti-lah masok dalam garisan kita, dasar pelajaran kerana hanya menerusi kebangsaan pelajaran dapat di-bentok sahaja jiwa dan semangat ka-Malaysian yang sa-benar- nya.
dasar sa-pakat dan lebeh baik-lah di-buat Jikalau sa-hingga masa ini walau pun perkara ini telah di-sebut, telah di-seru berkali2 pehak Kerajaan Negeri Sarawak maseh belum hendak memula- kan perundingan bagi melanjutkan atau menjalankan pelajaran kebangsaan Malaysia di-Sarawak, saya rasa langkah permulaan perundingan sa-chara tidak rasmi lebeh dahulu dengan pehak yang berkuasa di-Sarawak, dan juga dalam hal ini dengan pehak yang berkuasa di-Sabah, bagi menchari garisan2 per- Pusat di-antara Kerajaan temuan dengan Kerajaan Sarawak bagi men- chapai kata sa-bulat untok menjalankan dasar pelajaran kebangsaan yang sama bagi Malaysia Barat dan Malaysia Timor.
Dan saya suka menchadangkan, Tuan Yang di- Pertua, kalau boleh-lah, di-tetapkan suatu tarikh, suatu target date, suatu masa yang tertentu bila-kah persefaha- untok menyatukan Malaysia man Timor ka-dalam perlaksanaan dasar pelajaran kebangsaan ini boleh di- chapai dan dapat di-jalankan.
Ini ada- lah satu peroses yang tidak dapat di- bendong atau di-tolak, kerana jikalau oleh sebab beberapa hal yang tertentu di-rasai' oleh Sarawak dan juga dalam hal ini oleh Sabah untok menjalankan perlaksanaan perkara pelajaran ini dengan chara Sarawak tersendiri dan ini dengan chara juga dalam hal Sabah yang tersendiri, tetapi perkara tidak boleh-lah di-biarkan ber- ini kebajlkan masa panjangan hadapan negara Malaysia ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua.
untok Jadi pada masa ini pehak Sarawak, juga Sabah, ada-lah sentiasa meminta dan menuntut daripada Kerajaan Pusat bagi membelanjakan atau pun memberi pinjaman kapada Negeri2 itu bagi hal2 yang bersangkut menjalankan paut dengan pelajaran dan wang ini tidak dapat tidak akan terpaksa di- beri oleh Kerajaan Pusat kerana pela jaran ini ada-lah soal Persekutuan.
Tetapi jikalau duit ini di-churahkan dengan bagitu banyak kapada Sabah dan Sarawak dalam soal pelajaran tidak ada suatu dasar bagi dengan 7019 29 FEBR1 ARI 1968 I 7020 mengawal akan perbelanjaan wang di- berikan kapada Sarawak dan kapada Sabah itu, maka saya merasa ini ada- lah tidak adil kapada pembayar2 chukai di-Malaysia kita ini.
satu perkara yang juga dalam hal akan merasa Saya perchaya, Tuan Yang di-Per tua, bahawa saudara kita yang sa- negara yang sa-tanah ayer, Sarawak ini di-Sabah dan tidak suatu perkara yang bukan2 bagi pehak kita di- ini men- sabelah Malaysia Barat ini.

Kita hendak yuarakan perkara tingkatan di-mana menchapai suatu perpaduan yang lebeh rapat, perse- lebeh dekat, persau- fahaman yang daraan yang lebeh erat, semangat dan jiwa yang lebeh kukoh dapat kita chapai dalam negara Malaysia kita ini.
Masa hadapan kita hanya akan ter- jamin dengan ada-nya perkara ini dan hal ini hanya dapat di-chapai dengan perlaksanaan pelajaran kebangsaan yang di-satukan dan yang di-samakan bagi seluroh unit2 di-dalam Malaysia ini.
bagi dasar Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dengan seruan ini-lah saya bangun menyokong Rang Undang2 ini mudah2an seruan ini yang terbit dari hati ka-hati, yang terbit semangat Malaysia untok daripada Malaysia akan mendapat sambutan yang baik daripada pehak yang ber- kuasa dan juga rakan2 kita di-Sarawak dan di-dalam hal ini juga di-Sabah.
satu perkara yang Tuan Lee Siok Yew: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Ahli Yang Berhormat dari Kuala Trengganu Utara menyatakan bahawa pelajaran di-Malaysia Timor ia-lah sa-bagai satu badan autonomy.

