Source document: https://docs-lawep.s3.us-east-2.amazonaws.com/1698069751320.pdf (Guyana)
THE DE.BATE·S fl.

OFFICIAL REPORT LEGISLATIVE COUN��L1'J;� BRlTISH GUIANA.

PROCEEDINGS AT ITS FIRST SESSION, !

!)�S-19·:.9.

OF LEGISLATIVE WEDNESDAY, ,"!8TTJ COUNCIL lflc?8.

NOJ'RJ!fl/ER, 'l'he Legisbtive Council of British Guia.na, c1·P:1.tPd h_v the B1·iti�h Guimm (Constitu­ Court, the fundion,q 1928, in substitution for the existing and pi-ivileges by the Governor.
in Executive Combined tion) Ordet·-in-Council, Policy and mined on and hy procl:mrnt.ion in thr "Oazettr" Public Buildings, ina.ugur:Ltcd with ceremonies on t.he 18th July, 1928, assPmblPd November, on vVcdnrsd:Ly, 'JSth the occasion, ucfitting Legislature of the Court of deter­ of which bodirs ceased :111d chtcd and published Council in the Council Chamber, Guiana 1928.
The Com1eil, whkh was :- follo\l's w,Lq L:onsLitutr,1 as PRESENT; The President, His Excellency GtHlGISBERG, Tlrn Govrrnor, BrigadiP1'- ]'".C.M.G., Sccrl't.ary, .D.S.O.

Th(' Colonial The Attomey.GenPrnl, C.M.G.

l\fr.

C. DouaLAS-JoNES, J;;:.c., B.A., LL.M.

Mr.

lTEt.

:'l'OR ,loSEPHS, General Sir GORDON Thr Honourable " ,, (C:intab.

), LL.B.

(Lond.).

A. P. G. Aus•rJN, Unoflici1.tl Member) I) T. '1'.

Sm,1,1,rn ,, " Major ,, F-'.

DIAS T.Mru.rnn, Colonial Treasurer.

W. RAIN GRAY, M.A., Ph.D.

(Edin.


), " (Norninatrd ,, ,, ,, ,, B. Litt.

(Oxon.

), Director uf 1.

The Honourable Unof\icial Senior Member for North Education.

R. E. BRJ.SSINGTON , (Elected ).

R.V.

EVAN WoNG, B.Sc.

(Elected vV est Essequcbo Member for UnofficiaJ Senior South East Essequebo).

\V.

E. II.

BRADBURN, Colonel Major ,, J.C. CRAW, D.S.O., The Ho;nourable Inspector Director General of Police.

of Public ·w01•ks.

B. U. W:oon, M.A., Dip.

For.

(Cantab.

), Conservator of Forests.


,, ,, S. H. BAYLEY, l\fa1m;;ing Director, Colonial Transport Department J. MULLIN, A.I.M.M,, F.S.I., Commissioner of Lands and Mi!ileS (Tempomry).

",,Jfrm7if'r., 8 1crn·n.

:!8 Xo\'1rn1n:r: 4 1928 P1·1·sidn1t's 8w·,·1·h.

.

for The Honoul'al,l c.• W. G. B0As1-:, M.U.C.S.

( rnng.

}, J,.RC.P.

(Lond.

), " Genera 1, ( 'l'en,po·1·a ,·y ).

N.CANNON, (Elected H.C. Hu.,cPRRYS, Unofficial Seniot' Member for Georgetown).
(Elected Unofficial Member for East Demerara) Acting Surgt'On­ •· A.V.

CRANE, LL.B.

(l,oud.

), (Elected Unofficial l\fomhcr West DemPt·ara).

,, " ,, ,, " R A. Luc1moo, (Eledcd Unofficial Senior Member for Rerbice).

(Rlcct.Pd Unofficial ,Junior Member for Georgetown) (Elected Prnc:Y C. '\,VwR•r, J.Er,t:AZA.R, .

T, GoNSALYES, E. F. FRF.DP.RICKS, EsRequebo South-East (Elected ).
Unofficial ,Junior Member for New Amsterchm} Unofficial J,.L.B., (Elected Member for Georgetown) Unofficial ,Junior Member for .

,, " " A. E. SEERBr, (Elected s.McD.

DE FREI'l'AS, Esequebo North-West Unoftlcfal M.A., (Elected ).

Member for Demerara).

Unofficial Junior Mcmb0r for J.Sm'l'Fr, S. H. SEYMOUR, U1wfficial Member).

A.M.I.

Mech.

E., (Nominated (Nominated Uno.f-Uc,iaJ M.cmher).

Hi� T,ord�hip prnyers :- r.l,p f ollowing Bishop of Guiana (Rt.

Rev, Oswald H. Pa1-ry, M.A.)


read the THE PRESIDENT'S SPEECH.

0 Lord, our Heavenly Fathe;-, High :UHl of princes, to behl'.Jld upon eartl1: we beseech Thee with Thy cur Most.

Gr:wious Sov­ King of Kings., Lord of Lords, the who dost frpm Thy MightY.

only Rnle1· throne behold all the dwellers m'ost heartily fa,,onr ereign L,ord, King George; and so Tepleu­ ish him with the Grace o.f Thy Holy Spirit.
ihat he may always incline walk in Thy ways: endue him plenteouslv witli heavenly and wealth long to live: strengthe n him that hi'!

may vanquish all his enemies: attain C'VNlnsting .Jesus Christ Our Lord.

Amen.

and overcome ai'ter gifts; gr<i,nt him in bealr.h joy and felicity: through an,l finally, to Thy will and this life he may 0 Cod, the Father of Lights, an!]
FP\lll· send down Thy Holy Spirit ta in of Justice, upon thosB hera in the Councif for the fir&t time assembled: of the great responsibil.ity they may wisely and faithfully on all matters the welfare Thy Holy !>fame.

Through Jesus Christ, Our Lord.

Amen.

brought before them.

for of Thy peo-�le, aud tl1e glory -0,f that with a due sense la.ij upon the,m deliberate The Lora's Prayer was then said 1hy the en tire gathering.
The PRESIDENT acld1'essNl tlle Cotm-'j <'ii a,; follows :- 1Tn111nu·ahl<' :i\Lern hc1·,-; ol' tlw T,rgisl.i­ til'•J Council; ,,m r-);tremely fortunate on tl1is wlll to me personally of Rtat.P.

of b<'ing-rc•­ 011 the occasio11 King })erson occa :-: i "n i 1: being the bea l'Cl' to you, all([ tlll'<iugl1 you to the people of thi:-: c·nm1t1:y, o( :t message from our Kin�.

This is n,,L a message g-i.ven lJy His �,fojesty tl1hn1i.

:h the E,eeret.ntT hut.


it is u1.•,· \when l hall t!ll' 11011nn1· •·ri n;d by His )f aj<•:s1" or 111�, appointru<·111.

'!

'ht· ally desired vivid rememlnanct·:s Bl'iti,;h He was then a midshipni::rn "Canada .. " Hi.

:-: nf:ijP.sty tE'll :rou th:it since ther, Jill' often liad the people of Hriti�]i thoughts and Jie has sent \ them liis warmest wishes fo1· ,;ur<·es�.

aml prosperity. }

he ]1a: ,_,r his visit to )'ears ago.

on H.M.S.

me to :i ,;l,c><l Guiana.

forty-four me t,, ,•II .rnu tJiat.


(;11i��11n \1nppiness in his His.

Honour the �hief Justice (Sir ANTHOf\lY DE FREITAS· 0.8.E., M.A.

), a1imi11i;;terecl Jeg-i:rnee :1clmi11i><trl'ed o:f precede114_;e. p1·<';,:ent ill onlel· the Oath of Al­ to the ,I'resiclent, who in turn tl1c Oath to the members I have another message to \giw you to-day from Mr. Ame1',v,' of Stat.e fo1· the Colonies.
rt1,ks that this despatch to you:- the Hc>f"'••etar:v M r. •ry sl1ould l ·l ., 28 Xovprnmm l!l:!� 6 Downing Street, 8th August.

1928. permit of the eeta.blishment of the survey on a permanent basis.

Sir,-Wlth the issue of the Prnclamatloni.

6.The recent oommunlcation from the the regrel Jamaicans or the history In British Guiana Guiana has been brought to a and respect be felt for the pass.in,; or July the 18th one chapter or B1itish close.
I recognise that must Inevitably away of the two Courts round which the political for life of the Colony has revolved over a century.

It is with corresponding pleasure ed of the statesmanlike the encl of the last meeting of the Court ,:if Policy by the Member f:>r We!!

(t Demerara on behalf of the Elected Members.

.Pne for negotiation but if any advicP Governor of Jamaica on the p,sstb!Uty of settling opens up a new and hopeful prOfll)ect and •rhA has my warm welcome and supp,ort.
matter is primarily be­ tween the two Colonies, is requirer!

soheme of assis,ted �mt.

Scttlf'mrnl nt the disposal the experience connection :>tion of schemes of migration ment fr:im this country.

Oflko will hr gJarl 10 11lat•e or !hr>-tw1 C: ,vrrnmenh and oper­ and settle­ of a joint the Over­ which they have acquired 2.
The constitutional with the preparation and appreciation speech dellverr1l as to the details settlement, that I lmve learn­ In at changes ha"e left facts of the situa­ possesses the essential cer­ In common with the old.

The untouched tion.

The new Legislature tain features most urgent of the subjects which gage its attention pOSI· llon.

I need not dwell on the Imperative necessity and effective measures and or accompanying of the existing r�vision !l.
'fhe l:>an which will shortly of taking pr,:impt to balance next year's budget, them by a thorough system of taxation.

Is stlll the financial 'be Issued will en­ 6.Though It would be idle to suggest P!I grouud for dPpre,: The lla­ which the O:>lony has assumrd aro that the present is free from difficttltf the future offers little !

'lion and none at all for despair.


hilitles not beyond its actual and far below its po­ tential hope as well a!I of go,d will that I rleslre you to convey from me to the first mcf'tln� rr thl" Legislative Guiana.

Council -I have, etc., It is a messo..ge or good or Bl'lll!1h capacity.

(Sgd.)

L. S. AMIDRY.

Tho Govemor, Sir C. H. Rodwell, K.C.M.G.

works Apart committed which will re­ consideration.
1m which the Colony iH there are various which cannot be defray­ revenue but might be de­ on the London Market under the Colonial Stock Acts raloos questions quire early and careful from expenditure already and undertakings ed from ordinary frayed from loan funds.

Proviaed can be made for satisfacu:iry provision meeting the consequent addition to the I shall be pre­ hurclen of debt charges.
which you p:ired to consider may have to make f:ir loan expenditure on programme of road con­ the fmp01-tant !lln1rtion \nd in view of the strong desire expresse<l by the agricultural the inclusion <'iPnt for the Bank.

the initial N'1.n.bllshment reoniroil o] in the loan of a sum snfff.

of an Ae:ricultur by Mr. Leggate.

auy proposals recommended to 11rovirle community ca.pita!

I agree to that 4.
I agree to that 4.

The eslrublhihment, also, of a perma• Geological The experience has so conclusively of other demonstrated value of such a Department Depart• of a to the development latent min­ nent :ind well-equipped menl is necessary touutry of proved but largely eral resources.
Colonies the practical that it is a source of great satisfaction me to 'be able to inform you that the Col-:>­ ninl Research Rlrengthen the existing by a highly qualified 9•TY they will pay for a period of three that the Colony rears on the understanding to provide him with two will undertake assistants and In the hope that at the end of that time the �cial situation geological whose sal- to survey have offered Geiologist Committee will to Honourable members, :Ur.
Amery in I have learnt enough, for three weeks.

I cannot pretend to hnvl' a grasp of all 1he <letailR of we still have the imme 01'1 we have n n1>w Yery pointedly to solve.

I haw only been reminds us his despatch "that the constitutional changes lrnve left unton(·h{'() tlw essc11tinl facts or the sihtation."

lie re­ In other worch;, minds us that nltl1011gh Com,titution problems in t.his <'Otmtry therefore eomplete these problems.

however, to be certain of two tl1inJ.!1-.


Firstl)', that none of our provid- 1n·ohlf'ms are unsolvallle .

ro-opcra ed we liave good-will, tion, ltnrrl work and, most im­ of all, a sincere portant those problems, not :in� particular community for the goocl of the country as a whole.

Secondly, I have le�rnt an­ other very plain fact-a ve1·y hard fact-nud tllat is that our problems nre not going to be solved in th1·ee weeks, nor yet in three mouths, an<l 15ome of them certainly ;years.
for the good of or area, but not ill three desire to solve 7 P1•r.qiflr11f',9 Rprrclt.

2R X OVlDrBER 192R 8 Xow, I (lon't propo:-c 1o deal "'ith meets or twelve cl irertiom;, tl1C' Estimates A more filti11g I J>ropo:-p in te11 will Ol'<".u r latet· in the for 1929, to members of dill<' by this Govel'llment i11 I propos<' to fhem in (letaH to-clay.

opportunity RPsRion.


da)·:-· time, whC'11 1l1is f'oml<'il to ('011si,lC'r infol'm n1onouralllc :i(loptecl politics <liffcl'ellt ;m.ake H. a l1a hit every y<':11· to i11fo1·m ma<lc in eal'l':ri11g 'l'l1ere is 110 mie in writing a policy ,low11 a ncl lenvhlg it as a hit of C'ye­ waRl1.

