Source document: https://docs-lawep.s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/1698068865899.pdf (Guyana)
1,209 Members Present.LEGISLATIVE· COUNCIL.

Govt.

Notices.

1,210 (East- LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL.

The Hon.

Dr. G. M. Gonsalves 1n·11 Berbice).

The Hon.

Dr. C. Jagan (Central Dcmerara).

THURSDAY, 3RD JUNE, 1948 The Hon.

W. 0.

R. Kendall (New Amsterdam).

- The Council met at 2 p.m., His the Governor, O.B.E.. Sir Charles lVI.C., Presi­ K.C.M.G., Excellency Woolley, dent.

in 1:hP.

Chair.

The Hon.

C. A. McDocm (Nominated).

The Hon.

A. T. Peters (Wester:: Berbice).

The Hon.


W. A. Phang (Nor�h West­ ern District).

PRESENT.

The Hon.

J. Carter (Georgetown Tµe President, His Excellency the Woolley, South).

Governor, K.C.M.G., Sir Charles O.B.E., M.C.

Campbell The Hon.

E. M. Gonsalves (Nom­ inated).

The Hon.

the Colonial Secretary, Mr. W.L.

Heape, C.M.G.

The Clerk read prayers.

The Hon.

the Attorney-General, Mr. F. W. Holder, K.C .

The minutes of the meeting of the Council held on Friday, as printed read and confir'med.
and circulated, were taken as 28th May, 1948, The Hon.

the Colonial E. F. McDavid, C.B.E.

Treasul'er, Mr. PAPERS LAID.

The Hon.

Dr. J.

B. Singh, O.B.E., 1Demerara-Essequibo).

The COLONIAL SECRET ARY laid on the taole the following:- The Hon.

Dr. J.

A. Nicholson (George- town North).

The Report of the Government Analyst for the year 1947.

The Hon.

T. Lee (Essequibo River).

The Hon.

V. Roth (Nominated).

The Report of Wortmanville Hous­ ing Scheme for i.he period 1st January to 31st March, 1948.
The Hon.

C. P. Ferreira (Berbice GOVERNMENT NOTICES River).

The Hon.

T. T. Thompson (Nomi­ nated).

SOCIAL WELFARE SERVICES.

The COLONIAL TREASURER: I beg to give notice of the following motion:- The Hon.

G. A. C. Farnum (Nomi­ nated).

The Hon.

Capt.

J. P. Coghlan (Dem­ erara River).

The Hon.

D. P. Debidin (Eastern Demerara).


"BE IT RESOLVED that this Coun­ of the the continuance under initiated cil approves Social Welfare Services Colonial Development Schemes-D 212 and D 443, and of the establishment basis of on .a permanent the existing Social Welfare tion."

and Welfare Organisa­ The Hon.

J. Fernandes (Georgetown Central).

May I state that if there is time I shall ask leave of the Council motion later in the dav.

to take this 1,211 Unofficial 3 JUNE, 1948.


Notices 1,212 I-JOSPTTAL J:'EJ::.<: TIEC:1Tf.ATION�.

iics and 127% for East Indian families on ;;ugar plantations; The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: I beg motion:- lo �ive notice of the following "That this Council approves Fees (Amendment) of the Regula­ Hospital tions, 1948."
(ii)Notwithstanding the recent in wages of lower income increase groups, and efforts this great rise in the cost of living continues nlarming to devalue earnings I to control prices, extent; and to an UNOFFICIAL NOTICES TRADE UNION LEGISLATION.

Mr. ROTH: I beg to give notice of the following motion:- "WHEREAS the recent growth of Trade Unions purporting to and occu­ identical multiple represent pations is m ili ta ting against the .. best interests of Trade Unionism of the economic cietriment Colony.
and to the life of the industries "BE IT RESOLVED THAT this Council recommend to the immediate confining Honourable Government of legislation to each branch of industry tion, the choice of such Unions to be made by the Legislativ representat one Trade Union and occupa­ ives of the people."

e Council as CONSTRUCTION OF AIR STRIP.


enactment of 73,541 "(iii) Out of a population and 9,578 for New for Georgetown Amsterdam there are only 5,000 and the 1 1,350 property having con­ majority 0 to rent houses in which to sequently live, at rates currently to their earnings; of breadwinners owners respectively, out of proportion ·'BE IT RESOLVED that a Com­ the Economic of Labour.
the Com­ of Local Government and forth­ Adviser, mittee of this House be appointed with (co-opting the Commissioner rn issioner such other persons as are necessary) of prepar­ the practicability to consider ing a scheme for the payment of family modelled allowances Allowances Families Kingdom but commensurate financial cit:v of the Colony."

INCRF.ASED with the and productive capa­ generally Act of the United COST OF LIVING ALLOW­ position on the ANCE TO PENSIONERS.
Mr. FERNANDES: I beg to give Captain COGHLAN gave notice of motion:- the following notice of the foUo,Ning motion:- "BE IT RESOLVED that this to Government recommend co·uncil (a)The immediate investigation the possibility air strip in ciose proximity City.

of constructing of an to the Co) If constructing this Air strip is with­ possible, it be constr,,".ted out delay."

PAYMENT OF' FAMILY ALLOWANCES.

''WHEREAS by Resolution No.
IX Council on the passed by Legislative 22nd of April, rates of cost of living to Government allowance were approved; and pensioners "WHEREAS with the steadv rise in the cost of living, these rates are far too low; it is conside"i·ed that "BE IT RESOLVED that this Hon­ om•able Council recommends consideration favourable ment that the following be adopted:- of Govern­ rates should •c for the Mr. CARTER: I beg to _give notice of -the following motion:- "WHEREAS security of family life is the rno8t important foundation Guiana can be built; and on which a strong British if not the only WHEREAS it appears to be the policy of.
the Government Guiana tb encourage popnla tion; of British of the the increase AND WHEREAS- (i)The recently published statis­ tics on cost of living show an overall ri;,e to the extent o( 93 % on the figure for 1938 for urban working class farni- 40%on the first $360 per annum 20% on the next 3360 per annum and a flat rate of $144 per annum on pensions not exceeding $1.440 per annum.
$720 per annum but exceeding Provided that - (a)No pensioner shall receive less of than $10 oer month inclusive cost of livin,g the increased allo·-,.rance; fo) anv pensioner 'Nho is in receipt of a pension -from the public 1,213 Sum.

Juris.

(O.ffences) Bm.

Customs Duties (i:l.7ndt.)

Bill.

1,214 LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL.

funds of any other Colonial Government of living allowance lated pro raia on his entire pension.

as cost a sum calcu­ shall receive ORDER OF THE DAY SUMMARY JURISDICTION (OF�'ENCES} BILL.
With The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: regard to item 1 on the Order of the Day - the Summary Jurisdiction (Offences) (Amendment) withdraw further sentatioris Bill-I would ask leave to it as I desire to give the Bill lion as a result of repre­ which have been made.

considera Agreed to.

Consideration deferred.


are liable suitable preserves, no bill of entry tax is pay­ that such provision and intended for honey or miik, if they solely for the purpose of or to at the rate of Tariff Preferential and Reasons, able on bottles bottling are imported packing goods of local manufacture and such bottles production; import duty, ad va.lorem.

2 per centum British and 5 per centum General Tariff.
considered apply to all bottles when imported packing goods of local manufacture .

The question production date of this Bill has been consi­ operative denicl and it has been decided that the Biil should have retrospective It that it should be was at first considered retrospective year.

but on reference 10 or 1948. it v,,iJl (2)(a) states:- as from January 1, this to Ordinance solely for the purpose of be found that section It is should and bottle stoppers No.