saya Ini suka menjelaskan: di-Malaysia pelajaran Timor bukan-lah autonomous, akan tetapi mengikut laporan atau Penyata kapada kedua2 buah Negeri, ia-itu mengikut ia-itu I.G.C., Laporan pelajaran di-dalam negeri2 Sabah dan Sarawak mengikut biasa sa-belum dia masok Malaysia.
Jadi, Malaysia ini tahun 1963; telah di-tubohkan pada dan sa-lepas 10 tahun ini memang-lah Kerajaan Pusat, jikalau mendapatkan permintaan, atau permohonan dari pada negeri2 Sabah dan Sarawak perbelanjaan, untok membantukan atau alat kelengkapan atau kemuda- han2 pelajaran bagi kedua2 negeri itu, sentiasa memberi Kerajaan pertolongan.
Pusat satu dasar Pusat, Yang kedua Ahli Yang Berhormat itu menchadangkan bahawa Kerajaan hendak-lah kita, Kerajaan menjaiankan pelajaran kebangsaan supaya dapat di-gunakan suatu sahaja, ia-itu dasar pelajaran kebangsaan kita.
Berkenaan dengan target date itu, jikalau mulai' sekarang, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Sarawak dan Sabah telah memberikan pelajaran perchuma bagi sekolah2 rendah yang telah di-mulakan pada lhb Januari, 1966, bersama2 dengan Negeri2 di- jikalau Malaysia Barat, akan tetapi kedua2 Negeri itu memohon kapada Kerajaan Pusat atau menchadangkan kapada Kerajaan Pusat bagi men jaiankan bersama2 satu dasar pelajaran Kebangsaan Kerajaan Pusat, Kemen- sentiasa mengalu2kan terian tetapi kedua2 chadangan Negeri itu belum-lah boleh mencha dangkan apa2 Dasar Pelajaran Kebang sekarang di-dalam saan yang ada Malaysia Barat.
penjelasan Itu-lah daripada saya, Tuan Yang di-Pertua.

Terima kaseh.

itu, akan saya Wan Abdul Kadir bin Ismail: Ber kenaan dengan Kerajaan Sarawak dan Kerajaan Sabah tahun belum membuat apa2 langkah dalam ini ada-kah pehak kita— perkara Kerajaan Pusat hanya berdiam diri sahaja dalam soal itu?
sampai 20 Tuan Lee Siok Yew: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, tadi saya telah terangkan ia- itu Malaysia di-tubohkan dalam tahun 1963 jadi target date itu ia-lah sampai tahun 1973 maka baharu-lah pada sunggoh pun dasar ini di-jalankan Kerajaan2 Sarawak dan Sabah tidak berbuat apa2 chadangan atas hal ini, tetapi bila sampai masa-nya kelak, Dasar Pelajaran Kebangsaan mesti-lah di-jalankan di-Sarawak dan Sabah.

Usul di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.


Rang Undang2 di-bachakan kali yang kedua dan di-serahkan kapada Dewan sa-bagai Jawatan-kuasa.

7021 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7022 Dewan bersidang sa-bagai Jawatan- kuasa.

Rang Undang2 di-timbangkan dalam Jawatan-kuasa.

(Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan Meshuarat Jawatan-kuasa) Fasal2 1 dan 2 di-perentahkan men- daripada Rang sa-bahagian jadi Undang2.

Rang Undang2 di-laporkan dengan tidak ada pindaan: di-bachakan kali yang ketiga dan di-luluskan.
RANG UNDANG2 BENDA2 RADIOAKTIF Bachaan Kali Yang Kedua dan Ketiga Setia-usaha Parlimen kapada Menteri Kesihatan (Tuan Ibrahim bin Abdul Rahman): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya mohon izin menchadangkan satu Rang Undang2 yang bertajok Mengawal Benda2 Radioaktif dan Radas Pen- diangan Radio active Substances Bill di-bachakan kali yang kedua.
Per- kembangan kuasa nuclear dan peng- gunaan perkakas2 yang mempunyai chahaya pancharan dan benda2 radio aktif dalam berbagai2 lapangan telah menambah kemungkinan berlaku-nya pendedahan kapada bahaya kuasa ionizing radiation atau pun Pancharan Chahaya pengioman.