,ve lrnve got to have JH'actical proof ilrnt we l1aYe a policy a11cl that out.
1\Iy annual acl­ it hi 11ei11ir he of the <lress to )·ou will tl1erefore 11a ture of :in accom1t of flovermnent's Rtewal'dsbip tereists of 111<' progress of this Colo11y of its people.

thiR f'onnril out 111C'Rc polirie:-.

in fuinre carried in the i11- 1o h,v comdcler­ ,,•ork hefore in ,this Oom1cil by the Hononra ble to whom I nm.
for the Ycry cnreful To-,la�- I am going 1o limit mysC'lf the inunetliate 0111lining 11Jix Council mHl before Goven1menL, We will begin 1l1e R<'ission the Orller;; :rncl Tinles t11g carefully to govern our ow11 111•ocNlnl'e an1l c011- These cluet in clehate will lie int.r01lncecl Secretar:,, Colonial greatl)' indehte<l way in -whieh he has 1lrawn up theRe Orders aml for 1.he deep tl1011ght he has giYen to drnfling tll('m.

X m,· tltat.
X m,· tltat.

all th<' it r:rnnot he expeciecl points that :we raise i11 theRe Stamli11g Orclcrs vendnl.

I lrnvc 11ever yet met :111r in thiR worm t.hat Rules ancl O1'Clcrs 1mt.isfiecl everyone.

I can only n,;k tJ1cm ble members to consider J10110n1·a tl1em clisr-nsi:; with an open m.irnl, to to rememher ""]1:it clispas;;ionately nnrl W<' m·<' tryil1ir to aim at.

wh ic·h• :ll'e goh1g fo prove non-c0111TO· time to get RnleA, R01nE" of 1n·oced11re.
lll1t we cm1 hut tn· io l!<'t into 1mless we Jrnve ,ery Tl1ese �tarnl­ i1 l'eally cffirim1t dear 1·ules ing Rules aml Onlcris, I Imm no doubt, acr11s­ will iake honournhle m<'rnl)('r;;, tomccl to otl�er i11to, il1em as qnkkl)• a;; po;;sihlc, hnve to c:ill memb<'rs m·dc1.· I feel su1-e it will merely be he,­ <":n1se th<' new Rn](',; we arc goi11g lo C'oni-;icln lntc1· nrnl if I to n 1ioi11t we Jrnve not <]ui1e g-rnRp<'1l on i11 the !lny.
'- of ,vith regard to delays ,in c·ornluc-tin� pulilic· 01· p1·ivnl<' 1lc­ like to ask hououra ble tlie Council O'\\ing to too prolonged bates, I slrnul<l memheris to hear in miiHl that every m<>mher of tltis Council is 1Hesumahly a busy man who is either engaged in importa.ni eveu the Ilenfl iof a (io1·c1·11me11t pnr!meut is a lnis)· man-and c1·e1·)· hout· that they a1·<' he1·c away from their ilmsiness some public or privat<' ticularly lbea1· this in H11les p:0Yc1·ning which it is proposecl 1lid1lm1l means an hour lost in I pa1-­ sel'Yi<'<'.
members to the the length of time lmsi11ess­ De­ illis ('hamh<'l'.

1o allot to ln- ask honournhle spce('hes in mind when diRc11Rsh1g As to tlle cliirnity of this C'onneil I J1c•re i:-j11:-t h>laC'e 111C'111l1p1• ns I a:n 1hnt this 1ww do not think I nec1l Ray Yery murh xurc thnt nbont that.
I feel pe1·fec·tly eYe1·y ho11011ral1le as rcsoh-ed LegislatiYe ('01111C'il to ,m)· shall 11ot take xe<"oml o1he1· in the Empil'e with regarcl 1.o ""i tlJ \\"hich i-1 1l1e <Ugnity nrnl rom·l<':<_1· n ncl its i1ebat<' i1 s lm;;iness c·on1lurtR.

.

as reg:ndR ihe SLamling 01 Finall:v, like to point out tha ders I shoulrl time alo11e will revenl what tl1e wen points are and the Co1rncil will li nhle to ronsirler tl!ose weak points.
a111l ameud any o The n�xt item of work heforc this Couuril is some arrears in l'OJlllexion with legislation, overdue, finam:inl cur1·ent the c11nent year's some of whith iis I011g certain aml With c·ompleiing t·o1111Petc,L with husin<':-i;; expc11diture.
Havi11g thus <"lcare,J 1 he 1letks, fio to i;;pen k, of the clehris 1wo or three days' of ln�8, 1l1erc adjournment will be and the ,busillC'ss To mr mind, our main ohjerts of aml Orclers r, to are, fil'stl, the;;c l?11lcx in tJie 1,ecnre the maximum eflkiency a nfl conduct of the Council's the.

minimum of clela.y consi.stcn1 with time allowing for debate.

The second object iR the of the dighity of t11iis mainte1rn11ce C01111eil.
,iect it hi obvfous that we cannot get and make aheacl with public business nml suflil'ieut: to tbe firRt ob­ ·with regarcl reasonable or H1·itish <lui.rna.

!)

President's Speeeli.

2S ... -on:MBER 1928 l'resitl1•11t's .�pcccli.

10 of that aclministration.


down expenditure 11olit-y, rn for it woulll he required iii this cai;e-but we to balance does uot mean certain neces­ or cut them down of balanciug will then proceed I will limit myself It would also be posHihle :For the lll0lllCJLt out the extreme dillkulty that budget .• with the next para• other diJ:ectious.

to say 011 thi:-sullject to I>l'epare the budget here llr.
y broad that we have got 1o ancl other ex­ on public senice:-; to such an where he refers gi res us a fur­ in to help us in I sha.11 have before the Council the year 19:...>o by examining for that year.

Now, gentlemen, Amery gives us an exceedingl ltlnt when he meutions "the imperati necessity" Uead in conjunction graph of his despatch, us to po�ible loam,, he ther hiut that if we help ourselves tbls way he is 1irepared certain JUQl·e budget ls introthtced.
our budget by cutting iso ruthlessly-and to be ruthless would have to a.baudon imry public 1,ervices to sut·h a minrnrnm that thcv wonlll cease to exist.

That wo�ld be a allllost penny wi.Rc a1.1d a pouml foolish whi!-h this Uo\"Crn11w1;t to adopt.

On the other hand, although we are uot goiJ1g to a1lupt it, the pm;i­ tion is so serious c-nt down departmental vemliture extent that the wheels will go far mo1·e slowly.

I think hon.
I think hon.

members shoulll to poiuting foce that fac-t. 1Ve are up agai111,t of the task.

Like mauy other tasks be­ "'e have got a Government fore us, the lmla11d11g Go,·er1rmeut something that is adapted for a population to the accumulate<L aJLnual deficits in allll in the thiJ1g like 1,000,000 the 1n1st few yeiu:s, past 300,000 only been able to carry on its work by �iay the exper:.ses borrowing very heavi­ -and borrowing Ro much for the budget of 1929. ly-from the Crown .Agents.
Xow, this at the may ha,·e been a convenienc·e was-but things have time-p1·obably it got to sueh a state thn t it may prom impo1,sible for 19:ID without that very loan which is dependent of the budget.

It is a pretty Yicious circle.

i;aitl '•it ma�, prove impossible."

course, auce a hud�et ill :-,eYr1·al first iR to cstinrnlc 1me as hei11g-pn011glt pcll(liture ·1111} on the lmlancing I Of it is quite an easy thing to hal­ wa�s� · The you1· probable to lmlance the ex­ of the budget is circle.
l am but I foBl people have been 111,kecl for us to balance our bucl�et which yon want to carry out; gone bankrupt if they "'e have more than in the 1<ame posi• like a Yiciom; GoYermueut people, Thanks of i-omP• reYe· .has to it.

anll a :-ta.ff system of adm.iuistratiou then if you like to put up taxation that re-venue.

ith a view to increasing iinancial po8ition.

does to-1lay.

that finan­ In the first place, "e can it unless ,Ye take tlie steps to i;;eeure the halant'e, not budget, but all the however.
,ve have the ta"k of restoring Government's �ot very good at business, that there are a good many businessei, that would have bad fouml themselves tion that this Govel'llment Jlow are we going to restore cial position'?

never restore 11ec·essary only of this �·ear's bml�cts of future years.

Xow, that mea 1\s 11othing more nor les:-, tlrn n the \complete se1·vkes.

will nernr be nblc to hala11c-e b111lgcts.


therefore, that mu�l be a year of im•esfig-atio11 re-or�anisatio11 1t must be a yea 1· in which thei,e ser• vi<-es •are, where poi,sible, ,placed Cl'Ononuea "wl.te1·e too t•Yi<l<.

'111 f;O committecl the people Ink<> t;l'\"l'ral of our public services 0lllic 1,asis.

I working order.

I s n y po1,sible,'' that, if the interests are to be consiclerecl, ec011- I will wen!iou one or :r,�9 reorganisation On their pre�ent basis.
we yea1·1; tu plaee one or two on a 1,10\llld has been that U0Ycr11mt•11t of it will of all public becautle it is only of all public i-el'\'ices.

10:!ll and It follows, our futu1·e i u Ull(L as for past inerea�cs which Jrnye been designe,l unsatisfactory tf to colllillends on uf revenue that It ii, due to Xeither of those expedients -.

;eJi1 to thi� Government.

.11,t over-estimati , e arc in our 11rescnl m�ition; taxation, give 1,urplus balance:;, defeated tion to 1,uch a lteig:ht.
clil-ap "ltepen1ls in such a lllanuer no benefit from the increa.-secl and the 11eoplc that taxation adversely.

•�aiue<l nothiug by it.

their own eml1-1 hy raisiug taxa­ lmn­ as to severely They haYe that we hall ha ,·e felt the iuflueure that t t-adc 011 whi<-h our re\"C11ue taxatioi1 of they have 011]�· that to (.'-Olll!

!ider, of tl1osr '-t•n·itci;: .i111111al ad<ln•ss later on.

wl1en I give you my A into of the country.


investigation l. I am seriously lt is no use, however, nnmber of official:,; are requit·• Dul'ing l!l::?9 I 1nopo:se lo make an ex.hausth"e personal the organisation and work of eaeh Gov­ ernment Depal'tmen dlsttu·bed at Jthe size of i,;ome of them iu 1·elatJ.on of the to tl1e population throw­ countr�·.
u1g blame 1011 any one, tertainly not on in one ·nts, llecause Jleads of ])cpartim owing to the way this is inevitable small population ce1·tain eil to carry out public services, no mat• tn Jww :small within reason is the populali011, but there is al way:s a. chance ilia!

µere and lhcl'e :somelxxly in bc1.

:ausc somebody has ha:s :-;lippecl lJccn a:slcep and the Department has will grown 1U1duJ_y :show wlll'lhcr should like to remind lwu.
mcllluers, however, that jt is all very well lo clamour for the retluction menl:s. ,re can reduce them half way, or if -.., e like we can reduce them by 2,i per l'enl.

.But, are we going to effect economy by that rcrlul'lion to effect 1·1·ono1ny sort when the pensiona ht·en allowed lo grow lo ,mth a Je11�lh mi il has clone in lhil', <:ouulr,v.

by red1ictio11s l,le list has ·t H i:s not so ve1·y easy of that large.

lnrnstigatiou that i:s �o or not.

l of eslabli:sh­ of their present number.


I hope from wha l I ha \'C said I ha re mcm· the hudgcf fol' 1!129 and then made il quite clear to liononr.tble l1ers that our immcdia tc task is to l,alanre lo cleYok 1he whole of Lhe next year to re-orgauhmtion of tl1e public ser• Yices.

I )wpc I haYc said c•nough to conYinC'e of the �·ou of the �criou:,;nes1> 11vsilion.

·whi](' l'C('Ol!llisi11g- tht• ;_.

{ravit�· of the 1 feel, as )lr.


Amery io11 111�·sclf, although difli­ l'r<ll'ided thnl we with the re• 1,it11at 1-,aJ·i-, lhat lhc J>Oi'liti011.

(•\111, j:,; not hopeleKs.

g-1·:1 pplc llete1·minedly ,,,·guni><ation feel ('OllYiuced Head:-; of Departments loyalty in carrying task of 1·etrenchment 1>end, and m�!!
":hos, abi!ities a1·e men 011 whose out this difficult we can fully de- of tl1e public service:-;, that we have in the I 1•ei:;1wnsihilit�· wo1·thy of the incrca:sed they will be called upon to benr unde1· the new 01·ganisation.

And, finally,­ V I may pay him a personal compli­ ment.-1 am cmn-iu<'ed thnt in ,\fr .• \lil­ Jard we hrwe a 'l'rcns111·er who, h?
the remarkalJle grasp whidt lie luu, ob­ tained of our iinandal tlifli<:ultie1-1 t!Jc urief period during whicl1 he lH1M been here, Jishing gets the support that :-ihould he gh·cn to llim.

(Applause).

capa hlc o.f 1·e-eslah­ po,-i(ion if lw Olli' lost :finanrial is ,fully in NowP in giving the 111·ogralllllle of I con<·u on minerals ·TJiat betau;;c item, viz., that of C'olonhation.
for the ,LcYolop­ lhOU/.1,'h •.hat Lhc whole future of this It is no good pinnmg ge11Ucme11, of Olli' population of our agricultura work for 1929 I omitted one very inr porta11l I did not include it in the programme ncn Uy lice-a ust• it can p 1·otced with anrl entirely of any independent of the ,�·orh I haYe mentioned.

is ,·e1·y forluuate, upon the in<:J'casc a11d l111• i 11<:reasc ))J'Odu('lion <"om1try ,depends.

our faitlt menl of British Guili11a.

will tome in YeQ· useful.