4, effect.
4, effect.

as to the or ,., CORPORAL PUNISHMENT BILLS.

The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: I do further to corporal not referred at the moment punish­ propose to proceed with the Bills relating ment in view of the fact that one of the to a Select Biils has b een referred that the two It is proposed Committee.

to the although other Bills, might be dealt with at the Committee, same time.
In other words, when we are dealing with the Bill before the Select we can deal 'Nith the others Committee which relate to the same subject.

I therefor e ask leave to postponed and 6 which relate to corporal ment, and also item 7-the Interpretation Ordinance items 5 punish­ (Amendment) Bill.
"(a) Where prior to the thirtieth hundred and nineteen any such goods were en­ clay of December, forty-seven tered for consumption but the duties payable goods were not paid or secured prior to such date; .... " in the Colony in respect of such Consequently, it is proper and desit-­ effect is being able that if a retr.ospective given to this Bill it should be in keeping with what is set out in that Ordinsnce.
on that, therefore, Following insert a new clause - clause 3 -which will read:- I propose to two of this Ordinance, (a) .

and (b) of sub, "3.

Section and paragraphs two of the Cus­ (1) of section section Ordinance, toms (Amendment) shall be deemed to have ,:ome into operation December, nineteen hundred scven."

day of and forty­ on the thirtieth 1948, Agreed to Consideration deferred.

,, ' CUST0M-S DUTIES (AMENDMENT No.

2) BILL.

With those comments, I beg to move that the Bill be read a second time.
A Bill intituled "An Ordinance to amend the Customs Duties further Ordinance, Customs duty on tattles stop13ers 1935, with respect to the and bottle ."

The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: This Bill has been before hon.

Members for so111c-liti'.le ti111c ;ipprcri:d" 1hr rca�ons (or il� tion.
As \\'ill ::im s11rc they will i)e �cc11 ;ind I introduc­ from lhe Object� The COLONIAL TREASURER: I beg to second lhat, and in doing so I wish tn explsin that this Bill is really in pur­ suance of a suggestion Council town Central at the time variations taxation consicJcrcd.

mattrr wn11lrl lhink lhe hun.

Member wu11ld ;,c pl;'abcrl by the hon.

Member for George­ in lhe last budget were being he· c·tmsic_lrrrri, I 11nclcrtook then that the made in the in :ind nnw l 1,215 Customs Duties (Amdt.)
BiLL 3 JUNE, 1948.

Social Welfare Org.

1,216 to see it before the Council.

cioes meet the point which the hon.

Member requested at that time.

I think it should be considered Title and enacting clause : The ATTORNEY-GENERA L: I move that ,he titie of the Bill be amended by the addition .
respects" of the words "and in other' Mr. FERNANDES: I desire at this it is to justify discrimina­ for putting -in favour of one indus­ sta::(e to thank Government this matter right because, obviously, that should have been done something long ago.

As I said when I brought it up, it was di:i:ficult tion in that v<.ra� the other.

At the same time.

try against these things with the object of getting in half the rate of: duty was removed because it was found that another Ordin­ ance had to be passed.
I asked that this be done and I must say I am very grateful for oringing to Government Council so as ·to have the situation right.- it before the put Amendment put, and agreed to.

� Council resumed.

The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: I i:Jeg to move that this Bili iJe now read a third time and passed.

The COLONIAL SECRET ARY se­ conded.

Questior.

put.

and agreed to.

Bill read the third time and passed.

Question put, and agreed to.

ESTABLISHMENT OF SOCIAL WELFARE Bill read the sec.

:oncl time.
:oncl time.

COUNCIL IN COMMITTEE.

Council to consider itseif resolved the Bill ciause bv clause.

into Committee Clause 3-0peration of Ordinance.

The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: I be_g to move the insertion cla11se 3 at the end of this Bill:- of the following as "3.
Section 2 of this Ordinance, (a) and (b) of sub-sec­ 2 of the Customs 1948, and paragraphs tion (1) of section Duties (Amendment) Ordinance, shall be deemed to have come into on the thirtieth operation hi.mdred ber, nineteen day of Decem­ ORGANISATION.

Rule one standing The COLONIAL TREASURER: I beg Standing in order to enable to move that the relevant and Order be suspended me to take at once the motion of which of this I gave notice at the beginning 111eeting-the schedule tion 0£ Social Welfare Services.
It is a and one im­ of some importance, matter' point is that Mr. Laing, the Com­ portant will be of Local Government, n-1issioner the Colony shortly leaving ·iike to get this Bili through whilst he is in the Colony.

in the second and dealing and we would with the continua­ The ATTORNEY-GENERAL seconded.

and forty-seven."

Question put, and agreed t0.


The CHAIRMAN: When these duties I think it was intended introduced ,,,ere that they should come into effect from the date-when the budget came in-on January 1-and this clause is to .make up for an omission in the originai Bill.

Relevant suspended.
Relevant suspended.

Standing Rule and Order The COLONIAL TREASURER: I now beg to move the following motion:- The COLONIAL TREASURER: The i:Judget resolution as Members vvould was taken on December 30, ·1947, recall, and from that date t3.xes became effec­ tive.

Thereiore, he from that date.


any amendment should "BE IT RESOLVED that this Coun­ e of the under initiated cil approves the continuanc Social Welfare Services Colonial Development Schemes-D 212 and D 443, and of the basis of establishment the existing tion."

on a permanent Social Welfare Organisa­ and Welfare New clau�e (3) pul.

and agreed Lu.

Hon.

Members will recall that when this matter came up in Fmance Committee 1,217 Social Welfare LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL.

Organisaition ·.
Organisaition ·.

1,218 Estimates this Council is in fact to carry on this orgamsation and for it in and in future.

Mr. know whethe-r prepared will vote the necessary funds the 1949 Laing is in the hall and, I am quite sure, he is quite prepared to explain the whole situation.
details have any views speak first and allow Mr. Lamg tc, speak afterwards oecause I have said, a presentation but it is an opportunity express Services that if Members to express they should their views on the Social Welfare Before going fully into I would suggest it is not so much, as in this Colony.

for Members to of this idea The COLONIAL SECRETARY se­ conded.
that Mr. FERREIRA: May I suggest Mr. Laing should address the Council· now and set out the points for the con­ sideration versed in the subject of time would be saved if he were to speak and let us hear his views.

We might agree with of hon.

Members?

He is well and, I think, a lot them.


service, on and, what and so I under­ opposition there was a lack of into this Council were many ideas to the continuation with regard to the Social Wel­ of ,vhat was the policy iJut it seems to as to how in Council at the of the 1948 draft Estimates, and subsequently 2xamination were man,v confitctmg views and opinions expresced and its work in this fare Organisation Colony.
I will not say that Members expressed o:i: this important me that there the work should be carried was more important, appreciation behmd this orgariisation, took to invite you, Sir,.

to approve of a motion being introduced in order that there should be a full-dress debate, portant matter.

The Estimate5 on page 38, for an expenditure provided, that 1s tne amount estimated of $18,316; to be expended for the half :vear-from Juiy to the end of the year - on this Or�(anisat10n.
included the grants from the Colonial and Welfare· being maintained this month and, secondly, on provision to be carried from the main Estimates met from our own financial The Organisation Estimates, Development from which this service was on the 30th of ii the service is has to be made of the Colony and , as set up in those the following if Members so wish, on this im­ in our main Estimates That amount had to be resources.
comprises expires because for 1948 staff:- Head Office Staff: Assistant Social Junior Social Welfare Staff, Child Welfare Welfare Officer, Clerical Officer, Youth Organiser, Officer, Staff Co-operative Organiser.

and Field Mr. LEE: I support that suggestion.