Pendedahan ini berlaku bukan sahaja kapada pakar2 X-ray atau Radiologist pegawai2-nya serta orang2 sakit, tetapi juga kapada pekerja2 dalam bidang2 perusahaan dan kapada orang 'awam pada kese- luruhan-nya.
Sa-belum daripada per- ini hanya mereka2 yang kembangan menjalankan kerja2 perubatan sahaja yang banyak terdedah kapada chahaya pancharan di-fikirkan ini, maka tanggong-jawab masaalah ini ada-lah pegawal2 perubatan dan Kerajaan tidak payah berchampur tangan dengan me- ngadakan Undang2; tetapi oleh sebab penggunaan perkakas2 yang mempunyai chahaya pancharan makin bertambah dalam lapangan kerja2 perubatan dan perusahaan, lapangan juga untok tindakan Kerajaan maka perlin- dan mengadakan kawalan itu perlu.
Oleh dongan ada-lah dalam tidak kurang daripada 25 buah negara dalam dunia ini telah pun mengadakan undang2 mengawal perkara ini.

Negara kita juga pada masa hari ini telah bergerak maju dalam lapangan perubatan dan perusahaan.

Berbagai2 teknik dan chara yang baharu di-guna- kan dan ini menyebabkan penggunaan perkakas dan barang2 radioaktif sa- makin bertambah khas-nya dalam lapangan perusahaan.
Dengan yang demikian ada-lah di-fikirkan mustahak di-adakan satu Undang2 untok men- jaga dan mengawal kesihatan umum.

Rang Undang2 ini ia-lah mengawal kemasokan perubatan penjualan, peng gunaan, simpanan dan pengangkutan barang2 radioaktif dan radas pendia- ngan.

Mengikut Rang Undang2 ini, maka pembuatan dan pengeluaran, pen jualan, simpanan membawa masok dan keluar barang2 radioaktif dan radas pendiangan ada-lah di-larang, melain kan dengan mendapat kebenaran atau permit.
Menggunakan benda2 Radioak tif ada-lah juga di-larang, melainkan dengan ada kebenaran atau permit.

Dalam Rang Undang2 ini ada peruntokan membolehkan yang mereka2 yang mushkil dan tidak puas hati dengan keputusan yang di-perbuat oleh pehak yang berkuasa mengeluar- kan permit atau pun kebenaran merayu kapada Menteri yang bertanggong- jawab dalam hal kesihatan dan keputu san beliau ada-lah mu'tamad.
Satu Jawatan-kuasa Penasihat yang bernama Radiological Advisory Committee akan di-tubohkan di-bawah Rang Undang2 ini.

Anggota-nya ia-lah sa-ramai enam ini akan orang dan Jawatan-kuasa memberi nasihat kapada Menteri me- ngenai perkara2 yang di-rojokkan oleh Menteri kapada-nya.

Ahli2 Jawatan- terdiri daripada kuasa mereka2 yang berpengalaman dan teknikal, mempunyai professional khas mengenai pakar2 perkara2 dan benda2 radioaktif.
pengetahuan dan ini ada-lah Rang Undang2 juga memberi kuasa kapada Menteri membuat per- atoran2 yang tertentu untok mengada kan kawalan yang meliputi dan kemas.

ini Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya mohon menchadangkan supaya Rang Undang2 7023 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7024 bernama Mengawal Benda2 yang Radioaktif dan Radas Pendiangan di- bacha pada kali yang kedua.
itu dengan sangat-lah Tuan Tai Kuan Yang sangat2 membahayakan (Kulim Bandar Baharu): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya menyokong penoh atas Rang Undang2 Radioaktif yang di-kemuka- kan oleh Kementerian yang berkenaan.

Radioaktif berguna dalam kesihatan.