It it-no use pinning our fait.h on the fot·ests from though they a wnm,�rcial i:;tandpoinl.

and nc<:e:;­ will come in very 11,-<• I II I san·.

The preservation of our forests for thr fu I 111·r 1n·csernl is uecessary lion of agriculture.

hut the actual money-making where Gove1·11me11t money in order to tarry nu I alJ tl1ei',l' reforms and suppl�· the serviees the�· want-that has got to �me from the trade whic­ i:s dependent 1luttio11 ..
I hope honoural1lc will agree witl1 me on that 11oint .A11yway, I i-houlcl like lhern to l'l mt•mbt>r vc•r�· rarcfulh my Yiews and tbcse are ll1e view:-; whil-h emanate the policy whi<-h will J?OV<'l'll and a i:;y:-item <'Olon of education which ii; the ril!

'ht thiui: for the people of an nir1·in1lt tr�·.

Why c-a11 we c·arry on with thi�•!

Sintply because we are the lnckr '))OH· seRsors of a little tm·ked awa�• in one of the pigeon holp,.
; -I won't Ray in tqe fie<-retariat '1'1·cusm-y, but it has been tu<:kc<.l isa tion, agriculturr in lhi� Colony, fund w,hieh hai, been the peoplr with all J1a,-/.1,'0I to //,'Ct it,­ rneml><'t·i that U1�1-c arL uusinei;s reYenue ural toun­ or th'-' · upon our agri<'ullural pro 28 NoVEMBEB 1928 Preslde11t's Spcet·11.

U before we can tum and experiments Fund, gentle• we can proceed for turning of which on this away where we could not get at it.
We have a Colonisation men, and therefore without delay with thol:!e investiga­ tions, preparation,; which are requit-ed on the tap that is going to ensure a free and steady flow of the right sort of immigrants honour­ Later on I am going to infOl'lll able members more in detail of the is going to steps whkh GoYermnent take.

We shall then be ready on that tap of immigration, 1 spoke, early in 1931.
Finally, subject that the system of Colonisation which we shall adopt is not going to lead to any increased when it begins to take effect increasing the n1llllber this country revenue imate sources, present rates of taxation.

for Colonisation.

and 'irtc1·easing the annual legit­ of the Governruent from the ancl tencl to 1·e<lucc 80 much taxation.

it will by of people ju I want to assure this Council into British Guiana.

Rather, }'or the moment I need .


only men­ four selected placed in their hands I carrying on him for work.

I am not Colonh;atiou .Professor Lion Officer Dash as the Chief and thrown the yet.

Later on 1 hope one because we shall one when we are certain tion that I haYe specially men 1and have this highly important going to form a separate Departu{ent-not we shali require only require we cuu get that flow of inuuigrants spoke about.
1-'or the illlOIDent I have selected Colonisa full responsibility out certain principles Government.

deputy llr.

H. T. M. King of the North-W�st Distrit1, tried IQ:fticer of this Government servant of the people.

And I have t'electe<i most concerned with, and alive to the '.rnh1e of, this question Yiz., ;:\fr.

n. H. Wood and Mr. J. Mul­ lin.

I bclierc, in these four gcutlelllen who a1·c going to push through the Colonisation is m9re capable of pushing through such a i,;chemc.

(Ap11lause).
(Ap11lause).

memuers, we have a team a seasoned and and a Scheme and that no one of Departments · two lieacls I ihave selected honourable laid down by as his of Coloniisation, will begin 'rite work of i11Ycstigation hclt.

shoul<l prog1·css of 11.ocal iu.n1ilies experience in Pebruary holh iu the :Xortlt.

"Wcst ,Distrkt amt iu the alluvial Sufficient be made to enable lite first experimental tlements agricultural a1.,.
"ter 'to be settled on 1mch conditiou:s ise them or do11troy and will enable 'them to become tho owners of the land on whicll they are w01·ki11g and good char­ in these two area1:1 as will not pauper• laud set• of proved oil cai;y but fixed conditions.

their self-respect well11, the sewerage There will be certain arnl laml syi,telll.lS.

All these have been iu the 1mst few yea rs.


1 re· con­ other items of work that ,dll -proceed in l!l:!O, 1mch as the arte:sian sy:stem and the :sett defences drainage started gard them as highly jmportHJtl tributions you have got a Slllall want to keep as urnuy of them alive as possible.

immigrants troduce duce them to a flourishing not to a grave-yard.

tu the puhlic hcaltb.

lf II you arc going to in­ �'OU want lo intro­ and country you population, by these forboclli1gs.
I have mentioned that the work to whid1 is �owµ uu1·:-clves 1 am In some dfrections a great cleal more remai.Jts to be done, lmt in others I confess that I am nui yet satisfied we hani committed ucuelkial.
to prove perm,mently that it i:s not gui11g to not satisfied amt very us .Jinum:ially inconvenience severely but th.at in other tlircctio11Js, will ,be a mutter for close investiga­ tion ,during ask hon01uable duly alarmed propose to convey llly fears ancl hopes most freely to you ancl to receive, hope, your ussurnuecs ln concluding [the coming year.

I will members not to be un­ I my remarks this morn• on the subject.

I ing I want to sound a note of warn­ ing.


I :,;cc, and I ha.Ye heard, that under the new Constitution very much Well, I of Government.

is expected aKrec whole-heartedly.

For the first time UL very many years in thh; conn· try Government is in a position govern.

It is therefore of it.

that much should be expected t \ .\s to that, as llead of uo,·ermneut to only natui-al 1:i President's f::Jpecc·h.

28 N 0\1,Jl\lBElt 1!


)28 Prc.sillrnt's S11ecc:h. Hl arnl economy and to increase and put­ i n a state of in our t ask of restor­ finance can assure jOU of two things.

The first is that I and my officers will not spare ourselves ing the Government's ting the public ser\'ices efficienC'y the population.

tion and .tracle ly, Gornl'lnncnt official members of ihis Uouncil every opportunity act \"ising country.

when opinions must ha ,,e the final say.


with and of co-operating us on the necessities of the Of course, iu thhi country.

wishes to give the un­ produc­ Second­ difter, some one body agl'inLlluml in the last refilort, who are always of Government's members to the l)f;Ople whatever country they may a11CL in 110 plate nv s, I say this because I feel-I do not k11ow whether I am right-iliat J>nrt is the ex- of the task of co-opel'ation real aims 1>lanalion by elected elect them.
Goyernrnents suspect, he goYerniug, more readily thau in the tJ-opie and I am yet to learn that British Guiana is auy iexcrption rule.

The taisk of explanation will Le 110 ea�y one, for, as fa1· as I can sec at present, ·we shall have to mark time iu mo::;t directions we shali have aml in other direetio11s bad.

: uefore we can to step �leliberately stal'i rc•ol'ganisi..ng ser­ ccl'lain public· vices in ::;uch a manucr that.
the people will get 1·ral lleuefit from them arnl uut lie pauperised work lhey haYe l,efore tlleru.

for some considerable to _use a military and spoilt for the real expression, to the gcncrnl period, �Uud1 )low for the note of wa1·JLi..ng.

swamp of llut lhere is for draining to prepare are I.Jt·eak.iug iu wJ..tich we find wancl from his pockets and and as I ha re suit!

rightly is expected, is expected, of Uo,·crrnuent.

one thing that cuuuot.

lie expected.


That is, Lhai the Jloodctl clistrc::;s financial ourselves to-day can be drained in a brief space of tinte, that the '"sea de­ waye::; of bank­ fence" to keep out the i u a Iew month::;.

ruptcy mu be c1·e<.

:led The ulmo::;t we cau do at the morueut is to 1mt our fist i11 the hole iu the clykes through which the::;e wares of bankruptcy the plaus and materials av, 1.;y the 1lood waters of Jina ncial dh;­ tress.
Neither in the Oovcrmnent, 11or0 as far as I am a ware, in this Council i.; there a man who tan produce a magician's w,tving ii iu the air eause the dyke� and drains that we want to drop from the skies.

I do 110t want to ca::;t auy on mrm1Je1·s a1>1)e1·sioJJs but I think .I am right in sayiug that magicians' these days.
have meu both in the O0Yer11meut a)l(L and in 011 this Council who1-,e abilities whose perso1ial to this coun­ try we ean trust to cany out the real .hard, .slogging ·work is those men ask for with tl1e fullest Government.

In saying this I am well aware that co-operation ment is 11ot usually a popular thing: -it generally calls of self-sacrifice popularity, fe1·sonal in On the other Jland, we for 110 small measure and the sa�rifice that I earnestly co-operation clevol.io11 ahead of us.
It possible with Govern­ wands arc rather scarce of the Cotutcil, of l tlou·t ::;uppOKC the 1>coplc of this the agitators back.

All they in this Council the work.

hi additi,.m · are goi..ug to lWtlerstarnl alway,; th.at believe such as this where yc;u co1utfry stepping l.iovcrnment's and will get will !Jc garbled accotu1ls our:,; brought to them by the fal:--c l'lllll ill-iufonncd or those political who are anxious to sen·e their own enrls.
It is here on thi;; point of cx­ plana tion tllat the elected members cau do iurnluablc to repre::;enting Yiews of their co11stHuents-11ot au easy matter, I aclmit-I in a situation eaw1ot turn lite GoYenlllleut hon.

members have the moral election, tlie of ti-ying to e<lucate obligation people as to what the Go,·erlllllcnt is doing for tllem.

I am making a tlcler• ruined effort, as hon.

members will see, to incorpora in the GoYernrneut.


to succeed for a moment,, licve that the elected their shoulders to the wheel and help us through this difficult period into which the finances tJie cOlmtry have falle11.

I do not expect but I clo be· members will put and general work of out by an 18 all the elected lllcmbcrs Gentlemen, in concludi11g my first address to you, I wish you mo::;t hearti­ ly all success of your �uties towards the people of this coun- in the discharge 17 ReplJJ to Sptceh. ""
,� · :..o �,on:�rn•m iO'!S .-:tc111di11y lt1tin1 & U,-tlers.

_ 18 tn·.

Aud I pra�· that Almighty God wllI guide and support you in the work that you are <·alled couJttr.v plause).

aud your fellow men.

ou to do for this XOTICE 01" MOTIOX: EHTDUTI<}.

�l'Pi!

'LE::\IEX'f.Alff (.\.p­ The fl.rini:t of a fialute of seYenteen guns from Fort William Frederick the B.G.

Militia 11oun1·c-1l Artillery the opening of iltc Conneil.
Company an- by morrow rei-.ol ve it;;elf into a Committee of the whole Council to f'onsider Supplementary 11..te year the Estimate (Second) for 1928.

( Colo11inl Hccreta,-y).

Tl.tat the Cotrnf'il at it!-!

meeting to­ REPLY TO THE SPEECH.

ORDER OF THE DAY.

STANDING RULES AND ORDERS, Orcler-in-C'oundl 0 THE COLONIAL SECRETARY (Mr. sir, Hon.
meml>ers, Mr. AUSTIN: (Senior Unofficial a very address sir, it will be Therefore, of the members aclmb1isti·a­ has been welcomerl anll �uc·c-essfnl has been made that until the of t.l1c Couueil, the all(l Orders of the old shall remain in force Douglas-Jones): are aware that under the British Uuia ua l Coustitution) pro\'ision the m•w �tanding Uovernor Jrns made Unlcs aml Orders fut· 1his Council, 'witlt the c011r-;ent Starnliog Rules Court of l'olicy and effect.
necessary sion of the Standing to enable this Couneil to go into Com­ this ,afternoon mit.tee enclosure, Governor's -Xew Standing Rules and Orders.

I 110\\' f O I' lll a 1] .r .

lllO\'C tile sm:pl'll· sion of the Standing the to enable this Connell to <-011sid<'t" draft Rtarnlh1g Rules a n.t Orde1·s of Council.

_ ___.

the Legislative for me to move the suspen­ Rules and Orders to C'Ollsider Message, Xo.
1 Member): Your Excellenc·y,-1 have 1he honom· on 1ichalf to thank you for the of thii,; Com1c-i,l ,·ei-y able and romprehensiYe wl1lrh you Jrnve be!

'n pleased to gh"e 111<.

As Your aniYal here, sir, has eo• of the iJteide<l �dth 1he inaug-nration first meeting of the Legislative Council I think it uncler the 11ew Com;titution, is fitting if I wish you on behalf of 1lie members of the CounC'il Jiarmonions tio11.

There c-an he 110 <loubt whatso­ that your as- Your Ex<·ellenc•y.

c-,·<'r.
c-,·<'r.

1mmption of o1liC'!'

io11 of the c·ommunit�·­ hv everv R<'c-!

· n�>t that expet·t 1111>,1· miracles ,·ou, i-.ir, a;; a man of n<-- 1•<'o·al"(l 1hc-,· 1im;, au<l frei that yon are going 1o ui-.e your euergiei-to assist us in solving the Yer�- many problems before us.

Thi;; i;; 11ot the time for me to toueh n1l0n the Yatious points yon have r:�i in your .\11dre;;s, 1hci·cfor<'.