The PRESIDENT: I think, Mr. Laing will explain what are the activities the Social Welfare Organisation, it started with the help of Colonial Development and Welfare funds.
of and how Mr. M. B. LAING, C.M.G., O.B.E., and of Local Government (Com.missioner Social Welfare Officer) : Your Excellency and Members of Council,.

perhaps the best thing I can do is to read to hon.

Mem­ bers a part of Sir Gordon Lethem's Message to this Council when Social Welfare was first introduced.

Message the Governor out Government's Social Welfare.

Le them wrote in his Message.

reference 1944, with Social Welfare staff.


policy in regard to This is what Sir Gordon In that endeavoured to set No .. 4 of to the duties of the of the Co-operative Departm::mt, Provision has also been made for would, in some degree, expenses quite for the Officers travelling to Members that the question as well as funds of a Co-operative District various for the Youth Council, and so on.

When we discussed recently Movement and made provision initiation I think.
it was indicated these two services work hand m hand.

I think it was that the Field Staff of the explained would, in Social Welfare 0rgarusation act as Field Staff for the some degree, Movement.

I do not pro: Co-operative pose to go into that at all, because ibis is really an opportunity express their own views on thE: matter and fol' those views to be answered.
the same tune the Resolution will us I have said, so that Government for Mem ber·s to At is worded, ,,I � "It is proposed that thev should of wholesome devote their time to rural reconstruction.

The importance must not be forgotten rendering physically earning a satisfact01�y livelihood, but Purely social activities encouraged the individual and mentally, beyond a scale which recreation - as a means of more fitted, for the task of will not be each 1,219 Social W eLfare 3 JUNE, 1948.

Organisation.
Organisation.

1,220 to support for itself.

The decision practical basis since the community can­ district is willing and can, in fact, support.

to work upon a severely is inevitable, not bear the cost of adequate services until the economic been improved, from many points of view that th,:­ services assumption from the Imperial indefinite should be maintained on tlw social situation has Treasury fof an period.
and it is undesirable in laying the results we had achieved foundation of the Co-operative Movement - results which Your Excellency con­ sidered of sufficient importance to ask this Council to vote a forther sum of money to provide for a Registrar of Co­ operative and a small staff to foEn a separate to further develop �he Co-operative Movement - I think, I may then justly c:iaim that the Social Welfare Organization has succeeded e,tabiishing in the Co-operative Societies Movement.
;,ranch of continued assistance' "The chief concern of District " affecting and united will therefore self-sufficiency action over common the living conditions be of group activities aimed at within the dis­ Officers for the present the creation greater trict, problems and earning capacity of the people.

It will be necessary for them to devise ways in which rural populations can employ themselves between crops - with cottage tries and handicrafts.
of thrift co-operatives groups will provide material value."

The promotion clubs.

buying clubs, marketing and co-operative activity having b0th and an educational or village indus­ advantages profitably housing I think it is necessary that Members in regard to Social Welfare.
and there may be some misund�r­ should be reminded of the policy of Government because some of the gentlemen who are now Members of this Council were not Members when Government outlined its policy, standing of what is actually Social Welfare.

I think hon.

Members will now understand that Social Welfare in this Colony has a severely basis, and one of its objects greater Social Welfare mav be described as self­ help, and it will remain rooted in self­ help.

self-sufficiency.
self-sufficiency.

In other words, is to achieve meant by practical The first duty of my 01·ganisation was the best Jines that to policy, and was reached of the Co-operative the best results.

to try and ascertain could be pursued in the rural districts give effect to Government's after some time a decision that the establishment Movement would provide It was further ment of Home Industries encouraged.
Proceeding lines, as Your Excellency of Council are a wa1'e, we laid very care­ full:v the foundation of the Co-operative Move111ent.

�ncl in Your Excellency's Message lo this Council on Co-operation you praised my organisalio11 along those and Members decided that the develop­ should also be for the In regard to Home Industries, Mem­ !'
out of local oi: Georgetown and the Countr_v they may in surprised straw work­ oi' hats and bags :,ers are, I think, aware that we have endeavoured to estaolish tnat is_ the manufacture and othe1· useful articles materiai.

If Memoers look around the streets Districts to find that a large numoer '.l:i our ladies in the towns and the rural mstricts are at pre­ sent wearing hats and using iJags of local manufacture.
progress and it is achieving satisfactor_v inasmuch as one group of some seven younii: women made during last year a net profit of $1,000 for themselves.

have made of that line in the development We ceriainly results.

In addition to the activities mentioned, service is being very important along modern lines.

Officer has been appointed school for boys school for the approved and the approved the Social Welfare Branch has to develop other social services.
The development of the reformative s�rstem was a matter that we considered and one that should be developed A Probation and the probation developed: in Essequibo giris at Belfield are now organised on modern lines.

An After-Care Officer has inen appointeci for the Bo:vs' School to see that the training at the school is not lost when they leave the school.
An After-Care care of the girls from the Belfield School when they leave that institution is now proposed, an After-Care adult prisoners Georgetown Prison and the Prisons New Amsterdam Office1• to take charge of on dischar,ge from the at to appoint very shortl_v that the boys receive and Mazaruni.

Officer also takes And it � It,.'
A further matter that engaged the nf lhC' Social w�Hare Organis,1- ;1ttc11tion 11011 was the care of child1·en placed under the guardianship who had been of foster- 1,221 Social, WelfaTe LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL, 01·ganisation, 1,222 up to sec were given adequate there was no follow h:v our Poor Law Commissioners, in the homes o:E their foster­ This work is now being carriec1 parents PrcviO'usl_v that those children attention paren1s, out oy our Woman Welfare ace m,my other things_ unclertaker:1. ctcvclopmcnt Tnere is also th2 question of the charitable organisations benefit under the Ordinance the cli,tri•JL1tion There is.
for instance, o� the Friendly Societies, of the inspection deaiing of the sweepstake Sir, that should be the which with money.

Officer.

There to Government ask the Imperiai longer until the revenue I have been Horne, and there with that al 0ome time or other Government wolllct caffy 1t a little of this Colony haa improved, an Official Visitor of the Girls' I h3v2 at certain times visited Mr. Laing.
who is Chairman of the Corn­ mi ttec, I can say to this Council therE' has been very great improvement in those girls who were sent to that Home, and I can assure hon, Members tha:t if this Colon>' could afford it we should continue ii, The feeling I have 3t the back of my head is whether we can afford it If we can get an assurance from Government that we can afford vrithout den on the community ,_.,orkers _good, to carry on these things an extra financial bur­ or in no way the will be taxed, then I say it is imposing that The Social Welfare staff.
'Nhich I to retain ihat Social Wel­ will •.1e lost and '-'-' the Social Services ° ld up, improve to and all the endeavours is a very hum:H� one, is ·required suggest to carry oui all o:i' those and many other duiies, Should this Council feel in its wisdom that it is unneccessary the Social Welfare staff.
then all the work I have referr2d that ,,,e have made to bui anrt modernize in this e should have Colon�, to r2turn to the point we were at when Social Welfare started three years a_go, I would like to emphasize iare has onl;,, oeen in operation three years and had to i'.Je mad2 and to start ,:rom zero, We have iJnilt up this organi­ sation, We have achieved success various matters to which I have referred and, although think great cr2dit 1s clue to the Officers of the Social We1fare Branch of rn:v department suc­ cess they have achieved If there are any questions care to ask 1n conneetion matters '-'-'ith I shall ')e oniy too glad, Your Excellency.
to give any explanation 1:1:i�-requirC:'.
Members would with the man>' which Social Welfare deals for the very remarkaiJle I am sa>,irig which Members in so short s time it myself, I in the Mr, LEE: Th2re is no doubt in my community, introduced b:v Sir mind, as I have said at the co1ru11encemenl wl�en tnis ·;vas i:Jein_g Gordon Lethem, that Social Weifare is required in ever_v advanced •wt at that time I siso said that we have to carry this Social Welfare on the ex­ penditure Government revenue to cov2r that expenditure will be and will remain a burden to this Colony, I feel, Sir, that is still my opinion, ;Jui can this Colony carry the .responsi­ bility sid:.
: of our Budget and unless can see its way to obtain Social Welfare is a good thing.

oi' the expenditure ?