Dalam pada itu pula kapada ia manusia, maka ada-nya Undang2 ini bererti ada mempunyai kawalan.
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya ingin tahu mengapa Rang Undang2 ini sa-chara langsong tidak menyebutkan ketetapan bayaran permit yang mana ada di-dalam Rang Undang2 ini ada-lah menyebutkan (2) ia-itu "apabila bayaran yang di-tetapkan di-bayar atau boleh," dan "menetapkan dalam Fasal 23 bayaran yang kena di-bayar".
dalam Fasal (b) a Tuan Yang di-Pertua, walau bagai- mana pun dalam Rang Undang2 ini pehak Kementerian boleh membuat ketetapan bayaran2 permit tidak ada baik-nya di-chatetkan bayaran permit itu di-dalam Rang Undang2 ini.

Sekian, terima kaseh.


Tuan Ibrahim bin Abdul Rahman: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di-dalam mana2 Rang Undang2, atau Bill perkara bayaran atau menetapkan harga itu tidak-lah pernah di-buat, tetapi sa-telah Undang2 ini di-luluskan satu peratoran akan di-buat oleh Jawatan-kuasa dan Yang Berhormat Menteri dan Jawatan- kuasa itu akan menentukan berapa-kah bayaran untok satu2 permit itu.

Usul di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.


Rang Undang2 di-bachakan kali yang kedua dan di-serahkan kapada Dewan sa-bagai Jawatan-kuasa.

Dewan bersidang sa-bagai Jawatan- kuasa.

Rang Undang2 di-timbangkan dalam Jawatan-kuasa.

(Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan Meshuarat Jawatan-kuasa) Fasal2 1 hingga 25 di-perentahkan sa-bahagian daripada Rang menjadi Undang2.

Jadual di-perentahkan menjadi sa- bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.
Rang Undang2 di-laporkan dengan tidak ada pindaan: di-bachakan kali yang ketiga dan di-luluskan.

THE NATIONAL LAND CODE (PENANG AND MALACCA TITLES) (AMENDMENT) BILL Bachaan Kali Yang Kedua dan Ketiga (Dato' Menteri Tanah dan Galian Haji Abdul-Rahman bin Ya'kub): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya mohon menchadangkan supaya National Land Code (Penang and Malacca Titles) (Amendment) Bill di-bacha pada kali yang kedua.
Sa-telah mendapat pengalaman pada menjalankan tugas2 yang sa-lama dua tahun, Persurohjaya Hak Milek Tanah Pulau Pinang dan Melaka mendapati perlu untok membuat beberapa pindaan kapada Undang2 Hak Milek Pulau Pinang dan Melaka, tahun 1963, supaya title di- membolehkan daftarkan, di-pinda atau di-batalkan dalam keadaan2 tertentu, dan menasa- bah yang mana tidak dapat di-batalkan pada masa menggubal Undang2 dahulu.
replacement Pindaan2 ini juga bermaksud untok membolehkan daftar sementara, ia-itu registers di-simpan dengan interim lebeh untok kesamaran menghapuskan mengenai procedure.

Ini-lah rengkas- nya tujuan2 Rang Undang2 yang saya kemukakan itu.

lagi beberapa sempurna dan itu satu Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sa-terus-nya saya suka menghuraikan pindaan2 yang di-kehendaki persatu-nya.
Fasal 2 meminda section 31, Principal Act untok memberi kuasa kapada Per surohjaya membuka satu lambaran atau folio dalam daftar sementara, jika ia mendapati suatu holding telah tertinggal atau sa-suatu surveyed lot yang boleh di-siapkan sa-bagai holding.

Fasal 3 meminda section 34, Principal Act, untok memberi kuasa kapada Pesurohjaya membatalkan mana2 lam baran yang di-dapati salah di-buka serta menetapkan peratoran2 yang hendak di-ikuti terhadap pembatalan itu.
7025 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7026 Fasal 4 meminda section 53, Prin cipal Act, supaya mengenakan section 53 itu kapada pegangan2 tanah adat dalam Daftar Tanah 'Adat Negeri Melaka yang mana nama2 tuan punya tidak dapat di-tentukan pada hari yang ia-itu pada 1 haribulan di-tetapkan, Januari, 1966.