Ila If of hoi1011ra Addrei-;s, :111ee with C'Ustom yon will have it printe,1 :inti among the 1uem­ bers of the Council.
for yotu· and to ask that in accord­ for me to thank you on be· h]e llJClllbers The COLONIAL SECRETARY: By order of Your ExC'clle11C\\', sent to the Uounl'il Governor's Stantling Council.

macle, aml Question proposed, to go into Committee l !<hould just J ike to draw attention points in f'onnection Standing Hules ancl Orders.

)lessage :So.

1 1·01·eri11g Rules and Orders Bt'f'ore "Tha1 1 he Council do now adjourn until :!.

:rn o'C'loek this afternoon" ou ia l l'-in.,-eta l"y).
to ·one or two new with these The ATTORNEY GENERAL se­ �noving the resolution draft for this and it Rimply remami-;, C'it·citlated put, amt agreed to.

Rules amt Orders Q11c,;tio11 ('onclecl.

)lotion hy you, but secl .

( <'ul­ the I now }ll'e' Ilis Excellcney the '1.

'he Connell adjourned and resumed accordingly.

Ilule 2 ( b) tixef.l the day" aucl hours on which the Council shall sit.

The effect 1!l Standing Rules & Orders.

28 Nov.l!lt.lllElt 1928 Standi1ig .ll,1dcs & Oi•clcrs.

'.
'.

!O of this is that at the h,ours upon which it is stated that the Council shall acljoum the Council will auto­ adjourn at those hours.

r matically sir, it is your wish that, understand, if possible, at least an hour and a half 1,'1lall the day.

That would necei:;sitate amendment :be considered Committee.
to rule 2 (b) which can when we come to it in as a break in an be made available ot' the wor<ls: the length of an ex­ Rule .24-When in Committee I shall .. or length" after the words in the move the insertion inordinate the second line ·' read extracts," object being to leave to the discretion of the President tract of ;i ;written \whiqh any member may read, and to prevent occurn·ing reading any lengthy though they may have some bearing time u11- the subject, necessary.
rily any member from um1eeessa the time of the !Council :Uy are at the ·i:;allle or printed document on at the place of each member.

of this sort it is :11sual will be made 2 (c)-Arrangements for 1a copy of the Order of the Day to be laid In Legislatures t.llat ing are :read by the Clerk .a� the t·om­ mencement day, ancl it, facilities of the proccccliJ1gs is hoped that our printing will enable that to be done.
of each the minutes of t.he preceding meet­ Rule )25--This introduces what is the uunecessarily known as " the closure," conrmouly object being to curtail 1011g dellate:s, the l'i-esideHt dcutly <lisn1ssecl .

whcu in tlic opiniou ui a maUc1· hai:; ueeu sulli­ extracts wltith, al­ of this rule is tha L one clear The next rule to whic-h I wi�h to ir,; Rule 11 (1).

The draw attention efl'ect clay's notice has to be given of any motion or question to be moved or asked.
for what 1is Rule 12--This provides usually known as •· l'rivate all mo­ Day."'

On evei·y "'eduestlay will take tions by Unofficial precedence busi­ over all GoYernment ness in '' Orders of the Day.''

�!embers :Members' that where there Rule 17 provides are to a ques­ shall be taken a number of amendments tion such amendments first, and when au amendment has been agreed rupon all 1n-evious ones fall to the ground.
The l'resideut shall then put the motion as · amended or, if no amendments the ori­ ginal motion as moved.

a1·e adopted, attention Rule 21 (a)-I draw to this because in the old Combined Court ou one or two occasions some doubt as to whether the mover of an amendment hatl the J:ight to reply, although stat­ ed in the old Rules and Orders that \he had not.
it was distinctly there was Rule 23--This is of common form und makes it clear that when the Council is in Committee -uo motion or �mendment need be seyonded.
1lfo.le :!6--ln this rule the i>resiclent numl.Jer may last.. would give the l'resilleHt is giren power to .fix a ceL"tai11 of hours during which the debate on aHy question I I 1yi11 opera (C' iJt this way: a membe1· wishing to give notice of motion has to do so one day ,before the clay he intends 'l'his to tledde how much ti.me he eonHidcn; it desirable Hion.
It is possible two member,; may o<·t·upy time, lmt that is a mattc1· en­ tirely in the hanlli-; of !hr memberi:;, once 1the President allowed to move it.

time to allow for cliscus­ :has fixed the time for the debate.

IIH• whole t hn t 011c 01· Rµle 27-'rhis i.-a somc11·J1a t u11usual the object bei11g, Members: '•Rear, p1"ovision-(Ho11.

hear ! ")

It lias been n<loptetl in other of course, Colonies, and to save the time of the Uou11cil and prevent members wasting time.

Hon.
Hon.

mem• intentionally bers, w)].o a1·e convers:111t with the macle of the time many complaints wasted in tlle ol<l Combined Court iIL this c01:uiccti011, bility of a rule of thh; Hott.

from deliberntely will admit the desira­ Rule 31-I desire, sir, io draw at­ tention to this rule.

Not that I have any desire to cast any refleetiou members of the olcl Combined Court, experi­ lmt one of the great clitticulties enced by the ;I'resident of that Court in the 1�ast was that of keeping mem- on 21 Nta11rli11f!
Rulr.� & 01·rfrn�.

28 XoVElrBER 1928 -Committee22 Rule 2 (b )-Meetings.

ibers -strictly to observations on the subject -imcler consideration.

Although in the J)ast c·omdderable latitude was permitted, e11t of eco11om�· ciency in the work of the Council that t.hii1 I submit it is in the inter­ of time and for effi­ rule shonl<l be strictly observed.
Rule 37 (b)-This provide11 tlrnt a Bill shall 11ot l>e read a second time until seven day11 afte1· (li11lwd C'opy of the Bill on the tlate of 1rnhli- 1·11 tion.

it has been pnb­ n and eve1-y memher will rec-eive Rule 4-1 neefl!-1 ROmf' explanation.

or part of Bill has been what c-lause11 on Consolidation Bills.

goes through the Bill arc 11ew matter11.


Tlwn the into f'omrnittee When a <'om,olidation read a second time it shall be referred to a Committee Tl1is Committee and l'f'])Ort11 1·lau11<>11 f'ounc·il J!O<'H and deals with tlle report.

The reason for thL-.

is that the ol>jel"t BHl i11 to rep1·01ln<"e le1,rif,lation l"Olllplete ter as iR 1wc·e11i;;nry trm·en,r will 'thus he avoided and the pa11i:;11ge exi,;ting in form and only suclt new mat­ Con­ of the Rill accelerntecl.
of the Com;olidation i11 intJ·oclucecl.

)lotion made, .and Question propos­ ed, '"That the hour 2 p.m. oo alter�d to :!.30 p.m. and the hour -!

}l.lil.

nlte1·e1l to J.30 p.m: "-( Co/1111 f<tr!J).

int Nr1-r1•.

oo The COLONIAL SECRETARY: It g the if hon.

mem­ meet earlie1· .r thrn,e 1·epre11entin and then adjourn might be more conYenient bers, e11pedall public, from 12.HU p.m. to 2 p.m.
The alternative suggestion is that the Council s,houl(l meet at 11 a.m., ,rnd adjourn at 1 p.m. all(l then sit from 2.30 p.m. to 4.30 p.m. l'el'liapH which they prefer.

!ton.

members will irnlicate Mr. �ANNON: F1·om past E>Xperience, I thi11k r slrnll leave Your Excellem')·, the time out altogether, Council to <lec-i!le day.

and leave the ihat from day to to de­ be a �imit, be pul down 110w in the Mr. ELEAZAR: I beg to move that the• dau�e he clelete<l altogether.
Hither­ to it has been the rnstom to leave it to the President or 0-ovel'nor cide the cla�·s arnl hours on which the Council shall meet.

1 see no reason why it shoultl Rules ancl tllat there 11houhl exc·ept '<·ertain illlembers �eave the ComH'il a1 a usual l10ur-4 to -!.30-"�JLereas me111hc from the Counties will be wasting so nmeh time in town.

I 11ee no reason whr Your Excellen<':V yourself at every session shoulcl not state wihen the Council shall adjourn and when it shall resume its duties.

That.
That.

ltas been clone in ihe past and 'has caused no inconvenience at all and I see no reason wl1y the days or the hours sh�ll lle limited at all.

-outside of Demerara >1·s who have come like to Rule 53 is the uRual clam:e inserted in 'the Stamlin11: Rules and Orclers of Colonial Legislatures providing that in all cases 11ot 1novided for in the new Coni;;t.itution and OrdN·s, the -practice of the Hom�e of Commons of Great Britain shall be applicable.
or 'in 'tl1e RuleR .As I have stated, sir, umler the 11ew necessary to re­ the Standing Rules nE>w Constitution 1md Orders of the Court of Policy are of effec-t until this Council 111nke11 ·mes.

It is therefore _Jeal tlte Standing Rules and Orders of the Court of jPolicy-the lRules and Orders of the Coml1inecl Court ceased to have force when that august body disappenred.

sir, that the Council resolve Committee His Excellency's Rule1-1 and Orders.

I now mo,·e, itself into to consider No.


1-Draft )Iessage Standing the enclosure of The ATTORNEY GENERAL i,;e­ conded.

Question put, and agreed to.

(Mr. HEC­ of other Legislatures The Attorney General TOR JOSEPHS) : Perhaps I may con­ tribut!

to this debate.

I have had ex­ perience like this and I should like to point out to hon.

members that there is nothing novel about this 1·ule.

What own practice and Combined Court.

Hon.


members will :fincl that most Colonial Legisla­ tures-I think I may safely say all of -tpem-ha ve rules which provide tor is novel is oul' in the Court of Policy 2!l 8f11111li11!}

ll11lr.� & Ord,•r,q, 2R Xov1m111m 1!

)2R -('1Jllllllitt,·1·.

:.

!-1 "'e have to exerdse a rather judidal is to dirN·t that 1w 1·<•p1·(•:-;e11ta­ lllft'ting of ('onn<'il 10 jret away fl-om somC' of ac-c-or<lingly.

hut it is tliat WC' a1·e C'll· arnl each day.


The rNmlt thC' automnti<- t hC' a<ljournment is that memhers are ahle to mak<• 1l1('i1· There is 11rra11genw11ts nothing hapluumrd about it.

It is 11ot thn t we a1•f> intr0<lud11 g a nowlty on this o<·('asion, den,·om·ing the things of tbC' pnst a1ul to takC' 1tol1l and fntnre gui1l­ future allminisiration anrC'.

That is really the position.


Of :rn,l <'OUrse, the ohle.1· W<' get-myiwlf inducl1•1l, I in­ mu not referring more attracted a1·e we dh·idually-the to in to the things we are accustomed tht> days of out· yonth" aml in the pni-t. of some of the goo,l things for to any nwml.><>1· the pni-;t. has its <'linnrn, 1·a thr1· than to ft i'N'lllK that an of1'1•1111ing J)<'t' ma.,· lw rna1h• to 1·or1·<•1·t time aml kt•cp that 11(!>1 111ay rxtreme.
1ww:,;pa what it ha;; tlmw \\To11g-m· to 111ak1• :,;ome sot·t of a 1>olog)· put an imlcfinite pa J)(.

'1' from reportin of the ('ountil.

That he 1·Pad h mnniiy.

In thii,; Colony 1•,·1•1·yhody 1101 1·<•,111 i:,; tile fai1·ne:-;s a repo1·t 1,t!

'lting- tlte Coniwil liy k<>epi ont?

I put that, aspect lo Yom· Ex<·el­ lt•11c·�· g llH• p1·01·1'1•tli llt'\\';.pnpr1· of ihe 1·0111- What of keeping a man from for co111-i<lemtio11.
ng-his l'('J)Ol'tcr :r a l:uge :,;el'tion of ilw p1·01·1•<•di11g1- 1 iew:-;papt•1·s.

all tl1r('(' do1•:,; of hl't' 1 he hon.

rnemhl'l· n1·e .. lll;t_l' hn:,; 11oti1·e1l .. :11141 di1·1•1·1 The CHAIRMAN: T dn not know is hcing if anto­ If, for instanc,.., in regard 1.o what we clo, and 1 antl fixed hour!

'> for adjo,n·n­ "·hat is done i;;, tJ1c :Hules all(l Orders are <;u:s- hit of hnsilwi,;s Hupposing-the hour nf is -l.30 a11cl it is found :1 L mill(l venture to think that hou.

memhers will find it mu!


'h more ronvenient they have fixed hom·s of meeting matiC'alh i ng a ut�mrnt ieally.

an impm·tant tranisa<·te(l. :uljourmnent ·LU that.

ii would he very expetU..'nt ihat that wo1·k :should he rornpi",etl that a fh•l'llooii.

�ta1uling- 11<•rnlt•1l <·outinn<> c-ondudcd.

remedied, emergen<'.r.

tory to know ea('h day 'the Coun<'il is days on wl1 irh going to sit on spec-ific it would • meet autoniatica·uy and ad­ joum autmnati('all,v.
ing into line with wJrnt is being donc el;:ewhe1·e.

'we 11evro· let us f!O n ht>,Hl are.

Tbei,;e matters are eai-;ily' I think, on oc<'asions It is far more satisfac· TJte old trouble wa:,; 1hat knew whet·e we were.

Xow, au<l know where wr in order to ena hie the del>a •e to "'e arc 0111:r fall­ to a <·ertain hour or until • of Questi011 pnt: "TJiat the hou1· :!

p.m.

:!.