I was hoping it one or twc must be or know at La G-range There is no doubt that in the Courts Offi.cers are doing their best.
with the Government on the West Bank Demer­ the making of a useful in­ to launch all these household for the benefit of the people villages, the Probation and in the rlistricts-I ana Ba_gotville ara-the.v have instituted straw hats which has becomE: dustry helped by the Social Welfare Officer, As regards the co-operative side, together Produce .

Depot they ha ire attempted things whic:1 in time will prove of benefit to the community.
But it costs money, and that is my fear, I rea}ly cannot tell you how much I feel in respect of this money, because I know there capital local schemes in the several �ret provided ancl Members of this Council are aware, I tried as muc.n.

as possible for Bartica under the Ten Y2ar· Plan to get $10,000 for expenditure tica is one of the villages ency and, I _can assure Members of Coun­ cil, it has done a lot of g:ood there.
You meet people there at certain times, and you can fe2l that the association brought about there by Social Welfare among the men and women and children their views.

At the present is on foot a scheme for the establishment and expansion Bartica, Sports Club in respect expansion Members of Council of it, Your Excellency about it.
is broadening moment there I had to speaK to the Bartica here and, as Your Excellency on Social Welfare, of Social Welfare in the­ or hon, of permitting in my constitu­ The capital can enquire is not Bar­ � () 1,223 Soc�l Welfare 3 JUNE, 1948.

Organisation.

1,224 - .

in the modern officer, Mr. You have a very excellent Angoy, who is pushing it as much as and is gettmg tl1e people of the possible district to understand each other and to understand advancement way of Social Welfare.
There is esta­ blished a -Thrift Union and by that the people have saved some money and it has been expended, direction, I have said on more than one occasion, this small beginning that needs capital.

concerned.

in the right help.

As but they need further wants enlarging and tnat is where I am I believe, and are doing.
and the clubs are has seen the type that the children very good and it is I do not think l am incorrect is certainly started recreation for those children, clubs whereby thE::y make artic-les.

I think, Your Excellency of handicraft It is certainly improving.

in saying that handicraft coming into popularity, certainl�, getting from the sale of those articles them on.
We have women's institutions which have been fostering I venture the villages for the reason that the people did not know what to do with themselves.

The women's organisations some sort of club where the women go and exchange their every village a large sum of money.

to carry Q knowledge community, and, I think, by that.

was verv dull in the evenings to say, Sir, that years ago life in started to form Welfare.
oenefits Socia'J For instance, have not the means stock - two hens and let us take the Grow More Food Campaign in which you have poultry-rearing.

A family may want to embark upon.

that but ha,,e not the means to buy the required a cock - to start with.

I know several people in the villages to do so.
I feel that in providing this if Members are satisfied Social Welfare, some • provision with the establishment, must be made by Government in res­ pect of financial advances to cer­ tain members of the Social Welfare Movement in order' that they can better I have their position no doubt, Your Excellency will hear the views of Members of this Council and, if an assurance can be given that we can meet this expenditure, no trouble about the same time there is also the rumour of our local men are being that certain and some are being promoted overlooked in preference to the other.
I desire that some assurance then there can be it.

Tha.t is my view.

At in the community.

be given in respect of that.

to read an extract The next thing is, Sir, 1 may be from a pam­ allm-ved phlet which came into my hands termed Welfare in the Colonies": I think "Social what is the object and aim it tells exactly of Social Welfare in the Colonies.

The portion of the pamp'.,let reads I desire to quote "The concern of the social welfare worker is so widelv extended exhaustively exhaustiv2ly ever.
be helpful falling that reall:v the groups freely overlap.

It may, how­ It may, how­ them as catalogued.

catlogued.

into four group�, to represent that the notwithstanding A.

The promotion of community life and the use of the village other community study and recreational people of all ages as well as pre­ vocational associations.

music.

drama.
music.

drama.

groups for centre; hall or Mr. FARNUM: I have heard Mr. life, and I with village associated Laing and I would like to congratulate him on what he has done for Social Welfare in the Colony up to now.

I think, I am one of the oldest Members in this Council can say this: Since Social Welfare has been undertaken by Mr. Laing and his different out­ officers there is an entirely look for the youths and adults of the country feature.
"We cannot keep our children country districts town to swell the ranks of the unem­ ployed and make conditions Today Social Welfare has provided Not very long ago the cry was in the districts.

That is a very desirable from going into George­ difficult."

B.Activities auxiliary departments to the work ir., e.g., the of cottage mdustries.

horti• improvement of small stock management and do'llestic diet.
cooking, � sanitation and encouragement of and other beneficial social and co­ the development of specialist promotion culture.

breeding.

including house planning; co-operative movements; ordination isations adults.

of character-forming organ-• () and young for adolescents In Great Britain these activities are organisa­ to unofficial largely entrusted tions, such as Boys' and Girls' Clubs, Scouts, Guides and other uniformed bodies, Women's Institutes.

Farmers' sports clubs.


Clubs, the Mothers' Union and Young 1,225 Social Welfare tEGISLATIVE .�,226 COUNCIL.

c;>rganisation.

C.Activities undertaken for classes require of the comrnun1ty who specially mothers and infants ; care : expectant whose mothers are at work; children 'handi­ the sick, including from and those suffering capped children ; mental defectives and diseases chronic the insane ; the aged and the destitute.

particularly � Much of this work in Great Britain obligation bv local authorities.
or is is now a statutory and in undertaken by the work some cases is supplemented of specialist voluntary This is particularly the blind, the deaf, the crippled, tubercular mentally organizations.
for cases and the care of the true of services sick.· connected of juvenile delinquency, with the such as the approved schools and -the D.Activities work of the law courts, treatment includin_g organization care and protection dren and the prevention cnildren, ex-prisoners, danger of falling system, the chil­ ot n2glected of cruelty to and and those in into prostitution.

work for prisoners.

prostitutes of a probation welfare The official or.e:anizations .
which in Great Britain promote these obJect:; are probation services for adults and juveniles.

approved hostels residential on the voluntary prisoners' types of special young people."
and remand homes; service homes for children side are the and various a.id societies schools, and Borstals, and has achieved depart­ and I say again I feel what has I think foat fully describes been done and what Mr. Laing's ment is trying to achieve 'in a great measure, are very much and know that the villages better off today.

Not ver,v long ago the problem arose as to what to do with our after they leave �chool.
I know children with the some of them are alway� clash111g but since Social Wel­ Police Authorities, fare :has been started valuable occupation decreased continue, tinuance.

considerably.
considerably.

and I am votrng for its con­ they have found and that has This work should � .. Development Mr. DEBIDIN: This is another, what and I may term, "Colonial Welfare Baby," but I have come here today with an open mind and I am satis­ fied that if we have got a foundling must nurse it and make it grow in propor­ tion and become a vigorous adult in the community.
If I had to choose two points with which to oppose and useful we to the Colony, but that stage of economic stability to The requ:ir,ed that at some that after we work certainly help can be of to Imperial qualified establish of the failure, r·earnns men sufficiently a proper and carry out Social Welfare the motion I · would refer to two which seem.

to embrace everything throw this motwn out, and those.-a,·e : /1as not First of all I feel that this Colp11y: !·eached where it can sufficiently department work.
One Member referred -help.