Pindaan ini akan mem- bolehkan Pesurohjaya menentukan pemilek2-nya di-bawah section tersebut.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, penjelasan2 yang terkandong di-dalam Huraian pada Hujong Rang Undang2 tersebut.

Saya mohon menchadangkan.


lain ada Usul di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan setujukan.

Rang Undang2 di-bachakan kali yang kedua dan di-serahkan kapada Dewan sa-bagai Jawatan-kuasa.

Dewan bersidang sa-bagai Jawatan- kuasa.

(Tuan Yang di-Pertua mempengerusikan meshuarat Jawatan-kuasa) Fasal2 1 dan 2 di-perentahkan men Rang sa-bahagian daripada jadi Undang2.
Fasal 3— Dato' Haji Abdul-Rahman bin Ya'kub: Tuan Pengerusi, saya ingin menchadangkan pindaan kapada Fasal 3 saperti yang terkandong dalam Kertas Pindaan yang telah di-edarkan kapada Ahli2 Yang Berhormat.

Pindaan ber- bunyi saperti yang berikut: Clause 3: Substitute for the word "building" in the proviso to the proposed sub-section (3) of section 34 the word "holding".

Pindaan di-kemuka bagi di-putuskan, dan di-setujukan.

Fasal 3 yang di-pinda, di-perentah sa-bahagian daripada kan menjadi Rang Undang2.
Fasal2 4 hingga 12 di-perentahkan menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Rang Undang2.

PENANGGOHAN (Usul) Timbalan Perdana Menteri (Tun Haji Abdul Razak): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, ia-itu saya mohon menchadangkan Meshuarat ini di-tanggohkan sekarang.

Dr Lim Swee Aun: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya menyokong usul ini.

UCHAPAN PENANGGOHAN PILEHANRAYA UMUM NEGERI SARAWAK Tuan Tama Weng Tinggang Wan Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya bangun menguchapkan terima kaseh ribuan kerana dapat peluang beruchap dalam Uchapan Penanggohan ini.
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya suka hendak menarek perhatian Dewan ini mengenai Pilehan- raya Umum Negeri Sarawak.

Ra'ayat tidak berpuas hati Sarawak kerana Kerajaan tidak menepati janji-nya mengenai perkara mengadakan di-Negeri Sarawak.

Pilehanraya Perikatan selalu ini janji Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dalam bulan Disember, 1966, Gabenor Sarawak, Tun Abang Haji Openg, mengumum- kan pada masa membuka Council Negeri Sarawak supaya Pilehanraya Umum Sarawak di-adakan dalam bulan Ogos atau September tahun 1967.
Tuan Yang di-Pertua, tidak di- tepati.

Dalam bulan April, 1967, Suro- hanjaya Pilehanraya mengumumkan, ia- itu oleh kerana sebab2 yang tidak dapat di-elakkan Pilehanraya akan di-adakan pada bulan Februari, 1968 pula.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, janji ini pun tidak di- tepati.

Pada akhir tahun 1967, pada menjawab pertanyaan dalam Parlimen, Perdana Menteri menyatakan Pilehan raya ini akan di-tanggohkan lagi hingga bulan April, 1968.

Janji yang ketiga ini pun tidak di-tunaikan.


Pada menjawab satu soalan yang saya kemukakan dalam persidangan ini, Perdana Menteri menjawab ia-itu Pilehanraya akan di- adakan sa-lepas bulan Oktober tahun 1968.

Rang Undang2 di-laporkan dengan pindaan: di-bachakan kali yang ketiga dan di-luluskan.

Tuan Yang di-Pertua, ra'ayat Sara wak hilang-lah keperchayaan terhadap Kerajaan Sarawak yang di-pimpin 7027 29 FEBRUARI 1968 7028 oleh Penghulu Tawi Sli.
Nampak- nya Kerajaan Perikatan chuba hendak melengah2kan nasib hari Sarawak dengan menangohkan Pile hanraya Sarawak.

untong Tuan Yang di-Pertua, kami menyeru Kerajaan Perikatan supaya menghor- mati janji2-nya dan adakan Pilehanraya Umum di-Sarawak sa-lewat2-nya tahun ini juga.