:JO 1un.

and the ho111· J hc �It c1·c1l to p.m. he alte1·ed 1to.

Agreecl J:nle ;; (b)-Reporters.


to 4.30 p.m.'' Mr. FREDERICKS: I rc!

'lpectfully �uhmit that the 1nmishmcnt is ratl1er i11 :i way io he Jlnnishment wl11'1 th:11 th(• \10l'd,-; th<• se\·ere inflided th·e of that new!

'lpaper tcu to �1tteml.

the Cow1cil may <lecicle to the newspaper.

"mny clire<'t" It dors not follow that would do so.

Tl1e ( 'ounril on having a war11ing iKRUed Tlw wor<li-; nre nrny he• pel'll1it­ and not "will tlit·t•et."

Mr. FREDERICKS: Thauk you, )fr.

President.


Rul<> l;j-l'resicleut ma�· (fo,allow any question.

::Uotion made, a111l Q111'st io11 1wo11os<>1l .

from amongst "Tbat Rule 1;:; he clelete1I tile Itules and Onlers.''-(Jlr.

Bf('(t�ar).

Mr. ELEAZAR: Yom· Excellenc- y, �-ou have asked.

U!

'I fol' t·o-operntion, a 1ul the whole Colony is at one with hut we have to .,ou to co-operate, {look ahead and Your E�<'elle111·y may (.

'i1·- the ('hair.

not.


ahni�·s OC'('UP)' may wnnant Your I�x­ 1·umstanC'es hciug out c,f the <'ha i1· cellen<'�' at the moment.

'Who will <lt>tem1i11e whetl1er the qucstion uot '!

'fhe question l.ut it nm)· �10t be eou:,;id1•1·('(I varty oc-c-upyiug k11ow11, ha,·c l>een <·omddered.

11ot the power of prev<>nting- 1 ion!

'> being put, but from the l'<'}llies gi 1·en those quei:;tio11s Y<'l',\' f<tll'h IIHl)' lw r<•lenrnt.
so h." th<• I hare \lllC'omfortahle a rule as this one wni,; in t)1e The <'hait-h11tl tl1ose h:ul made it for some one.

If in m,r own tinw, that <Jn<•stions i1-rel<•rnnt the <'hair.

11ues- or 2j ,'{f<t111li11fl Rulr.q & ONler,q, 28 Xorn:1rnER l!l28 --{ '0111111 itt,,,, • :?li while in truth books the11 .

'1:hat rule would haw ll<'en RJ)plied and in fa<'t the were very necessary for the 11uestiom1 pm·poses which they were intended to llel'\"e, has not.
al'i:-icm and we h:t\'c this, and it is well­ of the Legislature · hy some extraneous says that It may be that l'rC'sillent it is inadmissible.

in the past the necessity but we have 'to look to the fuhue.

There umY ue a member who mav be eontrolled inttu­ enc-e jm.

;t as I suggested --;1gainst to provide known that in the existence of 1J11s nt.le hon.

memuers will find it Yl'ry ni-;efnl for their prott>etion.
It is a statement JJOint of the inhe1·ent ,Prei;i<lent the Chait-man as in that of any otlker who lly law or h;v 1·eg-ulation OYe1· nny deliberat.ive power of the of a Legiiiati"e Council or 1n·esi,les assC"mbly.

of a Boar«!

of Directors in regard to this particular Question1 to.

a gT1'l•d not pu1·sn<'d, mul Ihde Uule 2J.-8peeches not to be read.

)lotion nuHle, and Question proposell, ·• That the words "of moderate ·11e i 11se1·tecl -(l'o/011i11/ after the word 'extl'acts' 81>1•retary).
leug;;h" Mr. CRANE: '.

)lay I ask that the Uon.

A;ttorney House with a definition word, "modert1te" General supply this dause Hf the '!

The ATTORNEY GENERAL: 'J'L.e answer is sin1ply '' The l1resiclent of all word-.;.''
the judge of moderation is I nm therefore asking Your Excel­ J:ule [l:i for th<' reason of the Legisla beeau:-ie 1he is that the person who is lem·y to 1lelett• whi<-h I linve assigned, possibility nsking the question may have some r<'ason for doing so and he alone is 1.he person to judge.

As in the past 110 m<'mhc•1· tlw t>tl'r011ter�- �l question whic-h wns nn all11RP of P:ll'liamPntary if sl1011l1l n11ll's, l S('(' 110 l'C':18011 wl1,1· 1)(' that woul«l tbaf in �he fntu1·e imaj?inecl uot he tll<' <'nse.
Therefore tl1e rule is 1mn<'tei,:,uny, Jen«·y to agree to have this rule 111'­ leted.

and I nsk Your Excel­ to propound t 11 re Jw s ha<l is the sole President is of the opil1ion if tJ1e Pre:-i<lent The ATTORNEY GENERAL: I shall like to '.

})oint out Ito the hon­ mPmber that the judge of order in this Council just as t.l1e Hpeaker is in the House of Com­ mons, Rl)d even if 'this rule did not <'Xist tliat a question not admhirsib]e that right is atta<"hed in the Chair ,iappens to be presiding nt the tlme.
I do uot wish to alarm the 11011. meml;er.

I had tbe honour, temporarily for a few minutes, sidinJ?

OY<'r a meeting and rlisallowing foot!

a «1uestiou, some m1popular referees ma tdtc!-1 are t1·ea tecl.

is not a proper one or he ran dhmllow it, and to anyone wbo but I was not treated �s at foothall of pre­ Question put, and agreed to.

Rule 25.-0losure.

Mr. CRANE: Like the Chancellf)r's 1\Iotion madEi, and Question proposed, E'lea­ "That Rule 25 be deleted.''-(Jlr.

za r).
za r).

of tbe rule is tltat Tl1e ilnJ)Ortauce in all Parliamentary \a pro­ assemblies v1s10n of this nature is useful.

It js not� sir, 'that a member would wilfully Mr. ELEAZAR: In this rule I am.

that is not pro­ 1mt forward something pt>r 01· admissible, but it might very sure that somebody has been at paim;, Wl'll pc that a degree of i.n::fl.uence no cloulit, might be con<luet.

i n his <'npacity other countries constituency majority" only against hh,; better jmlgment but.
Your Excellency as a delegate to put forward some­ in troubled thing, and it ibelps him wihen he has any time what is known as "the done his duty to the people who re· ty1·anny lrns been quired him to put it :forward if the it is in this l'Ule.

A fully exemplified brought to bear upon him.


for his as a delegate whereby he is foreecl as '• the tyranny of the or how well or how skilled to see how this Council will itself in what is known iu of the majority" may be at angling waters, because, sir, if nL 1•ot 27 Str,1111i11fl 811lr.� & Or,1rrs.

2.-l Xonmnm: l!l2� -f'nmmittrr, for it, .A is is put and quei;tion the minm·it.,·.

nt that, aml the iul'iusion on in the future.


wl1en that majorit�· aucl HCC no jui-ti1i<-ation iH 110 justitic'a t.iou in the Jlnst is not heard.

.\ ·majot· tyraun il'al when it motion is movf'cl and is se1·ond1•d.

member g<•ts.

up.

wltere the majority majority a 110111inatf'<l t;a:n1 "I move that the question bf' put now."

'l'hat tlw minodt�· ity • ii; considered dcddes without hearing .\ majority 11il'al frain a man from 1li1-1<·mising his ov.,1 To insert a rule such a,; lh1,; :tl'ts.
whc•11 lhett• i:--a Unn•1·n­ 111 IJ1e book m�111.

majority t ion to t·est 11i;;enssion of that majority.

11.1;:t thc•n le1 us eontinue If tlil'l'l' Ho argument about looking to the future will justify of th is rnle amongst tlt<' rules of thi11 This llous(' has been, a;; one lfouH<'.

said,-!

tJ1i11k 111cmlle1· :--eneta1-y,-runniu� ('olonial is fu1·tlter consid<'l'('(l t�Ta n- ycatH.

If clu1·i11l,:" that pet·iocl hundrecl 1-1eeks to n·­ r to it lnul not been tqoug-h t )1<•(·t•ss1u·.
giw till' majm·it_y that pow<•r-tl1<>11 it a111l 1,0l,ocly majority, was an 1•kc·1<,tl would dream of i,;11g-g-1•sti111,:" eletted to dose <low11 the otlil'ial wl1y now that th<• minority be an eleded one should it be thoul,:"ht nec·e1-1;;a1-v dowu tl;at minority ing?

I J 1old that it is wi-ong and I ai-:k 1lrn t it be deleted should have the power .r­ mino1·it happen:,; to ­ of a de1<•1·rni11a te it wa1-, th<' Hon.
for om• and modc•ra of th<' al'tions 1·a i II p 1·ope1· and nitil'ii-;m to insert u rule to cloi-e Your Excellen<·y, from the Uule11.
without a hear­ n motion vut by s,l\·ours majorit�- lleen that an is )Jot t.o the wishes of if 1.hat minority By thi,; rule the attempt i,; de­ because it has the hear­ dedde hdo1·ehaml without is known to l:ow lo a re­ minoril.v, but l1ow is tha-q to aeeecl<' n member is simply a precis of per­ J1nps ·what mny ,,nve given rise to that motion or what may 11:tY(' passing in J1is mind.

How on f'a1·th 1·an a mnjority, 11ower, ing that minority?

YC'ry often a majority spt•<1:able majority t hf' minorit.''
l1f'nrd.

from JihNate to prewnt tlle n�inority l,ei11g pres­ lt<',11'<1, nn<I, ;;ir, when•ver :--nre i;; brou�ht.

to hPat· upon membe1·s Pspedally liy the majorit.,·, that is an ahui-:e t;r the poweri.. of that maj<)l'ity.

That will <·ertainly the vower to do just what it 1,leases.

Xothing can 1n·eV<'11t iA inclined whnt it ·likes, legal.

If this rule is pass('(!

be perfectly 11on1-1 for all that.

It "ill be hnving a giant's �iant.


to act that way from <loiug hut after all it is 110t it would legal but it will be tyran- give the majority and m,ing it like a a majority strength whieh I nm ai-kin� Your Ex1·<'1k1wy not to a rult• of this kintl to cliHl,:"i-at·e ve of a11y rea­ pe11nit t hi' rule hook l'f th i:--L<•g-isla ti\·e .

I <·a1111ot c·o11C'ei ( 'ounc-il sou whr any 11e1•,;011 clo with mPmhers majority of tlwm at least-in should �et it into J1is beacl to framC' such a rule.
I nm told to look tuture, but if I lake a glam:e into tJ1e who has Juul to of this Coundl-the the pai.

;t to 1he cir,·umsta nl'es ThiH •• into Brit• lie deleted the "closU1·e 11ot in British Mr. FREDERICKS: lifo i:--here to-<la, l'arlia 1·ou1·se hut it re­ r dreum­ f r o m ext.mor<lin:n. g-a ve it Though I nm not aski11g that it shoul<l I that the word .. may" he will sugg<•st 'for the wor<l ..

must.''

substitntecl is an iron rule.

Xo Yic.


:torian s<·ene,; whid1 brought r ish ,l'arliamentarr antl J clo not sec why all this rush 10 in.

The " l>roug-ht Jia ,.

(' the " closure .. dosurc" wns not n thing brought in­ me11tnry life in tJ11> to Bi-itish ,,1·di11a1·.,· of c•vents, H tiltc•cl sla n1·e;;-pel'nliar birth.

Conditions are Huiana what 1hey Wl't·e in the Yic­ to1·ian JH·oeeclure this : let us put the isi;ue in the hand11 of the President with the word •may' than to have the wore!

• must.'
• must.'

I think it "ill read softe1·.

F1·om mediate burr.

'· for the · <'losnre.'

m.,-experienee g-oes on J1ere to necessitate it.

lt is worse than the 'kangaroo' or the 'gu il­ lotine' to write the wor<l • must.'

The and the 'g-uillotine' 'kangaroo' i:;eenes in Parliament whkh brought it in, but no sud1 things <>xist J1ere to-day.

rule.

One makes rules for proper guiclnnre, but let it he in a more equitable eame into beinl,:".
I do i;my i n this Chamlier aTicl by rules •we shall <'Xist, I raU1er R<'e a more mode1·ate Ther<' is no im­ 11othing sense.

Jrncl period whe11 tl1is 1l'arliament.

'lr,,· I object to the wortho1 ' muist be put' and submit the word •may' to this honow-able body.

iiachiavelinu the minority.

allows this motion to be put or ' to be mon•cl unles1S he 1Satislie<l The COLONIAL SECRETARY: The hon .

.Member for New .A.11IBterdam .

(Ml'.


in hiis usual subtle manner J�leazar) seeH something in thiis .Machiavelian rule.

There is notl1ing nbout it.

lie regardis it ais juist an attempt 011 the part of the majority to re1St.rain 1'hat iK nothing of the ISOrt.

lf t,he hon.
lf t,he hon.

member would 1·eacl the y 1:1tat­ rul<' he ·will find it i1S clistiuctl_ e<L that the motion Rhnll not be put 'Ul1- leisi,; it a11pears that to the Prt>sident the motion is an abuse of the Rules of the House or an infringement of the rights of the minority.

No l'resideut 'tffet· the · closure is 11erfcctly ily have lmcn 1St11lkie11tly fear:, of the hon.

mernbcr arc entirdy unfounlled.

no i-iuggeistiou lie used ti) preYeut the minority J.,ciug hea1·1l.
uuly ohjectiou ;fhe illea of this rule is to cur­ loJ1g clebate arnl tail unnceei-;surily it would be most useful when �n- 1Sideri11g csthua.tes 1n·e,·ent bated longel' isirablc.