We may consider time or other.

I do believe have done some effective some amount nf ImpPrial very great adv�mtage that is another matter entirely.

second reason is this - I have said it once before and I will repeat it - the present has failed Social Welfare Department and failed very badly indeed.
I will' not but I go into all the details venture to say that one of the more is - they ·have not important who appointed of the had a knowledge have certainly people and their needs to compr_ise the Depart­ staff of the Social ·Welfare ment.

In' this I make a complete reservation cerned.

of this Colony.

I do not think there is an:v Offic2r of Government peopie of this Colony better than he does.
iJut I am afraid that he has had too much to do and with his manifold Department hands of an incompetent admin­ full marks to Mr. Laing for village job of istration.
it, but I do feel that this Social Welfare Department, and I am no useful purpose in the future, going to make this request which I do hope will be given some - vrhat we need weighty consideration most at this time in this Colony 1s a Social WcEurc Adviser, cal knowledge, have in the kno1Nleclge of the people he will make up with his ability along the lines of recognised fare work.

We have not had the benefit oi that.


We have had casual visits from Mr. Simey and others who have come to this Colony and shown they can give a great deal of advice.

He has done a wonderful was left languishing in so far as Mr. Laing is con­ in the I will give so that what he may not This gentlem3n constituted knows the people as.it is, can serve who knows the to advise duties this Social Wel­ staff.

a man who has.
a man who has.

techni­ or suggestion I want to think that is why Jamaica so well in social welfare difficulties has prospered work.

There are certain in i,227 Sociai Welfare 3 JUNE, 1948.

Organisatiuri.

1,228 com­ social conditions.

this Colony which must be ·regarded as in the way of proper social wel­ obstacles fare work, and they must be overcome.
I have mentioned but instability, economic there is also this factor to be considered� that we are a highly eosmopolitan munity, and a cross-section of the people in will snow a great deal of variation Those are cu�ture and things which have to be studied, and has to be wide enough to meet provision the needs and demands of each component part of the Colony.

I am afraid that as far as no v1sible this aspect.

first years of social welfare work in this Colony concentration and I have been nauseated .
of Committees of the various cils, of whose functions goes no has been made to deal with · As it is, we have seen in the on Youth Councils, by the number Youth Coun­ my knowledge attempt we heard no more.

genuine, a considerable sum Development Fund this Department commensurate is with There may have been that aHer spending of money from the Colonial and Welfa're unable to show results that expenditure.

efforts at bask::!t making, but to isolated what extent has that been pushed in the rural areas'?
before social welfare work was sta·rted in thi5 Colony I saw girls in the country districts leave� and "bizzy-bizzy making hats from coconut palm ."

I venture to say that long " Mr. LEE: I would like to inform my friend that wherever the're he Welfare Officer stationed ·will find that there has been great im­ provement work.

domestic in basket making and other was· a Social in a district I have had occasion to make serious failed I think and started that when social welfare work know what I am driving at.
in this Colony Government and complaint started the Social Welfare Department to recruit the help of the recognised the simply i)ecause social o'rganisations rules of those organisations did not con­ form to their requirements.

Members will Just a few bodies got ·together this social welfare work.

At that time I was connected was doing real work.

I refer to the Y.M.C.A.

As I said at a previous meet­ ing of this Council, Department thusiasm, ability, been put on .i better basis in this Colony.
Instead, the Department social welfare work in this Colony from the· volurita'ry organisations,.

time they became stifled.

the 4-H movement should have had the right amount of en­ with one institution determination if this Social Welfare and organising and after a which selfishly wrested Mr. DEBIDIN: I would like to ask the hon.

Member how many are in his distrist, and what are they doing?
Mr. LEE: There is one at Bartica, and as my fnend has been to Bartica I would like him to ten us where the Social Officer- The PRESIDENT: I am afraid I can- this not allo\1/ two Members.

proceea.

cross-argument The hon.

Member will between Mr. DEBID!N: I am glad that a period has been put tc tna.t argument because my friend has missed the point I was making.

I am nol saymg tnat it is not social welfare work as 1 n,gard it, but it must not be confined to just a few.
I would like to read a passagE: from the: pamphlet on "Social Welfare in the Colonies" points I have been n,aking.

par.

9, it states: some of the On page 3, which clinches "9.

The function wel­ of the "social � as three­ fare" worker may be described fold:- What have we seen for the expendi­ two students ture of a huge sum of money on this Large sums have been spent Department?

in sending to Jamaica.


I heard Mr. Laing say that co-operativ e societies were within view, but I would say that the co-operative really started with the launch service in the Mahaicony 'recently so great an river, which did not require imi;:ietus for its formation.

We are yet to see the development movement.

When we take stock we find inaugurated movement of the co-operative (1)To assume direct !

'esponsibility for certain not covered departments in their development.
types of service by the existing and to encourage which are I<) and help professional (2)To assist the administration departments in those and the specialist · aspects of their work which have a particulal' of the on the welfare so that the latter mav be at­ people, to take full ad- and persuaded tracted bearing 1,229 Social Welfm·e LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL.

1,230 Organisation.
1,230 Organisation.

vantage of the facilit�es that the former may have availabh� advice to assist services particular to the particular ar2a or social unit.
them in adapting offered, and needs of a their (3)To encourage programme and voluntary and to integrate the work bodies in to oi with the general of Churches these and similar fields; in particular develop the social welfare activiti2s Native Administrations organisations and societies, the development of :voluntary tions which provide scope for the activities, as full m2mbers.

persons.

both men and women.

and to promote their training to encourag� and of native organisa­ of indigenous in leadership."

?
?

How is this expenditure the of what good the Social can produce?

When with good living con­ and proper wages then we can housing conditions are in the rural areas.

How are the people to appreciate benefits of social welfare work under such conditions which ·we are now considering to bear fruit and benefit every class of people in the Colony unless they are in a position to be receptive Welfare Department they are provided ditions talk about establishing centres, their social uplift.
moment is that I am certainly see social work developed Colony.

From what I have read it is a colonial policy, and we must consider the most effective way in which the work can be carried on.

My stand at this anxious to in this community societies and clubs for debating welfare -� has price Associat10n of that work with that of work in this Colony will be under­ and in one or two of the villages­ is one of them - but very little but I cannot say that t.hat yet.
I hope that with As far as I have seen, most of the social weifare work is bemg done in the cities Bartica in the rur"1 areas of the Colony.
I know that the Sugar Producers set aside a portion of thE: increased for sugar for social welfare work on the sugar 'c'5tates, work has started the integration the Social Welfare Organisation welfare taken on a much wider and general The paragraph emphasises tne point I have been making -that we must haveo proper economic conditions fois opportunity gations within the last few weeks of conditions prevailing show that the .vages bemg paid to the workers are far from being living wages, much less saving wages.
When I pointed out to several persons the amount of forking work a man has to do on an estate for 8 cents it was remarked that it was really worth 8 shillings.

to say that my investi­ on the sugar estates in this Colony, and I will take social scale.

I have quoted certainly and the should be scrapped.

It is therefor proper functioning e very important and that we should consider the of to which we want to give life.

We need a Social Welfare very relevant usefulness a Department continuous Adviser.
In my opinion the entire staff of the Department I am sure that if a Social Welfare Adviser were brought to the Colony he would be able to recruit out the Colony.

He would be able to advise and train the ·people, probably using some of the present I have come to the conclusion that the Social Welfare Department has never placed any value upon voluntary work­ at least not enough value.

On this point I would like to read another paragraph from the pamphlet, help through­ voluntary which says : staff. "
The PRESIDENT : I must ask the hon.