Kalau Pilehanraya itu tidak di- adakan maka Kerajaan Perikatan akan lagi Sarawak mendapati menyertai-nya kelak.
tidak Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya berharap dapat menentukan hari yang akan datang untok pilehanraya bagi memuas- kan hati ra'ayat yang inginkan Pilehan raya Negeri Sarawak.

Itu-lah sahaja uchapan saya dan di-uchapkan terima kaseh.
Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, soal Pilehanraya di-Sarawak ini telah beberapa kali di-timbulkan dalam Persidangan Dewan Ra'ayat yang sedang berjalan sekarang ini dan saya telah pun menyatakan, ia-itu Pe nyata Persempadanan Bahagian, atau pun Report on the Delimitation of Parliamentary State Constituency di- Negeri Sarawak sedang dalam kajian Kerajaan dan report ini akan di-chetak dan di-bentangkan untok di-timbangkan oleh Dewan ini sa-telah Kerajaan selesai mengkajikan report itu.
tidak sa-kali2 selesai membuat Saya telah juga menyatakan, ia-itu Pilehanraya Sarawak akan di-adakan sa-telah sahaja Surohanjaya Pilehan persediaan2 raya saperti menyiapkan daftar pengundi, tempat membuang undi, menetapkan melantek pegawai2 dan sa-bagai-nya.

Kerajaan hendak .

melengah2kan pilehanraya di-Sarawak ini dan pilehanraya akan di-adakan sa- telah kesiapan2 semua telah sempuma.
Sa-bagai Ahli2 Yang Berhormat ma'alum Pilehanraya Negeri yang akan di-adakan ini ia-lah pilehanraya yang pertama kali di-adakan sa-chara terus atau direct election di-Sarawak, dan oleh yang demikian Kerajaan perlu mengkaji dengan teliti-nya shor2 yang telah di-buat oleh Surohanjaya Pile hanraya dalam report-nya, itu supaya menjaminkan, ia-itu pilehanraya yang akan di-adakan itu boleh di-jalankan dengan lichin dan sempuma, kerana Kerajaan berpengang tegoh kapada amalan demokrasi berparlimen.
akan di-bentangkan Saya suka menyatakan, ia-itu Kera jaan telah pun selesai mengkajikan report itu dan telah menetapkan, ia-itu report dalam Dewan ini dalam persidangan Dewan yang akan datang.

Sunggoh pun Dewan ini akan terus bersidang sa-hari dua lagi tetapi oleh sebab prechetakan report ini akan mengambil masa dan saya juga perchaya Ahli2 Yang Berhormat teru- tama sa-kali Ahli2 Yang Berhormat dari Sarawak perlukan masa untok mengkaji-nya.
Kerajaan telah memikir- kan, ia-itu untok faedah semua pehak lebeh sesuai report ini di-bentangkan untok mendapat persetujuan Dewan ini dalam persidangan yang akan datang ini.

terta'alok kapada tidak dapat di-mulakan Sa-bagaimana juga yang saya telah nyatakan di-Dewan ini bahawa pada menjawab pertanyaan2 dalam Dewan ini, ia-itu Surohanjaya Pilehanraya telah menasihatkan Pliehanraya Dewan Negeri sa- belum bulan Oktober tahun ini.
Tem- poh mengundi pula akan mengambil masa sa-lama satu bulan dan nasihat ini ada-lah report yang di-luluskan oleh Dewan Ra'ayat dalam bulan Januari.

Jadi, Surohanjaya Pilehanraya telah juga menyatakan ia- itu dari tarikh di-luluskan Penyata Delimitation of Constituency ini dan hari mengundi di-Sarawak, mereka berkehendakkan se-kurang-nya sa-belas bulan untok mengadakan beberapa per sediaan2 yang perlu.
Apabila Penyata Surohanjaya Pilehanraya di-terima oleh Parlimen, maka langkah2 akan di-ambil untok mengadakan persediaan2 bagi supaya pilehanraya pilehanraya dapat di-adakan dengan sa-berapa segera yang boleh.

itu Tuan Timbalan Yang di-Pertua: Meshuarat di-tanggohkan hingga pukul 9.30 hari esok.

Meshuarat di-tanggohkan pada pukul 8.40 malam.