.

The objection, isaid, by the hon.

member is not of 11Souud.

There is no infringement the rightis of the minority suggested ill this rule.

to of expenditure item being de­ than is necessary or de­ from 'fhat i1S, I gather, the that is being rai:sed.
that this power should there is As I have IS,lid, auy particular sir, a11 I have, that the minol'­ heard.

'l'he lo.

i-;uggei,ting (Mr. Fredericks) 1\'ith regard to the rema1·ks made liy the hon.

juuior Member for l:iouth-Em,t Ei.i,e11ucbo that the word " must " may lie al terecl is this: On(·e into "may,'' the position the !

'resident has decided that this motion s]1all oo moved, it must lie mo,·Nl forthwith, dent has so decide1l tion of "may'' about it.

'\Yhen tl1e hat.
'\Yhen tl1e hat.

arrh-ed at that decision Prei.ident then the motion mui-:t he put.

J t h1 entirely w,heu this motion 18 put.

ancl until the ,Preisi­ there is 110 ques­ iu the ]iands of the l'reisident -l'o1timittce.

ao with :that, of any Presi­ in these modern dayt1 apply the · clo­ The CHAIRMAN: ,In case tJie hon.

llember for New Amsterdam iis not quite i-iatiilfied I just Jike to 811\' that it does not seem to me pos­ oiiile.
I caunot conceive dent existing who woulcl deliberately s1u·e' in order to keep the minorit;v from being hearcl.

I cannot imagine it.

It may be lmt it sounds to me clays.

I like a reJic of very Jancient should also like to point out that all some Lules and Rtanding Orders-and of the rules-are not written for the ordinary ing Orclers one hais got to allow for somehody wiho ii-i going to deliberately the limiti-i .iJt over-step mul 11ersii-itc11tlr 011e cliredion That i1S wl1y or anothc1·.
a rule of lhis i;ort is brought b1.

I llo not fant·y that the Legislative iJlC'ludes tio11, himsC'lf ha ppcn in the future."

Council m1y member of that dcscrip­ hut.

as the hon.

member remarked man.

In all Rules and Stand­ tan tell what may ""'e IJC\'er <!ucstion 1wgativetl, and Uulc agreed ilulc :!T.-Limilalion of ::,pcech.

)iotioll matle, aml <.

!ue:stion proposed, .. 'fhal Huie.

27 be llelcted:'-(1Ur.

('mnc.)

Mr. CRANE: Your �xccllell(·�·.


t.ltiH for some in hh;tory-in is really the objt•dio11ahle ill da11:,;1• tltesc Hules.
.Xo one wuul(l seriously o1Jjett to Hule :!3 or Huie :!ti or Hulc :n, the or1linar�· as these rules provide in mNhods of df'aling-with obstruction all l'arliarnentary ,but I H:-:semblies, ha rn never l>cen able to find-and l (haYe searched the rules of those ai-;semblies Wl' have hccn in tlw habit of following r any sud1 altempt tu in thii-; 1·01111tr, limit the speech of any member to thir­ t�· or any ,1rnmher of minutes-possibly except i11 i-;omc other 1>art.

; of t.be world.
; of t.be world.

1'hh, rule, sir, (·omes with hail or evl'n worse g-1·a,·e al thi,.

; 1irn(•, lJe.

caui-;e Gove1·11ment tion or the (.

'oni-ititulio11 ltas heen gh'en th<' rei-ier,e power.

no,·ernrnent 'I.Jecu given a 1>erma1wnt majorit�·.

in lllc r1•co11.,truc­ which has I sayr sir, thnt tlw fullest opp1,1• tunity for out· 1·e1H·t•sentation ai1ces ought to be afiurtl,-d 11,;.

now un- L,f gnev­ :U St<1111li119 Rule.� & Orders.

28 :XO\'E:\IBER 1928 -Com III it IC/',... , ·•- with If you lim­ on it?
1 know in!-.tan1·c, JlC('essary attempt to 'turb their their wrongs, uot by debate but to 1.leal Uule :a.

\\·hy pre­ 1ler this uew Com1titutiou.

it the powers of a hody, whi<"lt ma,,· 1·(•dress l,y action, you l'ight of clebate.

In the tit-st all that membN·s c-an '10 ,at the prei-l'nt 1 imP i1n respe<·t to an.,· llH'asu1·:· forward is to sho"· the ways �,rought Jf in whi!
'l1 1'or showing the U1e oppol'tuni1J.Y r, tht•n I 1·a11 0111.1· J'et'orm sl•e• measm·e•s ,heing rushe1l tb1·ough th�s Honse and we• not being-in ,1 po�itiou the vart outsid(• people of this e·ountry.

It is absolutely, a membe1· 1111<1er vent a member who is not introducing a Bill from debating I shall l,e told that it, i,s 1101 appli­ in diarge of Bilh1 nilJlc to mc•mbcrs but ILherc an• ,·c•·� few prirntc Hilh� 01· motions · iu this Colo11y .
Why should · 1111•111hers iulemwdiat< rn1·y much to the tlclJate thirty mi1111le� 1iartk11lad:,- to spE'a k for money, do 11ot c·ollll' talk hcca11,;p l1e•1·a a<·1·01111t Gon•rnor, 11etessn to tell Your Ex<"('lle]l(• in1hi,1· and its possible of the obi nsencss of the last.

hut the last Go\'ernor .1 J1ow mea!mre woulcl llC taken here to we like to speak.

IL i" L,c rc:-t,il'led of us here, use we are 1·om1wlled tt ought to lw reformed.

of us who a1·1• tauj!ht '!


E,·cr;;one who might atl<l is taken a\\·a, l'ft'ect on tlw 'l'he elosure is reasonaule.

It ha!-1 to, not 011 1·y to speak.

thoi-;e made it to "'e hope so far as this Uon•1·11mcut i,i hut.

surc'- a me:1sll 1·e half a.

('('II· 1·011tral'I, nrnd" it nccessa by the l'ar,wll a member who feels was also a nec:cssar,1· knows that the j!roup in ry.

'l'he mcas­ in It may be useful when bec•n in for('e fo1· near]�, t 11 , •• ,.. J,;n�1·to1w obstruc-tion ta l'liamcnt AUillotinc ur1•.
"'e haVl· 110 sndt oh�tn1dion this 1·ow1t1·y.

ol' till' ti.me is th(• es.,1•n1·(• 1 do 1w1 see t h1• use of i l cxtPpl al-I a Jll'O\"O(·a ti re lllt'a whil'h mar lwing Yo111· Ex<"elle•n1·,1· of sympathy wHl1 that lw has a good point to put, lmt Ju•1·1• is thh, al'l,itra,·y limits him lo t.hirly minutes.

Xo art isl ic sp,;fl'll withiu the srnpe of thht.y mi11utt•s .

'l'hc ma 1i who does that is the man who .si.J.nply I.P an O(·<·nsion sp1•e•1·h mar 01c·11p�· lwu1·.
It is all well to sar rno,·c the suspeusion on 01·1·asio11s i11dusio11 the indusion when a well-thought jumhles alon�.

Tl1ere lll,Q' of the 8tan<lii1g of tJ1a l kind.

'l'hc well under a half­ is ohj(•c( Orcl1•1·s rule whfrh of ihP rnh• is 111·orotati,·e.

ion a hlc.

out to , spee1·hcs without any arbitrary rule•, will, if it i1; 11eeess,try within thirty mi11utc1; it.

\Ye want the to sing that solo, which Your tole!


us yon woulfl like us to concerned, we ourselre,; make 0111· uot attempt to cx<"eed opportllllity Ex<"ellcnl'y f:ing, in 01·der to he better able to join in the d10rus whieh you would raise.

)lr.

Baldwin with Lis Cabinet and a fixed majority flout it hy <"arryi11g wants, but he Jami g0Ye1·mneut t11e Opposition, tl1e majority, tl1em t11e,r must not spe.t;,, flt irty mi nut.es.

can go into the House and any measure he is disem,si e,·en t11011gh on.
You ]war �-01t arc in and you do not seel.

: to t"ll docs not do that.

In Eng­ tlw 11 I hope, sir, that �·ou will IJe able, so can he c:olllpres1;eel J•.111:;i!r i� Your J�xl'elh.•111·�, if a lilt·muer r<'pt•atin� if lie is h-diously ltim <le•al you mar d<•al·with :11.

If You e·aunot Uni<' :ll-I like to i1Tt•l<•rnnt, ]tis arg-ument, 11u<ler lJh1l<• with him unclet· n•asoH aml I am goinl,!'

lo 1:hall1•nl,!•.!

ti!


(' author oi' this rule to reason with me-lie is not irrelernnt 1heu I respedfullr in� reasonahle l'il whidt oui:-ht 1o be h1•,ml ancl whidt ought t.o assist it in its deliberations.

submit lw i-; nfft'r· argument to thil-1 Coun­ m· te1lions, whic:h JUClllbcr;; to insert s11spi<-io11 rule goes, to bring to bear upon its It would do a good d1•al to far as thh; 11:utitular :rom· personnl inlluem·e execution.
lull the suspicion-a has been fo1•ccd upon Ute elected or this House by the attcm11t.

this rule he1·e.

Ua,·ing govern, which the Uovel"llmeut claims it has and never had before, although the Government Government the people who are not now iu a position to carry any measure they l.-Onsider for the benefit of the community.
Huie 31 giwi-; all tlic power that is ne<•ef:sary to curb a memher who is likely to be we diff('r upon that, then let govern, but let tlw got the right to now hear the ,representatives of ;Jj t:;ta11ding Rulc1t &.

Order1t.

28 �on:mn:n lU:?8 -Com,nittee34 influence is there, the is there.

I Mk, sir, that Your bring your personal unduly long in his speech or irrelevant The 'closure' or tedious.

'guillotine' Excellency • to bear in this matter.


It is this rule on which we feel very particular strongly and I may say, sir, if this rule is put into operation it will bring members of thh; IIouse into conflict with each other.

It is likely that a rule of this kind-I do not like -will not only· bring memben; into conflict with ca.ch other but will cause yery a�gry feeling when operathe.

so do not provoke members by it.


,It is of no use to the llouse, to pro11hesy it is actually Legisla­ knowledge member occupying two and oil more That has hap})ened on the last day, the othe1·s him to look after theiL­ no secret, hoped that at some time or other such a rule woulcl IJe introduced.

lknow of my O\\'ll personal one elected a half days in adclres:,iing the ture, so much so that he was the only one present having deserted own affairs.

lhan one occasion.
lhan one occasion.

to eilly in the right direction form enable 10ne to put in more couci1-1e oue clesire1-1 miy representation to put to ancl so bring nbout il1 au the Ilouse, way the despatch of the expeditious I do ho11c the entire House business.

of the will suJJport the retention 1,1·oposecl better work in the Legislature nncl certainly reflect much mrm bers in the discharge rule whil'h is hound to produce in future credit on This step is undoul>t­ of their duties.

in orcler Mr. DIA.S :.


�lay I address a few for that it would of any Legis­ :with respect of this clause I am noc under ,.nH'ern,nem.

to the obserrntious to this llouse-1 remarks in answer to the .honourable member who last spoke?

::,1,eaki11g myself-arnl control J um mltlressi.ng welcome the introdudion into these rules, if for no other reason -I may be selfish-than help me to say what I have got to say iu lcsi,; time tltan I would ha,·e otherwise 1loue.
I cannot conceh·e lature of this kind with men-and [ the honourable include with their just resumed his seat-busy own affairs, !

'iay that any matter which may arise in this IIom,e cannot properly to in thirty minutes.

It is difficult spee1·h which concefre of any particular does not properly place before the House the views of a member in 1hat partic-ular with tl1irty ach ;:rive11 time.

If we were fo calculate members aromul this table thirty minutefi to spenk on we would have a hours.
l quite subject, fifteen particular bate lasting 1agine that in that }Jerio1l who can honestly be represented member who has of time you should have ever.,, so well debated unsaid.

phase of the imbject that nothing will be left Mr. CANNON : Your Excellency, to ham that I waste the when you have been here long c11ough, sir, you will 1·calise in this House least time i.J.1 speaking sir, than auy other member.

I cannot, sL1pport fro� my seal, howeYer, this rule.
� it is suggested, I think, sir, that it is far nicer and it wouhl come with better graee if it <toes not form part of these Rules.

I quite agree with the lasl speaker, and I happened been in Court when that 11a.rticular member ispoke for nearly two-and-a-half days, but he is not a member of U1e Legislature I clo not think any one here woulcl attempt to go through that ordeal as that particular did.

I appeal to Your Excellenc it would do quite a lol of good if you If in that this rule be deleted.
clireet for it, lime you see the 11ecessily then il is up lo you to again iutroduee it and haye it form part of the rules of this Ilouse, but as it sta.uds, support it.

I shall h,n·e to ask for a clivh;ion, ruy mover of the a111emlnle11t, to rcrnrtl it.

vote against gentleman y that if I stand aloue with the sir, I cannot to-day.