Member to confine his remarks to the debate.

We are discussing welfare.

social 6 Mr. DEBIDIN : I respectfully submit that the point is not irrelevant since it shows that the wages of the people, an index of our economic system-are far from being something upon which true and proper social welfare work can be based.

It is very relevant here about good health, good housing and good water.

We ah know what the when I read "3.


In Great Britain during the of social services years there :has been a that the com­ depend upon the of all its constituent last forty growing recognition munity is · an or.e:anic wholP whose health and vitality well-being members and on the good relations between them.
This has involved a great development ; but it must not be overlooked that if the pioneer activities societies are now being progressively taken over by the public administration of the community, something sistent beneficiary needed, is due in very large part to pressure and societies incorporated from the very individuals whose efforts are now being more ample and more con­ with the self-respect of the than private charity is in a system at once more of the unofficial the recognition that 1,231 Social Welfare 1,232 3 JUNE, 19'48.
Organisation.

feel that it would be better and more to the Colony to spCcnd money beneficial the youth of the country to in training be useful citizens later years in doles or crime prevention.

That is the view I take.

than to pay it out in of healthy develooment.

and more broadly highly organized based.


Indeed, · it may safely be said that it is not the elimination of volun­ tary effort but its integration with the which affords the official organization best prospects At any rate in Britain the last twenty years by a steady growth of intimate ation between the amateur and the p1·ofessional welfare activities teer groups, the _great organized societies the progress has.
been marked in a wide range of social arlti between volun­ and the n1ihlic co-oper­ departments."

of ' the he said.

I has some particular officer in those officers with One hon.

Member has described Social Welfare Office1·s as being failures.

They have failed hopelessly, do not agree with that.

The hon.

Member prcbably mind, but I know that whom I have come into contact Corentyne being very conscientious, The only com­ and very enL1usiastic.
plaint I have to make is that the work of the Department eno:;gh, of funds.

has not been carried far but I daresay that is due to lack on the me as Coast have impressed hard working.

If we are to have this Social Welfare very not only in its staffing and the Labour Department, it must change considerably Organisation and drastically, but in its outlook as well.
Our social welfare work in the past has not been what was or should have been expected of it, and I venture to say that unless we about it it will con­ drastic do something on the tinue to be a huge expenditure Colony and a misfit in our midst.

We handling have other Departments effectively some measure of social welfare work, such as the Education Department and if this.
Social Welfare Department to look after the rural areas particularly more it has to be more vigorous, than it has and more helpful enthusiastic been in foe past.

If this Department is to be continued tion I would strongl_v Committee Advisory Council and representatives areas should be set up so as to guarantee that its future activities out not onl:v on lines acceptable but in consonance Council of the people of the Colony.
urge that an of Members of this of the rural to this with the needs would be carried as a permanent organiza­ to li,_re is I those in the upper for and to improve their I would like to make an appeal on behalf of the people in the district particularly represent, reaches of the Berbice River who have little minds.

They have not even foe educa­ tional facilities on the coastlands.
people who should be taken in hand and given some light-scmething of the They should have all the attention Social Welfare Organisation.

enjoved by other people to live for.

They are a neglected I would also like to congratulate the Member.

Mr. Farnum, hon.

Nominated on what he said.

As a village leader he to know what is what, and is in a position I think he has done a great sei·vice in as he has spoken.

His remarks speaking ha,_re the motion.


guided me very largely in supporting Mr. FERREIRA: I came here this open mind on I dp not pretend with a perfectly The point at issue is whether afternoon this·motion.

social welfare essen­ or not we consider tial for this Colony, and I do not think anyone present would deny that it is essential.
absolutely to know very much about it but as a to the Prison I visitor need for after-care work, me great pleasure ment has appointed The sum involved in this proposal but really $36,000 is not merely $18,000 per annum, but I do not think it is an we cannot afford to pay.

I amount which have s,een the and it has given to know that Govern­ someone to that post.

I join issue with the last speaker � when he says that the Y.M.C.A.

organisation.
organisation.

only voluntary is the Mr. DEBIDIN : To a point of correc­ b tion.

I never.

said that t'1.e Y.M.C.A.

was the only voluntary organisation.

The PRESIDENT : The hon.

Member certainly gave that impression.

Mr. DEBIDIN : The only voluntary organisation doing that work.

1,242 Central in time, of a Co­ along these ser­ marketing to sacrifice with the Social or connection not altogether credit?
Absolutely are being by this Bank is also envisaged, The establishment, what social services WelfareLEGISLATIVE I am afraid some hon.

Members do people not only their COUNCIL.

Organisation.

by any means but by private and by public-spirited nothing.

scope for the establish­ and consumers' 1;241 Socia.l agrf,cultural The're is definite ment of credit, soclieties, good Social Welfare Officers know anything about Farmers' requisites, ploughs and threshers no relation Welfare Movement.
but though they may be very they do not those matters.

such as tractors, for joint use, have not realize done in this Colony, Department enterprise who are willing time but their money, and they are giv­ ing the Social Welfare Department all the support they can.

The Department is doing its part in helping vices and helping them in a valuable way.

I do wish that hon.

Members would make a study of the activities.

all these associations doing before actually have heard in some quarters.

today.
today.

With all my work I do find time these organisations, what they Depart­ find out what the Social Welfare ment is doing, and I suggzst to Members they do likewise One hon.

Member felt justified respect or $36,000 or, if necessary, knowledge for the Co-operative Movement.

in the Colony, he went on to say was that the opinion of Mr. Laing on the great value of the Social Wel­ fare wOl'k was worthless.

what in effect he said.

He had re:,pect.


for the man but not for his opinion to the value of the social welfare work operative and the members of it will be the primary themselves.

societies one of the things mentioned Excellency with the Co-operativ staff from order to take over redundant you will the Social Welfare Organisation be making the Colony pay $18,000 odd for the services of those who will not be proficient and have to be trained from the outset.
I do not say I will not vote $18,000, $100,000 I say $100,000 the Movement, best officers and not take over en bloc the Social Wel­ fare Officers.

will not be too much for but you must select the for it that can be obtained visit them and see are doing.

I do find time to and what they: deriding not Again I repeat, by Your has the remotest connection to say that he had the greatest for Mr. Laing as having greater of village affairs but what in effect to go and see That is exactly e Movement.
In than anyone of are them as I as The PRESIDENT : I desire there that is being conducted in this Colony.

As I said in my Movement is go­ whatever.

it is true, is a de­ It is valuable we want a seriarate department There is should be no misapprehension.

no such intention The Social Welfare Organisation, partment apart from the Co-operative Movement, but it can still render a lot of help in that direction.
Message, under its own head, but it docs not mean to say the Co-operative ing to take over Social Welfare Officer The Probation work, but in addition volunteer him whose most valuable known and, I J:ear, many.

There are dozens and dozens of organisations, put under the Central Youth Council and I know from my own experience knowledge doing.

That Council and represents isations of this vote is for that purpose ing that Council.

work.
work.

It is still being done in a small way and by no means covers the w:10Je problem.

It is prob­ ably too early, as one hon.

Member said, to judge the full value of it.

It is new born, and it has only just got going with a very small staff and only for three years.

British sections there a1:e certain not yet touched at all munity certainly for by the Social Welfare Department, and example o_ur Amerindian col!lmunity, of th2re are others.
There ' are sections to people in which it is far more difficult start Social Services and to get them going than in others.

It depends on their own enlightenment, with some communities others, and good wo1'k is being done, and ·.dorie with the full co-operation and philanthrophic kinds.

and what great good they are is a real live body not less than forty organ­ work.
is doing very gocd there are dozens of working with are not doing social welfare work, $1,200 of support­ of the Churches of various may be s1ow and not with services by youth organisations, Guiana is a big place and not appreciated associations and pr·ogress probation officers of the com­ but, as a whole, it is progressing 0 )I for the Co-operative Movement, I 1,243 Social Wetfare 3 jUNE, i948.