The honicmrablc member knows, and tlrn t I ha rn had of the debates in ex1Jci-ie11ce the entire Ilouse knows, consiclcrable the old Combiue<l Although Policy.
either llouse limiting the Elcctin1i; members, Court and Court of there was no rule in of it.

was themselves, the spect·hes Mr. GONSALVES: 1'.ilen I fir:-t Rules I thought that the the read these introduction time for a speech might ser,c its 1mrpose having 1·egard of the rule limiting to my short experiences 1n� :;;; :3la1tdi1&y llulc:3 & Orclt:I'�.

28 Xo\"ElJIJtn -{,'u111111 ii fr,·.

long time over <.-ertain of purpose, Hut on reading the rules in the old Court.
There had been no doulit that some members, perhaps in took an Wl· their cameistness 11ec:e:ssarily matter:;.

to-day and seeing that by Rule 25 no 11ucstion cellem:�· matter may be presented, think uow that there is any real neccs­ i;ity for the whole of Uule �7.
I hardly the may 1,e put unless Your Ex­ in your dii;cretion thinks take and having apportion­ the time auy of any c1ueslio11, power to apportion question may the duty of the ed the time it l>ccomes Electives to the themselves to i;ubruit limit of that time.

If, theu, there is of time !or the dis­ an apportiollllient cussiou I clo not see the reaison or the necessity J3ritish pro\'ision members.

·when I saw the individual 1 was struck and it gave rise iunovation in my mind.
Why all this to a suspicion pre�ution ?.

I came here this morning and took the oath to senc my SQvereigu r iu ><omething h�· bri11g that the King. "

in any Brit­ bas never beeu inlrodu<·ccl ish c:ouutry?

for this uu­ the time of oi' limiting of For.

Mr. WOOD (Conservator U see1Us to me, :sir, if l understand the to prevent the lion.
�Utorney l tan give me :,;ome other inter- in a debate any member Huie :!3-unle.,,;s Oenera 1n·ctation-that of this Uou:.e who gets u11 to make the debate iso Ion� ais thereby othe1· members from speaking on motion can bring a pennlty on the other members by allo\\ing to JlUt the motion to the Yotc.
If that is done one or any elected 11avc madt· the other cleckd rnemlicr,­ i,;uffer members will keeJJ an e�·c other elected on that member and he will not be allow­ eel to keep the Ilouse engaged length of time with his speeches future.

as a rmmll, and I am sure the ests) : Question!

Your Excellency for any in Mr. FREDERICKS: member will lf in a British Ilere �e ha rn got a Oo,·erno,· bit of hiistorr-this some of those .Assem­ ham certain pcrha1n,; though British, tha.r­ 1 not truJy Brit i:.;h.
\\'hut ,Ai;:,;embly, blies, actcl'istics am saying is this-1 1>ride myself in knowing a little is that a real British not a provision mind or proud about.

''A would be pleased 1 air field and no fa ,·our."

Let us play cricket.

who has come )Vith the best.

intentiou:; and wants co-operation.

thing:; with some sm,pi<:ion pubhc not.

enlightened edu<:a rnle:,; of lltis kiml it gh ei; l"isc to sm,· pi<:ion.

provision '.lour J�xcellency i11 this matter.

Why then haYe "!
Why then haYe "!

·we June a though somcwhal There is ample a.nd suil'icicnt in the other 1·ulcs led, and when yo1L begiu to ha, c will meet the Electives anc.L I hope '!

'his llltiuk a brnther :<ugge:stc<l Elctlirc I agree with him.

J � member here would vote agaim1t.

not laking to task nor arc we coudcnrn­ lmt.

we arc ,-;imply a tOllllH'Omisc; is tlte on be a com1nomise.

tlicru rnlc, l think, if put to the ,utc, eve electe(l "'e do not like it.
"'e at·(• Governm�nt ing Ho,·ernmeut, i:.a�·ing crn let us begin as frieuds antagonists.

of this kind I have JIO l1esit11tion J>ronouncing uuwananted.

arnl not as If there is to be a rule in that as we are beginning it as um1eccssa1·y I hope tltat Go,·ernmcnt a new and I thi11k that with the cxt"eptio11 of altogether if thinks it that any debal◄' go on longer, aud I think 111em­ for a period of th1·ee unless Your Excellenty Hulc :!
:i, Hulc :,;; if uol deleted might l>e so drafted may extend o,·er a period of five day:,;.

'l'he ntle provides d.ayis, should.

l,cris of this House will be 1:mtisficd fo1• by this two days longer are provided (:.!)

and sub-rules rule.

'.l'hc other two (!l) would in that case go out.

l make this suggestion of this Ilou1-,c wiUt a view that some witlt Gov­ might be l'ffcttcd <·ompromi,;e Hulc :!7 in so far crJllllcnt.
ai-the House thinks it iis necessary to limit 1he period of a tlebat(• her of <la�·s, a11y 111c111h<•1·, and so prevent i,;uc:h as the one in the Jmst, speakiug for two clays and a half, thus preventi11g other mem�rs from speaking.

to h011ournble members l�irst delete to a num­ Mr. FREDERICKS: add m_y quota again!

;t uccaui-e Hule 26 exist1:1. to Rule 27.


I do so Rule 2U gives I, too, want --{'ot1111'tttcr: ., ., and reserrntion with its majority powt'r would 11how thnt lcnien<'y Jct everything und the deletion t1ymbolisc (Applamsc lie fair and unbridled of thi11 rule would it to the public in general.

from the gallery).

or 1111 to The CHAIRMAN: If I hear an.,· den1om,tration the 1111hlk room will lJC by any members of the thi>< ('ouudl, 11. dea1·ed fo1·thwit attending to follow, of the 1·11k, if hon.
members giYe their and iu sentence:; 11ot here only to 1:1peak; we a1·e here Lo work, to think coud1:1ely and pt·ccisely.

That being 1w, apart from the t..•ducati\·c tt•mlency in1:1tead of mea mleriug into long sen· tences, diflicult Yiew1,1 in short an<I 1·risp tew word:-i e,·er�·t bing woultl I.Jc het let·.

Looking at it from that ))Oint he found that this regulatiou 1·eally i1,1 afraid of the majority tile minority.
If thit1 rule ,toe:-; ni,t exist we shall fintl oursel\'e:-; tion of the majority oppressed a l>le to eseape from it.

Thu t is tlw advantage should not 1:1utl'er of it: all the other member,; as the result of OJJt:'.

by oue member and not hciJ1g it would wouhl -where an hon.

membct· of the 11011:;e oppressiug l>e hel11ful in the posi­ liei11g to this.

th<• ohje1·t t·o1uplc111cnt The ATTORNEY GENERAL: I on Huie :!U.
I 11hould like to <·all attention The Jlom,e lias agl'ct•<l wuut to point out that Huie :!7 h; the ncec,o,;ur�· for thii,1 1·easo11: preserre bers.

It will not lui ,·e the effect hon.

and learned fri<•1Hl imagines.

1 t is not u11-Bl'itish; it enlarging the House.

1 ought lo 1n1t it tltis wa�·, it is against of spcc1·h of Uule :.u, and of it is to indiddual mem­ that my who la:,;t spok<• of the mcmhcrs of this Ilou1:1e.
of th<' 111c111he1·s the 1·cstrai11t tl11• Jil>t•rlt the right of of thl' liberty h; of Let us look at Hult• :!Ii.

The some· :-;pec<"11, some mo1U,entous If it happens ou :,;omc 1>articula r occasion that a mcmher wishes to cleliver thing of J1igh import, lbcrt:" is no u.oul>t a IJout it that there h; al ways powei-to 8tUlpend the .

:;tandiug Hules.

This House would do that when there is something :-;o a: to get the mome11tous benefit of the adYice of any member on such an occasion.
The1•efore of the rule iis 1uerelJ I may call an occasional not bas<.

'Cl upon 1,111hstnnce.

powers we ham got i11 these Orders and Rules and the power of sus1leni-ion; the good work whi�h the llouse a:-; n rule would do and whfrh imliritluul members :would l>e able to accomplit,h l>y their SJ>ceches wou 1d uot he in tl1e a1J'ected.

Tlti1,1 House ii,; alwa,ni Rlightest and woul<l generous to its colleague;; neYer abst a bi.
when I ht• ot·<·asion a rises, from giving tL heari11g he l1eard 011 proper gromuls.

the object to moderate what exul>era111·e The general to what ought to for argument 1mke, by old meml>er-1 11hould been gi\·en to long Hl)<.>echei,;.

of the oltl J,1.•gislatu1·<.

'-and may lix tlw total time in a <leuah'.


�ow, I l're1,1ident to he oceupied um a moderately i;ay l'ltther I will not, t1ir, in truth 01· otht•rwise, accuse any meml>er of that Lc,.rislature of huYi11g lhtl s11ppo1,iJ1�, au�· drnuce there was to enter thii,; llouse 11ome meml>e1· referred that the liberty gone if the Pre11i«l<•11t time for the debate.

If that me111l>e1· u11 and proce<.


'<led to propound to th<• llou1,1c, if he 11puk<• what would haJl}lt:'11 t·onsume the right of indivillual memhcn; come in?

ut once of other memhe1·s had tix<•1,1 is that be would would the total timt•.

\\"he1·1• his vieWd ><o lolll!

as that, to, we should realise like unto the one who was th<• total got Mr. CRANE: 011 a poi1;t of expl,111a­ tion, may 1 enquire whether the hon.
who haK ju>it gentleman lakeu his i;eat to inform this House- intends If l\'e look to the Hulei,; as we ought that Huie :!7 iia tlte to we woul<l reali1,1e natural complement or Huie :?ii.

Jt i,­ un important Utrougb our work as r1ukkly as we mav 1-easonably do, having due regard to the of it n ntl tile time whit·h we importan<-e ought to devote to iL .\.fter all we a1-e thing to try and get The CHAIRMAN: Tlw 1·orrt•et way of speaking hut "hon.

Attorney General.''

is not "hon.


gcutlcmau,'' Mr. CRANE: I U!n Y<'l'�· scll'rt, wa;; only followii1g procedure.

1 just want to know if th•!

th1• Parlinnwutn 1'\' ::!9 Standing Rttlc-� & Ordcn;.

28 Xor1rnc1::1: 1():!8 -Vo111111 ill cc.

-!O that sueh a rule is a natural hon.

.Utorney General i:; informing this llouse cornplernc11t J louse of Commons as a "Closure Compa1·tincut;' to what is known in tl1c by whld1 is Hu.le 2!i.

The ATTORNEY GENERAL: I h,ne my Yiews.


gfrell alreacly The CHAIRMAN: I do not think legal saws on that sulJ­ we need :s1ilit jed.

Tlie hon.

Atto1·11ey that Hule :.

?7 is the natural corollary of .l:ulc :.?G.

Tlirrc is 110 question 11011:-;e 1Wns.

of l 'n11U General sayi-­ uf the Mr. SEERAM: l urn going 1u ;-;up- of Go,·enuuent the policy and pro­ in all rnattcr:s. I for one mcnt to think with lhem.
\Ye all <:au­ not think alike :IJut there is that ardent desire to do all tliaL lies in our power to .facilitate cedul'e \Ye are Yery anxious-arnl ghc Your Kx.<:ellcnty -in evel'y to facilitate GoYcrmuent.

trom me amt other cleclecl ask Your E:x.c:ellc11c-,1· to delete thii,; rule.

I do :;o on the fnrlher assur­ ance that Utile ;n will l.,e suppoJ'tcd IJ�· me .i ml l am >1t11·e 1.:ern who han• spoken II" ill <lo likcw)sc.
)iYilh 'il1at ai-suranee matters 011 the 1>art of 1 hat hon, melll· way po:s:sible that nss1U·ance and imagLu.al>le 111eml.,c1·s I 11g these rules, fro;t been passed stand.

lJ the dclctwu uf this rule on tllL of l{ulc :u, 1Yll id1 l hope 1 thiuk turnui.Juuu;-;Jy.

1111l't i-.u·e11gLlL will IJc 11,1ssccl thc�c two 1-ules should be rnkeu to­ gether iu to11sideri aud I am sure ern1·y hon.

member here will agree that Hule 31 shourn l>c one of the d au:;e:; in the:;e rules.
That rule has 110t been reached as yet, but H provides that if an,v member indulges the or tedious speeches jrt il'l'elernnt l're,;illent may direct that member to di:sc·o11tinue his speech.

'Take, for ex­ ample, a member has bec,1 speakillg for fifteen that t.ime the ).

'resident he ix imlulgiJ,g uus l'epetition, with m1thority ber to dis<:ontinue Mr. HUMPHRYS: l i-u111wl'L the re· tent ion of lhtlc �7 hcnmse 1 run in witlt !lie i.Jm1.
AtWrnev agTce111cnt UeJJcral that it follow;; naturally U{ule 26, and t.hat ltaviJJg; I ceL"taii1ly think it :-;hottld a motion c:omes 11 p arnl Your Exccl­ lenty 11xes the lime wllich it shoultl oernpy ancl that time ihappens a couple of hours, I c-au quite imagille that xeYeral members, who would like to :;peak, wottltl not be heard at all, time.

if the motion It is the1·efore is allowed to :stand that.Hule also stanrl.

It follow1:1 quite natural­ ly Hu.le :.W.


I know I am in the m.in­ ority in so far as i.he elected arc concerned agaiJ1st cour:;e of time i.he_y will all agL"ce that the 1·ule is a good one aml t.hat l am right.

the l'resident is vested t.o <:all upon that mem­ is to ocrnp.r a fixetl l1ece1:1sarv decides that j 11 ii-relevant it, 'Jmt I am afraid i.hat in if Hule 2!i �7 must minutes.