Organisation.
Organisation.

1,:M4 and be so and what it has be;en Movement, is going to ly of that work and I agree, is really Organisation lines alto· Movement, .

: which Your Excellency says movement, I am not saying one word or All I am say­ been doing and maintain doing so well, and let the Co-operative Movement, must be a separate not combined with the Social Welfare Organisation.

the Social Welfare against the Officers of Government.
ing is that it works on different gether from the Co-operative and the one has no relationship with the I say there should be other.

Furthermore, no objection operative inclined not matter how much is voted, I think, the Co-operative it to this Colony.

Rather than voting $18,000 Members will be much more satisfied something Council showing be taken over, what are their qualifica­ Movement, tions for the Co-operative what are the salaries this $i8,316 Movement.
I would be equally to vote $100,000 what is and find out for themselves and we want it to be a but apart from co­ They will find that really work is being done.

The I do not want this work belittled, I have heard it derided in this Council, as I have today, which is very dishearten­ ing.

If you want people to come along and help in this kind of work and then you speak disparaging say it is no good, then what happen and where are we going?

I ask hon.

Members who oppose to reflect a little being done.


very valuable Co-operative too big to be a part of the Social Welfare Department, separate operation kinds of social welfare work.

If hon.

Members want to know what the policy of Government fare, you only have to r·ead the Colonial which one or two hon.

Office pamphlet Members have read from.

That sets out the policy of Government in re­ precisely spect of Social Welfare in this Colony.
That sets out what we are trying to do, .and we have had some success in that direction policy, ourselves it or not.

I am sorry to have interrupted the hon.

Member for Demerara River.

there are dozens of different when we are asked to support g the Mr. KENDALL: In supportin of the Social .

That is Gover'nment's and that is what we have to ask is going to be spent.
Movement is well worth who are the officers to is in regard to Social Wel­ organisation, to voting $18,000 is put up to this to be paid, and how for it.

It does concrete continue already for the Co­ if ::, Capt.

COGHLAN: Youi' Excellency, that I have said one word if you consider of the Social Welfare Move­ derogatory ment, 1 would ask to have the notes of because I have not my speech repeated, said one word that can be so construed.

nature the pro-· will stimulate into this Colony.


I would like to make a of hats and will assist as suggested by by way of by Govern­ I would like to see in direction making of hats.

I would in reducing that exists especially motion for the continuance Welfare Services few observations.
the Social Welfare Services one particular Mr. Laing-the like to see it stimulated protective tariff introdlo!ced ment so that hats of a similar should not be imported That, I believe, duction unemployment the rural areas.

I urge that self-sufficiency is something Services If we are to find employment youth, as suggested for Georgetown new avenues that the Social Welfare Services another to the Prisons.

that the inmates should produce certain articles their maintenance when leaving that better citizens.
the Social Welfare gate and see to it that those things are in becoming I think those are aspects should investi­ that the Social Welfare should take into consideration.

which wheri sold would assist and also assist them should try to seek.

There is aspect of this question Sir, I am of the opinion, by the hon.

Member institution in relation there must be Services Central, for our in in <: The PRESIDENT: The hon.

Member is quite right.

I never accused him of having said one single word against the work.
I was not 1'eferring Member, and I am indeed sorry if he gained that impression.

to the hon.

Capt.

COGHLAN: What I am say­ ing is this: It does not follow because a man is a good swimmer he must also be a good runner.

A man may be an excellent according there is absolutely tween the Social Welfare Movement and the Co-operative Movement.
Therefore what I would suggest Welfare Movement continue no relationship is to let the Social as it has be­ Social Welfare worker but, to Your Excellency's Message, l 1,245 Social Welfare LEGISLATIVE done for the good of British Guiana.

That is all I have to say in supp@:t, of.J;he motion.

Mr. McDOOM : Supporting of this organisation the con­ l would tinuance In the like to make one observation.

has past, we -know, the organisation been working among a certain type or class of people.
In my opinion it is yet to be too early to ex.9ect the organisation but I able to work at its.

fullest extent, will ask Mr. Laing, especially as he is going to leave this Colony shortly and I do not know how early he will be back, to make some arrangement organisation sections will extend among all of the people of this Colony.
whereby the :", Mr. CARTER: Sir, I feel I should River and I of this motion on a shop somewhere at all or had never been w'hile the otP:,er two had no in the Court for three young and stolen One of a number of articles.

record my approval behalf of Social Welfare.

I do not think any person who has.

the welfare of this country at heart can very well oppose of one this motion.
I have experience branch of work undertaken by the Officers of the Social Welfare Department, am.l that is in regard to Juvenile Delin­ quency.

Only this.

morning the hon.

Member for Essequibo appeared men who had entered on the East Bank, Demerara, therefrom those young men had been to Onder­ neeming, such experience in a Court oefor2.

The Probation .

took charge of those young men.

I have seen some of those Officers at work.


I have seen them appear for young men in the Courts, work done when the Probation take charge of those young persons, who happen to fall on the wrong side of the Law, I am not one of those who expect to see immediate results from the working of the Officers of the Social Welfare Department.

Department growth.

and we must wait to see what are going to follow.


It should be results many years before we see the and result of this Department, $30,000 regard as an investmen of this country.

we are going to spend we must full effect so this and I have seen the good must necesarily t for the future I expect that this have gradual Officers Officers > COUNCIL.

01·ganisation.

1,246 ◄ So I feel that is out of propor­ and economic I was surprised of the structure.
advancement must go hand in hand with there can Social Welfare work.

I have the advancement to hear one-hon.

Member say this country has not yet reached economic stability in order to undertake always regarded of· a country to be similar to that of an expanding tripod.

That is, there has to along the political to be advancement avenue, along the economic avenue and along the social avenue.
If one or the other of those advances tion, then, I think, there would be a collapse political advancement Therefore social advancement.

of this country not being be no question sufficiently to under­ economically take any Socal Welfare work.

I do want to· say, however, when Your Excellency Movement will not necessarily the umbrella of the Social Welfare Department, Depa1·tment the Co-operative inspire think it ought to.

I feel, as the hon.
I feel, as the hon.

Member for Demerara River has ·said, that the people who undertake co-opera­ tive work sh'ould be specialists own field and should be allowed a certain amount of elbow room and freedom to carry out their own plans and to carry them out in a mannet: they know best.

but that the Social Welfare and will no doubt stimulate as I Movement, I was.
very pleased said that the Co-operative stabled go under in their extent, and the focus control on the social I do want to say, however, I feel there should be some form of liaison between the Co-operative Officers.

and the Social Welfare Officers at all times, so that there can be one, constructive in regard to advancement side.
I want to say also that the Depart­ ment should continue self­ to stimulate help to the greatest should be at all times on the economic advancement individual as a and on the community whole.

I feel that the Department go farther taking, a larger measure resources of improvement.
I feel, for instance, time will come when the Social Welfare Department things-like leather other handicraft, result in the economic afield than the average under­ it does not have the will train enough persons in work, shoe-makmg which will immediately of the Colony, on the -to undertake advancement but possibly ... ..,,.. should .. and the of ·◄ At-t:::··C:: 1,247 SociaL WeLfare . '

3 JUNE, 1948.

What we are thinking of i!

this work that can do in our country.


that here is an important Social Welfare Department stimulating in this country.

secondary certain industrie.-.

Mr. PHANG : I rise to saY.

that I but I just like to Welfare has been in support this motion for the continuance of Social Welfare, remark that Social vogue in the Colony for three years.

l want to remind Mr. ,Laing that there is such a place as the North-West I would be glad if some attention to that quarter.

District.
District.

is given Mr. PETERS : I desire to state that As a matter am prepared of tbe Social Welfare so far as I view it, is a unit so far as I am concerned I to support the whole idea of furthering ion in our the Social Welfare proposit Colony.

For my part I do not see any conflict between the idea of the inherent ion and that of the Social Welfare proposit Co-operative proposition.

of fact, the idea .

of the co-operative proposition, of the larger whole Scheme.
Somehow or other that side of unit soul of our folk has been more developed than t.he .social welfare largely idea as a whole, and that is the reason why I am afraid it seems to captivate our in such a large and highly interest manner.

We ·rJave had a long extended history our land, whether we pay much attention to it or not.
We know something established Societies the Friendly out the country about the specifically Benefits Societies, in the Courts know more than anybody else of that dubious scheme, the scheme there of the Box Money.

The intention of the idea of the is the implementing spirit among our people.

lt co-operative has a rather long history.


are endeavourini;: larger whole tiality, that of the social idea as a whole, there are .some of us rather somewhat as to whether those two ideas timorous might · be made to work harmoniously.

For my o,vn part I see no inherent flict between them.
to bring lo light the and to exploit its poten­ Sick and Funeral and we who practice about through­ ; we know something Now that we con­ ,,, ·.... ...at When it comes to Social Welfare, i t seems to me that is"'orie way we are called Organisation.

1,248 idea of the -soul of of industry compara­ J themselves of our land-folk group interest matters as a whole.
That has been working to upon to see whether we can stimulate thc oc_ia1&unctions of our people whereby we gett hem to develop the unit soul, and then taking the Colony parochially, we may develop the larger soul, the soul.

We have had in our various colonial both urban and of the Colon�,, districts idea as to rural, a sort of single-handed one's interest the history and thinking develop the colonial tively little of d::!veloping as a single unit soul.
U you take ::i uillage and you are there able to foster the r-: in matters of co-operate , 11rntters of recreation, educational a sort of auasi post-graduate course after the primary course of the boy or girl has come to an encl, by this means we may hope to develop the urban group soul and in doing that move towards the larger issue of developing the Colony as such.
I for one represent in a small measure a part of the Amer­ indian community of this Colony, and I have been seeking one of the problems on to solve in the district of Essequibo where the western mainland t:1c folk live around the Mission Com­ pound is this : How to develop a sort of group soul among those folk whereby they will l'ise to a larger status of their in the light of for-· own individual interest getting do for themselves transpo1·ting what to do to develop fields, and thinki11g the group soul, not necessarily soul, but along social and indus­ spiritual trial lines in a sort of co-operative the occasion weeks <1go.
of that district tilat group soul any means of developing for the develop­ which is so important I am hoping that ment of any country.

this Social Welfare Scheme will take root and bring forth fruit.

Speaking hon.

Member for North Western District, I hope the western mainland of Esse­ quibo may not be forgotten.

for a while themselves, what they wood.

wood or going to the gold the young people without of Car'ia-Caria were absolutely I found that by squaring like the way.
On the of my last visit there a few Mr. THOMPSON : On the last I spoke at length on this matter occasion of Social Welfare.

Members have expressed have, because they have not _closely _I am afraid that many the opinion they of the Co-operative Movement in COUNCIL Organisg�ym.

1,250 so rapidly that there is no room for I do not know what has new prisoner·s.

been happening Member's facts as far as 1947 is concerned.

now from the Report of the Super­ intendent to the I quote for 1947.
He states: is contrary statement but the hon.

this year·, of Prisons "There were 2,618 admissions during the year, a decrease number of 164 compared with the previous year."

in actual Under the heading "Recidivism" of Prisons says : Superintendent the "There has been a commendable in the percentage decrease this year which was 44.9 as against in the previous year and 68.9 in 1945".
of recidivism 59.8 He goes on to say : "It is further hoped that with a Officer, After-care full-time post provision Draft Estimates.

achieved committals much more will be in reducing this aspect of for which in the 1948 to prisons."

is included I will quote another passage from in which the Superintendent the report writes: 1,249 Social Welfare LEGISLATIVE !°' would have been different.

themselves to be achieved with the work that The work is still in its the officers I think -Members to agree.
The Department has work, and rather than actively with on in the Had they done so I am sure of this Social Welfare.

things I demand for and we always disagree associated themselves has been going on.

I think.

i\_theW is one individual who Mr. Bayley does not want to see in that office it is T. T. Thompson.

He thinks I am pestering him too much in respect There are certain tne districts, finally done excellent criticise should identify the work that is being carried districts.
their opinions We cannot expect results overnight.

and the w.hole field cannot be infancy, at the same time.

There is a <'overed limited number of men in the field, and it will take some time for them to get around the districts.

It is for Members to enter the field and give what assist­ ance they possibly criticising has not been done.

If we do not accept the motion and give the Organisation support necessary very short while we would have a different in 1934, and I have done my bit.
If we we must want the country to progress not throw cold water on everything that is started.

failures, which th1: Department pointed that we would have better results.

We have to benefit by our in and if there is any direction and it is can instead of what has been done and what the I am sure that in -a tale to tell.
I started has failed, 4H work out to the Officer, I am positive "Juveniles were not received into prison on conviction and in this respect of the Social Welfare Department together Probation with.the Officer deserves Government healthy I feel the good work during the year, praise."

In another paragraph on Remand" the Superintendent states on "Persons of Prisons "There were 1,289 persons admitted into prison on remand during this year, as against year."
1,486 in the previous • That, I submit, is outside testimony of the value of Social Welfare war!-:, or one aspect of it.

Mr. FERNANDES: I thank you, Sir, I I have not figures.

yet.

The figures and that was or Octooer last year.

I to hear of thP.

improvement for those enlightening seen the 1947 figures had were the 1946 figures, about September am pleased read by you, Sir.
There is no doubt about it that I did say that very good work is being done by the 9Pcial Welfare Depart­ ment as regards probation.

I made that perfectly clear.

I · said'?

that the work As regards basket making, I know have been made to certain that shipments parts of the West Indies where the people have clamoured for them.

A few baskets have also been sent to Panama, and if the Department avenues for the export of these articles I am sure that the industry developed.
I am supporting and I wish the Organisation every success.

would explore the motion would be ..

The PRESIDENT : I would like to refer to the remark made by the hon.

Member for Georgetown Central (Mr. Fernandes) prisoners.

impression and of prisons I think he rather gave the are filling up that our prisons on the subject ... 1,251 · So<j� Welfare .

3 JUNE, 1948.

Organisat ion.


1,252 which were supplied was help­ but the being done in that fOnnection ing to curb juvenile delinquency, figures August Qr September respect hear _that th_ose high figures are not continuing.

is that the..,cases before the Juvenile Court in recent months are on the increase, but of course the good work by the Probation our youth criminals.
Mr. FERNANDES: My information of 1946, and I am very pleased to from becoming permanent is helping to prevent last year were in to me about Officers rate.

There have been that crime was increasing The PRESIDENT: I only wished to make it clear becaus2 I did riot want or tht public to get the either the Council impression at such an_.abnormal longer sentences which means that the daily prisons population perhaps that there was more serious crime.

But the extracts lsubmit, Welfare Department.


show good work by the Social during 1947 than has been higher, I nave quoted do, in 1946, and indicates The PRESIDENT: 1 only wished to give the Council the latest reliable information put the motion.

that can be given.

I will now Motion carried unanimously.

,, At this stage the Council was day at until the following adjourned 2 p.m . '

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