If at the eml o.f Your Excelle11cy, and Urn t i!tcy will yotc in my luu:nblc ltis speech.
or tecli• members to he 1iower, tedious to <liscontinue u.f tliis rule, vm,ted in the PreRi• to curl, ihe right of spccd1 jn .faY01u of the de­ I ·ihink it is an opinion I think there is ample anthor­ it,v, a1111)le deut to cull uvon a11y member who llecomes lti:; speech.

Lil,e the other hon.
members who have :s1,oken Ic!iu11 :llternpt of the ruclllbcni ¥0111· Excellm1c-y, 11eetl tlon for elc<:icll \\·1th a greai.er el'iticise Hems on ihe Estimate wltich are i11- t1·odt1cc<l, uccanse it is the only iu­ :;trumcnt that is left in their hands effcciiYely that !ltt'Y wield in sltoul<l ur per:suaue order lo criticise members to be Yestctl right to speak and iu motions, questions, of this llouse, and, there is a g1·euler under the new Coustitu• to-clay U-oYern- or even Hille :l7 J wii-l1 un no one.
There (o ca:;t ai:;pen;ion of ti111e h,nc a. l{l'eat clcHl in dclmtc ilHt( l'Ollicl lllore u;.il'fully on:upic1l.

on 110 rnem­ ller J1cre hut we ,111 do know that in tho past <'onr·L was waNtt•<l l.,cen "·orks a J.ranlship must lJc Yc1·y fow matters 1ha t caru10t IJe exJH'C:;;-;ed a ;.ipac:c of a half-hour, ha,·e a longer time thcu.

he can ai,;k for a �u;-;pe11�io11 all([ Order,;, is an ohjcctimial.Jle oue.

I <lo not think in this in:,;tante the Goverlllllent meant anythipg objeclionaule by it.
I feel it ::;houltl of the :-;ta ruling Hules I do uot tltink the rule within but if he m11;-;t on by ant rneru1Jc1· stand.

-11 8f<111di11g Rulr.� & Oi-dr•,•g.

2� Xonnrmm l!)'.

?$ -('m11mitt,•r·.

42 eniraging immediate I cannot romplain umlul.r 1011g or weari:-ome.

lcYrl of <lebatr ancl although am afrai•l Jwi- I Raid at a dh;<'U:-sion on a moi:it t]1e at­ here of the remarks of 1n·e<leces• Mr. ELEAZAR: I differ from w1rnt the hon.
member has just said, ancl I ueetl lmt to re.ad a shOl't 1rnsi:inir<• from a 1·eport Your Excel1enc�··s sor who momentous qu<'stion tention of this IIouse : •· I I t·mrnot admit that this clchate 11,<'Pll Alta 11 attempt to s11m up th<> :-pe<>dH•s which JrnYe bN•n mad<>.

Crl'lainly a ]1iglt lias lieP11 mnin­ tained, there has been m11d1 in the speeehes that I do not quite agree with, of the manner in ,,·hfrh the Yi<•ws of the 1't's11cctiYe ed.''

That was when the Ilouse was «liscussiJ1!!


It was also staten in thP report that unrler the nPw Con:-titution recom­ menrled the elected members would still haYe the fullest ing items of the Annual Estimates.

ra1mot conceive fullest limited to fifteen or thirty minutes.

As a matter of fact, 1o ·be can<licl, when this mre41 of v1·aise <'<l the memhM·s of the Com·t )·our ]nnuh]e and ol><"•lient sernrnt was 110t I happ<'nNl p1·esrJ1t.(Langl1t<'r).
han• heen i1l: p<'1·liap:-if 1 ]rn«l hren 1H·Psr111 the)' wonl«l not lHIYC l1a1l thi;i hit of praise.

the ronstitutional :a.pea kr1·s have her11 •le liver­ what is meant l>y "the power" if speeches power of discuSR· que:-tion.

are lo be to I was ;H'<·o1·1l­ Tlll're speeches bas l1ep11 hi speeehe,1, aml to fift<'e11 power to limit the and 110 romplnii1t ''l'here a:-to t]1e length of the Rpee<'h<'s.
is the majority, there is the ])ower of Gov­ ermnent to have its ·way ; tl1ere is Your Excellency's ti.me to be e11gagefl tllere is further the attempt to limit tlie individual to half-an-hour in some insta1H·es min­ utes and less i n others.

Is not t.hat au attempt to <'Urb free :-pee<'h free•lom of sp<'ec-h riirhts of the Bdtish publi<'?

Are we not part of ,t]1e Bl'itii-h Ern11ire?

Doex it.

11ot i-aYour of oppres:-ion?


It is the srt tl<',i of eYe1·y iulta hitaut of this Colony, of every well-wi:-her, with Your Exeellenr this Colony a morn on.

I cannot con- that we !

'!honld eo-op<'rntc y in tryi11g to giYe ancl fixerl intention 11ot part of 1.1,e '?

Is shnn1'1 that p<'rsons •·<'iY<' pla('ed some people cau waters.

hen• m order to see how well haw n rule angle in troubled \\11eu we come to tl1e Committee of we Jintl "!

will .he 1ur•m­ motions.

put on.


Your Excelleney, memb<'l·s, 10 a .few minutes au<l tJien tJ1e "'ays and )le:rns what rlo ·we find all 1he motions arc• Govet'll· 111e11t The Go,·ernml'nt he1·s are in the 1majorit�·.

and 11el'•l I say we, the eleeted aim.ited "closure" like the hon.

member who has :-poken before me, I am willing solo whether it is a vocal or instrmnen­ tal one, aull I am also willing in the c-lt0rus but with one condition, a ncl tlta t is.
that the poor OYertaxecl population ;;mall Yoke in ralling of this Colony woulrl l1ave a tltr tnne.

T]wy to join in the to join , would not have that if the Government has the power to put tl1e 'rlo:-nre' <'1rrted speerh.

members' on It seems to me that wl1a t was pass­ measurei-;, of tl1e J1011onr.llilP of t1Jat we see Goverument what we fcrl and l1ow we and if in ing through the mind of ihe maker of the rule is: now that the Ooyemmeut lws the pown· of a :rhm!

it is going to u:-e it a:-a giant.


In thl' fare of the fnc-t ilrnt e,·ery elertr<l memher, with the exc-eptiou )frm­ ber i'or East Dernerara (:\fr.

Hnm• this rnle.

we lik<' to phrp).

is ag-nim,t eomr frankly to OoYl'l'llment and trll (;0Yer1m1e11t feel al>ont certain 'spite agall.lsl us, then tltere hut to fall in :iml join in th<> <'11orus.

1Vhy a11tagonise swor«l of DamocJe,; Ruch a manner?

The Jean1e•l CTeneral is lc•ngt11y look to the future.

T11e )femher who is a mnn of few worcl:-, ]Ja$!


given hi:-views ag-aini-t to accerle to the majority of the Elec­ t h·eF; and rlelete this very ohjeetiona ble rule from the Rules of the IIouse.

tlie �eatest • :sinner of and lie tens you to 1u,?

\\'hy hol(l the ovl'r 011 r hra•ls in for CTeo1·grtow11.

it.

aml I ask Yowr ExC'ellency is 1io hope hon.


�enior i-peerhe:-, i:­ for n:­ .A tto1·11e�· The CHAIRMAN: with a grPat deal of interest to the ,·iews of th" variou:-members who are not in favour of Rule 27, lJut I must - ('u111111i/11•1•.

44 Unit' ;;:t-J•r11.cti <-e of the Ilouse of thl'l!lSelves.

c 'ommons.

)fot ion mn<le, amt QH<'!

';fion pro­ "That the word,.

: "an<l J>l'O· be irn,erte,1 poi<E><l, <'edm·e" '· lhl' practirf'" lt1111:-l'."-(j.lfr.
})('tween the wordi< nncl "of tl1e <'ommons r'm11r.)

Question )fotion put, and agreed to.

nml Qu<'Rt 111:1!1<', iou propoRNl, '·That Ute Council i<ha'il 110w l'l'Slllll<'" -('fl,r Rr·1•1·rtrl1'y).

C'olnnial Q11es1ion put.

:,11(1 to.

:ll,!1·1•(•11 Thi' ('0111wil rNmme<l.

)fotion made, nncl QueRl ion propoi::e1l, "That the St:rnding which l1nve been romiid<'re<l whole {'ounril ('(l."-(T1,r Rules a 111l Or•dl'rR h_,.

ihl' Srrrrtar.11).
ihl' Srrrrtar.11).

be adop1e<l Cnlonirrl n;; amf'ml­ tl1r nnY('1·11me11t The ATTORNEY GENERAL s('(•oncl­ used.

mPml,e;•s arguments contradict i>ai<l l>efore, am Hot the le;1s� im­ go 0 11.

I tl1in.k, too man� pr0Yi>10:- 11g J'o1· thirty minutes, pnt your case.

You C'an- L iliat I J.,y anJ of the argmnents however.

that i;; .
that i;; .

• \s l I run not at nll irn say all they war,t to ,;ay yet they e1· that thirty minutes :ne 11ot 1·1rnfess p1·esse!l 'L'h<'s<• One and all of tlte honourable said they <·a11 s1waki a II n111si<l 1011� <•nong-h to 11ot have it both ways.

Personally, sl1011lcl like lo see this rule lef� in with n prodi,;o to 1hr effed that if in tl1e a speech '!hould of llw Prr,dde11t opinion last longe1· minutes it thnn tl1irly shoul<l inl1·0<lnd11g- l1a,·(' with tl11' ,;lren!

!f-h prl'!

';Red rnl'nts u;;erl.


110r am I in the least i111- p 1·1'si-f'rl h:r thf' fn<'t that such a Rmall rnl<' ai:: tl1 ii;, if we left it in, wou'i1l rl'sult ing toJ!ether at every ium.

I tlo not tl1h1k 111t•v Nl.

woulcl, frankly, on such a ,;mnll poi,,;.

n111, n,; 011<' hon.

member suirgested, wl1�· pnt i1 i11 11ow?

If we fiml it HP<'<'RRatJ· ,lo 1101 mi11,l "·l1e11 not s11/,!
'::tPst :::l'r1·,,1m·:, inir 11p a thrPnt in the roof lik,, a sword thnt one t·a11 ('Ill lhrrrng-h all(f 1<'1 it d1·op on the Council.

W<' rn n put, i1 in lntl'r.

T of tl1at ;;arinir T th011:rl1l thr Rulei-.

lrnt T 11i1l ('olon I dirl not.

likl' ha11j!

'­ !firRt r 1·1':ul if In tll(• lt011.

in tlH' elected hP(·ans,• lo <lf'ff'nt memh<'rR of tll<' arixu­ !

'Oml1i11- in l Mr. GONSALVES: l\fa�, I en'luirf' whether tlw hon.

.Atto1·ne�, <1<'neral p 1·opo,;es ed n,; ju!


'lt gone thro11J!l1 am1'1Hl11wnt 1o have thei,;e Rnl<'>i c-onftrm­ to Rul<' 2G?

without any The COLONIAL SECRETARY: I did not un<l<'l',-taml 111c•11t wa;; hein� sngges1e1l that any amen<l- io Rnl<' 2G.

�1>.

/,!

't'ntlf'1 J am qui[(' iR quit<' pr<'pared.

111•11, :11ul t:oY('l'lllllf'TI1 to p l'C'))Rl'('(], omit 1lti;; I:ulP 27 for the rime being nml twnit nil(] !

'lee what the l'l'sult will ht'.

(lff':11·, :1 ti 11011.

1 1-m:t t ha I otl11•1·wis<•.


will do 't.hl'ir thl'i 1o :11l1l µ:,•t tl11·oug-lt eforted b<'fll 1o kc<'p as short aR poRRibll', tu th<' efficienr:, the debate;:;, T therefor<' or 1· spel'l'l1e,; an!l l';]lf'Nl membe1•fl, l1en1·).

1o Q1wst ion.

•· Tl1a1 I:nle 27 be rl<'leted" Mr. GONSALVES: Yon hnve strurk out Ihde :::'7.

::in<l h:ni11� amemlme11l i!

'I nec·essnr "'hich has tll<' \\'Ol'lh: YitlNl 1lo11e .r to Uule 26 in tlw p1·m iso 1o Order• 27.''

.. sn.vl' n.s is Jll'O.


so nn The PRESIDENT: am mueh obliire<l to i1.

iuix attention to 1he hou.

nwmh<'r for dr:1w­ p11 t. :111<1 ll g1·ee1l to. '

:m-Hel'Orrl of Proceedings.

]?1111 Mr. CRANE: fa it intended.

<'tl in th<' last line, "Xo report of tl1e <'nmwil shall ])(' required"?

The CHAIRMAN: 1'1iere the wMd as stat­ ''of" iR should reacl "to.''

Question, "That the word "of., in the lnRt line of Ru.le 39 be amended 1o read "to,'' put and agreed to, )lot ion made.

all{] Quest ion propO!


"<'{l, "That the words ";,;ave a;; i� provided in th<' prm·iso 21i he deleted.

"-(Thr Colonial t11ry).

1o Ordc1· 27 •• in J:ulr Secl"I�· Qne!

';tion to.

put and ngree<l Question, nnd Ot·cle1·s to.

pnt nncl agreecl "That t.hc Standing Rules be passed'' as amrndecl Th" Council adjourne<l 1111til to• monow nt 11 a.m.